Tuesday Volume 535 8 November 2011 No. 221

HOUSE OF COMMONS OFFICIAL REPORT

PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES (HANSARD)

Tuesday 8 November 2011

£5·00 © Parliamentary Copyright House of Commons 2011 This publication may be reproduced under the terms of the Parliamentary Click-Use Licence, available online through The National Archives website at www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/information-management/our-services/parliamentary-licence-information.htm Enquiries to The National Archives, Kew, Richmond, Surrey TW9 4DU; e-mail: [email protected] 143 8 NOVEMBER 2011 144

Mr Clarke: We are not denying access to justice for House of Commons anybody, but obviously a huge swathe of the population find it expensive to obtain justice and we have to ask Tuesday 8 November 2011 ourselves for which people the taxpayer should pay for access to justice. We have concentrated on the most important issues, in which there is a general public The House met at half-past Two o’clock interest in having people represented. It is wrong to represent changes in the way we pay lawyers and the amount that we pay as if we are somehow barring PRAYERS people from access to their legal rights.

Graeme Morrice: Does the Lord Chancellor not feel [MR SPEAKER in the Chair] that the cut in the civil legal aid budget, which will clearly have a detrimental impact on the citizens advice BUSINESS BEFORE QUESTIONS bureau and law centre network, will hinder the notion of the big society?

LONDON LOCAL AUTHORITIES BILL [LORDS] Mr Clarke: Legal aid is not the principal source of Consideration of Bill, as amended, opposed and deferred public funding support for citizens advice bureaux, and until Tuesday 15 November (Standing Order No. 20). legal aid changes will not take effect until 2013. Those and other voluntary bodies are taking a big hit from the LONDON LOCAL AUTHORITIES AND TRANSPORT FOR reduction of local authority and other grants. For that LONDON (NO.2)BILL [LORDS](BY ORDER) reason, the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills has already announced £27 million of continued funding for citizens advice bureaux, and we have set up TRANSPORT FOR LONDON (SUPPLEMENTAL TOLL a transitional fund for the voluntary sector to manage PROVISIONS)BILL [LORDS](BY ORDER) the transition to a tighter funding environment. We Second Readings opposed and deferred until Tuesday have £20 million set aside this year to support voluntary 15 November (Standing Order No. 20). bodies through their present difficulties, which are mainly because of local government cuts.

Sarah Newton (Truro and Falmouth) (Con): I very Oral Answers to Questions much welcome the Government’s commitment to the extra funding for welfare and benefits advice, but will my right hon. and learned Friend update us on what progress he has made with the Cabinet Office about the JUSTICE allocation of those funds?

Mr Clarke: My hon. Friend has rightly been chasing The Secretary of State was asked— me on this subject, and with her I have approached the Cabinet Office. My right hon. Friend the Minister of Legal Aid (Social Welfare) State, Cabinet Office, hopes to make an announcement shortly about the distribution of the money. As the sort 1. Julie Elliott (Sunderland Central) (Lab): What of people we are talking about need the general advice assessment his Department has made of the potential offered by such voluntary bodies, I very much hope that effects on other Government Departments of his he will soon make an announcement on behalf of the planned reductions to legal aid for social welfare law. Government. [78951] Sir Alan Beith (Berwick-upon-Tweed) (LD): Is it not 4. Graeme Morrice (Livingston) (Lab): What assessment clear that what most people will need with these changes his Department has made of the potential effects on is well-supported advice services, a user-friendly tribunal other Government Departments of his planned reductions system, and Government Departments that give people to legal aid for social welfare law. [78955] what they are entitled to in the first place?

The Lord Chancellor and Secretary of State for Justice Mr Clarke: Yes, I entirely agree. That is what I hope (Mr Kenneth Clarke): The impact assessment published we can deliver. The number of mistakes made by bodies alongside the Government’s response to consultation that distribute funds, which result in appeals to tribunal, lays out the best estimates of the costs and benefits of is obviously far too high. the legal aid reforms. Ultimately, costs to other Departments will be driven by behavioural responses to the changes, Mr Andy Slaughter (Hammersmith) (Lab): Last week and these are very difficult to predict with any real the Secretary of State confirmed that he was taking accuracy. legal aid away from brain-damaged children and disabled people unlawfully denied benefits. In answer Julie Elliott: I thank the Secretary of State for that to questions from my hon. Friend the Member for answer. Is it his Government’s view that it is acceptable Penistone and Stocksbridge (Angela Smith), the Minister for a whole swathe of the population to have no access with responsibility for legal aid, the hon. Member for to justice in the area of social welfare law? Huntingdon (Mr Djanogly), admitted that the Department 145 Oral Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Oral Answers 146 of Health pays up to £183 an hour for legal advice, Ombudsman Service and UCAS. Additionally, we intend Work and Pensions pays £201 an hour and Communities to extend the Act to over 100 more organisations through and Local Government pays £288 an hour. Some of the Protection of Freedoms Bill. We have also begun those well-paid Government lawyers will be up against consultations with more than 200 further bodies about our unrepresented constituents, especially on appeal. their possible inclusion. Next year we plan to consult Does the right hon. and learned Gentleman think that 2,000 housing associations and the housing ombudsman. that is fair? Simon Wright: I thank the Minister for his response Mr Clarke: Most of those do not get legal aid now, and for the progress made by his Department. As he and most personal injury cases are not brought using knows, Network Rail is responsible for spending billions legal aid. They are brought using no win, no fee of pounds of public money each year. Will he ensure arrangements. As the hon. Gentleman knows, in the that that organisation is brought within the scope of the new proposals for how no win, no fee ought to work, we Freedom of Information Act? have made special arrangements for particularly difficult cases and the insurance of the costs of medical reports. Mr Djanogly: The Government are committed to making Network Rail more accountable to its customers, Young Offender Institutions and believe that there is a strong case for its inclusion in the FOI. 2. Greg Mulholland (Leeds North West) (LD): What steps he is taking to ensure the provision of adequate Meg Munn (Sheffield, Heeley) (Lab/Co-op): Community legal advice in young offender institutions. [78952] organisations often have a great deal of trouble getting information out of local councils via the Freedom of The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice Information Act. What plans does the Minister have to (Mr Crispin Blunt): The training requirement to carry make the Act as currently drawn, with the organisations out the Prison Service order requiring legal services currently included, work better? officers to be available in every prison, including young offender institutions, could not be delivered. In future, Mr Djanogly: If the hon. Lady has problems to be governors will be required to give prisoners information addressed, she should write to the Ministry of Justice on how to access legal advice as part of their induction and we will take them up. into custody. The Prison Service order will be promulgated before the end of the year. Juvenile offender institutions Victim Support have discrete advocacy services available for prisoners under 18 years old. 5. Sajid Javid (Bromsgrove) (Con): What steps his Department is taking to provide support for victims; Greg Mulholland: I thank the Minister for that answer. and if he will make a statement. [78956] Last year a study of 25 young offender institutions and 300 requests for legal help from young people showed The Lord Chancellor and Secretary of State for Justice that 80% of those struggling to access legal advice were (Mr Kenneth Clarke): In the current financial year the from a black and ethnic minority background, and Ministry of Justice is providing funding of approximately 9% were female, which is disproportionate when compared £50 million to voluntary sector organisations that support with the general population. What plan do the Government victims of crime. Before Christmas we intend to launch have to tackle that? a consultation on proposals that will ensure that victims of crime are supported in the best way possible. Mr Blunt: I am grateful to my hon. Friend for bringing that to my attention. We will examine the new arrangements Sajid Javid: Too many victims of crime in my for induction into custody and the advocacy services constituency feel that their rights are put behind those available to make sure that any suggested discrimination of criminals. Will my right hon. and learned Friend that is happening will not be allowed to recur. please share with me what measures he proposes to take to correct that sense of injustice? Keith Vaz (Leicester East) (Lab): Will the Minister agree to meet me and other interested groups to discuss Mr Clarke: Apart from continuing to give support to the issue? The only way to combat the high level of victims organisations, as I said, we are about to implement discrimination is to be able to discuss it with those the Prisoners Earnings Act 1996, which will see up to concerned. £1 million taken from prisoners’ wages going into victims’ services. We have given Victim Support its three-year Mr Blunt: Of course. grant for the first time. It has never had such assured support—£38 million a year. We have honoured our Freedom of Information coalition commitment to place rape support centres on a secure financial footing, giving them long-term funding, 3. Simon Wright (Norwich South) (LD): What plans and we are about to open four more. he has to increase the scope of the Freedom of Information Act 2000. [78954] Alun Michael (Cardiff South and Penarth) (Lab/Co-op): Does the Secretary of State agree that the most important The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice thing for victims is the prevention of further offences (Mr Jonathan Djanogly): This month we extended the and reoffending, since what victims want is to know Freedom of Information Act to a further three bodies—the that they are not going to become a victim a further Association of Chief Police Officers, the Financial time after a bad experience? 147 Oral Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Oral Answers 148

Mr Clarke: I entirely agree with that. It is a point on Guy Opperman: I thank the Minister for that answer. which we are putting very heavy emphasis in all our Almost half of all serving prisoners have very basic policies on crime, punishment and rehabilitation. literacy and numeracy skills. What steps is he taking to transform the literacy training that offenders receive in Tom Brake (Carshalton and Wallington) (LD): Does prison? the Secretary of State agree that restorative justice can be key in helping victims, both in their hearing an Nick Herbert: I agree with my hon. Friend about apology from the offender, and in some cases hearing the problem. The majority of prisoners do not have the an explanation as to why the crime was committed? necessary reading and writing skills to do most jobs in the labour market on release. That is why assessing Mr Clarke: Again, I agree entirely. We find that of the literacy and numeracy skills is a priority in prisons and victims who agree to take part—they must agree to take why those with a need are offered classroom-based part—about 85% express satisfaction with the process. courses and individualised support, but there is also a It gives victims some feeling that someone has apologised role for the third sector, with organisations such as Toe and that they are getting some redress. By Toe providing mentoring for prisoners and by prisoners to help them learn reading skills. Mr Elfyn Llwyd (Dwyfor Meirionnydd) (PC): Can the Lord Chancellor imagine a more needy victim than Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP): The Minister has a child brain-damaged at birth whose parents are unable not mentioned young people, and high numbers of to sue for its financial security? them continue to reoffend. What strategy is in place to give them guidance and support so that they do not Mr Clarke: It is not true that they are unable to sue. reoffend when they come out of prison or young offenders We have a dispute about how much the lawyers should institutions? be paid in the event of a successful claim, which is an important matter, but I do not accept the assertion that Nick Herbert: I agree with the hon. Gentleman that none of these actions will be brought unless we leave the reoffending rates by younger people are particularly present no win, no fee arrangements completely untouched. high and that that is where we need to focus attention. The guidance he mentions is particularly effective when Robert Flello (Stoke-on-Trent South) (Lab): On it comes in the form of mentoring, which can be provided 12 October the Prime Minister announced that he had by third sector organisations, and we have seen some appointed Louise Casey to a new job. The Secretary of very effective examples of that. It is a question not only State has had at least a month to arrange for a new of statutory supervision and support, but of what others victims commissioner to take up his or her role. A can bring. month on, not only is no one in post, but the position Steve Brine (Winchester) (Con): May I urge the Minister has not been advertised and the Government have not to take an even closer look at the voluntary sector’s said what plans they have. Victims charities and work in that area, especially the charity KeepOut, which organisations and the Opposition have urged the I have recently become aware of? It is a crime diversion Government to move swiftly, so who is it to be? Sadly, scheme delivered by teams of serving prisoners that we have seen empty words on victims’ rights, and in this aims to steer young people away from the conveyor belt case we also have an empty post. to a criminal life and represents a positive step for many prisoners on their rehabilitation journey. Mr Clarke: I am extremely grateful to Louise Casey for the work she did and the discussions I had with her Nick Herbert: I am grateful to my hon. Friend for while she was in office. I find the hon. Gentleman’s drawing attention to the work of organisations such as question amazing. The post of victims commissioner KeepOut that provide exactly the type of mentoring was created by Act of Parliament in 2004, but the service I was talking about, helping those who are or previous Government failed to appoint anyone for five have been prisoners to dissuade young offenders from years and a fresh statute was introduced to revise the pursuing a life of crime. post in 2009. Louise Casey was appointed in early 2010. We are reconsidering—again—the basis on which we Mrs Jenny Chapman (Darlington) (Lab): I have listened make the appointment, but to be accused of tardiness to the Minister’s answers. We were promised a rehabilitation by someone who was in the last Parliament is positively revolution, but unfortunately the chief inspector of farcical. prisons can find no evidence of it. In the interests of looking at outcomes, can the Minister let us know when Reoffending we can expect to see this decline in reoffending and by exactly how much it will decline? 6. Guy Opperman (Hexham) (Con): What assessment he has made of the causes of reoffending. [R] [78957] Nick Herbert: I think that the whole House agrees that reoffending rates are too high. They have been The Minister for Policing and Criminal Justice (Nick persistently high, and we need to tackle that issue. That Herbert): Based on a survey of nearly 1,500 adult is why the rehabilitation revolution is important, and I prisoners, we found a number of factors associated with am sorry that the hon. Lady does not appear to support reoffending on release: negative childhood experiences; it. We have particular proposals on payment by results, poor educational backgrounds; low employment prospects; and we are now seeing them extended throughout public and poor health prospects, including drug usage. Research sector and private sector prisons, where we will ensure has also shown that criminal history, age and gender are that we pay for what works and incentivise providers to strong predictors of future reoffending. reduce reoffending. We are determined to reduce reoffending 149 Oral Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Oral Answers 150 by using innovative means, not the familiar means that he believe will be the case? Will the prison population Labour always proposes, which involve simply spending in May 2015 be the same, more or less than it was in more public money. May 2010?

Prison Population Mr Clarke: It is simply not the case that I have ever had a target for prisons, because as I have just explained 8. Nick Smith (Blaenau Gwent) (Lab): What estimate it is not within the control of Ministers. That is why his Department has made of the future size of the Ministers in the previous Government used to produce prison population. [78959] these various scenarios. I do not have a target. We make The Lord Chancellor and Secretary of State for Justice an estimate of the effect that legislative changes will (Mr Kenneth Clarke): The latest projections of the have on the future prison population, and as the right prison population in England and Wales, published last hon. Gentleman knows, the Legal Aid, Sentencing and week, modelled three scenarios. These track, as is the Punishment of Offenders Bill that the House has just usual practice, the impact of three different sentencing passed will, other things being equal, which they never trends on custodial convictions. By the end of June 2017, are, reduce the prison population by about 2,600. the prison population is projected to be 83,100 on the lower projection, 88,900 on the medium projection and Sadiq Khan: We have a complacent Justice Secretary 94,800 on the higher projection. who, one third of the way through this Parliament, has no idea whether the prison population will go up, down Nick Smith: The prison population is at a record or stay the same. He has cut our prison building programme, high, and some 60% of the prison population have cut capital investment in prisons, he is cutting probation speech, language and communication needs. How will officers and cutting prison officer numbers. Is he surprised the Justice Secretary address communication disability that the chief inspector of prisons has seen no evidence as part of his rehabilitation revolution? of a rehabilitation revolution and thinks that there should be a rocket up this Justice Secretary’s backside? Mr Clarke: I am sorry, but I missed the second point. Is the point of the question communication disability? Mr Clarke: The future level of crime depends on a [Interruption.] Prison projections are very difficult to huge number of variables, which are not within the make, and that is why we have the equivalent of the control of any Government or Minister. What one does fan-shaped projections that the Bank of England produces is to make sure that one does not exacerbate any problems, on inflation forecasts. It has always been the same with and that one accommodates those who come in. I am prison forecasts. trying to establish in prisons a more intelligent regime The future prison population will depend on all kinds that will achieve some improvements in reoffending of things beyond the control of the Government, but rates for those who have to be punished by going to the prison estate is well placed to meet the demand. prison. If any of my predecessors ever gave an exact Eventually it will all depend on whether we have long forecast of the prison population, two or three out, that and protracted youth unemployment, how far the recession predecessor was in my opinion an idiot. I do remember, has retracted, and how successful we are with our however, that the previous Government so miscalculated rehabilitation revolution, workplace reform, skills training, things that they had to let 80,000 people out of prison, education reform and so on. The Prison Service is there short of their sentence, because prisons were bulging at to meet the demand, but we expect the demand to be the seams and they had nowhere to accommodate them. reasonably stable. Gavin Williamson (South Staffordshire) (Con): I am Reoffending sure that my right hon. and learned Friend is aware of the importance of the construction of the Featherstone 9. Mrs Helen Grant (Maidstone and The Weald) 2 prison, which is currently being built in my constituency, (Con): What steps he is taking to reduce the level of but can he assure the House that he will do all he can to reoffending by people sentenced to one year or less. encourage G4S, the operator, to employ people locally, [78960] so that we have not just the disadvantages of a prison being built, but some of the advantages? The Minister for Policing and Criminal Justice (Nick Herbert): We are supporting local areas to develop Mr Clarke: Featherstone 2 is one of two new prisons integrated approaches to managing offenders and testing that we have coming on stream in 2012, and I am sure payment-by-results arrangements for providers working that it will provide a very valuable source of local with short-sentenced prisoners. employment when it opens, as it is quite a large prison. It will also, of course, contribute to our battle against Mrs Grant: Around 4,000 women are in British prisons, crime and to the need to punish serious criminals. most of whom are serving short-term sentences. Does Sadiq Khan (Tooting) (Lab): I know the Justice Secretary the Minister agree that community women offender does not like being reminded of this, and that is clearly projects can provide a very real alternative to custody? why I am going to do so. He had a target to reduce the prison population by 3,000 by 2015, and, as my hon. Nick Herbert: I suspect there is a consensus across Friend the Member for Blaenau Gwent (Nick Smith) the House about that issue. It is worth reflecting on the helped to remind the House, it is now 87,747, which is fact that, 15 years ago, there were only 1,800 women in about 3,000 more than when the right hon. and learned prison. The Prison Reform Trust has pointed out that: Gentleman became Justice Secretary. As a consequence “During one year more than 11,000 women are imprisoned of this Government’s policies, which projection does and almost 18,000 children are separated from their mothers.” 151 Oral Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Oral Answers 152

Some women need to go to prison, and it is important Stephen Barclay: In July, the Justice Committee found that custody remains available. However, we are focusing that, under the previous Government, just 25% of probation on developing suitable, intensive community sentences service staff time was spent with offenders. I welcome that can prevent such a flow into the custodial system the fact that, in Cambridgeshire, that figure has improved wherever possible. to more than 60%, but I urge the Government to take further steps, given that that has a crucial role in tackling Mr Barry Sheerman (Huddersfield) (Lab/Co-op): Is reoffending. the Minister aware that stalking is a pernicious crime that often attracts short sentences? Those sentences are Mr Blunt: I am delighted to hear of that excellent no good at all if the quality of the treatment for stalking performance in Cambridgeshire. That is evidence of the is not up to a good standard; those people are free to go good practice now flowing from freeing probation officers back and stalk usually the very women they were stalking from the highly prescriptive target setting and performance before. management that led to that 24% figure. That is what happens when 60 pages of national standards are reduced Nick Herbert: That is an example of the fact that to three, and professionals are supported with decent prison plainly plays an important role in relation to guidance and allowed to get on with doing the job to both punishing and incapacitating offenders. It must the best of their ability in the public interest. also play a role in the rehabilitation of offenders. The system has too often failed in that third role, including Paul Goggins (Wythenshawe and Sale East) (Lab): for the most serious crimes. Ministers have already acknowledged that probation officers will have to spend more time monitoring dangerous Mr Philip Hollobone (Kettering) (Con): The way to offenders on licence in the community as a result of stop foreign national prisoners who serve a sentence of introducing the new extended determinate sentence. a year or less from reoffending is to return them from What estimates has the Minister made of the additional whence they came to their country of origin. Will my costs of this extra supervision? right hon. Friend assure the House that that is being done on each and every occasion? Mr Blunt: It will be some time before prisoners are being released from the sentence framework that we Nick Herbert: I know my hon. Friend’s long-standing have just introduced, because those sentences apply to interest in that issue. It is absolutely right that those people who receive sentences of more than six years’ prisoners who have served a prison sentence should imprisonment, and the extended sentences will be many expect to be returned to their country of origin. We are years ahead, so we have not yet done a detailed assessment. returning more than 5,000 a year, and we will continue to make every effort to do so. Knife Crime

Kevin Brennan (Cardiff West) (Lab): The hon. Member 11. Andrew Griffiths (Burton) (Con): What steps he is for Maidstone and The Weald (Mrs Grant) is right taking to increase prison tariffs for people sentenced about women prisoners. Under the previous Government, for carrying knives. [78962] an inter-ministerial group was set up to try to implement the recommendations of the Corston report. Will the The Lord Chancellor and Secretary of State for Justice Minister describe what efforts he is making to maintain (Mr Kenneth Clarke): Sentencing guidelines provide that work in Government? that the starting point for an adult convicted of knife possession is a custodial sentence. Where immediate Nick Herbert: We do seek to maintain it. The focus custody is given, the average sentence length increased must be on developing suitable community sentences between June 2010 and June 2011. We are creating new that can satisfy the courts, address the causes of reoffending offences so that those who carry a knife in a public and also be sufficiently punitive. It is important that the place or school, and go on to threaten and cause immediate public have confidence in such sentences, so that we can risk of serious physical harm to another, can expect to ensure there is a satisfactory alternative for women who face at least a minimum custodial sentence. do not need to be sent to prison. The absence of satisfactory alternatives in the past has been part of the Andrew Griffiths: Constituents in Burton will applaud problem. the statements just made about sentences for the type of crime that is covered today on the front page of the Probation Officers Burton Mail, in which a young man was frogmarched to a cash point and forced to hand over money at knifepoint. 10. Stephen Barclay (North East Cambridgeshire) They want to see that kind of tough sentencing as a (Con): What steps he is taking to increase the amount deterrent. Will the Secretary of State back the Burton of time probation officers spend with offenders. [78961] Mail campaign to make Burton a knife-free zone and to prevent these kinds of activities happening again? The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice (Mr Crispin Blunt): We have already taken steps such as Mr Clarke: If the newspaper report is accurate, then reducing the number of targets and revising national whoever carried out that crime committed quite a number standards to increase the time spent face to face with of criminal offences, most of which carry very serious offenders. The Ministry is taking forward the offender penalties, so I hope that the local courts deal with it engagement programme of work further to cut red tape with appropriate seriousness, having obviously considered and give probation officers back their professional all the circumstances. We are sending out, we hope, a discretion. strong message that we will not tolerate the use of 153 Oral Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Oral Answers 154 knives. Threatening with a knife and putting someone The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice in fear of injury is a very serious matter. I wish my hon. (Mr Crispin Blunt): The first results against which payment Friend every success in working with his constituents to will be made in the two pilots at Her Majesty’s prisons try to reduce the scourge of knife crime in Burton. Peterborough and Doncaster will be available in 2014. I am visiting Peterborough prison on Friday to make my Indeterminate Sentences initial assessment of the ONE service. I will look in particular at the methodology and evidence from case 12. Steve McCabe (Birmingham, Selly Oak) (Lab): studies as it is too early for statistical data to be available. What steps his Department is taking in respect of prisoners serving indeterminate sentences who have Mr Spencer: The Minister may be aware of a case completed their minimum tariff. [78963] close to my constituency in which a paedophile was The Lord Chancellor and Secretary of State for Justice allowed out from a secure health unit on unescorted day (Mr Kenneth Clarke): Tariff-expired indeterminate sentence release, only to commit a crime against a 10-year-old prisoners will be released from custody only if the constituent of mine. I support the Minister’s plans to independent Parole Board is satisfied that they may be make improvements when these companies get things safely managed in the community. We are seeking to correct, but what plans does he have to deal with such identify further improvements to the progression of companies when they get it wrong? those prisoners through effective sentence planning, which will require the engagement of the offenders Mr Blunt: As my hon. Friend has made clear, that themselves. case involved a patient who was detained under mental health legislation, under which unescorted leave requires Steve McCabe: As I understand it, under the Lord the approval of the Secretary of State, a risk assessment Chancellor’s proposals a judge will be required to hand and a recommendation from a responsible clinician. down a mandatory life sentence the second time someone There are no proposals for companies to make such is convicted of using a nuclear weapon. Allowing for all decisions. the Lord Chancellor’s wisdom and guile, would it not be an awful lot smarter to hold someone indefinitely the first time they committed that offence? Gavin Shuker (Luton South) (Lab/Co-op): The Minister talks about payment by results for companies. It is clear Mr Clarke: Certainly, the Government take a serious that in his review of probation and payment by results view of the use of a nuclear weapon; I hope that not too next year, there is significant uncertainty about the role much of that breaks out in the hon. Gentleman’s of smaller probation trusts. Bedfordshire probation trust constituency. We discussed these proposals in the House is one of the smallest but best performing trusts. Can he only last week, and we achieved the House’s approval give an assurance that its role will be upheld in any for them. There is an indeterminate sentence called a subsequent review? life sentence, which is the best and most established form of indeterminate sentence. Having got rid of the Mr Blunt: The hon. Gentleman needs to understand failed indeterminate sentences for public protection, we that we are piloting payment by results in six ways in expect that quite a lot of people will get life sentences 20 different pilots to see what is the most effective way who hitherto would have been given the rather of delivering it. It might be by putting the responsibility unsatisfactory IPPs. on probation trusts, prisons, local authorities or chiefs of police. We are looking at all those things and will see Jeremy Corbyn (Islington North) (Lab): Will the what is the most effective way to take payment by Secretary of State consider the problem of pre-release results forward in the interests of us all. of prisoners where insufficient preparation is made for training or, particularly, for somewhere to live or some kind of community support? That means, in turn, that Rehabilitation they either stay longer in prison or are released into the community, where they are inadequately supervised 14. Mr James Clappison (Hertsmere) (Con): What and end up back in a whole regime of crime. progress he has made in implementing his plans for the rehabilitation of prisoners. [78966] Mr Clarke: We are looking at that problem very seriously, and we hope to produce a substantial improvement on the present situation. In particular, I The Minister for Policing and Criminal Justice (Nick am working with colleagues in the Department for Herbert): We have started piloting payment-by-results Work and Pensions to try to ensure that offenders models to drive what works and drug recovery wings. leaving prison can have instant access to the work We are supporting the piloting and roll-out of mental programmes that we are developing for other people health liaison and diversion services in police custody seeking work. Enabling people to get back into employment and courts. We are also developing plans to make is one of the best ways of improving the chances that prisons places of hard work. they will not offend again. Mr Clappison: Would not the task of the employment Payment by Results and work programmes to which my right hon. Friend has referred be improved if prisoners actually worked 13. Mr Mark Spencer (Sherwood) (Con): What while in prison? Is it not the case that far too few assessment he has made of the effects on reoffending prisoners are given the opportunity to work in prison rates of his policy of payment by results to companies. workshops for a full working week? Would that not be [78964] of benefit to prisoners and their victims? 155 Oral Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Oral Answers 156

Nick Herbert: I strongly agree with my hon. Friend. The Lord Chancellor and Secretary of State for Justice The Government are committed to ensuring that prisons (Mr Kenneth Clarke): I do not currently have any plans are places of work and restoration. We are focused on a to meet the Magistrates Association to discuss the programme to ensure that, wherever possible, we introduce recruitment and retention of magistrates. work into prisons. There are problems with the physical estate, but we are determined to make that happen Tony Baldry: Is my right hon. and learned Friend wherever we can. aware that lay magistrates are feeling a bit unloved at the moment? They feel somewhat squeezed between the Mrs Madeleine Moon (Bridgend) (Lab): Parc young police increasingly allocating non-court disposals at offenders institution in my constituency had a report one end and deputy circuit judges doing rather more from the chief inspector of prisons recently that revealed work at the other end, and there are court closures and that 60% of the 64 inmates were admitted with drug-related bench mergers. There has been no recruitment to the problems, that 25% had alcohol-related problems and Oxfordshire bench for several years now. What can he that 89% had truanted from school repeatedly. What do to ensure that lay magistrates feel appreciated? steps are we taking to ensure that rehabilitation is a real possibility in private sector prisons? Mr Clarke: I will heed my hon. Friend’s warning, but I think we probably all agree that the lay magistracy is Nick Herbert: Rehabilitation is important, whether in one of the distinctive strengths of our justice system. It a public or private sector prison. The movement to certainly makes a very valuable contribution, and I am payment by results will ensure that providers are focused glad to say that it is a popular form of volunteering. We on what they need to do to reduce reoffending. Ensuring obviously have to appoint strictly on merit, but we that offenders get off drugs and deal with their alcohol recruit more than 1,000 new magistrates every year and problems is an important part of that. That is one magistrates dispose of about 95% of the criminal justice reason why we are piloting drug recovery wings in work that goes through our system. I will take on board prisons. We will maintain our focus on those areas. his points, and I hope that we can encourage people in Oxfordshire to carry on the essential work that they are Richard Harrington (Watford) (Con): I congratulate doing for the good of the community. my right hon. Friend on the work that has been done to introduce work for prisoners. However, my constituents and I are concerned that local companies that are full of Restorative Justice honest, hard-working people may lose contracts to prisoners, who are effectively subsidised by taxpayers’ 16. Mr Robert Buckland (South Swindon) (Con): money. Will he assure me that that will not be the case? What steps he is taking to increase the use of restorative justice. [78969] Nick Herbert: I appreciate my hon. Friend’s concern. We will design the schemes in a way that ensures that The Minister for Policing and Criminal Justice (Nick that does not happen. However, we must not lose sight Herbert): We are committed to delivering more restorative of the importance of ensuring that prisons are places justice across the system, ensuring that more victims where offenders are not simply idle, but where they are have a chance to explain the impact of crime upon them rehabilitated and introduced to the world of work and and that offenders face up to the consequences. Many responsibility. areas already use restorative approaches, and we are considering how we can increase capacity to enable Fiona Mactaggart (Slough) (Lab): One factor that local areas to provide more effective responses to crime means that prisoners are less likely to be rehabilitated and disorder. on coming out of prison is the lack of access to housing. Many prisoners are released with just a cash voucher and no chance of anywhere to live. What is the Minister Mr Buckland: I thank my right hon. Friend for that doing about that scandal? response. Both the youth offending team and the police in Swindon are using restorative justice procedures to Nick Herbert: I agree with the hon. Lady that that is very good effect, particularly in the sentencing process one of the very important factors that determine and as an alternative to prosecution. What specific reoffending. That is why it is important that we have a plans does he have to support that invaluable work? concerted effort to ensure that on their release, prisoners, and particularly short-term prisoners who are not the Nick Herbert: I agree with my hon. Friend about the subject of statutory supervision or support, receive the value of that work, which can both provide enhanced necessary support and entitlement to services. That can victim satisfaction, whereas victims are otherwise too be done through the integrated offender management often an afterthought in the process, and reduce reoffending programmes that we are supporting, and also through rates. That was why the coalition agreement committed the payment-by-results schemes that we are piloting, us to introducing neighbourhood resolution panels, whichthe Under-Secretary of State, my hon. Friend the which we intend to take forward. We have invited Member for Reigate (Mr Blunt) described. expressions of interest and had good interest in them, and we will set up pilots in the new year. Lay Magistrates Kate Green (Stretford and Urmston) (Lab): What 15. Tony Baldry (Banbury) (Con): When he next steps will the Minister take to support restorative justice expects to meet the Magistrates Association to discuss programmes in prisons, such as that offered by the the recruitment and retention of lay magistrates. [78968] Prison Fellowship’s “Sycamore Tree” programme? 157 Oral Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Oral Answers 158

Nick Herbert: It is important that we support restorative John Robertson: Déjà vu, Mr Speaker: on 28 June, justice as a principle that applies across the criminal when my hon. Friend the Member for Derby North justice system, not just in any one part of it. The idea (Chris Williamson) asked a question on compensation that offenders should make amends and, when victims for victims of overseas terrorism, the Minister replied: want it, be required to confront their victims, is good, “In the coming weeks we intend to launch a public consultation and where such schemes are successful we want to see on victims services”—[Official Report, 28 June 2011; Vol. 530, them extended. c. 749.] Nineteen weeks down the road, we are still waiting for it. Will the Minister please tell me this: will he put the Corporate Manslaughter victims first and forget about his petty differences with the Opposition? 17. Katy Clark (North Ayrshire and Arran) (Lab): What assessment he has made of the level of support Mr Blunt: I can assure the hon. Gentleman that I available to families of people who have been victims of have no petty differences with the Opposition. There corporate manslaughter; and if he will make a statement. are a number of difficult issues to resolve, but the delay [78970] is absolutely in the interests of victims, as we identify greater resources so that we can wrestle with the wretched The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice situation that we inherited from the criminal injuries (Mr Crispin Blunt): In England and Wales, victims of compensation scheme, which was £750 million in debt. corporate manslaughter are eligible to receive the same We must sort those things out, and once we have done support as victims of homicide from the national homicide so, we will be able to come forward with a satisfactory service, which provides tailored and intensive one-to-one policy for victims of crime. support to bereaved families for as long as they need it. Support for victims of crime in Scotland is a devolved Several hon. Members rose— matter. Mr Speaker: With extreme brevity, I call Mr Simon Katy Clark: I am very grateful to the Minister for that Hughes. answer. My constituents Dorothy and Douglas Wright recently received an apology from the Director of Public Simon Hughes (Bermondsey and Old Southwark) Prosecutions following the failure to take corporate (LD): May I say to the Minister—[Laughter.] manslaughter action when their son Mark died. They did not get access to such a service, and their experience is Mr Speaker: Order. We must give the right hon. that families of those who die in such circumstances do Gentleman a chance. not get such access. Will the Minister consider that issue? Simon Hughes: May I say to the Minister that this is an inherited matter that has now lasted for 18 months? Mr Blunt: Of course, this is a devolved matter for the There is an obligation on the Government to sort it out hon. Lady’s constituents in Scotland, but I am quite soon. Can he give a commitment that victims will get happy to consider the development of the whole doctrine their answer before the end of this calendar year? of corporate manslaughter. It is very important that the families of those who may be corporate manslaughter victims receive the necessary support, even if a prosecution Mr Blunt: Yes, Mr Speaker. cannot be successfully secured. That means that Victim Support needs to be notified that there is a requirement Mr Speaker: Well, there was exemplary brevity on of support, which is sometimes not completely clear both counts. when someone dies in circumstances that might or might not lead to an investigation or successful prosecution Topical Questions for corporate manslaughter. However, I am very happy to consider the matter. T1. [78976] Ian Swales (Redcar) (LD): If he will make a statement on his departmental responsibilities. Overseas Terrorism The Lord Chancellor and Secretary of State for Justice (Mr Kenneth Clarke): Yesterday, the UK took over the 19. John Robertson (Glasgow North West) (Lab): chairmanship of the Council of Europe. Our key priority What steps his Department is taking to provide is reform of the European Court of Human Rights, for compensation for victims of overseas terrorism. [78972] which there is widespread support. We are pressing for consensus among all 47 member states on a package The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice of reforms that will make the Court more effective. The (Mr Crispin Blunt): The issue of compensation for Court is struggling under a growing backlog of almost victims of terrorism overseas is being considered alongside 160,000 cases, which is undermining its authority. The the Government’s review of victims’ services and aim will be for the Court to concentrate on the most compensation, at the conclusion of which we will publish serious issues of alleged failure to comply with the a consultation document. We plan to make an convention by a member state. The primary duty of announcement on victims of terrorism overseas at the compliance with the convention in individual cases same time as we launch the consultation, which we should rest with democratic Parliaments and national intend will be before Christmas. courts. 159 Oral Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Oral Answers 160

Ian Swales: Teesside suffers from arguably the worst Mr Speaker: May I encourage Ministers to face the coroner service in the country, with families now waiting House, so that we get the full force of their eloquence an average of 43 weeks for a verdict. How is the coroner head-on? service held accountable, and what can the Minister do to ensure that my constituents get the service they T2. [78977] Mr Jim Cunningham (Coventry South) deserve? (Lab): Has the Minister done an impact assessment on the effect of the legal aid reforms on women? The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice (Mr Jonathan Djanogly): Ultimately, coroners are Mr Djanogly: Yes, an equality impact assessment was independent judicial appointments, and as such, complaints carried out. must be made through the judicial appointments service. Having said that, I have been in contact with people in T5. [78980] Rehman Chishti (Gillingham and Rainham) Teesside and I shall continue to take an interest in this (Con): According to a written question that I asked the matter. Minister earlier this year, in 2009 the disciplinary punishment of additional days for bad behaviour in Sadiq Khan (Tooting) (Lab): One cannot help but prisons was imposed on 11,550 occasions. What steps notice the good mood that the Justice Secretary is in are being taken to improve discipline and behaviour in today, which I am sure has nothing to do with the spot prisons? of bother the Home Secretary is in. May I ask him a question on a similar issue—foreign prisoners? He will Mr Blunt: There is a zero-tolerance policy for any be aware that in 2007, the Labour Government negotiated violence in prison towards staff, visitors or other prisoners. with the EU a prisoner transfer agreement, which comes In addition, one should not underestimate the importance into force next month, which will mean that no prisoner of our proposals on work in prisons. If we can put in consent is required, and that the other country must place a much more useful prison regime under which comply with a request for a transfer. The Prime Minister far more prisoners are engaged in useful work, it will promised the repatriation of thousands of foreign prisoners aid the delivery of discipline in our prisons. by personally taking charge of negotiations with individual T4. [78979] Michael Connarty (Linlithgow and East countries. We all know that he likes to keep his promises, Falkirk) (Lab): Could I ask whether the Secretary of so can the Justice Secretary tell us how many new State will identify the amount of savings he will make prisoner transfer agreements have been successfully in his planned reductions for legal aid in social welfare negotiated with individual countries in the past 18 months, law and identify the amount of knock-on cuts to the and how many foreign prisoners does he expect to be Scottish budget through the Barnett formula? Could he repatriated this year? confirm that, if there are cuts, the Scottish Parliament does not have to follow the savage cuts in welfare law Mr Kenneth Clarke: First, I want to put the right hon. legal aid? Gentleman’s mind at rest: I agree with my right hon. Friend the Home Secretary in her handling of the Mr Kenneth Clarke: We debated all this last week. We current problems, so it is just my usual bonhomie; there are still spending £50 million on legal aid for welfare is no particular cause for it today. It is true that this law, even as we have revised and cut it back, and cut out important transfer of prisoners agreement is about to areas where, frankly, legal assistance is not necessary, come into force, and it will make a difference to our appropriate or justified. Our proposals affect England problem with foreign prisoners, although, of course, and Wales only, and the provision of legal aid in Scotland there are derogations to some important countries, such is not a matter for me. as Poland and Ireland, where it will not come into effect for a few years. The right hon. Gentleman hits on a T9. [78984] Steve Baker (Wycombe) (Con): Do the serious problem, though: we need to find a way of Government agree that magistrates are a vital and reducing the foreign prisoner population. At the moment, integral part of the justice system, and that they must we have only one international bilateral agreement near be supported and encouraged to play a part in to conclusion, but we are continuing to work on it, neighbourhood justice? because foreign prisoners take up more than 10% of places in our prison system. The Minister for Policing and Criminal Justice (Nick Herbert): Yes, we do. As we develop our proposals, T3. [78978] Gordon Henderson (Sittingbourne and Sheppey) including for the neighbourhood resolution panels that (Con): At Swaleside prison in my constituency, the I described earlier, we want to consider what role magistrates Kainos Community programme has an 87% success may play in that. They are, as my right hon. and learned rate in reducing reoffending by inmates taking part in Friend said, an important lay resource, and we should the scheme. Will my hon. Friend acknowledge this think of new ways to make use of them. success, and extend the scheme across the prison estate? T6. [78981] Rushanara Ali (Bethnal Green and Bow) The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice (Lab): How does the Secretary of State plan to fill the (Mr Crispin Blunt): I have seen the Kainos scheme in nearly £280 million gap in social welfare law in respect other prisons, and I am looking forward to visiting my of the provision of crucial advice and support on hon. Friend’s constituency to see it work at first hand. housing, debt and employment issues to some of the Of course, we will want to learn the lessons and apply poorest people in our country, given that there is little them, so that we can begin to achieve those kinds of to no evidence that the voluntary and charitable sectors reoffending rates—if they are as described—on a sustainable will be able to back-fill that gap? The £20 million basis. referred to does not seem to go far enough. 161 Oral Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Oral Answers 162

Mr Djanogly: First, it is important to appreciate that court. There have been bad cases where serious offences we are keeping £50 million of legal aid in social welfare have been committed. We hope to introduce an amendment law for the most urgent and vulnerable people who need in the other place that would allow the Crown Prosecution it. We need to appreciate that, at the moment, legal aid Service to challenge the granting of bail in the Crown is often used as a sticking plaster for matters that should court when a potentially dangerous prisoner is involved. properly be dealt with under general advice from citizens advice bureaux. T8. [78983] Jessica Morden (Newport East) (Lab): Constituents of mine with serious health conditions T10. [78985] Mr Aidan Burley (Cannock Chase) (Con): who have been turned down for employment and After the riots in the summer, courts such as Cannock support allowance are still having to wait up to nine magistrates court in my constituency sat late and months for a tribunal appeal hearing. With more than ensured that the surge in work was dealt with smoothly 40% of them being successful on appeal, what is the and efficiently. These late-night sittings have been Minister going to do to end this unacceptable wait? widely regarded as a huge success, not least by those magistrates who have full-time jobs that require them Mr Djanogly: This is relevant to a number of to work during office hours. What plans does the Departments. We are working with them to ensure that Secretary of State’s Department have to roll out these the procedures are such that better determinations are evening court sittings on a permanent basis? made at the outset so that we get fewer appeals. This is taking up a significant amount of my time. The hon. Mr Kenneth Clarke: The work done after the riots is a Lady makes an important point. tribute to the public spiritedness of all who sat on the bench—all the court staff, probation staff, police and duty defence solicitors. There was a widespread feeling Alun Cairns (Vale of Glamorgan) (Con): When a that people should do their bit to restore order, and I magistrates court is forced to close, does my hon. Friend am glad to say that the courts rose to the challenge. agree that every effort and flexibility needs to be shown Normally, on an ordinary day, we do not have a shortage to accommodate those magistrates in alternative courts? of court space, so there is no general need to have night or evening sittings. We can certainly improve the efficiency Mr Djanogly: Yes, and they are. So far as I know, no with which the more straightforward cases are dealt magistrates have been forced to resign because of any with. They can be brought on at an ordinary hour more court closure. They are normally encouraged to join the quickly than they sometimes are now. We are working successor court, although some take the opportunity to on that. It was a tribute to the court service and everybody resign at that point for their own reasons. who works in it that they all worked as well as they did. Huw Irranca-Davies (Ogmore) (Lab): The Secretary T7. [78982] Gloria De Piero (Ashfield) (Lab): I wrote of State will no doubt share my respect for those who to the Justice Secretary six weeks ago on behalf of my carry out pro bono work, which makes a big impact in constituent Gary Thrall, but have not yet had an my communities and throughout the UK. What does he answer. May I ask him again to look at this case and at make of the assertion that cutbacks are going to have the fact that 16 months on from a vicious knife attack, to be made in pro bono services because of the cuts to Gary has yet to receive a final settlement from the overall provision? Criminal Injuries Compensation Authority or to be advised of the likely time scale for the settlement, Mr Djanogly: I do not see any reason why that should which is preventing the family from moving on? be the case. Mr Blunt: I will, of course, investigate the case that the hon. Lady brings to my attention. I will get in touch Alok Sharma (Reading West) (Con): One of my with her directly. constituents who was witness to a burglary and theft in the local area has made me aware that the youth defendant Philip Davies (Shipley) (Con): According to figures who pleaded guilty on two counts was required as part from the Department, 10% of all crimes are committed of his rehabilitation order to spend three weeks at by people on bail and 20% of burglaries are committed summer arts college. Does the Minister believe that it is by people on bail. When the provisions in the Legal time to review some elements of the community sentencing Aid, Sentencing and Punishment of Offenders Bill come framework? into effect, which will make it harder for courts to remand people in custody, what estimate has the Mr Blunt: We are going to look at the community Department made of the number of crimes that will be sentencing framework, as I announced to the House committed by people on bail then? last week. We are absolutely clear that the whole framework has to carry public confidence that there will be effective Mr Kenneth Clarke: The changes we are making are punishment in the community, while at the same time to get rid of the anomaly whereby bail can be refused to delivering effective rehabilitation. A sentence that protects someone who is charged with an offence in circumstances the public and delivers restoration to the victim is a key where it is quite obvious that they are not going to be part of our consideration. sent to prison, even if they are found guilty. It is a reform that should have been made a long time ago. Diana Johnson (Kingston upon Hull North) (Lab): Serious offences are sometimes committed by people on We have an excellent community legal advice centre in bail, and we have committed ourselves to introducing a Hull. What are the Minister’s views on the future funding right of appeal when someone is given bail in the Crown of CLACs and community legal advice networks? 163 Oral Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Oral Answers 164

Mr Djanogly: These will have to be looked at in the progress on the Corston agenda and to learn some of its context of all not-for-profit organisations—citizens advice lessons in how to deal with not just women prisoners, bureaux and so forth. If the hon. Lady wishes to discuss but all prisoners. her particular concerns relating to her particular CLAC, I would be happy to discuss them with her. Yvonne Fovargue (Makerfield) (Lab): The Money Advice Service has sacked 100 front-line staff in order Robert Halfon (Harlow) (Con): Following the publication to spend more money on publicity. Does the Secretary of the Norgrove report, will my hon. Friend reassure of State now regret removing nearly all debt advice anxious fathers in my constituency, including Mr Colin from the scope of legal aid, and what cross-departmental Riches, and will he make every effort to ensure that discussions is he having about the future of such advice? parents have equal access to children? Mr Kenneth Clarke: I am very sorry to hear what the Mr Djanogly: We have every intention of ensuring hon. Lady has said, but I am not sure whether the issue that both parents have a meaningful relationship with is the responsibility of my Department; it may be the their children, and we will look carefully at the Norgrove responsibility of the Department for Business, Innovation report in order to develop a Government approach to and Skills. However, I will certainly check, because it is the matter. extremely important for advice to be available at what is a difficult time for many people. Advice on debt is, unfortunately, one of the things that many people require— Hugh Bayley (York Central) (Lab): The convictions not only foreign Governments, but a fair number of our of three world-class cricketers last week shows that even own citizens. cricket is not immune from corruption. In his role as the Government’s anti-corruption chief, will the Secretary Sheila Gilmore (Edinburgh East) (Lab): A few months of State look into the problem of corruption in international ago, the Minister said that the backlog of appeals on sporting bodies such as FIFA, and see what Britain can social security matters would be resolved through the do to drive corruption out of international sport? There employment of more people. That was before the summer, has also been controversy involving the Olympics and but the waiting times seem to be as long as ever. Why is Formula 1. that?

Mr Kenneth Clarke: I share the hon. Gentleman’s Mr Djanogly: There is still a significant number of concern, but the issue of corruption in sport is primarily appeals, but the number is now being stabilised and the the responsibility of my right hon. Friend the Secretary delays are being reduced. of State for Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport. I know that he is working with his European Union Mrs Mary Glindon (North Tyneside) (Lab): Given opposite numbers on specific measures to tackle it, and that probation trusts are experiencing major cuts in I am following his progress very closely. The recent their budgets, can the Minister explain how he expects convictions show that there are problems that need to them to do more for less? be tackled in the interests of everyone who believes in the value of sport—but honest sport—to a community. Mr Blunt: Probation trusts have been relatively well protected given the current environment. The additional Tom Brake (Carshalton and Wallington) (LD): The cuts are at least 13% less than the overall cut in the Government are committed to ensuring that women are Ministry of Justice budget, which shows that we are not sent to prison in disproportionately high numbers. making the protection of the front line a priority in May we have an update on the Corston report? order to ensure that services are delivered effectively. However, like everyone else, probation trusts will have to make their contribution to rescuing our nation’s Mr Blunt: The Government support the objectives of economy from the wretched mess in which it was left by the Corston report, as did our predecessor, and as we the last Administration. did in opposition. There are only one or two elements of it that we are unable to deliver, such as the recommendation Several hon. Members rose— for more smaller custodial units. As was made clear in the exchanges that followed the question asked by my Mr Speaker: Order. I apologise to colleagues. I should hon. Friend the Member for Maidstone and The Weald be happy to allow these exchanges to continue all day if (Mrs Grant), one of our main priorities is to make there were time, but there is not. 165 8 NOVEMBER 2011 Points of Order 166

Points of Order 1 January 2012. The Secretary of State also states in that document, however, that the Commission plans to 3.34 pm uphold the ban on battery cages and to start inspection visits at the start of 2013. There is therefore some Tony Baldry (Banbury) (Con): On a point of order, confusion about what action the Commission will be Mr Speaker. May I ask for your guidance? Item 4 on taking and in which year that will start. today’s Order Paper, under the heading “Backbench This is not the first time that Environment Ministers Business”, is entitled “Publication of a Select Committee have slipped up. They had to correct the record on Report”. Below that is a motion in the name of the hon. the new British Waterways charity, and there is also the Member for Liverpool, Riverside (Mrs Ellman), which now-legendary legal case that was supposed to be states proceeding in Europe on the use of wild animals in “That this House notes the publication of the Tenth Report circuses, but which transpired not to exist. Will you from the Transport Committee on High Speed Rail”. advise the House, Mr Speaker, on when the Secretary of As you know, Sir, a number of us are concerned about State might come to the Chamber to correct the record? that issue. Below the motion is a note which says I see that the Leader of the House is in his place; I “Proceedings on Mrs Ellman’s Motion are expected to continue wonder whether he can assure us that such unfortunate for approximately 20 minutes.” episodes will not become custom and practice. I have never seen such a provision on the Order Paper before. Will you give the House some idea of what you Mr Speaker: I am grateful to the hon. Lady, the expect to happen? Will the hon. Member for Liverpool, shadow Secretary of State, for her point of order. The Riverside be allowed to speak for 20 minutes about the matter to which she has referred is certainly of intense, Select Committee’s report? Will those of us who have and probably of enduring, interest to a great many, quite a lot to say about the report have any opportunity including the hens themselves. The other matters to to intervene or to make a contribution, or does the note which she referred will have been noted, doubtless at a merely constitute guidance meaning that the business distance by the Secretary of State, and here in person, in can continue until any hour? the Chamber, by the Leader of the House. If the hon. Lady were minded to pursue the matter any further, I Mr Speaker: I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for might—unfairly—conclude that she was seeking to establish his point of order, and I hope to be able, at least in part, a point not of information, but a political argument; to satisfy his curiosity. but I am sure she has not got the latter in mind in any First, I am sorry the hon. Gentleman has not noticed way. such an item on the Order Paper before; that is uncharacteristically unobservant of him, as in my current Grahame M. Morris (Easington) (Lab): On a point of recollection there have been at least three occasions on order, Mr Speaker. The Prime Minister and the Health which similar items have been placed on the Order Secretary have both claimed that UK cancer survival Paper. and death rates are poor by international standards, Secondly, the hon. Gentleman seeks a steer as to the and they have referred to that as a justification for the nature of the proceedings in question. It is an occasion NHS reforms. It has become clear from a study produced upon which the Chair of the Select Committee presents by Professor Pritchard-Jones— a statement about the report, and it is customary on such occasions for Members to intervene on the Select Mr Speaker: Order. The hon. Gentleman should resume Committee Chair, if they wish to do so. There are no his seat. I fear that points of order might be in danger of other speeches, however. transmuting into comments on past ministerial statements Thirdly, I should inform the hon. Gentleman that on a range of matters. If the hon. Gentleman is seeking this is a relatively recent development, and he may wish to prove to me and the House what an assiduous to look in the direction of his right hon. Friend the member of the Health Committee—and of the previous Leader of the House—who is currently sitting on the Health and Social Care Public Bill Committee—he is, Treasury Bench—if he is curious as to whether it will be he has succeeded in his mission. a temporary or an enduring phenomenon. I shall leave that little teaser in the mind of the hon. Gentleman. Steve McCabe (Birmingham, Selly Oak) (Lab): Further to that point of order, Mr Speaker. I just wonder Mary Creagh (Wakefield) (Lab): On a point of order, whether you are keeping any score of how many mistakes, Mr Speaker. I informed the Environment Secretary of misquotes or misdirections to the House Cabinet Ministers my intention to make a point of order today. Yesterday, are allowed to make before there is some attempt to call the right hon. Lady published a written ministerial them to account. statement on the results of the European Union Agricultural Council, in which she states that Mr Speaker: The short answer to the hon. Gentleman’s “the laying hens directive…comes into force on 1 January 2013.”— question is no, but he has made his point. If there are no [Official Report, 7 November 2011; Vol. 535, c. 5WS.] further points of order, we can come now to the ten-minute As Members on both sides of the House will be aware, rule motion, for which the hon. Member for Lewisham the laying hens directive, in fact, comes into force on East (Heidi Alexander) has been patiently waiting. 167 8 NOVEMBER 2011 Internet Regulation (Material 168 Inciting Gang Violence) Internet Regulation (Material Inciting Do we not owe it to the young people who are Gang Violence) viewing this stuff online to make them feel safer? These are not videos filmed in some make-believe American Motion for leave to bring in a Bill (Standing Order gangland. No, these are videos filmed in our own No.23) communities—in our car parks, our town centres and on our housing estates. They are filmed in easily recognisable 3.40 pm locations where my constituents will walk on a regular Heidi Alexander (Lewisham East) (Lab): I beg to move, basis. That leave be given to bring in a Bill to give courts the power to Currently, one of the only ways that this material is order internet service providers to remove certain material which removed from the net is if enough people flag the video, incites gang violence; and for connected purposes. via YouTube’s online community policing mechanism, I am introducing this Bill because I am appalled by as having inappropriate content; if enough people report the proliferation of online videos glorifying gangs and the video as being unacceptable, it will ultimately be serious youth violence. The police, via the courts and taken down. That is clearly a start, but it is not good internet service providers, need to be given explicit enough. The police should have the power to get access power to get these videos taken down or to get access to to these videos blocked by the courts and internet them blocked. These videos act as a recruitment mechanism service providers. I am not so naive as to think that for gangs. I believe they lead to an increased number of would be a panacea, but it strikes me that when the young people in our cities who feel the need to carry a police know that this kind of material is freely available knife for protection and they terrify any ordinary human to anyone with access to the web, they should be empowered being who watches them. to take action against it. I first came across these videos last year, when a We should not have to rely on voluntary community constituent contacted me after his son had been the censorship in relation to this important issue, not least victim of a gang-related mugging. He sent me links to a because the majority of people viewing the material are video that was up on YouTube of the gang that had probably those least likely to want to report it for fear of robbed his son. The video was filmed in broad daylight reprisal. I recognise that policing of the internet will in a car park in the heart of Catford. It contained always be incredibly difficult, but unless we start to images of 10 to 15 young men—perhaps I should say grapple with the online manifestation of gangs, I question boys—rapping, swearing and waving knives around as our ability to tackle the problem. We can talk about if they were cigarettes. The video boasts about violence; gang injunctions all we like, and there might be a need it is menacing, sickening and frightening. There are for them, but should we not also recognise that the same hundreds, if not thousands, of these sorts of videos on individuals might cause an equal amount of fear by the internet, not just on YouTube, but on sites such as their actions when sat at a computer at home? Spiff TV. If someone types “Brixton gangs”, “Hackney gangs”or “Lewisham gangs”into any online audio-visual In the time that remains, I shall turn my attention to search facility, they will find these videos. Not all contain the existing legislation. Although the Communications images of knives, but the narrative is the same, “Mess Act 2003 does not provide a solution to the problem, with us and we’ll stab you.” These videos have been the provisions in the Digital Economy Act 2010 might viewed tens of thousands of times each—sometimes be a useful template for what I propose. Section 127 hundreds of thousands of times. of the Communications Act, entitled, “Improper use of public electronic communications network” makes it a Over the past year, I have attempted to interest the criminal offence to send Minister for Policing and Criminal Justice in this issue, but my letters and contributions in debates have fallen “a message or other matter that is grossly offensive or of an indecent, obscene or menacing character”. on deaf ears. Last week, the Government launched their report into ending gang and serious youth violence, It might be possible to use that measure to deal with but it contains almost no mention of the internet. I find the perpetrator of the gang video—the camera man—but that remarkable, short-sighted and out of touch. We it does not provide a means of requiring that the violent know that the internet is increasingly central to people’s material be removed from public view on the internet. everyday lives—that applies to young people in particular. Clearly, we need to go after the gang members themselves, Indeed, some research suggests that teenagers spend as but we also need to be able to remove what is effectively much as 31 hours per week online. The popularity and their advertising material. The Communications Act accessibility of the internet means that it is inevitably does not seem to be of any use in that regard, whereas one of the ways through which young people get caught the Digital Economy Act contains a potentially useful up in the madness of youth violence, yet this Government template in respect of the power it grants to courts to seem to be ignoring it. order internet service providers to remove web content These videos frighten me and they will frighten young that infringes copyright. I put it to the House that the people too. Every one of us here today knows that removal of material inciting gang violence could and carrying a knife is wrong. Some of us will also know should be dealt with in a similar way. that if a young person carries a knife, it is probably as I understand that in the new year, the Department for likely to end up injuring them as anyone else. But we Culture, Media and Sport is going to publish a Green also know that many young people carry knives out of Paper on a new communications Bill. In the hope of fear. They may not start out to stab someone but, as we joined-up government, I urge the Under-Secretary of all know, too often that becomes the tragic reality. As State for Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport, the hon. Patrick Regan says in his book “Fighting Chance”: Member for Wantage (Mr Vaizey), who is present, to “The truth is that, for many, the everyday fear of gangs and ensure that DCMS and the Home Office work together what they can do to you is far greater than the fear of being and look carefully at the options for addressing this caught and going to prison”. important issue. If the Government are serious about 169 Internet Regulation (Material 8 NOVEMBER 2011 170 Inciting Gang Violence) addressing the problems of gangs and youth violence, European Budgets 2014 to 2020 they need to wake up to the role of the internet and the way in which young people become involved in gangs and knife crime. 3.49 pm As things stand, I fear there is a real danger that the The Financial Secretary to the Treasury (Mr Mark Government are leaving the need for an internet strategy Hoban): I beg to move, to tackle gang crime, and indeed other forms of crime, That this House takes note of European Union Documents in the “too difficult to tackle” box. That simply is not Nos. 12478/11 and Addenda 1 and 2, 12474/11, 12480/11, 12483/11, good enough. Gangs may not be a new phenomenon 12475/11 and Addenda 1 to 3, and 12484/11, relating to the but the casualisation of violence associated with them Commission’s proposal on the next Multiannual Financial Framework (MFF), 2014-20; agrees with the Government, that at a time of is. The speed and reach of the internet in propagating ongoing economic fragility in Europe and tight constraints on and glorifying that violence is also something new and domestic public spending, the Commission’s proposal for very we must not ignore it. We must find a way to address it. substantial spending increases compared with current spend is Question put and agreed to. unacceptable, unrealistic, too large and incompatible with the tough decisions being taken in the UK and in countries across Ordered, Europe to bring deficits under control and stimulate economic That Heidi Alexander, Mr David Lammy, Ms Karen growth, that the next MFF must see significant improvements in Buck, Joan Ruddock, Bob Blackman, Siobhain the financial management of EU resources by the Commission McDonagh, Meg Hillier, Bill Esterson, Teresa Pearce and by Member States and in the value for money of spend and and Mr Lee Scott present the Bill. that the proposed changes to the UK abatement and new taxes to fund the EU budget are completely unacceptable and an unwelcome Heidi Alexander accordingly presented the Bill. distraction from the pressing issues that the EU needs to address; Bill read the First time; to be read a Second time on and supports the Government’s ongoing efforts to reduce the Friday 16 March, and to be printed (Bill 246). Commission’s proposed budget. Yesterday, the Prime Minister made a statement to the House following the G20 meeting in Cannes regarding the ongoing crisis in the euro area. As his statement made clear, it is vital that the euro area sticks to the deal agreed to two weeks ago by the European Heads of Government to resolve the ongoing crisis. A resolution to that crisis is vital to UK, European and global economic interests. It is equally important that, over the longer term, the euro area and the wider EU take the necessary steps to tackle the deficits that are the root cause of the crisis. The ongoing instability in the euro area vindicates this Government’s decision to get ahead of the curve, cut our deficit and impose strict fiscal discipline on our budget. It is vital that EU member states demonstrate the same resolve, and we welcome commitments by Italy and Spain, among others, to do so. However, the European Commission must also lead from the front in a drive to impose financial discipline across the EU institutions. That is why it is unacceptable for the Commission to propose a 4.9% increase in the annual budget for 2012. The UK and the European Council have agreed that we could not approve such an increase at a time when member states are facing tough decisions to impose fiscal discipline and consolidation. We will be taking a firm stand on the 2012 budget when we meet in the budget ECOFIN later this month. Let me turn now to the principal subject of today’s debate: the multi-annual financial framework that sets out how much the Commission wants to spend in 2014 to 2020 and how it will fund it. The Commission’s proposals seek to increase both its revenue and its spending. It wants new taxes to expand the Brussels coffers, and proposes inflation-busting spending increases. That is simply not acceptable. The answer is not to raise more and spend more; it is to control spending. The best way to restrain EU annual budgets is to set— Geraint Davies (Swansea West) (Lab/Co-op): On a point of clarification, the Minister mentioned inflation- busting increases, but am I right in thinking that what is being proposed is a 5% cash increase in the ceiling over the seven-year period? If so, that would be less than the rate of inflation in real terms, and therefore not an inflation-busting increase. 171 European Budgets 2014 to 20208 NOVEMBER 2011 European Budgets 2014 to 2020 172

Mr Hoban: The most recent rate of inflation in the cash payments—actual expenditure that the multi-annual EU was about 2%, so clearly a 5% increase would be in financial framework will allow in each heading. Instead, excess of the rate of inflation, and therefore an inflation- it opts to use commitments—planned expenditure—but busting— frankly the cost to UK taxpayers is not how much is planned to be spent but the actual cash going out of the Geraint Davies rose— door. This should be the starting point for the higher control over spending, and we and our allies have made Mr Hoban: No, let me continue. that clear to the Commission. The best way to restrain EU annual budgets is to set tough multi-annual framework ceilings. That is why, at Mr MacShane: Will the Financial Secretary give way? the European Council in October 2010, member states agreed that the Mr Hoban: Let me make a bit more progress and I “forthcoming Multiannual Financial Framework must reflect will take the hon. Gentleman’s intervention in a short consolidation efforts being made by Member States to bring while. deficit and debt onto a more sustainable path”. The Commission also asked us to use as our starting Rather than following that path, however, the Commission point for a freeze—this is perhaps where the hon. Member has meekly bowed to pressure from the European for Swansea West (Geraint Davies) has been confused Parliament to increase the budget, thereby returning by the Commission’s numbers—the level of spend planned to the extravagance and irresponsible spending that in 2005, but we cannot ignore the fact that the global sowed the seeds of the current global economic crisis. crisis has taken place since then. Every country has had Just as we cannot accept the Commission’s 2012 budget, to scale back its spending from pre-crisis days and the we also cannot accept the Commission’s proposal, as set European Commission is no different. out on 29 June, to increase the multi-annual framework budget for 2014 to 2020 by 11%. Such an increase is The Commission can also do more to ensure that incompatible with the tough decisions being taken in money is spent more wisely. We are leading the way on the United Kingdom and in countries across Europe to reforming financial management in the EU. For the cut spending. first time in 17 years, we have refused to support the Instead of consolidation, the Commission proposes sign-off of the EU accounts. We are pushing for simpler, expansion. It has ignored the calls made in December clearer rules on spending programmes that make it last year by the UK, France and Germany for a real-terms easier to spot fraud and error, and we have also raised freeze in spending. The Commission claims to have our game at home to ensure that EU money spent here done as we have asked, but let me make it absolutely is spent properly and wisely. clear to the House that it has not. On average, the spend in each year of the next framework would be about Andrea Leadsom (South Northamptonshire) (Con): ¤14 billion higher than it is today. Will the Financial Secretary give way?

Mr John Redwood (Wokingham) (Con): Given that Mr William Cash (Stone) (Con): Will the Financial the Government are now studying the powers and duties Secretary give way? that can be brought back to the House for national and local decision, surely we should be taking big lumps out Mr Hoban: Let me finish a couple of sentences and of this budget? If, for example, we repatriated agriculture, then I will give way. industrial aid and regional aid, we could cut the budget by two thirds. I think that the members of the public to Tackling financial mismanagement in the EU can whom I answer would be very pleased with that. help meet spending commitments, so our message on spending is clear. There should be a real-terms freeze on Mr Hoban: My right hon. Friend makes an important spending, a focus on the amounts actually spent, not point. In parallel to the debate about the ceilings for the plans dreamt up over five years ago when the world was budgetary framework over the course of the period different. Let us tackle waste and financial mismanagement between 2014 and 2020, debates are also taking place across the EU. I give way to my hon. Friend the Member on the individual lines of expenditure within the EU for South Northamptonshire (Andrea Leadsom). budget, and we are proposing significant reductions in cost to underpin our strategy of curbing overall spending Mr Speaker: Order. Before the Minister gives way to by the EU. the hon. Lady, I emphasise that, of course it is in the gift of the Minister to give way as he thinks fit, but the total Mr Denis MacShane (Rotherham) (Lab): Will the time for the debate on this matter is only one and a half Financial Secretary give way? hours, and it would be a pity if Back Benchers were disappointed. I am sure that the Minister will tailor his Mr Hoban: May I make a little progress? I am conscious remarks and his giving way accordingly. of the number of hon. Members, perhaps on both sides of the House, who want to take part in the debate. Andrea Leadsom: Thank you, Mr Speaker. I shall In addition to the on-budget spending increases proposed bear in mind your comments. I am grateful to the by the Commission, the Commission has earmarked an Minister for giving way. Does he agree that one of the extra £18 billion in off-budget spending. That is an most ridiculous wastes of money in this day and age, alarming lack of transparency that brings added risks with tight budgets, is that the European Parliament of poor oversight and control. In a further lack of continues to move between countries during the week, transparency, the proposal fails to focus on levels of at enormous expense to British taxpayers? 173 European Budgets 2014 to 20208 NOVEMBER 2011 European Budgets 2014 to 2020 174

Mr Hoban: We could spend all 1 hour 30 minutes The inflation-busting increases proposed by the Commission detailing the ways in which the EU wastes money. My are out of touch with the realities felt by taxpayers hon. Friend has raised one. The EU spends more on across Europe, and out of touch with the views of José buildings in Luxembourg than on vital expenditure. So, Manuel Barroso, who in June argued that many states conscious of your strictures, Mr Speaker, let me make “need to show more ambition when it comes to fiscal consolidation”. some progress. We as a Government believe that the Commission Curbing European spending is not the only priority needs to show much more ambition, too, when it comes for the UK. We need to tackle how the EU funds its to fiscal consolidation. We will continue to press the spending, too. The Commission is trying to increase its European Commission and member states to deliver a control over funding by introducing new EU-wide taxes multi-annual framework that delivers real fiscal and amending the correction mechanisms such as the consolidation. This will be a challenging negotiation. UK abatement or rebate. Now, this Government have been absolutely clear. We will defend our rebate. Last Mr Cash: Will my hon. Friend give way? time the UK negotiated the multi-annual financial framework in 2005 the then Labour Government gave Mr Hoban: There will always be pressure from others ground on the rebate in return for reform of the common to spend more, and a failure to agree the framework agricultural policy. What has happened since then? The would shift the focus to the annual budget process value of the rebate has fallen, but the spending on the which, unlike the framework, is decided by qualified CAP has not budged. We will not fall for empty promises; majority voting. It is an uncertain prospect that we are we will resist any change to the abatement. Our rebate eager to avoid. That is why we will work tirelessly to remains absolutely justified. The structure of EU spending seek the best deal on the multi-annual framework, but a means that we get less per capita than any other member deal on our terms—a deal that curbs EU spending and state. Without the rebate, the UK’s net contribution as a puts a brake on the Commission’s plans for EU-wide percentage of national income would be the largest taxes and seizing some of our rebate— across Europe and twice as large as the contributions made by France and Italy. Our rebate is fully justified, Mr Cash: Will my hon. Friend give way? and we are not going to give it away. Mr Hoban: I was about to conclude to give my hon. Mr MacShane: Can the Minister confirm that, for Friend time to speak in the debate, but let me take his the six years, the proposed increase is 11%. Eleven intervention. divided by six is 1.85% or about 1.9% each year. Is that factually accurate? Mr Cash: This gives me an opportunity to put one thing on the record, not necessarily in a spirit of cynicism. Mr Hoban: This goes back to some of the challenges Last year I moved an amendment, which was accepted in the Commission’s presentation of its numbers. The by the House, that we would have no increase in the budget proposed by the Commission is £100 billion budget. By the end of the convolutions that took place, larger than the real freeze in spending that the UK and the Government accepted an increase of 2.9%. May I be its allies have proposed. [Interruption.] The right hon. absolutely assured that on this occasion, given the robust Member for Rotherham (Mr MacShane) says that I nature and the tenor of what my hon. Friend has said, have not answered the question. It is clear that the way that there will be no increase whatsoever? in which the European Commission has structured its budget, by having some things on or off-budget and by Mr Hoban: My hon. Friend is well versed in the talking about commitments rather than actual spending, intricacies of the European Union. As he knows, the confuses and clouds the position, leaving some to think budget negotiations later this month are done on a that the Commission has embarked on a freeze on the QMV basis. We do not have a veto on the 2012 budget budget, whereas in reality the EU is proposing a real-terms and we will be seeking to build a coalition of allies who increase in the budget. are as committed as we are to curbing the expenditure Let me move on to the second issue in relation to the of the EU, and who are as committed as we are to funding of the EU budget. The Government strongly opposing the inflation-busting increase proposed by the oppose the proposal for new taxes to fund the European European Commission. I am sure that when we reach Union budget. They attach considerable importance to that deal later this month, my hon. Friend will seek to the principle of tax sovereignty. Tax is a matter for hold the Government to account on that. I can assure member states to decide at a national level. We oppose him that we are doing everything in our power to ensure any new taxes or changes to the existing system that that we curb the EU’s plans and reduce the spending increase the UK’s contributions or pose a threat to our levels proposed by the Commission. long-term position, including a financial transactions tax to fund the EU budget. We cannot accept a budget Mrs Anne Main (St Albans) (Con): Will my hon. which asks for more and asks for a greater share from Friend give way? taxpayers and from the UK. A year ago, the Government set out their plans for Mr Hoban: I will not, as I was about to end, bearing the consolidation of public expenditure at the spending in mind Mr Speaker’s strictures. review. Supported by the International Monetary Fund We are committed to seeking the best deal for the and OECD, the Government set out plans to reduce the United Kingdom, a deal that curbs EU spending, puts a deficit. We have shown our resolve by keeping the UK brake on the Commission’s plans for EU-wide taxes, out of the storm that has engulfed the euro area, and we and seizes some of our rebate. I urge the House to will show the same resolve with the European Commission. support the motion. 175 European Budgets 2014 to 20208 NOVEMBER 2011 European Budgets 2014 to 2020 176

4.4 pm proposals to change what it calls its “own resources” method of calculating the income it received from each Chris Leslie (Nottingham East) (Lab/Co-op): The member state, it is suggesting two new direct revenue Minister started the debate by referring to today’s news streams. The first is a top-slice process for domestic about the eurozone crisis. Despite the failures of all VAT revenues, which I would like to ask the Minister leaders at the G20 summit, including the Prime Minister, about specifically. I am very sceptical about the proposal and the continued failure of the eurozone to put flesh and would be grateful if he addressed it when summing on the bones with regard to the dimensions of the up, because I do not think he touched on it adequately European financial stability facility and the role of the in his opening comments. Will he tell the House what European Central Bank, we hope that some leadership proportion of our domestic VAT would be diverted to will eventually emerge across the European stage to get EU institutions if the change was proceeded with? The to grips with the problem. I am sure that the Minister Commission seemed to suggest that it is a replacement will want to take back the message from both sides of for the VAT element of the funding formula used to the House that far sturdier action is needed on these issues. calculate contributions from each member state, but It is important that the House recognise the difference how would the existing arrangements and the new between the issues we would like to discuss today and arrangements compare? the specific issue addressed by the motion. The Minister With regard to the Commission’s proposal for a new referred to the Council of Ministers’ proposal in the EU financial transaction tax, can we at least be clear summer for a real-terms freeze in the EU’s annual that it twists the notion of a Robin Hood tax so wide of budget for 2012—in other words, a cash rise of over the mark that it is barely recognisable from the global 2%—yet the European Parliament voted on 26 October FTT, which has received so much support from charities, to back a package even higher than the Commission’s campaigners and leading economists worldwide? Revenues proposal for a 4.9% increase. Labour Members of the from any FTT must surely be destined for jobs, growth European Parliament voted against the package, which and carbon reduction at home and in the developing would have amounted to an increase of more than 5%. world. Pouring those revenues into the EU budget or We were prepared to support only a real-terms freeze in EU bail-out funds instead would be the wrong thing to the budget. do and totally contrary to the spirit of a genuine Robin I am told that there will now be a 21-day negotiation Hood tax. Instead, the starting point ought to be the period among the three EU institutions. If the 2012 proposal that Labour put forward at the 2009 G20 summit, budget is not passed by December, it will be worked out which is that all countries should agree to work together on a monthly basis, based on 2011 levels. We believe to establish a tax, set at a fraction of 1%, that could be that the proposal to increase the budget by more than levied on financial transactions, millions of which happen 5% will strike most people as unjustified and wrong-headed. in the City everyday. We want to see a financial transaction The last time we saw the Government negotiate an tax—but one that is implemented with the widest possible annual budget, the Prime Minister started by promising international agreement. a freeze but ended up claiming that an increase was a victory. This time he needs to do better and must not support another inflation-busting rise in the EU budget. Mr MacShane: In 1995 I moved an amendment to the Finance Bill proposing exactly what my hon. Friend suggests, but an hon. Friend who later became the Greg Hands (Chelsea and Fulham) (Con): What about Chancellor of the Exchequer and is now my right hon. the rebate? Friend the Member for Edinburgh South West (Mr Darling) wrote through it with red ink, “No new taxes”, so the Chris Leslie: I will come to that in a moment. idea died the death some 15 years ago. I agree with my If that means the Government need to stand firm for hon. Friend the Member for Nottingham East (Chris the full 21-day negotiating period, so be it. The UK Leslie), but let us not make the best the enemy of the should not allow the 2012 budget to rise beyond a good. If we get this thing going, we are getting something real-terms freeze. going that will help people. Waiting for everybody in the With regard to the snappily titled “Multiannual Financial world to sign up to it will involve a very long wait. Framework 2014-2020”, we rarely have an opportunity to debate a subject while the Chancellor is talking about Chris Leslie: I understand my right hon. Friend’s it at an ECOFIN meeting, so this is a useful sign that frustrations, but I really do not think that the proposal Parliament is in tune with the issues of the day. Defining on the table from the Commission would achieve the the main budget priorities over the seven-year period is outcomes that he or I seek. We have to make concerted a process that began in 1986 but was changed in the efforts to broker a deal where any FTT applies in any of Lisbon treaty so that there was greater involvement for the world’s big financial centres, all of which by the way the European Parliament. It is important to explore the have much to gain from a new and reliable revenue detail, but in our view the notion that there should be stream that supports jobs, growth and the developing any significant overall increase in expenditure is perverse, world. given the strictures being placed on mainstream public The Commission’s proposal falls short, especially investment projects at home. The Government must because of its intended destination for the revenue, but I ensure that they deliver on their rhetoric in the motion think that the difference my right hon. Friend seeks is and secure a much better deal than the one currently on this: we felt that there was a real window of opportunity the table. to steer the agenda on a financial transaction tax and to There are two crucial areas on which the Government persuade other countries that it was something seriously need to focus: the Commission’s proposal for new revenue worth considering, but our Chancellor is out there powers and the UK rebate. With regard to the Commission’s at the ECOFIN meeting today, resisting under all 177 European Budgets 2014 to 20208 NOVEMBER 2011 European Budgets 2014 to 2020 178 circumstances. Indeed, he wrote a private letter to bankers of the current position and, indeed, try harder to engage the other day in which he indicated that he was not in with further proposals on the CAP. That is by far the favour of it at all—even though that contradicts some bigger distortion. We need to pursue a stronger reform of his statements in this place. He is wrong to block agenda and to have a CAP reform that is fairer to small wider discussion among the G20 and beyond. farmers but does not lavish as much on wealthier players The BBC’s Nick Robinson reported this lunchtime in the wealthiest countries. We need to tackle that that our Chancellor asked what was the point in even anomaly as it is an outdated relic. having a conversation about the financial transaction I am grateful to Business for New Europe’s pamphlet tax and, apparently, whether it was entitled “Rethinking the EU Budget,” which suggests “the best way to spend our time”. some very important changes to EU competitiveness deficiencies, such as boosting research and development. It is important that we address those issues, because the It is also important that the Minister address the deficiencies Government’s weak and defeatist attitude is an abdication in the structural funds. Few of those are helping to of leadership and a total abandonment of the gains boost growth, when they ought to be getting investment made for the cause at the G20 meeting in 2009. It is time moving into the economy. Above all, the MFF ought to that Britain stepped up to the plate and showed the contain far greater emphasis on a strategy for jobs and leadership needed to broker a better deal by being open growth, where we know the Government have a blind to the idea that it is possible to win the argument for a spot. different approach. That is why we call on the Government to engage internationally—beyond the EU proposals The Commission and the European Parliament also alone. need reminding that, without growth, we cannot solve the debt crisis, the banking crisis or the jobs crisis. The second major proposal in this multi-annual financial Energy infrastructure projects, high-speed broadband framework is for the Commission to change the correction and transport link improvements could all be brought mechanisms for countries that are the most significant forward within the MFF envelope and prioritised to net contributors to the EU. In other words, it proposes boost employment and economic activity. [Interruption.] to end the UK’s permanent rebate. The rebate returns The Minister shouts from a sedentary position that that about two thirds of the difference between the UK’s involves more spending, but we are talking about within contribution to the EU and the money we receive back. the limitations of the budget. We do not wish to see the Let us be absolutely clear: the Commission’s proposals increases proposed by the Commission. The Minister are totally unacceptable. Of all the 27 countries, only should be out there arguing for a proper strategy for Germany is a higher net contributor to the EU budget growth, and his failure to do so betrays Ministers’ and than the UK, and we have the lowest per capita receipts the Treasury’s blind spot on these issues. from it. The common agricultural policy is a far bigger distortion of the EU budget than any correction mechanism The motion before us tonight talks tough on some of such as the UK rebate. these issues and we will not oppose it, but it is important that this time Ministers do not flunk the tests when they This is a key test for the Prime Minister. He needs to get into the negotiations. put up a strong defence of our rebate if the language that he uses here in the House is to be matched by his rose— deeds in those negotiations. Several hon. Members

Mr Redwood: Will the hon. Gentleman give way? Mr Speaker: Order. A considerable number of Members are seeking to catch my eye. I remind the House that the debate is due to conclude at 19 minutes past 5 and that Chris Leslie: Everybody will be watching closely, it would be seemly and courteous to allow the Financial including the right hon. Gentleman, to whom I am Secretary five minutes to reply to it. Members can do happy to give way. the arithmetic for themselves. There is less than an hour for Back-Bench speeches and, as a consequence, I have Mr Redwood: What promises did the previous Prime imposed a five-minute limit on Back-Bench contributions Minister but one receive when he gave away a chunk of with immediate effect, beginning with Mr John Baron. our rebate? I thought we were promised a reduction in agricultural spending, which would be very welcome. 4.16 pm Chris Leslie: I was not a Member at the time to which Mr John Baron (Basildon and Billericay) (Con): I the right hon. Gentleman refers, but it is true that there have added my name to the motion because I very much have been changes to the UK rebate, although not to support the Government’s attempts to reduce the the majority of it. My understanding is that, in terms of Commission’s proposed budget. We must rein in the money returned, the total amount of rebate has actually Commission’s spending, which is excessive, above inflation gone up, with ¤5.8 billion in the previous MFF round and goes against the direction of travel of Government compared with ¤2.8 billion before, so the rebate is still a budgets generally, as my hon. Friend the Financial very significant gain for the UK. Secretary has made clear from the Dispatch Box. There were changes to the common agricultural policy, Taking into account changes to the rebate, our net although—I accept—not as many as people would have contribution suggests that the increases are far worse liked, but until we have further proposals from the for this country. In the previous Parliament, the total Commission on reforming the common agricultural net contribution was around £19 billion. In this Parliament policy I am certainly not going to get into the business —over the next four or five years—it is set to rise to of urging the Minister to change the UK rebate. It is more than £41 billion. We often talk about big figures in very important that the Government put up a defence this place, but what does that actually mean in terms of 179 European Budgets 2014 to 20208 NOVEMBER 2011 European Budgets 2014 to 2020 180 people’s perception of such expenditure? Let us consider the conclusion that we should not increase our spending the average starting salary of a police officer or a nurse, on the European budget, and, indeed, that it should be which is well below £30,000. For that £21 billion or reduced, I do not support some of the wording in the £22 billion increase, we could have an extra 750,000 motion. police officers or nurses, or, at less then £300 million I agree that we should not increase our UK contribution each, we could have a further 80 hospitals. to the EU budget, now or at any time. We have to look Alternatively, if we were really interested in spurring towards a world where we reduce our contribution very on and encouraging growth in this country, given that a substantially. The right hon. Member for Wokingham 1p cut in basic rate income tax brings around £4 billion (Mr Redwood) and others have mentioned the common into the Treasury, we could have a 5p cut in the basic agricultural policy. Many times, when sitting on the rate of income tax. That certainly would encourage Government Benches in previous Parliaments, I have growth and make a real difference to this country’s called for the abolition of the common agricultural economic outlook. Speaking of that, given that a 1p cut policy. If it were abolished and we carried on subsidising in small business corporation tax equates to £500 million, our own farmers at the level they are subsidised now, we one could eliminate small business corporation tax for would have a massive reduction in our contribution to the increase we are talking about. If we really are the EU budget. serious about growth, I hope that that gives everyone an idea of the scope of the packages we could introduce, The proposed changes to UK abatement and new instead of just acquiescing in this monumental increase taxes are unacceptable. We should decide what our level in the EU budget. of taxes should be. The UK abatement was wrongly reduced in a previous negotiation on the common agricultural policy that did not result in anything beneficial Mr MacShane: Will the hon. Gentleman give way? for Britain. At the time, The Economist said that the deal was so bad that it could have been better to have Mr Baron: No, because I do not have time and I want had no deal. I agree. I support the Government’s efforts to push on. I do apologise. to reduce the Commission’s proposed budget. The numbers The situation is made even worse by the fact that the that are being talked about are clearly unacceptable. It European Court of Auditors has still not signed off the is regrettable, too, that all these things are governed by accounts after 16 years. It is unbelievable. Such a situation qualified majority voting instead of unanimity, but would simply not exist in the private sector. We would there we are. not be more than doubling our contribution to an I do not care for the wording of the motion. It refers organisation that has not signed off its accounts. We to “economic fragility in Europe”. Yes, the situation is have no precise idea of how the money is spent. We certainly very fragile at the moment, and we will not need to take cognisance of the fact that it is a dire recover from that fragility until we have more common situation when auditors have not been able to sign off sense about the eurozone. Certain members should be the accounts. It proves the lack of transparency that allowed to recreate their own currencies, find an appropriate exists when it comes to EU spend. parity for their currencies, and then reflate behind those I suggest to my hon. Friend the Minister that we have currencies. That is the way forward for those countries, to be careful about the position that the Government and it will benefit the eurozone and the European take. Although our first position is that there should be Union, and indeed the world economy overall, when no net increase at all in absolute terms, our fall-back that is allowed to happen. position seems to be that we do not want any increase in real terms—in other words, that we will match inflation. At the moment, inflation is a touch over 3% across the Mr Cash: I should like to correct the hon. Gentleman eurozone. However, there is a risk that inflation could on something. The multi-annual financial framework is rise, and we should be careful what we wish for when governed by article 312 of the treaty on the functioning talking about pegging our contribution to inflation. of the European Union, under which: This recession is unusual in that it is a de-levering “The European Council may, unanimously,”— recession caused by too much debt. The options available in other words, we could have imposed a veto— to Governments are to reduce spending, which is difficult “adopt a decision authorising the Council to act by qualified in the present environment, to create growth—again, majority when adopting the regulation”. difficult, because people are paying down their debts—or That means that it is unanimity first, and then QMV. to create an element of inflation in order to inflate the debt away. I suggest that the European Union, or certainly the eurozone, will explore that possibility and is currently Kelvin Hopkins: I would like to see Governments, and exploring the option of quantitative easing on a massive in particular our Government, using their veto from scale. Despite the economic outlook, higher inflation is time to time in a more bold and radical way. not an impossibility, particularly looking 12 months The wording that I am particularly concerned about out. I ask the Minister to be careful what he wishes for is that which talks about when he talks about pegging our contribution to inflation, because inflation could very well rise shortly. “tough decisions being taken…to bring deficits under control and stimulate economic growth”.

4.21 pm Those things are incompatible. If one wants simply to bring down budgets by cutting, that will not stimulate Kelvin Hopkins (Luton North) (Lab): Although we economic growth, but reduce it. The wording should be are all going to acquiesce in this motion—I understand the other way around. If one wants to bring deficits that there will not be a vote—and although I support under control, the best way to do so is to stimulate 181 European Budgets 2014 to 20208 NOVEMBER 2011 European Budgets 2014 to 2020 182 economic growth. Economic growth would bring down It seems to me that our Government have not really unemployment, increase tax revenues and reduce the got behind the spirit of that part of the Maastricht burden of benefits. treaty. Perhaps it is time that they looked at that sentence If we encourage all the member states of the European again, for democracy is about connection with the Union to deflate collectively, that is the route to depression. people and we have seen a little less of that than I would There are lessons from the 1930s on that. I hope that we have liked over recent weeks in this place. will quickly come to our senses and realise that we are in For too long, the European Union has failed to a pre-1930s situation. If we do not reverse it, we may recognise that edict. The very fact that the European head towards depression. Commission could propose a 5.9% increase this year In questions to the Chancellor the other day, I talked shows just how out of touch it is, at a time when Europe about the Labour Government of 1945, who had a is raging under the constraints of a defunct EU currency. gross debt much larger than we have now. They chose The whole European people face a future that could not to cut spending, but to create the welfare state, well be made much more difficult by the arrogance of bring in the national health service and run a full- those who created a currency for political reasons without employment economy. Full employment was sustained considering the economic constraints. for two and a half to three decades. That is what Every time I go to Europe, I come back with the view brought the deficit under control, and that is what we that the European Commission does not live on the should do again. same planet that most of us live on, that it is out of There are other bad examples from history, which I touch with the people and that it needs to be told again have mentioned before. After the first world war, there and again about article A. It does not understand what was the Geddes axe. There was a deficit after the my grandmother would have told it—that when someone war—there are always deficits after wars—so we thought is in financial trouble, there are only two things to do, that we should cut our way back to a lower budget. which are spend less and earn more. There is no other What happened, of course, was that for a decade we way out of any financial difficulties. had low growth, high unemployment and the deficit got The Government suggest that there is another way— worse, not better. We are in danger of doing that again. mediaeval coin clipping. I say to the Minister, who is In the short term, we have to spend. We could reduce looking quizzically at me, that that means financial our contribution to the European Union budget and easing. People went around cutting little bits of silver spend some of that money on areas of labour intensity off coins, and so devalued the currency. That is exactly with low import content. Those areas are obviously what the Government are doing. I point out that there is construction and the public services—precisely the areas a cost to pay for coin clipping, and it will be borne by that are being cut. Cutting is exactly the wrong thing to our children and grandchildren, which I find totally do and we should do the opposite if we are serious immoral. It is about time that we faced up to the real about bringing the deficit down. That would be beneficial purpose of adding to our inflationary burden. The for everybody because the people who do not have jobs Government think it is a cheap and easy way of getting would have jobs, the public services that are now suffering out of our deficit problems, but have no doubt, there would not suffer, and the people who are dependent on will be a cost to pay in the future. public services would not be hurt. I want to come on to the role of this Parliament. I I agree with the objective of reducing our contribution welcome what the Government have done to get the to the European budget and constraining it in the short 5.9% additional contribution down, and I congratulate term, but I do not believe that we should emphasise them. However, I believe they have to do more in Europe. simply cutting deficits without recognising that that They have to point out article A of the treaty to the EU, could make unemployment rise and the deficit get worse and particularly to the eurozone. They have to point out in the long term. That could lead us into a very serious that if democracy is to succeed, we have to make every economic situation. effort to get closer to the people, not to take government away from the people. The truth is that the whole European adventure has achieved the latter, and it is 4.27 pm about time that our Government got the point that they Mr Brian Binley (Northampton South) (Con): I welcome ought to aim for the former. this motion and the Government’s efforts to trim back the grandiose desires of the European Commission. 4.32 pm With your permission, Mr Speaker, I will take the Geraint Davies (Swansea West) (Lab/Co-op): I will Minister back to the Maastricht treaty because it is a keep my comments brief. I believe we all agree that we pretty good place to start. In 1992, that treaty created do not want to see an increase in the European budget. the European Union. I am sure that the Minister has We all understand that a ¤1 trillion fund is being read it on many occasions. Article A states: established to bail out the euro currency, and if push “This Treaty marks a new stage in the process of creating an comes to shove we all understand that we are being ever closer union among the peoples of Europe”. asked for more money for the International Monetary Would Members believe that the sentence continues by Fund. We all understand that we in Britain are facing saying massive constraints on public spending. However, we “in which decisions are taken as closely as possible to the citizen.”? should get our facts clear. The European Commission has clearly recognised the As I said in my intervention, I understand that what great strength of the first part of that sentence, but I fail is being proposed is that the 2013 budget will be higher, to see where it has recognised the import of the latter and will become the fixed 5% cash increase ceiling part. between 2014 and 2020. However, it is said the total 183 European Budgets 2014 to 20208 NOVEMBER 2011 European Budgets 2014 to 2020 184 amount of the budget as a share of EU gross income On the structural questions, the proposals—the financial will fall from 1.12% to 1.05%. I support what the transactions tax and the change to greater own resources— Government are saying, but let us be fair about what is are fundamental changes. The chairman of the European happening. There will be a cash increase ceiling, and the parliamentary committee, Mr Alain Lamassoure, who budget will fall in real terms as a share of overall EU gave us the benefit of his many speeches, and who has income. written a huge pamphlet on the subject, is living on another planet. In the meantime, a meteor has hit Stephen Williams (Bristol West) (LD): Will the hon. planet Europe and huge chunks are falling off it, but it Gentleman recognise that one reason for that fall as a is still spinning, even when the whole thing is disintegrating proportion of total European income is that some in front of our eyes. These people are astonishing. elements that are currently within the budget are being With respect to the Minister, I look to the future with taken out of it and accounted for in a different way? some concern, if only because we could end up with another increase in spending despite the blandishments Geraint Davies: No, I do not accept that, but I do of the motion. Delighted as I am that right hon. and accept that there need to be structural changes in the hon. Friends have signed the motion, I issue that cautionary budget, such as a reduction in common agricultural note. policy funding and more focus on growth, investment and tooling up Europe to compete with emerging markets. Mrs Main: I would like to test the resilience of the All those factors are important. Government Members proposal about whether we have to pay more, and say, who think this is all a complete waste of money and “No more will we pay,” and see what happens. We for that we would be better off spending it at home on chip ever capitulate when we are pressed to the point. I shops miss the point of having a commonality in research would like to say, “This is the will of this sovereign and innovation, and of making Europe more successful Parliament, and we will not pay any more”. We should for the future. The Government seem to be completely test that ignorant of any strategic undertakings or documentation that come out of Europe on how to push smart, sustainable Mr Cash: I, too, take that view. My hon. Friend is and inclusive growth. That is missing from the Government’s completely right. I note that the motion states that the armoury—they focus always on cuts and never on House growth, and they are missing the wood for the trees. “supports the Government’s ongoing efforts to reduce the On the Tobin tax, I clearly do not support a tax when Commission’s proposed budget”. 80% of it would fall on Britain and when it would I would hope to go further, but we shall see. undermine Europe’s competitiveness. I share the view of the shadow Minister, my hon. Friend the Member Mr Peter Bone (Wellingborough) (Con): The Prime for Nottingham East (Chris Leslie), that we should look Minister said at the Dispatch Box that he wanted to for an international basis for such a measure. That said, gain more reductions, but seemed to imply that he was we need to understand that an international Tobin tax held back by qualified majority voting. Does my hon. would fall primarily on the US and the UK. Friend believe that the Prime Minister has a veto, or is it My understanding is that the rebate has been frozen down to QMV? at £3.2 billion a year for the next seven years, but we need to realise that if the gross contribution is increasing, Mr Cash: I have already quoted article 312. There is our rebate is going down proportionately. The Prime no doubt that the whole process can be blocked by Minister should argue harder for the rebate to increase unanimity, but once the European Council has made a at least at the same rate as the increase in our gross decision to go ahead, the decision reverts to qualified contribution. Without further ado, I shall come to a majority vote. I think that is right, but the Minister will conclusion, because I know that many hon. Members correct me if I am wrong. wish to speak. I want to deal with one fundamental question that came up over and over again. That conference was 4.35 pm regarded as important because it supposedly carried the Mr William Cash (Stone) (Con): First, I should like national Parliaments with it. That was partly the case, to demonstrate the extent of the documents that I will although it did not apply to the United Kingdom discuss in the next five minutes, just to give some Parliament—certainly not to me in my capacity there. indication of what is going on. Growth is the key question, but, over that too, they are living on another planet, because their idea of growth Secondly, as Chairman of the European Scrutiny simply means more investment of public money. I had Committee, I had the opportunity to go, on behalf of to ask them, “Where is the money coming from?” There our national Parliament, to a conference on the multi-annual were about 300 people there—I was a little bit in the lions’ financial framework. It was a complete farce. Mr Barroso, den, but it was worth doing simply to see the unreality. our Minister for Europe, Ministers from other countries As T. S. Elliot said: and their permanent secretaries and so on were all there. I was completely staggered by their inability to have the “humankind cannot bear very much reality”. faintest idea of what was going on. I said to them, “You When I asked, “Where’s it coming from?”, they said, are living on another planet!” Somewhat unusually, “The taxpayers”, but it is not coming from the taxpayers; I ended up being congratulated by our UKRep it is coming from small business men all over Europe, representatives for at least spelling that out. It is devastating who, when running their businesses profitably, can then how far removed those people are from the realities of be taxed. But what if they cannot run them profitably? life, as my hon. Friend the Member for Northampton Here we have the problem with social employment laws, South (Mr Binley) said. and I had the temerity to mention to them things such 185 European Budgets 2014 to 20208 NOVEMBER 2011 European Budgets 2014 to 2020 186 as paternity and maternity leave, the working time together a coalition of those who are prepared to stand directive, the temporary agency directives and the rest. I against this increase, when more than 420 MEPs voted told them about the scale of redundancy payments. We for it. saw the Channel 4 programme the day before yesterday I am glad to say that the Democratic Unionist party on pensions in Greece. Apparently, when people leave Member of the European Parliament was among those work, those pensions remain, for the rest of their lives, who voted against, and I am delighted that, on this equivalent to what they had earned per year when occasion, every single member of the UK delegation to working. the European Parliament who actually voted, voted The growth must come from the small and medium-sized against. I have to note, however, that five Lib Dems, one businesses. I have here another of these documents—none Plaid Cymru Member and two Greens abstained, which of them ever see the light of day, but I have the pleasure I think is amazing on a vote that attracts such consensus of being able to tell the House about it today. This one in this House. I am sure that their colleagues here will is entitled, “Towards a European Consensus on Growth”, want to ask their European colleagues exactly why they but it, too, is completely and utterly unrealistic. There is decided to abstain rather than vote against. no serious understanding of where the money comes The proposal for an increase of £834 million in the from or of the fact that the result of having no growth UK contribution, which would bring our overall in Europe is that there is no growth here either, because contribution to more than £14 billion indicates just how 40% of our economy is tied in to Europe. But these out of touch are the Eurocrats and many in the European people will not change the structural system or the Parliament. It also illustrates why we need a referendum labour laws. on our relationship with the European Union. We have The EU representatives are talking and talking, but a situation in this House today where we are going to they are doing and doing nothing, and as a result, this agree to what I think is an excellent motion signed by black hole, whether Greece, Italy, Spain or wherever many excellent Members and it will be passed unanimously. else in the EU, is condemned to getting deeper and People in the country will think, “That’s it, then. The blacker, simply because there is no realisation of where sovereign Parliament of the United Kingdom has declared the money comes from in the first place. That is the its position.” Yet,there have been hints, and the Financial problem at the root of this multi-annual financial Secretary is already paving the way for a further statement framework. The whole project is based on a con trick of at some point, about some increase because we are monumental proportions. They believe that they simply subject to a qualified majority voting process. We are need to spend money on infrastructure and bridges—I not masters of our destiny in respect of something as would like to know where the contracts are going and vital as the spending of almost £1 billion of taxpayers’ how they are composed—but that does not solve the money. problem of the small businesses that simply cannot That goes to the heart of what the debate about our operate in the kind of environment that Europe now relationship with Europe is all about. The incapacity of represents. That is all I need to say. This is a dead this House, of Members on all sides, even when they parrot. agree, to implement something on which the vast majority —virtually everyone apart from a few Lib Dem and Green MEPs, it appears—agree on, yet we cannot do 4.42 pm anything about it. This illustrates far more eloquently Mr Nigel Dodds (Belfast North) (DUP): It is always a than anything any of us could say why we need this pleasure to follow the hon. Member for Stone (Mr Cash). referendum sooner rather than later, so that we can I well recall when the House, not that long ago, passed an address these fundamental inadequacies in the entire amendment in his name under which there was to be no process, which leaves us sitting here today, talking about annual increase in the EU budget. It was a wise amendment, an issue, passing resolutions but powerless in this sovereign and I was delighted that the House supported it. Parliament to do anything about it. I hope that the Government and all Members will take that on board. I want to reflect on what happened last year—the Financial Secretary mentioned this—when the proposal was for a 6.2% increase in the annual budget. Despite all 4.47 pm the tough talk, we ended up with an increase of 2.9%—at Richard Drax (South Dorset) (Con): What a pleasure a time when budgets are being slashed in many areas it is to follow the right hon. Member for Belfast North vital to our constituents—and people were mystified (Mr Dodds). It is an honour, indeed, and I entirely about why, after all the tough talk, we had agreed to an agree with everything he said. increase. Today the Financial Secretary has spoken It is encouraging to hear our Front-Bench team mention those dreaded words—“qualified majority voting”—and words like “resolve”—a word that seems to have disappeared I am worried that we will end up in a similar position from the English dictionary for a while. I wish they this year, despite all the tough talk. I am particularly would follow up their words with action. What further concerned because I recall the tough talk not just on evidence do we—the Government, the country, the last year’s increase, but when the question of the European world—need to see to show that this whole federalist External Action Service came before the House and we nightmare is not working? It is undemocratic and corrupt. were told that it would mean no increase in the budget. I have people in my constituency who are trying to It transpired, however, that there would be a £400 million borrow £10,000, £20,000 or £30,000 to keep their businesses spike increase in the budget for that. and jobs going. They simply cannot get it. Yet we are I was also worried when I saw that, after the European prepared to give Greece—and, I suspect, Italy—billions Parliament debated the matter on 26 October in Strasbourg, and billions of euros to a cause that is lost. It is 52 of the 120 MEPs who voted against the annual increase quite beyond me, quite beyond my constituents and quite were UK Members. It does not augur well for gathering beyond most people in this country. 187 European Budgets 2014 to 20208 NOVEMBER 2011 European Budgets 2014 to 2020 188

Both motions being debated today will, in their own ways, 4.52 pm grant further powers and resources to the EU —despite Mr Denis MacShane (Rotherham) (Lab): I stand as a our best intentions. We have heard that the Government resolute Thatcherite on this question. In 1940, Polish have succeeded in reducing the annual budget increase pilots came and grappled with the enemy, getting much from 2011 from 6% or thereabouts to 2.9%. I welcome closer than our pilots while risking their lives, and that. Like my hon. Friend the Member for Stone (Mr shooting down proportionally many more planes. Forty Cash), I hope that it will remain at that level. years later, Polish Solidarity helped to dig the grave of As to the multi-annual financial framework, these European Communism. What is our response? Today words are marvellous, are they not? The MFF—a slip Poland is the fourth larger contributor to the UK of the tongue could get one into all kinds of trouble—now rebate, despite being a much, much poorer country. commands our attention. I am relieved that the European That is why, in the 1980s, the Prime Minister—now Scrutiny Committee has recommended that these Lady Thatcher—was happy to see Britain’s contribution documents are seen in this House. Only here can such to the European Community budget, as it was then, rise decisions be taken. The absence of precise details about from £656 million in 1984 to £2.54 billion in 1990. the Commission’s proposal is concerning, and I note During the same period, the EC budget grew threefold. that because of that absence, the European Scrutiny When taxed by Labour Members of Parliament—including Committee has suggested that we focus on the Commission’s my right hon. and good Friend the Member for Blackburn expenditure ambitions and revenue proposals. (Mr Straw), who said, “She has come back from Brussels, The Government estimate that the overall MFF budget hauled down the Union flag and hauled up the white represents an average increase of £13.5 billion a year flag of surrender to Europe”—the Prime Minister said over the period. The UK contribution to the MFF “No, no, no: we must help our new friends and encourage between 2014 and 2020 is provisionally estimated to be growth in the economies of the countries that are 14.5% pre-rebate and 11.5% post-rebate. I agree with joining Europe.” Well, we are a different Britain now. the Government that such extravagance is completely We do not like the Poles, and we do not like Poland. We unacceptable, particularly when the level of public debt are saying to the Poles, “Keep signing a very large in member states will be 50% more than it was in 2007. cheque for our rebate.” The Commission argues that much of the increased There has been much talk about unaccountable transfers expenditure is already committed to EU-wide projects, of money. May I draw the House’s attention to one very and suggests that there will be no increases in administration unaccountable and huge transfer of money? I refer to costs. That is hard to believe, given that the Government the £40 billion that it is proposed that we should give to identified £1.1 billion of administration costs in this the International Monetary Fund, which is unaccountable year’s budget alone. I am glad to hear that there is no and secretive and whose staff salaries make the average possibility of the UK’s agreeing to the level of expenditure EU salary look like pauper’s pay.That sum—£40 billion—is contained in these documents. more than the entire amount raised in corporation tax The revenue proposals are equally serious. For obvious in Britain each year. It is bigger than the combined reasons, the EU’s ultimate aim is to finance the budget budgets of the Foreign and Commonwealth Office, the entirely from so-called “own resources”—which are, of Ministry of Defence, the Department for International course, nothing of the sort, and will become so only Development, the Department for Culture, Media and after the EU has levied a series of new duties, taxes and Sport, and all Departments except for the big spenders tariffs on member countries for its own benefit. The who have responsibility for costly areas such as the documents suggest a financial transaction tax, a financial NHS and social security. We are happy to send that activities tax, the auctioning of revenue from the EU £40 billion to Washington with barely a nod or a debate emissions trading scheme, an air transport tax, a new in this House, but it is a far bigger sum than any amount VAT, an energy tax, and an EU corporate income tax. being imposed in respect of Europe. That is utter madness. It is for us in this House to decide I agree with the points about maintaining budget issues of national sovereignty. The European Commission discipline, but I ask the Minister to confirm in his deludes itself in stating that such measures do not affect winding-up speech that from 2014 to 2020 the EU our right to rule ourselves. Document 12478/11 states: budget is due to increase by 11%, which is a rise of well “It should also be stressed the proposals for new ‘own resource’ under 2% per year—far below current inflation rates in have no impact on national sovereignty.” this country. I have every sympathy with the Minister, because I have done some of this work in Europe myself I strenuously disagree. and, frankly, dealing with EU budget questions makes Finally, there is the question of the rebate. Perhaps the Rosetta stone translation look like child’s play. most important is the suggestion that the current financing The bottom line is that the EU budget will not go system must above 1% of Europe’s gross national income because it “simplify the existing correction mechanisms”. cannot do so. There are debates to be had about how In plain English, that means the UK rebate, which is this money should be spent, and 85% of it comes now in the Commission’s sights. Our relative prosperity straight back to nation states, including Britain, to is held against us, as is the open-ended nature of the spend on agriculture subsidies and structural and regional rebate, but without it our net contribution to the EU as funds. If we did not have a common agricultural policy, a percentage of national income would be twice as large we would have to have a British agricultural policy, and as France’s contribution and 50% larger than that of I can assure colleagues that our farmers’ lobby would Germany. extract a far bigger share of taxpayers’ money than it does under the CAP. In these dying seconds, I urge the Government please, please to begin to stand up for our country and our Martin Horwood (Cheltenham) (LD): Will the right future. hon. Gentleman give way? 189 European Budgets 2014 to 20208 NOVEMBER 2011 European Budgets 2014 to 2020 190

Mr MacShane: No, because I want to conclude. Martin Horwood: Will my hon. Friend give way? This is not just a European question. The signal we are sending around the world is that we are open to Mr Bone: I am not giving way to anyone, because I business but are closed to foreigners, and that we want want other hon. Members to have a chance to speak inward investment but want to disconnect from Europe. later. We are sending a very negative and dangerous signal that we do not like the biggest single market in the Martin Horwood rose— world and we do not want to be full partners with the rest of the 500 million people living under the rule of Mr Bone: I must go back to talking about Labour, law and democracy. and I suggest that its approach arises from embarrassment, because in its 13 years in power it rolled over to each I understand Front-Bench colleagues’ interpretation and every command put to it by the European Union. of the Robin Hood tax—the fair trade tax—but I feel a The lack of Members on its Benches just goes to lot happier in the current economic crisis standing with increase Labour’s embarrassment. Labour does not the spirit of St Paul’s rather than the spirit of bean understand how a Government could put British interests counters. first and stand up to the European political elite. I suggest that the approach of our Liberal Democrat Several hon. Members rose— partners does not arise out of embarrassment; it arises because they love European bureaucrats spending British Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Lindsay Hoyle): Many Members money without any proper democratic accountability still wish to speak, so I ask Members to be as brief as to the British people. If the Lib Dems had their way, we possible. would be in the euro and in a complete financial mess. Of course they represent 8% of the British electorate, 4.57 pm but they are likely soon to be overtaken by the United Kingdom Independence party, which is at 6% in the Mr Peter Bone (Wellingborough) (Con): It is a great polls. pleasure to follow the right hon. Member for Rotherham We have a British bulldog of a Prime Minster who is (Mr MacShane), although I did not agree with a single taking the fight to Europe and putting British interests word he said. first, second and third. At least on the Conservative I rise to support the motion in the name of the Benches there is unity on wishing the Prime Minister Financial Secretary to the Treasury, which is signed by success in reducing the budget. We have a superb Minister, me, my hon. Friends the Members for Kettering and we want the message to go out that our Prime (Mr Hollobone), for Bury North (Mr Nuttall), for Minister is going to Europe to get a reduction in the Basildon and Billericay (Mr Baron), for Worthing West budget and to explain to the Europeans that they cannot (Sir Peter Bottomley), for Brigg and Goole (Andrew Percy) spend and spend and spend. My speech goes on to say and for Harlow (Robert Halfon), and my right hon. that “the Deputy Prime Minster thinks”—well, actually Friend the Member for Wokingham (Mr Redwood). It that is where it ends. is disappointing that no Member from Her Majesty’s official Opposition or any Liberal Democrat felt able 5.1 pm to sign the motion. How can anyone disagree with a motion that says that the EU budget proposed by the Stephen Williams (Bristol West) (LD): I am glad to Commission is have the opportunity to speak, especially after that “completely unacceptable and an unwelcome distraction from the generous build-up. We are having a curious discussion. pressing issues that the EU needs to address”, We have had many European Union discussions in the that declares it past few months, and I cannot recall my hon. Friend the Financial Secretary being received with such warm “supports the Government’s ongoing efforts to reduce the Commission’s proposed budget”, accolade on every occasion as he has been on this one. I am sure that must have cheered him. We saw the curious and that states that alliance of Conservative Eurosceptics and Labour “the Commission’s proposal for very substantial spending increases Eurosceptics when there was discussion of the possible compared with current spend is unacceptable, unrealistic, too demise of the eurozone. However, on this issue we large and incompatible with the tough decisions being taken in might actually have tri-party agreement. May I assure the UK and in countries across Europe”? my hon. Friend the Member for Wellingborough (Mr Bone), even though I am a Europhile within the Liberal Martin Horwood: Will my hon. Friend give way? Democrats—that phrase must make him shudder—that my party has usually been at the forefront of calling for Mr Bone: No, I am not giving way. reform from within the European Union? We do that How can anyone disagree with a motion that states because we want the European Union to work. We that the want it to be a success and we are certainly not blind to its shortcomings. “proposed changes to the UK abatement and new taxes to fund the EU budget” Chris Leslie: Will the hon. Gentleman therefore confirm are “totally unacceptable”? that Fiona Hall, the leader of the UK Lib Dems in the Why on earth did Opposition Members and our European Parliament, posted an article on 15 July that Liberal Democrat coalition colleagues not support the said: motion? May I suggest that Labour did not do so “It’s time to consign the UK rebate to history, along with the because of embarrassment, as— rest of Thatcherism”? 191 European Budgets 2014 to 20208 NOVEMBER 2011 European Budgets 2014 to 2020 192

Stephen Williams: That is not a position of this say that there is more rejoicing in heaven over one coalition Government at Westminster. As a good democrat, sinner who repenteth than over the 99 who are not in the hon. Gentleman will recognise that decisions that need of repentance. we make in local councils or in the European Parliament, I have very little time, so I shall address the veto where people have their own electoral mandates, do not briefly. It is crucial to be clear that there is a veto on the bind parliamentarians in this House. That is the way in multi-annual financial framework, which applies from which our democracy works and we take a difference 2014, but not on the annual budgets between then and stance on the matter here. now. The Government are therefore in a very strong The European Commission has asked for a 5% budget negotiating position for that framework but not necessarily increase, from ¤966 billion to just over ¤1 trillion, for for the annual budgets. They are also in a very strong the second half of this decade. Most of our constituents negotiating position regarding the own resources issue, would find it extraordinary that a request is being made which is also subject to the veto. for the EU budget to wax while people in every member I must confess that I rejoiced at the Minister’s speech state are having to endure the waning of their budgets. because we have been hearing for the first time since It was right that last December five large net contributors 1997 a proper and solid view on how we should interact to the EU budget—the UK, Germany, France, the with our European friends and neighbours. However, Netherlands and Finland—called for a freeze in the EU there is one issue to which I should like to alert Her budget for the second half of this decade. I would like Majesty’s Government. The budget is drawn up in euros the Minister to tell us whether the Government are and we have to be careful about what currency that seeking a cash freeze or a real-terms freeze. might actually be in the lifetime of the budget. It is of Whatever the level of the budget, it certainly is a concern to me that the euro might collapse between budget in drastic need of reform. The common agricultural now and the end of the budget, and that if it were to be policy still accounts for more than 45% of the European a German euro it could be substantially higher in Union’s spending, whereas research and development sterling terms than the current euro. We ought therefore accounts for only 6.7%. The Commission is actually to get some acknowledgement of the currency risk in proposing a switch between those budgets, but that any budget negotiations so that we can protect our switch is made possible only by the Commission’s call position in sterling. That really is a crucial point. for a larger budget. It is simply ludicrous for the European I want to mention own resources, because, as my hon. Union to continue to have agriculture as its largest area Friend the Member for South Dorset (Richard Drax) of expenditure, rather than the industries of the future— said, they are not own resources. As Margaret Thatcher industries where the UK is well placed. We are currently once said, it is our money, and we must not let the EU the largest recipient of EU funds for research and get at our money if we need it for our own purposes. development, and that is the budget that should be expanded. The priority for the United Kingdom coalition Finally, as time is short and you want me to wind up, Government should be to negotiate a major shift within Mr Deputy Speaker, let me mention the financial the EU budget and certainly within the existing level of transactions tax. This is the work of the devil and it resources. To clarify the issue for the hon. Member for must be opposed. We have heard a lot of wishy-washy Nottingham East (Chris Leslie), I say that our budget stuff about “If we get global agreement.” Well, thank rebate should remain while the EU budget remains in God for Lee Kuan Yew, because I think we can be its current unreformed and out-of-date state. confident that the good people of Singapore will say no to this awful nonsense. A financial transaction tax On sources of revenue for the European Union, I would not tax invisible, non-existent people: it would share the sentiments expressed by the Opposition Front- fall on the citizens and subjects of the United Kingdom. Bench team that it would not be right for the EU to take We must oppose it. We must be robust in opposing it on the personality of a federal state and have taxes and we must not let the European Union get its grubby paid directly to it, whether that be VAT or the proposed little hands on it. financial transactions tax. There is a very good case for a financial transactions tax being levied once we can have international agreement among the global financial 5.8 pm centres, many of which lie outside the European Union, Andrew Percy (Brigg and Goole) (Con): It is a pleasure but there is no case at all for the European Union itself to follow my hon. Friend the Member for North East to pinch that money, which the people who have Somerset (Jacob Rees-Mogg), who made a fantastic campaigned for the Robin Hood tax have earmarked speech. I wanted to address the dangerously pro-European for other purposes. May I reassure my colleagues that speech of the right hon. Member for Rotherham the Government are right to call for a freeze in existing (Mr MacShane), but sadly he has left the Chamber. We EU budgets? However, they should also vigorously heard from him the usual nonsense about how anybody press the case for reform. who opposes the European Union in some way hates foreigners, which is not the case at all. I was going to say Several hon. Members rose— to him that he should ask the people of Rotherham what they want their money to be used for and put that Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Lindsay Hoyle): Order. There to a referendum. They might keep re-electing him out of are three speakers and eight minutes. some sort of strange fondness, but I strongly suspect that they do not agree in the slightest with his views on 5.6 pm the European Union. Jacob Rees-Mogg (North East Somerset) (Con): It is I was intrigued by the words of the hon. Member for a great pleasure to follow my hon. Friend the Member Nottingham East (Chris Leslie). Obviously, we on the for Bristol West (Stephen Williams). I am tempted to Government Benches are most grateful for his support 193 European Budgets 2014 to 20208 NOVEMBER 2011 European Budgets 2014 to 2020 194 for the motion. I was not quite sure whether he was The Government state, in paragraph 97 of their suggesting that, had he been here during the previous explanatory memorandum on the EU budget, that their Parliament, he would have made sure that the rebate provisional estimate of the UK contribution to the next that the previous Government gave away without any EU financial framework is 11.5%, after the UK rebate reform would not have been given away. He certainly has been taken into account. The Commission’s proposed seemed to be making a pitch for a better job, if nothing else. ceiling for EU payments within the financial framework I was happy to sign this motion for the simple reason over the period from 2014 to 2020 is ¤972 billion, so a that I listen to the constituents of Brigg and Goole. I UK contribution of 11.5% on that level of EU payments am not the brightest individual, as anyone who has would see this country paying in almost ¤112 billion, heard my speeches will confirm, and I have not read which is about £96 billion at an exchange rate of £1 to ¤1.6. through all the relevant documents. However, when I speak to my constituents about what they want to have Mr Cash: Is my hon. Friend aware that, according to done with their money, they tell me that the last thing the European Commission’s proposal for the lump sums they want is for it to be sent off to an institution with “adjusted for relative prosperity”—the annual lump massive bureaucracy whose accounts have not been sums relating to the period from 2014 to 2020—Germany’s signed off for 16 years, only for large parts of it to be would be adjusted to ¤2.5 billion and the United Kingdom’s spent elsewhere. I am a passionate advocate of our to ¤3.6 billion, which is more than Germany’s? withdrawal from the European Union, and I have listened to my constituents. Following the recent vote, I received Mr Nuttall: No, I was not aware of that, and I am hundreds of messages telling me that I had done the grateful to my hon. Friend for bringing it to the attention right thing, and only one from an individual telling me of the House. that I had done the wrong thing— This country will need to contribute about £70 billion to the EU budget during the Parliament that will run Mr Bone: That was a Whip! from 2015 to 2020. Finally, the EU is proposing a substantial extension of its ability to collect its own Andrew Percy: No, it was a constituent who informed revenues by introducing new, EU-wide taxes—the so-called me that we could not have a referendum on the European own resources decision. It is also proposing a new, Union because the people do not understand the dedicated EU VAT and a new financial tax. And, just to arguments—the usual patronising guff that comes from rub it in, it is proposing to end the UK’s rebate. pro-Europeans. EU officials should spend more of their time ensuring I fully support the motion, which is why I put my that eurozone nations start to live within their means name to it, but we should be going much further. Apart and less time devising new ways to tax my constituents. from leaving the European Union, we should be going The EU wants to spend more and wants the UK to pay much further while we are in it to ensure that our budget more. The EU wants to scrap the UK rebate, and the contribution is substantially reduced. My constituents UK wants to bring in new Euro-taxes. To each of these, simply cannot understand why an ever-increasing amount and to echo the words of Baroness Thatcher, it is of their hard-earned money is being sent off and spent absolutely right that our Government should say no, by that institution. no, no. Andrew Bingham (High Peak) (Con): Does my hon. Friend agree with my constituents who have written to 5.15 pm ask me why the European Commission just does not get Mr Hoban: This has been a helpful debate. It is good it? They point out that, when they are keeping their own to see that harmony has broken out on the EU budget— budgets under close control, the Commission should be something that some of us thought was unlikely. There doing the same, instead of proposing these continual has been a clear expression of view across the House increases. that the EU Commission’s proposals for increases, not just in the 2012 budget but in the multi-annual framework, Andrew Percy: Yes,Ido. are excessive and need to be curbed. I welcome the support for the Government’s approach to building a 5.11 pm coalition of allies to curb the increases and seek to Mr David Nuttall (Bury North) (Con): As ever, it is a restrict the increase in budget to no more than a freeze great pleasure to follow my hon. Friend the Member in real terms. for Brigg and Goole (Andrew Percy), who speaks I want to correct the misconceptions of one or two straightforward common sense. I also rise to support Labour Members. The hon. Member for Nottingham the motion. We have had a good debate, and I want to East (Chris Leslie) lectured us on the need to stay firm make some brief points. on the rebate. That was an extraordinary position, given First, we must not lose sight of the fact that, under what happened under the previous Government. He the proposed new EU budget, there remain very few net said that the UK rebate had gone up in cash terms since contributors to the budget. Perhaps if more EU nations the 2005 deal, but let me tell him that the OBR’s contributed to it, the EU might become a more prudent forecast says that, thanks to the giveaway by the previous organisation. Secondly, I agree with the wording of the Government, our rebate falls from £4.2 billion in 2009-10 motion that states that the Commission’s proposal for to £2.7 billion in 2010-11. That is the cost of having a an increase is Labour Government in office when these debates are “unacceptable, unrealistic, too large and incompatible with the being held in Europe. tough decisions being taken in the UK”. The right hon. Member for Rotherham (Mr MacShane), Those words would be a good candidate for the winner who I notice is not in his place, said that Poland was the of the understatement of the year competition. fourth largest contributor to the UK abatement. Well, he 195 European Budgets 2014 to 2020 8 NOVEMBER 2011 196 should get his facts right; it is actually the sixth largest. Credit Institutions and Investment Firms But of course Poland is the largest net recipient of funds from the EU, and our support for developing the Polish economy far exceeds its contribution to our 5.18 pm rebate. The Financial Secretary to the Treasury (Mr Mark In this settlement, we are looking for a rebalancing of Hoban): I beg to move, funds to help economic development in those accession That this House considers that the draft Regulation on prudential countries to give a spur to the economy, and that is in requirements for credit institutions and investment firms (European the long-term interest of the UK economy. The right Union Document No. 13284/11 and Addenda 1-4) does not comply hon. Member for Rotherham said that the EU budget with the principle of subsidiarity for the reasons set out in the was capped at 1% of EU gross national income. It is Annex to Chapter 1 of the Forty-second Report of the European not. If one looks at what is on and off-budget, one sees Scrutiny Committee (HC 428-xxxvii); and in accordance with Article 6 of the Protocol on the application of the principles of that on average, over the course of the financial framework, subsidiarity and proportionality, instructs the Clerk of the House EU spending is 1.11% of European GNI, in breach of to forward this reasoned opinion to the presidents of the European that condition. He and the hon. Member for Swansea institutions. West (Geraint Davies) were also misled by the presentation I am pleased to have the opportunity to discuss the of the numbers. It is clear, and the information in our European Union’s proposals on prudential requirements report demonstrates clearly, that the EU Commission for the financial sector, and I welcome the Scrutiny proposes a real-terms increase in spending, and that is Committee’s thorough report on the issue. I find myself simply unacceptable when countries across the EU are in a slightly odd position today, in that the motion trying to curb their deficits and tackle their public before us today, which stands in my name, was tabled by spending. the Committee. The Committee has done a fantastic We will take a tough line in the negotiations on the job in identifying this issue around subsidiarity, and we budget and the financial framework. We want to ensure shall be supporting the motion. that Europe lives within its means rather than seeking to expand its means with new taxes and expanding its Mr William Cash (Stone) (Con): Will my hon. Friend own resources. Europe should spend the money it has give way? wisely and well. I hope that the House will support the motion before it today. Mr Hoban: I am one minute in to my speech and my Question put and agreed to. hon. Friend wishes to intervene. I am happy to give way. Resolved, Mr Cash: My hon. Friend would need to be only half That this House takes note of European Union Documents Nos. 12478/11 and Addenda 1 and 2, 12474/11, 12480/11, 12483/11, a minute in for the point that I am about to make. There 12475/11 and Addenda 1 to 3, and 12484/11, relating to the are some recommendations sculling around in the Procedure Commission’s proposal on the next Multiannual Financial Framework Committee and the Liaison Committee that the Minister (MFF), 2014-20; agrees with the Government, that at a time of would not necessarily have to reply to the questions put ongoing economic fragility in Europe and tight constraints on forward by the European Scrutiny Committee and by domestic public spending, the Commission’s proposal for very the Chairman. Is my hon. Friend aware of that? substantial spending increases compared with current spend is unacceptable, unrealistic, too large and incompatible with the tough decisions being taken in the UK and in countries across Mr Hoban: I am indeed aware of that and I think it is Europe to bring deficits under control and stimulate economic a good thing. Although my hon. Friends and I see eye growth, that the next MFF must see significant improvements in to eye on many of these issues, there may be an occasion the financial management of EU resources by the Commission when a reasoned opinion is put forward which the and by Member States and in the value for money of spend and Government do not quite agree with. That would put that the proposed changes to the UK abatement and new taxes to the Government and the Committee in a strange position. fund the EU budget are completely unacceptable and an unwelcome distraction from the pressing issues that the EU needs to address; I agree with the Committee that the Commission’s and supports the Government’s ongoing efforts to reduce the co-proposals on prudential requirements raise serious Commission’s proposed budget. concerns over subsidiarity and, as drafted, the proposals seriously undermine the efficacy of the Basel reforms in the EU. As argued in the Committee’s report, the proposals for maximum harmonisation will severely restrict the ability of member states to conduct macro-prudential policy. They limit the ability of member states to respond to the unique characteristics and risks of their market, and where necessary, go beyond minimum standards to ensure financial stability in their own jurisdiction. We cannot risk being straitjacketed into a one-size-fits-all approach in setting prudential levels. Across Europe, no two financial systems are the same, and in a system where euro area banks face the same centrally set interest rate, it is even more important that member states retain the flexibility to use other tools for financial stability. Let me deal with these issues in a little more detail. As hon. Members are aware, the Commission’s proposal on prudential requirements is the mechanism by which the EU will implement the Basel III agreement to strengthen 197 Credit Institutions and Investment 8 NOVEMBER 2011 Credit Institutions and Investment 198 Firms Firms capital requirements and introduce minimum liquidity must retain the tools and flexibility to tackle those risks. and leverage standards, changes that are absolutely Therefore, although Basel III provides an historic and necessary to correct the failures that preceded the latest coherent set of minimum standards, the ability to go crisis. Basel III is an ambitious agreement, a strong beyond them if necessary and deploy macro-prudential demonstration of collective endeavour and ambition, policy to tailor our response to idiosyncratic macro-financial and an agreement that will fundamentally reform the risks is in our vital economic interest. global financial system. As we agreed with our international counterparts at the G20, We are not alone in making that judgment. The previous head of the European Central Bank, Jean-Claude “We are committed to adopt and implement fully these standards”. Trichet, has said that There are those who would seek to use current economic “the Basel requirements are minimum, and they have to be circumstances to row back from full implementation of considered as minimum.” Basel III—those who argue that full implementation would undermine growth at a time when we need to do Likewise, the IMF argued in its UK spillover report: everything we can to support a global recovery. We “UK financial stability will be weakened (with adverse spillovers) disagree. At a time of instability and at a time when if EU rules constrain UK financial regulations at insufficiently bank balance sheets are under intense scrutiny and ambitious levels or if they limit the ability to use macro-prudential pressure, now is not the time to row back from strengthening instruments to address emerging risks.” those balance sheets. Stability is in itself a vital precondition Retaining that flexibility will not, as the Commission for growth, and Basel III sets out the vital reforms that has suggested, undermine our commitment to the single we need to increase stability in the banking sector. rule book. Of course, a single rule book helps to reduce Earlier this year the Commission published its draft the burdens on cross-border firms, but that cannot regulation on prudential requirements for the financial come at the expense of a member state’s ability to sector. Despite the G20 commitment to implementing implement higher prudential regulations. Instead, a single Basel III in full, the draft regulation deviates from that rule book that establishes harmonised definitions and agreement in crucial areas. In doing so, the proposals minimum requirements would protect the flexibility to significantly dilute the minimum standards agreed allow member states to adjust their prudential requirements internationally for global banks and increase the taxpayer’s as necessary, while at the same time helping to reduce potential exposure to future losses. As the Scrutiny burdens on cross-border firms. Committee highlights, the draft regulation also seeks Indeed, recommendation No. 10 of the Larosière to embed maximum harmonisation of prudential report on financial supervision states that requirements. “a Member State should be able to adopt more stringent national I share the Committee’s concern that the draft regulation regulatory measures considered to be domestically appropriate will severely limit the ability of member states to conduct for safeguarding financial stability as long as the principles of the macro-prudential policy, and where necessary, go beyond internal market and agreed minimum core standards are respected.” minimum standards to ensure financial stability in their own jurisdictions. We believe that it remains the case It is interesting that we have an agreement here. My that member states are best placed to identify risks to hon. Friend the Member for Stone (Mr Cash), Jacques financial stability in their jurisdiction. This is particularly de Larosière, who is the architect of the financial regulation, the case when it comes to taking action concerning their and the Government all agree with that we must have own financial stability. Given the considerable experience, the flexibility to go further if that is appropriate. expertise, information and knowledge available to member I believe that we have a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity states, it is difficult to see how the Commission can be to reform financial services and ensure that we embed considered to be better placed to assess macro-prudential a system that works in the interests of consumers and conditions, systemic risks and appropriate policies for underpins stable and sustainable economies. The each member state than the member states themselves. Government have neither dithered, nor delayed in Furthermore, it is not clear that the Commission implementing fundamental reform of our financial sector would be able to respond faster than the competent and our system of regulation. We are reforming the authorities of member states to risks as they arise. failed tripartite system, leading the debate on the future Therefore, I share the Scrutiny Committee’s concern of the financial sector through the Independent Commission that the inclusion of article 443, which contains a on Banking and leading the international agenda for delegated power for the Commission to adopt delegated full and fundamental reform across the global financial acts to impose stricter prudential requirements on member system. states, is entirely inappropriate. Not only is subsidiarity At a time of instability, the European Commission a matter of economic principle, but it is a matter of past will inevitably come under pressure to delay, obfuscate experience. The financial crisis taught us that it is vital and pander to vested interests across the EU that want that national authorities retain discretion to react decisively to soften standards. It is critical that the Commission and speedily to economic developments. It is vital that stands firm against those pressures and, with respect to member states retain their flexibility to adjust prudential the prudential requirements legislation, implements the requirements to respond to emerging systemic risks and Basel agreement in full. We must ensure that the Basel cyclical variations in economic activity, which, as we requirements are implemented as harmonised definitions have seen in the build-up to the eurozone crisis, can be and minimum requirements, not a maximum, that member very large. states have the flexibility to respond to the unique risks The crisis also taught us that we were not alert to and characteristics of their own markets, and that we those systemic risks, and not just at the firm level. It is implement regulations that are effective, credible and vital that we are not caught out again. National authorities consistent. I commend the motion to the House. 199 Credit Institutions and Investment 8 NOVEMBER 2011 Credit Institutions and Investment 200 Firms Firms 5.28 pm The motion before us is worded correctly. It focuses very much on subsidiarity, and on article 443 and the Chris Leslie (Nottingham East) (Lab/Co-op): The proposals that would give the Commission the right to capital requirements directives have sought to translate vary national regulations, even though it would prevent the proposals of the Basel Committee on Banking member states from changing their own rules beyond Supervision and apply them across the EU. Today’s the maximum harmonisation arrangements—a step, I proposal, CRD IV—another acronym that is familiar believe, too far. I agree with the draft reasoned opinion to many of our constituents—attempts to update those and, therefore, with the motion that the Clerk of the arrangements so that they fit the circumstances of today’s House forward this view to the presidents of the European banking system and learn the lessons of the global institutions. financial crisis. As the Minister said, no one disagrees that the quality and quantity of capital that banks hold Article 443 does indeed go too far, and it would not in order to absorb losses should be increased, and there be appropriate. Paragraph 18 of the European Scrutiny is broad consensus on that. Committee’s report sums that up well, stating there is no evidence to prove that CRD4 will make four changes. It will, first, introduce “the Commission is better placed than the competent authorities sanctions to ensure that all EU banks comply; secondly, of Member States to address national prudential concerns. Indeed, prevent over-reliance on credit rating agencies, which there is a strong argument to say that national authorities are not should not substitute for proper internal due diligence; only better placed, but can react more quickly than the Commission thirdly, improve corporate governance in the banking can by means of delegated legislation, thereby enhancing financial sector; and fourthly, address the pro-cyclicality of lending, stability.” which can accelerate the expansionary tendencies of an economic cycle. The difficulty comes when the Commission Graham Stringer (Blackley and Broughton) (Lab): proposes “maximum harmonisation” in order to achieve Does my hon. Friend agree that the Commission almost a single EU rule book for banking, preventing member certainly knows that it would not be better at that than states from setting higher standards beyond the levels the regulatory authorities, and that what is behind this proposed in the directive. regulation is an attack on the City in order to up the I am aware that many City institutions also favour game of Frankfurt and Paris? It must be resisted at all a harmonised international approach to regulation, but such costs. It is much more malevolent than just a bureaucratic an approach could render many of the recommendations mistake. of the Vickers commission, for example, redundant as we would simply be unable to introduce tougher standards Chris Leslie: It is difficult to ascribe motives to the here in the UK. The EU says that the directive is to Commission in all circumstances. My hon. Friend may prevent a race to the top, but we need to ensure that our well be right, but then again I have also talked to some financial services industry—by far the largest and of the City’s large banking institutions, which have in most systemically important of any EU country—has a some ways argued in favour of harmonisation, so it is a regulatory system that can protect UK taxpayers and mixed picture. I agree with the Government on the UK consumers. After all, when domestic banks fail, point before us, however, and it is important that we domestic taxpayers have to come to the rescue, so we stand firm and retain the flexibility of higher standards need domestic regulation that has the room and flexibility if we possibly can. to go beyond any internationally agreed minimum standards. Kelvin Hopkins (Luton North) (Lab): Is it possible that those banks that seem to favour harmonisation think that they might have an easier time under Europe-wide Mr Cash: The hon. Gentleman acknowledges, I am regulations than under more stringent regulations from sure, that the real reason why we are in the situation we the British Government? are in—I shall make a short statement about it later on behalf of the European Scrutiny Committee—is that Chris Leslie: My hon. Friend may well be correct. we have transferred such jurisdiction to the European “Who knows?” is the ultimate question, but his cynicism Union. As I said in a letter to the Financial Times the has been proved right in the past and may well be right other day, we are fighting back against the background today. not only of the City having moved against the proposals, but of our having opened the sluice gates and allowed it The motion is a sensible assessment, and asking the to happen. Clerk to send a reasoned opinion to the presidents of the European institutions is absolutely right, but what happens next? Will the Minister set out in a little more Chris Leslie: The hon. Gentleman’s work on the detail the consequences of today’s motion, and whether European Scrutiny Committee has been useful in respect we would have any prospect of shaping our own financial of the proposals before us, and it would have been regulatory agenda if, indeed, many of the changes in the helpful if the Minister had clarified where we stand in directive went through regardless of the opinion that we terms of qualified majority voting versus any veto sent? The mismatch between the Commission’s view options that we might have. I would be grateful if the and the UK’s position is only the tip of the iceberg or, to Minister could set them out. use a better metaphor, only the beginning of the story. I am afraid to say that the Government’s proposals Mr Hoban: The regulation and the directive would for financial regulation have not been properly thought come in through QMV. through and clash so much with European regulatory arrangements that they just will not be able to stand up Chris Leslie: Which proves the point that we need to adequately to their strength and power. Ministers knew ensure that we negotiate firmly. very well that the EU supervisory institutions would be 201 Credit Institutions and Investment 8 NOVEMBER 2011 Credit Institutions and Investment 202 Firms Firms split across thematic groups around banking, pensions nothing we can do on the Floor of the House to reverse and insurance, and markets. Yetaccording to the Minister’s that unless we apply the provisions of my sovereignty legislation, we are choosing to split our arrangements arrangements notwithstanding the 1972 Act. It is about between prudential and conduct regulation. time we started to do so. I agree completely that we need a greater focus on prudential regulation, but there is a growing risk and Chris Leslie: I am simply highlighting the anxieties increasing evidence that our UK institutions may leave felt across the City, the financial service sector and by us in a tangled mess unable to engage effectively with many hon. Members, who are worried that we are those very powerful EU structures. That concern is stepping into a new set of financial service regulation shared not only by Opposition Members, but across the structures domestically within the UK that are far away City and other financial service sectors. If our voice is from those bodies we need to be influencing, steering not adequately heard, we may be unable to be represented and having our voices heard by. It may well be that we properly in the right meetings at the right time. are stepping in the wrong direction. That is the anxiety I am voicing today. It is not just the Opposition who are saying that. Last year, the Financial Services Consumer Panel said that Jacob Rees-Mogg (North East Somerset) (Con): I am “the current European structure under the ESMA would be a very grateful to the hon. Gentleman for allowing me to poor fit with the proposed new UK arrangements and that this interrupt his characteristically thoughtful speech. Given could potentially weaken the UK’s voice in the European Union.” what he is saying, does he think that this would be a In September, the British Bankers’ Association said that very good, if not ideal, area in which to repatriate “little has been related on how the regulators will go about powers? ensuring…that UK representation around the European table is second to none. There has not, for example, been acceptance of Chris Leslie: I do not think it is wrong to try to have the suggestion made by the industry that consideration be given some level of co-ordination on financial services regulation to maintaining a single international secretariat across the relevant authorities as a common shared service and the establishment of across the EU. This is a global industry, and that is cross-authority teams to ensure that UK representatives at the broadly sensible. However, we now know very well how three European Supervisory Authorities and other European and those supervisory institutions of the EU are to be international committees are in a position to draw upon all structured, and yet we are designing new arrangements relevant expertise and knowledge.” for the post-Financial Services Authority world that do The Association of Independent Financial Advisers— not match very suitably with those. There may be different incidentally, I am attending its annual dinner this evening— approaches to how we can make the fit more effective said in September: and improve Britain’s voice. However, there is genuine concern that even though we knew about these “The AIFA is concerned that the twin peak approach to UK regulation is not consistent with the developing European sectoral arrangements 18 months ago, the Government have not approach. We must ensure that the UK system is able to efficiently yet provided the capability to adapt the regulatory interact with the European system and does not lead to significant reforms to ensure that we do not lose influence—and, in confusion for regulated firms and cost inefficiencies, or damage fact, build our influence. the competitiveness of the UK.” As regards the capital requirements directive, it is Indeed, two weeks ago, the Chairman of the Treasury clear that for the time being we need to resist the Committee, the hon. Member for Chichester (Mr Tyrie), Commission’s challenge to proper subsidiarity and give said in a letter to the right hon. Member for Hitchin our reasons for retaining national discretion to have and Harpenden (Mr Lilley): safer and higher standards for financial regulation here “How will the PRA and the FCA co-ordinate their interaction in the UK. with the new European Supervisory Authorities which do not We support the motion but hope that Ministers will neatly match the twin-peaks model—particularly where both take the opportunity to think more strategically about financial stability and consumer protection outcomes may be how best to address the structural mismatch between considered together at an EU level? With an enormous amount of EU legislation under way, how will the EU regulatory authorities their proposed reforms and the European arrangements, ensure that UK interests are represented with one voice?” because that risks marginalising the UK’s voice time and again. So there has been a barrage of anxiety about the Government’s proposals and how the design of their 5.41 pm domestic regulatory arrangements will fit with those European supervisory structures. The Minister has time Mr William Cash (Stone) (Con): Before I go into the to think about those matters before introducing the Bill. question of subsidiarity, I want to raise some matters If we try to persuade EU regulators to comply with our that relate to what the shadow Minister said. He made approach to financial regulation retrospectively, it will some extremely important remarks. I am sorry that our genuinely be like shutting the stable door after the horse own Front Benchers did not address those questions, has bolted. because they know that they are very much on my mind and have been for a very long time. Mr Cash: The shadow Minister is perhaps being The Minister said I would be glad to know that he rather disingenuous when he says that the Minister may and Commissioner De Larosière were ad idem as regards have time to think before the Bill comes through. I am the De Larosière report. I have to say that I have been sure the hon. Gentleman understands that, under the anything but ad idem with Mr De Larosière and his arrangements for the European Union, where a qualified report for three or four years. The moment I saw the majority vote is being applied and the measure becomes report, I wrote a letter to The Financial Times in which I part of our law, we implement it under section 2 of the pointed out that it was a very dangerous move and that European Communities Act 1972. There is absolutely its consequences would lead to jurisdiction over the 203 Credit Institutions and Investment 8 NOVEMBER 2011 Credit Institutions and Investment 204 Firms Firms City of London being transferred to the European pay and remuneration. Some of those points are Union. With all due respect to the shadow Minister, his exaggerated, but some are justified. I think that we Government were in power at the time this was under should go back to a system of regulation that is more discussion. He has been issuing strictures about negotiations, along the old Quaker lines, whereby one knew what but I am not interested in negotiations when 20% of our one’s capital was and how to use it properly, and through GDP is at risk in relation to a legislative system that will self-regulation people who were out of line were put completely and totally undermine and annihilate our back into line by common consent. That is for another ability to maintain that strength in the financial services day, but I am deeply worried. sector. I directly blame the previous Government for My hon. Friend the Member for North East Somerset their total failure to do anything about this. (Jacob Rees-Mogg) raised the question of repatriation. I will go further. I also blame those on our side of the Why is it that I have argued consistently for the repatriation equation who allowed this to happen, because it is, at of powers, not just in social and employment legislation, the very least, acquiescence in a system. Before the which again is for another day, but in the kind of general election, my hon. Friend the Member for Ludlow powers we are discussing? If the City of London goes (Mr Dunne)—my own Member of Parliament—convened down or is severely diminished, it will do nobody any a meeting in the Grand Committee Room relating to good. Those who vote for the Labour party would also these matters. Some very distinguished people were be affected because we need that money. For three and a present. There were people from the City of London, half centuries, the City of London has been at the heart the City institutions and the City of London Corporation, of our financial system and our revenue base. We cannot as well as the rapporteur, or lady in charge, of the afford to have that money redistributed, like so much financial services arrangements for the European chaff, among the other member states. Commission. It was a very high-powered conference. Despite the fact that I put up a very strong case for Graham Stringer: The hon. Gentleman is making the ensuring that this nonsense, from our point of view, did powerful case, with which I agree, that this is malevolent not continue, I found—not unusually, I have to say—that legislation that is directed at undermining the City of I was completely and utterly outvoted. At least, I was London. I suspect he will agree with me that the out-manoeuvred by a number of people, not on the Government should use the fundamental crisis at the quality of their arguments but on the sheer force of heart of the European Union to be as brutal and as their attitudes, which amounted to saying, “This is a determined as possible in bringing back as many powers global marketplace, this is what we have to do, we must as they can, because the European Union is not a engage in a situation where the rest of the world works benevolent body when it comes to the UK’s interests. together.” We now hear the same talk about the dreadful proposal for a financial transaction tax. Mr Cash: I very much agree with the hon. Gentleman. The reality is that the City has woken up. The hon. The more I have heard from him over the past few years, Member for Nottingham East (Chris Leslie) mentioned the more I have admired his determination to speak the the British Bankers Association. I have not examined truth. That is the position. This is not a party game; this every document that has come from these great and is serious and it is deadly. This move is determined and august bodies, but I fear that they did not do the right deliberate. That is what people need to know. thing at the right time and that they allowed this situation Roland Vaubel, the famous economist from Mannheim to happen. The Government and the Opposition of the university, talks about the use of the qualified majority time went along with the idea that it would somehow be voting system in the Council of Ministers as a form of beneficial to the United Kingdom for it to be put in this “regulatory collusion”, and mentions the strategy peril—and peril this is. The House is fairly thinly attended of deliberately raising rivals’ costs. Particular groups of this afternoon, but I venture to suggest that these countries—there are no prizes for guessing which—enter documents, which are six inches high on just the one into arrangements behind the scenes, and vote accordingly. issue of European Union prudential requirements, are a Both France and Germany use that system to their dagger pointing at the heart of the City of London. advantage, and as I said in the Financial Times the other day, we are being outmanoeuvred. The Minister rightly said that the proposal severely undermines Basel. He said that we will negotiate firmly. Despite all the time, money and effort being put into However, as I asked the Prime Minister yesterday, how the Vickers report, there are, as the shadow Minister will the Government be able to do anything about it in made clear, serious worries that Vickers may yet be the context of the fiscal union that they propose, which undermined by the very proposals that we are discussing. must include voting solidarity among the members of The problem goes much further, but I do not need to the eurozone, who have long wanted to take the City of enlarge upon all that any more. London away from us, when this issue is governed by a Some people tend to sneer at the idea, which I qualified majority vote? I have taken the trouble to look occasionally put forward, that our sovereignty is the this up and my best recollection is that there are 231 votes most important issue of all. I say that for one reason for the 17 members of the eurozone compared with 130 and one reason alone—it is only by exercising the votes for the rest. We are in a permanent massive sovereignty of this House on behalf of the British minority. That is what is going on. It is a kind of people that we have any chance of being able to return economic warfare. This is not just about Euroscepticism; and repatriate powers if the other member states are not this is an issue that goes to the heart of our capacity to prepared to negotiate. deliver revenues and prosperity in this country. I am prepared to listen to the Prime Minister telling There may well be cases for reform. I have great me that he will fight hard, or whatever answer he gave sympathy for those who think that the City has gone off me yesterday, but I remain totally unconvinced. We are beam recently in many respects, including on salaries, at risk as a result of proposals such as these, so it is 205 Credit Institutions and Investment 8 NOVEMBER 2011 Credit Institutions and Investment 206 Firms Firms absolutely essential that we get things right. When I opinion, we will be able to stop the proposals. I strongly wrote a pamphlet for him—in fact, for the general urge the Government to get as many member states as public—called “It’s the EU, Stupid”, I set all that out, possible together, and I am sure they are doing that, if so I do not need to enlarge on it any further. only to retrieve the situation as best they can. I have got out of the way the general points that I Of course, as we all know, other member states will believe are necessary to put the whole matter in context. know what we are up to, and they will not enter into an I see the Foreign Secretary laughing a little. I do not arrangement to submit a reasoned opinion. We have seen hold that against him, but I have to say that this is no that in the past—we do not get the requisite number of laughing matter; it is a very serious question. We are member states, and the proposal goes through. This is a reduced to having to argue about reasoned opinions test not just of the Government but of the integrity of and subsidiarity. Important though those are, as I have the system. If a reasoned opinion is required because said, there is a dagger pointing at the City of London. the Commission has exceeded its powers in relation to Not just this particular draft regulation but an accumulated subsidiarity, nothing should prevent that from going vast array of weaponry is being aimed at the heart of ahead on an objective basis. I am not trying to pre-empt our economic system. the decision, but I am anxious, on the grounds that I am about to mention, for other member states to understand Mr Andrew Turner (Isle of Wight) (Con): Could my that a reasoned opinion is necessary. It is in their hands hon. Friend help by reminding me how much is owed to to prevent the proposals from going through. the City of London as a proportion of national income? I turn now to the argument about the objectivity of a reasoned opinion. When the Commission makes a proposal Mr Cash: It has been declining, and that is another for legislation, it is now required under the European reason for concern, but the latest figure is something of treaties to produce a “detailed statement” that makes it the order of 15% to 20% of our gross domestic product. possible to appraise the proposal’s compliance with the Take that away, and where would we be? The draft principles of subsidiarity. I do not for a minute demur regulation is a deliberate attempt to do that, and it is from what I said during the Maastricht debates—that only one document of many. subsidiarity was a con trick intended to establish hierarchies, The aim of the Basel Committee on Banking Supervision not true subsidiarity. We shall see. is to That detailed statement is not just a bureaucratic “enhance understanding of key supervisory issues and improve procedure for its own sake, although one might be the quality of banking supervision worldwide.” forgiven for thinking that some in Brussels think it is. It I hope that it succeeds. However, the various directives is the principal means left whereby national Parliaments in question relate to the taking up and pursuit of the and electorates can assess the basis on which the business of credit institutions and to capital adequacy, Commission considers legislation to be necessary at and they are collectively known as the capital requirement supranational rather than national level. The presumption directive or CRD. They introduce a supervisory framework underpinning subsidiarity is that decisions are best taken within the EU, designed, it is stated, to as close to the citizen as possible. Amen to that, providing “ensure the financial soundness of credit institutions (banks and that it happens. building societies) and certain investment firms.” It is not sufficient to underline the importance of I take a slight interest in that, because my family founded those detailed statements. I remind, or inform, the the Abbey National building society back in the House that no piece of European legislation has ever 19th century and the National Provident Institution in successfully been challenged in the Court of Justice of 1835. Those institutions were run on sound grounds the EU on the grounds that it breached subsidiarity. and lasted until very recently, but have unfortunately Not one. That sends a very powerful message. There is now been mopped up as a result of some of the not a little suspicion, therefore, that subsidiarity is just international goings-on in the financial sphere. something to which lip service is paid. It strikes the In 2011, the European Commission proposed a draft democratic gong, but is not followed by any lunch. One regulation—the document referred to in the motion—and of the jobs of national Parliaments—that is us here in a draft directive, known together as CRD IV. They the Chamber—is to try to change that position. would incorporate the Basel III agreement on prudential requirements for credit institutions and investment firms Kelvin Hopkins: I suggested yesterday in European into EU law. How often have I said that the danger is Committee A that, as the hon. Gentleman suggests, that when a matter is transferred to EU jurisdiction, we subsidiarity has not functioned well. In fact, I do not lose control? Because of section 2 of the European really understand it myself. I suggested that it was a Communities Act 1972, we cease to be able to control it. political decoration, to overcome a difficulty. The reality We hand over control of the drafting, method and that I would understand is opt-outs and opt-ins, with interpretation of the law, and its effect on our own member states having the independence to do what they institutions, our own initiative and our own ability to be thought was right for their interests. innovative and succeed. The proposals are still before the European Scrutiny Mr Cash: I very much agree. All that I can say is that Committee, pending the receipt of further information on this occasion, there will be a very good test of from the Government. Meanwhile, the Committee has whether subsidiarity can win the day. Let us see. recommended that the House submit a reasoned opinion Given the importance of the detailed statement, the on the draft regulation to the European Commission, treaty makes several stipulations about what it should the Council of Ministers and the European Parliament. contain, which include an A draft is annexed to the Committee’s report. I mention “assessment of the proposal’s financial impact…in the case of a that because if enough member states issue a reasoned Directive, some assessment of the proposal’s implications for 207 Credit Institutions and Investment 8 NOVEMBER 2011 Credit Institutions and Investment 208 Firms Firms national and, where necessary, regional legislation; and…qualitative of functions to the European Union. If there is sufficient and, wherever possible, quantitative substantiation of the reasons opposition from enough member states, we can defeat for concluding that an EU objective can be better achieved at EU this proposal. level.” When the European Scrutiny Committee looked at 6.3 pm the draft regulation, it found—not by any means for the first time—that neither the Commission’s explanatory Harriett Baldwin (West Worcestershire) (Con): I shall memorandum nor its impact assessment contained a be brief in following my hon. Friend the Member for detailed statement to make possible an assessment of its Stone (Mr Cash) and in supporting the reasoned opinion. compliance with subsidiarity. Hon. Members should I also hope to strengthen and add to some of the bear it in mind that the draft regulation, which is of arguments made by the Minister and the Opposition immense importance, amends the capital requirements spokesman from the Dispatch Box in favour of subsidiarity directive by removing the discretion previously given to in banking regulation. member states to impose stricter prudential requirements If there is one over-arching lesson that we learned where national circumstances require that. That is a from the financial crisis of the past few years, it is the significant change. Indeed, the Government argue that importance of having the primary banking regulator it could lead to greater financial instability and, as the close to the financial market. I welcome the direction of Minister said, could severely undermine Basel. It will be travel on financial regulation in our national life, which seen from the draft reasoned opinion that the Committee will place much more importance on the role of the concluded that the Commission failed to discharge the Bank of England, because the Bank follows what is treaty obligation placed upon it to provide quantitative happening in this country’s financial markets on a and qualitative reasons for that change in the form of a day-to-day basis. detailed statement. It is instructive that the United States—a country Putting the procedural failures to one side, the House that has had monetary union for the past century—is will gather from the draft reasoned opinion that, on the also caught up in the financial crisis. That subsidiarity substance, the Committee agrees with the Government in banking regulation continues to apply in the US in that the objectives of the regulation were not better that each state is responsible for banking licences and achieved by precluding member states from imposing supervision in its jurisdiction. stricter prudential requirements when they considered that necessary. The Committee came to that conclusion Mr Cash: I am fascinated by my hon. Friend’s line of because it was clear from the Government’s explanatory argument, because she has raised the question of memorandum that there continued to be a need for commercial states’ rights, which are embedded in the a flexible approach to address prudential concerns at a American constitution—they are inviolable. Countries national level. That reality was reflected in the fact that in the EU have no such rights. When legislation at EU the Commission proposes in article 443 of the draft level goes through—this is why I so strongly attack and regulation that it should be able to adopt delegated Acts resist the idea of transfer of jurisdiction to that level—we to impose stricter prudential requirements for member are required under the 1972 Act to implement the law. states where necessary. The Committee could not find We do not have commercial states’ rights. sufficient evidence to demonstrate that the Commission was better placed than member states to address national Harriett Baldwin: Indeed, and to continue with my prudential risks that suddenly arise. Indeed, there was a example, the US Federal Reserve is very much a system strong argument for saying that national authorities made up of individual reserve banks—the Federal Reserve were not only better placed, but could react more Bank of New York and the Federal Reserve Bank of quickly than the Commission by means of delegated San Francisco all play important and distinct roles, legislation, thereby enhancing financial stability. recognising that different banking markets have different characteristics, and recognising how vital subsidiarity is I also have grave misgivings about the Commission in banking regulation. having such powers delegated to it—ever. EU delegated legislation is not unlike our own: it affords considerable My heart sank when I asked at the Vote Office for Executive power with far less oversight. papers relevant to today’s motion and was handed this 1,200-page document. We discussed earlier how the EU Finally, the Commission’s approach to the consideration could save money on its budget, but the document is a of subsidiarity is a matter of concern not only to the prime example of where money could be saved. It is European Scrutiny Committee, but to every national completely unnecessary. Parliament of every member state. I hope that they take I opened the document at random and found that note and do something about it, because a great deal is one proposal is to start dictating quotas for women on at risk. At its last meeting, COSAC—the bi-annual the boards of financial institutions in the EU. Page conference of the EU Committees of national Parliaments, 1,132, which I am sure my hon. Friend the Member for which I attended—concluded that the Commission was Stone will want to read in detail, is on quota laws for the not complying with the treaty obligations placed upon number of women who sit on the boards of financial it to provide sufficiently detailed statements. That was on institutions in different countries. I noted that in the the motion that I proposed, which was accepted by COSAC. table of a survey of governance arrangements, Iceland This was good news, because the Committee had been and Norway are included, but the last time I checked, pushing for it. We await a response from the Commission, they were not even member states. I put myself firmly in but we need support from other member states. the camp of people who think that the more diverse I repeat: I urge the Government to use all their range of views one has on boards, the better, but I diplomatic and persuasive powers, because we are put certainly do not think that that should be laid down in at a significant disadvantage as a result of the transfer 1,200 pages of EU guidance. 209 Credit Institutions and Investment 8 NOVEMBER 2011 Credit Institutions and Investment 210 Firms Firms Mr Cash: To give another example, article 218 refers— to have a single regulation, but where those outside the incomprehensibly—to the so-called financial collateral eurozone ought to have regulations referring to their comprehensive method. To illustrate how far away we own currencies and central banks. have moved from the notion of running a capitalist and That works both ways. There has been much financial system sensibly, we are now down to formulas. concentration on the need to raise bank capital rates I shall try to quote it. The document states: when an economy is booming, as part of efforts to calm “Institutions shall calculate the volatility-adjusted value of down an economic expansion, and that is obviously the collateral (CVA ) they need to take into account as follows true: had bank capitalisation rates been raised during …C =C(1-H -H )…where…C = the value of the collateral”. VA C fx the last boom, the effects would have been lessened, the That is absolute gobbledegook, but that is the manner degree of gearing, particularly in the Royal Bank of in which our system is run. It is completely mad. Scotland, would have been lower and the problems that followed would have been less. However, it is equally Harriett Baldwin: I can see that if I carry on giving important, when an economy is turning down, that examples, I will only encourage my hon. Friend to find bank capital requirements might need to be lowered, more passages of gobbledegook to read into the record, and that might well be the case now. but it is indeed the most appalling document. When banks face large amounts of bad loans and write-offs, we might need our central bank to say, “Well, Mr Nigel Dodds (Belfast North) (DUP): The hon. at this point, we cannot enforce a high bank capital Lady makes powerful points on subsidiarity. We have adequacy ratio because, if we do, our banks will not be had some fun at the expense of the document, which is able to continue in business, or they will not be able to long, convoluted gobbledegook, as the hon. Member make loans to good-quality borrowers now coming for Stone (Mr Cash) said. However, the reality—this forward.” The key argument of subsidiarity, therefore, makes my heart sink too—is that unless we get enough is that bank capital adequacy regulations have to relate countries in Europe to agree with us, the document will to the currency at issue, and that comes back to the become directly applicable law in the UK. That is how central bank at issue—in our case, of course, the Bank serious the matter is. When one considers the amount of of England. Those ratios must be flexible beyond scrutiny that we rightly give to legislation in the House, international agreement, because if the lender of last one realises that the amount of scrutiny given to the resort is willing to lend to a bank with low capitalisation document is appallingly low. in a time of crisis, that is a decision for that central bank and its risk-taking decision makers; it does not need to Harriett Baldwin: What adds to the power of the hon. be decided at an international level. Gentleman’s argument is the fact that this week, of all My final point is the one made by my hon. Friend the weeks, we have seen how completely inadequately the Member for Stone (Mr Cash): there is a danger, under euro countries have managed the governance of their the qualified majority voting system, of regulations budgetary arrangements and affairs over a matter that entirely suitable for the eurozone being passed through is causing serious problems for the world economy. for the whole of the EU. Her Majesty’s Government I wish to conclude by making one further point. I was need to be alert to that and to make every effort to completely gobsmacked by the chutzpah—if that is a prevent such regulations from being forced upon us. I parliamentary word, Mr Deputy Speaker—of the hope, therefore, that this motion, when passed, will be Opposition spokesman, the hon. Member for Nottingham taken seriously by the EU, and that we will be allowed East (Chris Leslie). Although I welcome the fact that he to regulate our banks in our way, as appropriate. agrees with the motion, I noted that he did not refer to the previous Labour Government’s role in signing us up to the Lisbon treaty without a referendum. It displayed 6.14 pm a stark lack of acknowledgement of his party’s role in Mr Hoban: This has been a helpful and thoughtful getting us to this position. debate, and it will give the Government immense support I have spoken briefly, Mr Deputy Speaker, because in making the arguments over the coming months about there is important business to follow, but I want to the need to get CRD IV right; about recognising that it reiterate how important it is that the Financial Secretary should be the responsibility of competent authorities in be armed with the maximum political support for his member states to set appropriate levels of bank capital trip to argue our case against this ridiculous 1,200-page beyond high minimum standards; and about the fact document. that we need the flexibility to do so in order to protect the stability of our financial system. That recognises the 6.11 pm fact that banking structures and systems vary between member states. The complexity of those banking systems Jacob Rees-Mogg (North East Somerset) (Con): It is manifests itself in the extraordinary length of the document a pleasure to follow my hon. Friend the Member for before us. These are complex issues that we need to West Worcestershire (Harriett Baldwin). I agreed with tackle. practically every word she said. I want to make a point about engagement with Europe, I want to focus on subsidiarity in relation to the bank picking up on the comments made by the hon. Member capital requirements. It seems to me that those capital for Nottingham East (Chris Leslie) about trade bodies. requirements must rest with the lender of last resort, The same comments were made to the Treasury Select because the organisation that will be best informed Committee today. There is nothing new about regulators about the requirements of banks within its system will co-ordinating the views of others when representing the be the bank to which they report. This regulation might UK on regulatory bodies. At the moment, the Financial therefore be an area where it is suitable for the eurozone Services Authority is our representative on the European 211 Credit Institutions and Investment 8 NOVEMBER 2011 Credit Institutions and Investment 212 Firms Firms Securities and Markets Authority, and in its representative those European arrangements, but surely he accepts role, the FSA must also reflect the views of other that a complex existing arrangement could be made regulatory bodies not represented on ESMA. For example, even more complex by the proliferation of financial it must take into account and reflect the views of the regulatory bodies that he is proposing. Financial Reporting Council and, on takeovers and mergers, the Takeover Panel. Mr Hoban: The hon. Gentleman has just recommended Furthermore, the European Insurance and Occupational such a proliferation of bodies—with this co-ordinating Pensions Authority has to represent the views of the secretariat. The PRA and the FCA are more than Pensions Regulator. If I am right, at one point, the UK’s capable of talking to each other about these matters. representative on EIOPA’s predecessor body, the Committee We need to ensure that they gather people’s views and of European Insurance and Occupational Pensions that the interests of the FRC and the Pensions Regulator Supervisors, was not the FSA, but the Pensions Regulator are reflected. However, I do not consider it to be the itself. There is nothing new, therefore, about one body huge problem that he is inflating it to be. representing the views of other regulators in the UK on It is also the case, of course, that the negotiation of these European bodies, and it would be wrong to suggest level 1 instruments, such as the directive before us that this is something novel or different. today, is the responsibility not of the PRA, the FCA or We need to ensure that, under the new regulatory the Bank of England, but of Her Majesty’s Government architecture, we are clear about who speaks for the UK and, in particular, the Treasury. It is very clear where the on these matters. On the European Banking Authority focus is; we do not seem to have any problem at all in and EIOPA, the Prudential Regulation Authority speaks co-ordinating the views of others for that process. for the UK, so it will want to gather the views of the This has been a helpful debate. It will help strengthen Pensions Regulator and the Financial Conduct Authority the Government’s hand in negotiation with Brussels. It on insurance issues, for example. It is clear that the is very clear that it is not just the UK Government who FCA will represent the UK on the board of ESMA, believe that we should have the freedom to go further and it will have to gather the views not only of the FRC beyond minimum standards if necessary, and the freedom and the Takeover Panel, as it does now, but of the Bank to set our own macro-prudential strategy. That is the of England, on clearing houses, and the PRA on prudential view of the International Monetary Fund, the view of issues relating to securities firms. Jean-Claude Trichet and the view of Jacques de Larosière. I do not therefore see this as some great novelty or There is a consensus around this. What is important, I innovation. It needs to work. However, surely no one in think, is that the Commission listens to that consensus the House is suggesting that UK regulatory bodies and takes the right action to enable member states to should be driven by what is happening in Europe, rather tackle financial stability. I am grateful for the support than meeting the needs of businesses and consumers in for this motion and commend it to the House. the UK. I do not think that anyone is seriously suggesting Question put and agreed to. that we have sectoral regulation in the UK, rather than Resolved, functional regulation. If the Opposition want to go That this House considers that the draft Regulation on prudential down the former route, let them say so, but we should requirements for credit institutions and investment firms (European find a way of ensuring that the current system works. Union Document No. 13284/11 and Addenda 1-4) does not comply with the principle of subsidiarity for the reasons set out in the Chris Leslie: What is the Financial Secretary’s assessment Annex to Chapter 1 of the Forty-second Report of the European of the British Bankers Association’s suggestion for a Scrutiny Committee (HC 428-xxxvii); and in accordance with Article 6 of the Protocol on the application of the principles of properly resourced international secretariat to ensure a subsidiarity and proportionality, instructs the Clerk of the House better single interface with those European institutions? to forward this reasoned opinion to the presidents of the European He might be right that we should not necessarily follow institutions. 213 8 NOVEMBER 2011 Transport Committee Report 214 (High Speed Rail) What are our conclusions? We conclude that there is Backbench Business a good case for proceeding with a high-speed rail network linking London and the major cities of the midlands, Transport Committee Report the north and Scotland, principally because it will provide a substantial and necessary step change in capacity and (High Speed Rail) a dramatic shift in connectivity not offered by any of Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans): We now move the alternatives proposed. This investment will assist on to the first of two items of Back-Bench business. I passengers and freight. We reject a policy of ever-rising shall shortly call Louise Ellman to move the first motion— train fares in an attempt to suppress peak-time passenger and, indeed, she will move the second. As I said to the demand. Current overcrowding is a consequence of a House just over a year ago when we debated the first current failure to provide necessary capacity at a time item under this relatively new procedure, the Chair of a when people want to travel and often need to travel. Committee speaks for about 20 minutes, during which The number of long-distance rail journeys more than time interventions may be taken, but after he or she doubled in the 15 years to 2009. Some of the highest concludes there will be no separate speeches and we will growth has been on the west coast main line, where the move on to the next business. number of journeys has increased by about 10% per annum for the past three years. The west coast main line 6.21 pm passenger demand levels forecast by HS2 for 2021 have Mrs Louise Ellman (Liverpool, Riverside) (Lab/Co-op): already been overtaken and are projected to increase. I beg to move, That this House notes the publication of the Tenth Report Mr Andrew Turner (Isle of Wight) (Con): Will the from the Transport Committee on High Speed Rail, HC 1185. hon. Lady help me by explaining how much money I am grateful for the opportunity to present on the Floor from the Government and how much from the customers of the House the Transport Select Committee’s report into or the users of the railway is involved? May I add that, high-speed rail. Our inquiry attracted widespread interest as a representative of the Isle of Wight, there is no and considered strongly contested and diverse views on benefit whatever for me or my constituents if a lot of the Government’s proposal to build a dedicated, high-speed, money is spent on a railway in the north of England? Y-shape network, with trains running at up to 250 mph. Phase 1 is proposed to run from London to Birmingham, Mrs Ellman: I thank the hon. Gentleman for his opening in 2026. Phase 2 would add two legs to the line, comments. Currently, the proportion paid by the traveller with one going to Manchester and the other to Leeds, or fare payer is increasing and is now about half of the operating from 2032-33. The total projected costs are cost. That is very different from what applied in previous £32 billion, with £16.8 billion for phase 1. The former years. Secretary of State for Transport, the right hon. Member for Runnymede and Weybridge (Mr Hammond), told We were told clearly that the west coast main line will the Committee that, spread over 17 years, this was be full by the end of this decade, which means that affordable and amounted to an average of £2 billion a additional required routes and services for passengers year—very similar to the current costs of building and freight could not be made available. Our specialist Crossrail. Should this proceed, Parliament would consider advisers were clear that HS2 is needed for capacity a hybrid Bill from October 2013 to May 2015. reasons if the pattern of growth continues or if peak demand cannot be spread. Our inquiry included consideration of more than 200 pieces of written evidence. We held five oral evidence The step change that HS2 would bring does not apply sessions, with more than 40 witnesses. We travelled on only to people who would use the new line. It would high-speed rail in Frankfurt, Paris and Lille, and spoke enable expansion on the existing classic line for more to business and civic representatives there, so that we local and regional services and for freight. Places such could make some assessment of the impact of high-speed as Milton Keynes would benefit; freight on rail would rail on continental Europe. We commissioned a report expand—and demand for freight on rail is anticipated on High Speed 2 from Oxera Consulting and asked for to double. When an assessment of the impact of High its analysis of the case put for High Speed 2. We Speed 2 is made, it is important to look at what services appointed specialist advisers, Bob Linnard and Richard could be made available on the existing classic line, as Goldson, to work with our excellent Committee staff. well as what would run on the new line. We took those steps because we recognised the importance of this inquiry and we wanted to listen to the greatest Ms Gisela Stuart (Birmingham, Edgbaston) (Lab): possible number of people with different views and As a Birmingham MP, it always strikes me that we focus different experience, and we wanted the highest level of on the benefits from London to Birmingham, but what advice and support in assisting us to analyse the validity about trade between Birmingham and cities in the of the project before us. north-east and north-west—another benefit that should It is regrettable that people expressing sincere and not be ignored? legitimate concerns about what they fear would be the local impact of high-speed rail on their environment Mrs Ellman: I thank my hon. Friend for her comments. have been castigated as nymbys. People are entitled to It is evident that the debate on High Speed 2 is often express their views, and while a decision on a major cast solely in terms of access to London, but this is also investment of this nature should be taken in the national about access between major cities. For example, if and interest, people are fully entitled to express their concerns when the line is completed as planned, Manchester and about what they believe what might be the impact on Leeds would be brought within 80 minutes of London, them, their community and their local environment. travelling from Manchester to Birmingham would take Abuse does not help debate. 49 minutes, while Birmingham to Leeds would take one 215 Transport Committee Report 8 NOVEMBER 2011 Transport Committee Report 216 (High Speed Rail) (High Speed Rail) hour and five minutes. It is as much about the connectivity improvements, and people travelling on local lines must between the cities of the United Kingdom as it is be able to benefit from the maximum possible access to between cities and their access solely to London. Indeed, the high-speed line. a high-speed line offers a dramatic shift in connectivity between the UK’s major cities as well as improved Andrew Stephenson (Pendle) (Con): I congratulate access from the regions to Heathrow and, through the hon. Lady and the Committee on the report. She linking with High Speed 1, to continental Europe. raised an important point about connectivity in the A high-speed network could be a catalyst for economic north. If people are to travel from London to the north growth, supporting jobs and investment. It could help and vice versa, once they have reached the north they to rebalance the economy and address the north-south will need to be able to travel effectively and efficiently, divide. which they cannot do at present. I therefore believe that the northern hub is crucial to the success of High Mr Andrew Turner: At present half the money comes Speed 2. from the Government, and a new railway costing about £18 billion is proposed. It is not clear whether people Mrs Ellman: I agree with the hon. Gentleman. I hope who can currently afford to travel would still enjoy the that he will put his weight behind the views of the Select same benefits. Would the money that is being spent Committee, which is already working hard to ensure continue to be spent, or would the amount be reduced? that the northern hub is delivered. The Committee considered that further information Mrs Ellman: Those are matters for Government policy. was required to inform decisions on access to Heathrow When we raised that specific issue with Ministers in the and terminals in London. We felt that there was not Select Committee, we were told that the current assessments enough information in the public sphere, particularly in were based on existing Government policy. That could, relation to Heathrow. We also felt, strongly, that of course, change; it would be a matter for the Government environmental concerns should be properly assessed in of the day. a revised business case. High-speed rail is likely to have Many local authorities and business representatives, substantial impacts on some local communities and especially in the west midlands and the north, were areas along the route, and we need to be satisfied that extremely enthusiastic about the potential economic full consideration has been given to an assessment of benefits of High Speed 2, and many referred to specially what those impacts might be. commissioned studies that showed what could be achieved. We do, however, have a number of concerns, which Dan Byles (North Warwickshire) (Con): I join those must be addressed during progress on High Speed 2 to who have welcomed the report, which contains a very ensure that the potential of a new high-speed rail network thorough analysis. The Committee has entered a number is realised and informs decision making. The Government of caveats alongside its support for High Speed 2. In the must commit themselves to phase 2 before phase 1 is summary, the Committee calls on the Government agreed. “to consider and clarify these matters before it reaches its decision”. Eric Ollerenshaw (Lancaster and Fleetwood) (Con): I Does the Committee believe that the Government should congratulate the Select Committee on its exhaustive not make a decision until all the points raised in the report. Would it not be useful if the Government found report have been clarified? some technical way of including in the Bill provision for services to Manchester and Leeds, so that the north Mrs Ellman: If the Government decide to proceed, could give its full support to the railway? they should issue a statement of their intention to do so. We have already been told that more information will be Mrs Ellman: I agree with the hon. Gentleman. Indeed, made available before a statement is issued. Following if he reads our report, he will see that we suggested a that, intensive work should be done to deal with some specific form of words enabling the Government to do of the issues that we have raised before the House just that. I hope that the Government read the report considers a hybrid Bill in 2013. It is proposed that very carefully, particularly the section to which I have proceedings on the Bill should take place over 18 months, referred. so if the Government decide to go ahead there will be plenty of time for consideration to be given and for The case for a high-speed line between London and more information to be produced before any final decision the west midlands depends largely on the assumption is made. that the Y-shape network will be completed. To provide a high-speed line that went solely from London to Birmingham would be to abandon the north, which I Ms Gisela Stuart: If the Government think it right to do not think many Members would want. Indeed, in the go ahead—and I agree with them—what will change longer term the line could extend to Scotland, Wales between now and 2013? Surely the hybrid Bill can serve and other parts of the United Kingdom. as a framework Bill, and it will not be necessary to wait until next year. It is important that local and regional economic strategies are drawn up and supported—that includes support from Government as well as the private sector—to Mrs Ellman: While we are committed to the necessity maximise high-speed rail’s potential to rebalance the for high-speed rail, we think it important for the detailed economy, but it is equally important that investment is issues that we have raised to be considered fully. maintained in the existing classic line, including initiatives such as the northern hub. Continued investment in the Christopher Pincher (Tamworth) (Con): Will the hon. classic line is important for the purpose of local Lady give way? 217 Transport Committee Report 8 NOVEMBER 2011 218 (High Speed Rail) Mrs Ellman: I am running out of time, but I will give Cost of Motor Insurance way once more. Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Nigel Evans): The procedure Christopher Pincher: The hon. Lady says that the for this motion will be as follows. Louise Ellman will Committee’s report raises important points, and she speak for around 10 minutes. We will then move to full says that the environmental impact has not been properly debate, which can last until 10 o’clock. Ministers will assessed. Does she believe that that impact will have a indicate when they wish to speak, which need not be at significant effect on the net cost-benefit ratio in the the beginning, and Louise Ellman will be afforded five business case? minutes in which to wind-up at the end.

Mrs Ellman: That is an important point. I cannot 6.40 pm anticipate what the impact would be, but we think that Mrs Louise Ellman (Liverpool, Riverside) (Lab/Co-op): other factors, including the importance of reducing I beg to move, current overcrowding, should be assessed as well. Ultimately, That this House expresses concern over the large increase in any cost-benefit ratio would have to take account of the the cost of motor insurance in recent years, including in relation findings in regard to those factors, and possibly others to young drivers; welcomes the report by the Transport Committee as well. on the cost of motor insurance (HC 591) and its continuing inquiry into the reasons for this increase; notes that factors The significance of the 250 mph maximum speed explaining the cost of motor insurance include the number and should be explained in relation to the choice of route, cost of personal injury claims arising from road accidents, assessment and the value of time-saving per individual should be of risk, fraud, and uninsured driving; notes that the Government reconsidered. The importance of reducing overcrowding has taken some steps to deal with these issues, including a ban on should also be assessed. Much more progress must be referral fees in personal injury cases, but that more could be done; further notes that Ministerial responsibility for these issues is split made on decarbonising fuel before High Speed 2 can be across several departments; and calls on the Government to seen as an essentially green project. Any reduction in establish a cross-departmental Ministerial committee on reducing carbon emissions that is attributable to high-speed rail the cost of motor insurance and to publish a plan for dealing with should be determined by the extent to which the UK’s the different aspects of this problem during this Parliament. energy is decarbonised, although it is certainly true that Members of the Transport Committee are signatories travelling by high-speed rail is greener than travelling by to the motion, and I thank the Backbench Business car or plane. The information that we currently have Committee for allowing me to move it. does not make clear the extent to which high-speed rail Many Members will have received letters complaining would replace air travel, particularly in phase 1. We about the rising cost of car insurance. People with clean repeat our call to the Government to publish a transport records who have driven for years without incident have strategy so that the role of rail and aviation, including suddenly found themselves facing big increases in their high-speed rail, can be assessed in a national context. premiums, and young drivers are now being asked to Those are our major concerns. We believe that they pay about £3,000 for insurance, effectively forcing them must be addressed if the High Speed 2 legislation is to off the road. complete its passage through Parliament in what, as I The Committee started looking into this issue in have explained, would be a lengthy and detailed process. November of last year, and we published a report in A decision to invest in a new dedicated high-speed rail March. It generated massive interest. People are extremely network would be the single most important transport concerned about their premiums, but serious questions infrastructure investment for generations. Our report about how the insurance industry works were also supports high-speed rail, and identifies important matters raised, and, unusually, we decided to reopen our inquiry. that must be addressed before final decisions are made It is, perhaps, fair to say that motor insurance was on High Speed 2. I call on the Government to respond not the Minister’s highest priority before our inquiry began, constructively. but I hope it has become a higher priority now. Many Question put and agreed to. Members have campaigned on the cost of motor insurance, and I single out for tribute my right hon. Friend the Member for Blackburn (Mr Straw), who has campaigned strenuously for the abolition of referral fees. The AA’s regular survey of the cost of motor insurance shows that quoted premiums have more than doubled since 2006, reaching an average of £921 last month. The premiums faced by young people, and especially young males, are significantly higher—in many cases, about £3,000. Jonathan Evans (Cardiff North) (Con): Did the Committee also look at the impact of the recent Test-Achats judgment on gender discrimination? At present, there is a significant disparity between insurance rates for young women and young men, but that case argues that the rates should, in fact, be the same. Mrs Ellman: I thank the hon. Gentleman for his question. The Committee did not look specifically at that point, but I fear that if there is to be equity, it will be equity upwards, rather than lead to a lowering of premiums. 219 Cost of Motor Insurance8 NOVEMBER 2011 Cost of Motor Insurance 220

High premiums have a major impact on the lives of Mrs Ellman: Yes, and the Committee has called for our constituents. Motor insurance is rightly compulsory, greater transparency, but the Government did not comment but for many people driving a car is a necessity, perhaps clearly on that point in their response to our report. As for getting to work, to college or to hospitals for we did not get a clear answer then, I shall repeat the appointments, as well as for visiting friends and family, question now: what are the Government’s views on doing the shopping or taking children to school. greater transparency? I and other Members have received a great deal of Some criminal gangs commit fraud by staging accidents, correspondence from people wanting to give examples but fraud can also include giving false information. We of the problems they have experienced. I received a commissioned a survey with Young Marmalade, an letter saying the following: insurance company specialising in young people, and a third of young drivers said they had considered giving “My partner has just tried to insure me again on our vehicle which is not a sporty flash car, to be told that it would cost him an inaccurate information to insurers in order to try to get extra £1,370.” a lower premium. There are plans to give insurers access to Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency data, but when A lady from Birmingham wrote: will that be implemented? Whiplash claims are another “My car was involved in an accident where a lorry collided source of increased costs and premiums. We need to with my car. The driver accepted it was his responsibility…My find a way of identifying when such injuries are genuine. renewal was due and my premium had increased from £700 to One of the reasons for the high premiums faced by over £2,000.” young people, and in particular young males, is the high These stories illustrate why the Government must act. accident rates among them. The accident rates for young Surprisingly, the recent increase in premiums has males are 10 times higher than those for older people. coincided with significant improvements in road safety, Some years ago, the Committee looked into this issue which is part of a welcome trend of falling numbers of and made a number of recommendations, including deaths and serious injuries on the roads. Why have changing attitudes and enforcing a graduated licence premiums risen so much, therefore? scheme, but we are still waiting for the Government to respond. We support the “black box” idea developed by There is better access to justice, with no win, no fee some insurers to monitor and assess the driving standards arrangements. Those arrangements are being changed, of young people so that that information can, perhaps, but we must not return to a situation in which justice is be used to calculate their premiums. available only to the rich. I am glad that the Office of Fair Trading is looking into There is also cold calling, where claims management the industry, and that the Government have started to companies canvass for claims, often using personal act by starting the legal process to ban referral fees, information obtained from unknown sources. Where is but do we truly have any confidence that premiums the regulation of data protection that is supposed to be will come down? I do not believe we have seen any in place? Claims management firms deserve special evidence of that. scrutiny. They encourage people to claim, and to make A great deal more needs to be done and that involves multiple claims when they might not otherwise have a number of Departments: the Department for Transport; done so. Premiums in the north-west are 50% higher the Home Office; the Ministry of Justice; the Department than the national average, apparently because of the for Education, which springs to mind immediately when activities of these companies. one thinks about road safety and attitudes; and perhaps Referral fees have been in the news. They are paid to a some others. Diverse Departments are involved and number of players in the industry as a reward for passing responsible for this area, so a cross-departmental working on business, thereby encouraging claims and sometimes party is required, and that is why I have brought this inflating bills. They are not paid to insurers alone; a motion to the House. I hope that the Government will number of bodies are involved, including insurance be able to agree to setting up such a working party, so companies, solicitors, car hire firms, claims management that insurance premiums can become affordable and companies, medical experts and vehicle repairers. Although the growing outrage of people forced to pay extortionate the Government have started to act on referral fees, rates can be addressed. what they are doing does not encompass all those sectors of the industry, and neither does it take into 6.50 pm account how companies might try to get around the abolition of referral fees. There are now alternative Karl McCartney (Lincoln) (Con): It is a pleasure to business structures, where non-lawyers can buy legal follow the hon. Member for Liverpool, Riverside practices. How will the Government ensure that companies (Mrs Ellman), who made many points with which I do not get around the ban on referral fees through agree. I congratulate her and hon. Members across the taking such steps? House on securing this debate and putting forward this motion. May I declare an interest as both a justice of Fraud is a major concern, including the staging of the peace and one of 32 million drivers who pays accidents by criminal gangs. That adds £80 to the insurance for the family car? Like many, I am dismayed average premium. that the previous Labour Government did nothing to dissuade the estimated 1.5 million uninsured drivers still Julian Sturdy (York Outer) (Con): The hon. Lady is on our roads or to halt the rise in fraudulent claims and making some powerful arguments on issues that the insurance scamming which plague drivers and our courts. Transport Committee has addressed. Does she agree Like many colleagues, I am aware that it can often be that we need greater transparency in the industry if we the issues that never make the front pages, or those that are to drive down the costs of motor insurance? receive little, if any, attention, that can irritate people 221 Cost of Motor Insurance8 NOVEMBER 2011 Cost of Motor Insurance 222 the most and can undermine and shake their belief in ago that was not so. Typically, the courts, those working the rule of law and a responsible society. Normally, this in them and the legal system suspect that the true occurs when people have done the right thing yet their number of fraudulent claims is at least 10 times that fellow citizens who have purposely done the wrong which reaches our courts. thing somehow get away with it and the law-abiding are To gauge whether my views were in tune with others—I left to pay the penalty. The menace of uninsured drivers feel that there is an appalling lack of appropriate is one such issue. If that and the so-called insurance punishments for uninsured drivers and accident scammers were effectively tackled, the costs of motor scammers—I conducted an online survey, as I said. It insurance would be significantly reduced for the law-abiding was predominantly of local people in Lincoln and drivers of our country. asked their views about uninsured drivers, given that the In September, I conducted an online survey regarding average fine for driving uninsured in the county of uninsured drivers, the fines and punishments currently Lincolnshire was £213 in 2010, a reduction from £233 in handed down, and what respondents felt should be the 2008.I was not surprised to find that the vast majority punishment, given the rising costs of premiums that felt the fine level was too low. It is especially galling for most law-abiding drivers have had to pay in recent insured drivers to note that while their average insurance years. There is a widely held view that there is a need for premiums have risen by up to 40% in recent years, the far harsher penalties for uninsured drivers and other fines for uninsured drivers have decreased in the same people who, aided and abetted by the claims industry, period. We can see why this situation has occurred. The lie about the extent of injuries caused to them and, in average comprehensive premium for the Lincoln postcode some cases, wilfully manufacture the circumstances in was just over £603 at the end of September 2011, which which accidents occur. There are also about 1,200 claims shows that someone has to be caught 2.8 times or more per day for whiplash, each case averaging a payout of in a year for it to be more expensive than to drive with £3,500, and hire car charges for replacement cars are insurance. also eye-wateringly high. That is not sustainable, nor do However, as we have heard, insurance is about risk I believe it is a true representation of accidents on our and age, and those key factors also matter. For example, roads. the estimated cost for comprehensive insurance for a My interest results not only from what my constituents male in Lincoln aged between 17 and 20 is £2,733. It is or friends and family tell me, but from what I have seen £1,338 for a 21 to 25-year-old and £765 for a 25 to with my own eyes and experienced personally. As a 30-year-old. That means that anyone from those age magistrate, I have found that our hands have for some groups caught driving uninsured has respectively to be time been tied by rules and by the ring-fencing of the fined 12.8, 6.5 and 3.6 times per year before the fine level of fines and type of sentences we can impose on exceeds the insurance cost. the same old faces that come before us, often three or four times in a few years. These people include those Jonathan Evans: But this is not only about the financial who drive without insurance, and often without tax and penalty that may be imposed on uninsured drivers. If MOTs for their vehicles too. It is also a proven fact that the uninsured driver is involved in an accident, the many of those convicted of vehicle crime are involved significant costs of personal injury have to be borne by in other law-breaking activities. all the people who are doing the right thing, and that Moreover, my family and I have been the victim of then adds to the insurance costs to which my hon. three car insurance scams, and the police forces in both Friend has referred. Kent and St Albans have shown no interest in following them up, despite judges and courts finding in favour of Karl McCartney: My hon. Friend is correct, and that us and our insurance company. But they should, because is something else that I will discuss later in my speech. how many fully insured drivers have the time and bullishness For many, the risk of driving without insurance is to see through such action, and challenge the system attractive. The “getting away with it” factor is too and the fraudsters? The system relies on this lack of enticing. As hon. Members on both sides, and you, willingness. Mr Deputy Speaker, may know, I like being positive, and there have been many changes recently that I warmly Kwasi Kwarteng (Spelthorne) (Con): How extensive welcome: the reported fall, by a claimed 25% in the past does my hon. Friend think the problem of fraud is in five years, in the number of people driving while uninsured; relation to rising premiums? the recent clampdown on people owning uninsured cars; the seizure of uninsured vehicles; and the coming Karl McCartney: It is very extensive, and I shall prevention of insurance companies and other agencies discuss it later in my speech. It is something we have to selling on personal data, which has fuelled insurance deal with. scamming. That move followed the welcome recent The system relies on a lack of willingness to contest Motor Insurance Regulation Bill sponsored by the right such fraudulent claims. After the judge’s decision in our hon. Member for Blackburn (Mr Straw). I hope that my most recent case, it was revealed in court that these ministerial colleagues will ensure that this applies to all scammers had tried it on—successfully—six times in referrals of personal data following vehicle accidents, the past five years from the same registered address and that the insurance industry and associated agencies of the vehicle. Unpunished, they are probably trying it will not look for any loopholes. on again as I speak. Not only do uninsured drivers However, I believe that more needs to done, and the increase the insurance premiums of law-abiding insured survey that I conducted through my website shows that drivers, but we taxpayers are being fleeced a second the vast majority of local people who responded think time, as our courts are seeing similar claims cases taking so too. Unfortunately, I suspect that much of the insurance up large amounts of court time, whereas 10 to 12 years industry’s claimed recent fall in uninsured driving has 223 Cost of Motor Insurance8 NOVEMBER 2011 Cost of Motor Insurance 224 come in London, where of course there has been a Karl McCartney: I have heard that before and I am proliferation of number plate recognition cameras, in still surprised considering that I was brought up knowing the City and, more recently, with the congestion charge that one had to be insured and given that one has to area. Across the country a frightening statistic is still in show one’s insurance documents to tax one’s vehicle. force, which is that when we drive on UK roads in some However, the point is well made. areas every 12th car we pass has an uninsured driver at I am going to continue to campaign for justice for the the wheel. insured drivers of our country and for heavier punishments Having taken my views and those of my constituents for those who are uninsured. The law-abiding majority—in into account, I have come up with a 10-point plan to this case drivers who, in many cases, struggle to pay clamp down further on the scourge of uninsured driving large car insurance premiums but who rely on their car and phoney claims. First, as part of the need for a far for work, for transporting children to school in rural more zero-tolerance attitude to be taken against supposedly areas or just to access local services and amenities—must low-level crimes, driving without insurance needs to be always come first. I am also wary of the claims made by treated as a higher priority by the police. Like drink-driving, insurance companies and their insurance bodies and uninsured driving needs to be no longer socially acceptable. organisations, along with some parts of our legal system— the legal firms and operators in this field—that they are Simon Hart (Carmarthen West and South doing their best to reduce uninsured driving and scamming Pembrokeshire) (Con): Does my hon. Friend agree that claims. They patently are not doing what they claim to things are a load easier for enforcement agencies in be doing. They are complicit in passing on the cost of other countries, because the certificate of insurance is fraudulent claims and the £400 million to £500 million a displayed on windscreens there? year that the Motor Insurers Bureau fund pays out, which is taken from our premiums rather than their Karl McCartney: Remarkably, my hon. Friend picks profits, to insure drivers who are involved in accidents up on the second point of my plan. Secondly, we should with uninsured drivers. That is too much. They do not have an insurance sticker on every windscreen, just as mind what our premiums are, as we have to pay the we do for the current tax disc, that proves that a car is figures they quote. They have a monopoly. insured. Thirdly, we need far tougher sentences for I hope that my right hon. and hon. elected colleagues those caught driving uninsured, with the minimum fine in government and honourable members of the judiciary in each area being the double the average insurance cost and legal system will actively seek to reduce the financial in that area for the age and gender of the person caught. burden of motor insurance on law-abiding drivers, Fourthly, where someone is caught and prosecuted for particularly on new and young drivers, by ensuring that driving uninsured, they should automatically lose their uninsured driver numbers are further reduced. That will driving licence for a set period, perhaps at least one ensure that young drivers in particular, at what should year. That should certainly be the case for a second be an exciting time when they are able to have some offence and perhaps the period should be longer—say independence, will be able to afford to drive legally on five years—for subsequent offences. Fifthly, when someone our roads. Further, older drivers who are struggling to is caught and prosecuted for driving uninsured for at afford motor insurance should find that premiums are least the third time, they should perhaps go to prison—only reduced not just marginally but heavily if the insurance for a short time—and be given a lifetime driving ban. industry and legal system help to clamp down on the Sixthly, if someone causes a serious accident while cost of uninsured drivers and on the cost generated by driving uninsured, they should go to prison and be fraudulent and inflated claims. Those involved in the given a lifetime driving ban. Seventhly, juries and magistrates legal system that is currently in place are happy to see should be made aware of whether false vehicle insurance those claims passed through the system because they claims had been made by those making a subsequent generate work, fees and profits at no cost to them, with vehicle insurance claim that has reached the court. drivers’ insurance premiums rising instead, as they have Eighthly, those making false insurance vehicle claims by more than 40% in the past year, to cover those costs. that reach the courts should be prosecuted and actively The points I have made are based on the views of pursued by the relevant police force. My penultimate law-abiding respondents locally and on the view I have point is that the names and addresses of those prosecuted always held that the law-abiding majority should come for driving uninsured should be published widely. Finally, first and the criminal should come last by a long way. we must support both the clampdown on insurers being The irritating system under which people may break the able to trade personal data of those involved in accidents law knowing that the penalties for being caught are and the regulation of the monopoly and sharp practices minor compared with the cost of complying with the currently engaged in by insurers and the legal profession law cannot continue. The situation has to be rectified to that see the motorist paying through insurance premiums ensure that the law is on the side of those who uphold it, and general taxation for their unwillingness to stamp not of those who break it. Tackling uninsured drivers out fraudulent and speculative claims, such as personal and insurance scammers will be a good step in the right injury and hire car charges. These moves are just the direction. start, and throughout my time in Parliament I am going Anything that will help to reduce the cost of insurance to continue to campaign for justice for the insured premiums for the law-abiding 32 million-plus drivers in drivers of our country. our country has to be a good thing. Ensuring that there is a truly competitive insurance industry can only help Julian Sturdy: I agree with my hon. Friend that drivers, especially if moves are made to ensure that it is tougher action is required. Is he surprised to hear that no longer viewed as a rip-off for the motorist—or 10% of drivers aged under 34 do not realise it is compulsory highway robbery, as some have termed the recent 40% rise to have motor insurance? in premiums. Perhaps regulating and removing the absolute 225 Cost of Motor Insurance8 NOVEMBER 2011 Cost of Motor Insurance 226 monopoly enjoyed by the sector will also, along with was the better part of 20 years ago. The problems with appropriate levels of punishment, help to eradicate the increased costs in insurance and the increased likelihood despicable practice of uninsured driving on our roads. I of people driving uninsured, as well as the risks posed support the motion. to those people and, more particularly, to everybody else, are intolerable. 7.3 pm Motor insurance is a curious entity in that it is one of Jim Dowd (Lewisham West and Penge) (Lab): May I the few examples, although not the only example, of a apologise to you, Mr Deputy Speaker, and to my hon. statutory obligation to purchase a product from a private Friend the Member for Liverpool, Riverside (Mrs Ellman) supplier. There may be far more than one supplier, but for missing the first few moments of her introduction to one has to have motor insurance to drive on public the debate? I commend her and the Committee for the roads. That places on the motor insurance industry excellent work they have done in this timely report. As particular responsibilities that it should meet but that she mentioned, the motor car has moved a long way would not otherwise arise. I think the situation implies from being a luxury to being, although not quite a that the industry should have the most stringent, open, necessity, something that is critical to the economic and transparent—I think a Government Member said that social well-being of many millions of people across the transparency was a key issue—and fair standards of country. Issues relating to cars clearly have a wide behaviour towards customers because it has a captive impact in every constituency. market. I accept that people can move from one provider The issue of young drivers concerns everybody. The to another, but one thing they have to have to drive on difficulty that many of them have in obtaining insurance public roads is motor insurance. If one’s household is only one part of that. I remember when I bought my contents insurance premium becomes unsustainable or first car back in— extortionate, one can either go to another supplier or take the risk on oneself. One can say, “The premiums The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Transport are not worth what I’m paying: I’ll take the risk on (Mike Penning): A Model T? myself. I don’t have to have it,” but the same is not true of motor insurance. If one wants to drive on a public Jim Dowd: No, it was not a Model T—it was a Mini, road one has to be insured. back in 1968. It was six years old and it cost me just over £100. By the time I had got my insurance, which The industry is confronted by a number of problems, was £60, plus four-months’ road tax—as it was then and to which others have referred. For example, there is the as the rest of the world calls it, or vehicle excise duty as rise in personal injury claims, almost all of which seem we call it now—and an MOT certificate, I had spent as to include claims for whiplash injury, as well as the issue much on those three items as the car had cost me. I was of referral fees, which the report has looked at and quite young at the time and that was probably reflected which others have mentioned. There is also the growth in the premium, but none the less it was a shock to have of the no win, no fee—or ambulance chasing, as it is to spend as much on ancillary costs as on the vehicle known in some circles—industry, and the business of itself. downright fraudulent claims. All these issues have to be Today, we hear stories of young people having a grappled with by the industry, which is an extensive one, vehicle costing a few hundred pounds and insurance and I am sure that people will have different views premiums of more than £1,000. It is not the cost of the about how well it is dealing with them. vehicle that is the issue; it is the risk of using it on the road. Effectively, motor insurance is a public liability The report covered a number of areas, including insurance; one does not necessarily have to insure one’s personal injury claims, referral fees, uninsured drivers property but one does have to insure against damage to and fraud, but it did not cover an area that I want to other people’s property and, indeed, to other people. It make particular reference to on behalf of one of my is the scale of the problem that we need to look at. As constituents. He is 73 years old, and he has been working has been said, there are more than 30 million cars on as a minicab driver for a number of years. He has a state the road and it does not take a genius to work out that pension, although not a full one, and that is his only as the number of cars on the road rises, so the likelihood other income, so he is keen to carry on working. In of accidents rises in similar proportion. However, I August this year, his then insurer advised him not that it believe that this country has a very good, but still was putting up his premium but that it was cancelling improvable, record on reducing road accidents and certainly his hire and reward cover. It gave no other reason than road casualties. the fact that he was now 73, as though he had just gone across some magical threshold. It was not even prepared One shock that I had in 1992 when I was first elected to take on the risk at a higher price. to the House—apart from having been elected to the House—was the fact that for the first time in more than My constituent quite understands that, as people 20 years I had to buy my own car. I had experienced the grow older, so they might become a bigger risk and comparative luxury of having a company car in the therefore have to pay a bigger premium, but the insurer intervening 20 years and precisely because I did not would not increase the premium. It simply would not have a personal insurance record—a no claims bonus, accept the risk, for no other reason than his age. His as everyone knows it—at that time, the first insurance wife is somewhat younger than him, but she, too, is past quote I got was more than £1,200 for a very medium-range retirement age. She is still working, however, so his car, which my former company kindly sold to me. It was recourse to benefits would be somewhat limited. He only when I got the company to provide me with a contacted other insurance companies and brokers, but certificate saying that I had had blemish-free motoring to no avail. He got no offers at all to renew his hire and for 10 years or more that the insurance company reduced reward cover, which is essential for anyone wishing to the figure, but it still only came down to £800—and that work as a minicab driver. 227 Cost of Motor Insurance8 NOVEMBER 2011 Cost of Motor Insurance 228

My constituent’s social, domestic and pleasure policy they also treat people as part of a group that has an was unaffected, except for a marginal increase in price. I alleged poor record, and increase the premiums accordingly. could understand if the insurer felt that he was a danger This never seems to work in the opposite direction. to the public and should therefore not be on the road. I Mr Thoresen suggested that my constituent continue would not agree with such a proposition—I do not to try to secure insurance through a specialist broker, think that any sensible person would—but it would at and he very kindly gave me the details of four specialist least have the characteristic of consistency. As things companies for him to approach. My constituent contacted stand, however, it is perfectly legal for him to drive on me again in the middle of October, having contacted all the roads as a private citizen in his very unglamorous four companies. Of the four, three would not offer him minicab, but it is no longer possible for him to pursue insurance at all, and the one company that did so his livelihood as a minicab driver. wanted about £750 a month. That amounts to well The majority of the population have a driving licence, over £9,000 a year. I have absolute confidence that my and I quite understand why they expire on the licence constituent is an excellent minicab driver, and I am sure holder’s 70th birthday. The assumption is that we need that his customers must be among the happiest in south to consider whether people are still fit to drive on public London, but I am also fairly certain that he does not roads. The primary consideration must be safety, not make enough money to pay £9,000 a year in insurance least the safety of other road users, and it is perfectly costs. reasonable to check people’s eyesight and reaction times In the Financial Secretary’s response, he also said: more as they get older, to ensure that they can still drive safely. We are told that we have an increasingly ageing “Research has indicated that no age groups are specifically population, so this is going to become more and more excluded from the insurance market”. of an issue. There is no question but that everyone who I suggest to him that it is unnecessary specifically to drives on public roads should be deemed fit to do so, exclude anyone if they are being offered a price that is but I cannot understand the distinction between my completely and utterly unaffordable. Theoretically, everyone constituent driving as a private individual and driving in this country can go and stay at the Savoy—there is for gain as a minicab driver. not a sign outside saying “No riff-raff”—but most people would not consider doing so because they cannot After my constituent had been to see me, I wrote to afford it. Similarly, in this case, that insurer made the the Chancellor of the Exchequer and to the director-general cover so unaffordable that it might just as well have of the Association of British Insurers. I got a reply from banned my constituent from having it. He and I have no the Financial Secretary to the Treasury, in which he objection to the need for an increase, but we object to states: the scale and disproportionate nature of that increase. “Some age-based practices, such as the use of broad age bands All he wants to do is continue to pursue his livelihood combined with significant price increases between age bands, may and not have to depend on benefits. appear arbitrary. Insurers, however, use age bands as a means by which to price the risk of insuring a variety of individuals, and the transaction costs involved. The effects of age bands will, David Rutley (Macclesfield) (Con): The hon. Gentleman however, be reflected in the premium charged to an individual is making some important points. Does he agree that should they enter a new band.” there might be scope for some new products in the As I have said, my constituent has been denied that motor insurance industry that could be tailored to older opportunity, as he has not been put into a new band. His or younger drivers and perhaps designed around themes premium has not been increased; it has been refused. such as pay as you go? Such products could be made more affordable if they were tailored to specific age I also received a response from Mr Otto Thoresen, segments that have different risk profiles from those of the director-general of the Association of British Insurers. the average driver. I will read out a point that supports exactly what the Committee says in its report. He says: “In 2010, motor insurers paid out £1.21 in claims and expenses Jim Dowd: I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for for every £1 received in premiums. A combination of high legal that suggestion. I said earlier that the insurance market costs, rapidly increasing personal injury claims, fraud, and a should be more personalised, rather than more generalised. stubbornly high level of uninsured driving have driven the industry Companies should certainly look into that. I fear that, to a point where, after price stability and, in many cases, falling because the motor insurance sector is a captive market, premiums in the middle of the last decade, they have now had to we do not get the level of service that we would get rise.” from, say, the home insurance sector, because it knows The Committee makes that point as well. Mr Thoresen that everyone has to have insurance if they want to went on to say that there were issues relating to the taxi drive on public roads. I agree with the hon. Gentleman, insurance business, and that however, that products should be tailored more specifically to the individual. “evidence across the market has shown that the probability of being involved in an accident worsens as drivers reach their As I said, my constituent wants to continue to work. mid-70s”, He does not want to become dependent on benefits. as my constituent is now doing. Some years ago, the then Secretary of State for Employment was famously misquoted as saying that people should One of the objections to the way in which insurance get on their bikes to find work. The present Secretary of companies conduct their business is that, when it suits State for Work and Pensions advised people in south them to do so, they treat people as individuals, and if an Wales to get on the bus and go to Cardiff to look for a individual has a particularly poor record, they will job. My constituent wants to get in his minicab and suffer the consequences. However, when it suits them, work, but the insurance industry will not let him. 229 Cost of Motor Insurance8 NOVEMBER 2011 Cost of Motor Insurance 230

7.19 pm Jonathan Evans: Rather than go down the route of legislation, might it not be a helpful preliminary step if Roger Williams (Brecon and Radnorshire) (LD): I the insurance industry reduced the premium provided welcome this opportunity to speak in the debate. I want people accepted the proposals he has made on driving to say a few words about young drivers, the insurance behaviour? That would not require legislation and might industry and Government policy. I have some sympathy ultimately encourage better driving habits. with the excellent points about why the industry is being pushed into charging ever higher premiums, but the Roger Williams: That was precisely the comment that premiums young people are charged are very high indeed. the Minister made to me. I commend the work of Many would argue that that is for good reason. Premiums Co-operative Insurance and other insurance companies, have been quoted this evening of £2,700 for a newly which have come up with their own graduated driving qualified male driver. I shall quote a few statistics that licence scheme. A smart box in the insured car monitors might substantiate that. many aspects of the driver’s habits, including speed, One in five young drivers will have an accident in cornering and the time the car is driven. The driver is their first six months on the road, and 17 to 24-year-olds given a quarterly cashback payment according to their make up 12% of insured drivers but 25% of claims. An driving score. The data collected from a sample of 1,300 18-year-old is three times more likely to be involved in a young drivers show that almost four in five consistently car accident than a 48-year-old, and young drivers tend drive within the speed limits, and 40% of males and to be involved in more serious accidents than older 41% of females achieved the top score in all categories. people, with the average claim for a younger driver So either through Government policy or by persuading being three times more than that for older drivers. Men insurance companies to take up similar measures, we between the ages of 17 and 20 are seven times more can reduce the number of accidents on the road. That likely to be killed or seriously injured on the road than will not only bring down the costs of everyone’s insurance all male drivers. I thank the road safety charity Brake premium but, far more important, prevent many fatalities for supplying me with that information. There is a clear on our roads. cost to insuring young drivers. More tragically, every year 3,300 young drivers and 7.25 pm passengers are killed or suffer life-changing injury as a result of road crashes. In rural areas there is a lack of Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP): I congratulate the public transport so young people need to drive, and I hon. Member for Liverpool, Riverside (Mrs Ellman) on am absolutely not discouraging them from doing so. introducing the debate. Car insurance and premiums is Many wish to have the opportunity of independence a big issue in Northern Ireland. Just two weeks ago the from their parents and, not having public transport, hon. Member for South Down (Ms Ritchie) secured an take to driving, but we must ensure that young people Adjournment debate on insurance in Northern Ireland, are as safe as possible, not just for their sake but for for which Northern Irish Members were present. It is passengers and other road users and pedestrians. good to be involved in the bigger issue for the whole of the United Kingdom, because we are part of the UK In my constituency in 2006 we had the tragic loss of and as such we are concerned about the issue. life of four young girls on Llangynidr mountain, and this summer a young girl from Hay-on-Wye was killed The Consumer Council for Northern Ireland has in a neighbouring village in Herefordshire. Many of produced figures demonstrating that the cost of car these tragedies can be avoided. I have worked with insurance is comparatively higher in Northern Ireland Brake and with Sarah Jones of Cardiff university on than in England and Wales. It is accepted that there is a graduated driving licences, whereby restrictions are placed disparity, and the insurance companies and many other on newly qualified drivers. The proposals supported by people understand that to be the case. There is, however, Brake are, first, a restriction on the number of young a lack of understanding and analysis of the factors that passengers in the car. Often the excitement of first have resulted in the higher costs. going out and having friends in the car leads to reckless There has to date been a lack of informed discussion and ill-considered driving. There should be no driving about the cost of car insurance in Northern Ireland. for young newly qualified drivers between 11 pm and 6 The premiums for us are clear, and those of us who pay am, unless for work purposes. There should be zero their insurance are aware of that. tolerance of alcohol, and no driving on motorways. This is not a radical plan. Countries with a form of Mr Nigel Dodds (Belfast North) (DUP): On average, graduated driving licence include New Zealand, Australia, premiums in Northern Ireland are 84% higher than in much of Canada and 48 of the American states. other regions of the United Kingdom—a startling figure given the high cost of insurance premiums across the UK as a whole. My hon. Friend is right to point out the Mrs Ellman: Is the hon. Gentleman aware that the particular problems in Northern Ireland. Transport Committee considered this issue in the previous Parliament and made precisely the same recommendation Jim Shannon: Clearly, the fact that premiums are 84% as he is making now? The then Government did not higher shows what we in Northern Ireland have to bear. respond positively; perhaps this Government will. Part of the role of the cross-departmental ministerial Committee is to address that issue. Roger Williams: I was aware of the report, and I have Premiums are high in Northern Ireland, but the met the Minister in this Government. While he understood number of compensation claims is falling, whereas in my good intentions, he was not able to reciprocate England and Wales it is increasing. The number of positively. claims notified to the compensation recovery unit has 231 Cost of Motor Insurance8 NOVEMBER 2011 Cost of Motor Insurance 232 reduced by 23% in Northern Ireland over a nine- year that exists in parts of America and Europe, whereby a period, and over the same period it increased in England gadget, for want of a better word, is put in cars that and Wales by 17%. It is a clear disparity—84% dearer monitors the speed and the mannerisms of the driver. insurance to start with, despite the fact that our claims That feeds back to a central place. That reduces fees are reducing. We have to ask why premiums are so high because if drivers transgress, on the principle of “Three in Northern Ireland. strikes and you’re out,”they lose their premium reduction. In 2009 the CRU was notified of 29,467 claims for That might be a way of addressing some of the issues. compensation. In 2010 the county court of Northern Ireland made awards in only 768 civil bills for personal Mike Penning: It is not for me to publicise which injury claims. The vast majority of claims are dealt with companies do that, but, as we heard from the hon. without the need for determination by the court. Again, Member for Brecon and Radnorshire (Roger Williams), claims are down but we are paying extremely high at least one of them does, and there are several available premiums. on the market. In England and Wales a claim for damages arising from personal injury will routinely involve detailed Jim Shannon: It is not for me to advertise those firms claims for future caring costs. In Northern Ireland, either, but I understand that they do good work and these costs are reduced as injured persons will often be there are good possibilities for young drivers. cared for by family members. That is perhaps the nature We want to make it clear, first, that the number of of us in Northern Ireland, but it is a factual example. In insurance providers operating in the market is lower 2010, 87% of awards for personal injury in the county than in England and Wales, restricting choice for consumers court were for less than £5,000. When there are claims, and reducing competition within the market. Secondly, the average claim is small. That is important to note. there is a small number of accident management companies operating in Northern Ireland. There is some suggestion Karl McCartney: Does the hon. Gentleman know that costs are higher when accident management companies whether the reduction in Northern Ireland is a result of are involved. Despite the point that was made earlier, insurance companies still having plenty of assessors that may be a contributing factor and requires consideration. who look at claims and make sure they are not fraudulent Lastly, the fact that Northern Ireland is a rural community or as high as they are in England and Wales? with a dense road network and high levels of social need requires specific consideration. Jim Shannon: I am not aware of all the details. I am Northern Ireland Members of Parliament have a aware only that compensation claims are down. The duty tonight to highlight the imbalance in insurance value is down, as well as the numbers. That indicates premiums between Northern Ireland and the rest of the that we deserve consideration when it comes to premiums. United Kingdom. We believe that, as the hon. Member That is the point I am making. for Liverpool, Riverside said in her submission, a review A number of the factors that are thought to have is needed. Northern Ireland needs to be part of that contributed to the rise in the cost of insurance premiums cross-departmental ministerial committee. We look forward in England and Wales are absent from Northern Ireland— to its conclusion and to a reduction in fees for car again, it is important to draw the comparison. The drivers and for those who have to pay such high insurance absence of no win, no fee agreements means that those premiums in Northern Ireland. I support the proposal. in Northern Ireland who are seeking compensation must invest their own funds—perhaps that explains the previous point—before a legal claim can be brought. 7.34 pm Alternatively, a solicitor’s practice may be willing to fund the outlays. This dissuades unmeritorious litigants. Iain Stewart (Milton Keynes South) (Con): As a Furthermore, in England and Wales a successful plaintiff’s member of the Transport Committee, I am pleased to solicitor can claim a success fee, which can increase have an opportunity to take part in the debate. I pay legal costs by up to 100%. There is no provision for tribute to the hon. Member for Liverpool, Riverside success fees in Northern Ireland. (Mrs Ellman) for introducing the Committee’s report so The insurance market in Northern Ireland shares a ably and comprehensively. I do not intend to speak for number of characteristics with England and Wales. The long, but having spent a considerable time examining same advertisements are shown on TV. Admiral Group the issues, there are a few points that I would like to advertises on TV, as does Churchill, but underneath, place on the record. the wee small print says, “Not available in Northern Two weeks ago two events happened to me that Ireland.” So although Churchill says, “Oh, yes” to every crystallised in my mind the facts that we are debating question he is asked, that does not apply to Northern tonight. First, I received in the post my motor insurance Ireland, so there is clearly an issue to be addressed. The renewal notice from my insurance company. I can assure insurance market in Northern Ireland shares a number the House that it was not a happy moment in the of characteristics, but not the price. That is the point we Stewart household, because my premium had shot up want to make. by the order of 25%. I shopped around a little and got a Some time ago I had the opportunity to go with some slightly better quote, but it was still a substantial increase of my constituents to meet the Department of the on last year, despite my having had no accidents. Environment in relation to a suggestion we were making. Secondly, no sooner had I signed up to the new policy Perhaps the Minister in his response, as well as the than I got a text message suggesting that as I had had an Committee, will take this on board to see how we could accident in the past three years, perhaps I required reduce premiums and fees in Northern Ireland. One of assistance to claim compensation. As I said, I had had the suggestions that was made concerned a new scheme no such accident. It strikes me that those two experiences, 233 Cost of Motor Insurance8 NOVEMBER 2011 Cost of Motor Insurance 234 which I am sure have been shared by thousands, if not The destination of those fees and the routes by which millions, of people up and down the country, are not they travel are far from clear, but I have been surprised unlinked. to learn of some of the organisations that potentially Although I accept that, as the Select Committee’s gain a sizeable income from referral fees. For example, it report sets out, there is a range of reasons why insurance has been suggested to me that trade unions receive premiums have gone up considerably in recent years, significant income, either directly or through benefits in from the evidence that I saw as part of our inquiry, kind, from referral fees. I have been unable to quantify together with private discussions that I have had with that, but Lord Justice Jackson states in his review of the some insurance companies, I am convinced that it is cost of civil litigation: referral fees for personal injury claims and the activities “Trade unions refer the personal injury claims of their members of some claims management companies that have been to solicitors on union panels…For example, one union informs a significant contributor to the growth of those premiums. me that it receives a referral fee of £200 for every case which I do not doubt that there may be perfectly respectable proves to be “worthy of investigation”. Other trade unions do not charge referral fees as such, but instead receive certain free legal claims management companies, but I am of the view services from solicitors for their members.” that the current arrangements whereby lawyers and others can pay and receive fees for referring personal I am in no way suggesting that that is wrong, but it injury claims has created an industry that pursues claimants illustrates the opaqueness of the system and the fact for profit. Although I do not want to see anyone who that money can be distributed in ways that people might has a genuine claim denied proper compensation, far not first realise. For that reason, I am glad that the too often those proper boundaries are breached and Government have taken action to ban referral fees there is a financial incentive throughout the system to through the amendments made last week to the Legal exacerbate claims or make fraudulent ones. Aid, Sentencing and Punishment of Offenders Bill. It has been difficult to obtain exact figures, but there I would be grateful if the Minister could clarify one is certainly an average sum of several hundred pounds point on that—I appreciate that it was not his Bill and in each claim which sloshes around the system in ways that he might wish to speak with the Under-Secretary that are very opaque. The cost, of course, is picked up of State for Justice, my hon. Friend the Member for by the policyholder. This creates a double problem. For Huntingdon (Mr Djanogly) about it. The new clause the honest motorist, that pushes up premiums at a time added to the Bill last week defined payment for referral when many households are struggling to meet the cost fees as “any form of consideration”. I presume that that of living. will include the offset models to which I have referred, where legal services are traded rather than cash, but I Dr Sarah Wollaston (Totnes) (Con): Further to the would be grateful for clarification. unfortunate shock that happened in the Stewart household, I strongly believe that the ban on referral fees will may I tell the House about the unfortunate shock in my help to strip out some of the unnecessary costs in motor household when I received a notice saying that I did not insurance. There is a balance to be struck between need to take any further action to continue my insurance providing fair access to justice and having a system that with Tesco, but the small print indicated that the premium is wide open to abuse in a “something for nothing” had gone up from £900 to £5,700 as I am the parent of a culture. I believe that the pendulum has swung too far 17-year-old boy? It is a further sharp practice that in the latter direction and I am glad that the Government the small print is not there, and it would have been very have taken action on referral fees. However, as the easy to miss the fact that I could have spent nearly two Transport Committee’s report recommends, there are months’ salary on insuring my 17-year-old boy. I think many other causes behind the rising cost of premiums everybody in the House would agree that it would and they often cut across Government Departments. be entirely unreasonable and very difficult for anyone living in a very rural area, as I do, for my son not to be In conclusion, I urge the Government to take on able to drive. board the motion’s final recommendation, which is also set out in the Committee’s report. A cross-departmental Iain Stewart: My hon. Friend makes a powerful point. ministerial committee should be set up to consider The shock in my household cannot even begin to compare further ways of reducing the cost of motor insurance. with that in Totnes. She raises an extremely important point. Many of us will pay our motor insurance premiums 7.43 pm by a monthly direct debit, and among all the paperwork that we receive it is very easy to say, “Yes, we’ll continue Julie Hilling (Bolton West) (Lab): As a member of with that policy,” and then suddenly the premiums that the Transport Committee, I, too, pay tribute to our we are paying shoot up. I echo her call for much more Chair, my hon. Friend the Member for Liverpool, Riverside transparency and explanation on the renewal documents (Mrs Ellman), for leading the debate. The ever-rising about what the new cost will be. cost of motor insurance simply cannot continue, and it The first problem I indentified is that the premiums is the only insurance that is compulsory. It is up to an go up, placing a strain on households that have tight individual, and perhaps their mortgage company, to incomes, but another problem is that premiums are insure their house, their holiday or anything else, but pushed up to such a level that other, less honest motorists the law states that we must insure our cars and motorbikes; seek in some way to evade paying their insurance, and we are a captive audience. That is why it is absolutely other Members have alluded to that. They will either right to debate the issue this evening. not have insurance at all, or they will in some way make Insurance premiums are bad enough for mature fraudulent claims on their insurance policies to try to motorists, but for young drivers they are frankly ridiculous. minimise payments. That creates a vicious cycle; the They lead to young people finding solutions that are more people evade payment or misclaim on their policies, against the law. Research from the AA shows that more the higher the costs that honest motorists have to bear. than a fifth of drivers under the age of 25 are prepared 235 Cost of Motor Insurance8 NOVEMBER 2011 Cost of Motor Insurance 236 to break the law to avoid high insurance premiums. It insurance company. Perhaps naively, I have expected it shows that 21% would consider driving without insurance, to sort the situation out. In times gone by there was the 42% have changed the information they provide to “knock for knock” policy; one’s insurance company an insurance firm to qualify for a cheaper policy, funded the repairs to the vehicle, even if the fault was 22% have added another driver to their policy, 15% have with another driver. I am told that the increased number changed whether they were the main driver, of insurers in the industry and its internet basis stopped 3% have changed their employment information and that policy. 2% have changed information about their address. The last time I had to use my insurance, I was clearly All over the UK, otherwise law-abiding citizens are sold to a claims management company. Instead of the breaking the law to get affordable car insurance. For normal car hire company, I had a credit hire car, although example, cars belonging to young people are being I did not know anything about that at the time. I was insured by their parents, with the parents registered as contacted many times to claim for the “injuries” I had the main driver even though they never drive the car. received, even though I had been sitting in my living Tragically, if one of those young people has an accident, room when someone drove into my car. Why did my their claim might not be met by the insurance company. insurance company not provide the necessary services It is bad enough to lose their car and possibly be itself and charge the other person’s insurer, or pass my prosecuted, but what about the person they might hurt? case on to the other insurer to deal with? Some young people are finding unique ways of I also believe that insurance companies could do far overcoming the problem. For example, 18-year-old Chris more to reward good drivers. The Pass Plus scheme was Berry from Bolton was quoted £17,800 to insure his introduced to give additional post-test instructions to P-reg VW Polo. He is now using a 1953 Fordson Major novice drivers, such as motorway driving, driving at tractor to get around, with an insurance premium of night, town centre driving and so on. Initially that £57 a year. He said: reduced premiums, but it seems that people with Pass “If I had the choice, I’d have my car—I can go further in it and Plus are no longer being rewarded. We have been told of it would be much better in the rain. If you are image conscious, I schemes that can introduce technology into cars to don’t think you would drive the tractor…but it can go 40 mph on show if a person is driving safely, for example when a good day” they are driving within speed limits and whether they He also told The Bolton News that the insurance company accelerate and brake gently. I believe that the insurance rang him up after he received the quote for nearly companies should do more to promote such schemes. £18,000 to ask him whether he wanted to take it out. He We have been told about the very high propensity for said: young drivers to have serious accidents, but in truth it is “I told them they were having a laugh—it’s a Polo, not a not young drivers but young, male drivers, and I regret Ferrari” the European ruling that insurance premiums should be Of course, no insurance company would offer him any equalised for men and women. Insurance has always sort of quote if it was a Ferrari. been based on risk, and it seems perverse that the ruling will end up costing women a great deal more because of Jim Dowd: I just want an assurance that he is not the risky behaviour of men and, particularly, young using red diesel for non-agricultural purposes. men. More regulation should therefore be introduced for Julie Hilling: I do not think so, although perhaps that novice drivers, and I should welcome a mandatory is worth investigation. “newly qualified” plate, which exists in other European We have heard much over the past few months about countries, because it would have two advantages. First, referral fees, which the hon. Member for Milton Keynes it would warn experienced drivers that the person in South (Iain Stewart) mentioned. I am sure that other front just might do something a little out of the ordinary. hon. Members will talk about that in detail, so I will Indeed, I remember the first time that I drove alone, confine my remarks to just a few points. I believe that along a country road, and a lorry decided to overtake referral fees must be stopped, but they should be stopped me. I was absolutely terrified, but I am sure that the for the whole of a motor claim, not just the personal driver would have thought twice if he had realised that I injury part. I also believe that the money paid to solicitors had passed my test only the day before. in the motor insurance portal should be reduced to an amount that simply covers the true cost of dealing with Secondly, the plate could be used to identify drivers a case. While there is spare money in the system, there on the road in order to enforce other restrictions that will always be a tendency to find another way of bypassing should be in place. We hear tragic stories of young the ban. For instance, there is money to be made in people losing their lives or having life-changing injuries referring claims for vehicle repairs. The Committee also after car accidents, and normally the driver is found to heard about how credit hire cars are supplied to accident be alcohol and drug-free, but I suspect that they are victims, rather than normal hire cars, which are much fired up on testosterone. Young drivers should not be cheaper. We heard how insurance companies will pass allowed to carry backseat passengers, and we should claims to claims management companies, thereby building investigate other restrictions to make our roads safer. more costs into the system. I hope the Government make rapid progress on making Although I agree that referral fees should be banned, the driving test more rigorous and on ensuring that all the insurance industry should do more to tackle the drivers are prepared for many more of the situations situation. I challenged a number of insurance companies that they find on the roads. and their professional bodies to look to themselves for I was alarmed to find out recently that about 10,000 solutions. Whenever I have been involved in a claims people are driving on our roads with more than 12 points situation, my first port of call has always been to my on their licences, so I urge the Government to investigate 237 Cost of Motor Insurance8 NOVEMBER 2011 Cost of Motor Insurance 238 that urgently and to take action. Previously, there was I went out with the police on a dawn patrol—all very an effective carrot and stick: if someone built up their exciting—in a vehicle impressively equipped with the no claims bonus, they got cheaper car insurance; if they latest, unbelievable technology for automatic number got endorsements or points, their insurance premium plate recognition. We have a ring of steel in Bradford—fixed went up; and if they got three endorsements or 12 points, cameras—but the technology in our vehicle enabled us they lost their licence. We need to do more to ensure that to see all the number plates coming towards us and good drivers can afford to drive, and I hope that the going away from us. They pinged up as information Government will take urgent and comprehensive action. came through about vehicles that the police had an interest in, not necessarily just those that were uninsured. 7.51 pm Within 60 minutes of leaving the police station, we had identified an uninsured driver, the car had been Mr David Ward (Bradford East) (LD): Just after I seized and it was on the back of a trailer on its way to was elected, I was asked to go to a local mosque to meet the compound. The car probably ended up being crushed. a group of young men who wanted to talk to me about It would have been held for a period, but probably the various issues in the BD3 area of Bradford. It soon owner just went to the next car auction and replaced the became apparent, however, that the main issue that they vehicle—and off he went again. wanted to discuss was unaffordable motor insurance. Tales were told of people having to give up the ownership The police do impressive work—they seized 2,000 of vehicles used for family purposes and, more worryingly, vehicles during the previous 12 months—but the level of people having to give up the ownership of vehicles of fines has to be investigated. There is a difficulty for such as taxis, which were used for businesses and as part magistrates, because they have to take into account the of their livelihoods. Even more worrying, I guess, were ability to pay of the person being charged. It seems a tales of friends who used Leeds postcodes when applying simple solution just to increase the fine, but if the for insurance, despite living in Bradford, as the only person cannot pay the penalty it does not really matter way—fraudulently, of course—to obtain affordable motor whether it is £300 or £3 million because it is not going to insurance. be a deterrent. I undertook to determine the extent of the problem Karl McCartney: The hon. Gentleman may have heard locally, and to see what proceedings had already taken my speech, in which I made precisely that point. Fines place in Parliament to address the issue. It quickly have to be such that uninsured drivers definitely insure became clear that Parliament did indeed take the issue themselves. Unless they are increased in the magistrates seriously, especially through the work of the Transport courts and elsewhere, such drivers will not be forced to Committee. It was useful to see the work that took place do so. What does the hon. Gentleman think? during the previous Parliament, and I am delighted that it has continued into this Parliament on such an important issue. Indeed, I welcome the Committee’s dogged and Mr Ward: Absolutely. When the fines are so much persistent pursuit of it. lower than the premiums, there are bound to be people who take the risk of getting caught, and it completely We distributed about 15,000 local survey forms, and undermines the public’s confidence in the system and, incredibly almost 2,000 were returned. In fact, they are indeed, the police. If fines are to be a proper deterrent, still coming back. The respondents to the survey have surely they should at least reflect the amount that the seen their premiums rise by more than 60% in the past driver would have had to pay had they not avoided two years, at an average of just under £900, and their paying insurance. responses show that many Bradford residents are well aware of the role that personal injury claims play in pushing up total claims and, therefore, premiums. Many Sammy Wilson (East Antrim) (DUP): Given that the people have reported being pressurised to make bogus fine system is clearly not working, does the hon. Gentleman claims, and often by reputable firms of solicitors. agree that one way we could deal with the issue would be to ensure that when someone purchases a car, whether We carried out interviews with the police, insurance from an auction, a dealer or wherever, they need to have brokers and companies, driving instructors, GPs and, of proof of insurance before they can leave the premises? course, numerous affordable-insurance-seeking drivers In that way we would have someone checking before the in order to get their views, and we produced a report car ever got on to the road. and held a summit meeting to report back on the work that we carried out. What became apparent was that almost everybody we talked to had their own pet reason Mr Ward: Absolutely. I mentioned all the survey why insurance premiums were high. Whoever we talked returns that we received, and we asked for people’s to, they would say, “This is why they are so high.” suggestions on how they would improve things. Several respondents suggested a gibbet in the centre of Bradford, Many members of the public blamed uninsured drivers, but the hon. Gentleman’s point is useful, because there and unfortunately we have the dishonour of topping is no shortage of suggested solutions. I am not aware of the hit parade for uninsured drivers. I think that we the processes and protocols of the House, but, rather have held it for several years in the BD3 community, than relying all the time on the Transport Committee to and during our survey we often heard the question, resurrect and pursue the issue, we could consider establish “Why don’t the police do more about it?” a small all-party working group to consider many of the The police pointed out that the cost of uninsured ideas that are coming forward and constantly to keep drivers—the Transport Committee covered the point, up the pressure. For a number of years, there has been a but not a lot of people know this—is about £30 per spiral of ever-increasing insurance premiums, and we premium, and it plays a part in high premiums but not a need to reverse that. We need to keep constant pressure tremendously large part in excessively high premiums. on the system until we bring premiums down. 239 Cost of Motor Insurance8 NOVEMBER 2011 Cost of Motor Insurance 240

We considered the issue of road accidents. Our initial, However, does not the fact that insurance companies intuitive position was that there are a lot more accidents almost appear to roll over if a personal injury claim is and that that explains the situation; but of course the set below a certain level encourage people to make such opposite is true. Road safety experts revealed that the a claim? The hon. Gentleman is right to point out that number of car accidents had fallen dramatically. Driving fraud is sometimes hard to prove, but one thing insurance instructors called for more stringent testing—I suppose companies perhaps ought to be doing is to fight more of they would—and, indeed, for post-test tests to take these cases, so that if people want to get this money, place perhaps a year or six months after the original test they have to put up some evidence in court. That might to deal with some of the issues involving young drivers. deter some of these applications. However, that did not seem to offer a solution to the murky world of personal injury claims that became apparent. There is an increasing number of claims and Mr Ward: That is absolutely right; we need someone the cost per claim emerged through discussions with to take on and challenge the system. Over the years it brokers, who candidly told us that £3,000 was the going has clearly become easier just to recoup the money by rate for a personal injury claim. It is widely known in doing the same to someone else. That is what has the community that insurance companies are willing to happened in the system. Insurance companies have pay out because it is a quicker and less costly course of been guilty of such an approach and they have had to action than challenging claims, even when they suspect respond to what other companies have done. Those claims of being opportunistic and fraudulent. other companies have then also had to do it, and so the cycle goes on. One driving instructor was full of genuine, deep sympathy for young drivers. He said that many good We considered the various component parts of the drivers simply cannot afford vehicles. There is a problem matter: whiplash injuries, referral fees, personal injury when a young driver passes their test and cannot afford lawyers’ costs and many of the things that have been to drive for probably a year or 18 months but they then covered in great detail by other speakers and the Transport jump into a car. Putting that to one side, the driving Committee. The overall conclusion was that there was instructor was sympathetic to young drivers who had not a simple solution to the problem of unaffordable passed their test, but who were unable to afford insurance. car insurance and that, in fact, it is a complex and However, he then said, “I did it, you know.” I said, deeply flawed system. None of the component parts “Well, what exactly do you mean?” He said that he was can be removed: they all fit together to create the system giving a driving lesson to a young woman and that they and they all need to be dealt with individually. We need were involved in an accident that was not their fault. a batch of measures, each one designed to deal with the There was minor vehicle damage and no personal damage component parts of what has become a crazy, crazy at all—or so he thought. system. The next day, the woman returned after a discussion Our work over the summer generated a number of with family members who were clearly more streetwise case studies, some of which would be funny if they were than her. She told the instructor that, over night, she not so serious. I was contacted in January by a teenager had developed a neck pain. They both ended up claiming who had been quoted £26,000 for third party insurance and received more than £2,000 each plus £3,000 for the on a 1.1 litre Citroen Saxo. When I raised that with the car repairs—simple as that. I went to see the police and local paper, I was contacted by other young people who said, “Well, surely you can do something about the had received even more ridiculous quotes. One young matter.” The police said that it is very difficult to prove woman was quoted a figure of £53,000, which was the fraud in such cases. In fact, they had managed to catch record. I think we can take it that the insurance company only one person who was guilty of fraud. That case did not want to insure that person. Clearly such premiums involved an accident after which somebody had immediately are unaffordable for anyone, even those with an extremely jumped out of the car, lain on the floor and called for high disposable income. an ambulance. The person then realised that they were The young seem to be particularly affected, but they not insured, so they rang their brother and got him to are not the only ones experiencing problems. The hon. lie on the floor. That fraud was, in fact, detected, but Member for Lewisham West and Penge (Jim Dowd) that example shows the difficulties. mentioned an incident concerning an elderly gentleman, People talk about the compensation culture, but what which shows that the issue affects everyone. During the is interesting—I am fascinated by this—is the immoral summer, I was visited by various reporters and journalists stance taken by many people who are otherwise good as part of my investigation. The comical thing was that and honest. They would never drop a sweet wrapper or invariably, after the interview or the filming, the journalist let their dog foul the pavement, and yet they get involved or the cameraman or woman gave me their story or that in this world of fraud. Many people believe that they of their nephew, niece, son or daughter. They all had a should not have been asked to pay so much for their tale to tell and were of the opinion that something had insurance in the first place and that it is not wrong to try to be done. to get some of that money back through a fraudulent A recent case study is worth considering because it is claim. It is almost as if people feel they are getting back about an ordinary person. A gentleman and his wife something they are entitled to. Good people are, sadly, owned a 2007 Vauxhall Corsa that was in decent condition. doing bad things. He had held his licence for 17 years and had had no accidents, and his wife had held her licence for five years Sammy Wilson: The hon. Gentleman is right: there is and had had no accidents or claims. He had a nine-year that culture, which is encouraged by people’s experiences, no-claims bonus. In 2009-10, he paid £600, the next year their friends’ experiences and sometimes the advice they he paid £800 and the next year £6,200—no accidents, are given by their legal advisers, solicitors and so on. no claims, no difference. Another sad thing about that 241 Cost of Motor Insurance8 NOVEMBER 2011 Cost of Motor Insurance 242 case is that the gentleman has recently become unemployed, an investigation into the car insurance market with a and because of that his insurance premium has gone up. specific focus on Northern Ireland. We must robustly How does that make sense? establish why premiums have increased by a reported That case study reveals the impact of the postcode 40% in the 12 months to March 2011 and why insurance lottery, which is an issue that has not been raised costs are significantly higher in Northern Ireland than because it is difficult to do so. I mentioned that my very in comparable regions of Britain. Indeed, we must not first meeting was in a mosque. There is a huge community only assess that but redress it. The findings from the cohesion issue because people say, “The reason we are OFT must be robustly addressed and the resulting paying a lot is because of those people over there.” That measures must have teeth. is why I was so keen to get involved in this campaign at Some of the evidence produced has suggested that the beginning. The young men I met were living in an car insurance premiums in Northern Ireland have increased area with ridiculously high insurance premiums. by almost 73% in the past two years. The situation is even worse for younger drivers, whose premiums, according Graham Jones (Hyndburn) (Lab): People such as taxi to research, have increased by 112%. Young people face drivers have been particularly hit by this. As other severe difficulties in entering the job market, and the Members have said, taxi drivers’ premiums have risen prohibitively high cost of motor insurance is yet another exponentially and they are suffering greatly—far more barrier to their finding work. Only yesterday, I received in fact than the constituents who write to me because a letter from a constituent who highlighted a problem they are suffering. In my constituency, there is a second he had encountered with his son. He said that approximately issue with taxi drivers, and I wonder whether it is the three weeks ago he received a quote to renew his insurance case elsewhere. Very few companies now want to insure with his 18-year-old son on the policy, and to say that he taxi companies, and that is probably why the fees are was shocked at the price would be a gross understatement. more exorbitant. In my constituency, only one or two The price quoted was £2,488.92, which he simply could insurers will insure taxis in my postcode area. Is that not afford. He rang a number of insurance companies something that the hon. Gentleman is familiar with and and was quoted between £2,800 and £4,000 to cover his would like to comment on? son. The first company told him that it would drop the price to £2,200, but it was still beyond his means to pay Mr Ward: The hon. Gentleman makes a good point such an amount. about the branding of people. Whether it is taxi drivers My constituent said that the sad part of the situation or all those who live in the BD3 area, the assumption is is that his son has now been forced off the road due to that because they are from that area they are all contributing the exorbitant price of car insurance in Northern Ireland. to the high insurance premiums that we are paying. He will not be able to stay on in his part-time job, as his That is very unfair and also very dangerous as regards father’s working schedule does not allow him the time the cohesion of the wider community. to leave and collect him when he requires transport. My The report that we prepared concluded with a whole constituent feels strongly that something needs to be range of measures, and many Members have come up done to help young drivers to stay on the road and with additional measures. I conclude by again paying travel to their jobs, even if they are part-time, or even if tribute to the work of the Select Committee, which they are students pursuing their studies, and thereby do needs to keep driving this. The title of our report was their bit to help get the economy in that part of the “It can’t go on like this”, and we all know that it cannot world up and running again. He says that it was tough go on like this. If we all work together across the House to have to sit his son down and tell him that as from we can slay this monster. 15 November he will not be able to allow him to drive. That young boy not only showed remarkable courage 8.11 pm but is a very sensible young adult, and he is being penalised by insurance companies for the actions of Ms Margaret Ritchie (South Down) (SDLP): I others. It has been suggested that those companies are congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Liverpool, quick to label some young drivers as boy racers, and Riverside (Mrs Ellman) on tabling this motion for that needs to be addressed. debate. As the hon. Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon) said, some two weeks ago I had an Adjournment debate All these problems are compounded by the restricted on the cost of motor insurance in Northern Ireland. A range of companies offering premiums in Northern Minister from the Treasury responded on that occasion, Ireland, which limits competition and drives up prices. I and I found that useful, but many issues are involved in urge the Minister to address and where possible, working the rising cost of insurance premiums in Northern with others, to remove any barriers to companies that Ireland. wish to enter the market, particularly those in Northern Drivers in Northern Ireland are subject to excessively Ireland. Obviously, that means working with Ministers high insurance costs that are rapidly rising year on year. in the Northern Ireland Executive. I appreciate that the problems are not unique to Northern Two fundamental arguments are put forward to justify Ireland, but they are particularly striking in our case. the high costs of motor insurance in Northern Ireland: We have found in our research that consumers in Northern first, that Northern Ireland is a case apart because its Ireland have less choice of insurance providers, with demographics and road layouts bring an increased risk three times fewer companies offering car insurance. In of incidents on our roads; and secondly, that Northern August, as the hon. Member for Strangford stated, the Ireland’s legal system places a higher burden on insurers. Consumer Council for Northern Ireland launched a The evidence that Northern Ireland has a very young campaign to highlight the cost of car insurance, and I population is greatly exaggerated; indeed, we have a fully support that. The Minister is no doubt aware that proportion of young people similar to that found in the Office of Fair Trading subsequently agreed to undertake many regions in Britain. Likewise, a lack of motorway 243 Cost of Motor Insurance8 NOVEMBER 2011 Cost of Motor Insurance 244 coverage has been cited as a reason for increased premiums, my constituency have told me of their struggle to secure because statistically motorways are the safest road type. affordable insurance. They are understandably concerned However, maps show that Northern Ireland has a relatively about the discrepancy in insurance prices between Northern consistent motorway density compared with regions in Ireland and other regions in Britain. Households feel Britain and in Europe. Moreover, some of the fundamental that by having to pay excessive insurance fees, they are actuarial evidence regarding the number of accidents, being unduly discriminated against. That unfair practice claims and casualties on our highways weighs against has been in place for too long. It adversely affects the any of the debatable factors regarding demographics or young and the old who depend on their cars for work, road layout. Those facts must be kept at the forefront of particularly in areas where public transport provision is our minds when considering the claimed justification limited. Essentially, that means rural communities. There for the increased cost of premiums, which are rising at are, shall we say, certain locational issues. a time when we in Northern Ireland are experiencing a The broader context is that the economy is suffering, decline in the number of road traffic accidents. The with record numbers of young people out of work. numbers available for the latest year, 2010, show the That is exacerbated by people’s use of motor vehicles lowest number of road deaths since records began in being restricted. At this time of economic recession, we 1931. Naturally, every death on our roads is a tragedy, need a dynamic, mobile work force. Car insurance but we must commend the work done to improve safety. being so expensive puts up a barrier to economic success, There are some basic facts that are hard to reconcile especially for the young. The unemployment rate among with rising insurance costs. The number of road traffic young people is estimated to be 18%—almost one in accidents reported to the police service has dropped five cannot find a job. That compares with an overall over the past decade from nearly 40,000 per year in unemployment rate in Northern Ireland of 7.6%. Excessive 2000 to about 30,000 per year in 2009. The number of insurance premiums adversely affect young people and compensation claims is decreasing, whereas in England prevent them from offering the skill of driving to potential and Wales the numbers are rising. More specifically, employers. In these extremely challenging times, I ask according to a National Audit Office report published the Minister to consider any measures that would make at the beginning of the year, the number of claims insurance more affordable for young people, particularly reported to the compensation recovery unit fell by 23% when driving relates to their employment. in the decade up to 2009. In conclusion, insurance costs have a real impact on In short, the trend is clear: although accidents and people, both young and old, who need to be mobile for claims are decreasing, the cost of insurance is increasing. social and economic reasons. I hope that my short I ask the Minister again to give detailed consideration contribution has made clear the scale of the problem to this fundamental point. All these facts weigh heavily faced by motorists. I hope that I have given examples against the argument that the demographic or topographical that illustrate that parents are suffering from the undue factors in Northern Ireland justify the increasing cost of burden of being quoted high insurance costs for their insurance. Those factors are difficult to relate to the sons and daughters. They are not able to pay those costs draconian rise in the cost of insurance premiums. because of the limited financial means that they now have. I believe that the insurance industry must stabilise Sammy Wilson: The hon. Lady has done some impressive its premiums so that hard-pressed motorists get a fair research into the fall in accidents. It is clear from the deal when they purchase their motor vehicle insurance. statistics on road accidents and deaths that there has I seek assurances from the Minister that he recognises been a dramatic improvement even since four or five the problem and will act on a cross-departmental basis, as years ago. For that reason, we should agree that this the motion suggests. Supplementary to that, in the case issue is not about the number of accidents, the demography of Northern Ireland, I ask him to work directly with or the level of claims, but about the lack of competition Ministers in the Northern Ireland Executive to address in the market. It therefore needs to be addressed by the its particular problems in light of any recommendations Department for Business, Innovation and Skills and the that come from the Office of Fair Trading report later Office of Fair Trading. They must find out whether this year. collusion between the insurance companies has increased the price of insurance in Northern Ireland. 8.25 pm Ms Ritchie: I thank the hon. Gentleman for that John McDonnell (Hayes and Harlington) (Lab): I will helpful intervention. I agree that the research shows be as brief as I can be, because my right hon. Friend the clearly that the lack of competition in Northern Ireland Member for Leicester East (Keith Vaz) is clearly keen to has driven up the cost of insurance premiums. That is speak early and at length on the subject of his Adjournment an area that the Office of Fair Trading should focus on debate, and because everything has been said. Anybody in its investigation. It should drill down on the nature reading this debate in Hansard will be impressed by the and cost of insurance premiums in Northern Ireland. amount of work and time that individual Members We, as Members of Parliament for Northern Ireland, have spent performing research in their constituencies. will look at that. The hon. Gentleman, wearing his This subject is close to many of our hearts. other hat as a member of the Northern Ireland Executive, I wanted to speak because when constituents approach is no doubt working with Ministers in Whitehall to us, particularly young constituents, we have a duty to address those issues. The hon. Member for Strangford ensure that their voice is heard in this Chamber. I was has highlighted the legal issue, so I do not need to approached by a young man called Joshua Deacon, elaborate on that. who lives in the London borough of Hillingdon. He has Many people living on low incomes or in rural areas experienced high insurance costs. He did a mini survey can simply no longer afford to keep a car on the road. and a petition on the internet because he thought that As I have said, many young people and their parents in the same must be happening to his friends. He found 245 Cost of Motor Insurance8 NOVEMBER 2011 Cost of Motor Insurance 246 costs ranging from £2,000 up to about £20,000, which is should have been. So far, Co-operative Insurance and ludicrous. His survey showed that a number of young others have offered some voluntary schemes, but they people, particularly in my area, which is quite a geographical do not seem to have had the take-up that they should expanse, used their cars for work or to seek work, but have done. that such costs were preventing them from travelling The question, then, is how we move forward. We and driving them off the road. know that a range of solutions could be put in place, The other concern that emerged, which has been and that a technical solution could be introduced on a expressed by other Members, is that the higher the cost, voluntary basis to give people incentives and reduce the more people there are who just do not insure themselves. their costs. I believe that the next stage is to bring the Like the hon. Member for Bradford East (Mr Ward), I matter back to the Government. We have tried exhortation went out with my local police, and the first arrest was of in the past, but we need to try it again, as was said an uninsured young person. He was not driving particularly earlier. We need another meeting at which we bring all dangerously, but it was obvious from his driving that he the insurance companies together and exhort them to was young. When he was pulled over, he was found to consider financial incentives for young people. We have have no insurance. The worry, given what is happening such arrangements in acceptable behaviour contracts in in my constituency, is that as unemployment increases other areas. People could sign up to certain behaviour and incomes decrease, more and more people will be patterns if they so wished, which would enable us to unable to pay their insurance costs. As a result, there monitor them using technical solutions so that we could will be an increase in criminality. reduce their overall insurance costs. As a result of my young constituent’s efforts, a number Tessa Munt (Wells) (LD): I wonder whether, when of months ago I put down an early-day motion on this that is being considered, it might be possible to consider subject. The responses that I received from the insurance the circumstances that two or three of my constituents companies were exactly as have been reported here. have found themselves in. Young people have applied With regard to Northern Ireland, I think that there is a for insurance online and the insurance company has cartel in operation. One particular area of the country agreed a premium and formed a contract with those is being exploited as a result of the insurance companies young people to provide insurance, but has then come working together to produce higher rates. In fact, I back six or eight weeks later with a much increased believe that is happening more broadly as well. premium, ostensibly because something was originally I have received the same responses from insurance incorrect. That has certainly happened to young women companies as are mentioned in the report. They say that in my constituency with the Diamond insurance company. the figures are based on actuarial valuations and on the high level of accidents involving young people. We all John McDonnell: It is almost like the policy of excess understand that completely, but we cannot understand that has been developed for other insurance costs. I why the situation has not changed despite the fact that believe that the onus is now on the Government to bring we have been knocking the subject around for so long in the insurance companies in for a thorough discussion the House. I pay tribute to my hon. Friend the Member about how we can take forward voluntary arrangements. for Liverpool, Riverside (Mrs Ellman), who has persisted However, there will come a time, which I believe we are with it through the Transport Committee. Time and nearing, when if we cannot get in place voluntary again, we have come up with a list of suggestions, many arrangements and incentives that work, we will have to of which the hon. Member for Brecon and Radnorshire introduce regulation. (Roger Williams) listed. We have suggested graduated Like many other Members, I cannot cope any more licences, restrictions in use, curfew arrangements, limits with driving along the road and seeing shrines to people on the number of passengers and where they are located, who have died. The number in my area seemed to be and alcohol restrictions. In addition, we raised some peaking at one point, although I have not looked at the time ago the idea of black boxes and speed limiters recent statistics. A large number of young people were being inserted into cars. being killed on the roads, and we would drive down the road and see the bouquets of flowers and the pictures of Sammy Wilson: I can fully understand the hon. those young people. It relates to the point that the hon. Gentleman’s point about the cost of insurance premiums Member for East Antrim (Sammy Wilson) made about for young people, but does he not feel that imposing youthful exuberance—young people get their first car restrictions on freedom such as curfews on top of high and are out on the roads, and sometimes it goes to their insurance premiums would be unfair, even if it were heads. They might have their friends with them, and enforceable? For many young people, getting their driving unfortunately it often results in tragedy. licence is their ticket to freedom. To tell them that they cannot go out at night or have their friends in the car is Roger Williams: The hon. Gentleman is making a not fair, especially when most young people drive very powerful case. I know that the hon. Member for responsibly and do not race around the roads causing East Antrim (Sammy Wilson) made a point about a accidents. restriction of freedom, but surely that is the whole point of a driving licence. People have to pass a test, and John McDonnell: I fully agree, and that was why, maybe there ought to be another test for them to pass when the proposal for black boxes came up, I thought it before they can have unlimited access to a car. was the ideal solution. It would enable someone to demonstrate that they were driving carefully and not at John McDonnell: It is true that we need to consider a speed. I thought that could have been the technical whole range of measures. I believe that we need to make solution, or at least could have moved us a bit further another attempt to find voluntary arrangements with on. I cannot for the life of me understand why it has not the insurance companies, setting out a range of activities been taken up by the insurance industry as well as it that people can sign up to and that we can technically 247 Cost of Motor Insurance8 NOVEMBER 2011 Cost of Motor Insurance 248 monitor. In that way, we could reduce insurance premiums. For many, the car is and will remain the essential way However, if that is not brought to fruition, we may well of getting around. For some—and, as we have heard, have to move on to regulation. That could mean more particularly young people—the fast-rising cost of insurance testing, and in fact that extra testing need not just be for could make the difference between taking up a job that young people. It could be much wider than that, because requires a car and being a burden on taxpayers by living it is not just young people who are affected, even on benefits. With job vacancies so scarce, transport to though the statistics that the insurance companies produce access opportunity needs to be affordable—that relates demonstrate the high number of accidents among young to motor insurance just as it relates to bus and rail fares. drivers in their first couple of years after passing their The sky-high cost of motor insurance for young test. people has been an important part of the Opposition’s In addition, if regulation is to be introduced, and if it policy review. We urge the Government to implement involves imposing technical solutions, the insurance the Committee’s recommendations to improve the education companies should bear some of the cost. If it is not and safety awareness of young drivers and to consider willing to work with us in promoting voluntary solutions further changes to the driving test. effectively, it should bear the cost. It is important to stress that all drivers will benefit To return to an earlier point, this is about reducing from having safer younger drivers on the road—that costs, but it is also about reducing deaths and accidents. point was well made in the debate. Equally importantly, That does not just involve young people, because collateral much has been heard about the potential of the black damage is also done to pedestrians and others. The box and the relative lack of take-up so far. I am sure House has addressed that significant issue effectively in that the Minister will join me in praising insurance the debate tonight, and now it is over to us to work with providers that use black boxes, but will he make clear the Government to get the insurance companies to what he is doing to encourage greater take-up of the agree a strategy that we can monitor over the coming technology among providers? year or so. We can see whether that works, and take There is no excuse for breaking the rules, but as legislative action if it does not to demonstrate our premiums rise we know that related criminal behaviour seriousness. is at risk of increasing, potentially undermining the progress that the previous Administration made in tackling fraud and driving without insurance. The Association 8.35 pm of British Insurers recorded a 9% increase in fraud. John Woodcock (Barrow and Furness) (Lab/Co-op): Mike Penning: Would the hon. Gentleman be kind May I add my congratulations to my hon. Friend the enough to tell the House what measures the previous Member for Liverpool, Riverside (Mrs Ellman) on securing Administration took against uninsured driving? This this important and well informed debate, and to the Government introduced the continuous insurance policy. Committee on producing its excellent and timely report? The eye-watering rises in the cost of motor insurance John Woodcock: The hon. Gentleman knows that the in the past few years have been one more burden on continuous insurance policy was a measure that was set families already hit by high prices at the pump, food out by the Labour party and which he has taken forward, inflation and soaring energy costs. Earlier in the year, which we welcome. According to the Motor Insurers’ annual increases in insurance premiums were running Bureau, however, there has been a 25% fall in insurance as high as 40%. Although the AA reports that by fraud and uninsured driving over the past five years, September the figure had dropped to around 16%, which we welcome and want to see continue. premium increases still far outstrip inflation. The average On tackling uninsured drivers, the Minister mentioned premium of £921, which my hon. Friend highlighted, the continuous insurance enforcement scheme, but to means that more than half an average monthly take-home work effectively that needs the necessary tools to do the salary is used simply to insure a car. enforcing, so will he tell the House, either now or during We know that those likely to be earning least are his speech, what level of resource the DVLA has put paying most for their insurance. As we have heard, aside to pursue and enable the prosecution of transgressors, average premiums for young drivers are more than and how many drivers who ignore official reminders £2,000. Understandably, motorists resent those huge that their insurance has expired have so far been given a increases. The overwhelming majority of careful, responsible fixed penalty notice under the new scheme? drivers feel that they are subsidising the careless, the Last week, the House had the opportunity to debate reckless and the uninsured. Increasingly, they are aware referral fees paid by claims management companies and that their premiums are increasing as a result of fraudulent personal injury lawyers to insurance firms in return for or frivolous personal injury claims for non-existent or the details of potential claimants. For the past five or pre-existing conditions. six years, these fees have greased the wheels of a perceived Although the Government should not get into the compensation culture, encouraging claims that have business of setting insurance premiums, Ministers have little realistic chance of success or which are simply a responsibility to ensure that the market works fairly fraudulent. The cost of those claims feed directly back and in the interests of consumers. The insurance industry into the premiums that all motorists pay, so I, too, pay has made a strong case that the 75% increase in the tribute to the work done by my right hon. Friend the number of compensation claims in the past five years is Member for Blackburn (Mr Straw) on this issue. His a key factor in driving up premiums. Increased access to investigation into the scale of the problem and his legal redress for genuine injury is a good thing, but private Member’s Bill put pressure on Ministers to add responsible motorists paying for insurance fraud is clearly clauses on referral fees, at the last moment, to the Legal not. Aid, Sentencing and Punishment of Offenders Bill last 249 Cost of Motor Insurance8 NOVEMBER 2011 Cost of Motor Insurance 250 week. However, as we made clear then, the Government useful to our constituents. I cannot say that about parts have so far missed the opportunity to crack down of the speech by the hon. Member for Barrow and adequately. Furness (John Woodcock), particularly when it became I shall list what measures the Government have so far party political. That is not what this evening’s debate rejected: making the soliciting for and payment of fees was about, especially considering that the previous in road traffic accident cases a criminal offence; outlawing Administration were in government for 13 years and the blight of unsolicited phone calls and text messages; many of the measures he now asks us to bring forward strengthening the rules on data protection and third-party could have been introduced then. The hon. Member for capture; and tightening the rules for whiplash claims. It Poplar and Limehouse (Jim Fitzpatrick), a former Front- is unfortunate that as industry practice has been shown Bench Transport spokesman was much better in his to be driving up costs for law-abiding motorist, the tone; he never used to read out a speech that was Government are ducking their responsibilities on this written before and that did not contribute anything to issue. If the Minister is serious about keeping premiums the debate. as low as possible, I hope that, even at this late stage, he To answer what was probably the only sensible point will prevail upon Justice Ministers to change the that the hon. Member for Barrow and Furness raised— Government’s position. about continuous insurance enforcement—60% of all The Select Committee made the sensible suggestion those written to, having been shown to be uninsured, that the Government examine international experience have responded positively and were either given a SORN— on restraining claims numbers. It is disappointing that statutory off-road notice—or said that they would insure. Ministers have refused its idea of a proper study. I hope About £122,000 has been picked up in fines, and 250,000 that they will reconsider. The Committee also rightly penalty notices have been issued—in excess of what we pointed to the importance of road safety as another key expected at this stage of the new piece of legislation. factor influencing insurance premiums. Despite last Let us move on to the general debate, led so excellently week’s horrific tragedy—the Minister visited the scene, by the hon. Member for Liverpool, Riverside. Everyone at the M5 in Somerset, at the weekend—Britain continues will be pleased to know that we shall not divide the House to have the safest roads in Europe and among the safest on the motion. There is an issue about the committee in the world. However, the first two quarters of this year that is being formed, but I will come back to that in a have seen increases in deaths compared with the same few moments. Many of the issues I see in my constituency point the previous year. A continuation of that trend correspondence have been alluded to brilliantly in this would mean 2011 would be the first year since 2003 to evening’s debate. see a rising death toll on Britain’s roads. To add to the anecdotal evidence, a member of my It is worrying that these upward ticks in road deaths own staff was in a road traffic accident the other have come at a time when spending on road safety evening. She was hit from behind; the person got out of campaigns has been cut. If the trend of safer roads were the car and was very amenable. My staff member said, to reverse, the country’s principal concern—everyone’s “How are you? Are you okay? Do you want to go principal concern—would, of course, be the tragic human through the insurance process?” The other lady said, cost seen so vividly this week. We know that a knock-on “I’d like to pay you privately because otherwise my effect of less safe roads would be further upward pressure premiums will go through the roof.” Everything was on insurance premiums. That raises this question: has sorted out fine; no contact was made with the insurers the Minister estimated what the impact would be on or the police. However, she received a text message road safety and on premiums of his proposal to scrap asking “Would you like to claim for the injury that you the annual MOT—a move that could lead to 800,000 had?” A member of the public had obviously informed cars that are dangerous to drive being left on the roads those whom I described to the Committee as ambulance for up to a year longer? chasers. Apparently it is not just the insurers who are Motorists are feeling the squeeze. Many face being passing information around; others also think that they priced out of their cars and, by extension, out of their can secure substantial earnings from such events. jobs. As the Transport Committee has so effectively set Several Members paid tribute to the right hon. Member out, those motorists want to know that their Government for Blackburn (Mr Straw). I thank him, in his absence, are doing what they can to enable lower insurance costs. for contacting me to say that he could not be present If Ministers wish to prove that they are not out of touch this evening. We have worked closely for many years on with those concerns, they need to set out how they will many subjects when our respective parties have been in go further. opposition and in government, and I believe that the motion has opened the Government’s eyes to the possibility 8.46 pm of using his Bill for this purpose. There will be of course The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Transport be attempts to find loopholes, but it is the Government’s (Mike Penning): For colleagues who have been here responsibility to ensure that any legislation is fit for throughout the debate, may I say—I know it is not my purpose. brief to do so—that my thoughts and prayers go to the I believe that 11, if not 12, Members spoke in the family of the Red Arrows pilot who was killed this debate—that does not include those who have intervened— afternoon? Our servicemen do a lot for us. I say this as and it will be impossible for me to respond to all the colleagues might not know that, sadly, this pilot died—the points that they raised, but I will of course write to all second fatality in the Red Arrows this year. those whose questions I have not had time to answer. This afternoon’s debate has been excellent—led brilliantly My hon. Friend the Member for Lincoln (Karl by the Chair of the Transport Select Committee, the McCartney) made an important point about uninsured hon. Member for Liverpool, Riverside (Mrs Ellman). drivers. Uninsured driving is a criminal offence, and I In general, the debate has been sensible, measured and am sure that no Member would condone it, but given 251 Cost of Motor Insurance8 NOVEMBER 2011 Cost of Motor Insurance 252 that it contributes only £30 to the average premium, Many colleagues, including the hon. Member for there must be many other factors in the market. I see Hayes and Harlington (John McDonnell), have said we that the hon. Member for South Down (Ms Ritchie) is need to do more about the insurers, and I agree. I present, and I shall comment on the position in Northern certainly do bring the insurers around the table, and I Ireland shortly, but the fact remains that that £30 is not give them a very hard time. After all, they want things the reason that premiums have been shooting through from me. They wanted the continuous insurance; they the roof—although we have seen some reduction in have been calling for that for years, and they have got it. recent months. They also want access to DVLA data in order to try to Nevertheless, notwithstanding our concern about the alleviate fraud, both intentional and unintentional. size of premiums, we must in no circumstances condone People ask me, “What do you mean by ‘unintentional uninsured driving, which plagues not only our constituents fraud’?” Well, I am a dad, and I was asked whether I who pay their premiums but the police. Like the hon. would put my daughter on the insurance as an additional Member for Bradford East (Mr Ward), I have been out driver. I had to look very carefully at whether she was with the local police force many times, and I am sure an additional driver or the main driver, but most parents that anyone else who has done so will confirm that would not know the difference, so we need to educate when the police pull drivers over for being uninsured, them on that. They think they are helping their young they will almost certainly pick them up for another people by naming them as an additional driver in those offence which, in many cases, will have nothing to do circumstances, but if their son or daughter is, in fact, with driving offences. People who wish to break the law not the additional driver, that insurance will be invalid, in that way often wish to break it in other ways. We and the insurer will almost certainly find that out—and must help the police in every possible way to ensure that if the son or daughter is involved in a crash, they will such fraud is dealt with, because driving without insurance almost certainly not be covered, and anybody else involved is indeed fraudulent. in the accident with them will also be penalised. We must also help the insurers, who will doubtless be Some Members who were present for the debate have monitoring this debate and will realise that they are the moved on to other things, so our proceedings now feel a pariahs: the nasty, horrible people to whom we must little like an Adjournment debate, where people have pay our premiums. I suppose that I should declare an not returned for the concluding speeches. That is a interest at this stage. I have two daughters between the shame, because this is not an Adjournment debate; it is, ages of 17 and 25, and the premium is high. I am proud rather, a proper debate of the House with a motion to say that they have managed to work hard throughout before it. Perhaps as Members get more used to debates their time at university, and that the work that they have such as this, more of them will return to hear the done has helped to pay the insurance. I have not had to concluding remarks. bear the whole burden. I certainly will work with the devolved Governments The hon. Member for Bolton West (Julie Hilling) in respect of their responsibilities. Responding to the mentioned the crass decision by the European Court of comments of the hon. Member for South Down Justice that gender could not be taken into account by (Ms Ritchie), I have serious concerns about the market insurers deciding premiums, although, as we all know, as it operates in Northern Ireland. I am not responsible premiums are based on risk. I find that astonishing, for the market, however; that is a Treasury matter, because the figures clearly show that, sadly, boys aged which is why the Treasury took the recent debate. I also between 17 and 25 are 10 times more likely to be understand that the Northern Ireland regulators are involved in accidents than girls of a similar age. One of conducting a review, and I can assure the hon. Lady the most frightening pieces of evidence that has been that if there is any evidence of collusion in the market—if given to me while I have had the honour of being the any cartels are operating there or here—we will come Minister responsible for these matters is that the most down on them like a ton of bricks, as would be only dangerous activity in which a young lady can engage in right and proper. this country is sitting next to a boy aged between 17 and As the Transport Committee has concluded, there is 25 who is driving a car. not just one simple solution to this problem. I agree, for Jim Dowd: Is not the problem with the European instance, that there is a postcode lottery. In some ways, approach the assumption that every member of a certain that is similar to the gender issue we have just discussed. group will behave in a certain way? It is a generalised Some postcodes cover large areas; that is certainly the rather than a personalised approach. The assessment is case in my part of the world. It is fundamentally wrong being made not on the basis of what a particular for people to be penalised because of the road or individual who wants to buy a particular product is neighbourhood in which they happen to live. Insurance likely to do, but on the basis of what people in a calculations used to be based on theft and damage rates, particular category are likely to do. Even if there is no but modern cars are very difficult to steal. Joyriders still evidence against an individual, that individual will be steal ordinary cars, but most vehicle thefts are of high-value subject to the same penalty. cars that are stolen to order. That is a completely different kind of theft from the thefts that affect premiums. Mike Penning: I completely agree—just as I often Let us consider why premiums are so high. It is not agreed with the hon. Gentleman during the many years just to do with uninsured drivers. It is also to do with when we served on the Health Committee together. The ambulance chasers. Some 50% of all personal injury actuaries have to be able to look at risk in general; claims are made on car insurance. How can that be right otherwise we will all be put into the same pot, which is when, as we have heard this evening, we have some of unfair to those who are in lower-risk categories. I have the safest roads in the world, and certainly the safest concerns that addressing this issue will lead to premiums roads in Europe? Our killed and seriously-injured rates being increased, not reduced. are extremely low, although we need to get them even 253 Cost of Motor Insurance8 NOVEMBER 2011 Cost of Motor Insurance 254 lower. The truth of the matter is that most of these parents, grandparents and sisters doing that, but someone claims, many of which are fraudulent, are not reported who gets into a car marked “driving instructor” should to the police. Very often they are reported after the not have to look for a little badge on the windscreen incident; Members have referred to constituents saying that says that the person is a trainee. These people people followed up on incidents the following day. The should be qualified driving instructors. The industry hon. Member for Lewisham West and Penge (Jim Dowd) supports me on this and we will do this. There also has touched on this in his speech. The police would never to be an ongoing training programme for driving instructors. have been called in such cases; it will never be on the Some instructors took their qualifications many years records of the police that that sort of thing has taken ago, and we need to make sure that they are au fait with place. Some countries in Europe, including Germany, what we want from the driving test, although we also have carefully considered the speed that someone would want them to earn an income. have had to be travelling to be in an accident before they As we have heard today, there are also things that can claim for whiplash. I was with the relevant German happen to people suddenly when they pass their driving Minister at a conference recently, and we discussed this test. Clearly, some people—young people in particular, and other measures, particularly priority. The evidence but not all of them—appear to have some kind of is that this does not appear to be working in Germany lobotomy when they get behind the wheel of a car. I am simply because people are increasing the speed that they talking about highly intelligent young people who are claim they were travelling at before the accident. perfect role models in every other aspect of their life, and then they get behind the wheel of a car. Sadly, as John Woodcock: I just want the Minister to set out has been discussed, testosterone is one of the leading why he has rejected our calls to restrict whiplash claims, factors. Drink and drugs are involved, but testosterone given the seriousness of this problem in forcing up is one of the big problems here. insurance premiums. Will he not reconsider? In my constituency, the place where most people pass Mike Penning: I have not rejected that; this was done their test is St Albans. Between my constituency and by a colleague in the Ministry of Justice, as it is a legal St Albans is a rather large motorway called the M1, and matter. However, I completely agree with my colleague, to get back from the test centre, people have to cross it. as he is a legal person and I am not. There are legal That means that someone could be driving for the first differences between Germany and this country.Everything time on their own and as they turn left or right to come is possible, and this Parliament can do whatever it off the A414 they will be on the M1. I think we need to wants to do. [Interruption.] Perhaps that is not the give people, particularly young people, the opportunity case—I see some of my Eurosceptic friends in the to learn how to drive on the motorway before they pass House this evening. There are certain things that I their test. That is why we will pass regulations to allow would like to be doing in my Department that Europe qualified driving instructors to take learners on to prevents me from doing. motorways. Can I make that compulsory? No, I cannot because some counties have no motorways, so it would As we have heard across the House today, insurers be discriminatory to do so, but we will give qualified have to take responsibility and say, “No, we’ll take you instructors the opportunity to do that. to court and we will challenge this.” They should not We need to make sure that the test is not the endgame, just settle out of court because it happens to be cheaper but not—in my opinion or that of the Government—to than the possible consequences of going to court. make it compulsory to take post-test qualifications. Immediately we start to do that, the no win, no fee Pass Plus was a partial success, but was never really ambulance chasers will look very carefully at their rolled out properly. cases, and people who should genuinely get their compensation will get it and those who are swinging a Jim Dowd: Before I came to the House, I used to leg, as my grandfather would say, will not. I shall refer drive extensively on the motorway network—in my back to my time on the Select Committee on Health, company car, for those who were listening earlier—and because it is not just in this area that we have this the idea of the odd learner turning up on the motorway problem with insurance. Our hospitals, in particular, is strange. Traffic on our motorways travels at much tend to settle out of court rather than challenging higher speeds generally. Would it not be better to allow claims, and that is costing the taxpayer and the NHS an people to pass the traditional test and then take an absolute fortune, so this is a culture that we have to turn additional period of tuition on the motorway, rather around. than allow someone who might have been behind the Hon. Members have touched on other aspects in the wheel of a car for only two or three hours suddenly to report and the evidence to the Select Committee. I have turn up on a motorway alongside juggernauts and significantly changed the driving test, the practical and fast-driving cars? The Minister will know better than the theory, since my appointment, and I intend to anyone that the average speed on motorways is much change it even more. I have said it before and I will say it higher than the 70 mph limit. again that people are currently taught to pass a test; they are not taught to drive. They are not taught to Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo): Order. drive safely for themselves and for others, and we have Minister, I realise that driving on motorways is a very to make sure that we have qualified driving instructors important subject, but I have a feeling that you were and that everybody knows they are qualified when they going to bring the debate back to the cost of motoring. get into that car. One change we are going to make—I hope that the Select Committee will agree with me on Mike Penning: An integral part of driving and the this—is that someone who is not a qualified driving cost of insurance is how people are qualified to drive. instructor will not be able to take someone out on their That is why qualifications, as well as the ordinary own to teach them to drive. I am not going to stop driving test, are specifically mentioned in the report we 255 Cost of Motor Insurance8 NOVEMBER 2011 Cost of Motor Insurance 256 are discussing, which is why I was speaking to the issue. Karl McCartney: I understand what my hon. Friend is However, I shall take your guidance, Madam Deputy saying about points. Is there not also a need to make it Speaker, and steer towards more detailed work on the socially unacceptable to drive while uninsured? Would black box. it perhaps be prudent to consider a prison sentence for people who seem determined to do it three, four of five Madam Deputy Speaker: Order. I am very sorry, but I times or who have been involved in a serious accident was trying to ensure that the Minister stayed where he while uninsured? wanted to be, whereas the hon. Member for Lewisham West and Penge (Jim Dowd) was tempting him away. I Mike Penning: I thank my hon. Friend for that point. do not need a gentle rebuke from the Minister; I thought We will continue to look at the penalties involved. I was helping him. Those of us who came through the drink-driving campaigns of the ’70s and ’80s will remember how we turned Mike Penning: I know you too well ever to rebuke drink-drivers into pariahs, but that involved educating you, Madam Deputy Speaker, and I would never be led the public first, then using a big stick. We did the same astray by the hon. Gentleman. with seat belts, and we now need to do it with drug-driving I do not agree with the hon. Gentleman. We have a as well as with uninsured driving. We will continue to situation in which young people—or, indeed, anyone— look at this, but, at the end of the day, it is for the passing their test today can go on the motorway. There magistrates and the courts to decide how they interpret are no restrictions on that, and we need to give them the the law. They have a degree of autonomy, which is why necessary skills. I have a full car, full motorbike, HGV so many drivers who have more than 12 points have and tank licence to boot, and I have driven on the kept their licence. It is a matter for the courts to interpret motorway in all types of vehicle, so I understand. I have the special needs of the people involved, and perhaps an H licence. The hon. Gentleman was indicating from the lawyers who represent them are also a factor. I was a sedentary position, “What is a tank licence?”—it is an shocked when I saw the figures, and it was my own H licence for tracked vehicles. Department that released them. Let me touch on issues of technology. As we heard I know that the hon. Member for Liverpool, Riverside earlier, some insurers have been using technology, is going to respond to the debate. Her Committee has particularly the black box. The Co-operative insurance produced an excellent report, and we have had an company, which was mentioned earlier, has a scheme excellent debate. I look forward to implementing many that encourages people to take the box in their car, and of the measures that have been mentioned, so that our it monitors very carefully what speed one is travelling roads can continue to be the safest in Europe and at, what time of day one is driving—nearly everything. I among the safest in the world. have been pushing quite extensively with insurers to roll that out further. It is the obvious way forward. If people 9.12 pm are given the responsibility of a driving licence, they can be given the opportunity of responsibility. However, Mrs Ellman: We have heard many excellent contributions insurance companies have to be transparent. We have to this evening. Members have reflected different experiences, know why the premiums are what they are and how but all have given us the same message: insurance they can best be broken down so that the public, when premiums are too high, the insurance industry is they look at their premium, know exactly what they are dysfunctional and more must be done. I recognise the getting for their money. If there is a discount, we need work that the Minister has been doing, particularly on to know exactly what it is and that if the person who uninsured driving, on referral fees, and on improving takes out that policy sticks rigidly to the agreement their driving standards. I am pleased that the insurance sector premium will not shoot up the following year or month. has now adopted the Select Committee’s recommendation to fund a specialised unit in police service to detect and In conclusion, I think this has been a very sensible act on fraud. debate. I welcome the report from the Committee chaired by the hon. Member for Liverpool, Riverside and I I have listened carefully to what the Minister has said, think that we can agree on most things. We have many, and I recognise his good will and commitment. I do not many Committees sitting already; one more would be wish to divide the House on the motion tonight, but I quite difficult. We meet regularly on a cross-party basis must warn him that the Committee will continue its to discuss these matters, and myriad Departments can scrutiny, and we look forward to the next occasion on be involved, depending on the issue in question. which we can question him on what has been done in his Department and across government, because that is At the moment, we are doing a great deal of work on the only way we will make progress on this important penalties, which I have not yet touched on, and on the issue. question of whether fines are the answer. The Secretary of State for Work and Pensions has already announced Question put and agreed to. that he is going to allow fines to be increased for those Resolved, on benefits. At the moment, the figure is £5, but that That this House expresses concern over the large increase in will increase to £25. I personally think that, as well as the cost of motor insurance in recent years, including in relation looking at increasing fines, we need to look at the to young drivers; welcomes the report by the Transport Committee points. In most cases, people will be prepared to pay a on the cost of motor insurance (HC 591) and its continuing fine, but they might find the prospect of getting additional inquiry into the reasons for this increase; notes that factors explaining the cost of motor insurance include the number and points on their licence more of a deterrent. They might cost of personal injury claims arising from road accidents, assessment decide that getting an extra six points, rather than just of risk, fraud, and uninsured driving; notes that the Government three, might mean losing their licence. I hope that such has taken some steps to deal with these issues, including a ban on a move might prevent more people from driving while referral fees in personal injury cases, but that more could be done; uninsured. further notes that Ministerial responsibility for these issues is split 257 8 NOVEMBER 2011 Business without Debate 258 across several departments; and calls on the Government to EUROPEAN UNION DOCUMENTS establish a cross-departmental Ministerial committee on reducing the cost of motor insurance and to publish a plan for dealing with Motion made, and Question put forthwith (Standing the different aspects of this problem during this Parliament. Order No. 119(11)),

Business without Debate REFORM OF THE COMMON FISHERIES POLICY That this House takes note of European Union Documents DELEGATED LEGISLATION No. 12519/11, relating to a Commission Communication—Reform Motion made, and Question put forthwith (Standing of the Common Fisheries Policy, and No. 12514/11 and Addenda Order No. 118(6)), 1 to 3, relating to a Draft Regulation on the Common Fisheries Policy; and supports the Government’s view that fundamental reform of the EU fisheries policy is required to deliver the STATISTICS BOARD legislative changes necessary to achieve healthy fish stocks, a That the draft Statistics and Registration Service Act 2007 prosperous fishing industry and a healthy marine environment.— (Disclosure of Pupil Information by Welsh Ministers) Regulations (James Duddridge.) 2011, which were laid before this House on 19 July, be approved.— (James Duddridge.) Question agreed to. Question agreed to. Motion made, and Question put forthwith (Standing Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo): We now Order No. 118(6)), come to motion 9. There is a small error in the motion as printed on the Order Paper. It should refer to the STATISTICS BOARD motion in the name of Mr Peter Lilley, not Sir George That the draft Statistics and Registration Service Act 2007 Young, relating to the House of Commons Members’ (Disclosure of Value Added Tax Information) Regulations 2011, Fund. I will therefore ask the House to consider the which were laid before this House on 15 September, be approved.— motion in the amended form. (James Duddridge.) Question agreed to. Motion made, and Question put forthwith (Standing DELEGATED LEGISLATION Order No. 118(6)), Ordered,

NATIONAL HEALTH SERVICE That the Motion in the name of Mr Peter Lilley relating to the House of Commons Members’ Fund shall be treated as if it That the draft Health and Social Care Act 2008 (Regulated related to an instrument subject to the provisions of Standing Activities) (Amendment) Regulations 2011, which were laid before Order No. 118 (Delegated Legislation Committees) in respect of this House on 10 October, be approved.—(James Duddridge.) which notice of a motion has been given that the instrument be Question agreed to. approved.—(James Duddridge.) 259 8 NOVEMBER 2011 Yemen 260

Yemen The World Bank has cut back on aid, freezing its £500 million programme and citing the uncertainty in Motion made, and Question proposed, That this House the political and security situation. As the Minister will do now adjourn.—(James Duddridge.) know if he has followed the deliberations on Yemen in 9.15 pm the House, the concern has always been that countries of good will come together, as they did under the Keith Vaz (Leicester East) (Lab): It is a great pleasure previous Government when the former Prime Minister for me, though a sad pleasure, to raise in the House yet held a conference concerning Yemen, and the Friends again the situation in Yemen. I am delighted to see the of Yemen donated billions of dollars to Yemen, but at Minister of State, Foreign and Commonwealth Office, the end of the day very little of that money finds its way the hon. Member for Taunton Deane (Mr Browne) at to the Yemenis. the Dispatch Box to keep the House informed of developments in Yemen. So we have a power vacuum. President Saleh has been in office for many, many years. I have met him on My attachment to Yemen comes from the fact that it many occasions and the Foreign Secretary met him just is the country of my birth. My parents having been before the Arab spring and the protests began. He is a born in Mumbai in India travelled to Aden in south president who has been very supportive of the present Yemen, where I, my sister, my hon. Friend the Member Government, but a president nevertheless who made it for Walsall South (Valerie Vaz) and my other sister were clear that he wished to leave the country’s presidency, born. For the first nine years of my life I lived in Yemen. vacate his position and give way to a Government of I have returned to Yemenover the years, having established national unity. We need to resolve the impasse. Because the all-party Yemen group. It is a country to which I feel of the bombing that occurred in the presidential palace, an emotional and physical attachment, because of the President Saleh went to Saudi Arabia and the situation kindness that was shown to me and my family and the became a little calmer, but it has become worse again. way in which that country has sought to develop over the past quarter of a century. Why does this matter? The situation matters to us I am sorry to say that the situation in Yemen is hugely because what happens in Sana’a today may well yet again at a crisis level. That is despite the good happen on the streets of London, so the counter-terrorism work of successive British Governments. I pay tribute agenda is extremely important. That is why I have in particular to the Foreign Secretary, the Secretary of welcomed the support that the American Government State for International Development, the Minister of State, gave to the Yemeni security forces, donating £90,000 Department for International Development, the right worth of public order equipment in order to train hon. Member for Rutland and Melton (Mr Duncan), members who were there to provide support. The reason our ambassador in Sana’a, Jon Wilks and Joanna Reid, we are so interested in that country is that al-Qaeda in who heads the DFID project there. All those people who the Arabian Peninsula is based in Yemen. There are are still in that country in turmoil show what is best about people in that country who not only want to destabilise Britain. A commitment made by Ministers at the Dispatch Yemen and therefore the middle east, but want to Box and at numerous conferences in the past decade has export their brand of terrorism to other parts of the been followed through by exceptional public servants. world. Tackling terrorism is a key factor in trying to deal with the situation there. The political crisis that we are seeing shows a central Government in Yemen who are weak, peaceful protests I was heartened to hear from the Prime Minister at that are turned into violence and, since the start of this the Liaison Committee that at a meeting of the National year, hundreds of people dead and thousands injured Security Council, the Secretaries of State of all the across this impoverished country. At least 94 children major Departments focused on the situation in Yemen. are known to have died since the start of the year. That pleases me, having raised the matter on so many Recent reports from places such as Taiz, a southern occasions. Because Yemendoes not have the oil resources town that has always had a tradition of law and order—a of a Libya or the punch power of a country such as real civil society—reveal that it has become a place of Saudi Arabia, it is easily forgotten. I was heartened to lawlessness. Only last Wednesday seven civilians were know that at the highest levels of our Government, the killed in Taiz, including two children. Prime Minister and senior Ministers were prepared to The background to the events has always been that have that discussion and set out a roadmap. Yemenis a poor country, but we now have a humanitarian How do we deal with the situation? That is what I crisis. Some 7.5 million people struggle to find enough hope the Minister will tell the House about tonight. We to eat each day; 320,000 people have been displaced in need somehow to move on the good work that we have the north and 100,000 in the south. Yemen is the done in the international debate that we are having and poorest country in the middle east, with 40% of Yemenis the pressure that we are applying in the Security Council, living off less than £1.25 a day. In Yemen there are with an excellent resolution sponsored by the United 3.6 million children under the age of five, 43% of whom Kingdom recently about the situation in Yemen. We are underweight and 58% of whom have had their have to turn those resolutions into good deeds. growth stunted. There are acute water shortages, and That means that we need to send support for the UN inflation and unemployment are rocketing. One in three envoy, and as I have said for the past six months and Yemenis go hungry every night. It has the third highest seriously believe, we need to send to Yemen three wise malnutrition rate in the world. people, one representing the UN, one representing the So the background to the current situation of unease Government, and one representing the European Union, and crisis is the humanitarian catastrophe. I was told to negotiate directly with the president and the Opposition recently at a meeting with the Yemeni Foreign Minister to try to bring all sides together. It is clearly something that 32 schools were closed in Sana’a due to military that cannot be done just by the Yemeni Government occupation and that there are severe electricity shortages. and the Yemeni people. The Gulf Co-operation Council 261 Yemen8 NOVEMBER 2011 Yemen 262 and the Saudi Arabian Government have tried and debate. I start by paying tribute to you, Mr Speaker, for failed. My message to the Minister tonight is that we your recent visit to India—it is not the topic under cannot allow the situation to drift and eventually Yemen consideration, but it was mentioned by the right hon. to break up into civil war. Member for Leicester East (Keith Vaz)—which was The picture I have painted is bleak, but we must not greatly appreciated by the Foreign Office and Parliament. forget the courage of the Yemeni people. The country is I pay tribute to the right hon. Gentleman, a former awash with weapons, yet peaceful protesters are going Foreign Office Minister himself, for his long-standing out and trying to bring international attention to what interest in Yemen, which is born of his personal is happening. There is a long history of peaceful protest commitment to the country and a very contemporary in the Arab world. My first memory of Yemen is of interest. It is a constant reminder to the House and the standing after school one day on the top floor of the Foreign and Commonwealth Office of the importance block flats where we lived and seeing my first political of Yemen to Britain’s national interests. protest. A group of Yemeni students were walking The British Government have a long-standing through the centre of Malah and protesting about relationship with Yemen, and we have worked with its the level English teaching in their schools. I went to the Government and our partners in the international balcony and watched that amazing protest. There is a community for some years to pursue security, prosperity long history of peaceful protest in Yemen, but not a and democracy in the country. The current situation is history that ends with the violence we have seen. of increasing concern, however, and I am grateful for We must come to the aid of the Yemeni people. this opportunity to lay out comprehensively before the I know that the Minister is very busy—he now has House the British Government’s current assessment. responsibility for India, in addition to his large responsibilities all over the world—and that this is not As the right hon. Gentleman has already said, Yemen his primary area of concern as a Foreign Office Minister, is in a sad state today. The political process is stalled, but he has come to the Dispatch Box today because he the economy is in tatters and ordinary Yemenis are represents the Foreign Office. When he goes back to his suffering greatly. Security is fragile, violence is worsening fellow Ministers, he must tell his right hon. and hon. and the country is fragmented and divided. Al-Qaeda in Friends that the House is debating Yemen today because the Arabian Peninsula will exploit and is exploiting that we believe that tomorrow will be even worse. instability. The country will take a long time to recover, The good news is that in a few days’ time I will and the British Government are profoundly concerned welcome Tawakkal Karman, the first Yemeni to win the by Yemen’s decline, a concern that is reflected at the Nobel peace prize, to the House of Commons, where highest levels of the Government and in the interest she will talk with colleagues. Because of the House’s being taken by the most senior Ministers. wonderful structure of all-party groups, the all-party Yemen is stuck in political stalemate. The momentum group on Yemen has been able to visit the country behind the valuable initiative of the Gulf Co-operation almost every year, but we have not done so for the past Council—GCC—to broker a political settlement leading year and a half. I am assured by the President and the to a managed transition has been lost, and over the ambassador that it is safe to visit but, as I pointed out past 10 months we have seen widespread demonstrations to the ambassador, even the President was not safe in throughout Yemen calling for President Saleh to step the presidential palace. I am not sure that they could down and for democratic change. Tragically, the guarantee the safety of British Members of Parliament, demonstrations have also frequently seen the use of so we said no on this occasion. excessive and lethal force by Government security forces, It has always been my dream to take my young son but regrettably the armed opposition, too, has been and daughter to visit the country where their father and partly responsible for the frequent escalation of violence. aunts were born and where their grandparents had such a wonderful life before the revolution started in Aden. We have condemned in the strongest terms the use of My dream is that one day I can ask you, Mr Speaker, to excessive force against unarmed protesters, and we have go to Sana’a and speak to the Yemeni Parliament in a called for restraint by all sides and for the Yemeni situation that is very different from the one that exists authorities to listen to the legitimate demands of the currently. You have been such a great Speaker and gone Yemeni public for change. We continue energetically to to so many countries. You recently went to India and encourage negotiators on both sides urgently to conclude spoke to the Indian Parliament. Your going out to discussions on implementing a plan for political transition speak to the Yemeni Parliament in different circumstances based on the Gulf Cooperation Council initiative. That would be of such great benefit. plan, brokered by Yemen’s neighbours and with widespread I do not use the term often, but I beg the Minister, as international support, represents the best hope for a a Government spokesman, to give this as much ministerial peaceful end to the crisis. It envisages a transfer of time as he can, not to lose focus, not to allow Yemen presidential power to the vice-president, the establishment to break up in civil war and not to allow those who wish of a national unity Government led by the Opposition to peddle terrorism to take it from the streets of Aden, and early presidential elections. Taiz and Sana’a and bring it to the streets of Birmingham, We welcomed President Saleh’s decree in September London and Manchester. That is my plea to the Minister in which he authorised Vice-President Hadi to restart tonight. dialogue with the Opposition and to sign the initiative on his behalf. Along with our EU, US and GCC partners, 9.28 pm as well as the UN, we have been working closely with The Minister of State, Foreign and Commonwealth the vice-president and the Opposition to encourage a Office (Mr Jeremy Browne): I am grateful for the speedy conclusion to discussions on an implementation opportunity to respond to this short but important mechanism. 263 Yemen8 NOVEMBER 2011 Yemen 264

It is important to appreciate, however, that our and, continue to work closely with our international partners principally, our regional partners’ efforts are ultimately and allies, including in both the EU and the Security dependent on the willingness of President Saleh to fulfil Council, to support a peaceful transition. We look his promise to agree formally to transition. To date, he forward to the Security Council’s review on 21 November has pledged on several occasions to pass all executive of the situation in Yemen in the light of the adoption of authority to the vice-president and then to step down, resolution 2014. but each time I regret to say that he has reneged on his We have talked about the Yemenieconomy. Its situation promise. is truly desperate. Economic collapse and escalating Our task, alongside our international partners, has conflict and violence is pushing Yemeninto a humanitarian been and continues to be to impress upon the Yemeni crisis. The right hon. Gentleman mentioned the role leadership that, in the absence of an agreed and sustainable played by the Minister of State, Department for political settlement, Yemen will continue to spiral International Development, my right hon. Friend the downwards towards state failure and humanitarian Member for Rutland and Melton (Mr Duncan) in that catastrophe. We can already see that the country is regard. We share the UN Security Council’s grave concern fragmented and under-governed, with growing insecurity, about the deteriorating humanitarian situation. Although especially in southern Yemen,and with frequent episodes a £15.4 million package of humanitarian assistance of extreme violence, targeted largely at unarmed protestors. has been given, DFID continues to support a range The Yemeni authorities have lost security control of initiatives being carried out by non-governmental over large swathes of the country, and the Government organisations, UN agencies and the International are barely functional, struggling to deliver services and Committee of the Red Cross to help to alleviate the to pay salaries. The current situation has the biggest suffering of Yemenis. DFID continues to be active in impact on the wider Yemenipopulation, who are struggling Yemen. to eke out an existence in an environment of food price More generally, the current crisis has set back Yemen’s rises, water scarcity and sudden upsurges in violence, so development by years. Yemen was already the poorest it is indeed a truly terrible situation. country in the middle east and faced significant challenges, including falling oil revenues, increased water scarcity Keith Vaz: I thank the Minister very much for what and rapid population growth. There is political instability, he has said so far, but there is a logjam: we have groups, violence, great poverty, economic hardship and, as a in their particular positions, unwilling to give way. The result, humanitarian suffering. It is very much the President has said that he wants to go, the Opposition Government’s intention to approach Yemen in a broad want to take over, and the Saudi Arabian Government co-ordinated way, drawing on our security and diplomatic and the Gulf Co-operation Council are involved, but expertise, as well as on our humanitarian and development what is the mechanism by which we break that logjam? knowledge. We do not want a bloody revolution, so there must be Yemen’s human rights record is also very worrying. The something that we can do, with all the great diplomacy high number of credible allegations of violations perpetrated at our disposal, to try to break this logjam. What does by the authorities against peaceful demonstrators is the Minister think it should be? disturbing. There have been numerous reports of detentions, civilians caught up in armed conflict, the recruitment of Mr Browne: I agree with the right hon. Gentleman’s child soldiers and restrictions applied to the media. We assessment. I hope that the next passage of my speech have witnessed appalling violations by the security forces will at least provide him with some assurance that we since the beginning of the protests, in particular in are seeking to make progress, while recognising that we Sana’a on 18 March. Most recently, we have seen an inevitably face some restrictions and limitations on our escalation of violence by both sides in Sana’a in September, ability to bring about the change we all wish to see. and the shocking use of heavy artillery to quell The lack of urgent progress in Yemen towards achieving demonstrations. We estimate that more than 400 civilians peace, alongside a worsening humanitarian situation, have now been killed and that thousands have been has placed the country increasingly under the international injured. spotlight. Since the Adjournment debate on the subject I should like to use this opportunity to pay tribute to secured by the right hon. Gentleman in April, the the work of all our staff in the embassy at Sana’a. The United Nations has begun to play a helpful political right hon. Gentleman said at the end of his speech how role in support of the efforts of the GCC, alongside our much he would like to be able to take a cross-party EU and US partners. A UN special adviser has visited delegation from this Parliament to the Parliament in the country five times and will be arriving in Yemen Yemen but was prevented from doing so by his concerns again shortly. We welcome the UN Security Council’s about the security situation. It is worth placing on the statements and, most recently, resolution 2014, which record the fact that the United Kingdom staff and their was adopted unanimously on 21 October. As the Foreign Yemeni colleagues have been operating in very difficult Secretary stated, that resolution represents a clear indication circumstances in an environment of high terrorist threat. from the international community that the deteriorating Sana’a is now probably our most dangerous post world- humanitarian, economic and security situation in Yemen wide—the most dangerous place for Foreign Office and is a direct result of President Saleh’s refusal to agree to a other British Government staff to serve in. Our diplomats’ political settlement. ability to operate has also been continually constrained That was also the view of the EU Foreign Affairs by ever-present and unpredictable bouts of violence Council in October, which said that it would explore all and civil disorder. Our staff are living in temporary available options if the political impasse persisted and container accommodation inside the embassy compound the economic and humanitarian situation continued to and have to cope with irregular electricity, and occasionally deteriorate as a result. We, the British Government, will even water, supplies. Life for our local staff has often 265 Yemen8 NOVEMBER 2011 Yemen 266 been even more difficult, with many living in areas of Mr Browne: I endorse the point that my hon. Friend the city affected by ongoing violence and curfews. They makes. We have a narrow self-interest in security terms, have been constantly affected by frequent food, fuel and but I hope and believe that we also have a wider electricity shortages. Yet through all this, all our staff enlightened interest, and a desire on humanitarian grounds continue to show willingness, effectiveness and commitment to see the population of Yemen living more materially in pursuit of our vital national objectives in Yemen. prosperous lives free from the degree of insecurity that they That brings me to the crux of what I wish to say. The must feel on a daily basis. I hope and believe that not reason we maintain, at considerable cost and, in terms only because of the hard concerns about national security of hardship, a considerable burden on our staff, a but because of a desire to see stability, peace and diplomatic and wider British Government presence in relatively greater prosperity in Yemen, the British Yemen is that we recognise, as the right hon. Gentleman Government are affording that country the degree of said, the great importance of Yemen in its own right attention and seriousness that it clearly warrants. across the wider region and globally. As he said, it is I thank the right hon. Gentleman for the opportunity important in security terms because the presence of to discuss Yemen’s manifold challenges and what he has al-Qaeda and other malign influences in Yemen means said about them. I am sure that we will have other that they have the potential to visit themselves on us opportunities to discuss what I hope will be progress by here in the United Kingdom. However, we also recognise the British Government and our international partners it in other regards. in the months and years ahead. Bob Stewart (Beckenham) (Con): I hope the Minister Question put and agreed to. will forgive me for interrupting. We also have responsibility because the Aden protectorate was, for a very long time, a responsibility of ours. I speak as someone who lived there for four years. We also have a responsibility to this 9.43 pm part of the world because of that. House adjourned. 1WH 8 NOVEMBER 2011 King George Hospital 2WH

hospitals in north-east London from six to five, transferring Westminster Hall services to large hospitals and reducing facilities in the Redbridge and Barking and Dagenham areas. We have Tuesday 8 November 2011 ended up with a series of proposals that, when they were initially put forward, were deemed by Professor George Alberti to be clinically unsound. Later they [MR GRAHAM BRADY in the Chair] were revamped, tweaked and remodelled, and they became known as the health for north-east London proposals. King George Hospital Those proposals envisaged principally getting rid of the accident and emergency department at King George Motion made, and Question proposed, That the sitting hospital, Ilford. There has been an accident and emergency be now adjourned.—(Michael Fabricant.) department in the district general hospital there since 1931, when the population was 85,000. Now it is 264,000 9.30 am in the London borough of Redbridge, and the hospital Mike Gapes (Ilford South) (Lab/Co-op): I want to also serves Barking and Dagenham, with a population raise the issue of the Care Quality Commission report approaching 200,000. The proposals also included getting on the Barking, Havering and Redbridge University rid of King George hospital’s maternity services, which Hospitals NHS Trust in north-east London, the related serve young mothers in an area with a growing, diverse, independent reconfiguration panel report and the recent predominantly ethnic minority population. Many of decision by the Secretary of State for Health to endorse those young mothers have come recently to the United the recommendations in the panel’s report and, as a Kingdom, or at least have recently moved to Ilford. At result, significantly to downgrade services at King George the same time it is proposed to increase the number of hospital in Ilford. It is not the first time that the births taking place at Queen’s hospital in Romford—the problems in north-east London health services and one about which there were particular concerns—to hospital provision have been debated in Westminster make it what some people have called a baby factory. Hall or the House. Indeed, I introduced debates in Those words were used in the reports by the CQC and 2006, 2009 and 2010, and my right hon. Friend the the independent reconfiguration panel. Member for Barking (Margaret Hodge) introduced a In March 2010, following concern and a campaign debate in June about maternity services. against the proposals, the then Secretary of State for Members of Parliament throughout north-east London Health referred the matter to the independent have been very concerned, and there has been cross-party reconfiguration panel. The IRP then decided not to consensus, in very unusual circumstances, involving eight carry out an investigation, but to allow the consultation Members of Parliament: myself, my right hon. Friend process to continue. That process led to final proposals, the Member for Barking, my hon. Friends the Members which were published towards the end of 2010, and for Leyton and Wanstead (John Cryer) and for Dagenham then went through the so-called consultation and decision- and Rainham (Jon Cruddas), the hon. Members for making process, based on the primary care trusts. The Ilford North (Mr Scott), for Hornchurch and Upminster joint committee of primary care trusts rubber-stamped (Angela Watkinson), and for Romford (Andrew Rosindell), the proposals despite overwhelming public opposition: and the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions. We aside from the tens of thousands of people who signed have had massive support in the community. Decisions petitions against the proposals, within the committee’s have been made by local authority health overview and own limited, and rigged, consultation procedure the scrutiny committees and there is wide public concern, public were opposed by a two-to-one majority—and an with huge petitions and public meetings, about proposals eight or nine-to-one majority in areas that were directly that were initiated in 2006 to downgrade services at affected—to what was put forward. King George hospital, the smaller of the two hospitals We were told, however, that there was clinical support. in the trust. There was no ballot of GPs, or system to ascertain what That trust, in the words of the first paragraph of the ordinary GPs thought. Care Quality Commission’s summary, “had a history of poor performance under the previous regulatory Margaret Hodge (Barking) (Lab): My hon. Friend framework. It has long-standing and escalating debts (in 2005/06 says that there was no ballot of GPs, but does he accept this was just under £16m; by 2009/10 it was close to £117m). that I undertook a survey of GPs in Barking and There have been numerous changes at executive level.” Dagenham, and there was unanimous support for retaining Queen’s hospital, Romford is the newer of the two the two A and E departments, at both King George hospitals, having opened towards the end of 2006. It hospital and Queen’s? cost a huge amount of money and is run under a private finance initiative arrangement, which has led to certain Mike Gapes: Yes, I should have said that there was no difficulties. There was high-profile publicity, particularly official ballot of GPs, because, of course, the view of about deaths in maternity services, and the CQC began the NHS bureaucracy was that the clinical leadership a series of investigations, as a result of which it decided and the practices should make the decision; therefore, to carry out a full investigation of the trust as a whole, there was a strange kind of managed democracy and encompassing both hospitals and all services. That consultation. investigation went on throughout this summer, and its report was published at 10 am on 27 October. Mr Lee Scott (Ilford North) (Con): Does the hon. At the same time, there have been proposals from the Gentleman also agree that it is possible that a number NHS London region bureaucracy, driven by the people of the GPs who were spoken to were too concerned for within it, who have a vision of reducing the number of their own futures to give their real opinion? 3WH King George Hospital8 NOVEMBER 2011 King George Hospital 4WH

Mike Gapes: I suspect that that may be the case. A we knew what the decision was—to endorse the report—but number of others were also on the payroll in one way or we did not know the content of the report. That is a another—including many who were the lead GPs in the matter of concern. consortia that endorsed the proposals. Nevertheless, the essence of the proposal is that Barking, It is important to get the chronology right. Following Havering and Redbridge trust will be completely the decision of the joint primary care trust meeting in reorganised, because the IRP recommended going ahead December to endorse the proposals, all the councillors with the downgrading of services at King George hospital, from all the parties in the London borough of Redbridge despite public opposition and deep concerns. made a unanimous referral to the Secretary of State. I have a question. The CQC report was published at The joint overview and scrutiny committee for all the 10 o’clock. Is the CQC report consistent with the IRP boroughs in outer north-east London also made a report and the Secretary of State’s decision? The Secretary referral to the Secretary of State. The Secretary of State of State, having read the CQC report, should have then decided—the Minister will recall a previous debate thought hard about whether to endorse the IRP report. in the main Chamber, in which we had an interesting The CQC report is absolutely damning about services exchange on the matter—to refer the case to a new at Queen’s hospital. It contains some criticisms of King independent reconfiguration panel investigation. George, principally because that hospital is in the The IRP spent a lot of time talking to Members of same trust as Queen’s, with the same management, Parliament and councillors, and it worked hard; I have which the report is also strongly critical of. However, of no criticism of the consultation process. In its analysis, the 73 recommendations in the CQC report, concerning although it tended to group us all into one paragraph maternity, A and E, children’s services, dealing with called, “Save King George Hospital Campaign,” which complaints from MPs, quality of care, cleanliness and covers many interviews and consultations, the community’s all kinds of other issues, the vast majority relate to the opposition was reflected. The view was expressed, if new, five-year-old, private finance initiative-built Queen’s tucked away, that the local community was overwhelmingly hospital in Romford. The report explicitly says on occasion against the proposals. that the recommendations do not apply to King George and that at King George, there is a different case. We The IRP published its report internally, but not publicly, have a series of absolutely damning recommendations and put it on the desk of the Secretary of State on relating to the larger hospital in the trust. 22 July, and there it sat. Two or three weeks after that, the CQC decided to carry out a full, no-holds-barred I do not wish to go through the report in great detail, look at Barking, Havering and Redbridge trust. as it is a long document. If people are looking for Understandably, I guess, the Secretary of State decided horror reading at Christmas, I recommend taking the to hold back until he had received the CQC report report away and reading it. Apart from criticising poor before he published the IRP report and gave his official management, it says that some staff, particularly in the response; Members of Parliament expected something maternity services at Queen’s, have very poor attitudes like that to happen. to the patients whom they are treating. It also confirms that attempts to cut the deficit at Barking, Havering and Then, interestingly, everything went quiet. We originally Redbridge trust over the years have led to reductions in thought that we were going to get an announcement in the quality of care. September, but September came and went. Then we The IRP report also flags up concerns, saying that if thought that we would get an announcement in early the trust drove on with the deficit reduction programme October, but that did not happen. Eventually, three and reduced the number of staff and beds, there could hours after the CQC report was made public, the Secretary be an issue with quality. Damningly, the report makes it of State published his response. clear that although services at King George were reduced There is a little bit of history here. As a local Member over the years, it has not led to efficiency savings. All it of Parliament—I know that other MPs feel the same—I has done is reduce the quality of care in a hospital that was not appropriately informed about the matters. BBC serves my constituents and those of a number of other London news on television at 6.30 pm on Wednesday MPs. The cost of doing that has not led to improvements evening ran a story saying that the Secretary of State in efficiency; on the contrary, it has contributed to the was going to announce at 12 o’clock the following day ongoing deficit problems in the dysfunctional trust. the closure of A and E and maternity services at King There we have it. The Secretary of State receives a George hospital. I raised a point of order in the Chamber report from the IRP recommending the endorsement of that evening with Madam Deputy Speaker, who had no NHS London’s vision to downgrade services at King knowledge of the matter—there was no statement or George hospital in Ilford. He then receives a report announcement to come. saying that there are two hospitals in the trust, covering The following morning, telephone calls to the private 750,000 people in the community in the three boroughs, and press offices of the Department of Health ascertained one of which is doing badly and there are criticisms of that yes, the news was true: there was going to be an the other. He therefore endorses the recommendations announcement. To be fair, I was phoned back eventually, to cut the services at the hospital that is doing better, on at 11.15 am, and told that the announcement would be the aspiration, but with no evidence, that it will lead to a made at 1 pm, and that I would be told in advance of it. miraculous Stakhanovite improvement in the services That is true: I received an e-mail at, I think, 12.46 pm. at the bigger, supposedly better and more expensive Attached was a letter from the Secretary of State with a hospital in the long term. You really could not make link to the IRP report, but the report was not available it up. on that link; the link did not work until 1.10 pm. Other The Secretary of State could have delayed his decision people had a similar problem, by which time the on the IRP report. He could have said, “I am concerned announcement was already up and running. Therefore, about the CQC report and the damning indictment of 5WH King George Hospital8 NOVEMBER 2011 King George Hospital 6WH what is going on at Queen’s hospital. I have waited three Margaret Hodge: Perhaps the Minister will be able to months with the report sitting on my desk, and I will help us in his reply, but my understanding is that the wait another year to see whether I am satisfied that the business plan put forward by NHS Outer North East improvements at Queen’s hospital are happening and London at the end of the summer suggested that, for have happened, that the quality of services provided is the finances to stack up, the proposals will have to be sufficient, and that there has been an improvement in implemented by April 2012. If that has been superseded, primary care services, which is also called for in the IRP that is welcome news, but the local information is that report.” He could have waited, or he could have said, “I the NHS ONEL business plan suggests the closure of have made an announcement. I am minded to support the A and E and maternity services by April 2012. the recommendations unless there is a significant improvement at Queen’s hospital and other services.” Mike Gapes: There is obviously some uncertainty, because I was not told that when I spoke to NHS The Minister of State, Department of Health (Mr Simon ONEL. Perhaps it is having a rethink in light of the Burns): I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for giving report. way, and I hope this reassures him. As he will know from the decision, nothing to do with the IRP proposals Mr Scott: If it is helpful, I have also received a letter will come into effect until the problems highlighted in from Heather Mullin stating exactly what the Minister the CQC report have been remedied, and the time scale has said, which is that two years is the minimum time for that in many ways fits in with the hon. Gentleman’s scale for things to be looked at. point. Mr Burns rose— Mike Gapes: I am sorry, but that is not good enough. Mike Gapes: I am happy to keep giving way. The Minister gives the impression that the Secretary of State has somehow not “fully supported”—to use his own words—the recommendations. The letter that I Mr Burns: To respond to the hon. Gentleman and the have from Heather Mullin of the Health for north east right hon. Member for Barking (Margaret Hodge), I London programme states that the Secretary of State will repeat what I said before, which is that it is of fully supports the recommendations of the IRP. paramount importance that the recommendations and demands of CQC are met before anything happens with the IRP recommendations, because patient safety is Mr Burns: The hon. Gentleman is making a fallacious paramount. As far as can be assessed, it will probably point. I have never said that at all. It is quite clear from be two years to get patient safety to the required levels the letter that my right hon. Friend the Secretary of and to address all the problems highlighted in the CQC State sent to him and to other hon. Members that he report. Whatever the hon. Gentleman or the right hon. does. The point that I was making in my intervention is Lady may have heard from other people, we estimate that he said that the IRP proposals should not come that the time scale will probably be about two years, into effect until the problems have been sorted out at the because the CQC’s requirements are paramount. two hospitals. I am saying that it has already been accepted that those improvements have to be made Mike Gapes: I would like to move on to what the prior to the IRP proposals coming into effect, which is CQC actually said, because it has made several criticisms what I understood that the hon. Gentleman was saying and expressed deep concern. It will prove difficult for should happen. the management of the trust and the present configuration of Queen’s hospital to meet the required improvements Mike Gapes: I am saying something different; I am within a two-year timetable. My right hon. Friend the saying that the Secretary of State could have delayed his Member for Barking and I have visited the hospital, decision or that he could have said that he was minded and there are, for example, bottlenecks where people are to—the words that I used—support the proposals, but on trolleys around the corner where they cannot be would not make a final decision until he was satisfied. seen, which is pointed out in the report. There are I spoke to people within the Health for north east design faults, and it is a bit like Eros at Piccadilly circus London programme last week. I asked them what the with trolleys suddenly coming from both directions. timetable for the implementation of the proposals was, This newly designed hospital has a level of chaos. and they could not tell me. I asked them whether babies Whoever was responsible for signing off the design will be born at King George hospital, Ilford, in five must have decided that it was an airport rather than a years’ time, and I was told, “Almost certainly not.” I hospital, because the design has big issues— therefore asked whether babies would be born there in two years’ time, and I was told, “They may be. We have Mr Burns rose— not yet worked out the detail of these proposals. There is still a lot of work to do.” Mike Gapes: Before the Minister intervenes, I am criticising the previous Government, the private finance initiative and the people in the consultancies and the Mr Burns: There is no secret about this. The private sector who run the PFI and make a huge amount improvements to care must first be achieved at the of money from it, for designing a hospital that does not hospitals before the IRP proposals are enacted. It is work well. The reports state that. They criticise the bad anticipated—one can never be 100% accurate—that signage, the design and the way that wards are structured. the time scale will probably be about two years. Queen’s hospital has, for example, areas where children cannot be seen and areas where people wait for more Mike Gapes: I give way to my right hon. Friend. than an hour before being attended to by a nurse or 7WH King George Hospital8 NOVEMBER 2011 King George Hospital 8WH

[Mike Gapes] know whether that is accurate. There is no proposal to have a similar unit on the King George site. That idea doctor. There is a whole litany of things that relate was floated in the consultation, but it was ruled out. partly to design, partly to management, partly to staff We have had a maternity hospital in Ilford since 1926; shortages and partly to other issues at the hospital. children have been born in that hospital since 1926. But I do not believe that Queen’s hospital can be turned from 2013 there will be no children born in that hospital, around in the suggested time scale, and that raises wider even though we have a young population. People in questions. The CQC wrote to me after I asked for an Ilford will be forced to go to the Queen’s hospital, where update following the publication of its report, and I there is capacity for 9,000 or 10,000 births a year. It will received it yesterday. The update confirms the reasons be one of the largest maternity units in the country and why it had to intervene, which included the poor it has been described as a “baby factory” in one of the performance of the trust in the past and the fact that documents that I have referred to this morning. long-term problems prevented offering care that consistently Alternatively, they can go to Newham hospital or Whipp’s meets CQC’s essential standards. To be fair, the CQC Cross hospital. Apparently, the facilities for babies to be refers to both hospitals. It continues by saying that they born at Newham hospital or Whipp’s Cross hospital have taken action to mitigate the risk of immediate will be increased, although the cost of doing that is harm in the short term, which includes reducing births undefined. That will happen, while the perfectly good at both Queen’s hospital and King George hospital and maternity service that exists in Ilford at King George transferring caesareans out of the area. When they will hospital is being run down. My constituents will have to be transferred back is an interesting question, which we travel to Havering or to Whipp’s Cross. It is not easy can perhaps come to later. The update also states that to get to Whipp’s Cross from Ilford lane; the route is the CQC met many staff and patients and that their complicated and there are sometimes lots of traffic concerns were made known, but the nub of the issue is problems. There will be concerns about that. that if improvements are not forthcoming, the CQC Interestingly, Havering has the oldest population of is prepared to restrict access to or close services that any London borough; that is pointed out in the IRP appear to be basically unsustainable. It then states that report. The boroughs with the youngest populations in the CQC is not responsible for service reconfiguration. London are Barking and Dagenham, and Redbridge. The CQC, therefore, is not yet convinced that the 74 So we have this huge increase in young people in north-east improvements that it has requested will be met. The London, but their hospital will not be in the communities final paragraph in the letter to me states that the CQC where they live. I could understand it if we had had a has set out 16 key recommendations that must be hospital at Queen’s hospital that provided long-term fulfilled by the trust and that it will monitor their care for people suffering from long-term illnesses, mental implementation, but it admits that the trust needs help health problems and so on, and if we had our maternity from organisations in the local health economy such as hospital in the area where most of the births were NHS London and commissioners and that the necessary taking place. But oh no—the IRP, Health for north east significant changes are likely to challenge both clinical London and the Government do it the other way round. flows and trust finances. We pointed that out in the consultation and the local MPs and councillors kept making these points, but we There it is. We have problems with capacity and have been ignored. money, and we have a decision from the IRP and the Secretary of State to downgrade King George hospital, Mr Brady, I am conscious of the time and that other but serious concerns remain about Queen’s hospital. Members wish to speak, so I simply want to get back to Are we confident that within two years those problems the CQC. I have been told that the CQC will review in will have been addressed sufficiently well, at a time March 2012 whether or not the Barking, Havering and when there are financial problems; that Queen’s hospital Redbridge University Hospitals NHS Trust is delivering will suddenly have been turned around, so that it is such improvements. The CQC says: a fantastic place that my constituents and the constituents “If we do not see improvements, we are prepared to take of my neighbouring MPs—my right hon. Friend the further action to restrict and ultimately close services that do not Member for Barking and my hon. Friend the Member deliver care that meets our essential standards of safety and quality, and that present risks to people using services.” for Dagenham and Rainham—will feel happy to go into it to give birth to their children? I already have That review is due to take place in March 2012, which is constituents expressing concerns because of the media not very far away. It is not two years away; it is just a few reports and other things that are going on. months away. The CQC report points out that in the past there were I hope that the quality of care at Queen’s hospital more than 2,000 births a year in the King George improves sufficiently; I hope that services at King George hospital; at one time, there were 2,500 births a year. hospital are not run down by surreptitious salami-slicing However, those numbers were deliberately run down by cuts in preparation for the implementation of Health the trust to around 1,300 births a year. Then, a few for north east London’s plans, as they have been for months ago, the trust began to push the numbers up several years now; and I hope that quality of patient again, because Queen’s hospital could not cope. Within care and treatment for my constituents is put ahead of two years of now, the capacity for births at King the bean-counting desire to reduce the deficit at the George hospital—a capacity of around 2,000 births a Barking, Havering and Redbridge University Hospitals year—will go. We are told that some of that capacity NHS Trust. will go to a midwife-led birthing unit on the Barking However, I am not confident that those things will hospital site, where there are currently about 10 births a happen. I am extremely angry at the betrayal of my week, or about 500 births a year. I am told that that constituents by the bureaucracy in Health for north east figure is the maximum for that unit, although I do not London; by the Minister, who said before the general 9WH King George Hospital8 NOVEMBER 2011 King George Hospital 10WH election last year that there would be no top-down The CQC report and the letters that I have received reorganisation; and by others, who said that they would say that, that owing to the pressure of our one-paragraph keep district general hospitals open and that those “Save King George Hospital” campaign, the urgent hospitals should not close. The Prime Minister said that care centre will now be manned by doctors, nurses and in 2007. In 2009, he promised “a bare-knuckle fight”. some specialists 24/7, 365 days a year. I acknowledge That was in the context of Chase Farm hospital, but the that, and I am grateful for it. However, in his response principles involved are the same. I feel that we have been to the debate, will the Minister say whether we can look betrayed and that our services are going to be reduced, at taking the next step and going a bit further to make and I fear the consequences of that for my constituents. that urgent care centre an A and E department. Regarding maternity services, during the consultation Mr Graham Brady (in the Chair): It may be helpful I had a meeting at Barking, Havering and Redbridge for right hon. and hon. Members to know that I anticipate University Hospitals NHS Trust, and I believe that the taking Front-Bench contributions from 10.40 am. hon. Member for Ilford South (Mike Gapes) had a Colleagues can work out for themselves that we may be similar meeting, although we were not allowed to have able to get everyone in to speak if speeches are reasonably meetings together, for whatever reason. It was hinted—quite short. strongly—that a birthing unit would remain, in some shape or form, at King George hospital. I do not know 10.5 am what happened to that idea but I would like it to be considered, because it came through loud and clear at Mr Lee Scott (Ilford North) (Con): I am grateful for the meeting that I attended. the opportunity to speak in this debate. Before I talk about anything to do with the hospitals Mike Gapes: I recall the conversation that I had very that we are discussing today, we should praise the well. I was told that the local trust wanted to have the doctors, the nurses and the back-up staff at Barking, birthing unit, but that they had to get the approval of Havering and Redbridge University Hospitals NHS NHS London and that, as usual with regard to services Trust. After everything that has happened in these last in Ilford, NHS London’s bureaucracy was less inclined few weeks, particularly the reports on the trust, morale to go along with it. must be pretty low. I do not believe that those staff are to blame for the problems at the trust. I believe that Mr Scott: I thank the hon. Gentleman for that criticisms of staff can be made and that there are things intervention. that need to be learned, but I also believe that the fault I want to praise the hospital’s new management. for the problems lies much more with the previous Averil Dongworth is doing a good job with her staff. senior management at the trust than with the doctors, She inherited a difficult situation, with a £117 million nurses, back-up staff and front-line staff. Of course, deficit and low morale, and she should be praised for recommendations for improvements have been made, doing her utmost to turn things around. The CQC but those staff took their orders from others and we report stated that things had improved over the past should try to build morale rather than knock it down. months. That is what I genuinely feel. The hon. Member for Ilford South said that there are I, along with other right hon. and hon. Members in 265,000 people in the London borough of Redbridge our local area, thought that the Care Quality Commission alone and, given the amount of new build that has report was going to be bad, but I did not think for one outline or detailed planning permission, the population moment that it would be quite as bad as it turned out is going to grow considerably. I understand that the to be. It was damning of just about everything. It was situation is similar in Barking and Dagenham, and probably easier to see what was right than what it is estimated that the area could grow by about was wrong, because the good points were fewer than the 50,000 people in the next five years or so. When I met bad ones. with the independent reconfiguration panel and the I will talk about the CQC report in depth, and at this CQC, I mentioned that issue in relation to my own point I want to mention that I am talking on my own constituency, and I am sure that colleagues have also behalf and that of my hon. Friend the Member for done so. Hornchurch and Upminster (Angela Watkinson), who On the ballot of GPs that did not take place, GPs is a Government Whip and therefore is unable to were consulted and the report says that they gave their speak in this debate. If she disagrees with anything I say, blessing to what was happening. However, that seems to I am sorry but that is too bad. The damning report by contradict what I heard from a number of GPs who the CQC was ostensibly of Queen’s hospital but it contacted me in private, as they made it clear that also points the finger at King George hospital. As with although they did not feel confident enough to make the independent reconfiguration panel report, I was their views public they had grave concerns. I know that disappointed, upset and angry that the decision that that is anecdotal, but I want to put it on the record. It was made had been taken. certainly happened with me; I know not if it happened I will begin with accident and emergency. In my own with other Members, but I would be surprised if it had constituency of Ilford, North, I believe that a large not. additional burden will be placed on Whipps Cross I think it is fair to say that the private finance initiative hospital. My guess is that in an emergency, people from at Queen’s hospital has been a failure. It was badly wards such as Woodford Bridge, Fairlop and Fullwell negotiated—the hon. Member for Ilford South will go to that hospital, rather than cross the A12 right acknowledged that that was done by the previous the way through to Queen’s hospital, so there will be a Government and not the current one—it was a bad major problem at Whipps Cross. deal, it was badly set out and there are grave concerns. I 11WH King George Hospital8 NOVEMBER 2011 King George Hospital 12WH

[Mr Scott] The Minister can reply if he wishes. A 0.1% increase in cash terms is not real-terms growth, especially when understand that the planning applications for the new inflation is running at about 5%. Thirdly, he promised units that would need to be built at Queen’s have not no more top-down reorganisation. In north-east London, even gone in, and are unlikely to do so before the new we are suffering from his reneging on those three promises. year. The time scale for the build ties in with the two He must listen to that, because it has a terrible impact years the Minister mentioned earlier, so that would on the quality of the health service offered to my obviously be a constraint. constituents. I have said to him privately, and will say to In a letter to the hon. Member for Ilford South, we him publicly, that that will grow health inequalities in heard that the CQC would undertake a re-evaluation in London. March 2012. I urge it to make a full report before any I do not want to repeat what others have said about changes are made—in two years’ time or whenever—to the Care Quality Commission. What I will say is that a say, “Yes, we are satisfied that our 73 points of concern lot of emphasis has been placed on confidence in the have been rectified.” new management at Queen’s. I am on my fifth chief executive there, and every time a new one arrives, I Mr Simon Burns: As my hon. Friend will appreciate, think, “Perhaps this one will be a little better.” The new the CQC is independent of the Department of Health, chief executive has been in place for six months, and so because it is a regulatory body that is concerned with far I am not sure about that confidence. If one looks at standards of quality. Knowing how it works, however, I the maternity services, why in September did we suddenly have no doubt that on an ongoing basis it will look see elective caesareans being transferred from Queen’s closely at ensuring that its recommendations are to the London hospital? None of us knew why, none of implemented and the required standards for people in us could understand it, none of us was told the reason, that community are reached. but it was because the CQC went back into the maternity unit because it was so bad, and threatened to close the Mr Scott: I thank the Minister. I am sure that the entire unit. The only way for the hospital to maintain CQC will take note of what the Minister, other colleagues the unit was for it to accept that caesareans should be and I say in this debate. I have presented petitions transferred. The teams were not talking to each other, signed by a total of 39,000 people, and other Members people were not taking responsibility and no one was have presented petitions directly to Downing street; via putting the patient at the heart of care, but the required our local Ilford Recorder, to which I pay tribute for its cultural change has not occurred. Yes, new midwives continued campaign; and in other ways. I am sure that it are being recruited, but not at the right grade and not to is an underestimate to say that there must have been a manage the unit. The Minister is putting too much on total of 50,000 plus signatures. Averil Dongworth, because she will not be able to turn around those cultural issues. The record so far shows Mike Gapes: I presented 25,000 signatures, which that she does not share information freely, particularly became 28,000, to NHS London on the initial proposals, with Members of Parliament, and that she has not and another 32,000 in the latest round. Adding all those done much. together with the ones that went in from other groups, I The most recent case that I have had at the unit is an would guess that it was more like 100,000. anonymous one—the woman does not want to reveal her name, although the case will be investigated. This Mr Scott: My arithmetic shows why I will probably mother was left for hours without being checked on, never be in the Treasury. None the less, a huge number and it was her mother—the grandmother—who had to of people have signed petitions. look after her. She was almost lifeless and delirious, and I ask the Minister to take on board the fact that there she was discharged without anyone checking her scar is cross-party support for keeping the services that our from the cuts she was given or changing her dressing. constituents need at King George’s, and to consider She was asked to give water samples, but they were left upgrading the urgent care centre by renaming it an A in the bathroom and were still there when she left, and E and adding a little to it—I do not ask for a lot in which is just not on. Queen’s provides facilities for 7,000 life—and a birthing unit at King George’s. births, and if the proposals go ahead that will increase to 9,000, making it the biggest single maternity unit in 10.14 am the country. Given the quality of care, the problems faced and the population growth, it is sheer madness to Margaret Hodge (Barking) (Lab): I congratulate my go ahead with a proposition that closes a hospital in hon. Friend the Member for Ilford South (Mike Gapes) this area of London. on securing this debate, and on giving us the opportunity Perhaps the Minister will give us some words of to comment on something that impacts on all constituents comfort about the finances. The trust’s finances have of all hon. Members participating today. been in a mess for ever, since well before the Labour I am really disappointed, because I feel that the Government came into office. I assure the Minister that Minister and his Secretary of State have reneged on when I became a Member of Parliament in 1994 there promises that he gave to my constituents before the was already a deficit in the trust. David Varney, a election. First, he said that he would never close the A well-respected and talented man with a lot of experience, and E, and we all know that the closure of such a was chairman of the trust albeit for a very short time, department means the closure of a hospital over time, and I breathed an enormous sigh of relief that at last we because most patients who go through a hospital come had someone there who could sort the trust out. He in that way. Secondly he said that there would be more went to NHS London and said, “Write off the debt, money in real terms for the NHS. Sadly, that is not true give me a blank sheet of paper and I’ll provide you with either, and it is impacting dreadfully—[Interruption.] a decent health service within budget.” NHS London 13WH King George Hospital8 NOVEMBER 2011 King George Hospital 14WH refused, so David Varney walked away. That was a Time and time again people say to me, “I rang the GP tragedy for the people of that part of London, and such at 6.30 in the evening. He said to ring back the following tragedies will continue to be repeated. The problems morning. I rang at 8 o’clock in the morning, and I will not be sorted out until somebody grasps them couldn’t get through. By that time, I felt that the only properly and says, “Right, we will do something about way to be seen was to go to A and E.” [Interruption.] the finances,” enabling the trust to run a decent service The Minister looks at me in amazement. That is the within budget rather than always chasing a deficit. reality on the ground. One thing about the CQC report that has not been raised is that it is about not only maternity but accident Mr Simon Burns: I am fascinated to hear the right and emergency. One of the most shocking things, for hon. Lady say that. Does she know who the authors me, involves radiology. The results of scans are just were of the GP contract that ended evening and weekend sitting around. Some scans show a possibility of cancer, work for GPs? It certainly was not my Government. but individuals are seen so late that the cancer has grown. People’s lives are being threatened and death Margaret Hodge: Making a political point does not warrants are being written simply because the hospital get at what is happening in practice. It is not about the has no systems to transfer knowledge from a scan to a contract; it is about the practice, attitude and culture in consultant who can quickly pick up on the symptoms the whole NHS economy in our part of north-east and deal with the patient. London. That is the problem that the Minister must That is awful, as is the fact that people sit in theatre tackle. Making a cheap political point does not help all the time. The fact that A and E is bound to be bad make any advances in the quality of health care in my again this winter is awful. The fact that proper records quarter of London, for which he is responsible. are not kept of who has had cannulas inserted for Finally—I have said this to the Minister privately, treatment is awful. The culture throughout the hospital and I will say it publicly—there is inequality in health is awful, and it seems to me that it will take a heck of a care across London. The teaching hospitals in the heart lot more than Averil Dongworth, whose only record is of London take away necessary resources from outer the closure of Chase Farm hospital, to turn that around. London, whether north-east or south-east. If Queen’s I am conscious of time. I campaigned for years to becomes the only hospital in our part of London, it will reopen a birthing unit at Barking hospital, for all sorts have to meet the health needs of 500,000 people, according of reasons, including pressure on Queen’s, population to the CQC. The catchment area in inner London has a growth and the fact that I wanted babies to be born in population of about 200,000. It is completely different. Barking again. I was grateful when it was finally built. I have spent my whole adult life bringing up my Those hospital beds have been ready for occupation children in north London. The catchment area where I since March this year, but they are still not occupied. live has four hospitals that I can reach within 10 minutes When I last asked NHS London what was happening, I and that provide excellent health care for me and my was told that the unit would be open by March next family. In north-east London, where I work, if King year. That is a 12-month wait. If the hospital is kept George hospital closes, it will take those who live on the empty, £1 million in costs for security, electricity, heating Thames View estate an hour and a half on three buses and so on will go down the drain each year. Now the to get to Queen’s hospital. People with weekly hospital deadline has changed from next March to next spring. appointments will not go. With the greatest respect to That is absolute madness. There is pressure on Queen’s. the Minister, that means that they will die earlier. His Queen’s is failing to deliver, so people are being sent to Government have said that they want to tackle health London, while a brand-new facility that could provide inequalities. Our Government tried to tackle them, but for many more births than my hon. Friend the Member did not make much progress. Those health inequalities for Ilford South has suggested stands empty. Will the will grow. Minister give us an assurance that the unit will be open Why does the Minister not take a bold move and not next spring but by Christmas, so that people in my consider the configuration of teaching hospitals in inner constituency can have hope? London? For example, the Royal Free hospital is not a The decision whether to close the A and E at King good hospital. The physical building is terrible, and it George hospital was predicated on the idea that fewer sits on an extremely valuable site that would do a lot to people should go to A and E; I agree. If and when the sort out the financial situation faced by the NHS, but Minister can demonstrate to me and other Members some talented and good people with the right culture of Parliament that fewer people are actually going to and attitude work there. Those people ought to be A and E, maybe we can have a serious conversation working in areas of health need, such as our bit of about whether that part of north-east London has too north-east London. They should be operating out many hospital places. The reality is that we have a of the brand-new Queen’s hospital on the Romford site. mobile and transient population, many of whom have If he did something radical and sensible like that, it not registered with a GP and who, if they want to access would improve health outcomes for people in my health care, go first to A and E. constituency. It would also help him tackle some of the Another reality is that GP and community services financial problems that he faces, and it would make also have issues. Before taking a decision, is the Minister sense in terms of tackling health inequalities across the willing to do a comprehensive inspection of GP services capital. in my area to ensure that they can fulfil the demands on them, as the decision to close assumes they can? If GP 10.28 am services prove to be up to scratch, again, I am willing to enter into conversation with him about whether there Jon Cruddas (Dagenham and Rainham) (Lab): I echo are too many hospital places. However, at present, he is every point made by my right hon. Friend the Member letting down the people in my borough. for Barking (Margaret Hodge) in her powerful speech, 15WH King George Hospital8 NOVEMBER 2011 King George Hospital 16WH

[Jon Cruddas] Nevertheless, the Health Secretary is looking to increasing capacity further. Does the Department not understand which I think will resonate with the local community. I what multiple panels are recommending to it? congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Ilford Secondly, on demographic changes, which have also South (Mike Gapes) on securing this debate and on the been mentioned, the IRP’s decision to transfer maternity extensive speech that he made, as did the hon. Member services to Queen’s hospital seems peculiar, given that for Ilford North (Mr Scott). There is total agreement the CQC report states that across the aisle on issues of local concern about the “King George Hospital is geographically located for the populations provision of health care in north-east London and the of Barking and Dagenham and Redbridge,” sub-region. I will not repeat the points made, but I will an area with an expanding, multicultural and relatively emphasise a couple of them, especially about the pressure young population and a high level of teenage pregnancies. on Queen’s hospital if the King George closes. Those Under the IRP’s recommendations, however, provision points are echoed in the report, and I will touch on of maternity services would be predominantly from them. Queen’s hospital. Moreover, as has been mentioned, a I welcome the Care Quality Commission’s investigation third of the population of Havering is over the age of of Queen’s hospital. I recognise that it must have been a 65, which means a different health profile and different stressful and worrying time for many people involved, needs in the sub-region that cannot be catered for solely but it is definitely a process that we needed to go by Queen’s hospital. With people living longer and the through. The report has 16 key recommendations for population growing at an ever-increasing rate, the number the future, and I, like my colleagues, will support the of patients presenting at Queen’s hospital will increase chief executive and her staff in trying to meet them. I year on year, and it is very unlikely that it will be able to have major concerns, however, about how the two reports manage these levels in five, 10 or even 15 years’ time. will affect each other, specifically in relation to Queen’s Thirdly, on travel, it does not help the fears of local hospital. Many of my constituents are extremely worried residents that, historically, transport links between the about the proposals to close the A and E and maternity hospitals have been incredibly poor. My right hon. services at King George hospital, especially when the Friend the Member for Barking has mentioned the only alternative for them is to go to Queen’s hospital. Thames View estate. It can easily take someone living Some figures have not been cited this morning, but on the other side of Ilford up to an hour and a half to they are worth rehearsing. According to page 26 of the get to Queen’s hospital, as opposed to 20 minutes or less independent reconfiguration panel report, planned activity to get to King George hospital. for 2011 for Queen’s hospital is 885,511 people, while for King George hospital it is 284,459. The combined Mike Gapes: I travel to Queen’s hospital by public total of 1,169,970 people simply cannot be treated by transport. If people get the train from Ilford to Romford Queen’s hospital alone. A 24% increase in patient numbers and come out of the station, they will see that two buses will result in havoc in a hospital that is struggling to on one side of the road go in one direction to Queen’s cope with its current intake of patients. The estimated hospital, and that two buses on the other side go in the increases from 2010 to 2017 of 12.5% in the Barking other direction. I have been pressing for years for proper and Dagenham primary care trust and of 5.7% in signage at Romford station, and, while various chief Havering PCT demonstrate that the acute sector in the executives of the trust have said that they will do it, they sub-region has a serious structural problem, and closing still have not done so. The links for people who have to the services at King George hospital will do nothing to rely on public transport to get to Queen’s hospital are help. appalling. The question of the structural debt has been raised throughout the debate. The trust is clearly suffering Jon Cruddas: I agree. The point has been made in from its escalating debts. From 2005-06 to 2009-10, the Havering, Barking and Dagenham, and Waltham Forest, trust debts rose from £16 million to £117 million. Those as well as Redbridge. levels will only increase and make any future improvements The fourth point relates to evidence of no gains from very difficult to sustain. That takes us back to the the previous transfer of services in the sub-region. changes in the staffing of people who were keen to There has already been a long, ongoing transfer of remove some of the structural debts in order to resolve services form King George hospital to Queen’s hospital, some of the health problems that we have seen over the but the efficiency gains that were predicted have not past few years, but who have since departed because occurred, as my hon. Friend the Member for Ilford they did not receive the support that they desperately South has said. What are the guarantees that any future needed to secure that. transfer of resources will lead to such efficiency gains? What is the correct move in order for both hospitals and I want to touch on the four general issues in the CQC the wider trust to see a rise in standards and in order for report. First, capacity at Queen’s hospital is already too the faith of local residents to be restored in their local high for hospital staff to cope. The report states: NHS trust? If that is to be achieved, King George “An independent review of maternity services at the trust was hospital’s A and E and maternity services simply cannot undertaken at the beginning of 2011, which concluded that close. It would go against all logic suggested by the ‘Capacity at Queen’s is of major concern to the review team’. The CQC report and cause no end of damage to the confidence recommendations from this review included the need to develop of residents in their local hospitals. I urge the Government measures to ease the capacity at Queen’s, including ‘an impact assessment of the changes at KGH. It should also include an to step in and implement the CQC report and hold back updated Escalation Plan, with clear indicators relating to capping the IRP report, until we can re-evaluate after the CQC numbers at Queen’s and temporary closure if required in the has been able to see whether its initial recommendations interests of patient safety’.” have been met. 17WH King George Hospital8 NOVEMBER 2011 King George Hospital 18WH

My right hon. Friend the Member for Barking has attempts to cut the financial deficit at Barking, Havering talked about one case that was recently brought to her and Redbridge trust led to reductions in the quality of attention. All local MPs have a series of cases that are care. equally dramatic and heart-rending. A few hours after About three hours after the CQC report was published, the two reports were published on 27 October, I received the Health Secretary made an announcement about this e-mail: King George hospital, which now looks set to lose its A “Just wanted to give an example of what could happen if the and E and maternity units. We know that the Health above A&E is closed.” Secretary backed the IRP’s proposal for services to be The correspondent is referring to King George hospital. expanded at nearby Queen’s hospital in Romford. That They continue: raises the question why, when the report on King George “Two weeks ago I had to take my eldest daughter to Queens as hospital was presented to the Secretary of State on she thought she was having an early miscarriage. All the spaces in 22 July, it then sat on his desk for more than three the Early Pregnancy Unit were full, (apparently they even called months and he chose to release its conclusions and in the consultants), we had to wait in the A&E department for recommendations on the same day, three hours after the approximately 7 hours before she was seen by a doctor, she could CQC report. not have a scan as there were 15 women in the unit which meant it was full, so she was sent away and told that there was no point in From articles in the Ilford Recorder, in the constituency returning at 9am as they had a full unit to clear before they could of my hon. Friend the Member for Ilford South, I see see her. We tried to arrange a private scan but were unable to do that there is a great deal of concern and consternation so (not that we are awash with money but she was distraught). about that decision. Indeed, my right hon. Friend the Homerton agreed to see her and scan her and we are returning Member for Barking (Margaret Hodge) described the there tomorrow, unfortunately we are almost certain that she has decision in the press as “sheer madness”, outlining how lost a much wanted baby. Queen’s hospital is already having difficulty dealing How is Queens going to cope if King Georges is closed as they with existing pressures—an issue which she raised today. are not coping now”? My hon. Friend the Member for Ilford South previously Overall, such reports confirm what all the local MPs described the decision as a disaster and is quoted in the have known for years about the standards of care Ilford Recorder as saying that the decision on King throughout the sub-region. The pressures are growing. George hospital showed an Extra capacity is needed and should not be cut. “absolutely contemptuous attitude to local people’s wishes and concerns”. 10.37 am The proposed changes will not take place until the Barking, Havering and Redbridge University Hospitals Andrew Gwynne (Denton and Reddish) (Lab): I welcome NHS Trust, which runs both sites, tackles the issues you to the Chair, Mr Brady, and congratulate my hon. raised by the CQC. The Minister went into a little more Friend the Member for Ilford South (Mike Gapes) on detail about that in the debate. However, it is not just securing this important debate on the issues facing his the disruption, but the uncertainty of local people, who local hospitals. I know that he, my right hon. and hon. will no longer have access to A and E and maternity Friends, and other Members across the party divide services on their doorstep, that should be of concern to have campaigned extensively for their local health services, all hon. Members. and I commend them for it. Yes, we need to acknowledge that reconfigurations The Government are implementing a number of much are unpopular. We went through that a few years ago in wider changes in the health service—I will touch on Greater Manchester. Nevertheless, given public opposition those later—but my hon. Friend must be disappointed and the views of the overview and scrutiny panel, local with the recent decisions made about the hospitals in MPs and members of the local authorities across party, his area and the health services used by his constituents. will the Minister say what account has been taken of He and others have mentioned the recent Care Quality the level of local opinion on the local health services by Commission report on the standard of care received by the IRP? My hon. Friend the Member for Ilford South people under Barking, Havering and Redbridge University says it was in its report, but what weight did the IRP Hospitals NHS Trust. The report had immediate concerns and the Secretary of State give to that level of opinion? in relation to maternity services, identified failings in emergency care and radiology, and demanded widespread Mr Burns: May I help the shadow Minister? The improvement. consultations—not on the IRP level when it was doing As Members have mentioned, Queen’s hospital had its work, but on the proposals themselves—have, since the most serious concerns, including poor clinical care, 20 March 2010, had to fulfil the four conditions for verbally abusive and unprofessional behaviour by staff reconfigurations set out by my right hon. Friend the towards patients and colleagues, and a lack of learning Secretary of State, which include consulting local people from maternal deaths and incidents. The report states: within the health economy and local opinion. “Despite some signs of improvement in recent months, patients remain at risk of poor care in this trust”. Andrew Gwynne: I appreciate that, but we heard today that there is a great deal of concern across local It also notes that the trust addresses issues on a short-term authorities and the communities, and I would like to basis, under instruction, rather than proactively looking know what weight was given to their views. for longer term solutions. The report also states: “There is past and current evidence of poor leadership from Margaret Hodge: Does my hon. Friend agree that it some managers and a culture among some staff of poor attitude appears that money has been the key factor in forming and a lack of care for patients, especially in maternity.” the decisions, and not the care of people? The views of That is of extreme concern, and those views have been bureaucrats have taken precedence over the views and reinforced in this debate. The report also confirmed that experiences of local communities. 19WH King George Hospital8 NOVEMBER 2011 King George Hospital 20WH

Andrew Gwynne: Absolutely. We recognise that reorganisation will make it harder for the NHS to tackle reconfiguration is sometimes necessary in parts of the the sorts of problems identified at Barking, Havering country for reasons of financial efficiency, safety and and Redbridge University Hospitals NHS Trust, and better health outcomes. However, people are rightly the wider issue of social care for older people by the disappointed by the way in which the nature of the CQC. The Prime Minister has clearly gone back on his debate changed in the run-up to the general election. As promise on NHS reorganisation. The coalition agreement hon. Members rightly said, the general election was could not have been any clearer: fought with a pledge about hospital closures and “We will stop the top-down reorganisations of the NHS”. reconfigurations that is not being met. Back in 2010, the It is difficult to see how the coalition Government could now Prime Minister clearly promised a moratorium to have said that, when only weeks later they published a stop closures. Indeed, in opposition both he and the White Paper outlining the biggest reorganisation of the Secretary of State toured the country making promises NHS since 1948. It is clear that such a change on this to overturn some very difficult reconfiguration decisions scale is the last thing that the NHS needs right now. taken by the previous Labour Government. Yet, as we have seen, the moratorium has not materialised, and Returning to the more specific question about Barking, there is now evidence of major changes to hospital Havering and Redbridge trust and the future of King services across the country. George hospital, given the CQC report and what hon. Members have said today, what consideration has the I do not want to stray too far from the subject, but it Minister given to the ability of Queen’s hospital to deal is worth remembering that the Prime Minister gave a with the added pressures on its services when King firm pledge not to close services at Chase Farm hospital, George hospital closes its A and E and maternity services? but in September 2011 the Secretary of State accepted On the face of it, no consideration has been given to the the recommendations of the IRP and approved the local support for keeping A and E and maternity services downgrading and closure of services at Chase Farm. at King George hospital. If services are to be transferred— Similarly, at the Fairfield maternity department near the Minister says within two years—does he recognise Bury, we were told on a visit by the now Secretary of that people need certainty, and that NHS staff need State that the service would be kept open. We now know proper expectations to plan and manage those changes? that the maternity department at Fairfield General hospital If those time scales are not met, what plans are in place is scheduled to close in March 2012. for NHS services in that part of London? My hon. Friend the Member for Ilford South raised The concerns expressed by Members today are right, concerns about the ability of Queen’s hospital to improve and need to be addressed by the Minister. Also, the when the NHS faces tough financial challenges in the wider changes to the NHS will make it much harder to years ahead. That is fair comment. At the general identify such failures in care in future and to deal with election, Labour promised to guarantee to maintain them effectively. That is why we are so against what the NHS front-line funding in real terms. In contrast, the Government are doing to our national health service. Prime Minister offered real-terms increases. We can debate that another time, but I would suggest that that was just an electoral gimmick. The Treasury figures show that in 2009-10 health spending was £102,751 million 10.50 am in the last year of the Labour Government. In 2010-11, The Minister of State, Department of Health (Mr Simon actual health spending was £101,985 million. Burns): It is a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship today, Mr Brady. Mr Burns: Will the hon. Gentleman be kind enough I congratulate the hon. Member for Ilford South to tell hon. Members that the health spending figures (Mike Gapes) on securing the debate because, from for the financial year 2010-11 were set by his own personal experience in a previous debate and from meetings, Government, and that, for the lifetime of this Parliament I know that he and other right hon. and hon. Members and thereafter, we are increasing health spending in real have a tremendous interest in, and concern about, securing terms, albeit a modest increase because of the financial the highest-quality health care for their constituents. I mess we inherited, which needs to be sorted out? share their desire for excellent health services in hospitals and in the community, whether in Barking, Dagenham, Andrew Gwynne: I said that that was the actual health Ilford or elsewhere in London and the country. That is spend for the first year of this Government, which why it is so important that the issues raised by the Care represents a real-terms cut of £766 million, according Quality Commission’s investigation into Barking, Havering to Treasury figures. That includes the GDP deflator, and Redbridge university hospitals NHS trust are acted which so excited the Minister during the Opposition on immediately and that safe services are realised and day debate when my hon. Friend the Member for Leicester sustained. West (Liz Kendall) tried to raise this issue. That is the Before I go on, I extend my sympathies to anyone first cut in health spending for 14 years. Indeed, that is who has experienced poor care at the trust. We can all the first real-terms cut since the last year of the previous be united in our concern and, in certain cases, even Conservative Government in 1996-97. The Government horror at what the CQC report showed. It is unacceptable promised a real-terms increase in health spending; they in this day and age for services to deteriorate to that have delivered a real-terms cut. level, with such low-quality patient care. The improvement There are wider concerns about how the Health and of the quality of care in that area and throughout the Social Care Bill will impact on local health services. NHS is crucial—it is imperative and a priority. I can The extensive reorganisation of the NHS was not put assure right hon. and hon. Members that the Secretary forward by either party in government in their manifestos, of State, my ministerial colleagues and I take such or in the coalition agreement. Clearly, such a massive issues every bit as seriously as they do. 21WH King George Hospital8 NOVEMBER 2011 King George Hospital 22WH

Although the CQC report identified some risk of midwives to the trust. For an initial period of eight poor care throughout the trust, it is the maternity weeks, Caesarean sections have been transferred from service that requires immediate action and where the the trust to Homerton university hospital in Hackney. biggest risk of poor care was identified. The local NHS All such actions are having an immediate impact on the has taken immediate action at the trust to ensure that ground and protect patients. services are safe. NHS London and the Outer North In February of this year, the trust gained a new chief East London PCT cluster have been working in executive, Ms Dongworth. The CQC and NHS London collaboration with the trust to manage capacity and have confidence in her, and have given her their full demand, to support its clinical leadership and to address support. The CQC reported: the gaps in capability. “Almost without exception, staff were positive about the impact Margaret Hodge: Will the Minister therefore ensure the new Chief Executive is having at the Trust. They have embraced the Chief Executive’s inclusive style and believe, for the first time that the unit at Barking hospital is open before Christmas? in many years, that there is a real opportunity for positive change.” Mr Burns: Since the right hon. Lady has specifically mentioned it, I will discuss that now, instead of later as It is my belief that such positive leadership can help the I had intended. There is a plan to move the midwifery-led trust to move forward from the report and to continue unit services into Barking hospital; that is continuing, to make the improvements that are so badly needed. A high priority for the hospital, and currently I believe recruitment drive has already brought in an additional that capacity is about 50%. She ought to have waited 72 midwives, enabling the trust to have one of the best until she had heard the end of my answer. If she wants midwife to birth ratios anywhere in London, and one of to intervene again, I point out that I have only been left the highest levels of senior doctor cover. There is now seven minutes and there is a lot to deal with. However, it regular, independent monitoring of performance every is not for me in Whitehall to micro-manage decisions; week. The trust has made it absolutely clear that continuing services and the speed at which services are provided to improve is its top priority. All local NHS partners are must be a local decision by the local health economy. committed to making that happen. The Secretary of The only assurance I can give—it is an assurance—is State will also actively monitor developments. that the MLU is a priority for the hospital. I am advised I now pick up on a point made by my hon. Friend the that the whole service is expected to be provided at Member for Ilford North (Mr Scott) which, to be fair, Barking hospital by April 2012, which I think is the date I think was a special plea about his urgent care centre. given to the right hon. Lady. The urgent care centre at King George will see the NHS London continues to monitor closely the actions majority of patients who already attend. I must advise taken in the local NHS, including twice-weekly discussions my hon. Friend that few blue-light cases are actually with all key stakeholders, as well as regular meetings taken to that unit. He might have been hoping that I with the PCT cluster, the trust and NHS London’s would do something to upgrade the centre to an accident performance and chief nurse’s teams. Some concrete and emergency unit, but I am afraid that that is not actions, which I hope reassure right hon. and hon. within my remit. However, under the modernisation of Members, have already been taken. To ensure safety, the NHS, nothing prevents the clinical commissioning NHS London, PCTs and the trust decided to cap the group, when commissioning care for its patients, from number of deliveries to 20 a day at Queen’s and seven a looking at the situation if it is so minded. If it wants to day at King George from the beginning of October. In commission enhanced levels of care in an urgent care or collaboration with the South West Essex commissioning A and E centre, it has the powers to do so if it wishes. cluster, a number of women with Essex postcodes due I cannot prejudge what a local CCG might or might not to give birth at Queen’s or King George will give, and want to commission in the future, but the opportunity is have given, birth in hospitals in Essex instead. Additional, available. part-time professionals are being brought in—including Owing to the shortage of time in the debate, I have the well-respected head of midwifery from the Royal not been able to answer all the points made by the hon. Free hospital—to support the maternity unit until Member for Ilford South, or by the right hon. Member substantive leadership can be appointed. for Barking (Margaret Hodge) and the hon. Member Five supervisors of midwives from surrounding trusts for Dagenham and Rainham (Jon Cruddas). I commit have agreed to support the team at Queen’s. A senior to writing to them with the answers to their specific obstetrician has been recruited and will begin working points, made during this interesting and in many ways with the trust shortly. Given CQC concerns about the traumatic debate. I appreciate, as they do as constituency number of vacancies and the skill mix in the maternity MPs, that it is totally unacceptable to have poor-quality work force, NHS London’s chief nurse has set up a health care for our constituents and for patients within midwifery leadership scheme to attract 12 experienced the NHS. 23WH 8 NOVEMBER 2011 Grammar Schools 24WH

Grammar Schools I do not claim that grammar schools are for everyone. It is a case of horses for courses. Some children flourish in academic surroundings, and others do not. We must 11 am cater for all children, and grammar schools play a vital Gareth Johnson (Dartford) (Con): It is a pleasure, role in that diversity. A one-size-fits-all education system Mrusb Brady, to serve under your chairmanship, the must never be our goal. Such a system can only help one irony of which will not be lost on hon. Members who sort of child. Children have different needs, talents and are present. I know that you take a keen interest in capabilities, and our education system should reflect education matters. that. I applied for this debate because grammar schools are I make no secret of my support for selective education. an important and integral part of the education system It gave me the opportunity to specialise in academic in the United Kingdom. They provide social mobility work within the state system, an opportunity that tends and opportunity for thousands of children every year, to be available elsewhere only in the private school and are hugely popular with pupils and parents alike in system. I do not claim to be part of a rags-to-riches the areas where they are found and beyond. It may help tale—I never wore rags and, unfortunately, I am not if I give a brief history of how they were established. rich—but I come from a modest working-class background. My father was a milkman. I went to the local state Grammar schools were created during the second primary school, and I was fortunate to pass the 11-plus, world war, and promoted by the Labour Government and to go to Dartford grammar school. I used that that was formed in 1945, but it is fair to say that opportunity to become a solicitor and now a Member subsequent Labour Governments have had a less of Parliament. The social mobility that that education enthusiastic approach to them. In 1965, Harold Wilson gave me would be difficult to find outside the grammar declared an end to selection in schools—a diktat that school system. It is wrong to suggest that only was withdrawn by Ted Heath in 1970, after which date comprehensive schools provide equal opportunities for the matter was left to local education authorities. That children. was again changed in 1974 by the re-elected Harold Wilson, who obliged LEAs to close grammar schools, a situation that was repealed in 1979 by Margaret Thatcher. Kevin Brennan (Cardiff West) (Lab): If it is hard to The Government’s recent announcement allows an find social mobility outside the grammar school system, expansion of existing schools, and I congratulate the how does the hon. Gentleman account for my social Minister on that announcement. mobility as a comprehensive school pupil?

Mark Field (Cities of London and Westminster) (Con): Gareth Johnson: I am not saying that there are no Before my hon. Friend finishes his history lesson, which examples of social mobility among non-selective schools, is timely—I congratulate him on obtaining this important but in my experience it is common for children who go debate—surely one problem in the post-war era and one to grammar schools to benefit enormously from the reason for the hostility on one side of politics to the social mobility that they offer. grammar school system was the failure of the plan to What is unique about grammar schools is that they build up technical schools and colleges as part of enable specialisation in academic work, which is not the 1944 Butler Act settlement. Will he congratulate the always available, not should it be, in other schools. In Government on their tremendous work in the past some areas with exclusively comprehensive schools, the 18 months in developing technical schools, which I catchment area around good non-selective schools hope will work in tandem with a strong and thriving experiences higher house prices than in areas around grammar school system well into the future? less-well-performing comprehensive schools, which leads to poorer families being unable to send their children to Gareth Johnson: My hon. Friend makes a pertinent the best performing schools in the area. and correct point. Having a range of options available To return to the point made by the hon. Member for for children is undoubtedly the key to a good and Cardiff West (Kevin Brennan), social mobility may successful education system. We should not try to pretend suffer in areas without selective education. Grammar that all children are alike, and that they have the same schools provide an equal chance for children from poorer needs and desires in the education system. The Minister’s backgrounds. Common sense suggests that children will recent announcement is a huge step towards the goal learn more when placed with children of similar academic that I would like to reach—new grammar schools where ability. parents and local authorities want that option. Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP): Grammar schools Mr Andrew Turner (Isle of Wight) (Con): Does my clearly push academia, and push pupils to achieve above hon. Friend accept that it is not only those at grammar what they may think they can do. An example in my schools who like grammar schools and secondary modern area is Regent House school in Newtownards, where schools? Rugby, where I used to live, had both sorts and one young fellow achieved six A-levels, four of which they were very welcome. were 100% passes. That proves that if children are in the right school and are pushed hard, they do well. Gareth Johnson: Yes. Grammar schools have a positive effect on non-selective schools in the areas where they Gareth Johnson: The hon. Gentleman makes an are found. Boroughs where there are grammar schools important point. I think I am right in saying that tend to have some of the best exam results, which is Northern Ireland has a completely selective school system. evidence of the positive impact that grammar schools I have taken the liberty of obtaining some figures on may have not just on their own environment, but beyond. exam success in Northern Ireland compared with England. 25WH Grammar Schools8 NOVEMBER 2011 Grammar Schools 26WH

I do not doubt that there are caveats attached, and I will most over-subscribed school in Kent. They form as give him the figures after the debate. According to the crucial a part of the educational system as the grammar Library, in England, just under 70% of GCSE entries schools, and benefit from the existence of grammar were awarded a grade C or higher, compared with just schools. under 75% in Northern Ireland; and 76% of A-level entries in England were awarded a grade C or higher compared with 84% in Northern Ireland. That is the Mark Field: We all know that the existence and proof of the pudding. Northern Ireland has a completely indeed excellence and elitism of grammar schools have selective process and, with caveats attached, it has improved been a matter of dispute in our party. Does my hon. exam success as a result. Friend agree—I hope the Minister will discuss this later—that if we can commit to making academies the grammar schools of the 21st century, places of great Kevin Brennan: Is the hon. Gentleman aware that elitism and excellence, the culture war that has existed Andreas Schleicher, statistician at the OECD, who is within the Conservative party can come to a close and often cited by the Secretary of State as being the most we can look firmly to the future? important man in education, makes it clear in his pronouncements that the best and most effective education system for all pupils is non-selective? Gareth Johnson: I very much hope that that will be considered in due course by the Department. I have Gareth Johnson: Education will always provoke spoken about the benefit that grammar schools offer differences of opinion. Some academics disagree with children from poorer backgrounds. Children who receive other academics, but common sense seems to dictate free school meals in grammar schools achieve almost an that it is right to have different types of schools because equal success those who do not have free school meals— we have different types of children. What is inherently 95.6%, compared with an overall figure of 98%. However, wrong with the comprehensive system is that it is a pupils in non-selective schools who have free schools one-size-fits-all system. It tries to put all children, of all meals achieve far less in examinations—30.9%, compared types and varieties, into one bag. Common sense dictates with an overall figure of 55%. That confirms my point that that surely cannot be right. that pupils from the poorest backgrounds have most to Common sense also suggests that children learn more gain from the grammar school system. when they are placed with other children with similar My hon. Friend the Member for Cities of London abilities, and that has been shown in the streaming that and Westminster (Mark Field) highlighted the potential takes place more and more often in non-selective schools. for academies, and I welcome the freedom that the I cannot understand why some people believe that it is Government have given to schools to become academies. acceptable to stream within a school, but not between The new freedoms allow schools to become flexible in schools. That simply does not make any sense whatever. their approach to education. The Department for Education Grammar schools are generally good schools, and heaven has wisely allowed grammar schools to continue to knows we need to look after good schools. We need select on academic ability when they convert to academy them to ensure that we educate our population and that status. I hope that the Department will soon consider the country’s future is secure. allowing academies that did not previously select on More than 98% of children who attend a grammar academic ability to do so. Grammar schools are popular. school achieve five GCSEs or more compared with 80% They provide excellent education, offer social mobility in comprehensive and independent schools. I concede and enable many children to reach their maximum that those figures may not cause surprise, because selective potential. We need to allow them to flourish. schools are, by their nature, full of children with a record of academic achievement. However, when we look at A-level success where there has already been a 11.13 am record of achievement at the GCSE stage, grammar Mr Rob Wilson (Reading East) (Con): I congratulate schools again out-perform all other forms of schooling. my hon. Friend the Member for Dartford (Gareth In addition, boroughs with grammar schools tend to Johnson) on securing this extremely important debate. out-perform boroughs with none, so grammar schools His commitment to grammar schools is well known. I help all the schools in the area to perform better. note that he is a distinguished alumnus of Dartford In my constituency of Dartford, we have four grammar grammar school, along with Sir Mick Jagger. schools: Dartford grammar school, where I was a pupil; Dartford grammar school for girls, where I am a governor; Reading school, in my constituency, can boast my Wilmington grammar school for boys; and Wilmington hon. Friends the Members for Cities of London and grammar school for girls. Each offers something different, Westminster (Mark Field) and for North East Hertfordshire and each provides academic specialisation, which is (Oliver Heald) as Old Redingensians. While not easily highly sought after in the area, particularly by children described as rock stars, they have equally made their from modest backgrounds. My neighbour and hon. mark in the world of politics. Friend the Member for Bexleyheath and Crayford (Mr Evennett) is a passionate supporter of grammar Mark Field (Cities of London and Westminster) (Con): schools in his constituency. I know that his constituents My hon. Friend has missed out the black sheep of the enjoy the benefit of grammar schools in my area, and family; the right hon. Member for Oxford East (Mr Smith) vice versa. was also an alumnus of Reading school. Despite the It is a myth that non-selective schools in selective disadvantage of a grammar school education, he still school areas inevitably suffer. In Dartford, we have managed to go to Oxford and become a Cabinet Minister, first-rate non-selective academies, one of which is the albeit in a Labour Government. 27WH Grammar Schools8 NOVEMBER 2011 Grammar Schools 28WH

Gareth Johnson: That is an excellent intervention. I parents of pupils currently in grammar schools. Why recall that his hairstyle back in those days was very should parents of children attending a grammar school much like a rock star’s. be disfranchised in decisions about the school’s future, As a keen supporter of grammar schools, I have as parents and their children will be affected by the campaigned vigorously to protect them in my constituency, outcome of any ballot? and I am delighted to contribute to the debate today. Is it right that 10 faceless people can cause huge Grammars have played a significant part in the important instability at local schools that have served the people of role of social mobility. Through selection, grammars Reading so well for so long? Recently, when those offer our most academic young people and constituents faceless individuals started that ballot process, it caused across the country excellent educational opportunities. huge problems. How does a school cope with a threat to Academic selection in secondary education is often the its future? The uncertainty it causes for staff, parents focus of rigorous debate, and we are getting a flavour of and pupils is significant. Enormous effort and expense that this morning. Some have argued that grammar has to go into administering the ballot and putting the schools are an impediment to social mobility, but that case for the school, taking time away from the important view is profoundly wrong. Our 160-odd grammar schools teaching effort that has to go on. It was both wrong and continue to offer fantastic opportunities to gifted pupils unfair, and it should never have been allowed to happen. from more disadvantaged backgrounds, thus unlocking In short, the episode in Reading exposed a gaping all the potential that an academically rigorous education democratic deficit whereby a tiny, unrepresentative part can provide. of Reading’s community managed to unsettle two schools Far from impeding social mobility, our grammar along with their staff, pupils and parents. Because of schools encapsulate the driving principle of aspiration the disruption and potential expense to our grammar and ambition. The Prime Minister has said, when staving schools, I hope that the Minister will look at the initial off class-based attacks from the left about his educational trigger point for initiating such a ballot, which should background, “It matters not where you come from, but surely be well above 10 anonymous people. Working where you are going.” Grammar schools reflect that closely with Reading school’s head teacher, Mr John ethos. They are precisely about where someone is going, Weeds, we lobbied Ministers in the Department for not where they are from. They provide a ladder of Education. As a result, we have an undertaking from opportunity, and I fail to see how that is an impediment, the Minister that amendments will be made to the as some have described. funding agreement, which I hope will achieve greater If we take social mobility seriously, as I do, it is clarity. fundamentally important that our grammar schools are For now, the threat to Reading’s grammar schools safeguarded and that threats to their future are taken has been temporarily beaten back, but it could return at seriously, but those who wish to threaten and destroy any time. If they wish, the same 10 people in Reading our grammar schools do not rest. Their commitment to could return with their protest year after year, and the vandalising some of the best schools that state education Government must change the rules so that if a ballot provides continues undiminished, as I recently found in attempt fails one year, it cannot be constantly repeated. Reading. Such a strategy could become a device for destabilising Reading is on the front line of the battle to protect grammar schools all over the country, and I would have our grammar schools. Reading East is fortunate to have grave concerns for the remaining grammar schools in two excellent grammar schools: Reading school, which England should it be repeated elsewhere. In defending I have already mentioned, and Kendrick school, which the few grammar schools that we have left, it seems that is a girls’ grammar school. Both schools feature at the the price of their retention will be constant vigilance, top of the nation’s league tables for educational attainment, unless the Government make significant and necessary a fact of which I am enormously proud. Despite their changes to the legislation. I am therefore encouraged to excellence, Reading’s grammar schools find themselves see that so many determined hon. Members are firmly fixed in the crosshairs of those who seek to kick participating in this important debate. away the ladder of opportunity that they offer by To remove grammar schools would be to remove a removing their ability to select pupils. This year, a mere specialist part of our state education system that seeks 10 Reading residents formed an anonymous group to to maximise a pupil’s academic potential. Critics of put a petition together to trigger a ballot to end grammar grammar schools—usually, although not exclusively, school education in Reading. from the left—say that those who do not pass the Without wishing to suck this debate into the realm of selection criteria for a grammar school education will in legal complexities, the law pertaining to a ballot was some way be left behind by the system. That argument, confusing and flawed, because the grammars had converted however, is flawed. Not every pupil is academic in to academy status, as they had been encouraged to do orientation, but that does not mean that their potential by the Government. A lack of synergy was exposed should be left unfulfilled. Too often, our state education between annex E of the academy funding agreements system has let down technically gifted as well as academically and the provisions of the School Standards and Framework gifted pupils, and we need schools that reflect the abilities Act 1998, the legislation that sets out the regulations of all pupils. pertaining to grammar school ballots. The confusion That is why I am delighted that university technical focused on the 20% petition threshold of local people colleges are growing in number and strength, and last eligible to vote in the ballot—namely, parents at feeder week I joined Lord Baker of Dorking in celebrating and primary schools. promoting the success of such colleges at a parliamentary It is also worth noting that the ballot itself, should it reception with rest of the UTC community—a community have gone ahead, was undemocratic, because it comprised which now looks more like a movement. By departing only parents from primary feeder schools and not the from a one-size-fits-all approach to education, both 29WH Grammar Schools8 NOVEMBER 2011 Grammar Schools 30WH types of school serve the interests of social mobility. It to access the grammar school system. Other counties is about being holistic, serving pupils in the system and have few grammar schools. That is a pity, because the reflecting their needs accordingly. Our grammar schools schools attract only a small number of children, which do precisely that, and they deserve our unwavering may not include a representative percentage of the support. population as a whole. In many ways, that supports my advocacy of the need for more grammar schools to 11.23 am create a proper mixed environment and educational system that is appropriate for different children with Laura Sandys (South Thanet) (Con): I thank my hon. different abilities at different ages. Friend the Member for Dartford (Gareth Johnson) for securing the debate. He has said many things that I As my hon. Friends and I have said, grammar schools agree with, particularly on the Kent grammar school do not work in isolation, and when seeking excellence in system. our grammar schools it is crucial that we also seek it in our high schools and other schools in the area. We When I arrived in Kent as a parliamentary candidate, cannot promote grammar schools without promoting a I had no great understanding of the grammar school mixed educational environment. system although I did have an open mind. I wanted to find out what parents felt about the issue, and when Kent is lucky to have very good high schools, and I knocking on doors I came across families in which one ask the Department to look at how they are judged child went to a grammar school and the other to the during Ofsted reports. It is important that the system in high school. Sometimes the child at the high school which those schools operate is understood by Ofsted, went on to sixth form at the grammar school. I found and that the 30% of children in my area who enter the that Kent had an integrated system and that it was grammar school system is understood in the context of impossible to knock on a door and say, “That is a what those high schools have achieved in that mixed grammar school house,” or, “That is a high school and selective system. house.” Perhaps that has something to do with the I wish to be clear on three points. First, we must not number of grammar schools in Kent. In my constituency, undermine excellence. I was concerned to hear about as in that of my hon. Friend, there are four grammar the campaign in Reading, because if we end up with a schools. That means that 30% of young people in my situation in which grammar schools, which are excellent constituency go to a grammar school, and it also allows schools, are threatened or put under pressure by parents, children who have finished their high school education we will do our education system a big disservice. Secondly, to attend sixth-form college at a grammar school. People I would like the Department to be clear about the can access that excellence at any time. opportunities and social mobility offered by grammar One thing that struck me very starkly was the issue of schools, when there are enough of them in an area to social mobility. We look for excellence in education, and enable them to increase their intake. Thirdly, I will no one disputes that grammar schools provide that. always be dedicated to my high schools, and I am clear There is always, however, a big question about whether that they need to achieve a huge amount. The Government grammar schools attract only children from middle-class must understand the selective nature of the system in families. One school in my constituency, Chatham House, which they operate. surveyed its pupils’ parents and found that only 20% We are looking to increase opportunities for schools had been through higher education. That means that to expand, extend their interests and attract parental 80% of children at that school will be the first generation choice, and that will be the same for grammar schools, to go into further education or university. For me, that high schools and technical colleges. At the same time, provided a stark understanding of the issue, and it we must maintain and sustain the excellence that currently sounded a clarion call that we are talking about a route exists in our grammar school system. into higher education for a first generation of children. In one of the richer areas of east Kent—an interesting 11.29 am thing to say, because the area has high levels of deprivation—Sir Roger Manwood’s grammar school in Mr Robert Syms (Poole) (Con): Like other hon. Sandwich has an average number of children on free Members, I know how dear this subject is to you, school meals. Again, that reasserts the message coming Mr Brady. No doubt you are having occasion to bite across from teachers. your tongue in order to be an impartial Chair. I start with the usual caveat that I enter in such Kevin Brennan: I am sure that the statistics that the debates. The vast majority of children go to comprehensive hon. Lady has quoted are correct, but is she aware that schools, and if we are to remain a first-class economy, overall, the ratio of state to grammar schools is 25:1? we must raise education standards for all children in the There are 158 pupils on free school meals in non-grammar United Kingdom, in whatever sector they are being schools for every one in a grammar school. The ratio is educated. However, that does not mean that we should 158:1, rather than 25:1, which is what it should be. Is the not value and cherish the 160-odd grammar schools. grammar school mentioned by the hon. Lady highly Looking around the Chamber, I see a smattering of the unusual? geography of Britain where parents banded together in the bad old days and managed to maintain their grammar Laura Sandys: It is not unusual for me or for parents schools, as we have done in the Poole and Bournemouth who send their children to grammar schools in my area, area. These schools have suffered hostility and sometimes but different counties have different systems. Kent has a indifference. I am glad that at last we have a Government high number of grammar schools that are attended by who appreciate the value that these 160 schools bring to between 25% and 30% of children. That offers a huge the UK and the chances that they give to the children opportunity for young people from diverse backgrounds who go to them. 31WH Grammar Schools8 NOVEMBER 2011 Grammar Schools 32WH

[Mr Robert Syms] most of the country. To be fair, in the 1950s and ’60s, although the grammar schools were successful, both One of the saddest things over the past 20 or 30 years parties were worried about the failure across Britain in because of the changes is that a bigger divide has terms of skills and attainment of those who did not developed in the UK, in that those from a middle-class have the chance to go to grammar schools. background who can afford to pay for education have As I have said, I entered teaching at the time of more opportunities, whereas some of those from more comprehensivisation. The phrase used at the time was disadvantaged backgrounds have found that with the that it would be a grammar school education for everybody. demise of grammar schools in many areas, their My first comprehensive school was in Tottenham— opportunities have not expanded as much as they might Northumberland Park school, just behind the Spurs have done 10, 20, 30 or 40 years ago. It is still amazing ground. In a sense, that was my education in how to me to see the people whom this country has produced political education is. who make a major contribution to business, to universities I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Dartford and to the media who came from a grammar school (Gareth Johnson) on securing this debate. It is a pity background. that there are no Labour Members present other than We must cherish and support the grammar schools the shadow Minister, the hon. Member for Cardiff West that we have. They provide a beacon for the academy (Kevin Brennan), but I hope that we will hear from him programme. I understand why the Government have that this will be the end of the grammar school wars. focused more on academies than on grammar schools. Clearly, everyone is in favour of grammar schools, but Kevin Brennan: Would the hon. Gentleman also like not everyone is in favour of the 11-plus. Rather than to hear from the Liberals on this issue? arguing about that, it was probably right and proper to get on with the academy programme, which seems to be Eric Ollerenshaw: Well, there you go. What I am building up a head of steam. The existence of grammar trying to say is that I hope—my hon. Friend the Minister schools will allow many academies to look at the way in has already indicated this—we will see the end of the which they teach their pupils. I am thinking of the grammar school wars. I think that all parties have streaming, the uniforms and the whole ethos of those learned from the mistakes that we made and the destruction schools. If the expansion of the academy programme of good schools that took place in the genuine attempt sees many academies adopt those things, that may be a to create all-purpose comprehensives for everybody. quicker way of ensuring that the widest possible number Let us consider what happened in the ’70s and ’80s. I of pupils get a better chance in life. shall give a personal example. I remember as a teacher in Tottenham at the time trying to bring in an A-level We come into politics to make a difference, or at least course—France under Louis XIV—and being challenged we hope to make a difference. Of course, it is terribly by other teachers who said, “Do you think they’re good difficult for any of us to measure what difference we enough for this, Eric?” The penny then began to drop make. However, the changes that the Government are that somehow there was a dumbing down in the system. making to school admissions, particularly as they relate No teacher in that comprehensive sent their child to it. to grammar schools, really are a major difference, because Most moved to the higher reaches of Hornsey to get the presumption against expansion is to go, which near the comprehensive there. There was a classification means that good schools will be able to expand. I have of comprehensives, but only the middle-class, trained no doubt that one of the most important announcements professionals knew the distinctions. made by the Government is the one that will allow grammar schools to expand, because they are popular My family background is that I was the first one who and more people will wish to go to them, providing that passed the 11-plus and all that stuff, but my parents and they meet the standards. That is the first staging post on grandparents did not understand the system. I just went the way to cherishing and perhaps expanding this sector to a school where I managed to pass the 11-plus and in the future as a major beacon for educational standards. ended up in a grammar school. Hon. Members can imagine that loads of parents in Tottenham did not I do not intend to say much more, but the number of understand that there were distinctions between the colleagues present for the debate says something about schools. We must remember that that was the day and how strongly they feel. The Minister and I are old age when schools did not publish their results. There friends, and I am pleased with and proud of what he is were huge battles to get schools to publish results, so doing in the Department to improve standards and people had to be really in the know in order to know opportunities not only for those from prosperous which comprehensive produced better results than the backgrounds, but for those from poorer backgrounds. other comprehensives. Then there were all the other things that we tried. I 11.33 am started off teaching mixed ability. Then we tried setting Eric Ollerenshaw (Lancaster and Fleetwood) (Con): and then, as has been said, streaming. Then we had Like other hon. Members, I am the product of a grammar social priority schools and social priority staff, which school—Hyde County grammar school, which was meant that we got extra money. I managed to keep that destroyed in the grammar school wars. On the other extra money until 2000, when I finished, but that was side of things, I went into teaching in 1973, in the another problem with the bureaucratic system. In addition heyday of comprehensivisation, with a genuine desire to all those different attempts to do things, there were for comprehensives to succeed, because there was, in a new subjects, including integrated humanities, cross- sense, no golden age. I think that it was my hon. Friend curricular studies and sociology—I think I happen to the Member for Cities of London and Westminster be the only Conservative in education who ever taught (Mark Field) who remarked on the failure of the tripartite sociology to A-level. We made all those attempts to do system, because there was not a tripartite system in something with the system, having destroyed the previous 33WH Grammar Schools8 NOVEMBER 2011 Grammar Schools 34WH system, even though, as hon. Members have said, every 11.41 am school and every area are totally different. If results can Esther McVey (Wirral West) (Con): I congratulate my be measured, people can understand those results, and hon. Friend the Member for Dartford (Gareth Johnson) if the schools are achieving, let them get on with it. on raising this issue. All of us are saying that grammar One of the bravest things that we did in opposition schools provide excellent education for all children from was finally to stop the wars and say that we support the all backgrounds. As my hon. Friend the Member for academies programme. I hope that that will be reciprocated South Thanet (Laura Sandys) explained most powerfully, and that we can pull out of the political wars about we would not necessarily know what schools people’s education. I now find myself the Member for Lancaster children go to when we are knocking on doors while out and Fleetwood, where there are two grammar schools. canvassing. One is Lancaster Royal grammar school, which claims For me, the debate is about acknowledging grammar a history going back to the 13th century. It is a boarding schools and the excellent work they do. It is also about state grammar school. I thank the Minister, who had a acknowledging the part they play in the educational meeting with some of us who represent state boarding system. There are a number of different kinds of schools, schools. I hope that that is another area in which we and grammar schools are just one, but we cannot run might see an increase now that we are in the era of free away from the fact that they do an excellent job. They schools—let them get on with it. My area also has need to be supported, and I am delighted that the Lancaster Girls’ grammar school, which dates back to Government are backing them, which will enable them 1907. Those schools are very successful. They are to flourish. outstanding schools that provide outstanding opportunities for children. Alongside them, my area has Church of Grammar schools produce consistent successful results England schools, such as Ripley St Thomas school, and well-rounded citizens and adults. I say that as a which has been rated outstanding by Ofsted. Central previous governor of Calday Grange grammar, which is Lancaster high school, a comprehensive school, is just 365 years old this year. I was most impressed by the way about to get its first sixth form. That school provides in which the parents there came together to support not a very good education for those who do not want a only the school, but the pupils in it. I was also impressed grammar school education or a religious school. In by the community engagement there. If parents want a sense, everything is there. There are no problems in my grammar schools and support them—this one has been area—touch wood—with choice in education, simply going for 365 years, and there are many more like it, not because there is huge variety, which is the key. As I have just in Wirral West, but right across Wirral—we must said, we must pull the politics out, let schools get on keep hold of them. Parents know what is right for their with it and allow them to prove by their results what kids and they want these schools to keep going. they can do. The successful results of grammar schools in Wirral I welcome the announcement that grammar schools West speak for themselves, so let me give just a couple will be allowed to expand, but I ask the Minister to go of examples. On the average point score per student, further. On selection criteria, the school admissions Calday Grange grammar gets 34.5% above the average code specifically mentions selective schools and in the country, Upton Hall school for girls gets 37% above the average and West Kirby grammar gets nearly “designated grammar schools that rank children according to their performance in a test and allocate places to those who score 40% above the average. On the five A to C grades at highest”. GCSE, Calday Grange grammar is 44.5% higher than the average, Upton Hall is 35.5% higher and West Kirby It then has some rules about siblings who can or cannot grammar school is 43.5% higher. That is outstanding, go to such schools. If we are to go the whole hog on free and it is part of the grammar school system. Why try to schools—if we are letting 100 flowers bloom and all mend something that is not broken? Why take away that—let us start pulling out the regulation and something that is unbelievably successful? discrimination that have been built up against grammar schools, which hon. Members say provide a successful Wirral grammar school for girls had a 100% pass rate education for children in their patch. for A-level students, with 43% of its pupils getting A* and A grades and 73% getting between A* and B Beyond that, grammar schools that have gone for grades. The school is unbelievably successful. It is ranked academy status are raising the issue of the possible in the top 100 state schools in the country in the Sunday impact of funding still being under the control of local Times list. education authorities and school forums, where there is a predominance of non-academies. There is still work My area desperately needs great schools—I can say to be done on that. As my hon. Friend the Member for that because I am from Merseyside. In fact, every area Reading East (Mr Wilson) has said, there is also could say the same. That really is key when we look at discrimination because people can call for a ballot over the future generation we are creating and at social which school they get. Let us put an end to all that. mobility. Grammar schools have to be the engines for social mobility in communities. The debate is about grammar schools. As my hon. Friend the Member for Poole (Mr Syms) has said, they Grammar schools are academic schools, and our top make up a minority of schools, but they are still very universities look to them. More than 1,000 grammar successful. Let us put an end to these arguments about school pupils went to Oxford and Cambridge after which kind of schools we have, which should be up to taking A-levels in 2008. In areas such as mine, grammar the local area and to parents. We should enable people schools provide an outlet for academic potential. to have the education that they want for their children. We all watch BBC and ITV and select excellence in The Government’s responsibility should simply be to dancing, singing or some other kind of performance— measure success and to build on it, and grammar schools nobody has a problem with that. We all vote on these have been one part of that success. things and say that someone can win because they are 35WH Grammar Schools8 NOVEMBER 2011 Grammar Schools 36WH

[Esther McVey] We retain grammar schools in Rugby because of the hard work and diligence of an earlier generation of the best. Why do we have a problem with looking at politicians, who fought to retain our selective schools in academic excellence and selecting people in that way, the face of the comprehensivisation of Britain. The fact when the whole country is quite happy to send in a text that we have grammar schools is a major asset for the to vote in these shows? community I represent. Our schools are in high demand. Parents move into our area to provide their children Jim Shannon: Why do people vote for Russell Grant with the opportunity to attend a grammar school, and in “Strictly Come Dancing” if this is about excellence? I they also apply from substantial distances—20 or 30 miles cannot understand that. away—to secure that kind of education for their children. We know the schools are popular, and it is because of Esther McVey: To be fair, I think that man has got the high standards and excellence that a grammar school move and groove and slinky hips, and I will be voting provides. My hon. Friend the Member for Dartford for him. As an ex-dancer, I was taken by his dancing gave a full account of the academic qualifications secured abilities. at most grammar schools. I welcome what the Government are doing. I welcome I am pleased that the Government recognise the free schools and academies, because I believe in choice. strengths and qualities that grammar schools can bring The grammar schools in Wirral West are moving to the country, and that they have brought forward a become academies and following the academy route. As policy that will enable them to expand. In Rugby we they progress towards becoming academies, I hope they have been looking forward to the expansion of our will remain true to their beliefs, aims, aspirations and grammar schools in the past few years, because of our founding principles. I hope they will remain the same party’s policy to permit them to grow where there is when they become academies. I hope that our support population growth. Rugby has a very positive approach for them will allow them to flourish, that we do not to new housing development. We have a site that is change a winning formula, and that we ensure that expected to take 6,200 new homes in the next 20 years, these excellent schools remain in our community. and we are expecting the grammar school provision What the coalition Government are doing is a refreshing to increase in proportion. It is great news that we may change. They are offering choice, pushing for discipline, be able to go further. looking to support and encourage all sorts of schools and looking for achievement in every area. Yes, there I am anxious to ensure that our grammar schools must be academic achievement, but there must be should be available for the broadest possible number of achievement and fulfilment for every child. What some children in our community. I have one or two anxieties might do in academia, others might do through practical about the selection process that will take place in an era skills, while others might provide for their community of academies. Until now, the selection arrangements in a very different way. I support all those kids, because for our existing grammar schools have been run by the they all have a talent; we just have to find out what local authority, and I have two concerns about the theirs is and nurture them. process to which the authority has moved in recent years. 11.47 am The first concern is about the need for parents to opt in. That came home clearly to me much as it did to my Mark Pawsey (Rugby) (Con): I am grateful for the hon. Friend the Member for South Thanet (Laura opportunity to speak in this important debate. Like Sandys). I was on a doorstep talking to parents who everyone who has spoken before me, I am a strong had a bright and gifted young child, who had been supporter of grammar schools. Like my hon. Friend the denied the opportunity of a grammar school place Member for Dartford (Gareth Johnson), whom I because they had not filled in the necessary form in time congratulate on securing the debate, I am a product of for the child to take the exam. I was horrified that there the grammar school in the constituency I represent. was a system in which parents must opt in rather than Rugby retains grammar schools, but we have the best opting out. I should like the Minister to comment on an of both worlds because we also have non-selective schools. opt-out system. I recognise that there will be parents We have a non-selective school in Ashlawn that has a who decide that a selective education is not right for grammar stream, and we have two high-class, selective, their children, or who do not want to put their children single-sex grammar schools—Lawrence Sheriff school under the burden of taking a selection exam. However, for boys and Rugby high school for girls. I should if we are to make our grammar schools the engines of declare an interest, in that my daughter is a pupil at the social mobility that they should be, we should make girls’ school. certain that a child’s ability to sit the selection exam is As I say, Rugby has grammar schools, and I am a not determined by their parents’ ability to get a form product of Lawrence Sheriff. My hon. Friend the Member filled in on time, and sent back to the school and local for Isle of Wight (Mr Turner) was there a few years authority. before me, and I came to this place with my hon. Friend the Member for Warrington South (David Mowat), Laura Sandys: Another issue in my constituency is who also went to the school. The school therefore has a that fewer girls than boys apply to grammar school. proud tradition of producing Members of Parliament. There is no reason for that, other than parents’ not At the school, I was in a class with the sons of cement necessarily looking at their girls, and their potential to factory workers and scrap metal merchants, each of go to grammar school, in the same way. My hon. whom was the first member of their family to go to Friend’s system would be extremely interesting, in many university. I therefore have a good understanding of the ways, in relation to opening that up and perhaps increasing role of grammar schools in providing social mobility. the number of girls who apply. 37WH Grammar Schools8 NOVEMBER 2011 Grammar Schools 38WH

Mark Pawsey: My hon. Friend’s intervention is profound. I am very supportive of what the Government are The essence of my support for grammar schools and, I doing in increasing the role of grammar school education, am sure, of the support of other hon. Members present, and I look forward to many children benefiting from is that they should be available to all children. We want the changes that we will make in the years to come. them to be vehicles of social mobility. We want children from less privileged backgrounds to go to them; so my heart went out to the parents I met whose daughter 11.57 am had been denied the opportunity of a grammar school education. Kevin Brennan (Cardiff West) (Lab): Welcome to our proceedings, Mr Sheridan. We have had a very interesting debate, although I feel somewhat as though I am intruding Mr Rob Wilson: Why are not primary schools on a private argument . encouraging parents to put their children in for the examinations, and opting in on behalf of the children? Mr Andrew Turner: What argument? Does my hon. Friend agree that primary schools do not do enough to get their children into grammar schools? Kevin Brennan: I think that there is an argument, because I agree with the Minister that more grammar Mark Pawsey: Absolutely. I share my hon. Friend’s schools should not open, and I sense an undercurrent view. One of the difficulties is that in certain primary among the hon. Members who have spoken that they schools there is an expectation that children will sit the would like more to open. Perhaps if I am wrong about selection exam, whereas in other schools, perhaps in less that, one of them will intervene and tell me so, but no well-off areas, the expectation may not be present; but it one is standing up to speak, so we can take it that they should be. Those schools should put all their children do not agree with the Minister and that they have an forward, to give them the opportunity to participate in argument with his policy— a selective education. Esther McVey: Will the hon. Gentleman give way? I have a second point about the selection process on which I would like the Minister to comment. I have Kevin Brennan: In a minute. I will finish and let the mentioned my daughter, who is currently at grammar hon. Lady intervene in a second, if she will contain her school. My other daughter, who is older, sat the exam slinky hips, as she said in her speech earlier. I apologise—I 10 or 12 years earlier, when the entrants sat several should not have said that: I was simply quoting what practice papers in school and then took the actual she said about “Strictly Come Dancing.” paper in school—an environment that they were all The Minister’s policy is not to open more grammar entirely comfortable with. I am sure that that enabled schools, and I understood from the speeches of other each child sitting the paper to do their best. By the time hon. Members that they want to open more, so perhaps my younger daughter took the exam it had been moved the hon. Lady will clarify matters. to a separate examination centre. At the age of 11, with the entire cohort of other children of that age, she was Esther McVey: I think if the hon. Gentleman was taken to a foreign environment—a school they were not listening to what I was saying, he would know that I familiar with. They sat in rows in the same way we gave full acknowledgment to the grammar schools that would have sat our GCSE and A-level exams. For many we have, and the fact that parents want to keep them. children, the move from the comfortable environment My speech was not about increasing them, or making to somewhere completely different was distressing. They alterations; I was saying that they are an important part are youngsters of 11 years old. Sure, the selection exam of the education system, for which they must be should determine which children are the most capable, acknowledged. and who will benefit— Kevin Brennan: I accept that one hon. Member in the debate agrees with the Minister’s—and the Kevin Brennan: I am very interested in the experience Government’s—policy that more grammar schools should that the hon. Gentleman describes; but is he entirely not be opened. The hon. Lady has made it clear that she comfortable with categorising children in that way at agrees with that. I am looking around the Chamber to the age of 11? see whether other hon. Members want to tell us they agree with the Minister, but I do not see any.

[JIM SHERIDAN in the Chair] Stephen McPartland (Stevenage) (Con) rose— Kevin Brennan: Ah! I am very grateful to the hon. Mark Pawsey: Absolutely comfortable. I know as a Gentleman for intervening on me. parent that it is possible to identify at the age of 11 the children who will benefit from the more rigorous academic Stephen McPartland: I did not speak in the debate, education that would come through a grammar school. but I understood my hon. Friends to be saying that they However, I do not want children to be assessed in an were very proud of the grammar schools in their areas, environment in which they are not entirely comfortable and that they wanted them to have the opportunity to at such a tender, early age. I urge the Minister to do his expand. I believe that it is Government policy that all utmost to ensure that the process of selection is put on a good schools should have the opportunity to expand. more even footing, and that the system is better able to identify those with the ability and skills to benefit from Kevin Brennan: I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman a grammar school education, rather than those who for that clarification. I shall take it then, that all perform particularly well in an exam on a given day in Government Members present do not wish to see more an unknown environment. grammar schools opened across the country, which is 39WH Grammar Schools8 NOVEMBER 2011 Grammar Schools 40WH

[Kevin Brennan] Kevin Brennan: We have made our position clear. Although I am not in favour of selection, it is up to the the Government’s policy, although they support the parents in existing areas, via the ballot mechanism Minister’s move to allow existing grammar schools to described by the hon. Gentleman, to decide whether expand their numbers. they want to keep grammar schools. That has been our policy for many years, and the decision has always been Mr Andrew Turner: I would say that it would be a taken in that way at a local level, previously by local good idea to have grammar schools in areas in which authorities. they do not currently exist, but I would need to consult The hon. Gentleman said that no one is suggesting my electors before I decided which way to vote. that social mobility is possible only through the grammar school route. Perhaps that is not what he wanted to Kevin Brennan: I take from that that the hon. Gentleman suggest, but he made a remark—and I intervened on has some doubts about his own Government’s policy in him, as the record in Hansard will show—that might not allowing more grammar schools to be built; that is have implied that that was what he believed. However, I the logical conclusion of his statement. accept the explanation that that is not the case. I will come on to the evidence that says that non-selective We now know that there is a mixed bag of views systems are more effective than selective ones. among Government Members about the matter. I agree with the Minister that we should not build more grammar The hon. Member for Reading East (Mr Wilson) schools, because selection at age 11, in my view, does objected to the mechanism available to parents, should not work and is wrong. I will expand on that in a they seek to trigger a ballot, to change a selective system moment. in their local area to a non-selective one. There was only one part of his argument that I did not understand. If the presence of grammar schools benefits all children Mr Syms: As the hon. Gentleman is speaking for the and parents in an area, as many of his hon. Friends say Opposition, if he believes that selection at age 11 is is the case, why is he concerned about parents of children wrong, is he in favour of abolishing the 160 grammar in the feeder schools to grammar schools having a vote schools? on keeping a selective system? After all, according to him and his hon. Friends, all those parents would Kevin Brennan: Our policy on the matter is unchanged. benefit massively from the gravitational pull of a selective It should be up to local parents, via the ballot mechanism school in their area. described earlier, to decide whether they want to keep the grammar schools that are in their area. Our policy is unchanged from what it has been for many years. Mr Rob Wilson: My concern is not about parents of children in feeder schools voting—they should be able I congratulate the hon. Member for Dartford (Gareth to do so—but about parents of children in grammar Johnson) on securing the debate. When he opened the schools not being able to vote, and about the fact that debate, he talked about a one-size-fits-all education. He ballots may be triggered by 10 anonymous people collecting told us his story of social mobility, which he attributed a petition. to his attendance at grammar school. He seemed to indicate that that kind of social mobility would not be possible without grammar schools, but I have to tell Kevin Brennan: Leaving aside the issue of the trigger, him that that is not correct. which the hon. Gentleman raised with the Minister—I am sure that the Minister will respond to it—the logic I think I come from a background similar to the hon. of his argument suggests that he would want parents Gentleman’s. My parents both left school at 14. My from all secondary schools in an area to be able to vote father worked in the steelworks and my mother was a in a ballot, because they, too, would all benefit hugely, dinner lady. I attended a comprehensive school and as described by his hon. Friends, from the presence of ended up here via various other institutions along the grammar schools that their children do not attend. By way, including teaching in a comprehensive school, his own logic, all parents in an area should have a say in which the hon. Member for Lancaster and Fleetwood whether the local system should be selective or non-selective. (Eric Ollerenshaw) also did. Social mobility is not dependent However, the current system allows parents of children on attendance at a grammar school. There is conflicting in feeder schools to vote in that way. If he is afraid that evidence regarding the impact of grammar schools on they will vote differently, clearly he is saying that they social mobility, when looked at in the round, and the might not feel that their children are benefiting from evidence that the hon. Member for Dartford cited was having a selective school in their area. That was not the circumstantial rather than conclusive. point that his hon. Friends were making. The hon. Member for South Thanet (Laura Sandys) Gareth Johnson: No one here has suggested that it is mentioned the high schools in her area, and spoke with impossible to have social mobility in non-selective schools. passion and persuasiveness about the school system What we are saying is that there is a high degree of there. It was interesting to hear that non-grammar social mobility in grammar schools, which we are all schools in the area are now referred to as high schools. proud of. Why do we never hear the term “secondary modern” I hope that the hon. Gentleman will clarify something any more? Why are non-grammar schools referred to as for me. He says that he is against selection at 11, yet his high schools, comprehensive schools, sometimes community party has a policy of continuing selection at 11 for the schools or a variety of other appellations? It is for the 164 remaining grammar schools. Does he want a policy reason pointed out by the hon. Member for Lancaster with which he disagrees to remain? and Fleetwood—the tripartite system that existed across 41WH Grammar Schools8 NOVEMBER 2011 Grammar Schools 42WH the country condemned the vast majority of children to The hon. Member for Wirral West made the point second-class schools. That is the truth and the reality of that academic excellence is extremely important, and what the system was like. she referenced the very good schools in her area. I simply reiterate that academic excellence can be catered Eric Ollerenshaw indicated assent. for in good, non-selective schools, whether they are academies, community schools or whatever. Kevin Brennan: The hon. Gentleman is nodding, because he taught in that system and knows what secondary On the point of social mobility and the make-up of modern schools were like, as a whole, across the country. existing grammar schools across the country, in a They provided a second-class and extremely poor education parliamentary answer to my hon. Friend the Member to the children who failed their 11-plus and were unable for Sefton Central (Bill Esterson) in April this year, to attend other schools. which can be found in the Library debate pack for this debate that I am sure hon. Members have seen, the Minister set out the number of year-7 pupils attending Mr Andrew Turner: I have no experience of grammar state-funded secondary schools overall, the number of schools or secondary modern schools on the Isle of those pupils attending grammar schools and then the Wight, because that has not happened to the schools numbers of pupils from a black ethnicity, those who there. Both grammar and secondary modern schools receive free school meals and those who have a statement are doing well in places such as Thanet, the rest of Kent of special educational needs. It must be said that if one and Rugby, where grammar schools remain. They are looks at the Minister’s statistics, it is not the case that good schools; it does not matter what one calls them. grammar schools are purely academically selective; they are clearly socially selective as well. Kevin Brennan: I am not disputing the fact that there are many good schools within a selective system that are not grammar schools. I completely accept the point made by hon. Members about good schools in their Laura Sandys: As I outlined in my contribution, local areas; they will know far better than I the quality different areas have different settlements when it comes to of education offered in those schools. I am simply grammar schools and high schools, and that is important pointing out that when the system was scaled up right to understand. In an area with many grammar schools, across the country in the 1950s and 1960s, the reason there is a much greater cross-section of the population. why the comprehensive movement came along was because When there are only three or four in a county, they are of the failure of that system to cater for the needs of the often in rural areas and people must drive to them. vast majority of children. There is therefore a difference in the systems. We often put an umbrella around all grammar-school systems as The hon. Member for Lancaster and Fleetwood brought if they were one, rather than look at the nuances that to the debate the benefit of his experience as a teacher have developed in different areas with different outcomes. in a London comprehensive school, and he made some valid points about the kind of social selection that can also take place in a comprehensive school. I taught in a Kevin Brennan: In her speech, the hon. Lady made comprehensive school for 10 years, and in my experience the point that the grammar school in her area with a in schools, what counts is not whether a school is free school-meal intake was at exactly the average for selective, but the quality of its leadership, the teachers the area, but that is an exception. It has to be an in the school and the relationship created with parents, exception, and the statistics show that. In 2010, for and the effective enforcement of good standards of example, 96,680 year-7 pupils attending state-funded behaviour in the classroom. Those are the sorts of secondary schools received free school meals out of a issues that count in giving a good education to a child. total number of 549,725. Out of 22,070 grammar school That is perfectly possible—I witnessed it in many pupils, 610 received free school meals. The table goes on comprehensive schools. With the right leadership and to give a percentage, and I must say that, using my the right quality of teaching, we can offer an educational comprehensive school maths, I think the figures are experience for all children in a comprehensive school, wrong in the Minister’s answer. I am sure that it was not including those who are academically gifted. his answer, but perhaps a mistake in translation when it went into the debate pack. The percentage calculations Eric Ollerenshaw: I agree with the hon. Gentleman that I have done to check seem wrong, but what is clear on that, but I just wonder why his party still pursues the from the figures when they are recalculated in a different line of antagonising the remaining grammar schools way is that the ratio of state-school pupils to grammar- and why it would prefer to see even them abolished at school pupils is about 25:1 and yet the ratio for free some point. On his party’s strictures, if the schools are school meals is 158:1. There is clearly a huge amount of good with good teachers and good results, should they social selection going on, but I give those figures with not be allowed to continue? the health warning that they may have been mistranslated along the way. Perhaps the Minister will clarify that—if Kevin Brennan: I am not in the least antagonistic not now, at a later date. towards any school. As I have made clear, our policy is that the parents of children in the feeder schools to such I will not go on much longer except to say that, as I schools should have the decision as to whether a system stated earlier, Andreas Schleicher, the OECD statistician is selective or not. Let us be clear. When discussing who compiles the figures for the programme for grammar schools, it is not just a case of one school, but international student assessment, pointed out at a meeting a selective system in an area. That is the consequence of that I attended that the best school systems in the world having selection. It is quite right that parents should are non-selective. That is a clear conclusion of the have a choice on that. OECD’s research. 43WH Grammar Schools8 NOVEMBER 2011 Grammar Schools 44WH

12.15 pm My hon. Friend the Member for Reading East (Mr Wilson) was right to pay tribute to Reading school, The Minister of State, Department for Education where 78% of the pupils achieved the E-bac, and to (Mr Nick Gibb): I begin by congratulating my hon. Kendrick school, where 72.8% achieved the E-bac. Friend the Member for Dartford (Gareth Johnson) on securing this important debate, which has been interesting Kevin Brennan: At Chislehurst and Sidcup grammar and well argued. As ex-grammar school pupils, we school, only 15% of pupils achieved the E-bac. Does share a familiarity with the high standards and positive the Minister regard that as a failure? experience that grammar schools engender. I also know that he continues to serve as a governor at Dartford Mr Gibb: The hon. Gentleman makes a good point. grammar school for girls to ensure that those standards There are a variety of standards in the list of grammar and values continue. As the Sutton Trust recently reported, schools, and I believe that we will see a rise in that figure more than eight in 10 of girls at that school are accepted that he just quoted in the years ahead, just as we will see at university. At 83%, it is around the same percentage a rise in the proportion of pupils taking the E-bac right as Maidstone grammar school, which I attended for across the state sector as schools focus on achieving one year, where 87% are accepted. That record is testament results in the E-bac. to the work of the school, its staff and the girls themselves. More than nine in 10 pupils go to university from My hon. Friend the Member for Reading East raised Dartford grammar school—the boys school. the issue of the grammar school ballot provisions, both in statute and in annex E to the funding agreement. We This debate comes at a time of almost unprecedented have discussed these issues on a number of occasions reform in our education system, and I am grateful to my and the head teachers of the two schools that he hon. Friend for paying tribute to the work of the mentioned—Reading school and Kendrick school—have Department since May 2010. For too long, standards made very clear representations. Throughout the country, were allowed to slip in far too many schools. I know there have been just 10 petitions since 1998 and only that Sir Michael Wilshaw, Her Majesty’s new chief one went to a ballot. That proposal to abolish a grammar inspector at Ofsted, will bring a resolute determination school, in Ripon, was defeated by a margin of two to to reverse that trend and to return the focus of all one, but we are looking very seriously at the technical schools towards excellence rather than excuses. issues that my hon. Friend raised both today and in Grammar schools ensure that thousands of state- recent weeks. educated pupils move on to higher education and to the My hon. Friend the Member for Lancaster and most competitive universities. Around 1,050 grammar Fleetwood (Eric Ollerenshaw) paid tribute to Lancaster school pupils were studying at Oxford and Cambridge Girls’ grammar school, where 87.3% of the pupils achieved in 2009. Some 98% of pupils in grammar schools achieved the E-bac combination of GCSEs, and to Lancaster five or more GCSEs at grades A* to C, including Royal grammar school, where 81.9% of pupils achieved English and maths, compared with 57.8% of pupils the E-bac combination of GCSEs. Those are excellent nationally. In 2009-10, some 95% of grammar schools schools, and my hon. Friend is right that we should not pupils who were eligible for free school meals achieved be engaged in wars about such excellence. five or more GCSEs at grades A* to C, compared with My hon. Friend the Member for Wirral West (Esther about 31% nationally. The gap between the overall McVey) was right to extol the virtues of Calday Grange figure of 98% and the free school meals figure of some grammar school, where 87.3% of pupils achieved the 95% of those in grammar schools achieving those good E-bac, and the two Wirral grammar schools, where GCSE grades, which is about three percentage points, is 77.3% of pupils achieved the E-bac combination of absolutely critical. That contrasts sharply with the national GCSEs. figure. My hon. Friend the Member for Rugby (Mark Pawsey) In 2009, 55% overall achieved five or more GCSEs at was right to pay tribute to Lawrence Sheriff school and grades A* to C, including English and maths, but for Rugby high school. I listened very carefully to the pupils who were eligible for free school meals the overall important points that he made about the selection figure was just 31%. That gap of 24 percentage points process, and local authorities should be advising parents has stubbornly remained over recent years. That is a about the options that are available to their children, disparity in outcome that we want to close or, at the particularly those who are from more disadvantaged very least, bring closer to the narrower gap that grammar backgrounds. I have also taken on board my hon. schools have achieved for the simple reason that reducing Friend’s important point about the environment in which the attainment gap between pupils from rich and poor the tests are taken. backgrounds is one of the key objectives of the coalition My hon. Friend the Member for South Thanet (Laura Government. The question is how we can achieve that Sandys) raised the issue of the ethos and popularity of objective. How do we spread to the whole state school grammar schools. It is that formula that the Government sector the grammar school ethos of high standards and are now seeking to replicate in every school in the ambition and of placing no limit on achievement? country and for every pupil, irrespective of family No limit on achievement certainly seems to be the background. In this country, we have many exceptional approach taken by Dartford grammar school. It is one schools and teachers who work extremely hard towards of three such schools where, in 2010, more than 95% of achieving those goals—in fact, we have some of the pupils achieved the English baccalaureate’s combination very best schools and teachers in the world—but we of GCSEs. A further nine grammar schools scored also know that many state schools are struggling to above 90%, and 67.9% of grammar pupils achieved the work in what is at times an almost unworkable system E-bac nationally, compared with the overall national of bureaucracy and central control. As a result, we have figure of 15.2%. fallen back in the programme for international student 45WH Grammar Schools8 NOVEMBER 2011 Grammar Schools 46WH assessment rankings, from fourth to 16th in science, Secondly, our drive for greater autonomy has seen from seventh to 25th in literacy and from eighth to 28th 111 of the 164 grammar schools that made those in maths. Our 15-year-olds are two years behind their applications become academies, and many of them peers in Shanghai in maths and a full year behind support other local schools. The vast majority of grammar teenagers in Korea and Finland in reading. schools participate in some form of partnership with other maintained schools or academies, be that an Kevin Brennan: When the Minister cites those figures, exchange of staff, working with students or supporting will he cite the change in the number of countries school leadership. Between them, the newly converted participating in the PISA survey, will he say over what academies have agreed to support more than 700 other period he is quoting and will he also give the Trends in schools and to support fellow head teachers through International Mathematics and Science Study statistics the doubling of the national and local leaders of education for the same period? programmes. Thirdly, it is vital to ensure that improvement is Mr Gibb: Even if we take into account the increasing driven not by the Government but by schools themselves, number of countries taking part in the PISA surveys, through effective accountability that focuses on raising which took place in periodic years from 2000 onwards, standards. We are overhauling the inspections framework the surveys still show this country declining. Also, the to focus on schools’ “core four”responsibilities—teaching, TIMSS survey is different, because it examines the leadership, pupil attainment and pupil behaviour. The curriculum of the countries in which children are tested, E-bac sets a high benchmark against which parents can whereas the PISA survey looks at a common set of hold schools to account, and it helps to narrow the gap questions right across the different countries. The PISA between those from the poorest backgrounds and those survey is the one that we should be concerned about. from the wealthiest backgrounds. The Russell group of universities has been unequivocal Kevin Brennan: It is only fair to put on record that, as about the core GCSEs and A-levels that best equip the Minister knows, Andreas Schleicher, who compiles students for the most competitive courses and the most the PISA statistics, does not agree that there has been competitive universities—English, maths, sciences, any absolute decline in performance in this country. geography, history and modern or traditional languages. However, nine out of 10 pupils in state schools who are Mr Gibb: However, Andreas Schleicher also says that eligible for free school meals are not even entered for there has been no increase in performance in this country, those E-bac subjects, and just 4% of those pupils achieve whereas other countries around the world are increasing the E-bac. In 719 mainstream state schools, no pupils performance. That is the problem facing our young who are eligible for free school meals were entered for people if we do not improve standards in our state any single-award science GCSE; in 169 mainstream schools, because those young people are now competing state schools, none of them were entered for French; in for jobs in a global market. It is no longer good enough 137 mainstream state schools, none of them were entered just to look at the past, because we now have to compare for geography; and in 70 mainstream state schools, our system with the best systems in the world. none of them were entered for history. Academic subjects Our education system has become one of the most should not be the preserve of the few, but we need to stratified and unfair in the developed world. Since coming free schools to achieve that aim. into office, we have been setting out our vision for Fourthly, therefore, we are dramatically reducing the reform on four broad themes: improving the quality of bureaucracy that constricts achievement. In opposition, teaching and the respect for our work force in schools; we counted the number of pages of guidance sent to greater autonomy for schools to plan and decide how schools in one 12-month period. They came to an and when improvements should take place; more intelligent incredible 6,000 pages—or six volumes of “War and and localised accountability; and reducing and simplifying Peace”, if people are inclined to consider it that way—and the bureaucracy that frustrates and demoralises teachers. yet they contained little of substance that schools do Those themes formed the basis of the White Paper that not already know or share. we published a year ago this month, “The Importance of Teaching”, and I believe that grammar schools can The most recent example of our efforts is the recently actively support improvement in each of those four completed consultation on the school admissions and areas. appeal codes. There were some 130 pages of densely worded text, with more than 650 mandatory requirements First, we want to get the best graduates into teaching that were often repeated. The revised versions, which we by funding the doubling of the Teach First programme published last Wednesday, total just over 60 pages and during the course of this Parliament, and by expanding are minimal in their requirements, while preserving the the Future Leaders and Teaching Leaders programmes, important safeguards as well as introducing new which provide superb professional development for the requirements, such as priority in admissions for children future leaders of some of our toughest and most challenging adopted from care. As my hon. Friend the Member for schools. We want grammar schools actively to share Poole (Mr Syms) said in his contribution, it is one of their experience of staff development with other schools, the most far-reaching changes that we can make if we in both the initial training of staff and the provision of give all schools, including grammar schools, a greater professional development. We have had more than 1,000 say over their own published admission number. expressions of interest in establishing teaching schools and 300 applications have already been received, with Currently that intake number is tightly managed by grammar schools among the keenest to sponsor or the local authority to ensure that any increases do not support local schools to improve standards in their affect “the school down the road”. That kind of “rationing” communities. of places only limits choice for parents and pushes 47WH Grammar Schools 8 NOVEMBER 2011 48WH

[Mr Gibb] Primary Care (Devon and the South-West) cohort after cohort of children to less accomplished schools rather than giving good schools the freedom to 12.30 pm expand and share their excellence. Mr Ben Bradshaw (Exeter) (Lab): This debate is Our approach is simply to let schools decide how about a proposal by most, but not all, of the NHS many students they can offer a high quality of education primary care trusts in the south-west, including my own within their own capital budget, while ensuring that in Devon, to contract out some of the important they maintain standards or improve any underperformance. administrative work done to support GP practices and Why is that important? Quite simply, it is important other family health services to a business partnership because we want the number of places in all good with the private French company Steria, called Shared schools to increase, to increase genuine choice for parents. Business Services, or SBS. The work includes running Even marginal increases in some areas will lead to a the system of payments to GPs, pharmacists, positive cycle of increased standards. Critics who argue ophthalmologists and others, patient registration and that that will create sink schools overlook the current screening, organising the timely transfer of patients’ admissions codes— records, and basic but vital things such as ensuring that GPs do not run out of prescription forms. Jim Sheridan (in the Chair): Order. We must now I was first alerted to the proposal when constituents move on to the next debate. Before doing so, I ask of mine who work for the Devon primary care support colleagues who are leaving Westminster Hall to do so services at Newcourt House on the edge of Exeter quickly and quietly. contacted me. I subsequently visited, and spoke to some of the 27 staff who between them have more than 500 years’ experience of working in the field. As a result of those conversations and subsequent research I now have grave concerns about the proposal and the process that has led to it. As far as I am aware, there have not been any complaints about the quality or efficiency of the current service. On the contrary, the in-house service in the south-west in general and in Devon in particular is considered to be one of the best in the country for quality and efficiency. The Department of Health has for the past two years been undertaking a major research and benchmarking exercise to improve and standardise the quality of primary care commissioning, including that of support services. Of the 19 NHS organisations reviewed, Devon was shown to be one of the best for quality, and the best for efficiency. Its costs for transferring medical records, for example, are less than half the national average. That Department of Health study is supposed to help develop a national standard or specification for primary care commissioning, so why is the Department pushing PCTs in the south-west to contract out the services when we have not yet seen the results of this important work? The Department’s programme director for primary care commissioning, who is in charge of the work on a national specification, has said that she “cannot envisage” the arrangements that are likely to emerge from her work “being in line with” what is being proposed in Devon and across the south-west. Surely, therefore, it makes sense to wait until the work of the Department’s national commissioning board project team is complete and published before pressing ahead with the contract. In his letter to me of 25 October the Secretary of State for Health states that decisions are entirely a matter for individual local trusts, but from the conversations I have had and the documentation I have seen, it is clear that his Department and the strategic health authority have put considerable pressure on PCTs to sign up to the SBS bid. I have seen a letter from the Department’s commercial director to a PCT chief executive, which basically implies that they have no choice. As a former Health Minister, I know that it is possible for different bits of the Department not always to work in a joined-up way, but it seems extraordinary that the commercial 49WH Primary Care (Devon and the 8 NOVEMBER 2011 Primary Care (Devon and the 50WH South-West) South-West) division is pushing a policy that would seem to, if not queries and I have found the advice to be much more up to date go completely against, at least pre-empt what the primary and helpful than the service that I received from their equivalents care commissioning officials are doing. in the previous PCT where I worked prior to coming to Devon. The support that we receive is invaluable. It allows us to do our In spite of the pressure from the centre, some PCTs in jobs rather than spending hours on the telephone and e-mail. The the south-west have decided not to go with the SBS bid plans to derail this system are unhelpful and counter-productive and to keep the work in-house. Somerset has done that, for the wasted time that will be spent finding information elsewhere.” Bristol, South Gloucestershire and North Somerset have I thought that the whole thrust of this Government’s recently announced a delay to any decision until they policy was about giving GPs the power and money to have done a full due diligence assessment, and I understand commission services as they wished, but here the that Gloucester put up some initial resistance. Government are doing exactly the opposite and ignoring The original bid from SBS was to cover the whole of the wishes of local professionals in the process. the south-west, but with significant parts of the region Doubts have also been raised about SBS’s reported either now not signing up to the contract or having record in reducing costs. A 2008 report by the Office for second thoughts, I would be grateful for the Minister’s Public Management details examples of huge oversights thoughts about how that will affect the viability of the in plans for cost reduction. One member of staff has bid. It must also surely strengthen the arguments for said that his waiting for the outcome of the national specification work, given that the study might recommend a very “team are as big as they were when SBS was introduced” different solution only for PCTs to discover that they because SBS had to re-recruit a full team after its are already bound into a contract with SBS that they previous job cuts had left the organisation unable to cannot change. function effectively. The report concluded that What particularly concerns the staff in Exeter and me “few if any cost savings were made as a result of the agreement is the future quality of the service. I have seen figures—I and it is deemed ‘unlikely’ by interviewees and commentators that can let the Minister have them if he has not been given they ever will”. sight of them by his officials—that show that the quality Staff in Devon have told me that the draft contract of primary care support services that are already run by with SBS does not include a lot of their current work. SBS are worse than those in the south-west, and that The work will have to be done by someone, so on whom they have deteriorated since SBS took them over. For will the costs fall? The staff feel particularly aggrieved example, in the south-west 91% of patient records are that the strategic health authority’s finance director transferred within the maximum target time of six recently visited India to inspect SBS’s work but has not weeks, and the east midlands used to boast a similarly talked to the people who currently provide an excellent good figure but performance has fallen to 76% since service on his own doorstep. I understand that he has SBS took over at the end of 2010. North London was also told primary care trust chiefs that SBS represents the first and is the only other area where SBS runs the “the way forward for the NHS”. primary care support services, and performance there is Again, that hardly sounds like encouragement for local just 35%. decision making. The SBS model involves moving some of the work It has been suggested to me in the past 24 hours that currently done in Devon and the rest of the south-west European competition rules might not have been adequately to India. I have nothing, in principle, against work addressed when dealing with the bid. I would be grateful being done in India. When I book my train tickets to if the Minister went away, examined that point and and from Exeter every week I speak to extremely helpful reassured me in writing, if not in his reply, that both the people in India, but for these particular NHS services, policy and the process are legally watertight. the local knowledge that the staff have built up over many years, and the relationships that they have with We face a fragmented part-privatisation of an important local GPs and others, are vital for resolving problems part of the NHS across the south-west, before the and ensuring that a system runs safely and efficiently. Minister’s departmental officials have reported their For example, during last winter’s bad snow, staff from findings on best practice and a national specification Exeter used Land Rovers to ensure that GP surgeries for primary care commissioning. Questions have been did not run out of vital supplies. raised about the company bidding for the work, in terms of its record on quality and its potential to deliver Our existing service operates a hub and spoke model savings. The Government claim that the decisions are for the ordering of prescriptions by practices. Suppliers entirely for local PCTs, yet pressure has clearly been deliver orders to the hub—the primary care support applied by some in his Department and the strategic services—which then delivers to the individual practices. health authority, contrary to everything that the Devon primary care support services have two very Government claim to support in terms of local busy staff members to administer the process from their commissioning and decision making. There is also a side, but the NHS SBS bid would have just two strong feeling that the decision is being rushed through. administrators across the whole south-west. For example, it appears that staff in Devon are being The chairman of the Devon local medical committee, subjected to a curtailed consultation period, before due which represents GPs in my area, has described the diligence work is complete. Surely consultation with current service as “exemplary” and has told me that staff should begin after local managers have satisfied GPs and their practices have “severe anxieties” about themselves that any bid stacks up. the proposed change. Just last night, a Devon GP contacted me when she heard I had secured this debate It feels as if loyal and hard-working NHS staff in and said: Devon are being presented with a fait accompli that is “I have over the past two years had several causes to ask the being pushed on them for ideological reasons by a Devon primary care support service for brief advice. They clearly Government that is not joined-up. Primary care support have a wealth of knowledge born from years of dealing with these services are what keep the wheels of the NHS moving 51WH Primary Care (Devon and the 8 NOVEMBER 2011 Primary Care (Devon and the 52WH South-West) South-West) [Mr Ben Bradshaw] of their assessment of the quality and value for money that they will receive by letting contracts to SBS. smoothly. The quality of local service is at stake, and I Nevertheless, the Department supports the use of SBS. urge the Minister, in consultation with senior staff at I will explain how that tension is resolved. As a former the regional and local levels, to put the decision on Minister, the right hon. Gentleman will have grappled hold, at the very least until the questions and concerns with it himself. that staff have raised with me and that I have highlighted Public sector use of shared services and private sector in this short debate have been addressed satisfactorily. expertise is in line with the policies of this Government and the last Government, but it absolutely must offer 12.41 pm best value for money and meet the required quality The Minister of State, Department of Health (Paul standards. Equally, when the previous Government set Burstow): I congratulate the right hon. Member for up SBS, they took a 50% stake, meaning that from day Exeter (Mr Bradshaw) on securing this debate. As a one, the Department has had a duty to promote the former Health Minister, he has stood up in the Chamber venture and create value for the taxpayer. In turn, to respond to hon. Members who have raised concerns the Department’s share of SBS profits is returned to the on behalf of constituents, as he has done thoroughly NHS. It is therefore not uncommon for the Department, and thoughtfully today. I appreciate the way in which he in undertaking its duty, to correspond with NHS presented his case. When he was a Health Minister, I organisations considering the use of NHS SBS in support found him to be a constructive and courteous colleague of using shared services, particularly SBS. Such letters on the occasions on which I dealt with him. have been consistently provided throughout the existence I pay tribute to the hard work done by national of SBS, and I have copies of correspondence dating health service staff every day of the week, whether in back to October 2008 that relates to the transfer of back offices or on the front line in wards. They change family health services of the sort that we are debating. lives. It is all too easy to dwell on the things that go wrong and not to pay enough attention to the excellent Mr Bradshaw: Does the Minister accept, however, work that they do. I certainly want to pay attention to that the original joint venture established by the Labour that today. This Government are committed to doing all Government was for finance and accounting, not family that they can to support front-line staff and ensure that health services? The only area in which we allowed SBS they continue to deliver excellent services to the right to take over the running of family health services was hon. Gentleman’s constituents. north London, because that service was failing dismally. I will first address the central issue—the role of NHS It does not seem to have improved much since SBS took shared business services and how it has come to be such over, either. an important player in shared services—by referring to the chronology. NHS SBS was established in 2005 after Paul Burstow: My understanding—I will go back and an open competition in accordance with European check, and if it is not correct, I will write to the right procurement regulations. I will certainly consider the hon. Gentleman—is that that extension of SBS’s role right hon. Gentleman’s point about procurement law, was a policy decision by the previous Government, and and will write to him if any further issues need to be that the Nicholson challenge set in 2009 of making dealt with. I will confirm the state of play. better use of support services by sharing across The service was established to help meet efficiency organisations was identified as an opportunity to realise targets set out in the previous Government’s efficiency savings that could then be reinvested in front-line services. review, led by Sir Peter Gershon, in 2004. In creating I hope that that is a shared goal, even though its NHS SBS, the last Government brought together two execution is open to proper scrutiny and debate. shared financial service centres situated in Leeds and I reassure the right hon. Gentleman again that although Bristol and introduced private sector capacity and expertise the Department writes letters of the sort that he has to assist expansion and increase the range of services referred to, they are nothing new in the context of offered, in order to deliver the potential efficiencies of promoting that business venture and the return of profits such an approach. I appreciate the right hon. Gentleman’s to the NHS. I stress that those decisions are local. question about his concerns on behalf of staff. As a Back in 2007, the National Audit Office considered constituency MP, I too would want to ensure that such the potential of NHS SBS and estimated that it could concerns were properly aired and that the decision deliver £250 million in savings over 11 years. To date, makers involved understood those concerns and properly more than £70 million has been saved, freeing up funds reflected on and respected them. However, I am sure for front-line patient care. As I mentioned, the review of that the right hon. Gentleman, as a former Health shared services undertaken as part of Sir David Nicholson’s Minister, will understand that the responsibility for productivity challenge identified how a minimum of determining how local services are delivered rests with £600 million could be saved across England and redirected local NHS organisations. I will set out why. Local NHS to support front-line services. The report cites SBS as an organisations are in the best position to understand example of successful shared service ventures, delivering what local people need, how to design shared services to typical savings of between 20% and 30%. meet the support needs of NHS provider organisations In the specific case of Devon PCT’s family health and so on, and how to ensure that the offer available is services, as the right hon. Gentleman said, SBS provides appropriate and affordable. It would be inappropriate numerous administrative functions relating to primary for a Minister to try to micro-manage the details of care, including patient registration, patient records individual contracts. management and contractor payments. Those functions In line with that policy, the Government absolutely help the NHS to run more smoothly, and the testimonies do not mandate NHS organisations’ use of SBS. That that he read out bear witness to the fact that they are remains a decision for local organisations on the basis valued services. 53WH Primary Care (Devon and the 8 NOVEMBER 2011 Primary Care (Devon and the 54WH South-West) South-West) The PCT, along with nearby health care commissioners, of the local area, will the decision be taken to proceed. has been exploring how to save money on administration Should the proposals be advanced, it is expected that and management functions without affecting front-line five centres of excellence will be established in the services. To spell out the current situation in relation to south-west, based in St Austell in Cornwall, Exeter the agreement between the south-west and SBS, SBS in Devon, Ferndown in Dorset, Brockworth in provided an outline proposal in March this year, followed Gloucestershire, and Devizes in Wiltshire. That decision up with a final proposal in June. At the south-west will be a local one made by NHS organisations on the regional project board, 10 trusts agreed to sign an basis of all the facts provided as part of the process that intention to proceed in September. The intention to I have set out. The matter is to be decided locally, and proceed is made between the trusts and SBS—there is those concerned must assure themselves—hence the no contractual relationship in that sense between the due diligence process—that the contracts afford the Department and SBS—as an agreement to invest the necessary flexibility and quality standards. Indeed, time and effort in undertaking the final element of due on quality change and the formation of an NHS diligence, which was one of the right hon. Gentleman’s commissioning board, the contracts are framed in a concerns, and consultation. It is not, therefore, a way that allows such flexibility. I am assured that that commitment to enter into a contract. should not present an insuperable obstacle to delivering Due diligence is a process that runs alongside the the wider goals. contracting process. The due diligence process began formally alongside the final proposals in June, and will Mr Bradshaw: I appreciate that, but would it not gather pace following the intention to proceed. As part make all the more sense to hold off signing the contracts of this process, efforts are undertaken by both sides to until we know what the national picture will be when understand the precise details of the proposed arrangements. the commissioning board publishes its findings? I should It is as part of that process that the final and precise be grateful if the Minister returned to the Department quality, which is an important consideration, and service and found out why the official in charge of this work standards are determined. If, as part of the process, the does not seem to think that the model being pursued in trusts are not satisfied that the offer from SBS can meet the south-west involving SBS would be compatible with the quality and value standards that they require, they what is likely to emerge from the recommendation of are not committed to entering into an agreement with the national commissioning board. SBS. Paul Burstow: I will write to the right hon. Gentleman Mr Bradshaw: That is helpful, because my understanding to amplify why I think that the policy concern is not as of the situation is that the staff in Devon have been told great as has been presented, and why the emergence of to expect to be TUPE’d across on 1 December. The the NHS commissioning board, with its role in family consultation for staff is taking place in parallel with the health services and the commissioning of primary care, due diligence process, but surely that should wait until provides a model whereby the exploitation of the the trust itself is satisfied with the quality of the bid, opportunities for shared services will be even greater following the due diligence process. than it is now. Paul Burstow: It is not uncommon for such processes In conclusion, local NHS organisations have to run in parallel, which, as the right hon. Gentleman responsibility for getting value for money and meeting has identified, is what is happening in this case. This is the highest levels of quality. That is true about everything not, however, a conveyor belt that cannot be reversed. they do, including proposals such as the one under The point that I am making is that the due diligence discussion. The coalition Government support the move process is not about doing things by rote; it is about to shared services, if that decision is made locally and making sure that both the taxpayer’s interest and the for the right reasons. quality standards of the service are properly protected. This is equally one of the key proposals that will help It is a legitimate area for local scrutiny and debate, and trusts to meet the quality and productivity challenge for challenge by him and other Members who have a that the NHS has faced since 2009. I understand that concern in the matter. the proposal for the south-west region aims to deliver The TUPE consultation started on 2 November. operational savings of 32%, with a 23% net saving after Extensive discussions will be held with staff and managers. the cost of change. By commissioning the service in a Following the consultation, the organisations will be different way, it is estimated that the NHS can save in required to consider the feedback from staff. Again, it is excess of £6 million over four years in the south-west, not a rote process, but one that requires decision makers including £1.6 million in Devon. to have proper regard for what they learn from the I hope that the right hon. Gentleman will agree that it process. The right hon. Gentleman has mentioned India. is only right for local organisations to look at areas I should make it clear that NHS SBS has no call centres where they can deliver efficiencies and quality, and can for family health services in India. It is envisaged that, release money for investment in front-line services. I under this contracting arrangement, if it goes through, hope that this debate has gone some way to addressing some staff will work in India, but they will not be part the right hon. Gentleman’s questions. I will undertake of a call centre service. to enter into the correspondence that he has requested. Only when each of the processes that I have described If he has any further questions, I am sure that the is complete, and the individual local organisations have Department will want to respond as quickly as it possibly concluded that the service offering is in the best interest can. I thank him for initiating this debate. 55WH 8 NOVEMBER 2011 Schools (Bradford) 56WH

Schools (Bradford) The lack of information on capital allocations beyond 2011-12 means that the building programme has to be broken down into phases. Funding is only secured for 12.55 pm phase 1, which will provide additional accommodation Mr David Ward (Bradford East) (LD): Thank you for to cater for the children up to and including 2012-13. It chairing this debate, Mr Sheridan, and I thank the should be pointed out, however, that a number of Minister of State, Department for Education, the hon. schools also have a backlog of maintenance issues. In Member for Bognor Regis and Littlehampton (Mr Gibb), phase 1, the council cannot address many of those for attending. I would like to begin with a quote: issues due to the limitations of available capital. The figure for the backlog on repairs for primary and secondary “Funding totalling £337 million has been secured after an outline business case by Bradford Council was approved by is approximately £55 million. Partnership for Schools (PfS), the organisation which administers Phase 2, for growing other year group capacity and the Building Schools for the Future programme (BSF) on behalf beyond, will depend on available funding. Future forecasts of the Government.” also identify the need for further additional capacity It continues: over and above the current expansion programme. “Kath Tunstall, Bradford Council’s strategic director for services Additional problems have been caused by a reduction in to children and young people, said: ‘We are delighted that the pupil admission numbers at Catholic primary schools final stage of the improvement programme has been given the go proposed by the diocese and governing bodies of voluntary ahead. aided schools. The reduction in places in certain schools We will now be able to provide the most up-to-date environment and the desperate need for additional places is a double and facilities for all our secondary schools. whammy. This is not simply an inner-city issue, as it is Bradford children will be taught in the surroundings and with often portrayed. We are now experiencing difficulties in the technology that their efforts deserve. This is marvellous news.’” most areas across the Bradford district. It did, indeed, seem to be marvellous news. Although plans to provide additional capacity are in That was the lead story in the Bradford Telegraph and place, potential proposals and approvals of free schools Argus on 7 April 2010, just one month before the in the district—of which the local authority has no general election. What a cruel deceit. It was cynical and knowledge at any one time—give rise to what can be mean. At the time, I was a governor of one of the described as tensions in the planning process, particularly 19 schools in phase 3 of the Bradford BFS programme, where clear expansion programmes have begun to be and I was pretty sure that it was all too good to be delivered and there is a need to continue them through true—I think that many of us felt the same—and so it the older year groups. proved to be. It was an example of the sheer dishonesty of a Government who knew that they were going to lose Mr Gerry Sutcliffe (Bradford South) (Lab): Is it not the forthcoming election, promising the earth in the full true that Bradford has taken a very pragmatic approach knowledge that the new Government, of whatever political to free schools? The local authority and all three parties complexion, would never be able to deliver the BSF on the council have decided to support the principle. programme. It was shameful. There might be arguments about each other’s schools, Unfortunately, the problems that the BSF programme but free schools will be members of the family of the was designed to remedy are still with us today. The wider school population. However, there are issues that reception year population in Bradford is increasing affect that wider school population. rapidly—in fact, we have one of the fastest-growing young populations in the whole country—which is having Mr Ward: I have read some comments to that effect. a severe impact on school places in our primary schools. They are not actually accepted in principle by the Although, nationally, numbers in maintained nursery Liberal Democrat group, but I recognise the hon. and state-funded primary schools started to increase in Gentleman’s contribution. My point about free schools 2010, they have been increasing in Bradford since 2006. is about the difficulties they create for a strategic view of school admission numbers across the district. A significant number of our primary schools are now full, particularly in the lower age groups in key stage 1, We are also experiencing significant pressure in the which will start to impact soon on key stage 2. To secondary sector, particularly lower age groups. Numbers overcome the additional demand for places in primary in secondary schools in Bradford started to increase in schools, 28 schools—nearly 20% of our primary schools— 2008 and are forecast to continue rising. As I understand have increased their published admission numbers. Do it, that is against the national trend. Recent statistics on not forget that, year on year, we have already asked our pupil projections identify state-funded secondary schools schools to increase their numbers, but here we have showing a decline since 2004, and they are expected to 28 trying to respond, all in one go, to the increased decline even further until 2016. That is not the case in demand. In order to accommodate the additional children, Bradford. the schools have been included in a building expansion Previously, there were plans to increase capacity programme funded through basic need allocations. Bulge at a number of secondary schools—I mentioned 19 in classes had previously been established, but a more phase 3—through the BSF programme. However, the permanent solution was required to help schools with cessation of the BSF programme means that that route their organisation, management of staff and classes, is not available. Alternative plans are being developed. and to enable them to plan ahead. For all schools, an The current approach, where possible—we have done extensive programme of building works to incrementally this with our schools over a number of years with some provide additional accommodation over a seven-year success, and we have to pay tribute to the head teachers period is required as the larger cohorts progress through and governing bodies of schools for accommodating the year groups. it—has been to request schools to admit year 7 pupil 57WH Schools (Bradford)8 NOVEMBER 2011 Schools (Bradford) 58WH numbers above their pupil admission numbers. However, Although a new programme, the priority school building that is not a sustainable solution. It can only be done programme, was announced in July to deal with the where there are gaps later up in the school years, and it most serious cases, only a limited number of schools in soon exceeds capacity. Bradford qualified to bid for that funding, given the With the basic need allocation for the district fully criteria that were set. Importantly, none of the primary committed to the expansion of primary schools at this schools being expanded qualified, while some of the stage, no funding has been secured to implement any smaller primaries, as well as a smaller secondary school, plans for secondary expansions. It is estimated that, in Queensbury, did meet those criteria but declined to take addition to any expansions of existing schools, two part because of fears about the affordability of the further 1,000-place schools will be required in the next private finance initiative deal on offer. Should the six three to four years. Those two new secondary schools secondary submissions to the PSBP programme—Aire are required in Bradford in addition to the capacity Valley, Belle Vue boys’ school, Carlton Bolling, Oakbank potentially being introduced through known proposed and the two new schools—be rejected by the Department free schools in the district—they are over and above. for Education, pressure on pupil places throughout the There is a tension between current place planning and secondary estate will not be dealt with and the authority proposed expansion programmes with the unknown might well face difficulties in fulfilling its statutory duty. quantity of free school places. We now have five free As an aside, I can comment on one of the schools I schools in Bradford and we do not know what will have mentioned, Carlton Bolling, where I am a former become available in the future. That creates the potential— chair of governors. Although the backlog maintenance perversely and inadvertently—to develop overprovision is only 30.71% of the total costs of a new build, the in certain areas. school currently has sections that are structurally unsound. As previously stated, we have information on capital In fact, some areas of the school are roped off and allocations up to 2011-12 only. In the past, we had unusable because they are unsafe. Also bear in mind three-year allocations. The most recent announcement that the other schools were part of the reorganisation for capital allocations for 2011-12 was for one year only. programme, which was when they most recently had Failure to be able to plan over a three-year period has investment, but at Carlton Bolling the previous reinvestment led to considerable problems, such as the inefficient use occurred as the result of a fire. The fire damage, however, of resources. Capital schemes have been broken down was not to the classroom area but to the sports and into smaller phases, which are proving more costly than dining room areas, so the heavy investment during that larger schemes. On the ability to complete schemes on time was in the non-classroom parts of the school. The time, due to the late announcement of funding—I believe classroom area has not therefore received substantial that there were big headlines in the Telegraph and Argus investment and includes the part that I referred to as last week—it has proved difficult to contract and mobilise structurally unsound. building contractors to complete programmes in time The purpose of the debate was to explain the need for for the beginning of the new academic year. Hundreds support for Bradford schools, which are in dire need of of school days were lost recently as a result of schools capital investment, and to emphasise the scale of the opening late. On long-term planning, schools are finding issue. It is incredibly difficult to plan strategically for it extremely challenging to plan ahead in terms of school places in Bradford, not simply because of the space, resources and staffing. considerations I have presented but because of The only capital resource provided by the Department the enormous difficulty faced by the council in meeting for Education for additional accommodation is basic its statutory responsibility to provide the right number need funding. That is based on the need for additional of school places in exactly the right areas, given the teaching space and is insufficient to deal with existing short-term capital allocations and a highly turbulent inadequacies of accommodation, or the provision of and mobile school population. other important spaces required for the successful operation Recently, in questions to the Secretary of State, I of a school—play space, dining space, space for whole- pointed out that 60% of the children in a year 3 classroom school gatherings, community space and so on. The that I had visited were not together in reception. Go to indications from the James review are that space many areas, even in Bradford, and 90% of those who requirements are likely to be reduced, which is also a come into reception go on to the same secondary school. serious concern. Our turbulent and mobile school population makes the The methodology used by the Department to determine dynamics of forecasting for future places very difficult. the allocation of basic need funding to authorities is In addition, we have free schools supported in their based on the local 2011 school capacity and forecasting desire to set up when and where they choose, the information return, which only focuses on a five-year freedom of popular schools to expand their pupil admission forecast. Basic need pressure across the secondary school numbers without having to consult their local education estate will only realistically become apparent by the end authority, and school fears about the private finance of that forecast period and will require addressing in initiative. I will welcome the Minister’s comments on the time frame of this funding announcement. such crucial issues. Bradford’s very welcome £7.4million allocation towards 1.14 pm its basic needs will, I am afraid, be insufficient to cover the pressure on pupil places across both the primary The Minister of State, Department for Education and secondary school estate. In addition—I have referred (Mr Nick Gibb): I congratulate my hon. Friend the to this—there are significant backlog maintenance Member for Bradford East (Mr Ward) on securing the requirements to bring existing accommodation up to debate. Clarity on how the Government are funding suitable standards across Bradford’s existing school estate. and ensuring fairness and choice for parents and their Basic need funding is not provided to address this issue. children throughout the country is important. The debate 59WH Schools (Bradford)8 NOVEMBER 2011 Schools (Bradford) 60WH

[Mr Nick Gibb] On disadvantaged pupils, in 2011-12 the Government are providing a pupil premium of £9.1 million for more is particularly timely, as the academies and free schools than 18,000 pupils in schools throughout Bradford. I programmes gather pace and as we announce our additional was taken by the point made by my hon. Friend in oral basic need allocations for those areas deemed to be questions concerning the churn of pupils in his schools— most in need, which include Bradford. 60% of the year 3 pupils had not been at that particular Bradford is playing an active part in the academies primary school in reception. However, we must still programme, with seven schools already open as academies provide a high quality of education for those children. and another 10 in the pipeline. Bradford has 27 outstanding The pupil premium of £488 per pupil this year will schools, which offers an excellent basis on which to increase over the next four years. We are doubling the continue to drive up standards and school-to-school total expenditure on the pupil premium next year, from collaboration. Currently, two free schools in Bradford £600 million to £1.2 billion, and it will rise to £2.4 billion are open, both of which directly support local needs. by 2014-15. I agree with my hon. Friend that at all The Rainbow free school aims to improve education stages the processes of how decisions are made and how quality for children in central Bradford and to reach out money will be spent to deliver real impact must be clear. to children in challenging circumstances. The positive My hon. Friend raised his concern that local authority local reaction to the Kings science academy was reflected budgets will be top-sliced to pay for the academies and in a high volume of applications for places in its first free schools programme. In the context of the pressures year. highlighted in the debate, I understand that concern, My hon. Friend mentioned five free schools altogether, but I hope I can reassure him that no school, parent or and a further three are due to open in September next child should be disadvantaged financially by academies year, helping to provide new school places where they and free schools. Far from disadvantaging other schools are most needed. However, I accept his point that the and breaking up the system, they will improve parental need goes beyond the supply provided by the new choice and ensure that all schools aim to raise their schools. What has been achieved is educational standards. transformation, delivering professional autonomy and recognising the expertise of teachers and the best leadership LAC SEG—the snappy acronym for the local authority in the country. That is what we hope to achieve through central spend equivalent grant—enables schools converting the academies and the free schools programmes. None to academy status to pay for those services that they the less, real challenges face Bradford, with its increasing previously received free from the local authority. To school population and the capital expenditure needed avoid the taxpayer paying twice for those services, the to repair and maintain its schools. element paid to academies needs to be recouped from My hon. Friend was right to point out the political local authorities. How that recoupment is calculated dishonesty of announcing a major piece of school and top-sliced from local authority grants is subject to funding one month before there had to be a general consultation, and the Government will respond to that election and when everyone knew that there simply was consultation and make an announcement in due course. not the sum of money needed to provide such a scale of The key is to ensure that local authority-maintained school building in any part of the country, let alone in schools and academies are funded fairly. one particular area. The Chief Secretary wrote on leaving The academies and free schools programme aims to office that “there is no money”. It was political dishonesty meet demand for school places and to increase choice of the worst kind to make those promises in Bradford for parents and children. Our commitment is to ensure and elsewhere, writing blank cheques when there was that parents and their children have a choice of school no money to support them. places, whether in maintained schools, academies or We are committed to providing practical support to free schools. On performance, failure to secure high-quality enable Bradford to manage its pressures. On school education for pupils will not be accepted. The Government places, the Secretary of State’s 3 November announcement are committed to tackling underperformance. It is on capital allocation included a further £500 million for unacceptable that more than 200 primary schools have basic need, in addition to the £800 million announced been under the floor standard in their key stage 2 results for the same financial year to reduce pressure on school for five years or more, and that more than half of those places. As my hon. Friend said, that led to £7.4 million schools have been underperforming for at least 10 years. for Bradford, in addition to the basic need allocation of A further 500 or so have been below the acceptable £10.3 million in 2011-12, announced last year. That is minimum standard for three of the past four years. on top of the £45.9 million of capital grant for Bradford Those schools have let down repeated cohorts of children. in 2011-12, which covers capital needs including We are starting work, as an urgent priority, on turning maintenance. around the 200 schools nationally that have most On school buildings, the priority schools building consistently underperformed by finding new academy programme, which was announced in July 2011, targets sponsors for them so that they can reopen from September those schools that are in the worst condition or have 2012. We want to work closely with the schools involved severe basic needs. Four Bradford schools have applied, and the local authorities to ensure that that happens. one of which is Carlton Bolling; as my hon. Friend pointed out, parts of that school are structurally unsound We have collective responsibility to make education and cordoned off from use by pupils and staff. Each provision more effective and efficient within the current application will be assessed fairly on its merits and economic climate. To do so, we must increase choice for against the criteria. Once all applications have been parents and their children so that they have the highest assessed, the successful schools will be announced, which possible quality of education provision to choose from. should happen by the end of the year. Academies and free schools are a key part of that 61WH Schools (Bradford)8 NOVEMBER 2011 Schools (Bradford) 62WH reform, but every education institution has a role to within the PFI arrangements. It is important to take play. The security and predictability of front-line school into account those long-term maintenance costs. budgets will be vital to that success. By stopping wasteful and bureaucratic Building Schools My hon. Friend spoke about the importance of being for the Future projects we have been able to allocate able to plan for more than one year at a time. In £1.4 billion to local areas to prioritise their maintenance December 2011 there will be another announcement on needs, and that includes £195 million of devolved formula capital for future years, to address that planning point. capital, which has been allocated directly to schools to We must ensure that there is up-to-date information so use in line with their priorities. On top of that, we have that funding is targeted to the right areas. We are allocated £800 million of basic need funding for 2011-12, gathering that data now, so that funding can be targeted which is twice the previous annual level of support, as accurately as possible on where the need lies. despite the fact that we are dealing with a very difficult We have announced that capital spending will be budget deficit. As recent events in Europe have proved, £15.9 billion over the four years of the spending review we took the right decisions early on in this Administration period, and I assure my hon. Friend again that no to help to tackle that deficit. money is being diverted away from other schools to Earlier this year, the Secretary of State announced an academies. Our commitment within the spending review addition to the £800 million of a further £500 million to is clear—to protect school funding in the system at flat provide extra school places where there is greatest pressure cash per pupil—because even when funding is tight, as caused by the increasing pupil population—that makes it is with the current imperative to tackle the country’s a total of £1.3 billion—because we recognise the importance budget deficit, we realise that it is essential that buildings of ensuring that every pupil has a place when they start and equipment are properly maintained to ensure that school, whether primary or secondary school. health and safety standards are met, and to prevent an Future allocations and the management of funding ever-increasing backlog of decaying buildings that would for 2012-13 to 2014-15 will be informed by the outcome be difficult and expensive to deal with. of the capital review, but the Secretary of State has We have learned the lessons of the private finance already indicated that local authorities may expect the initiative contracts entered into by the previous headline amounts of capital available in future years to Administration, but it is important that in being able to be broadly in line with those allocated when we first deliver the necessary capital expenditure we transfer announced the figures for 2011-12. some of the risk of maintaining buildings to facility As well as radically reviewing how capital funding is management operations that ensure that those buildings allocated and spent in future, the Government have do not deteriorate. That is the essence of the PFI renewed their focus on finding an academy solution for arrangement. the weakest primary schools in the country. In that respect, Bradford will be supported by the Department Mr Ward: The concern of the smaller schools—five for Education in challenging underperformance and primary schools and one small secondary school—seems securing improved performance in schools that are to be affordability. Does the Minister have any words of struggling. The introduction of the academies and free reassurance for such schools? schools programme should be viewed as an additional tool in the arsenal of local authorities as they seek to Mr Gibb: I do not want to give assurance on a eradicate any basic need pressures they are encountering. particular proposal, but in general terms schools must We believe that giving those involved in education the maintain their buildings, and when looking at whether freedom, flexibility and support they need to shape the something is affordable, the calculations often omit future of our schools and opening up opportunities for looking at what a school will have to spend on maintenance others to enter the education sector will offer an education over the next five, 10 or 20 years. When assessing the system to meet the needs of local communities. value for money of a PFI arrangement, it is important to do just that, and not simply to compare the cost of 1.28 pm building a school with a design-and-build arrangement Sitting suspended. 63WH 8 NOVEMBER 2011 Basement Developments 64WH

Basement Developments houses, built as terraces of varying widths and with a number of different storeys. They have proved remarkably adaptable over the past century to changing housing 1.30 pm needs as well as changing tenure and household size. Ms Karen Buck (Westminster North) (Lab): I am Does the hon. Lady share my view that in recent years grateful for the opportunity to speak in this short almost unprecedented pressure has been brought to debate. I am pleased that the hon. Member for Cities of bear, along the lines that she has pointed out, to attach London and Westminster (Mark Field) is also joining a bathroom to every bedroom and find space for home us. I know he has concerns about basement developments, cinemas and gymnasiums at subterranean levels? That too. can cause real problems: it is not just the soil but the disruption to which she has already alluded. I have been conscious of the issue over the past year or two, having received constituency correspondence on it, and I was aware that the matter had been raised by Ms Buck: I agree with everything that the hon. amenity associations in various boroughs in central Gentleman, my neighbour, has outlined, and I will London. However, it was not until I accepted an invitation touch on a few of those points. to see one of the larger basement developments in NW8 We know that, for the most part, basement developments a couple of weeks ago that it really came home to me are not opposed in principle, but their scale and the just what an extraordinary change we are seeing in speed with which such major developments are now some of our inner city communities. spreading over large parts of inner London is a major I saw a basement excavation stretching between Hamilton concern for neighbourhoods. I have already mentioned terrace and the mews behind it in St John’s Wood. It what I saw myself in terms of the scale of some of the seemed that the excavation was the size of an aircraft building works and the disruption and damage that carrier—absolutely vast. It was far greater in scale than they do. The damage to neighbours, streets and pavements I had expected. Not only was this enormous excavation is uncompensated. It can become a burden on the local going on, but lorries that were turning into the mews to authority that has responsibility for mending pavements, take away the soil were pounding away. There was noise or it can fall on residents in the case of some of the and filth in the air. The small mews was already buckled unadopted roads and mewses. None the less, the damage by the pressure of the lorries coming into the street, is not compensated in any way. which was not designed for the kind of traffic that was The sheer scale and number of basement developments being imposed on it. It was vividly brought home to me means that the noise is incessant, even when builders how disruptive such basement developments are. They keep within the considerate builders code—sometimes are an imposition on many residents in areas where they they do; sometimes they do not—because the works are have become such a striking phenomenon over the past so substantial and prolonged. As my neighbour, the couple of years. hon. Member for Cities of London and Westminster, We all know that building works are a hazard of has said, many of the properties are terraced—substantial, urban living. We live in a growing city. Wherever we live certainly—so there is no buffer zone between the residential in London or other cities, at some stage we are likely to properties affected. experience building works. It is right that we must I heard a sad story of one resident in St John’s Wood endure some of this as our infrastructure is updated who is suffering from cancer. Living in the middle of and as much-needed new housing development is fitted two properties, they had to endure the noise and nuisance into our growing cities. However, if we look at some of of a major basement development on one side. They got the plans for basement developments that are now through that particular nightmare—it is always difficult spreading all over inner London, we are not talking living next to building works—and then found that an about infrastructure development or new house building. application for a basement development had been made In many cases, basement developments—sometimes double for the property on the other side. basements going down two levels—stretch not just under the footprint of the house or even one or two thirds Sir Hugh Cortazzi, a local resident who I am delighted beyond the footprint of the building itself, but through to see has turned up to listen to this short debate, has an entire garden. Those gardens are sometimes substantial, been corresponding with me on this issue. He describes because they are in our more prosperous neighbourhoods. his experiences as follows: Plans include underground cinemas, swimming pools, “The excavation of the basement and garden at an adjoining gymnasiums and gun rooms. Delightful as that may be property has been continuing since September last year and vast for residents fortunate enough to live in such properties, quantities of earth have been removed via trucks and skips. The it is hard to accuse those who object of restricting the pollution and noise are extremely disruptive but they will also necessary growth and infrastructure development of cause damage to the environment, alter buildings in a conservation area and could have adverse effects on the water table and our city. drainage in an area built on streams which already suffers from subsidence”. Mark Field (Cities of London and Westminster) (Con): An editorial in The Lion, the parish magazine of I agree with what the hon. Lady says. The Knightsbridge St Mark’s church, Hamilton terrace, added: Association in my constituency, among others, has made it clear that it is not opposed in principle to the provision “The digging and tunnelling not only devastates existing gardens of basements beneath existing houses, but it is concerned but damages the water balance and root systems in surrounding properties...hidden waterways have suddenly come to light, causing about aspects of the design, construction and usage. unexpected flooding...we must ask ourselves whether those with What applies in the hon. Lady’s seat similarly applies in millions to spend should be allowed to endanger the quality of mine. We are dealing primarily with terraced houses. As life for their neighbours by embarking on developments that in many other parts of London, they are 19th-century could damage the area for years to come”. 65WH Basement Developments8 NOVEMBER 2011 Basement Developments 66WH

Responses to the Westbourne neighbourhood survey agreements broadly cover your building repair costs?” included these findings: three quarters answered no. There was overwhelming “We have been through hell and beyond not with a basement support for greater legislative protection, an enforceable development but steelbox frames underpinning our back extension code of practice, and greater powers for local authorities against our wall—2 years of hell...and we cannot open our front to block or restrict developments where necessary. door...We are about to be sent to an early grave—works are now being applied for next door on the other side”. Last night I received an e-mail from another constituent Mark Field: Does the hon. Lady agree with the in Hamilton terrace. They asked whether I Knightsbridge Association, which wrote to me before “would also look at the gigantic building operations at…Hamilton the debate? Its view is that terrace for which the application was for minor alterations. The actual operations are reaching out almost two thirds into the “provision should be made in party wall agreements for a bond to garden, and I have complained to WCC without receiving an be put up by the developer or an insurance taken out to ensure acknowledgment or an answer. Last week when I was home that neighbours are able to obtain redress where problems are briefly…I could not lock or unlock the basement door into the caused.” garden for the second time in two months because of the movements As the hon. Lady is aware, all too often, the offending caused by the huge digging works…So for the second time in that party may not be a UK national, and it can be difficult period I had to call a carpenter to repair and adjust the door. On top of all that I have been suffering endless dirt and dust from the for those who have lost out financially—often quite building works apart from the noise which makes serious substantially—to secure the redress that they deserve. work…during the day utterly impossible.”

Mark Field: Some solutions are in place. There is the Ms Buck: That is a good point which deserves to be issue of planning law, and it is vital that local authorities explored, and I look forward to hearing the Minister’s produce an annual public report so that we are aware response. Neighbours affected by such developments how many applications for this type of development often find that work is done by companies or people have been approved. Could one further provision be a who are not UK residents, and that those who live at the highway licence? We must ensure that the streets function property will not necessarily be there for a long time or normally, so where licences have already been issued—as are not in full-time occupation. People’s ability to obtain in the cases to which the hon. Lady referred—it should leverage during the building works, or redress afterwards, be possible to bar further works for a period of time is limited. and stop the intense disruption that has taken place. The problem has increased over the past two or three Things such as skips and builders licences should be years and is impacting negatively on local communities charged for by the day, just like a parking meter. That and individuals. Nobody seems able to protect residents would provide a strong incentive to minimise the disruption affected by such developments, whether it is the local to people’s lives, to which the hon. Lady referred. authority or organisations such as the Grosvenor or Cadogan estates, or the John Lyon’s Trust, which manages Ms Buck: I agree with the hon. Gentleman, and I will some of the properties in St John’s Wood conservation touch on those issues in a moment. area. Such agencies do what they can by way of guidance Westminster city council—the authority with which I and a voluntary code of conduct for subterranean am concerned, although I know that other inner-London development, but it is understandably difficult for them authorities deal with similar issues—states in its policy to act where the planning authority cannot. Everyone is guidance: keenly aware of the amounts of money behind these “The environmental impact of subterranean development also developments, which makes opposing them risky in the has potential to be significant and result in increased carbon absence of clear Government guidance. emissions, due to additional requirements for lighting, ventilation and pumps. By limiting the extent of basement developments and The previous Government amended the Town and requiring them to meet sustainable design standards, negative Country Planning (General Permitted Development) environmental impacts may be reduced.” Order 1995 in 2008, and removed the volume restriction We know, however, that due to a degree of uncertainty that had previously limited home owners to developments about current planning guidance, some local authorities— that did not exceed a fixed percentage of their floor Westminster in this case—are anxious about their ability area. The 2008 guidance seemed to confirm that basement to block developments. excavations should be permitted, although subject to I have mentioned the devastating impact of some conditions and restrictions intended to limit the impact developments experienced by neighbours and local on others. I am not sure, however, that the pace and communities, but we must also remember the sheer scale of change was—or could have been—foreseen in scale of some of the work—that took me by surprise, 2008, and three years on, the system is obviously not and I am indebted to the work of the St John’s Wood working. If the legislative framework is inadequate, Society, South East Bayswater Residents Association especially given the size and number of subterranean and others, for their mapping of such developments. developments, what do the Government think can be The St John’s Wood Society has identified no fewer done to rectify the situation? than 86 basement applications in that corner of NW8 I seek clarification on whether the current unsatisfactory between October 2010 and September 2011, plus 10 repeat situation results from a correct interpretation of the excavations; Hamilton Terrace alone has 13 applications. 2008 legislation, which may therefore require further In the Westbourne Neighbourhood Association survey, amendment, or whether the legislation has been interpreted to which I have already referred, 47 local residents said wrongly. In the latter case, can the issue be resolved by that their area contained local developments of the an additional consultation process to correct and restore kind under discussion. When asked, “Did party wall the original intent of the measure? I believe that that 67WH Basement Developments8 NOVEMBER 2011 Basement Developments 68WH

[Ms Buck] concerns about the loss of viable gardens and mature trees because of basement developments, particular point was raised with Ministers by representatives of those that go deeper than two storeys. the St John’s Wood Society and others, at a recent meeting, and it would be good to have an answer from Ms Buck: I think that I covered most of those points the Minister. in my contribution, but the hon. Gentleman is right. Those living next to such developments should not have If, however, the developments are based on a correct to suffer the disruption and upheaval that now takes interpretation of the 2008 guidance, what options are place at a relentless pace, given the scale and number of now available? The hon. Member for Cities of London developments under way. Residents, taxpayers and local and Westminster mentioned proposals by the Knightsbridge authorities should not be expected to foot the bill for Association and other amenity societies. I will not go damage and disruption inflicted by such developments into too much detail, but those proposals include the on a number of our neighbourhoods. Through available removal of permitted development rights to allow the vehicles such as the Party Wall etc. Act or planning implementation of stronger safeguards to protect guidance, it is clearly time to say that something has neighbours and local neighbourhoods, and better guidance gone wrong over the past two or three years, and that for inspectors at appeal. It is frequently felt that inspectors firmer, stronger controls must be introduced to protect are not familiar with the conservation areas most affected, people’s interests. given the nature of central London where the basement developments are being built, and that they are not necessarily best placed to make their objections known. 1.49 pm Other suggestions include updating the Party Wall etc. The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Act 1996 to allow more control over construction, and Communities and Local Government (Robert Neill): It is compensation for residents of adjoining properties. That a pleasure to see you in the Chair, Mr Sheridan. I could include allowing bonds to be set up against the congratulate the hon. Member for Westminster North development. Existing building regulations could be (Ms Buck) on securing the debate and I acknowledge reviewed to ensure that the interests of conservation the very constructive interventions and support that she areas are considered when assessing the development has had from my hon. Friend the Member for Cities of application. London and Westminster (Mark Field). Given the proposed amendments to the Localism Bill This is an important debate about planning and in the other place, it would be helpful to know what basement development. It raises important issues, not scope the Minister thinks has been provided for local for the first time in relation to planning, about balancing authorities and residents to protect themselves against sustainable development with individual rights, and I excessive subterranean developments and the combined will happily do my best to respond. The issues have impact of multiple developments in a small area. What been well set out by the hon. Lady. She is particularly can the Minister offer by way of stronger and clearer concerned about problems arising from home owners’ guidance to the small number of inner-London authorities wishes to increase the size and value of their home by where almost all such developments are taking place? extending the property through the excavation of new This is not nimbyism or an objection to new basement rooms. I recognise that there can be a problem infrastructure or housing developments—indeed, the with such development. It tends to occur in a fairly St John’s Wood Society played a constructive role in the limited geographical area, predominantly in parts of future development of the King’s Troop barracks. It is, central London, as we have heard. I am also aware that however, a response to a real and worsening problem the cause for concern is often not the completed basement, that was probably unforeseeable only a few short years but the disruption that can be caused during the ago. Like Chelsea and Bayswater, St John’s Wood may construction phase. That is precisely what was graphically be a largely prosperous area, but its residents have the described by the hon. Lady. same right as anyone else to be protected from unacceptable This is quite a complex issue, because it covers many levels of noise, nuisance and disruption that prevent aspects of both the planning process and the construction them from the quiet enjoyment of their homes. We have process, including concerns about noise and general a shared interest in protecting the urban environment disturbance and issues about the consistency and and the character of our residential neighbourhoods, effectiveness of enforcement. There is not necessarily, which contribute to making London the city that we therefore, a single silver bullet that can deal with the love so much. problem, but there are existing powers and good practice available to tackle it, and I will endeavour to set those out. Mark Field: I thank the hon. Lady for an excellent speech. She will appreciate that we work on a bipartisan It is important to bear it in mind that the planning basis, putting the interests of our constituents first. She system is designed to consider the impact of a development did not address this issue directly, but James Wright, once complete, and of course it is often the case that chairman of the Belgravia Residents Association suggested, subterranean developments, once complete, have little with some validity, that basements are often developed visual impact. The system is essentially about land use by non-resident, non-UK taxpayers, for the benefit of a and visual impacts. What we are talking about today is single wealthy individual and at significant cost to the generally an extension to an existing acceptable land environment and community, as highlighted by the hon. use—a dwelling house. In the end, its visible impact will Lady. Furthermore, extensive damage is caused to roads, be limited, but I do understand that that does not help and repairs are often paid for by the taxpayer, because the people experiencing the disturbance during its the developer is not accountable for that. There are also construction. However, although there are some limitations, 69WH Basement Developments8 NOVEMBER 2011 Basement Developments 70WH people often regard the planning system as the most That is the position as far as planning law is concerned. reliable route for alerting a local community that a I will also consider building control, because the two development is proposed—we are all familiar with the are closely interlinked. It is likely that subterranean requirement to put up notices and so on—which can development work would be required to meet the Building then act as a trigger for wider engagement on how any Regulations 2010. That means that the person in control development will take place. of the works—from what I have heard, I imagine that that would be the contractor in these cases—will either It might be helpful if I describe how the planning have to submit plans or give a notice to the local system deals with subterranean developments, and the authority building control department about the controls available. A planning application is likely to be development. That enables the works to be inspected by necessary for a substantial new and deep basement, but a building inspector on behalf of the local authority. as I think the hon. Lady conceded, that will depend on The building inspector will have to be satisfied that the the size of the existing property. It generally depends on basement structure complies with the relevant requirements. the size of the extension in relation to the original size It is fair to say that much of the building regulations of the house, as is well known. None the less, where concentrates on the safety of those working on the site. permitted development rights grant planning permission I do not think that that is suggested as the primary issue without the need for an application, a local planning in this case, but it is worth bearing in mind. The authority can consult on using the powers available to it building regulations are also concerned with ensuring to ensure that the proposals are brought back under its that nothing is done to impair the stability of the control through the planning process. In other words, it building during the construction process. Again, that is possible to issue an article 4 direction—that is article can be a worry for neighbours. 4 of the Town and Country Planning (General Permitted Development) Order 1995—which removes the permitted Work would also need to be carried out in accordance development rights in relation to the proposed development. with the Construction (Design and Management) In those circumstances, an application must be made in Regulations 2007 and various other related health and the normal way. safety measures. Regulation 31 of the 2007 regulations requires steps to be taken to ensure that an excavation is Local authorities are already required to consult safe both for those within the building and for neighbours. neighbours and other interested parties on planning The noise and other sources of potential nuisance, applications, and we already advocate pre-application such as dust and deposits, that we have heard about can engagement between applicants and neighbours. Local be dealt with through the statutory nuisance regime set authorities can use locally prepared planning policies to out in the Environmental Protection Act 1990. In addition, set the standards by which planning applications for the specific issue of noise from construction sites can be subterranean development will be assessed. In addition, dealt with through the powers in the Control of Pollution local authorities are able to produce guidance that can Act 1974. outline matters such as submission requirements and the standards that development will need to achieve. Mark Field: The big concern that many of our residents Our proposals to introduce neighbourhood planning have, whether this is on grounds of planning, building provide further opportunities to fine-tune the detail to regulations or environmental protection, is that ultimately reflect what may be particular concerns in particular they are often up against an applicant who is incredibly neighbourhoods of London or other major cities. Local wealthy—who has very deep pockets—and can bypass authorities can already require applicants to ensure that all of those. I am talking about the lack of the cumulative their planning applications are accompanied by a robustness that is required in this whole area to ensure construction method statement, and require such that we do not have a David and Goliath situation a statement to be prepared and signed off by a chartered between a developer wanting to drive ahead and, obviously, civil or structural engineer. Those methods can deal add great value to his property through substantial with some of the matters raised. works along the lines that we have described, which are incredibly disruptive, and a local authority whose hands are tied behind its back because of what are obviously Ms Buck: Perhaps the Minister is coming to this very inadequate protections or notional protections. point, but one of the grave concerns of residents in places such as St John’s Wood, Chelsea and so on is that Robert Neill: I understand the point that my hon. although each individual development can be close to Friend makes, but perhaps it is not entirely fair to say unbearable, the compounded effect of, say, 13 developments that the controls are inadequate. There is without doubt in one street in St John’s Wood is absolutely intolerable. a fairly new challenge because of the technology and the What powers does the local authority have to consider type of building that we have only fairly recently seen. the compounded effect of numerous developments, rather However, there are powers, if they are robustly enforced. than each individual one on its merits? Ms Buck rose— Robert Neill: May I just make this point? The Control Robert Neill: As a matter of planning law, local of Pollution Act 1974 enables issues such as the equipment authorities can have regard to cumulative impacts and type, the hours of working and acceptable noise levels they can attach planning conditions to the permissions to be stipulated, so there is a control there, if it is to ensure that developments meet the standards set for robustly enforced. such development. Of course, they have to consider each of those on a case-by-case basis, but it is well Ms Buck: I am grateful to the Minister for giving established in the case law that cumulative impacts can, way; we are about to run out of time. Will he either in the proper circumstances, be a material planning mention briefly the scope for looking at the Party Wall consideration. etc. Act 1996 in particular, as per the proposals that the 71WH Basement Developments8 NOVEMBER 2011 Basement Developments 72WH

[Ms Buck] expressed in the other House. We can then consider the matter if she wishes to make further representations. I hon. Member for Cities of London and Westminster think that that is the fairest way to do justice to her and and I have outlined, or meet us separately, possibly with her constituents— representatives of the local amenity societies, to consider what action might be available under that set of powers? Robert Neill: Certainly. The 1996 Act was considered 2pm in relation to the Localism Bill. As time is short, perhaps Sitting adjourned without Question put (Standing Order I will write to the hon. Lady, setting out the views No. 10(11)). 11WS Written Ministerial Statements8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Ministerial Statements 12WS Written Ministerial ENVIRONMENT, FOOD AND RURAL AFFAIRS Single Payment Scheme Statements The Minister of State, Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (Mr James Paice): In the statement Tuesday 8 November 2011 made by my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs on 14 July, Official Report, columns 40-44WS, she explained that the Rural Payments Agency business plan for 2011-12 would be ENERGY AND CLIMATE CHANGE updated when the agency’s strategic improvement plan (SIP) was finalised. Work on constructing that plan is progressing well and the new RPA management team Statutory Security of Supply Report are already taking forward some components. However, as there may be public expenditure implications, it has been necessary to factor in additional time for scrutiny The Minister of State, Department of Energy and and approvals processes before the plan can be finalised. Climate Change (Charles Hendry): I have today laid Consequently, my expectation is that the SIP will now before Parliament the 2011 statutory security of supply be ready for publication in the first quarter of 2012. report (SSSR), which has been produced jointly with In the meantime, the RPA oversight board, which I Ofgem and with input from National Grid. The report chair, has reviewed the existing indicator in the business is a technical document that provides factual information plan for demonstrating that payments under the 2011 to the market on security of supply. The report covers single payment scheme (SPS) are made in an accurate electricity, gas and oil. The latter is not a statutory and cost-effective manner. In doing so, we have considered requirement but is included for completeness. I have progress on both 2011 scheme processing and work to placed a copy of this report in the Libraries of both address legacy errors. In line with my earlier statements, Houses. the agency has been undertaking corrective action on In addition, I am also publishing today a risk assessment the remaining known legacy data problems alongside produced for the purpose of the EU Security of Gas the processing of 2011 SPS claims. I am pleased to say Supply Regulation 994/2010. This is available on the that that corrective work on the known error cases DECC website at: remains on track to be completed by the end of the http://www.decc.gov.uk/en/content/cms/meeting_ payment window on 30 June 2012, with further analysis energy/en_security/eu_sec_reg/eu_sec_reg.aspx. planned on potential cases. Outstanding top-up payments have already been completed in respect of 2010 claims and are significantly advanced in respect of long-standing requests raised by claimants relating to earlier scheme DEFENCE year claims. Against that background the oversight board has agreed the following additional indicators for 2011 SPS: Pingat Jasa Malaysia by the end of December 2011 to have paid a minimum of 86% of eligible claimants and 78% of the total estimated value; by the end of March 2012 to have paid a minimum of 95% of The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Defence both the eligible claimants and the total estimated value. (Mr Andrew Robathan): Her Majesty the Queen has These indicators reflect a change in the focus of the given her approval to a recommendation from the agency’s efforts towards processing the more difficult Committee on the Grant of Honours Decorations and cases at an earlier stage, which is expected to increase Medals that those entitled to accept the Pingat Jasa the value of payments made at the beginning of the Malaysia (PJM) medal should now also be permitted to payment window while maintaining performance on wear it. the numbers of claimants paid in that period. Each The Government of Malaysia introduced the medal individual indicator betters or matches performance in 2005 and awarded it to British and Commonwealth under any previous scheme year while both reducing, veterans who had served in the conflict in Malaya in the rather than adding to, legacy problems and operating late 1950s and 1960s. Approval is not normally given for with a much-reduced budget. That represents a stride foreign medals to be accepted if British recognition for forward for the agency but, as I discussed with leaders the same campaign has already been presented. As an of farming representative bodies last week, there remains exception, veterans were originally permitted to accept some distance to go before I could be happy that but not wear the medal. This was done to recognise the farmers are receiving the service they deserve. I am clear generous gesture by the King and Government of Malaysia, that further strides towards that goal must be made in and their wish to award the PJM in recognition of the indicators that are set for subsequent years and that service given by many veterans in the difficult years communications with farmers who are not paid early in leading up to and following Malaysian independence. the window must be improved now. I know the RPA Following this change to the original decision we are chief executive has heard the clear message from farm taking action to ensure that as many holders of the leaders on the latter point and will ensure steps are medal as possible are aware, to enable them to wear taken to address it over the coming months. their medal with pride at remembrance events this I will continue to keep the House informed on the week. agency’s progress. 13WS Written Ministerial Statements8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Ministerial Statements 14WS

TRANSPORT if it is agreed that it should remain as an NDPB, to review the control and governance arrangements in place to ensure High-speed Rail that the public body is complying with recognised principles of good corporate governance. The triennial review will build upon the internal The Secretary of State for Transport (Justine Greening): review of the body conducted earlier this year. As the House will know, since taking up office as I will announce the findings of the review later this Secretary of State, a key early priority for me is to make year in line with the decision on the response to the a decision on the way forward following the Government’s consultation on high-speed rail. recent consultation on high-speed rail (HS2). If you would like further information, or to contribute My Department received around 55,000 responses to to the review, please contact my Department or the consultation and an analysis of them has been [email protected]. undertaken. I am being provided with detailed information I remain committed to the ongoing review of public on the issues raised. This will provide me with extensive bodies and my Department continues to work with the evidence in respect of all the issues that will affect my Cabinet Office to develop forward plans of reviews. decision. A number of colleagues have understandably requested meetings regarding HS2 and I believe it is important HOME DEPARTMENT that that there should be an opportunity for me to hear Deportation with Assurances directly from MPs on their views about HS2. Given that the consultation has closed, due process means it would not be proper for me to respond to any substantive The Secretary of State for the Home Department points that are made at this meeting. (Mrs Theresa May): I am pleased to announce that on I wish to place on record that I will be providing MPs Saturday 24 September my right hon. Friend the Foreign with an opportunity for such a meeting. I have scheduled Secretary, and His Excellency Taieb Fassi Fihri, Moroccan this meeting for 21 November and have written to Foreign Minister, signed a memorandum of understanding all Members to ask them if they wish to attend. The between the Government of the United Kingdom of meeting will take place in the Palace of Westminster. In Great Britain and Northern Ireland and the Government the interests of transparency, I will arrange for a transcript of the Kingdom of Morocco concerning the provision to be made available, as a public record of the proceedings. of assurances in respect of persons subject to deportation on grounds of national security. Triennial Review of NDPBs (HS2 Ltd) Copies of the memorandum of understanding have been placed in the Libraries of both Houses and on the The Secretary of State for Transport (Justine Greening): Foreign and Commonwealth Office website. Reducing the number and cost of public bodies is a There are a number of outstanding elements of the coalition priority. The triennial review process has been arrangement which UK and Moroccan officials are established to continue our work ensuring accountability continuing to negotiate, along with a number of other in public life by examining all non-departmental public judicial agreements and arrangements. We will publish bodies at least once every three years. I am announcing further details when this process is complete. today the triennial review of HS2 Ltd. This review has The Government are committed to strengthening our two aims: bilateral relationship with Morocco across a range of to provide a robust challenge of the continuing need for this fields, including measures to combat the shared threat NDPB—both its functions and form; and, from terrorism. 157W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 158W

Alistair Burt: We are aware that the Algerian authorities Written Answers to have closed some places of worship which had not been registered, including those of Christian groups, since Questions new regulations governing religion in Algeria came into effect in May 2007. I discussed the situation with a delegation of Algerian Christians when I met them on Tuesday 8 November 2011 26 October. The Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs, my right hon. Friend the Member for Richmond (Yorks) (Mr Hague), discussed the FOREIGN AND COMMONWEALTH OFFICE importance of reform with the Algerian authorities during his recent visit, although he did not raise religious Adam Werritty freedoms specifically. The UK also raises the issue of human rights, including Mr Kevan Jones: To ask the Secretary of State for freedom of religion and belief, with the Government of Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs whether (a) he, Algeria through a variety of mechanisms including the (b) any Ministers and (c) officials of his Department EU-Algeria Association Agreement. Following a recent have met (i) Mr Michael Hintze, (ii) Mr Tony visit by Mr Stefan Füle, European Commissioner for Buckingham, (iii) Mr Michael Davis, (iv) Mr Poju Enlargement and European Neighbourhood policy, the Zabludowicz, (v) Jon Moulton and (vi) Stephen EU and Algerian Government have increased dialogue Crouch; and where any such meetings took place. on these issues, by establishing a sub-committee on [78657] political dialogue, security and human rights. Freedom of religion, including for Christian groups, was discussed Mr Lidington: A full list of ministerial meetings with at the first meeting which was held last month. external organisations is published quarterly on the Foreign and Commonwealth Office’s website at: British Overseas Territories www.fco.gov.uk/en/publications-and-documents/ transparency-and-data1/hospitality/ Mr Ivan Lewis: To ask the Secretary of State for Records of meetings by officials are not held centrally Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs when the and would be available only at disproportionate cost. Government intends to publish its new strategy for the British Overseas Territories. [79397] Bridget Phillipson: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs whether (a) he, Mr Bellingham: The British Government plans to (b) officials of his Department and (c) special advisers publish a White Paper on the Overseas Territories next in his Department have met Mr Adam Werritty on year. I refer the hon. Gentleman to the statement given official business since May 2010; and how many such by the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth meetings took place (i) on his Department’s premises Affairs, my right hon. Friend the Member for Richmond and (ii) elsewhere. [78866] (Yorks) (Mr Hague), on 14 September 2011, Official Report, column 48WS, setting out the main principles Mr Lidington: The information requested is (a) no; of the Government’s strategy. (b) yes; (c) no, Our records show that three meetings Departmental Freedom of Information took place at the Foreign and Commonwealth Office. Information on the number of meetings which may Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for have taken place elsewhere, including overseas, is not Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs how many held centrally and could be provided only at requests under the Freedom of Information Act 2000 disproportionate cost. his Department has received in each month since May Afghanistan: Females 2010; how many responses given in each such month disclosed (a) the full information requested, (b) part Katy Clark: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign of the information requested, with some information and Commonwealth Affairs if he will take steps to withheld under exemptions in the Act and (c) none of ensure that women and women’s organisations in the information requested; and in respect of how many Afghanistan are included in (a) discussions at the requests received in each such month (i) (A) Bonn conference in December on the future of substantive and (B) holding responses were issued Afghanistan and (b) all ongoing discussions on the within 20 working days of the date of receipt, (ii) no future of Afghanistan. [78549] substantive response was issued within 40 working days of the date of receipt and (iii) no substantive response Alistair Burt: I refer the hon. Member to my answers has yet been issued. [78924] of 18 October 2011, Official Report, columns 892W and 893W. Mr Lidington: The figures for the number of Freedom of Information requests received each month since May Algeria: Christianity 2010 by the Foreign and Commonwealth Office are as follows: Mr Gregory Campbell: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what Number representations he has made to the Government of 2010 Algeria on the prohibition of any Christian activity May 65 from taking place outside of a state-recognised church June 102 building. [79024] 159W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 160W

We do not hold data centrally on the individual roles Number performed by staff in our non-departmental public July 100 bodies and details could be compiled only at August 97 disproportionate cost. September 107 October 116 Departmental Lost Property November 118 December 78 Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs whether his 2011 Department has lost any (a) computers, (b) mobile telephones, (c) BlackBerrys and (d) other IT January 99 equipment since May 2010; and if he will make a February 138 statement. [77357] March 131 April 80 Mr Lidington: Official items lost, stolen or damaged May 137 are all recorded as “losses”. Information is only available June 126 for the period since August 2010 without incurring Three-monthly figures for whether information was disproportionate cost. Information on the number of disclosed in full, in part or not at all, and the timeliness mobile telephones lost is not held centrally and can be of replies to requests are available on the Ministry of obtained only at disproportionate cost. Since August Justice website at 2010, 28 computers, including laptops (12 of these were http://www.justice.gov.uk/publications/statistics-and-data/foi/ in the UK and the other 16 were at one of our 260 posts implementation-editions.htm overseas) and 37 BlackBerrys (15 of these were in the UK and the other 22 were at one of our 260 posts Departmental Legal Opinion overseas) have been lost, stolen or damaged. All Foreign and Commonwealth Office (FCO) Stephen Hammond: To ask the Secretary of State for computers, including laptops, and BlackBerrys are Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs how many times encrypted and password protected; and all BlackBerrys his Department sought legal advice from external that are registered as lost or stolen are blocked remotely, counsel in (a) 2007, (b) 2009, (c) 2010 and (d) the making it impossible for them to be used. The FCO first six months of 2011. [78063] implements security incident management procedures to ensure that the impacts of incidents are risk managed Mr Lidington: Central records of this information are and investigations are undertaken to seek, where possible, not maintained, and an accurate answer to this question to retrieve lost/stolen assets. cannot be provided without incurring disproportionate cost. Officials who are involved in the Foreign and Departmental Orders and Regulations Commonwealth Office’s litigation cases and related matters are in constant contact with counsel. Stephen Hammond: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs how many (a) Stephen Hammond: To ask the Secretary of State for statutory instruments, (b) Ministerial orders and (c) Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs how many times other pieces of secondary legislation were issued by his his Department’s legal section provided legal advice to Department in (i) 1990, (ii) 1995, (iii) each year since Ministers in (a) 2007, (b) 2009, (c) 2010 and (d) the 1999 and (iv) 2011 to date. [78110] first six months of 2011. [78078] Mr Lidington: The number of statutory instruments Mr Lidington: Advice from the Department’s legal in the relevant years are as follows: section is fully integrated into the decision-making process 1990: 37 within the Department. No record is maintained of the 1995: 26 number of times legal advice is provided to Ministers 1999: 28 within that process, and the information requested could not be obtained without incurring disproportionate 2000: 36 cost. 2001: 37 2002: 26 Stephen Hammond: To ask the Secretary of State for 2003: 17 Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs how many 2004: 35 officials in his Department were working in its legal 2005: 24 section in June 2011; and how many staff were working 2006: 18 in the legal departments of his Department’s agencies 2007: 21 and non-departmental bodies. [78088] 2008: 13 Mr Lidington: The Foreign and Commonwealth Office 2009: 30 (FCO)’s legal department has approximately 70 staff 2010: 11 working as legal advisers, support and information staff 2011 (to date): 23. and maritime policy officers. It is not possible to list the number of ministerial Neither the FCO Services Trading Fund nor the orders made in these years without incurring Wilton Park Executive Agency have their own legal disproportionate cost, but the ministerial orders will be departments. statutory instruments and will accordingly fall within 161W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 162W the number given above for statutory instruments. We without discrimination. Reports of discrimination, including believe there were no pieces of secondary legislation on the basis of religion and ethnicity, are a serious issued by the Foreign and Commonwealth Office in the concern which we have raised with the Iranian authorities. relevant years which were not statutory instruments. Meg Munn: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign Departmental Parliamentary Questions and Commonwealth Affairs what recent information he has received of members of the Baha’i faith in Iran Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for being prevented from studying; and if he will make a Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs whether draft statement. [79103] answers to parliamentary questions prepared by officials in his Department are cleared by special Alistair Burt: I refer the hon. Member to my answer advisers (a) before and (b) after the relevant Minister. of 27 October 2011, Official Report, column 305W. [79567] Liam Fox Mr Lidington: Ministerial clearance is always the final stage before a parliamentary question is answered. Ian Lucas: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign European Union: Legislative Competence and Commonwealth Affairs what information his Department holds on meetings between the right hon. Mr Douglas Alexander: To ask the Secretary of State Member for North Somerset, when Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs how many for Defence, and representatives of the Government of meetings Ministers in his Department have held as part (a) Israel, (b) Pakistan, (c) Afghanistan, (d) India, of the Government’s examination of the balance of the (e) the US, (f) Sri Lanka and (g) Egypt. [79015] EU’s existing competences since May 2010. [78766] Alistair Burt: The information requested is not held Mr Hague: I have held regular internal discussions centrally and could be provided only at disproportionate with officials and my ministerial colleagues on a range cost. of issues, including the balance of the EU’s existing competences. Members Iran: Baha’i Faith Mr Douglas Alexander: To ask the Secretary of State Meg Munn: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs how many and Commonwealth Affairs what recent reports he has meetings (a) he and (b) ministerial colleagues in his received of the student campaign in Iran entitled Can Department held with backbench hon. Members who you solve this? regarding the denial of education to are members of the Conservative party between members of the Baha’i faith. [79101] Monday 17 October and Tuesday 25 October 2011. [78279] Alistair Burt: I met with representatives from the Baha’i community in the UK to discuss this campaign Mr Hague: It has been the custom of successive and the wider issues of repression against the Baha’i Governments that Ministers meet hon. and right hon. minority in Iran on 15 September. The Foreign and Friends in the normal course of business. Commonwealth Office has so far received, and replied to, over 2000 emails expressing concern for the closure Middle East: Armed Conflict of the Baha’i Institute of Higher Education. The closure of the Baha’i Institute of Higher Education and arrest Katy Clark: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign of members of its staff form part of a wider pattern of and Commonwealth Affairs pursuant to the answer of harassment of Baha’is in Iran, including the imprisonment 24 October 2011, Official Report, column 534W, on of Baha’i leaders. We regularly raise these issues with prisoners, whether he has recently (a) raised concerns the Iranian authorities, including when I met the Iranian with and (b) issued statements to the government of chargé d’affaires in August this year. We will continue Israel in relation to Palestinian prisoners in Israeli to press the Iranian Government to accord all their prisons. [79217] people the right to freedom of religion. With our EU partners, the UK has taken co-ordinated action to Alistair Burt: I discussed this matter during my visit address Iran’s human rights record, imposing travel in June with the Minister of Justice, indicating the UK’s bans and asset freezes on over 60 Iranians responsible concerns about both the detention and the treatment of for human rights violations, including Government Palestinian prisoners, including children. The British Ministers and members of the judiciary. ambassador to Tel Aviv most recently raised the issue on 26 October during his visit to the Israel Prison Meg Munn: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign Service complex, at the invitation of the Public Security and Commonwealth Affairs what recent information Minister, where there are around 4,500 security detainees. he has received on denial of education in Iran to He raised concerns over visitation rights and the treatment individuals and groups other than members of the of minors, particularly cuffing and shackling. In his Baha’i faith. [79102] discussions with the Public Security Minister, the Alistair Burt: Access to higher education in Iran is ambassador stressed the importance the UK placed on noteworthy with roughly one in 20 Iranians in full-time Israel fulfilling its obligations under international law. university study, and over 60% of university attendants The Government of Israel has reaffirmed to us its are female. This is to be commended, and every effort should commitment to treating prisoners in line with international be made by Iran to afford all citizens access to education human rights standards. The UK will continue to monitor 163W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 164W the situation with regard to Palestinian prisoners in Yemen: Politics and Government Israeli prisons and encourage the Government of Israel to meet its stated commitments. Martin Horwood: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what assessment Office of UK Permanent Representative to EU: he has made of the views of the general public in Manpower Yemen on the proposed Gulf Co-operation Council agreement on a political transition. [79378] Martin Horwood: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs how many UK Alistair Burt: As in many parts of the Middle East nationals were working (a) in UKREP in each of the and North Africa, Yemenis have been energised by last 20 years and (b) on the latest date for which popular protests starting in Tunisia which have pressed figures are available; and if he will make a statement. for democratic change. From late January 2011 we have [78726] witnessed the growth of widespread protest movements Mr Bellingham [holding answer 7 November 2011]: across Yemen. On the anti-Government side these have There are currently approximately 130 Foreign and been largely made up of students, some politically Commonwealth Office staff working in UKREP Brussels. affiliated and civil society and have received the support This figure includes UK-based civil servants and staff of the official opposition grouping JMP, and elements employed locally. For operational and security reasons, of the armed forces. At the same time we have also seen we cannot provide a more detailed breakdown. large pro-Government demonstrations in support of President Ali Abdullah Saleh. The number of staff has not changed significantly in the last three years. The anti-Government protest movement across Yemen has made plain its principal demand, that President Previous figures were compiled on a different basis Saleh step down. The Gulf Co-operation Council (GCC) and could be reconciled with the most recent figures Initiative meets this demand in its outline of a staged only at disproportionate cost. plan for a formal transfer of power leading to the Sri Lanka formation of a National Unity Government and early presidential elections. The Joint Meeting Parties (JMP) Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for supports the aims of the Initiative and has already Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs on which signed the GCC Initiative, as have representatives of the occasions the British ambassador to Sri Lanka or his ruling party (GPC). The protest movement, representative senior staff have met hon. Members in Sri Lanka in of large numbers of Yemen’s students and civil society, each month since May 2010; and if he will make a is diverse and lacks a single voice. In meetings with its statement. [78211] members British embassy officials have seen a range of views, some aligned with the JMP and its support of the Alistair Burt: Hon. Members visit our global network GCC Initiative, others not. A major theme is concern of posts frequently and we do not hold a central record with accountability and justice for those suspected of of meetings. Our high commission in Sri Lanka confirms human rights abuses and corruption. the following meetings: The highly volatile security situation in Sana’a, the October 2010 capital, and across Yemen constrains the ability of our A delegation from the UK Commonwealth Parliamentary embassy staff to travel widely in the country and interact Association that included the hon. Member for Maidstone and freely with as many Yemenis as we would like. But our The Weald (Mrs Grant); the hon. Member for Wimbledon (Stephen ambassador reports a continued desire for change among Hammond); the hon. Member for Southend West (Mr Amess); many Yemenis. the right hon. Member for Torfaen (Paul Murphy); and the hon. Member for East Lothian (Fiona O’Donnell). Martin Horwood: To ask the Secretary of State for February 2011 Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what assessment The hon. Member for Cities of London and Westminster he has made of the response of the general public in (Mark Field); Yemen to UN Security Council Resolution 2014. The hon. Member for Romford (Andrew Rosindell); [79379] The hon. Member for Bassetlaw (John Mann). July 2011 Alistair Burt: In meetings with the leaders of the The right hon. Member for North Somerset (Dr Fox). official opposition and judging from public statements October 2011 by leaders of the protest movements there is widespread The hon. Member for The Wrekin (Mark Pritchard). support for the UN in maintaining, through its adoption of Resolution 2014, pressure on president Saleh and his I also visited Sri Lanka on an official visit in February government. The Yemeni regime has also welcomed the 2011. resolution and undertaken to respond positively to it. Strategic Defence and Security Review Tawakkol Karman, Nobel prize winner and civil right activist, referred to it as a “good start”. There is a sense Mr Ainsworth: To ask the Secretary of State for among protestors that the UN can do more, but the Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs whether it resolution with its clause on reviewing the situation remains his policy that the implementation of the after 30 days sends a strong message to the Yemeni proposals in the Strategic Defence and Security Review leadership and opposition of global concern about the will not result in strategic shrinkage. [79005] deteriorating situation in Yemen and the urgent need for a political settlement. In particular it sends a clear Mr Lidington [holding answer 7 November 2011]: message to President Saleh that he should sign the Gulf Yes. Cooperation Council Initiative without delay. 165W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 166W

The general public, specifically those involved in Financial year Number of officials anti-government protests and on the receiving end of lethal force by government security forces, should be 2007-08 14 encouraged by the resolution’s clear condemnation of 2008-09 7 human rights abuses by all sides and the call for 2009-10 9 those responsible to be held accountable. Protestors 2010-11 10 from all camps are vocal on the issues of justice and 2011-12 8 accountability. The will for concerted international action to urge Departmental Security president Saleh to follow through with his promises to transfer power is strong and growing. We are making Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for Wales clear our concern over the economic, humanitarian and (1) what level of security vetting is required for the post security situation in Yemen. All our efforts are focused of (a) head of communications, (b) deputy head of on achieving a peaceful political settlement. But ultimately communications and (c) head of press office in her that choice rests in Yemeni hands. Department; and if she will list each person who has held these posts since May 2010; [77920] (2) what level of security vetting is required for (a) grade six and seven, or equivalent, press officers and WALES (b) ministerial private secretaries in her Department; Adam Werrity [77921] (3) what level of security vetting is required for (a) Mr Kevan Jones: To ask the Secretary of State for special advisers and (b) ministerial-appointed policy Wales whether (a) she, (b) her Ministers and (c) advisers in her Department; and if she will list each officials of her Department have met (i) Mr Michael person who has held these posts since May 2010; Hintze, (ii) Mr Tony Buckingham, (iii) Mr Michael [77922] Davis, (iv) Mr Poju Zabludowicz, (v) Mr Jon Moulton (4) what company or Government service is used to and (vi) Mr Stephen Crouch; and where any such undertake security vetting at (a) counter terrorist meetings took place. [78662] check, (b) security check and (c) developed vetting level in her Department. [77923] Mr David Jones: No such meetings have taken place. Mrs Gillan: Information relating to security vetting is Departmental Pay publicly available in the booklet entitled HMG Personnel Security Controls, which is available from the Cabinet Stephen Hammond: To ask the Secretary of State for Office website at Wales how many officials in her Department received a www.cabinetoffice.gov.uk/resource-library/hmg-personnel- pay rise other than by promotion in the last two years; security-controls and what the average increase was in each such year. This booklet describes the circumstances in which a [78532] post may require the holder to be the subject of national security vetting checks. It would not however, be appropriate Mr David Jones: Staff on full-time equivalent earnings to confirm which specific posts within the Wales Office of under £21,000 a year are eligible for a pay increase of are the subject of vetting, as this could highlight who at least £250. Six staff in the Wales Office were eligible within the department has access to sensitive material for these payments in both financial years, 2010-11 and and this could be used for targeting purposes. 2011-12. Details of the Wales Office special adviser is available Eight staff on loan from the Welsh Government in the quarterly publication of the list of special advisers received progression payments to which they had a which is available in the Library of the House and can contractual entitlement in 2010-11. Two staff on loan also be accessed on the Cabinet Office website at from the Welsh Government (WG) received the progression http://www.cabinetoffice.gov.uk/resource-library/special- payments in 2011-12. The average increase arising from adviser-data-releases progression payments for both years was around 4%. We do not have any other ministerial appointed policy Nine staff on loan from the WG who were not eligible advisers. for a progression payment received a one-off pay uplift of £400 regardless of grade in 2010-11. All vetting for the Wales Office is co-ordinated by the Ministry of Justice, who liaise with the Defence Vetting Stephen Hammond: To ask the Secretary of State for Agency to undertake the CTC, SC and DV checks. Wales how many officials in her Department received a bonus in each year since 2007. [78535] HOME DEPARTMENT Mr David Jones: Ministry of Justice staff working at the Wales Office are entitled to non-consolidated Animal Experiments performance related pay for outstanding performance and, under the reward and recognition scheme, for Kerry McCarthy: To ask the Secretary of State for additional work performed. All payments are non- the Home Department how many and what proportion pensionable lump sums. The total number of officials of licence applications under the Animals (Scientific receiving these since 2007 is shown in the following Procedures) Act 1986 were (a) granted and (b) table: rejected in each of the last three years. [78306] 167W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 168W

Lynne Featherstone: Details of the number of licences between applicants (or prospective applicants) and the granted and rejected under the Animals (Scientific Animals in Science Regulation Unit Inspectorate. This Procedures) Act 1986 for the last three years are shown means that proposals unlikely to meet the Act’s stringent in the following table. requirements are revised or withdrawn before formal A feature of the regulatory regime under the 1986 Act refusal becomes necessary. is the discussion that often takes place at an early stage

Granted in 2008 Refused in 2008 Granted in 2009 Refused in 2009 Granted in 2010 Refused in 2009

Project licences 695 0 541 0 515 0 Personal licences 2,835 0 2,645 0 2,664 0 Certificates of designation 207040

Animal Experiments: EU Law purposes of scientific research, use wild populations of primates for breeding purposes. [78709] Kerry McCarthy: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department what effect the transposition of Lynne Featherstone: Of the overseas breeding centres European directive 2010/63/EU will have on the extent supplying animals to the UK during the past two years of legislative restrictions on the use of (a) endangered we understand that two use wild populations of non-human species, (b) neuromuscular blocking agents, (c) dogs, primates for breeding purposes. Both have policies for cats and equids and (d) purpose breeding of quail and reducing dependence on wild-caught animals for future ferrets. [78251] breeding stock at least in relation to the animals likely to be bred and supplied to the United Kingdom. Lynne Featherstone: The use of (a) endangered species, (b) neuromuscular blocking agents, (c) dogs, cats and Chris Williamson: To ask the Secretary of State for equids, and (d) the purpose breeding of quail and the Home Department how many overseas companies, ferrets are all matters on which views were sought in the designated as breeding and supply establishments to public consultation on the options for transposition of supply primates to the UK for the purposes of European directive 201/63/EU which closed on 5 September scientific research, wean infants from their mothers at 2011. six months or younger. [78710] We are now analysing the responses to the public consultation and will announce decisions on these and Lynne Featherstone: The Home Office has no jurisdiction other matters covered by the public consultation in due or remit to designate or approve overseas breeding and course. We plan to publish a report on the public supplying centres. The use of non-human primates consultation by the end of 2011. from an overseas source in regulated procedures is authorised only when the centre in question has Kerry McCarthy: To ask the Secretary of State for demonstrated that animals bred and supplied to licensees the Home Department with reference to Articles 4 and in the United Kingdom will have been weaned at more 13 of European directive 2010/63/EU on animal than six months of age except in rare cases where experimentation, whether it is her policy to require (a) infants have been either abandoned or orphaned. an alternative method or testing strategy not involving the use of live animals to be used whenever it is Anti-Semitism scientifically feasible and (b) an alternative method or testing strategy not involving the use of live animals to Mr Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for the be used whenever it is scientifically feasible and if the Home Department what estimate she has made of the method is recognised under Community legislation. number of anti-Semitic attacks during Jewish high holy [78307] days in (a) 2010 and (b) 2011; and if she will make a statement. [R] [78675] Lynne Featherstone: In the public consultation on the options for transposition of European directive 2010/63/EU Andrew Stunell: I have been asked to reply. we indicated our intention to transpose article 4, on the principle of replacement, reduction and refinement, Individual police forces collate and analyse intelligence and article 13, on the choice of methods, as they stand. on the number of anti-Semitic attacks, in order to inform local operational decisions and to provide adequate We are now considering the responses to the public protection at times of demand. In addition, the Association consultation and will announce any further decisions of Chief Police Officers analyses this intelligence, to on these issues in due course. We plan to publish a inform forces of any emerging challenges. Data on report on the public consultation by the end of 2011. attacks on Jewish High Holy Days are not separately identified. Animal Experiments: Primates Mr Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for the Chris Williamson: To ask the Secretary of State for Home Department what steps the Government is the Home Department how many overseas companies, taking to protect the Jewish community from anti- designated as breeding and supply establishments to Semitic attacks; and if she will make a statement. [R] supply non-human primates to the UK for the [78676] 169W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 170W

Andrew Stunell: I have been asked to reply. Where no PES has been completed, this may be for Hate crime, including that targeting a person’s religion, one of a variety of reasons: is an issue the Government take very seriously. We are one is currently being completed; the pilot/project has not working with the Association of Chief Police Officers involved the introduction of a new process or policy, or because and other partners to encourage the reporting of all the pilot/project may alter during its life, and by virtue of being a test of a new way of working, results are not yet known and hate crime and improve the response of the police and therefore a decision cannot yet be taken on roll out and PES other criminal justice agencies to ensure better protection requirements. for victims. The cross-Government working group on anti-Semitism Kate Green: To ask the Secretary of State for the and the police regularly meet representatives of the Home Department what her policy is on measures to Jewish community to discuss the protection of the improve gender sensitivity in the asylum process; and if Jewish community against anti-Semitic attacks. The she will make a statement. [78702] anti-Semitism working group and the cross-Government Hate Crime Strategy Board have a number of actions in Damian Green: The UK Border Agency is working train to tackle anti-Semitism, which are reassessed on a closely with a range of key corporate partners in developing regular basis. These include funding the security needs improvements to the asylum system, with the ambition of Jewish faith schools within the state school sector, of running an asylum system which is truly gender challenging anti-Semitism in online media, improving sensitive. In particular, the agency recognises that women the recording of all hate crime, including anti-Semitic can face particular forms of persecution that are quite hate crimes, and improving the training of hate crime often different from those faced by men, and is committed prosecutors. to ensuring that women’s claims for asylum are dealt with as fairly and sensitively as possible. The agency is looking to develop a system which caters for, and reflects, Asylum the needs of women.

Keith Vaz: To ask the Secretary of State for the David Heyes: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department how many staff are employed by Home Department how many legacy asylum cases have the UK Border Agency’s Case Assurance and Audit been settled in Ashton-under-Lyne constituency in Unit to deal with casework. [79436] each year since March 2007; how many such cases have resulted in the asylum seeker being (a) removed, (b) Damian Green: The UK Border Agency’s Case granted leave to remain and (c) granted discretionary Assurance and Audit Unit employs a total of 126.87 leave to remain. [77395] full-time equivalent staff.

Damian Green: Information is not held in relation to Asylum: Employment the specific date on which individuals move to certain areas. We have therefore provided figures for the number of legacy asylum cases based on the applicant’s last Shabana Mahmood: To ask the Secretary of State for known address with postcodes in the Ashton-under-Lyne the Home Department how many asylum seekers have constituency. The total number of legacy cases in the (a) applied for and (b) been granted the Right to Ashton-under-Lyne constituency is 130. Of those, 105 Work after 12 months in each of the last five years. have resulted in the asylum seeker being granted leave [79194] to remain; five have resulted in the asylum seeker being granted discretionary leave to remain and five have Damian Green: The UK Border Agency does not resulted in the asylum seeker being removed. routinely collect statistics relating to the number of asylum applicants who are given permission to work. Note: This is because an application for permission to work is Figures rounded to the nearest 5 (- = 0,*=1or2).Figures may not recorded as a separate case type on the agency’s not sum to the totals shown because of independent rounding. Figures were extracted on 26 October 2011. case information database. Any application of this nature is instead dealt with by the case owner as part of the application for asylum with the outcome being recorded Kate Green: To ask the Secretary of State for the within the case notes. To provide the complete set of Home Department what equality impact assessment data requested it would be necessary to look at each has been carried out in respect of the reforms proposed individual application for asylum that has exceeded the as part of the Asylum Improvement Project; and if she 12 month point in the last five years and record whether will make a statement. [78701] an application for permission to work has been made and if so granted. The cost of doing so would be Damian Green: The Asylum Improvement Project disproportionate. (AIP) spans a large number of pilots/projects. Equality However, between mid August and the end of November impact assessments (now called policy equality statements) 2010 the agency did run an exercise to collate statistics have been completed for AIP projects/pilots where on the number of asylum seekers who were granted appropriate. For example policy equality statements permission to work. Those figures are as follows: (PES) have been completed for: Number of asylum seekers granted permission to work between 13 August and 24 i-Apply asylum support applications (online asylum support November 2010 applications) Number Experian checks on support applications Total applications received from 13 August to 24 November 188 Electronic appeal bundles for asylum support appeals 171W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 172W

Number of asylum seekers granted permission to work between 13 August and 24 James Brokenshire: In 2010-11, there were 593,146 November 2010 offences recorded by the police in those forces Number deemed to be rural according to ’A Classification of Total grants from 13 August to 24 November 88 Residential Neighbourhoods’ guidance. This represents Totals refusals from 13 August to 24 November 100 a fall of 4% over 2009-10. Further detail is provided in the table. These figures are based on management information Offences recorded in rural police force areas1 and are not subject to the detailed checks that apply for Offence group 2009-10 2010-11 % change National Statistics. Violence against 126,226 123,637 -2 Charities the person Sexual offences 8,938 9,496 6 Dr Whiteford: To ask the Secretary of State for the Robbery 3,386 3,551 5 Home Department what grants her Department made Burglary 72,186 71,481 -1 to charitable organisations in each of the last five years. Offences against 58,904 53,253 -10 vehicles [79080] Other theft 153,120 155,605 2 offences Damian Green: Although the Home Office and UK Fraud and 16,445 15,648 -5 Border Agency have made grant payments to fund forgery charitable organisations over the past five years, and Criminal 137,982 121,166 -12 may continue to do so in the future, it would not be damage possible to fully answer this question to the level of Drug offences 28,423 28,484 0 detail required without incurring disproportionate cost. Other offences 11,292 10,825 -4 Our systems record payments to not for profit organisations Total 616,902 593,146 -4 which includes charities but also other philanthropic 1 Forces deemed ‘most rural’ and ‘less rural’ according ‘A Classification of institutions and social enterprises. Hence, to do so Residential Neighbourhoods’ (ACORN). Forces are: Cambridgeshire, Cumbria, Devon and Cornwall, Durham, Dyfed-Powys, Gloucestershire, would require investigating more than 300 not-for-profit Lincolnshire, Norfolk. North Yorkshire, North Wales, Suffolk, West Mercia recipients, identifying whether they make payments to and Wiltshire. charities as a lead partner. Criminal Records: Databases As with all grant funding in the Home Office and agencies, grants paid to charities are monitored to ensure that recipients deliver the objectives of individual projects Guto Bebb: To ask the Secretary of State for the as well as contributing to the strategic aims of the Home Department what fee she proposes will be Department. payable for individual subscriptions to her planned online criminal records system. [79191] The Criminal Records Bureau, Identity and Passport Service and the National Fraud Authority have not provided any funding to charities over the previous five Lynne Featherstone: I refer the hon. Member to the years, and have not allocated any budget to fund charities answer I gave during the Public Bill Committee, (Bill over the spending review period. 146), sixteenth sitting, 10 May 2011, Official Report, column 643. Civil Disorder Departmental Consultants Mr Lammy: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department what plans her Department has to Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for the facilitate co-operation between police forces in the Home Department pursuant to the answer of event that they are called to deal with widespread 19 October 2011, Official Report, columns 957-8W, on public disorder; and if she will make a statement. departmental procurement, how many contracts [78144] involved the provision of consultancy services; how many contracts involved the employment of a Nick Herbert: The Police Reform and Social consultant within her Department; whether any such Responsibility Act 2011 makes provision for the Home consultants remained in employment on the latest date Secretary to issue a Strategic Policing Requirement to for which information is available; and if she will make which all police and crime commissioners and chief a statement. [77719] constables will have regard. It will set out the policing capabilities that are expected to be delivered by police Damian Green: Pursuant to the answer of 19 October forces working together in order to tackle national 2011, Official Report, column 958W, on departmental threats such as terrorism, public disorder and civil procurement, two contracts involved the provision of unrest, organised crime and civil emergencies. consultancy services. These contracts continue and Police force co-operation and requests for mutual aid consultants remain engaged. under section 24 of the Police Act 1996 are co-ordinated The Department’s commercial objectives require by the Association of Chief Police Officer’s Police consultancy services to be commissioned in terms of National Information Co-ordination Centre. defined output, not in terms of individuals assigned by Crime: Rural Areas the firms. Each consultancy requirement is scrutinised, to prove operational necessity and to ensure Miss McIntosh: To ask the Secretary of State for the that the need cannot be met by permanent staff. Home Department what recent estimate she has made The Department has spent £28 million less in the first of the level of crime in rural areas. [78750] six months compared to the same period last year. 173W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 174W

Departmental Freedom of Information of the date of receipt, (ii) no substantive response was issued within 40 working days of the date of receipt and (iii) no substantive response has yet been issued. Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for the [78915] Home Department how many requests under the Freedom of Information Act 2000 her Department has Damian Green: Information up to June 2011 is set out received in each month since May 2010; how many in the following tables. Information on Freedom of responses given in each such month disclosed (a) the Information Act performance for Government full information requested, (b) part of the information Departments in the 3rd and 4th quarters of 2011 will be requested, with some information withheld under published by the Ministry of Justice (MoJ) in late 2011 exemptions in the Act and (c) none of the information or early 2012. The most recent MoJ statistics are available requested; and in respect of how many requests at: received in each such month (i) (A) substantive and (B) http://www.justice.gov.uk/publications/statistics-and-data/foi/ holding responses were issued within 20 working days index.htm

Table 1: Freedom of information requests received by the Home Office, May 2010 to June 2011 2010 May June July August September October November December

Requests received 200 262 278 234 268 279 327 221 Substantive response within 20 145 191 216 193 221 229 254 191 working days Holding response within 20 working 55 76 61 41 47 49 73 30 days No substantive response within 40 10 10 18 7 6 13 15 7 working days No substantive response yet issued 0 0 0 0 0 0 ¦0 0

2011 January February March April May June

Requests received 272 311 284 217 263 306 Substantive response within 20 working days 243 266 246 194 239 275 Holding response within 20 working days 29 44 38 23 24 30 No substantive response within 40 working days 9 9 12 8 6 7 No substantive response yet issued 0 0 0 0 0 1 Note: The columns do not sum because (a) in some cases both a holding and a substantive response may have been sent within 20 days and (b) in some cases a holding response may have been sent within 20 days but no substantive response was sent within 40 days.

Table 2: Freedom of information responses sent by the Home Office, May 2010 to June 2011 2010 May June July August September October November December

Information released in full 68 79 106 83 100 89 87 108 Information released in part 19 22 24 48 35 37 32 30 Information withheld in full 13 25 11 15 56 23 17 15

2011 January February March April May June

Information released in full 95 97 111 76 81 95 Information released in part 39 34 43 35 28 32 Information withheld in full 12 17 18 24 27 38 Note: The figures do not include cases where no information was held or where the cost limit was invoked.

Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for the http://www.justice.gov.uk/publications/statistics-and-data/foi/ Home Department in respect of how many responses index.htm to requests for information received by her Department Figures on requests refused because they relate to under the Freedom of Information Act 2000 the reason commercially sensitive information are published in the of (a) commercially sensitive information, (b) quarterly MoJ statistics, Statistics for the 3rd and 4th information not held, (c) information too costly to quarters will be published by MoJ in late 2011 or early provide and (d) vexatious or repeated requests has 2012. Figures on requests which were not answered been given in response since January 2010. [78916] because to do so would exceed the cost limit, or because they were vexatious or repeat requests, are published in the annual MoJ statistics. The annual statistics for 2011 Damian Green: Information on Freedom of Information will be published in early 2012. Act performance for Government Departments is published by the Ministry of Justice (MoJ). The most recent MoJ Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for the statistics are available at: Home Department which Minister in her Department 175W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 176W is responsible for determining whether exemptions to Damian Green: Detainee custody officers (DCOs) the Freedom of Information Act 2000 should apply to must be certificated by the Secretary of State for the responses to requests for information under the Act; Home Department, my right hon. Friend the Member and which other Minister is responsible for making for Maidenhead (Mrs May), to carry out their duties such determinations should the subject matter of the and to exercise powers, one of the conditions of which request fall within the Ministerial responsibilities of is that they have undergone training on restraint techniques the Minister with lead responsibility. [78917] approved by the National Offender Management Service. Officers receive refresher training every 12 months. Separate Damian Green: The Freedom of Information Act 2000 training is provided for those involved in the overseas requires that a Minister must determine whether an escorting of children, using non-pain compliant techniques, exemption applies only in the case of the exemption Physical Control in Care (PCC). under section 36 of the Act. Any Minister may determine Any use of restraint is a matter of last resort when all that section 36 applies. The application of other exemptions other avenues of persuasion have failed and there is no in the Act is determined by officials. other option to effect the person’s co-operation. Its use must be justified, proportionate and for the shortest Departmental Health Insurance possible period to achieve the objective. Officers must report in detail where it has been used. Andrew Selous: To ask the Secretary of State for the Restraint on a child is only ever used where it is Home Department whether her Department pays for strictly necessary to prevent self-harm or to protect private medical insurance for its officials; and what the others and property. In very exceptional circumstances cost of such payments was in the last year for which officers may be given authority to physically intervene figures are available. [79143] to enforce a child’s removal where, despite attempts to persuade them to comply, they refuse to do so. Interventions Damian Green [holding answer 7 November 2011]: may start with guiding or shepherding, before PCC No officials in the Home Office or its Agencies (UK techniques are used. Border Agency, Identity and Passport Service and Criminal Records Bureau) are provided with private health insurance Information on the number of occasions where DCOs as part of their employment package. physically intervened in the case of children is not available prior to 2008 and there are no occasions of Departmental Lost Property such interventions in 2011. Of the 1,124 enforced removals and notified voluntary Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for the departure of persons aged under 18 in 2008, there were Home Department whether her Department has lost five instances. any (a) computers, (b) mobile phones, (c) Of the 1,007 enforced removals and notified voluntary BlackBerrys and (d) other IT equipment since May departure of persons aged under 18 in 2009, there were 2010; and if she will make a statement. [77338] eight instances. Of the 737 enforced removals and notified voluntary Damian Green: Following the Government’s commitment departure of persons aged under 18 in 2010, there was to transparency, in April 2011 the Home Office published one instance. historical figures (between 2005-10) for ICT losses. In future the Home Office aims to publish this data annually. All interventions occurred at the point of boarding an aircraft other than one in 2009 in an immigration This data can be found on the Home Office website removal centre. at: There have been no interventions at Cedars pre-departure http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/publications/about-us/ transparency/lost-mobiles-laptops-media/lost- accommodation. ict?view=Binary The number of people aged under 18 removed as enforced removals and notified voluntary departures Departmental Public Expenditure from the UK in 2008, 2009 and 2010 (2010 figures are provisional), are a subset of published information David Simpson: To ask the Secretary of State for the compiled under National Statistics protocols available Home Department how much her Department spent on the Home Office Science, Research and Statistics on new furnishings in the last year. [72936] web pages at: http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/science-research/research- Nick Herbert: The Department’s expenditure on furniture statistics/migration/migration-statistics1/ and fittings in 2010-11 was £4.251 million. Expenditure Data on the number of occasions where DCOs physically in 2009-10 was £3.14 million, and previous to that in intervened in the case of children is based on management 2008-09 it was £5.956 million. Breaking these figures information, and is not subject to the detailed checks down to costs for furniture alone could be done only at carried out for National Statistics. It is provisional and disproportionate cost. subject to change. A child is defined as a person aged under 18 years of age. Deportation: Children Deportation: Offenders Dr Huppert: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department on how many occasions control Dr Huppert: To ask the Secretary of State for the and restraint has been used on children as part of the Home Department with reference to the report by enforced removal process in each of the last five years. the Chief Inspector of the UK Border Agency entitled, [78711] A thematic inspection of how the UK Border Agency 177W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 178W manages foreign national prisoners, what steps she is Damian Green: 63 officials were working in the Legal taking to revise the risk assessment of ex-offenders Adviser’s Branch of the Department on 9 June 2011 contained in the Enforcement Instructions and (the date when the June 2011 numbers were updated) Guidance. [78761] who also provide most of the legal advice for the Department’s agencies and some of its non-departmental Damian Green: Risk of harm to the public is an bodies. important consideration when deciding whether or not The Government Equalities Office, part of the Home to detain under immigration powers a foreign national Office since 1 April 2011, employs eight lawyers and one offender who is liable to deportation, but it is not the administrative officer. The number of staff working in only consideration. There will be circumstances in which the legal teams of the Department’s agencies and non- it will be legitimate to detain even where there is no departmental bodies is as follows: identified risk of re-offending, for example where there The UK Border Agency Cash Forfeiture Team: 20 is a significant risk of the individual absconding or where the individual’s own lack of co-operation is a National Policing Improvement Agency: 10 determinative factor preventing removal. The Equality and Human Rights Commission: 81 Risk assessments provided by the National Offender The Independent Safeguarding Authority: two Management Service will always be taken into account, The Serious Organised Crime Agency: 61 where they are available, when deciding whether or not The Independent Police Complaints Commission: 15. to detain a foreign national offender under immigration Not all of the officials/staff mentioned above work powers. Where such assessments are not available (for full-time, and the figures include support staff as well as example, where the person is not subject to monitoring lawyers. by the Probation Service) managers will make a decision based on the specific facts of the case. Public Sector The UK Border Agency accept the need to ensure that detention is used appropriately and lawfully and have already put in place a package of measures to Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for the improve the quality of detention decisions and Home Department (1) what steps she is taking to put in documentation. For example the detention review template place a right to provide for public sector workers to and guidance have been revised to better support take over the running of services; and if she will make a caseworkers in making evidence-based detention decisions statement; [74782] and demonstrating progress since the last 28 day review. (2) what steps her Department has taken to The UK Border Agency will also review the template encourage the development of public service mutuals and guidance for making the initial detention decision in its area of responsibility; and if she will make a to ensure that all detention decisions are based on a statement. [74821] sound consideration of the evidence. (3) how many applications from employees to run services for which her Department is directly Entry Clearances responsible she has received since May 2010; and if she will make a statement. [77604] Jack Lopresti: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department what assessment she has made of Nick Herbert: The Government have stated their the length of time required to process the legacy visa commitment that every Department will put in place applications by the UK Border Agency. [79140] rights to provide for public sector workers to take over the running of services. The Localism Bill, currently Damian Green: In 2006 the Government committed going through Parliament, contains a proposed community to a review of all older unresolved asylum cases by right to challenge, which will enable local authority summer 2011. This was achieved by March 2011. A employees to express an interest in taking over the total of 500,500 cases were reviewed as part of the service they deliver. programme. The Government also want to give as many public As Jonathan Sedgwick, then Acting Chief Executive sector workers as possible the right to mutualise. However, of the UK Border Agency, reported to the Home Affairs some areas of the public sector—including frontline Committee on 12 September, 479,000 of the 500,500 policing—are exempt because of operational or security cases in the legacy programme have been fully concluded. concerns. There are 18,000 cases that have received an initial Currently, on the authority of the chief constable decision but have barriers to full conclusion, which and police authority, police forces may choose to continue to be actively managed by a dedicated casework outsource a variety of functions including but not unit. limited to human resources, finance, IT support, legal services, translation services, forensic and scientific testing Legal Opinion services, vehicle maintenance and running emergency call centres. Stephen Hammond: To ask the Secretary of State for We are exploring options for how rights could be the Home Department how many officials in her extended to public sector workers within the police Department were working in its legal section in June service, including working with other Government 2011; and how many staff were working in the legal Departments to determine whether existing models such departments of her Department’s agencies and non- as pathfinder projects, work force engagement or employee- departmental bodies. [78084] led spin-offs are appropriate. 179W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 180W

Riot Control Weapons Humber, (d) north-west, (e) Scotland and Northern Ireland and (f) Wales and south-west since the Mr Hollobone: To ask the Secretary of State for the comprehensive spending review in 2010. [78561] Home Department if she will make it her policy that in cases of public disorder, police forces deploy water Damian Green: Since the comprehensive spending cannon before baton rounds are deployed. [79184] review staff numbers in the named regions above have changed as shown in the following table:

James Brokenshire [holding answer 7 November 2011]: 1 The decision to deploy a particular less-lethal weapon is FTE an operational decision for chief officers. Region 31 March 2011 30 September 2011 UK Border Agency (a) London and the south-east 12,886 12,189 (b) Midlands and the east of 1,360 1,281 England Nia Griffith: To ask the Secretary of State for the (c) North East, Yorkshire and 2,402 2,327 Home Department what criteria will be used to Humber2 determine which of the UK Border Agency hubs will (d) North-west2 2,570 2,508 be closed in order to meet the target reduction from (e) Scotland and Northern 618 604 Ireland 70 to 25 as outlined in the Agency’s business plan. (f) Wales and south-west 611 598 [78692] Overseas3 2,126 2,130 Other4 75 Damian Green: Plans for consolidating our network UK Border Agency total 22,580 21,642 of hubs are predicated on UK Border Agency, Home 1 Full-time equivalent actuals, excluding staff on unpaid maternity leave, Office and wider Government objectives. career break, special leave, or loan to other Government Departments. At the top of these objectives, the criteria used for 2 Some locations have been reattributed between these areas following Cabinet Office guidance. determining the location of our future hubs are based 3 European posting and international visa function based abroad. on the need to ″secure the border″, and ″reduce costs 4 Staff whose location was not recorded centrally. and improve customer service″. Hub closures will be targeted and sequenced in locations where they can Nia Griffith: To ask the Secretary of State for the provide the greatest contribution to the delivery of Home Department what criteria are being used to these objectives. implement job reductions in the UK Border Agency. [78691] UK Border Agency: Finance Damian Green: As part of the work force planning Nia Griffith: To ask the Secretary of State for the process directors must submit work force plans to deliver Home Department what funding will be available to the services they are responsible for within allocated the UK Border Agency’s regional divisions of (a) budgets. Where headcount reductions are necessary it is London and the South East, (b) the Midlands and the for directors to formulate proposals as to how they will East of England, (c) the North East, Yorkshire and be achieved. the Humber, (d) the North West, (e) Scotland and Strategies for reduction in UK Border Agency include Northern Ireland and (f) Wales and South West in (i) reorganisation and more efficient ways of working, a 2012-13 and (ii) 2014-15. [78690] recruitment freeze and voluntary exit schemes. Where plans are likely to result in surplus staff who may be at Damian Green: The UK Border Agency is not in a risk of redundancy, directors are required to follow the position to confirm the funding for future years for its process set out in the Home Office Restructuring, regional divisions, as the business planning process for Redeployment and Redundancy Policy. 2012-13 is not scheduled to be completed until March 2012. Once completed, the agency will publish the business Nia Griffith: To ask the Secretary of State for the plan on its website, which will show its overall budget Home Department how many UK Border Agency settlement. Figures for 2014-15 are expected to be available officers were employed in each of the agency’s regions in March 2014. in (a) 2007, (b) 2008, (c) 2010 and (d) 2011. [78693] UK Border Agency: Manpower Damian Green: The periods requested cover both the Border and Immigration Agency and the UK Border Nia Griffith: To ask the Secretary of State for the Agency as shown. The increase in staffing between 2008 Home Department what change there have been in the and 2010 is the machinery of government transfer of number of staff employed by the UK Border Agency in border detection from HM Revenue and Customs and (a) London and the south-east, (b) midlands and the UK Visas from Foreign and Commonwealth Office to east of England, (c) north-east, Yorkshire and the the UK Border Agency.

Border and Immigration Agency (BIA) UK Border Agency (UKBA) Region 31 March 2007 FTE1 31 March 2008 FTE 31 March 2010 FTE 30 September 2011 FTE

(a) London and the South East 12,101 11,464 13,762 12,189 (b) Midlands and the East of 930 892 1,638 1,281 England (c) North East, Yorkshire and 2,478 2,433 2,562 2,327 Humber2 181W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 182W

Border and Immigration Agency (BIA) UK Border Agency (UKBA) Region 31 March 2007 FTE1 31 March 2008 FTE 31 March 2010 FTE 30 September 2011 FTE

(d) North West2 2,438 2,485 2,887 2,508 (e) Scotland and Northern 386 403 652 604 Ireland (f) Wales and South West 269 360 638 598 Overseas3 90 87 2,309 2,130 Other4 205 133 18 5 UK Border Agency total 18,896 18,258 24,467 21,642 1 Full-time equivalent actuals, excluding staff on unpaid maternity leave, career break, special leave, or loan to other Government Departments. 2 Some locations have been reattributed between these areas following Cabinet Office guidance. 3 The 2007-08 figures relate to European posting, the 2010-11 figures include the international visa function. 4 Staff whose location was not recorded centrally.

HOUSE OF COMMONS COMMISSION Departmental Freedom of Information Welsh Grand Committee: Wrexham Jon Trickett: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer Jessica Morden: To ask the hon. Member for which Minister in his Department is responsible for Caithness, Sutherland and Easter Ross, representing determining whether exemptions to the Freedom of the House of Commons Commission, what the total Information Act 2000 should apply to responses to cost was of holding the Welsh Grand Committee in requests for information under the Act; and which Wrexham including staffing, accommodation and other Minister is responsible for making such travel. [79145] determinations should the subject matter of the request fall within the ministerial responsibilities of the John Thurso: The cost to the House of holding the Minister with lead responsibility. [78920] meeting of the Welsh Grand Committee in the Guildhall, Wrexham, on 20 October is estimated at £7,600. This Miss Chloe Smith: HM Treasury officials normally figure includes sound recording and transmission, determine whether exemptions under the Freedom of interpretation, accommodation, subsistence and travel, Information Act (the FOI Act) apply to requests received and a small amount of overtime. It does not include by the Department. Members’ travel costs, which fall to be reimbursed by The exception to this is exemptions under section 36 IPSA, nor staff salary costs that would have been of the FOI Act (prejudice to the effective conduct of incurred anyway. It also includes costs of an earlier visit public affairs) which can only apply if it is the reasonable to Wrexham by staff to plan the arrangements for the opinion of a ’qualified person’ that the exemption is meeting. engaged. In relation to information held by Government, the qualified person must be a Minister. The Economic Secretary, as HM Treasury’s departmental Minister, TREASURY handles section 36 cases. However, all HM Treasury Ministers are qualified persons for this purpose and Bank Services should the Economic Secretary be unavailable, for example during recess, the decision will fall to the appropriate Dr Alasdair McDonnell: To ask the Chancellor of the duty Minister. Exchequer how much funding was allocated to the Having obtained the opinion of the qualified person devolved Administration in (a) Northern Ireland, (b) on whether or not an exemption under section 36 Scotland and (c) Wales under the provisions of the applies, HM Treasury officials then conduct a second Dormant Bank Accounts Act 2008 in (i) 2008, (ii) test to determine whether the information should be 2009, (iii) 2010 and (iv) 2011. [77827] released m the public interest or protected. Danny Alexander [holding answer 1 November 2011]: The first release of dormant accounts monies from the Growing Places Fund Reclaim Fund to the Big Lottery Fund was in August 2011. No funding was allocated to Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland through the dormant accounts scheme Tom Blenkinsop: To ask the Chancellor of the before 2011. Exchequer with reference to the announcement by the So far £36.5 million has been released to the Big Chief Secretary to the Treasury of 18 September 2011, Lottery Fund. The Big Lottery Fund apportions dormant where the funding for the Growing Places Fund will accounts in the following proportions: come from. [76558] England: 83.9% Amber Rudd: To ask the Chancellor of the Wales: 4.9% Exchequer with reference to the letter from his Scotland: 8.4% Department of 13 October 2011, reference 2/05396/ Northern Ireland: 2.8%. 2011, in response to the letter from the hon. Member This means that so far this year, approximately £3.06 for Hastings and Rye of 19 September 2011, reference million has been allocated to Scotland, £1.79 million AR/EOR/00483, on the Growing Places Fund, when he has been allocated to Wales, and £1.02 million has been expects to announce further details of the scheme. allocated to Northern Ireland. [76896] 183W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 184W

Danny Alexander: The Departments for Communities Mr Gauke: HMRC has been liaising with all payroll and Local Government and Transport will together software developers registered with HMRC’s Software contribute £250 million towards the Growing Places Developers’ Support Team since autumn 2010. HMRC Fund. The remaining £250 million will be made available has held a number of workshops for payroll software from the reserve. DCLG and DFT are currently developing developers to discuss Real Time Information (RTI). the detail of Government’s proposals, including how These were attended by around 160 developers representing money will be allocated and the mechanism by which almost 120 software houses. In addition, HMRC officials the fund will operate. A prospectus setting out details have held regular meetings with the payroll software was published yesterday. industry representative organisations. A list of respondents to the latest consultation on HM Revenue and Customs: Disclosure of Information RTI can be found in the Summary of Responses document published on 30 September 2011 on the Kate Green: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer HMRC website. how many requests to HM Revenue and Customs from (a) the police, (b) trading standards authorities PAYE and (c) the Serious Fraud Office for disclosure of information for criminal purposes made under the IDG60190 Anti-Terrorism, Crime and Security Stewart Hosie: To ask the Chancellor of the Act 2001 standard procedure for disclosing any Exchequer whether his Department has completed (a) information for criminal purposes were refused in each repaying overpaid tax and (b) collecting underpaid tax of the last three years; and if he will make a statement. as a result of miscalculations of tax liability by HM [78747] Revenue and Customs in the PAYE system. [79086]

Mr Gauke: The information requested is as follows: Mr Gauke: The PAYE system collects tax on account of an individual’s liability for the year using code numbers Trading Serious Fraud based on the information available at the start of the tax Tax year Police Standards Office year. For those who move in and out of work, have 2009-10 473 60 1 fluctuating income, or have expenses and benefits, in 2010-11 319 38 0 year PAYE deductions do not always equal the tax due. 2011-12 year to 288 29 0 For this reason at the end of each tax year, HMRC date checks that customers have paid the right amount of tax—usually around 85% of people have paid the right This excludes any rejections made outside of the amount. This is part of the normal PAYE cycle of work centralised team that deals with ATCSA requests but and has happened each year since PAYE was introduced the number of such requests made is minimal as these in 1944. will only made in exceptional circumstances. For the tax year 2010-11 HMRC have completed repaying those customers where they have received Insolvency all the information from the employer or pension provider. HMRC are now working through the cases Mr Liddell-Grainger: To ask the Chancellor of the where the customer has underpaid and, as last year, Exchequer (1) what assessment he has made of the where they have received all the information they will likely effects on director behaviour in the event that complete the process in time to adjust customers’ 2012-13 fewer actions are taken by insolvency practitioners as a tax codes. result of implementation of the proposed changes to conditional fee arrangements and after the event Population: Infrastructure insurance in insolvency litigation; [79091] (2) what estimate he has made of the effect on HM Revenue and Customs revenue of the proposed Angie Bray: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer changes to conditional fee arrangements and after the what estimate he has made of the additional cost to the event insurance in insolvency litigation in each of the public purse of providing public infrastructure to next 10 years. [79092] accommodate future population growth. [78475]

Mr Djanogly: I have been asked to reply. Danny Alexander: Investment in our infrastructure An updated impact assessment was published alongside will be vital, the Government estimate some £200 billion the Legal Aid, Sentencing and Punishment of Offenders of investment in our infrastructure between 2010-15 Bill which includes provisions on the proposed reform from both the public and private sector. of no win no fee conditional fee agreements. Officials In considering planned investment the Government are continuing to discuss the likely impacts of these and private investors estimate the level of future demand, changes in relation to insolvency proceedings. population growth being one of a number of factors. Population estimates are subject to change and the Pay: Software impact of an increasing population on our infrastructure need may also change. Stephen Timms: To ask the Chancellor of the Last year the Government published the National Exchequer which providers of payroll software his Infrastructure Plan setting out their vision and plan for Department has met to discuss upgrading their infrastructure investment. The next iteration of the products to supply real time PAYE information. [79362] plan will be published later this year. 185W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 186W

Taxation: Amusement Arcades Mr Byrne: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer (1) what estimate he has made of the number of Katy Clark: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer families affected by his proposal to increase the hours if he will meet representatives of the British threshold for tax credit entitlement to 24 hours a week; Amusement Catering Trades Association to discuss (a) and what the average cost per family will be; [79173] taxation and (b) the future of the amusements (2) what estimate he has made of the number of industry. [79419] families affected by his proposal to increase the hours threshold for tax credit entitlement to 24 hours a week Miss Chloe Smith: Treasury Ministers and officials by (a) region and (b) constituency. [79174] meet with a wide range of organisations and individuals in the public and private sectors as part of the usual Mr Gauke: No estimate has been made. policymaking process. As was the case with previous The increase in the hours rules for couples from Administrations, it is not the Government’s practice to 16 hours to 24 hours is part of a range of reforms to the provide details of all such discussions. tax credits system announced at the spending review. Estimating the impact of an individual measure does VAT: Construction not give a clear indication of the full impact on an individual household. Peter Aldous: To ask the Chancellor of the The Government published estimates of the distributional Exchequer what recent assessment he has made of the impact of the whole package of announced tax and effect of a reduction in VAT on building repair and benefit measures which can be found at: maintenance work on (a) economic growth, (b) levels http://cdn.hm-treasury.gov.uk/sr2010_annexb.pdf of employment and (c) small and medium-sized enterprises. [78986]

Mr Gauke: I refer the hon. Member to the TRANSPORT answers given on 17 October 2011, Official Report, Aviation: Alcoholic Drinks column 713W, and on 21 October 2011, Official Report, column 1201W, to the hon. Member for Sefton Central (Bill Esterson). Henry Smith: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport what the blood alcohol limit for pilots is. VAT: Hotels [79018] Mrs Villiers: The blood alcohol limit for pilots is set Dan Jarvis: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer out in section 93 of the Railways and Transport Safety what representations his Department has received on Act 2003. reducing the rate of VAT for hotels in the run-up to the London 2012 Olympics. [77435] Aviation: EU Action

Mr Gauke [holding answer 31 October 2011]: Iam Henry Smith: To ask the Secretary of State for aware of a number of trade campaigns to reduce the Transport what matters were discussed at the recent rate of VAT on the tourism and hospitality sectors, meeting of European Aviation Safety Agency’s including the hotel sector. Generally, these advocate an Advisory Group of National Authorities on 25 to immediate permanent cut in VAT because other EU 26 October 2011; and if she will make a statement. member states have reduced rates of VAT for hospitality, [79020] and on the basis of some economic modelling. Therefore, they take no account of the significant benefit to the Mrs Villiers: The meeting discussed issues relating to hotel industry of the holding the Olympics in London the regulation of commercial operations, such as sightseeing in 2012. flights, which take off and land at the same airport, the Businesses in the hotel sector also benefit from measures requirements for the approval of third country operators introduced under this Government. For example, the and the draft rules for flight time limitations. The main rate of corporation tax has been cut from 28% to discussions will help inform the European Aviation 26% and the small profits rate of corporation tax has Safety Agency’s development of the rules in these areas. been cut from 21% to 20%. Aviation: Security

Welfare Tax Credits: Eligibility Jonathan Ashworth: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport what recent discussions she has had with Mr Byrne: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer airport operators on the extension of the trial of the how his proposal that families will need to work swabbing of religious and cultural headgear to all 24 hours a week in order to claim tax credits from April airports in the UK. [78277] 2012 will be implemented; and if he will make a statement. [79172] Mrs Villiers: Officials engage with airport operators on a regular basis. However, the trial of alternative Mr Gauke: I refer the right hon. Member to the screening processes for headgear is a voluntary one so answer I gave the hon. Member for Stalybridge and the decision on whether to participate is an operational Hyde (Jonathan Reynolds) on 13 October 2010, Official matter for individual airports. Most major UK airports Report, column 481W. have decided to participate. 187W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 188W

Aviation: USA network further. These may also include sites in central Bedfordshire if suitable locations are identified by the Henry Smith: To ask the Secretary of State for private sector promoters. Transport if she plans to meet officials from the US (a) Federal Aviation Administration and (b) Department Invalid Vehicles: Accidents of Transportation. [79019] Mrs Villiers: I have no plans to meet with officials Jessica Morden: To ask the Secretary of State for from the US Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) or Transport what analysis her Department has made of the Department of Transportation. However Department the number of accidents caused by mobility scooters in officials have regular contact with officials from these each of the last five years. [79063] bodies. Norman Baker: Although my Department has no Buses: Inspections central database which records the number of mobility Nick de Bois: To ask the Secretary of State for scooters involved in accidents, we are aware of reports Transport what plans she has to review regulations in of specific incidents. Road casualty statistics do not respect of safety inspections under Section 19 of the currently include mobility scooters as a separate vehicle category. However, I am pleased to note that from 2013, Transport Act 1985. [78295] the police will be able to record whether a mobility Norman Baker: There are no plans at this time to vehicle has been involved in an accident on the public review regulations in respect of safety inspections under highway. section 19 of the Transport Act 1985. Cycling: Safety Metals: Theft

Dr Huppert: To ask the Secretary of State for Maria Eagle: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport (1) what assessment her Department has Transport what the cost was of replacing cable stolen made of the effect of the use of trixi safety mirrors on from each rail franchise in each of the last five years. the number of road accidents involving cyclists in [78799] London; [79459] (2) what assessment her Department has made of the Norman Baker [holding answer 7 November 2011]: cost effectiveness of the use of trixi safety mirrors in Any cable that is stolen from the railway is stolen from (a) reducing accidents involving cyclists and (b) Network Rail, as the owner and operator of the encouraging cycling. [79460] infrastructure, and not the individual rail franchisee. Network Rail estimates that the cost of replacing Norman Baker: The Department has provided Transport stolen cable including replacement cable and labour for London (TfL) with a signs authorisation for the use ″ ″ costs but not the cost of compensation to train operators of cycle safety mirrors (known as trixi mirrors) across affected by the disruption, in 2008-09 was £4.4 million; the Mayor of London’s Cycle Superhighway network. in 2009-10 was £3 million; and in 2010-11 £4.3 million. The Department has made no assessment of the cost effectiveness of these mirrors in reducing accidents involving cyclists and encouraging cycling in London or elsewhere, Ports: Liverpool although it is aware that TfL is undertaking its own monitoring and will be interested in the outcome of Dr Julian Lewis: To ask the Secretary of State for that. Transport what reports she has received on statements made by the leader of Liverpool city council prior to Electric Vehicles: Bedfordshire the announcement of the outcome of the public Andrew Selous: To ask the Secretary of State for consultation on changing the status of the cruise liner Transport where vehicle charging points will be located terminal in Liverpool stating that (a) a settlement had in central Bedfordshire; and when they will be installed. been determined, (b) the principle of Liverpool having (c) [78600] a turnaround facility had been conceded and suggesting legal action against the Government; when Norman Baker [holding answer 7 November 2011]: she expects to publish the result of the consultation; The Plugged-In-Places project in the east of England is and if she will make a statement. [78642] working with Central Bedfordshire council to initially install eight publicly-accessible charge points in central Mike Penning [holding answer 7 November 2011]: I Bedfordshire. Site selection is ongoing, with charge am aware of such statements having been reported. The points likely to be installed in car parks, among other outcome of the consultation was not pre-determined. places. The responses are currently under consideration and The project aims to install charge points across the our conclusions will be announced shortly. wider east of England and is continuing to work with Central Bedfordshire council and other organisations Railways to identify other potential charge point locations to expand the network further. Jesse Norman: To ask the Secretary of State for A number of private sector initiatives are now also Transport what her assessment is of progress in installing recharging points in the UK, e.g. under Charge implementing the Government’s plans to upgrade Master’s POLAR scheme and Ecotricity’s Electric Britain’s rail network; and if she will make a statement. Highway scheme, boosting growth in the national [78999] 189W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 190W

Mrs Villiers: I am pleased with the progress Network The settlement included an allowance for franchises Rail is making in the delivery of the programme of that had already been contracted along with forecasts works currently funded for Control Period 4. for contracts that have yet to be signed. Projects are being delivered on time and on budget The Department’s forecasts in respect of future contracts with some ahead of schedule and at lower costs. These along with our estimate of some of the variables within projects are starting to benefit both freight and passenger existing contracts (such as revenue share and support customers alike. figures) are commercially sensitive. As such they cannot be published. Railways: Fares However, contracted subsidy and premium payments Zac Goldsmith: To ask the Secretary of State for in respect of all train operating companies are Transport whether her Department has made an published on the Department’s website as and when assessment of the potential effect on female part-time contracts are signed. The contractual terms that are published include figures for the base contract payments workers of future increases in rail fares. [78771] or premiums along with details of the revenue share Mrs Villiers: The Department gave due regard to the and support arrangements that would vary those base equalities impact of the comprehensive spending review payments. decision on rail fares. This was in accordance with the Actual spending on rail is published in the Department’s statutory equality duties in place at the time. annual report and accounts. A breakdown of subsidy As part of this we considered that if fares increases and premiums paid or received in any given year in disproportionately affected non-season (peak) tickets, respect of each franchised train operator is also published then women could be disproportionately affected (as annually by the Office of Rail Regulation in National they are more likely to work part time than men). Rail Trends which is available on their website. However, in practice, we expect that percentage price changes for non-season tickets will be broadly the same Railways: Repairs and Maintenance as for season tickets. Therefore in proportionate terms, part time workers are likely to be affected in a similar way to full time workers. Karl McCartney: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport (1) whether Network Rail is required to Railways: Finance notify her Department prior to the commencement of engineering works; [79315] Maria Eagle: To ask the Secretary of State for (2) whether she has issued guidance to Network Rail Transport what estimate her Department has made of on maintaining adequate transport links for rail the level of rail franchise revenues in each of the next commuters normally affected by engineering works; 10 years. [78503] [79316] Mrs Villiers [holding answer 7 November 2011]: The (3) if she will meet (a) Network Rail, (b) East Coast Department’s internal forecast of revenue in respect of Trains and (c) other transport stakeholders in Lincoln future and existing contracts are commercially sensitive. to discuss Network Rail’s engineering works to the As such they cannot be published. track near Grantham on the East Coast Mainline; [79317] Railways: Freight (4) if she will assess the level of disruption to rail transport links to Lincoln arising from Network Rail’s Maria Eagle: To ask the Secretary of State for engineering works to the track near Grantham on the Transport what estimate her Department has made of East Coast Mainline. [79318] the annual number of rail freight tonne kilometres for each of the next 10 years. [78641] Mrs Villiers [holding answer 7 November 2011]: The scope and timing of engineering works are operational Mrs Villiers [holding answer 7 November 2011]: The matters for Network Rail under the industry’s national Department uses the agreed rail freight forecasts produced possessions planning regime which is overseen by the by the rail freight industry working with the Rail Freight independent Office of Rail Regulation. Group. A revised rail freight forecast was published in October 2011 covering tonne kilometres to 2019 and 2030. These can be found at: Rescue Services http://www.rfg.org.uk/userfiles/file/Rail%20Freight%20 Demand%20Forecasts%20to%202030_ver2.pdf Maria Eagle: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport what steps she is taking to improve the Dr Huppert: To ask the Secretary of State for ability of maritime rescue services to deal with the Transport what her estimate was at the time of the increasing size of ships operating in UK waters. [76546] comprehensive spending review of the amount of money paid by train operating companies to the Mike Penning: The standard for a nation’s maritime Government in (a) 2010-11, (b) 2011-12 and (c) rescue services are informed, and to some extent prescribed, 2012-13; and what her latest estimate is. [79285] by the International Maritime Organization (IMO) as Mrs Villiers [holding answer 7 November 2011]: Forecast part of the Safety of Life at Sea (SOLAS) convention. expenditure and income from rail franchise contracts The SOLAS convention is progressively amended formed part of the overall comprehensive spending and adapted to take account of changes to vessel review settlement for the Department that was published characteristics, including aspects related to increasing in 2010. vessel size. 191W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 192W

The Maritime and Coastguard Agency (MCA) uses Mike Penning: The Merchant Shipping (Registration an automatic identification system to monitor maritime of Ships) Regulations 1993, gives the UK and other traffic as part of maintaining an overall picture of members of the Red Ensign Group, powers to refuse vessel traffic and search and rescue response capabilities. the registration of ships if they are non-compliant with This enables the MCA to identify vessels that might be safety requirements. In line with other flag states, it is ‘at risk’ and encourage preventative action before problems our intention to review and simplify these regulations to arise. increase the powers of refusal. Road Signs and Markings The Maritime and Coastguard Agency will be taking this matter forward substantively in 2012 with a view to completing the work in 2013, subject to other regulatory Maria Eagle: To ask the Secretary of State for priorities and the outcome of the wider Red Tape Transport how many requests for special road traffic Challenge initiative. sign authorisations her Department has received in each of the last 10 years; and what the annual cost has been of processing these requests. [79149] ATTORNEY-GENERAL Norman Baker [holding answer 7 November 2011]: The numbers of requests for authorisations and Convictions: Industrial Health and Safety authorisations issued for the years 2001-2011 are shown in the following table. We do not hold figures for Katy Clark: To ask the Attorney-General what steps numbers of requests for authorisations for years before he is taking to improve the rate of conviction of those 2007. involved in failure to comply with health and safety requirements at work. [78153] Request for Authorisations Calendar year authorisations issued Chris Grayling: I have been asked to reply. 2001 — 455 HSE applies its Enforcement Policy Statement, 2002 — 433 Enforcement Management Model and the Code for 2003 — 197 Crown Prosecutors when taking decisions on when to 2004 — 423 bring a prosecution. This resulted in a conviction rate of 2005 — 303 94% in 2010-11. This is a good record, and in order to 2006 — 261 maintain the quality of enforcement decisions, HSE 2007 560 539 conducts a rolling programme of regulatory decision making peer reviews. Whether or not a person or company 2008 631 601 is successfully convicted is a matter for the court having 2009 556 532 heard the evidence presented. 2010 724 672 2011 705 606 Departmental Freedom of Information The recent policy document ‘Signing the Way’ will, as it is implemented, reduce the number of special Jon Trickett: To ask the Attorney-General (1) how authorisations which will need to be submitted to the many requests under the Freedom of Information Act Department. 2000 the Law Officers’ Departments have received in each month since May 2010; how many responses given Details of the costs of authorisations could be provided in each such month disclosed (a) the full information only at disproportionate cost. requested, (b) part of the information requested, with Shipping: Registration some information withheld under exemptions in the Act and (c) none of the information requested; and in respect of how many requests received in each such Maria Eagle: To ask the Secretary of State for month (i) (A) substantive and (B) holding responses Transport what the average age is of ships on the UK were issued within 20 working days of the date of Ships Register; and what steps her Department plans to receipt, (ii) no substantive response was issued within take to achieve the Marine and Coastguard Agency 40 working days of the date of receipt and (iii) no target of achieving an average age for ships on the substantive response has yet been issued; [78927] register of 19 years by March 2015. [76489] (2) in respect of how many responses to requests for Mike Penning: The average age of ships on the UK information received by the Law Officers’ Departments Ship Register is 20 years. The Maritime and Coastguard under the Freedom of Information Act 2000 the reason Agency’s aim of achieving an average age for ships on of (a) commercially sensitive information, (b) the register of 19 years is based on encouraging the first information not held, (c) information too costly to registration of new ships and applying rigour when provide and (d) vexatious or repeated requests has considering applications for the registration of older been given in response since January 2010; [78928] ships. (3) which Minister in the Law Officers’ Departments is responsible for determining whether exemptions to Maria Eagle: To ask the Secretary of State for the Freedom of Information Act 2000 should apply to Transport what progress her Department has made on responses to requests for information under the Act; amending legislation to give the Marine and and which other Minister is responsible for making Coastguard Agency (MCA) more powers to refuse to such determinations should the subject matter of the accept ships on to the UK register which the MCA request fall within the Ministerial responsibilities of defines as not being in the UK’s interests. [76490] the Minister with lead responsibility. [78929] 193W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 194W

The Solicitor-General: Tables containing the latest Number of free TV licences issued to available Freedom of Information data for the Law persons in the UK aged 75 or over Officers’ Departments have been placed in the Library of the House. 2007-08 3,709,445 Freedom of Information cases received by the AGO 2008-09 3,776,118 are generally dealt with by departmental officials, but 2009-10 3,853,911 either one of the two Law Officers can be consulted in 2010-11 3,929,753 those cases where it is necessary to determine whether Total 39,357,925 information should be withheld under the section 36 exemption (Prejudice to effective conduct of public SCOTLAND affairs). Adam Werritty The other Law Officers’ Departments are public authorities in their own right under the Freedom of Mr Kevan Jones: To ask the Secretary of State for Information Act 2000 and are responsible for responding Scotland whether (a) he, (b) his Ministers and (c) to requests for information themselves. officials of his Department have met (i) Mr Michael Hintze, (ii) Mr Tony Buckingham, (iii) Mr Michael CULTURE, MEDIA AND SPORT Davis, (iv) Mr Poju Zabludowicz, (v) Mr Jon Moulton and (vi) Mr Stephen Crouch; and where any such Olympic Games 2012: Newspaper Press meetings took place. [78661] Fiona Bruce: To ask the Secretary of State for David Mundell: There have been no such meetings. Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport whether he has had any discussions with the British Olympic Charities Association on increasing accreditation for local Dr Whiteford: To ask the Secretary of State for newspapers wishing to report on the London 2012 Scotland what grants his Department made to Olympics. [78734] charitable organisations in each of the last five years. Hugh Robertson: I am in touch with Lord Moynihan, [79071] Chairman of the BOA, to see if further accreditations David Mundell: The Scotland Office has not awarded can be made available. A copy of the most recent letter I any grants to charitable organisations in any of the last have received from Lord Moynihan on this matter will five years. be placed in the House Libraries. Television: Licensing NORTHERN IRELAND Mr Jim Cunningham: To ask the Secretary of State Departmental Freedom of Information for Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport how many free television licences were issued in (a) Coventry South Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for constituency and (b) the area for which Coventry city Northern Ireland (1) how many requests under the council is responsible in each of the last five years. Freedom of Information Act 2000 his Department has [78646] received in each month since May 2010; how many responses given in each such month disclosed (a) the Mr Vaizey: The administration and enforcement of full information requested, (b) part of the information the television licensing system is the responsibility of requested, with some information withheld under the BBC which operates independently of the Government. exemptions in the Act and (c) none of the information The BBC does not record the numbers of free TV requested; and in respect of how many requests licences issued on a constituency or regional basis. received in each such month (i) (A) substantive and (B) The BBC has provided the number of free TV licences holding responses were issued within 20 working days issued to persons aged 75 or over throughout the UK, of the date of receipt, (ii) no substantive response was since the concession was introduced on 1 November issued within 40 working days of the date of receipt 2000, as shown in the following table. and (iii) no substantive response has yet been issued; [78897] Number of free TV licences issued to (2) in respect of how many responses to requests for persons in the UK aged 75 or over information received by his Department under the 2000-01 3,002,549 Freedom of Information Act 2000 the reason of (a) 2001-02 3,381,000 commercially sensitive information, (b) information 2002-03 3,395,772 not held, (c) information too costly to provide and (d) 2003-04 3,490,877 vexatious or repeated requests has been given in 2004-05 3,548,595 response since January 2010. [78898] 2005-06 3,604,026 2006-07 3,665,879 Mr Swire: The information requested is shown in the following tables:

2010 Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec

Total number 13 26 26 15 9 20 21 13 20 12 26 12 Full release 6975511136114101 Partrelease 0110000013433 195W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 196W

2010 Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec

Noinformationreleased316324121110 Withheld under s.43 011000000000 Infonotheld1411525333397 Cost limit engaged 312200412020 Vexatious/repeated 000000000000 Full response in 20 days 13 21 21 14 8 17 21 12 18 10 23 11 PIT extended in 20 days 041111012221 Resolved after 40 days 032000000001 Still ongoing 000000000000

2011 Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun

Total number 11 11 16 16 14 31 Full release 1 3 2 6 10 12 Partrelease 131403 Noinformationreleased111003 Withheld under s.43 0 0 0000 Info not held 8 3 9 5 4 11 Cost limit engaged 0 1 3101 Vexatious/repeated 0 0 0000 Full response in 20 days 11 10 15 14 14 30 PIT extended in 20 days 0 0 1101 Resolved after 40 days 0 0 0000 Still ongoing 0 0 0001

The Department provides statistical data to the Ministry Person must be a Minister or, if held by a non-ministerial of Justice regarding its compliance with the Freedom of department, the persons in charge of that department Information Act and the Department’s performance (for example, the chief executive). with regard to the 20 working day deadline for responding If the release of any information under this Act to requests submitted under this Act. The MOJ publishes might result in the prejudicial effects outlined by this these statistics on a quarterly and annual basis and section of the Act, this information is presented to these can be found at: either the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland, my http://www.justice.gov.uk/publications/statistics-and-data/foi/ right hon. Friend the Member for North Shropshire implementation.htm (Mr Paterson), or me to decide whether or not this The Ministry of Justice is currently compiling statistical exemption is engaged, depending on the subject matter returns from all Whitehall Departments for requests of the information in question. This information is received during the third quarter of 2011. These are accompanied by supporting background information scheduled to be published on the MOJ website on that outlines the potential impact of the release of that 15 December 2011. The figures for the fourth quarter of information and arguments supporting both the release 2011 will be published on 26 April 2012 along with the of the information and those that favour it being withheld. 2011 annual return. Departmental Pay Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland which Minister in his Department is Stephen Hammond: To ask the Secretary of State for responsible for determining whether exemptions to the Northern Ireland how many officials in his Freedom of Information Act 2000 should apply to Department and the bodies for which he is responsible responses to requests for information made under the earned more than (a) £65,000, (b) £95,000, (c) Act; and which other Minister is responsible for £140,000 and (d) £175,000 in the last year for which making such determinations should the subject matter figures are available. [78509] of the request fall within the ministerial responsibilities Mr Paterson: The following figures relate to staff of the Minister with lead responsibility. [78899] employed by my Department, in its present form which came into being on 12 April 2010: Mr Swire: Officials within the Northern Ireland Office (a) four; are responsible for reviewing any information held by (b) four; the Department that is in scope of a request under the (c) one; and Freedom of Information Act and to identify any (d) none. information that might engage any of the exemption All figures relate to the 2010-11 financial year. provisions provided under this Act. However, the exemption provisions of section 36 of Stephen Hammond: To ask the Secretary of State for the Act (prejudice to the effective conduct of public Northern Ireland how many officials in his affairs) can only apply if it is the reasonable opinion of Department received a pay rise other than by a Qualified Person (QP) that the exemption applies. In promotion in the last two years; and what the average relation to information held by Government, the Qualified increase was in each such year. [78530] 197W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 198W

Mr Paterson: Comparable figures for my Department Mr Paterson: On 12 April 2010, the Northern Ireland as it is now configured are not available before 12 April Office transferred responsibility for policing and justice 2010 following the completion of devolution of policing to the Northern Ireland Assembly. Comparable figures and justice functions. are, therefore, not available for the Department as it is In line with the arrangements that apply across all now configured prior to April 2010. Whitehall Departments, during the 2011-12 financial The Department receives support from the Home year 11 members of staff, earning a full-time equivalent Office Legal Adviser’s Branch (HOLAB) and from the salary of up to £21,000 received a pay increase of one Crown Solicitor’s Office for Northern Ireland. It also incremental step on their pay scale or £250 if they were receives occasional advice from other Government bodies, at their maximum and still earning below £21,000. The such as the Treasury Solicitor’s Office (TSO). average increase was £397. There were also 62 members During the financial year 2010-11 the Department of staff who assimilated on to the Ministry of Justice spent £773,000 on legal costs arising from work undertaken pay scales in 2010-11 and three members of staff who by HOLAB and TSO. The costs for the first six months assimilated on to the MOJ pay scales in 2011-12. This of the financial year 2011-12 are approximately £343,000. change forms part of the framework of the new The costs of legal work undertaken by the Crown arrangements that were put in place on 12 April 2010, Solicitor’s Office for Northern Ireland for 2010-11 was as a consequence of the completion of devolution. The £147,000, and for 2011-12 was £51,000. average increase in 2010-11 was £1,208 and £1,509 in The Northern Ireland Office does not commission 2011-12. external legal advice itself, but in acting on behalf of the Department, these bodies will from time to time Stephen Hammond: To ask the Secretary of State for instruct counsel. Northern Ireland how many officials in his Department received a bonus in each year since 2007. Since April 2010, the Department has been taken to [78533] court 11 times (including industrial tribunals and judicial reviews). The NIO were dismissed from three of these Mr Swire: Comparable figures for the Department as and the remaining cases are ongoing. it is now configured are not available before 12 April 2010 following the completion of devolution of policing Stephen Hammond: To ask the Secretary of State for and justice functions. Northern Ireland what the cost was of (a) internal and (b) external legal advice commissioned by his During 2010-11, the Northern Ireland Office paid Department in the first six months of 2011. [78524] special bonuses to 39 members of staff in recognition of one-off exceptional pieces of work and/or for exceptional Mr Paterson: The Department receives legal support and sustained effort and results over a period of six from a range of Government bodies, including the months or more. The highest bonus paid to any member Treasury Solicitor’s Office (TSOL), the Home Office of staff was £750 and the average was £348. Legal Advisor’s Branch (HOLAB), the Departmental Departmental Regulation Solicitor’s Office and the Crown Solicitor’s Office. s The Northern Ireland Office does not commission Stephen Hammond: To ask the Secretary of State for external legal advice itself, but in acting on behalf of Northern Ireland how many (a) statutory instruments, the Department, these bodies may from time to time (b) ministerial orders and (c) other pieces of instruct counsel. secondary legislation were issued by his Department in The external costs for support from HOLAB during (i) 1990, (ii) 1995, (iii) each year since 1999 and (iv) the first six months of the 2011-12 financial year are 2011 to date. [78518] approximately £369,000. The costs for advice from TSOL for the first six months of the 2011-12 financial year Mr Paterson: On 12 April 2010, the Northern Ireland were £32,568. Office transferred responsibility for policing and justice The costs of legal advice arising from work undertaken to the Northern Ireland Assembly. Comparative figures by the Crown Solicitor’s Office for Northern Ireland in are not available prior to this date. the financial year 2010-11 were £3,000 and in the first Since 12 April 2010 my Department has made 11 six months of 2011-12 were £2,000. statutory instruments. My Department issued no other secondary legislation (e. g. statutory rules) in the above period. The information WORK AND PENSIONS relating to ministerial orders could be obtained only at disproportionate costs. Attendance Allowance

Legal Opinion Ian Austin: To ask the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions what consideration he has given of the Stephen Hammond: To ask the Secretary of State for length of the attendance allowance claim form. [78299] Northern Ireland how much his Department spent on (a) legal advice and (b) instructing counsel in (i) 2007, Chris Grayling: It is essential that all the right information (ii) 2009, (iii) 2010 and (iv) the first six months of 2011; is gathered at the start of a claim so the correct amount how many times (A) his Department was taken to of benefit can be decided and paid with as little delay as court and (B) a decision taken by his Department was possible. Claiming attendance allowance inevitably involves subject to a judicial review; and what the outcome was the customer or their representative answering detailed of each such (1) case and (2) review. [78506] and sensitive questions about their personal circumstances, 199W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 200W this is unavoidable if help is to go to people who meet maintenance payments (a) due to resident parents and the entitlement conditions set by Parliament. (b) owed by non-resident parents living in the London borough of Bexley. [77533] Carers: Grandparents Maria Miller: The Child Maintenance and Enforcement Mr Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for Work Commission is responsible for the child maintenance and Pensions what financial support is available from system. I have asked the Child Maintenance Commissioner his Department for grandparents who are the primary to write to the hon. Member with the information carers of their grandchildren; whether any further requested and I have seen the response. support is planned during the next two years; and if he will make a statement. [78674] Letter from Noel Shanahan: In reply to your recent Parliamentary Question about the Maria Miller: Grandparents who care for their Child Maintenance and Enforcement Commission, the Secretary grandchildren or other members of their family aged 12 of State promised a substantive reply from the Child Maintenance or younger for 20 hours or more a week, have been able Commissioner. to gain national insurance credits towards the basic You asked the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions, what state pension from April 2011. recent assessment he has made of the total monetary value of outstanding child maintenance payments (a) due to resident Income support and jobseeker’s allowance (income- parents and (b) owed by non-resident parents living in the London based) can be claimed by any person, including Borough of Bexley. [77533] grandparents, who has taken on responsibility for a As at June 2011, £13,677,000 in arrears was owed on cases child which is not their own. The exact amounts that where the parent with care is resident in Bexley. £7,742,000 of this they receive will depend upon the individual circumstances is owed specifically to the parent with care with the remainder of each case. A single foster carer may also be entitled owed to the Secretary of State. Non-resident parents living in to income support for his or her own needs. Bexley owed £13,555,000 in child maintenance arrears which comprises arrears owed both to the Secretary of State and parents This general policy will be taken forward in universal with care. These outstanding maintenance arrears have accumulated credit. Working kinship carers will be able to claim the since the Child Support Agency was established in 1993. child care element in universal credit on the same basis Further information by Local Authority is available on the as any other parent. internet at the following link: Local authority payments can also be made in particular http://www.childmaintenance.org/en/publications/xls/ circumstances. regional0611.xls Child Maintenance and Enforcement Commission and in the House of Commons library. These figures are arrears for cases administered on the Child Julian Smith: To ask the Secretary of State for Work Support Agency’s computer systems, and are rounded to the and Pensions how many people were employed by the nearest thousand pounds. It is not possible to break down arrears by Local Authority for cases managed off the Agency’s computer Child Maintenance and Enforcement Commission in system so these figures will not add up to the total reported in the the most recent period for which figures are available. Quarterly Summary of Statistics published in June 2011. [77657] I hope you find this answer helpful. Maria Miller: The Child Maintenance and Enforcement Commission is responsible for the child maintenance Mr Evennett: To ask the Secretary of State for Work system. I have asked the Child Maintenance Commissioner and Pensions what recent representations he has to write to the hon. Member with the information received on the methods used to calculate child requested and I have seen the response. maintenance payments to be paid by non-resident parents. [77540] Letter from Noel Shanahan: In reply to your recent Parliamentary Question about the Child Maintenance and Enforcement Commission, the Secretary Maria Miller: I have received a number of representations of State promised a substantive reply from the Child Maintenance on the methods used to calculate maintenance, and Commissioner. these have reflected a wide cross-section of personal You asked the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions, how circumstances. For example many non-resident parents many people were employed by the Child Maintenance and express concern that the 2003 scheme rules take no Enforcement Commission in the most recent period for which account of the income of parents with care, while some figures are available. [77657] parents with care believe that the maintenance calculation As at June 2011, the Child Maintenance and Enforcement should take account of a higher proportion of a non- commission employed 7,900 full time equivalent staff. This information resident parent’s income. is available on page 5 of the June 2011 Quarterly Summary of Statistics (QSS), which is available at the following link: There are no plans to change the scheme rules of the http://www.childmaintenance.org/en/pdf/qss/ Child Support Agency’s two current schemes, but in QSS_June_2011.pdf our Green Paper “Strengthening families, promoting and in the. House of Commons library. parental responsibility: the future of child maintenance” published on 13 January 2011, we confirmed plans to I hope you find this answer helpful. introduce a single new child maintenance scheme from Children: Maintenance 2012. This new scheme will make use of income data from Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs. Mr Evennett: To ask the Secretary of State for Work Detailed rules about the methods to calculate child and Pensions what recent assessment he has made of maintenance in the new scheme will be contained in the total monetary value of outstanding child regulations which will be subject to public consultation 201W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 202W before the new scheme goes live. The start of the A further £44 million has been incurred for software consultation process will be publicly-announced in due development on the reassessment of incapacity benefit course. customers. I and my officials have met, and will continue to In addition, £48 million incurred on seven assets meet, a number of organisations representing separated within a project to develop a single customer view parents to discuss the way in which the new scheme will which underpins the DWP Enquiry Service. operate. The remaining 27 assets have the following categorisation: Construction: Jarrow 12 relate to software licences, two relate to IT and 13 to software development. Mr Hepburn: To ask the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions what estimate he has made of the number Departmental Freedom of Information of businesses in the construction industry in (a) Jarrow constituency, (b) South Tyneside, (c) the north-east and (d) the UK in each year since 1997. Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for Work [79392] and Pensions how many requests under the Freedom of Information Act 2000 his Department has received in Mr Hurd: I have been asked to reply. each month since May 2010; how many responses given The information requested falls within the responsibility in each such month disclosed (a) the full information of the UK Statistics Authority. I have asked the authority requested, (b) part of the information requested, with to reply. some information withheld under exemptions in the Letter from Stephen Penneck, dated November 2011: Act and (c) none of the information requested; and in As Director General for the Office for National Statistics, I respect of how many requests received in each such have been asked to reply to your recent Parliamentary Question month (i) (A) substantive and (B) holding responses concerning the number of businesses in the construction industry were issued within 20 working days of the date of in (a) Jarrow constituency, (b) South Tyneside, (c) the North East receipt, (ii) no substantive response was issued within and (d) the UK in each year since 1997. [79392] 40 working days of the date of receipt and (iii) no Annual statistics on the number of enterprises are available substantive response has yet been issued. [78900] from the ONS release UK Business: Activity, Size and Location at: Chris Grayling: The Ministry of Justice publishes www.statistics.gov.uk annual and quarterly reports containing statistical The table below contains the latest statistics available, which show information on Freedom of Information requests received the number of enterprises in Jarrow constituency, South Tyneside, the North East and the United Kingdom between 2000, the by monitored bodies, including central Government earliest year for which data are available, and 2011 for the Departments. construction sector. The first two quarterly reports for 2011 can be found Count of VAT and/or PAYE registered enterprises in the construction sector, at the following address: 2000-11 http://www.justice.gov.uk/publications/statistics-and-data/foi/ Number implementation-editions.htm South Jarrow Tyneside North-east UK Annual and quarterly reports for 2010 and the annual statistics from 2005 can also be found at the following 2000 — 178 4,655 188,495 address: 2001 — 173 4,695 192,526 http://www.justice.gov.uk/downloads/publications/statistics- 2002 — 179 4,741 193,880 and-data/mojstats/ 2003 98 186 4,751 195,184 2010%20Annual%20and%20Q4%20FOI%20bulletin%20vfinal.pdf 2004 98 202 5,085 203,333 These reports include statistics on the number of 2005 111 219 5,545 214,402 non-routine requests received by this Department and 2006 123 239 5,965 222,526 the initial outcomes of these requests. It also contains 2007 142 258 5,818 232,190 the number of complaints to the Information Commissioner 2008 161 293 6,890 249,934 of which we have been notified, and the outcomes of 2009 187 307 7,794 289,085 these complaints. 2010 182 295 7,328 274,413 In addition, copies of each report have been placed in 2011 170 284 6,831 262,465 the Libraries of both Houses. Departmental Assets Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for Work Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions in respect of how many responses to and Pensions what assets with a value of £250,000 or requests for information received by his Department more his Department has bought since May 2010; for under the Freedom of Information Act 2000 the reason what purpose; and if he will make a statement. [77374] of (a) commercially sensitive information, (b) information not held, (c) information too costly to Chris Grayling: The DWP has acquired 36 assets provide and (d) vexatious or repeated requests has costing more than £250,000 between 1 May 2010 and been given in response since January 2010. [78901] 31 October 2011 totalling approximately £202.2 million. The assets all relate to software, IT development and Chris Grayling: The Ministry of Justice publishes software licences. annual and quarterly reports containing statistical The largest purchase was the implementation of the information on Freedom of Information requests received first phase of the central payment system (CPS) at by monitored bodies, including central Government £73.8 million, which has modernised benefit payments. Departments. 203W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 204W

The first two quarterly reports for 2011 can be found We are able to advise that expenditure on external at the following address: legal services, commissioned by DWP’s internal legal 1 http://www.justice.gov.uk/publications/statistics-and-data/foi/ services section for the same period was £2.0 million . implementation-editions.htm External legal advice is commissioned for a variety of Annual and quarterly reports for 2010 and the annual reasons. These include the need for specialist advice in statistics from 2005 can be found at the following address:. areas where relevant expertise does not exist within http://www.justice.gov.uk/downloads/publications/statistics- internal legal services, and particularly complex or important and-data/mojstats/2010%20Annual%20and%20Q4% matters where counsel’s view may be sought to complement 20FOI%20bulletin%20vfinal.pdf internally produced legal advice. These reports include statistics on the number of 1 Expenditure on external legal services comprises a range of non-routine requests received by DWP and the initial payments, including payments to meet other sides’ costs, where outcomes of these requests. It also contains the number these are required to be paid as a result of litigation; payments of exemptions used for commercially sensitive information, made to counsel from the Attorney-General’s approved list for prosecutions, litigation or advisory services; and payments to information not held, too costly to provide and vexatious local agent solicitors for prosecutions, some civil litigation and or repeated requests. other occasional work. It does not however include information In addition, copies of each report have been placed in about legal services provided to DWP pursuant to outsourced the Libraries of both Houses. arrangements. A more detailed breakdown of this expenditure could be provided only at disproportionate cost. The quarter three statistics for 2011 are currently being collected and will be published in due course. Stephen Hammond: To ask the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions how much his Department spent Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for Work on (a) legal advice and (b) instructing counsel in (i) and Pensions which Minister in his Department is 2007, (ii) 2009, (iii) 2010 and (iv) the first six months of responsible for determining whether exemptions to 2011; how many times (A) his Department was taken the Freedom of Information Act 2000 should apply to court and (B) a decision taken by his Department to responses to requests for information made under was subject to a judicial review; and what the outcome the Act; and which other Minister is responsible for was of each such (1) case and (2) review. [78095] making such determinations should the subject matter of the request fall within the Ministerial Chris Grayling: DWP does not hold information in responsibilities of the Minister with lead responsibility. the format requested in relation to all of DWP’s expenditure [78902] on external legal advice. We could provide the information only at disproportionate cost. The information we do Chris Grayling: Departmental officials normally readily hold on expenditure on external legal services determine whether exemptions to the Freedom of includes information about expenditure on instructing Information Act 2000 should apply to responses to counsel. requests for information under the Act. DWP’s expenditure on external legal services1, However, the exemption under section 36 (prejudice commissioned by its legal department, in the financial to the effective conduct of public affairs) can only apply years 2005-06 to September 2011 is set out in the if it is the reasonable opinion of a qualified person that following table. the exemption is engaged. In relation to information 1 Expenditure on external legal services comprises a range of held by a Government Department like DWP the qualified payments, including payments to meet other sides’ costs, where person must be a Minister. these are required to be paid as a result of litigation; payments In such instances officials normally seek the opinion made to counsel from the Attorney-General’s approved list for of the Minister responsible for the relevant subject prosecutions, litigation or advisory services; and payments to matter. local agent solicitors for prosecutions, some civil litigation and other occasional work. It does not however include information about legal services provided to DWP pursuant to outsourced Departmental Legal Opinion arrangements. A more detailed breakdown of DWP’s expenditure on external legal services could be provided only at disproportionate cost. Stephen Hammond: To ask the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions what the cost was of (a) internal Expenditure on external legal services and (b) external legal advice commissioned by his Expenditure Department in the first six months of 2011. [78066] Financial year Total spend (£ million)

2005-06 5.1 Chris Grayling: The information is as follows: 2006-07 5.6 (a) The cost of the internal legal services section for 2007-08 5.3 the period for the first six months of the financial year 2008-09 4.5 is £4.9 million. These are made up of salary costs for 2009-10 4.6 lawyers and support staff, plus other costs e.g. training 2010-11 4.1 and travel, but do not include departmental overheads 2011-121 2.0 e.g. accommodation and IT. 1 April to September 2011. (b) DWP does not hold information in the format The number of files that the litigation division of requested in relation to expenditure on external legal DWP opened relating to judicial review and other cases advice commissioned across the whole of DWP. We is detailed in the following table, for each year from could provide the information only at disproportionate 2008 to the end of June 2011. Not all of these cases will cost. have resulted in legal proceedings being issued as they 205W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 206W may have been resolved before that stage. A more Disability Allowance detailed breakdown of whether a case resulted in legal proceedings and the outcome of any such cases could Mr Virendra Sharma: To ask the Secretary of State be provided only at disproportionate cost. for Work and Pensions (1) what the cost was to the public purse of severe disablement allowance payments Number due to a main disabling condition of chronic pain in Judicial review Other1 each local authority area in the last year for which figures are available; [78003] 2008 75 332 2009 145 446 (2) how many people received severe disablement 2010 204 549 allowance due to a main disabling condition of chronic 2011 (first 6 months) 75 327 pain in each local authority area in the last year for 1 Some cases which originated as judicial review cases but have subsequently which figures are available. [78004] been appealed to the Court of Appeal or Supreme Court (formerly the House of Lords) may have been included as “Other” cases. It is also possible that some Maria Miller: The information as requested is not cases involving human rights claims may have been included as “Other” cases available. even though they were judicial review cases. In each case this is because it would result in disproportionate cost to determine whether the cases were or were not The term chronic pain is a general one that refers to JR cases. persistent pain lasting anywhere from three to six months, therefore chronic pain can be a result of a large number Departmental NDPBs of diagnoses that cause pain. The medical condition of severe disablement allowance claimants is recorded using Stephen Hammond: To ask the Secretary of State for a grouped version of the International Classification of Work and Pensions how many officials were (a) Diseases (ICD10), and the only codes that specifically directly and (b) otherwise employed by non- indicate chronic pain are those for ‘Chronic intractable departmental public bodies for which his Department pain’ and ‘Other chronic pain’, both of which come is responsible (i) in 2000, (ii) in 2005, (iii) in 2007, (iv) in under the general heading of ‘Pain not elsewhere classified’. 2010 and (v) on the most recent date for which figures Figures for ‘Pain not elsewhere classified’ are provided are available. [78120] in the following table; however, this is unlikely to be an accurate reflection of those individuals with chronic Chris Grayling: The figures of civil servants employed pain. The cost to the public purse cannot be calculated directly and otherwise within non-departmental public because the numbers are too small to quote for severe bodies for which this Department is responsible are disablement allowance with this medical code by local shown in the following table: authority.

Total number of civil The following table shows the number of severe servants (in full-time disablement allowance claimants in Great Britain and Dates of information equivalent) abroad, May 2010 to February 2011

Number of civil servants 31 March 2000 3,925.00 employed directly by Pain not elsewhere NDPBs All diagnoses classified 31 March 2005 3,777.00 May 2010 233,710 1,060 31 March 2007 3,562.00 August 10 231,550 1,050 31 March 2010 12,041.81 November 2010 229,000 1,030 February 2011 226,300 1,020 30 September 2011 11,206.07 Notes: 1. Data are rounded to the nearest 10. Number of civil servants 31 March 2000 16.00 2. To qualify for incapacity benefit/severe disablement allowance, claimants otherwise employed by have to undertake a medical assessment of incapacity for work called a personal NDPBs, e.g. capability assessment. secondment, loan Source: DWP Information, Governance and Security Directorate 100% Work and 31 March 2005 30.00 Pensions Longitudinal Study 31 March 2007 49.20 Under the employment support allowance regime, 31 March 2010 101.25 new claimants have to undergo the work capability 30 September 2011 60.75 assessment. From April 2011 incapacity benefit recipients will begin also to undertake this assessment. The medical condition recorded on the claim form does not itself confer entitlement to incapacity benefit or employment Departmental Publications support allowance. So, for example, a decision on entitlement for a customer claiming incapacity benefit Stephen Timms: To ask the Secretary of State for on the basis of alcoholism would be based on their Work and Pensions what estimate he has made of the ability to carry out the range of activities related to cost of changing from use of the term customer to the physical and mental function, assessed by the personal/work term client in guidance and documentation issued by capability assessment. his Department; and if he will make a statement. [79364] Driving: Disabled

Chris Grayling: Changing the term customer to claimant Claire Perry: To ask the Secretary of State for Work was done at no additional cost. Any changes to documents and Pensions what the average cost per individual is of or guidance were implemented when the guidance was providing specially adapted motor vehicles for disabled due to be updated. drivers. [76272] 207W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 208W

Maria Miller: The Department works closely with (2) how many people have secured employment Motability but it is an independent charity and is wholly under the Supporting Youth Employment scheme. responsible for the administration of the Motability [79154] Scheme. Support for vehicle adaptations is provided through Motability’s own charitable fund or the Specialised Chris Grayling: The Department does not recognise Vehicles Fund, which Motability administers on behalf the Supporting Youth Employment scheme, therefore of the Department for Work and Pensions. the information requested is not available. The average contribution to the cost of adapted Employment: Electronic Government vehicles from the Specialised Vehicle Fund in 2010-11 is contained in the following table. This contribution is in addition to the disabled person’s higher rate mobility Chi Onwurah: To ask the Secretary of State for Work component of disability living allowance being committed and Pensions whether he has considered increasing the to a five year lease through the Motability Scheme. capacity of the directgov online jobs search to handle more users. [79305] Average Specialised Vehicles Fund contribution in 2010-11 Average Specialised Chris Grayling: The Directgov job search has been Vehicle Fund Adaptation Number of vehicles contribution (£) built as a scalable solution. Usage is constantly monitored and any increased capacity requirements will be facilitated Passenger Wheelchair 1,793 3,750 by increasing the amount of hardware required in support Adapted Vehicle of the service. Drive from Wheelchair 373 24,000 Adapted vehicle Other adapted 233 7,000 Chi Onwurah: To ask the Secretary of State for Work Note: and Pensions for what reasons users of the directgov The Specialised Vehicles Fund primarily provides financial assistance to those online jobs search cannot search beyond a 15 mile severely disabled scheme customers who require complex vehicle adaptations that allow them to enter a car as a passenger while remaining seated in their radius of the user under the category all jobs; and if he wheelchair or enables them to drive their car while seated in their wheelchair. will consider expanding the job search radius. [79306]

Employment and Support Allowance Chris Grayling: The Directgov vacancy database, supplied by the Department for Work and Pensions, holds Mrs Moon: To ask the Secretary of State for Work approximately 115,000 vacancies at any one time with and Pensions pursuant to the answer of 12 October vacancy data updated daily. Such a significant amount 2011, Official Report, columns 426-7W, on the of data processing requires a number of search constraints employment and support allowance, how much arising in order to protect service integrity. from personal and occupational pensions was Searches for ’all jobs’ are very popular and will disregarded for the purpose of calculating contributory usually return the current maximum of 250 vacancies employment support allowance entitlement in each that the service can display; in addition such search year since 2000; and if he will make a statement. requests have been limited to a 15 mile search radius. [79127] In response to customer feedback, a number of service Chris Grayling: The disregard for occupational and improvements are currently being considered, including personal pension income was introduced in 2001 for the maximum number of vacancies displayed and an incapacity benefit claims. The disregard is £85.00 per increase to the radius search area. week plus half any excess. The same disregard was introduced into contributory employment and support Chi Onwurah: To ask the Secretary of State for Work allowance in October 2008 when it replaced incapacity and Pensions how many unique users visited the benefit. The value of the disregard remains unchanged Directgov online jobs search page in each of the last 36 since its inception. months for which figures are available. [79311]

Employment Schemes Chris Grayling: The information requested is not available. The system measures individual search sessions, so a unique user may search 10 times a day—this will be Alison Seabeck: To ask the Secretary of State for recorded as 10 sessions. The following tables offers user Work and Pensions how many unemployed people have session information that is available: become self-employed through the use of enterprise November 2008 to October 2009 clubs since April 2011. [78578] Month User sessions

Chris Grayling: The Department does not publish November 439,398 statistics on the numbers of people who have become December 350,075 self-employed through the use of enterprise clubs. Enterprise January 672,135 clubs are a locally driven initiative and their support February 2,972,195 can be accessed without referral from Jobcentre Plus. March 3,650,120 April 3,439,207 Employment Schemes: Young People May 3,744,478 June 4,416,138 Mr Byrne: To ask the Secretary of State for Work July 4,840,956 and Pensions (1) how much his Department has spent August 4,624,624 on the Supporting Youth Employment scheme to date; September 3,964,570 [79155] 209W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 210W

November 2008 to October 2009 Chris Grayling: Between 28 February 2011 and 3 April Month User sessions 2011 my Department issued 1,000 letters each week to incapacity benefit claimants informing them that October 4,705,881 their reassessment was about to commence. This Total 37,819,777 figure increased to 7,210 a week from 4 April 2011 and since 5 May 2011 the Department has issued 11,005 November 2009 to October 2010 letters each week. This will continue until the Month User sessions 27 December 2013. November 4,481,441 December 3,616,351 Income Support January 7,749,935 February 7,507,888 Ian Austin: To ask the Secretary of State for Work March 8,235,478 and Pensions what estimate he has made of the number April 7,290,295 of those in receipt of income support who have never May 7,236,443 been in (a) full-time and (b) part-time employment. June 7,602,041 [78302] July 8,181,994 August 8,023,040 Chris Grayling: The information requested is not September 8,415,311 available, and could be provided only at disproportionate October 8,076,240 cost. Total 86,416,457 Income Support: Lone Parents November 2010 to October 2011 Month User sessions Ian Austin: To ask the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions what estimate he has made of the likely November 8,003,336 number of lone parents claiming income support in December 5,585,671 each of the next three years. [78303] January 9,735,834 February 9,162,881 Chris Grayling: We estimate that the number of lone March 10,077,864 parents claiming income support in the next three years, April 8,025,887 with the current year for comparison, will be: May 9,208,410 June 8,830,365 Number July 8,782,867 2011-12 602,000 August 8,370,552 2012-13 514,000 September 8,706,295 2013-14 460,000 October 8,516,291 2014-15 440,000 Total 103,006,253 Note: Source: Figures include all lone parents who claim income support including Speedtrap and Webtrends Analytics tools those who are claiming on grounds of incapacity for work, being a carer, or other reasons. Chi Onwurah: To ask the Secretary of State for Work Source: and Pensions how many simultaneous unique users the Budget 2011 forecasts Directgov online jobs search system is capable of This reduction reflects: handling. [79312] 1. The lone parent obligation reducing from age of youngest child seven to age five meaning more lone parents will be seeking Chris Grayling: The information requested is not work and able to access sustainable employment. available. The system capacity is not measurable in 2. Reassessment of those on incapacity benefit. Income support terms of numbers of simultaneous unique users. can be paid in addition to incapacity benefit but not in addition to employment and support allowance. Chi Onwurah: To ask the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions how many unique users he expects to visit Pay: Pensions the Directgov online jobs search in the next year. [79313] Mr Jim Cunningham: To ask the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions what recent representations his Chris Grayling: The information requested is not Department has received on the restoration of the link available. The Directgov job search system records user between salaries and pensions. [78645] sessions, rather than unique users. Incapacity Benefits Steve Webb: We are regularly engaged in discussion with stakeholders about the pensions system and pensions Stephen Timms: To ask the Secretary of State for reform. Work and Pensions what information his Department The Government met their commitment to restore holds on the number of letters sent to incapacity the earnings link with the basic state pension. When the benefit claimants informing them that their earnings link was broken, the basic state pension was reassessment was about to commence in each week 26% of average earnings. By 2009 it was 16%. The since the beginning of February 2011. [79526] restoration of the earnings link will halt this decline. 211W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 212W

The Government have given a triple guarantee that Notes: the basic state pension will increase by the highest of 1. This estimate is derived from the Family Resources Survey growth in average earnings, prices or 2.5%. This will which is a nationally representative sample of approximately help provide a more solid financial foundation for 25,000 UK private households. Data for 2009-10, the latest year pensioners from the state. available, were collected between April 2009 and March 2010. 2. The 2009-10 Family Resources Survey estimated that due to Personal Independence Payments under-reporting the number of state pension recipients derived from the survey was 4% less than the number of actual recipients of state pension so the estimates presented should be treated with Mrs McGuire: To ask the Secretary of State for Work caution. and Pensions pursuant to the answer of 24 October 3. The figures from the Family Resources Survey are based on a 2011, Official Report, columns 12-13, on personal sample of households which have been adjusted for non-response independence payments, what criteria his Department using multi-purpose grossing factors which align the Family will use to determine sufficient evidence. [77255] Resources Survey to Government Office Region population by age and sex. Estimates are subject to sampling error and remaining Maria Miller: When providing advice for personal non-response error. independence payment, trained independent assessors 4. Figures have been rounded to the nearest 100,000. will consider individuals’ ability to carry out a series of 5. Informal carers are individuals who provide any regular service key everyday activities, set out in regulations. This advice or help to someone in or outside of their household who is sick, will inform decisions on benefit entitlement, taken by disabled or elderly, those who give this help as part of a formal departmental decision makers who are ultimately job are excluded from this definition. The definition used is not dependent on receipt of a carer’s benefit. responsible for ensuring appropriate evidence has been obtained and taken into consideration. State Retirement Pensions: Public Expenditure Assessors will need to ensure that they have sufficient evidence on which to base their advice. This evidence Rachel Reeves: To ask the Secretary of State for will be gathered from a range of sources, partly provided Work and Pensions if he will estimate the cost to the by the claimant and the remainder requested by the public purse of uprating (a) the state pension and (b) assessor. In most cases we envisage that this will also benefits at a consumer prices index level of (i) 2.5 per involve information gathered from a face-to-face cent., (ii) 3 per cent., (iii) 3.1 per cent., (iv) 3.5 per cent., consultation between the claimant and the assessor. (v) 4 per cent., (vi) 4.5 per cent., (vii) 4.6 per cent., (viii) However, such consultations may not always be necessary 4.9 per cent. and (ix) 5.1 per cent. in 2012-13; and if he or appropriate—especially where there is already sufficient will estimate the average change in the level of evidence available, such as from the claimant themselves payments of uprating at each level on (A) women and or from individuals involved in supporting the claimant, (B) men in each income decile in receipt of such such as their GP, specialist or social worker. Decisions pensions and benefits. [79622] on whether sufficient evidence has been gathered will be based on the circumstances of the case and guidance Steve Webb: The information requested is provided in will be provided to support such decisions. The assessment the following table for (a) the state pension and (b) criteria for the benefit are still being developed. benefits. The table shows the cost of increasing the benefits, by the given rate in April 2012 compared to a Social Security Benefits baseline of no uprating in April 2012. ’Other benefits’ only includes those benefits uprated by CPI. It therefore Mr Jim Cunningham: To ask the Secretary of State excludes pension credit as the standard minimum guarantee for Work and Pensions what plans he has to encourage is uprated by average earnings. people to take up their benefit entitlement. [78647] These costs are indicative only. Actual costs will be dependent on increases in benefit rates in April 2012. Steve Webb: I refer the hon. Member to the written Proposed benefit rates will be announced to Parliament answer I gave him on 15 November 2010, Official by ministerial statement later in the autumn. Report column 586W. Cost of up-rating for 2012-13 From October 2013, however, universal credit will £ billion, 2011-12 prices provide a new single system of means-tested support for Rate State pension Other benefits Total working-age people who are in or out of work. Existing means-tested benefits will no longer be needed, these 2.5% 2.0 1.0 3.0 include income-based jobseeker’s allowance, income-related 3.0% 2.4 1.2 3.6 employment and support allowance, income support, 3.1% 2.5 1.3 3.8 working tax credit, child tax credit and housing benefit. 3.5% 2.8 1.4 4.3 As a result people will be better placed to find out what 4.0% 3.3 1.6 4.9 benefits they can get. 4.5% 3.7 1.8 5.5 4.6% 3.8 1.9 5.7 State Retirement Pensions: Carers 4.9% 4.0 2.0 6.0 5.1% 4.2 2.1 6.3 Notes: Andrea Leadsom: To ask the Secretary of State for 1. The costing is based on DWP budget 2011 case load forecasts. Work and Pensions how many people drawing a state 2. ’State pension’ includes basic state pension up-rated with the triple lock pension are carers. [79523] policy, additional pension and graduated retirement pension. 3. ’Other benefits’ refers to working age benefits including, income support, jobseeker’s allowance, employment and support allowance, incapacity benefit Steve Webb: In 2009-10 there were an estimated maternity allowances and statutory sick pay, and also housing benefits and 1.2 million people who were in receipt of state pension disability benefits. Pension credit is excluded. and who identified themselves as informal carers. 4. Totals may not sum due to rounding. 213W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 214W

We are unable to estimate the average change in the Once universal credit is fully implemented we estimate level of payments of up-rating at each level on (A) that around 100,000 people will be affected by the women and (B) men in each income decile in receipt of removal of the rule that allows an individual to receive such pensions and benefits. This information could be both additions. supplied only at disproportionate cost. There will be a package of transitional protection for existing claimants to ensure no cash losers as a result of Tax Credit the move to universal credit, where circumstances remain unchanged. Mr Byrne: To ask the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions what assessment his Department has Dame Anne Begg: To ask the Secretary of State for made on the potential effect of child and working age Work and Pensions further to his Department’s impact poverty of his proposal to increase the hours threshold assessment on universal credit, how many couples at for tax credit entitlement to 24 hours per week. [79175] the latest date for which figures are available comprised one member of working-age and one member eligible Mr Gauke: I have been asked to reply. for pension credit. [77269] The Government have published their analysis of the cumulative impacts of their policies where they can Steve Webb: The information available is set out in robustly model them. The most recent analysis can be the table. This provides the number of couples in receipt found in the annex to Budget 2011: of income replacement benefits administered by the http://cdn.hm-treasury.gov.uk/2011budget_complete.pdf Department of Work and Pensions. Number of couples receiving income replacement benefits at February 2011 with Universal Credit one member of working age and one eligible for pension credit Claimant over 60 Claimant under 60 Benefit type partner under 60 partner over 60

Dame Anne Begg: To ask the Secretary of State for Pension Credit 93,200 0 Work and Pensions further to his Department’s impact Income-based Jobseeker’s 1,100 1,700 assessment on universal credit, how many people were Allowance simultaneously working more than 30 hours per week, Income Support 2,600 1,900 receiving working tax credit and not in receipt of Notes: housing benefit (a) in each of the last two years and 1. Caseload figures are rounded to the nearest 100. 2. The figures assume that pension credit is available when one partner reaches (b) at the latest date for which figures are available. age 60. However, the qualifying age for pension credit is increasing in line with [77267] the increase in women’s state pension age. At February 2011 the qualifying age for pension credit was between 60 and four months and 60 and five months. Current data do not allow analysis that takes account of the increase in Chris Grayling: According to the Family Resources qualifying age. Survey for both 2008-09 and 2009-10 there were estimated 3. Jobseeker’s allowance is payable until state pension age. Income support is payable until a person reaches the pension credit qualifying age, so these data to be 1 million benefit units with an adult working more include those who are over 60 who have not yet reached the pension credit than 30 hours a week, where the benefit unit was qualifying age. receiving working tax credit and not receiving housing 4. Data are not available for partners of employment and support allowance or incapacity benefit claimants. benefit. 2009-10 is the latest year for which data is 5. The best statistics on benefits are now derived from 100% data sources. available. However the 5% sample data still provide some detail not yet available from the 100% data sources. The proportions from the 5% sample data have been Notes: used and applied to the overall 100% total for the benefit to determine the 1. The Family Resources Survey (FRS) is a nationally representative total number of couples. sample of approximately 25,000 UK private households. Estimates 6. Figures are not available for couples who may be entitled to this support, but do not claim it. are subject to sampling error and remaining non-response error. Source: The FRS is known to under-record benefit receipt so the estimates Department for Work and Pensions, Information Directorate, 5% sample presented should be treated with caution. 2. Figures have been rounded to the nearest 100,000. Winter Fuel Payments 3. A benefit unit is defined as a single adult or a married or cohabiting couple and dependent children. 4. Housing benefit receipt is recorded at a benefit unit level on the Ian Austin: To ask the Secretary of State for Work FRS. This analysis is therefore only possible at a benefit unit level. and Pensions what estimate he has made of the number of people aged between (a) 60 and 65, (b) 65 and 70 Dame Anne Begg: To ask the Secretary of State for and (c) 70 and 80 years in (i) England, (ii) Dudley Work and Pensions further to his Department’s impact borough and (iii) Dudley North constituency who will assessment on universal credit, how many people will receive the winter fuel payment in each of the next be affected by the removal of the rule that allows an three years. [78333] individual to claim simultaneously both a disability and a carer premium. [77268] Steve Webb: Projections for the numbers of people receiving winter fuel payments are not produced below Chris Grayling: The Department is removing the the Great Britain level. However, if the England, Dudley current overlapping provision that allows people to metropolitan borough and the Dudley North constituency receive both a disability addition and a carer element. share of cases in 2010-11 were maintained in 2011-12, However, as now, couples could get a disability addition 2012-13 and 2013-14 the number of people projected to for one member and the carer element for the other receive winter fuel payments would be as given in the partner. following tables: 215W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 216W

Table 1: Projected winter fuel payment recipients in England Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for Work Thousand and Pensions which private sector organisations have 2011-12 2012-13 2013-14 signed a contract with his Department for delivery of Below 65 2,486 2,109 1,475 the Work Programme. [79369] 65 to 69 2,463 2,635 2,792 Chris Grayling: DWP has signed Work programme 70 to79 3,545 3,593 3,774 contracts with fifteen private organisations, namely; A4e Table 2: Projected winter fuel payment recipients in Dudley metropolitan borough Avanta Enterprise Ltd (TNG) Rounded to the nearest 100 Business Employment Services Training Ltd (BEST) 2011-12 2012-13 2013-14 ESG EOS Below 65 15,400 13,100 11,000 65 to 69 16,900 18,000 18,800 G4S 70 to79 24,100 24,400 25,000 Ingeus UK Ltd JHP Group Ltd

Table 3: Projected winter fuel payment recipients in Dudley North constituency Maximus Employment UK Ltd Rounded to the nearest 100 Pertemps 2011-12 2012-13 2013-14 Prospects Services Ltd. Reed in Partnership Below 65 3,400 2,900 2,400 Seetec 65 to 69 4,000 4,200 4,400 70 to79 6,400 6,500 6,700 Serco Ltd Source: Working Links Budget 2011 forecasts and DWP statistical data Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for Work Mr Jim Cunningham: To ask the Secretary of State and Pensions which voluntary and third sector for Work and Pensions what recent representations his organisations signed Work Programme contracts; and Department has received on increasing the age range if he will make a statement. [79383] within which people are eligible for winter fuel payments. [78644] Chris Grayling: DWP has signed Work programme contracts with two voluntary and community organisations, Steve Webb: We have received a small number of Rehab Jobfit and Careers Development Group. representations about extending winter fuel payments to specific groups of people below women’s state pension Heidi Alexander: To ask the Secretary of State for age. Work and Pensions how many people in (a) each ethnic group and (b) of each client type have been referred to the Work programme’s prime contractors in Work Programme each contract area in the last 12 months. [79530]

Mr Byrne: To ask the Secretary of State for Work Chris Grayling: The Department intends to publish and Pensions whether he has instructed Work official statistics on referrals to the Work programme programme providers not to publish performance from spring 2012 and on job outcomes from autumn information. [79179] 2012. This is in line with guidelines set by the UK Statistics Authority to ensure published statistics meet Chris Grayling: Work programme contracts do not the required high quality standards. allow providers to publish performance information without the Department’s express permission. This is in Heidi Alexander: To ask the Secretary of State for line with UK Statistics Authority guidelines that do not Work and Pensions how much has been paid in allow the release of information prior to the publication attachment fees in each Work programme contract area of official statistics. DWP intends to publish official in the last 12 months. [79531] statistics on referrals to the Work programme from Chris Grayling: The Work programme was launched spring 2012 and job outcomes from autumn 2012. on June 2011. There is a budget of £789 million allocated for this financial year to cover the costs of our Labour Stephen Timms: To ask the Secretary of State for Market Support Employment programmes including Work and Pensions what data he plans to publish on attachment fees associated with the Work programme. the number of (a) referrals to and (b) job outcomes for Tier 1 and Tier 2 subcontractors under the Work Heidi Alexander: To ask the Secretary of State for Programme (i) in total, (ii) in each contract package Work and Pensions what estimate he has made of the area and (iii) of each subcontractor; and when he plans likely number of clients in each Work Programme to publish it. [79363] prime contracting area in the next (a) six and (b) 12 months. [79532] Chris Grayling: The Department intends to publish official statistics on referrals to the Work Programme Chris Grayling: The following table shows the indicative from spring 2012 and on job outcomes from autumn volumes for claimant starts by contract package area 2012. This is in line with guidelines set by the UK (CPA). The estimates are for the 10 month period from Statistics Authority to ensure published statistics meet when the Work Programme went live in June 2011, to the required high quality standards. March 2012. 217W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 218W

Volume estimates have been formulated for each year Grant Shapps: The Home Ownership for people with only. Long Term Disabilities (HOLD) scheme aims to help eligible aspiring home owners whose housing needs Contract package Total volume of cannot be met through the Government’s main affordable area clients for 2011-12 home ownership programme. It enables purchasers to CPA 1 East of England 46,000 select a property on the open market suitable to their CPA 2 East Midlands 46,000 needs (for example, close to carers), and buy on shared CPA 3 West London 38,000 ownership terms with a housing association. CPA 4 East London 45,000 All applicants for our affordable home ownership CPA 5 North East 39,000 products, including this scheme, must undergo a robust CPA 6 Merseyside Halton, Cumbria 45,000 affordability check and demonstrate to their mortgage and Lancashire lender and the housing association that the costs of CPA 7 North, West and Greater 45,000 Manchester, Cheshire and home ownership are sustainable for them. Warrington It is a demand-led scheme. My Department provides CPA 8 Scotland 56,000 capital funding to housing associations, through the CPA 9 Thames Valley, Hampshire and 29,000 Homes and Communities Agency’s affordable homes Isle of Wight programme. We are investing almost £4.5 billion to help CPA 10 Surrey, Sussex and Kent 31,000 deliver up to 170,000 additional affordable homes between CPA 11 Devon, Cornwell, Somerset 20,000 and Dorset 2011-12 and 2014-15. As part of this, housing associations CPA 12 Gloucestershire, Wiltshire and 20,000 may bid for funding to help with the purchase of West of England properties on the open market for this scheme, where CPA 13 Wales 35,000 this has the support of the local authority. There are no CPA 14 Birmingham, Solihull and the 40,000 plans to amend the operation or rules of the scheme. Black County The following table shows the number of households CPA 15 Coventry, Warwickshire, 30,000 Staffordshire and The Marches assisted and amount of funding provided under this CPA 16 West Yorkshire 28,000 scheme in each of the last three years. CPA 17 South Yorkshire 19,000 Households assisted Expenditure (£ million) CPA 18 North East Yorkshire and the 18,000 Humber 2008-09 93 3.7 1 Total 628,000 2009-10 137 5.7 1 Totals may not sum due to rounding. 2010-11 132 5.7 Source: Homes and Communities Agency’s Information Management System

COMMUNITIES AND LOCAL GOVERNMENT Departmental Procurement Integration Strategy Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government how many Kate Green: To ask the Secretary of State for contracts his Department has awarded directly to third Communities and Local Government when his sector organisations in each month since May 2010; Department plans to publish its integration strategy. what the value was of such contracts; and if he will [79308] make a statement. [75118]

Andrew Stunell: The Government plan to publish a Andrew Stunell: This information on contract awards document setting out their approach to integration later is not held centrally and could be supplied only at this calendar year. The Secretary of State for Communities disproportionate cost. and Local Government, the right hon. Member for Brentwood and Ongar (Mr Pickles), will make a statement However we are able to provide a breakdown of to Parliament at this time. actual expenditure with third sector organisation for the period requested which is set out in the following Affordable Housing: Disability table:

Third sector organisations (£) Hilary Benn: To ask the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government (1) how many May 2010 174,314 people have been assisted by the home ownership for June 2010 1,054,642 people with long-term disabilities scheme in each of the July 2010 272,099 last three years; and how much funding has been August 2010 65,962 allocated to the scheme in each such year; [78487] September 2010 62,401 (2) what assessment (a) he has made of the success October 2010 1,162,744 of the home ownership for people with long-term November 2010 86,278 disabilities (HOLD) scheme, and (b) the ability of December 2010 146,376 those wishing to access the HOLD scheme to afford January 2011 989,366 their share of the property; [78488] February 2011 53,288 March 2011 377,055 (3) whether he has any plans to amend the operation April 2011 113,706 or rules of the home ownership for people with May 2011 900 long-term disabilities scheme. [78489] 219W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 220W

publish a wide range of technical literature on Third sector organisations (£) housing design for use by designers, landlords and June 2011 3,600 home owners: July 2011 5,699 www.pocklington-trust.org.uk August 2011 0 The Government are also supporting the Design Council September 2011 0 to provide advice to practitioners on designing homes Total 4,568,430 and neighbourhoods to meet the needs of people regardless The analysis of our supplier base which has enabled of their ability: the identification of third sector organisations was www.designcouncil.org.uk undertaken by an independent company. Please note Non-domestic Rates: Empty Property that this will include public sector bodies. Mr Jim Cunningham: To ask the Secretary of State Tristram Hunt: To ask the Secretary of State for for Communities and Local Government if he will Communities and Local Government whether his assess the impact of the reduction of the Empty Department has contracts with organisations that Property Rates threshold on the growth of new specialise in (a) public relations, (b) strategic business centres. [79064] communications, (c) brand management and (d) advertising; what the name is of each such Robert Neill: I refer the hon. Member to the answers I organisation; and what the net value is of any such gave my hon. Friend the Member for York Outer (Julian contract. [78244] Sturdy) on 26 January 2011, Official Report, column 2MC, and my hon. Friend the Member for Newark Robert Neill: The Department is currently not (Patrick Mercer) on 8 February 2011, Official Report, outsourcing work in (a) public relations, (b) strategic column 178W. communications and (c) brand management and consequently has no contracts with companies specialising in these areas. The only major advertising campaign that the ENVIRONMENT, FOOD AND RURAL AFFAIRS Department is running this year is Fire Kills that Adam Werritty urges people to test their smoke alarms regularly in order to avoid deaths and injuries from fire in the home. The national advertising creative elements are Mary Creagh: To ask the Secretary of State for handled by agency RKCR/Y&R and the value of their Environment, Food and Rural Affairs whether any contract this year is £220,000 on current estimates. All Ministers in her Department have met (a) Mr Adam advertising is placed in media outlets through the Central Werritty, (b) representatives of Atlantic Bridge and Office of Information, the Government’s agency for (c) representatives of Pargav Ltd in an official capacity these services. in the last 18 months; and what the dates were of any such meetings. [76915]

Housing: Visual Impairment Richard Benyon: No DEFRA Ministers have met with Mr Adam Werritty, representatives of Atlantic Hilary Benn: To ask the Secretary of State for Bridge or representatives of Pargav Ltd in an official Communities and Local Government (1) how many capacity in the last 18 months. homes designed specifically for blind or visually impaired people have been (a) built or (b) adapted in Agriculture: Pay each of the last 10 years; [78490] (2) what guidance his Department has issued about Mrs Glindon: To ask the Secretary of State for (a) the support required and (b) the housing needs, Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what assessment including design, of people who are blind or visually she has made of the possible effect of the abolition of impaired; [78491] the (a) Agricultural Wages Board and (b) agricultural minimum wage on (i) pay levels, (ii) employment and (3) how many assessors have been given specific (iii) the activities of unlicensed gangmasters in the training in awareness of blindness, low vision and sight agricultural sector. [78035] loss in respect of housing needs. [78492] Mr Paice: On the assumption that the Public Bodies Grant Shapps: We do not keep records relating to the Bill is given Royal Assent, DEFRA will carry out a number of homes designed specifically for blind or public consultation on the future of the Agricultural visually impaired people or details around assessors. Wages Board. We intend to publish a full impact assessment However, the Government are committed to encouraging and equality impact assessment on the effects of any the delivery of homes and neighbourhoods which are abolition as part of the consultation exercise. safe and inclusive, where nobody is disadvantaged and which all people are able to occupy and use regardless Animal Welfare: Circuses of their ability. While this Department does not issue guidance on Caroline Lucas: To ask the Secretary of State for this matter, guidance on meeting the needs of blind or Environment, Food and Rural Affairs pursuant to the visually impaired people is available for practitioners answer of 3 October 2011, Official Report, column to draw on from organisations such as the Pocklington 1405W, on wildlife: circuses, if she will publish any Trust who have undertaken extensive research and advice that she has received from the Better Regulation 221W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 222W

Executive on the proposed regulatory framework for Common Land setting up and operating a licensing regime; and if she will make a statement. [79028] Mr Andrew Smith: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what responses Mr Paice: We have been developing our proposals for her Department has received to its consultation on the a licensing regime for wild animals in travelling circuses designation of town and village greens; and if she will in line with Better Regulation Executive guidance and make a statement. [78800] advice. This includes the preparation of an impact assessment to be scrutinised by the Regulatory Policy Richard Benyon: The consultation on proposals for Committee (RPC). The impact assessment and draft the registration of new town or village greens closed on legislation will be published as part of the public 17 October 2011. Officials are currently considering all consultation on our proposals early next year. of the responses received and we will announce our conclusions early next year. Caroline Lucas: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs pursuant to the Departmental Billing answer of 3 October 2011, Official Report, columns 381-2W, on zoo: licensing, for what reasons circus Mike Freer: To ask the Secretary of State for inspections were conducted on a confidential basis; and Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what the average if she will ask those who requested confidentiality to cost to her Department was of processing the payment agree to publication and the placing of a copy in the of an invoice in the latest period for which figures are Library. [79029] available; and what proportion of invoices settled in that period her Department paid (a) electronically and Mr Paice: These inspections were conducted to establish (b) by cheque. [74979] the feasibility of an enforceable licensing regime. To ensure full participation, the participants were given Richard Benyon: The average cost of processing an assurances that the data collected would be confidential. invoice is £3.70. This includes all overheads. The reports are confidential and as a consequence we Over 99% of the payments issued by DEFRA are will not release them. issued electronically, with the remainder being issued by cheque. This figure has remained consistent over the course of the last financial year. Bovine Tuberculosis: Disease Control Departmental Manpower

James Wharton: To ask the Secretary of State for Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs whether her Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how many (a) Department plans to introduce registration and full-time and (b) part-time employees her Department licensing for camelids. [74629] employed in each year since 1997. [75073]

Mr Paice: DEFRA has no plans to formally register Richard Benyon: DEFRA was created in June 2001 or license camelids. and the following table shows the number of staff in post in DEFRA and its Executive agencies each year since then, in terms of full-time equivalents and headcount. Broadband The split between full-time and part-time employees is not held centrally and could be provided only at disproportionate cost. Chi Onwurah: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs pursuant to the Full-time equivalent Head count contribution of the Parliamentary Under-Secretary for Natural Environment and Fisheries, 26 October 2011, 1 April 2002 13,737 14,206 Official Report, column 397, to which broadband 1 April 2003 13,513 14,030 league tables she was referring to; and if she will place a 1 April 2004 13,442 14,004 copy of those league tables in the Library. [79473] 1 April 2005 13,205 13,723 31 March 2006 12,983 13,595 Richard Benyon: I refer the hon. Lady to the following 31 March 2007 11,814 12,363 documents: 31 March 2008 10,640 11,168 31 March 2009 10,189 10,730 the December 2010 Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD) ‘Digital Economy Paper No. 165— 31 March 2010 10,042 10,629 Indicators of Broadband Coverage’, which shows the UK as 31 March 2011 9,112 9,689 being among 14 OECD countries with very few or no Fibre to the Home (FTTH) connections; Departmental Security the Ofcom ‘International Communications Market Report 2010’, which states that household take-up of superfast broadband Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for in the UK at the end of 2009 was 0.2%; and Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (1) what level of the Commission for Rural Communities ‘Rural Advocate Report security vetting is required for the post of (a) head of 2010’, which states that only 1.5% of UK villages and hamlets communications, (b) deputy head of communications were able to receive cable-based broadband (as against 60% of and (c) head of press office in her Department; and if urban areas). she will list each person who has held these posts since I will place copies in the Libraries of the House. May 2010; [77885] 223W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 224W

(2) what level of security vetting is required for (a) E-mail grade six and seven, or equivalent, press officers and (b) ministerial private secretaries in her Department. Jack Dromey: To ask the Secretary of State for [77886] Environment, Food and Rural Affairs whether any (a) Ministers, (b) officials and (c) special advisers in her Richard Benyon: The circumstances in which a post Department use private e-mail accounts for the may require the holder to be the subject of national conduct of government business. [73213] security vetting checks are set out in the publicly available booklet ‘HMG Personnel Security Controls’, available Richard Benyon: The Ministerial Code, the Code of from the Cabinet Office website. Conduct for Special Advisers, and the Civil Service Code set out how Ministers, officials and special advisers It would not be appropriate to confirm which specific should conduct government business. posts or individuals within the Department are the subject of vetting, as this could highlight who has Fisheries access to sensitive material and be used for targeting purposes. Tim Farron: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what estimate Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for her Department has made of the number of illegal Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what level of cocklers working in (a) England, (b) the North West security vetting is required for (a) special advisers and and (c) Cumbria; and what steps she is taking to (b) ministerial-appointed policy advisers in her reserve permits for local fishermen. [77166] Department; and if she will list each person who has held these posts since May 2010. [77887] Richard Benyon: Inshore Fisheries and Conservation Authorities (IFCAs) are responsible for the management Richard Benyon: The circumstances in which a post of cockle fisheries in England. These fisheries are primarily may require the holder to be the subject of national managed through permit schemes. Permitting schemes security vetting checks are set out in the publicly available are district wide in application, and limit the number of booklet ‘HMG Personnel Security Controls’, available active fishermen and/or the quantities of cockles that from the Cabinet Office website. can be harvested. However, IFCAs do not restrict the It would not be appropriate to confirm which specific issue of permits to local fishermen. posts within the Department are the subject of vetting, In order to obtain a North West Inshore Fisheries as this could highlight who has access to sensitive and Conservation Authority (NWIFCA) permit, applicants material and be used for targeting purposes. must provide evidence of identity, evidence of address and a valid national insurance number. They must also The names of special advisers are included in the complete a one day training course on safe working in quarterly publication of the list of special advisers intertidal areas. Permits are restricted to experienced which is available in the Library of the House and can fishermen, although the byelaw provides for 40 new also be accessed on the Cabinet Office website. permits to be issued each year from a waiting list. There are no ministerial-appointed policy advisers in By its nature, illegal fishers cannot be accurately the Department. quantified. IFCAs use all available resources to enforce their individual permit schemes. The NWIFCA is Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for responsible for the management of the cockle fisheries Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what company in the North West and Cumbria. 440 permits were or Government service is used to undertake security issued for 2011-12 under NWIFCA Byelaw No.5. vetting at (a) counter terrorist check, (b) security check and (c) developed vetting level in her Fiona O’Donnell: To ask the Secretary of State for Department. [77888] Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (1) if she will assess the potential effects of the closure of the Richard Benyon: The Department uses Defence Business Western Waters scallops fishery on jobs related to the Services National Security Vetting and FCO Services— local scallop fishing industry; [77733] National Security Vetting to undertake security vetting (2) whether she had recent discussions with the at counter terrorist check, security check and developed Scallop Association on the closure of the Western vetting level. These are both Government services. Waters scallops fishery. [77734]

Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for Richard Benyon: The recent closure of the important Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how many Area VII scallop fishery to UK vessels over 15 metres in people were in possession of a security pass for her length has clearly created problems for the sector. We main Departmental headquarters, including multi-site are working with industry to avoid a situation where it headquarters and not including staff or contractors, in causes permanent damage to these businesses and the each month since May 2010. [77889] markets they have worked hard to develop over the years. To reopen the fishery this year the Marine Richard Benyon: Passes may be issued to those who Management Organisation (MMO) is seeking to source are required to make frequent visits to specific Government additional effort from other member states by agreeing sites, subject to security checks. Disaggregating the international swaps. number of security passes held other than by staff or Following a preliminary assessment of the likely impact contractors in each month since May 2010 would incur of the closure on the scallop fishing industry, the MMO disproportionate costs. decided to close the fishery in October as the industry’s 225W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 226W preference was for an early closure to allow the possibility DEFRA has allocated £3.2 million this year to fund of them being able to supply scallops to the lucrative our share of the marine finfish and shellfish data collection French Christmas market. element of the above national programme. Data collection DEFRA officials and the MMO have been in regular is carried out by the Centre for Environment, Fisheries contact with the Scallop Association and other parts of and Aquaculture Science (CEFAS). the industry throughout this process. These discussions DEFRA has also allocated funding of £2.9 million in began prior to the closure, firstly at the UK Scallop the current financial year for CEFAS to carry out Group in June, followed by a dedicated meeting in late additional finfish and shellfish data collection and analysis August and have been continuing on an almost daily work. basis as MMO sought to agree the best possible deal for CEFAS provides expertise to many of the working the wider UK fishing industry via international swaps. groups of the International Council for the Exploration of the Sea (ICES) to provide fish stock assessments. Fisheries: Quotas The UK also contributes an annual share, within an allocated budget of £0.2 million, for the work of ICES Ms Ritchie: To ask the Secretary of State for to provide analysis and advice that informs EU annual Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what progress proposals on fishing opportunities. In addition, the was made on increasing the quota allocation for fish Fisheries Science Partnership scheme, which carries out species at the meeting of the Agriculture and Fisheries fishery surveys and other one-off projects working in Council in Brussels on 21 October 2011; and if she will partnership with fishermen, has departmental funding this year for £0.95 million. This scheme provides data to make a statement. [77015] support ICES assessments. Richard Benyon: As UK Fisheries Minister I attended These budget allocation figures include an overall cut the Council meeting on 21 October. We had a useful of 5% this year, and continue to be subject to the exchange of views on the important EU-Norway Government’s ongoing comprehensive spending review negotiations and secured the Fisheries Commissioner’s process. agreement that fishing quotas should not be subject to Floods: Insurance an automatic cut for those stocks for which data is considered incomplete; instead, total allowable catches will be decided on a case-by-case basis. Though this Mary Creagh: To ask the Secretary of State for year’s negotiations will be challenging, the removal of Environment, Food and Rural Affairs when she expects the threat of a blanket cut for data-incomplete stocks is to announce plans to take forward the statement of a positive development. principles for flood insurance after it concludes in 2013. [79141]

Fisheries: Statistics Richard Benyon: We are working closely with the insurance industry to ensure that flood insurance remains Fiona O’Donnell: To ask the Secretary of State for widely available in England after the Statement of Principles Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how much expires in 2013, and will provide an update on this work funding her Department has allocated to the (a) before Christmas. collection and (b) analysis of data on UK fish stocks in each of the last five years; and how much such Food: Prices funding she plans to allocate in each of the next four years. [79147] Huw Irranca-Davies: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what Richard Benyon: The European Commission’s Data assessment she has made of the effect of fuel prices on Collection Framework (DCF) establishes a European food prices in (a) each of the last five years and (b) Community framework for the collection, management the next five years. [78099] and use of data in the fisheries sector and support for scientific advice regarding the common fisheries policy Mr Paice: There are a number of factors that affect (CFP). The UK overall national programme’s actual food prices in the shops, the largest driver being world and forecast figures under this framework are set out commodity prices, but with exchange rates and oil below. EU financial assistance for national programmes prices also having an impact. is provided to member states up to a level of 50%. Increases in global energy prices increase the cost of agricultural inputs, especially fertilisers, putting an upward £ pressure on commodity prices. Along the food supply chain, higher energy prices will impact retail food prices Actual by increasing the cost of transporting, processing and 2007 5,718,828 marketing. 2008 5,958,746 Recent research modelling undertaken by the 2009 6,266,058 university of Nottingham and the university of Exeter 2010 6,847,338 for DEFRA1 showed that the long term effect of a 10% shock to the world price of oil, translates into a Forecast 3.50% increase in retail food prices, other factors held 2011 8,139,028 constant. However, there will be interactions with other 2012 7,858,681 drivers of retail food prices, and the modelling shows 2013 8,889,999 that larger persistent shocks have a greater effect than smaller one-off shocks. 227W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 228W

DEFRA routinely monitors trends in the affordability Mr Philip Hammond [holding answer 18 October of food, looking at both domestic retail food price 2011]: There are no such emails. inflation (as measured by the consumer price index) and changes in the factors that drive domestic retail food Mr Kevan Jones: To ask the Secretary of State for price inflation. Defence on how many occasions he has had meetings 1 Retail Food Price Inflation Modelling Project—T. Lloyd et al, with Mr Adam Werritty in an official capacity when April 2011 civil servants were not present; and whether any other Metals individuals were present at such meetings. [75497]

Mr Andrew Smith: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr Philip Hammond [holding answer 18 October Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what research 2011]: I have not attended meetings at which Mr Werritty her Department has commissioned on reducing the was present. loss of phosphorus into watercourses and the sea; and if she will make a statement. [79056] Austin Mitchell: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence how many entry passes to his Department Richard Benyon: DEFRA funds research on the loss were issued to Adam Werritty since the end of April of phosphorus and other pollutants into watercourses 2010. [76713] and the sea through the following research programmes: Sustainable Water Management (Agriculture); and Mr Philip Hammond: I refer the hon. Member to the Water Availability and Quality. answer I gave on 19 October 2011, Official Report, The Environment Agency also funds research on column 986W, to the hon. Member for North Durham agricultural, urban other sources of phosphorus pollution. (Mr Jones). This research broadly covers: It is a matter of public record that Mr Werritty made Identifying sources of phosphorus and other pollutants, and 22 visits to the Ministry of Defence. These are listed in predicting pollution risk; the Annex to the Cabinet Secretary’s report into ‘Allegations Understanding the movement of phosphorus in the environment; against Rt Hon Dr Liam Fox MP’, which is freely Understanding environmental impacts; available on the Cabinet Office website at the following address: Understanding the interaction between phosphorus and other pollutants; and http://www.cabinetoffice.gov.uk/resource-library/allegations- Developing cost-effective approaches to mitigating agricultural against-rt-hon-dr-liam-fox-mp-report-cabinet-secretary and other sources of pollution. This answer corrects the answer provided by my DEFRA has recently established three Demonstration predecessor, my right hon. Friend the Member for Test Catchments to test approaches to the reduction of North Somerset (Dr Fox), on 15 September 2011, Official agricultural diffuse pollution and the improvement of Report, column 1281W, to the hon. Member for ecological status in freshwaters, while maintaining Bassetlaw (John Mann) in which the number of visits economically viable food production. wasgivenas14. Information and reports on the above mentioned projects can be found on the DEFRA and Environment Mr Kevan Jones: To ask the Secretary of State for Agency websites. Defence (1) pursuant to the answer of 18 October 2011, Official Report, columns 30-31W, on Adam Phosphate-Based Fertilizers Werritty, whether Lord Astor of Hever informed his Department of his meeting with Adam Werritty in Mr Andrew Smith: To ask the Secretary of State for Bahrain in December 2010; [77273] Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what steps her Department is taking with the agriculture sector with (2) pursuant to the answer of 18 October 2011, Official Report, columns 30-31W, on Adam Werritty, at the cost of phosphate-based fertilizers. [79055] what large social gatherings the Under-Secretary of Mr Paice: DEFRA provides guidance on accounting State for International Security met Mr Werritty; and for the phosphate content of manures, slurries and where each such event took place; [77275] other non-mineral fertiliser sources coming into farms, (3) how many meetings (a) officials in his and on reducing phosphate-based fertiliser inputs Department and (b) military personnel have attended accordingly, thereby increasing efficiency in the use of with representatives of IRG Ltd since May 2010; phosphorus on farm and reducing input costs. The [77177] Department is aware of the effects that fluctuating (4) which officials were present at the meeting prices of phosphate and other fertilisers can have on attended by the Minister for International Security farming businesses, but it is not the role of Government Strategy, Mr Adam Werritty and a representative of to intervene in the market price of fertilisers. IRG Ltd; how the meeting was arranged; and whether notes were taken of the issues discussed; [77178] (5) what the name is of the representative of IRG DEFENCE Ltd who was present at the meeting attended by the Adam Werritty Minister for International Security Strategy and Mr Adam Werritty; [77179] Bridget Phillipson: To ask the Secretary of State for (6) (a) when and (b) where the meeting attended by Defence if he will publish emails between Mr Adam Mr Adam Werritty, the Minister for International Werritty and special advisers in his Department Security Strategy and the representative from IRG Ltd pertaining to official business. [75412] took place. [77299] 229W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 230W

Mr Philip Hammond [holding answer 31 October Ammunition: Storage 2011]: I refer the hon. Member to the Cabinet Secretary (Sir Gus O’Donnell)’s report of 18 October 2011. Angus Robertson: To ask the Secretary of State for The Under-Secretary of State for Defence, my noble Defence what proportion of the total storage capacity Friend Lord Astor of Hever, has met Mr Steven Crouch, for UK munitions is at (a) Crombie, (b) Beith and (c) a director of IRG Ltd, socially on no more than five Glen Douglas. [78339] occasions over several years. The Minister for International Security Strategy, my hon. Friend the Member for Nick Harvey: The storage capacity for the Defence Aldershot (Mr Howarth), has had one meeting with Munitions sites at Crombie, Beith and Glen Douglas, Mr Crouch. Records of any other meetings between expressed as a proportion of the total storage capacity officials or military personnel with representatives of of the Ministry of Defence’s defence munitions sites is: IRG Ltd are not held centrally and could be provided only at disproportionate cost. Percentage Mr Howarth’s meeting with Mr Crouch, which is Crombie 2 referred to in the Cabinet Secretary’s report, was at the Beith 7 suggestion of my right hon. Friend the Member for Glen Douglas 11 North Somerset (Dr Fox) and took place on 27 September 2011 in the House of Commons. No officials were This calculation excludes munitions deployed on present and no note of the meeting was taken. No operations or stored in facilities locally awaiting transit substantive issues were raised, no confidential for training or onward movement to operations. information was disclosed, and there was no follow-up to the meeting. After the meeting had taken place Angus Robertson: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr Howarth informed his office in accordance with Defence what NATO funding his Department receives the Cabinet Secretary’s guidelines. The two social for the munitions facilities at (a) Crombie, (b) Beith events that both Mr Howarth and Mr Werritty and (c) Glen Douglas. [78340] attended took place in Wiltshire on 16 July and in London on 24 September 2011. Nick Harvey: The Ministry of Defence currently Lord Astor acknowledged Mr Werritty as they passed receives no funding from NATO for the munitions in a hotel reception area in Bahrain in December 2010. facilities at Crombie, Beith and Glen Douglas. It was not a meeting, either official or unofficial, and Lord Astor had no further contact with Mr Werritty Angus Robertson: To ask the Secretary of State for while in Bahrain. There was, therefore, no requirement Defence whether the UK is the sole user of the to inform the Ministry of Defence about the contact munition facilities at (a) Crombie, (b) Beith and (c) but the incident was referred to in the Cabinet Secretary’s Glen Douglas. [78341] report for completeness. Nick Harvey: The UK is the sole user of munitions facilities at Defence Munitions sites at Crombie, Beith Mr Kevan Jones: To ask the Secretary of State for and Glen Douglas. The jetty facilities at Crombie are Defence pursuant to the answer of 18 October 2011, available for use by visiting forces of NATO and other Official Report, columns 30-31W, on Adam Werritty, partner nations. whether Lord Astor of Hever informed his Department of his trusteeship of Atlantic Bridge upon Armed Forces his appointment as a Defence Minister. [77274] Bridget Phillipson: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr Philip Hammond: The Under-Secretary of State Defence how many service personnel have extended for Defence, my noble Friend Lord Astor of Hever, their terms of service since 7 May 2010. [78540] resigned as a trustee of Atlantic Bridge before taking up his positions within the Ministry of Defence. There was Mr Robathan: The information requested is not held therefore no requirement to discuss this upon his arrival. centrally in the format requested; however, data on the extension of service where it is available is as follows. 3,055 members of the RAF have extended their terms Aircraft Carriers of service since 7 May 2010. From 2010 to date, the naval service has offered Angus Robertson: To ask the Secretary of State for extensions of service to 333 personnel. Data on whether Defence whether the jetties at (a) Glen Mallen and (b) these offers were accepted is not held centrally. Crombie will be able to accept the Queen Elizabeth Data for the Army could be compiled only by examining Class aircraft carriers for berthing. [78342] personal records and could be provided only at disproportionate cost. Nick Harvey: While both jetties could potentially accept the Queen Elizabeth class aircraft carriers for Armed Forces: Germany berthing, further infrastructure work would need to be carried out in order to make them fully operational and Sir Menzies Campbell: To ask the Secretary of State suitable for berthing the carriers. for Defence when he expects to have an estimate of the It is planned that the QE class aircraft earners will be cost of the forthcoming return of British troops from base-ported in Portsmouth. Germany. [78042] 231W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 232W

Nick Harvey [holding answer 2 November 2011]: The Defence Equipment costs involved in bringing troops back from Germany will not be known until the outcome of detailed planning Mrs Moon: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence currently being undertaken is completed. There will pursuant to the answer to the hon. Member for however be savings in the region of £250 million a year Blaydon of 21 October 2011, Official Report, column on allowances, education and medical support that 1167W, on defence equipment, what his Department’s currently exists for the Germany garrisons, once the policy is on using special couriers to transport military move is completed. kit; and if he will make a statement. [77527] Nick Harvey: The policy for the prioritisation of Armed Forces: Redundancy demands to transport defence equipment is contained in Joint Service Publication 886 (The Defence Logistics Bridget Phillipson: To ask the Secretary of State for Support Chain Manual). The two highest priority demand Defence how many armed forces personnel were issued codes require the ’fastest possible means’ of delivery. with notifications of termination of contract in each This can be achieved by either Ministry of Defence month since May 2010. [78598] transport or contract freight services, including special courier, depending on the circumstance. Mr Robathan: Service personnel do not have a contract of employment and may leave the armed forces for a Defence: Finance wide variety of reasons. The number of personnel notified Mr Mike Hancock: To ask the Secretary of State for that they were included in tranche 1 of the armed forces Defence how much and what proportion of the defence redundancy scheme, in September 2011 is given in the budget was allocated to service pay in each of the last following table. three years. [79114] 1 redundancy—September 2011 Number Mr Robathan: The following table shows the amount spent by the Ministry of Defence on service pay for the Naval service 1,020 last three financial years, and the percentage of total Army 920 defence spending this equates to. RAF 920 Note: Percentage of total Figures have been rounded. Financial year Service pay (£ billion) defence spending

2008-09 8.937 23 Armed Forces: Suicide 2009-10 9.481 24 2010-11 9.888 25 Cathy Jamieson: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence what steps his Department is taking to The figure for service pay includes salaries, allowances, examine the underlying causes of recent trends in pensions and national insurance contributions. suicide rates among male army recruits aged 16 to 19 years; and what steps he is taking to address this. Departmental Computers [79214] Bridget Phillipson: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr Robathan [holding answer 7 November 2011]: Defence on how many occasions his Department was The risk of suicide among male Army personnel in the subject to cyber attacks since May 2010; and what form under 20 age group has been reducing over the last 15 or each such attack took. [78537] so years. Between 2006-10 the risk of suicide among Nick Harvey: Within the Ministry of Defence (MOD) male Army personnel in this age group was 9% lower there are technical, organisational, procedural and physical than the equivalent age group in the male UK population. measures in place to protect against and mitigate the The Army monitor all self-harm incidents, including impact of cyber attacks. In 2010, the MOD detected suicide, and has put in place a range of policies and and blocked more than 1,000 potentially serious attempts welfare support to try and prevent these occurring. to infiltrate or disrupt our computer systems, however These include the Army Suicide Vulnerability Risk we do not comment on the specific detail of cyber Management (SVRM) policy which is aimed at helping security incidents or threat assessments. the chain of command to identify those who may be vulnerable and, once identified, how to manage their Departmental Meetings care with the appropriate welfare and medical services. Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for All staff at recruiting and training establishments are Defence how many meetings he has had with trained to recognise and identify vulnerable trainees representatives of (a) social enterprises, (b) charities, who may be having problems. Commanding officers (c) large private sector businesses and (d) small and undertake risk assessments in accordance with the medium-sized private sector businesses since May supervisory care directive which takes account of 2010; and if he will make a statement. [75704] the particular factors of the environment, the age of the trainee population, and the type of training being Mr Philip Hammond: Details of Ministers’ meetings undertaken. Welfare support is available to recruits with external organisations are published on the Ministry 24 hours a day through unit welfare officers, padres and of Defence website at the following address: others such as the Women’s Royal Voluntary Service. http://www.mod.uk/DefenceInternet/AboutDefence/ They also have access to confidential helplines and free CorporatePublications/FinancialReports/Expenses/ counselling. MinistersHospitalityReceived.htm 233W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 234W

The information currently published covers May 2010 Libya: Armed Conflict to March 2011 and is being updated on a quarterly basis in accordance with the Government’s ongoing John Glen: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence transparency programme. what proportion of flying hours for Operation Ellamy were spent in transit to the operational area for (a) Departmental Private Finance Initiative Tornado and (b) Typhoon. [77704] Mr Philip Hammond [holding answer 1 November Stella Creasy: To ask the Secretary of State for 2011]: The vast majority of UK Tornado and Typhoon Defence if he will publish the (a) cost, (b) date of aircraft missions flown in support of Operation Ellamy commencement and (c) duration of each private were from Gioia Del Colle, Italy, which is in the UK finance initiative contract managed by his Department. joint operational area. In those cases all flying hours [76539] were within the operational area. Nick Harvey [holding answer 27 October 2011]: Some UK Tornado missions were flown from RAF Information on private finance initiative contracts that Marham in the UK. However, while the Ministry of were signed prior to 16 March 2011 is available on the Defence has details of the proportion of time spent in Treasury’s website at the following address: transit for these sorties, this information is not held centrally and could be provided only at disproportionate http://www.hm-treasury.gov.uk/ppp_pfi_stats.htm cost. In addition to listing the project name and responsible Department, the information available includes the capital John Glen: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence value of the asset and associated unitary charge payments, how many hours of air tanker support were required to the date the contract was signed, and the operational enable Tornado sorties flown from the UK as part of period of the contract. Operation Ellamy. [77705] This information is updated twice yearly. Mr Philip Hammond [holding answer 1 November Departmental Procurement 2011]: 170 hours of air tanker support using a combination of VC10 and Tristar aircraft were required to enable the small number of Tornado sorties flown from the UK as Alison Seabeck: To ask the Secretary of State for part of Operation Ellamy. Defence what contracts his Department has awarded for off the shelf systems where no customisation was Mr Jim Murphy: To ask the Secretary of State for required since May 2010. [78275] Defence how many (a) sorties and (b) combat sorties the Royal Air Force participated in as part of Nick Harvey: In the period from 1 May 2010 to Operation Ellamy. [78268] 31 October 2011, the Ministry of Defence let over 8,000 new contracts. The details of these contracts are not Nick Harvey [holding answer 3 November 2011]: held centrally and could be provided only at a From the start of Operation Ellamy until 27 October disproportionate cost. 2011, the Royal Air Force conducted approximately 2,990 sorties, of which 2,060 were combat sorties. The Iraq: Peacekeeping Operations Army and Royal Navy also conducted both combat and other air sorties during the operation.

Mrs Moon: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence Military Aircraft what assessment he has made of the effects of Operation Kipion on the UK’s international relations; Mrs Moon: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence and if he will make a statement. [77478] pursuant to the answer of 17 October 2011, Official Report, column 602W, on military aircraft, whether he Nick Harvey: Operation Kipion is the UK’s overarching has considered mothballing the Sentinel R1 following operation for Defence presence and contribution to its withdrawal from service; and if he will make a security in the middle and near east. It covers a wide statement. [78272] range, but not all, of our operational activity in the region, in support of the Secretary of State for Foreign Nick Harvey: As announced in the strategic defence and Commonwealth Affairs, the right hon. Member for and security review, our current plan is to withdraw the Richmond (Yorks) (Mr Hague’s), Gulf Initiative. Sentinel system from service when it is no longer required Through our high level engagements and through to support operations in Afghanistan. anecdotal reporting from our security co-operation activities Disposal plans for the Sentinel R1 remain immature, it is our strong belief that the activities, bounded within and no options have been ruled out. the operation have had a positive effect on the way in which the UK is perceived in the region. Continuing to RAF Leuchars enhance our defence links is a key part of our ongoing commitment to the region. Sir Menzies Campbell: To ask the Secretary of State We are now working more closely with our international for Defence pursuant to the answer of 19 October partners on maritime security operations including 2011, Official Report, column 993W, on RAF combating terrorism, piracy, and weapons proliferation. Leuchars, if he will place in the Library a copy of the We expect that the strength of these relations will sustainability appraisal undertaken in April 2011. continue to increase as the operation matures. [77315] 235W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 236W

Nick Harvey [holding answer 31 October 2011]: A Trident copy of the sustainability appraisal for RAF Leuchars will be placed in the Library of the House. Angus Robertson: To ask the Secretary of State for As part of the Basing review process further sustainability Defence which areas his Department has assessed as and other environmental studies will be undertaken. having the highest risk of cost overrun within the programme to replace Trident nuclear submarines. Sir Menzies Campbell: To ask the Secretary of State [77651] for Defence what his policy is on the future of the (a) 58 RAF Regiment, (b) 612 Regiment, (c) 71 Engineer Mr Philip Hammond: The project management of the Regiment, (d) HQ Dundee and Central Scotland Wing successor submarine programme includes the use of Air Training Corps, (e) East of Scotland University formal, best practice, recognised risk management Air Squadron, (f) Mountain Rescue Team, (g) No. 2 techniques. This is based upon a joint risk management RAF Police Wing and (h) 6 Force Protection Wing approach, which is being overseen by a joint Ministry of currently based at RAF Leuchars; and if he will make Defence (MOD)/industry integrated programme a statement. [78041] management team. Nick Harvey [holding answer 2 November 2011]: The aim of this approach is to ensure that risks and Plans for the transfer of RAF Leuchars to the Army are opportunities are identified and assessed, and that at an early stage. Therefore, at this point, I am unable to appropriate steps are taken to reduce risk to an acceptable provide more detailed information on the future location level. There are regular reviews to confirm risks are of those units currently based at RAF Leuchars. being managed effectively. Assurance that risk has been reduced to an acceptable RAF Menwith Hill level, and that individual risks have been reflected in the cost modelling, will be important elements of the main Fabian Hamilton: To ask the Secretary of State for gate approval process in 2016. These will be subject to Defence what information his Department holds on the independent scrutiny from within the MOD and from number of US personnel stationed at Menwith Hill. Her Majesty’s Treasury. [77621] I am withholding further details as their disclosure would prejudice commercial interests and impact on the Nick Harvey: There are 1,200 US personnel stationed formulation or development of Government policy. at RAF Menwith Hill. This figure is comprised of the following groups: US military: 450 US civilians: 400 HEALTH US contractors: 350. Adam Werritty Rescue Services: Helicopters Mr Kevan Jones: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr Donohoe: To ask the Secretary of State for Health whether (a) he, (b) officials of his Department Defence when he last held discussions with the and (c) special advisers in his Department have met Secretary of State for Transport on potential long-term Mr Adam Werritty on official business since May 2010; procurement options for search and rescue helicopters; and how many such meetings took place (i) on his and if he will make a statement. [77826] Department’s premises and (ii) elsewhere. [78851]

Mr Philip Hammond [holding answer 1 November Mr Simon Burns: Details of all ministerial meetings 2011]: Discussions between the Department for Transport with external parties are published quarterly in arrears and the Ministry of Defence are ongoing regarding a on the Department’s website. The latest data up to the range of potential options to meet future requirements end of March 2011 can be found at: for helicopter search and rescue in the UK. I understand www.dh.gov.uk/en/Aboutus/MinistersandDepartment Leaders/ that the Secretary of State for Transport, my right hon. Departmentdirectors/DH_110759 Friend the Member for Putney (Justine Greening), intends to make a statement on the matter before the end of the No special advisers have met with Adam Werrity. year. Information on whether officials have met with Adam Werrity could be provided only at disproportionate cost Submarines: Decommissioning but Ministers are aware of no such meetings.

Alison Seabeck: To ask the Secretary of State for Alcoholic Drinks: Misuse Defence with reference to his Department’s consultation on submarine dismantling, if he will Nick Smith: To ask the Secretary of State for Health estimate the cost of (a) towing a submarine, (b) what steps he is taking to reduce the number of people towing a barge with a submarine on it and (c) using a who exceed the Government’s guidelines for weekly heavy lift ship to transport a submarine between alcohol consumption. [78596] Rosyth and Devonport. [78246] Anne Milton: The Department will be bringing together Nick Harvey: The information requested on estimated the Government’s approach in an alcohol strategy to be costs relates to the development and formulation of published in the near future. The Change4life campaign Government policy, and its disclosure would be likely to will also be incorporating messages of the health risks prejudice commercial interests. from alcohol consumption early next year. 237W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 238W

Nick Smith: To ask the Secretary of State for Health Back Pain what estimate he has made of the number of people in each age group who exceed the Government’s Nic Dakin: To ask the Secretary of State for Health guidelines for weekly alcohol consumption. [78597] when he expects the National Institute for Health and Clinical Excellence to publish a quality standard on Mr Simon Burns: Current Government recommendations lower back pain. [76923] are that adult men should not regularly drink more than three to four units of alcohol a day and adult Paul Burstow: The National Institute for Health and women should not regularly drink more than two to Clinical Excellence (NICE) jointly with the National three units a day. Quality Board recently ran an engagement exercise on Information from surveys on the number of units the library of NICE Quality Standard NHS health care drunk on a typical day in the previous year along with topics. As part of this exercise a proposed library of frequency of consumption is used to calculate average topics was published for comment. Within this proposed weekly consumption. Table 2.4 of the ‘Statistics on library of topics ‘Low Back Pain’ was included. The Alcohol: England 2011’ provides information on the engagement exercise closed on 14 October 2011. NICE percentages of the population by gender and age group are currently analysing the responses received and will who exceed the weekly equivalent of the guidelines at 21 be able to provide more information in due course. units for men and 14 units for women. Further information on the engagement exercise can be found at: The ‘Statistics on Alcohol: England 2011’ report and tables have been placed in the Library. www.nice.org.uk/getinvolved/currentniceconsultations/ NQBEngagement.jsp Alcoholic Drinks: Prices Breast Cancer: Screening

Nick Smith: To ask the Secretary of State for Health Mr Andrew Smith: To ask the Secretary of State for whether his Department has sought legal advice on the Health what progress is being made on the provision of compatibility of the introduction of a minimum price digital mammography in NHS screening services. for alcohol with European law. [78595] [78687]

Anne Milton: The Home Office has lead responsibility Paul Burstow: Local national health service breast for alcohol pricing policy and has sought and received cancer screening programmes in England are replacing such legal advice on behalf of the Government. their current analogue (film) systems with digital systems (direct digital mammography—DDM). As at October 2011, 67 (83.7%) of the 80 local programmes had at Arthritis least one DDM X-ray set, and 33 (41%) were fully digital. Local programmes have been advised to implement Karen Lumley: To ask the Secretary of State for direct digital as quickly as possible as the independent Health what steps his Department has taken to support Advisory Committee on Breast Cancer Screening (has people with mobility problems caused by arthritis. said that running both film and digital systems together [78995] is inefficient. 13 programmes (16%) are still to implement digital mammography. Paul Burstow: Guidance from the National Institute for Health and Clinical Excellence outlines the. Care Carers: Employment which people with rheumatoid arthritis or osteoarthritis can expect to receive. This includes appropriate medication Karen Lumley: To ask the Secretary of State for to relieve symptoms and prevent further disease progression Health what financial support and practical assistance and access as needed to surgery, physiotherapy, occupational the Government provides to carers who are seeking therapy, clinical psychology, and support for self care. work following the death of the person being cared for. For people with mobility problems there have been a [77806] number of recent initiatives to help improve access to Maria Miller: I have been asked to reply. physiotherapy, occupational therapy and other allied health professional services, including pilots of self-referral; A person who was entitled to carer’s allowance projects to demonstrate the potential benefits from immediately before the death of the person cared for service redesign; and the development of systematic continues to be entitled to it for up to eight weeks collection of information on referral to treatment waiting afterwards. times. Depending on their personal circumstances, the ex-carer A new Community Equipment Services model makes may claim or continue to claim other benefits such as it easier for people to obtain simple items of equipment jobseeker’s allowance if they are actively seeking and or home adaptations. For those who need wheelchairs, available for work; employment and support allowance we have recently carried out a review led by two regional if they have a disability or incapacity which limits their pilot sites and a report is now being prepared to provide capability for work; or, in other circumstances, income advice for other areas wishing to improve their services. support. These benefits include a carer premium for Finally, our policies on Any Qualified Provider and on people who are entitled to carer’s allowance. personal health and social care budgets will in future Regardless of which benefit carers or ex-carers claim, enable people with continuing healthcare needs, including Jobcentre Plus provides personalised and flexible practical people with arthritis, greater control and choice over assistance for those seeking work, either directly or the services they receive. through Work Programme providers. 239W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 240W

The level of support offered by Jobcentre Plus; how (3) which Minister in his Department is responsible quickly a person is referred to the Work Programme; for determining whether exemptions to the Freedom of and whether engagement is voluntary or mandatory Information Act 2000 should apply to responses to depends on which benefit is being claimed. So for requests for information under the Act; and which example an ex-carer claiming jobseeker’s allowance could other Minister is responsible for making such volunteer to enter the Work Programme three months determinations should the subject matter of the request into their claim. fall within the Ministerial responsibilities of the Local Jobcentre Plus offices are empowered to decide Minister with lead responsibility. [78923] when and how to support customers, tailoring that support to their individual need, although support may Mr Simon Burns: The number of Freedom of be subject to mandatory participation depending on the Information (FOI) requests received and answered by benefit being claimed. Jobcentre Plus District Managers the Department in each month since May.2010 to and advisers have access to a comprehensive flexible September 2011 is contained in the following table: menu of options to enable them to make the cost effective choices and provide the right support to individuals. Number of FOI cases answered The support available directly through Jobcentre Plus Number of FOI cases on time (or within permitted may include: Month and year received extension) mandatory adviser interviews and jobsearch reviews May 2010 129 129 flexible interviews, the frequency and duration of which are June 2010 170 170 decided by a personal adviser July 2010 170 170 work preparation, including help with CV writing or interview August 2010 180 180 skills September 2010 170 170 referral to approved training October 2010 160 160 work trials, work experience, access to help if considering November 2010 199 199 self-employment and work clubs December 2010 166 166 access to funds to help with the costs of training and returning January 2011 240 240 to work February 2011 168 168 help to calculate whether the person would be better off in March 2011 208 208 work when considering a job, and April 2011 132 131 advice about in-work benefits and adviser support during the May 2011 125 125 early weeks in work. June 2011 153 153 When determining the level of support ex-carers July 2011 167 167 receive, they are treated as though they were still carers August 2011 151 151 for eight weeks following the end of their caring September 2011 154 154 responsibilities. Once a carer or ex-carer has started receiving this support, they can continue accessing it The further information requested about partial and until they start full time work or are mandated to full disclosure and timeliness is not routinely collected participate in the Work Programme. on a monthly basis and to provide this would incur Jobcentre Plus works in partnership in local communities disproportionate cost. with service providers, Local authorities, the NHS, voluntary However, this information is collected quarterly and and community sector and employers to find ways to is published by the Ministry of Justice at: support carers and ex-carers back to work. www.justice.gov.uk/publications/statistics-and-data/foi/ Departmental Freedom of Information implementation-editions.htm The number of responses to FOI requests received by Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for Health the Department using certain exemptions since January (1) how many requests under the Freedom of 2010 is contained in the following table: Information Act 2000 his Department has received in Reasons for withholding information under FOI from January 2010 - June 2011 each month since May 2010; how many responses given Number in each such month disclosed (a) the full information requested, (b) part of the information requested, with Commercial interests_(s43) 64 some information withheld under exemptions in the Information not held 773 Act and (c) none of the information requested; and in Cost limits (s12) 224 respect of how many requests received in each such Vexatious and repeat requests (s14) 9 month (i) (A) substantive and (B) holding responses were issued within 20 working days of the date of It is the responsibility of senior departmental officials receipt, (ii) no substantive response was issued within within relevant policy teams to determine whether 40 working days of the date of receipt and (iii) no exemptions under the FOI Act should apply to responses substantive response has yet been issued; [78921] to requests for information under the Act. (2) in respect of how many responses to requests for However, section 36 of the FOI Act sets out an information received by his Department under the exemption from a ‘right to know’ if the disclosure of Freedom of Information Act 2000 the reason of (a) information, in the reasonable opinion of a qualified commercially sensitive information, (b) information person, would prejudice the effective conduct of public not held, (c) information too costly to provide and (d) affairs. In England, the FOI Act defines a qualified vexatious or repeated requests has been given in person as any Minister of the Crown for information response since January 2010; [78922] that is held by a Government Department. 241W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 242W

In general, clearance for the use of section-36 is Paul Burstow: Clinical networks will support the sought from the Minister responsible for departmental NHS Commissioning Board and clinical commissioning management, my noble Friend the Parliamentary Under- groups to design pathways of care and shape services, Secretary of State Earl Howe. based on a wide-range of multi-disciplinary input. Proposals for the role of clinical networks will be developed after Departmental Lost Property the completion of a review of clinical networks which is currently engaging with a wide range of stakeholders to Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for Health assess how the functions and range of networks can pursuant to the answer of 27 October 2011, on lost most effectively support commissioners. computers and mobile telephones, how many losses or Annette Brooke: To ask the Secretary of State for thefts of (a) computers, (b) mobile telephones, (c) Health under his proposed reforms which part of the BlackBerrys and (d) other IT equipment there have NHS will be responsible for (a) designing care been since May 2010. [79367] pathways and (b) shaping local services for (i) disabled children and young people (A) with complex needs and Mr Simon Burns: The following table gives details of (B) requiring palliative care and (ii) other disabled departmental losses and thefts from May 2010 to 30 children and young people. [79618] September 2011. Departmental losses and thefts 1 May 2010 to 30 September 2011 Paul Burstow: We are determined to embed children’s Number health explicitly throughout the new system.

Computers 14 Clinical commissioning groups will be responsible for Mobile telephones 8 commissioning services for children and young people BlackBerries 55 with a disability or complex needs. They will work in Other IT equipment 19 partnership with the health and well-being boards that Total 96 will be a forum for local commissioners across the national health service, local government; elected NHS Connecting for Health (NHS CFH) is part of representatives, and representatives of HealthWatch to the Department’s Informatics Directorate. However, agree how to improve the health and well-being of the there are a number of fundamental differences between people in their area including children and young people. the Department and NHS CFH including suppliers and The NHS Commissioning Board (NHSCB) will have equipment used. It is therefore deemed appropriate to responsibility for the direct commissioning of a number display the figures for NHS CFH losses and thefts of services from April 2013. Included within those separately to the rest of the Department. services will be services for people with rare conditions which are currently commissioned at both a national NHS CFH losses and thefts 1 May 2010 to 30 September 2011 and regional level as described in the Specialised National Number Definitions Set. Computers 13 When commissioning children’s services, both the Mobile telephones (includes all 32 NHSCB and clinical commissioning groups will also mobile devices) seek advice from paediatricians, nurses and other clinical BlackBerries 0 professionals with expertise across a range of areas. Other IT equipment 9 Total 54 There will be senior clinical leadership for children’s services within the NHS Commissioning Board, providing advice and support to commissioners. Departmental Official Engagements Annette Brooke: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr Spellar: To ask the Secretary of State for Health Health what function the NHS Commissioning Board if he will place in the Library the ministerial diary of will have in respect of national delivery of health the Minister of State for Social Care for October to services for (a) disabled children and young people (i) December 2010. [78767] with complex needs and (ii) requiring palliative care and (b) other disabled children and young people. Paul Burstow: Details of all ministerial meetings with [79619] external parties are published quarterly in arrears on the Department’s website. The latest data up to the end Paul Burstow: Subject to the passage of the Health of March 2011 can be found at: and Social Care Bill, the NHS Commissioning Board www.dh.gov.uk/en/Aboutus/ will have a duty to conduct a performance assessment MinistersandDepartmentLeaders/Departmentdirectors/ of each clinical commissioning group in respect of each DH_110759 financial year. When conducting a performance assessment, the board Disability: Young People has a duty to consult each relevant health and well-being board as to its views on the clinical commissioning Annette Brooke: To ask the Secretary of State for group’s contribution to the delivery of any joint health Health if he will create a clinical network for children and well-being strategy. Health and well-being boards with defined responsibility for developing care will include a director of children’s services. pathways for (a) disabled children and young people The board will have a duty to have regard to jointly (i) with complex needs and (ii) requiring palliative care prepared local joint strategic needs assessment (JSNAs) and (b) other disabled children and young people. and the joint health and well-being strategy (JHWSs) in [79617] its own direct commissioning. 243W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 244W

The board will have responsibility for the direct Grahame M. Morris: To ask the Secretary of State commissioning of a number of services from April for Health what assessment he has made of the ability 2013, including those services for people with rare of public health policy to reduce healthcare costs for conditions, which are currently commissioned at both a the NHS; and if he will make a statement. [78583] national and regional level as described in the Specialised National Definitions set. Anne Milton: The ongoing public health reforms are There will be senior clinical leadership for children’s part of a long term strategy designed to produce substantial health services within the NHS Commissioning board savings for the national health service in the future. providing advice and support to commissioners. We provided some figures to demonstrate the potential Fats: Health Hazards savings that would arise from the reforms in “Healthy Lives, Healthy People: Our strategy for public health in Dr Huppert: To ask the Secretary of State for Health England”. We stated that: what assessment his Department has made of the ″Changing adult behaviours could also reduce premature death, quantity of trans fats consumed in the UK; and what illness and costs to society, avoiding a substantial proportion of steps the Government is taking to reduce such cancers, vascular dementias and over 30% of circulatory diseases; consumption. [78993] saving the NHS the £2.7 billion cost of alcohol abuse; and saving society the £13.9 billion a year spent on tackling drug-fuelled Anne Milton: The Department monitors the presence crime.″ of trans fats in the United Kingdom diet through a A copy of the White Paper has previously been rolling programme, the National Diet and Nutrition placed in the Library. Survey (NDNS). Estimated mean intakes of trans fat Through investing in public health and spending for all age groups from 2008-09 to 2009-10 of the effectively on prevention, we aim to release efficiency NDNS were 0.7-0.9% of food energy (calorie intake), savings which can then be used elsewhere in the NHS. well within public health recommendation of no more than 2% of food energy. As part of the Public Health Responsibility Deal, the Health Professions Department is working in partnership with UK food businesses to remove artificial trans fatty acids (TFA), Nic Dakin: To ask the Secretary of State for Health from the few foods that still contain them. what arrangements he plans to put in place to ensure Businesses are pledging to remove artificial TFA that all statutorily regulated health professionals, from products by the end of 2011. They will achieve this including osteopaths, will be able to input into the by removing partially hydrogenated vegetable oils and design of relevant patient pathways. [76922] limiting the levels of artificial TFA in oils and fats used as ingredients or in preparing foods (eg frying oils) to a Mr Simon Burns: The Government want the full maximum of 2%. range of health and care professionals to be involved in This voluntary action will help to ensure that intakes the new commissioning arrangements, supporting the of trans fats remain low, and give consumers confidence NHS Commissioning Board and clinical commissioning that artificial trans fats will not be added to foods in the groups to design pathways of care and shape services. future. Both the board and clinical commissioning groups will General Practitioners: Finance have a statutory duty to secure professional advice from persons who taken together have a range of professional Mr Whittingdale: To ask the Secretary of State for expertise. Health what the average total payment per GP made to Subject to the passage of the Health and Social Care general practices in England was in the last year for Bill, the NHS Commissioning Board will be responsible which figures are available. [79240] for issuing guidance to commissioning groups on their duty to obtain appropriate professional advice. Mr Simon Burns: The total payment per general practitioner made to all general practices in England in Health Protection Agency 2010-11 is £237,738, based on the four combined contracting routes for: general medical services, personal medical services, alternative provider medical services and primary Grahame M. Morris: To ask the Secretary of State care trust medical services. for Health what assessment he has made of the quality Health of accountability through the regional structures of the Health Protection Agency; and if he will make a Grahame M. Morris: To ask the Secretary of State statement. [78581] for Health what consideration he has given to placing a statutory duty on local authorities to reduce health Anne Milton: The quality of accountability in the inequalities. [78580] regional structures of the Health Protection Agency (HPA) is assessed as part of the formal governance Mr Simon Burns: Local authorities are independent structures set out in the HPA management statement. democratic bodies. Nationally, we will be able to promote This process includes the Department undertaking regular a focus on tackling health inequalities through such accountability reviews of the HPA through quarterly non-legislative means as the Public Health Outcomes performance reports and an annual accountability review. Framework. We believe such non-legislative approaches Each region contributes to this process by reporting on are at least as effective as a legal duty on local authorities progress against objectives set out in the agreed HPA in the Health and Social Care Bill. business plan. 245W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 246W

Hepatitis Hospital Beds

Jim Fitzpatrick: To ask the Secretary of State for Liz Kendall: To ask the Secretary of State for Health Health what analysis his Department has undertaken (1) how many (a) acute and (b) non-acute patients on any relationship between hepatitis C infection and aged 18 years and over were occupying a hospital bed health and social inequalities. [78542] but eligible for discharge by NHS commissioner area in each quarter in (i) 2009-10, (ii) 2010-11 and (iii) 2011 to Anne Milton: Evidence indicates that hepatitis C in date; [78574] this country affects populations who may experience (2) how (a) acute and (b) non-acute patients aged inequalities, with people who inject drugs at greatest 18 years and over were occupying a hospital bed but risk of acquiring infection. Studies also suggest that eligible for discharge by local authority area in each there may be a relatively high prevalence of hepatitis C month in (i) 2009-10, (ii) 2010-11 and (iii) 2011 to date. and associated liver disease in certain minority ethnic [78575] populations. Paul Burstow: The Department does not collect data In response to this evidence, improvements in national in each quarter or month but we have a snapshot figure surveillance have been made to monitor HCV infection that represents an average of the number of patients and diagnostic testing in the general population as well delayed per day during that period. This information as in particular risk groups, including people who inject has been placed in the Library. drugs, offenders, minority ethnic populations and men who have sex with men. The findings of this surveillance Hospitals: Eggs are reported annually in the Health Protection Agency’s “Hepatitis C in the UK” report. Mr Spellar: To ask the Secretary of State for Health The Heath Protection Agency’s annual reports on whether he has issued guidelines to hospitals on their hepatitis C provide further details of hepatitis C in buying criteria to ensure eggs produced in conventional population risk groups, a copy of the most recent report cages should not be used in any form. [78569] “Hepatitis C in the UK, 2011” has been placed in the Library. Mr Simon Burns: We encourage national health service organisations to adopt the Government Buying Standards HIV Infection (GBS) for food, where possible, through the NHS operating framework for 2011-12 published in December 2010. Rushanara Ali: To ask the Secretary of State for Mandatory GBS criteria currently bans the use of fresh Health what assessment he has made of the adequacy (in-shell) eggs from conventional cage systems. If a cage of the current level of Government funding for HIV system is used it should be enriched cages. In light of the forthcoming European Union ban on conventional education and prevention in England. [78715] cages, we intend to extend this mandatory criteria to Mr Simon Burns: This year, the Department has cover all liquid and powdered egg products, which are invested £2.9 million in a national programme of HIV currently in voluntary best practice criteria. prevention for men who have sex with men and African This Government believe that their role is to set a communities, the groups most at risk of HIV in the credible and workable example for the wider public United Kingdom. Prevention will be a key part of the sector to follow, and it is this that the GBS is designed Government’s new Sexual Health Policy Framework. to deliver. All public bodies have a different set of requirements and the local people most closely connected The Department is currently considering how national with them, staff, patients, governors, will have different HIV prevention programmes might be taken forward priorities, making them best placed to decide how to from 2012-13 when the current programmes end. At a achieve the objectives we are aiming for. local level, it is for local primary care trusts, and from 2013 local authorities, to decide their level of investment Hospitals: Waiting Lists in HIV prevention, taking into account HIV prevalence and their wider public health needs. Liz Kendall: To ask the Secretary of State for Health how many urgent NHS operations were cancelled in HIV Infection: Greater London each month of (a) 2009-10, (b) 2010-11 and (c) 2011 to date. [78573] Rushanara Ali: To ask the Secretary of State for Health what steps he is taking to reduce the number of Mr Simon Burns: The number of urgent cancellations cases of HIV in London. [78716] in each month requested is shown in the following table: Urgent cancellations Mr Simon Burns: Targeted HIV prevention programmes Month Number for those groups at increased risk of HIV continue to play an important role in reducing the number of cases 2009-10 April 166 of HIV both in London and on a national level. The May 195 Department continues to fund the Terence Higgins June 173 Trust and the African Health Policy Network for prevention July 234 work both in London and nationally. August 144 At a local level, it is for local primary care trusts, and September 115 from 2013 local authorities, to decide their level of investment in HIV prevention, taking into account HIV October 239 prevalence and their wider public health needs. November 283 247W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 248W

Urgent cancellations Paul Burstow: The Department does not collect Month Number information on estimates of the total number of adults December 215 with learning disabilities. However, the Institute of Health Research at Lancaster University estimated that in 2004 January 309 there were 800,000 adults (aged 20+) with learning, February 264 disabilities, which they modelled would increase to 870,000 March 197 in 2011. The number of adults with learning disabilities receiving 2010-11 April 204 social care services as of 31 March 2010 was 102,500. May 178 This figure consists of 95,500 people aged 18 to 64 and June 165 7,000 aged 65+. July 240 In recognition of the pressures on the social care system in a challenging local government settlement, August 172 the spending review allocated an additional £7.2 billion September 185 over four years to 2014-15 to support the delivery of October 173 social care. November 211 It is up to local authorities to choose how best to use December 322 their available funding. However, we think that the January 222 extra investment we have set out, combined with a rigorous focus on efficiency, will mean that there is February 248 funding available to protect people’s access to care March 237 during the spending review period, including those with learning disabilities. 2011-12 April 219 May 205 Lighting: Health Hazards June 271 Joan Walley: To ask the Secretary of State for Health July 203 what (a) assessment he has made of and (b) August 254 representations he has received on the recent Scientific September 310 Committee on Emerging and Newly Identified Health Note: Risks review of the ability of EU member states to Prior to August 2010, these figures were collected weekly, and therefore the manufacture incandescent bulbs available where there monthly figures shown are an aggregate of either four or five weeks as opposed to a calendar month. are medical grounds; and if he will make a statement. Source: [R] [79447] Weekly and monthly sitreps. Anne Milton: The European Commission’s Scientific Learning Disability Committee on Emerging and Newly Identified Health Risks (SCENIHR) released a preliminary Opinion on Bob Russell: To ask the Secretary of State for Health the health effects of artificial light on 18 July 2011. what estimate he has made of the number of people SCENIHR have carried out a public consultation and with a learning disability in England who are being scientific hearing on this opinion and we understand supported (a) exclusively or (b) predominantly that SCENIHR will publish a final opinion before the through a health budget; and if he will make a end of 2011. statement. [79207] The Government have asked the European Commission to take the SCENIHR review and recommendations Paul Burstow: Personal health budgets are currently into account. being piloted across England. Over 2,700 people have The Department is continuing to work with patient been recruited into an independent evaluation programme. groups, clinicians and the lighting industry to keep the Around half of them will have personal health budgets; health issues under review. the remainder are in a control group. The evaluation does not include a specific cohort of people with learning Medical Treatments: VAT disabilities. So, although it is likely that many people with learning disabilities are involved in the pilot, we do Rosie Cooper: To ask the Secretary of State for not yet know how many, or to what extent their needs Health what recent representations he has received on are being supported through a personal health budget. the inability of NHS trusts to recover VAT on medical However, the evaluation team will gather information treatments compared to the ability of dispensing and report on the conditions that people have, including pharmacists to do so; and what representations he has learning disabilities. The final evaluation report is due received from patients and pharmacists on collection of in October 2012. prescriptions from their local pharmacists which are taken into hospital to be administered. [78831] Bob Russell: To ask the Secretary of State for Health what recent estimate he has made of the number of Mr Simon Burns: Value-added tax (VAT) is a matter adults with a learning disability in England; what steps for Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs (HMRC). he is taking to ensure there is sufficient funding for Since 1 May 2010, the Department has received fewer people who need care and support due to learning than 10 written representations on the inability of national disability; and if he will make a statement. [79209] health service trusts to recover VAT on medical treatments 249W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 250W compared to the ability of dispensing pharmacists to do both the ‘Healthy Lives, Healthy People’ White Paper so; and fewer than five written representations from and the Public Health Responsibility Deal. patients and pharmacists on the collection of prescribed medicines from their local pharmacies which are then NHS: Pensions taken into hospital to be administered. Musculoskeletal Disorders Rachel Reeves: To ask the Secretary of State for Health what the participation rate was for the NHS Nic Dakin: To ask the Secretary of State for Health pension schemes in each pay band in each year from what assessment his Department has made of the role 2006 to 2010. [79528] of osteopathy in reducing workplace sickness absence due to musculoskeletal disorders. [76921] Mr Simon Burns: The information requested is not held centrally. Anne Milton: The Department has not made an However, using data from the NHS Electronic Staff assessment of the specific effects of complementary Record (ESR) Data Warehouse it is possible to estimate medicines, such as osteopathy, in reducing workplace pension membership rates for Hospital and Community sickness absence. However, improving health in the Health Services (HCHS) staff for the end of the period workplace is a key part of public health policy through of interest:

Estimated pension membership rate (headcount) September 2009 (%) September 2010 (%)

Non-Medical AfC Band 1 64 64 AfC Band 2 78 77 AfC Band 3 82 82 AfC Band 4 86 85 AfC Band 5 87 87 AfC Band 6 91 91 AfC Band 7 95 94 AfC Band 8a 96 96 AfC Band 8b 97 96 AfC Band 8c 97 97 AfC Band 8d 98 98 AfC Band 9 98 97 Other 97 96

Medical Consultants 97 96 Training Grades 95 95 Other Medical 90 90

All HCHS 87 87 Notes: 1. The ESR Data Warehouse contains monthly snapshots of the live ESR system, which is a payroll and human resources system containing staff records for national health service employed staff in England. It contains records on all NHS staff except for those in the following groups: general practitioners (GPs), GP practice staff and other primary care providers e.g. dentists; two foundation trusts (Moorfields Eye Hospital NHS Foundation Trust and Chesterfield Royal Hospital NHS Foundation Trust); and those staff groups affected by Transforming Community Services where the service is now provided by a non-NHS organisation. 2. Pension membership rates are estimated by considering the proportion of ESR’s, across staff groups, with recorded employer pension contributions. Aggregate estimates are then produced using published NHS Information Centre work force census data collected annually each September. Data cleaning processes are also applied to the ESR extracts before use. 3. For non-medical staff, estimates are generated by Agenda for Change (AfC) pay band. Medical staff are not employed on AfC terms so estimates are provideo1 by broad staff groups.

NHS: Private Sector result of his proposals in the Health and Social Care Bill. [78949] Derek Twigg: To ask the Secretary of State for Health (1) what recent assessment he has made of the Mr Simon Burns: The Government’s assessment to effect on the number of NHS patients who will seek date of the proposal to remove the private patient private treatment of the proposals contained in the income cap for foundation trusts is contained in the Health and Social Care Bill; [79223] Government’s Command Paper, “Liberating the NHS: (2) what recent estimate he has made of the number Legislative framework and next steps”, and the Impact of non-European Economic Area overseas private Assessments so far published for the Health and Social patients that would be treated in NHS hospitals as a Care Bill 2011. 251W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 252W

Older People: Carers 2011-12 total revenue allocations per head1 £

Andrea Leadsom: To ask the Secretary of State for Berkshire East PCT 1,451 Health how much funding he allocated to social care Kingston PCT 1,458 for the elderly in the latest period for which figures are available. [79412] England average 1,693 1 In December 2010 PCTs were informed of their total 2011-12 revenue Paul Burstow: Allocating funding for adult social allocations which include: care is the responsibility of local authorities, who receive 2011-12 recurrent revenue allocations; non-recurrent allocations for primary dental services, pharmaceutical services funding from central Government through the local and general ophthalmic services; and government formula grant and raise money locally through support for joint working between health and social care. council tax. These allocations were announced separately in 2010-11. The latest local authority budget data for 2011-12 show that local authorities have budgeted £7.0 billion Public Health England towards social care for those over 65. We also estimate that around £300 million has been transferred to local authorities for older people’s services from primary Grahame M. Morris: To ask the Secretary of State care trusts this year, as part of the additional support for Health what plans he has to ensure Public Health for social care provided through the health system. England is operationally independent of Government. Budgeted expenditure for older people will therefore be [78584] around £7.3 billion this year. Anne Milton: Public Health England will be established Primary Care Trusts: Per Capita Costs as an Executive Agency of the Department of Health on 1 April 2013, and will work in an open and transparent way. It will be managed by a chief executive who will be Mr Whittingdale: To ask the Secretary of State for solely responsible for the day-to-day operation of the Health (1) how much Mid Essex Primary Care Trust agency. Public Health England will receive its own received per capita in the latest period for which figures budget to deliver its services. It will have scientific are available; [79233] committees that will provide rigorous and impartial (2) what the average level of per capita funding for advice on public health issues. This operational freedom primary care trusts in England was in the latest period will be supported by a framework agreement between for which figures are available; [79234] the Department and Public Health England which will (3) which 10 primary care trusts received the (a) set out the roles and responsibilities of both organisations. highest and (b) lowest level of per capita funding in the latest period for which figures are available. [79235] Skin Cancer

Mr Simon Burns: Mid Essex Primary Care Trust Sir Paul Beresford: To ask the Secretary of State for (PCT) received funding of £1,399 per capita in the Health (1) how many single technology appraisals have 2011-12 PCT revenue allocations compared to the national been published by the National Institute for Health average of £1,693. and Clinical Excellence for (a) malignant melanoma The 10 PCTs with the highest and lowest per capita and (b) each other cancer disease area since 1 March funding for 2011-12 are shown in the following table. 2010; [79464] 2011-12 total revenue allocations per head1 (2) how many treatments for people with advanced £ melanoma have been recommended by the National Institute for Health and Clinical Excellence since Highest 1 March 2010. [79465] Islington PCT 2,350 Newham PCT 2,320 Paul Burstow: The National Institute for Health and City and Hackney Teaching PCT 2,275 Clinical Excellence (NICE) has not published any final Knowsley PCX 2,246 technology appraisal guidance on treatments for malignant Liverpool PCT 2,200 melanoma or advanced malignant melanoma. NICE is Hammersmith and Fulham PCT 2,180 undertaking three appraisals of drugs for the treatment Blackpool PCT 2,128 of this condition. Tower Hamlets PCT 2,116 Brent Teaching PCT 2,101 Since 1 March 2010, NICE has published 21 single Lambeth PCT 2,074 technology appraisals on treatments for cancer. This includes three appraisals that were terminated because NICE did not receive an evidence submission from the Lowest manufacturer or sponsor of the technology. Berkshire West PCT 1,367 South Gloucestershire. PCT 1,370 Social Services: Fees and Charges Mid Essex PCT 1,399 Leicestershire County and Rutland PCT 1,403 Buckinghamshire PCT 1,407 Rushanara Ali: To ask the Secretary of State for Bedfordshire PCT 1,431 Health if he will publish the evidential basis used by his Oxfordshire PCT 1,439 Department to set £23,250 as the proposed means- Cambridgeshire PCT 1,446 tested threshold for social care costs. [78717] 253W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 254W

Paul Burstow: With effect from 1 April 1993, the Any specific decisions in relation to St Helens and National Assistance (Assessment of Resources) Regulations Knowsley Teaching Hospitals NHS Trust will be 1992 set the upper capital limit at £16,000. This was determined following the finalisation of the analysis based on the figure used in the financial assessment for and this framework. income support. Due to the passage of time, it is not possible to establish the reasons that the level set was felt to be appropriate at the time. Contemporary papers JUSTICE and reports are not available. Since 1993, the upper capital limit, for residential Young Offenders: Drugs and Alcohol charging, has been periodically uprated. The last uprating, to £23,250, was in 2010. 18. Mrs Moon: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice what estimate he has made of the number of Speech and Language Disorders: Health Services people entering young offender institutions who have drug and alcohol problems. [78971]

Mr Nicholas Brown: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr Blunt: No estimate has been made because this Health (1) how many people were (a) wholly and (b) information is not collected centrally. From April 2012, partially state funded for speech and language therapy the National Drug Treatment Monitoring System in 2010; and what estimate he has made of funding that (NDTMS) is being introduced into prisons and young will be provided by his Department in each such offenders institutions in England. NDTMS will allow category in the remainder of the Comprehensive for accurate data to be collected from substance misuse Spending Review; [79187] services. (2) which primary care trusts have announced Prison Work funding reductions for speech and language therapy during the Comprehensive Spending Review period; 20. Richard Harrington: To ask the Secretary of State and what the level was of each such funding reduction; for Justice what plans he has to promote work in [79188] prisons. [78973] (3) what the total cost to the public was of funding speech and language therapy in 2010; and what he Mr Blunt: We have made clear our intention to make estimates the cost will be in each year of the prisons places of work and industry. We are already Comprehensive Spending Review. [79189] making good progress towards longer prisoner working weeks at a number of prisons. We have also set up a Business Advisory Group to both advise and promote Anne Milton: The information requested is not collected the outcomes we are seeking. centrally. Funding for speech and language therapy is provided within the national health service budget and These plans will require new businesses in prisons to decided by local NHS organisations. This process provides cover their costs and the enhanced costs of undertaking the means for addressing local needs within the health work in prisons as well as providing a return for victims community, including the provision of speech and language of crime and a contribution towards the rehabilitation therapy. of the prisoners engaged in this new commercially positive work. St Helens and Whiston NHS Hospital Trust Anti-corruption

21. Hugh Bayley: To ask the Secretary of State for Derek Twigg: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice when he last met the Secretary of State for Health when he plans to make his decision on the Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport to discuss funding gap at St Helens and Whiston NHS Hospital corruption in sport as part of his role as the UK’s Trust. [78950] international anti-corruption champion. [78974] Mr Simon Burns: The Department is currently examining Mr Kenneth Clarke: I have regular discussions with the private finance initiative issue in a small number of ministerial colleagues as part of my international anti- trusts where it cannot be resolved locally. As part of the corruption champion role, although I have not met the potential provision of financial support to specific national Secretary of State for Culture, Olympics, Media and health service trusts going forward to support them Sport, the right hon. Member for South West Surrey achieve foundation trust status, this is being considered. (Mr Hunt), to discuss this particular matter. The UK is The framework and process have not been finalised. supporting the EU’s efforts to reduce corruption in However, in relation to any support, which might be sport and I am monitoring the progress of this work. provided to trusts, the Department has outlined four key tests that they would have to meet: Personal Injury Law the problems they face must be exceptional and beyond those 22. John Howell: To ask the Secretary of State for faced by other organisations; Justice what steps he is taking to reform the use of they must show that the problems are historic and that they referral fees by personal injury lawyers. [78975] have a clear plan to manage their resources in the future; they must show that they are delivering high levels of annual Mr Djanogly: In my written ministerial statement of productivity savings; and 9 September 2011, Official Report, column 32WS, I they must deliver clinically viable, high quality services, including informed the House of the Government’s decision to low waiting times and other performance measures. ban the payment and receipt of referral fees in personal 255W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 256W injury cases. This ban is being taken forward through Mr Blunt: The latest available published data, as of provisions in the Legal Aid, Sentencing and Punishment 12 October 2011, on offenders found guilty at all courts of Offenders Bill. for offences relating to the public disorder between 6 and 9 August 2011, show that 185 offenders (27%) Conditional Fee Arrangements were aged between 10 and 17 years. In order to allow timely reporting of statistics on Chris Bryant: To ask the Secretary of State for offenders proceeded against at the magistrates courts Justice what estimate he has made of the number of for offences resulting from the 6-9 August public disorder, people who used conditional fee agreements in (a) a dataset has been compiled from manual returns from privacy and (b) libel cases in 2010. [78958] the courts. The available information does not include whether a parent of an offender found guilty of an Mr Djanogly: I understand that 158 defamation offence related to the public disorder was subject to a proceedings were commenced in the Queen’s Bench parenting order. Division in 2010, although we do not have data on how these cases were funded. Data provided to Lord Justice Jackson suggested that only 17.5% of a similar number Civil Proceedings: Legal Costs of such cases in 2008 were funded by way of conditional fee agreement. Mr Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice what steps he is taking to reduce the level of civil Census: Guernsey litigation. [78967]

Malcolm Wicks: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr Djanogly: The Government are implementing Justice (1) what discussions his Department and the fundamental reform of civil litigation funding and costs. Bailiwick of Guernsey had on the decision not to We are also banning referral fees in personal injury organise a census of population in Guernsey in 2011; cases. The Government believe that together these changes [78707] will deter unnecessary and avoidable claims from progressing (2) for what reason the Bailiwick of Guernsey has to court. not organised a census in 2011. [78708] Coroners Mr Kenneth Clarke: My Department has not had any discussions with the States of Guernsey on their decision Jonathan Ashworth: To ask the Secretary of State for not to hold a census of Guernsey’s population in 2011. Justice what discussions he has had with faith groups As an internally self-governing dependency of the on his proposals for the future of the Office of Chief Crown, this is entirely a matter for the island authorities. Coroner. [78965] However, I can inform the right hon. Member that the States of Guernsey has migrated to an electronic collation Mr Djanogly: I have not had any formal discussions of social and economic data traditionally compiled by with faith groups on this matter, however the Ministry paper census. It was considered that the merits of moving of Justice has just consulted on the proposals for the to such a system were compelling, following examples future of the office of the chief coroner as part of a set by countries such as Finland. wider consultation on the Public Bodies Bill reforms Alderney is working with Guernsey towards adopting and received responses from faith groups. Faith groups a similar system and Sark compiles its own population were also consulted on the new charter for the coroner figures. service, and we have corresponded with leaders of faith groups on specific coroner issues such as less invasive Charities post-mortem examinations.

Dr Whiteford: To ask the Secretary of State for Departmental Assets Justice what grants his Department made to charitable organisations in each of the last five years. [79079] Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice what assets with a value of £250,000 or more his Mr Djanogly: The Ministry of Justice funds a large Department has bought since May 2010; for what number of groups, including registered charities, voluntary purpose; and if he will make a statement. [77365] and community groups. It would incur disproportionate costs to research each organisation, check its charitable Mr Kenneth Clarke: Since May 2010, the Department status and disclose what grants were given. has bought the following assets with a value of £250,000 Grants are given to organisations that provide a wide or more: range of services, such as the provision of support for victims of crime, mediation services, work to reduce Name of the asset Value (£ million) Purpose crime and debt advice. Secure email—IDS 0.3 Email upgrade Civil Disorder Secure email 0.4 Email upgrade —LDAP Mr Hollobone: To ask the Secretary of State for Law courts 1.4 Site for the new Justice how many and what proportion of people Aberystwyth law convicted following the public disorder of August 2011 courts ISIS prison 136.6 Provision of new were children; and what proportion had parents subject prison capacity to parenting orders. [79296] 257W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 258W

Departmental Freedom of Information Quarter Withheld

April-June 2010 267 Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice July-September 2010 309 how many requests under the Freedom of Information October-December 2010 247 Act 2000 his Department has received in each month January-March 2011 339 since May 2010; how many responses given in each April-June 2011 315 such month disclosed (a) the full information requested, (b) part of the information requested, with some information withheld under exemptions in the The following number of substantive responses have Act and (c) none of the information requested; and in been issued by the Ministry of Justice since April 2010. respect of how many requests received in each such In this case, ’substantive’ should be understood as any month (i) (A) substantive and (B) holding responses answer that is not a holding response. The figures were issued within 20 working days of the date of therefore include answers where the Ministry of Justice receipt, (ii) no substantive response was issued within has: confirmed it does not hold the information; explained 40 working days of the date of receipt and (iii) no that providing the information would exceed the cost limit provided for in the Act; declined to answer under substantive response has yet been issued. [78912] section 14 of the Act (vexatious or repeated requests); provided all the information requested; and provided Mr Djanogly: To answer this question in full, a manual some of the information requested. search of every request received and answered by the Ministry of Justice since May 2010 would be required, Quarter Substantive response as we do not have the means to extract the information April-June 2010 818 electronically. This would incur disproportionate cost. July-September 2010 887 Relevant information readily available is, however, October-December 2010 822 provided as follows. The Ministry of Justice publishes January-March 2011 948 on its website quarterly and annual statistics on freedom April-June 2011 901 of information requests received by over 40 central Government bodies, and it is from these publications The Ministry of Justice has issued a ’holding reply’ that the following statistics are taken. The available on 47 occasions between April 2010 and June 2011. A statistics cover the period April 2010 to June 2011. holding reply in this instance is one sent in accordance Under the Official Statistics Code of Practice, we cannot with the provisions of the Act informing the requester release statistics for a time period prior to their appearance that the balance of the public interest arguments relating in a regular statistical report. Statistics for the remainder to the disclosure of the information requested requires of 2011 will be collated and published in due course. further consideration, and as such the deadline for Between April 2010 and June 2011 the Ministry of response is legitimately extended. The Department can Justice provided the full information requested 844 only take this approach if it is considering an exemption times. This statistic, and the quarterly breakdown as which is subject to the application of a public interest follows, includes only first requests, it does not include test. By quarter, the figures are as follows: information provided at internal review or subsequent appeal stages available under the Freedom of Information Quarter Number of PIT extensions Act (’the Act’). Full disclosure by quarter: April-June 2010 13 July-September 2010 11 Quarter Full disclosure October-December 2010 8 April-June 2010 152 January-March 2011 9 July-September 2010 190 April-June 2011 6 October-December 2010 164 January-March 2011 167 The Department is unable to provide information April-June 2011 171 about the number of requests not responded to within 40 days, without incurring disproportionate cost. However, the number of times that the Department has responded Between April 2010 and June 2011 the Ministry of to a FOIA request beyond the statutory 20 day deadline Justice partially withheld information in 344 first response is 660 (April 2010-June 2011). This can be broken down requests, and by quarter: further: Quarter Partial disclosure Quarter Responded to late April-June 2010 57 April-June 2010 125 July-September 2010 59 July-September 2010 93 October-December 2010 99 October-December 2010 84 January-March 2011 68 January-March 2011 136 April-June2011 61 April-June 2011 222

Between April 2010 and June 2011 the Ministry of The number of cases that had not received a substantive Justice withheld the whole response of information response, at time of the relevant official statistics publication, 1477 times, and by quarter: for the period April 2010-June 2011, areas follows: 259W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 260W

The Ministry of Justice obtains the opinion of the Quarter Number substantive response yet issued qualified person by seeking the view of—usually—the Minister responsible for the subject matter to which the April-June 2010 22 information relates. July-September 2010 18 October-December 2010 17 Departmental Lost Property January-March 2011 50 April-June 2011 105 Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice pursuant to the answer of 31 October 2011, Official Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice Report, columns 391-2W, on departmental lost in respect of how many responses to requests for property, whether he has had discussions on the information received by his Department under the activities of ElcomSoft and its password breaking Freedom of Information Act 2000 the reason of (a) programmes; and if he will make a statement. [79372] commercially sensitive information, (b) information not held, (c) information too costly to provide and (d) Mr Djanogly: The Ministry of Justice has not had vexatious or repeated requests has been given in any discussions on the activities of ElcomSoft and its response since January 2010. [78913] password breaking programmes.

Mr Djanogly: The Ministry of Justice publishes on its Departmental Public Expenditure website quarterly and annual statistics on Freedom of Information requests received by over 40 central government Austin Mitchell: To ask the Secretary of State for bodies. The information provided has been taken from Justice whether he receives any external funding for (a) these publications. The figures provided are for the his ministerial office and (b) his advisers; and what the period 1 January 2010 to 31 June 2011. (i) source and (ii) amount is of any such funding. Under the Official Statistics Code of Practice, we [77592] cannot release statistics for a time period prior to their appearance in a regular statistical report. Statistics beyond Mr Kenneth Clarke: Neither my ministerial office nor 31 June 2011 will be collated and published in due special advisers are funded externally. course. These figures include only first requests; information Departmental Travel provided at internal review or subsequent appeal stages available under the Freedom of Information Act (‘the Luciana Berger: To ask the Secretary of State for Act’) are not included. Justice how much his Department has spent on first class travel by (a) air, (b) boat and (c) train since May Number 2010. [75517] (a) Commercially sensitive 38 information Mr Kenneth Clarke: Since May 2010 the Ministry of (b) Do not hold 914 Justice has spent the following on first class travel: (c) Refused under costs 1126 (a) Air: £4,279; (d) Refused as repeated 19 (b) Boat: nil; (e) Refused as vexatious 7 (c) Train: £889,138. We have introduced a new travel and subsistence The total number of requests received in this period policy in April 2010 containing restrictions on using was 4,075. first class travel. However, the policy does recognise that in certain cases (e.g. when accompanying a Minister or Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice where a member of staff has special needs) and with which Minister in his Department is responsible for prior management approval, first class travel is undertaken. determining whether exemptions to the Freedom of Information Act 2000 should apply to responses to Extradition requests for information under the Act; and which other Minister is responsible for making such determinations should the subject matter of the request Mr Raab: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice fall within the Ministerial responsibilities of the what information his Department holds on how many Minister with lead responsibility. [78914] extradition requests to the UK have been refused by a court under Article 8 of the European Convention on Human Rights in each year since 2000. [79335] Mr Djanogly: Departmental officials within the Ministry of Justice determine whether exemptions to the Freedom Mr Blunt: The Department does not compile information of Information Act (FOIA) are engaged. about requests for extradition of persons from the However, the application of the exemption in Section United Kingdom in a way that would permit the reasons 36 (prejudice to the effective conduct of public affairs) for refusal to be ascertained to this level of detail. The of FOIA is subject to the reasonable opinion of a information requested could therefore only be found by qualified person, who for Government Departments is manual examination of case files, and would incur a a Minister of the Crown. disproportionate cost. 261W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 262W

Legal Aid Scheme: Prisoners Members: Correspondence

Sir Gerald Kaufman: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr Llwyd: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice Justice when he plans to answer the letter from the how many prisoners currently serving indeterminate right hon. Member for Manchester, Gorton of sentences in England and Wales have received legal aid 27 September 2011 with regard to Mr Naseer Ahmed for proceedings in the family courts relating to (a) Bhatti. [79375] custody of children, (b) adoption of children, (c) contact with children and (d) parental responsibility. Mr Kenneth Clarke: I have now replied. [79390] Prisoners: Foreign Nationals

Mr Djanogly: This information is not kept by either Mr Bone: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice the Ministry of Justice or the Legal Services Commission. what recent estimate he has made of the number of people in prison who are (a) citizens of other EU Legal Opinion member states and (b) non-EU citizens. [79297] Mr Blunt: As at 30 September 2011 there were 11,076 Stephen Hammond: To ask the Secretary of State for foreign national prisoners, of which 3,776 were EU Justice (1) how many times his Department’s legal nationals and 7,300 non-EU nationals. The number of section provided legal advice to Ministers in (a) 2007, foreign national prisoners held in all prison establishments (b) 2009, (c) 2010 and (d) the first six months of in England and Wales by nationality is published quarterly 2011; [78077] in the Ministry of Justice Statistics bulletin ‘Offender (2) how many officials in his Department were Management Statistics Quarterly Bulletin—Table 1.5. working in its legal section in June 2011; and how many The publication is available free of charge via the following staff were working in the legal departments of his link: Department’s agencies and non-departmental bodies. http://www.justice.gov.uk/publications/statistics-and-data/ [78086] prisons-and-probation/oms-quarterly.htm These figures have been drawn from administrative Mr Djanogly: The information is as follows: IT systems which, as with any large scale recording (1) The Legal Directorate within the Ministry of system, are subject to possible errors with data entry Justice provides advice to the Lord Chancellor and and processing. Secretary of State for Justice, my right hon. and learned Prisons: Private Sector Friend the Member for Rushcliffe (Mr Clarke) and Ministers directly as required and indirectly when policy John McDonnell: To ask the Secretary of State for officials request legal advice for submissions. There is Justice which services (a) the National Offender no central record of all the legal advice provided by the Management Service and (b) his Department provide Legal Directorate and it would not be possible to provide to private companies which are managing jails. [78811] this information for the periods requested without manually searching files and submissions and incurring Mr Blunt: Private sector suppliers do not generally disproportionate costs. rely on shared services being provided by the National Offender Management Service (NOMS) or the Ministry (2) Total headcount in Legal sections of the Ministry of Justice (MOJ) for the delivery of their contractual of Justice. commitments.

Number Private sector providers receive some support in relation to auditing and assurance, contractual and operational MOJ HQ 85 policy advice and operational and incident support. In HMCTS (July figures) 11,852 addition, on newer custodial contracts they use some NOMS 2— MOJ third-party contracts for goods and services (e.g. ALBS/NDPBS 3— food), where there are financial benefits and it is in the 1 Includes magistrates courts legal advisers and tribunal lawyers and public interest. Other shared national contracts include registrars. contracted court and inter-prison escorting services and, 2 No legal staff employed directly. where appropriate, as part of an integrated national 3 Information for the period requested is not available centrally and service, data, security and some other operational can not be collated within the time frame without incurring disproportionate costs. arrangements are shared. Under the Governments Transparency Agenda the Translation Services department publishes senior salary and organogram data for the MOJ and its agencies including executive Priti Patel: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice NDPBs (CCRC, CICA, ICO, JAC, LSC, LSB, Parole what the total cost to the public purse was of providing Board and YJB) on the Justice website however it does translation services to foreign (a) defendants in court not include advisory NDPBs. cases and (b) offenders in prisons in each of the last five years. [72981] The last figures published provided information as at 31 March and, the next exercise will produce the September Mr Djanogly: The Ministry of Justice’s central accounting data which is due to be published at the end of November. systems do not all separately record the costs of providing This information can be found at: translation services to foreign defendants and offenders. http://www.justice.gov.uk/publications/transparency-data/ It would incur disproportionate cost to disaggregate senior-civil-service-salaries-and-organograms.htm such costs from the respective accounts. 263W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 264W

ENERGY AND CLIMATE CHANGE The first 30,000 domestic sized installations (=2 kW) Adam Werritty of micro combined heat and power are also supported by the feed-in tariff under a pilot scheme. Mr Kevan Jones: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change whether (a) he, (b) any Departmental Responsibilities Ministers and (c) officials of his Department have met (i) Mr Michael Hintze, (ii) Mr Tony Buckingham, (iii) Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy Mr Michael Davis, (iv) Mr Poju Zabludowicz, (v) Jon and Climate Change how many applications from Moulton and (vi) Stephen Crouch; and where any such employees to run services for which his Department is meetings took place. [78652] directly responsible he has received since May 2010; and if he will make a statement. [77608] Gregory Barker: Details of meetings that are held between DECC Ministers and external parties are published Gregory Barker: No applications have been received externally on the Department’s website on a quarterly from any member of DECC’s senior civil service to run basis. Information for other officials’ meetings is not any services for which DECC is responsible since May held centrally and could be obtained only at 2010, and we have no record of any such applications disproportionate cost. from other DECC employees. Mr Kevan Jones: To ask the Secretary of State Electricity for Energy and Climate Change whether (a) he, (b) officials of his Department and (c) special advisers in Chris Ruane: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy his Department have met Mr Adam Werritty on official and Climate Change pursuant to the answer of business since May 2010; and how many such meetings 20 October 2011, Official Report, column 1112W, what took place (i) on his Department’s premises and (ii) timetable he has set for the implementation of elsewhere. [78850] measures to improve competition in the domestic energy market. [78255] Gregory Barker: Details of meetings that are held between DECC Ministers and external parties are published Charles Hendry: The Government plan to lay an externally on the Department’s website on a quarterly order in Parliament this month to increase the threshold basis. Information for other officials’ meetings is not for supplier participation in the Community Energy. held centrally and could be obtained only at Saving Programme (CESP) and Carbon Emissions disproportionate cost. Reduction Target (CERT). We expect it to be in force Carbon Emissions: Pilot Schemes before the end of the year. Ofgem has announced that it plans to consult later Luciana Berger: To ask the Secretary of State for this month on a range of tariff proposals that aim to Energy and Climate Change pursuant to the reform the energy market by making it simpler and contribution of the Minister of State for Climate more competitive to reduce tariff complexity. Change to the Public Bill Committee on the Energy Bill In December, Ofgem plan to make a decision on their [Lords] of 21 June 2011, Written Evidence, column proposals to improve electricity wholesale market liquidity. 42S, what progress has been made on establishing follow-on pilot programmes to the local carbon Feed-in Tariffs: Housing framework pilots. [79468] Ian Lucas: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy Gregory Barker: DECC-supported the £2.5 million and Climate Change if he will estimate the average cost Local Carbon Frameworks pilot in 2010-11, which involved to homeowners of bringing a property up to level C 30 local authorities. Its aim was to identify the best energy performance certificate rating before qualifying ways to reduce carbon emissions at a local level. An for eligibility for receipt of the feed-in tariff. [79330] evaluation of the pilot and toolkit for the benefit of all local authorities will be published later this year. There Gregory Barker: The Government’s current consultation are no plans to run further local carbon framework on feed-in tariffs for solar photovoltaics (PV) sets out pilots but DECC will continue to support local authorities two options for strengthening the link between energy cut carbon, and I have recently asked the Committee on efficiency and FITs. The first option is that only buildings Climate Change to provide advice on this. with an energy performance certificate (EPC) rating of Combined Heat and Power: Social Rented Housing level C would be eligible for the standard FITs rates for solar PV. Mike Weatherley: To ask the Secretary of State for The costs of reaching level C will vary depending on Energy and Climate Change whether he has plans to the base-level energy performance of the building in promote the installation of micro-combined heat and question. However, we estimate that for a typical house, power in (a) residential property and (b) social an investment of up to £5,600 in energy efficiency housing for the purposes of reducing carbon emissions measures may be required to bring a property up to and fuel costs. [78550] level C. Gregory Barker: Micro combined heat and power From autumn 2012, the measures necessary to meet will be eligible for the Green Deal, which will be available level C would be largely financeable through the Green to all sectors, including social housing. It can be financed Deal. Prior to that, the carbon emissions reduction with Green Deal finance if it has been recommended target (CERT) scheme may also be able to provide a during the Green Deal assessment for a given property proportion of the installation costs for the more basic that it can achieve savings on the energy bill. measures. 265W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 266W

Gas Fired Power Stations smart meter programme. The Government’s key principles underpinning the programme’s privacy framework are Mr Binley: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy that consumers should have a choice as to how their and Climate Change what the installed available smart metering data is used and by whom, except where generating capacity was of each (a) coal, (b) gas it is required to fulfil regulated duties. We are minded to (combined-cycle gas turbine), (c) nuclear, (d) oil and define regulated duties narrowly. The intention is to (e) renewables plant in November 2011. [78697] publish a further consultation on privacy policy proposals in 2012. Charles Hendry: DECC publishes data on installed In addition, the arrangements for the security of the generation capacity for each plant owned by major smart metering system have been developed by a dedicated power producers in the UK. This is updated on an team of security experts within the programme, who annual basis, data up to May 2010 are available in perform ongoing risk assessments in order to identify table 5.11 of DUKES at the following link: the nature of possible threats, and ensure that risks are http://www.decc.gov.uk/en/content/cms/statistics/energy_stats/ appropriately managed. source/electricity/electricity.aspx At any point in time, not all installed capacity may be Oil: Safety available, for a number of reasons, including unplanned and planned (maintenance) outages. Based on its Winter Outlook Report (published on 11 October 2011) , National Mr Spellar: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy Grid’s operational view of Great Britain’s generation and Climate Change what assessment his Department capacity anticipated to be available for the start of has made of the threat to oil platforms from terrorism winter 2011 is 81.8 GW.A breakdown of this capacity is or criminal attack; and what steps he is taking to shown in the following table: prevent such attacks. [79414] Operational view of generating capacity available for winter 2011-12 Fuel type Capacity (MW) Charles Hendry: The Department maintains a continuous assessment of threats to upstream oil and gas infrastructure CCGT 29.3 from all sources including terrorism or criminal attack OCGT 1.2 in conjunction with the Security Services and the industry. Pumped storage 2.7 A number of measures are used to mitigate the risks; Oil 3.4 these are applied in proportion to the significance of Coal and biomass 28 each piece of infrastructure. Wind 3.4 Hydro 1 Pensioners: Fuel Poverty Interconnectors 3 Nuclear 9.8 Source: Mr Jim Cunningham: To ask the Secretary of State Taken from figure E3. Embedded renewable generation is not included. for Energy and Climate Change what recent steps his The full National Grid report can be found at the Department has taken to lift pensioners out of fuel following link: poverty. [78643] http://www.nationalgrid.com/NR/rdonlyres/BE947476-51DF- 4D5F-8E2B-5342595157A9/49492/ Winter_Outlook_Report_201112.pdf Gregory Barker: Government are committed to supporting vulnerable consumers and tackling fuel poverty Generators declare their forward availability to National and have in place a range of policies to contribute Grid. These data are revised on a continuous basis, and towards these aims. These include the Warm Home are used by National Grid for both operational and Discount to assist more of the most vulnerable households planning purposes. Summary charts of declared availability with their energy bills. The Core Group element of this (“output usable”), by fuel type, are available at the scheme provides an automatic rebate of £120 this winter following link: on electricity bills to poorer pensioners. http://www.bmreports.com/bsp/bsp_home.htm daily, two to 14 days ahead; and Warm Front continues to provide assistance with insulation and heating measures to low income and weekly, two to 52 weeks ahead. vulnerable pensioner households. Meters The CERT extension and Super Priority Group have a significant positive impact on fuel poverty. Around Mr Gale: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy 185,000 households could receive measures to provide a and Climate Change what steps he plans to take to long-term solution to fuel poverty. Many more households ensure the installation of Smart meters is done in such will receive measures which will protect them from a way that data on the household will be made secure. falling into fuel poverty. [78483] Looking forward Government continue to work towards introducing the new energy company obligation—the Charles Hendry: The Government recognises the privacy ECO—within the Green Deal framework. A key focus and security of personal data as an important issue and for the ECO will be on providing support for low are putting in robust arrangements in place to protect income and vulnerable households who cannot achieve consumers. significant energy savings without an additional measure We are committed to following the principle of of support, enabling them to heat their homes more ’Privacy by design’, which means that privacy issues are affordably on a long-term basis, and improve the energy considered early and embedded into the design of the efficiency of their homes. 267W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 268W

Renewable Energy: Heating first introduced. The FITs scheme was never intended to provide windfall profits and in the current climate we Mrs Main: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy regard the returns expected for FIT generators under and Climate Change whether he has considered the proposed new tariffs to be reasonable. including bioliquids in the Renewable Heat Incentive. [79481] Caroline Flint: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change with reference to Gregory Barker: As stated in the Renewable Heat paragraph 32 of his Department’s consultation on Incentive policy document (published in March), we are Comprehensive Review Phase1-Tariffs for Solar PV, considering whether to support bioliquids as part of published on 31 October 2011, whether his developing the second phase of the scheme. Department has made an estimate of the average time lag between when a project is installed and when it is Solar Power confirmed on Ofgem’s central fit register. [79031]

Caroline Flint: To ask the Secretary of State for Gregory Barker: The average length of time between Energy and Climate Change how many (a) feed-in the commissioning date of a solar photovoltaic (PV) tariff and (b) solar installations there were in (i) the installation and the date on which it is confirmed on the UK, (ii) each local authority area and (iii) each Ofgem Central Feed-in Tariffs (FITs) Register is 49 parliamentary constituency in each of the last 15 years. days. [79099] It is important to note that the confirmation of an installation on the Ofgem Central FIT Register is the Gregory Barker: The table, which will be placed in the last stage in the FITs application process, and is later Libraries of the House, shows the total solar photovoltaic than the date an installation becomes eligible for FITs installed capacity in the UK at the end of each of the payments. last 15 years. Prior to the introduction of Feed in Tariffs, data by local authority and parliamentary Mr Jim Cunningham: To ask the Secretary of State constituency, as well as the number of UK solar for Energy and Climate Change what assessment his photovoltaic installations, are not available. Department has made of the effect of the timing of his The total number of Feed in Tariff installations and planned consultation on solar feed-in tariffs on the Feed in Tariff solar photovoltaic installations, in each capacity of small and medium-sized enterprises to fully local authority, parliamentary constituency and Great participate in that consultation. [79287] Britain as a whole, as at the end of September 2011, is given in an annex, a copy of which will be placed in the Gregory Barker: The reference date of 12 December Libraries of the House. 2011 proposed in the Government’s consultation on Solar Power: Feed-in Tariffs feed-in tariffs (FITs) for solar photovoltaics (PV) is six weeks after the publication date of this consultation. As the consultation explains, this period will allow many Caroline Flint: To ask the Secretary of State for prospective generators, particularly householders, who Energy and Climate Change with reference to have made a financial commitment to installing PV (for paragraph 6(ii) of his Department’s consultation on example, paying a deposit) to complete their installations Comprehensive Review Phase1-Tariffs for Solar PV, and receive the current tariffs. published on 31 October 2011, for what reason 12 December was chosen as the reference date. [79030] We recognise though that some prospective FITs generators who have incurred or committed expenditure Gregory Barker: The reference date of 12 December may not be able to complete their installations and 2011 proposed in the Government’s consultation on submit their applications for FITs before the proposed feed-in tariffs (FITs) for solar photovoltaics (PV) is six reference date. In forming the proposal, we have taken weeks after the publication date of this consultation. As into account the possibility of hardship to persons in the consultation explains, this period will allow many this situation. We consider that the proposed approach prospective generators, particularly householders, who is reasonable given a number of factors. These include have made a financial commitment to installing PV (for the urgency of the concerns about the impact on the example, paying a deposit) to complete their installations scheme’s budget of continuing high levels of uptake at and receive the current tariffs. the current tariffs, including any rush of new installations We recognise though that some prospective FITs triggered by the consultation. In addition, the proposed generators who have incurred or committed expenditure new tariffs are designed to provide a reasonable rate of may not be able to complete their installations and return in line with those intended when the scheme was submit their applications for FITs before the proposed first introduced. The FITs scheme was never intended reference date. In forming the proposal, we have taken to provide windfall profits and in the current climate we into account the possibility of hardship to persons in regard the returns expected for FIT generators under this situation. We consider that the proposed approach the proposed new tariffs to be reasonable. is reasonable given a number of factors. These include The Department has not specifically assessed the the urgency of the concerns about the impact on the impact of the timing of the consultation on small and scheme’s budget of continuing high levels of uptake at medium-sized enterprises. the current tariffs, including any rush of new installations triggered by the consultation. In addition, the proposed Mr Jim Cunningham: To ask the Secretary of State new tariffs are designed to provide a reasonable rate of for Energy and Climate Change if he will assess the return in line with those intended when the scheme was potential effects of his proposals to alter solar feed-in 269W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 270W tariffs rates before the conclusion of the consultation Gregory Barker: The following table sets out estimates period on solar feed-in tariff rates; and if he will make for the number of solar photovoltaic (PV) installations a statement. [79288] that are projected to be installed between 12 December 2011 and the end of the current spending review period Gregory Barker: The reference date of 12 December under the proposals set out in the Government’s 2011 proposed in the Government’s consultation on consultation on feed-in tariffs for solar PV. feed-in tariffs (FITs) for solar photovoltaics (PV) is six weeks after the publication date of this consultation. As Installations (cumulative total) the consultation explains, this period will allow many 12 December 2011-31 March 30,000 prospective generators, particularly householders, who 2012 have made a financial commitment to installing PV (for 2012-13 55,000 example, paying a deposit) to complete their installations 2013-14 85,000 and receive the current tariffs. 2014-15 115,000 We recognise though that some prospective FITs Notes: 1. Estimates are based on the impact assessment supporting the consultation generators who have incurred or committed expenditure on FITs for solar PV and take a midpoint of the projected impacts of the two may not be able to complete their installations and options for energy efficiency requirements set out in the consultation. submit their applications for FITs before the proposed 2. Estimates are uncertain and depend on a number of factors including final decisions following the current consultation on FITs, how the market responds reference date. In forming the proposal, we have taken to any resulting changes in tariff levels, the future profile of costs of PV panels into account the possibility of hardship to persons in and the average size of installation for different tariff bands. this situation. We consider that the proposed approach 3. Estimates rounded to nearest 5,000. is reasonable given a number of factors. These include Priti Patel: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy the urgency of the concerns about the impact on the and Climate Change pursuant to the written scheme’s budget of continuing high levels of uptake at ministerial statement of 31 October 2011, Official the current tariffs, including any rush of new installations Report, column 26WS, on feed-in tariffs, what impact triggered by the consultation. In addition, the proposed assessment he carried out on the effect of the decision new tariffs are designed to provide a reasonable rate of to reform the feed-in tariff on (a) the solar PV market return in line with those intended when the scheme was and (b) small and medium-sized enterprises providing first introduced. The FITs scheme was never intended solar PV installations. [79462] to provide windfall profits, paid for by energy consumers in general, and in the current climate we regard the Gregory Barker: The impact assessment accompanying returns expected for FIT generators under the proposed the Government’s consultation on feed-in tariffs (FITs) new tariffs to be reasonable. for solar photovoltaics (PV) estimates that new solar PV installations will continue to come forward under Mr Jim Cunningham: To ask the Secretary of State the proposed changes to FITs for solar PV. The number for Energy and Climate Change for what reason his of installations are expected to be between 70-95% less consultation on solar feed-in tariffs is six weeks long. for different tariff bands than under the “Do Nothing [79290] scenario”. The impact assessment does not estimate the specific impact of this, or the potential new business Gregory Barker: The consultation on proposed changes opportunities arising from the consultation proposals to feed-in tariffs for solar photovoltaics (PV) runs for on energy efficiency, on small and medium-sized enterprises approximately eight weeks; from 31 October to (SMEs). 23 December 2011. This consultation period is shorter Priti Patel: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy than that recommended in the code of practice on and Climate Change pursuant to the written consultation. However, the Government considers that ministerial statement of 31 October 2011, Official this is justified given the small number of issues covered Report, columns 26-7WS, on feed-in tariffs, what by the consultation and the urgency of the budgetary estimate he has made of the number of small and risk that it is focused on addressing. medium-sized enterprises installing solar PV who have been affected by the decision to reform the feed-in Ian Lucas: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy tariff. [79529] and Climate Change if he will estimate the number of solar PV systems which will have been installed, Gregory Barker: The Department does not hold specific commissioned and submitted for accreditation to a information on the number of small and medium-size feed-in tariff licensee before 12 December 2011. [79331] enterprises (SMEs) currently installing solar photovoltaics (PV). 3,237 companies have been certificated to install Gregory Barker: We estimate that by 12 December solar PV under the Microgeneration Certification scheme. 2011, a total of approximately 130,000 solar PV installations Of these, 3057 companies have been certificated since will be eligible for feed-in tariffs (FITs). This estimate is the start of the feed-in tariffs scheme in April 2010. We uncertain and depends on projected growth between expect that the majority of these companies are SMEs. now and 12 December.

Priti Patel: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy PRIME MINISTER and Climate Change pursuant to the written Cabinet Committees: Third Sector ministerial statement of 31 October 2011, Official Report, column 26WS, on feed-in tariffs, what Mr Thomas: To ask the Prime Minister which estimate he has made of the number of planned Cabinet Committee is responsible for discussing solar PV installations scheduled to take place after 12 progress on the Government’s Big Society agenda; and December 2011. [79461] if he will make a statement. [78209] 271W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 272W

The Prime Minister: I have convened a steering group Mr Hurd: There have been over 1,000 awards from of Ministers on a number of occasions to help drive the the Transition Fund. We do not publish details of big society agenda. The big society agenda is wide-ranging, unsuccessful applicants but I can confirm that of the covering various policy areas, and is embedded in 1,721 applications made to the programme, 606 were departmental reforms. Therefore different Cabinet unsuccessful. committees will consider different aspects. Departmental Work Experience Departmental Public Appointments Luciana Berger: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet Mr Jenkin: To ask the Prime Minister (1) who has Office how many unpaid and expenses-only internships applied to be Head of the Civil Service; and when he (a) his Department and (b) each public body for plans to announce who will take up that appointment; which he is responsible employed in the last 12 months [79471] for which figures are available. [78379] (2) how many hours per week he proposes that the Head of the Civil Service will devote to that role; and Mr Maude: From 1 November 2010 to 31 October when he will have regular meetings with the post 2011 the Cabinet Office and its non-departmental public holder. [79472] bodies employed no unpaid or expenses-only interns. However, the Department did offer 11 apprenticeships The Prime Minister: I refer the hon. Member to the and 34 paid internships. press notice issued by my office on 11 October 2011. The Social Mobility Strategy published in April 2011 This is available on the No. 10 website: clearly states that we want to ensure that everyone has a http://www.number10.gov.uk/news/cabinet-secretary- fair opportunity to fulfil their potential. Making work announces-retirement experience and internships available to young people from all walks of life is a key element of this. I am Tony Blair pleased that the Government are leading by example in Whitehall with a new internship programme for under- Mr Amess: To ask the Prime Minister pursuant to represented groups. The new Whitehall Internship the answer of 28 April 2011, Official Report, column Programme has been developed in response to a pledge 524W, on Tony Blair, how much is payable in Public in the coalition agreement which states that the Government Duties Cost Allowance per year; what the rate was in will provide internships in every Whitehall Department each year since May 2007; how much was paid to Tony for under-represented groups, including black, Asian Blair in Public Duties Cost Allowance in each month and minority ethnic communities. since 2007; what restrictions apply to the use of this In addition to our internship schemes for university allowance; and if he will make a statement. [56610] students and recent graduates, during the summer of 2011 the Cabinet Office also offered four high achieving Mr Maude: I have been asked to reply. 16-year-olds from low-income backgrounds an opportunity I refer my hon. Friend to the answer I gave on to complete a short paid work experience placement, 27 October 2011, Official Report, column 338W. aimed at raising the aspirations of young people who would not ordinarily have the opportunity to visit or work in Whitehall. Travel and living expenses were also provided, as well as accommodation in central London CABINET OFFICE and a range of after work entertainment and development Big Society Capital opportunities. ElcomSoft Mr Thomas: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet Office when he expects the Big Society Bank to make Mr Thomas: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet its first loan; and if he will make a statement. [79490] Office what representations he has received on the work of ElcomSoft and its password breaking programmes; Mr Hurd: I expect the Big Society Bank to become and if he will make a statement. [79370] operational and start making investments in early 2012. In the meantime, I have directed the Big Lottery Mr Maude: Neither I nor my officials have received Fund to set up an interim Investment Committee to any representations from ElcomSoft about their work make initial investments to support the growth of the or products. social investment market using up to £5 million of the English portion of money released through the dormant Federation of Student Islamic Societies accounts scheme. The Investment Committee announced its first Mr Lammy: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet in-principle investment of up to £1 million in the Private Office what correspondence his Department has Equity Foundation in July. received from (a) ministerial colleagues and (b) officials in the Home Office on recruitment events Charities organised in conjunction with the Federation of Student Islamic Societies since 1 June 2011. [77955] Mr Thomas: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet Office which organisations that applied for funding Mr Maude: There was limited correspondence in late from the Transition Fund were not successful; and if he October between Home Office and civil service fast will make a statement. [79371] stream officials regarding the status of the October 273W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 274W

Federation of Student Islamic Societies (FOSIS) event Number that was organised to promote fast stream to FOSIS Active members at 31 members. Opters out March

2006-07 4,421 594,000 Mr Lammy: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet 2007-08 5,576 577,000 Office how many civil service recruitment events have 2008-09 5,366 564,000 been organised in conjunction with the Federation of 2009-10 4,322 574,000 Student Islamic Societies since 1 June 2011. [77956] Skin Cancer Mr Maude: Civil service fast stream attended, with Sir Paul Beresford: To ask the Minister for the several other major recruiters, the Federation of Student Cabinet Office how many people were diagnosed with Islamic Societies Annual Careers and Community Fair malignant melanoma in each of the last 10 years. on 18 June 2011, as an opportunity to promote the fast [79463] stream graduate talent management programme. Mr Hurd: The information requested falls within the responsibility of the UK Statistics Authority. I have Principal Civil Service Pension Scheme asked the authority to reply. Letter from Stephen Penneck, dated November 2011: Rachel Reeves: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet As Director General for the Office for National Statistics, I have been asked to reply to your recent question asking how many Office what the participation rate for the Principal Civil people were diagnosed with malignant melanoma in each of the Service Pension Scheme was for each pay band in each last 10 years. [79463] year from 2006 to 2010. [79534] The latest available figures for newly diagnosed cases of malignant melanoma (incidence) are for the year 2009. Please note that these Mr Maude: The number of employees eligible to be numbers may not be the same as the number of people diagnosed with cancer, because one person may be diagnosed with more members of the Principal Civil Service Pension Scheme than one cancer. but who opted out in the years between 2006 and 2010 The table included in this answer provides the number of newly are given in the following table, together with active diagnosed cases of melanoma skin cancer in England for each membership of the scheme at the end of the relevant year from 2000 to 2009. years, as published in the Cabinet Office: Civil The latest published figures on the incidence of cancer in Superannuation Resource Accounts. We do not hold England are available on the National Statistics website at: data on the breakdown of participation rates by pay http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/rel/vsob1/cancer-statistics- band. registrations--england--series-mb1-/no--40--2009/index.html

Registrations of newly diagnosed cases of malignant melanoma, persons, England, 2000-091,2 Cancer registrations 2000 2001 2002 2003 2004 2005 2006 2007 2008 2009

England 6,019 6,440 6,697 6,971 7,674 8,226 8,942 9,067 9,861 9,771 1 Malignant melanoma is coded as C43 in the International Classification of Disease, Tenth revision (ICD-10). 2 Newly diagnosed cases registered in each calendar year.

Social Finance In July we announced a £10 million funding programme, to launch in 2012, for investment and contract readiness, in order to help social sector organisations prepare for Mr Thomas: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet new opportunities in public service delivery and social Office what steps he is taking to promote the investment. In August, the Government announced a development of social finance; and if he will make a trial of four Social Impact Bonds which would let statement. [79491] people invest in social projects and be paid a return if the projects are successful. Mr Hurd: The Government are committed to supporting the growth of a strong social investment market. In February, we published our strategy—‘Growing the INTERNATIONAL DEVELOPMENT Social Investment Market: A vision and strategy’—which outlines our vision to create a new pillar of finance for Afghanistan: Females social ventures. Since then, Big Society Capital (BSC) has been set up Katy Clark: To ask the Secretary of State for and is in the process of securing Financial Services International Development how much his Department Authority and State Aid approvals. We expect it to be has spent annually on funding for organisations open for business in spring next year. BSC will use up to supporting (a) women’s rights and (b) women’s health £400 million of dormant accounts money and £200 million in Afghanistan. [78719] investment from the ‘Merlin’banks to support organisations that invest in the social sector, helping them to provide a Mr Andrew Mitchell: Details of all DFID’s projects greater range of financial services to the social sector and programmes, including annual spend, are available and to raise more money for onward investment into online at: the sector. http://projects.dfid.gov.uk/ 275W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 276W

The Department for International Development (DFID) Mr Andrew Mitchell: The Department for International is supporting programmes that directly benefit women’s Development’s assistance to Burma has been designed organisations and activities in Afghanistan. Our funding to achieve results for poor and vulnerable people there, to the International Planned Parenthood Foundation with programmes in areas including maternal health, and WOMANKIND Worldwide is supporting civil society livelihoods and malaria. To enable this, I have allocated organisations in Afghanistan and elsewhere address the the following levels of aid to Burma: £36 million in human rights and practical needs of women and girls. 2011-12; £36 million in 2012-13; and £55 million in During my recent visit to Afghanistan I launched a 2013-14. major new civil society programme which will help Further details are available in the DFID Burma Afghan organisations to hold their government to account. operational plan which is available on the DFID website; The programme will particularly target women (and www.dfid.gov.uk youth) and it is expected that many women’s organisations will benefit. In addition, the Foreign and Commonwealth Office (FCO) provides support to the Afghanistan Departmental Security Independent Human Rights Commission and the Human Rights Support Unit at the Ministry of Justice. The Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for FCO also provides support to paralegal services working International Development what level of security with women and girls in adult prisons and juvenile vetting is required for the post of (a) head of detention centres. communications, (b) deputy head of communications and (c) head of press office in his Department; and if Katy Clark: To ask the Secretary of State for he will list each person who has held these posts since International Development whether his Department May 2010. [77890] provides financial support to organisations in Afghanistan which provide assistance to women or Mr Duncan: The booklet HMG Personnel Security girls who have been victims of (a) domestic abuse, (b) Controls, available from the Cabinet Office website at: rape and (c) forced marriage; and if he will make a www.cabinetoffice.gov.uk/resource-library/hmg-personnel- statement. [78720] security-controls Mr Andrew Mitchell: The Department for International describes the circumstances in which a post may require Development is not currently supporting organisations the holder to be the subject of national security vetting in Afghanistan that provide direct assistance to women checks. and girls who have been the victims of domestic abuse, It is not appropriate to confirm which specific posts rape and forced marriage. However, during my recent or post holders within a Department are the subject of visit to Afghanistan I announced a major new civil vetting, as this could highlight who within a Department society programme which will help Afghan organisations has access to sensitive material and be used for hostile to hold their Government to account, including on targeting of individuals. their obligations to protect women and girls from violence, Since November 2010 the post of head of and promote human rights more generally.The programme communications is held by James Helm, succeeding will particularly target women and young people and it James Hardy. Since May 2010 the deputy head of is expected that many women’s organisations will benefit, communications is Deborah Hermer, and the head of including those focussed on rights issues. news is Charlotte Morgan. Afghanistan: Mortality Rates Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for Katy Clark: To ask the Secretary of State for International Development what level of security International Development what recent discussions he vetting is required for (a) grade six and seven, or has had with the Government of Afghanistan on equivalent, press officers and (b) ministerial private maternal mortality rates in Afghanistan; and if he will secretaries in his Department. [77891] make a statement. [78718] Mr Duncan: The booklet HMG Personnel Security Mr Andrew Mitchell: I had discussions in Kabul last Controls, available from the Cabinet Office website at: week with Afghan Ministers on a range of subjects www.cabinetoffice.gov.uk/resource-library/hmg-personnel- including health outcomes. Officials met with the acting security-controls Minister of Public Health in June 2011 to discuss describes the circumstances in which a post may require maternal mortality issues. The ministry is prioritising the holder to be the subject of national security vetting women and children’s health with a focus on reducing checks. maternal mortality, as well as neonatal and under-five It is not appropriate to confirm which specific posts mortality. It has developed a new reproductive health or post holders within a Department are the subject of policy and strategy to run from 2011 to 2013. We expect vetting, as this could highlight who within a Department new data on maternal mortality in Afghanistan to be has access to sensitive material and be used for the published by the Government of Afghanistan in the hostile targeting of individuals. coming months. Burma: Overseas Aid Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for International Development what company or Rushanara Ali: To ask the Secretary of State for Government service is used to undertake security International Development how much aid he plans to vetting at (a) counter terrorist check, (b) security provide to Burma in (a) 2011-12, (b) 2012-13 and (c) check and (c) developed vetting level in his 2013-14. [78714] Department. [77893] 277W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 278W

Mr Duncan: The Department for International Equatorial Guinea: Overseas Aid Development currently uses both “Foreign and Commonwealth Office Services”, a trading fund of Mr Knight: To ask the Secretary of State for FCO, and the Defence Vetting Agency, for national International Development pursuant to the answer of security vetting. 10 October 2011, Official Report, column 145W, on Equatorial Guinea: overseas aid, (1) what form the Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for multilateral aid to Equatorial Guinea, to which the UK International Development how many people were in contributes, takes; [78847] possession of a security pass for his main departmental headquarters, including multi-site headquarters and (2) what role the UK has in the oversight of not including staff or contractors, in each month since performance, results and fiduciary issues relating to May 2010. [77894] financial aid to Equatorial Guinea; [78846] (3) if he will cease UK contributions to multilateral Mr Duncan: 61 temporary building passes are currently aid to Equatorial Guinea in light of the reports of held by persons other than staff (including those of excessive personal expenditure by a government other Government Departments) and contractors. Minister in that country; [78845] The Department’s access control system only holds data for current live passes, and historical information Mr Duncan: In 2008-09 (the last year for which the is not available. Development Assistance Committee of the Organisation Departmental Written Questions for Economic Cooperation and Development has published figures), Equatorial Guinea received $11 million in Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for multilateral aid, comprising $5 million from the Global International Development how many parliamentary Fund to prevent malaria and treat HIV/AIDS, $4 million questions for (a) ordinary written answer and (b) from EU institutions to improve governance, $1 million written answer on a named day by his Department have from the United Nations Children’s Fund (UNICEF) remained unanswered for a period of two months since for HIV/AIDS education and clean water, and $1 million from the United Nations Population Fund (UNFPA) May 2010. [79572] for reproductive health. The UK’s imputed share of Mr Andrew Mitchell: None. multilateral aid to Equatorial Guinea was £278,000 in 2008-09. Information on the imputed UK share of Developing Countries: Economic Situation multilateral aid is published each year in Statistics on International Development. Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for International Development what recent discussions he The Global Fund’s grant to Equatorial Guinea for has had with ministerial colleagues on the effects of the anti-retroviral treatments for HIV/AIDS has now closed recession on (a) developing countries and (b) and its grant for the provision of anti-malaria bed-nets developed country aid provision. [77080] is nearly closed. Equatorial Guinea does not currently have access to the 10th allocation of the European Mr Andrew Mitchell: I have had a number of discussions Development Fund, because it has not ratified the 1st regarding the effects of the recession with ministerial revision of the Cotonou agreement. colleagues. Along with other donors, the UK makes voluntary or Developing Countries: Teachers assessed contributions to a range of multilateral development organisations which are not tied to a particular Annette Brooke: To ask the Secretary of State for project, sector, or country and can be spent against any International Development which of his Department’s activity that relates to the organisation’s mandate. It is country offices will deliver teacher training for the organisations themselves, with approval from programmes to contribute to the Government’s pledge their management boards, to decide how best to allocate to train 190,000 teachers by 2014; what plans he has to funding to meet their mandates. ensure that such programmes comply with the UN Following the Multilateral Aid Review, the UK is convention on the rights of persons with disabilities; pressing to improve performance, results, value for money and what guidance he has issued country offices on the and fiduciary control in the multilateral development use of participatory teaching methods to improve organisations to which we contribute. We do this through quality and inclusiveness in teaching. [78602] technical discussions, high-level meetings between DFID Ministers and senior officials of the organisations Mr Andrew Mitchell: The UK Government’s pledge concerned, and our membership of the management to train 190,000 teachers by 2014 will be delivered boards. through multilateral organisations. DFID expects multilateral organisations to adhere to the UN convention Overseas Aid on the rights of persons with disabilities in their operations. In addition, DFID is supporting teacher training through Mr Ivan Lewis: To ask the Secretary of State for our bilateral education programme, as published in the International Development on what occasions Official Operational Plans of DFID Country Offices. In 2010, Development Assistance funding has been used to fund the Department issued a Guidance Note entitled ″Education construction of an airport. [79454] for children with disabilities—improving access and quality″, which emphasises the importance of complying Mr Duncan: In order to fulfil obligations to provide with the UN convention, and utilising inclusive basic levels of access, Official Development Assistance methodologies in teaching to ensure quality and has been used over the past few years to fund elements inclusiveness in education. of airport construction in two other Overseas Territories 279W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 280W which are ODA eligible—Anguilla (completed in 2001) Mr Duncan: An independent review which looked at and Montserrat (2005). Aid has also been used in the funding options concluded that a public-private partnership past few years to assist the construction of an airport in (PPP) approach was unlikely to deliver better value for Lashkar Gar in Afghanistan (2009). money for taxpayers compared to the grant funded approach. The airport will therefore, in accordance St Helena: Airports with the review and consistent with decisions in the 2005 contract, be funded by the UK Government.

Mr Ivan Lewis: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr Ivan Lewis: To ask the Secretary of State for International Development what assessment he has International Development what consultation his made of the potential for increased tourism revenues Department held with local residents on the arising from construction of an airport on St Helena. development of a new airport on St Helena. [79401] [79396] Mr Duncan: The people of St Helena have been Mr Duncan: The Department for International consulted extensively over the last 10 years about the Development has commissioned a number of feasibility construction of an airport. The first referendum on the studies which have examined potential tourism revenues subject took place in January 2002 when 71.6% of as a result of an airport. The first study was undertaken respondents voted in favour of an airport. Focus meetings in 2005. A further analysis was undertaken in 2009. were held in community centres around the island in Assessments of revenue and expenditure scenarios were 2006. In 2009 a formal public consultation was held. examined again in May 2010 as part of updated The outcome of this consultation mirrored the 2002 economic assessment work. Each of these analyses has referendum, with very strong majority support for an concluded that an airport will contribute to a sharp airport. increase in the number of tourists and to increases in tourism revenues. Mr Ivan Lewis: To ask the Secretary of State for International Development what assessment he has Mr Ivan Lewis: To ask the Secretary of State for made of the environmental impact of his decision to International Development what value for money grant funding for a new airport on St Helena. [79402] assessment he has made of the decision to fund development of an airport on St Helena. [79398] Mr Duncan: A full Environmental Impact Assessment of the proposed airport has been carried out to UK Mr Duncan: The business case for the St Helena standards and has been reviewed by the Institute of airport agreed by Ministers has rigorously reviewed the Environmental Management. The reply given on 14 June value for money case for an airport. The value for 2011, Official Report, column 751W, provides a fuller money case builds on a number of economic and financial statement on this subject. assessments which have been completed since 2005. All of these reports have come to the same conclusion, Mr Ivan Lewis: To ask the Secretary of State for namely that the best long-term solution from an economic International Development what assessment he has and financial perspective for both HMG and St Helena made of the effects on the economy of St Helena of his is to construct an airport. Building and running a new decision to grant funding for a new airport. [79403] ship for St Helena would consign the island to long-term isolation, increase the island’s dependence on UK aid Mr Duncan: A full feasibility study was undertaken indefinitely and therefore would cost the UK taxpayer in 2005 which looked in detail at the impact on the more in the long run. economy of introducing air access to St Helena. This was reviewed in 2010. These studies show that an airport provides the best chance to reduce St Helena’s dependence Mr Ivan Lewis: To ask the Secretary of State for on UK aid. St Helena Government is currently reviewing International Development whether he has plans to its tax, investment, immigration and land policies and is fund infrastructure projects in British Overseas enacting reforms in these and other areas. This is being Territories in addition to the new airport at St Helena. done to encourage investment and private sector activity [79399] so that St Helena can take full advantage of the opportunities an airport will bring. Mr Duncan: Providing and maintaining infrastructure for Overseas Territories in receipt of UK budgetary Mr Ivan Lewis: To ask the Secretary of State for assistance is an important priority for the UK aid International Development what representations he programme. Every investment in infrastructure in OTs received in advance of his decision to grant funding for is subject to the Treasury’s five case model. As a result, the new St Helena airport. [79404] each investment is subject to rigorous value for money assessments. Several investments are currently being Mr Duncan: The majority of St. Helenians, those considered in other Overseas Territories, including new living on the island and the diaspora living and working housing, school and hospital building programmes in in Ascension, the Falklands, and in the UK, have long Montserrat and a maintenance project for Calshot Harbour called for an airport to be built on St. Helena. These on Tristan Da Cunha. views are underlined by the results of recent referenda on the island which showed a clear majority in support Mr Ivan Lewis: To ask the Secretary of State for of an airport. Many others connected with St. Helena International Development what funding has been have campaigned for opportunities for economic growth committed to the new St Helena airport by the private and development that only an airport can bring to the sector. [79400] island. 281W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 282W

Mr Ivan Lewis: To ask the Secretary of State for tenders prior to the “pause” in negotiations announced International Development for what reason the by the Labour Government in December 2008. Impregilo Government’s decision to fund an airport at St Helena declined to resubmit its tender in June 2011, leaving was made in advance of the publication of the Basil Read (Pty) Ltd as the sole bidder. The tender was Government’s strategy for the overseas territories. assessed and found to be compliant. The DFID/St [79405] Helena Government negotiation team entered into negotiations in early August 2011 and concluded Mr Duncan: This Government set out four conditions negotiations in October 2011 at 20% below the previous for the construction of an airport in July 2010, and offer in real terms, taking into account inflation and the these have now been met. The decision to fund an value of the pound. airport in St Helena is entirely consistent with the Government’s vision for the overseas territories as vibrant St Helena: Overseas Aid and flourishing communities, generating wider opportunities for their people so they become less dependent on UK Mr Ivan Lewis: To ask the Secretary of State for aid. It also brings to a close the uncertainty the British International Development what criteria he used to citizens of St Helena have been experiencing over their determine that funding an airport on St Helena was an future since the airport project was approved in 2005 appropriate use of Official Development Assistance. and ’paused’ in 2008. [79458]

Mr Ivan Lewis: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr Duncan: All the Department for International International Development from what budget within Development’s (DFID’s) support for St Helena meets his Department the funding for the new airport on St the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Helena will come. [79406] Development’s (OECD) definition of Official Development Assistance (ODA). Special provision is made for Mr Duncan: The airport will be funded from the development assistance to the British Overseas Territories Department for International Development’s programme under the International Development Act (2002). capital budget. Mr Ivan Lewis: To ask the Secretary of State for International Development when he expects the DEPUTY PRIME MINISTER construction of the airport on St Helena to be Electoral Register completed. [79407] Mr Duncan: The construction phase is due to complete Chris Ruane: To ask the Deputy Prime Minister towards the end of 2015. pursuant to the answer of 20 October 2011, Official Report, column 1099W, on voter registration, what the Mr Ivan Lewis: To ask the Secretary of State for reason was for the closure of the Electoral International Development what discussions he had Participation Fund; and what assessment he has made with the Secretary of State for Foreign and of the effects of closure on electoral registration levels. Commonwealth Affairs before reaching his decision on [78254] a new airport on St Helena. [79455] Mr Harper: The decision to end the Participation Mr Duncan: The Department of International Fund was taken as part of the emergency Budget which Development has worked very closely with the Foreign was published on 22 June 2010. One of the main and Commonwealth Office, at both official and ministerial reasons for the decision was the under-use of the fund. level, in reaching the decision to build an airport on St. In its last full year only £427,190 —17.1% of the total Helena. The Governor and Government of St. Helena available—was claimed by electoral registration officers. have also played a full part in deliberations. The Government have made no assessment of the effects of closure on electoral registration levels, but as part of Mr Ivan Lewis: To ask the Secretary of State for the transition to individual electoral registration is funding International Development how many bids he received research on the current state of the electoral register for the design, build and operate contract for the new and under-registered groups. airport on St Helena. [79456] Chris Ruane: To ask the Deputy Prime Minister Mr Duncan: The Department for International whether he has received any requests from Development received one bid. The other company that international observers to monitor the implementation had submitted a tender prior to the ’pause’ in negotiations of his proposed changes to electoral registration announced by the Labour Government in December legislation. [79424] 2008 declined to resubmit its tender in June 2011. Mr Harper: As of 7 November 2011 the Government Mr Ivan Lewis: To ask the Secretary of State for have not received any requests from international observers International Development what the tendering process to monitor the implementation of individual electoral was for awarding the design, build and operate contract registration. for the new airport on St Helena. [79457] Chris Ruane: To ask the Deputy Prime Minister if he Mr Duncan: Following a market testing exercise will consider extending the powers of Scottish and conducted in October 2010, DFID reissued the Invitation Welsh chief electoral officers to enable then to conduct to Tender to two bidders, Impregilo SpA and Basil registration initiatives similar to those undertaken in Read (Pty) Limited. Both these companies had submitted Northern Ireland. [79425] 283W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 284W

Mr Harper: Scotland and Wales do not have chief EDUCATION electoral officers. However, pursuant to the answer I Adam Werritty gave on 11 October 2011, Official Report, column 342W, the Government are considering a number of ways to Derek Twigg: To ask the Secretary of State for increase voter registration rates in the context of the Education on how many occasions in an official move from household to individual electoral registration. capacity he has met Mr Adam Werritty since May This includes conducting research with groups who 2010. [76367] have traditionally been under-registered to explore ways in which they may be encouraged to register. Tim Loughton [holding answer 24 October 2011]: The Secretary of State for Education, my right hon. Chris Ruane: To ask the Deputy Prime Minister Friend the Member for Surrey Heath (Michael Gove), pursuant to the answer of 20 October 2011, Official has not met with Adam Werritty in an official capacity Report, column 1100W, on electoral registration, what since May 2010. assessment he has made of the capacity for the results Adoption of dataset pilot tests to inform any new legislation on electoral registration within the time available. [79426] Meg Munn: To ask the Secretary of State for Education how many adoptive placements broke down Mr Harper: The data matching pilots will conclude in England in each of the last five years. [78555] this month and external evaluation will be completed by the Electoral Commission in March 2012. The results Tim Loughton: Information on the number of adoptions of these pilots will thereafter be available to Parliament which breakdown following the making of an adoption to inform its deliberations on individual electoral order is not collected centrally. registration. Information is available on the outcomes of children placed for adoption at 31 March 2007. This is published Chris Ruane: To ask the Deputy Prime Minister as part of the Adoption and Special Guardianship data pursuant to the answer of 20 October 2011, Official pack, and shows that 5% of children placed for adoption Report, columns 1100-1W, on electoral registration, at 31 March 2007 had not been adopted three years how many prosecutions there were for not completing later. This includes 3% of children who remained as an electoral registration form between 1997 and 2007. placed for adoption at 31 March 2010. The Adoption [79484] and Special Guardianship data pack can be found at: http://www.education.gov.uk/childrenandyoungpeople/ Mr Harper: The Government do not hold this families/adoption/a0076713/datapack information. The Electoral Commission does not hold To produce this information for years other than data on the number of prosecutions initiated as a result 2007 would incur disproportionate cost. of a failure to respond to the annual canvass between Arts: Teachers 1997 and 2007. However, they do hold data from 2008 to 2010 which can be found on the Electoral Commission’s Dan Jarvis: To ask the Secretary of State for website at: Education how many (a) art, (b) music, (c) media http://www.electoralcommission.org.uk/performance- studies and (d) drama teachers are teaching in each standards/data-collection region of England. [77945] The Electoral Commission figures show that the Mr Gibb: Information on the qualifications and number of prosecutions initiated as a result of a failure deployment of teachers in the secondary sector is collected to respond to the annual canvass since 2008 are as in the new School Workforce Census, which took place follows: in November 2010. The “School Workforce Census Statistical First Release”provides a head count of teachers Prosecutions to year groups 7-13 by subject in Table 12. 2008 183 The following table summarises the number of teachers 2009 67 of Art and Design, Music, Media Studies, and Drama, 2010 144 by English region: Teachers of art and design, music, media studies, and drama in publicly funded These data are collected by voluntary survey of electoral secondary schools (head count) to year groups 7-13 in 2010, by region year: registration officers (EROs). The Electoral Commission November 2010—coverage: England does not have the power to collect this information and Total head count1 (rounded to nearest 10) it is therefore not compulsory for EROs to complete the Art and Media form. Region Design Music Studies Drama North-east 550 310 280 380 Lobbying South-west 1,470 810 800 1,210 North-west 1,770 1,010 810 . 1,540 Yorkshire 1,140 590 580 900 Julian Sturdy: To ask the Deputy Prime Minister and the what recent progress he has made on establishing a Humber statutory register of lobbyists. [79631] East 1,030 590 540 880 midlands West 1,430 860 650 1,200 Mr Harper: The Government will publish a consultation midlands paper on the introduction of a statutory register of East of 1,440 870 800 1,320 lobbyists this month. England 285W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 286W

Teachers of art and design, music, media studies, and drama in publicly funded Tim Loughton: The Department for Education has a secondary schools (head count) to year groups 7-13 in 2010, by region year: November 2010—coverage: England joint business agreement with the Defence Vetting Services, Total head count1 (rounded to nearest 10) National Security Vetting (DBS NSV), part of the Art and Media MOD (formerly the Defence Vetting Agency—DVA) Region Design Music Studies Drama for undertaking security vetting at (a) counter terrorist check, (b) security check and (c) developed vetting Inner 630 350 370 480 London level. Outer 1,260 710 780 1,020 Education Maintenance Allowance London South-east 2,510 1,420 1,410 2,130 Nic Dakin: To ask the Secretary of State for Total 13,230 7,520 7,020 11,060 Education what mechanisms he has put in place to 1 Teachers are counted once against each subject that they are teaching. Head monitor and evaluate the effect of ending education counts are used, so a teacher teaching music and drama would be counted once in each. maintenance allowance on the (a) recruitment, (b) Note: attendance levels, (c) retention and (d) achievement of Figures are based on over 158,000 secondary level teachers (66% of the students post-16. [76069] secondary workforce) submitting curriculum information, and weighted to provide national estimates of the number of secondary level teachers by subject. Mr Gibb [holding answer 21 October 2011]: The Source: Department for Education is committed to monitoring School Workforce Census the effects of the new arrangements for 16-19 financial support through the commissioning of an independent Departmental Data Protection evaluation of the impact of the new arrangements. This will help us to find out whether the fund is meeting the Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for needs of young people, particularly those who are Education how many official ministerial papers were disproportionately likely not to participate post-16; and recorded as not returned to his Department or to assess the delivery of the policy. otherwise unaccounted for in each month since May 2010; and if he will make a statement. [76811] Education Maintenance Allowance: Birmingham Tim Loughton [holding answer 26 October 2011]: Shabana Mahmood: To ask the Secretary of State for The Department’s Cabinet documents officer has robust Education what assessment he has made of the effect systems in place to ensure compliance with Cabinet of the removal of educational maintenance allowance Office guidance on handling papers. No ministerial on residents of Birmingham Ladywood constituency papers have been recorded as not returned or unaccounted aged 16 to 17 years. [76336] for since May 2010. Mr Gibb: All local authorities must ensure that there Departmental Pay are sufficient further education and training opportunities for every young person in the area; that young people Stephen Hammond: To ask the Secretary of State for are encouraged, enabled or assisted to participate in Education how many officials in his Department and education and training; and that participation is monitored the bodies for which he is responsible earned more than locally so that those young people who need support are (a) £65,000, (b) £95,000, (c) £140,000 and (d) clearly identified. Local authorities should also have £175,000 in the last year for which figures are available. processes in place to ensure that all 16 and 17 years olds [78054] were offered a place in education or training before the end of September this year. The Department for Education Tim Loughton: Information for the Department is monitoring young peoples’ participation both nationally representing the salary bands as at 31 March 2011 is set and locally, and will publish figures in due course. out in the following table: The Department for Education is also committed to monitoring the effects of the new arrangements for Salary band Staff numbers 16-19 financial support through an independent evaluation £65,000 - £94,999 105 of the impact of the new arrangements. This will help £95,000 - £139,999 12 us to assess whether the 16-19 Bursary Fund is meeting £140,000 - £174,999 1 the needs of young people, particularly those who are £175,000+ 1 disproportionately likely not to participate post-16, and to assess the delivery of the policy. Salary information for the Department’s arm’s length bodies is a matter for them and is not held centrally. First Aid: Curriculum Contact information for them can be found at the following link: Martin Horwood: To ask the Secretary of State for http://www.education.gov.uk/aboutdfe/ Education what consideration he has given to including departmentalinformation/transparency/b0065313/disclosure- first aid in the new national curriculum. [79211] of-scs-posts-and-salary-information Mr Gibb [holding answer 7 November 2011]: First aid Departmental Security is currently included in the non-statutory programme of study for personal, social, health and economic education Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for (PSHE) education. We are carrying out an internal Education what company or Government service is review of PSHE, which is not part of the national used to undertake security vetting at (a) counter curriculum. The purpose of this review is to identify terrorist check, (b) security check and (c) developed ways in which schools can improve the quality of teaching vetting level in his Department. [77898] of PSHE. 287W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 288W

We aim to reform the national curriculum so that it Grandparents properly reflects the body of essential knowledge in key subjects and does not absorb the overwhelming majority Mr Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for of teaching time in schools. A less prescriptive national Education what guidance his Department produces for curriculum will also give teachers greater flexibility to social workers on the role of grandparents; whether he use their professional judgement to design wider school plans to amend any such guidance; if he will place in curricula that best meet the needs of their pupils. Our the Library a copy of any such guidance; and if he will proposals for the new scope of the national curriculum make a statement. [78742] will be announced next year, following which there will be consultation before final decisions are made. Tim Loughton: The Department does not produce guidance for social workers on the role of grandparents. Free Schools In April 2011 new statutory guidance to local authorities came into force which sets out the framework for the Kevin Brennan: To ask the Secretary of State for provision of support to family and friends carers and Education (1) on what number of pupils his includes a requirement for local authorities to publicise Department bases its calculation of the funding for the support and services available locally. This statutory each free school in operation; [76177] guidance has been placed in the House Libraries. (2) how many pupils are enrolled in each free school in operation. [76178] Health Education: Nutrition

Mr Gibb [holding answer 21 October 2011]: Pupil Zac Goldsmith: To ask the Secretary of State for funding for each free school is based on the Academy Education what recent assessment he has made of the Trust’s estimate of pupil numbers at the opening date provision in schools of education on food. [78105] following the enrolment process. The Young People’s Learning Agency (YPLA) then compares each trust’s Mr Gibb: Food education (also known as “food estimate of pupil numbers for the current academic technology”), is currently part of the design and technology year against actual pupil numbers in census returns. curriculum. It is compulsory for all pupils in maintained This comparison is used to make adjustments (either primary schools, at key stages 1 and 2. Although it is additional or clawed back grant) to pupil funding in not currently a compulsory part of the secondary subsequent years if any shortfall or increase in pupil curriculum, most secondary schools in England are numbers exceeds the threshold percentage set out in the teaching practical cooking to 11 to 14-year-olds, including funding agreement. food education, at key stage 3, as it is one of two topics We estimate that over 3000 pupils have enrolled during within the design and technology curriculum that must the first intake for the 24 free schools that opened in be taught. The National Curriculum Review which is September 2011. This means that these schools are on currently under way will advise the Government as to course to reach their full capacity in the coming years. which subjects should remain in the national curriculum Further information about the number of children on and at what key stages they should feature. Our proposals roll at each school will be collected in the school census for the content of the new national curriculum will be and published in due course. published early in 2012.

Free Schools: Finance Mathematics: Science

Lisa Nandy: To ask the Secretary of State for Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for Education pursuant to the answer of 10 October 2011, Education what steps he plans to take to encourage Official Report, column 208W, when he expects to more pupils to take up mathematics and science finalise the budget allocation for free schools for subjects. [74236] 2011-12. [76947] Mr Gibb: In June 2011 the Secretary of State for Mr Gibb: The budget allocation for free schools for Education, my right hon. Friend the Member for Surrey 2011-12 will be finalised in due course. Heath (Michael Gove), announced that the Government would be spending up to £135 million over the current Grammar Schools spending review period to support the take-up of mathematics and science in schools. This funding will Gareth Johnson: To ask the Secretary of State for support incentives for graduates to train to teach Education what his policy is on the future provision of mathematics and science; high quality continuing grammar schools; and what plans he has for the future professional development for existing teachers in these number of grammar schools. [76080] subjects; and greater take-up of three separate sciences at GCSE and further mathematics at A level. In addition, Mr Gibb: Grammar schools often represent the very we have already announced that mathematics and science best in standards and attainment in our education system will be compulsory subjects within the national curriculum with a high proportion of young people going on to following the current review, and we have included them study at the most competitive universities. It is not within the new English baccalaureate. possible, under the prohibitions in the School Standards A recent survey by the National Centre for Social and Framework Act 1998 to establish any new wholly Research showed that 29% of year 9 pupils had opted selective school and the Government have no plans to to study triple science at GCSE while a further 54% had amend this legislation. opted for core and additional science. 289W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 290W

The Schools White Paper signalled the Government’s people preferred face-to-face professional career intention to provide stronger incentives such as training guidance, how he plans that access to such guidance bursaries of up to £20,000 to science graduates to will be assured under the new National Careers Service. attract high calibre recruits into teaching. [78937] Music: Education Mr Gibb: There is a range of evidence suggesting that young people like to access advice in a variety of Mr Graham Stuart: To ask the Secretary of State for ways including face-to-face, in groups or online. Schools Education with reference to his response to the Henley are best placed to know what support their pupils need. Review of Music Education, when he plans to publish The Government recognises that many young people his national plan for music education. [75396] can benefit from a face-to-face discussion of their skills, abilities and interests to help them think through Mr Gibb: We will shortly publish a National Plan for future education and career options. We will highlight Music Education, which will reform the delivery and this important issue to schools through statutory guidance funding of music education. It will ensure that all pupils in advance of the new duty to secure access to independent have the opportunity to learn an instrument, learn to careers guidance commencing in September 2012, subject sing, have opportunities to play in ensembles and have to the passage of the Education Bill. The guidance will access to musical progression routes regardless of where place a clear expectation on schools that they should they live and their family circumstances. The needs of secure face-to-face careers guidance where it is the most the pupil will be at the heart of the plan. Through it, the suitable support, particularly for young people from Government will signal their commitment to ensuring disadvantaged backgrounds. Schools may choose to that all pupils have access to high quality music education. work in partnership with providers engaged in delivering New Schools Network the National Careers Service, or with other providers, as they see fit. The National Careers Service will be Lisa Nandy: To ask the Secretary of State for required to meet a robust, high quality standard and all Education (1) if he will assess whether the condition in providers involved in the service will be expected to be the grant agreement between his Department and the accredited to the standard by April 2013. It was recently New Schools Network has been compromised; [76019] announced that this quality standard will be the revised matrix standard. The standard will assist schools in (2) what (a) meetings and (b) events organised by making well-informed decisions about which providers his Department representatives of the New Schools to work with. Network have been invited since May 2010; [76020] Teachers: Pensions (3) what bodies his Department has interviewed in connection with the grant agreement to provide Fiona Mactaggart: To ask the Secretary of State for support for the free school pre-application process; Education what assessment he has made of the [76021] potential effects of planned changes to teacher pension (4) how his Department has been providing support contributions on the proportion of teachers who opt for the free school pre-application process since 30 out of the Teachers Pension Scheme. [77624] September 2011; [76022] (5) whether his Department has provided (a) Mr Gibb: At the spending review the Office for Budget financial and (b) other support to the New Schools Responsibility estimated that some additional members, Network in addition to that provided by the grant amounting to 1% of the value of the paybill, would agreement. [76023] opt-out of all the public service schemes as a result of the proposed increase in pension contributions. Mr Gibb: As with all grants of this nature, officials A consultation on the proposed increase to considered NSN’s performance and compliance regularly. contributions for members of the Teachers’ Pension There were no breaches of the grant agreement. The Scheme in 2012-13 was recently concluded and the Department has not provided any financial or other Department is considering all responses received prior support to NSN in addition to that provided under the to the deadline. The Government are committed to terms of the grant agreement. The Department has not implementing the contributions increase in a way which provided any specific pre-application support since will protect the lower paid from the full impact of the 30 September although we are aware NSN, in its role as changes and will therefore reduce the risk of increased an independent charity, has been available to offer opt-outs from the scheme. support to free school proposers. No interviews have been carried out by the Department in connection with Sadiq Khan: To ask the Secretary of State for the recent competition to award a grant to provide Education what initiatives he plans to introduce to (a) support for the free school pre-application process. retain talented teachers and (b) encourage high-calibre Ministers and Special Advisers have met NSN on several graduates to enter the teaching profession after the occasions since May 2010; officials have met NSN introduction of his planned changes to the Teachers’ frequently. Providing information on the exact number, Pension Scheme. [78764] and type of events, and meetings could be done only at disproportionate cost. Mr Gibb: The reformed Teachers’ Pension Scheme (TPS) will remain a valuable part of the remuneration Schools: Vocational Guidance package available to teachers and will continue to play an important role in recruiting and retaining teachers. Ian Mearns: To ask the Secretary of State for The reformed scheme will be introduced from 2015 Education with reference to the conclusion of his and proposals are still under discussion with unions. summit with young people in May 2011 that young We are taking the teaching profession’s views very 291W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 292W seriously, to reach agreement on a scheme which will BA/BSc with Qualified Teacher Status course and (e) reflect the distinctive nature of the teaching profession the Teach First programme in each of the last 10 years. and the value of the work carried out by teachers. [77960] Recruitment and retention issues will be considered alongside the implementation of the reformed TPS. Mr Gibb: UCAS scores of postgraduate teacher trainees are not collected centrally. The following table shows Bob Stewart: To ask the Secretary of State for the average UCAS tariff score of first-year college-based Education if he will bring forward proposals to carry undergraduate teacher trainees from 2002/03 to 2009/10 out an independent valuation of the Teachers’ Pension inclusive. It includes both bachelor of education courses Scheme. [78765] and BA/BSc with qualified teacher status courses. Average UCAS tariff score of first-year undergraduate teacher trainees, 2002/03 Mr Gibb: The Government put valuations of the to 2009/10 public service pension schemes on hold while the Academic year Average UCAS points score consultation on the discount rate used to calculate 2002/03 238.7 contribution rates was taking place. The outcome of the 2003/04 249.1 consultation was announced in Budget 2011, but valuations 2004/05 255.1 remain on hold. Valuations are dependent on assumptions 2005/06 266.5 about the value of future costs, design of benefits and 2006/07 277.2 other factors. Many of these are currently under review 2007/08 265.0 as part of the Government’s proposed reforms of the 2008/09 283.0 public sector pension schemes. A decision on when to 2009/10 291.4 undertake the next valuation of the Teachers’ Pension Notes: Scheme will be taken in due course. 1. UCAS tariff score was used to assess candidates from 2002/03 onwards. 2. UCAS introduced the tariff score to take account of curriculum 2000. It was designed to make different qualifications comparable. It is based on a number Mr Wallace: To ask the Secretary of State for of qualifications including A/AS levels. Grade A* at A level scores 140 points; Education if he will publish a financial valuation of the grade A at A level scores 120 points; grade B scores 100 points; grade C scores teachers’ pension scheme since the last such valuation 80 points; grade D scores 60 points and grade E scores 40 points. Tariff scores cover those entrants for whom data are collected. Tariff score data are not in 2004. [78990] collected for some qualifications, including access courses, OND/ONC, HND/HNC, GCE, A/SCE, Higher, GNVQ/GSVQ, NVQ/SVQ level 3. 3. Coverage is undergraduate courses in universities and other higher education Mr Gibb: The Government put valuations of the institutions. public service pension schemes on hold while the 4. Includes both bachelor of education courses and BA/BSc with qualified consultation on the discount rate used to calculate teacher status courses as they are combined in the data source. Source: contribution rates was taking place. The outcome of the TDA’s Performance Profiles. consultation was announced in Budget 2011, but valuations remain on hold. Valuations are dependent on assumptions Damian Hinds: To ask the Secretary of State for about the value of future costs, design of benefits and Education what proportion of people starting (a) a other factors. Many of these are currently under review Postgraduate Certificate in Education course, (b) the as part of the Government’s proposed reforms of the Graduate Teacher Programme and (c) the Teach First public sector pension schemes. A decision on when to programme had previously graduated from their undertake the next valuation of the Teachers’ Pension undergraduate studies in each degree class in each of Scheme will be taken in due course. the last 10 years. [77981] Mr Gibb: The following tables show the number of Teachers: Training first-year trainees on (a) Postgraduate Certificate in Education courses, (b) the Graduate Teacher Programme Damian Hinds: To ask the Secretary of State for and (c) the Teach First programme, between 2000/01 Education what the average UCAS points score was of and 2009/10, by classification of their first degree. people starting (a) a Postgraduate Certificate in Information relating to qualifications on entry to the Education course, (b) the Graduate Teacher Graduate Teacher Programme is only available from Programme, (c) a Bachelor of Education course, (d) a 2003/04, and for Teach First from 2005/06.

(a) First-year primary and secondary trainees in their first year of mainstream initial teacher training (ITT) courses, by classification of first degree, 2000/01 to 2009/10 Total number of Degree class first-year not known, or postgraduate non-UK trainees on Academic 1st 2:1 2:2 Pass qualification Total mainstream year (percentage) (percentage) (percentage 3 (percentage) (percentage) (percentage) (percentage) ITT courses

2000/01 6 44 35 4 3 8 100 19,060 2001/02 5 45 35 4 3 8 100 20,720 2002/03 6 46 34 4 3 6 100 22,180 2003/04 7 47 34 4 3 6 100 24,640 2004/05 7 47 32 3 2 8 100 24,930 2005/06 8 48 31 3 2 8 100 24,600 2006/07 8 48 32 3 2 8 100 23,780 2007/08 7 48 30 3 2 9 100 22,810 293W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 294W

(a) First-year primary and secondary trainees in their first year of mainstream initial teacher training (ITT) courses, by classification of first degree, 2000/01 to 2009/10 Total number of Degree class first-year not known, or postgraduate non-UK trainees on Academic 1st 2:1 2:2 Pass qualification Total mainstream year (percentage) (percentage) (percentage 3 (percentage) (percentage) (percentage) (percentage) ITT courses

2008/09 8 49 30 3 2 8 100 22,700 2009/10 9 50 28 3 3 7 100 24,070 Notes: 1. Includes universities and other higher education institutions, school-centred ITT and Open University but excludes employment based routes and cases where Qualified Teacher Status was granted on assessment without a course of initial teacher training. 2. Numbers have been rounded to the nearest 10. Source: TDA’s Performance Profiles

(b) First-year trainees on the Graduate Teacher Programme (GTP), by classification of first degree,2003/04 to 2009/10 Degree class not known, or Total number of non-UK first-year Academic 1st 2:1 2:2 Pass qualification Total trainees on year (percentage) (percentage) (percentage) 3 (percentage) (percentage) (percentage) (percentage) GTP

2003/04 7 38 33 5 8 9 100 5,210 2004/05 8 38 32 5 9 8 100 5,340 2005/06 8 40 33 5 7 7 100 5,410 2006/07 8 44 31 5 6 7 100 5,240 2007/08 9 44 32 4 5 6 100 5,190 2008/09 8 45 31 4 5 7 100 5,080 2009/10 11 45 30 4 5 6 100 5,070 Notes: 1. Data for earlier years is not available. 2. Excludes cases where qualified teacher status is granted on assessment without a course of initial teacher training. 3. Numbers have been rounded to the nearest 10. Source: TDA ’s Performance Profiles

(c) First-year trainees on the Teach First programme, by classification of first degree, 2005/06 to 2009/10 Degree class not known, or Total number of non-UK first-year Academic 1st 2:1 2:2 3 Pass qualification Total trainees on Teach year (percentage) (percentage) (percentage) (percentage) (percentage) (percentage) (percentage) First programme

2005/06 25 714001100170 2006/07 18 708004100250 2007/08 25 694002100260 2008/09 22 734001100370 2009/10 29 646001100480 Notes: 1. Data for earlier years is not available. 2. Excludes cases where qualified teacher status is granted on assessment without a course of initial teacher training. 3. Numbers have been rounded to the nearest 10. Source: TDA’s Performance Profiles

BUSINESS, INNOVATION AND SKILLS assessment of the recommendations in the British Banks: Loans Chamber of Commerce report entitled, Workforce Survey—Small Businesses. [79021] Shabana Mahmood: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills what recent discussions he has had with banks and other financial institutions Mr Davey: This Department is leading the cross- on identity checks needed to take out bank loans. Government Employment Law review and is looking at [73053] all evidence about the operation of the underpinning legislative framework and burdens on business, including Mr Davey: I have held no such discussions. from the British Chambers of Commerce, other business The Joint Money Laundering Steering Group, an representative groups, trade unions and other stakeholders. industry association, produces guidance on how financial A key objective of the review is making it easier for a services firms should interpret rules on identity checks, business to take on staff. The review will also consider as set out in the UK money laundering regulations. ideas that emerge from the Red Tape Challenge aimed at facilitating the recruitment of employees by businesses. Business: Surveys Where we can make legislation easier to understand, improve efficiency and reduce unnecessary bureaucracy, Mr Binley: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, we will. Innovation and Skills whether he has made an 295W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 296W

Charities Mr Davey: This information cannot be provided for all liquidations because the costs of retrieving it are Dr Whiteford: To ask the Secretary of State for disproportionate. Business, Innovation and Skills what grants his According to the case database maintained by The Department made to charitable organisations in each Insolvency Service, there are: of the last five years. [79082] 264 compulsory liquidations where the insolvency order was made five or more years ago; Mr Davey: As the Department does not separately 64 compulsory liquidations where the insolvency order was identify charitable organisations within its supplier base made ten or more years ago; the information requested cannot be provided without 30 compulsory liquidations where the insolvency order was incurring disproportionate cost. made 15 or more years ago; three compulsory liquidations where the insolvency order was Company Accounts made 20 or more years ago where the official receiver has not applied for release as liquidator. Mrs Moon: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills if he will consider the Construction: Self-employed merits of giving Companies House a duty to investigate companies which (a) persistently file late accounts and Mr Hepburn: To ask the Secretary of State for (b) fail to file accounts; and if he will make a Business, Innovation and Skills how many people were statement. [79132] self-employed in the construction industry in (a) Jarrow constituency, (b) South Tyneside, (c) the Mr Davey: To combat persistent late filing of accounts North East and (d) the UK in each year since 1997. Parliament introduced, in addition to the existing penalties [79391] for filing accounts late, a double penalty for companies who file late in successive years; Companies House, Mr Hurd: I have been asked to reply. which is responsible for issuing late filing penalties, has The information requested falls within the responsibility issued 16,832 of these double penalties between April of the UK Statistics Authority. I have asked the authority and September this year. When companies fail to file to reply. accounts at all, Companies House contacts the company to investigate if it is still in operation; if it is not they Letter from Stephen Penneck, dated November 2011: will take action to remove the company from the register, As Director General, I have been asked to reply to your and in the financial year ending 31 March 2011 53,550 Parliamentary Question asking how many people were self-employed companies were removed for this reason. If the company in the construction industry in (a) Jarrow constituency, (b) South Tyneside, (c) the North East and (d) the UK in each year since is still required Companies House will, as a last resort, 1997. (79391) prosecute the company directors for failing to file the accounts. During the financial year ending 31 March The Office for National Statistics (ONS) compiles employment statistics for local areas from the Annual Population Survey 2011 Companies House prosecuted over 3,000 directors (APS) and its predecessor the annual Labour Force Survey (LFS) for this reason. following International Labour Organisation (ILO) definitions. As a result of these initiatives there has been a Due to small sample sizes, estimates are not available for the substantial fall in the number of penalties issued in Jarrow constituency and South Tyneside. Estimates are also not 2011. Therefore, I do not believe that Companies House available for periods 1997 to 1999 or for the UK for some periods needs further investigative powers at this time. - estimates for Great Britain have been provided as an alternative. Table 1 shows the number of people self-employed in the Company Liquidations construction industry in the available geographies for the 12 month periods ending in February for 2000 to 2004 from the LFS and for the 12 month periods ending in March for 2005 to 2011. Mr Weir: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, As with any sample survey, estimates from the APS are subject Innovation and Skills what estimate he has made of the to a margin of uncertainty. A guide to the quality of the estimates amount owed to unsecured creditors by firms in is given in the table. liquidation in each of the last three years. [79257] National and local area estimates for many labour market statistics, including employment, unemployment and claimant Mr Davey: The Insolvency Service (“The Service”) count are available on the NOMIS website at: does not collate a total figure for the amount due to http://www.nomisweb.co.uk unsecured creditors by firms in liquidation but is able to Table 1. Number of persons1 self-employed in the construction industry in each provide details as to the average amount owed in year since 2000 compulsory liquidations. Thousand For the year 2008/09, the mean level of debt owed by 12 months companies in compulsory liquidation was £584,134 and ending: North east Great Britain UK the median was £67,500. For 2009/10 the mean level of February 2000 16 622 n/a debt owed by companies in compulsory liquidation was February 2001 13 630 n/a £1,132,000 and the median was £81,000. February 2002 14 665 n/a Profiling data are not available for the period 2010/11. February 2003 18 698 n/a February 2004 18 756 787 Mr Weir: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, March 2005 20 795 828 Innovation and Skills how many liquidations which March 2006 24 805 836 commenced (a) five, (b) 10, (c) 15 and (d) 20 years or March 2007 24 830 860 more ago have not yet been finalised. [79259] March 2008 25 839 870 297W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 298W

Table 1. Number of persons1 self-employed in the construction industry in each Mr Davey: The information requested covering the year since 2000 period January 2010 until June 2011 is published on the Thousand Ministry of Justice website 12 months ending: North east Great Britain UK http://www.justice.gov.uk/publications/statistics-and-data/foi/ implementation-editions.htm March 2009 24 815 845 (see full statistical data reports) March 2010 19 780 810 March 20112 **21 *767 *794 Under the Official Statistics Code of Practice, we n/a = Data not available. cannot release statistics for a time period prior to their 1 Persons aged 16 and over. appearance in a regular statistical report. Statistics for 2 Coefficients of Variation have been calculated for the latest period as an indication of the quality of the estimates. See Guide to Quality below. July 2011 onwards will be published in due course. Guide to Quality: The Coefficient of Variation (CV) indicates the quality of an estimate, the Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for smaller the CV value the higher the quality. The true value is likely to lie within +/- twice the CV—for example, for an estimate of 200 with a CV of 5 Business, Innovation and Skills which Minister in his per cent. we would expect the population total to be within the range 180-220 Department is responsible for determining whether Key: exemptions to the Freedom of Information Act 2000 * 0 = CV<5%—Statistical Robustness: Estimates are considered precise **5=CV<10%—Statistical Robustness: Estimates are considered reasonably should apply to responses to requests for information precise under the Act; and which other Minister is responsible *** 10 = CV <20%—Statistical Robustness: Estimates are considered for making such determinations should the subject acceptable **** CV ? 20%—Statistical Robustness: Estimates are considered too matter of the request fall within the ministerial unreliable for practical purposes responsibilities of the Minister with lead responsibility. CV = Coefficient of Variation [78896] Source: Annual Population Survey and Annual Labour Force Survey Mr Davey: Departmental officials would normally determine whether exemptions to the Freedom of Departmental Freedom of Information Information Act 2000 should apply to responses to requests for information under the Act. Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for However, the exemption under section 36 (prejudice Business, Innovation and Skills how many requests to the effective conduct of public affairs) can only apply under the Freedom of Information Act 2000 his if it is the reasonable opinion of a qualified person (QP) Department has received in each month since May that the exemption applies. In relation to information 2010; how many responses given in each such month held by government, the qualified person must be a disclosed (a) the full information requested, (b) part Minister or, if held by a non-ministerial department, of the information requested, with some information the persons in charge of that department (for example, withheld under exemptions in the Act and (c) none of the chief executive). the information requested; and in respect of how many requests received in each such month (i) (A) The qualified persons opinion in BIS is obtained via substantive and (B) holding responses were issued a submission to the relevant Minister. This would normally within 20 working days of the date of receipt, (ii) no be the Minister responsible for the subject matter. The substantive response was issued within 40 working days submission sets out details of the request and the arguments of the date of receipt and (iii) no substantive response for and against disclosure. has yet been issued. [78894] Departmental Procurement Mr Davey: The information requested covering the period May 2010 until June 2011 is published on The Owen Smith: To ask the Secretary of State for Ministry of Justice website Business, Innovation and Skills what methodology (a) http://www.justice.gov.uk/publications/statistics-and-data/foi/ his Department and (b) the non-departmental public implementation-editions.htm bodies for which he is responsible used to estimate (see full statistical data reports). This information is not savings to the public purse made in respect of its available on a monthly basis. procurement and purchasing since May 2010. [69272] Information where no substantive response issued within 40 working days is not separately identified. Mr Davey: The Chief Secretary to the Treasury, the right hon. Member for Inverness, Nairn, Badenoch and Under the Official Statistics Code of Practice, we Strathspey (Danny Alexander), said in response to my cannot release statistics for a time period prior to their hon. Friend the Member for Southport (John Pugh), on appearance in a regular statistical report. Statistics for 15 November 2010, Official Report, columns 615-6W, July 2011 onwards will be published in due course. that the Government have announced a more specific and innovative approach to efficiency and reform across Jon Trickett: To ask the Secretary of State for the public sector, including: Business, Innovation and Skills in respect of how a reduction in administration budgets of 34% across the whole many responses to requests for information received of Whitehall and its arm’s length bodies saving £5.9 billion a year by his Department under the Freedom of by 2014-15; Information Act 2000 the reason of (a) commercially radically reducing the number of arm’s length bodies across sensitive information, (b) information not held, (c) Government; and information too costly to provide and (d) vexatious or the Efficiency and Reform Group’s tough new efficiency regime repeated requests has been given in response since which will drive savings in procurement, major projects and estate January 2010. [78895] management; 299W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 300W and that, in result, Departments would no longer be by Government auditors who found the benefits assertions required to report against the previous Government’s to be fairly calculated and presented. efficiency target. These savings are borne out in Department accounts. In August 2011, the Minister for the Cabinet Office The table on page 79 of the Annual Report and Accounts and Paymaster General, my right hon. Friend the Member 2010-11 (HC1001) reports that non-pay Gross for Horsham (Mr Maude), announced that the Efficiency Administration Costs for BIS reduced from £187 million and Reform Group’s new measures had saved £3.75 billion in 2009-10 to £140 million in 2010-11. Figures in this over 2010/11. report are prepared in accordance with HM Treasury’s Financial Reporting Manual for central Government This impact was assessed using methodologies in the Departments and associated Treasury resource accounting table. The assessment has been independently verified and budgeting guidance.

Table—Activity and Calculation Method Area Activity description Evidence Base/Calculation

Consulting Government put in place a moratorium on new consulting Savings are calculated by subtracting total departmental spend, and extensions to existing contracts. reported spend on consultancy for 2010/11 from total departmental reported spend on consultancy for 2009/10. Where spend was considered operationally critical (for To reduce the risk of costs shifting between categories, we also example, where it might put at risk critical services) an monitored expenditure on other Professional Services exception process existed for Department Ministers to sign categories, including contingent labour. off expenditure over £20,000.

Crown Commercial Government has renegotiated deals with some of the The method of calculation varies according to the initiative that largest suppliers to Government. yields the saving, but was based on cash releasing savings against a baseline of what would have otherwise been spent. This was often price savings against the previous price paid. Savings agreed with suppliers are recorded in Memoranda of Understanding as guaranteed-in-year or conditional-in-year savings. Realised savings were subsequently tracked back to departmental verification of supplier progress reports.

Contingent Labour Government have significantly cut the number of Savings are calculated by subtracting total departmental temporary staff. reported spend on contingent labour for 2010/11 from total departmental reported spend on contingent labour for 2009/10.

Communications Government froze all new marketing spend unless it is an Calculations compare departmental spend on marketing and operational necessity. Where spend was proposed. advertising through COI for 2010/11 with that for 2009/10. Ministerial sign-off was required for £20,000 or above.

Centralising Procurement Government have started to centralise spend on common For each initiative, calculations are performed using individual goods and services to drive down prices. benefit methodologies that set out how savings will be calculated against an 2009/10 price baseline. These savings derive from the 10 categories of expenditure Evidence is management information provided by suppliers. targeted for centralisation, and relate to price savings through increased aggregation.

ICT We implemented: Calculations are based on departmental reports of spend that has not proceeded. (a) a moratorium on all new ICT spend above £1 million; Spend that has not gone ahead in 2010/11 is recorded, as a and result of stopping or reducing spend. (b) a review of all on-going ICT commitments. Further, sustainable savings are targeted through the Government ICT strategy. Departments also reported those projects that were closed before undergoing the review.

Major Projects We reviewed the Government’s biggest projects to see where HMT have provided assurance that the relevant amounts were 2010/11 costs could practically be reduced within removed from departmental budgets following the Major contractual constraints, or wasteful projects stopped Projects related negotiations. altogether. We have halted or curtailed spend on four projects: 14-19 Reform—£60 million Identity Cards—£50 million Highways Agency Projects—£54 million Whole Farm—£5 million We have redacted £22 million of potential double counting from these figures, that arises between this work and our supplier renegotiation work stream. £14.9 million arises from the Home Office National Identity Cards and £6.7 million from DEFRA Whole Farm. 301W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 302W

Table—Activity and Calculation Method Area Activity description Evidence Base/Calculation

Property We put in place national property controls such that Calculations are property by property based on the amount signature of new property leases or lease extensions were Departments have reported saved through the Government’s approved centrally. property database by non-renewal of property leases at lease breaks or upon lease expiry. It has not always been possible to net off all costs associated with vacating buildings. However, we have also not claimed savings in respect of revenue from property disposals.

Departmental Public Expenditure a freeze on all external recruitment—including secondments—into the civil service. Nicholas Soames: To ask the Secretary of State for Since then, I have exceptionally agreed to the secondment Business, Innovation and Skills what steps he is taking into BIS of two individuals on very short term secondments to deliver the efficiency gains required by HM Treasury. and four individuals on medium term arrangements. I [77042] have done this in order to provide the Department with professional and financial expertise necessary to conduct Mr Davey [holding answer 27 October 2011]: The the essential business of the Department and which did 2010 spending review committed the Department to a not already exist in sufficient quantity within the civil 25% real-terms reduction in our budgets by 2014-15 to service. make our contribution to the Government’s deficit reduction targets—a challenge BIS is already meeting Departmental Travel through significant reductions in staff and the streamlining of our partner organisations. Luciana Berger: To ask the Secretary of State for During 2010-11 BIS and its partner organisations Business, Innovation and Skills how much his implemented the spending controls established by the Department has spent on first class travel by (a) air, Cabinet Office and Treasury in May 2010. These included (b) boat and (c) train since May 2010. [75522] tight controls over pay and recruitment, advertising and marketing spend, consultancy, ICT, estates and Mr Davey: Since May 2010 to the end of September procurement. In particular the Department: 2011, BIS (excluding UKTI and other Agencies) has delivered £836 million of in-year savings as a contribution to spent the following amounts on first class travel: the Emergency Budget announcement in June; undertook work on public bodies reform—in particular the £ transition of responsibilities from the regional development agencies Air 0 (RDAs) to successor bodies; Boat 0 implemented new controls on marketing and consultancy spending, Train 107,330 and a freeze on public sector pay in line with Cabinet Office guidance; Spend on first class travel continues to fall in line with significantly reduced the administration budget for the Department, the Department’s commitment to sustainable travel and including partner organisations, with an 11% reduction in 2010-11; as part of our cost reduction programme. As a comparison reduced the number of staff within the core Department by the data on first class travel for the last three financial 576 during 2010-11; and years set out in the following table: as our Annual Report and Resource Accounts of 2010-11 show, staff costs were £12.7 million lower in 2010-11 than 2009-10 £ and other administration costs were £47.5 million lower in 2010-11 than 2009-10. Air Cabinet Office guidance for the pay freeze was that 2009/10 143,479 there should be no pay increases for staff earning more 2010/11 0 than £21,000. The exception to this was cases where 2011/121 0 Departments had any legally-binding contractual commitments. BIS has been unable to create a single Boat pay system as a result of the freeze and the pay arrangements of the legacy Departments apply. Staff No spend recorded — on former BERR terms have a contractual pay arrangement and so received an award during the pay freeze. Staff on Rail former DIUS terms did not. 2009/10 387,949 2010/11 157,964 Departmental Secondment 2011/121 20,372 1 To end September 2011. Mr Iain Wright: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills what senior Departmental Work Experience representatives of the business sector have been seconded to work in his Department in the last Luciana Berger: To ask the Secretary of State for 18 months. [75205] Business, Innovation and Skills how many unpaid and expenses-only internships (a) his Department and (b) Mr Davey: Eighteen months ago the Minister for the each public body for which he is responsible employed Cabinet Office and Paymaster General, my right hon. in the last 12 months for which figures are available. Friend the Member for Horsham (Mr Maude), introduced [78368] 303W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 304W

Mr Davey: In the last 12 months the Department for Mr Prisk [holding answer 7 November 2011]: Para- Business, Innovation and Skills has not offered any phenylenediamine has been assessed several times over unpaid or expenses-only internships. the last few years as part of the European Commission’s Information on non-departmental public bodies hair dye strategy. (NDPB’s) are not held centrally and will incur Insolvency disproportionate costs. I have approached Departments and agencies and they will respond to the hon. Member Toby Perkins: To ask the Secretary of State for directly. Business, Innovation and Skills how many businesses Employment Tribunals: Reform (a) were liquidated and (b) went into administration in each month since April 2011. [78685] Elizabeth Truss: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr Davey: Statistics on the number of (a) liquidations Business, Innovation and Skills what progress his and (b) administrations in England and Wales and Department has made on reform of employment Scotland in each month from April to September 2011 tribunals; and if he will make a statement. [78953] are provided in Table 1 as follows. Official Statistics for Mr Davey: Earlier this year, the Government launched Northern Ireland on a monthly basis are not available; the ‘Resolving Workplace Disputes’ consultation, a figures for October 2011 are not yet available. significant step in the employment law review. This Table 1: Liquidations and administrations in England and Wales and Scotland1 consultation sought views on measures to encourage England and Wales Scotland the early resolution of disputes and ensure that, where Number of Number of Number of Number of 2 2 parties do need to come to an employment tribunal, the 2011 liquidations administrations liquidations administrations process is as swift, user friendly and effective as possible. April 1,187 219 86 21 The Chancellor of the Exchequer, my right hon. Friend May 1,542 214 128 19 the Member for Tatton (Mr Osborne), has already June 1,547 262 134 21 confirmed the Government’s intention to proceed with July 1,582 256 90 16 one of these measures; to extend the qualifying period August 1,283 235 124 19 for unfair dismissal claims from one to two years and September 1,275 182 106 17 we will be publishing our Government response in the 1 Source—Insolvency Service and Companies House. coming weeks, setting out other measures that we are 2 Compulsory liquidations and creditors’ voluntary liquidations. intending to take forward, to deliver reform across the Mr Liddell-Grainger: To ask the Secretary of State employment tribunal system. for Business, Innovation and Skills what assessment he Farepak has made of the merits of amending section 233 of the Insolvency Act to prevent suppliers demanding Mr Weir: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, payments upon insolvency where such payments make Innovation and Skills when he expects that the company rescue harder or reduce dividends to liquidation of Farepak will conclude. [79260] creditors. [79090]

Mr Davey: On 19 October 2011 the joint liquidators Mr Davey: The Government have previously announced of Farepak issued reports to both creditors and agents that we would consider the case for updating section on the progress of the liquidation. These reports refer 233 of the Insolvency Act 1986 and the wider issue of to ongoing work being undertaken towards bringing termination clauses. We are aware of the problems that legal proceedings against third parties with the objective can be caused for those seeking to rescue a struggling of securing more money for creditors. Given the nature company by such clauses. We are currently looking into of the intended action I understand that it is not possible the merits of any change, and have been discussing this to provide an estimate on when the liquidation will be with interested parties. concluded. Mr Weir: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills if he will bring forward Mr Weir: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, proposals to set a cap on the fees charged by insolvency Innovation and Skills what information his practitioners. [79253] Department holds on whether the claims management team for Farepak (in liquidation) have been informed Mr Davey: I confirm that I have no plans to bring of the death of any (a) agent and (b) customers of forward proposals to cap the fees charged by insolvency that firm. [79261] practitioners, which are properly a matter for the creditors or the court. Mr Davey: This Department does not hold this information. The Liquidators’ claims management team However, the Government believe that it is important are responsible for updating any change of details of for creditors and others affected by insolvency to have agents or customers, including where there is notification confidence that the fees charged by insolvency practitioners of death. are fair. For this reason, earlier this year the Government issued a consultation on a set of reforms, which included Hair Dyes: Chemicals a proposal to introduce a non-court based mechanism for creditors to complain about the level of fees charged Tony Lloyd: To ask the Secretary of State for by insolvency practitioners. Business, Innovation and Skills what recent assessment This Department is currently reviewing responses to he has made of the safety of para-phenylenediamine in the consultation, and I hope to be in a position to make hair dye products. [79045] an announcement on the way forward shortly. 305W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 306W

Mr Weir: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, although this may be extended with the permission of Innovation and Skills what steps his Department is the court or by the agreement of creditors. taking to encourage greater transparency in the Liquidations do not have a statutory time limit, but insolvency sector. [79254] research conducted by the Insolvency Service suggests that the average length of a liquidation is around two to Mr Davey: Earlier this year the Government issued a 2.5 years. consultation on a set of reforms to the regulation of insolvency practitioners, which included proposals to The Enterprise Act 2002 also introduced a statutory improve the transparency, consistency and accountability 12-month time limit for bankruptcy, and provides for of the insolvency regulatory regime. earlier discharge in some cases. This Department is currently reviewing responses to the consultation, and I hope to be in a position to make Insolvency Service: Finance an announcement on the way forward shortly. Toby Perkins: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr Weir: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, Business, Innovation and Skills what the budget for the Innovation and Skills what the average time taken to Insolvency Service has been in each financial year since settle an insolvency case was in the latest period for 2000-01. [78684] which figures are available. [79255] Mr Davey: Budget information for The Insolvency Mr Davey: The Insolvency Service does not record Service, an executive agency of the Department for this information. Business, Innovation and Skills, is published in the Following the introduction of the Enterprise Act 2002, agency’s annual corporate plan and is available from administration has a statutory time limit of 12 months, 2004-05 as follows:

£ million 2004-05 2005-06 2006-07 2007-08 2008-09 2009-10 2010-11 2011-12

Official Receiver administration 55.8 68.0 72.5 122.4 135.0 155.1 130.2 93.2 DebtReliefOrders —————1.91.82.5 Enforcement (net) 34,3 38.1 38.1 42.2 39.4 40.5 39.8 35.3 Redundancy Payments — 8.7 8.7 8.7 8.2 11.8 9.8 9.2 Estate Accounting 2.7 2.9 2.8 2.9 2.9 2.9 2.6 2.0 Policy 1.6 2.2 2.2 2.0 2.0 2.0 1.9 1.6 Insolvency Practitioner Regulation 0.6 0.6 0.6 0.9 0.9 1.4 1.4 1.5 Other 0.5 0.5 0.5 2.5 2.5 1.7 1.6 1.7 Total 95.5 121.0 125.4 181.5 190.9 217.3 189.1 146.5

Records are not available prior to 2004. The latest The following information is available regarding the agency corporate plan can be viewed at: number of complaints recorded in the last five years www.bis.gov.uk/insolvency/about-us/strategy-and-planning including those relating specifically to administration:

Total complaints Administration

Insolvency: Complaints 2006 468 81 2007 550 89 2008 618 181 Mr Weir: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, 2009 828 197 Innovation and Skills how many complaints have been 2010 531 129 received by the Insolvency Service in respect of insolvency practitioners and administrators in each of the last five years. [79258] Legal Opinion Mr Davey: The vast majority of insolvency practitioners are regulated by one of seven recognised professional Stephen Hammond: To ask the Secretary of State for bodies. Any complaint about the conduct of an insolvency Business, Innovation and Skills how many officials in practitioner is directed towards and dealt with by the his Department were working in its legal section in appropriate recognised professional body. June 2011; and how many staff were working in the Information regarding the number of complaints legal departments of his Department’s agencies and received by the recognised professional bodies is contained non-departmental bodies. [76393] within the Insolvency Service’s Annual Review of Insolvency Practitioner Regulation, which also includes Mr Davey: The Department for Business, Innovation complaints made directly to the Secretary of State for and Skills had 170 staff working in its legal section at Business, Innovation and Skills, the right hon. Member the end of June 2011. Companies House had seven staff for Twickenham (Vince Cable), in relation to the small working in its legal department. There were 57 staff number of insolvency practitioners authorised directly working in the legal departments of our non-departmental by him. public bodies. 307W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 308W

Staff in these Departments cover a number of roles Ministerial Policy Advisers including lawyers, paralegals, investigation offices and administrative support. Chi Onwurah: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills what arrangements are Stephen Hammond: To ask the Secretary of State for in place to ensure regional balance in his Department’s Business, Innovation and Skills how much his expert and adviser groups. [75801] Department spent on (a) legal advice and (b) instructing counsel in (i) 2007, (ii) 2009, (iii) 2010 and Mr Prisk: There are no arrangements in place to (iv) the first six months of 2011; how many times (A) ensure regional balance. his Department was taken to court and (B) a decision taken by his Department was subject to a judicial Appointments to these groups are made following review; and what the outcome was of each such (1) case processes which are fair, open and transparent, command public confidence and result in appointments which are and (2) review. [76396] made on merit. Mr Davey: The Department for Business, Innovation Where there is a specific requirement for membership and Skills was set up in 2009. The Department accesses of certain groups to represent regions this will be legal advice from its own Departmental lawyers as well implicit in the job specification when an appointment is as from external counsel and solicitors, Treasury Solicitors advertised. and parliamentary counsel. Details of expenditure on internal and external legal advice for the Department Regional Growth Fund since 2009 are set out as follows: Derek Twigg: To ask the Secretary of State for Million Business, Innovation and Skills when Stobart Group 2009/10 2010/11 2011/121 and Prologic will receive the funding allocated from round one of the Regional Growth Fund. [78948] Legal advice 6.9 7.6 2.9 external Mr Prisk: The Stobart Group and Prologis have told Instructing 0.5 0.8 0.4 the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills counsel2 that, subject to satisfactory completion of confirmatory Legal advice 5.0 4.7 2.1 due diligence, they intend to start to draw down their internal Regional Growth Fund allocations in January 2012. Total2 11.9 12.3 5.0 1 Data for this year covers the six month period April to September Mr Marsden: To ask the Secretary of State for 2011 Business, Innovation and Skills (1) whether any of the 2 Total = External + Internal advice. Counsel costs are within external advice figures. recommended bids put forward for the second round of the Regional Growth Fund by the Independent The cost for counsel only includes the payments Advisory Panel were amended by the Ministerial made directly by the Department. Information about Group chaired by the Deputy Prime Minister; [79280] the cost of counsel instructed by Treasury Solicitors on behalf of the Department could be obtained only at (2) whether any of the recommended bids put disproportionate cost. forward for the second round of the Regional Growth Fund by its Independent Advisory Panel were rejected The Department does not keep central records of the by the Ministerial Group chaired by the Deputy Prime number of times it has been taken to court. The Department Minister. [79284] only keeps a record of open judicial review cases and there are currently 35. Mr Prisk [holding answer 7 November 2011]: The Independent Advisory Panel’s job is to advise Ministers Manufactured Goods: Origin Marking on which bids to the Regional Growth Fund to support. Final decisions on which bids to support rest with the Mark Menzies: To ask the Secretary of State for Ministerial Group chaired by the Deputy Prime Minister. Business, Innovation and Skills with reference to the launch of his Make it in Britain campaign, whether he Jonathan Reynolds: To ask the Secretary of State for plans to take steps to ensure that British-manufactured Business, Innovation and Skills how much has been products are labelled as made in Britain. [79100] spent on due diligence in respect of bids submitted to the Regional Growth Fund in each region. [79470] Mr Prisk: There are no plans for the ‘Make it in Great Britain’ campaign to cover the labelling of British- Mr Prisk: It is for successful bidders to pay the cost manufactured products. of due diligence. The campaign will focus on transforming outdated opinions of UK manufacturing—highlighting Britain’s Supermarkets: Competition outstanding manufacturing companies, large and small, and our world-beating companies’ excellent reputation Ms Ritchie: To ask the Secretary of State for for innovation. Business, Innovation and Skills what progress has been It is all part of the Government’s drive to made towards the establishment of the Groceries Code encourage long-term economic growth and rebalance Adjudicator; and what proposals he has for the powers the economy. of the post holder. [77577] 309W Written Answers8 NOVEMBER 2011 Written Answers 310W

Mr Davey: The draft Groceries Code Adjudicator countries, including by providing duty-free, quota-free Bill has undergone pre-legislative scrutiny, and Parliament access for least developed country exports. published the Government’s response to the Business, The UK is supporting the poorest countries to achieve Innovation and Skills (BIS) Select Committee report on more balanced outcomes in international trade negotiations 15 October 2011. We now aim to introduce a Groceries through the Trade Advocacy Fund. This major initiative Code Adjudicator Bill as soon as parliamentary time will provide high-quality legal and technical advice, allows. training and logistical support, and will help the poorest The powers proposed for the adjudicator are set out countries secure development outcomes in the Doha in the draft Bill. talks. Trade: Developing Countries WOMEN AND EQUALITIES Rushanara Ali: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills what steps he is taking Departmental Consultants to (a) ensure that the Doha Round talks are completed and (b) secure an agreement on trade for developing Mr Thomas: To ask the Minister for Women and countries by the end of 2012 . [78821] Equalities how many full-time equivalent staff are employed on consultancy contracts in the Government Mr Davey: While it is now clear that the full Doha Equalities Office; and if she will make a statement. Development Round will not be concluded in 2011, the [77503] Government are continuing to press for the best possible outcome at the 8th World Trade Organisation (WTO) Lynne Featherstone: As of 1 April 2011, the Government ministerial conference in December this year. We are Equalities Office has been part of the Home Office and working closely with the European Commission, EU is no longer a separate Government Department. The member states and other WTO members to ensure that information requested was provided by the Minister for there is a clear way forward for the Doha Round in 2012 Immigration, my hon. Friend the Member for Ashford which delivers trade liberalisation, strengthens the (Damian Green). multilateral system and advances the interests of poor E-mail countries. The Government have always been clear that Jack Dromey: To ask the Minister for Women and development is a key priority of the Doha Round, and Equalities whether any (a) Ministers, (b) officials and we have consistently emphasised this where possible. (c) special advisers in the Government Equalities We are disappointed that the proposed “early harvest” Office use private e-mail accounts for the conduct of package focusing on issues for the least developed countries government business. [73200] failed earlier this year, but we will continue to press for the best outcome possible for poor countries, including Lynne Featherstone: The Ministerial Code, the Code at the forthcoming WTO ministerial. We also continue of Conduct for Special Advisers, and the Civil Service to press for agreement for countries to live up to Code set out how Ministers, officials and special advisers commitments made to advance the interests of poor should conduct government business.

ORAL ANSWERS

Tuesday 8 November 2011

Col. No. Col. No. JUSTICE ...... 143 JUSTICE—continued Corporate Manslaughter ...... 157 Probation Officers...... 151 Freedom of Information...... 145 Rehabilitation ...... 154 Indeterminate Sentences ...... 153 Reoffending ...... 147 Knife Crime...... 152 Reoffending ...... 150 Lay Magistrates ...... 155 Restorative Justice...... 156 Legal Aid (Social Welfare) ...... 143 Topical Questions ...... 158 Overseas Terrorism ...... 157 Victim Support ...... 146 Payment by Results...... 153 Young Offender Institutions ...... 145 Prison Population ...... 149 WRITTEN MINISTERIAL STATEMENTS

Tuesday 8 November 2011

Col. No. Col. No. DEFENCE ...... 11WS HOME DEPARTMENT ...... 14WS Pingat Jasa Malaysia...... 11WS Deportation with Assurances...... 14WS

ENERGY AND CLIMATE CHANGE...... 11WS Statutory Security of Supply Report...... 11WS TRANSPORT...... 13WS ENVIRONMENT, FOOD AND RURAL AFFAIRS...... 12WS High-speed Rail ...... 13WS Single Payment Scheme...... 12WS Triennial Review of NDPBs (HS2 Ltd)...... 13WS WRITTEN ANSWERS

Tuesday 8 November 2011

Col. No. Col. No. ATTORNEY-GENERAL ...... 192W COMMUNITIES AND LOCAL GOVERNMENT ...... 217W Convictions: Industrial Health and Safety ...... 192W Affordable Housing: Disability ...... 217W Departmental Freedom of Information ...... 192W Departmental Procurement...... 218W Housing: Visual Impairment...... 219W BUSINESS, INNOVATION AND SKILLS ...... 293W Integration Strategy ...... 217W Banks: Loans...... 293W Non-domestic Rates: Empty Property ...... 220W Business: Surveys ...... 293W Charities ...... 295W Company Accounts ...... 295W CULTURE, MEDIA AND SPORT...... 193W Company Liquidations ...... 295W Olympic Games 2012: Newspaper Press...... 193W Construction: Self-employed...... 296W Television: Licensing...... 193W Departmental Freedom of Information ...... 297W Departmental Procurement...... 298W DEFENCE ...... 227W Departmental Public Expenditure...... 301W Adam Werritty...... 227W Departmental Secondment ...... 301W Aircraft Carriers ...... 229W Departmental Travel ...... 302W Ammunition: Storage ...... 230W Departmental Work Experience...... 302W Armed Forces ...... 230W Employment Tribunals: Reform...... 303W Armed Forces: Germany...... 230W Farepak...... 303W Armed Forces: Redundancy...... 231W Hair Dyes: Chemicals ...... 303W Armed Forces: Suicide ...... 231W Insolvency...... 304W Defence Equipment ...... 232W Insolvency: Complaints ...... 305W Defence: Finance ...... 232W Insolvency Service: Finance ...... 306W Departmental Computers ...... 232W Legal Opinion...... 306W Departmental Meetings ...... 232W Manufactured Goods: Origin Marking...... 307W Departmental Private Finance Initiative ...... 233W Ministerial Policy Advisers ...... 308W Departmental Procurement...... 233W Regional Growth Fund...... 308W Iraq: Peacekeeping Operations...... 233W Supermarkets: Competition ...... 308W Libya: Armed Conflict...... 234W Trade: Developing Countries ...... 309W Military Aircraft ...... 234W RAF Leuchars ...... 234W CABINET OFFICE ...... 271W RAF Menwith Hill ...... 235W Big Society Capital ...... 271W Rescue Services: Helicopters ...... 235W Charities ...... 271W Submarines: Decommissioning...... 235W Departmental Work Experience...... 272W Trident...... 236W ElcomSoft...... 272W Federation of Student Islamic Societies ...... 272W Principal Civil Service Pension Scheme...... 273W DEPUTY PRIME MINISTER...... 282W Skin Cancer ...... 274W Electoral Register...... 282W Social Finance ...... 273W Lobbying ...... 283W Col. No. Col. No. EDUCATION...... 284W HEALTH—continued Adam Werritty...... 284W Alcoholic Drinks: Misuse ...... 236W Adoption ...... 284W Alcoholic Drinks: Prices ...... 237W Arts: Teachers...... 284W Arthritis...... 237W Departmental Data Protection...... 285W Back Pain...... 238W Departmental Pay...... 285W Breast Cancer: Screening ...... 238W Departmental Security...... 285W Carers: Employment ...... 238W Education Maintenance Allowance ...... 286W Departmental Freedom of Information ...... 239W Education Maintenance Allowance: Birmingham...... 286W Departmental Lost Property...... 241W First Aid: Curriculum ...... 286W Departmental Official Engagements ...... 241W Free Schools ...... 287W Disability: Young People...... 241W Free Schools: Finance...... 287W Fats: Health Hazards ...... 243W Grammar Schools...... 287W General Practitioners: Finance ...... 243W Grandparents...... 288W Health...... 243W Health Education: Nutrition...... 288W Health Professions ...... 244W Mathematics: Science...... 288W Health Protection Agency...... 244W Music: Education...... 289W Hepatitis ...... 245W New Schools Network ...... 289W HIV Infection ...... 245W Schools: Vocational Guidance ...... 289W HIV Infection: Greater London...... 245W Teachers: Pensions ...... 290W Hospital Beds ...... 246W Teachers: Training...... 291W Hospitals: Eggs ...... 246W Hospitals: Waiting Lists...... 246W ENERGY AND CLIMATE CHANGE...... 263W Learning Disability ...... 247W Adam Werritty...... 263W Lighting: Health Hazards ...... 248W Carbon Emissions: Pilot Schemes ...... 263W Medical Treatments: VAT ...... 248W Combined Heat and Power: Social Rented Housing ...... 263W Musculoskeletal Disorders...... 249W Departmental Responsibilities ...... 264W NHS: Pensions...... 250W Electricity ...... 264W NHS: Private Sector...... 249W Feed-in Tariffs: Housing ...... 264W Older People: Carers...... 251W Gas Fired Power Stations...... 265W Primary Care Trusts: Per Capita Costs ...... 251W Meters...... 265W Public Health England...... 252W Oil: Safety...... 266W Skin Cancer ...... 252W Pensioners: Fuel Poverty...... 266W Social Services: Fees and Charges ...... 252W Renewable Energy: Heating ...... 267W Speech and Language Disorders: Health Services...... 253W Solar Power...... 267W St Helens and Whiston NHS Hospital Trust...... 253W Solar Power: Feed-in Tariffs...... 267W

ENVIRONMENT, FOOD AND RURAL AFFAIRS...... 220W HOME DEPARTMENT ...... 166W Adam Werritty...... 220W Animal Experiments ...... 166W Agriculture: Pay...... 220W Animal Experiments: EU Law ...... 167W Animal Welfare: Circuses...... 220W Animal Experiments: Primates...... 167W Bovine Tuberculosis: Disease Control...... 221W Anti-Semitism...... 168W Broadband...... 221W Asylum ...... 169W Common Land ...... 222W Asylum: Employment ...... 170W Departmental Billing ...... 222W Charities ...... 171W Departmental Manpower...... 222W Civil Disorder ...... 171W Departmental Security...... 222W Crime: Rural Areas ...... 171W E-mail...... 224W Criminal Records: Databases...... 172W Fisheries...... 224W Departmental Consultants...... 172W Fisheries: Quotas ...... 225W Departmental Freedom of Information ...... 173W Fisheries: Statistics...... 225W Departmental Health Insurance...... 175W Floods: Insurance ...... 226W Departmental Lost Property...... 175W Food: Prices ...... 226W Departmental Public Expenditure...... 175W Metals...... 227W Deportation: Children ...... 175W Phosphate-Based Fertilizers...... 227W Deportation: Offenders...... 176W Entry Clearances...... 177W Legal Opinion...... 177W FOREIGN AND COMMONWEALTH OFFICE...... 157W Public Sector...... 178W Adam Werritty...... 157W Riot Control Weapons ...... 179W Afghanistan: Females ...... 157W UK Border Agency...... 179W Algeria: Christianity ...... 157W UK Border Agency: Finance ...... 179W British Overseas Territories...... 158W UK Border Agency: Manpower...... 179W Departmental Freedom of Information ...... 158W Departmental Legal Opinion...... 159W Departmental Lost Property...... 160W HOUSE OF COMMONS COMMISSION...... 181W Departmental Orders and Regulations...... 160W Welsh Grand Committee: Wrexham ...... 181W Departmental Parliamentary Questions...... 161W European Union: Legislative Competence ...... 161W Iran: Baha’i Faith ...... 161W INTERNATIONAL DEVELOPMENT ...... 274W Liam Fox ...... 162W Afghanistan: Females ...... 274W Members...... 162W Afghanistan: Mortality Rates ...... 275W Middle East: Armed Conflict...... 162W Burma: Overseas Aid...... 275W Office of UK Permanent Representative to EU: Departmental Security...... 276W Manpower...... 163W Departmental Written Questions ...... 277W Sri Lanka...... 163W Developing Countries: Economic Situation ...... 277W Strategic Defence and Security Review ...... 163W Developing Countries: Teachers ...... 277W Yemen: Politics and Government ...... 164W Equatorial Guinea: Overseas Aid...... 278W Overseas Aid...... 278W HEALTH ...... 236W St Helena: Airports...... 279W Adam Werritty...... 236W St Helena: Overseas Aid ...... 282W Col. No. Col. No. JUSTICE ...... 254W TRANSPORT—continued Anti-corruption ...... 254W Rescue Services ...... 190W Census: Guernsey ...... 255W Road Signs and Markings...... 191W Charities ...... 255W Shipping: Registration ...... 191W Civil Disorder ...... 255W Civil Proceedings: Legal Costs ...... 256W TREASURY...... 181W Conditional Fee Arrangements...... 255W Bank Services...... 181W Coroners ...... 256W Departmental Freedom of Information ...... 182W Departmental Assets...... 256W Growing Places Fund...... 182W Departmental Freedom of Information ...... 257W HM Revenue and Customs: Disclosure of Information ... 183W Departmental Lost Property...... 260W Insolvency...... 183W Departmental Public Expenditure...... 260W Pay: Software...... 183W Departmental Travel ...... 260W PAYE...... 184W Extradition ...... 260W Population: Infrastructure ...... 184W Legal Aid Scheme: Prisoners...... 261W Taxation: Amusement Arcades ...... 185W Legal Opinion...... 261W VAT: Construction...... 185W Members: Correspondence ...... 262W VAT: Hotels ...... 185W Personal Injury Law...... 254W Welfare Tax Credits: Eligibility ...... 185W Prison Work...... 254W WALES...... 165W Prisoners: Foreign Nationals...... 262W Adam Werrity...... 165W Prisons: Private Sector ...... 262W Departmental Pay...... 165W Translation Services ...... 262W Departmental Security...... 166W Young Offenders: Drugs and Alcohol...... 254W WOMEN AND EQUALITIES ...... 310W NORTHERN IRELAND...... 194W Departmental Consultants...... 310W Departmental Freedom of Information ...... 194W E-mail...... 310W Departmental Pay...... 196W WORK AND PENSIONS...... 198W Departmental Regulation ...... 197W Attendance Allowance ...... 198W Legal Opinion...... 197W Carers: Grandparents ...... 199W Child Maintenance and Enforcement Commission...... 199W PRIME MINISTER ...... 270W Children: Maintenance ...... 199W Cabinet Committees: Third Sector...... 270W Construction: Jarrow ...... 201W Departmental Public Appointments ...... 271W Departmental Assets...... 201W Tony Blair ...... 271W Departmental Freedom of Information ...... 202W Departmental Legal Opinion...... 203W SCOTLAND...... 194W Departmental NDPBs ...... 205W Adam Werritty...... 194W Departmental Publications ...... 205W Charities ...... 194W Disability Allowance...... 206W Driving: Disabled...... 206W TRANSPORT...... 186W Employment and Support Allowance ...... 207W Aviation: Alcoholic Drinks ...... 186W Employment: Electronic Government...... 208W Aviation: EU Action ...... 186W Employment Schemes ...... 207W Aviation: Security ...... 186W Employment Schemes: Young People ...... 207W Aviation: USA ...... 187W Incapacity Benefits...... 209W Buses: Inspections...... 187W Income Support ...... 210W Cycling: Safety...... 187W Income Support: Lone Parents ...... 210W Electric Vehicles: Bedfordshire...... 187W Pay: Pensions ...... 210W Invalid Vehicles: Accidents...... 188W Personal Independence Payments ...... 211W Metals: Theft ...... 188W Social Security Benefits...... 211W Ports: Liverpool ...... 188W State Retirement Pensions: Carers ...... 211W Railways ...... 188W State Retirement Pensions: Public Expenditure...... 212W Railways: Fares ...... 189W Tax Credit...... 213W Railways: Finance...... 189W Universal Credit...... 213W Railways: Freight ...... 189W Winter Fuel Payments...... 214W Railways: Repairs and Maintenance ...... 190W Work Programme...... 215W Members who wish to have the Daily Report of the Debates forwarded to them should give notice at the Vote Office. The Bound Volumes will also be sent to Members who similarly express their desire to have them. No proofs of the Daily Reports can be supplied, nor can corrections be made in the Weekly Edition. Corrections which Members suggest for the Bound Volume should be clearly marked in the Daily Report, but not telephoned, and the copy containing the Corrections must be received at the Editor’s Room, House of Commons,

not later than Tuesday 15 November 2011

STRICT ADHERENCE TO THIS ARRANGEMENT GREATLY FACILITATES THE PROMPT PUBLICATION OF THE VOLUMES

Members may obtain excerpts of their Speeches from the Official Report (within one month from the date of publication), on application to the Stationery Office, c/o the Editor of the Official Report, House of Commons, from whom the terms and conditions of reprinting may be ascertained. Application forms are available at the Vote Office.

PRICES AND SUBSCRIPTION RATES DAILY PARTS Single copies: Commons, £5; Lords, £3·50. Annual subscriptions: Commons, £865; Lords, £525. WEEKLY HANSARD Single copies: Commons, £12; Lords, £6. Annual subscriptions: Commons, £440. Lords, £225. Index: Annual subscriptions: Commons, £125; Lords, £65. LORDS VOLUME INDEX obtainable on standing order only. Details available on request. BOUND VOLUMES OF DEBATES are issued periodically during the session. Single copies: Commons, £105; Lords, £40. Standing orders will be accepted. THE INDEX to each Bound Volumeof House of Commons Debates is published separately at £9·00 and can be supplied to standing order. All prices are inclusive of postage Volume 535 Tuesday No. 221 8 November 2011

CONTENTS

Tuesday 8 November 2011

Oral Answers to Questions [Col. 143] [see index inside back page] Secretary of State for Justice

Internet Regulation (Material Inciting Gang Violence) [Col. 167] Motion for leave to bring in Bill—(Heidi Alexander)—agreed to Bill presented, and read the First time

European Budgets 2014 to 2020 [Col. 170] Motion to take note of EC document—(Mr Hoban)—agreed to

Credit Institutions and Investment Firms [Col. 196] Motion—(Mr Hoban)—agreed to

Backbench Business Transport Committee Report (High Speed Rail) [Col. 213] Motion—(Mrs Ellman)—agreed to Cost of Motor Insurance [Col. 218] Motion—(Mrs Ellman)—agreed to

Yemen [Col. 259] Debate on motion for Adjournment

Westminster Hall King George Hospital [Col. 1WH] Grammar Schools [Col. 23WH] Primary Care (Devon and the South-West) [Col. 48WH] Schools (Bradford) [Col. 55WH] Basement Developments [Col. 63WH] Debates on motion for Adjournment

Written Ministerial Statements [Col. 11WS]

Written Answers to Questions [Col. 157W] [see index inside back page]