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Ep. 11 - Tanya Muneera Williams

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Ep. 11 - Tanya Muneera Williams Ep. 11 - Tanya Muneera Williams ABDUL-REHMAN MALIK VOICEOVER: My name is Abdul-Rehman Malik. I’m canvassing the world for the most interesting people, to hear about their journeys, their work, and what it means to be alive in the world today. And perhaps nobody has captured that experience, of being alive, better than the 13th-century Persian poet and Sufi mystic Jalaluddin Rumi in his poem, “The Guest House.” FEMALE VOICE: This being human is a guest house. Every morning a new arrival. A joy, a depression, a meanness, some momentary awareness comes as an unexpected visitor. Welcome and entertain them all. ABDUL-REHMAN MALIK VOICEOVER: So welcome to This Being Human. A podcast inspired by Rumi’s words and motivated by all those who carry that message forward in the world today. Today, poet and MC Tanya Muneera Williams. TANYA MUNEERA WILLIAMS: Thinking about Malcolm X, who is Malcolm X? And I wasn't sure who he was, but I knew that I wanted to be whatever he was, you know? And so, I explored various different things. And then when I found out that, like, Muslims pray five times a day, I was like, five times a day, I don't know if I could do that! ABDUL-REHMAN MALIK VOICEOVER: A few years ago, Tanya Muneera Williams wrote an op-ed for The Independent, titled: “I’m a Black female Jamaican hip-hop rapper - and I converted to Islam." The themes of race, womanhood and spirituality are a big part of Tanya’s work -- both as a poet and as half of the hip-hop duo “Poetic Pilgrimage.” She’s also an educator and a contributor to the popular BBC Radio 2 segment “Pause for Thought.” Tanya was born in Bristol, England. She grew up in her mother’s church, but converted to Islam as a young adult, at a time when tensions were high for Muslims living in England. I sat down with Tanya Muneera Williams to hear about her spiritual and artistic journey. ABDUL-REHMAN MALIK: Tanya Muneera Williams, I am so happy to have you join us on This Being Human. TANYA MUNEERA WILLIAMS: Thank you for inviting me. I'm really happy to be here. ABDUL-REHMAN MALIK: Tell us about your name. Tanya Muneera Williams. TANYA MUNEERA WILLIAMS: My birth name is Tanya Samantha Williams. I was thinking about changing my name. So when I converted to Islam, I was given the name Muneera. I love the name. I was like what does it mean? They told me: she who holds the light. I was like, wow, that's something I would like to be, so I really love that name and at one point I was thinking about changing my name by default and then, just experiencing Islam and people saying, oh, you haven't changed your name properly yet? You know. I was like, no, actually, there's something -- I want to hold onto the name that my mother gave me. So I definitely do use the name Muneera and like a lot of my friends call me Muneera and I'm quite comfortable with that, but I also use the name Tanya and it’s also nice to go into Muslim spaces and use Tanya and go into non-Muslim spaces and use Muneera and just disrupt that a little bit. ABDUL-REHMAN MALIK NARRATION: Disrupting and defying expectations is a driving force in a lot of Tanya’s work. This includes her hip-hop group Poetic Pilgrimage. She and her creative partner Sukina Abdul Noor are both converts to Islam. Two Black women onstage in hijab, rapping. Their performances are captivating. ABDUL-REHMAN MALIK: I want you to take us backstage. What is it like for you in those moments just before you go on to the show? TANYA MUNEERA WILLIAMS: Sometimes I feel like I have many people living inside of me. I'm definitely, extremely nervous. I'm definitely excited as well. Most of the times I'm excited. I was always curious about who would book us, you know, what is it about people that want to see, particularly if it's not a Muslim audience. Like who wants to see this Black Muslim woman wearing the hijab and who cares about what I have to say, you know? Sometimes I hear in my head this really just doubting, like, you know, are you good enough? Do you have enough? But then there's this voice inside of me that's like, no, I'm here. I'm supposed to be here. This isn't an accident. So, so many different things happening in one moment, which is a little bit scary, but also, I'd say a thrill I guess. ABDUL-REHMAN MALIK: I've seen you step on stage dozens of times and it's that last emotion that you describe that I experience. It's really that you belong. And is there a moment when you move from doubt to belonging on that stage? TANYA MUNEERA WILLIAMS: I think it's probably about two lines in. Recently I did a TEDx talk and again, I didn't have much time to rehearse. And I was supposed to just be performing. And in the last moment they were like, oh, we want you to say something as well. I was like, okay, oh my gosh, I'm not prepared. All of these different thoughts came into mind and then I could see it when I watched the video back. I literally see, ah, she's clicked in, she realizes that this is her stage, that she is supposed to be here, you know. And people can see it, but actually, it adds to dramatic effect, if that makes sense. It adds to that sort of like, building up to this sort of momentum, so it works, it definitely works. ABDUL-REHMAN MALIK NARRATION: Tanya grew up in Bristol, a port city in Southwest England. The city is known for its rich music scene -- in particular as a major breeding ground for trip hop and drum and bass. It’s also a culturally diverse city, with a complex political history. All of these influences ended up shaping Tanya’s identity. ABDUL-REHMAN MALIK: Let's go back to growing up in Bristol. And tell me about the influences you heard and saw at home that made you fall in love with music. What would your parents have on their sound system that spoke to you, that attracted you? TANYA MUNEERA WILLIAMS: It's so interesting, you know, because, like, the sort of music that my parents listened to was almost like a cross between reggae and country music, right. So, I wasn't really interested in that sort of music. I think it was my older brothers. It was their music. So, it would be like your Burning Spears as well as like Michael Jackson and, you know, Kool and the Gang, all of these various different things. And also, like, Bristol is, still, but back then was very, very, very like influenced and was very instrumental in sort of like sound system culture. My brothers would go to sound systems. So like a lot of sound system mix tapes, of course, you know, your Bob Marley, you know Abyssinian, Burning Spear, all of these different sorts of songs, you know, and of course, there was like, you know, pop music at the time. And then Pirate Radio station was a big thing as well. So I was lucky enough to be able to hear various different forms of music - particularly in thinking about music widely associated with Black culture. So, house music, you know, drum and bass, my cousin is Roni Size, you know, so like, I remember going to his house and hearing this drum and bass sort of like music emerging. I remember the creation of drum and bass, you know. So many different things. I'm influenced by so many different forms of music. ABDUL-REHMAN MALIK: Tell us a little bit about that sound system culture. What does that look like? What is a gathering around a sound system… look like and feel like? TANYA MUNEERA WILLIAMS: Okay, so there is a center in Bristol called the Malcolm X Center. The center is, but was particularly back then, the hub of everything. So, it is a center in the area called St Paul's. And it has a red, gold and green flag with Malcolm X's face painted on the front of it. You go up some steps leading to it is in this old sort of church building. And you go in and it's just this community hall. It's nothing fancy about it. Then slowly, people will start to come into this sort of arena. And you may have like a few people on the event. So, say, for example, you may have Qualitext, you know, you may have, like, I don't know, Ghetto Force or another sound system. And they'll be clashing, going backwards and forwards, you know, with tracks, with records. Twelve inches, seven inches. People would gather. We hear a song, you know, and it will be quite intergenerational as well. You know, you have people of different ages there. Darkened room, you know, smoke blowing, that's essentially what a sound system… experience of a sound system. ABDUL-REHMAN MALIK: Bristol has such a unique history, doesn’t it? And I wonder, beyond the musical influences and that amazing scene that you've just described, what was it like growing up in Bristol, in the, in the 1980s generally? TANYA MUNEERA WILLIAMS: First of all, just to say that Bristol is like -- or was the heart of slavery in England.
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