DISTINGUISHED VISITORS

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 1985

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 direct result of pressure from the rank and file of the Labor Party and some sections of the trade union leadership to which the Premier is subservient?

Ms KIRNER (Premier) - I am not sure who The SPEAKER (Hon. Ken coghm) took the chair at wrote the question but the syntax was not as good as 2.7 p.m. and read the prayer. it could have been.

DISTINGUISHED VISITORS Honourable members interjecting.

The SPEAKER - Order! On behalf of the Ms KIRNER -S-y-n! It's all right guys, don't get members of the Legislative Assembly I welcome to excited. the Public Gallery a number of distinguished guests: firstly, Mr Stephen Brown, who, as many The answer I gave to the previous question is also honourable members would know, is the appropriate to this question. This is a very important Consul-General for Great Britain. He is the guest of issue for the community. Earlier today I was asked the honourable member for Polwarth. I also by members of the media whether I thought it was a welcome Ms Jane Cheng and Mr Eliot Charng from matter that affected the community, and why people the Taipei Economic and Cultural Office in were discussing an issue that did not seem to be Melbourne, who are the guests of the honourable very important for the community. I believe, as I member for Albert Park. think the opposition believes, that it is indeed an important issue for the community. It is so important that the government is prepared to issue QUESTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE to the community an information document on it. Honourable members interjecting. PRIVATISATION OF GOVERNMENT UTILITIES The SPEAKER - Order! The honourable member for Warrnambool! Mr KENNETT (Leader of the Opposition) - I Ms KIRNER - But what happens when the refer the Premier to her often repeated commitment opposition is asked to put its plans on the table, not that the government would introduce legislation this only for corporatisation but for privatisation? What sessional period to effect corporatisation of our are we told by the shadow Treasurer? We are told major statutory authorities and, in particular, to the that they are confidential; so confidential that the commitment made by the Minister for Consumer opposition is not prepared to release the details of its Affairs in another place, the Honourable Theo corporatisation and privatisation proposals. Theophanous, that legislation would be introduced this week. Will the Premier honour her commitment An honourable member interjected. this week; if not, why has she backed away from the commitment? Ms KIRNER - Yes, the opposition has released the broad framework, the one-page policy Ms KIRNER (Premier) - The government has a document - sorry, policy brief. It is so brief that it commitment to government trading enterprise fits on a page! When the media discovered - it (GTE) reform, and the process of discussion of that seems it was the media because no-one else was able GIE reform is currently going on both within the to discover it from the opposition - that there are party and with the public; but it is my view that working parties on the issue made up of business there needs to be a further period of discussion, and people, the names of those business people that period of discussion should be based on both an remained secret. That is fine so far as I am concerned. information paper and a statement of the principles contained in the Bill. That will be available in the Mr Kennett interjected. next two weeks; it will also be available for the opposition to support in the spring sessional period. Ms KIRNER - It is not fine in terms of the Leader of the Opposition. Details of the opposition's Mr McNAMARA (Leader of the National policies of selling off the assets of this State that are Party) - Is it not a fact that the Premier's failure to in monopoly ownership are not available for public proceed with her corporatisation legislation is a QUESTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE

1986 ASSEMBLY Tuesday. 9 June 1992 discussion. That is one of the differences between the Mr Kennett - What are you going to do? government and the opposition: our policies will be available for public discussion, the opposition's are Ms KIRNER - Isn't it wonderful! I know I not. When the opposition's policies are available for should not respond to interjections, Mr Speaker, but discussion, when it feels like it at some time in the the Leader of the Opposition asked, ''What are you far future, the differences will be clear. People do not going to do?" He should be aware that the want the opposition's secrecy and will not want its Committee for Melbourne and the government have policies once they are made public - and it seems worked very hard to ensure that Victoria has a that will be a long time yet! second carrier based in Melbourne. I should have thought that the Leader of the Opposition would say PREMIERS CONFERENCE that that is one for Victoria - never mind about its being one for Kennett or one for Kimer. Mr THOMSON (Pascoe Vale) - Will the Premier advise the House of the outcome she is seeking for The SPEAKER - Order! There is far too much Victoria from the financial Premiers Conference due audible conversation. to be held in Canberra on Friday? Ms KIRNER - The Federal government's airline Mr Elder - She's taking the begging bowl. decision will give the government the opportw1i ty to hold discussions with representatives of Qantas to Ms KIRNER (Premier) - I was very pleased to ensure that with the increased funding the airline hear the shadow Treasurer make a second statement will receive it will revive its maintenance industry, of support for the government - the first was on based in Victoria. Loy Yang last week and the second was on fiscal equalisation today. It was quite different from some Those two major decisions will be of benefit to of the backbench interjections about begging bowls. Victoria. The Premiers Conference offers the Infact-- opportunity for a third major decision, which is at last to address something that previous Premiers, Honourable members interjecting. both Labor and Liberal, have agreed to, and that is to change the basis on which financial assistance grants Ms KIRNER -It is a very important Premiers are made. Conference. In fact, it could well be a watershed conference for Victoria and New South Wales. The Premiers will be aiming for three things: first, to obtain an increase of at least 2 per cent in the The SPEAKER - Order! There is far too much financial assistance grants made to the States. audible conversation. I ask the honourable member for Forest Hill to remain silent. The SPEAKER - Order! There is far too much audible conversation. Mr Kennett interjected. Ms KIRNER -Secondly, we will be aiming to Ms KIRNER - We know who the joke is - and achieve a decent result in the area of health we know who the joker is! The conference the funding - or at least the establishment of a Premiers will be attending on Friday will be of framework within which decent results can be interest to all Victorians. I should have thought it achieved -which is a matter that all State Premiers would be of interest to the Leader of the Opposition support. and the Leader of the National Party, but obviously it is not. Most importantly, the Premier of New South Wales, Nick Greiner, and I have written to the Prime Three important decisions have been made in the Minister suggesting that it is time the conference past fortnight. The first two, the introduction of pay addressed fiscal equalisation. I am confident that, for television and the proposed airline merger, are in the the first time since its introduction - in my view it interests of Victorians. The introduction of pay is the wrong way to try to assist the States that have television is important because it will establish a fewer resources - that matter will be addressed. further base for our telecommunications industry; Given that our manufacturing bases in New South and the proposed airlines merger will allow Ansett Wales and Victoria are at risk because of current to become the second carrier -- tariff policies, it is neither rational nor sensible to require Victoria and New South Wales to go on QUESTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 1987 supporting other States that have the opportunity to without there first being a massive clean-up it would recover revenue from their mining and tourism not be of any use to the community. Some people industries. said it represented a danger to the bay. That appears to have been forgotten by the opposition. I find it Our letter makes it clear that the current system of specifically interesting that the opposition, fiscal equalisation is unsustainable and that we are particularly the Leader of the Opposition, is now not prepared to continue to accept decisions that saying, ''Don't give assistance to private enterprise". result in the people of Victoria and New South I ask honourable members to look at this Geelong Wales subsidising the people of Queensland to the Advertiser January headline: "Geelong: Kennett tune of $170 or more per person. That has to stop, reveals grand plan". I wonder what that is about. It and I believe at the Premiers Conference the Prime is about tax breaks and land tax rebates for business Minister may have the courage to ensure that it does. people in Geelong.

BA YSIDE PROJECT Honourable members interjecting.

Mr I. W. SMITH (Polwarth) - I ask the Premier The SPEAKER - Order! There is far too much why she allowed the further expenditure of millions audible conversation. I ask the honourable member of dollars of public money on the Bayside project for Portland to lower his voice. when earlier this year she was in possession of official advice that the project was no longer viable, Ms KIRNER - It is about tax breaks, land tax and why she caved in to the Deputy Premier's freebies, certainty in planning and security for strong advocacy of and support for the project in the business in Geelong. face of such advice? Mr Kennett - Hear, hear! Ms KIRNER (Premier) - The way the opposition has turned aroWld on the Sandridge issue is very Ms KIRNER - The Leader of the OppOSition interesting. Between 1988 and 1991 the project was says, ''Hear, hear!" strongly supported by the opposition. I hope people who are watching and listening to question time Mr DELZOPPO (Narracan) - On a point of today are taking note of the opposition's behaviour. order, Mr Speaker, on the question of relevance I It is Wlbelievable. This is an important issue, and suggest the Premier is at the wrong end of the bay: one the public thinks is important because the she should be at Sandridge instead of Geelong. government has invested in the vicinity of $70 million in an asset that will be -- Honourable members interjecting.

HonourabLe members interjecting. The SPEAKER - Order! I warn the honourable member for Derrimut. He is well aware of the The SPEAKER - Order! I ask the Leader of the Standing Orders; if he is unable to abide by them the Opposition and the Deputy Leader of the Chair will have no choice but to take appropriate Opposition to remain silent so that the Premier's action. At this stage I do not uphold the point of reply can be heard. order, but I ask the Premier to relate her remarks to the question. Ms KIRNER - We have invested approximately $70 million in what will be a prime asset for all Ms KIRNER (Premier) - In response to the Victorians. There was advice that care ought to be humorous point of order raised by the honourable taken in the development, and care was taken. That member for Narracan, I am well aware that the advice was reflected in the conditions associated project the Leader of the Opposition is prepared to with the heads of agreement. The heads of bankroll is Baylink, not Bayside. I am also well agreement were not finalised because the Sandridge aware that the Leader of the Opposition will City Development Company Pty Ltd was not personally coordinate the region's rebirth. Heaven prepared to meet those conditions. That is a pity help the region! because in my view the Bayside project would have been a great asset for the people of South Melbourne. Mr Kennett - Two bob!

The environmental effects statement said that if the Ms KIRNER - What we have here is a two bob asset were used for parkland or anything else each way Leader of the OppOSition. When a major QUESTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE

1988 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992 project that will be an asset to Victoria is placed in who was required to forward a common assessment front of the Victorian public and the Leader of the task (CAT) of 2000 words or 10 pages submitting Opposition can see it running well in front of him, some 20 000 words or 100 pages. Detennining what he supports it; but when things get a little tough, his is the required workload for CATs is a problem for attitude changes. What he is saying now about both teachers and students. support and tax breaks for Baylink is what he said about support for Sandridge. Students undertaking the higher school certifica te and the matriculation certificate were allowed study Honourable members interjecting. periods before the exams undertaken at the end of the school year. The Victorian Curriculum and The SPEAKER - Order! The Leader of the Assessment Board (VCAB) has not allowed for that Opposition, the Deputy Leader of the Opposition, study period in the external and internal common the Leader of the National Party and the Minister for assessment tasks. I have asked Howard Kelly, the Police and Emergency Services are making it Chairperson of VCAB, to examine whether students difficult for honourable members to hear the can have a study period to undertake the verified Premier's reply. I ask them to remain silent. and test CATs that are required to be done by August and November of this year. Ms KIRNER - I understand the members interjecting were asking that the photograph be Teachers also have an excessive workload and they incorporated, but I have much more respect for should have a class-free day for the verification of Hansard than to request that. CATs. I have requested the Department of School Education as a matter of urgency to ensure that there Bayside will be an asset for the goverrunent; and if is a class-free day so that teachers can verify CATs. I the conditions relating to the heads of agreement hope to make an a1U10W1Cement about those issues had been agreed to the govenunent and the taxpayer in the next few days. would have enjoyed even greater benefits, not a net loss. As was the case with the matriculation and higher school certificate year 12 courses, students VICTORIAN CERTIFICATE OF experience problems organising their time. That EDUCATION must be overcome by students themselves. I have asked VCAB to examine that issue and Howard Mr KENNEDY (Bendigo West) - Will the Kelly is meeting students, teachers and principals to Minister for School Education advise the House analyse the excessive student workload that exists at whether he has examined recent claims about the present and how it can be overcome. excessive workloads of year 11 and 12 students and advise the House of his response to them? This morning's newspapers reported on the excessive workload of VCE students and quoted two Mr POPE (Minister for School Education) - I am students saying that organisation is the key to the sure honourable members who have children VCE. One student was reported as saying that if undertaking the Victorian certificate of education are students organise their time well they can fit in well aware of the student workload of the VCE. study and sport with no trouble at all. They will also be aware of the anxieties that arise as a result of the workloads of not just students but also My department will address each and every issue teachers. that arises with the VCE. As I said, it is in its first full year of implementation and I believe the anxieties of I have already announced that I have established a students and teachers can be addressed for the working party headed by Michael Nonnan to bettennent of the VCE. examine teacher workloads. As the VCE is in its first full year of implementation it is to be expected that BAYSIDE PROJECT students will be anxious about the requirements. However, it is clear that a number of VCE students Mr GUDE (Hawthorn) - I refer the Deputy are submitting work well in excess of what is Premier in his capacity as the Minister for Major expected of them. I have no doubt that other Projects to the original tender procedure for the members of the House could come up with Bayside project and, in particular, to the selection anecdotes about the problems experienced by criteria established by the then Premier, the students. I heard one the other day about a student honourable member for Bundoora. Were those QUESTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 1989 selection criteria followed and was the tendering In November last year the honourable member for process carried out with due propriety following Bendigo East said: acceptable public tendering practices? The Bill amends the Bayside Project Act which was Mr KENNAN (Minister for Major Projects) - especially drafted and passed by Parliament so that the The opposition well knows who won the tender for Sandridge consortium ... could proceed with this large the Bayside project. It has continually supported this and exciting development without waiting for the very important project, but \\;'hen it believes it can proclamation of the Subdivision Act. obtain political mileage it wants to sledge the project. I remind members opposite who want to The honourable member for Bendigo East engage in sledging the project that it was legislated previously lauded the Sandridge company and told for on three separate occasions. the developers how good they were. Now the Deputy Leader of the Liberal Party wants to sledge Mr Elder interjected. the selection in 1987 of Sandridge as the developer for the project. The SPEAKER - Order! The honourable member for Ballarat North! That ill behoves the opposition. It knows very well that the government's attitude towards the project Mr KENNAN - In 1988 in a debate on the has been consistent and that the government Bayside project the honourable member for Ivanhoe selected the best available developer at that time. is reported in Hansard as having said: Members opposite should remembe'r that this was a huge toxic wasteland, and indeed -- The opposition is excited about the project and I look forward to the steady growth of ~ area. Honourable members interjecting.

The then honourable member for Shepparton, the The SPEAKER - Order! The Minister has now former Leader of the National Party, said: been answering the question for approximately 4 minutes. The original question related to the I cannot remember hearing the opposition tendering process, and I ask the Minister to come to complimenting the government for some years, but that. when a good project is being developed it is only right and proper that it should get support. Mr KENNAN - Sandridge was selected after an exhaustive review of all the available options. On In the other place Mr Chamberlain said: balance it came up as the best available developer for the project, a project that was endorsed by the This important Bill deals with an exciting project, to use opposition on three occasions through three the Minister's words. I support him in that assessment. different Acts of Parliament.

As recently as 30 May the honourable member for AUDITOR-GENERAL Doncaster said: Mr McNAMARA (Leader of the National The Bayside project has received the support of the Party) - I refer the Premier to a sustained, coalition parties since it was first proposed in or around deliberate and orchestrated campaign against the 1984 or 1985. The development is unique - Office of the Auditor-General by her Treasurer, by the Minister for School Education and by the I well understand the opposition does not like being Minister for Manufacturing and Industry reminded of those things - Development. Do those attacks have her support? Further, will the Premier give an assurance to the in terms of what it will do for Victoria. House that the Auditor-General's report on the Treasurer's statement for this financial year will be Mr Birrell, Leader of the Liberal Party in the other tabled by the government prior to the election? place said: Ms KIRNER (Premier) - That is exactly the The Liberal and National parties support the same as a question that was aslsed some few weeks development of the Bayside area ... ago by, I think, the same honourable member. QUESTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE

1990 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992

Mr McNamara interjected. The SPEAKER - Order! I warn the honourable member for Mildura. He is well aware of the Ms KIRNER - It may not have been asked by Standing Orders and if he is unable to abide by them the Leader of the National Party, but it was certainly the Chair will have no choice but to take appropriate asked by an opposition member. action.

Honourable members interjecting. Ms KIRNER - I again put on the record that I do not believe the use of bullying tactics is appropriate The SPEAKER - Order! There is far too much in this Parliament. I will answer the second part of audible conversation; it is impossible for the Premier the question. to be clearly heard - Honourable members interjecting. Ms KIRNER - It is quite clear that the Auditor-General determines the time at which he Ms KIRNER - The first part of the question, tables his reports - this or any other report - not which I have answered, was, ''When will the the government. Auditor-General table his report?" Firstly, it is his decision. Secondly, I support the right of the Honourable members interjecting. Auditor-General to report to this House without fear or favour and to comment outside this place if he so Mr McNamara - Do you support the wishes. I support those positions strongly and I have Auditor-General? Do you - yes or no? supported them, as honourable members well know, in public. Ms KIRNER - When I answered the first part of the question - However, on the matter of the integration report in my view, on matters of policy the Auditor-General Honourable members interjecting. went beyond his brief.

The SPEAKER - Order! The Leader of the Honourable members interjecting. National Party is out of order. Ms KIRNER - On that point. He chose to do so Ms KIRNER - I hope the film now being taken and I chose to disagree with him on the basis that shows the opposition members to be as bad as they we, the government, are entitled to make policy. I look from my viewpoint across the table. The believe our policy on integration is internationally bullying tactics of the Leader of the National Party sound, internationally renowned and internationally are objectionable. They are not much better than the supported, and I do not resile from it. bullying tactics of the Leader of the OppOSition, but from the Leader of the National Party they are AUSTRALIAN TOURISM EXCHANGE unacceptable. Mr COLE (Melbourne) - Will the Minister for Members of this House have a responsibility. They Tourism inform the House of the economic impact should not try to bully people who are asking on Victoria of the Australian Tourism Exchange that questions or making speeches. That is one of the is taking place this week at the World Congress reasons why some honourable members in this place Centre? do not feel game even to get to their feet. Mr CRABB (Minister for Tourism) - The Honourable members interjecting. Australian Tourism Exchange is Australia's No. 1 tourism trade fair. It is being held today and during Ms KIRNER - You ought to be ashamed of the next three days at our very successful World yourselves! Talk to my honourable members! It is Congress Centre. Last year the International time you people understood that! Tourism Exchange resulted in $1.2 billion worth of business for Australia, of which one-third went to Honourable members interjecting. Victoria.

Mr Bildstien - What are they doing here? About 600 overseas buyers and more than 700 Australian sellers of tourism services are attending the exchange. Given those increased QUESTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 1991 numbers, we expect the amount of business sold this our spectacular World Congress Centre and see the year to be even greater than that sold last year. This 1500 people who are transacting something like is one indicator of the phenomenal growth being $1.5 billion worth of business for the biggest growth experienced in the tourism industry. industry in this State.

In 1990-91 this State experienced a 2.3 per cent COMMUNITY SERVICES VICTORIA increase in domestic tourism, compared with a 3 per cent reduction in the remainder of Australia, and a Mr JOHN (Bendigo East) - I refer the Minister 7 per cent increase in the number of international for Community Services to her response to my tourists, the same figure that applied to other States. question of 27 May on the sect raid when she The figures for 1991-92 are looking even better. strongly refuted the claim that any of the children were strip searched. Has she since investigated the On the strength of the extraordinary success of matter and does she still stand by her denial that the major events through last spring and summer and children were strip searched? on the strength of the very successful figures achieved this Easter for tourist attractions at Mrs SETCHES (Minister for Community Warmambool, the Great Ocean Road, the Lakes, the Services) - As he said, the honourable member Grampians (Gariwerd) and the River Murray, and raised this matter the last time the House met and I given the forward bookings for this year's snow said that when children are placed in the care of season, we can expect at least to match the targeted Community Services Victoria (CSV) certain things figure of an 8 per cent overall growth. take place including the removal of clothing to bath children, to put them to bed, to ensure that they are The prediction for the tourism industry in Australia examined by a paediatrician and simply to care for is for a growth figure of 8 per cent per annum for the children in a normal way. rest of the century, achieving ultimately between 5 million and 6 million overseas tourists by the year I again totally refute the imputation in the question 2000. To maximise the benefits to this State from that about children in the care of C5V being strip extraordinary growth it is necessary to develop searched. It is outrageous, it is untrue and it is tourist facilities such as accommodation, transport absolutely terrible to say that the children were and other types of infrastructure. treated that way. They were treated with care and respect by C5V. In fact, when older children did not Every aspect of tourism seems to be going well wish to have their jumpers removed when being except one: the banks. The banking system in examined by a paediatrician, their wishes were Victoria, and in every other State in Australia, seems respected and their jumpers and outside clothes to be remarkably reluctant to recognise the success were not removed. Now, put up or shut up about and growth of the tourism industry. Because the this! It is outrageous! banks lost megamillions by supporting gross and speculative ventures in Queensland in the LIBRARY SERVICES 19805-- Mr ANDRIANOPOULOS (5t Albans) - Will the Mr Perrin interjected. Minister for the Arts advise the House of the action he is taking to provide support, for the first time, for Mr CRABB - Then it was corporatised, now it is cooperative activities in the provision of library privatised. All the banks had the same experience in services? Australia - they lost money by supporting speculative ventures in Queensland. And now they Mr KENNAN (Minister for the Arts)­ seem to have taken the attitude that they will not Honourable members will be aware that the State support tourism ventures anywhere. Many people government funds municipal libraries to the extent in Victoria are prepared to invest their own money. of some $20 million a year. This year, for the first They are keen to expand their facilities or innovate time, we decided to put a little more than $1 million and introduce new infrastructure, but they are aside for cooperative activity grants. The purpose of finding it extraordinarily difficult to get a decent the grants is so that libraries can increase hearing from the banks. enormously their productivity and use in local areas by cooperating with other libraries, particularly by I challenge the bankers of Victoria to take some time taking advantage of computerisation. out, either today or in the next three days, to visit CORRECTION OF DIVISION LISTS

1992 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992

Some regions have libraries that cooperate with each members to take an interest in this very innovative other better than others. We wanted to ensure that scheme. there was an incentive in the library grants so that libraries would be encouraged to institute programs COMMUNITY SERVICES VICTORIA leading to greater cooperation and to the goal we all have - that wherever one lives in Victoria, even if it Mr JOHN (Bendigo East) - I refer to the sect raid is in the more remote parts, one should have the by officers of Community Services Victoria and same access to the information database that every advise the Minister for Community Services that I other Victorian has. With the advantages of hold some 11 statutory declarations by children and computerisation and the electronic transfer of parents to the effect that children were stripped and information, we now face the possibility of bringing examined. Does the Minister now accept that she has all Victorians on to effectively the same database misled the House? within reasonable budgetary provisions. Mrs SETCHES (Minister for Community Last Friday night at Heidelberg I had the pleasure of Services) - I would view with interest copies of the aIU10uncing with my colleagues the honourable so-called statutory declarations. It is now time for members for Eltham and Thomastown a $75 000 me to investigate the claims being made by the grant to the Yarra Plenty Regional Library Service. It opposition and by the Children of God sect parents. is establishing a library centre of excellence that I will be pleased to advise Parliament further on the involves keying in some 26 or so local schools by basis of information that I will gain from the electronic means to the information base at the department. However, I have also been advised by library, thereby giving the schools access not only to the department that medical examinations were catalogue information but also to a state-of-the-art carried out as is usual, by paediatricians; that CD-ROM network. children were --

That will have an enormous impact on schools, and Honourable members interjecting. the Minister for School Education will shortly aIU10unce an initiative in that regard. It means that The SPEAKER -Order! It is impossible to hear all the users of school libraries and library services in the Minister's reply. This is an important issue and the Yarra Plenty region - where the members I honourable members are entitled to hear the have referred to have been so cooperative - will Minister's reply. I ask honourable members to have access to a cost-effective network between remain silent. public and other libraries. Mrs SETCHES - I advised Parliament that when Mr Heffeman interjected. they were taken into custody on that day the children, who were of various ages, were treated Mr KENNAN - I urge the honourable member and looked after in a way that would be expected of for Ivanhoe to take a greater interest in what is going a statutory organisation such as Community on in that area. Services Victoria. I will be pleased to accept copies of the statutory declarations and follow them up A range of cooperative grants will certainly be of accordingly. great interest to all honourable members. They extend through municipalities such as Hawthorn, CORRECTION OF DIVISION LISTS Altona and Frankston and also, and more importantly for my colleagues in regional Victoria, The SPEAKER - Order! I inform the House tha t to north-eastern Victoria, where there is a capacity in the division that occurred on Thursday, for greater regional cooperation. They extend to the 28 March 1992 on the Fair Trading (Environmental Central Highlands, Bendigo, Glenelg, the Wimmera, Labelling) Bill the tellers for the Noes inadvertently the Goulbum Valley, Corangamite, Benalla, Swan recorded the name of the honourable member for Hill, the eastern suburbs and, as I mentioned, the Sandringham, Mc Lea, instead of the name of the north-eastern region and the Frankston area - we honourable member for Malvern, Mc Leigh. The would not want to leave out that area. Clerk will make the necessary corrections to the division lists. In total some 44 public libraries will share in the $1 million or so being allocated under the cooperative activities grant scheme, and I urge local PETITIONS

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 1993

PETITIONS By Mr Cooper (5645 signatures)

The Clerk - I have received the following petitions Chemicals - use, transport and storage for presentation to Parliament: To the Honourable the Speaker and members of the MMBW planning rate - Melton Legislative Assembly in Parliament assembled:

To the Honourable the Speaker and members of the The humble petition of the undersigned citizens of Legislative Assembly in Parliament assembled: Victoria respectfully showeth:

As the Melbourne and Metropolitan Board of Works We are concerned with the dangers resulting from the plays no water or sewerage role in Melton, the use, transport and storage of chemicals as they affect petitioners therefore ask that the planning rate be personal safety and the environment and we request removed. We, the residents of Melton, gain nothing out that a Parliamentary committee be established to of these rates, which we have to pay each year to the examine the use, transport and storage of chemicals, MMBW. whether commercial, industrial, agricultural or veterinary chemicals. We ask that the committee And your petitioners, as in duty bound, will ever pray. examine the need for such chemicals and make recommendations regarding minimisation of use and By Mr Cunningham (6069 signatures) alternatives.

Speed limit - Horn Street, Leongatha And your petitioners, as in duty bound, will ever pray.

To the Honourable the Speaker and members of the By Ms Kimer (279 signatures) Legislative Assembly in Parliament assembled: Laid on table. The humble petition of the undersigned citizens of the State of Victoria objects strongly to the speed limit in AUDITOR-GENERAL'S REPORT Horn Street in front of Leongatha Christian School and Mary MacKillop College. We believe that the speed Response limit should be 60 kilometres per hour in that area. Mr HARROWFIELD (Minister for Finance) And your petitioners, as in duty bound, will ever pray. presented response by Minister for Finance to Auditor-General's report on finance statement By Mr Wallace (288 signatures) 1990-91 together with progress report on issues from November 1991 response to Penalties for serious sexual offences Auditor-General's report on Ministerial portfolios.

To the Honourable the Speaker and members of the Laid on table. Legislative Assembly in Parliament assembled: STATE CONSERVATION STRATEGY The humble petition of the undersigned citizens of Victoria sheweth: Mr HARROWFIELD (Minister for Finance) presented report of State conservation strategy That the penalties for crimes such as rape, abduction, March 1992. serious assault and sexual penetration of a child are hopelessly inadequate and do little to reflect the Laid on table. seriousness of the crime or act as a deterrent to would-be offenders. PARLIAMENT OF VICTORIA COMMITTEE Your petitioners therefore pray that the government introduce corporal punishment as an additional Parliamentary service committee penalty to imprisonment for criminals convicted of heinous violent offences. Mr DELZOPPO (Narracan) presented third progress report of Joint Select Committee on the And your petitioners, as in duty bound, will ever pray. Parliament of Victoria on the appointment of a WORKCARE

1994 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992

Parliamentary service committee, together with tabling the following audited reports for the minutes of evidence. quarter ended 31st March 1992 - Accident Compensation Commission Laid on table. Victorian Accident Rehabilitation Council Ordered that report be printed. WorkCare Appeals Board WORKCARE Medical Panels Hospitals Superannuation Board - Report for the year The SPEAKER presented reports for quarter ended 1990-91 30 September 1991 of: Land Conservation Council - Final Recommendations Victorian Accident Rehabilitation Council; for the Wilderness Special Investigation, November 1991 and for quarter ended 31 March 1992 of: Parliamentary Committees Act 1968 - Response of the Accident Compensation Commission; Minister for Police and Emergency Services with respect to the recommendations made by the Social WorkCare Appeals Board; and Development Committee's first, second and third Reports into Strategies to deal with the issue of Medical Panels Community Violence. given to the Speaker pursuant to Accident Physiotherapists Registration Board - Report for the Compensation Act 1985. year 1991 Laid on table. Planning and Environment Act 1987 - Notices of AUDITOR-GENERAL'S REPORT approval of amendments to the following Planning Schemes: Bayside development Broadmeadows Planning Scheme - No. L30 Brunswick Planning Scheme - No. L17 The SPEAKER presented special report No. 18 on Bayside development. Bulla Planning Scheme - Nos U8, 159 Cranboume Planning Scheme - Nos L69, L70 Laid on table. Croydon Planning Scheme - No. L45 Ordered to be printed. Flinders Planning Scheme - No. L97 BLF CUSTODIAN Goulburn Shire Planning Scheme - No. L7 Hastings Planning Scheme - Nos L33, L48, L50 The SPEAKER presented 19th report given to the Speaker pursuant to section 7A of BLF Keilor Planning Scheme - No. L44 (De-recognition) Act 1985 by the Custodian Melton Planning Scheme -No. L17 appointed under section 7(1) of that Act. Metropolitan Region Planning Scheme - No. R 114 Laid on table. Momington Planning Scheme - No. L41 Ordered to be printed. Nunawading Planning Scheme -No. L38

PAPERS Pakenham Planning Scheme - No. L43 Shepparton Shire Planning Scheme - No. L37 Laid on table by Clerk: Traralgon (Shire) Planning Scheme - No. L40 Accident Compensation Act 1985 - Whittlesea Planning Scheme - No. L66 Communication from the Assistant Minister for State Casual Employees Superannuation Board - Labour explaining the reasons for the delay in Report for the year 1990-91 APPROPRIATION MESSAGES

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 1995

Statutory Rules under the following Acts: AS 3163-1985-Approval and test specification-Electric washing machines Building Control Act 1981-SR No. 77 for household use Country Fire Authority Act 1958 - SR No. 75 Australian Wool Corporation Test Method County Court Act 1958 - SR No. 76 102-1982: Method for the measurement of the felting severity of the wool product Drugs, Poisons and Controlled Substances Act wash cycle or washing action of domestic 1981 -SR No. 73 washing machines Public Service Act 1974 - Public Service SRNosBO,81 Determination No. 13 SR No. 82, together with copies of the State Electricity Act 1958- following documents as required by Section SR No. 78, together with copies of the 32 of the Interpretation of Legislation Act 1984 following documents as required by Section to accompany the Statutory Rule: 32 of the Interpretation of Legislation Act 1984 Australian Standard to accompany the Statutory Rule: 1861.1-1988-Air-conditioning Australian Standard 1430-1986-Household units-Methods of assessing and rating Refrigerators and Freezers performance Part I-Refrigerated room air-condi tioners AS 1042-1973-Direct-acting indicating electrical measuring instruments and their AS 1024-1971-Direct recording electrical accessories measuring instruments and their accessories AS 1284.1-1991-Electricity metering Part 1: General purpose induction watthour AS 1042-1973-Direct-acting indicating meters electrical measuring instruments and their accessories AS 3303-1990/New Zealand Standard 6324-1990-Approval and test AS 1284.1-1991-Electricity metering Part 1: specification-Particular requirements for General purpose induction watthour refrigerators and food freezers meters AS 2575.2-1989/New Zealand Standard AS 1677-1986-Refrigerating systems (as 6205.2-1989-Energy labelling of appliances amended) Part 2-Refrigerators, refrigerator I freezers AS 3179-1989-Approval and test and freezers-Determination of energy specification-Refrigerated room air consumption and efficiency rating (except conditioners (as amended) section 5 of that Standard). It It It It It SR No. 79, together with copies of the following documents as required by Section Proclamation fixing an operative date pursuant to an 32 of the Interpretation of Legislation Act 1984 Order of the House dated 25 October 1988: to accompany the Statutory Rule: Australian Standard State Electricity Commission (Amendment) Act 1992- 2040-1990-Performance of household Whole Act; 27 May 1992 (Gazette No. G20, 27 May, electrical appliances-Clothes washing 1992). machines APPROPRIATION MESSAGES AS 1284-1991-Electricity metering-Parts 1, 3 and 4 Messages read recommending appropriations for: AS 1284, Part 2-1973-Electricity metering Part 2-Portable alternating current Borrowing and Investment Powers (MMBW) Bill rotating standard watthours meters Funeral Directors Registration Bill AS 2442-1981-Performance of household electrical appliances-Rotary dothes dryers MELBOURNE UNIVERSITY (VCAH) BILL

1996 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992

MELBOURNE UNIVERSITY (VCAH) 5. Clause 11, page 8, line 25, omit "other clauses" and BILL insert "clauses 2 to 5,7 and 8". 6. Clause 11, page 8, line 33, omit "educational". Returned from Council with message relating to Council's suggested amendments. 7. Clause 11, page 8, line 34, omit "(8)" and insert "(10)". 8. Clause 11, page 9, line 2, omit "educational". Message read recommending further appropriation. 9. Clause 11, page 9, line 3, omit "some of the land is The SPEAKER - Order! As the required used for" and insert "the main use of the land in statement of intention has been made pursuant to the grant is". section 85(5)(c) of the Constitution Act 1975 in 10. Clause 13, line 21, omit "The" and insert"As soon as relation to the Bill, I am of the opinion that the practicable after the date of commencement of this suggested amendments need to be made by an section, the". absolute majority. 11. Clause 13, line 22, omit "may" and insert "shall". Message from Council considered. 12. Clause 13, line 28, omit ''The'' and insert"As soon as Council's suggested amendments: practicable after the date of publication of the Order in the Government Gazette, the". 1. Clause 2, line 5, omit "1 July 1992" and insert "a day or days to be proclaimed". 13. Clause 13, line 28, omit "may" and insert "shall". 2. Clause 3, line 8, omit "means 1 July 1992;" and 14. Clause 13, after line 33 insert - insert- "() A Crown grant under this section must include the condition that the land in the grant must be used for agricultural education or for some (a) for the purposes of section 11(4) (in so far as it other purpose approved by the Minister in relates to the land in clause 1 of Part 1 of the accordance with sub-section (4). Schedule) and section 11(8)(a), means a day appointed by the Governor in Council by ( ) Part of the land in a Crown grant under this notice published in the Government Gazette; section may with the approval of the Minister be used for purposes other than agricultural (b) for the purposes of section 11(4) (in so far as it education but so that at all times the main use relates to the land in clauses 2 to 5,7 and 8 of of the land in the grant is agricultural Part 1 of the schedule) and section 11(8)(b), education .... means a day appointed by the Governor in Council by notice published in the Government Mr ROPER (Minister for Employment, Gazette; Post-Secondary Education and Training) - I move: (c) for the purposes of all other provisions of this That this House make the amendments suggested by Act, means 1 July 1992;" the Council. 3. Clause 11, page 8, after line 19 insert- The amendments deal with various parcels of "() If land subject to a demise mentioned in Victorian College of Agriculture and Horticulture sub-section (5) is granted to Melbourne, land and allow that land to be transferred in stages section 273(3) and (4) of the Land Act 1958 to the University of Melbourne. The opposition cease to apply to that land and section 273(1) previously sought more stringent amendments that and (2) apply as if they referred to Melbourne stipulated that the land could be used for instead of the Minister. agricultural purposes only. The government has () The revocation of any reservation under this been able to persuade members of the opposition to section and any grant made under this section expand the amendments so that the land can be used do not affect the continuity of any licence primarily for agricultural purposes. existing over any land to which the revocation or grant applies, being a licence granted by the Members of the opposition raised other problems, as College or any of its predecessors in law.". a consequence of which the major amendment provides that although the land is to be used 4. Clause 11, page 8, line 21, omit "may at any time" primarily for agricultural education it can be used and insert "shall as soon as practicable". for other purposes. Among other things the ROYAL MELBOURNE INSTITUTE OF TECHNOLOGY BILL

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 1997 amendment will ensure that, after proper 4. Clause 54, line 31, omit "Part 3" and insert "Part 2". negotiations, the Wimmera college land can be used 5. Clause 54, line 35, omit "Part 3" and insert "Part 2". by the Country Fire Authority, which would have been prevented by the amendments previously 6. Schedule I, omit Part 2. suggested by the opposition. 7. Schedule I, omit "PART 3" and insert "PART 2". I commend the amendments to the House. Mr ROPER (Minister for Employment, Post-Secondary Education and Training) - I move: Mr W. O. McGRATH (Lowan) - I appreciate the fact that the Minister for Employment, That the amendments be agreed to. Post-Secondary Education and Training has taken the opportunity to ensure that the land at the The amendments are of a technical and drafting Longerenong campus can be used by the Country nature; therefore, I suggest that the House supports Fire Authority (CFA) for training exercises, which them. are already well advanced. The amendments will also ensure that the land can be used for training by The SPEAKER - Order! As the required various CFA fire brigades in the western part of the statement of intention has been made pursuant to State. section 85(5)(c) of the Constitution Act 1975, I am of the opinion that the amendments require to be After the officer in charge of CFA region No. 17, passed by an absolute majority. JOM Lloyd, raised the matter with me, I took it up with the shadow Minister for tertiary education and Motion agreed to by absolute majority. training, the Honourable Haddon Storey, who, in negotiations with the Minister, was able to ensure SWINBURNE UNIVERSITY OF that fire brigade training facilities can be established TECHNOLOGY BILL on the campus at Longerenong. Returned from Council with message relating to The SPEAKER - Order! As there is not an amendments. absolute majority of the House present, I ask the Council's amendments: Clerk to ring the bells. 1. Clause 7, line 31, after "in" insert "or managing". Bells rung. 2. Clause 19, page 13, line 4, after "Council," insert "the Academic Board,". Required number of members having assembled in Chamber: 3. Clause 39, line 32, after ''Board of" insert "Technical". 4. Clause 43, line 31, omit "sub-section (6)" and insert Motion agreed to by absolute majority. "sub-section (7)". Ordered to be returned to Council with message 5. Clause 53, line 10, omit "section 7(5)" and insert intimating decision of House. "section 7(6)".

ROYAL MELBOURNE INSTITUTE OF 6. Clause 60, line 25, after "rights" insert "but excluding TECHNOLOGY BILL the land described in Book 722 Number 246". 7. Clause 68, after line 32 insert - Returned from Council with message relating to '(d) in Schedule 2, omit "Swinburne Limited".' amendments. The SPEAKER - Order! As the required Council's amendments: statement of intention has been made pursuant to 1. Clause 31, line 28, omit "Statutes may make" and section 8S(5)(c) of the Constitution Act 1975, I am of insert "Council, after consultation with the State the opinion that the amendments of the Legislative Training Board, may make Statutes making". Council require to be passed by an absolute majority.

2. Clause 38, page 24, line 3, omit "sub-section (6)" and Mr ROPER (Minister for Employment, insert "sub-section (7)". Post-Secondary Education and Training) - I move: 3. Clause 54, lines 16 and 17, omit "Parts 1 and 2" and insert ''Part 1". That the amendments be agreed to. ALPINE RESORTS (AMENDMENT) BILL

1998 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992

The amendments are of similar nature to the the agreement of the relevant management amendments just agreed to by the House on the authority. Clause 5 addresses those issues by Royal Melbourne Institute of Technology Bill. They making provision for agreements to be entered into are basically drafting amendments, with one change with other public authorities and prescribing the to land described in the original Bill where there was broad basis for the conditions that may be included a slight omission. in such agreements.

Motion agreed to by absolute majority. Clause 6 provides the required regulation-making power to impose cross-country trail fees and for the ALPINE RESORTS (AMENDMENT) BILL commission or its delegates to determine where regulatory provisiOns may apply. Introduction and first reading I commend the Bill to the House. Received from Council. Mr W. D. McGRATH (Lowan) - The Bill Read first time on motion of Mr CRABB (Minister substitutes a retirement age of 72 years for 65 years for Tourism). for part-time commissioners of the Alpine Resorts Commission. Many people believe they are able to Second reading carry on with their usual activities at 65 years of age and the opposition believes a retirement age of 72 is Mr CRABB (Minister for Tourism) - I move: satisfactory for part-time commissioners so that they can continue to pass on their expertise in the That this Bill be now read a second time. management of the commission. The amendment does not necessarily mean that all part-time The purpose of this Bill is twofold: firstly, it amends commissioners will serve until they are 72 years of the Act to provide for retirement of members of the age, but it gives them the opportunity to continue commission at 72 years of age in accordance with past 65 years of age if they so wish. Cabinet guidelines for the retirement age for part-time commissioners. Clause 4 substitutes "72" The Bill enables the commission to manage for "65" in section 6(4)(a) of the Principal Act; and, cross-country skiing facilities effectively and to secondly, it will enable the Alpine Resorts apply cross-country skiing trail fees. It is a Commission to manage cross-country skiing continuation of the government's philosophy of the facilities effectively and to apply cross-country user-pays principle. I hope the scale of fees that will skiing trail fees. be implemented will not restrict people from participating in cross-country skiing. Grass skiing as In October 1991 following advice from the Legal and well as the various forms of snow skiing are Constitutional Committee that the Act did not becoming more popular and the scale of fees should provide clear and express power for the commission not prevent people from participating in those to impose cross-country trail fees, I gave an popular sports. undertaking to the House to introduce amending legislation. Subsequent analysis of the Act revealed The Bill gives the commission power to enter into that the commission also required power to enter arrangements or agreements with adjoining into arrangements or agreements with adjoining management authorities where cross-country ski management authorities where cross-country ski trails extend beyond alpine resort boundaries. The trails extend beyond alpine resort boundaries. Such various authorities managing ski resorts must an agreement had been prepared for Lake Mountain cooperate for the bettennent of the sport. alpine resort in 1991 with the Department of Conservation and Environment. The National Party does not object to the Bill. Tourism is becoming more and more popular in the A t Lake Mountain the commission is: expending State. Government regulation and legislation must fW1ds on ski trail development and maintenance; provide the best opportunities and facilities to managing trail systems and the public's use of the encourage more people to participate in trails; and charging cross-country trail fees. Lake cross-country skiing in Victoria's alpine resort areas. Mountain has now become one of the busiest cross-country skiing centres in the world. Similar Mr COLEMAN (Syndal) - The intent of the arrangements are possible in other areas subject to legislation is to put in place a system that will allow CRIMES (FAMILY VIOLENCE) (FURTHER AMENDMENT) BILL

Tuesday, 91une 1992 ASSEMBLY 1999 the Alpine Resorts Commission (ARC) to negotiate Those management issues must be addressed. with adjoining land managers about access to Perhaps they should not be the subject of this cross-country trails. legislation. Apart from provisiOns now being made for certain agreements, the opposition supports the Last year Parliament dealt with a disallowance legislation. motion on trail head fees that were to be collected by the Alpine Resorts Commission for the maintenance Motion agreed to. of cross-country trails. In consideration of the disallowance provisions, the Legal and Read second time. Constitutional Committee found there was no head of power for such fees to be charged. The committee Passed remaining stages. also found there was no provision for agreements or arrangements to be made for access to the trails into CRIMES (FAMILY VIOLENCE) other parts of land outside the reserves. (FURTHER AMENDMENT) BILL

The Bill puts in place a system that will allow for Introduction and first reading fees to be charged and for agreements and arrangements to be made for trails outside the alpine Received from Council. resorts managed areas. The passage of those trails outside the alpine resorts managed areas but within Read first time on motion of Mr KENNAN national parks is a matter of contention. It is (Attorney-Genera}). envisaged that both parties will come to an agreement. It is not mandatory that the ARC reaches Second reading agreement but that it put in place a system whereby the land managers consult and come to some Mr KENNAN (Attorney-General) - I move: agreement or arrangement. That this Bill be now read a second time. The Bill provides for the agreements or arrangements to be published in the Government The Crimes (Family Violence) Act has been in Gazelle to allow those who are interested in the operation since December 1987. It provides cheap, location of the trails to understand the arrangements quick and easily accessible protection for victims of or agreements that have been made. family violence. From 1 July 1990 to 30 June 1991, 3232 final intervention orders were made by the Some concern has been expressed, the most courts in Victoria. Family violence continues as a noteworthy of which concerns the connecting trail serious widespread community problem. between the Mount Hotham and the Dinner Plain resorts. Some clearing work has been carried out After discussions at the Standing Committee of without the head of power. I hope the ARC will Attorneys-General (SCAG) and the Family Violence exercise sympathetically the powers that are now Prevention Committee and in light of provided in the Bill and that the machinery to be recommendations from the Victorian Community used to maintain the cross-country trails will be of a Council Against Violence, the Victorian Law Reform variety and size that will not damage the Commission and other groups concerned with this environment. problem, it has become clear that several issues require legislative clarification. The main purposes Arrangements for the expansion of trails and for the of the Bill are: to provide for portability of protective codifying of their use must be made for places such orders between States and Territories; to provide for as the Lake Mountain alpine resort where pressure is emergency intervention orders to be made after being experienced. More importantly for many hours by telephone or facsimile transmission; to people, additional car parking will allow better allow emergency intervention orders to be made access to those areas. The provisions of the Bill will after hours on the information given by the police also apply to the Baw Baw Plateau. Recent complainant; to codify police powers of entry in legislation declared part of that area to be a family violence incidents; to give police the power to wilderness zone. As part of the conditions imposed enter premises where they believe a person has on the management of a wilderness zone, no motor assaulted or threatened to assault a family member; vehicles can traverse the country, thereby making it and to provide for mandatory confiscation of difficult for any snow machines to operate there. CRIMES (FAMILY VIOLENCE) (FURTHER AMENDMENT) BILL

2000 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992 firearms by police attending family violence the police over the telephone or in the facsimiled incidents. documents. It would also be possible for the magistrate to speak to the parties, if appropriate. The PORTABILm officer would complete the order form and serve it upon the defendant and then send all the papers to Women often move interstate to escape violent the courthouse nominated by the magistrate. The former husbands or de facto partners. Any matter would be heard fully with both sides able to protection order that they had obtained is not valid give evidence in a matter of days. That will provide in another State or Territory. It is unnecessarily immediate emergency protection for the victim and onerous and traumatic to require those women to children and allow them to stay in their own home. undergo another court process as a result of crossing a State border. POLICE POWERS OF ENTRY

The Standing Committee of Attorneys-General It is imperative that police have a clear decided to resolve the problem by providing for understanding of their powers of entry in response portability of protection orders. Each State and to calls for assistance in family violence situations. Territory will enact legislative amendments to give There are powers under statute such as the Crimes effect to this recommendation. Act and there are powers at common law under various cases and court decisions. The Bill now The Bill provides for portability between States and codifies those powers and places them squarely and Territories. This means that if a woman who has a clearly into the Crimes (Family Violence) Act. protective order from New South Wales moves to Victoria, she can register that order in Victoria and it The police already have the power to enter premises would be enforceable under the terms of the with the express or implied consent of an occupier, Victorian legislation. Registration is by way of an pursuant to sections of the Crimes Act 1958, and to administrative process so that the woman does not prevent a breach of the peace. Those powers are need to go through another court hearing in Victoria clearly set out in the Bill. In addition, the Bill to obtain protection. provides that the police may enter and search premises in two further situations: (i) where the EMERGENCY INTERVENTION ORDERS BY police officer reasonably believes that the person has TELEPHONE OR FACSIMILE assaulted or threatened to assault a family member; and (ii) where the police officer reasonably believes Police receive between 800 to 1000 calls each month that a person is on the premises in breach of an in respect of family violence. The majority of those intervention order. calls occur at night or on weekends. That is outside normal court hours when registrars and magistrates MANDATORY CONFISCATION OF FIREARMS are not readily available to grant intervention orders. When police attend after hours, the victim may In its Homicide Report No. 40, the Law Reform require immediate protection and may require the Commission of Victoria found that 4 out of 10 alleged perpetrator to be excluded from the home homicides occur in the home. It also found that wltil a court can hear the matter. Where a criminal firearms were used in 44 per cent of domestic offence has occurred, the perpetrator should be homicides. The commission concluded that the arrested and charged. The measure in the Bill is not single most effective measure to reduce homicides is meant as a substitute for criminal proceedings. to reduce the availability of guns. Since May 1988 However, there are cases where there are no the police have had the discretionary power under grounds for arrest and charge but there are grounds the Crimes (Family Violence) Act to seize any for an intervention order. firearm if satisfied on the balance of probabilities that there are grounds for an intervention order The Bill empowers a police officer to apply for an being issued or after an intervention order has been intervention order after hours by telephone or made. facsimile transmission in emergency cases. The police officer would make a complaint by telephone In view of the evidence about guns and homicide or facsimile to a duty magistrate who would then and to prevent firearms being used to cause fear and make an intervention order by telephone or injury to family members, it is not appropriate that facsimile. The Bill also provides that in those cases seizure of a gun remains a matter of discretion. The the magistrate can rely on the information given by Bill provides for mandatory confiscation of firearms. INDUSTRIAL RELATIONS (SUPERANNUATION ENFORCEMENT) BILL

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2001

Pursuant to the Bill, where a police officer attends a "(h) a statement, in relation to each limited partner, family violence incident and is aware of the presence of the amount of any capital and the value of of a firearm, the firearm must be seized where the any property that the partner has agreed to police officer believes there are grounds for issuing contribute to the partnership, showing an intervention order. Under the principal Act, the separately the amount or value actually court can subsequently make an order in respect of contributed and the amount or value the firearms seized. If no such order is made the outstanding;". firearm must be returned to the person. 6. Clause 5, page 6, line 28, omit "(h)" and insert "(i)". CONCLUSION 7. Clause 5, page 9, line 20, omit "debts or obligations of" and insert "amount of any capital or the value The Bill has been drafted after extensive consultation of any property that the limited partner has agreed with legal centres, women's advocacy groups, to contribute to". police, magistrates and civil liberty groups. These 8. Clause 5, page 9,line 23, omit "unpaid" and insert amendments will strengthen the Crimes (Family "outstanding". Violence) Act to provide ongoing and more effective protection to victims of family violence, victims who 9. Clause 5, page 10, line 29, omit "(a)". are in the main innocent and defenceless women 10. Clause 5, page ID, line 30, omit "and". and children. 11. Clause 5, page ID, lines 31 and 32, omit proposed I commend the Bill to the House. paragraph (b). 12. Clause 5, page 11, lines 21 to 24, omit proposed new Debate adjourned on motion of Mrs WADE (Kew). sub-section (1). Debate adjourned until later this day. 13. Clause 5, page 11, line 25, omit "(2)".

INDUSTRIAL RELATIONS 14. Clause 5, page 11, line 25, omit "such a contribution" (SUPERANNUATION ENFORCEMENT) and insert "a contribution made by a limited BILL partner". 15. Clause 5, page 14, lines 32 to 34, omit proposed Returned from Council with message relating to paragraph (a). amendments. 16. Clause 5, page IS, line I, omit "(b)" and insert "(a)". Ordered to be considered later this day. 17. Clause 5, page IS, line 3, omit "(c)" and insert "(b)".

PARTNERSHIP (LIMITED 18. Clause 5, page IS, lines 12 to 24, omit proposed PARTNERSHIPS) BILL sub-sections (3) and (4). Mr KENNAN (Attorney-General) - I move: Returned from Council with message relating to amendments. That the amendments be agreed to. Council's amendments: I understand, as was clearly expressed in this House 1. Clause 5, after line 23 insert- and in the other House, that the opposition wants no restriction on the operation of limited partnerships "'debt" includes liability, however incurred;'. in this State. I have very serious reservations about 2. Clause 5, page 3, after line 22 insert- that, particularly for the reasons that were expressed by the honourable member for Balwyn in respect of "Division 2 - Nature and formation of limited the operation of such partnerships and the difficulty partnerships" of ensuring, for instance, that the limited partners do 3. Clause 5, page 4, lines 9 to 35 and page 5, lines 1 to 29, not operate in the day-to-day management of a omit proposed new Division 2. business, which I suspect can really probably happen only at the end of the day or after the event. 4. Clause 5, page 5, lines 33 and 34, omit "that is If something does go wrong, the difficulty of designated under Division 2". establishing the circumstances is a real problem. 5. Clause 5, page 6, after line 27 insert - PARTNERSHIP (LIMITED PARTNERSHIPS) BILL

2002 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992

I have further reservations - as does the proposed national companies scheme with which it government - whether this may effectively be an has not proceeded. It may be that at the time of erosion of a national scheme of companies extending the national companies scheme in the regulation. The matter has been raised at the fundraising provisions area I foreshadowed and Standing Committee of Attorneys-General. given the taxation changes that sooner or later may be introduced, those provisions will apply to a I understand action will be taken - I think by creature that will not have existed and will not be of regulation - to overcome some of the concerns by any great consequence in any event. For my part, I applying the fundraising provisions of the national consider that that in some sense may be a good thing. Companies Code to limited partnerships so that there will be national regulation. It may be that if The honourable member for Balwyn cogently put his now or in the future the Federal government or the reservations about the Bill. I share those reservations Australian Commissioner of Taxation change their and I share the reservations expressed by the attitude towards limited partnerships those honourable member for Ivanhoe. I add to them the partnerships will not have proliferated to the extent reservations I have now expressed. they otherwise might have. I note also the comment of the honourable member for Ivanhoe who said that The opposition has expressed a view about the Bill. it is difficult to understand why such matters are not We accept that is the opposition's view and we do regulated on a uniform national basis. not intend to take the time of Parliament trading the Bill between Houses. The opposition has expressed a The government reluctantly moves that the clear view on both occasions and we reluctantly amendments be accepted. It does so only after the accept it. opposition has clearly expressed its position both in debate in this House and by moving amendments in Mrs WADE (Kew) - The coalition is pleased the the Upper House that if there were to be any limited government has decided to accept the amendments partnerships in this State they should be on the basis it made in another place. As the Attorney-General proposed by the opposition. pointed out, we made our position clear. We said we were serious about the amendments and the I emphasise that the amendments may not prove to Attorney-General has now agreed to incorporate be in the long-term public interest. I shall continue to them into the legislation. I wish he had done it with press at the Standing Committee of a little more grace, but that is not his style. Attorneys-General for a uniform national scheme on the basis of what happened to some extent when the The Bill sets up a new business structure by way of matter was last before the House. These are limited partnerships. That structure was extensively substantially limited liability creatures, the motive debated when the Bill was before the House earlier for which is substantially taxation minimisation. in the sessional period. That business structure is Where a limited liability is created, it seems to me available in other States and the coalition is pleased inherent potential problems are created. The that it will now be available in Victoria. If it were not government would prefer they not be encouraged. Victoria would miss out on business opportunities when people attracted to the advantages of limited The fact of the matter is that other States have partnerships established themselves in other States introduced limited liability partnership provisions, where such legislation is in place. which raises the question of why Victoria should not have them. The matter may be addressed to some When the New South Wales legislation was extent by applying the fundraising provisions to introduced by that State's former Attorney-General, them. Also, if the Australian Commissioner of the coalition took the view that until similar Taxation takes action through Federal taxation legislation was available in this State we would not provisions there may be problems with these entities be able to attract people engaged in a wide variety of for Australia as a whole. operations ranging from infrastructure projects­ which is the type of business structure for which the There is nothing necessarily peculiar to this Attorney-General introduced the legislation­ provision either in this State or in other States and I through to tourist, agricultural and research projects am not suggesting that there will be anything because they would not be able to take advantage of peculiar in this State or other States where limited limited partnerships. Limited partnerships are liability partnerships exist. The Federal government particularly useful in cases where a fair amount of had a proposal for closed corporations under the risk is involved because the risk can be spread PARTNERSHIP (LIMITED PARTNERSHIPS) BILL

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2003 among a large group of people, and also in national scheme. The coalition is totally unable to long-term projects where losses can be written off understand the proposition in that regard. earlier against other income, which is not the case for investments in corporations. The Attorney-General has also foreshadowed that the Standing Committee of Attorneys-General will The Attorney-General wanted to limit the legislation examine whether the fund raiSing provisions of the only to projects that were approved by him. He national companies and securities scheme should included in the Bill a wide range of projects that he apply to limited partnerships. I should have thought could approve, but if a person wanted a limited that was a matter for the Ministerial Council partnership on a project that was provided for under associated with the scheme. I do not believe the the terms of the legislation, he or she would not have coalition would see any problem with that: it would been able to proceed without the approval of the be appropriate if a limited partnership were Attorney-General. The Attorney-General has undertaking a large public fundraisirig. I should explained that he did not want other projects to go have thought the fundraising provisions that apply ahead without the right to approve them because if to corporations undertaking public fundraising or, that were the case he would not be able to control as proposed, to other financial institutions should them. He was concerned that he may find out only also apply to limited partnerships, but that that after the event that a limited partnership had not should not be the case if the fundraisings were not complied with the legislation. public fundraisings.

I should have thought the government would have The Attorney-General also referred to the tax learned by its experience. It has been trying to pick advantages and appeared to be concerned about winners all through its period in office and almost encouraging them. We are not talking about without exception those winners have turned out to bottom-of-the-harbour schemes but about the ability be disasters for Victorian taxpayers - disasters such to take advantage of the losses of a company in as the Victorian Economic Development estimating an investor's or limited partner's tax Corporation, Tricontinental Corporation Ltd, the situation and the fact that company tax does not Victorian Investment Corporation Ltd and a apply. Those tax advantages have been approved by multitude of other ventures, including strategic the Commissioner of Taxation. research ventures that are still going on. If the Commonwealth government wishes to act in One would have thought the Attorney-General any way in relation to those so-called tax advantages would have learned from the problems with the it is free to do so. The coalition is not with the Bayside project. Apparently he believes that if he has Attorney-General if, as is apparently the case, he control of a project, whether it be the Bayside feels that so long as he has approved the scheme it is project, the Museum project or another project all right for it to receive tax advantages, but that it is wlder his control - which do not seem to be not appropriate for other projects even if the turning out the way he expected - it will be Commissioner of Taxation thinks it is all right. I successful. I thought have thought the point out to the Attorney-General that he would not Attorney-General would have been the last person be looking only at State infrastructure programs; the who should have the power to approve projects Bill is wider than that and allows him to approve under this new business structure. He referred to the almost any project in Victoria. national companies and securities legislation and suggested that our amendment is incompatible with The Attorney-General made various comments that scheme. I find that incomprehensible. I asked concerning the corporations legislation, which are him questions about it when the Bill was previously not relevant to the Bill. I do not intend to go into before the House. I do not understand how it can be those comments. It is not up to the government to said that Victoria is eroding the national scheme by ensure that no business enterprise in Victoria goes bringing in legislation that is exactly the same as broke or that no investors or creditors ever lose any legislation in force in New South Wales, Western money - that is totally inappropriate. If a Australia, Tasmania and Queensland. The government tries to do that it is doomed to failure. Attorney-General would appear not to be looking after Victoria's interests if he is prepared to see other Despite the way the Attorney-General has States introduce this sort of legislation while holding responded to the opposition's amendments he has back Victoria because of his interpretation of the nevertheless accepted them. The opposition is pleased about that on behalf of business enterprises PARTNERSHIP (LIMITED PARTNERSHIPS) BILL

2004 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992 and people looking for job opportunities and with the government in supporting that initiative. investments in Victoria. Yet the development of the limited partnership concept in the form in which it is contemplated by Mr STOCKDALE (Brighton) - I compliment the this Bill, and by similar legislation in other States, honourable member for Kew and direct attention to actually takes off the Commonwealth the pressure to the somewhat churlish way in which the grapple with the need to establish a set of ground Attorney-General adopted the opposition's rules that are not discriminatory in their application amendments. I compliment the honourable member to projects of various kinds. for Kew on the basis that her diligence and superior understanding of the workings of the law in relation If a single proponent, such as the Broken Hill to a series of Bills have served the community well Proprietary Co. Ltd (BHP) in the case of the VFT, because the government has adopted amendments had proposed to take on the promotion, funding and she introduced in a public-spirited way to improve development of the VFT project the Commonweal th legislation brought before the House. For reasons I tax position would have borne on it very differently shall return to later it is clear from the from the way it did when, because of its sheer Attorney-General's remarks in the debate that the magnitude, it had to be conducted on the basis of considerations to which he alluded support the some sort of joint partnership arrangement. The position of the opposition, not the pOSition that he breakdown of accountability by the Commonwealth adopted. This debate and the course of the and the perpetuation of nonsensical tax legislation demonstrate that the community will be arrangements is enhanced by the sort of recipe the well served when the current Attorney-General is Attorney-General was recommending. replaced by the honourable member for Kew. Secondly, I reinforce the point made by the It is clear and it is common ground that not only can honourable member for Kew that the opportunity limited partnerships be used for artificial tax for the State government, through the avoidance purposes but that they have been so used Attorney-General, to determine whether those tax on a wide scale emanating from the jurisdictions of advantages would be available would do two other States. It is amazing that the Attorney-General things: it would give undue control over the predicated his remarks on the real danger that development of major projects to the State and limited partnerships may be used as a vehicle for tax would create another level of uncertainty about the avoidance or for tax-effective conduct of projects. development of major projects.

In the government's provision the Attorney-General Not only would major projects require the approval is seeking to put himself in a position of being able of and a ruling from the Commonwealth to determine whether people operating in Victoria or Commissioner of Taxation as to the application of otherwise under Victorian law will have available to Commonwealth tax laws, but it would require a them benefits under tax arrangements that have the determination in some form by the State effect of reducing Commonwealth tax obligations; Attorney-General as to whether the rulings of the and we are talking about the avoidance of Commonwealth tax authorities would be capable of Commonwealth tax, particularly company tax and being carried out. That is not only objectionable on income tax. the grounds of the amount of power it puts into the hands of the Attorney-General in an area that is not It seems to me that there are at least three bases on only economically but politically potentially which such a power is objectionable: firstly, that sensitive - I will return to that in a moment - but such a diversion from a proper accountability of the it would also add to uncertainty about the planning suitability of Commonwealth taxation can serve only and development of major infrastructure works in to delay the identification of the need for reform at particular. the Commonwealth level and the carrying into effect of reforms. I instance the case of the Very Fast Train The third point concerns the very real danger of the (VFf) project. In that case, among other reasons - I raising of allegations of political or economic favours grant that it was not the only reason - the fact that being extracted by the proponents if the Victorian the participants in a joint venture would have been government has the power to veto or authorise unable to pass the losses back to taxpaying Significant elements of the financial plans of major participants was a factor in delaying a potentially projects. very beneficial project, not only for Victoria but for the nation. The opposition was on common ground PARTNERSHIP (LIMITED PARTNERSHIPS) BILL

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2005

The House will recall allegations being made against Attorney-General believes the Bill is appropriate for a former Queensland government that political projects in the public interest, simply because the favours were demanded in exchange for that government is connected with them, equally the Bill government's agreeing to give the green light to is suitable for projects undertaken by the private major developments. Regardless of whether the sector, because such projects can also add to the Attorney-General would be a party to such wealth and prosperity of the nation. arrangements, he is placing the executive government of Victoria in the position of being The Attorney-General put strange arguments about questioned about whether advantages would flow tax minimisation. If I understood him correctly he to one political party or another as a result of said he was concerned about the Bill's being approvals being granted. extended to cover all limited partnerships because they might be used for tax minimisation purposes. The principles of the rule of law must apply and be The Attorney-General seems to be saying that he seen to apply in such circumstances. A clear set of approves of the government's taking part in tax principles should be established which apply minimisation schemes but does not approve of the equally to all, which do not depend on the discretion private sector's being involved in such schemes. If of the executive government and which can be that is his argument, it is improper. scrutinised in light of the development or progress of particular projects. Where discretion is conferred If the Attorney-General is arguing that the it must be conferred with an abundance of caution. participants in accelerated infrastructure programs, such as the construction of Loy Yang B or other To give the executive government, through the projects, are entitled to tax benefits, why does he not Attorney-General, the discretion to make available argue that the participants in private sector projects tax advantages under Commonwealth law to his should be able to claim the same benefits? As the favoured projects as he sees fit is to make it almost honourable member for Kew pointed out, the impossible for him to defend himself or his so-called tax benefits associated with limited government against the sorts of allegations I have partnerships simply allow the various participants referred to. In trying to pick winners the to claim the tax deductions of the project against Attorney-General would almost inevitably be their own tax positions rather than their having to required to answer questions about what was in it quarantine projects, as a result of which benefits for him or his government in preferring one party would be denied for many years. That would hardly over another. He would also be asked about the be a tax minimisation scheme in the usual sense of consequences of exercising his discretion to give tax the term. The Attorney-General has a hide to claim advantages, thereby reducing Commonwealth tax such benefits for the government's projects alone. revenue and creating favourable circumstances for one project perhaps at the expense of another. The Attorney-General cited the remarks I made during the second-reading debate in support of the Far from supporting his government's position, the position the government has adopted. The points I views advanced by the Attorney-General strongly made were points of detail that related, in particular, support the arguments put by the shadow to the drafting of proposed section 67(3). Although Attorney-General. I suggest that the sooner the they could be dealt with within the context of the Attorney-General vacates his post and hands it to Bill, and although they raised matters that require someone who has regard not only for the interests of attention, they do not go to the heart of the scheme. the government but also for the long-term interests The Attorney-General's citation of my arguments in of the people of Victoria and the interests of the rule support of his position is odd. If he had taken my of law, so that the actions of institutions are not only concerns to heart he would have ensured that the seen to be fair but are fair and even-handed, the Bill was amended accordingly. better it will be for the people of Victoria. The concerns that I have raised apply to a Bill that is Mr CLARK (Balwyn) - I shall make two points confined to schemes involving the public sector or in supporting the comments made by the schemes approved by the Attorney-General in the honourable members for Kew and Brighton. Firstly, same way as they would apply to a more general the Attorney-General's argument seems to be that Bill. The lack of sincerity with which the the Bill is good enough for the government sector Attorney-General has picked up my remarks is but not good enough for the private sector. The reflected in the fact that he has not attempted to coalition has put the opposing argument: if the implement the suggestions I made. SUPERANNUATION (OCCUPATIONAL SUPERANNUATION STANDARDS) BILL

2006 ASSEMBLY Tuesday. 9 June 1992

Governments cannot pick winners. The exercise of (lq Disallowance of a regulation under the Attorney-General's discretion would not act as a sub-section (IB) is deemed to be disallowance safeguard against the problems I raised; and the best by Parliament for the purposes of the way to have dealt with them would have been to Subordinate Legislation Act 1962". amend the Bill. Nevertheless the coalition expects 4. Clause 92, line 22, after this line insert - the Bill will be beneficial. If circumstances arise that make it clear that the legislation needs to be "(3) Regulations made under this Act relating to amended, I hope a future government will do so. occupational superannuation standards may be disallowed in whole or in part by Motion agreed to. resolution of either House of Parliament in accordance with the requirements of SUPERANNUATION (OCCUPATIONAL section 6(2) of the Subordinate Legislation SUPERANNUATION STANDARDS) Act 1962. BILL (4) Disallowance of a regulation under sub-section (3) is deemed to be disallowance Returned from Council with message relating to amendments. by Parliament for the purposes of the Subordinate Legislation Act 1962". Council's amendments: 5. Clause 111, page 51, line 4, after this line insert - 1. Clause 38, page 16, line 7, after this line insert - "(3) Regulations made under this Act relating to "(3) Regulations made under this Act relating to occupational superannuation standards may occupational superannuation standards may be disallowed in whole or in part by be disallowed in whole or in part by resolution of either House of Parliament in resolution of either House of Parliament in accordance with the requirements of accordance with the requirements of section 6(2) of the Subordinate Legislation section 6(2) of the Subordinate Legislation Act 1962. Act 1962. (4) Disallowance of a regulation under (4) Disallowance of a regulation under sub-section (3) is deemed to be disallowance sub-section (3) is deemed to be disallowance by Parliament for the purposes of the by Parliament for the purposes of the Subordinate Legislation Act 1962" Subordinate Legislation Act 1962". 6. Clause 115, page 53, line 12, before ''The'' insert "(1)" 2. Clause 67, page 31, line 2, after this line insert- 7. Clause 115, page 53, line 15, after this line insert - "(3) Regulations made under this Act relating to "(2) Regulations made under this Part may be occupational superannuation standards may disallowed in whole or in part by resolution of be disallowed in whole or in part by either House of Parliament in accordance with resolution of either House of Parliament in the requirements of section 6(2) of the accordance with the requirements of Subordinate Legislation Act 1962. section 6(2) of the Subordinate Legislation Act 1962. (3) Disallowance of a regulation under sub-section (2) is deemed to be disallowance by (4) Disallowance of a regulation under Parliament for the purposes of the sub-section (3) is deemed to be disallowance Subordinate Legislation Act 1962". by Parliament for the purposes of the Subordinate Legislation Act 1962". 8. Clause 116, page 54, line 17, after this line insert - 3. Clause 77, line 24, after this line insert - "(6) Regulations made under this section may be disallowed in whole or in part by resolution of "(IB) Regulations made under this Act relating to either House of Parliament in accordance with occupational superannuation standards may the requirements of section 6(2) of the be disallowed in whole or in part by Subordinate Legislation Act 1962. resolution of either House of Parliament in accordance with the requirements of (7) Disallowance of a regulation under section 6(2) of the Subordinate Legislation sub-section (6) is deemed to be disallowance Act 1962. by Parliament for the purposes of the Subordinate Legislation Act 1962". FINANCIAL INSTITUTIONS (VICTORIA) BILL

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2007

9. Clause 117, page 55, line 25, after this line insert - Council's amendments:

"(7) Regulations made under this section may be 1. Clause 4, lines 14 and 15, omit ", or a claim for disallowed in whole or in part by resolution of compensation has been made,". either House of Parliament in accordance with 2. Clause 4, lines 17 to 25, and page 3, lines 1 to 4, omit the requirements of section 6(2) of the proposed sub-section (2) and insert - Subordinate Legislation Act 1962. "(2) U a claim for compensation in respect of the (8) Disallowance of a regulation under death of a worker is made under the Workers sub-section (7) is deemed to be disallowance Compensation Act 1958, a claim must not be by Parliament for the purposes of the made under this Act by any dependant of the Subordinate Legislation Act 1962". worker unless the claim made under the Mr ROPER (Minister for Employment, Workers Compensation Act 1958 is Post-Secondary Education and Training) - I move: withdrawn or is rejected.". 3. Clause 5, line 16, after "includes" insert "an". That the amendments be agreed to. 4. Clause 5, line 17, after "compromise" insert ", other Any honourable member who reads the than damages in the nature of interest". amendments will understand that, in effect, they are 5. Clause 6, line 35, omit "or entering". the same as those made on nine previous occasions and relate to the disallowance by either House of 6. Clause 6, line 36, omit "judgment," and insert various matters set out in clauses 38 to 117. The "judgment or". government will not oppose the amendments made 7. Clause 6, line 36, omit "damages," and insert by the Legislative Council. "damages or approving a". Mr I. W. SMITH (Polwarth) - I thank the 8. Clause 7, lines 11 and 12, omit ", or a claim for Minister for his comments. These are the compensation has been made,". amendments we sought to move in this House but 9. Clause 7, lines 14 to 26, omit proposed sub-section (2) which were, in the end, moved in another place and insert- because of some technical drafting difficulties. They meet the requirements of the opposition. "(2) U a claim for compensation in respect of the death of a worker is made under the Accident Motion agreed to. Compensation Act 1985, a claim must not be made under this Act by any dependant of the FINANCIAL INSTITUTIONS worker unless the claim made under the (VICTORIA) BILL Accident Compensation Act 1985 is withdrawn or is rejected.". Returned from Council with message relating to 10. Clause 10, page 9, line 12, after "person" insert "as". Council's amendments. 11. Insert the following new clause to follow clause 10: Ordered to be considered later this day. Existing proceedings ACCIDENT COMPENSATION "AA. A question concerning the validity of the (FURTHER AMENDMENT) BILL appointment of an inspector arising in any proceedings commenced under the Returned from Council with message relating to Occupational Health and Safety Act amendments. 1985, the Dangerous Goods Act 1985 or the Liquefied Gases Act 1968 before the The SPEAKER - Order! As the required commencement of this Act must be statement of intention has been made pursuant to determined as if this Part (other than this section 85(5)(c) of the Constitution Act 1975, I am of section) had not been enacted." the opinion that the amendments require to be 12. Long title, omit ", the Transport Accident Act 1986". passed by an absolute majority. Mr HARROWFIELD (Minister for Finance) - I Message from Council considered. move:

That the amendments be agreed to. LEGAL AID COMMISSION (AMENDMENT) BILL (No. 2)

2008 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992

The amendments are of a technical nature and arise (a) its decision to impose a condition requiring the out of the drafting of the legislation but they were payment of the amoWlt; and agreed to between the parties and accepted in the (b) its decision to impose the condition requiring other place. the payment of interest. Mr CLARK (Balwyn) - I wish to comment (ID) If commWlication of one decision to impose a briefly on amendment No. 11, which ensures that condition is given at a different time from the questions arising in court cases that have been other, interest must not accrue until 30 days after commenced prior to the amendments being made by the later commWlication.". this legislation - questions that relate to the validity 2. Clause 8, page 4, lines 20 to 23, omit proposed of the appointment of inspectors under the three sub-section (20). pieces of legislation referred to - are to be determined as if this legislation had not been passed. 3. Clause 10, page 5, line 11, after "fee simple" insert ", either solely or as a joint tenant or a tenant in That is an important recognition of the fact that this common,". Parliament should wherever possible avoid enacting 4. Clause 10, page 5, line 13, after "fee simple" insert "or legislation which retrospectively alters the legal an equity of redemption, either solely or as a joint position affecting parties to litigation, which is tenant or a tenant in common,". probably what would have happened by the operation of the legislation if the amendment had 5. Clause la, page 5, line 37 and page 6, line 1, omit"A not been made. recording of a notice lodged by the Director is to be made in the register" and insert ''The Registrar of Where litigation is on foot and the point has been Titles must, subject to the provisions of Division 1 decided based on the existing law, it is a harsh step of Part V of the Transfer of Land Act 1958, record to overturn that law and impose a different legal in the register a notice lodged by the Director". regime on the parties concerned. I am appreciative 6. Clause la, page 6, line 20, omit "depositing with" and of the fact that the government has accepted this insert "delivering to". point to preserve the position of parties under litigation that is already under way. It is a welcome 7. Clause 10, page 6, lines 33 to 35, omit ",if the land is amendment, and I think it avoids what otherwise Wlder the Transfer of Land Act 1958 the certificate would have been an unsatisfactory position. may be lodged with the Registrar of Titles" and insert - The SPEAKER - Order! As there are fewer than 45 members present, I ask the Clerk to ring the bells. (a) if the land is under the Transfer of Land Act Bells rung. 1958 the certificate must be lodged with the Registrar of Titles; and Required number of members having assembled (b) if the land is not Wlder the Transfer of Land Act in Chamber: 1958 a memorial of the certificate which complies with Part 1 of the Property Law Act Motion agreed to by absolute majority. 1958 must be lodged with the LEGAL AID COMMISSION Registrar-General." . (AMENDMENT) BILL (No. 2) 8. Clause 10, page 8, line 7, after "Secondly," insert "in the case of a charge Wlder section 47A of theLegaJ Returned from Council with message relating to Aid Commission Act 1978,". amendments. 9. Clause la, page 8, line 8, omit "encumbrances" and Council's amendments: insert "mortgages or charges".

1. Clause 7, line 30, after this line insert- la. Clause 10, page 8, lines 23 and 24, omit "of which the Commission had notice" and insert "which ranked "(1C) If the Commission has imposed a condition in priority to the Commission's interest". Wlder sub-section (1) requiring a person to pay interest on any amoWlt payable to the 11. Clause 10, page 8, line 26, omit "registering" and Commission, interest must not accrue Wlti130 days insert "enforcing". after the Commission has commWlicated to the assisted person Wlder section 33 - WATER (RURAL WATER CORPORATION) BILL

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2009

12. Clause 10, page 8, line 30, omit "and certificate of the Public Service Board, having regard to the title". person's position with the Corporation.". 13. Clause 10, page 8, line 32, omit "and certificate of 9. Clause 4, page 14, after line 29 insert- title". "(4) A regional Management Board must meet at 14. Clause 10, page 8, Hoe 33, omit "the least 6 times each year. Registrar-Generalor". (5) There must be presented to each meeting of a 15. Clause 10, page 8, line 37, omit "Registrar-General Regional Management Board financial or". statements that present fairly - 16. Clause 12, page 10, lines 18 to 26, omit proposed (a) the results of the financial operations of the sub-section (4). Board during the period beginning at the end of the month preceding its last Amendments agreed to on motion of Mr KENNAN meeting and ending at the end of the (Attorney-General). immediately preceding month; and

WATER (RURAL WATER (b) the financial position of the Board as at the CORPORATION) BILL end of the immediately preceding month.". 10. Clause 4, page 14, after line 35 insert- Returned from Council with message relating to amendments. "(2) The Minister must make sure that on and from 1 July 1993 the Corporation exercises its Council's amendments: power of delegation under this clause to 1. Clause 4, page 4, line 22, after ''Minister'' insert", delegate to a Regional Management Board after considering the recommendation of a sufficient powers, discretions and functions to selection committee established by the Minister,". enable the Board to operate within its region as it would if it were an independent 2. Clause 4, page 5, line 16, after "management" insert ", authority but subject to and in accordance including farm enterprise management". with any performance contract entered into, or 3. Clause 4, page 11, line 24, after "court" insert "or business plan agreed, with the Corporation tribunal". and any conditions or limitations specified in the instrument of delegation.". 4. Clause 4, page 12, line 28, omit "(d)" and insert "(e)". 11. Clause 4, page 15, lines 1 to 4, omit all words and 5. Clause 4, page 12, line 30, after "transfer" insert expressions on these lines. "unless varied by a certified agreement". 12. Clause 4, page 16, line 24, after "management" insert 6. Clause 4, page 12, line 34, omit "(d)" and insert "(e)". ", including farm enterprise management". 7. Clause 4, page 13, line 5, omit "(d)" and insert "(e)". 13. Clause 8, page 24, line 17, omit "Registrar" and 8. Clause 4, page 13, after line 5 insert- insert "Register". "(8) An officer of the public service or a person 14. Schedule, page 29, item 11.34, omit "(d)" and insert referred to in section 368 of the Public Service "(e)". Act 1974 who becomes an officer of the 15. Schedule, page 29, item 11.35, omit "(d)" and insert Corporation under sub-section (2) (e) may, "(e)". within the 2 year period after the day on which section 4 of the Water (Rural The SPEAKER - Order! As a statement of Corporation) Act 1992 comes into operation, intention has been made pursuant to section 85(5)(c) apply for promotion or transfer to an office in of the Constitution Act 1975 on the Bill, I am of the the public service or appeal against the opinion that the amendments made by the promotion or transfer of another person to an Legislative Council need to be agreed to by an office in the public service as if he or she were absolute majority. an officer in the public service. Mr ROPER (Minister for Employment, (9) For the purposes of sub-clause (8), the Post-Secondary Education and Training) - I move: classification of a person who applies for promotion or transfer to an office in the public That the amendments be agreed to. service must be taken to be that determined by LOY YANG B BILL

2010 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992

A number of the amendments are of a tedutical "'Completion of Construction Agreement" means nature. Amendment No. 8 refers to the rights of the construction agreement pursuant to which officers of the Public Service, and amendment No. 9 SECY, as independent contractor for the refers to the responsibilities of regional management Participants, is to complete construction of the boards to meet and present to each meeting financial Power Station (including the first generating lrnit statements. The government accepts the of approximately 500 megawatts scheduled for amendments of the Legislative Council. completion in the second half of calendar year 1993 and the second generating unit of approximately The SPEAKER - Order! As there are fewer than 500 megawatts scheduled for completion in the 45 members present, I ask the Clerk to ring the bells. second half of calendar year 1996):. 5. Schedule 1, page 24, clause 1.1, omit the definition of Bells rung. '1oint Venture Agreement" and insert- Required number of members having assembled "10int Venture Agreement" means the agreement in Chamber: providing for the establishment of an unincorporated joint venture for the purpose of Motion agreed to by absolute majority. acquiring (as tenants in common in undivided shares), operating and maintaining the Power LOYYANG B BILL Station, regulating the rights, interests and obligations of the Participants, providing for the Returned from Council with message relating to establishment of a management committee to Council's suggested amendments and amendments. oversee the operations of the joint venture, establishing the basis upon which disputes in Message read recommending further appropriation. relation to the joint venture are to be resolved and regulating financial arrangements between the Message from Council considered. Participants in relation to the joint venture.'.

Council's suggested amendments: 6. Schedule 1, page 24, clause 1.1, omit the definition of "Miscellaneous Services Agreement" and insert - 1. Clause 30, line 20, before "The" insert "(1)". "'Miscellaneous Services Agreement" means the 2. Clause 30, page 19, after line 7 insert- agreement pursuant to which, among other things, "(2) A guarantee, covenant, undertaking or SECV is to supply or provide certain services and agreement under sub-section (1) that applies supplies (including electrical energy, ash disposal, to a body of a kind referred to in sub-section saline waste disposal, neutralised chemical waste (1)(e) is not affected by reason only that the disposal, low quality water, high quality water, body ceases to be such a body, unless the gas, auxiliary fuel, drainage and sewage disposal) terms and conditions of the guarantee, in connection with the operation of the Power covenant, undertaking or agreement Station and which is to establish rights of access otherwise provide.". and easements to facilitate access to and from the Power Station and adjoining land for the purposes 3. Schedule I, page 23, clause 1.1, omit the definition of of supplying these goods and services.'. "Coal Supply Agreement" and insert - 7. Schedule 1, page 24, clause 1.1 omit the definition of mCoal Supply Agreement" means the agreement "Operating and Maintenance Agreement" and pursuant to which SECV is to maintain a capability insert- to supply and, as requested by the Participants, is to supply brown coal from the open cut mine at "'Operating and Maintenance Agreement" means Loy Yang in accordance with appropriate quantity the agreement pursuant to which Mission Energy and quality limits, for use in the Power Station, Management Australia Pty Ltd is to be appointed and the Participants are to pay SECY for by the Participants to operate and maintain the maintaining the supply capability and for the coal Power Station on their behalf in accordance with used.'. prescribed perfonnance standards, planned annual performance levels, and budgets and programs 4. Schedule 1, page 23, clause 1.1, omit the definition of which have been approved by the management "Completion of Construction Agreement" and committee established under the Joint Venture insert- Agreement.' . LOY YANG B BILL

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2011

8. Schedule 1, page 24, clause 1.1, omit the definition of (i) the exercise of a right conferred on a person "Power Supply Agreement" and insert - by this Agreement or a Project Agreement, or the performance or satisfaction of an '''Power Supply Agreement" means the obligation imposed on a person by this agreement pursuant to which the Participants will Agreement or a Project Agreement, does maintain a capability to supply electricity from the not contravene paragraphs (a)(i), (ii) or Power Station to SECV, and the Participants will (iii); and supply electricity to SECV as it requires, and SECV will pay to the Participants a capability charge (ii) if an action or combination of actions is not referable to the capability to supply maintained by directed at affecting the Power Station or the Participants and an energy charge referable to affecting, modifying or reducing the rights electricity supplied by the Participants to SECV:. or benefits or adding to the obligations of a Participant in relation to the Power 9. Schedule 1, page 24, clause 1.1 omit the definition of Station but, as a result solely of SECV or "Sale of Assets Agreements" and insert - another body being a statutory body of IIJSale of Assets Agreement" means the agreement the State, that action or combination of pursuant to which, among other things, the Power actions affects or potentially affects the Station (to the extent constructed), the land on Power Station or affects, modifies or which the Power Station is being constructed and reduces or potentially affects, modifies or various related fixtures and completed chattels reduces the rights or benefits or adds to or will be sold by SECV to the Participants, as tenants potentially adds to the obligations of a in common in accordance with their respective Participant in relation to the Power Station shares in the joint venture, for a price specified:. in a way that is different to its effect or potential effect on other power stations 10. Schedule 1, pages 26 and 27, omit clause 4.2 and and related facilities owned by SECV or insert- another statutory body or the rights, "4.2 Grants of interests in Crown land benefits or obligations of SECV or another statutory body as proprietor of those other The State must grant or cause to be granted to power stations and related facilities, then SECV or the Participants at the request of or on that action or combination of actions does behalf of any of them such interest in such Crown not contravene paragraphs (a)(i), (ii) or land as the Minister determines is: (iii). (a) necessary for the purposes of the project; 4.6 Clause 4.5 does not prevent or restrict the State, and SECV or any agent, instrument or statutory (b) not required or reasonably likely to be body of the State, or Council, taking any required by the State for any purpose action or combination of actions which is or (including, without limitation, its sale), involves:

on terms and conditions which are reasonable (a) a sale, lease or other disposal of all or part in all the circumstances.... of any interest in:

11. Schedule 1, page 28, clause 4.5(a)(i)(O), after (i) a power station or the Power Station; or "products," insert ''by-products,''. (ii) facilities associated with the generation by, 12. Schedule 1, page 28, clause 4.5(a), after sub-clause or supply, transmission or distribution of (iii) insert - electricity from, a power station, ";or on terms different to those contained in a contract; (iv) in the case of a local law, modifies or reduces the rights or adds to the obligations which the (b) the supply of products, by-products, Participants or the Operator have at the date materials or services used or produced by, of this Agreement in a way which is or through the operation of, a power discriminatory." . station on terms different to those contained in a contract; 13. Schedule 1, pages 28 and 29, clause 4.5, omit paragraphs (c) and (d) and insert - (c) the sale, purchase or supply of electricity from a power station on terms different to '(c) For the avoidance of doubt, each party to this those contained in a contract; or Agreement acknowledges that: LOY Y ANG B BILL

2012 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992

(d) the issue of a Permit in respect of a power over any part of the project area unless the station which Permit is subject to Minister administering that Act is satisfied - conditions different to the conditions (a) that the licence or authority is necessary to applying to an equivalent Permit issued in enable a person other than the Commission to respect of the Power Station. supply coal for the purposes of the project; and and the taking of an action or combination of (b) that the granting of the licence or authority actions described in paragraphs (a)-(d) does would not materially adversely affect the not contravene Clause 4.5. ability of a party to a project agreement to 4.7 In clause 4.6: fulfil the party's obligations under the agreement.". (a) "power station" means a power station for the generation of electricity other than the 12. Clause 21, after line 20 insert - Power Station; and "() Sections SO, 81 and 82 of the Weights and (b) "contract" means a Project Agreement, this Measures Act 1958 do not apply to the sale or agreement or any other agreement entered supply of coal for the purposes of the project.". into for the purposes of the Project by the 14. Clause 23, lines 32 to 34 and page 14, lines 1 to 13, Operator or by one or more Participants.'. omit sub-clauses (1) and (2). Council's amendments: 15. Clause 23, page 14, line 20, omit ''8''. 1. Clause 3, page 3, line 34, after "by" insert "or under". 16. Clause 23, page 14, line 22, omit "or (3)". 2. Clause 3, page 4, line 7, after "varied" insert "in 17. Clause 23, page 14, line 25, omit "both Houses" and accordance with section 9". insert "either House". 3. Clause 7, lines 28 and 29, omit "or derogates from". 18. Clause 23, page 14, line 26, omit "each" and insert 4. Clause 12, line 22, after "into" insert "and perform". "the".

5. Clause 12, line 23, after "project" insert ", including 19. Clause 23, page 14, line 28, omit "resolutions of both the project agreements". Houses are" and insert "a resolution of either House is". 6. Clause 12, line 30, after "station" insert ", including an arrangement for the declaration of a trust in 20. Clause 23, page 14, line 29, omit "(5)" and insert respect of any real or personal property of the "(3)". Commission used for the purposes of the project". 21. Clause 23, page 14, lines 32 and 33, omit "resolutions 7. Clause 13, line 5, before ''The'' insert "(I)". are passed, or the last of the resolutions is passed, as the case requires" and insert "resolution is 8. Clause 13, line 18, before "subsidiary" insert passed". "company that is a". 22. Clause 23, page 15, line 2, omit "or (3)". 9. Clause 13, after line 22 insert- 23. Clause 28, line 11, after "Commission," insert "(2) A guarantee, covenant, undertaking or "undertake". agreement under sub-section (1) is not affected by reason only that the company to 24. Clause 33, omit this clause. which it applies ceases to be a subsidiary of 25. Clause 40, line 31 and page 22, line 1, omit "the the Commission, unless the terms and Commission to fulfil its obligations under a project conditions of the guarantee, covenant, agreement" and insert "a person to fulfil an undertaking or agreement otherwise provide.". obligation to supply coal for the purposes of the 10. Clause 19, line 16, omit "13" and insert "14". power station". 11. Clause 19, line 16, omit "or the disposal of an interest 26. Clause 40, page 22, lines 6 and 7, omit "the under section 14.". Commission to fulfil its obligations under a project agreement" and insert "a person to fulfil an 12. Clause 21, lines 10 to 13, omit sub-clause (1) and obligation to supply coal for the purposes of the insert- power station". ( ) An exploration licence, mining licence or other authority must not be granted under the Mineral Resources Development Act 1990 LOY Y ANG B BILL

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2013

27. Insert the following new clauses to follow clause 32 (e) the issue of a permit within the meaning of the State Agreement in respect of any electricity generating asset other than the Act not to affect restructuring of electricity power station; industry (f) any restructuring of the Commission "A.(1) Nothing in this Act or the State Agreement including the incorporation of any part of prevents or restricts the State, an agency or the Commission. instrumentality of the State, the Conunission, another statutory body or a municipal council Freedom of Information Act 1982 taking any action that constitutes or is ''8.(1) The Freedom of Information Act 1982 does connected with a restructuring of the not apply to a document to the extent to which Commission or the electricity industry. the document discloses information about - (2) A provision of an agreement that is inconsistent (a) a financial model relating to the project with sub-section (1) is void and unenforceable provided by or on behalf of a participant to the extent of the inconsistency. to a Minister or an agency within the (3) Despite sub-section (2), a provision of a project meaning of that Act or an authorised agreement is not void and unenforceable by representative of such an agency; reason only of a provision that is inconsistent (b) the disposition by a participant of an with sub-section (1) but which accords with interest in the project; principles in the contractual documents. (c) a penalty or compensation payment payable (4) In this section- by or to a participant under a project "contractual documents" means the copy of agreement; the documents in 4 volumes held by the (d) the determination of the price of an option Commission entitled "Investment in Loy Yang held by a participant under a project B Project: Contracts Initialled by Mission: State agreement; or Electricity Commission of Victoria: Mission Energy Company: 28 May 1992:" as added to, (e) a management report relating to the altered or amended by an addition, alteration operation and financial performance of or amendment signed by a person authorised the power station prepared by or on so to do in writing signed by the Leader of the behalf of a participant. Parliamentary Liberal Party; ''Loy Yang (2) A participant in the joint venture within the property" has the same meaning as in section meaning of the State Agreement must not, 35; "restructuring" includes - under the Freedom of Information Act 1982, (a) any sale, lease or other disposal of all or part disclose any information which may entail of any interest in the Loy Yang property commercial confidentiality except with the held by the Commission or another agreement of all other participants. statutory body; (3) A decision of a participant not to disclose (b) any sale, lease or other disposal of any information because of sub-section (2) is to be interest of the Commission or any other taken to be a decision that is subject to review entity in any property within the Victorian in accordance with the Freedom of electricity industry other than the Loy Information Act 1982. Yang property; (4) For the purposes of section 34 of the Freedom of (c) any agreement relating to the supply of Information Act 1982 - products, by-products, materials or (a) a participant is to be deemed to be a services used or produced by, in or business, commercial or financial through the operation of any electricity undertaking; and generating asset other than the power station; (b) the obligations of an agency or a Minister under sub-section (3) of that section apply (d) any agreement relating to the supply, in respect of a participant whether or not purchase or sale of electricity from any the relevant document or documents have electricity generating asset other than the been supplied by the participant. power station; LOY Y ANG B BILL

2014 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992

Proceeds of sale Legislative Assembly and the Legislative Council. "C (1) The net proceeds must be applied as soon as practicable after receipt - (7) For the purposes of this section, any money received by or on behalf of a subsidiary of the (a) first, to repaying, discharging or satisfying Commission or by another person on behalf of temporary purpose borrowings; and the Commission is deemed to have been (b) secondly, in repaying, discharging or received by the Commission at the time of satisfying other Commission debt. such receipt.

(2) The net proceeds are not payable, and shall not (8) In this section - be required to be paid, in whole or in part, "Commission debt" means liabilities of the directly or indirectly, to the State for any Commission, whether current or non-current, reason whatsoever. but does not include any liability of the (3) The Auditor-General - Commission to the State; (a) within one month after the Commission has "global limit" means the global limit fixed by received $100 000 000 or more of the net the Australian Loan Council applicable to proceeds; and borrowings by the State of Victoria and its emanations as in force from time to time; (b) within one month after the Commission has received any subsequent amount or "Loy Yang property" means - amounts totalling $100 000 000 or more of (a) the Loy Yang land; and the net proceeds - (b) any business or undertaking carried on by must prepare and sign a report as to whether the Commission on the Loy Yang land; there has been compliance with this section and and include a summary of the reasons for the conclusions of the Auditor-General. (c) any real or personal property, whether or not situated on the Loy Yang land, (4) In respect of each year ended 30 June in which associated with any business or any net proceeds are received by the undertaking carried on on any part of the Commission or taken into account in relation Loy Yang land; and to the global limit for the year concerned the Auditor-General must prepare and sign a (d) a company, joint venture, partnership, trust report before the next succeeding 31 July as to or other body which has an interest in any of the property referred to in paragraph (a), (b) or (c); (a) whether the borrowings of the State and its emanations complied with the globallirnit "net proceeds" means the total financial for the year concerned; and consideration paid or payable to the Commission as the purchase price of the Loy (b) whether any borrowing was treated as a Yang property under the Sale of Assets refinancing and not a new money Agreement within the meaning of the State borrowing only by virtue of a repayment, Agreement, less the transaction costs; discharge or satisfaction of Commission debt under this section. "temporary purpose borrowings" means borrowings by or on behalf of the Commission (5) In each report prepared under sub-section (4), as temporary purpose borrowings for the the Auditor-General must include a finding as purposes of the global limit and made to to whether any money actually received in finance the development of the Loy Yang one year was taken into account in relation to property; the global limit in any other year and, if so, identify the year concerned and the effect of "transaction costs" means the direct costs, such treatment. charges and expenses of, or in connection with, selling or leasing any interest in the Loy (6) Each report prepared and signed under Yang property, incurred by the Commission sub-section (3) or (4) must be transmitted by on its own behalf including, without the Auditor-General to the Legislative limitation - Assembly and to each member of the LOY YANG B BILL

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2015

(a) the costs, charges and expenses of "6.1 (a) Rights under this Agreement or any part of negotiating, preparing, executing and this Agreement cannot be assigned, settling each project agreement; and mortgaged, charged, disposed of or otherwise dealt with by a Participant except as provided (b) the costs, charges and expenses payable to in this Clause. any financial or legal adviser or other professional consultant appointed by the (b) An assigrunent, mortgage, charge, disposition Commission; and or other dealing with rights under this Agreement or any part of this Agreement (c) the reasonable overhead and other internal other than as provided in this Clause is void.". costs, charges and expenses of the Commission - 36. Schedule 1, page 30, clause 6.S, omit "6.1" and insert "6.2". less the costs, charges and expenses of stamping or registering a project agreement or 37. Schedule 1, page 30, clause 7.1, omit this sub-clause any other instrument executed to give effect to and insert- a requirement of a project agreement whether '7.1 If a Participant goes into liquidation (other payable by the Commission or another than a voluntary liquidation for the purpose person.". of reconstruction) and there is a failure by that 28. Schedule 1, page 23, omit '[Parties to be named1 Participant to observe a financial obligation ("the' and insert - under the Joint Venture Agreement which failure is not cured within 90 days, the State 'Loy Yang B Power Station Pty Ltd (ACN. 052 530 may by notice in writing given to that 551) of Monash House, 15 William Street, Participant terminate the obligations of the Melbourne, Victoria (''L YBPS''); and Victorian State to that Participant under this Agreement. Power Station Investments Pty Ltd (ACN. 054 752 Termination under this Clause does not 377) of 7th Floor, 228 Victoria Parade, East prejudice any right, obligation or liability of Melbourne, Victoria (''VPSI'')j and Mission Energy the State, that Participant or any other Australia Pty Ltd (ACN. OSS S63 785) of Level 37, Participant then accrued or incurred under 101 CoIlins Street, Melbourne, Victoria for and on this Agreement and does not prejudice any behalf of the Latrobe Power Partnership (,'LPP',), right, obligation or liability of the State or A Limited Partnership of which Mission Energy other Participant thereafter arising under this Australia Pty Ltd is a general partner. Agreement.". (L YBPS, VPSI and LPP are referred to in this 38. Schedule 1, page 30, clause 8.1(b), omit "of the Agreement as the'. addressee" (where first occurring). 29. Schedule 1, page 25, after sub-clause 1.3 insert- 39. Schedule 1, page 30, clause 8.1(b), omit "of the "1.4 Rights and obligations of each Participant addressee specified in this clause" and insert under this Agreement are several and no "notified by the addressee to each other party for Participant is responsible for the obligations of the purposes of this Agreement". any other Participant". 40. Schedule 1, page 31, omit all words and expressions 30. Schedule 1, page 26, clause 2.3(b), omit "The before sub-clause 8.2. Participants" and insert ''Each Participant". 41. Schedule 1, page 31, omit clause 9 and insert­ 31. Schedule 1, page 26, clause 2.6, after "waived" "9. VARIA nON OF AGREEMENT (where first occurring) insert "in whole or in part". This Agreement may from time to time be added 32. Schedule 1, page 26, clause 4.1(b), omit "provide a to, substituted, cancelled or varied in accordance subsidy for" and insert "subsidise". with section 9 of the Loy Yang B Act.", 33. Schedule 1, page 27, clause 4.3(b)(ii), omit "provide a subsidy for" and insert "subsidise". 34. Schedule 1, page 29, clause S, before "modify" insert "vary,". 35. Schedule 1, page 29, clause 6.1, omit this sub-clause and insert- LOY Y ANG B BILL

2016 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992

transaction and clarify definitions. As I understand it, the opposition agrees with the suggested 42. Schedule 1, page 32, omit "Executed as an amendments, as most of them were proposed by the agreement." and insert - opposition in the other place. '1N WITNESS WHEREOF this Agreement has been executed by the parties on the day and year Mr PLOWMAN (Evelyn) - The opposition does first above written. not oppose the amendments. In consultation with the opposition the government proposed the SIGNED by DAVID WHITE amendments, which were well canvassed and in the presence of: supported by both parties in the other place, but because of the financial implications the amendments had to be returned to this House as suggested amendments. The opposition supports the THE COMMON SEAL of suggested amendments.

STATE ELECTRICITY COMMISSION OF Mr STOCK DALE (Brighton) - The major VICTORIA substantive effect of the suggested amendments concerns the definition in various clauses of the agreements, and later amendments clarify the rights was affixed in the presence of: and obligations of the parties to the agreement.

I refer the House to the agreement described as the power supply agreement in amendment No. 8 THE COMMON SEAL of suggested by the Council. Throughout the series of negotiations on the Bill the opposition parties have maintained the position that the proposed power LOY YANG B POWER STATION PTY LID tariff, which in 1991-92 dollars is 6.8 cents per kilowatt hour, is not an appropriate tariff to the was affixed in the presence of: extent that it was substantially above the output price of electricity elsewhere in the Victorian system and substantially above the price at which power would be available from other States at the Victorian border. THE COMMON SEAL of We remain concerned about the power tariff because VICTORIAN POWER STAnON it is the essence of the power supply agreement. I INVESTMENTS PTY LTD advise the Treasurer, who is the representative in this House of the Minister for Manufacturing and was affixed in the presence of: Industry Development, that, notwithstanding the fact that we have reached agreement on the terms of the proposed legislation, the desire of the opposition is that there be continuing review of the power tariff. THE COMMON SEAL of The State Electricity Commission has conceded that the cost of constructing the power station is MISSION ENERGY AUSTRALIA PTY LID approximately $125 million more than the cost of constructing the station under best international was affixed in the presence of: practice. That is probably a conservative estimate. Indeed, it has been suggested to the coalition that the private tenderers could construct the power station Mr A. J. SHEEHAN (Treasurer) - I move: in Victoria for 50 or 60 per cent of the actual cost incurred by the SEC. That would not only reduce the That the suggested amendments be agreed to. construction cost but have a substantial compounding effect in reducing the amount of In the main the ?mendments suggested by the interest to be capitalised during the construction of Council will expand the terms and conditions of the the project. There is scope for a reduction of at least LOY Y ANG B BILL

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2017

$100 million to $125 million in the asset price, and on the 1991-92 price of 6.8 cents a kilowatt hour the fact that the station was not constructed under against the output from Hazelwood. power station of best international practice should be reflected in the apprOximately 3.3 cents and with the costs from premiums Victorians will pay when they purchase other stations interspersed between the two at electricity. irregular intervals. That wide disparity in the output prices is undesirable when Victoria is embarking on The SEC has also said that there are spin-off effects the creation of competition and when that step is for other parts of their system as a result of being taken against the background of the Loy Yang B having private equity participation and development of the national electricity grid and the especially as a result of Mission Energy or another opening up of national competition in the supply of private operator being the daily operator of the electricity. If Victoria is to capture the full benefits of power station. The SEC has put the present value of competition there should be competition within a those future benefits at approximately $300 million. fairly narrow band of output prices for power It is clear that those benefits would not be available stations. but for the fact that Mission Energy is a participant in the joint venture owning the power station and The coalition has not taken the step of making its will operate the station. If the government were support for the Bill contingent upon any change in looking at a rationale for prodUCing a more the power tariff; it has been assured that the contract commercial tariff one might take the view that the terms will allow that matter to be dealt with during whole or at least part of that future benefit ought to the life of the contracts the Bill facilitates. The be loaded into the tariff today so that Victorians can coalition is prepared to undertake an examination of share in those benefits through lower power prices. those issues when it is in government. However, even with those two changes taking place the tariff would not be reduced to a commercial However, I press upon the government the fact that level. the most opportune time for consideration of the issue is prior to the formal settlement and signing of Today I had a brief discussion with the Minister for the contracts. It is in the interests of all parties, Manufacturing and Industry Development and I particularly the Victorian community in the longer understand that he still regards it as a matter term, the SEC and Mission Energy, for the appropriate for consideration. I am concerned that government to take the opportunity of reviewing Parliament is embarking on a course which could and adjusting the power tariff on the grounds I have see approximately 20 per cent of the output of indicated. Victorian generating capacity committed for 30 years at a price that is approximately 40 per cent I understand that Mission Energy has given a above the competitive tariff of the rest of the commitment to the government and the SEC, as it Victorian system and of the power delivered to the gave to the coalition, that any adjustment in the Victorian border from interstate. power tariff and, probably, in any other price determinant, will flow through the computer model I am strongly of the view that that is not in the that replicates the financial arrangements under interests of the Victorian community, the SEC or which the power station operates, preserving only Mission Energy. Everybody has an interest in Mission Energy's desired rate of return so that the ensuring that there is a real commercial opportunity full effect of any price reduction will be reflected in a for Mission Energy to sell its optional 20 per cent of lower electricity tariff for the people of Victoria. power to authorities other than the SEC so that real benefits will accrue from the contractual options that In light of the proposed amendments it is Mission Energy gains under the power supply particularly important to make it clear that the agreement. arrangements should not prohibit any subsequent moves to enhance competition within the electricity During the second-reading debate I referred to the industry. I press on the government the fact that the advice from Price Waterhouse that overseas power tariff should complement the desire for experience suggests that the discipline of enhanced competition. It is not only the formal competition is substantially weakened when there is contractual restrictions that can inhibit the a wide disparity between the most expensive power introduction of competition or undermine its and the cheapest power coming into the system. For effectiveness; the financial arrangements can also more than a decade the output of Loy Yang B in impede the discipline that flows from competition historical cost accounting terms will be predicated and deny the Victorian community the full NATIONAL PARKS (WILDERNESS) BILL

2018 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992 advantages of the competition -limited though 6. Clause 8, omit this clause. they are under the present arrangements - that will 7. Clause 12, lines 17 to 21, omit proposed sub-section inevitably flow from the restructuring of the (40). Victorian industry and its opening up to interstate competition. 8. Clause 13, page 6, lines 25 and 26, omit "Until the applicable date of expiry for a licence referred to in I formally request that the government reactivate section 32AD(2A),". what seems to be a dormant consideration of the 9. Clause 13, page 6, line 30, omit "10,'. appropriate power tariff and that it negotiate on the grounds I have spelled out - and any other relevant 10. Clause 13, page 7, lines 1 and 2, omit "8, 9 and 10" grounds - to ensure that the people of Victoria and insert "8 and 9". receive the maximwn benefits from the competition 11. Clause 14, omit this clause. created in this vital industry and that the best commercial tariff is offered in the best interests of all 12. Clause 15, page 10, lines 21 to 26, omit all words and parties. expressions on these lines.

13. Clause 18, page 18, line 15, omit "BOGONGE" and Motion agreed to. insert "BOGONG" The SPEAKER - Order! The House will now 14. Clause 22, page 22, line 1, omit "(a)". deal with the amendments made by the Legislative 15. Clause 22, page 22, lines 4 to 7, omit paragraph (b). Council. 16. Insert the following new clause to follow the Mr A. J. SHEEHAN (Treasurer) - I note the heading to Part 6 - comments of the honourable member for Brighton. Deer hunting in Avon Wilderness Park The Minister for Manufacturing and Industry Development in another place has indicated that the 'A. The Principal Act is amended as follows - government is prepared to negotiate on the issue of (a) after section 17C(2)(f) insert- the power tariff and prices to achieve the government's objectives. I move: "or (g) deer hunting by stalking or the carrying of That the amendments be agreed to. firearms or other weapons for that purpose, in the wilderness park referred Mr PLOWMAN (Evelyn) - The coalition to in Part 2 of Schedule Two A, if carried supports the passage of the amendments that were out in accordance with an authority or fully debated in another place. permit under section 37.";

Motion agreed to. (b) in section 37(3) after "Schedule Two and" insert "Part 2 of Schedule Two A and"; Ordered to be returned to Council with message (c) in section 37(6) after "Schedule Two and" insert intimating decision of House. "Part 2 of Schedule Two A and.".' NATIONAL PARKS (WILDERNESS) Mr HARROWFIELD (Minister for Finance) - I BILL move:

Returned from Council with message relating to That the amendments be agreed to. amendments. I reluctantly agree to the amendments. The Bill is an Council's amendments: historic piece of legislation. It establishes a 1. Clause 2, line 8, omit "and 9 and sections 5 and IS" comprehensive system of wilderness areas to protect and insert "3, 7 and 9". the State's remaining wilderness for this and future generations. I am disappointed that the Bill did not 2. Clause 2, lines 11 and 12, omit sub-clause (3). proceed in its original fonn. 3. Clause 2, lines 16 and 17, omit sub-clause (7). I shall comment on three amendments, the first 4. Clause 6, omit this clause. being the deletion of the Wongungarra wilderness 5. Clause 7, omit this clause. zone. It is clearly not in accordance with the PARLIAMENTARY COMMITTEES (AMENDMENT) BILL

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2019 government's wishes, despite what has been said suspect that the Liberal Party would agree with me during the second-reading debate in this place, nor on that, but again the National Party tail is wagging is it in accordance with the recommendations of the the coalition dog. Land Conservation Council (LCC) which state: Having made those brief but necessary comments, I In the event that the government decides that logging is reluctantly accept the amendments. The Bill is not to proceed in the northern part of the Wongungarra important in protecting the State's wilderness areas. River catchment, council considers that the area It is appropriate that it is being passed at the same encompassed by the original candidate area ... should time as the United Nations Earth Summit is being be a wilderness area. conducted; it is time to reflect on the importance of wilderness areas. The opposition's argument concerning the impact on the timber industry is unfounded. Firstly, the Mr HONEYWOOD (Warrandyte) - Although government is satisfied that the commitment to the noting the desire of the Minister to read into the timber industry can be met from the East Kiewa area record the government's concern about various and from the possible earlier harvesting of regrowth. amendments, the proof is in the pudding.

Secondly, the Wongungarra wilderness zone I take pleasure in supporting the amendments. The proposal would not have caused a loss of jobs. Hamer government established the Land Because of the rugged terrain and the application of Conservation Council and the coalition has had a the Code of Forest Practices and the Flora and Fauna long tradition of supporting genuine LCC Guarantee Act, it is possible that the estimated recommendations. The Bill in its original form went 30 000 cubic metres of harvestable timber in the beyond the LCC recommendations and the Wonungarra wilderness zone is an overestimate, amendments take into account the requirements of that is, if it were ever to be harvested. all user groups. The government tends to forget that there is more than one user group in national parks. The second amendment relates to the provision for There are also four-wheel drive enthusiasts, deer deer hunting in the Avon Wilderness Park. In 1989 hunters and others who wish to enjoy recreational the Liberal Party supported the wilderness pursuits or, in some cases, financial pursuits, and amendments to the National Parks Act to prohibit they should have access to national parks. hunting in the Avon Wilderness Park. It has done a backflip by, in conjunction with the National Party, The government thumbed its nose at those groups inserting an amendment to again provide for deer and attempted to railroad the Bill through hunting in the Avon Wilderness Park. Parliament. It did not recognise that all parties and all interests should be protected, induding the One can only conclude that the backflip is a result of grazing rights incorporated in the National Parks the undue influence asserted by the National Party regulations that were approved a short time ago. on the coalition on environment and conservation issues. It is a remarkable change: since 1989 the The opposition applauds the government on seeing Liberal Party has totally reversed its pOSition. The the logic of the amendments to the Bill. Avon Wilderness Park would have been the only area in the southern Alps and virtually the only area Motion agreed to. west of Mount Hotham where deer hunting and the use of firearms was not permitted. PARLIAMENTARY COMMITIEES (AMENDMENT) BILL The third amendment relates to the continued grazing in wilderness zones in the Alpine National Introduction and first reading Park. It is a fundamental principle of wilderness protection that stock grazing is not a use compatible Received from Council. to a wilderness area. That principle was clearly recognised in the 1989 wilderness amendments to Read first time on motion of Mrs WADE (Kew). the National Parks Act, and also by the LCC, which recommended a to-year phase-out. Continued Mrs WADE (Kew) - I seek leave to move that grazing in the wilderness zones in the Alpine the Bill be printed and, by leave, read a second time National Park is not an accepted principle that forthwith. should be enshrined in wilderness park areas. I FINANCIAL INSTITUTIONS (VICTORIA) BILL

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Mr Roper (to Mrs Wade) - I will talk to you (c) after section 314(d) there were inserted- about it. "(e) any reference to a SOCiety or foreign society that is a party to the merger in an The SPEAKER - Order! The question is: agreement, instrument or other document is to be taken to be a reference to the That the Bill be printed and the second reading be merged society, unless inconsistent with made an Order of the Day for next day. the context or subject-matter, so far as relates to a period after the merger takes Mr STOCKDALE (Brighton) - On a point of effect."; order, Mr Speaker, you asked the Leader of the House whether leave was refused in this matter. I do (d) after section 315(d) there were inserted- not believe he actually gave an answer. Given your "(e) any reference to the foreign society in an question about the Bill being considered tomorrow, agreement, instrument or other document will the Minister say whether leave was refused or is to be taken to be a reference to the granted? transferee society, unless inconsistent with the context or subject-matter, so far as The SPEAKER - Order! The Leader of the relates to a period after the transfer of House appeared to indicate by a shake of his head engagements takes effect.". that leave was refused. If there is any doubt, I am sure the Leader of the House will clarify it. 3. Clause 14, page 12, lines 3 to 6, omit sub-clause (2). 4. Clause 15, omit this clause. Ordered to be printed and second reading to be made Order of the Day for next day. 5. Clause 25, page 15, line 6, omit "inder" and insert "under". FINANCIAL INSTITUTIONS (VICTORIA) BILL 6. Clause 39, line 34, omit "this Act" and insert "this or any other Act or the Financial Institutions (Victoria) Code". Message from Council relating to amendments considered. 7. Clause 40, line 4, omit "(3)" and insert "(4)". Council's amendments: 8. Clause 41, line 34, after ''Division'' insert ", the Co-operative Housing Societies Act 1958 or the 1. Clause 5, line 18, after "section 5" insert "of the Friendly Societies Act 1986". Financial Institutions (Victoria) Act 1992". 9. Clause 45, page 26, after line 28 insert - 2. Clause 8, page 8, after line 9 insert - "(10) In this section - "(5) The Financial Institutions Code referred to in sub-section (1) applies as if- (a) a reference to a financial year includes a reference to the year ending on 30 June (a) after section 299(d) there were inserted- 1992; and "(e) any reference to a society that is a party to (b) in relation to that financial year, a reference the merger in an agreement, instrument or to a report of operations includes a other document is to be taken to be a reference to a report of the operations of reference to the merged society, unless each of the Reserve Boards; and inconsistent with the context or subject-matter, so far as relates to a period (c) in relation to that financial year, a reference after the merger takes effect."; to financial statements includes a reference to financial statements for each (b) after section 3OO(d) there were inserted- of the Reserve Boards; and "(e) any reference to the transferor society in (d) in relation to that financial year, a reference an agreement, instrument or other to the Commission in sub-section (3)(c) document is to be taken to be a reference and (3)(d)(i) includes a reference to the to the transferee society, unless Reserve Boards. inconsistent with the context or subject-matter, so far as relates to a period (11) In sub-section (lO),''Reserve Boards" means - after the transfer of engagements takes (a) the Building Societies Reserve Board under effect."; the Building Societies Act 1986; FINANCIAL INSTITUTIONS (VICTORIA) BILL

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(b) the Credit Co-operatives Reserve Board 25. Clause 95, line 8, omit "1986" and insert "1958". under the Co-operation Act 1981; 26. Clause 95, line 11, omit "1986" and insert "1958". (c) the Friendly Societies Reserve Board under 27. Clause 106, line 8, omit "accounts" and insert the Friendly Societies Act 1986.". "borrow'. 10. Clause 47, page 29, line 6, omit "(3)" and insert "(4)". 28. Clause 107, line 11, after "fund" insert If, and any 11. Clause 47, page 29, line 14, omit "(3)" and insert income from investment of such assets". "(4)". 29. Clause 109, page 71, after line 3 insert- 12. Clause 47, page 29, line 16, omit "(3)" and insert "(c) in section 101S, for "Reserve Board" (where "(4)". first occurring) substitute "Commission";". 13. Clause 58, line 16, omit "41" and insert "25". 30. Clause 109, page 71, after line 16, insert - 14. Clause 61, line 19, after "committed," insert "or a "(h) in section 101P, for ''Reserve Board" (wherever cause of action that arose,". occurring) substitute "Commission".". 15. Clause 61, line 24, insert - 31. Clause 117, line 27, omit ''Victoria'' and insert "(4) For the purposes of proceedings continued or ''Victorian'' . instituted by the Commission under this 32. Insert the following new clause to follow clause 14: section in relation to the Co-operation Act 1981, sections 237, 238 and 239 of that Act are Jurisdiction of Courts (Cross-vesting) Act 1987 to be taken to continue to have effect, despite "AA. Nothing in section 14 affects any other anything to the contrary in this Act, as if a jurisdiction of any court or the operation of reference in those sections to the registrar the Jurisdiction of Courts (Cross-vesting) Act were a reference to the Commission.". 1987.". 16. Clause 72, after line 9 insert- Mr KENNAN (Attorney-General) - I move: "(1) In section 10 of the Principal Act, for "Reserve Board" (wherever occurring) substitute That the amendments be agreed to. "Commission"." Mrs WADE (Kew) - The amendments, as agreed 17. Clause 72, after line 18, insert- to in another place, are of concern to the coalition in "(5) In section l1(c) of the Principal Act, for some respects. They are largely technical "Reserve Board" (where twice occurring) amendments but one in particular, relating to substitute "Commission"." friendly societies, causes us concern. 18. Clause 73, line 23, omit "paragraph (a) is repealed" When the Bill was last before this House the and insert "for paragraph (a) substitute - coalition expressed concern about the provisions "(a) amounts received by the Commission for regarding friendly societies. The Bill sets up the payment, or repayment, to the Building Australian Financial Institutions Scheme to apply to Societies General Reserve Fund; and".". building societies and credit unions. While it is not intended that friendly societies be part of the 19. Clause 76, line 21, omit "established under that national scheme, the regulation of friendly societies section" and insert "referred to in those sections". has been brought under this Bill. Amendments now 20. Clause 80, line 28, omit "include" and insert "insert". before the House deal with friendly societies. 21. Clause 84, page 45, line 18, omit "(13(d)" and insert Friendly societies have expressed concern to the "(13)(c)". coalition and the government about being brought 22. Clause 89, lines 4 and 5, omit "that Part" and insert under the legislation, particularly that the expertise ''Part V of the Principal Act". to be put on the Victorian regulating body, to be called VicFic, is not appropriate to friendly societies. 23. Clause 91, line 27, omit "continues" and insert "and One of the amendments in this group of sections 237, 238 and 239 of that Act continue". amendments deals with the financing of VicFic, and 24. Clause 91, line 28, after "up" insert "as if, in sections a large part of that financing is by levy on friendly 237 and 238, a reference to the registrar were a societies. Indeed, friendly societies will pay large reference to the Commission". sums of money for regulation under this Bill. As I FINANCIAL INSTITUTIONS (VICTORIA) BILL

2022 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992 understand it, the largest Victorian society will pay Meetings occurred between the friendly societies about $1 million a year for the advantage of being and the Attorney-General's representatives, regulated by the new regulating authority, VicFic. including one last Thursday morning which concluded at about 10.30 a.m. The friendly societies' The amendment clarifies a possible deficiency in the representatives were advised at that meeting that the Bill so that there can be no doubt that levies upon Bill would not be debated in the other place until friendly societies, together with levies on credit this week. At about 11.30 a.m. last Thursday I was unions and building societies, will go into the pot to telephoned by the Director of Policy and Research, pay for the scheme. Attorney-General's Department, who advised me that a new set of amendments would be faxed to me When the Bill was last before this House the at my electorate office. I received the fax containing coalition urged the Attorney-General to remove the new amendments, including some that had been friendly societies from the Bill. Concerns expressed circulated previously and the one concerning include those about expertise on VicFic and that the friendly societies. The facsimile message carried an size of possible levies on friendly societies would 11.48 a.m. time of dispatch. have a detrimental effect on them. Fears regarding the amount of the levies have been confirmed During my telephone conversation with the because the friendly societies have now been told Attorney-General's representative I advised him that about the very high level of the fees they will each be when I had had an opportunity of examining the expected to pay. amendments I would advise the Attorney-General when the coalition would be ready to proceed with The Friendly Societies Association of Victoria has debate on the Bill. Unfortunately, I did not have the told me that two or three of the largest friendly opportunity of considering those amendments and I societies are not prepared to agree to the regulation. had no chance to further contact the office of the It is easy for friendly societies to become life Attorney-General because, some time before 11.57 insurance companies, thereby transferring the a.m. on that day, the Honourable James Guest in the regulation of friendly societies from Victoria to come Legislative Council, who was handling this Bill and under the umbrella of the insurance commissioner in the amendments for the coalition, was told by the Canberra. Attorney-General's representative in that place, the Minister for Health, that the amendments were It is a backward step to have an Upper House technical in nature and had been in the hands of the amendment clarifying the situation concerning coalition for some time, and that the Bill was ready levies to be paid through VicFic. If the three largest to proceed. friendly societies become life insurance companies and are regulated from Canberra, the next step is for The Bill was brought on for debate at 11.57 a.m. and them to move their head offices to Canberra, with the amendments were accepted. I shall repeat some the consequent loss of jobs and investment in of those times. I was rung at 11.30 a.m. and told that Victoria. Victoria has always been the base for the amendments would be faxed through. I was friendly societies. Large sums of money are invested given no indication of any intention to bring the Bill by ordinary Victorians in friendly societies and, in on for debate last Thursday and, as I said, the many cases, the funds are invested back into Victoria. friendly societies had been told that the debate would not come on until this week. I was aware of Therefore, we asked the Attorney-General to the negotiations that had been taking place between consider amending the Bill. After speaking to the the friendly societies and the Attorney-General's friendly societies, we suggested he could proclaim Department and I had no reason to think that the the sections dealing with friendly societies at a date coalition would not be able to consider the outcome different from that on which the other provisions are of those negotiations before the matter was proclaimed. So there would be the possibility of considered in another place. deferring the operation of these provisions until further consideration was given to them. The The other item of interest is that when the Bill came Attorney-General undertook to consider that on for debate in the other place last Thursday suggestion while the Bill was between Houses. My morning, it was listed on the Notice Paper as understanding was that consideration was to be Government Business, Order of the Day No. 6. given to changing the Bill so that the provisions Somewhat unexpectedly for members of the regarding friendly societies could be considered coalition, it jumped to the No. 2 position on the separately. FINANCIAL INSTITUTIONS (VICTORIA) BILL

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I\'otice Paper. No explanation for that change in been agreed to by the friendly societies. I ask the business was given. Attorney-General to amend the Bill to permit separate proclamations because that will give him The coalition was not given time to properly an option. It is an option he does not have to take consider the amendments relating to friendly but it will give him more time to consider the future societies and it did not have time to consider the of friendly societies in Victoria. As I said, they have negotiations that had been taking place between the been here for more than 100 years and it seems a Attorney-General's Department and the friendly pity that the action we take by rushing this Bill societies. My understanding is that those through Parliament may force them out of the State negotiations resulted in the provisions to allow for a in a matter of weeks. separate proclamation being identified so that if the Attorney-General wanted to consider separate The amendments would give the Attorney-General proclamations, the Attorney-General's Department the opportunity for more careful consideration and would be in a position to have those amendments discussion with friendly societies. The prepared speedily. Attorney-General has misled friendly societies and I understand that they have received a letter of I am concerned about the breach of undertaking and apology acknowledging that they were misled about convention in the handling of the Bill in another the time at which debate on this Bill would come place. I am not apportioning any blame; it may well before the Legislative Council. However, if the have been a misunderstanding. However, there does Attorney-General is prepared to put forward the seem to have been a certain lack of care in the way in amendments I assure him that he will have coalition which the Bill was brought on unexpectedly for support and he will certainly have support from all debate in another place. Victorian friendly societies and their members.

I am more concerned about the friendly societies Mr STOCKDALE (Brighton) - I support the and their operation in Victoria. As I said, Victoria remarks of the honourable member for Kew. No has always been the base for friendly societies and honourable member in this House should the Bill going ahead in its current form could well underestimate the significance of the matter raised mark the end of Victoria as the main base for by her. Friendly societies are important institutions; friendly societies. Friendly societies have been in they represent hundreds of thousands of Victorians. operation in Victoria for more than 100 years. In that The Victorian societies represent about 80 per cent of time nobody has lost any money in a friendly the friendly society industry throughout Australia society. I understand that about four societies have and this problem is virtually peculiar to Victoria. gone out of operation and been merged with other The national scheme does not involve friendly healthy friendly societies so that suggests that there societies which are included in the Bill as a separate may be a problem once every 25 years. We have just section, but the Attorney-General obviously regards had a problem and are therefore not due for another it as convenient to include them in the Bill one for 25 years, so I suggest that the implementing the national scheme of regulation for Attorney-General has time to further consider the other non-banking institutions. Bill. The societies have put it to the coalition that they are The Attorney-General said it is inappropriate for the disadvantaged in two ways by the proposals being Bill to become part of a national scheme with its advanced: firstly because the substantive provisions headquarters in Brisbane. He said he would like to make it virtually impossible for them to operate as see the headquarters of any scheme for friendly friendly societies in Victoria; and, secondly, because societies located in Melbourne. I suggest that if he of prejudice in the national consideration of the part goes ahead now the decision may not be made by a friendly societies play in the non-bank financial Victorian government but by friendly societies institutions area. voting with their feet and going elsewhere to be regulated. Their regulation and involvement are currently under consideration by the national task force and I do not see any harm in keeping options open. The friendly societies have been valiantly striving to provisions that need to be amended - and there are direct attention to the peculiarities of their position. not many of them to enable a separate proclamation They have been fighting with one hand tied behind of the friendly society provisions - have been their backs because they represent a minority identified by the Attorney-General's staff and have interest in the national consideration not only in the FINANCIAL INSTITUTIONS (VICTORIA) BILL

2024 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992 sense of being a minority proportion of the non-bank building societies; a number of them own building institutions as a whole but also because no other societies. It is important that their separate interests State has the same degree of urgency about as friendly societies be registered and that it be consideration of the matter because they do not have recognised that this is not an Australian problem; it the same concentration of those institutions as is peculiarly a Victorian problem. I urge the Victoria has. Attorney-General to take up the proposal of the honourable member for Kew and at least provide a They are fearful that the provisions included in the safety valve for the friendly societies to be regulated Bill will so disadvantage them in that consideration on their own merits. that their position will not be considered on its merits and they will be lumped unthinkingly into Mr KENNAN (Attorney-General) (By leave) - I the national pattern of regulation on terms which shall reply to the matters raised by honourable will make it impractical for them to continue. I am members. The honourable member for Brighton is sure the Attorney-General does not intend to destroy correct in saying it is certainly not the wish of the the friendly society industry or to drive a major set government to drive friendly societies to another of financial and service-providing institutions out of State. The honourable member for Kew is correct in Victoria. I am sure that when the Premier refused to saying that it is certainly not the wish of the receive a deputation on the matter that she did not government that friendly societies be regulated from intend that those results should flow. Queensland.

The proposal advanced by the honourable member The government has given consideration to the for Kew is a safety valve. The Attorney-General does matters raised. It is a misnomer to say that what will not need to prejudice his consideration of the case be required will be several proclamations. What will raised by the friendly societies and supported by the be required are legislative amendments to take opposition by agreeing to the proposal to bring into friendly societies out of the Financial Institutions force the national scheme while dealing separately (Victoria) Bill and put them back under the Friendly with the issues that confront friendly societies. In the Societies Reserve Board. On balance, that is not normal course of events one would have thought justified. The fears of friendly societies are that the two sets of provisions are so different in understood; I do not say they do not honestly hold quality that they would have had separate them. However, the government contends that those commencement provisions in any case. fears will not be borne out.

I simply reinforce the suggestion made by the To take friendly societies out of regulation in this honourable member for Kew. She has advanced a State would require a new piece of legislation. constructive suggestion in the spirit of cooperation Nothing will happen in relation to the Victorian and it is one the Attorney-General should readily be friendly societies being regulated other than by the able to advance. It does not reduce his position to Victorian Financial Institutions Commission unless any extent. It still leaves him absolutely in control of Parliament agrees. All the Bill does is provide that the advice he and his government tenders to the the friendly societies will be regulated by the Governor in Council about the method of bringing commission which has considerable efficiency if it the Bill into force. He still retains the option of regulates all the non-bank financial institutions, and bringing the Bill into force on a single day but he it is more than capable of handling that regulation. will build in a safety valve which will facilitate separate consideration of what is clearly an Regardless of whether the Victorian Financial important and separate matter. Institutions Commission becomes a national regulator of friendly societies, whatever happens I end where I began: what is involved here is with the regulation of friendly societies is a matter potentially the survival or the extinction of an for the future. There is nothing that allows important Victorian industry, an industry centred in subliminal regulation from Queensland, and any Victoria, and an industry that offers important regulation of the Victorian friendly societies by the advantages to Victoria in retaining Melbourne's Victorian Financial Institutions Commission will status as a major financial centre. Honourable require the consent of this Parliament. members are debating cooperative or mutual bodies that represent hundreds of thousands of Victorians The position needs to be understood. The political and offer services in a wide range of activities, parties have put their views in the case. I do not including -as the Attorney-General is aware- think any political party is saying that it is FINANCIAL INSTITUTIONS (VICTORIA) BILL

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2025 necessarily against the regulation of friendly linked with the Australian financial institutions societies; each is saying that the regulator must be in scheme. That scheme is supposed to be up and Victoria, Victoria having 85 per cent of Australia's operating by July. Some practical reasons exist - friendly societies. quite apart from the reasons I have advanced today - why one would not want to bring in by I suggest one other matter. It is the govemment's then the provisions relating to friendly societies. understanding that the same position will apply in New South Wales as will apply here, that is, that the All that needs to be done is that the friendly societies supervisory authority for the non-bank financial be untangled from the other financial institutions institutions in New South Wales will have provisions in a small number of sections. It would be responsibility for friendly societies as well as for the quite easy to do and would require only a decision other bodies. on the part of the Attorney-General. If that were done, it would be left with him whether he brought Mrs WADE (Kew) (By leave) - It is important in all the legislation on the same day or whether, that honourable members understand the position of having further considered the matter, he decided to the friendly societies and the possibilities now before leave the friendly societies until some later date or us. There seem to be two misconceptions in what the not to proclaim the provisions at all and come back Attorney-General has said. I want to make the with other proposed legislation. proposal put forward by the coalition quite plain and explain why it is important. The Attorney-General has said there is no question of the friendly societies being caught up in the The Attorney-General has suggested that the only Australian Financial Institutions Commission way to deal with the problem of the friendly (AFIC) aspect - that is, the national aspect - of the societies is to take the friendly societies provisions legislation, without Parliament agreeing to it. If the that are in the Financial Institutions (Victoria) Bill friendly societies are to be brought under AFIC the out of the Bill. Of course, that would be one way of legislation will have to be brought back to dealing with the problem. It is a way the coalition Parliament. At the moment the friendly societies are would not have objected to; in fact, even at this late being brought under the new Victorian Financial stage, we still would not object to it. However, Institutions Commission and are not under the because we have got to a fairly late stage in the national scheme. The friendly societies are proceedings, we are not suggesting that. What is concerned that they might be brought under AFIC suggested is something much simpler: that is, that and regulated from Brisbane. the Bill be amended in such a way that there is an option for the Attorney-General and the govemment The Attorney-General tells us that is not his not to bring in the provisions relating to friendly intention. He does not seem to understand that he societies until further consideration has been given may not be the person who will make the final to those provisions. My understanding is that that decision about the regulation of friendly societies. was the proposal the representative of the friendly Certainly Parliament will have to decide whether the societies discussed with the Attorney-General's friendly societies go to the AFIC scheme. However, Department. three of the largest friendly societies in Victoria have indicated that they are not prepared to come under I have received a letter that I unfortunately do not the proposal before the House and be regulated by have with me at the moment in which the the Victorian Financial Institutions Commission. representative of the friendly societies identifies the Those three friendly societies are seriously provisions of the Bill that would have to be considering transferring to regulation by the amended to allow the friendly societies provisions to insurance commissioner in Canberra, under be brought into operation on a different date from Commonwealth legislation. the rest of the provisions. As the honourable member for Brighton said, one would perhaps have The friendly societies do not want to be caught up in wanted to do that anyway, even if the friendly the AFIC scheme. They are frightened that if they societies were quite happy with the Bill. There is a stay in Victoria under VicFic they will eventually different regulatory set-up for the friendly societies come under AFIC. They do not like the idea of a under the proposed legislation from that for the levy. One of the major friendly societies is being building societies and credit unions. It would be asked to pay a levy in the vicinity of $1 million. I possible to bring in at a different date the provisions understand that were that society to come under relating to friendly societies and the provisions Commonwealth legislation it would pay a levy of HERITAGE RIVERS BILL

2026 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992 approximately $30 000. I understand the insurance smaller States are trying to grab all the seats on the commissioner is examining the fees under his Act. A AFIC board. I seek an assurance from the review is being undertaken and it is anticipated that Attorney-General that that is not the case. I trust that the fees under that legislation will be increased but he will inform us whether he does have the concerns they will still be substantially lower than the levy that were attributed to him in the newspaper article, provided for by the Bill. whether he can give assurances that people with potential conflicts of interest will not take their Although the Attorney-General believes he will be places on the AFIC board, and whether New South able to come back to Parliament when it resumes Wales and Victoria will have adequate and present different provisions dealing with the representation on the board. regulation of friendly societies, the fact is that the most important friendly societies in Victoria, which The other matter that was raised in the newspaper give strength to the industry, may leave Victoria by article concerns the commencement date for the that time. They do not want to come under the operation of the legislation in New South Wales. jurisdiction of AFIC or to have to pay the levy. There is a problem because the New South Wales Parliament is unlikely to sit for more than one day I am seriously concerned about what the friendly before 1 July. I shall be interested to know whether societies are saying. I urge the Attorney-General to the Attorney-General can provide information about reconsider this issue. The amendments have been that matter, which will also have some bearing on identified and the coalition is prepared to support building societies and credit unions and the issue those amendments if the Attorney-General puts relating to friendly societies. them forward. It would be appropriate to defer consideration of the Bill and deal with it later in the Motion agreed to. day. The amendments will be easily prepared and the coalition will agree to them. The HERITAGE RIVERS BILL Attorney-General should take the opportunity to understand the seriousness of this issue, which is Message from Council relating to amendments about jobs, investment and the health of friendly considered. societies. The size of the levy may be sufficient to Council's amendments: discourage people from investing their savings in friendly societies. The Attorney-General has the 1. Clause I, line 4, after "protection of" insert "public option. land in". 2. Clause 2, line 11, omit "or days". There are a couple of other matters that I did not raise earlier with the Attorney-General because my 3. Clause 8, after line 25 insert- major concern was about friendly societies. An "() A management plan proposed to be made article in the Financial Review of 5 June has led to under this section must be made available for other concerns about the Bill and the amendments. public inspection for at least 60 days before it The article says: is made.

In a new twist to the debate over national laws for () The managing authority must have regard to building societies and credit unions, the NSW and any comments made by persons who have Victorian governments have accused the smaller States inspected the management plan during the and the major industry bodies of making a power grab inspection period.". for the board of the proposed Australian Financial 4. Clause 8, after line 31 insert- Institutions Commission. "() The managing authority must cause notice of a A document has apparently been brought to the management plan made under this section attention of the New South Wales Minister and our and of any amendment or revocation of such Cl Attorney-General which allegedly shows that the plan to be published in the Government smaller States, supported by the major industry Gazette. bodies, the Credit Union Services Corp. (Australia) ( ) Sections 5, 6 and 6A of the Subordinate Ltd and the Australian Association of Permanent Legislation Act 1962 apply to and in respect Building Societies, are considering a bloc vote to of a management plan made under this ensure their preferred candidates are elected to the section, and any amendment or revocation of AFIC board. There have been rumours that the such a plan, as if the plan, amendment or HERITAGE RIVERS BILL

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revocation were a statutory rule within the 13. Insert the following new clause to follow clause 21: meaning of that Act, notice of which had been "AA. Transitional provision. published in the Government Gazette on the day on which the Minister approved the plan, This Act is not to be taken to disturb the amendment or revocation.". continuity, operation or effect of any instrument made granted or issued under any other Act before 5. Clause 10, line 13, after "3" insert "unless the the commencement of this Act which authorises Governor in Council by notice published in the the carrying out of the grazing of domestic stock in Government Gazette, approves its construction in a natural catchment area or heritage river area.". that area". 14. Schedule 1, page 11, after Part 17 insert­ 6. Clause 10, line 15, after "3" insert "unless it is approved by the Governor in Council by notice "PART 18 - ABERFELDY RIVER HERITAGE published in the Government Gazette". AREA 7. Clause 10, after line 20, insert - All those pieces of public land along the Aberfeldy River within an area of 200 metres wide along each "() Sub-section (3) does not apply to a water side of the river for its entire length within the diversion approved by the Governor in boundaries of the Baw Baw National Park." Council by notice published in the Government Gazette.". 15. Schedule 3, page 14, Column 1, heading, omit "contructed" and insert "constructed". 8. Clause 17, line 28, before "A" insert "(1)". 16. Schedule 3, page 15, Column 1, heading, omit 9. Clause 17, line 29, after "authority," insert "contructed" and insert "constructed". "municipality," 17. Schedule 3, page 15, in Column 1 after "Glenelg 10. Clause 17, lines 31 and 32, omit "or with any other River Heritage Area" insert "Aberfeldy River person or organisation". Heritage Area". 11. Clause 17, after line 33 insert- 18. Schedule 3, page 15, in column 3 after "Glenelg "(2) The Minister must cause notice in the River Heritage Area" insert "Aberfeldy River prescribed form of the making of an Heritage Area". agreement to be laid before each House of Mr HARROWFIELO (Minister for Finance) - I Parliament within 10 sitting days after it is move: made. (3) The agreement has no effect if either House of That the amendments be agreed to. Parliament passes a resolution declaring it be of no effect within 10 sitting days after notice In so doing I register my disappointment about of the making of the agreement is laid before these amendments. They are another example of the the House. National Party having its say in the coalition party room on issues on which the Liberal Party would (4) The Minister must publish notice of the once have agreed with the government. resolution of the House in the Government Gazette.". Or Napthine interjected. 12. Clause 18, after line 18 insert - Mr HARROWFIELO - I look across the "(3) Regulations made under this·section may be Chamber and see many of the Liberal Party disallowed in whole or in part by resolution of members who are conservation minded and who either House of the Parliament in accordance would not necessarily have agreed to such with the requirements of section 6(2) of the amendments, but once again the National Party has Subordinate Legislation Ad 1962. won the day. It is remarkable that the National Party (4) Disallowance under sub-section (3) is deemed to seems to have its way on Bills of this kind. be disallowance by the Parliament for the purposes of the Subordinate Legislation Ad The government has accepted these amendments 1962.". because this is an important Bill, which will provide some protection for the heritage rivers. I make no bones about the agenda of many members of the National Party. It was made dear by the Deputy HERITAGE RIVERS BILL

2028 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992

Leader of the National Party in debate in this House The government's track record on planning issues that he wanted to dam a number of the heritage and in denying public input into such important rivers. It was also made clear in the debate in the measures as dual occupancy as of right is well Upper House that a dam would be built on the known. Everyone knows about the government's Mitchell River. It is unfortunate that the Big Brother denial of access to information for the amendments, to which we reluctantly agree, will little man in the street - we are used to it! make it even easier for dams to be built on these valuable rivers. Is it irresponsible for an opposition to move that the public has access to management plans? If not, how The original intention of the legislation was to can the Minister give his approval reluctantly? I am require an Act of Parliament to permit the sure that the public, particularly residents of areas construction of a dam on a heritage river. The that contain heritage rivers, would be concerned to amendments will weaken that provision by ensure that scrutiny was given to the government's providing that the Governor in Council may give track record or to a proposal by any government for approval for such construction. In the unlikely event control over those important aspects of their daily of a coalition government, National Party members lives. I am therefore surprised that the Minister gave would urge that every river in sight be dammed. his approval with reluctance.

Unfortunately the amendments will make possible The second amendment, to which the opposition the diversion of the Genoa, Suggan Buggan and the gave much thought, involves dams to be approved Thomson rivers without scrutiny of Parliament. The by the Governor in Council. This government, National Party's rural satellites have ensured those probably more than any other government, has rivers can be diverted by the Governor in Council implemented the Governor in Council approval rather than as a result of the full scrutiny of mechanism on various pieces of legislation that have Parliament. come before the House. It is well used to that mechanism and has enjoyed its usage. It is therefore The coalition has amended the Bill to include the surprising that the Minister should say that the Aberfeldy River in the Baw Baw National Park, government will reluctantly permit the Governor in which you, Mr Acting Speaker, made reference to in Council to approve dams. There is no question about your contribution to the second-reading debate. whether dams will be constructed - that is not an Although the amendments do not meet the criteria issue before the House! for heritage rivers spelled out by the Land Conservation Council, they include the two dams Mr Harrowfield interjected. under the control of Melbourne Water on the upper Aberfeldy River within the Baw Baw National Park. Mr HONEYWOOD - We are here referring to a procedure, a mechanism of government It is with a degree of reluctance that the government administration which the government has time and accepts these amendments. The government does again used effectively for its own purposes and not believe these rivers should be easily damaged in which it now, for some unknown reason we can only the way a coalition government would seek to wonder about, seeks to deny in the Bill before the damage them: dams are not appropriate on those House. heritage rivers and any action to dam those rivers should be taken only after a conscious choice of Mr Cooper interjected. Parliament, not simply by obtaining the approval of Governor in Council. Mr HONEYWOOD - That is probably correct. The third major amendment is one I know you, Mr HONEYWOOD (Warrandyte) - To demolish Mr Acting Speaker, have a considerable interest in: the rhetoric of the Minister one need only look at the the incorporation in the Bill of the Aberfeldy River. four major amendments which the opposition The government has said it moves with reluctance to proposed after much thought and which have been incorporate the river in the Bill. Yet the government accepted by the government. has historically constantly attacked and persists in attacking the opposition as being anti-conservation, The first amendment provides that public access to as being a coalition made up of two parties that do management plans be permitted. Everyone knows not support conservation goals. The coalition that over the past ten years the government has decided to go one better than the government and, constantly denied the public access to information. based on advice received by the Honourable Mark HERITAGE RIVERS BILL

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2029

Birrell, the Leader of the Opposition in another Mr W. D. McGRATH (Lowan) - It is place, from the Land Conservation Council, which disappointing that the government has accepted the made recommendations as to the intrinsic worth of amendments with reluctance. As we have seen with the Aberfeldy River, felt it should explain to and the legislation on wilderness areas and the original urge the government to incorporate the Aberfeldy heritage rivers legislation, the government is River in the Bill. The government has reluctantly pandering to narrow-minded conservationists rather agreed to do that. than, as the opposition has endeavoured to do, taking a broad, overall view for the good of all Mr Hamilton interjected. people in Victoria.

The ACTING SPEAKER (Mr Delzoppo) - Many people would declare themselves Order! The honourable member for Morwell is out conservationists. I am very much a conservationist of his seat and is being disorderly. I ask him to cease because of my farming background. These days interjecting. My comments also apply to the farmers need to be conservationists if their farming honourable member for Springvale. enterprises are to survive. There have been changes in wheat production, for instance, with the Mr HONEYWOOD - The Minister proposes introduction of minimum tillage, stubble retention that we add additional sections of the Aberfeldy and so on. The amendments provide an opportunity River to the Bill. If he would like to move a motion for normal farming practices to be carried out along to that effect the opposition will be prepared to designated heritage river frontages. It is only fair examine it. It is interesting that the Minister has that farmers who have access to river frontages, criticised the opposition for attempting to include including the Wimmera River that flows through parts of the Aberfeldy River in the provisions of the my electorate from the Pyrenes Ranges through legislation, yet today he proposed that we include Glenorchy, up to Horsham and along through additional sections of it. You, Mr Acting Speaker, Dimboola to Jeparit and Lake Albacutya, should may reflect on whether that is a genuine attempt to retain those rights if they need them. assist the important goal of the opposition. A great deal of conservation work will have to be The fourth major amendment to the Bill, which the carried out along the Wimmera River over the next opposition thought long and hard about, concerns decade - it may take even 30 or 40 years - to the retention of the traditional grazing rights along rectify the damage that has been done over the past river banks. Any Labor members who have 100 years. In these more enlightened times farmers ventured out of the Melboume metropolitan area and others are more aware of the need to deal with will know that for many years farmers have enjoyed the problems caused by soil degradation and traditional grazing rights on river banks, which are salinity. The amendments will ensure a more an important part of their usage entitlements and balanced Bill that will guarantee the cooperation of important for their livelihoods. farmers and the municipalities through which the heritage rivers flow. The Labor Party will hold no country seats after the next election and will be confined to a small rump to The Minister referred to the damming of the the west of the Yarra River. It is therefore not Mitchell River. If he had taken the time to visit East interested in the genuine needs of rural Victoria or Gippsland and talk to the people of the region about the fact that for more than 150 years farmers have the benefits to be gained from the damming of the gained their livelihoods from grazing. As a river, he may have taken a different view. The responsible opposition, the coalition considers that damming of the Mitchell River would guarantee a usage rights, together with other so-called secure water supply not only for farmers but also for conservation uses, should be taken into account. The residents of the towns in the region, especially major conservation groups did not raise any real during dry seasons. Victoria has some of the driest concerns about the retention of the grazing rights, areas in the country. If we are to continue to increase which have been enshrined in legislation for many productivity and improve the economic health of years and which in the past have normally received Victoria we must not waste water by allowing it to bipartisan support. I am surprised that the Minister run down our rivers to the sea without being should a ttempt to deny farmers those rights. For harvested. those reasons it is with pleasure that I support the amendments that are before the House today. The amendments will ensure a balance between the need to conserve scarce resources and the need to HERITAGE RIVERS BILL

2030 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992 increase opportuni ties for economic growth. If the Party could have their way in the coalition party government had its way river frontages would be room without the overwhelming support of fenced off, dams would not be built and members of the Liberal Party. Although there is a management plans could be adopted without being healthy tolerance of diversity in the coalition party scrutinised by Parliament. The amendments will room the fact remains that the 15 members of the ensure that management plans can be disallowed by National Party would need the support of a either House of Parliament. substantial number of their Liberal Party colleagues before their views prevailed. The amendments will more clearly define the purposes of the Bill. In its original form the Bill The Minister's remark about the tail wagging the pandered to the wishes of narrow-minded dog discloses a great deal more about how the Labor conservation groups. The amendments will ensure Party functions than how the coalition makes that the legislation is workable and of benefit to all decisions. The truth is that while reason and logic Victorians rather than a few special interest groups prevail in the coalition party room, only brute force who, if they had had their way, would have denied prevails in the Labor Party caucus room. Victorians access to the heritage rivers listed in the Honourable members know that when the socialist Bill. left unions exert pressure on their Parliamentary colleagues the socialist left Premier and the socialist Mr STOCKDALE (Brighton) - The responses of left Cabinet acquiesce, Treasurers lose their heads my colleagues have dignified the remarks made by and the caucus toes the line. the Minister for Finance with substantive debate, but I shall reply by highlighting the nakedly political The socialist left faction of the caucus does not have nature of the government's intentions, as disclosed the numbers to prevail. However, when socialist left by the Minister. It is clear to even the most ferocious unions oppose a government position, they take supporter of the government that, in an unguarded action to ensure that members of the caucus are moment, the Minister let slip the fact that the Bill whipped into line and do the bidding of the faceless was introduced not for the purposes outlined in the members of the union movement. I am not talking second-reading speech but in an attempt to create about the faceless men in the coalition room because the appearance of a division of opinion between the they do not exist; I am talking about the faceless men coalition parties. Not only has the government not in the union movement who call on the government been successful, but the Bill highlights the to toe the party line. government's naked abuse of the aspirations of many Victorians who want to conserve our natural The ACTING SPEAKER - Order! The heritage. That was evident in the Minister's honourable member should come back to the response, once his government's shallow political question before the Chair. tactics were seen to have failed. Mr STOCKDALE - I am on the question. The When faced with amendments moved by a united remarks of the Minister clearly demonstrate that the coalition that has, since its formation, acted in the Bill is about naked politics. I am drawing attention interests of all Victorians, the Minister claimed that to the fact that it is not the tail wagging the dog in the National Party tail has wagged the Liberal Party the coalition room but the wolf rounding up the dog. My colleagues have shown that the Minister's sheep in the caucus room that dictates the form of comments on the amendments had no substance. legislation. The Minister has shot himself in the foot The Minister did not bother to debate the with this ridiculous argument. The amendments are amendments, seeking instead to use them to create in the legislation at the initiative of the coalition the illusion of undemocratic action. Not only did the because they are substantively sensible. They are Minister's comments lack merit but they also improvements on the Bill the government displayed an utter lack of mathematical ability. introduced in an ill-fated attempt to create division. Indeed, the Minister compounds the error because if As the House will be aware the coalition comprises this is a story about the tail wagging the dog and if 15 members of the Parliamentary National Party and the amendments are unconscionable and defeat the 52 members of the Parliamentary Liberal Party and purpose of the Bill, one would expect the ALP to that more members of the Liberal Party represent take a principled stand. rural electorates than do members of the National Party. I am surprised that a Minister for Finance The government is not saying, 'We will not allow could imagine that the 15 members of the National these amendments; these wicked National Party HERITAGE RIVERS BILL

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2031 amendments shall form no part of our legislation". The government is a shallow, latter-day convert that We expect the government to stand up for the public demonstrates its lack of conviction in interest, but after this show of rhetoric, what does mealy-mouthed speeches like that which the the Minister say? He says, 'We will have the Minister gave on these amendments. amendments of the nasty old National Party after all". If the tail of the dog is being wagged it is Mr STEGGALL (Swan Hill) - It feels very because the shallow political stunts of the wolf in the different to follow the honourable member for ALP's party room have been exposed yet again. Brighton on a heritage rivers or water Bill but I endorse his remarks and congratulate him on them. It might be good fun for the Minister to indulge in What he said needed to be said. It must be shallow rhetoric, which is his way, and to circulate understood that one of the basic problems the his comments in Hansard to the conservation Minister for Finance has and one of the reasons he organisations and to electorates like Brighton or made such a foolish contribution to the debate is his through a direct mail campaign to the people who lack of knowledge of water law in Victoria. As has belong to the ratbag loony fringe organisations that been pointed out several times, the Water Act, which are Labor Party fronts. But there is a more sinister this Parliament spent much time on a few years ago, point here and that is why I am speaking on this Bill, covered many of the areas of the issue, and the unaccustomed territory as it is for me. amendments the Minister kindly moved today will help to bring the issue of heritage rivers into line The real nub of this is that the Minister has exposed with the water law. the ALP's cynical exploitation of even the moderate and responsible conservation-minded organisations. The Minister mentioned several matters that should I propose to send copies of my speech to all be covered again. He said that without this conservation organisations and to ask them to think legislation the rivers identified in the Bill would be about what is disclosed by the Minister's remarks. easily damaged. The Minister must understand that He has disclosed that the government has no without the approval of the relevant Minister and concern about the merits of this legislation, which adherence to procedures under the Water Act, has always been a shallow political stunt to create which are there to make sure these areas are not the illusion of division within the coalition. It shows damaged, nothing can be built on any waterway in that the government has no stomach for a real Victoria. conservation debate. The government is not interested in the genuine conservation issues raised The Minister mentioned the fact that the coalition by the Heritage Rivers Bill, just as it has no interest desired to have the Aberfeldy River included in the in the real conservation merits of the debate on Bill. He also mentioned the fact that the dam sites national parks, alpine national parks and Mallee Melbourne Water has planned for the area were not national parks. Those Bills were political stunts to included. He did not say that there is no way the try to capitalise on the sensitivity of people people of Melbourne will be able to get water from genuinely interested in conservation issues and the Aberfeldy River unless the entitlements on the values and to exploit them in the narrow party river are delivered to Melbourne. People do not political interests of the ALP. understand that everybody in Victoria will need entitlements to use water. Those entitlements It is important that this stunt is exposed and that we include conservation entitlements on all our rivers draw attention to it. It is not sufficient merely to and streams, including the rivers identified in the draw attention to the fact that the government is legislation. They cover conservation requirements, hypocritical in saying that it does not support the agricultural requirement and urban requirements, amendments and then not only endorsing but all of which will be applied this year and next year actually moving them. This government is cynically to all waterways in Victoria. exploiting the people who have a genuine concern for conservation. They ought to reject the If the government had been at all sincere about the government and accept the coalition's proud legislation it would have been more open about the heritage of promoting conservation which began management plans, to which we have introduced decades before the Labor movement realised there amendments so people can find out what they mean was not only employment but also votes in and what they do, and it would have understood conservation. that the same management plans are in the Water Act and can be used in that area. However, the government is not genuine, as the honourable ABORIGINAL LAND (MANA TUNGA LAND) BILL

2032 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992 member for Brighton pointed out. The Bill was 3. Clause 3, line 14, after "(a)" insert "or with the introduced merely to divide the Parliament. provisions of paragraph (b)". However, it failed because of the logic that has been 4. Clause 5, omit this clause. applied. The same strategy failed in 1989, when the Liberal and National parties worked together for the The ACfING SPEAKER - Order! As a first time on a big Bill, the Water Bill, which covered statement of intention has been made pursuant to many conservation issues. I only wish people would section 85(S)(c) in relation to the Bill, the Speaker is consider today's contribution by the Minister and of the opinion that the amendments made by the the contributions of the Minister for Conservation Legislative Council need to be agreed to by an and Environment in another place and the Minister absolute majority. for Water Resources. Mr ROPER (Minister for Employment, Many of the Minister's comments are not true. These Post-Secondary Education and Training) - I move: are simple, logical, commonsense amendments. There is nothing strange about them. They will bring That the amendments be agreed to. the Bill into line with water law in Victoria. Government members fail to understand that the I am very much in sympathy with the views of the Water Act was amended by some 700 amendments Murray Valley Aboriginal Co-operative Ltd which that were moved and accepted by the government in a letter to me says it is disappointed that the - just as the Minister has accepted amendments to opposition is seeking to amend the Bill by deleting this Bill. Parliament was at one on the Water Bill, as provisions that would enable the Aboriginal it is on this Bill. The government's approach is community to prevent mining on the Manahmga interesting because I thought the function of land. The cooperative points out that the Royal Parliament was to argue and debate the issues raised Commission into Aboriginal Deaths in Custody and by proposed legislation until consensus and the Woodward commission recommended that appropriate ends were reached. Aboriginal communities have the ability to control development on Aboriginal land. The amendments I agree with the amendments made by the run counter to that proposition. Legislative Council. I hope the Heritage Rivers Bill will be applied in the spirit of the Water Act and The cooperative recognises, as does the government, water law in Victoria and that the divisions the that the Bill will not pass through Parliament government sought to create will not occur. The without the opposition's support. Although that is government and the public must understand that not its preferred position the cooperative is prepared the coalition is keen to ensure that the conservation, to accept the amendments. development and protection of our rivers and streams is paramount to us all. I appreciate the cooperative's view. It is a shame that members opposite do not support the government in Motion agreed to. attempting to carry out recommendations 336 and 338 of the Muirhead Royal Commission's report. ABORIGINAL LAND (MANATUNGA When the Bill was last before the House I made clear LAND) BILL the importance the government placed on the recommendations of the Muirhead and Woodward Message from Council relating to amendments Royal Commissions. Unforhmately the Upper considered. House has omitted one of those recommendations from the Bill. Council's amendments: 1. Clause 3, after line 11, insert - The Bill provides many opportunities by granting freehold title of the Manahmga land to the Murray "(b) must not include any term or provision that Valley Aboriginal Co-operative Ltd. It puts into purports to exclude, modify or restrict the effect most of the purposes the government and the operation of the Mineral Resources cooperative sought in attempting to put into effect Development Act 1990, the Petroleum Act the Royal Commission recommendations. The 1958 or the Extractive Industries Act 1966; government, like the cooperative, reluctantly agrees and" to the amendments. We hope one day the opposition 2. Clause 3, line 12, omit "(b)" and insert "(c)". will understand exactly what has been proposed in the Royal Commission report and by others who ABORIGINAL LAND (MANATUNGA LAND) BILL

Tuesday. 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2033 have considered the Aboriginal land rights issue, an grants of land are made - and there is nothing issue that will be even more topical given the recent wrong with that - a future government will ensure High Court decision. that specific restrictions are not placed on them.

Mr STEGGALL (Swan Hill) - The Minister's I do not understand why the government is now comments are a little strange, considering recent moving in this direction because I thought that the changes to mining law in Victoria over the past two issues had been resolved by the inquiry conducted years. Why did the government introduce the by Mr Arnold and that landowner veto would not Mineral Resources Development Bill, which denied apply. I am not sure why the Minister introduced landowners the right of veto? I also refer the House this measure, but obviously he does not understand to the previous debate on the Heritage Rivers Bill. the workings of Aboriginal communities.

Did the Minister introduce provisions to deny ApprOximately a week ago I met with landowners the right to veto mineral exploration in representatives of the Murray Valley Aboriginal 1990 in an attempt to divide the conservative parties, Cooperative, who told me that this was not an or was the Labor Party genuine? If the government important issue to them. I remind the House that if was genuine in its desire not to give landowners a one wants a view about Aboriginal culture one does right of veto over mineral exploration in this State, not go to the Department of Aboriginal Affairs but why did it include the provision in the Bill? Why is to the community concerned. The department does the Minister disappointed that he has not been able not speak for the Murray Valley Aboriginal to include a landowner veto in this Bill, which Cooperative because those people make their own relates to land at Robinvale? decisions within the community and within their area. They do not have a centralised pyramid The Labor Party has not taken a strong stand on this structure of decision making such as the Labor Party issue. Two years ago the Minister should have stood or other institutions. I am sure the Minister would up, argued, fought, scratched and clawed to ensure be aware of that, and he should also be aware that it that landowner veto on minerals was applied in is difficult to negotiate general rules for Aboriginal Victoria. I thought we had finished with that people because each community does not argument, that Parliament had agreed the necessarily have the same view. ownership of minerals belonged to the State and that the government would apply a set of procedures to Some time ago skeletal remains of Aborigines were cover that issue. The coalition did not move to found at the Swan Hill golf and country club, and amend that Bill. The Mineral Resources after discussion with the Aboriginal community it Development Bill was introduced and passed, was decided that it would collect, bury and look according to the government's wishes. after those skeletal remains at a designated cemetery. Some years later skeletal remains were The Bills relating to Aboriginal communities at found during the construction of the Framlingham and Condah contained a mining veto. Mildura-Broken Hill road and the Aboriginal The National Party and the Liberal Party refused to community involved decided that those remains accept a veto in those Bills because it would have should be left where they were found and for the made Aboriginal people different from the rest of road to be slightly raised so that it could pass over Australians. them. Different Aboriginal communities have different solutions to different problems. That is The Minister for Aboriginal Affairs should why the solution to a problem in Swan Hill may be understand that in dealing with problems associated different from a solution to a similar problem in with the Aboriginal community Aboriginal people Robinvale, Framlingham or Condah. should not be made to feel that they are different from the rest of us. The Murray Valley Aboriginal All parties support the granting of land to the Cooperative does not regard this as a Significant cooperative but the Aborigines of that community issue, but after talking to the people in the district do not want to be different from other Victorians. I officials from the Department of Aboriginal Affairs am sorry that the Minister is only reluctantly have said that the Manatunga land should not be accepting the amendments proposed by the other treated differently from the land at Framlingham place because previous debates in the community and Condah, which were the subject of Federal and in Parliament on these issues have benefited all legislation. When representatives of the cooperative Victorians. They established a number of rules: one spoke to me I told them that from now on when being that the Crown owns the minerals and a DISTINGUISHED VISITOR

2034 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992 second being that landowners do not have a veto but MINISTERIAL STATEMENT that companies searching for minerals negotiate with the landowners under established procedures. Women's centre - Queen Victoria Nothing has changed and the legislation ensures hospital site that the Manatunga land will be treated similarly to other land throughout Victoria. Ms KIRNER (Premier) - I also welcome Mr Fischer to the Public Gallery. I believe that the cooperative will utilise the land for the best advantage of its community. The coalition is I desire to make a Ministerial statement. right to amend the Bill in this way and the government should accept the amendment in the As many honourable members will know, there has right spirit. been considerable bipartisan support for the establishment of a women's centre at the former Mr HONEYWOOD (Warrandyte) - During the Queen Victoria hospital site. debate on the Heritage Rivers Bill the government reluctantly accepted the coalition's amendments. Planning is now proceeding with the intention of One of the key amendments relating to the retention opening the centre during 1996, the centenary of the of traditional grazing rights for Aboriginal farming establishment of Melbourne's first women's communities and families has been reluctantly hospital. Honourable members will wish to be agreed to by the government. Aboriginals have a informed of recent amendments to the agreement, traditional fanning culture that requires access to which I will outline to the House today. Crown land. They have retained their traditional farming culture for more than 150 years and the It is important to recall that the Queen Victoria government should not deny that community its hospital began in 1896 when a one-shilling fund was right to use Crown land. launched for a women's hospital staffed entirely by women. As the honourable member for Brighton said, the government is interested only in short-term political Mr Steggall interjected. gain; it denied the community access to Crown land in the Heritage Rivers Bill but wants to impose a Ms KIRNER - The views of the honourable different set of conditions in this Bill. Parliament member for Swan Hill are not really needed on this does npt generally give freehold title to Crown land subject. And it was not for salinity but for women! on a regular basis but on rare occasions should have due cognisance of such usage. The coalition supports The women of Victoria contributed 66 000 shillings, the amendments. and a medical and surgical hospital was established first in William Street and then at the Lonsdale Street The SPEAKER -Order! I am of the opinion that site. the amendments to this Bill are required to be passed by an absolute majority. As there is not an In 1989 when the government decided to sell the absolute majority of the members of the House Queen Victoria hospital site following the transfer of present, I ask the Clerk to ring the bells. the hospital to Clayton, the significant claims of the women of Victoria were not forgotten. The Bells rung. government, the opposition parties and a coalition of women's groups known as the Queen Victoria Required number of members having assembled Hospital Action group negotiated an agreement to in Chamber: ensure that a women's centre would be included in any future plans for the site. It was agreed that any Motion agreed to by absolute majority. contract of sale for the site would include proviSion for a women's centre. Specifically, the government Sitting suspended 6.26 p.m. until 8.4 p.m. agreed to refurbish the eastern tower for use as a women's centre and to require the purchaser to lease DISTINGUISHED VISITOR the tower to the government for 200 years so that it could be sublet at a nominal rental to a legally The SPEAKER - Order! Before proceeding, I incorporated women's centre. It was also agreed that welcome to the Public Gallery Mr Timothy Fischer, open space around the tower would be set aside for Leader of the National Party of Australia. the centre. MINISTERIAL STATEMENT

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2035

These provisions were part of the March 1992 Mr KENNETT (Leader of the Opposition) - This agreement to sell the site to a developer, Mr David statement is supported by the coalition, which is as Marriner, and, as part of my Priority Victoria job committed as the government is to making this statement, $80 000 was allocated for development of project work. Therefore it has bipartisan support. a plan to refurbish the tower. However, I find it extraordinary that at this hour of the night the Premier has decided to make this In May this year I convened a meeting attended by statement - one of the few Ministerial statements the Attorney-General and Minister for Major that has been made by the government. In fact we Projects, the Minister for Planning and Housing, the have not had any -- Minister for Community Services, the Leaders of the opposition parties, the shadow Attorney-General, Ms Kimer interjected. the shadow Minister for Health, the shadow Minister for housing and the aged, Mr Marriner, and Mr KENNETT - This tower is for women in a representatives of the Queen Victoria Women's society in which women -- Centre Inc. Ms Kimer - You are making a dangerous error. The meeting agreed to allocate tower E, the central tower, for the women's centre rather than tower P, Mr KENNETT - It is for women in a society in as was originally planned. The change to tower E which they have been terribly neglected by this offers a number of advantages: government. We have not heard a Ministerial statement about the fact that the women who will tower E is more historically Significant because it make use of the centre are those who are losing their was previously the main entrance to the hospital jobs in increasing numbers. and bears the hospital's name; Ms Kimer - You are joking! the integrity of the building and existing features, such as an internal staircase and a lift, mean that Mr KENNETf - You have not made one the cost to the government of refurbishment will Ministerial statement on the effect of this be less than for tower P; and government's policies --

more space will be available for the centre. Honourable members interjecting.

Mr Marriner also indicated that he would prefer to The SPEAKER - I have already warned the transfer the ownership of the land on which tower E honourable member for Derrimut today. I am was located to the women's centre. The government prepared to take the appropriate action against him and the opposition agreed that this was a preferred if he is unable to abide by Standing Orders. I also solution and agreed to hold further talks with all ask the honourable member for Caulfield to remain parties on the matter. silent.

The Queen Victoria Women's Centre will be an Ms KIRNER (Premier) - On a point of order, invaluable asset for the women of Victoria, and I Mr Speaker, I thought the normal processes would like to thank the many women's groups who regarding the making of Ministerial statements have contributed to the development of the project. were, firstly, to inform oneself and, secondly, to inform the Leader of the Opposition and the Leader The centre will provide women with information of the National Party. That process took place and services, give them a place to meet and relax, during question time today. The Leader of the and offer facilities such as a cafe, a library and a OppOSition passed to me a note which said, "Okay, bookshop. The city location ensures that the centre is Jeff Kennett". accessible to women, and I feel sure that it will become a meeting place for country and regional Mr Maclellan interjected. women visiting the city. Ms KIRNER - I do not find this a laughing I move: matter. This is a serious matter and a non-political issue. That this House takes note of the Ministerial statement. MINISTERIAL STATEMENT

2036 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992

An Honourable Member - What is the point of the National Party to address the fundamental issues order? contained in the Ministerial statement. I suggest that I am in order in doing that. The normal procedures Ms KIRNER - Some people have been taking have been followed and I find it extraordinary that this issue seriously for the past three years and I the Premier wants to guillotine debate on matters think it is an extraordinarily serious matter. The affecting women. women members on this side of the House, and I assume the women members of the opposition led The SPEAKER - Order! On the point of order, by Mrs Tehan -- the arrangements made between the parties are matters entirely for those parties. They are not Mr Kennett interjected. matters in which the Chair customarily intervenes. I do not intend to intervene in this case and I do not Ms KIRNER - The agreement was that I would uphold the point of order. make the statement at this time. I said I would made it at 8 p.m. straight after the suspension of the Mr KENNETI - There is no question about sitting. The point of order is that I had the agreement where the opposition stands on this issue. I say of the Leader of the Opposition to make the again that there is bipartisan support for this statement. venture. In fact there was bipartisan support when the decision was made to change the tower that was I regard this as a serious issue. It is also a bipartisan to be made available to the women of this State from issue. The statement has been approved by all one tower to the other and the middle tower is -- parties and I regret that the Leader of the Opposition is taking this opportunity of making general political Ms Kimer interjected. comments. Mr KENNETI - The Premier keeps muttering Mr KENNETI (Leader of the Opposition) - Mr that the opposition is making a big mistake. Only Speaker, I suggest that there is no point of order. The earlier today the Premier was accusing people of Premier has outlined what has taken place. Earlier using bullying tactics. We have been given the today I received a fax from her office informing me opportunity of debating something as important as that she wished to make a Ministerial statement and this gathering place for women and we do not asking me whether it was okay. I indicated to the intend to run away from the issue. The Premier can Premier that it was okay, and that is in line with the continue to make threats and claim that we are normal format for the making of Ministerial making a big mistake if she wants to. statements. Mr Jolly interjected. Ms Kimer interjected. Honourable members interjecting. Mr KENNETI - No-one has argued that there is not a bipartisan approach on this issue. The normal Mr KENNETI - This is extraordinary! The rules of debate for Ministerial statements are that the government has introduced a Ministerial statement Leader of the Opposition and the Leader of the on what the coalition considers to be a major issue National Party respond. This statement is about a and the Premier is Criticising the opposition for centre for women; it is about an opportunity for wanting to debate it. Now the honourable member providing a gathering place for women. for Doveton, who has just come back from his dinner, is interjecting. Honourable members interjecting. We must consider what this particular tower will The SPEAKER - Order! I ask the Premier and symbolise for the women of Victoria. The concept of honourable members on both sides of the House to the tower grew out of the government's decision to remain silent so that debate can proceed in an dispose of a building that was put together by the orderly manner. I ask the Leader of the Opposition women of Victoria: the Queen Victoria hospital. The to round off his comments on the point of order. opportunity for women to have a core focal point on that site was put at risk when the Cain government Mc KENNETI -It is the normal custom in this introduced a Bill to sell the site. type of debate to have a speaker from the government, one from the opposition and one from MINISTERIAL STATEMENT

Tuesday, 91une 1992 ASSEMBLY 2037

Women not only outside Parliament but also on all Mr KENNElT - Here we go again. The Premier sides of Parliament joined together to preserve part says, "This is the biggest mistake". I should have of that site for women and women's groups. At least thought that tonight the Premier, who claims to be part of that site has been maintained to be used by so strongly in support of women, might have taken women as a special centre to accommodate a whole this opportunity for once in her Premiership to make range of groups and provide for the needs of those a major statement about women and their security. who, for reasons beyond their own control, are not Instead honourable members have heard the as well off as others in this society. Premier read a one and a half page statement! That is all women are worth to this Premier - one and a Mr David Marriner showed an interest in the site as half pages on one aspect of women's issues! part of his overall plan for the City of Melbourne. His commitment to redevelop tower E was accepted I invite honourable members to consider what some and supported by women in this community and, as of the women in this State may be going through at a result, the tradition of women using the Queen the moment. Let us look at how they may be able to Victoria site will be maintained. use the facility. Unlike the Premier, I am concerned about opportunities for women in our society. I The coalition is delighted that 100 years later the invite honourable members to consider who might development of the tower will provide a special area use the proposed facility. to be set aside for women in this State to call their home. Some home it will be, because it is a A number of women in this State are unemployed. substantial tower, the best of the three on the site. It Since 1981-82 the number of women unemployed will be refurbished at some cost and will become a has risen from 8 per cent of the total number of major focal point for women. The tradition that people unemployed to 12 per cent. The Premier sits women entered into with the one-shilling fund as there smiling! But they are the official figures. As all described by the Premier, which provided resources honourable members will be aware, many women for the site to be developed, will be continued. who have lost their places in the work force today are simply not registering as unemployed because In particular, the tower will provide women from there is no hope of their obtaining jobs. the country and outlying areas with a meeting place in the city. As the Premier and I, along with the I refer to the women employed in the textile, Leader of the National Party and the honourable clothing and footwear industry. Those women may member for Kew, discussed with the women look to the tower, the symbol of what the involved in the centre and Mr Marriner when we government has done for women, and feel despair. met only a couple of weeks ago, a facility will be The government should hang its head in shame. provided for women to use when they come to Over the next 12 months some 30 000 people in the town. Women who do not have access to a flat will textile, clothing and footwear industry will lose their be able to use the facility as a place where they can jobs because of the government's policies. Of those freshen up before they go shopping. The Premier in the industry, 66 per cent are women of whom rolls her eyes into the back of her head. That is what more than 50 per cent are of ethnic origin. They will was said at the time; that is what was decided at the look to the tower as a place of resource, a gathering meeting. place where discussions can be held, and therefore an important network point. The sad thing is that an Ms Kimer interjected. increasing number of women are losing their security, losing their jobs, and losing their pride Mr KENNElT - Here is the double face of the under the policies of this government and, of course, Premier. When the Premier was at the meeting in the Federal Labor government. The government has room K she said, '1 am serious about the project; I done nothing concrete apart from encouraging the feel strongly about it," when talking about the establishment of the facility in the central tower of facility that is to be used by women outside the the fonner Queen Victoria hospital to address the metropolitan area as a rest room to change in, as fundamental concern in the community. well as a place to have meetings, and so on. Isn't it amazing! The coalition mentions it in this House and Another group of women, those of ethnic the Premier tries to make snide remarks about it! background who are ageing, are finding themselves increasingly isolated. I hope the tower will provide Ms Kimer interjected. them with solace and a networking point as well. MINISTERIAL STATEMENT

2038 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992

Ms Kirner - Jesus, we don't need solace! women. The coalition feels strongly about the matter and has identified three or four groups in special Mr KENNETf - The Premier says, ''Jesus, we need. Look at the honourable member for Frankston don't need solace". If the Premier understood the North laughing! It is amazing! I cannot understand plight and fear of ethnic women, particularly those it! who are ageing, she would understand -- One cannot take one's child shopping at Westfield Ms Kirner interjected. Shoppingtown-Doncaster and feel secure. When a man was arrested the other day - I do not know Mr KENNETf - Now honourable members are whether he is guilty - my 13-year-old son said out seeing the true colours of the Premier! of the blue, '1 hope they hang him; it would have been better if the girl had been older, but to take Honourable Members - Hear, hear! such a young child ... ". I do not think any of that is worth chuckling about! Unfortunately, it could be Mr KENNETI - When the coalition expresses anyone's child - the child is a member of this concern about one section of the female community, community! that is, ageing ethnic women who are increasingly isolated because many of them do not have a second The issue raised tonight by the Premier is important language, and expresses the hope that those women but she should have taken the opportunity of may be able to use the tower as a place for solace, for addressing the ramifications of the use of the tower comfort and for networking, what does the Premier for women in our SOCiety. She should have referred say? The answer is, ''Jesus, we don't need solace". If to what Parliamentarians and others can provide for I had said that of women or of men the Premier the group who will use the tower that will provide would have been up and down and I would have greater comfort for them. I make no apology for been pilloried. widening the debate to take into account the focal point of the tower. I do not know history as well as Mr Spyker - You are a disgrace! others may, but I do know what happened when this country went through a major depression that it Mr KENNETI - The Premier has clearly did not come out of until 1914, and I do not believe indicated that her concern is skin deep. that women then felt as insecure as they do today. Women who support their families, who look after Mr Spyker interjected. sick parents and who share the responsibility of looking after their families have anxiety levels tha t The SPEAKER - Order! I ask the Minister for have never been higher. They do not feel secure Transport to exercise self-control and I ask the because they do not know whether they or their honourable member for Warmambool to remain spouses will be able to keep their jobs. If they lose silent, in his customary manner. their jobs they are fearful about whether they will get others and they are fearful about the Mr KENNETI - I know the Premier is finding it employment prospects for their children. a little difficult, but there are people on both sides of the House who have been here a bit longer than I We are not talking about symbolism. This tower is have or as long as I have who have always not just about a meeting place for women to help expressed a genuine concern about the way the them feel better. We are talking about something community might provide security, comfort, and, that is a lot more fundamental; we are talking about importantly, dignity for members of the community. a community in 1992 in which the majority of That concern is expressed as much about women as women live in fear. They live in fear of the economic about men. Unfortunately, in recent times women situation, they live in fear of the social situation, and have been singled out for an unfair level of they fear a whole range of things that have been unemployment in their ranks. The honourable imposed upon them because of the failure of our member for Frankston North may laugh, but I invite society to meet their aspirations. her to consider the textile, clothing and footwear industry where the majority of people who are In the western suburbs, an area that the Premier losing their jobs are women. represents, women rape victims cannot use the only rape crisis centre. Unfortunately, the majority of crimes against individuals in our society are committed against MINISTERIAL STATEMENT

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2039

The SPEAKER - Order! I ask the Leader of the Mr KENNETf - The Premier has decided to Opposition to relate his remarks to the question make a Ministerial statement on the second-last day before the Chair: of the sessional period on a matter that is so crucial and so vital to women that she has addressed one That this House takes note of the Ministerial statement. and a half pages to it!

Currently the Leader of the Opposition appears to Ms Kimer - No. be diverting away from the question to a point that is unacceptable. I ask him to direct his remarks to Mr KENNElT - I am sorry, my copy has only the question before the Chair. one and a half pages. The tower is important at a time when women are being denied -- Mr KENNETf - Unfortunately the incidence of rape of women is growing in our SOCiety. I wonder Ms Kimer - Who will decide what goes on? whether the tower will provide help, counselling services and solace for women who are abused. The Mr KENNElT - We want to ensure that tower represents a symbol of hope, but the way it Parliament pays attention to women, not just by will actually work may be different from the providing a tower as a symbol but also by the fundamental concept of a tower for women. Many Premier indicating how she will stop the erosion of women believe there is a critical lack of child-care jobs for women and how she will provide job places. Will the tower offer assistance to women opportunities for young women. How will she who are seeking places for their children or for those protect women on our streets? who cannot afford the cost of child-care because of the extra costs imposed by the government? There The SPEAKER - Order! I ask the Leader of the are a range of issues such as women's health that are Opposition to return to the question before the being spoken about more openly today than they Chair. I ask the Premier to resist the temptation to were 10 or 20 years ago. That is good not only for interject. women but also for men so that they understand the problems that affect their spouses and their children. Ms Kimer - It is hard! Will the tower offer fundamental health services to women? Mr KENNElT - The tower is more than a structure for women, yet it is the only issue Ms Kimer interjected. concerning women on which the Premier has made a statement to Parliament. As I walk around the city Mr KENNETf - I am sorry, the Premier has said I have met with women who are associated with the that we do not determine it. I should have thought groups who want to use the tower to establish a that when the government is involved in making centre for women. We are more than happy to land and a building available, at some stage it would support that concept, but when I talk to women in have a responsibility. the community - and women talk to me - it becomes apparent that this tower is not foremost in Ms Kimer interjected. their minds. The tower is not a priority. Jobs, security and safety are important to women! Women Mr KENNETf - The Premier is parroting on want to be able to afford to live and to provide for about the fact that women will determine what will their children in a way to which they believe they happen in the centre. We do not argue about that, are entitled in a developed society. but we are trying to raise the symbol of hope -- In the dying days of the government we find Ms Kimer - No, you are not! ourselves in an amazing situation. On Friday, the Premier attended a Ministerial conference on Mr KENNETf - I am not? I did not know the women and expressed concern about certain Premier could read my mind. I say to the Premier: publications on which she called for a national you have come here tOnight on what may be the approach, but she has had a similar opportunity to second last day of this sessional period and you may that of the Premier of Western Australia to deal with come back for the spring sessional period -- this problem because there are already laws in place that she could use, but she has failed to do so. Again Ms Kimer interjected. we see a double standard. MINISTERIAL STATEMENT

2040 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992

The tower will ultimately be refurbished and it will Ms Kimer - Oh dear! stand as a link with history. I hope it will also stand as a beacon of opportunity. Mr KENNEIT - The Premier says, "Oh dear!"

Mr Spyker - You're a joke! Mr Spyker interjected.

Mr KENNElT - Peter says that I am a joke. Mr KENNElT - Here we go again. Standing Does the Minister for Transport realise that if he here and listening to the Premier and the Minister were not losing so much money each week on the for Transport confirms in my mind the way the public transport system every woman in the State government has totally run out of steam. The could be employed? government is now made up of an incredible collection of people who have no policy direction Mr Spyker - You're a joke and a farce! and no way of addressing the issues confronting women - if there had been a policy for the $122 The SPEAKER - Order! I ask the Minister for million that the government wasted on the Transport to remain silent and I ask the Leader of Sandridge development, women would be a lot the Opposition to ignore interjections and to confine better off. his remarks to those directly relevant to the Ministerial statement. Mr Micallef - Where were you?

Mr KENNElT - What will the tower provide Mr KENNEIT - Unfortunately, as you know, for women? We hope it will provide a vibrant focus Mc Speaker, neither you nor I had any control over in the centre of the city and will, therefore, enhance the Sandridge development. Only three people had the opportunity for women, particularly those from control: the Deputy Premier, the Premier and the outlying areas and country and provincial areas who former Minister. Over a period you have feel isolated by distance, to better utilise the city, to consistently concealed the truth -- come to Melbourne and participate in a whole range of events. The SPEAKER - Order! The Chair has done no such thing. I ask the Leader of the Opposition to However, we need to do more than just take a address the Chair and confine his remarks to the building and say to women, as the Premier question before the Chair. obviol,lSly has done,"I have given you a tower"­ that is the one innovation she has introduced for Mr KENNElT - Mc Speaker, of course you have women since she has been Premier. We must once not done anything about it, nor have I. The majority again restore to all women - young and old women of the community, being women, will say, ''} cannot in business, in families and in the professions - an believe that another $122 million of our money has opportunity of understanding and believing that been wasted". Is it any wonder that people live in they live in a society that respects them for what fear when day after day they are confronted by a they are, for their own creativity and individuality government that on one hand says, ''Here is a tower" and that will provide them with employment, with but on the other hands says, '1ust look what we have dignity through work and, fundamentally, with lost", which was tonight represented by Sandridge. security. No tower will do that; unfortunately that Do you ever get the feeling that somewhere along responsibility relates in part to the quality of the the line just a small degree of honesty in terms of society in which we live. your approach on women's issues or management is called for? The quality of the society in which we live today is degrading women because it is not giving them Mr Micallef - You have got it all! security or control over their own lives. Women live in abject fear of what they will be able to provide for Mr KENNEIT - No-one has it all but something themselves and their families. No-one has ever separates some: a degree of honesty. The Ministerial doubted that women are the lifeblood of our statement we are debating tonight is not about community. In view of that this tower is only a drop women's needs or opportunities; it is the Premier's in the large bucket that is necessary for the symbol of a tower to overcome all the neglect of the recognition of the needs of women and past 10 years of Labor government. The Premier fundamentally avoids the tough issues that the says, ''Here is a tower; this tower we give to you to Premier is not prepared to address. make up for your loss of employment, loss of , MINISTERIAL STATEMENT

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2041 respect, loss of security and loss of safety". If, as I of those traditional Labor Party members who has suspect, the tower is restored some time down the never lost his electoral base -- track - I hope in the foreseeable future - there is no doubt that as women continue to suffer an The SPEAKER - Order! In pursuit of the increasing number of them will need it. Women live Premier's request I ask the Leader of the Opposition in despair as a result of the failings of the whether he is prepared to withdraw the remark to government to understand that its primary role is to which the Premier has taken objection? create an environment in which people can live their own lives free of direction and free of interference by Mr KENNElT - What remark am I to the government of the day. withdraw? What remark is offensive?

Mr Simmonds interjected. The SPEAKER - Order! I thought the Premier made it dear; if not, I will ask the Leader of the Mr KENNElT - As a matter of fact, I have not. I Opposition to resume his seat while the Premier was just about to refer to the honourable member for makes it dear. Reservoir. If ever a member has been actively involved in the pursuit of women, the needs of Ms KIRNER (Premier) - TItis has been a serious women, obviously it is the honourable member for debate about women's issues and the Leader of the Reservoir. There are people in this House, and I take Opposition has decided to broaden it into a general the honourable member for Reservoir as being debate on women's issues, which is his prerogative, one-- although I and various women involved in the women's centre debate did not anticipate or expect Ms KIRNER (Premier) -On a point of order, that he would do so. That is not a political statement Mr Speaker, I said earlier in the debate that I take but a statement about women's involvement in the this matter seriously, and I do. women's centre.

Mr Perton interjected. On this matter of issues that are of great importance to women - all the issues raised by the Leader of The SPEAKER - Order! The honourable the Opposition are of importance to women, as is the member for Doncaster! particular issue that the honourable member was just referring to - the Leader of the Opposition Ms KIRNER - Because I take it seriously, and I used the line that the honourable member for know you do too, I think it is inappropriate in a Reservoir had been committed to one of the issues, debate about a women's centre or any other matter which was the pursuit of women. I put it that that about women for the Leader of the Opposition to has one connotation and one connotation only -it lower the debate by using a one-liner about the is not a connotation that women would accept or, I pursuit of women. I object to that comment, and ask suspect, that the honourable member for Reservoir the honourable member to withdraw it. would accept. I believe, therefore, that it is an offensive remark and one that the Leader of the The SPEAKER - Order! The Premier has asked Opposition should withdraw. the Leader of the Opposition to withdraw. Will he do so? Mr KENNElT (Leader of the Opposition) - On the point of order, Mr Speaker -- Mrs Hirsh - It is offensive! Honourable members interjecting. The SPEAKER - Order! The honourable member for Wantirna! The SPEAKER - Order! I warn the honourable member for Wantirna. She is well aware of the Mr KENNElT (Leader of the Opposition) - In provisions of the Standing Orders, and I ask her to the normal pursuit of the debate -- remain silent. I ask the honourable member for Springvale to remain silent to enable the Leader of An honourable member interjected. the Opposition to respond to the request that has been made through the Chair. Mr KENNElT - There is no gutter at all. The honourable member for Reservoir happens to be one Mr KENNElT - In response to the perhaps disorderly interjection of the honourable member for MINISTERIAL STATEMENT

2042 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June ]()92

Reservoir, who asked whether I had finished, my When it won government the Labor Party was comments were inoffensive -- innovative and forward-looking; but with the passing of each year it has become increasingly out Mr Micallef - Not to us. of touch not only with its own membership but with the needs and aspirations of Victorian women. Mr KENNETT - My comments were inoffensive Government policies are no longer relevant to the unless the Premier sets out to try to misconstrue vast majority of women because the government is them, which says more about the Premier than it no longer able to provide the resources to meet their does about me. The point I wanted to make in needs or to give a lead in developing policies. When response to the interjection made by the honourable the honourable member for Reservoir, or two or member for Reservoir is that he is one of those old three other of his colleagues whom I will not name, Labor members who still believes in the sorts of interject they do so to make the point that they are things the Australian Labor Party once claimed to part of what Labor once represented, a political believe in. He has always been -- party which sprang from the trade union movement and which fought for the rights of the working The SPEAKER - Order! The Leader of the class - the rights of both men and women - but Opposition should indicate whether he is prepared which is now a mere shadow of its former self. to withdraw the comments he made. The Premier attempted to misconstrue my Mr KENNETT - I withdraw the words if the comments for no reason other than to try to Premier finds them offensive. I do not find them misrepresent the coalition's response to the offensive, and I find the request to withdraw them a Ministerial statement. It is a sad state of affairs when reflection on a Premier who tried to read into them a a female head of a Labor government no longer feels meaning that was not intended. That can be taken as comfortable about a debate that addresses some of a sign of the direction in which debate in this place is the needs of her constituency - a constituency she heading. It now means that every time the Premier has deserted. In responding to the Premier's makes a statement members of the opposition can Ministerial statement the coalition is addressing interpret them in a certain way and so ask that they many of the issues that affect at least 50 per cent of be withdrawn. the members of her political party, all of whom have been denied the opportunity of expressing their I was attempting to hi~iuight the marked change in views at a State conference because the Premier is the government's attitude to the issue of women. too worried about what might be said. Regardless of which side of the House you sit on, you would have to say that the honourable member The Premier should have made her Ministerial for Reservoir has always kept to his principles. You statement at the beginning of the sessional period - may not like them, but he has never changed. He is or at least halfway through it - just as she should as true a Labor man today as he was when he was have encouraged debate about other important first elected to this place. His respect for and attitude issues such as youth unemployment, the state of our to women has not changed - and my remarks are manufacturing industries and the levels of tariffs, all not tokenistic. The honourable member has of which she has run away from. remained true to the traditions he was brought up with. While he has not changed, the attitudes of The House will remember the Premier's phrase those around him have changed. 'Work, not words". You introduced that phrase to try to differentiate -- Regardless of whether one talks about women's issues, the economy or hOUSing, support for the The SPEAKER - Order! I remind the Leader of Labor government has declined because the the Opposition that he must address the Chair and Victorian community no longer believes that the must not directly address any other member. Labor Party of 1992 is the same Labor Party that was elected to office in 1982. The changes that have Mr KENNETT - It could be said that the occurred in that time are epitomised by tonight's establishment of the women's centre in the eastern debate on the Premier's Ministerial statement about tower represents work - but it is only one tower. the establishment of a women's centre in the central Women make up 52 per cent of our population of 4.5 tower of the Queen Victoria hospital. million, yet they are offered only one tower at time when they are losing their jobs and are increasingly becoming the victims of violent crime. Although the MINISTERIAL STATEMENT

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2043 opposition supports the establishment of the Your giving the call to the Leader of the National women's centre, it stands for more than mere Party was correct, Mr Speaker, and I suggest that the symbolism. After the next election a coalition Leader of the House does not have a point of order. government will do something of value for women-- Mr McNAMARA (Leader of the National Party) -On the point of order, Mr Speaker, I direct Mr Kennedy interjected. to the attention of the House the letter that was sent to me by the Premier advising me of her intention to Mr KENNETf - Just as I am about to finish my make a Ministerial statement. A similar letter was remarks, the honourable member for Bendigo West sent to the Leader of the Opposition. As has been the asks, 'What is that?" Obviously I have been wasting case wi th responses to previous Ministerial my time in trying to explain the issue to him. I statements, the order of reply is rotated in the same should like to see the women of Bendigo once again way as it is at the start of question time. If the able to feel that their families are secure, that they government wishes to use a heavy hand on this and their daughters can find employment and that occasion, in the months to come the coalition will they can walk the streets of Bendigo knowing that remember the precedent that has been set. they are safe. The coalition makes no apologies whatsoever for its policies on women. The women of It is entirely inappropriate to change procedure. I today deserve better than they have received from draw the attention of the Chair to the fact that I had the Labor government. the call and I had commenced my speech. In fact, I was well into it when the Leader of the House, who A coalition government will have the responsibility was obviously dozing at the time, was awakened by of restoring to women everything which they have a my comments. Clearly I had the call; I was right to expect in a modern society but which they proceeding with my remarks, and I think it have been denied by a government that believes appropriate that I continue. only in symbolism - and that is a tower. The SPEAKER - Order! On the point of order, I Mr McNAMARA (Leader of the National do not feel it is necessary for me to hear any further Party) - The coalition is committed to the argument. I am heartened by the fact that after such establishment of the women's centre on the Queen a short contribution the Leader of the National Party Victoria hospital site. Nevertheless it is was well into his speech. Perhaps it is indicative of interesting -- things to come. There is recent precedent for either ruling to be given in these circumstances. I was Mr ROPER (Minister for Employment, under the impression that there was an arrangement Post-Secondary Education and Training) - On a between the parties that party Leaders would speak point of order, Mr Speaker, the Minister for first. I gave the call to the Leader of the National Community Services stood to receive the call at the Party and I shall give him the opporttmity to same time as the Leader of the National Party. Given conclude his remarks. However, I reaffirm that this that the two parties are now in coalition, in the is not necessarily to be taken as a precedent for all normal course of events the Minister for Community such future occasions. Services should have been given the call to respond to the rather strange remarks of the Leader of the Mr McNAMARA - I thank you for your ruling, Opposition. Mr Speaker. As I said, the coalition is committed to making this centre at the Queen Victoria hospital Mr KENNETf (Leader of the Opposition) - On site work. We are talking about creating a centre that the point of order, Mr Speaker, you know as well as will be important to the women of Victoria; it will I do that in a debate on a Ministerial statement - not just be important to women of the metropolitan and the Premier referred to the matter during her area but also it will be greatly appreciated by remarks - the normal procedure is for the Leader of women in regional centres. the Opposition and the Leader of the National Party to follow the Minister. That has been the practice not On this very day that the Premier has made a only for the 10 years of this government but for the Ministerial statement on the proposed women's 10 years before that. centre at the Queen Victoria hospital site, the Reserve Bank of Australia has decided to remove the portrait of Caroline Chisholm from the $5 note. The Ministerial statement at least is something positive MINISTERIAL STATEMENT

2044 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992 following something negative. For decades Caroline the site in jeopardy when it introduced legislation to Chisholm fought for women's rights in this country, sell the site. If that legislation had proceeded in its but her contribution has been substantially original form the site would have been sold and we downgraded by the Reserve Bank's decision. would not be debating the importance of a centre that will be of benefit to future generations of I am disappointed, however, that the Premier Victorian women. The conservative politicians in the decided to make this Ministerial statement at this Legislative Council, at the behest of various hour. I do not know why she did not proceed with women's groups throughout Victoria, acted to the statement following question time, as happens ensure that at least some part of the former hospital with other Ministerial statements. was retained and redeveloped for the use of women. We should be thanking those honourable members. Ms KIRNER (Premier) - On a point of order, However, I have heard nothing from the Premier Mr Speaker, there was a clear agreement between that has acknowledged their work. That should be the government and the Leader of the Opposition­ put on the record. I am sorry it did not include the Leader of the National Party - that the Ministerial statement Mr Gude interjected. would be made at 8 p.m. That is why I did not make the statement after question time. Perhaps this is a Mr McNAMARA - The Premier has been totally point of clarification rather than a point of order. silent, as the honourable member for Hawthorn suggests. Those conservative members of Parliament The SPEAKER - Order! There is no point of ensured that a centre for women should remain at order. that site, and it is this issue with which we are dealing tonight. Mr McNAMARA (Leader of the National Party) - No matter what the reason, I am of the I congratulate Mr David Marriner on his view that it would have been more appropriate to commitment to this project and on successfully bring on the Ministerial statement following negotiating the redevelopment of tower E as a question time as has been the case with other women's centre. It will ensure that the tradition for Ministerial statements. It would have received full women at the hospital site will be maintained. media coverage and gained better attendance by members of the government. It is not unprecedented The Liberal and National parties are delighted that a for government motions to be brought to the House special area will be set aside for women at a site at later hours. All honourable members will recall which, as I said, nearly 100 years ago was set aside that in 1989 when she was the Minister for with the establishment of the one-shilling fund to set Education the Premier brought in the Ministerial up a hospital for women. statement on the Victorian certificate of education at 10 p.m. on the very last day of the sitting. Most importantly, the proposed centre will give country women somewhere to meet in the city. That Regardless of whether this Ministerial statement was is terribly important. They will be able to make use brought in by the Premier later on the Parliamentary of the centre to refresh themselves and meet with day to try to avoid media coverage, it is very friends. I have received representations from disappointing. This is far too important an issue for organisations such as the Country Women's it to be ignored in this fashion. Association wanting the matter to be finalised. I shall comment on Mr Marriner's generosity in this It is worth remembering that it was conservative regard. The central tower, tower E, a prime position members in the Legislative Council who, in 1989, in the proposed redevelopment, is being provided recognised that the Queen Victoria hospital site had for the women's centre, which gives a better floor special significance for the women of Victoria. It was area than what was originally proposed for the as a result of the actions of our conservative centre in tower F.. one of the smaller towers at the colleagues in another place that amendments were side of the building. The change to the central tower made to the legislation dealing with the Queen offers the advantage of a location central to lifts and Victoria hospital site to ensure that a place was other amenities as well as proViding more floor preserved at that site for the women of Victoria. The space. site for a hospital for women grew out of the one-shilling fund appeal that was set up almost 100 At the meeting which was attended by the Premier, years ago. The previous Cain administration placed the Leader of the OppOSition and me, Mr Marriner MINISTERIAL STATEMENT

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2045 was extremely helpful to ensure that the project women have a women's centre or forum at which to came to fruition. The centre will provide a vibrant discuss those issues. We must ensure that the focus for the heart of the city and it will be an important issues receive adequate publicity. Women important centre for the women of Victoria, from a whole wide range of backgrounds and particularly country wOl)len. The women visiting regions will visit the centre. The Premier said: the centre will be able to talk about such problems as increasing unemployment. In country areas more The centre will provide women with information and than 50 per cent of young women do not have jobs. services, give them a place to meet and relax, and offer facilities such as a cafe, a library and a bookshop. The More than 12 per cent of Victorian women are city location ensures that the centre is accessible to unemployed, and the figure for women in country women, and I feel sure that it will become a meeting regiOns is closer to 18 or 19 per cent. Those women place for country and regional women visiting the city. will be able to meet at the Queen Victoria Women's Centre and talk about the future of the textile, That is precisely what I have been saying. Female clothing and footwear industry. If they come from public servants will meet at the centre and ask why country regions such as Wangaratta or only 19 per cent of management positions in the Warmambool, which two of my colleagues Victorian Public Service are occupied by women. represent so well, they will discuss what has That should be a specific issue of concern to the happened over the past 12 months when 11 000 Premier. Women meeting at the centre will ask why women have lost their jobs. Women will be able to she has not done more to help them. It appears that focus on that issue when they visit the Queen now the Premier has got herself up the ladder she Victoria hospital site. has kicked it away. She does not want competition up there! Women who come from distressing situations will visit the centre. Recently there has been an increase Women with children will meet at the centre and ask in the number of violent crimes, particularly against about the additional child-care places needed in women. Women are concerned about the lack of outer areas of Melbourne. As of March 1992 none of government funds provided for policing. Women the 50 000 additional child-care positions pledged by from the western suburbs will meet at the centre to the Federal government before the 1990 election had discuss the problems faced by rape victims who come to fruition. Not one of those 50 000 places had cannot attend rape crisis centres in the western been made available. suburbs because the police and the State government have refused to guarantee the Women meeting at the centre will ask what the attendance of forensic physicians. government has done as a result of the Office of the Public Advocate saying many women in State The SPEAKER - Order! The Leader of the institutions had been abused. That issue was National Party may make passing references to highlighted in the last Parliament but nothing was issues that can be addressed at the centre but he is done. Honourable members know that since then not at liberty to enter into an extensive exposition of women have been abused in one of our major such matters. institutions. The government has not addressed the issue. Mr McNAMARA - Mc Speaker, I was following on the line on which you directed the Leader of the It is important to build on the proposed centre's Opposition. foundation. After the next election it will be the aim of the coalition to restore to women in society, The SPEAKER - Exactly. The Leader of the women in business, women in families, women in Opposition was directed back to the Ministerial professions - all women, young and old - hope, statement. security, opportunity and prosperity for themselves and their families, for they are the lifeblood of Mr McNAMARA - I refer the House to the Victoria. important issues women will discuss when they visit the Queen Victoria Women's Centre. It is only On behalf of the coalition, and particularly the natural that they will talk about their future and the National Party, I strongly support the establishment future of their children. A Significant number of of the Queen Victoria Women's Centre. The site has problems affecting women have occurred through been made available through the actions of the government neglect. It is important that Victorian coalition - not the Labor government, the current MINISTERIAL STATEMENT

2046 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992

Premier or the former Premier, who attempted to In May this year, I convened a meeting attended by the sell the site. The honourable member for Bundoora Attorney-General and Minister for Major Projects, the wanted to flog it off. He wanted to give nothing to Minister for Planning and Housing, the Minister for the women of Victoria, the descendants of those Community Services, the Leaders of the opposition who, through the one-shilling fund, paid for the parties, the shadow Attorney-General, the shadow hospital site. Minister for Health, the shadow Minister for housing and the aged, Mr Marriner, and representatives of the The conservative members of Parliament in the other Queen Victoria Women's Centre Inc. place insisted on inserting a clause in the land Bill to ensure that one of the towers was reserved for I do not understand why the Leader of the Victorian women. Victorians owe a continuing debt Opposition felt he needed to respond so vigorously, of gratitude to coalition members of Parliament in because there was general agreement to use tower E the other place, who ensured that the hospital site rather than tower F for the women's centre. Tower E was protected. is histOrically more Significant than the other towers and that is why the women requested that tower for Mr Gude - The safeguard! the centre. The Premier was instrumental in ensuring that a bipartisan approach was adopted so Mr McNAMARA - As the Deputy Leader of the that the women involved in the centre could have Opposition says, that has been the safeguard. How confidence that the project had the support of all lucky Victoria has been in having a safeguard over parties. the past 10 years against such a reckless Labor administra tion. I was surprised to hear the diatribe from the Leader of the Opposition. Rather than limit his remarks to Mrs SETCHES (Minister for Community the Ministerial statement, he chose to speak about Services) - I thank the previous speaker, the Leader other matters and ended up by saying that the of the National Party, for his contribution. At least project would do little to assist the people of there were some shreds of truth in what he said Victoria. The women's group does not feel that way about the former Queen Victoria hospital site. at all; it feels it will have special significance for the Honourable members may recall that in 1989 when people of Victoria. The Leader of the Opposition debate on the Bill to sell the site occurred, I was said that the tower project is empty symbolism and Minister for Conservation, Forests and Lands and as compared it to the delivery of child-care places, such I was responsible for introducing the measure among other things. I remind the Leader of the under the Land Act to remove the reservation so that Opposition that the government has delivered 22 the Queen Victoria hospital site could be offered for day-care centres, more than 3000 places in sale. out-of-school-hours care and 500 effective full-time child-care places. At that time debates in both Houses were vigorous. The debate in the community was well developed, The coalition keeps asking the question, so it ought with women's organisations advising both the to know that child-care places are being established opposition and the government of their deep in technical and further education centres feelings on the ability of Parliament to protect an throughout Victoria and that the government has area of the site that would recognise the allocated $5 million for additional child-care centres longstanding contribution of health services offered in growth areas. How does that stack up against the to Victorian women on the site. non-policies of the coalition? The New South Wales government has not delivered any child-care places I was a party to the meeting that occurred with that were allocated under the Commonwealth-State women, the Premier, members of the government agreement -- and the female members of the opposition at that time. The agreement that was reached was reported Mr PERTON (Doncaster) - On a point of order, in full to Parliament. As a result a good. deal was Mr Speaker, the Minister for Community Services is entered into to dispose of the Queen Victoria out of order on the question of relevance. The hospital site. Mr Marriner was the person who took Minister is criticising the contribution of the Leader on the redevelopment of the site. of the Opposition, but she is now referring to child-care places in technical and further education I refer the House to the Premier's Ministerial and the New South Wales government's policies on statement where she states: ; MINISTERIAL STATEMENT

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2047 child-care. The Minister's contribution does not The government undertook a campaign stressing relate to the Ministerial statement at all. that violence is ugly and it has done a lot to ensure the safety of women in their own communities. The Ms KIRNER (Premier) - On the point of order, opposition is silent on that. It believes the centre will Mr Speaker, both the Leader of the Opposition and do little to ensure that women feel safe in Victoria. the Leader of the National Party made great play of The coalition knows that when women come child-care places in Victoria, so if the opposition together as a group they are a powerful force to be wants broader issues regarding child-care places reckoned with. In the past women have been locked ruled out of order it should have moved to do so out of the decision-making process. When a earlier when both the Leader of the Opposition and conservative government was in power women did the Leader of the National Party referred to them. not benefit at all; one has only to examine the Those issues were introduced by the coalition and conservative's policies on women to understand that. the Minister is responding to them. In New Zealand the equal pay legislation has been The SPEAKER - Order! I make two points on repealed by Victoria's equivalent of the opposition. the point of order raised by the honourable member Equal opportunity legislation has been repealed and for Doncaster: firstly, it is customary to allow more subsidies for child-care have been taken away, latitude to the spokesman for the respective parties forcing women back into the home. By the cancelling than to other speakers; and, secondly, the Minister of awards New Zealand has effectively moved to for Community Services is responding to matters ensure that the employment of women is destroyed raised during the course of debate. As a consequence and that women can obtain only a certain level of I do not uphold the point of order, but I ask the payment for services. Minister to relate her remarks directly to the Ministerial statement. That is a clear indication of how the Victorian opposition feels about women; it would ensure that Mrs SETCHES (Minister for Community there are no more child-care places in Victoria. The Services) - The Leader of the Opposition said that opposition has not decided what its programs or the project is empty symbolism and compared it policies are on neighbourhood houses or for further with the number of child-care places in Victoria. The education for adult women. There were very few question should be asked: what will the coalition do neighbourhood houses when the opposition was in for those women who are looking for succour or government but today there are 240. The direction from the government? The Leader of the government respects women but the opposition Opposition and the Leader of the National Party disrespects them and is so ashamed of its policies have not said that the introduction of the proposed that it will not publicly state what they are. goods and services tax will mean that all-day care will cost an extra $19.20 a week and that The contribution by the Leader of the Opposition intermediate day care will cost an additional $15 a was gratuitous. All he really said was that he agreed week. They want to restrict women from being part with what the Premier said at a meeting on the of the labour force, because ensuring that women changes that were being undertaken. The stay in the family home is part of the coalition's redevelopment of the tower is an important issue strategy. that the women of Victoria have looked forward to. The decision made by Mr Marriner involves The Leaders of the coalition said that it was goodwill but the Leader of the Opposition and the appropriate for the issue of women's health to be Leader of the National Party have indulged in raised so that men can understand the problems. political grandstanding. Prior to the Labor government coming to power in 1982 only one rape crisis centre existed in Victoria. Mrs WADE (Kew) - I echo the contribution The government has made a concerted effort to made by the Leader of the Opposition when he said ensure that women's health programs and centres that it would have been much better to have had a are available in every health region in the State. The wider debate on issues affecting women because government conducted a review of women's needs here has not been much opportunity to do so. I recall to assist women to understand their birthing one debate on safety issues on which I endeavoured experiences. The opposition says all that is to speak, but I was unable to do so. symbolism and is not worthwhile because women do not feel safe in their own community. An opportunity for coalition members to address important issues affecting women would have been MINISTERIAL STATEMENT

2048 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992 welcomed because women are in a desperate Premier decided to turn it into a party-political issue. situation in Victoria. Many unemployed women are She referred to the history of the Queen Victoria supporting parents with the sole responsibility of tower and the Queen Victoria hospital but probably bringing up children. They are in an unenviable for good reason did not spend much time on it. situation; they need all the help they can get, in particular, they need jobs. Many women have The original women's hospital was a hospital on the unemployed adult children, which is a matter of site that is now occupied by the Peter MacCallum considerable concern. Many of my friends are in that Cancer Institute. It was freehold land owned by situation and I know how much it is worrying them. women who had raised money through the About 15 per cent of Australian children are said to one-shilling fund to buy that land and establish a be living in poverty. hospital. Eventually the site was exchanged and the hospital was transferred from the Peter MacCallum I shall answer a number of matters the Minister for site to the Queen Victoria site. The hospital that was Community Services spoke about in her run first on the Peter MacCallum site and then on contribution. The Minister said that we regarded the the Queen Victoria site was a women's hospital tower as just a symbolic issue. That is not the case: staffed by women. The women of Victoria the opposition sees the tower as an important issue. contributed 66 000 shillings that led to the In fact, the coalition was responsible for obtaining establishment of the first hospital. the tower for the women of Victoria. When the government decided to sell the Queen The Minister also said that the opposition did not Victoria site in 1989 and move that hospital to the support the Violence is Ugly campaign. On a Monash Medical Centre, the women of Victoria felt number of occasions I have said publicly that a lot is that some part of the hospital should remain to to be said for that campaign but that it is not the commemorate the one-shilling fund and the efforts whole answer to providing safety for women. The of those early women. The Queen Victoria Hospital campaign does get across a message that is Action group and a number of women's important in the community. I was intending to refer organisations that supported that group, including to that in my contribution to the Crimes (Family Jewish women's groups, the Country Women's Violence) (Further Amendment) Bill later this Association and a variety of other women's evening. organisations, pointed out to the government that the site of the hospital should be commemorated. The Minister also refered to equal opportunity legislation. The Equal Opportunity Act in Victoria If one reads in Hansard the debate in this place of 23 was the first Act in Australia that provided equal May 1989, it is clear a number of meetings were held opportunity and anti-discrimination legislation for between the government and the Queen Victoria women and it was introduced and passed by a Hospital Action group. Eventually the action group Liberal government. met with representatives of the then Department of Management and Budget, the Major Projects Unit The Minister also referred to neighbourhood houses. and the Women's Policy Coordination Unit. In good They were commenced by a Liberal government. faith they attended that meeting where they were There were not as many then as there are now but told by the government they would get nothing. one must expect that in 10 years there would be a They were asked to give an undertaking not to considerable increase. pursue any legal claims in respect of the Queen Victoria hospital site. It is clear from reading the I turn to the history of the tower. I am disappointed debate in this place on 23 May that the government that this matter should have been turned by the offered no support for the proposal. Premier into a partisan issue and that the Premier should have taken away from the bipartisan support That could have been the end of the saga but the for this project, which it has had since the coalition coalition took the view that there should be a forced the government to listen to the Queen commemoration of the efforts of Victorian women. Victoria Women's Action group and ensure that the Our position was put by the honourable member for tower was provided for the women of Victoria. I had Berwick, who set out the history of the hospital and valued the bipartisan nature of the support for the explained to the government that the coalition tower. Since the signing of the agreement the believed the women had a good case. He concluded government has joined with the coalition in by saying that the issue must be sorted out to the supporting the tower. There was no dispute until the opposition's satisfaction while the Bill was between MINISTERIAL STATEMENT

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2049 here and another place - the phrase that by the head of the Women's Policy Coordination honourable members have heard on so many Unit. I have received all the literature and the occasions - or else the clause relating to the Queen questionnaires sent to women's groups as well as Victoria hospital would be removed or the entire Bill reports on the answers received. The file on this would be opposed. subject in my electorate office would be about 2 feet thick! Therefore, I was surprised when, perhaps in a The Bill was concerned with various parcels of land preview of what has happened tonight, during a and was intended to provide the government with recent question time the Premier shouted out to me resources for its assets sales program, including the that I had no interest in the subject and that the only Queen Victoria hospital site; also, the sale of woman on this side of politics who was interested Willsmere Hospital was supposed to bring quite a was the Honourable Rosemary Varty. That is not the large sum of money to the government - although case. Although Mrs Varty is a supporter, I also have it appears not to have done so. a great interest in this subject, as has the Honourable Marie Tehan, who attended the recent meetings. The Bill was concerned with a large number of other areas of land. The government was told that, if it did I was a little surprised at what the Premier said. I not agree with this proposal, the Bill would not go think she said something like, "This project is forward. The honourable member for Berwick went supported by all women on the government side". I so far as to say that, given that the feminists on the make it clear to the House that the project is government side had obviously not supported the supported not only by the women on this side but Bill in caucus, he would have to take on the mantle also by all coalition members. of a feminist and put the case. As I have said, the honourable member for Berwick The issue then went to the other place. I understand was largely responsible for the tower being made meetings were held between the Leaders of the available to women because he handled the Bill in parties and eventually the government was this place and ensured that the women's centre was prevailed upon and realised that, if it did not agree established. There can be no doubt about the to the establishment of the women's centre, it would support of all male and female honourable members not have its Bill passed. An agreement was recorded on this side. in Hansard at the time the Bill was dealt with in the other place. The Victorian Women's Consultative Council has consulted widely on this issue. A number of possible The only reason the tower was given to the women uses for the tower have been put forward and a of Victoria was that the government understood that general consensus has been reached on some of the the Bill, which at the time was being handled by the uses to which it could be put. Provision will be Minister for Community Services - who no longer made for Health Sharing Women to have a portion appears to be in the House - would not otherwise of the tower; they will move in as soon as it has been have passed through Parliament. refurbished. The tower can also be used to house meeting rooms and women will be able to obtain Following the agreement the proposal received information about various services, including bipartisan support in 1989. I was pleased about that educational opportunities and other important and certainly the opposition did nothing to rock the services, at the tower. boat. Since then several public meetings have been held and the matter was referred to the Victorian One of the major issues raised by country women Women's Consultative Council, which was to has been the provision of a facility in the women's undertake consultations with as many Victorian centre that they can use as a headquarters when in women as were prepared to be involved and to Melbourne for the purpose of accessing various report back to the Premier on the appropriate uses services not available in country Victoria such as for the tower and the way in which it could be medical and legal services, financial counselling and managed. advice about employment opportunities. They have said they would like a place where they could That process has taken a long time. Meetings were deposit luggage and change their clothes upon widely advertised and were held throughout arrival in Melbourne and could perhaps have their Victoria. They were attended by women who put children cared for while attending appointments. It forward a variety of proposals. I have taken much is not proposed that an ordinary child-care centre be interest in this process. I have been regularly briefed established there, but a number of women have said MINISTERIAL STATEMENT

2050 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992 that such a short-term facility would be useful for other family members who are also unemployed. country women who travel to Melbourne for Many are suffering considerable depression and medical appointments and who have no-one at stress and any service that assists them is welcome. home to mind their young children. 'This matter was The services the women of Victoria have suggested raised with the action group at the meeting when it and which have been accepted by the Queen was agreed that tower E was more appropriate than Victoria Hospital Action group might go some way tower F. General agreement was reached by the to sorting out their problems. It is not something that large number of representatives of the government is within the capacity of a women's centre but it may and the coalition at that meeting. go some way to assist them.

There is much to be said in favour of the middle The government has not done too well even in the tower. It is in better condition than the others; and public sector. I have been looking at an evaluation of Mr Marriner informed the meeting that it would cost the government's Women in Action plan and I only half as much to refurbish tower E as to notice that it boasted that four women had been refurbish tower F. At the time the proposal received appointed to the position of chief administrator in bipartisan support. the period under consideration. Those four women were named as: Elizabeth Proust, who has now The Leader of the National Party was concerned to gone; Ann Morrow, who has now gone; Patricia ensure that a place where country women could rest Faulkner, who is still there but should be and be refreshed, and could perhaps have children considering her position; and Katie Lahey, who I minded, would be made available. He was assured notice in the Government Gazette has been by the Queen Victoria Hospital Action group downgraded by Order in Council. She was representatives that such a facility would be appointed to the position of chairman and now provided at the centre. suddenly finds herself in a chief executive position. It does not appear that the high-flying women of SES The Leader of the Opposition raised a number of level are doing too well under this government. issues that were perhaps not directly related to the Certainly that report also said that the proportion of tower and the women's centre. He suggested that women in management within the Victorian work the tower would provide some solace for women. force as a whole is rather better than the pOSition in He was rubbished by the Premier and the the public sector. honourable member for Wantirna. Women have much to be concerned about. The Mr Spyker interjected. Leader of the Opposition and the Leader of the National Party referred to the position of women in Mrs WADE - I take up the interjection by the the textile, clothing and footwear area where at least Minister for Transport who says that one should not 11 000 jobs have already been lost with the use the world "solace" in relation to women. While likelihood of tens of thousands more jobs being lost. interjections were being made it occurred to me that New government initiatives are desperately needed perhaps government members do not understand but not much is being offered to women. the desperate situation women are in. Something that would really assist them would be to meet with The Prime Minister's One Nation statement was a other women and discuss their problems and male statement. In April he suddenly discovered the perhaps get advice from women who are suffering women's vote and he was forced to confess - I from similar disadvantages. believe it was at a breakfast - that he had not previously thought of himself as being concerned Under this government full-time wages for women with the women's vote but that he had had a sudden have continued to remain at approximately 80 per change of mind, presumably after speaking to some cent of wages for men. The unemployment situation of his minders. He said he now saw some sense in for women is desperate. Since the Premier came to having women in the work force, something he had office the number of women in employment in not appreciated in the past. He certainly did not Victoria has dropped by 47 100 and the number of appreciate it when he brought in his One Nation unemployed women in Victoria has increased by statement. 47 BOO. The unemployment rate for women during the time the Premier has been in office has increased The One Nation statement is about infrastructure from 6.9 per cent to 12 per cent. Many of those and about jobs in the infrastructure area. If any of women are in desperate situations and many have those jobs eventuate, and I am not sure that they MINISTERIAL STATEMENT

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2051 will, they will be only for men; there will be no jobs crime. Without doubt women in every age group are for women. I contrast that with the Fightback concerned about the increase in crime. Whatever we package which will provide jobs right across -- might think of the statistics produced, everybody I meet has been or knows someone who has been a Ms Kirner interjected. victim of crime. I am talking about serious crime such as assault, rape and armed robbery. Mrs WADE - Mr Speaker, the Premier has asked me how the Fightback package will help women. Women are frightened to go out of their homes at night. They drive around the city with their car The SPEAKER -Order! I suggest that the doors locked and are frightened that their cars might honourable member ignore interjections and I ask break down. Older people at home, both men and the Premier not to interject. I ask the honourable women, keep their doors locked and are frightened member for Kew to confine her remarks to the to answer a knock at the door. The government's matters directly raised in the Ministerial statement. answer to this has been to publish literature. I am not sure how available that literature is to other Mrs WADE - I am overcome by your ruling, members of Parliament but my electorate office has Mr Speaker. I had been hoping that the Premier received only one copy. Perhaps it is distributed would ask me how the Fightback package would more widely in government members' electorates. advantage women, and I can now provide her with Some of the literature is useful and contains hints to a list of approximately 20 initiatives in the Fightback people on how better to protect themselves. That package that will assist women. I shall not take up literature could be made available to the women's your time with them, Mr Speaker, but I contrast centre so that people are able to inform themselves. them with the One Nation statement. However, that is not enough, and it is not enough to tell people they are safe when we know they are not. Mr Norris interjected. It is useful for people to be given information so that they can discuss how they might protect themselves. Mrs WADE - Tax cuts, more jobs, increased I am not suggesting that the women's centre will child-care support. provide a solution to all the problems that exist; of course it will not. As I said, the debate should have The SPEAKER - Order! The honourable been much wider and it should have included member for Dandenong is out of order and out of consideration of the creation of an environment in his place. He is well aware of rulings from the Chair. which jobs could be provided, particularly for women. The women's centre will give some Mrs WADE - Those initiatives also include assistance to women. I have no problem with the savings on petrol and improved superannuation word "solace"; I think women can provide that for benefits, especially for women who drop out of the each other when they get together, just by discussing work force. However, I shall not pursue that further problems. at this stage. As the Minister for Community Services said, when Women are suffering from considerable stress and women get together they can find solutions to that is affecting their health. Good work being is problems. Women are practical because they have to done by Health Sharing Women, which assists be. They have to roll up their sleeves and get on with women by putting out some publications that are various domestic crises that confront them. As a useful in ensuring that the medical profession is general rule men are more inclined to indulge in aware of women's concerns and is not stuck in a theories before they get to the stage of rolling up frame of mind where it tends not to appreciate that their sleeves. In fact, it might be said that men often medical problems affecting women are not do not get to the stage of rolling up their sleeves necessarily the same as problems affecting men. unless they have good women behind them to give them a good push! The Leader of the Opposition also spoke about the problems of women and safety. That is a major issue By getting together women will be able to help each that is raised when I visit women's groups. The first other and find practical solutions to some of the issue raised with me is invariably about jobs, problems that can be tackled at that level. regardless of whether it is about jobs for the women or for members of their families. The second issue raised with me is safety and its relationship with ROAD SAFETY (LICENCE CANCELLATION) BILL

2052 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992

I was invited by the Minister for Community also to first offenders who have high blood alcohol Services to release the coalition's policy on women. I readings. do not have time to do so -- For many years the legislation has provided that a Mrs Hirsh interjected. driver must lose his or her licence on conviction for a drink-driving offence. The legislation has also The SPEAKER - Order! The honourable declared that the power of the courts to release the member for Wantirna has been warned already. offender on a bond without recording a conviction cannot be exercised in cases where the driver has Mrs WADE - The coalition's policy will been found guilty and the reading is above .10 for a concentrate on creating jobs; it will concentrate on first offence or .05 for a subsequent offence. minimising the difficulties faced by women in combining paid work with family responsibilities; it The Parliamentary Social Development Committee will concentrate on creating flexible working hours carried out an extensive examination of these and access to part-time work; and it will concentrate provisions in 1988 and its recommendations for on job sharing and permanent part-time work with amendments to the legislation were subsequently appropriate conditions. included in the Road Safety Act.

The coalition is concerned about the issues facing The Social Development Committee initiatives also women as carers of families. The coalition is require that drivers who have lost their licences as a concerned to provide services that are not just what result of high readings or subsequent offences the government thinks are necessary from time to should not have licence restoration orders made in time but services that women actually want. their favour unless they produce to the court two reports about their usage of alcohol. The reports Prior to the election the coalition will produce a must be obtained from a reputable agency women's policy that will be attractive to the women accredited by Health Department Victoria. One of Victoria. It will not be just words; it will be about report must be at least 12 months old and the other action. not more than 28 days old when licence restoration is sought. Debate adjourned on motion of Mrs RAY (Box Hill). With that background, it was a matter of considerable concern and disappointment to the Debated adjourned until next day. government to find shortly after the new Sentencing Act 1991 came into force last month that a magistrate ROAD SAFETY (LICENCE thought it proper to circumvent the requirements by CANCELLATION) BILL deciding not to record a conviction in the case of a solicitor who pleaded guilty to an offence involving Second reading a blood alcohol reading of .12 per cent, that is, more than twice the legal limit. Mr SPYKER (Minister for Transport) - I move: The Sentencing Act 1991 contains sentencing lhat this Bill be now read a second time. guidelines for the courts which, among other things, require the courts to have regard to: the maximum The main purpose of the Bill is to ensure that a court penalty; current sentencing practices; the nature and must cancel a driver's licence if the driver is found gravity of the offence; and the offender's culpability guilty of a drink-driving offence involving a high and degree of responsibility for the offence. blood alcohol reading or if the driver has previously been found guilty of a serious drink-driving offence. The police are therefore appealing against the decision. However, the government considers that Honourable members will be aware of the ongoing the matter is of such importance that the legislation efforts by Parliament to ensure that the laws of this should be amended immediately to give the courts State express the community's concern about the explicit directions in such cases. evils of drink-driving. Those efforts have been directed particularly at drivers who have prior Already another magistrate has chosen not to drink-driving offences - repeat offenders - and impose a licence cancellation, this time where a repeat drink driver had a reading of .14 per cent. If ROAD SAFETY (LICENCE CANCELLATION) BILL

Tuesday. 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2053 legislative action is not taken, it is likely that there The old Penalties and Sentences Act provided that will be many more cases contested in the hope of a persons found guilty of an offence need not similar result, with serious implications for the court necessarily have a conviction recorded against them system. and could serve a community service order, enter into a bond, be fined or have other such action taken The Bill has the effect that if a court finds a person against them. 'That was being used by magistrates guilty of a drink-driving offence, but exercises its who would not convict drivers facing drink-driving discretion under the Sentencing Act in such a way as charges if extenuating circumstances applied but to not record a conviction, the court must still apply who would nevertheless find them guilty and put the mandatory licence cancellation requirements of them on some sort of a bond. the Road Safety Act. This also means that when the person reapplies for a licence the provisions about Parliament subsequently passed section 78 of the assessment reports and drink-driving education Road Safety Act, which abrogated Part 9 of the then courses must be satisfied. This will ensure that the Penalties and Sentences Act so that magistrates did directions set by Parliament following the Social not have that discretion in cases where a person Development Committee's report into drink-drivers charged with a first offence had a blood alcohol apprehended with high blood alcohol levels will reading of more than .1 per cent or more than .05 per continue to be followed. cent for subsequent offences. Last year Parliament enacted the Sentencing Act, which repealed the I commend the Bill to the House. Penalties and Sentences Act 1985 and amended the Road Safety Act 1986 to maintain the provisions in Mr COOPER (Momington) - The opposition section 78. Section 7 of the Sentencing Act states: supports the legislation, which is designed to plug a hole in the Road Safety Act 1987 following recent If a court finds a person guilty of an offence, it may, rulings of the Magistrates Court on matters relating subject to any specific provision relating to the offence to drink-driving offences. There is no doubt in the and subject to this Part - mind of any honourable member that Parliament made it clear that it wanted convicted drink-drivers ... with or without recording a conviction, order the taken off our roads. offender to pay a fine -

No reasonable person who has read speeches or take some other action. relating to legislation dealt with by this House, certainly in recent years, would have any doubt that The result has been that in recent cases before the Parliament has sought to remove the discretion of Magistrates Courts magistrates held that section 7 of magistrates on such matters. However, as the the Sentencing Act is superior to and overrules Minister said in his second-reading speech, section 78 of the Road Safety Act. In both cases the loopholes have now been found. I suppose that even magistrates did not proceed to record convictions. after passing this Bill to close a loophole that has Although in each case the magistrate concerned emerged down the line some smart-alec lawyer will found the defendant guilty of an offence, the offence find another way around the intention of Parliament was not recorded as an offence and thus the and will be able to persuade magistrates or judges to provision for mandatory licence cancellation did not release people convicted of drink-driving back onto prevail. the roads. I turn to the two cases in question and in considering One hopes that will not occur but we must face the them rely on the newspaper reports of them. In the reality that lawyers are employed to try to find those first case a driver was found guilty of driving with a loopholes on behalf of their clients and quite often blood alcohol reading of .14, and despite the fact that do. One can only hope that when they do they are it was his third offence he walked away with his able to sleep at night knowing that they have acted licence. The case was reported in the Herald-Sun of to release back onto the roads persons who have 8 May 1992 under the heading ''Loophole lets .14 probably had previous convictions for dnmken drink-driver hold licence". The article says in part: driving and who may re-offend, and in the act of re-offending possibly kill innocent bystanders or A tow-truck driver with three convictions for drivers. drink-driving walked from court yesterday with his licence intact. CLASSIFICATION OF FILMS AND PUBLICATIONS (AMENDMENT) BILL (No. 2)

2054 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992

The 47-year old driver blew .14 - almost three times you drink, then drive, you're a bloody idiot" have the legal limit - after he was pulled over by police in met with widespread approval. I am appalled that Alexandra in April last year. the loophole exists, but I commend the government for expeditiously introducing a Bill to remove it. I The man kept his licence by taking advantage of a hope the Bill will achieve its aim and that no more loophole in the new Sentencing Act - exposed by the loopholes will be discovered by smart-alec barristers Herald-Sun last week - which allows drink-drivers to and solicitors because such actions are at odds with be fined without conviction and retain their licences. the spirit of the legislation and the requirements of Parliament, both of which are supported by most The court was told the driver had two convictions for Victorians. refusing a preliminary breath test and one conviction for driving under the influence dating back to the early I commend the Bill to the House and trust it has a '70s. speedy passage.

The magistrate fined him $300 after he pleaded guilty Mr SPYKER (Minister for Transport) - I thank to exceeding .05. the honourable member for Momington for his cooperation in ensuring that the amendment to the Sergeant Robert Taylor of the prosecutions division Road Safety Act is proclaimed as soon as possible. said yesterday the result of the Mansfield case was Parliament has a responsibility to ensure that the exactly what police had feared could happen under the legislation it passes is sound, and when people try to loophole. use a loophole in an Act to evade their responsibilities the community has a right to be '1t was theoretically possible for repeat drink-drivers to angry. keep their licences - and now it's happened", he said. I thank the honourable member for MOmington for The second case concerned a solicitor who, allowing the Bill a speedy passage. The Bill will according to an article in the Herald-Sun of 1 May reinforce the aim of the Road Safety Act, which is to this year, recorded a blood alcohol reading of .12. make our roads safer for all Victorians. The article states: Motion agreed to. The 28-year old solicitor pleaded guilty in the night session of the Prahran Magistrate's Court on ... a charge Read second time. of exceeding .05. The court heard he was detected after being involved in a collision with a tram in Domain Passed remaining stages. Road, South Yarra, on 24 April last year. CLASSIFICATION OF FILMS AND The solicitor, who had no prior convictions, was not PUBLICATIONS (AMENDMENT) BILL charged only with exceeding .05. (No. 2)

Magistrate Mc Phillip Goldberg fined him $400 but did Second reading not convict him. Mr ROPER (Minister for Employment, In other words, he did 'not lose his licence. The Bill Post-Secondary Education and Training)-On amends the Road Safety Act by requiring the behalf of the Attorney-General, I move: mandatory cancellation of a licence when a person is found guilty of a drink-driving offence even though That this Bill be now read a second time. a conviction is not recorded. Section 50 of the Road Safety Act presently states that "on conviction for an BACKGROUND offence" a licence is cancelled. TItis Bill provides that "on convicting a person, or finding a person guilty of The purpose of the Bill before the House is to amend an offence" a licence is cancelled. the Classification of Films and Publications Act 1990 to prohibit the possession of photographs and films I have no doubt that the Bill will receive the which depict a child engaged in a sexual act. unanimous support not only of Parliament but also of the general community. The Transport Accident The Child Exploitation Unit of the Victoria Police Commission advertisements that carry the slogan '1f and the Spectrum task force, which was established CLASSIFICATION OF FILMS AND PUBLICATIONS (AMENDMENT) BILL (No. 2)

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2055 to investigate the disappearance of Karmein Chan, appeared to be. It is also a defence to prove that the have established a strong connection between child possessor of the photograph was not more than two pornography and child sex crime perpetrators. years older than the subject or was married to the Many of these videos, films and photographs are not subject. This parallels the defences under section 48 produced in Victoria. Often their origins are obscure, of the Crimes Act relating to the sexual penetration making control of their production and distribution of persons between the ages of 10 and 15 years. It difficult, if not impossible. The existing law does not would be illogical to provide a defence to the sexual adequately address this problem. penetration of a 14-year-old by a 15-year-old while making the possession by the 15-year old of a film of The Classification of Films and Publications Act that sexual activity a criminal offence. makes it an offence to possess "objectionable films and publications for the purpose of sale, hire, A third defence relates to material which possesses publication, distribution or exhibition". It also artistic merit. It is not the intention of the legislation contains the graver offence of procuring a child for to create an offence for possessing a copy of a movie the making of an objectionable film or publication. such as Lolita, or Taxi Driver or a documentary about child prostitution or child abuse. The defence also The Bill extends those provisions by providing that extends to material which possesses a bona fide possession of films, videos or photographs of medical, legal, educational or scientific character. children engaged in sexual acts or sexual poses will These defences are consistent with the purposes of be an offence. this Bill - the prevention of child sexual abuse.

There are three main reasons for this prohibition. PENALTIES First, the Child Exploitation Unit of the Victoria Police advise that photographs or films of children Possession of pornography alone is not, of course, as engaged in sexual activity are often used to confuse serious an offence as possessing that material for the the child and lower his or her inhibitions. Secondly, purpose of selling, publishing, displaying or a record of that child's involvement in sexual exhibiting, depositing in a public place, copying or activity may then be used to blackmail the child into distributing it. The penalty for these offences is silence. Thirdly, the production of child $24 000 or two years imprisonment. In the case of pornography involves child sexual abuse and procuring a child for the purpose of making an exploitation. objectionable film or publication, the penalty is $60 000 or five years or both. The maximum penalty Production for commercial purposes obviously provided for this offence is 12 months imprisonment requires a market. Currently, the law prohibits only or $12 000. This is consistent with the penalties the importation, production, sale, exhibition and provided for related offences. hire of child pornography and the procuring of a child for objectionable films and publications. This This Bill is evidence of this government's Bill attaches sanctions to the consumer, upon whom commitment to the elimination of child abuse and the instigators in this chain of child exploitation are exploitation and the reduction of crime in this State. dependent for their profit. I commend the Bill to the House. The Bill creates a new offence of knowingly possessing a film or photograph of a child who is Mrs WADE (Kew) - The Classification of Films under 16 years, or apparently under 16 years of age, and Publications (Amendment) Bill (No. 2) creates engaged in sexual activity or posing in a sexual the new offence of possession of child pornography. manner. The new offence is set out in proposed section 60A of the principal Act, which provides that: It is not the intention of the government to prohibit (1) A person must not knowingly possess a film or the possession of films or photographs of children photograph of a child who is, or apparently is, who are merely naked, such as may be found in under the age of 16 years and who is engaging in many family photograph albums. sexual activity or is depicted in an indecent sexual manner. DEFENCES The provision was amended in the other place at the Under the new provisions, it is a defence to prove suggestion of the coalition. There are a number of that the child was 16 years or over, or reasonably statutory defences to a charge under the proposed CLASSIFICATION OF FILMS AND PUBLICATIONS (AMENDMENT) BILL (No. 2)

2056 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992 section. It is a defence if, at the time of the alleged ... whether possession alone should also be a criminal offence, the film or publication was classified; the offence ... film or photograph possesses artistic merit or is for a genuine medical, legal, scientific or educational ... similar censorship laws in the past have achieved purpose; the defendant believed on reasonable nothing. There is no reason to expect that this one will grounds the child was aged 16 years or older, or if he work any better. or she was married to the child; or at the time of the alleged offence the defendant was not more than Near the end of his article Mr Merkel says: two years older than the child was or appeared to be. If the ban is to be persisted in, the conduct should not I understand the Attorney-General was considering be criminalised. It need result in no more than other amendments to that provision. It is a difficult confiscation. Provision may be made for repeat provision to frame and I have some sympathy for offenders to receive counselling or psychological help. Parliamentary Counsel who was given the task. It is important to cover the area the Bill intends to cover The latter comment reveals that even someone who but not to include within the offence people who is not in favour of the legislation believes some unknowingly possess child pornography or who action may be required. The Law Institute of Victoria possess child pornography for medical or legal refers to the Bill in comments it made to the purposes. It is also a defence to a charge under the coalition. It indicates that it has some apprehensions section for any member or officer of a law but acknowledges that: enforcement agency to have a film or photograph in his or her possession in the exercise or performance These reservations must be balanced with the of a power, function or duty conferred or imposed community interests sought to be protected by these on him or her by or under this or any other Act or at proposals. common law. Organisations that normally strongly defend The coalition considered the Bill with care. freedom of speech believe there is a need for some Government action that limits an individual's control of child pornography. freedom of choice must be treated seriously. Proposals outlawing the sale, publication or The Bill has the support of all parties and that is posseSSion of material, even pornographic material, because one factor distinguishes child pornography should be subject to intense scrutiny. They normally from other pornography - it involves the sexual raise a number of issues such as freedom of choice, exploitation of children. The making of films or moral values, the role of the State in detennining photographs over a period involves ongoing harm to moral issues or what people read, the relationship the children involved. For a person to possess films, between sex and violence and pornography, the photographs or videos depicting children in sexual desirability of censorship, and the degradation of situations involves children taking part in sexual women. acts or being depicted in sexually indecent poses. The making of videos of child pornography involves Normally this type of legislation divides people into children taking part in sexual acts with adults, other two camps: those against anything that limits children or even animals, as was depicted in the freedom of choice and those who feel that any police video that honourable members viewed. In advantages of access to this material is outweighed any case children must be induced to be by the disadvantages. Concern was expressed by the photographed or filmed and to take part in those Victorian Council of Civil Uberties and an article acts. written by the president, Mr Ron Merkel, QC, outlines that the council is, on balance, against the I do not believe there is any scientific proof of the legislation. Mr Merkel states: longstanding harm that may be done to children involved in those sexual acts. The community does No-one suggests that the intractable problem of sexual not want to experiment on children to determine exploitation or child abuse will be solved by the ban. what harm is caused, but forhlllately the legislation is not dependent on scientific proof. Commonsense Mr Merkel states that although the acts depicted in tells us there is harm. this type of material are criminal acts the problem is: A number of studies on child pornography have been undertaken overseas. I refer in particular to an CLASSIFICATION OF FILMS AND PUBLICATIONS (AMENDMENT) BILL (No. 2)

Tuesday. 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2057

Attorney-General's report on pornography in the ... that photographs and films of children in sexual United States of America, referred to as the Meese activity are often used to confuse the child and lower Commission report. It describes the activity of his or her inhibitions. creating the photographs and films and the actions of child exploitation. It found that the issues of The Meese report states: sexual abuse of children and of child pornography are inextricably mixed. Page 406 of the report states: There is substantial evidence that photographs of children engaged in sexual activity are used as tools for Child pornography necessarily includes the sexual further molestation of other children. Children are abuse of a real child, and there can be no shown pictures of other children engaged in sexual understanding of the special problem of child activity, with the aim of persuading especially a quite pornography until there is understanding of the special young child that if it is in a picture, and if other way in which child pornography is child abuse. children are doing it, then it must be all right for this child to do it. It also says: The reports highlight the need for the creation of this ... child abusers will frequently take photographs of new offence . children in sexual poses or engaged in sexual activity, without having any desire to make commercial use of The second-reading speech read on behalf of the these photographs. At times the child abuser will Attorney-General identified the existence of a record merely keep the photograph as a memento, or as a way of child involvement in sexual activity as a tool of of recreating for himself the past experience. blackmail towards that child in the future. That is Frequently, however, the photograph will be given to very serious, but it does not need to come to another child abuser, and there is substantial evidence blackmail for that child to be adversely affected by that a great deal of "trading" of pictures takes place in the fact that he or she has taken part in a sexual this manner. activity which has been recorded on film or still photograph. Those photos or films may follow a The desire to have collections of a large number of child throughout not only his or her childhood but photographs of children seems to be a common, also his or her adult life. Even if the child does not although not universal, characteristic of many know what has happened, or there is no further paedophiles. Some of this exchange of photographs contact, the child or the young adult will be aware of takes place in person, a great deal takes place through the films and photographs and will not know when the mail, and recently a significant amount of exchange they will appear again. The existence of such a film has taken place by the use of computer networks or photograph can create a continuing fear that it through which users of child pornography let each may surface later and that the secret activity may other know about materials they desire or have become known. In many cases it may be worse to available. suffer that over many years than for the matter to actually surface and be exposed. The existence of There are other reports along similar lines. I shall not child pornography involves the deprivation of the read extracts from all those reports but I draw to the dignity and privacy of the victim. attention of honourable members the report of the National Center for Missing and Exploited Children, The involvement of children in the production of an American report that was produced in child pornography cannot be regarded as cooperation with the United States Federal Bureau consensual. The harm is of such magnitude that of Investigation. It makes similar findings to those in there is strong support from all parties in this place the Meese report. Those findings are consistent with for this legislation. reports from the Child Exploitation Unit in Victoria. The extracts I have read from the Meese report are Another reason put by the Attorney-General for supported by the experiences of the officers in the amending the principal Act to make possession of Child ExplOitation Unit. child pornography illegal is that the possession of that pornography in large quantities, particularly by I shall refer to one additional aspect that was paedophiles, will create a market in child referred to in the second-reading speech: pornography. This new offence may very well decrease the incentive for people to have the material; consequently, there could be a decrease in the demand for it. The Meese report reached a CLASSIFICATION OF FILMS AND PUBLICATIONS (AMENDMENT) BILL (No. 2)

2058 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992 similar conclusion and the Victoria Police Spectrum photographs of family members might well take ou t Task Force puts forward that aspect as one of the of the Bill an area which should be covered. justifications for legislation. Another issue was the presence of photographs, The coalition was asked to consider whether the films or videos found in a house being known to one existing offences relating to the selling or displaying member of the household and not known to other of pornography were sufficient. It appears from members of the household. Again we did not want those reports and from the experience of the Child the situation to arise where family members who Exploitation Unit of the Victoria Police that the were unaware of the material could be charged with material is not necessarily kept for commercial gain. an offence. That is adequately covered by the word However, if it is kept for that purpose it is very "knowingly" in proposed section 6OA(l). It is more difficult to catch people in the act of selling the difficult to successfully prosecute people with the material. People engaged in selling this material offence with that word included, but it is a necessary meet with each other; they are careful to exclude safeguard to protect innocent family members. those who are not like themselves, and the only way their activities can be discovered is through a We raised with officers of the Attorney-General's member of the Police Force posing as a paedophile Department whether the provision about law and gaining acceptance. That can happen - I think enforcement officers should be broadened to include it has happened in the past - but it is a very people other than law enforcement agencies who difficult and lengthy process. might come into possession of child pornography in the exercise or performance of their powers, The legislation will enable action to be taken when a functions or duties. A number of people could person is found in possession of child obtain child pornography in that way. For instance, I pornography - particularly where a person has a suggested to officers of the Attorney-General's large collection of the pornography, making it Department that they may have material sent to obvious that the material is for sale - but where them by a concerned citizen. They may receive a otherwise it is impossible to obtain evidence of a sale. parcel in their offices and they may take it to show the Attorney-General. At that stage the We must not encourage the extension of the sale of Attorney-General would be in breach of the pornography into computer networking and other provision. ways of increasing commercial activity in this area, as has happened in the United States of America. I do not know, Mr Deputy Speaker, whether people have brought pornography into your electorate Although members of the coalition were most office but they have certainly brought it into my concerned about the posseSSion of child electorate office. At one stage a pornographic video pornography based, as it is, on sexual exploitation of was available to be shown to members of children, we had some concern about the Parliament. The material in that film was absolutely enforcement of the proVisions of the Bill. We did not horrific. I do not know that members of Parliament wish to find that it covered family snapshots, could be said to have been in possession of the video perhaps of naked children in the back yard but certainly the Parliamentary Library was, and if swimming pool or at the beach. We did not want the provisions in the Bill were enforced the library family photograph albums to come within the officers would have been guilty of an offence. provisions of the Bill. Therefore, we examined the legislation closely and we are satisfied that, so far as An officer of the Attorney-General's Department to is possible in drafting a difficult piece of legislation, whom I spoke about this matter said that if that situation is not caught up in the provisions. pornographic material came into one's possession it would be best to quickly pass it on to the police. I A suggestion was put to us that the Bill should not pointed out that in the process of taking it to the cover photographs, films or videos of children police, from the time one received it, one would be related to the person possessing such items. Of committing an offence. It could be that if one ran course there are no real stereotypes in this area. It is into an unsympathetic policeman at the local police not necessarily the dirty old man in the dirty old station when one was handing over the tape or raincoat who creates child pornography; it is often a photo one could be charged with possessing the respected family member who is responsible for material. creating that sort of material. To exclude CLASSIFICATION OF FILMS AND PUBLICATIONS (AMENDMENT) BILL (No. 2)

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2059

I had hoped the Attomey-General would move an milk bars that is widely available to children. It was amendment to clarify the situation. My considered that the classification system needed to understanding is that he did not want to do so be tidied up to ensure that such material would no because he felt that he would be putting forward an longer be available to children. I refer to magazines amendment that would protect him. In the interests and other publications that contain material that of his own staff and perhaps officers of Community could be described as "soft pomography" and are Services Victoria, the Attomey-General should be readily available to children. The Classification of brave enough to put forward an amendment so that Films and Publications (Amendment) Bill, which people coming into possession of this material in the was introduced by the coalition and passed by the course of carrying out their functions or duties are Legislative Council, does not have the support of the not inadvertently guilty of an offence. Following a govemrnent and the govemrnent is refusing to bring change of government we will be considering a it forward for debate in this place. change in this area. The amendment that was drafted by the coalition to The other proposal I should mention is contained in try to bring Victoria into line with the national proposed section 60A(3) and relates to artistic merit. scheme has been described by the govemrnent as Proposed section 60A(3) was not included in the being too wide. It is the coalition's intention that original Classification of Films and Publications certain material should go through the classification (Amendment) Bill. It provides that: process. The govemrnent considers such an exercise would be too expensive. We are willing to consider the defence of artistic merit cannot be relied on in a case other amendments to deal with this particular where the prosecution proves that the child was problem. We would like it to be dealt with on a actually under the age of 16 years. bipartisan basis, just as we have dealt with this Bill on a bipartisan basis. The coalition was disturbed that without the proposed subsection it could be said that Parliament We had considered holding up this Bill until this was indicating that it is all right to have child issue was dealt with, but we realised that it was not pomography so long as it has artistic merit. It was in the best interest of children that we should do appreciated that that was not the intention of the that, but we do ask the Attomey-General to consider Attomey-General and that he was trying to protect this matter during the Parliamentary recess. If he people who might have copies of films such as Taxi were prepared to suggest additional provisions Driver or Lolita. Originally I thought that such films which would make the examination of material less might be covered by the classification defence but if expensive and which excluded from the it were an old film acquired prior to the classification process other material that we are not classification system being put in place there might concemed about, we would be willing to consider not be enough protection. Fortunately the such amendments. honourable member for Balwyn suggested the provision contained in proposed section 6OA(3). Finally, I raise the adequacy of the penalties contained in the Bill. The maximum penalty A bipartisan attitude has been adopted on the proposed for the offence of possessing child Classification of Films and Publications pomography is 12 months imprisonment or a fine of (Amendment) Bill (No. 2), just as a bipartisan $12 000. I am concemed about whether the penalty attitude was attempted to be taken on the women's is adequate for the worst type of offence under the centre to be contained in the central tower of the section, that is, the possession of a large quantity of former Queen Victoria Hospital discussed earlier child pomography, including multiple copies, which this evening. The coalition considers the amendment would obviously mean that the person was to be important and deserving of bipartisan support. manufacturing or distributing the material for sale. In those circumstances I do not believe 12 months The govemrnent has not entered into the same spirit imprisonment or a $12 000 fine is an adequate of bipartisan support for the amendment proposed penalty. The penalty should be considered in the by the coalition to the Classification of Films and context of other penalties for related offences. Publications Act. The amendment was directed at a different issue but related also to children. The The Attomey-General referred to the penalty for coalition has been disturbed at hearing the large selling, publishing or displaying pomographic number of complaints from parents who have material, which has a penalty of two years described unsuitable material in newsagencies and imprisonment or a fine of $24 000. He says that it is CLASSIFICATION OF FILMS AND PUBLICATIONS (AMENDMENT) BILL (No. 2)

2060 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992 not as serious to possess such material as it is to sell Mr PERRIN (Bulleen) - I was saying that the it. I remind the Attorney-General that the offence is contribution of the honourable member for Kew was one of selling or distributing pornography. It is not excellent and encapsulated the position of the an offence that relates to child pornography. This opposition on this Bill. The Bill basically introduces a provision relates specifically to child pornography. I new offence of possession of child pornography and ask the Attorney-General to reconsider this penalty provides a maximum penalty for that offence of and consider whether a much higher maximum $12000 or one year in gaol. That penalty is mild penalty should be inserted in the Bill to cover compared with what I believe should be imposed in possession of a large collection of pornographic the worst cases of child pornography. material involving the sexual abuse of children. The Bill has been through the Upper House and I note also that the maximum penalty for procuring amendments proposed by the opposition have been a child for the purpose of making an objectionable incorporated in the Bill. I understand that further film is five years imprisonment or a fine of $60 000. I amendments will be proposed by the suggest that a similar penalty would not be Attorney-General in the Committee stage of the Bill. inappropriate - it will not be applied in every Notwithstanding that, the opposition supports the case - to cover the worst cases of the possession of legisla tion. a collection of pornographic material involving the sexual abuse of children. The Bill is of great importance to the community because it aims to protect moral standards and The coalition supports the principle of the Bill and particularly those of children. Reform of this area of acknowledges that the Attorney-General has the law is long overdue. It is time the government accepted a number of amendments made by the came up with legislation to toughen the law relating coalition, which will improve the Bill. I refer to the to child pornography. Child pornography has been amendment moved by the honourable member for pervading the community. Many honourable Balwyn regarding artistic material and the change in members are concerned about pollution of the the wording from "a child posing" to a "child environment and I think we should be looking at depicted in an indecent sexual manner", which other types of pollution, particularly child provides a wider description. We are disappointed pornography. Any step to stamp out child that the Attorney-General has refused to accept the pornography is a step in the right direction. other amendments we suggested. I am strongly of the view that all forms of So far as the coalition's Bill is concerned it seems that pornography are offensive and degrading to the the statements made by the Premier and the human condition. Child pornography, in which Attorney-General have been mere words. They have children are exploited for the sexual gratification of both made statements about the undesirability of adults, is the most sickening form of pornography. material dealt with under the coalition's Bill but For a considerable time the police have been have decided to do nothing about it. The Bill before concerned about the proliferation of child the House is not the whole answer to the defects in pornography in the community. The honourable the Act. It is, however, a step in the right direction, member for Kew made it clear that the police have and in that respect it has the support of the coalition. been making an effort to infiltrate the paedophile community to ensure that some of its practices are Mr PERRIN (Bulleen) - The Bill before the wiped out. Honourable members from the House is very important. I congratulate the opposition side of the House are opposed to honourable member for Kew for her excellent paedophilia and child pornography and strongly contribution to the debate. support the police in that action.

The DEPUTY SPEAKER (Mr Norris) - Order! The Spectrum Task Force of the Victoria Police is The time appointed under Sessional Orders for me investigating the murder of Karmein Chan. Karmein to interrupt the business of the House has now lived in my electorate of Bulleen and I know the arrived. Chan family personally. I knew Karmein and was one of the small number of members of Parliament Sitting continued on motion of Mr ROPER who attended her funeral. What happened to that (Minister for Employment, Post-Secondary little girl was an absolute abomination and when the Education and Training). perpetrator of the offence is found he should have CLASSIFICATION OF FILMS AND PUBLICATIONS (AMENDMENT) BILL (No. 2)

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2061 the book thrown at him and never again be allowed not be explOited for the sexual gratification of others to see the light of day. and that it has no need for child pornography. Even those who supposedly claim that such works have I speak on behalf of many of my constituents who great artistic and historic merit may find that they are concemed about the detrimental effects of child have to hide them in the cupboard. pomography. The Spectrum Task Force has uncovered a number of child pomography rackets. I I believe the inclusion in the Bill of the various put on the record my support for the task force and defences will allow lawyers to defend successfully the Victoria Police in their efforts not only to find the an endless number of people who possess child murderer of Karmein Chan but to outlaw child pornography, and no law that we pass in this pomography rackets. Parliament will ever be effective unless we can enforce the mechanisms in it. I am convinced that The five-year-old child of one of my constituents the police do not have the resources to attack either was recently abducted and sexually molested at the child pornography or pornography in general. From Doncaster shopping centre. My constituents are the knowledge I have gained from speaking to a concemed about the number of such incidents in number of police officers about cases involving their area. It is about time action was taken against pornography, I can say that the legislation will be those mongrels who prey on and commit such vile ineffective unless we have the police to enforce it. If acts on our children. we are going to pass the Bill there have to be the police numbers to enforce it. That follows as a I am disgusted and frightened by the number of matter of course. people whose only means of sexual gratification is to watch children being sexually abused. The abuse of I wish to mention the effects of child pornography children is an abomination. Society has a because they need to be understood, particularly in responsibility to protect its children, and Parliament line with recent cases illustrating the way adults should take the lead. It is unfortunate that the treat children. I shall not detail the Karmein Chan govemment has taken almost a decade to introduce case but we need to understand the effects of child such a Bill. The Bill is only a small step in the right explOitation. It creates a society in which selfish direction - the offences outlined in the Bill should sexual gratification is the main criterion of child carry heavier penalties - and we have a long way pornography. I do not believe that is the sort of to go. society the community at large wants.

I am concemed about the defences allowed under Paedophiles thrive on child pornography. I am proposed section 60A because they are too widely totally opposed to everything they stand for. Their defined and will allow too many offenders to be let own personal sexual gratification is of no benefit to off the hook. I believe such defences should be more society. The quicker we wipe out every form of narrowly defined and that people who possess or paedophilia the better off society will be. participate in the making of child pomography should receive the harshest penalties. We must recognise the effect child pornography has on the children themselves. Children are the Proposed section 60A(2) provides that a defence to a exploited party; they are the ones whose innocence charge of possession of child pomography is proved adults seek to exploit. These adults tend to believe if, for example, a film or photograph is deemed to that children are there simply for their pleasure. have artistic merit or is for general educational They exploit their innocence by playing on a child's purposes. I believe such defences should be natural acceptance of adult superiority; they use that removed from the Bill and that the possession of power against the child. Unfortunately, because they child pomography of any sort should be made an do not know any better, children are explOited quite offence. The Bill does not give a definition of artistic regularly, particularly when they are shown merit or genuine educational purposes, as a result of exploitation of another child through pornography. which lawyers are likely to have a field day! Such exploitation desensitises the child.

I do not know what you would define as art, People have come to my electorate office and told Mr Deputy Speaker, but many artefacts dating back me that they were exploited in childhood by adults thousands of years could be said to be pomographic and they have described the effect this exploitation or to depict acts of child pomography. But a modem has had on their lives. It is catastrophic. I can cite society should be able to say that children should cases of young women who have not been able to CLASSIFICATION OF FILMS AND PUBLICATIONS (AMENDMENT) BILL (No. 2)

2062 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 91une 1992 form stable relationships with males in later life. I revulsion at all forms of child exploitation and child can cite instances of exploitation of children at pornography. I fail to understand why the Bill does schools and other places in the commtmity. not outlaw all forms of child pornography. Constituents of mine have told me of the effects exploitation and child pornography have had on The Bill refers to the classification of films and their later lives. publications but not to a new form of child pornography - computer pornography. There are There is no doubt in my mind that pornography has many computer pornography programs in the an horrific effect on children and causes them great commtmity that can be used by adults to exploit trauma for the rest of their lives. As with incest and their control over children. I am unhappy about the other abominable things that occur in our society, its fact that computer pornography has not been impact on children affects them well into adulthood included in the Bill. I believe computer pornography when they understand that they have been exploited should be incorporated into the provisions of the and been part of an abysmal act. Bill. Many children have their own computers and video cassette recorders. Floppy discs can be Another aspect of child pornography I direct to the purchased over the counter or by mail order and are attention of the House is child magnets, which are swapped freely among children. used to break down the resistance of children and provide them with a comforting relationship and the The Attorney-General has said that he will accept impression that what they are observing is normal. the coalition's amendment relating to the A number of magazines promoting child requirement that there be less than a two-year pornography have Disney cartoons in them. The difference between the portrayed age of a child and children view the Disney characters as a good thing; his or her real age in the provisions relating to they can relate to them and be happy with them. The prosecutions for child pornography. Television presence of Disney characters in the same magazine programs have depicted young women in their early as child pornography breaks down their reluctance 20s as 14-year-old schoolgirls. One television to oppose what is happening to them and provides program in particular portrays a young woman in the exploiter - the adult - with a way of her early 20s as a yowlg schoolgirl. It is relatively overcoming the children's natural resistance to what easy for young women to pass themselves off as is happening to them. Magazines sold in Victoria use schoolgirls of 13 or 14 years of age. Some shows those child magnets, whether they be Disney or want to give the impression that a sexual act is other cartoons, to make it easier for child taking place between an adult person and a young pornography to be accepted by children. The result schoolgirl. Portrayal of such scenes should be illegal. is that the child becomes engaged in further explOitation by the adult. I strongly support the comments of the honourable member for Kew. The coalition's amendments will In his second-reading speech the Attorney-General limit the amount of pornography available to said: children. The government should accept the coalition's amendments because they will have the The Child Exploitation Unit of the Victoria Police and effect of restricting the opporttmities for children to the Spectrum Task Force, which was established to view adult pornography. investigate the disappearance of Karmein Chan, have established a strong connection between child The Bill is a small step forward, but while I am a pornography and child sex crime perpetrators. member of Parliament I will do everything in my power to effect a ban on all forms of child In other words, the police investigating the Karmein pornography and many forms of pornography that I Chan case made a very strong connection between believe have a corrupting influence on young child pornography and child sex crime perpetrators. children. I look forward to the honourable member I should have thought that would be a good reason for Kew being the Attorney-General in a coalition to totally oppose, wipe out and make unlawful all government, because she will assist me in uSinz all forms of child pornography, but the Bill does not my powers to ensure that our society is protected seek to do that. If honourable members had attended from such evils and the evil people who are the fWleral of Karmein Chan and sat within metres perpetrating despicable acts on our children. I shall of her coffin, they would understand the massive try everything during my time in this place to ensure effect it had on me and my family for days that it comes about. afterwards. They would have experienced my CLASSIFICATION OF FILMS AND PUBLICATIONS (AMENDMENT) BILL (No. 2)

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2063

Mr CLARK (Balwyn) - I support the honourable made to override the right of individual autonomy members for Kew and Bulleen in their calls for that is inherent in that model. Experience, however, effective measures dealing with child pornography. over the past 20 or 30 years suggests that, at least in In doing so, I shall address myself in particular to some cases, that model should be overridden if some civil libertarian arguments that I think are serious damage is not to be done to society. badly misconceived when an attempt is made to apply them to the measures that are contained in the There is no sphere in which it is more evident that Bill. this is so than the sphere of literature and other material of a violent or pornographic nature. The It is trite to say that before Parliament makes evidence is slowly and inextricably mounting that at anything illegal one should be able to show that least a great part of this pornographic or violent harm can flow from what is to be made illegal. Few material, in particular, or material that combines honourable members would quarrel with that both elements, has a serious impact on citizens and proposition. The question is: what is the nature of leads them to act in a way which is anti-social and the harm that should be shown before Parliament is which is damaging to many others. It operates by justified in taking measures to make something inducement - by putting ideas into people's heads, illegal? That harm can be direct, and I suggest that both as to conduct and as to ways to give effect to that is certainly the case in this instance, for reasons that conduct - by desensitising people and by that I will come to in a moment. inflaming paSSiOns, either sexual or violent. When the evidence builds up that that is the case, one A more difficult question arises when the harm that really must start to ask whether the classical notions is said to flow from the particular action to be made of liberty and freedom from censorship can continue illegal is indirect. That brings us back to a debate to apply. that has been raging for some time. Lawyers would be familiar wi th the deba te referred to as the One particularly strong case against the application Devlin/Hart debate, as to the extent to which society of these notions is the instance of child pornography, should intervene to restrict the actions of individual which is the subject of the Bill. citizens. I find it very hard to understand how civil The arguments put by Professor Hart - I shall put libertarians can oppose this legislation. The them in broad terms without doing full justice to his honourable member for Bulleen expressed concern arguments - were that it was necessary to show that it qid not go far enough and certainly this Bill that some direct harm would flow from an does apply to a very limited class of matters; in individual's conduct before society was justified in effect, that class of matters relating to pornography making that conduct illegal. It may be that at the where the child involved is actually under the age of time Professor Hart put those arguments the 16 years. Although the primary offence is expressed downside was not as manifest as it has become to relate to children who not only actually are, but today. Regrettably experience over the past 20 or 30 also apparently are, under 16 years of age, by virtue years has suggested that to adopt a very limited of the defence available to the defendant that he or view of the extent to which society should intervene she believes on reasonable grounds that the child to restrict the conduct of others can have most was 16 years or older, in essence the legislation adverse consequences. applies only to pornography that actually involves those aged under 16. The trouble is that Professor Hart's model is based on the assumption that individuals are responsible For the reasons expressed by the honourable and autonomous units who can be required to be member for Bulleen in particular it is hard for fully responsible for their own conduct - to the anyone to deny that causing a child under 16 to take extent that where one person induces a second part in pornographic acts can in most if not all person to engage in certain activities, the first person instances be extremely damaging to the child does not bear the responsibility but rather the concerned. The universal concern about child second, who is presumed to be able to take exploitation and the universal account of the distress responsibility for acting or not acting on the suffered by abused children and the difficulties that inducement of the first. abuse causes for them in later life should be sufficient evidence for anyone to take that There is a great deal to be said for that argument in proposition as established. the abstract and there needs to be a strong case CLASSIFICA TION OF FILMS AND PUBLICATIONS (AMENDMENT) BILL (No. 2)

2064 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992

One need then only go the further step of It would be most regrettable if people who peddle demonstrating that the possession of films and this sort of material could avoid the provisions of the photographs recording these incidents is an Bill simply by having all their photographs scanned inducement to these incidents occurring in order to onto computer disc and retaining them only in that establish a very good case for making this sort of form while disposing of the original physical copies. material illegal. This applies not only to its sale and I am sure that that is not the intention of the distribution but also its possession - for the reasons Attorney-General, and if he has any doubts about outlined most cogently by the honourable member this matter, particularly if he intends to move other for Kew, namely, that a great deal of this material amendments in this Chamber, I suggest that he circulates without sale being an element. adopt one of the readily available definitions of "document" that extend to computer images and For all those reasons I am very surprised tha t the apply it to the definition in the Bill to make sure that civil liberties lobby has expressed opposition to the computer images are photographs within the legislation. I should have thought the legislation was meaning of the Bill. about the least we as a Parliament could do to tackle this problem, particularly in light of the evidence I shall make two other points, the first of which that has become available in Victoria during the past arises from the remarks of the honourable member year or so. for Bulleen, who expressed concern that lawyers would find a range of loopholes in the defences Indeed, I go further and join with the honourable contained in the Bill. In my view those defences member for Kew in expressing concern that the bend over backwards to accommodate anybody government has not taken up the very sound who might on any conceivable argument have the proposals contained in the Bill promoted by the slightest scrap of justification or quasi-justification coalition to extend restrictions to cover the public for possessing the sort of unpleasant material to display of material that is unsuitable for children, or which the Bill relates. To that extent the Bill is in a indeed to take up what is also a very reasonable loose format. It does not require smart lawyers to proposition put by the Australian Federation for the arrive at that result; it is evident from the nature of Family and others, that material that is generally the defences set out in proposed section 60A(2). offensive and obnoxious should not be on ready However, smart lawyers may want to take up one public display. point: proposed section 60A(1) refers to a person possessing a film or photograph of a child who is, or I make specific comments about some of the apparently is, under the age of 16 years. The use of provisions of the Bill. The honourable member for the words "or apparently is" is clearly intended to Bulleen raised the question of computer remove from the prosecution the burden of proving pornography. There must be at very least a grave what would be a difficult thing to prove in many doubt about whether the wording of the Bill is instances, that is, that the person depicted in the film adequate to cover the possession of images in or photograph is actually under the age of 16 years. computer form of children under the age of 16 engaging in sexual activity or depicted in an The provision seems intended to make it enough for indecent sexual manner. The reason for the doubt the prosecution to show that the person is lies in the definition of photograph contained in the apparently under that age and then leave it to the Bill. The word "photograph" is defined as including defendant to argue that he or she believed the a photocopy or other reproduction of a photograph. person was actually aged 16 years or older. Given What is not clear is whether an image held in that legislative intention, which is sensible, I express computer-readable form constitutes a reproduction some concern at the use of the word "child" in this of a photograph. On the one hand, it can be argued subsection because if I were a lawyer acting for the that it does because the fact that the reduction into defendant in one of those cases I would say that this computer-readable form of what was originally a required the prosecution to prove, not that the photograph is not visible on a computer disc as a person depicted was under the age of 16 years, but photograph does not mean that it is not a that that person was in fact a child. In some reproduction. On the other hand, if one takes a more instances, given the evidence cited by the limited view and thinks of the word "reproduction" honourable member for Bulleen that people aged as being analogous to photocopying or other over 21 years can impersonate children, it would be artificial replication, the Bill does not catch computer difficult for the prosecution to get to first base in images in its provisions. prosecuting someone because the prosecution could not prove in the first instance that the person ADJOURNMENT

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2065 depicted was a child because the possibility, issues, including the technical matters raised by the however remote, could not be ruled out that the honourable member for Balwyn and the matters person was an adult posing as a child. raised by the honourable member for Kew, including the question of penalty. The honourable One would hope a court would avoid that problem member for Bulleen raised some other possible by reading the reference in the Bill to a child as being amendments. Between now and the next sessional a reference to someone who appeared to be a child. period, the government is happy to consider all the One would hope a court would do that in order to issues raised. avoid the obvious loophole, but it would be preferable for the loophole to be closed. Mrs Wade interjected.

The final point I make relates to proposed new Mr KENNAN - The honourable member for section 6OA(3) to be inserted into the legislation. As Kew refers to a separate Bill. The government is the honourable member for Kew mentioned, happy to give consideration to the suggestion but subsection (3) arose out of a suggestion I made to get stresses that it is not persuaded that a new Bill is around what previously appeared to be a most necessary. If the opposition can persuade the outrageous provision, that it be a defence to a charge government that the Bill is necessary over and above of child pornography that it possessed artistic merit. the existing national scheme, of course the One might think it Virtually impossible that government will be happy to consider it. someone could mount a defence about such obnoxious material but, given that the argument of Over the next couple of months it may be that artistic merit seems to be raised about a lot of other further matters relating to the Bill will arise, that is, obnoxious material, one could not rule out that after the Act has been operating for a while. possibility. Mr E. R. Smith interjected. Proposed new section 60A(3) is put in probably the most limited form the amendment could take and it Mr KENNAN - As usual, the government will shares that characteristic with the defences provided be only too happy to consider them, along with in subsection (2) in that both subsections bend over other matters the honourable member for Glen backwards to accommodate the slightest skerrick of Waverley may care to raise. justification or quasi-justification for possession of sllch material. What the amendment means is that, if Motion agreed to. there is some doubt as to the age of the person concerned and the prosecution cannot prove that the Read second time. person concerned was under the age of 16 years but, of course, the defendant cannot prove that the Passed remaining stages. person was 16 years of age or older, then the defence of artistic merit is available. Despite this weakness, it ADJOURNMENT is important that Parliament places on record that honourable members do not accept in any way that, Mr ROPER (Minister for Employment, in any circumstance where a child under the age of Post-Secondary Education and Training) - I move: 16 years has been exploited in the production of such material, that material can possess artistic That the House do now adjourn. merit. Therefore the amendment is worth while. Motor vehicle repairs In conclusion, I hope the Attorney-General will give consideration in particular to the two technical Mr NORRIS (Dandenong) - I direct to the matters I raised, relating to the definitions of attention of the Minister for Consumer Affairs in "photograph" and "computer images", and the use another place - and I would be grateful if the of the word "child" in proposed section 60A(1) and Minister for Employment, Post-Secondary Education take action to deal with the matters. and Training would relay my remarks to him - a matter that is of concern to all those who receive Mr KENNAN (Attorney-General) - I thank annual vehicle insurance premium notices. honourable members for their contributions and Invariably one gets a shock - I know I do - when enthusiastic bipartisan support for the Bill. one sees the figure that one is expected to pay for Honourable members have raised a number of motor vehicle insurance. ADJOURNMENT

2066 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992

I have a constituent, John Pennant, who rW1S a fine Community Services Victoria smash repair business and who is a great advocate for those who are concerned about vehicle insurance Mr JOHN (Bendigo East) - I raise a matter for rates and the way in which vehicles are repaired the attention of the Minister for Community after smashes. Mr Pennant claims he is particularly Services. I wish to pursue new developments with concerned about being asked by insurance regard to the dawn raid conducted by Community companies to cheat by doing substandard work and Services Victoria (CSV) on the families of the sect being placed under pressure to repair vehicles under known as the Children of God. The ma tters I raise certain figures. He claims that if he is not prepared do not impinge in any way on the court proceedings to do the repair job in the way requested by the currently under way and are not sub judice. insurance companies, he will not be recommended for work or his quotes will not be accepted by the Two weeks ago, on 27 May, in answer to a question insurance companies. by me, the Minister denied that any of the children were strip searched while they were in the custody Mr Pennant also has pointed out that it is common of CSV. Subsequently parents contacted me to say practice for non-genuine parts to be used in smash that that was not correct. Yesterday those parents repairs. That is a controversial issue. Substandard gave me 16 statutory declarations, 11 of which car parts that are made in Taiwan and other concerned medical examinations. The declarations countries may look okay but often do not comply were from parents and children. Some of the with Australian standard requirements, but because declarations detail the circumstances of intimate insurance companies demand tha t repairs come in medical examinations. under certain figures, they almost insist that substandard parts and panels are used in repairs. I have done what the Minister asked me to do in Some insurance companies use delaying tactics, question time this morning and have submitted working one smash repair shop against another, and copies of the statutory declarations to her. They were such tactics play on the nerves of the insured wltil delivered to the Minister this evening. Although I the insured eventually reaches a point of desperation have permission to name the people, without and of not caring which repairer does the work, so naming the people involved I wish to quote a couple long as the vehicle is fixed. of incidents that were alleged to have occurred. One of the declarations states: It has been suggested that a special court be established to deal solely with insurance claims. It on 16 May 1992, I was taken to a public hospital, in has also been suggested that such a court could have which I asked ''Why''. They said it was to make sure specified time limits set for hearing claims in a that I was medically okay. I said, "I was". When I went pre-trial system to enable the unfortwlate parties to in the room, he, a male doctor, asked me to take off my reach agreement without going through the farce of socks and shoes, he said I didn't have to take off my top getting quotes from various insurance companies. or my pants if I didn't want to. I said I didn't want to, he said it was okay. Then I was very surprised and Mr Pennant alleges that one company told him to disgusted when he pulled my shirt up to my cover up a repair job on a vehicle. He said that repair collarbone. After this he asked me to stand up so he shops are forced to follow this course because the could check my legs. I offered to pull up my jeans and I only way they can make any money out of repair did so, but he said that I had to pull them down. work is to do substandard work or else their quotes are not accepted by the insurance companies. I ask I refused. He insisted on me doing so. So, very the Minister to refer the matter to the Minister for reluctantly I pulled them down and my sister is a Consumer Affairs so that he may examine the use of witness that very disgustedly I pulled my pants up. substandard parts in smash repairs and consider setting up a special court to hear such matters with In another of the declarations it is stated: pre-trial hearings to assist the parties to come to agreement. That would mean savings would be During the week of May 15-21 while I was in the made, particularly for we poor vehicle owners who custody of CSV workers they told me that a doctor are hit annually by insurance premiums. from CSV was going to examine myself, and my brothers and sister. I asked to see an independent doctor, because my barrister had advised me to do this, but they ignored my request. ADJOURNMENT

Tuesday. 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2067

When the doctor examined me she insisted that I Border Anomalies Committee undress and I asked, "Do I have to do this?" -- Mr JASPER (Murray Valley) - In the absence of Mr ROPER (Minister for Employment, the Premier, I direct to the attention of the Minister Post-Secondary Education and Training) - On a for Employment, Post-Secondary Education and point of order, Mr Speaker, the honourable member Training the Border Anomalies Committee, which appears to be quoting from a document or was established in 1979 with the agreement of the documents that mayor may not be the statutory Premiers of New South Wales and Victoria. During declarations he spoke of earlier. Following the the past 13 years by mutual arrangement the custom of this place I ask that the document or committee has sorted out many anomalies. In its first documents be made available to honourable few years the committee resolved some members. 40 anomalies and produced regular reports, mostly every 12 months. That has not been the case in The SPEAKER - Order! Is the honourable recent years, and the last report of the Border member prepared to maker the documents available? Anomalies Committee was handed down in late 1990. Mr JOHN (Bendigo East) - Yes. I direct to the attention of the Premier the need for a The SPEAKER - Order! The honourable more aggressive examination of the anomalies that member may proceed. directly affect the people living along the Victoria-New South Wales border. Differences in Mr JOHN - I have permission to make those workers compensation schemes, superannuation documents available and copies have already been awards, especially in the building industry, and the given to the Minister. I shall continue reading the conditions under which apprentices are employed document: highlight the need for reciprocity between New South Wales and Victorian government departments. and she said, ''Yes, you have to". Since its establishment the committee has eliminated I was very much embarrassed about this and I tried to many of the more obvious anomalies, but the more cover myself during the examination, but she insisted I difficult problems will be resolved only by urgent take my clothes off. I do not believe that I had a choice government action on both sides of the border. in this matter. Unfortunately in recent years the work of the committee has had to take a back seat. I ask the I shall not read any more. Copies of the documents Premier to discuss the matter with her New South have gone to the Minister who, w1til this morning, Wales counterpart so that the necessary steps can be consistently denied that medical examinations had taken to ensure that the committee meets on a taken place - she denied that for two weeks! regular basis and that it presents reports every 12 months. If the government were prepared to Honourable members interjecting. support the committee's operations many more people would be prepared to bring forward Mr JOHN - What consents were obtained? An examples of the anomalies that exist along the alleged murderer can telephone his solicitor to be border. present when he is questioned and we get little children under your government -- When I have raised the matter on previous occasions the Premier and her Ministers have responded by The SPEAKER - Order! The honourable pointing to the number of meetings held by New member will address the Chair. South Wales and Victorian Attorneys-General and community services Ministers to overcome the Mr JOHN - By contrast 72 per cent of homeless problems faced by people living along the border. I youth in this State in the government's care under ask the Minister to impress on the Premier the need statutory orders are living in drains and cardboard for positive action to enhance the work of the boxes; over 1000 proven cases of child abuse are not committee. allocated to CSV workers --

The SPEAKER - Order! The honourable member's time has expired. ADJOURNMENT

2068 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992

Western Metropolitan College of TAFE A new college council was appointed last year and it has worked very hard at cOW1cil meetings and Mr FORDHAM (Footscray) - I direct to the through the efforts of individual members to attention of the Minister for Employment, improve the situation at the college. They deserve Post-Secondary Education and Training the financial commendation and support rather than criticism of position of the Western Metropolitan College of the sort offered by the honourable member for T APE. During debate on the Supply Bill on 5 May Forest Hill. I ask the Minister to comment on this the honourable member for Forest Hill saw fit to important matter so that the record can be corrected direct to the attention of the House what he following the scurrilous statements made by the described as the disastrous financial situation facing honourable member for Forest Hill. the college. In turn he attacked the State Training Board, the decision to amalgamate the Footscray and Mr TANNER (Caulfield) - On a point of order, Newport colleges of TA FE, the Victoria University of Mr Speaker, I believe you should consider whether it Technology, the administration of the college and is appropriate for a Minister to make a comment me. rather than lUldertake to respond to a specific action.

Later by way of personal explanation I was able to The SPEAKER - Order! I will consider the demonstrate to the House, or at least to those who matter. were listening, that I was not a member of the college cOlUlcil at the time the college faced this Urban Land Authority difficult financial pOSition and that I became a member only in April 1991 and the president of the Mr HONEYWOOD (Warrandyte) - I raise a college in November 1991. matter for the attention of the Minister for Planning and Housing regarding major maladministration at However, it is not my own personal position that I the Urban Land Authority (ULA). I refer specifically am concerned about but the aspersions that have to examples of nepotism and possible profiteering as been cast on the college by the honourable member a result of inside information obtained through key for Forest Hill. Firstly, I ask the Minister to respond ULA marketing personnel family relationships with to the aspersion that the amalgamation of Footscray respect to appointments by the ULA of agents to and Newport was some sort of political put-up job handle ULA estate transactions. Members opposite relating to the financial situation at the time. Because say, "Hear, hear!" the Minister well knows that for a long time prior to the amalgamation there had been discussions Ms Lynne lones, now Lynne Lawson, a marketing involving the two colleges with a representative officer at the ULA, reports directly to Bob Grant, committee that had been plalUling for the who was appointed as marketing officer by the ULA amalgamation on educational rather than political in late 1987 and promoted to marketing manager in criteria. Secondly, I direct to the attention of the }lUle 1988. Since 1990 he has been the marketing House the reality of the financial position currently director. facing this very important college of technical and further education, one of the largest in Australia. It is Lynne Lawson's father is Mr Ron lones, whose my understanding that the financial position directorships of real estate companies are as follows: improved considprably in 1991. Farnbach Burnham Pty Ltd (Altona), an appointment that began on 18 February 1972 and Mr Richardson interjected. ceased on 1 llUle 1991, along with Vera Burnham, William Keith Burnham and Warwick Keith The SPEAKER - Order! The honourable Burnham; Farnbach Burnham (West) Pty Ltd, an member for Forest Hill is out of order, as he well appointment that began on 13 IW1e 1989, along with knows. Warwick Keith Burnham; and Triwest Real Estate Pty Ltd, an appointment that began on 1 llUle 1990 Mr FORD HAM - That was known by the with Valerie Dawn lones. The latter is a company honourable member for Forest Hill at the time he whose beneficial shareholders include Warwick made the comment in the House. Over the past 18 Keith Burnham. There is also a principal company, months many people working at the college have Farnbach Burnham Pty Ltd, of which the three put an enormous amount of effort into improving its Burnhams are directors. Ron lones is also allegedly financial and operational arrangements. They related to the Burnham family. deserve recognition rather than criticism. ADJOURNMENT

Tuesday. 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2069

According to ULA records the following ULA On 24 October 1991 I received a letter from the ULA estates have been provided with exclusive denying access to further sensitive documents that marketing rights to the Bumham-Jones companies. support that case. The contact person whom I was The first was Tarneit Village, Werribee, which went told to contact for any future access was none other to Triwest Real Estate Pty Ltd and involved some than Lynne Lawson, the marketing officer whose hundreds of allotments. The second was West father had been selling the estates. In response to my Grove, Werribee, which also went to Triwest and original request last year about a relative of Bob involved six stages and approximately 1000 Grant, who sold three ULA estates in the eastern allotments at $1 million-plus commission. The third suburbs, the Minister for Planning and Housing was Woodgrove, Laverton, which went to Farnbach replied: Burnham Pty Ltd from late 1991, again involving large commissions. The fourth was the rifle range Firstly, you requested that I take action to ensure that a estate in the Premier's electorate of Williamstown, proper procedure is implemented for the selection of involving 990 allotments, which went to Farnbach real estate agents. Burnham in conjunction with John Williams Real Estate Pty Ltd at $1 million-plus commission. And A procedure for such appointments, which I consider is the fifth was Altona Bay, which went to Fambach both appropriate and proper, is in place. Burnham and involved approximately 500 allotments at $500 OOO-plus commission. I call on the Minister to release to Parliament a copy of the audit report of the Ministry of Finance In late 1991 the exclusive right to a further estate, the undertaken earlier this year into serious allegations Newport railway estate, was given to a Mr Wayne about the appointment of ULA estate agents. The Sweeney of Wayne Sweeney and Associates Pty Ud, report is damning and it has been denied to me on who worked for Farnbach Burnham with Ron Jones the basis of commercial confidentiality, as well as by for three years from 22 October 1980 to 10 April the guidelines set by the Land MOnitoring Division 1983. Less than six months prior to his appointment of the Department of the Treasury. to sell the Newport land Mr Sweeney was one of only three agents in Victoria named in the Estate Water charges Agents Board's am1Ual report as having committed serious offences, including the taking of money out Mrs HIRSH (Wantima) - I ask the Minister for of the trust account of a licensed estate agency Planning and Housing to take action on an issue company of which he was a director and officer in raised with me by approximately 40 of my effective control when there was no entitlement to constituents from Karoo Road and Wedge Crescent, do so; instances of double taking of sales Rowville. They have signed a petition seeking action commission, advertising and other expenses; and but it cannot be tabled in the House because it is not other charges concerning failure to ensure that the written in the proper form. My constituents have auditor was advised of those debits, failure to bank written me a letter asking me to raise the matter trust money promptly, failure to properly retain with the Minister. moneys in the appropriate trust account, failure to keep full and accurate records, giving false and They express concern about the transfer of misleading information to the board, and deceptive government water charges to public housing conduct for which he was reprimanded, fined a total tenants. They ask the Minister to consider the fact of $5500 and ordered to pay the costs of the inquiry. that they are paying their water rates and are being Mr Sweeney contravened a number of sections of hit with additional costs that they can ill afford. the Estate Agents Act 1990. They believe the rate of 15 cents a kilolitre that they are being charged will increase and that further I met with Mr Bob Grant at the ULA in October hardship will be imposed on them. The residents 1991. He admitted to me that until 27 June 1991 no also feel that they are being discriminated against formalised or documented procedures were in place because the charges apply only to those who live in to appoint estate agents to market ULA estates and metropolitan Melbourne and not to public housing only then under his authorship and signature. tenants in rural areas. Residents pay more for their Clause 2.4 of the document indicates that a brief for water rates because many of the dwellings have old each estate "will be forwarded to selected agents taps and shower roses that are less efficient than requesting them to submit a proposal to market an new fittings. upcoming ULA estate". There was therefore no open tender process in place. ADJOURNMENT

2070 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992

Approximately 40 residents have written to me simply a matter of custom and practice which is seeking action from the Minister, who I know is defined by Speakers' rulings. The technique concerned about the provision of public housing in suggested by Speaker Christie is: Knox because 17 new units for older people are (i) setting out the complaint; being built in the area. I hope the Minister will examine the concerns raised by the residents of (ii) indicating the Minister or Department involved; Wedge Crescent and Karoo Road, Rowville, and (iii) giving a brief resume of the facts; and ensure that modem tap and shower fittings are installed in those dwellings. (iv) finally suggesting the action sought. Gaming machine supplier Speaker Wheeler also said, in part: the adjournment debate is an opportunity to give Mr ELDER (Ballarat North) - I refer the Minister information which members consider requires attention. for Gaming to the introduction of gaming machines in Victoria. The Minister is aware that the Chairman I rule that the contribution made by the honourable of the Victorian Gaming Commission, Mr Darcy member for Footscray is in conformity with those Dugan, and the Premier have embarked on a rulings. I do not uphold the point of order. $700 000 television advertising program suggesting, among other things, that gaming machines are Responses squeaky clean. Mr McCUTCHEON (Minister for Planning and Mr Dugan and the chief executive officer of the Housing) - The honourable member for commission are currently in the United States of Warrandyte raised allegations regarding officers of Amer.ica investigating the supplier of gaming th~ Urban ~d Authority (UlA). I made inquiries ma~hines to Tattersalls to see if it is squeaky clean. WIth the chaIrman of the authority about the matter Untted States law enforcement agencies have been the honourable member raised last November. slow in providing information about the supplier of the machines, but the State of Ohio has raised doubts Mr Gude interjected. about the company, BLC, and is currently deciding whether it will investigate it because of the Mr McCUTCHEON - The honourable member inadequate answers it has received from both the for Hawthorn is making unjustified allegations. The company and law enforcement agencies. honourable member for Warrandyte produced a lot of info~ation and I do not think it is appropriate to Given the undertaking by the Premier and Mr Darcy answer It all. I shall respond in some detail, but I Dugan that gaming machines and their suppliers are shall ~ake only one or two points. Firstly, on several squeaky clean, I seek an assurance from the Minister occaslOns the honourable member said there were that on the return from the United States of Darcy no procedures in place for the appointment of estate Dugan and the commission's chief executive officer agents for the ULA. When the leader of the Parliament will be given a full account of the reasons OppOSition was Minister of Housing, Mr Arthur for the trip, the result of their investigations of BlC Hicks, the then Chairman of the ULA, put and its contract with TattersaUs. I hope the procedures in place for the selection of estate agents investigation will not delay the introduction of for the particular task of marketing UlA properties. gaming machines into Victoria. Those procedures were reaffirmed by the board in Jun~ 1991. Following a review that I requested of the The SPEAKER - Order! The honourable chaIrman of the authority an investigation was member for Caulfield raised a point of order about a carried out by the Bureau of Internal Audit of the matter raised by the honourable member for Ministry of Finance. Some proposals were made for Footscray in which the honourable member for additional procedures to be introduced, which I Caulfield sought a ruling from the Chair about ~equested the chairman of the authority to whether the matter was admissible. Implement. They have been implemented. In regard to the other matters, I shall provide the honourable I shall quote briefly from sections of the Legislative member with detailed answers. Assembly of Victoria Rulings from the Chair, which led to the current form of the adjournment debate. I The honourable member for Wantirna referred to remind the House that the adjournment debate is water charges by Melbourne Water for public not provided for in the Standing Orders but is ADJOURNMENT

Tuesday, 9 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2071 housing estates and a petition by tenants who are The honourable member for Wantima can assure concerned about pay-for-use water charges. her constituents that their case has been understood and that appropriate measures are being taken by Honourable members interjecting. my department.

The SPEAKER - Order! I ask the honourable Mr Coleman - What are you going to do about members for Syndal and Gisborne to remain silent it? to enable the House to adjourn at a reasonable time. The SPEAKER - Order! I ask the honourable Mr McCUTCHEON - The charges introduced member for Syndal to remain silent so honourable by Melbourne Water have two components: firstly, members can hear the responses of Ministers and so consumers of water are billed for the consumption the House can proceed in a reasonably orderly on a pay-for-use basis; secondly, there has been a manner. reduction in the water rate charged to ratepayers of an amount equivalent to the extra sum paid on the Mr ROPER (Minister for Employment, pay-for-use basis. Post-Secondary Education and Training) - The honourable member for Dandenong raised for the The arrangement for public housing tenants is that attention of the Minister for Consumer Affairs the metered properties are being charged for water. I issue of motor vehicle repairs and people being refer to a note from the manager in my department ripped off - which appears to be an ongoing responsible for public housing tenants: problem in the motor vehicle industry. I will draw that matter to the attention of my colleague in the As an interim measure for public tenants serviced by other place. Melbourne Water through separate meters, the Director of Housing, awaiting the outcome of the legislative The honourable member for Bendigo East raised the clarification, has asked its tenants to pay their water issue of the treatment of children belonging to the consumption accoWlts issued directly to them by water Children of God sect. Honourable members will supply authorities, and has on a once-only basis recall that on a number of occasions claims have credited the rental accounts of these tenants for the been made that the children were "strip water cost up to the previously free level. searched" - the words deliberately used by the honourable member for Bendigo East. Leaving aside As honourable members will be aware, the level is the veracity of the statutory declarations made, 75 kilolitres for the six-month reading period which is another matter, those statutory declarations between October 1990 and April 1991. do not suggest in any way that the children were strip searched because, as honourable members will The Director of Housing has made it clear that be aware, that phrase has a very specific meaning. tenants will be responsible for the payment of water The attitude taken by the honourable member for on a pay-for-use basis and will not be treated any Bendigo East is interesting. differently from other consumers of water throughout Victoria. Mr STOCKDALE (Brighton) - On a point of order, Mr Speaker, these matters were addressed by The honourable member for Wantirna raised the honourable member for Bendigo East to the concerns directed to her by tenants - not only Minister for Community Services. It involves public housing tenants but also others who are personal attacks the Minister has made on the concerned that landlords would need to become honourable member and it is entirely inappropriate responsible for ensuring that water fittings on their for the Minister at the table to be giving a properties are not wasteful and that taps do not leak second-hand response to matters that the Minister or pipes do not become faulty and result in undue for Community Services has highly personalised. charges to tenants. The Director of Housing has The Minister should refer the matter to the Minister authorised a refitting program, and a considerable for Community Services for a proper response. amount of money has been spent by my department in the careful refitting of properties so that tenants The SPEAKER - Order! There is no point of will not live in properties where leaking water is order. caused by poor fittings. Mr ROPER (Minister for Employment, Post-Secondary Education and Training) - The ADJOURNMENT

2072 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 9 June 1992 words "strip search" have a specific meaning and TAFE has assisted in overcoming the financial the statutory declarations do not relate to it. The difficulties, it has also developed an adequate TAFE Minister has made it clear that if the honourable facility for the western suburbs of Melbourne. I am member provided ma terial the ma tter would be sure a large number of people in the western investigated. suburbs are pleased with the progress being made by the college in serving the people of the western The honourable member for Murray Valley referred suburbs, and they are also pleased with the way the to border anomalies. I shall direct his remarks to the college has turned itself around financially and is attention of the Premier and ask her to respond providing an efficient and effective service. directly to the honourable member. The honourable member for Ballarat North sought The honourable member for Footscray raised the information about the visit by the Chairman of the financial situation of the Western Metropolitan Victorian Gaming Commission to the United States College of T AFE and, as honourable members will of America. The commission took the view that for a recall, earlier this session the honourable member for number of reasons, including the need to have direct Forest Hill suggested that the college was in serious discussions with United States law enforcement financial difficulty and he impugned the honourable agencies, a visit to the United States was necessary member for Footscray. The honourable member for to make sure the most useful information was made Footscray was able to demonstrate accurately that available in the most expeditious way. the points made by the honourable member for Forest Hill were incorrect. As I have previously told the House, the government strongly supports the Gaming The matter that concerns the council, many people in Commission in its desire to ensure that the system the western suburbs and me is the suggestion that introduced in this State is free of criminal activity. the Western Metropolitan College of TAFE is in For that reason, I am prepared to support the visit of financial difficulty. The honourable member for Mr Dugan and Mr Ronaldson to the United States of Forest Hill knows that to be untrue because he has America. They will be reporting on their visit been given a copy of a report prepared by the directly to the commission. Obviously their visit director of the college to the General Manager of the relates to the way any system will operate here and State Training Board which clearly shows the whether people are licensed or put on a roll and it is progress that has been made in the past 12 months in very much a matter for the commission. As I said, ensuring that the college is well and truly financial. Mr Dugan and Mr Ronaldson will report fully to the commission. It is Significant that after his request made under the freedom of information legislation a deal of material Individual pieces of information relating to was made available to the honourable member for operations of the commission are not made available Forest Hill that was unfavourable to the view held to me, but I shall see what information Mr Dugan by him. He has not referred to tha t information in can provide directly to the honourable member for Parliament or anywhere else. The director's report Ballarat North. that was made available to him made it clear that the deficit had been turned into a surplus and that it is Motion agreed to. expected that that will continue in the current year. House adjourned 12.32 a.m. (Wednesday). The report clearly demonstrates significant improvements in the administration of the college and also directs attention to the fact that, although the merger of the Footscray and Newport colleges of QUESTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE

Wednesday, 10 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2073

Wednesday, 10 June 1992 Ms KIRNER - If you don't want to treat this as a serious issue --

Honourable members interjecting.

The SPEAKER (Hon. Ken Coghill) took the chair at The SPEAKER - Order! I ask the House to come 10.36 a.m. and read the prayer. to order. It is an important issue in which many honourable members are interested and because of the loud interjections of a few members it is QUESTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE becoming impossible to hear. I ask honourable members to remain silent so the Premier's reply can be clearly heard. VICTORIAN CERTIFICATE OF EDUCATION Ms KIRNER - Dc Blackbum, who was recently appointed as the chancellor of one of the new Canberra universities, produced an excellent report. Mr KENNETT (Leader of the Opposition) - The reforms were developed by the Honourable Ian Given the acknowledgment by the Minister for Cathie, the then education Minister, and by the School Education that the Victorian certificate of Victorian Curriculum and Assessment Board education processes introduced by the Premier have (VCAB)-- resulted in the need for a major restructure of the VCE following reports of suicide and physical and Honourable members interjecting. emotional problems, I ask the Premier --

Honourable members interjecting. The SPEAKER - Order! Again there are far too many interjections. I ask honourable members on both sides of the House to remain silent. The SPEAKER - Order! The Leader of the Opposition is entitled to ask his question without Ms KIRNER - The Honourable David Evans being shouted down by members on my right or my who represents North Eastem Province in the other left. place, was then a member of VCAB, as were a number of members of the Liberal Party. They Mr KENNETT - Does the Premier now accept carried out an important task, as important as the that her education experiment has failed the needs work done under the Honourable Lindsay of the students of Victoria, has destroyed the Thompson, a former Liberal education Minister, in employment prospects of thousands of young revising the higher school certificate examination, Victorians and has betrayed the aspirations of the which was the forerunner of the Victorian certificate entire community? of education. Ms KIRNER (Premier) - I thank the Leader of It is important to put the VCE in context, and to do the Opposition for his question, and I also thank the so one needs to understand that many of the reforms opposition for its bipartisan commitment to the in the VCE have been adopted by other States. continuation of the Victorian certificate of education. Queensland has not had examinations for many Silence from the opposition on that statement! Isn't it years - since the Radford report was handed down. interesting, it is not simply the government's South Australia has adopted a similar form of VCE-- assessment to that used in Victoria; and the Honourable members interjecting. Australian Capital Territory has had competitive assessments since its senior colleges were established. Ms KIRNER -It is not simply the government's VCE. The VCE arose from an excellent report Mr Kennett interjected. recognised throughout the world as a major education report by Jean Blackbum in 1984. Under Ms KIRNER - Mr Speaker, you know very well, the leadership of the then Minister for Education, the as does the Leader of the Opposition - who is not honourable member for Footscray, Robert really interested in the subject, he is interested only Fordham-- in trying to apportion blame - that the VCE is an important reform for all Victorians, particularly for Honourable members interjecting. QUESTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE

2074 ASSEMBLY Wednesday, 10 June 1992

our young people, some of whom are sitting in the Ms KIRNER - Yes, it was you. And guess where Public Gallery. he was: I discovered from News Diary that the Leader of the Opposition was unable to go because Since the Labor Party has been in office various he was at a press lunch - that I was unable to go education Ministers have initiated and then to - to farewell Josephine Cafagna and Paul Austin. developed reforms together with members of the opposition, who have been part of the decisions Mr Kennett interjected. made by VCAB. The young people in our schools are giving politicians on both sides of the House an Ms KIRNER - You weren't at that, either! The important message. They are saying, 'Why don't the Age News Diary column suggested you were there. I politicians butt out of the VCE? It's our VCE, and we am very sorry about that. I don't know where he want to get on with it". was and perhaps he doesn't know either. I do know he was not at the TCF meeting. Do you know what BA YSIDE PROJECT his non-attendance allowed him to do? It allowed him to go around the Bendigo area the next day or Mr McNAMARA (Leader of the National the day after saying that the TCF meeting was a Party) - I ask the Premier whether it is a fact that stunt. That is interesting. I wonder why the the Major Projects Unit arranged for funds to be honourable member for Ballarat North came up to borrowed for the Bayside project specifically to pay me after the meeting, shook hands over the table and interest on the funds previously borrowed for the said, 'Well done, Joan". I wonder why the project. How can the Premier justify such a shonky honourable member for Warmambool has financial arrangement? appropriately acknowledged the good work in having the meeting. I wonder why there are so many Ms KIRNER (Premier) - The answers to the press articles supportive of the meeting and the TCF questions asked by the opposition are well covered industry! in the Auditor-General's important report. The question asked by the Leader of the National Party is Mr Kennett - More photos! responded to in the report. It is within the normal bounds of managing such projects to have money Ms KIRNER - Not of you. One is enough for the spent over time and to borrow accordingly. week! The headings of those articles are: "Time to protect provincial Victoria"; "Call for action on TEXTILE, CLOTHING AND FOOTWEAR tariffs"; "Cities plead for halt to tariff cuts"; and INDUSTRY "Bendigo joins push to shield industry jobs". I am sure both honourable members representing the Mr ERNST (Bellarine) - Will the Premier advise Bendigo area would be interested. It seems to me it the House of the outcome of her recent meeting with was an appropriate time for the Leader of the representatives of the textile, clothing and footwear Opposition to put his actions where his mouth was (TCF) industry from Victoria's provincial centres and attend the meeting, but he did not do so. and explain what further a~tion she intends to take Fortunately he sent the shadow Minister for to support the industry? manufacturing, industry development and commerce, who agreed with my statement on Ms KIRNER (Premier) - Just on two weeks ago support for the industry and offered to provide an historic meeting was held in Parliament House further words on micro-economic reform. The with representatives of about 20 local council areas shadow Minister said he would provide some extra and 13 regional development bodies and a number words and we look forward to those words -they of honourable members from both sides of the have not arrived yet; but when they do arrive I am House. In that sense it was an historic meeting. sure they will be terrific. Despite the bravado of the Leader of the OppOSition, as demonstrated in the House that day when the In contrast, today the Minister for Manufacturing issue of the TCF industry was raised and he said, and Industry Development, the Honourable David 'TU be in it," guess who didn't turn up, just like he White, and the South Australian Minister didn't turn up on television last night! The Leader of responsible for manufacturing, Mr Lynn Amold, the OppOSition did not turn up. will meet with Senator Button to discuss the issues that we regard as important in the manufacturing Mr Kennett - Was it me? and TCF industries. That is a practical outcome of QUESTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE

Wednesday, IQ June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2075 the work of the task force, which now includes a representative in this place of the Minister for number of local goven1ment members. Manufacturing and Industry Development, to the Gas and Fuel Corporation's agreement with a In addition I had the good fortune last week to meet European-based bank to buy the gas bills of with the Deputy Prime Minister of New Zealand Victorian industry and the Victorian community, and the New Zealand Ambassador. The latter and I ask: what is the loss of revenue to the Gas and agreed to take up the important issue of New Fuel Corporation, what is the cost to the Victorian Zealand's different trade relationships. I have also community -- spoken to Senator Button and understand that in the next few weeks he will issue a major statement on Mr Crabb interjected. TCF that will contain a major contribution by our task force. The SPEAKER - Order! I ask the Minister for Tourism to show his usual self-restraint and remain The Leader of the Opposition laughs. I suggest that silent to allow the honourable member for Brighton instead of laughing at the TCF industry and its to put his question without interruption. plight, which he made so much of last night when he spoke on my Ministerial statement on the Mr STOCKDALE - I ask: what is the loss of women's centre, he should do what the Leader of revenue to the Gas and Fuel Corporation; what is the Opposition has done in South Australia and say the cost to the State of Victoria; for how many years that he, as the Leader of the Opposition, is prepared does the agreement operate; and when will to tackle the Liberal tariff policy. Parliament be advised of all the details surrounding the arrangement? Mr Kennett - What is his name? Mr A. J. SHEEHAN (Treasurer) - Finally the Ms KIRNER - Mr Dean Brown, who said that opposition has some interest in the future of major Fightback would hurt South Australian jobs. Isn't it govenunent trading enterprises. Up to this stage all interesting and isn't it a big contrast between the the opposition has done is talk about breaking them Leader of the Opposition, who makes such a noise up and flogging them off. It is interesting to note about the TCF industry that he is not prepared to that in such an approach they avoided the use of the stand up and be counted and say that what will word "privatisation". The opposition cannot come to really hurt the TCF industry is Fightback. He is not grips with the argument they are pushing; they prepared to stand up and be counted on the subject cannot identify those parts of the authorities they of the TCF industry and is not prepared to say what wish to break up; they cannot put a price on them he will do for the small -- and they cannot put an outcome on them.

Mr Kennett interjected. Members of the opposition have no view of the future apart from saying, 'We will break them up The SPEAKER - Order! I ask the Leader of the and flog them off". They are continually avoiding Opposition to remain silent and the Premier to the use of the word "privatisation". Now the round off her reply. opposition come into this place asking questions about the well-known securitisation plan that refers Ms KIRNER - The final point about the failure to a small percentage of the revenue flow of the Gas of the Leader of the Opposition to attend that and Fuel Corporation - my understanding is that it meeting is that it is not really a failure to attend that is 10 per cent. That will provide for an evening-out is so important, it is his willingness to constantly talk of the revenue flows to the enterprise, which is a about the TCF industry but his failure to be perfectly normal commercial practice. prepared, as Dean Brown, the Leader of the Opposition in South Australia, is prepared, to stand It is important that the opposition state their view up and say that Fightback will decimate the TCF about the future of govenunent trading enterprises. I industry. believe they are unable to spell it out and unable to use the word "privatisation". GAS AND FUEL CORPORATION AGREEMENT COMMUNITY SERVICES VICTORIA

Mr STOCKDALE (Brighton) - I direct the Mr McDONALD (Whittlesea) - Will the attention of the Treasurer, in his capacity as the Minister for Community Services inform the House QUESTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE

2076 ASSEMBLY Wednesday, 10 June 1992 of the steps she is taking to investigate affidavits are suffering from injury or illness. The consent was relating to children taken into Community Services obtained from CSV. Victoria (CSV) care, which were tabled in Parliament yesterday? The specific role of the opposition seems to be to provide the community with fear, worry and Mrs SETCHES (Minister for Community suffering about what might happen, but I shall tell Services) - The shadow Minister raised the matter the House where the real shock, horror is. It lies in of the Children of God sect children who were taken what this opposition will do to child protection. It into custody last month. I am interested in the has already been done in New South Wales, where interrelated and interchangeable terms used by the the number of child protection staff to do honourable member opposite when talking about investigations has been reduced. New South Wales this matter, because in his titillating lead-up to make does not follow up reports; that is obviously what certain he had everybody's attention he actually this opposition would do if it got into government. It reduced this matter to a shock, horror, grubby little will not allow doctors to look at children to see if exercise by talking about the strip searching of tiny they are in need of care and attention. I really think children. it will go beyond what New South Wales has done in cutting back more than a quarter of its offices in fl flStrip searching has a particular connotation. It regional areas and reducing money to community means looking for contraband, substances, weapons groups. or other things of that sort and is undertaken in corrective institutions. That is how the term is They are now saying that they will not allow section commonly w1derstood. When the honourable 271 of the Act, which allows for paediatric member had everybody's attention he then changed investigations of children taken into care, to be the term to - wait for it - medical examination. enforced. They are a disgrace, and to use shock, Suddenly, strip searching had gone. Perhaps the horror and titillation tactics to describe what is honourable member does not know the difference happening to the children is outrageous. between a medical examination and a strip search! PAINTING IN DEPARTMENT OF It is important that grubby accusations such as he PREMIER AND CABINET made should be put into the context of what really happened. On 15 May at the Janefield Training Mr GUDE (Hawthorn) - I refer the Premier to Centre, which was the holding centre for the her purchase of an $8000 painting which she children, 24 children were medically examined. On described as a representative example of Aboriginal 16 May six children were medically examined and art to be owned by the public. When she made that on 17 May two were examined at -wait for it­ statement about the use of taxpayers' money, was Monash Medical Centre. In both cases the the Premier misleading the House deliberately or examinations were carried out by paediatricians. had she herself been misled about the authenticity of The medical examinations were arranged the painting? Was the Premier duped yet again? speCifically. CSV had concems based on advice it had received from former sect members and other The SPEAKER - Order! In asking a question the people that there was inadequate proVision of honourable member is not at liberty to make an medical attention to the children suffering from, for imputation. instance, asthma. Mr Kennett interjected. It is not routine for children to be medically examined but in this case it was felt to be The SPEAKER - Order! I warn the Leader of the appropriate, and all three paediatricians involved Opposition. He is well aware of the provisions of have stated that they respected individual children's Standing Orders. If he wishes to raise a point of requests about the removal of clothes. Then the order he knows the manner in which he should do matter of consent was raised. Under section 271 of it. I ask the Deputy Leader of the Opposition to the Children and Young Persons Act the rephrase his question. director-general is provided with the power to arrange medical examinations of children taken into Mr GUDE - I refer the Premier to her purchase safe custody or under interim accommodation of an $8000 painting which she described as a orders. Such examinations are relevant when related representative example of Aboriginal art to be to concerns about children who may be neglected or owned by the public. When she made that statement QUESTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE

Wednesday, 10 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2077 about the use of taxpayers' money was the Premier There is a certificate of authenticity from the dealer. misleading the House or had she herself been misled Mr Kirby has indicated that the department will take about the authenticity of the painting? Was the appropriate action if it is not authentic. Premier duped yet again? The really sad thing about this is that the whole of Ms KIRNER (Premier) - The painting was the forgery matter in the Aboriginal art area is purchased as a work for the Department of the clearly becoming a very large issue and one that is Premier and Cabinet and is hW1g at the entrance of now reboW1ding on the Aboriginal communities. the major meeting area of both the Cabinet room The government will give the Oenpelli community and the Victoria room, where most visitors come every support if this is a forgery issue, and I look through. forward to the matter being resolved in the interests of the Aboriginal community. The department has a certificate of authentication by the dealer, Mr Neil McLeod, stating that the work BA YSIDE PROJECT was by the artist. Mr WALLACE (Gippsland South) - I ask the Mr Gude interjected. Premier to explain to the House why the government signed a development agreement and a Ms KIRNER - I take this as a serious matter, contract of sale with the Sandridge developers when and so should you. A couple of weeks ago some three of the shareholders who held 20 per cent of the doubt was raised by a journalist about the painting, shares were in the hands of receivers? and the head of the Department of the Premier and Cabinet, Mr Peter Kirby, immediately took action, Ms KIRNER (Premier) - As I said earlier today, through the National Gallery of Victoria, to verify yesterday and the week before in question time, the the work's authenticity. The National Gallery asked real issue is whether in this whole matter of Bayside a consultant to visit the Oenpelli people. Mr Kirby is the public has an asset. awaiting advice from the gallery, which is expected today. Mr Elder - Did you get a certificate for that?

Mr McNamara interjected. Ms KIRNER - I will have to pay that one. It is a question of whether the public has an asset which is The SPEAKER - Order! The Premier will cleared, which is now available for major resume her seat. I warn the Leader of the National development, which will be developed with Party. He is well aware of the provisions of Standing community consultation and which will bring great Orders and of his obligation to provide some benefits to the Port Melbourne community in jobs leadership in the House, and I ask him to remain and investment in the wider Melbourne commw1ity. silent. I believe it will, I believe the people of Melbourne think it will, and indeed -- Ms KIRNER - We certainly know that the Leader of the National Party would never make a Honourable members interjecting. mistake about art - certainly not the art for art's sake kind. There are a number of works of art The SPEAKER - Order! It is impossible for the hanging in various areas of the Department of the Premier's reply to be heard, and I ask honourable Premier and Cabinet, and indeed throughout the members to cease interjecting. offices of the Premier and Ministers, which the National Gallery makes available. There are also a Ms KIRNER - I believe it was a great pity that number of works of art that are hanging there as last night the Leader of the OppOSition, having been part of art acquisitions over the years by Premiers in invited to take part in the 7.30 Report and discuss the previous governments. This is the only one that has issue on its merits with the Minister for Major been purchased by the Department of the Premier Projects, squibbed it. He either squibbed it or he and Cabinet, as I understand it, in my time as read the questions that were given to him Premier. beforehand and did not like them. Or perhaps he was scared to debate the question with the Minister The most serious issue - and I do take it very for Major Projects. Perhaps he knows that he would seriously - is that the government purchased the have to admit that his people have said that it is in painting as authentic and expected it to be authentic. fact a good project or that what I am saying is true. PETITIONS

2078 ASSEMBLY Wednesday, 10 June 1992

Perhaps he knows that the convenor of the program members to be able to hear the Premier's reply was very disappointed that he was not going to be without interruption. on and asked the Minister for Major Projects -- Or Napthine interjected. Mr KENNETI (Leader of the Opposition) - On a point of order, Mr Speaker, the Premier, either Honourable members interjecting. through lack of knowledge or deliberately, is not telling Parliament the truth. The SPEAKER - Order! I ask honourable members on both sides to remain silent. I warn the The SPEAKER - Order! There is no point of honourable member for Portland who, by his very order. If the Leader of the Opposition believes he loud interjection, provoked a further barrage of should make a personal explanation, he should interjections. I will not warn him again. I am quite handle it in the normal and appropriate manner and prepared to take the appropriate action against him. approach the Chair at an appropriate opportunity. Ms KIRNER (Premier) - Thank you, Honourable members interjecting. Mr Speaker. I really cannot believe the response of the opposition and of the Leader of the Opposition Ms KIRNER (Premier) - When the Minister for on this issue; he has turned up the heat over the past Major Projects said to -- few days but when he gets one little bit of heat at the end of question time he wants to get out of the Mr Kennett interjected. kitchen. He should have gone into the kitchen last night and faced up to the debate with the Minister Honourable members interjecting. for Major Projects.

Ms KIRNER - He has given it out all day! PETITIONS

Honourable members interjecting. The Clerk - I have received the following petitions for presentation to Parliament: Ms KIRNER - Here they go, McCarthyism at work! B-double vehicles

Mr Kennan interjected. To the Honourable the Speaker and members of the Legislative Assembly in Parliament assembled: The SPEAKER - Order! The Deputy Premier! I ask honourable members on both sides of the House The humble petition of the undersigned citizens of the to remain silent to enable the Premier to complete State of Victoria showeth that the approval of the use of her reply. I ask the Premier to round off her reply. B-doubles in residential areas is detrimental to the residents. Mr STOCKDALE (Brighton) -On a point of order, Mr Speaker, this is a flagrant abuse of Your petitioners therefore pray that a permit not be question time. The Premier has made an inaccurate issued by VIe ROADS for the use of Seaford attack on the Leader of the Opposition; she has Road/Klauer Street by B-double vehicles. control of the agenda and if she wants to have a debate on the report she should list it. The Premier And your petitioners, as in duty bound, will ever pray. has been challenged to debate the report - we will see who squibs it now! By Mrs Hill (123 signatures)

The SPEAKER - Order! There is no point of Licence demerit point system for taxi order. drivers

Honourable members interjecting. To the Honourable the Speaker and members of the Legislative Assembly in Parliament assembled: The SPEAKER - Order! I ask the House to come to order. I ask honourable members on both sides of The humble petition of the undersigned citizens of the the House to respect the right of all honourable State of Victoria showeth a dissatisfaction with the MIGRANT SKILLS AND QUALIFICATIONS BOARD

Wednesday. 10 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2079

consequences of the Victorian government's licence Ordered that report and appendices be printed. demerit point system on taxi drivers. Or V AUGHAN (Clayton) - I desire to move, by Your petitioners therefore pray that the Minister for leave: Transport will take account of the difficulties which the present arrangements are causing, and take measures That this House takes note of the report of the to reduce the deleterious effect of these arrangements Privileges Committee tabled in this House on 10 June on taxi drivers. 1992.

And your petitioners, as in duty bound, will ever pray. The SPEAKER - Order! Will the honourable member clarify whether he wishes to give notice of By Mr Thomson (621 signatures) motion or seeks leave to move the motion?

Human life experimentation Or V AUGHAN - I am seeking leave to move the motion. To the Honourable the Speaker and members of the Legislative Assembly in Parliament assembled: Mr Gude - Leave granted.

The humble petition of the undersigned citizens of the The SPEAKER - Order! Does the honourable State of Victoria sheweth: member wish to speak to his motion? I seek clarification from the honourable member as to That from their beginning at the initiation of whether he desires to give notice that tomorrow he fertilisation, human embryos deserve legal protection will move a motion or whether he is intending, by from all experimentation which is destructive or leave, to move a motion for consideration today. harmful to them. Or V AUGHAN - I desire to give notice that Your petitioners therefore pray that the Legislative tomorrow I will move: Assembly, in Parliament assembled, should pass legislation to prohibit harmful and destructive That his House takes note of the report of the Privileges experimentation on human life. Committee tabled in this House on 10 June 1992.

And your petitioners, as in duty bound, will ever pray. Mr MACLELLAN (Berwick) - On a point of order, Mc Speaker, the honourable member first By Mr J. F. McGrath (1056 signatures) sought leave and leave was granted by the House for him to move a motion. He moved the motion Laid on table. and you called on him to find out whether he wished to speak on it. That is what is before the MIGRANT SKILLS AND Chair at this stage. The honourable member has now QUALIFICATIONS BOARD changed his mind and decided he wants to give notice for another occasion on another day. If that is Mr ROPER (Minister for Employment, what he wants to do, it is what he should have done Post-Secondary Education and Training) presented in the first place. I point out to you, Sir, that the rep'ort of Migrant Skills and Qualifications Board motion before the Chair is the motion moved by the for year 1991. honourable member by leave. That is the motion that should now be put. Laid on table. Mr CRABB (Minister for Tourism) -On the PRIVILEGES COMMITTEE point of order, Mc Speaker, it is obvious to anybody who is listening with half an ear that what the Dr VAUGHAN (Clayton) presented report from honourable member believed he was doing was Privileges Committee on matter referred to asking for leave to give notice of a motion for committee on 28 May 1991, together with tomorrow, which is a fairly common practice in appendices and minutes of evidence. these circumstances and with the procedures of the House. It is necessary to obtain the leave of the Laid on table. House in order to give notice of a motion to be moved at some future time. It was clear from what PAPERS

2080 ASSEMBLY Wednesday, 10 June 1992 the honourable member said and from the way he STANDING ORDERS COMMITIEE replied to the matters you raised that that was his intention. Programming of government and general business The SPEAKER - Order! On the point of order, the role of the Chair is to attempt to facilitate the Mr ROPER (Minister for Employment, intentions of the honourable member, which in this Post-Secondary Education and Training) - I move: case were not clear to the Chair. However, teclmically the honourable member for Berwick is That the Standing Orders Committee have power to correct: the honourable member for Clayton did inquire into and report upon the programming of move a motion by leave and was given leave, and government and general business of this House to that motion is now before the Chair. The options are provide for the more efficient and effective use of now for the House to consider the matter, including Parliamentary debating time. any further action the House may take in respect of its consideration of the motion at this time. This issue has been discussed with the other parties over a significant period. It was first raised Debate adjourned on motion of Mr MICALLEF approximately two years ago when the honourable (Springvale). member for Bennettswood was the Leader of business for the Opposition. Various proposals have Debate adjourned until next day. been put forward in other Parliaments. One of the problems this House has is that none of the three PAPERS parties can be sure how long a particular deba te will take or a speech will go for. I remember when, for a Laid on table by Clerk: bet, one of my former colleagues, your predecessor, Mr Speaker, spoke for more than an hour on a Members of Parliament (Register of Interests) 1978- housing Bill. Indeed, like the racecourse in his Summary of Variations notified to 1 June 1992- electorate he went around the territory four or five Ordered to be printed times.

Parliamentary Committees Act 1968 - Government Speaking for more than an hour, which was not an response to the Natural Resources and Environment exception in those days, has become almost a Committee Report on the allocation of fish resources in challenge on even the smallest Bill. Sometimes Victorian bays and inlets, June 10, 1992. honourable members do not intend to speak in a debate but do so during the evening in a way that It It It It It cannot be controlled by the honourable members who control government business for their The following proclamations fixing operative dates respective parties. in respect of the following Acts pursuant to Order of the House dated 25 October 1988: The Federal Parliament has an arrangement that seems to work well and other Parliaments have Local Government (Consequential Provisions) Act similar arrangements. The Standing Orders 1989 -Section 9 and items 1.4, 9.1, 9.3, 9.4, 9.5, 9.11, Committee should address the issue. It has 9.14,9.16,9.43-9.50 (inclusive), 9.52, 9.53, 9.55,21.9, presented a report to Parliament that has been 21.10,33.13,47.1,47.3-47.6 (inclusive), 52.22, 57.10, carefully examined. I understand the other parties 57.11,96.1,96.2,96.3,107.23,107.30,107.38,115.8, are examining that report as well as an interim 122.19,122.25,132.11,132.12 of Schedule 2 and item 87 report and intend to have their views ready for of Schedule 3; 3 June 1992 (Gazette No. G21, 3 June, debate during the next sessional period. The 1992). government intends to issue prior to the next session a draft proposal containing a number of suggested Local Government (Elections) Act 1992 -Sections 1, 2, changes. 5,6,7,9-25 (inclusive); 3 June 1992 (Gazette No. G21, 3 June, 1992). In the meantime this issue needs to be considered by the Standing Orders Committee so that we can Police (Industrial Functions) Act 1992 - Whole Act; achieve orderly debates. That is not necessarily done 1 July 1992 (Gazette No. G21, 3 June, 1992). by simply setting down a starting time for a particular debate, because that may well result - FUNERAL DIRECTORS REGISTRATION BILL

Wednesday, 10 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2081 and honourable members have raised this with address the problems perceived in those me - in a debate which may be going strong and submissions. quite properly in a Parliamentary sense but which may be cut off because a particular time has been set Of course without legislative control, the ultimate down for another matter to resume. problem or risk to the consumer is the financial collapse of a funeral director and the loss of I hope the Standing Orders Committee can look at benefits - that is, the funeral- for which the experience elsewhere and as a consequence arrive at consumer has paid. The potential exists for this to recommendations that the House can consider. occur if the prepaid moneys are not managed properly or are not separated from the funeral Mr GUDE (Hawthorn) - The coalition has no director's own funds. difficulty with a review of the Standing Orders of the House. It is interesting, to say the least, that in its Currently there is no legislative control over the dying days the government starts to show taking and handling of prepaid moneys, so allowing inordinate interest in this area. One could be funeral directors who may be in financial difficulties excused for suggesting that this move is a to continue to operate and take prepaid money to preparation for opposition and that that is its key prop up their businesses, leaving the consumer at motivation rather than an improvement of the risk if the funeral director is bankrupted. Even if a operations of the House. financial collapse is foreseen, currently there is nothing that the government can do except watch it Nonetheless, in the spirit of the intent expressed in happen. the motion, the coalition believes no harm will be done and a great deal of good could be achieved by It is necessary to have some form of regulation to inquiring into the processes that apply in ensure: that funds paid for funerals actually go to an Parliaments in other States - and in other places, approved account; that an approved contract exists for that matter. The opposition is certainly prepared that lists the nature of the services to be provided; to work with honourable members from all sides of that the service is actually provided to the standard the House to achieve an appropriate set of by a registered funeral director; that adequate procedures within which the House can operate. In monitoring of the above occurs; that other that context, the opposition supports the motion. insurance-based products are not misrepresented as a prepaid funeral; and that management of existing Motion agreed to. prepaid funeral moneys be required to comply with the provisiOns within two years of the FUNERAL DIRECTORS commencement of the legislation. REGISTRATION BILL The Bill provides for registration of funeral directors. Second reading The funeral director is the point of contact with the consumer and the person who makes a commitment Mr KENNAN (Attorney-General) - I move: to provide the funeral and who accepts the money as prepayment for the future funeral. Only registered That this Bill be now read a second time. fuIleral directors will be allowed to take money for the prepayment of future funerals and the Bill places Prepaid funerals now account for about 30 per cent conditions on funeral directors in this regard. For of all funerals in Victoria and some estimates of the example, funeral directors must provide the amount of money in prepaid funds in the State are consumer with a contract setting out the standard of as high as $90 million. The increasing flow of money funeral he or she will receive and the cost of the into funeral funds and the potential for abuse service. This is essential because there is sometimes without the existence of legislative controls have a long interval between prepayment for a funeral resul ted in calls for legisla tion. and the death of the consumer and fulfilment of the contract. The price will be fixed by the contract and Last year in response to the concern the government except where additional services are requested there released a discussion paper for public comment. can be no increase in cost. After reviewing the submissions that were received and after discussions with various interested parties, There is also a requirement on the funeral director the proposed legislation has been prepared to that the money paid for the future funeral be invested in certain financial institutions or funeral FUNERAL DIRECTORS REGISTRATION BILL

2082 ASSEMBLY Wednesday, 10 June 1992 funds. This is to ensure that prepaid money is member and consumer member. The board will secured outside the funeral director's business and register funeral directors and inquire into matters that the funeral director does not have access to the with regard to the funeral directors registration, money before the funeral is delivered. The Bill also including compliance with the conditions. Following limits the investment choices to what are considered an inquiry the board can take diSCiplinary action secure investments and, in the case of the financial against a funeral director in certain instances. collapse of the funeral director, the money will still be invested and available to the consumer who This Bill also adds the Funeral Directors Registration could then transfer the benefit to another fWleral Act 1992 to the schedule to the Ministry of director to provide a fWleral. There has been much Consumer Affairs Act. This will have the effect of consideration of the investment choices currently conferring on the Ministry's inspectors the powers of available and the requirements set out in the Bill inspection of the Consumer Affairs Act to assist in have been carefully drafted to ensure that there is no the monitoring and enforcement of the provisions of interference with present legitimate investment the Funeral Directors Registration Act. practice of the industry. Some important transitional provisions are included This Bill allows the Ministry of Consumer Affairs to in the Bill. For example, the Bill deems a person or recognise the existing legislative checks and balances firm which has been carrying on a business for at that have been conducted wlder other legislation in least six months and which has applied for approving funeral funds established wlder the registration to be a registered fWleral director. Victorian Friendly Societies Act 1984 and capital guaranteed life insurance policies under the Life It also requires funeral directors to comply with the Insurance Act 1945. There is provision for a trustee investment requirements of the Act for prepaid that has no connection with a funeral director to be contracts entered into before the commencement of approved for the establishment of a funeral fund, the Act and under which a funeral has not been provided the trustee complies with certain provided. A period of two years has been allowed guidelines. This will enable certain funds which for compliance in this regard, and I have been given operate with certain prudential controls and which, to understand that funeral directors consider that in many cases, are already successfully operating to that is a reasonable time for investments to be continue their operations. rearranged without causing the financial ruin of a funeral director. Investments must be made in the name of the individual consumer and within 14 days the funeral I am convinced that this Bill, which will be funded director must provide to the consumer copies of by the registration fees and which will incur no cost documentation from the financial institution to show to the government, will provide the legislative that the money has been invested in accordance with control necessary to ensure that the consumer's the contract. investment is secured with the minimum of disruption to the industry. The consumer may transfer or assign the benefit of the investment to the funeral director in payment for I commend the Bill to the House. the fWleral. However, the Bill prohibits the funeral director from accessing that money until the funeral Debate adjourned on motion of Mr GUDE has been provided. The Bill also prohibits fwleral (Hawthorn). directors from accepting a commission for investing the prepaid money. There are other conditions with Mr KENNAN (Attorney-General) - I move: which the funeral director has to comply in order tha t the consumer can make an informed decision That the debate be adjourned until Wednesday, 24 June. about a prepaid investment and in order to provide a system that the government can monitor and Mr MACLELLAN (Berwick) - I have been enforce. approached by the Exclusive Brethren about this Bill. I ask the Attorney-General to indicate whether it The Bill establishes a Funeral Directors Registration is his intention to resume debate on the second Board. The board will have a chairperson and reading in the spring sessional period or whether it members drawn from the industry and consumers. will be held over until after the election. It will be constituted either as the chairperson sitting alone or with the chairperson and an industry BORROWING AND INVESTMENT POWERS (MMBW) BILL

Wednesday, 10 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2083

Mr KENNAN (Attorney-General) (By leave)­ MEDICAL TREATMENT (AGENTS) BILL We hope to resume debate at the beginning of the next sessional period. Second reading

Motion agreed to and debate adjourned until Mrs SETCHES (Minister for Community Wednesday, 24 June. Services) - I move:

BORROWING AND INVESTMENT That this Bill be now read a second time. POWERS (MMBW) BILL This Bill addresses a problem that has arisen in Second reading connection with the operation of the Medical Treatment Act 1988. The Medical Treatment Act is Mr ROPER (Minister for Employment, one of the more Significant pieces of legislation that Post-Secondary Education and Training) - I move: has been enacted in recent years relating to the rights of patients. It sets out to clarify the law as it That this Bill be now read a second time. applies to the capacity of patients to refuse medical treatment. The Bill makes provision for a new borrowing limi t to apply to Melbourne Water. As originally enacted the legislation did two things. Firstly, it prohibited a doctor treating a patient if that Honourable members will remember that patient had been informed about the nature of his or Melbourne Water has an existing debt limit of her condition and had decided to refuse treatment $3400 million passed by Parliament in December for that condition, provided that a medical 1989. This limit has provided sufficient flexibility to practitioner and another person had witnessed a enable Melbourne Water to manage its operations. refusal of medical treatment certificate. Secondly, it However, in the 1991 merger of six water authorities protected a doctor who withdrew, or declined to with the Melbourne and Metropolitan Board of provide treatment on the basis of such a certificate. Works, Melbourne Water assumed additional debt from the merged authorities of approximately Honourable members will recall that the Act was $315 million. extended in 1990. The thrust of the changes made by the amending legislation was to enable a person to The assumed debt was not raised under Melbourne appoint an agent to make medical decisions on that and Metropolitan Board of Works powers or person's behalf in certain circumstances. Such an approvals under the Borrowing and Investment agent must be appointed by way of an enduring Powers Act. However, refinancing of the borrowings power of attorney (medical treatment) and can make because of their maturity or as a result of debt decisions only in the event of the donor of the power management to reduce ongoing funding costs will becoming incompetent. result in the replacement debt issued by Melbourne Water being included within the current debt limits The Act contains a number of safeguards to prevent under the Borrowing and Investment Powers Act. the misuse of an enduring power of attorney (medical treatment). These include a capacity for the An increase in the limit by $300 million from power to be suspended or revoked by the $3400 million to $3700 million is necessary to enable Guardianship and Administration Board. Melbourne Water to maintain its current flexibility to manage its operations. As currently drafted, the Act contemplates the appointment by a donor of only one agent to act on I commend the Bill to the House. his or her behalf. The problem which has arisen and which I mentioned earlier is that some people have Debate adjourned on motion of Mr STOCK DALE sought to appoint more than one agent. For (Brighton). example, a husband and wife might execute an enduring power of attorney (medical treatment) Debate adjourned until Wednesday, 24 June. exercisable by the other. However if, say, both are seriously injured in the same motor car accident, no-one with the necessary legal authority would be available to make decisions about medical care on their behalf. MEDICAL TREATMENT (AGENTS) BILL

2084 ASSEMBLY Wednesday, 10 June 1992

With such a prospect in mind, advice given to the all the members of the committee for the work they government is that a number of people have did. The committee addressed a very difficult topic expressed a wish to appoint an alternate, such as and came up with sensible and logical responses to another member of the family or a friend, who could the questions raised. make decisions if the principal agent were w1available or unable to act. The current legal basis The Medical Treatment Act, which was based on the for the appointment of an alternate agent is, at best, findings of the Social Development Committee, questionable. Nevertheless, because an alternate allows individuals to refuse medical treatment. For agent may be called upon to make life or death example, someone who is suffering from cancer can decisions on behalf of the donor, it is essential that decide that he or she no longer wants to receive there should be no doubt as to the law underpinning certain treatment and can advise his or her doctor his or her appointment. accordingly. All the parties involved are protected under the Act so that no blame can be apportioned This Bill is designed to amend the Medical to the doctors, the nurses or the hospitals involved. Treatment Act to enable both an agent and an In short, the Act allows individuals to choose alternate to be appointed under an enduring power whether to continue to receive medical treatment. of attorney (medical treatment). It also sets out the circumstances wlder which an altemate is The Medical Treatment (Enduring Power of authorised to sign a refusal of medical treatment Attorney) Act, which was proclaimed in 1989, certificate. Consequential changes are made to the extended the provisions of the Medical Treatment jurisdiction of the Guardianship and Administration Act by recognising that persons may not always be Board to enable issues relating to the exercise of the competent to make decisions about whether to powers of an altemate as well as the principal agent refuse medical treatment. The Act allows a person to be resolved by the board. who, for whatever reason, is unable to spell out his or her views to be represented by an agent who can It is important to emphasise that this Bill will not convey to the doctors concerned that person's wish change the fundamental nature of the Medical to refuse medical treatment. Treatment Act nor weaken any of the existing safeguards built into the legislation. Rather its aim is The Bill is the next step in the process. The operation to put beyond doubt that those members of the of the Medical Treatment (Enduring Power of community who wish to appoint both an agent and Attorney) Act has identified circumstances in which an altemate to act in their interests at a time when the appointment of a single agent is not sufficient - they are unable to make their own decisions are and I shall give the House some examples to legally capable of doing so. complement those outlined by the Minister in her second-reading speech. The Bill provides for the I commend the Bill to the House. appointment of more than one agent - a secondary or alternate agent - who can act when a principal Or NAPTHINE (Portland) - The change in the agent is either unavailable or incompetent to do so. order of business is fortuitous because, as the Such circumstances can arise when, for example, the honourable member for Balwyn pointed out, it agent dies before the person he or she has been would have been totally inappropriate to deal with appointed to represent. the Funeral Directors Registration Bill immediately before the Medical Treatment (Agents) Bill! As the The Medical Treatment (Agents) Bill will provide for shadow Minister for Health, the Honourable Marie the appointment of an alternate agent to make Tehan, has said, the Bill and the Medical Treatment decisions about the medical treatment of a person if Act have nothing to do with euthanasia in any way, that person should become incompetent and shape or form, so that notion can be set aside by problems should arise in contacting the principal honourable members and the general community. agent. In her second-reading speech the Minister referred to the common occurrence of a husband and The issues dealt with in the Bill differ Significantly wife appointing each other as agents under enduring from the issue of euthanasia. The Bill continues the powers of attorney. If both partners were seriously work done by the Social Development Committee, injured in a motor car accident, neither of them which in 1987 published a report on options for would be able to make proper decisions about the dying with dignity. The report has been recognised treatment of his or her partner. An unconscious not only throughout Australia but throughout the person who, when conscious and competent, had world as a significant document, and I congratulate expressed certain views about medical treatment MEDICAL TREATMENT (AGENTS) BILL

Wednesday, 10 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2085 would be unable to have those views expressed and departmental officers and Parliamentary Counsel, the appointed agent, if seriously injured, would be all of whom worked hard in attempting to improve unable to make those decisions. Similar problems the wording of the proposed legislation. would arise if either the husband or the wife were killed in the accident. The Bill provides for a second In the original draft "and" was changed to "or" in or alternate agent to act on behalf of the person to proposed section SAA(2)(b )(i) and the phrase "was provide further protection. able and available to act" was amended to "can be contacted and is not incompetent" in subparagraph A person may giver someone an enduring power of (ii). Those amendments have considerably improved attorney in 1992 but by the year 2000, some eight the Bill. As it is a difficult area for which to legislate, years later, the agent may be overseas, may be some issues may emerge that will lead to more unable to be contacted, or may be incompetent. The problems. I believe we, as legislators, together with husband or wife may be in a nursing home and not Parliamentary Counsel and departmental officers, physically or mentally competent to make decisions have done as much as we can to get the measure for his or her partner. A friend may be appointed, right. The legislation must now go out into the field but in the intervening years the friends may have to enable any problems that arise when it is drifted apart and the agent may be unable to be implemented to be identified. I do not resile from contacted. In a number of cases the appointment of the fact that the legislation may need to be returned one only agent will not produce the result desired by to Parliament for further modification. Some cases the person who appointed the agent, so the person may go to court for interpretation of certain will not receive appropriate medical treatment provisions. Although that will be disappointing for under the principles associated with providing an the individuals concerned, the House and the enduring power of attorney. community must recognise that it is difficult legislation to get right the first time. Honourable The Bill recognises that fact and introduces members can only attempt to reduce the ambiguity progressive legislative developments. I do not and confusion of the Bill and to make Parliament's suggest that the Bill is necessarily the end of the intentions clear. When the measure is out in the field development of such legislation. The community the community may identify certain problems that will identify certain provisions of the Bill that need will need to be addressed by further legislation. to be tightened up and improved. It is important that the Bill clearly set out the different roles The intent of Parliament is clear. The Medical expected of the principal and alternate agents. I Treatment Act proposes a system whereby a person suggest that the Bill does that reasonably well. can nominate a principal agent to make decisions on his or her behalf on the refusal of medical treatment. In most cases the principal agent will have the power to make decisions; only if he or she is This Bill provides for a person to appoint an unavailable, unable to be contacted, incompetent or alternate agent. If for various reasons the principal deceased will the second or alternate agent come agent is unable to act after every effort has been into play. The Bill clearly specifies the circumstances made to find him or her, the alternate agent can act where the alternate agent will be required to make in his or her stead. That is the principle behind the decisions. legislation and I hope the Bill truly reflects that aim. Honourable members have made vigorous attempts Clause 6, which proposes to insert section SAA into to allow the provisions to reflect that principle so the principal Act, provides some detail. It is not easy that the intention of Parliament is made clear to the to describe the circumstances in which an alternate community, the courts and to people to whom the agent can act, but I suggest clause 6 makes a legislation is directed. reasonable fist of it. The Bill is a welcome addition to current legislation The Bill originally introduced in the other place and is the logical consequence of the all-party contained many provisions and phrases that have Parliamentary Social Development Committee's been changed. Many aspects of the first draft Bill report, which widely canvassed those issues. The were unclear, ambiguous or confuSing. It was steps in the development of the legislation have been extremely difficult to ensure that the intent of the Medical Treatment Act and the Medical Parliament would be reflected properly in the Treatment (Enduring Power of Attorney) Act and legislation. I commend the Honourable Marie now this Bill, which will amend the existing Tehan, the honourable member for Balwyn, MEDICAL TREATMENT (AGENTS) BILL

2086 ASSEMBLY Wednesday, 10 June 1992 legislation by providing for the appointment of agreed that the legislation was necessary and filled a alternate agents. void in the community.

Finally, it is incumbent upon the government and As the honourable member for Portland pointed out, those involved in administering the law to make the situation with the Medical Treatment (Enduring every endeavour to publicise the new legislation to Power of Attorney) Act is different. If a duly let people who have already given others enduring appointed agent has died, is incompetent or is powers of attorney know about the roles of principal unavailable, a person who is unable to make his or and alternate agents so that they can revisit their her own decisions is left in an invidious position. appointments in light of the option of having both a The Medical Treatment (Agents) Bill rectifies that principal and an alternate agent. situation. The purpose of the Bill states:

People need to be made aware of both pieces of The purpose of this Act is to enable a person to appoint legislation to enable them to make provision of this an alternate agent to make decisions about the medical sort in their wills or in powers of attorney dealing treatment of the person if the person becomes with their finances. A person should seriously incompetent and the agent is unable or unavailable to consider whether to give power of attorney for act. medical treatment while he or she is fully competent. Even in youth one should think about With the amendments that have already been made planning for the future. in the other place, the Bill fills the void. It is better legislation than it was when it was introduced. The Bill is a welcome addition to the current provisions, and I wish it a speedy passage. An educative process should now be undertaken to inform people about the proviSions of what will Mr MAUGHAN (Rodney) - I support the become the Medical Treatment (Enduring Power of remarks made by the honourable member for Attorney) Act. This is enlightened legislation that Portland. When I came to this place the Social flows from the profound work that the Social Development Committee had recently presented its Development Committee carried out three years ago. report. As the honourable member for Portland correctly said, it is a well-reasoned report and one Mr CLARK (Balwyn) - The operative provisions that has been widely accepted. of the legislation fall into two parts. The first part extends the operation of the agency provisions of the I pay tribute to all the members of the Social principal Act to allow for the appointment of an Development Committee at that time, who went alternate agent, as outlined by previous speakers in through personal agony in establishing their the debate. The second part corrects an error in the positions. As a result of that report and the public principal Act that prevented a patient who regained discussion that followed, the Medical Treatment Bill consciousness or regained competence from was passed. I supported that legislation, as I revoking a refusal of treatment that had been put in supported the Medical Treatment (Enduring Power place by an agent or a guardian. of Attorney) Bill, which was landmark legislation. The Parliament should take pride in having The legislation arrives in this place considerably introduced that legislation. improved by the work carried out in another place. Congratulations should be extended to the shadow I organised a seminar in Echuca to inform my Minister for Health on her diligence and electorate of the provisiOns of the Medical Treatment perseverance in ensuring that several serious defects Act. A member of the Social Development in the original legislation were remedied. Committee attended the seminar and explained how Congratulations should also be extended to the he had changed his position as he learnt more about Minister for allowing the process of improvement to the issues. A doctor, a lawyer and people of three take place and for introdUCing the amendments that different shades of religious opinion were in the were made as a result of the initiatives of the audience of 60 or 70 people. None of them went shadow Minister. away from that meeting with exactly the same view as he or she had come with. They all learnt A tribute should also be paid to the work of the staff something, changed their views and approached the of Health Department Victoria who have been issue with goodwill. Almost without exception they involved with the legislation. I refer to Drs Whiting and Russell, who went to great lengths to ensure MEDICAL TREATMENT (AGENTS) BILL

Wednesday, 10 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2087 that the points that were put to them were medical treatment on behalf of the persons who adequately dealt with. The work carried out by appoint them. However, I strongly disagree with the Parliamentary Counsel should also be commended way that is done in existing legislation and the way because the set of amendments that came back to the that process is being extended by the Bill. The power coalition were well drafted in the context in which of an agent to make decisions about medical they were prepared and met almost all of the treatment should be conferred by a power of concerns that had been raised. attorney under the Instruments Act - in other words, either the general form in the Instruments The conduct of Health Department Victoria in this Act at present or a parallel form which relates only case makes a pleasant contrast to the conduct of the to medical treatment matters but which is otherwise department when the legislation was passed in 1988 in the normal form of an enduring power of attorney. and 1990. At that time the reconunendations of the Social Development Committee were hijacked by a A power of attorney under the Instruments Act group of ideologues both inside and outside the would empower the agent to authorise medical department who took what could conceivably have treatment, not just refuse it; and it would be fully formed the basis of acceptable legislation and and squarely in the context of the general law. That proceeded to introduce legislation that was a long would make it clear that the normal duties of an way from being acceptable. Whether that was due to agent applied and that the agent was not authorised reckless folly and disregard for the dangers or due to to exercise the power conferred on him or her with ulterior motives I cannot tell, but the result was an the intention of bringing about the death of the unsatisfactory process in which the department patient. That is a grave defect in the medical refused to take any responsible legal advice and trea tment legislation. refused, so far as I know, to consult with Parliamentary Counsel about the legal concerns that I add that worthwhile safeguards could be were raised. It presented feeble and trite responses incorporated regarding the manner in which a to many of the concerns expressed. general power of attorney is authorised and executed and the way in which it is subsequently It is pleasing to note that other jurisdictions in dealt with, in line with some of the Australia are aVOiding the pitfalls into which the reconunendations of the Law Reform Commission, Victorian legislation has fallen. I welcome the which I shall touch upon shortly. It would be far change in attitude of Health Department Victoria more preferable to have enduring powers of since the 1988 and 1990 legislation. I understand the attorney in that context rather than in the spedfic principal protagonists of the earlier legislation have context of refusal of treatment because in that now left the department, one going to the private specific context the powers under the Act are sector and the other to another part of the public extremely dangerous. sector. By contrast, both Drs Whiting and Russell have been most helpful and constructive. Unfortunately the Bill must be assessed, as I said earlier, in the context of the Act it amends, and I am However, the Bill comes in the context of legislation opposed to the clauses in the Bill that extend the that has been enacted in the past and it must be operation of the agency proviSions. The same defects assessed in that context. The shadow Minister and that apply to the prindpal Act apply to the others have dealt with most of the drafting defects of extensions made by the Bill. Those provisiOns in the the Bill as initially introduced, and I would say Bill will simply allow the dangers inherent in the something like 90 per cent of those defects has been principal Act to arise in a wider range of picked up and reflected in the amendments. circumstances.

I still have some reservations about provisions The reasons for my opposition can be placed in two relating to the Guardianship and Administration categories. The first is what most people would Board, not because of the precise wording that has consider to be the purely moral issue of allowing an been adopted in the Bill but because the provisions intention of bringing about the death of a patient. make the legislation extremely complex and because The principal Act allows agents and guardians to the role of the board under this legislation will exercise powers in a homicidal manner for reasons I continue to cause problems in the future. set out at length in my remarks on the 1990 Bill. I do not intend to repeat them in any detail. I simply say At the outset I say that I have no objection to the that the scope of the inununity conferred by concept of allowing agents to make decisions about section 9 in conjunction with the loose wording of MEDICAL TREATMENT (AGENTS) BILL

2088 ASSEMBLY Wednesday, 10 June 1992 the "other laws" provision in section 4(3)(b) and the I authorise my agent to make decisions about medical general grounds under which an agent can make a treatment on my behalf. decision set out in section 5(2) lead to the conclusion that the Act allows an agent or guardian to refuse One can imagine the context in which someone says treatment with the intention of bringing about the to granny, mum or dad, '1ust sign this power of death of the patient concerned. attorney and we will make sure you are looked after and get proper treatment when you are in hospital". Leaving aside the question of whether, given that Whether or not there is malice or bad faith on the such a killing is immoral, the law should make it part of the people who say that, granny, mum or illegal, I say that at least the law should not punish a dad could sign the power thinking it was simply to person who intervenes to prevent either a suicide or ensure proper medical treatment would be given a homicide. However that is what the principal Act without being aware of the additional serious power does and that is what the Bill will allow to happen in to refuse treatment that was being conferred by the a wider range of cases. piece of paper being signed.

My second ground for objection to this scheme of In that context I refer to a discussion paper and a legislation is a more practical one, whether one report issued by the Law Reform Commission in characterises it as a moral objection or not. In my April and August 1990 after the 1990 amendments to view the legislation creates a great danger that the Act were passed in that year. The commission patients will be killed against their will and without did not consider medical powers of attorney but their consent. That danger is exacerbated by a considered general powers of attorney and made number of defects in the drafting and operation of what I consider to be some sound observations. I do the principal Act as it is to be extended by this Bill. not always agree with what the Law Reform Commission says but in this instance it is on the I shall mention a few aspects of the dangers that are right track. The reports deal with a number of issues created. The first is that no real warning is given to relating to the giving of powers of attorney. The first the person who gives an enduring power of attorney issue is: (medical treatment) about the nature of the authority that that person is giving to the agent. The Act has a Is the donor competent to give an enduring power of schedule that states in bland terms: attorney?

I authorise my agent to make decisions about medical One of the proposals contained in the discussion treatment on my behalf. paper is:

That statement contains nothing about refusal of The test of competence should be included in the medical treatment or about taking action to bring material read to the donor. The donor should be aware about the death of the patient concerned. It contains of the size of the estate. The donor should be informed no warning of the scope conferred by this measure. that the attorney will have total control of the estate. The donor should therefore be made aware that the That is in stark contrast to the steps that legislators attorney should be a person whom the donor trusts. take in other contexts to ensure that people are fully aware of the danger or the seriousness of a step The Law Reform Commission goes on to discuss the being contemplated. To see that one need only question: contemplate the health warnings on cigarette packets, where the proposal is now that the warning Is the donor free from undue influence? should no longer be in relatively small print; the matter is serious enough for the warning to be put in It says: large and bold type. Similarly, with consumer protection laws we go to great lengths to ensure that The second problem is that even if the donor is credit contracts are expressed in plain English and competent to give an enduring power of attorney, he or that people taking out loans are fully aware of what she may be unduly pressured by relatives or friends they are letting themselves in for. However, this into giving such a power, and may not even serious matter, regardless of what one thinks about understand its true significance. its merits, is simply covered in that line and a half: With respect to the risk of not understanding, the commission suggests that an enduring power of MEDICAL TREATMENT (AGENTS) BILL

Wednesday, IQ June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2089

attorney should commence with a clear explanation of This is in relation to powers of attorney that do not what it signifies. This should include a statement that it relate to life or death matters. They are important hands over to the attorney the power to manage the matters of people's financial affairs and donor's affairs and that it will continue in force even management and can involve lifestyle decisions, but when the donor becomes unable to manage his or her not life and death matters. If the Law Reform own affairs. The donor should acknowledge that he or Commission recommends such clear safeguards in she has read the explanation or had it read to him or relation to a general enduring power of attorney, all her before giving the power. The witnesses should be the more should we include clear safeguards in an required to certify that the donor has done so. enduring power of attorney for medical treatment purposes. The commission goes on to propose: The second danger created by the scheme in the Bill An enduring power of attorney should commence with is that there is no protection against action that a a clear explanation of its nature and effect. The donor person may attempt to take under a revoked power should acknowledge that he or she has read the of attorney. Powers of attorney can be signed and explanation or had it read to him or her, before signing handed over to the attorneys and then later they can the power. The witnesses should be required to certify be revoked orally or by notice in public newspapers that the donor has done so. and in various other ways, but those means of revocation do not ensure that the document comes Those protections are missing from the principal Act back into the hands of the donor. There is a and will be missing from the Act as it is amended by document that appears to be a valid power of this Bill. attorney in the hands of an individual, with no safeguards to ensure that, if the person who has When the Law Reform Commission gave its report given and subsequently revoked that power of on enduring powers of attorney, which it then attorney should end up in hospital, that other person referred to as enduring powers of management, it will not come along and attempt to exercise the set out as a schedule to its report a recommended power conferred by the revoked power of attorney. standard form of enduring power of management, and I commend that form to all honourable Given the seriousness of this matter I suggest that members because of the pains it takes to ensure that there should be a register of medical treatment a person giving such a serious power is fully aware powers of attorney to ensure that abuse does not of what he or she is doing. occur.

I refer to some of the text proposed to be included in The third area concerns the authority given to agents an enduring power of management. The first part is: and guardians to refuse treatment, based on mere presumptions about what the patient concerned By completing this document, you give power to a wants. Refusal can be based upon whether the agent person to manage all or part of your financial affairs, considers that the patient would consider the either immediately or at a future time. You can also treatment unwarranted, and the experience in the give the person power to make domestic decisions on United States has shown that statements made by your behalf such as where to live and whether to go on people when they are healthy, fit and well are often a holiday. The power endures even if you become taken out of context when a decision about medical incompetent. treatment arises and the person concerned is gravely ill and unable to speak for himself or herself. Later on above the Signature clause the commission proposes the words: It can be replied that people should ensure that, when they appoint someone, that person is fully I understand that if I sign this document or have it briefed and understands their wishes, but that point signed at my direction I am giving my manager full applies only in relation to agents, not guardians. power to act on my behalf, except for any limits set out Further, there is no mechanism in the Bill to allow in this document. the wishes of the donor to be placed on record in the power of attorney either as binding instructions or Then in bold letters is the warning: simply as statements of wishes that should be taken into account by the agent. Do not sign this form unless you understand what it means. MEDICAL TREATMENT (AGENTS) BILL

2090 ASSEMBLY Wednesday, 10 June 1992

I have noted one of the cameo case studies in a Finally, in terms of the deficiencies of the scheme of recent report to Parliament by the Office of the things, there is the blanket immunity conferred on Public Advocate. It deals with a person who is given medical practitioners and others by section 9 of the an enduring power of attorney, and indicates that principal Act, which puts all the incentives in the steps have been taken to have a statement of the wrong direction. It creates the impression that as wishes of that person held by the Office of the Public long as you get the paperwork filled out properly Advocate in conjunction with the power of attorney that is as far as the concern of medical practitioners itself, even though the statutory scheme does not and others need go. envisage that limitations can be placed on these powers of attorney. If that practice is being adopted In the context of the reputable public hospital or the by the Office of the Public Advocate, there seems to reputable private hospital, one would hope that be all the more reason for it to be reflected in the most if not all doctors would carry out their duties legislation. The Law Reform Commission report to diligently, and if there were any doubts they would which I referred earlier, in the context of enduring take the issues to the Guardianship and powers of management, recommends that option Administration Board, as the notes on the refusal expressly, and it contains draft provisions in which form recommend. the donor of the power can choose to specify that the agent can do anything that the donor could lawfully However, since the passage of the Act in 1990 there do in relation to managing "only the following has been a continuous series of press reports on financial and domestic affairs", and there is space to concern about abuses that have taken place in set them out. nursing homes. There have been reports by the Guardianship and Administration Board on "elder Conversely, it includes a clause to limit the power of abuse" and the board has referred to elderly people managers, and the donor can specify, "However the being forced to hand over their worldly goods to manager does not have power to ... " and can then set relatives. Unfortunately, the board has not taken the out the express exclusions. By contrast, no such logical further step of raising similar concerns in the power is given to a donor in the scheme created by context of refusal of medical treatment legislation. the Bill, and that is a serious deficiency. We have also heard serious concerns about the Furthermore, the legislation includes no clear rights of psychiatric patients, and it could well be sanction in respect of deliberate abuse and misuse of that they are another category of persons who are the authority conferred by the Bill. For example, vulnerable to abuse under the legislation; yet despite there is no sanction in respect of a dishonest or this public record of the dangers this blanket reckless completion of a statement in a refusal immunity is conferred on people who act in certificate by an agent or guardian where he or she accordance with the paperwork, so long as it is states that he or she believes the patient would properly filled out. request that no medical treatment or only medical treatment of a particular kind be administered. Some time ago the guardianship board indicated that it would prepare a report on the operation of As other commentators have pointed out, that the Medical Treatment Act and enduring powers of absence of sanction is not only a defect in itself, it attorney and guardianship orders. Many months also means that it would be extremely difficult, if at have passed since that statement of intent was all possible, to successfully prosecute someone who published but we have yet to see a report on this deliberately misused the power conferred on him or part of the operation of the Bill. I look forward to her either as an agent or as a guardian, without any seeing it in due course. I express my regret that the genuine belief in the wishes of the patient, to bring guardianship board has not published that about the death of that patient. assessment so that Parliament is in a position to review the legislation it has enacted. Similarly, there is no sanction in the Bill against a deliberate false completion of a statutory declaration Even though I expect the House to pass the Bill as it in the form provided for in the Bill. There may be stands, I wish to place on record the fact that I am sanctions available from other contexts that could opposed to those provisions of the Bill that extend apply, but it would be preferable if a sanction were the operation of the agency provisions of the set out in the legislation. principal Act. I am opposed to agency powers not in principle but because they have been placed in the NATIONAL PARKS (FURTHER MISCELLANEOUS AMENDMENT) BILL

Wednesday, to June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2091 flawed context of the medical treatment legislation It is recognised across the world that this Parliament as it currently stands. has made a creditable attempt to deal with an extremely important matter that some people have I shall also comment on the other substantive area of to deal with during their lives. It is of grave concern the Bill, clause 9, and the corresponding provisions to some people that they may have to act as either in the schedule, that remedy one of the serious principal or alternate agents in matters that involve oversights in the principal legislation. I am pleased people who are near and dear to them. that the defect is being remedied. The fact that it got through reinforces the point I was making earlier The work of the Social Development Committee has about the reckless haste and oblivion to danger with been of an enormously high standard. The issues it which the legislation was pushed through in the first was prepared to look into and ask people's advice place. on in the resolution of these matters resulted in an extremely good social examination of matters that The defect to which I am referring prevented a some people would prefer not to face from time to patient, who regained consciousness and time. competence and found that medical treatment had been refused on his behalf by an agent or guardian, I for one am thankful that the committee did such a revoking the refusal of treatment by the agent or good job of ensuring that people have the guardian. I should have thought that that would be opportunity of appointing both principal agents and a fundamental right of exercise of a patient's alternate agents. When it comes down to it, it is only autonomy. Clause 9 makes it clear that the an instrument by which people are able to order revocation can be made by the person on whose their lives in a sensible way. It is a legitimate wish of behalf the certificate was given - in other words, by a person nearing the end of his or her life to die with the patient. The wording in Schedule 3 has been dignity. I am pleased that the opposition has amended to include reference to the patient supported the Bill. completing the notice of cancellation. That is a most welcome amendment and it should be brought into Motion agreed to. effect with all possible speed. Read second time. The right of a patient to exercise autonomy and to appoint someone else to make medical treatment Passed remaining stages. decisions on his or her behalf within the context of the general law and within the range of what is NATIONAL PARKS (FURTHER lawful medical practice is not fundamentally a MISCELLANEOUS AMENDMENT) BILL contentious issue. However, it is regrettable that this issue has led to legislation that suffers from the Second reading defects to which I have referred. I hope this government or a future government will act quickly Mr HARROWFIELD (Minister for Finance) - I to review the legislation and remedy the dangers move: that I have referred to, thereby laying to rest what should be a very simple issue. That this Bill be now read a second time.

Mrs SETCHES (Minister for Community Since coming to office in 1982 the Labor government Services) - I thank honourable members opposite has undertaken a major program to establish a for their comments on this important piece of world-class representative system of parks. That has legislation. As they have said, this is a creditable and involved 12 amending Acts implementing Land honest attempt to deal in a sensitive way with Conservation Council recommendations which have matters that we thought we had right in the increased the area managed under the National begiruting. It deals with the fact that the appointing Parks Act from 985 000 hectares in 1982 to more than of a principal agent may sometimes not be sufficient 2.8 million hectares. That expansion of the park because of circumstances that arise in the ordinary system has been supplemented by a program to course of people's lives. Some cases can be enlarge existing parks by adding land obtained by extremely sad - when, for example, the principal purchase, exchange or donation. The Bill further agent cannot carry out action consented to. expands the park system by implementing several Land Conservation Council recommendations and NATIONAL PARKS (FURTHER MISCELLANEOUS AMENDMENT) BILL

2092 ASSEMBLY Wednesday, 10 June 1992 adding areas obtained through the land purchase Notable additions include: program and other sources. the addition to Churchill National Park of 78 This Bill has four major objects: to create Enfield hectares known as King's Land, which will State Park and Mount Granya State Park as contribute significantly to a link of open space recommended by the Land Conservation Council; to between Churchill National Park and Lysterfield add Significant and substantial areas to 19 national, Park in the rapidly expanding outer-eastern State and other parks, obtained through land suburbs; purchase and donation; to amend the leasing provisions for the commercial facilities at Mount the addition to Lysterfield Park of 128 hectares of Buffalo National Park to permit their operation by land purchased to protect excellent remnant private enterprise; and to increase the nwnber of forest and to provide a link between the park and penalty units prescribed for offences under the Act. public land along the Monbulk Creek; and

CREATION OF ENFIELD STATE PARK AND the addition to Werribee Gorge State Park of 200 MOUNT GRANY A STATE PARK hectares of purchased land will increase the size of the park by one-third and add Significantly to Enfield State Park, just 20 kilometres south of the conservation and recreation values of the park. Ballarat, is a valuable addition to Victoria's parks system in an area where native vegetation is now These additions are important steps towards not common or extensive. Its dry, dissected hills achieving targets outlined in the government's State support a diversity of plants, including more than 60 conservation strategy and Melbourne's open space species of orchids, a major occurrence of the rare strategy, and the aims of the Open Space 2000 Yarra gwn and the endemic Enfield grevillea. For program. Government land purchases will also add many years Enfield has also been a popular location significant areas to Otway National Park, Warby for bushwalking, camping, orienteering and nature Range State Park, French Island State Park and Kara observation. Visitors are also attracted to the park Kara State Park. A donation from the Ross Trust is and its surrounds to view the many relics of the largely responsible for the addition of 110 hectares of district's rich gold history. The proposed park land to the Arthurs Seat State Park. contains one pre-existing miners right claim, which will continue in line with existing legislation. The EXCISIONS FROM PARKS Bill also provides for recreational fossicking to continue in the park as recommended by the Land Two small areas totalling 19 hectares are to be Conservation Council. excised from French Island State Park: one is currently being used by the residents of French Mount Granya State Park in the State's north-east Island as a tip and has been for many years; the was originally recommended by the Land other was cleared prior to the declaration of the park Conservation Council in 1973 and again in the and has never been managed as part of the park. An North-Eastern Area (Benalla-Upper Murray) Review area of 40 square metres, which is used as a traffic in 1986. The park will add to the system of parks in roundabout, is to be excised from the Langwarrin the scenic upper Murray area. Because of its Flora and Fauna Reserve. The description of the proximity to the growing centre of Albury-Wodonga reserve is also amended to remove another area, it will provide additional opportunities for which is part of the Frankston International small increasing nwnbers of visitors to enjoy the natural bore rifle range and which was incorrectly included a ttractions of the region. in the reserve when it was reserved.

ADDmONS TO PARKS LEASING PROVISIONS AT MOUNT BUFFALO NATIONAL PARK The Bill adds some 2875 hectares to 6 national parks, 10 State parks and 3 parks. A feature of the additions The Bill amends the provisions in the Act which is the nwnber and size of the areas purchased by the allow the Mount Buffalo Chalet, ski lifts and tows to government, particularly for addition to parks close be leased to the Victorian Tourism Commission or a to Melbourne. Others result from donation or Land subSidiary company for a period of 20 years. The Conservation Council recommendations. changes enable a lease to be granted to a private company as approved by the Minister and extend the area leased to include Tatra Inn, Keown Lodge JURIES (AMENDMENT) BILL (No. 2)

Wednesday, 10 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2093 and the associa ted ski tows and ski fields known as Debate adjourned until Wednesday, 24 June. Cresta and Dingo Dell. The 20-year maximum term relating to the existing Mount Buffalo leasing JURIES (AMENDMENT) BILL (No. 2) provision is retained in the amended provision. Second reading There are a number of checks and balances to ensure that the values of Mount Buffalo National Park are Debate resumed from 21 May; motion of protected. Any lease will be subject to detailed Mr KENNAN (Attorney-General). conditions designed to facilitate commercial management while ensuring the protection of the Mrs WADE (Kew) - The purposes of the Bill as natural values of the park. The Minister may not introduced in another place were twofold: to abolish issue any lease without first receiving advice from indictments by grand juries and to further amend the National Parks Advisory Council. It is not the provisions of the Juries Act in relation to jurors. The government's intention to establish another ski provisions relating to the abolition of grand juries resort to compete with Falls Creek, Mount Hotham were removed by coalition amendments in another or Mount Buffalo. The government will ensure that place. The Attorney-General has indicated that he the current familiar setting at Mount Buffalo does not intend to reinstate those provisions in the National Park is essentially maintained. This Bill. I shall therefore refer only briefly to the amendment and the subsequent awarding of the coalition's position on grand juries in response to lease to the private sector is expected to substantially comments made by the Attorney-General in the reduce the future allocations of departmental funds second-reading debate. to the management of the ski fields at Mount Buffalo. This is not the first attempt by the Attorney-General OTHER AMENDMENTS to abolish grand juries; he made a previous attempt in 1987 after the McArdle case, which is well known The 1989 legislation that created the Alpine National to honourable members as a result of the efforts Park inadvertently and incorrectly included the made by the honourable member for Glen Waverley Benambra-Black Mountain Road, the Alpine Road, on behalf of Mr Ron Legge. the Omeo Highway, and the Benambra-Corryong Road. The Bill removes those roads from the park. In 1987 the opposition refused to agree to the abolition of grand juries without a proper inquiry The penalty units for offences under the Act are to taking place. The opposition appreciates that the be increased to a maximum of 20 penalty units or grand jury procedure is cumbersome, expensive and $2000. That restores parity with penalties for similar open to abuse and is therefore unsatisfactory. offences under allied Acts such as the Flora and However, in the event of the Director of Public Fauna Guarantee Act and the Wildlife Act. Prosecutions (DPP) not seeing the merits of a particular case the grand jury procedure is the only The Bill changes the title of the Director of National way to take proceedings further. In addressing a Parks and Wildlife to the Director of National Parks, grand jury in 1940 Mr Justice Lowe said: as the director no longer has direct administrative responsibilities under the Wildlife Act. The law is very jealous to see that justice shall be done and it has provided a special procedure where if CONCLUSION justices for any reason fail to commit a person who is charged or if justices have committed a person against The Bill makes an important contribution to whom a charge is made and the Crown authorities for enhancing this State's world-class park system. It any reason refused to go on with that committal and also provides for the more efficient operation of the present the man for trial before an ordinary jury, this park system. I take this opportunity to record the special procedure is available in such cases as these to State's appreciation to those whose generous enable anybody who thinks that a crime has been donations of land have led to several of the committed to come before the Full Court and to show additions to the park system included in this Bill. to the Full Court a case which the Full Court thinks is proper to be dealt with by a grand jury. I commend the Bill to the House. In 1987 when the Attorney-General last proposed to Debate adjourned on motion of abolish grand juries the coalition suggested that the Mr HONEYWOOD (Warrandyte). grand jury procedure and the proposed abolition be JURIES (AMENDMENT) BILL (No. 2)

2094 ASSEMBLY Wednesday, 10 June 1992

referred to the Legal and Constitutional Committee having another Attorney-General who interferes for report. Had the Attorney-General accepted that with prosecutions and investigations in this way. recommendation and referred the matter to that committee we would have had a report by now and I am referring to two specific instances of the we would be able to examine the proposal in the Attorney-General interfering with a prosecution and light of that report. an investigation. In those cases the independent prosecuting and investigation authority was not the Mr Richardson - Mr Deputy Speaker, I direct DPP but the Commissioner for Corporate Affairs. your attention to the state of the House. Those two instances took place in 1985 and 1986 respectively, and there was clear intervention by the Quorum fonned. Attorney-General. I should like to point out that in 1985 and 1986 the Commissioner for Corporate Mrs WADE - As I was saying before the call for Affairs was in a position similar to the DPP, the only a quorum, the question of the abolition of grand difference being that the commissioner had an juries is a matter that should have been referred to investigatory function in addition to a prosecuting the Legal and Constitutional Committee. It cannot function, so the role is perhaps more akin to that of be resolved by the Attorney-General ignoring a the Chief Commissioner of Police. It is well recommendation for that action and continuing to established that it is quite improper for a Minister to present the same legislation to the House whenever interfere in the decision of a police chief he wants to be mentioned in a newspaper headline. commissioner to prosecute or to interfere in an If the Attorney-General has a commitment to reform individual investigation. in this area and is not just on about abolishing citizens' rights or getting his name in the newspaper, In 1985 the then Commissioner for Corporate I believe he would welcome an inquiry. A referral to Affairs, Mr John King, made a decision not to the Legal and Constitutional Committee may very prosecute partners in a firm of stockbrokers, Vinton well result in a recommendation to abolish grand Smith, Dougall Ltd. That was on the basis that the juries; on the other hand, it may not. commissioner believed himself to be a business facilitator rather than a policeman. He overturned Whatever the outcome of such an inquiry, we would the decision of the previous commissioner to be able to consider the issue based on full prosecute and decided the prosecution would not go consideration of it and of the evidence given to the ahead. It appears that although the committee. That evidence would be given by people Attorney-General was not terribly keen about with expertise and experience in the criminal justice prosecutions at that time stockbrokers fell into a system. Full consideration of the issue may result in different category, and when the Attorney-General the recommendation of a procedure that would learnt that the prosecution against the stockbroking replace grand juries and do away with the firm was to be dropped he interfered and directed cumbersome, expensive and unsatisfactory nature of the Commissioner for Corporate Affairs to continue such proceedings but would also preserve the with it. safeguard referred to by Mr Justice Lowe in the passage I read from his instruction to a grand jury. I have two letters from the commissioner that Having watched the Attorney-General in action, I substantiate what I say. One is directed to one of the have to say that an alternative procedure to replace commissioner's solicitors and is dated 5 July 1985. grand juries rather than the abolition of the safeguard would be my preference. Mr Kennan - I wonder whether the honourable member for Kew would undertake to make the Ten years ago I could not have imagined an letters available. Attorney-General interfering with the prosecution process. However, there is no doubt the Mrs WADE - Certainly. Attorney-General has interfered with the decisions of an independent prosecuting authority in order to Sitting suspended 1 p.m. until 2.3 p.m. initiate at least one prosecution and one investigation. In the circumstances there is no reason Mrs WADE - Immediately prior to the to believe the Attorney-General would not interfere suspension of the sitting I referred to a grand jury to prevent a prosecution going ahead, and an proceeding or an alternative procedure being alternative procedure is important to safeguard the established to bring matters to trial when the citizens of Victoria should we be in the position of Director of Public Prosecutions decides not to JURIES (AMENDMENT) BILL (No. 2)

Wednesday, 10 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2095 proceed with a case. I explained that 10 years ago Dear Henry, re Vinton Smith, Dougall and Co. one would not have thought that that would be Following discussions with the Attorney-General I necessary, but the current Attorney-General has have decided to instigate prosecutions against the interfered with prosecutions and initiated at least defendants in this matter. one prosecution and an investigation. I refer to the fact that in 1985 the Commissioner for Corporate I shall keep you informed of progress. Affairs decided to drop a prosecution of a number of stockbrokers involved in the firm Vinton Smith, That is clearly evidence of political interference in Dougall Ltd on the basis that the commissioner felt the prosecution process. that he was not a policeman but a business facilitator. Subsequently the commissioner met with Another matter of concern relates to an investigation the Attorney-General and was told that he should into the Macedonian Orthodox community. I have in proceed with the prosecution. I refer to a letter of my possession a memorandum to the 5 July 1985 from the Commissioner for Corporate Attorney-General from a Ministerial adviser, Peter Affairs to solicitors in which he says that he Fitzgerald, as well as a letter from Mr Fitzgerald to discussed the matter of Vinton Smith, Dougall Ltd the Commissioner for Corporate Affairs. I shall not with the Attorney-General and that: read all of the memorandum dated 28 January 1986, but I note that it refers to the misuse of funds in the ... it has been decided to proceed by way of prosecution Macedonian Orthodox community. Mr Fitzgerald in the Melbourne Magistrates Court. refers to breaches in the audited accounts and to the payment of interest to members of the church. He If we are unhappy with the outcome of the case as to says that excessive interest of approximately $30 000 penalty we may appeal to the Supreme Court. has been paid. At that stage the Office of Corporate Affairs had a strict priority system that meant that The commissioner was obviously reflecting the only the most serious matters were investigated. In views of the Attorney-General when he made that fact, hundreds of matters were written off in 1985 statement. He then says: and strict guidelines were settled between the Attorney-General and the Commissioner for I will be addressing the magistrates conference on Corporate Affairs as to what matters should be 24 July and will take the opportunity to draw investigated. It is clear that this matter did not fall magistrates' attention to the comments of the chief within those guidelines, nevertheless, Mr Fitzgerald judge in R v. GaUagher regarding the sentences imposed says to the Attorney-General: by the Melbourne Magistrates Court on property developers who broke the law. I suggest that, notwithstanding the corporate affairs priority system, an investigation take place to That statement is also a cause for concern. determine whether there have been the breaches I have mentioned above. If so I suggest that they - Mr KENNAN (Attorney-General) -On a point (i) consider the position of the auditor of order, Mr Speaker, prior to the suspension of the sitting I asked the honourable member for Kew to (ii) supervise the next elections (induding register of make available the letter regarding Vinton Smith, members) Dougall, and I ask for it to be made available now. (iii) arrange for repayment of any excess interest. Mrs WADE (Kew) - Mr Speaker, I have a copy I further suggest that, given the importance of the of the letter for the Attorney-General and I shall company to the Macedonian community, Gary make it available. Sheppard be asked to supervise the investigation.

The SPEAKER - Order! The normal procedure As I recollect it, Mr Sheppard was attached to the is to make material available immediately following Attorney-General's staff and it was intended by the conclusion of a speech. Mr Fitzgerald that he should investigate the matter under the jurisdiction of a supposedly independent Mrs WADE - I shall do that. I refer now to a Commissioner for Corporate Affairs. It appears the letter from the commissioner to the then Chairman Attorney-General accepted that advice from of the National Companies and Securities Mr Fitzgerald because the memorandum to the Commissioner, Henry Bosch, dated 4 July, which Commissioner for Corporate Affairs encloses a copy states: of the earlier memorandum to the Attorney-General JURIES (AMENDMENT) BILL (No. 2)

2096 ASSEMBLY Wednesday, 10 June 1992 and says that Mr Fitzgerald suggests that a limited would total 15 members. If at least 10 still remained investigation supervised by Gary Sheppard should at the conclusion of the trial, the case could be be undertaken. That is a clear indication of concluded. If at the end of the trial more than 12 interference in the supposedly independent office of jurors were still empanelled, a ballot would be held the Commissioner for Corporate Affairs. to reduce the number to 12.

Mr KENNAN (Attorney-General) - On a point The coalition supported those amendments. of order, Mr Speaker, 1 make it clear that 1 am asking However, it appears that the legislation has not the honourable member for Kew to make available covered all circumstances that may arise. The section to me all the documents to which she has referred. in the Juries Act which allows the trial to continue with 10 jurors applies only if a juror or jurors should Mrs WADE (Kew) -I am prepared to do that. die, become ill or leave the jury because of the death The memorandums are a clear illdkariun that the or illness of his or her close relative. The proviSion in Attorney-General has interfered with at least one the Act does not cover other examples of cases prosecution undertaken supposedly within the where a juror may be discharged. An example given discretion of prosecution authorities and at least one by the Attorney-General is where a juror may know investigation within the jurisdiction of an a key witness who has not been called until late in independent authority. The Director of Public the trial. Another circumstance was brought to my Prosecution has similar standing to that of the attention in mid-February when 1 met with the Commissioner for Corporate Affairs. Director of Public Prosecutions to discuss another Bill. While speaking to him, he mentioned the I do not anticipate that, following the next election, instance of a woman juror in a lengthy trial before there will be any question of such interference the County Court who had become pregnant during occurring. However, we must guard against the the trial and gave birth while the trial was on foot. appointment at some time in the future of an The DPP said that the woman juror had wished to Attorney-General who may behave in the manner I continue to serve as a juror and had asked that the have described; in those circumstances it is case be adjourned for two or three weeks so that she important that safeguards exist in the system. could have her baby and resume her duties as a juror. While the opposition considers the grand jury process to be cumbersome and expensive and not I had a relaxed discussion about this matter with the entirely appropriate, my preference is for the Legal DPP and I expressed the view that in a case of that and Constitutional Committee to consider the issue length, in which there already had been a significant and arrive at some alternative procedure. Had the number of adjournments - amounting to 70 or 80 Attorney-General referred the matter to that days at that stage - by reason of the judge or other committee when that suggestion was first made in jurors requiring adjournments, 1 felt somewhat 1987, the issue may well now have been clarified. sympathetic to the woman's circumstances. 1 did not believe it was a situation where the judge should be I now turn to the provisiOns remaining in the Bill, all automatically required to discharge a juror. 1 had of which are amendments to the Juries Act. The some sympathy for the juror who had sat there for amendments follow amendments considered by this the whole term of her pregnancy but who needed to House in 1990. Before those amendments a jury in a be discharged before the conclusion of the trial. In criminal trial consisted of 12 jurors; if, owing to the about mid-March, about one month before this Bill death or illness of one or more jurors, the number of was introduced in the other place, 1 was surprised to jurors was decreased, the trial could continue hear from a number of sources that an provided 10 jurors remained. If more than two jurors announcement had been made to the court in that were unable to continue in a very long trial - and particular trial that I would not agree to the long trials seem to be becoming more frequent - it pregnant woman being discharged from the jury was necessary to commence a new trial with a new and that 1 would insist that the woman continue on jury. That system is very expensive and involves the jury whether or not she so desired, and that in increased stress for the defendant. order to prevent her from being discharged 1 would not agree to an amendment to the Juries Act. The amendments considered by this House in 1990 allowed the court - where it was considered a trial Mr E. R. Smith - Who said that? would take a lengthy period - to empanel an additional three jurors, so that the empanelled jury JURIES (AMENDMENT) BILL (No. 2)

Wednesday, 10 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2097

Mrs WADE - I was somewhat surprised and I (No. 2), which allows jurors who are balloted out to did not believe that such a statement would be return for the remainder of a trial. made. I was told that the statement was made to the court by the prosecuting counsel. I telephoned the A barrister has raised with me the question of barrister concerned, Mr Doug Meagher, QC, and whether the amendments to the Juries Act should asked him whether there was any truth in what I apply to cases before the courts at the had heard. He said he had made the statement that I commencement of the legislation. He expressed would object to the woman being discharged from concern about the matter but we finally concluded the jury and that I felt she should be compelled to that the Bill dealt with what is essentially a technical stay on the jury; also, that I would not agree to any matter and does not make a change to the law that is amendment of the Act. likely to affect any strategic decision making by counsel or an accused person in relation to the I instructed Mr Meagher to ensure that the court was conduct of a trial. The coalition is prepared to accept aware that his initial statement to it was incorrect. I that the amendments will affect the operation not asked him why he had made his statement and he only of future trials but any trial that is being replied that it had been made under instructions. conducted when the provisions come into operation. When I asked where the instructions had come from, he said, ''From the DPP". I am baffled about that. In summary, the coalition supports the provisions of Whatever my thoughts may have been about the Bill and trusts that on this occasion the pregnant jury women, they were irrelevant to that Attorney-General has covered all the defects of the case. At that stage no amending Bill had been original proposal. introduced here and, even if the DPP, Mr Bongiorno, had misunderstood my views about pregnant Mr E. R. SMITH (Glen Waverley) - I am pleased women on juries, my views had absolutely no to support the Juries (Amendment) Bill (No. 2). bearing on the case. I cannot imagine why those Honourable members will be aware that the original instructions were given to Mr Meagher. Since then I Bill contained a third provision relating to grand have been unable to query the DPP about that juries to which the honourable member for Kew instruction, due to other priorities. As the DPP is referred in her learned speech. The remaining two within the province of the Attorney-General's clauses have the support of the opposition parties Department, I ask the Attorney-General to because, following wide consultation with members investigate why those instructions were given. of the legal profession closely associated with the jury process, they are considered to be of benefit to The amendment to section 44 will permit the the hearing of cases in Victoria. discharge of a jury member who is due to give birth, if the judge considers it appropriate. It will also It is interesting to reflect on the fact that a provision permit a juror to be discharged for any other good relating to grand juries again occupied the and sufficient reason. The coalition supports the government's mind. The matter was brought to a amendment. I emphasise that the amendment has head back in 1986 when a grand jury was my full support. constituted. The government has been anxious to rid itself of the grand jury system since that time. The The remaining amendment relates to a situation government felt the embarrassment of the where one of a number of co-accused in a trial circumstances of the case and would be far more decides to plead guilty while the trial is on foot. In comfortable if the grand jury system were those circumstances, the judge will direct the jury to eliminated. return a verdict of guilty. A ballot would then be taken to reduce the jury to 12, who would then give When the grand jury was constituted the court the verdict. No provision presently exists to allow system was forced to abide by the decision of the the court to retrieve jurors who have been balloted grand jury. On 30 April 1987 Mr Justice O'Shea, in out and return them to the jury box for the responding to overtures by the prosecutor, continuation of the trial of the remaining co-accused. Mr Morrish, QC, that no evidence be led, said strenuously that he wanted a safeguard. The judge Without the amendment the advantage of extra said that a prosecutor appointed by the jurors would have been lost in the cases to which I Attorney-General to perform the duties did not have referred. The coalition supports the carry the same weight as a prosecutor for the Queen amendment reflected in the Juries (Amendment) Bill would carry. As honourable members are aware, on that occasion the judge called for a prosecutor for JURIES (AMENDMENT) BILL (No. 2)

2098 ASSEMBLY Wednesday, 10 June 1992 the Queen to carry out the relevant duties. That most of the Australian States and in the United instance is significant because the provision relating Kingdom. As the honourable member for Kew said, to a grand jury has been deleted from the original an improvement might be made to the grand jury Bill, although, as I said, the judge on that occasion system if it were considered by the Legal and considered it necessary to call for a prosecutor for Constitutional Committee. The committee could the Queen. investigate the relevant factors including the inequities outlined by the Attorney-General and I Parliament has time to consider the value of the am confident that as a result Victoria would have a safeguard required by Judge O'Shea. No honourable better form of administration of the criminal justice member who has had any experience with grand system in this State. Honourable members will be juries would describe the system as anywhere near aware that sometimes the deliberations of the Legal perfect. However, although not allowing for a and Constitutional Committee take some months to finding of guilt or iImocence, it allows for a check reach conclusion, but an opportunity would be process. The grand jury system provides a provided for the committee to knock off the rough safeguard, as referred to by Judge O'Shea when he edges of the system, as it were, and suggest a way in called for a prosecutor for the Queen to present the which it might work as satisfactorily as it does in the case. The grand jury system provides the United States of America and other jurisdictions. The opportunity of returning a case for trial so that the grand jury system is used in the American arguments from both sides may be heard again. One indictment process. It allows juries to question of the criticisms of the system is that only the prosecution and defence wib1esses, notwithstanding arguments of the prosecution are heard. In other that the fifth amendment excludes an appearance by words, the defendant is not called, nor is counsel for the defendant. The grand jury system allows for the the defendant. The legal system tests -- evidence to be tested. A grand jury decides whether to send a particular person for trial on the basis of a The ACTING SPEAKER (Mr Emst) - Order! I better understanding of the extent and weight of the remind the honourable member for Glen Waverley evidence to be considered. that the grand jury provision has been taken out of the Bill. While a passing reference is permitted, it A grand jury has greater coercive powers than do goes beyond the Bill to have a full-scale debate on the police in the normal run of investigations. A the grand jury provision. I remind him that he suspect or wib1ess can plead that he wishes to take should come back to debate the provisions of the Bill. advice from a legal adviser, or if necessary, maintain the right of silence. Under the grand jury system Mr E. R. SMITH - Thank you, Mr Acting there are coercive powers to force that particular Speaker, for your reminder. I am trying to keep person to give evidence. This is considered by many within the parameters set by the honourable to be of great benefit, but whether that is something member for Kew and the Attomey-General. They that would work under our system is a matter for were given the latitude to refer to the grand jury careful examination. system in their dissertations because the matter was germane to the original Bill. While I make passing The grand jury has been used only once during the reference to the grand jury system, I appreciate your past 40 years. On that occasion the grand jury found guidance on the matter. unanimously that the defendant ought to go before a judge. In the case I alluded to in 1987, regarding Currently the process of juries in this State is under Mr McArdle, the County Court was presided over close scrutiny. The Bill contains two amendments to by Judge O'Shea. the Juries Act that will help with the process of law in this State. I refer to the effect of the two clauses by Juries are the subject of much discussion in the alluding to the grand jury process because all the community. The Bill provides for the better working matters come under the general discussion on juries, of the jury system. The amendments made in the and they are the subject of the Bill honourable Upper House will ensure that the safeguard of a members are debating. grand jury will be retained. I hope there will be an opportunity in the future for the Legal and As honourable members are aware, the grand jury Constitutional Committee to carefully examine the system is included in the jury system in a number of grand jury system. The coalition plans when in different jurisdictions in the United States of government to send a term of reference to the America. Honourable members will be aware also committee for it to examine the grand jury system, that the grand jury system has been discontinued in so that it is proved once and for all that it has a place PORT OF MELBOURNE AUTHORITY (AMENDMENT) BILL (No. 2)

Wednesday, 10 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2099 in our system, not necessarily in its current fonn but the Bill that I was not proposing to raise. It would to act as a safeguard in cases where the integrity of give me a great deal of pleasure to do so. the criminal justice system is being called into question and where members of the administration For the community to have confidence in the of criminal justice have had their decisions strongly criminal justice system it is necessary that it works questioned. efficiently and that it not be under duress, as has been the case during the past few years. An attempt In a democracy such as ours we must pursue every will be made in the future to amend the Bill, and I avenue available to ensure the system is working shall support that, as will other honourable well so that it retains the confidence of the members. We want to see the system working as a community. Over the past few years I believe public safeguard and to improve the running of the confidence in the Victorian criminal justice system criminal justice system in Victoria. has been seriously eroded. An inquiry into this matter should be held in the early months of the Mr KENNAN (Attorney-General) - I thank incoming government. I shall also call for an inquiry honourable members opposite for their enthusiastic into the Legge case, not in the sense of the matter support for the provisions contained in the Bill. being heard before an expensive legal tribunal but before a QC of eminence in the city who, together Motion agreed to. with a junior, will be able to examine this complaint because a grave injustice has been done. I know Read second time. moves are afoot to reactivate this matter and irrespective of whether it comes to fruition during Passed remaining stages. the time of the current government, or when the coalition is in government, one thing is certain: I PORT OF MELBOURNE AUTHORITY shall be pressing with all the influence I can bring to (AMENDMENT) BILL (No. 2) bear for the matter to be reopened and for it to be dealt with by a QC and a junior so that justice can be Second reading seen to be done as well as be done. One of the great virtues of the British criminal justice system, which Debate resumed from 21 May; motion of we are lucky to live under in Australia, is that justice Mr ROPER (Minister for Employment, must not only be done but also be seen to be done. Post-Secondary Education and Training).

Decisions that are made behind closed doors, such Mr COOPER (Mornington) - The Port of as in the Legge case, are matters that go to the heart Melbourne Authority (Amendment) Bill has two of public confidence, which at this stage has been major purposes. The first is to modernise the seriously eroded. Many people on this side of the regulation-making powers of the Port of Melbourne House recognise the injustice that has been done. It Authority. The second is to increase the penalties is a shame the government, during the past few that may be imposed for a breach of the authority's months, has chosen to attack me rather than to bring regulations concerning goods, oils and inflammable the matter into the open so that all the aggrieved liquids. parties can have their say. The opposition has no problem with the first One of the main factors that gives the appearance of purpose because the Port of Melbourne Authority justice is that a person has his or her day in court Act is now 34 years old and most legislation that old and to deny that day in court is anathema to people would certainly be in need of modernisation. It is on this side of the House. The coalition supports important for the House to understand that in line with pleasure the two measures contained in the with the second purpose substantial increases are Bill. It is commendable that the government has not proposed for the maximum penalties for breaches of persisted in its efforts to abolish the grand jury the regulations. It is proposed that the fines for system. offences relating to oil will be increased from the present level of $5000 to a new level of $40 000, and Mr Kennan interjected. for other offences from the present level of $2000 to a new level of $10 000. Mr E. R. SMITH - If the Attorney-General wants to hurry me I can start on another aspect of I suppose the government will justify such huge increases by saying it wants to bring penalties into PORT OF MELBOURNE AUTHORITY (AMENDMENT) BILL (No. 2)

2100 ASSEMBLY Wednesday, 10 June 1992 line with the Dangerous Goods Act. That Act was Since January 1988, the authority has investigated one of three major pieces of legislation that was seventy-three (73) offences against the Port of rushed through this Parliament in 1985 when the Melbourne Authority Dangerous Goods, Handling, government had a temporary majority in the Storage and Transportation Regulations 1976. Of these, Legislative Council. Two of those pieces of thirty-four (34) were prosecuted by the authority, with legislation have certainly not been to the credit of penalties imposed by the relevant Magistrate of this government or to the benefit of this State. between $250 and $1500 for each case. Twenty-three (23) official warnings were issued by the authority as a Mr Micallef - It's a matter of opinion! result of these incidents and no further action was taken in the remaining sixteen (16) cases. Mr COOPER - It is a matter of opinion, it is my opinion and the same opinion is held by the people Offences detected included the failure to seal scuppers of Victoria. They will be expressing that opinion at while handling oil, and the discharge of oil or the next election when a lot of your mates will be in dangerous substances onto port property. grave jeopardy in trying to hold their seats. That letter reveals that since January 1988 only about Mr Micallef - We'll see! 8 prosecutions a year have been made with the penalties imposed ranging from $250 to $1500. That Mr COOPER - You'll be history, along with is well below the present maximum level of $5000. your mates. They'll be history, out in the street There were 23 other offences in that four-and-a-half looking for a job, that is if they can find one - most year period that were not considered by the Port of of them would be unemployable. Melbourne Authority to be serious enough to take to court; warnings were issued instead. This is hardly The Dangerous Goods Act did not cover oil an overwhelming case of an increasing incidence of pollution offences on wharves in the port of serious offences to warrant fine increases of the Melbourne. This omission has led to confusion when magnitude proposed. spills occur in the port. The opposition remains puzzled as to why there needs to be separate Later information provided by the Port of legislation for such occurrences in the port of Melbourne Authority by way of a chart showing the Melbourne and why oil spills and other matters that penalties handed out in each of the 34 cases referred are covered by this Bill could not have been handled to in that letter of 4 May show that the maximum under the Dangerous Goods Act. As it is, it appears penalty imposed was $1000. There was one penalty that the confusion will continue. It is the of $1000 imposed in 1988, another one in 1990 and government's decision to do that and it puzzles the two in 1991. The information in the chart that I have opposition, as does the motivation for this Bill and in front of me is at variance with the information in the reasons why such substantial increases in the 4 May letter, which states that the maximum penalties are being implemented by the government. penalty imposed was $1500.

The opposition does not believe that the evidence The letter states that the maximum penalty imposed available on the level of offences being committed under the regulations was $1500, yet the supporting warrants such enormous increases in penalties for chart supplied by the Port of Melbourne Authority such offences in the port of Melbourne. The evidence at a later date states that the maximum penalty given to it by the government shows that the imposed was $1000. The House must ponder offences being committed are not of the level of whether the Port of Melbourne Authority knows seriousness and number that would warrant this what is going on when the information it supplied to huge increase in penalties. The evidence provided to the opposition is clearly inaccurate and inconsistent. the opposition by the Port of Melbourne AuthOrity What is the truth? The PMA chart shows that in the suggests the opposite, that is, there is very little four-and-a-half year period since 1988 the total of reason for this Bill being introduced. the fines collected was $15 000 and the average penalty was $472. Again, this shows the necessity for A letter dated 4 May 1992 from the Port of the government to justify the increases and penalties Melbourne Authority to my colleague, Mr Baxter, proposed. the Leader of the National Party in another place, states in part: If the average penalty imposed is $472, why is it that the government is seeking to increase penalties from $5000 to $40 000 for offences relating to oil, and from CRIMES (FAMILY VIOLENCE) (FURTHER AMENDMENT) BILL

Wednesday, 10 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2101

$2000 to $10 000 for other offences? It is clear that Mr A. J. SHEEHAN (Treasurer) - The since 1988 nowhere near the present maximum honourable member for Momington raised two penalty has been applied by the courts. Why does issues - the reasons for the increase in fines and the there need to be such a huge increase in the need for legislation to be written in plain English. penalties? It is a reasonable question to put to the government and it deserves more than the answer Although it may be true to say that the existing that it just wants to bring everything into line with maximum penalties have not been imposed, it is something else. Surely when dealing with penalties important to consider not only the types of offences there needs to be a reason for increasing them, and committed to date but also the potential for further that reason should always be that the level or types breaches. The regulations will continue to be of offences warrant such an increase. breached unless the penalties imposed are sufficient to act as a deterrent - and honourable members I now refer to proposed section 136(4)(b) as will be aware of the health and environmental contained in clause 3 of the Bill. This government effects of the breaching of the regulations. has continually boasted, particularly under the present Attorney-General, that it supports plain The clauses of the Bill, which were drafted on the English in legislation. It says that legislation should advice of Parliamentary Counsel, represent standard always be of a type that can be easily understood by legislative drafting techniques for conferring the community and that a person should not have to discretionary powers on officers of authorities. As go to a lawyer or a Parliamentary draftsman to have such the provisions are not unique to the Bill. legislation interpreted. I commend the Bill to the House. I ask the House to consider proposed section 136(4), which states in part that regulations made under the Motion agreed to. section may: Read second time. (b) require a matter affected by the regulations to be approved by, or to the satisfaction of, a person or Passed remaining stages. body or a class of people or bodies. I ask the Treasurer to explain what that means. For CRIMES (FAMILY VIOLENCE) his benefit I repeat that the proposed section states (FURTHER AMENDMENT) BILL that regulations made under the section may: Second reading (b) require a matter affected by the regulations to be approved by, or to the satisfaction of, a person or Debate resumed from 9 June; motion of body or a class of people or bodies. Mr KENNAN (Attorney-General). The provision sounds like double-dutch to me. If the government intends Bills to be written in plain Mrs WADE (Kew) - In an ideal world violence, English, let's have it! The paragraph is written in domestic or otherwise, would not exist. Although such convoluted language that it will do no more that should be our aim, it will be a long time coming. than confuse the layman. Certainly we will not see a world free of violence in our lifetimes. In the meantime we must deal with Although the coalition will not oppose the Bill, we violent offenders - in this case, people who commit have genuine concerns about its provisions. I ask the crimes of domestic violence. Treasurer to give a better response to the concerns raised than was given by the Minister for The Bill will amend the Crimes (Family Violence) Manufacturing and Industry Development to my Act by improving its operation and enforcement. colleague the Honourable Bill Baxter, the Leader of The Bill should not be seen as an answer to domestic the National Party in the other place. violence. Although it contains some legal remedies the Bill will not prevent domestic violence, The coalition believes the House and the people of especially when all of the available evidence Victoria deserve to be given a logical explanation for suggests that domestic violence is increasing the increase in the penalties for breaches of the port because of the effects of the current recession. of Melbourne regulations. The Bill will make four major changes to the Act. It provides for the registration and enforcement in CRIMES (FAMILY VIOLENCE) (FURTHER AMENDMENT) BILL

2102 ASSEMBLY Wednesday, 10 June 1992

Victoria of restraining orders made in other States­ priority to reports of domestic violence. that is, orders made to keep someone away from Notwithstanding the change in police standing other members of the family or from the family orders, from recent meetings I have had with home. The Bill also provides for the making of women's organisations it seems to me that there is applications for interim protection orders under the still a lot of dissatisfaction with the police response principal Act by fax or telephone. Those applications in some circumstances, although I understand it has can be made outside court hours, and in some improved from the 1988 position. circumstances - for example, where it is difficult for the applicant to get to court - they may be made The Australian Institute of Criminology's Trends and during court sitting times. Issues paper No. 16 on Australian policing states:

The Bill will also codify police powers to enter The Minneapolis Police Deparbnent conducted an homes without warrants when domestic violence is experiment which randomly assigned one of three suspected and make mandatory the seizure of intervention strategies to cases of common assault by firearms in such circumstances. Police officers one spouse against another. The strategies included already have the power to seize firearms found at (1) arrest; (2) an order to the suspect to leave the the scene of an incident of domestic violence. That premises for 8 hours; and (3) advice, which included power was conferred as a result of an amendment informal mediation in some cases. Arrested suspects proposed by the coalition and accepted by the were significantly less likely to engage in subsequent government when the principal Act was amended acts of violence than were those suspects assigned the on a previous occasion. The amendment gave police other intervention strategies. officers at the scene the discretion to confiscate firearms, but following several reports on domestic My experience from talking to women's group is violence the government has decided that in such that the majority of women believe family violence circumstances the seizure of firearms should be should, firstly, have a high priority for police mandatory, and the coalition supports the proposal. response and, secondly, be treated as a criminal offence. The Bill does not deal with the criminal The community does not seem to appreciate the aspects of family violence but it is important that, in extent of domestic violence or understand the supporting intervention orders and providing for reasons underlying it. Many people do not accept them to be more easily obtained, as they will be that domestic violence is no different from other when the Bill is passed, the House does not view types of violence. Several newspaper articles have intervention orders as a substitute for criminal made reference to a survey conducted in 1988 by the charges where criminal offences have occurred. The Office of the Status of Women, which revealed that responses to family violence other than criminal 25 per cent of those interviewed did not equate a proceedings include intervention orders, husband's frightening his wife with violence; 16 per counselling, and the provision of alternative cent did not class a husband's threatening to hit his hOUSing. It is important for the government to spouse as violence; and 10 per cent did not consider provide alternative responses, but they are it violent for a husband to push his wife. Some 22 additional to and should not be considered as per cent of men and 17 per cent of women - substitutes for bringing criminal actions. approximately 1 in 5 of all people interviewed - believed that certain circumstances justified the use The first set of provisions covered by the Bill relates of physical force by a man against his wife. The most to the registration of interstate protection orders. The staggering finding of the survey was that 28 per cent Bill does not specify what will happen and the of people said they would ignore a neighbour Attorney-General has not advised the House beating his wife. That is worrying because it whether it is his intention to gazette orders from all indicates a community attitude to domestic violence States. The orders that could be covered by the Bill that is different from the attitude to other forms of are not uniform; they vary significantly from State to violence. State. They are not in similar terms to Victorian intervention orders provided for in section 4 of the When I was President of the Equal Opportunity Crimes (Family Violence) Act, which provides: Board I had ongoing correspondence and meetings (1) The court may make an intervention order in respect with women's groups about the police response to of a person if satisfied on the balance of domestic violence. Between 1985 and 1988 police probabilities that - standing orders were rewritten to meet women's concerns that police were not giving appropriate CRIMES (FAMILY VIOLENCE) (FURTHER AMENDMENT) BILL

Wednesday, 10 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2103

(a) the person has assaulted a family member or Now it appears that orders from other States caused damage to property of a family applying to people beyond family members will be member and is likely to again assault the enforced in Victoria but it is likely that orders under family member or cause damage to property the Racial and Religious Vilification Bill will not be of the family member; or enforceable in other States. I suggest that issue should be taken up by the Attorney-General at the the person has threatened to assault a family Standing Committee of Attorneys-General or by member or cause damage to property of a rationalising the legislation he introduces into family member and is likely to assault the Parliament. family member or cause damage to property of the family member; or There is also a maximum duration of orders that the person has harassed or molested a family varies from State to State. In Victoria, Tasmania and member or has behaved in an offensive Queensland an order remains in operation for 12 manner towards a family member and is months. In South Australia it is two years. In New likely to do so again. South Wales, Western Australia and Northern Territory the legislation sets no limit for the length of (2) The order may impose any restrictions or operation of restraining orders. However, the court prohibitions on the person that appear necessary must specify a time in the order. or desirable in the circumstances to the court. Such provisions can prohibit or restrict the approach Proposed section 18AA(3) states: of a person to a family member or access to the family home or to any other place frequented by the Subject to this section, a registered interstate summary family member. South Australia, Tasmania, Western protection order - Australia and the Northern Territory all deal with (a) has the same effect in this State as it has for the time this issue under their justice Acts and have taken an being in the State or Territory in which it was aI:pro~ch to the matter different from that taken by made; and Vlctona. They have built on breach of peace provisions in those Acts and orders are not limited (b) has that effect as if it were an order of the court­ to the protection of family members. Anyone may of that State. A person can obtain greater protection apply for an intervention order under those Acts. in Victoria under an interstate order than under a Victorian order. In introducing the amendments the When I examined the provisions of the Racial and Attorney-General should have considered whether Religious Vilification Bill, which has been other amendments were required in Victoria to introduced in the other place, I noted that, had the ensure that Victorians under Victorian court orders provisions on intervention orders in Victoria been as obtain the same protection as they would under an wide as they are in other States, it would have been order registered in Victoria from another State. unnecessary to include the harassment order provisions in that Bill. I ask the Attorney-General There is a difference in penalties for restraining whether it is proposed that orders against people orders. In Victoria the penalty is $1000 or six months other than family members will be enforced in imprisonment, and in Queensland it is $2400 or 12 Victoria? If so, will the anti-harassment orders under months imprisonment. In allowing for restraining ~e Racial and Religious Vilification Bill, assuming it orders to be registered from interstate and enforced IS passed, be enforceable in other States in the same in Victoria as if they were an order of the court in way that orders from other States will be enforceable Victoria the opportunity was available to bring those here? provisions into line to ensure that Victorians had the same protection as people from interstate. It is The Attorney-General is looking a bit puzzled. In ~urpris~g that these issues have not been taken up other States those orders are not taken out by family ill the BIll because the opposition has been waiting members only; they can be taken out by neighbours for a long time for the Bill to be introduced, or other people. When similar legislation was last particularly the proviSions relating to the before Parliament I made the suggestion that there enforcement of interstate restraining orders. be a similar extension to the Victorian legislation, but the government rejected my advice. If the The Attorney-General had announced his intention government had accepted that advice, the to introduce these provisions over the past three anti-harassment orders in the Racial and Religious sessional periods. In each case at the beginning of a Vilification Bill would not have been necessary. new sessional period he has issued a press release CRIMES (FAMILY VIOLENCE) (FURTHER AMENDMENT) BILL

2104 ASSEMBLY Wednesday, 10 June 1992 annoWlcing his intention to go ahead with the proposed section 18AB(l)(a) is necessary as a result recognition of interstate restraining orders but each of the Sentencing Act. Prior to that Act, police had sessional period we have been disappointed. The the power to enter and search premises without a opposition was at the end of its patience. I believed warrant where they had reasonable groWlds to the Attorney-General was neglecting his believe a person was being assaulted on those responsibilities towards victims of domestic violence premises. That power to enter was based on a in continuing to annOWlce provisions but not to provision in the Crimes Act that there was a power introduce them. The coalition decided that if the to enter premises where it was considered that an Minister did not introduce the provisions this offence carrying a penalty of at least five years sessional period it would introduce a private imprisonment was taking place on the premises. member's Bill. I am happy that has not been That power fell to the groWld when the Sentencing necessary. The Attorney-General traditionally does Act came into operation, so far as assault was not accept private members' Bills no matter what is concerned. The penalty for assault was reduced in them. In the interests of the women concerned, it from five years to three years. is better that he has introduced these provisions, but it would have been better had he done so a year ago. The Bill reintroduces that power of entry in domestic violence situations, but I suggest that the The second set of amendments authorises members Attorney-General should also look carefully at of the Police Force to apply for interim intervention whether there should be other amendments orders by facsimile or telephone. As the Bill was introduced to cover other situations where police originally introduced in another place it was believe an assault is taking place on premises. It proposed that that facility could be available only in appears the Attorney-General has withdrawn the out-of-court hours. As a result of representations by power of the police to enter without a warrant in police, particularly police in COWltry areas, that those circumstances. I suspect it was not an provision has been extended to enable applications intentional change and is one that should be to be made by facsimile or telephone in reversed as soon as possible. circumstances where it is difficult for the police member who is the applicant to take the matter I refer to a number of provisions regarding the before the court even when the court is sitting. The seizure of firearms. At present there is power, coalition recognised that that would assist victims in proposed originally by the coalition and accepted by COWltry areas and discussed the matter with the the government, for the police to seize firearms Attorney-General's Department. It has agreed on the where they attend a domestic violence complaint, form of the amendments to authorise the but that power is discretionary. applications. The orders that can be obtained by facsimile or telephone are interim orders only and The Bill requires a police member attending a last for a specified period before the applicant has to domestic violence situation to seize the firearms. go to court for a full hearing. The defendant is There were a number of problems when that notified of that hearing so that he can put his case. provision was originally introduced in another place. The Bill was Significantly amended in another The third set of amendments is contained in place to meet the concerns raised by the police and a proposed section 18AB in clause 9. That provision number of gW1 clubs. codifies the power of entry for police in domestic violence situations. It sets out five situations where I met with representatives of three different gW1 there is power to enter and search premises without clubs and fOWld them helpful in discussing the a warrant. Proposed section 18AB(l)(b) states: proposed provisions. There was no question tha t they were not disputing that firearms should not be the member reasonably believes that the person is on present in domestic violence situations. They were the premises in breach of an intervention order. concerned to ensure that the provisions contained in the Bill were absolutely clear about the That is the only provision that increases the power of circumstances in which firearms were seized and the police from what it has been in the past and it what happened to the firearms after they were has the support of the coalition. seized. Following discussions with those representatives I discussed a number of The provisiOns in paragraphs (a), (b) and (c) are amendments with the Attorney-General's existing powers of the police to enter and search Department and agreement was reached on a premises without a warrant. The provision in number of amendments that dealt with the issues BANK INTEGRATION BILL

Wednesday, 10 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2105 raised. Those amendments covered such things as: eventually it was decided that each State should the Registrar of Firearms being advised of the legislate and Victoria was the first State to do so. seizure of firearms from a domestic violence situation; the registrar being able to take action to As to the specific matters she raised, the government withdraw any licence if appropriate; and will gazette all interstate orders and orders will be appropriate action being taken for the confiscation made on the application of the person requiring of firearms under the Firearms Act if a person does them. not hold a licence. Mrs Wade interjected. There was also the question of what happens to firearms that are seized because the existing Mr KENNAN - Orders against non-family provisions in the principal Act are not terribly clear members, yes. The length of the orders will be the about that. The Act puts forward a number of same as in the original State. We do not anticipate a options but does not say which option applies in point of racial vilification. I am also grateful to the which case. If an order is not made the options are honourable member for Kew from departing from that a firearm must be returned to the person, the National Rifle Association pro-gun stance that forfeited to the Crown or disposed of as the Minister the coalition has maintained so savagely in administering the Firearms and Other Weapons Act Parliament over the many attempts by the 1958 directs. government to crack down on guns. She seems to be taking a sensible attitude on this occasion and I The coalition included a number of proposals about congratulate her on it. those, some of which were accepted by the government. In particular it was agreed that where a Motion agreed to. firearm was seized and there was no case for confiscation but there was a case for the disposal of Read second time. it, the firearm would be placed with a firearms dealer and when it was sold the owner of the Passed remaining stages. firearm would receive the price of the firearm less the reasonable costs of the firearms dealer. BANK INTEGRATION BILL

The only issue that was not clarified was that when Message read recommending appropriation. an order had not been made or when no directions were given about the firearm it should be returned Second reading within a specified number of days. For some reason that was not acceptable to the government. It is clear Mr A. J. SHEEHAN (Treasurer) - I move: from the Act that the firearm has to be returned in those circumstances but no period is specified for That this Bill be now read a second time. that return. Prior to deregulation, the activities of trading and The coalition is happy that a number of amendments savings banks were separate and subject to separate dealing with issues raised by both the police and the prudential regulation. With deregulation, that gun clubs were negotiated satisfactorily with the distinction was removed so that savings banks could government. Those amendments improve the undertake trading bank activities and vice versa. enforcement procedures of the Bill. However, there is room for further improvement and this is one Bill From the viewpoint of the banks there was no that will have a priority for revision following a commercial rationale for formalising the integration change of government. of savings banks and trading banks because of the practical difficulties of merging the operations Mr KENNAN (Attorney-General) - I thank the without legislation and because of the need for the honourable member for Kew for her enthusiastic consents of numerous depositors and third parties. support for this initiative that the government took The banks were also reluctant to incur the taxes and early in 1991 through the Standing Committee of charges that would result from the transfer of assets Attorneys-General. I accept her congratulations on and liabilities. Therefore the Commonwealth taking that initiative. At that time it was thought it government passed the Bank Integration Act 1991 to could be done through the Commonwealth using provide for the necessary transfer of assets and the Service and Execution of Process Act, but BANK INTEG RA TION BILL

2106 ASSEMBLY Wednesday, 10 June 1992 liabilities and their exemption from taxes and in relation to State legislative proposals relating to charges that might otherwise arise on the transfer. the Corporations Law. Formal consultation with the Ministerial Council has therefore been initiated and The Commonwealth government's objective is to it is anticipated that it will be completed prior to the reduce the number of banking authorities within the passage of the Bill through the House. In any event, banking group to simplify the accounting and the Bill will not be proclaimed until that consultation reporting statements of the banks referred to in the has been completed. Act thereby simplifying the prudential supervisory role of the Reserve Bank. The legislation is expected I commend the Bill to the House. to result in simpler funding and accounting arrangements and provide greater flexibility in Mr STOCK DALE (Brighton) - This is an servicing customers. The Commonwealth Act important Bill and, given the cavalier manner in contemplates that the States will pass which the government has treated it, it has not complementary legislation to give effect to those received the attention it warrants from the provisions in relation to banks incorporated in the government. The coalition has had to take the respective States. initiative in actually having the Bill introduced to facilitate the integration of banks under a national Legislation is necessary in Victoria because the scheme deadlined for 30 June. savings and trading entities of three of the banks which are subject to the Bank Integration Act passed It is now the second week of June and the by the Commonwealth government are incorporated government is just getting around to the second in Victoria. The State legislation will enable the reading of the Bill. The handling of the Bill over the integration and reorganisation of those banks, the last few days shows the government has completely exemption of the banks from taxes and charges and lost the plot of the management of Parliament. The it will provide for other miscellaneous matters in reality is that the Bill should have been brought on relation to the integration. much earlier. Even today no discussion has been initiated by the government about passing it through In the case of Victoria the relevant banks are the the Upper House to ensure that it will facilitate the Australia and New Zealand Banking Group Ltd and operation of the national scheme. The only reason its subsidiary, Australia and New Zealand Savings for it coming on at all is that the coalition has taken Bank Ltd, Citibank Ltd and its subSidiary, Citibank the initiative to actually push the government and Savings Ltd and National Australia Bank Ltd and its ensure that the banks make clear their position to the subSidiary, National Australia Savings Bank Ltd. government.

The complementary Victorian legislation includes Indeed, over the past few days I have liaised provisions to: constantly with the Leader of the House about the time at which it was proposed to bring the Bill on for ensure the receiving bank becomes the successor debate. I have taken the initiative of speaking to him in law of the transferrin~ bank; because I have learnt from experience that it is absolutely useless talking to the Treasurer. He the assets and liabilities of the transferring bank simply does not know when the Leader of the House vest in the receiving bank; will bring on Bills. In relation to Bills over which he himself has control he frequently says to me that he the exemption of the banks from State taxes and has no idea when the Bill is coming on and that, '1 charges arising from the integration; will have to discuss it with the Leader of the House".

provide for the dissolution of the transferring As he has taken that line again, I liaised with the bank; and Leader of the House. Indeed, we had an arrangement that it would come on directly after provide for other miscellaneous matters lunch and I organised my affairs to facilitate my incidental to the integration of savings and being here, as I was, at 2 o'clock. The Bill did not trading banks. come on then, which is understandable because the Leader of the House cannot control the duration of The heads of agreement between the States and the the debate on whatever Bill happens to be before the Commonwealth in relation to the Corporations Law House at the time of the luncheon adjournment; but provide for consultation with the Ministerial Council BANKING (PREMIUM ACCOUNTS) BILL

Wednesday, 10 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2107 since that time several other Bills have been brought operations. Traditionally, in many cases they have on. opera ted on two separate banking licences.

I sat here and waited, not knowing when it was The policy of the Reserve Bank is that each bank that coming on, with other Bills from all over the Notice is in fact a group bank with a common identity other Paper being dealt with, with the Whip rushing than the corporate structure of the parent and through the door when one Bill finished to shout at subsidiaries should operate on a single banking the Minister at the table - who was not the Minister licence and that the savings and trading banks responsible -about what Bill was coming on next. should be amalgamated.

I then went to look for the Leader of the House and We support that initiative. As we understand it, it is met a member of his staff in the corridor. I was told supported nationally by Australian governments. that he was at a meeting and was Wlavailable, and I The Bill is the Victorian Parliament's part in told the member of his staff to give him a message to facilitating that process. We support the Bill; we will advise me when the Bill was coming on. vote for it and facilitate its passage through the Upper House - if the government finally has its act I then proceeded to go to a meeting with the Upper together to the point of wanting that to happen. House coalition spokesman on Treasury matters, a meeting concerning the passage of other Bills, but I I ask the Treasurer to indicate in closing the debate had to drop everything in the course of that whether the Bill is private, and if so the basis on important discussion when I found out, over the which it is being dealt with by Parliament. It appears loud speaker, that this Bill was being brought on to be limited in its scope to three groups of banks with no notice whatever to the coalition. and provides those banks with substantial concessions from what would be the case were this This is absolutely laughable. It is supposed to be the special legislation not to be enacted. It bears a government's legislative program but the opposition number of features of private legislation, and I has to take the initiative to bring on Bills, and even request the Treasurer to state whether it is being then they pop up out of order and without notice. dealt with as a private Bill or as a public Bill. No discussion took place and there was no liaison about when these important matters would be dealt The SPEAKER - Order! The matter just raised with, which have now come on, on the last possible by the honourable member for Brighton is one for day of the sitting of the Lower House. the Chair and the House, not for the initiating member, in this case the Minister. I have taken It is an absolute shambles and shows that the advice on the matter, and it is a matter of public government's internal ructions have so diverted it policy. Accordingly I do not rule that it is a private from conducting the affairs of the State that the Bill. people of Victoria carmot count on even the orderly conduct of the House. It is ludicrous that I have to Mr A. J. SHEEHAN (Treasurer) - In closing the spend the transition period between Bills racing up debate on the second reading of the Bill I note the the stairs - on this occasion I was in the middle of a introductory remarks of the opposition, and I meeting - because two Ministers carmot get their apologise for the inconvenience. act together and give even 5 minutes notice of when a Bill is coming before the House. It is just laughable. Motion agreed to.

The Bill is part of the legislative package to Read second time. implement the policy of the Reserve Bank of Australia of amalgamating the licences of Australia's Passed remaining stages. major banks. The Bill is quite complicated but it has the support of the opposition parties. Indeed, we BANKING (PREMIUM ACCOUNTS) believe it is important as a matter of national BILL banking policy that Parliament should have facilitated it with a greater degree of attention and Second reading care than the Bill has received. Historically banks have operated on the basis of keeping their savings Debate resumed from 19 May; motion of bank operations separate from their trading bank Mr ROPER (Minister for Gaming). BANKING (PREMIUM ACCOUNTS) BILL

2108 ASSEMBLY Wednesday, 10 June 1992

Mr STOCKDALE (Brighton) - The Bill philosophy and took the view that it is not introduces into Victoria, as part of the introduction appropriate for Parliament to lock out one form of into Australia, a scheme that falls somewhere gambling - and I will qualify that remark in a between banking and lotteries. It operates in New moment - because people should have a choice as Zealand and in the United Kingdom and perhaps in to the form of gambling or investment they regard as other places. We have been given some information most appropriate for themselves. Despite some in relation to its operation in New Zealand and in reservations about potential revenue effects on the Great Britain, and I am not sure whether it actually State and on Tattersall's and its agencies the operates anywhere else. coalition will not oppose the legislation.

It is called the Banking (Premium Accounts) Scheme The legislation has attracted some controversy when and it is limited to banks. It operates on the basis of the coalition circulated the Bill after the Minister banks being licensed by the Minister to conduct made his second-reading speech. Tattersall's has accounts that are part of the scheme. The scheme expressed the view that not only will the scheme operates on clearly designated accounts on the basis involve a reduction of State revenue but also that the that every $100 a person deposits in his account precedent of taxing the interest of the prize pool will entitles the depositor to a chance in the monthly imperil the tax-free status of lottery winnings under draw. For example, if a depositor has a balance of ordinary principles. The same view has been forcibly $1000 in the relevant month, that depositor would be expressed to the coalition by many agents. Needless entitled to 10 tickets in the monthly draw. to say, the agents also mount the argument that the scheme threatens the business of Tattersall's The designated accounts do not attract interest in the agencies. normal way. Rather, the interest from the accounts is paid into a pool from which the prizes are funded In addition, a view has been advanced from within each month. The opposition understands that there the banking community that schemes of this kind will be a major prize and a series of minor prizes. are inimical to the nature of banking and that they The major proponent, the ANZ Bank, has indicated send the wrong sort of signal to the community that the guaranteed prize will be apprOximately about banking at a time when banks are having $200000 a month and that it will guarantee a prize difficulty in presenting themselves in a favourable of that magnitude even it is necessary to subsidise light to the community and to their customers. the pool. The opposition understands that it will be necessary to subsidise the pool in the early stages of Despite those reservations, the fact is that similar the operation of the scheme. schemes operate in Britain and New Zealand with considerable public support. I understand that a The return to the govenunent from the scheme is typical depositor is a relative, often a grandparent of twofold. There is an important difference between young children. Money is progressively deposited the implications of the scheme for the State over a number of years and accounts are is built up compared with the implications of the conduct of in the interests of the children. The accounts provide lotteries, for example by Tattersall's. The State yield savings for the children when they get older and is to be 25 per cent of the prize pool in years one to there is always the hope that they will actually win three inclusive and thereafter 30 per cent of the prize the major prize and therefore obtain a Significant pool. In addition, unlike Tattersall's prizes, prize increment to the savings already made by their winners will be liable to Commonwealth income tax grandparents or other relatives. on the basis of special legislation passed by the Commonwealth to cover the scheme. That means The usual deposit in Britain appears to be in the that the total yield to govenunent will exceed the order of about $1000, which under the scheme the return to govenunent from Victorian lotteries Victorian scheme would entitle the depositor to 10 conducted by Tattersall's but that the total return to tickets in each monthly draw. Until recently, New the State will actually be less because a certain Zealand has not had a national lottery and Britain amount will be taken out by the Commonwealth as still does not have a national lottery, although it is in income tax. the course of introducing one. The absence of a national lottery means that the evidence regarding The opposition will not oppose the legislation, but I the operation of the schemes in New Zealand and have to say that it has some misgivings about it on a Britain has qualified relevance to what might be number of counts. In the final analYSiS, however, the expected in Australia, particularly in Victoria where coalition applied its own principles and political lotteries are so well established. BANKING (PREMIUM ACCOUNTS) BILL

Wednesday, 10 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2109

It does seem to be agreed by Tattersalls, its agents appreciates their input. I do not propose to go into and the banks that, although some funds will be detail and summarise what has been put to the attracted away from normal lottery operations, the opposition, although it has been useful in its attraction factor is likely to be relatively small, in the consideration of the scheme. For the reasons I have order of less than 10 per cent. The banks argue that given we must place a caveat on the infonnation once the return of revenue from the Commonwealth based on international experience. is taken into account, Victoria will not suffer any detriment even if an attraction of that magnitude The opposition believes people should be given a were to take place. choice between this and other forms of investment and between this and other forms of lotteries. In the There must be some reservation about those figures final analysis the role of Parliament, in the absence on the basis that they are largely based on the of any overwhelming case to the contrary, should be experience of New Zealand and Britain where there to let people make choices about their own funds. is no well-established lottery as there is in Victoria. For that reason the opposition does not oppose the With Tattersalls and other lotteries operating Bill. throughout much of Australia the pOSition in New Zealand and Britain is not analogous with Australia Mr CLARK (Balwyn) - I support the remarks as a whole. However, in considering the matter on made by the honourable member for Brighton. This the basis of commonsense, it appears that the market is a matter of individual choice and if people wish to for premium accounts is different from the market engage in this sort of gambling scheme we, as a for nonnallotteries. Parliament, should not be standing in their way. However, on an analysis of the scheme of gambling The point has been made by a number of people that contained in the Bill and on what I understand is the there is some advantage in participating in the corresponding Commonwealth legislation it seems it proposed fonn of lottery rather than the traditional will be a pretty poor bet for people who choose to gold casket or Tattersall's lottery, in that if one puts take part in these investments in terms of the rate of money into a Tattersall's lottery and does not win, return they will receive on their funds. Not only will the stake is lost. However, under the new scheme their funds be subject to levies contained in the $100 deposit remains in one's account. The proposed section 6N but they will also be subject to opposition believes that is a false analogy and that Commonwealth taxation. When those two taxes are the price of entering the lottery under the scheme is combined the return investors receive from their not the $100 deposit but the interest that is diverted investments will be heavily reduced by two levels of from the account to the prize pool instead of being government having a bite at the pool. paid to the depositor. On my arithmetic, if a person who was paying the It is most unlikely that people will stop buying top marginal rate of taxation of 47.5 per cent won a Tattersalls tickets and instead put away units of $100 prize under this scheme he or she would lose 25 or in premium bond accounts in order to participate in 30 per cent to State revenue and another 47.5 per the monthly lottery. It appears that the attraction cent to Commonwealth revenue of the money that value will be small. If the effect of additional became available in the pool, which is the equivalent revenue going to the Commonwealth is ignored of the interest earned on a nonnal account. The Victoria stands to suffer some loss of revenue as a money available to an investor would at best be 75 result of the introduction of this scheme. However, per cent of 52.5 per cent of the gross prize pool, the loss will be on a small scale and in the final which works out to be something in the order of 40 analysis it will reflect no more than the choice of a per cent. The effective take out of the investment limited number of people preferring to put their pool of 60 per cent compares most Wlfavourably money into a premium account rather than buy a with the take out of other investment pools, such as lottery ticket. The opposition suspects that the the Totalizator Agency Board at slightly more than behaviour of people who buy lottery tickets will be 15 per cent in the pools with the least take, ranging substantially unaltered by the Bill and that any to in the order of 20 per cent in the pools with higher detrimental effect on the operation of lotteries and takes, and the Tattslotto pool at 40 per cent. on the State revenue will be small. I see little merit in the sort of scheme being proposed The opposition has been provided with a great deal in the Bill. However, it is not for members of of material by the principal proponents of the Parliament to tell people what they can speculate on scheme, in particular the ANZ Bank and it with their money. So long as people are aware of the ENVIRONMENT PROTECTION (RESOURCE RECOVERY) BILL

2110 ASSEMBLY Wednesday, 10 June 1992 sorts of returns they will obtain and of the big bites 11. Clause 4, line 27, omit "establish" and insert that will be taken out of the money at State and "monitor and report on". Federal levels, it is their choice as to whether they 12. Clause 4, page 4, line 9, omit "investigate and help participate in this sort of arrangement. People develop" and insert "support the development of". should be entitled to participate if they so wish. For those reasons I join with the honourable member for 13. Clause 4, page 4, lines 11 to 14, omit paragraphs (g) Brighton in indicating that the legislation should be and (h). allowed to proceed. 14. Clause 4, page 4, line 16, omit "(1) Recycle 2000" and insert ''The Council". Mr ROPER (Minister for Gaming) - I thank honourable members for their contributions. This is 15. Clause 4, page 4, lines 19 to 21, omit proposed a minor measure but one that at least one bank sub-section (2). believes is a worthwhile initiative on its part. Uke 16. Clause 4, page 4, lines 23 to 26, omit all words and the honourable members for Brighton and Balwyn, expressions on these lines and insert - the government will wait to see whether the bank's analysis of the Australian market is adequate. That is "(1) The Council is to have 14 members." a matter for the bank and this Bill will enable it to 17. Clause 4, page 4,line 30, omit"11 executive conduct that test. members of Recycle 2000" and insert "14 members of the Council". Motion agreed to. 18. Clause 4, page 5, line 5, omit "2" and insert "4". Read second time. 19. Clause 4, page 5, line 5, omit "representatives of local government" and insert "municipal Passed remaining stages. councillors". ENVIRONMENT PROTECfION 20. Clause 4, page 5, lines 10 to 17, omit paragraphs (d) (RESOURCE RECOVERY) BILL and (e) and insert- "(d) 3 representatives of community, employee, Message from Council relating to amendments conservation or consumer interests chosen by considered. the Minister;". Council's amendments: 21. Clause 4, page 5, line 18, omit "(f)" and insert "(e)". 1. Clause 1, line 19, before "measures" insert "viable". 22. Clause 4, page 5, line 22, omit "(g) 3" and insert "(f) 2. Clause 4, line 4, omit ''Recycle 2000" and insert 4". ''Recycling and Resource Recovery Council". 23. Clause 4, page 5, line 26, omit "Recycle 2000" and 3. Clause 4, line 7, omit "Recycle 2000"and insert "the insert "the Council". Recycling and Resource Recovery Council". 24. Clause 4, page 5, line 28, omit ''Recycle 2000" and 4. Clause 4, line 8, omit "Recycle 2000"and insert ''The insert "members of the Council". Council". 25. Clause 4, page 5, lines 29 and 30, omit "executive 5. Clause 4, line 16, omit "Recycle 2000"and insert "the members of Recycle 2000" and insert "the Council". Council". 26. Clause 4, page 5, line 31, omit "49E" and insert 6. Clause 4, lines 17 and 18, omit "executive members of "49D". Recycle 2000" and insert "Council". 27. Clause 4, page 5, line 32, omit "An executive 7. Clause 4, line 20, omit "Recycle 2000" and insert "the member" and insert "A member of the Council". Council". 28. Clause 4, page 6, after line 6 insert - 8. Clause 4, line 21, omit "Recycle 2000" and insert ''The "(f) is to be paid, and is to be paid from the Council". council's funds.". 9. Clause 4, line 23, omit "Recycle 2000" and insert "the 29. Clause 4, page 6, lines 7 and 8, omit "an executive" Council". and insert "a". 10. Clause 4, line 24, before "promote" insert "advise 30. Clause 4, page 6, lines 14 and IS, omit "an executive" on,". and insert "a". ENVIRONMENT PROTECTION (RESOURCE RECOVERY) BILL

Wednesday, ID June ]992 ASSEMBLY 2111

3l. Clause 4, page 6, line 16, omit "49F" and insert "49E". 55. Clause 4, page 8, line 21, omit "Recycle 2000" and insert ''The Council". 32. Clause 4, page 6, line 19, omit"an executive" and insert "a". 56. Clause 4, page 8, lines 24 to 33, and page 9, lines 1 to 36, omit proposed sections 49} and 49K. 33. Clause 4, page 6, line 22, omit "executive". 57. Clause 4, page 10, line I, omit "49L" and insert 34. Clause 4, page 6, line 23, omit "executive". "49H". 35. Clause 4, page 6, line 26, omit "an executive" and 58. Clause 4, page 10, lines 2 and 3, omit "Recycle 2000" insert "a". and insert "the Council". 36. Clause 4, page 6, line 28, omit "executive". 59. Clause 4, page 10, line 3, omit "executive". 37. Clause 4, page 6, line 35, omit "executive". 60. Clause 4, page 10, line 4, omit "Recycle 2000" and 38. Clause 4, page 7, line I, omit "49E" and insert "490". insert tIthe Council". 39. Clause 4, page 7, lines 2 and 3, omit "an executive" 6l. Clause 4, page 10, line 6, omit "a member" and insert and insert "a". "2 members".

40. Clause 4, page 7, line 5, omit "49G" and insert "49F". 62. Clause 4, page 10, line 6, omit "490" and insert "49C". 41. Clause 4, page 7, line 6, omit "executive members of Recycle 2000" and insert "members of the Council". 63. Clause 4, page 10, line 8, omit "490" and insert "49C". 42. Clause 4, page 7, line 9, omit"7 executive" and insert "9". 64. Clause 4, page lO,line 10, omit"a member" and insert "2 members". 43. Clause 4, page 7, line 12, omit "executive". 65. Clause 4, page 10, lines 10 and 11, omit "490(3)(g)" 44. Clause 4, page 7, line 14, omit "Recycle 2000" and and insert "49C(3)(f)". insert "the Council". 66. Clause 4, page 10, line 18, omit "490" and insert 45. Clause 4, page 7, line 25, omit "executive". "49C". 46. Clause 4, page 7, line 26, omit "executive". 67. Clause 4, page ID, line 19, omit "executive". 47. Clause 4, page 7, lines 29 to 34, omit proposed 68. Clause 4, page 10, line 20, omit "490" and insert sub-section (8) and insert - "49C". "(8) If a matter is validly put to a postal vote and at 69. Clause 4, page 10, line 28, omit "2" and insert "3". least 9 members return their votes to the Chairperson in writing within 15 days of the 70. Clause 4, page 11, line I, omit "49M" and insert day the voting papers are sent to them, then "491". the decision of the majority of those executive 71. Clause 4, page 11, line 2, omit "Recycle 2000" and members is the decision of the Council.". insert "The Council". 48. Clause 4, page 7, line 35, omit flan executive" and 72. Clause 4, page 11, line 4, omit "Recycle 2000" and insert "a". insert "the Council". 49. Clause 4, page 8, line 5, omit "Recycle 2000" and 73. Clause 4, page 11, line 9, omit "Recycle 2000" and insert ''The Council". insert "the Council". SO. Clause 4, page 8, line 7 omit "49H" and insert - 74. Clause 4, page 11, line 12, omit "Recycle 2000" and "49G". insert "the Council". 51. Clause 4, page 8, line 8, omit"An executive" and 75. Clause 4, page 11,line 14, omit "Recycle 2000's" and insert "A". insert "the Council's".

52. Clause 4, page 8, line 10, omit "Recycle 2000" and 76. Clause 4, page 11, line 16, omit "49N" and insert insert "the Council". "49J". 53. Clause 4, page 8, line 11, omit "Recycle 2000" and 77. Clause 4, page 11,lines 19 and 20, omit "Recycle insert "the Council". 2000's" and insert "the Council's". 54. Clause 4, page 8, line 19, omit "Recycle 2000" and 78. Clause 4, page 11,line 23, omit "Recycle 2000" and insert ''The Council". insert "the Council". ENVIRONMENT PROTECTION (RESOURCE RECOVERY) BILL

2112 ASSEMBLY VVednesday, 10 June 1992

79. Clause 4, page 11, line 28, omit "490" and insert "(I) The chairpersons of Groups listed in Schedule "49K". C must prepare a draft constitution for the Waste Management Council. so. Clause 4, page l1,line 29, omit "Recycle 2000" and insert ''The Council". (2) If the draft constitution has the approval of a majority of the chairpersons, it must be 81. Clause 4, page 11, line 31, omit "Recycle 2000" and submitted to the Minister for his or her insert "the Council". approval.". 82. Clause 4, page 12, line I, omit "Recycle 2000" and 102. Clause 4, page IS, lines 29 to 31, omit paragraphs insert ''The Council". (c) and (d) and insert- 83. Clause 4, page 12, line 19, omit "49P" and insert "(c) the election of the Council's Chairperson "49L". by all members of the Waste Management 84. Clause 4, page 12, line 20, omit ''Recycle 2000" and Council;". insert ''The Council". 103. Clause 4, page IS, line 32, omit "(e)" and insert 85. Clause 4, page 12, line 30, omit "Recycle 2000" and "(d)". insert "the Council". 104. Clause 4, page 16, line I, omit "(f)" and insert "(e)". 86. Clause 4, page 13, line 6, omit "Recycle 2000" and 105. Clause 4, page 16, line 3, omit "(g)" and insert "(f)". insert "the Council". 106. Clause 4, page 16, line 5, omit "(h)" and insert "(g)". B7. Clause 4, page 13, line B, omit "Recycle 2000" and insert "the Council". 107. Clause 4, page 16, line 8, omit "(i)" and insert "(h)".

8B. Clause 4, page 13, line 12, omit "Recycle 2000" and lOB. Clause 4, page 16, line 10, omit "0)" and insert "(i)". insert "the Council". 109. Clause 4, page 16, line 13, omit "(k)" and insert "0)". 89. Clause 4, page 13, line 17, omit "Recycle 2000" and 110. Clause 4, page 16, line IS, omit "(1)" and insert "(k)". insert "the Council". 111. Clause 4, page 16, line 17, omit "(m)" and insert 90. Clause 4, page 13, line 20, omit "Recycle 2000" and "(I)". insert "the Council". 112. Clause 4, page 16, line 18, omit "(n)" and insert 91. Clause 4, page 13, line 28, omit "49Q" and insert "(m)". "49M". 113. Clause 4, page 16, line 19, after "accounts" insert­ 92. Clause 4, page 13, line 34, omit "Recycle 2000" and insert "the Council". "after the reports have been approved by the majority of the members of the Council.". 93. Clause 4, page 14, line I, omit "Recycle 2000" and insert "the Council". 114. Clause 4, page 16, line 30, omit "30 June" and insert "31 December". 94. Clause 4, page 14, line 3, omit "Recycle 2000" and insert "the Council". 115. Clause 4, page 16, after line 31 insert -

95. Clause 4, page 14, line 5, omit "49Q" and insert "(7) The Minister must ensure that such a "49M". constitution makes adequate provision for the matters set out in sub-section (3).". 96. Clause 4, page 14, line 7, omit "490" and insert "49K". 116. Clause 4, page 16, line 32, omit "(7)" and insert 97. Clause 4, page 14, line 16, omit "Recycle 2000" and "(8)". insert "the Council". 117. Clause 4, page 16, lines 35 to 37, and page 17, lines 98. Clause 4, page 14, line 18, omit ''Recycle 2000" and 1 to 6, omit proposed sub-sections (8) and (9) and insert "the Council". insert- 99. Clause 4, page 14, line 22, omit "Recycle 2000" and "(9) The fixing of a constitution by the Minister is to insert ''The Council". be regarded as if it were the approval of the 100. Clause 4, page IS, line 9, omit "executive" and constitution by the Minister under sub-section insert "Board". (4).". 101. Clause 4, page IS, lines 17 to 22, omit proposed 118. Clause 4, page 17, lines 16 to 19, omit paragraph (c) sub-sections (1) and (2) and insert- and insert- ENVIRONMENT PROTECTION (RESOURCE RECOVERY) BILL

Wednesday, 10 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2113

"(c) to encourage municipal councils to- (3) In this Division a reference to an industry may be read as a reference to a sector of an (i) adopt schemes for composting domestic industry. waste, mulching garden waste and recycling rubble; SIA. Industry waste reduction agreements

(ii) collect recyclable items wherever (1) The Authority may enter into an industry waste practicable; reduction agreement with any person or with any association representing an industry. (iii) set performance targets for municipal waste reduction programs;". (2) Such an agreement must, in accordance with the regulations - 119. Clause 4, page 17, lines 21 and 22, omit "Recycle 2000" and insert "the Recycling and Resource (a) identify the solid wastes that are likely to Recovery Council". arise as a result of the activities of the person or industry; and 120. Clause 4, page 17, lines 24 and 25, omit "Strategies for waste reduction and disposal" and insert (b) set out what steps the person or industry 'Waste Management Plans". will take to do all or any of the following 121. Clause 4, page 18, lines 22 and 23, omit "Recycle 2000" and insert "the Recycling and Resource (i) to reduce those wastes or to keep those Recovery Council". wastes to a minimum; or

122. Clause 4, page 18, after line 23 insert- (ii) to recover, recycle or re-use those wastes; or "(n) to promote research into landfill disposal costs and charges.". (iii) to reduce litter; or 123. Clause 4, page 19, lines 3 and 4, omit "by all (iv) to safely dispose of the wastes that municipal councils in Victoria." cannot be recovered, recycled or re-used; and 124. Clause 4, page 19, after line 4, insert- (c) specify targets to be achieved by the person ";and or industry with respect to those steps; and (d) 1 representative from any new member of the (d) provide an economic assessment of the Council". market for the wastes that can be 125. Clause 4, page 19, lines 9 to 11, omit proposed recovered (if applicable); and sub-section (4). (e) set out the steps that the person or 126. Clause 4, page 19, line 17, after "waste" insert association proposes to take to ensure a "collected at origin and". stable and viable collection system for those wastes in the light of the assessment 127. Clause 4, page 20, line 1, omit 1/1993" and insert made under paragraph (d) (if applicable); "1994". and 128. Clause 4, page 22, lines 26 to 34, pages 23 to 33, and (f) provide for the person or association to give page 34, lines 1 to 31, omit proposed Sub-divisions the Authority and the Recycling and 1 to 3 of Division 4 and insert - Resource Recovery Council a report every "51. Application of this Division 6 months on the progress made with respect to the implementation of the (1) This Division applies to any person or industry agreement; and that creates, manages or disposes of or first sells items in Victoria that could result in (g) specify the period or periods for which it is wastes being deposited in Victoria. to be in force. (2) For the purposes of this Division, if a person is a (3) The agreement may provide for any other body corporate, a reference to that person incidental matter. includes a reference to any subsidiary of that SIB. Criteria to be satisfied before Authority person within the meaning of the may enter agreement Corporations Law. The Authority must enter into an industry waste reduction agreement with any person, or with any ENVIRONMENT PROTECTION (RESOURCE RECOVERY) BILL

2114 ASSEMBLY Wednesday, ID June 1992

association representing an industry, to whom this (4) The AuthOrity may withdraw the notice at any Division applies who has submitted a draft time. industry waste reduction agreement which deals (5) A person who fails to comply with a with the matters listed in section 51A(2) after the requirement under this section is guilty of an Authority- offence. (a) has consulted the Recycling and Resource Penalty: 100 penalty units. Recovery Council with regard to the agreement and any targets and performance SIF. Notice of breach of agreement measures in the agreement; and (1) If at any time the AuthOrity, acting reasonably, (b) is satisfied that the agreement is generally believes a person or an industry is in breach of consistent with any national strategy or an industry waste reduction agreement, the industry plan that has been endorsed by that Authority may give the person, or the Council. association representing the industry, a notice of breach. SIC. Monitoring by the Authority (2) The notice must - (1) The Authority must monitor industry waste reduction agreements. (a) be in writing; and (2) The monitoring must take into account the (b) specify the breach; and environmental, economic, commercial and (c) specify the date by which the Authority social issues involved in the agreement and requires the breach to be rectified. must seek, and take into account, the views of the public generally, local government and (3) The date specified must be at least 3 months industry. after the date of the notice.

(3) The AuthOrity must keep a record of products (4) A person to whom a notice is given under this or materials for which there are no industry section must rectify the breach in accordance waste reduction agreements. with the requirement in the notice. 510. Amendments to agreements Penalty: 100 penalty points. The Authority must agree to amend an industry 51G. Reports to Parliament waste reduction agreement at any time if - (1) The Authority may, from time to time, submit to (a) it is of the opinion that the amended agreement the Minister - would satisfy section 51B were it a new (a) a report on industry waste reduction agreement; and agreements; (b) it has consulted the Recycling and Resource (b) a report identifying any person or industry Recovery Council with regard to the to whom this Division applies and who is amendment; and not a party to an industry waste reduction (c) the amendment does not deal with a matter that agreement; is subject to a notice under section 51F. (c) a report identifying any person or industry 51E. Authority may require a person to enter who has failed to submit a draft industry agreement waste reduction agreement under section 51E; (I) The Authority may require any person or industry to whom this Division applies and (d) a report identifying any person or industry who is not a party to an industry waste who has failed to provide a satisfactory reduction agreement to submit to the explanation for any variation of Authority a draft industry waste reduction performance from that set out in their agreement that complies with section 51A(2). industry waste reduction agreement. (2) Notice of the requirement must be in writing (2) Amongst other matters, any such report must - and must specify the date by which the draft (a) include an economic assessment of the agreement must be submitted. market for the wastes that can be (3) The date specified must be at least 6 months recovered by the person or industry (if after the date of the notice. relevant); and ENVIRONMENT PROTECTION (RESOURCE RECOVERY) BILL

Wednesday, 10 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2115

(b) take into account relevant environmental, 143. Clause 4, page 42, lines 29 to 34, omit all words and economic, commercial and social issues. expressions on these lines and insert -

(3) The Minister must cause any such report to be "Group (if any) of which that council is a member, laid before each House of Parliament before if that council is listed in Schedule 0; or the end of the seventh sitting day of that (B) to a nominated representative municipal House after the report is received by the council, if that council is listed as a member of Minister. a geographical grouping in Schedule 0 and (4) The Authority must not name any person, or the councils in that grouping have nominated any association representing an industry, in a a council to act as their representative to report under sub-section (1)(b), (c) or (d) receive payments made under this section; or unless, at least 28 days before the report is (C) to the Waste Management Council, if that submitted to the Minister, it has given that council is listed in Schedule C or is not a person or association a notice in writing member of any Regional Management Group advising that it intends to take that action. or geographical grouping that has nominated (5) The notice must also specify the reasons why a representative under sub-sub-paragraph (B); the Authority intends to name the person or and". association.". 144. Clause 4, page 43, lines 1 and 2, omit "Recycle 129. Clause 4, page 34, lines 33 to 35, and page 35, lines 2000" and insert "the Recycling and Resource 1 to 9, omit proposed section 51Q. Recovery Council". 130. Clause 4, page 35, lines 18 and 19, omit "regional 145. Clause 4, page 43, lines 15 to 19, omit all words and corporation formed under section" and insert expressions on these lines and insert - "corporation formed under section 193 or". "(B) to a nominated representative municipal 131. Clause 4, pages 36 to 40, and page 41, lines 1 to 16, council, if that council is listed as a member of omit proposed Divisions 6 and 7. a geographical grouping in Schedule 0 and the councils in that grouping have nominated 132. Clause 4, page 41, line 17, omit 1/8" and insert "6". a council to act as their representative to 133. Clause 4, page 41, line 18, omit 1/530" and insert receive payments made under this section; or "52". (C) to the Waste Management Council, if that 134. Clause 4, page 41, lines 20 and 21, omit "The council is listed in Schedule C or is not a Authority, after consultation with Recycle 2000" member of any Regional Management Group and insert ''The Recycling and Resource Recovery or geographical grouping that has nominated Council, after consultation with the Authority". a representative under sub-sub-paragraph (B); and". 135. Clause 4, page 41, line 23, omit "establish" and insert "publish". 146. Clause 4, page 43, lines 20 and 21, omit "Recycle 2000" and insert "the Recycling and Resource 136. Clause 4, page 41, line 27, omit 1/9" and insert '7". Recovery Council". 137. Clause 4, page 41, line 28, omit 1/53E" and insert 147. Clause 4, page 43, line 23, omit ''Recycle 2000" and "52A". insert "the Recycling and Resource Recovery 138. Clause 4, page 41, line 31, and page 42, line 1, omit Council". "(other than fines)". 148. Clause 4, page 43, line 24, omit ''Recycle 2000" and 139. Clause 4, page 42, line 6, omit 1/53F" and insert insert "the Recycling and Resource Recovery "52B". Council".

140. Clause 4, page 42, line 17, omit "53G" and insert 149. Clause 4, page 43, line 25, omit ''Recycle 2000" and "52C". insert "the Council". 141. Clause 4, page 42, line 20, omit "53F" and insert 150. Clause 4, page 43, after line 29 insert - "52B". "(3) The Authority must comply with sub-section 142. Clause 4, page 42, lines 24 and 25, omit"a member (1) not more than 60 days after receiving any of a Regional Waste Management Group" and money under section SOS." insert "listed in Schedule C or 0". ENVIRONMENT PROTECTION (RESOURCE RECOVERY) BILL

2116 ASSEMBLY Wednesday, IQ June 1992

151. Clause 4, page 43, line 30, omit "53H" and insert 174. Clause 20, omit this clause. "52D". Mr HARROWFIELD (Minister for Finance) - I 152. Clause 4, page 43, line 31, omit "53F and 53G" and move: insert "52B and 52C". That the amendments be agreed to. 153. Clause 4, page 43, line 32, omit ''Recycle 2000" and insert lithe Recycling and Resource Recovery The Bill is a major advance in terms of better Council". recycling and waste management procedures in 154. Clause 4, page 44, line 1, omit "531" and insert Victoria. Obviously the government and the "52E". opposition have disagreed about some issues. In particular, the amendments that we are now 155. Clause 4, page 44, line 3, omit "53G" and insert discussing mean the acceptance of volWltary "52C". national recycling targets that could easily be 156. Clause 4, page 44, line 4, omit ''Recycle 2000" and bettered in Victoria; the removal of any obligation on insert lithe Recycling and Resource Recovery industry to make financial contributions to Council". improving the recycling system; the weakening of sanctions against non-performers in recycling; and 157. Clause 4, page 44, lines 16 to 30, omit proposed allowing at least the potential, if not the reality, of Division 10. environmentally dangerous products going into 158. Clause 5, lines 2 to 10, omit all words and landfills. expressions on these lines and insert- Although the amendments were not sought by the '(1) In section 4(1) of the Principal Act, after the government it is important that the Bill should be definition of '1icence" insert -'. passed. In those circumstances it was important that 159. Clause 5, line 12, omit "16" and insert "9". I make those points in relation to the amendments that are being discussed. 160. Clause 5, lines 15 to 20, omit paragraphs (d) and (e). 161. Clause 6, omit this clause. The Bill will provide for a better coordinated recycling system in Victoria, the provision of better 162. Clause 7, omit this clause. information about recycling to householders and the 163. Clause 8, omit this clause. development of a better system of recycling. If nothing else, the Bill has heightened community 164. Clause 9, lines 19 to 24, omit sub-clause (1) and awareness of the importance of recycling, an insert - awareness that was growing in any case. '(1) After section 16(IA) of the Principal Act insert- These amendments are not the ones we sought but we accept them because they are necessary to "(IB) The Governor in Council may, by Order, achieve the legislation. declare State environment protection policy with respect to the removal, disposal or Mr HONEYWOOD (Warrandyte) - This Bill has reduction of litter in the environment.".'. involved an enormous amount of consultation. 165. Clause 10, omit this clause. Much thought went into the various proposals that were put to both the opposition and the government 166. Clause 11, omit this clause. regarding the implementation of the legislation. It 167. Clause 13, omit this clause. involved major input by local government, industry groups and individual companies and, far from 168. Clause 15, omit this clause. agreeing with the Minister's rhetoric about the 169. Clause 16, page 49, omit proposed Schedule B. provisiOns being watered down through voluntary agreement, we believe we have produced a package 170. Clause 18, line 3, omit "(1)". that will effectively provide for the implementation 171. Clause 18, line 7, omit"l January" and insert"l of so-called resource recovery. October". One of the key amendments provides for a $10 000 172. Clause 18, lines 8 to 10, omit sub-clause (2). fine for any company that does not meet the 173. Clause 19, line 13, omit "16" and insert "9". volWltary industry agreement it puts forward. We have been told by a number of parties, including the FIRE AND EMERGENCY SERVICES (MISCELLANEOUS AMENDMENTS) BILL

Wednesday, 10 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2117

Australian Conservation Foundation, that in to address the issue of future funding to ensure that addition to being fined $10 000 and named as a a more equitable system is introduced. company that has not done the right thing, a company would have been more deterred by the Motion agreed to. imposition of a tax of 1 per cent that was proposed at one point. The trouble with the tax is it would AGRICULTURAL AND VETERINARY encourage more businesses to flee Victoria and CHEMICALS BILL would act as a major deterrent to industry rejuvenation in Victoria. Returned from Council with message relating to Council's suggested amendment and amendments. In addition, we have watered down the concept of the Recycle 2000 body and allowed for greater Message read recommending appropriation. industry and local representation on the replacement body that will implement the Message from Council considered. legislation. Apart from noting that there will not be Council's suggested amendment: many recoverable resources on the other side of the House after the forthcoming election, the opposition Clause 66, line 22, after "office" insert - supports the Bill. "., and

Motion agreed to. (c) unless he or she holds a full-time government office (within the meaning of the Public FIRE AND EMERGENCY SERVICES Service Act 1974) or a full-time office in the (MISCELLANEOUS AMENDMENTS) public service or with a statutory authority, is BILL entitled to be paid allowances for travelling and personal expenses at the rates and on the Returned from Council with message relating to conditions applicable to officers of the public amendments. service.". Council's amendments: Council's amendments:

1. Clause 2, line 5, omit "or days". 1. Clause 4, page 3, line 2, after "preparation" insert "(whether in a solid or liquid form)". 2. Clause 4, omit this clause. 2. Clause 6, line 9, omit "that 12 months" and insert 3. Clause 7, line 26, at the end of this line insert - "than 2 years".

3. Clause 8, after line 7 insert - (a) After "Authority" (where first occurring) insert "(3) If national registration arrangements for "(not being a volunteer officer or member)"; preparations come into existence under the (b) , Commonwealth Act - 4. Clause 13, omit this clause. (a) the Minister may, by notice published in the Government Gazette, declare that those Mr SANDON (Minister for Police and arrangements apply for the purposes of Emergency Services) - I move: this Act; and

That the amendments be agreed to. (b) while the registration of a preparation is in force under those arrangements the The Bill has returned from another place where the preparation must be taken to be registered amendments have been made and we concur with under this Act.". them. 4. Gause 14, lines 28 and 29, omit paragraph (b) and insert- Mr McNAMARA (Leader of the National Party) - I thank the Minister for agreeing to the "(b) on any prescribed ground.". amendments moved in another place. They are 5. Clause 16, line 3, omit all words and expressions on appropriate and they add some sanity to the this line and insert - legislation. The Bill, as amended, will ensure that funding for fire services in Victoria will continue for "(a) the names of all registered preparations; and a further period during which time we will be able ADJOURNMENT

2118 ASSEMBLY Wednesday, 10 June 1992

(b) the names of the wholesale dealers in registered Motion agreed to. preparations.". Mr BAKER (Minister for Food and 6. Clause 18, line 22, omit "12 months" and insert "2 Agriculture) - I move: years". 7. Clause 27, line 24, omit ", and time at which,". That the amendments be agreed to. 8. Clause 42, lines 31 and 32, omit "over land that is not Mr McNAMARA (Leader of the National owned or occupied by the person". Party) - The bulk of the amendments were moved 9. Clause 43, lines 20 and 21, omit "on land not owned by the coalition and I support the motion. or occupied by the pilot". Dr NAPTHINE (Portland) -It is important to 10. Clause 55, line 26, after "dealer" insert- recognise that these amendments were put forward "if- by the coalition to improve the legislation and the way the legislation has come forward is part of a (i) it is being carried out for a prescribed reason; or package that is in line with Commonwealth (ii) the result of the testing shows that the legislation. When the Bill was Originally brought preparation does nor comply with standards forward the Minister introduced it with some set under this Act; or urgency and said it needed to be passed quickly. At that time the coalition consulted with the industry, (iii) the result of the testing shows that the which had not seen the legislation. Since that time, it preparation has been changed in a way that is has been announced that this measure is not as required under this Act to be approved and urgent as the Minister made out. The industry has approval has not been obtained". been widely consulted by the coalition and these 11. Clause 56, page 43, line 23, after "owner" insert­ amendments have come forward from suggestions from the industry and they improve the legislation "if- significantly. (i) it is being carried out for a prescribed reason; or It is of note that although the Minister claimed the (ii) the result of the testing shows that the stock or Bill was urgent, it has been on the Notice Paper with agricultural produce (as the case requires) is the amendments suggested by the Legislative contaminated or that, in the case of land, the Council for some weeks and it is being dealt with growing of plants or the grazing of stock on it now on the final day of the sessional period. would be likely to result in the production of contaminated agricultural produce or the The coalition has improved the amending legislation contamination of the stock". because it is significant for the veterinary and 12. Clause 59, line 5, before "A" insert "(I)". agricultural chemical industries. It hopes it works well and dovetails into the legislation being planned 13. Clause 59, after line 11 insert- by the Commonwealth government that may be "(2) A person must not make any statement about a implemented during the next 12 months. preparation or its use that is false or misleading and likely to cause a person who Motion agreed to. relies on the statement to commit an offence under this Act. Ordered to be returned to Council with message intimating decision of House. Penalty: In the case of a corporation, 100 penalty units. ADJOURNMENT In any other case, 50 penalty units.". Mr ROPER (Minister for Employment, Mr BAKER (Minister for Food and Post-Secondary Education and Training) - I move: Agriculture) - I move: That the House, at its rising, adjourn until a day and That the House make the amendment suggested by the hour to be fixed by Mr Speaker, which time of meeting Council. shall be notified to each member of the House by telegram or letter. Mr McNAMARA (Leader of the National Party) - The opposition supports the motion. AGRICULTURAL INDUSTRY DEVELOPMENT (TOMATO PROCESSING) BILL

Wednesday, 10 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2119

Mr MACLELLAN (Berwick) - Honourable their viability because Victoria produces members are entitled to know when the House will approximately $20 million worth of tomatoes or resume and whether it is expected to resume for a 70 per cent of the Australian production. normal Budget session. Before agreeing to the motion the Leader of the House can be given leave The Bill repeals the Tomato Processing Industry Act to provide further information to honourable and is drafted in a similar format to other members so that they can make arrangements in agricultural Bills such as that dealing with the wine their electorates during the recess and so that they grape industry. No doubt other agricultural know whether the spring session will be of normal industries will come under the umbrella of duration, whether it will be short or long or whether agricultural industry development legislation in the there will be a session. If at all possible the years to come. govenunent will run away from its Parliamentary obligations so it cannot be held accountable for its The Bill provides for the establishment of the Budget outcomes. Tomato Processing Industry Development Order which will: establish a Tomato Industry Negotiating These matters should be in the mind of the Leader of Committee; recommend prices to be paid by the House. Cabinet will have made decisions about processors; recommend the terms and conditions of it, and the Minister for Employment, Post-Secondary payment; recommend grade standards and grading Education and Training should provide detailed procedures for tomatoes purchased by processors; advice regarding what he expects to be the duration determine provisions to be included in contracts of the spring session. between producers and processors for the supply and purchase of tomatoes for processing; and Mr ROPER (Minister for Employment, provide a means of settling disputes between Post-Secondary Education and Training) producers and processors about the grading of (By leave) - Although I cannot predict the end of the tomatoes purchased by processors. spring session - that is a matter for the Premier to determine - I inform honourable members that it is The coalition has had time-consuming consultations the govenunent's intention to introduce the Budget with the representatives of the Victorian Farmers in the normal way and to commence the session in Federation and the tomato processors group, and I approximately the third or fourth week of August. I place on record the cooperation shown to the shall make a program available to the Deputy coalition by those two groups, which had different Leaders of both parties as soon as it is available. points of view.

As has been intimated already, Bills have been The Minister for Food and Agriculture does no deliberately introduced at this time so that credit to himself when he introduces Bills of this Parliament has a number of measures to debate nature because he shows no concern for the growers. when it resumes. It was only after a long process of consultation that the coalition's agricultural committee drew together Motion agreed to. the different views of the processors and growers.

AGRICULTURAL INDUSTRY I understand that during the Committee stage the DEVELOPMENT (TOMATO Minister will move a number of amendments tha t PROCESSING) BILL were basically agreed to by both sides of the industry. The coalition is pleased because it Second reading demonstrates that, if one is prepared to do the work, cooperation can be reached between the growers Debate resumed from 9 April; motion of and the processors. Mr BAKER (Minister for Food and Agriculture). The tomato growers group has been well led in Mr W. D. McGRATH (Lowan) - This important discussions and negotiations. I well remember the Bill affects a number of Victorians and it is first meeting in this building when both groups important to growers, processors and the workers gathered. The conversation was very much up front who are involved in the processing industry. and straightforward; both groups expressed their Victoria produces a high quality product that is used views strongly. Now we are in a position to allow for domestic consumption. The participants in the the passage of this Bill because the parties were able industry should operate at a profit and maintain AGRICULTURAL INDUSTRY DEVELOPMENT (TOMATO PROCESSING) BILL

2120 ASSEMBLY Wednesday, 10 June 1992 to negotiate an agreement. I hope the Bill will serve must also suffer the possibility of importation of all components of the industry well. tomatoes from New Zealand, which has a distinct advantage because of the lower dollar value there. It Tomato growers have been concerned about the is an advantage for New Zealanders to export their reducing arbitrated price, from $118 per tonne in products, particularly to Australia. 1991 with a contracted record intake achieved by the industry. They have had to suffer about a 30 per cent In addition to anti-dumping regulations and the cut in the contract arrangements and sell their government prOViding a protective duty, we must produce at about $9 per tonne less than the agreed aggressively address such matters as meeting price. It is difficult to achieve a reasonable return in quality standards; in that respect, the Australian today's farming environment. Quarantine and Inspection Service (AQIS) can play a stronger role. The national authority representing The increasing costs of chemicals and fuel alone are food manufacturers has a Significant role to play in difficult to counter. As the Minister recently ensuring that not only tomatoes but all food outlined, agricultural products in Victoria have products meet stringent regulations when imported withstood chemical residues extremely well. I into Australia. The Minister for Health has a understand that about 99 per cent of agricultural responsibility to ensure correct labelling so that the production is chemical free in this State. That is no country of origin and the correct description of the mean feat and reflects well on the farming product contained in a can is readily apparent to community. supermarket customers.

In today's Herald-Sun an article on food imports Without acting contrary to the way in which other states: countries import and export foodstuffs, we could put more hurdles in front of the importation of SPC chairman John Corboy claimed last September that tomatoes and tomato paste into Australia. It is overseas tomato producers had about 50 per cent of the necessary for us to ensure that we provide as much Australian market. advantage as possible to our growers and processors, to those who work on the farms at ... Victorian Farmers Federation tomato section harvesting time, and to those involved in the chairman Mr Peter Walsh said it was misleading to processing industry. discount the damage being done on the basis of new figures. 'lrnport statistics aren't the only measure of Harvesting tomatoes is a very labour-intensive what's going on", Mr Walsh said. "Price is an equal industry. Wages paid to harvesters in the factor and to take anything in isolation doesn't tell the Boort-Kerang region generally average about whole story". Tomato growers had suffered a 30 per $500 000 a year. The tomato processing industry cent cut to contracts and a 9 per cent price drop last provides a valuable economic base for many people year, he said. in the area. If the industry is allowed to fall away, the results will impinge not only on the farmers but As I have said, it is alarming that farm costs are also on members of the work force and the various increasing against a background in which about service industries and suppliers to the industries. 50 per cent of tomato product is being imported. As I said, by working together the various sectors of The tomato industry contested and won an the industry have reached agreement. I record in anti-dumping case against overseas importers. The Hansard a letter I have received from the Australian Commonwealth anti-dumping procedures take too Tomato Processors Association: long for a case to be established - about 290 days. That would not happen in any other country with Agricultural Industry Development (Tomato similar standards. The United States of America Processing) Bill 1992 would soon demonstrate that a product was entering that country at a price lower than the cost of With reference to recent discussions we hereby confirm production there. support from the Victorian members for the attached amendments to Schedule 2 of the above Bill. The tomato industry was able to demonstrate that to the authorities. Now we are able to put in place Based on the overall adoption by members of the VFF protective duties to make it more difficult for those Tomato Section, we also confirm the countries to export tomatoes to Australia. Australia AGRICULTURAL INDUSTRY DEVELOPMENT (TOMATO PROCESSING) BILL

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endorsements/adoption of the enclosed industry code Through the work I mentioned earlier, a much of practice by Victorian members. tighter provision will be included by way of amendment. I understand the Minister for Food and Yours sincerely, Agriculture will move an amendment along the Jens Norlyng lines that the tomato processing industry President development order made under the Agricultural Australian Tomato Processors Association. Industry Development Act 1990 will have the following purposes, which come to the nitty-gritty The letter indicates that a copy has been sent to of the changes: Mark Cohen, the executive officer of the Victorian Farmers Federation Tomato Section. The letter The purposes of this order are: continues: (a) to set up a committee:

P.S. It is observed that clause 17 of the Bill amendment (i) to recommend prices to be paid by processors does not tie in with other clauses (i.e. 9-10-11-16) to producers for processing tomatoes grown and will need further modification. in the State; (ii) to recommend the terms and conditions of The letter lists the Victorian members of the payments; Australian Tomato Processors Association: Ardmona Fruit Products, Mooroopna; EAC (Aust.) (iii) to recommend grade standards and grading Ltd - Plumrose Division, Nepean Highway, procedures for tomatoes purchased by Cheltenham; H. J. Heinz Co. Aust. Ltd, Princes processors; Highway, Dandenong; SPC Ltd, Andrew Fairley (b) to determine provisions to be included in contracts A venue, Shepparton; and Unifoods Pty Ltd, Femtree between producers and processors for the supply Gully Road, Knoxfield. or purchase of tomatoes purchased by processors; It was encouraging to receive the correspondence (c) to provide a means of settling disputes between the from Jens Norlyng. On 15 May I received a letter producers and processors about the grading of from Mr Peter Walsh, President, Victorian Farmers tomatoes purchased by processors. Federation Tomato Section, in which he says: Part 4 of the agreed amendments deals with definitions that are basically the same as those I enclose signed copies of changes to the AID (Tomato contained in the Bill. Processing) Bill and the Industry Code of Practice both as negotiated and agreed. by the VFF Tomato Section Next follows the difference between the provisions with the Australian Tomato Processors Association. of the Bill and those recommended by the various sectors of the industry. The Bill provides that: The VFF Tomato Section supports the amendments to the code of practice and the AID (Tomato Processing) The Chairperson is not entitled to vote on any question Bill. arising at a meeting of the Committee. We confirm our willingness on behalf of our growers to I foreshadow that if the Minister for Food and comply with the above. Agriculture does not move the necessary amendments they will be moved in the Upper Yours faithfully, House by Mr de Fegely, on behalf of the coalition. Peter Walsh Under the terms of the agreement arrived at President between the processors and producers, the following VFF Tomato Section. provision will be included in the Bill: The letter has attached to it the amendments that The chairperson is not entitled to vote on any question have been agreed upon. Clause 9 of the Bill provides arising at a meeting of the committee excepting in the that the Tomato Industry Negotiating Committee event of an impasse in the recommended price only "may" recommend prices to be paid to negotiations. In the event of an impasse being reached producers. The committee is to comprise four during negotiations on a recommended price the members from the processors and four members chairman shall have a casting vote. from the growers, with the chairperson to be an officer of the Department of Food and Agriculture. AGRICULTURAL INDUSTRY DEVELOPMENT (TOMATO PROCESSING) BILL

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A great deal more responsibility will be placed on (b) times of payment; the chairperson. The two parties to the negotiations (c) interest penalties for non-compliance with times will have to sharpen their pencils, as it were, in of payment. preparing their final offer on the negotiated price. The decision of the independent chairperson will be It then says: made somewhat easier if a vote must be cast in a (3) If the Committee fails to reach an agreement to situation where the two sets of figures are fairly recommend terms and conditions of payment close together. If the two sides are trying to maintain those applying in the previous year must be continuity in the tomato processing industry they recommended. will endeavour to offer prices that are close. The involvement of the chairperson may therefore be Once again I believe the agreement tightens up the only minor. provision by requiring a commitment by both sides. Perhaps that is why they have arrived at that There may be an enormous amount of pressure on position of a commitment by both sides to ensure the chairman regarding price if an impasse is that the industry has a degree of fairness for reached. Clause 9(1) of Schedule 2 provides for the everyone involved. function to recommend prices. It says: Clause 11 of the schedule, which relates to the The Committee may recommend prices for tomatoes function to recommend grade standards and purchased by a processor. grading procedures, provides:

(1) The Committee may recommend grade standards The agreement between the processors and the and grading procedures for tomatoes purchased producers says: by processors. (1) The committee must recommend prices for tomatoes The agreed pOSition of the growers and processors purchased by the processor. on clause 11 of the schedule is: It goes on to say: The Committee must recommend grade standards (2) The Committee may recommend different prices for and grading procedures for tomatoes purchased tomatoes according to- by processors. (a) the grade of the tomato; Once again it is a tightening up of the position that has been agreed to by the processors and the (b) the purpose for which they are used or intended producers. As I said at the beginning, those two to be used. groups are to be congratulated on the work they (3) The Committee may adjust a recommended price if have done. Further, a code of practice has been it is of the opinion that it is appropriate to do so developed for this industry, which is now included because of the changed circumstances. in the agreement which I hope will become part of the legislation. The code of practice, jointly adopted Once again under the agreement there is a degree of by the Australian Tomato Processors Association flexibility. Clause 10 of the schedule deals with the and the Victorian Farmers Federation Tomato function to recommend terms and conditions of Section, must be reviewed at the first meeting each payment. It states: year of the Tomato Industry Negotiating Committee. (1) The Committee may recommend the terms and It may make recommendations to the Australian conditions of payment by processors for tomatoes. Tomato Processors Association on amendments to the code, which may be adopted by the signatories, The agreed position that I hope the Minister will and which will be published in the market report take up between the producer and the processors prepared by the Tomato Industry Negotiating says: Committee. (1) The Committee must recommend terms and conditions of payment by processors for tomatoes. The Agricultural Industry Development Act will be subject to review mid-term of the order. The (2) The terms and conditions of payment recommended Minister will appoint three persons to conduct the by the Committee may include all or any of the review. The review team will be appointed by 31 following- August 1994 and it will report to the Minister no (a) maximum amounts which should be deducted later than 30 November 1994. Its terms of reference from the price otherwise payable for tomatoes; will be to assess the effectiveness of the Tomato AGRICULTURAL INDUSTRY DEVELOPMENT (TOMATO PROCESSING) BILL

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Industry Negotiating Committee in meeting its and which would ensure that efficiency is not only objectives and fulfilling its functions and to maintained but also improved. recommend to the Minister whether the order should be recommended, remade or revoked. I give There is an enormous amount of work still to be a strong commitment to that review taking place in done on new irrigation technolOgies. I refer to the two years' time. work being done by Bruce Crockroft in soil sciences in the Shepparton area. I took the opportunity of Mr Bildstien - Hear, hear. visiting Shepparton with Bruce Crockroft - and the honourable member for Shepparton would know Mr W. D. McGRA TH - The honourable member him well - and looked at some of the work he is for Mildura also gives his strong support to ensuring doing in horticulture. He told me that the cost of that the review takes place. We want to ensure that water irrigation is becoming prohibitive for beef the tomato industry continues in Victoria. This is production. We have to be much more efficient in important to those in the country and it is almost as the use of water and produce much higher value important to those in the city because a lot of that crops than just grass that cattle or sheep graze and processing work is carried out in the metropolitan that we turn into either lamb or beef. area. He also said that work is needed to be done in the Mr Richardson - It is important in Knox also! science of soils so that we understand what our soils are about, and ensure that we are getting the very Mr W. D. McGRA TH - I am glad to hear that it best effidencies out of the soils and the inputs we is important in Knox also. There is always a lot of make into our agricultural areas. Mr Speaker, you work to be done and it appears that the focus of the heard me speak about the industry code of practice Labor government has been on the growers. for the tomato processors and growers. That code of practice is contained in a six-page document and Mr Bildstien - The easy option. was signed by both the processors and producers of tomatoes. I should like to read it into Hansard but Mr W. D. McGRATH - The focus has been for because of time constraints I shall not do so, but I them to produce their crops at lower prices. I believe shall mention some key aspects of it. A key objective an enormous amount of work can be done on work of the code of practice is its purpose: practices within processing plants. We must address the 17.5 per cent loading, the rostered days off and The purpose of this code of practice is to underwrite penalty rates that are used within the industry if we the process of self-regulation in the Victorian tomato are to have a competitive situation in this country. It processing industry in establishing agreed yet is no use saying that the farmers have to produce voluntary standards of conduct by tomato processors their product at a lower price. That has been said for and tomato growers in negotiations and in contractual the past decade but one of the reasons why farmer relationships. efficiency loses pace with the rest of the world is that they do not have the margins that will provide the Participants. This code of practice is endorsed by the necessary profits to enable them to introduce new Australian Tomato Processors Association and adopted technology or new farm practices. It is Vitally by the Victorian members of the Australian Tomato important that food processing be considered in the Processors Association and the Tomato Section of the overall picture. Victorian Farmers Federation as representing tomato growers in Victoria. Adoption of this code of practice is The farming community cannot be expected to open also to tomato growers and processors in New become more efficient in the amount of produce it South Wales and South Australia. produces if the processors are not efficient. That lack of return on produce means that farmers cannot Principles. Members subscribing to this code of invest in their farms to ensure they maintain the best practice are committed to establishing an environment farm practices in relation to new equipment and which is conducive to the long-run viability, growth new technology and other advantages in their and productivity enhancement of an internationally overall operations. I am concerned that there is not competitive tomato processing industry in Australia. enough money returning to the farming sector to They commit themselves to the view that growers, ensure that world best practice can be put in place, processors and consumers are best served if the market which would enable reinvestment in the industry, is allowed to operate free from restrictive practices, AGRICULTURAL INDUSTRY DEVELOPMENT (TOMATO PROCESSING) BILL

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from external regulation and from activities which may growers shall be linked to the recommended prices manipulate or distort it. for the relevant year;

(ill) That each contract shall specify the tonnage of I believe that aspect of the principles is very tomatoes to be supplied and purchased by the important. U the industry is able to maintain those processor; principles it will be setting the criteria for many. other agricultural industries where the product IS (iv) That each grower shall nominate the number of produced and processed in Australia. U those hectares to be grown, indicating where this is principles can be adhered to they will go a long way shared under contracts to supply more than one towards ensuring that both production and processor. processing have a very sound footing not only for Mr Speaker, the code of practice then refers to many tomatoes but for other horticultural industries: more topics such as the terms and conditions of payment, crop failure, supply of fruit to third Administration. This code of practice is administered parties, supply of surplus fruit, grading of fruit, by a committee comprising members nominated and grading standards and procedures and access to drawn equally from the Australian Tomato Processors premises. It also refers to industry statistics, research Association and the Tomato Section of the Victorian activities and levy collection. It must be said that the Farmers Federation under an independent industry supports a financial commitment to .. Chairperson. This committee shall be responsible for research. It wants to see its industry prosper and It IS any amendments to this code of practice which must be prepared to put its money where its mouth ~ ~y. agreed unanimously. putting levies on its industry for research activIties. Penalties. Failure of members from either the That is very commendable and we hope through the Australian Tomato Processors Association or the agricultural institutes and other institutes around Tomato Section of the Victorian Farmers Federation to Victoria that it is able to get a good. return on that meet their obligations under this code of practice may particular investment because it is vitally important result in such members being cited and, in the last to the industry. While it can be said that the resort, expelled. processors have a big investment in the industry, because I am the shadow Minister for Food. and The articles of the code of practice provide: Agriculture, I can say without fear that the constituency I represent leans more to the Representation. Members accept that representatives, agricultural production side. Perhaps the shadow either elected officers or employees of the accepted Minister for Manufacturing and Industry grower organisation in any state may (if requested) be Development can add his comments on the present at contract negotiations between processors and processing side. growers. I acknowledge that processors make large Members accept that grower representatives shall not commitments with investment into this industry in be disadvantaged in their personal tomato contracting Victoria. It is good. to see new plants being with processors as a result of their activities on behalf developed at Girgarre, which I visited a few weeks of growers and Tomato Section of the Victorian ago. During my visit to one of the plants I Farmers Federation. discovered that government regulations require a boiler attendant to be on duty while the processing Contractual agreements. Members agree to meet the plant is in full production but that that regulation following standards in all contractual arrangements lapses after two years, after which the ~lant can between growers and processors in the supply of operate without having to employ a boiler attendant. processing tomatoes: I am not sure why the attendant is needed, but it is (i) That a standard contract schedule be developed for certainly inappropriate for the owners of the new each member of the Australian Tomato Processors plant to be required to employ him under those Association including all the variations requested conditions. by growers and processors and that a copy of this be lodged with the Executive Officer of the Tomato One of the tomato producers we visited at Boort Section of the Victorian Farmers Federation; gave me the figures for his total production costs for the 1990-91 season, if for no reason other than to put (ii) That each contract agreed between members of the his production costs into their proper perspective. Australian Tomato Processors Association and The figures show that he produced 11 059 gross AGRICULTURAL INDUSTRY DEVELOPMENT (TOMATO PROCESSING) BILL

Wednesday, 10 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2125 tonnes of tomatoes in 1990-91, that 796 cull tonnes The Bill repeals the Tomato Processing Industry Act were deducted and that the net paid tonnes were and replaces it with a marketing order under the 10 263. I am not sure whether the culled tonnes were Agricultural Industry Development Act. The thrown out or processed. shadow Minister for agriculture, the Deputy Leader of the National Party, has explained the purpose of Some 178 hectares were sown to tomatoes, 170 of the order and has examined in detail both the which were harvested. The area harvest yielded 24.3 clauses and the amendments proposed by the paid tonnes per acre, or 60.3 paid tonnes per hectare. coalition after long and exhaustive consultation. The figure for the average cull was 7 per cent. The costs for casual and pennanent employees were The convenor of the coalition's agricultural broken down as follows: weeding costs, $79 841; committee, the Honourable Dick de Fegely, who harvesting costs, $6S 393; general labour, $43 954; represents Ballarat Province in the other place, is to and tax paid on wages, $16 299. The producer had a be commended for the consultations he has total wages bill of $205 487. undertaken with the Victorian Farmers Federation's tomato industry group and the Australian Tomato He paid $51260 for base dressing superphosphate; Processors Association. Members of the coalition $12078 for starter fertilisers; and $25 740 for side have examined the issue in detail and recently spent dressing fertilisers. He incurred spreading costs of some time in the 800rt district talking to growers $2800 and cartage costs of $6380. His total fertiliser and watching tomatoes being harvested. costs were $98 258. He paid a total of $68 333 for the chemicals he used in production. His fuel costs were The Bill is based on the recommendations contained broken down as follows: petrol, $11 221; diesel, in the April 1987 report of the Public Bodies Review $37327; and oil and grease, $8445. Committee, which recommended that the operations of the Tomato Industry Negotiating Committee be He invested $626 200 in equipment, less depreciation reviewed after five years. In carrying out its review at an annual rate of 15 per cent, which amounted to of the Tomato Processing Industry Act the $93 930; and his administrative costs amounted to Department of Food and Agriculture has obviously $28 799. Those costs represent heavy outgoings for ignored those recommendations, because many of only one farmer. Such high levels of investment are the claims made by the Minister in his one of the reasons why farmers do not want to see second-reading speech are not supported by the their industry driven out of existence. report.

The coalition is grateful for the way the growers and The Minister's claim that current statutory processors have worked together to reach intervention must be removed can be contrasted agreement. Although the Bill should not have been with much of what he has been telling farmers and introduced in its present form, I hope the Minister rural communities during his travels throughout will accept the positions agreed to, because the rural Victoria in the past year or so. I refer to an coalition has worked closely with the tomato article in the Age of 12 August 1991, which is headed industry to ensure that the interests of growers and "Baker challenges party line". As the House is producers are protected. The agreements will benefit debating a tomato processing Bill perhaps it is an not only the tomato industry but the economy of opportune time to quote extracts from the article. Victoria, which is why the coalition can be satisfied Given the recent remarks of the Leader of the House with the work it has done. on tariffs and protection, I wonder whether he will contribute to the debate. I remind the Minister of I again express my appreciation of the work done by some of the things he said in August 1991: the tomato processors and the Victorian Farmers Federation tomato producers group, because the The agriculture Minister, Mc Baker, has criticised the positions that have been arrived at will benefit all "flat earth" free-trade policies of the Federal Victorians. government and called for policies that take more account of the public good. Mr BILDSTIEN (Mildura) - I am disappointed that the time for the second-reading debate has been Mc Baker said the free-trade line was all-pervasive. restricted. To ensure that my colleagues can ''There is no doubt there is a particularly virulent ... contribute to the debate I shall make only a brief disease that is running through our university schools contribution. of economics and commerce and has gone out into the Public Service and into the Labor Party itself, and that AGRICULTURAL INDUSTRY DEVELOPMENT (TOMATO PROCESSING) BILL

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is the latest fashion in economic theory ... neo-classical Mr Baker - I still am. economic theory. Mr BILDSTIEN - The 1987 report of the Public '1t carries with it a lot of baggage such as talk of level Bodies Review Committee said it believed the public playing fields ... It carries with it notions of user-pays, interest had been served by the Tomato Industry full-cost accounting." What it did not allow for was Negotiating Committee (TINC) through its role in some sense of the public good, which had always been improving harmony in the industry. Page 76 of the part of Labor thinking, he said. report, under the heading "Consideration of public interest", said the committee was formed as an Mr Baker - A good line! industry forum to assist processors and growers to establish stable business relationships. It was not Mr BILDSTIEN -It was a good line. What has formed to promote the relationships between the happened since? You have changed your mind. The industry and the general public. However, in article continues: encouraging stability in the industry, the committee has facilitated a reliable flow of processed tomato Speaking at the Victorian ALP's country conference in products to consumers. Ballarat- The Minister said the Commonwealth government's perhaps that is the nub: the Minister was speaking at decision to reduce tariffs of imported paste makes it Ballarat - essential that the Victorian industry become competitive with imports. No-one can argue that Mr Baker said Labor had always believed the public Victorian grown tomatoes are not the best in the good had to be built into the economic equation. He world. They are among the most economically was concerned that this was not being argued in the produced, yet everyone involved in tomato farming party any more. and processing is in crisis. The Australian $60 million a year tomato industry is facing a grave At that time the Minister for Food and Agriculture threat from tonnes of cheaper imported products. was arguing -- Australian producers are being priced out of their own market as customers choose cheaper imported Mr Baker - I'm still arguing. products. The Minister well knows that Australia now imports food and beverages valued at more Mr BILDSTIEN - The Minister is still arguing than $2 billion a year and that many of those that the public good needs to be debated in the party imported products come from countries that heavily room. I am pleased to hear that admission. The subsidise their producers and processors. article continues: Over the past two years the Australian tomato The advice he received from industry was always industry has been forced to reduce its production by neo-dassical theory from "economic Druids". He said it about 40 per cent. According to the information worried him that different views were never provided to the coalition's agriculture committee, expressed '" Australia has lost markets totalling about $55 million worth of tomato pieces, purees and pastes because Mr Baker said he strongly opposed the Industry of imports coming from 11 countries - principally, commission's plan for deregulation, w~ch Italy, Thailand and China. Last year tomato growers recommended that all government assistance be and processors spent more than $100 000 gathering scrapped by 1999. This would bring turmoil ... evidence for the Australian Customs Service to show that some of the imported products being sold here Mr Baker said Australia was naive and in "too much of were below the price at which they were sold in a hurry" to be first when it came to dismantling trade their own countries and that they were damaging an protection when there was little evidence that important local primary industry. Australia's main trading partners were rushing to do the same. There was only "modest pressure" around It is interesting that, five weeks after the industry the world for trade reform. lodged its claim, the Australian Customs Service advised the industry that it agreed with the Having reread that article, I must ask why the allegations and would proceed with an inquiry. On Minister is not now arguing in favour of the public 5 December, almost five months later, officials interest. confirmed that tomatoes from Italy, Spain, China AGRICULTURAL INDUSTRY DEVELOPMENT (TOMATO PROCESSING) BILL

Wednesday, 10 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2127 and Thailand were being dumped in Australia at of our briefings. To the contrary, the Public Bodies below their home prices and that local growers were Review Committee accepted the argument that the being damaged as a result. introduction of the Tomato Industry Negotiating Committee (TINC) had led to increased stability in How can the Minister talk about competitiveness prices and greater harmony between growers and with imports when it takes so long for an industry to processors. convince the government to cease dealing with those trade cheats? The Minister will be aware that there They are the words of the committee. Among its are charlatans out there in the world market, and we concluding remarks at page 93 of the report, the cannot stand by and watch some of our most committee rejects the argument and believes there is efficient industries being destroyed by the unjust no conclusive proof that prices have been set too and unfair schemes of our competitors. Australia's high. The farmgate prices for processing tomatoes free trade policy goes far beyond those of most of its has declined by 42 per cent in real terms in the 10 trading partners and has made Australia one of the years to 1987. most open markets in the world for foreign goods. Importers, especially supermarket chains, say they The committee did not accept the point of view of buy cheap foodstuffs on world markets to provide the majority of processing companies that the TINC goods to consumers at affordable prices. The giant should cease to have price setting activities. Five multinational food companies that dominate the years ago the processors were arguing that price manufacture and distribution of food in Australia setting activities of that committee should cease but must certainly have the ear of government. Their the all party Parliamentary Public Bodies Review market power, coupled with the retailers' might, has Committee did not accept that argument. It believed the potential to commit producers to peasantry if the TINC attempted to set prices efficiently and had growers are left without legislative support for the given serious consideration to factors other than marketing arrangements of primary industry. inflation.

Frankly, I believe the mind-set of the abundant On page 82 of the report the committee says that it economists who direct farmers' destinies from the does not accept that the TINC has set prices for Public Service and the consultancy firms that submit tomatoes which have been higher than the prices to please the government bodies that employ them that would prevail in a free market. Clearly the have far too great an influence on the fate of our report is in contrast with the remarks made by the rural industry. The most serious threats arise from Minister in his second-reading speech. within our own nation: inefficiencies and rorts that impose huge costs on producing and shipping, and The committee went on to say that the the sad fact that efforts so far have been applied to determination of prices represented a critical the easy targets with the least political sensitivity component on the TINC activities. Given the small and minimal benefits. number of processing enterprises and the lack of alternative markets for processing tomatoes, the In its 1987 report, the Public Bodies Review committee believed price setting was essential to Committee commented that most of the tariff protect the interests of growers. protection against imports had been to the benefit of the processing sector and not to the growing sector. It stated that an unregulated market for processing tomatoes would be imperfect because of the weak In a report in 1986 the then Industries Assistance bargaining position of growers and therefore Commission estimated that the effective rate of endorsed the statutory pricing of tomatoes as an protection on the processing of tomato paste in 1984 appropriate method of ensuring that growers have was almost 50 per cent. satisfactory bargaining power.

In the second-reading speech the Minister claims The Bill seeks to abandon the protection afforded tha t farmga te prices for tomatoes fixed under the under the existing Act and go down the same path Tomato Processing Industry Act (TPIA) in some of the wine grape industry. One should ask the wine years have been above that which would normally grape industry how it is fairing under the have applied under fair and competitive conditions. legislation. I wrote to Brian Ferry, President of the He does not substantiate that claim or provide Victorian and Murray Valley Wine Grape Growers evidence that that is the case, nor could his Council Inc. and asked him to provide comments on department, when that question was put during one how the wine grape industry is faring under AGRICULTURAL INDUSTRY DEVELOPMENT (TOMATO PROCESSING) BILL

2128 ASSEMBLY Wednesday, 10 June 1992 legislation that we want to introduce for tomatoes. I Industry Development Act. Even the Minister's own shall quote a number of paragraphs. Mr Ferry states: department admits that the Act has failed wine growers because they do not have the skills, the Since the introduction of the Agricultural Industry funds or the resources to match the wine producers Development Bill and the Wine Grape Processing Act, at the negotiating table. grape growers have seen their income significantly reduced. In the recent Ministerial reshuffle the Department of Agriculture and Rural Affairs, as it was then known, That is a telling paragraph. changed its name to the Department of Food and Agriculture. In adding the word "food" I assume the In the first year of operation grape prices were reduced government recognised that food production is of by up to 50 per cent. Processors justification for these vital importance to the Victorian economy and is reductions was based on their insistence of the responsible for an estimated 20 per cent of gross existence of a massive oversupply in excess of 100 ()()(} domestic product and 40 per cent of the State's tonnes due to extremely high stock levels. Australian exports. Bureau of Statistics have since revealed a mistake in their figures of 55 million litres (equivalent to 70 ()()() The Minister has said repeatedly that we must never tonnes). ABS figures are based on data supplied to underestimate the importance of agriculture to the them by the processors. Victorian economy. He said that he recognises the importance of agriculture to the Victorian economy, The letter then talks about what happened to prices but one wonders when one thinks carefully about in the industry. In the summation, Mr Ferry says: the likely ramifications of the legislation on the tomato growing sector whether he has been unable 1. Grape prices have fallen despite increased demand. to convince all of his Cabinet colleagues. Agriculture 2. Single indicator prices have not been achieved. is a major industry to the State. In 1988-89 the gross value of agricultural production was $4.8 billion. 3. 1991 market information distorted. 1992 market information ignored. The SPEAKER - Order! The honourable 4. Prices for grapes in Victoria have fallen behind other member should relate his remarks to the Bill. regions. Mr BILDSTIEN - The Bill will impact on a 5. Growers have not known what prices they will major sector of our rural economy and that one receive for grapes, in many cases until harvest sector is part of an agricultural industry worth commences. $4.8 billion or about 22 per cent of Australia's 6. Some growers have received less than the bottom agricultural production. Agricultural employees in end of the recommended range. this State number about 993 000. When one considers that there are 250 000 unemployed people, 7. VIe industry stagnant, due to lack of grower anything we can do to ensure that agriculture plays confidence. a role in the recovery of the Victorian economy is 8. Development brought to almost a standstill despite important. booming exports, and the requirement for more varietal planting. I shall refer briefly to a statement made by the Federal Leader of the Opposition on 29 April: It is obvious the AID legislation is an impotent piece of legislation which allows the extremely powerful I think one of the things that flabbergasts most and concentrated processing sector of the industry Australians, the one thing they really probably find the freedom to abuse the large market dominance harder to understand at the present time than almost they enjoy without fear of recrimination. anything else, is how Australia, wealthy in terms of its When one reflects on the words of Mr Ferry and agricultural capabilities and the range of its agricultural takes into account the remarks to which I have just products, imports food. referred from the 1987 report of the Public Bodies Review Committee, one can understand why I think the most amazing thing to most Australians concern has been expressed about the legislation. We when they go to the store, to the shelves - and it is not are being asked to accept changes for the tomato just in the canned goods area but it is right across the industry which clearly have not been successful for whole board, and more recently we've seen it in terms the wine grape industry under the Agricultural of things as basic as tomatoes - is trying to understand AGRICULTURAL INDUSTRY DEVELOPMENT (TOMATO PROCESSING) BILL

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why these things are being dumped into this country to the work has been done by the coalition. I join with the detriment of our industry. the honourable members for Lowan and Mildura in commending the coalition's agricultural committee, It is a tragedy, in particular I believe, because the food especially the convenor, the Honourable processing industry, if you have to pick an industry Oick de Fegely, for working so diligently with the that has really got enormous potential for Australia can growers and the processors to come to an agreement get up and go and contribute hundreds of thousands of and to finish up with a Bill that has the support of all jobs and billions of dollars of exports and so on. parties. 'That can do nothing but good for the future of this industry. As recently as 11 September 1991 the Weekly Times reported that: I also compliment the processors and the growers on the way they have cooperated through the length The State government shelved a report identifying an and breadth of the consultation process which took $800 million a year productivity boost for Victoria's place over a number of weeks. It was that food processing industry. consultation factor that helped the Bill to be fonnulated. The Bill is in line with modem trends of The document in question is The economic potentiill for deregulation and the removal of protective addingfurther value to Victoriiln agricultural products, mechanisms, especially within agricultural prepared by Or Andy Stoeckel at the Centre of industries. lntem,ltional Economics. In the tomato, broiler chicken and wine grape We know that that report has been shelved and that industries the concern has always been that the more the Minister is sitting on it. Unfortunately the powerful processors will screw down the growers to benefits that the report identifies and the industry a price which is below the cost of production. That is improvements that could be achieved are also not why in 1976 the then government established a being released. tomato industry negotiating committee, which has had some success. However, regardless of whether it The coalition parties have consulted widely on this was the negotiating committee for the wine grape Bill. Over a period we have been talking with both industry, the tomato processing industry or the the growers and the processors and, as I said at the chicken industry, the growers always began their outset, credit should be given to the convenor of our negotiations at the highest price and the processors agricultural committee, the Honourable Dick began at the lowest price and usually finished up de Fegely, for ensuring that the amendments in the without agreement. In those cases an arbitrator had Bill have the support of both parties. to step in and fix the price.

I trust that the Minister will accept the amendments The Bill removes the statutory control on prices and to be moved in this place. If he does not do so the the contractual arrangements between the growers coalition will proceed with them in another place. and the processors. It provides an alternate means for producers and processors to get together to Mr AUSTIN (Ripon) - This is an important Bill decide on price and then enter into contracts. As I for the tomato industry, but it has been handled said earlier, the growers and processors have been badly by the Minister for Food and Agriculture and fair and reasonable in the negotiations on the Bill, by the government. Once again a Bill of importance and that point should be noted by members of is coming on for debate in the dying days of a Parliament and governments in the future. Parliament, and I hope this is the last Bill that will be handled by this Minister! The processors wanted the Bill and the growers did not. That was the starting point when the Bill was Once again the Minister for Food and Agriculture, first introduced and then discussions with the who is at the table, is the only government member coalition committee commenced. The growers and present in the Chamber. He has a complete range of processors have been fair and reasonable throughout empty seats behind him. Obviously government the whole debate but I was impressed by the members do not have the slightest interest in attitude of the processors, who said that they really agriculture, and that is an insult to rural Victoria. need each other. That has been an important aspect in the background of this issue. The lack of consultation by the Minister and the government with industry has been noticeable; all AGRICULTURAL INDUSTRY DEVELOPMENT (TOl\lATO PROCESSING) BILL

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I hope that spirit of cooperation holds tight over the cost of the tomatoes was $780, so the raw material ensuing years; it would be a pity if any outside represents a substantial percentage of the total cost. influence were brought to bear. As the honourable member for Lowan said, an amendment will be We ought to note that that is just for the paste moved to ensure that this issue is reviewed after two product and there are many value-added products years. During that time careful monitoring will take to be produced after that point. It is claimed that our place to ensure that the spirit of the legislation and unit cost of production and processing skills are the cede of practice are being adhered to. That better than most, but we do have some handicaps, as commitment was given today during this debate by pointed out by the previous speakers. Firstly, we the honourable member for Lowan. It will be have to tackle the public authority dividend tax on recorded in Hansard and it will remain firm. natural gas. In addition we have high transport costs. The cost of diesel in the United States of A few years ago Victoria had some 600 tomato America is $1 a gallon; the cost of a litre of fuel in growers. It was interesting to note that the Minister's this State is 60 cents. In addition, we have a shift second-reading speech mentioned 90 growers. I loading cost of 25 per cent. In America the loading is lUlderstand from speaking to producers that there only 10 per cent. In this country we have double are now only 64 growers in Victoria and at least time at weekends and we need to bear in mind that 5 major processors. during the processing season - which, for tomatoes, is dictated by seasonal conditions - plants are run The important part of the Bill is Part 4A concerning 24 hours a day, 7 days a week. This means the the tomato processing industry order. The purposes payment of ridiculous penalty rates, which prevent of the order come under clause 3 of Schedule 2, us from being competitive. which states: I wish the Bill every success and I am sure The purposes of this Order are - processors will act fairly and that there will be a spirit of goodwill. If that occurs, the whole industry (a) to set up a Committee - will benefit with further productivity gains, and we (i) to recommend prices to be paid by processors to will see the way opened to win more of the export producE"~s for processing tomatoes grown in market share. the State; Mr KILGOUR (Shepparton) - It gives me . (ii) to recommend the terms and conditions of pleasure to be involved in this debate, which payment; involves the growing of tomatoes for processing (iii) to recommend grade standards and grading rather than for the fresh market. In the electorate I procedures for tomatoes purchased by represent three factories process tomatoes. The processors; Rosella factory at Tatura employs many people in that area, and it will increase its number of (b) to determine the provisions to be included in employees through ongoing building projects over contracts between producers and processors for the next few years. the supply or purchase of tomatoes for processing; and There are also the Ardmona Fruit Products (c) to provide a means of settling disputes between Co-operative Co. Ltd at Mooroopna and the SPC Ltd producers and processors about the grading of factory at Shepparton as well as the H.]. Heinz Co. tomatoes purchased by processors. Aust. Ltd factory at Girgarre and Plurnrose Pty Ltd at Echuca. That is the main part of the Bill. It has been suggested by some people that the processing Victorians produce around 70 per cent of the industry in Victoria may not be as efficient as in national crop of tomatoes for processing. some other countries and, from what I have heard, Interestingly, the tomato industry is a leader in been told and read, that statement is unfair and self-funding of research for the industry with all inaccurate. sectors of the industry contributing around $400 000 annually towards lifting yields and towards the It is interesting to note that this year the cost of future of the industry - improving productivity production of a tonne of paste by one of the major and also our international competitiveness. processing companies was $970. That is the cash cost, not including depreciation. Of that $970 the AGRICULTURAL INDUSTRY DEVELOPMENT (TO MA TO PROCESSING) BILL

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Of course, there have been major productivity gains However. coming into Australia from a developed in the industry in recent years, helped greatly by the country is a different story. Tomato products from a research carried out by the industry. Grower developed country now facing a 15 per cent barrier numbers have decreased significantly in recent years will soon be facing a barrier reduced to 5 per cent, from around 350 in 1976 to around 64 now in the and in 1996 the current 10 per cent barrier faced by industry. developing countries will be reduced to nil. People are looking to invest in Asian countries instead of In real terms returns to growers have decreased in Australia because of what they can do. recent years but yields have increased by up to 60 per cent. There have certainly been greater The Bill establishes the Tomato Industry Negotiating efficiencies in recent years but there are some real Committee, membership of which will comprise dangers to the industry, none more important than four producers, four processors, and a chairperson the heavily subsidised imports dumped in this from the Department of Food and Agriculture. The country from overseas. opposition is hopeful that the negotiating committee will bring the processors and growers into line so Already 10 to 15 per cent of tomato paste is that the industry is able to look to the future with imported into the country and around 40 per cent of some optimism. whole tomatoes are imported. However, I notice that in recent times dumping duties have been imposed It is most important that the right people take their on canned and diced tomatoes from Italy and China place on the Tomato Industry Negotiating and countervailing measures have been taken Committee so that it has the future of the industry at against some of those products from Spain, Italy and heart and can ensure that growers and processors Thailand. continue to put in the money necessary to make the industry successful in the future. It will be most For the industry to improve in years to come, we important also for the committee to achieve results must solve these sorts of problems. Other problems that will support the industry. After all, if it does not include uncompetitive work practices in some of our achieve results it will lose relevance and it will lead factories, transport costs and government to a breakdown of strength in the industry. We must regulations, which combine to make it 40 per cent ensure that the committee achieves results so that more expensive to put tomatoes in a can in Australia the industry can forge ahead. than in some overseas countries. It will be necessary to change clause 9 of the Bill to We must guard against the pressure on our farmers ensure that the committee must recommend prices. to produce crops at less than cost price and pressure As the Bill currently stands the committee has the for our processors to produce tomatoes and other option of recommending prices. We must ensure products at less than cost price. The growing of that the committee recommends terms and tomatoes costs around $5000 a hectare, and for the conditions of payment by the processors for growers and the bankers to commit themselves to tomatoes, as is stated in clause 10 and we must this sort of cost we must have confidence in the ensure that the committee recommends grades and industry and confidence that the processors can grading standards. contract to the producers to ensure the future of our important industry. After all, it is an important There is a need for more flexibility in pricing at the industry. end of the season so that negotiations can take place with the processors and the growers. We must Where would we be without the tomato sauce for ensure that the growers do not have to plough their our Four 'n' Twenty pies at the football? They say crops in simply because of an industrial dispute that where would the game be without the Four 'n' makes the processors unable to collect the product Twenty, but where would the Four 'n' Twenty be from the field. If the committee fails to reach without the tomato sauce from our industry? agreement on terms and conditions, grading standards or grading procedures, the standards Let us examine what happens when we try to export applying in previous years must be recommended these products overseas. To export tomatoes to by the committee. Malaysia we have a 55 per cent tariff barrier. To get· them into Indonesia we have a 40 per cent barrier. It is important that the committee meets and To get soup and sauce into the Philippines we face a recommends prices, terms and conditions of 50 per cent barrier. payments and sets quality standards and grading AGRICULTURAL INDUSTRY DEVELOPMENT (TOMATO PROCESSING) BILL

2132 ASSEMBLY Wednesday. 10 June 1992 procedures before crops are planted and not later get the two sides to eventually agree to the code of than 1 September. That will allow growers to practice. commit themselves to what they will do with their crops during the following 12 months. It will be I make this simple point - and I take the point necessary for the committee to recommend prices as made by the honourable members for Ripon and early as possible so that those important decisions Mildura regarding products being dumped in this can be made prior to planting and so that growers country - we are the only twits trying to play on a can be sure that their investments are right for the level playing field. Victoria is acknowledged as future. growing the best tomatoes in the world at the most economical cost and yet when I go to my local An interim review of the tomato order is necessary supennarket I am always upset to see loads of to ensure that the changes to the Agricultural overseas tomato products on the shelves. I appeal to Industry Development Act are working. A review all Victorians to read the labels on the cans. I would every two years will place additional pressure on all not trust tomatoes grown in Thailand, Spain or Italy. parties to ensure that the changes work. I do not know what has been put on the tomatoes while they have been growing. I plead with my I commend the growers and the processors in fellow Victorians to read the labels before they Victoria for the work they have done in coming up purchase. So what if it costs a couple of cents more with the negotiating committee and the code of to buy tomato products from Victoria! At least the practice that will have to be adhered to by both the local industry, local fanners, local growers and local industry and the processors. Growers from places producers are being supported. such as 8oort, Rochester and Unanderra have worked for many hours to ensure that the code of The Federal government has been lax in the past in practice will be effective so that the growers and the not promoting strongly enough the local Australian processors will be able to work together to ensure product. It has sat back and allowed foreign that the industry has a viable future. products to flood. our supennarket shelves, and it annoys me no end just as I am sure it annoys Success will depend on the honour of both parties. members of the opposition. The message for all of us The parties will be in a less regulated industry and is to read the labels before buying. If shoppers do when the committee recommends prices or terms, not buy locally produced products, they are being the code of practice must make those prices or terms unAustralian. To buy a product produced in mandatory. The opposition hopes that the growers Thailand or Malaysia because it might cost a couple and the processors act honourably and that they can of cents less is to let down the side. come to an agreement. The processors need toma toes and the growers need markets if they are I congratulate the government for introducing the to be able to improve their standards of living in the Bill and the growers and processors for getting future. together in a complex and difficult situation and coming up with what I hope will be a successful I hope the goodwill that currently exists between the fonnula. I congratulate members of the opposition processors and the producers continues to result in for what I found to be a most infonnative debate. negotiations that secure the continued success of the tomato processing industry. Mr PESCOTI (Bennettswood.) - The contribution by the honourable member for Mc NORRIS (Dandenong) - The H. J. Heinz Co. Dandenong came from the heart because I know he Aust. Ltd factory with its 57 varieties of tomatoes is is concerned about the difficulties Australian situated on the border of my electorate. That consumers face when choosing which products to company processes more tomatoes than almost buy. One thing that interested me in his anyone else. I have been listening to the debate contribution - I notice that no other government while I have been in my office and I congratulate member has bothered to make a contribution - was members of the opposition on their contributions. that government members are totally ignorant about Speaking as a complete amateur, I have found the the problems of the industry. debate to be a learning process. Like the honourable member for Shepparton who spoke before me, I also The problem this piece of legislation deals with is extend to the growers and the processors every good the costs associated with government policies. wish in their endeavours. I have been fascinated to Australians become involved in the amazingly inane learn that it has been a long and tortuous process to debate about trying to work out why our products AGRICULTURAL INDUSTRY DEVELOPMENT (TOMATO PROCESSING) BILL

Wednesday. 10 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2133 are not price-<:ompetitive. We have had report after government's Regulation Review Unit. A 1988 report on what the problems are and yet the report of an inquiry into food regulation in Australia problems are not being addressed. recommended exactly what is happening in 1992. The government has sat on its hands on the issue of The Bill brings together the growers and the tomato processing and many other issues in the food processors. The growers who toil in the fields day in processing industry. and day out to grow tomatoes have taken up the problem, but what has the government done to deal The government did not act on the with the difficulties Victoria has in competing with recommendations in its own report, but waited until the rest of the world? the Committee for Melbourne, which has more credibility in the community than the government This Bill is before the House as the result of a report and which has been used by the government to give presented to the Committee for Melbourne by credibility to decisions it cannot make itself, came up Pappas Carter Evans and Koop Pty Ltd. That report with recommendations that merely repeated what identified impediments in the food processing the government's own Regulation Review Unit industry in Victoria. The second last item on a recommended in 1988. weighted average index of the difficulties facing the food processing industry is the issue of raw It is an absolute disgrace that the government talks materials; all the items above it are issues that have about reform of the food processing industry. It is not been addressed by the government, and those the growers, in particular, who must bear the brunt issues are headed by industrial relations. of the effects of the delay in implementing reforms. Processors must also bear the brunt because the The honourable member for Dandenong says he things that need to be done by the government have knows the H. J. Heinz Co. Aust. Ltd factory and not been done. appreciates the difficulties that Heinz has encountered because of the union and the workers When one considers the major amendments to the using the way fresh produce is brought into the legislation, which will be moved by the government plant to hold the company to ransom. When one but which were negotiated by the oppOSition, one examines the weighted average index produced by understands how incompetent the Minister for Food Pappas Carter Evans and Koop one realises that and Agriculture is. He should have been able to industrial relations issues have doubled the value of bring the growers and processors together to find a raw materials. Once again the government is forcing solution and use the strength that he says he has in growers to bear the bnmt of the problem. The Cabinet to push through other reforms. We will growers are the people who do the work and are the never get it right in this country. The honourable wealth creators in the community, but the high-cost member for Dandenong will always find himself in government - the sponge - we have in Victoria the supermarket staring at tomato cans and has not tackled the industrial relations issues. wondering why tomatoes are coming in cheaper from overseas countries. It is because the cost The second item on the index is transport. The structures and problems in those other countries government has not tackled the issue of transport, have been addressed! including delays on the wharves. The third item is government charges. The government has not Mr Norris interjected. tackled that issue or the issue of government regulations and international trade practices - the Mr PEScOlT - The honourable member for uneven playing field that is talked about but has not Dandenong says, "What about wages?". That is a been tackled because the reforms that are needed myth because workers in Germany receive before you can have a level playing field are the extremely high wages, higher than those received by reforms that the government has not examined equivalent workers in Australia. In California, for properly. instance, workers receive low wages.

I feel strongly that the debate so far has not Mr Norris - You are joking - Mexicans! concentrated sufficiently on why we are here. The Pappas Carter Evans and Koop report, produced for Mr PES COlT - That is right, but also in the Committee for Melbourne, has adopted California tractors cost half as much as they do in recommendations put to the Victorian government Australia and fuel costs half what it does in and the Commonwealth government in 1988 by the Australia. In California a whole range of issues in AGRICULTURAL INDUSTRY DEVELOPMENT (TOMATO PROCESSING) BILL

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relation to the costs associated with growing in Victoria is very competitive with equivalent costs tomatoes has been dealt with, but the main issues in other parts of the world. are still not being addressed by the Victorian government. As the honourable member for Bennettswood correctly pointed out, the tomato processing It is a well-known fact that the average cost of industry is not competitive with processing in other employing a worker in Victoria is way ab

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The swnmary of a report prepared jointly by the The most salient corrunent during the debate was Boston Consulting Group and Pacific Dunlop Ltd offered by the venerable and honourable member mentions manufacturing, obsolete technology for Ripon when he quoted the growers and compared with the rest of the world, inadequate processors as saying, 'We need each other". The Bill product development, plants corrunonly operating recognises that. On one side of the equation there is at 30 per cent of capacity, a poor industrial record, the prospect of competitive investment and on the outdated work practices and shift penalties. I point other side of the equation there is some future out that the main reason for the recent closure of the guarantee for the domestic processing industry Pacific Dunlop plant in Bairnsdale was the cost of which was under serious threat. It took only the fact penalty rates. that the government produced this Bill and indicated that it meant business about dealing with Also mentioned in the report is the fact that penalty this issue to bring both sides of the industry together rates for weekend work are 100 per cent compared in agreement. TItat was most useful and I take great with New Zealand, where they are in the order of pride in it. 30 per cent, and penalty shift rates are at 30 per cent in Australia compared with 10 per cent in New Motion agreed to. Zealand. We are not talking about low labour-cost countries, as the honourable member for Dandenong Read second time. tended to suggest. Ordered to be committed later this day. We compete with countries such as New Zealand that have been serious about micro-economic refonn Message read recommending appropriation. and have dealt with waterfront refonn, transport and industrial relations and, therefore, are far more Committed. competitive. In the area of packaging, can costs are 40 per cent higher in this country than they are in Committee Europe; and board costs are 44 per cent higher than they are in the United States of America. This Clauses 1 to 3 agreed to. government and the Federal government should deal with these issues. I reject the notion that the Clause 4 reason we are uncompetitive with tomato products is the high price of fruit. That is not it; it is largely Mr BAKER (Minister for Food and because of the inefficiencies in the processing Agriculture) - I move: industry, which we have failed to deal with. 1. Clause 4, page 3, after line 18 insert­ I could go on at length about this but I think my Review of the Order colleagues have dealt with most of the issues and I "S7C. (1) The Minister must appoint a Committee do not intend to canvass them further. However, I consisting of 3 persons to review the Order wish to say that the agreement between the under section 57 A. processors and growers is that the price should be arbitrated rather than recorrunended. It has been a (2) The committee must be appointed by and great effort and I corrunend both growers and commence its review on 31 August 1994, and processors for that and wish the legislation speedy must conclude the review and report to the passage. Minister upon the review by 30 November 1994. Mr BAKER (Minister for Food and (3) The committee must review the effectiveness of Agriculture) - I thank honourable members for the Tomato Industry Negotiating Committee, their contributions. It has been made clear by a established under the Order, in meeting its variety of speakers that this matter comes before the objectives and carrying out its functions and House with the agreement of both sides of the may make recommendations to the Minister industry, and that is a healthy development. I am on whether the Order should be remade, more interested in results than rhetoric and I am amended or revoked.". pleased to be able to say it appears that the Bill will be passed during this sessional period. 2. Clause 4, page 3, line 19, omit "57C" and insert "570". Amendments agreed to; amended clause agreed to. AGRICULTURAL INDUSTRY DEVELOPMENT (TOMATO PROCESSING) BILL

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Clause 5 commencement of this Schedule) for the 1992 harvest are to be recommended.". Mr BAKER (Minister for Food and 8. Clause 6, proposed Schedule 2, page 6, item 11(1), Agriculture) - I move: omit "may" and insert "must". 3. Clause 5, line 24, after this line insert- 9. Clause 6, proposed Schedule 2, page 6, at the end of "(1) In section 3 of the Principal Act, in the item 11, insert- definition of "order", for "or Part 4" substitute "(4) If the Committee fails to make a ", Part 4 and Part 4A".". recommendation about the grade standards Mr W. D. McGRATH (Lowan) - The and grading procedures for tomatoes amendment was not included in the proposals purchased by processors, the Committee must circulated earlier and I ask the Minister to explain it. recommend the terms and conditions recommended by it for the previous year. Mr BAKER (Minister for Food and (5) In the case of the first recommendation made by Agriculture) - The amendment adds to the the Committee after its appoinbnent, if the consequential amendments and ensures that the Committee fails to make that order under new Part 4A is adequately defined in recommendation, the grade standards and section 3 of the principal Act and has legal status grading procedures fixed under the Tomato conferred by section 12 of that Act. Processing Industry Act 1976 (as in force immediately before the commencement of this Amendment agreed to; amended clause agreed to. Schedule) for the 1992 harvest are to be recommended.". Clause 6 10. Clause 6, proposed Schedule 2, page 6, item 14(1), Mr BAKER (Minister for Food and omit "for quality standards and grading Agriculture) - I move: procedures before harvest and no later than 1 October" and insert "quality standards and 4. Clause 6, proposed Schedule 2, page 5, Item 8, omit grading procedures before planting and no later this item and insert - than 1 September". "Chairpersons voting rights 11. Clause 6, proposed Schedule 2, page 6, item 15, after 8. The Chairperson has a casting vote on the "(f)" insert "weighing,". question of recommended prices, if the 12. Clause 6, proposed Schedule 2, page 7, item 16, after Committee does not otherwise agree on that "delivered for processing" insert "or grading question. The Chairperson is not entitled to procedures". vote on any other question arising at a meeting of the Comntittee.". 13. Clause 6, proposed Schedule 2, page 7, item 17, omit "or ensuring compliance with the terms and 5. Clause 6, proposed Schedule 2, page 5, item 9(1), omit conditions fixed by the Committee". "may" and insert "must". 14. Clause 6, proposed Schedule 2, page 7, after item 19 6. Clause 6, proposed Schedule 2, page 5, item 10(1), insert - omit "may" and insert "must". Codes of Practice 7. Clause 6, proposed Schedule 2, page 6, at the end of item 10 insert - "20. (1) Where a code of practice has been prepared for the tomato processing industry by the "(3) If the Committee fails to make a Australian Tomato Processors Association and recommendation about the terms and the Victorian Farmers Federation (Tomato conditions of payment, the Committee must Section), the Committee must review that code recommend the terms and conditions of practice at its first meeting for each year. recommended by it for the previous year. (2) Upon reviewing a code of practice, the (4) In the case of the first recommendation made by Committee may make recommendations to the Committee after its appoinbnent, if the the bodies who made the code about Committee fails to make that amendments to the code. recommendation, the terms and conditions fixed under the Tomato Processing Industry (3) If amendments are made to the code, the bodies Act 1976 (as in force immediately before the who made those amendments must cause MELBOURNE WATER CORPORATION BILL

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them to be published in a newspaper MELBOURNE WATER CORPORATION circulating generally throughout the State or BILL in a publication circulating generally to growers and processors in the State within Returned from Council with message relating to 30 days of having been made.". amendments. Mr BILDSTIEN (Mildura) - I received these Council's amendments: amendments from the Minister for Food and 1. Clause 2, line 10, before "This" insert "(1)" Agriculture just a short time ago. I have looked through them as quickly as I can and they appear to 2. Clause 2, line 10, after "Act" insert "(except this be as proposed by the coalition parties, so I shall section and section 56 ( 4 »". accept them in this fonn. However, I indicate that 3. Clause 2, after line 11 insert - the coalition will examine the amendments thoroughly while the Bill is between here and "(2) This section comes into operation on the day another place. on which this Act receives the Royal Assent.

(3) Section 56(4) comes into operation on the day Amendments agreed to; amended clause agreed to. on which section 6 comes into operation.".

Clause 7 4. Clause 27, line 4, before '1t" insert "(1)".

5. Clause 27, after line 9 insert- Mr BAKER (Minister for Food and Agriculture) - I move: "(2) In carrying out its role the Board must have regard to the need - 15. Clause 7, before "The" insert "(1)". (a) to improve the quality of service provided 16. Clause 7, at the end of this clause insert - to the customer; and "(2) On the corrunencement of this Act the Tomato (b) to minimise the cost to the corrunwtity of Processing Industry Negotiating Committee the perfonnance by the Corporation of its under the Tomato Processing Industry Act functions.". 1976 goes out of office and its successor in law is the Committee constituted by the Order 6. Clause 35, after line 14 insert - under section 57 A of the Principal Act. "() must include such perfonnance indicators and (3) On and from the corrunencement of this section, targets (whether financial or operational) as unless the context otherwise requires, a the Board considers appropriate;". reference in any Act or subordinate 7. Clause 39, line 29, omit "the" and insert "a prepared instrument or in any document whatever to plan or within 30 days after receiving a copy of a the Tomato Processing Industry Negotiating revised". Committee is a reference to the committee constituted by the Order under section 57 A of 8. Clause 43, page 18, after line 14 insert - the Principal Act". "( ) include an assessment of - Mr W. D. McGRA TH (Lowan) - Schedule 1 (i) the cost of carrying out the Corporation's refers to the wine industry and Schedule 2 will now corrununity service obligations; and refer to the tomato industry. The honourable member for Mildura indicated that the coalition will (il) the cost of implementing any directions reserve its right to reconsider the amendments while given by the Minister under section 45; the Bill is between here and another place. Even and though they appear to be satisfactory the coalition (ill) the cost of carrying out any other wants to ensure that the producers and the obligation that is imposed on the processors are satisfied that their views are Corporation by or under this or any other represented in the amendments. Act and that requires it to act otherwise than in accordance with nonnal Amendments agreed to; amended clause agreed to. corrunercial practice; and". Reported to House with amendments. 9. Clause 45, after line 7 insert - "( ) The Minister must cause a copy of a Passed remaining stages. direction given under sub-section (1) to be MELBOURNE WATER CORPORA nON BILL

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laid before each House of Parliament (d) Section 31(4) does not apply to a meeting of within 15 sitting days together with, if the the Board; Board has advised the Minister that the (e) The requirement w1der section 43(3)(d) that direction would require it to act otherwise the financial statements be signed by a than in accordance with its own policy, an director other than the Chairperson does assessment given by the Board of the cost not apply; of implementing the direction.". (f) Paragraph (c) of sub-section (3) of this 10. Clause 47, lines 30 and 31, omit ''between 10 a.m. section must be read as if it referred to the and 4 p.m. on business days" and insert "on Chairperson of the Board of Directors of business days at the times determined by the the Melbourne Water Corporation instead Board". of to a director of the Melbourne Water 11. Clause 48, line 5, before ''TIle'' insert "(1)". Corporation;

12. Clause 48, after line 8 insert - (g) Paragraph (d) of sub-section (3) of this section does not have effect. "() Regulations made under this section may be disallowed in whole or in part by resolution of () On 31 December 1992 the General Manager either House of Parliament in accordance with of MMBW goes out of office.". the requirements of section 6(2) of the 20. Insert the following new clause to follow clause 53- Subordinate Legislation Act 1962- A. New section 281 inserted in MMBW Act ( ) Disallowance under sub-section (2) is deemed to be disallowance by Parliament for the after section 280 of the MMBW Act insert - purposes of the Subordinate Legislation Act 281. Special drainage and river improvement rate 1962.". (1) The Metropolitan Drainage and River 13. Clause 53, after line 3 insert - Improvement Rate does not apply in respect "() In section 200(1) of the MMBW Act, after of rateable properties within the land within "metropolis" insert "except those within the the catchments of the Lang Lang, Bunyip and land referred to in section 281(1)".". Tarago Rivers and of the Ararat Creek or within any other land included in the 14. Clause 53, line 4 Clefore ''In'' insert "(2)". metropolis as mentioned in section 3(7) that is 15. Clause 53, line 10, after "3(7)" insert "except the part prescribed by the Governor in Council by of that land referred to in section 281(1)". regulation for the purposes of this section.

16. Clause 56, line 11, omit "(a)". (2) For the purposes of this Part the Board may from time to time but not oftener than once in 17. Clause 56, line 12, omit ";and". every year make and levy a special drainage 18. Clause 56, line 13, omit paragraph (b). and river improvement rate in respect of rateable properties within the land referred to 19. Clause 56, page 30, a. er line 7 insert- in sub-section (1). "() Despite anything to the contrary in this Act, the (3) This special rate - following provisions apply to the period from the commencement of this sub-section until (a) may be made and levied- 1 January 1993: (i) at different amounts in the dollar or at (a) The Board shall consist only of the different minimum amounts in respect of Chairperson and no other director shall be different properties within the land appointed; referred to in sub-section (1);

(b) The Chairperson must not be appointed for (0) at zero rate in respect of any specified a term extending beyond 31 December rateable property or any specified class of 1992 but is eligible for re-appointment; rateable property within that land;

(c) The person appointed as Chairperson must (b) must not exceed 7 cents in the dollar of the have qualifications relevant to, or net annual value or (as the case may be) experience in, an area referred to in the annual value of those properties. section 20; SMOKING BAN IN PARLIAMENT HOUSE

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(4) Before proceeding to make a special rate WIder Motion agreed to. this section on or after 1 January 1993 the Board must consult with a community-based SMOKING BAN IN PARLIAMENT committee appointed by it. HOUSE

(5) The following provisions apply with respect to Mr ROPER (Minister for Employment, the membership of a committee appointed Post-Secondary Education and Training) WIder sub-section (4): (By leave) - I move: (a) More than one haU of the membership must 1. That all buildings located within the Parliamentary consist of persons who are owners or Reserve be designated as "smoke-free areas" and occupiers of property in the land referred that smoking be prohibited within such buildings to in sub-section (1) including 2 persons and in all areas occupied by committees of the nominated by the Victorian Farmers Parliament of Victoria. Federation; 2. That the following process be adopted: (b) Any cOWlcil whose municipal district is wholly or partly within the land referred 2.1 All persons found smoking any substance to in sub-section (1) must be represented whilst in the areas, as defined, be requested to on the committee; desist.

(c) The Minister may direct that a public 2.2 On refusal, the name of the offending person statutory body or government department shall be reported to the relevant Presiding be represented on the committee. Officer.

(6) Subject to this section, section 16 of the 2.3 10 the event of a member of Parliament further Melbourne Water Corporation Act 1992 offending, the member shall be subjected to applies to a committee appointed WIder action taken by the relevant Presiding Officer sub-section (4). to withdraw a privilege enjoyed by the members as determined by the Presiding (7) Subject to this section, the provisions of this Act Officer. The privileges include: car parking at that extend and apply with respect to the Parliament House, restriction of items Metropolitan Drainage and River available for expenditure under Part A of the Improvement Rate extend and apply also with Electorate Service Entitlement, withdrawal of respect to the special drainage and river credit facilities for catering services. improvement rate made or to be made under this section.". 2.4 10 the event of a staff member further offending the officer/employee shall be subjected to Mr COLEMAN (Syndal) - The amendments relevant disciplinary actions. were dealt with in another place, but it is appropriate to reflect on the operation of the 2.5 10 the event of representatives of the media and Melbourne and Metropolitan Board of Works. For other visitors to the Parliament further more than 100 years that organisation has offending, the person shall be asked to leave substantially stimulated the growth in the city and the premises. on behalf of the coalition I thank the present board, 3. That this "smoke-free areas" rule shall not apply to its chairman and the previous incumbent who have individual member's offices subject to the strived to ensure that the organisation performed its agreement of the members of Parliament role soundly. accommodated in such office until the Parliament by motion otherwise provides. The work leading to the proclamation of the legislation would not have been achieved but for the 4. That the resolution to ban all smoking in areas work done by the existing board, particularly the defined shall take effect from 1 July 1992. preparation of the business plan. The incoming As honourable members are aware, last October the board of the Melbourne Water Corporation will House Committee made a report on this issue and operate under a business plan that has largely been the situation has moved forward since then. developed by the outgoing board of the Board of Discussions have been held in the various party Works. On behalf of the coalition I thank all rooms where differences of opinion - some involved for a job well done and I hope the new stronger than others - have been aired. While it organisation is as successful as the previous body. BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE

2140 ASSEMBLY Wednesday, 10 June 1992 may be my personal view, I am concerned to move considerable time is available to debate the Bill and forward on this issue. transmit it to the other place, where its passage can be facilitated. As has already occurred, I expect that the number of members smoking in their rooms or anywhere else The opposition is prepared to debate and pass this will diminish. Bill in a spirit of cooperation, as has occurred in relation to the Bill just debated; the Bill will help the Honourable members interjecting. dairy industry. The Dairy Industry Bill has been listed on the Notice Paper for a number of weeks, Mr ROPER - When I came here you could still and debate on it has been foreshadowed for a see pipes in the pipe stand at the rear of the number of months. It is incumbent upon the Chamber, where I often used to leave my pipe, government to debate that Bill or to explain to the causing a stink in that area. That was resolved by a industry in Victoria why it is not prepared to do that. bout of pneumonia in 1977 - not a recommended way to stop smoking! Mr TANNER (Caulfield) - On a point of order, Mr Speaker, we seek your clarification. With all the This motion is a step forward and I am pleased with speaking about a motion, we wish to know which the cooperation \. {the other parties in discussing motion we are now speaking to. what can be a very difficult issue, particularly for some individual members of this place. The SPEAKER - Order! I thought the honourable member was listening; however, the Motion agreed to. question before the Chair is that remaining business be postponed. BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE The question is: Mr ROPER (Minister for Employment, Post-Secondary Education and Training) - I move: That the motion be agreed to.

That further business be postponed. House divided on motion:

Mr W. D. McGRATH (Low an) - On a point of Ayes, 44 order, Mr Speaker, in relation to, Government Andrianopoulos, Mr McDonald, Mr Business, Orders of the Day, No. 15 - the Dairy Balter, Mr Mathews, Mr Industry Bill - as the Minister has moved the Barker, Mrs MicaUef, Mr postponement of further business, and I assume this Batchelor, Mr Norris,Mr is preparatory to his moving to adjourn the sitting, I Cain,Mr Pope, Mr ask him to explain why the sitting is to be adjourned Co le, Mr Ray,Mrs and why the House is not to proceed with the Bill, Crabb, Mr Roper, Mr which the opposition wishes to pass through this Cunningham, Mr Rowe,Mr place. Dollis, Mr (TellC') Sandon, Mr Emst, Mr Seitz, Mr The SPEAKER - Order! At this stage I take the Fordham, Mr Sercombe, Mr honourable member for Lowan to be speaking Garbutt, Mrs Setches, Mrs against the motion rather than on a point of order. Gavin, Mr Sheehan, Mr A.J. Hamilton, Mr Sheehan, Mr F.P. The question is: Harrowfield, Mr Shell, Mr HiIl,Mrs Simmonds, Mr That the motion be agreed to. Hirsh, Mrs Spylter, Mr Jolly, Mr Thomson,Mr Or NAPTIUNE (Portland) - On the question, Kennan, Mr Trezise, Mr Mr Speaker, the point made by the Deputy Leader of Kennedy, Mr Vaughan,Dr the National Party is fair and reasonable. The dairy Leighton, Mr (TellC') Walsh, Mr industry in Victoria is important and it looks McCutcheon, Mr Wilson,Mrs forward to the passage of the Bill. It is fair and Noes, 36 reasonable for the Leader of the House to explain Austin, Mr McGrath, Mr ].F. why the House should adjourn at 6.30 p.m. when Bildstien, Mr McGrath, Mr W.O. ADJOURNMENT

Wednesday, 10 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2141

Brown, Mr McNamara, Mr An article in today's Age reports the comments of C1ark, Mr Maclellan, Mr Ms Lawson's father, a real estate agent who is Coleman, Mr Maughan, Mr (Teller) involved in these deals: Cooper, Mr Napthine, Or Delzoppo, Mr Perton, Mr Last night, Mc Ronald Iones, manager of the Tri-West Elder, Mr Peseoll, Mr Estate Agents, confirmed that his daughter worked in Gude, Mr Plowman, Mr the marketing department of the authority while he Hayward, Mr Richardson, Mr applied for and obtained the right to sell authority Honeywood, Mr (Teller) Smith, Mr E.R. estates. He said: 'The fact is that she is not a senior Jasper, Mr Smith, Mr I.W. officer in that division. If she was someone senior then John, Mr Steggall, Mr there would be the potential for embarrassment - and Kennett, Mr Tanner, Mr sure, it is wUortunate she is related to me, but I Kilgour, Mr Wade, Mrs absolutely reject there was any conflict of interest". Lea, Mr Wallace, Mr Leigh, Mr Weideman, Mr The Minister's spokesperson, Mr Griffin, and a real Lieberman, Mr Wells, Or estate agent are involved in an actual conflict of interest as Ms Lynne Lawson is in fact more than just a junior officer. She is the marketing officer. I Motion agreed to. have a statutory declaration from a real estate agent in the western suburbs dated 9 June, which states: ADJOURNMENT That on or about Tuesday, 10 September 1991, I was Mr ROPER (Minister for Employment, interviewed by Lynne Lawson, Marketing Officer of Post-Secondary Education and Training) - I move: the Urban Land Authority, and another gentleman unknown to me, regarding the appoinbnent of That the House do now adjourn. managing agent of the subdivision in Power Street, Newport. Urban Land Authority I was accompanied by our saJes manager of our Mr HONEYWOOD (Warrandyte) - I request the SWlShine office. Premier to investigate the failure of the Minister for Plaruting and Housing to properly deal with issues It is clear that Ms Lawson has been involved in a relating to his portfolio and a conflict of interest large number of interviews to select real estate specifically within the Urban Land Authority agents, including Mr Wayne Sweeney, a former marketing department. During the weekend the work colleague of Ms Lawson's father, who was Minister, through a spokesperson, maintained that granted exclusive rights to sell the same estate in Ms Lynne Lawson, an officer of the ULA marketing Newport. The so-called junior officer has been department, had not been involved in the selection assisting in choosing which estate agent should be processes for choosing real estate agents to selected for the Newport estate. exclUSively market ULA estates. Clearly the Minister has the responsibility, as does Not only did the Minister through his spokesperson Mr Griffin, to explain not only why this categorically deny this involvement to a number of maladrninistration was allowed to take place, but journalists but also Mr Griffin, Chainnan of the also why they have misled everybody and lied about ULA, is the subject of a report in the Herald-Sun on the involvement of a staff officer in the marketing Tuesday, 9 June, stating: department of the ULA.

Mr Griffin reported the related staff member had not Not only must the Premier do something about it, been involved in the selection processes. but also the Minister. In a letter dated 5 December 1991 the Minister said, in part: A spokesperson for Mc McCutcheon said Mc Griffin reported he was satisfied there had been no A procedure for such appoinbnents, which I consider is impropriety. both appropriate and proper, is in place.

The Minister was supporting the procedure that was in place, which was not an open tender procedure. ADJOURNMENT

2142 ASSEMBLY Wednesday, 10 June 1992

Clause 3.3 of the procedure that was finally adopted Valley College ofTAFE cannot expand on its Fryers for appointing agents states: Street site.

If the authority believes there is any apparent conflict of The Minister for Planning and Housing has interest in relation to the dealings of the agents and endorsed the sale of this land and will have their relationship with any other party (including the discussions with the Department of Conservation legal representatives, financiers and builders), then the and Environment about selling the 8 hectares that authority will automatically review the agent's the department uses for fisheries research to that appointment. department so that the proceeds of that sale would go towards purchasing the land from the There was a conflict of interest and the procedures Department of Planning and HOUSing. should have been adopted in this case. It is important that the TAFE college is able to plan I also have a letter signed by Lynne Lawson on for future courses and expansion and that the college behalf of the marketing director informing an agent should know as soon as possible whether the land that the agent had not been given the rights to sell will become available. The officers from the State another estate. The so-called coffee girl is sitting in Training Board can then go to work and get access to on interviews asking most of the questions and the land in order to consider the expansion of the deliberating on who, including friends of her father, college for further courses. I ask the Minister for a should be considered for the exclusive right to sell report on any progress on the land deal. estates. Protection of Aboriginal sites When I tried to get information, including an audit report from the Department of Finance, I was told by Mr HAMILTON (Morwell) - I raise for the the freedom of information officer to report to none Minister for Aboriginal Affairs the assessment and other than the marketing officer, Ms Lynne Lawson. protection of Aboriginal sites. There are many Significant sites throughout Victoria. In the Goulbum Valley College of TAFE Gippsland community some 2000 Koories are spread throughout a number of pockets in the central Mr KIlGOUR (Shepparton) - I direct the Latrobe Valley and East Gippsland. These members attention of the Minister for Employment, of the Aboriginal community are part of the Gunai Post-Secondary Education and Training to a land tribe; they have been shifted around the State and a exchange deal involving the William Orr campus of number of their sites have been put at risk. the Goulbum Valley College of T AFE in Wanganui Road, Shepparton. That campus has a piece of land The community not only in Gippsland but which is used by the Department of Conservation throughout Victoria is concerned that sites of and Environment, under a lease arrangement for significance to the Aboriginal community have which no rent is paid, for fisheries research. The adequate protection and, just as importantly, that lease arrangement expires in 1995. There is little assessment of their value is made and, given the chance tha t the land will revert to the college and sensitivity of this matter, that the assessment is consequently that 8 hectares bordering Reedy accurate. These sites are all over the place: one is at Swamp will be lost to that campus. the Den of Nargun in East Gippsland; one is at Framlingham in the Shire of Warmambool; some are For some time the college has sought access to 18 on Crown land and some in the Bannah State Forest. hectares currently vested in the Department of Several Significant sites have already been identified Planning and Housing. The 18 hectares lies across and procedures have been put in place to protect the road from the Wanganui Road site and it would them. However, other sites are still being accessed be a tremendous opportunity for the Goulburn by the general public and it is important that an Valley TAFE college to expand its William Orr accurate assessment is made of them by either the campus on that site. Currently 70 per cent of the 200 Federal or State governments. acres in Wanganui Road is flood prone and cannot be built on. The college needs extra land if it is to Some sites are on private land and that causes some expand. The parcel of land across the road would problems to the Minister and the government in make an excellent adjunct to the campus; it is on assessing and protecting them. One is at Parwan in sandy rises, it is suitable for fanning and it is also the Bacchus Marsh area. I am familiar with tha t area suitable for the erection of a building. The Goulbum because for many years an uncle of mine lived at the ADJOURNMENT

Wednesday, 10 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2143 railway house at Parwan. It is a beautiful part of I do not doubt there are some Labor Lawyers who Victoria and the Parwan valley is under benefit financially from the practice of law. There are consideration for declaration as an Aboriginal site of also many lawyers, but not Labor Lawyers, for whom significance. However, I understand the land is practice in the area of Labor law is an economic owned privately. I ask the Minister to find out what bonanza. avenues are open to ensure that significant sites are protected not only in the interests of Aborigines but However, it is equally true that practising as a Labor for all Victorians. The original occupiers of this land lawyer, however spiritually satisfying it may be, is have a wonderful heritage and it is in everybody's rarely financially rewarding. No lawyer commits interests to ensure that their culture is recognised himself to working in this area of the law for financial and preserved for the future. gain. No lawyer commits himself to practising in this area of the law for reasons other than commitment to Labor Lawyers serving the public interest in the widest sense of that term. Mr E. R. SMITH (Glen Waverley) - I raise a ma tter for the a ttention of the Premier and in her Those high-sounding words were delivered in 1979 absence the Minister for Transport, who is at the in Adelaide. This poor man now finds himself in the table. It concerns the spiritual crisis of a Labor invidious position of having earned more than lawyer. I call on the Premier to provide counselling $8 million, all since the government brought in its advice to this lawyer, whose standards have fallen WorkCare legislation in 1985. That is why I am considerably in the past 13 years, mainly during the calling on the Premier to provide him with period of the current Labor government. counselling advice.

In August 1979 at the Inaugural National I know the amount of $8 million to be accurate Conference of Labor Lawyers held in Adelaide, in becalLc:;e I obtained the figures from a story in the the final speech to the conference the lawyer said, Herald-Sun of 30 May - which has not been "Elitism and a craving for status and power are denied - when his firm was named in a qualities that are equally corrupting and of course confidential Accident Compensation Commission totally inconsistent with the professed aims of the file that revealed that four Melbourne law firms had Labor movement". The lawyer's speech is contained boosted their earnings from WorkCare claims by in the book l.Jlw, Politics and the l.Jlbor Movement $37 million in the past 20 months. edited by Gareth Evans in 1979. The article reveals that the four firms picked up The Llbor lawyer went on to attack with almost more than $13 million from the bonanza of legal religious fervour lawyers who are i.nterested only in practice in common-law litigation. This is the money. He said: controversial litigation area for lump sum payouts for pennanent injury and pain and suffering caused The Labor lawyer is a lawyer who permanently by workplace injuries. One of the recipients of this commits himself to practice and expertise in the areas bonanza is the lawyer who is now facing the crisis I of the law most relevant to the groups and individuals I mentioned and for whom help from the Premier is have referred to. sought.

He is referring to the disadvantaged. He goes on to What a crisis for him to have fallen so far short of the attack not only Labor Lawyers and praise the high ideals he established at the Inaugural National integrity of his own -- Conference of Labor Lawyers.

The SPEAKER - Order! I ask the honourable Mr ROPER (Minister for Employment, member to state the area of government Post-Secondary Education and Training) - On a administration to which he refers. He appears to be point of order, Mr Speaker, the honourable member referring to the activities of people as members of a is simply reading a document. He has not averted private organisation. his eyes from that document since he started. Honourable members are supposed to make their Mr E. R. SMITH - It relates to appointments speeches, not read them, and I suggest that you and I shall come to that in a moment. He said: advise the honourable member that he should make sure he is not reading his speedl. ADJOURNMENT

2144 ASSEMBLY Wednesday, IQ June 1992

The SPEAKER - Order! I ask the honourable The SPEAKER - Order! I ask the honourable member to inform the Chair and the House whether member for Springvale to return to his place and to he is reading his speech. make an unqualified, simple withdrawal.

Mr E. R. SMITH (Glen Waverley) - I have notes Mr Perton - Slink back! that I should be happy to make available. Mr Micallef - What's your problem? The SPEAKER - Order! The Chair must accept the response by the honourable member. Mr Perton - No problems like you, mate!

Mr E. R. SMITH - Not only has the poor man's The SPEAKER - Order! The honourable firm been the recipient of the $8 million but he has member for Doncaster! also been appointed chairperson of the Totalizator Agency Board and the Victorian Arts Centre Trust. Mr MICALLEF (Springvale) - I withdraw. He is also a board member of Telecom Australia and a former President of the Australian Labor Party. I Dorset Road, Boronia ask the Premier to do all she can to enable this poor lawyer to establish the egalitarian virtues that were Mrs HIRSH (Wantima) - Mr Speaker, what will so important to him and to save people like him happen about the 5 minutes I am allocated for my from the seduction of cushy government contribution? I had got to my feet but I had not appointments. Will the Premier inform the House of commenced what I wanted to say. any others who have fallen from their true ideologies and have profited as Labor mates in the The SPEAKER - Order! Start the dock again. same way as this poor man, a true believer, has? Peter Redlich, this is your life! Mrs HIRSH - I raise an important matter for the attention of the Minister for Water Resources. It Mr DELZOPPO (Narracan) - On a point of concerns Mrs Lorraine Davie of 168 Dorset Road, order, Mr Speaker, the honourable member for Bororua. Mrs Davie is an older woman who has Springvale used a most tmparliamentary term to spent much of the past 30 years campaigning to have describe one of my colleagues. I ask him to drains and flooding fixed in Dorset Road, Boronia withdraw. near the corner of Alfred Street and properties fronting Dorset Road between Reve Street and The SPEAKER - Order! I did not hear the Alfred Street. Mrs Davie has been to see me on a in terjection. number of occasions and has brought a folder containing some 200 or 300 documents including Honourable members interjecting. correspondence between herself and the Knox City Council and a number of government departments The SPEAKER - Order! I did not hear it, but I that spans the past 30 years. In going through have been advised of what it was. I ask the Mrs Davie's documentation, I found a letter honourable member for Springvale to return to his addressed to Mr G. Hayes, the then honourable place and withdraw. member for Scoresby, so Mrs Davie's campaign certainly goes back a long time. Mrs Davie has not Mr MICALLEF (Springvale) - I called him a yet gained any satisfaction in having the flooding smart arse and I meant it, but I withdraw it. problem, relating to water rurming down Dorset Road, fixed. It is important to raise the matter in the Honourable members interjecting. House on her behalf.

Mr GUDE (Hawthorn) - On a further point of Mrs Davie's campaign includes the provision of a order, Mr Speaker, the honourable member for number of photographs. I seek leave to table the Springvale knows full well the forms of this House. photographs if possible. They are very clear. A withdrawal should be an tmqualified withdrawal. What he has done is to insult the House and the Mr Perton - Just incorporate them in Hansard! member yet again. I ask for an tmqualified withdrawal. Mrs HIRSH -It would be good if they could be incorporated in Hansard because they paint a clearer Or Napthine - And an apology to the House! ADJOURNMENT

Wednesday, ID June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2145

picture than words ever could of the problems with unused car parts manufactured by the car Mrs Davie experiences. makers, but with cheaper second-hand parts or non-genuine parts supplied from Taiwan. Mr J. F. McGrath -A picture paints a thousand words! In the interests of protecting the rights of consumers, maintaining good road safety, an independent Mrs HIRSH - However, I do not believe Hansard first-class motor repair industry, the greatest has photographs included in it and I have not possible confidence in the motor vehicle insurance previously shown them to you, Mr Speaker, for industry, and protecting the good names of AAMI approval. I hope honourable members will show and its owners, I ask the Minister for Consumer some interest in the matter by examining the Affairs to investigate the allegations made on the photographs so that they may tmderstand the Investigators program about the motor repair problems that Mrs Davie experiences with flooding industry in Victoria and the operations of AAMI and in that part of Dorset Road, Boronia. All States Auto.

I hope that the Minister for Water Resources can St Albans shopping centre enhancement arrange to have another look at Mrs Davie's property and that the problems she is experiencing Mr SEITZ (Keilor) - I refer the Minister for can at last be ameliorated. Planning and Housing to the report on the St Albans shopping centre enhancement and urge him to AAMI Ltd and All States Auto establish the Department of Planning and Housing Management Pty Ltd as the lead agency in following through the final recommendations of the report, which include Mr TANNER (Caulfield) - The matter I raise is setting up an implementation committee involving a for the attention of the Attorney-General, the number of government agencies and representatives representative in this House of the Minister for of local government. The report relates to essentially Consumer Affairs. In his absence I ask the Leader of planning matters directed at improving the the Government to direct the matter to the attention St Albans shopping centre. of the Minister for Consumer Affairs. The main concern of constituents in my electorate is Last year members of the motor repairers industry to be able safely to cross the railway line at directed to my attention their concerns about the St Albans. A number of recommendations in the practices of AAMI Ltd and its owners, who report relate to how a safe crossing can be achieved. constitute All States Auto Management Pty Ltd. I The report was latmched some time ago by the understand that AAMI has apprOximately 20 per Mayor of SW1Shine and no action has been taken on cent to 25 per cent of the motor repair insurance it. market in Victoria and that the addition of the operation of All States Auto brings the proportion The shopkeepers and the general community, owned by this group of companies to more than including students at the St Albans campus of the one-third of the market in Victoria. After discussion Victoria University of Technology, have expressed with the motor repairers and the Victorian concern about the isolation of the university campus Automobile Chamber of Commerce, I left it with the from the shopping centre. Consideration needs to be industry to negotiate with AAMI and All States given to the matter so that the shopping centre and Auto. the campus can be joined by a ring-road with access by walkways and bicycle paths. St Albans should On 19 May last the Investigators program shown on become a proper university town. The government Melbourne television station ABV2 restated the should foster and develop knowledge in the concerns that the motor car repairers had expressed community of a university campus located right in to me last year. Statements were made that a car that the middle of St Albans. Problems are caused AAMI insisted should be repaired had been fotmd because of its inaccessibility to the main communal by two independent assessors - one of them areas, especially bus stops - because all the buses engaged by the producers of the program - to be seem to stop at the railway station - and because no not worth repairing. one can park outside the post office, which is nearby.

It was alleged that motor repairers were being There needs to be a proper plaruting process, the forced by AAMI or All States Auto to repair cars not rezoning of residential land, and the provision of ADJOVRNMENT

2146 ASSEMBLY Wedn~sday. 10 June 1992 extra parking with the cooperation of the Members of the Jewish community are aware of the municipalities of Sunshine and Keilor. Also, the major commitment Peter Redlich has to a number of Department of Planning and Housing should their important concerns, and it is interesting that become involved through the urban improvement the honourable member makes this rather foolish programs administered by the Minister through the attack only days after Peter Redlich received an Western Region Commission. TItis would be of great Order of Australia award, which the majority of bendit not only to the people living aroW1d the people from all political persuasions who have dealt shopping centre area and the university but also to with him would think was well justified. the people of the western suburbs in general when they are trying to commute and use the wliversity. The honourable member for Warrandyte raised again an issue concerning the Department of At present one reads in the local papers, on a weekly Planning and Housing and the Urban Land basis, the problems of gaining access to the Authority. Last night the Minister said procedures university .md the shopping centre. For that reason I are in place within the authority, and the authority strongly urge the Minister for Planning and Housing marketing staff have received extensive briefings to investigate whether his department can become making it clear that Ms Lawson is not involved in a the lead agency in bringing together both local and conflict of interest, and that is the advice the Federal govenunents in the plamting process to Minister has received from Mr Greenway. make the St Albans shopping centre enhancement report a reality. By way of an aside Farnbach Bumham Pty Ltd was appointed to the Altona Bay estate when the Leader Responses of the Opposition was the Minister for Housing, and when Lynne Lawson was about 10 years old. Mr ROPER (Minister for Employment, Post-Secondary Education and Training) - The The honourable member for Shepparton raised an honourable member for Keilor has raised an important issue concerning post-secondary important issue for the Minister for Planning and education in his area. I was very pleased to visit the Housing, and I will make sure the Minister Goulbum Valley College of T AFE early this year and addresses that issue and responds to him. see the ways it is developing not only in technical and further education but also in adult and The honourable member for Wantirna raised the community education and university arrangements. plight of part of her electorate in relation to the responsibilities of the Minister for Water Resources, One could speculate that, if La Trobe University and I will direct that matter to the attention of the should decide it does not wish to run the Dookie Minister and ask for a direct reply. College, Goulbum Valley College of TA FE may well have to take over, and I made it clear to the The honourable member for Glen Waverley made Vice-Chancellor of La Trobe University that, if he what one might say is a strange attack on the senior thinks he can simply move the resources of the partner of a major law finn and seemed to confuse nursing school, that will be wUortunate for La personal income with income of the finn. The firm Trobe. But I am sure La Trobe does not intend to has members of both political parties among its reduce nursing education in that part of the State. partners and on its staff, and one of its senior legal staff I know to have been a very active YOW1g In relation to the William Orr campus, I am not sure liberal, who may even have had the occasional what stage the discussions have reached between interest in areas such as Caul field, on behalf of other the State Training Board and the Department of people. I am sure the person concerned knows Conservation and Environment, but I will make whom I am talking about. inquiries and advise the honourable member accordingly. Peter Redlich has performed a valuable service for this community in connection with the Victorian Finally, the honourable member for Morwell asked Arts Centre as well as assisting the racing industry me to provide details of methods and practices for thought the Totalizator Agency Board. He has been the protection of Aboriginal and Torres Strait Island an ardent advocate of the racing industry, and those sacred sites - Koori sacred sites - and I am pleased in the industry appreciate the efforts put in on their to inform the House that the 1984 Federal Heritage behalf. Protection Act and our own legislation act to protect sites of Significance. Of course, there can be debate ADJOURNMENT

Wednesday. 10 June 1992 ASSEMBLY 2147

about what is a significant site. The honourable importance. More recently graffiti was found in the member mentioned sites in Gippsland, of which caves. Although some people find graffiti to be there are many. He also mentioned some sites in the significant, we try to keep it off our trains and we Warmambool area, where assistance is being like to keep it out of caves as well. It does not come provided by the honourable member for under the cultural heritage legislation. Mr Koch told Warmambool who is working to ensure a better the GeeJong Advertiser that he was attempting to sell relationship between the shire and the local Koori the site because of his own personal requirements in community where some fish traps of significance terms of family law. He was prepared to sell it to the were to be disturbed by local council works. Wathaurong community, which was keen to find $500 000 to buy it. He also mentioned land at Parwan near Bacchus Marsh, which the media played up some time ago, It is often useful for those who are concerned about with helicopters flying over and so on, and he said Aboriginal sites of significance to consider them that the State should buy the land. I made it clear carefully before they either visit them or report that that the State was not about to spend $SOO 000 on the they are impressed. Unfortunately the honourable site. However, it was important that the matter be member for Bendigo East was either misled or was examined and it has been examined by both the gullible, but certainly he did see some sites. There shadow Minister for Aboriginal Affairs and by the were some scarred trees there. Victorian Archaeological Survey. Mr Gude interjected. I will tell the honourable member something that he probably does not know about, which obviously the Mr ROPER - He would have me spend $500 000 shadow Minister for Aboriginal Affairs did not on it. He is not suggesting that he does not support know either. The shadow Minister asked that I have the stories with the headlines '1..iberals support the matter examined and he was eager to see the site Koori land claim". This example shows that the for himself, according to the local paper. He told the government adequately examines such places and if group of Aborigines gathered at a protest camp just they are of real significance it decides that it is outside Mr Koch's property that he had been appropriate that they be protected. I express my impressed with what he had seen. Obviously this appreciation to the honourable member for became an interesting issue for the media and for the Warrnambool for the work he has done in the honourable member for Ballarat East. I was a bit Warmambool area. surprised about how impressed he was. The issue raised by the honourable member for Mr Gude interjected. Caulfield about motor repairs is a matter close to most honourable members' hearts. As a fonner Mr ROPER - When the honourable member for Minister for Consumer Affairs, I am very much Bendigo East investigated the matter he was told aware of this constant problem. The matter raised that the officer was told by Mr Koch that Mr Koch concerns an insurance company. If those matters are had constructed the two-stone arrangements, which proved, and my colleague, the Minister for he described as forming energy lines. These were the Transport, suggests they may be well founded, I sacred rocks that the media and others had pointed shall ensure that the Minister for Consumer Affairs out. I suppose they were sacred to Mr Koch but they takes appropriate action. were fairly recent creations. Motion agreed to. Apparently some caves were of great significance. When these caves were first explored in early 1970 it House adjourned 7.24 p.m. was found that there was no Aboriginal art of any

QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

Tuesday, 28 April 1992 ASSEMBLY 2149

Tuesday, 28 April 1992

QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

The following answers to questions on notice were circulated:

CONSULTANTS - DEPARTMENT OF LABOUR

(Question No. 547) Mr COOPER asked the Minister for Labour: In respect of each department, agency and authority within his administration, what are the names of each consultant employed since October 1988, indicating, in each case - (a) the purpose for which they were employed; (b) what working plans were given; (c) the cost of their services; (d) the duration of their contract; and (e) any additional payments made in excess of the contract price? Mr POPE (Minister for Labour) - The answer is: INDUSTRIAL RELA nONS

Consultant MlCHAEL ARNOLD PTY LTD. Purpose for which employed: To report to the Minister for Labour by 31st August 1990 on the form and content of a new Industrial Relations Act having regard to: (1) incorporating the "Marshall" amendments; (2) incorporating any recommendations arising from the "Sandon" report; (3) removing ambiguities in the drafting of the existing Act; (4) changes to achieve a complementary industrial relations system in the light of the Commonwealth Industrial Relations Act 1988; (5) such other matters as referred by the Minister for Labour. Working Plans: No formal plans, ongoing consultation with divisional staff. Cost: $19300.00. Duration of Contract 3 July 1989 to 4 May 1990. Additional Payments: None - costs based on $350.00 per day over duration of contract.

Consultant: VIDEOPROJEcrs Purpose for which employed: To develop information video - ''Highway Robbery", shown at schools etc. and providing information on rights and entitlements of yOWlg workers. Working Plans: General brief given to FIlM VICI'ORlA, who arranged tendering processes and all development of the video. Cost: $95 000.00 paid direct to FILM VICI'ORIA Duration of Contract From JWle 1990 - FILM VICI'ORIA still handling distribution and royalties. Additional Payments: None.

Consultant: THOMSON WHITE/FCB Purpose for which employed: To create an advertising campaign on television, to promote "Wageline". "Your Rights Are On The Line". Working Plans: Briefing papers provided to parties which sought to tender. Ongoing consultation as project proceeded. Cost: $448 000.00. Duration of Contract 5 March 1990 to 30 June 1990. Additional Payments: None. QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

2150 ASSEMBLY Tuesday. 28 April 1992

Consultant: THOMSON WHITE/FCB Purpose for which employed: Stage 2 of the advertising campaign to promote "Wageline". "Advice That's Straight Down The Line". Working Plans: Briefing papers provided to parties which sought to tender. Ongoing consultation as project proceeded. Cost: $400 994.00. Duration of Contract: 2 August 1991 to 16 December 1991. Additional Payments: None.

Consultant: ARTELLIGENCE Purpose for which employed: To develop and implement a computer-based expert system in line with the department's VITAL system for calculation of wage arrears under the Commercial Clerks Award Working Plans: Specifications provided giving the award information available within the system and the outputs required. Cost: $54 825.00. Duration of Contract: 23 October 1991 - current. Additional Payments: None.

EMPLOYMENT

Consultant: PRICE WATERHOUSE (Only one consultant has been employed since October 1988). Purpose for which employed: Price Waterhouse was employed to undertake computer programming to provide a user­ friendly interface with the Australian Bureau of Statistics ASCO/CCLO link file. Working Plans: An extensive proposal setting out the requirements of the computer system, together with a detailed contract, were provided to Price Waterhouse. Cost: The service cost $14 500. Duration of Contract: The contract, dated 21st August 1989, stated that all work should be completed by 22 September 1989. However, due to several factors, the project was not completed until October 1990. Final payment to Price Waterhouse was made in November 1990. Additional Payments: No additional payments in excess of the contract price were made.

OCCUPATIONAL HEALTH AND SAFETY AUTHORITY MARKETING AND COMMUNICATIONS Consultant: SCALI, McCABE, SLOVES Purpose for which employed: To undertake responsibility for the planning and implementing of a mass media campaign to introduce and advise the Victorian public of the new Dangerous Goods (Storage and Handling) Regulations. Working Plans: A comprehensive agency brief and marketing plan was prepared prior to tendering. A written contract was made detailing creative production and media buy costs and schedules based on the recommendations for a Dangerous Goods Advertising Campaign prepared by Scali, McCabe, Sloves Pty Ltd dated January 1990 and incorporating media recommendations of the same date. Cost: Amount approved $665 010.00. Duration of Contract: 8 months. Additional Payments: Total costs $694 691.13. This amount exceeds the original estimate primarily due to the number of support materials being increased to meet unanticipated needs such as for farming and fire services and the increased number of subsidiary advertisements placed in relevant journals to meet specific targets.

Consultant: THOMSON WHITE/FCB Purpose for which employed: To plan for and advise the Victorian public of the miscellaneous amendments to the OHS Act (1990) and increase awareness of workplace fatality and injury in this State. A comprehensive agency brief and marketing plan was prepared prior to tendering. A written contract was made detailing agency duties, costs, term of appoinhnent, services, commission and service fees, reports and meetings, cancellation and termination. Cost: Amount approved $1 274975.00. Duration of Contract: 7 months (1 January 1991 - July 1991). Additional Payments: Total cost $1 262 835.80. QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

Tuesday, 28 April 1992 ASSEMBLY 2151

Consultant: THOMSON WHITE/FCB Purpose for which employed: To plan for and advise the Victorian public of the benefits of implementing a systems management process to reduce the incidence of claims resulting from workplace accidents and incidents. Working Plans: A comprehensive agency brief and marketing plan was prepared prior to tendering. Agency proposals were subject to market research evaluation. A written contract was made detailing agency duties, costs, terms of appointment, services, commission and service fees, reports and meetings, cancellation and termination. Cost: Amount approved $700 000.00. Duration of Contract: 6 months (1 September 1991 - February 1991). Additional Payments: Total cost $622 212.00.

GOVERNMENT SECTOR WORKFORCE MANAGEMENT

Consultant: DA VRIK TRAINING SERVICES Purpose for which employed: To provide a skill enhancement course for surplus officers. The programme was to provide an introduction to basis computing and including training in: - Introduction to PC - Dbase - Lotus 123 - Wordperfect 5.1 Working plans: The consultant provided an outlines of the course content specifying the subjects to be included in the course. Cost: Cost of services for the total period of contract was $31 000. Duration of Contract: Initially contracted in April 1991 for a series of three (3) programmes. Due to the success of the programme a further six (6) programmes were contracted, extending until December 1991 Additional Payments: The contract price agreed to between Davrik Training and Workforce Management Unit was $3000 per programme comprising twelve (12) participants. Workforce Management Unit increased the size of the group, after the initial 3 programmes, due to the increasing number of redeployees requiring computer skills training in order to facilitate their successful redeployment into available positions. The cost per programme then increased to $4000 for a class size of 15 participants.

VICTORIAN OCCUPATIONAL HEALTH AND SAFETY COMMISSION

The following consultants with contracts exceeding $10 000 were employed since October 1988:

Consultant: LACEY MANAGEMENT SERVICES PTY LTD Purpose for which employed: To identify the occupational health and safety training needs of health and safety representatives, and managers and supervisors, and propose ways of meeting these needs. Working plan: A detailed working plan was submitted by the consultants in the course of the tender process. Cost: $59970. Duration of Contract: Five months from 2 November 1988. Additional Payments: None.

Consultant: VICTORIAN SA WMILLERS' ASSOCIATION Purpose for which employed: To determine the level and extent of injuries occurring in sawmilling operations, research the causes of such injuries and develop strategies for the control of target risks. Working plan: A detailed working plan was submitted by the consultants in the course of the tender process. Cost: $70000. Duration of Contract: One year from 7 February 1989. Additional Payments: None. QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

2152 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 28 April 1992

Consultant: VlNER, ROBINSON, JARMAN PTY LID Purpose for which employed: To conduct research into risk assessment and control in specified segments of the retail industry, and in short distance road transport as it relates to delivery and distribution of goods to those segments. Working plan: Detailed working plans were submitted by the consultants in the course of the tender process. Cost: $97700. Duration of Contract: Six months from 4 April 1990. Additional Payments: None.

Consultant: VICTORIAN TRADES HALL COUNCIL Purpose for which employed: To assist the Commission in undertaking an inquiry into asbestos usage in Victoria. Working plans: A working plan was developed by the project team established by the commission with representation from the Victorian Congress of Employer Associations, the Victorian Trades Hall Council and the Department of Labour. Cost: $3500()' Duration of Contract: Six months from 16 March 1990. Additional payments: None.

Consultant: METAL TRADES INDUSTRY ASSOCIATION OF AUSTRALIA (VICTORIAN BRANCH) Purpose for which employed: To assist the commission in undertaking an inquiry into asbestos usage in Victoria. Working plans: A working plan was developed by the project team established by the commission with representation from the Victorian Congress of Employer Associations, the Victorian Trades Hall Council and the Department of Labour. Cost: $16267. Duration of Contract: Six months from 29 March 1990. Additional payments: None.

Consultant: MONASH UNIVERSITY ACCIDENT RESEARCH CENTRE Purpose for which employed: To research into and report on occupational health and safety issues related to the design and use of forklift trucks in Victoria. Working plans: A detailed working plan was submitted by the consultant in the course of the tender process. Cost: $49965. Duration of Contract: Five months from January 1992 (contract to be signed). Additional payments: None envisaged.

OCCUPATIONAL HEALTH AND SAFETY AUTHORITY

PLANT SAFETY & CHEMICALS

1. COODE ISLAND TECHNICAL INVESTIGATION CONSULTANCY Consultant: MR BARRY PRA IT OF UNlQUEST LIMITED (THE CONSULTA TION ARM OF QUEENSLAND UNIVERSITY) Purpose for which employed: To lead a technical investigation into the circumstances surrounding the fires at the Terminals A site, Coode Island, August 21 and 22, 1991. Working Plans: A detailed brief was provided identifying the purpose of the consultancy and directing the consultant to undertake a technical investigation and evaluation. The brief listed operational objectives and specified the information and reports to be provided. Costs: The consultancy fee is $14 880. Duration of Contract: 10 October 1991-30 April 1992. Additional Payments: None. QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

Tuesday, 28 April 1992 ASSEMBLY 2153

2. RISK ASSESSMENT STUDY OF THE ESSO/BHP FRACTIONATION PLANT AND ASSOCIA TED TANK FARM Consultant: TECHNICA LIMITED, LONDON (RESTECH CONSULTANTS, AUSTRALIA) Purpose for which employed: To assess the risks associated with locating a marine loading/unloading facility near the Esso/BHP fractionation plant at Long Island Point, Hastings. Working Plans: A detailed, five-page study brief was provided. The study brief included: the objectives, scope, and time frames of the project. It also specified the information and reports to be provided. Another detailed work plan was provided after the completion of a draft report. The plan identified new sections to be included and areas of the report requiring expansion and updating. A time frame was also provided. Cost: The consultancy fee was $65 000. Duration of Contract: October 1990 - March 1991. Additional Payment: An additional payment of $33000 was approved for an extension of the study to account for plant modifications, emerging community issues and other local developments.

3. DANGEROUS GOODS (STORAGE AND HANDLING) REGULATIONS 1989 Consultant: MR BARRY PRATT OF UNIQUEST LIMITED Purpose for which employed: To review a draft of regulations for the storage of dangerous goods and finalise the draft to the stage where it is suitable for promulgation. Working Plans: A two-page brief was provided. The brief outlines the purpose of the project, listed objectives and provided a three stage time frame for its completion. An additional work plan was provided for the extended study. This lists operational objectives and provides a two stage time frame for completion of the objectives. Cost: The consultancy fee was $25 000. Duration of Contract: 9 January 1989 -27 March 1989. Additional Payments: Additional payments of $15000 and $SOOO were approved for an extension of the consultancy to consolidate the regulations and represent the Department of Labour in the final Victorian Occupational Health and Safety Commission working party sessions.

CONSTRUCTION INDUSTRY LONG SERVICE LEAVE BOARD Consultants employed by the board with contracts exceeding $10 000.00 since October 1988:

Consultant: SYSTEM SERVICES PTY LID Purpose for which employed Contracted to assist the board's EDP section with clean up of work backlogs associated with systems modifications and audit trails. Working Plans: System investigation forms from board's users specifying instructions. Cost: $39145.00. Duration of Contract: 7 months. Additional Payments: $3145.00.

Consultant: W ANG AUSTRALIA Purpose for which employed: Change the board's EDP programs structure written in PACE to improve performance. Working Plans: Through working specifications developed by Wang with contributions from the board's staff - EDP and users. Cost: $41500.00. Duration of Contract: 2 1/2 months. Additional Payments: Nil.

WORKCARE APPEALS BOARD Since October 1988 the board has engaged the following consultants with contracts exceeding $10 000.00: Consultant: PROJECT PLANNING & MANAGEMENT (PPM) Purpose for which employed: The firm was engaged in January 1990 to assess temporary accommodation for the board and to oversight the rental/fitout program at 191 Queen Street. Working Plans: The brief provided for the firm to oversight and coordinate leasing, architectural, structural and building contracts for the project. Cost: $22 000. QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

2154 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 28 April 1992

Duration of Contract: 4 months ending May 1990. Additional Payments: Nil.

Consultant: PROJECT PLANNING & MANAGEMENT (PPM) Purpose for which employed: The firm was engaged in February 1990 to perform a project management function in respect of the board's permanent accommodation at 624 Bourke Street. Working Plans: The brief required PPM to assess permanent accommodation for the board and to oversee and coordinate leasing, architectural, mechanical and electrical services and building contract for the project. Cost: $43000. Duration of Contract: March 1990 to February 1991. Additional Payments: Nil.

Consultant: NELSON PARKHILL BOO Purpose for which employed: The firm was engaged to assess the viability of dividing the corporate service function then existing at the Accident Compensation Tribunal. Working Plans: The brief required the firm to define a separation of resources between the board and the Accident Compensation Tribunal with zero net increase in total staff resources across both agencies. Cost: $17500 (50% WAB share of cost). Duration of Contract: June 1990 to November 1990. Additional Payments: Nil.

WOMEN BOARD, COUNCIL OR COMMIITEE MEMBERS - DEPARTMENT OF LABOUR

(Question No. 1278) Mrs WADE asked the Minister for Labour: In respect of each department, agency or authority within his administration, how many women hold positions on boards, councils or committees, indicating in respect of each board, council or committee, the names and qualifications of each female member, and the total number of members? Mr POPE (Minister for Labour) - The answer is: The response for the Employment Division has been included in this answer as the Employment Division was part of the portfolio of the Minister for Labour at the time of the question. Employment is now part of the portfolio of the Minister for Employment, Post-Secondary Education and Training. INDUSTRIAL RELATIONS DIVISION Victorian Building and Construction Industry Council One female member Director, Major Capital Projects, Ministry of Finance Quals - Bachelor of Architecture (Melb) Post Grad. Diploma in Urban Sociology (Swinburne) Advanced Management Program (Mt. Eliza) Seventeen members on Council

OCCUPATIONAL HEALTH AND SAFETY AUTHORITY The following is a list of committees with women members. Qualifications are not specifically recorded since committee members are nominated by bodies or the Minister on an organisational basis.

1. Victorian Occupational Health & Safety Commission

Victorian Occupational Health & Safety Commission members One female - VTHC One female - Independent commissioner Alternate Members One female - VCEA QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

Tuesday, 28 April 1992 ASSEMBLY 2155

One female - VCEA One female - VCEA One female - VTHC One female - VTHC Membership total 14 Alternate members total 10

VOHSC Retail Research Steering Committee One female - VCEA One female - VCEA One female - OHSA One female - VCEA One female - VTHC Membership total 8

VOHSC Non-English Speaking Background Workers' Advisory Committee One female - VTHC One female - VTHC One female - OHSA One female - OHSA One female - Chairperson (OHSA) One female - VCEA Membership total 9

VOHSC Building and Construction Industry Advisory Committee One female - OHSA One female - Chairperson (OHSA) Membership total 16

VOHSC Education and Training Advisory Committee One female - VTHC One female - Chairperson (OHSA) Membership total 7

VOHSC Research Advisory Committee Female - VTHC Membership total 5

VOHSC Women Workers Advisory Committee One female - VTHC One female - Independent expert One female - VCEA One female - VCEA One female - OHSA One female - VCEA One female - VTHC Membership total 7

VOHSC Standards Advisory Committee One female - OHSA One female - VOHSC commissioner Membership total 7 QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

2156 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 28 April 1992

2. Hazardous Chemicals Taskforce

Consultative Committee One female - Melbourne City Council One female - Hazardous Materials Action Group One female - Dandenong City Council Membership total 14

EMPLOYMENT MIGRANT SKILlS AND QUAUFICATIONS BOARD

Membership - including chair 11 Female members 4

Barrister and Solicitor LLB (Hons), MA (Public Policy)

Migrant Liaison Officer Victorian Trades Hall Council BA Dip. Ed.

Vic President Association of Overseas Qualified Professionals Ph.D., BA(Hons)

Director Training Development Division Office of the State Training Board MA, BA(Hons), Grad. Dip. of Librarianship

INDUSTRIAL RELATIONS COMMISSION OF VIcrORIA

Two female commissioners Membership total 14

In respect of Conciliation and Arbitration Boards, the IRCV currently has approximately 222 boards with members, totalling approximately 1350 board members, of which 194 are women. Details of qualifications of board members are not kept by the IRCV registry.

CONSTRUCTION INDUSTRY LONG SERVICE LEAYE BOARD

1. Construction Industry Long Service Leave Board 11 members Nil female members

2. Information Technology Committee 7 members 1 female member (progress towards BBus (Accounts Major»

3. CIlSLB Development Working Party 4 members 1 female (B.Bus (Personnel &t Industrial Relations»

4. Occupational Health &t Safety Committee 4 members 1 female member (progress towards B.Bus (Accounts Major» QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

Tuesday, 28 April 1992 ASSEMBLY 2157

5. Office Based Structure Steering Committee 8 members 2 female members (B. Se. (Psychology & Mathematics» and RBus (Personnel & Industrial Relations) 6. Office Based Structure Executive, Investment & Property and Corporate Services Working Parties 4 members 2 female members (B. Se. (Psychology & Mathematics» and (non-tertiary qualified)

7. Office Based Structure Industry Services Working Party 4 members 1 female member (B. Se. (Psychology & Mathematics»

ACCIDENT COMPENSAnON COMMISSION

One female (appointed 5 March 1991) Membership total 12

MEDICAL PANELS Medical Panels Selection Committee 3 members One female member (MBBBS) (The list of members of the medical panels consists of 67 specialist medical practitioners, one female - MBBS, FRCS)

VICTORIAN ACCIDENT REHABILIT AnON COUNCIL

VARC Board of Management One female - BA One female - Registered Nurse One female - Occ. Psych. MAPS Membership total 11

Standards Advisory Committee One female One female - BA Psychology, Post Grad. Diploma Rehab. Counselling, MA in Counselling. Registered Psychologist One female Membership total 9

Professional Review Committee One female One female One female - B App. Se. (Physio), Grad, Dip.Rehab. Studies, Grad, Dip. Health Admin. Membership total 4

Workplace Based Injury Management Advisory Committee One female - Registered Nurse One female One female Membership total 13

Vocational Rehabilitation Training Committee One female - B. App. Se. (Physio), Grad. Dip. Rehab. Studies, Grad. Dip. Health Admin. One female - BA Psychology, Post Grad. Diploma Rehab. Counselling, MA in Counselling, Registered Psychologist. One female QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

2158 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 28 April :992

One female Membership total 12

WORKCARE APPEALS BOARD

Senior Members - Full time One female - LLB, BA, Barrister and Solicitor One female - BSc, LLB, Barrister and Solicitor One female - BA, Dip. Ed., LLB One female - LLB, BA, Registered Nurse One female - BA, BSW, MSW One female - BA, LLB, Grad.Dip.Lib. Total women 6 Total membership 20

Senior Members - Part time One female - BA, LLB, Grad. Dip. Soc. Stud. One female - BA(Hons), LLB, LLM One female - LLB One female - BA, LLB, BEd One female - LLB, LLM Total women 5 Total membership 5

Senior Members - Sessional One female - B. Juris, LLB One female - BEc, LLB One female - LLB One female - BA(Hons), LLB (Hons), LLB; M Phil. One female - BA, LLB One female - BA, LLB Total women 6 Total membership 13

Ordinary Members - Full time One female - BA, Cert. in Ergonomics One female - SRN, Cert. of Occ. Health & Safety and Welfare One female - Sen. Grad .Dip. Soc. Sc. One female -SRN. Cert. of Occ. Health & Safety and Welfare Total women 4 Total membership 8

Ordinary Members - Part time One female - BA, BSW, Dip. Data Collection and Analysis One female - BSc, Dip. Ed. One female - Dip. Soc. Studies One female - BA, Dip. Ed., B.Ed. One female - BA, Dip. Soc. Studies Total women 5 Total membership 13

Ordinary Members - Sessional One female - BA One female - BA, Dip. Soc. Studies One female - BA QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

Tuesday. 28 April 1992 ASSEMBLY 2159

One female - SRN, Dip. Soc. Studies, BSW One female - BSc, Dip. Ed., Continuing Education Certificate - Occupational Rehabilitation

Total women 5 Total membership 13

Medical Members Total women 0 Total membership 6

DISCHARGED SERVICEMEN'S EMPLOYMENT BOARD

3 members o female

INTERPRETERS - MAJOR PROJECTS

Question No. 1314 Mr DICKINSON asked the Minister for Major Projects: In respect of interpreters employed by each department, agency and authority within the Minister's administration: 1. How many interpreters are employed on a full-time or part-time basis, indicating (a) the languages other than English spoken; (b) in which offices such interpreters are located; and (c) what is the cost to the people of Victoria? 2. Whether officers undertaking private courses in foreign language receive any government assistance? Mr KENNAN (Minister for Major Projects) - The answer is: I am advised by the Major Projects Unit that: No interpreters are employed by the Major Projects Unit, either full time or part time, nor does any member of staff participate in any private courses in foreign languages with government assistance.

INTERPRETERS - HEALTH

Question No. 1332 Mr DICKINSON asked the Minister for Community Services, for the Minister for Health: In respect of interpreters employed by each department, agency and authority within the Minister's administration: 1. How many interpreters are employed on a full-time or part-time basis, indicating (a) the languages other than English spoken; (b) in which offices such interpreters are located; and (c) what is the cost to the people of Victoria? 2. Whether officers undertaking private courses in foreign language receive any government assistance? Mrs SETCHES (Minister for Community Services) - The answer supplied by the Minister for Health is: 1. Interpreting services to the health sector are provided through three distinct arrangements: (i) Central Health Interpreter Services (CHIS) a publicly funded statutory body which provides a central pool of health interpreters for public health agencies; (ii) Mental Health Interpreter Services (MHIS), a government agency which provides a small specialist pool of interpreters to psychiatric services; (iii) Interpreters employed directly by individual hospitals. Following machinery of government changes announced in January 1991, responsibility for the CHIS and MHIS is now provided by the Ministry of Ethnic, Municipal and Community Affairs. Information on the operation and funding of CHIS and MHIS is now provided by the Ministry of Ethnic, Municipal and Community Affairs. Hospital-funded interpreters continue to be the responsibility of the employing hospital. Fourteen Victorian hospitals employ in-house interpreters out of their global budgets. Approximately 35 interpreters covering 12 languages are involved. The approximate total cost of hospital-based interpreters is $700 000. Details on the operation and funding of hospital-based interpreters are kept by each individual hospital. QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

2160 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 28 Apri11992

Training provisions for interpreters of CHIS and MHIS are now the responsibility of MEMCA. In-service training for hospital-based interpreters is provided through the professional development programs of each institution.

GEELONG REGIONAL STAFF - MAJOR PROJECTS

Question No. 1341 Mr DICKINSON asked the Minister for Major Projects: In respect of each department, agency and authority within his administration, whether it is intended to dispose of staff in the Geelong region; if so - (a) how many; (b) in which areas; (c) over what period; (d) for what reasons; indicating in each case - (i) what categories of staff are involved and how many in each category are to be dismissed; (ii) what redundancy package is being offered; and (iii) how will superannuation entitlements be affected? Mr KENNAN (Minister for Major Projects) - The answer is: I am advised by the Major Projects that: The Major Projects Unit does not employ any staff within the Geelong region.

GEELONG REGIONAL STAFF - HEALTH

Question No. 1359 Mr DICKINSON asked the Minister for Community Services, for the Minister for Minister for Health: In respect of each department, agency and authority within her administration, whether it is intended to dispose of staff in the Geelong region; if so - (a) how many; (b) in which areas; (c) over what period; (d) for what reasons; indicating in each case - (i) what categories of staff are involved and how many in each category are to be dismissed; (ii) what redundancy package is being offered; and (ill) how will superannuation entitlements be affected? Mrs SETCHES (Minister for Community Services) - The answer supplied by the Minister for Health is: There are no program changes planned to retrench staff of the department in the Geelong region.

UNION GRANTS - MAJOR PROJECTS

Question No. 1395 Mr DICKINSON asked the Minister for Major Projects: In respect of each department, agency and authority within his administration, what are the details of all grants made since the last election to trade union groups? Mr KENNAN (Minister for Major Projects) - The answer is: I am advised by the Major Projects that: No grants were made by the Major Projects Unit to any trade union group since the last election.

UNION AUTHORITY BOARD MEMBERS - HEALTH

Question No. 1494 Mr DICKINSON asked the Minister for Community Services, for the Minister for Health: In respect of each statutory authority within her administration, whether provision has been made for elected representatives or trade union nominated representatives on their boards; indicating - (a) what the basis is of their representation and when it was established; (b) who the current trade-union representatives are and who held the positions previously; and (c) what fees or remuneration are paid to the representatives? QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

Tuesday, 28 April 1992 ASSEMBLY 2161

Mrs SETCHES (Minister for Community Services) - The answer supplied by the Minister for Health is: I assume by "elected representatives or trade-union nominated representatives" the Member is referring to those persons appointed or elected to statutory boards as the result of an election conducted by, or on the nomination of the Victorian Trades Hall Council or a union affiliated with the council and does not include members appointed, or elected, by those whose profession or trade is regulated by a statutory board, or who may be appointed on the nomination of a professional association or college, or by the board itself. On this basis, the answer to the member's question is as follows:

Dental Technicians Licensing Committee (a) Dental Technicians Act 1972 -section 3(1)(d)

(b) Trevor Knight (current member) Trevor Knight (previous member)

(c) $66 per half day meeting

Food Standards Committee- section 60 (2)(i)

(b) Bernard Reed (current member) John Parker (previous member)

(c) $63 per half day meeting

Victorian Ambulance Board

(a) Ambulance Services Act 1986 -sections 7(2)(e), (f)

(b) Gary Bartram, John Taplin (current members) Norman Branson, Geoff Coffey (previous member)

(c) None

Victorian Nursing Council

(a) Nurses Act 1958 -sections 4 (2) (a) (ii), 4(2) (v)

(b) Raymond Thomas, Anne Higgins, Andrew Robinson (current members) Raymond Thomas, Jean Phillips, Andrew Robinson (previous members)

(c) $153 per full day meeting

COMPASS AIRLINE TICKETS - MAJOR PROJECTS

Question No. 1530 Mr DICKINSON asked the Minister for Major Projects: In respect of each deparbnent, agency and authority within his administration, how many Compass airline tickets were held at the time of the Compass collapse, indicating -(a) the value of the tickets; and (b) whether any refunds, or alternative travel, have been received? Mr KENNAN (Minister for Major Projects) - The answer is: I am advised by the Major Projects that: No Compass airline tickets have been purchased by this unit. The Major Projects Unit obtains all airlie tickets through National Bank Travel. QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

2162 ASSEMBLY Tuesday, 28 April 1992

DOMESTIC AIR TRAVEL - MAJOR PROJECTS

Question No. 1558 Mr DICKINSON asked the Minister for Major Projects: In respect of each department, agency and authority within his administration, what percentage of domestic air travel was undertaken by officers for each of the years 1987 to 1991 inclusive, indicating which airline provided the travel? Mr KENNAN (Minister for Major Projects) - The answer is: I am advised by the Major Projects Unit that in each of the years 1987 to 1991 the following amount of domestic air travel was undertaken by officers of the Major Projects Unit:

Year No. of return domestic flights Carrier

1987 3 return domestic flights Australian Airlines for 2, Ansett for 1

1988 5 return domestic flights Australian Airlines for 3, Ansett for 2

1989 1 return domestic flight Australian Airlines

1990 4 return domestic flights Australian Airlines

1991 18 return domestic flights Australian Airlines for 12, Ansett for 6

MOTOR VEHICLES - MAJOR PROJECTS

Question No. 1585 Mr DICKINSON asked the Minister for Major Projects: In respect of each department, agency and authority within his administration, what vehicles were acquired in each of the years 1987 to 1991 inclusive, indicating -(a) the make; (b) type; (c) model of vehicle; and (d) whether consideration has been given to privatise departmental fleet ownership; if not why? Mr KENNAN (Minister for Major Projects) - The answer is: I am advised by the Major Projects Unit that in each of the years 1987 to 1991 the following vehicles were purchased: Year Make Model Type Date Date Purchased Purchased Sold

1987 Mitsubishi Sigma Sedan 14.4.87 4.7.89 1987 Mitsubishi Sigma Sedan 17.11.87 4.7.89 1987 Nissan Pintara Sedan 20.11.87 18.6.90 1988 Nissan Pintara Sedan 24.11.88 2.11.90 1988 Holden Calais VNSedan 13.3.88 10.4.90 1989 Toyota Camry SE Wagon 4.7.89 1990 Toyota Camry CSXSedan 10.4.90 1990 Ford Fairlaine NASedan 18.6.90 1991 Mitsubishi Magna GLXWagon 2.11.90 1991 Mitsubishi Magna GLXWagon 1.7.91 1991 Ford Laser GhiaSedan 5.7.91 1991 Ford Corsair Ghia Sedan 24.6.91

As only a small number of vehicles are owned by the Unit consideration has not been given to purchasing fleet ownership. Vehicles owned have been purchased on an 'as needs' basis through VicFleet, Ministry of Finance, in accordance with State Tender Board requirements. QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

Wednesday, 29 April 1992 ASSEMBLY 2163

Wednesday, 29 April 1992

QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

The following answers to questions on notice were circulated:

ADMINISTRATIVE APPEALS TRIBUNAL

(Question No. 922) Mr LEIGH asked the Attorney-General: How many divisions of the Administrative Appeals Tribunal have been chaired by Mr Waiter Webb since 1 January 1989, indicating - (a) the number of cases in which hearings have been completed but a determination not yet given; and (b) the average length of time between completion of hearings and the handing down of de terminations? Mr KENNAN (Attorney-General) - The answer is: I have been advised that as at February 1992, Mr Webb, Deputy President of the Administrative Appeals Tribunal has no determinations outstanding other than those matters heard in recent weeks and that ascertaining the time lapsed between hearings and determinations would require an unjustifiable allocation of resources.

WOMEN BOARD, COUNCIL OR COMMITTEE MEMBERS - FOOD AND AGRICULTURE

(Question No. 1273) Mrs WADE asked the Minister for Food and Agriculture: In respect of each department, agency or authority within his administration, how many women hold positions on boards, councils or committees, indicating in respect of each board, council or committee, the names and qualifications of each female member, and the total number of members? Mr BAKER (Minister for Food and Agriculture) - The answer is: The large number of boards, councils and committees within the department, agencies and authorities that report to me make the resources necessary to compile the information to answer the member's question unjustifiable. If, however, the member has a specific board, council or committee about which she would like detailed information, I would be happy to provide such information.

INTERPRETERS - FOOD AND AGRICULTURE

Question No. 1317 Mr DICKINSON asked the Minister for Food and Agriculture: In respect of interpreters employed by each department, agency and authority within the Minister's administration: 1 How many interpreters are employed on a full-time or part-time basis, indicating (a) the languages other than English spoken; (b) in which offices such interpreters are located; and (c) what is the cost to the people of Victoria? 2 Whether officers undertaking private courses in foreign language receive any Government assistance? Mr BAKER (Minister for Food and Agriculture) - The answer is: 1. Neither the Department of Food and Agriculture, nor agencies or authorities that report to me employ interpreters on staff. QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

2164 ASSEMBLY Wednesday, 29 April 1992

2. No officer undertaking private courses in a foreign language receive government assistance for such courses. However, the department does keep a register of officers that may be of assistance in providing interpreter services if the need should arise.

INTERPRETERS - SCHOOL EDUCATION

Question No. 1324 Mr DICKINSON asked the Minister for School Education: In respect of interpreters employed by each department, agency and authority within the Minister's administration: 1 How many interpreters are employed on a full-time or part-time basis, indicating (a) the languages other than English spoken; (b) in which offices such interpreters are located; and (c) what is the cost to the people of Victoria? 2 Whether officers undertaking private courses in foreign language receive any Government assistance? Mr POPE (Minister for School Education) - The answer is: 1. (a) No interpreters are employed on a full-time or part-time basis by the Department of School Education. Language services are now co-ordinated centrally by the Ministry of Ethnic, Municipal and Community Affairs (MEMCA). (b) Two MEMCA employees based. at the Geelong School Support Centre by mutual agreement provide language services in Italian and Croatian. No other interpreters are located in DSE offices. (c) Advice should be sought from MEMCA. 2. Advice about interpreters undertaking private courses in foreign languages should be sought from MEMCA. Teachers of languages other than English (LOTE) who had paid study leave in 1991 are continuing their sequential LOTE study in 1992. No new study leave awards were granted for 1992 from the normal study leave provision. To meet DSE policy on LOTE provision, LOTE teachers of those languages which are in short supply (eg. Japanese) have been given the opportunity under the LOTE Training and Retraining Program to undertake tertiary courses in order to upgrade their LOTE qualifications.

GEELONG REGIONAL STAFF - CONSERVATION AND ENVIRONMENT

Question No. 1342 Mr DICKINSON asked the Attorney-General, for the Minister for Conservation and Environment: In respect of each department, agency and authority within his administration, whether it is intended to dispose of staff in the Geelong region; if so - (a) how many; (b) in which areas; (c) over what period; (d) for what reasons; indicating in each case - (i) what categories of staff are involved and how many in each category are to be dismissed; (ii) what redundancy package is being offered; and (ill) how will superannuation entitlements be affected? Mr KENNAN (Attorney-General) - The answer supplied by the Minister for Conservation and Environment is: In respect of all agencies within the conservation and environment portfolio: There is no program to specifically reduce staff in the Geelong region. Any such reductions are likely to be the result of general activities, such as individual officers taking up offers of enhanced resignation packages, or decisions to streamline an area of that agency's operations.

GEELONG REGIONAL STAFF -FOOD AND AGRICULTURE

Question No. 1344 Mr DICKINSON asked the Minister for Food and Agriculture: In respect of each department, agency and authority within his administration, whether it is intended to dispose of staff in the Geelong region; if so - (a) how many; (b) in which areas; (c) over what period; (d) for what reasons; indicating in each case - (i) what categories of staff are involved and how many in each category are to be dismissed; (ii) what redundancy package is being offered; and (ill) how will superannuation entitlements be affected? QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

Wednesday, 29 April 1992 ASSEMBLY 2165

Mr BAKER (Minister for Food and Agriculture) - The answer is: At the time of the member's question, there were no plans to "dispose of" staff. For the purpose of responding to this question, Geelong region has been interpreted as the Geelong metropolitan area.

PUBLICATIONS - FOOD AND AGRICULTURE

Question No. 1371 Mr DICKINSON asked the Minister for Food and Agriculture: In respect of each department, agency and authority within his administration, what publications are produced, indicating - (a) how many copies are produced; (b) what the unit cost is, including production and distribution of the publication; (c) what income, if any, is derived from the publication; (d) what is the purpose of the publication; and (e) whether the publication was solely printed in Victoria; if not, why? Mr BAKER (Minister for Food and Agriculture) - The answer is: The following table sets out publications distributed or made generally available to the public which were produced by the Department of Food and Agriculture or agencies under my administration for the period 1 January 1992 to 31 March 1992:

NUMBER PUBLICA nON COST TO COST TO PURPOSE/ STATE PRINTED TITLE PUBLIC PRODUCE TYPE PRINTED

1000 Saltwatch Sports $5.00 $5.00 Teacher resource Vic. 200 Table Grape News $3.50 $3.50 Newsletter Vic. 300 A Taste of Salt Free $2.30 Poster Vie. 1000 Solar Drying $0.45 $0.45 Information Vie. 3400 Mallee Farmer Free (1) Newsletter Vie. 80 Ag. & Pasat. Rep. $0.67 $1.30 Information Vie. 800 Chem.Ind.News Free $1.20 Information Vie. 5000 Wimmera Farmer Free (1) Newsletter Vie. 50 Clin.Path.Interp. of Blood Tests Free $3.50 Information Vie. 100 Sentinel Free $0.55 Information Vie. 500 Pigs & People $7.50 $5.00 Conference Papers Vie. 100 Pig Open Day Papers $4.00 $2.50 Open Day Papers Vie. 100 Field Day Notes Free $2.50 Information Vie. 900 Sheep Notes Free $1.00 Information Vie. 125 Yellow Rag Free $0.50 Industry Newsletter Vie. 250 Pasture Renovation Free $0.20 Information Vie. 2000 MRCbooklet Free $0.57 Information Vie. 3000 Subcontracting information $15.95 $2.80 Information Vie. 1000 Greenhouse information $8.95 $2.23 Information Vie. 14000 Wheat varieties Free $0.21 Information Vie. 20000 Brochures -Various (prom.) Free $0.03 Information Vie. 200 Newsletter (2) $5.00 Information Vie. 700 Dairy Course Notes Free $5.00 Course Notes Vie. 150 Field Day Notes Free $0.84 Information Vie. 300 Newsletter Free $2.23 Information Vie. 150 Man. the Downturn Free $2.80 Information VIe. 250 Chemical Residues Free $0.95 Information Vie. 100 Technieal Bulletin Free $2.50 Information Vic. 400 Research Report $15.00 $7.50 Research Update Vie. 400 Fact Sheets Free $0.03 Information Vie. 350 OnionCryer Free (1) Ind. Newlet. Vie. 5200 Up-Update Free (1) Information Vie. 450 Regional Ag. Report Free $2.55 Information Vie. 2500 Northern Irr. Cropper Free (1) Information Vie. 300 Aust. Barley News Free $1.67 Info. to Gov. SA(3) 1800 Citrep Free $0.77 Information Vie. 1450 Veterinary List $50.00 $5.39 To meet req.of Act Vie. QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

2166 ASSEMBLY Wednesday, 29 April 1992

500 VDFB Ann. Rep. Free $2.74 To meet req. of Act Vic. 9000 Milk News Free $1.82 Information Vie. 60000 M-Team Supemews Free $0.49 Promotion for Milk Vic. 800 Egg Report Free $0.98 Newletter Vie. 400 Notes from the Board Free $0.47 Newsletter Vie. 500 Making cut Free $0.05 Info. flyer Vic. 1000 Questionnaire on strawberries Free $0.10 Public awareness Vie. 500 Potato varieties Chart Free $0.10 Public awareness Vie. 500 Grape Quality Assurance in Vie. Free $0.06 Public awareness Vie. 500 Aust. Nutrition Free $0.10 Public awareness Vie. Foundation Information 500 Crop Herbicide $10.00 $7.00 Information Vie. Information '92 500 Maize Team News Free $1.00 Information Vic. 60 Beef Field Day Free $15.00 Information Vie. 2000 Workshop brochure Free $2.28 Promotion for workshop Vic. 200 N.E. Animal Health Newsletter Free $4.00 Information Vie. 200 Field Day Notes Free $5.00 Information Vie. 100 Field Day Notes Free $2.00 Information Vie. 50 Seed Workshop Notes Free $2.00 Workshop Notes Vic. 1200 Soil Care Newsletter Free $9.00 Information Vie. 80 Drought Feeding of BeefCattIe Free $5.00 Information Vie. 200 Direct Seeding of trees Free $1.00 Information Vie.

Note (1) Costs have been offset by advertising in total or to a large part Note (2) Distributed free to industry, or $37.50 to non-industry Note (3) Produced by the Australian Barley Board whieh is a joint board with South Australia and is located in Adelaide

PUBLICATIONS - HEALTH

Question No. 1386 Mr DICKINSON asked the Minister for Community Services, for the Minister for Health: In respect of each deparbnent, agency and authority within her administration, what publications are produced, indicating - (a) how many copies are produced; (b) what the unit cost is, including production and distribution of the publication; (c) what income, if any, is derived from the publication; (d) what is the purpose of the publication; and (e) whether the publication was solely printed in Victoria; if not, why? Mrs SETCHES (Minister for Community Services) - The answer supplied by the Minister for Health is: The time and resources required to answer the question for all agencies and authorities of Health Deparbnent Victoria cannot be justified. (a) Excluding those publications tabled in Parliament, the following regular publications have been produced by the deparbnent in the financial year 1991-92: (1) Health Deparbnent Victoria. 1990-91 in review (3000 copies) (2) Health Victoria (63 600 copies per annum) (3) Elective surgery activity bulletin (500 copies) (4) Hospital comparative data (1600 copies) (5) A guide to hospital DRG reports (300 copies) (6) Coverage - newsletter of the AIDS/STD Unit (2000 copies) (7) Victorian STD surveillance report (2500 copies) (8) Surveillance of sexually transmitted diseases in Victoria 1990 (2000 copies) (9) Health events calendar 1991 (3000 copies) (10) Open mind - newsletter of OPS (7000 copies) (b) The unit costs of the above publications are: (1) $1.52 (2) $0.75 (3) $0.35 (4) $4.61 (5) $1.18 (6) $0.55 (7) $0.22 (8) $1.58 (9) $0.37 (10) $0.11. (c) $875.00 from sales of item (4) to private consultants. QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

Wednesday, 29 April 1992 ASSEMBLY 2167

(d) The publications are issued to inform the health sector and the community of the Health Department Victoria's policies and activities. (e) The publications are printed solely in Victoria.

UNION GRANTS - CONSERVATION AND ENVIRONMENT

Question No. 1396 Mr DICKINSON asked the Attorney-General, for the Minister for Conservation and Environment: In respect of each department, agency and authority within his administration, what are the details of all grants made since the last election to trade union groups? Mr KENNAN (Attorney-General) - The answer supplied by the Minister for Conservation and Environment is: Since the last election on 1 October 1988, grants totalling $113 900 have been made available by the Department of Conservation and Environment to the Victorian Trades Hall Council for the establishment of a project officer position at the Trades Hall to coordinate communications between the government and trade union movement on environment issues and concerns. Since the last election the Environment Protection Authority has made a grant of $30 000 to the Victorian Trades Hall Council to produce 700 000 copies of recycling leaflets. The total cost of the production of the leaflets was $50 000. No other agencies within my portfolio have made any grants to trade union groups since the last election.

UNION GRANTS - FOOD AND AGRICULTURE

Question No. 1398 Mr DICKINSON asked the Minister for Food and Agriculture: In respect of each department, agency and authority within his administration, what are the details of all grants made since the last election to trade union groups? Mr BAKER (Minister for Food and Agriculture) - The answer is: The Department of Food and Agriculture and agencies that report to me have not made grants to trade union groups since the last election.

ENTERTAINMENT EXPENDITURE - FOOD AND AGRICULTURE

Question No. 1425 Mr DICKINSON asked the Minister for Food and Agriculture: In respect of each department, agency and authority within his administration, what was the actual expenditure on entertainment and hospitality for each of the years 1987 to 1991 inclusive, indicating the positions held by the persons authorising such expenditure? Mr BAKER (Minister for Food and Agriculture) -The answer is: As expenditure on "entertainment" and "hospitality" are not charged. against a particular Budget line, but are instead accounted against the program which incurs such expenditure, resulting in the need. to check through each Budget line individually, the time and resources to supply the information sought in the member's question cannot be justified.

COMPASS AIRLINE TICKETS - HEALTH

Question No. 1549 Mr DICKINSON asked the Minister for Community Services, for the Minister for Health: In respect of each department, agency and authority within her administration, how many Compass airline tickets were held at the time of the Compass collapse, indicating - (a) the value of the tickets; and (b) whether any refunds, or alternative travel, have been received? QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

2168 ASSEMBLY Wednesday, 29 April 1992

Mrs SETCHES (Minister for Community Services) - The answer supplied by the Minister for Health is: At the time of the Compass airline collapse, Health Department Victoria did not hold any Compass airline tickets.

TEACHERS - SCHOOL EDUCATION

Question No. 1610 Mr DICKINSON asked the Minister for School Education: For each school in the Geelong Region for the years 1987 to 1991 inclusive - (a) what was the number of teaching staff; (b) how many new teachers were employed; and (c) the cost of emergency teacher services? Mr POPE (Minister for School Education) - The answer is: (a) The number of teachers in the Geelong School Support Centre district for the years 1987 to 1991:

1987 1988 1989 1990 1991

Primary Schools information 879.5 928.5 920.0 928.5 not retained

Secondary Colleges 945.6 936.6 927.1 918.5 915.1

(b) The number of new teachers employed:

1987 1988 1989 1990 1991

Primary Schools 6S 41 96 41 14

Secondary Colleges 128 103 123 103 52

(These figures are for the Barwon South Western Region. The Geelong School Support Centre District would represent 40 per cent of the region total.)

(c) The cost of emergency teacher services 1987 -1991:

1986/87 1987/88 1988/89 1989/90 1990/91 $ $ $ $ $

2761461 2531154 2600958 2895324 2490 113

ANDREW, FREWIN AND RICHMOND CONSULTANCY - HEALTH

Question No. 1634 Mr PERTON asked the Minister for Community Services, for the Minister for Health: In respect of a consultancy conducted by Andrew, Frewin and Richmond for Health Department Victoria in relation to the 'Bendigo Psychiatric Centre - external audit': 1. Whether he will advise - (a) on what date the consultancy commenced; (b) the original planned duration of the consultancy; and (c) the date of the completion of the consultancy? 2. Whether the contractual price for the delivery of the consultancy was $2221; if not, what was the contractual price? 3. What are the qualifications of the consultant(s) and the hourly /daily fee for the consultant(s)? 4. Who has been interviewed by the consultant(s)? 5. What were the original terms of the consultancy, indicating whether there has been any alteration to the terms of the consultancy; if so - what were the alterations? 6. Whether the consultant(s) has produced any interim/final finding, reports or recommendations; if so - what are the dates and details of such finding, reports or recommendations? QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

Wednesday, 29 April 1992 ASSEMBLY 2169

Mrs SETCHES (Minister for COITummity Services) - The answer supplied by the Minister for Health is: 1. (a) The consultancy commenced on 11 November 1991. (b) Original planned duration was 2 to 3 weeks. (c) Completion date of consultancy: 24 December 1991 (Date of final report). 2. No. The contract price is $7995.00. 3. Chartered Accountants; the average hourly fee is $51.50 • 4. Chief Executive Officer, General Services Officer as well as staff at Bendigo Psychiatric Centre. 5. To conduct on behalf of the Health Department an internal audit of Bendigo Psychiatric Centre; no alteration is made to the terms of engagement. 6. A final report, dated 24 December 1991, made the following audit observations: that controls and procedures operating at the centre are adequate, and the centre has generally adhered to those controls and procedures; a number of controls could be improved. Details are contained in a copy of the final report, which has been sent under separate cover to Mr Perton. QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

2170 ASSEMBLY Thursday. 30 April 1992

Thursday, 30 April 1992

QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

The following answers to questions on notice were circulated:

SUPERANNUATION - DEPARTMENT OF LABOUR

(Question No. 863) Mr GUDE (Hawthorn) asked the Minister for Labour: 1. Whether a consultant has identified an anomaly regarding the amount of taxation taken from employees of the Department of Labour contributing to the State Superannuation Board of Victoria? 2. Whether the Department of Labour has been making its full progressive contribution toward each employee's entitlement within the State Superannuation Board; if not, why? 3. Whether he will provide the dates that the Department of Labour employer's contributions were made to the State Superannuation Board during the period 1985-90, indicating (a) the date that payment was due; (b) the amount due on each date; and (c) the amount contributed on each date? Mr POPE (Minister for Labour) - The answer is: 1. The department has no knowledge of a consultant identifying an anomaly regarding the amount of taxation taken from employees of the Department of Labour contributing to the State Superannuation Board of Victoria. 2. The Department of Labour does not make progressive contributions toward each employee's entitlement within the State Super IOnuation Board. The State's contributions are the responsibility of the Department of Treasury. 3. Not applicable.

WOMEN BOARD, COUNCIL OR COMMITTEE MEMBERS - FINANCE

(Question No. 1286)

Mrs WADE asked the ~.1inister for Finance: In respect of each department, agency or authority within his administration, how many women hold positions on boards, councils or committees, indicating in respect of each board, council or committee, the names and qualifications of each female member, and the total number of members? Mr HARROWFIELD (Minister for Finance) - The answer is: Details of women holding positions on statutory boards, councils or committees within the Ministry of Finance as at 15 April 1992 are as follows:

Board, Council or Member Qualification Total Number Committee of Members

Surveyors Board of Mrs D. Prescott Bachelor of Arts, Associate 6 Victoria of the Library Association of Australia, Member of Australian Institute of Cartographers, Registrar of the Australian Society of Indexers QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

Thursday, 30 April 1992 ASSEMBLY 2171

Advisory Mapping Mrs A. Freeman Bachelor of Arts, Diploma 18 Committee of Librarianship, Map Librarian, State Library of Victoria. Municipal Valuation Mrs A. Freeman Fellow, Australian Institute 3 Fees Committee of Valuers and Land Economists. Cr L. Burke Diploma Landscape Gardening Fonner Mayor, City of Prahran. Place Names Dr Eve Fesl Doctor of Philosophy 7 Committee MrsMary Master of Arts (Public History) Sheehan Bachelor of Arts (Hons)

MEDIA CONCEPT CONSULTANCY - CONSERVATION AND ENVIRONMENT

Question No. 1306 Mr PERTON asked the Attorney-General, for the Minister for Conservation and Environment: In respect of a consultancy conducted by Media Concept for the department to 'extend the engagement of Media Concept to produce a weekly 3AW radio program on the environment entitled "Life Force" at a total of 42 weekly radio segments': 1. Whether the duration of the consultancy has been extended; if so - (a) for how long; (b) why; and (c) which officer of the department approved the extension? 2. Whether the contractual price of the consultancy was $157500; if not what was the contractual price? 3. Whether the consultant(s) has been paid any progress payments; if so - (a) what amounts; and (b) on what dates? 4. What are the qualifications of the consultant(s) and the hourly / daily fee for the consultant(s)? 5. Who has been interviewed by the consultant(s)? 6. What were the original terms of the consultancy, indicating whether there has been any alteration to the terms of the consultancy; if so - what were the alterations? 7. Whether the consultant(s) has produced any interim/final finding, reports or recommendations; if so - what are the dates and details of such finding, reports or recommendations? Mr KENNAN (Attorney-General) - The answer supplied by the Minister for Conservation and Environment is: 1. The duration of the consultancy has been extended in two instances. (a)The consultancy was extended for a period of 12 weeks (20.6.91 -1.9.91) and then a further 43 weeks (2.9.91 -30.6.92). (b)In the first instance the program met the quality standards set out in the contract and met the department's requirements for issues covered. The department considered it important to maintain the continuity and high community interest established in the program. In the second instance the consultancy was extended because ratings and community response to the Life Force program continued to increase and demonstrate the community interest and need for infonnation on the environment. (c)Both extensions were approved by Mr A. Herington, the then Director, Strategic Planning Division of the department, and approved by the Effectiveness Review Committee and the Tender Board. 2. Yes. 3. Yes, (a)$52500 $52500 $52500. (b) 6.9.91 18.12.91 19.3.92. 4. This infonnation is commercial-in-confidence and cannot be provided. When the consultants were engaged, the guidelines for engaging consultants issued by the Department of the Premier and Cabinet were followed. 5. The consultants have interviewed on the ''Life Force" program a large number of people from Federal, State and local government, private companies, major organisations, community-based groups and individuals with specialist areas of interest and expertise. 6. The original terms of the consultancy (which have largely remained unchanged) were that: each week during the tenn of the agreement the consultant shall provide the department with three ''Life Force" segments of not less than 5 minutes duration and one community service message of 30 seconds. The consultant shall liaise with officers of the department of other nominated persons to prepare the content of the segments. The department shall have the right to nominate the content of each segment. Alterations to the terms of the consultancy relate to changes in the consultancy price and dates of payment. QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

2172 ASSEMBLY Thursday. 30 April 1992

7. The consultants have not been required to produce any findings, reports or recommendations. They have provided rating reports on 24 May 1991 and 9 August 1991.

GEELONG REGIONAL STAFF -MANUFAcruRING AND INDUSTRY DEVELOPMENT

Question No. 1361 Mr DICKINSON asked the Treasurer, for the Minister for Manufacturing and Industry Development: In respect of each department, agency and authority within his administration, whether it is intended to dispose of staff in the Geelong region; if so - (a) how many; (b) in which areas; (c) over what period; (d) for what reasons; indicating in each case - (i) what categories of staff are involved and how many in each category are to be dismissed; (ll) what redundancy package is being offered; and (ill) how will superannuation entitlements be affected? Mr A. J. SHEEHAN (Treasurer) - The answer supplied by the Minister for Manufacturing and Industry Development is: Apart from the State Electricity Commission, neither my department or any agency under my administration intends to dispose of staff in the Geelong region. The following information is provided regarding the State Electricity Commission: (i) Three personnel intend to leave the SEC's employ by means of the voluntary departure package. (ll) The areas involved are Accounting, Human Resources and Technical Support at the Barwon Customer Service Business. (ill) These staff are leaving voluntarily over the next two months. (iv) No staff are being dismissed. (v) & (vi) The standard SEC package of two weeks per year of service plus leave entitlements is being offered, and the employees will receive all their superannuation entitlements.

PUBLICATIONS - MANUFAcruRING AND INDUSTRY DEVELOPMENT

Question No. 1388 Mr DICKINSON asked the Treasurer, for the Minister for Manufacturing and Industry Development: In respect of each department, agency and authority within his administration, what publications are produced, indicating - (a) how many copies are produced; (b) what the unit cost is, including production and distribution of the publication; (c) what income, if any, is derived from the publication; (d) what is the purpose of the publication; and (e) whether the publication was solely printed in Victoria; if not, why? Mr A. J. SHEEHAN (Treasurer) - The answer supplied by the Minister for Manufacturing and Industry Development is: Department of Manufacturing and Industry Development: (a) A list of current DMID publications is attached. (b) The unit cost of each publication is detailed. Only the magazines incur definitive distribution costs. All magazines are distributed by mailing houses and their costs are included in the unit costs. (c) With the exception of Link, Scope, Bendigo Geological Survey Book, Bendoc Geological Survey Book and Kilmore Geological Survey Book, no income is derived from the publications. (d) The purpose of each publication is detailed in the attachment. In a general sense, the purpose of DMID publications is to inform and promote the department's industry, mining and energy services, and to promote Victoria as an attractive destination for investment. (e) All publications are printed in Victoria. The department also has a policy of using, where possible, paper manufactured in Australia. State Electricity Commission of Victoria: The SEC has produced 63 publications since 1 July 1991 as per attached list. (a) The 63 publications were produced for external use. (b) The unit cost of each publication is listed, together with the final price for production. (c) No income was derived from these publications. (d) These publications are produced to give customers/clients a better understanding of services, and also to educate students and customers on the safe use of electricity. QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

Thursday, 30 April 1992 ASSEMBLY 2173

(e) The publications are printed solely in Victoria. Manuals produced for internal SEC use are not included on this list, however, all these were printed in Victoria. With respect to the publication of the SEC's Annual Report 1990/91: (a) 7000 copies of this report were printed. (b) The unit cost of $12.76 includes both production and distribution costs. (c) No income was derived from the publication of the Annual Report. (d) The Annual Report is produced to conform with the provisions of the Annual Reporting Act 1983. (e) It is printed solely in Victoria. Gas and Fuel Corporation of Victoria: The Gas and Fuel Corporation of Victoria, as part of the annual reporting process, details in the Annual Report, publications produced each year, and provides information regarding points where they can be inspected or obtained. The time and resources required to provide the information in the format requested cannot be justified. All publications are printed in Victoria. Overseas Projects Corporation of Victoria: (a) The Overseas Projects Corporation of Victoria produces two publications. These publications are the annual report and its marketing booklet. (b) The unit cost of the annual report is $11.85 and the unit cost of the marketing booklet is $8.72. (c) These two publications are effective marketing tools for the corporation both domestically and overseas. Accordingly no charge is made for these publications and as such no income is specifically derived from them. (d) The annual report is produced in accordance with the requirements of the Corporations Law and provides the corporation's clients with information about its operations and activities. The marketing booklet is used both domestically and overseas to market the services of the corporation in accordance with its charter. (e) Both publications are printed in Victoria. Exhibition Trustees: (a) The trust's annual report. (b) The report costs approximately $7.80 per unit to produce. (c) Nil. (d) To meet the requirements of the Annual Reporting Act. (e) Yes. Geelong Regional Commission: (a) As per attached list, plus annual report. (b) &: (c) The time and resources to collate this information cannot be justified. However, sale prices are based on cost retrievaL (d) Purposes of the publications cover such activities as strategic planning, statutory planning, historic and conservation planning controls, environmental studies, employment and training studies, industrial and commercial research, economic and demographic data, tourism analysis, special project reports, promotional material, industrial support submissions, market assessments, feasibility studies and submissions to government. (e) Yes. Coal Corporation of Victoria: (a) As per attached list. (b) As per attached list. (c) No income is derived from the publications. (d) As per attached list. (e) Yes. Latrobe Regional Commission: (a) The following publications were produced: 1. Annual report 2. The Gippsland Magazine (b) 300 1991-92 annual reports were printed at a cost of $3606. 17000 copies of the Gippsland Magazine are produced each quarter. The last quarter cost was $14 538. (c) Annual report - Nil. The Gippsland Magazine - $4754. QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

2174 ASSEMBLY Thursday, 30 April 1992

(d) (1) The aIU\ual report is produced to conform with the provisions of the Annual Reporting Act 1983. (2) Promotion of the Latrobe region. (e) Yes. Renewable Energy Authority of Victoria: (a) As per attached list. (b) The total budget for the production of publications is currently $210 000 per year. The publications listed under "Books" are sold in order to recoup publication costs. The average unit production cost per book is $22. All brochures are distributed free of cost. The unit cost per brochure ranges from $0.07 to $0.65. (c) Publications: $10583 has been received from sales to the end of March this financial year. Brochures: Nil income. (d) The aim of the brochures and publications is to provide information for a wide cross-section of Victorians, to promote the use of renewable energy and energy conservation. (e) All publications are printed in Victoria.

List of currently available DMID publications 1. DMID aIU\ual report. 1990/91. 2000 printed. Unit price $5.75. 2. Supplementary program 90/91. Description of DMID program budget for the year. 500 printed. Unit price $3.20. 3. Pappas Carter Evans and Koop report. Major study of industry sectors with growth potential and recommended strategies for development. 750 printed. Unit price $18.49. 4. Towards a Smarter Economy /Flagship brochure. Description of work and services of DMID. 3000 printed. Unit price $5.96. Series of DMID corporate brochures. Range of brochures explaining department services and agencies set up to support industry in Victoria. The series comprises: Automotive Industries Sheehanhemicals and Pharmaceuticals Project Chemical, plastics and rubber processing Defence and Aerospace Industries Downstream Mineral Processing Energy Management Unit Engineering Unit Enterprise Improvement Services to lift international competitiveness Environmental Unit Export services for Victorian business Forest Products GEDIS Geological Survey of Victoria Government Supply Support Agency Marine Engineering Group Minerals Group Office Trade and Investment Petroleum Processed Food Industry Project Project Facilitation Regional Development Agency Social Policy and Programs Strategic Partnering Service Textiles Clothing and Footwear Victorian Manufacturers Database Waste and Environmental Management & Recycling Industries QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

Thursday, 30 April 1992 ASSEMBLY 2175

2000 of each printed. Unit price $0.42. Services and Contracts. A summary of the services offered by DMID and who to contact for information. 3000 printed. Unit price $0.57. 5. DMID Corporate Plan. Summary of department's corporate plan. 2000 printed. Unit price $1.03. 6. Export Assistance from Specialist Agencies (NIES). Explanation of manufacturing services delivered by multiplier agencies and funded through NIES, using company case studies. 6000 printed. Unit price $3.73. 7. Planning for Growth (NIES). Explanation of enterprise improvement programs - or various forms of business planning assistance - using company case studies. 6000 printed. Unit price $2.0B. B. The People Factor (Contribution of Labour) NIES. An account of the workplace improvement program using company case studies. 1500 printed. Unit price $2.38. 9. Contribution of Labour DL brochure. Outline of NIES workplace improvement program. 3000 printed. Unit price $O.4B. 10. Country Link. Magazine promoting investment and business in regional Victoria. 3000 printed per addition. Unit price $8.21 inclusive. 11. Energy Forum. Magazine which canvasses energy conservation and renewable energy issues. 5000 printed per addition. Unit price $O.B2. 12. BaHarat Economic Profile. Detailed economic analysis of Ballarat regional economy. 2000 printed. Unit price $3.61. 13. Bendigo Economic Profile. Detailed economic analysis of Bendigo regional economy. 1000 printed. Unit price $7.40. 14. Bendigo Geological Survey book. Geological survey of Bendigo region, includes full colour map. 300 printed. Unit price $17.00. 15. Bendoc Geological Survey book. Geological survey of Bendigo region, includes full colour map. 300 printed. Unit price $21.64. 16. Kilmore Geological Survey book. Geological survey of Kilmore region, includes full colour map. 300 printed. Unit price $17.01. 17. Leading Aerospace Companies. Profile of the top Victorian-based aerospace firms and their capabilities. 1000 printed. Unit price $1.90. lB. 40 Key Companies. Profile of the top Victorian-based defence firms and their capabilities. 1000 printed. Unit price $0.60. 19. Thought for Food brochure. Sources of R&D within food processing industry. 1000 printed. Unit price $0.70. 20. Wine Industry brochure. A profile of the Victorian wine industry. 2000 printed. Unit price $1.43. 21. Austsearch brochure. A brochure promoting Victorian engineering capabilities, targeting companies and projects in SE Asia. QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

2176 ASSEMBLY Thursday, 30 April 1992

2000 printed. Unit price $4.05. 22. Towards Taiwan brochure. Supporting document for Australian trade fair to Taiwan. 500 printed. Unit price $6.60. 23. Austceram brochure. Promotion and explanation of international ceramics conference to be hosted by Melbourne. 4000 printed. Unit price $0.40. 24. Energy Relief Grant Scheme brochure. An account of a financial service aimed at providing financial relief for those unable to pay energy bills. 50 000 printed. Unit price $0.14. 25. State of Energy brochure. Promotion of Victoria's competitive edge in low energy tariffs for industry. 2000 printed. Unit price $1.65. 26. Victoria's Approval Process. Summary of the approval process for major projects. 3000 printed. Unit price $1.43. 27. Metals and Heavy Engineering Group (MAHEG) brochure. An account of this industry-specific group and its services. 1500 printed. Unit price $1.00. 28. State Data Centre DL brochure. Description of the new land titles and information centre established in Ballarat. 1000 printed. Unit price $0.49. 29. Meet The Buyer brochure. Promotion of the DMID organised government purchasing exhibition. 20 000 printed. Unit price $0.47. 31. Docklands Draft Strategy Report. Interim report on the suggested development of the Melbourne docklands area. 3000 printed. Unit price $7.63. 32. Packaging Training booklet. Account of the new packaging training centre. 2500 printed. Unit price $1.72. 33. Food Packaging Seminar Series No. 1 brochure. Explanation of the importance of packaging to export. 1000 printed. Unit price $1.68. 34. Food Packaging Seminar Series No. 2 brochure. The processing and packaging of food for export purposes. 2500 printed. Unit price $0.99. 35. Export Awards booklet. The official program for the Governor of Victoria Awards for significant export achievement. Printed 500. Unit price $5.60. 36. Assisting Victorian Companies to Achieve Export Success (The Market Entry program Application Guide). Account of the department's Market Entry Program which assists companies with information, identifies market niches, prospective distributors and potential partners in export markets. Copies 2000. Unit price $1.00. 37. A Guide For Investors. A full range of essential information to prospective investors in Victoria induding labour market, taxation, foreign exchange, infrastructure, and cost of land, power, and transport services. State and Federal assistance schemes described. Copies 2000. Unit price $3.50. 38. Victoria's Trade and Investment Review Magazine. Magazine to encourage investment in and exports from Victoria. Print run 6000-8000 copies. Unit price $2.40. 39. Melbourne: Australia's Best Climate for Business. Introduction to the benefits of doing business in Victoria, mainly for an overseas readership. Information on specific industry sectors, infrastructure, workforce, arts and entertainment. QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

Thursday, 30 April 1992 ASSEMBLY 2177

Printed (English 6000, Japanese 2000, Chinese 3000, French 2000, German 2000). Unit price $3.08. 40. Sector Studies. Description and assessment of specific industry sectors including details of government trade and invesbnent support. Copies: Fruit & Vegetable 500 copies. Unit cost $1.50. Cereal Products Industry 500 copies. Unit cost $2.17. 41. The Confectionary Industry in Victoria (kit). Detailed description and assessment of the confectionary industry in Victoria, with details of government support for investors. Confectionary Sector Study /350 printed. Unit price $2.74. Victoria's Competitive Strengths 2000 printed. Unit price $2.00. Confectionary Overview 300 printed. Unit price $4.60. 42. Renewable Energy and Energy Conservation Interim reports on government strategy to conserve energy and encourage alternative sources of energy. Parts 1 and 2. Printed 5000. Unit price $2.41. 43. Energy Efficiency Strategy. Final report on government strategy to conserve energy and encourage alternative sources of energy. Printed 10 000. Unit price $0.24. 44. Decision Maker booklet (Energy). Hints for saving energy in and around the home. Printed 30 000. Unit price $0.28. 45. Cereal Products, Winegrowing, Fruit and Vegetable and Dairy Products brochure. Description of profile and opportunities within these industry sectors. Printed 500. Unit price $0.28. 46. Tower Hill booklet. Popular account of the geology of Tower Hill. Printed 1000. Unit price $6.00. 47. LPG brochure. Account of the concession available for some users of LPG. Printed 20 000. Unit price $0.24. 48. Regional Victoria: An invesbnent profile. An economic profile of each of 21 economic development regions throughout country Victoria. Printed 8000. Unit price $5.75. 49. MRDA Brochure Package A range of brochures explaining the provisions of the new Act governing mining in Victoria and the implications for exploration, mining, planning and the environment. Set includes: A Guide to the Minerals Resources Development Act 1800 copies. Unit cost $2.33. Mining Licence. 1400 copies. Unit costs $3.75. Exploration Licences. 1400 copies. Unit price $3.75. Landowners Questions Answered. 1500 copies. Unit price $1.76. Guide to reporting. 1000 copies. Unit cost $2.60. General Brochure: Minerals Resources Development Act. 2500 copies. Unit price $0.76. Nagambie - A Wealth of Opportunity. 500 copies. Unit cost $0.80. Code of Practice: For Exploration and Rehabilitation of Exploration Sites. 1500 copies. Unit price $1.76. 50. Link. Magazine promoting manufacturing in Victoria by providing information to companies on developing a comparative advantage. QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

2178 ASSEMBLY Thursday, 30 April 1992

Unit price $4.00. Income derived $7800 per annum. 51. Scope. Inform Victorian industry of supply opportunities in aerospace and defence related industries in Australia and overseas, and of new purchasing policies and procedures. Magazine also informs potential purchasers of the capabilities of Victorian companies to aerospace and defence equipment and services.

ST ATE ELECTRICITY COMMISSION LIST OF PUBLICATIONS PRODUCED SINCE 1 JULY 1991 Title Unit Cost Final Price $ $

Business Model User's Guide 3.99 1595.00 Application for Domestic Off-Peak Water 9.50 1419.00 Operating Cost of Domestic Appliances 0.24 9480.00 Shared Trench Agreement Booklet 1.22 1220.00 Be An Energy Watchit Be Energy Wise 0.12 1200.00 Electricity Safety Posters for Schools 0.06 900.00 The Chemistry of Brown Coal 0.75 1 125.00 Be A Safety Watchit 0.08 304.00 We Are Here To Help 0.19 224.00 Dual Occupancy Brochure 0.88 4416.00 Victoria's Hydro Power Book 0.81 8100.00 Electric Vehicle News 1.48 593.00 Brooklyn Shared Trench Agreement 1.80 900.00 Direct Debit Brochure 4.00 300.00 Electric Publications for Business 0.15 367.00 Warning to Campers 0.17 347.00 Operating Costs Domestic Appliances 0.32 6360.00 How to Lighten Your Light Bill 0.12 2960.00 How to Save Electricity Costs in Small Business 0.46 2295.00 Application for Domestic Off-Peak Water Rebate 6.38 1276.00 Tungsten Halogen Heating 0.62 925.00 Guide to Operating Costs of Domestic Appliances 0.33 6535.00 Wann to Electric Off-Peak Storage Floor Heating 0.24 1213.00 SEC "Winner" Tariff Brochure 0.15 2900.00 Safe Use of Electric Blankets 0.27 273.00 Electrical Efficiency In Motel/Hotel Accommodation 1.19 2376.00 Dual & Multiple Occupancy 0.17 850.00 How to Lighten Your Light Bills 0.12 3480.00 Guide to Operating Costs of Domestic Elec/ Appliances 0.21 6240.00 Saving your Energy Dollar 0.40 11865.00 We are Here to Help Brochures 0.12 115.00 Guide to Operating Costs of Domestic Appliances 0.21 4213.00 Saving your Energy Dollar 0.22 2327.00 "Winner" Tariff Brochure 0.25 2470.00 "I'm Worried About My Bill" 0.05 921.00 SEC Easy Access Leaflet 0.44 17618.00 Rural Water Leaflets 0.43 812.00 Direct Debit Leaflet - Business Customers 0.03 11908.00 Heatbank Operating Guide 0.52 2602.00 Saving Your Energy Dollar 0.54 2717.00 We are Here to Help Brochures 0.16 130.00 First Aid for Electric Shock Victims 0.40 793.00 Rural Stock and Domestic Water Supplies 3.95 11559.00 Gas Turbine Station Environment Effects 92.76 18553.00 Salinity Assistance Program 0.33 654.00 Operating Guide - Heat Banks 0.48 1429.00 Off-Peak Storage floor heating 0.55 5499.00 How to Lighten Your Light Bills 0.19 2185.00 Electricity - The Wonder Power 0.43 4255.00 Energy Watchit Book 2 0.58 5823.00 Electricity Project Sheet Book 1.23 1015.00 Hot Water Insert Brochure 0.24 1192.00 Technical Guide to Domestic Electric Hot Water 0.54 5364.00 Wind Power in Victoria 0.65 1300.00 QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

Thursday, 30 April 1992 ASSEMBLY 2179

The Chemistry of Brown Coal 1.16 5809.00 Resource Material and Activities 0.95 9529.00 Rural Customers Electricity Supply 0.54 1616.00 Electricity Booklet 0.49 2459.00 Industrial Lighting Efficiency Program 0.20 3980.00 Electricity the Story 0.90 541.00 Batteries Bulbs and Circuits 0.01 470.00 Green Links 1.43 858.00 Electricity Safety Posters 0.71 213.00

GEELONG REGIONAL COMMISSION - PUBLICA nONS

1. BANNOCKBURN, INVERLEIGH, LARA, MORIAC mLE - Bannockbum Structure Plan - Inverleigh Structure Plan - Revised Inverleigh Structure Plan March 1985 - Bannockburn Structure Plan - Public Discussion Document May 1989 - Adopted Bannockburn Structure Plan April 1990 - Moriac Structure Plan - Moriac Structure Plan - Public Discussion Document August 1990 - Lara Structure Plan - Public Discussion Document February 1983 - Lara Structure Plan, April 1985 - Lethbridge Structure Plan

2. BARRABOOL AND SURF COAST - Jan Juc Structure Plan - Torquay /Jan Juc Structure Plan - Torquay West Outline Development Plan - Torquay /Jan Juc Structure Plan - Public Discussion Document October 1990 - Angle~a Structure Plan - Public Discussion Document September 1991 - Aireys Inlet to Eastern View Structure Plan - Adopted Aireys Inlet to Eastern View Structure Plan, January 1982 - Aireys Inlet to Eastern View Structure Plan _. Public Discussion Document, June 1991 - Bellbrae Structure Plan - Bellbrae Structure Plan Revised 1982 - Waurn Ponds Valley Structure Plan 1977

3. BELLARINE - Walling ton Structure Plan - Leopold Structure Plan - Leopold Structure Plan March 1990 - Ocean Grove Structure Plan 1979 - Drysdale/Clifton Springs Structure Plan - Public Discussion Document Jan 1990 - Drysdale/Clifton Springs Structure Plan - Public Discussion Document 1982 - Adopted Drysdale / Clifton Springs Structure Plan 1983 - Portarlington/Indented Head Structure Plan - Public Discussion Document December 1991 -Queensdiffe Urban Conservation Study -October 1982 -Queenscliffe Residential Strategy January 1978 - Foreshore Works Barwon Heads to Queenscliff - Tuckfield Parsonage & Wesleyan Chapel Drysdale 1982

4. SOUTH BARWON /NEWTON - Belmont Community Shopping Centre Structure Plan Public Discussion Document, April 1982 - Belmont Community Shopping Centre Structure Plan, April 1983 - Wandana Heights/Mountpellier Structure Plan, February 1981 - Newtown Residential Strategy, March 1977 QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

2180 ASSEMBLY Thursday, 30 April 1992

- West Fyans Street Zoning Report, Sept. 1984 - West Fyans Street Strategic Plan Dec. 1983

5. GEELONG WEST - Latrobe Tce Statutory Planning Report - Geelong West Strategic Plan - Public Discussion Document Sept. 1982 - Geelong West Strategic Plan, Dec. 1983 - Pakington Street Community Shopping Centre Study 1979 - Pakington Street Community Centre Study - Public Discussion Document, June 1981 - Pakington Street Community (Shopping) Centre Structure Plan, January 1982 - Geelong West Strategic Plan - Public Discussion Document - Pakington Street District Business Areas Parking Study, March 1979 - Timber Houses in Geelong West -City of Geelong West Urban Conservation Study Vol. 1 -City of Geelong West Urban Conservation Study Vol. 2

6. REPORTS -Geelong Region Rural Residential Living Strategy, February 1983 -Geelong Region Retail Strategy, Dec. 1978 - Geelong Regional Floodland Study, June 1979 - Geelong Region Recreation Facilities Inventory, Sept. 1980 - Geelong Marina Initial Report Site Selection & Study Brief 1977 -Geelong Region Recreation Strategic Plan, March 1984 -Geelong Region Recreation Strategic Plan Summary Report, March 1984 - Barwon River Water Management Study - Public Discussion Document, Nov. 1979 -Strategy for Retail Centre Development in the Geelong Region for the 19905, May 1990 - Geelong Region Retail Centre Strategy, June 1991 - Hot Dip Galvanising -A Land Development & Monitoring System, July 1981 - Geelong Regional Employment & Training Study -Corio Bay Foreshore Study, Oct. 1985 - Geelong Residential Areas Study - Public Discussion Document, February 1981 -Geelong Central Area Strategy Plan (Brochure) - Report on Application of Victorian Government Regional & Industry Policies to Trade-Exposed Finns in Geelong - March 1985

7. RESEARCH REPORT SERIES - Demand for Light Industrial Accommodation No. 1. - Regional Characteristics of Geelong Agriculture No. 2. - Rural Community Attitudes towards land use in the Geelong Region No. 3. - Geelong Region Retail Strategy No. 4. - Geelong Regional Floodland Study No. 5. - Regional Forecasts for the Geelong Region 1976-2001 No. 6. - Caravan and Carparking Study No. 7. - Geelong Rural Residential Study No. 8.

8. ECONOMIC/RESEARCH - Geelong Region Demographic Characteristics of Townships 1986 - Geelong Region Demographic Characteristics of Municipalities 1986 - Geelong Region Demographic Characteristics of Suburbs 1986 - Population Forecasts for the Geelong Region 1976-2000 - Population Trends 1971-76, June 1978 - Population Outlook, the Geelong Region to 2001 - Geelong Strategy - Employment in Geelong June 1975 - Employment Strategy for Geelong Region, June 1981 -Geelong Region Facts & Figures, May 1981 QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

Thursday, 30 April 1992 ASSEMBLY 2181

- Tourism in the Geelong/Otway Region - Trends, characteristics and comparisons - February 1990 -Geelong Region Data Book, April 1979 - Geelong Region Industrial Register 1976 -Geelong Region Industrial Register 1980 -Geelong Region Industrial Register 1985 -Geelong Region Industrial Register 1991/92 - Geelong Region Training Register 1991

9. GEELONG BIKE PLAN -Geelong Bikeplan 1979-80 Action - Geelong Bikeplan June 1979 - Bicycle Planning in Australia - Police and Pedals 1990 - Technical Bulletin No. 1. Bicycle Signs - Technical Bulletin No. 2. Bicycle Accidents - Technical Bulletin No. 3. School Bicycle Touring - Technical Bulletin No. 4. (A) Bicycle Surveys - Technical Bulletin No. 4. (B) Bicycle Enforcement - Technical Bulletin No. 5. Bicycle Enforcement - Technical Bulletin No. 6. Bicycle Racks - The Geelong Spokesman Newsletter (4 editions) 1980 - Melbourne Bikeplan Stage 2 Summary Report - Geelong/Otway Bike Tours (wallet & loose pages)

10. GEELONG and FORESHORE - Geelong Central Area Study - City Centre Structure Plan 1985 - Geelong Central Area Study Strategy Plan - Geelong Central Area Study Public Discussion Document 1979 -Geelong Central Area Strategy, Jan. 1981 - Geelong Project 2000 - Geelong City By The Bay - City By The Bay Foreshore Tourist Precinct Updated Economic Review - Geelong City By The Bay - Shopping Centre Study - Geelong Foreshore Tourist Precinct Impact Study - Geelong Foreshore Precinct Analysis of Scope and Potential - City By The Bay - The Bay Unk (Brochure) - Corio Bay Foreshore Study - Geelong City By The Bay - The Bay Unk

11. PLANNING/GEELONG REGIONAL COMMISSION - A Development Strategy for Geelong Region, December 1974 -Rural Area Planning Policy, March 1974 - Report to the Minister for Planning, Hon. G. Hayes on the exhibition of and hearing of objections to the Proposed Geelong Regional Planning Scheme, May 1978 - Geelong Development Strategy (brochure) - Report of the Hearing Committee to Amendment No. 6 to the Geelong Regional Interim Development Order, Dec. 1978 - Geelong Central Area Redevelopment Interim Development Order - Amendment No. 140 to the Geelong Regional Planning Scheme - Progress of amendments to the Geelong Regional Interim Development Order and the Geelong Regional Planning Scheme - Report on Amendment 45 to the Geelong Regional Planning Scheme, March 1982 - Geelong Regional Planning Scheme - Planning Scheme Ordinance - Heales Road Industrial Area Corio -Submission regarding purchase of industrial land at Heales Road, April 1980 QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

2182 ASSEMBLY Thursday. 30 April 1992

- Geelong Investment Scenario, October 1982 - Geelong Consolidated Engineers Pty Ltd - Corio Industrial Estate (sales brochure) - Geelong Regional Commission Marketing Plan 1986-87 - Geelong Regional Commission Corporate Plan 1982-85 - Major services Heales Road industrial area, Jan. 1982 - South Geelong Industrial Estate Masterplan - Market Assessment Stage 11 Surf Coast Plaza, February 1987 - Geelong Traffic Safety Centre Feasibility Study, Nov. 1981 - Geelong Regional Planning Scheme 1992 - Directions. The Geelong Region Development Strategy ''Five Year Implementation Plan 1989-90" - Breakwater Industrial Estate Site Guidelines -Geelong Region Historic Buildings & Objects Study Vol. 1. - Geelong Region Historic Buildings & Objects Study Vol. 2. -Geelong Region Historic Buildings & Objects Study Vol. 3.

12. SUBMISSIONS - To Pioneer Ceramics - Carborundum P /L & Nissho-Iwai Co. Ltd. -Conservation & Recreation land purchase submission, May 1976 - To Henderson's Federal Spring Works P /L, Oct. 1978 - Nissho Iwai Aust Lld Silicon Carbide project, Oct. 1980 - Frank, Wild, Schon, Ehlers, Ostermeier Group, Oct. 1979 - Institute of Educational Administration (lEA) site analysis, April 1980 - lEA site selection proposals - Kingston Homestead July 1979 -lEA -Supplementary submission, July 1979 - lEA, March 1979 - To Commissioner for the Govt of Victoria in Japan, December 1979 - Bismark Project, March 1980 - Gellibrand River enquiry, Aug. 1979 - RAN submarine replacement program - Victoria Institute of Marine Science - Framework for the Future, February 1992 - To the Committee of Enquiry Into the National Estate, February 1974

13. NATIONAL WOOL CENTRE/MUSEUM - National Wool Centre Geelong - Dennys Lascelles Wools tore Conservation Management Plan - National Wool Centre Bicentennial Submission, February 1985 - National Wool Centre Geelong - Various brochures -'G GEELONG' Industrial Folder 1991 - A Profile of the Geelong Region June 1979 - A Profile of the Geelong Region 1988 - A Profile of the Geelong Region 1990 - Otway / Geelong Harmony of Contrasts 1976 - The Geelong Region: An Industrial Location 1976 - The Geelong Region: A Living Working Environment 1976 -Geelong Region. The Living/Working Environment 1980 - Geelong Region. The Industrial Location 1980 - Living Geelong: Meet its People - Uniquely Geelong: Your Business Opportunity 1990 - The Geelong Report (8 issues) - ABC of the GRC (brochure) - Geelong Convention Guide 1983-83 - Geelong Region Convention Guide 1987-88 QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

Thursday, 30 April 1992 ASSEMBLY 2183

- Geelong Convention Guide 1989-90 - "Geelong Ambassador Certificate" - Geelong Convention Bureau (brochure) - Geelong/Otway Visitors Guide -Geelong/Otway Visitors Guide 1991 - Go Getaway (brochure) - Surf Coast Plaza, Torquay (brochure) - For Sale - Foundry (brochure) - Go Tourism - Membership Opportunities (folder) - Accommodation & Training facilities for harness horses ( (brochure) - Directions 1988-98 (brochure) - Poster(s) -10 Years of Achievement - Bells Beach - Geelong, Where its happening - Baylink (brochure) - Facts (brochure) - Geelong Central Area Strategy Plan (brochure) - National Wool Museum (brochure) - Geelong and the Surf Coast - Weekend Adventures (brochure) - Geelong and the Surf Coast - Discovery Map (brochure) -Swan Bay (brochure)

PRINTEDCCV PUBLICATIONS 1 JANUARY 1991-PRESENT

Name of Publication Frequency Unit Quantity Income Purpose of Publication Printed solely Cost Printed Derived" in Victoria

1. Activity Update Quarterly $1.07 700 Nil To inform SECV and other govt'rnment personnel on the Yes marketing activities of the Coal Corporation 2. Coal Corporation'S Bi-annually $4.00 500 Nil To promote the Coal Corporation and its products to existing Yes Energy Update and potential industrial customers 3. Heat-A-Brix Herald Reprints as $1.25 2000 Nil To inform potential users of the benefits of burning Heat-A-Brix Yes required briquettes in slow combustion heaters 4. Victoria Briquettes Reprints as $1.25 2000 Nil To inform potential industrial and export clients on the benefits Yes required of briquette-fired combustion systems and to advise on the specifications of Victoria briquettes 5. CCV Annual Report Annually $10.98 2000 Nil To meet the requirements of the Annual Reporting Act Yes " No sales revenue is derived from these publications as they are provided to customers, contacts and the public free of charge.

RENEWABLE ENERGY AUTHORITY OF VICTORIA

BOOKS SELLING PRICE Home Energy Rating Scheme Vols 1 & 2 $22 Energy Efficient Housing Study Vols 1 & 2 $25 Solar Efficient Subdivisions Study $25 Solar Efficient Design Manual for Designers and Architects $25 Remote Area Power Supply $12 Potential Application of Renewable Energy - Rural Sector $13 Potential Application of Renewable Energy - Commercial Sector $20 Potential Application of Renewable Energy - Industrial Sector $30 Efficient Renewable Energy Scenario Study for Victoria $40 Solar Efficient Design for Housing $20 NB Executive Summaries of the above publications are provided free of charge QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

2184 ASSEMBLY Thursday, 30 April 1992

BROCHURES

ENERGY EFFICIENT HOUSING Solar Angle on Good House Design Builders and Designers of Energy Efficient Houses Five Star Design Rating Guidelines Five Star Design Rating Checklist Five Star Design Rating Application Solar Efficient Design Manual Application House Plan Energy Advisory Service House Plan Assessment Checklist Energy Efficient Housing - Marketing

HEATING Active Solar House Heating Choosing A Heating System Home Heating Hints Heat Shifters Hydronic Heating Portable Heaters Wood Fuels Buying a Wood Heater Wood Heating Installation Considerations for Wood Heaters Wood Heaters - Glossary Operating a Wood Heater Types of Wood Heaters

ENERGY CONSERVATION The Energy Decision Maker Insulating Your Home Insulation Guide Insulation Regulations Being Cool Doesn't Take Much Energy Cooling Estimator Sealing Out Draughts Microwave Cooking How To Stop Energy Costs Going Through the Window Pergola Design Helping You To Save Energy - Energy Information Centre (corporate brochures)

RENEWABLE ENERGY Remote Area Power Supply Solar On the Land Solar Water Pumping Using Solar Electricity Solar Trained Plumbers Solar Pool Heating Our Energy Future Renewable Energy Information Package QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

Thursday, 30 April 1992 ASSEMBLY 2185

HOT WATER Domestic Solar Water Heating Hot Water Hints Water Heating Using Wood Solar Water Pumping

TRANSPORT Transport Decision Maker Alcohol Fuels: The Transport Solutions

EDUCA nONAL MATERIAL Primary student sheets - The Energy Files (x 10) Secondary student sheets - The Energy Information Files (x 12) Energy Education Resource Directory Learning To Save Energy - Energy Education Centre (corporate brochure) Energy Paths for the 21st Century Energy Quiz (game)

STUDENT KITS Energy, Technology and Society $135 The Sun, Energy and Us $90

DISTRIBUTOR LISTS Solar Hot Water Solar Pool Heating Solar Lighting and Power PVModules Solar Pumps Educational Material Wind Generators

POSTERS Renewable Energy Energy Smart Houses Super Energy Saver

OTHER PUBLICA nONS Annual Report Solutions Newsletter

PUBLICATIONS - PORTS

Question No. 1389 Mr DICKINSON asked the Treasurer, for the Minister responsible for Ports: In respect of each department, agency and authority within his administration, what publications are produced, indicating - (a) how many copies are produced; (b) what the unit cost is, including production and distribution of the publication; (c) what income, if any, is derived from the publication; (d) what is the purpose of the publication; and (e) whether the publication was solely printed in Victoria; if not, why? Mr A. J. SHEEHAN (Treasurer) - The answer supplied by the Minister responsible for Ports is: Port of Melbourne Authority: As per attached list. Port of Geelong Authority: The Port of Geelong Authority produces the following publications: QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

2186 ASSEMBLY Thursday, 30 April 1992

-Portside - Annual Marketing Report - Port Profile - Strategic Overview - Annual Report

1. Portside (a) 1500 copies per annum. (b) $2.82 per copy. (c) Nil. (d) To advise and inform port customers and the general community of the authority's activities. (e) Yes. 2. Marketing Report (a) 2000 per annum. (b) $9.90 per copy. (c) Nil. (d) To advise and inform port customers and the general community of the authority's activities, and to report on the authority's annual financial performance. (e) Yes. 3. Port Profile (a) 3000 per annum. (b) 83 cents per copy. (c) Nil. (d) To advise and inform port customers and the general community of the authority's activities. (e) Yes. 4. Strategic Overview (a) 1500 per annum. (b) $1 per copy. (c) To advise port customers and the community of the authority's strategic direction and corporate plan. (d) Yes. 5. Annual Report (a) 200 per annum. (b) $10 per copy. (c) Nil. (d) Annual Report. (e) Yes.

Port of Portland Authority: (a) Publications produced -1990-91 (i) Annual Report (1000 copies) (ii) Port Information and Trade brochure (10 000 copies) (ill) Portland Portfolio newsletter (3 issues x 3500 copies) (b) Unit cost (including production and distribution) (i) Annual Report $5.50 (ii) Port Information and Trade brochure $0.026 (ill) Portland Portfolio newsletter $1.40 (c) Income derived from publications All publications are distributed free of charge (d) Purpose of Publication (i) Annual Report - To satisfy Annual Reporting Act requirements, Parliamentary requirements and distribute to customers. (ii) Port Information andTrade brochure - Low cost promotional and education item for distribution to trade, schools and public. (iii) Portland Portfolio newsletter - Published to provide regular updates of trade, policy and port activities to customers and others. QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

Thursday, 30 April 1992 ASSEMBLY 2187

(e) The publications are not presently printed in Victoria. Quotations are obtained from printers within 100 kilometres radius of Portland. Current printer is based in Mount Gambier, South Australia and was awarded the above jobs based on standard of printing and price.

Port of Melbourne Authority

Unit Direct Victorian Publication Copies Cost $ Income Publisher Publication Content

Panorama 29400 1.13 Nil Yes Quarterly magazine containing articles relating to the port, port service providers and port users. The Channel 12000 0.67 Nil Yes Regular employee newspaper highlighting activities of interest to staff. Trade & Transport Review 3000 5.50 Nil Yes Annual review of statistical trade and transport data for Port of Melbourne and Hastings (Western Port) Port of Melbourne Brochure 4000 1.67 Nil Yes Outline of port facilities. Annual Report 1990-91 2300 2.92 Nil Yes Annual Report produced in accordance with the Annual Reporting Regulations 1988. Victorian Tide Tables 3000 2.10 $12239 Yes Booklet containing tide tables for Melbourne, Geelong, Port Phillip Heads, Portland, Hastings, and Port Welshpool. PMA Employees Handbook 1700 4.11 Nil Yes Handbook outlining employment conditions within the PMA. Land Use Plan - Options 4000 5.20 Nil Yes Outline of Consultation Process and Final Consultation & Draft Final Options Report on Victorian Ports Land Report Use Study. Land Use Plan - Summary, 4500 2.40 Nil Yes Reports on various elements of the Victorian Options and Questionnaire Land Use Plan Study Group. Corporate Folder 5000 1.00 Nil Yes Folder to hold port promotion material. Fact Sheets 2000 0.16 Nil Yes Occasional information papers on various elements of port activity e.g. oil pollution. Port of Melbourne Map 6000 0.34 Nil Yes Small map of Port of Melbourne and Port and Fact Sheet Phillip Bay supplemented by key statistics and points of interest about the port. VDP Information Booklets 600 0.63 Nil Yes Booklet outlining process for voluntary departure.

UNION GRANTS - MANUFACTURING AND INDUSTRY DEVELOPMENT

Question No. 1415 Mr DICKINSON asked the Treasurer, for the Minister for Manufacturing and Industry Development: In respect of each department, agency and authority within his administration, what are the details of all grants made since the last election to trade union groups? QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

2188 ASSEMBLY Thursday. 30 April 1992

Mr A. J. SHEEHAN (Treasurer) - The answer supplied by the Minister for Manufacturing and Industry Development is: Department of Manufacturing and Industry Development $

19.04.89 Municipal Offices Assoc. 9000.00 19.04.89 vrHC Skills Training 26300.00 23.06.89 vrHC Medic. Research 102000.00 23.06.89 vrHC Skills Training Unit 26300.00 18.06.90 vrHC Skills Training Unit 39450.00 18.06.90 vrHC Multi Function Polis 7500.00 06.06.91 vrHC Skills Training Unit 9146.00 14.11.91 vrHC Skills Training Unit 33000.00 $252696.00