Taylor Trial Transcript
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Case No. SCSL-2003-01-T THE PROSECUTOR OF THE SPECIAL COURT V. CHARLES GHANKAY TAYLOR THURSDAY, 4 NOVEMBER 2010 9.00 A.M. TRIAL TRIAL CHAMBER II Before the Judges: Justice Julia Sebutinde, Presiding Justice Richard Lussick Justice El Hadji Malick Sow, Alternate For Chambers: Mr Artur Appazov For the Registry: Ms Rachel Irura Mr Alhassan Fornah For the Prosecution: Ms Brenda J Hollis Mr Nicholas Koumjian Ms Kathryn Howarth Ms Maja Dimitrova For the accused Charles Ghankay Mr Terry Munyard Taylor: Mr Silas Chekera Ms Logan Hambrick Ms Kimberley Punt CHARLES TAYLOR Page 48670 4 NOVEMBER 2010 OPEN SESSION 1 Thursday, 4 November 2010 2 [Open session] 3 [The accused present] 4 [Upon commencing at 9.02 a.m.] 09:02:58 5 PRESIDING JUDGE: Good morning. We'll take appearances, 6 please. 7 MR KOUMJIAN: Good morning, Madam President. Good morning, 8 your Honours, and good morning to Defence counsel. This morning 9 for the Prosecution, Kathryn Howarth, Maja Dimitrova, an intern 09:03:24 10 with our office Jacqueline Greene, and myself, Nicholas Koumjian. 11 MR MUNYARD: Good morning, Madam President, your Honours, 12 counsel opposite. For the Defence this morning, myself, Terry 13 Munyard, Silas Chekera, Logan Hambrick and our legal assistant 14 Kimberley Punt and intern Szilvia Csevar. 09:03:54 15 PRESIDING JUDGE: Mr Witness, we're going to continue with 16 your testimony this morning and I'm required to remind you that 17 you took an oath to tell the truth and that oath is binding on 18 you today. 19 THE WITNESS: Yes. 09:04:14 20 WITNESS: DCT-102 [On former oath] 21 CROSS-EXAMINATION BY MR KOUMJIAN: [Continued] 22 Q. Good morning, Mr Kolleh. 23 A. Good morning. 24 Q. Now, Mr Kolleh, when we left off, I believe I had made a 09:04:24 25 reference to testimony about Isaac Mongor and how he trained you, 26 the trainees, at Camp Naama, the RUF trainees, and I promised to 27 give a reference. First of all, before I do that, Mr Witness, 28 you said PI. Who was PI? He was a trainer there, correct? 29 A. Yes, he was also helping to train. SCSL - TRIAL CHAMBER II CHARLES TAYLOR Page 48671 4 NOVEMBER 2010 OPEN SESSION 1 Q. And he was Liberian, correct? 2 A. Yes. 3 Q. He was an NPFL man, correct? 4 A. Yes. 09:05:13 5 Q. Okay. I'd now like to read to you from the transcript of 6 5 July this year, page 43601, and this is the testimony of 7 Issa Sesay. Mr Witness, you know who Issa Sesay is, correct? 8 A. Yes, I know Issa. 9 Q. He was asked in the middle of the page - well, I'll wait 09:05:48 10 for the transcript to come up. I don't know if I've given the 11 page number, 43601. Thank you. He was asked at line 16: 12 "Q. And who was responsible for that training? 13 A. The instructors who trained us were Rashid Mansaray, 14 Special Forces, Mohamed Tarawalli, Mike Lamin. They were 09:06:25 15 the main instructors who trained us, because the others, 16 they came in like - late - like Gonkanu, Isaac Mongor, PI, 17 they came in late. In fact, some of them were not 18 effective instructors because I can recall at one time when 19 we had lectures from Isaac Mongor as to how to attack a 09:06:50 20 town, city attack, we talked about how to capture a town. 21 The lectures that he gave that day and later Foday Sankoh 22 knew about the lectures he had given, Foday Sankoh was 23 angry with him." 24 Then he was asked about what the lecture was and he said at 09:07:13 25 the bottom of the page: 26 "A. Well, Isaac Mongor was teaching us that, look, when you 27 were dividing a town, when you were dividing a troop to 28 attack a town, when you've captured the town you will call 29 all the civilians for them to come out of their houses and SCSL - TRIAL CHAMBER II CHARLES TAYLOR Page 48672 4 NOVEMBER 2010 OPEN SESSION 1 you would assemble them." 2 First of all, let me just stop there. Mr Kolleh, was that 3 the practice when the RUF captured a town, or a village, to call 4 all the civilians out of their homes and hiding places and 09:07:45 5 assemble them in one spot? 6 A. I am not aware of other training. 7 Q. Sir, that's not my question, okay. Right now my question 8 to you is the practice of the RUF. You said you were with the 9 RUF from the invasion through disarmament. When you captured a 09:08:03 10 town or village, was it the practice to take all of the people 11 that you found there, in their houses or in their hiding places, 12 and assemble them in one spot? 13 A. Yes. 14 Q. And Mr Sesay went on to say that Isaac Mongor told them: 09:08:25 15 "You will call all the civilians for them to come out of 16 their houses, you would assemble them and you divide the group 17 into two. Kill one group. You kill everybody. And the other 18 group, they would stay with you. Those who want to train, you 19 would talk to them and others would stay in the town as 09:08:45 20 civilians." 21 Now, did Issa Sesay tell the truth about the training that 22 you received at Camp Naama from Isaac Mongor? 23 A. I can't tell. Issa was speaking in his own capacity. Issa 24 and Isaac Mongor were in 1st Platoon. I was in 3rd Platoon. We 09:09:05 25 used to have classes by section, not as general. 26 Q. Did you ever hear Isaac Mongor give this type of lecture? 27 A. No. 28 Q. Did you ever hear of Isaac Mongor being disciplined by 29 Foday Sankoh for the lectures that he was giving? SCSL - TRIAL CHAMBER II CHARLES TAYLOR Page 48673 4 NOVEMBER 2010 OPEN SESSION 1 A. No. 2 Q. So as far as you know, Foday Sankoh had no problem with 3 this lecture - with any training by Isaac Mongor. Is that 4 correct? 09:09:30 5 A. No. 6 Q. Well, perhaps it was my question. Do you know of Foday 7 Sankoh having any objections to Isaac Mongor's training 8 techniques? 9 A. I don't. 09:09:44 10 Q. By the way, Mr Witness, just for reference for the Court 11 and counsel there's another document that says similar facts 12 about Isaac Mongor's training and that's confidential document 13 P277. 14 MR MUNYARD: Madam President, I think P277 is in two 09:10:13 15 separate parts, I wonder if we could be referred to which part 16 Mr Koumjian's talking to. 17 MR KOUMJIAN: Well, if that's necessary I will. I believe 18 it's in three parts but I'll ask my colleague to find it, I 19 believe it's on the last - the third part. If they look first in 09:10:31 20 part three where there's a section on Isaac Mongor. 21 Q. Mr Witness, another person, NPFL who trained you as Naama 22 was One Man One, correct? 23 A. No. 24 Q. You never heard - you know who One Man One is, correct? 09:10:53 25 A. No. 26 Q. You never heard the name One Man One? 27 A. I never heard no One Man One training. 28 Q. Well that wasn't my question. 29 A. No. SCSL - TRIAL CHAMBER II CHARLES TAYLOR Page 48674 4 NOVEMBER 2010 OPEN SESSION 1 Q. Have you heard of anyone called One Man One? 2 A. No. 3 Q. Well, another witness DCT-292, I cannot tell you his name, 4 who said he trained at Naama, testified on 2 June 2010. Could we 09:11:21 5 please look at the transcript at page 41867. 6 While this is coming up, you told us Gonkanu only conducted 7 physical training, is that correct? 8 A. Yes. 9 Q. You said he would only come once in a while and he was a 09:12:10 10 volunteer and would go back, is that right? 11 A. Yes. 12 Q. And when you say "go back" you mean he would go to the NPFL 13 part of Camp Naama, correct? 14 A. He would go on his own. 09:12:22 15 Q. Well, that wasn't my question. Do you know, did he go to 16 the NPFL part of Camp Naama, is that where he was staying? 17 A. No. 18 Q. You don't know where he was going? 19 A. No. 09:12:31 20 Q. Okay. So on page 41867 of the 2 June, going down about 21 nine lines, the question was - thank you, 7 lines at line 7: 22 "Q. No, I'm asking you about Liberians who were teaching 23 training." 24 And the witness answered, the witness who has testified he 09:12:54 25 was at Camp Naama: 26 "A. Okay, in training, really, the Liberians that trained 27 us was Gonkanu, he trained us, One Man One, he trained us.