Association for Diplomatic Studies and Training Foreign Affairs Oral History Collection Foreign Assistance Series
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Association for Diplomatic Studies and Training Foreign Affairs Oral History Collection Foreign Assistance Series DALE D. CLARK Interviewed by Robert Zigler Initial interview date: October 14, 1998 Copyright 2010 ADST TABLE OF CONTENTS Background Born and raised in Utah Uni ersity of Utah, Columbia and Har ard Uni ersities Mormon Missionary in Germany (1931-1934) Department of Agriculture 1935 Tenant Farmers ,rogram -estern States Contribution of small Church groups M./. -ilson U.S. Na y1 /ondon, 2ngland 1941-1945 ,reparations for in asion of France Military go ernment 3oint operations with political officers ,lanning and coordination in Germany Morgenthau ,lan Herbert Hoo er 5Conflicts in ,lanning at Supreme Head6uarters7 Har ard Uni ersity1 Faculty Member 1945- Berlin, Germany1 Ci il Affairs Di ision, Military Go ernment (OMGUS) General /ucius Clay 5Fighting Group Against Humanity7 2d /itchfield 5Museum at Checkpoint Charlie7 Bremen, Germany1 Ci il Affairs Di ision Operations Berlin, Germany1 Ci il Affairs Di ision, (OMGUS) 1949 1 Georg Dertinger, dinner guest /ifting Berlin blockade Berlin airlift /a rentiy Beria Transition to ci ilian go ernment Germany9 Itinerate ,rofessor, Uni ersity of Maryland 1949 South Ruislip, Germany1 ,rofessor 1950 ,rospecti e students gone to Korea -ashington, DC1 ,oint IV ,rogram1 Foreign Agriculture Ser ice c1951 Chief, Iran Office 2ducation for the world Stanley Andrews o erseas trip ,rogram formulation Musa Bey Alami ,roject in 3ordan Iran ,oint IV program Cold -ar Recruitment Brigham Young Uni ersity contract Iran Uni ersities Ardeshir Aahedi ,resident Khomeini Iran Friendship group Creation of Non-profit Volunteer OrganiBation ,articipants International Voluntary Ser ices (IVS) Musa Alami ,roject -orld Neighbors-IVS project Mennonites Muslim banking ,eace Corps International De elopment Ad isory Board (IDAB) 0ational Council of Churches 2ric 3ohnston Ad isory Board Guatemala self-financing project Bishop OCRourke and ,hilippine project ,eople-to-,eople approach Indian ,rogram Change to 5high-spending7 approach Stanley Andrews ,ositions in ,oint IV ,rogram 2 Chief, 2ducation ,rogram Assistance to foreign colleges Criteria for aid Iran program Stanley Andrews, Administrator Acting Head of ,oint IV Visit to o erseas programs ,eace Corps as model Comments on building an organiBation Assembly of parts Religious organiBations 0ew Deal re olution 0on-profit organiBations International Voluntary Ser ices 5Testing the ,eople to ,eople Approach7 Board of Go ernors Youth s. age /ater non-Go ernment ser ice 1954-19D4 Musa Bey Alami School, 3ericho, 3ordan International de elopment Ad isory Board Staff ,oint IV program Small farmer programs -ashington, DC9 Bureau of Indian Affairs 19D4- Self-help financing for Tribes Senate Banking Committee Final comments Iran then and now ,resident Khomeini Voluntary agencies and USG 0o 5pariah7 nation INTERVIEW $: Dale Clark, welcome to this interview and we(ll begin to proceed. Now, could you tell me a little bit about your childhood time because you come from a far off state in the -nion and you(re not an .ast Coaster and that kind of thing/ C/ARK1 -ell, my birthday was 1910, August 23. I was born in Salt /ake City and I grew up in Farmington, Utah, a small farming town. I was a Four-H kid and grew the 3 crops that were grown in that area. I did my high school at Kays ille, Utah, Da is High School, then proceeded to the Uni ersity of Utah. $: At the -niversity of -tah, what was your area of study at that time/ C/ARK1 My area of study was history and political science. I might indicate that I had an early start on that back in high school, an interest in international relations. They had an oratorical contest there and my entry was 5The Thralldom of the Sword.7 I won. My parents, particularly my mother, were ery much interested in international relations. At the Uni ersity of Utah, I was 6uite acti e in student affairs. I joined a good fraternity, mainly ICm afraid on the basis of the fame that I had recei ed in high school as a champion onion grower. This was a widely publiciBed e ent that was distributed all o er America and netted me a proposal of marriage from a girl in 3eanerette, /ouisiana that I ne er did meet. Somebody used my name and generated a correspondence relationship carried on without my knowledge. ThatCs a little aside. My college was interrupted by a two and a half or three year period as a missionary for my church. I went to Germany where I learned the German language. At the close of that missionary eEperience, I tra eled. I rode a bicycle from one end of Germany to the other isiting many newspaper editors along the way. Then, I proceeded to the Scandina ian countries and all the way south to 2gypt. I had newspaper credentials and as a young newspaper correspondent I was able to inter iew people in the foreign offices all along the way. Many of the articles I wrote were published in Salt /ake City newspapers. $: About when was that/ 0hat year/ C/ARK1 That was 1931-1934, the year of HitlerCs triumph. I was li ing in Berlin when Hitler came to power. I take a little pride in the fact that the things I wrote about Hitler will hold up today just as well as they did then. I was not fooled. Howe er, my iewpoint was one of sympathy for the young Germans with whom I worked. Many of these young people had no hope for the future, and many, e en in their 30s ne er had a job. My feeling was that I could understand why some of them would fall for the NaBi promises and allure and why they could be forgi en for falling for HitlerCs promises. I, as an American, with my own background, would ha e considered NaBism impossible. In my recent isit in Germany I found that the young people I talked to simply could not understand how the youth of the 1930Cs fell for the Hitler line. $: So you went on your bicycle tour up to Scandinavia. Did you come back to the -nited States and what happened then/ C/ARK1 I came back to the United States in 1934. I published some newspaper articles and finished up my college degree at the Uni ersity of Utah. I then went to -ashington DC in 1935 when I fell into a hot bed of New Dealers in the Departments of Agriculture. A most stimulating eEperience. Then, I headed for Columbia Uni ersity where I got an MA in Go ernment and ,ublic Administration. I studied there with Raymond Moley as 4 one of my professors. He was the head of the 5brain trust7 in the New Deal re olution. This knowledge came in handy in helping set up a brain trust for the formation of GermanyCs first post Hitler political party, the Christian Social Union. The New Deal Brain Trust became, in Munich, G-4, or Gedon Strasse Four. Here, 3oseph MFller, the organiBer of GermanyCs first free political party after the war, organiBed his campaign to bring decency back to Germany. $: Let(s back up here for a moment. 2ou(ve now graduated from Columbia with an M . 0hat happened ne4t/ C/ARK1 I returned to the Department of Agriculture and was assigned to head the Tenant Farmers program in the western fi e states. SteinbeckCs Grapes of -rath tells how this program helped landless migrant refugees from the dust bowl become farm owners. I then entered Har ard 1939-41 and recei ed a ,h.D. at Har ard. I must back up a little and indicate that in 1935 when I entered the Department of Agriculture, I was in a general way directed by the Under-secretary, M. /. -ilson. M. /. -ilson was particularly interested in rural life and the contribution that the small church group could make to the solution of the problems of that day. The migration of the Dust Bowl people to California, for eEample, uprooted communities and a sense of community needed to be restored. For models, -ilson looked to some of the rural church groups in the Middle -est1 Mennonites, Brethren and Guakers, and also the Mormons in Utah. Much attention was focused on Brigham YoungCs settlement of the Great Basin, which they considered one of the most remarkable resettlement feats in all history. $: 2ou worked for the Department of Agriculture and then moved on to Harvard to get your doctorate degree there. 2our sub6ect and thesis was what/ C/ARK1 My subject was go ernment and my emphasis was on the same thing I had been doing in the Department of Agriculture1 the acti ating of people in local communities to ha e an impact on go ernment. The subject of my thesis was 7roup Participation in dministration. The basic idea was that the ine itable centraliBation of go ernment would throw society out of balance unless you had a compensating increase in acti ity at the local le el. The institutions that pro ided this still had to be formed. The man who did this mainly was M. /. -ilson and I was sometimes labeled 5M/Cs boy Friday.7 There would be formed a whole system of local community action committees in addition to the county agent system. There were conser ation ser ice and local committees locally elected, but linked with go ernment. 5 $: That being the case, you got your doctorate and what year was that/ In those days did you get scholarships or particular awards, or did you have to finance your education independently/ C/ARK1 After graduating from Har ard I returned to the Department of Agriculture and Security Administration in fi e western states, including California.