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Regional Oral History Office University of California The Bancroft Library Berkeley, California Government History Documentation Project Ronald Reagan Gubernatorial Era POVERTY PROGRAMS AND OTHER CONSERVATIVE POLICY STRATEGIES, 1970-1984 Interviews with A. Lawrence Chickering and Robert B. Hawkins, Jr. Interviews Conducted by Gabrielle Morris in 1984 Copyright fc) 1986 by the Regents of the University of California All uses of this manuscript are covered by a legal agreement between the University of California and A. Lawrence Chickering and Robert B. Hawkins, Jr. dated 16 August 1984 and 11 August 1986. The manuscript is thereby made available for research purposes. All literary rights in the manuscript, including the right to publish, are reserved to The Bancroft Library of the University of California, Berkeley. No part of the manuscript may be quoted for publication without the written permission of the Director of The Bancroft Library of the University of California, Berkeley. Requests for permission to quote for publication should be addressed to the Regional Oral History Office, 486 Library, and should include identification of the specific passages to be quoted, anticipated use of the passages, and identification of the user. The legal agreement with A. Lawrence Chickering and Robert B. Hawkins, Jr. requires that they be notified of the request and allowed thirty days in which to respond. It is recommended that this oral history be cited as follows : A. Lawrence Chickering and Robert B. Hawkins, Jr., "Poverty Programs and Other Conservative Policy Strategies, 1970-1984," an oral history conducted in 1984 by Gabrielle Morris, Regional Oral History Office, The Bancroft Library, University of California, Berkeley, 1986. Copy No . A. Lawrence Chickering 1984 Photo by Mark Citret ROBERT B. HAWKINS, JR. 1982 TABLE OF CONTENTS 'A. Lawrence Chickering and Robert B. Hawkins, Jr. PREFACE i INTERVIEW HISTORY v I PERSONAL BACKGROUNDS: OBSERVATIONS OF POVERTY PROGRAMS IN NEW YORK CITY AND WASHINGTON STATE 1 II CALIFORNIA OFFICE OF ECONOMIC OPPORTUNITY; LEWIS UHLER AS DIRECTOR, 1970- 1971 Legal Services Paradoxes Alternate Models for Empowering Minorities Education Vouchers; Two Kinds of Help Blacks and Politics; Complexity of Federalism Accountability in Self-Help Programs 19 III ROBERT HAWKINS BECOMES DIRECTOR OF CALIFORNIA OEO A Need for Balance Economic Development Efforts 23 IV INSTITUTE FOR CONTEMPORARY STUDIES, AND OTHER GOVERNMENTAL RESEARCH 29 V RONALD REAGAN'S LEADERSHIP 36 VI FURTHER EXPERIENCES WITH CALIFORNIA POVERTY PROGRAMS 43 Relations with Washington and the State Health and Welfare Agency 43 California Rural Legal Assistance Vetoes; Other Legal Services Ventures 45 Bureaucratic Instincts 49 Varieties of Development Ideas; Lieutenant Governor's Role 52 Local Officials' Problems 57 VII GOVERNOR REAGAN'S LOCAL GOVERNMENT TASK FORCE, 1973-74 60 Conflicting Philosophies of Regional Government 60 Task Force Members and Organization 63 Alternate Findings on Special Districts and .Local Agency Formation 66 Task Force Process 69 Lack of Consensus in the Governor's Office and Cabinet 71 Governance as Politics: Neighborhood Units of Government, Contract Cities 74 Response from Cities and Counties 78 Changing Strategies in the 1980s: Advisory Commission on Intergovernmental Relations, Sequoia Institute 81 Varied Options for Organizational Change 84 VIII THOUGHTS ON THE INTELLECTUAL ELITE; INITIATING POLICY STUDIES 88 Politicization of the 1960s 88 Absolute and Relative Concepts of Poverty 90 The Opinion-making Culture; Adversary Oppositional Needs 93 Early Projects of the Institute for Contemporary Studies 98 TAPE GUIDE 104 APPENDIX A Press release, State Office of Planning and Research July 24, 1974 105 APPENDIX B "The task-force report Reagan didn't buy," California Journal, September 1974 107 APPENDIX C Selected pages from The Letter, from the Institute for Contemporary Studies, Vol. XII, No. 1, Winter /Spring 1986 108 INDEX m PREFACE are the focus of California government and politics from 1966 through 1974 Documenta the Reagan Gubernatorial Era Series of the state Government History Office of The Bancroft tion Project, conducted by the Regional Oral History at the Davis and Library with the participation of the oral history programs Graduate Los Angeles campuses of the University of California, Claremont School, carries and California State University at Fullerton. This series of interviews forward studies of significant issues and processes in public administration inter begun by the Regional Oral History Office in 1969. In previous series, views with over 220 legislators, elected and appointed officials, and others active in public life during the governorships of Earl Warren, Goodwin Knight, and Edmund Brown, Sr., were completed and are now available to scholars. The first unit in the Government History Documentation Project, the Earl centered on Warren Series, produced interviews with Warren himself and others state and key developments in politics and government administration at the social welfare county level, innovations in criminal justice, public health, and from 1925-1953. Interviews in the Knight-Brown Era continued the earlier with inquiries into the nature of the governor's office and its relations executive departments and the legislature, and explored the rapid social and economic changes in the years 1953-1966, as well as preserving Brown's own account of his extensive political career. Among the issues documented were the rise and fall of the Democratic party; establishment of the California Water Plan; election law changes, reapportionment and new political techniques; education and various social programs. During Ronald Reagan's years as governor, important changes became evident in California government and politics. His administration marked an end to the progressive period which had provided the determining outlines of government organization and political strategy since 1910 and the beginning of a period of limits in state policy and programs, the extent of which is not yet clear. Interviews in this series deal with the efforts of the administration to increase government efficiency and economy and with organizational innovations designed to expand the management capability of the governor's office, as well as critical aspects of state health, education, welfare, conservation, and criminal justice programs. Legislative and executive department narrators provide their perspec tives on these efforts and their impact on the continuing process of legislative and elective politics. Work began on the Reagan Gubernatorial Era Series in 1979. Planning and research for this phase of the project were augmented by participation of other oral history programs with experience in public affairs. Additional advisors were selected to provide relevant background for identifying persons to be interviewed and understanding of issues to be documented. Project research files, developed by the Regional Oral History Office staff to provide a systematic background for questions, were updated to add personal, topical, and chronological data for the Reagan period to the existing base of information for 1925 through 1966, and to supplement research by participating programs as needed. Valuable, continuing assistance in preparing for interviews was provided by the Hoover Institution at Stanford University, which houses the Ronald Reagan Papers, and by the State Archives in Sacramento. ii An effort was made to select a range of interviewees that would reflect the increase in government responsibilities and that would represent diverse points of view. In general, participating programs were contracted to conduct interviews on topics with which they have particular expertise, with persons presently located nearby. Each interview is identified as to the originating institution. Most interviewees have been queried on a limited number of topics with which they were personally connected; a few narrators with unusual breadth of experience have been asked to discuss a multiplicity of subjects. When possible, the interviews have traced the course of specific issues leading up to and resulting from events during the Reagan administration in order to develop a sense of the continuity and interrelationships that are a significant aspect of the government process. Throughout Reagan's years as governor, there was considerable interest and speculation concerning his potential for the presidency; by the time interview ing for this project began in late 1980, he was indeed president. Project interviewers have attempted, where appropriate, to retrieve recollections of that contemporary concern as it operated in the governor's office. The intent of the present interviews, however, is to document the course of California government from 1967 to 1974, and Reagan's impact on it. While many interview ees frame their narratives of the Sacramento years in relation to goals and performance of Reagan's national administration, their comments often clarify aspects of the gubernatorial period that were not clear at the time. Like other historical documentation, these oral histories do not in themselves provide the complete record of the past. It is hoped that they offer firsthand experience of passions and personalities that have influenced significant events past and present. The Reagan Gubernatorial Era Series was begun with funding from the California legislature via the office of the Secretary of State and continued through the generosity of