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An Interview with Jorge N. Ferrer Jorge N Participation and Spirit: An Interview with Jorge N. Ferrer Jorge N. Ferrer and Iker Puente Participation and Spirit: An Interview with Jorge N. Ferrer Espiritualidad Participativa: Una entrevista con Jorge Ferrer Jorge N. Ferrer* Iker Puente** California Institute of Integral Studies Universidad Autónoma de Barcelona San Francisco, USA Barcelona, Spain Abstract This interview with Jorge Ferrer explores a wide number of themes, ranging from his psycholo- gy studies at the University of Barcelona and the roots of his interest in transpersonal psychology to his arrival to San Francisco and first years at the California Institute of Integral Studies (CIIS) as a doctoral student. Topics discussed include his dissertation research, the publication of his first book Revisioning Transpersonal Theory (SUNY Press, 2002), the participatory turn in transpersonal psychology, his first publications in the Journal of Transpersonal Psychology and debate with Ken Wilber, and the develop- ment of the participatory paradigm in more recent years. Finally, Ferrer highlights what he considers to be the main issues and debates within transpersonal psychology, as well as shares his main current inter- ests and future projects. Key words: transpersonal psychology, participatory turn, perennial philosophy, participatory paradigm, Jorge Ferrer Resumen Esta entrevista con Jorge Ferrer explora un amplio abanico de temas, comenzando por sus estu- dios de licenciatura en psicología en la Universidad de Barcelona, las raíces de su interés por la psicolog- ía transpersonal, su llegada a San Francisco y sus primeros años en el CIIS y la ―Bay Area‖ como estu- diante de doctorado. Los temas tratados incluyen su trabajo de tesis, la publicación de su primer libro Es- piritualidad creativa, el ―giro participativo‖ dentro de la psicología transpersonal, sus primeras publica- ciones en el Journal of Transpersonal Psychology y su debate con Ken Wilber, así como el desarrollo del paradigma participativo a lo largo de los últimos años. Finalmente, Ferrer destaca cuales considera que son los principales asuntos y debates en el campo de la psicología transpersonal actualmente, sus inter- eses principales y sus proyectos futuros. Palabras clave: psicología transpersonal, giro participativo, filosofía perenne, paradigma participativo, Jorge Ferrer Received: 28 October, 2013 Accepted:12 December, 2013 © Journal of Transpersonal Research, 2013, Vol. 5 (2), 97-111 e-ISSN: 1989-6077 // p-ISSN: 2307-6607 JTR - 97 Participation and Spirit: An Interview with Jorge N. Ferrer Jorge N. Ferrer and Iker Puente Coming back to your question, I still remember IP: How and when did you become interested in the relief and exhilaration I felt when I came across the transpersonal psychology? How and where did you Spanish translation of Roger Walsh and Frances Vaugh- find it in the Barcelona of the 1980s? an‘s (1981) Beyond Ego: Transpersonal Dimensions in Psychology (Más allá del ego, published by Ed. Kairos) JF: The roots of my interest in transpersonal psychology at the university‘s library. In this book I found, finally, a are deeply personal. Let me explain: I experienced spon- school of psychology concerned with not only the study taneous trances or states of absorption in my childhood of non-ordinary states of consciousness, but also integral (at times in the classroom!), out-of-body experiences healing and development. I eventually subscribed to The throughout my pre-adolescence, and some deep mystical Journal of Transpersonal Psychology, and, since most of states via psychedelics in my last year of high school. In the transpersonal literature was in English language, I addition, by my seventeenth birthday I had became spent countless hours translating transpersonal articles aware of a number of energetic blocks in my body and into Spanish both for my study and with the intention of associated psychological neurotic patterns. These non- improving my English skills. By then I had learnt that ordinary experiences, as well as the awareness of psy- most transpersonal scholars and institutions were located chological wounds, pushed me to search for understand- in California and dreams of travelling there one day to ing and healing through the study of psychology at the obtain a graduate degree in transpersonal psychology University of Barcelona (1986-1991). Needless to say, began to arise in my mind. My original goal was to bring mainstream psychology, which was already dominated what I would learn in California back to the University by cognitivist and neuroscientific approaches, provided of Barcelona so that future students would be able to neither answers to my questions nor healing to my find there such integrative perspective. My family did wounds. not have money to fund my studies, so many years By the second year of my psychology degree, I passed before I was able to realize my California dream. launched a personal search through autodidactic study. It was not until 1993 that ―la Caixa‖ Cultural Foundation My natural inclination for deep (i.e., beneath the surface) granted me a Fellowship to study in the East-West Psy- explanations drew me to psychoanalysis: I first read chology doctoral program at the California Institute of most of Freud‘s Collected Works and from there I went Integral Studies (CIIS), San Francisco. on to read Jung and Fromm. Reading Fromm, Suzuki, and de Martino‘s (1970) Zen Buddhism and Psychoana- IK: You studied psychology in Barcelona and started lysis was a turning point in my quest. That was my first doing a Ph.D. there. How was your experience at the contact with Eastern philosophies (where I found non- University in Barcelona? How was transpersonal pathological accounts of my non-ordinary experiences), psychology seen in the academia in Barcelona? After which in turn led me to Alan Watts, Abraham Maslow, more than 20 years living in San Francisco, do you humanistic psychology, and eventually to transpersonal see changes when you came back to Barcelona? psychology. At that time, I also started practicing meditation JF: My psychology studies at the University of Barcelo- regularly, first with a Hindu group called Brahma Kuma- na were disappointing, to say the least. Although I per- ris and then with a Korean Zen teacher. During this pe- formed well academically, my heart was not involved. riod, I experimented combining psychedelics and medi- As said, I was looking for deep psychological healing tation and also began to attend psychotherapy. Two pi- and understanding, and psychology at the university was votal events happened: first, my encounter with the psy- dominated by cognitivist and biological approaches that chologist Octavio Garcia, who was teaching transper- were mostly interested in empirical evidence and reduc- sonal psychology in a local yoga center in Barcelona. tionist explanations. (This is, by the way, why even Meeting Octavio was hugely important for me. He was though I strongly support scientific studies of transper- not only the first clinical psychologist interested in sonal psychology and the mission of this Journal, I feel transpersonal psychology I had ever met, but also a se- uneasy about the emerging scientism in the field; I rious spiritual practitioner who clearly walked his talk. would not want transpersonal psychology to become a The second was meeting Ramon V. Albareda and Mari- subfield within the Psychology of Religion or the Scien- na T. Romero, co creators of Holistic Sexuality—an tific Study of Religion). To complement my studies, I innovative body of work that, despite its name, is actual- created my own extra-curriculum with subjects ranging ly a powerful transpersonal approach to integral trans- from depth psychology to shamanism to Eastern philos- formation (see Ferrer, 2003). Involvement in this work ophy, and from consciousness studies to meditation re- provided me with not only deep personal healing, but search to humanistic and transpersonal psychologies. In also essential experiential seeds for my future participa- addition, together with other psychology students, I tory approach to spiritual growth. launched a study group called The Beagle (named after Darwin‘s famous ship) to explore alternative psycholog- © Journal of Transpersonal Research, 2013, Vol. 5 (2), 97-111 e-ISSN: 1989-6077 // p-ISSN: 2307-6607 JTR - 98 Participation and Spirit: An Interview with Jorge N. Ferrer Jorge N. Ferrer and Iker Puente ical approaches and techniques (gestalt, psycho-drama, Insofar as my transpersonal interests, then, the meditation, etc.) and support special events at the Uni- university years were rather solitary times. This is why I versity with local humanistic psychologists. It was in the have felt so excited to witness the increasing interest in context of this group that I taught my first course in transpersonal psychology in Spain over the last two dec- transpersonal psychology, but otherwise I felt rather ades. Even though transpersonal psychology has not isolated during those years insofar as my real academic made it (for the time being?) into mainstream university interests. curricula, there are several professional transpersonal In the late 1980s, very few people at the Univer- associations, a Master degree is in preparation, and many sity knew about transpersonal psychology. A couple of people know today about the field. The facts that the professors knew about its existence but considered it a editor of this Journal is a Spaniard, and that the author of California fad that did not belong to the province of
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