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TRIAL - November 18, 2016 (Vol. XII) Florida v. Georgia 2945 1 PROCEEDINGS 2 SPECIAL M ASTER LANCASTER: G ood morning, 2943 3 counsel. ` SUPREME COURT OF THE UNITED STATES No. 142, Original 4 MR. PRIMIS: G ood mornin g, your H onor. 5 MR. PERRY: G ood morning. STATE OF FLORIDA, ) ) SPECIAL M ASTER LANCASTER: G ood morning, Plaintiff, ) 6 ) V. ) VOLUME XII 7 Claudette. ) STATE OF GEORGIA ) ) 8 THE REPORTER: G ood morning. Defendants. ) 9 MR. PRIMIS: Your H onor, Craig Primis TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS 10 for the State of G eorgia. Florida has put on The above-entitled matter came on for HEARING 11 its last w itness, so G eorgia is going to before SPECIAL MASTER RALPH I. LANCASTER, held in the U. S. Bankruptcy Court, at 537 Congress Street, 12 begin its case now. Portland, Maine, on November 18, 2016, commencing at 13 And I figured, like Mr. Perry has been 8:55 a.m., before Claudette G. Mason, RMR, CRR, a 14 doing, I w ill giv e the game plan for the next Notary Public in and for the State of Maine. 15 several days. APPEARANCES: For the State of Florida: PHILIP J. PERRY, ESQ. 16 SPECIAL M ASTER LANCASTER: Thank you. JAMIE L. WINE, ESQ. ABID R. QURESHI, ESQ. 17 MR. PRIMIS: Today Georgia will call tw o BENJAMIN M. LAWLESS, ESQ. GEORGE C. CHIPEV, ESQ. 18 form er directors of the Environm ental For the State of Georgia: CRAIG S. PRIMIS, ESQ. CHRISTOPHER J. MANER, ESQ. 19 Protection Division. First, Jud Turner; and KAREN McCARTAN DeSANTIS, ESQ. EMILY K. MERKI, ESQ. 20 then when he's done, M s. Carol Couch. And I Also Present: JOSHUA D. DUNLAP, ESQ. 21 think we can get through both witnesses today 22 based on the estim ates from Florida. THE REPORTING GROUP 23 Then Monday, w e will call D r. W ei Zeng, Mason & Lockhart 24 whose nam e you have heard several times. 25 He's the State of G eorgia chief hydrologist. THE REPORTING GROUP Mason & Lockhart 2944 INDEX 2946 1 And Katie Kirkpatrick, w ho is the vice chair Witness Direct Cross Redirect Recross 2 of the Metropolitan North G eorgia Water Judson Turner 2947 2948 3029 3078 3 Planning District. And she's going to talk Carol Couch, Ph.D. 3105 3106 3135 3147 4 about M & I, m unicipal and industrial. And 5 then Tuesday, w hich is our last day before EXHIBITS 6 the holid ay break, w e plan to call Peter Number Page Referenced 7 Mayer, our expert on M & I, and Mark M asters, JX-21 3115, 3137, 3149 8 who works at the Water Policy Center at JX-69 3009, 3078 JX-73 3059, 3088 9 Albany State which is interested in JX-86 3045, 3086 JX-105 2969 10 agricultural w ater use. JX-126 3048, 3087 JX-154 2966 11 We believe we can get through all those ----------------------------------------------------- FX-46 3110 12 witnesses based on our negotiations and FX-47 3118 FX-49b 3017 13 mutual estimates. It is possible on Tuesday FX-49g 3015 FX-49h 3016 14 before the Thanksgiving break that if w e FX-50 3007 15 finish early, w hat -- that w e could finish FX-51 3008 FX-54 2957 16 early. W e don't know for sure. But w e FX-56 2977 FX-65 3120 17 belie ve it's probably best to h ave Mark FX-67 3020 FX-77 2991 18 Masters as the defined last w itness so that FX-85 3079 FX-97 3005 19 Dr. Panday, w ho is com ing after him and all FX-109 3126 FX-115 3133 20 of the people on both teams who are preparin g FX-232 2996 FX-534 2950, 3029, 3088 21 for D r. Panday don't have to stay here FX-536 2998 22 instead of going hom e to see their families FX-599 3018 FX-708 2983 23 when he very well likely will n ot go on. FX-879 3012 FX-901 3106 24 So that w ould be the plan. And then we FX-904 3079 ----------------------------------------------------- 25 will start right after the holiday break with GX-1325 3031, 3084 THE REPORTING GROUP THE REPORTING GROUP Mason & Lockhart Mason & Lockhart 1 of 87 sheets Page 2943 to 2946 of 3193 The Reporting Group (207) 797-6040 TRIAL - November 18, 2016 (Vol. XII) Florida v. Georgia 2947 2949 1 Dr. Panday. 1 MR. PERRY: Now, your Honor, in addition 2 SPECIAL MASTER LANCASTER: Thank you. 2 to those binders, we actually have the 3 MR. PRIMIS: Thank you, your Honor. 3 material that we would like to conduct our 4 Right now the State of Georgia would 4 examination with today. So with your 5 like to call Judson Turner to the stand. 5 permission I would like to -- 6 THE CLERK: Please raise your right 6 SPECIAL MASTER LANCASTER: Please. 7 hand. 7 MR. PRIMIS: Thank you. 8 Do you solemnly swear that the testimony 8 MR. PERRY: Your Honor, the binder may 9 you shall give in the cause now in hearing 9 seem a little heavy that I just handed out; 10 shall be the truth, the whole truth, and 10 but it has some big documents. And I don't 11 nothing but the truth, so help you God? 11 think that we will be here, at least in my 12 THE WITNESS: I do. 12 examination, for more than two hours, 13 THE CLERK: Please be seated. 13 probably fewer than two hours. 14 Pull yourself right up to the microphone 14 BY MR. PERRY: 15 and please state your name and spell your 15 Q. So good morning. Shall I call you Director 16 last name. 16 Turner or Mr. Turner? 17 THE WITNESS: Judson Turner, J U D S O N, 17 A. Well, I'm no longer a director; so mister would 18 T U R N E R. 18 be fine. 19 DIRECT EXAMINATION 19 Q. Sometimes you still call people by their former 20 BY MR. PRIMIS: 20 title, so -- 21 Q. Good morning, Mr. Turner. 21 A. Sometimes. 22 A. Good morning. 22 Q. All right, sir. You have a hydrology modeling 23 Q. A few tips before we begin. Make sure you speak 23 unit that you oversaw for about four years while 24 into the microphone today. And also, if you can 24 you were director; is that right? 25 speak slowly so the court reporter gets 25 A. That's correct. THE REPORTING GROUP THE REPORTING GROUP Mason & Lockhart Mason & Lockhart 2948 2950 1 everything you say, that would be terrific. 1 Q. And it was your intent in overseeing that 2 Now, Mr. Turner, I have handed you a copy of 2 hydrology modeling unit, that the work be as 3 your written direct testimony. And, sir, do you 3 accurate as possible. Right? 4 adopt that as your sworn testimony in this case? 4 A. Absolutely. Sure. 5 A. Yes. 5 Q. And Mr. Zeng was head of the hydrology modeling 6 MR. PERRY: Good morning, your Honor. 6 unit while you were director? 7 SPECIAL MASTER LANCASTER: Good morning, 7 A. That's correct. 8 Mr. Perry. 8 Q. Okay. So I would like you to turn with me, 9 CROSS-EXAMINATION 9 please, to tab 1 of the large binder we just 10 BY MR. PERRY: 10 handed out, which is Florida Exhibit 534. And 11 Q. Good morning, Mr. Turner. 11 the exhibit is titled Unimpaired Flow Assessment 12 A. Good morning. 12 for the Apalachicola-Chattahoochee-Flint River 13 MR. PERRY: Your Honor, we had a series 13 Basin. Do you see that, sir? 14 of video clips we already played for 14 A. I do. 15 Mr. Turner. We played video clips for 15 Q. And it says there, developed by the Georgia Water 16 Mr. Turner earlier in this proceeding; and I 16 Resources Institute. Do you know what that 17 am not going to cover the exact same ground 17 entity is? 18 as in those video clips. The parties will 18 A. I do. I know that they're at Georgia Tech; but 19 provide all of the video clips and deposition 19 that's -- I couldn't tell you exactly all of 20 designations at the end; but for the Court's 20 their work. But I'm aware of them. 21 convenience, we have a binder of those video 21 Q. Might you turn to the second page, please, of 22 clips for Mr. Turner that we already played. 22 Florida Exhibit 534. 23 And I would like to hand those up, if I 23 A. Yes. 24 might. 24 Q. Do you see the name A. P. Georgakakos in about 25 SPECIAL MASTER LANCASTER: Please. 25 the middle of that page, the second page of THE REPORTING GROUP THE REPORTING GROUP Mason & Lockhart Mason & Lockhart Page 2947 to 2950 of 3193 2 of 87 sheets TRIAL - November 18, 2016 (Vol. XII) Florida v. Georgia 2951 2953 1 Florida Exhibit 534? 1 A. I think that's right. 2 A. Yes. 2 Q. Okay. So if you read with me just two paragraphs 3 Q. And do you know that gentleman? 3 down, the first sentence says, the assessment 4 A. I do know Dr. Georgakakos. 4 demonstrates that the UIF series has both random 5 Q. And you worked with him from time to time while 5 and systematic errors.