Master Class Dave Navarro on Tattoos, the Occult, His Health Struggles and His Ongoing Feud with John Frusciante INTERVIEW By Gabe Spatz

Dave Navarro’s career now spans three decades and shows no signs of slowing. He’s a rocker, an actor, and the world’s foremost expert on tattoos. He’s been called the “Dave Navarro of fill- in Red Hot Chili Peppers guitar players.” He’s probably won a Grammy, or at least some of the bands he’s played with have probably won Grammys. He knows his way around a six-string and has plied his trade in groups as diverse as Alice in Chains, Jaynes Addiction, Temple of the Dog and Audioslave. But if you’re not a fan of hard rock music, you might be familiar with him as the heavily tank-topped host and head judge of the critically acclaimed reality competition show, Ink Master, on Spike TV. The man is such a giant in both music and tattoo circles that I have to admit I was a bit intimidated when I was invited to his Malibu home for an interview last week, but he quickly made me feel right at home. Despite his menacing looks (black eyeliner, razor sharp magician’s goatee, many many rings and necklaces, most of which bearing some variation of the ankh symbol) he was warm, friendly and extremely engaging. Right away he invited me to remove my shoes and slide with him ice-skater-style in my socks across the hardwood, past his collection of scimitars and into his living room, which was decorated like Hot Topic’s idea of a Greek triclinium (lots of velvet, satin and leather. Black and Purple. Too many pillows. Metal studs. Some fringe. A few tassels). He offered me a steaming cup of Lapsang Souchong and insisted that I recline in the traditional fashion on the Klinai (basically a chaise lounge) opposite him. We talked about love, life, tats, and his new album Darkness is the Angel of the Daylight, out this December on Capitol/EMI.

Tell me about the new album, it seems like a new direction for you, a bit more subdued and subtle. Was that by design, or just part of your natural progression as an artist? I don’t really see a distinction between the two honestly. Everything is by design and everything is natural. Know what I mean? When I pick up my guitar to write a song, I become a conduit, or like an open circuit, and whatever passes through, you have to just let it in. Does that make sense? I know a lot of musicians say similar shit to that, but I’m not saying that I’m channeling the muses, or receiving transmissions from god or something. What speaks through me, is me. It’s my higher self. If the album is more subdued or whatever, I guess it’s because my higher self is feeling more mellow or something. I don’t know.

Does that just have to do with getting older? I mean I’m more comfortable now than I ever was. I also slowed down on the drugs and what- not. Plus, I had this medical issue for years that sorta kept me on edge, but I’ve found a way to manage it. That was huge for me.

I’m sorry to hear that. I mean it’s not a big deal. I used to be embarrassed about it, but it’s like whatever now. So yeah I had what’s called Stress- Induced-Priapism. Basically they’re erections that wouldn’t go away. It sounds funny or whatever, but it was no joke. I used to get them when I was stressed out or anxious. Like back in the day before a big show, like when the Chili Peps played on Carson, I got this absolute rager, man. And Keeds was up there all ‘Lammy- Dammy-Flammy-Flammy-Flip-Flop’—a song I wrote BTW—and Flea is over there just like pushing the boundries of Post- Alternative-Funkpunk, and whoever the drummer is is doing his thing, and meanwhile I’m just worried about trying to keep this total battering ram from bursting through my lace-up fly and ruining my fave pair of pleather bell-bottoms, I mean, you know. Navarro's Health Struggles Nearly Plus, all the while I’m trying to keep my donger hidden behind my Derailed His Musical Career ax, which, not to brag, wasn’t always that easy. Wow. Yeah man, wow. I know. It’s like both a blessing to have this massive surpluss of raw sexual energy, but then it became a curse. But it’s all good now. For a while I was going to mad doctors who all gave me different pills and exercises to do. None of them worked for shit. But then one day I was talking to my personal fedora stylist, Ichiro, and he was like, “it’s all about finding your center,” and like, “the answer is within you,” and stuff. You know, he’s Japanese. But he suggested finding a mantra and using that to combat my monolithic petrified sequoias. So I picked out some song lyrics that I like and kinda made that my mantra.

Do you mind? Oh yeah not at all. It’s, uh:

Mackin' to this phat beat Bass pushin' through my back seat You know I got that gangsta lean Ho's they all adore me I stop and they all swarm me To check out all my fly gold rings

It’s a Kid Rock lyric from a song he did for a motion picture called Osmosis Jones. Pretty cool flick. I just repeat that like 10-15 times and it usually goes away, no problem. Total lifesaver. The stiffies used to interfere with everything, my music career, my love life, everything. Thank god for Ichiro. Orray-Gato, big time.

“It’s all about finding your center”

So your love life has improved? I remember your relationships being very public back in the nineties. Yeah, I mean, things change. I’m seeing someone now, but I’d rather not broadcast it so much. But the nineties though. Yeah. I plowed through the nineties dick-first, man. No joke. I had sex with Mira Sorvino. ‘Lotta people don’t know that. Also Alanis Morrisette. Alanis Morrissette is actually a pretty cool lil chica. Beautiful voice, strong heart and she’s a super talented writer. Pussy like a warm tub of creamed corn. And I like creamed corn a lot, both for eating and, you know, fucking. But Carmen [Electra] was the one. She’s probably who you had in mind right?

You guys were a pretty memorable nineties couple. I don’t know, I thought things were gonna work out between me and Carmen. I always imagined that we’d settle down in a nice little place on the Vegas Strip and raise a couple human canvasses of our own. I don’t know. Say-law-vee, right?

"Till Death Do Us Part" Navarro and Electra Pose for Their Wedding Invitations

Speaking of human canvasses, let’s talk Ink Master for a bit shall we? Fuck yeah.

How’d you get involved with the world of tattooing? Ever since I was a tiny blank canvass, I knew I wanted to get into that world. It started when I was maybe 7 or 8. I was at this pinball arcade in Redondo Beach and this guy walked in with the sickest armbands made to look like pieces of barbed wire wrapped all the way around his biceps. It blew my mind. Right then and there I knew all I wanted to do is get fucking inked. Then I started to study up on it. I wanted to learn everything there was to know about tats and tat culture. Like I found out that tat artists call it ‘Blasting,’ and like, you know tattooing is an ancient tradition that started with like, some Africans or like Hawaiians or people over there. And back then tribal tattoos were just called regular tattoos, you know? That tripped me out.

Because they were worn as tribal markings. I’m sorry? No I’m talking about tribal tattoos. It’s a style of tattooing. It’s like cool shapes that are all black and pointy. Pretty sick.

How would you describe your own tattoos? Sick as fuck, dude! No but seriously, as you probably know, I’m attracted to the occult and things of a darker nature, which is why you see so many ankhs and bats and stuff tatted on my own personal body. This one here is pretty new, it’s called the Leviathan’s Cross. It’s the symbol for the alchemical element sulfur. People think it’s a Satan thing but it isn’t. It represents the masculine aspect of the human soul. Which is actually beautiful and somewhat romantic. I’m just a sulfur searching for my mercury, you know what I mean? Navarro Sporting His Leviathan's Cross Throat Tat Would you describe yourself as a Pagan? Oh most definitely. I officiated my first pagan wedding backstage at Lollapalooza ’91, and attained the High Priesthood the following year. Which is faster than normal. People think there’s something sinister to it, but it’s all about getting in touch with like nature and your body and shit. But to be an HP [High Priest] you have to know more than just the basics of folk-magic and how to cast a circle, you know? You’ve got to have management skills and be able to make really tough decisions within your coven, which is why I really think the priesthood helped prepare me for my roll on Ink Master more than anything else.

How so? Well, it’s like this: as High Priest, I’m also in charge of organizing all the activities for my initiates throughout the week. Organizing relay races and solstice-egg hunts and birthday parties and stuff. And on Ink Master, I’m responsible for coming up with all the flash challenges. Like when they all had to create a work of art by dropping paint-filled latex gloves from a hot air balloon, I came up with that. I’m also in charge of deciding what we’re going to be testing the artists on each week. You know, one day we’re taking a look at their use of finesse, next week it might be their execution, then their skill, and maybe after that we take a look at their overall artistry, and so on. It’s not as easy as it looks, and if I didn’t have that firm foundation in elemental sorcery, I don’t know if I’d be up for it.

Sounds like it’s more than just a TV show to you. It’s so much more. Being crowned Ink Master is a solemn honor that brings with it some big responsibilities. You know, the earliest human canvasses and tattoo artists were always sorta lost without anyone to look up to for guidance and inspiration. That’s where the Ink Master steps in. He, or she is there to set an example for the entire world of tattoo artists. There are over a hundred tattoo artists out there working today, and the reigning Ink Master has to be there to guide them, council them and lead them. And some of them crack under the pressure.

Navarro in His Pagan Regalia Before the show was here to vet them, Ink Masters were simply elected by a panel of tat-blasted elders—with input from a human canvas jury of course. But they didn’t really have to prove they could tattoo. There were no flash challenges, no skull picks, no elimination tattoos, no live finales, nothing. I know, fucking crazy. Some cocky young ink-slinger could throw his hat in the ring and just get voted in regardless of how clean his line work or how saturated his colors. And when you’re choosing an Ink Master based on nepotism and petty politics, that’s when bad shit goes down.

Bad shit? Legend has it there was an Ink Master from Italy back in the 17th century named Memphis Pete who decreed that all tats had to be done on the ribs only from then on, which is fucking crazy. Most human canvasses couldn’t take it. Memphis Pete was overthrown in a really violent coup known as the War of the Compass Roses. The industry nearly collapsed, and it didn’t really become stabilized until Spike TV stepped in and pretty much singlehandedly saved tattooing as we know it. So yeah, I’d say I take my judging duties pretty fucking seriously, dude.

And how do the other judges fit in? I know I’ve learned a lot from Chris [Núñez] and Oliver [Peck] and I think I’ve probably taught them a lot too. What I get from Oliver and Chris is passion and enthusiasm about the craft, and what I give them in return is just stone-cold analytical expertise. They’re both tattoo artists themselves, so I think they might be a little bit too close to the art form to offer objective criticism, you know? Whereas, because I have no experience in tattooing or the visual arts whatsoever, but have spent my life collecting badass tats from some of the best in For Navarro, Judging Tats is Serious the biz, I think that gives me a more refined critical eye. Does Business that make sense?

Do you think your work on Ink Master translates to your music? Or are the two worlds completely separate? Oh not at all, it totally relates. If anything, my critical ear is even more attuned than my critical eye. I’m a musician first and foremost. I bleed rock n roll. I’m a way better guitar player than John Frusciante and I honestly believe I was put on this planet to do one thing and one thing alone: Make music. And Judge tattoos.

I wasn’t going to go there, but you mentioned John Frusciante... I don’t care, man. Honestly.

You’ve been candid about your dislike for him in the past, and although he’s never responded publicly, you continue to attack him in interviews and on twitter. What’s the beef about? It’s not a beef. I just think he sucks at guitar plain and simple. Yes, it’s true, I only joined the Peps on their sixth album and he was there since ’88. Whatever. People think that makes him like the “Official” guitar player of the Peps? Fucking please. The guy’s got no feel, no style and he couldn’t solo his way out of a wet paper bag. I was at fucking Woodstock ‘94, bro. Where the fuck was he? At home sucking his own ass. It’s nothing personal. I love the guy honestly, but when people start saying I’m not a “legit” member of that band, it gets on my fucking nerves. I am the heart and soul of the Red Hot Chili Peppers and everyone who is anyone knows it.

OK, well that about does it. Anything else before we wrap up? I don’t know. I don’t want to sound like a tool or anything, but earlier when I said I had sex with Mira Sorvino, I might’ve meant Ashley Judd. It’s tough to say, but I think it was Ashley Judd. Which one was in Reindeer Games? It was Judd I think. But like, 90’s hot Ashley Judd when her shit was still on point. I’m not like a body image nazi, but I’m big into fitness, so that stuff is important to me. So, yeah I’m rambling, but that’s it.

Thank you Thank you, oh and pick up the new album, Darkness is The Angel of the Daylight. It’ll be out soon and it’s a super emotional, super real record. It’s all about honesty and positivity and it features some of my strongest writing yet, I think. And none of that pussy ass guitar masturbation that Frusciante is trying to hit you with album after album. Only solid in your face rock music. Oh and check out Ink Master: Revenge, premiering soon on Spike. And, one more time, John Frusciante is a little bitch and if he doesn’t like it, he knows where to find me. That’s it. Thank you. One love.