Vol. 593 Tuesday, No. 1 23 November 2004

DI´OSPO´ IREACHTAI´ PARLAIMINTE PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES

DA´ IL E´ IREANN

TUAIRISC OIFIGIU´ IL—Neamhcheartaithe (OFFICIAL REPORT—Unrevised)

Tuesday, 23 November 2004.

Ceisteanna—Questions Taoiseach ………………………………… 1 Minister for Finance Priority Questions …………………………… 15 Other Questions …………………………… 27 Adjournment Debate Matters …………………………… 35 Leaders’ Questions ……………………………… 36 Resignation of Member …………………………… 44 Requests to move Adjournment of Da´il under Standing Order 31 ……………… 45 Order of Business ……………………………… 46 European Conventions: Motions ………………………… 56 Council of Europe Development Bank Bill 2004: Order for Report Stage …………………………… 56 Report and Final Stages …………………………… 56 Health Bill 2004: Order for Second Stage …………………………… 67 Second Stage ……………………………… 67 Private Members’ Business Roads Infrastructure: Motion ………………………… 82 Health Bill 2004: Second Stage (resumed) ……………………… 110 Adjournment Debate Hospital Services ……………………………… 142 Job Losses ………………………………… 144 Food Safety Standards …………………………… 150 Questions: Written Answers …………………………… 153 1 2

DA´ IL E´ IREANN

DI´OSPO´ IREACHTAI´ PARLAIMINTE PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES

TUAIRISC OIFIGIU´ IL OFFICIAL REPORT

Imleabhar 593 Volume 593

De´ Ma´irt, 23 Samhain 2004. Tuesday, 23 November 2004.

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Chuaigh an Leas-Cheann Comhairle i gceannas ar 2.30 p.m.

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Paidir. Prayer.

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Ceisteanna — Questions. lation has been drafted for my Department out- side the Office of the Attorney General so the ———— matter of approval does not arise.

Proposed Legislation. Mr. Rabbitte: What is the Taoiseach’s view of 1. Mr. Rabbitte asked the Taoiseach if the the subcontracting out of legislation to be approval of the Attorney General was sought by drafted, whether that of his Department or other his Department in regard to the subcontracting Departments, on the instructions of the Depart- out to private firms of the drafting of legislation; ment as distinct from the Attorney General? the number of occasions on which such consent Since the Taoiseach’s answer to me, which I took was given; if the Attorney General is satisfied to mean that legislation was not being subcon- with the drafting of legislation outside his office; tracted out, Deputy Burton told me that the Cen- and if he will make a statement on the matter. tral Bank Bill was contracted out at a cost of \1.5 [22145/04] million. Subsequently, before it went through 2. Mr. Sargent asked the Taoiseach if the Committee Stage, the Bill had to go back to the Attorney General gave approval to the subcon- Office of the Attorney General to be redrafted. tracting out to private firms of the drafting of Does that matter require consideration? legislation; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [27998/04] The Taoiseach: I draw a distinction between 3. Mr. J. Higgins asked the Taoiseach if statutory instruments and Bills. The Office of the approval was given by the Attorney General to Attorney General is not opposed to statutory the subcontracting out to private firms of the instruments being sent out for drafting. It has drafting of legislation. [30191/04] recommended a list of people who are appro- The Taoiseach: I propose to take Questions priate for Departments to employ in that regard Nos. 1 to 3, inclusive, together. because there is much drafting to be done and As outlined in a reply to a written parliamen- the statutory instruments are regularly handled in tary question on 29 September 2004, no legis- this way by Departments. 3 Ceisteanna — 23 November 2004. Questions 4

[The Taoiseach.] General that there should be a coherence of style It is very rare for Bills to be drafted outside the and uniformity, it would be desirable that his writ Office of the Parliamentary Counsel. I asked my should run with line Departments. Department to check how many Bills were drafted outside that office over the five-year The Taoiseach: I do not disagree with the period since the beginning of 2000. There was not Deputy but we should be clear about it. There a great deal of checking to be done. Only two are three areas to be considered. There is no Government Bills, the Adventure Activities Stan- problem with regard to the drafting of statutory dards Authority Bill 2000 and the Official Langu- instruments being done outside the Office of the ages (Equality) Bill 2002, were drafted outside Attorney General, provided the drafting is done the Office of the Parliamentary Counsel. While by people recommended by that office and who those Bills were drafted outside the Office of the are seen as competent to provide the quality of Attorney General and that of the Parliamentary drafting desired. Counsel, both were drafted by a former official in The Office of the Attorney General believes the latter office. No Bills were drafted in private practice. It should be borne in mind that over the there is merit in the heads of Bills being drafted period mentioned, 226 Bills were enacted. by people with legal qualifications in the various An outside firm with special expertise advises Departments. There are a number of such people the Department of Finance on the regulation of in the top six Departments competent to draft financial services, which relate to the Bill referred heads of Bills and the explanatory matters sur- to by Deputy Rabbitte. As part of that advice, rounding them. There are some outside the the firm prepared a sample draft of the Central Departments who have also done such work. My Bank and Financial Services Authority Bill 2003. understanding is that such work is far better done That was a substantial Bill with a large number within the office than outside it. of heads. The sample draft was presented to On the outside work — and the Central Bank Government not as a Bill but merely as heads or and Financial Services Authority Bill 2003 was an the scheme of the Bill. The Bill itself was drafted enormous Bill — the office of the Parliamentary by the Office of the Parliamentary Counsel. Counsel states that the distinction between a Bill The same situation pertained to the Unclaimed and the heads of a Bill is important in the context Life Assurance Policies Bill 2002, with an outside of the Cabinet and Oireachtas procedures, as it firm drafting the heads of the Bill for the Depart- sees them, and that the heads of a Bill are merely ment in the form of a sample draft. The Bill itself an outline of the policy objectives a Department was drafted by the Office of the Parliamentary wishes to achieve. The office of the Parliamentary Counsel. Counsel holds the view that it is not involved in These situations rarely arise. I have spoken on the preparation of the heads of Bills because a number of occasions with the Office of the policy formulation is a matter for Departments. Parliamentary Counsel, the Attorney General If the policy formulation of the heads of a Bill is and the two previous Attorneys General. They drawn up either inside or outside the office, the are not in favour of Bills being drafted by outside office of the Parliamentary Counsel lives with parties, a view I support. Their position is that that. Without putting a tooth in it, that office whenever drafting is attempted within Depart- would say that when one goes further than that, ments or by outside agencies, the quality of the the quality of the work done by those outside is drafting is not of much use to them and is not not up to a penny. I know there are people out- satisfactory. They end up doing the drafting side who will argue that it would say that, but in themselves. I do not wish to be unfair or unchari- fairness to the people in the office of the table to the outside agencies, but such drafting is Parliamentary Counsel, many of whom are not satisfactory. beyond retirement age and many of whom have expertise both in this country and outside it, they Mr. Rabbitte: The Taoiseach seems to be say- do a specialist job. They do not believe we can ing that where primary legislation was contracted out, work was done up to heads of Bill stage and give the work out. the drafting then done in the Office of the Over the years I have asked why that is the Parliamentary Counsel. Can the Taoiseach be case, and I am sure Deputy Rabbitte has experi- more clear? He has expressed the matter in one ence of this too. While somebody can draft a Bill way. Another way of putting it would be to say and even draft a Bill from the heads of a Bill, that the quality of the outside work is not up to does not give us the legislation. A parliamentary scratch and that the drafting must be done by the draftsperson must go back to God knows when Office of the Parliamentary Counsel. That is my — perhaps to the 1940s — to check the compati- understanding of the position. bility of the Bill with legislation in the 1940s, Regarding the Finance Bill to which I referred, maybe with a Bill in the 1950s, amending legislat- I am informed by Deputy Burton that the cost of ing in the 1960s and perhaps cross reference the contracting out its drafting came to \1.5 million. Bill with a Finance Act. The office feels that out- That is quite a mind-blowing figure for a single side people do not do that to any quality. Experi- Bill, no matter how substantial or complex. If the ence over a long period and with many Attornies Taoiseach agrees with the Office of the Attorney General seems to vindicate their position. 5 Ceisteanna — 23 November 2004. Questions 6

Mr. Sargent: Can I take from the Taoiseach’s These were the only Bills in the past five years reply that the Office of the Attorney General that were drafted outside the Office of the does not approve of outsourcing, and on an indi- Parliamentary Counsel. Both were drafted by a vidual basis is not asked for its approval in former official of that office. advance of outsourcing? When legislation which has been outsourced is returned in draft form, is Mr. J. Higgins: I am relieved the Attorney the Taoiseach satisfied there is a sufficient General is not attempting to lead an MBO. There number of staff to make sure it does not progress is a significant backlog of legislation in the in a flawed state? I think his colleague, the Government’s promised list and the usual Leader of the Seanad, Senator O’Rourke, response from the Taoiseach to queries about referred to the State Airports Bill as legally when this legislation will be brought forward is flawed and suggested that it had been drafted that there is yet no date. Does the Taoiseach outside the House — by a leading firm of solici- agree that this points to a significant shortage of tors — and that that might be one of the reasons. staff at the drafting stage? Admittedly, we would This indicates that there may be a problem of have been much better off if some of the legis- staffing in the office of the Attorney General. lation brought forward by the Government had The Taoiseach said previously in a reply that never seen the light of day. I do not want to tempt there were seven vacancies. Can he give us an up- fate. In regard to progressive or necessary legis- to-date position since four vacancies on the draft- lation, however, the Government should be pro- ing side were referred to? There was an 8% viding for sufficient staff in the office to ensure increase in the Estimates for staffing. Is that one there is no backlog or unnecessary pressure on of the areas the Taoiseach proposes to resolve the existing staff. The outsourcing of work would because it may put an end to outsourcing if there then be unnecessary. is an adequate number of staff in-house? The Taoiseach: The point is that we are not The Taoiseach: I do not wish to be repetitious outsourcing. One cannot simply advertise for but I have been told there were only two Bills positions in the Office of the Parliamentary outsourced in the past five years, and not too Counsel and get people with sufficient com- many before that. In a period when the House petency to fulfil that role. Such people are enacted 226 Bills, only two were sent out. Those recruited whenever they become available. There two Bills were sent to a former official of the is usually a vacancy or two in the office and some Office of the Parliamentary Counsel so, in effect, excellent staff who are beyond retirement age are someone who did not understand the system did continuing to provide the service. not draft a Bill. Statutory instruments have been From the House’s point of view, I can not recall frequently sent out, as have heads of Bills, includ- when we were stuck for legislation. It is generally ing the case Deputy Rabbitte cited. It is not liked the other way around. There are Bills at various and where Bills have been sent out, the office stages on the Order Paper and after the budget believes it ends up, to a large extent, having to do next week, the resources almost of a full-time the work again. person will be required for both the Social Wel- Drafting legislation is a slow process. It is a fare Bill and the Finance Bill for a long period of professional job and it takes a long time for some- time. Other legislation also requires time. It is a one to acquire the expertise. Some of the people matter of prioritising. The House is putting for- in the office have been abroad but are now work- ward by a multiplier significantly more legislation ing in this country. I think there are approxi- than it did five, ten, 15 or 20 years ago. It is mately 13 people in the office and there might becoming more productive all the time in terms be one vacancy in that area of the Office of the of legislation. Parliamentary Counsel. I understand there are some 13 draftsmen in National Security. the Office of the Parliamentary Counsel and one 4. Mr. Sargent asked the Taoiseach if he will vacancy. It is a specialised job in this country and report on the recent work of the high-level group elsewhere. The draftsmen frequently work con- established within his Department in the after- tract hours and stay on in the role. A number of math of the terrorist attacks on 11 September them are elderly and it is very much appreciated 2001; and if he will make a statement on the that they stay on. Although I am no legal expert, matter. [22475/04] their role involves a gifted talent. Any politicians in any jurisdiction will tell you that they are treas- 5. Mr. Rabbitte asked the Taoiseach if the high- ured people. That is why they are asked to stay level group established within his Department in on and we are in the same position. the aftermath of the 11 September 2001 attacks is still functioning; if he will report on its recent Mr. Sargent: To which two Bills has the work; and if he will make a statement on the Taoiseach referred? matter. [23383/04] 6. Mr. Kenny asked the Taoiseach if he will The Taoiseach: The two Bills were the Adven- report on the recent work of the high-level group, ture Activities Standards Authority Bill 2000 and established under the aegis of his Department, to the Official Languages (Equality) Bill 2002. monitor developments in the United States ter- 7 Ceisteanna — 23 November 2004. Questions 8

[Mr. Kenny.] The Taoiseach: The Deputy is aware, as I rorist atrocities of 11 September 2001; and if he pointed out shortly after the events of 11 Sep- will make a statement on the matter. [24128/04] tember 2001, that the Government set up the Office of Emergency Planning to co-ordinate the 7. Mr. J. Higgins asked the Taoiseach when the work of the various emergency services in prepar- high-level group established by his Department in ing contingency plans. The task force on emer- the aftermath of the 11 September 2001 terrorist gency planning is chaired by the Minister for attacks last met; and if he will make a statement Defence. It meets frequently to assist and con- on the matter. [24150/04] sider these issues. I will not comment in detail on 8. Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in asked the Taoiseach its work. It primary role is advisory and to exam- if it is proposed to maintain in 2005 the high-level ine any issues about which it is concerned. The group established within his Department in the issue raised by the Deputy is not one about which wake of the atrocities of 11 September 2001 in it is concerned. There is no change in the position the United States; and if he will make a statement regarding the Shannon stopover and we should on the matter. [29971/04] not talk up that issue. Reverend Jesse Jackson was in with me and The Taoiseach: I propose to take Questions before he left the country a few days later, he Nos. 4 to 8, inclusive, together. contacted me to tell me that what he had stated The national security committee, which is on this matter had not been accurately quoted, chaired by the Secretary General to the Govern- what was reported was not his view and that he ment, comprises representatives at the highest considered it mischievous that his views were level of the Departments of Justice, Equality and being used in such a way. Law Reform, Defence and Foreign Affairs, and of the Garda Sı´ocha´na and the Defence Forces. Mr. Sargent: What I said was a direct quote. The committee meets as required and will con- tinue to do so in 2005. In addition, its members Mr. Rabbitte: Whatever Jesse Jackson felt liaise on an ongoing basis to monitor devel- about the way he was quoted, is the Taoiseach opments which might have national security saying that the advice from the high-level group implications, in particular in the international is that the ongoing facilitation of American arena. It is concerned with ensuring that the troops to Iraq through Shannon is not a factor in Government and I are advised of high-level the considerations here? For example, how is it security issues and the responses to them, but not that people in captivity can be transferred from involving operational security issues. Iraq to Cuba without going through Shannon Air- port? The Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Mr. Sargent: Are the Taoiseach and the high- Reform is on record as saying that he would be concerned if that were in fact happening. It would level committee aware of the opinion clearly appear that it is happening and that we are not expressed by the Reverend Jesse Jackson, the minded to establish the truth or otherwise of that United States civil rights campaigner, that the claim. In the event that this is the situation, is the ongoing involvement by Ireland in the war in Iraq Taoiseach saying the national security committee through its making available Shannon Airport for is saying it is not a factor in its weighing up of any United States troops is putting Ireland “in the potential threat to the security of this country? line of fire”? Has the high-level group made any recom- The Taoiseach: Since 11 September 2001 every- mendations on the use to which Shannon Airport body is conscious of the level of terrorism in a is being put? Will the carrying of unspecified range of countries for a variety of reasons. The cargo, which is neither searched for weapons nor arrangements that have pertained here for the inspected for compliance with air safety and fire past 45 years are not new and do not add any- regulations, be addressed? Does the Taoiseach thing to the precautions that are being taken. consider it would be proper to make sure that this Those precautions would be taken in any event. matter is addressed to avoid any risk to the We are all aware there have been a number of people or directly to Shannon? Will he act on the concerns about what international terrorists are Minister of Defence’s statement that he would up to and how they operate. There are all the not be happy if people were being brought protections and security provided by Interpol, through Shannon who may be unaccounted for or Eurojust and all the other agencies that co- who may be being brought through in a way that operate with the Garda and the Army, but that transgresses international human rights agree- position is not changed because of the arrange- ments, for example, being brought through on ments that have been in place for the past 45 their way to Guantanamo Bay? Will the years. Taoiseach take hold of this issue and address the concerns expressed by Reverend Jesse Jackson, Mr. Kenny: We are now the most defenceless which are shared by many people here, that country in Europe. Is there a document which Ireland is, effectively, in the line of fire as a result sets out Ireland’s national security policy? In the of the activities that continue to take place at wake of the atrocities of 11 September 2001, a Shannon? number of statements were made by the Govern- 9 Ceisteanna — 23 November 2004. Questions 10 ment. It was stated, for example, that the elite between different emergency requirements. The Army ranger unit would be considerably possible amalgamation of the management of strengthened. That has not happened. No extra emergencies into a single agency was raised in a finance has been given to G2, the military intelli- report of the Emergency Planning Society which gence wing, which has a unique understanding of was presented to the Government some months Middle East complications and difficulties. What ago. Substantial costs would be associated with is the situation with regard to these issues? this approach and a number of the agencies Is the Government’s approach to emergency argued as to whether or not this would be the best planning not very fragmented? There is the thing to do. In a small country it is not difficult to national security committee, the Office of Emer- bring people together. The problem is that there gency Planning, the task force on emergency are different types of emergency, which require planning and the interdepartmental group under different skills, resources and experience. If one the control of that task force. If, God forbid, is dealing with a marine oil pollution incident it someone decided to fly a plane into the country is a very serious issue, but it is entirely different as a suicide mission, the Taoiseach would have to from reacting to the only crisis we have had in make the crucial decision to call in the RAF to this country in recent years which was the foot shoot it down. Is the Taoiseach happy that the and mouth outbreak. It is for this reason that pri- streamlining of national security issues is suf- mary responsibility remains with the relevant ficiently well informed and professional and agency but all of them can pull together when would, in all circumstances, enable him to make required to do so. that decision correctly? Is there a danger that he Approximately 23 or 24 groups were involved would underestimate the importance of such an daily on the foot and mouth campaign. On event or that his information might be flawed? Is marine issues there may be seven or eight groups he happy that he could deal with such a critical and, therefore, having them all emergency? 3 o’clock together would be unnecessary. The foot and mouth experience was a The Taoiseach: In considering modern terror- good example where people came together from ism and security issues, one can never know what their respective agencies on a committee that someone might do or whether threats will be car- worked very well. It was initially chaired by ried out. The interdepartmental group, which is myself and then by the former Minister for Agri- an advisory group under the chair of the Sec- culture and Food, Deputy Joe Walsh. retary General of my Department, is the first port Until the Department of Justice, Equality and of call for feeding in information which comes Law Reform, the Department of Defence, the from various quarters. It exchanges such infor- Defence Forces and the Garda Sı´ocha´na see it mation. It is a very tight group, consisting of the otherwise, I think the current arrangement works Secretaries General or appropriate officials from very well. the Departments of Justice, Equality and Law Reform, Defence and Foreign Affairs, the Garda Mr. Kenny: Will the Taoiseach comment on the and the Defence Forces. If the group needs any- Government statement, following the attacks of one from another area he or she is invited to par- 11 September 2001, concerning the expansion of ticipate. That group is advisory. the elite Army ranger unit? Following the events of 11 September 2001 it Given the pressure of political circumstances was believed that we should have an office of applying to the entire Middle East, does the emergency planning to co-ordinate the work of Taoiseach not think that G2, our military intelli- the various agencies. There are several agencies gence unit, which has an extensive understanding — not all are represented on the national security of the complications of Middle Eastern politics, committee — which do whatever is necessary to should be properly funded and resourced? prepare contingency plans. The Minister for In the Taoiseach’s discussions with various Defence answers questions on that matter groups, have reports of personnel associated with although much of the committee’s work is confi- al-Qaeda operating in Dublin been brought to his dential. The committee meets frequently, con- attention? Has that matter been dealt with to siders that role, examines information and liaises his satisfaction? with Eurojust, Interpol and the other groups. The Taoiseach should indicate what tangible Possible crises and ongoing work are dealt with improvements have been made since 11 Sep- by those two groups. They come under the aegis tember 2001. What has happened, if anything, in of my Department and I am kept abreast of their respect of national security that is to the benefit work. I do not deal on a daily basis with the and comfort of the people of the nation following Office of Emergency Planning. That is the decisive Government action? responsibility of the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform. The Taoiseach: There is now an office of emer- The Minister for Defence, through the Office gency planning under the Department of of Emergency Planning and the task force on Defence, which was not there heretofore and emergency planning, oversees emergency plan- which feeds into all agencies and groups. In ning generally to promote the best possible use addition, the taskforce on emergency planning of State resources and to ensure compatibility also feeds into that group. Under the aegis of my 11 Ceisteanna — 23 November 2004. Questions 12

[The Taoiseach.] The Taoiseach: The committee has no political own Department, there is a group to which I role. The committee does its utmost to protect referred earlier, including the Department of and safeguard the country from a defence and Justice, Equality and Law Reform, the Depart- security point of view. It exchanges information. ment of Defence, the Department of Foreign It is not involved in the politics of the matter, nor Affairs, the Garda Sı´ocha´na and the Defence is the office of emergency planning which con- Forces. There is a cross-link between both groups stantly tries to ensure the State is protected and — one is advisory and the other deals with spec- to oversee emergency planning generally. There- ific matters that arise. fore, the questions raised by the Deputy do not As Deputy Kenny knows, considerable capital arise. resources have been put into the Department of On aircraft that wish to stop — and do stop — Defence over the past five Estimates to update coming from anywhere in the United States and equipment, as well as providing additional train- going to any destination, not just to Iraq, as they ing skills and expertise. I cannot answer precisely have traditionally done for four and a half dec- what all those projects are; it is a matter for the ades, they must seek the permission of the Mini- Minister for Defence. I know from the Chief of ster for Transport in the case of civilian aircraft Staff, however, that the Defence Forces have and the Minister for Foreign Affairs in the case been engaged actively through those units. In of foreign military aircraft. Following the 1959 particular, our rangers are highly thought of in letter, there are concessions on that matter. Suc- the United Nations. They were asked to work on cessive Governments have followed the arrange- the Indonesian border during the difficulties in ments agreed in 1959 by the Minister for External East Timor. They are highly skilled and their Affairs, Mr. Frank Aiken, on security issues dur- equipment has been improved dramatically. ing the time of the Cold War. Those procedures There is considerable co-operation on the still pertain and do not mean that the aircraft need to be checked on each occasion. However, movement of people associated with al-Qaeda. rules are laid down. While I am not briefed on these issues weekly, I am aware of the intelligence work by the Garda CaoimhghınO´ Caolain: Has the remit of the Sı´ocha´na, and externally, on a number of individ- ´ ´ high level group changed in any way since 11 Sep- uals. Considerable effort, both by the Garda tember 2001, for example regarding the situation Sı´ocha´na and the Army, has been put into Middle currently pertaining in Iraq? Has the high level Eastern groups operating both here and else- group reviewed the Government’s policy of facili- where. There are not significant numbers tation of US military forces at Shannon Airport involved but security-wise a substantial effort since it was established? Shannon Airport is now goes into that now. being used as a staging post or perhaps Ireland is being used as an aircraft carrier for US forces Mr. J. Higgins: As part of its brief, does the travelling to and from their war in Iraq. As National Security Committee have a political role recently revealed in Department of Transport in advising the Government on how aspects of documentation, can the Taoiseach confirm that foreign policy or actions the Government might the people through the Government and take might lay the people open to an increased Exchequer are subsidising access to the war on chance of an outrage by groups using terrorist Iraq for the US forces to the estimated tune of methods? How often does the committee report \6 million so far? Is this position continuing? to the Government? For example, has it indicated Will the Taoiseach explain how he can rec- how the obliteration of Fallujah and the huge oncile that subsidisation of the US war in Iraq anger that has caused in the Arab and Moslem with his stated position, following the march by worlds might allow some groups to feel they tens of thousands of Irish citizens in this city, that should go around the world and quite wrongly he was personally opposed to the invasion of seek revenge on ordinary people? Iraq? How does he reconcile what is happening at Has the National Security Committee a role in Shannon Airport and the use of Irish taxpayers’ how the Shannon facility is used, which the money in this way in the context of the daily hor- Government affords to the United States military rific scenes in Falluja and other locations in Iraq to assist in its occupation? Has the committee and of the cruel murder of Margaret Hassan? made inquiries as to whether prisoners being spir- Will the Government consider adopting and ited from the Middle East have stopped there on reflecting the view of the overwhelming majority the way to President Bush’s gulag in Guantan- of Irish people on the US-British war in Iraq and amo? The Taoiseach might also give us his on clearly indicate to the US authorities that we are reaction to that matter. Should it not be absol- no longer available to facilitate or subsidise their utely clear given the strong indications that this is ongoing military actions in that country? happening, which would be an absolute outrage, that all US military airplanes or airplanes on duty The Taoiseach: There has been no change in related to the US military should be checked the terms of reference. I am not involved in the when they stop at Shannon to ensure the Govern- day to day work of the advisory committee. It is ment is not facilitating the kidnapping of suspects always looking at new threats and militant groups and their illegal relaying to Guantanamo? because there is always concern about new 13 Ceisteanna — 23 November 2004. Questions 14 groups in the Middle East that surface on an firm there is not a breach of international law tak- almost monthly basis. Intelligence is exchanged ing place with the transfer of suspects from wher- on an ongoing basis but the terms of reference of ever to Guantanamo Bay through Shannon the committee have not changed. Airport. There is enough illegality as regards the There has been no change since 1959 in the war in Iraq without it taking place in this country position on the stop-over facilities used by US as well. forces. It is not a matter of justifying it, the posi- Will he confirm whether the spending of tion has been the same for half a century, with between \5 million and \10 million over the next Ireland making available to the US landing and six months on a national security system at Irish overflight facilities. That period covers many ports is in response to any particular heightened crises and military confrontations where the US threat, in terms of terrorism, or whether it was took military action without specific UN endorse- planned all along? The expert committee to draw ment, such as in Kosovo and Vietnam. We have up a blueprint to deal with a biological threat has never withdrawn or suspended those facilities not met for over a year. Has that matter been during that time and I do not see the situation resolved? Is the biological threat now seen as any differently now. non-existent or has there been a falling down on the job in that a meeting has not taken place? Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in: Have we always subsi- dised it? The Taoiseach: In reply to Deputy Rabbitte, I have no information whatsoever about prisoners The Taoiseach: If the Deputy wants to pursue being moved to Guantanamo Bay or elsewhere. that matter, he should put questions to the Mini- ster for Transport. I do not have the figures. Mr. J. Higgins: Why are the planes not being searched? Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in: The Taoiseach might know. An Ceann Comhairle: The Taoiseach, without interruption. The Taoiseach: On the issues of concern to the Deputy, there are no difficulties with Shannon The Taoiseach: Approval has been sought in that feed into the wider system. Flights from the that regard as per the schedule used for that pur- United States and elsewhere also land in German pose from both the Departments of Foreign bases. The House is well aware that the position Affairs and Transport. However, I have no infor- when the war started, when there was no UN res- mation about prisoners. I do not have the number olution, was that we believed there should have of overflights, but I am sure Deputy Kenny is been a resolution and have consistently sup- aware that nowadays, with long flight capability, ported Mr. Kofi Annan at every level. The posi- many are going to Germany, and are also overfly- tion has moved on in the European Union and ing France, incidentally. elsewhere and countries have taken a different On the UN resolution the answer is “Yes”. approach. A UN resolution is in place so the posi- There is no doubt about that, as regards any of tion is not the same now as it was then. these conflicts. I have said this to President Bush—— Mr. Rabbitte: Does the Taoiseach know whether prisoners are being transported from Mr. Kenny: As I was saying to President Bush. Iraq to Guantanamo Bay by the Americans? The Taoiseach: ——across the table in Mr. Kenny: Would the Taoiseach prefer if the Hillsborough and in the White House. It was not UN had given a clear mandate for the invasion of something he wanted to hear, perhaps, the first Iraq through a second resolution? Would that few times, but in any event we made that point have made his decision on Shannon easier? The very clear. It is a lesson for the future. As regards Government found it difficult to say to the any of these conflicts, all the divisions within the American Government that we would continue European Council, the hostilities and difficulties to make Shannon available. It would have been in parliaments could have been avoided, I easier for the Taoiseach to do that if the United believe, if sufficient time had been given. I will Nations had been in a position to give a clear, not change my view on that. Ireland had done unequivocal second mandate, as happened in good work on the first resolution. I am not taking 1990, with the first invasion of Kuwait. any credit for that because it was done by officials Does the Taoiseach have information about in the Department of Foreign Affairs. It rep- the number of overflights that did not land in resented a good effort and good work could have Shannon which have been approved by the been done on the second resolution too, which Government? As some Members have mentioned could have avoided many of the difficulties Iraq, does he have any confirmation that the body experienced. recovered there recently was actually that of Mrs. I hope it is a lesson for the future. I know the Margaret Hassan? UN needs to be reformed and that there are issues to be resolved regarding vetoes, boycotts, Mr. Sargent: I would again like to ask the etc. Having said that, however, I believe it could Taoiseach if he will instigate measures that con- have been achieved, and was achieved later on, 15 Priority 23 November 2004. Questions 16

[The Taoiseach.] and a decrease in accident and emergency ser- even in difficult circumstances when the war had vices while there is chaos in the health service started. People still sought a unanimous and fewer are eligible for medical cards than were resolution. seven years ago? Do people ask him why things On the security at ports, that has much to do went so wrong? Why does the Minister think with drug-related issues as anything else, but it is there has been a preference for recruiting to improving. I have no formal confirmation on Mrs. administration and management tasks instead of Margaret Hassan, but I fear that this could be the to frontline services? This view has been sup- case. I believe the Deputy is aware of the difficult ported by the Comptroller and Auditor General circumstances that surround this question. It has in his report on the health services. What changes not been confirmed, but I believe it is Mrs. does he believe are necessary if we are to get Hassan. better value from spending on this scale given that these golden years will not last forever? Since we are not delivering, what changes does Priority Questions. the Minister advocate making to obtain better delivery? ———— Mr. Cowen: I do not accept the continuous con- Fiscal Policy. tention of the Opposition that there has been no 58. Mr. R. Bruton asked the Minister for Fin- improvement in the health service in the past ance if he is satisfied that the extra tax collected seven years. That is patently absurd. in the past seven years is delivering value for money through the spending increases they were Mr. R. Bruton: There has been no com- used to finance. [30128/04] mensurate improvement. Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): The Mr. Cowen: That is patently absurd. It suggests Government has more than doubled total spend- that 35,000 extra employees are going to work ing on public services between 1997 and 2004 to every day and doing nothing which is also pat- \ over 41 billion. As provided for in the Abridged ently absurd. I can give a simple example of the Estimates Volume published last week, the improvements in the health service. When I \ Government will add a further 2.5 billion to this became Minister for Health and Children in June in 2005 on a pre-budget basis to fund day-to-day 1997, the Government of which the Deputy was spending on public services. Priority has been a member left a situation where the intellectual given to expenditure on social welfare, health, disability provision was \1 million for that year education and investment. Gross current spend- which did not even cover emergencies. We have \ ing on health has increased by 176% to 9.6 had subsequent multi-annual investment in that billion in 2004, spending on social welfare has area, in which I was involved, for three years of \ increased by 97% to 11.3 billion while expendi- more than \18 million. This meant increases in \ ture on education has increased by 103% to 6.1 residential places for more than 1,700 people with billion. Capital spending to address the country’s intellectual disability and more than 3,000 new infrastructural deficit has increased by 178%. The day care places. That is just one subhead of general Government debt ratio has decreased activity and there are many more where there from 65% of gross domestic product, GDP, in have been real improvements. There is no sugges- 1997 to an expected ratio of less than 32% by the tion of a completed agenda but real improve- \ end of this year. In addition almost 10.5 billion ments for ordinary people in respect of the has been set aside for long term pension and increased provision in the health service. social security costs by investing in the national On the question of frontline staff, there are an pensions reserve fund. extra 6,500 nurses in the service and 8,500 in the This level of spending has been achieved in tan- medical, dental and health and social care pro- dem with the preservation of a stable budgetary fessional grades. We then hear the facile idea that position and major reductions in personal tax- support services are a waste. For frontline staff to ation. It has resulted in significant improvements do their job properly, they need good support in public services across the board but issues con- staff behind them. I do not think consultants cerning individual programmes or projects should should be engaged in surgeries and all that type be raised by the Deputy with the relevant of detailed work and that they should work out Ministers. their appointments for next week and send out the letters themselves. While there is the super- Mr. R. Bruton: The Minister admits that the ficial attraction of the Deputy’s argument which tax take has doubled in the past seven years and is meant to have a wider populist appeal, there that tax as a proportion of gross national product, are many in the support services that help front- GNP, has also increased. Do people ask him, in line staff to do their job better. the same way as they ask me, what we get for all this extra money? Have we made an impact? For Mr. R. Bruton: May I ask the Minister—— example, do they ask him about the trebling of spending in the health area which appears to have Mr. Cowen: In regard to the future, it is not produced only a few hundred extra hospital beds simply a question of more resources, although 17 Priority 23 November 2004. Questions 18 they are important because this is a people- Mr. R. Bruton: The increase in the number of centred service. It is also about getting better administrative staff—— value and implementing the required reforms which are a major challenge to the system. They Mr. Cowen: The Deputy has been trying to give have been devised as a result of the widest con- a false impression for months. sultative process that has ever taken place in the health service. Tax Yield. Mr. R. Bruton: The Minister is trying to attack 59. Ms Burton asked the Minister for Finance a straw man. Does he agree it was the Comptrol- if his attention has been drawn to recent figures ler and Auditor General who reported that the showing that in 2001, 41 persons earning more increase in administrative staff at a rate of 90% than \500,000, including 11 earning more than \1 dwarfed the increase in frontline staff medical million, paid no tax; his views on whether it is staff which was only 20%? He has drawn the satisfactory that super high income earners attention of the Oireachtas to this imbalance. should be able to secure a zero tax liability when Does the Minister agree significant new layers of so many low and middle income earners pay tax bureaucracy have been created in the health ser- at up to the 42% rate; the steps he intends to take vice? In the Dublin area alone, three new health to ensure a reasonable tax contribution from all boards were created which did not deliver high earners; if he has considered the introduc- improved service. Will the Minister admit any tion of a minimum effective tax rate or the cap- mistakes in regard to the way in which these ping of reliefs; and if he will make a statement on matters have been handled? Will he admit they the matter. [30012/04] have made serious blunders in regard to cost overruns? Will he admit when benchmarking Mr. Cowen: The recent figures to which arose, which was a golden opportunity for reform Deputy Burton refers were made known to her to be brought forward as an issue, the Govern- in my reply to her parliamentary question last ment paid the money without any reform being month on this matter. There are many reasons a negotiated? I will not even deal with waste of the person would have a nil liability. This can arise scale of Punchestown. from the cumulation of tax relief for pension con- tributions, trading losses carried forward, capital Mr. Cowen: Some 6,500 nurses and 8,500 allowances and various tax incentives. It must be people in medical, dental and health and social accepted that, of their nature, tax reliefs even care professional grades, such as physiotherapists where they can be justified for good public policy or social workers dealing with community care problems, are frontline staff. I do not know what purposes, will reduce the tax bills of those in the the Comptroller and Auditor General calls them higher income bracket. but I know they are frontline staff. I am conscious of the need to ensure equity in the tax system. This Government has reduced the Mr. R. Bruton: The Minister ought to at least tax burden on all taxpayers, especially the lower brief himself before he speaks. He should read paid, on an unprecedented scale. Since 1998, we the audit he has done and not pretend the prob- have also taken effective measures to limit and lems do not exist. refocus tax reliefs to ensure a proper balance is struck between the provision of particular incen- Mr. Cowen: The Deputy’s problem is that he tives for good public policy reasons and the avail- wants to answer his own questions. ability of opportunities for higher earners to reduce their tax exposure. I will continue this Mr. R. Bruton: It is for the Minister to answer policy. To that end, all reliefs and incentives must them. It is for me to state the problems—— be kept under review to ensure they fulfil the pur- pose for which they were intended. Mr. Cowen: I am giving my opinion which hap- I refer the Deputy to the long-standing practice pens to differ from that of the Deputy. I am sorry of Ministers for Finance not to comment on what if I have a different opinion. may or may not be contained in upcoming budgets. I do not intend to depart from that Mr. R. Bruton: No, the Minister is distorting approach. the facts. Ms Burton: Does the Minister accept that a for- Mr. Cowen: The truth born out of experience tunate 41 persons who earn more than \500,000, is not of any relevance to the Deputy. To suggest \ that 90% of the increase of 35,000 are down to 11 of whom earn more than 1 million, pay no paper pushers in the health service—— tax? Does he accept this is an insult and outrage to the 32.6% of PAYE workers who pay some of Mr. R. Bruton: That is not what the Comptrol- their income tax at the top rate of 42%? I can ler and Auditor General said and it is not what I understand the Minister’s discretion relative to said. The Minister is deliberating misinterpreting next week’s budget, but such plain inequity to the what I said. vast bulk of compliant taxpayers whereby a new golden circle of 41 semi-millionaires pay no tax Mr. Cowen: I am not. The Deputy is trying to and 391 taxpayers with incomes in excess of give a false impression—— \120,000 per year pay either no tax or pay tax at 19 Priority 23 November 2004. Questions 20

[Ms Burton.] reliefs that should be characterised or referred to the 20% rate is a grave injustice. Does the Mini- as reliefs for the rich. ster not believe that in terms of maintenance of This Government has a strong record on clos- confidence in the integrity and fairness of the tax ing off and limiting reliefs, where necessary, to system, which is absolutely essential in any func- promote tax equity. Prominent in this regard was tioning society, never mind one with the preten- the cap of \31,750 on tax relief applied in the sion of being left-wing, such circumstances are an 1998 budget, which will progressively limit the tax outrage to the compliant taxpayer? Will the Mini- loss involved. In the 2003 budget the former ster undertake to cap or review those allowances Minister announced the termination of various that are producing this outrageous state of property and investment reliefs. The termination affairs? date was extended in the 2004 budget and Fin- ance Act to provide for an orderly winding down Mr. Cowen: There has been much comment in of the various existing schemes. These schemes recent weeks on these figures and the fact that a will terminate on 31 July 2006, with only pipeline very small number of high earners have managed projects qualifying, subject to certain conditions to pay little or no tax through the use of tax being met. To answer the Deputy’s question, incentives. Therefore, I take this opportunity to obviously the schemes will be kept under review. put the figures in their correct context. Of the 270 PAYE income earners on \500,000 or more per Ms Burton: I remind the Minister that the for- annum, 263 were liable to tax at the 42% rate, mer Minister, Deputy McCreevy, promised to one was liable at the 20% rate and nine had a nil end some of the reliefs in the 2002 budget but net income tax liability. Of the 590 self-employed changed his mind last year and extended them. income earners on \500,000 or more per annum, As a consequence, some of the tax breaks will 552 were liable to tax at the 42% rate, six were continue for at least another 15 years, thus liable at the 20% tax rate, and 32 had a nil net enabling a golden circle to pay no tax while a sin- income tax liability. gle individual earning more than \28,000 per On tax reliefs in general, all Governments have annum could end up paying tax at the 42% rate. generally introduced or continued various tax This is the legacy of Deputy McCreevy’s grossly reliefs with the aim of stimulating investment in inequitable and unjust tax system. People want to particular sectors of the economy or in particular know what the Minister will do about this. Let regions. Such investment has led to employment me give one example of the inequities to which I creation or maintenance, as well as improving the refer. To be eligible for the small self-adminis- tered pension scheme, one would need to be able capital stock of buildings, for example, in the \ hotels sector or in various cities and towns under to invest at least 70,000 per year. How many the urban renewal and town renewal schemes. ordinary workers can invest this much in a pen- However, it is accepted that these reliefs, no sion scheme? matter how desirable, narrow the tax base and will, of their nature, have the effect of reducing Mr. Cowen: I am making the point that equity the tax paid by high earners. is being established in the tax system generally while the Deputy is referring to a specific issue. As I stated, there can be many reasons some The wider issue is such that it represents greater persons can have a nil liability to income tax. This economic justice to have 400,000 more citizens at can arise from the accumulation of tax relief for work. The removal of another 280,000 workers pension contributions, trading losses carried for- from the tax net, the reduction of the standard ward, capital allowances on business investments, and higher rates of tax by 6%, the substantial charitable donations and various property-based increase to \246 in the sum one must earn before tax reliefs. These tax reliefs are incentives that paying PAYE tax and the significant widening of were introduced purposely by successive Govern- the standard tax band also represent significant ments, including the rainbow Government, to improvements and greater economic justice for stimulate investment. the ordinary people. On the question of golden circles raised by Under the rainbow coalition, the top 1.5% of Deputy Burton, I do not know the identity of earners paid less than one fifth of the tax. The members of such circles. The Deputy knows their top 1.5% of earners now pay more than one quar- affairs are confidential to the Revenue Commis- ter of the tax. When one examines the sioners. To use the term “golden circle” is progression—— unworthy and takes from the argument. It is worth noting that the ten most costly Ms Burton: They must be civil servants—— reliefs cover items such as pension contributions, stamp duty and capital gains tax exemptions on Acting Chairman (Mr. McGinley): I am sorry, one’s home, mortgage interest relief, non-tax- Deputy—— ation of child benefit, medical insurance relief and SSIAs. These reliefs are widely used by all Mr. Cowen: They are not. classes of society and the cost pertaining thereto amounts to more than \5 billion. They are not tax Ms Burton: That is the reality. 21 Priority 23 November 2004. Questions 22

Acting Chairman: We have spent eight minutes people who believe they have been mis-sold a on this question so we will proceed to Question policy in this regard who have come forward as a No. 60. result of the invitation or appeal to do so by the Consumer Director, Mary O’Dea? Is the Minister Financial Services Regulation. in a position to confirm that the cases presenting would be included in IFSRA’s ongoing examin- 60. CaoimhghınO´ Caola´in asked the Minister ´ ation of the endowment loan shortfalls? I expect for Finance the action he proposes to take in that they must be included. response to the endowment policy scandal; and if Can the Minister indicate whether he has given he will make a statement on the matter. any further consideration to measures, legislative [30294/04] or otherwise, that might be necessary to tighten Mr. Cowen: The Irish Financial Services Regu- up this area, given that there are undoubtedly latory Authority, IFSRA, is currently studying people who are suffering and are continuing to the position on endowment loan shortfalls, having suffer as a result of the shortfalls experienced? commenced a survey earlier this year to deter- Does he believe this area should be more tightly mine whether and to what extent there will be regulated? Is there not a case for restrictions on difficulties for customers. It would be inappropri- the types of mortgages that can be sold to cus- ate to reach any conclusions on this issue in tomers or consumers? Experience of the product advance of IFSRA’s consideration of the out- indicates that this is a particular area which needs come of the survey. better protection for consumers and tightening of There are currently no reliable data on the the regulations applying to the financial overall numbers of cases where there may be a institutions. shortfall. However, endowment loan approvals in The Minister implied in his reply that he is the past five years represent just 3% of the over- unlikely to take steps in advance of the IFSRA all mortgage market, although it has been con- report. Will he confirm whether, following the siderably higher in the past. Since 1989, a total of report and having given it his full consideration, 90,000 endowment loans were approved, which is he will be open to considering the recommend- roughly 10% of total loan approvals since 1989. ations of IFSRA and to taking the substantive Recent publicity on endowment mortgages has and appropriate steps necessary? focused on the possibility that a significant number of holders of such mortgages will have a Mr. Cowen: I do not wish to anticipate the find- shortfall of funds when their mortgages reach the ings of IFSRA, which was set up to provide an end of their normal term. These products enhanced regulatory and supervisory regime gov- inherently require customers to take some risk. erning the financial services industry, primarily They are exposed to market fluctuations, just like through the enactment of the Central Bank and any market-based life assurance investment. The Financial Services Authority of Ireland Act 2003. fact that an endowment mortgage holder does not It is the competent authority in this area and it gain as much as expected is not in itself an indica- should be allowed to get on with its work. Having tion of any inappropriate practices on the part of commenced a survey earlier this year, it is study- the bank or insurance company concerned. ing the situation to determine whether and to There is already a substantial volume of legis- what extent there will be difficulties for cus- lation in place on these products. For example, tomers. It would be premature at this stage to the Consumer Credit Act 1995 requires that all second-guess the outcome of the survey, the endowment loan application forms must contain results of which will be used to establish the nat- a prominent notice to the effect that there is no ure of any appropriate action to be taken. I will guarantee that the proceeds of the insurance monitor the position as the information obtained policy will be sufficient to repay the loan in full by IFSRA becomes available. when it becomes due. The Act also obliges the While it is estimated that approximately 90,000 provision of ongoing information on the perform- endowment mortgages were sold in Ireland since ance of the policy, as do the Life Assurance 1989, there are no reliable data as yet on the over- (Provision of Information) Regulations 2001. The all numbers of cases where there may be a short- Central Bank and Financial Services Authority of fall. Obviously there may not be a shortfall in Ireland Acts 2003 and 2004 established IFSRA every case. We must await the outcome of the and considerably strengthened the regulatory survey. The Deputy referred to the consumer environment, including through the provision of director of IFSRA, Ms Mary O’Dea, who has an enhanced structure for dealing with con- encouraged people to come forward if they are sumers’ complaints about financial institutions. worried about the possibility of having been mis- I will continue to review the adequacy of the sold an endowment mortgage. The advice at the legislative framework as the information moment is that people should complain in the developed by IFSRA becomes available. first instance to the company from whom they bought the policy. Following the enactment of the Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in: In his response the Insurance Act 1989, a code of conduct for Minister has confirmed the endowment mortgage insurance intermediaries and guidelines were issue affects some 90,000 policyholders. Has he drawn up by the industry in consultation with the any information at this point on the number of then Department of Industry and Commerce. 23 Priority 23 November 2004. Questions 24

[Mr. Cowen.] As the Deputy will appreciate, it is not the prac- The key requirements of the code were that the tice to comment on the possibility or otherwise of intermediaries should know the clients can give tax policy changes in the lead-up to the annual the best advice. budget.

Acting Chairman: : Ceist 61—— Mr. P. McGrath: I would appreciate if the Minister would forward to me the figures to Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in: Gabh mo leithsce´al, a which he has referred rather than put them on Chathaoirligh, nach bhfuil seans agam—— the record of the House. The figures put forward by the Construction Industry Federation, to Acting Chairman: D’u´ sa´id tu´ beagnach trı´ which the Minister appears to be alluding, sug- no´ ime´ad ar do che´ad cheist bhreise, a Theachta. gests that on a house in Dublin costing \295,000, Ta´ seacht no´ ime´ad caite againn ar an gceist seo. VAT amounts to \35,000; site taxes, \30,000; Mar sin, caithfimid dul ar aghaidh. labour taxes, \29,000; and profit taxes, \11,000. Perhaps the Minister will detail the figures with ´ Caoimhghı´nOCaola´in: De ghna´th, bı´onn which he disagrees. seans beag ag gach Teachta an dara ceist breise The Minister will be aware that stamp duty for a cur. first-time buyers is increased on property costing more than \190,000. However, it is not just the ´ ´ Acting Chairman: Ta me buartha faoi sin ach cost in excess of \190,000 which is taxed, stamp ta´ se´ in am don che´ad cheist eile. duty must be paid on every euro the house costs. Will the Minister examine this cost because the Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in: Is mo´ r an trua e´ sin. threshold is very low and it is a very heavy tax on Tax Code. first-time buyers? Will he agree that the reward for people in private rented accommodation in 61. Mr. P. McGrath asked the Minister for Fin- terms of tax breaks is extremely low. It might be ance if he is satisfied with the tax treatment of the tax efficient to increase the tax relief because housing sector; and if he will make a statement on there might be more reporting by tenants and the matter. [30129/04] more claims for tax relief. It would be self-financ- Mr. Cowen: Government policy in the housing ing in terms of bringing more people into the market has focused, among other things, on tax net. improving supply, assisting home ownership particularly for first-time buyers, facilitating the Mr. Cowen: The figures the Deputy is using are expansion of the private rented sector and pro- figures presented by the Irish Home Builders moting the regeneration of certain areas. In this Association as part of its pre-budget submission context, a range of tax incentives exist in regard last year, which estimates that the total tax take to the housing market in the case of first-time from the cost of a new home is more than 40%. buyers and other owner-occupiers, for tenants However, the calculation by the IHBA is based and investors. I can detail these for the Deputy if on the presentation of statistics in a manner that he desires. is open to question. In its calculation, the IHBA The years 2002 and 2003 were the eighth and included VAT as a percentage of the house price ninth successive years of record housing output net of VAT. Normally one would show the tax as with 57,695 and 68,819 completions, respectively. a percentage of the overall price, including tax. \ This positive trend in supply has continued into If, for example, a person who earns 10,000 pays 2004, with statistics for the six months to June tax at 40% and PRSI at 3%, it would not be the showing that overall house completions at 35,957 case that the individual’s liability for tax and were up 21.4% on the same period last year. The PRSI would be expressed as a percentage of net \ rate of house building is now more than double income, namely, 75%. To say one is paying 4,300 that in 1996. We have had some success in our out of \5,700 would be misleading. tax policy but we do not claim all the credit. Taking the base figure used by the IHBA, and Like all other goods and services, the State presenting the statistics, as would commonly be finds it necessary to raise taxes from this area. done in practice, as a percentage of the total cost, However, there has been some badly informed including VAT, the actual cost of a new home commentary recently in regard to the tax take that accrues directly to the central Exchequer from new homes. Figures in excess of 40% have through taxation is in the order of 28%, based been attributed to the amount the Government on both south Dublin and national prices. This is raises in tax from each new home. However, this broadly the order Exchequer tax represents on all figure is wrong. The cost of a new home that economic activity across the economy. In accrues directly to the Exchequer through tax- addition, the IHBA has included in its calcu- ation is more like 28%, based on both Dublin and lations pay-roll taxes, even though it accepts that national prices. This is broadly in line with the tax construction labour might be employed elsewhere take on the overall economy. in the economy. The housing market is a complex and dynamic Given the high levels of employment currently one and demands continuous monitoring and experienced in the building industry, and that it adjustment to address changing circumstances. is a pay-roll tax and not specific to housing, it 25 Priority 23 November 2004. Questions 26 appears there is a strong argument for exclusion carrying out for some time, will now be used to of that tax. Removing this element reduces the drive a further investigation project aimed at central Exchequer tax take to almost 18.5% for a recovering any previously undisclosed liabilities house in Dublin and under 17% based on arising from the use of insurance products as a national prices. On the basis of the figures used vehicle for evasion. by the IHBA for a new house in Dublin, the The structure of the investigation is a matter Exchequer tax take, comprising capital gains tax, for the Revenue Commissioners but I understand stamp duty on site transaction and corporation from them that while the precise nature of the tax on profit and VAT, excluding pay-roll taxes investigation has not been decided the successful and other local authority charges and levies, is approach taken in the investigations of bogus \54,365 of an average house price of \295,000, non-resident accounts and offshore accounts is which is less than 18.5%. likely to form the basis for this latest investi- Even if we add the estimates of home builders gation. This is likely to involve discussions with for other charges, which are not strictly the industry to seek its co-operation, a defined Exchequer taxes but rather local authority period for voluntary disclosure and subsequent charges such as the development levy application pursuit of those who failed to come forward in to each house and the cost per house of the obli- the voluntary phase. Preparatory work is under gation of the developer to transfer land under way and the investigation itself will begin next Part V of the Planning and Development Act year. 2000, that brings the total take by the State, excluding pay-roll taxes, to just under 26%, or Ms Burton: Does the Minister agree this Rev- \76,010, for a house in Dublin and less than 23% enue investigation is likely to yield at least for a new house based on national prices. another \1 billion, probably \1.5 billion, in On the other question—— unpaid taxes and penalties as a consequence of people investing untaxed or undeclared money in Mr. P. McGrath: May I ask the Minister a insurance-based products? question? The Minister stated that a voluntary disclosure scheme is to be set up. Does he agree that for Acting Chairman: The Minister has given a some of these people this will be the fourth comprehensive reply. opportunity they have been given by the State to come clean. We have had two tax amnesties and Mr. P. McGrath: The Minister is filibustering. an investigation into non-resident deposits. Now they are being given another chance. What are Acting Chairman: We have spent seven compliant taxpayers to make of this? minutes on the question. The Minister referred to the financial insti- Mr. P. McGrath: How can the Minister con- tutions co-operating. What exactly does that done the payment by a first-time buyer of \75,000 mean? Most small business people did not wake in tax on a new house in Dublin costing \300,000? up one morning and decide to buy a single pre- mium insurance product. It had to be sold very 62. Ms Burton asked the Minister for Finance aggressively to them with its consequent tax the investigation that has been carried out by the advantages. Is the Revenue likely to take action Revenue Commissioners into the reported use of against financial institutions which may have single premium insurance policies as a tax avoid- been selling products conscious that those prod- ance mechanism; the information available to him ucts offered tax evasion opportunities to certain or to the Revenue Commissioners on the extent individuals who were not tax-compliant? of this practice; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [30013/04] Mr. Cowen: What people should take from this is that they should place their trust in the integ- Mr. Cowen: I am advised by the Revenue Com- rity, competence and professionalism of the missioners that as part of their ongoing assess- Office of the Revenue Commissioners to deal ment of potential tax risks, various methods used with this matter comprehensively as it has dealt by taxpayers to hide undisclosed income or gains with other matters that come to its attention. are identified. Some of these have been the sub- That is what people should make of it. I have ject of major investigation projects. The infor- spoken to the Chairman of the Revenue Commis- mation assembled by Revenue from various sioners, who comes to visit me from time to time sources, including disclosures made by taxpayers regarding developments and issues that arise, and in the course of some of the recent investigation he has my total confidence. That is based on an projects, indicates that there may have been use outstanding performance by him and his staff. of insurance products for the purpose of hiding Compliant taxpayers may be assured that anyone undisclosed income or gains. who has been involved in tax evasion, which is an Revenue’s concern relates to the status of the offence, will be dealt with and that the returns to moneys which are invested by the taxpayer into the taxpayer will be what one would expect based the relevant policies and whether they were on the investigations which are continuing. undisclosed income or gains of the taxpayer. The Neither the Chairman of the Revenue Com- research into this area, which Revenue has been missioners nor anyone else is in a position, 27 Other 23 November 2004. Questions 28

[Mr. Cowen.] fare systems. The group was made up of rep- because it is too early in the investigations, to resentatives of the social partners and was comment on the likely receipts. That issue, with chaired by my Department. a range of factors, will be considered in fore- The current established approach to taxation in casting tax revenue. This issue has been under Ireland and other OECD countries is that while investigation by the Revenue Commissioners. the tax system has a role to play in the broader The preparatory work has been done. Revenue issue of equitable income distribution, it is not the has an outstanding record of success in dealing primary mechanism for the distribution of income with the most difficult task of tracing income to low-income households. Instead, the social which was not declared for tax purposes. The welfare system is the main instrument for this. Office of the Revenue Commissioners will get to It is also the established and generally accepted the bottom of this, as it has got to the bottom of view that the fundamental role of taxation is to other matters. raise revenue to fund the provision of services by the State. The introduction of a refundable tax Ms Burton: Does the Minister agree that the credit system would be a major departure from expected \1 billion or \1.5 billion which will arise this position. It would have significant impli- next year from these inquiries should be set aside cations for the social welfare system as well as for capital investment, particularly in areas that wide-ranging economic, cost and administrative would benefit compliant taxpayers who paid their implications. taxes in the 1980s when others were putting their money offshore or into special products to hide it Mr. Boyle: The Minister has not expressed an from the tax man? It should be borne in mind opinion, he has outlined the views of the working that it was the Minister’s predecessor and people group which met on the last partnership agree- in the Revenue who argued at the time of the tax ment. In the debate on tax equity, the question marches that there was not a pot of gold in terms of refundable tax credits deserves consideration, of unpaid taxes, yet time and again we have seen given that people on the minimum wage are pay- evidence of a huge industry of non-compliance ing tax at the moment on 90% of their income. regarding the payment of taxes. That means that a large number of PAYE workers benefit only partially from the tax credits Mr. Cowen: I am not aware of any area that they have been allocated or are unable to take has greater geographic virtue than any other in advantage of them. terms of compliance with taxation in the 1970s or As to the excuse regarding the effect on the any other decade. Neither do I believe the social welfare system of refunding tax credits, it Deputy is so aware. might be argued that administratively it would be a better mechanism for redistributing income. Ms Burton: Does the Minister not follow the Other mechanisms under social welfare to bring tribunals? up the pay of low paid workers are very compli- cated and are not being accessed. The family Mr. Cowen: Furthermore, it was my prede- income supplement is accessed by only one third cessor who introduced a package of powers that of the people who are entitled to claim that sup- can cater for investigations of the type being plement. By using the tax system creatively in this planned in this instance. Much of the taxation way, the Minister might, at lower cost and with which was not paid is now being paid because of better efficiency, go a long way towards solving a more compliant culture brought about by the the problem of low paid workers not getting full policies pursued by this Government. Those poli- advantage from the tax system. cies contrast starkly with the policies of the Administration that was in place when I was first Mr. Cowen: I am advised by the Revenue Com- elected to this House in the mid-1980s, which missioners that the most recent estimated cost of ensured effective taxation rates of 73%. making all personal tax credits refundable when they are unused, including personal employee Other Questions. credits, the home care tax credit, the one-parent family credit and the age credit, as well as the ———— minor personal credits, such as the incapacitated child credit and the blind person’s credit, would Tax Collection. be approximately \1.3 billion annually. The main category of refund would relate to the basic per- 63. Mr. Sargent asked the Minister for Finance sonal credit where the annual cost of refunding if he has considered the possibility of introducing the unused portion of the credit to income ear- refundable tax credits; and if he will make a state- ners with insufficient earnings to fully absorb it ment on the matter. [29985/04] would amount to approximately \700 million. Mr. Cowen: The issue of making unused tax The next two categories of refund in order of credits refundable was considered by a working scale are the employee credit, which would cost group established under the Programme for Pros- approximately \590 million, and the home care perity and Fairness to examine the role credit which would cost approximately \35 refundable tax credits can play in the tax and wel- million. 29 Other 23 November 2004. Questions 30

The estimate of \1.3 billion relates only to the Mr. Cowen: There is no point being juvenile cost of extending refundable tax credits to all about it. those on Revenue’s tax files. If a refundable tax credit system were to be introduced, one would Mr. R. Bruton: As we are time limited, we do have to consider those who are not on the tax not have the luxury of waiting for answers. files, for example, those who are of employable age but not working, including those on social Mr. Boyle: The Minister is wasting time. welfare. That would increase the cost sig- nificantly. Mr. Cowen: I made a point in regard to this question. It was suggested that I have a discussion Mr. R. Bruton: Would the Minister consider with the Minister for Social and Family Affairs in going part of the distance along this route? I have regard to the impact secondary benefits have in preventing people coming into the jobs market. I in mind particularly the family income sup- will take up that offer. However, an economic plement. Family income supplement has a very paper prepared by the European Commission in low take-up, not because there are not many 2001 refers to the major negative aspects regard- people in the income categories that are eligible ing this system as including high budgetary costs, but because they must apply for it. Would the which imply higher taxation and, therefore, Minister consider making administrative arrange- increased rather than reduced distortions of the ments to pay family income supplement through labour market. In addition, it suggested that the tax code? He rightly states social welfare is another problem with universal public assistance the way in which many of these needs should be schemes which are not usually combined with addressed. Is the Minister aware that if a person work, for example, a simple negative income tax is unemployed and in receipt of rent supplement, system, is the disincentive effect they have on 95% of the rent is paid but if that person gets a persons or families not already on welfare but job at the minimum wage or higher, the sup- who become windfall beneficiaries of universal plement towards the rent, either from tax or sup- schemes. plementary welfare, drops to zero? This unwit- tingly creates an unemployment trap in our Mr. R. Bruton: What about the family income system. Between the Minister for Finance and the supplement? Minister for Social and Family Affairs, some sol- ution must be found. If Deputy Boyle’s solution Mr. Cowen: The point I am making indicates is not the correct one, perhaps the Minister will that no matter how we try to deal with the impact find a different one. of supplementary benefits or the loss of eligibility to them in the event of people entering the work- Mr. Cowen: We are getting into a potential place, a refundable tax credit system is not a com- budgetary area and I am not prepared to com- ponent that would bring about a solution, accord- ment on what, if any, amendment I will make to ing to those more expert than I in this area. the tax credits system. However, with 4 o’clock regard to the broader point on the Decentralisation Programme. facts, costs and problems that come 64. Mr. P. McGrath asked the Minister for Fin- with this, there are negative effects with such a ance if he intends to use budget 2005 to make system of refundable tax credits without the further announcements on decentralisation. characteristics of a partial basic income system. [29917/04] Mr. R. Bruton: That is not what I asked. Mr. Cowen: Budget 2005 will be presented to the Da´il and published on Wednesday, 1 Mr. Cowen: I am coming to the point. I am December. As the Deputy knows, it is not the sorry if I do not answer as precisely as the Deputy usual practice to speculate in advance of the wishes. I could say to the Deputy that he could annual budget on what it will contain. I do not have asked his question differently or more propose to deviate from this practice. quickly but he would not find that appropriate or Mr. P. McGrath: Will the Minister comment on helpful. I will answer the Deputy’s question. the fact that he has not included any figure for The issue of the impact of secondary benefits decentralisation in the Estimates for 2005? Was is a continuing problem. this an oversight or the deliberate policy of the Minister? The Minister of State responsible for Mr. P. McGrath: Miriam Lord was right. decentralisation has already acquired eight facili- ties for decentralisation throughout the country. Mr. Cowen: The Deputy does not have to inter- The Minister’s predecessor, Deputy McCreevy, in rupt me every time I open my mouth. Question last year’s budget stated that no deals could be Time is about providing information, not inter- entered into until a corresponding building or rupting each other. property in Dublin was disposed of. With regard to the eight properties which have been acquired Mr. R. Bruton: The problem is that we are and the Departments which will use them, will time limited. the Minister outline the matching properties 31 Other 23 November 2004. Questions 32

[Mr. P. McGrath.] On the other question, these are matters dis- which have been disposed of in Dublin city to cussed by Government which I am sure will be comply with the former Minister’s budget state- announced in due course. ment of 2004? Mr. Boyle: The Minister seems to accept the Mr. Cowen: I cannot refer to my predecessor’s \800 million figure given by the Minister of State, reference to the question of corresponding build- Deputy Parlon, to the Joint Committee on Fin- ings. The issue of buildings is one which my col- ance and Public Service in regard to the cost of league is dealing with in conjunction with the physically moving to centres throughout the Office of Public Works. With regard to the non- country. The Minister of State admitted this did involvement of decentralisation costs or a pro- not include ancillary costs, such as providing ser- vision for next year, these will arise in the multi- vices like child care, and did not cover additional annual Estimates 2005-2009 which will be pub- current expenditure such as logistical costs or the lished with the budget. They were not included in cost of travel to and from the secretariat in the previous multi-annual envelope. Dublin and the new locations of many of the agencies, wherever they will be. Have the figures Mr. P. McGrath: Will the Minister forward to been researched and can the Minister estimate me the information on the properties? what the likely costs will be in a year?

Mr. Cowen: I will. The properties are already Mr. Cowen: I have no idea what those costs, if in the process of being disposed of. any, will be. However, I am sure the Deputy will welcome the investment these funds represent. Ms Burton: I understand the Minister lives in Parlon country. Will the Minister speculate as to Mr. Boyle: I would welcome the figures. whether there will be signs next week in Parlon country reiterating the Minister of State’s coup Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in: On the last occasion last year in regard to decentralisation? Specifi- we addressed this sequence of questions, the cally, is the proposal to decentralise certain public Minister indicated that the calculation was that bodies, such as the IDA, still on track or will it some 4,813 Dublin based civil servants had be held back until such time as agreement can be applied to participate in the proposed relocation reached with the staff in those organisations? or decentralisation scheme. Has there been any advance on that figure in regard to Dublin based Mr. Cowen: The only signs of a political nature civil servants seeking to move from the city to I expect to see next week are those asking where other rural locations? Mindful of the words of the the Labour Party is in that area, a question which former Minister, Deputy McCreevy, when he is often asked of me in my constituency. Regard- stated that the prospect of a hanging concentrates ing the question of the IDA, there will be ongoing the mind wonderfully, does the Minister believe consultations with staff in regard to ensuring a the deadline of the next general election is successful roll-out of this programme. unlikely to be met in the context of the announce- ment made in last year’s budget? Would the Mr. R. Bruton: The Minister was probably in Minister consider a changed proposal that might the House some three weeks ago when the have a more realistic target date and would allow Ta´naiste indicated that an announcement on time to consider the proposed locations and for decentralisation was due within a day or two days civil servants to properly plan for the advent of at most. What has happened to that announce- such a move? ment? Is it being held back for the budget, as would appear to be the case? What is the Mini- Mr. Cowen: The Government’s policy on ster saying about the multi-annual envelope? The decentralisation is proceeding as planned. Minister of State kindly told the Joint Committee Despite many, such as the Deputy, claiming this on Finance and the Public Service it would cost or that will not happen, progress is constantly \800 million to accommodate the new staff and being made by the implementation group. Some that proceeds from sales would be \400 million. 3,711 Dublin based civil servants are interested Will we see a multi-annual spread of these costs in moving to new locations; that figure was 2,195 published with the budget? in July.

Mr. Cowen: Decentralisation costs were not Tax Code. part of the 2004-2008 five year multi-annual 65. Mr. Crawford asked the Minister for Fin- envelope because they had not been assessed at ance if he is satisfied all persons eligible for tax that time. Obviously, the Office of Public Works relief are receiving the relief to which they are has to take account of those costs going forward. entitled under medical relief, rent paid to private landlords, home carers and so on; and if he will Mr. R. Bruton: Are they built into the 2005 make a statement on the matter. [29925/04] Estimates? Mr. Cowen: I am advised by the Revenue Com- Mr. Cowen: The Deputy will discover on missioners that each year all PAYE taxpayers budget day what is built into the 2005 Estimates. receive a certificate of tax credits and standard 33 Other 23 November 2004. Questions 34 rate cut-off point setting out their entitlements. have claimed tax reliefs to which they are entitled This certificate is accompanied by a detailed if they spend more than a certain amount on information letter setting out the main personal medicines or on private rental? tax credits available for the year, tax rates and tax bands, exemption limits, and how to claim an Mr. Cowen: The budget summary leaflet is pre- adjustment to the tax credit certificate. pared in Irish and English. Once credits are claimed, they are in most cases automatically carried forward from year to Mr. R. Bruton: Would it help if the Depart- year to avoid the necessity to reclaim. For self- ment put the information in bright lights on the employed taxpayers, their statutory return form tax certificates sent to people in March each that is issued annually contains reference to all year? claimable reliefs and allowances. Information on the full range of reliefs is available on the Rev- Mr. Cowen: Whatever about bright lights on enue website with a range of claim forms for tax forms, we could ask the Chairman of the Rev- download and a “what’s new” section. enue Commissioners to see what could be done Revenue also provides information via the to assist. Aertel service on RTE 2, on page 451. Revenue is reminding people via media advertisements of Mr. Boyle: One tax relief which seems to have the tax relief available to taxpayers who maintain a low take-up is the standard tax rate relief on relatives or certain other persons in approved refuse charges. From 1 January 2005, with the nursing homes. Revenue is developing a system application of the polluter pays principle, seven to simplify procedures for claiming certain credits local authorities are threatening to grossly using a self-service facility via the Internet. When increase the level of charges in their areas. Has available, which is likely to be early in 2005, this the Minister made allowance for this anticipated will be advertised widely to encourage taxpayers increase and does he anticipate a greater take-up who have entitlements to various tax credits to of this relief in the next tax year? claim them. Mr. Cowen: I cannot comment on any issue that might be related to the budget Mr. R. Bruton: This matter arose from the recent visit by the Chairman of the Revenue Tax Collection. Commissioners to the Joint Committee on Fin- ance and the Public Service. I was staggered to 66. Mr. Howlin asked the Minister for Finance note how low the take-up was in medical relief, the progress made by the Revenue Commis- for example. Most people would spend at least sioners into allegations that tax improprieties \125 annually on medicine, and a family would may surround trust operations in a bank (details spend at least \250, yet only 105,000 people out supplied) in Jersey; if the Revenue has reached a of a population of 4 million claimed the relief. In determination regarding whether these trusts the private rental area there are 90,000 people facilitated tax evasion as distinct from tax avoid- claiming relief. We know from the CSO that ance; and if he will make a statement on the there are 220,000 people in rented accommo- matter. [29849/04] dation, though some of those are in local auth- Mr. Cowen: I am informed by the Revenue ority housing. Only 100,000 people claim home Commissioners that substantial progress has been carer credits. It is clear that many people are not made regarding this inquiry. Arising from a vol- claiming their entitlements so the Minister for untary disclosure programme, 254 individuals Finance and the Revenue Commissioners are came forward and made voluntary disclosures. To exacting tax which they should not be exacting. date this programme has recovered in excess of Will the Minister make a better effort to look at \105 million for the Exchequer. the particular categories where there is clear evi- Inquiries by the Revenue Commissioners have dence of under-claiming, and make it easier for identified those individuals who failed to make people to receive their entitlements? This is voluntary disclosures. They are under investi- excess taxation on many people in the low-paid gation by the investigation and prosecution div- categories in those areas. ision of the Revenue Commissioners. It is clear from some of the disclosures and the amount col- Mr. Cowen: Reliefs are made available for all lected to date that in some instances taxpayers citizens to claim and we try to make people as used trusts to facilitate tax evasion. aware as possible. There is no policy to do other- wise and the Revenue Commissioners are pro- Ms Burton: Will the Minister confirm that active in this area. Much discussion takes place there are 59 or more individuals who have not during the time of the budget and I hope that come clean to the Revenue Commissioners with will heighten awareness. After each budget the regard to these trusts? Will prosecutions follow? budget book is placed on the Department’s dedi- The Revenue Commissioners have allowed these cated website, www.budget.gov.ie. people a great deal of time in which to come clean. The Minister has acknowledged that a Mr. R. Bruton: Will the Department add a note number of them are guilty of tax evasion. How to people’s tax credit notification asking if they many are involved and will they be prosecuted? 35 Leaders’ 23 November 2004. Questions 36

Mr. Cowen: From its investigation and Leaders’ Questions. inquires, the Revenue Commissioners have iden- Mr. Kenny: Last year the Taoiseach told the tified 43 individuals holding trusts who failed to IMI: “We will keep down personal and business avail of the voluntary disclosure programme. The taxes in order to strengthen and maintain the other 85% of individuals holding offshore trusts competitive position of the Irish economy.” We availed of that programme. The action to be were told that the Government intended to taken under the tax laws is a matter for the Rev- launch an onslaught and a flood of announce- enue Commissioners, in whom I have total ments by Ministers about their plans to tackle confidence. inflation. The Taoiseach will be aware that the recent report by the National Competitiveness Written answers follow Adjournment Debate. Council was a savage indictment of the efforts of the Fianna Fa´il-Progressive Democrats Govern- Adjournment Debate Matters. ment to control inflation and implement policies which would maintain business and consumer AnLeas-Cheann Comhairle: I wish to advise costs. Ireland is now Europe’s most expensive the House of the following matters in respect of country. According to the National Competi- which notice has been given under Standing tiveness Council, decisions by Government, its Order 21 and the name of the Member in each agencies and regulators have contributed case: (1) Deputy Michael Moynihan — the refusal adversely to inflation. In other words, far from of Eircom to move poles in Lismire Village — being a solution to the problem, Government is considerable work has been ongoing by Cork part of the problem. County Council and the local community for the The Taoiseach will be aware that for business, past four years approximately and despite numer- competitiveness is not just a buzzword. Costs ous approaches and commitments Eircom has have increased, cheques must still be paid, price still not attended to this matter; (2) Deputy increases cannot be passed on, contracts are lost Haughey — the recent decree issued by President and jobs are placed in danger. The Taoiseach will Lukashenko of Belarus regarding children travel- be aware of the 27 stealth charges imposed on ling abroad for medical treatment and for rest the Irish business and consumer sector since 2002. and recuperation, and the response of the Mini- VAT has risen by 8%, ESB charges soared by ster to this; (3) Deputy O’Dowd — the Minister’s 13%, parking fees are up 25%, accident and response to the fact that BSE risk material may emergency charges have increased to \45, the have unsuspectingly entered the national food drugs refund threshold level has been raised to chain through the pipes of a Drogheda company \78 and leaving certificate examination fees have (details supplied); (4) Deputy Neville — the issue gone up to \86. In the Estimates last week, the of the primary care strategy, Mid Western Health drugs refund threshold level went up again, to Board, and the implementation project, Cois \85, accident and emergency visit charges Abhainn in west Limerick; (5) Deputy Connolly increased by \10 to \55 and inpatient stay charges — to discuss the recent closure of Barford Meats went up \10 to \55. Limited, Carrickmacross, County Monaghan, We seem to have a unique regulation where, with the loss of 82 jobs and the consequences for for instance, price increases in gas and electricity the local economy; (6) Deputy McGinley — the are allowed by the regulator on the basis that this urgent necessity to take action in regard to the will encourage competition. There have been 34 Nuvotem industry, Donegal, where 43 workers new stealth charges. Last week’s Estimates saw \ have been suspended without work for 11 weeks; 50 million being collected by means of increased (7) Deputy Burton — the spate of recent shoot- health charges. Fine Gael has been highlighting ings in west Dublin and the need for community rip-offs in Irish society over recent years and policing in the west Dublin area; (8) Deputy thousands of ordinary people have sent in their Lynch — the urgent need for Aer Lingus to stories to the relevant website. Will the Taoiseach tell the House of three tangible initiatives taken resume its cargo and courier operations due to by the Government that have helped to increase the devastating effect the suspension of these ser- Ireland’s competitiveness, which is so important vices has on Irish businesses who have to resort for our future? to purchasing seats on planes for staff to transport goods to clients; (9) Deputy O’Sullivan — the The Taoiseach: In recent years the economy need for the Minister to use his influence to has annually turned in one of the best economic ensure that children from the Chernobyl area of performances in the world. From 1997 to 2003 the Belarus can continue to come to Ireland and economy has grown by more than 8% per annum other countries for medical treatment and in real terms. These are genuine increases for the recuperation; and (10) Deputy Cowley — to ask economy and for business. For the current year the Minister if the recruitment embargo in the we expect Ireland to maintain its global economic Western Health Board on the hiring of nurses can position. The mid-term review of the economic be lifted. outlook forecast a growth of 4.7% and we might The matters raised by Deputies Cowley, even beat that. Irish GNP growth is predicted to Connolly, McGinley and O’Dowd have been rise by 4.2%, while euro area growth is predicted selected for discussion. at 1.7%. We remain one of the strongest econom- 37 Leaders’ 23 November 2004. Questions 38 ies in terms of profitability. Deputy Kenny knows any hope that there will be an end to the rapid profitability among Irish companies, both spiral of Government inspired costs? Will we see indigenous and international, is extremely strong. a situation where prices charged by Government That is what enables us to create the current level bodies will not rise more than the rate of inflation of jobs. Again this year, over 1,000 jobs are being unless there are compelling public interest created per week. The number at work has reasons? increased by almost 400,000 over recent years. Unemployment is at an historic low and employ- The Taoiseach: On the professions, we know ment creation is at an historic high. EU and Irish this is an area of high cost. The Competition inflation are at the closest point in three or four Authority, as Deputy Kenny knows, has pro- years. I would have thought the convergence of duced its interim reports for each profession and the two would have been the source of some will produce the final reports. On regulatory satisfaction. We have seen all the international reform and the concept of regulatory impact areas in which we have moved to make successful analysis on legislation and other areas, we pub- productive investment. lished a White Paper last January in which we The Competition Authority report is to keep are committed to having a thorough regulatory people on their guard so that we examine areas impact analysis on each area to ensure there are in which we can try to do better. That is the pur- no costs or inbuilt costs and that we are not doing pose of the Competition Authority. It is not to something to add regulation, red tape and tell us we are doing well and that we should do bureaucracy to our systems. That is good. In no more. Regulators do not apply stealth taxes. terms of legal fees, what the Ta´naiste has done in A stealth tax is a secret tax. The purpose of regu- insurance and what we have done in PRBI and in lators is to create a transparent position so that other areas to bring down costs is working and people can make their submissions. will continue to work. On income tax and taxes I was asked to give three examples. Our taxes generally, I could go into each area, whether it be policies actively drive our ability to create jobs corporation tax, personal tax and so on, but in and wealth. We have moved on insurance and on terms of creating employment, all are quite infrastructure on which we are spending 5% of attractive. gross domestic product, GDP, which is much On the argument we could always do better, I higher than that being spent by any other coun- will not argue with that because I always try to try. We have moved on education and on Science do better in terms of employment, growth and Foundation Ireland. Those are four or five what this country is achieving. We should not examples and I could go through each of them. always get ourselves caught up in expenditure. In education, infrastructure, Science Foundation We are spending on the productive areas of the Ireland and in other areas, we are trying to get economy which we were not able to do for years. the productive sector of the economy up and run- The reason we are spending 5% of GDP on pro- ning. I do not have to remind Deputy Kenny ductive investment is that, for generations, we where we are in a global context in that few coun- were not able to spend anything on capital pro- tries are ahead of us. grammes. On many occasions, capital pro- grammes were squeezed and reduced. We are Mr. Kenny: That is all very well but actions now able to spend on capital programmes, and speak louder than words and the reality is not that increases expenditure because one is talking what the Taoiseach outlined. For instance, the about a great deal of money. In the past six years Government’s tax policies have driven 50% of we have spent \5 billion on roads. These are sub- taxpayers into the 42% tax rate. The Forfa´s stantial increases. We have done the same in report of 2003 refers to the cutting edge of com- respect of water services, including the work done petitiveness. In organisations sponsored by the in Dublin Bay and in the west. All these works IDA and Enterprise Ireland, there were 4,000 job are costly but they are good and help the pro- losses in 2001, 8,000 in 2002 and 7,500 in 2003. ductive side of investment. We should not only These figures have not been plucked from the air look at them as a cost on public expenditure. but are identified in that Forfa´s report. The Regarding our debt-GDP ratio, I remember Taoiseach also said — it seems to be a hallmark and I know Deputy Kenny would acknowledge of his Government — that there is a policy of that, when the Maastricht figures came out in containment by spending rather than by reform 1992, we were on 120% or not far off it and were allied to spending. In other words, while the reducing it at that stage. The European model country has done very well from a number of was to get to 60%. It seemed that it would be points of view, it could have done so much better impossible for us, as part of the conditions for had the Taoiseach implemented a real policy of our entry into monetary union, to reach the 60% reform allied to good spending. target. We are now under 30%. We should not The Taoiseach made the point about tackling become fixated on the fact we are spending the professions and the uncompetitive practices money when we are reducing our debt and when which exist in that regard. When will a person be the general Government deficit and the current able to go directly to a barrister or a consultant budget deficit, EBR, are very low. We must be without being charged through the nose for a let- prudent and follow fiscal controls, and the ter of introduction? Does the Taoiseach hold out Government is doing that. To criticise us in some 39 Leaders’ 23 November 2004. Questions 40

[The Taoiseach.] There are difficulties with regard to older houses way for spending, especially on productive areas, in the State, which are not bound by new building is not a reasonable argument. regulations. The surveys indicate, however, that those difficulties can be overcome at minimum Mr. Rabbitte: Has the Taoiseach had the cost. I presume Deputy Rabbitte is not raising opportunity to examine the annual report of the this issue with regard to new houses. As he Radiological Protection Institute of Ireland, pub- knows, the greater number of houses built since lished last Thursday? The report shows yet again 1970 are governed by the new regulations, which that 200 people die of lung cancer directly attribu- take account of radon gases. This has worked table to radon gas. That is more than half the well. number of people who die in road accidents each There are no means to deal with this issue in year and we quite properly spend tens of millions regard to older houses other than by people tak- on the effort to save lives on the roads. When ing interest and advice. People are given free does the Government intend to treat deaths from advice as to how they should deal with the issue. radon gas with the same seriousness? I am not sure what more can be done. It is not a According to the Radiological Protection question of having to rebuild or restructure one’s Institute of Ireland’s report, 100,000 houses are house. I do not wish to be flippant but Deputy identified as being at risk. Counties regarded as Rabbitte is aware that these are basic issues that being high risk areas are Carlow, Kilkenny, are all centred around ventilation in the summer Waterford, Wexford, Wicklow, Clare, Galway, in particular. This is how the build-up of these Mayo and Sligo where the chances of dying are gases occurs. The solutions are not complex or one in 50 from a lifetime of exposure to radon. costly. That is twice the risk of a car accident. What does the Government plan to do about this? Mr. Rabbitte: Radon gas is the most significant, The Taoiseach will probably have read that secret and deadly killer after smoking. I do not Daniel Day-Lewis, who lived in County Wicklow, see how the Taoiseach can say that the solution fled this country. I only mention him because, as is ventilation and advice. It is exclusion pre- a fellow thespian, the Taoiseach will have sym- cautions that must be installed, not ventilation, at pathy with him as a result of the radon instance a cost of some \10,000 per unit. The cost of treat- in his house. As I said, I mention him because the ing a cancer patient could be \1 million. My col- Taoiseach would be interested in any film with league, Deputy Stagg, established a remedial the words “my left foot” in the title and may even grant scheme but the Government abolished it in audition for the next one because of the classes 1997. It is not true to say that the only solution I hear he is taking in that area. What does the to be offered is free advice and a recommend- Government intend to do to respond to the ation that doors should be kept open during the serious matters raised in the annual report of the summer. The necessity is to retrofit exclusionary Radiological Protection Institute of Ireland? precautions that will deal with this silent menace. Some 100,000 houses are at risk. This rep- The Taoiseach: I remind Deputy Rabbitte that resents a significant number of people and many the stars are coming to this country because of of those householders are unable to afford the the good tax regime, they are not flying in the cost of the measures I have described. Does the other direction. Taoiseach continue to believe that advice and recommendations to keep doors open during the Mr. Rabbitte: If we do not get rid of the gas, summer are the best we can do? Will the Govern- tax breaks will be of little use. ment re-establish the grant scheme in place until 1997, which was introduced by Deputy Stagg and The Taoiseach: I am sure Mr. Daniel Day- continued by Deputy McManus? Lewis or any other stars will have little difficulty The Taoiseach: I do not wish to be flippant. An in dealing with the remedial issues mentioned in issue is either serious or it is not. There are other the Radiological Protection Institute review. concerns in this area and asbestos is probably a It is a serious issue and has been for some more serious issue than radon gas. I believe, sub- years. The Radiological Protection Institute has ject to correction, there was a proposal about a undertaken several reviews that highlight how grant but no such grant was paid to anybody. people can take preventative measures with regard to this issue, at minimum cost to them- Mr. Stagg: The Government came into power selves. People should follow this advice. A signifi- and removed the grant. cant number of people die from the effects of radon gas. The surveys of which I have been The Taoiseach: Such a grant was never paid to aware for the past ten years have been based on anybody. It is great to have a theory but no trying to assist people through providing free money was paid out. advice on the actions they should take. A former Minister of State came to the Cabinet Mr. Stagg: Deputy Jacob removed the grant. a number of times in recent years and pointed out that most surveys showed that if people take The Taoiseach: The Radiological Protection remedial action, the problem can be eliminated. Institute has done several surveys on this and has 41 Leaders’ 23 November 2004. Questions 42 pointed out that basic issues of ventilation in old The Government has failed to provide the houses will dramatically improve the situation. resources to bring this about and it continues to do so. What genius in the Department of Justice, Mr. Stagg: Such measures will do nothing of Equality and Law Reform thought that the the kind. The Taoiseach is incorrect and his infor- people of west Dublin would believe it a solution mation is inaccurate. to throw up a few Garda checkpoints in their estates and have gardaı´ walking through the The Taoiseach: There are strict regulations estates with horses? The problem is not confined with regard to new houses. I am not simply talk- to west Dublin. My Independent colleagues rep- ing about opening the doors. It is a question of resent constituencies with many of the same proper ventilation schemes. The institute has also needs. What is required are emergency resources said that it will give advice and recommendations in education, social services and psychological to householders on how this issue can be tackled services to intervene dramatically to prevent this on an individual basis. The Department of Edu- occurrence. Provision of emergency resources in cation and Science has provided assistance in this community development to empower communi- matter to older schools, particularly through the ties to take control of their neighbourhoods is summer building scheme. I am not sure of the the key. costs involved with regard to this issue. However, How does the Government think that I am aware of the situation with regard to a Blanchardstown, a city, so to speak, of 70,000 number of old houses whereby small issues were people, can be covered by a handful of com- identified which required minor action. I am not munity gardaı´? Does the Taoiseach not realise saying there were no costs involved but the costs that what people demand is not high profile were minor. We all spend resources on the main- stunts but large numbers of community gardaı´ tenance of our homes. Such costs were not in the working side by side with local people under the order of \10,000 or \20,000. direction of local representative organisations? That is what is critically needed. I want to hear the Taoiseach’s response on this matter. The Mr. Kenny: The Taoiseach speaks as if it were position I outlined is not only the case in parts of the cost of a flower basket. Dublin, it also pertains in many neighbourhoods, cities and towns throughout the country and also Mr. J. Higgins: Can the Taoiseach explain why in rural communities. in the Ireland of 2004, which his Government has had a considerable influence in shaping, a The Taoiseach: The Deputy asked a number of number of young men are so brutalised, twisted questions, which I will answer in two ways. He and mentally damaged that they will savagely mentioned gangland killings and referred to the murder a rival gang member while his child and need for local development, social exclusion pro- partner sleep beside him under the roof of his grammes, educational programmes for the mother, as happened this week in west Dublin? disadvantaged, early intervention schemes to tar- Why will such young men savagely slaughter an get young people at risk and the need to work innocent man, a father of two, as he flees from with organisations in the statutory and voluntary them, as happened two weeks ago? How can such sectors such as Barnardos and others. The State people leave a 74 year old pensioner, Mr. William resources these organisations to help them to Barkley from Donegal, in the revolting and look after people across the system who are dys- appalling condition depicted in today’s Evening functional at an early age and to provide them Herald? Why, after almost eight years, has the with the necessary assistance for their rehabili- Taoiseach allowed a situation to develop whereby tation. Community development support pro- the brutal murder of gang members is often grammes are funded by enormous amounts of greeted by ordinary, decent people, the backbone taxpayers’ money, taxpayers being the people to of those communities, who are frustrated, angry whom the Deputy referred. In education alone and fearful, with relief that there is one less indi- this year, more than \50 million has been allo- vidual to terrorise the neighbourhood and pose a cated to provide for the educationally danger to them and their children? disadvantaged and more than \20 million has The Government policy has failed miserably to been allocated to community development pro- use the unprecedented resources available to grammes. Such programmes are targeted mainly transform those working-class neighbourhoods, at people who, as the Deputy rightly said, consti- still criminally neglected even if they are in the tute a small number of families in a small number shadow of opulent new apartment blocks and the of areas who, either through no fault of their own glass towers of major corporations. Life for many or through circumstances of being influenced by of the predominantly good people in these com- others, require that kind of assistance. Pro- munities is fraught with tension and insecurity. fessional people ranging from clinical psychol- Why has the Government failed in its policy to ogists to teachers to individuals working with engage with that cohort of young people, a small people under stress work hard in many areas. minority, who are clearly dysfunctional from an Unfortunately, my experience is that such pro- early age and represent a serious menace to their grammes do not cover the category of people who neighbourhoods and communities? wish to be involved in gangland attacks. They are 43 Resignation 23 November 2004. of Member 44

[The Taoiseach.] vide for the educationally disadvantaged. We normally groups who believe there is a way other resource various voluntary organisations which than the normal route to make it rich. They are require funding to provide for early intervention normally not dysfunctional but clever, smart and in the case of children. We are also providing not drug takers or abusers of alcohol. They are social housing and social facilities in these areas. willing to operate whatever system is necessary I agree with such measures. or to undertake themselves or through others However, we should not let all of that mask the whatever violence is necessary to make unlawful situation. There are groups of people whom the gains. Unfortunately, we have seen the results of Deputy and I know and of whom we are not some of those events. We have not seen too many proud who are gangsters, thugs and criminals and gangland killings this year. The gangland killing who do not need the help of any of these inter- over the weekend was only the second, although ventions. The Deputy rightly said that there are there have been murders in other areas. people in my area and his area who operate With the large number of gardaı´ in this country activities to make large amounts of money to compared with police forces operating in other maintain properties in Spain, Amsterdam and countries of our size, the Garda has specialist elsewhere. If we were tough enough and strong forces in these areas which are well resourced and enough, we would stand up to some of these use the modern technology available to try to people, as the Deputy does in his area and I regu- break these gangs. Deputy Joe Higgins is aware larly do in my area, but these people operate with of the feud in the area in question and that some immunity on many occasions. of the people involved, who come from different Gardaı´ do their best. My only regret, given the areas, are well known, have been involved for a number of years I have been trying to address long time and are experienced in criminal activi- this problem, is that we are so easy on these ties in this city. This is an operational matter for people. We believe that a garda going out with a the Garda which is using considerable resources book and a pencil will deal with these people and, to deal with these issues. if a garda were to hit the wrong one, he would be up before a board under the disciplinary code. Mr. J. Higgins: What confidence can the decent This is unfair to the Garda force. How in the people in the communities in this estate have that name of God can a garda with a pencil and a the Government has a solution to address these book deal with people who—— issues when the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform can glibly say that this is merely the (Interruptions). dying sting of a wasp or when in a prominent street in the Taoiseach’s constituency there is an The Taoiseach: Deputy Costello knows very open market for cocaine and heroin about which well what we are faced with. We are up against he must know? What confidence can they have hardened criminals who are not in the same cate- when a society is fostered where inequalities are gory as disadvantaged people. allowed to increase and the necessary resources are not invested in sufficient measures to provide Mr. Kehoe: The Taoiseach is in a position to for those who, for social and historic reasons, do something about that. have been left behind and, unfortunately, among a brutalised minority there emerges the kind of The Taoiseach: We are up against fairly ruth- nihilism that wreaks havoc on the community? less people. Those are the issues that need to be addressed. They will not be resolved by the equivalent of Mr. Durkan: What will be done? Operation Freeflow as we approach Christmas. That will not resolve the issues. Fundamental, The Taoiseach: I am all for helping people, but structural adjustments and emergency resources let us not be mistaken about this. We are up are required to fund grassroots community acti- against tough hardened criminals and we know vists and organisations to assist them to take con- what they are about. trol of their communities. Will the Government make those resources available? Resignation of Member. The Taoiseach: In respect of all the issues to An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: I announce for which the Deputy referred, if he were to give cre- the information of the House that I received a dit to what is being done with the resources being communication from Deputy McCreevy in regard spent, I could take him seriously and say we to his appointment as a member of the Com- should do more, and I would not oppose that. mission of European Community and to advise The Deputy is aware that we invest tens of mil- the House that Deputy McCreevy, having lions of taxpayers’ money in local development become a member of the Commission, ceased to social inclusion programmes. We invest enor- be a Member of Da´il E´ ireann on Monday, 22 mous amounts in community development sup- November 2004. port programmes. We have invested almost \100 million in the young people’s facilities and ser- Mr. Rabbitte: I still remember him, but nobody vices fund. Resources are being invested to pro- on the Government benches does. 45 Order of 23 November 2004. Business 46

The Taoiseach: We wish him well. closure in the Sunday Independent and Irish Inde- pendent newspapers relating to allegations of Requests to move Adjournment of Da´il under energy price hiking to the effect that gas and elec- Standing Order 31. tricity prices are being regulated upward and in such a way as to impact negatively on industrial An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: Before coming to and domestic consumers and to the detriment of the Order of Business, I propose to deal with a the competitiveness of the economy. number of notices under Standing Order 31 and will call on the Deputies in the order in which An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: Having con- they submitted their notices to my office. sidered the matters raised, I do not consider them to be in order under Standing Order 31. Mr. Crawford: I seek the adjournment of the Da´il under Standing Order 31 to debate the fol- Order of Business. lowing urgent matter: the ongoing crisis in the psychiatric services where funding is inadequate The Taoiseach: It is proposed to take No. 10, and people needing individual care, such as my motion re proposed approval by Da´il E´ ireann of neighbour and friend who failed to get adequate the amendments to the Convention establishing help which led to his suicide, do not get the care the European Telecommunications Satellite they need. Organisation (back from committee); No. 11, motion re proposed approval by Da´il E´ ireann of Mr. Neville: I seek the adjournment of the Da´il the amendments to the Convention for the estab- to discuss the following issue of urgent national lishment of the European Radiocommunications importance: the study of Bodywhys, which high- Office and the ratification of the instrument lights the lack of services for people with eating amending the ERO Convention (back from disorders and the particularly inadequate services committee); No. 20, Council of Europe Develop- for children and adolescents with such disorders. ment Bank Bill 2004 — Order for Report and Report and Final Stages; and No. 3, Health Bill Mr. Connolly: I seek the adjournment of the 2004 — Order for Second Stage and Second Da´il under Standing Order 31 to discuss the fol- Stage. It is proposed, notwithstanding anything in lowing matter of urgent public and national con- Standing Orders, that (1) the Da´il shall sit later cern: a comprehensive review of the Irish driving than 8.30 p.m. tonight and business shall be inter- test system with a view to reducing unacceptable rupted not later than 10.30 p.m.; and (2) Nos. 10 year-long waiting lists and the 51% failure rate, and 11 shall be decided without debate. Private and improving driving standards to reduce the Members’ Business shall be No. 43, motion re ongoing road accident carnage. roads infrastructure

Dr. Cowley: I seek the adjournment of the Da´il An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: There are two under Standing Order 31 to raise a matter of proposals to put to the House. Is the proposal for national importance: the failure of Government dealing with the late sitting agreed? to sanction a sports hall for Davitt College, Castlebar, County Mayo while 11 other projects Mr. Kenny: Fine Gael will not accept a guillo- have been brought forward ahead of it. The pro- tine of the Health Bill 2004. This is a fundamental ject is on the priority list and is being sought for Bill which will reform the health services and the past 25 years. every Member will want to contribute to the debate. Mr. Allen: I seek the adjournment of the Da´il under Standing Order 31 to discuss the elections Mr. Rabbitte: I must oppose the late sitting in the Ukraine, which have been described by because it is the only mechanism available to me observers as the most fraudulent ever held in to ask the Taoiseach to explain why he switched Europe. the Health Bill and the Irish Nationality and Citizenship Bill. The Government has been Mr. Deenihan: I seek the adjournment of the promising the Health Bill for 18 months. It is sup- Da´il under Standing Order 31 to raise a matter posed to provide for major reform of the health of urgent importance: the crisis in the accident service. The Bill was published on Friday, most and emergency department at Kerry General Deputies will have received it in their pigeon Hospital, Tralee, which is now the most under- holes yesterday and it has been brought forward staffed accident and emergency department in from Wednesday to Tuesday. Why is that the country; and the urgency for funding to be happening? allocated to provide a new accident and emer- The Minister for Health and Children, when gency unit in Tralee to replace the existing unit, she was on this side of the House, would have which will be expected to deal with 30,000 worked herself up into incredible lucidity if this patients in 2005. kind of thing had happened. She is now bringing forward yellow pack medical cards. Patients will Mr. Durkan: I seek the adjournment of the soon be expected to make do with half a bed; or House under Standing Order 31 to discuss a will the Minister put two patients into one bed? matter of vital national interest: the recent dis- This Bill is her major effort. She is the one who 47 Order of 23 November 2004. Business 48

[Mr. Rabbitte.] Ms McManus: A Leas-Cheann Comhairle, may pledged that there should be two weeks between I raise a point of order? publication of a Bill and its being debated in the House. Why the change? An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: I call Deputy The first schedule for this week had the Irish McManus on a point of order. Nationality and Citizenship Bill for debate today, on which there would have been a number of Ms McManus: It is wrong for the Taoiseach to votes. That schedule was agreed by the Whips at mislead the House. He has misled the House and the Whips’ meeting. Then, without any notice, he will continue to do so unless he is stopped. He the Government changed the schedule to bring has no right to say what he has—— forward the Health Bill, on which there will not be any vote. The least the House is entitled to An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: That is not a know is why the Government made that change point of order. and why one of the most major pieces of legis- lation being advanced by the Government, on its Ms McManus: He has no right to say what he own claim, is to be guillotined on Friday. has said because it is not true.

Mr. Sargent: It is alarming to hear the Health An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: That is not a Bill is to be guillotined. The late sitting notwith- point of order. standing, this decision must be reversed. The Bill, apart from being brought quite suddenly to our Ms McManus: If it is not a point of order I am attention for debate with limited time to prepare, not sure what I am doing here. It is wrong for the is an issue which reaches far beyond the Minister Taoiseach to say what he has just said. for Health and Children. It relates to the way the Government has forced an economic policy Mr. Quinn: It is a lie. which has disimproved the health of the people of the country. God help those who need hospital An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: The word “lie” attention on the back of that. There is a need to should not be used. address the Government’s responsibility for so much of the deteriorating health of the country Ms McManus: Members received the Bill yes- and the way that deterioration is compounded by terday morning and 36 hours later we are to the Government’s failure to provide the facilities debate it in the House. to address the health problems when they arise. The debate will not be given the breadth and length it needs. The Government is trying to close An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: As I have pointed down the debate because it would be damning for out, that is not a point of order. it to hear the facts of this matter. Recent research shows ever more clearly how the Government has Ms McManus: On behalf of the people I rep- disimproved the health of the country. This resent, I ask why the Bill has been brought for- matter needs further debate and action. ward to today.

Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in: I object to the guillot- An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: The Chair has ining of the Second Stage of the Health Bill on called on the Deputy to resume her seat. I call Friday. I do not know whether it is an accident the Taoiseach. or can be attributed to the change in Chief Whip, but there have been very few votes on the Order The Taoiseach: I will try to answer the ques- of Business in this sitting. This is because there tions put by Deputies Rabbitte and Sargent. May has been an acceptance by the Government that I do so without interruption? guillotines are not appropriate and are not Over the past 18 months, however, the Govern- acceptable to the House, particularly of substan- ment has indicated that it is a major priority to tial and substantive legislation such as the Health implement the health service reform programme. Bill. The Bill is the wrong remedy for the wrong Therefore, it intends that, on 1 January 2005, the problem because it seeks merely to make bureau- Health Service Executive will take over the man- cratic changes to the health service and does not agement of the health service from the health deal with the real reforms the public need and for boards and the Eastern Regional Health Auth- which they are crying out. ority. The Government discussed this legislation I join colleagues in opposing the Order of Busi- last week and I understand that Deputy ness as presented. The Government is reintroduc- McManus received a copy of it after the Govern- ing the guillotine and making a totally inappropri- ment meeting last week. ate proposal. Ms McManus: Yes, I got it but none of my col- The Taoiseach: The Government published its leagues received it until yesterday. health reform programme 18 months ago. The changes of the Health Service Executive have The Taoiseach: I understand you got a copy of been in the public domain since then. it last Tuesday. 49 Order of 23 November 2004. Business 50

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: The Taoiseach Mr. Allen: That is not the reason. should address his remarks through the Chair. The Taoiseach: The Whips were informed. Ms McManus: I got it but nobody else in my party did, and I only got a draft, I did not get a Mr. Stagg: They were not informed. copy of the Bill. The Taoiseach: They were informed yesterday. The Taoiseach: Deputy McManus is the spokesperson so I presume she briefed her Mr. Rabbitte: The Taoiseach should tell us party’s Deputies. the truth.

Mr. Rabbitte: There are several Deputies to The Taoiseach: It is our responsibility—— contribute. Mr. Sherlock: It is leading to a dictatorship. Ms McManus: I ask the Taoiseach to recognise what is happening here. Members of the House The Taoiseach: If giving more time to a Bill is other than Opposition spokespeople did not dictatorship, that is a new type of dictatorship. receive the Bill until yesterday. I only got a copy of the full Bill yesterday. Before that I got a draft, Ms McManus: The Taoiseach is not giving a photocopy more time for the Bill.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: The Deputy has An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: The Taoiseach is made her point. She should resume her seat and in possession. allow the Taoiseach to continue his reply. The Taoiseach: I am not much in possession as Ms McManus: We are being asked to debate this is the third time Deputy McManus has inter- this Bill today. We were promised it would be on rupted me. However, at least it is giving me an the Order of Business for tomorrow. Why has it opportunity to state that the Deputy has had the been scheduled for today? Bill for over a week and she has had the pro- posals for 18 months. If Deputies are asking me An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: The Taoiseach to withdraw the Bill today and to take it only should be allowed to proceed with his reply. tomorrow and Friday, we can look at that.

Mr. J. Brady: They all want to see change. Mr. Allen: The Taoiseach withdrew Bills before. The Taoiseach: I thought the last thing I would have to do is defend starting discussion on the The Taoiseach: If, however, Deputies want to Bill today, so that we would deal with it today, have it debated today, tomorrow and Friday, we tomorrow and Friday. will go on to Committee Stage next week and Report and Final Stages the following week, and Mr. Rabbitte: No, we can deal with it it will be in the Seanad right up to the Christmas tomorrow. recess. I have repeatedly explained to the House that this is an urgent Bill and, so that it would not The Taoiseach: Do people want less time to be complex, we took out the entire section on the debate the Bill? information and quality issues. We undertook to take those in a separate Bill in the spring session. Mr. Rabbitte: The Taoiseach should tell the How many concessions on a Bill do I have to House why he switched it. make?

The Taoiseach: That is why we are having it Question proposed: “That the proposal for today, tomorrow and Friday. dealing with the late sitting be agreed.”

The Da´il divided: Ta´, 66; Nı´l, 56.

Ta´

Ahern, Bertie. Cassidy, Donie. Ahern, Michael. Collins, Michael. Ahern, Noel. Cowen, Brian. Andrews, Barry. Cregan, John. Ardagh, Sea´n. Cullen, Martin. Blaney, Niall. Curran, John. Brady, Johnny. Davern, Noel. Brady, Martin. de Valera, Sı´le. Brennan, Seamus. Dempsey, Noel. Browne, John. Dempsey, Tony. Callanan, Joe. Dennehy, John. Callely, Ivor. Devins, Jimmy. Carey, Pat. Ellis, John. 51 Order of 23 November 2004. Business 52

Ta´—continued

Finneran, Michael. O´ Cuı´v, E´ amon. Fox, Mildred. O´ Fearghaı´l, Sea´n. Hanafin, Mary. O’Connor, Charlie. Harney, Mary. O’Dea, Willie. Haughey, Sea´n. O’Donnell, Liz. Healy-Rae, Jackie. O’Flynn, Noel. Hoctor, Ma´ire. O’Keeffe, Batt. Jacob, Joe. O’Keeffe, Ned. Kelleher, Billy. O’Malley, Fiona. Kelly, Peter. O’Malley, Tim. Killeen, Tony. Parlon, Tom. Kirk, Seamus. Power, Peter. Kitt, Tom. Power, Sea´n. Lenihan, Brian. Roche, Dick. McEllistrim, Thomas. Smith, Brendan. McGuinness, John. Smith, Michael. Martin, Michea´l. Treacy, Noel. Moynihan, Donal. Walsh, Joe. Moynihan, Michael. Woods, Michael. Nolan, M.J. Wright, G.V.

Nı´l

Allen, Bernard. McGrath, Finian. Boyle, Dan. McGrath, Paul. Broughan, Thomas P. McManus, Liz. Bruton, Richard. Mitchell, Olivia. Burton, Joan. Morgan, Arthur. Connaughton, Paul. Moynihan-Cronin, Breeda. Connolly, Paudge. Naughten, Denis. Costello, Joe. Neville, Dan. Crawford, Seymour. Noonan, Michael. Cuffe, Ciara´n. O´ Caola´in, Caoimhghı´n. Deenihan, Jimmy. O´ Snodaigh, Aengus. Durkan, Bernard J. O’Shea, Brian. English, Damien. O’Sullivan, Jan. Enright, Olwyn. Penrose, Willie. Ferris, Martin. Perry, John. Gilmore, Eamon. Quinn, Ruairi. Gormley, John. Rabbitte, Pat. Gregory, Tony. Ryan, Eamon. Hayes, Tom. Ryan, Sea´n. Healy, Seamus. Sargent, Trevor. Higgins, Joe. Sherlock, Joe. Higgins, Michael D. Shortall, Ro´ isı´n. Hogan, Phil. Stagg, Emmet. Howlin, Brendan. Stanton, David. Kehoe, Paul. Timmins, Billy. Kenny, Enda. Twomey, Liam. Lynch, Kathleen. Upton, Mary. McGinley, Dinny. Wall, Jack.

Tellers: Ta´, Deputies Kitt and Kelleher; Nı´l, Deputies Kehoe and Stagg.

Question declared carried. the meeting of the Cabinet sub-committee deal- ing with the Aer Lingus issue, he wished every- An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: Is the proposal body here would become involved in as inclusive for dealing with Nos. 10 and 11 without debate a debate as possible. In that sense the representa- agreed to? Agreed. tives of the rest of the House, including those from the Fianna Fa´il Party, do not have sight of Mr. Kenny: I hope the Taoiseach and his fellow the Goldman Sachs report with its ten recom- Ministers will achieve further progress in tomor- mendations. If we are to have an inclusive debate, row’s discussions with the leader of the DUP, the in which all stakeholders in this business are to Reverend Ian Paisley, and the British Prime involve themselves, could the report not be pub- Minister in London tomorrow. While I am some- lished or at least its recommendations made avail- what disappointed that we did not have the able to us? This will allow everybody with an opportunity to have a debate on the matter interest in the matter to understand the options beforehand, I can understand its sensitivity. I being discussed by the Cabinet sub-committee. hope all goes well at that meeting. In respect of the announcement being made I take the words of the Minister for Transport today by the absent Minister for Justice, Equality to heart, when he said yesterday that, following and Law Reform about the new traffic corps, can 53 Order of 23 November 2004. Business 54 we take it that adequate facilities will be made The Taoiseach: I made no statements at the available to train these people and that they will weekend about Aer Lingus. Last week I thanked be sufficiently resourced both in communications the management, the board and the workers in equipment and high visibility vehicles to allow Aer Lingus. them to do their jobs? Will this require legislation and if so when will we see it? Mr. Sargent: The Taoiseach might meet the former management of Aer Lingus since it has The Taoiseach: I thank the Deputy for his com- arisen that there was not even a meeting between ments on the talks. I still cannot be certain how them. That is a strange way to show appreciation this will move into a debate. As the Deputy has for work done. Once the Government has dis- said, our difficulty is that we are in different levels cussed the Goldman Sachs report, will it let us of the debate. However, I have tried to brief all know when we can debate this issue? the parties over the weekend. I had a long meet- I wish the Taoiseach well in his discussions with ing yesterday with the SDLP and we have also the parties and the British Prime Minister in talked to the other parties. While we have not Downing Street. On promised legislation and a given them the documents we have tried to brief matter involving the Department of Foreign them as much as we can. There is not much to say Affairs, President Lukashenko of Belarus has beyond what I said here during Question Time. stated that he will not allow children who have Depending on what happens in coming days, I radiation sickness and who have been affected by will keep the issue of the debate under review. I the Chernobyl disaster to travel to Ireland for the again confirm I will meet Dr. Paisley, the DUP medical treatment and clean food they need. Is and Sinn Fe´in before we have the meeting and the Taoiseach taking any steps to address this then we will see where we move, but I do not matter? It is straightforward from a humanitarian expect tomorrow to bring a conclusion to this point of view. He could allay the fears of the Pres- issue. It will move on from there. ident of Belarus and ensure these children do not The Cabinet discussed the second matter fol- suffer further as a result of that tragedy in 1986. lowing the meeting of the Cabinet sub-commit- The subject could be discussed under the diplo- tee. The Cabinet sub-committee decided we matic relations and immunities (amendment) Bill would publish the Goldman Sachs report. but addressing this should not require legislation.

Mr. Cullen: It will be available on the website. The Taoiseach: I will bring that matter to the attention of the Minister for Foreign Affairs. The Taoiseach: We will put it on the website as ´ ´ soon as possible and then issue the documents, if Mr. Durkan: Will the Bord Gais Eireann Bill we have any documents on the matter. We made and the electricity Bill be brought before the a commitment on the traffic corps in An Agreed House or published and circulated as soon as Programme for Government. The Minister for possible, given the recent references to price Justice, Equality and Law Reform set out the hikes in energy, to give Members an idea of the time-table from the strategic review today, point- Government’s thinking in the area? ing out the changes that will lead to the enforce- The Taoiseach: The Bord Ga´is E´ ireann Bill ment of traffic law. The number of gardaı´ dedi- will be before the House next year. I do not have cated to this task will rise from 500 today to 1,200, a date for the electricity Bill, although its heads more than doubling the number enforcing road have been approved and it is being drafted. traffic law in every possible way. I will raise the other issues about training with the Minister. Mr. Quinn: What is causing the delay with the introduction of the building control Bill, which Mr. Rabbitte: I also wish the Taoiseach well in deals with radon gas among other things? Can it his discussions in Downing Street tomorrow. be prioritised? Will primary legislation be necessary to Has the Government had a chance to consider implement the yellow pack medical cards? If so, the timing of the referendum to ratify the Euro- when will that legislation be brought before the pean constitution? The British Government is House? Is the interpretation placed at the week- likely to have that referendum in spring 2006 and end on the Taoiseach’s denunciation of the Aer it is desirable that we have our referendum before Lingus management correct, that the Govern- that. There are limited numbers of windows for ment has reversed direction and will retain Aer running it so will the Taoiseach indicate his Lingus in public ownership? thoughts on the matter?

The Taoiseach: The substantial increase in The Taoiseach: The heads of the building con- medical cards above the increase in the limit for trol Bill have been approved for some time and those currently on medical cards will require it is scheduled for mid 2005. legislation. On the referendum, a spring 2006 referendum is the probable preference of the British Govern- Ms McManus: The Taoiseach is misleading the ment, although it is not final. There will probably House, they are not medical cards and he knows be an election before then. It is advisable for us that, they are yellow pack cards. to hold our referendum before then, although we 55 Council of Europe Development Bank 23 November 2004. Bill 2004: Report and Final Stages 56

[The Taoiseach.] European Conventions: Motions. have not decided on a date. We are, however, Minister of State at the Department of the looking at the steps we must take to ensure every- Taoiseach (Mr. Kitt): I move: thing moves in time. We want to spend as much time as we can ensuring the preparatory work is That Da´il E´ ireann approves the amend- done ments, approved in May 1999 by the Assembly of Parties of the European Telecommunica- Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in: I join other Members tions Satellite Organisation, to the convention in wishing well all who wish to see a satisfactory establishing the European Telecommunica- and sustainable resolution of the current talks tions Satellite Organisation, which originally engagement. If agreement is reached, does the entered into force in September 1985, copies of which, including the amendments, were laid Taoiseach envisage a peace dividend for the before Da´il E´ ireann on 27 October 2004. southern Border counties of Donegal, Sligo, Leitrim, Cavan, Monaghan and Louth, given that over the period since the Good Friday Agree- Question put and agreed to. ment, the expected peace dividend has not materialised and many of the services and public Minister of State at the Department of the supports people had have been taken away? Does Taoiseach (Mr. Kitt): I move: the Taoiseach envisage a serious package of sup- That Da´il E´ ireann approves the amend- ports and a keen bent towards those counties in ments, adopted at Copenhagen on 9 April 2002 light of any advance in the near future? by the Council of the European Radio- communications Office at its 14th ordinary The Taoiseach: There is no legislation planned meeting, to the convention for the establish- for this area and we must wait to see if we can ment of the European Radiocommunications conclude the comprehensive settlement to look at Office, ERO, The Hague 1993, and approves issues that surround it. There are no proposals the ratification of the instrument amending the in the area but the Government continues to put ERO Convention which was signed by the Irish significant resources into the Border, midland ambassador to Denmark, subject to ratifica- and west, BMW, region to help economic tion, in Copenhagen on 17 December 2002; development in those regions. In our multi- copies of the convention, including the amend- annual and capital programmes, large amounts of ments, and an attached copy of the instrument of ratification were laid before Da´il E´ ireann on resources are dedicated to assisting in that region. 27 October 2004. Mr. Kehoe: When will the criminal justice Bill come before the House? Question put and agreed to.

The Taoiseach: The Criminal Justice Council of Europe Development Bank Bill 2004: (International Co-operation) Bill will be taken in Order for Report Stage. this session. The heads of the criminal justice Minister of State at the Department of Finance (miscellaneous provisions) Bill are expected (Mr. Parlon): I move: “That Report Stage be before Christmas and the Bill will be introduced taken now.” in the new year. We are also working on a crimi- nal justice (protection of confidential Question put and agreed to. information) Bill for next year but the criminal justice (miscellaneous provisions) Bill will be the Council of Europe Development Bank Bill 2004: first before the House. Report and Final Stages. Mr. Howlin: On the Council of Europe An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: Amendment No. Development Bank Bill, which supports Belarus, 1 is in the name of Deputy Burton. Amendment has there been any communication with the Pres- Nos. 2 to 6, inclusive, are related. Amendments ident of Belarus? There is concern at the No. 1 to 6, inclusive, will be taken together. assertion that children who have come here for treatment will no longer be allowed to do it. Ms Burton: I move amendment No. 1: Before we debate the Bill, will the Taoiseach In page 3, line 14, after “text” to insert “in indicate the Government view and if it has been the English language”. made known through the European Union or These amendments are largely technical in nature directly to the Government of Belarus? and self-explanatory. The first amendment is to provide for a statement that the text is in the The Taoiseach: The Minister for Foreign English language. Council of Europe Bills are Affairs was not involved in this issue today but normally in both French and English. the Department has made contact. I will ask for Amendment No. 2 is also for tidying up pur- a note to let the Deputies Howlin and Sargent poses. In the context of the Government donating know what progress has been made. to the Council of Europe Development Bank, it 57 Council of Europe Development Bank 23 November 2004. Bill 2004: Report and Final Stages 58 is important, given that in last week’s Estimates Minister of State feels free to cast aspersions on it walked away from its commitment as regards organisations such as Tro´ caire, Concern and overseas development assistance. These amend- Oxfam. It is a shameful act by this Government ments are appropriate on Report Stage, given the and it is a pity that Deputy O’Donnell is not here subsequent disgraceful attack by the Minister of to participate in this brief comment on the State with responsibility for overseas develop- Council of Europe Development Bank Bill. ment, Deputy Conor Lenihan, on the aid agencies such as Tro´ caire and Concern. This attack was Mr. R. Bruton: I join Deputy Burton in point- crude and intemperate and indicated, on the ing out the complete hypocrisy of solemnly com- Minister of State’s part, probably complete lack mitting at the UN to deliver 0.7% of GNP by of knowledge as regards the work of development 2007 and reneging on that in a year when the agencies, particularly in the poorest and most dis- Exchequer’s revenue intake has never been tressed parts of Europe. The House has just stronger. In the past 12 months the Government heard a reference to the evolving situation in has succeeded in collecting the equivalent of Belarus, which may affect the capacity of the \3,000 for every household in the country, over Chernobyl charity, and people such as Ms Adi and above what it raised the year before. It has Roche, to continue the inestimable work they turned around, on the back of such a revenue per- have done on behalf of children suffering from formance, and told the poorest of the world that the aftermath of the 1986 nuclear disaster. Ireland cannot honour its commitments. This is In the context of the Government agreeing to wrong. What value are we to put on the solemn make a commitment to the European Develop- promises of the Taoiseach if, even in good times, ment Bank, this calls into question its lack of he cannot honour that commitment? The Mini- imagination as regards the standing of develop- ster of State, I am sure will answer, as the Mini- ment money. The excuse given for the Taoiseach ster for Finance has done already, by asserting walking away from the solemn commitment he that Ireland is seventh in the world in terms of made before UN and other bodies as regards development aid and say that \65 million is com- reaching the overseas development assistance tar- mitted over the next two years. That is true, but get of 0.7%, was that the agencies and the the whole point of the Taoiseach’s statement was Department of Foreign Affairs were unable to that Ireland was to lead the field. It was to spend the money. The Minister of State also indi- become one of only two countries that would cated this here today. Here we have a blank honour this commitment. We were going to try to cheque being sent to the European Development lead by example and bring others with us. It is Bank. Unlike our experience with the aid agen- reneging on a solemn principle and this is not cies and the bilateral programme of the Depart- acceptable. ment of Foreign Affairs, I do not know whether There are red herrings about the extent to every penny of this \13 million commitment to which we can stand over this current initiative the European Development Bank can be and assertions to the effect that this money will accounted for. The Minister expects us to rubber be well spent. I also read over the weekend that stamp an initiative for the European Develop- the World Food Programme is looking for \1 ment Bank on which there is precious little billion to try to deal with world hunger and it is detailed accountability while his colleague, the not getting the contributions. If there is money newly appointed Minister of State at the Depart- surplus to what is committed to existing pro- ment of Foreign Affairs is free to cast aspersions grammes, why not put it towards the world on organisations such as Tro´ caire, Concern and hunger programme, so that this body, which is Oxfam in order to bolster the naked and shame- doing vital work to save lives on a day by day ful turnaround the Taoiseach did in walking away basis, can deliver on its programmes. I find it hard from Ireland’s ODA commitment. to explain to people who ask me why this was In the Estimates last week the commitment done and why this decision was made. We all made to annual increases over the next two years know that gross domestic product, GDP, and as well as in the forthcoming Estimate were such GNP grow. They are not stationary targets. Even that if adhered to, unless our growth in gross by the end of 2007 we will not be at 0.5%, as national product, GNP, collapses, not only will Deputy Burton said. All the predictions are that we undershoot the 0.7% target, but we will we will be short of that. We will only have made almost definitely be below the new target of 0.5% a small headway towards the target. Only in one . The commitments made are nonsensical in terms year — the year after the commitment was made of meeting even the anticipated growth projec- — when we were looking for a position on the tions for the Irish economy given by the ESRI Security Council, was a realistic effort made to and other bodies for 2005-07. In moving my honour the commitment. Every other year there amendment I deeply regret that it follows in the have been only token gestures. We need to take context of the shameful reneging by an Irish ourselves and our promises more seriously than Government, having hawked the commitment has been exhibited in this case. I am extremely around the world at the UN and other places to disappointed. I welcome the Bill. It is timely that gain votes for Ireland. The Government is now the Government supports the work of this Bill. I offering to write a blank cheque for the European have no general comments on any of the amend- Development Bank, while at the same time the ments proposed on Report Stage. 59 Council of Europe Development Bank 23 November 2004. Bill 2004: Report and Final Stages 60

Mr. Boyle: Deputy Burton referred to an issue to say that internationally this does not represent of great importance, that of subsequently best practice. We should use the mechanism of reporting back to this House on the activities of our membership of this bank to ask whether the the Council of Europe Development Bill. In var- development that will occur in Belarus as a result ious agreements with international finance agen- of accessing funds from this bank — our member- cies there is a requirement for the Minister for ship of the bank is comparable with the making Finance to table such reports. I have in mind the of diktats of this type — will affect the benefit to International Monetary Fund, IMF, and the which young people from Belarus, Ukraine and World Bank in particular. While those reports are other countries in the region are entitled, which often not what they should be in terms of passing they have received previously. on information, at least there is a mechanism for Will the Minister of State say how the Govern- reporting back to this House. I ask the Minister ment will report back to the Da´il in future on of State to state whether such a mechanism will how the Council of Europe Development Fund is exist for this in the future? doing its work, how we can respond in future and It is obvious that the Government has been specific issues occurring in Belarus? I hope for guilty of gross hypocrisy in the area of develop- some defence on what is an unacceptable position ment aid. As of now, 0.39% of GNP is given to on overseas development aid but I may be living overseas development aid, which is well short of in hope of receiving an adequate response in the 0.7% target promised by the Taoiseach, most that area. recently in Johannesburg. Even if one takes into account the \60 million increase projected this Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in: I welcome that we year and the \130 million projected for the next have reached Report and Final Stages of the Bill two years, it is likely that the 0.5% figure will not and I will support its passage. I welcome Deputy be reached either, given the projected levels of Burton’s amendments and join in her presen- economic growth. The figure in 2007 is likely to tation of them, as we did on Committee Stage. be no greater than 0.44% or 0.45% of GNP. That On the broad areas addressed by colleagues, it is is the summit of the Government’s ambition on important to reflect on the backdrop to the Bill, overseas development aid. We are moving from a which was introduced following the end of the current figure of 0.39% to 0.44%. We are talking Second World War. Both the Council of Europe about a significant fund in ODA of well over and the Council of Europe Development Bank \400 million and up to \500 million and \600 are facing a very different set of circumstances million by 2007. today from those in the late 1940s on their estab- However when the Band Aid Foundation lishment. We have to recognise that we are facing asked for a VAT rebate on DVD and CD sales a very changed position in our country. Through- of its charity record which will be released at out Europe reactionary politics are holding sway, Christmas, the Government chose to respond not where fortress Europe is the image that is by giving a VAT rebate but by taking \1 million presented and is the reality for many of those for from the development assistance budget and giv- whom the Council of Europe Development Bank ing it to the Band Aid budget regardless of how Bill might address the problems and difficulties that money has been allocated. One can under- they would experience coming here and to other stand the reason we on this side, and many out- European countries. side, are utterly cynical about the Government’s The situation here has changed because we are attitude to overseas development aid. That is an in the post referendum period, the citizenship ref- attitude that can translate not only into develop- erendum having been adopted by the people last ment aid but across a myriad of charities and vol- June. That is one of the more regrettable untary organisations requesting particular action decisions the Irish people have taken in recent on the way they are treated for VAT repayment years. This does not auger well for the policies purposes. the European Council has set itself to improve I wish to raise the issue of Belarus, a matter community relations, encourage tolerance and that was raised on the Order of Business. Belarus guarantee the rights, including social rights, of is significant in the context of this Bill because it immigrants irrespective of what category they is likely that it will be one of the countries seeking may have attributed to them by their country of funds from the Council of Europe Development choice. Bank and will be accessing such funds to develop I would look with interest at the prospects of badly needed infrastructure. The Taoiseach has the polices being out-worked and supported given an indication that he will seek a statement through the European Council Development from the Department of Foreign Affairs on what Bank in the coming weeks, months and years. is being done. Ireland has given more per capita Certainly it is a laudable pursuit, but I do not than any other country towards alleviating the know how it will translate in real terms. The stress and suffering caused by the Chernobyl dis- recent upsurge in racially motivated attacks and aster in 1986. When the head of Government in utterances indicate a tremendous need for the that region says that in future young people Council of Europe and the Council of Europe cannot come to Ireland to receive medical assist- Development Bank to focus on matters in Ireland ance or for rest and recuperation, from which in regard to our attitudes to indigenous people on they have benefited for the past 18 years, we need this island as well as those new brothers and sis- 61 Council of Europe Development Bank 23 November 2004. Bill 2004: Report and Final Stages 62 ters in our respective communities. There is much regarding overseas aid, as published in the about which to be concerned. It is appropriate to Estimates: appeal for a revisitation of the decision on Irish It is incomprehensible that our Government children who will not have the opportunity to has taken credit internationally for something enjoy equal rights of citizenship and nationality it will not now deliver on. In a world where 1.2 with those of us who have been able to enjoy our billion people live on less than $1 a day and birthright in Ireland. There are some 11,000 chil- where 8,000 people die of AIDS each day, dren in this category. I appeal to the Minister of Ireland is failing to live up to its promise. State and the Ta´naiste, who has joined him in the House, to consider seriously the terrible anguish, This failure brings shame on each and every one suffering and pain of uncertainty that many of us, which is very sad indeed. I hope that the families are experiencing throughout this juris- Minister of State, Deputy Parlon, and the Mini- diction as a consequence of their loss of the right ster for Health and Children, Deputy Harney, as to remain here. Moreover, they should consider representatives of their party, will recognise that the terrible vista that will present itself if this a former Minister of State from their party was country continues to deport Irish children to an enthusiastic exponent of the commitment other jurisdictions. How will those children, their regarding overseas development aid. It is regret- extended families and the wider communities in table that their partners in Government are now which they will grow and, I hope, flourish regard failing in this regard. this country in the future when they look back at the way Ireland, the country of their birth, closed Acting Chairman (Mr. Sherlock): We are on its door on them? Such circumstances are absol- amendment No. 1. utely abhorrent and a revisitation of those cases that existed prior to the June referendum is cer- Minister of State at the Department of Finance tainly required. We should extend an open and (Mr. Parlon): The Acting Chairman could be for- welcoming hand to these children, their parents given for forgetting the business of the House. and siblings. What better time than the month of We are dealing with amendments to the Bill, with Christmas for the Minister of State, Deputy which I want to deal. Parlon, and his colleagues to exercise themselves in this regard instead of closing the door on and Acting Chairman: I referred to amendment banishing to a stable elsewhere people who No. 1, in the name of Deputy Burton, and others should be able to find an opportunity to be nur- related thereto, but the Minister of State made tured and nourished in this, the land of their no move to speak on them. birth? Like my colleagues, I am deeply disappointed Mr. Parlon: I apologise to the Acting Chair- by the commentary of the Minister of State, man. I remind the House that we are dealing with Deputy Conor Lenihan, on overseas develop- amendments to the Council of Europe Develop- ment aid. The exercise of criticising the aid agen- ment Bank Bill. We have dealt with many other cies’ use of ODA funding for advocacy is incred- issues. When we took Committee Stage of the ible. In other words, he is criticising the aid Bill, the same amendments were tabled but, organisations’ use of funding in raising awareness unfortunately, Deputy Burton was not present. I of the needs of the Third World and the need for oppose the amendments as I consider those refer- justice and human rights universally. I strongly ring to “the English language” to be unnecessary. reject his commentary and feel it was totally inap- If the intention was to emphasise that the text is propriate. However, it was coming on the tail of in English and French, it was not necessary as the the Government’s significant indication of its text in English is the official text of the document. intent not to proceed with what was a clear prom- If the intention was to indicate that the text is not ise, made a number of years ago, to ensure that in Irish, it must be noted that the Bill, as drafted, we would reach the target of allocating 0.7% of will facilitate the translation of the official text gross national product, GNP, for overseas of the agreement into Irish. The amendment, as development aid by 2007. proposed, would mean that when the Bill, as The budget has yet to be presented but it is not passed, is translated, the only text that could be too late to ensure, over the week remaining used would be the English text. The drafting in before its presentation on 1 December, that a this regard is consistent with similar legislation. change of heart be brought to bear on this issue The other textual amendments are a matter of and that we have a restoration in that budget of style and I am satisfied that the current drafting the proposed annual increases to 2007, thereby is appropriate. realising a commitment that I understood had the I welcome the support in the House for over- support of all political opinion in this House. seas development aid but the comments that were Clearly, the commitment no longer has such sup- made in this regard are not relevant to this Bill. port. Let me conclude with the words of Hans Our contributions to the Council of Europe Zomer, spokesperson of Do´ chas, the umbrella Development Bank are new and additional to our group of 34 Irish aid agencies that has, quite ODA contributions. I am proud to be part of an understandably, reacted with great alarm and Administration that will contribute over \1.8 anger to the signalled intent of Government billion to overseas development aid over the next 63 Council of Europe Development Bank 23 November 2004. Bill 2004: Report and Final Stages 64

[Mr. Parlon.] Will the Government consider assisting Irish- three years. This is a substantial contribution on born children deported to the countries the Bill behalf of a small economy. seeks to assist which are very poor and where On the issues raised about the accountability of there is a problem of migration to the rest of the Council of Europe Development Bank, the Europe? Will the Minister ensure that some of \13 million we are paying to the bank is the cost the money the Government is committing to the of joining it. The bank is very accountable. It is an Council of Europe Development Bank will be arm of the Council of Europe and is accountable used to assist some of these deported Irish thereto. It comprises members of the Council of citizens? Europe of which Ireland has been a member since the Council’s foundation in 1949. In joining Mr. Parlon: In response to Deputy Boyle, the the bank we are completing our commitments to reporting of the activities of the bank is carried the Council of Europe and its work in Europe, out through the Council of Europe in which including the countries in eastern Europe which Ireland has a permanent representative. I am sure are in dire need of our support. an annual report is submitted. Therefore, we will obtain the information through the permanent Mr. Boyle: I asked whether we would receive representative and make it availableto the reports on a regular basis, preferably annually, on Deputy. the activities of the bank, to be placed in the On Deputy Burton’s question, there was an Oireachtas Library. I raised a question on the Opposition question to the Taoiseach earlier likelihood of countries such as Belarus receiving regarding the difficulties in Belarus. He gave a loans from the bank and asked about the mechan- commitment that either he or the relevant Mini- isms Ireland could use to argue against diktats of ster would deal with the issue. that type issued by the Belarussian authorities affecting those who wish to travel to and from Ms Burton: Will the Minister of State reply to Ireland. the question on the children? The purpose of the Bill is to assist migrants. Ms Burton: Let me reiterate some of the points I put to the Minister of State, Deputy Parlon, to Mr. Parlon: The issue the Deputy raised is assist him. He is probably aware that announce- irrelevant to what we are dealing with today. We ments were made over the weekend by the Pres- are dealing with amendments to the Council of ident of Belarus indicating the possible intention Europe Development Bank Bill and the criteria of that country to close access to projects such as set down for spending the money. Unfortunately, the Chernobyl Children’s Project. I am sure he is it does not apply to Belarus. I am sure migrants aware that many hundreds of thousands of Irish from Belarus in eastern Europe will benefit, just people have contributed to this charity to as many other eastern European countries have improve the lot of children suffering form the benefited substantially in the past from invest- effects of the disaster in Chernobyl. ments from the Council of Europe Development As I understand it, part of the function of the Bank. Council of Europe Development Bank is to assist poor countries that are members of the Council Ms Burton: I draw the Minister of State’s atten- of Europe. I know it has a specific brief regarding tion to the following excerpt from the Bill: migrants, a subject to which I will return. It is The primary purpose of the Bank is to help appropriate, in view of the fears raised by people in solving the social problems with which Euro- such as Adi Roche regarding events in Belarus, pean countries are or may be faced as a result that we should take the opportunity during the of the presence of refugees, displaced persons consideration of this Bill to ask the Minister of or migrants consequent upon movements of State to comment, on behalf of the Government, refugees ... The investment projects ... The on whether he has sought to make represen- Bank may also contribute to the realisation of tations to the Government of Belarus which is investment projects approved by a Member of likely to be a recipient of assistance under the the Bank which enable jobs to be created in programme of the Council of Europe Develop- disadvantaged regions, people in low income ment Bank and other similar institutions. Did the groups to be housed or social infrastructure to Minister of State inquire what is happening in be created. regard to the possible change by the authorities in Belarus? The point I am making is that following the refer- Some months ago, the Government undertook endum earlier in the year, we now have the a referendum, which considerably more than 80% phenomenon of Irish citizen children being of the people supported, to seek to limit the right deported from time to time by the Minister for to Irish citizenship to children born Justice, Equality and Law Reform to some of the 6 o’clock in Ireland. As the Minister of State poorest countries in Europe. As major contribu- will be aware, some of these children tors to the bank, will the Minister of State use his have been deported, along with their non-Irish offices to try to assist some of the children who parents, to some countries which are to be aided were deported, together with their migrant by the Council of Europe Development Bank. parents who applied unsuccessfully for refugee 65 Council of Europe Development Bank 23 November 2004. Bill 2004: Report and Final Stages 66 status in this country? It is a straightforward ques- Ms Burton: The Minister of State is in Govern- tion and it is an area in which the Government ment. He should be aware of these figures. ought to have a policy. Deporting Irish citizens from the country is a unique phenomenon in the Mr. Parlon: The number is minimal. When a history of Ireland. The Minister of State will be decision is taken by the Minister for Justice, aware that some of these children are returning Equality and Law Reform, it is for a very good to very poor circumstances. As a humanitarian reason. gesture, will he undertake to use the Govern- ment’s contribution to the Council of Europe Ms Burton: The Minister of State’s colleague Development Bank to assist some of these Irish never stops boasting about his decision. citizen children who are now back in very poor parts of eastern Europe? The Minister of State Mr. Parlon: The Minister is fully supported by must be aware of this fact because his colleague, the people following the 9:1 margin in the refer- the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law endum result. Reform, never stops boasting about the expulsion Acting Chairman: The Minister of State must of children. stick to the question.

Mr. Parlon: The referendum to which the Mr. Parlon: The question is entirely irrelevant Deputy referred was put to the people recently. I to what we are dealing with. I am satisfied that recall the public voted 9:1 in favour of the the day-to-day running of the Council of Europe referendum. Development Bank will deal with the issues the Deputy raised. Ms Burton: I am asking about the children who have been deported. Amendment put and declared lost.

Mr. Parlon: One of the laudable reasons we Ms Burton: I move amendment No. 2: decided to join the bank and make a contribution In page 3, lines 22 and 23, to delete all words was because of some of its policies. We are \ from and including “(which” in line 22 down to members of the bank because of our 13 million and including “Act)” in line 23. contribution, but in terms of being involved in its day-to-day running or in carrying out its policies, that is an issue for the bank itself. It is not in our Amendment put and declared lost. remit to advise the bank. It has a good tradition and record of supporting the underprivileged in Ms Burton: I move amendment No. 3: eastern Europe. In page 3, line 23, after “and” to insert “of”.

Ms Burton: Is the Minister of State saying that Amendment put and declared lost. the Government will take no interest in how the \ bank spends 13 million of Irish taxpayers’ Ms Burton: I move amendment No. 4: money? This is exactly the blank cheque phenom- enon. The Minister of State, Deputy Lenihan, was In page 3, line 24, to delete “which” and sub- crass enough to criticise organisations like Tro´ - stitute the following: caire and Concern for spending money on advo- “the text in the English language of cacy in this country. Talk about the pot calling which”. the kettle black. May I make a positive suggestion to the Minister of State and the Ta´naiste? In the Amendment put and declared lost. run-up to Christmas, he should consider asking the bank to support and sustain Irish-born chil- Ms Burton: I move amendment No. 5: dren who are being deported from this country along with their failed asylum seeker parents and In page 4, line 9, after “text” to insert “in the who will find themselves in very difficult econ- English language”. omic circumstances when they return to their parents’ country of origin. Amendment put and declared lost.

Mr. Parlon: Perhaps the Deputy will make Ms Burton: I move amendment No. 6: available to the Minister for Justice, Equality and In page 4, line 16, to delete “as” and substi- Law Reform or me the names of some of the tute the following: people to whom she referred. She is exaggerating the situation. “the text in the English language of which is”. Ms Burton: I am not. Amendment put and declared lost. Mr. Parlon: To how many people is the Deputy referring? Bill received for final consideration and passed. 67 Health Bill 2004: 23 November 2004. Second Stage 68

Health Bill 2004: Order for Second Stage. together. We published in detail our plans for health reform. We proposed to replace health Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children boards with a single Health Service Executive (Ms Harney): I move: “That Second Stage be and to bring together 27 health agencies in the taken now.” HSE. We said we would establish a Health Infor- mation and Quality Authority and re-focus the Question put and agreed to. role of the Department of Health and Children. We published the Prospectus and Brennan Health Bill 2004: Second Stage. reports that informed our policy. The Minister for Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children Health and Children said the legislation would (Ms Harney): I move: “That the Bill be now read take 18 months to prepare. The media gave wide- a Second Time.” spread coverage to all aspects of the reform pro- I am pleased introduce the Second Stage of the gramme. Opposition parties commented immedi- Health Bill 2004 to the House. This is an historic ately, accepting, it is fair say, the thrust of the reforms while asking for more to be done. Some piece of legislation. It provides for the most com- \ prehensive reorganisation of our health services people asked for more funding and nearly 1.7 since 1970 which is long overdue and vital. It is a billion more has been provided since then. once-in-a-generation event. It is our generation’s Few people if any said the present situation was chance to put patients first in the design of the the best for patients. Few argued for the retention management of health services. It is our chance of the health boards or that we needed all the to put in place modern, effective management to separate agencies with unclear or overlapping make the best use of these tremendous resources roles. The Department of Health and Children we are applying to health and to get clear value immediately set about a wide-ranging communi- and clear results for that money. It is our chance cations process that has continued up to this day. to create a system where money can follow This legislation has arisen from a long deliberat- patients and where outcomes can be measured. ive process by many people, both before and after We are legislating for the start of the 21st century, June 2003. I hope our debates in this House will for ten, 20 or 30 years in advance. There is no bring this process to fruition by focusing on pre- going back. We can no longer rely on outdated cise points of legislation. The Health Bill 2004 and ineffective legislation that may have met the forms the main legislation to implement a single needs of Ireland of the 1960s and 1970s. unified health service. The Bill provides for the We must bring sense to the patchwork of establishment of the Health Service Executive on amendments we have made to health legislation a statutory basis and provides for the consequen- over the years and to the growth of separate tial dissolution of the Eastern Regional Health health agencies. We do not need 273 people on Authority, the area health boards, the health separate health boards in addition to 166 boards and a number of other identified agencies. members of the Da´il and 60 senators to manage It sets out the functions of the Health Service and account for public health spending. We do Executive and outlines the accountability not need more than 58 separate health agencies. arrangements applying to it. The Bill also pro- It has become a jumble and it has led to below- vides for the establishment of a national health par results for patients and below-par value for consultative forum, regional health forums, advis- money for taxpayers. Those are the two reasons ory panels and a statutory complaints framework. we are proposing this legislation and the two ways I will now outline the provisions of the Bill. Government policy should be judged: better out- Section 6 establishes the Health Service Execu- comes for patients and better value for taxpayers’ tive on establishment day which is planned for 1 money. To achieve them, we badly need clarity January 2005. The executive will be a corporate of roles and accountability — political responsi- body and will be entitled, subject to the pro- bility for the Minister and management responsi- visions of the Health Acts 1947-2001, to acquire, bility for the management. The lines of responsi- own and dispose of land and property. bility and accountability are clear in this The object and functions of the executive are legislation, the clearest they will ever have been set out in section 7. The object and functions of in health administration in this country. That will the agency responsible for the delivery of health make a real difference to the quality of health and personal social services are being set out services provided for our people. clearly in statute for everybody to read. This is of The need for reform of our health management critical importance because in attempting to structures has been well known for a long time make an organisation responsible for the per- by anyone with an interest in public admin- formance of its functions, one must first know istration. The Government’s policy behind this what those functions are. The object of the execu- legislation is also well known. In this Bill, the tive is “to use the resources available to it in the Government proposes to implement our policy most beneficial, effective and efficient manner to that has been widely communicated and debated improve, promote and protect the health and wel- since we first announced our health reform pack- fare of the public”. The executive is assigned the age on 18 June 2003. The Taoiseach, the then functions transferred to it of the bodies being dis- Minister for Finance, the Minister for Health and solved on establishment day, which are those Children and I made that announcement functions which were conferred on the ERHA 69 Health Bill 2004: 23 November 2004. Second Stage 70 and the health boards under the Acts listed in terms of office. Five members of the first board Schedule 3 to the Bill. A review of the functions will serve five years and five members will serve in this schedule will give an idea of the breadth three years. This is to ensure continuity of experi- of the functions and responsibilities being taken ence in the board so that not all members of the on by the executive. board leave at the same time. The board is In delivering or arranging for the delivery of required to meet as often as necessary to carry health and personal social services, the executive out its functions but must have at least one meet- is required to integrate the delivery of health and ing in each of 11 months of the year. I do not personal social services. In requiring the execu- consider this an onerous commitment as the tive to do this, we are seeking to address the criti- board has responsibility for the management of cism which has frequently been levelled at the an organisation with a budget of \10 billion, health services that patients can get lost in the 100,000 employees and the provision of health system when moving from one sector to another services to approximately 4 million people. because of the lack of integration between the In accordance with good governance guide- various settings. The executive is also being lines, the board is the governing body of the required to have regard to the need to co-operate executive. Section 12 confers on it the authority and co-ordinate its activities with those of other to perform the functions of the executive, other public authorities if the performance of their than those conferred in statute on the medical functions could affect the health of the public. officer of health. The executive can then delegate This is important for the executive in its role of any of those functions to the chief executive protecting and promoting the health of the officer, CEO, who has operational responsibility public. for the day-to-day running of the executive under Section 8 allows the executive to enter into section 18. agreements with other public authorities either The provisions of section 14 allow the Minister on its own initiative or if requested by the other to remove the board if it fails to comply with public authority to do so. Health boards have specified obligations, including failure to comply agreements with local authorities and local auth- with a direction of the Minister or any other orities with health boards to carry out functions requirement under this Act, or if the Minister is on each other’s behalf and we want to encourage satisfied that it is not performing its functions in the continuance of that co-operation, be it for- an effective manner. If a Minister is of the latter mally under section 8 or informally under view, he or she can commission an independent section 9. review of the matter giving rise to that opinion. Under section 10, the Minister for Health and The board of the executive is required to give the Children is enabled to give general direction to person undertaking the review all reasonable the executive on the performance of its functions assistance. under this legislation or other enactments. As it The responsibilities of the executive are diverse is, the Minister and the Government is respon- and wide-ranging. In recognition of this, section sible for setting overall health policy and it is 15 allows the executive to establish committees to essential that the Minister has the power to provide it with assistance and advice in regard to inform the executive of policy decisions made and the performance of its functions. The members of to direct it to carry out its duties in compliance the committees need not be members of the with Government policy. The executive is also board, but may be persons who have the experi- required to provide the Minister with any infor- ence and knowledge required to advise the board. mation or statistics relating to the functions of the Section 17 provides for the recruitment by the executive which may be requested. board of a CEO pursuant to a recommendation Section 11 establishes the board of the execu- from the public appointments service. The CEO tive. The board will have 11 members, including is responsible to the board for the performance the chairperson, all of whom will be appointed of his or her functions and for the implementation by the Minister from among persons who, in the of the board’s policies. The board is empowered Minister’s opinion, have the experience and to appoint a deputy CEO in the absence of a expertise relating to the executive’s functions to CEO or if the position is vacant. enable them to make a substantial contribution The Bill provides for a formal system of del- to the performance of the executive’s functions. egation of functions by the CEO to other As with appointments to other State organis- employees and for subsequent sub-delegation by ations, persons who are Members of the Houses those employees of some or all of their functions of the Oireachtas, the European Parliament or a to other employees. This formalised mechanism local authority are not eligible to become for delegation will provide clarity for employees members of the board and should they be elected in regard to their roles and responsibilities and to either House of the Oireachtas, the European aid accountability within the executive. Parliament or a local authority during their ten- Section 20 provides that the CEO will be the ure of office, they immediately cease to be accounting officer of the executive. This reflects members of the board. the principle that the board is solely responsible The provisions relating to the operation of the for the management of the health services. This board are set out in Schedule 2. The board’s term will mean that the CEO will be accountable, in of office is five years and members may serve two the same way as a Secretary General of a Depart- 71 Health Bill 2004: 23 November 2004. Second Stage 72

[Ms Harney.] 2001, enables the Minister for Health and Chil- ment, for the appropriation account and for the dren to designate certain grades or classes of Vote of the executive. This is a very strong form employees who may not become members of a of accountability for a public body and will give local authority. much greater clarity than before as to where Section 25 requires all members of the board, responsibility for the management of public funds the employees of the executive and advisers lies. A similar provision is found in the Garda Bill engaged by the executive to maintain proper 2004 in regard to the Garda Commissioner. standards of integrity, conduct and concern for The CEO will, under section 21, be required to the public interest. This is vital in an organisation appear before Oireachtas committees when that deals with people on a daily basis and often requested by those committees to account for the when they are most vulnerable. The executive performance of the executive. Political responsi- will be required to prepare and make available to bility for the activities of the health services will all its employees and advisers engaged by it a rest with the Minister for Health and Children code of conduct that will indicate the standards of who, supported by the Department, will hold the integrity and conduct to be maintained by these executive to account. persons in the performance of their functions. The executive is allowed recruit its employees Part 7 contains the main accountability require- subject to the terms of the Public Service Man- ments being imposed on the executive. It sets out agement (Recruitment and Appointments) Act a statutory framework of accountability for the 2004. The overall numbers, grades and terms and executive by requiring it to clearly set out the conditions will be determined by the executive plans it has for the provision of services over a with the approval of the Minister for Health and three year period and the services it intends to Children and with the consent of the Minister provide for the level of funding it receives on an for Finance. annual basis, and then to indicate the level and Provision is made in section 63 for the transfer quality of those services provided for the expen- to the executive of the staff currently employed diture it has incurred. in the ERHA, area health boards and health In view of the Government’s decision to make boards, and the other dissolved bodies. These the CEO of the executive the accounting officer employees will transfer on establishment day on of the executive, I will introduce a number of terms and conditions no less favourable than technical amendments on Committee Stage in those they enjoyed prior to the transfer. Staff of regard to the provisions of this Part. These bodies which will be dissolved at a later stage by amendments will ensure that the executive will order of the Minister will also transfer under simi- operate as a separate entity with full account- lar terms. Provision is made for changes to the ability for its own Vote. terms and conditions of such staff on an agreed In accordance with good governance practices, basis following negotiations with staff representa- the executive is required, in section 40, to prepare tive interests. and submit to the Minister a code of governance. The disciplinary procedures provided for in the This code will outline the guiding principles Health Act 1970, which provide for appeal to the applying to the executive in the performance of Minister in the event of a proposal to dismiss a its duties, its structure and the responsibilities of staff member, will no longer apply. Instead, the its board and the CEO, the processes and guide- Bill provide for the application of the employ- lines used to ensure compliance with the require- ment protection legislation, namely, the Unfair ments of the Act and its internal controls, includ- Dismissals Acts, 1997 to 2001, to the employees ing procedures relating to internal audits, risk of the executive. These provisions were extended management, public procurement and financial to local authority employees in the Local Govern- reporting. The code will also outline how the ment Act 2001. A saver is provided in the Bill for executive intends to integrate the delivery of persons who have initiated a process under health and personal social services and the nature section 24 of the 1970 Act which provides for the and quality of services that persons can expect establishment of committees for certain removals, when receiving those services. The executive is that where such a process is not completed on required to publish this report and to provide establishment day, it should continue until it is details in its annual report on its adherence to it. completed. In section 29, the executive is required to pre- Section 23 requires the executive to prepare a pare and submit to the Minister a corporate plan superannuation scheme in respect of its for the subsequent three year period. The corpor- employees which must be submitted for the ate plan, which must have regard to Government approval of the Minister for Health and Children and ministerial policies, will outline the execu- with the consent of the Minister for Finance. tive’s key objectives for the following three years Members of either House of the Oireachtas or and the strategy for achieving those, and should of the European Parliament are not eligible for detail how the executive intends to use the employment with the executive and if employees resources available to it in that period. When the of the executive are elected to any of those insti- plan is approved by the Minister, he or she is tutions, he or she will immediately be seconded required to lay it before the Houses of the from employment with the executive. The Bill, by Oireachtas. The executive is required to provide way of amendment to the Local Government Act the Minister with updates on its implementation 73 Health Bill 2004: 23 November 2004. Second Stage 74 of the corporate plan in its annual report or in then lay copies before each House of the any other manner specified by him or her. Oireachtas. Section 32 requires the executive, on receipt of The Bill provides for the establishment of three notification of its funding, to prepare a national new mechanisms to enable public representatives service plan, which must provide an indication of and users to reflect their views on the delivery of the type and volume of health and personal social health and personal social services to the Minister services to be provided by the executive during and the executive. I consider it very important the period of the plan and estimates of income, that both users and public representatives should expenditure and number of employees for the be able to have forums available to them to period and the services to which the plan relates. advise the executive of their views on how they The plan must also comply with the limits given perceive the management and delivery of health with the approval of expenditure for the period, services as it affects them. comply with directions from the Minister, be con- In section 46, provision is made for the estab- sistent with the policies and objectives of the lishment of a maximum of four regional health Government and have regard to the corporate forums comprising members of city and county plan in place at that time. The plan must also councils within the functional area of the forum. comply with the limits given with the approval of The forum will provide local public representa- expenditure for the period and with any direc- tives with the opportunity to make represen- tions from the Minister, be consistent with the tations to the executive on the range and oper- policies and objectives of the Government and ation of health and personal social services within the Minister and have regard to the corporate the forum’s functional area. This Government is plan in place at that time. The executive will also very aware of the important role played by public be required to prepare capital plans that will out- representatives in representing the views of their line how it intends to use the capital funding constituents on developments in the health available to it for that year. Under section 38, the services. executive is not permitted, without prior written Under section 47 the executive is enabled to permission from the Minister, to undertake or establish such mechanisms as it considers appro- enter into an agreement to undertake capital priate, including advisory panels, to assist it in developments that would exceed an amount seeking the views of local communities or other determined by the Minister. groups on health and personal social services. Such panels may consist of users of the services, As the executive itself will be unable to provide service providers or other groups which the all of the health and personal social services executive considers appropriate. The establish- required by the public, it is empowered under ment of these advisory panels meets the commit- section 43 to enter into arrangements with other ment in the health strategy for a more structured service providers for the delivery of any of those approach to community participation in decisions services. These arrangements will be on such about the delivery of health services. terms and conditions as the executive may deter- Under section 48, the Minister can direct the mine and will be subject to the resources avail- executive to establish an advisory panel for a par- able to it and any directions issued by the Mini- ticular purpose, should he or she think it appro- ster. As it is public finances that will fund these priate, and he or she may appoint members to arrangements, service providers entering into the panel. these arrangements will be required to keep all The health strategy recommended that a statu- proper and usual accounts and records of income tory framework for complaints be put in place. and expenditure as specified by the executive. This is provided for in Part 9. This framework will The service providers are also required to submit enable persons dissatisfied with an action of the these accounts annually for audit and submit the executive or other service provider to make a audited accounts together with an auditor’s cer- complaint as allowed for in Part 9. It will provide tificate to the executive. The executive is also for clarity and uniformity of approach in dealing empowered to make whatever arrangements it with complaints. It seeks to provide that the com- considers necessary to monitor the expenditure plaint should be resolved at local level, but pro- incurred and the services provided under these vides access for independent review if the com- arrangements and to request any information plainant is unhappy with the decision reached by from the service providers it considers material to the complaints officer. Availing of this statutory the provision of those services. complaints framework does not preclude a per- Section 41 requires the executive to prepare its son from making a complaint to the Ombudsman annual financial statements in accordance with or the Ombudsman for Children. accounting standards specified by the Minister The executive will be required to establish and to have them adopted by the board on or complaints and review procedures for dealing before 1 April in the year following the financial with complaints about it or about other service year to which they relate. It is also required to providers. Service providers may establish their prepare and adopt an annual report not later than own complaints procedures providing the execu- 30 April each year outlining its performance of tive is assured that the procedures are of a com- its functions in the previous year. The report must parable standard to those it established. If a per- be submitted to the Minister and he or she will son is unable to make a complaint because of 75 Health Bill 2004: 23 November 2004. Second Stage 76

[Ms Harney.] supply services for that financial year. The illness or age or disability, certain specified per- ERHA and health boards are then required to sons may make a complaint on his or her behalf. prepare and submit to the Minister within 42 days Complaints must be made within 12 months of a service plan outlining the services they propose the actions giving rise to the complaint. Com- to provide for that determination. This process plaints cannot be made about certain issues which must be followed up to 31 December 2004 as the include matters which are or have been the sub- provisions of the new legislation will not take ject of legal proceedings, matters relating to clini- effect until 1 January 2005. The provisions in this cal judgment, matters relating to the recruitment Schedule allow the service plans of the ERHA and appointment of employees, etc. and the individual boards to be amalgamated The procedures relating to the operation of the after establishment day to become the executive’s statutory framework will be set out by way of national service plan, if the Minister so decides. regulations made by the Minister. The executive The individual determinations issued to the is required to provide in its annual report a gen- bodies dissolved on establishment day are eral report on the number of complaints received, allowed to be aggregated to become the determi- the nature of those complaints, the number nation for the executive for 2005. resolved by informal means and the outcome of As the House will see, this is a very compre- any investigations undertaken during the pre- hensive Bill designed to provide the executive vious year. with operational independence in the manage- Section 60 lists the bodies to be dissolved on ment and delivery of health and personal social establishment day. Provision is made in Part 10 services for our country for many years ahead. To for the transfer of their staff, property, liabilities, complement that independence, strong account- contracts, etc. to the executive. A number of ability mechanisms are in place to ensure that the bodies established under the Health (Corporate object of the executive is met. This legislation is Bodies) Act 1961 were identified by Prospectus just the enabling mechanism to allow the reform in its report, for dissolution with their functions, process to get under way. There remains much staff, assets and liabilities transferring to the hard work ahead to streamline processes from the executive. It is not intended to dissolve these eight health boards and the ERHA into one bodies immediately but it is necessary to provide cohesive unit while continuing to deliver quality the Minster with the power under this Act to do front-line services to the public. There are many so at a later stage. more reforms ahead — in the way we deliver and As I said earlier, it is important to provide for pay for health services, in the way we pay for and a smooth transition from the health board struc- use drugs and in the way we respond to people’s ture to the executive structure. With this in mind, needs, all with the aim of providing top quality the Bill contains a number of transitional pro- health care based on need. I commend this Bill visions to provide for continuity between the to the House. structures in place within the health boards pre- establishment day and the structures within the Dr. Twomey: Fine Gael welcomes any reform executive from establishment day. Section 62 pro- of the health sector but fears that reform regard- vides for the transfer of functions from those ing two major issues in this Bill is in name only. bodies dissolved on establishment day to the One of these has regard to what the Bill sets out executive on that day. to accomplish, while other public health services Provision is made in section 79 to continue the to be provided for the public may also be in name delegation of functions made by the health board only. Many of these changes were first high- CEOs and the regional chief executive of the lighted three years ago in the health strategy. The ERHA prior to the establishment day to continue Prospectus and Brennan reports of 2003 were across into the executive structure on and after part of this blueprint for change. However, with establishment day, and until the executive varies only four weeks to go before the implementation such delegations. Appointments as authorised of the Health Service Executive, there is still a officers, for example environmental health lack of clarity as to what will happen. This is a officers, made prior to establishment day, will huge concern for patients, taxpayers and also continue in force until such time as such employees of the health services. authorisations are varied by the executive. These While many nice words have been spoken continuation provisions are important as the tonight, there is a considerable number of issues executive will not be in a position on establish- that should be cleared up. Everything is not per- ment day to put in place delegations and to issue fect. The Minister is right on one point, that is, warrants of authorisation to employees through- getting the legislation through the Houses of the out the country. Oireachtas will probably be one of the easier Provision is also made to deal with the transfer tasks in regard to this reform. of financing and accountability from the health The first casualty of the Government’s inepti- board structure to the executive structure. Under tude in regard to reform of the health services the current legislation, the Minister is required to was Professor Halligan. He must be thanking his issue letters of determination to the ERHA and lucky stars on this occasion because when one the health boards within 21 days after the publi- considers the behaviour of the Taoiseach towards cation by the Government of the Estimates for the management of Aer Lingus last week, one 77 Health Bill 2004: 23 November 2004. Second Stage 78 can only imagine the scapegoating that will be tives and participation by service users — there due to the CEO of the HSE when the Govern- are many faults in that regard — and there is pro- ment fails to implement the changes we expect vision for the transfer of staff to the executive in the health services. Perhaps incompetence is a from the ERHA, the health boards and other strong word but we must look at what is hap- statutory organisations connected with health. pening with such a short length of time to go I have discovered that staff in the health ser- before 1 January 2005 when the HSE should be vices are not happy with the consultations so far. up and running. There is no permanent CEO for We cannot alienate workers in the health service the HSE, although we knew this legislation was when carrying out radical reforms. It does not coming for the past 18 months. The permanent matter whether they are doctors, nurses or board of the HSE has yet to be announced. We administration staff, we cannot alienate these are getting rid of 140 local authority members, 90 workers because their views are vital. In recent professional representatives, nine representatives weeks I have been contacted by a number of of the voluntary services and 24 ministerial employees of the health boards who said they appointees, but as of now, we still do not know were unhappy with the way the interim Health the identity of the 11 members of the new board. Service Executive has spoken to them. They feel This is a very important issue because we are the interim Health Service Executive is trying to getting rid of 263 people and replacing them with force a corporate culture on health admin- 11 individuals who will have responsibility for a istration which is geared more towards the com- total budget of \11 billion of taxpayers’ money. mercial world than the ethos of public service that To think that we do not know the calibre of the exists in the health services at present. While I people who will make these huge decisions in a fully agree with the Minister in regard to few weeks’ time makes a mockery of many of the efficiency, accountability and transparency, we fine words spoken tonight. It is one thing to have must bring these people on board and not alien- lost the CEO but not to have a board to take over ate them. The above four points apply not only the new HSE is unbelievable, especially since the to the people working in the health services but health boards, as we knew them, have already also to the Government. That is something that is been dismissed. We are running the risk of having not clear when one reads through the legislation. a banker’s version of the ERHA taking over the IMPACT has threatened strike action because health services. That lack of clarity and direction it is not happy with the way people working in the is far more worrying than much of what I have health services have been treated. These people heard tonight. believe they have been poorly informed and do We have been given three weeks to debate this not know what role they will play after 1 January issue in the Houses of the Oireachtas. In some 2005. The delegation about which the Minister respects, we are rushing through important legis- spoke is not clear to anybody, not even the CEOs lation. We have seen this happen on a few or assistant CEOs. They do not know what their occasions — for example, with the citizenship ref- function is or what the integration or the lines erendum and the amendments to the Freedom of of responsibility about which the Minister spoke Information Act. Both were vital and important involves. They are simply unhappy with what is Bills which were guillotined and rushed through happening. this House to stifle debate and prevent people My concern is that as the deadline approaches, raising issues about which they had concerns. nobody seems to have a clear idea where the However, we will continue to raise these issues Government sees this executive in 12 months’ both inside and outside the House. time. Although section 3 allows for provisions of In regard to the long delay in bringing forward the Bill to be brought into operation at different the legislation, all I can say is that the Taoiseach times, if there is a lack of clarity beforehand, it and the former Minister, Deputy Martin, must will increase anxiety and increase the difficulties have had little or no interest in the health ser- the Minister will face in trying to reform the vices. Both must have been more interested in administration side of the health services — he saving their own aspirations for the future of will face many difficulties unless it is clear to Fianna Fa´il. The Ta´naiste, as leader of the Pro- people what will happen. gressive Democrats, has been left to make up for In regard to complaints, it is important service seven years of bad Government. We hope this users — patients, consumers or whatever one will happen more easily than what already likes to call them — have an opportunity to make appears to be the case. complaints about difficulties in the service. I do The objectives of this legislation can be broken not want to see the HSE turn into an unaccount- down into four major points. The executive will able statutory agency like the National Roads be responsible for managing the health services Authority, which appears to be happening. There as a single entity and will protect the health and may be less accountability to the people who use welfare of the population. The consolidation of the service after 1 January 2005 than it is at service providers will reduce the fragmentation of present. We have had our fair share of complaints services and make them more integrated and eas- about health boards up to now but this could ier for patients to access. Those are the two vital make matters much more difficult. There is points as far as patients are concerned. There will nothing in this legislation which specifically shows be established structures for public representa- the HSE is answerable to anybody other than 79 Health Bill 2004: 23 November 2004. Second Stage 80

[Dr. Twomey.] the Joint Committee on Health and Children itself. I am sure the Minister will take time to soon. What about patients who face the prospect respond to these remarks, but that is how it looks of waiting three years before they see a neurol- to me. ogist? This waiting time will not be reduced from The national health consultative forum and the January 2005. four regional health fora have no powers and they This is another issue which must be taken on could all end up as talking shops with no man- board when considering reform of the health ser- date. One could raise whatever issue one liked, vice. Patients’ conditions can deteriorate in six but it would not have to be heeded by anybody, months, never mind over a period of three years. especially since the people who will now be on I mention neurology because it is another issue the board of the HSE will not be public or pro- due for discussion with the Ta´naiste in January. fessional representatives but 11 people nomi- Patients in this area find that no matter how hard nated by Government who can, more or less, they try to contact the consultants, who are decide to ignore or listen to what they like. The extremely facilitating when one tries to push complaints procedure could be restrictive and urgent cases on behalf of constituents, it is could be anti-consumer. However, the health ser- impossible to secure an appointment. This is vice belongs neither to the Minister nor to me but another issue about which the Government talks to all the people. but does nothing. Section 55 states that a complaints officer may There has been much talk of the national treat- not, following investigation of a complaint, make ment purchase fund recently. Regional services a recommendation the implication of which are provided at the so-called regional level, would require or cause the executive to make a including orthopaedics, dermatology, ophthal- material amendment to the service plan. In other mology, ear, nose and throat services and so on. words, if the problem is not highlighted, the prob- There is a hidden waiting list for such services lem never existed. That is how I read that section. with which the national treatment purchase fund If there is no opportunity to state there is a prob- does not deal. This involves the cases where a GP lem and to make a recommendation, that is, more sends a letter to a hospital, after which the patient or less, saying the problem can be buried, put receives an outpatient appointment. This system aside or forgotten about. It suggests that when will not become any faster under the reform of the report is published at the end of the year, a the administration. Hospitals generally do not complaint, no matter how important, can be send out appointments because it is at this point ignored. The more important a complaint, the that patients may become eligible for services more likely it is not to be highlighted because the under the national treatment purchase fund. complaints officer would not be in a position to These hidden waiting lists are quite extensive. For make a recommendation on it or could make only orthopaedics, for instance, the waiting time can a lukewarm recommendation. be as much as two to four years depending on the According to section 59, the annual report on region. It is not much fun to wait four years for complaints and reviews shall contain “such infor- an orthopaedic review. mation as the Executive considers appropriate or The Ta´naiste may feel that I am inventing this the Minister may specify”. This represents almost information to create problems for her but the a second attack on those who wish to make com- health boards have published lists detailing the plaints. The information contained in the annual waiting times for some of these specialist services. report is that which the executive or the Minister Waiting times for rheumatology services vary decide. A blanket can be thrown over any major between two and three years while ENT services complaint against the Health Service Executive, have waiting times of between two and four HSE, in its annual report and some complaints years. ENT services include, for example, the may not even get that far. This is a similar situa- treatment of adenoids, provision of tonsillecto- tion to that regarding the restrictions introduced mies and the use of grommets which have a dra- in terms of the freedom of information legislation matic effect on the development of a child’s hear- two years ago. ing. While a child may become eligible for Will the consolidation of service providers help treatment under the national treatment purchase to reduce waiting times and will integration make fund within six months of receiving an appoint- it easier for the public to access health services? ment, most of the damage is done during a wait This issue is very much an aspect of the admin- of two or three years. The administrative reforms istration of the health service and I stress that will not speed up the delays that exist in securing there are two elements which require reform. outpatient appointments. As we have long main- These are the delivery and the administration of tained on this side of the House, we cannot effect health services and they run in tandem. We may a change in isolation. It must run in tandem with get carried away with the notion that the pro- other reforms. posed changes will change the situation I have no issue with the 32 regional services dramatically. This will not be the case. The pro- because they are not being altered too much. My vision of radiotherapy services, for example, will concern is with the HSE and the four regional not become available any faster for cancer services below it. These bodies have the potential patients. It is hoped the Ta´naiste and Minister for to become merely another administrative night- Health and Children will address this issue before mare for the patients who are trying to use the 81 Roads Infrastructure: 23 November 2004. Motion 82 service. The Eastern Regional Health Authority This scattergun approach to health spending was set up out of the Eastern Health Board for has left us with the current mess. The Ta´naiste the purpose of improving the delivery of services seems destined to repeat this approach in the con- to patients in the greater Dublin area. The text of the lack of clarity regarding investment in ERHA was established to administer the service primary care and mental and disability services. and three health boards were set up to function beneath it. The former Minister for Health and Debate adjourned. Children, Deputy Martin, established and also abolished this body. We should analyse the Private Members’ Business. experience with the ERHA in the hope that we may discover the mistakes that were made. Of ———— those who sit on the board, there is only one with any experience of the ERHA who might give Roads Infrastructure: Motion. pointers as to what pitfalls the HSE should avoid in the process of dissolving the health boards and Mr. Gilmore: I move: the ERHA. The Ta´naiste risks making the situa- That Da´il E´ ireann, tion worse through the establishment of the HSE. Members on this side of the House have con- considering: sidered the matter and are unsure whether the — the necessity to improve transport links correct approach is being taken. We are con- along the Cavan-Dublin corridor; cerned about the accountability aspects for the — the importance of the Hill of Tara patient. This aspect is not as strong as the national monument and its environs; Ta´naiste has suggested. Another problem evident in this legislation is — the inevitable road construction delays that these health bodies will take on advisers and which will result and the inevitable consultants and set up committees to do the work destruction of heritage if the National for them. Such an approach could see an expan- Roads Authority persists with its cur- sion into the same old quangos into which we rent plan to build the M3 through the sometimes felt the health boards were Tara-Skryne area; and descending. There is no indication in the legis- — that the Minister for the Environment, lation of the regulation that will operate in this Heritage and Local Government is cur- regard. There is no concrete information about rently considering his options under the the regulation of the entire system. The Bill National Monuments Act; seems more concerned with setting up protocols and establishing chains of command. One can calls on the Government to: easily predict that many of these delegations and — address the current transport problems committees will include many of the same people on this corridor by proceeding immedi- about whom the Ta´naiste has spoken of removing ately with the Dunshaughlin, Kells and from the health service. She must make clearer Navan bypasses, by other road her role in this regard. improvements and the provision of a Will managing the health service as a single Navan-Dublin rail link; entity make the significant difference that she has — direct the NRA to immediately recon- predicted? The health service is comprised of sider other options for the proposed different branches. The primary care branch con- M3; and discontinue its plans to route sists of general practice services and community the M3 through the Tara-Skryne Valley. care services such as home carers, nursing homes and public health nurses. There is the acute and I wish to share my time with Deputies Shortall non-acute hospital sector and I understand that and Quinn. the acute sector will be another pillar of the An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: That is agreed. hospital service when it is properly established. Another branch is the mental health and dis- Mr. Gilmore: Some of the worst traffic con- ability services which have been grossly ditions in this country are to be found on the N3. underfunded. In her estimates, the Ta´naiste Some 15,000 cars crawl through the town of Kells observed that some 1,000 staff will be recruited every day. Traffic backs up at Navan in this area. I hope this means the recruitment of 7 o’clock and Dunshaughlin. The road is in 1,000 frontline staff, who will remain as frontline poor condition and it has one of the staff rather than move into another capacity after worst road accident rates in the country. Many of the first year or two. The administration aspect those who are stuck day in and day out in these must also be considered. All these elements are frustrating traffic queues are young workers who important and should move in tandem with each have been forced by the high house prices in other. This is not happening. The previous Mini- Dublin to commute from towns and commuter ster, Deputy Martin, spent the past four years just estates in County Meath. spending money on the health service and did not There is no disputing the need for improved seem to be quite sure what he was about. road and transport links along this corridor or the 83 Roads Infrastructure: 23 November 2004. Motion 84

[Mr. Gilmore.] UCD. In his submission to An Bord Pleana´la, Dr. necessity to urgently resolve the traffic conges- Newman described the Hill of Tara as one of the tion which is the daily reality on the existing N2. most important archaeological complexes in the In 1998, the national road needs study concluded world. He pointed out that the Hill of Tara had that a dual carriageway standard road was needed to be considered in a wider geographical context. between Kells and Clonee. In 1999 Meath County In his submission he stated: Council approved plans for a bypass of Dun- The Hill of Tara represents the ritual and shaughlin and planned to also bypass Kells and political core of a far larger territory or land- Navan. These plans, however, were effectively set scape. It cannot be regarded, or treated, in iso- aside by the National Roads Authority, which at lation from this broader landscape because this the behest of the Government advanced a pro- would be to divorce it from its cultural and geo- posal for a 62.8 km motorway to run from Clonee graphical context. For the most part, people did to north of Kells, which would be built as a PPP not live on Tara; they buried their dead there and which would be tolled. and built temples. They lived instead in the The NRA and Meath County Council com- shadow of their sacred mountain. This is why missioned consultants to produce a route selec- archaeologists and historians are concerned tion report and to conduct a public consultation about any developments within the vicinity of process. Eventually the NRA selected a route for Tara. Moreover all of our researches point to the section of motorway between Dunshaughlin the valley between Tara and Skreen as an area and Navan, which was not the preferred option of paramount importance throughout the his- of the vast majority of those who made sub- tory of Tara and this is spectacularly corrobor- missions and which was not recommended under ated in the geophysical survey carried out as any of the environmental headings of archae- part of the EIA. ology, built heritage, water quality, landscape, air quality or noise level. This valley between Tara and Skyrne is precisely This route, which is the subject of the Labour where the NRA plans to build the M3 and it has Party motion, was subsequently approved by An been described by Dr. Newman as “chock-a- Bord Pleana´la in October 2003 following an oral block with archaeological monuments and hearing. A tendering process is now under way to interesting and complex ones at that”. It is esti- select a single contractor to build the motorway. mated that there is an archaeological site along It is expected that construction will begin in 2006 the route of the proposed motorway on average or perhaps 2007 and that the motorway will be every 370 metres. Initially, the NRA sought to completed by 2010, provided there are no legal play down the number of such sites. In letters to challenges or other delays. newspapers and to other interested parties in While many concerns have been expressed February this year, the NRA claimed that there about the proposed motorway, including the were only two recorded sites along the entire 60 plans to toll it, the main worry now relates to the km of the proposed motorway and that the geo- 14 km section between Dunshaughlin and Navan. physical survey had found a further three, that is, This section of the M3 will cut through the Tara- five in all. Skryne Valley, one of the richest archaeological By May of this year the NRA’s interim report landscapes in Europe, and will include a major on test trenching along the route acknowledged 26 acre floodlit interchange at Blundelstown, just that “to date approximately 28 archaeological over one kilometre from the northern edge of the sites have been confirmed or identified by the Hill of Tara. It will also cut through the historic archaeological testing”. On 1 June at the Joint complexes of Lismullin and Dowdstown and will Committee on the Environment and Local take away a major part of the nature reserve at Government, the NRA mentioned 15 possible Dalgan Park. archaeological sites on which testing was ongoing The unique archaeological, cultural and natural and 23 other areas of archaeological potential, all landscape of Tara and its environs, which has remaining areas currently being tested. existed virtually untouched for almost 6,000 On 21 September at a meeting between the years, will be destroyed forever if the M3 is built NRA, Meath County Council and the Meath on the route that has been approved. The NRA Archaeological and Historical Society, it was argues — no doubt this will be repeated in the announced that the M3 between Dunshaughlin course of this debate — first, that the Hill of Tara and Navan would impact on a minimum of 38 site is not being touched by the motorway and, monuments and complexes. In September also second, that every effort has been made and will the NRA published 21 archaeological reports be made to mitigate the archaeological impact of outlining the results of test trenching between the motorway construction. Dunshaughlin and Dowdstown which identified a The leading authority on Tara is Dr. Conor minimum of 38 sites, monuments and archaeolog- Newman of NUIG. He has worked on Tara since ical complexes, some of them between one hec- 1982. He was director of the State’s Tara survey tare and two hectares in area, and representing organised under the discovery programme, which an archaeological site on average every 370 began in 1992. He has written extensively about metres along the route of the planned motorway Tara with his academic colleagues Dr. Joseph between Dunshaughlin and Navan. This number Fenwick of NUIG and Dr. Edel Bhreathnach of and scale of sites and monuments are in line with 85 Roads Infrastructure: 23 November 2004. Motion 86 the predictions of Doctors Newman, Fenwick and to considerable pressure from international and Bhreathnach and are a far cry from the claims expert opinion on the importance of Tara. The made by the NRA prior to the approval of the Minister will probably order an initial archaeol- motorway scheme. ogical dig. After that he will still have to decide It is remarkable that the NRA played down the whether to halt the construction of the motorway possible archaeological impact of the M3 because or perhaps order the destruction or removal of at the An Bord Pleana´la hearing Dr. Newman the archaeological find concerned. stated: If he accedes to the NRA request he exposes the country to international ridicule. If he denies From the very outset this route was iden- the request the motorway cannot be completed tified as the least desirable from the archaeol- or will have to be rerouted. If he takes time to ogical point of view; the attrition rate on the make up his mind, at the very least, he will delay archaeological heritage will be far greater here completion of the road, probably adding hugely than for any other of the proposed routes. This to the cost since, unlike the Carrickmines case, is not just my conclusion, it is the conclusion the option of sending the contractors further up arrived at by the archaeological consultants the road will not be available as there is an involved in the route selection process. What is archaeological site, that we know of, every 370 surprising, therefore, is that in spite of this, the metres. National Roads Authority has selected this as Inevitably there will be legal challenges and the preferred route. some will be taken in international courts. The Dr. Newman, in his submission to An Bord long-suffering Meath commuter may yet become Pleana´la in September 2003, complained that the knowledgeable about the Valetta Convention as geophysical images produced by the archaeolog- he or she suffers years of added traffic congestion ical consultants to the environmental impact and chaos. statement were not included in the environmental This is an occasion when Government should impact statement. He wrote: face the inevitable. The M3 cannot be built through the Tara-Skryne Valley, as is planned. Instead what we got were interpretive draw- Any attempt to do so would destroy 6,000 years ings that we had to take at face value. This is of Celtic heritage, prolong the traffic problems it completely abnormal practice. I have never was meant to solve and add hugely to the already encountered a situation before where the geo- estimated \680 million it is planned to cost the physical images were not provided alongside taxpayer. interpretive drawings. It is an industry standard. The Labour Party proposes that the traffic problems of County Meath should wait no longer. Dr. Newman concluded that this had completely The bypass of Dunshaughlin, Navan and Kells compromised the EIS, on which the motorway should proceed without further delay. The por- scheme was based. He said: “If I were a con- tions of this motorway north of Navan and south spiracy theorist, I might have concluded that the of Dunshaughlin can be proceeded with. The geophysical evidence was part-buried because it section between Dunshaughlin and Navan will proved so spectacularly the enormity of the have to be thought out again. There are options. archaeological dimension to this section of the There are the routes which were already con- motorway.” No conspiracy theory is required. sidered. There is the suggestion by the Ballinter The facts speak for themselves. Only nine months Residents Association that there should be ago, the NRA claimed there were only five improved road links to the M2 which will be only archaeological sites on the route. Now even they 12 km from the planned M3. There is the pro- admit there are 38. They would not listen to Dr. posal to reopen the Navan to Dublin rail line, Newman and other experts. They buried the geo- which would considerably reduce the demand for physical evidence which have confirmed Dr. car traffic. Newman’s warning that the Tara-Skryne Valley There is a window of opportunity for the is chock-a-block with sites and monuments. For Government to dig the NRA out of this hole. whatever reason, they selected the wrong route, That window, however, will close some time in and they now claim to be unable to change that. the new year when a tender is accepted and con- Their apologists are now attempting to blackmail tracts are entered into. the people and commuters of Meath that to be I, therefore, ask the Government to make the freed from the insufferable traffic jams, they must decision called for in the Labour Party motion. sacrifice the Celtic heritage of our country and No other authority is in a position to make that continent. decision. The NRA cannot withdraw from the Let us consider realistically what will happen if motorway scheme which has now been approved, the NRA is allowed to persist with its planned An Bord Pleana´la will not unilaterally revisit it route for the M3. For 38 sites that we know of so and Meath County Council is not in the driving far, the NRA will have to request the Minister seat. This is a decision that must be made by the for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government. Doing so will protect our heritage, Government to exercise his new powers under save the country from ridicule, save the taxpayers the National Monuments Act 2004. On most of money and save the N2 commuter from an even those 38 occasions, the Minister will be subjected longer wait for traffic relief. 87 Roads Infrastructure: 23 November 2004. Motion 88

[Mr. Gilmore.] national development plan to replace this with a I was interested in the Government amend- full motorway. Initially this proposal was gener- ment for three reasons. First, it is tabled by the ally welcomed by the people of Meath as an Minister for Transport, not by the Minister for essential element of a modern transport system, the Environment, Heritage and Local Govern- but it quickly became evident that the route selec- ment, to whom the motion was addressed and on ted by the NRA was not realisable because of whose shoulders responsibility rests for making its archaeological significance and sensitivity. The the immediate decisions relating to the per- critical objections to the scheme relate to that missions sought by the NRA. Second, considering section of the motorway between Dunshaughlin the motion refers to the M3 and Tara, the amend- and Navan which, as proposed, would cut right ment makes no mention of the M3. Third, the through the Tara-Skryne Valley. The reasons for amendment makes no mention of Tara. these objections are obvious. Tara is one of I take some comfort from that. The amend- Ireland’s foremost archaeological and cultural ment does not address the centrality of the landscapes. There are 38 known sites of archaeol- motion, the necessity to address the question of ogical significance on the route. the section of motorway between Dunshaughlin This route, chosen by the NRA and supported and Navan which poses a threat to the Tara by the Government, is known as the B route. Of national monument. When the Minister for the six routes considered, the B route is arguably Transport replies to the debate, I hope he will tell the most sensitive. It is impossible to understand us not what is in the amendment about the fine why this route was chosen. All the environmental things the Government is doing to advance the experts employed by the NRA to assess the var- roads programme and the national spatial ious routes stated that another route, known as strategy, but what it intends to do about the the P route and located east of the Hill of Skryne, section of the M3 which is to run through the was the most viable. Under the headings of national monument of Tara. archaeology, built environment, flora, fauna, habitat, landscape, visual effects, air quality and Ms Shortall: County Meath has the fastest noise quality, the P route was found to be the best growing population of any county outside Dublin. option. In no category did this group recommend It has grown by more than 22% in the past six the B route but none of this information was con- years. Its population stands at approximately tained in the EIS. 135,000 and it is expected to increase to 180,000 It is quite clear and inevitable that if the by 2012. Many of the towns of Meath have Government persists with plans to route the M3 become dormitory towns for people working in through the Tara-Skryne Valley, the people of Dublin who have been forced out of homes in Meath will not see their motorway for a very long Dublin by spiralling house prices. time. Given the strength of opposition to the pro- Large numbers of residents of towns such as posed route, which is growing daily, it is absol- Navan, Kells and Dunshaughlin commute on a utely certain that the motorway will be delayed daily basis to and from the capital. In doing so interminably as each and every archaeological they face atrocious traffic congestion. The daily site in its path is excavated. If the Government treck to and from work is becoming more and does not agree to this, I believe each site will be more difficult by the month. The journey challenged in the courts. The amended National between Navan and Dublin takes approximately Monuments Act is unlikely to speed up this pro- two hours in the morning and the same in the cess as the Minister has suggested. It is almost evening. This adds four hours to the working day certain that the new Act will be challenged in and an incredible 20 hours to the working week the courts. for people who must endure it. Many young The residents of Meath, who are growing couples leave home before 6.30 a.m. and do not increasingly impatient with delays in providing a return until after 8 p.m. There is no quality of life modern transport infrastructure, will be let down for people who live like this, especially when they yet again. The M3 was designed as five separate have young children and hardly see them during contracts but, for reasons best known to the the week. NRA, its construction is to be delivered in a sin- These problems have come about not only gle contract. The Minister should now direct that because the Government has failed to control the contract be split into its component parts. The house prices but also because there has been no obvious thing is to proceed with the by-passing co-ordination of housing development and trans- of Dunshaughlin, Navan and Kells which would port provision. In the absence of a development tackle the most serious bottlenecks on the M3. strategy, housing has been provided where devel- The Government should also fast-track Iarnro´ d opers have chosen to provide it and little thought E´ ireann’s plans to upgrade the rail connection has been given to how people will access work, from the Maynooth line between Clonsilla and schools, colleges and services generally. We were Dunboyne. Priority should also be given to rein- promised the greater Dublin land use and trans- stating the rail line from Dunshaughlin to Navan. port authority in the programme for Government The permanent way is there, although there is but, like so many other promises, that has fallen some building close by. As a project and an objec- by the wayside. While the NRA drew up plans to tive for serving that part of Meath, which is the upgrade the N3, the Government decided in the most poorly served part of the greater Dublin 89 Roads Infrastructure: 23 November 2004. Motion 90 region, it should be afforded the priority to pro- concerning the delays? The commuters of south vide a full commuter service. and mid-Kildare were just as inconvenienced by Given the delays in the M50 and the N11 it is the delays when trying to get through Kildare quite possible that the M3, as proposed, may not town as were the commuters of Meath whom be completed for a decade, with massive Deputy Shortall described earlier. Yet, because additional cost to the taxpayer. The transports of an obstinacy of decision making at official needs of County Meath’s residents require urgent level, this matter was taken to the courts — as attention. I call on the Minister to give that was the right of those involved, invoking legis- county the attention it requires by taking the lation the Government had supported — and the necessary practical and pragmatic decisions. The delays and their cost, both direct and indirect, Minister should proceed with the by-passes, were piled on the community in the form of stress upgrade the rail line and revise the section in a myriad of ways. between Dunshaughlin and Navan. For the sake The problem does not stop there because we of our heritage and in fairness to the commuters have also had the Carrickmines experience. of Meath, it is the only way forward. Whatever about corruption in the decision mak- ing and rezoning of the alignment of a road going Mr. Quinn: I join my colleagues in supporting through an area where the site was already this reasoned and reasonable motion which, no known to have some archaeological artefacts, doubt, the reasonable Minister, Deputy Cullen, which could never be fully ascertained until the will accept. The Labour Party did not table this excavations were completed, the obstinacy of the motion because it is opposed to progress or NRA and those who are politically responsible because it does not recognise the chronic traffic for it seems to suggest an attitude of: “Put your problem confronting Meath and other parts of head down, keep going. It’ll be all right on the the country. In many respects, traffic jams are the day and, sure, we’ll push it through”. Whatever problems of success and I would prefer to have options there were in respect of maintaining pro- those problems than the alternatives. That said, gress on the wider M50 road in the vicinity of however, the measure of our ability to deal with Carrickmines, that is not an option now. such success is how we handle these problems but We have not stopped learning from our recent it should not be informed by our past attitudes. experiences. The Minister himself is deeply con- I remind the Minister of some of our attitudes cerned about the implications of the site in from the past. Wood Quay immediately comes to Waterford. Anybody who had ready Carty’s Irish mind. It was a stubborn clash between officials History — and God knows that was not a very and professionals — some from the National accurate historical analysis of archaeological arte- Museum and others from the department of med- facts in the 1950s and 1960s — would have said ieval studies at UCD. In the case of Wood Quay, that at the confluence of those three rivers, there was an obstinacy driven by a sense from slightly further upstream from where the city of some officials that once they had made a decision Waterford is located, one was likely to find within they could not be seen to reverse it because 100 metres of the banks of the river some archae- somehow or other this would be a loss of face. ological remains. Yet for reasons, perhaps related There is no loss of face involved in this case to cost or to engineering and mechanical but there is a potentially serious loss of heritage efficiency, a route was selected which to every- and no one wants that epitaph to be written on body’s surprise, as Donnchadh O´ Corra´in has their professional career. Fast-forwarding from said, is perhaps the largest Viking site of signifi- Wood Quay, we should ask ourselves what les- cance to be found this century and possibly ever sons we learnt from Mullaghmore and Luggala in Europe. about that assertive statist attitude that says the The Labour Party is pointing out that we have State can do no wrong and does not need to listen been here before. This is not some new accident. to third parties — that once the internal experts There is a pattern and a legacy of archaeological have come to a view, nobody else could have a remains — originally calculated to be only five better or more informed view and that the State, and which Deputy Gilmore has now announced in effect, is above the law. The State attempted are of the order of 38, which is one for every 370 to hold that view until such time as the Supreme metres. It will make the lawyers’ fees in tribunals Court said “No”. As an agent acting on behalf of of inquiry look like chickenfeed by the time we the citizens of this Republic, the State must abide get out of the courts if this matter proceeds down by the same laws on planning and development the legal path we seem destined to follow if the as other institutions. It was a good day for plan- Government proceeds with this proposal. ning when local and State authorities were We are not suggesting the Government should obliged to go through the planning process. stop and build nothing because we recognise, as The Minister has experience of the NRA in his has been said, that we need a traffic resolution. own constituency. If this was a once off, acciden- On the Cavan corridor we are clearly saying that tal casualty of judgment perhaps we might be a north of Navan and south of Dunshaughlin the bit more understanding and tolerant. Let us start route is not in contestation and the NRA should with the Kildare by-pass, however, and the dis- proceed. However, within that space alternatives missive ignoring of warnings about the environ- exist, some of which have been mentioned by mental impact of that by-pass. What happened Deputy Shortall. On this side of the House we 91 Roads Infrastructure: 23 November 2004. Motion 92

[Mr. Quinn.] way is built. It is possible to justify the apparent cannot take the Executive decisions to reverse additional cost of those interim bypasses by com- the decision-making process that has already pleting them in the short term. The cost offset been statutorily completed. Only the Govern- against the legal fees, the delays and the oppor- ment can do that. tunity cost associated with those delays would be We are not trying to force the Minister to lose more than sufficient to justify the additional net face. We do not say the NRA is a bad organis- expenditure. ation. On the contrary, the activities of the NRA We want the Minister not to press his amend- probably provide us with the best archaeological ment. The Whip’s office must have been pretty opportunity the nation and our culture has con- stretched for imagination if this was all it could ceivably ever had. We will dig up more of this come up with today. We do not dispute the land than ever before with far greater safeguards Government’s roads programme, the expenditure than prevailed when the railways were built in the or the necessity to take action. We are talking century before last at a time when no protection about a specific problem that has been encoun- existed. We do not even know if we have every- tered and not for the first time. This problem thing that was found. Anything that was dis- seems in part to reveal an inability within the covered was found by accident. NRA to recognise that sometimes the longest We now have a legislative structure, trained way home is the quickest way to get there. Some- archaeologists — while not enough of them, far times the longest route is the shortest route. more than before — and an opportunity to do If the Government persists with ratification of something that will allow people in 500 years’ the tenders and the commitment to contract then time to say, “Wasn’t that some generation of Irish we know from Carrickmines, Wood Quay, Lug- people, who notwithstanding their need to gala, Mullaghmore and Mutton Island in Galway resolve all the problems of commuting, stress and that it will not stop here. Not just Irish citizens strain, held back, looked at the matter again and but also European citizens, aware that the Euro- decided to stop for the time being.” We should pean heritage lying beneath the soil in County not walk away from the matter. Let us just hold Meath will be damaged, if not destroyed, by this and see what we can find. intemperate and precipitate action, will use the Archaeological techniques are developing and institutions of the courts at national and Euro- will continue to develop in terms of scientific pean level and the delays the Minister dreads will imaging and all sorts of electronic surveillance become real. The costs that he does not want to that can enable us to ascertain in advance before contemplate will be higher than he could measure putting a spade in the ground that the probability and the dissatisfaction among commuters, not to of finding something is much higher than we mention businesses and the local community, could have known ten, 15 or 20 years ago. It is with the existing inadequate system of transport not just what is found that is important from the will get worse in the short term rather than better. point of view of analysis and interpretation but What is involved in accepting our proposal — also where it is found and its relationship to other a loss of face? I do not believe any Fianna Fa´il parts, places and spaces. We do not know enough Minister would suggest that preserving the Celtic about our past and we have an obligation and heritage of the country could be considered a loss responsibility, if not a duty, to maximise its con- of face. veyance into the future for our children and grandchildren. Mr. Rabbitte: It is not a phenomenon with The Minister is at this point. We are not asking which they are familiar in any way. him to stop or walk away. We are saying he should just pause. The Minister has the ability, Mr. Cullen: I lose face many times along the power and responsibility to make this pause. He way. should then proceed without delay with what can be done. He should consider the options that can Mr. Quinn: No reasonable citizen on either side maximise traffic efficiency and minimise traffic of the political divide would look unfavourably at delays by proceeding with the three bypasses to the Government having second thoughts on the which Deputies Gilmore and Shortall have basis that, while it did so for the best possible already referred. In the short term, it would be reasons and in the best possible way because of possible to improve the flow of traffic in Dun- the necessity to move quickly, it might have got shaughlin, Kells and Navan. This would not be it wrong. The Government could think about the wasted money. Nobody in Kinnegad today feels matter for a second time and, because of issues it that the small mini-bypass around that village did not fully realise, comprehend or understand, represents wasted money, as I am sure Deputy decide to delay proceeding with the section Cassidy would agree. between Dunshaughlin and Navan in order to come up with alternatives. Mr. Cassidy: As would Deputy Penrose. The Minister could indicate to the House tonight a willingness to take on board the thrust Mr. Quinn: Yes. Yet that was a short-term of what we suggest, a willingness to recognise that alleviating measure, which in one respect will mistakes have been made in the past on routes become redundant once the main N4-N6 motor- resulting in damage, some of it irreparable and 93 Roads Infrastructure: 23 November 2004. Motion 94 some of it impossible to quantify or measure, and — notes that the Government investment that the Government is currently facing similar in our road network is essential to pro- dilemmas in Waterford. Against the background vide for balanced regional investment of what the Minister now knows — not what he and is delivering shorter, safer and fears — he should tell the House in the course superior road journeys; of the debate that in principle he is prepared to — notes the comprehensive statutory reconsider. We do not say he must take the public consultation procedures in place, actions set out in our motion, which are merely under the Roads Act 1993, which are options and suggestions. also being supplemented by extensive Ultimately the Minister has the executive non-statutory local consultations by responsibility and must make those choices. road authorities; and However, only he can make that choice. The NRA cannot unilaterally halt this project nor can — emphasises the importance of public the other agencies involved, only the Minister private partnerships in harnessing the and the Government. That is why the Labour necessary skills and finance to support Party Members, holding the Minister to account, the earlier completion of the Govern- ask him to think again and to do what is best for ment’s ambitious national road infra- everybody involved. structure targets.” I am pleased to have the opportunity tonight to Minister for Transport (Mr. Cullen): I move outline this Government’s commitment to the amendment No. 1: protection of our national heritage and the pres- ervation of archaeological sites and features. The To delete all words after “Da´il E´ ireann” and ongoing liaison between my Department, the substitute the following: National Roads Authority and the national “commends the Government’s commitment monuments division of the Department of Envir- and proactive approach in the delivery of the onment, Heritage and Local Government to pre- upgraded national roads network; serve our national heritage and deal with archae- ological sites and features in accordance with best — notes the Government’s commitment to practice is also based on the code of practice on the protection of our national heritage archaeology for the national roads programme and the preservation of archaeological agreed by the NRA and the then Department of sites and features; Arts, Heritage, Gaeltacht and the Islands in 2000. — notes the ongoing liaison between the The NRA continues to demonstrate its commit- NRA and the national monuments div- ment and investment in placing archaeological ision of the Department of Envir- issues at the centre of the road planning process onment, Heritage and Local Govern- — evident in the discovery of so many previously ment in preserving our national unrecorded areas of historical and archaeological heritage and with dealing with archaeol- importance and indeed through the employment ogical sites and features in accordance of archaeologists. Archaeological works conduc- with best practice; ted to date along the route of the M3, including test trenching, are being carried out in accordance — notes that the roads programme is being with appropriate statutory authorisation — implemented in full accord with the licences under section 26 of the National Monu- code of practice on archaeology for the ments Act 1930, as amended. national roads programme agreed with The M3 route is a significant distance from the the then Department of Arts, Heritage, Hill of Tara national monument and, accordingly, Gaeltacht in 2000; the works to date do not require a special consent under section 14 of the Act, which concerns — commends the National Roads Auth- works or other activities that could impact on a ority, NRA, on its commitment and national monument. In the event of archaeolog- investment in placing archaeological ical features being discovered along the line of issues at the centre of the road planning the motorway which are of national or inter- process — evident in the discovery of national significance and which would warrant so many previously unrecorded areas of classification as a national monument, both historical-archaeological importance; Meath County Council and the NRA would seek — notes that the national roads investment the appropriate consent from the Minister for the programme is being implemented as Environment, Heritage and Local Government. part of the National Development Plan The role of An Bord Pleana´la, which con- 2000-2006 and supports the objectives cluded its oral hearing on this project in Nov- of the national spatial strategy; ember 2002 after sitting for 28 days, the longest ever hearing for a national roads scheme, further — confirms the importance of the trans- supports the independent appraisal of the impact port corridor that links north west, of the roads programme on issues including Cavan and north Meath to Dublin as impact on archaeological sites and features. The one of the busiest in the country; hearing dealt at length with archaeological issues. 95 Roads Infrastructure: 23 November 2004. Motion 96

[Mr. Cullen.] everyone else, I want a full excavation but the The inspector concluded as follows in his report context has moved to preserving this site forever to the board: so millions of people can come to look at it. There is nothing to see unless the viewer is an archaeol- Having regard to all of the evidence given at ogist in the company of an archaeologist who can the hearing and the cross-examination on the explain the site. It is meaningless. The artefacts archaeology impacts in the Tara/Skreen area are important and I take the point that the con- presented at the hearing and to the details set text of their find is equally important. Saving out in the EIS, I am satisfied that the route as those artefacts, which have been given to the proposed would not have a significant impact National Museum and will be put on display in on the archaeological landscape associated with time, is what is really happening. the Hill of Tara, as indicated by the area desig- Most people in Waterford think the situation is nated as the core zone on the RMP Map SK completely different. This is where problems 500. I also consider that the route proposed will start, when people get the facts wrong and not impact significantly on the archaeological present them in a distorted way. landscape associated with the Hill of Skreen. I am also pleased to have this opportunity tonight Mr. M. Higgins: They just want a heritage to highlight how this Government’s continued policy. Archaeology is not a by-product of road commitment to investment in our roads network building. is providing a high quality national roads infra- structure that is contributing to the ongoing Mr. Cullen: There is a heritage policy. Archae- development of our national economy, providing ology has changed dramatically because it is now further opportunities for regional development, planning led. That is not a bad thing, as Deputy safer roads, shorter and more reliable travel times Quinn said, because we would not discovering and enhancing our quality of life. these artefacts without the massive investment in Under the National Development Plan 2000- infrastructure. That is why they are coming to 2006 and the objectives of the national spatial light. There are archaeologists who would prefer strategy, the ambitious national roads investment not to see these sites touched, for them to be built programme has seen investment of over \5 billion over and left in situ and undisturbed. It is the to the end of 2003. The Government’s commit- legitimate point of view of some archaeologists. ment to national road infrastructure is further underpinned with the \8 billion investment Mr. M. Higgins: The NRA should not define between Exchequer funding and public private archaeology policy. partnership investment over the period 2004-08 Mr. Cullen: The problem for politicians is announced under the multi-annual funding plan squaring the circle between the conflicting points provisions in the last budget. The results of these of view because someone must decide. Ironically, commitments, including over \1.1 billion in the I am in the House when the Opposition envir- BMW regions, are already evident to all, with onment spokespeople have tabled a motion that bottlenecks all over the country being removed, is largely concerned with archaeology, an area offering relief to many of our towns and villages. which I dealt with for the last two years. Perhaps Projects that have been completed include the the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and M1 from Dublin to Dundalk, bypasses of Kildare, Local Government should be here with me. Monasterevin and Cashel, phase one of the N7 Limerick southern ring road, the N22 Ballincollig Mr. M. Higgins: I remember when we had an bypass and the N11 from Ashford to Rathnew, to archaeology policy. name but a few. Work continues on many other projects, including the bypasses of Fermoy, Ennis, Mr. Cullen: We have a very good archaeology Loughrea, Mullingar, Cavan, Ballyshannon and policy, the best in Europe. Bundoran, Kinnegad and Enfield, the Sligo inner Since the start of the NDP in 2000, 46 projects, relief road, the Dublin Port tunnel and the south comprising 327 kilometres of road, have been eastern motorway, which will complete the M50 completed and there are 20 projects of 196 kilo- from the M1 to the M11. Planning is under way metres currently under construction. There are 9 on projects such as the widening of the M50 and projects of 147 kilometres at tender stage and a provision of free-flow interchanges, the Water- further 12 projects of 167 kilometres are either ford city bypass, and the road from Kinnegad to through the statutory process or before An Bord Athlone. Pleana´la. Deputy Quinn mentioned the Waterford I welcome the opportunity to present the facts bypass, with which I am familiar. The problem is on the M3 Clonee-Kells motorway. The M3 that everyone I meet in Waterford thinks that the Clonee to north of Kells motorway is a much ruins of Pompeii have been found, with entire needed project, consistent with both the national buildings being dug up. That is completely untrue development plan and the national spatial and it has discredited good work in so many strategy. It is vital infrastructure which will con- different ways. I have spoken to many of the tribute to the ongoing success of the local and archaeologists from all points of view and they regional economy, bring better-balanced regional are pleased with the pace of work there. Like development, improve safety and access to and 97 Roads Infrastructure: 23 November 2004. Motion 98 from Dublin, the ports and airport. In addition, process was viable in terms of archaeology. The this project will transform the quality of life for preferred route was assessed as best or joint best those people living in Dunboyne, Dunshaughlin, under 14 of the 18 assessment criteria used as part Navan and Kells. This project will result in of the environmental impact evaluation process reductions of through traffic of 75% in Dun- and, accordingly, scored higher on environmental shaughlin, 78% in Navan and 90% in Kells. It will grounds than any alternative route. also benefit everyone living along the existing N3 The public consultation process saw 4,000 by removing the majority of the through traffic people attend public meetings. The preferred and associated congestion which currently affects route was subsequently submitted to An Bord their lives on a daily basis. The present road is Pleana´la for consideration. Following a 28-day not coping with the traffic volumes using the oral hearing, during which extensive attention route and the situation will only worsen given the was given to archaeology and potential impacts planned development in County Meath and on Tara, the board approved the M3-Clonee- further afield. north of Kells road project proposal. In this I am fully aware of the rich archaeological regard, it should be noted that the decision to landscape in County Meath, the importance of approve the proposal was, inter alia, based on the the Hill of Tara and its significance to our board’s conclusion that the motorway scheme “is national heritage. Both Meath County Council necessary to provide adequately for the existing and the National Roads Authority are aware of and projected traffic growth and would be in the special place that the Hill of Tara holds in the accordance with the proper planning and sus- national consciousness and of their responsibilit- tainable development of the area”. The board ies to protect it and the cultural heritage of also concluded that the scheme “would not have County Meath. A great deal of time, expertise significant adverse effects on the environment”. and expense has been expended in developing the I understand that the NRA and Meath County M3 motorway scheme through the planning pro- Council are working on arrangements to advance cess and every effort has been made to mitigate the project to construction in accordance with the the impact of the proposed road through the approvals obtained from An Bord Pleana´la and landscape surrounding the Hill of Tara. both are committed to resolving archaeological As regards the proximity of the motorway to issues in line with best practice and in a manner the Hill of Tara, the proposed road passes that fully complies with any direction which may between the Hill of Skryne to the east and the be given by my colleague, the Minister for the Hill of Tara to the west. The route was carefully Environment, Heritage and Local Government, chosen to avoid the important core zone around Deputy Roche, under the national monuments Tara, which has national monument status. The legislation. chosen route lies 1.5 km. to the east of the limit I wish to set out in more detail the extent of the of the record of monuments designated area and archaeological work carried out on the proposed east of the existing N3. In other words, the motor- route. In the case of the M3, a test trench was way as it passes through the Tara-Skryne Valley excavated along the centre line of the 59 km will be a greater distance from the Hill of Tara length of the route, with cross trenches being dug than the existing N3 Dublin-Navan road. The every 20 metres. I understand that the National scheme has been designed to minimise physical Roads Authority and Meath County Council and visual impacts on the archaeological land- have carried out extensive archaeological investi- scape around Tara. gations of the route of the M3, including test Great care was taken by Meath County trenching over virtually the entire 59 km length Council and the NRA to avoid any previously of the scheme. This work, as would be expected, recorded or upstanding monuments when plan- has identified a number of previously unknown ning the route of the M3 project. Statements by archaeological sites and features. Reports on the various groups stating that the selected route was sites concerned have been submitted to the Mini- “the only route that was considered by the NRA” ster for the Environment, Heritage and Local are incorrect. A total of ten route options in four Government to assist him in determining the broad corridors were examined as part of the most appropriate manner in which to deal with route selection study for the Dunshaughlin- the sites concerned. The reports concerned relate Navan section of the scheme which involves the to a total of 38 sites on the 15 km section of the Tara area. Project planning and assessment of route between Dunshaughlin and Navan. The route options was carried out over a period of extent to which new sites have been discovered, more than three years. The impact on archae- approximately 2.5 sites per kilometre, is similar ology, implications for other aspects of the envir- to the experience on many other schemes onment, effects on people and their homes, the throughout the country and in some cases the extent to which farms would be severed, together incidence of sites on the M3 is substantially less with traffic, engineering and cost considerations than finds on other national road schemes. For were taken into account in evaluating the ten example, on the M1 route, a total of 211 pre- route options in the Tara area. The archaeolog- viously unknown archaeological sites were found ical consultants engaged by Meath County over a distance of 60 km, an average of 3.5 sites Council to advise on route selection concluded per kilometre. In addition, in the case of the that the preferred route which emerged from this Cashel bypass, which was opened to traffic last 99 Roads Infrastructure: 23 November 2004. Motion 100

[Mr. Cullen.] we must balance all these issues. A balanced view month, 100 new sites were located on the 7 km in the context of the M3 is important. route or 14 per kilometre. The reports on the new discoveries on the M3, I know that Deputy Gilmore was making a as submitted to the Minister to the Minister for point about the exceptional number sites, but that the Environment, Heritage and Local Govern- is not the case. The number is low relative to what ment, identify burnt spreads as the most common people might have thought. I am just giving the site type. Other sites include former burial House some other examples. I was aware of this locations, possible foundations of houses, includ- before I left my previous Department. That is not ing five of relatively recent origin. Overall, the to suggest in any way that the Hill of Tara and new discoveries appear to be along expected lines the Hill of Skryne are not extremely important. and do not seem to be of unique archaeological There is no question about that. The Minister for value in their own right. the Environment, Heritage and Local Govern- The National Monuments (Amendment) Act ment is better informed than I am on this. 2004 introduced new procedures for approved However, a balanced view must be taken of the road projects. A separate excavation licence is fact that the level and extensiveness of the sites not required where such a project has been on this route are not as fulsome as people might approved by An Bord Pleana´la, a process which have thought. This confirms, in a sense, that great includes consideration of an environmental and careful consideration was given to the route impact statement which will have identified the chosen, in the first place. impacts involved and the extent of mitigation needed. Instead, the Act requires that any Mr. M. Higgins: It is the total context that archaeological works associated with that matters. development must be carried out in accordance with the directions of the Minister for the Envir- Mr. Cullen: I take the total context into onment, Heritage and Local Government, follow- account. I am not for a second trying to suggest ing consultation with the director of the National that the Hill of Tara is not important in a total Museum of Ireland, and accordingly proper stan- context. However, I am trying to point out that dards can be so specified for the carrying out of great care was taken. Some of the points that those works. people accept as facts are not true in terms of the That is belt and braces, as is the direct involve- extensiveness of the archaeological effort. ment of the director of the National Museum of Trenches have been dug every 20 kilometres on Ireland. a 59 km site. On behalf of taxpayers, irrespective of any more work to be done, \30 million will be Mr. M. Higgins: The Minister with responsi- spent on archaeology on this route. bility for heritage matters was a co-equal before that Act. That was the reality. Mr. English: The State will get it back in tolls. Mr. Cullen: There was no obligation previous Mr. Cullen: I am delighted that so many young to that for the Minister for the Environment, people are now choosing archaeology as a pro- Heritage and Local Government to consult with fession and going to universities and colleges. It the director of the National Museum of Ireland. is wonderful, but let us understand why this is It was I who introduced that section. happening and appreciate that it is the taxpayer Mr. M. Higgins: The Minister with responsi- who pays for the phenomenal amounts being bility for heritage matters was a co-equal with the spent on these routes and to a much greater Minister for the Environment and Local Govern- extent than in many other countries throughout ment and it was not a case of the Minister for the Europe. I do not suggest we lower our standards Environment and Local Government showing his to theirs, but the standards are high. Deputy colleague what he was proposing to do. The Mini- Michael D. Higgins, as a former Minister of State ster knows that. with responsibility for the arts, was one of the key players responsible for raising archaeology and Mr. Cullen: Just for the record—— heritage matters to their present important levels. We all want to maintain those levels, but in the Mr. M. Higgins: Yes, I am saying it for the end—— record.

Mr. M. Higgins: Roads should be designed sep- Mr. Cullen: In regard to the section I amended arately from archaeology. when I brought it before the House, there was no obligation and there was nothing in legislation Mr. Cullen: ——a balance must be drawn providing that the Minister for the Environment, between doing full and excellent mitigation of Heritage and Local Government should consult sites from an archaeological viewpoint and bal- with the director of the National Museum of ancing all that with the needs of ordinary men Ireland. I introduced that as a new policy and a and women who spend four hours a day sitting in new direction in legislation, which is a belt and their cars trying to go to and from work. That is braces approach. At least give me some credit for not a quality of life we want for our people, so doing some positive things. 101 Roads Infrastructure: 23 November 2004. Motion 102

Mr. Gilmore: The Minister is telling him and elements of the national roads programme more giving him 14 days. It is a fig leaf. efficiently and more quickly than the traditional methods of financing and constructing road Mr. Cullen: The current position is that Meath schemes which rely exclusively on the Exchequer County Council has applied to the Minister for as the source of funding. A further key element the Environment, Heritage and Local Govern- of the PPP programme is rigorous assessment of ment for directions as to the carrying out of proposals from planning, design and value for archaeological works associated with the M3 money perspectives, not least to satisfy the due approved road project. diligence requirements of financial institutions. The archaeologists employed by Meath County This Government’s commitment to the roads Council on this project operate to the highest pro- programme is not just about concrete and tarmac fessional standards. The use of test trenching is or the undoubted quality of the workmanship part of the comprehensive and proactive strategy that we can all see as our new roads are opened. for dealing with archaeology on the route that At the core of this programme is our absolute was submitted to An Bord Pleana´la during the commitment to making sure we have lasting oral hearing process. The test trenching process foundations in place to protect and grow employ- and other archaeological evaluation methods ment in every part of the country. When the have been the subject of a published study under- roads programme is completed, Ireland will, for taken by the Oxford archaeological unit co- the first time, have a modern infrastructure to funded by the European Regional Development support economic and social life. At a time when Fund, entitled Evaluation of Archaeological commitment to balanced development has never Decision-making Processes and Sampling Stra- been greater, the roads programme allows the tegies. The study concluded: regions to prosper. Investment in our roads is an investment in the future of our country and a All non-intrusive methods of site evaluation statement of confidence in the future of com- had merits ... and were all comparatively cheap, munities throughout the country. but they all had some serious failings and none As I have already stated, I as Minister for were even moderately successful at evaluating Transport, particularly in the light of my experi- the range of archaeological remains that sur- ence as Minister for the Environment, Heritage vived. Machine trenching was the only effective and Local Government, am firmly committed to means of predicting the character of the sites ensuring that investment in the national roads in this study and even though it was more programme is planned and implemented in a expensive than other methods, the improved manner which ensures the protection of our quality of information and greater certainty national heritage and archaeological sites and from which to devise a mitigation strategy features. I am committed to ensuring that the made it cost effective. NRA works proactively with the national monu- The test trenching on the route of the M3 project ments division of the Department of the Envir- was carried out by archaeologists who were fam- onment, Heritage and Local Government in iliar with the results of the previous surveys ensuring that archaeological issues arising on undertaken along the route. The purpose of these national roads projects are resolved in accord- archaeological investigations is to identify new ance with best practice. In recent years the sites along the route. Those discovered are archaeological work carried out under the reported to the Minister for the Environment, national roads programme has made a massive Heritage and Local Government and will be dealt contribution to our store of knowledge about our with in accordance with the requirements of the past and I want to ensure we implement the Minister. Rather than losing sites, this work is national roads investment programme in a man- adding to the archaeological record long-forgot- ner which minimises any adverse impacts on the ten sites that have no visible presence in the environment and as far as possible protects our landscape. national heritage. This project is being implemented as a public May I share time with Deputy O’Connor? I private partnership. Attracting private financing apologise for omitting to say this earlier. and ensuring we can benefit from better allo- cation of risk between the public and private sec- Acting Chairman (Ms O’Sullivan): Is that tors while also availing of private sector project agreed? Agreed. management expertise and design innovation in major road projects was central to the policy set Mr. O’Connor: I thank the Minister for sharing out in the National Development Plan 2000-2006. time with me. I compliment the Labour Party on Some \245 million will be made available by the tabling the motion and giving us an opportunity private sector in 2005 through PPP investment. to hear a comprehensive speech by the Minister. The Clonee-Kells project is one of ten key PPP I declare an interest. I am a well-known supporter projects of which three are already under con- of the Minister and his Minister of State and am struction. Attracting private investment and always happy to support him. international private sector project management and design expertise means that the NRA can Mr. O’Dowd: The Deputy should be promoted deliver large, key projects which are essential for that. 103 Roads Infrastructure: 23 November 2004. Motion 104

Mr. O’Connor: I am a happy backbencher from The archaeological considerations were fully Tallaght and that is the only time I will mention taken into account in the entire road planning that town. process. All Members, including those opposite, will be glad to hear the Minister’s assurances in Ms O. Mitchell: The Deputy must be on the that regard. I hope that in the rest of this debate, payroll. account will be taken of the points he articulated. I look forward to hearing what Members have to Mr. O’Connor: Having listened carefully the say, including those from the area in question. I Minister I support what he said. All of us are am always happy to hear them. I look forward to aware of the need for this scheme and the hearing the end of the debate tomorrow night and increasing congestion in the towns and villages of to supporting the Minister’s position. Kells, Navan and Dunshaughlin which are better known to my colleagues opposite. The new road Acting Chairman: Amendment No. 2 cannot be will reduce traffic on the existing N3 and will sig- moved at this time but it may be referred to in nificantly reduce through traffic in Dunshaughlin, the course of the debate. Navan and Kells. The existing N3 experiences a high incidence Mr. O’Dowd: I wish to share my time with of road accidents, which is unfortunate. I am Deputies Olivia Mitchell and English. informed the new road will reduce accident rates by up to 50%. This should be welcomed because Acting Chairman: Is that agreed? Agreed. there is not a day when we do not lament acci- dents. The need for a major improvement in the Mr. O’Dowd: This is a very important debate. environment for those living adjacent to the exist- The first part of the amendment, which I cannot ing N3 and to the towns and villages which the move but to which I will refer, refers to the need N3 passes through is essential. The capacity of the to commence work on the road forthwith. The existing two-lane road is 13,800 annual average reason is very simple. The capacity originally daily traffic against current traffic volumes which envisaged for the M3 was approximately 11,600 range from 15,000 to 28,000 per day. cars per day. The number of cars actually travel- ling on it is 21,700 per day, and this number is to I note that the options mentioned by Members rise to 36,500 per day by 2024. If the road cannot so far for upgrading the existing N3 Dublin- cope with the present number, it will not be able Navan road are not feasible. There are 62 house to do so in ten years’ time. It is clear that some- farm entrances, 47 field entrances and two com- thing must be done and Fine Gael contends that mercial entrances on to the existing N3 between the new road must commence now. Dunshaughlin and Navan. To close these accesses The amendment we will be moving tomorrow would require the provision of a series of local will state very clearly that we must immediately access roads, dramatically increasing the footprint re-examine the issues with a view to finding a res- of the road scheme and leading to increased sev- olution that will address the concerns about the erance and environmental impact. Widening of archaeological impact of the proposed road. The the existing road would involve demolition and amendment will be simple, short and factual. If encroachment on to existing properties. There we do not find a way of resolving this issue, the are 184 houses adjacent to the existing road delays to which the Labour Party referred will between Dunshaughlin and Navan. Perhaps occur. Nobody, including members of the Oppo- Members opposite will confirm what they would sition, wants them, and I do not believe the say to local people, who would be clearly impac- Government wants them either. Let us get ted upon if this route had been chosen. The together to solve this problem. chosen route lies within the corridor 1.5 kilo- To address this issue we must first recognise metres to the east of the Hill of Tara which is the importance of Tara, the location of the pri- approximately twice the distance from the Hill of mary prehistoric monument in this country. Tara as the existing entry Dublin-Navan road. There should not be a road within miles of it. If The landscape architect who wrote the visusal it were in the Valley of the Kings, for example, impact section of the EIS concluded that in the would we consider it in the same light? Tara is overall context the proposed road would not have just as important and sacred as anywhere else. an appreciable residual impact and would quickly The problem is that there is a road at Tara at be assimilated into the fabric of the robust present, on which people live. We must use the County Meath landscape. He recognised that for route and this begs the question of where we a period immediately following construction must locate the proposed road. Given the import- some locations would continue to suffer visual ance of the area, let us face the fact that we will impact until planting became established. The find archaeological sites no matter where we put preferred corridor has a number of other advan- an alternative road. I accept fully the argument tages, including the fact that it is outside the core put forward by the Labour Party that the area is Tara zone, and represents the best route in terms littered with archaeological monuments and is of serving traffic demand and impact on the exist- part of our history. We cannot say “No” to 5,000 ing network and is the preferred option for cross- years of history, nor can we say where it starts or ing at the River Boyne. stops. We know that the archaeological monu- 105 Roads Infrastructure: 23 November 2004. Motion 106 ments exist and we would have to build the road be considered by the Government. The other on stilts if we were to meet the requirements that option it should consider is that of working on some people wish us to meet. the existing roadway. Perhaps it would be less dis- We must ask ourselves how we should proceed. turbing archaeologically to expand the existing The current argument is that development and road in situ than to opt for the pink route or progress are in opposition to archaeology, but another route. We cannot put our heads in the Fine Gael believes this should not be so. We sand and must face the reality that we must should be at a stage in our policy-making and compromise on these issues. development in which archaeology and develop- We are not compromising archaeological finds ment can go hand in hand. The argument at the if we protect them by recording them. What is core of the issue concerns whether we should be important is not what is under the ground but preserving in situ or preserving by recording. The that we protect and preserve archaeological arte- latter will soon be at the core of Fine Gael policy. facts when we find them by bringing them to our The road must be built and we must protect what- museums or keeping them in situ. It is most criti- ever archaeological sites we can, keeping them in cal that we learn from them. We will have learnt situ if at all possible. If it is not possible to keep nothing if we do not dig or work in the most them in situ — it will not be in this case — we appropriate way. must find the route that will least affect the It is all very well to talk about sealing archae- archaeological sites. ology in situ, as the Minister stated. This is poss- I praise the NRA for the commitment it has ible if one is building a house or shopping centre made to developing this country and for the but not possible if one is building a motorway, money it is spending on roads and archaeology. given the massive downward pressure it would We should not lose sight of this. I agree with the exert on a repository of archaeological remains. Minister regarding the spending of \20 million to Let us face facts and do the business. \30 million on archaeology. It is an enormous I watched “The Time Team” two weeks ago amount and it is well spent. The archaeological and saw archaeologists do a trial dig in Eamhain sites found must be recorded and reported. Macha in Armagh. They dug in the middle of what they believed to be nowhere and discovered Mr. Callely: If that is the case, the Deputy important archaeological artefacts. No matter should support our amendment. where one touches in a sacred landscape, such as that of Tara or Eamhain Macha, one will find Mr. O’Dowd: No, my amendment is very clear sites of archaeological importance. Let us recog- on this matter. It attempts to deal with an issue nise this, minimise the impact and listen to those that is not addressed at all in the Government who are present in the Visitors Gallery, such as amendment, namely, the effort to resolve the Professor George Eoghan, a former Member of problem. the Seanad. These people know their business and spend their life working in this area. Theirs Mr. Callely: That is what our amendment does. is a labour of love and it is a learning process for us to meet them and listen to them. Let us listen Mr. O’Dowd: No, it does not. The Minister of to them and find a realistic, practical solution to State’s amendment does not mention this area at the problem. We must do this and, above all, all. I do not mind meeting him to discuss this build the road. matter and am prepared to do so afterwards. I want to see the problem resolved, as I hope he Ms O. Mitchell: I support my colleague Deputy does. O’Dowd. I have the greatest sympathy with the We must have archaeology that is empathetic issues raised by this motion and fully understand to development, and vice versa. If we achieve this, the frustration and desperation that drives those we will not have High Court cases or mass pro- responsible for such a motion. I share many of the tests but clarity and vision. Clarity and vision in feelings that have been expressed by members of this area are what this country needs but it has the Labour Party, but like Deputy O’Dowd I not got them under this Government. Fine Gael have come to a different conclusion. The pro- will provide them when in Government. posed road must go ahead and there are ways of That one should preserve sites in situ is one dealing with the problems that have been view in archaeology but it is not practical or outlined. realistic in this age. We must consider preserving The issue in question is one regarding which by record. This is the reality and the road we must there is no right or wrong answer. All we can do go down. once we have agreed that we want to build a road A pink option, as it was described by the NRA, — there is virtually full agreement that we do — was put on the table when it was making its is arrive at the best answer, bearing in mind a decision. This option is the one that has the least variety of criteria, including archaeological effect on archaeological sites but, unfortunately, criteria, that are very important regarding the it is probably the most expensive. However, it has road in question. been researched and the associated route has It is difficult to make a decision on the route been drawn on a map. The NRA has done much of the road because we have all been lobbied preliminary work on the pink option and it should heavily on this issue and professors on both sides 107 Roads Infrastructure: 23 November 2004. Motion 108

[Ms O. Mitchell.] better than what has now been determined? I do have been cited. Film stars and others from all not think so. We have gone through the process. over the world, but not too many from County Whatever one might think about the process — I Meath, have expressed their views on it. As I said previously to the Minister that I do not think tried to inform myself on it, I wavered from side a whole lot of it — we have gone through it and to side in a way that I did not find necessary selected a route. regarding the Carrickmines issue, which was very We have all heard calls for a compromise by much more clear-cut. Most people realise there is building three bypasses and linking them a vast difference between the remains of a 500- together. I would like it if that were the solution, year-old outer wall of a castle and archaeological but it is not the case. Not only would it be danger- sites in a 5,000-year-old landscape. ous but it would add significantly to the conges- Tonight I have heard accusations, counter tion on the road. It would create a number of accusations, rebuttals and so on. The waters have bottlenecks. If anyone doubts it, they should ask been so muddied that we cannot have a rational the residents of Knocklyon or Sandyford who had debate on the issue, not least as a result of the a motorway spewing out into their area for a presence of professional objectors associated with number of years. This is exactly what would hap- the campaign. There is a type of objectors’ road- pen if a number of bypasses were built and the show whereby they move from one cause to traffic was fed back on to the narrow roads. another — almost any cause will do. These types The people of Meath have a once-off oppor- of objectors do very little to serve the people of tunity to get 57 kilometers of high standard County Meath who have genuine concerns, which motorway, which would deliver them from the perhaps could be addressed and ameliorated but constant congestion of the Navan Road. It would for the “all or nothing” nature of the campaigns reduce their business costs, improve safety, run by professional objectors who are more con- relieve the local feeder road of traffic and end the cerned with negative campaigning than with find- conflict between heavy commercial and commut- ing solutions to problems. ing traffic and children travelling to school, trac- The waters are muddied further by the one- tors, animal movement, pedestrians, cyclists and sided nature of the information available to all of all the normal activities which require a safer us, particularly to the public. It is difficult enough environment and slower pace. I am not sure if the for us as Deputies to get accurate information. chance which is currently available will be avail- Inevitably, our opinions are formed and able in the future. I would be very reluctant to informed, and our decision-making is influenced halt the process now and I do not think we would by the kind of information available to us. I heard be serving the people of Meath well if we did so. today that the chosen route was the worst, but my information is that it is the second best in terms Mr. English: I thank my colleagues for allowing of avoiding the archaeology of the area. I assume me to speak on this motion. As I am probably the that information is correct. What we did not hear only Deputy who lives on this route and within a is that what is best for the archaeology of the area certain distance of the proposed motorway, five is highly unsuitable in terms of the impact on minutes will not be sufficient time to speak on traffic, environmental footprint, visual intrusion the matter. There is no doubt that most people and so on. We heard all about the archaeological who have problems regarding the Tara area arguments but little about any of the other issues believe in the merits of the motorway. Most that must be considered when building a road. people who live in County Meath are in favour For instance, we did not hear that in the six routes of it, but they not want it at the cost of the considered initially — ten routes were examined destruction of Tara. These people are entitled to — in the sensitive area around Tara the impact a proper debate and answers on the issue. was measured across 18 different aspects, includ- There has been a request to discuss the matter ing traffic, safety, environment, visual intrusion, further at committee level. If there is a question the impact on homes, people, businesses, hedge- about the process, it should be answered. I spoke rows, farms, severance, community and archae- on the issue in committee a number of months ology. All these aspects are important. I accept ago but there has been no progress on the matter. archaeology is particularly important in such a If there had been progress, perhaps this motion sensitive area but the route that was selected was would not have been tabled. There are questions top in 14 of the 18 criteria examined. The next to be answered and people’s fears must be best option was way behind. allayed. We must find a solution to the problem. What was chosen in the end was neither the There appears to be a civil war between them and cheapest nor shortest route; it was the best route us, which is not good enough. in 14 of the 18 criteria examined, as determined The people of Navan, Kells, Cavan etc., want not by blinkered officialdom or people with a par- and need the motorway. I live beside the pro- ticular point of view, but by 18 well paid, inde- posed route and have driven through the area pendent professional experts in their field. If this every day since I began driving. The motorway is the best of ten routes, the logic of the argument was needed long before now. The motion seeks is that if we drop or postpone this proposal there to find a solution to the problem. There will be is an 11th route which will be better. Is there a inevitable problems with one section of the route that will not meet with objections or that is motorway. There are two sides to the argument. 109 Health Bill 2004: 23 November 2004. Second Stage (Resumed) 110

The Taoiseach said last week that he is not con- alone will not solve our problems. A railway is vinced by the arguments, but we need to find a needed. Development of the M50 junction is solution, otherwise there will not be a motorway. needed in order that people can get into Dublin. This is my greatest fear as a representative for A motorway will improve conditions at off-peak Navan, one of the areas affected. However, I do times. At peak times there will be no great not want any area to suffer unduly as a result. improvement. Something must be done. I ask for Naturally, any motorway will cause some suffer- a review of this and an examination of other ways ing, but we should avoid causing unnecessary of solving transport problems. problems in the Tara-Skyrne valley. The only way to deal with the issue is for both Debate adjourned. sides to compromise. The construction of the motorway should begin while a compromise is Health Bill 2004: Second Stage (Resumed). being sought. Excuses are being made that one section of the motorway cannot begin because it Question again proposed: “That the Bill be will be tolled and it is just one project. This is the now read a Second Time.” choice that was made. It began as three projects in 1999 when I first became a councillor. Why can Dr. Twomey: Fine Gael supports the reform of it not be separated? I have 30 or 40 questions the health service. However, it is not interested which I would like to ask on behalf of myself and in the perception of reform because this issue is others. If we received answers to the questions, it too important to both patients and potential might help us move on. Can we begin with part patients. Earlier I pointed out that we need to of the project and solve the problem while the know the qualifications of the new board of the work continues? Construction should begin at HSE to have an informed opinion on their ability, Carnaross, Clonee and so on. As it will take three we want clarity on the issue of accountability and or four years to construct the motorway, perhaps that we want lines of command and delegation of a solution could be found in the meantime. This roles that are clear for everybody to see when the would not cause a delay and it would give people HSE comes into operation. a fair chance to put forward their case and try to The risk of all these changes not working is resolve the issue. extremely high. The opportunities for patients to Bypasses are needed to relieve the traffic flow express their concerns through the consultative through Navan, Kells and Dunshaughlin. The suf- and regional fora are unclear and are not binding fering of 22,000 commuters who must travel each on Government. The opportunity to dismiss, day from Meath to Dublin to work — it is elude and even hide patients’ complaints is a sig- another area where the Government has failed nificant possibility. The patient is not fully pro- because these people should not have to travel to tected by this legislation. On those grounds alone Dublin — trying to negotiate these towns cannot Fine Gael must oppose this legislation. continue. There is also suffering involved for The view of workers must be respected. those who do not need to leave Navan, Kells and Although the Minister said there will be no Dunshaughlin because they cannot conduct their forced redundancies, many of the employees of business properly. The commercial viability of the health service are extremely concerned about these towns is suffering and something must be what their roles will be. We must be crystal clear done about the problem. as to the role of advisers, consultants and commit- This debate relates to more than just the tees established by the HSE if it is not to contrib- motorway. I am disappointed that alternatives ute to the difficulties we have seen in the health have not been examined. A rail link has not been boards up to now, with no rationalisation of the considered. The Minister should not shake his administration of the health service and another head. This aspect has not been considered. One tier of administration simply added in place of cannot dispute the need for a railway line. There one we have removed. will always be disputes about motorways but a There are two major points I did not reach railway line would be acceptable to everyone. It before Private Members’ business that I want would make common sense to build a railway line clarified. The former Minister for Health and but the issue is not being discussed. The NRA Children, Deputy Martin, and the current Mini- and Iarnro´ dE´ ireann could not work together on ster, Deputy Harney, have stated that the HSE the project. We will now have a motorway but will be accountable to the Minister for Health and not a railway line. The motorway could be Children. I do not see undisputed evidence that delayed for years because of concerns expressed this is the case. My reading of this legislation is or there might be a decision to change the route. that the Minister will be able to avoid difficult Alternatively, it might transpire that we can build questions on the health service after 1 January only three bypasses and 90% of the motorway. 2005. This is not the way to deal with a crisis in Solutions need to be found. A railway could have the health service. If we have failed the public been built by now, either on its own or in con- over the past five years, covering up is no junction with a motorway, but that was not even solution. considered. Earlier the Minister stated: “The CEO will, We need to find a solution. People in the under section 21, be required to appear before northern area need this motorway. A motorway Oireachtas committees when requested by those 111 Health Bill 2004: 23 November 2004. Second Stage (Resumed) 112

[Dr. Twomey.] Ms McManus: I move amendment No. 1: committees to account for the performance of the To delete all words after “That” and substi- executive.” She continued: “Political responsi- tute the following: bility for the activities of the health service will rest with the Minister for Health and Children “Da´il E´ ireann declines to give a second who, supported by the Department, will hold the reading to the Bill in view of: executive to account.” The legislation does not (a) the inadequate time given to refer to that. The only reference to a Minister is members of the Da´il to consider the terms in section 9 where it is stated that in carrying out of the Bill; the duties under this section the CEO shall not (b) the fact that the position of Chief question or express an opinion on the merits of Executive of the Health Service Executive any policy of the Government, or a Minister of has yet to be filled; the Government or on the merits or objectives of such a policy. There is nothing to indicate that the (c) the threatened industrial action by HSE will be accountable to Da´il E´ ireann. This is, 15,000 members of the trade union therefore, another agency similar to the National IMPACT, arising from concerns about Roads Authority, which is an unaccountable jobs and working conditions; statutory body from which we will get very poor (d) the confusion and uncertainty that answers when we request them after 1 January. remains about Government plans for Section 20 provides that the new CEO, and not reform of the health services.”. the Secretary General of the Department of This Bill is a major legal instrument that will Health and Children, will be the accounting result in a new configuration of administration of officer of the executive. The Minister believes this our health service. It is an important Bill worthy is a very strong form of accountability for public of full public scrutiny. It is clear the Minister for funds and will give much greater clarity than Health and Children believes otherwise. By forc- before, but I disagree. Accountability could be ing through a rushed debate without any period worse than before given that the only information for reflection or consultation, she is trampling on we might get will be what the CEO and the HSE every safeguard that a reasonable person, regard- decide to give and we will have no way of finding less of their political outlook, expects of a Parlia- out for ourselves the details we now get from the ment worthy of the name. By her actions the health boards. When we have questions regarding Minister for Health and Children is treating this what is happening to our patients, what is hap- House with disdain and the people we represent pening in the health boards, how money is being with contempt. spent, we can get relatively detailed answers at This Government has had 18 months since it present. I am afraid that soon this will no longer announced its plan to abolish health boards and be the case. establish a Health Service Executive. During that I have read the reports that have been pub- time we have seen no detailed proposals of the lished. I have read the health strategy, and I have legislation envisaged. No heads of the Bill have read the Prospectus and Brennan reports. They been published and no briefings on the Bill have are fairly nebulous. They do not set out clearly been held for Members of this House. The arbi- what will happen regarding the administration of trary date of 1 January was set as the start-up date for the new HSE and due democratic pro- the health service after 1 January. Nothing in this cess has been sacrificed at the altar of expediency legislation makes me comfortable about voting as a result. for it. There is still much that needs to be changed There is, at the very least, a convention in this in the primary legislation. There is a huge amount House, which I understood the Minister sup- of information that could still be put out into the ported, that a Bill, particularly a major Bill of this public domain by the Department of Health and type, should be published two weeks — at a mini- Children. The role of the Department after 1 Jan- mum — before it is debated on Second Stage so uary is not clear. The people who work there are that time and attention can be given to the a great source of advice for Members of this changes contained in it. That procedure has been House, but we are not sure what they will be flouted by the Minister. Debate on the Bill was doing after 1 January. due to begin tomorrow, although it was published There are so many ifs, buts and possibilities. only last Friday evening. However, even that ludi- As both a politician and a medical doctor, this is crously tight timeframe was not tight enough for creating the fear that we will not know what is the Minister and the debate is now shoved back happening in the health service after 1 January into today’s Order of Business. I am not and that in some respects this legislation is letting interested in any statement of regret from her the Government off the hook on significant issues about this decision. What is needed is a full and that are continually raised in this House. These comprehensive explanation as to why the issues must be clarified even if the amendments Government is so intent and determined to stam- Fine Gael will be tabling on Committee Stage pede this important Bill through the House just are passed. 96 hours after publication and 36 hours after Members received their copy of it. It may be a 113 Health Bill 2004: 23 November 2004. Second Stage (Resumed) 114 record but, if it is, it is a despicable record. A new recommendations made in the Brennan and Pros- low has been reached by a Government that has pectus reports. This was the spin but the truth is lost the run of itself. The Minister should tell us different. The truth is that Professor Brennan’s the reasons for her hurry and tell us what is so report specifically recommended the retention of important or pressing that democratic account- health boards, in the Minister’s words, “to safe- ability must suffer at her hand. The Minister built guard the need for local democratic represen- her reputation on telling it as it is so let us hear tation”. Her only caveat concerned the size and it from her now. number of health boards, which should be Maybe we should not be surprised — this high- reviewed, a point on which I support her. All that speed hijack of democracy is only the latest twist is left in the Bill of her recommendation is sham in a comedy of errors that has characterised the local representation. Government’s approach to health care reform Even within the narrow confines of administra- since it was announced in June 2003 — but we tive reform there is a shortfall between what was should begin to worry. The comedy of errors has promised and what we received. The Govern- every likelihood of becoming a catalogue of disas- ment’s health care programme states: ters. Back in the heady days of the health strategy A key policy aim of the health strategy is to launch in 2002 we were promised health care deliver high quality services that are based on reform. However, by June 2003 we discovered evidence-supported best practice. In order for what was on offer was administrative reform only. the reformed health service to base planning The big challenges facing a true health care and policy-making on world-class standards, it reformer were ignored then and continue to this is essential to ensure that high quality infor- day to be ignored. The Government has no policy mation is available to the system. The Health to tackle the inherent inequality in our health ser- Information and Quality Authority will be vice. The system of apartheid between the treat- established to achieve this aim. ment of private and public patients is intact. There is no policy to shift care towards the most The Government is merrily pursuing its course of appropriate level, to move, that is, towards pri- establishing the HSE on 1 January next without mary and community care so that fewer patients this essential reform being published. There is no end up in hospital. The Cabinet decision on gen- sign of the Health Information and Quality Auth- eric drug description has disappeared off the map, ority or the Bill to establish it. Information and the 3,000 beds did not materialise, the hospital quality should be central to the new structures waiting lists did not disappear and the 200,000 which are to come into being. Without this piece medical cards were taken away. Yet, those who of the jigsaw in place, the proposal to set up the suffered are expected to be grateful for a cheap, HSE is seriously defective and even risky. yellow pack substitute. It is 18 months since the Government set in We have a new Minister but we still have the train an interim HSE to deal with transition issues same old spin. On RTE’s “This Week” pro- and to enable a smooth transfer to the new struc- gramme last Sunday the Minister for Health and tures. Instead, there has been a lack of consul- Children spoke to the Irish people and told them tation and certainty at all levels over that period a cock and bull story. She told them that the level as new structures and systems affecting around of medical card coverage is now at its highest 120,000 people are being mooted and developed. level since 1995 as a consequence of the provision The Minister for Finance stated publicly that in this year’s Estimates, which is simply untrue. there would be no forced redundancies and the The claims made by the Minister are unfounded Government stated there would be no voluntary and she knows well that a medical card provides redundancies. Meanwhile, however, health for a whole range of benefits other than the visit boards have been abolished and will no longer to the doctor, and to claim that a free general function as an entity in the new structures. It is practitioner card is a medical card is gross difficult to envisage how this circle can be dishonesty. squared, particularly as a whole new layer of The Minister talks, as her predecessor did, administration is being created by the interim about a patient-centred health service, and she HSE. again referred to it in this debate. To have the Today I received the most extraordinary patient at the centre of the service is a wonderful answer to a parliamentary question in regard to idea but it does not match reality despite the best senior management posts which might have been efforts of professionals caring for patients. It is filled by health boards. I discovered that a circu- worth noting that in this major Bill, which covers lar went out from the Department of Health and 68 pages, there is only one mention of the word Children last March advising health boards that “patient”. We may have been promised a patient- they were not to appoint to new posts without centred health service, but instead all we got was permission because of the changes in the struc- an announcement from the Government of its tures, which sounds reasonable on the part of the intention to abolish health boards and to establish Minister and the Department. However, it turns the Health Service Executive. This is hardly a out that since March last 22 senior management health care reform programme. Nor it is correct posts have been filled. That does not make sense. to maintain, as the Minister repeated in her con- These senior management posts have been filled tribution, that the changes announced followed at a time when the employers making the 115 Health Bill 2004: 23 November 2004. Second Stage (Resumed) 116

[Ms McManus.] leaves a disturbing lacuna. There is little reassur- appointments are in effect out of a job in the ance to be drawn from the temporary appoint- sense that the health boards are defunct. These 22 ment of Mr. Kevin Kelly in that position. posts mean that a remarkable number of senior We have no proper debate or scrutiny of legis- managers have come into the system at a time lation, no information and quality authority, no when we should expect, if anything, movement in partnership, no streamlined system of change, no the opposite direction. CEO and no need for the headlong rush to meet The Minister should tell us how many staff will the 1 January deadline. That is why we in the be left in the Department of Health and Children Labour Party are tabling this amendment. when these structures go through, which might With regard to the appointments to the HSE provide a picture of what is happening within the board itself, appointments which as Deputy service. It would be useful also if the Minister Twomey pointed out are still unknown, the Bill would tell the House how many staff currently quite rightly specifies that no member of the employed in particular positions will no longer be Oireachtas or European Parliament should be employed in those positions given this change appointed. However, there is no statutory bar on across the health board structure. I presume she other inappropriate appointments other than the knows the answer. obvious ones related to criminal records and the IMPACT is a trade union with an honourable like. This board will have sole responsibility for record of embracing change and is not one of the the management of our health service. It will trade unions which has tried to block develop- meet in secret. It will be very different from the ment. However, even that trade union has been current management system which is essentially driven through frustration to the point of holding the responsibility of the Minister and is managed a strike ballot and directing its members not to by the Civil Service. Whatever about the short- attend briefing meetings. The vote was endorsed comings in the current system, there was little if by a massive margin of 7:1, whereupon Mr. Kevin any possibility of a conflict of interest. In the new Kelly, chairman of the HSE, went on radio and environment, where private individuals rather stated it was all due to a misunderstanding. A than civil servants will be managing the health misunderstanding, if that is the problem, should service, that will no longer be the case. not arise if the people driving change are doing We hear a lot about vested interests in the their jobs properly. However, the IMPACT health service. In this new structure there is even spokesperson, who was also interviewed on radio, greater likelihood of influence from vested made it clear that this is about more. He spoke interests such as the pharmaceutical industry, for about a breakdown in trust, delays, breaches of example. A person from that industry is currently agreements and an AIB culture intruding into the on the interim board, and I note that solely as an health service. This is serious from a trade union obvious example. that has welcomed health care reform and helped A code of conduct is provided for in this Bill to deliver it in the past. We will have to wait and for those appointed to the board but it is for guid- see if this is to be another first for the Minister. ance only and looks like a very poor protection Will she be responsible for the birth of a new against powerful interests that have much to gain statutory body that on opening its eyes for the by having a foothold in a body managing the first time will confront the possibility of a strike entire Irish health service. The reference to gen- by the workers for whom it is responsible? der balance is so weak as to be meaningless. We We move on to the matter of the new chief do not know who these members will be but we executive officer or, to be more accurate, his fail- know they will meet in secret. The media will not ure to show. have the access it has hitherto had to health Professor Aidan Halligan was to be the Bonnie board meetings and the public will not have Prince Charlie of our day, coming over the waves access either. to liberate us. He was such a catch that he was In section 20 of the Bill, the CEO is defined as offered the highest salary rate ever for an Irish the accounting officer. That is a significant public servant, who could afford to get home in change. I find it unacceptable that the Minister time for his tea every day by helicopter if he for Health is going to bring in amendments as yet needed to, and whose coming was announced unseen to her own Bill on this particular section. officially by the Minister, again with a virtual fan- If they are simply technical amendments as she fare of trumpets. First he was to come next April. claims, what is the delay in publishing them? Then he was convinced to come by the end of Section 32 of the Bill requires the executive to next January. Deliverance, we were to under- prepare and adopt a service plan specifying the stand, was at hand for the Irish health service. services to be provided within the financial limits Alack and alas, like the Young Pretender the for the year. The Minister has extensive powers professor never did come over the sea. It turned and can amend the plan and issue directions as out he had not signed any contract nor signed off to its form and manner of preparation. However, on his existing job. He is perfectly entitled not to there is no requirement on the Minister to publish do so, but I would love to hear what he has to the draft service plan or give any ministerial say about all this. The failure to appoint a CEO directions, nor is there any requirement in this further undermines confidence in the Minister Bill to publish the service plan even in its final responsible. Professor Halligan’s withdrawal form. 117 Health Bill 2004: 23 November 2004. Second Stage (Resumed) 118

I have grave concerns with the proposal that Will the Minister define personal social ser- the Oireachtas Committee on Health and Chil- vices? The Minister may need to seek legal advice dren will have the oversight role. That is unrealis- on that issue. Part 2 of the Disability Bill defines tic and my experience so far has not been encour- “health service” as meaning a service, including a aging. The only time that Mr. Kelly addressed the personal social service, provided by or on behalf committee was in his early days, when he clearly of a health board. “Personal social service” is did not have much experience, but he referred undefined in that Bill and in any other statute. If repeatedly to the road-map being the composite one looks up Oasis, Comhairle’s information on plan towards which everyone was working. As a the public services website, one is cross-referred member of the committee I looked for a copy of to “community care services”, a term that has no that composite plan. I did not get it for weeks statutory definition either. According to the web- and I had to badger everyone, including the then site, public health services provided in the com- Minister, the Taoiseach and others before I got munity in Ireland are sometimes referred to as it. That is not a very encouraging experience if community care services. They are generally pro- we are talking of an Oireachtas committee which vided by the health boards or by voluntary organ- is very busy and which has to concentrate on isations in conjunction with or on behalf of the many aspects of the health service, playing such health boards. Entitlement to community care a central role. services is not as clear-cut as entitlement to Part 8 outlines a series of bodies that have the hospital services. There is also wide variation in potential to be expensive and time-wasting talk the level of services available in different parts of shops. A national consultative forum “may be the country. In general, medical cardholders are convened” from time to time — big deal. The entitled to community care services free of county councillors are to be pacified by regional charge, though not of course the “yellow pack” health forums with no power, but of course with unfortunates. Others may also be entitled but it expenses, and if that is not enough we will have is not always possible actually to get the services. local panels which will be circumscribed even in Community care services can include the public the matters they can discuss. health nursing service, home help service, physio- The biggest failing of the health board struc- therapy, occupational therapy, chiropody service, ture was the lack of direct accountability. day care, respite care service and so on. The rules Members of health authorities should have been about which community care services must be and could still be directly elected by the people, provided differ in accordance with the different not channelled through county councils. Had that services. In some cases, health boards are obliged decision to have direct elections been taken and to provide services, while in others the health had Professor Brennan’s advice been heeded, we board has discretion about whether to make the would have a dynamic and responsive structure, service available. unlike this plethora of bodies that will be all The website goes on to deal, in turn, with mouth and no teeth. I am dissatisfied because the public health nurses, care assistants, home helps, nature of this Bill is to offer much promise but physiotherapy, occupational therapy, chiropody, then let us down. It is very disappointing in what technical aids, respite care, day it does. 9 o’clock centres, meal services, transport, Do the proposals for a complaints procedure social workers, speech therapists and satisfy the need for a clear and independent dieticians. I can find a statutory basis for the pro- assessment of complaints? The appointment of vision by health boards of some of these services complaints officers will be made internally both — for example, for home nursing, home help, at executive level and at service provider level. employment training and technical aids for dis- Inevitably that will not protect the independence abled adults. However, other services do not of any response to a complaint. I would have seem to fit within the statutory framework but, thought that the experience of the Garda Com- admittedly, the framework is piecemeal and I plaints Board and its utter failure to deal with may have overlooked something. complaints from the public should be a warning In regard to social workers, the position seems to the framers of this legislation. I would prefer to be that on the abolition of public assistance to see the proposal for a health ombudsman who provided by local authorities and the introduction would play an effective and focused watchdog of supplementary welfare in the 1970s, the role which would benefit the service as well as remaining public assistance officers were trans- the user and would be a much healthier, cleaner ferred to health boards but the health boards, in way to deal with complaints. A complaints pro- general, and these transferred officers, in particu- cedure was promised for a long time even before lar, apart from dispensing supplementary welfare, this Bill was mooted but what has been produced were not given any specific social welfare brief. It in the Bill is a deep disappointment. would be odd if there were no statutory basis for The voluntary hospitals are not mentioned in the employment of social workers or the pro- the Bill. I wonder what discussions have been vision of services by them outside the context of held with them, or with the Department or the child care and the Child Care Act, but perhaps HSE with regard to their future relationship the Minister might find out and advise us in her within the health service. reply. 119 Health Bill 2004: 23 November 2004. Second Stage (Resumed) 120

[Ms McManus.] cussing proposals to create four health boards in Are physiotherapy, occupational therapy and the Dublin region and making the point that chiropody sought to be justified as being out- everyone acknowledged that the old Eastern patient services under the 1970 Health Act which Health Board was a monster but that there was a includes institutional services other than inpatient real risk that we are going to create four monsters services provided at, or by persons, attached to a instead of one. There is a real risk here in that hospital or home and institutional services pro- this Bill is being rushed through to the point vided at a laboratory, clinic, health centre or simi- where nobody has stopped to reflect and to lar premises? Where does respite care fit in? Is it ensure things which could be done better will be deemed to be a form of home help for which done better. There is a real risk we will end up there is statutory authority? Is a health board jus- with a board that is unaccountable and untouch- tified in providing or funding a day centre which able, other than by way of its connection with the provides activities such as recreation, sport or lei- Minister, that there will not be proper oversight sure facilities outside a strict employment training and that it will not be open in the way modern context? Where do technical aids for disabled society and the protection of patients demand. children fit in? Neither seems to fall under section 68 of the Health Act 1970. It may be that the Mr. Connolly: I wish to share my time with Disability Bill not only deals with the provision Deputies Gormley and O´ Caola´in. of an indeterminate range of undefined services, I welcome the opportunity to speak on this Bill. variously described as community care or per- It signals the biggest shake up in the health ser- sonal social services, but that in regard to some vices in 43 years. The establishment of the Health of them at least, there is no statutory basis for Service Executive will transform the administra- their provision in the first place. tive function of the health boards with the effect The matter is confused rather than clarified by of centralising services. Effectively, we will move the Health Bill 2004. This Bill proposes to define from 11 health boards to four nationally. Health health and personal social services for the first board members, the democratic voice of the time. It is clear that it is simply to be a compendi- people, were the people’s watchdog in regard to ous term which encompasses everything existing services at local level. There was a myth that health boards already do. The term is defined in health board members cost the health boards a section 2 as meaning services provided in accord- fortune. If one looks at what they cost, it was in ance with the scheduled Acts. The Schedule lists the region of .003% of the total budget. Before it every Act that contains a reference to a service reached health boards, 97% of health board fund- provided by a health board. For example, health ing was predetermined so the influence health board functions under the Marriages Act 1844 board members had was negligible. The benefit and the State Lands (Workhouses) Act 1930 and was that the people felt they had a voice. There 1962 are health and personal social personal ser- was also the voice of the professionals rep- vices. A person with a disability will be entitled to resenting professions in the health services. an assessment as to whether health board services As Deputy McManus said, rather than abol- under the Rats and Mice Destruction Act 1919 ishing health boards, we should have looked at are required to meet the needs occasioned by his ways of tweaking the system and of re-examining or her disability but not, apparently, whether he what we had. I have no doubt it needed to be or she needs a speech therapist. That may seem changed and that there was a need for account- like a technical point but it is an apposite one ability in the way services were delivered. since we have been dealing with systems and However, I am not particularly happy with the structures with which we have become familiar way we are moving in terms of ministerial nomi- and which have provided services at community nees and so on. These people do not have to go level. However, I raise the question whether they back to the electorate. Effectively, there will be a all have a statutory basis. Does that issue need to bunch of head nodders on this board and there be addressed in this Bill? will be a lack of accessibility for the press and so The concentration has been on changes in on. It is an issue of major concern. administration to the point of obsession. Essen- The abolition of these health boards and the tially, the problem lies in the hospital sector and establishment of the HSE is clearing the way for I would prefer if a new national hospitals auth- implementation of the recommendations in the ority had been established and if the health Hanly report. There will be no democratic objec- boards had been directly elected and streamlined, tions and no voice for the people. Given the that is, fewer in number, larger in geographic changes to the health services which were sig- area, and maintained not to deal with hospitals nalled, health board members were a thorn in the but with community services such as primary care side of the Department, the Executive and the and so on for which they have built up a responsi- professional bodies. The easy option was to get bility. That separation would have made a lot of rid of health boards so there would be no difference but with a lot less disturbance and cost. objectors. Obviously, there are always concerns about There has been a number of reports on the bureaucracy and streamlining to make sure there health services recently. I believe the cost of is not unnecessary bureaucracy but I do not see those reports totals approximately \40 million. I this Bill resolving that issue. I remember dis- wish to refer to the health strategy and the Hanly 121 Health Bill 2004: 23 November 2004. Second Stage (Resumed) 122 report. The health strategy refers to services was a case last year where patients were put in a being accessible to all. Under the Hanly report, I hospital carpark. do not see how that can happen because the Are the regional centres going to adopt a Hanly report, irrespective of what people say, is system similar to that initiated by Holles Street about removing services from the smaller Hospital whereby notice will be given that only a hospitals. There will be a withdrawal of services certain number of patients will be treated at a from hospitals such as Monaghan General particular time? The precedent has been set in Hospital and Ennis, Nenagh and Loughlinstown this regard. The situation will arise whereby we hospitals. In particular, services are being with- simply cannot handle the volume of patients drawn from accident and emergency units. That presenting for treatment. Hospitals may effec- is the big threat hanging over each of these tively put themselves off call in such cases. hospitals. Looking at the situation in Monaghan My colleagues and I have been accused of General Hospital, lives have been lost. The North wanting all-singing, all-dancing hospitals at every Eastern Health Board is a prototype of what the crossroads or in every county. We know this will Hanly report is about. If one reads that report not happen. We do not expect that heart or brain and supplants the North Eastern Health Board, surgery, renal operations and orthopaedic units that is what it is and what it has given us. The can be provided in small hospitals. That is not mid-west region has been described as the pilot what people want. The key issue is the provision project but we are a step ahead of it. The north of well functioning accident and emergency units east is never out of the news and always for the at all these small hospitals. Other services must wrong reasons. Much of this is accounted for by be provided also if the accident and emergency the fact that the region has the most underfunded services are to be sustainable, to have the volume health board in the country. and mix of staff necessary in smaller hospitals. The rush to implement to the Hanly report This issue must be considered. There is no point relates to the requirement to satisfy the EU in people being told at Monaghan General Working Time Directive which was to be Hospital, for instance, that they should hold on implemented on 1 July this year. The report con- for another hour and they will brought to a sidered many options but only certain of those regional centre of excellence. People have died on the way to other hospitals and this will con- options are being taken. These are the cheap tinue to happen. options. Smaller hospitals have been robbed of The priority must be to save lives. People’s their staff to accommodate a reduction in staff concerns regarding their local hospitals is to have hours in the larger hospitals in line with the EU faith that their lives will be saved rather than directive. The Hanly report also referred to the endangered. They are willing to undertake jour- need for beds. More than 2,000 beds are required neys for elective treatment. Patients have trav- in the system. The report also referred to regional elled to Cork, Waterford, England and elsewhere centres of excellence. I would be very happy to to receive elective treatment under the national be shown these centres. treatment purchase fund. There is no objection to The changes are more hospital-focused than such travel because it is not a matter of emer- patient-focused. We are familiar with environ- gency and their lives are not under threat at that mental impact studies. A patient-impact study of time. the changes proposed in the Hanly report should A significant issue is consultant numbers and I have been undertaken. The major question is wish to offer some comparative figures in this how to marry the requirements in terms of local regard. The average EU figure is 139 surgeons services with the changes proposed with regard to per 100,000 population while the corresponding the establishment of regional centres of excel- figure here is 31. The EU average for gynaecolo- lence. This will be the acid test. There is a percep- gists and obstetricians is 131 as compared to tion that my Independent colleagues and I are Ireland’s figure of 23. The EU figure for paedia- opposed to such regional centres. This is grossly tricians is 146 while in Ireland it is 22. There are unfair. We are pro-people, pro-services and pro- on average 98 radiotherapists per 100,000 popu- local hospitals. lation in the EU but only 39 in this country. We However, I do not know how these centres will must begin to employ more consultants, pro- cope with the additional volume of patients that fessionals and hands-on people in the service. will be transferred from smaller hospitals. If Last week, the Ta´naiste and Minister for regional centres of excellence include such facili- Health and Children sent her adviser to the ties as Beaumont and Tallaght Hospitals, the Cavan-Monaghan area. When she receives the reality is that they cannot cope with the current report of this visit, I hope she will listen to the volume of patients. Cavan General Hospital concerns expressed by the Monaghan Hospital cannot cope with the overflow of patients from alliance, the Monaghan Hospital development Monaghan General Hospital. This problem will group and the staff in both hospitals in the area. be magnified in larger hospitals. The notion of This will allow the Ta´naiste to gain a better regional centres of excellence with spare capacity enlightenment as to the services required. is an excellent prospect. However, where are we There has been talk of providing clinical nurse to accommodates patients? They are being put on practitioners in hospital units. This sounds like a trolleys in corridors and in dental rooms. There good idea. However, the training period for clini- 123 Health Bill 2004: 23 November 2004. Second Stage (Resumed) 124

[Mr. Connolly.] What questions will the Ceann Comhairle rule cal nurse practitioners is some seven years and out of order because a matter is deemed to be there are five such qualified people currently one for the Health Service Executive? It would employed in the health service. Moreover, clinical be helpful if the Ta´naiste could spell out in detail nurse practitioners must have a consultant in the matters about which we will not be allowed to room with them. Allocating such a practitioner to ask questions. Will we be able to ask about bed a hospital, therefore, necessitates the co-oper- shortages, the accident and emergency crisis, ation of a consultant surgeon. They are not stand- orthodontic or cancer services? What will be off alone staff and the Ta´naiste should take this limits? If a subject is off limits, does that not into consideration. mean there will be less accountability? What pre- cise input will the House have in making health Mr. Gormley: I welcome the opportunity to policy? We are told that under section 29 the speak on this important legislation and appreciate executive will have to produce a corporate plan. the Ta´naiste’s attendance at the debate. The Under section 30, such a plan will have to be Ta´naiste did not sell herself short in her introduc- placed before the House after the Minister has tion of the Bill. Words such as “historic” and approved it. Surely if the Minister is serious about “once in a generation event” tripped off her accountability, the House should have the oppor- tongue. I am only surprised she did not use the tunity to debate such a corporate plan and to words “ground breaking” to describe the legis- make amendments. Likewise, we should have the lation. She also claimed to be putting the patient opportunity to debate the progress reports. We first, a claim we have heard before. We heard it will have progress reports and they will simply at the launch of the health strategy in 2001 when come before the House, but we will not have the so many other promises were made. We were opportunity to debate them. That is a missed promised 200,000 more medical cards but all we opportunity in the legislation. got was an extra 30,000 courtesy of the Estimates. Perhaps that can be revisited on Committee This is what the Government describes as “put- Stage. However, I believe this will not happen ting the patient first”. We were promised 3,000 because, essentially, this legislation is about new beds but little has happened in this regard removing power from Deputies, councillors and three years later. This is another element of the health boards. Were the health boards costing the Government’s policy to put the patient first. The State a fortune, as was claimed when the idea to Ta´naiste should communicate this policy to those disband them was first put forward? No, the patients on trolleys and chairs in accident and Brennan report did not call for the disbandment emergency units as we speak. of the health boards. A few advisory panels will The Ta´naiste will tell us this is just the start of replace them. They will give advice but will any- a brand new era in health care which will usher one pay a blind bit of notice to what they advise? in a state-of-the-art, world-class health service, as How much will this new executive cost? It will she has described it. In order for it to happen, not come cheap. We will pay an inordinate we must give it time. I do not buy that. This Bill amount of money to its chief executive so that represents yet another rebranding of the health he or she will take the poisoned chalice from the service. More importantly, it represents a Minister. His or her primary function will be to rebranding of the Government parties as caring, protect the Minister, essentially, to be her mud- even socialist, and an attempt to buy time. guard, for which he or she will be handsomely remunerated. Ms Harney: The Government is not socialist. The legislation does not address the root causes of our health crisis. Like conventional medicine, Mr. Gormley: It represents an admission by the it deals with the symptoms of the problem. We Government that, after more than seven years in may be — I say “may be” because this is disputed power, the health service is a mess but that we — living longer, but we are becoming sicker. As should trust in its strategy of applying new, slick, pointed out in the latest Feasta review entitled corporate principles to the service. In a short Growth: The Celtic Cancer, which I advocate as time, perhaps after the next general election, recommended reading for the Ta´naiste—— waiting lists and the crisis in accident and emer- gency provision will be in the past. Ms Harney: It is a joke. As I said when this legislation was first mooted, Mr. Gormley: It is not a joke. the Bill sets up another layer of bureaucracy, cen- tralises control of the health service and will Ms Harney: It recommends poverty is good for result in less accountability. Under section 21, the one’s health. chief executive officer can appear before an Oireachtas committee but woe betide him or her Mr. Gormley: It is an excellent document. if a word of criticism of the Government should cross his or her lips. Section 21 (9) prohibits any Ms Harney: I read a bit of it. such critical statements and means that the CEO might as well be gagged before coming in front Mr. Gormley: That is good because I will of an Oireachtas committee. What rights do remind the Ta´naiste about a few key statistics in members have with regard to Question Time? it. 125 Health Bill 2004: 23 November 2004. Second Stage (Resumed) 126

Ms Harney: It proposes we go into recession would best improve their health found that the because it would be good for our health if we majority reported that less stress would improve were unemployed and poor. their health regardless of their age, sex and social background. A follow-up report in 2001 also Mr. Gormley: The review is no joke because it reported that stress was the most common answer is founded on the fact that—— from males and females in reply to that question. These are the facts. Ms Harney: The review is mad. In an on-line survey in 2001 a sample of 2,000 students were asked if they thought that the level Mr. Gormley: It is not mad. of stress experienced by the general Irish popu- lation had increased, in response to which more Ms Harney: It is crazy stuff. than two thirds said that it had increased a great deal, 30% said it had increased a little and only Mr. Gormley: It is an excellent piece of work. 3% said it had not increased at all. All the indica- I commend the authors of it, in particular my tions show that stress is increasing. Green Party colleague, Dr. Liz Cullen, for her One of the surveys I find fascinating was one fascinating and insightful contribution. What it on depressive disorders. In 2003, research involv- states is the key to solving the problems we are ing a representative sample of 12,702 women in currently experiencing in our health service. I am four European countries found that women in glad the Ta´naiste has at least dipped into it. Dublin were more susceptible to depressive dis- orders than in similar cities in other countries. It Ms Harney: I was so amazed by what I heard was found that one in three suffered from about it that I had to read it to see if it could depression. One of the authors, Professor Patricia possibly be true. Casey, commented that this study was conducted at a time of economic boom when one would Mr. Gormley: It is all true. expect depressive disorders to reduce. They have not reduced. This is this problem. Ms Harney: It states that economic success if The Ta´naiste created the Celtic tiger, so she bad for our health. claims. She has created this mess, this level of ill- ness and now she claims she will fix it, but I do Mr. Gormley: The Ta´naiste wants to believe not believe she will. what the Taoiseach calls the right wing econom- ists who write for The Economist who would have us believe that we are living in some sort of nirv- Ms Harney: One third of women here do not ana in that they claim we have the best quality of suffer from depression. life in the world. That is bunkum. This publi- ´ cation puts paid to that myth. Caoimhghı´nOCaola´in: This Bill will not pro- vide one extra bed in our hospital wards. It will Ms Harney: It suggests a recession would be not reduce by one hour the waiting time of a sin- good for our health. gle patient in any of our chaotic accident and emergency units. It will not lead to the employ- Mr. Gormley: We do not have the best quality ment of a single extra nurse, doctor or paramedic. of life in the world. A question I have put over It will not extend radiotherapy services to the and over again to the Minister’s predecessors, and regions. It will not restore a single service that which I will put to her, is the role played by stress has been lost to local hospitals. Above all, it will in causing illness. We have to examine stress not address the scandal whereby money can buy levels—— superior health care in this State and where public money subsidises the private health busi- Ms Harney: The Deputy is causing me stress. ness while public patients suffer. The Bill diverts vital energy from the real delivery of services. I Mr. Gormley: I will try not to. support the amendment tabled by Deputy McManus. Ms Harney: He should think about my health. Before this Bill was even published the change- over process had descended into chaos. The duly Mr. Gormley: I might be bad for the Ta´naiste’s appointed chief executive officer of the Health health if I do, but I will try not to cause her so Service Executive, for which the Bill legislates, much stress. stepped down less than two months before he was I will give a few statistics. A survey of 1,000 due to officially take up his position. On the day people carried out in 2001 on behalf of the Men- this Bill was published, IMPACT which rep- tal Health Association of Ireland found that 73% resents 25,000 workers in the health services, reported finding life more stressful than five years announced that its members had voted to stop previously, 19% of the respondents said they co-operating with preparations for health service were smoking more and 17% said they were reforms until it gets safeguards about the conti- drinking more in order to cope with stress. The nuity of health services, jobs and working con- national health and lifestyle survey of 6,539 ditions when the new health structures come into people in 1999 to ascertain what people believe force on 1 January 2005. Its members have 127 Health Bill 2004: 23 November 2004. Second Stage (Resumed) 128

[Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in.] eral Hospital, finally reducing our hospital to the endorsed industrial action by a margin of 88% to status of a day clinic. 12% in a national ballot of staff directly As a former member of the North Eastern employed by existing health boards, including Health Board, I know that colleagues of most nurses and other health professionals as well as political shades fought hard to retain services at clerical, administration and managerial staff. I do Monaghan hospital. We were met time and again not believe these workers took that decision with deliberate efforts to deceive, confuse and lightly. They feel they have been left in the dark conceal information. The executive of the health and that they face an uncertain future. board, the Department of Health and Children in I have also listened carefully to what has been Dublin and the professional bodies, such as said by organisations representing people with Comhairle na n-Ospide´al and the Royal College disabilities. They too are very concerned at the of Surgeons in Ireland, dictated from on high. lack of clarity and information about how services The Bill will make a bad situation even worse. on which they depend will be delivered under the Decision making will be even more remote from new structures. This is surely yet another example the citizen and the community. For at least all of the disastrous mismanagement of the health of next year, energy will be concentrated on this services by the Government, which published its massive bureaucratic change instead of on real health strategy in 2001, the Prospectus report in delivery for patients and real reform of the health 2003 and which is now presiding over a situation services. It cannot be stressed enough that any so- where those who deliver the services and those called reform that does not challenge the grossly who avail of them are left in a state of uncertainty unfair two-tier public/private system will only and agitation. maintain inequity and inefficiency. We should This Bill is based on the recommendations of have a much fuller discussion on that issue. Such the Prospectus report. When it was published I a debate would address the Government’s policy stated that it proposed not real reform of the of subsidising the private health industry. health services but bureaucratic change. Every- The guillotining of this Bill will not allow such thing that has happened since then, supports that a debate, but I will make some points briefly. I contention. We see all around us the glaring need ask the Minister to clarify the following issue in for real reform and real improvement in the her concluding remarks. Spin doctors in the delivery of services in our crisis ridden health Department of Health and Children, or perhaps system. Instead what do we have? We have this in the Progressive Democrats, recently told the Bill that is the wrong remedy for the wrong ill- media that the Minister wishes to increase private ness. We have a Bill to establish an all-powerful sector involvement in the health services. Lo and quango appointed by the Minister for Health and behold, a 43% increase in funding for the treat- Children and subject to no direct democratic ment purchase fund was signalled in last week’s accountability. Book of Estimates. I have asked the Taoiseach When the Prospectus report was published I how this tallies with his claim to hold socialist and stated that few would shed tears for the old republican principles but he has declined to health boards. They were too cumbersome and answer. The increased privatisation of services it was widely agreed that they would have to be can only lead to a reinforcement of the public replaced. The Minister’s comments in her intro- private apartheid in our services, which is driven ductory speech were accurate in that respect. not by the need of patients but by the profit However, they had a degree of democratic motive of the private health business. Money accountability. There was representation of must be invested in our public health system. elected councillors and of bodies representing We have yet to be given an explanation of why health service workers. That degree of account- the Minister went on a visit to New York recently ability is now gone. The Government tries to to look for ideas for our health services. I hope cover up the democratic deficit by providing in she has carefully examined the grossly unequal the Bill for fora and powerful talking shops. They health system in the United States where an esti- will be powerless talking shops. Decisions will be mated 43 million people have no health cover made even more remotely from the communities whatsoever. Perhaps the Minister will also and individuals they will affect. explain that trip to us in her closing remarks. The people of my constituency know the con- For years, the Government has been promising sequences of that only too well. The day before a separate health complaints Bill to provide a he left office the Minister’s predecessor, Deputy statutory framework for the handling of com- Martin, issued a public statement which appeared plaints within the health services. Then we were to provide for significant improvements at told statutory provision for health complaints Monaghan General Hospital and to reverse some would be included in this Bill. What have we got? of the loss of services we suffered during his term We have little or nothing. It is left to the Health of office. The promises have turned out to be a Service Executive to establish these procedures. carefully woven fabric designed for public There will be no independent complaints system. relations. That fabric has been unravelling ever Section 52 sets out all kinds of limitations and since. Last week, it was confirmed that all surgical restrictions on the type of complaints which can doctors are to be removed from Monaghan Gen- be made. 129 Health Bill 2004: 23 November 2004. Second Stage (Resumed) 130

The Bill provides for the most far reaching demand proper services and facilities. We change in the administration of the health ser- demand that sick people who turn up at accident vices since the establishment of the health boards. and emergency units, whether walking wounded It is a significant Bill for our health services, the or in ambulances, be facilitated properly and foremost issue of public concern and a foremost given a hospital bed as quickly as possible. I am responsibility of the Oireachtas. Yet, this long not talking about people with cracked finger promised and long delayed legislation was only nails. I have little sympathy for such people or for published late last Friday and we are being asked those who turn up at accident and emergency to debate and pass Second Stage of a major Bill units the worse for drink. I am talking about of 82 sections in the space of three days. It is to people who are genuinely sick. We must continue be rammed through the Oireachtas by Christmas to exert pressure to ensure that such people are in a desperate effort to hide the shambles that is facilitated. This pressure must be maintained the so-called health policy of the Government. At throughout the country and not only in my con- the core of this issue is the ongoing erosion of our stituency. Public representatives are often called health services by the Government and its failure upon to intervene on behalf of families and to to grasp that fact. calm people when their relatives are in accident Accordingly, I will be supporting the amend- and emergency units. Every opportunity should ment tabled by Deputy McManus because the be taken in this Chamber to support that view. I Bill is a mess and should be withdrawn and have heard comparisons being made with other redrafted. jurisdictions but until we reach that situation we must keep the pressure on. Mr. O’Connor: I welcome the opportunity to I have always supported the accountability of contribute to the debate and I acknowledge the health boards. In fairness, the political system presence of the Ta´naiste and Minister for Health served the health boards well, even though I and Children and the Minister of State, Deputy often saw criticism being levelled from fairly emi- Tim O’Malley. nent people around the country, including Unlike my colleague, Deputy Gormley, I do Dublin, who did not quite see the contribution of not have a book written by a party member to politicians in that positive way. Unfortunately, promote. I must pass on that opportunity. This is that criticism created a different sort of view, important legislation and it is important that we although many politicians, including councillors, debate it in the time allowed. There is pressure served the health authority and its predecessors to pass the Bill because many people are awaiting well. its enactment. I want to put on the record the great work that I too lament the passing of health boards. I was was done over the years by the association of elected to Dublin County Council in 1991 and health boards under the chairmanship of Mr. Jack was nominated to be a member of the Eastern Burke who did a tremendous job. I hope the Health Board in 1994. I was delighted to be given Minister will examine ways in which people of that opportunity and to gain that experience. such expertise will have an input under the new Working on the health board, I learned about the legislation. working of the health service at first hand. I have I have strong views about representation on also had the opportunity to serve on hospital hospital boards. I was first appointed to the plan- boards, including the board of St. James’s ning board of Tallaght Hospital in 1987 by the Hospital and the board of Tallaght hospital, then Minister for Health, Deputy Rory which I first joined in 1987. I enjoyed my time on O’Hanlon. He asked me to serve at that level and the Eastern Health Board. Subsequently, I was bring a local perspective to the work of the board. nominated by the council to the South Western I remember attending my first meeting of the Area Health Board. I became the founding chair- board in Harcourt Street and asking the chairman man of that body and was a member of the and members when we would meet in Tallaght. I Eastern Regional Health Authority. I value the almost caused consternation because that was not experience I gained of the workings of the health done at the time. I and others brought that board. For most of that period, my good friend, Tallaght feel to the board. Even when I was on Deputy Callely, was chairman of the Eastern the board of St. James’s Hospital I tried to do Health Board and of the Eastern Regional that, as did other colleagues. Health Authority and was a great help to many Where the Eastern Regional Health Auth- of us. I valued that period of my political life and ority’s nominees have lapsed it should be under- I enjoyed it hugely. While I lament the passing of stood that there is still a need for local represen- the health boards, I accept that times change and tation. I recently made representations to the things move on. We are now trying to achieve a Ta´naiste, asking her to look at that gap. As far as different model. Like all models, it will not be Tallaght is concerned, other than the nominees perfect in the first instance but we must work on of the National Children’s Hospital, the Adelaide these things. Hospital, the Meath Hospital and the archbishop, As a Fianna Fa´il backbencher, I am not afraid the charter does not provide for other represen- to say that when huge amounts of public money tation. I hope that matter will be examined. I also are being put into the health services — more appeal to those in a position to nominate than \11 billion this year — it is right that we members through that process — and I am talk- 131 Health Bill 2004: 23 November 2004. Second Stage (Resumed) 132

[Mr. O’Connor.] better. It is important that Tallaght gets its share, ing specifically about Tallaght — to look at nomi- as should Limerick or other parts of Dublin. nating more local people. It is important to have a local perspective on all hospital boards, along Mr. F. McGrath: Or Beaumont or Clontarf. with the required professional expertise. I have already made that point to the Ta´naiste and I Mr. O’Connor: Beaumont, indeed. The Deputy hope the Minister of State, Deputy Tim will understand that I do not go to Beaumont all O’Malley, will take it on board. Hopefully, it will that often, although I am happy to acknowledge come to fruition. the tremendous contribution that hospital has We must support the health services in our made to our health care services. respective regions. Normally, I would not make a I want to make the case for Millbrook Lawns Tallaght speech but it is important for me to talk because it is currently going through the planning about my constituency for a while. process and the site needs to be properly rede- veloped. I hope to have the continued support of Mr. Neville: I was there today. the Department and the Minister in seeking those facilities. There is a need to keep pace with Mr. F. McGrath: The Deputy should stay under requirements throughout my constituency and the Whip. the region generally. Sick, vulnerable people who wish to access health services should be entitled Mr. Neville: Alan Dukes No.2—the to do so in proper facilities. Tallaght strategy. Where I came from in Crumlin, I remember looking at health centres that had not been Mr. O’Connor: I represent Dublin South-West upgraded for some years. The case for upgrading which has approximately 35,000 houses and a such facilities must be made when there is money population of about 70,000. It goes from Brittas in the economy to do so. I applaud the work of to Tallaght, Firhouse, Templeogue and health board staff throughout the country and Greenhills. specifically in my own area in the Eastern Regional Health Authority which succeeded the Mr. Neville: He has a vote in every area. Eastern Health Board. People make the point that there are too many staff but we should Mr. O’Connor: During my period in public life, appreciate the great work they have done. I have continued to campaign strongly with col- Like my colleagues in the House, I have had leagues from all parties for proper facilities many dealings not only with hospital staff but also throughout that region and not only in our with those looking after medical card applications hospital. We all campaigned in Tallaght to ensure and the delivery of health services generally. I that the Adelaide, Meath and National Children’s acknowledge the work they are doing and sup- Hospitals came to Tallaght, which they did in port them in their efforts. June 1998. There are other facilities there also, however. I sometimes invite people to come to Mr. Neville: But they cannot cope. Tallaght and I would be happy to show colleagues around. Now that the Luas is there it is easy to Mr. O’Connor: In the context of the devel- access. opments taking place under the remit of the Bill, health staff should be properly briefed about Mr. F. McGrath: The Deputy should not for- what is going on. They should also have an oppor- get Beaumont. tunity to discuss their future. When I worked in an ordinary job, I went through phases when we Mr. O’Connor: Other facilities in the area did not know what was going on in companies but include the brand new health centre in Jobstown, it is important to understand what is happening. the new GP centre in Killinarden and similar Those of us who are privileged to represent con- facilities in Brookfield. The need for a refur- stituencies here have a responsibility to continue bished and developed health centre in Millbrook to make that point. When I meet health workers Lawns remains an issue, although the Govern- in Tallaght, Millbrook Lawns, Brookfield, Killin- ment has grant-aided that to the extent of \1 mill- arden and Jobstown I get the sense they would ion so far. I wish to tell the Minister of State that like to know what is going on and what the future we are knocking on the Ta´naiste’s door for of the structures will be. That is a fair point for further increased funding in that regard at a time them to make. when there is buoyancy in the economy through Not only am I a strong supporter of Tallaght sound management of the economy by the Fianna Hospital, having been associated with the board Fa´il-led Government with our good friends from from 1987 to 2002, but I have been a patient there the PDs. also. I have queued for my blood test like every- body else. When I had a heart attack in 1999, the Mr. F. McGrath: Ouch. hospital was there to care for me. I recall driving back to Tallaght that night to make sure I got sick Mr. O’Connor: I apologise to the Minister of there, rather than anywhere else. That is where I State because I should have linked those words wanted to be. I am happy to acknowledge the 133 Health Bill 2004: 23 November 2004. Second Stage (Resumed) 134 great job that Tallaght Hospital does. The Tallaght Hospital who have told me about their hospital’s cardiac rehab team is responsible for problems and difficulties. As I am known to some looking after so many people. I am not being flip- patients, when I go there I am sometimes asked pant about this matter. I am speaking seriously if I have come to check. I do not go to check. about my own illness and the manner in which I When I go it is usually to visit neighbours and to was assisted to recover. I would not be here but support what the hospital does. I hope we will for the work of that cardiac team. continue to do that in all our hospitals. During the remainder of this debate, we will Mr. Neville: The Deputy is lucky to be here. hear much discussion of the Bill, the services and what we are trying to achieve. I hope that we will Mr. O’Connor: Like many people who become not engage in silly political point making, sick, sometimes one wonders if one wants to although I have no problem in dealing with that bother any more. Lots of Deputy Neville’s col- and having such debates. I am particularly proud leagues told me to take up golf but I wanted to of what we have achieved in Tallaght Hospital be a politician and here I am. and throughout the region with the development of health services. I will continue to be as strong Mr. F. McGrath: A safe seat. as anybody and stronger than most in stressing to the Minister the need for resources, which is what Mr. O’Connor: I do not have a safe seat. The the public is telling us. Deputy need not worry. He probably has the As I go about my business people talk to me safest seat in the House. I am working on what I about health services with other issues. While this am doing and I am always happy to acknowledge is certainly an issue, I will not wait the remaining what my friends in Tallaght Hospital did for me 900 or so days until the next general election to and many others. While I do not want to single go around Tallaght and the rest of my area listen- out one department ahead of another, I am ing to what people are saying. I do so on a daily always in awe of the work of the cardiac rehabili- basis and am always happy to do so. It is tation team, which does a tremendous job. important that we continue to do that. We need Tallaght Hospital is deserving of the support of to take those opportunities to listen to what all of us. Deputy Finian McGrath spoke about people say, both negative and positive, and rep- Beaumont Hospital. Like every other hospital, resent those comments in these debates. Tallaght Hospital gets picked on. A massive Sinn The programme for last Sunday’s Gilbert Fe´in protest took place outside the hospital last O’Sullivan concert contained a note suggesting, Saturday, involving, I understand, four protesters. “Think negative, but always act positive”. In Last week Deputy Twomey visited the hospital terms of what we are trying to achieve in this without me and addressed a meeting about health debate, I hope we will always do that. I have no care. While in a democracy that may be fair problem with colleagues listing the difficulties, as enough, I am always more positive about such I have done. I am not afraid to make represen- matters. tations about the difficulties. Where there have I take every opportunity to support my local been cases in Tallaght of people unable to get hospital and if I lived close to Beaumont Hospital through the system and get a bed quickly enough I would do the same as Deputy Finian McGrath. or get the services they require, I have not been My local hospital has a catchment, which not only afraid to take on the bureaucracy. includes the third largest population centre in the We need to continue to strongly support the country but also stretches as far as Carnew, initiatives to reduce waiting lists. Not only in almost 70 miles away. Many good people come to Tallaght but also throughout the country, people Tallaght Hospital for its services. are concerned about waiting lists and the manner I am always happy to stress that Tallaght in which appointments are delayed. We must con- Hospital should not just be about cut fingers and tinue to voice those concerns while also making illnesses, it also has a clear role to play in the the point the hospital authorities often stress to development of our health services and can do a me that people fail to show up for appointments considerable amount in the area of health pro- for all sorts of reasons, which leaves others with- motion. While I do not want to again talk about out appointments. the cardiac area, those familiar with the building I thank the Minister of State for his attention will know of the “heart walk” pathway right and I wish him well. through the building. Many people especially on cold winter days have the opportunity to walk Mr. F. McGrath: He was listening very there. I am always happy to promote that as it carefully. is important that health promotion should get a considerable amount of our attention. Mr. T. O’Malley: I listened to every word. That is not to say that I do not share concerns about accident and emergency because I do. We Mr. O’Connor: All Ministers listen to us hum- need to continue to apply pressure in that regard ble Fianna Fa´il backbenchers and we get a good and to support the staff in every way. I have often response from them. The Minister of State has had the opportunity to talk to front line staff in come to Tallaght on a number of occasions and the accident and emergency department in has done very positive work. I am happy to wish 135 Health Bill 2004: 23 November 2004. Second Stage (Resumed) 136

[Mr. O’Connor.] dence to do so. Even when we advise them to him well and congratulate him. I look forward to take a certain route independently, they are often supporting the Bill and to listening to other con- reluctant to do so. This might be nothing more tributions. than contacting the consultant dealing with the family member. I am surprised by the number of Mr. Neville: I welcome the opportunity to con- people who approach me in difficulty about a tribute to the debate. I am pleased the Minister family member, often a parent or child, who are of State, Deputy Tim O’Malley, is present. I con- reluctant to talk to a consultant. cur with the previous speaker’s comments on We act as advisers and mediators for those health boards. The abolition of the health boards people. Will these functions of ours disappear? is unfortunate. I strongly support the notion of Currently we can carry out these functions and if local representation and public representatives we are dissatisfied, we can go to the deputy chief representing their constituents on key issues of executive officers or the chief executive officer or concern to them. The Minister of State and I table a parliamentary question and get a reply. served on a health board and our experiences Will all that assistance, representation and were positive. We made a contribution and held mediation still be available when the new execu- the Executive to account. I compliment the Mini- tive is established on 1 January? For those of us ster of State on the work he did while a member who see assisting such people as part of our role, of the Mid-Western Health Board during the this is important work and I would appreciate it many years he served there. if the Minister for Health and Children would Deputy Noonan with others from all parties clarify the position. was on that board. We made our contribution in In general, I can only compliment the people representing our people and in ensuring the in the various Departments who respond to our executive and administrators were accountable requests and assist in every way they can by and questioned them on issues of concern. While informing us of issues of concern to our constitu- sometimes they were put under pressure, on all ents. I find it difficult, however, to get the same occasions they appreciated that they needed to level of response from the Mid-Western Health account to the people of the mid-west region Board. Perhaps the Minister of State has experi- through their representatives in that forum. That enced this or maybe it is a personal thing against forum has been removed and we now have a me. I do not know and I have not discussed it health executive whose accountability is very with my colleagues. I have, however, discussed it vague. with the chief executive officer of the health It is obvious that this is becoming the National board. Roads Authority of the health service. While we A year ago, a person came to me in pain late at can get information on our national roads, all night. She asked me if I could obtain information Members know how difficult it is to influence the about the results of a CAT scan for which she decisions of such an authority in the interests of had been waiting for some time to assist in the people we represent. Even more significant obtaining relief from the pain and advice on what and delicate is trying to influence an executive was happening. She felt the delay in getting the that makes decisions on one of the most basic results inhibited the treatment of her condition. I issues that concerns everybody, the health of our contacted the Mid-Western Health Board and people. While I am very dissatisfied with the was told it would be a breach of hospital confi- response to representations at local level rather dentiality policy if it kept me informed at every than at ministerial level, at least we had the stage of a patient’s condition once she has been opportunity to make those representations and to seen by the hospital consultant. I simply asked talk to people in the health boards. This area when the patient would be seen. The reply to my needs to be clarified. inquiry stated that this practice would be in Some people believe we should not make rep- breach of patient clinical confidentiality as well as resentations about issues of concern, such as being time-consuming, and the health board people on waiting lists, people concerned at how would not respond. It continued that recent rep- they are dealt with in accident and resentations bordered on malpractice and I was 10 o’clock emergency departments and similar asked to cease immediately. issues. However, people with such I tabled a parliamentary question on this which concerns should have available to them the was responded to by the assistant chief executive avenue of their public representatives to rep- officer who informed me that the consultant resent them. In a utopia that should not be neces- physician requested a CAT scan on 6 June, which sary. Such complaints and difficulties should not was later discussed at a case conference with the exist and people should not need to contact us. radiologist where it was decided that it was not People have concerns, however, and are some- appropriate to have a CAT scan for this patient. times upset about their dealings with the health However, a chest X-ray was carried out on 24 services and we are the conduit to bring those September 2003 and the results were made concerns to the health board. Some people know known to her, the consultant and her GP. That is how to go about these matters but there is a large the information I wanted on the first day but number who do not know how to make contact instead I was told that I was to stop making or achieve access and who do not have the confi- inquiries. 137 Health Bill 2004: 23 November 2004. Second Stage (Resumed) 138

I have other examples of such behaviour. On tive issue. It is not an administrative issue, but a 3 August I spoke with extreme concern about a clinical problem. Are clinicians eliminated from distressed patient and said that there was a the Bill? As the Minister of State is well aware, danger to the person’s life. I was told by an officer the report on the death and suicide of Ms Anne of the Mid-Western Health Board that I was very O’Rahilly from Adare in 2002, certainly raised rude to say that and I should not do so. I have a many clinical problems and queries about clinical letter about another person on a waiting list that issues and decisions which were vital to the qual- states that the patient will be informed of the ity and credibility of that excellent report. It quer- prognosis and treatment and there is no need to ied the clinicians on several occasions. In this continue to make representations because the legislation, can such a report be compiled under person was in the system and the correct course the complaints procedure? If it is just a question of action would be decided by the medical team. of administration and the limitation of clinical This person had been on a waiting list for a long queries, then it is extremely limited. It now seems time and he just wanted to know when he would that certain clinicians and clinical decisions are be called. above questioning. Most people who query clin- I expressed my concerns on this issue to the icians just want information or assurance and chief executive officer of the Mid-Western Health sometimes have definite complaints to make. Board on 5 April. He said he would look into it Many of these can be satisfied locally through a but I am still awaiting a reply from him so I have complaints procedure, but if it is being asserted given up. The Minister of State is from my area that any of these issues cannot be queried, the and I appreciate his professionalism but I am con- likelihood is that the Minister will end up in the cerned about this because I have never experi- courts. People in such circumstances do not want enced anything like it in any Department. to go to court, they just need to have their com- People take politicians into their confidence plaints responded to under the system. The Mini- and in all my experience of public representa- ster of State is aware of the many issues that I tives, those confidences have always been raise in that area, and I will not repeat them on respected. I cannot remember a person coming to this occasion. However, this is an area that should me to express concern about a political colleague be covered and to which the Minister for Health using information given in confidence. Every and Children, Deputy Harney, might respond interview in a clinic is confidential and will only when she comes to debate the Bill. be dealt with by relevant people who can give the Under section 21, the CEO will be required to information to assist the person in their query. appear before the Oireachtas committees when We do this work even though the perfectionists requested by them to account for the perform- would say that we should not, that we should only legislate. I totally disagree. We have a role in ance of the executive. The Minister for Health legislation but we also have a role in represen- and Children of the day is responsible to this tation and that role exists for politicians in all House directly and we can hold him or her countries. In Britain, MPs who live in London responsible. We cannot hold the CEO respon- spend more than 50% of their time dealing with sible. However, last March the Joint Committee queries from their constituents. I make no on Health and Children wrote to the then Mini- excuses for doing the same. We would like the ster for Health and Children, Deputy Martin, and Minister of State to respond to our concerns on invited him to attend a meeting on three issues representation. about which members were extremely concerned. Complaints may be made under the Bill if a He was due to meet us before the end of May, patient feels he or she has not been treated in but could not make that meeting. He was due to accordance with fair and sound administrative meet us before the House rose for the summer practice. We often, however, have queries about recess and that did not happen. We were antici- other areas, sometimes of a clinical nature. Will pating a Cabinet reshuffle and he did not want to such complaints be excluded? Why should some- come anyway. There was a change of Minister one not complain about clinical aspects of his or and we invited the new incumbent, who now tells her treatment? us that she must read into her brief. That is per- In the area of mental health, especially, which haps fair enough, but I reckon that if a Minister the Minister of State deals with extensively, as I attends the committee to respond to those quer- do because of my responsibilities as party spokes- ies, the process will have taken approximately 12 man, I am conscious that we may differ on certain months. This is the Joint Oireachtas Committee aspects, because of our different roles. Deputy on Health and Children, where the Minister is Tim O’Malley is a Minister of State and I am an directly responsible to this House. What chance Opposition spokesman. I am not being personal, is there of getting a CEO to a meeting of the com- but I deal with this area on an ongoing basis and mittee, who is not responsible to it, apart from I get many complaints. Last week there were two section 21 specifying that he or she may appear suicidal patients, one of whom would not go back before the Oireachtas? The Minister for Health to 5B in the regional hospital because of his clini- and Children is directly responsible to the cal treatment there. I understand this complaint Oireachtas and it takes 12 months to get him or would not be allowed under the proposed legis- her to meet the committee to discuss issues of lation on the grounds that it is only an administra- concern. 139 Health Bill 2004: 23 November 2004. Second Stage (Resumed) 140

[Mr. Neville.] in the health service, when it is obvious that it is Finally, I would like to deal with one of the primarily accounted for by bureaucracy rather Minister of State’s own areas of responsibility, than people in the front line, with the administra- since he is in the House. We were extremely con- tive square footage substantially greater than the cerned that yesterday’s Estimates showed that area reserved for centres of care. the contribution to the mental health services as I have tabled umpteen parliamentary questions a percentage of the overall budget has dropped and have got unsatisfactory answers. I have been again, to 6.15% from 6.69%. The relative contri- critical of our local health board. We are at a bution has dropped for every year since 1997 point where the Bill is being introduced and the when the Fianna Fa´il-Progressive Democrats system is being radically modernised. There is a Administration began. The Minister of State has need for a common sense approach across parties, spoken about \15 million being contributed. as mentioned by the Minister. There should However, one of the key recommendations in the almost be a Tallaght strategy because it is the report is for a dedicated isolation service or a health of the country we are talking about which special care unit for people who are suicidal in involves a budget of \11 billion per year. To con- 5B. The cost of that is \10 million and it is being tinue to haggle over the health policy would not promised as “imminent” in that report. However, be helpful. There is no sense to the Labour Party there is only \15 million extra for the whole coun- position on medical cards and its comments gen- try, so where is the rest of the expenditure that is erally on the medical services. Some of the com- needed to come from? I was hoping and ments do not facilitate constructive debate. The expecting a response for the needs of our own terminology “yellow pack” used in regard to area, and we then see a total of just \15 million medical cards is a disgrace and the Labour Party for all the areas of need, which are our responsi- should refrain from that type of language in the bility as well. This puts the entire issue into con- context of this debate. I appeal to all parties to text and the Minister of State will understand our work towards a political consensus, to urge con- concern. I believe he deserves a better response structive debate and to take the emotions and from the people who decide how the budget is political positions out of the debate in order that allocated within the Department as regards men- we can come to some resolution on an overall tal health services. package for the heath service. During the course of the debate leading up to Mr. McGuinness: I welcome the Bill. Before the launch of the Bill, I saw St. Luke’s Hospital dealing with some of its aspects, like many other in Kilkenny being transformed. I will use it as a Members and indeed those in public life in gen- model given that a number of backbenchers from eral, I have been critical of the bureaucracy sur- all parties have visited the hospital. The Fine rounding the health services and the manner in Gael spokesperson has visited it and I commend which replies are delivered to us, whether in the him for doing so as it is not part of his constitu- context of a parliamentary question or by way of ency. He is showing an overall national interest. correspondence to the CEOs of health boards. I commend the Minister of State, Deputy Tim The previous speaker has outlined his experience O’Malley, who also visited St. Luke’s Hospital. in a way that ties in with the matter I want to During a visit to Kilkenny, the Minister, Deputy address. A serious inadequacy exists in terms of Harney, visited the hospital. I extend a personal the health boards and the information they give. invitation to her, without any political bells Likewise, there is inadequacy in terms of the ringing, to come and walk through the hospital accountability of the health service to this House. with the consultants and those who run and man- In the course of this Bill, while public represen- age that hospital because it is a model for the rest tation is mentioned as well as the public being of the country. represented in other fora, there is a strong need Thirty years ago Carlow hospital closed. There to ensure there is clear responsibility to the were beds in the corridors in every part of St. Members of this House in the context of the Luke’s Hospital in Kilkenny. The consultants and questions we ask of the service, or in individual the managers at the hospital, separate from the cases, while recognising the confidentiality that health boards, saw there was a crisis and that must exist between the health service and its something had to be done, and worked together. client. There is no excuse for the virtual non- Today there are no beds in the corridors. Some accountability that exists at present. 17,000 in-patients and 40,000 out-patients are I welcomed the abolition of the health boards seen. For that service there are only five rooms as a step towards reducing the bureaucracy in the and three cubicles, plasterboard separating them. system. I also welcomed the appointment of It is not a modern facility. Deputy Harney as Minister for Health and Chil- There is no surgical waiting list. All of this has dren. I wish her well, because like many others, I been achieved with 317 beds. It is possible to rad- believe she is the right person in the right place ically overhaul the service and deliver care at this time to do the business in the context of directly to the patient where it is required. They delivering an efficient health service by removing have pioneered these initiatives. They have dealt vested interests from it and the top heavy with paediatrics and geriatrics. The hospital also bureaucracy we have seen. All one has to do is has a stroke unit. The plan was supported by the look at the increase in the number of employees investment of millions of euro in that hospital by 141 Hospital 23 November 2004. Services 142 the former Minister for Health and Children, An issue that annoys me greatly in St. Luke’s Deputy Martin. The hospital can act as a model Hospital is that the scanning system is not avail- for the rest of the country against the backdrop able out of hours, it is available from 9 a.m. to 5 of the Mater and St. Vincent’s hospitals, each of p.m. Monday to Friday. When patients have to be which has 14,000 in-patients beds. The figures are scanned outside of those hours they have to be generally the same. sent either to Waterford or Beaumont hospitals. The Hanly report is condemned throughout the There was a case some time ago where the proper country and politically one should not speak care and attention was not given to a patient and about it. There is a sentence in it that refers to the journey to Dublin was simply too much and the general hospitals. I suggest the activities of St. the patient died. That was one death too many. Luke’s, as of today, fit into its description of a We have to resolve the staffing issues in regard general hospital. That service should proceed to that problem, ensure the mechanism for a res- under the Hanly description of a general hospital olution is found immediately and that the service and be funded and expanded accordingly. It does is delivered not only to Kilkenny but to the not take that much money. St. Luke’s Hospital is region it serves. considering an out-patients facility which would Last but not least, care of the elderly must cost \3 million, which is in addition to the work come first. A unit is being completed at St. Can- it has done. The staff are excellent and one gets ice’s Hospital in Kilkenny, which will make avail- the best of care. If it succeeds in getting the out- able a separate unit that the Minister of State has patients facility it can use the building to improve seen. I urge the Minister of State to ensure that the accident and emergency unit. It has moved unit is delivered on time and within budget and from the provision of services, the whittling away that the next phase is funded immediately in of the waiting list, dealing with thousands of order that care can be extended to the elderly and people across the services to endeavouring to pressure can be taken from the beds in Castle- improve the quality of service being delivered. comer and Thomastown. The cost of that improved quality is \3 million. It is seeking a Dexascanning system to define how Debate adjourned. brittle or otherwise are the bones of the elderly and get them the appropriate treatment. It is Adjournment Debate. seeking accommodation for step-down facilities. It has the initial facility for analysing patients on ———— the way in. There are those who will vacate the acute beds and end up in the care facility before Hospital Services. going home. That has all been achieved on a Dr. Cowley: I am very grateful for the oppor- shoestring budget. It is the finest campus in the tunity to raise this important matter on the country staffed by the best people. I urge the Adjournment. There is a limit on the recruitment Minister to look at not only what has been of whole-time equivalents, WTEs, such that the achieved but at its short shopping list to put the health board is confined to a certain number of hospital at the cutting edge of the development staff and not in a position to go above the ceiling of the health service without waiting lists or that exists. This is arbitrary and unfair. It is very people being delayed for a considerable period in regrettable to have insufficient staff when the the accident and emergency unit. If system in that work to be done is a matter of life or death. I ask hospital is replicated we will have a system based the Minister of State to consider this issue and lift on that model which will relieve hospitals the embargo. throughout the country. There is a need for sens- The embargo has affected many parts of the ible debate and accountability. health service in recent years. This is particularly As one who promoted the notion of abolishing the case in Mayo, where the failure to recruit four the health boards and reducing bureaucracy, I say extra staff needed to have an extra shift in the there is a need to speed up that process. I hope Mayo dialysis unit means that seven people have the Bill has a speedy passage through the House. to travel all the way to Galway to receive essen- I hope too that the debate is constructive, and if tial treatment that they should receive in their sensible amendments are proposed on Commit- own county, even though there is a state-of-the- tee Stage they will be accepted. art dialysis unit in Mayo General Hospital. This I have no doubt, given the long political career problem can only be resolved by lifting the ban of the Minister, Deputy Harney, we will have that on employing nurses. This is a very important and type of approach in trying to reach agreement simple resolution and I ask the Minister of State across parties to resolve the many problems in the to take it on board. It is not a question of money. health service. We can strive towards the working The seven people who have to travel to Galway model where we do not have waiting lists and ser- are all very ill. In explaining the rationale behind vices are available immediately. I consider the my request to lift the embargo, it is important to health portfolio to be a work in progress. There discuss the background. For many years the will always be new problems, new services coming people of Mayo have worked very hard to have a on stream and demands of one kind or another dialysis unit in their county because the distance but we can deal with those. from parts of Mayo, such as Belmullet or Black- 143 Job 23 November 2004. Losses 144

[Dr. Cowley.] increase nationally of 563 nurses in the system in sod, to Galway is almost the equivalent of that the year ended 30 June 2004. from Dublin to Galway. It is a long way to have My Department wrote to the CEO of the West- to go for essential services. The campaign to have ern Health Board on 21 September approving the a dialysis unit in Mayo involved all sorts of activi- provision of funding and authorising the follow- ties and led to a state-of-the-art unit with a capa- ing increases in the employment ceiling to allow city of 24 patients. It currently has 26 patients and for the commissioning of new units in the board’s thus it is already exceeding its capacity. Although area: University College Hospital, Galway — an the number of patients in the unit has doubled in adjustment in the employment ceiling of 140 the past year, the number of nurses has remained additional posts to allow for the transfer of ortho- the same. paedic trauma and the commissioning of inten- Consider the operation of every other dialysis sive care beds; Mayo General Hospital — an unit. In Beaumont Hospital’s dialysis unit, there adjustment in the employment ceiling of 95 are four shifts and in that of University College additional posts to allow for the full com- Hospital, Galway, there are three. There are but missioning of orthopaedics and a further adjust- two in the dialysis unit in Mayo and, therefore, ment of seven staff for the unit for the elderly; the seven very ill people who need dialysis to stay Portiuncula Hospital, Ballinasloe — an adjust- alive are required to take a round trip to Galway, ment in the employment ceiling of ten additional which, in some cases, amounts to 2,000 miles per staff to allow for the development of a stroke care week. It takes three and a half hours to get to unit and the commissioning of ICU beds; and Galway from one end of Mayo and the same to Roscommon County Hospital — an adjustment get back, amounting to seven hours of the day. in the employment ceiling of 40 additional staff This is in addition to four hours on a dialysis to expand the emergency department and for a machine, resulting in a total of 11 hours per day. new medical assessment unit. It is clear from these figures that the Govern- Elderly people have to make this lengthy trip. ment is committed to the continued development Only one third of people receiving dialysis are of services in the Western Health Board and that suitable for a kidney transplant and, therefore, recruitment of nurses and other health service the remaining two thirds must have dialysis for staff remains a priority. life. They are condemned to making the afore- mentioned journey, which takes 11 hours per day, Job Losses. three times per week, on Monday, Wednesday and Friday, for example. It takes 33 hours of a Mr. Connolly: I thank the Ceann Comhairle for patient’s week to travel to the dialysis unit and choosing the issue of job losses at Barford Meats back and to receive treatment. That is horrific. Limited in Carrickmacross for debate on the Despite the humanitarian aspect of requiring Adjournment. I met worker representatives and someone to make such a journey, the cost must the union representing the factory workers, also be considered, whether it be the cost to the SIPTU, last week regarding the closure of the health board of taxis or that of an ambulance if company, which is to result in the loss of 82 jobs. the patients are ill. One of the patients to which These losses include seven that took place earlier I refer is 74. He lives on the outskirts of Castlebar in the year, in the belief that the company would and is at present in hospital in Galway. He will have an opportunity to restructure itself financi- be discharged tomorrow but will be required to ally. It was believed that the seven workers would travel from home to Galway three days per week come back within a six month period to a com- although he is not fit to travel. He is condemned pany that had reshaped itself. Ten workers are to death unless the Government removes the due to lose their jobs this Friday and 65 workers lost their jobs last Friday week. While those who recruitment embargo and allows four nurses to be believed they would regain their jobs were wait- hired. I implore the Minister of State to do this. ing for the scene to improve, matters got worse and the company lost its contract to supply one Minister of State at the Department of Health of its major overseas purchasers, one of the big and Children (Mr. T. O’Malley): There is no supermarket chains. Government embargo on the recruitment of The workers in Carrickmacross have remained nurses. The chief executive officer of each indi- very loyal to the company and did without wages vidual health board has responsibility for the when it was going through tough times. Rumours management of the workforce, including the started a month ago that the company was in dif- appropriate staffing mix and the precise grades ficulty and on Wednesday last week the staff of staff employed within that board, in line with demanded answers. They received answers they service plan priorities, subject to the overall did not want to hear. The company had been a employment levels remaining within the author- very good employer in the town for the previous ised ceiling. 25 years and many workers had worked for it for The Health Service Employers Agency under- in excess of 20 years. Effectively they are not takes a quarterly national survey of nursing qualified to do any other work and, therefore, will resources. The most recent survey reported that need retraining and support. A task force should the recruitment of additional nurses continued to be set up by the Minister to achieve this and to be a prominent feature of activity, with a net ensure the workers find other jobs. 145 Job 23 November 2004. Losses 146

Regrettably, the record of IDA Ireland in At Enterprise Ireland’s urging, a business mentor creating jobs during the past seven years is not was appointed in May 2003 to review the financial good. Carrickmacross should be sold on the basis situation and provide strategic guidance to the that it is accessible to Dublin. The bypass, which company. Resulting from this involvement, the is being built ahead of schedule and was not due company embarked on a restructuring exercise in until next year, makes Carrickmacross accessible September 2004. It was thought at the time that from Dublin and Belfast. As the town is situated this would facilitate the survival of the business. between two airports, the area should attract new Enterprise Ireland expects to meet shortly the industries. The loss of these jobs will not only owner of the company to discuss the future situa- have a serious impact on families financially in tion. Enterprise Ireland is of the opinion that terms of mortgages and so on, but it will rep- there may be a number of potential investors resent a loss of approximately \30,000 per week interested in acquiring the assets and business of to a small town like Carrickmacross. Barford Meats Limited. Enterprise Ireland would Workers in these circumstances should have work with any new buyer and consider new pro- some protection, as should employers. If there posals to develop the business. are early warning systems in place and if compan- I understand that a representative from the ies are prepared to draw attention to problems at FA´ S office in Dundalk, together with a represen- an early stage, Government mentoring pro- tative of the local enterprise service, met unions grammes could be set up. Monaghan, in particu- and management at Barford Meats Limited. lar, has many small indigenous industries which Approximately 34 members of the workforce have grown significantly, delivering services were spoken to and provided with information. A worldwide. Houses are delivered from County list of the current job vacancies in the area was Monaghan to China and throughout the world. supplied together with appropriate registration Bar furniture is delivered to capital cities forms. I understand that individual interviews are throughout Europe and across the United States. taking place in the offices of the Department of These companies, which began on a small basis, Social and Family Affairs in Carrickmacross. are in competition with big companies through- Enterprise Ireland continues to work closely out the world. If they get into trouble it can hit with its client companies in Monaghan and the home very quickly. In some instances, these com- local business community in the county to foster panies can become victims of their own success, new business development. In 2003, Enterprise and this can happen at an alarmingly fast rate. Ireland approved almost \3.5 million in support There should be a mechanism whereby people of projects for its client companies in the county can indicate they are in trouble. and to date in 2004, Enterprise Ireland has After 20 years’ service, statutory redundancy is approved over \1.7 million. all the workers in the company are offered. This As part of its role in regional development, the would cost the company \500,000 in total. If the Enterprise Ireland regional office in Dundalk workers received statutory redundancy, plus two works with other regional organisations and third weeks pay for each year they worked, it would level institutions to improve the business climate not be an unreasonable demand for a company at regional level for clients and to influence the that has a sizeable amount of assets. Companies conditions in which growth in the north-east should be asked to sell their assets to ensure the region is established and sustained. The develop- workers who created the wealth are looked after? ment of community-based enterprise centres is a It is not an unreasonable demand that the crucial part of the drive to create new regional workers should receive in excess of the statutory enterprise through the provision of infrastructural redundancy. facilities to support the establishment and expan- sion of micro-enterprises through local com- Minister of State at the Department of munity participation. Enterprise Ireland has sup- Enterprise, Trade and Employment (Mr. M. ported the development of five community Ahern): I thank Deputy Connolly for raising this enterprise centres in the county. matter on the Adjournment. I am aware that you, Enterprise Ireland is currently involved in a a Cheann Comhairle, have a personal interest in range of initiatives in the county, which include the matter, as has the Minister of State, Deputy an INTERREG funded cross-Border project Brendan Smith. I believe all the Deputies from specifically for the furniture industry. A number Cavan-Monaghan have an interest in the matter. of County Monaghan furniture companies have The company was formed in 1984 to produce applied to be accepted on the project. This pro- fresh and frozen meat products. It encountered ject will involve eight southern companies and difficulties during the BSE crisis and the foot and eight Northern Ireland companies participating in mouth outbreak. The sterling exchange rate has a two year programme, looking primarily at the recently exacerbated these problems and, as a issue of design and innovation. result, the company ceased operations on 12 Nov- Enterprise Ireland is also working with the ember 2004. Armagh-Monaghan Digital Corridor Project Enterprise Ireland has been working closely Committee. The objective of this committee is to with the company over the past 18 months with a develop the Armagh and Monaghan areas into a view to identifying outside investors who would cluster of information and communication tech- bring much needed investment to the business. nology related industries. IDA Ireland partici- 147 Job 23 November 2004. Losses 148

[Mr. M. Ahern.] of dedicated and loyal service to the company but pates in this initiative, which is geared at encour- have been in a virtual limbo during the past 11 aging enterprises with a requirement for weeks since the decision to have them tempor- advanced telecommunications to locate on both arily laid off. sides of the Border where the telecommunica- Since then, it has been almost impossible to get tions networks, both North and South, can be any response from the company. Communi- accessed. IDA Ireland is actively marketing cations between management and employees are County Monaghan on an ongoing basis as a non-existent. This is leading to frustration, location for foreign direct investment, through its anxiety and uncertainty among the workers. The network of overseas offices, to secure new invest- company has two other production centres, one ment and jobs for the area. IDA Ireland is work- in the Czech Republic and one in India, where ing closely with local authorities and third level production costs are lower than here. However, colleges to deliver the best solution. I assure the the Crolly workers have built up tremendous Deputy that the State agencies will continue to skills and experience over the years and industrial promote Monaghan for new investment and jobs. relations in the factory were unblemished and second to none. The employees have foregone a Mr. McGinley: Go raibh maith agat, a Cheann number of wage increases in recent years. The Comhairle as deis a thabhairt dom an t-a´bhar ta´b- burning question is whether the workers should hachtach seo a tho´ ga´il ar an Athlo´ . Gabhaim hold out in the hope of getting their jobs back or buı´ochas leis an Aire as ucht a bheith i la´thair. seek new employment opportunities. At present Cuirim fa´ilte roimh an Aire ar ais go dtı´ an Da´il they are in the dark. an tseachtain seo. Chuir se´ isteach go mo´ r orainn We are now in the run-up to the Christmas sea- an timpist a bhı´ aige ata´ seachtain o´ shin ach ta´ son when there are huge financial demands on lu´ cha´ir orainn go e´irigh leis e´alu´ sla´n. Ta´ su´ il orm parents and families. These 43 workers, many of gur gairid go mbeidh se´ i mbarr a shla´inte arı´s. them the sole breadwinner in their family, are Ta´ me´ cinnte go bhfuil a fhios ag an Aire go under severe pressure. They need to know what maith an ca´sfa´ monarcha Nuvotem. Ta´ an mhon- the future holds for them. I ask the Minister, in archa suite i gCroithlı´ agus is minic a chuaigh an conjunction with U´ dara´s na Gaeltachta and the t-Aire thar doras ansin agus e´ ar a gcuairteanna management, to break the present impasse. It is rialta ar Thı´r Chonaill, agus go speisialta ar ghael- intolerable that the situation should be allowed tachtaı´ an iar-thuaiscirt. Ta´ monarcha lonnaithe to drift. ansin le breis agus 100 bliain. Ta´ Nuvotem lonnai- Bheinn iontach buı´och don Aire fa´ aon rud a the ansin le 23 bliain, o´ 1980. thig leis le do´ chas a thabhairt do na daoine seo Buille mo´ r an nuacht seo dos na hoibrithe, agus iad a chur ar ais ag obair no´ malairt fostaı´ochta a buille nach raibh siad ag su´ il leis. Ar 20 Mea´n fha´il do´ ibh agus an Nollaig buailte linn. Fhomhair du´ radh leo go riabh siad a´ ligint chun bealaigh, go sealadach mar a du´ radh ag an am. Minister for Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Ta´ 11 seachtain imithe o´ shin agus ta´ se´ ag cur Affairs (E´ amon O´ Cuı´v): Gabhaim buı´ochas leis isteach go mo´ r ar na hoibrithe cad e´ ata´ i nda´n an Teachta Mac Fhionnlaoich as ucht na bhfocal daoibh. Is beag cumarsa´ide agus is beag eolais ata´ deamhe´in a bhı´ aige dom. Mar is eol don Teachta le fa´il o´ n gcomhlacht, comhlacht a d’oibrigh siad Mac Fhionnlaioch, ta´ Nuvotem Teo i mbun de´an- do´ go dı´cheallach agus go dian ar a son le bli- tu´ saı´ochta i gCroithlı´ o´ 1979 agus ta´ an comhlacht anta anuas. ag tairgeadh transfhoirmitheoiri no´ Toroidal Ala´n des na hoibrithe seo, is iad na prı´omh Transformers don earna´il teileachumarsa´ide-leic- daoine ata´ ag saothru´ ina gcuid teaghlaigh fe´in treonaice. agus ta´ costaisı´ agus freagrachtaı´ orthu maidir le Ta´ an comhlacht seo, maron le dha´ chomhlacht morga´istı´ agus costais eile. Anois, ta´ an Nollaig eile, ceann i bPoblacht na Seice agus ceann eile buailte linn agus gan a fhios acu an mbeidh siad san Ind, agus oifig dhı´olacha´in sa Ghearma´in, ag dul ar ais ag obair no´ nach mbeidh. Sin an mar chuid den ghru´ pa idirna´isiu´ nta Talema. Is rud is mo´ ata´ ag cur isteach orthu, go bhfuil siad fochuideachta 100% de chuid Nuvotem e´ an coinnithe ins an dorchadas agus nach bhfuil a comhlacht i bPoblacht na Seice agus ta´ mionscair- fhios acu cad e´ ata´ i nda´n daoibh. An mbeidh siad shealbhaı´ocht 1% ag Nuvotem san Ind. Ta´ an gno´ ag dul ar ais ag obair no´ nach mbeidh? sa tSeic agus san Ind a´ bhainistiu´ ag Nuvotem. To´ gadh an cheist ag U´ dara´s na Gaeltachta. Chuir Nuvotem fostaı´ocht mhaith ar fa´il i nGa- Tho´ gme´ fe´in an cheist sa Da´il agus tho´ g daoine eltacht Dhu´ n na nGall, i gceantar Ghaoth Dobh- eile ı´ ag an gcomhairle condae. Ach is beag eolais air agus na Rosa, o´ n am ar bunaı´odh e´ go dtı´ le ata´ faighte agus is beag dul chun cinn ata´ de´anta gairid. Nı´ i bhfad tar e´is an comhlacht a bhunu´ agus trı´ mhı´ imithe. bhı´ an leibhe´al fostaı´ochta os cionn 70 agus Nuvotem Crolly is one of the longest estab- d’fhan se´ ag an leibhe´al sin ar feadh sco´ r bliain, lished industries in the Donegal Gaeltacht, pro- ag sroicheadh buaicphointe de 114 post i la´rna ducing electrical coils and transformers since no´ chaidı´. 1980. It came as a bombshell to the workers on 3 D’ı´oc U´ dara´s na Gaeltachta \1.531 milliu´ ni September last that 43 out of a total workforce of ndeontais leis an gcuideachta thar an thre´imhse 56 were to be laid off until further notice. Many 1979 go dtı´ 1995. Nı´or ı´ocadh aon deontas o´ shin. of these workers have given more than 20 years Rinne an tU´ dara´s infheistı´ocht \780,889 i scaire- 149 Food Safety 23 November 2004. Standards 150 anna tosaı´ochta sa chuideachta freisin Caithfidh ach gur fe´idir leis an U´ dara´s a dhe´anamh ach me´ a threisiu´ gur scaireanna tosaı´ochta iad seo leanu´ int ar aghaidh bheith ag ple´ leis an mbainis- gan aon cheart vo´ ta´la, rud a chiallaı´onn nach tı´ocht agus iarracht a dhe´anamh dul i malairt bhfuil aon chearta ag an U´ dara´so´ thaobh bhaini- threo go gineara´lta sa nGaeltacht agus fostaı´- stiu´ no´ riaradh na cuideachta o´ la´ go la´.Isag ochta nı´os buaine nua aimseartha a aimsiu´ . gna´thscairshe´albho´ irı´ na cuideachta amha´in ata´ na cearta sin. Rinne an infheistı´ocht deireanach i Food Safety Standards. scaireanna tosaı´ochta sa chomhlacht i 1998. Ag breithniu´ ar an bhfostaı´ocht mhaith a cuir- Mr. O’Dowd: I thank the Chair for selecting eadh ar fa´il thar na blianta, nı´l aon amhras ann this matter for discussion. When I realised what ach go bhfuarthas luach maith ar infheistı´ocht an time this would be dealt with I thought that per- Sta´it sa chomhlacht seo. haps I would be live on “Oireachtas Report”. I Maidir leis an staid reatha, ar an gce´ad dul sı´os do not know whether that is the case, but if it is caithfear a aithint go bhfuil an chuideachta ag I say “hello” to all the people watching. feidhmiu´ in earna´il ata´ thar a bheith leochaileach This is a very serious issue. It was the subject sa tı´r seo i la´thair na huaire mar gheall ar an gco- of a story in the Drogheda Independent recently imhlint ghe´ar o´ thairgeo´ irı´ ata´ ag feidhmiu´ i dtı´or- on foot of a court case which is proceeding in tha le costais ta´irgı´ochta i bhfad nı´os ı´sle. Nı´ Dublin. It was also covered in The Sunday Trib- amhain go bhfuil an margadh da´ tha´irge ag une as a lead story last Sunday week and also last laghdu´ le roinnt blianta anuas ach ta´ an brabu´ s Sunday. I understand that there are legal pro- ag laghdu´ chomh maith. ceedings in train and that the Minister cannot Ta´ 58 fostaithe san iomla´n i gcomhlacht Nuvo- comment on those. tem faoi la´thair idir 15 fostaithe go la´naimseartha Let me make it clear that I am not asking him ag cur seirbhı´sı´ teicniu´ la, dı´olacha´in agus riara- to comment. However, I would like him to cha´in ar fa´il don ghru´ pa agus 43 fostaithe in obair reassure the public that everything is in order. I ta´irgı´ochta i gCroithlı´.Ta´ an 15 phost seo mar have spoken to the Assistant Secretary General chuid tha´bhachtach de riaradh agus bhainistiu´ an of the Department of Agriculture and food, Mr. ghru´ pa agus is postanna ta´bhachtacha iad seo don Tom Moran. I have also met the chief veterinary cheantar freisin. officer of the Food Safety Authority of Ireland Maidir leis an bhfoireann ta´irgı´ochta, a´fach, and a senior Inspector in the Department of Agri- tuigim go bhfuil na daoine seo leagtha as a gcuid culture and Food. I am satisfied that they are oibre le deich seachtaine anuas agus ta´ cu´ rsaı´ fos- making every effort to clarify the position. There taı´ochta ag brath ar orduithe a bheith ar fa´il don is one final step that must be taken and that is aonad ta´irgı´ochta i nDu´ n na nGall. Tuigim that the Minister for Agriculture and Food must chomh maith go bhfuil an chuideachta tar e´is gla- commission an independent report into all of the cadh le hiarratas le gairid o´ ochtar den fhoireann allegations that have been made. It should be an ta´irgı´ochta i leith ı´ocaı´ochtaı´ reachtu´ la iom- independent assessment and it should be done as arcaı´ochta. quickly as possible. If that is done it will clarify Mar is eol don Teachta, ta´ coimhlint ghe´ar in the issue for everybody concerned. earna´il na de´antu´ saı´ochta le roinnt blianta anuas I thank the Department of Agriculture and agus ta´ poist a´ gcailliu´ int ar fud na tı´re seo da´ Food for meeting me and explaining the intricac- re´ir, na ceantair Ghaeltachta san a´ireamh. Ce´ ies of the situation. My concern and that of the nach bhfuil aon smacht ag U´ dara´s na Gaeltachta public, notwithstanding everything we have been ar riaradh na cuideachta seo, mar ata´ soile´irithe told, is to have an independent risk assessment of agam nı´os tuisce, bı´onn caidreamh rialta ag the situation. I urge the Minister to have that car- feidhmeannas an U´ dara´is le bainistı´ocht Nuvo- ried out immediately. tem chun scru´ du´ a dhe´anamh ar na fe´idear- thachtaı´ ata´ ann maidir le hinmharthanacht an Minister of State at the Department of Agri- chomhlachta a chinntiu´ . culture and Food (Mr. B. Smith): My Department Ta´ curtha in iu´ l ag bainistı´ocht an chomhlachta and two other defendants are currently being don U´ dara´s go bhfuil tre´an-iarrachtaı´ ar siu´ lag sued in the High Court by a company Nuvotem chun orduithe a aimsiu´ a chuirfidh ar 11 o’clock in Drogheda which had been con- a gcumas ta´irgeadh a athbhunu´ sa mhonarcha i tracted by one of the defendants, but gCroithlı´. Deir an bhainistı´ocht chomh maith go not by my Department, to store tallow derived bhfuiltear do´ chasach orduithe a chuirfidh ar a from specified risk material. The plaintiff alleges gcumas e´ seo a dhe´anamh a aimsiu´ san earrach that it was unaware of the nature of the tallow seo chugainn. put into storage at its premises. The specific alle- Tugadh figiu´ irı´ dom a thaispea´int na difrı´ochtaı´ gation to which the Deputy referred is based on idir na sca´laı´ pa´ sa tSeic agus sa tı´r seo. Is fadhb a statement made in the course of the case by a ı´ seo agus nı´ bheadh e´inne sa tı´r seo sa´sta agus nı´ former employee of the company. My Depart- bheadh se´ dleathach oibre ar an gcinea´lpa´ ata´ i ment does not accept this allegation. I will not gceist. A fhad is go bhfuil iomaı´ocht mar sin ar comment on the specifics of the case, other than bun, beidh fadhbanna ag an gcinea´l seo de´antu´ sa- to state that my Department and the other two ı´ochta. Ta´ su´ il agam go bhfaighfear tairgı´ breise defendants are vigorously defending their posi- ach caithfimid tuiscint nach bhfuil mo´ ra´ngodı´re- tion in court. I will, however, make some general 151 The 23 November 2004. Adjournment 152

[Mr. B. Smith.] taminated animal feed. It has never been demon- comments on tallow and any health risks that strated that tallow is a cause of BSE. Any risk might or might not be associated with it. that might arise with tallow relates to the pres- Tallow is a bi-product of the meat slaughter ence of protein in that product. From February industry. Rendering of animal bi-products, 1997, Ireland, as part of its national BSE control including tallow, takes place in nine rendering measures, introduced arrangements for removal plants in the State, which are all approved by my and destruction of specified risk materials. Part Department under European Union legislation. of this system was the designation of a specific The standards applied are set in line with best rendering plant to process this material. The EU practice, which itself is based on the latest resultant SRM meat, bonemeal and tallow could scientific knowledge. The overarching EU BSE only be sent out of the country for incineration. controls, including the rendering process criteria Risk assessments carried out on SRM tallow and the approved disposal methods for animal bi- have demonstrated that there is negligible risk products are regularly reviewed by the EU scien- associated with it in the event of its being con- tific steering committee. This committee, which is sumed by cattle. In the case of consumption by the main advisory body to the EU Commission humans, due primarily to the species barrier any on BSE, regularly reports to the Community risk potential would be further significantly institutions on developments in this area. The EU reduced. Any health risks associated with animal Food and Veterinary Office also audits, on an bi-products, including tallow, are the subject of regular consultation between my Department and ongoing basis, the implementation of EU legis- the Food Safety Authority of Ireland. I stress that lation by member states. these products do not go into the human or ani- The rendering process prescribed in EU legis- mal food chain and are disposed of by inciner- lation is essentially a series of moisture and fat ation or co-incineration. reduction steps that transform the bi-products Numerous inaccurate statements have been into meat, bonemeal and tallow. Meat and bone- made recently in regard to BSE. The best meal is a solid dry substance whereas tallow is approach to dealing with a subject such as BSE is oil. My Department in line with EU legislation to concentrate on what is known to be sound and regulates storage, handling, transport and export agreed scientific fact. I have set out the facts on for destruction of these products. this and hope what I have said puts the Deputy’s The role of meat and bonemeal in the develop- mind at ease. ment of BSE in animals is well established. It is accepted that the vast majority of BSE cases have The Da´il adjourned at 11.05 p.m. until been caused by the consumption by cattle of con- 10.30 a.m. on Wednesday, 24 November 2004. 153 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 154

Written Answers. Decentralisation Programme. 69. Mr. Stanton asked the Minister for Finance The following are questions tabled by Members the progress that has been made regarding the for written response and the ministerial replies decentralisation of public service jobs to Youghal received from the Departments [unrevised]. in County Cork; the number who have opted to transfer to Youghal; the office space that has Questions Nos. 1 to 8, inclusive, answered been identified or acquired; the timescale for orally. completion of the move; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [29990/04] Questions Nos. 9 to 57, inclusive, resubmitted. Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): As part of Questions Nos. 58 to 66, inclusive, answered the overall decentralisation programme it is orally. intended that 100 staff of the Valuation Office and 100 staff of the Public Appointments Service Tax Yield. will be decentralised to Youghal, County Cork. Planning for the move is ongoing in both offices 67. Mr. Gogarty asked the Minister for Finance and in the Office of Public Works, which is deal- his views on the recent slowdown in corporation ing with accommodation procurement issues. tax returns; and if he will make a statement on Both organisations have published outline imple- the matter. [29979/04] mentation plans in accordance with the recom- Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): It is not mendations of the decentralisation implemen- possible to be definitive on corporation tax tation group chaired by Mr. Phil Flynn. receipts at this stage as almost one third of the The data from the central applications facility, 2004 yield is currently due in. As of end-October, CAF, published in September showed that a total of 28 persons have applied for decentralisation we were just under 2% behind target but this with the Valuation Office and 88 persons have could be due to timing effects rather than a con- applied for decentralisation with the Public clusive indication of any particular underlying Appointments Service. The OPW has identified a shortfall. We will be better able to assess the true number of potential sites in Youghal for new position shortly. offices. The evaluation process is at an advanced stage and it is expected that negotiations will Tax Code open shortly. 68. Mr. Sherlock asked the Minister for Fin- The next stage of the decentralisation process ance his views on the recent call made by the is the selection of organisations for inclusion in Consumers Association of Ireland and the Irish the first phase of moves and the sequencing and Bankers’ Federation for the abolition of stamp timing of such moves. An analysis of the figures duty on laser, credit and ATM cards; and if he emerging from the CAF and any relevant prop- will make a statement on the matter. [29871/04] erty and business aspects is being undertaken by the decentralisation implementation group. Pend- Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): Stamp duty ing completion of this work it is not possible to exists on various financial cards in order to pro- give an estimated time for completion of the pro- vide Exchequer revenue. The stamp duty on gramme to Youghal. cheques, bills of exchange and promissory notes has existed for many years and when electronic Drug Seizures. means of money transfers such as credit cards, ATM cards and laser cards were subsequently 70. Mr. Timmins asked the Minister for Fin- introduced, stamp duty was gradually extended to ance the value of illegal drugs seized in the years those products to ensure that the stamp duty from 2000, 2001, 2002 and 2003 that involved the assist- cheques etc. was not eroded. ance of the Naval Service. [28755/04] In 2003, the stamp duty yield from all financial Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): The cus- cards was some \85 million. The yield from credit toms service of the Revenue Commissioners has and charge cards was almost \52 million, whereas primary responsibility for the prevention, detec- the yield from cash cards was almost \33 million. tion, interception and seizure of controlled drugs Stamp duties on credit cards and cash cards are a intended to be smuggled or illegally imported contributor to the Exchequer’s tax revenues, into the State under the memorandum of under- which help fund public services such as health and standing signed by the Garda Commissioner and education, thereby facilitating continued econ- the chairman of the Revenue Commissioners on omic success, which is of benefit to all taxpayers. 12 January 1996. On drug smuggling by sea, the The growth in the numbers of such cards and Naval Service assists the customs service in dis- their usage suggests that the existence of a stamp charging its enforcement functions. The Naval duty does not discourage their use. Service also participates with customs and the As Deputies are aware, it is not the practice to Garda Sı´ocha´na in a joint task force where this is comment in the lead up to the annual budget and convened to deal with specific intelligence-driven Finance Bill on the intention or otherwise to maritime drug enforcement operations. This make changes in taxation. relationship has been further developed by the 155 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 156

[Mr. Cowen.] Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): I would provisions of the Criminal Justice (Illicit Traffic accept that the number of applications to the cen- by Sea) Act 2003. tral applications facility, CAF, from the Civil Ser- During the years 2000 to 2004, the customs ser- vice are much better than those from the State vice has had considerable success in seizing con- agencies. Unlike the State agencies the Civil Ser- trolled drugs with a street value estimated at vice has considerable previous experience of some \125 million. While the Naval Service was decentralisation and has a long tradition of inter- not directly involved in these seizures, it has dur- departmental transfers. ing these years provided invaluable support to the The decentralisation implementation group, customs service and regularly assisted in surveil- DIG, asked that all organisations participating in lance and the monitoring of shipping movements. the programme should prepare detailed imple- The Naval Service has also participated in a mentation plans including risk mitigation plans. number of international joint customs operations, These plans were prepared and submitted to the JCOs, which have resulted in significant seizures group. Most included risk mitigation strategies. In of drugs in the participating states. A number of its July report the DIG has recommended, at these operations are conducted each year by the paragraph 9.3, that in preparing the next version Customs Services of the member states of the EU of their implementation plan each organisation in collaboration with other partner admin- should ensure that a risk mitigation strategy is istrations. In 2003, an operation resulted in the included. I am satisfied that this approach rep- seizure of 7,270 kilos of cannabis resin, 732 kilos resents a realistic approach to risk identification of cocaine and 4.4 kilos of amphetamines. In and mitigation. 2002, an operation resulted in the seizure of 16,489 kilos of cannabis resin and three kilos of Tax Collection. cocaine and in 2000, an operation resulted in the seizure of 5,313 kilos of cannabis resin. 73. Mr. Broughan asked the Minister for Fin- The vast bulk of these seizures were not made ance the total amount taken in by the Revenue in Ireland but in the participating member states Commissioners, as printed in Iris Oifigiuil,in and other partner countries. However, these huge respect of settlements made with tax defaulters volumes of drugs were prevented from being under subsection (2) of section 1068 of the Taxes placed on the European market and the Naval Consolidation Act 1997, in respect of each of the past five years; the total amount taken in respect Service assisted the customs service and the State \ in discharging our obligations as active partici- of settlements for each year of less than 12,700 pants in the fight against international drug which are not published in Iris Oifigiuil:ifhehas trafficking. satisfied himself that sufficient steps are being In addition to this, the Naval Service and the taken to combat tax evasion in view of the con- Air Corps has assisted customs on other tinuing high level of settlements; and if he will important law enforcement operations most make a statement on the matter. [29844/04] notably on the case of the MV Anto, a ship that Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): Iam was detected in the attempt to smuggle 70 million advised by the Revenue Commissioners that the cigarettes into the State in 2001. total number of audited settlements made with tax defaulters and published under subsection 2 Decentralisation Programme. of section 1068 of the Taxes Consolidation Act 71. Mr. Deenihan asked the Minister for Fin- 1997 in respect of each of the years 1999 to 2003 ance the position regarding the decentralisation and in 2004 to date is as follows: In 1999, 194 of a section of the Revenue Commissioners to cases were published totalling \12.32 million; for Listowel, County Kerry; and if he will make a 2000, 258 cases were published totalling \19.05 statement on the matter. [29650/04] million; for 2001, 295 cases were published total- ling \25.44 million; for 2002, 272 cases were pub- Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): Iam lished totalling \35.41 million; for 2003, 1,257 advised by the Revenue Commissioners that were published totalling \133.92 million; and for under the decentralisation programme 50 posts 2004, 501 were published to date totalling \84.93 are to be decentralised to Listowel and the million. decision on timing and sequencing will be made I am informed by the Revenue Commissioners following the recommendations of the Govern- that separate records have not been maintained ment’s decentralisation implementation group. for years prior to 2003 of settlements for less than The Office of Public Works is examining a \12,700, which are not published. In 2003 the fig- number of proposals in relation to a suitable site ure was 12,531 cases with a yield of \39.16 mill- in Listowel. ion. I am, however, in a position to inform the 72. Mr. P. Breen asked the Minister for Fin- House of the overall total number of audited ance if he has satisfied himself with numbers of settlements made with tax defaulters in each of persons from within the State agencies who have the years in question. These are as follows: For indicated a willingness to decentralise with their 1999, settlements totalled 16,938 with a yield of agencies; and his views on the assessments from \136.87 million; in 2000, the number was 16,000 some of the agencies of the risk of damage to and the yield was \355.90 million; in 2001, the delivery of services. [29895/04] number was 16,022 and the yield was \202 mill- 157 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 158 ion; in 2002, the number was 15,951 and the yield a prominent notice to the effect that there is no was \265.46 million; in 2003, the number was guarantee that the proceeds of the insurance 15,658 and the yield was \423.04 million; and in policy will be sufficient to repay the loan in full 2004, the number was 6,686 up to 30 June 2004 when it becomes due. The Act also obliges the and yield was \224.63 million. provision of ongoing information in relation to Significant steps have been taken by Revenue the performance of the policy, as do the Life to increase their effectiveness in combating eva- Assurance (Provision of Information) Regu- sion over recent years. Key to these devel- lations 2001. The Central Bank and Financial Ser- opments has been the use of the information vices Authority of Ireland Acts 2003 and 2004 powers granted to Revenue in the Finance Act established the Irish Financial Services Regulat- 1999. Revenue has used these powers to great ory Authority, or IFSRA, and considerably effect, as evidenced in the bogus non-resident strengthened the regulatory environment, includ- account campaign, and this has undoubtedly also ing an enhanced structure for dealing with con- influenced the significant voluntary disclosure sumers’ complaints about financial institutions. take-up in Revenue’s current offshore account IFSRA is already studying the situation, having investigation. commenced a survey earlier this year, to deter- mine whether and to what extent there will be Special Savings Incentive Scheme. difficulties for customers. It would be premature at this stage to second-guess the outcome of the 74. Mr. Wall asked the Minister for Finance if survey. I will continue to review the adequacy of he has plans to offer guidance and advice to the legislative framework as the information investors in the SSIAs when the accounts mature developed by IFSRA becomes available. in 2006; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [29868/04] Tax Code. Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): The SSIA 76. Mr. Stagg asked the Minister for Finance if scheme opened on 1 May 2001 and entry to it an estimate is available of the amount of capital closed on 30 April 2002. The accounts are due to gains taxes to be paid by shareholders in a com- mature between May 2006 and April 2007 at the pany (details supplied); the number of share- end of the five year period. A total of 1.17 million holders subject to tax; the number of share- accounts were opened during the period outlined. holders likely to be able to avail of relief as a The specific goal of the SSIA scheme was to result of capital losses incurred on investments in encourage people to save over a period of at least Eircom; and if he will make a statement on the five years. Its effect has been to stimulate such matter. [29874/04] savings over varying income ranges which is evi- dent in the extensive take-up by many low Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): Iam income earners. The scheme has been a success in advised by the Revenue Commissioners that the those terms. The scheme has a specific duration. total number of shareholders nominally subject to The use to which the moneys arising on tax was estimated at 132,000. However, since the maturity of the SSIAs is put is ultimately a matter circumstances of individual shareholders are not for the individual account holder. known, for example whether they have other reckonable gains or losses, it is not possible for Endowment Mortgages. the Revenue Commissioners to give a reliable estimate of the amount of capital gains tax to be 75. Mr. McCormack asked the Minister for Fin- paid by the shareholders involved. ance if he is satisfied with the response from fin- The Revenue Commissioners have also ancial institutions to the shortfall on endowment informed me that capital gains tax of in excess of mortgages compared to the projections at the \34 million has been received to date in respect time of sale. [29882/04] of these disposals. This figure is based on pay- Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): Recent ments received in the Collector-General’s office publicity in relation to endowment mortgages has where the name of the company in which the focused on the possibility that a significant shares were held was specified. It does not number of holders of such mortgages will have a include payments received in local Revenue shortfall of funds when the mortgage reaches the offices or where the name of the company was end of its normal term. These products inherently not identified or where the payment included require customers to take some risk; they are capital gains tax for gains on the sale of other exposed to market fluctuations, just like any assets. market-based life assurance investments. The fact I am also advised by the Revenue Commis- that a person does not gain as much as expected sioners that it is not possible to provide details of is not in itself an indication of any inappropriate the number of these shareholders likely to be able practices on the part of the bank or insurance to avail of relief as a result of capital losses company concerned. incurred on investments in Eircom. Persons who There is a substantial volume of legislation in incur capital losses on the disposal of shares are place in relation to these products. For example, only required to provide details of the quantum the Consumer Credit Act 1995 requires that all of those losses on their annual tax return of gains endowment loan application forms must contain and losses for the year in which the loss arose. 159 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 160

[Mr. Cowen.] paid by way of a set fee payable for the entirety Similarly, when they offset the losses against sub- of the tribunal. sequent gains it is the amount of the losses being The calculation of daily rates will be based on offset that is required. Details of the company in this fee. These rates are as follows: senior coun- which the shares were held are not sought. sel, \213,098 p.a. or \969 per day; junior counsel, \142,065 p.a. or \646 per day — 2/3 of SC rate; Tax Collection. and solicitor, \176,000 p.a. or \800 per daily appearance or \100 per hour for work under- 77. Dr. Twomey asked the Minister for Finance taken other than appearing at the tribunal. if the Revenue Commissioners has conducted It was also decided at that time that the new fee investigations into the degree of complicity of fin- structure should apply to existing tribunals and ancial institutions in some of the cases of tax eva- inquiries with effect from such dates as may be sion currently being unearthed; and if any cases determined by the Government following consul- are pending in respect of such practices. tation between the Attorney General and the [29922/04] chairperson of each tribunal-inquiry. Arising Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): Iam from the above-mentioned consultations the advised by the Revenue Commissioners that its Government have agreed the dates on which the recent investigations have had, as its initial and new schedule of fees would be applied to existing principal focus, the recovery of unpaid taxes for tribunals and inquiries. These are as follows: the Exchequer. The steps taken by its officers, The Murphy Inquiry into child sexual abuse in including applications to the High Court for Ferns: 1 December 2004 orders to access information in financial insti- The Clarke Inquiry into events at Lourdes tutions in relation to taxpayers who have made Hospital, Drogheda: 31 March 2005 false returns and as a result failed to pay their The Dunne (Post Mortem) Inquiry: 31 March proper taxes, have resulted in the recovery of 2005 more than \1.6 billion in undisclosed taxes The Barr Tribunal, investigating the shooting together with interest and penalties. Some \223 dead of John Carty at Abbeylara: 1 June 2005 million of this sum, including tax, interest and The Moriarty Tribunal, investigating payments penalties, was actually recovered from financial to Mr. Haughey and Mr. Lowry: 11 January 2006 institutions who had failed in their obligations to The Morris Tribunal investigating activities by remit the proper amount of deposit interest gardaı´ in Donegal: 30 September 2006 retention tax. It has been suggested that in some The Mahon Tribunal, investigating certain instances the defaulting taxpayers have been planning matters and payments: End March 2007 assisted in their actions by the financial insti- The Ryan Commission on the Investigation of tutions or by their officials. Child Abuse: May 2008. Revenue has, within the range of offences pro- The Government decided to set different dates vided for in the tax code, sought to identify cases in relation to different tribunals and inquiries where evidence amounting to the commission of having regard to the individual circumstances of an offence on the part of a financial institution or each tribunal or inquiry and after communication its officials could be assembled. I understand with each of their chairpersons. The Government from it that the only relevant offence within the determined not to set dates which were unrealist- tax code, that of “aiding and abetting”, is ically early, as to do so might have involved extremely difficult to prove and seems to require extensive disruption of the tribunals and inquiries by reason of changes in legal personnel involved. that the bank official needs to be directly advising The delays and costs which such changes would the taxpayer in relation to the completion of the have entailed could have added to, rather than false return. Revenue has not come across any reduced, the costs of the tribunals and inquiries. case to date where the involvement of the official can be proved to amount to knowingly “aiding Capital Expenditure. and abetting” the taxpayer to make a false return. 79. Mr. Penrose asked the Minister for Finance Tribunals of Inquiry. if he will make a statement on the progress of the capital programme under the national develop- 78. Ms B. Moynihan-Cronin asked the Minister ment plan; and if he intends to provide for for Finance if agreement has been reached with increased capital spending in 2005 in view of the each of the tribunals of inquiry regarding a pro- significant reduction in the level of capital spend- posed new schedule of fees; when the new fees ing in the first nine months of 2004. [29861/04] will come into operation in each case; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [29856/04] Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): Capital investment under the National Development Plan Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): My prede- 2000-2006 is mainly delivered through the econ- cessor announced on 19 July last that the Govern- omic and social infrastructure operational pro- ment had decided that, with effect from 1 Sep- gramme, ESIOP. Total spending to date under tember 2004, the cost of all legal representation, the ESIOP is close to target, and the Exchequer including that of third parties, at newly-estab- contribution is well above target; by mid-2004, lished tribunals or other forms of inquiry will be the Exchequer had provided \1.8 billion more to 161 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 162 the ESIOP than was originally planned. ESIOP As previously advised to the Deputy in a reply investment is delivering major improvements to to a parliamentary question on 14 October 2004, the economic and social infrastructure through- the impact of such maturing funds on consumer out the country in the areas of roads, public trans- demand in 2006 and 2007 is difficult to estimate port, environmental infrastructure, housing and and will depend on how the accumulated SSIA health. savings are spent or saved, how that portion of an On the broader matter of capital spending individual’s income that was previously saved in across all Votes, the end October figures show SSIAs is used, and the extent to which savings are that the amount spent in the first ten months of rolled over into other investment products. To the year was below the amount that Departments date, two reports have been done regarding the had profiled to spend over that period. However, impact of the SSIAs, one by Goodbody Stock- in line with usual trends, Departments expect brokers and one by Lansdowne Market Research. their rate of spending to increase over the However, there is no consensus in these reports remainder of the year. Also, I would remind the as to how these funds may be used with both Deputy that Departments can now carry over reaching differing conclusions regarding the div- unspent capital allocations from one year into the ision between consumption and saving. The next, up to a limit of 10% of the voted capital ESRI, in its autumn bulletin, did not hypothesise estimate. This new facility is part of the arrange- about the likely impact on the economy of the ments associated with the five-year, multi-annual release of SSIA funds because they believe that capital envelopes announced in the 2004 budget there are too many uncertainties around the and allows Departments more flexibility to plan likely behaviour of fund recipients. and manage their capital expenditure I have not commissioned any specific study on programmes. the impact of the release of the funds. My The forecast outturn figures published in the Department is keeping the issue under review in 2005 Abridged Estimates show that there will be the context of the normal assessment of the econ- a capital carryover of some \250 million from omic and budgetary position going forward. 2004 to 2005. When that carryover is added to my However, it is important to emphasise that, as the pre-budget provision for capital spending in 2005, scheme will not commence to mature for another the total cash amount available for the year will one and a half years, there are many uncertainties be over \5,970 million. This is an increase of 14% regarding the maturity of the SSIAs, which makes over the 2004 projected outturn. the task of analysing the impact particularly difficult. Price Inflation. Stability and Growth Pact. 80. Mr. Naughten asked the Minister for Fin- ance if he has issued guidelines to Ministers on 82. Mr. Coveney asked the Minister for Fin- the inflationary impact of increases in charges ance when the terms of the Stability and Growth and prices. [29911/04] Pact are likely to be revised; and if he will make a statement on the pact. [29900/04] 220. Mr. R. Bruton asked the Minister for Fin- ance if he has issued guidelines to Ministers on 136. Mr. M. Higgins asked the Minister for Fin- the inflationary impact of increases in charges ance his views on the need for reform of the Stab- and prices. [30130/04] ility and Growth Pact; and if he will make a state- ment on the matter. [29858/04] Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): I propose to take Questions Nos. 80 and 220 together. Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): I propose I am satisfied that all my colleagues are aware to take Questions Nos. 82 and 136 together. of the need to confine increases in charges and The European Commission presented a formal prices administered by Departments to the mini- communication on 3 September 2004 outlining its mum consistent with ensuring that fees recover proposals for strengthening economic governance an appropriate contribution to particular services. and clarifying the implementation of the Stability and Growth Pact. Special Savings Incentive Scheme. The process of discussion of the Commission’s proposals is now under way. At the recent ECO- 81. Mr. Neville asked the Minister for Finance FIN Council of 16 November, Ministers had a if he has commissioned any study on the impact useful exchange of views on the subject. The of the release of funds under the SSIA scheme; Council requested officials to continue work on and if he will make a statement on the matter. the issues involved and to report back, with a [29883/04] view to enabling the Council to conclude the Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): The SSIA review early in 2005. scheme opened on 1 May 2001 and entry to it Ireland is engaging fully with the ongoing dis- closed on 30 April 2002. The accounts are due to cussions to encourage sensible reforms which are mature between May 2006 and April 2007 at the in line with Ireland’s economic priorities. For end of the five year period. A total of 1.17 million example, Ireland has long argued that low debt accounts were opened during the period outlined; countries should have some flexibility in allocat- around 400,000 accounts existed at 31 December ing resources towards their investment needs. 2001. The Commission proposals include a move in this 163 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 164

[Mr. Cowen.] were secured; the number of cases in which direction. I look forward to further productive prison sentences were imposed; the sentence in discussions with my EU colleagues on this and each case; if he has satisfied himself with the level other points in the coming months. of court cases taken having regard to the high level of evasion; and if he will make a statement Tax Evasion. on the matter. [29845/04] 83. Mr. Costello asked the Minister for Finance Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): Iam the number of court prosecutions initiated as a advised by the Revenue Commissioners that the result of tax evasion in respect of each year since following table provides information on court 1997; the number of cases in which convictions prosecutions initiated for tax evasion:

Year Number of Fines imposed Custodial sentence Details of Custodial sentence Convictions (suspended in brackets)

1997 1 \635 Nil 1998 6 \42,854 2 (2) (a) 6 months (suspended) (b) 2 years (suspended) 1999 1 \19,046 Nil 2000 3 \952 2 (1) (a) 2 years (18 months on appeal) (b) 12 months (suspended) 2001 4 \ 14,284 4 (2) (a) 12 months (b) 6 months (suspended), (c) 6 months (suspended), (d) 3 months 2002 3 \5,540 1 (1) 6 months (suspended) 2003 6 \29,365 Nil 2004 to 17 Nov. 1 \5,000. Fines imposed in relation to 3 charges and sentence adjourned on one charge.

The Revenue Commissioners has a very clear Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): I propose policy of prosecuting cases of serious tax evasion. to take Questions Nos. 84, 101 and 149 together. The investigations and prosecutions division of The Government first approved a programme the Office of the Revenue Commissioners is of pilot PPP projects in 1999. Substantial progress responsible for this and the objective is to has been made since then. We are still learning increase the number of prosecutions. Recent fig- and continue to keep our processes and pro- ures indicate that this approach is proving suc- cedures under review. PPPs are acknowledged to cessful. There are currently 41 cases under inves- be complex, involving, as they do, a long-term fin- tigation for potential prosecution, the DPP is ancial commitment for both the private and considering seven cases and has given directions public sector partners for a period of anything up to prosecute in another eight. Bench warrants to 30 years. have been issued in two cases for failure to attend The pilot projects which have been completed court and five cases are in the courts process. are the bundle of five secondary schools in Ballin- collig, Clones, Dunmanway, Shannon and Tub- bercurry, and the second Westlink bridge. Both Public Private Partnerships. of these involved private financing. Both were 84. Ms O. Mitchell asked the Minister for Fin- completed in time. A number of additional pro- ance if he has satisfied himself with the perform- jects are in progress across a range of sectors ance of PPP projects to date; and his expectation including education, roads, and environmental for expenditure funded in this way in 2005. services. Not all PPP projects involve private [29893/04] financing. There are differing PPP structures, including design build operate, which is the pre- 101. Ms O. Mitchell asked the Minister for Fin- dominant type of PPP in the environment sector ance if, in view of the lack of involvement by the in regard to water and wastewater services. private sector in PPPs, including public transport Lessons gained from the initial pilot phase have projects, he intends to introduce reforms to make been incorporated into our processes, structures PPPs increase private sector involvement in such and procedures, including the establishment of schemes; and if he will make a statement on the the National Development Finance Agency, matter. [27008/04] NDFA. On foot of the learnings in the pilot phase, my Department prepared and issued 149. Mr. Gormley asked the Minister for Fin- guidelines for Departments and agencies in ance his views on the use of public private part- regard to the assessment, approval, audit and pro- nership finance initiatives; and if he will make a curement of PPP projects. More guidance is in statement on the matter. [29982/04] progress. 165 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 166

The Comptroller and Auditor General recently \8,172 million, \8,099 million was invested in completed a value for money report on the non-Irish equities and bonds. bundled schools, which I have noted. This report The commission also publishes quarterly per- provides a useful contribution to the develop- formance statements setting out a summary of the ment of the PPP process in Ireland. As noted in fund’s performance in the year to date as a means the report, a number of the issues which were of improving the timeliness of information on the highlighted had already been identified and had fund. The most recent of these performance state- been incorporated into guidance issued by my ments, for the quarter to end-September 2004, Department. was published on October 15 last. It shows the The multi-annual investment framework, total net assets of the fund were \10,778 million which was first announced in budget 2004, at 30 September 2004. Of this amount, \1,448 included estimates for PPP-NDFA investment. million was held in cash and other net current Based on the latest information available from assets, including derivatives, and a total of \9,330 Departments in respect of PPPs, there will be a million was held in equities and bonds. The state- shortfall in PPP projects funded by unitary pay- ment does not distinguish between Irish and non- ments at construction stage in 2005, relative to Irish investments. the Estimates announced in 2004 in relation to The commission’s annual report is required to such PPPs. I will be reviewing the position include information on the investment strategy between now and the budget and I will be followed by the fund, a report on the investment announcing a new multi-annual capital envelope return achieved and a valuation of the net assets for the period 2005 to 2009 on budget day. The of the fund at year-end. These requirements are new capital envelope will take account of the PPP designed to ensure that detailed information con- shortfall in 2005, overall investment priorities and cerning the fund is made available to the Minister the wider expenditure and budgetary position. and the public at the appropriate time. The PPP procurement option should be avail- As the Deputy will be aware, the National Pen- able to Departments and State authorities for sions Reserve Fund Commission which manages application to appropriate projects where there the fund is independent of Government. It con- is the right scale, risk and operational profile to trols and manages the fund with discretionary harness the benefits of this new approach. That is authority to determine and implement the fund’s not to say that it should replace traditional investment strategy. This investment strategy is methods where these are considered more suited based on a commercial investment mandate with to the individual project or projects under con- the objective of securing the optimal return over sideration. The ongoing challenge for my Depart- the long term, having regard to the purpose of ment is to have in place balanced and proportion- the fund as set out in section 18(1) of the National ate procedures for the appraisal, assessment and Pensions Reserve Fund Act 2000 and the pay- evaluation of proposals, which would facilitate ment requirements of the fund as provided for the selection of PPP projects offering quality under section 20 of the Act, provided the level of public services, value for money and timely risk to the moneys held or invested is acceptable delivery. to the commission. My Department is continuing to keep under review how the resources and skills required to Price Inflation. manage the process can most effectively be mar- 86. Mr. Durkan asked the Minister for Finance shalled and applied and how the procedures used the action he can take to address the issue of ris- in this form of procurement can help drive value ing costs in respect of goods and services, con- for money outcomes. tributory factors to which are not reflected in the CPI; and if he will make a statement on the National Pensions Reserve Fund. matter. [29988/04] 85. Ms Shortall asked the Minister for Finance the amount in the funds of the national pensions Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): The Direc- reserve fund at the latest date for which figures tor General of the Central Statistics Office, CSO, has sole responsibility for and is independent in are available; the amount invested outside of deciding the statistical methodology and pro- Ireland; the amount held in cash balances; and if fessional standards to be used in compiling the he will make a statement on the matter. consumer price index, CPI. The latest CPI release [29875/04] shows inflation in October was 2.7%. Inflation Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): The 2003 has averaged just 2.1% in the first ten months of annual report of the National Pensions Reserve this year, compared to an average of 3.8% in the Fund Commission shows that at 31 December same period last year. 2003 the marked to market value of the national My Department’s forecast for CPI inflation in pensions reserve fund was \9,561 million. This 2004, which was published in the Economic included cash deposits of \1,283 million, net cur- Review and Outlook in August, is 2.2%. This rent assets of \36 million, unrealised gains on for- compares to an annual inflation rate of 3.5% in eign derivative contracts of \70 million and equi- 2003. This moderation in the rate of inflation is ties and bonds worth \8,172 million. Of this welcome. 167 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 168

[Mr. Cowen.] varied issues dealt with in the report and its Maintaining a moderate rate of inflation recommendations. remains a key priority of economic policy because Interested parties have contacted my Depart- of its importance in restoring competitiveness. In ment and a small number of submissions have this regard, only limited changes to indirect taxes been made in this regard. I also understand the were made in budget 2004 because the goal of Law Reform Commission’s final report on the keeping inflation low took precedence on that question of a fiscal prosecutor and Revenue court occasion. is due shortly and is likely to treat of many of the issues. My Department is also discussing relevant Decentralisation Programme. issues with other Departments. The group’s recommendations and all the views received on 87. Mr. Deasy asked the Minister for Finance them to date are under examination. if he envisages making any special provision for promotion and for new recruitment in the context of the decentralisation programme; and if he will Currency Fluctuations. make a statement on the matter. [29886/04] 89. Mr. Boyle asked the Minister for Finance the threats the weakening in value of the US dol- Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): Promotion lar poses to the economy here; the measures he and recruitment are key elements of the Govern- intends to put in place to counteract these threats; ment’s decentralisation programme. In the imple- and if he will make a statement on the matter. mentation phase, they are important in support- [29975/04] ing the efficient movement of Departments and offices to their new locations. In a decentralised Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): Any sharp service, acceptance of a post, whether as a result appreciation of the euro vis-a`-vis the dollar is of promotion or open recruitment, will have to be always a challenge to the economy. This arises conditional on agreement to work in a particular because a strong euro reduces the competi- location. tiveness of the exporting sector. Indeed, Ireland The need for new procedures in these areas has is more affected than most within the euro area, been clearly identified as a priority by the decen- given our deeper trade exposure to the US than tralisation implementation group. In accordance many of our European partners. In this regard, it with the group’s recommendations, the Depart- is important that businesses take necessary ment of Finance has begun detailed discussions measures to cope with currency fluctuations, such with the staff unions on the procedures which as hedging against these risks as well as enhancing must be put in place to support the programme their flexibility to cope with currency movements. and to develop arrangements for a fully The experience of sharp currency fluctuations decentralised service. It is essential that these in the past also highlights the importance of procedures be discussed and agreed in partner- regaining cost competitiveness. Keeping pay ship between management and staff. increases in line with the terms of the current To support the implementation phase, Depart- national wage agreement, Sustaining Progress, is ments and offices are making promotion appoint- important in this regard. ments to posts, which it is planned will be I also note that a depreciation of the dollar has decentralised, conditional on appointees under- some potentially positive benefits, most notably taking to relocate to a particular decentralised the fact that oil prices are denominated in dollars, location. Open recruitment to posts which it is and so the euro price per barrel of oil will be planned will be decentralised are also being made lower. conditional on appointees undertaking to relocate to a particular decentralised location. Tax Amnesty. 90. Ms Lynch asked the Minister for Finance Revenue Powers Group. the number of breaches detected of the Waiver 88. Mr. Howlin asked the Minister for Finance of Certain Tax, Interest and Penalties Act 1993 the progress made by his Department and the in respect of each year since 1994; the number Revenue Commissioners in their consideration of of prosecutions initiated and convictions secured the recommendations of the Revenue Powers arising from such detections; if it is adopted in the Group; and if he will make a statement on the manner intended by the Houses of the matter. [29850/04] Oireachtas; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [29851/04] Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): As the Deputy will know, my predecessor established Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): Iam the Revenue Powers Group, under the chairman- advised by the Revenue Commissioners that ship of Mr. Justice Frank Murphy, to examine there are two ways in which a taxpayer may have Revenue’s main statutory powers and report on been in breach of the amnesty, first, in making changes needed. The group’s report was pub- a false declaration or, second, in not making a lished on 4 February 2004 and the Minister indi- declaration. I am informed that Revenue does not cated at that time that he wished to allow a period have figures for the number of detected breaches for debate and public reflection on the many and of the amnesty. Because of the confidentiality 169 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 170 conditions built into the 1993 amnesty legislation, but issues in relation to individual programmes such breaches are difficult to identify and prove. and-or projects should be raised by the Deputy No individual has been successfully prosecuted with the relevant Minister. to date for failure to comply with the obligatory provisions of the Waiver of Certain Tax, Interest State Laboratory. and Penalties Act, 1993. Individuals and companies have been success- 92. Mr. Rabbitte asked the Minister for Fin- fully prosecuted in recent years as a result of Rev- ance the position with regard to the transfer of enue investigations, and although these investi- the State Laboratory from its present location at gations have in some instances involved Abbotstown to its new location at Backweston; consideration of possible amnesty breaches, it the reason for the delay in completing the was not possible in any of them to obtain the evi- transfer; if all staff have agreed to the proposed dence necessary to meet the required standards relocation; the estimated final cost of the transfer; of “beyond reasonable doubt” from an amnesty the steps being taken at the new location to perspective. Revenue’s criminal investigation ensure that delays in the completion of tests are programmes have been refocused recently with ended, especially in view of serious concerns the establishment of an investigations and pros- expressed by coroners at the delays in inquests; ecutions division, one of whose functions is to and if he will make a statement on the matter. increase the number of prosecutions for serious [29866/04] tax evasion. Where in the course of investigations Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): Iam amnesty offences are identified, they are con- informed by the State Chemist that the new lab- sidered for investigation with a view to taking a oratory in Backweston will be ready for occu- criminal prosecution. Many of the cases currently pation by the end of November, so no transfer under investigation relate to tax offences commit- could take place earlier. The project team will ted in recent years and do not therefore involve have the new location and equipment ready for consideration of amnesty issues. In view of this, I each of the nine sections of the laboratory, which am satisfied that the Revenue Commissioners is will move in turn over a period of two to three making every effort to ensure the law is applied months. Disruption to testing and other labora- in the manner intended by the legislation as tory procedures will be kept to a minimum by passed by the Houses of the Oireachtas. moving each section over a different weekend. Particular care will be taken in this regard in the Departmental Expenditure. case of the toxicology section which handles 91. Mr. Hogan asked the Minister for Finance reports for the coroners. All of the staff of the if he has satisfied himself that the extra tax col- laboratory are co-operating fully in the prep- lected in the past seven years is delivering value arations for the relocation, although the staff for money through the spending increases which unions have not yet completed the conciliation they were used to finance. [29887/04] and arbitration process. Consequently, it is unlikely that the move will commence until Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): The December. Government has more than doubled total spend- The overall final cost of the facility at Backwes- ing on public services between 1997 and 2004 to \ \ over \41 billion. As provided for in the Abridged ton is estimated to be 87.5 million, including 9 Estimates Volume published last week, the million provided in 2004 for equipment. Government will be adding a further \2.5 billion I am conscious of the importance of the service to this in 2005 on a pre-budget basis to fund day- provided to the coroners by the State Laboratory to-day spending on public services. Priority has and the impact it inevitably has on relatives of been given to expenditure on social welfare, people whose deaths are the subject of inquests health, education and investment. Gross spending at a time of great distress. I know the manage- on health has increased by 176% to \9.6 billion ment of the laboratory share that sensitivity and in 2004, spending on social welfare has increased constantly monitor the service by reviewing avail- by 97% to \11.3 billion while expenditure on edu- able resources, outsourcing possibilities and the cation has increased by 103% to \6.1 billion. complexity of analyses. Capital spending to address the country’s infras- Additional resources have been allocated to tructural deficit has increased by 178%. The gen- the toxicology section and there has been a sub- eral Government debt ratio has decreased from stantial increase in the number of analyses com- 65% of GDP in 1997 to an expected ratio of less pleted. However, there is still a backlog of cases, than 32% by the end of this year. In addition, due to an increase of 50% in the past two years nearly \10.5 billion has been set aside for long in the number of cases referred, and a general term pension and social security costs by increase in the complexity of the analyses investing in the national pensions reserve fund. required. This level of spending has been achieved in tan- A range of measures are being taken at present dem with the preservation of a stable budgetary to reduce the turnaround time of samples sent to position and major reductions in personal tax- the laboratory and processed by its toxicology ation. In my view it has resulted in significant section. Additional priority is to be given to the improvements in public services across the board coroners cases over other work of the section. 171 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 172

[Mr. Cowen.] national development plan projects. In this Laboratory management are also reviewing the respect it provides a centralised expert service to procedures and processes in the toxicology area Departments and certain other State authorities. with a view to automating as much as possible. The PPP procurement option should be avail- I am told by the management of the laboratory able to Departments and State authorities for that the completion of the relocation to Backwes- application to appropriate projects where there ton will enable the enhancement of the quality of is the right scale, risk and operational profile to service provided to all its clients, including the harness the benefits of this new approach. Coroner Service. Discussions will commence soon with sectoral interests on planned changes in the area of public Departmental Programmes. sector contracts for construction and construction 93. Mr. Allen asked the Minister for Finance related services. The changes will involve the the reason for the delay in publishing the public amendment and introduction of new standard capital programme. [29898/04] forms of construction projects which will transfer appropriate risks to contractors where they are Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): There has best placed to manage them. These initiatives been no delay in publishing the summary public seek to address the issues of improved project capital programme, PCP. In accordance with nor- management and to reduce the potential for pro- mal practice, the 2005 summary PCP was pub- ject cost overruns. lished as part of the Abridged Estimates Volume, AEV, and presented to the Da´il on 18 November. Departmental Investigations. As I indicated when publishing the AEV and summary PCP, I will be announcing a revised 95. Ms McManus asked the Minister for Fin- multi-annual capital envelope for 2005-09 on ance the progress in regard to any action taken by budget day. his Department and the Revenue Commissioners The full public capital programme will as nor- arising from the report of the High Court inspec- mal be published as a separate document along tors on a bank (details supplied) which was pub- with the Revised Estimates Volume in February lished on 30 July 2004; and if he will make a state- of next year. ment on the matter. [29853/04] Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): Iam Capital Projects. advised by the Revenue Commissioners that they 94. Mr. McGinley asked the Minister for Fin- had commenced an investigation in January 1998 ance if he has satisfied himself with the effective- when information indicating serious tax evasion ness of the process whereby different funding on the part of customers of the financial insti- options are being assessed for capital projects; tution in question had been made known to them. and if he will make a statement on the matter. As a result of the subsequent investigation they [29903/04] had become aware of the magnitude of the invest- ments made by individuals through the financial Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): Capital pro- institution. jects are procured primarily by the traditional The investigation is largely complete and means of Exchequer capital or by public private settlements made to date with individuals amount partnership, PPP. In both cases, projects are sub- to \48.12 million in respect of tax, interest and ject to appraisal for value for money in accord- penalties, with a further \4.7 million received as ance with the relevant guidelines laid down by payments on account of the individuals’ final liab- my Department. It is a matter for the sponsoring ility. The investigations into the tax liability of the Department or agency, with the approval of the remaining cases are continuing. relevant sanctioning Department, to determine As indicated, much of the information in the which project option represents best value for report of the High Court inspectors was known money. but some additional matters concerning the Under the general conditions of sanction for activities of the institution itself came to light and the multi-annual capital envelopes introduced in have been the subject of further consideration by budget 2004, Departments are required to comply Revenue in the context of establishing whether in all cases with my Department’s guidelines for there is evidence that criminal offences under the the appraisal and management of capital projects. Taxes Consolidation Act 1997 have been commit- My Department is in the process of revising these ted and, if so, whether admissible evidence can be guidelines in consultation with Departments. obtained. In particular the “aiding and abetting” New guidelines will be published later this year. offence under section 1078 of the Taxes Consoli- To assist State authorities in determining the dation Act is being considered but, as indicated optimal means of financing public investment by Revenue in other situations, it is very difficult projects, the Government established the to prove. National Development Finance Agency, NDFA, Apart from the tax matters, the behaviours on 1 January 2003. The NDFA’s role includes outlined in the report may suggest weaknesses or advising on the financing and risk evaluation of failings in relation to compliance with certain Ireland’s public private partnership procurement other regulatory and legislative requirements, projects and raising or arranging finance for such as those relating to money laundering, 173 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 174 exchange controls and notification of fees and Tax Yield. charges. The findings in the report and the bank’s 96. Mr. Connaughton asked the Minister for response are being examined in detail by the Irish Finance the aggregate amount of revenue Financial Services Regulatory Authority, IFSRA, expected to be raised in 2004 in taxation from the which has already stated that any actions or purchase, registration and use of motor vehicles, measures that are required will be taken. In light distinguishing the total in VAT, in excises, in of this and other widely reported issues, IFSRA VRT, in motor tax and so on. [29904/04] is engaged in an industry-wide exercise focusing on appropriate systems and controls to ensure 243. Mr. Durkan asked the Minister for Fin- that all credit institutions are fully in compliance ance the anticipated outturn in terms of receipts with all relevant laws and requirements. IFSRA of all taxation derived from the motor industry; is also making sure that there is proper monitor- and if he will make a statement on the matter. ing of the fee and interest reimbursement pro- [30282/04] gramme, which has been commenced by the Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): I propose bank. to take Questions Nos. 96 and 243 together. The role of the Minister for Finance in relation I am not in a position to provide figures of the to financial regulation is to bring forward legislat- anticipated outturn for 2004 of taxation specifi- ive proposals whereby a duly empowered finan- cally derived from the motor industry. The latest cial regulator can regulate and supervise the fin- estimated figures for 2004 to end October 2004, ancial sector in accordance with those powers. as advised by the Revenue Commissioners, in The necessary legislative framework has been put respect of the yield from VAT, excise and VRT in place and day to day responsibility for the for various commodities associated with motor- supervision of credit institutions is a matter for ing, are shown in the following tables: IFSRA. IFSRA is independent in the exercise of its supervisory functions and my Department does not get involved in its day to day activities. VAT Yield 2004 to October I should point out that the regulatory structures governing financial institutions have changed \ million enormously in recent years, taking into account many of the lessons already learnt from this case Petrol 252.81 and others. However, if further examination by Auto Diesel 28.46 IFSRA or my Department indicates that Motor Oil & LPG 1.98 additional powers are required to prevent a Cars 367.51 recurrence of similar practices, I will address that Motor Cycles 4.78 as a matter of priority. In any event, the proposed consolidation and simplification of financial ser- Car Repairs 28.14 vices legislation will provide an opportunity to Car Accessories 23.28 carry out any necessary strengthening or rational- Car Hire 10.68 isation of the regulatory framework in this regard. Driving Instruction 2.67 The exchange control implications of this case Haulage 25.71 were first raised in early 1998 and, as the House has previously been informed, were investigated Total 746.02 by the Central Bank at the request of the then Minister for Finance. The bank’s interim report to the Minister for Finance in May 1998 was not conclusive and the bank indicated that it would Excise Duty 2004 to October defer concluding its consideration of exchange \ control matters pending the finding of other million investigations. Legal advice at the time was that Petrol 838.00 the report was not sufficient to warrant its Auto Diesel 750.40 referral to the DPP. It should be noted that Auto LPG 0.08 exchange controls were phased out progressively, especially from 1988, and were finally abolished Total 1,588.5 on 31 December 1992. My Department has writ- ten to the Governor of the Central Bank asking him to arrange for a review of the situation hav- ing regard to both the recent High Court inspec- VRT 2004 to October tors’ report and the 1998 report of the author- \ ised officer. million I should point out that the report has been Cars 890.62 referred to the DPP, and criminal charges might Motor Cycles 2.95 therefore follow. While it would not be a matter Car Derived Vans 9.61 for me, the behaviours reported in this case are Commercial Vehicles 2.42 of a type that could also have potential impli- cations for individuals both from a company law Total 905.60 and a financial services regulatory point of view. 175 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 176

[Mr. Cowen.] I am conscious of the need to ensure equity in It is not possible to quantify income tax and cor- the tax system. Since 1998, this Government has poration tax data separately for the motor made 29 separate and effective moves to limit industry. reliefs, re-focus allowances, close off loopholes In respect of annual motor tax, I am informed and ensure that a proper balance is struck by the Department of the Environment, Heritage between the provision of particular incentives for and Local Government that the forecast for good public policy reasons and the availability of motor tax receipts in 2004 is \724 million. The opportunities for higher earners to reduce their provisional yield for the year to end October is tax exposure. I will continue this policy. To that \640 million. end, all reliefs and incentives will be kept under In respect of toll roads, I am informed by the review to ensure that they are fulfilling the pur- Department of Transport that the annual fee to pose for which they were intended. the Exchequer is estimated to be approximately As I have recently informed the House, the \9 million for 2004. It is estimated that VAT Revenue Commissioners are introducing a receipts for the first six months of the year are number of changes to certain tax forms which will \4 million. yield additional information regarding the cost of reliefs. This is part of ongoing commitments to Tax Code. improve the quality of information available on the costs of tax expenditures generally. Provisions 97. Ms Burton asked the Minister for Finance were included in the Finance Act 2004 to under- the steps he is taking to carry out an assessment pin these changes. This will provide better data of various tax reliefs, especially property-based in this area and enable fuller estimates of the tax reliefs, to establish whether they are making a sig- foregone to be made over time. nificant contribution to the economic life of the country or simply allowing high earners to reduce National Minimum Wage. or eliminate their tax liability; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [29841/04] 98. Mr. G. Mitchell asked the Minister for Fin- ance the cost of removing the minimum wage Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): All major entirely from the scope of income taxes in tax incentives-expenditures are kept under review 2005. [29897/04] by this Government, especially in the context of the annual budget and Finance Bill process. It is 118. Mr. Gilmore asked the Minister for Fin- widely acknowledged that there are legitimate ance the progress made to date with regard to the and reasonable reasons for tax reliefs as a general commitment given in An Agreed Programme for principle and few would argue that these tax Government to remove all persons on the relief provisions have not made a significant con- national minimum wage from the tax net; the tribution to the economic life of the country. Suc- steps he intends to take to ensure that this com- cessive Governments have introduced them for a mitment is honoured; and if he will make a state- range of purposes such as regenerating inner cit- ment on the matter. [29847/04] ies, improving tourism prospects in areas where Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): I propose the potential was not being realised, developing to take Questions Nos. 98 and 118 together. industries such as the film industry and providing I am informed by the Revenue Commissioners seed capital for small businesses. I would add that that the full year cost of removing the minimum the economic aspect is only part of the picture wage entirely from the scope of income tax in one must look at when assessing tax reliefs: 2005 would be \350 million, if achieved through societal, cultural and environmental effects are an increase in the employee PAYE credit. It also important and should not be discounted or would be \525 million in a full year if the neces- ignored. sary increase was applied solely to the personal Our estimates of the costs of the ten highest credit. If the required increase was applied costing reliefs show these to include pension con- equally between the personal and employee cred- tributions, stamp duty and capital gains tax its, the full year cost would be \440 million. exemptions on one’s home, mortgage interest When the statutory minimum wage came into relief, non-taxation of child benefit, medical effect in 2000, less than 64% of the annualised insurance relief and the special savings accounts. figure of \11,330, or £8,923, was exempt from tax- These cannot be characterised as tax shelters for ation. In budget 2002, 90% of the minimum wage high earners. became exempt from tax and in budgets 2003 and There are many reasons a person would have 2004, this position has been maintained even a nil liability. This can arise from the cumulation though the minimum wage was increased in of tax relief for pension contributions, trading October 2002 and February 2004. The wage cur- losses carried forward, capital allowances and rently stands at \7 per hour, having been various tax reliefs. It must be accepted that tax increased from \6.35 per hour on 1 February reliefs, even where they can be justified for good 2004. The annualised equivalent of the minimum public policy purposes, will reduce the tax bills of wage is \14,196 and 90% of this figure is free of those in the higher income bracket. tax for the single PAYE person. 177 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 178

There is a commitment in the Government pro- of tax relief for pension contributions, trading gramme, An Agreed Programme for Govern- losses carried forward, capital allowances and ment, which states that “over the next five years various tax incentives. It must be accepted that, our priorities will be to achieve a position where of their nature, tax reliefs, even where they can all those on the minimum wage are removed from be justified for good public policy purposes, will the tax net”. The five year period mentioned reduce the tax bills of those in the higher commenced two years ago when the Government income bracket. were elected to office. I should also point out that I am conscious of the need to ensure equity in the commitment to exempt the minimum wage the tax system. This Government has reduced the from tax is given in the context of a broader econ- tax burden for all taxpayers, particularly the omic and budgetary strategy which provides, lower paid, on an unprecedented scale. Since among other things, that the public finances will 1998, we have also taken effective measures to be kept in a healthy condition and that personal limit and refocus tax reliefs to ensure a proper and business taxes will be kept down in order to balance is struck between the provision of par- strengthen and maintain the competitive position ticular incentives for good public policy reasons of the Irish economy. and the availability of opportunities for higher The current national partnership agreement, earners to reduce their tax exposure. I will con- Sustaining Progress, contains a commitment in tinue this policy. To that end, all reliefs and generally similar terms. Accordingly, exemption incentives will be kept under review to ensure from tax of those on the minimum wage will be a that they are fulfilling the purpose for which they matter for consideration in the context of the were intended. annual budgets over the next number of years With regard to the steps I may take or consistent with the Government’s overall econ- measures I may be considering, I refer the omic and budgetary strategy and with the Deputies to the long-standing practice of Mini- Government’s commitments already mentioned. sters for Finance not to comment on what may or However, there should be no doubt about our may not be contained in upcoming budgets. I do commitment in this regard. not intend to depart from that approach.

Housing Market. Question No. 101 answered with Question No. 84. 99. Mr. Noonan asked the Minister for Finance his views on the exposure of the economy to Ansbacher Accounts. reversals in the housing market; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [29909/04] 102. Ms B. Moynihan-Cronin asked the Mini- ster for Finance the number of persons, compan- Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): Recent ies and trusts being investigated by the Revenue years have seen a rapid increase in output in the Commissioners arising from accounts (details residential construction sector. In 2003, housing supplied) at the latest date for which figures are construction accounted for just over 10% of available; the number of cases in which settle- GNP. While I would expect a normal easing back ments have been agreed; the total amount paid of housing output in the coming years construc- to date; the number of cases still outstanding; if tion sector demand should be assisted by a con- additional action has been taken by the Revenue tinuation of a strong public capital programme Commissioners arising from the report of the and a pick up in other investment. Most commen- inspectors; and if he will make a statement on the tators believe the Irish housing market is under- matter. [29855/04] pinned by sound economic fundamentals and favourable demographics which must also be Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): Iam taken into account. advised by the Revenue Commissioners that their Ansbacher review team has inquired into 289 Tax Code. cases to date and 92 of these cases have con- cluded settlements with Revenue. The 289 cases, 100. Mr. Gormley asked the Minister for Fin- taking account of spouses and connected com- ance if he intends to introduce measures to panies, consist of 300 names. The 289 cases are prevent high earners from achieving zero tax liab- made up of 179 cases listed on the High Court ility; and if he will make a statement on the inspectors’ report and 110 similar cases dis- matter. [29981/04] covered by Revenue or listed on the authorised 109. Mr. Perry asked the Minister for Finance officer’s report. whether additional caps should be introduced in A total of 211 cases have been under active respect of certain tax reliefs in order that they not investigation. The remaining cases consist of 62 be used to eliminate the tax liability of high earn- non-resident persons, including 17 former Irish ing persons. [29920/04] residents, 12 individuals who claimed the 1993 amnesty provisions and four cases with insuf- Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): I propose ficient identity information. to take Questions Nos. 100 and 109 together. The investigation includes examining the tax There are many reasons a person would have position of disclosed entities and accumulating a nil liability. This can arise from the cumulation and assembling information on other connected 179 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 180

[Mr. Cowen.] institutions and third parties of books, records entities. The number of connected entities in and other documentation, which are relevant to relation to cases under investigation is now liabilities of Ansbacher account holders. Some nearly 700. 150,000 documents have been received under the Revenue continues to make use of its legislat- terms of the High Court orders. Advanced invest- ive powers to seek books, records, documents and igative computer software is used in controlling information in the cases being investigated. and managing the documentation. Where appropriate, prosecutions will be con- To date, a total of \44.01 million has been sidered but these will depend on the level of evi- received in respect of 92 cases — 54 cases with dence available. final settlements of \32.47 million and 38 cases Revenue has made five successful applications with payments on account of \11.54 million. This to the High Court for the production by financial is made up of the following:

Cases \ million

Cases involving Ansbacher or Ansbacher type arrangements 76 Cases 35.31 Other cases involving offshore funds or deposits 16 Cases 8.70

Total 92 Cases 44.01

The 92 cases which have concluded settlements mittee of Public Accounts specifically on pro- with Revenue as referred to in the opening para- posed changes in spending arrangements. If there graph consist of 54 cases with final settlements of is a particular report the Deputy has in mind, I \32.47 million; 25 non-resident cases covered by am happy to consider this matter further on the the provisions of double taxation agreements; 11 basis of more detailed information. with no additional liability; and two covered by the 1993 amnesty provisions. Tax Code. Revenue made an application under section 11 104. Mr. Kenny asked the Minister for Finance of the Companies Act 1990 for a copy of the High if he has examined the take up of tax relief for Court inspectors’ report, which was made avail- pension contributions across different income cat- able to Revenue on 6 July 2002. The information egories; and if he will make a statement on the in this report has been carefully considered as matter. [29915/04] regards the tax liabilities of the persons con- cerned. In addition, Revenue has made a further Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): It is not application to the High Court for access to the possible to examine the take up of tax relief for supporting papers to the High Court inspectors’ all pension contributions across different income report. Judgment was delivered by the President categories. This is because the relevant infor- of the High Court on 25 May 2004 to allow access mation is not available to the Revenue Commis- to the supporting papers in relation to clients of sioners as the tax relief for pension contributions Ansbacher named in the High Court inspectors’ for employees is normally given at source, that is, report and those persons and companies, includ- the taxable income is the income net of pension ing members of the board, found by the High contributions by employees. Court inspectors to have failed to co-operate with their inquiry. The judgment also allows for the Claims Against the State. Revenue Commissioners to make application and 105. Mr. Sherlock asked the Minister for Fin- grounding affidavit for the obtaining of infor- ance the number of cases for compensation mation and documents relating to any other indi- lodged against the State for alleged exposure to vidual or company. Access to documents is sub- toxic mould in Government-owned buildings; the ject to the direction of the High Court. The High steps being taken to eliminate any threat posed Court orders in the matter were granted in June by toxic mould; and if he will make a statement 2004. Revenue has informed me that the investi- on the matter. [29872/04] gations are time-consuming and complex and are likely to continue for some time to come. Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): The State Claims Agency is handling two cases of alleging Departmental Expenditure. personal injury following exposure to a toxic mould. The State Claims Agency, as part of its 103. Mr. Ring asked the Minister for Finance if risk management programme, commissioned a he has received any report from the Office of the survey of a number of Government-owned build- Comptroller and Auditor General or the Com- ings located countrywide to ascertain the situa- mittee of Public Accounts on proposed changes tion in relation to toxic mould. The buildings in spending arrangements; and if he will make a selected were of varying age and building types. statement on the matter. [29912/04] The report did not reveal any prevalent toxic Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): I have mould problem. The State Claims Agency is in received no report from the Office of the discussions with the Office of Public Works to Comptroller and Auditor General or the Com- ensure that the necessary mechanisms are in 181 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 182 place to permit the identification and removal of It is always difficult to achieve complete equity toxic mould where discovered. The State Claims in taxation but this issue is borne in mind where Agency will provide guidelines to the Office of relevant in the case of stamp duty. Public Works and State authorities early in the 108. Mr. Wall asked the Minister for Finance new year, based on the report’s findings. his views on the recent suggestion made by Dublin City Council for the introduction of a Decentralisation Programme. sales tax and hotel bed tax to fund local councils; 106. Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in asked the Minister and if he will make a statement on the matter. for Finance if he will report on progress to date [29870/04] on the decentralisation programme; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [29973/04] Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): It is my understanding that this question relates to a Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): The two detailed submission by Dublin City Council to a reports of the decentralisation implementation major independent review of local government group, DIG, dated 31 March 2004 and 30 July financing in Ireland which is being carried out. 2004, provide detailed accounts of the progress The Minister for the Environment, Heritage and made in implementing the decentralisation pro- Local Government has set up a steering group gramme announced last December. An analysis to oversee this review, which is expected to be of the applications registered with the central completed in spring 2005. At this juncture it applications facility by 7 September 2004 has also would be premature of me to offer any comment been published. I refer the Deputy also to the on the possible recommendations or measures presentations made to the Oireachtas Joint Com- which may arise from the review process. mittee on Finance and the Public Service on 6 October 2004 by the chair of the implementation Question No. 109 answered with Question group, the CEO of the Public Appointments Ser- No. 100. vice, PAS, and the Department of Finance. I am very pleased with the progress which has already Decentralisation Programme. been made in driving forward the implementation of the programme. 110. Mr. Rabbitte asked the Minister for Fin- In addition, I have received for consideration ance the total estimated cost of acquiring sites, from the DIG a report containing proposals on new buildings, equipping new offices and other those organisations which, in the group’s view, ancillary costs likely to arise from the decentralis- should be included in the first phase of moves and ation proposals; and if he will make a statement I expect to be making an announcement in this on the matter. [29865/04] regard shortly. 127. Mr. Boyle asked the Minister for Finance the costings which are being provided, in view of Tax Code. the fact that it is accepted that it will cost over \1 107. Mr. Kehoe asked the Minister for Finance billion to provide accommodation for office relo- if he has satisfied himself with the equity of the cation throughout the country for Departments stamp duty code. [29891/04] and agencies, in terms of logistics and ancillary costs; and if he will make a statement on the Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): As pre- matter. [29976/04] viously advised to the Deputy in a reply to a parliamentary question on 14 October 2004, Minister of State at the Department of Finance stamp duty is a tax on property and property (Mr. Parlon): I propose to take Questions Nos. rights. As ownership of property is positively cor- 110 and 127 together. related with income, the incidence of this tax will The Budget Statement 2003 set out a major tend to fall more on those on higher incomes. The new programme of public service decentralisation equity of this depends on ones viewpoint but such involving the relocation of 10,300 civil and public a tax is generally regarded as progressive from service jobs to 53 centres in 25 counties. Further the point of view of equity. announcements since then increased the scope of As for equity between different classes of pur- the programme to over 10,500 jobs in more than chasers of property, the following points are of 56 locations. relevance: stamp duty does not arise in the case My office has been tasked with procurement of of transfers on death; stamp duty does not arise development sites in the designated locations and in the case of transfers between spouses; half the the procurement of accommodation solutions to normal rate applies in the case of transfers the office and facility requirements of the Depart- between other close relatives; no stamp duty ments and agencies involved. Following the applies in the vast majority of purchases of new requests for property proposals, the Office of houses by first-time buyers or other owner occu- Public Works received in excess of 700 proposed piers, whereas investors pay the normal rates on property solutions in relation to the decentralis- the purchase of new houses; and in the case of ation programme scheduled for the various the purchase of a second-hand house by a first- locations around the country. Detailed evaluation time buyer, stamp duty only applies if the value of these proposals has been undertaken and the exceeds \190,500. Office of Public Works has made significant pro- 183 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 184

[Mr. Parlon.] fees and inflation. In addition, the cost of equip- gress in sourcing possible sites at the locations ping the accommodation to standard office equip- concerned. ment levels could be estimated at c.\4,000 per The evaluation process involves the following person. This would exclude the cost of infor- three-strand approach: an architectural assess- mation and communication technology and ment by OPW architects; a valuation process specialised equipment requirements. undertaken by both OPW and private sector val- Such general measurements of cost do not uers; and an assessment by reference to the busi- include specialised facility and equipment ness needs and staff requirements of each requirements and other variables which would decentralising Department or agency. arise from the spread of possible procurement To date, eight property solutions have been methodologies. In addition, general cost indi- agreed in principle and a further 20 are at an cators of this type show a snapshot in time. The advanced stage in the acquisition process. The chairman of the decentralisation implementation balance of the sites will be pursued over the com- group laid out a sequencing approach to members ing months. of the Joint Committee on Finance and the Public A broad range of factors will influence the Service on 6 October. The group’s views on sequ- selection of sites and these include: proximity of encing and timing are to be submitted to the the site to commercial, leisure and educational Cabinet sub-committee on decentralisation for its facilities; proximity to public transport; access to consideration. The outcome of these deliber- and from a good quality road network; and zon- ations will clearly have an impact on how we can ing for development. The prevailing property more closely assess programme costs going market conditions in each geographical area will forward. also have a significant bearing on the acquisition It is self-evident that a firmer scale of costs for of sites. In the circumstances and taking into the decentralisation programme will only emerge account that the acquisition process is still in pro- on foot of actual cost proposals being received gress, it is not possible at this stage to provide a from the market. Nevertheless we can clearly precise estimate of the cost of the site acquisition anticipate that, generally-speaking, the cost of programme. However, for working purposes providing accommodation infrastructure in prov- only, an indicative figure of \75 to \100 million incial locations compared to central Dublin is being used by the OPW. locations should yield considerable cost savings to The next stage in the decentralisation process the State over time in terms of site costs, capital will focus on the construction of office accommo- build costs and maintenance costs. dation on the sites being procured by OPW. The In relation to non-property costs, my Depart- decentralisation implementation group recom- ment, at the request of the Decentralisation mended a public private partnership approach, Implementation Group engaged consultants to where appropriate, to the procurement of the identify the areas in which non-property related office accommodation. Consequently, my office costs and savings would arise in both the tran- has been developing a comprehensive risk- sition phases and in the longer term. I understand adjusted costing of project elements to measure that this report has been received and further the value for money of future PPP bids, in information concerning these issues will be made addition to examining the appropriateness of available shortly. using traditional procurement methods. It is expected that the scale and locational profile of Aer Rianta. some decentralisation projects will not fit within 111. Mr. R. Bruton asked the Minister for Fin- a PPP procured model. Accordingly the cost pro- ance if he is satisfied with the payments made to file of such projects may vary from the PPP terminate the employment of the chief executive model. of Aer Rianta; and the papers which were It is anticipated that, in the vast majority of presented to him in this respect before he issued cases, the accommodation facilities will be pro- his approval. [29879/04] vided by the construction of new office buildings and cost estimation can be approached on that Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): I refer the basis. However, in advance of actual market test- Deputy to my previous reply of 14 October. The ing of any procurement methodology, it is poss- previous Minister, as shareholder, indicated his ible, at this time, only to assign the most general consent to arrangements, outlined to him by the measurements of cost to such a large-scale, chairman of Aer Rianta on 24 September last, diverse and complex programme. concerning the package the board proposed to make to the deputy chief executive who was leav- It is estimated that approximately 210,000 sq. ing the company. I understand that the proposed m, or 2.26m sq. ft, of office space will be required package included a lump sum of two and a half to accommodate the total numbers included in times salary, a contribution to pension fund, pay- the programme. Current industry cost norms in ment of a bonus and retention of company car. respect of commercial offices would indicate an average build cost to fit-out standard, in the range Banking Sector. of \1,450 per square metre to \2,000 per square metre. Such figures exclude VAT, professional 112. Ms Burton asked the Minister for Finance 185 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 186 if he has plans to require the main banks to make This positive trend in supply has continued into a greater contribution to the Exchequer through 2004, with statistics for the six months to June taxation or other appropriate mechanism, showing that overall house completions at 35,957 especially in view of the recent report from a were up 21.4% on the same period last year. company (details supplied) showing that the two The housing market is a complex and dynamic main banks here are among the most profitable one and demands continuous monitoring and in Europe; and if he will make a statement on the adjustment to address changing circumstances. In matter. [29842/04] such examinations tax equity is always a consider- Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): As the ation. As the Deputy will appreciate, it is not the Deputy is no doubt aware, companies are liable practice to comment on the possibility or other- to corporation tax on their profits at the relevant wise of tax policy changes in the lead up to the tax rate. Since 1 January a new standard rate of annual budget. corporation tax of 12.5% has applied across the board to the trading profits of companies. If a Decentralisation Programme. particular company’s net trading profits for tax 114. Mr. Penrose asked the Minister for Fin- purposes increase, then it will pay more corpor- ance the supports, financial or otherwise, which ation tax. The Finance Act 2003 provided for a will be made available to civil and public servants special levy on financial institutions calculated by transferring to new locations outside of Dublin reference to the amount of tax payable by them under the proposed decentralisation programme; in 2001 on deposit interest. The levy applies at and if he will make a statement on the matter. \100 million per annum for each of the years [29864/04] 2003, 2004 and 2005. As Deputies will be aware, it is not the practice in the lead up to the budget Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): The decen- to comment on any possible changes in taxation. tralisation implementation group in its second report published in July 2004, recognised that a Tax Code. professional and comprehensive range of support 113. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Fin- services should be provided to assist decentralis- ance if he is satisfied with the equity of the tax ing staff with the myriad of issues likely to arise. treatment of the housing sector. [29906/04] The number of moves of staff and their families provides a significant market opportunity for pro- Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): A range of viders of professional and other services. If it is tax incentives exist in the housing market in the possible for providers to offer services on a cen- case of first-time and other owner occupiers, tralised or co-ordinated basis, there would also be investors and tenants. For owner-occupiers, mort- significant benefits for staff. gage interest relief at the standard rate is granted The group recommended that the Department in respect of interest paid up to a ceiling on loans of Finance approach the market seeking used for the purchase or improvement of a per- expressions of interest for the supply of services son’s sole or main residence. Preferential covering auctioneering, legal, relocation and arrangements exist for first-time buyers over other appropriate services to support and assist other owner occupiers. The existing higher ceil- staff relocating to any of the centres under the ings for first-time buyers on allowable interest were increased in budget 2003. The period for public service decentralisation programme. which these increased ceilings will apply was Depending on the expressions of interest extended from five years to seven years. received, the Department may pass on infor- All owner-occupiers, including first-time buy- mation about the services being offered to staff. ers, are generally exempt from stamp duty on The Department advertised in the national new houses where the property is 125 square press on Monday, 8 November for expressions of metres or less. In addition, there is more favour- interest for the supply of services. The request able stamp duty treatment for first-time buyers of for expressions of interest made it clear that no second hand houses up to \381,000 as compared subsidy from public funds would be provided for to other purchasers. Owner-occupiers also are not any of the services offered or provided to staff. subject to capital gains tax on the gain from the What services are provided and what the costs disposal of their main residence. might be are issues which will have to be agreed In relation to investors, in budget 2002, against between the provider and those members of staff a background of increasing rents and a shortage who are considering using the services offered. of rental stock, mortgage interest relief was rein- The programme of decentralisation will be troduced in respect of borrowings for use in the implemented through the transfer of staff on a rented residential sector. For tenants, tax relief voluntary basis. There will be no redundancies at the standard rate is available to individuals in and, as on previous occasions, the payment of respect of rent paid on their accommodation up removal or relocation expenses will not arise. to a certain ceiling. However, discussions will be held with the public The years 2002 and 2003 were the eight and service unions at every stage to ensure the neces- ninth successive years of record housing output sary support is in place for all staff affected by with 57,695 and 68,819 completions, respectively. the programme. 187 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 188

Flood Relief. remind the Deputies that the Government at its meeting on 21 September last approved the 115. Mr. O’Dowd asked the Minister for Fin- recommendations of the flood policy review ance the financial assistance he can offer to busi- group. This confirms the role of the OPW in tak- nesses and householders in view of the recent dis- ing a strategic approach to flood management in astrous flooding in many parts of the country. the future and working in co-operation with the [27535/04] relevant local authorities. The programme of 133. Mr. Hayes asked the Minister for Finance flood relief schemes on hand will be implemented the steps he intends to take to alleviate the hard- as resources permit in the context of an inte- ship felt by many residents and business people grated, long-term strategy on flood management throughout the country who have been adversely measures, for example, flood warning systems, affected by recent flooding; if he has satisfied flood mapping, guidelines on development and himself with the flood prevention programmes in formulation of catchment flood risk management place in towns and cities; and if he will make a plans to foster a catchment-based approach to statement on the matter. [27703/04] flood management. Account will be taken of the need to prioritise expenditure in the areas of Minister of State at the Department of Finance greatest need and to be mindful of the impli- (Mr. Parlon): I propose to take Questions Nos. cations of climate change. I am glad to be able to 115 and 133 together. report that the OPW has already commenced At its meeting on 2 November 2004 the work on the development of flood warning Government approved the establishment of a systems and flood hazard mapping as the first humanitarian aid scheme to relieve hardship aris- steps in this new approach. I am satisfied that a ing from the flooding of people’s homes as a coherent, sustainable, long-term strategy on flood result of severe rainfall over several days during management is now in place consistent with the the last week of October 2004. The Irish Red recommendations of the flood policy review Cross has been appointed to administer the group and combining structural and non-struc- scheme on the ground. My officials in the Office tural measures. of Public Works met on 3 November 2004 with the IRC to finalise arrangements for the scheme Tax Code. and advertising of the scheme in both the national and local media commenced on 7 November 116. Dr. Upton asked the Minister for Finance 2004. The closing date for receipt of applications if he has considered the taxation implications of for aid is the 24 November 2004. receipt of decoupled payments by farmers, which The scheme applies to homes. It does not apply might occur within one financial year; and if he to businesses. It is emphasised that the scheme is will make a statement on the matter. [29347/04] humanitarian and is designed to relieve hardship. Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): I am aware It is not compensation for losses and is not a sub- of the taxation implications for farmers arising stitute for insurance. Eligibility criteria for assist- from the decision to fully decouple certain direct ance will be in line with previous aid schemes, payment schemes from production levels with namely death, serious injury, damage to home or effect from 2005. In effect all FEOGA premia extreme hardship. The scheme applies payments will from 2005 be replaced by a single countrywide. payment to all eligible farmers. The Department In regard to flood prevention programmes in of Agriculture and Food is committed to making towns and cities, the OPW is committed to the the first annual payment under the new arrange- implementation of a national priority programme ment to farmers in December 2005. This payment of drainage schemes to alleviate localised flood- will be in respect of entitlements established for ing problems. This priority programme was the calendar year 2005. However, under the cur- drawn up following the severe flooding of 1994- rent regime FEOGA premia payments are gener- 95 and the passing of the Arterial Drainage ally made in two instalments, with an advance (Amendment) Act 1995 which gave the Commis- paid in the year to which the payment relates and sioners of Public Works powers to undertake the balance in the following year. The timing of drainage schemes to alleviate localised flooding. the changeover from the current system to the The first localised flood relief scheme carried out single farm payment scheme will result in certain by the OPW on behalf of the Government under farmers having additional taxable income in the the Arterial Drainage (Amendment) Act 1995 form of additional direct payments in the calen- began in 1996. Other areas have been added to dar year 2005. While farmers who have opted for the list in the intervening years. To date, 12 the income averaging system can spread this schemes have been completed and the major additional income for taxation purposes over scheme currently under construction in Kilkenny three years this facility is not available to part- city will also be substantially completed before time farmers or farmers where the spouse has off the end of this year. The estimated capital cost of farm income. The Deputy will appreciate that in projects currently in the OPW’s flood relief pro- line with normal practice in the run up to the gramme is in the order of \400 million. annual budget and Finance Bill I do not wish to The Government is committed to a strategic comment further on the intention or otherwise to flood management policy. In that context I make changes in taxation. 189 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 190

American Tax Amnesty. this work, the Revenue Commissioners is introd- ucing a number of changes to the forms which 117. Mr. S. Ryan asked the Minister for Fin- will yield additional information regarding the ance if he has carried out an assessment of the cost of certain important tax reliefs, especially the likely economic impact here of the corporate tax property-based incentive reliefs, and I can supply amnesty signed into law by the US President, Mr. the Deputy with a list of these. Provisions were George Bush, which may mean that profits gener- included in Finance Act 2004 to underpin these ated here by US firms may now be returned to changes. This will provide better data in this area the US; and if he will make a statement on the and enable fuller estimates of the tax foregone to matter. [29869/04] be made over time. Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): The Property based incentives on which infor- American Jobs Creation Act 2004 gives US multi- mation is being sought in tax forms: urban nationals a one-off chance to repatriate to the US renewal; town renewal; seaside resort; rural accumulated profits held outside the US by avai- renewal; multi-storey car parks; living over the ling of a special effective corporate tax rate of shop; enterprise areas; park and ride; hotels; 5.25%. Non-US profits repatriated to the US are holiday cottages; nursing homes — associated normally taxed at between 35% and 40%. This housing for elderly or infirm — and convalescent reduced rate of corporation tax will only be avail- homes; student accommodation; qualifying able for a 12 month period. private hospitals, including qualifying sports President Bush recently signed the legislation injury clinics; and buildings used for certain child into law and full details of how it will be inter- care purposes. preted in practice are not yet available. Conse- quently, it is not yet possible to assess fully the EU Cohesion Policy. likely economic impact. 120. Mr. O’Shea asked the Minister for Finance I draw the attention of the Deputy to what my the efforts he is making to implement EU colleague, the Minister of State, Deputy Killeen, cohesion policy, specifically towards development ´ said in the Dail on 16 November, namely, that of the regions with regard to EU cohesion policy; IDA Ireland is not overly concerned that this and if he will make a statement on the matter. one-off opportunity to repatriate accumulated [27987/04] profit to the US will affect the level of ongoing US investment in Ireland. However, IDA Ireland Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): The central and Forfa´s will undertake a joint review of the aim of EU cohesion policy is to reduce the econ- legislation. omic and social disparities of the Union. The member states, their regions and the Commission Question No. 118 answered with Question are supported in their policy efforts mainly by the No. 98. use of the Structural and Cohesion Funds. In Ireland’s case, these funds, valued at around \3.7 Capital Expenditure. billion over the period 2000 to 2006, are delivered through the community support framework, CSF. 119. Mr. Sargent asked the Minister for Fin- The CSF represents an agreement between ance the amount of the capital expenditure pro- Ireland and the European Commission for the gramme allocation for 2004 which has been spent support of a range of interventions in support of to date; and if he will make a statement on the cohesion policy. The key objectives of the CSF matter. [29986/04] 2000-06 are continuing sustainable economic and Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): Net voted employment growth; consolidating and improving capital spending to the end of October 2004 our international competitiveness; fostering amounted to \3.051 billion. Under the rolling balanced regional development; and promoting multi-annual capital envelopes announced in social inclusion. budget 2004, Departments are allowed to carry In pursuit of the objective of balanced regional over to the following year up to 10% of voted development, the strategy is delivered through capital savings in the current year. Latest assess- three national operational programmes, OPs: ments from Departments of the full year outturn, economic and social infrastructure OP; pro- as set out in the recently published Abridged ductive sector OP; the employment and human Estimates Volume, AEV, indicate savings of \80 resource development OP; and two regional OPs. million net of an estimated \248 million carryover The national OPs have specific funding envelopes of capital savings from 2004 into 2005. A saving for the BMW and south and east regions. They of \80 million would be equivalent to 1.5% of support investment in infrastructure, public trans- the voted capital provision in the 2004 Revised port, research and development, education and Estimates Volume, REV. On the question of training. The regional programmes support local costs, however, the Deputy will be aware that my infrastructure, local enterprise, agricultural and Department has been working closely with the rural development, child care and community Revenue Commissioners to investigate infor- development in the BMW and south and east mation and data capture issues with a view to regions. The regional assemblies, with members improving data quality and transparency without drawn from the regional authorities, are the man- overburdening compliant taxpayers. On foot of aging authorities for the regional programmes. 191 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 192

[Mr. Cowen.] member states to provide for a uniform basis of Ireland, and both of its regions, has made con- assessment for VAT. Work in this area is ongoing siderable progress in achieving convergence with in the context of the European Commission VAT other member states of the Union. In terms of modernisation strategy. The strategy is designed progress on economic development and employ- to meet the needs of the Internal Market and of ment, we now exceed the average EU levels for the changing environment within which the VAT the key cohesion indicators of GDP per capita, system operates. Examples of this changing envir- employment rate, and the rate of unemployment. onment include the increase in cross-border trade, the emergence of e-commerce and the sub- Tax Yield. stantial growth in the supply of services across the 121. Mr. M. Higgins asked the Minister for Fin- Internet to businesses and private consumers. ance if he will make a statement on the antici- The EU VAT directive provides for the appli- pated end of year Exchequer returns for 2004. cation by member states of a standard rate of [29860/04] VAT, which may not be less than 15%, and a common band for reduced VAT rates between Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): At the 5% and 15%, applying to specified categories of Abridged Estimates Volume (AEV) Conference goods and services. last week, I stated that, as of then, my Depart- In the area of excise taxation, Council direc- ment was anticipating an Exchequer borrowing tives provide for a community framework for the requirement of about \0.7 billion compared to a taxation of energy products and electricity, tob- Budget Day forecast of \2.8 billion for 2004. The acco products, alcohol and alcoholic beverages. difference was mainly due to about \2 billion These directives set down common definitions extra in tax receipts and some savings on expendi- and classifications for the various product groups, ture. There is still a lot of tax to come in so such the rules for calculating the tax, and the criteria estimates are always subject to change and up- under which relief from tax may be granted. dating. Minimum rates of taxation for the products are also stipulated. The minimum rates are reviewed Tax Harmonisation. in Council from time to time. 122. Mr. Cuffe asked the Minister for Finance his views on whether there are areas of tax con- Tax Code. vergence which can and will happen within the 123. Mr. Murphy asked the Minister for Fin- European Union; and if he will make a statement ance if he has plans to introduce greater trans- on the matter. [29978/04] parency in tax expenditures in budget 2005. [29889/04] Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): It is not clear what the Deputy has in mind by the refer- Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): As I pre- ence to “tax convergence”. However, if by tax viously told the House, tax expenditures are regu- convergence the Deputy means the Commission’s larly reviewed and are invariably looked at in the proposals for a common consolidated tax base or context of the annual budget and Finance Bill the harmonisation of rates, then Ireland is process to ensure they continue to meet the pur- opposed to such developments. It is Ireland’s pose or purposes for which they were introduced. position that each member state must be in a Where tax changes are announced in the budget, position to decide for itself the appropriate struc- they are set out in the summary of budget ture of its own tax system, bearing in mind the measures together with an estimated cost or yield, need to ensure that member states do not intro- where possible. This will continue to be the posi- duce unfair tax practices. tion. This may often involve making a range of However, Ireland is happy to address tax behavioural assumptions that may or may not matters at the EU level once the actions are prove valid and, in some cases, data to allow cost- appropriate, are targeted at clearly identified bar- ing may not be available. riers to the workings of the Internal Market and On the question of costs, the Deputy will be are agreed by unanimity when they come before aware that my Department has been working Council for decision. closely with the Revenue Commissioners to In this regard, work is ongoing on a number of investigate information and data to capture issues tax dossiers in both the direct and indirect tax with a view to improving data quality and trans- area at EU level. For example, there is a proposal parency without overburdening compliant tax- to amend the mergers directive to aid business to payers. On foot of this work, the Revenue Com- operate more effectively cross border and I missioners are introducing a number of changes understand that this is well advanced. Likewise, to the forms which will yield additional infor- the recently agreed interest and royalties direc- mation regarding the cost of some tax reliefs. Pro- tive and the proposal to amend the parent and visions were included in Finance Act 2004 to subsidiary directive are designed to facilitate the underpin these changes. improvement of the internal market. Changes were made in this area previously. In relation to indirect taxation and VAT, the The Finance Act 2003 stipulated that returns of EU sixth VAT directive provides a Union frame- income must henceforth be made for stallion stud work for the harmonisation of the VAT laws of fees and commercially managed woodlands. This 193 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 194 will provide better data in this area and enable the latest information available from the central estimates of the tax foregone to be made. applications facility in respect of applications In addition the use of electronic filing of tax from civil servants and other public servants cur- returns by means of the Revenue on-line system, rently located in Dublin who wish to transfer to ROS, has been increasing and will continue to be new locations outside of Dublin under the decen- encouraged. Returns filed using ROS can more tralisation programme; the way in which this com- readily accommodate information data capture. pares with the target of 10,300; his views on the Additional cost information will assist in the reg- potential loss of skills and expertise for specialist ular review of these reliefs. State agencies should they be decentralised with so few persons willing to transfer; and if he will Special Savings Incentive Scheme. make a statement on the matter. [29862/04] 124. Mr. S. Ryan asked the Minister for Fin- Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): The latest ance the number of special savings investment figures from the central applications facility show accounts opened at the latest date for which fig- there is very substantial interest in the pro- ures are available; the average amount of savings gramme. The figures for the Civil Service are per investor per month; on the basis of such fig- much better than those for the State agencies. ures, the definitive figure for the likely cost to the Unlike the State agencies, the Civil Service has Exchequer of the scheme; and if he will make a considerable previous experience of decentralis- statement on the matter. [29867/04] ation and has a long tradition of interdepartmen- tal transfers. I see no reason in principle State Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): Iam agencies should always have to remain in Dublin. informed by the Revenue Commissioners that, Clearly, there are particular issues that arise in based on the analysis of the 2003 returns fur- dealing with the State agencies. This was always nished by all qualifying savings managers, the going to be the case. The correct approach is to total number of active accounts at 31 December tease out the issues and develop good long-term 2003 was 1,113,880 and the average monthly sub- \ solutions in consultation with all of the parties scription at that date was 165. involved. This is the approach being adopted by As indicated in replies to previous questions, it the Flynn group. is not possible to give a definitive answer as to the eventual cost of the scheme as it is subject to Question No. 127 answered with Question a number of variables such as participants dying, No. 110. withdrawing from the scheme or varying their monthly contributions. The cost of the scheme in Tax Code. 2003 was \531.9 million. If the current average monthly payment for the first ten months of 2004 128. Dr. Upton asked the Minister for Finance continues for a full year, the annual cost in 2004 whether there is an anomaly in treatment of farm- would be approximately \545 million. This, ers who might qualify for agricultural relief on however, is not a conclusive figure, and the final capital acquisitions tax in comparison with busi- figure may be different if account holders change ness relief for business persons; and if he will their monthly contributions. The total gross cost make a statement on the matter. [29350/04] over the period of the scheme will be reduced by Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): Agricultural the exit tax to be received at the end. relief and business relief are two separate and dis- tinct reliefs. Where agricultural relief has been Tax Code. granted in respect of any property, business relief 125. Mr. Eamon Ryan asked the Minister for will not apply to that property. Finance if he has considered the views of the Relief from capital acquisitions tax for gifts and chambers of commerce here on the suitability of inheritances in respect of agricultural property a site value tax; and if he will make a statement was introduced in 1976. The relief now amounts on the matter. [29984/04] to a reduction of 90% in respect of the market value of the agricultural property in question. Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): I under- In relation to business property, capital acquis- stand that the Chambers of Commerce of Ireland itions tax relief for all gifts and inheritances of has made this proposal in the context of local relevant business property was introduced in the government financing, which is currently the sub- Finance Act 1994, amounting to a reduction of ject of an independent review commissioned by 50%. Business relief now amounts to a reduction the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and of 90% in respect of the taxable value of relevant Local Government. This review is expected to be business property taken by the beneficiary, which completed in spring 2005. At this stage, it would is similar to agricultural relief. Each of these be premature of me to offer any comment on the reliefs are subject to certain criteria. possible recommendations or measures which Agricultural relief applies only where the prop- may arise from the review process. erty is taken by a “farmer”, who is defined in the legislation as an individual who is domiciled and Decentralisation Programme. ordinarily resident in the State and 80% of whose 126. Mr. Quinn asked the Minister for Finance gross property consists of agricultural property, as 195 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 196

[Mr. Cowen.] Executive, Bank of Ireland Group; and Tony defined, after taking the gift or inheritance. This O’Brien, Chairman, C& C Group PLC. condition was introduced to exclude individuals Decisions on performance-related awards for with substantial non-agricultural assets from individual posts are made by the committee based qualifying for the relief, and this test does not on recommendations from Secretaries General in apply in order to qualify for business relief. the case of the Civil Service, the Garda Com- There are certain conditions that must be met missioner or the Chief of Staff of the Defence to avail of business relief, which do not apply to Forces. The recommendations made to the com- agricultural relief. Examples of these are a mini- mittee are based on assessments of performance mum share holding requirement in the case of against pre-set objectives. shares in a company acquired by gift-inheritance, The first awards under the scheme were made a minimum period of ownership requirement by in 2003. The awards covered a 12 month period the disponer, and a requirement that the business from 1 January 2002 in the case of the Civil Ser- continues to trade for a minimum period after vice grades and an eight month period from 1 being acquired by gift-inheritance. For the above May 2002 in the case of the other groups. The reasons, I do not consider that there is an anom- awards made in 2004 were in respect of the 12 aly between the two reliefs, as suggested by the month period from 1 January 2003 in all cases. Deputy. The cost of the awards approved by the Com- mittee for Performance Awards amounted to Public Sector Remuneration. approximately \2 million in 2003 and approxi- 129. Mr. O’Shea asked the Minister for Finance mately \2.2 million in 2004. As already indicated, the amount paid out to date under the perform- the awards in 2003 related to an eight month ance-related bonus scheme for senior civil ser- period only in the case of the ranks in the Garda vants, gardaı´ and members of the Defence Sı´ocha´na and the Defence Forces. In the case of Forces; the average amount paid; the largest the Civil Service grades, where the awards related amount paid out; the number of such persons to a 12 month period, the average amount paid who applied for the bonus and who were refused; was in the region of \10,000. The highest award the way in which and the person by whom made in 2003 was approximately \20,500 and the decisions are made in regard to whether such per- lowest award was approximately \1,700. In 2004, sons should receive the bonus; if he is satisfied the average amount paid in respect of all groups that nominations for payments are subjected to was in the region of \10,600, the highest award sufficient scrutiny; and if he will make a state- made was approximately \21,500 and the lowest ment on the matter. [29857/04] award was approximately \2,000. The numbers of people who participated in the Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): Following the recommendations of the review body on scheme of performance-related awards were 213 higher remuneration in the public sector in its in the case of the awards made in 2003 and 205 report dated 25 September 2000, the Government in the case of the awards made in 2004. decided to replace the then existing scheme in the In 2003, some award was made to all persons Civil Service with a new scheme of performance- who participated in the scheme. In 2004, one per- related awards and to introduce the new scheme son who participated in the scheme did not in the Garda Sı´ocha´na and the Defence Forces. receive an award. The scheme of performance- The new scheme applies to Civil Service posts related awards and the guidelines approved by at the levels of Assistant Secretary and Deputy the Committee for Performance Awards allow Secretary, Deputy Commissioners and Assistant discretion to give some award in situations where Commissioners in the Garda Sı´ocha´na and Major demanding targets have been narrowly missed. General and Brigadier General in the Defence I am satisfied procedures are in place to ensure Forces. The scheme applied in the Civil Service that recommendations for awards are considered with effect from 1 January 2002 and with effect fully. As I have indicated, a Committee for Per- from 1 May 2002 in the other areas. The funding formance Awards has been established, as recom- of awards is based on 10% of the payroll for the mended by the review body on higher remuner- posts covered by the scheme. Within this overall ation in the public sector, to oversee the awards limit, payments of up to 20% can be made to scheme. The committee, which has a majority of individuals. members from the private sector, examines the In accordance with the recommendations of recommendations of Secretaries General, the the review body, a Committee for Performance Garda Commissioner and the Chief of Staff of Awards was established to oversee the operation the Defence Forces and decides on the award for of the scheme of performance-related awards. each person covered by the scheme. The members of the committee are Eddie Sulli- I might mention that the information sought by van, chairperson, Secretary General, public ser- the Deputy, as well as other information relating vice management and development, Department to the scheme of performance-related awards, is of Finance; Dermot McCarthy, Secretary General contained in the annual reports of the Committee to the Government; Ann Fitzgerald, Secretary for Performance Awards. The report for 2003, General, Irish Association of Investment Man- covering awards made in 2004, is available on the agers; Maurice Keane, former Group Chief website of my Department at www.finance.gov.ie. 197 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 198

Tax Code. scheme; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [29854/04] 130. Mr. Broughan asked the Minister for Fin- ance the steps he is taking to establish the cost Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): Authorised to the Exchequer in terms of tax foregone of 33 Revenue officers are empowered to make an separate tax reliefs in respect of which no such application to a judge of the High Court seeking information is available; and if he will make a an order requiring financial institutions to supply statement on the matter. [29843/04] names, addresses and other relevant information concerning account holders who may have held Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): I presume bogus non-resident deposit accounts. Such appli- the question refers to replies that I have given to cations are made under section 908 of the Taxes previous Da´il questions about the costing of tax Consolidation Act 1997, as amended by the Fin- reliefs. Information on the cost of tax reliefs is ance Act 1999. Information supplied by the finan- usually sourced from the tax returns of individ- cial institutions under section 908 orders is the uals and companies claiming the reliefs. Specific principal basis for identifying bogus non-resident information is not currently available on the costs account holders who did not avail of the volun- of certain reliefs and there are more than 33 spec- tary disclosure scheme in 2001. This inquiry work ific provisions, which serve to reduce the tax paid commenced on 16 November 2001. in certain circumstances, for which full cost infor- mation is not available. In part this is because the I am advised by the Revenue Commissioners aggregate information on tax return forms does that 18 applications for orders under section 908 not always allow for a distinction between the have been made and granted. When one includes reliefs claimed in respect of different schemes. institutions which have been taken over or amal- gamated with other institutions, these orders seek On the question of costs, however, the Deputy information in respect of accounts in 26 financial will be aware that my Department has been institutions. No further applications for such working closely with the Revenue Commissioners orders are pending in regard to the bogus non- to investigate information and data capture issues resident account inquiries. with a view to improving data quality and trans- parency without overburdening compliant tax- A large volume of information has been payers. On foot of this work, the Revenue Com- reported to Revenue under the High Court missioners are introducing a number of changes orders. Inquiry work in relation to the examin- to the forms which will yield additional infor- ation of the first batch of taxpayers commenced mation regarding the cost of certain important tax on 11 October 2002. Further general issues of reliefs, especially the property-based incentive inquiry letters were made in January, May, July, reliefs, and I can supply the Deputy with a list of September and October 2003 and January 2004. these. Provisions were included in the Finance These general inquiry letter issues relate to 91,000 Act 2004 to underpin these changes. This will non-resident accounts that had Irish addresses provide better data in this area and enable fuller connected to them. A total of 177,000 inquiry let- estimates of the tax foregone to be made over ters have been issued to taxpayers in respect of time. these non-resident accounts. The final general inquiry letter issue took place in January 2004. Property based incentives on which infor- mation is being sought in tax forms: urban While it is clear that this is an extensive investi- renewal; town renewal; seaside resort; rural gation programme the Revenue Commissioners renewal; multi-storey car parks; living over the have informed me that they are satisfied that sig- shop; enterprise areas; park and ride; hotels; nificant progress has been made in this the final phase of the investigation. Since 15 November holiday cottages; nursing homes — associated \ housing for elderly or infirm — and convalescent 2001 payments of 330 million have been made to Revenue by taxpayers who held bogus non- homes; student accommodation; qualifying resident accounts. private hospitals, including qualifying sports injury clinics; and buildings used for certain child Tax Code. care purposes. 132. Mr. Stagg asked the Minister for Finance Non-Resident Accounts. the annual cost to the Exchequer of tax foregone in respect of pension relief from 1997 to date; the 131. Ms McManus asked the Minister for Fin- number of persons receiving tax relief in respect ance the number of High Court orders sought to of retirement annuity premiums of up to 30 years, date by the Revenue Commissioners under the from 30 to 40 years, from 40 to 50 years and 50 Finance Act 1999 to require financial institutions years and over, respectively; and the number who to supply names, addresses and other relevant have invested the maximum earning capacity in information regarding holders of bogus accounts each category; and if he will make a statement on at the latest date for which figures are available; the matter. [29873/04] the number of cases in which orders have been granted; the general progress made to date in Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): Iam identifying the holders of such accounts who did informed by the Revenue Commissioners that the not avail of the recent voluntary disclosure relevant available information relates to the cost 199 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 200

[Mr. Cowen.] of retirement annuity contracts which are avail- of tax relief on pension contributions by able to the self employed and to employees not in employers, employees and self employed and the occupational pension schemes. The information is exemption of income and gains in the pension provided for the five income tax years 1997-98 to funds together with the numbers of employees the short tax year 2001, the latest year for which contributing to approved superannuation it is available. schemes and the numbers of claimants in respect Following is the information available:

Income Tax relief relating to pension contributions Estimated Cost

Income Tax Relief 1997/98 1998/99 1999/00 2000/01 2001

Contributions by employers and employees and exemption of income and gains in the pension fund* \1.5bn \1.8bn \2.2bn \2.4bn \1.8bn Number of employees contributing to approved superannuation schemes** n/a n/a 569,220 629,800 670,500 ‘Retirement Annunity Contracts’ available to the self- employed and to employees not in occupational pension schemes \91.3m \116.2m \180.8m \205m \170m Numbers of Claimants 72,200 92,900 104,500 109,300 109,300 *These are extremely tentative estimates. **Calendar year figures sourced from annual reports of the Pensions Board.

It should be noted that as PAYE taxpayers were individuals this represents because some individ- charged to tax on their earnings in the period uals had accounts in different banks or in differ- from 6 April to 31 December 2001 and self- ent branches of the same bank. In other instances employed taxpayers were assessed to tax for the there was more than one name on the account. short year on 74% of the profits earned in a 12 The Revenue Commissioners have advised month accounting period, the cost figures will not that, following the issue of the letters by the fin- be directly comparable with those of earlier years. ancial institutions, written responses were Information on the number of persons receiv- received from approximately 25,000 persons. Of ing tax relief in respect of retirement annuity pre- these, approximately 15,000 persons advised that miums by reference to age and maximum qualify- they would submit a statement of disclosure. ing amount is not available. Approximately 10,000 persons who gave details of their offshore account were subsequently noti- Question No. 133 answered with Question fied by Revenue that a statement of disclosure No. 115. was not required. I am also advised that a further 134. Mr. Crowe asked the Minister for Finance 5,000 persons, approximately, phoned the Rev- if he intends introducing new tax breaks for cars enue Commissioners and, on the basis of the fitted with additional safety features. [27212/04] information provided, were advised that a written response was not required. Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): I will con- To date the total amount collected by the Rev- sider all aspects of taxation in framing measures enue Commissioners from this investigation is in for the 2005 budget. However, it has been the excess of \705 million. The individual cases will practice of successive Ministers for Finance not be finalised by officers in the Revenue districts to comment on what may, or may not, be con- across the country when the preliminary work is tained in a forthcoming budget and I do not complete. intend to depart from this approach. Question No. 136 answered with Question Non-Resident Accounts. No. 82.

135. Mr. Gilmore asked the Minister for Fin- Northern Ireland Issues. ance the response received to date by the Rev- enue Commissioners to the letters sent by ten top 137. Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in asked the Minister banks to around 120,000 customers warning them for Finance if he will report on progress in his to regularise their tax affairs by the end of March efforts to secure a PEACE III programme; and if 2004; the number of responses received; the he will make a statement on the matter. amount collected to date; the number of such [29974/04] cases that have been finalised; and if he will make Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): The a statement on the matter. [29848/04] Government is very aware of the valuable role Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): Iam the PEACE II programme has played in building advised by the Revenue Commissioners that pre- peace and reconciliation in Northern Ireland and cise figures are not available as to the number of the Border region and that there continues to be letters which issued from the financial insti- a need for such funding. Therefore, I welcome tutions. It is understood to be in excess of that an extension is being pursued on foot of the 100,000. It is not known how many accounts or conclusions of the Heads of State meeting of June 201 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 202

2004 which, responding to a joint initiative by the day. This is in line with the Revenue administra- two Prime Ministers concerned, invited the Com- tive practice prior to the Finance Act 1994 which mission to examine the possibility of extending was based on the number of nights spent in the the programme to 2006. State. Officials in my Department are working closely As Deputies are aware, it is not the practice to with the UK Government, the Department of comment in the lead up to the annual budget and Finance and personnel in the North, the Special Finance Bill on the intention or otherwise to EU Programmes Body, SEUPB, the Commission make budget or legislative changes. and the Presidency on this matter. The SEUPB, which manages the programme, carried out Asbestos Remediation Programme. extensive public consultation over the summer to 139. Ms O’Sullivan asked the Minister for Fin- find out how, if the extension is granted, the ance the cost to the State of the removal of asbes- additional moneys should be focused. There was tos from primary and secondary schools; the a very good response to this consultation — more number of schools which remain to be cleared full than 70 written responses and a wide attendance of asbestos; and if he will make a statement on at public meetings. This shows the high level of the matter. [26119/04] engagement with the PEACE II programme. Based on these consultations my Department, in Minister of State at the Department of Finance conjunction with the Department of Finance and (Mr. Parlon): In the five years since the com- personnel in Northern Ireland, submitted pro- mencement of the asbestos management pro- posals for an extension to the European Com- gramme in schools, approximately \55 million has mission on 30 September last. been spent on remedial works, including exten- The proposals were adopted by the Com- sive reinstatement works following the removal mission on 13 October. The proposals require of asbestos materials. amendments to EC Regulation No. 1260/1999 on Approximately 2,700 schools have so far been the PEACE programme and budgetary adjust- surveyed and works identified as necessary have ments to secure funds for an extended pro- either been completed, are in hands or are pro- gramme. These require a Council decision and grammed over the coming months. The remain- ratification by the European Parliament by the ing 1,300 or so schools will be surveyed during end of the year. I can assure the Deputy that my 2005 and arrangements for the management of Department will continue to make every possible any materials identified will be put in hands as effort to get a positive decision so that Peace soon as possible thereafter. funding can be continued under an extended pro- gramme in 2005. National Development Finance Agency. As the Deputy is aware, the proposed exten- 140. Ms Shortall asked the Minister for Finance sion would bring the programme in line with the projects that have been undertaken and partly other structural fund programmes which run to or wholly funded by the National Development 2006. If extended, spending in the PEACE pro- Finance Agency in respect of capital projects as gramme may occur until 2008. indicated by him in launching the NDFA; the sums committed to each project; the Department Tax Code. or agency for which each project is being under- 138. Mr. Costello asked the Minister for Fin- taken; the duration and likely completion date of ance if he intends to make changes to the legislat- each; and if he will make a statement on the ive provisions regarding residency abroad for tax matter. [29876/04] purposes, particularly in regard to the so-called Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): The Cinderella clause, whereby if a person has left the National Development Finance Agency, NDFA, country by midnight, it does not count as a day was established in 2003 under the National of residence; and if he will make a statement on Development Finance Agency Act 2002. the matter. [29846/04] The role of the National Development Finance Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): As the Agency is to advise State authorities on the opti- Deputies may be aware, the residence rules for mum means of financing public investment pro- tax purposes were last updated in the 1994 Fin- jects in order to achieve value for money. State ance Act by the then Government following a authorities, who are the decision-making bodies comprehensive review of the matter by the Rev- in regards to projects undertaken or to be under- enue Commissioners and my Department. Prior taken, are obliged to seek the advice of the to this the rules were based on a mixture of statu- National Development Finance Agency in tory provisions, old case law and Revenue admin- relation to capital projects or grouped projects istrative practice, which was an unsatisfactory sit- valued in excess of \20 million. For projects uation. The new residence rules set out in the valued under that amount, the advice of the 1994 Finance Act both simplified and clarified the agency may be sought but is not obligatory. In whole area and were generally welcomed. These addition to its advisory role, the NDFA is rules provide inter alia that an individual is empowered to advance moneys and to enter into deemed to be present in the State for a day if the other financial arrangements in respects of pro- individual is present in the State at the end of the jects approved by any State authority. To date, 203 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 204

[Mr. Cowen.] qualifying research and development expenditure the agency has not exercised the option of raising incurred on or after 1 January 2004. finance itself. However, it has arranged or As the measure was only introduced this year endorsed third party private financing in a it is too early to assess the impact of the credit. number of projects. Of those, financing has been However the Government is mindful of the need provided from the following sources: private bank to assess its effectiveness and an assessment will debt, European Investment Bank project loans be done by my Department over the next number and private equity. I am advised by the agency of years in tandem with the Department of that since its establishment in 2003, more than 60 Enterprise, Trade and Employment and the rel- projects have been referred to it for advice. evant state agencies. Projects on which NDFA advice has been A special tax relief for research and develop- received, and in respect of which financial con- ment was introduced in the 1995 Finance Act. tracts have been closed, include: the Dundalk The tax relief provided, in addition to the normal western bypass, the Kilcock-Kinnegad motorway deduction to companies in computing trading and the Rathcormac-Fermoy bypass — all income for research and development expendi- National Roads Authority projects — the Luas, ture, an additional treble deduction for incremen- Railway Procurement Agency, Fatima Mansions, tal expenditure on research and development. Dublin City Council, the Metropolitan Area The incentive applied on a group basis to the Broadband Network Management Company, the excess of annual group incremental expenditure Department of Communications, Marine and over £25,000, \31,743.45. The research and Natural Resources, and a variety of projects for developmentproject was also required to be four local authorities, Cork City Council, Cork approved by Forbairt. The tax relief applied for County Council, Kildare County Council and a three year period provided the three year north Tipperary County Council. period did not commence on or after 1 June 1999. Further details including duration, cost and I am informed by the Revenue Commissioners likely completion dates of the various projects are that there are no statistics available to them on a matter for the relevant State authorities respon- the take up of this relief, however the indications sible for procuring the projects. are that the relief was not widely availed of.

Garda Stations. Flood Relief. 141. Mr. Deenihan asked the Minister for Fin- 143. Mr. Stanton asked the Minister for Fin- ance the reason for the delay in selecting a site ance if his attention has been drawn to the flood damage caused in Youghal and Ballynacoda in for the new Garda station in Castleisland, County east Cork; the funding available for flood relief; Kerry; and if he will make a statement on the his plans to safeguard against flooding; and if he matter. [29649/04] will make a statement on the matter. [27446/04] Minister of State at the Department of Finance Minister of State at the Department of Finance (Mr. Parlon): The Commissioners of Public (Mr. Parlon): Preliminary reports from Cork Works are continuing to negotiate for a suitable County Council suggest that approximately 50 site for a Garda station in Castleisland. The com- homes and 20 business premises were flooded in missioners identified a number of sites that were the Youghal and Ballynacoda areas in east Cork regarded as suitable by the Garda Sı´ochana. following the severe rainfall in the last days of However, to date, despite extensive negotiations October. and a number of firm offers, agreement has not The Government has approved a humanitarian been reached on an acceptable price. The prices aid package to relieve hardship arising from the quoted to date are significantly above the open flooding of people’s homes. The purpose of the market value in each case. The commissioners scheme is solely to provide humanitarian assist- have now identified other sites in the area and ance to relieve hardship and is not intended to have commenced preliminary investigations on provide compensation for losses. My officials their suitability in each case. have met with the Irish Red Cross Society, IRCS who will implement the scheme details of which Tax Code. have been agreed and published in the national 142. Mr. Eamon Ryan asked the Minister for and local press in the past two weeks. The closing Finance if he will report on the use that has been date for receipt of applications under the scheme made to date of research and development tax is 24 November 2004. The IRCS has considerable relief; and if he will make a statement on the experience in this area having previously matter. [29983/04] implemented a number of such schemes in the past for the OPW. I have every confidence that Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): A 20% tax applications will be dealt with in a compassionate, credit was introduced in the Finance Act 2004 for impartial and as timely a manner as possible. qualifying incremental expenditure by companies The funding available through the OPW for on research and development activity. A com- flood relief activities in 2004 is \20.559 million. mencement order was made by my predecessor The funding which will be available in 2005 is not in July 2004 bringing the measure into effect for confirmed yet, but I anticipate that the level of 205 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 206 funding will at least remain at current levels. Last month the Government approved the recom- Number of FOI Number of FOI Number of FOI requests received requests received requests received mendations of the flood policy review group. This at 19 November at 19 November at 19 November confirms the lead role of the OPW in taking a 2002 2003 2004 strategic approach to flood management in the future and working in co-operation with the rel- 280 296 73 evant local authorities. Following the recent flooding, OPW will be seeking initial assessments I have no plans to review amendments made to of the situation in the city and county areas of the Freedom of Information Act 1997. Cork. These assessments will then be considered by OPW under new prioritisation criteria cur- Decentralisation Programme. rently being developed by it for all flood relief works as recommended by the flood policy 146. Mr. Durkan asked the Minister for Fin- review group. ance the extent to which the objectives set in the decentralisation proposals announced in budget Tax Code. 2004 have been achieved to date; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [29987/04] 144. Mr. Gogarty asked the Minister for Fin- ance his views on the fact that tax relief and tax Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): The two avoidance measures cost the State \8.4 billion in reports of the decentralisation implementation foregone taxes each year; and if he will make a group, DIG, dated 31 March 2004 and 30 July statement on the matter. [29980/04] 2004 provide detailed accounts of the progress made in implementing the decentralisation pro- Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): I assume gramme announced last December. An analysis the Deputy is referring to information on the esti- of the applications registered with the central mated cost of certain major tax incentives-expen- applications facility by 7 September 2004 has also ditures recently supplied to the Oireachtas Joint been published. I also refer the Deputy to the Committee on Finance and the Public Service by presentations made to the Oireachtas Joint Com- the Office of the Revenue Commissioners. It is mittee on Finance and the Public Service on 6 not correct to characterise as tax avoidance the October 2004 by the chairman of the implemen- legitimate use of such provisions, most of which tation group, the CEO of the PAS and the are well established and reflect accepted prin- Department of Finance. I am very pleased with ciples of taxation reliefs. the progress which has already been made in driv- Among these major tax incentives-expendi- ing forward the implementation of the tures, some of the reliefs estimated to have sub- programme. stantial costs in terms of tax foregone include In addition, I have received for consideration relief for superannuation contributions, the from the DIG a report containing proposals on exemption of child benefit from income tax, the those organisations which, in the group’s view, special savings investment accounts as well as should be included in the first phase of moves and stamp duty, capital gains tax and mortgage I expect to be making an announcement in this interest relief for owner occupiers. It is widely regard shortly. acknowledged that there are legitimate and reasonable reasons for tax reliefs as a general Natural Heritage Areas. principle and few would argue that these tax 147. Mr. O’Dowd asked the Minister for Fin- relief provisions have not made a significant con- ance the reasons behind the higher than expected tribution to the economic life of the country. cost of renovating the Palm House at the Botanic I will, of course, continue to keep all reliefs and Gardens in north Dublin; and if he will make a incentives under review to ensure that they are statement on the matter. [27533/04] fulfilling the purpose for which they were intended. Minister of State at the Department of Finance (Mr. Parlon): The OPW undertook the resto- Freedom of Information. ration of the Palm House at the Botanic Gardens on behalf of the Department of the Environment, 145. Ms O’Sullivan asked the Minister for Fin- Heritage and Local Government. I am glad to ance the number of applications he has received report that restoration of the Palm House was to date in 2004 under the Freedom of Information completed on time and well within budget. Act; the way in which this compares with the The Department of Finance sanctioned a total same periods in 2002 and 2003; if, in view of the project budget of \16.71 million, which included huge decrease in the number of applications, he for the restoration works, contingency, pro- will review the restrictions imposed on the oper- fessional fees, planning fees and 1% for art, for ation of the Freedom of Information Act 1997; the project. The Commissioners of Public Works and if he will make a statement on the matter. in Ireland placed a contract in the sum of [29859/04] \13,148,125 inclusive of VAT and bond with John Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): The infor- Paul Construction Limited. As the works pro- gressed it became apparent, when account had mation requested by the Deputy is as follows: been taken of necessary extras and variations that 207 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 208

[Mr. Parlon.] annual reports of the Revenue Commissioners. there was going to be a significant saving, esti- Individual details of settlements have also been mated at \0.25 million, on the total project published where the provisions of section 1086 of budget of \16.71 million. Accordingly, the OPW the Taxes Consolidation Act 1997 applied. recommended that the adjacent Camillia House be restored as part of the Palm House contract. Question No. 149 answered with Question The Department of the Environment, Heritage No. 84. and Local Government endorsed the recom- mendation as it was considered to be the most Decentralisation Programme. cost effective method of dealing with it. In 150. Mr. Quinn asked the Minister for Finance addition, that Department were of the view that if the year 2007 remains his target for completion this project would have had to be undertaken of the decentralisation programme; the proposed sooner or later. This represented good value for date for the transfer of the first Department and money as the existing contractor had developed the first State agency; the number of staff the expertise and had the appropriate skills to involved in each case; and if he will make a state- carry out the restoration work. Moreover, if the ment on the matter. [29863/04] restoration of the Camillia House was to be deferred, the existing glasshouse would have been Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): It has very obvious and would have taken from the res- always been the case that implementation of the toration of the Palm House itself. Government’s decentralisation programme Accordingly, the Department of the Envir- would take a number of years. In the past year, onment, Heritage and Local Government asked the Decentralisation Implementation Group has OPW to proceed with the restoration of the Cam- undertaken work with Departments and State illia House. They undertook to provide the agencies on the implementation programme. I additional funds estimated at \0.5 million to com- have now received for consideration from the plete these restoration works. The Department implementation group a report containing pro- also contributed to additional works to the paths, posals on those organisations which, in its view, internal and external topsoiling. I am pleased to should be included in the first phase of moves. say that the Royal Institute of the Architects of I expect to be make an announcement on this Ireland awarded the project an Irish Architecture shortly. 2004 award in May 2004. Health Board Services. Tax Yield. 151. Aengus O´ Snodaigh asked the Ta´naiste 148. Ms Lynch asked the Minister for Finance and Minister for Health and Children if her atten- the number of persons, companies and trusts tion has been drawn to the excellent work of an being investigated by the Revenue Commis- organisation (details supplied) in County sioners arising from an inquiry (details supplied) Donegal in providing a wide spectrum of at the latest date for which figures are available; domestic violence services in the locality; if her the number of cases in which settlements have attention has further been drawn to the funding been agreed; the total amount paid to date; the crisis facing the organisation and to the fact that number of cases still outstanding; and if he will the existing level of funding is estimated to cover make a statement on the matter. [29852/04] only 25% of the projected cost of running the project in 2005 due to increased demand for its Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): Iam services; and if her Department, in co-operation informed by the Revenue Commissioners that with the North Western Health Board, will make arising from the Clerical Medical Insurance-NIB the necessary funding available to ensure that the inquiry, 452 cases have been targeted for inves- organisation can continue its work and fulfil its tigation. mandate. [30300/04] To date, 295 cases have been settled on pay- ment of tax, interest and penalties amounting to Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children a total of \48.15 million. A further 115 cases have (Ms Harney): My Department does not directly been finalised with no additional liability arising. fund health and personal social services to victims The remaining 42 cases are the subject of ongoing of abuse. Moneys are made available each year investigation, in respect of which \5.30 million to the health boards for the provision of services has been paid on account. to women victims of domestic violence. In the course of 2003, three cases were pros- Additional funding has been made available each ecuted in the courts with fines being imposed in year since the establishment of the national steer- ing committee on violence so that now more than two cases and a suspended sentence imposed in \ the other. The individuals concerned have also 12 million is provided annually to the health settled their tax affairs and paid the outstanding boards for the provision of such services. tax, together with interest and penalties. A Ministerial Appointments. further case is currently under investigation with a view to prosecution. 152. Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in asked the Ta´naiste Aggregate results of the ongoing investigations and Minister for Health and Children the number have been published each year since 1998 in the of times she has met the Northern Ireland 209 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 210

Department of Health, Social Services and Public funding supports the work of the various agencies Safety or with the British Minister for Health involved in this area including the health boards, within the past 12 months; the matters discussed the National Suicide Review Group, The Irish at these meetings; if further meetings are Association of Suicidology and the National Suic- planned; and if she will make a statement on the ide Research Foundation for its work in the matter. [29651/04] development of a National Parasuicide Register. The annual report of the National Suicide Review Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children Group, NSRG, meets the requirement of the (Ms Harney): Since taking up office in late Sep- Health (Miscellaneous Provisions) Act 2001, that tember, I have not yet met either the Northern the Minister for Health and Children will report Ireland or the British Ministers for Health. annually on the measures taken by health boards However, I am pleased to inform the Deputy that to prevent suicides in the previous year. This I have arranged an introductory meeting with Ms report outlines the measures taken by the health Angela Smith, Minister for Health, Social Ser- boards and other agencies to help prevent suicide vices and Public Safety, Northern Ireland. This and reduce the impact of suicidal behaviour. The meeting will take place on 9 December 2004. aim of the report is to facilitate sharing of infor- mation across the health boards and other sectors Suicide Prevention. regarding suicide prevention projects and to pro- 153. Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in asked the Ta´naiste vide accurate and current information on the pat- and Minister for Health and Children the con- terns of death by suicide in Ireland. tacts she has had with the Northern Ireland As the Deputy may be aware, work is now well Department of Health, Social Services and Public under way on the preparation of a strategic action Safety or with the British Minister for Health plan for suicide reduction which involves the since 30 September 2004 relating to all-Ireland Health Boards Executive, HeBe, in partnership co-operation on suicide prevention. [29652/04] with the National Suicide Review Group and sup- Minister of State at the Department of Health ported by the Department of Health and Chil- and Children (Mr. T. O’Malley): Since taking up dren. This strategy which will be based on exten- office in late September, the Ta´naiste and Mini- sive national and international consultation and ster for Health and Children has not yet had the evidence based research will build on existing opportunity to meet either the Northern Ireland policy and on the recommendations contained in or the British Ministers for Health. the report of the national task force. All measures However, in the area of suicide prevention, I aimed at reducing the number of deaths by suic- am informed that the position in Northern ide will be considered in the preparation of this Ireland and Britain has been taken into account strategy which will be completed in 2005. in the formulation of the strategic action plan for suicide reduction which is currently being pre- Health Board Staff. pared. The strategic action plan, which involves 155. Ms McManus asked the Ta´naiste and the health boards executive, HeBe, in partnership Minister for Health and Children the number of with the National Suicide Review Group and sup- new posts advertised and filled by the new Health ported by the Department of Health and Chil- Service Executive; and if she will make a state- dren, will be based on extensive national and ment on the matter. [29654/04] international consultation and evidence based research. It will build on existing policy and on 204. Ms McManus asked the Ta´naiste and the recommendations in the report of the Minister for Health and Children the number of National Task Force on Suicide 1998. All directors posts that are created in the health measures aimed at reducing the number of deaths reform programme; the number of these posts by suicide will be considered in the preparation that have been filled; the salary attached to the of this strategy which will be completed in 2005. job; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [30226/04] 154. Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in asked the Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children the total Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children cost associated with the national task force on (Ms Harney): I propose to take Questions Nos. suicide; the breakdown of the cost; its priorities 155 and 204 together. for action for the coming 12 months; and the good The interim Health Service Executive iden- practices which have been identified through its tified the requirement for nine national director work. [29653/04] posts during their analysis earlier this year. Eight of these posts have been advertised with inter- Minister of State at the Department of Health views held and an announcement on the success- and Children (Mr. T. O’Malley): Since the publi- ful candidates is due shortly from the interim cation of the report of the National Task Force Executive. The approved remuneration level for on Suicide in 1998, my Department has given the posts is as follows: director of national special attention to resourcing suicide prevention hospitals office — \152,000; director of primary initiatives. A cumulative total of more than \17.5 continuing and community care directorate — million has now been provided towards suicide \152,000; director of national shared services — prevention programmes and for research. This \117,000; director of population health — 211 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 212

[Ms Harney.] to 31 August 2004 is set out on a county basis in \127,000; director of finance — \127,000; director the following tabular form: of human resources — \127,000; director of infor- mation and communication technology — County Amount Paid from GP Savings \117,000; director of change management and organisational development — \117,000. Work is \ continuing in the interim executive on the job Carlow 866,946 specification for the director of corporate affairs Cavan 1,191,695 post. Clare 2,439,633 Cork 9,566,826 Medical Cards. Donegal 9,620,500 156. Mr. Ring asked the Ta´naiste and Minister Dublin 18,867,368 for Health and Children the person who monitors Fermanagh 11,531 the interests of medical card holders in relation Galway 4,460,066 to the indicative drug target savings schemes; if Kerry 3,274,138 they are represented in this scheme; if only her Kildare 679,692 Department and doctors are represented; and if Kilkenny 1,271,250 she will make a statement on the matter. Laois 677,511 [29655/04] Leitrim 2,232,230 208. Ms Cooper-Flynn asked the Ta´naiste and Limerick 3,719,965 Minister for Health and Children the account- Longford 1,088,539 ability that exists on the operation of the indica- Louth 2,519,932 tive drug target saving scheme, to ensure that the Mayo 6,002,893 savings under the scheme are being used to bene- Meath 2,450,963 fit the patients of general practitioner prac- Monaghan 737,643 tices. [30238/04] Offaly 592,387 209. Ms Cooper-Flynn asked the Ta´naiste and Roscommon 1,986,573 Minister for Health and Children if she will pro- Sligo 2,558,230 vide details on the indicative drug target savings Tipperary 1,923,209 scheme in regard to the savings since the scheme Waterford 4,791,394 began in 1993; the breakdown in the savings on a Westmeath 1,424,218 county by county basis; and her views on the fact Wexford 3,067,881 that this represents the best use of taxpayers money. [30239/04] Wicklow 2,133,409 Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children TOTAL 90,156,620 (Ms Harney): I propose to take Questions Nos. 156, 208 and 209 together. In 1997 a review of the IDTSS was completed by The indicative drugs target savings scheme, Michael Murphy, Professor of Pharmacology at IDTSS, was introduced from 1 January 1993 and University College, Cork. The purpose of the was developed in line with health policy. The review was to determine the effects of the IDTSS IDTSS is a negotiated agreement between the on the quality of patient care in the GMS with Irish Medical Organisation and the Department particular reference to changes in prescribing pat- of Health and Children. The agreements provide terns. The review found that there were changes that both parties are committed to the achieve- in prescribing behaviour as a result of the indica- ment of responsible and cost effective tive drugs target savings scheme. Some doctors prescribing. made savings through enhanced prescribing of Under the terms of the IDTSS individual generic medications and there were no discern- doctors can accrue savings which may be used to ible negative effects on overall quality of fund capital developments in their practices prescribing. which provide additional or enhanced services impacting on patients. These include information Health Board Staff. technology, practice premises, clinical equipment, 157. Ms McManus asked the Ta´naiste and research, education, training and recruitment of Minister for Health and Children the number of extra primary care expertise on fixed term con- senior management posts filled in the Eastern tracts, for example, paramedical, counselling etc. Regional Health Authority, in the three health Savings made cannot be used to subsidise normal boards in the Dublin area since 1999, and in each practice expenses. Health boards are required to health board area nationally as agreed by her evaluate and approve applications from partici- Department. [29656/04] pating GPs for the use of the savings made under the IDTSS. 161. Ms McManus asked the Ta´naiste and The national distribution of payments under Minister for Health and Children the number and classification of senior management posts filled the scheme from the time of its commencement since March 2004 by the Midland Health Board; 213 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 214 and if she will make a statement on the The Secretary General of my Department matter. [29678/04] wrote to each CEO in March of this year instructing them, inter alia, to ensure that no vac- 176. Ms McManus asked the Ta´naiste and ancies at senior management level should be Minister for Health and Children the number of filled on a substantive-permanent basis except in senior management posts filled in the Eastern exceptional circumstances where the formal Regional Health Authority, in the three health approval of my Department had been secured in boards in the Dublin area since 1999, and in each advance. A total of 22 such posts have been sanc- health board area nationally that did not require tioned since the issuing of the letter in March her approval; and if she will make a statement on 2004 and the details of these posts are outlined in the matter. [29790/04] the following table. The posts approved are either Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children key management posts for the delivery of patient (Ms Harney): I propose to take Questions Nos. services or concern important areas of health ser- 157, 161 and 176 together. vice operations. The filling of these posts is con- Responsibility for human resource planning sidered essential to maintaining the continuity including in relation to senior management posts and quality of service provision in the health ser- in each health board region rests with the chief vices in the context of the transition to the new executive officer, CEO, of each health board and administrative structures. the regional chief executive of the Eastern As my Department does not maintain individ- Regional Health Authority. Each CEO, in man- ual records in respect of the filling of senior man- aging the workforce in his-her own region is agement posts other than those directly related to responsible for determining the appropriate staff- the Secretary General’s letter of March 2004, I ing mix and the precise grades of staff to be have asked the CEO of each board and the employed in line with service plan priorities, sub- regional chief executive of the ERHA to respond ject to overall employment levels remaining directly to the Deputy in respect of appointments within the approved regional employment ceiling. in the period from 1999 to March 2004.

Health Board Number Title of post sanctioned of Posts

Eastern Regional Health Authority 1 Financial Controller

Mid-Western 1 Research and Development Officer 1 General Manager Limerick Primary, Community and Continuing Care

Midland 1 Materials Manager 1 Superintendent Registrar of Births, Deaths and Marriages 1 General Manager Acute Hospital Services 1 General Manager Community Care

North-Eastern 3 Regional Risk Advisors

North-Western 1 Regional Project Manager, EPR (Acute Services)

South-East 1 Travellers Health Officer 1 Regional Births Deaths and Marriages 1 General Manager Waterford Regional Hospital 1 Head Office Finance Post 1 Director of Finance (Temporary post-12 months)

Southern 1 Service Manager 3 Superintendent Community Welfare Officer 1 Medical Manpower Manager

Western 1 Superintendent Registrar of Births, Deaths and Marriages

Total 22

Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children 158. Ms McManus asked the Ta´naiste and (Ms Harney): The interim Health Service Execu- Minister for Health and Children the role envis- tive together with my Department have been aged in the new health service for persons cur- engaged in discussions with IMPACT since early rently employed at the assistant chief executive this year regarding the implications of the reform officer grade in the health boards; and if she will for senior management personnel within the make a statement on the matter. [29657/04] health boards. The interim Health Service Execu- tive has repeatedly stated that all existing senior 215 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 216

[Ms Harney.] their current roles. During the course of 2005 the managers in the health boards will have national directors of the Health Service Execu- important roles to play within the Health Service tive will work with health staff in their respective Executive. From 1 January, as part of the tran- divisions to deploy the staff into newly designed sition arrangements, which are designed to pro- health service. This system of deployment will be tect existing levels of service and reduce staff the subject of discussions with the relevant uncertainty, all existing senior managers in the health unions. health boards will continue in their current role. Instead of reporting to a health board chief Question No. 161 answered with Question executive officer, these senior managers will No. 157. report to the appropriate national director in the HSE corporate headquarters in Naas. A docu- Hospital Services. ment, which clearly sets out these reporting 162. Mr. Naughten asked the Ta´naiste and relationships is currently being finalised by the Minister for Health and Children further to interim Health Service Executive. Question No. 792 of 29 September 2004, when During the course of 2005 the national direc- quarterly cervical smear clinics will be reinstated; tors will start the process of implementing the and if she will make a statement on the agreed design and this implementation will matter. [29696/04] include ongoing discussion and negotiation with health staff and their representative groups. Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children (Ms Harney): The provision of health services for 159. Ms McManus asked the Ta´naiste and people living in County Roscommon is a matter Minister for Health and Children the undertak- for the Western Health Board. My Department ings which have been given to the 11 chief execu- has made inquiries of the board and I am advised tive officers of health boards with regard to their that the board is currently preparing a reply in employment; and if she will make a statement on this matter which will issue directly to the the matter. [29658/04] Deputy.

Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children 163. Mr. F. McGrath asked the Ta´naiste and (Ms Harney): Discussions are continuing between Minister for Health and Children the action she my Department and the health board chief execu- will take with regard to patients on trolleys at tive officers concerning personnel issues arising Tallaght Hospital; and the reason all patients are from the dissolution of the health boards from 1 facing the same way on the trolleys at the January 2005. hospital. [29703/04] The executive chairman of the interim Health Service Executive has asked the chief executive Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children officers to continue to work within the health (Ms Harney): Services at the Adelaide and Meath system for six months or so in 2005 to address Hospital, incorporating the National Children’s important issues regarding governance arrange- Hospital, Tallaght, are provided under an ments, management of risk and addressing staff arrangement with the Eastern Regional Health uncertainty during the early part of the transition Authority. My Department has, therefore, asked phase. This is a key part of the risk management the regional chief executive of the authority to programme which is being put in place to ensure examine this issue and to reply to the Deputy that services are maintained through the tran- directly. sition to the unitary system. I have identified the delivery of accident and emergency, accident and emergency, services as a 160. Ms McManus asked the Ta´naiste and priority area for attention. Many of the difficult- Minister for Health and Children the arrange- ies and delays experienced in emergency medi- ments which have been made for a voluntary cine, accident and emergency, departments redundancy scheme in relation to the health reflect system-wide issues. It is, therefore, neces- reform arrangements; and if none is envisaged, sary to take a whole-system approach, involving the plans in place to redeploy existing health primary care, acute care, and sub-acute and com- board staff; and if she will make a statement on munity care in tackling the problems in emer- the matter. [29659/04] gency medicine Departments. I have secured additional funding of \70 mill- Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children ion in new current expenditure in 2005 to (Ms Harney): The Government has repeatedly implement a number of initiatives to improve the stated there will be no involuntary redundancies delivery of emergency services. These include as a result of the health reform programme. improvements in the following areas: patient There are no plans to introduce a voluntary flows through accident and emergency depart- redundancy scheme for any health service ments by developing and expanding minor injury employees, and no voluntary redundancy pack- units, chest pain clinics and respiratory clinics in age has been sought from the Department of hospitals; acute medical units for non-surgical Finance. patients; GP out-of-hours services; the physical From 1 January 2005 the current health board environment for patients and staff including chief executive officers will cease in their current cleaning and security measures; direct access for role, but all other staff will continue to work in GPs to diagnostic services; the availability of 217 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 218 acute beds for emergency patients by sourcing Hospital Staff. capacity in the private nursing home sector for 167. Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in asked the Ta´naiste those patients who have completed their acute and Minister for Health and Children the action phase of treatment and expanded home care being taken as a matter of urgency to fill the vac- packages to support older people at home. ant dental surgeon position at Portiuncula I am confident the measures I have announced Hospital. [29739/04] will have a significant impact on the delivery of accident and emergency services. Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children (Ms Harney): Responsibility for the provision of Health Board Staff. dental services in the Western Health Board area is a matter for the board in the first instance. My 164. Mr. J. Higgins asked the Ta´naiste and Department has asked the chief executive officer Minister for Health and Children the reason the to investigate the matter raised by the Deputy report of the project team for the transfer of FA´ S and to reply to him directly. community employment schemes to health boards set up by the Health Boards Executive in Hospital Waiting Lists. June 2002 has not yet been acted upon; and if she 168. Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in asked the Ta´naiste will make a statement on the matter. [29715/04] and Minister for Health and Children if she will Minister of State at the Department of Health take action to shorten the waiting time for and Children (Mr. T. O’Malley): A Health Ser- appointments with hospital consultants; and if she vice Executive project team examined the cost of will make a statement on the matter. [29740/04] implementing the mainstreaming of FA´ S com- 169. Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in asked the Ta´naiste munity employment scheme workers engaged in and Minister for Health and Children if she or the the delivery of health-related services to perma- National Treatment Purchase Fund has collated nent positions financed by the health boards. The statistics indicating the average waiting times for implementation of the project team’s report is outpatient appointments with hospital consult- being discussed by my Department with the ants; and if so, if she will provide these statis- Department of Finance in the context of the tics. [29741/04] budget for 2005. 171. Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in asked the Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children the average Hospital Waiting Lists. waiting time for pre-operative outpatient 165. Mr. Ring asked the Ta´naiste and Minister appointments with hospital consultants for for Health and Children when a person (details patients requiring hip replacement operations. supplied) in County Mayo will be called to [29743/04] Galway to be seen by a urologist; if this person is Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children on a waiting list; if so, when they were placed on (Ms Harney): I propose to take Questions Nos. it. [29730/04] 168, 169 and 171 together. Responsibility for management and monitoring Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children of outpatient waiting lists, including orthopaedic (Ms Harney): The provision of hospital services outpatient waiting lists, rests with individual for people living in County Mayo is a matter for hospitals and health boards. It is a matter for each the Western Health Board. My Department has hospital to prioritise its services based on patient asked the chief executive officer of the board to need and use its available resources to best effect investigate the position in relation to this case and to ensure that patient services are delivered to reply directly to the Deputy. efficiently and effectively. Figures on the number of persons waiting for an outpatient appointment Ambulance Service. with a consultant are not collected by my Depart- 166. Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in asked the Ta´naiste ment. However, I intend to raise with the and Minister for Health and Children if her atten- National Treatment Purchase Fund, NTPF, the tion has been drawn to the fact that Buncrana, question of how we might begin to make progress in relation to outpatient appointments in 2005. the second largest town in Donegal, is without In accordance with health strategy objectives, both an ambulance service and an appropriate the Government’s immediate focus is on the out-of-hours doctors’ service; and if the necessary reduction of waiting lists and waiting times for funding for these essential health services will be inpatients and day case treatments in acute provided sooner rather than later. [29738/04] hospitals. This is being particularly facilitated by Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children the NTPF. (Ms Harney): Responsibility for the provision of 170. Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in asked the Ta´naiste health services to persons residing in County and Minister for Health and Children the average Donegal rests with the North Western Health waiting times for hip replacement operations in Board. My Department has, therefore, asked the each of the health board areas. [29742/04] chief executive officer of the board to investigate the matter raised by the Deputy and to reply to Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children him directly. (Ms Harney): Responsibility for the collection 219 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 220

[Ms Harney.] a medical card is, by legislation, a matter for the and reporting of waiting lists and waiting times chief executive officer of the relevant health now falls within the remit of the National Treat- board-authority. My Department has, therefore, ment Purchase Fund, NTPF. asked the chief executive officer of the Southern My Department has asked the acting chief Health Board to investigate the matter raised by executive of the National Treatment Purchase the Deputy and to reply to him directly. Fund to reply directly to the Deputy on the matter raised. Hospitals Building Programme. Question No. 171 answered with Question 175. Mr. M. Moynihan asked the Ta´naiste and No. 168. Minister for Health and Children the position in relation to the proposed extension for Kanturk Health Board Services. Hospital; the reasons for the delay in proceeding with the work; and when work is expected to 172. Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in asked the Ta´naiste commence on the project. [29181/04] and Minister for Health and Children if a person (details supplied) will be transferred to a nursing Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children home in County Monaghan. [29744/04] (Ms Harney): As the Deputy will be aware, the provision of health services in the Cork area is a Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children matter for the Southern Health Board in the first (Ms Harney): As the Deputy will be aware, the instance. The board’s policy document “Ageing provision of health services in County Monaghan with Confidence” has identified the need to is, in the first instance, the responsibility of the develop additional long-stay beds for older North Eastern Health Board. My Department people in the Southern Health Board area and as has, therefore, asked the chief executive officer part of this programme the board is proposing to of the board to investigate the issue raised by the increase the number of long-stay beds at Kanturk Deputy and reply direct to him as a matter of Hospital. The proposal to develop additional urgency. beds at Kanturk Hospital is one of the capital projects which the board has submitted to my Services for People with Disabilities. Department as part of its capital development 173. Mr. Allen asked the Ta´naiste and Minister programme. My Department will continue to lia- for Health and Children the grant aid available ise with the board to establish what new projects for the installation of lifts for the disabled in can be progressed, taking account of existing buildings that are used by the public, for example, commitments and overall funding resources avail- community centres, churches and parish halls; able to my Department. Regard will also be had and if there is no grant aid available, if he will to the significant additional revenue funding and consider introducing such a grant scheme. staffing which will be required for these devel- [29771/04] opments as well as the board’s overall capital Minister of State at the Department of Health funding priorities. and Children (Mr. T. O’Malley): The matter of access to public buildings and the provision of Question No. 176 answered with Question lifts which would facilitate access for people with No. 157. disabilities is not a matter for the Department of Health and Children. Health Board Services. The National Disability Authority established 177. Mr. Ring asked the Ta´naiste and Minister under the aegis of the Department of Justice, for Health and Children the services available for Equality and Law Reform will have responsi- children with autism in an area (details supplied) bility, under proposed measures in the Disability of County Mayo; the services currently provided Bill 2004, for the development of a draft code of by the health board; and the services proposed by practice relating to the accessibility of public the health board for that area. [29791/04] buildings to persons with disabilities for the pur- pose of giving guidance to public bodies. Minister of State at the Department of Health The Department of the Environment, Heritage and Children (Mr. T. O’Malley): Responsibility and Local Government has responsibility for for the provision of services for persons, including monitoring the regulations governing access to children, with intellectual disability and those public buildings including access for people with with autism in the Mayo area is a matter, in the disabilities. first instance, for the Western Health Board. My Department has asked the chief executive officer Medical Cards. of the health board to investigate the matter 174. Mr. Allen asked the Ta´naiste and Minister raised by the Deputy and reply directly to him. for Health and Children the reason for a decision by the Southern Health Board in the case of a Hospitals Building Programme. person (details supplied) in County Cork. 178. Mr. Healy-Rae asked the Ta´naiste and [29772/04] Minister for Health and Children the position Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children regarding the long-awaited new hospital for (Ms Harney): Responsibility for the provision of Dingle, County Kerry (details supplied); and if 221 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 222 she will make a statement on the matter. analysis of data on incidence and prevalence of [29792/04] cancer in Ireland. My Department has, therefore, asked the Tanaiste and Minister for Health and Children ´ director of the National Cancer Registry to inves- (Ms Harney): As the Deputy will be aware, the tigate the matter and reply directly to the Deputy. provision of health services in the Kerry area is a matter for the Southern Health Board, in the first 181. Mr. Gormley asked the Ta´naiste and Mini- instance. The board in consultation with my ster for Health and Children the procedure a per- Department decided to build a new 72 bed com- son can follow if they discover a cancer cluster in munity hospital in Dingle, County Kerry to their area; the person they should contact to carry replace the existing hospital. This new hospital out an investigation; and if she will make a state- will comprise a mix of beds for continuing care, ment on the matter. [29808/04] rehabilitation-convalescent, respite, palliative care beds and beds which will be used for direct Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children admissions by the local GP-primary care team. In (Ms Harney): The health board or authority in addition, there will be a central module, a day the area in which the cancer cluster is suspected care unit, a mental health day care unit and an to exist is responsible for investigating the exist- ambulance base. ence of such clusters. Statistical and epidemiolog- The next step in the progressing of the Dingle ical protocols have been devised to assist in the project to construction is to invite tenders for the evaluation of small-area clusters. I understand construction of the project. Any decision in this investigation would draw upon information relation to progressing this project will be con- sources such as the National Cancer Registry, sidered by my Department in the context of the HIPE data of local relevance, death certification significant additional revenue funding and staff and other sources which may be available locally. which will be required by the board to operate Anyone with concerns in relation to cancer clus- the new hospital and having regard to the board’s ters should bring the matter to the attention of employment ceiling and funding available to my the public health department of the health board- Department. authority in their area who would consider the matter and initiate an investigation where Health Board Services. appropriate. 179. Mr. Kenny asked the Ta´naiste and Mini- Hospital Waiting Lists. ster for Health and Children if consideration will be given to subsidising patients in the North 182. Mr. Neville asked the Ta´naiste and Mini- Western Health Board area who have to go to ster for Health and Children, further to Question Northern Ireland to avail of orthodontic services; No. 287 of 19 October 2004, when a pre-waiting and if she will make a statement on the list appointment will be made for a person matter. [29793/04] (details supplied) in County Limerick for the Mid-West Orthopaedic Hospital, Croom. Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children [29814/04] (Ms Harney): The provision of orthodontic ser- vices is the statutory responsibility of the health Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children boards in the first instance. (Ms Harney): I understand the Mid-Western The chief executive officer of the North West- Health Board has issued a response to the ern Health Board has informed my Department Deputy dated 22 November 2004. that due to staff shortages, the board is currently referring highest priority orthodontic patients to Health Board Services. private practitioners in both the Republic of 183. Mr. Kehoe asked the Ta´naiste and Mini- Ireland and Northern Ireland. The board has ster for Health and Children if she has received received additional funding from my Department an application from a person (details supplied) in to help meet the cost of such private referrals County Wexford; and if she will make a state- which are free of charge to the patients. ment on the matter. [29817/04] The chief executive officer has also informed my Department that the board has recently held Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children interviews for a specialist orthodontist and expect (Ms Harney): As the Deputy will be aware, the to fill the post in the coming weeks. provision of health services in Enniscorthy is, in the first instance, the responsibility of the South Cancer Screening. Eastern Health Board. My Department has, therefore, asked the chief executive officer of the 180. Mr. Gormley asked the Ta´naiste and Mini- board to investigate the matter raised by the ster for Health and Children the data that is kept Deputy and reply direct to him as a matter of on the cancer register; if it includes the areas urgency. where a person grew up and the place at which they live; and if she will make a statement on the Hospital Staff. matter. [29807/04] 184. Ms McManus asked the Ta´naiste and Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children Minister for Health and Children her views on (Ms Harney): The National Cancer Registry has concerns expressed by the Medical Council in statutory responsibility for the collation and relation to non-resident cosmetic surgeons carry- 223 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 224

[Ms McManus.] supports the aim to provide as high quality a ing out work here; and if she will make a state- service as possible and to make the most equit- ment on the matter. [29949/04] able use of resources and thus to help maximise the availability of these services. Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children (Ms Harney): The Medical Council is the statu- The current position reflects this approach. tory body established to provide for the regis- Under the Health (Nursing Homes) Act, 1990 tration and control of persons engaged in the health boards may pay a subvention to assist a practice of medicine under the Medical Prac- person in meeting the cost of private nursing titioners Act 1978. Doctors practising medicine home care. It was never envisaged that this sub- should be registered with the Medical Council. vention would cover the full cost of nursing home Persons who avail of the services of doctors per- care. The Department of Health and Children has forming cosmetic procedures should endeavour established a working group to review the oper- to seek the services of reputable institutions. ation and administration of the nursing home When invasive procedures are being arranged in subvention scheme. The health strategy outlined cosmetic clinics, persons are strongly advised to in the document Quality and Fairness; A Health check that the services are provided by a medical System for You” acknowledges the need to clar- practitioner who is appropriately registered with ify and simplify eligibility arrangements and sets the Medical Council in this country. In addition, down a commitment to introduce new legislation before agreeing to undergo any procedure, per- to provide for the introduction of clear statutory sons should ascertain the level of follow-up medi- provisions on entitlement and eligibility. cal support which will be available to them after A review of all existing legislation in this area the surgery has been completed. has been carried out in my Department which will inform the approach to the drafting of new legis- Nursing Home Subventions. lation in this area. As part of this exercise, my 185. Mr. Penrose asked the Ta´naiste and Mini- Department will attempt to resolve the current ster for Health and Children the position in differences in approach in the consideration of relation to the provision of nursing home care for the ability of individuals to pay under the various persons who are over 70 years of age and who regulations in this area. Arising from concerns hold medical cards; if this will be provided free about the current practice of charging for long- under the terms of the Health Act 1970, as stay care in health board institutions, the matter amended; the steps she is taking to ensure that is being examined with regard to advice from the those who have paid for the service to date will office of the Attorney General with a view to be refunded their payments; and if she will make clarification of the situation at an early date. a statement on the matter. [29950/04] Services for People with Disabilities. Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children (Ms Harney): Eligibility for health services in 186. Mr. F. McGrath asked the Ta´naiste and Ireland is primarily based on residency and Minister for Health and Children if a care plan means. Under the Health Act, 1970, determi- will be put in place for a person (details supplied) nation of eligibility for medical cards is the in Dublin 9 with a disability particularly for Janu- responsibility of the chief executive officer of the ary 2005; and if she will make a statement on the appropriate health board other than for persons matter. [29951/04] aged seventy years and over, who are automati- Minister of State at the Department of Health cally eligible for a medical card. Medical cards are and Children (Mr. T. O’Malley): Responsibility issued to persons who, in the opinion of the chief for the provision of services, including care plans, executive officer, are unable to provide general for persons with an intellectual disability and practitioner medical and surgical services for those with autism in the Dublin 9 area is a matter, themselves and their dependants without undue in the first instance, for the Eastern Regional hardship. It is open to all persons to apply to the Health Authority. My Department has asked the chief executive officer of the appropriate health regional chief executive of the Eastern Regional board for health services if they are unable to Health Authority to investigate the matter raised provide these services for themselves or their by the Deputy and reply directly to him. dependants without hardship. However, central to our system of publicly funded long-term care Hospital Services. is the principle that it is fair and reasonable that those who can afford to contribute to the cost of 187. Ms McManus asked the Ta´naiste and their long stay care should do so. The health Minister for Health and Children if her attention strategy reinforces this point and states that: has been drawn to the special deals or contracts being made by hospitals with certain pharmaceut- It is recognised that quality care is expensive ical companies to use only a particular drug for and that the bulk of the cost of providing a high certain conditions, for example a drug (details standard of quality care should be borne by the supplied) being prescribed by St. James’s exchequer. Nonetheless, it is fair that all those Hospital; her views on the cost of this drug com- in receipt of publicly provided residential long- pared to other generic drugs; and if she will make term care should make some payment towards a statement on the matter. [29952/04] accommodation and daily living costs, if they can afford to do so, just as they would if they Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children were living in the community. This principle (Ms Harney): Responsibility for the provision of 225 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 226 hospital services in the eastern region rests with vices for women, especially in the Southern the Eastern Regional Health Authority. My Health Board area. [29968/04] Department has, therefore, asked the regional chief executive of the authority to examine the Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children issue raised and to reply to the Deputy directly. (Ms Harney): Since 1997, there has been a cumu- lative additional investment of approximately \57 million in the development of appropriate treat- Mental Health Services. ment and care services in the Southern Health 188. Ms McManus asked the Ta´naiste and Board region for people with cancer. The invest- Minister for Health and Children if she has ment has enabled the funding of ten additional received correspondence from a group (details consultant posts together with support staff in key supplied); the details of her response to it; and if areas such as medical oncology, haematology, she will make a statement on the matter. radiation oncology and breast surgery. The fund- [29953/04] ing has facilitated the appointment of 27 cancer care nurse specialists across the region. The roll Minister of State at the Department of Health out of the national screening programme to the and Children (Mr. T. O’Malley): Correspondence remaining counties is a major priority in the has been received from the group referred to by development of cancer services. It will ensure that the Deputy on the relocation of the Central Men- all women in the 50 to 64 age group in every tal Hospital. In responding to the group’s con- county have access to breast screening and follow cerns, it has been explained that proposals for the up treatment where required. A capital invest- \ development of a new Central Mental Hospital ment of approximately 20 million has been are under consideration in my Department. The approved to construct and equip two static clini- majority of admissions to the Central Mental cal units, one in Cork and the other in Galway. Hospital come from within the prison service. The investment will also ensure that mobile units are available to screen women in the relevant age Accordingly, ease of access between the main group in the Southern Health Board area and Dublin prisons and the hospital is of importance. throughout the country. Detailed planning for the I understand that the location of the hospital units is progressing as a matter of priority and a adjacent to a prison would have operational design brief will be completed shortly. It is benefits for the prison service. On the other hand, expected that a design team will be in place early it must be borne in mind that the Central Mental next year. The design, construction and com- Hospital is a therapeutic, health care facility. I missioning of the units will take approximately fully agree with families and carers who feel that two and a half years. it would not be desirable that the hospital be per- The report entitled Development of Cancer ceived as, or closely identified with, a prison Services for Symptomatic Breast Disease recom- complex. mended the development of a limited number of I understand that the Minister for Justice, specialist units. Considerable investment and pro- Equality and Law Reform has advanced pro- gress has been made in implementing the recom- posals to develop a new prison complex replacing mendations with most of the units now oper- Mountjoy. I recognise the potential benefits of ational or at an advanced stage of development. close co-operation between that project and the The symptomatic breast service units for the re-development of the Central Mental Hospital Southern Health Board is at South Infirmary-Vic- toria Hospital in Cork and at Cork University and have asked my officials to consider how the Hospital. Any woman irrespective of her age or matter might be progressed to the mutual benefit residence who has immediate concerns or symp- of both services. toms should contact her general practitioner who, where appropriate, will refer her to the sympto- Social Insurance. matic services in her region. 189. Mr. O’Shea asked the Ta´naiste and Mini- ster for Health and Children her proposals to Health Board Services. exempt separated spouses, whose only income is 191. Mr. Ring asked the Ta´naiste and Minister the maintenance payments from the other separ- for Health and Children the categories of persons ated spouse, from the 2% health levy; and if she that are being treated now for orthodontic treat- will make a statement on the matter. [29954/04] ment; the breakdown of the categories that are being treated; and the categories that are avail- Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children able for patients in respect of orthodontic treat- (Ms Harney): As the Deputy is aware the issues ment. [29997/04] of taxation, social insurance and levies are dealt with in the context of budget day announcements Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children and as such are a matter for the Minister for (Ms Harney): The provision of orthodontic ser- Finance. vices is the statutory responsibility of the health boards in the first instance. The aim of my Department is to develop the treatment capacity Cancer Screening Services. of orthodontics in a sustainable way over the 190. Mr. Coveney asked the Ta´naiste and Mini- longer term. Given the potential level of demand ster for Health and Children if she has plans to for orthodontic services, the provision of those improve the inadequate level of breast care ser- services will continue to be based on prioritis- 227 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 228

[Ms Harney.] Western Area Health Board’s child care services ation of cases based on treatment need as hap- where it provides valuable accommodation to the pens under the existing orthodontic guidelines. mainstream residential programme. The guidelines were issued in 1985 and are intended to enable health boards to identify in Accident and Emergency Services. a consistent way those in greatest need and to 193. Mr. R. Bruton asked the Ta´naiste and commence timely treatment for them. Patients in Minister for Health and Children if her attention category A require immediate treatment and has been drawn to an increasing number of include those with congenital abnormalities of the serious accidents caused by the use of a leisure jaw, such as cleft lip and palate, and patients with facility, more commonly known as a bouncing major skeletal discrepancies between the sizes of castle; if, in her discussions with the accident and the jaws. Patients in category B have less severe emergency departments of various acute hospitals problems than category A patients and are placed and the ambulance and fire service, this matter on the orthodontic treatment waiting list. Patients has been raised; and if she will make a statement in category C have less severe problems than in on the matter. [30140/04] category B. The number of cases treated is dependent on Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children the level of resources available in terms of quali- (Ms Harney): The number and extent of injuries fied staff in an area. This is reflected in the treat- associated with the use of the leisure facility as ment waiting list. The provision of orthodontic described by the Deputy did not feature in my services is currently severely restricted due to the discussions with the agencies I have met in the limited availability of trained specialist clinical context of improving the delivery of emergency staff to assess and treat patients. Consequently, a services. category C waiting list may not be maintained in some health boards. Hospital Charges. 194. Mr. M. Brady asked the Ta´naiste and Child Care Services. Minister for Health and Children the number 192. Mr. R. Bruton asked the Ta´naiste and taken to court for non-payment of hospital bills Minister for Health and Children if her attention for hospitals (details supplied); and the amount has been drawn to the circumstances surrounding of unpaid accounts written off as bad debts for a psychiatric unit (details supplied) which was each hospital. [30182/04] designated to provide services to children from Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children south and west Dublin; if this facility has (Ms Harney): Information on the number of per- remained idle for the past seven months and now sons taken to court for non-payment of hospital faces closure; if the reasons for this delay ema- bills and the amount of unpaid accounts written nate from the failure to provide funding to recruit off as bad debts are monitored and under the a consultant child psychiatrist for this facility; and direct responsibility of the relevant health board if she will make a statement on the matter. or authority. Accordingly, my Department has [30139/04] referred the Deputy’s question to the chief execu- tive officer of the Eastern Regional Health Auth- Minister of State at the Department of Health ority and requested that he respond directly to and Children (Mr. T. O’Malley): I have been the Deputy on the matter raised. informed by the South Western Area Health Board that, despite the availability of funding and Health Board Services. repeated and exhaustive efforts in Ireland and internationally, the board was unable to recruit 195. Mr. M. Brady asked the Ta´naiste and adequate consultant cover for Courthall, the Minister for Health and Children the action facility referred to by the Deputy. In the context planned to eliminate waiting lists for children’s of the overall strategic plans for the child and orthodontic treatment. [30183/04] adolescent psychiatric services in the board’s Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children area, the use of its in-patient facilities was (Ms Harney): The provision of orthodontic ser- reviewed. In light of its review, health board man- vices is the statutory responsibility of the health agement worked with staff to create a new service boards and authority in the first instance. The aim model which could address the need for a high of my Department is to develop the treatment quality, comprehensive in-patient service for capacity of orthodontics in a sustainable way over young people with mental health problems. With- the longer term. I am pleased to advise the out the requisite senior medical cover it was not Deputy that a number of measures have been possible to deliver such a service on the Courthall adopted to improve orthodontic services on a site. As a result, a consolidation of inpatient ser- national basis. The grade of specialist in ortho- vices is now taking place which will allow for a dontics has been created in the health board significant enhancement of services at War- orthodontic service. In 2003, my Department and renstown House, another child and adolescent the health boards funded 19 dentists from various psychiatric in-patient facility operated by the health boards for specialist in orthodontics quali- South Western Area Health Board. The facility fications at training programmes in Ireland and at at Courthall is now being utilised by the South three separate universities in the United 229 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 230

Kingdom. The 19 trainees for the public ortho- individuals living in psychiatric hospitals in that dontic service include six dentists who success- year as requiring transfer from these locations to fully completed their training in September 2004 more appropriate accommodation. There is spec- and have taken up duties with the boards. These ific mention of this programme in the health measures will complement the other structural strategy with a stated objective to complete the changes being introduced into the orthodontic transfer of persons with intellectual disability service, including the creation of an auxiliary from psychiatric hospitals as soon as possible and grade of orthodontic therapist to work in the not later than 2006. orthodontic area. Between 1999 and 2003, additional revenue Furthermore, the commitment of the Depart- funding of \10.5 million and \28.4 million capital ment to training development is manifested in the funding was allocated to the intellectual dis- funding provided to both the training of specialist abilities programme to provide more appropriate clinical staff and the recruitment of a professor care settings for this group of clients. It is the in orthodontics for the Cork Dental School. This intention to continue this programme in 2005 appointment will facilitate the development of an from within the additional funding of \40 million approved training programme leading to special- for new services for people with intellectual dis- ist qualification in orthodontics. My Department abilities which was announced last week. has given approval in principle to a proposal to further substantially improve training facilities for Legislative Programme. orthodontics at the school, which will ultimately 197. Ms McManus asked the Ta´naiste and support an enhanced teaching and treatment ser- Minister for Health and Children if she can give vice to the wider region under the leadership of information relating to the introduction of a new the professor of orthodontics. human tissue Act that was promised as far back In June 2002, my Department provided as 2000; and if she will make a statement on the additional funding of \5 million from the treat- matter. [30185/04] ment purchase fund to health authorities specifi- cally for the purchase of orthodontic treatment. Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children This funding enables boards to provide additional (Ms Harney): An EU directive on standards of sessions for existing staff and to purchase treat- quality and safety of human tissues and cells was ment from private specialist orthodontic prac- adopted on 31 March 2004. The directive sets titioners. The chief executive officers of the minimum standards on the donation, procure- health boards and authority have informed my ment, testing, processing, storage and distribution Department that at the end of the September of human tissues and cells for human appli- 2004 quarter, there were 22,168 patients receiving cations. The directive must be transposed in orthodontic treatment in the public orthodontic member states by 6 April 2006. Transposition will service. This means there are over twice as many give Ireland a framework on which to build the patients getting orthodontic treatment as there legislative base for all such activities. Work has are waiting to be treated and more than 6,000 commenced on the drafting of legislation to trans- extra patients are getting treatment from the pose the directive and identifying the other steps health boards and authority since the end of the to be taken to ensure compliance with it. September 2001 quarter. The European Commission is considering the question of a directive on organ transplantation, Services for People with Disabilities. including the issue of consent, and proposes to conduct a thorough scientific evaluation of the 196. Mr. Stanton asked the Ta´naiste and Mini- situation. It will present a report on its analysis to ster for Health and Children her policy in meet- the Council of the European Union as soon as ing the accommodation needs of persons with possible. It is hoped that this will provide the mental illness or intellectual disability; and if she framework for the development of legislation in will make a statement on the matter. [30184/04] this area. In the meantime, it is intended to estab- Minister of State at the Department of Health lish an expert group to review organ donation, and Children (Mr. T. O’Malley): It is the policy procurement and utilisation policy in Ireland. The of my Department to transfer persons with an work of the group will inform Ireland’s contri- intellectual disability or autism from psychiatric bution to the discussions on the proposed direc- hospitals and other inappropriate placements to tive on organs. more appropriate care settings. It is also policy to provide enhanced levels of service for persons Mental Hospitals Report. with an intellectual disability and those with 198. Mr. Cuffe asked the Ta´naiste and Minister autism who are accommodated in psychiatric for Health and Children the action she is taking hospitals, those accommodated in de-designated on foot of the recommendations in the most units, which were formerly designated as psychi- recent report of the Inspector of Mental atric services and to others who moved some Hospitals. [30204/04] years ago from psychiatric hospitals to alternative accommodation which is now unsuitable for their Minister of State at the Department of Health needs. The national intellectual disability data- and Children (Mr. T. O’Malley): The report of base report for 2003 identified a group of 307 the Inspector of Mental Hospitals for the year 231 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 232

[Mr. T. O’Malley.] additional financial and other resources to the ending 31 December 2003 was published on 8 work of Living Links in valuable bereavement September 2004. I welcome the publication of this support that they provide across the country. report and acknowledge the important role the [30221/04] inspector has played for several years in provid- ing an accurate and detailed account of services Minister of State at the Department of Health in the mental health sector throughout the coun- and Children (Mr. T. O’Malley): I am aware of try. In his 2003 report, the Inspector of Mental the work of the organisation referred to by the Hospitals notes the continuing decline in the Deputy. I am informed that the Mid-Western number of patients in psychiatric inpatient facili- Health Board provides support and funding for ties, from 3,966 at the end of 2002 to 3,701 at the key bereavement support initiatives in North end of 2003. Approximately 10%, or 2,349, of all Tipperary. This includes the Living Links organis- admissions to psychiatric hospitals and units in ation and Suicide Understanding and Support, or 2003 were involuntary admissions. Ireland has a SUAS, which provide support for those bereaved significantly higher rate of involuntary admission by suicide. The Mid-Western Health Board pro- than other European countries. However, it is vided \5,000 to the Living Links organisation in anticipated that the full implementation of the 2003 and a further \10,000 was provided this year. Mental Health Act 2001, with its more stringent Funding of \3,000 was provided to SUAS this procedures for involuntary detention, will signifi- year. The provision of additional funding and cantly reduce the number of involuntary admis- resources for these organisations is a matter for sions, bringing practice in this country more into the Mid-Western Health Board. line with the rest of Europe. Additional funding for the provision of support In his report, the inspector refers to and wel- services for those bereaved by suicide will be con- comes the ongoing replacement of old insti- sidered in the context of the estimates process tutional mental hospitals with acute psychiatric for 2005. units attached to general hospitals. During 2003, two new acute psychiatric units opened at St. 200. Mr. Lowry asked the Ta´naiste and Mini- Luke’s General Hospital, Kilkenny and at Mayo ster for Health and Children if her attention has General Hospital, Castlebar. This year a new 50- been drawn to a letter (details supplied) sent to bed acute psychiatric unit opened at the Midland her office on 31 October 2004; if her attention has Regional Hospital, Portlaoise. The inspector also further been drawn to the crisis of youth suicide noted some other developments which had taken that is facing the country; her views on the fact place during 2003, especially, the establishment of that a co-ordinated effort based on the principal the expert group on mental health policy in of early intervention involving her Department, August 2003. The expert group is preparing a new the National Children’s Office, the Department national policy framework for the mental health of Education and Science is needed to tackle this services. The group has undertaken an extensive huge and sensitive issue facing young people; her consultation process with interested parties and is proposals for dealing with the crisis of youth suic- expected to report in 2005. ide that faces parents and young people today; I assure the Deputy that, while I am pleased and if she will make a statement on the with the scale of the progress being made in many of the services, I accept that much remains to be matter. [30222/04] done in providing a service which will enhance the quality of care for those suffering from mental Minister of State at the Department of Health illness. It is my intention to facilitate the service and Children (Mr. T. O’Malley): I am aware of providers in bringing about the improvements the correspondence referred to by the Deputy. It and developments identified by the inspector as is acknowledged that the issue of suicide preven- quickly as possible. I am fully committed to tion, especially among young people, requires endeavouring that the recommendations made in action in a number of different areas and across the inspector’s report for 2003 are implemented a broad range of services and Departments. The as soon as possible. An additional \15 million is issue will be addressed in the context of the prep- being made available for the further development aration of the strategic action plan for suicide of our mental health services in 2005. reduction which is currently underway. The strategy, which involves the Health Boards Suicide Incidence. Executive in partnership with the national suicide 199. Mr. Lowry asked the Ta´naiste and Mini- review group supported by the Department of ster for Health and Children if her attention has Health and Children, will be based on extensive been drawn to the vital work being done by national and international consultation and evi- organisations such as Living Links; the financial dence based research. It will build on existing support or otherwise provided to the organisation policy and the recommendations contained in the over the past five years either nationally or to any 1998 report of the national task force on suicide. north Tipperary branch of the organisation; the All measures aimed at reducing the number of funding that has been provided to similar suicide deaths by suicide will be considered in the prep- bereavement and counselling organisations serv- aration of this strategy which will be completed icing north Tipperary; and if she will provide in 2005. 233 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 234

Health Board Services. vided to both the training of specialist clinical staff and the recruitment of a professor in ortho- 201. Mr. Ferris asked the Ta´naiste and Minister dontics for the Cork Dental School. The appoint- for Health and Children the number on the wait- ment of a professor will facilitate the develop- ing list for orthodontic treatment in County ment of an approved training programme leading Kerry; and the number of orthodontists that are to specialist qualification in orthodontics. My assigned to the county. [30223/04] Department has given approval in principle to a Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children proposal to further substantially improve training (Ms Harney): The provision of orthodontic ser- facilities for orthodontics at the school which will vices in County Kerry is the statutory responsi- ultimately support an enhanced teaching and bility of the Southern Health Board in the first treatment service to the wider region under the instance. Orthodontic information by county is leadership of the professor of orthodontics. not routinely collected by my Department. In June 2002, my Department provided Therefore, the chief executive officer of the additional funding of \5 million from the treat- Southern Health Board has been requested to ment purchase fund to health boards and the provide the information requested directly to authority specifically for the purchase of ortho- the Deputy. dontic treatment. The funding enables boards to provide additional sessions for existing staff and 202. Mr. Ferris asked the Ta´naiste and Minister purchase treatment from private specialist ortho- for Health and Children when a person (details dontic practitioners. The chief executive officers supplied) in County Kerry, who has been on the of the health boards and the authority have waiting list for orthodontic treatment, can expect informed my Department that at the end of the to receive that treatment. [30224/04] September 2004 quarter, there were 22,168 patients receiving orthodontic treatment in the Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children public orthodontic service. This means that there (Ms Harney): As the Deputy is aware, responsi- are more than twice as many patients getting bility for the provision of orthodontic treatment orthodontic treatment as there are waiting to be to eligible persons in County Kerry rests with the treated and more than 6,000 extra patients are Southern Health Board. My Department has getting treatment from the health boards and asked the chief executive officer of the board to authority since the end of the September 2001 investigate the matter raised by the Deputy and quarter. to reply to him directly. 203. Mr. Ferris asked the Ta´naiste and Minister Question No. 204 answered with Question for Health and Children if there is adequate fund- No. 155. ing or orthodontic care to cut the inordinate amount of time that people are forced to wait for Hospital Services. treatment. [30225/04] 205. Mr. Ring asked the Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children when a person (details Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children supplied) in County Mayo will be given a bed in (Ms Harney): The provision of orthodontic ser- the University College Hospital in Galway. vices is the statutory responsibility of the health [30227/04] boards and health authority in the first instance. The aim of my Department is to develop the Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children treatment capacity of orthodontics in a sus- (Ms Harney): The provision of hospital services tainable way over the longer term. I am pleased for people living in County Mayo is a matter for to advise the Deputy that a number of measures the Western Health Board. My Department has have been adopted to improve orthodontic ser- asked the chief executive officer of the board to vices on a national basis. The grade of specialist investigate this case and to reply directly to the in orthodontics has been created in the health Deputy. board orthodontic service. In 2003, my Depart- ment and the health boards funded 19 dentists Legislative Programme. from various health boards for specialist in ortho- 206. Ms Cooper-Flynn asked the Ta´naiste and dontics qualifications at training programmes in Minister for Health and Children when she Ireland and at three separate universities in the intends to bring in new legislation to update and United Kingdom. The trainees for the public codify the legal framework for eligibility and orthodontic service included six dentists who suc- entitlements in regard to the health services; and cessfully completed their training in September the title of the new legislation. [30236/04] 2004 and have taken up duties with the boards. These measures will complement the other struc- Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children tural changes being introduced into the orthodon- (Ms Harney): As the Deputy is aware, my tic service, including the creation of an auxiliary Department is committed to the preparation of grade of orthodontic therapist to work in the new legislation to update and codify the entire orthodontic area. legal framework for eligibility and entitlements in The commitment of the Department to training regard to health services. The health strategy, development is manifested in the funding pro- Quality and Fairness; A Health System for You, 235 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 236

[Ms Harney.] vices (Payments) board. It remains my intention acknowledges the need to clarify and simplify to bring the review to Government, after which eligibility arrangements and sets down a commit- its publication and implementation will be ment to introduce new legislation to provide for discussed. the introduction of clear statutory provisions on entitlement and eligibility. A review of all exist- Questions Nos. 208 and 209 answered with ing legislation in this area has been carried out in Question No. 156. my Department which will inform the approach to the drafting of new legislation in this area. As Long-Term Illness Scheme. part of this exercise, my Department will be 210. Ms Cooper-Flynn asked the Ta´naiste and attempting to resolve the current differences in Minister for Health and Children the illnesses approach in the consideration of individuals’ covered under the long-term illness scheme; the ability to pay under the various regulations in criteria for inclusion in the scheme; when the last this area. illnesses were added to the scheme; and the It should be noted that central to our system of names of these illnesses. [30240/04] publicly funded long-term care is the principle that it is fair and reasonable that those who can 211. Ms Cooper-Flynn asked the Ta´naiste and afford to contribute to the cost of their long stay Minister for Health and Children the number of care should do so. The health strategy reinforces persons that benefit under the long-term illness this point and states that: scheme. [30241/04] It is recognised that quality care is expensive Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children and that the bulk of the cost of providing a high (Ms Harney): I propose to take Questions Nos. standard of quality care should be borne by the 210 and 211 together. Exchequer. Nonetheless, it is fair that all those Under the Health Act 1970, a health board in receipt of publicly provided residential long- may arrange for the supply, without charge, of term care should make some payment towards drugs, medicines and medical and surgical accommodation and daily living costs, if they appliances to people with a specified condition, can afford to do so, just as they would if they for the treatment of that condition under the were living in the community. This principle long-term illness scheme. The conditions are supports the aim to provide as high quality a mental handicap, mental illness for people under service as possible and to make the most equit- 16 only, phenylketonuria, cystic fibrosis, spina able use of resources and thus to help maximise bifida, hydrocephalus, diabetes mellitus, diabetes the availability of these services. insipidus, haemophilia, cerebral palsy, epilepsy, multiple sclerosis, muscular dystrophies, parkin- Arising from concerns about the current practice sonism, conditions arising from thalidomide and of charging for long-stay care in health board acute leukaemia. Parkinsonism, acute leukaemia, institutions, this matter is being examined with muscular dystrophies and multiple sclerosis were regard to advice recently received from the office added to the scheme in 1975. The average of the Attorney General with a view to early monthly number of claimants under the long- clarification. The issue will be given priority in term illness scheme in the year ending 31 the context of legislative changes on eligibility. December 2003 was 32,720. The scheme was designed to protect patients General Medical Services Scheme. with a specified condition from excessive drug 207. Ms Cooper-Flynn asked the Ta´naiste and bills for the treatment of that condition. Follow- Minister for Health and Children the reason the ing the establishment of the general medical ser- Deloitte and Touche report into GMS was never vices scheme in 1971 to provide free treatment published. [30237/04] for those who could not without undue hardship arrange to provide it for themselves and their Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children dependants, various co-payment schemes have (Ms Harney): The Deloitte and Touche con- been introduced to provide assistance towards sultancy review of governance and accountability the cost of approved drugs and medicines for mechanisms in the general medical services people with significant ongoing medical expenses, schemes was received by my Department in Feb- without restriction to the treatment of a particu- ruary 2003. While the review was being con- lar condition. Since 1999, non-medical card hold- sidered by officials in my Department, the com- ers and people with conditions not covered under mission on financial management and control the long-term illness scheme have been able to systems in the health service published the use the drugs payment scheme. Under this Brennan report and the audit of structures and scheme, no individual or family unit pays more functions in the health system resulted in the than \78 per calendar month towards the cost of Prospectus report. Since the contents and recom- approved prescribed medicines. The monthly mendations of the latter reports are relevant to threshold is due to increase to \85 from 1 Janu- the subject matter of the general medical services ary 2005. review, my Department requested Deloitte and In light of the protection provided from excess- Touche to update its draft having regard to the ive drug costs by the general medical services and latest financial data from the general medical ser- drugs payment schemes, there are no plans to 237 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 238 amend the list of eligible conditions under the waiting list for arthritis treatment in the Western long-term illness scheme. Health Board area for each of the past three years; the year of referral from which patients are Medical Cards. being allocated routine appointments and the 212. Ms Cooper-Flynn asked the Ta´naiste and year of referral for urgent waiting lists; the Minister for Health and Children if general prac- numbers that have been treated under the titioners were paid a retainer per medical card for national treatment purchase fund; and if she will customers who were deceased but remained on make a statement on the matter. [30256/04] the health board list for many years. [30242/04] Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children (Ms Harney): The provision of arthritis treatment (Ms Harney): In 2001, following the decision to is a matter for the Western Health Board. My provide medical cards to all people aged 70 years Department has asked the chief executive officer and over, potential inaccuracies in general medi- of the board to investigate the issues raised and cal service scheme lists came to light. Health to reply directly to the Deputy. boards were requested to undertake reviews of their GMS registers. A group was established Cross-Border Projects. under the auspices of the Health Boards Execu- ´ ´ tive to oversee these reviews. Following the 215. Caoimhghı´nOCaola´in asked the Tanaiste reviews and as of July 2004, approximately and Minister for Health and Children if she will 104,000 records have been removed from the report on her meeting of 17 November 2004 with GMS register. Health boards have advised that officials from the Northern Ireland Department they consider most of these to be normal of Health, Social Services and Public Safety in deletions due to death, change in eligibility status relation to the establishment of a North-South or persons moving from one board area to child protection forum. [30260/04] another. Minister of State at the Department of Health The Health Boards Executive-led group iden- and Children (Mr. B. Lenihan): Following an tified an amount of overpayment of capitation invitation, an official from my Department met fees arising from the removal of these entries of \ with officials from the Northern Ireland Depart- approximately 8.4 million. My Department is ment of Health, Social Services and Public Safety fully committed to recouping the overpayments on 17 November. The meeting, which was identified in line with the commitment given to extremely positive, was used to exchange infor- the Committee of Public Accounts. mation and documents and to explore any advan- tages to having further meetings. A further meet- Water Quality. ing has been tentatively arranged early in 2005. 213. Mr. McGuinness asked the Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children if the SEHB has Health Board Staff. conducted an analysis of the quality of the drink- 216. Ms McManus asked the Ta´naiste and ing water at Clogh and Moneenroe, County Minister for Health and Children the number of Kilkenny; if so, if the reports will be publicised; vacancies by health board area, of nursing, ther- and if she will make a statement on the apy and allied medical professional posts; and if matter. [30250/04] she will make a statement on the matter. Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children [30315/04] (Ms Harney): The Department of Health and Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children Children is not the Department responsible for (Ms Harney): Information on vacancy levels in the analysis of the quality of drinking water. The the health service is not collected by my Depart- Minister for the Environment and Local Govern- ment as a matter of routine. The Deputy may ment made regulations in 2000 through SI 439 to wish to note, however, that the Health Service give effect to the terms of the European Com- Employers Agency undertakes quarterly surveys munities (Drinking Water) Regulations 2000. of nursing vacancies, the latest of which is for the Under these regulations it is the duty of the sani- period ending 30 June 2004. Employers reported tary authority to take the necessary steps to in this survey that 771 vacancies existed, a ensure that water intended for human consump- decrease of 23% from 1,007 vacancies recorded a tion is wholesome and clean and meets the year previously in June 2003. A copy of the sur- requirements of the regulations. A sanitary auth- vey, which contains a breakdown by hospital, ority is defined under the regulations as a sanitary health board and voluntary agency, will be for- authority for the purposes of the Local Govern- warded directly to the Deputy by my ment (Sanitary Services) Acts 1878 to 1964. I Department. trust this clarifies the position for the Deputy. Responsibility for the management of the workforce, recruitment and the filling of vacanc- Health Board Services. ies in each region rests with the relevant health 214. Mr. Kenny asked the Ta´naiste and Mini- board or authority. My Department has therefore ster for Health and Children the numbers on the requested the chief executive officer of each 239 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 240

[Ms Harney.] the initial purchase cost to the State of a centre health board and the regional chief executive of (details supplied) in County Carlow; the break- the Eastern Regional Health Authority to investi- down of the ongoing costs since then; and if he gate the matter raised by the Deputy on vacancies will make a statement on the matter. [29832/04] in therapy and allied health professional grades Minister of State at the Department of Finance and to respond to her directly. (Mr. Parlon): Ionaid Folain, Myshall, was pur- Hospital Waiting Lists. chased by the Office of Public Works on behalf of the Reception and Integration Agency of the 217. Mr. Crawford asked the Ta´naiste and Department of Justice for the sum of Minister for Health and Children her views on \1,333,225.00. The total for security and other whether it is reasonable or realistic for a person costs incurred on the property from its acquisition (details supplied) in County Cavan to be advised until its transfer to the Department of Health and on a number of occasions that the appointment Children in August 2002 was \176,509.98. for a pre-assessment has been cancelled in Our Lady’s Hospital, Navan; her further views on Question No. 220 answered with Question whether it is further proof that the waiting list is No. 80. not relevant simply due to the fact that people cannot obtain assessments in order to secure a Budget Submissions. place on the waiting lists; and if she will make a 221. Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in asked the Minister statement on the matter. [30316/04] for Finance if he has received a pre-budget 2005 Ta´naiste and Minister for Health and Children submission from the End Child Poverty Coali- (Ms Harney): Responsibility for the provision of tion; and if he will make a statement on the services at Our Lady’s Hospital in Navan rests matter. [30295/04] with the North Eastern Health Board. My Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): I confirm Department has, therefore, asked the chief that I have received a pre-budget 2005 submission executive officer of the board to investigate the from the End Child Poverty Coalition. Its con- issue raised and to reply directly to the Deputy. tents will be considered by me in the context of the forthcoming budget. Appointments to State Boards. 218. Mr. Stanton asked the Ta´naiste and Mini- Natural Heritage Areas. ster for Health and Children the identity of the 222. Mr. P. Breen asked the Minister for Fin- members of the working group on home supports ance if the OPW will continue to employ guides and personal assistance services; when the group on Scattery Island, Kilrush, County Clare, for the was established; when she expects to receive its 2005 season; when it expects to recruit same; the report; and if she will make a statement on the plans the OPW has to further develop this matter. [30317/04] important tourism amenity; and if he will make a Minister of State at the Department of Health statement on the matter. [29693/04] and Children (Mr. T. O’Malley): The working Minister of State at the Department of Finance group on home supports and personal assistants (Mr. Parlon): Guide and information officers will first met in January 2002. The membership of the be deployed by the heritage services of the Office working group is as follows: Allen Dunne, Dis- of Public Works at Scattery Island in 2005 at a ability Federation of Ireland; Anne Winslow, level that is necessary and appropriate to protect Irish Wheelchair Association; David Fennell, the monuments on the island and to interpret Cheshire Foundation; Margaret Gillard, Rehab them for visitors. The guides will be deployed Group; Michael Corbett, Disability Federation of from the guides staff complement located at Ireland; Joan Bradley, Post Polio Support Group; Ennis Friary. Mo Flynn, Eastern Regional Health Authority; Pat Dolan, North Western Health Board; Anne Tax Code. Marie Kilkenny, Department of Health and Chil- dren; and Frank Tracy, Department of Health 223. Dr. Upton asked the Minister for Finance and Children. if he will consider any possible tax relief measures The report of the working group will be incor- to encourage better farm management; and if he porated into the strategic review of health and will make a statement on the matter. [29349/04] personal social services which is being under- Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): It is under- taken by my Department. This will involve an in- stood that the Deputy is referring to the pro- depth examination of the needs of people who posals made by the Irish Farmers Association and require home support and personal assistant ser- the Irish Creamery Milk Suppliers Association in vices. I expect to receive the report early in 2005. their pre-budget submissions for specific tax measures to encourage land consolidation. The Asylum Support Services. Deputy will appreciate that in line with normal 219. Mr. Kehoe asked the Minister for Finance practice in the run-up to the annual budget and 241 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 242

Finance Bill, I do not wish to comment on the lished on my Department’s website in early July intention or otherwise to make changes in and copies have been placed in the Oireachtas taxation. Library. As agreed by Government in June, I will consider the report on an ongoing basis in the 224. Ms O. Mitchell asked the Minister for Fin- ance the categories and nature of disability which overall budgetary context having regard to the qualify for tax relief under section 92. [29727/04] existing and prospective cost of the scheme. 225. Ms O. Mitchell asked the Minister for Fin- 226. Mr. Cuffe asked the Minister for Finance ance if he intends to include persons confined to if a golf club (details supplied) in County Dublin a wheelchair following a stroke in the category of is exempt from capital gains tax; if changes were those qualifying for tax relief under section 92. made in the 2002 budget that altered the club’s [29728/04] tax status; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [29745/04] Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): I propose to take Questions Nos. 224 and 225 together. Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): It has not I assume the Deputy is referring to the Dis- been the practice to comment on the tax affairs of abled Drivers and Disabled Passengers (Tax individuals or persons unless a Deputy is clearly Concessions) Regulations 1994 made under asking a question on their behalf. However, I section 92 of the Finance Act 1989. The disabled understand from the Revenue Commissioners drivers and disabled passengers tax concessions that the golf club in question is included on a list scheme is open to people with disabilities who published on the Revenue website of bodies meet the specified criteria and have obtained a which have been granted a tax exemption under primary medical certificate to that effect. The section 235 of the Taxes Consolidation Act 1997. senior area medical officer attached to the rel- The general position is that income, including evant health board is responsible for both the capital gains, of those bodies established for the medical assessment and the issue of the medical sole purpose of the promotion of athletic or ama- certificate. teur games or sports is exempt from tax where it The medical criteria for the purposes of the tax can be shown to the satisfaction of the Revenue concessions under this scheme are set out in the Commissioners that such income is applied solely Disabled Drivers and Disabled Passengers (Tax for those purposes. This method of tax treatment Concessions) Regulations 1994. A total of six cat- is of long standing, originating in the Finance Act egories of disabled person are listed under the 1928 and extended in 1963 and 2003. There were regulations and a qualifying person must satisfy no changes in the 2002 budget relating to this one or more of them. They are persons who are matter. wholly or almost wholly without the use of both legs; persons who are wholly without the use of Decentralisation Programme. one leg and almost wholly without the use of the other leg such that the applicant is severely 227. Mr. M. Moynihan asked the Minister for restricted as to movement of the lower limbs; per- Finance the progress on the acquisition of a site sons without both hands or without both arms; for the proposed OPW office in Kanturk, County persons without one or both legs; persons wholly Cork; the number of sites being considered; and or almost wholly without the use of both hands when a decision is expected to be taken in respect or arms and wholly or almost wholly without the of making an offer for one of these premises. use of one leg; and persons having the medical [29180/04] condition of dwarfism and who have serious diffi- Minister of State at the Department of Finance culties of movement of the lower limbs. An indi- (Mr. Parlon): The evaluation of property sol- vidual who qualifies under the medical criteria as utions to fulfil the accommodation brief for staff set out above is issued with a primary medical decentralising to Kanturk is at an advanced stage. certificate. Preliminary negotiations have commenced with Possession of a primary medical certificate the respective owners of a number of sites. On qualifies the holder for remission or repayment completion of negotiations, a formal offer to pur- of vehicle registration tax, a repayment of value chase will be made for the site deemed most added tax on the purchase of the vehicle and a suitable. repayment of VAT on the cost of adaptation of the vehicle. Repayment of the excise duty on fuel Flood Relief. used in the motor vehicle and exemption from annual road tax to Local Authorities are also 228. Mr. Gregory asked the Minister for Fin- allowed. ance further to his reply of 28 October 2004, the An interdepartmental review group was estab- assistance he can give to a person (details lished to review the disabled drivers’ and disabled supplied) in Dublin 3 who has been refused passengers’ tax concessions scheme. The group insurance flood cover and who cannot sell their examined all aspects of the scheme including the house as a result; and if he will make a statement qualifying medical criteria. The report was pub- on the matter. [29806/04] 243 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 244

Minister of State at the Department of Finance relief, which were attractive to borrowers. These (Mr. Parlon): The Office of Public Works has no products inherently require customers to take responsibility for the availability of insurance some risk whereby they are exposed to market against flood risk. I regret, therefore, that I am fluctuations as with any market based life assur- not in a position to assist with this matter. ance investment. The fact that a person does not gain as much as expected is not in itself an indica- Garda Stations. tion of any inappropriate practices on the part of the bank or insurance company concerned. 229. Mr. Penrose asked the Minister for Fin- ance if, in view of the recent correspondence to The consumer director of IFSRA, Mary him, he will consider a proposal to erect a new O’Dea, has encouraged people to come forward Garda station at a location (details supplied) in if they are worried about the possibility of having County Westmeath; and if he will make a state- been missold an endowment mortgage. They ment on the matter. [29945/04] should complain in the first instance to the com- pany from whom they bought the policy. The UK Minister of State at the Department of Finance did not establish a compensation fund for the (Mr. Parlon): The Commissioners of Public payment of compensation to holders of mortgage Works acquire sites and erect new Garda stations linked endowment insurance policies with short- in accordance with priorities established by the falls. The financial services compensation scheme Department of Justice, Equality and Law in the UK is a statutory fund of last resort to Reform. There are no current plans to replace administer and pay compensation to eligible Castlepollard Garda station. Any such proposal investors when a firm falling under its ambit is would require the agreement of the Department unable to fulfil its financial commitments to its of Justice, Equality and Law Reform and the clients. As regards endowment mortgages, our Garda authorities. understanding is that the relevant UK authorities have set down guidance for financial institutions Financial Services Regulation. in relation to dealing with policyholders where mis-selling may have occurred. This guidance was 230. Ms Harkin asked the Minister for Finance based on the findings in cases brought before the if the Irish Financial Services Regulatory Auth- courts and ombudsman schemes and given in ority and the relevant insurance companies will accordance with long standing powers available establish a compensation fund, similar to that in to regulators in that jurisdiction. the UK, through which holders of mortgage linked endowment insurance policies with short- There is already a substantial volume of legis- falls can be enabled to deal with their mortgage lation in place to address these products. For obligations. [29946/04] example, the Consumer Credit Act 1995 requires that all endowment loan application forms must Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): The Irish contain a prominent notice to the effect that there Financial Services Regulatory Authority, IFSRA, is no guarantee that the proceeds of the insurance is studying the matter of endowment loan short- policy will be sufficient to repay the loan in full falls having commenced a survey earlier this year when it becomes due. The Act also obliges the to determine whether and to what extent there provision of ongoing information on the perform- will be difficulties for customers. It would be ance of the policy, as do the Life Assurance inappropriate to reach any conclusions in (Provision of Information) Regulations 2001. The advance of IFSRA’s consideration of the out- Central Bank and Financial Services Authority of come of the survey. I will continue to review the Ireland Acts 2003 and 2004 established the adequacy of the relevant legislative framework as IFSRA and considerably strengthened the regu- information from IFSRA becomes available. latory environment. The Acts include an No reliable data exists on the overall numbers enhanced structure for dealing with consumer of cases where there may be a shortfall. However, complaints about financial institutions. endowment loan approvals in the last five years represent just 3% of the overall mortgage market, Tax Code. although it has been considerably higher in the 231. Mr. Sherlock asked the Minister for Fin- past. Since 1989, a total of 90,000 endowment ance if there is a proposal to amend an order loans were approved, roughly 10% of total loan (details supplied) in view of the fact that it is hav- approvals since 1989. These types of mortgages ing a detrimental effect on the delivery of inshore operate on the basis that instead of making capi- rescue and recovery services. [29947/04] tal payments on a mortgage, the client pays only the interest. Therefore, the capital amount owed Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): This matter does not decrease. However, the client also has been raised on a number of occasions. The makes an investment with a life assurance com- Value Added Tax (Refund of Tax) (No.18) pany the aim of which is to cover the mortgage Order 1985, referred to by the Deputy, provides and, possibly, provide some additional benefit for the repayment of VAT costs incurred in beyond that. The products provided additional respect of equipment for use only in respect of benefits, for example, in the form of higher tax rescue or assistance at sea. The order does not 245 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 246 extend to equipment used in rescue craft oper- in the report of the flood policy review group ational on bodies of fresh water. Practical diffi- approved by the Government last month, the culties in distinguishing the intended use of such Department of Communications, Marine and equipment in the context of craft on fresh water Natural Resources will continue its current role bodies and the potential costs to the Exchequer in relation to coastal erosion and coastal flooding. are the main considerations in this regard. Chari- ties and non-profit groups are exempt from VAT Tax Code. under the EU’s sixth VAT directive. This means 234. Mr. Ring asked the Minister for Finance if they do not charge VAT on their services and he will consider raising the guidelines at which cannot recover VAT incurred on goods and ser- persons have to register for VAT; the last time vices that they purchase. this was reviewed or changed; and if he has plans Only VAT registered businesses which charge to raise that level upwards from \51,000. VAT are able to recover VAT. However, the [29996/04] Deputy may be aware that the Finance Act 1973 provided for the zero-rating of “life saving ser- Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): Traders vices provided by the Royal National Lifeboat making supplies in the State are obliged to regis- Institution, including the organisation and main- ter for VAT where certain turnover thresholds tenance of the lifeboat service”. This means that are exceeded or are likely to be exceeded in any while the RNLI does not charge VAT on the ser- continuous period of 12 months. The current vices it provides, it is entitled to reclaim VAT thresholds, which were introduced in the Finance incurred on the goods and services which it pur- Act 1994 with effect from 1 July 1994 are \25,500 chases in delivering its services. In addition, the in the case of a person supplying services and Irish Coast Guard, under the aegis of the Depart- \51,000 for persons supplying goods. The first ment of Communications, Marine and Natural threshold also applies to persons supplying a Resources, administers the community of inland combination of goods and services or goods and inshore rescue services grant scheme. The chargeable at the 13.5% or 21% VAT rates which community of inshore rescue services and the are produced from zero-rated materials. inland rescue service may apply for grants under Businesses with a turnover below these thres- the scheme in respect of both current and, more holds can, of course, register for VAT. Those recently, capital expenditures. Guidelines on the businesses in the service sector in particular fre- scheme in terms of eligibility criteria and grant quently choose to do so for commercial reasons. levels are available from the Irish Coast Guard. It is not customary for me to comment on any possible changes to thresholds which may, or may Water and Sewerage Schemes. not, arise in the context of the forthcoming budget. 232. Mr. McGuinness asked the Minister for Finance further to Parliamentary Question No. 235. Ms Burton asked the Minister for Finance 158 of 10 November 2004, when the survey will the number of small, self-administered pension be completed; and if it will be costed. [29948/04] funds and schemes; and the amount of tax relief claimed in respect of such schemes. [30112/04] Minister of State at the Department of Finance (Mr. Parlon): The survey referred to in my reply to Parliamentary Question No. 158 of 10 Nov- Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): Iam ember 2004 is an ongoing staff operation. When informed by the Revenue Commissioners that engineering staff visit heritage sites on other busi- there are approximately 2,500 small self-adminis- ness the opportunity is taken to review existing tered pension schemes in existence. Employer waste water and sewerage systems. As such there contributions to small self-administered pension is no additional cost attached to this survey. schemes are treated as a trading expense of the employer for tax purposes. Employee contri- butions to such schemes are netted off as Flood Relief. deductions from an individual’s income before 233. Mr. Boyle asked the Minister for Finance arriving at the definition of income for tax pur- the flood alleviation measures being taken on poses. Figures for pension contributions by islands that are his area of responsibility. employers and employees are not captured in [28019/04] such a way as to provide a dedicated basis for compiling estimates of cost to the Exchequer. Minister of State at the Department of Finance Accordingly, the specific information requested (Mr. Parlon): The Office of Public Works has not by the Deputy is not readily available. received any information on flooding on any island arising from the recent heavy rainfall. It is Grant Payments. highly likely that any flooding on the islands resulted solely from tidal flooding, which is the 236. Mr. Ring asked the Minister for Finance if responsibility of the Department of Communi- he has received a request for \1.685 million by a cations, Marine and Natural Resources. In working group (details supplied) in County accordance with the recommendations contained Mayo; the position regarding same; if consider- 247 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 248

[Mr. Ring.] for final expenditure outcomes at year end; and ation will be given to this package; and when the if he will make a statement on the matter. necessary funding will be supplied. [30143/04] [30177/04] Minister of State at the Department of Finance 241. Mr. Durkan asked the Minister for Fin- (Mr. Parlon): The Office of Public Works has not ance if he has examined the circumstances received a request for \1.685 million from the whereby a number of Government Departments have underspent in terms of their budgets in the group but has received a copy of the report of the past year; and if he will make a statement on the group dated October 2004. The Office of Public matter. [30280/04] Works does not have any statutory responsibility for the works now proposed by the working Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): I propose group. to take Questions Nos. 237 and 241 together. Net voted expenditure for each ministerial Departmental Estimates. Vote group to end-October 2004, with a break- down of current and capital spending, is set out 237. Ms Burton asked the Minister for Finance below. The forecast outturn information is based the net voted expenditure for each Department on the latest estimates received from Depart- in the first ten months of 2004, with a breakdown ments and offices in connection with the recently of current and capital spending; his latest forecast published 2005 Abridged Estimates Volume.

Vote Group — Net Spending to end-October 2004 2004 Forecast Outturn

Current Capital Total Current Capital Total

Finance group 639 146 785 865 263 1,128 Taoiseach’s group 103 0 103 142 1 144 Justice group 1,408 68 1,477 1,748 107 1,854 Environment 580 860 1,440 685 1,624 2,310 Education 4,840 238 5,078 5,876 509 6,385 Marine 116 62 178 154 104 258 Agriculture 553 61 614 724 96 819 Transport 299 994 1,293 411 1,571 1,982 Health 6,915 297 7,212 8,095 510 8,604 Enterprise, Trade & Employment 658 171 829 766 339 1,105 Arts, Sport & Tourism 237 70 307 302 131 433 Defence 632 14 646 826 24 850 Foreign Affairs 423 7 430 550 13 563 Social & Family Affairs 4,892 0 4,892 5,972 8 5,980 Community group 131 63 194 181 98 279

Total 22,426 3,052 25,478 27,295 5,398 32,693

The end-October Exchequer returns showed that Tax Code. net voted spending by Departments and offices is 238. Mr. Cuffe asked the Minister for Finance some \1.35 billion below profile, of which \466 \ the amount of tax forgone to the exchequer due million is in respect of current spending and 885 to the tax relief afforded to creative artists; the million is for capital spending. The 2005 number of persons who availed of this exemption; Abridged Estimates Volume included forecast and the amount of relief granted to each per- outturn information as summarised above. Over- son. [30205/04] all, there is a forecast saving of \150 million on gross spending of which \70 million is a saving on Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): Iam day-to-day spending. There is an \80 million sav- informed by the Revenue Commissioners that the ing on capital net of \248 million capital carry- most recent relevant information available on the over from 2004 to 2005 under the multi-annual exemption of certain earnings of writers, compo- capital envelopes announced in the 2004 budget. sers and artists relates to the short income tax There are higher receipts of \100 million across year 2001, in respect of which some 1,323 claims some Departments which will result in a net total for exemption were allowed at an estimated cost forecast saving of \250 million between current to the Exchequer of \23.5 million. It should be and capital, net of the capital carryover. Notwith- noted that as PAYE taxpayers were charged to standing the significant underspend to date, over- tax on their earnings in the period from 6 April all savings, net of capital carryover, are forecast to 31 December 2001 and self-employed tax- at 0.75% of the 2004 Revised Estimates Volume payers were assessed to tax for the short year on provision. 74% of the profits earned in a 12-month account- ing period, data provided may not be directly 249 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 250 comparable with those of earlier or later years. official level between the Department of Finance However, the Revenue Commissioners estimated and other Departments and with each of the Civil that the full year cost to the Exchequer of the Service unions. artists relief for the tax year 2000-01 was \36.8 The strategic management initiative implemen- million. tation group of Secretaries General provided The specific information requested by the advice, at the request of the Government. Heads Deputy on relief granted to each person is not of relevant Departments provided views, at the readily available. However, a breakdown of the request of the Government, on the experience of number of claimants by reference to ranges of the their respective Departments with the previous income which was tax exempted is set out in the programme of decentralisation. In addition, one following table. A married couple who has major public service union provided advice, in elected or has been deemed to have elected for response to an invitation from the then Minister, joint assessment is counted as one tax unit. on the development of criteria for the Numbers of persons claiming the artists exemp- programme. tion and the income subject to the exemption in All of the material, together with the factors the short tax year 2001: set out in reply to Question No. 214 of 17 Nov- ember 2004, were taken into account prior to the Range of Income Number of Income announcement of the new programme in Claimants Subject to Exemption December 2004.

\\Question No. 241 answered with Question No. 237. 5,000 or less 446 916,555 5,001-10,000 248 1,796,686 Price Inflation. 10,001-50,000 456 9,867,796 242. Mr. Durkan asked the Minister for Fin- 50,001-100,000 75 5,411,767 ance the cost increases deemed most likely to 100,001-200,000 39 5,298,712 militate against consumer confidence in the econ- 200,001-500,000 31 10,092,434 omy here with particular reference to the need 500,001-10,000,000 28 46,631,246 to maintain Ireland as an attractive investment location; and if he will make a statement on the Total 1,323 80,015,197 matter. [30281/04] Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): I am con- Budget Submissions. scious of the need to maintain and improve Ireland’s competitive position to ensure the con- 239. Mr. R. Bruton asked the Minister for Fin- tinuation of strong output and employment ance if he has received a submission from a com- growth in the future. Ireland is a highly open pany (details supplied) regarding a staggered economy, and we must remain competitive to excise rate; and if he has assessed the feasibility continue to attract investment and to allow con- of this proposal. [30220/04] tinued export growth. On an EU harmonised Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): A pre- basis, Irish inflation fell below the euro area aver- budget submission from the persons in question age earlier this year and remains close to, but just has been received. This submission, as with all slightly above the euro area average. The other pre-budget submissions, is being considered Government’s anti-inflation strategy has contrib- in the context of preparations for the forthcoming uted to this and the Government will remain budget and Finance Bill. focused, through the partnership process, on sec- uring low inflation and responsible wage growth Decentralisation Programme. in the economy, thereby helping to secure Ireland’s competitiveness and future prosperity. 240. Mr. Timmins asked the Minister for Fin- For the year as a whole, my Department, in its ance , further to Question No. 214 of 17 Nov- annual economic review and outlook published in ember 2004, if he will provide a reply to same. August, projected that inflation as measured by [30243/04] annual changes in the consumer price index Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): In my reply would average 2.2% this year. This would be the to Question No. 214 on 17 November 2004 I set lowest rate of increase since 1999. I note that the out the range of factors that were taken into IIB-ESRI consumer sentiment index has account and measured against each other in sel- improved steadily over the course of this year and ecting locations for all the new decentralised is now at its highest level since mid-2001. offices. The then Minister for Finance first announced the Government’s intention to Question No. 243 answered with Question embark on a new decentralisation programme in No. 96. the 2000 budget. Following that announcement, the Department of Finance received represen- National Development Plan. tations, submissions and inquiries on behalf of 244. Mr. Durkan asked the Minister for Fin- more than 130 centres throughout the country, ance which Departments are on target in respect including Wicklow, seeking to be included in the of spending in the context of the national programme. In addition there were meetings at 251 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 252

[Mr. Durkan.] and child care measures are ahead of projections. development plan; those that are not; and if he The PEACE and technical assistance operational will make a statement on the matter. [30283/04] programmes are on track to meet their targets by the end of the year. Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): The national development plan consists of seven oper- Disabled Drivers. ational programmes, three national economic and social infrastructure operational programmes, 245. Mr. Durkan asked the Minister for Fin- productive sector operational programmes, and ance if an evaluation has been done with a view the employment and human resource develop- to a determination of the precise number of dis- ment operational programmes, two regional abled passengers and disabled drivers likely to operational programmes, a joint programme with benefit from a liberalisation of the regulation of Northern Ireland, PEACE II operational pro- the disabled drivers and disabled passengers gramme and a technical assistance operational regulations 1994; when he will initiate improve- programme. In total, over 270 distinct measures ments in this area; and if he will make a statement are implemented by Departments and agencies. on the matter. [30284/04] With the exception of the Departments of the Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): In the Taoiseach, Foreign Affairs and Defence, all report of the interdepartmental review group, Departments are engaged to varying degrees in established to examine the operation of the dis- the implementation of specific measures of the abled drivers and disabled passengers (tax national development plan. concessions) scheme, reference was made to a Monitoring of progress of operational pro- move away from qualification for the scheme grammes and measure level is undertaken pri- being determined by specified medical criteria in marily by programme monitoring committees favour of an approach addressing mobility diffi- which meet twice yearly for each operational pro- culties. However, the report also stated that on gramme. Implementation of the national the basis of figures received from reports from development plan is not monitored by monitoring representative organisations who made sub- committees at Department level, given the range missions to the review group there could be as of measures a Department or its agencies are many as 92,000 people who consider that they delivering. Progress reports relating to the first should be admitted to the scheme either in its half of 2004 have recently been reviewed by the present form or in a revised format. The Govern- monitoring committees. These reports show that ment has agreed that I will consider the report on spending for 2004 at operational programme level an ongoing basis in the overall budgetary context is broadly on target at mid-year. \ having regard to the existing and prospective cost It is estimated that around 31 billion or some of the scheme. 87% of the profiled expenditure for the period of the national development plan from January 2000 Tax Code. to June 2004 has been incurred. The regional breakdown of this expenditure is \8.3 billion for 246. Mr. Durkan asked the Minister for Fin- the BMW region and \22.8 billion for the south- ance if he will consider a reduction in stamp duty ern and eastern regions, representing 75% and with a view to alleviating part of the financial bur- 92% of profiled expenditure for each region den for first-time house buyers; and if he will respectively. With respect to the operational pro- make a statement on the matter. [30285/04] grammes, the economic and social Infrastructure Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): Stamp duty operational programme is performing well with is a significant contributor to the Exchequer expenditure ahead of target at mid-year. Expen- which helps to fund Government spending on diture on the employment and human resource public services such as health and education. development operational programme has Stamp duty receipts also allow for a broader tax achieved 92% of profiled expenditure by mid- base than would otherwise be possible. All year and is on course to meet its full year target. owner-occupiers are generally exempt from Due to changes in the nature of the inter- stamp duty on new houses where the property is ventions supported by the productive sector oper- 125 sq. m. or less. First-time buyers are also ational programmes, performance over the exempt from stamp duty on second hand houses period of the national development plan appears up to the value of \190,500 and benefit, there- disappointing at just over 46% of profiled expen- after, from reduced rates on second hand proper- diture. However, the level of expenditure profiled ties up to \381,000 when compared to other pur- for this operational programme at the beginning chasers. It is not the practice to comment in the of the national development plan proved to be lead up to the annual budget and Finance Bill unrealistically high given the nature of industrial on the intention, or otherwise, to make changes development in recent years. in taxation. Both regional programmes have begun to per- form well with evidence of catch-up occurring Flood Relief. across a range of measures. Difficulties still exist in the tourism and agricultural sectors where 247. Mr. Durkan asked the Minister for Fin- demand for grant support has been less than ance the extent to which requests for funding for anticipated. The performance at the end of June the alleviation of flooding at various locations 2004 for the non-national roads, microenterprise throughout the country has been complied with; 253 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 254 and if he will make a statement on the matter. to the provision of this facility; and if he will make [30286/04] a statement on the matter. [30287/04] Minister of State at the Department of Finance Minister of State at the Department of Finance (Mr. Parlon): The Government is committed to a (Mr. Parlon): A revised brief was received from strategic flood management policy. In October, the Department of Justice, Equality and Law the Government approved the recommendations Reform which has increased the scale of the of the flood policy review group. This confirms Garda station. Negotiations are nearing com- the lead role of the Office of Public Works in pletion with Kildare County Council for the taking a strategic approach to flood management acquisition by the Commissioners of Public in the future and working in co-operation with Works of an additional portion of land required the relevant local authorities. The programme of for the development. On completion of these flood relief schemes will be implemented as negotiations a revised sketch scheme will be resources permit in the context of an integrated, issued to the Department of Justice, Equality and long-term strategy on flood management. The Law Reform for approval. strategy calls for considerable emphasis on non- structural flood management measures such as Price Inflation. flood warning systems, flood mapping, guidelines 249. Mr. Durkan asked the Minister for Fin- on development and formulation of catchment ance if he has identified the most likely causes of flood risk management plans to foster a catch- price increases in respect of goods or services ment-based approach to flood management. which are most likely to impact negatively on the Account will be taken of the need to prioritise economy but which are not reflected in the con- expenditure in the areas of greatest need and to sumer price index; and if he will make a state- be mindful of the implications of climate change. ment on the matter. [30288/04] While work has continued on the River Nore in Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): The direc- County Kilkenny and River Tolka schemes, the tor general of the Central Statistics Office has Office of Public Works has conducted feasibility sole responsibility for and is independent in studies to assess flood risk and to develop flood deciding the statistical methodology and pro- alleviation schemes in several areas throughout fessional standards to be used in compiling the the country prone to flooding. These studies have consumer price index. The latest consumer price been undertaken either by the Office of Public index release shows that the annual rate of Works engineering services or through external inflation in October was 2.7%. As a result, consultants and include such areas as Clonmel, inflation has averaged just 2.1% in the first ten County Tipperary, Mallow and Fermoy, County months of this year, compared to an average of Cork, Waterford city, Carlow town, Mornington, 3.8% in the same period last year. My Depart- County Meath, and Ennis County Clare. Other ment’s forecast for consumer price index inflation areas include Enniscorthy, County Wexford, in 2004, published in the economic review and Templemore, County Tipperary, Arklow, County outlook in August, is 2.2 %. This represents a sig- Wicklow, Piltown, County Kilkenny and Tullow, nificant moderation from the 3.5% rate of County Carlow. Feasibility and pre-feasibility increase in 2003. This moderation in the rate of studies will be completed for these areas. inflation is welcome. The Office of Public Works continues to work closely with local authorities in the development Social Insurance. and implementation of flood relief schemes. In 250. Mr. Stanton asked the Minister for Fin- the likelihood that further requests for flood ance , further to Question No. 200 of 17 Nov- relief studies will be made from various local ember 2004, the reason the annual surplus on the authorities following the recent floods, they will social insurance fund fell from \631 million in be considered by the Office of Public Works 2001 to \422 million in 2002 and to \255 million under new prioritisation criteria being developed in 2003; and if he will make a statement on the for all flood relief works, as recommended by the matter. [30318/04] flood policy review group. Minister for Finance (Mr. Cowen): The extent Garda Stations. to which the annual income of the social insurance fund is not required to meet benefit 248. Mr. Durkan asked the Minister for Fin- payments and administration costs in that year ance the position in regard to the provision of the represents the annual surplus of the fund. The promised new Garda station at Leixlip, County annual income and expenditure on the social Kildare; the progress made in this regard on an insurance fund in the period from 2001 to 2003 is annual basis since 1996; the remaining obstacles set out in the following table.

Surplus SIF Income — M % Increase on SIF expenditure — M % increase on Annual Surplus — M previous year previous year

2001 4307 3676 631 2002 4,798 11.4 4,376 19.1 422 2003 5,088 6.1 4,833 10.5 255 255 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 256

[Mr. Cowen.] licences. I am prepared, however, to keep the Over the period, the annual increases in expendi- matter under review and am open to any relevant ture exceeded the increase in income, hence the proposals whereby stakeholders benefiting from decline in the level of the annual surplus. Several any reduction in commercial catch might fund in factors gave rise to this situation. whole or in part any compensation arising. In Apart from changes in the level of insurable recent years the Department has supported a employment and earnings, several alterations in number of catchment-based set-aside schemes the rates and structure of PRSI occurred over this with matching funds through the regional fisher- period. In December 2000, there was a 0.7% ies boards. The Department is prepared to con- reduction in the employer rate of PRSI. In April tinue to support such proposals, subject to avail- 2001, employee PRSI rates were reduced by able Exchequer funding. The only context for set- 0.5%. The employer and self-employed contri- aside schemes will still be through an agreed local bution ceiling were also abolished that year. In scheme involving commercial fishermen and all March 2002, there was a further reduction of other stakeholders who stand to benefit from 1.25% in the highest employer PRSI rate. All increased spawning escapement. Should a these changes, given the timing of their imple- regional fisheries board bring forward developed mentation, would have a part-year impact in their proposals for a local catchment-based set-aside first year and a full year impact in subsequent scheme, the Department is prepared to consider years on the fund’s income. such a proposal provided that any matching funds The cost of the annual social welfare budget required would come from within the existing packages gave rise to year on year increases in allocations to the fisheries boards. expenditure. As with income above, there will also be relevant timing factors. The 2002 and 2003 Post Office Network. budget increases were applied with effect from 252. Mr. N. O’Keeffe asked the Minister for January and accordingly, the full year impact is Communications, Marine and Natural Resources set out in those years. However, the 2001 budget if measures will be put in place to computerise increases came into effect in April of that year rural post offices. [29967/04] and accordingly, the 2001 financial year contained only a part year cost of those increases. The full Minister for Communications, Marine and year cost of the 2001 budget rates increases were Natural Resources (Mr. N. Dempsey): The not fully reflected until the following 2002 finan- Government is committed to a viable and sus- cial year. In addition, there was an increase in tainable rural post office network providing a the number of people claiming benefits over the range of services to meet consumer needs. This period. For example, those recipients claiming commitment is illustrated by the Government unemployment benefit increased over the period injection of \12.7 million into the network in 2003 in question from around 59,900 in 2001 to 70,100 to facilitate modernisation measures. The in 2003, and there was also an increasing number Government has also strongly supported An Post of people entitled to a contributory social welfare initiatives such as the channelling of new utility pension, invalidity pension and disability benefit. and banking services through the network. In addition, An Post has introduced new service Fishing Industry Development. delivery models to improve access to post office 251. Mr. Ring asked the Minister for services. There are 1,000 automated post offices, Communications, Marine and Natural Resources 475 non- automated post offices, 160 postal agen- his proposals for a buy-out for drift and draft net cies and An Post has established 3,000 Post Point fishermen; his proposals for a set-a-side; his pro- outlets in retail premises of which 600 can be used posals to compensate these persons for the loss for bill payment. of their quota; and if he will make a statement on The automated network accounts for over 95% the matter. [29732/04] of An Post’s counter business. Up to 1,000 auto- mated offices transact 95% of counter business Minister of State at the Department of while 475 non-automated offices undertake 5% Communications, Marine and Natural Resources of business. This illustrates the level of business (Mr. Gallagher): The Government has consist- transacted by individual non-automated offices. ently ruled out buy-out as an effective means of The current level of automated coverage is con- achieving the restoration of salmon stocks and sidered by An Post to be extremely comprehen- instead promoted the application of quotas on sive by any objective standard and this level of commercial fishing and bag limits on angling to coverage makes it difficult to justify on either cus- achieve catch reductions as the best instrument tomer-service or economic ground the extension available to achieve this objective. No convincing of automation to all offices, regardless of their case has been advanced as to the public good that location or business volumes. would be acquired by the State in the context of Automation of the post office network was a publicly funded buy-out nor why stakeholders, completed in 1997. It is, therefore, only in excep- benefiting from increased numbers of salmon tional circumstances, such as an existing auto- entering the rivers, should not contribute in mated office closing and its equipment being whole or in part towards achieving that increase. transferred to a suitable neighbouring location As a result, I have no plans to introduce pro- which transacts significant volumes of welfare posals to purchase commercial salmon fishing business, that offices are automated today. The 257 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 258 core objective continues to be the retention of if there is medical evidence that mobile telephone access to post offices services in as many locations masts are injurious to health. [30168/04] as possible, in the manner which best meets con- sumer needs, whether services are provided via Minister for Communications, Marine and post office, postal agencies or the Post Point Natural Resources (Mr. N. Dempsey): There is network. no scientific medical evidence that mobile tele- phone masts are injurious to health. Fishing Industry Development. In recent years, more than 25,000 peer- reviewed studies into possible health effects of 253. Mr. M. Brady asked the Minister for non-ionising radiation and the class of electro- Communications, Marine and Natural Resources magnetic emissions associated with mobile phone the financial assistance available to fishermen for technology have been published. No definite cau- setting up local fishing co-operative societies. sal link has been proven between the emissions [30166/04] and any adverse health effect. Minister of State at the Department of Notwithstanding the overwhelmingly clean bill Communications, Marine and Natural Resources of health given to these technologies compared to (Mr. Gallagher): No financial assistance is avail- other environmental risks which our society able for the setting up of local fishermen’s co- willingly accepts, many countries, including operative societies. However, support is available Ireland, have adopted a precautionary approach. for existing co-operative societies from Bord Ias- Absence of proof of harm is not proof of absence caigh Mhara, under such measures as the sup- of harm. By consensus among many countries, porting measure programme, the market invest- guidelines are established for safe levels of ment programme and fish handling grants. I will exposure to various kinds of electromagnetic arrange for further information to be forwarded emissions. These guidelines are set at levels which to the Deputy in respect of these measures. Infor- are many times less than the experimental levels mation is also available on the Bord Iascaigh at which no adverse effects have been established. Mhara website. Ireland has adopted the guidelines established by the international commission on non-ionising Fisheries Protection. radiation protection, and participates in the work of the international committee on electromag- 254. Mr. M. Brady asked the Minister for netic safety, which sets standards in this area. Communications, Marine and Natural Resources All licensed telecommunications operators in if it is illegal to kill pike taken from lakes and Ireland are required by the terms of their licences rivers; and if so, the number of prosecutions. to observe the international commission on non- [30167/04] ionising radiation protection guidelines for Minister of State at the Department of limiting exposure of the public to electromagnetic Communications, Marine and Natural Resources emissions from their facilities. ComReg conducts (Mr. Gallagher): Under the Fisheries Acts, it is audit measurements to verify compliance with not illegal to kill pike taken from lakes and rivers. these limits. Ireland maintains relevant activity to The conservation of pike by-law No. 667 of 1990 ensure that public authorities have access to the however prohibits the taking or killing by any most up-to-date and relevant information in this person of more than one pike on any day and area, and steps have been taken to ensure that the taking or killing by any person of any pike these masts operate within limits which respected exceeding 3 kg. This by-law also prohibits a per- international bodies have deemed to provide pro- son having in his or her possession more than one tection for the public. dead whole pike or, alternatively, more than 1.5 kg in weight of pike flesh or parts. Separate by- Energy Resources. laws, Nos. 466 and 467 of 1949, in the Shannon region, permit nets to be used for the capture of 256. Mr. Cuffe asked the Minister for coarse fish, including pike, in Lough Ree and cer- Communications, Marine and Natural Resources tain other lakes of the Shannon system during a if he has an estimate of the total peat resources limited period each year. remaining in the State; and if he will make a state- Under the Fisheries Acts, primary responsi- ment on the matter. [30202/04] bility for the conservation and protection of Minister for Communications, Marine and inland fisheries stocks rests with the central and Natural Resources (Mr. N. Dempsey): Under the regional fisheries boards. It has not been possible Turf Development Acts, Bord na Mo´ na plc is to collate from the boards the information sought charged with the management, development and on the number of prosecutions initiated by the working of the bogs and other lands vested in the boards under these by-laws. I have however company. Bord na Mo´ na plc owns approximately asked the chief executive officer of the central 7% of the total peatland in Ireland. The esti- fisheries board to gather this information and to mated reserves of peat for energy in the owner- forward it directly to the Deputy. ship of the company is calculated at 45 million tonnes. Neither my Department nor Bord na Communications Masts. Mo´ na plc is in a position to provide estimates of 255. Mr. M. Brady asked the Minister for peat reserves in areas not in Bord na Mo´ na Communications, Marine and Natural Resources ownership. 259 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 260

Telecommunications Services. ered generating capacity to the electricity net- work. The group’s report, due before the end of 257. Mr. Wall asked the Minister for Communi- 2004, will form the basis of my future policy cations, Marine and Natural Resources the decisions in this area. reason a person (details supplied) in County Laois cannot be connected to broadband; and if he will make a statement on the matter. Telecommunications Services. [30254/04] 259. Mr. English asked the Minister for Communications, Marine and Natural Resources Minister for Communications, Marine and when a person (details supplied) in County Natural Resources (Mr. N. Dempsey): The pro- Meath will receive a telephone connection; the vision of broadband is a matter for the private reason it is taking so long; and if he will make a sector companies operating in a fully liberalised statement on the matter. [30314/04] market, regulated by ComReg. Several compan- ies are marketing broadband services in the Athy Minister for Communications, Marine and area. Broadband can be delivered by a number Natural Resources (Mr. N. Dempsey): I have no of technologies, including DSL, fibre optic cable, statutory function in this matter. It is an oper- coaxial cable, fixed wireless links and satellite. ational issue for the service provider concerned. My Department’s website, www.broadband.go- Responsibility for the regulation of the telecom- v.ie, lists nine companies offering DSL services munication service providers rests with the Com- and five companies offering satellite broadband mission for Communications Regulation which is services in Athy. an independent statutory body.

Electricity Generation. Human Rights Issues. 258. Mr. Durkan asked the Minister for 260. Mr. Kenny asked the Minister for Foreign Communications, Marine and Natural Resources Affairs if his attention has been drawn to the con- his policy in regard to the wind generated elec- cern surrounding the detention of a person tricity; if he has issued directives to the energy (details supplied) in Cuba; if he has raised this regulator or received communications therefrom matter with the Cuban authorities; if the matter in this regard; and if he will make a statement on has been discussed at European Union level; and the matter. [30276/04] if he will make a statement on the matter. [29689/04] Minister for Communications, Marine and Natural Resources (Mr. N. Dempsey): The pro- Minister for Foreign Affairs (Mr. D. Ahern): motion of renewable energy, of which wind Mr. Adolfo Fernandez Sainz, a journalist, is one energy is the predominant technology, is a key of 75 members of the peaceful opposition in priority of the Government. The 1999 Green Cuba, including other journalists, writers and Paper on sustainable energy established a target doctors arrested in March and April 2003 and to add 500 MW of new renewable energy based sentenced to prison terms of up to 28 years after electricity generating plant to the electricity net- a summary legal process that did not meet inter- work by 2005. This target has since increased to nationally accepted standards. Mr. Sainz was sen- 718 MW. tenced to 15 years and remains in custody, The wind resource is random and cannot although seven of the original 75 prisoners have increase or decrease the electricity generated in since been released on health grounds. I am immediate response to consumer demand. The aware of serious concerns regarding the con- current support target for wind powered projects ditions in which he and other prisoners of con- does not raise serious technical issues for system science are detained and family visits. stability. However planning for future pro- The Government’s concern regarding the grammes at increased penetration levels of wind detention and sentencing of these dissidents, powered electricity generating plant does raise including Mr. Sainz, was conveyed at the time to significant technical issues which must be the Cuban charge´ d’affaires at a meeting in the addressed in order to maintain system security for Department of Foreign Affairs. On 5 June 2003, electricity consumers. The Commission for Ireland and its partners in the European Union Energy Regulation, which is independent in the decided to respond to the grave violation of inter- discharge of its functions, is examining issues of national human rights standards involved by a immediate relevance regarding the grid code for range of measures including limiting bilateral wind powered generators. In May 2004, a renew- high level governmental visits to Cuba and invit- able energy development group, chaired by my ing dissidents to national day receptions offered Department, was established. The group, which by those EU member states with resident embass- includes CER participation, will advise on future ies in Havana. These measures remain in force options on policies, targets, programmes and sup- and the position of the dissident prisoners has port measures to develop the increased use of been discussed on a regular basis in the Council renewable energy in the electricity market to framework. On 14 June 2004, during the Irish 2010 and beyond. Presidency of the EU, the General Affairs and A major portion of the group’s work is to External Relations Council again called on the resolve the challenges arising from future Cuban Government to release immediately all increased connection of intermittent wind pow- those, like Mr. Sainz, who have been detained for 261 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 262 political reasons. The General Affairs and Exter- the human rights of all citizens. There will be nal Relations Council also reiterated that con- further discussion of these matters during the structive engagement remains the basis of the EU-China summit, scheduled to take place in The EU’s policy towards Cuba. Hague on 8 December 2004. I am aware of the I hope that the Cuban authorities will now claims made by the Irish Falun Dafa Association move to release Mr. Sainz and all other prisoners to which the Deputy refers. of conscience in Cuba. Such a move, which is imperative on human rights grounds, would also Asylum Applications. make a significant contribution to the resumption 264. Mr. M. Higgins asked the Minister for For- of a full dialogue between the EU and Cuba. eign Affairs if he has discussed with the Depart- ment of Justice, Equality and Law Reform, the State Visits. advice given by the UN High Commissioner for 261. Mr. Cuffe asked the Minister for Foreign Refugees regarding the way in which protection Affairs if his attention has been drawn to the fact is to be provided to Iraqi asylum seekers includ- that according to the Irish Falun Dafa Associ- ing those who have been rejected. [29784/04] ation, a person (details supplied) due to make an Minister for Foreign Affairs (Mr. D. Ahern): I official visit here in November 2004, took part in am aware of the advice of the UN High Com- the persecution of Falun Dafa practitioners in missioner for Refugees on the return of Iraqi asy- China; and if he will make a statement on the lum seekers. Asylum applications are assessed matter. [29710/04] within an independent statutory framework. The 262. Mr. Cuffe asked the Minister for Foreign advice of the UN High Commissioner for Refu- Affairs if he will be raising the persecution of per- gees on returns forms an important part of the sons (details supplied) with the Chinese Vice- assessment of cases. In the circumstances, I have Premier when he comes here in November 2004; not felt it necessary to discuss this matter with the and if he will make a statement on the matter. Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform. [29711/04] Arms Trade. 263. Mr. Cuffe asked the Minister for Foreign Affairs if he will be raising human rights 265. Mr. P. McGrath asked the Minister for violations in China with the Chinese Vice-Prem- Foreign Affairs his views on the embargo on the ier during his upcoming visit here; and if he will sale of arms by the EU to other countries; and make a statement on the matter. [29712/04] the countries to which this embargo applies. [30178/04] Minister for Foreign Affairs (Mr. D. Ahern): I propose to take Questions Nos. 261 to 263, inclus- 267. Mr. P. McGrath asked the Minister for ive, together. Foreign Affairs the future proposals for the lifting The Ta´naiste and I held official talks with the of the embargo on the sale of arms by the EU; Chinese Vice-Premier, Mr. Huang Ju, in Dublin the criteria that he would promote in assessing if Castle, on 16 November 2004. During our dis- this embargo should be lifted for particular coun- cussion on EU-China relations, I raised our con- tries; and if he will make a statement on the cerns over human rights with the vice-premier. I matter. [30180/04] also recalled that a number of specific issues were being addressed through the EU-China human Minister for Foreign Affairs (Mr. D. Ahern): I rights dialogue and that the Government looked propose to take Questions Nos. 265 and 267 forward to continued progress in this regard. together. The Chinese Vice-Premier informed me of the Sanctions or restrictive measures, including measures his Government is taking in the field of arms embargoes, are used by the European human rights, which included the addition of an Union as a policy instrument, either as auton- express provision on human rights to China’s con- omous EU sanctions or in implementing certain stitution earlier this year. He stated that China resolutions of the UN Security Council. As a wished to continue the regular EU-China human coercive non-military instrument, sanctions are rights dialogues and confirmed that China would generally employed to react to violations of inter- attend the next session of that dialogue, due to national law, violations of human rights and poli- be held in February 2005. China has recently cies that do not respect the rule of law and demo- upgraded its presence in the EU-China human cratic principles. rights dialogue to director-general level. EU arms embargoes are in place against Bos- The EU-China human rights dialogue, estab- nia and Herzegovina, Burma-Myanmar, China, lished in 1996, is the agreed formal framework the Democratic Republic of Congo, formerly through which the EU raises its concerns about Zaire, Iraq, Liberia, Sierra Leone, Somalia, individual human rights cases, including those of Sudan and Zimbabwe. This list is publicly avail- Falun Dafa practitioners, and more general able on the EU’s official website. The EU revises issues, such as the protection of freedom of its list of sanctions and other restrictive measures religion and expression, which have a particular against third countries, including arms embar- impact on practitioners of Falun Dafa. Ireland, goes, on a case by case basis, when it judges it together with our EU partners, will continue to appropriate to do so. In such cases, the EU takes encourage the Chinese authorities to respect fully into consideration all developments in a particu- 263 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 264

[Mr. D. Ahern.] tations to that effect. I expect the US authorities lar country since the arms embargo was imposed to ensure that its forces operate at all times in and decides whether these would warrant the lift- conformity with international law. ing of sanctions against that country. 269. Aengus O´ Snodaigh asked the Minister for For example, the General Affairs and External Relations Council, on 11 October 2004, took the Foreign Affairs if he has carried out any form of decision to lift the EU arms embargo against review of his decision to allow Shannon Airport Libya, which had been in place since 1986. In that to be used as a staging post by US military forces context, the Council took into particular con- for the war in Iraq; if not, if he will consider initi- sideration Libya’s announcement on 19 ating a review particularly in view of he refusal December 2003 that it would dismantle weapons of these same US forces to allow emergency of mass destruction programmes and the settle- humanitarian aid into the devastated city of Fal- ment reached in Tripoli on 3 September 2004 on luja to relieve the civilian population. [30308/04] compensation for dependants of victims of the 1986 Berlin discothe`que attack. The Council saw Minister for Foreign Affairs (Mr. D. Ahern): these developments as further proof of Libya’s The use of Shannon airport by the US military is readiness to change its past policies and of its a long-standing practice which has been in place commitment to responsible government. The for several decades. On 20 March 2003, following question of whether to lift the EU arms embargo an extensive debate, the Government decision to against China is under consideration within the maintain the availability of these facilities was ´ EU. In this regard, I draw the Deputy’s attention approved by Da´il Eireann. The US forces serving to my written reply of 19 October to Question in Iraq are part of the multinational force No. 211. operating at the request of the interim Iraqi Government. The presence of the multinational 266. Mr. P. McGrath asked the Minister for force in Iraq was authorised by the UN Security Foreign Affairs if the EU Council of Ministers Council in Resolution 1511 of 16 October 2003. and the European Commission discussed the This authorisation has been reaffirmed in Resol- embargo on the sale of arms to Libya; if it was ution 1546 of 8 June 2004. I expect the multi- agreed to lift this embargo; the date this decision national force and the interim Iraqi Government came into effect; and the position adopted by him operating in Falluja to do whatever is possible to on this important issue. [30179/04] allow the humanitarian needs of the people of Falluja to be addressed. Minister for Foreign Affairs (Mr. D. Ahern): The General Affairs and External Relations EU Funding. Council discussed the issue of the EU embargo on arms sales to Libya at its meeting on 11 270. Mr. Ferris asked the Minister for Arts, October, and decided to lift the embargo. Ireland Sport and Tourism if Tourism Ireland has agreed with our partners that it was important to received funding from the EU; and if so, the way recognise Libya’s decision to dismantle its wea- in which it was spent. [29930/04] pons of mass destruction programmes and its Minister for Arts, Sport and Tourism (Mr. agreement to compensate victims of a number of O’Donoghue): Tourism Ireland has not received terrorist attacks in which Libya had been impli- funding from the EU. cated. The EU arms embargo came to an end on 14 October. Arms sales to Libya continue to be Arts Funding. covered by the EU code of practice on arms sales. 271. Mr. Cuffe asked the Minister for Arts, Question No. 267 answered with Question Sport and Tourism if he has plans to provide No. 265. multi-annual funding for the arts. [30209/04] Minister for Arts, Sport and Tourism (Mr. Foreign Conflicts. O’Donoghue): The allocation of funding on a 268. Mr. Gormley asked the Minister for For- multi-annual basis is not compatible with the eign Affairs if he will make representations to the existing Estimates system, which operates on an US Government regarding the killing of an annual cycle. It is, therefore, not possible to pro- unarmed Iraqi in Falluja by an American solider vide funding on the basis suggested by the which was broadcast by American networks and Deputy. was in total contravention of the Geneva Conven- tion; and if he will make a statement on the Film Industry Development. matter. [30181/04] 272. Mr. Wall asked the Minister for Arts, Minister for Foreign Affairs (Mr. D. Ahern): Sport and Tourism the number of meetings he The US authorities have already announced an has had with Screen Producers Ireland about film investigation into the circumstances of the inci- production, television production and television dent in question, and the soldier involved has advertising of an international or national nature; been withdrawn from the area. In these circum- the results of such meetings; and if he will make stances, it is not necessary to make represen- a statement on the matter. [30245/04] 265 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 266

Minister for Arts, Sport and Tourism (Mr. In tandem with the Government’s national spa- O’Donoghue): Television production and adver- tial strategy, with its associated gateways and tising fall outside of my remit. With regard to film hubs, all the development agencies are working production, I and my officials maintain contact with State agencies and others to enhance the with the industry at a number of levels, of which attractiveness of individual regions. The strategy formal meetings are only a small part. I formally provides an important framework for the met Screen Producers Ireland, formerly known as achievement of this objective through the prior- Film Makers Ireland, on two occasions and am itisation of infrastructural development in the scheduled to meet with it again in January 2005. gateway and hub locations and the development I and my officials meet individual practitioners of magnets of attraction for investment. from the industry on an ongoing basis, both for- The county enterprise boards are actively co- mally and informally. These meetings serve to operating with the south and east and Border keep me and my officials abreast of the issues midlands and west regional authorities in that concern the industry, of their perspectives on developing indigenous microenterprises through- policy matters, and of their views on the most out the regions. A particular advantage of the appropriate way forward. county enterprise board system is that it delivers dispersed economic development throughout the Anti-Competitive Practices. State. Over 30,000 jobs have been created in 273. Mr. M. Brady asked the Minister for indigenous companies supported by the boards Enterprise, Trade and Employment the steps since their establishment in 1993. Enterprise being taken to tackle car price fixing in cases in Ireland offers a wide range of supports to which dealers are operating a cartel. [30151/04] indigenous industry, both financial and non-fin- ancial. These contain higher aid levels for Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employ- enterprises in the regions. ment (Mr. Martin): The Competition Act 2002 prohibits anti-competitive practices such as price 275. Mr. McGinley asked the Minister for fixing and the abuse of a dominant position. The Enterprise, Trade and Employment the number Competition Authority, an independent body, is of IDA supported jobs that were created in responsible for the enforcement of competition Donegal in 2001, 2002, 2003 and to date in 2004, law in the State. Accordingly, anyone with infor- respectively; the locations in which they were mation regarding anti-competitive practices created; and if he will make a statement on the should refer the matter directly to the authority matter. [29829/04] for investigation. The authority is investigating the car retail industry and recent media reports Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employ- indicate that it has raided various dealers in that ment (Mr. Martin): IDA Ireland is the agency regard. with statutory responsibility for the attraction of foreign direct investment to Ireland, including its Job Creation. regions and areas. There were 673 new IDA Ireland supported jobs created in Donegal in the 274. Mr. M. Moynihan asked the Minister for period 2001 to 2003, of which 353 were created in Enterprise, Trade and Employment if he has 2001, 179 were created in 2002 and 141 were plans to target industry and enterprise to rural created in 2003. This data is compiled from the Ireland and smaller towns by offering financial annual Forfa´s employment survey. County data incentives to do so. [29178/04] for 2004 will not be available until mid 2005. Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employ- These new jobs were created in County Donegal ment (Mr. Martin): Support for job creation and in the Letterkenny, Laghey, Buncrana and investment on a regional or local basis is a day- Donegal Town areas. to-day operational matter for the industrial These results were achieved against a back- development agencies. The agencies are actively ground of new challenges brought about by a promoting all areas for new investment and jobs combination of the recent global economic down, on an ongoing basis. IDA Ireland is actively mar- which resulted in less companies investing over- keting individual areas as a location for additional seas and fewer visiting Ireland. Other factors foreign direct investment through its network of included greatly increased pressures on high tech- local and overseas offices. Enterprise Ireland is nology companies to cut costs and find the most concentrating on the development of indigenous competitive location for specific products, ser- industries, with the 35 city and county enterprise vices and functions; the emergence of new alter- boards having primary responsibility for the native low cost locations for producing goods and regional promotion of indigenous industry in the services in eastern Europe, China, and India. I am microenterprise sector. Shannon Development confident that the strategies and policies being promotes the development of the indigenous pursued by IDA Ireland in County Donegal, industry sector in the Shannon region on behalf together with the ongoing commitment of of Enterprise Ireland and foreign direct invest- Government to regional development will con- ment in the Shannon Free Zone. All agencies are tinue to bear fruit in terms of delivering the also working with existing clients with a view to maximum possible level of additional jobs for helping them expand their activities. the county. 267 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 268

Unemployment Levels. number of major road improvements. The Government, along with the State development 276. Mr. McGinley asked the Minister for agencies, is committed to balanced regional Enterprise, Trade and Employment if his atten- development, particularly through the implemen- tion has been drawn to the serious unemployment tation of the national spatial strategy and the crisis in County Donegal; the reason the unem- Government’s decentralisation programme. The ployment rate in the county is four times the State development agencies will continue to work national unemployment average; the measures he together to promote County Donegal, to attract proposes to adopt to replace the thousands of investment and to foster job creation there. jobs that have been lost there during the past number of years; and if he will make a statement Company Closures. on the matter. [29830/04] 277. Mr. Connolly asked the Minister for Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employ- Enterprise, Trade and Employment his views on ment (Mr. Martin): I am conscious of the unem- the closure of a company (details supplied) in ployment situation in County Donegal, partic- County Monaghan with the loss of a total of 82 ularly following the closure announcements by jobs; his proposals to replace these jobs; and if he Unifi Ireland and Fruit of the Loom of their will make a statement on the matter. [29938/04] manufacturing plants there. Finding alternative employment for the workers affected is a priority Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employ- for me and the State development agencies under ment (Mr. Martin): Enterprise Ireland has been the auspices of my Department. working closely with Barford Meats Limited over IDA Ireland is committed to the development the past 18 months, with a view to identifying out- of the north-west region and continues to strive side investors who would bring much needed to secure new investment for Donegal. Both IDA investment to the business. At Enterprise Ireland and Enterprise Ireland work closely with Ireland’s urging, a business mentor was appointed their existing base of companies in the region. In in May 2003 to review the financial situation and its efforts to secure investment, IDA Ireland is provide strategic guidance to the company. working with Invest Northern Ireland, on a vir- Resulting from this involvement, the company tual cross-Border park which will involve joint embarked on a restructuring exercise in Sep- marketing efforts and planned improved telecom- tember 2004, whereby the various investors munications infrastructure on a cross-border including Enterprise Ireland were bought out by basis. Construction of the Letterkenny business the main promoter, Mr. Gene McGinn. This park has been completed and construction by ensured the company was fully owned by Mr. Donegal County Council to extend Letterkenny McGinn. It was thought at the time that the ring road to this park is well advanced. Work has restructured balance sheet would facilitate the now been completed on the provision of a second survival of the business. Enterprise Ireland 25,000 sq.ft. advance factory at the park and plan- expects to meet with Mr. McGinn shortly to dis- ning permission has been granted for a third cuss the future situation regarding the company. advance facility. Planning permission has been Enterprise Ireland believes there may be some obtained for a new facility at Ballyshannon and potential investors interested in acquiring the IDA has undertaken a significant amount of assets and business of Barford Meats Limited. development work recently on the site. In Enterprise Ireland will work with any new buyer addition to this, further land has been purchased and consider any new proposals to develop the in Buncrana and planning permission has been business. Enterprise Ireland activity in job obtained for a 20,000 sq.ft. factory. IDA is work- creation is focused on the retention and creation ing with a local private developer in the provision of new jobs in existing companies, and on the of advance space within this development. creation of new jobs by supporting entrepreneurs Enterprise Ireland works with companies in to set up high potential start-up companies. IDA County Donegal and in the north west to assist Ireland is actively marketing County Monaghan them grow their sales and exports and improve on an ongoing basis as a location for foreign innovation in order that they can compete on direct investment, through its network of over- world markets. Enterprise Ireland is encouraging seas offices, in order to secure new investment these companies to adopt new technologies and and jobs for the area. Regional locations can suf- to move up the value chain. Its range of supports fer badly from the loss of one industry and sub- includes strategy development, production and stantial work is required to enhance such operations, marketing, human resources develop- locations to make them more attractive and com- ment, finance and research and development. In petitive. IDA Ireland is working closely with local conjunction with the ongoing work of these agen- authorities and third level colleges to deliver the cies, other issues need also to be addressed to best solution. promote employment creation in the north west. A representative from the FA´ S office in Dun- These include the development of infrastructure dalk, together with a representative of the local in the area, in particular roads, water, electricity enterprise service, met with the local shop stew- and gas supply, air access and broadband ard and a member of the management of Barford communications. Recent developments include Meats Limited. Approximately 34 members of the provision of funding for the Letterkenny the workforce were spoken to, and advised of the water supply scheme, the approval of a feasibility procedures to follow. A list of the current job vac- study grant for the extension of the natural gas ancies in the area was supplied together with pipeline from Derry to Letterkenny and a appropriate registration forms. Individual inter- 269 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 270 views are due to take place on 22, 23 and 29 Nov- approximately \35 million in 2003. The strategy ember 2004, in the offices of the Department of also aims to progress the implementation of the Social and Family Affairs, Ardee Road, Carrick- strategy and plan for the electronics sector, macross, County Monaghan. agreed by the Enterprise Ireland board in 2001. The live register figure for County Monaghan The strategy encompasses export development, published by the Central Statistics Office for scale, competitiveness, technology development, October 2004 is 2,271, a decrease of 276 from new business sectors such as photonics, regional October 2003. The live register, though not an development, infrastructure and funding. accurate measure for unemployment as it IDA Ireland, through its information includes others in receipt of social welfare pay- communications technology division, and net- ments, is nonetheless a useful indicator of the work of overseas offices, is working to secure economic situation in an area. The State agencies additional investment in Ireland from both new continue to make their best efforts to bring new target companies, and its exiting client base, with investment, and jobs to County Monaghan. a view to creating new employment opportunities within the sector. Employment in IDA supported Industrial Development. overseas companies within the information 278. Ms Enright asked the Minister for communications technology sector over the last Enterprise, Trade and Employment if he has car- five years was 45,651 in 1999, 52,624 in 2000, ried out an evaluation of the employment oppor- 46,513 in 200, 43,660 in 2002 and 41,459 in 2003. tunities in the electronic engineering and microe- The recent global economic downturn impacted lectronics sector; if there has been a decline in heavily on corporate information technology employment in these sectors; and if he will make spending, and resulted in significant global job a statement on the matter. [29939/04] losses across the information communications Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employ- technology sector. Job losses in Ireland’s infor- ment (Mr. Martin): Electronics and microelec- mation communications technology sector were tronics is a sub-sector of the information disproportionately lower than those experienced communications technology sector, which was in other countries. reviewed as part of the Forfa´s technology fore- FA´ S has not carried out a study of these sectors sight report in 1999. Employment in Enterprise in recent times. The fourth report of the expert Ireland-supported companies classified as being group on future skill needs, published in autumn sub-sectors of electronics and including microe- 2003, included chapters on information communi- lectronics, fell by 5% to 12,600 between 2002 and cations technology skills and engineering skills. 2003 and is expected to remain at this number for Information communications technology skills the remainder of 2004. relate to both the hardware and software parts of Employment and wealth creating opportunities the information communications technology sec- for indigenous clients in electronics are under tor including electronic engineering and microe- continuous review at Enterprise Ireland. To lectronics. The information communications tech- maximise the potential of companies in the elec- nology sector has been a key focus of the expert tronics and microelectronics sector, Enterprise group on future skills needs, over recent years. Ireland is focused on supporting activities, includ- The Government has responded positively to the ing the development of the export revenue reports of the group by increasing significantly stream of client companies, by structured direct the provision of computer and engineering engagements with the Enterprise Ireland network courses within the third level sector, as well as a of overseas offices. Other activities include acce- variety of activities in primary and second level lerating the competitiveness and technology schools through the information communications development of key client companies; increasing technology investment fund. the number of sub-supply companies with inter- The expert group’s 2003 report estimated that national reach and overseas presence, especially employment in the information communications in Europe and the CEE; driving the development technology sector would grow by 11% across the of proprietary products in sub-supply companies sector from 2004 to 2010. Microelectronics design using the various Enterprise Ireland, research and development support and incentive programmes; is an area of high growth potential, and as a sig- driving the development of the photonics indus- nificant source of potential demand for degree try in Ireland in line with the agreed initiatives graduates in electronic engineering. Significant as set out in the Enterprise Ireland strategy for growth is expected in the international delivery of 2002-07. services over the Internet and mobile networks. This strategy includes supporting research and Mixed trends are expected in electronic hardware development from basic research through to com- and systems, with lower value added activities mercialisation; encouraging the start up of pho- likely to continue to migrate out of Ireland. tonics-based companies; exploitation of the tech- However, some areas of high-end manufacturing nology in existing companies; facilitating are expected to grow along with a variety of back- collaboration across the sector; and branding up, support and research and development activi- Ireland as a centre of excellence in photonics. In ties. While employment in the information Ireland, the photonics industry is still in its communications technology sector has fallen in infancy, with approximately 12 indigenous pure recent years, Ireland has performed better than play photonics companies, all Enterprise Ireland most in terms of restricting the impact of the glo- client companies, with a combined turnover of bal downturn on employment levels here. 271 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 272

Local Employment Service. tiveness fund 2003, which had a fund of \10 mill- ion, nine companies in Waterford were approved 279. Ms O’Sullivan asked the Minister for a total of approximately \1.3 million in support Enterprise, Trade and Employment when he of projects. expects the Clare local employment service to recommence operations; and if he will make a As part of its regional development role, statement on the matter. [30171/04] Enterprise Ireland works with other agencies in the county to develop the business infrastructure. Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employ- Enterprise Ireland also works closely with the ment (Mr. Martin): A review of the labour institutes of technology to encourage industry market needs of the Clare region, undertaken by and third level partnerships in the regions in FA´ S in the context of the closure of Clare local order to increase the level of technology used by employment service, recommended the establish- Irish companies, helping them to add value to ment of a new service. In the light of this recom- their products and services. Under this initiative mendation discussions took place between FA´ S Enterprise Ireland has approved over \1.4 million regional management in the mid west and the from the beginning of 2003 to date for such pro- board of management of Eirı´ Corca Baiscinn, an jects. Enterprise Ireland infrastructural projects ADM funded group. The FA´ S regional director include the community enterprise centres and for the area is reviewing a proposal received from incubation facilities in the colleges. Eirı´ Corca Baiscinn and discussions are ongoing The development of community-based between FA´ S regional management and Eirı´ enterprise centres is a crucial part of the drive to Corca Baiscinn regarding the details of the create new regional enterprise through the pro- proposal. vision of infrastructural facilities to support the establishment and expansion of microenterprises Job Losses. through local community participation. Enterprise Ireland provided over \1 million in 280. Mr. O’Shea asked the Minister for funding in support of the development of com- Enterprise, Trade and Employment if, in view of munity enterprise centres in County Waterford recent job losses in the manufacturing sector in located in Waterford city, Dunhill, Cappoquin, the Waterford constituency, he will set up a task Lismore and Portlaw. All the centres are now force for the Waterford constituency to assess the fully constructed, apart from the Portlaw centre, situation in manufacturing industry to make which is to be reviewed by a new local committee. recommendations for the creation of new jobs and the preservation of existing jobs; and if he Enterprise Ireland has formed close links with will make a statement on the matter. [30172/04] Waterford Institute of Technology and other col- leges in the region, such as the Institute of Tech- Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employ- nology Carlow and the Tipperary institute, in ment (Mr. Martin): While job losses have developing programmes that are likely to boost occurred in County Waterford in the indigenous enterprise and business growth. Enterprise manufacturing sector over the past year, such as Ireland funds eligible participants to enable them Nypro and Waterford Crystal, employment in the to spend one year in developing their businesses indigenous sector has remained strong overall. In with expertise from the colleges. Recruitment is 2003 there were 5,907 people employed in now complete for the 2004-05 programme, for Enterprise Ireland client companies. Over 90% which 25 candidates have been selected, a of this figure are engaged in manufacturing activi- number of whom are eligible for Enterprise ties, showing an increase of 4.8% in employment Ireland support. Enterprise Ireland is a partner over the previous five years. This represents a with Waterford Institute of Technology and the strong position compared to the national trend in five rural county enterprise boards of the south manufacturing industry. In this regard, I refer the east in the EnAct programme. EnAct is an innov- Deputy to the Forfa´s employment survey 2003. ative programme developed by the Waterford In terms of job creation, Enterprise Ireland Institute of Technology through European fund- activity is focused on the creation of new jobs ing provided under the innovative actions pro- through supporting entrepreneurs setting up new gramme that aims to develop the management high potential start-up companies, the retention capabilities of microenterprises in the south east. and creation of new jobs in existing companies Some 18 companies are participating on the pro- and in enhancing the innovation capability of gramme and it will be completed by the end of Ireland at a national and regional level through December 2004. support of research in companies and third level There are no plans at present for the establish- institutions. ment of a task force for County Waterford. Since January 2003 Enterprise Ireland has However, all of the key players, which might be approved over \7.5 million in direct support to involved in such a task force, meet on a regular companies in Waterford and paid over \6.5 mill- basis as members of the city and county develop- ion. These supports are designed to sustain exist- ment boards and of the economic working groups ing businesses and support companies in of each board. Enterprise Ireland and IDA developing their businesses. Enterprise Ireland Ireland are available and willing to participate in also works with companies on competitiveness any new initiative for the county. Net employ- issues and under the Enterprise Ireland competi- ment in IDA Ireland supported companies grew 273 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 274 by 972 people in the period 2000 to 2003, which Clonmel will have a positive benefit for the represented a 20.69% increase over that period. entire county. The main increase in employment came from Responsibility for the provision of industrial companies such as AOL, IS, Sun Life, FS, Gen- property solutions within the mid-west region lies zyme Pharmaceutical and Guhring Engineering with Shannon Development. IDA Ireland works and Construction. County Waterford is also closely with Shannon Development in the pro- increasing its proportion of employment in com- motion and marketing of these tailored property parison to other counties in the south-east region solutions, throughout the mid-west. These include and now accounts for 52% of all employment the National Technology Park in Limerick and arising from overseas investment in the region. the Tipperary technology park in Thurles, which As the gateway location for the south-east is part of the Shannon development knowledge region, IDA Ireland is seeking to develop Water- network. Five companies operate out of the ford city as a first class location for overseas Thurles technology park, four of which are based investment with the necessary infrastructure, in the incubator InnovationWorks. These com- skills availability and support services capable of panies are involved in e-commerce, digital cin- attracting investment into County Waterford and ema, software development and health and the entire region. A key part of IDA Ireland safety. The customer services division of Cantrell strategy is to work with existing clients to con- and Cochrane also recently moved into a 5,000 tinue to re-invest in their sites in the county. In sq. ft. unit, retaining 26 jobs in Thurles. Shannon addition, IDA Ireland is continuing to actively Development has also initiated the establishment market its new business and technology park on of a Thurles marketing group with representa- 70 acres on the Cork Road through its network tives of Thurles Town Council, the Tipperary of overseas offices. Some 25,000 sq. ft. of high institute, Leader, the county enterprise board and quality office space is available in the advance Thurles Chamber of Commerce to promote the office building on the park. Private and IDA attractiveness of Thurles as an investment Ireland owned manufacturing space in the main location. industrial estate is also actively marketed as it The further development of the Tipperary becomes available. The State agencies are making technology park by Shannon Development will every effort to bring new investment and employ- provide the focus for IDA Ireland’s marketing ment opportunities to County Waterford. effort in north County Tipperary. Through its strategic competitiveness programme, IDA Job Creation. Ireland is working with the existing base of com- panies in the mid-west region with a view to sup- 281. Mr. Lowry asked the Minister for porting them in broadening their activities in Enterprise, Trade and Employment his views on Ireland at a functional level. The objective is to whether there is an employment crisis in the mid- deepen each company’s embeddedness in Ireland west region and in north County Tipperary in through research and development, increased particular; his proposals for dealing with this crisis technology and by securing an European, Middle and for encouraging foreign and indigenous East and African or global mandate. investment to promote job creation in north Tipperary; and if he will make a statement on the Although the primary focus on attracting for- matter. [30217/04] eign direct investment into the mid-west is on ser- vice related activity, manufacturing can still play Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employ- an important role in the region as is evidenced by ment (Mr. Martin): IDA Ireland has statutory Taro Pharmaceutical’s decision to locate in responsibility for the attraction of foreign direct Roscrea. Shannon Development has acquired a investment to the mid-west region, except for the 29 acre site in Roscrea to develop a business park. Shannon Free Zone, which falls within the remit It is envisaged that the park will be attractive, of Shannon Development. Shannon Develop- because of its location adjacent to the N7 and to ment is also responsible for supporting indigen- office, logistics and industrial enterprises. The ous enterprises in the mid-west region. The six main strategy behind the park is to capitalise on city and county enterprise boards located in the Roscrea’s excellent central Ireland location for region also help develop indigenous enterprise both foreign direct investment and indigenous potential and stimulate economic activity at industry or for companies that might wish to relo- local level. cate to the less congested Shannon region. Plan- The total number of jobs in IDA Ireland and ning permission has been received and external Shannon Development client companies for the infrastructure works are in the process of being three years 2001, 2002 and 2003 was 35,096, provided. 31,848 and 30,805 respectively. While this shows Shannon Development, in association with a decline in overall employment, the agencies local authorities in the Shannon region, including assisted in the creation of 2,468 new jobs in the north County Tipperary, is also spearheading the region in 2001, 1,899 in 2002 and 1,719 in 2003. drive to bring high speed Internet access to towns This performance must be seen against a back- in the region. Thurles, Nenagh, and Roscrea are ground of a difficult external economic envir- scheduled as priority towns for phase two of the onment. The recent decision by Guidant Corpor- advanced broadband roll-out programme which ation to significantly expand its operation in should convey significant advantage on those 275 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 276

[Mr. Martin.] answer to Question No. 70 on Tuesday, 16 Nov- towns, in terms of attracting foreign direct invest- ember 2004. ment and indigenous industry. Proposed Legislation. 282. Mr. Kehoe asked the Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment the number 284. Mr. Crowe asked the Minister for of visits which IDA Ireland and Enterprise Enterprise, Trade and Employment if a decision Ireland have made to a factory (details supplied) has been made on the trade union legislation in County Wexford since it was built. [30253/04] being considered in his office; and the cause of the delay in bringing the proposed legislation to Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employ- the Houses of the Oireachtas. [30306/04] ment (Mr. Martin): IDA Ireland which is the Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employ- agency with statutory responsibility for the attrac- ment (Mr. Martin): At present, there are no legis- tion of foreign direct investment, and Enterprise lative proposals in my Department relating to Ireland which is concentrating on indigenous trade unions. industry, that they are actively marketing the fac- tory to potential investors. A profile of the facility Unemployment Levels. has been circulated to IDA Ireland’s overseas offices informing them of its competitive rental 285. Mr. Crowe asked the Minister for rate in comparison to locations like County Enterprise, Trade and Employment if he accepts Dublin. There have been two site visits from that employment figures for a number of housing potential overseas investors since completion of estates in the Tallaght area where the clusters of the advance factory facility two years ago. long-term unemployed are unacceptable; and if Enterprise Ireland has reported that the demand he has any new initiatives to overcome unemploy- for factory space in the south east has been very ment in those areas. [30307/04] slow over the past three years. The agency has Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employ- brought three groups to view the facility over the ment (Mr. Martin): Sustainable reductions in past two years. Ultimately decisions regarding unemployment are a key priority in the Govern- where to locate a project, including what areas to ment’s national employment action plan. My visit are taken by the investors. efforts, and those of the state agencies under the aegis of my Department, are directed towards this 283. Mr. Durkan asked the Minister for end. FA´ S, through its three employment service Enterprise, Trade and Employment the Depart- offices, provides a vocational guidance and ment which provides funding to FA´ S whether referral service to all jobseekers in the Tallaght directly or indirectly; if the said Department will area. To date, this year, 1,192 unemployed people provide sufficient funds to that body to facilitate have been referred to FA´ S under this initiative. the restoration of various schemes discontinued In the case of the five high unemployment due to inadequacy of funding; and if he will make areas of Tallaght, Fettercairn, Brookfield, Jobs- a statement on the matter. [30278/04] town and Kilinarden, FA´ S is devoting concen- trated resources to clients in these areas by plac- Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employ- ing them on top of the training course waiting ment (Mr. Martin): There are three related ´ lists. They are also given preference under the employment schemes operated by FAS to combat high supports process. FA´ S has indicated that 16 unemployment, namely the social economy pro- clients a week from the five areas are interviewed gramme, job initiative and community employ- and offered support. At present 64 clients are ment schemes. These programmes are funded by undergoing training or career guidance. As a Exchequer and national training fund allocations further measure early school leavers in the seven provided by my Department. The allocation to schools in the area are contacted by FA´ S and all FA´ S employment schemes in 2004 was \366 \ invited to attend a guidance interview to discuss million of which 351 million was earmarked to training and employment opportunities. provide 25,000 places on the three related pro- grammes for the unemployed. This means there Social Welfare Appeals. has been no reduction in the level of participation as compared with 2003. 286. Mr. O’Dowd asked the Minister for Social The 2005 allocation for FA´ S employment and Family Affairs the number and category of schemes is \382 million, an increase of 4.3% over appeals made to the superintendent community 2004. Funding will be adequate to allow FA´ S welfare officer in each county in the North maintain existing levels of service on the three Eastern Health Board area in the past five years; programmes at 25,000 places. The breakdown of the numbers granted and refused and sub- funding between the various programmes will be sequently appealed to the chief appeals officer in an operational matter for FA´ S. Decisions on the the North Eastern Health Board; and if he will funding of individual projects within these pro- make a statement on the matter. [29737/04] grammes will also be taken by FA´ S as part of its Minister for Social and Family Affairs (Mr. day-to-day operational responsibilities. In doing Brennan): The supplementary welfare allowance so it will observe the changes to the schemes I scheme is administered by health boards on announced on 10 November and outlined in behalf of my Department. Within each board, the 277 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 278 scheme is administered by a superintendent and to the chief appeals officer of the social welfare community welfare officers. The role of the appeals office if the appellant is not satisfied with superintendent community welfare officer relates the outcome of their appeal to the health board’s to the determination and review of claims and to appeals office. the supervision of community welfare officers. Statistics are not available in any health board Superintendent community welfare officers have area on the number or type of cases referred to no formal role in a health board’s appeals process individual superintendent community welfare for this scheme. In instances where a person is officers for guidance and decision. Details of the dissatisfied with the outcome of his or her appli- number of supplementary welfare allowance cation for supplementary welfare allowance, he appeals dealt with by the appeals officer in the or she has the right to appeal the decision to the North Eastern Health Board from 1999 to the health board’s appeals officer, usually a senior end of September 2004 are set out in the follow- manager within the health board. With the excep- ing tables. Supplementary Welfare Allowance tion of decisions relating to exceptional needs appeals in North Eastern Health Board 1999 to payments, which are issued at the discretion of end September 2004. Breakdown by category is each health board, a further appeal may be made not available in respect of 1999 and 2000.

Granted Refused Total

1999 11 62 73 2000 9 90 99

Supplementary welfare appeals in North Eastern Health Board 2001.

Granted Refused Total

Back to School Clothing and Footwear Allowance 0 38 38 Rent Supplement 3 18 21 Mortgage Interest Supplement 0 14 14 Basic SWA 2 11 13 Exceptional / urgent needs payments 3 21 24 Diet Supplement 1 2 3

Total 9 104 113

Supplementary welfare appeals in North Eastern Health Board 2002.

Granted Refused Total

Back to School Clothing and Footwear Allowance 7 29 36 Rent Supplement 2 18 20 Mortgage Interest Supplement 0 7 7 Basic SWA 1 5 6 Exceptional / urgent needs payments 1 15 16 Diet Supplement 1 3 4

Total 12 82 94

Supplementary welfare appeals in North Eastern Health Board 2003.

Granted Refused Total

Back to School Clothing and Footwear Allowance 8 33 41 Rent Supplement 4 29 33 Mortgage Interest Supplement 1 4 5 Basic SWA 0 17 17 Exceptional / urgent needs payments 1 7 8 Diet Supplement 0 1 1

Total 14 91 105 279 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 280

Social Welfare Benefits. as Christmas bonus and medical card regardless of earnings. 287. Mr. R. Bruton asked the Minister for Fuel allowance, back to school clothing and Social and Family Affairs the estimated cost of footwear allowance and diet supplement, are sub- extending the free schemes from age 66 to age 65; ject to the \317.43 income limit. Rent or mort- and if such a move has been assessed as a policy gage interest supplement is also subject to the option by him. [29679/04] limit, and is paid over a four year period with Minister for Social and Family Affairs (Mr. tapered rate of 75% in year one, 50% in year two, Brennan): The household benefits package, and 25% in years three and four. However, par- which comprises the electricity-gas allowance, ticipants may opt to be assessed under the stan- telephone allowance and television licence dard rules if it is financially more favourable. schemes, is generally available to people living I will continue to monitor the scheme to ensure permanently in the State, aged 66 years or over, that it continues to assist those furthest from the who are in receipt of a social welfare type pay- labour market to gain a foothold into sustainable ment or who fulfil a means test. employment or self employment. Any further The package is also available to carers and changes to the above initiatives would have to be people with disabilities under the age of 66 who considered in the light of competing priorities and are in receipt of certain welfare-type payments. available resources. People aged over 70 years of age can qualify 289. Mr. Howlin asked the Minister for Social regardless of their income or household compo- and Family Affairs if current rules enable the sition. Widows and widowers aged from 60 to 65 award of rent subsidy to an elderly Irish citizen, whose late spouses had been in receipt of the currently residing in the UK, who is in poor household benefit package retain that entitlement health and has very limited means, if he or she to ensure that households do not suffer a loss of returns here and secures private rented accom- entitlements following the death of a spouse. In modation; and if he will make a statement on the the time available it has not been possible to cost matter. [29754/04] the Deputy’s proposal. This estimate will be com- municated to him as soon as possible. A range of Minister for Social and Family Affairs (Mr. proposals has been made to extend the free Brennan): The supplementary welfare allowance schemes to other groups. These are kept under scheme, which is administered by health boards review in the context of the objectives of the on behalf of my Department, provides for the scheme and budgetary resources. payment of a weekly or monthly supplement in respect of rent to eligible people. Entitlement to 288. Mr. F. McGrath asked the Minister for rent supplement depends on a number of factors: Social and Family Affairs if he will take action (a) that applicants are habitually resident in the regarding the threshold on household income for State; (b) they have a genuine housing need retention of secondary benefits on back to work which cannot be provided from another source, schemes; and if he will make a statement on the and (c) they satisfy a means test. A person in the matter. [29720/04] circumstances described by the Deputy would not be precluded from receiving rent supplement. Minister for Social and Family Affairs (Mr. The habitual residence condition introduced in Brennan): The back to work allowance scheme, May 2004 and the new rent supplement eligibility which was introduced in September 1993, is part rules introduced in January 2004 do not make of my Department’s programme of initiatives such a person ineligible for rent supplement. designed to assist long term unemployed people, However, it is not possible to give a definitive lone parents and other social welfare recipients position on entitlement until the person con- to return to the active labour force. There are two cerned applies for rent supplement in Ireland and strands to the scheme, the back to work allow- a detailed assessment of his or her situation is ance for employees, and the back to work made by the relevant health board. enterprise allowance for self employment. Partici- 290. Mr. M. Moynihan asked the Minister for pants retain a tapered rate of their qualifying pay- Social and Family Affairs the details of the ment over three years, or four years if taking up arrangement of his Department in treating self employment. They also retain any secondary parents differently to non-parents in assessing benefits they were in receipt of prior to partici- income from casual unemployment assistance pation, subject to, in some instances, the gross claims whereby the current arrangement allows a household income level remaining under \317.43 disregard of \12.70 per day for non-parents, but per week. Gross household income includes none for parents; and the basis for such an appli- spouse-partner’s income but allows for PRSI and cation; and his plans to address this anomaly. reasonable travel expenses. From 6 April 2000, [29182/04] back to work allowance payment and family income supplement are disregarded for the pur- Minister for Social and Family Affairs (Mr. poses of the \317.43 gross weekly household Brennan): Legislation provides that where a per- income limit. Participants on the back to work son works for up to three days a week either on allowance scheme retain secondary benefits such a casual or part-time basis, earnings are assessed 281 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 282 at 60% for unemployment assistance purposes. In payment of deserted wife’s benefit, provided addition, persons without children are allowed a earnings do not exceed \17,776.33 a year. \12.70 disregard for each day worked, with the The scheme was closed to new applications balance of earnings assessed at 60%. The current with effect from 2 January 1997 on the introduc- arrangements for assessment of casual and part- tion of the one parent family payment scheme time means came into force in November 1996. under which an eligible parent with dependent Prior to this, payment was only made in respect children is entitled to payment irrespective of of days in the week on which a person was unem- gender or the circumstances that gave rise to the ployed, with one sixth of the weekly means lone parenthood. Lone parents are encouraged assessment being deducted from each daily UA under the scheme to maximise their income from payment. No payment was made in respect of any different sources by availing of the exemption of day of employment, irrespective of the level of earnings and maintenance payments in assessing daily earnings. This practice could prove to be a means. considerable disincentive to taking up part-time Lone parents may earn up to \146.50 per week or casual employment. without affecting their payment. Earnings above While many people who were in receipt of UA this limit are assessed at 50%, up to a maximum and working casually or part-time stood to gain of \293.00 per week. Lone parents are also eli- significantly under the new system, those without gible to avail of the full range of employment sup- qualified child dependants would have lost a large port schemes operated by my Department. part of their weekly UA payment. For this The schemes for deserted wives under social reason, a special daily disregard of \12.70 — £10 insurance have been retained to the extent that at the time — was introduced to protect their existing entitlements already acquired in August payments. 1992, when the earnings limit was introduced for With the introduction of the new assessments new claimants, and in 1997, when the one parent in 1996, it was envisaged that some 10,500 casual- family payment scheme was introduced, have part-time workers would benefit financially. Also, been preserved. All new claimants, irrespective of these simplified arrangements made it easier for gender, who seek income support as lone parents, people to see for themselves the advantages of are treated equally. taking up part-time or casual employment, as opposed to remaining fully unemployed. The Social Welfare Appeals. question of changes in the assessment of means from casual or part-time earnings would be a 292. Mr. Ring asked the Minister for Social matter for consideration in a budgetary context and Family Affairs when an appeal for carers and in the context of priorities generally. allowance will be finalised for a person (details supplied) in County Mayo. [29796/04] 291. Mr. Perry asked the Minister for Social and Family Affairs if a person who is entitled to Minister for Social and Family Affairs (Mr. the deserted wife allowance is allowed to enter Brennan): The person’s application for carer’s employment; when the legislation was changed to allowance was disallowed by a deciding officer on assess earnings from income; and if he will make the grounds that full-time care and attention was a statement on the matter. [29787/04] not being provided by the person concerned. The person concerned appealed against this decision to the social welfare appeals office. Following her Minister for Social and Family Affairs (Mr. letter of appeal, the case was referred back to my Brennan): Deserted wife’s allowance is a means- department for further investigation. When inves- tested payment made to women who have no tigations are complete, the matter will receive dependent children, who were deserted by their further consideration by my Department. husband and who do not satisfy the contribution Under social welfare legislation decisions in conditions for deserted wife’s benefit. Deserted relation to claims must be made by deciding wife’s allowance was closed to new applications officers and appeals officers. These officers are with effect from 2 January 1997 when the one- statutorily appointed and I have no role in regard parent family payment was introduced. In to making such decisions. assessing means for the purposes of the allow- ance, account is taken of income from savings, Social Welfare Benefits. investments, property and employment. Deserted wife’s benefit is a social insurance payment made 293. Ms Lynch asked the Minister for Social to a woman deserted by her husband. Entitlement and Family Affairs the amount of his Depart- to payment is conditional on satisfying contri- ment’s Estimates which has been overpaid to bution conditions based on the social insurance recipients of the one parent family payment record of either the wife or her husband. An allowance who have returned to employment in earnings limit was introduced for deserted wife’s the years 2001, 2002 and 2003; his views on benefit as and from 31 August 1992. The limit, whether his Department should improve its noti- which applied only to new claims after that date, fication or early warning system to persons in this is currently \12,697.38 a year, gross earnings. category to ensure that overpayments do not Where earnings are in excess of \12,697.38 a year, occur; and if he will make a statement on the there may be entitlement to a reduced rate of matter. [29827/04] 283 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 284

Minister for Social and Family Affairs (Mr. In addition to those on approved schemes, any- Brennan): The total amount of overpayments one who has been unemployed for 12 months or raised to date in respect of one parent family pay- more and who moves from a welfare payment to ment cases for the tax years 2001, 2002 and 2003 full-time open market employment may retain is \23.2 million. A breakdown for individual tax rent supplement on the tapered retention basis years is not available. Recipients of one parent outlined above. family payments are obliged to notify my Depart- Participants in the back to work scheme and ment when there is a change in their circum- community employment can opt to be assessed stances, for example, when their earnings under either standard supplementary welfare increase. Overpayments may arise where ben- allowance rules or the retention arrangements eficiaries have failed to notify my Department of outlined above and will be entitled to receive pay- an increase in their weekly earnings. Applicants ment under the more favourable option in their are advised of this requirement when their pay- case. Under standard assessment rules rent sup- ment is initially awarded. The notice is also plements are calculated to ensure that an eligible included on payable order books. person, after the payment of rent, has an income Lone parent customers who are paid elec- equal to the rate of basic supplementary welfare tronically are notified each year of the budget allowance appropriate to his or her their family increases and included in the notification is the circumstances, less a minimum contribution, cur- list of conditions for the continued receipt of the rently \13, which each recipient is required to pay payment. from his or her own resources. Up to \50 in In addition, my Department takes other oppor- respect of additional income from part-time tunities to inform customers of the need to notify employment is disregarded in the means test thus it of any changes in circumstances, for example ensuring that a person is better off as a result of in the recently published customer charter. The taking up such an opportunity. Any amount of charter is on display in public offices and is avail- family income supplement in payment is also dis- able on my Department’s website. regarded. A new initiative was announced by Govern- 294. Mr. Cregan asked the Minister for Social ment in July of this year whereby local authorities and Family Affairs the situation with respect to will progressively assume responsibility for meet- persons on rent allowance; if it is reduced on a ing long-term housing needs including those of gradual basis, if a person or adult children can people dependent on rent supplement for 18 take up full or part-time work; and if the situation months or longer. These new rental accommo- changes when responsibility for a recipient of this dation arrangements will see local authorities put allowance transfers to the local authority under solutions in place for people with long-term hous- the 18-month rule. [30131/04] ing needs, while the existing rent supplement scheme will continue to provide income support Minister for Social and Family Affairs (Mr. for up to 18 months where necessary. The local Brennan): Rent supplements are available authority approach will be accommodation- through the supplementary welfare allowance based. People accommodated under these scheme which is administered by the health arrangements will make a contribution towards boards on behalf of my Department. Supplemen- their housing costs on the same basis as people tary welfare allowance is not normally payable to on the existing local authority differential rent people who are engaged in full-time employment. scheme. For these purposes, employment for 30 hours or more per week is regarded as full-time. Question No. 295 withdrawn. Arrangements which have been in place for a number of years allow a person to retain a por- Family Support Services. tion of his or her rent supplement where he or she takes up employment through approved schemes, 296. Mr. Cuffe asked the Minister for Social such as the back to work scheme or community and Family Affairs if he will reinstate the cre`che employment. These arrangements are particularly supplement as it provides vital childcare support beneficial to people who take up full-time to children and families in disadvantaged com- employment, as they would not otherwise be munities in the absence of the required funding entitled to rent supplement. supports. [30208/04] Subject to certain conditions, including a Minister for Social and Family Affairs (Mr. weekly household income limit of \317.43, rent Brennan): It is estimated that there are over 3,000 supplement may be retained on a tapered basis cre`ches and pre-schools in the country, the for up to four years, that is, 75% in year one, 50% majority of which are privately operated. The in year two, and 25% in years three and four. remainder are community-based and operate on Back to work allowance and family income sup- a not for profit basis. Some are grant-aided by plement, in cases where one or both of these are health boards while others receive funding in payment, are disregarded in the assessment of through the equal opportunities child care pro- the \317.43 weekly income limit. PRSI and gramme of the Department of Justice, Equality reasonable travelling expenses are also dis- and Law Reform. In addition, the Early Start pre- regarded in the means test. school programme, operated by the Department 285 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 286 of Education and Science, targets children in the Minister for Transport (Mr. Cullen): Regu- three to four age bracket in areas of dis- lations governing the issue of driving licences by advantage. licensing authorities have for many years pro- The child care facilities which are grant-aided vided that an application to renew a lapsed driv- by health boards generally cater for children who ing licence may be submitted without a certificate are referred by a public health nurse or other of competency to drive if a person makes such health professional where the child’s needs, or application within a period of ten years from the those of the parent, are of a medical or personal date of expiry of the previous driving licence. social services nature. The objective of the sup- After ten years has elapsed, a person must first plementary welfare allowance scheme is to meet pass the driver theory test, apply for a provisional immediate, short-term income maintenance licence and undergo the driving test to obtain a needs. The practice of paying cre`che sup- driving licence. plements, as they came to be known, through the 299. Mr. Perry asked the Minister for Trans- scheme evolved in certain health board areas with port if an application for a driving licence from a the original intention of providing short-term person (details supplied) in County Sligo has support to parents to enable them to avail of ser- been received; and if he will make a statement on vices such as counselling or addiction treatment the matter. [29788/04] programmes, or to facilitate children with special needs to benefit from interaction with other Minister for Transport (Mr. Cullen): Under the children. Road Traffic Act 1961 and the Road Traffic In many cases however, supplements remained (Licensing of Drivers) Regulations 1999 to 2004, in payment for long durations and in circum- it is a matter for the appropriate licensing auth- stances which were outside the scope of the ority, in this case Sligo County Council, to deter- scheme. In effect, the supplements had become a mine the eligibility of a person for a driving licence, and to issue licences. long-term child care support rather than a short- term social welfare intervention. This was the 300. Mr. Hogan asked the Minister for Trans- reason that steps were taken this year to curtail port when a person (details supplied) in County these payments. The other specific cre`che and Kilkenny will be notified of their driving test; and playschool support programmes remain in place. if he will make a statement on the matter. I consider that child care and child welfare sup- [30173/04] ports are best provided by consolidating and improving these programmes. I am in discussions Minister for Transport (Mr. Cullen): The appli- with my colleagues in that regard. cant has been placed on a cancellation list for a driving test at the Kilkenny driving test centre Driving Tests. and a test appointment will be arranged as soon as possible. 297. Mr. Crawford asked the Minister for Transport the position regarding the availability Road Network. of driving testers in County Monaghan; if testing 301. Mr. J. Breen asked the Minister for Trans- is now only taking place on a bi-weekly basis; the port if he will revisit the decision taken in 1999 waiting time for having a test; his views on not to allow the NRA to build motorways whether this is causing further stress and costs on between Dublin and regional cities; and if he will many persons who have to pay high insurance as make a statement on the matter. [30190/04] provisional drivers; and if he will make a state- ment on the matter. [29660/04] Minister for Transport (Mr. Cullen): The national development plan, NDP, provides for a Minister for Transport (Mr. Cullen): The cur- substantial investment in national roads over the rent average waiting time for a driving test at the period 2000 to 2006. A significant priority within Monaghan test centre is 33 weeks. By the end of the national roads programme is to upgrade the this year driving tests equivalent to 55 weeks’ five main inter-urban routes, linking Waterford, work will have been carried out at the test centre Cork, Limerick, Galway and the Dundalk Border during 2004. At least one driver tester is assigned with Dublin, to motorway-high quality dual car- to carry out tests at the centre for each of the riageway standard, involving a substantial public remaining weeks of this year. My Department private partnership, PPP, component based on will seek to arrange an early test for candidates user tolls and bringing significant improvements who provide documentary evidence of the need to other key routes. for an urgent test. The current position in relation to the upgrad- ing of the five major inter-urban routes is that the 298. Mr. O’Dowd asked the Minister for Trans- M1 is expected to be fully complete by the end port if there are guidelines by which a driving of 2006. Work is complete on major projects on licence can be granted to a person (details the N7 Monasterevin bypass, on the N8 Cashel supplied) in County Louth in view of special cir- bypass. The N4-N6 Kilcock-Kinnegad project cumstances; and if he will make a statement on continues under construction. Work started this the matter. [29746/04] year on the Dundalk western bypass and Dun- 287 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 288

[Mr. Cullen.] provision of further transport services in the dalk to Newry on the M1, on the Fermoy bypass, greater Dublin area is being pursued within the N8, and Naas road widening, N7. Completion of broad policy framework established by the these projects will eliminate many of the major Dublin Transportation Office’s A Platform for bottlenecks on these routes. In addition it is Change. This framework does not envisage an expected that compulsory purchase orders and extension of the Luas network to Clonee in the environmental impact statements for the remain- period to 2016. At present, Iarnro´ dE´ ireann is ing projects in planning on these routes will either planning to expand services on the Maynooth line be approved by, or be before, An Bord Pleana´la later this year and is also looking into the feasi- by end 2004. bility of the development of a spur from the Maynooth line to Dunboyne. This would have the Driving Tests. effect of improving rail services to the city centre from the Clonee catchment area. 302. Mr. Perry asked the Minister for Trans- port if he will address the concerns raised with Driving Tests. regard to registered driving instructor status; the position regarding the validity of the RDI status 305. Ms O. Mitchell asked the Minister for of a person (details supplied) in County Sligo Transport the number of candidates presenting within the DTSA; his plans to pass this decision for the driving test at test centres, who are on over to the board of the DTSA; and if he will their second, third or subsequent attempt to make a statement on the matter. [29687/04] secure a full driving licence; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [29774/04] 303. Mr. Crowe asked the Minister for Trans- port if he will investigate the case of a person Minister for Transport (Mr. Cullen): There are (details supplied) in County Tipperary; and if he 118,074 applicants awaiting a driving test at intends to pass the decision regarding this per- present. Details of those applicants who are tak- son’s status over to the board of the DTSA. ing their driving test for the second or subsequent [29688/04] occasion are not recorded at application stage. Minister for Transport (Mr. Cullen): I propose 306. Mr. Ring asked the Minister for Transport to take Questions Nos. 302 and 303 together. the arrangements in place for Civil Service staff Proposals being developed by my Department within the driver testing section at Ballina, for the regulation and quality assurance of driving County Mayo, who do not wish to transfer to the instruction will involve a test of the competence Driver Testing and Standards Authority. of individual instructors. A working group com- [29797/04] prising representatives of my Department and of instruction interests has formulated the design of Minister for Transport (Mr. Cullen): The the standards that a driving instructor must meet. Driver Testing and Standards Authority Bill cur- I am considering what arrangements will be put rently before the House provides that “Any per- in place to oversee implementation of the stan- son who immediately before the establishment dard in the context of the establishment of the day was a member of the staff of the Department Driver Testing and Standards Authority. The of Transport and who is designated by the Mini- Driver Testing and Standards Authority Bill ster for employment in the Authority shall on the 2004, which provides for the establishment of the appointed day be transferred to and become a authority was published on 6 July 2004 and the member of the staff of the Authority.” Nego- Second Stage debate commenced on the 14 tiation and consultation with staff and their rep- October 2004. Regulations will be required to resentative organisations to determine the give effect to the proposals for introducing regu- detailed arrangements for the establishment of lation of driving instruction and the position of the Driver Testing and Standards Authority are existing driving instructors will be considered in continuing. the context of drafting of the regulations. Road Safety. Public Transport. 307. Ms O. Mitchell asked the Minister for 304. Mr. J. Higgins asked the Minister for Transport the amount that has been spent on Transport if consideration has been given to implementing the national road safety strategy bringing the Luas from Benburb Street, through annually from 1997 to 2004, inclusive; and if he Stoneybatter, the Navan Road and up to will make a statement on the matter. [29811/04] Blanchardstown and Clonee and beyond, with 308. Ms O. Mitchell asked the Minister for park and ride facilities being available for motor- Transport the amount that has been spent by his ists in Clonee to facilitate commuters living in this Department on implementing the national road significant catchment area. [29716/04] safety strategy annually from 2002 to 2004, inclus- Minister for Transport (Mr. Cullen): Responsi- ive; the amount it is envisaged will be spent annu- bility for the development of specific proposals ally on the Road Safety Strategy 2004 to 2006; for the expansion of Luas services lies with the and if he will make a statement on the matter. Railway Procurement Agency, RPA. However, [29812/04] 289 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 290

Minister for Transport (Mr. Cullen): I propose first full year of the operation of the Government to take Questions Nos. 307 and 308 together. Road Safety Strategy 1998 — 2002. Between 1998 Funding made available to the road safety and 2004, there has been significant and sustained agencies under the aegis of my Department in increases in the funding made available to the 1997 amounted to approximately \10.65 million. road safety agencies under the aegis of my The following table sets out the funding to the Department. Overall funding has grown from a road safety agencies under the aegis of my total of \11.372 million in 1998 to \22.488 milion Department on an annual basis, since 1998, the in 2004, a rise of 97.7%.

State Body 1998 1999 2000 2001 2002 2003 2004

\m \m \m \m \m \m \m National Safety Council 1.148 1.290 1.202 2.484 2.941 2.758 2.886 Medical Bureau of Road Safety 0.794 1.380 1.565 1.771 1.728 2.067 2.337 National Roads Authority 9.430 10.506 10.819 11.906 7.953 9.708 17.265

Total 11.372 13.176 13.586 16.161 12.622 14.533 22.488

The overall Exchequer provision for road safety expenditure and is expected to report to improvement and maintenance works, which the steering committee shortly. have a significant impact on road safety, in 2004 on the national road network is \1.280 billion. Public Transport. This compares with an expenditure outturn of 309. Mr. P. McGrath asked the Minister for \1.223 billion in 2003. Local authorities receive Transport if Iarnro´ dE´ ireann will purchase all, or funding for road improvements and remedial part of the lands for sale at St. Joseph’s Hospital, measures on non-national roads, which is not Clonsilla, Dublin 15 with a view to providing a included in these figures. In addition, the funding park and ride facility at Clonsilla train station; made available for Garda operations supports the and if he will make a statement on the matter. enforcement of road traffic law. That is a matter [29839/04] for the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Minister for Transport (Mr. Cullen): The issue Reform. of the purchase or disposal of lands is an oper- The 2005 Estimates include increased pro- ational matter for Iarnro´ dE´ ireann to consider in visions for all of the road safety agencies. The the light of its requirements. Iarnro´ dE´ ireann is specific allocation to safety-related aspects of the exploring options with Fingal County Council to NRA’s activities in 2005 and 2006 has not yet improve access to Clonsilla station which may been finally determined. Funding for 2006 in also yield some parking benefits. It would also respect of the National Safety Council and the encourage private sector involvement in car park- Medical Bureau of Road Safety will be deter- ing schemes. mined in the context of the 2006 Estimates process. Road Network. The success of implementing road safety policy 310. Ms O. Mitchell asked the Minister for as set out in the road safety strategy is critically Transport the amount of the \1.27 billion target dependent on major investment in resources by included in the NDP for private financing of the various Departments and their agencies. The national roads programme which has been Government remains committed to ongoing sup- secured to date; if this target has not been port for the pursuit of road safety policies. reached, the amount of funding which has been In addition, my Department is chairing a steer- secured to date; if he will report on the difficulties ing group overseeing a cross-departmental review in reaching the target of \1.27 billion; and if he of road safety expenditure which will examine will make a statement on the matter. [29966/04] expenditure incurred over the lifetime of the road Minister for Transport (Mr. Cullen): The safety strategy. This will seek to evaluate the national development plan, NDP, included a effectiveness of all public spending on road safety private finance target of \1.27 billion. This target and, if necessary, recommend an adjustment in is the cumulative contribution expected from the spending on particular policies and measures private finance sector towards the capital invest- based on their effectiveness. The review will also ment in the national roads programme for the seek to establish the impact of road safety per- period 2000 to 2006. The National Roads Auth- formance on other areas, such as health and ority, NRA, announced in mid-2000 a programme emergency services. The steering committee con- of nine PPP projects. This PPP programme was sists of representatives from the Departments of further augmented in 2004 with the announce- Transport, Justice, Equality and Law Reform, ment of an additional PPP project, namely the Health and Children, Finance and Environment, M50 upgrade PPP. To date, four PPP contracts Heritage and Local Government. A consultant have been awarded namely the second Westlink has been engaged to carry out an analysis of road bridge completed in 2003 and the following pro- 291 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 292

[Mr. Cullen.] onment, Heritage and Local Government, the jects under construction; N4-N6 Kilcock-Kinne- Minister outlined the roles of local authorities gad motorway, M1 Dundalk western bypass and with regard to this matter. the N8 Rathcormac-Fermoy bypass. The total amount of private finance put in place for these State Airports. projects amounts to \567 million inclusive of 312. Mr. F. McGrath asked the Minister for standby facilities on the debt and equity funding Transport if a jet (details supplied) has ever to cover any additional costs incurred by the PPP landed at Shannon Airport; if prisoners were ever companies. If one excludes these standby facili- transported through that airport; and if he will ties, the amount of private finance placed into make a statement on the matter. [30003/04] PPP contracts to date amounts to \480 million. Other PPP projects are at various stages of pro- Minister for Transport (Mr. Cullen): In accord- curement including the N25 Waterford bypass, ance with the 1944 Chicago Convention on Inter- N3 Clonee-Kells motorway, Limerick tunnel and national Civil Aviation, aircraft may come into M50 upgrade. All these contracts are planned to Ireland for technical stops such as for refuelling be awarded either in 2005 or 2006, and assuming purposes, as this aircraft has done, without notify- that no delays affect these targets, an estimated ing the Department of Transport, and no notifi- further \1.1billion of private finance will have cation about this aircraft was received by my been committed to national roads investment Department. amounting to \1.58 billion in total by end 2006, a My Department has been informed by sum well in excess of the \1.27 billion target. In Shannon Airport management that this particular addition, the remaining two PPP projects will be aircraft, registration N8068V, has used Shannon advertised in 2005, namely, the Portlaoise PPP Airport three times in 2004, and has not used motorway and the Galway-Ballinasloe scheme, Shannon Airport on any date prior to 2004. Each both of which will be substantially funded by landing was a technical stop, that is, for refuelling private finance. or other technical reasons. On no occasion did any passengers join or leave the flight at Airport Services. Shannon. 311. Mr. Gogarty asked the Minister for Trans- Furthermore, I understand that the US auth- port the body which is responsible for monitoring orities have confirmed to the Department of For- noise emissions from aeroplanes at Weston Aero- eign Affairs that the US has not used Irish air- drome; if his attention has been drawn to the fact ports for the transit of prisoners to or from the that South Dublin County Council says this is not detention centre at Guantanamo or elsewhere. I its responsibility; if his attention has been further also understand that the US side has confirmed drawn to the fact that the Irish Aviation Auth- that they would not transit Irish airspace or use ority has stated in a written response that this is Irish airports for this purpose without seeking the not within its statutory remit; and if he will make authorisation of the Irish authorities. a statement on the matter. [30001/04] Public Transport. Minister for Transport (Mr. Cullen): There is no statutory requirement for the monitoring of 313. Mr. Crowe asked the Minister for Trans- noise emissions from aeroplanes at Weston Aero- port if he has proposals for supplying public drome. My Department has responsibility for transport to run between Churchill and Letter- implementing European legislation relating to kenny. [30147/04] noise emissions from civil subsonic jet aeroplanes, Minister for Transport (Mr. Cullen): The pro- which are large commercial jet aircraft. These vision of public bus services on specific routes is regulations-directives apply to civil airports that a commercial and operational matter for bus have more than 50,000 movements of civil sub- operators. It is open to any private bus operator sonic jet aeroplanes per year. As the aircraft who may be interested to apply to my Depart- using Weston, a privately owned aerodrome, are ment for an annual passenger licence under the smaller aircraft mostly engaged in training, leis- Road Transport Act 1932 to operate a regular bus ure or general aviation, this aerodrome does not service on the route mentioned in the Deputy’s come within the scope of this European question and my Department would look favour- legislation. ably on any such application. Bus E´ ireann may The Irish Aviation Authority, IAA, is respon- initiate new services subject to compliance with sible for the safety regulation of the Irish aviation the necessary regulatory requirement of giving industry. Weston Aerodrome has been operating advance notice to my Department and to com- as an aerodrome since 1938. In recent years, the pliance with the provisions of section 25 of the development of Lucan has pushed large residen- Transport Act 1958 concerning competition with tial areas quite close to Weston Aerodrome. With licensed private operators. a view to limiting the noise impact on residential areas, Weston Aerodrome introduced procedures Driving Tests. for pilots in relation to the flight paths and alti- tudes. I understand that in response to a similar 314. Mr. Crowe asked the Minister for Trans- question put to the Department for the Envir- port if his attention has been drawn to the fact 293 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 294 that a person licensed to drive a bus and a taxi with Department of Finance guidelines on the has to take additional lessons and a test in order appraisal and management of capital projects and to be allowed to drive a taxi with a trailer. working rules for cost-benefit analysis. In [30148/04] addition, the development and implementation of toll based public private partnership projects also Minister for Transport (Mr. Cullen): Regu- take account of Department of Finance interim lations on driver licensing set out the various cat- guidelines on the assessment, approval and pro- egories of driving licence in accordance with har- curement of PPP projects. Furthermore, the monised EU requirements. A category B driving implementation of the national roads programme licence gives entitlement to drive vehicles, other overall has been evaluated as part of the eval- than motorcycles, mopeds, work vehicles or land uation process applicable to such programmes tractors, having a design gross vehicle weight not under the national development plan and com- exceeding 3,500 kg and having passenger accom- munity support framework. modation for not more than eight persons. The The NRA is making good progress in the design gross vehicle weight of the trailer may not implementation of a programme of toll-based be greater than 750 kg or, alternatively, the public private partnership projects as part of the design gross vehicle weight of the trailer may not national roads programme, with the M50 second exceed the unladen weight of the drawing vehicle Westlink bridge completed on time, construction and the total design gross vehicle weight of the under way on the N4 Kinnegad-Enfield, N8 Fer- combination does not exceed 3,500 kg. moy bypass and the M1 Dundalk western bypass. A category EB driving licence gives entitle- PPP concessions are well advanced for the N3 ment to drive combinations of vehicles where the Clonee to south of Virginia bypass, N6 Ballin- drawing vehicle is in category B and where the asloe bypass, N7 Limerick southern ring road, design gross vehicle weight of the trailer is greater phase two, N8 Portlaoise to Cullahill to Castle- than 750 kg. A category D driving licence gives town, N25 Waterford bypass and the M50 entitlement to drive vehicles having passenger upgrade. accommodation for more than eight persons. The design gross vehicle weight of the trailer may not National Car Test. be greater than 750 kg. A category ED driving licence gives entitlement to drive combinations of 316. Mr. M. Brady asked the Minister for vehicles where the drawing vehicle is in category Transport when the review of the national car D and where the design gross vehicle weight of testing service will be carried out; and the reason the trailer is greater than 750 kg. Persons with a vehicles have failed for not having Baile A´ tha category B or a category D licence who wish to Cliath on number plates. [30150/04] have entitlement to drive such vehicles in combi- Minister of State at the Department of Trans- nation with trailers with a design gross vehicle port (Mr. Callely): The car testing contract pro- weight greater than that granted by the licence vides for a review of the service by the Minister must pass a specific driving test in the EB or ED after the mid-point of the contract which will category, respectively, to demonstrate that they occur in January 2005. The review will commence have the necessary skills for towing larger trailers. early in the new year. The format, dimensions and technical specifications of registration plates Road Network. for display on motor vehicles are currently pro- 315. Ms O. Mitchell asked the Minister for vided for in the Vehicle Registration and Tax- Transport if all public private partnerships ation (Amendment) Regulations 1999, which planned, initiated or completed to date as part of were made by the Revenue Commissioners. The the road building programme under the NDP regulations provide, inter alia, that a registration were subjected to a cost benefit analysis; the plate shall exhibit the index mark, for example, details of such analyses; if such PPP projects “D”, and place name, for example, “Baile A´ tha already completed were finished within the times- Cliath”, of the relevant licensing authority. The cale and budget envisaged; and if he will make a regulations specify the place name to be used for statement on the matter. [30149/04] each of the 29 licensing authorities, which is the Irish version of the county concerned. The Minister for Transport (Mr. Cullen): The requirements with regard to index marks and national development plan provides for signifi- place names are long-standing and date back to cant private sector investment in the national the Road Vehicles (Registration and Licensing) roads development programme. In line with this (Amendment) Regulations 1990. A registration policy, a number of major road upgrade projects plate that does not meet the specifications consti- are being implemented by the National Roads tutes a reason for refusal of an NCT test certifi- Authority, NRA, by means of public private part- cate. I understand this position has been strongly nerships, with the private sector being remuner- endorsed by the Garda authorities. ated in part by user tolls. The assessment and evaluation of all individual Rail Services. national road projects, including cost benefit analysis, is undertaken by the NRA as an integral 317. Mr. Penrose asked the Minister for Trans- part of the planning of projects in accordance port if, in the context of the recent reply to a 295 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 296

[Mr. Penrose.] port the number of road fatalities recorded from parliamentary question seeking the re-opening of 1997 to 2004; the number of road fatalities Killucan station, County Westmeath, and the recorded in north Tipperary in each year from accepted need for this development, he would 1997 to 2004; the number of these fatalities which help to part fund an independent feasibility study were pedestrian fatalities; and if he will start an on a euro for euro basis with the local community initiative, particularly among school children, to council which would examine the need and poss- encourage the use of high visibility jackets by ible usage of such a service in the catchment area; pedestrians and others at night in order to reduce and if he will make a statement on the matter. the number of pedestrian fatalities annually. [30231/04] [30232/04] Minister for Transport (Mr. Cullen): The statu- Minister for Transport (Mr. Cullen): Statistics tory responsibility for the provision of railway relating to road accidents, based on information services rests with Iarnro´ dE´ ireann. As I have ´ ´ stated in previous responses to similar questions provided by the Garda Sıochana, are published about Killucan, the company is involved in dis- by the National Roads Authority in its annual cussions with the local authorities in the area to road accident facts reports. The most recent establish whether a suitable catchment area for report is in respect of 2002 and is available in the any proposed station can be established. This is Oireachtas Library along with reports relating to normal practice in circumstances such as these. previous years. The table below sets out the The provision of funding for any necessary stud- number of fatalities in Ireland from 1997 to 2002, ies is a matter for Irish Rail or in conjunction with the number of pedestrian fatalities in Ireland the local authority. from 1997 to 2002 and the number of fatalities in north Tipperary for each of those years. The Road Traffic Accidents. reports do not give details of pedestrian fatalities 318. Mr. Lowry asked the Minister for Trans- broken down by county.

Year 1997 1998 1999 2000 2001 2002

Number of Road Deaths in Ireland 472 458 413 415 411 376 Number of Pedestrian road deaths in Ireland 130 114 92 85 89 86 Number of Road Deaths in North Tipperary 9 12 7 13 7 5

Provisional figures for the number of persons ments be delivered; and if he will make a state- killed in road traffic collisions in 2003 show there ment on the matter. [30244/04] were 336 fatalities for that year. Statistics relating Minister for Transport (Mr. Cullen): The issue to the number of traffic accidents in north raised by the Deputy is the day-to-day responsi- Tipperary during 2003 are not yet fully analysed bility of the Railway Procurement Agency and I and authenticated. They will be set out in Road have brought the concerns raised to its attention. Accident Facts 2003, which will be published by the National Roads Authority. Provisional figures Driving Tests. for 2004 indicate that at 22 November 2004, 332 320. Mr. Kehoe asked the Minister for Trans- people had lost their lives on the roads in Ireland. port the name of the company which was granted It is generally accepted that road safety issues the contract for the theory test; the location of such as the wearing of high visibility jackets are the company; the original location of the com- best promoted by way of educational and pub- pany; when the contract expires; and if he will licity campaigns, such as those undertaken by the make a statement on the matter. [30246/04] National Safety Council. The National Safety Council has developed school resource packs Minister for Transport (Mr. Cullen): The con- relating to road safety for both primary and sec- tract for the delivery of the driver theory testing service was awarded to Prometric Thomson ondary schools in order to promote safe behav- Learning, a company based in Manchester which iour. The rules of the road includes a strong is part of Thomson Learning, a division of the recommendation supporting the use at night by Thomson Corporation, a major conglomerate pedestrians outside of urban areas of light col- headquartered in the United States of America. oured clothing and reflective armbands. The company operates a call centre in Manches- ter through which test applications are processed. Rail Services. A separate company, Prometric Ireland Limited, 319. Mr. O’Connor asked the Minister for has been established here to operate the service. Transport if he will seek action and a report from The contract is for a period of seven years. Driver the RPA in respect of the outstanding concerns theory testing commenced on 11 June 2001. The of the Kingswood Heights residents association, service may be contacted at LoCall number 1890 606106. Correspondence may be addressed to the Tallaght; if his attention has been drawn to the customer service manager at PO Box 144, concern of the community that the RPA commit- Drogheda, County Louth. 297 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 298

Parking Regulations. Only a small proportion of military flights through Irish administered airspace pass through 321. Mr. O’Shea asked the Minister for Trans- port , further to Question No. 319 of 17 Nov- Irish sovereign airspace. Irish administered air- ember 2004, his proposals to amend the Road space covers 135,000 square miles of which 32,000 Traffic (Traffic and Parking) Regulations 1997 square miles is sovereign airspace. for persons (details supplied); and if he will make Under a Eurocontrol — European Organis- a statement on the matter. [30261/04] ation for the Safety of Air Navigation — multilat- eral agreement to which Ireland is a party, var- Minister for Transport (Mr. Cullen): As indi- ious categories of flights — flights under visual cated in reply to Question No. 319 on 17 Nov- flight rules, flights performed by small aircraft, ember 2004, the Road Traffic (Traffic and flights performed for the transport of Heads of Parking) Regulations 1997 empower local auth- State and search and rescue flights — are exempt orities, the Irish Wheelchair Association and the from paying en route charges. In the case of other Disabled Drivers Association to grant a disabled categories — military flights, training flights, person’s parking permit when they are satisfied flights performed to test air navigation equipment that the applicant is suffering from a disability and circular flights — states have the option to that prevents him or her from walking or causes exempt such flights from payment of the en route undue hardship to the person in walking. The charge. In common with most Eurocontrol qualifying criterion is, therefore, that of impaired member states, Ireland exempts all such flights, mobility as stated above and no specific medical including military flights of member states of condition that gives rise to such impairment is Eurocontrol, the United States and Canada, from stipulated. payment of the en route charge. This arrangement has applied since Ireland joined the Eurocontrol Driving Tests. en route charging scheme in the early 1970s. For 322. Mr. Durkan asked the Minister for Trans- this reason, arrangement the IAA costs with port if it is normal to expect a motor car to fail a regard to military flights are met from my national car test if a decorative toy is suspended Department’s Vote. from the rear view mirror; and if he will make a Ireland also exempts military aircraft flights statement on the matter. [30289/04] from payment of the communications charge and the IAA costs in relation to those charges are also Minister of State at the Department of Trans- port (Mr. Callely): The items to be tested, the met from my Department’s Vote. Efforts to col- method of testing and the reasons for refusal of a lect this charge in the early 1990s were unsuccess- NCT certificate are set out in the national car test ful and, following advice from the Attorney Gen- manual 2004, which is published by my Depart- eral, debts then outstanding were written off with ment. The NCT includes a check to ensure there the agreement of the Department of Finance and is an adequate view from the driving seat and that a decision taken to cease charging the communi- it is not interfered with by objects or stickers on cations fee to military aircraft. \ or in the vicinity of the windscreen. The presence A total of 6.1 million, not including VAT, was of an object or sticker in the direct line of vision paid to the IAA between January 2003 and Sep- of the driver which would prevent the driver hav- tember 2004. US military flights account for ing an adequate view would constitute a reason approximately 90% of the total amounting to \5.5 for refusal of an NCT test certificate. million. Foreign military aircraft using State air- A person dissatisfied with the outcome of a ports pay the appropriate airport charge to each NCT may appeal the decision under the com- airport authority. plaints and appeals procedure operated by the National Car Testing Service Limited, NCTS. It Road Safety. is also open to a car owner to appeal a decision 324. Mr. Crowe asked the Minister for Trans- of NCTS to refuse a test certificate to the Dis- port if his attention has been drawn to the anom- trict Court. aly that many school buses have no belts in view of widespread concern surrounding the non-use State Airports. of seat belts; and if he intends to introduce legis- 323. Aengus O´ Snodaigh asked the Minister lation to cover this in the near future. [30310/04] for Transport if the decision to waive fees for the Minister of State at the Department of Trans- hundreds of US military flights that have used port (Mr. Callely): At present, buses having a Shannon Airport has cost to Irish taxpayer nearly design gross weight not exceeding 3,500 kg, that \6 million. [30309/04] is, minibuses, first registered since 1 January 1992 Minister for Transport (Mr. Cullen): The Irish are the only buses which require to be fitted with Aviation Authority, IAA, provides air traffic con- seat belts, in which case seat belts are required trol and communications services to aircraft for the driver and each forward facing front seat which pass through sovereign and international passenger. Persons occupying these seats are airspace it administers on the north Atlantic. required to use the seat belts. 299 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 300

[Mr. Callely.] Ireland, one of the six North-South implemen- In June 2003 the European Commission pub- tation bodies established under the British-Irish lished proposals to amend a number of directives Agreement Act 1999, is to examine the possible relating to the type approval requirements for restoration of the Ulster Canal. At this time, no safety belts and restraint systems, anchorages for decision has been taken to proceed with the res- safety belts, and seats, their anchorages and head toration of the Ulster Canal. restraints. These proposals provide, inter alia, for A study was commissioned which estimated the the mandatory fitment of seatbelts in buses and cost of the restoration of the full canal at approxi- coaches, other than those used on staged stop mately sterling £90 million based on year 2000 urban services, at manufacturing stage for the costs. The issues arising in regard to the Ulster purpose of obtaining motor vehicle type Canal, including the question of whether a approval. Under the proposals it would be a phased or partial approach to the matter might requirement for the registration, sale and entry be feasible, are being considered by my Depart- into service of new buses and coaches from 1 Jan- ment and the Department of Culture, Arts and uary 2006, and that their safety belts and restraint Leisure in the North. systems, anchorages for safety belts and seats, and anchorages and head restraints would con- 327. Mr. Ferris asked the Minister for Com- form to the technical requirements specified in munity, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs if he will the proposed amending directives. make a statement on the future strategy of In anticipation of the aforementioned pro- Waterways Ireland for the development of water posals, Directive 2003/30/EC has been adopted based amenities. [29929/04] which provides, inter alia, for the compulsory wearing of seat belts by all occupants of vehicles, Minister for Community, Rural and Gaeltacht including buses, where seat belts are fitted. Affairs (E´ amon O´ Cuı´v): Waterways Ireland is Member states are required to transpose this one of the six North-South implementation directive into national law by 9 May 2006. It is bodies established by the British-Irish Agreement my intention to make the necessary regulations to Act. The body’s remit is the management, main- provide for the compulsory wearing of seat belts tenance, development and restoration of the where fitted in vehicles as soon as the type inland navigable waterway system, principally for approval standards for related safety systems, recreational purposes. including standards relating to the mandatory fit- Waterways Ireland advises me that it has a pro- ment of seat belts, have been agreed at Euro- gramme in place to promote and market the pean level. waterways under its remit as part of its marketing and promotion strategy launched earlier this year. Public Transport. It also continues to develop jetties, harbours and moorings along the waterways. In 2005, for 325. Mr. Stanton asked the Minister for Trans- example, it intends to complete two harbours at port the plans he has for the implementation of Portrunny, County Roscommon, and Garryken- the action plan on accessibility under the Dis- nedy, County Tipperary. In addition, it will pro- ability Bill 2004; and if he will make a statement vide more than 600 metres of additional moorings on the matter. [30319/04] at various locations throughout the waterways Minister for Transport (Mr. Cullen): The out- system North and South. line sectoral plan under the Disability Bill 2004, published recently by my Department, is a draft Dormant Accounts. consultation document. The plan outlines my 328. Mr. Naughten asked the Minister for Department’s proposals with regard to the Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs the ongoing development of accessible public trans- timescale in processing an application under the port services for people with mobility and sensory dormant accounts fund by ADM Limited; the impairments. My Department will shortly com- timescale for deciding on an application (details mence an extensive consultation process on the supplied); and if he will make a statement on the plan and every submission received will be taken matter. [29692/04] fully into consideration in finalising the plan in 2005. Minister of State at the Department of Com- munity, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs (Mr. N. Inland Waterways. Ahern): Decisions on the disbursement of funds from dormant accounts moneys are a matter for 326. Mr. Ferris asked the Minister for Com- the Dormant Accounts Fund Disbursements munity, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs if he will Board, an independent body established under make a statement on his strategy in regard to the the Dormant Accounts Acts. The board has development of the Ulster Canal. [29928/04] engaged Area Development Management Lim- Minister for Community, Rural and Gaeltacht ited, ADM, to administer the initial round of Affairs (E´ amon O´ Cuı´v): The Deputy will be funding on its behalf which involves the disburse- aware that one of the functions of Waterways ment of up to \60 million from the fund. 301 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 302

Following an invitation earlier in the year to additional to that set out in the contract will be groups and organisations to make applications for paid. funding, more than 1,600 applications were received by ADM. The process of assessing and Community Development. approving these applications is ongoing. In this 331. Mr. Gilmore asked the Minister for Com- regard, the board has to date approved 318 pro- \ munity, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs the reason jects for funding totalling approximately 30 mill- funding is not being made available under the ion. Over the coming months, further allocations YPFSF for activities being organised for children will be made by the board up to a total figure of \ aged under ten years; if he will widen the remit 60 million. of the YPFSF to include persons under ten years; I understand an application from the group his views on whether organised activities for per- concerned was received by ADM on 5 March sons under ten years are particularly important 2004. This application is being evaluated against in some neighbourhoods; and if he will make a the criteria set out in the published guidelines. statement on the matter. [29931/04] Following this evaluation process, a recommend- ation will be made to the Dormant Accounts Minister of State at the Department of Com- Fund Disbursements Board for decision. The munity, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs (Mr. N. group concerned will be advised of the board’s Ahern): As the Deputy is aware, the young decision in due course. people’s facilities and services fund, YPFSF, was established in 1998 to assist in the development Grant Payments. of facilities, including sport and recreational facilities, and services in disadvantaged areas 329. Mr. F. McGrath asked the Minister for where a significant drug problem exists or has the Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs the potential to develop. The fund is aimed at young reason a centre (details supplied) in Dublin 5 did people in the ten to 21 age bracket as this is con- not receive a grant under his Department’s pro- sidered the age group potentially most at risk of gramme of grants for locally based community drug misuse and, in particular, opiate misuse. In and voluntary organisations; and if the maximum addition, it should be noted that the youth initiat- support and assistance will be given to this ives funded under the YPFSF are guided by the centre. [29719/04] Youth Work Act 1997 and, more recently, the Minister of State at the Department of Com- Youth Work Act 2001, which states that youth munity, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs (Mr. N. services should have particular regard to the Ahern): In reviewing the operation of the pro- youth work requirements of persons who are gramme of grants for locally based community aged between ten and 21 years and are socially or and voluntary organisations 2004, and having economically disadvantaged. \ regard to the funds available for the programme To date, more than 75 million has been allo- and the availability of funding from other cated under the fund to support in the region of sources, a number of categories of organisations 450 facility and services projects. This includes \ were excluded from applying under the pro- the 13 million worth of allocations I announced gramme. Family resource centres were one of earlier this year for more than 100 proposals those categories excluded. The Department of under the second round of the fund. Through the Social and Family Affairs funds family resource new funding being allocated, a number of new centres under the family and community services youth and community centres will be built and a resource programme through the Family Support wide and diverse variety of youth work projects Agency. It is open to the group in question to across the 14 local drugs task force areas are apply for funding under that programme. being supported. Substantial funding is also being made available towards the staffing and oper- Departmental Correspondence. ational costs of a number of larger community- youth centres built under the first round of the 330. Mr. Perry asked the Minister for Com- fund. munity, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs if he has While the primary focus of all YPFSF funded received correspondence from an agency (details facilities is on the ten to 21 age bracket, the supplied) in County Donegal; if he will address Deputy should note that their use by the wider the concerns raised; and if he will make a state- community, including by children younger than ment on the matter. [29779/04] ten years old, is also accommodated. There are Minister of State at the Department of Com- no plans at present to broaden the remit of the munity, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs (Mr. N. YPFSF. Ahern): My Department has received correspon- dence from the agency referred to by the Deputy Cailliu´ int Postanna. and has responded stating that no application for 332. D’fhiafraigh Aengus O´ Snodaigh den Aire additional funding has been received from any of Gno´ thaı´ Pobail, Tuaithe agus Gaeltachta ce´n uair the successful tenderers. The contracts with the dheireanach a bhuail U´ dara´s na Gaeltachta le six successful tenderers state that no funding bord bainistı´ochta an chomhlachta Nuvotem ata´ 303 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 304

[Aengus O´ Snodaigh.] cable nor possible to quantify total spend on lonnaithe i gCroithlı´, Contae Thı´r Chonaill; ar RAPID across all Departments. For this reason ple´adh scaoileadh chun bo´ thair a dhe´anamh go and because no specific budget was allocated to sealadach ar oibrithe sa chomhlacht; an raibh an RAPID, it is not possible to provide the remain- t-U´ dara´s ar an eolas ag an am go raibh orduithe der of the information requested. do tha´irgı´ Nuvotem a´ seoladh chuig an chomhlacht i bPoblacht na Seice; agus an bhfuil Tables: aon eolas eile ag an U´ dara´s a d’fe´adfadh cuidiu´ Strand I RAPID Areas Strand II RAPID chun an staid fostaı´ochta a re´iteach do na hoibri- Areas the ata´ thı´os leis i dTı´r Chonaill. [30233/04] Minister for Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Blanchardstown Athlone Affairs (E´ amon O´ Cuı´v): De re´ir an eolais ata´ Bray Athy curtha ar fa´il ag U´ dara´s na Gaeltachta, ta´ an Clondalkin Ballinasloe comhlacht ata´ luaite ag an Teachta i gcoimhlint Cork — Blackpool / The Glen / Carlow le comhlachtaı´ i dtı´ortha le costais ı´seal ta´irgı´- Mayfield ochta. Mar is eol don Teachta, ta´ coimhlint ghe´ar Cork — Fairhill / Gurranebraher / Carrick-on-Suir in earna´il na de´antu´ saı´ochta le roinnt blianta agus Farranree ta´ poist a´ gcailliu´ int sa tı´r seo da´ re´ir, na ceantair Cork — Knocknaheeney / Cavan Churchfield Ghaeltachta san a´ireamh. Tuigim go mbı´onn caidreamh rialta ag Cork — Togher / Mahon Clonmel feidhmeannas U´ dara´s na Gaeltachta leis an Dublin — Ballymun Ennis gcomhlacht seo chun scru´ du´ a dhe´anamh ar na Dublin — Finglas Galway fe´idearthachtaı´ ata´ ann maidir lena inmharthan- Dublin — North East Inner City Kilkenny acht a chinntiu´ . Ina thaobh sin de, rinneadh tuille- Dublin — North West Inner City Longford adh ple´ ar thodhchaı´ an chomhlachta ag cruinniu´ Dublin — Northside Mallow ar 18 Samhain 2004. Tuigim o´ nU´ dara´s go bhfuil Dublin — South East Inner City Navan an comhlacht fo´ s ag lorg orduithe a chuirfidh ar Dublin — South Inner City New Ross a chumas ta´irgı´ocht a athbhunu´ sa tı´r seo ach nı´ Dublin — South West Inner City Sligo mo´ r, ar ndo´ igh, an choimhlint ghe´ar ata´ san ear- Du´ n Laoghaire / Rathdown Tipperary na´il de´antu´ saı´ochta seo i la´thair na huaire a cho- Limerick — Kings Island Tralee imea´d san a´ireamh. Limerick — Northside Tuam Designated Areas. Limerick — Southside Wexford Drogheda Youghal 333. Mr. Kehoe asked the Minister for Com- munity, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs the counties Dundalk and towns which have been designated under the Tallaght — Jobstown RAPID programme; the amount spent in each Tallaght — Killinarden area since such designation; the amount of budget Tallaght — Fettercairn shortfall in each designated centre; the total spent Waterford on the RAPID programme to date; and the amount of the proposed budget when announced. [30255/04] Forestry Protection. Minister for Community, Rural and Gaeltacht 334. Mr. Sargent asked the Minister for Agri- ´ ´ Affairs (Eamon O Cuı´v): Strand one of the culture and Food if she has satisfied herself with RAPID programme targets 25 urban areas and the adequacy of tree protection legislation; and if strand two targets 20 provincial towns. These there are plans to review and update the pro- areas are listed in the table which follows. While visions. [29805/04] no specific budget was allocated to the RAPID programme, it was stated at the time that: Minister for Agriculture and Food (Mary Coughlan): The main instrument for the protec- Under the National Development Plan up to tion of trees in Ireland is the Forestry Act 1946, \ 15 billion has been earmarked for social which lays down provisions in relation to felling, inclusion measures, to be spent on develop- uprooting and injury of trees. Additional protec- ment measures over the next five years. The tion is provided for under the Planning and RAPID programme will prioritise the 25 iden- Development Act 2000 which empowers local tified areas and frontload a significant share of authorities to place tree preservation orders on this money to them over the next three years. trees. I intend to review the body of forestry legis- My Department, supported by Area Develop- lation next year. This will incorporate a full exam- ment Management Limited, co-ordinates the ination of the adequacy of the provisions provid- implementation of the programme. While I can ing for tree protection, including review of the administration of the felling licensing system. A provide details of allocations made by my legislative review group has already carried out Department to RAPID areas, it is neither practi- some work on this matter. 305 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 306

Grant Payments. intramammaries and take account of devel- opments since the original legislation was 335. Mr. Ring asked the Minister for Agri- enacted. Since that time, my Department has had culture and Food the reason a person (details a number of meetings with stakeholders and supplied) in County Mayo still has not received received a number of submissions which have the special beef premium payment. [29682/04] been under consideration. The next formal stage Minister for Agriculture and Food (Mary in the process is to consult the animal remedies Coughlan): Further to my reply to Question No. consultative committee. I have recently reactiv- 213 of 3 November 2004 in which I indicated that ated this committee so that this consultation can payment would issue shortly to the person take place in the near future. Following com- named, I am pleased to confirm that the 60% pletion of this process, it is my intention that the advance payment in the amount of \3,870 issued necessary legislative amendments will be finalised to the person named on 12 November 2004. and brought into effect as soon as possible.

Mayo Landslides. Grant Payments. 336. Mr. Ring asked the Minister for Agri- 339. Mr. Timmins asked the Minister for Agri- culture and Food if the compensation payment to culture and Food the position with regard to a a person (details supplied) in County Mayo will suckler cow payment 2003 for a person (details be reviewed and reassessed in order that the pay- supplied) in County Wicklow; if this can be made ment can be increased. [29683/04] as a matter of urgency; and if she will make a Minister for Agriculture and Food (Mary statement on the matter. [29748/04] Coughlan): The person named is an applicant Minister for Agriculture and Food (Mary under the Pullathomas landslide damage relief Coughlan): The person named is the husband of scheme. Payments were issued by my Depart- the registered herd owner. The registered herd ment to all eligible farmers on 15 October 2004. owner applied on 20 animals under the 2003 suck- My Department has carried out a review of this ler cow premium scheme on 14 February 2003 case and has not found any grounds for an and has been paid her full entitlement under this increase in the level of compensation paid to the scheme. The 80% advance payment, amounting applicant. to \3,586.40, issued to her on 20 October 2003 337. Mr. Ring asked the Minister for Agri- and the 20% balance payment of \896.60 issued culture and Food the position regarding the to her on 1 April 2004. review of a compensation payment received by a The registered herd owner applied on 20 ani- person (details supplied) in County Mayo; and if mals under the 2004 suckler cow premium the amount to this person has been increased. scheme on 12 March 2004. Following an inspec- [29684/04] tion of the herd on 9 July 2004 the application was cross-checked against the cattle movement Minister for Agriculture and Food (Mary monitoring system database where it was found Coughlan): The person named is an applicant that one of the animals applied on, tag number under the Pullathomas landslide damage relief FBA799023, moved out of the herd on 5 May scheme. My Department has carried out a review 2004. Paragraph 21 of the terms and conditions of the case concerned and is satisfied that the governing the 2004 suckler cow premium scheme assessment of the damage is reasonable and in provides that animals may be classified as accept- accordance with the terms of the scheme. able replacements provided that replacement However, during the course of the review an takes place within 20 days. In this instance, the error in calculation was discovered as a result of replacement animal, tag number PWCD0086E, which a further sum of \45 is due to the applicant. moved into the herd on 9 June 2004. My Depart- Arrangements are being made for the payment of ment wrote to the registered herd owner on 17 this amount to the applicant and a cheque will November 2004 advising that animal tag number issue shortly. FBA799023 was rejected from her application as it had not been replaced within the required 20 Veterinary Medicines. day period and that the premium due on her 338. Mr. Naughten asked the Minister for Agri- remaining eligible animals would be subject to a culture and Food , further to Question No. 262 of reduction penalty to be calculated at the end of 29 September 2004, her plans for intramammary the scheme year. She was also advised that she medicines; and if she will make a statement on could seek a review of this decision by writing to the matter. [29695/04] my Department within seven days and supplying any information that she believed would help her Minister for Agriculture and Food (Mary case. Processing of her 2004 suckler cow premium Coughlan): Following a review by my Depart- scheme application will be finalised on receipt of ment of the existing regime governing the distri- her response. bution and sale of veterinary medicines, it was concluded earlier this year that a number of Bovine Disease Controls. changes to the regime would be appropriate to give effect to the Irish Medicines Board report on 340. Mr. Timmins asked the Minister for Agri- 307 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 308

[Mr. Timmins .] Minister for Agriculture and Food (Mary culture and Food the position with regard to a Coughlan): The person named has advised my person who wishes to apply for a herd number; Department of the death of her late husband, the criteria which must be fulfilled and the pro- with whom she was registered as joint herdowner. cedures which must be followed; and if she will My Department has asked that she provide a let- make a statement on the matter. [29749/04] ter from her solicitor confirming that she is entitled to full ownership of the lands and stock. Minister for Agriculture and Food (Mary As soon as this information is received her appli- Coughlan): The herd number system is an admin- cations for 2004 area- based compensatory allow- istrative arrangement under the bovine disease ance and 2004 suckler cow premium will be pro- eradication schemes. A herd number is issued to cessed for payment. the keeper of bovine animals, being a person, for the purposes of and solely in the interests of dis- 344. Mr. Perry asked the Minister for Agri- ease control for bovine animals. The same culture and Food if she will again review the force system, however, is used to identify applicants for majeure application of a person (details supplied) various schemes operated by my Department. I in County Sligo; and if she will make a statement emphasise that a herd number does not confer on the matter. [29767/04] ownership of animals or lands tested under a herd number on any particular person acting as the Minister for Agriculture and Food (Mary keeper. Coughlan): The person named, having been noti- The main criteria taken into account in the fied that the circumstances outlined by him did allocation of a herd number are the herd is man- not satisfy the criteria for force majeure-excep- aged at all times as a separate unit without inter- tional circumstances under Article 40 of Council mixing with other herds, for example, separate Regulation (EC) No. 1782/2003, submitted an farm equipment, housing and fodder; adequate appeal to the independent single payment handling facilities are available to enable satisfac- appeals committee. Following a full examination tory testing to be carried out on each holding; and of the circumstances outlined in the appeal, the the herd has a distinct owner-manager, known as independent single payment appeals committee keeper, who can be legally responsible for made a recommendation and a letter issued to the breaches of the animal health regulations. person named on 24 August 2004. The appeals The general details in regard to applying for a committee found that the original decision taken herd number are outlined in the application form by my Department should be upheld. ER1, a copy of which I am arranging to send to My Department has re-examined the circum- the Deputy. Applications for a herd number must stances of this case, taking account of the be submitted to the applicant’s local district vet- additional medical evidence submitted and has erinary office. The local DVO will advise the per- decided that the single farm payment entitle- son wishing to apply for a herd number should ments for the person named will be based on the further details be required. 1997-1999 reference period. A statement of pro- visional entitlements reflecting this position will Grant Payments. issue shortly to the person named. 341. Mr. S. Ryan asked the Minister for Agri- 345. Mr. Perry asked the Minister for Agri- culture and Food the reason beef premium and culture and Food if she will rescind the decision suckler payments were not made to a person made on the force majeure of a person (details (details supplied) in County Tipperary for the supplied); and if she will make a statement on the years 2002, 2003 and 2004. [29764/04] matter. [29768/04] 342. Mr. S. Ryan asked the Minister for Agri- Minister for Agriculture and Food (Mary culture and Food the reason an area based pay- Coughlan): The person named, having been noti- ment was not granted to a person (details fied that the circumstances outlined by him did supplied) in County Tipperary. [29765/04] not satisfy the criteria for force majeure-excep- Minister for Agriculture and Food (Mary tional circumstances under Article 40 of Council Coughlan): I propose to take Questions Nos. 341 Regulation (EC) No. 1782/2003, submitted an and 342 together. appeal to the independent single payment I understand there are legal proceedings appeals committee. Following a full examination between members of the family involved in this of the circumstances outlined in the appeal, the case. As a result my Department is not in a posi- independent single payment appeals committee tion to identify the person entitled to payment of made a recommendation and a letter issued to grants and accordingly payment must be withheld the person named on 29 September 2004. The until the dispute is resolved. appeals committee found that the original decision taken by my Department should be 343. Mr. P. Breen asked the Minister for Agri- upheld. culture and Food when a person (details My Department has re-examined the circum- supplied) in County Clare will receive headage stances of this case, taking account of the payment; and if she will make a statement on the additional medical evidence submitted and has matter. [29766/04] decided that the reference year 2000 will be 309 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 310 excluded from the calculation of the single farm ment, COFORD, is to be decentralised. payment entitlements for the person named and [30160/04] the entitlements will be based on the reference Minister for Agriculture and Food (Mary years 2001 and 2002 only. A statement of pro- Coughlan): The national council for forest visional entitlements reflecting this position will research and development is a non-statutory issue shortly to the person named. agency under the aegis of my Department with a 346. Mr. Perry asked the Minister for Agri- contract staff of five persons. It is located in culture and Food if a decision will be expedited Dublin, separate from the Department. No decision has been taken about its decentra- on forestry payment for a person (details lisation. supplied); and if she will make a statement on the matter. [29769/04] Pension Provision. 349. Mr. Sargent asked the Minister for Agri- Minister for Agriculture and Food (Mary culture and Food the pension arrangements in Coughlan): The forest service of my Department respect of the personnel in the work of the has been in contact with the person in question national council for forest research and develop- and awaits documentation from him. ment. [30161/04] 347. Mr. P. Breen asked the Minister for Agri- Minister for Agriculture and Food (Mary culture and Food the reason a person (details Coughlan): Three staff of the national council for supplied) in County Clare did not qualify for for- forest research and development are members of estry premium; and if she will make a statement the non-contributory pension scheme for non- on the matter. [29831/04] established State employees and also of the spouses and children’s contributory scheme for Minister for Agriculture and Food (Mary non-established State employees A further Coughlan): The person named was an applicant member of staff is on secondment from Coillte under the 1989 EEC scheme of compensatory and is a member of the Coillte pension scheme. allowances in respect of forestry paragraph 3(a) The remaining staff member is employed through of the terms and conditions of the scheme: pro- an agency and the pension arrangements in this vided that the scheme will apply only to individ- case are not a matter for this Department. ual natural persons permanently engaged in agri- Departmental Expenditure. culture who were in receipt of 1986, 1987 and 350. Mr. Sargent asked the Minister for Agri- 1988 grants under the sheep headage scheme or culture and Food if she will provide a breakdown cattle and equine headage scheme or beef cow of expenditure and estimated cost of expenditure scheme in the disadvantaged areas. outstanding by her Department on recently pub- As the person named did not receive grants lished books (details supplied); and if any of the under the disadvantaged areas schemes in 1986, expenditure is recoverable from the European 1987 and 1988, he was deemed ineligible and was Union or any other party. [30162/04] notified of the decision in writing by my Depart- Minister for Agriculture and Food (Mary ment on 13 March 1990. Coughlan): The expenditure and projected Decentralisation Programme. income associated with the two recently pub- lished the national council for forest research and 348. Mr. Sargent asked the Minister for Agri- development books Trees Forests and the Law in culture and Food the location to which the Ireland and Irish Forestry — A Concise History national council for forest research and develop- are set out below.

Trees, Forests and the Law in Ireland

Income Expenditure

\\ Sales * 1,660.00 Authors 5,209.40 Printing 3,233.00 Projected Additional Sales: 6,980.00 Launch: Venue 1,615.50 Invites 235.95 Photographer 428.00 Posters 50.00

Total: 8,640.00 Total: 10,771.85

*Postage and packaging is charged at cost. 311 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 312

Irish Forestry — A Concise History

Income Expenditure

\\ Sales * 390.00 Legal review 200.00 Printing 3,127.00 Projected Additional Sales: 8,600.00 Launch: Venue 562.79 Invites 235.95 Copyright 235.00

Total: 8,990.00 Total: 4,360.74 * Postage and packaging is charged at cost.

There is no expenditure outstanding on these mission propose to disallow EU funds of circa publications. The expenditure is not recoverable \800,000 from the final claim under the forestry from the European Union or any other party. operational programme for agriculture and rural 351. Mr. Sargent asked the Minister for Agri- development 1994-1999; and the outcome of the culture and Food if she will provide a breakdown proposal. [30164/04] (details supplied) of expenditure by or on behalf Minister for Agriculture and Food (Mary of the national council for forest research and Coughlan): The European Commission has indi- development during the past 12-month period cated that certain expenditure relating to staff available; and if she will also provide an estimate costs for research and development under the for- of the cost of depreciation of any significant estry heading of the operational programme for assets in use during the period and of services agriculture and rural development, 1994-99, is rendered to the national council for forest ineligible for co-funding. Such expenditure had, research and development by other units within however, been deemed eligible under the pre- her Department and other Departments or State vious operational programme. agencies. [30163/04] This matter has been in dispute for some time. It was agreed to exclude the expenditure in ques- Minister for Agriculture and Food (Mary tion from the formal closure of accounts pro- Coughlan): The breakdown of the national cedure in 2003, on a ’without prejudice’ basis. My council for forest research and development costs Department, which now has responsibility for this for the calendar year 2003, by category requested, matter, hopes to bring this matter to a conclusion is set out below. There was no depreciation of any very shortly. significant assets in use in 2003 and the national council for forest research and development did Tuberculosis Incidence. not avail of any services from its parent Depart- 353. Cecilia Keaveney asked the Minister for ment at that time, the Department of Marine, Agriculture and Food , further to Question Nos. Communications and Natural Resources, or any 97 of 8 October 2003 and 180 of 9 December other Department. A copy of the national council 2003, the progress which has been made since to for forest research and development annual rectify tuberculosis problems that a number of report for 2003 was made available to all herd owners are experiencing at a location Deputies. (details supplied) in County Donegal; and if she Cost category \ will make a statement on the matter. [30165/04] Minister for Agriculture and Food (Mary Advertising 13,630.01 Coughlan): As stated in reply to Parliamentary Conferences/Seminars 18,535.87 Question No. 180 of 9 December 2003, a survey Printing/Stationery 109,728.40 and sampling of badgers was conducted under Projects 1,201,888.18 licence in mid November 2003. A substantial pro- Rent/Phones 8,765.37 portion of the badgers were removed and these Researcher Training 7,659.16 were sent for post mortem examination. A high rate of TB lesions was disclosed indicating a link Running Costs 185,073.08 with infection in the bovine herd from the local Salaries 147,607.00 badger population. The disease situation in the Travel & Subsistence 52,648.06 area has improved since last year, with four herds Total 1,745,535.13 restricted compared to six in September 2003. Epidemiological studies indicate that all of these cases are related to the original breakdown.

EU Funding. Milk Quota. 352. Mr. Sargent asked the Minister for Agri- 354. Mr. Wall asked the Minister for Agri- culture and Food the reason the European Com- 313 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 314 culture and Food the payments due to persons investment scheme for the marketing and pro- (details supplied) in County Kildare; further to cessing of certain agricultural products, up to previous parliamentary questions, the position 40% grant aid may be awarded for capital pro- regarding decoupling and the problems that they jects intended to improve the marketing and pro- have now in regard to leasing and milk quotas; cessing of products in the horticulture, potatoes, and if she will make a statement on the grain, egg packing and livestock, including marts, matter. [30201/04] sectors. Awards are made following evaluation and taking account of the funding available. In Minister for Agriculture and Food (Mary the case of marts, grant assistance is geared Coughlan): Having checked the Department’s towards the improvement of marketing facilities, database using the details supplied, there is no with grant aid being prioritised towards rational- evidence that any payments are due to the per- isation and relocation of existing enterprises. sons named. As indicated in previous replies in Under the current call for proposals eight respect of the decoupled dairy premium, where a applications, seeking grant aid in the region of lease of lands and milk quota expires during the \6 million, have been received in respect of the milk quota year, that part of the milk quota util- following livestock marts: Castlerea Co-Op, ised by the lessee will be available to that person Castlerea, County Roscommon; Connacht Gold for the purpose of establishing the decoupled pre- Co-Op, Balla, County Mayo; Cork Co-Op, Cahir, mium in 2005. The remainder of the leased quota County Tipperary; Cork Co-Op, Dungarvan, will be transferred to the lessor, if the lease is County Waterford; Cork Co-Op, Macroom, not renewed. The lessor will be entitled to the County Cork; Inishowen Co-Op, County decoupled dairy premium on the transferred Donegal; Kilkenny Co-Op Livestock Market quota if he or she is a milk producer during the Limited; Listowel Livestock Mart, Listowel, 2004-05 milk quota year or commences milk pro- County Kerry. These applications are being duction in his or her own right prior to May 2005. evaluated and decisions will be made in the com- ing weeks in respect of those applications where Farm Management. all the necessary planning approvals have been 355. Mr. McGuinness asked the Minister for obtained. Agriculture and Food further to a previous As the problem on the farm is a complex one, parliamentary question, the action she intends to the approach has been to investigate as many take in the case of a person (details supplied) in factors as possible in a methodical, scientific way County Kilkenny; the reason the farming agen- so that the most appropriate course of action can cies subject to her Department are not pro- be pursued to try to identify the underlying cause. actively searching for a solution to the problem This work is ongoing and is being progressed as or actively engaging with the person; if there is quickly as possible. The farmer concerned has an aid package the person can avail of to ease the been very much involved in all aspects of this hardship caused by the exceptional circumstances investigation and has been kept fully informed at of their case; if she and her senior officials will all times. My Department does not operate any visit the farm; and if she will make a statement scheme to alleviate hardship in circumstances on the matter. [30210/04] such as are being encountered in this case. I am satisfied that this matter is being examined by Minister for Agriculture and Food (Mary those persons, within and outside my Department Coughlan): Following concerns expressed by a best qualified to carry out this work and I look few farmers about animal production on individ- forward to the result of that examination. ual farms in County Kilkenny, and in accordance with an established protocol, investigations 357. Mr. Kehoe asked the Minister for Agri- involving several relevant agencies are under culture and Food if an application for the suckler way. Staff from my Department have visited the cow premium by a person (details supplied) in farm concerned on several occasions. Likewise, County Wexford will be accepted. [30249/04] Teagasc staff have been to the farm. Two inter- agency meetings have already been held about Minister for Agriculture and Food (Mary this matter involving my Department, Teagasc, Coughlan): The application period for the 2004 the local authorities and the Environmental Pro- suckler cow premium scheme ran from 2 January tection Agency. 2004 to 30 June 2004. Applications received after 30 June but before the 26 July 2004 could be Grant Payments. accepted subject to the application of a late pen- alty. No premium is payable on applications 356. Ms Cooper-Flynn asked the Minister for received on or after 26 July 2004. Agriculture and Food the grants that are avail- able through her Department for marts; the The person named submitted his application number of such applications that have been under the 2004 suckler cow premium scheme on made; the location of same; and the level of grant 9 November 2004. As the application was lodged assistance sought. [30234/04] after the closing dates outlined above, my Department advised him that his application Minister for Agriculture and Food (Mary could not be accepted. He was also advised that Coughlan): Under my Department’s capital he could seek a review of this decision by writing 315 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 316

[Mary Coughlan.] Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform to my Department and supplying any information (Mr. McDowell): I propose to take Questions that he felt would help his case. Nos. 359, 360 and 383. To date, my Department has not received any The Employment Equality Acts 1998 to 2004 request for review. If the person named wishes to prohibit discrimination in the context of employ- seek a review on medical grounds he will need to ment on nine grounds and the Equal Status Acts provide a medical certificate covering the nature 2000 to 2004 prohibit discrimination regarding and dates of his illness. the provision of goods and services, including accommodation on the same nine grounds. Both 358. Mr. P. Breen asked the Minister for Agri- sets of Acts prohibit discrimination on the basis culture and Food the reason a person (details of race, which includes nationality. supplied) in County Clare has not received area There are two independent bodies with statu- aid payment; and if she will make a statement on tory roles, the Equality Authority and the the matter. [30257/04] Equality Tribunal. The authority provides infor- mation and advice on any of the grounds, Minister for Agriculture and Food (Mary whether in an employment or non-employment Coughlan): The person named was selected for a area. A person may seek redress through the good farming practice inspection in 2004. At Equality Tribunal which has the power to refer a inspection a discrepancy in the area of the hold- case for mediation or investigation. If the director ing was found. Pending resolution of the query of the tribunal finds in favour of the complainant, payment of the 2004 area-based compensatory he or she may make an order for award of com- allowance could not be made. The problem has pensation and-or order a specific course of action now been resolved and payment of the full to be taken. amount due will be made to the person named Arising from commitments given by the shortly. Government at the 2001 UN Conference Against Racism in Durban and reaffirmed in Sustaining Human Rights Issues. Progress, I will shortly launch the national action plan against racism. The plan will provide stra- 359. Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in asked the Minister tegic direction to combat racism and to develop for Justice, Equality and Law Reform if his atten- a more inclusive, intercultural society in Ireland. tion has been drawn to the fact that non-nationals It will form the cornerstone of the Government’s who were granted permission to remain here on anti-racism policy. The labour inspectorate of the the basis of their having Irish citizen children are Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employ- facing discrimination by employers who wrongly ment is responsible for monitoring certain believe that a decision (details supplied) retro- employment conditions for all categories of actively stripped them of their employment workers in Ireland, including immigrant workers. rights; the way in which he intends to combat this It is open to inspectors to pursue allegations of problem; and if he will make a statement on the worker mistreatment, to seek redress for the indi- matter. [29993/04] viduals concerned, and to refer matters to the appropriate legal officers for a decision on poss- ´ 360. Caoimhghı´nOCaola´in asked the Minister ible prosecution. for Justice, Equality and Law Reform if his atten- tion has been drawn to the fact that non-nationals Drug Treatment Services. who were granted permission to remain here on the basis of their having Irish citizen children are 361. Mr. J. O’Keeffe asked the Minister for facing discrimination in accessing rental accom- Justice, Equality and Law Reform the position modation through landlords who wrongly believe regarding compulsory drugs testing of prisoners; that a decision (details supplied) retroactively and if he will make a statement on the matter. stripped them of their residency rights; the way [29663/04] in which he intends to combat this problem; and Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform if he will make a statement on the matter. (Mr. McDowell): As envisaged in the programme [29994/04] for Government, the introduction of mandatory drug testing will be central to supporting future ´ 383. Caoimhghı´nOCaola´in asked the Minister policy on drug supply and demand reduction in for Justice, Equality and Law Reform if his atten- prisons. Already prisoners accommodated in the tion has been drawn to the fact that non-nationals open centres at Shelton Abbey and Loughan who were granted permission to remain here on House and in the designated drug-free areas of the basis of their having Irish citizen children are the training unit in the Mountjoy complex, St. facing discrimination by landlords and employers Patrick’s institution and Wheatfield Prison are who wrongly believe that a decision (details required to undergo frequent drug tests to con- supplied) retroactively stripped them of their firm their drug-free status. residency and employment rights; the way in Mandatory drug testing will, however, operate which he intends to combat this problem; and if across the prison system. Crucially, it will, for the he will make a statement on the matter. first time, provide firm information on the preva- [29998/04] lence and nature of drug abuse in the prison 317 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 318 system. It will disclose trends in drug misuse, posals for the creation of mandatory minimum enable identification and referral of drug abusers sentences for certain firearm offences. to treatment programmes, enable enhanced There are no plans to lay down uniform guide- focusing of resources and act as a deterrent to lines and principles on sentencing. The courts are drug misuse. Without this basic information, in the best position to see just what is the proper planning for treatment can never be as focused as sentence. They alone can take all the circum- it should be and resources can never be effec- stances in a particular case into account and seek tively targeted. The introduction of mandatory to ensure that the scales of justice are being prop- drug testing will allow the Irish Prison Service to erly balanced. deploy its resources in the most rational and pro- ductive manner. The new prison rules, which are Judicial Conduct. at an advanced stage of preparation, will include specific provision for mandatory drug testing. 363. Mr. J. O’Keeffe asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the reason for Sentencing Policy. the delay in fulfilling the promise made in the programme for Government regarding legislation 362. Mr. J. O’Keeffe asked the Minister for for judicial conduct; and if he will make a state- Justice, Equality and Law Reform the progress ment on the matter. [29666/04] made to date on legislation laying down uniform guidelines and principles in relation to the pun- 364. Mr. J. O’Keeffe asked the Minister for ishment of offenders; and if he will make a state- Justice, Equality and Law Reform the details of ment on the matter. [29665/04] the general scheme of the proposed legislation for judicial conduct; if the heads of the Bill will be Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform published; and if he will make a statement on the (Mr. McDowell): The traditional approach to matter. [29667/04] sentencing is for the Oireachtas to lay down the maximum penalty and for a court having con- 365. Mr. J. O’Keeffe asked the Minister for sidered all the circumstances of the case to Justice, Equality and Law Reform the anticipated impose an appropriate penalty up to that date of publication of the legislation for judicial maximum. This approach reflects the doctrine of conduct; and if he will make a statement on the the separation of powers. The Executive lays matter. [29668/04] down the possible punishment range but it is for Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the courts to decide the punishment to be applied (Mr. McDowell): I propose to take Questions to the offender taking account of the seriousness Nos. 363 to 365, inclusive, together. of the crime and all the circumstances of the case The programme for Government promised and of the offender. legislation to provide effective remedies for com- With regard to drug offences, part II of the plaints about judicial misbehaviour. The prep- Criminal Justice Act 1999, which came into effect aration of heads of a judicial council Bill is at an on 26 May 1999 provides in section 4 for the advanced stage in my Department, and I expect creation of a new offence related to the pos- to be in a position shortly to bring the heads to session of drugs with a value of IR£10,000 or Government for approval, with a view to pub- \13,000 or more for the purpose of sale or supply, lishing the Bill in the first half of 2005. The legis- which is punishable by up to life imprisonment. lation will provide, among other things, a process It also provides in section 5 that the court shall, for the investigation of complaints about judicial in imposing sentence, specify a minimum period misbehaviour, including lay participation in such of imprisonment to be served of not less than ten investigations. years upon conviction for the offence. It is my intention, as previously stated in Section 5 also provides, however, that a court answer to a question from the Deputy last July, is entitled to depart from the imposition of the to bring the heads of the Bill before the minimum sentence where there are exceptional Oireachtas Joint Committee on Justice, Equality, and specific circumstances relating to the offence Defence and Women’s Rights when they have or the person convicted of the offence which reached a suitable stage so that members of both would make it unjust in all the circumstances to Houses can have a pre-emptive look at how the impose the minimum ten year sentence. Factors legislation is developing. I am confident that the to which the court may have regard in this respect promised legislation will be enacted during the include whether the person pleaded guilty, and if term of office of the present Government; so the so, the stage at which the person indicated the question of a delay in fulfilling the promise made intention to plead guilty and the circumstances in in An Agreed Programme for Government does which the indication was given, and whether the not arise. person materially assisted the investigation of the offence. I am considering bringing forward a Departmental Funding. number of amendments to strengthen these pro- visions by way of amendments to the Criminal 366. Mr. J. O’Keeffe asked the Minister for Justice Bill 2004, which is before the House. I am Justice, Equality and Law Reform how much also considering bringing forward several pro- money was made available to the Judicial Studies 319 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 320

[Mr. J. O’Keeffe.] this individual into this country and the continued Institute in each of the past four years; and if he enforcement of his prison sentence under the will make a statement on the matter. [29669/04] transfer of sentenced persons legislation. However, Irish prison officers are required to Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform provide the escort for prisoners transferring into (Mr. McDowell): The sums of money made avail- this country under the legislation. Due to neces- able to the Judicial Studies Institute in each of sary cutbacks in overtime levels in the Irish the past four years are as follows:. Prison Service, as well as for operational reasons, it has been necessary for the Irish Prison Service Year \ to restrict such prison transfers into Ireland to one per month. Several prisoners are on the list 2001 317,435 for transfer. However, I have been assured that 2002 368,000 this transfer will be effected as soon as is practi- 2003 400,000 cally possible. 2004 400,000 National Drugs Strategy. 369. Mr. Kenny asked the Minister for Justice, Garda Stations. Equality and Law Reform the progress being 367. Mr. Crawford asked the Minister for made in developing a co-ordinated framework on Justice, Equality and Law Reform if he intends drug policy within each Garda district; and if he to downgrade the status of the Garda head- will make a statement on the matter. [29733/04] quarters in Monaghan town; if not, if Monaghan Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform station will be upgraded in view of the failure to (Mr. McDowell): I am informed by the Garda decentralise any worthwhile project to Monaghan authorities that, since March 2004, the Garda town or the north Monaghan region; and if he structures for delivering local drugs strategies will make a statement on the matter. [29681/04] have been enhanced by the establishment of a Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform specific co-ordinating framework for delivering (Mr. McDowell): There are no plans to alter the the organisation’s overall drug strategy. This co- status of Monaghan Garda station. ordinating framework involves the nomination of The Government has approved my proposal to individuals at the following levels within the increase the strength of the Garda Sı´ocha´na to organisation: national, assistant commissioner; 14,000 members on a phased basis, in line with national support services; regional, detective the agreed programme for Government commit- superintendent; divisional, inspector; and district, ment in this regard. This is a key commitment in sergeant. Part of the role of the nominated indi- the programme for Government, and its imple- viduals is the compilation of divisional drug polic- mentation will significantly strengthen the oper- ing plans which reflect local priorities in terms of ational capacity of the force. The Commissioner reduction of supply and demand for drugs. will draw up plans on how best to distribute and 370. Mr. Kenny asked the Minister for Justice, manage these resources. The additional resources Equality and Law Reform the progress to date in will be aimed at the areas of greatest need, as is establishing community policing fora; and if he envisaged in the programme for Government. will make a statement on the matter. [29734/04] The programme identifies particular areas with a significant drugs problem and a large number of Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform public order offences, but it will be possible to (Mr. McDowell): Two community policing fora address other priorities as well, such as the need have been established in the context of the significantly to increase the number of gardaı´ national drugs strategy. These are operating on a allocated to traffic duties. The additional gardaı´ pilot basis under the aegis of the north inner city will not be put on administrative duties. They will and Finglas — Cabra local drugs task forces, be put directly into frontline, operational, high- respectively. visibility policing. They will have a real impact. Also, the Garda Commissioner has established a community policing forum in Dublin’s “A” Prisoner Transfers. Garda district on a pilot basis following extensive 368. Dr. Upton asked the Minister for Justice, consultations between the gardaı´ and community Equality and Law Reform , further to Question interests. The establishment of community polic- No. 290 of 12 October 2004, his views on the fact ing fora, in general, needs to be delivered in the that the person has been moved to a prison in context of an appropriate policy framework for the north of England; and the position regarding what will be relatively new partnership structures efforts to transfer this person to a prison here. involving the gardaı´, local authorities and local [29702/04] communities to deal with a range of issues of mut- ual concern. Such a framework will ensure that Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform community policing fora are developed in an (Mr. McDowell): As I recently informed the appropriate, consistent and properly planned Deputy, my Department has received the High manner. Court warrant which allows for the transfer of 321 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 322

Work is well under way on the development of Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform such a policy framework. The Garda Sı´ocha´na (Mr. McDowell): The Department of Com- Bill 2004 represents the most significant legislat- munity, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs is the lead ive reform of Garda structures since the found- Department in tackling the problem of drug ation of the State. Included in its draft provisions abuse as it co-ordinates the implementation of are mechanisms for enhanced co-operation the National Drug Strategy across the four pillars between the gardaı´ and local authorities through of supply reduction, treatment, education-preven- the establishment, on a statutory basis, of policing tion and research. My Department and its associ- committees. It is intended that such committees ated agencies are mainly concerned with supply will act as fora where matters relating to all reduction. In that context, I am informed by the aspects of policing can be discussed and where Garda authorities that there has been no notice- strategies and recommendations for dealing with able increase in the incidence of abuse of con- issues arising locally can be decided. It is also trolled drugs in the north-eastern region. That intended that these policing committees will does not imply any complacency in the matter. facilitate the establishment of local policing fora Drug law enforcement is a high priority in the to address specific issues in local areas. region and a number of successful operations tar- geting known suppliers of illicit drugs have been Drugs in Prison. conducted this year. 371. Mr. Kenny asked the Minister for Justice, To ensure that a more co-ordinated response is Equality and Law Reform when he expects work in place to tackle the problem of drug misuse on the prison drugs policy to be completed; when across the country, the National Drugs Strategy the policy will be put in place; and if he will make 2001-2008 provides for the establishment of ten a statement on the matter. [29735/04] regional drug task forces, or RDTFs. I under- stand from my colleague, the Minister of State at Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the Department of Community, Rural and Gael- (Mr. McDowell): Preparation of a drugs policy tacht Affairs, that all of these task forces, includ- for the Irish Prison Service is at an advanced ing the north-eastern RDTF, are currently map- stage and I expect to publish it early next year. ping out the nature and extent of drug misuse in The new policy will facilitate consistent regu- their areas with a view to better co-ordination lation and operational structure in pursuing both and addressing gaps in overall service provision. supply and demand reduction. In this context, \500,000 has been provided by the Department of Community, Rural and Gael- Proposed Legislation. tacht Affairs in the current year for administra- 372. Mr. Kenny asked the Minister for Justice, tive and technical assistance costs incurred by the Equality and Law Reform when he expects the ten RDTFs in the preparation of their regional drug offenders Bill to be published and brought action plans. These plans will be completed by before the Houses of the Oireachtas; and if he early 2005 and recommendations on the funding will make a statement on the matter. [29736/04] of the plans will then be brought to the Cabinet committee on social inclusion for approval. Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform The Department of Health and Children has (Mr. McDowell): The purpose of the drug primary responsibility for tackling the problem of offenders Bill as set out in the Government legis- alcohol abuse. The Minister for Health and Chil- lative programme, is to provide for the regis- dren established a strategic task force on alcohol tration of convicted drug dealers with the gardaı´ in January 2002. The terms of reference and to provide for stiffer penalties for persons requested the task force to review international involved in the supply of drugs to a prisoner in research in order to identify evidence-based accordance with the commitments in An Agreed measures effective in preventing alcohol related Programme for Government. Work on prep- harm. It was also requested to recommend spec- aration of the Bill is at a preliminary stage of ific, evidence-based measures to Government to examination and I am not yet in a position to prevent and reduce alcohol related harm in indicate a timeframe for its publication. However, Ireland. The task force has published two reports I am examining proposals on the creation of an which contain approximately 100 recommend- offence of supplying controlled drugs to a prison ations. These recommendations provide a blue- or place of detention with a view to bringing for- print for tackling alcohol problems in Ireland. ward appropriate amendments for inclusion in The second report is due to go to Government in the Criminal Justice Bill 2004 which is currently the near future. As is the case with drug abuse, before the House. the gardaı´ in the north-eastern region are pro- active when it comes to law enforcement in the 373. Mr. Connolly asked the Minister for area of alcohol abuse. Justice, Equality and Law Reform his views on the increase in drugs and alcohol abuse in the 374. Mr. Connolly asked the Minister for north-east region; the strategies that are in place Justice, Equality and Law Reform if he has for- to deal with it; and if he will make a statement mulated proposals to address this increasing on the matter. [29752/04] problem of driving under the influence of drugs; 323 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 324

[Mr. Connolly.] cerned as soon as I have reached a decision in and if he will make a statement on the matter. this case. [29753/04] Refugee Status. Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform 376. Mr. Allen asked the Minister for Justice, (Mr. McDowell): Road traffic legislation is the Equality and Law Reform the reason the appli- responsibility of the Minister for Transport. The cation by a person (details supplied) for refugee influence of drugs on driving behaviour is an issue status was rejected. [29775/04] of increasing concern. However, identification of the presence of drugs is more complex than for Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform alcohol. It is illegal in Ireland to drive while under (Mr. McDowell): It is not the practice to com- the influence of drugs to such an extent as to be ment in detail on individual asylum applications. incapable of having proper control of the vehicle. Applications are processed in accordance with Section 49 of the Road Traffic Act 1961, as the provisions of the Refugee Act 1996, as inserted by section 10 of the Road Traffic Act amended and in particular having due regard to 1994, prohibits the driving of a mechanically pro- the definition of a “refugee” in section 2 of that pelled vehicle by a person while under the influ- Act which states that a refugee is a person who, ence of an intoxicant. An intoxicant includes owing to a well founded fear of being persecuted alcohol and drugs and any combination of drugs for reasons of race, religion, nationality, member- and alcohol. Enforcement of the law on drug ship of a particular social group or political driving is a matter for the gardaı´. When a Garda opinion, is outside the country of his or her suspects that a motorist is driving under the influ- nationality and is unable or, owing to such fear, ence of any intoxicant, he or she may arrest the is unwilling to avail himself or herself of the pro- suspect under section 49 of the Road Traffic Act tection of that country; or who, not having a 1961. nationality and being outside the country of his The Medical Bureau of Road Safety continues or her former habitual residence, is unable or, to analyse specimens for the presence of drugs. owing to such fear, is unwilling to return to it. Since 1 January 2002 all samples found under the In considering an asylum claim, consideration legal limit for alcohol are automatically tested for is given to the subjective and objective elements the presence of a drug or drugs as well as cases of the application. The subjective element of an where the gardaı´ request that a test for drugs take asylum application concerns the applicant’s indi- place. In order to advance research on drugs and vidual circumstances as they are perceived and driving in Ireland, additional funding was made described by him or her. The objective element available to the Medical Bureau of Road Safety of the application concerns the relevant country for a two-year programme of drug analysis of of origin information which comes from a wide blood and urine specimens, the results of which variety of sources including information from were published in June 2004. A total of 2,000 organisations such as the UNHCR, Amnesty specimens were selected for drug analysis, 1,000 International, the US State Department, Canad- with results under the limit for alcohol and 1,000 ian Boards of Immigration and other EU member over the limit. Of those samples with essentially states as well as media and internet sources. In zero levels of alcohol, 68% were positive for one addition to these periodically updated sources, or more drugs. The recently published Road the Office of the Refugee Applications Com- Safety Strategy 2004-2006 proposes that the missioner and the Refugee Appeals Tribunal MBRS together with the department of forensic have access to up to date news reports regarding medicine at University College Dublin will put in events and developments in the countries place an education programme in drug recognit- concerned. ion techniques for gardaı´ and doctors in order to further facilitate the operation of drug testing. Asylum Applications. 377. Mr. M. Higgins asked the Minister for Citizenship Applications. Justice, Equality and Law Reform the details of 375. Mr. Gogarty asked the Minister for his response to the advice given by the UNHCR Justice, Equality and Law Reform when a regarding the treatment of Iraqi asylum seekers, decision will be made on the application for Irish including those who have been rejected. citizenship by a person (details supplied) in [29783/04] County Dublin; and if he will make a statement Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform on the matter. [29760/04] (Mr. McDowell): As the Deputy will be aware, Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform processing of asylum applications in Ireland is (Mr. McDowell): I have been informed by carried out within an independent statutory officials in the citizenship section of my Depart- framework as set out in the Refugee Act 1996, as ment that the processing of the application for amended. This Act provides for an investigation naturalisation from the person concerned has at first instance by the independent Office of the now been completed and that it is due to be for- Refugee Applications Commissioner, ORAC, warded to me for a decision in the coming weeks. and any subsequent appeals by the independent I will inform the Deputy and the person con- Refugee Appeals Tribunal, RAT. The granting of 325 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 326 refugee status in Ireland is considered in accord- initiated arising from the events of that day. In ance with the definition of refugee contained in all the circumstances, I do not think it would be section 2 of the Refugee Act 1996, as amended. appropriate for me to comment further at this In March 2003, UNHCR advised countries to stage. suspend all forced returns to Iraq, and further requested the suspension of individual processing Alcohol Promotions. of asylum requests. The ORAC and RAT sub- 379. Mr. R. Bruton asked the Minister for sequently took a decision to suspend processing Justice, Equality and Law Reform if the new pro- of applications for asylum from Iraqi nationals in vision planning drink promotions at concession- light of this advice and as the rapidly evolving ary prices is in force; if publicans are entitled to situation in Iraq had made meaningful analysis of designate a certain night of the week on which applications unfeasible. Throughout 2003, ORAC drink will be available cheaper on their premises; and RAT liaised with UNHCR regarding their and if he will make a statement on the matter. position on Iraq and the processing of Iraqi [29813/04] nationals. ORAC re-commenced processing of Iraqi Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform applicants in March 2004. Interviews were con- (Mr. McDowell): The position is that section 20 ducted with all Iraqi applicants on hands and of the Intoxicating Liquor Act 2003 prohibits the these cases have since been determined at first supply of intoxicating liquor at a reduced price stage. Given the length of time which has elapsed during a limited period on any day. It is intended since their initial application, applicants were to discourage practices which may lead to excess- given the opportunity to submit any additional ive consumption of intoxicating liquor, such as information which they wished to have taken into “happy hours” and it came into operation on 18 account in the determination of their case. In con- August 2003. For the purposes of section 20, “re- sidering such applications and determining duced price” is defined as a price less than that whether to grant refugee status, account was regularly being charged for the intoxicating liquor taken of the UNHCR advice to states on the during an earlier period after 10.30 a.m. on the possibility of persecution emanating from non- day concerned and after 12.30 p.m. on a Sunday. state agents currently active in Iraq and to the It does not, therefore, prohibit commercial prac- potential relevance of past persecution in tices such as an annual wine sale or a product determining whether to grant refugee status. Fol- promotions taking place over one or more days, lowing this decision by ORAC, the RAT sub- as long as intoxicating liquor is not sold at a sequently resumed processing of Iraqi cases on reduced price during a limited period after 10.30 appeal as they arose. a.m. on any day. In deciding whether or not to deport a person, Section 22 of the 2003 Act provides for the including a failed asylum seeker, one of the making, should the need arise, of regulations pro- factors considered is the refoulement provision in hibiting or restricting a licensee from doing or section 5 of the Refugee Act 1996, as amended. permitting, for the purposes of promoting the In relation to potential returnees to Iraq, the cur- licensee’s business or any event or activity taking rent situation in that country is assessed. Each place on the licensed premises, anything that is case is considered on an individual basis and the intended or likely to encourage persons on those situation in Iraq is monitored regularly to ascer- premises to consume intoxicating liquor to an tain whether persons can be returned there. The excessive extent. current advice of the UNHCR on returns forms an important part of the assessment of the Iraqi Departmental Correspondence. caseload. 380. Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in asked the Minister Garda Disciplinary Proceedings. for Justice, Equality and Law Reform if he will provide a substantive response to correspondence 378. Mr. Cuffe asked the Minister for Justice, he has twice received from this Deputy in the Equality and Law Reform if he intends to publish matter of a person (details supplied) in County the internal Garda review into the events at the Donegal. [29816/04] reclaim the streets manifestation in Dublin city centre on 6 May 2002. [29803/04] Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Mr. McDowell): I expect that the Deputy will by Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform now have received my recent response to him on (Mr. McDowell): The circumstances surrounding the matter he has raised. the events of the demonstration in Dublin on 6 May 2002 were investigated by the Garda Sı´och- Garda Strength. a´na and as a result of that investigation, a file containing certain recommendations was for- 381. Mr. P. McGrath asked the Minister for warded to the Director of Public Prosecutions for Justice, Equality and Law Reform further to his directions. Prosecutions were instigated in a Parliamentary Question No. 293 of 12 October number of cases and while some cases have been 2004, if he is unable to give the population of dealt with by the courts others are still pending. gardaı´ in sub-districts and the way in which he Separately, certain civil actions have been can thus ensure that Garda resources are allo- 327 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 328

[Mr. P. McGrath.] Registration of Title. cated appropriately in heavily populated areas; 384. Mr. Ring asked the Minister for Justice, and if he will make a statement on the matter. Equality and Law Reform if the Land Registry [29838/04] Office will expedite any applications pending on Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform a folio for a person (details supplied) in County (Mr. McDowell): Population statistics do not cor- Mayo; and when this matter will be finalised. relate to Garda sub-district boundaries. Follow- [29999/04] ing each census of population the Central Statis- Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform tics Office, on completing its analysis, supplies the (Mr. McDowell): I am informed by the Registrar Garda Sı´ocha´na with population figures for each of Titles that this is an application under Section Garda division and district only. The 1996 data is 49 (acquisition of title by virtue of long the most recent available, as the breakdown from possession) of the Registration of Title Act 1964, the 2002 census has not yet been supplied. which was lodged on 4 August, 2004 — dealing However, in conjunction with the CSO, a pro- No. D2004SM006422R refers. Due to their com- gramme is underway to further sub-divide the plicated nature, applications under section 49, 2002 data. This will enable the Garda Sı´ocha´na to which require detailed examination of claims for quantify the population of Garda sub-districts. It registration as owners, can take some time to pro- is expected that this additional information will cess. Accordingly, it is not possible to estimate a be available in early 2005. District and divisional completion date at this stage. The application is data will continue to be produced. receiving attention in the Land Registry and will I have been informed by the Garda authorities, be completed as soon as possible. who are responsible for the detailed allocation of resources, that Garda personnel allocation Garda Stations. throughout the country is continually monitored and reviewed by Garda management to ensure 385. Mr. Ring asked the Minister for Justice, that the optimum use is made of Garda person- Equality and Law Reform when a Garda station nel. The Government has approved my proposal (details supplied) in County Mayo will be to increase the strength of the Garda Sı´ocha´na to officially opened; and if the new station has the 14,000 members on a phased basis, in line with PULSE computer system. [30000/04] the agreed programme for Government commit- Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform ment in this regard. This is a key commitment in (Mr. McDowell): I have no plans, at this time, to the programme for Government, and its imple- officially open the Garda station at the location mentation will significantly strengthen the oper- referred to by the Deputy, which has been com- ational capacity of the force. The Garda Com- pleted and is occupied. I am informed by the missioner will now be drawing up plans on how Garda authorities that their intention is to pro- best to distribute and manage these resources. vide a PULSE connection to the station in the However, the additional resources will be tar- new year. geted at the areas of greatest need, as is envisaged in the programme for Government. The pro- Commuinications Masts. gramme identifies areas with a significant drugs problem and a large number of public order 386. Mr. Gregory asked the Minister for offences, but it will be possible to address other Justice, Equality and Law Reform , further to priorities as well, such as the need to significantly Question No. 235 of 16 November 2004, if such a increase the number of gardaı´ allocated to traffic survey will be carried in view of the fact that it is duties. One thing I have promised is that the standard annual practise in many other countries; additional gardaı´ will not be put on administra- and if he will make a statement on the matter. tive duties. They will be put directly into front [30114/04] line, operational, high visibility policing. They will Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform have a real impact. (Mr. McDowell): I am informed by the Garda authorities that, they do not intend to carry out a Departmental Correspondence. survey of the electromagnetic field strength of the 382. Mr. Naughten asked the Minister for mast at the station referred to by the Deputy. In Justice, Equality and Law Reform if he will fur- my reply to the Deputy to Parliamentary Ques- nish a reply to correspondence as outlined in the tion No. 168 of 4 November 2004, I outlined the reply to Question No. 1072 of 29 September 2004; approach being adopted generally by the Garda and if he will make a statement on the matter. Sı´ocha´na to the measurement of the electromag- [29955/04] netic field strengths on masts located at Garda stations. Comreg, which is the licensing authority, Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform also commissions independent surveys to ensure (Mr. McDowell): I intend to furnish a reply to the service providers and the Garda Sı´ocha´na comply correspondence in question in the near future. fully with licence conditions which includes emis- sion limits in compliance with the guidelines of Question No. 383 answered with Question the International Commission for Non-Ionising No. 359 Radiation. 329 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 330

Closed Circuit Television Systems. (Sexual Offences) Act 1993 is being used by the gardaı´ and that the area will continue to receive 387. Mr. Costello asked the Minister for close attention. The number of women arrested Justice, Equality and Law Reform when the for soliciting in the area for each of the past five recommendations of the expert committee on the years is as set out hereunder: installation of closed circuit television cameras in an area (details supplied) in Dublin city will be Year Arrests published; the number of gardaı´ who are employed full time in dealing with the problem 1999 24 of prostitution in the area; the number of women 2000 44 who have been arrested for soliciting in the area 2001 44 for each of the past five years; the number of men 2002 97 who have been arrested for soliciting the services 2003 89 of prostitutes in each of the past five years; the number of pimps living off immoral earnings in the area who have been arrested in each of the The number of men arrested for soliciting the ser- vices of prostitutes in the area for each of the past past five years; the number of prosecutions and five years is as set out hereunder: the number of convictions in all these cases; and if he will make a statement on the matter. Year Arrests [30115/04] Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform 1999 31 (Mr. McDowell): I am informed by the Garda 2000 22 authorities that local Garda management is aware 2001 44 of the current problems in the Montpelier Hill — 2002 63 Arbour Hill — Benburb Street area. The 2003 58 Montpelier Hill area and surrounding streets are the subject of regular foot and mobile patrols by There have been no arrests in respect of persons both uniformed and plain clothes gardaı´. Two living off immoral earnings in the area from 1999 gardaı´ are employed full time in dealing with to 2003 inclusive. The number of prosecutions prostitution in the area concerned. I am assured and the number of convictions in all of the cases the current legislation under the Criminal Law above is as follows:

Year Women Men

Prosecuted Convicted Prosecuted Convicted

1999 24 22 31 22 2000 44 21 22 09 2001 44 20 44 16 2002 97 66 63 25 2003 89 44 58 42

The CCTV advisory committee, established by Road Traffic Offences. the Garda Commissioner to advise on CCTV 389. Mr. M. Brady asked the Minister for matters, has received a report from the chief Justice, Equality and Law Reform the number of superintendent of the north central division of the prosecutions for non-tax or insurance; and the Dublin metropolitan region which encompasses number of vehicles confiscated. [30118/04] the area in question, outlining the CCTV require- ments of the division. The advisory committee is Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform still considering this report and is not in a position (Mr. McDowell): The number of prosecutions for to make recommendations on the matter to the non-tax or insurance in which proceedings com- commissioner at present. menced in 2003 are as follows:

Visa Applications. No road tax 16,451 388. Mr. J. O’Keeffe asked the Minister for No Insurance 30,430 Justice, Equality and Law Reform if a holiday visa for a person (details supplied) will be approved. [30117/04] Between 1 January 2003 and 31 December 2003, the number of vehicles seized under the pro- Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform visions of section 41 of the Road Traffic Act 1994 (Mr. McDowell): The visa in question was is 9,800. approved by my Department on 18 November 2004. 390. Mr. M. Brady asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the number of 331 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 332

[Mr. M. Brady.] Garda Stations. vehicles, that is, cars and motorcycles in Garda 392. Mr. M. Brady asked the Minister for stations (details supplied). [30119/04] Justice, Equality and Law Reform if there are plans to refurbish Coolock Garda station. Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform [30121/04] (Mr. McDowell): The number of vehicles in the Garda stations referred to by the Deputy is as Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform follows: (Mr. McDowell): All Garda accommodation is kept under review by the Garda authorities. Station Make and Model Although there are no plans at present to refur- bish Coolock Garda station, the Garda housing Raheny Fiat Punto (1) officer is due to visit the station with a view to Renault Megane 1.6 (1) determining the future accommodation require- Toyota Corolla 1.4 (1) ments there. Toyota Avensis (1) Ford Transit (1) Garda Deployment. Ford Mondeo 2.0 (1) 393. Mr. M. Brady asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform when it is Coolock Toyota Corolla 1.4 (5) planned to replace gardaı´ on clerical duties with Ford Transit (2) civilian staff. [30122/04] Ford Mondeo 2.0 (1) Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform Howth Kawasaki GT 550 (1) (Mr. McDowell): I refer the Deputy to my Ford Focus 1.4 (1) response to Question No. 428 of 17 November Ford Mondeo 2.0 (1) 2004. In 2001 the Government approved an Toyota Corolla 1.4 (1) extensive programme of civilianisation to be introduced on a phased basis over a number of years. The programme provided for the civilianis- Probation and Welfare Service. ation of a number of technical and administrative posts in the short, medium and long term, the 391. Mr. M. Brady asked the Minister for transfer of the finance function from Garda dis- Justice, Equality and Law Reform if he will trict clerks to civilian staff, and the transfer of civ- report on the Donaghmede probation office, ilian staff from my Department to the Garda including the number of staff engaged on duties Sı´ocha´na as civil servants of the State. and the number of offenders dealt with weekly; The transfer of civilian staff of my Department and if he will meet with the Donaghmede resi- to the Garda Sı´ocha´na is provided for in the dents association to discuss the centre. Garda Sı´ocha´na Bill 2004 which is currently [30120/04] before the Oireachtas, while the transfer of the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform finance function is now almost complete. (Mr. McDowell): The probation office in Don- However, the next phase of the civilianisation aghmede opened to its clients at the end of March programme including the civilianisation of the 2004. Since then it has seen an average of 58 posts above will have to be rolled out within the clients every month. The offices accommodate confines of the Government decision of 4 two teams of 12 probation and welfare officers, December 2002, which placed a cap on numbers two senior probation and welfare officers and two across the civil and public service. My Depart- clerical officers. One team covers the local catch- ment is currently reviewing the position with both ment area while another specifically deals with the Department of Finance and Garda manage- referrals under the Children Act 2001. A moni- ment as to how we will proceed further with toring group for the office was established com- Garda civilianisation in the context of the overall prising representatives of the traders of the shop- constraints of civil and public service numbers. ping centre, the property management group, the 394. Mr. M. Brady asked the Minister for probation and welfare service and the gardaı´ Justice, Equality and Law Reform the number of under an independent chairperson. Representa- gardaı´ in the drug squad unit in the Dublin north- tives of the residents association have declined east area (details supplied). [30123/04] participation in the group to date. The monitoring group will report to me after a Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform period of 12 months of operation of the office (Mr. McDowell): I am informed by the Garda with regard to any increase in criminality which authorities, which are responsible for the detailed is found to be linked to the operation of the pro- allocation of resources, that the personnel bation and welfare service in Donaghmede shop- strength of the drug squad unit in the Dublin ping centre. It is my intention to take action, if in north-east area as at 22 November 2004 was 26, the collective opinion of the monitoring group, it all ranks. I am very pleased to say that the transpires that the presence of the probation and Government has approved my proposal to welfare office in the shopping centre is linked to increase the strength of the Garda Sı´ocha´na to a significant rise in crime in the area. 333 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 334

14,000 members on a phased basis, in line with line, operational, high visibility policing and they the agreed programme for Government commit- will have a real impact. ment in this regard. This is a key commitment in the programme for Government, and its imple- Garda Recruitment. mentation will significantly strengthen the oper- 396. Mr. M. Brady asked the Minister for ational capacity of the force. The Commissioner Justice, Equality and Law Reform the number of will now be drawing up plans on how best to dis- Garda recruits who can be accommodated in tribute and manage these resources. However, Templemore training centre on an annual basis; the additional resources will be targeted at the and if there are plans to extend the training areas of greatest need, as is envisaged in the pro- centre. [30125/04] gramme for Government. The programme iden- tifies in particular areas with a significant drugs Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform problem and a large number of public order (Mr. McDowell): The Garda college currently has offences, but it will be possible to address other a capacity to induct a maximum of 640 trainees priorities as well, such as the need to significantly per annum. Accommodation is provided for increase the number of gardaı´ allocated to traffic trainees at the Garda college and externally by duties. One thing I have already promised is that the operation of the student living out pro- the additional gardaı´ will not be put on adminis- gramme, which may be extended as the need trative duties. They will be put directly into front arises. As part of my proposal to increase the line, operational, high visibility policing and they strength of the force to 14,000, in line with the will have a real impact. Government’s commitment set out in An Agreed Programme for Government, the Garda will Garda Operations. recruit 1,096 trainees in each of the next three years. To facilitate this accelerated recruitment, 395. Mr. M. Brady asked the Minister for a significant enhancement of the Garda college Justice, Equality and Law Reform if, in view of facilities is underway. the fact that motor tax is computerised, there are A new four-storey block will be built which will plans to release gardaı´ from duties of checking provide for central administration and free up the tax discs to enable them to carry out more essen- teaching blocks for classroom use. New library tial duties. [30124/04] and gymnasium facilities will also be provided Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform and existing catering and canteen facilities will be (Mr. McDowell): The enforcement of motor tax expanded. The plans for all of this are being offences is the responsibility of the Garda Sı´och- advanced by the Office of Public Works and con- a´na. The checking of vehicles for motor tax is not struction will be completed by the end of next a stand alone function of the Garda Sı´ocha´na but year in time for the peak inflow of new recruits is carried out whilse checking vehicles and drivers to the college. Work will also be undertaken to for other violations of road traffic and transport relocate the tactical training facility, which will be law, such as driving licence, insurance, drink driv- displaced by the new building. ing, seat belt wearing, illegal haulage, tachograph In addition, the Garda Commissioner will tem- and road worthiness of vehicle offences. There is porarily move the majority of in-service training further added value to the carrying out of such out of the Garda college to a new location. This checks in terms of crime prevention and detec- will enable the Garda college to concentrate tion. The Garda authorities have no plans to mainly on training new recruits arising from the divert personnel from such enforcement duties. accelerated recruitment campaign. The OPW has The Government has approved my proposal to advertised for expressions of interest in the pro- increase the strength of the Garda Sı´ocha´na to vision of the new accommodation for in-service 14,000 members on a phased basis, in line with training. This outsourced facility will provide the agreed programme for Government commit- accommodation for up to 100 gardaı´, with class- ment in this regard. This is a key commitment in room and lecture facilities. the programme for Government, and its imple- mentation will significantly strengthen the oper- Departmental Staff. ational capacity of the force. The commissioner 397. Mr. Costello asked the Minister for will now be drawing up plans on how best to dis- Justice, Equality and Law Reform with regard to tribute and manage these resources. However, the decision to sell his headquarters at St. the additional resources will be targeted at the Stephen’s Green, the number of staff to be relo- areas of greatest need, as is envisaged in the pro- cated; the number of staff who have relocated to gramme for Government. The programme iden- date; the alternative offices and premises that tifies in particular areas with a significant drugs have been acquired for this purpose; if such problem and a large number of public order premises have been purchased or leased in each offences, but it will be possible to address other case; and the purchase cost or annual rental of priorities as well, such as the need to significantly each such property in each case. [30186/04] increase the number of gardaı´ allocated to traffic duties. One thing I have promised is that the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform additional gardaı´ will not be put on administra- (Mr. McDowell): Some 305 staff relocated from tive duties. They will be put directly into front my Department’s headquarters at 72-76 St. 335 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 336

[Mr. McDowell.] details of a particular case, I will set out the gen- Stephen’s Green in late 2003 to alternative eral position. The acquisition of Irish citizenship accommodation at 94 St. Stephen’s Green, Block through the naturalisation process is a privilege, C, Ardilaun House on St. Stephen’s Green and rather than a right. The discretionary nature of the Old Faculty Building on Shelbourne Road in the naturalisation process is in keeping with inter- Ballsbridge. Some of this accommodation was national practice. It is not the case, therefore, that already under lease by the Office of Public a person who is resident here has a right to natu- Works. This includes one floor at 94 St. Stephen’s ralisation after a certain period of time, even an Green and the ground floor in Block C, Ardilaun extended period of time. All decisions on natural- House. The Old Faculty Building, Shelbourne isation, even where all the statutory conditions Road is in State ownership. The cost of leasing for naturalisation have been fulfilled, have been extra office space at 94 St. Stephen’s Green is made at the “absolute discretion” of the Minister \357,150 per annum. The sale of 72-76 St. for Justice, Equality and Law Reform since 1935. Stephen’s Green realised \52.3 million. The granting of permission to a non-national to reside in the State for an extended period of time Garda Operations. is not contingent on the acquisition of Irish 398. Mr. Cuffe asked the Minister for Justice, citizenship. Many non-nationals who reside here Equality and Law Reform if he has an estimate have not applied for Irish citizenship, in some for the amount of time spent by the Garda Sı´och- cases because it would impact upon their citizen- a´na in the past year in responding to false alarms ship of origin. Section 15(d) of the Irish National- from automatic domestic alarms (details ity and Citizenship Act 1956 provides that an supplied); his views on whether this is a wise use applicant for a certificate of naturalisation must of resources; and if he will make a statement on have one year’s continuous residence in the State the matter. [30203/04] immediately before the date of application and, during the eight years immediately preceding that Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform period, must have had a total residence in the (Mr. McDowell): The Garda authorities are not State amounting to four years. in a position to quantify the amount of time spent Section 16A of the Irish Nationality and answering false alarms. The Garda authorities Citizenship Act, 2001 qualified that residency have conducted a review of policy on this matter requirement to the effect that when calculating and I am advised that they are now in discussion residence in the State in respect of an applicant with the security industry on revised arrange- for naturalisation who is required to have per- ments. Agreement on revised arrangements mission to reside in the State, no period will be should have a significant effect in reducing the reckoned where the applicant does not have such number of false alarms. permission. In addition, any time spent seeking to be recognised as a refugee or for the purpose of Film Censorship. study must also be discounted. Any non-national 399. Mr. Wall asked the Minister for Justice, who has not completed the requisite period of Equality and Law Reform his views on corre- residence at the time of his or her application for spondence (details supplied); and if he will make naturalisation can reapply when he or she has a statement on the matter. [30251/04] completed the requisite period. Failure to acquire citizenship does not preclude the granting or Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform retention of residency permission. (Mr. McDowell): The office of film censor was created by the Censorship of Films Act 1923. The Deportation Orders. film censor is appointed to undertake the func- 401. Aengus O´ Snodaigh asked the Minister for tions provided for in this and subsequent legis- Justice, Equality and Law Reform the number of lation, including the Video Recordings Act 1989. Irish citizen children removed with their non- As the film censor is independent in the exercise national parents during the mass deportation of of his official functions, it would be inappropriate 16 November 2004; the countries to which they for me to intervene in individual cases. Section 8 were sent; if there was a similar mass deportation of the Censorship of Films Act 1923 provides for on 17 November 2004; if so, the number of Irish review of decisions made by the film censor on citizen children removed with their non-national foot of the provisions of the Act. parents; and the countries to which they were sent. [30297/04] Citizenship Applications. Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform 400. Mr. Ferris asked the Minister for Justice, (Mr. McDowell): A total of 71 persons were Equality and Law Reform if a migrant worker returned to Romania and Moldova on a char- who has been made illegal for a period of time tered aircraft on the night of 16 November 2004 through no fault of their own may apply that time in an operation carried out by the Garda national to their five years residency requirement for natu- immigration bureau. Some 47 adults and ten ralisation. [30296/04] minors were brought to Romania and 14 adults Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform were brought to Moldova. In addition to the 71 (Mr. McDowell): As the Deputy has not provided persons removed, an Irish-born child was taken 337 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 338 back to Romania by her mother, who indicated whose role is to investigate the circumstances in that she wished to return to that country. It is which they were used. misleading to characterise the operation that took One of the key objectives of the Garda Sı´och- place as a mass deportation, as that term implies a´na Bill 2004, which will commence Committee that an individual consideration of cases had not Stage in the Seanad soon, is the establishment of taken place. Individual consideration was an independent Garda ombudsman commission afforded in every case, in accordance with the rel- to replace the existing Garda Complaints Board. evant legislation. The primary function of the ombudsman com- mission will be to investigate complaints by Garda Sıocha´na Band. ´ members of the public against members of the 402. Aengus O´ Snodaigh asked the Minister for Garda. It will have comprehensive powers of Justice, Equality and Law Reform the current investigation and ultimate control and oversight strength of the Garda Sı´ocha´na band; the total of all complaints processed in accordance with cost of running same; the number of overtime the provisions of the Bill. It will have the power hours involved in 2003 in running the band; if the to investigate any case involving the Garda in gardaı´ assigned to the band have other policing which death or serious harm to a person has duties; if consideration has been given to ending occurred, if such an investigation is desirable in the band and reallocating its number to front-line the public interest or if it appears to the com- policing duties. [30299/04] mission that a member of the Garda may have Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform committed an offence or behaved in a manner (Mr. McDowell): It has not been possible to com- that would justify disciplinary proceedings. Pro- pile the detailed information requested by the posals for the establishment of the ombudsman Deputy in the time available for answering commission are contained in the Garda Sı´ocha´na parliamentary questions. The information is Bill 2004. being compiled and I will forward it to the Deputy shortly. Citizenship Applications. Garda Equipment. 404. Aengus O´ Snodaigh asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the number of ´ 403. Aengus O Snodaigh asked the Minister for naturalisation applications made since 1997 in Justice, Equality and Law Reform if he will total and by category; the number and percentage report on the guidelines for deployment of less of such applications granted in total and by cate- lethal weapons authorised for use by the emer- gory; the number of such applications pending gency response unit; if his attention has been drawn to the fact that the Minister for Defence decision in total and by category; the total has indicated that he will publish such guidelines number and percentage of refusals in each cate- if these weapons are adopted for use by the gory; and the reasons therefor. [30302/04] Defence Forces on ACP operations; if the PSNI Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform guidelines for deployment are in the public (Mr. McDowell): Some 15,015 applications for domain; if his attention has further been drawn to naturalisation were received from 1997 until the the fact that each instance of use is automatically end of October 2004, of which 10,603 were scrutinised by the Police ombudsman; and if he received after 1 January 2002. Certificates were has similar plans for this jurisdiction when the issued in 6,422 cases, or 42.77% of all cases and ombudsman commission has been created. [30301/04] 1,075 applications, or 7.16% of the total, were refused in the same period. Some 7,518 appli- Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform cations, or 50.07% of the total, were outstanding (Mr. McDowell): On 19 November 2002, the at the end of October 2004. It should be noted Government noted my proposal to authorise the that the numbers of certificates issued or appli- introduction of three “less than lethal” devices cations refused in the aforementioned period do for use by the Garda emergency response unit not necessarily refer to applications received dur- when it is necessary to avoid the use of firearms. ing that same period. The use of “less than lethal” devices is restricted Statistical information available in the citizen- to the unit. Guidelines on the use of authorised ship section of the Department of Justice, less lethal weapons by the Garda are constantly Equality and Law Reform has always been based under review to reflect operational and techno- logical developments in less lethal alternatives. on the number of applications received, certifi- The guidelines are an operational matter for the cates issued and applications refused. Records are Garda Commissioner. The operation of such wea- not maintained in a way that would permit the pons by the Defence Forces is a matter for the reasons for decisions to grant or refuse appli- Minister for Defence. The guidelines for use of cations to be quantified objectively. Reasons for such weapons by the PSNI and the publication of refusing a certificate of naturalisation include such guidelines are matters for the PSNI. non-compliance with residency requirements, not Instances of use of “less lethal” devices by the being of good character and long-term depen- PSNI are referred to the police ombudsman dency on State support. 339 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 340

Prisons Inspectorate. 408. Mr. J. O’Keeffe asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform if it is less 405. Aengus O´ Snodaigh asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the reason for costly for the State to engage serving prison the delay in publishing the annual report for 2003 officers or a private security firm to maintain a of the prisons inspectorate; when it is likely to presence at unoccupied prisons; and if he will be published; and if and when he will take the make a statement on the matter. [30323/04] necessary steps to establish the prisons inspector- 409. Mr. J. O’Keeffe asked the Minister for ate as an independent statutory organisation with Justice, Equality and Law Reform the amount adequate resources. [30303/04] paid in overtime to prison officers serving at Fort Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform Mitchell Prison and the Curragh Prison since (Mr. McDowell): Under his terms of reference, their closure, up to 18 November 2004; and if he the Inspector of Prisons and Places of Detention will make a statement on the matter. [30324/04] is required to submit a written report on his Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform activities to the Minister for Justice, Equality and (Mr. McDowell): I propose to take Questions Law Reform each year. I arranged for the publi- Nos. 407 to 409, inclusive, together. cation of the first annual report of the inspector, I refer the Deputy to the answers provided to which was provided in 2003. The inspector sub- Questions Nos. 228 and 299 of 16 November mitted his second annual report to my office in 2004, which are relevant to the matter in hand. I May 2004. The second report raises certain legal said on that date that a small cohort of prison issues that need to be addressed, however. I am staff is assigned to duties at the Curragh and Fort in correspondence with the inspector to ascertain Mitchel for security reasons and because of the if the issues can be resolved so that we can pro- need to carry out essential maintenance. I indi- ceed to the publication phase as soon as possible. cated that there are 11 and 12 staff serving at the The Inspector of Prisons and Places of Deten- Curragh and Fort Mitchel, respectively, and that tion has a staff of three persons — a special overtime payments paid to them are made on the adviser, an executive officer and a personal assist- same basis as overtime payments at all other ant — assigned to his office. The creation of locations in the Prison Service. Overtime is neces- additional posts in the Civil Service, including in sary in the prisons because of the pattern of cover the Inspector of Prisons and Places of Detention’s required to maintain security all day, every day office, is precluded by a Government decision and the small number of staff providing that taken in December 2002. The inspector also cover. Approximately \162,000 was paid in over- avails of the services of a number of experts in a time to prison officers serving at the Curragh and range of fields to assist him in fulfilling his duties, Fort Mitchel from the time they were mothballed as and when he believes it necessary and appro- until 30 September 2004. Up-to-date figures are priate. The question of establishing independent not available. It should be noted that Fort Mit- inspection arrangements on a statutory basis is chel was fully operational until it was mothballed under consideration. on 10 February 2004 and the Curragh was fully operational until it was mothballed on 20 Janu- Prisoner Complaints Procedures. ary 2004. 406. Aengus O´ Snodaigh asked the Minister for Serving prison officers are being used, rather Justice, Equality and Law Reform if his attention than a private security firm, because there was no has been drawn to any other cases either past or question of staff losing their jobs as a result of the pending apart from that of a person (details mothballing of the Curragh and Fort Mitchel. It supplied) by former prisoners against the State made sense to retain a small cadre of the staff due to the use of solitary confinement as a form from the institutions rather than retaining private of punishment within the State’s prisons. security firms which would have incurred [30304/04] additional costs. It would not have been appro- priate to retain a private security firm, given that Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the institutions were not being closed, but moth- (Mr. McDowell): The Irish Prison Service does balled so they can be reopened at short notice if not use solitary confinement, although there is the Government decides on that course of action. provision in the prison rules for the use of close As I said, the Prison Service has saved over \6 confinement. I am not aware of any such other million in respect of pay costs for both facilities claims by former prisoners. in the first nine months of 2004, compared to the same nine-month period in 2003. Significant over- Irish Prison Service. all savings have been made in prison officer over- 407. Mr. J. O’Keeffe asked the Minister for time in 2004. The mothballing of the Curragh and Justice, Equality and Law Reform the reason Fort Mitchel continues to achieve the Govern- overtime payments are made on the same basis ment’s objective of significantly reducing over- to prison officers at a prison which has no inmates time levels in the Prison Service. Most of the staff as to prison officers at a prison which has inmates; from the institutions have been redeployed to and if he will make a statement on the matter. effect overtime savings in other Prison Service [30322/04] institutions. 341 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 342

Both institutions’ staffing arrangements are Justice, Equality and Law Reform the reason a under continuing review. Any decision on their response has not issued pursuant to an undertak- future will have regard to ongoing discussions ing given in response to Question No. 239 of 22 between the Irish Prison Service and the Prison June 2004; if he will respond to it forthwith; and Officers’ Association on eliminating overtime and if he will make a statement on the matter. reducing other costs. The discussions are close to [30325/04] being concluded. I am hopeful that an agreement Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform will be finalised in the next month or so and that (Mr. McDowell): The compilation of the infor- staff will ballot for acceptance. mation requested by the Deputy took longer than originally anticipated. The delay in dealing with Departmental Reports. this matter is regretted. The information is as 410. Mr. J. O’Keeffe asked the Minister for follows:

Title of Report Reason Publication has not taken place

Policy Research Relating to Victim Support Organisation Not intended for publication Two confidential reports on the security of the Department’s Not intended for publication due to security considerations Information Technology Systems A Training Needs Analysis and Development of a Professional Not intended for publication. Circulated to the Assistant Development Programme for the Assistant Principal Grade Principal Grade Information Management and Technology Strategy for the Not intended for publication, internal relevance only organisations under the auspices of my Department and Divisions of the Department directly involved in the asylum process and related immigration processes A Study on the Irish Automated Fingerprint System and to Not intended for publication, internal relevance only analyse options in order to meet EURODAC requirements Recommendations/options as to the implementation of a new Not intended for publication, internal relevance only generation of fingerprint technology to serve my Department, the Office of the Refugee Applications Commissioner and the Gardaı´ An Examination of the Cultural Diversity Issues impacting on Not intended for publication, internal relevance only the operation of the Office of the Refugee Applications Commissioner A review of the Office of the Refugee Applications Not intended for publication, internal relevance only Commissioner. A Strategy Review and Analysis of the Refugee Documentation Not intended for publication, internal relevance only Centre 29th Interim Report — Inquiry to Examine all aspects of Publication of the Report will be arranged shortly practice and procedure relating to Personal Injuries Litigation Good Practice guidelines for persons involved in video recording The guidelines are currently under consideration by my interview Department Strategic Review by the Gardaı´ of Traffic Policing This is a review carried out internally by the Gardaı´ of an operational area to assist them in their planning for better carrying out their operational duties in the area of law enforcement. Not intended for publication. A Review and Evaluation of the Pilot Voluntary Assisted Not intended for publication, internal relevance only. Return Programme Inspector Of Prison and Places of Detention Annual Report This Report raises certain legal issues that need to be 2003-2004 addressed. I am in correspondence with the Inspector in relation to this matter so that the publication phase may be proceeded to as soon as possible The Interim Parole Board Annual Report 2003 It was necessary to translate this Report into Irish in order to comply with the Official Languages Act, 2003, as well as arranging to have it formally printed. This process has now been completed and it is expected that the Annual Report will be published in the immediate future. Evaluation of the Irish Prison Service Sexual Offender This Report was received by my Department in May, 2004. Intervention Programmes Work is currently ongoing on a synopsis version of this lengthy Report for publication and circulation. It is hoped that this work will be completed in the coming months at which time the Report will be made public. Prison Visiting Committee Annual Reports for 2000 and 2001 There is no requirement under Prison Visiting Committee Legislation to publish Reports. However, they are made available on request. Also, I have recently undertaken to publish such Reports on an annual basis and the Reports covering the years 2002 and 2003 have been laid before the Houses of The Oireachtas.

Inquiry into Child Abuse. date for claims to the Residential Institutions Redress Board in view of the difficulty faced by 411. Mr. J. Higgins asked the Minister for Edu- many former residents of such institutions who cation and Science the reason there is a cut off suffered abuse in coming forward and in view of 343 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 344

[Mr. J. Higgins.] mary sectors; and if she will make a statement on the fact that many such victims who are now liv- the matter. [30313/04] ing in the UK might not even had their attention drawn to their entitlement to seek compen- Minister for Education and Science (Ms sation. [29717/04] Hanafin): I recently announced, in the context of the 2005 Estimates, an increase in the standard 412. Mr. J. Higgins asked the Minister for Edu- per capita grant from \274 to \286 per pupil, with cation and Science if efforts will be made to effect from 1 January next. The increase will inform former residents of industrial schools who bring the per capita grant received by were victims of abuse and are now living in the disadvantaged schools to \324 per pupil. Second- UK that they may be entitled to seek compen- ary schools will benefit further under the school sation through the Residential Institutions services support initiative. The initial support Redress Board. [29718/04] grant of \25 per pupil that was introduced for second level schools in September 2000 will Minister for Education and Science (Ms increase to \103 from January next. The volun- Hanafin): I propose to take Questions Nos. 411 tary secondary schools grant, which has been sig- and 412 together. nificantly enhanced in recent years — to \131 The Residential Institutions Redress Act was from last January — will be further increased by enacted on 10 April 2002 and the board was for- \10 per pupil, bringing the overall grant for such mally established on 16 December 2002. The Act schools to \145 from next January. The increases makes provision for the board to accept appli- are in addition to the range of equalisation grants cations for up to three years from that date. of up to \15,554 per school per annum that have Section 8(2) of the Act provides that the board been approved for voluntary secondary schools. may extend this time limit at its discretion, if it Schools have welcomed the improvements. The considers that there are exceptional circum- provision I have made in the context of the 2005 stances. Section 5(b) Act provides that the board Estimates for the significant increases in the fund- shall make all reasonable efforts, through public ing of voluntary secondary schools is a clear dem- advertisement, direct correspondence with per- onstration of my commitment to prioritise avail- sons who were residents of an institution and able resources to address the needs of schools. otherwise, to ensure that persons who were resi- dents of an institution are aware of the redress Compulsory Retirement. board and its remit. The board commenced an advertising campaign in Ireland in December 414. Mr. R. Bruton asked the Minister for Edu- 2002 and a targeted advertisement campaign in cation and Science if, in view of the recent the United Kingdom in early 2004. While the Government legislation to end the provision of board has responsibility for making decisions on compulsory retirement at the age of 65, she will the level of advertising required, I am satisfied make arrangements to permit school caretakers that it will continue to make all reasonable efforts to work beyond this traditional retirement age; to ensure that former residents are made aware and if the request of a person (details supplied) of the redress scheme. in Dublin 5 to continue to work as caretaker until In devising its policies in the redress area, the the age of 66 will be acceded to. [29671/04] Government was conscious that a significant Minister for Education and Science (Ms number of former residents of institutions emi- Hanafin): The Public Service Superannuation grated to the United Kingdom, particularly in the (Miscellaneous Provisions) Act 2004 removed the late 1940s, 1950s and 1960s. Five outreach officers requirement to retire on age grounds, in cases of were appointed to existing Irish centres in the UK persons coming within the definition of “new to appraise and advise former residents that entrant” as set out in the Act. A new entrant residing there of developments relating to the under the Act is a person who commenced Commission to Inquire into Child Abuse and the employment in the public service on or after 1 Residential Institutions Redress Board. The out- April 2004 or a person who returned to employ- reach services, which are funded by my Depart- ment in the public service since that date after a ment, continue to operate and provide appro- break in service of more than 26 weeks. The per- priate advice about the redress board and other son in question, who has been employed as a matters. The Department of Education and school caretaker since 1995, is required to retire Science provides funding to a number of support at the age of 65 in accordance with the conditions groups to assist them in providing information of service pertaining to his employment. He and referral services to survivors of child abuse reached that age in September of this year. To here and in the United Kingdom. facilitate the appointment of a replacement, the Department of Education and Science has, as an Capitation Grants. exceptional matter, agreed to a request from the 413. Mr. English asked the Minister for Edu- school authorities that he be retained in employ- cation and Science if she intends to raise the level ment until 31 December 2004. As he is not a new of capitation grants to voluntary secondary entrant, it is not possible to approve his retention schools to bring them in line with other post-pri- beyond that date. 345 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 346

Institutes of Technology. Roscommon; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [29686/04] 415. Mr. Crowe asked the Minister for Edu- cation and Science if her attention has been Minister for Education and Science (Ms drawn to the proposal to cut four of the courses Hanafin): The extension and refurbishment pro- in the GMIT, Castlebar; the negative effect it will ject for the school referred to by the Deputy, have on education in the country; and if the which has a band 2 rating, is at an early stage of courses have been cut for financial reasons. architectural planning. A response is awaited to [29672/04] the letter recently sent by officials from the Department of Education and Science to the Minister for Education and Science (Ms school authorities requesting a stage 2-3 sub- Hanafin): The institutes of technology are statu- mission, or developed sketch scheme. Depart- tory bodies established under the Regional Tech- mental officials are nearing the completion of a nical Colleges Acts 1992 to 1999 and the Dublin review of all projects which did not proceed to Institute of Technology Acts 1992 and 1994. construction as part of the 2004 schools building Under the terms of the Acts, the governance and programme, including the school in question. All day-to-day activities of the institutes, including projects are being assessed against the published the number of approved courses that institutes prioritisation criteria, agreed earlier this year with wish to deliver in particular locations, are matters the education partners. Each project will be for which the governing bodies and the manage- assigned a band rating and the progress of all pro- ment staff of the institutes are responsible. jects will be considered in the context of the While proposals for new courses and proposed schools building programme from 2005 onwards. alterations to previously approved courses are subject to ministerial approval in the context of Schools Building Projects. the annual programmes and budgets process, any 418. Mr. Naughten asked the Minister for Edu- decisions to discontinue delivery of previously cation and Science when she plans to publish the approved courses are operational matters for the multi-annual school building programme; and if institutes in the context of their regular internal she will make a statement on the matter. reviews of course provision. An institute that [29700/04] decides to reduce course provision significantly in a particular campus normally informs my Depart- Minister for Education and Science (Ms ment of such a decision in advance of any such Hanafin): Officials from the Department of Edu- reduction. The Department of Education and cation and Science are nearing the completion of Science is not aware of any proposal by Galway- a review of all projects which did not proceed to Mayo Institute of Technology to reduce the construction as part of the 2004 schools building number of courses provided in its Castlebar programme. All projects are being assessed campus. against the published prioritisation criteria, agreed earlier this year with the education part- Schools Building Projects. ners. Each project will be assigned a band rating and their progress will be considered in the con- 416. Mr. Crawford asked the Minister for Edu- text of the school capital programme from 2005 cation and Science the position regarding the onwards. The Minister for Finance has indicated application for an extension to a school (details that he will deal with adjustments to the capital supplied) in County Cavan; and if she will make envelopes in his Budget Statement on 1 a statement on the matter. [29685/04] December next. Accordingly, I do not propose to publish a timetable of announcements before Minister for Education and Science (Ms this date. Hanafin): The extension project at the school referred to by the Deputy, which has a band 1 419. Mr. Naughten asked the Minister for Edu- rating, is at an early stage of architectural plan- cation and Science further to departmental corre- ning. My officials are nearing the completion of a spondence, if she will approve a revised band rat- review of all projects which did not proceed to ing and associated funding for a school (details construction as part of the 2004 schools building supplied) in County Roscommon; and if she will programme, including the school in question. All make a statement on the matter. [29701/04] projects are being assessed against the published prioritisation criteria, agreed earlier this year with Minister for Education and Science (Ms the education partners. Each project will be Hanafin): The application from the school to assigned a band rating and the progress of all pro- which the Deputy refers is being considered as jects will be considered in the context of the part of a review of all projects which did not pro- schools building programme from 2005 onwards. ceed to construction under the 2004 schools building programme. All projects are being Schools Refurbishment. assessed against the published prioritisation criteria, revised earlier this year following consul- 417. Mr. Naughten asked the Minister for Edu- tation with the education partners. Each project cation and Science if she will approve capital will be assigned a band rating and the progress of funding for a school (details supplied) in County all projects will be considered in the context of 347 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 348

[Ms Hanafin.] The Department of Community, Rural and the schools building programme from 2005 Gaeltacht Affairs provides funding to support the onwards. development of playgrounds in CLA´ R and RAPID areas. The Department of Education and 420. Mr. Ring asked the Minister for Education Science co-funds the development of such play- and Science when funding will be provided to a grounds, which are attached to a primary school primary school (details supplied) in County Mayo in a RAPID or CLA´ R area. I understand that the to secure a piece of ground it has purchased at school to which the Deputy refers is not in a the back of the school; and the funding available Rapid or CLA´ R area. for putting up fencing or a wall to secure the remainder of the property. [29722/04] School Staffing. Minister for Education and Science (Ms 422. Mr. Gogarty asked the Minister for Edu- Hanafin): School building repair projects can be cation and Science when she envisages that the addressed under a number of schemes funded by current backlog of resource teaching will be the Department of Education and Science. cleared; and if she will make a statement on the National schools receive funding each year under matter. [29724/04] the grant scheme for minor works to national Minister for Education and Science (Ms school properties, which came into operation in Hanafin): All applications for resource teaching January 1997. Improvements to school buildings support received by the Department of Edu- and grounds which come within the scope of the cation and Science by the closing date of 30 June minor works covered by the grant include the 2004 have been processed and decisions in the replacement of windows, roof repairs, the resur- cases in question have been issued to the schools facing of the school yard, repainting and redecor- concerned. Subsequent priority was given to ating. The summer works scheme provides capital applications for special educational needs sup- grants for necessary small-scale works which can ports for new entrants received after the closing be planned and delivered in the summer months. date. Decisions have also issued to schools in such The closing date for the receipt of applications cases. The Department is processing a number of under the 2005 scheme, in line with the scheme’s appeals arising from the decisions and responses terms and conditions, was 5 November 2004. to the appeals will be conveyed to the schools Application forms and further details on the when the process has been completed. schemes are available from the Department of The National Council for Special Education Education and Science’s school planning section has been established as an independent statutory in Tullamore and the Department’s website, body with the responsibilities set out in the www.education.ie. National Council for Special Education (Establishment) Order 2003. The council has 421. Mr. Ring asked the Minister for Education employed a number of special education needs and Science the funding available which is for the organisers who will be a focal point of contact provision of a playground to cater for the small for schools and parents. It is intended that the children in a primary school (details supplied) in organisers will process further applications for County Mayo. [29723/04] special educational needs resources. It is antici- pated that the council and the organisers will Minister for Education and Science (Ms become operational shortly. The Department of Hanafin): School building repair projects can be Education and Science is liaising with the council addressed under a number of schemes funded by with a view to putting the revised arrangements the Department of Education and Science. for the processing of applications for special edu- National schools receive funding each year under cational needs resources in place. the grant scheme for minor works to national school properties, which came into operation in Site Acquisitions. January 1997. Improvements to school buildings and grounds which come within the scope of the 423. Mr. Hayes asked the Minister for Edu- minor works covered by the grant include the cation and Science if her Department has iden- replacement of windows, roof repairs, the resur- tified a site for a gaelscoil in Clonmel, County facing of the school yard, repainting and redecor- Tipperary; and when such a site will be pro- ating. The summer works scheme provides capital vided. [29725/04] grants for necessary small-scale works which can Minister for Education and Science (Ms be planned and delivered in the summer months. Hanafin): The property management section of The closing date for the receipt of applications the Office of Public Works, which acts on behalf under the 2005 scheme, in line with the scheme’s of the Department of Education and Science on terms and conditions, was 5 November 2004. site acquisitions, is continuing to explore the Application forms and further details on the possibility of acquiring a site for the gaelscoil in schemes are available from the Department of Clonmel, County Tipperary. Due to the commer- Education and Science’s school planning section cial sensitivities of site acquisitions, it is not pro- in Tullamore and the Department’s website, posed at this stage to identify specific sites to be www.education.ie. acquired. This information will be placed on the 349 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 350

Department’s website when the relevant acquis- Scoileanna La´n-Ghaeilge. itions have been completed. 427. D’fhiafraigh Mr. Gogarty den Aire Oidea- chais agus Eolaı´ochta ce´ mhe´ad pa´iste a lorg a´it i Special Educational Needs. rang na naı´ona´n beag i scoileanna i Leamhca´n sna 424. Mr. Hayes asked the Minister for Edu- blianta 2002, 2003, 2004, agus an luafaidh sı´ an cation and Science when a person (details figiu´ r le haghaidh gach scoile. [29756/04] supplied) in County Tipperary with dyslexia will 428. D’fhiafraigh Mr. Gogarty den Aire Oidea- be allocated a laptop computer. [29726/04] chais agus Eolaı´ochta ce´ mhe´ad a´it i rang na Minister for Education and Science (Ms naı´ona´n beag a chuir scoileanna i Leamhca´nar Hanafin): The Department of Education and fa´il sna blianta 2002, 2003 agus 2004, agus an Science does not have a record of an application luafaidh sı´ an figiu´ r le haghaidh gach scoile. for a grant in respect of the equipment for the [29757/04] person referred to by the Deputy. I have asked 429. D’fhiafraigh Mr. Gogarty den Aire Oidea- officials from the Department to contact the chais agus Eolaı´ochta ce´ mhe´ad pa´iste a mheas- school authorities about the matter, with a view ann an tAire a bheidh ag lorg a´ite i rang na to the speedy resolution of it. naı´ona´n beag i scoileanna i Leamhca´n sna blianta 2005, 2006 agus 2007. [29758/04] 425. Mr. Kehoe asked the Minister for Edu- cation and Science the reason, following the allo- Minister for Education and Science (Ms cation of 12 hours special needs assistance for a Hanafin): Ta´ se´ beartaithe agam Ceisteanna person (details supplied) in County Wexford, no Uimh. 427, 428 agus 429 a fhreagairt le che´ile. teaching resource hours were allocated; the Ta´ naoi mbunscoil i Leamhca´n. Ba e´ lı´on iom- options now available to this person; and if she la´nnanaı´ona´n beag a bhı´ rollaithe sna scoileanna will make a statement on the matter. [29750/04] sin ar fad i 2004 na´ 671 dalta. Ce´ go le´irı´onn se´ seo go bhfuil ardu´ de 118 a´it ar a´iteanna o´ fhigi- Minister for Education and Science (Ms u´ irı´ Mhea´nFo´ mhair 2002, nı´l mo Roinnse ar an Hanafin): The pupil did not qualify for resource eolas maidir le haon leanbh nach raibh ar a teaching support on the basis of the application c(h)umas rochtain a fha´il ar a´it i Leamhca´nletrı´ originally submitted to the Department of Edu- bliana anuas. Is mar gheall ar na gnı´omhartha cation and Science. The school in question has tapa agus cinntitheacha a ghlac an ranno´ g ´ ´ ´ since furnished additional documentation in sup- pleanala scoileanna i mo Roinnse e seo. Bhı infheistı´ocht de \17.5 milliu´ n mar thoradh ar na port of the application. Officials from the Depart- gnı´omhartha seo chun sola´thar bunoideachais a ment are liaising with the National Educational chur ar fa´il agus a uasghra´du´ sa cheantar seo, ata´ Psychological Service on the matter and a ag forbairt go tapa. decision will be conveyed to the school as soon A´ irı´tear ar mhionsonraı´ na ngnı´omhartha a gla- as this process has been completed. cadh tionscadail tho´ ga´la ar tugadh fu´ thu ag scoil sho´ isearach Scoil A´ ine agus Scoil Shinsearach Schools Building Projects. Naomh Toma´s. Cuireadh dha´ scoil nua 16 seomra 426. Mr. Gregory asked the Minister for Edu- ranga ar fa´il do scoil na´isiu´ nta Educate Together cation and Science the position regarding the Leamhca´in agus scoil na´isiu´ nta Educate Together application by a school (details supplied) for Griffeen Valley. Sa bhreis air sin, ta´ tu´ s curtha le funding to proceed with a new school building; to´ ga´il fhoirgneamh nua scoile chun atheagru´ ar the next stage for this application; the likely time- scoileanna na´isiu´ nta Ardeaspag Ryan a e´ascu´ scale for full approval of this project; the esti- chun scoil sho´ isearach agus scoil shinsearach a mated timescale for the completion of the project bhunu´ . San idirthre´imhse, ta´ socruithe de´anta do in view of the fact that the school children have shola´thar co´ irı´ochta sealadaı´ fad is a bheidh an foirgneamh nua a´ tho´ ga´il. already been in prefabs for three years; and if she Ta´ mo Roinnse ag de´ilea´il go cuimsitheach le will make a statement on the matter. [29755/04] riachtanais Leamhca´in, agus leanfaimid ag de´an- Minister for Education and Science (Ms amh athbhreithnithe ar chu´ rsaı´ ansin. Ar an Hanafin): The application from the school in mbealach seo ta´ mo Roinnse sa´sta go mbeifear in question is being considered as part of a review of ann socruithe tra´thu´ la breise a dhe´anamh ma´sga´ all projects which did not proceed to construction chun freastal ar e´ilimh bhreise a d’fhe´adfadh a under the 2004 schools building programme. theacht chun cinn ann. Under the review, all projects are being assessed 430. D’fhiafraigh Mr. Gogarty den Aire Oidea- against the published prioritisation criteria which chais agus Eolaı´ochta an eol di na´r freastalaı´odh were revised earlier this year following consul- in am ar an 154 pha´iste a chla´raigh le haghaidh tation with the education partners. Each project oideachais bunscoile trı´ Ghaeilge i Leamhca´n don will be assigned a band rating and the progress of scoilbhliain 2004-05 toisc gur diu´ ltaı´odh don iar- all projects will be considered in the context of ratas le haghaidh Gaelscoile nua; an eol di, toisc the school building programme from 2005 an diu´ ltaithe sin, na´r freastalaı´odh ar 82 de na onwards. pa´istı´ seo; an eol di gur mhol coiste comhairleach 351 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 352

[Mr. Gogarty.] tation with the education partners. Each project a Roinne fe´in gur cho´ ir aitheantas a thabhairt do will be assigned a band rating, and the progress Ghaelscoil nua anuraidh sa cha´s nach mbe´adh an of all projects will be considered in the context of ghaelscoil reatha in ann freastal a dhe´anamh ar the school building programme from 2005 an e´ileamh; o´ s rud e´ nach bhfuil an scoil reatha onwards. in ann freastal a dhe´anamh ar an e´ileamh de bharr easpa spa´is agus an fha´is ollmho´ ir sa Special Educational Needs. daonra, an bhfuil se´ i gceist aici aitheantas a thab- 432. Mr. Perry asked the Minister for Edu- hairt do ghaelscoil nua, a thoso´ idh i Mea´nFo´ mh- cation and Science if the resource help for a per- air 2005, sa cheantar. [29759/04] son (details supplied) in County Leitrim will be Minister for Education and Science (Ms continued after 2005; and if she will make a state- Hanafin): Diu´ ltaı´odh iarratas nı´os luaithe i 2004 ment on the matter. [29763/04] do ghaelscoil nua i Leamhca´n ar an moladh a Minister for Education and Science (Ms rinne coiste comhairleach na scoileanna nua. Rin- Hanafin): This pupil’s special educational needs, neadh an cinneadh ar an mbunu´ s go bhfe´adfaı´ an or SEN, are in the high-incidence disability cate- sola´thar Gaeilge a bhı´ i Leamhca´n cheana a gory, and it would be expected that pupils in that leathnu´ chun freastal ar e´ilimh bhreise a thioc- category would have their SEN met from within fadh chun cinn. Rinne pa´tru´ n na scoile beartaithe the resource or learning support teaching allo- achomharc ar an gcinneadh seo. Nı´or e´irigh leis cation available to the school. The school’s cur- an achomharc a stiu´ raigh bord achomharc rent staffing is a principal and one assistant neamhsplea´ch. teacher. In addition, the school has the equivalent Ta´ freastal a´ dhe´anamh ar an e´ileamh do shola´- of a teaching allocation of approximately 14 thar la´n-Ghaeilge i gceantar Leamhca´in leis an hours for the support of pupils with high-incid- leathnu´ ata´thar a dhe´anamh ar an ngaelscoil ata´ ence SEN and those with learning support needs, ann. Maidir leis seo, ta´ se´ cinnithe go leathno´ far that is, functioning at or below the tenth percen- an scoil go dtı´ scoil 24 seomra ranga a thiocfaidh tile on a standardised test of reading or math- o´ thaobh me´id le re´imse me´ideanna na scoileanna ematics. The school had an enrolment of 22 at sa cheantar seo, ata´ ag forbairt go tapa. September 2003. Le deireanaı´, d’e´iligh u´ dara´is bhainistı´ochta na In the context of the proposed new system for scoile go mbeadh an leathnu´ teoranta d’ocht resource teacher allocation, I am conscious of dif- seomra ranga breise. Ta´ se´ seo a´ bhreithniu´ lais- ficulties that could arise, particularly for children tigh de mo Roinnse i la´thair na huaire. Gne´ tha´b- in small and rural schools, if it were implemented hachtach ina leith sin is ea an leibhe´al e´ilimh ata´ as currently proposed. Accordingly, I will be ann. Ma´ thagann e´ileamh sa bhreis ar dha´ ionchur reviewing the model to ensure that it provides an seomra ranga chun cinn, comhsheasmhach le pro´ - automatic response for pupils with common mild tacal caighdea´nach, is e´ an che´ad rogha na´ an sol- learning disabilities without the need for cumber- a´thar ata´ ann a leathnu´ . Maidir leis sin, ta´ se´ cin- some individual applications, while at the same nithe go bhfuil an suı´omh sa´ch mo´ r chun freastal time ensuring that pupils currently in receipt of ar scoil 24 seomra ranga. a service continue to receive the level of service Tuigim go bhfuil fo´ gra foirmiu´ il faighte maidir appropriate to their needs. The review will leis an ru´ n iarratas a dhe´anamh ar aitheantas do involve consultation with educational interests ghaelscoil nua sa cheantar, a thoso´ dh ag feidhmiu´ and the National Council for Special Education i Mea´nFo´ mhair 2005. Ta´ an fo´ gra ru´ in curtha ar before it is implemented next year. aghaidh chuig coiste comhairleach na scoileanna It is important to emphasise that applications nua lena bhreithniu´ . Ple´ifidh an coiste leis an may be made for specific resource teacher allo- a´bhar, agus de´anfaidh an coiste, ar an ngna´thshlı´, cations for pupils with lower-incidence special a chuid moltaı´ liomsa ar an a´bhar sin ag tra´th educational needs regardless of the gender of the nı´os deireanaı´. pupil or status of the school. Schools Building Projects. 433. Mr. Ferris asked the Minister for Edu- cation and Science if the decision of circular 09/04 431. Mr. McGinley asked the Minister for Edu- regarding special education teachers will be cation and Science the stage an application for a amended in order that the ratio of 1:140 pupils is school (details supplied) in County Donegal is at applied to mixed schools and all girls’ schools. under the small schools initiative; and if she will [29777/04] make a statement on the matter. [29762/04] Minister for Education and Science (Ms Minister for Education and Science (Ms Hanafin): The application from the school to Hanafin): As the Deputy will be aware, the pro- which the Deputy refers is being considered as posed new system for resource teacher allocation part of a review of all projects which did not pro- involves a general teaching allocation for all pri- ceed to construction as part of the 2004 school mary schools to cater for pupils with higher-incid- building programme. All projects are being ence special educational needs, that is, borderline assessed against the published prioritisation mild and mild general learning disability and criteria, revised earlier this year following consul- specific learning disability, and those with learn- 353 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 354 ing support needs, that is, functioning at or below vice continue to receive the level of service the tenth percentile on a standardised test of appropriate to their needs. The review will reading or mathematics. It will also allow for indi- involve consultation with educational interests vidual allocations for pupils with lower-incidence and the National Council for Special Education special educational needs. before it is implemented next year. The proposed allocation mechanism is as fol- lows. In the most disadvantaged schools, as per Schools Building Projects. the urban dimension of giving children an even 434. Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in asked the Minister break, a teacher of pupils with special educational for Education and Science if the much needed needs will be allocated for every 80 pupils to cater extension for a school (details supplied) in for the subset of pupils with higher-incidence County Monaghan will be included in her special needs. In all boys’ schools, the ratio will Department’s building programme for 2005. be one teacher for every 140 pupils. In mixed [29789/04] schools, or all girls’ schools with an enrolment of greater than 30% boys, it will be one for every Minister for Education and Science (Ms 150 pupils. In all girls’ schools, including schools Hanafin): The extension project for the school with mixed junior classes but with 30% or less referred to by the Deputy is at an advanced stage boys overall, it will be one for every 200 pupils. of architectural planning. It has a band 2 rating. The rationale for a pupil-teacher ratio of 150 My Department’s technical staff are currently pupils for every teacher in mixed schools to sup- examining the stage 4 documentation, detailed port pupils with higher-incidence special edu- design. The school authorities will be kept cational needs and learning difficulties or delays advised of developments. is that the pupil-teacher ratio for a learning sup- My officials are nearing completion of a review port teacher was approximately 300 pupils; 10% of all projects which did not proceed to construc- of pupils would be expected to have learning dif- tion as part of the 2004 school building pro- ficulties in the fields of literacy and numeracy gramme with a view to including them as part of and, on that basis, approximately 15 out of a a multi-annual programme from 2005. All pro- group of 150 pupils would be expected to have jects are being assessed against the published learning difficulties. This is considered half of a prioritisation criteria agreed earlier this year with teacher’s caseload. A further 3%, or four to five the education partners. Each project will be pupils, in that cohort would be expected to have assigned a band rating, and the progress of all higher-incidence special educational needs and projects will be considered in the context of the would expect to receive 2.5 resource teaching programme from 2005. hours per week. This would account for the other Special Educational Needs. half of a teacher’s caseload. The rationale for the different pupil-teacher 435. Mr. Ring asked the Minister for Education ratios in boys’ schools, 140:1, and girls’ ones, and Science the position regarding the appeal for 200:1, is twofold. International literature on the a person (details supplied) in County Mayo in incidence of disability indicates that, across all respect of the person’s need for educational sup- disability types, there is a greater incidence in port due to special needs. [29795/04] boys than in girls. International and national sur- Minister for Education and Science (Ms veys of literacy and numeracy have found that Hanafin): Following a review of the application those difficulties are more common among boys for special educational needs supports for the than girls. The rationale for the level of support person in question, my Department has sanc- proposed for schools in areas of urban disadvan- tioned 12.5 hours special needs assistant support. tage is that evidence shows that there is a signifi- cantly higher incidence of literacy and numeracy Boards of Management. difficulties in urban disadvantaged compared with other schools, including those in areas of rural 436. Mr. J. Higgins asked the Minister for Edu- disadvantage. cation and Science her plans regarding the pro- It is important to emphasise that applications vision of representation for parents on the boards may be made for specific resource teacher allo- of management of comprehensive schools; and cations in respect of pupils with lower-incidence the timetable for her proposals. [29801/04] special educational needs regardless of the gen- Minister for Education and Science (Ms der of the pupil or the status of school. I am con- Hanafin): My Department continues to work with scious of difficulties that could arise with the pro- all the interested parties on the inclusion of par- posed model, particularly for children in small ent representatives on boards of management of and rural schools, if it were implemented as cur- comprehensive schools. Agreement has been rently proposed. Accordingly, I will be reviewing reached on the revised composition of the boards, the model to ensure that it provides an automatic which have a different composition in each of the response for pupils with common mild learning sectors — Catholic, Protestant and Jesuit. The disabilities without the need for cumbersome revised composition of the boards provides for individual applications, while at the same time two parent representatives in each instance. The ensuring that pupils currently in receipt of a ser- work on the revision of the legal instruments in 355 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 356

[Ms Hanafin.] in County Offaly for an extra temporary post; and the case of the Jesuit comprehensive has been if she will make a statement on the matter. completed, and a new board including parents [29821/04] has been established. Minister for Education and Science (Ms In the case of the Catholic comprehensives, the Hanafin): The staffing of a primary school is text of the legal instruments has been agreed, and determined by reference to the enrolment of the my Department awaits confirmation from the school on 30 September of the previous school Catholic legal representatives as to the intended year. The actual number of mainstream posts circulation date of the revised document for sanctioned is determined by reference to a staff- execution by individual bishops. Talks are con- ing schedule and is finalised for a particular year tinuing with representatives of the Protestant following discussions with the education partners. comprehensives with a view to resolving out- The enrolment of the school referred to by the standing issues relating to those schools. Deputy on 30 September 2003 was 75 pupils, which warrants a staffing of a principal and two Schools Building Projects. mainstream class teachers for the 2004-05 school 437. Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in asked the Minister year. The school also has a resource teacher. To for Education and Science the status of the school ensure transparency and openness in the system, extension proposals for a school (details an independent appeals board is now in place to supplied) in County Cavan; the prospects of these decide on any appeals on mainstream staffing. works being included in the schools building pro- The staffing of the school in question for the gramme for commencement in 2005; and her 2004-05 school year was considered by the plans regarding the need for temporary accom- appeals board on 21 October 2004. The board modation to cater to the needs of pupils in situ rejected the appeal, and the board was notified and others on the school’s ever-growing entry accordingly. I am sure the Deputy will appreciate waiting list, pending the completion of the long- that it would not be appropriate for me to inter- overdue extension. [29819/04] vene in the operation of the independent appeals board. Minister for Education and Science (Ms Hanafin): The extension project for the school Schools Amalgamation. referred to by the Deputy is at an early stage of architectural planning. It has a band 1 rating. My 440. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- officials are nearing completion of a review of all cation and Science the progress being made in projects which did not proceed to construction as relation to the amalgamation of the three second part of the 2004 school building programme, level schools in Kildare town; if a decision on the including the school in question. All projects are site for this school has been made; when a being assessed against the published prioritisation decision can be expected; and if she will make a criteria agreed earlier this year with the education statement on the matter. [29822/04] partners. Each project will be assigned a band rat- Minister for Education and Science (Ms ing, and the progress of all projects will be con- Hanafin): The purchase of a site for the proposed sidered in the context of the school building pro- amalgamated post-primary school in Kildare gramme from 2005 onwards. town is currently being actively pursued. I will The management authority of the school has make a decision in the matter as soon as dis- made an application for temporary accommo- cussions have been completed. In the meantime dation. All such applications are being considered my officials are nearing completion of a review of in the school planning section of my Department, all projects which did not proceed to construction and it is planned to publish the list of successful as part of the 2004 school building programme, applicants early in the new year. including the school in question. All projects are being assessed against the published prioritisation School Transport. criteria agreed earlier this year with the education 438. Mr. Kehoe asked the Minister for Edu- partners. Each project will be assigned a band rat- cation and Science if she will provide the reply to ing, and the progress of all projects will be con- Question No. 115 of 14 October 2004; and if she sidered in the context of the school building pro- will make a statement on the matter. [29820/04] gramme from 2005 onwards. The school authorities will be kept informed of Minister for Education and Science (Ms developments. Hanafin): My Department has asked Bus E´ ireann to clarify some further points arising from its Schools Building Projects. recent report. The Deputy will be advised of the position as soon as possible. 441. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- cation and Science if her attention has been drawn to the fact that a site for a new vocational School Staffing. school in Athy, County Kildare was purchased in 439. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- November 2001; the progress for the provision of cation and Science if her attention has been a new school; and if she will make a statement on drawn to an appeal by a school (details supplied) the matter. [29824/04] 357 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 358

Minister for Education and Science (Ms question. I acknowledge that there was not suf- Hanafin): The building project for the school ficient clarity around that point in my earlier referred to by the Deputy is at an early stage of reply. architectural planning. It has a band 3 rating. My officials are nearing completion of a review of all Third Level Admissions. projects which did not proceed to construction as 444. Mr. Crowe asked the Minister for Edu- part of the 2004 school building programme, cation and Science the reviews and consultations including the school referred to by the Deputy. and the organisations and groups with which she All projects are being assessed against the pub- is engaged to reassess or alter the system of selec- lished prioritisation criteria agreed earlier this tion of persons for third level places on the basis year with the education partners. Each project of the leaving certificate results points system; will be assigned a band rating, and the progress and the system of selection which is involved. of all projects will be considered in the context of [29833/04] the school building programme from 2005 onwards. Minister for Education and Science (Ms Hanafin): I have not engaged in consultations 442. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- with organisations or groups to reassess or alter cation and Science if her attention has been fundamentally the system of selection for third drawn to the fact that the Department of Defence level places on the basis of the leaving certificate has allocated a site, free of charge, for a new points system. school building for a school (details supplied) in As the Deputy will be aware, my predecessor County Kildare; if her attention has further been and the Minister for Health and Children estab- drawn to the fact that the County Kildare lished a working group on undergraduate medical vocational education committee has sought the education and training to review the organisation appointment of a design team for the proposed and delivery of medical training and education in new school; and if she will make a statement on Ireland. The group has recently presented interim the matter. [29825/04] recommendations for significant reform of the entry mechanism to medical education. Those Minister for Education and Science (Ms recommendations include the introduction of a Hanafin): My Department has given sanction to multi-streamed model of entry to medicine, com- County Kildare vocational education committee prising undergraduate and graduate entry to make the necessary arrangements to secure the methods, with leaving certificate performance no site in question. In the meantime, my officials are longer the sole selection method for entry at nearing completion of a review of all projects undergraduate level. In that regard, it is proposed which did not proceed to construction as part of that selection for entry to undergraduate medi- the 2004 school building programme, including cine should have two stages. Anyone opting for the school referred to by the Deputy. All projects medicine who achieved 450 leaving certificate are being assessed against the published prioritis- points would be eligible for consideration, with ation criteria agreed earlier this year with the places to be allocated on the basis of performance education partners. Each project will be assigned in a separate entry test. a band rating, and the progress of all projects will Those recommendations are a very welcome be considered in the context of the school build- attempt to address the tremendous pressures ing programme from 2005 onwards. placed on students in the second level system as a result of the extremely high leaving certificate Schools Amalgamation. points required for entry to medicine and certain 443. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- other disciplines. It is important that the signifi- cation and Science if she will clarify her reply to cant implementation issues associated with the Question No. 133 of 7 October 2004 in relation proposed change are carefully attended to. I am to the amalgamation of a school (details supplied) currently considering the composition and terms in County Offaly; if the original agreement to of reference of an implementation group for that form a community college has been changed; if purpose and intend to bring forward proposals on the amalgamation is proceeding on a green-field that front shortly. site as outlined by her and not on an existing site as already agreed; and if she will make a state- State Examinations. ment on the matter. [29826/04] 445. Mr. Crowe asked the Minister for Edu- Minister for Education and Science (Ms cation and Science the revision of the leaving cer- Hanafin): The status of the new school referred tificate requirements and curricula being con- to by the Deputy is a community college and not sidered by her. [29834/04] a community school as inadvertently stated in my Minister for Education and Science (Ms reply of 7 October last. I can also confirm that Hanafin): The National Council for Curriculum purpose-designed facilities will be provided to and Assessment, or NCCA, was established as a accommodate the new school on the site of an statutory body in July 2001. Its brief, as stated in existing secondary school. The site is currently the Education Act 1998, is to advise the Minister being acquired from the trustees of the school in for Education and Science in matters relating to 359 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 360

[Ms Hanafin.] of my Department regarding site acquisitions the curriculum for early childhood education, pri- generally, is exploring the possibility of acquiring mary and post-primary schools, and the assess- a site for the school referred to by the Deputy. ment procedures employed in schools and exam- Owing to the commercial sensitivities of site inations on subjects that are part of the acquisitions, it is not proposed at this stage to curriculum. identify specific sites to be acquired. However, The NCCA has carried out a comprehensive that information will be placed on my Depart- public consultation process on the future direc- ment’s website when the relevant acquisitions tion of senior cycle education in Ireland. That have been completed. In the meantime, my concluded with the publication by the NCCA of officials are nearing completion of a review of all Directions for Development — Developing projects which did not proceed to construction as Senior Cycle Education, which was presented at a part of the 2004 school building programme, national forum in Dublin Castle on 23 September including the school referred to by the Deputy. 2003. That forum was attended by representatives All projects are being assessed against the pub- of all the partners in education. lished prioritisation criteria agreed earlier this The NCCA proposals set out a vision for the year with the education partners. Each project type of school system which might exist by 2010. will be assigned a band rating, and the progress The proposals envisage a restructured senior of all projects will be considered in the context of cycle curriculum consisting of transition units, the school building programme from 2005. The short courses and subjects. Innovatory features of question of the provision of new accommodation the leaving certificate vocational programme and for the school will be considered further when a the transition year programme would be incor- site has been acquired. porated into transition units that would focus on areas such as work-related learning, special stud- Schools Building Projects. ies, community participation, arts education, ICT 447. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- literacy and study skills. The option of a two or cation and Science the reason the board of man- three-year cycle would be retained, and the leav- agement of a school (details supplied) in County ing certificate applied programme would continue Donegal and the architectural and design team as a discrete programme. All pupils, including have been asked to redesign a comprehensive LCA pupils, would follow at least one transition brief for a school extension which was originally unit, and many pupils would take a greater accepted by her Department in 2000; and if she number. The proposals provide also for an will make a statement on the matter. [29933/04] increased emphasis on a wider range of modes of assessment such as practical, portfolio or project Minister for Education and Science (Ms work and continuous assessment, with assessment Hanafin): The building project for the school events spread out during courses of study and referred to by the Deputy is at an early stage of available at several points during the two or architectural planning. It has a band 2 rating. My three-year cycle. officials recently wrote to the school authorities Publication of Directions for Development has with a revised brief for the project. That was fol- been followed by further analyses and consul- lowing an examination of the proposal as pre- tation by the NCCA in the lead-up to the viously submitted, which was found to be over- council’s presentation of advice and recommend- elaborate in both design and area and not in com- ations to me on the future of senior cycle. I pliance with the original brief as issued in January understand that the next stage of that advice will 2001. The school authorities subsequently con- include an elaboration of the possible configur- tacted my Department outlining that the revised ation of subjects, short courses and transition brief is unacceptable to it and requesting a meet- units, details of how assessment might be man- ing to discuss current building plans for the aged, an analysis of the implications for staff school. My officials will be in contact with the development and infrastructure, and a detailed school authorities shortly with a view to arranging action plan for implementing the proposal. That the proposed meeting. In the meantime, my advice is due early in 2005 and will enable officials are nearing completion of a review of all decisions to be made on implementation. projects which did not proceed to construction as part of the 2004 school building programme, School Accommodation. including the school referred to by the Deputy. 446. Mr. P. McGrath asked the Minister for All projects are being assessed against the pub- Education and Science when a permanent site lished prioritisation criteria agreed earlier this and the provision of an appropriate school build- year with the education partners. Each project ing will be secured to serve the needs of a school will be assigned a band rating, and the progress (details supplied) which is in temporary accom- of all projects will be considered in the context of modation in Griffeen Valley, Lucan; and if she the school building programme from 2005. will make a statement on the matter. [29837/04] School Staffing. Minister for Education and Science (Ms Hanafin): The property management section of 448. Mr. Penrose asked the Minister for Edu- the Office of Public Works, which acts on behalf cation and Science if he will take steps to ensure 361 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 362 that a person (details supplied) in County West- 1992 in relation to the setting up of companies. meath will be appointed to a permanent position However, section 37 of the Vocational Edu- as soon as possible; and if she will make a state- cational (Amendment) Act 2001 has not been ment on the matter. [29934/04] commenced, and section 5(1)(e) of the Regional Technical Colleges Act 1992 still applies. My Minister for Education and Science (Ms Department will consider any application from Hanafin): The permanent teacher allocation for institutes of technology for establishment of cam- an individual voluntary secondary school for a pus companies in accordance with the primary particular school year consists of approved ex- legislation. quota posts and the posts warranted by the enrol- ment at the end of the preceding September on Schools Refurbishment. the basis of the current pupil-teacher ratio. Vac- ancies in schools arising from career breaks, 450. Mr. Ring asked the Minister for Education approved leave of absence or secondments and and Science if the proper procedures were put in concessionary posts, which are allocated in excess place in relation to a school (details supplied) in of a school’s normal quota of posts, may only be County Mayo; the tests which were carried out filled in a temporary or part-time capacity. on the tiles and roof of this school; if there were The number of posts in any particular school regular inspections of the roof as it was in pro- which can be filled in a permanent capacity gress; the person who carried out the inspections; cannot exceed the allocation warranted by the the reports which are available on file in this enrolment and the approved ex-quota posts. In matter; if she will provide this Deputy with a copy the case to which the Deputy refers, the number of the reports on file; if all these inspections were of posts which can be filled in a permanent capa- carried out in the first instance, the reason it was city is 22. According to my Department’s records, necessary to change the design when the school there are 22 permanent teachers on the staff of was being re-roofed; the further reason this the school in question. In the circumstances, no design was put in place when the building was further permanent appointment can be made at roofed on the first occasion; and if she will make this time. a statement on the matter. [29936/04] Minister for Education and Science (Ms Institutes of Technology. Hanafin): The architectural service for this pro- 449. Mr. Quinn asked the Minister for Edu- ject was provided by my Department’s pro- cation and Science if her attention has been fessional and technical staff. Regular site meet- drawn to the fact that institutes of technology ings and site inspections were carried out by a have been effectively prevented from promoting range of technical personnel from my Depart- the formation of campus companies, capable of ment during construction. This school was built sharing their economic potential with external to a standard Department design that has been partners who have available investment capital, successfully used throughout the country over a due to an interpretation of the Regional Techni- 15-year period. However, it was deemed prudent cal Colleges Act 1992, section 5(2A) and the to change the roof design in this instance as the Vocational Educational (Amendment) Act 2001, original design was unable to deal with the excep- section 37; if her attention has further been drawn tional and unpredictable local wind factors. to this restrictive interpretation; if, in the interests of promoting greater scientific research and its Home Tuition. effective commercialisation with productive part- 451. Mr. McGuinness asked the Minister for ners at campus level on the institutes of tech- Education and Science if further home tuition nology, similar to universities, she will issue clear hours will be approved in the case of a person enabling guidelines to all institutes of technology (details supplied) in County Kilkenny; and if a regarding their ability to retain minority share- decision in this case will be expedited. [29937/04] holdings in such campus companies in which out- side investors constitute the majority sharehold- Minister for Education and Science (Ms ing; and if she will make a statement on the Hanafin): I understand that, arising from an matter. [29935/04] appeal, the level of home tuition approved for the child in question was recently raised from ten to Minister for Education and Science (Ms 20 hours per week. That represents a very signifi- Hanafin): The functions of institutes of tech- cant level of one-to-one support, which will con- nology are set out in section 5 of the Regional tinue to be made available to the child until a Technical Colleges Act 1992. The functions pro- school placement commences. The school in vide for institutes to enter into arrangements, which placement has been sought is due to obtain including participation in limited liability com- new accommodation in the near future, and I am panies, in certain circumstances and under such advised that a place will be made available for conditions as the Minister may determine. the child in question at that stage. The Deputy’s question alludes to section 37 of the Vocational Educational (Amendment) Act Schools Building Projects. 2001. This section provides for an amendment to section 5 of the Regional Technical Colleges Act 452. Mr. Ring asked the Minister for Education 363 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 364

[Mr. Ring.] explore the possibility of full recognition for AMI and Science if she will take steps to ensure that graduates has recently been initiated. the final payment for a project in County Mayo In response to a request from AMI representa- issues to a person (details supplied); and the per- tives, my Department has recently initiated a pro- son who will deal with this. [29991/04] cess to explore the possibility of full recognition Minister for Education and Science (Ms for AMI graduates. When the outcome of that Hanafin): A member of my Department’s techni- process is known, I will communicate them to the cal staff is currently liaising with the quantity sur- Deputy. My Department has not commissioned veyor from this school’s design team regarding any comparative study on the AMI teacher train- the contractor’s final account. When those dis- ing course and the courses in the colleges of cussions have been concluded, my Department’s education. building unit will contact with the contractor’s representatives. Pupil-Teacher Ratio. 453. Mr. Ring asked the Minister for Education 457. Ms O’Sullivan asked the Minister for Edu- and Science if funding will be provided for a cation and Science her plans to reduce class sizes school (details supplied) in County Mayo under to fewer than 20 for children under nine in view the summer works scheme 2005. [29992/04] of the commitment in the programme for Government and the fact that her predecessor did Minister for Education and Science (Ms nothing to meet that promise during his term in Hanafin): The management authority of the office. [30007/04] school to which the Deputy refers has recently Minister for Education and Science (Ms made an application for replacement of a roof Hanafin): Significant improvements have been under the summer works scheme 2005. All appli- made in the pupil-teacher ratio at primary level cations for the 2005 scheme will be considered in school planning section of my Department, and it in recent years. The ratio has fallen from 22.2:1 is planned to publish the list of successful appli- in the 1996-97 school year to 17.44:1 in the 2003- cants in January 2005. 04 school year. Arising from these improvements, class sizes have reduced in the same period. In Teaching Qualifications. line with the commitment in the programme for Government, class sizes will be reduced further. 454. Ms O’Sullivan asked the Minister for Edu- This, however, can only be done on a phased cation and Science the amount spent on the com- basis, having regard to available resources and pletion of a comparative study on the AMI spending priorities within the education sector. teacher training course and the courses in the col- The timing and manner in which the target set leges of education; when this report was com- out in the programme for Government can be pleted; and when the complete report will be pub- met is being examined by my Department in con- lished. [30004/04] sultation with the education partners. Additional 455. Ms O’Sullivan asked the Minister for Edu- posts will continue to be provided. The deploy- cation and Science if it is her intention to provide ment of these posts will be decided within the full recognition to AMI graduates trained context of the overall policy that priority will be here. [30005/04] given to pupils with special needs and those from disadvantaged areas and junior classes. 456. Ms O’Sullivan asked the Minister for Edu- cation and Science the reason, under Departmen- Teaching Qualifications. tal policy, AMI graduates trained here are not allowed to sit an Scru´ du´ le hAghaidh Ca´ilı´ochta 458. Ms O’Sullivan asked the Minister for sa Ghaeilge. [30006/04] Education and Science if it is her intention to pro- vide full recognition to Montessori teachers who Minister for Education and Science (Ms qualify from a college (details supplied) in Hanafin): I propose to take Questions Nos. 454 to 456, inclusive, together. County Dublin. [30008/04] The content of courses delivered in the colleges Minister for Education and Science (Ms of education and other teacher preparation insti- Hanafin): Discussions between representatives of tutions is considered by my Department before my Department and the college referred to by the recognition of the course is awarded. In the case Deputy, regarding the full recognition of the of the AMI three-year, full-time course, the con- HETAC accredited degree in humanities in Mon- tent is not currently deemed to be sufficiently tessori education, are ongoing and are expected comprehensive to allow for recognition of the to conclude shortly. As soon as the outcomes are course to teach in mainstream primary schools. known, I will communicate them to the Deputy. Therefore, it would not be appropriate for AMI graduates to sit an Scru´ du´ le hAghaidh Ca´ilı´ochta 459. Ms O’Sullivan asked the Minister for sa Ghaeilge. As a result, AMI graduates are lim- Education and Science the number of unqualified ited to restricted recognition which enables them teachers who have been employed in a primary to teach in certain categories of special school and school for longer than one school year; and if she classes and as resource teachers. A process to will make a statement on the matter. [30009/04] 365 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 366

Minister for Education and Science (Ms SENOs will become operational shortly. In this Hanafin): A total of 147 unqualified teachers regard, my Department is liaising with the council employed by primary schools for the 2003-04 regarding future arrangements for the processing school year were re-employed by these schools in of applications for SEN supports. September 2004. The recruitment and appoint- ment of teachers to fill vacancies in an individual Schools Building Projects. school is a matter for the board of management 461. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- of the school concerned. Unqualified teachers cation and Science the criteria used to decide that should only be employed in exceptional circum- a project at a school (details supplied) in County stances and when all avenues for recruiting quali- Donegal is deemed necessary rather than urgent; fied personnel have been exhausted. In this con- the regard that was given to the fact that the text, my officials have recently written to all numbers attending the school have increased primary schools which, on 1 September of the steadily since the initial assessment of overall current school year, were employing an unquali- accommodation in 1998; and if she will make a fied teacher who had worked previously as an statement on the matter. [30108/04] unqualified teacher. Minister for Education and Science (Ms Special Educational Needs. Hanafin): A large-scale building project for the school to which the Deputy refers is listed in 460. Mr. J. Higgins asked the Minister for Edu- section 9 of the 2004 school building programme. cation and Science the number of schools which It was assigned a band 3 rating by my Depart- have been and are in the process of having their ment in accordance with the published criteria for provision of special needs assistants reviewed; the prioritising large-scale projects. The project purpose of this review of provision of special planned for the school is being considered as part needs assistants; if this review is being conducted of a review together with all other projects that on the basis of the number of hours allocated to did not proceed to construction as part of the schools or on the basis of each child; if this review 2004 school building programme. All such pro- is being conducted by the same qualified person- jects are being assessed against the published nel that originally allocated the special needs sup- prioritisation criteria, revised earlier this year fol- port; and if she will make a statement on the lowing consultation with the education partners. matter. [30010/04] Each project will be assigned a band rating and Minister for Education and Science (Ms the progress of all projects will be considered in Hanafin): A review of special needs assistant, the context of the school building programme SNA, provision, which commenced recently, will from 2005 onwards. All factors relating to the apply to approximately 2,000 primary schools school mentioned, including the increased enrol- with existing SNA support. The review is con- ment, are being considered in the review. Full cerned with the level and deployment of SNA details of the prioritisation criteria are available posts in mainstream classes. The intention is to on my Department’s website at www.education.ie. ensure that the level of approved SNA support in 462. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- schools, and the manner in which that support is cation and Science when a school (details being allocated, are such as to ensure that the supplied) in County Donegal will progress from special care needs of pupils are being appropri- stage 1 to the next stage; and if she will make a ately met. As part of the exercise, outstanding statement on the matter. [30109/04] applications for SNA support for pupils who are attending mainstream classes will be processed. Minister for Education and Science (Ms Decisions on the applications will be conveyed to Hanafin): The building project for the school the schools as soon as this process has been referred to by the Deputy is at an early stage of completed. architectural planning and has a band 3 rating. The team conducting the review is comprised My officials are nearing completion of a review of retired members of my Department’s inspec- of all projects that did not proceed to construc- torate. It was supplemented recently by a number tion as part of the 2004 school building pro- of special education needs organisers, SENOs, gramme, including the school referred to by the who are employed by the National Council for Deputy. All projects are being assessed against Special Education. As the Deputy may be aware, the published prioritisation criteria, agreed earl- the council has been established as an indepen- ier this year with the education partners. Each dent statutory body with responsibilities as set project will be assigned a band rating and the pro- out in the National Council for Special Education gress of all projects will be considered in the con- (Establishment) Order 2003. The SENOs will be text of the school building programme from a focal point of contact for schools and parents 2005 onwards. and will process applications for resources for pupils with special educational needs, SEN. Site Acquisitions. In this context, the SENOs are undergoing extensive training to ensure they will also be 463. Mr. R. Bruton asked the Minister for Edu- qualified to review the levels of SNA supports in cation and Science if a site for a new primary schools. It is anticipated the council and the school at Ballycullen in west Dublin has been 367 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 368

[Mr. R. Bruton.] vision. Detailed discussions regarding reservation acquired by his Department; the likely timeframe of sites and scale and timeframe for devel- involved concerning a decision in respect of opments also take place at this forum. Arising building this new school facility; the number of from this process, a site for primary school pur- meetings he has held with South Dublin County poses has been reserved in the Fortunestown Council and the Dublin schools planning commit- area. A decision on the provision of a new school tee as a means of assessing the likely timescale will involve further consultations with the local of housing development at this location and the authority regarding the rate and likely timescale anticipated demand; and if she will make a state- of housing developments in the area, together ment on the matter. [30138/04] with an ongoing assessment of the capacity of existing schools to meet anticipated demand. Minister for Education and Science (Ms Hanafin): The school planning section of my Schools Building Projects. Department works closely with the four local authorities in the Dublin region in monitoring 465. Mr. Walsh asked the Minister for Edu- demographic changes and assessing the likely cation and Science the position regarding the pro- impact of planned new housing developments. A vision of a gaelscoil at Clonakilty, County Cork; dedicated forum, the Dublin school planning and if she will make a statement on the committee, chaired by school planning section, matter. [30152/04] interacts with the Dublin local authorities. This Minister for Education and Science (Ms forum also comprises representatives of the Hanafin): An application for the provision of a patron bodies of primary schools. It meets twice new school for the gaelscoil in Clonakilty is being a year. The Dublin school planning committee considered as part of a review of all projects that acts as an initial point of contact where the local did not proceed to construction as part of the authorities can signal to my Department and the 2004 school building programme. All projects are patron bodies anticipated demand for school pro- being assessed against the published prioritisation vision. Detailed discussions regarding reservation criteria, revised earlier this year following consul- of sites and scale and timeframe for devel- tation with the education partners. Each project opments also take place at this forum. Arising will be assigned a band rating and the progress of from this process, a site for primary school pur- all projects will be considered in the context of poses has been reserved in the Ballycullen area. the school building programme from 2005 A decision on the provision of a new school will onwards. involve further consultations with the local auth- ority regarding the rate and likely timescale of Special Educational Needs. housing developments in the area, together with an ongoing assessment of the capacity of existing 466. Mr. Costello asked the Minister for Edu- schools to meet anticipated demand. cation and Science the reason the weighted system for improving the allocation of teaching 464. Mr. R. Bruton asked the Minister for Edu- resources for pupils with special education needs cation and Science if a site for a new primary will result in the loss of 2.2 teachers at a school school at Fortunestown in west Dublin has been (details supplied) in Dublin 7; if the decision in acquired by her Department; the likely timeframe relation to this school will be reversed; if the involved concerning a decision in respect of number of schools in disadvantaged areas that are building this new school facility; the number of adversely affected by the new weighting system meetings her Department has held with South introduced in June 2004 will not lose out as a Dublin County Council and the Dublin schools result of the changes; and if she will make a state- planning committee as a means of assessing the ment on the matter. [30154/04] likely timescale of housing development at this location and the anticipated demand; and if she Minister for Education and Science (Ms will make a statement on the matter. [30142/04] Hanafin): I am conscious of difficulties that could arise in relation to the proposed model for allo- Minister for Education and Science (Ms cating resource teachers to primary schools, Hanafin): The school planning section of my particularly for children in small and rural schools Department works closely with the four local if it were implemented as proposed. Accordingly, authorities in the Dublin region in monitoring I will review the proposed model to ensure it pro- demographic changes and assessing the likely vides an automatic response for pupils with com- impact of planned new housing developments. A mon mild learning disabilities without the need dedicated forum, the Dublin school planning for cumbersome individual applications while, at committee, chaired by school planning section, the same time, ensuring pupils in receipt of ser- interacts with the Dublin local authorities. This vice continue to receive the level of service forum also comprises representatives of the appropriate to their needs. The review will patron bodies of primary schools. It meets twice involve consultation with educational interests a year. The Dublin school planning committee and the National Council for Special Education acts as an initial point of contact where the local before it is implemented next year. It is important authorities can signal to my Department and the to emphasise that applications may be made for patron bodies anticipated demand for school pro- specific resource teacher allocations in respect of 369 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 370 pupils with lower incidence special educational the application. A decision will be conveyed to needs. the school as soon as this process has been completed. School Staffing. 467. Mr. Crowe asked the Minister for Edu- Student Support Schemes. cation and Science if she will investigate the 469. Mr. Haughey asked the Minister for Edu- delayed progress at a school (details supplied) in cation and Science the student support schemes County Donegal and the delay in having an extra and measures available under the aegis of her teacher allocated to the school and in the pro- Department to assist a third level student of a vision of a pre-fab. [30155/04] private college (details supplied); and if she will Minister for Education and Science (Ms make a statement on the matter. [30157/04] Hanafin): The staffing of a primary school is Minister for Education and Science (Ms determined by reference to the enrolment of the Hanafin): The higher education grants scheme school on 30 September of the previous school operates under the Local Authorities (Higher year. The number of mainstream posts sanctioned Education Grants) Acts 1968 to 1992. Under the is determined by reference to a staffing schedule scheme, an approved course is defined as a full- and is finalised for a particular year following dis- time undergraduate course of at least two years cussions with the education partners. The main- duration or a full-time postgraduate course of not stream staffing of the school referred to by the less than one year’s duration pursued in an Deputy for the current school year is a principal approved institution. An approved institution is and three mainstream class teachers based on the defined to mean a university, university college enrolment of 113 pupils on 30 September 2003. or other institution of higher education in so far According to data submitted to my Department as it provides a course or courses of not less than by the board of management, the enrolment on two years’ duration, being a course or courses 30 September 2004 was 120 pupils. The staffing that the Minister for Education and Science for the 2005-06 school year will be determined on approves for the time being for the purposes of the basis of this figure in accordance with the the Acts. agreed staffing schedule which is expected to be Each year a list of approved institutions is notified to boards of management early in 2005. specified for the purposes of the scheme. The The school planning section of my Department approved institutions mainly comprise of publicly has considered all applications for temporary funded third level institutions. In this regard, the accommodation. In the context of the available college to which the Deputy refers is not an funding and the number of applications for that approved college for the purpose of the scheme. funding, it was not possible to approve all appli- Any extension to the scope of the grants scheme cations received and only those with an absolute to include private colleges such as Portobello Col- and demonstrated need for additional accommo- lege can be considered only in light of available dation were approved. The application from the resources and in the context of competing school referred to by the Deputy was not success- demands within the education sector. There are ful on this occasion. no plans to extend the scope of the student sup- The need for accommodation at the school is port schemes to private colleges. being considered as part of a review of all pro- jects that did not proceed to construction as part Special Educational Needs. of the 2004 school building programme. All pro- jects are being assessed against the published 470. Mr. Stagg asked the Minister for Edu- prioritisation criteria, revised earlier this year fol- cation and Science when a computer will be pro- lowing consultation with the education partners. vided to a person (details supplied) on foot of the Each project will be assigned a band rating and application made by the principal of this person’s the progress of all projects will be considered in school; and if she will make a statement on the the context of the school building programme matter. [30158/04] from 2005 onwards. Minister for Education and Science (Ms Hanafin): My Department awaits the submission Special Educational Needs. of an application for a grant in respect of the 468. Mr. McHugh asked the Minister for Edu- equipment for the person referred to by the cation and Science if she will approve as a matter Deputy. I have asked my officials to contact the of urgency a special needs assistant for a person school authorities regarding this matter, with a (details supplied) in County Galway; and if she view to the speedy resolution of same. will make a statement on the matter. [30156/04] School Closures. Minister for Education and Science (Ms Hanafin): My Department received an appli- 471. Mr. M. Brady asked the Minister for Edu- cation for special needs assistant support for the cation and Science the discussions that have pupil in question on 15 November 2004. My taken place regarding alternative accommodation officials are liaising with the National Edu- for pupils given the decision to close a school cational Psychological Service, NEPS, regarding (details supplied) in Kilbarrack; the future use of 371 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 372

[Mr. M. Brady.] As part of this process, the Minister for Edu- the school; and if he will meet with residents to cation and Science is included among the pre- discuss the future use of the school. [30169/04] scribed authorities to whom local authorities are statutorily obliged to send draft development Minister for Education and Science (Ms plans or proposed variations to development Hanafin): A decision has been taken by the trus- plans. My Department monitors these plans and tees of the school referred to by the Deputy that meets with local authorities, as required, to estab- it will close in June 2007. Given the pattern of lish the location, scale and pace of major housing falling enrolments at the school, together with developments and their possible implications for surplus capacity in the general area, my Depart- school provision. Where appropriate, the local ment concurs with the trustees’ decision. I am authority may be requested to reserve a site for satisfied there is sufficient capacity in post-pri- educational purposes. In this way, every effort is mary schools in the area to cater for children who made to ensure adequate existing provision or would otherwise have attended the school in timely arrangements are made to extend capacity, question. Assistance with arrangements for spec- where necessary. Liaison with existing schools is ific alternative placements for pupils is, in the first an important part of the process also, as the instance, a matter for the school’s management school authorities would usually alert my Depart- authority. At this early stage, consideration has ment where, in their view, the need for additional not yet been given to the future use of the school accommodation is anticipated. building. In the absence of such consideration, a In addition, standing arrangements are in place meeting with residents would not be beneficial at for officials of my Department’s planning and this time. building unit to meet on a regular basis with officials of the four Dublin local authorities to Educational Disadvantage. discuss development proposals and consequent 472. Mr. Eoin Ryan asked the Minister for site requirements for new schools. My Depart- Education and Science if she will designate a pri- ment is concentrating on the areas of major mary school (details supplied) in the Dublin 4 development and population growth with a view area as a Dublin inner city school in view of the to identifying where the most urgent need for large number of its pupils who live in the defined new or additional educational facilities exists or inner city area; and if she will make a statement is likely to arise in the future. on the matter. [30170/04] School Accommodation. Minister for Education and Science (Ms Hanafin): My Department has been engaged in 474. Mr. Cuffe asked the Minister for Edu- an overall review of its educational disadvantage cation and Science if she considered acquiring a programmes, with a view to building on what has hall (details supplied) in Dublin 2 in order to pro- been achieved to date, adopting a more system- vide future accommodation for students. atic, targeted and integrated approach and [30207/04] strengthening the capacity of the system to meet Minister for Education and Science (Ms the educational needs of disadvantaged children Hanafin): My Department does not provide and young people. A decision to expand or student accommodation or direct financial assist- extend any of the initiatives aimed at addressing ance for the provision of such accommodation. In educational disadvantage is being considered in recognition of the difficulties students can experi- the context of this review, the outcome of which ence in obtaining accommodation and following I hope to announce shortly. consultation with third level colleges, a special tax incentive was introduced to encourage the pro- Site Acquisitions. vision of dedicated student residential accommo- 473. Mr. Cuffe asked the Minister for Edu- dation in section 50 of the Finance Act 1999. The cation and Science the demographic and other tax incentive is available for expenditure up to 31 data used in determining the location of new July 2006 where an application for full planning schools; and if data on planning applications for permission is received by a planning authority by dwellings is used as part of this process. 31 December 2004. The opportunity, therefore, [30206/04] exists to create significant additional accommo- dation for third level students. A rent a room Minister for Education and Science (Ms relief scheme was introduced in the Finance Act Hanafin): The process of assessing the need for 2001. It allows homeowners rent out a room in new or additional educational facilities at primary their homes and have rental income up to \7,620 and post-primary level in a given area entails con- a year tax free. The scheme encourages house- sideration by my Department of all relevant holders to rent rooms to students. factors, including enrolment and demographic trends, housing developments and the capacity of 475. Mr. O’Donovan asked the Minister for existing schools to meet the demand for places. Education and Science the proposals she has for This process includes obtaining information the purchase of a site for the construction of a regarding the number of planning permissions new school (details supplied) in County Cork to granted and sought in particular areas. replace the existing overcrowded and inadequate 373 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 374 school; and if she will make a statement on the mately 12.5 part-time resource teaching hours. I matter. [30211/04] am conscious of difficulties that could arise regarding the proposed model, particularly for Minister for Education and Science (Ms children in small and rural schools if it were Hanafin): The property management section of implemented as proposed. Accordingly, I will the OPW, which acts on behalf of my Depart- review the proposed model to ensure that it pro- ment on site acquisitions generally, is exploring vides an automatic response for pupils with com- the possibility of acquiring a site for the school mon mild learning disabilities, without the need referred to by the Deputy. Due to the commercial for cumbersome individual applications, while, at sensitivities of site acquisitions, it is not proposed the same time, ensuring pupils in receipt of ser- at this stage to identify specific sites to be vice continue to receive the level of service acquired. However, this information will be appropriate to their needs. The review will placed on my Department’s website when the rel- involve consultation with educational interests evant acquisitions have been completed. and the National Council for Special Education before it is implemented next year. It is important Schools Refurbishment. to emphasise that applications may be made for 476. Mr. O’Donovan asked the Minister for specific resource teacher allocations in respect of Education and Science the plans she has to reno- pupils with lower incidence special educational vate and refurbish a national school (details needs. supplied) in County Cork; the date when works will commence; and if she will make a statement Suicide Prevention. on the matter. [30212/04] 478. Mr. Lowry asked the Minister for Edu- Minister for Education and Science (Ms cation and Science if her attention has been Hanafin): A number of schemes are funded by drawn to the crisis facing teachers in primary and my Department from which school building post-primary schools relating to the issue of youth repair projects can be addressed. Under the grant suicide; her views on the fact that a co-ordinated scheme for minor works to national school effort based on the principle of early intervention properties, which came into operation in January involving her Department, youth affairs, the 1997, all national schools receive funding annu- Department of Health and Children and the ally. Items such as the replacement of windows, National Children’s Office is needed to tackle this roof repairs, re-surfacing of school yard, re-paint- huge and sensitive issue facing young people; her ing and re-decorating qualify as improvements to proposals for dealing with the crisis of youth suic- school building and grounds and come within the ide that faces parents and young people today; scope of the minor works covered by this grant. and if she will make a statement on the The summer works scheme, SWS, provides matter. [30214/04] capital grants for necessary small-scale works that Minister for Education and Science (Ms can be planned and delivered during the summer Hanafin): I am aware of the serious problem of months. Applications are considered under the youth suicide and of the need for a co-ordinated terms and conditions of the scheme. The manage- response to this difficult issue. My Department is ment authority of the school has recently made represented on a national steering group, which is an application for grant aid towards electrical preparing a national strategy for action on suicide works at the school under the summer works prevention. A number of Departments and scheme 2005. All applications for the 2005 interested bodies are also represented on this ste- scheme will be considered in school planning ering group, which is also supported by a techni- section and it is planned to publish the list of suc- cal advisory group. Wide consultation has taken cessful applicants early in the new year. place throughout the country, including consul- tation with the partners in education. The consul- Special Educational Needs. tation process is nearing completion and a new 477. Mr. Lowry asked the Minister for Edu- strategy and implementation plan will be ready cation and Science if her attention has been by March 2005. Several sections of my Depart- drawn to a letter (details supplied) regarding the ment and its associated agencies are considering issue of the new weighted system for assessment actions which can be taken to tackle this serious of special needs teacher requirements in primary problem. I will be in a position to make a further schools; if she will reconsider the special needs statement on this matter when the national requirement in the school outlined; and if she will strategy is published. make a statement on the matter. [30213/04] Special Educational Needs. Minister for Education and Science (Ms Hanafin): I am aware of the concerns raised in 479. Mr. Lowry asked the Minister for Edu- the letter regarding the impact that the proposed cation and Science her views on whether there is model for allocating resource teachers to primary a need for behavioural therapists to support pri- schools will have on the school in question. The mary and post-primary schools in tackling issues school has two full-time resource teaching posts, of behaviour, youth suicide, discipline and other one full-time learning support post and approxi- related issues; the cost to her Department to pro- 375 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 376

[Mr. Lowry .] tains a short section on the creation of a support- vide one behavioural therapist to every two pri- ive and caring school ethos, and advice on mary and post primary schools; and if she will assessing students for suicide risk. NEPS psychol- make a statement on the matter. [30215/04] ogists regularly assist schools in the aftermath of an incident since early intervention is important Minister for Education and Science (Ms in preventing distress and further difficulties for Hanafin): The issues of behaviour, youth suicide, those close to a person who has died tragically. and discipline are so complex that they are This is a highly valued element of the service that unlikely to be addressed by the introduction of NEPS provides to schools and I have asked NEPS one particular kind of professional intervention. to contact the writer of the letter in relation to The problems need to be addressed at whole the individual mentioned. school, class and individual pupil level, as well as With regard to the broader strategy, research by collaborative interventions in the wider edu- indicates that the development of self-esteem, cation, health, justice and welfare systems to general coping skills and personal effectiveness is ensure easy access to therapeutic services for chil- the most appropriate way to help the general dren and young people. As regards the employ- population of young people to deal with life ment of behaviour therapists, a more practical pressures and stress. The introduction of social, solution would be to ensure guidance counsellors, personal and health education, SPHE, as a core support teachers and pastoral staff who are in subject at primary level and up to junior certifi- schools have access to appropriate training and cate level has been a great achievement. An support that will enable them to deal with the dif- SPHE support team is in place to help schools to ficulties mentioned by the Deputy. implement this curriculum. The National Council Schools may request support from the National for Curriculum and Assessment is completing a Educational Psychological Service, NEPS, on proposal on SPHE for senior cycle. This will suicide and, if necessary, NEPS refers children include a module on mental health. and young people on to therapeutic services in In addition, my Department is involved in a the health sector. NEPS has also produced a national steering group, which is drawing up a resource pack for schools that helps them to plan new strategy and implementation plan for the a response to critical incidents and, in some areas, prevention of suicide. It expects to report in psychologists have arranged meetings on this sub- March 2005 and I will make a further statement ject for guidance counsellors and other groups when the strategy is published. of teachers. With regard to the cost of providing one behav- Telecommunications Services. iour therapist to every two schools, it is difficult to get a precise estimate because of variations in 481. Mr. Stanton asked the Minister for Edu- the pay scales in different settings. The pay for a cation and Science if all circular letters and other recruitment grade therapist at the bottom of the such documents are to be sent to all primary scale ranges from approximately \27,000 to schools by post until all schools have access to \32,000 and, therefore, providing one to every affordable broadband service; the allowance that two schools would cost approximately \50 mill- schools get per year in order to allow them to pay ion. However, it would be more appropriate and for Internet access costs; and if she will make a effective to support services available to schools. statement on the matter. [30235/04] Minister for Education and Science (Ms Suicide Prevention. Hanafin): My Department’s commitment to qual- 480. Mr. Lowry asked the Minister for Edu- ity customer service includes the commitment to cation and Science if her attention has been maximise the use of technology to improve ser- drawn to a letter (details supplied) sent to her vice delivery. Within the planning and building office on 31 October 2004; the way in which she unit of my Department, the Internet is used as intends to assist primary and post-primary the predominant mechanism for disseminating teachers who are faced with students at risk of information to schools on a range of relevant potential suicide; and if she will make a statement matters and issues. The unit has not received sub- on the matter. [30216/04] stantive complaints regarding this method of communication either from schools or from the Minister for Education and Science (Ms education partners. It is proposed to continue this Hanafin): I am aware of the contents of this let- pilot and to use the Department’s website to ter, which outlines details of a particular case and update school authorities on planning and build- also makes suggestions about a strategic ing matters only. Other circulars and associated approach aimed at dealing with emotional dis- documents will continue to be sent by post. turbance, thus preventing suicide. Schools faced Since 1999, some support has been available on with an emergency situation have access to advice an annual basis to schools to allow them access from the National Educational Psychological Ser- the Internet. Initially, through sponsorship by vice, NEPS. NEPS published a school handbook Eircom Limited, originally as Telecom E´ ireann, on responding to critical incidents last year and, and laterally by arrangement within my Depart- while it mainly addresses the issue of preparing ment limited free access was granted to all for and managing critical incidents, it also con- schools who wished it. In 2003-04, my Depart- 377 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 378 ment gave schools direct grants of between \200 Minister for Education and Science (Ms and \300 to support school Internet access Hanafin): The Government has committed \698 charges. million to the education sector for research, tech- My Department engaged in a public tender nology, innovation and development under the process, the results of which will see broadband National Development Plan 2000-2006. Internet connectivity supplied to all recognised Some \38 million of this has been specifically first and second level schools free of charge. The allocated to institutes of technology under the process will be funded as part of an agreement technological sector research sub-measure. The between Government and the Telecommunica- objective of providing this specific funding for tions and Internet Federation to which industry institutes of technology is to support and will contribute \15 million and the Exchequer \3 strengthen the research capability of the sector by million in the period 2005 to 2007. I announced a enabling institutes to focus on research projects new \18 million funding package on 20 Nov- based on core strengths, either of individual ember to enable primary and post-primary institutes or of the sector as a whole. Funding for schools to upgrade and augment their computer research is allocated on the basis of a competitive network facilities in advance of broadband roll- process with independent adjudication by out to schools. This new funding is additional to national and international experts. the \18 million being provided for broadband Waterford Institute of Technology has received through the industry-Government fund. funding amounting to some \2.36 million under The roll-out of broadband connectivity will be the technological sector research sub-measure in managed and moderated by a national school the period 2000 to 2004. I also understand that broadband network, which will provide a range the institute, in collaboration with other third of network support functions, including content level institutions, has been allocated almost \5 filtering, virus protection, firewall and intrusion million under the programme for research in detection services, and a unified schools e-mail third level institutions, PRTLI as the lead insti- system. It is envisaged the broadband network tution in a particular research project. will be in place at commencement of the broad- band roll-out in early 2005 and that all schools Special Educational Needs. will be connected by the end of that year. 484. Mr. P. Breen asked the Minister for Edu- cation and Science if consideration will be given Schools Building Projects. to sanctioning a special needs assistant for a per- 482. Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in asked the Minister son (details supplied) in County Clare; and if she for Education and Science if she will report on will make a statement on the matter. [30258/04] her plans regarding the provision of a new school Minister for Education and Science (Ms building for a school (details supplied) in County Hanafin): I can confirm that my Department has Cavan; the prospect of same being included in the considered an application for a special needs schools building programme for 2005; and if she assistant, SNA, for the pupil in question. The pro- will make a statement on the matter. [30247/04] cess included a visit to the school by my Depart- Minister for Education and Science (Ms ment’s inspectorate. The staffing level at the Hanafin): An application from the school in school consists of ten teaching posts and 16 SNAs County Cavan referred to by the Deputy is being and the current enrolment is 53. My Depart- considered as part of a review of all projects ment’s advice is that the school should deploy its which did not proceed to construction as part of existing SNA support in a flexible manner to the 2004 school building programme. All projects meet the needs of all the pupils with special care are being assessed against the published prioritis- needs in the school, including the pupil in ques- ation criteria, revised earlier this year following tion. My Department conveyed this advice to the consultation with the education partners. Each school in a letter on 10 November 2004. project will be assigned a band rating and the pro- gress of all projects will be considered in the con- Higher Education Grants. text of the school building programme from 485. Mr. English asked the Minister for Edu- 2005 onwards. cation and Science if a person (details supplied) in County Meath will be given a grant for a two- Institutes of Technology. year degree course in embalming for a college in 483. Mr. O’Shea asked the Minister for Edu- California; and if she will make a statement on cation and Science her proposals to assist Water- the matter. [30311/04] ford Institute of Technology in rapidly Minister for Education and Science (Ms developing its research and development capacity Hanafin): The position is that none of the third to assist the manufacturing sector in the south- level student support schemes operated under the east region in meeting the growing challenges in aegis of the Department extend to undergraduate the global market, thereby contributing the pro- courses outside the European Union. Apart from tection of existing jobs and the creation of new the funds provided specifically for the purposes jobs; and if she will make a statement on the of the third level student support schemes, there matter. [30248/04] are no other moneys at the disposal of the 379 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 380

[Ms Hanafin.] school (details supplied) in County Laois; the Department of Education and Science out of status of the application; if it will be included in which financial assistance could be made avail- the schools building programme 2005; and if she able for study for a college in California. will make a statement on the matter. [30327/04] 486. Mr. English asked the Minister for Edu- 552. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- cation and Science the reason a person (details cation and Science if an application under the supplied) in Dublin 15 will not be classified as a schools building programme has been made by a mature student and still has to submit their family school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the income details to qualify for grant aid from the status of the application; if it will be included in local authority; and if she will make a statement the schools building programme 2005; and if she on the matter. [30326/04] will make a statement on the matter. [30393/04]

Minister for Education and Science (Ms 586. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- Hanafin): The higher education grant schemes cation and Science if an application under the operate under the Local Authorities (Higher schools building programme has been made by a Education Grants) Acts, 1968 to 1992. These Acts school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the define a mature student to mean a person “of not status of the application; if it will be included in less than 23 years of age, or such age as may stand the schools building programme 2005; and if she specified for the time being in regulations made will make a statement on the matter. [30427/04] by the Minister with the consent of the Minister 587. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- for Finance, who have secured places in approved cation and Science if an application under the institutions and have reached that age on the 1st schools building programme has been made by a day of January, or such other date as may be pre- school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the scribed from time to time by the Minister with status of the application; if it will be included in the consent of the Minister for Finance, in the the schools building programme 2005; and if she year of entry to such institutions”. The Acts will make a statement on the matter. [30428/04] further provide, inter alia, for the making of grants to mature students whose means and those 589. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- of their parents, where the mature students are cation and Science if an application under the dependent on their parents do not exceed pre- schools building programme has been made by a scribed limits. school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the Under the terms of the higher education grants status of the application; if it will be included in schemes, mature students are categorised as the schools building programme 2005; and if she either independent mature students or mature will make a statement on the matter. [30430/04] students dependent on parents. An independent 591. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- mature student is defined to mean a mature cation and Science if an application under the student who was not ordinarily resident at home schools building programme has been made by a with his or her parents from the October preced- school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the ing their entry to an approved course. Indepen- status of the application; if it will be included in dent mature students are assessed without refer- the schools building programme 2005; and if she ence to either their parents’ income or address. will make a statement on the matter. [30432/04] When assessing the means of students, other than independent mature students, the Acts spec- 593. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- ify that the students’ means and those of their cation and Science if an application under the parents or guardians must be below a prescribed schools building programme has been made by a limit. This provision requires that parental school (details supplied) in County Laois; the income be taken into account irrespective of the status of the application; if it will be included in individual circumstances in any case where the the schools building programme 2005; and if she student is not an independent mature student. will make a statement on the matter. [30434/04] With regard to the student referred to by the Deputy, Meath County Council confirmed that 595. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- the student was assessed as a dependent mature cation and Science if an application under the student on the year of entry of his approved schools building programme has been made by a course and will, therefore, continue to be assessed school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the as such for the duration of the course. To assess status of the application; if it will be included in the eligibility of the candidate for a maintenance the schools building programme 2005; and if she grant, the local authority must examine the will make a statement on the matter. [30436/04] income details of both the candidate and of the 599. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- parents in this case. cation and Science if an application under the schools building programme has been made by a Schools Building Projects. school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the 487. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- status of the application; if it will be included in cation and Science if an application under the the schools building programme 2005; and if she schools building programme has been made by a will make a statement on the matter. [30440/04] 381 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 382

600. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- the schools building programme 2005; and if she cation and Science if an application under the will make a statement on the matter. [30337/04] schools building programme has been made by a 498. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the cation and Science if an application under the status of the application; if it will be included in schools building programme has been made by a the schools building programme 2005; and if she school (details supplied) in County Laois; the will make a statement on the matter. [30441/04] status of the application; if it will be included in Minister for Education and Science (Ms the schools building programme 2005; and if she Hanafin): I propose to take Questions Nos. 487, will make a statement on the matter. [30338/04] 552, 586, 587, 589, 591, 593, 595, 599 and 600 together. 500. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- My Department has no record of an appli- cation and Science if an application under the cation for capital funding from the schools schools building programme has been made by a referred to by the Deputy. school (details supplied) in County Laois; the status of the application; if it will be included in 488. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- the schools building programme 2005; and if she cation and Science if an application under the will make a statement on the matter. [30340/04] schools building programme has been made by a school (details supplied) in County Laois; the 504. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- status of the application; if it will be included in cation and Science if an application under the the schools building programme 2005; and if she schools building programme has been made by a will make a statement on the matter. [30328/04] school (details supplied) in County Laois; the status of the application; if it will be included in 489. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- the schools building programme 2005; and if she cation and Science if an application under the will make a statement on the matter. [30344/04] schools building programme has been made by a school (details supplied) in County Laois; the 512. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- status of the application; if it will be included in cation and Science if an application under the the schools building programme 2005; and if she schools building programme has been made by a will make a statement on the matter. [30329/04] school (details supplied) in County Laois; the status of the application; if it will be included in 490. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- the schools building programme 2005; and if she cation and Science if an application under the will make a statement on the matter. [30352/04] schools building programme has been made by a school (details supplied) in County Laois; the 520. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- status of the application; if it will be included in cation and Science if an application under the the schools building programme 2005; and if she schools building programme has been made by a will make a statement on the matter. [30330/04] school (details supplied) in County Laois; the status of the application; if it will be included in 492. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- the schools building programme 2005; and if she cation and Science if an application under the will make a statement on the matter. [30360/04] schools building programme has been made by a school (details supplied) in County Laois; the 522. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- status of the application; if it will be included in cation and Science if an application under the the schools building programme 2005; and if she schools building programme has been made by a will make a statement on the matter. [30332/04] school (details supplied) in County Laois; the status of the application; if it will be included in 493. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- the schools building programme 2005; and if she cation and Science if an application under the will make a statement on the matter. [30362/04] schools building programme has been made by a school (details supplied) in County Laois; the 523. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- status of the application; if it will be included in cation and Science if an application under the the schools building programme 2005; and if she schools building programme has been made by a will make a statement on the matter. [30333/04] school (details supplied) in County Laois; the status of the application; if it will be included in 495. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- the schools building programme 2005; and if she cation and Science if an application under the will make a statement on the matter. [30363/04] schools building programme has been made by a school (details supplied) in County Laois; the 526. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- status of the application; if it will be included in cation and Science if an application under the the schools building programme 2005; and if she schools building programme has been made by a will make a statement on the matter. [30335/04] school (details supplied) in County Laois; the status of the application; if it will be included in 497. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- the schools building programme 2005; and if she cation and Science if an application under the will make a statement on the matter. [30366/04] schools building programme has been made by a school (details supplied) in County Laois; the 529. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- status of the application; if it will be included in cation and Science if an application under the 383 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 384

[Ms Enright.] 496. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- schools building programme has been made by a cation and Science if an application under the school (details supplied) in County Laois; the schools building programme has been made by a status of the application; if it will be included in school (details supplied) in County Laois; the the schools building programme 2005; and if she status of the application; if it will be included in will make a statement on the matter. [30369/04] the schools building programme 2005; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [30336/04] 532. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- cation and Science if an application under the 501. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- schools building programme has been made by a cation and Science if an application under the school (details supplied) in County Laois; the schools building programme has been made by a status of the application; if it will be included in school (details supplied) in County Laois; the the schools building programme 2005; and if she status of the application; if it will be included in will make a statement on the matter. [30372/04] the schools building programme 2005; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [30341/04] 538. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- cation and Science if an application under the 502. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- schools building programme has been made by a cation and Science if an application under the school (details supplied) in County Laois; the schools building programme has been made by a status of the application; if it will be included in school (details supplied) in County Laois; the the schools building programme 2005; and if she status of the application; if it will be included in will make a statement on the matter. [30378/04] the schools building programme 2005; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [30342/04] 539. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- cation and Science if an application under the 503. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- schools building programme has been made by a cation and Science if an application under the school (details supplied) in County Laois; the schools building programme has been made by a status of the application; if it will be included in school (details supplied) in County Laois; the the schools building programme 2005; and if she status of the application; if it will be included in will make a statement on the matter. [30379/04] the schools building programme 2005; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [30343/04] 540. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- cation and Science if an application under the 506. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- schools building programme has been made by a cation and Science if an application under the school (details supplied) in County Laois; the schools building programme has been made by a status of the application; if it will be included in school (details supplied) in County Laois; the status of the application; if it will be included in the schools building programme 2005; and if she the schools building programme 2005; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [30380/04] will make a statement on the matter. [30346/04] Minister for Education and Science (Ms 508. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- Hanafin): I propose to take Questions Nos. 488, cation and Science if an application under the 489, 490, 492, 493, 495, 497, 498, 500, 504, 512, schools building programme has been made by a 520, 522, 523, 526, 529, 532, 538, 539 and 540 school (details supplied) in County Laois; the together. status of the application; if it will be included in My Department has no record of an appli- the schools building programme 2005; and if she cation for capital funding from the schools will make a statement on the matter. [30348/04] referred to by the Deputy. However, school plan- 509. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- ning section officials are in ongoing discussions cation and Science if an application under the with the trustees of a number of schools in Port- schools building programme has been made by a laoise regarding possible future accommodation school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the requirements in this rapidly developing town. status of the application; if it will be included in 491. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- the schools building programme 2005; and if she cation and Science if an application under the will make a statement on the matter. [30349/04] schools building programme has been made by a 525. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- school (details supplied) in County Laois; the cation and Science if an application under the status of the application; if it will be included in schools building programme has been made by a the schools building programme 2005; and if she school (details supplied) in County Kildare; the will make a statement on the matter. [30331/04] status of the application; if it will be included in 494. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- the schools building programme 2005; and if she cation and Science if an application under the will make a statement on the matter. [30365/04] schools building programme has been made by a 527. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- school (details supplied) in County Laois; the cation and Science if an application under the status of the application; if it will be included in schools building programme has been made by a the schools building programme 2005; and if she school (details supplied) in County Laois; the will make a statement on the matter. [30334/04] status of the application; if it will be included in 385 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 386 the schools building programme 2005; and if she schools building programme has been made by a will make a statement on the matter. [30367/04] school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the status of the application; if it will be included in 528. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- the schools building programme 2005; and if she cation and Science if an application under the will make a statement on the matter. [30424/04] schools building programme has been made by a school (details supplied) in County Laois; the Minister for Education and Science (Ms status of the application; if it will be included in Hanafin): I propose to take Questions Nos. 491, the schools building programme 2005; and if she 494, 496, 501 to 503, inclusive 506, 508, 509, 525, will make a statement on the matter. [30368/04] 527, 528, 534, 536, 543, 547, 548, 549, 561 and 534. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- 583 together. cation and Science if an application under the Applications for capital funding have been schools building programme has been made by a received from the schools referred to by the school (details supplied) in County Laois; the Deputy. These applications are being considered status of the application; if it will be included in as part of a review of all projects which did not the schools building programme 2005; and if she proceed to construction as part of the 2004 school will make a statement on the matter. [30374/04] building programme. Under this review, all pro- jects are being assessed against the published 536. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- prioritisation criteria which were revised earlier cation and Science if an application under the this year following consultation with the edu- schools building programme has been made by a cation partners. Each project will be assigned a school (details supplied) in County Laois; the band rating and the progress of all projects will be status of the application; if it will be included in considered in the context of the school building the schools building programme 2005; and if she programme from 2005 onwards. will make a statement on the matter. [30376/04] 543. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- Questions Nos. 492 and 493 answered with cation and Science if an application under the Question No. 488. schools building programme has been made by a school (details supplied) in County Laois; the Question No. 494 answered with Question status of the application; if it will be included in No. 491. the schools building programme 2005; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [30384/04] Question No. 495 answered with Question No. 488. 547. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- cation and Science if an application under the Question No. 496 answered with Question schools building programme has been made by a No. 491. school (details supplied) in County Laois; the status of the application; if it will be included in Questions Nos. 497 and 498 answered with the schools building programme 2005; and if she Question No. 488. will make a statement on the matter. [30388/04] 499. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- 548. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- cation and Science if an application under the cation and Science if an application under the schools building programme has been made by a schools building programme has been made by a school (details supplied) in County Laois; the school (details supplied) in County Laois; the status of the application; if it will be included in status of the application; if it will be included in the schools building programme 2005; and if she the schools building programme 2005; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [30339/04] will make a statement on the matter. [30389/04] 531. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- 549. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- cation and Science if an application under the cation and Science if an application under the schools building programme has been made by a schools building programme has been made by a school (details supplied) in County Carlow; the school (details supplied) in County Laois; the status of the application; if it will be included in status of the application; if it will be included in the schools building programme 2005; and if she the schools building programme 2005; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [30371/04] will make a statement on the matter. [30390/04] 557. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- 561. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- cation and Science if an application under the cation and Science if an application under the schools building programme has been made by a schools building programme has been made by a school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the status of the application; if it will be included in status of the application; if it will be included in the schools building programme 2005; and if she the schools building programme 2005; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [30398/04] will make a statement on the matter. [30402/04] 562. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- 583. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- cation and Science if an application under the cation and Science if an application under the schools building programme has been made by a 387 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 388

[Ms Enright.] 596. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the cation and Science if an application under the status of the application; if it will be included in schools building programme has been made by a the schools building programme 2005; and if she school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the will make a statement on the matter. [30403/04] status of the application; if it will be included in 566. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- the schools building programme 2005; and if she cation and Science if an application under the will make a statement on the matter. [30437/04] schools building programme has been made by a 598. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the cation and Science if an application under the status of the application; if it woll be included in schools building programme has been made by a the schools building programme 2005; and if she school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the will make a statement in the matter. [30407/04] status of the application; if it will be included in 568. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- the schools building programme 2005; and if she cation and Science if an application under the will make a statement on the matter. [30439/04] schools building programme has been made by a school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the 601. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- status of the application; if it will be included in cation and Science if an application under the the schools building programme 2005; and if she schools building programme has been made by a will make a statement on the matter. [30409/04] school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the status of the application; if it will be included in 569. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- the schools building programme 2005; and if she cation and Science if an application under the will make a statement on the matter. [30442/04] schools building programme has been made by a school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the 605. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- status of the application; if it will be included in cation and Science if an application under the the schools building programme 2005; and if she schools building programme has been made by a will make a statement on the matter. [30410/04] school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the status of the application; if it will be included in 578. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- cation and Science if an application under the the schools building programme 2005; and if she schools building programme has been made by a will make a statement on the matter. [30446/04] school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the 610. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- status of the application; if it will be included in cation and Science if an application under the the schools building programme 2005; and if she schools building programme has been made by a will make a statement on the matter. [30419/04] school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the 584. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- status of the application; if it will be included in cation and Science if an application under the the schools building programme 2005; and if she schools building programme has been made by a will make a statement on the matter. [30451/04] school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the 617. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- status of the application; if it will be included in the schools building programme 2005; and if she cation and Science if an application under the will make a statement on the matter. [30425/04] schools building programme has been made by a school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the 588. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- status of the application; if it will be included in cation and Science if an application under the the schools building programme 2005; and if she schools building programme has been made by a will make a statement on the matter. [30458/04] school (details supplied) in County Tipperary; the status of the application; if it will be included in Minister for Education and Science (Ms the schools building programme 2005; and if she Hanafin): I propose to take Questions Nos. 499, will make a statement on the matter. [30429/04] 531, 557, 562, 566, 568, 569, 578, 584, 588, 590, 590. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- 594, 596, 598, 601, 605, 610 and 617 together. cation and Science if an application under the Applications have been received for capital schools building programme has been made by a funding from the schools to which the Deputy school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the refers. These applications are being considered as status of the application; if it will be included in part of a review of all projects which did not pro- the schools building programme 2005; and if she ceed to construction as part of the 2004 school will make a statement on the matter. [30431/04] building programme. Under this review, all pro- 594. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- jects are being assessed against the published cation and Science if an application under the prioritisation criteria which were revised earlier schools building programme has been made by a this year following consultation with the edu- school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the cation partners. Each project will be assigned a status of the application; if it will be included in band rating and the progress of all projects will be the schools building programme 2005; and if she considered in the context of the school building will make a statement on the matter. [30435/04] programme from 2005 onwards. 389 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 390

Question No. 500 answered with Question status of the application; if it will be included in No. 488. the schools building programme 2005; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [30449/04] Questions Nos. 501 to 503, inclusive, answered with Question No. 491. Minister for Education and Science (Ms Hanafin): I propose to take Questions Nos. 505, Question No. 504 answered with Question 507, 518, 521, 533, 537, 550 and 608 together. No. 488. Applications for building works have been made by the schools referred to by the Deputy. 505. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- The building projects are at early stages of archi- cation and Science if an application under the tectural planning. My officials are nearing com- schools building programme has been made by a pletion of a review of all projects which did not school (details supplied) in County Laois; the proceed to construction as part of the 2004 school status of the application; if it will be included in building programme including the schools in the schools building programme 2005; and if she question. All projects are being assessed against will make a statement on the matter. [30345/04] the published prioritisation criteria, agreed earl- 507. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- ier this year with the education partners. Each cation and Science if an application under the project will be assigned a band rating and the pro- schools building programme has been made by a gress of all projects will be considered in the con- school (details supplied) in County Laois; the text of the school building programme from status of the application; if it will be included in 2005 onwards. the schools building programme 2005; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [30347/04] Question No. 506 answered with Question No. 491. 518. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- cation and Science if an application under the Question No. 507 answered with Question schools building programme has been made by a No. 505. school (details supplied) in County Carlow; the status of the application; if it will be included in Question No. 508 and 509 answered with Ques- the schools building programme 2005; and if she tion No. 491. will make a statement on the matter. [30358/04] 510. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- 521. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- cation and Science if an application under the cation and Science if an application under the schools building programme has been made by a schools building programme has been made by a school (details supplied) in County Kildare; the school (details supplied) in County Carlow; the status of the application; if it will be included in status of the application; if it will be included in the schools building programme 2005; and if she the schools building programme 2005; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [30350/04] will make a statement on the matter. [30361/04] 533. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- Minister for Education and Science (Ms cation and Science if an application under the Hanafin): The extension project for the school schools building programme has been made by a referred to by the Deputy was authorised to pro- school (details supplied) in County Laois; the ceed to advanced architectural planning stage 4, status of the application; if it will be included in detail design, in July 2004. My officials are near- the schools building programme 2005; and if she ing completion of a review of all projects which will make a statement on the matter. [30373/04] did not proceed to construction as part of the 2004 school building programme including the 537. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- school referred to by the Deputy. All projects are cation and Science if an application under the being assessed against the published prioritisation schools building programme has been made by a criteria, agreed earlier this year with the edu- school (details supplied) in County Laois; the cation partners. Each project will be assigned a status of the application; if it will be included in band rating and the progress of all projects will be the schools building programme 2005; and if she considered in the context of the school building will make a statement on the matter. [30377/04] programme from 2005 onwards. 550. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- 511. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- cation and Science if an application under the cation and Science if an application under the schools building programme has been made by a schools building programme has been made by a school (details supplied) in County Laois; the school (details supplied) in County Kildare; the status of the application; if it will be included in status of the application; if it will be included in the schools building programme 2005; and if she the schools building programme 2005; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [30391/04] will make a statement on the matter. [30351/04] 608. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- 519. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- cation and Science if an application under the cation and Science if an application under the schools building programme has been made by a schools building programme has been made by a school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the school (details supplied) in County Kildare; the 391 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 392

[Ms Enright.] 576. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- status of the application; if it will be included in cation and Science if an application under the the schools building programme 2005; and if she schools building programme has been made by a will make a statement on the matter. [30359/04] school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the status of the application; if it will be included in 555. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- the schools building programme 2005; and if she cation and Science if an application under the schools building programme has been made by a will make a statement on the matter. [30417/04] school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the 577. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- status of the application; if it will be included in cation and Science if an application under the the schools building programme 2005; and if she schools building programme has been made by a will make a statement on the matter. [30396/04] school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the 556. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- status of the application; if it will be included in cation and Science if an application under the the schools building programme 2005; and if she schools building programme has been made by a will make a statement on the matter. [30418/04] school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the 579. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- status of the application; if it will be included in cation and Science if an application under the the schools building programme 2005; and if she schools building programme has been made by a will make a statement on the matter. [30397/04] school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the 558. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- status of the application; if it will be included in cation and Science if an application under the the schools building programme 2005; and if she schools building programme has been made by a will make a statement on the matter. [30420/04] school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the 580. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- status of the application; if it will be included in cation and Science if an application under the the schools building programme 2005; and if she schools building programme has been made by a will make a statement on the matter. [30399/04] school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the 563. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- status of the application; if it will be included in cation and Science if an application under the the schools building programme 2005; and if she schools building programme has been made by a will make a statement on the matter. [30421/04] school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the 582. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- status of the application; if it will be included in the schools building programme 2005; and if she cation and Science if an application under the will make a statement on the matter. [30404/04] schools building programme has been made by a school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the 564. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- status of the application; if it will be included in cation and Science if an application under the the schools building programme 2005; and if she schools building programme has been made by a will make a statement on the matter. [30423/04] school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the status of the application; if it will be included in Minister for Education and Science (Ms the schools building programme 2005; and if she Hanafin): I propose to take Questions Nos. 511, will make a statement on the matter. [30405/04] 519, 555, 556, 558, 563 to 565, inclusive, 571, 572, 565. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- 576, 577, 579, 580 and 582 together. cation and Science if an application under the My Department has no record of an appli- schools building programme has been made by a cation for capital funding from the schools school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the referred to by the Deputy. status of the application; if it will be included in the schools building programme 2005; and if she Question No. 512 answered with Question will make a statement on the matter. [30406/04] No. 488. 571. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- 513. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- cation and Science if an application under the cation and Science if an application under the schools building programme has been made by a Schools Building Programme has been made by school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the a school (details supplied) in County Laois; the status of the application; if it will be included in status of the application; if it will be included in the schools building programme 2005; and if she the Schools Building Programme 2005; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [30412/04] will make a statement on the matter. [30353/04] 572. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- 615. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- cation and Science if an application under the cation and Science if an application under the schools building programme has been made by a Schools Building Programme has been made by school (details supplied) in County Kildare; the a school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the status of the application; if it will be included in status of the application; if it will be included in the schools building programme 2005; and if she the Schools Building Programme 2005; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [30413/04] will make a statement on the matter. [30456/04] 393 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 394

Minister for Education and Science (Ms The initiative allows boards of management to Hanafin): I propose to take Questions Nos. 513 address their accommodation and building priori- and 615 together. ties with a guaranteed amount of funding and My Department has recently funded the pro- them control of the building project. vision of a new eight-classroom school and a new 517. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- three-classroom school for the schools referred to cation and Science if an application under the by the Deputy. schools building programme has been made by a 514. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- school (details supplied) in County Laois; the cation and Science if an application under the status of the application; if it will be included in Schools Building Programme has been made by the schools building programme 2005; and if she a school (details supplied) in County Carlow; the will make a statement on the matter. [30357/04] status of the application; if it will be included in 559. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- the Schools Building Programme 2005; and if she cation and Science if an application under the will make a statement on the matter. [30354/04] schools building programme has been made by a 535. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the cation and Science if an application under the status of the application; if it will be included in Schools Building Programme has been made by the schools building programme 2005; and if she a school (details supplied) in County Carlow; the will make a statement on the matter. [30400/04] status of the application; if it will be included in 570. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- the Schools Building Programme 2005; and if she cation and Science if an application under the will make a statement on the matter. [30375/04] schools building programme has been made by a school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the Minister for Education and Science (Ms status of the application; if it will be included in Hanafin): I propose to take Questions Nos. 514 the schools building programme 2005; and if she and 535 together. will make a statement on the matter. [30411/04] My Department has no record of an appli- cation for capital funding from the schools 575. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- referred to by the Deputy. cation and Science if an application under the schools building programme has been made by a 515. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the cation and Science if an application under the status of the application; if it will be included in schools building programme has been made by a the schools building programme 2005; and if she school (details supplied) in County Kildare; the will make a statement on the matter. [30416/04] status of the application; if it will be included in the schools building programme 2005; and if she 609. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- will make a statement on the matter. [30355/04] cation and Science if an application under the schools building programme has been made by a Minister for Education and Science (Ms school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the Hanafin): I am pleased to advise the Deputy that status of the application; if it will be included in the school in question is included in my Depart- the schools building programme 2005; and if she ment’s 2004 school building programme. As part will make a statement on the matter. [30450/04] of the expansion of the devolved scheme con- tained in the 2004 school building programme, a Minister for Education and Science (Ms grant of \200,000 was sanctioned to enable the Hanafin): I propose to take Questions Nos. 517, management authority of the school in question 559, 570, 575 and 609 together. to provide additional accommodation. The projects referred to by the Deputy are part of this year’s school building programme and I 516. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- am pleased to inform her that construction work cation and Science if an application under the is recently under way at each of them. schools building programme has been made by a school (details supplied) in County Laois; the Question No. 518 answered with Question status of the application; if it will be included in No. 505. the schools building programme 2005; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [30356/04] Question No. 519 answered with Question No. 511. Minister for Education and Science (Ms Hanafin): I am pleased to advise the Deputy that Question No. 520 answered with Question the school in question was included in my Depart- No. 488. ment’s 2003 school building programme. As part of a pilot initiative contained in the Question No. 521 answered with Question 2003 school building programme, a grant of No. 505. \100,000 was sanctioned to enable the manage- ment authority of the school in question to pro- Questions Nos. 522 and 523 answered with vide additional classroom accommodation. Question No. 488. 395 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 396

524. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- Question No. 534 answered with Question cation and Science if an application under the No. 491. schools building programme has been made by a school (details supplied) in County Laois; the Question No. 535 answered with Question status of the application; if it will be included in No. 514. the schools building programme 2005; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [30364/04] Question No. 536 answered with Question No. 491. Minister for Education and Science (Ms Hanafin): I am pleased to advise the Deputy that Question No. 537 answered with Question the school in question is included in my Depart- No. 505. ment’s 2004 school building programme. As part of the expansion of the devolved Question No. 538 answered with Question scheme contained in the 2004 school building pro- No. 488. gramme, a grant of \275,000 was sanctioned to enable the management authority of the school Questions Nos. 539 and 540 answered with in question to provide additional accommodation. Question No. 488. The initiative allows boards of management to 541. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- address their accommodation and building priori- cation and Science if an application under the ties with a guaranteed amount of funding and schools building programme has been made by a gives them control of the building project. school (details supplied) in County Laois; the status of the application; if it will be included in Question No. 525 answered with Question the schools building programme 2005; and if she No. 491. will make a statement on the matter. [30382/04] 542. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- Question No. 526 answered with Question cation and Science if an application under the No. 488. schools building programme has been made by a school (details supplied) in County Laois; the Questions Nos. 527 and 528 answered with status of the application; if it will be included in Question No. 491. the schools building programme 2005; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [30383/04] Question No. 529 answered with Question No. 488. 544. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- cation and Science if an application under the 530. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- schools building programme has been made by a cation and Science if an application under the school (details supplied) in County Laois; the schools building programme has been made by a status of the application; if it will be included in school (details supplied) in County Laois; the the schools building programme 2005; and if she status of the application; if it will be included in will make a statement on the matter. [30385/04] the schools building programme 2005; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [30370/04] 545. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- cation and Science if an application under the Minister for Education and Science (Ms schools building programme has been made by a Hanafin): I am pleased to advise the Deputy that school (details supplied) in County Laois; the the school in question is included in my Depart- status of the application; if it will be included in ment’s 2004 school building programme. As part the schools building programme 2005; and if she of the expansion of the devolved scheme con- will make a statement on the matter. [30386/04] tained in the 2004 school building programme, a 546. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- grant of \275,000 was sanctioned to enable the cation and Science if an application under the management authority of the school in question schools building programme has been made by a to provide additional accommodation. The school (details supplied) in County Laois; the initiative allows boards of management to status of the application; if it will be included in address their accommodation and building priori- the schools building programme 2005; and if she ties with a guaranteed amount of funding and will make a statement on the matter. [30387/04] gives boards of management control of the build- ing project. 554. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- cation and Science if an application under the Question No. 531 answered with Question schools building programme has been made by a No. 499. school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the status of the application; if it will be included in Question No. 532 answered with Question the schools building programme 2005; and if she No. 488. will make a statement on the matter. [30395/04] 602. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- Question No. 533 answered with Question cation and Science if an application under the No. 505. schools building programme has been made by a 397 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 398 school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the Questions Nos. 547 to 549, inclusive, answered status of the application; if it will be included in with Question No. 491. the schools building programme 2005; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [30443/04] Question No. 550 answered with Question No. 505. 603. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- cation and Science if an application under the 551. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- schools building programme has been made by a cation and Science if an application under the school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the schools building programme has been made by a status of the application; if it will be included in school (details supplied) in County Laois; the the schools building programme 2005; and if she status of the application; if it will be included in will make a statement on the matter. [30444/04] the schools building programme 2005; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [30392/04] 606. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- cation and Science if an application under the Minister for Education and Science (Ms schools building programme has been made by a Hanafin): I am pleased to advise the Deputy that school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the the school in question is included in my Depart- status of the application; if it will be included in ment’s 2004 school building programme. As part the schools building programme 2005; and if she of the expansion of the devolved scheme con- will make a statement on the matter. [30447/04] tained in the 2004 school building programme, a grant of \350,000 was sanctioned to enable the 607. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- management authority of the school in question cation and Science if an application under the to provide additional accommodation. The schools building programme has been made by a initiative allows boards of management to school (details supplied) in County Tipperary; the address their accommodation and building priori- status of the application; if it will be included in ties with a guaranteed amount of funding and the schools building programme 2005; and if she gives boards of management control of the build- will make a statement on the matter. [30448/04] ing project. 612. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- cation and Science if an application under the Question No. 552 answered with Question schools building programme has been made by a No. 487. school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the 553. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- status of the application; if it will be included in cation and Science if an application under the the schools building programme 2005; and if she schools building programme has been made by a will make a statement on the matter. [30453/04] school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the status of the application; if it will be included in 613. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- the schools building programme 2005; and if she cation and Science if an application under the will make a statement on the matter. [30394/04] schools building programme has been made by a school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the Minister for Education and Science (Ms status of the application; if it will be included in Hanafin): An application for capital funding has the schools building programme 2005; and if she been received from the school to which the will make a statement on the matter. [30454/04] Deputy refers. This application is being con- 616. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- sidered as part of a review of all projects which cation and Science if an application under the did not proceed to construction as part of the schools building programme has been made by a 2004 school building programme. Under this school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the review, all projects are being assessed against the status of the application; if it will be included in published prioritisation criteria which were revised earlier this year following consultation the schools building programme 2005; and if she with the education partners. Each project will be will make a statement on the matter. [30457/04] assigned a band rating and the progress of all pro- jects will be considered in the context of the Minister for Education and Science (Ms school building programme from 2005 onwards. Hanafin): I propose to take Questions Nos. 541, 542, 544, 545, 546, 554, 602, 603, 606, 607, 612, 613 Question No. 554 answered with Question and 616 together. No. 541. My Department has no record of an appli- cation for capital funding from the schools to Questions Nos. 555 and 556 answered with which the Deputy refers. Question No. 511.

Question No. 543 answered with Question Question No. 557 answered with Question No. 491. No. 499.

Questions Nos. 544 to 546, inclusive, answered Question No. 558 answered with Question with Question No. 541. No. 511. 399 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 400

Question No 559 answered with Question the schools building programme 2005; and if she No. 517. will make a statement on the matter. [30414/04] 560. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- Minister for Education and Science (Ms cation and Science if an application under the Hanafin): The school in question was included in schools building programme has been made by a my Department’s 2003 school building pro- school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the gramme. As part of a pilot initiative contained in status of the application; if it will be included in the 2003 school building programme, a grant of the schools building programme 2005; and if she \200,000 was sanctioned to enable the manage- will make a statement on the matter. [30401/04] ment authority of the school to provide additional classroom accommodation. The initiative allows Minister for Education and Science (Ms boards of management to address their accommo- Hanafin): The extension project for the school dation and building priorities with a guaranteed referred to by the Deputy is at an early stage of amount of funding and gives boards of manage- architectural planning. It has a band 2 rating. My ment control of the building project. officials are nearing completion of a review of all projects which did not proceed to construction as 574. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- part of the 2004 school building programme cation and Science if an application under the including the school in question. All projects are schools building programme has been made by a being assessed against the published prioritisation school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the criteria, agreed earlier this year with the edu- status of the application; if it will be included in cation partners. the schools building programme 2005; and if she Each project will be assigned a band rating and will make a statement on the matter. [30415/04] the progress of all projects will be considered in the context of the school building programme Minister for Education and Science (Ms from 2005 onwards. Hanafin): An application for capital funding has been received from the school to which the Question No. 561 answered with Question Deputy refers. This application is being con- No. 491. sidered as part of a review of all projects which did not proceed to construction as part of the Question No. 562 answered with Question 2004 school building programme. Under this No. 499. review, all projects are being assessed against the published prioritisation criteria, which were Questions Nos. 563 to 565 inclusive answered revised earlier this year following consultation with Question No. 511. with the education partners. Each project will be assigned a band rating and the progress of all pro- Question No. 566 answered with Question jects will be considered in the context of the No. 499. school building programme from 2005 onwards.

567. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- Question No. 575 answered with Question cation and Science if an application under the No. 517. schools building programme has been made by a school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the Questions Nos. 576 and 577 answered with status of the application; if it will be included in Question No. 511. the schools building programme 2005; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [30408/04] Question No. 578 answered with Question No. 499. Minister for Education and Science (Ms Hanafin): My Department has no record of an Questions Nos. 579 and 580 answered with application for capital funding from the school to Question No. 511. which the Deputy refers. 581. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- Questions Nos. 568 and 569 answered with cation and Science if an application under the Question No. 499. schools building programme has been made by a school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the Question No. 570 answered with Question status of the application; if it will be included in No. 517. the schools building programme 2005; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [30422/04] Questions Nos. 571 and 572 answered with Question No. 511. Minister for Education and Science (Ms Hanafin): The extension project for the school 573. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- referred to by the Deputy is at an early stage of cation and Science if an application under the architectural planning. It has a band 1 rating. schools building programme has been made by a My officials are nearing completion of a review school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the of all projects which did not proceed to construc- status of the application; if it will be included in tion as part of the 2004 school building pro- 401 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 402 gramme, including the school in question. All \340,000 has been recently completed at the projects are being assessed against the published school in question. prioritisation criteria, agreed earlier this year with the education partners. Each project will be Question No. 593 answered with Question assigned a band rating and the progress of all pro- No. 487. jects will be considered in the context of the school building programme from 2005 onwards. Question No. 594 answered with Question No. 499. Question No. 582 answered with Question No. 511. Question No. 595 answered with Question No. 487. Question No. 583 answered with Question Question No. 596 answered with Question No. 491. No. 499.

Question No. 584 answered with Question Schools Refurbishment. No. 499. 597. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- 585. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- cation and Science if an application under the cation and Science if an application under the schools building programme has been made by a schools building programme has been made by a school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the status of the application; if it will be included in status of the application; if it will be included in the schools building programme 2005; and if she the schools building programme 2005; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [30438/04] will make a statement on the matter. [30426/04] Minister for Education and Science (Ms Minister for Education and Science (Ms Hanafin): I am pleased to inform the Deputy that \ Hanafin): The extension project for the school an extension-refurbishment project costing 1.6 referred to by the Deputy is at an early stage of million has been recently completed at the school architectural planning. It has a band 2 rating. in question. My officials are nearing completion of a review Question No. 598 answered with Question of all projects which did not proceed to construc- No. 499. tion as part of the 2004 school building pro- gramme, including the school in question. All Questions Nos. 599 and 600 answered with projects are being assessed against the published Question No. 487. prioritisation criteria, agreed earlier this year with the education partners. Each project will be Question No. 601 answered with Question assigned a band rating and the progress of all pro- No. 499. jects will be considered in the context of the school building programme from 2005 onwards. Questions Nos. 602 and 603 answered with Question No. 541. Questions Nos. 586 and 587 answered with Question No. 487. School Accommodation. 604. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- Question No. 588 answered with Question cation and Science if an application under the No. 499. schools building programme has been made by a school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the Question No. 589 answered with Question status of the application; if it will be included in No. 487. the schools building programme 2005; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [30445/04] Question No. 590 answered with Question No. 499. Minister for Education and Science (Ms Hanafin): I am pleased to advise the Deputy that Question No. 591 answered with Question the school in question was included in my Depart- No. 487. ment’s 2003 school building programme. As part of a pilot initiative contained in that programme, 592. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- a grant of \150,000 was sanctioned to enable the cation and Science if an application under the management authority of the school to provide schools building programme has been made by a additional classroom accommodation. The initiat- school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the ive allows boards of management to address their status of the application; if it will be included in accommodation and building priorities with a the schools building programme 2005; and if she guaranteed amount of funding and gives them will make a statement on the matter. [30433/04] control of the building project.

Minister for Education and Science (Ms Question No. 605 answered with Question Hanafin): An extension/refurbishment costing No. 499. 403 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 404

Questions Nos. 606 and 607 answered with agreed that the soccer club be allocated one pitch Question No. 541. on the northern side of a mill race which traverses the barrack lands and a second pitch to the south Question No. 608 answered with Question of that mill race, while the GAA club would be No. 505. given an area adjacent to the soccer pitch on the northern side. The formal allocation of the land Question No. 609 answered with Question in question to the clubs is a matter for Cork No. 517. County Council and my Department is in the pro- cess of transferring title to the property to the Question No. 610 answered with Question council. In addition, an area of almost ten acres, No. 499. currently held under licence by the GAA club, is to be sold to that club. Schools Refurbishment. 611. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- Defence Forces Reserve. cation and Science if an application under the 619. Mr. Timmins asked the Minister for schools building programme has been made by a Defence the position in respect of the announce- school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the ment of the relocation of a unit (details supplied) status of the application; if it will be included in from Sligo to Athlone; if, in view of the circum- the schools building programme 2005; and if she stances, this decision will be reversed; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [30452/04] will make a statement on the matter. [29794/04] 614. Ms Enright asked the Minister for Edu- Minister for Defence (Mr. O’Dea): On 26 July cation and Science if an application under the 2004, my predecessor Deputy Michael Smith schools building programme has been made by a officially launched the Reserve Defence Force school (details supplied) in County Offaly; the review implementation plan which is the start of status of the application; if it will be included in a process that will radically change the structure the schools building programme 2005; and if she and configuration of the reserve, while preserving will make a statement on the matter. [30455/04] its traditional strengths. These include such things Minister for Education and Science (Ms as the spirit of voluntary commitment, the main- Hanafin): I propose to take Questions Nos. 611 taining of strong links with local communities and and 614 together. a nationwide geographical spread. I am pleased to inform the Deputy that a \2.8 The Permanent Defence Force is now organ- million refurbishment programme has recently ised in a three-brigade structure and a Defence been completed at the schools in question. Forces training centre. The Reserve Defence Force will be similarly reorganised and restruc- Questions Nos. 612 and 613 answered with tured and it is envisaged that the implementation Question No. 541. of this plan will take place over the course of the next six years. Question No. 614 answered with Question The plan defines the organisational framework No. 611. of the new Army Reserve and provides for a greater concentration of units within each Army Question No. 615 answered with Question brigade area. There will be mergers both at bat- No. 513. talion and company level as well as between sister technical support units. This will be the key to Question No. 616 answered with Question providing enhanced training facilities and oppor- No. 541. tunities for each member of the reserve. In producing detailed proposals for the restruc- Question No. 617 answered with Question turing of reserve units within each brigade area, No. 499. the military authorities have taken due cogni- sance of the existing FCA presence within com- Army Lands. munities. Consultation and communication have been a priority throughout the development of 618. Mr. Timmins asked the Minister for the plan. They will continue to be important if the Defence the position with respect to the disposal changes now proposed are to be carried through of Army lands at a location (details supplied) in smoothly and effectively. Reserve units will be County Cork to local organisations; and if he will kept informed of developments on a regular make a statement on the matter. [29778/04] basis. Minister for Defence (Mr. O’Dea): An area Members of the FCA are already seeing the comprising more than 27 acres of the property in benefits of the reorganisation process in terms of question is being handed over to Cork County better clothing and improved equipment and Council for community use, including the pro- more and better quality training. As the process vision of playing pitches. I understand that at develops, we will see additional benefits in terms meetings held in the County Hall, Cork, in Janu- of a clearer role for the reserve, a better overall ary 2002, between my predecessor and represen- organisation structure, and opportunities for suit- tatives of local GAA and soccer clubs, it was ably qualified personnel to serve overseas. We 405 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 406 will also see benefits from the closer integration aspect of the Helsinki headline goal agreed by the and greater inter-operability of the reserve and Heads of State and Government in 1999. Follow- the Army. ing on from the realisation of the Helsinki head- The proposed relocation of the 5 Field CIS line goal, albeit with some shortfalls, earlier this company is consistent with the recommendations year member states adopted a new headline goal contained within the Reserve Defence Forces with a horizon of 2010. Under the new headline review implementation board report. The report goal, member states decided to commit them- proposed this relocation of 5 Field CIS company selves to be able by 2010 to respond with rapid to Athlone, where they will be co-located with and decisive action applying a fully coherent its Permanent Defence Force sister unit. This co- approach to the whole spectrum of crisis manage- location will facilitate additional training with ment operations, that is, the Petersberg Tasks, highly sophisticated signals equipment which is which, in short, involve humanitarian, rescue, not available in Sligo. peacekeeping and crisis management operations, The military authorities have advised that sig- including peacemaking. In this context, the ability nals training will continue in Sligo, as the new of the EU to deploy force packages at high readi- organisation in Sligo contains the signals platoon ness as a response to a crisis either as a stand- of headquarters company. This ensures that sig- alone force or as part of a larger operation nal skills will not be lost to the reserve in Sligo enabling follow-on phases, is a key element of the and that personnel will continue to train in the 2010 headline goal. signals area. In addition, the new organisation of At a military capabilities commitment con- the reserve in Sligo provides for an infantry com- ference on 22 November 2004, I informed my EU pany which actually will increase the overall colleagues of Ireland’s preparedness to enter into establishment of the reserve in Sligo from 77 to consultations with partners with a view to partici- 155. It is not intended that any Reserve Defence pation in the rapid response elements which will Force location will close. make up the high readiness force packages. As with many developments in the European Union, Communications Masts. the development of rapid response elements has involved much consultation between the member 620. Mr. Gregory asked the Minister for states. This consultation largely takes place at EU Defence , further to Question No. 256 of 16 Nov- level between the civil servants and military per- ember 2004, if such a survey will be carried out sonnel of the member states assigned to their in view of the fact that such surveys are standard respective representations in Brussels. In annual practice in many other countries; and if he addition, a key aspect of the development of the will make a statement on the matter. [30113/04] multinational rapid response elements will be the Minister for Defence (Mr. O’Dea): Iam question of interoperability with prospective part- advised that while there is no statutory require- ners. In this context, some informal consultations ment for owners or users of communications have taken place between both civil and military masts to have electromagnetic field strength tests officials of my Department and those of Sweden carried out, the Commission for Communications and Finland, with whom the Defence Forces Regulation, ComReg, which is the licensing auth- already have a good working relationship in Lib- ority for the use of the radio frequency spectrum eria and Kosovo, respectively. in Ireland, has recently completed a large survey As stated in my reply to the House on 17 Nov- of communications facilities on behalf of the ember 2004, further detailed analysis on Ireland’s Minister for Communications, Marine and participation in the rapid response elements will Natural Resources. The location in question was take place over the coming months. Following not selected as one of the sites for survey on this completion of the necessary analysis I intend occasion. However, I understand that ComReg returning to Government with proposals regard- may be requested to undertake further measure- ing the level of such participation. I re-emphasise ments next year although a decision in that regard that Ireland’s participation in such rapid response has yet to be made. elements will remain subject to the usual require- ments of Government decision, Da´il approval Overseas Missions. and UN authorisation. 621. Aengus O´ Snodaigh asked the Minister for Planning Issues. Defence the questions regarding Irish partici- pation in the proposed EU battle groups which 622. Mr. Sargent asked the Minister for the he has raised with the EU civil service as indi- Environment, Heritage and Local Government cated to Da´il E´ ireann on 17 November 2004; the the guidelines and best practice advice on tree questions raised with EU counterparts on this protection that are available from his Depart- issue; and any other questions currently being ment to local authorities for their subsequent pro- examined by him in relation to this issue. active distribution to architects, developers and [30305/04] planners. [29804/04] Minister for Defence (Mr. O’Dea): The Minister for the Environment, Heritage and development of EU rapid response elements to Local Government (Mr. Roche): Guidelines for carry out crisis management operations was a key planning authorities on tree preservation were 407 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 408

[Mr. Roche.] in view of Ireland’s record concerning compliance issued by my Department in 1994. The guidelines with EU environmental regulations, he will con- draw attention to the opportunities open to plan- sider upgrading or consolidating enforcement ning authorities to influence and control the con- mechanisms; and if he will make a statement on tribution which trees can make to the quality of the matter. [29676/04] life. Copies of the guidelines are available in the 629. Mr. Cuffe asked the Minister for the Oireachtas Library. Environment, Heritage and Local Government the mechanisms that are in place to ensure com- Water and Sewerage Schemes. pliance with EU environmental regulations; and 623. Mr. Ring asked the Minister for the Envir- if he will make a statement on the matter. onment, Heritage and Local Government the [29677/04] position with regard to a water scheme extension Minister for the Environment, Heritage and (details supplied) in County Mayo; when funding Local Government (Mr. Roche): I propose to was applied for by the council for this project; take Questions Nos. 625, 628 and 629 together. when funding will be approved; and the expected I am keenly aware of the importance of timely start date of this extension. [29661/04] transposition and effective implementation of EU Minister for the Environment, Heritage and environmental legislation. Some 200 pieces of EU Local Government (Mr. Roche): The extension environmental legislation, including more than of the Lough Mask regional water supply scheme 140 directives, have by now been transposed and, from Shrah to Westport is included in my Depart- more recently, external legal and drafting expert- ment’s water services investment programme ise has been utilised in order to expedite this. 2004-2006 to commence construction in 2005. My The European Commission has power to take Department approved the design report for the infringement proceedings against member states scheme last June and the submission of contract where it considers that legislation has not been documents by Mayo County Council is now transposed or has been improperly transposed. In awaited. line with this prerogative, the Commission raises The Louisburgh water supply scheme is also issues in correspondence with member states, and included in my Department’s water services if agreement is not reached on how to address the investment programme 2004-2006 to commence issue, may take a case to the European Court of construction in 2005. Mayo County Council’s Justice. My Department is in ongoing communi- design report for this scheme, and also for a pro- cation with the Commission on a range of issues posed supply to Murrisk, is under examination in at any given time and in addition meets regularly my Department and will be dealt with as quickly with Commission officials to identify how issues as possible. of non-compliance can best be addressed. High priority is being given to addressing outstanding Community Warden Service. issues in consultation with the Commission and relevant stakeholders. 624. Mr. J. O’Keeffe asked the Minister for the The European Commission published its fifth Environment, Heritage and Local Government annual survey on the implementation and the position regarding the proposal to establish a enforcement of Community environmental law community warden service; and if he will make a 2003 in July 2004. The report included a perform- statement on the matter. [29664/04] ance table of member states under three head- Minister for the Environment, Heritage and ings, relating to non-transposition, non-conform- Local Government (Mr. Roche): The pilot com- ity and failure to implement derived or secondary munity warden service was launched in February obligations. Of the then 15 member states Ireland 2002 in five local authorities: Galway, Leitrim and was ranked sixth best in relation to transposition, Wexford County Councils, Galway City Council eighth in relation to conformity and 15th in and Naas Town Council. My Department has relation to the implementation of derived or sec- commissioned an independent evaluation of the ondary obligations. pilots and a final report is due very shortly. This My Department, through the local authorities will provide a basis for further consideration of and the Environmental Protection Agency, EPA, the future of the service continues to work towards maintaining a high level of environmental protection for Ireland. To Environmental Policy. strengthen implementation structures, the office of environmental enforcement, OEE, has been 625. Mr. Cuffe asked the Minister for the established, with roles in direct enforcement Environment, Heritage and Local Government action, in providing support and guidance for the reason that between 1998 and 2003, Ireland local authority enforcement efforts, and in pursu- has had the second highest number of envir- ing those local authorities whose enforcement onment infringement cases of all EU member performance requires improvement. Ongoing states; and if he will make a statement on the EPA participation in IMPEL, an informal net- matter. [29673/04] work of European regulators concerned with the 628. Mr. Cuffe asked the Minister for the implementation and enforcement of environmen- Environment, Heritage and Local Government if, tal legislation, also assists in this work. 409 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 410

626. Mr. Cuffe asked the Minister for the of Creggs, County Galway; and if he will make a Environment, Heritage and Local Government statement on the matter. [29697/04] the reason his Department failed to comply with Minister for the Environment, Heritage and EU Regulation No. 2037-2000; and if he will Local Government (Mr. Roche): I refer to the make a statement on the matter. [29674/04] reply to Questions Nos. 1172 and 1204 of 29 Sep- 627. Mr. Cuffe asked the Minister for the tember 2004. Environment, Heritage and Local Government 632. Mr. Naughten asked the Minister for the the reason his Department chose not to reply to Environment, Heritage and Local Government, correspondence and notices of action from the further to Question No. 826 of 27 April 2004, if European Commission and preferred to argue he will approve funding for the upgrade to the the case before the court, with its significant cost south Roscommon water supply and Killeglan to the State; and if he will make a statement on springs; and if he will make a statement on the the matter. [29675/04] matter. [29699/04]

Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government (Mr. Roche): I propose to Local Government (Mr. Roche): The south take Questions Nos. 626 and 627 together. Roscommon water supply scheme has been Due to competing demands in relation to the approved for funding under my Department’s requirements of new EU environmental legis- water services investment programme 2004-2006. lation, and the need to deploy available resources The design review report for the scheme submit- on a priority basis, it was not previously possible ted by Roscommon County Council will be to put in place the detailed arrangements which further considered on receipt of additional infor- are necessary for the administration of EU Regu- mation which my Department has requested from lation 2037-2000 on substances that deplete the the county council. ozone layer. In this regard, it is important to note that none of the substances controlled under the Departmental Review. regulation are produced in this country. 633. Mr. O’Shea asked the Minister for the Prior to the judgment of the European Court Environment, Heritage and Local Government, of Justice steps were already being taken towards further to Question No. 179 of 13 October 2004, implementation of the Regulation. Consultants, when the review of the disabled persons grant URS Ireland Limited., were appointed at the end scheme in his Department will be concluded; if of 2003 by the Environmental Protection Agency he intends to publish the report of the review; on behalf of my Department to advise in this and if he will make a statement on the matter. regard and their final report is expected shortly. [29708/04] On receipt of the report, appropriate administra- tive arrangements for the regulation will be Minister of State at the Department of the brought forward as a matter of urgency. Environment, Heritage and Local Government (Mr. N. Ahern): The position regarding the Questions Nos. 628 and 629 answered with review is as set out in my reply to Question No. Question No. 625. 179 of 13 October 2004. The outcome of the review will be made available when completed. Land Initiative Scheme. Natural Heritage Areas. 630. Mr. Naughten asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government, 634. Mr. Ring asked the Minister for the Envir- further to Question No. 1203 of 29 September onment, Heritage and Local Government the 2004, the status of the application; and if he will position in relation to a project (details supplied) make a statement on the matter. [29694/04] in County Mayo; when he expects the work to commence on the visitor centre; if planning per- Minister for the Environment, Heritage and mission has been secured; when the construction Local Government (Mr. Roche): My Department phase will commence; and when it is expected will be in a position shortly to respond to infor- that the facility will open. [29731/04] mation received from Roscommon County Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Council in relation to the council’s revised pro- \ posals for the serviced land initiative scheme at Local Government (Mr. Roche): A sum of 3.81 Lanesboro Road, County Roscommon. million has been allocated by my Department under the National Development Plan 2000-2006 for this project, which involves a new visitor Water and Sewerage Schemes. centre to serve Ballycroy National Park, County 631. Mr. Naughten asked the Minister for the Mayo. A site has been acquired by my Depart- Environment, Heritage and Local Government if ment in the village of Ballycroy for this purpose. he has received the preliminary report on the A planning application for the proposed visitor development of a sewerage scheme for the village centre was lodged with Mayo County Council by 411 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 412

[Mr. Roche.] Minister for the Environment, Heritage and the Office of Public Works on behalf of my Local Government (Mr. Roche): I understand Department earlier this year. Additional infor- that a number of local authorities have used their mation requested by the council is being com- general by-law making powers under the local piled and I expect that this will be supplied to government code to prohibit the consumption of Mayo County Council within the next month. alcohol in public parks and open spaces. It may Subject to planning permission being obtained, it be, however, that significant further extension of is hoped that work on this project will commence this type of regulatory control should best be in 2005, with a 12-month completion time. addressed in the context of public order legis- lation which is the responsibility of my colleague, Services for People with Disabilities. the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law 635. Mr. Allen asked the Minister for the Reform. My Department has raised this issue Environment, Heritage and Local Government with that Department. the grant aid available for the installation of lifts for the disabled in buildings that are used by the Water and Sewerage Schemes. public, for example, community centres, churches and parish halls; and if there is no grant aid avail- 638. Mr. M. Moynihan asked the Minister for able, if he will consider introducing such a grant the Environment, Heritage and Local Govern- scheme. [29770/04] ment the state of progress on a development (details supplied) in County Cork; if he will out- Minister for the Environment, Heritage and line the delays in this project since the announce- Local Government (Mr. Roche): Such grant ment of funding by his Department in 1999; and assistance is not available from my Department, the reasons therefor. [29179/04] although I understand that a grant for purposes of this kind has been approved for Kildare Minister for the Environment, Heritage and County Council by the Dormant Accounts Fund Local Government (Mr. Roche): The Kilbrin Disbursements Board. My outline local govern- sewerage scheme has been approved for con- ment sectoral plan under the Disability Bill 2004 struction in my Department’s Water Services includes objectives, inter alia, to promote univer- Investment Programme 2004-2006 under the rural sal access to public spaces, buildings and services towns and villages initiative at an estimated cost owned and operated by local authorities, and to of \1.4 million. My Department approved con- review and update standards set out in part M, tract documents for the collection system in May access for people with disabilities, of the national 2004 and it is a matter for the council to advance building regulations. this element of the scheme to construction. Tender documents for the Kilbrin waste water Water and Sewerage Schemes. treatment plant, which is being procured as part 636. Mr. P. McGrath asked the Minister for the of a grouped design-build-operate contract that Environment, Heritage and Local Government if also involves a number of other locations, have tenders have been received for the completion of been submitted to my Department by Cork a sewerage scheme (details supplied) in County County Council. The tender documents will be Westmeath; the date on which these tenders were further considered when they have been revised received; if funding has been sanctioned for this by the council as requested by my Department in scheme; and if not, when it is expected that this September 2004. scheme will be given approval. [29773/04] Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Air Pollution. Local Government (Mr. Roche): I understand 639. Mr. Gormley asked the Minister for the that tenders for the provision of waste water Environment, Heritage and Local Government treatment facilities for Castletown-Geoghegan the procedure a person can follow if they believe and five other locations were received by Meath there is serious air pollution in their area which County Council, acting as procurement authority, is affecting their health; the person they should on 15 October 2004, and are being examined by contact to monitor the pollution and deal with the council. My Department has approved the this problem; and if he will make a statement on funding for the project under the rural water the matter. [29809/04] programme. Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government Code. Local Government (Mr. Roche): I refer to the 637. Ms M. Wallace asked the Minister for the reply to Question No. 376 of 28 October 2004. Environment, Heritage and Local Government Air quality management is primarily the the legislative mechanism by which a local auth- responsibility of local authorities. Accordingly, ority can bring forward by-laws preventing where an issue regarding air pollution arises in a alcohol consumption in public parks and open particular area, it should be brought to the atten- spaces. [29780/04] tion of the local authority concerned. 413 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 414

Seal Cull. with normal practice, the Guidelines for Planning Authorities on Sustainable Rural Housing, pub- 640. Mr. Haughey asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government if lished on 4 March 2004, were issued in draft form research has been undertaken on the number of to give all those interested an opportunity to com- seals off the Irish coast; if there are circumstances ment before the guidelines are finalised in statu- whereby seals can be culled in a controlled and tory form. Submissions in relation to the draft caring manner having regard to the scientific guidelines were to be submitted to my Depart- research available; and if he will make a state- ment by 30 April 2004. In view of the importance ment on the matter. [29836/04] of the rural housing issue, my predecessor requested planning authorities and An Bord Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Pleana´la to have regard to the draft guidelines Local Government (Mr. Roche): There are two with effect from their date of publication. The species of seals in Irish waters, the harbour or guidelines are a material consideration both in common seal and the more numerous grey seal. relation to development plans and in the con- In August 2003, a national census of harbour sideration of planning applications. Planning seals was carried out by the national parks and authorities are required to review and vary their wildlife service, NPWS, of my Department and development plans, where necessary, to ensure the coastal and marine resource centre of Univer- their policies on rural settlement are consistent sity College Cork. This indicated a minimum with the policies set out in the guidelines. population of some 3,000 harbour seals around A total of 105 submissions in relation to the the country’s coast. This report is available on the draft guidelines have been received by my NPWS website at http://www.npws.ie/en/ Department from interested organisations and PublicationsLiterature/IrishWildlifeManuals/ A individuals. The submissions have been examined further report is available at the same NPWS in detail by my Department. I intend to carefully website entitled, Summary of NPWS Surveys for consider any suggestions for clarifying or improv- Common, Harbour, Seals and Grey Seals, 1978 to ing the guidelines before they are finalised. It is 2003. While there have been a number of studies my intention that the guidelines will be issued in of grey seal populations at certain breeding sites, their final statutory form by the end of this year. including a report commissioned by the Marine When issued in their final statutory form, the Institute in 2000 on grey seals status and monitor- guidelines will have the status of ministerial plan- ing in the Irish and Celtic Seas, there has not been ning guidelines under section 28 of the Planning a recent comprehensive national survey. and Development Act 2000. Section 28 provides However, in line with a recommendation of the that planning authorities and An Bord Pleana´la Marine Institute report and as part of its pro- must have regard to the provisions of any such gramme of monitoring habitats and species pro- guidelines when exercising their planning tected under the EU habitats directive, the functions. NPWS is planning a national grey seal survey in It is not intended at this time to issue a plan- 2005. ning policy directive on rural housing, following The inter-relationship between seals and fisher- the publication of the final guidelines. ies is complex. It should be noted that in most cases seals are feeding on different resources to Local Authority Staff. those sought by fishermen. There is nonetheless a perception that seals, particularly grey seals, can 642. Mr. Timmins asked the Minister for the threaten fishing and acquacultural operations. Environment, Heritage and Local Government Scaring and killing of seals may be permitted by the position on the recruitment process for IT licence under the Wildlife Acts on the grounds officer posts, namely, IS analyst-developer, IS of interference with fishing or acquaculture. The project leader and IS technical support officer number of such licences issued has been low, and within local authorities (details supplied); the on the basis of present surveys and assessments, reason there is a clause in the criteria which states extensive culling of the Irish seal population is that an applicant has to be a serving member of not envisaged. a local authority, health board and so on; the further reason IT jobs are not treated like other Planning Issues. professions within local authorities; the further reason persons who have worked in a local auth- 641. Mr. P. Breen asked the Minister for the ority before and possess the necessary qualifi- Environment, Heritage and Local Government if cation and experience relevant to the job cannot he plans to issue directives to local authorities be allowed to apply for such positions; the further and An Bord Pleana´la to implement his policy on reason IT positions cannot be made available at one-off housing rather than the guidelines pro- grade IV level if external applicants are not eli- posed by his predecessor; and if he will make a gible to apply for grade V positions or a special statement on the matter. [29940/04] panel created for external candidates who have Minister for the Environment, Heritage and worked within local authorities before; and if he Local Government (Mr. Roche): In accordance will make a statement on the matter. [29941/04] 415 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 416

Minister for the Environment, Heritage and ing and monitoring the implementation of the Local Government (Mr. Roche): The IT grading master plan for the docklands area and making structure introduced in local authorities in 2002 recommendations to the executive board on a included the creation of new employments of IS wide range of matters, including liaison and co- project leader, IS analyst-developer and IS tech- ordination between the authority and organis- nical support officer at grades VII, VI and V lev- ations representing the interests of docklands els respectively. The arrangements for filling residents, includes representatives of organis- posts in the new structure were agreed with the ations which are concerned with community union concerned, IMPACT. Accordingly, the first development and the promotion of the social, filling of these posts was confined to serving staff economic or general interests of communities in in local authorities, subject to the availability of a the docklands area. Accordingly, I am satisfied sufficient number of suitably qualified candidates. that the interests of local residents are already Posts at grades IV to VII level in local auth- well represented within the authority. orities are normally filled through the common recruitment pool system that restricts applications Planning Issues. to employees of local authorities, health boards, VECs, institutes of technology and certain other 644. Mr. McGuinness asked the Minister for local government and health agencies. However, the Environment, Heritage and Local Govern- given the specialist nature of the IS project leader ment if he will request a detailed report regarding and IS developer-analyst posts, and by agreement the purchase of land by Trim Town Council with the union concerned, the filling of these beside Trim Castle for use as a car park for which posts subsequent to their first filling is by public it obtained Government funding; if all proper competition open to anyone who possesses the procedures were adhered to relative to procure- necessary qualifications. These qualifications ment; and if he will make a statement on the require candidates to have the NCC higher dip- matter. [29944/04] loma in computer studies or an equivalent accredited IT qualification and relevant experi- Minister for the Environment, Heritage and ence and skills; in such cases, prior employment Local Government (Mr. Roche): My Department or experience in a local authority is not a require- has sought and received a report from Trim Town ment. As specialist IT qualifications are not Council on issues pertinent to grant assistance of required for the grade V level post of IS technical \63,486.90, IR£50,000, provided to the council in support officer, competition for such posts, sub- 2000 by the then Department of Arts, Heritage, sequent to their first filling, is from within the Gaeltacht and the Islands. This report is now common recruitment pool system. under consideration. In the case referred to, the individual con- cerned is not precluded from applying for posts Fire Stations. of IS project leader or IS analyst-developer which arise subsequent to the first filling of such posts 645. Mr. Ring asked the Minister for the Envir- in a local authority provided that he possesses the onment, Heritage and Local Government the qualifications declared as to education and position in relation to a new fire station (details experience. supplied) in County Mayo; if all the documents are in place for this project; when this project will Ministerial Appointments. commence; and the detailed breakdown of all the stages completed to date and the stages for com- 643. Mr. Gregory asked the Minister for the pletion. [29995/04] Environment, Heritage and Local Government if he will consider the appointment of a representa- Minister of State at the Department of the tive of Docklands residents associations to the Environment, Heritage and Local Government executive board of the Dublin Docklands (Mr. B. O’Keeffe): Approval in principle has Development Authority to ensure that the been granted for the proposed replacement fire interests of local residents have a voice at board station in Westport which is included in the fire level; and if he will make a statement on the services capital programme as a priority project. matter. [29943/04] Some \445,700 has been recouped to Mayo Minister for the Environment, Heritage and County Council to date to meet expenditure Local Government (Mr. Roche): The Dublin already incurred in respect of the site and fees for Docklands Development Authority Act 1997 this project. provides for an executive board comprising a My Department had requested Mayo County chairperson and seven ordinary directors. The Council to review certain aspects of the proposed current board was appointed with effect from 1 plans and costings of this project; a response has May 2002 for a five-year term of office, and no now been received and is being examined. Once vacancies have arisen. the outstanding issues have been resolved satis- The council of the Dublin Docklands Develop- factorily the project will be approved to proceed ment Authority, whose functions include adopt- to tender stage. 417 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 418

Noise Pollution. sanction will be given for the commencement of work on the extension of the Innishannon water 646. Mr. Gogarty asked the Minister for the supply schemes (details supplied); and if he will Environment, Heritage and Local Government make a statement on the matter. [30174/04] the body which is responsible for monitoring noise emissions from aeroplanes at Weston Aero- Minister for the Environment, Heritage and drome; if his attention has been drawn to the fact Local Government (Mr. Roche): The Innishan- that South Dublin County Council says it is not non, Ballinadee-Ballinspittle-Garretstown, water its responsibility; if his attention has been further supply scheme has been approved for funding in drawn to the fact that the Irish Aviation Auth- my Department’s Water Services Investment Pro- ority has stated in a written response that this is gramme 2004-2006 under the rural towns and vil- not within its statutory remit; and if he will make lages initiative, at an estimated cost of \6.4 a statement on the matter. [30002/04] million. Minister for the Environment, Heritage and My Department has approved Cork County Local Government (Mr. Roche): There are no Council’s revised preliminary report for the Inni- statutory limits for noise emitted from airports or shannon water supply scheme, which will serve aerodromes, nor is there a specific statutory Ballinadee, Ballinspittle, Garretstown and Kil- requirement on local authorities to monitor noise brittain. It is now a matter for the council to pre- emissions from airports or aerodromes. My pare contract documents. Following receipt and Department is preparing regulations to transpose approval of the contract documents by my Directive 2002-49-EC relating to the assessment Department, the council will be in a position to and management of environmental noise which invite tenders for the scheme. covers, inter alia, major airports with more than 50,000 take-off or landing movements per year. Tourist Accommodation. This will require the making of strategic noise 648. Mr. Sargent asked the Minister for the maps by 30 June 2007 and action plans to manage Environment, Heritage and Local Government if noise issues and effects by 18 July 2008. However, the statutory charge for directional signs indicat- the directive specifically excludes take-off or ing bed and breakfast locations will not be landing movements for training purposes on light increased to avoid burdening bed and breakfast aircraft as would, I understand, be mostly the case owners further who already have considerable at Weston Aerodrome. overheads such as commercial rates which are not Notwithstanding that there are no statutory paid for by property owners renting accommo- noise limits, I should point out, however, that dation; and if he will liaise with his colleague, the section 107 of the Environmental Protection Minister for Arts, Sport and Tourism on the Agency Act 1992 provides local authorities with importance of the bed and breakfast sector for powers to require measures to be taken to the economy in general and the tourism industry prevent or limit noise from any premises, pro- in particular. [30176/04] cesses or works. It would be open to the relevant Minister for the Environment, Heritage and local authority to avail of these powers if it con- Local Government (Mr. Roche): The Planning sidered that this were necessary. and Development Regulations 2001 were The granting or refusal of planning permission amended in 2002 to set the licence fee for a for an airport or an aerodrome, or for develop- fingerpost type directional sign to indicate tourist ment in the vicinity of an airport or an aero- accommodation, which does not exceed one drome, is a matter for the relevant planning auth- metre in length, at \50. It is not currently planned ority under the Planning and Development Act to increase this fee. 2000. Under section 34 of that Act a planning My Department has been in contact with the authority may impose conditions on a planning Department of Arts, Sport and Tourism in the permission to reduce or prevent noise emissions context of the ongoing implementation of the or intrusions on a case by case basis. Weston action plan for tourism recommended by the Aerodrome has been operating since 1938, long tourism policy review group in its report, New before the introduction of the planning code and Horizons for Irish Tourism, An Agenda for is therefore an authorised development under the Action. planning code. I understand from the Department of Trans- Water and Sewerage Schemes. port that Weston Aerodrome has introduced recommended procedures for pilots in relation to 649. Mr. Walsh asked the Minister for the flight paths and altitudes with a view to limiting Environment, Heritage and Local Government if the noise impact on residential areas. he will sanction the commencement of work on the Skibbereen sewerage scheme; and if he will Water and Sewerage Schemes. make a statement on the matter. [30218/04] 647. Mr. Walsh asked the Minister for the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Environment, Heritage and Local Government if Local Government (Mr. Roche): I refer to the 419 Questions— 23 November 2004. Written Answers 420

[Mr. Roche.] Minister of State at the Department of the reply to Question No. 184 of 13 October 2004. Environment, Heritage and Local Government The position is unchanged. (Mr. B. O’Keeffe): The proposed new head- quarters fire station at Clonard in Wexford town is one of the projects included in the fire services capital programme, announced on 24 May 2004, Fire Stations. to be advanced to construction stage on a phased basis in the period up to the end of 2005. The 650. Mr. Kehoe asked the Minister for the submission of design drawings and a detailed cost Environment, Heritage and Local Government plan for approval is awaited. the position regarding the building of a new fire The new fire station is to be built as part of a station for Wexford town; if a site has been desig- wider council development on the site at Clonard. nated; when the fire stations will relocate; and if The cost of the fire station element of this site he will make a statement on the matter. was \263,000 and this has been recouped to the [30252/04] council.