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Volume III ~ Friday No. 38 26th January, 1962

. •. PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES

DEWAN RA'AYAT (HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES).

OFFICIAL REPORT CONTENTS

EXEMPTED BUSINESS (MOTION) [Col. 3899] BILLS-- The Supplementary Supply (1961) Bill [Col. 3851] The Rubber Research Institute of Malaya Bill [Col. 3888] The Malayan Red Cross Society (Incorporation) Bill [Col. 3899] The Geneva Conventions Bill [Col. 3904] The Railway Amendment Bill [Col. 3908] The Arms Amendment Bill [Col. 3909] The Rubber Industry (Replanting) Fund (Amendment) Bill [Col. 3911] The Internal Security (Amendment) Bill [Col. 3916] The Land Development (Amendment) Bill [Col. 3949] The Rubber Exchange (Incorporation) Bill [Col. 3950] MOTION- The Development (Supplementary) (No. 1) Estimates, 1961 [Col. 3967] Committee:- Head 100 [Col. 3968] Head 102 [Col. 3969] Head 114 [Col. 3970] Hi=ad 120 [Col. 3971] Heads 130, 132, 133 [Cols. 3972, 3973) Head 136 (Col. 3973]

Dl-TERBITKAN OLEH moa BENO CHONG, A.M.N .• PEMANGKU PENCHETAK KERAJAAN PFRSEKUTUAN TANAH MELAYU 1962

Harga: $1 ...

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FEDERATION OF MALAYA DEWAN RA'AYAT (HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES) Official Report

Third Session of the First Dewan Ra'ayat

Friday, 26th January, 1962 The House met at Half-past nine o'clock a.m.

PRESENT: The Honourable Mr. Speaker, DATo' HAJI MOHAMED NOAH BIN OMAR, S.P.M.J., D.P.M.B., P.I.S., J.P. the Prime Minister and Minister of External Affairs, Y.T.M. PuTRA AL-HAJ, K.o.M. (Kuala ). the Deputy Prime Minister, Minister of Defence and Minister of Rural Development, TuN HAJI ABDUL RAZAK BIN DATO' HUSSAIN, S.M.N. (Pekan). the Minister of Internal Security and Minister of the Interior, DATO' DR. ISMAIL BIN DATO' HAJJ ABDUL RAHMAN, P.M.N. (Johor Timar). the Minister of Finance, ENCHE' TAN Srnw SIN, J.P. (Melaka Tengah). the Minister of Works, Posts and Telecommunications, DATO' v. T. SAMBANTHAN, P.M.N. (Sungai Siput). the Minister of Transport, DATO' SARDON BIN HAJJ JuBIR, P.M.N. (Pontian Utara). the Minister of Health and Social Welfare, DATO' , P.M.N. (Ulu ). the Minister of Commerce and Industry, ENCHE' MOHAMED KHIR BIN J OHARI (Kedah Tengah). the Minister of Labour, ENCHE' BAHAMAN BIN SAMSUDIN (Kuala Pilah}. the Minister of Education, ENCHE' ABDUL RAHMAN BIN HAJJ TALIB (Kuantan). the Assistant Minister of Education, ENCHE' ABDUL HAMID KHAN BIN HAJJ SAKHAWAT ALI KHAN, J.M.N., J.P. (Batang Padang). the Assistant Minister of Rural Development, TuAN HAJI ABDUL KHALID BIN AWANG OSMAN (Kota Star Utara). the Assistant Minister of Commerce and Industry, ENCHE' CHEAH THEAM SWEE (Bukit Bintang). the Assistant Minister of Labour, ENcHE' V. MANICKA­ VASAGAM, J.M.N., P.J.K. {Klang). ....-~ ··------~------·

3847 26 JANUARY 1962 3848

The Honourable the Assistant Minister of the Interior, ENcHE' MOHAMED ISMAIL BIN MOHAMED YUSOF (Jerai). ENCHE' ABDUL GHANI BIN ISHAK, A.M.N. (Melaka Utara). ENCHE' ABDUL RAUF BIN A. RAHMAN, P.J.K. (Krian Laut). ENCHE' ABDUL SAMAD BIN OSMAN (Sungai Patani). TuAN HAJJ Ann11LLAH BIN HAJI ABDUL RAoF (Kuala Kangsar). TUAN HAJI ABDULLAH BIN HAJI MOHD. SALLEH, A.M.N., P.I.s. (Segamat Utara). TuAN HAn AHMAD BIN ABDULLAH (Kota Bharu Hilir). ENcHE' AHMAD BIN ARSHAD, A.M.N. (Muar Utara). ENcHE' AHMAD BIN MOHAMED SHAH, s.M.J. (Johor Bahm Barat). TUAN HAJJ AHMAD BIN SAAID (Seberang Utara). ENrnE' AHMAD BIN HAn YusoF, P.J.K. (Krian Darat). TuAN HAn AZAHAR! BIN HAJI IBRAHIM (Kubang Pasu Barat). ENCHE' Aziz BIN ISHAK (Muar Dalam). DR. BURHANUDDIN BIN MOHD. NOOR (Besut). ENCHE' CHAN CHONG WEN, A.M.N. (Kluang Selatan). ENCHE' CHAN StANG SUN (Bentong). ENCHE' CHIN SEE YIN ( Timar). DATIN FATIMAH BINTI HAJI HASHIM, P.M.N. (Jitra-Padang Terap) ENCHE' HAMZAH BIN ALANG, A.M.N. (Kapar). ENCHE' HANAFI BIN MOHD. YuNUs, A.M.N. (Kulim Utara). ENCHE' HARUN BIN ABDULLAH, A.M.N. (Baling). ENCHE' HARUN BIN PILUS (Trengganu Tengah). TuAN HAJr HASAN ADLI BIN HAJI ARSHAD (Kuala Trengganu Utara). TuAN HAJI HASSAN BIN HAJI AHMAD (Tumpat). ENCHE' HASSAN BIN MANSOR (Melaka Selatan). ENCHE' HUSSEIN BIN To' MuDA HASSAN (Raub). ENCHF:' HUSSEIN BIN MOHD. NOORDIN, A.M.N., P.J.K. (Parit). TuAN HAJI HussArN RAHIMI BIN HAn SAMAN (Kota Bharu Hulu). ENCHE' IBRAHIM BIN ABDUL RAHMAN (Seberang Tengah). t .. ENCHE' ISMAIL BIN IDRIS ( Selatan). ENCHE' KANG KOCK SENG (Batu Pahat). ENCHE' K. KARAM SINGH (Damansara). CHE' KHADIJAH BINTI MOHD. SIDEK (Dungun). ENCHE' KHONG KOK y AT (Batu Gajah). .. ENcHE' (Kluang Utara) . .. ENCHE' LEE SECK FUN (Tanjong Malim) . ,.,

3849 26 JANUARY 1962 3850

The Honourable ENCHE' Lr:E SIOK YEW, A.M.N. (Sepang). DR. LTM SWEE AUN, J.P. (Larut Selatan). ENCHE' Lrn YOONG PENG (Rawang). ENCHE' T. MAHIMA SINGH, J.P. (Port Dickson). ENCHE' MOHAMED BIN UJANG (Jelebu-Jempol). , ENCHE' MOHAMED ABBAS BIN AHMAD (Hilir ). ENCHE' MOHAMED ASRI BIN HAJI MUDA (Pasir Puteh). ENCHE' MOHAMED DAHARI BIN HAJI Moun. Au (Kuala Sclangor). ENCHE' MOHAMED NOR BIN Moun. DAHAN (Ulu Perak). D.no' MOHAMED HANIFAH BIN HAJI ABDUL GHANI, P.J.K. (Pasir Mas Hulu). ENCHE' MOHAMED SuLONG BIN Moun. ALI, J.M.N. (Lipis). ENCHE' MOHAMED YusoF BIN MAHMUD, A.M.N. (Temerloh). TUAN HAJI MOKHTAR BIN HAn ISMAIL (Perlis Selatan). NIK MAN BIN NIK MOHAMED (Pasir Mas Hilir). ENnm' N(; ANN TECK (Batu). ENcHE' OTHMAN BIN ABDULLAH (Tanah Merah). ENCHE' OTHMAN DIN ABDULLAH, A.M.N. (Perlis Utara). TuAN HAJJ Rm>ZA BIN HAJI MOHD. SAID (Rembau-Tampin). ENCHE' SE>\H TENG NGIAB (Muar Pantai). TUAN SYED EsA BIN ALWEE, J.M.N., s.M.J., P.1.s. (Batu Pahat Dalam). TUAN SYED HASHIM BIN SYED AJAM, A.M.N., P.J.K. (Sabak Bernam). TUAN SYED JA'AFAR BIN HASAN ALBAR, J.M.N. (Johor Tenggara). \ ENcHE' TAJUDIN BIN Au, P.J.K. (Larut Utara). \-ENCHE' TAN PHOCK KIN (Tanjong). .. TENGKU BESAR INDERA RAJA IBNI AL-MARHUM SULTAN IBRAHIM, D.K .. P.M.N. (Ulu Kelantan). DATO' TEOH CHZE CHONG, D.P.M.J., J.P. (Segamat Selatan). .. ENCHE' Too JooN HING (Telok Anson) . ENcHE' v. VEERAPPEN (Seberang Selatan). WAN SULAIMAN BIN WAN TAM, P.J.K. (Kota Star Selatan). WAN YAHYA BIN HAJI WAN MOHAMED (Kemaman). .. ENCHE' YAHYA BIN HAJJ AHMAD (Bagan Datoh) . i .. ENCHE' YEOH TAT BENG (Bruas) . ENCHE' YONG Woo MING (Sitiawan). PuAN HAJJAH ZAIN BINTI SULAIMAN, J.M.N., P.1.s. (Pontian Sela tan). TuAN HA.JI ZAKARIA BIN HAJI MOHD. TAIB (Langat). ENCHE' ZULKIFIEE BIN MUHAMMAD (Bachok). ~-.- -~------·-.-----~- ~------~··-·- - -- ~~---_,,.,.------~----·~ -- ---

3851 26 JANUARY 1962 3852 ABSENT: The Honourable DATO' SULEIMAN BIN DATO' HAJJ ABDUL RAHMAN, P.M.N. (Minister without Portfolio) (Muar Selatan) (On leave). the Minister of Agriculture and Co-operatives, ENCHE' ABDUL AZIZ BIN ISHAK (Kuala Langat). ENCHE' AHMAD BOESTAMAM (Setapak). ENCHE' CHAN SWEE Ho (Ulu Kinta). ENCHE' CHAN YOON ONN (Kampar). ENCHE' v. DAVID (Bungsar). ENCHE' GEH CHONG KEAT (Penang Utara). ENCHE' LIM Joo KONG, J.P. (Alor Star). ENCHE' LIM KEAN Srnw (Dato Kramat). ENCHE' QuEK KAI DONG, J.P. (Seremban Barat). ENCHE' D. R. SEENIVASAGAM (lpoh). ENCHE' s. P. SEENIVASAGAM (Menglembu). ENCHE' TAN CHENG BEE, J.P. (Bagan). ENCHE' TAN KEE GAK (Bandar Melaka). ENCHE' TAN TYE CHEK (Kulim-Bandar Bahru). WAN MUSTAPHA BIN HAn ALI (Kelantan Hilir).

IN ATTENDANCE: The Honourable the Minister of Justice, TUN , s.M.N.

PRAYERS Fund. Legislative authority is, there­ fore, now required for the expenditure (Mr. Speaker in the Chair) of a sum of $12,238,648. The full amount has already either been BILLS advanced from the Contingencies THE SUPPLEMENTARY SUPPLY Fund or provided by transfers from (1961) BILL other Sub-heads within the same Head of the Estimates, and all the expendi­ Second Reading ture which has taken place lies within The Mininster of Finance (Enche' the revised estimated total of $944 ): Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg million which I quoted during the to move that a Bill intituled "An Act course of my speech on the Budget to apply a sum out of the Consolidated for 1962. Fund for additional expenditure for the service of the year 1961 to appro­ The various purposes for which the priate such sum for certain purposes additional provision is required are and to provide for the replacement of set out in the Treasury Memorandum amounts advanced from the Contin­ tabled as Command Paper No. 51 of t gencies Fund" be read a second time. 1961, and I do not feel that they call for comment from me at this juncture. The Second Supplementary Esti­ It will be noted that, as usual, a mates of Expenditure for 1961, which number of items take the form of a have been laid on the Table as token provision of $10, which indi­ Command Paper No. 50 of 1961, cates that, although it has been provide for a total sum of $13,634,800 possible to provide the additional of which $1,396,152 consist of expendi­ sums from money already voted for ture charged on the Consolidated other purposes without calling upon 3853 26 JANUARY 1962 3854 the House to authorise extra provi­ Furniture and Furnishings for the sion, the Treasury nevertheless feels Residence of the President of Dewan it desirable to make particulars of the Negara. Members of this House will new expenditure known to the House. remember that in the course of dis­ In accordance with the recommenda­ cussions in this House on the question tions of the Public Accounts Com­ of furniture and fittings, not only for mittee, statements of any such the President but also for Ministers, expenditure are now laid before the I have had occasion to raise the point House at the next following meeting, that it is desirable that as far as being included in the same Paper as furniture and fittings for Ministers, the that in which Contingencies Fund President of the Dewan Negara and Advances are reported under S.O. the Speaker of the House of Repre­ 68 (1). sentatives are concerned, it is necessary that some sort of a standard should Sir, I beg to move. be agreed upon in respect of not only the sum of money to be allotted for The Deputy Prime Minister (Tun furnishing but also as to the type of Haji Abdul Razak): Sir, I beg to inventory. I feel that, in the course of second the motion. reading reports from the Public Question put, and agreed to. Accounts Committee, we are also aware that the Public Accounts Com­ Bill accordingly read a second time. mittee is also in agreement with such a procedure. So, I would like to seek House immediately resolved itself information from the Prime Minister into Committee of Supply. because, as far as I am aware, no agreement has been reached as to (Mr. Speaker in the Chair) what constitutes appropriate furniture for Ministers and others, apart from SCHEDULE the fact that it has been agreed on a certain monetary fund. So, in view of Head S. /- this, I would like to seek clarification The Prime Minister: Mr. Chairman, from the Honourable Prime Minister Sir, I beg to move that the expendi­ whether any agreement has been ture under Head S.1, Parliament, be reached on this particular question. approved. By way of explanation, I would like to say a few words with The Prime Minister: Mr. Chairman, regard to the requirement of $4,000 Sir, it is not possible for us to assess under Sub-head 15, Special Expendi­ the requirements of the President, ture. The requirement is to purchase Dewan Negara, or the Ministers for the Encyclopaedia Britannica which that matter, until we know from the Members have asked for from experience what type of furniture time to thre. should be added; and it is on their request that all this provision is The other one is Sub-head 18, made. Furniture and Furnishings for Resi­ dence of President of Dewan Negara. Question put, and agreed to. The President, Dewan Negara is at The sum of $7,000 for Head S. 1 the moment staying in Class II, P.W.D. ordered to stand part of the Schedule. quarters, and it has not the furnitures ~ in keeping with his position and Head S. 4- dignity of his high office. The require­ ment for another $3,000 is to buy The Prime Minister: Mr. Chairman, extra furniture for the house. Sir, I beg to move that the expenditure under Head S. 4, Election Commis­ Enche' Tan Phock Kin (Tanjong): sion, be approved. By way of Mr. Chairman, Sir, I rise to seek explanation, I would like to mention some clarification on Sub-head 18, here that the requirement is for r·--- -~ . ------~---·~--

3855 26 JANUARY 1962 3856 $133,400-that is the supplement introducing the 1961 Estimates of required for 1961 to pay honoraria Expenditure, Honourable Members and allowances to the additional will recall that I gave the object of Assistant Registration Officers. It was organising study tours as educational found necessary to employ for every to enable representative groups to 900 electors one Assistant Registration visit neighbouring countries and also Officer in order to give full coverage. enable others to come to this country. Previously 1,500 Assistant Registra­ At the same time we have found it tion Officers were employed, but the necessary to introduce local tours, increase in the sum sought now will because when organising the overseas enable the Commission to employ tours many of those who went over­ 2,800 Assistant Registration Officers. seas have not travelled within this It is found necessary, in order to bring country; and in order to enable them the register up to date, to employ this to see conditions at home and condi­ number of officers. tions abroad, it is necessary to make provision for them to study within this Question put, and agreed to. country. The sum of $145,881 for Head S. 4 Then, Contributions to the United ordered to stand part of the Schedule. Nations Special Fund, $15,375, under Head S. 7- Sub-head 24. In 1960 the Federation Government's share of the contribu­ The Prime Minister: Mr. Chairman, tion to the United Nations Special Sir, I beg to move that the supplement Fund was $15,375. There was a of $469,540 for Head S. 7, Prime provision in the 1960 Estimates to pay Minister, be approved. This supple­ for this, but because of an oversight, ment is required for the following this sum was not paid. The contribu­ reasons. tion for 1960 has been advanced from The Government Hospitality Fund­ the Contingencies Fund and the A token vote of $10 is entered here. provision amounting to $15,375 is now The actual sum required is $50,000, sought to meet the contribution to the but because there were savings from Special Fund. "Personal Emoluments", only a token provision of $10 is entered in the Another expenditure is under Supplementary Estimates. There is Sub-head 25, Economic Planning already a provision of $150,000 in the Organisation, $14,700. In the Esti­ 1961 Estimates for Government mates of Expenditure for 1961, a hospitality, but it has been found that sum of $134,479 for P.E. of the this sum is inadequate and a further Economic Planning Committee was sum of $50,000 is required . entered. It will also be recalled that the House was informed during the • Under Sub-head 21, Study Tours, debates on the First Supplementary the purpose of including this Sub-head Estimates that the Economic Secre­ in the Supplementary Estimates is in tariat in the Prime Minister's Depart­ order to inform the House that the ment had been reorganised and provision of $900,000 in the 1961 expanded into an Economic Planning Estimates was used not only to meet Unit. As a result of this expansion, it expenses of selected persons sent over­ was found necessary to increase t seas on study tours but also to meet certain other expenses connected with expenses of tours in this country of the Economic Planning Unit. These people from neighbouring countries expenses are O.C.A.R. expenses and and also local tours to enable the are listed as Sub-heads 25B-25E in people from the remote parts of this the Supplementary Estimates. Sub-head country to visit . various places in 47, Purchase of an official motor-car, order to broaden their minds. I must $13,000. This official car is for the emphasise that no additional expendi­ head of the Economic Planning Unit. ture is required for these tours. When He is Professor W. T. Phillips, an ·~ Jz:;tlll!l!l(..IJitlr.,,·

3857 26 JANUARY 1962 3858 expert on economic planning. One of Sub-head 51, Colombo Plan the conditions which had been agreed Consultative Committee Meeting. upon on the appointment of Professor $331,260. This Colombo Plan Con­ Phillips was that he should be provided sultative Committee meeting is held with a suitable car and a suitable annually in a member country. This h0use together with allowance for the is the first time that the Colombo Plan syce and so on. Therefore, a sum of meeting is held here and this amount $13,000 is required. Then under is to meet the cost of the meeting in Sub-head 48, Furnishing for house . and Installation of one air-conditioning unit, $12,000-this is again for Mr. Chainnan: I propose that a sum Professor Phillips. of $469,540 under Head S. 7 stand part of the Schedule. Under Sub-head 28, Contribution to the Commonwealth Economic Enche' Zulkiflee bin Muhammad Committee, there is a provision of (Bachok): Tuan Yang di-Pertua, Sub­ $23,335. For the year 1960/61 the head 25 berkenaan dengan Study Tours Federation's subscription to the saya dapat memahamkan kira-nya Commonwealth Economic Committee Kerajaan ini menghantar orang2 negeri was $18,300, but for the year ini untok melawat luar negeri bagi 1961/62 the Federation's contribution meluaskan pandangan mereka maka is increased to $23,335, and the saya dapat memahamkan bahawa increase is $5,035 more than for the Kerajaan ini menghantar anak negeri year 1960 / 61. The reason for the ini dari Utara ka-Selatan dari Timor increase is because the Union of ka-Barat atau sa-balek-nya. Tetapi, South Africa has, as you all know, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya tidak faham gone out of the Commonwealth and dan tidak bersetuju bahawa negeri ini membelanjakan wang mengambil therefore her subscription has to be 2 2 paid by the remaining members of orang dalam negeri lain bagi melawat the Commonwealth. negeri ini, atas nama Study Tours. Tuan Yang di-Pertua, wang yang di­ Then comes Sub-head 46, Expenses belanjakan oleh Kerajaan itu ada-lah for Conferences on Economic and wang ra'ayat, bagi kepentingan ra'ayat. Cultural Co-operation in South-East Boleh jadi bagi masa yap.g telah lalu Asia. This sum of $8,100 is required Study Tours telah di-gunakan bagi to pay for the expenses of a delegation membawa orang2 Melayu Brunei, of four officials attending the Confer­ dan dari Borneo Utara ka­ ence on economic and cultural negeri ini. Bagi memahamkan akan co-operation in South-East Asia in kedudokan Kerajaan Persekutuan Bangkok. Tanah Melayu supaya dengan demikian dapat-lah mereka itu gambaran yang Sub-head 49, Visit of the Yang tepat dengan apa yang ada dalam di-Pertuan Agong to Brunei-that I Persekutuan ini. Tetapi kalau sudah need not explain. This money is di-jadikan dasar negeri ini kita jemput­ required to pay for the expenses of lah pula orang2 Singapura menengok the visit which he made as from the negeri kita ini dan akan kita jemput­ 1st to 5th of July, 1961. lah orang2 dari India menengok negeri kita yang semua-nya itu, Tuan Yang Then Sub-head 50, Furnishings of di-Pertua, akan menguntongkan hanya Assistant Ministers' Houses, $5,000. orang2 yang melawat negeri ini atas ~ The scale of furnishings has been fixed perbelanjaan Kerajaan. for the houses of Assistant Ministers and so most of the Assistant Ministers Kalau Persekutuan Tanah Melayu have had their houses furnished in ini tidak dapat menarek orang2 luar 1960 in accordance with this scale. But negeri kapada dasar pelanchong ini there are still a few whose houses have maka tidak-lah mesti bagi Persekutuan not been fully furnished and this menghulorkan wang untok orang2 amount is for that purpose. melawat ka-negeri ini. Suka-lah saya

-- 't!a\HllP'"'*, 'Ill'< """' 3859 26 JANUARY 1962 3860 mengeshorkan kapada Yang Berhormat intention is to enable such individuals, Perdana Menteri supaya mengkaji who are resident in the Federation of sa-mula dasar-nya memikirkan betapa Malaya and who have no opportunity tidak tepat-nya dan tidak bijak-nya at all to travel outside, to have this kita membelanjakan wang negeri ini opportunity, so that they can see for supaya orang lain melawat ka-negeri themselves what is happening in other ini. Jadi, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya countries and form their own opinions. berharap supaya jangan itu terus­ As far as I am aware, Sir, it is never menerus di-lakukan. the intention for such study tours to be used for propaganda purposes for Sub-head 47-Purchase of an official the Government-and so much so that motor-car. Sa-orang professor yang whoever is entitled to such study tour berkhidmat dalam negeri ini boleh-lah must come back and praise the membuat sharat-nya sebab kita ber­ Federation Government. It is with this kehendakkan perkhidmatan-nya. Siapa in mind that a delegation of the mesti berjanji mesti membeli motor­ Socialist Front accepted grants for car baharu, sebab sa-tahu saya study tours to visit the Borneo terri­ Kerajaan ada mempunyai" kumpulan tories, and I must say that it is most motor-car V.I.P. yang boleh di­ 2 deplorable to read in the newspapers gunakan oleh professor yang ke­ of certain allegations made by the hormat menjalankan kewajipan-nya. Government with regard to this Ia tidak dudok dalam negeri ini sampai delegation of the Socialist Front. empat lima tahun tetapi hanya men­ Members of the delegation visited the jalankan tugas-nya bagi membantu Borneo territories and formed certain economic planning unit. Saya perchaya conclusions-and I say here that they kalau sa-orang ini professor tentu-lah are quite entitled to form their own ia juga dapat menahan kepentingan conclusions, as that it is exactly the sa-buah negeri kapada kedudokan-nya. intention. Afterall, Sir, they are spend­ Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya hendak ing the money of this country and bertanya kapada Perdana Menteri not the money of the Alliance Govern­ berkenaan dengan Sub-head 49- ment, or that of the Alliance Party. tentang lawatan Yang di-Pertuan So, I think it is most deplorable that Agong ka-Brunei dan lawatan itu kita officials and Ministers of the Alliance menyaksikan dan kita mengikuti-nya. have seen fit to condemn them because Saya ingin tahu bagaimana-kah dasar of their 'Views on the question of Kerajaan dalam anggota rombongan . I am sure the Honourable Yang di-Pertuan Agong bukan sahaja the Prime Minister, who has stated lawatan-nya ka-Brunei bahkan lawatan the policy of such study tours to the ka-negeri2 lain, ada-kah bilangan ini House in no uncertain terms, and to di-tentukan di-atas satu dasar yang the people of this country in no tertentu atau pun bilangan ini di­ uncertain terms, in the light of my tentukan dengan kehendak dan explanation will, I think, regret that kemahuan pehak yang tertentu sahaja. such statements were made by members Berjimat dalam perbelanjaan ini tidak­ of the Government; and I hope that lah sentiasa di-perhatikan dan saya he will re-state in this House the policy berharap Yang Amat Berhormat with regard to such study tours, so Perdana Menteri dapat menerangkan that in future Members of this House, dasar dalam perkara ini supaya jelas or the people of this country, will kapada Dewan ini bahawa segala know exactly their position when pemergian ini tidak di-lakukan dengan accepting such study tours. Unless this , tidak ada dasar yang tertentu. is done, it will be embarrassing to any person or persons who accept such Enche' Tan Phock Kin: Mr. Chair­ study tours on the assumption that the man, Sir, I rise to speak on the Item grants are to enable them to travel to "Study Tours". As I understand it, other countries to see things for them­ study tours are granted to individuals selves, to judge for themselves what to travel to various places and the is going on in other countries, and to •••tt¥!1!!!:'1C'~

3861 26 JANUARY 1962 3862 compare conditions there with condi­ that is involved in transporting a tions prevailing in Malaya, because it physician to India and, after the is with such assumption in mind that Indian trip is over, to transport him they have visited the other countries back again, and to send somebody and after which made certain state­ else to Pakistan (Laughter). This is ments which might not be to the liking most ridiculous and, apart from the of the Government, and as a result fact that it is a well-known fact that of which the Government came out according to procedure it is normal to attack them. Therefore, Sir, I would that a senior physician should be sent, earnestly urge the Honourable the it is an open facf that members in the Prime Minister to clarify once again Medical Services were most dissatisfied the policy of the Government in regard with this arrangement, because of to this matter. personal consideration. The physician, who was sent with His Majesty to Secondly, on the question of the Pakistan, is an administrator, and it official car under the Head "Special is most abnormal to send an adminis­ Expenditure", I think the Honourable trator as a physician to accompany • Member for Bachok is quite correct His Majesty; and it is a well-known in putting forward his views on this, fact that it was done because of but I would not go as far as he does. personal consideration, because the I would say that as far as the provision physician concerned happens to come of a car and furnishing is concerned, from the North. This is a very clear it is extravagant by any standards, case of spending public money purely because if we make a comparison with to accommodate certain people because the furnishings and car allowed to a of personal consideration. I sincerely Division I officer or to a Minister, it hope that, in view of the facts brought is definitely on the extravagant side, up by Members of the Opposition and and I urge that in the light of what in view of public concern over such the Honourable Minister of Finance extravagance of public funds, the has warned this country with regard Government will look very seriously to thrift and with regard to a desire into this-and it is my earnest hope to economise, that Government will that such state of affairs will not arise give very serious consideration to the again in future. advise given by the Honourable Minister of Finance and practice what Enche' Othman bin Abdullah is being preached. (Tanah Merah): Rises. Mr. Chairman: Tolong jangan sentoh Coming now to another point-tours perkara2 yang telah di-chakapkan by His Majesty to various places, which terlebeh dahulu. Chari perkara baharu. was also raised by the Honourabl~ Member for Bachok-I am inclined Enche' Othman bin Abdullah: to agree with him that there is no Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya hendak fixed policy with regard to this, chakap perkara yang belum di­ because as far as such tours are chakapkan oleh Ahli2 Yang Berhormat concerned, it creates the impression yang terdahulu daripada saya. Ber­ that Government is merely using the kenaan dengan Study Tours saya suka opportunity to enable certain people menarek perhatian Yang Berhormat to accompany His Majesty for the Perdana Menteri ia-itu tujuan Study purpose of giving them a free trip Tours ia-lah melebarkan pengetahuan without consideration of the financial orang kita di-luar negeri dan meng­ implications. One very good example untongkan kapada diri-nya dan kapada is the tour of His Majesty to India negara. Tetapi yang saya dapat and Pakistan. The most remarkable ketahui ia-itu bila satu2 rombongan thing is that they have sent two itu pergi ka-luar negeri, apabila ia physicians to accompany His Majesty­ balek tidak ada satu pun kenyataan one for India and another for Pakistan. atau repot yang di-buat oleh rombo­ Just imagine the amount of air passages ngan itu tentang kejayaan2 dalam w' JU: 4JJf44¥b9?4lt,

3863 26 JANUARY 1962 3864 perjalanan-nya ka-luar negeri. Jadi shared by quite a large number of nampak-lah kapada kita bahawa Members in this House-particularly pemergian anggota itu hanya untok his comment on the trip of His Majesty menguntongkan diri-nya sa-orang, dan to India. He has suggested that His dia mencheritakan lain daripada apa Majesty need not have taken two yang kita harapkan. doctors on that trip if His Majesty could have done with one, who could Jadi, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya have accompanied him throughout the mengeshorkan kapada Yang Berhormat tour. Sir, this country has not got the Perdana Menteri supaya tiap2 anggota office of Royal Physician and, as a rombongan yang kita hantar ka-luar result, we have got to ask the Hospital negeri itu, bila dia balek chuba buat Authorities whether they could spare satu pendapat. Mithal-nya, dia pergi a doctor for a certain period to accom­ ka-Jepun. Apa pendapat dia dalam pany His Majesty on tour-the tour masa melawat negeri Jepun, kemudian as Honourable Members will appre­ t shorkan kapada jabatan yang ber­ ciate took seven weeks. According to kenaan supaya dapat di-ambil the Hospital. Authorities, the only pertimbangan. Itu yang pertama. Yang people they could spare for the period kedua-nya, kebanyakan anggota were those two doctors--one doctor rombongan yang pergi ka-luar negeri to cover half the tour and another to itu, kata-lah, dia itu sa-orang ahli cover the other half. Unfortunately, politik, dia tidak dapat mencheritakan one doctor came from the North-and bagaimana kedudokan politik negeri 2 for that matter so does the Honourable itu. Saya harap supaya orang yang Member (Laughter), and if he is akan pergi dalam rombongan itu pada entitled to sit here, I do not see any masa yang akan dapat di-ambil dari­ reason why the physician could not pada orang yang ada hubongan-nya accompany His Majesty to India just dengan masharakat. Mithal-nya, guru2 2 because he comes from the North. I sekolah kebangsaan, guru sekolah do not think the place where he resides ugama, kerana mereka ada hubongan makes any difference-I too come from yang terus dengan masharakat dan the North. The Hospital Authorities dapat di-amalkan daripada basil said that they could not spare a doctor pengalaman-nya. Kalau sa-kira-nya to go on a seven week tour and, if it orang itu tidak ada berhubong rapat was necessary for a doctor to accom­ dengan masharakat, saya rasa pany His Majesty throughout the tour, pengetahuan yang dia dapat sadikit two doctors would be sent-each sa-banyak di-luar negeri itu tidak akan doctor, as I have said, to cover half dapat di-amalkan, sa-lain daripada the period of the tour; this is because memuji2 negeri itu sendiri. each doctor is a specialist in his own Sebab itu, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, particular line. Sir, that is why it was saya mengeshorkan kapada Yang Ber­ necessary to send Dr. Sinnadurai and hormat Perdana Menteri supaya pada Dr. Bakar on that trip with Their masa yang akan datang biar-lah wang Majesties. yang kita beri kapada rombongan itu banyak mendatangkan faedah. Ini With regard to the object of studv bukan-lah saya menafikan ia-itu ada tours, the Honourable Member will juga faedah-nya rombongan itu pergi realise that the object of study tours ka-luar negeri, tetapi biar-lah men­ is two-way. One is to enable our datangkan faedah ia-itu mengeluar­ people to visit other countries and to kan pendapat2, kemudian di-timbang­ broaden their minds and outlook; and kan supaya sa-suai dengan negeri ini at the same time it is only fair for sendiri. those who visit foreign countries to go there carrying with them the good­ The Prime Minister: Mr. Chairman, will of the people of this country and Sir, the Honourable the Member for to impress on the people in those Tanjong is, of course, entitled to his countries which they visit our regard views. Fortunately, his views are not for them. It is for them to go as ~r: -·4'.@[email protected],,._./'P ~ .

3865 26 JANUARY 1962 3866 ambassadors from this country rather way to explain this matter is to speak than as fifth columnists. In the case in Malay. of the Honourable Members from the Socialist Front, who went on a study Professor Phillip di-pinjamkan dari­ tour to Sarawak, unfortunately, they pada World Bank. Jadi gaji-nya di­ did not go as our ambassadors but bayar oleh Kerajaan Amerika. Jadi they went there as fifth columnists for apa tanggongan kita ia-lah untok our enemy (Laughter) (Applause). memberikan kapada-nya sa-buah rumah, motokar dan syce. Apa yang Dato' Dr. Ismail: Shame! kita buat ia-lah chuma hendak menyetnpurnakan apa yang di-janjikan. The Prime Minister: It is a great Tuan2 tentu-lah dapat memikirkan pity, but that is so. They went and kalau kita bagikan motokar yang told people there how bad this country burok dan rosak malu-lah kita is saying that we, here have no freedom (Ketawa). Orang ini dudok sementara of speech, freedom of movement, and di-sini dan apabila dia balek dia so on. But that is not correct. We mungkin boleh kata: "Ini-lah Malaya, • concede that they are entitled to kita menolong-nya dengan hati yang express views about this country, but ikhlas, gaji saya di-bayar oleh negeri they should not do it in order to lain, sa-sampai saya di-sana di-bagi present a picture which is completely pula saya motokar yang burok sampai untrue. dua tiga batu berjalan sudah rosak, dan juga di-beri saya dudok di-rumah Sir, as I have said, the object of atap". Pembawaan kita di-Tanah study tours is to broaden one's mind, Melayu ini ada-lah di-puji orang, kata to bring a message of goodwill from orang biar kita kalah tidak apa tetapi the people of Malaya to others, and kalah budi jangan sa-kali (Ketawa). at the same time to see things. If there is a chance of our improving the Bagitu juga berkenaan dengan conditions of our people here through perjalanan Duli Yang Maha Mulia reports which are received from those Seri Paduka Baginda Yang di-Pertuan who went on study tours, we will be Agong ka-luar negeri. Saya suka-lah happy to do it. Study tours, I think, menerangkan di-sini bahawa 6 bulan have been successful, because they have tcrdahulu daripada Duli Yang Maha a two-way purpose. Sir, while we allow Mulia berangkat atau berchadang our people to go abroad, we also at hcndak berangkat ka-luar negeri, kita the same time invite other people to di-sini telah mengator mengikut come here. This is nothing new. Most susunan dan menetapkan siapa2-kah of the countries in America and Europe yang harus dan layak mengiringi Duli provide study tours-in America they Yang Maha Mulia itu berjalan ka-luar have got the Leadership Grant, in negeri terutama-nya untok menjaga England they have got the British kehormatan dan kedaulatan Duli Yang Council Grant, and there are various Maha Mulia itu. Jadi, sa-lama 6 bulan other grants. We, as a new country, Menteri2 boleh di-katakan tiap2 are alert to see what can best be minggu bersidang dan apa2 keputusan adopted from outside for the good dalam persidangan itu saya sampaikan and benefit of our people. Study tour kapada Duli Yang Maha Mulia Seri is the result of following the example Paduka Baginda Yang di-Pertuan of other countries, and on the whole Agong, dan semak punya semak people benefit greatly. sampai sudah tetap siapa orang2 yang patut dan layak mengiringi Duli Yang The other matter brought up by the Maha Mulia itu. Membuat perbelan­ Honourable Member for Tanjong is jaan yang berpatutan serta membuat about the motor-car. I think this peratoran di-dalam perjalanan itu matter was also mentioned by the apabila di-putuskan bersetuju baharu­ Honourable Members for Bachok and lah Duli Yang Maha Mulia berjalan Tanah Merah. So, I think the best ka-luar negeri. Bukan benda ini di- ~ f94? .. C'.YU""""" ------~~~~ ·~~--

3867 26 JANUARY 1962 3868 buat dengan serta-merta kerana kita Berhormat Perdana Menteri. Apabila pun sa-buah negeri yang baharu dan saya menyebutkan bahawa motokar kita tahu kita ini belum lagi biasa yang hendak di-berikan kapada sa­ ini-lah pertama kali-nya yang kita orang itu saperti ini tidak mesti-lah adakan sa-orang Raja dari Tanah baharu. Tidak-lah patut di-fahamkan Melayu melawat ka-luar negeri. Jadi, oleh Yang Berhormat Perdana Menteri tentu-lah apabila Raja kita hendak berfikir bahawa kita hendak memberi .ka-luar negeri kita berkehendakkan sa-buah motokar yang berjalan dua selamat dan sempurna supaya orang2 batu rosak, sa-olah2 motokar yang negeri luar itu memuji apa chara2 yang berumor sa-tahun di-Tanah Melayu kita buat itu. Jadi, kerana itu-lah tidak ini, dua tiga kali berjalan boleh rosak. benar di-sebutkan benda itu di­ Ini, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, satu perkara jalankan dengan serta-merta. Jika sa-bagai Perdana Menteri saya harap tuan2 tengok hadiah2 yang di-berikan supaya tidak-lah memikirkan perkara oleh orang negeri2 lain kalau tuan2 ini sampai bagitu sa-kali. Dan amat­ tengok hadiah itu ada-lah berharga lah menyedehkan Yang Berhormat ' berpuloh2 sampai beratus ribu ringgit. Perdana Menteri memahamkan yang Kita tidak mampu hendak membawa kita ini hendak memberi rumah atap, balek semua hadiah2 itu. Kata-lah perkara ini tidak berbangkit. J adi, hadiah2 yang di-terima oleh Duli Yang saya berharap supaya beliau itu Maha Mulia Seri Paduka Baginda tidak-lah memahamkan apa yang di­ Yang di-Pertuan Agong itu di-bawa kehendaki oleh fikiran2 dari pehak ka-dalam rumah ini atau Dewan pembangkang di-sini, biar-lah ke'adilan Ra'ayat ini tentu-lah kita terkejut itu di-berikan dengan chara berpatutan melihat-nya. Jadi, sebab itu-lah sa­ dan tidak-lah merayau2 jauh daripada bagaimana saya katakan, saya tidak itu. dapat apa2 tegoran pun berkenaan dengan hal ini. Itu-lah jawapan saya. Enche' K. Karam Singh (Daman­ sara): Mr. Chairman, Sir, with your Enche' Zulkiflee bin Muhammad: permission, the Honourable the Tuan Yang di-Pertua, sadikit sahaja. Prime Minister has said certain things Mr. Chairman: Sa-tahu saya Ahli2 which cast aspersions on the Socialist Yang Berhormat memang ada hak Front, and it is but right that we state boleh berchakap sa-masa kita dalam our view points so that the wrong Jawatan-Kuasa. Tetapi mengikut impression is not conveyed by what practice yang biasa di-jalankan di­ the Honourable Prime Minister has Parliamentary Democracy di-United said. The Honourable the Prime Kingdom, sa-lepas daripada Yang Minister said that he did not know Berhormat Perdana Menteri menjawab that when the Socialist Front sent its tidak-lah ada lagi perkara2 yang delegation on a study tour of the hendak di-bangkitkan. Saya hanya Borneo territories they would function boleh meneruskan permintaan sama as a "fifth column". Mr. Chairman, Sir, ada bersetuju atau tidak. Kalau I think there is a misunderstanding of hendak berchakap juga, saya benarkan the meaning of "fifth column", because tetapi biasa-nya tidak, sebab sa-tahu had we been a fifth column, I don't saya daripada ini dalam bulan April think the Government would undertake nanti kita akan adakan lagi meshuarat to send us there, and that shows that dan Ahli2 Yang Berhormat boleh what we did is perfectly legal. So, berchakap atas semua perkara di-atas that would show that his remark about dunia ini bila Duli Yang Maha Mulia fifth columnists is unfounded. Mr. Seri Paduka Baginda Yang di-Pertuan Chairman, Sir, if the Socialist Front Agong membuka sidang Parlimen. delegation went to Borneo on Govern­ ment expense, it does not mean that Enche' Zulkiflee bin Muhammad: we should become itinerant bards of Yang menjadi soal kapada saya, Tuan the virtues of the Alliance. Even when Yang di-Pertua, ia-lah membayangkan we go there, we still hold our stand­ suatu yang tidak benar oleh Yang points, and although we do not ·;;~,-'

3869 26 JANUARY 1962 3870 disparage the country-we will never We want everybody who goes out disparage the country-it does not from this country to any other country mean that we go there to whitewash to think that they go there as mes­ the sins of the Alliance in the eyes of sengers of goodwill from this country the outside world. In the same way, and to win friends and to tell the we do not complain when Alliance people in the other country what this members go abroad and do not praise country is like. That is all that is the Socialist Front. So, if they do not required of them. praise the Socialist Front when they go abroad, I think they cannot expect Question put, and agreed to. us to go round the world praising The sum of $469,540 for Head them. Mr. Chairman, Sir, I think it S. 7 ordered to stand part of the would be the height of absurdity if we Schedule. went abroad and said, for instance, that the Minister of Internal Security Head S. 13- is doing a very good job by arresting The Prime Minister: Mr. Chairman, people. We can never do that-and Sir, I beg to move that Head 13 stand we will never do that. Neither can we part of the Schedule. I would like to go and say that there is full freedom explain Sub-head 15. The amount of as practised by the Alliance Govern­ $10,000 shown under it is towards ment, when we know fully well that conducting a comprehensive employ­ trade unionists are arrested, persons ment and unemployment survey in in Opposition Parties are arrested. Mr. 1962 / 63, and the sum now sought is Chairman, these are facts which no to meet the expenses of this pilot one can whitewash. So, I don't think survey. anyone in the Government Party is justified in making those remarks. Enche' Zulkiftee bin Muhammad: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, chadangan saya The Prime Minister: I must say a atas menjalankan perkara ini ada-lah few words in reply to the Honourable fikiran yang baik. Saya berkehendak­ Member. This country has been lucky kan supaya Yang Berhormat Perdana after independence to receive within Menteri ini memikirkan sama ada our shores delegations from various boleh dia menambah atau mengisi countries coming from different parties, under employment daripada service parties in power, parties not in power; ini. Tuan Yang di-Pertua, perkara ini but as far as I could see and hear amat-lah mustahak sebab kita menya­ dari orang2 yang menganggor dan from what they have to say, they talk 2 well of their country, they never even beberapa perkara dan kesulitan yang discuss disparagingly about the various bdum dapat kita selesaikan. Saya parties which they have in their own perchaya sa-kira-nya Public Services Commission mengambil tugas ini bagi country. They come here to represent 2 their country and with the intention of orang yang tidak chukup pendapatan­ bringing messages of goodwill from nya dalam chara hidup mereka maka their country to the people of this dapat-lah kita sa-bagai sa-buah Kera­ country. The same thing is true when jaan membuat ranchangan yang 2 I went to and Sarawak. membolehkan mengubati kesulitan 2 l don't think very many people realised under employment atau orang yang 2 which party is in power in this country. tidak chukup pendapatan itu. Baharu ini, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, dua ribu They had heard about me and they 2 had heard about a few Honourable orang lebeh anggota pemuda dari Ministers, but they did not know what seluroh Tanah Melayu telah . datang 2 party is in power in this country. All ka-Depoh untok mendapatkan kerja they realised is that this is the Federa­ yang kosong. Oleh yang demikian tion of Malaya. Therefore, it is wrong dalam perkara under employment ini for the Honourable Member to say patut-lah di-tolong oleh Kerajaan. that they are expected to go there and Enche' K. Karam Singh: Mr. Chair­ to praise us. That is not so--we don't. man, Sir, we note that a sum of ~- ---.....-.--~- -- ""~

3871 26 JANUARY 1962 3872 , $10,000 is being asked for by the of the Government to create additional Prime Minister to carry out a pilot jobs. And even today ...... survey of employment and unemploy­ ment in the Federation. Since the Mr. Chairman: Order, order. The Socialist Front came into this House, point at issue is the pilot survey of we have been consistently asking the employment and unemployment. I Government to have a policy of must warn you that you must confine guaranteeing every person in this to that only. I cannot allow you to country a job, because we realise that wander about. a job is the best friend of any citizen and it is the job which feeds the citizen. Enche' K. Karam Singh: Mr. Chair­ But, Sir, up to now no concrete steps man, Sir, if this Government wants to have been taken in this direction and fight for what it claims that it is although what the Government is fighting, that it presents a superior doing-the proposed measure by the ideology to other ideologies, I would Honourable Prime Minister to carry tell the Honourable the Prime Minister out a pilot survey of employment and that under Socialism there is a unemployment-is a good proposal, guarantee of employment to every we find that it is rather belated; and citizen (Laughter). I would also tell what we find here is not some proposal the Honourable Prime Minister that if to give more jobs to the people, or he wants his Party to succeed in the some proposal to combat unemploy­ battle against Communism, he must ment in our country but just a bring up a programme of full employ­ preliminary pilot survey, the first ment to every citizen, because we preliminary step in this field. Mr. know that if on the one hand the Chairman, Sir, if at this late stage all Honourable Prime Minister savs that that we have arrived at is a proposal he wants to fight Communism and on of a pilot survey, I should say the the other hand you have thousands Government is not at all alive to its upon thousands of unemployed, who responsibilities. If we look at today's have no homes, who have no jobs, it papers we find a picture of crowds of will make a pretence of all that the applicants for a few jobs in the police. Alliance claims that it is doing for Sir, what is that an indication of? the people. I would ask the Govern­ ment to see what is happening-and Dato' Dr. Ismail: The popularity of not be half-hearted-and take a stand the police. in the face of the entire world that Malaya is a country which will Enche' K. Karam Singh: It indicates guarantee a job to every citizen; and not that the Minister concerned is I can assure the Honourable Prime discharging his duties very well, but Minister that when he can give that that the Government is not finding undertaking and implement it, we enough jobs for the people of this will . be the first persons to go round country. And if the jobs advertised had the world and tell the world what a been any other jobs, perhaps any job good Government we have in this outside the Ministry of the Interior, respect (Laughter). we would find that as many applicants would still have come. Enche' Mohamed Yusof bin Mahmud (Temerloh): Tuan Pengerusi, Mr. Chairman, Sir, in this connection saya hendak berchakap sadikit dalam I would say that this much publicised perkara ini tentang peruntokan wang campaign of the Labour Ministry that $10. Saya dengan sukachita-nya all persons for new jobs will only be mengalukan2 dan saya perchaya per­ recruited through the Employment buatan ini banyak mendatangkan Exchanges is a farce meant to deceive faedah, tetapi suka saya hendak beri­ the people of Malaya that the Govern­ tahu kapllda Ahli Yang Berhormat ment is providing jobs for the people, yang baharu berchakap tadi, sebab because there is ·no effort on ·the part saya tahu Menteri Buroh ada iklankan "·"~·

3873 26 JANUARY 1962 3874 pekerjaan2 kapada mereka yang hendak to qualify but to clarify, Sir, because bekerja, tetapi mereka2 ini tidak mahu I am not apologising for what I have hendak pergi bekerja ka-tempat2 said. The reply from the Government baharu. Itu terang ada di-terangkan Bench has confused a policy of full . dalam surat2 khabar. Jadi atas ikhtiar employment with forced labour, be­ menchari kerja ini, saya puji atas usaha cause if it is a question of having forced yang di-buat oleh Yang Amat Ber­ labour, we from the Socialist Front will hormat Perdana Menteri. be the first to oppose it. I ask the Government not to deliberately confuse The Prime Minister: Mr. Speaker, the terms "forced labour" and "full Sir, I thank the Honourable Member employment" and, on the excuse of from the Socialist Front who talked forced labour, not to have a policy of about the scheme they had in mind full employment in our country. which· would give employment to every person in this country. But I must Question put, and agreed to. warn the Honourable Member that that sort of employment which he The sum of $10,000 under Head had in mind is contrary to human S. 13 ordered to stand part of the freedom-forced labour,·for instance­ Schedule. and that sort of thing we do not The Minister of Transport (Dato' welcome. What we are trying to Sardon bin Haji Jubir): Dato' Pe­ provide is a job to every man, which ngerusi, saya menchadangkan Kepala is obviously the intention of every 14 di-bawah Kementerian Pertanian good government-and I can say our dan Sharikat Kerjasama menjadi sa­ Government is pretty good no matter bahagian daripada Jadual ini. Saya what the Socialist Member might think minta Ahli2 Yang Berhormat melibat of us. Cmd. 51 muka 8 di-mana penjelasan itu ada-lah terang, sebab itu-lah saya This pilot scheme which we have minta persetujuan ini. here is, he said, rather belated. But the Honourable Member must remem­ Question put and agreed to. ber that for the last 100 years when The sum of $10 for Head S. 14 we were under the British we never ordered to stand part of the had any such scheme for employment Schedule. and no unemployment statistics. We have had this idea ever since we came Head S. 15- into power, but to try to work it out The Minister of Commerce and is not easy; we have to seek opinion Industry (Enche' Mohamed Khir and advice from everywhere. It is now Johari): Mr. Chairman, Sir, I have th.at we are embarking on this pilot got nothing to add to the Explanatory scheme and we hope that we will make Statement as provided for in the paper it a success. except to say that the air passages for The other suggestion is by the the Assistant Minister and the three Honourable Member for Bachok who officials were paid for by the German said that we should also try to make Government. Sir, I beg to move. statistics of the under-employed. That Question put, and agreed to. is a good suggestion and one which I will take note. I do not think there The sum of $10 under Head is any other view expressed on this S. 15 ordered to stand part of the matter except that what we are pro­ Schedule. posing here is only for $10,000, and Head S. /7- I hope we will get the approval of the House to put this scheme into The Deputy Prime Minister (Tun operation. Haji Abdul Razak): Sir, I beg to move that the sum amounting to Enche' K. Karam Singh: Mr. Chair­ $2,490,554 under Head S. 17 be man, Sir, I would like to clarify, not approved. This supplementary budget, 7 __...... ---- -.....,.,,..____ _ - -~------·------

3875 26 JANUARY 1962 3876 Sir, is self-explanatory-the whole I need only explain the visit of the provision is required for our Malayan Deputy Prime Minister to Japan. In Special Force in the Congo. The first fact, this sum was approved but owing supplement of about $800,000 was to the needs of the late His Majesty approved in 1961 and the present Tuanku Abdul Rahman the proposed requirement is for further expenditure trip was cancelled-the amount then for the remaining part of the year. approved was $13,650. Sir, I beg to As Honourable Members can see from move. Command Paper No. 50 of 1961, the large sum of $2 million is required Enche' K. Karam Singh: Mr. Chair­ for the purchase of vehicles for our man, Sir, regarding this ASA, the troops in the Congo at the request of question has been raised in this House the United Nations. and outside as to whether it is not a camouflage for SEA TO, but the Question put, and agreed to. Government and the Honourable the The sum of $2,490,554 under Prime Minister have not clarified that Head S. 17 ordered to stand part point. The lack of clarification would of the Schedule. only go to strengthen the very strong feeling that ASA is a satellite organi­ Head S. 18- sation of the now discredited SEATO. The Minister of Education (Enche' Mr. Chairman, Sir, the feeling that Abdul Rahman bin Haji Talib): ASA is a satellite of SEA TO is Dato' Pengerusi, saya bangun men­ strengthened by the fact that of the chadangkan Kepala 18-Kementerian three members of ASA two of them are Pelajaran peruntokan sa-banyak $30 members of SEATO. Therefore, if menjadi sa-bahagian daripada Jadual those two members, Siam and Philip­ ini. Keterangan2 yang lanjut tentang pines, are full-fledged members of kenapa wang sa-jumlah $8,276 ini SEATO, it would be, perhaps, that di-kehendaki ada-lah di-beri dalam when it came to taking decisions Siam Command Paper 51, muka 9 dan saya and the Philippines would take tidak berhajat hendak menerangkan decisions in favour of SEA TO. or lebeh lanjut. taking a SEATO line inside ASA; and Question put, and agreed to. Malaya being in the minority would have to submit to a SEATO line The sum of $30 for Head S. 18 within ASA. Therefore, we would agreed to stand of the Schedule. like to have a clarification on this point, and we would want to know Head S. 19- whether ASA is genuinely an The Prime Minister: Mr. Chairman, independent organisation, and what Sir, I beg to move that Sub-head 1. proposals it has to raise the standard Sub-heads 21A. B, C, Sub-heads 36, of living of the masses in these 37, 38, and Sub-heads 7 and 39, territories, or that it is just a small totalling $45,080 stand part of the liaison between the top officials only. Schedule. All these Sub-heads are I would submit, Sir, that no inter­ under Head S. 19. Sir, the sum is national organisation today has very made up of: much value, if it is not directed towards the upliftment of the people Malayan National Secre­ economically, socially and politically­ tariat for ASA $33,570 basically economically-of the masses Officers on Attachment, of the regions concerned. In this Leave, Overlap and respect, I would like to make an Transfer 10 observation that that is the failure of SEATO, because it did not do any­ Visit of the Deputy Prime thing at all to uplift the masses in the Minister and Party to SEA TO region, economically or other­ Japan 11,500 wise. j877 26 JANUARY 1962 3878 The Prime Minister: Mr. Chairman, Enche' Tan Siew Sin: I haven't got Sir, I do not know whether I can help that but I have given the expenditure the Honourable Member. From time for the four Heads separately. to time we had tried to explain that SEATO is a defence treaty among all Sir, of the nine items appearing in these countries-I cannot remember the Second Supplementary Estimates some of them at this moment-but I of Expenditure for 1961, four are think the Honourable Member is well items of Charged Expenditure and the aware that SEATO is made up of all reasons why additional provision is those countries which are in the required in each case have been Western bloc. On the other hand ASA explained in the Treasury Memo­ is an economic agreement between randum which has been placed before Philippines, Thailand and Malaya. It you as Command Paper No. 51 of has got no defence matter in it at 1961. I should, however, draw the all and that alone will explain to the attention of Honourable Members to Honourable Member that its object is a printing error which has occurred in entirely different from that of SEA TO. Sub-head 5 of Head 10-Charged The intention is. as I have said and Expenditure-of Command Paper No. I say again, to build up a strong 50 of 1961. The word "injury" has economy among these three countries; been left out at the end of the Sub­ and the only way to do that is to try head and the correct title should be to bring these three countries together "Compensation for damage to property and concentrate our efforts on the and for personal injury." matter of economic stability and all matters connected with culture, so The other five main items appear that we could bring all these people in the Supply Expenditure portion of within this area very much more the Supplementary Estimates. The closely. This ASA organisation is not need for additional funds under each confined to these three countries alone. of the Sub-heads involved is also All countries in South-East Asia were explained in the Command Paper, but invited but some of them did not think I think it would be helpful if the it advisable to join, but it is up to reasons given in support of supple­ them-we are not trying to force our mentary provision under Sub-head 42, views on others, but if they wish to Head 22, Treasury, were explained join they are welcome at any time, further. except China and all countries with communist affiliations. It is the practice for payment of pensions to Malayan Government Question put, and agreed to. pensioners resident in India to be made by the Indian Government on The sum of $45,080 for Head behalf of the Federation Government. S. 19 ordered to stand part of the This is a service which the Indian Schedule. Government renders free of charge. Under the system in force, the Indian Heads 22 to 27- Government makes payment to the Enche' Tan Siew Sin: Mr. Chair­ pensioners from its own funds and man, Sir, as the Treasury is responsible then presents a statement of account for four Heads of expenditure I think to the Accountant-General, Federation I can take them together. I accordingly of Malaya, for reimbursement of the move that expenditure under Heads payments which have been made. 22, 23, 25 and 27 covering expenditure Reimbursement in respect of those of $188,991, $7,000,000, $10 and claims which can be readily checked $119,338 respectively be approved. have been made over the years from time to time but the sum of $188,991 Mr. Chairman: Could you give the has been outstanding in respect of total amount of all that? the period since 1943. It has not been 3879 26 JANUARY 1962 3880 an easy matter to check all these Head S. 29- payments owing to the fact that many of the relevant records were lost during The Minister of Health and Social the period of the Japanese Occupation Welfare (Dato' Ong Yoke Lin): Mr. and further, in some cases, supporting Chairman, Sir, I beg to move ...... vouchers did not accompany the Mr. Chairman: Order! I do not claims and appear to have been think that is your usual place. You mislaid in transit. However, after should stand up in your usual place considerable correspondence and a and then move. personal visit to India by our Accountant-General, it has been Dato' Ong Yoke Lin: I am sorry, decided that the outstanding claim Sir. of $188,991 should be settled in full and the provision now sought will Dato' Dr. Ismail: Sir, on a point of recoup the advance which has been clarification, I do not think that made from the Contingencies Fund. Ministers, like other Honourable Members, have any specific places I should also, perhaps, say a few allotted to them. words to supplement the explanation given in the Command Paper for the Mr. Chairman: It is difficult for the provision required under Head 23- Members to know which Minister is Contributions to Statutory Funds. The moving-it is difficult for them to $7 million is required in order that the know unless the Ministers are in their capital sum of the Supplies Depart­ usual places. That is when moving ment Trading Account may be only. (To Dato' Dr. Ismail) You are increased from $40 million to $47 not moving now, so it does not matter. million. As Honourable Members are Dato' Dr. Ismail: Is it your wish no doubt aware, this Account is used that the Ministerial Bench should also for the operation of a scheme which have name plates? involves the purchase of all locally grown padi and rice offered to Govern­ Mr. Chairman: No, but I think when ment at the guaranteed price of $15 moving they should sit at their usual per picul for good dry padi delivered places. at mill door. The recent large increase in the domestic crop coupled with Dato' Ong Yoke Lin: Mr. Chair­ the deflation of world prices for rice man, Sir, I beg to move that the has made it necessary for Government expenditure of $150,615 for Head 29 to hold larger stocks of rice than in be approved. Sir, without these funds, the past, thereby necessitating an the National Tuberculosis Control increase in the working capital of the Campaign could not have been imple­ Account. mented in 1961 and there would have been a delay of seven months. This The other three groups of Sub­ vote, therefore, was urgently required heads, in respect of which supple­ to launch the National Tuberculosis mentary funds are required, are Control Campaign according to our described in paragraphs 33, 34 and plan. The vote covers the following: 35 of the Command Paper which is before ·the House. As the explanations (i) Uniform and staff-clothing for have been clearly set out, I think no nurses, hospital attendants and further comment is required from me. other staff approved under Personal Emoluments for the Question put, and agreed to. control plan; The sum of $7,308,339 for Heads (ii) printing and stationery, new 22 to 27 ordered to stand part of forms and health education the Schedule. pamphlets for the plan-these 3881 26 JANUARY 1962 3882 forms and pamphlets were private. Saya suka-lah sa-kira-nya required for B.C.G. Campaign, Menteri Yang Berhormat ini dapat case-finding campaign, notifica­ memikirkan kemungkinan mengada­ tion and progress reports, tuber­ kan satu ranchangan X-Ray bagi culosis clinic work, State tuber­ seluroh Persekutuan Tanah Melayu culosis case-registers-in all 21 dengan tujuan hendak mengadakan forms were involved and thirty penchegahan berkembang-nya batok pamphlets were prepared with kering di-dalam negeri ini. Oleh sebab, the assistance of the Colombo Tuan Yang di-Pertua, sa-kira-nya Plan Adviser from Australia; di-lakukan rawatan dan pemereksaan di-kawasan2 luar bandar yang jauh2 (iii) transport and travelling in­ maka kita dapati banyak orang2 yang cluding diverse wages for implementation of the B.C.G. berpenyakit T.B. sama ada dengan campaign and the case-finding peringkat awal atau pun peringkat campaign including home menengah.. Sa-kira-nya mereka itu tidak di-beri rawatan dengan lebeh visiting: this was also required dahulu maka elok-lah di-adakan for transport and commuted X-Ray kapada mereka itu. Saya fikir allowances for nursing sisters apa yang di-buat di-dalam usaha2 and nurses from the eleven States who attended special control yang lain-nya di-hantarkan di­ bandar2, di-tempat2 yang tidak ber­ courses in Kuala Lumpur hajat tidak akan mendapat faedah­ Centre for Tuberculosis Control 2 Campaign; nya. Mereka di-kampong itu akan mengembangkan T.B. di-masa yang (iv) equipment including office akan datang pula, sama ada diri equipment for the Control mereka itu sendiri atau bagi keturunan Campaign, syringes, needles, mereka. Saya minta soal ini dapat laboratory apparatus, X-ray di-fikirkan oleh Yang Berhormat accessories, filing cabinets, etc.; Menteri. and Enche' Mohd. Yusof bin Mahmud: (v) books and periodicals to es· Tuan Yang di-Pertua, dalam per­ tablish a central library to assist untokan wang yang di-belanjakan itu in the implementation of the saya berasa besar hati perkara itu telah Campaign. banyak di-majukan dalam daerah saya, satu perkara yang saya berharap di­ Enche' Zulkiflee bin Muhammad: pertimbangkan ia-itu dalam perkara Tuan Yang di-Pertua, mendahului' orang2 yang akan menerima rawatan ranchangan ini daripada tahun 1962 atau pun menerima nasihat penyakit ada-lah satu pekerjaan yang baik. Dan batok kering di-daerah itu. Di-daerah saya rasa, di-dalam menjadikan satu itu berjauhan daripada Health Centre. chara bahawa jika sa-kira-nya perkara Kalau dapat satu kerjasama yang yang saperti ini di-chepatkan per­ di-buat oleh Menteri itu dengan mintaan kapada Supplementary Esti­ Pejabat Keretapi atau Pejabat Bas mates ini, maka saya ingin meminta supaya dapat mereka2 itu bermurah pertimbangan daripada Menteri Yang hati memberi concession ticket bagi Berhormat berkenaan dengan per­ mereka2 yang datang menemui' doctor2 khidmatan control T.B. di-negeri ini. ka-tempat itu. Sebab sa-tahu saya Pada fikiran saya apa yang telah perkara ini ada terjadi di-Melaka di-sebutkan oleh Menteri Yang Ber­ di-mana masa dahulu tiap2 orang yang hormat tadi ada-lah merupakan control kena penyakit ini yang ada surat di-dalam perkara2 yang di-fikirkan pengakuan · daripada doctor maka telah di-dapati sa-bagai perkara yang bas2 itu dapat menurunkan tambang di-bawah perubatan dan rawatan di­ untok menyenangkan sadikit kapada sampaikan kapada pengetahuan doctor mereka yang menanggong penyakit atau pun kapada pengetahuan doctor ini. ,...... ---~------

3883 26 JANUARY 1962 3884 Oleh itu saya harap dapat Menteri Head S. 31- ini membuat satu perundingan dengan Kompeni2 itu supaya dapat memberi­ The Minister of the Interior (Dato' kan kesenangan kapada orang2 yang Dr. Ismail): Mr. Chairman, Sir, I beg bersangkutan yang mengidap penyakit to move that Head 31, amounting to ini. $928, 105, stand part of the Schedule. As is stated in Command Paper Dato' Ong Yoke Lin: Mr. Chair­ No. 51 of 1961, the amount is required man, Sir, I would like to inform the to acquire land on the Stadium Hill, Honourable Member for Bachok that which will be a virtual acropolis for the campaign is now only in its Kuala Lumpur in the years to come, initial stage where we are training the because this place contains the staff, improving and extending T.B. Merdeka Stadium, which is the centres in the various States and national symbol of independence, the districts. We also fully realise-and I Tunku Abdul Rahman Park, the have said so in this House before-­ Chin Woo Stadium and the Victoria that tuberculosis cases are not, as Institution. All these are associated many people seem to think, confined with sports and culture and it will be to the overcrowded areas in the towns. most inappropriate to construct resi­ There are a good proportion of tuber­ dential accommodation right in the culosis cases in the rural areas. As centre of these public places which soon as the stage of training of staff now form one of the main attractions is progressing well, then the work will in Kuala Lumpur. Construction of the be further extended into the rural Stadium Negara will enforce the fore­ areas-mainly in the rural areas as well going statement, apart from the great as in the urban areas we will emphasise shortage of open spaces in the middle the preventive side, that is the B.C.G. of the town. vaccination for babies and for pre­ school going children. Question put, and agreed to. In reply to the Honourable Member The sum of $928,105 for Head S. 31 for Temerloh, I will look into his ordered to stand part of the Schedule. request that concession tickets be given Heads S. 41 and S. 42- to tuberculosis sufferers to go for treatment. But I know, that the The Minister of Internal Security Malayan Association for the Preven­ (Dato' Dr. Ismail): Mr. Chairman, Sir, tion of Tuberculosis spends over a with your permission, I would like to million dollars a year for purposes move that Head S. 41 totalling · such as the case quoted by the $149,680 and Head S. 42 totalling $20 Honourable Member. The Social stand part of the Schedule. I do not Welfare Services Lotteries Board gives propose to give further explanation, annually a grant of about $900,000 to because they are well explained in the Malayan Association for the Command Paper No. 51 of 1961. Prevention of Tuberculosis and some Question put, and agreed to. little time ago I think half the proceeds of one lottery, which amounted to The sum of $149,700 for Heads S. 41 $250,000, was also given to the and S. 42 ordered to stand part of M.A.P.T.B. So, the M.A.P.T.B. is the Schedule. co-operating very well with the Govern­ Heads S. 55, 56 and 60- ment in this national tuberculosis campaign. The Minister of Transport (Dato' Sard.on bin Haji Jubir): Tuan Yang Question put, and agreed to. di-Pertua, dengan kebenaran Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya minta Kepala 55, The sum of $150,615 for Head 56 dan 60 di-jalankan dengan sa-kali S. 29 ordered to stand part of the gus. Kepala 55 minta timbangan Schedule. wang sa-banyak $5,600 dan telah pun 3885 26 JANUARY 1962 3886 di-terangkan sebab2-nya dalam Com­ Statement here is fairly clear and I mand Paper 51 chuma saya menambah do not think much more need be said menguchapkan terima kaseh kapada about this. Ahli2 yang bekerjasama dalam Rail­ way Economic Commission. Kepala Mr. Chairman: Head 65 is under 56 Civil Aviation sa-bagaimana yang you also. Would you like to move telah di-terangkan itu oleh kerana them together? hendak membuka Padang Kapal Dato' V. T. Sambanthan: Yes, Sir. Terbang baharu Kuala Trengganu Shall I move it separately or together kerana hendak menambahkan kaki­ again? tangan-nya bagi menjaga di-kawasan itu. Mr. Speaker: You can move it now. Berkenaan dengan Kepala 60 telah Dato' V. T. Sambanthan: I also beg pun di-terangkan di-sana satu jumlah to move that Head 65, a token sum dan tidak payah-lah saya tambah lagi. of $10, be approved. Enche' Zulkiftee bin Muhammad: Enche' Zulkiftee bin Muhammad: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, berkenaan de­ Tuan Pengerusi, $153,986 ada-lah ngan Kepala 55 ini ia-itu di-minta harga 11 buah motor-car di-beli bagi kapada Yang Berhormat supaya menggantikan motor-car yang lama membelanjakan dan telah pun di­ bagi Menteri2 ini yang di-fikirkan belanjakan sa-banyak $5,600 dan tempat2 itu tidak-lah ekonomik. Saya penyata itu telah pun keluar di­ minta Menteri Yang Berhormat itu bukakan di-Dewan ini, saya suka­ satu sahaja, ada-kah pembelian motor­ lah supaya Menteri Yang Berhormat car wang sa-banyak $153,986 bagi 11 itu membuat Penyata-nya di-sini motor-car ini ada satu asas di­ bila Kerajaan hendak memberikan luluskan oleh pehak yang berkuasa pertimbangan2 di-atas pandangan ini atau pehak yang tertentu atau pun dan bila pula hal ini akan di-jalankan menurut. kehendak Menteri itu sahaja. bagi kebajikan perkhidmatan keretapi dalam negeri ini. Dato' V. T. Sambanthan: These cars are pretty old. The cars that were Dato' Sardon bin Haji Jubir: Tuan used before-the American cars-had Yang di-Pertua, saya menguchapkan run their lease of life. They are found terima kaseh kapada Wakil Bachok to be not only uneconomical but also ia-itu saya sendiri pun telah mendesak bad. Therefore, we felt that we have Kerajaan supaya apa segala pengakuan to change these cars and to replace yang elok itu dapat di-laksanakan them with good cars. tetapi ada satu bab berkenaan dengan kewangan saya minta-lah rakan saya Enche' Zulkiftee bin Muhammad: supaya memberikan timbangan yang Tuan Pengerusi, saya ta' hendak saksama supaya perkara itu dapat bangkitkan dua tiga kali dalam perkara di-jalankan dengan lebeh lekas lagi. ini tetapi yang saya hendak tahu, ada­ Saya akan siarkan kapada orang kah pembelian itu di-atas asas yang ramai bila dapat keputusan-nya kelak. telah di-tetapkan oleh satu2 pehak atau Menteri itu membeli motor-car Question put and agreed to. itu. Saya rasa kalau tidak keberatan The sum of $331,987 for Heads 55, Menteri lain pun boleh membeli-nya. 56 and 60 ordered to stand part of the Schedule. Dato' V. T. Sambanthan: Yes, Mr. Speaker. These cars were in fact Heads 63 and 65- subject to a check up by the Public Works Department and they them­ The Minister of Works, Posts and selves felt that they were of no more Telecommunications (Dato' V. T. economical value. Sambanthan): Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to move that Head 63, $201,787, stand Mr. Chainnan: That is not the part of the Schedule. The Explanatory reply. 3887 26 JANUARY 1962 3888 Dato' V. T. Sambanthan: May I Dato' V, T. Sambanthan: Sir, there have the question again, Sir? is no scale as such laid down for a Minister's car. I will take Mr. Chairman (To Enche' Zulkiflee): the Honourable Member's question You better speak in English. I am in two sections. One is, what is the sure you can do that (Laughter). policy relating to cars. The policy relating to cars is that, as with all Enche' Zulkiftee: But it is my Government vehicles, when they prove policy not to speak in English here. to be uneconomical, we change them. Mr. Chairman: Never mind about Now, what type of cars are to be used by Ministers. We have no particular that. For the sake of the Minister. scale as to what type of cars are to Enche' Zulkiflee: Yes, Sir, for the be used for Ministers, but we try to sake of the Honourable Minister I stand by the normal range of cars­ will do my best. The question is say, the Chevrolet range, the Mercedes, whether those cars are bought in and such like-and we do not go accordance with certain policy laid to, say, the Cadillac range or the down by the Government, or are they Rolls Royce range. just bought in accordance with the Question put, and agreed to. wishes of the Ministers themselves. Have you a scale as to what type of The sum of $201,787 for Head S. 63 motor-cars are to be bought for them? and the sum of $10 for Head S. 65 These are my questions, Sir. oredered to stand part of the Schedule. Dato' V. T. Sambanthan: Mr. Clauses 1 and 2 ordered to stand Speaker, Sir, this was the decision of part of the Bill. the Cabinet. These cars were old and Bill reported without amendment: the Cabinet felt that these cars had to read the third time and passed. be changed, because Ministers could not be going about in cars which break THE RUBBER RESEARCH down frequently. That really is the answer. INSTITUTE OF MALAYA BILL Enche' Zulkiflee: With due respect, Second Reading Sir, still I think he did not answer my The Assistant Minister of Com­ question. merce and Industry (Enche' Cheah Theam Swee): Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg Mr. Chairman: Have you any policy to move that a Bill intituled "an Act with regard to the purchasing of these to provide for the reconstitution of the cars? Rubber Research Institute of Malaya Dato' V. T. Sambanthan: Well, Sir, and for matters incidental thereto" be the policy of the Government is that read a second time. when the cars get old, we change As Hon'ble Members will note from them (Laughter). That really is the the explanatory statement attached to answer. the Bill, the Rubber Research Institute is at present constituted under the Enche' Zulkiflee: Yes. It is the Rubber Research Institute of Malaya policy of any individual that when his Enactment, 1934. With the setting up car gets old, he changes it; but the of the Malayan Rubber Fund Board question is whether you change it with in 1959, whereby control of the the same type of car or whether you research policy of the organisations change it with a better type of car. If financed by the Malayan Rubber Fund that is the case, what is the scale for a is now vested in the Malayan Rubber Minister's car? Have you any scale? Fund Board under the chairmanship If ·you do not have a scale; please of the Controller of Rubber Research, say that "We do not have a scale." it is now necessary for the Rubber 3889 26 JANUARY 1962 3890 Research Institute to be reconstituted which has been the legislation govern­ to fall in line with this major re- ing the functioning of the RR.I. until organisation. today. The Rubber Research Institute, In line with the reconstitution of the together with its sister organisations-­ Institute steps were taken to provide the Natural Rubber Producers Re­ the funds for the running of the search Association in Welyn Garden Institute to be secured on a firmer City near London and the Natural basis and in the same year the Rubber Rubber Bureau with its offices in the Regulation Enactment (which was major rubber consuming countries of introduced to implement the Inter­ the world-are financed principally national Rubber Regulation Agreement from a cess levied on exports of rubber of 1934) was brought into force. The from the Federation. The total expendi­ Malayan Rubber Fund (which was the ture of these organisations is of the forerunner of the present Malayan order of $12 million per annum. Rubber Fund) came into existence, and with this financial stability, the The Rubber Research Institute of Institute was able to build up an Malaya has had a long and chequered adequate specialist staff and emphasis history. It will be interesting to relate was given for the first time to the that it had its origin in 1926 with a establishment of advisory services for Director and a nucleus of scientists rubber smallholders. Major capital which included the scientific staff developments, the building of modern formerly employed in Malaya by the laboratories and the extension of the Rubber Growers Association and a R.R.I. Experimental Station at Sungei scientist seconded from the Department Bulah were undertaken forthwith. of Agriculture. In 1928, the Institute From 1935, there followed a period secured an area of 2,000 acres in the of orderly and fruitful development of Sungei Bulah forest reserve for the the Institute, such development gaining opening up of an experimental momentum with each year until the station. The work of the Institute had outbreak of the war in 1939. With hardly begun when, in the world-wide the Japanese occupation in 1941 the depression of the early 30's, the rubber work of the R.R.I. suffered another producing industry suffered a major set back-a great deal of damage was set-back. During that period, expendi­ done. irreplaceable records were lost, ture on research was reduced followed equipments were spoilt, and much of by a consequent retrenchment of staff the continuity of field experimental and reduction in salaries and the work work was lost. of the Institute came to a near stand­ still. In 1949, following a period of rehabilitation and reconstruction, a With the gradual improvement five-year programme, which provided following the economic recovery, for the expansion of all services rubber producers in Malaya, impressed financed by the Malayan Rubber by the notable advances in rubber Fund, was launched. The adoption of plantation practices made in Java and the five-year research programme Sumatra, called for a thorough together with the Government's finan­ re-appraisal of the organisation and cial guarantee enabled the R.R. I. to work of the Rubber Research Institute. expand and gave the Institute the A commission was appointed in 1933 much-needed stability. Recruitment of and as a result of the commission's qualified staff was intensified and recommendations, notable changes long-term fundamental research was were made in the constitution, embarked upon with a much greater management and direction of the degree of confidence than had been work of- RR.I. and these were provided in the past. Today, the embodied in the Rubber Research Institute has six main divisiens at its Institute of Malaya Enactment, 1934, Headquarters in Kuala Lumpur and -an 3891 26 JANUARY 1962 3892 experimental station at Sungei Buloh at under-graduate and post-graduate covering an area of about 3,000 acres. levels to Malayans to do specialised training both in Malaya and overseas I need hardly say that through the in order to equip themselves to fill skill, initiative and perseverance of the highest posts in the Institute. In the staff of the Institute, it has been future, only where suitably qualified able to build up over the years a Malayans are not available will fund of scientific knowledge on rubber expatriates be employed and that will research which is second to none in be done only on short term contracts the world. The R.R.I. is today acknow­ but in exceptional cases where the ledged as one of the world's leading efficiency of the Institute is likely to institutions on rubber research, and its be affected, vacancies may be filled scientific and other officers have made by expatriates on a long term basis. notable impressions not only in inter­ As a first step, a new post of Deputy national scientific forums but also in Director (Administration) has been industry and commerce the world created in the Institute which will be over. Many of the technical officers filled by a Malayan. He will assume have made their skills and experiences responsibility for administration of available to other natural rubber the Institute and relieve the Director producing countries. of much of the routine administrative With the changes in the post-war work of the Institute. position of the natural rubber industry Mr. Speaker, Sir, the new features as a result of the introduction and in the Bill are- phenomenal expansion of the synthetic rubber industry, both the Government Firstly, the composition of the new and the Industry are keenly aware that Board of the Rubber Research Institute of Malaya provides for a more balanced rubber research must proceed with the distribution between Government and utmost vigour if natural rubber industry representatives; producers are to maintain a fair share of the world's expanding demand for Secondly, the authority of the Board of the Rubber Research Institute to new rubber. It is hoped, therefore, consider and approve the budget of the that with the re-constitution of the Institute has been transferred to the Institute as envisaged in the Bill Malayan Rubber Fund Board. It is the coupled with the provision of adequate duty of the new Board, however, to ensure that expenditure is in accordance financial resources, the Institute will with the estimates approved by the be able to embark on a more vigorous Malayan Rubber Fund Board; programme of research in the crucial years ahead. Thirdly, decisions relating to salaries and terms of appointment of the Director and the senior staff of the Institute is I am aware that it is necessary to now vested in the Malayan Rubber Fund maintain the high standards of Board; efficiency of the RR.I. and conse­ quently the need to keep a highly And lastly, the Director and Deputy Directors of the Institute are now trained and experienced staff. Never­ appointed by the Minister on the recom­ theless, it is equally desirable to build mendations of the Malayan Rubber Fund up a reservoir of Malayans with Board after consultation with the Co­ scientific skills who will be able in due ordinating Advisory Committee. course to run the Institute. I am glad I would like to emphasise here to be able to announce that a that there was very close consultation programme for Malayanisation of the with the Rubber Producers Council R.R.I. has been formulated which has a.nd the Malayan Rubber Fund Board as its policy the immediate cessation during the drafting of this Bill, and I of all appointments of expatriate am glad to say that these bodies officers on permanent terms, the representing the rubber industry have gradual replacement of existing agreed to this Bill in every detail. expatriate staff with Malayan officers and the provision of scholarships both Sir, I beg to move. 3893 26 JANUARY 1962 3894 1be Minister of Commerce and expatriate officers, and who can take Industry (Enche' Mohamed Khir over the administration of the various .Johari): Sir, I beg to second the Departments and administer them most motion. efficiently. And yet the Minister con­ cerned has not put forward any Enche' Tan Phock Kin: Mr. Speaker, methods whereby a serving officer, who Sir, I would like to touch on one very has the qualifications and who is in a important aspect of the speech given position to take over, can be appointed by the Honourable Assistant Minister to that position. So, I put it to the of Commerce and Industry. As Mem­ Minister that as far as Malayanisation bers of this House are quite aware, is concerned no positive effort is being the Rubber Research Institute of made whatsoever. It is a well-known Malaya can be said to be a special fact that in some Departments like the reserve for the expatriates. Local Smallholders Advisory Service, like officers, Malayan officers, working in the Estates Advisory Service. local the Rubber Research Institute are most officers are in a position to take over dissatisfied and are most frustrated. from expatriate officers-and it is no The Assistant Minister has mentioned use paying lip-service to the question here that among other things it is very of Malayanisation by merely saying important to create a reservoir of that "we are going to adopt a pro­ Malayans, who can eventually take gressive method on Malayanisation" over the running of the Rubber while actually doing nothing about it. Research Institute. These are very fine words, but let us examine the policy Another matter which has given rise with regard to Malayanisation in to concern among the employees of respect of which the Minister took the R.R.1.-and it is a matter which great pains to explain to us. is driving a lot of employees to seek What is actually happening in the employment outside the R.R.I. in R.R.I.? It is stated here that they are private mercantile firms-is the rather adopting a progressive policy of inequitable method of the salary Malayanisation by a system of scholar­ schemes. If we study the salary ships and by a system of recruiting schemes of the R.R.I.. we will note expatriates should local officers not be that they have a very peculiar system available. However. my point here is of what they describe as "A" Scheme this. If we understand the term and "B" Scheme. Let me ask the "Malayanisation" correctly, Malayani­ Minister, "How do you judge that a sation does not mean that one has to person should be in the "A" Scheme wait for an expatriate to reach his or in the "B" Scheme-is it because term of service, to reach his retiring of his qualifications or is it because of age. If we do that, it is not Malayani­ degrees and other qualifications?" If sation, as a Malayan succeeds to a we study the Report of the R.R.I., we post by virtue of the fact that an will discover that there are some expatriate has retired and the post is expatriate officers without any academic not specially Malayanised. qualifications whatsoever. without any degrees, without any diplomas, who On the question of Malayanisation, are put on the "A" Scheme for the I put it to the Minister concerned simple reason that they are expatriates. that no positive effort is made to This is a legacy of the past. and I Malayanise. Can the Minister tell this see no reason why the present Govern­ House honestly that there are no local ment. which is an independent Govern­ officers, senior officers, who are in a ment. should adopt the same old position to take over? I am sure the policy without doing anything about Minister, if he is honest, cannot deny it, whereas at the same time we find to this House that at the present a number of Malayan officers with moment there are Malayan officers in very good academic qualifications­ the R.R.I. who are qualified, and in and quite a number of them have even some cases better qualified than serving higher qualifications than those of ~---- "~ ------.....-

3895 26 JANUARY 1962 3896

expatriates-being placed on the "B" bergantong kapada basil getah-nya. Scheme. What is the Government Kalau-lah sa-kadar kita mengadakan doing about it? They have done penyiasatan2 sahaja sa-bagaimana practically nothing, in spite of the fact tujuan Undang2 di-dalam Fasal 11, that they have been in power for the cheraian 3, saya berasa kita mungkin past few years. These are matters menghadapi kechiwaan bagi negeri ini which should be looked into in any dengan sebab kemajuan synthetic re-organisation of any body or of any rubber yang kita tengok dalam dunia statutory corporation. In the interests ini mengugut keadaan basil getah of justice and in the interests of kita. Dunia dengan keadaan-nya ada eventually developing into a position sekarang ini sa-makin maju dalam whereby Malayans can eventually bahagian kimia dan kemajuan2 yang succeed expatriate officers, the lain bahawa perusahaan getah dengan primary duty of the Government is yang pada kita sekarang ini akan ke­ to see to it that as far as conditions tinggalan kalau tidak-lah kita daripada of employment are concerned, as far bahagian research ini berusaha bukan as promotions are concerned, there is sahaja menyiasat tetapi menyediakan justice in them and that a person fomula yang baharu bagi getah kita will be promoted in accordance with ini walau beberapa banyak sa-kali pun his ability and in accordance with his ada-nya getah synthetic yang di-hasil­ qualifications. kan di-tempat2 lain. Bahawa dengan • ada-nya formula dengan basil getah I am afraid that as far as the kita keluarkan di-sini bahawa formula R.R.I. is concerned, this pre-requisite yang akan di-sediakan itu tidak-lah is absent. We know very well that as menewaskan dan merosakkan keadaan far as the R.R.I. is concerned, ex­ basil ekonomi kita yang bergantong patriates have a very favourable kapada basil getah negeri ini. • position due to past legacy, and due to the fact that the organisation as Jadi, saya berharap pehak Kemen­ such is run by expatriates. I would like terian yang berkenaan menjalankan to urge the Minister concerned to look itu bersama dengan mengadakan into this matter and to devise ways penyiasatan dan membentok formula and means, whereby he can give this yang boleh mengatasi perlawanan matter the consideration it deserves. dengan synthetic rubber, bagaimana Unless and until this is done, I am synthetic rubber boleh menjatohkan afraid the question of Malayanisation natural rubber maka natural rubber will be a very slow process. The menyediakan formula yang sa-suai Minister may have all his objects of dengan perkembangan ekonomi ber­ Malayanising the R.R.1., but if this dasarkan dengan perkara2 yang saperti fundamental grievance is not being itu. remedied, I am afraid more and more local officers will resign from the Enche' K. Karam Singh: Mr. R.R.I., and I cannot blame them for Speaker. Sir, this is to carry on the doing so. views expressed by my Honourable friend from Tanjong. We have been Dr. Burhanuddin bin Mohd. Noor given to understand that local officers, (Besot): Tuan Yang di-Pertua, pehak who are at present serving under Yang Berhormat · Kementerian ini expatriates in the R.R.I., are not being ada menyebutkan berkenaan dengan taught the jobs by the expatriates. synthetic rubber dan tujuan2 R.R.I. Mr. Speaker, Sir, it is most necessary ini untok menjalankan usaha that in this very vital Institute those penyiasatan yang lebeh berkesan people at the top, who happen to be lagi daripada yang sudah2. Ini expatriates at the moment, should tentu-lah satu langkah yang baik co-operate unselfishly with the local bagi kemajuan negeri ini. Tetapi saya Malayan officers who are beneath suka hendak menarek perhatian lagi them, so that in course of time they kerana ekonomi negeri ini sangat-lah will be properly trained to take over "'•

3897 26 JANUARY 1962 3898 the reins of the Rubber Research concerned. even without the Socialist Institute in their own hands. Sir, we Front voicing their voice, as they voice this view so that the Govern­ usually do all over the place, we are ment will remove one more impedi­ quite aware of the necessity-at least ment in the path of full Malayanisation on the question of national pride-and of the Rubber Research Institute. of course bearing in mind not to impede the efficiency of the R.R.I. at The Minister of Commerce and In­ any time we will adopt a progressive dustry (Enche' Mohd. Khir bin Johari): policy of Malayanisation. Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya hendak menjawab apa Yang Berhormat dari Question put, and agreed to. Besut tadi berkenaan dengan shor-nya tentang usaha memajukan getah asli Bill accordingly read a second time itu. Memang itu-lah dasar-nya yang and committed to a Committee of the di-jalankan oleh pehak R.R.I. dan whole House. 2 juga pehak di-London sana. House immediately resolved itself Berkenaan dengan perkara2 lain into a Committee on the Bill. maka saudara saya akan menjawab- Bill considered in Committee. nya. (Mr. Speaker in the Chair) Enche' Cheah Theam Swee: Mr. ~ Chairman, Sir, I think I need not deal Clauses 1 to 15 inclusive ordered with the points raised by the leader of to stand part of the Bill. the PMIP as my Minister has already Bill reported without amendment: dealt with them. read the third time and passed. As regards the points raised by the Sitting suspended at 12.00 noon. Honourable Member for Tanjong and the Honourable Member for Daman­ Sitting resumed at 4.30 p.m. sara, they seem to be alike-there is no doubt about that and I will lump (Mr. Speaker in the Chair) them together in my reply. The Honourable Member for Tanjong SEATING OF MEMBERS obviously did not get his facts right­ Mr. Speaker: Honourable Members, perhaps his brief did not contain all the Honourable the Minister of what the dissatisfied few in the R.R.I. Internal Security this morning raised would care to give him. He pointed the question of the seating of Members out that the appointments to Division in this Chamber, and, in particular, A and B is a matter of concern to the seating of Ministers, and I think him. I would like to make it clear to I should say a few words to clarify this House that in the case of Divi­ the matter. sion A officers, applicants require an Honours Degree to begin with and 10 The House will be aware that under years post-graduate experience. Where Standing Order 2, the Speaker-I these qualifications are filled, then quote-"may allot a seat to every Malayans with such qualifications are member and may vary such allotment usually appointed direct to Division A; from time to time, as he may think and where such qualifications are not fit." Such an allotment was made filled-usually the lack of the require­ on my instructions soon after the ment of 10 years post-graduate inauguration of Parliament in 1959, experience-they are appointed to and remains in force at present. It is Division B according to the terms of quite correct, however, as the Honour­ their appointment and then when the able Minister of Internal Security has qualification of 10 years post-graduate pointed out, that Ministers do not experience is obtained they are usually have specific places allotted to them. promoted to Division A. As far as .the That was done in accordance with the Malayanisation policy in the R.R.I. is practice in the British House of -""""--~-·------··-- ---·------~---·---~------

3899 26 JANUARY 1962 3900 Commons and of other Parliaments of It is a sad comment on this, the the Commonwealth, where it is usually twentieth century, that man's in­ left to Ministers themselves to arrange humanity to man shows every sign of in what order they shall take their increasing rather than decreasing. In places in the Chamber in order of consequence, when we see a body of seniority after the Prime Minister. men and women voluntarily working That is what has actually happned in together to assist in raising standards fact. of health, to carry out humanitarian works, to mitigate the evils of today, Such being the case, I think it is we cannot but encourage them. both desirable and convenient for all concerned for Ministers, whenever it This Bill seeks to give legal recogni­ falls to their lot to conduct public tion and status to the Red Cross business in this Chamber, to do so Society in this country by making it from their accustomed places. a Corporation.

EXEMPTED BUSINESS l do not think I need dwell at great length on the history of the Red Cross (MOTION) Movement, whose humanitarian deeds are recognised throughout the civilised Tun Haji Abdul Razak: Tuan Yang world. For centuries, attempts have di-Pertua, saya mohon menchadang­ been made by nations and by indivi­ kan ia-itu perjalanan Majlis Meshuarat duals to mitigate the horrors of war, berkenaan dengan urusan Kerajaan but it was not until about a hundred pada hari ini akan di-kechualikan 2 years ago that a Swiss gentleman, one daripada sharat Peratoran Meshuarat Henri Dunant, witnessed the battle of 12 (1) sa-hingga pukul 10.30 malam Solferino. He was so horrified at the ini. carnage and the suffering of the Dato' Dr. Ismail: Tuan Yang di­ wounded that he devoted the Pertua, saya sokong. remainder of his life and his entire fortune, to establishing an international ·Question put, and agreed to. society to secure the welfare of all people, of all races and creeds, both Resolved, in time of peace and in time of war. That the proceedings of the House in So was born the International Red respect of Government business this day Cross. May I say here, Sir, that the shall be exempted from the provisions red cross symbol has nothing-I em­ of Standing Order 12 (1) until 10.30 p.m. phasise "nothing"-to do whatsoever with the Christian religion or, for that THE MALAYAN RED CROSS matter, with any other religion. It is SOCIETY (INCORPORATION) basically the Swiss flag with colours BILL reversed-the White Cross on the red background became the red cross on Second Reading a white background as a tribute to Henri Dunant and his nation­ Dato' Ong Yoke Lin: Mr. Speaker, Switzerland. The Red Cross emblem Sir, I beg to move that a Bill intituled is intended to be international and "an Act to incorporate the Malayan neutral and to signify one thing only Red Cross Society and for purposes i.e. respect for the individual who connected therewith" be read a second suffers and is defenceless, who must time. be aided, whether friend or enemy without distinction of nationality, Sir, it is my privilege and pleasure race or religion. to invite Honourable Members to accord a second reading to this Bill, So, as time went on, many nations which has already passed through all organiMed their own national Red stages in another place. Cross in the framework of the Inter- '~·l

3901 26 JANUARY 1962 3902 national organisation. Britain was one and an addition to the services of the earliest to do this, and naturally rendered by the Government. encouraged the formation of Branch societies in the colonial or dependent I, therefore, commend this Bill to territories. Thus it happened that the the House. In doing so, I would Malayan Red Cross Society was a appeal to the entire nation to support branch of the British parent body. this society. It needs money for its With the achievement of Merdeka, great work, and I appeal to all the Federation of Malaya Branch concerned to give generously whenever decided to set up on its own and to appeals are made by the Federation continue the excellent work which had of Malaya Red Cross Society. Even been done before. This Bill will now more important, however, is the ques­ give the Society its corporate status. tion of personal service: I would urge more citizens to join the Red Cross I should like to refer Honourable as active members. I am sure that the Members to the purposes of the spare time which they sacrifice will be Society, which are set out in Clause 5 its own reward-perhaps the greatest of the Bill. It is stated in Clause 5 reward ·of all-in serving others. May as follows: I also pay a warm tribute to all those who, in the past, have laid the founda­ "The purposes of the Corporation shall tions of the present Society? Their be- splendid work in the past is the ( a) in time of peace or war, to carry challenge to us for the future: but it on and assist in work for is a challenge which we Malayans are the improvement of health, the prepared to meet. prevention of disease and the mitigation of suffering throughout Sir, I beg to move. the world;" (b) in time of war, to furnish Dato' Sardon bin Haji Jubir: Sir, voluntary aid to the sick and I beg to second the motion. wounded both of armies and non-belligerents, to prisoners of Enche' Zulkiftee bin Muhammad: war and to civilian sufferers from Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya sendiri the effect of war, in accordance mengalu2kan Rang Undang2 ini, dan with the spirit and condition of di-dalam menerima Rang Undang2 ini the Geneva convention for the saya mengingatkan bahawa pada satu amelioration of the condition of masa dahulu saya ada bertanya the wounded and sick in armed berkenaan dengan sama ada mungkin forces in the field, signed at Geneva on the twelfth day of bahawa Red Cross ini di-gantikan August, nineteen hundred and menjadi Bulan Sabit, tetapi Kerajaan forty-nine; telah menjawab perkara itu tidak bagitu mustahak. Dan pada hari ini (c) to perform all the duties devolved 2 upon a national society by each dengan ada-nya Rang Undang ini nation which has acceded to the tentu-lah di-maksudkan bahawa said Convention. Pasokan · Palang Merah Malaya ini akan berjalan dengan sifat asal-nya. So, Sir, the essence of the Society is Sunggoh pun, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, that it is composed of volunteers, who tidak-lah menjadi soal sangat kapada are not paid by Government although kita tentang rupa dengan ada-nya the Government does give a measure Bab 4 dari Rang Undang2 ini yang of financial support to the Society; it mengatakan bahawa tujuan bagi is not, therefore, under Government pcrtubohan Perbadanan ini ia-lah control. As Minister of Health I would untok memberi satu pertubohan yang not wish it to be under my control­ terbuka dengan tidak ada perbezaan my knowledge of it enables me to say di-atas asas ugama, bangsa dan with complete confidence that its politik kapada semua orang di-Perse­ independent activities are of the most kutuan Tanah Melayu ini. Ini, Tuan beneficial nature and are an adjunct Yang di-Pertua, ada-lah satu asas W!Clt(¥ ------~------~----

f 3903 26 JANUARY 1962 3904 yang laju yang saya berharap di-dalam (Mr. Speaker in the Chair) pelaksanaan-nya akan di-perhatikan dengan sunggoh2 oleh mereka yang Clauses I to 13 inclusive ordered to bertugas dalam Pasokan Palang stand part of the Bill. Merah Malaya. Jangan satu masa pun Bill reported without amendment: di-gunakan atau di-isharatkan peng­ read the third time and passed. gunaan Perbadanan negeri ini bagi maksud lain dari maksud yang berseh THE GENEVA CONVENTIONS ini. Sa-kira-nya berlaku sa-suatu yang BILL menunjokkan demikian. maka tujuan baik dan berseh yang ada pada Second Reading Pasokan Palang Merah Malaya ini akan dengan sendiri-nya hapus. Dato' Ong Yoke Lin: Mr. Speaker, Sir. I beg to move that a Bill intituled Oleh kerana tujuan-nya tepat Bab 4 "an Act to enable effect to be given dari Perbadanan ini menuju kapada to certain international conventions penubohan sa-buah Perbadanan _yang done at Geneva on the twelfth day of terbuka saya berharap di-ambil per­ August, nineteen hundred and forty­ hatian oleh Perbadanan ini supaya nine, and for purposes connected kegiatan2 yang di-sibarkan ka-kawasan therewith" be read a second time. yang jauh dari bandar supaya mereka Dato' Sardon bin Haji Jubir: Sir, I ini dapat menjalankan kerja yang beg to second the motion. kebajikan saperti yang di-tujukan oleh Perbadanan yang hendak kita luluskan The Minister of Justice (Tun Leong Undang2 pada hari ini. Yew Koh): Mr. Speaker, Sir, I do not think I need detain the House long Dato' Ong Yoke Lin: Mr. Speaker, over this Bill. Its bulk may appear Sir, as regards the point raised by the formidable. but, in fact, it does little Honourable Member for Bachok, I more than re-state the position which can give a categorical assurance that has existed in this country for half a the Federation of Malaya Red Cross century or more. Society will stick to the principles and objectives as enunciated in this Bill, The Geneva Conventions and the particularly in Clauses 4 and 5. International Red Cross are very closely allied, and their whole Sir, with regard to the request made existence is to mitigate the horrors of by the Honourable Member for war. For centuries, mankind has been Bachok made previously to change the plagued with warfare, some of which Red Cross to Red Crescent, I think may. perhaps. have been necessary or that matter ...... inevitable. Whatever may be the philosophical approach-whether we Enche' Zulkiflee: Sir, on a point of condone or connive warfare-the fact explanation, in fact. I did not mention remains that much of the attendant that. human suffering is totally unnecessary; and it behoves us to do our utmost Dato' Ong Yoke Lin: I am sorry. to reduce any such suffering. whether physical or mental. to the absolute Question put, and agreed to. minimum. Bill accordingly read a second time The four Geneva Conventions of and committed to a Committee of the 1949 are set out in the Bill between whole House. pages 7 and 122. I believe that their general terms will be familiar to all House immediately resolved itself Honourable Members. Basically. we into a Committee on the Bill. can say that the principal aims are to secure the welfare and health of those Bill considered in Committee. who are wounded; to guarantee, so far ,,,

3905 26 JANUARY 1962 3906 as is possible, the humane treatment of the Geneva Red Cross (Control of prisoners of war; to immunise from Use) Ordinance of 1959 which was military action hospitals, hospital ships, approved by the former Legislative ambulances and aid posts by prescrib­ Council after independence. This is no ing an international emblem for their new provision, but merely tidies up identification; and to prevent the our legislation. I do not think I need wanton destruction or misappropria­ once again stress that the Red Cross tion of property in the course of has nothing to do with religion-that hostilities. Honourable Members will point was made by my Honourable see that in Clause 3 (1) on pages 1 friend, the Minister of Health, when and 2 of the Bill, we ourselves he moved the Federation of Malaya declare that any grave breach of the Red Cross Society Bill. There has been conventions shall render the person some misunderstanding in the former responsible liable to a maximum of Legislative Council, and more recently life imprisonment (if the breach has in another place, on this score. All resulted in the loss of life) or fourteen we wish is to protect a symbol which years for any other contravention. is used by most nations, most creeds The grave breaches are set out in the and most races to identify establish­ various conventions, and I quote ments or persons who are to be free their general purport: from physical attack in the course of "Wilful killing, torture or inhuman their humanitarian work. Obviously, if treatment; each nation decides on its own symbol Use of prisoners in connection with there will be a multitude of symbols biological experiments; (Hitler's hench­ which can only cause confusion. I men killed innumerable thousands of might mention that I have been prisoners and internees in the name of informed by the Red Cross Society medical experiments); that the vast majority of the Muslim Forced labour and imprisonment of nations use the Red Cross rather protected persons; than the Red Crescent for exactly Denial of the right of trial; that reason-the avoidance of confu­ sion. Taking of hostages; Wanton destruction or appropriation I, therefore, commend this Bill to of property." this House and hope it will receive the I have named only a few of these same approval and endorsement as severe breaches, and I am sure was accorded to it recently in another Honourable Members will definitely place. agree that a nation which condones Enche' Zulkiftee bin Muhammad: such breaches can only put itself Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya tidak-lah beyond the pale in world society. berhajat hendak mencheritakan pen­ What we are now legislating is dirian saya berkenaan dengan ini oleh something we have always taken for sebab perkara ini dapat di-agakkan. granted in the past; legislation, in fact, Saya suka supaya Menteri Yang existed before independence but was Berhormat dapat memerhatikan satu in the form of an Act of the British perkara di-dalam Bab 9 daripada Parliament, which as protecting power Undang2 ini, sebab kita maseh di­ was responsible for these humanitarian dalam Jawatan-Kuasa lagi. Dalam measures. Now that we are indepen­ Bab 9 di-nyatakan bahawa ada-lah dent, it is obviously only right and salah bagi sa-siapa pun dengan proper that we should enact our own tidak mendapat kebenaran daripada legislation, and I now invite this House Menteri untok menggunakan maksud2 to do this thing. perniagaan atau perdagangan bagi apa2 maksud pun menggunakan apa2 Finally, may I tum to Part III of tanda yang mengandongi design the Bill on pages 6 and 7? We have emblem dan sa-bagai-nya-A, B dan written into this Bill the provisions of C. Tuan Yang di-Pertua, ini ada-lah ,,,.,...... ,.,. --~-·---~---~---·~·-~------~---- -~---·---

3907 26 JANUARY 1962 3908 satu sharat yang baik dan bertujuan Jadi, chara yang sa-macham ini supaya menchegah orang2 mengguna­ nampak-lah kapada orang ramai kan tanda2 tersebut bagi kepentingan bahawa jika tanda itu bukan kerja2 mereka itu tetapi yang susah-nya saya yang di-buat oleh Red Cross, fikir di-zaman moden ini ada-lah ma'ana-nya menggunakan tanda itu kerana penalty yang di-buat di-Bab 10 bukan tujuan Red Cross maka Red yang ada di-dalam Undang2 ini ada­ Cross akan menchegah-nya supaya lah: tanda atau emblem itu jangan di­ pergunakan atau di-permainkan oleh ''10 (1) If any person contravenes any orang ramai. J adi, saya memang-lah of the provisions of this Part of this Act, bersetuju fine itu kechil bukan-lah kita he shall, subject to the provisions of section 11 be guilty of an offence and hendak memberi fine yang lebeh tetapi liable on conviction to a fine not exceed­ supaya orang ramai mengambil per­ ing one hundred dollars and to forfeit hatian ia-itu symbol Red Cross itu any goods upon or in connection with tidak boleh di-gunakan sa-lain dari­ which the emblem, design or words, as pada badan Red Cross sahaja. Pada the case may be, was or were used". fikiran saya orang ramai tentu tahu 2 Tuan Yang di-Pertua, $100 pada dan juga kedai saperti yang di-katakan zaman moden ini tidak mahal walau sa-orang doctor menggunakan symbol pun ada buroh2 yang tidak dapat $100 Red Cross kalau di-ketahui' oleh 2 Medical Association tentu-lah doctor tetapi bagi orang hendak menjalankan itu akan di-ambil tindakan. Jadi, Red perdagangan dan perusahaan sa-kali Cross ada-lah memperliharakan symbol dia dapat menggunakan emblem atau itu untok tujuan Red Cross sahaja. design bagi Perbadanan Palang Merah ini dia akan mendapat untong yang Question put, and agreed to. banyak. Tuan Yang di-Pertua, bukan­ lah soal for future atau soal $100 Bill accordingly read a second time tetapi soal kesalahan sa-saorang itu and committed to a Committee of the menggunakan tujuan2 yang lohor whole House. atau tujuan yang ikhlas dan baik yang di-tubohkan oleh persatuan House immediately resolved itself international. Pada pandangan saya into a Committee on the Bill. ini ada-lah satu kesalahan dan saya Bill considered in Committee. suka-lah menarek perhatian Menteri Yang Berhormat ini memikirkan (Mr. Speaker in the Chair) bahawa orang2 yang berlaku saperti ini dan kemungkinan berlaku-nya saya Clauses I to 13 inclusive ordered rasa tidak-lah terlalu jauh orang2 ini to stand part of the Bill. melakukan saperti ini daripada pem­ balasan yang akan dia dapat lebeh First Schedule, Second Schedule, besar dan sa-kira-nya Menteri Yang Third Schedule and Fourth Schedule Berhormat ini mernikirkan ini saya ordered to stand part of the Bill. rasa ada-lah lebeh memberi keuntong­ Bill reported without amendment: an kapada Perbadanan ini. read the third time and passed. Dato' Dr. Ismail bin Dato' Abdul Rahman: tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya mE RAILWAY (AMENDMENT) suka menompang menjawab soalan BILL Ahli Yang Berhormat dari Bachok itu. Memang benar apa yang di-katakan Second Reading itu, ia-itu benda yang akan orang The Minister of Transport (Dato' gunakan untok faedah yang terlampau Sardon bin Haji Jubir): Mr. Speaker, kechil. Tetapi saya fikir tujuan bagi Sir, I beg to move that a Bill intituled Red Cross sa-kira-nya pekerjaan ''an Act to amend the Railway macham itu di-dapati maka ia akan Ordinance, 1958" be read a second di-bawa ka-Mahkamah dan di-denda. time......

3909 26 JANUARY 1962 3910 Sir, the Bill is simple and straight­ arrangements were being made for forward. It seeks to provide repre­ bringing the Act into force some sentation for the Associated Malay practical difficulties were encountered Chambers of Commerce of Malaya on and these had to be overcome. The the Port Swettenham Board. The amendments proposed in this Bill will, existing section of the Ordinance, we hope, remove these difficulties which it seeks to amend, provides which would have impeded the smooth representation for the Federated administration of the new Act and also Malay States Chamber of Commerce, in some respects inconvenienced the the Associated Chinese Chambers of public. Commerce, and the Associated Indian Chambers of Commerce. I don't think I do not intend to take much of the I need say anything more, Sir. time of the House in detailed ex­ planation of the new clauses, the I beg to move. reason for which will be apparent from a reading of this Bill. The Assistant Minister of Rural Development (Tuan Haji Abdul Clause 2 provides an amendment Khalid): Sir, I beg to second the of Section 6 because the sub-section motion. as at present worded could lead to abuse, without, of course, the Question put. and agreed to. knowledge of the Government con­ Bill accordingly read a second time cerned, and would render more difficult and committed to a Committee of the the task of the Police who have to whole House. check to see that arms are carried with proper authority. Under the House immediately resolved itself present legislation, Government De­ into a Committee on the Bill. partments obtain from the Police a permit for members of their staff who Bill considered in Committee. in the course of their duty are required (Mr. Speaker in the Chair) to carry arms and there is no reason to believe that the present practice Clauses 1 and 2 ordered to stand causes inconvenience. The amendment part of the Bill. proposes in fact to leave things as they are at present. If in any circumstances Bill reported without amendment: exemption is required and a case is read the third time and passed. presented to me, I shall be happy to consider the application-for such THE ARMS (AMENDMENT) BILL cases Section 51 of the Act was designed. Second Reading The Minister of Internal Security An interim licence issued under (Dato' Dr. Ismail): Mr. Speaker, Sir, Section 14 gives to the holder the I beg to move that a Bill intituled same right of use of the arm as "an Act to amend the Arms Act, permanent licence, though of course 1960" be read a second time. for a limited period of one month only. Neither the Customs Department nor Sir, I regret that the Arms Act, the Treasury saw any need to be 1960, which was approved by the associated with the issue of such a House in June, 1960, has not yet been licence. On the other hand, the House brought into force. This is because will agree that it is important to much preparatory work had to be ensure that the issue of an interim completed, particularly in regard to licence is under fairly close control by the drafting of new forms which we the Chief Police Officer and the had to print for the first time in the amendment proposed. to Section 14 (4) national language as well as in English; will facilitate the exercise of this and also for the reason that when the control by the Chief Police Officer. - --~------~------

3911 26 JANUARY 1962 3912 The extension of the powers of that a Bill entitled "The Rubber delegation provided by Clause 4 of the Industry (Replanting) Fund (Amend­ Bill is to meet a practical need. Much ment) Act, 1962" be read a second of the work connected with the issue time. of registration licences under this Act is done by the Officer in Charge of the Sir, the Bill provides for two Police District and quite a large pro­ amendments to the Rubber Industry portion of the Officers in Charge of (Replanting) Fund Ordinance, 1952 Police Districts are not gazetted which are found to be necessary with officers. Without this amendment, the the introduction of the Rubber Export work would have to be distributed to Duty (Penang) Act, 1961 and the new other officers in the Contingent Section 13 (2) of the Financial Pro­ imposing an unnecessary burden on cedure Ordinance, 1957. them as well as delay the issue of The purpose of the amendment in licences and permits. Clause 2 is to enable a cess under Clause 5 introduces a new section Section 7 of the Rubber Industry to resolve the difficulty that will arise (Replanting) Fund Ordinance, 1952 to in those areas where the Police be levied on rubber exported from Contingent responsible jurisdiction Penang. At present, the replanting cess for administration does not coincide under Section 7 of the Ordinance is with the State boundary. The Cameron collected on rubber produced in Penang Highlands, for example, are in Pahang, and on rubber exported from the Federation other than Penang. but administered by the Perak Contin­ Previously, Penang rubber was not gent and there are a number of such subjected to payment of export duty areas. but with the introduction of the Sir, I beg to move. Rubber Export Duty (Penang) Act, 1961 which became effective from 1st Dato' Sardon bin Haji Jubir: Sir, January, 1962, rubber exported from I beg to second the motion. Penang now attracted duty at the same rate as that exported from the principal Question put, and agreed to. customs area of the Federation. Hence, Bill accordingly read a second time in order to enable the collection of and committed to a Committee of the replanting cess to be made legally, Section 7 of the Rubber Industry whole House. (Replanting) Fund Ordinance, 1952 House immediately resolved itself has to be amended to provide for the into a Committee on the Bill. replanting cess to be levied on rubber exported from Penang. Bill considered in Committee. The purpose of the amendment in (Mr. Speaker in the Chair) Clause 3 is to reword Sub-section (1) of Section 15 of the Ordinance to Clauses 1 to 5 inclusive ordered to conform to present practice. The stand part of the Bill. section as at present worded states Bill reported without amendment: that funds required for the purpose read the third time and passed. of the Government Rubber Replanting Schemes are charged on the revenues THE RUBBER INDUSTRY of the Federation. Under the Financial Procedure Ordinance, 1957 all Charged (REPLANTING) FUND Expenditure should be paid from the (AMENDMENT) BILL Consolidated Fund and accounted in Second Reading the Consolidated Revenue Account, unless a law allows it to be paid from The Assistant Minister of Commerce moneys accounted in the Consolidated and Industry (Enche' Cheah Theam Loan Account or the Consolidated Swee): Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to move Trust Account. At present, funds for 3913 26 JANUARY 1962 3914 the replanting schemes are made fahamkan ia-lah negeri Pulau Pinang, available from the Development Fund tetapi sa-benar-nya saya di-sabelah as these schemes are essentially of an Seberang Perai ada-kah orang di­ investment nature. But the Develop­ sabelah Seberang Perai termasok ment Fund is accounted in the gulongan Penang ini. Kalau dapat Consolidated Trust Account. In order Yang Berhormat Menteri Muda itu to regularise the present practice, it is menegaskan ma'ana atau erti-nya now proposed that the section be Pulau Pinang atau pun negeri Pulau amended so that funds required for Pinang. the replanting schemes should be paid from the Development Fund, and if Enche' Cheah Theam Swee: Mr. there is insufficient money in the Speaker, Sir, it is quite clear that when Development Fund, the expenditure you say "Penang" and also mention may be met from moneys account in that this is effective in those areas the Consolidated Revenue Account. outside the Customs Principal Area, The amendment is merely con­ then you must mean the Island of sequential and involves no change of Penang. policy or intention. The amendment Question put, and agreed to. has been made to take effect retrospectively from 1st January, 1961 Bill accordingly read a second time as this is the date of the coming into and committed to a Committee of the force of the amended Section 13 (2) whole House. of the Financial Procedure Ordinance, 1957. House immediately resolved itself into a Committee on the Bill. Sir, I would like to inform the House at this stage that I wish to move Bill considered in Committee. an amendment to Clause 3 of the Bill (Mr. Speaker in the Chair) during the Committee stage. My Ministry has been advised by the Clauses I and 2 ordered to stand Parliamentary Draftsman that Clause part of the Bill. 3 as it stands in the Bill needs to be reworded so that payments under Clause 3- Section 15 (1) of the Rubber Industry Enche' Cheah Theam Swee: Mr. (Replanting) Fund Ordinance, 1952 Chairman, Sir, I beg to move that will not be restricted to monies held Oause 3 be amended be deleting the for the credit of the Development whole of Clause 3 and substituting Board, since the Government is therefor the following new clause required to provide the whole of the which has been tabled in this monies under Section 15 (1). The House: rewording of Clause 3 of the Bill has been circulated to Honourable Mem­ "Amendment of Section 15. bers and I shall move for the adoption 3. The monies which are to be of the amended wording at the provided by the Government for the appropriate moment. purposes of Part III of the principal Ordinance shall be defrayed out of the Development Fund and, insofar as the Sir, I beg to move. monies, held for the credit of the Development Fund are insufficient, The Assistant Minister of Labour from monies held· in the Consolidated (Enche' V. Manickavasagam): Sir, I Fund, and accordingly, for the words beg to second the motion. 'and are hereby charged upon the revenues of the Federation' appearing in Sub-section (1) of Section 15 of the Tuan Haji Ahmad bin Saaid: principal Ordinance _ there shall be (Seberang Utara): Dato' Pengerusi, substituted the words 'defrayed out of saya ingin mendapat penjelasan dari­ the Development ·Fund and, insofar as pada Yang Berhormat Menteri Muda the monies held for the credit of the Develpoment Fund are insufficient for berkenaan dengan Bill ini di-sebutkan such payment, from monies held in the "Penang". Jadi Penang biasa-nya di- Consolidated Fund'." 3915 26 JANUARY 1962 3916 I do not think that it is necessary for will arrange your papers properly me to explain further, as I have already (Laughter). done so in my opening speech. Amendment put, and agreed to. Mr. Chairman: You should have Clause 3, as amended, ordered to done it at this stage-at the time when stand part of the Bill. you move the amendment. Would you repeat the reasons why. Bill reported with .amendment; read the third time and passed. Enche' Cheah Theam Swee: Mr. Chairman, Sir, as I have said earlier on, THE INTERNAL SECURITY the purpose of the re-wording of this (AMENDMENT) BILL Clause is that it is the considered opinion of the Parliamentary Drafts­ Second Reading man that, if it stands unamended, The Minister of Internal Security payment under Section. 15 (1) will not (Dato' Dr. Ismail): Mr. Speaker, Sir, be restricted to monies held for the I beg to move that a Bill intituled "an credit of the Development Fund since Act to amend the Internal Security the Government is required to provide Act, 1960" be read a second time. the whole of the monies under Section There are two amendments to the 15 (1). The amendment proposed will Internal Security Act, 1960, as regularise the procedure for which the proposed in this Bill and they are as amendment is intended, follows: Enche' Tan Phock Kin: Mr. Chair­ Firstly, Section 41A provides that the man, Sir, I have not seen the Minister charged with the responsibility notice of amendment. According to for internal security may by order our Standing Orders it says "at least direct a statutory body to refer the one day's notice of any proposed question of any appointment to that amendments shall wherever practicable body to him; and it also confers power be given"; and as far as I am aware, on him to veto an appointment which this thing has just been tabled a few is, in his opinion, prejudicial to the minutes ago. interests of the Federation. The pur­ pose of this section is to ensure the Enche' Cheah Theam Swee: Mr. exclusion, from the staff of a statutory Chairman, Sir. I think, it is the practice body. of persons with communist con­ and behaviour of the Socialist Front nections or other serious character Members to try and display their own defects. It is a necessary measure ignorance. I believe the proposed for safeguarding against subversion, amendment was tabled many days ago, espionage, leakage of information and and if the Socialist Front Members sabotage of vital installations. In view did not choose to look at their papers of the importance of statutory bodies tabled in this Parliament. surely, it is to the country and of their close no fault of ours (Lauf(hter). Further connection with the Government, it I think it is justifiable for me to is considered that similar security mention, since he referred to a slip of safeguards as are now adopted in paper, that that slip of paper pro­ respect of appointments to the Govern­ duced-held up by the Member for ment service should be applicable to Tanjong-does not concern this Bill these bodies. at all; it concerns the Life As­ surance (Compulsory Liquidation) Bill Sir, at this stage, I would like to (Laughter). take the opportunity to assure the House that it is never the intention Enche' Tan Phock Kin: For your of the Government to veto applications information, there is no paper at all. from candidates for appointment purely on political grounds. The provisions of Mr. Chairman: (To Enche' Tan this proposed amendment will, how­ Phock Kin): I hope in future you ever, be invoked against persons, who 3917 26 JANUARY 1962 3918 are considered to be a security threat Minister, who is answerable to this to the country, whatever their political House. affiliations. Sir, I beg to move. Secondly, Sir, in regard to Section 4 lB, provisions similar to the proposed Tun Haji Abdul Razak: Sir, I beg amendment were previously contained to second the motion. in the Education Ordinance of 1957- Enche' K. Karam Singh: Mr. Sub-section (4) of Section 59 of this Speaker, Sir, I stand here in this Ordinance provided that the Registrar, House today on behalf of my Party if he was satisfied at any time that a to oppose this undemocratic and school was being used for purposes dictatorial measure in no uncertain detrimental to the interests of the terms, becaus~ this evil measure that Federation, or of the public, or for the is proposed today has got very serious purpose of instruction that is detri­ consequences upon the rights of our mental to the interests of the public people. or of the pupils, or as a meeting place of an unlawful society, and that Mr. Speaker, Sir, a very simple circumstances so required, may study of the new Clause 41A, which declare the school to be unlawful and I will read now, will show the dangers such declaration could take effect that it poses and threatens to the forthwith. Before the repeal of the rights of our people. Sir, the new Education Ordinance, 1957, it was the Clause 41A reads as follows: intention of the Government to retain the provisions of Sub-section (4), "(l) Where any written law confers any power relating to any appointment upon Section 59, in the Education Act, any person, body or authority constituted 1961. However, on adivce, this Sub­ under such law, the Minister may by section was omitted from the Educa­ order require that before making any tion Act, 1961, as it was felt that it appointment, that person, body or would be more appropriate in the authority shall submit to him- Internal Security Act, in view of the (a) a list of the names of the persons fact that the subject matter of the from whom such appointment will sub-section related mainly to subver­ be made; and sion. Thus it can be seen that the (b) such other information as may be purpose of this amendment is not to specified in the order. seek new power, but merely to transfer (2) Such person, body or authority the power to order the immediate shall not appoint or recruit any person whose appointment is in the opinion of closing down of a school-which could the Minister prejudicial to the interests have been retained in the Education of the Federation. Act of 1961-to the Internal Security (3) No person otherwise than in the Act. It may also be pointed out that course of his official duty shall disclose under the Education Ordinance, 1957, to any person any communication which this power was exercisable by a he may have received from the Minister Registrar of Schools, and under that under Sub-section (2)." law he exercised his power by Mr. Speaker, Sir, by asking this declaring the school to be unlawful House to sanction this new Clause 4 lA, and striking it off the Register, whereby the Minister is asking this House to the school ceased to exist as such. give him powers of victimisation of It is felt that the closing of public honest people seeking promotions institutions such as a school is a under any body lawfully constituted matter of grave public concern and, in this country. The Minister is seeking therefore, it would be more appropriate powers to veto those candidates, whom that the closure of such an institution his Party does not like, from being could be only for so long as circum­ appointed to a particular post. Sir, stances require and that the power to we know that the words "to the c.Iose it should be conferred on a interests of the Federation" mean one 3919 26 J ANDARY 1962 3920 thing in the language of the Alliance him, but it is the neutral people who Government: they mean "to the are in the service of this country, interests of the Alliance Party". So, who without regard to party politics any person who would be unwilling are trying their best without publicity to be a party tool of the Alliance to serve the interests of this country. Government will have forfeited forever Sir, in that light, we reject this any chances of promotion. Clause 41A. Mr. Speaker, Sir, here we have a Mr. Speaker, Sir, I now come to very secret procedure of getting names, Clause 41B which reads as follows: getting any information asked for, and "(I) The Minister, if he is satisfied at then backlisting certain persons, telling any time that a school or educational the persons in authority, under any institution is being used- body that has been constituted-and (a) for a purpose detrimental to the there are very many of them in our interests of the Federation or of country-that "So-and-so" and "So the public; or and so" shall not be promoted or (b) for the purpose of instruction appointed. This means that this detrimental to the interests of the Minister, whose utterances by no public or of the pupils; or means give confidence to the people (c) as a meeting-place of an unlawful of this country that they can expect society, fairness from him or his Government, is going to have absolute powers of and that the circumstances so require, may make an order closing such school blacklisting or blackballing anyone that or educational institution for such period, he or his party or, perhaps, anyone not exceeding six months at any one time, in his party does not like. So what as may be specified in the order." will we have? The entire machinery will be built up under the operation Mr. Speaker, Sir, the Honourable of this Clause 41A into a sycophantic Minister has just mentioned that this organisation, which will try to please provision was contained in the Edu­ the Minister in his every whim-and, cation Ordinance, and that it is being Sir, you will find that only that class transferred into the Internal Security of persons will get appointed, or will Act. If this clause was meant purely rise after their appointment as they for educational purposes, why is it not are prepared to sell themselves to the retained in the Education Ordinance? will and pleasure of the ruling party If it is meant only for educational today. This will result in less able, purposes, why is it being put into the less qualified people, people with less hands of a Minister who has the police integrity, or no integrity at all, coming in his hands, who has the C.1.D. in to the top, with the result the best his hands, and who has the Internal people who have the interests of the Security Act in his hands? Why is it country at heart more than the interests being put into such hands, and for of any party being left behind, thus what purpose? We know that these resulting in a loss to this entire nation. powers will not be put into the hands of this Ministry without some con­ Mr. Speaker, Sir, in this respect I sideration, or some plans already made, would like to say that putting this because the purpose of giving this very evil measure in the hands of a power to this Minister is for him to Minister who has, at the slightest act; and when he does act we know provocation, not hesitated to rain that any school which perhaps has not threats on the Opposition, I think, is opted to receive full grants under the a most unwise thing. Sir, I hope the Rahman Talib Report can be said to Honourable Minister will not now say be used for purposes detrimental to the that we are afraid of this. I will tell interests of the Federation or of the him that it is not we, the eight Mem­ public and that school is closed for bers of the Socialist Front here, who six months without the Minister having want to be promoted or appointed by to answer anyone. Mr. Speaker, Sir, 3921 26 JANUARY 1962 3922 we know that there is controversy on at any time that a school or educational the question of education-we know institution is being used for a purpose there is controversy, and when there detrimental to the interests of the is controversy, when certain schools Federation or of the public, may close are being forced to give up the Chinese the institution for six months. We language and to take over the national know that today syllabuses are pro­ language as the medium of instruction vided for schools, and if any school and being forced to convert into is not complying with a syllabus, it English-medium schools, schools which can be made to comply with the resent this policy of the Government syllabus as you have school in­ can incur the wrath of this clause. spectors-or do you mean to tell us And, Mr. Speaker, Sir, as coming that they are sleeping? Do you mean events cast their shadows we can say to say that your Education Department that the arrest of students recently and is worthless, that your inspectors their release may be indications that cannot do their work? Is that what the slightest suspicion will cause this you mean to impress on us? Mr. Ministry to close entire schools. We Speaker, Sir, there is ample machinery know that perhaps there may be to see that syllabuses are complied teachers in a certain school who do with. not entirely agree with the policy of Further, Sub-clause (c) says "as a the Government, but they are within meeting-place of an unlawful society,". the law not to opt to take grants-in­ Sir, we know that schools are used for aid from the Government. They are teaching, and it may happen that the still within their right-the Govern­ Honourable the Minister may tomorrow ment has not said it is illegal for a find that perhaps the students of a school not to opt to take grants in-aid. certain school or the teachers of a The Government has not said that, certain school may meet and say "We but we know from recent incidents want to continue as an independent that this Government has not hesitated school." The Government not liking to cancel the teaching certificates of this, although that is not illegal, might teachers, that this Government will say that the teachers are holding illegal not hesitate to victimise schools which meetings and close the school; or the are not prepared to opt to take grants­ students there might voice certain in-aid from the Government, and this grievances-for instance, it has hap­ Clause 41B can be used by the pened in a certain prominent school­ Government to brow-beat these and without any enquiry, without schools into perhaps not having certain finding out anything, perhaps to save teachers in them against whom the themselves from an embarrassing Government cannot produce valid situation, the Minister will go and reasons to cancel their certificates. close the school for six months. So, This is an additional weapon of Mr. Speaker, Sir, from what I have oppression that this Ministry is asking said, this is a most sinister piece of today. legislation that has come up to this House. Although the Internal Security Mr. Speaker, Sir, in the exercise of Act is a very evil provision and an this power, the sole master is the undemocratic Act, these two clauses­ Minister in charge of this Ministry. aause 41A and Gause 41B--will It is an absolute power and I ask the provide the poison fangs of the evil Ministers not to be too gleeful, Internal Security Act, and it is the because power corrupts and absolute people of Malaya and the freedom power corrupts absolutely; and I will of Malaya that will suffer from these say that this absolute power in the two poison fangs, which the Minister hands of this Minister bodes ill for is asking us today to fix on to the the future development of our country. Internal Security Act. For these Mr. Speaker, Sir, Clause 41B says reasons, Mr. Speaker, Sir, our Party's that the Minister, if he is satisfied stand today is that unequivocally, .,,------~~ ----~------~------~-

3923 26 JANUARY 1962 3924 unreservedly and completely we reject the Miriister-will not be able to hold this most sinister legislation. a post in many of these statutory bodies. If this is the case, then certainly Enche' Liu Yoong Peng (Rawang): this Bill is nothing but a step towards Mr. Speaker, Sir, I support the a more dictatorial government in our statement made by my colleague the country. Member for Damansara in respect of the new Clause 41B. To support his Enche' Lee Siok Yew (Sepang): saying that the Minister may use this Mr. Speaker, Sir, I am surprised to power to curb members of the schools, hear the statement of the Honourable if they do not fall in line with Govern­ Member for Rawang. I do not think ment policy, I wish to illustrate this he is staying in Kajang and I am sure more fully as to how it can happen. he did not know what happened in For instance, quite recently, there is Kajang. Sir, I am a member of the a school in Kajang called the Yuk Board of Management of the Yuk Wah Wah High School. The managers of Secondary School. I attended two that school held a meeting to decide meetings which were called by the whether the school should or should Chairman of the School Committee, not be converted to the National-type and the meetings were held in Kajang School, and in that meeting they Merchant Club. The first meeting, decided not to convert. Afterwards. the according to my opinion, is illegal Honourable Member for Sepang went because I found that although the to tell the managers of the school that meeting was for members of the Board they had made an illegal decision. and supporters, but a lot of the mem­ that was not the thing to do, and that bers of the Socialist Front attended the Government would take action on the meeting. These members are them if they want to uphold their neither members of the Board nor are illegal decision. Because of this, Sir, they supporters (Applause). Mr. they were intimidated to hold another Speaker, Sir, therefore I reserved the meeting and, of course, they had to right, as a member of the Board, to decide that they would convert to the say what is right and what is wrong. National-type School. Such things have I did not force anyone of them to happened, Sir, and I say that if this accept to convert this particular school sort of power is given to the Minister, into a National-type secondary school. most sinister things can happen and I explained the policy of the Govern­ the liberty of the people to decide for ment but unfortunately the Chairman themselves would be deprived. There­ of the Socialist Front stood up and fore, Sir, I sincerely think that this said that I tried to gain publicity, that Bill is giving too much power to the I tried to make this meeting a public Minister; and even thought it has rally. Whether this sort of meeting is made a Member, like the Member for legal or illegal, I do not know. Sepang, to think in a certain way in The second meeting was called at his constituency which is bad enough. a later date, and something also it will be worse if such power is given happened. Slogans were found in the to a Minister. And as my Honourable school and posters were found in the _colleague has said that power corrupts streets. In fact, Mr. Speaker, Sir, I I sincerely hope that it will not corrupt am a politician and I did not do any­ so absolutely. thing to interfere or influence the members of the Board and the As regards Clause 41A, my conten­ supporters; tion is the same: that it is only a guise, because on the face of it, it As a result of the happenings at the aims to deal with subversive activities, second meeting, a third meeting was but in practice it would be that people called. Copies of a letter by the who are impartial, who are neutral. Education Department, Selangor, were who would not like to fall in line with circulated to the parents of pupils the twin-due to the famous twins of asking them whether their children •

3925 26 JANUARY 1962 3926 would like to study in a National-type the Socialist Front supporters. I do not secondary school, or an independent know what they were there for. For school, or any other school, and the the information of the Honourable parents made up their minds to select Member for Rawang, most of the the National-type secondary school-­ supporters and parents ii;i Kajang about 71 per cent of the parents made supported the Government policy and their decision to select the National­ therefore decided to convert the type secondary school (Applause). school into a National-type secondary Therefore, Sir, this school was con­ school. This was shown in their later verted into a National-type secondary meeting. Had it not been for the school. disturbance of the members of the Socialist Front in the Kajang Yuk Mr. Speaker, Sir, I know some of Wah Secondary School, I think there the members of the Socialist Front; would not have been such a rouse. As I can at any time produce their names for the part of the Honourable Member and addresses to the Police if they for Sepang, he has, as he said, every were to challenge me outside this right to point out that the meeting was House (Laughter). Let them deny it. not legal; and he has every right to I know so-and-so is a member of the point out that the supporters of the Socialist Front, and I know so-and-so Socialist Front have no business to be is a member of the Communist Party. there. Thank you. This group of people are all in the so-called Socialist Front in the country. Enche' Zulkiftee bin Muhammad: Mr. Speaker, Sir, this is my ex­ Tuan Yang di-Pertua, oleh kerana planation. tujuan Rang Undang2 ini bagi mengemaskan Undang2 Keselamatan Enche' Liu Yoong Peng: Mr. Negara yang telah di-luluskan oleh Speaker, Sir, on a point of clarification. Dewan ini. dan oleh kerana telah mendapat jaminan daripada Menteri Mr. Speaker: We are not in Com­ Yang Berhormat bahawa Undang2 ini mittee; you cannot speak again. tidak di-salah gunakan bagi sa-barang maksud yang lain daripada keselamat­ Enche' Liu Yoong Peng: On a point an negara, maka saya menyokong of clarification only, Sir. Rang Undang2 ini (Tepok). Mr. Speaker: Yes, but not very long. Tuan Yang di-Pertua, di-dalam sa-buah negara saperti kita ini tentu-lah Encbe' .Liu Yoong Peng: . Mr. terpaksa banyak chara2 yang patut Speaker •. Sir, I speak on a pomt of di-perbuat bagi menchegah s\.way~ clarification. The Member for Sepang · jangan berbalek keadaan negen m1 did admit and did confess that he kapada keadaan2 yang telah lalu yang actually stated that the first two kita ada dalam-nya. meetings were illegal, and that he even threatened some of the people there Saya, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, hanya (Laughter). mengulang apa yang telah saya sebut­ kan dahulu dalam Dewan ini bahawa Encbe' Lee San Choon (Kluang yang amat mustahak dalam membuat Utara): Mr. Speaker, Sir, it is a pity Undang2 yang keras saperti ini ia-lah that the Honourable Member for dalam pelaksanaan-nya sadikit tegas Rawang did not clarify and elaborate dan tegas di-atas tujuan asal. Tuan what happened at the meeting stated Yang di-Pertua, oleh kerana Undang2 by the Honourable Member for ini bertujuan bagi mengemaskan Sepang. During the meeting, which Undang2 Keselamatan Negara, maka was supposed to be a supporters' saya suka menarek pandangan Menteri meeting, many people, who are even Yang Berhormat supaya di-fikirkan under the age of 21 and who did not sama ada maseh menasabah beberapa pay even a single cent to the school, perkataan yang ada dalam Undang2 ini attended the meeting, and these are yang dahulu-nya Undang2 ini ada ------..------~ ------______.,..--

3927 26 JANUARY 1962 3928 dalam Undang2 Pelajaran dalam negeri ada-lah mu'tamad, dengan tidak boleh ini ia-itu "The Minister, if he is satisfied di-bawa ka-dalam mana2 Mahkamah at any time that a school or educa­ pun. Saya suka, Tuan Yang di­ tional institution is being used-(a) for Pertua, supaya di-bayangkan sa-chara a purpose detrimental to the interests "specific" oleh Menteri Yang Ber­ of the Federation or of the public; or hormat apa procedure atau perjalanan ( b) for the purpose of instruction perundangan yang benar2 akan berlaku detrimental to the interests of the sa-kira-nya perkara bantahan ini di­ public or of the pupils; or ...... " kemukakan kapada Yang di-Pertuan Tuan Yang di-Pertua, perkataan "or Agong? Ada-kah perkara itu akan of the pupils" lebeh layak di-letakkan di-lakukan dengan "discretion" dari­ dalam sa-buah Undang2 yang ber­ pada Yang di-Pertuan Agong, atau sangkutan dengan Undang2 Pelajaran. perkara itu pada akhir-nya bergantong Saya berpendapat bahawa sa-kira-nya kapada shor2 yang akan di-kemukakan telah di-sebutkan saperti dalam oleh Kabinet berkenaan dengan bahagian (a) dan (b) hingga perkataan perkara itu? "public" itu, perkataan "or of the pupils" tidak-lah lagi mustahak di­ Hal ini mustahak di-nyatakan dengan jelas kapada Dewan ini supaya rasa pakai, sebab ia itu tidak ada lagi 2 benar2 bersangkutan langsong dengan terjamin yang Undang Keselamatan Undang2 Keselamatan Negara. Dahulu ini dapat di-pegang oleh ahli2 di-sini boleh jadi perkataan saperti ini yang akan membolehkan mereka mcnasabah di-tetapkan, kerana ia itu merasa bahawa tidak-lah terlalu berat 2 harga yang di-bayar bagi mewujudkan di-letakkan dalam Undang Pelajaran 2 yang ada kait-mengait-nya dengan Undang Keselamatan Negara. murid sekolah, dan pada masa ini Enche' Tan Phock Kin: Mr. Speaker, perkataan "public" telah pun dengan Sir, my colleagues from Damansara sendiri-nya berma'ana termasok di­ and Rawang have expressed certain dalam-nya "the pupils". apprehensions over the passage of this Tuan Yang di-Pertua, harga yang Bill, and I must say that such appre­ di-bayar oleh kita bagi mewujudkan hensions are not without foundation. sa-buah Undang2 Keselamatan Negara The Honourable Minister of Internal itu ada-lah besar, hingga kita terpaksa Security in the course of his speech membuat beberapa peratoran yang has endeavoured to assure this House mengikat diri. Oleh sebab yang demi­ that the Bill if it becomes an Act will kian, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, dan oleh not be implemented with any political sebab hendak mengawal kepentingan bias. perjalanan demokrasi dalam negeri Sir, the Honourable ·Member for ini, saya suka-lah minta penjelasan Bachok, speaking on behalf of his supaya "specific" daripada Menteri Party in support of this Bill, has also Yang Berhormat berkenaan dengan expressed certain concern over certain Cheraian (2) dalam Bab 41 ia-itu clauses, and I would like here to point "Appeal" yang hendak di-buat kapada out that the utterances that have been Yang di-Pertuan Agong. Nampak made from time to time by Members pada kita apa yang kita buat dengan of the Government are responsible for kelulusan sharat I dan 2 daripada any apprehension which the public Rang Undang2 ini akan menimbulkan may have over assurances given by rasa tidak puas hati kapada beberapa the Government. It is very well for pehak sama ada perkara itu benar the Honourable Minister of Internal atau tidak. Tetapi, di-sini orang2 yang Security to tell us, "You need not merasa bahawa dia di-dzalimi atau worry. It will not be used for political teraniaya, maka dia boleh-lah dalam purposes." If we analyse the utter­ masa sa-bulan membuat bantahan ances made from time to time by the terhadap "perentah menutup sekolah Members of the Government, we can itu" kapada Yang di-Pertuan Agong, more or less conclude as to whether yang keputusan-nya dalam perkara itu such assurances have any value or not. ...

3929 26 JANUARY 1962 3930 Let me quote one very recent which he may have received from the example-the utterance that was made Minister under sub-section (2)." in this House this morning. It was said In other words, nobody will be able to by none other than the Honourable know the reason as to why certain Prime Minister that the Members of people are being excluded, as to the the Socialist Front, because they have reasons why the Minister has used his expressed certain views against the legal powers on those persons. So you Alliance Government as distinct from see, Sir, if the Minister is really sincere the Federation of Malaya, or His about it, then he should consider Majesty the Yang di-Pertuan Agong, making some amendments to his are fifth columnists. That is a very original proposal. It is no use giving harsh phrase to use, but nevertheless it assurances, but he must act in a was used and used by none other than manner that will convince us in this the Honourable Prime Minister. So, if House, and the people of this country, the Government or somebody in the that he is sincere about it. So, I would position of the Honourable Prime like to suggest to him that he will be Minister can say in this House that, able to assure us, and assure the because Members of the Socialist country more effectively, if he is Front did criticise the Government and prepared to amend the Bill and to make certain expressions of dis­ make a provision for the Minister to satisfaction over the way this Govern­ disclose in public his reasons for using ment is run, they are considered as his veto power. Further, there should fifth columnists in his opinion, then also be a provision for a person who from that argument it is only natural is aggrieved to appeal to a Court of that the people of this country, and in Law. particular the Members of the Socialist Front, fear that should the Minister With regard to Clause 41B, our be given such power, he may think Honourable friend from Bachok wants in a like way; and though he has given some clarification on Clause 41B (2) in us an assurance that there are no which the board of managers can political implications at all in the Bill, appeal to the Yang di-Pertuan Agong. yet the fear is not unfounded. What is the position here? Anybody who has any knowledge of our Well, let us analyse the Bill as such, Constitution will know that His and see whether the reasons given by Majesty the Yang di-Pertuan Agong is the Minister are correct or otherwise. a constitutional Monarch and as such Firstly, we come to the new Clause His Majesty will have to accept the 41A. According to the Minister, he advice of the Prime Minister and of the has told us that he is not seeking Government. In other words, the any new power, but, in fact, 41A is appeal is a mere formality. If the a new power. In the past the Minister Minister is of the view that a school had no power whatsoever to veto~ in should be closed, naturally the Yang the past the Minister had no power di-Pertuan Agong, being a constitu­ whatsoever to demand that names tional Monarch, will agree with the should be submitted to him; and what view of the Government. So this is, in is the safeguard in this Bill against fact, a camouflage, and I would urge the Minister acting in a manner to the Government that, if it is really victimise his political opponents? The sincere about it, the appeal should amendment, as it stands, I submit, be made not to His Majesty but that it should be made to an independent has no safeguard whatsoever because judiciary. So, Sir, it is no use telling nobody is any wiser. No reason is us that no political pressure will be going to be given, because Clause 4 lA used. The Government must act in such (3) says: a manner that it will not give rise to "No person otherwise than in the any suspicion. Afterall, all Ministers course of his official duty shall disclose are political figures and it will be to any person any communication rather difficult for political figures to ------~. ------·

3931 26 JANUARY 1962 3932 act without political motive, and I "That the bill be read a second time submit, here, that the judiciary is the on this day six months." only body that is free from political prejudices and it is the only body In other words, I propose to give the which the public will have confidence Minister tiine to consider the very in. reasonable proposal by me, and I feel that the Honourable Member for Secondly. l would also submit that Bachok has also some recommenda­ under Clause 41B the Minister should tions with regard to the amendments not be the sole arbiter as to whether to the original Bill .. a school is being used for purposes which are considered detrimental, Mr. Speaker, Sir, I would like to because, as I have pointed out, the submit this amendment to the House. Minister is a political figure and is Mr. Speaker: I think we have a bound to have certain political bias. Standing Order here which says that The Minister has also pointed out to notice of all amendments should be us that this is nothing new and that given before it is debated in this this is really a transference of power House. l am looking for that amend­ from the Education Ordinance to th~ ment to the Standing Order which has Internal Security Act. I must say here just been approved by the House. that either the Minister is trying to mislead us, or that he is very ignorant Enche' Tan Phock Kin: Mr. of the Education Ordinance-ro igno­ Speaker, Sir ...... rant that he cannot see the difference between a Minister who decides and Mr. Speaker: One minute! l have a Registrar of Schools, who is not a not finished yet! If you look up your political figure and who is a civil copy of the Standing Orders and refer servant. In the Education Ordinance to the amendment slip to S.O. 57 (2)- it is the Registrar of Schools. The 1 do not know whether you have got Registrar of Schools at least will that amendment or not-it says, "At command more confidence, if it is over least one day's notice of any proposed the question of political bias. He will amendment shall wherever practicable definitely command more confidence be given ...... " than a Minister. particularly a Minister of the Alliance Government. Sir, I Enche' Tan Phock Kin: Sir, may I must point out that the Minister is point out that that particular amend­ merely trying to mislead this House by ment refers to the procedure in saying that there is no fundamental Committee of the whole House with change when, in fact, there is a regard to a Bill. I am now moving this fundamental change-a change from a amendment under S.O. 53 (4) which non-political figure to a political figure says, "On the second reading of a to make decisions. Bill. an amendment may be proposed to the question, 'That the Bill be now The proposal put forward by me, read a second time'. to leave out the I am sure Honourable Members of word 'now' and add at the end of this House will agree, is a very the question, 'on this day six reasonable proposal. It is consistent months' ...... " with the desire of the Government to give no political bias to its decision, Mr. Speaker: Do you want to delete a desire to assure this House that no the word "now" and to add at the end political pressure will be used. I hope of the question, the words "on this that the Honourable Member for day six months"? Bachok. after listening to my reasons, will support me (laughter) because I Enche' Tan Phock Kin: Yes. Sir. would like to move an amendment to the motion, an amendment that will Mr. Speaker: I shall have .. to read as follows: consider the amendment of yours. ""

3933 26 JANUARY 1962 3934 I think this is the best time to Honourable Member attacking me--1 suspend the meeting till tonight. can take it; I do not mind him attack­ ing the policies of the Government-I The meetig is suspended till half­ can take it; but when he tells an past eight tonight. untruth to this House and tries to put words into my mouth which I never Sitting suspended at 6.20 p.m. uttered, I think the Honourable Member should have the decency to Sitting resumed at 8.30 p.m. withdraw them. If he had listened to my speech very carefully, he would (Mr. Speaker in the Chair) have heard that I did say that in respect of Section 41B, I was not THE INTERNAL SECURITY asking for any new powers. Let me (AMENDMENT) BILL. quote what I said, Sir, in regard to Section 41B. I said: "Thus it can be Second Reading seen that the purpose of this amend­ ment is not to seek new power, but Debate resumed. merely to transfer the power to order Mr. Speaker (To Enche' Tan the immediate closing down of a Phock Kin): Will you formally move school-which could have been re­ your amendment? tained in the Education Act of 1961- to the Internal Security Act." Now, Enche' Tan Phock Kin: Mr. that is exactly what I did say. If he Speaker, Sir, I beg to move that the had listened to what I had said, just motion before the House be amended as I have listened to what he has said, as follows: he would not have been so hasty as to come to wrong conclusions, which "That the Bill be read a second time he usually does in this House. on this day six months." Enche' Tan Phock Kin: On a point Enche' K. Karam Singh: Mr. of clarification, Mr. Speaker. I am Speaker, Sir, I have the honour to afraid the Honourable Minister is second this motion (Laughter). deliberately misleading the House. I Mr. Speaker: Honourable Members, have explained ...... there is an amendment to the motion Dato' Dr. Ismail: Mr. Speaker, Sir, before the House. The question before on a point of order. I challenge the the House is "That the Bill be now shorthand writer of this House to read read a second time." Now, it is pro­ what he said, because I did take it posed that the word "now" be deleted down in my own handwriting when and the words "on this day six he spoke. In regard to Section 41A, months" be added at the end of the he said that I never asked for new question. I appeal to Honourable power, whereas I did say in regard to Members that they must confine their Section B. I do not like an untruth debate to that amendment only, and if I am to be contradicted, Sir, because after the amendment has been I hope the Honourable Member will disposed of, we will be going back to have the decency to admit what he the second reading on the principles had said in this House. I demand, Sir, of the Bill. that the shorthand writer read what Dato' Dr. Ismail: Mr. Speaker, Sir, the Honourable Member said in this I oppose the amendment moved by House. the Member for Tanjong because of Mr. Speaker: Please proceed. the reasons given by 1).im (Laughter). Now, firstly, he said that, according to Enche' Tan Phock Kin: If I may him, I did say that I never asked clarify on that point. What a person for new powers under Section 4 lA of said is one thing; it should not be Clause 2. Now, Sir, I do not niind the taken out of its context. For example. ,------·--~~------·----·----

3935 26 JANUARY 1962 3936 I have said that-I never deny it-but under Section 4 lB, which is entirely a I have qualified the statement by new one. And secondly, I think if he pointing out that the powers which had taken the trouble to study the were vested in the Registrar of National Language properly, he would Schools are now being vested in the have known that the Honourable Minister itself. So if one looks at it Member for Bachok was seeking purely from the point of view of the a clarification from me as to whether Minister, in the past the Minister had reference to the Yang di-Pertuan no such power; with the amendment Agong is in accordance with the the Minister possesses the power; and Constitution, and he wanted to know I still maintain that I am quite correct from me whether this had gone in saying that irrespective of what the through the Cabinet to the Yang di­ Minister thinks. Pertuan Agong. So on these two reasons-one because of the untrue Dato' Dr. Ismail: I still maintain statement of the Honourable Member that he was saying an untruth because and the other, because of his failure he did say, when he was speaking on to understand the National Language Section 41A, that I was asking for new of what another Honourable Member power, whereas in my speech I did is trying to convey-I totally oppose say that in regard to Section 41B I this amendment. did not seek new power at all, and I hope he has the decency to admit that Enche' K. Karam Singh: Mr. he did say that in respect of 41A. Speaker, Sir, before I proceed to answer the Minister in his rather heaty Mr. Speaker: We are now debating argument, I would like to find out on the amendment, that is, the second from him, when he said that he is reading of the Bill be passed six not seeking new power under the new months later. If Members will confine Clause 41A-he has said that-if he on that ...... is true to his word-he does not seek any new power under that Clause, Dato' Dr. Ismail: No, Sir, I want then let him forgo that Clause if he your ruling. The Honourable Member wants to remain true to his word. challenges the accuracy of my state­ This is on a point of clarification, ment because I quoted him, and how Sir. are we going to prove unless what he said was taken by the ...... Dato' Dr. Ismail: All right, I will clarify to him, Sir. I read my speech, Mr. Speaker: After we have finished, and if I said Clause 4 lA in my haste, then we come back to the debate on then I meant Clause 41B, because in the second reading of the Bill. We are my statement in reference to Clause now dealing with the amendment. We 41B I did say, "Thus, it can be seen are now debating on the amendment that the purpose of this amendment and what I want to hear is why the is not to seek new power." But I Bill should be proceeded with now have the decency to admit my and not six months later. After the mistake-I meant that in reference to amendment, you can come back to Clause 41 B I am not seeking any new the principle of the Bill, when you power; in Clause 41A I am seeking will have the right of reply as the new power. The Honourable Member Mover of the second reading of the for Tanjong said in respect of Clause Bill. 41A, but if he had said in respect of 41n I would not have contradicted Dato' Dr. Ismail: Well, Sir, I oppose him. this amendment because of the reasons given by the Honourable Member. Enche' K. Karam Singh: I do not and one of the reasons was that he know which Minister to believe-the said I tried to seek new power under Minister who spoke a few minutes ago, Section 41A which, in fact~ I do not or the Minister who is speaking now seek. I admit that I am seeking power because he has confused himself as

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3937 26 JANUARY 1962 3938 to which is "A" and "B". I am not kapada dua bah sahaja. Saya fikir ta' trying to be clever, but when he has payah di-tanggohkan 6 bulan kerana so confused himself on "A" and "B", terang di-nyatakan sini perkara 41 (a) how can he accuse us of confusing dan 41 (b) chuma mengambil beberapa him on "A" and "B". Mr. Speaker, masa sahaja. Dan perkara ini nampak­ Sir, I think this is a misunderstand nya mudah hendak memikirkan. Sa­ arising from the Minister's own con­ bagai salah sa-orang daripada Ketua fusion of Clauses 41A and 41B. Front Socialist meminta kebenaran Tuan Yang di-Pertua keluar be- Dato' Dr. Ismail: Am I to assume rama1·2 ...... that the Honourable Member now admits that the Member for Tanjong Mr. Speaker: Apa ada kena-mengena did tell an untrue statement. If he dengan perkara ini. did, he should have the decency-as I had-to withdraw that statement. Tuan Haji Ahmad bin Saaid: Berkenaan Socialist Front. Enche' K. Karam Singh: Mr. Speaker, Sir, we admit no such thing Mr. Speaker: Ta' payah-lah­ and we do not want anyone to assume. irrelevant. But, Mr. Speaker, Sir, from the very Tuan Haji Ahmad bin Saaid: beginning the Honourable Minister was Perkara ini ta' payah di-tanggohkan going on one argument, that is, he is hingga 6 bulan kerana senang sahaja not seeking new powers under Clause undang2 ini, kerana terang dan nyata 41A. So, when I asked him to stick to kapada kedua bah itu. that, and if he is not seeking any new power to forgo this clause, he comes Amendment put, and negatived. up now and say it is Clause 41B. So, if he wants to set his own argument Mr. Speaker: Now we come back right, he must start from the beginning to the original motion "That the Bill to avoid all this confusion, so that be now read a second time". If no we can know very clearly and definitely other Honourable Member wishes to what the Minister says and what he speak, I shall put the question. means to say. Enche' Tan Phock Kin: Mr. Speaker, Amendment put, and negatived. Sir ...... Tuan Haji Ahmad bin Saaid: Tuan Mr. Speaker: You have no more Pengerusi...... right to speak! Mr. Speaker: Saya hendak me­ Enche Tan Phock Kin: I have not ngingatkan sahaja hanya-lah kita spoken on the motion yet, Sir. I spoke hendak membahathkan sama ada Bill on the amendment. ini hendak di-jalankan ini jam juga Mr. Speaker: Once you moved the motion yang ada di-hadapan Rumah amendment, you have finished with ini atau pun 6 bulan belakang. Chakap your right. You have no more right itu sahaja kerana kita hendak balek to speak-that is the practice. principle ini. Enche' Tan Phock Kin: May I know Tuan Haji Ahmad bin Saaid: Tuan the relevant Standing Order in regard Pengerusi, saya bangun untok mem­ to that ruling? bangkang chadangan yang telah di-kemukakan oleh Yang Berhormat Mr. Speaker: Once you speak in the wakil Tanjong supaya perbahathan debate on the second reading, that mengenal Rang Undang2 Keselamatan means you have already exercised your Dalam Negeri ini di-tanggohkan hingga right-and you can only speak once. 6 bulan. Jadi bukan-lah maksud pindaan sa-bagai satu undang2 yang Enche' Tan Phock Kin: May I penoh lengkap, chuma pindaan-nya point out, Sir, that that refers only I'" .....

3939 26 JANUARY 1962 3940 to a particular motion. I have moved Menteri yang bertanggong-jawab dan a separate motion on an amendment. Menteri itu akan membuat kapada So, I should be entitled to speak. Cabinet dan keputusan-nya akan di­ bawa kapada Yang di-Pertuan Agong Mr. Speaker: Before you moved untok di-perkenankan. Ini-lah concept your motion you have already spoken dalam kita punya Perlembagaan on the principle of the Bill-and that kerana raja2 kita mengikut dalam is enough. If no other Honourable Perlembagaan ia ta' boleh champor Member wishes to speak, I shall put dalam politik dan kalau ada tegoran the question. atau pun pindaan di-datangkan kapada Dato' Dr. Ismail: Mr. Speaker, I Parlimen atau pun kapada Menteri will first try to answer an Honourable yang bertanggong-jawab dalam parli­ Member for whom, although he men ini memberi peluang kapada belongs to the Opposition Bench, I Dewan ini supaya sama ada bersetuju have great respect-that is the Member atau membantah apa yang di-buat oleh for Bachok. I have respect for him, Menteri dan Cabinet, dan dalam because he is a patriot; he puts the Dewan ini juga boleh di-adakan vote security of the country before party of no confidence. Itu jawapan-nya considerations (Applause) because he kapada Ahli Yang Berhormat dari said he supports this Bill in the interests Dato Kramat. of the security of this country. Now, Sir, since the Benches on the Ia chuma bertanya kapada saya Socialist Front are occupied by only ia-itu berkenaan dengan Clause 2 two Members, I take this opportunity Section 41 (a) ia-itu berkenaan dengan to address them individually, not public-41 (b) for the purpose of because I would like to do this pre­ instruction detrimental to the interests ferably but because it is convenient of the public or of the pupils. Ia to do so. mengatakan ia-itu kalau ta' ada pupil itu patut di-masokkan dalam Educa­ Now, I would like first to deal with tion Act. Di-sini maksud-nya-for the the Honourable Member for Daman­ purpose of instruction detrimental to sara. He has referred to this Bill as the interests of the public or of the an evil thing and should not be passed pupils-ada kala-nya chara subversive by this House. The Honourable ini bukan-nya ia membuat dalam Member is quite eloquent in English masa yang di-tetapkan dalam pelajaran and he would probably understand kadang2 di-gunakan dalam sekolah itu if I quote an English proverb which untok di-jalankan gerakan subversive, says, "Evil is to him who evil thinks" jadi pada masa itu termasok-lah (Laughler). To the majority of this internal security. country, and to the majority of Mem­ bers of this House, this Amendment Atas soal yang di-katakan bila masa to the Internal Security Act is a membuat appeal ini ia-itu Clause 2. necessary thing for the security of this 41 (b) (2) The board of managers or country: probably, because the governors of any school or educational Socialist Front has been so penetrated institution, aggrieved by any order by the communists that after mixing made under Sub-section (1), may within very freely with some people, one one month of the date of the order acquires the habits of those people. He make an objection against such order is concerned that this Bill will victimise to the Yang di-Pertuan Agong. Well, honest people. I submit, Sir, that this in practice it has to go through the Bill is to protect honest peopl~honest Minister responsible and the Cabinet people in the public service of this before it is submitted to the Yang di­ country, honest people who are serving Pertuan Agong. That is according to in the statutory bodies of this country­ the Constitution. Ia-itu menunjokkan and honest people have nothing to bila hendak membuat appeal atau hide. It is only those who try to rayuan itu ia-lah hendak melalui' subvert the country have everything to • ..... , • 3941 26 JANUARY 1962 3942

hide (Applause). I am not surprised not affect the promotion of members that from my utterances he and his of the statutory bodies. It is probable, colleagues have no confidence in me, Sir, that the Honourable Member is as the Malay proverb says ...... so anxious that in interpreting this Bill according to the like of the Enche' K. Karam Singh: Sir, on a Socialist Front, he even deviated from point of clarification, I said "the the truth as stated in the Bill. country"-not myself or my col­ leagues ...... Now, Sir, if I have the sole power, absolute power, as has been alleged Dato' Dr. Ismail: Sir, I am not in his speech, then there is no giving way. To quote the Malay House of Parliament in the Federation . proverb, "Churahkan ayer di-atas daun of Malaya. The fact that there is a keladi" -tak lekat. So, whatever jewels House of Parliament and that the I throw to Members of the Socialist Honourable Member is free to attack Front, it is no use-"it is just like me, even when his facts are distorted, throwing jewels to swines" which, Sir, speaks for itself-that this House is is an English proverb. based on parliamentary democracy. If he had as much respect for parlia­ Enche' K. Karam Singh: Mr. mentary democracy, he would not Speaker, Sir, on a point of order. l abuse the privilege of this House by ask the Minister to withdraw it. It is trying to say untrue things in regard an insult. to this Bill-I cannot infer otherwise Mr. Speaker: He is quoting an than to say that he purposely tried to English proverb. mislead this House by speaking of promotion when nothing is said in the Enche' K. Karam Singh: Mr. Bill in regard to promotion in respect Speaker, Sir, I submit that this is an of people employed in statutory indirect way of referring to people as bodies. swines. So to be fair and above abuse, I would ask that remark be withdrawn. Sir, I come now to the Honourable Member for Tanjong. I hope that when Mr. Speaker: So long as it is a the Hansard is published, especially proverb, I cannot ask him to with­ in regard to the debate on this Bill, draw. a proper record will be revealed to this House, and if necessary I will Dato' Dr. Ismail: Sir, I am not refer the matter to the Privileges responsible for the English language. Committee in regard to the behaviour I am merely quoting. of the Honourable Member. He did Mr. Speaker: I hope you will restrain say that in regard to Section 4 lA that yourself a little bit. I was trying to seek new power, while, if he had listened to my speech he Dato' Dr. Ismail: Sir, if the Honour­ would have heard that I said in regard able Member for Damansara would to Section 4 lB, and I quote what I just listen as he would like to talk, said- he would not have said what he had "Thus it can be seen that the purpose said in regard to Section 4 lA of this of this amendment is not to seek new Bill. He has talked at great length power, but merely to transfer the power about the Alliance-that by virtue of to order the immediate closing down of this Bill, if it is passed, the Alliance a school-which could have been retained in the Education Act of 1961-to the will victimise members of the statutory Internal Security Act." bodies in regard to promotion. Sir, I am sure the Honourable Member is Sir, from my experience as Minister a learned member of the legal profes­ of Internal Security and from my sion, and if he had read this Bill experience in the United Nations, it is carefully he would see that Section 4 lA a common tactic among the com­ refers only to appointments-it does munists to say untrue things and then r------~-·-- ~- ---~-- ·------.,..------~ -

3943 26 JANUARY 1962 3944 refuse to withdraw the untrue state­ motive, and I submit to you, Sir, that ments. It is, as the free world knows, the Honourable Minister should be a common communist tactic to twist asked to withdraw the statement. facts, to twist truth, in order to suit their arguments. Mr. Speaker: I regard this as an inference of opinion; it does not impute Enche' Tan Phock Kin: Mr. improper motive. Please proceed. Speaker, Sir, on a point of order­ Standing Order 36 (6): No member Dato' Dr. Ismail: So, Sir, by virtue shall impute improper motives to any of the fact that I am going to be con­ other member. I think the Honour­ ferred with this power, and that I am able Minister is abusing his position, answerable to this House, I think the being the last speaker, by making two Honourable Members from the allegations without substance and to Socialist Front should both vote for impute by implication that I, because this Bill now, if they really respect of what I have said, am actually parliamentary democracy-it is better adopting a communist tactic. That, Sir, to have a Minister who can answer is imputing that I am a communist them in this House, who can take and I challenge him-he may have and give harder than they can give­ other facts as the Minister of Internal rather than to attack a member of the Security, to prove it to this House. Public Service who cannot answer for himself (Laughter) (Applause). Mr. Speaker: The way he said it, he does not impute improper motive. Question put, and agreed to. (To Dato' Dr. Ismail) Please proceed. Bill accordingly read a second time Dato' Dr. Ismail: Thank you, Mr. and committed to a Committee of the S_Reaker, Sir. Now, it is very strange whole House. that the Honourable Member for Tanjong-and the Honourable Mem­ House immediately resolved itself ber for Damansara-should have a into a Committee on the Bill. sudden liking for an officer in the Bill considered in Committee. Education Department. He has said that Section 41B should remain in the (Mr. Speaker in the Chair) Education Act, because that power then would have been exercised by the Clauses I and 2- Registrar-General of the Education Department. I presume it is easy for Enche' Tan Phock Kin. Mr. Chair­ these two Honourable Members to man, Sir, I would like to ask the attack members of the Public Service Honourable Minister of Internal who are not in this House, but if I Security a few questions with regard am given the power, probably they are to Clauses I and 2, and I hope that afraid to attack me (Applause). But in his reply he will take the trouble I can give them as hard as I could to say exactly what he means and not take-in fact, harder (Applause). later on to tell us that he did not actually mean what he said. Enche' Tan Phock Kin: Mr. Speaker, Sir, on a point of order-S.O. 36 (6). Coming to Clause 2 of the Bill and I am afraid the Honourable Minister in view of the assurance given by him is very clearly imputing improper to this House ...... motives. He is suggesting, because of Mr. Chairman: Which Clause are our indication that the Registrar of you referring to-41A or 41B? Schools can act more independently free from political control, that our Enche' Tan Phock Kin: Sir, I am intention is to attack the Registrar­ referring first to Clause 4 lA because General of Schools without him being of· the fact that the Minister took great able to reply to us in this House. pains to tell this House not to fear That is a very clear case of improper the introduction of this amendment ..,. , - 1 3945 26 JANUARY 1962 3946 ' because it will not be used for any that we believe in parliamentary political purpose or with any political democracy-we believe in Government bias. So, in view of that and in view by discussion. If an Honourable of the fact that Clause 41A (3) says Minister of the Alliance Government, that "No person otherwise than in the which professes to believe in demo­ course of his official duty shall disclose cracy, refuses to consider the to any person any communication viewpoints of the Members of the which he may have received from the Opposition who, afterall, represent a Minister under Sub-section (2)", it is very substantial number of people of obvious from this that as far as the this country, by making a statement action of the Minister is concerned, which is so unbecoming of one, who his vetoing of any appointment, no is the Minister of Internal Security, one is any wiser unless they are in­ and of one who professes to belong formed of the reasons as to why veto to a political party that believes in powers are being used by the Minister. parliamentary democracy, it is, to me, So in view of that assurance, can he most astounding that a Minister of tell us the reason as to why he cannot his standing should give a reply of agree to delete this Clause 41A (3), this nature. If he does not believe and also to tell us the reason why he in discussion, let him say so very cannot agree to the inclusion of clearly and not confuse the House by another paragraph to give provision to making differentiation between this au those people, who are aggrieved man and that man. After all, I am by the decision of the Minister, to here not in my personal capacity. I appeal to a Court of Law. These are am here as a representative of a two specific points which I would like constituency which is constituted in the Minister to explain to this House accordance with the provisions of our as to why he cannot accept those two Constitution. If we do not like our very reasonable suggestions. Constitution, if we do not like the Opposition in this House, then we Dato' Dr. Ismail: Sir, I will reply should amend the Constitution to to the second point first, with regard make it into a one-party House so to bringing the case to open Court. that there shall be no election and the (To Enche' Tan Phock Kin) Is that Minister shall be in power all the time. the one? It is most amazing that a Minister Enche' Tan Phock Kin: Yes. of such a standing can make a state­ ment of this nature. and I sincerely Dato' Dr. Ismail: I cannot do that hope that in the course of this debate because I am given the power under he will cool down and speak with the Internal Security Act passed by proper perspective. this House. Enche' V. Veerappen (Seberang As to the other assurance, it is no Selatan): Mr. Chairman, Sir, I wish to use giving an assurance to the speak entirely on Clause 2, that is in Honourable Member. I have given my regard to Section 41A and Section 41B. assurance to the House, and the House As has been pointed out, Section 41B has passed the second reading of this has been brought over' from the Bill. So, I am not going to give an Education Ordinance. Sir, no doubt the assurance to the Honourable Member Minister has tried to explain to this and I will give an assurance to the House, but there is one point on House as I have already given in my which I would like to have clarification. original speech. In view of the fact that when the question of Malaysia was debated the Enche' Tan Phock Kin: Mr. Chair­ subject of education was to be made man, Sir, I am afraid the Honourable separate as far as was Minister is very stubborn. I was under concerned. if this matter comes under the impression, and the people of this the Ministry of Internal Security, then country were under the impression, this would apply to Singapore as well ,.------~· l 3947 26 IANUARY 1962 3948 and, therefore, the Minister has the Dato' Dr. Ismail: Sorry, I can't power to close any school in Singa­ hear him. pore, whereas if this remains under the Education Ordinance, the Minister Mr. Speaker: Will you speak a bit of internal Security will have no power louder, please? to extend it to Singapore. Enche' Tan Phock Kin: I have Enche' Tan Phock Kin: Mr. Chair­ spoken quite loudly, and if the Minister man, Sir, I would like now to touch had been more attentive, he would on Clause 41B. aause 41B has been have heard me. Well, for his benefit a · matter of great controversy over I shall repeat what I have said. I shall which the Minister was very 'irritated not only be louder, but I shall be because he said that I mentioned the slower and pronounce each word more fact that he is seeking new powers carefully. On this question, I am under Clause 41B. Let us look at the suggesting that to eliminate all forms position of 41B very carefully. The of suspicion of political bias, the power old Education Ordinance vested the should be vested in the Registrar of Registrar of Schools with the power Schools rather than in the Minister. to close down schools, if he is of the I also suggested that there should be opinion that the schools were used a proviso whereby appeal can be made for a purpose detrimental to the to a court of law. This is consistent interests of the Federation. The with my main argument, that is to Minister is trying to twist words ...... eliminate political bias from the whole matter. Tuan Haji Ahmad Saaid: On a point of order, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, There is a fundamental change here mengikut atoran meshuarat waktu with regard to the powers being dalam Committee, Yang Berhormat transferred from the Registrar to the boleh ...... Minister, and if one looks at it purely Enche' Tan Phock Kin: I am not from the point of view of the Minister, giving way, Sir. formerly he had no power. Now under this provision he has. So, that Mr. Speaker: (To Tuan Haji Ahmad is exactly my contention when I argue Saaid) On a point of order-berapa? my case, and the Minister is not going to frighten me into silence by threaten• Tuan Haji Ahmad Saaid: Saya ing to take action against me under hendak tahu apa-kah pindaan supaya the Committee of Privileges. They have beliau boleh memberi penjelasan di­ already taken action against me and atas pindaan yang hendak di-bahath­ the people of this country have kan, dalam Committee ini, tidak ada already known that they are so petty pindaan pun. on such matters, and even if they Mr. Speaker: May I remind this were to take action again the people House that we have already debated of this country will not be surprised the principle of the Bill. We are now at all because of their pettiness. I am in Committee and are only discussing endeavouring to explain to him what the clauses. If you have no amend­ I actually said, so that he will not ment, I can allow you only to seek be confused. any clarification from the Minister. Don't take too long-just the points Dato' Dr. Ismail: Sir, in reply to you want clarified. the Member for Seberang Selatan, I am not a seer and I cannot anticipate Enche' Tan Phock Kin: Very well, events. So, his question is purely on this particular clause, Sir, my hypothetical at the moment. concern is this: as I have pointed out, and it is also the desire of the Minister In answer to the Honourable Mem­ that there should be no political ber for Tanjong, I do not accept his motive ...... suggestions. • - , 3949 26 JANUARY 1962 3950 • Clauses 1 and 2 ordered to stand running the FLDA Schemes and the part of the Bill. provision of the basic amenities. These should be the responsibility of the Bill reported without amendment: Government and it is proposed that read the third time and passed. the Government would give annual subvention to the Authority. THE LAND DEVELOPMENT (AMENDMENT) BILL The settlers should only be asked to pay the subsistence allowance, cost Second Reading of houses and the direct cost of The Deputy Prime Minister and developing their individual holdings. Minister of Rural Development (Tun Haji Abdul Razak): Mr. Speaker, I Amendments to Sections 2 and 5 beg to move that a Bill intituled "an are consequential to the amendments Act to amend the Land Development of Section 8. I trust, therefore, that this Bill will have the support of this Ordinance, 1956" be read a second House. time. This is a simple Bill intended to Sir, I beg to move. amend Section 8 of the Land Develop­ Enche' Tan Siew Sin: Sir, I beg to ment Ordinance, 1956. Section 8 of second the motion. this Ordinance governs the financial policy of the Federal Land Develop­ Question put, and agreed to. ment Authority. Bill accordingly read a second time Under this section, as it stands and committed to a Committee of the now, the Federal Land Development whole House. Authority must balance its accounts taking one year with another, and it House immediately resolved itself has to recover every cent that is spent into Committee on the Bill. on the development of any scheme whether the expenditure is for the Bill considered in Committee. provision of basic services, develop­ (Mr. Speaker in the Chair) ment of individual holdings or admini­ strative expenses. Clauses I to 5 inclusive ordered to stand part of the Bill. It has been decided that it is only fair and proper that certain items of Bill reported without amendment: expenditure incurred by the Federal read the third time and passed. Land Development Authority should be non-recoverable-expenditure in­ THE FEDERATION OF MALAYA cluding cost of managing FLDA RUBBER EXCHANGE (INCOR- schemes and the provision of facilities such as roads, office buildings, health PORATION) BILL centres, etc., etc. Second Reading Now this clause, Clause 4 of the The Asmstant Minister of Commerce Bill, would enable the Authority, on and Industry (Enche' Cheah Theam my direction as Minister of Rural Swee): Mr. Speaker, Sir, I beg to Development and with the concurrence move that a Bill intituled "The of the Treasury, to split the expendi· Federation of Malaya Rubber Ex­ ture into recoverable and non­ change (Incorporation) Bill, 1962" be . recoverable. read a second time. Honourable Members will agree A great deal has been said, is being with me that it is only right and fair said and will be said about rubber and that settlers should not be called upon I do not for a moment doubt that to pay the administrative expenses of there is any lack of concern either in 3951 26 JANUARY 1962 3952 or outside this House with regard to Drafting Committee consisting of the importance of rubber to the rubber trade and legal experts from economy of this country. I, therefore, the Federation, Singapore, London and do not propose to go into this aspect New York was appointed to submit of it and, without much ado, realising recommendations and prepare the its great degree of importance, we necessary legislation, rules and bye­ must do all we can to assure that, laws for the setting up and operation not only at the present time but also of the Exchange. With the exception in the long-term future, we will be of certain modifications, the major able to sell every pound of rubber recommendations of this Drafting that we produce. The most funda­ Committee were accepted by Govern­ mental and essential step to take is, ment following which a statement on therefore, to create conditions in the the setting up of the Rubber Exchange, marketing facilities or organisation in together with the Report of the Drafting this country so that international con­ Committee, was published on the 24th fidence in our rubber market can be October, 1961. achieved. Sir, publicity has already been given Whilst trading in rubber has been in to the recommendations in the Report existence in various parts of the of the Drafting Committee and to the country for as many years as rubber Government's views on the establish­ has been produced, such trading has ment of the Rubber Exchange and they been governed by rules formulated by have been well received by the rubber the trade associations themselves and trade and industry in this country. experience in the last few years has shown that these rules not only require It is needless for me to emphasise the discipline of members to abide by that control of the Federation Rubber but also lack the force of law. As the Exchange must be vested in the hands world's largest producer of natural of persons who are ordinarily resident rubber, it is therefore necessary for in this country. Ordinary membership a marketing organisation to be set up of the Exchange should be limited in to provide facilities to enable the the case of individuals to persons rubber produced in this country to be carrying on business and who are marketed on sound lines which would ordinarily resident in the Federation be acceptable in international trading or in the case of corporations are circles throughout the world. either incorporated in or registered As early as February 1960, the under any written law of the Federa­ Government announced as a matter tion. However, in order to maintain of policy that a . rubber exchange the Pan-Malayan character of the should be set up in the Federation and rubber trade, the Exchange will operate appointed a Committee consisting of on parallel lines with the Singapore Government officials and representa­ Chamber of Commerce Rubber Asso­ tives of all sections of the rubber trade ciation in providing contracts, disci­ and industry to examine what form pline in trade, arbitration, price fixing, of market organisation and legislation etc., including facilities for ordinary would be most suitable. This Com­ dealings in physical rubber and for mittee recommended, inter alia, that a what is commonly known as hedging. Rubber Exchange should be set up Members of the Singapore Chamber immediately in the Federation, of Commerce Rubber Association in membership of which should be open Singapore will therefore be accorded to all members of existing organisations associate membership of the Exchange connected with the rubber trade and arid it is hoped that there is reciprocity industry in the Federation. from Singapore. In order to induce overseas traders to participate in the The recommendations of the Com­ Exchange, provision has also been mittee were accepted in principle by made for such traders to become the Government, following which a overseas members of the Exchange. . -. --- ~

3953 26 JANUARY 1962 3954

Sir, the Government considers that behind the contracts entered into under it is necessary particularly in the initial the rules of the trade associations. years of the Exchange, that the first Provision has therefore been incor­ Board of Directors should be persons porated in the Bill to ensure the appointed by the Minister but whose enforceability of brokers contracts and terms of office would cease with the any broker who intends to conduct coming into force of the first elected guarantee business through the Ex­ Board of Directors. I have said it change would be required to furnish before but I would like to reiterate and maintain a continuing security to here that Government does not wish the Exchange. This is, I am afraid, to control nor interfere with the a far reaching innovation-however, it working of the Exchange, but it is appears to be necessary. Another accepted that in the interest of the important innovation which has been trade that in the early stages there introduced into the Federation Rubber should be the maximum liaison between Exchange is the provision for the the Government and · the Exchange. setting up of a Guarantee Fund to For this reason, there is provision for meet claims arising in event of the a Government Director to serve on the failure of a guarantee broker. A clause first Board of Directors, and it is has been included in the rules of the obvious that a single Government Exchange to enable such a Guarantee Director out of a total of twelve Fund to be set up. The rules provide Directors cannot in any way bring that the Guarantee Fund should be about any Government control or built up to an amount in the region interference in the affairs of the of $2 million by levies on transactions, Exchange. but the Government realises it will take a long time to build up this Fund. With regard to the choice of the In order to ensure that the Exchange members of the first Board of Directors, gets off to a good start, Government I have, in consultation with the Rubber is therefore prepared to guarantee the Producers' Council and Federation of sum of $2 million required to set up Malaya Rubber Trade Association, the Fund provided that the amount appointed persons whom I know are of levv on transactions is to be fixed persons of standing, and knowledge by Government so long as the in the rubber trade and industry. All guarantee has not been liquidated. The the Directors are persons ordinarily Government is also aware that in the resident in the Federation. It is the initial years of the Exchange it may prime concern of Government to ensure not be able to accumulate sufficient that the Exchange, in its infancy, funds to meet the cost of running the should be entrusted to persons who Exchange, and the Government is are able, through their knowledge also prepared to provide a guarantee and experience in the rubber trade, in the region of $150,000 to meet the to operate the Exchange successfully. administration expenses so as to ensure Consideration has also been given to that the Rubber Exchange will operate selecting persons to represent the five successfully right from the beginning. different classes of members, namely, producers, estate selling agents, manu­ Sir, those are about the main facturers' buying agents, brokers and features of the Bill, and I would like dealers. The geographical distribution to say at this stage that there are a of the persons selected as Directors has few amendments to the Schedules of also been taken into account. There the Bill which I will move at the is provision for a Director to be Committee stage, due to some error nominated by the Rubber Producers' in the· arrangement of the Bill and a Council to represent the Producers' few minor printing errors. class. Sir, I beg to move. One _of the greatest shortcomings in the present rubber market in Malaya Enche' Mohamed : Sir; is that there is no statutory force I beg to second the motion. r------• 3955 26 JANUARY 1962 3956 Enche' Zulkiftee bin Muhammad: di-kehendaki dalam kemajuan negara Tuan Yang di-Pertua, di-antara tujuan2 pada masa ini, sama ada perusahaan yang hendak di-jalankan oleh Per­ itu merupakan basil perusahaan yang badanan yang hendak di-luluskan sempurna atau yang tidak sempurna Undang2-nya ini ia-lah untok memaju­ semua-nya ada-lah berguna kapada kan bantu dan mengembangkan serta Persekutuan Tanah Melayu bagi memelihara perusahaan getah pada membolehkan negara ini terlebeh umum-nya, khusus-nya yang bersang­ dahulu menggunakan hasil-nya yang kutan dengan kepentingan Malaya utama. dan orang2 yang bersangkutan dengan pekerjaan ini. Saya telah melihat Dan oleh sebab yang demikian, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya ada-lah dalam Rang Undang2 Perbadanan ini, 2 dan nyata bahawa tugas-nya bagi menyambut baik Rang Undang ini. memelihara ahli2-nya ada-lah di· Enche' K. Karam Singh: Mr. nyatakan. Di-dalam peratoran me­ Speaker, Sir, I rise to raise a small nyatakan satu daripada jenis ahli2.nya matter for clarification. The Honour­ ia-lah saperti yang tertulis dalam muka able Assistant Minister said that he 15 Fasal (b) ia-itu orang yang men­ had appointed the Board of Directors­ jalankan pemiagaan kechil dalam of course, if I am wrong I stand to perusahaan getah. Saya harap, Tuan correction. Now, on page 7, Clause Yang di-Pertua, supaya Menteri dapat 13, there is a list of the first Board memerhatikan bahawa di-dalam of Directors; and as we read through melaksanakan tugas (a) ia-itu tujuan the names, we find the names of Perbadanan ini. Soal2 yang bersang­ "Cheah Ewe Keat, who shall be the kutan dengan menambah elokkan Chairman" and "Tee Teh, who shall penghasilan bagi mereka yang ber­ be the Deputy Chairman"; and then kebun kechil di-perhatikan, terutama come the other names. Now, as a mereka yang tidak mempunyal alat2 matter of enquiry, I would like to memajukan dalam hal ini, sebab-nya, know what are the considerations that Tuan Yang di-Pertua, walau pun a Bill of this nature should state so Persekutuan Tanah Melayu ini categorically that Mr. Cheah Ewe Keat mempunyai ladang2 yang besar yang shall be the Chairman. What are these masing2 dari sharikat ladang itu considerations that have led to this tentu-lah akan menjadi ahli bagi very strong-in fact, absolute-stipula­ Perbadanan ini tidak-lah chukup tion that Mr. Cheah Ewe Keat shall dari segi kemajuan ekonomi negeri be the Chairman. ini sa-kira-nya di-biarkan mereka yang berladang kechil itu tidak maiu saperti Tuan Haji Ahmad bin Abdullah sekarang ini, terutama orang2 Melavu (Kota Bharu Hilir): Tuan Yang di­ di-kampong yang getah2 mereka itu Pertua, saya hendak berchakap sadikit di-keluarkan dengan mendapat grade sahaja. Sa-bagaimana yang kita telah yang rendah, yang demikian pendapat­ dengar uchapan Penolong Menteri an mereka kechil. Hal ini sengaja saya Perdagangan dan Perusahaan bahawa sebutkan di-sini. sebab selalu-nya Perbadanan ini ia-lah satu perbadanan apabila perniagaan di-.ialankan dengan yang sangat mustahak dan sangat sa-chara besar2an, maka kerap-lah penting bagi kernajuan atau pun kepentingan orang2 kechil tertinggal perdagangan getah dalam negeri ini. dalam-nya. dan dengan ada-nya exchange ini maka dapat-lah perkara pasaran itu di-ator Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya sukachita dengan chara yang baik. Sa-bagaimana dengan ada-nya tujuan (L) dalam yang kita tahu ada-lah smallholder Perbadanan ini yang mengusahakan yang banyak sa-kali ia-lah terdiri bagi menggalakkan penyiasatan di­ daripada orang Melayu dan dealers dalam guna2 getah dia akan menyebar­ ada juga terdiri daripada orang Melayu kan basil penyiasatan itu kapada orang saperti yang tersebut dalam muka 10 ramai. Ini-, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, ia-itu Abdul Jalil bin Aminudin dan ada-lah satu perkara yang sangat Haji Abdul Rahman bin Mahmood. • ~ 3957 26 JANUARY 1962 3958 Tetapi, apabila kita pandang padang meeting of this Board; and the reason muka 7 tentang Board of Directors, why we happen to choose Enche' tidak ada sa-orang pun orang Melayu Cheah Ewe Keat to be the first Chair­ yang di-lantek menjadi anggota dalam man of the Board is that we consider Jema'ah Pengarah ini. Saya fikir him fit in every way-he is a loyal sudah-lah tiba masa-nya bagi Kemen­ man who has proved his worth to the terian Perdagangan dan Perusahaan, country. yang sa-tahu saya suka hendak menolong orang2 Melayu dalam Enche' K. Karam Singh: Mr. perkara perdagangan, elok-lah bagi­ Speaker, Sir, on a point of clarification, nya supaya di-masokkan sa-orang dua I would like to know this. There are menjadi anggota Jema'ah Pengarah. ten names on page 7 of the Bill, Clause Dengan chara yang demikian sahaja­ 13. From the reply of the Honourable lah baharu orang Melayu dapat masok Minister, are we to assume that the dan berlumba2 bersama di-dalam nine names following the name of medan perdagangan dan dapat belajar Mr. Cheah Ewe Keat are names of pelajaran yang baik yang akan dapat persons less loyal to Malaya than Mr. memberi keuntongan dan kebaikan Cheah Ewe Keat? bagi kemajuan perdagangan ekonomi. Enche' Mohamed Khir Johari: Enche' Mohamed Khir Johari: I have only answered the question on Tuan Yang di-Pertua, bagi menjawab the appointment of the Chairman. soal yang di-bawa oleh Yang Ber­ With regard to the appointment of the hormat dari Kota Bharu Hilir, yang Board of Directors, I will quote the sa-benar-nya, perkara itu memang appropriate paragraph of the speech dalam pengetahuan saya sendiri, dan of the Assistant Minister when he jika Yang Berhormat itu semak dalam introduced this Bill-he said: Fasal 11 (1) di-situ ia akan nampak ahli-nya akan di-lantek oleh Rubber "I have, in consultation with the Rubber Producers' Council and Federa­ Producers Council, dan ahli itu ia-lah tion of Malaya Rubber Trade Association, Ahli Tetap. Ahli2 yang di-lantek bagi appointed persons whom I know are Lembaga Pengarah itu chuma sa-takat persons of standing and knowledge in Meshuarat Agong Yang Pertama the rubber trade and industry." sahaja. Dengan sebab itu ada-lah di-chadangkan bahawa wakil dari That, Sir, is the criterion. pekebun kechil ada-lah termasok Enche' Cheah Theam Swee: Mr. dalam Fasal 11 (1) ini. Jadi dia akan Speaker, Sir, I think, in reply to the menjadi Ahli Tetap dalam Lembaga Honourable Members from the PMIP, Pengarah itu. Saya harap keterangan the points raised by them have been ini memuaskan hati Yang Berhormat adequately replied by my Honourable itu. Minister, and I would only add that Bagi tu juga pandangan Yang Ber­ I do appreciate the views. In fact, we hormat dari Bachok berkenaan dengan on this side of the House, have, kepentingan orang2 kechil. Yang sa­ perhaps, a greater interest, and stronger benar-nya, pengundi2 saya pun views too, on the question of diffi­ kebanyakan terdiri daripada orang2 culties of smallholders in respect of kechil, jadi saya tidak boleh lupa di­ the way and manner in which we atas kepentingan mereka itu. should improve their standard of living. However, that is not the main With regard to the point raised by basis of the Bill. As the Honourable the Honourable Member for Daman­ Minister has already replied to that sara regarding the choice of Chairman, adequately, I do not want to waste the I can only refer to the speech of the time of the House. Assistant Minister, when he explained why it was necessary to appoint the In regard to the enquiry as the first Board of Directors pending the Honourable. Member for Damansara holding of the first annual general puts it, I do not know whether he is

______.__ -

3959 26 JANUARY 1962 3960 trying to embarrass me, or in any way that it is of benefit to have him as trying to belittle the purpose of the the Chairman of the Exchange. Bill. I have only to say this. Mr. Cheah Ewe Keat has been in the Enche' K. Karam Singh: Rises. rubber trade for not less than thirty years-perhaps, longer than the Hon­ Mr. Speaker: You have no more ourable Member for Damansara and I right to speak! have. seen daylight (laughter)-and the Enche' K. Karam Singh: On a Ministry considers him, perhaps, the point of clarification, if you will allow most competent man at this time. I me, Sir. I do not wish to embarrass know it is a bit too much for me to anyone, and personally the Honourable make such a remark on Mr. Cheah Assistant Minister and I are good Ewe Keat, but the Ministry does friends. But I just like ...... consider him, having such a lot of experience in the rubber trade as a Mr. Speaker: In fact, I don't under­ man who knows all the difficulties, all stand all these! (Laughter). It has the drawbacks and all the setbacks nothing to do with this and I am not that exist in the rubber trade today, interested in this. that he would be a suitable Chairman for the first Board of Directors. Enche' K. Karam Singh: Sir, I wish Further, there is nothing to gain as to point out that it has been stated Chairman or members of the Board that Mr. Cheah Ewe Keat has been of Directors. All they do is to offer thirty years in the rubber industry and their services, their knowledge, for the that is one of the strong reasons that good and for the betterment of the has attributed to his being appointed rubber trade in this country, which as the Chairman. I would just want means the nucleus of the Malayan to know, as a matter of interest. economy. I do not know why this point whether the nine other persons, was raised-perhaps. the Honourable whose names are given here, are junior Member for Damansara would like in the number of years in the associa­ me to elaborate further and I would tion with the rubber industry to Mr. try to do so though it would be a Cheah Ewe Keat or not. source of embarrassment to me holding the office as the Assistant Minister of Mr. Speaker: I think you can raise Commerce and Industry to have to that matter later when we are in the take part in the appointment of Mr. Committee. (To Enche' Cheah Theam Cheah Ewe Keat as Chairman. Swee) Do you want to say anything now? Sir, in fact, the initial idea was to appoint Mr. Tee Teh as the Chairman Enche' Cheah Theam Swee: I do of the Exchange-Mr. Tee Teh is listed not think it is necessary. now as the Deputy Chairman. Between Question put, and agreed to. Mr. Tee Teh and Mr. Cheah Ewe Keat, it has been found-I think this Bill accordingly read a second time has gone through many stages of and committed to a Committee of the deliberations between rubber trade whole House. members and all the people involved in the rubber trade-that the most House immediately resolved itself suitable person to be Chairman of the into a Committee on the Bill. first Board would be Mr. Cheah Ewe Bill considered in Committee. Keat. I do not tl1ink for a moment that either the Honourable Member for (Mr. Speaker in the Chair) Damansara or I or any other Member in this House can claim any authority Clauses I to 19 inclusive ordered on the rubber trade, or any knowledge to stand part of the Bill. of it, to an extent possessed by Mr. Bill reported without amendment: Cheah Ewe Keat. I, therefore, think read the third time and passed. ""

3961 26 JANUARY 1962 3962

First Schedu/,e- 76. Union Rubber Brokers (Malaya) Ltd.- 508, Lee Yan Lian Building, Kuala Enche' Cheah Theam Swee: Mr. Lumpur. Chairman, Sir, I beg to move an (2) that the words "who shall be a person amendment to the First Schedule, on ordinarily resident in the Federation" pages 10 and 11. Due to a printing appearing under Rule 86 of the Second Schedule (page 35) be placed within error "Lee Seng Peng" has been brackets. printed as "See Seng Peng" at 38. A further amendment to this Schedule is Sir, this list of names was in fact to add the list of names circulated in originally to be printed in the Bill, the notice of amendments and tabled but due to some error in the arrange­ in this House. I accordingly move- ment and compiling of the papers, this part was left out. (l) that the First Schedule to the Bill be amended: Enche' Tan Phock Kin: Sir, may I seek clarification from the Minister (a) by substituting the name "Lee Seng Peng" for "See Seng Peng" concerned with regard to the list of appearing under 38; original members. It seems to me that (b} by supplementing the following there are quite a number of member­ additional names and addresses of ship apparently from the same firm. persons and firms after 59 : For example, 5 and 6-Bee Seng & Co. 60. Ban Lee Chan & Co. Ltd.-37, Klyne and Bee Seng Co. Ltd.-are both Street, Kuala Lumpur. of the same address. Can the Minister 61. Central Investment Co. Ltd.-39, Jalan kindly inform the House as to the Mersing, Kluang, Johore. reasons why firms with apparently the same interest are allowed to be mem­ 62. Chin Guan Leong-5, Pekan Melayu, Alor Star, Kedah. bers? What advantages do they get by becoming members? 63. Chop Hock Hin-40, Pekan Pcndang Pendang, Kedah. Secondly, may I know how did they 64. Dunlop Rubber Purchasing Co. Ltd.-- make the list of new members. Is it 28, Kampong Java Road, Klang. because applications were made by 65. Firestone Malaya Ltd.-Malayan Rail­ them to become mem hers of this ways Godown 3, Brickfields Road, exchange? Whether the fact was Kuala Lumpur. advertised and membership called for? 66. Ghee Seng Co.-46, Jalan Campbell, Or is it merely because that they are Kuala Lumpur. members of existing rubber trade 67. Harper Gilfillan & Co. Ltd.-Mount­ associations and automatically become batten Road, Kuala Lumpur. members of this exchange? 68. Hock Tong & Co.-91, Ampang Road, Kuala Lumpur. Enche' Cheah Theam Swee: Mr. 69. Kuek Ho Yao-4, Jalan Bukit Changar, Chairman, Sir, I do not blame the Johore Bahru, Johore. Honourable Member for Tanjong for 70. Maclaine Watson (Federation) Ltd.­ popping up and asking such a question, Eastern Bank Building, The Embank­ as we know that he often does so in ment, Kuala Lumpur. a manner like this. As we know, in 71. Saw Seng Kew-Saw Seng Kew & Co. the case of names of people of Chinese Ltd., 23, Beach Street, Penang. origin in this country, we can find a 72. Sin Aik Joo-4, Klyne Street, Kuala hundred Tan Ah Kows. So, it is not Lumpur. surprising for us to find Bee Seng & Co. 73. Societe des Matieres Premieres Tropi­ and Bee Seng Co. Ltd. reading through cales-188 Sungei Besi Road, Kuala the list. It is more significant perhaps Lumpur. that he has noticed that the address 74. South Malaya Co. Ltd.-39, Jalan is the same. Now, I would like to Mersing, Kluang, Johore. point out to the Member for Tanjong 15. Tong Teik Co. Ltd.-B-3, 2nd Floor, that one is a company perhaps Elceetee Building, 33-C, Beach Street, constituted by way of partnership or Penang. by way of sole ownership-we do not ,..---- ~-- ~-~- - ---

3963 26 JANUARY 1962 3964 know-and the other one is a limited company and, therefore, in control of company, which is registered under the limited company. In other words, the Companies Ordinance of the this particular man will have two Federation of Malaya and the limited votes if he is controlling one vote for company is a separate legal entity from himself and one vote for the limited an individual person. So, if we have company in which he has majority Bee Seng & Co. as a member and interests. So far as the Minister or the Bee Seng Co. Ltd. as another member, Ministry is concerned, this very point then we have two members in the is an important one, because by so exchange. doing you are actually allowing dual membership and anybody with money On the other question, as to the can become members twice. He can way in which these first members were incorporate various limited companies listed, well, perhaps again, as displayed in which he has the majority interests earlier today, he did not follow the and he can even control the exchange. activities of the Government properly If he says that Bee Seng & Co. and Bee and he has found curiosity in this Seng Co. Ltd. are distinctly two legal respect. Statements were made in the entities, it is true. But has he press and circulars sent to various examined these companies to see to it associations calling for a meeting and that they are not controlled by one it was in fact convened at the Rubber person? There are other instances Research Institute theatre. All those here; for example, you have 11, Cheah who desired to be members attended Ewe Keat, 243 Circular Road and 20, the meeting and they turn out to be Ewe Keat, Ltd., 4-6 Ampang Street. the first members. There were no Similarly, 28, Heah Joo Seang, Rubber hush-hush methods or back-door Trade Association of Penang, 16, methods. Anson Road and then you have Hock Lye Co. Ltd., which is a well-known Mr. Speaker: That is going beyond firm of Mr. Heah Joo Seang. So, I the matter under debate. suggest that this matter should also be considered by the Ministry-the Enche' Cheah Theam Swee: Sir, I question of control. am trying to explain that there were no hush-hush methods in constituting Enche' Cheah Theam Swee: I think these members. By the tone of the it would be necessary for me to clarify question from the Honourable Member the point which the Honourable from Tanjong we must assume that Member for Tanjong has raised. Now, we are under suspicion, or that these the idea is not to limit the member­ members were listed by me. I assure ship of this exchange to one single this House that everything was done individual. The idea is to see that in an open manner. In fact, this was there are provisions for regulating the conducted by officials of the Ministry present day very unsatisfactory state and it had nothing to do with us­ of affairs in the rubber trade into a popping around listing the names better and acceptable form of market­ ourselves. ing system, and it is perhaps desirable to have as members of this exchange Enche' Tan Phock Kin: I am rather all those involved in the rubber trade. surprised to hear the manner in which It is not a question of control, or the Assistant Minister has replied my reaping benefit from the exchange. In perfectly simple question which made fact, there is._ no question .of anybody no insinuation whatsoever. He gave being able to reap any benefit from the me a very remarkable answer-that exchange. The idea is to get these peo­ one is a limited company and the ple who are involved in the trade and other is not. The whole point is this: who are desirous of contributing to a I would like to point out that it is better trading system to be members of possible that an individual may have the exchange. And if every entity who predominant interests in a limited is involved in the trade becomes a •

3965 26 JANUARY 1962 3966 member of the exchange, it will be House is that the words "who shall easier for the market to exercise a be a person ordinarily resident in the form of discipline and control and Federation" appearing under Rule 86 perhaps better trading manner of the Second Schedule be placed amongst the rubber traders. That is the within brackets. idea and it is therefore desirable to get all the separate entities in the trade Amendment put, and agreed to. to be members of the exchange. Enche' Tan Phock Kin: Sir, on Amendment put, and agreed to. page 14, Rule No. 3 of the Second Schedule, under aasses and Categories First Schedule, as amended, ordered of Membership, there is provision for to stand part of the Bill. membership, and in view of the state­ ment by the Assistant Minister, Sir, I Second Schedule- take it that it is desirable that as many members of the trade as possible Enche' Cheah Theam Swee: Mr. should join the Corporation. But Chairman, Sir, I propose to move an under th.is Rule, they have to apply amendment to Rule 86, on page 35, for merbership, and in some cases, I Second Schedule, as follows: take it, their applications may be That the words "who shall be a rejected by the Board. So if it is the person ordinarily resident in the desire that every category of people Federation" appearing under Rule 86 in the trade should be eligible to be of the Second Schedule be placed within members, what can such people do brackets. should their applications be rejected by the Board. because there is a fear This is only a printing error, Sir, that should the Board desire to limit because if those words are not placed its membership, which is inconsistent within brackets, then the meaning of with the desire of the Assistant the regulation will be quite different. Minister, then the people concerned, though they are legitimately in the Enche' Tan Phock Kin: Sir, I rise trade, will have no recourse. Are there again to seek clarification and I must any provisions in the Rules to safe­ say to the Assistant Minister that it guard them against such an even­ is a desire to seek clarification and tuality? nothing else-I am not insinuating anything. With regard to membership, Enche' Cheah Theam Swee: Sir, the Assistant Minister has expressed whether or not there are provisions in the view that it is desirable that as the Rules, I presume the Honourahle many people as possible in the trade Member for Tanjong will take the should be members of the Association trouble to read all the Rules. and under the Rule on Membership, it says that members will have to apply Enche' Tan Phock Kin: Sir, I and will have to be elected. thought that we are here to discuss this Bill, and I am merely seeking Enche' Cheah Theam Swee: That is a clarification. on Schedule Two. Mr. Chairman: The Honourable Enche' Tan Phock Kin: Yes, I am Member for Tanjong is asking for a speaking on Schedule Two, page 14, clarification; he wants to know under No. 3. I thought we are now on the what Rule is there recourse for a Second Schedule. person whose application for member­ ship is rejected. Mr. Speaker: I shall have to dispose of this amendment. first, then you Enche' Cheah Theam Swee: Well, I can ask for clarification on that, do not see how the Honourable because we are still on the Second Member for Taniong can envisage Schedule. The amendment before the such a possibility. I think Rule 3 here ......

3967 26 JANUARY 1962 3968 sets out quite clearly that membership total expenditure did not exceed the shall be also open to those eligible total estimated cost shown in the 1961 for membership in accordance with Estimates, there was no need for us the provisions of these Rules. to seek the sanction of this House for these adjustments. Second Schedule, as amended, ordered to stand part of the Bill. However, it was inevitable that there should be certain cases in which Bill reported with amendment: the original estimated cost of a read the third time and passed. scheme proved to be insufficient, and a few cases also where it was necessary MOTIONS to create completely new Sub-heads. If the Government finds it necessary to mE DEVELOPMENT (SUPPLE­ increase the total estimated cost of a MENTARY) (NO. 1) ESTIMATES, scheme or to create a· new Sub-head 1961 in the Development Estimates the approval of this House has to be The Minister of Finance (lnche' Tan sought by Supplementary Estimate, Siew Sin): Mr. Speaker, Sir. I beg to and this is what is now being done move, in the case of the 16 items included "That this House shall immediately in Command Paper No. 49 of 1961. resolve itself into Committee of the Since ample savings were available whole House to consider the expendi­ from other Sub-heads to supply the ture proposed in the statement laid on actual money required for these 16 the Table as Command Paper No. 49 items, there would be no purpose in of 1961, and to recommend whether the our asking the House to approve a same shall be approved by this House disbursement of additional funds, with or without modification." except by way of token votes. It is It may seem strange, Sir, that in for this reason that only a token sum these Supplementary Development of $10 is shown against each Estimates, I am asking the House to Sub-head concerned, while the approve only this small sum of $160, additional funds required for each but this figure is the total of 16 token scheme, which were provided by vire­ votes of $10 each, behind which lies ment from other Sub-heads, are noted a net increase of $21,212,000 in the in the "Remarks" column. The total total estimated cost to completion of . amount provided by these virements is the schemes included in the Develop­ $4,639,019. ment Estimates for 1961. Sir, I beg to move. When the Government introduced Tun Haji Abdul Razak: Sir, I beg the 1961 Development Estimates last to second the motion. April, I informed the House that the full amount of $455 million· included Question put, and agreed to. in them was not likely to be spent during the year, but that in order to House immediately resolved itself allow a start to be made over a broad into a Committee of the whole House. field it had been decided to include Development (Supplementary) (No. provision for a wide range of different 1) Estimates, 1961, considered in schemes. As the year proceeded it Committee. became apparent that some schemes could proceed faster than others and (Mr. Speaker in the Chair) in such cases, the Treasury used its powers under the Development Fund Head 100-:-. Ordinance to transfer sums which were Enche' Tan Siew Sin: Mr. Chairman, not at once required under one Sub­ Sir, I beg tMalacca. Sir, I beg 1961. to move. Enche' Zulkiflee bin Muhammad: Head 114- Tuan Yang di-Pertua, boleh-kah saya Tun Haji Abdul Razak: Mr. mendapat sadikit penjelasan? Kenapa Chairman, Sir, I beg to move that ---~-----

3971 26 JANUARY 1962 3972 expenditure amounting to $10 (token entered in the Supplementary Esti­ vote) under Head 114, Sub-head 61, mates for the purpose of informing the be approved. Actually, the amount House. required under this Head is $2,297,000; and this large sum of Question put, and agreed to. money is required for the purchase of Tbe sum of $20 for Head 120 Ferrets armoured cars and spares for agreed to stand part of the Develop­ our Am1ed Forces. It is possible to ment (Supplementary) (No. 1) Esti­ find this amount by virement from mates, 1961. various Sub-heads as indicated in the Command Paper. Head 130- Question put, and agreed to. Tun Haji Abdul Razak: Mr. Chairman, Sir, I beg to move that a The sum of $10 for Head 114 agreed token vote of $10 under Head 130, to stand part of the Development Sub-head 44, be approved. The sum (Supplementary) (No. 1) Estimates, of $737,264 is required for expendi­ 1961. ture under this Sub-head, Financial Assistance to Padi Cultivators. Sir, it Head 120- is the remnant of the old scheme of Enche' Tan Siew Sin: Mr. Chair­ granting financial assistance to padi man, Sir, I beg to move that the cultivators under the Interim Report of expenditure shown at Head 120 total­ Rice Cultivation of 1955. I might ad­ ling $20 be approved. vise that this is the last expenditure required under this Sub-head. t Only a token provision of $10 each has been made in the Development Question put, and agreed to. (Supplementary) (No. 1) Estimates, The sum of $10 for Head 130 1961 for two Sub-heads appearing in agreed to stand part of the Develop­ the portfolio of the Treasury. ment (Supplementary) (No. 1) Esti­ The first of these is in respect of mates, 1961. the establishment of a Customs office Head 132- and quarters in Rompin to facilitate the collection of export duty on iron­ Tun Haji Abdul Razak: Mr. Chair­ ore produced by mines in that area. man, Sir, I beg to move that the A sum of $6,000 was required to expenditure amounting to $20 under purchase land for the purpose and Head 132 be approved. the funds were provided by virement from Sub-head 18. A token provision A token provision of $10 is of $10 has, however, been entered in required under Sub-head 18 for the Supplementary Estimates so that expenditure on Small Irrigation the matter may be brought to the Schemes in Pahang. The original attention of this House. amount estimated was $20,090 but it has been found insufficient. So the The second Sub-head is Sub-head amount of $30,000 is required which 20--Customs Office, Penang. In view is found by virement from Sub-head of the fact that export duty is being 54. collected on rubber produced in Pen'ang after 1st January, 1962, it An equal token amount of $10 is was necessary to erect an office at the requested under Sub-head 80 for the loading and unloading wharf at Kemubu Irrigation Scheme, Kelantan. Penang to provide facilities for the It has been found that it is possible collection of the duty. The total cost to spend $80,000 under the Scheme in of the building amounting to $32,000 1961. Therefore, this amount is was met from savings in Sub-head 18 required and it has been found by and a token provision of $10 has been virement from Sub-head 55. ~

~ 3973 26 JANUARY 1962 3974 Question put, and agreed to. monsoon conditions from October onwards it was not advisable at that The sum of $20 for Head 132 stage to recall tenders and it was agreed to stand part of the Develop­ decided that this be deferred to late ment (Supplementary) (No. 1) Esti­ December, 1961. mates, 1961. :j,, Originally, the building envisaged Head 133- for this project was to be similar to Tun Haji Abdul Razak: Sir, I beg the timber type constructed at' to move that a token amount of $10 Jementah. But in view of the fact be approved under Head 133, that such a building would not Sub-head 9. The sum required withstand monsoon conditions in the represents the additional provision of East Coast, it is now decided that a $15,000 for Regional Fry Breeding concrete post and panel type should and Distribution Scheme in Kuala be constructed instead. As a result, Kangsar. additional provision is required to supplement the authorised provision. Question put, and agreed to. The whole project is now estimated to cost $59,969. A sum of $2,795 has The sum of $10 for Head 133 been spent on the project and a agreed to stand part of the Develop­ provision of $57,174 has, therefore, ment (Supplementary) (No. 1) Esti­ been included in the Development mates, 1961. Estimates, 1962. Head 136- Question put, and agreed to. The Minister of Transport (Dato' The sum of $10 for Head 136 f Sardon bin Haji Jubir): Mr. Chair­ agreed to stand part of the Develop­ man, Sir, I beg to move that a token ment (Supplementary) (No. 1) Esti­ vote of $10 under Sub-head 10, mates, 1961. Head 136, Postal Services, be approved. Mr. Chairman: I think it is time to suspend the_ meeting. The original provision in respect of Kuala Rompin Post Office and House resumes. Quarters was $40,000 but due to high cost in the transportation of materials Mr. Speaker: Honourable Members, to the area, the provision was found I have to report that the Committee to be insufficient to construct the new of the whole House, which has Post Office. A supplement of $10,000 been considering the Development was approved by Virement Warrant (Supplementary) (No. 1) Estimates, No. 2 of 1961 from savings offered 1961, has progressed up to Head 136 under Sub-head 27, Post Office of those Estimates. Petaling Jaya, but the project could The House is now adjourned to not be pursued because the tenders had 10.00 o'clock tomorrow morning. already lapsed after extension of the validity period. In view of the Adjourned at 10.30 p.m.