Monday Volume 492 18 May 2009 No. 78

HOUSE OF COMMONS OFFICIAL REPORT

PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES (HANSARD)

Monday 18 May 2009

£5·00 © Parliamentary Copyright House of Commons 2009 This publication may be reproduced under the terms of the Parliamentary Click-Use Licence, available online through the Office of Public Sector Information website at www.opsi.gov.uk/click-use/ Enquiries to the Office of Public Sector Information, Kew, Richmond, Surrey TW9 4DU; Tel: 0044 (0) 208876344; e-mail: [email protected] 1187 18 MAY 2009 1188

Mr. Prentice: The police have been severely criticised House of Commons for their kettling technique, which they used in the G20 demonstrations a few weeks ago. Will my friend assure Monday 18 May 2009 me that there is no question whatever of the police using Tasers for crowd control?

The House met at half-past Two o’clock Mr. Coaker: To reassure my hon. Friend, I have said to the Joint Committee on Human Rights that Tasers PRAYERS should not be used in public order control situations, and Tasers were not used during the G20 demonstrations. Officers equipped with Tasers raided a residence in an [MR.SPEAKER in the Chair] operation to arrest individuals suspected of criminal damage at the G20 protest. My hon. Friend makes an important point, however: there is a right to protest in this country, and Tasers are not appropriate for use in Oral Answers to Questions controlling such demonstrations.

Chris Huhne (Eastleigh) (LD): Three weeks ago, four HOME DEPARTMENT environmental protesters dressed as suffragettes superglued themselves to a statue of Viscount Falkland in Parliament. They were arrested for demonstrating unlawfully, held The Secretary of State was asked— in detention for a total of 18 hours and given hugely restrictive police bail conditions, such as not being Sexual Assault Referral Centres allowed even any contact with each other, although they were friends. Does the Minister accept that there is 1. Lynda Waltho (Stourbridge) (Lab): What funding widespread controversy about the way in which lawful her Department has allocated to sexual assault referral and peaceful protests are policed—as evidenced by the centres for 2009-10. [275709] solicitors of the climate camp protestors today echoing our call for a full judicial inquiry? Does he agree that an The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the inquiry would provide useful public guidance to the Home Department (Mr. Alan Campbell): In 2009-10, police on policing lawful and peaceful protest? £1.6 million has been allocated for sexual assault referral centres—SARCs. As part of the 2008 funding round, Mr. Coaker: The hon. Gentleman will know that £659,000 was allocated, and a further £941,000 was there is always a balance to be struck between protest announced on 15 April this year. and the rights of law-abiding citizens to go about their business and the protection of property. That balance is Lynda Waltho: I welcome that fantastic news about difficult for the police sometimes to maintain, but funding, but when I met women from Women’s Aid a notwithstanding the case to which the hon. Gentleman few weeks ago they were concerned that funding, although has referred, we have an excellent example outside welcome, may be diverted from rape crisis centres and Parliament currently of the police dealing with quite a that they will continually have to reapply for funding difficult situation—controlling the Tamil demonstration from different pots of money. Will my hon. Friend but at the same time trying as far as they can to allow reassure me that that will not happen? After all, rape access to Parliament. The hon. Gentleman makes an crisis centres were set up for women, by women, for a important point, however, and he will know that Denis specific function that is slightly different from that of O’Connor, the chief of Her Majesty’s inspectorate of sexual assault referral centres. constabulary, having been asked by the Metropolitan Police Commissioner, will consider the whole issue of Mr. Campbell: I am happy to give my hon. Friend public order and tactics. We await that review with that reassurance. We value the work of rape crisis interest. centres and SARCs, and that is why we continue to invest in both of them. However, it is right that we look John Bercow (Buckingham) (Con): The Minister of at co-ordinating provision where possible to ensure that State’s reply to the hon. Member for Eastleigh (Chris we make the best use of funding. Huhne) is both measured and reassuring. Can I invite the Minister of State to confer with his right hon. and Water Cannon hon. Friends in the Foreign and Commonwealth Office in order that those Ministers can explain once and for 3. Mr. Gordon Prentice (Pendle) (Lab): What all to the Government of Sri Lanka, a country that I discussions she has had with police forces on the use of recently visited, that the British police are not in the water cannon by police forces in policing business of seeking to restrain or disperse protestors by demonstrations. [275712] the use of water cannon simply because they are holding placards or waving banners of which that Government The Minister for Security, Counter-Terrorism, Crime happen to disapprove? It is not the British way. and Policing (Mr. Vernon Coaker): The Home Office, working with the police, keeps all less lethal technologies, Mr. Coaker: The hon. Gentleman makes an important including water cannon, under constant review. There point. The Foreign Office and Foreign Office Ministers are no plans to introduce water cannon at the present are engaged in discussions with the demonstrators outside time. Parliament and, indeed, with the Sri Lankan Government 1189 Oral Answers18 MAY 2009 Oral Answers 1190 about the whole issue of protest. In this country, people point that I was making was that the police are doing a have a right to protest. That is what is going on outside, very good job with what is happening in Parliament and in my view and that of many people, the policing of square at present. To go back to the original question that demonstration, by facilitating protest but as far as about the use of water cannon and other such equipment, possible allowing the public and Parliament to go about it is encouraging to see our police policing such a their business, is a testament to the police. It is sometimes demonstration in normal uniform, by and large. difficult for the police, because people may say that something ought to be done about Tamils who are Michael Savage sitting in the road, for example, but the only way to move them, if they will not move, is by force. The way in which the police have tried to persuade people to conform 4. Michael Fabricant (Lichfield) (Con): For what is the right way forward. reasons she decided to prevent Michael Savage from entering the UK; and if she will make a statement. Mr. Gerald Howarth (Aldershot) (Con): Does the [275713] Minister not accept that what is going on in Parliament square is an absolute disgrace? It is an abuse of the right The Secretary of State for the Home Department to protest. For seven weeks, the square has effectively (Jacqui Smith): Michael Savage was excluded for engaging been under semi-permanent occupation by the Tamils, in unacceptable behaviour by seeking to provoke others and people going about their business in London have to serious criminal acts and by fostering hatred that been disrupted. Why will the Minister not answer me might lead to inter-community violence. The exclusion when I ask how many police days have been devoted to is in line with the strengthened policy on exclusions that the demonstration and how much it has cost? The I announced to the House on 28 October last year. In Minister has told me that the Home Office does not his radio broadcasts, Mr. Savage has spoken about keep those figures and that they are a matter for the killing 100 million Muslims, and he has spoken in Metropolitan Police Commissioner. Who is in charge of violent terms about homosexuals. Coming to the UK is the Metropolitan Police Commissioner? The people of a privilege. I refuse to extend that privilege to individuals London should be told how much the demonstration is who abuse our standards and values to undermine our costing. way of life.

Mr. Coaker: The fact is that the number of officers Michael Fabricant: Notwithstanding the Home and the amount of resources deployed are an operational Secretary’s answer, she will be aware that the things of matter for the Metropolitan Police Commissioner. The which she accuses Mike Savage are also illegal in the only point that I make to the hon. Gentleman is that, United States of America, and he has not faced prosecution far from being an affront to democracy, what is going there. Does she realise how ludicrous her ban is and the on out there is a victory for democracy. disrepute into which she has put this country in the eyes of many right-seeing—and, indeed, left-seeing—people Having said that, I should also say that of course in the United States? Does she also plan to ban Howard there are issues about how any demonstration is policed. Stern, Rush Limbaugh and other middle-aged, white, However, I pose this question to the hon. Gentleman: ordinary, American radio presenters? what would be the effect were the police to conduct a clearance operation, bring the tents down and forcibly Jacqui Smith: I subscribe to the view, as expressed by remove people, including women and children? Then we another Member of this House, that would see a protest from the other side of the argument. We have to look at the issue in a proportionate, sensible “It’s clear for reasons of our security that we must expel or and measured way. We have to try to facilitate protest refuse entry to those who preach hate, pit one faith against another and divide our society.” while trying, as far as we can, to ensure that people can go about their lawful business. Those were the words of the Leader of the Opposition, and I think he was right. Frankly, if the hon. Gentleman David Howarth (Cambridge) (LD): I agree completely believes that it is appropriate for somebody to use words with what the Minister just said. However, it raises the about Muslims such as, point of what counts as the “community”for the purposes “I said so kill 100 million of them, then there would be of the Association of Chief Police Officers guidance on 900 million of them. I mean would you rather us die than them?”, keeping the peace, for example. That says that the then he has a very different set of values than I have, impact on the community is the first consideration in and I want to ensure that those are implemented in the these circumstances. Does the Minister think that when decisions that we make about who we do and do not protests are being policed, the “community” must include allow into this country. the interests of peaceful protesters themselves and that the matter is not exclusively about keeping the traffic Mr. John Gummer (Suffolk, Coastal) (Con): Many of running? us would agree with the thrust of what the Home Secretary has said. On the other hand, had that person Mr. Coaker: I absolutely agree, and I think that come to Britain, he would find the great politeness of anybody would. Part of a protest is the individual the people from her Department who welcome people demonstrator’s being able to demonstrate and to say to this country, but quite the rudest notices in the world. and do what they want, within reason. Alongside that, She—or someone—has removed “please” and “thank the police, while facilitating the protest, have a responsibility you” from every notice that her Department puts forward to try to ensure, as far as possible, that traffic keeps to visitors and returning people. Could she make Britain’s moving and that people who are not interested in the welcome to those whom we want a good deal more demonstration can go about their business. The only polite than it is now? 1191 Oral Answers18 MAY 2009 Oral Answers 1192

Jacqui Smith: We have tried to improve the notices at solely because of the individuals there but because of our borders. It is important that when people enter the the ability that that gives us internationally to take UK it is clear to them that it is the UK border and that forward the sort of values that we hold, and the US we have certain conditions in place. My hon. Friend the holds, in fighting and tackling terrorism. Minister for Borders and Immigration is taking up points about the welcome to people coming to this Illegal Immigrants country. The right hon. Gentleman makes an important point about our wanting to welcome those who come 5. Andrew Selous (South-West Bedfordshire) (Con): here in good faith—those who will make a contribution What recent assessment she has made of the to this country, and who come here for holidays—and effectiveness of measures to remove illegal immigrants to differentiate between them and people such as Mr. Savage from the UK. [275714] who clearly have no place in this country and would have no welcome here. The Minister for Borders and Immigration (Mr. Phil Woolas): The immigration system is undergoing the Mr. Crispin Blunt (Reigate) (Con): The Home Office’s biggest shake-up in a generation. We have strengthened production of a “name and shame” list was a self-evident our borders, started the roll-out of local immigration gimmick and demeaning to Government, and it has led teams, introduced civil penalties for rogue employers to a completely avoidable legal action that is producing who knowingly hire illegal workers, and introduced tier splendid publicity for Michael Savage. Does the Home 4 of the points-based system for students. We are committed Secretary think, on reflection, that that was a mistake to removing those with no right to be here, targeting the and the wrong way for the Government to behave? most harmful first. Last year, more than 66,000 people were removed from the UK or left voluntarily, including Jacqui Smith: No, I do not, because I agree with the a record number of foreign criminals. hon. Gentleman’s party leader that we need to be clear about who we will and will not accept into this country. Andrew Selous: Many of my constituents want to We need to be clear about the values that we have. know the reason for the huge delays in the Home Office, Where someone preaches hate and foments hatred in which lead to the failure to remove illegal immigrants, the way that has happened in this case, where they who then acquire the right to stay in this country. The provoke others to serious violence, and where they use figures show that the number of removals fell in the last phrases such as, in relation to somebody who said on quarter of 2008 and was lower than in 2007. Why was his radio programme that he was gay, that? “You should only get AIDS and die, you pig!”, then it is right that we express our view about that. We Mr. Woolas: I do not accept the hon. Gentleman’s recognise that coming to this country is a privilege, and point. The trend of our removals is significantly up. Of we will express our values in terms of those we exclude. course, we have difficulties with some countries that refuse to issue documents, and that must be taken into account. However, there is steady improvement, as the Mr. David Winnick (Walsall, North) (Lab): If Savage report that the chief executive of the UK Border Agency had said what he said about Muslims about Christians gives regularly to the Home Affairs Committee—I see or Jews, what would be the reaction? its Chairman in his place— shows.

Jacqui Smith: My hon. Friend makes a very important Gwyn Prosser (Dover) (Lab): We would have far point. Had an Islamic preacher said the equivalent fewer illegal immigrants to remove if we were even more about killing 100 million Jews, there would rightly have effective in reducing the flow of illegals from northern been outrage. There would have been—as there have France to Dover. What progress has the Minister made been from Conservative Members—calls for that individual in setting up a secure holding centre in Calais? What to be excluded. In developing our policy, we have taken benefits will flow from that? an even-handed approach in saying that if people foment hate—if their aim is to drive division between different Mr. Woolas: I thank my hon. Friend for the question. faiths and potentially to cause inter-community violence Given his constituency, he knows more than most, if in this country—then they are not welcome in this not all, about the issue. Let me reassure the House that country. the people trying to get into our country from Calais are not queuing up; they are locked out. Our bilateral Mr. Julian Brazier (Canterbury) (Con): If it is an conversations with the French have produced good even-handed approach, could the Home Secretary explain progress. We will have a high-level bilateral meeting why we have welcomed back to this country from next month, when we hope to finalise the next stage of Guantanamo Bay two UK residents, but not citizens, our reform to put in place what is already one of the who are not only suspected terrorists in Afghanistan most effective border controls in the world. but wanted on murder charges in Spain? John Mason (Glasgow, East) (SNP): Can the Minister Jacqui Smith: We have, for some period of time, tell us why a four-year-old boy with medical problems taken a position of wanting to see Guantanamo Bay has been imprisoned in Dungavel in Lanarkshire? closed. In order to help to facilitate that, we have accepted back, and in fact sought the return to this Mr. Woolas: It would not be right to comment on country, of those who are nationals and have previously individual cases. If the hon. Gentleman wants to take been resident in the UK. I think that President Obama’s up the matter with me, I will respond in due course. On decision to close Guantanamo Bay is the right one, not the general policy of detaining children, it is, of course, 1193 Oral Answers18 MAY 2009 Oral Answers 1194 a last resort, and we have programmes to consider that, which mostly results in the UKBA winning the alternatives. However, regrettably, on some occasions, argument and winning the case. There is a constant people who have not co-operated with the decisions of campaign, if I may use that word, to ensure that the law the independent tribunals and courts and would, in is enforced, but I nevertheless thank my hon. Friend for their view, otherwise abscond, face detention. her suggestion.

Andrew Mackinlay (Thurrock) (Lab): I think that this Paul Rowen (Rochdale) (LD): The Minister talked in is the third time that I have asked this question of the his initial remarks about the steps that he had taken to Home Secretary and the Minister, but I am totally strengthen the UK borders. Could he explain to the bewildered. Why can the Minister not get on top of House how reducing the number of diplomatic posts cases of mums or dads who are married to or partners that process immigration and visa applications is improving of British citizens—their kids, who are British children, and strengthening our borders? run around my surgery—but cannot resolve their status? They might, yonks ago, have arrived here as illegal Mr. Woolas: I thank the hon. Gentleman; I know that immigrants, but the problem is a no-brainer: they are the issue is important for his constituency. There is a not going back anywhere, so why cannot we get their misunderstanding abroad on that point. Partly as a papers regularised so that they can work and enjoy life? result of security measures in some countries, but partly The problem is not small, but endemic. I have it every also as a result of change in management and improvements week in my constituency, and I do not want to wait till in efficiency, we now operate on a hub-and-spoke basis. 2010 and 2011 to resolve it. When can those cases be It is important to recognise that our contracted agents resolved? Common sense should prevail. are the first contact with the applicant, for both the application and the pick-up. If the hon. Gentleman Mr. Woolas: I can give my hon. Friend the reassurance. looks at the number of positions that are designated to I refer him to the comprehensive information that we individual posts, rather than the number that are have provided to the Select Committee. The legacy geographically located at such places, he will find that cases for failed asylum and immigration problems are there has been an improvement through the hub-and-spoke being got through at a pace. Under policy and law, we approach. rightly have to look at each case on its merits. We are doing that and we are on track to complete that in the Chris Grayling (Epsom and Ewell) (Con): The Minister timetable that the Home Secretary outlined. If I may will remember my raising the case of the 5,000 illegal say so, we are doing a good job of it. immigrants given clearance to work in the security industry by the Security Industry Authority 18 months Mr. Nicholas Soames (Mid-Sussex) (Con): Does the ago. Can he give the House a categorical assurance that Minister of State agree that the effective removal of none of those workers is still working in the security illegal immigrants is an important underpinning for industry? public confidence? Does he also agree that it is just as important that the Government take the steps that the Mr. Woolas: The hon. Gentleman knows that someone right hon. Member for Birkenhead (Mr. Field) and I in my position can never give an absolute categorical have raised with them to break the link between people assurance at a specific point in time, and no Minister coming here to work and those who settle? could. I agree with him, however, that it is important for the confidence of the system that that is seen to be done. Mr. Woolas: The answers to the hon. Gentleman’s When we are able to report on the issue, he will see the questions are yes and yes. It is important that temporary effectiveness of the UKBA under its new structure and settlement rights do not automatically become permanent management. settlement rights and that that is made clear. One of the advantages of the points-based system is exactly that. It Chris Grayling: I think that most people in this House is backed up by the border control of counting in and and outside it would expect Ministers to have something counting out, which I know my right hon. Friend the of a handle on the issue 18 months later and to be able Member for Birkenhead (Mr. Field) and he have supported. to give a clear answer. Let me then ask him two questions. We have today introduced two new countries to the We established two months ago that only 35 of those effective visa regime, and it is also important that those people had been deported. How many more have been visas are counted in and counted out. I am grateful for deported since and where are the rest? the hon. Gentleman’s support for that policy. Mr. Woolas: I appreciate that the hon. Gentleman Ms Gisela Stuart (Birmingham, Edgbaston) (Lab): has a campaign on the issue, but a campaign should be Has the Minister given any more thought to the idea based on the facts. He well knows that not all those that if someone fails in their application for asylum, people are liable for deportation, so his question is appeals and fails again, and is then told that they have trying to move the goalposts. I appreciate that that is no right to be here and no further right of appeal, that good propaganda; it is just not good policy. decision ought to be picked up in person, so that that person is not informed by letter and allowed simply to disappear into the community? Identity Cards

Mr. Woolas: There is much merit in that suggestion. 6. Mr. John Leech (Manchester, Withington) (LD): When a failed asylum seeker’s appeal rights are exhausted, What assessment she has made of the likely uptake of the procedures that we follow are critically important. voluntary identity cards in the pilot scheme in However, we are regularly subject to legal challenge on Manchester. [275715] 1195 Oral Answers18 MAY 2009 Oral Answers 1196

The Secretary of State for the Home Department comes from being able to tie our identity to ourselves in (Jacqui Smith): Identity cards will start to be available a modern world, we can recognise the benefits. Also, as to British citizens resident in Manchester from the I pointed out to the House either at the previous Home autumn, at a fee of £30, and will, I am sure, become Office questions or the one before, the idea that there popular with members of the public who want a convenient are large sums of money to be saved by doing away with and secure means of proving their identity. the scheme is completely fallacious. Anyone who suggests that will have a black hole not only in their plans for Mr. Leech: I thank the Secretary of State for saying security but in their financial plans. that with a straight face. Could she tell the House how low the take-up needs to be before the Government Damian Green (Ashford) (Con): With every month realise that they have very little public support and that that passes, it becomes clearer that the ID card scheme the ID cards scheme is a complete waste of money? will never be introduced, yet, as the Home Secretary has just said, at last month’s Home Office questions she was Jacqui Smith: The most recent research on the national determined to tell us about the new contracts that she identity service as a whole has shown, as research has had signed to create the system. There are billions of consistently shown, that about 60 per cent. of the pounds of taxpayers’ money at stake, so will she pledge British public support the identity card scheme and less today to publish the details of those contracts and the than 25 per cent. disagree with it. People will have the break clauses in them, to remove any suspicion that she opportunity—and have already begun to take that is trying to tie the hands of her successors and land the opportunity—to register their interest and, in Manchester, British taxpayer with a huge and unnecessary bill for a to get the security and convenience that comes from discredited policy? being able to prove their identity far more securely than they can now. Jacqui Smith: I made clear and announced to the David Taylor (North-West Leicestershire) (Lab/Co-op): House the costs of breaking those contracts. I am sure The cost of identity cards has surged by a further that the hon. Gentleman is not proposing that I put quarter of a billion pounds to the present figure of commercially confidential information into the public £5.3 billion, which excludes every Government Department domain—leak it, perhaps? We have been completely apart from the Home Office, and also excludes businesses, clear that, of the total cost of implementing ID cards, citizens and many sectors of society. Does the Home approximately 70 per cent. would need to be spent in Secretary believe that there is a risk that the Manchester any event, just to implement secure biometric passports. citizens who signed up for the card—no doubt in the I presume that Opposition Members are not turning fiction section of the central library, while having a their backs on what every other Schengen country is continental breakfast—have signed away their privacy going to do: put fingerprints into secure biometric for life and given a blank cheque to this and, perhaps, passports. The operational costs of issuing ID cards in future Governments? addition to that will be recovered largely from fees, so, as I said earlier, the Opposition’s suggestion that there is a large amount of money to be saved by scrapping the Jacqui Smith: I know that my hon. Friend would not ID card scheme suggests that there is a black hole not want the facts to get in the way of an amusing question. only in their plans but in their finances. He is wrong: the costs have not increased in the way in which he suggests. Last year, we were able to demonstrate a reduction of £1 billion in the cost of the instigation of Crime (Public Transport) the national identity service over the next 10 years. The cost for the people of Manchester to take up this 7. Mary Creagh (Wakefield) (Lab): What steps she is opportunity on a purely voluntary basis will be £30, and taking to reduce levels of crime at bus and railway we will see how many of them want to take up the stations. [275716] opportunity.

Sir Patrick Cormack (South Staffordshire) (Con): The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Can the Home Secretary not acknowledge that, Home Department (Mr. Alan Campbell): The Government whatever the precise figure, it is an enormous one, and fund schemes such as the secure stations scheme to that the scheme is never going to happen because no reduce crime at transport hubs, with extra CCTV cameras, sane Government will pursue it? So why does she not better lighting, and customer help and information chuck it? points.

Jacqui Smith: There are already people in this country Mary Creagh: I thank my hon. Friend for that reply. who have identity cards in their hands and in their Last October, a 21-year-old woman was assaulted, robbed wallets. We have already issued 30,000 identity cards to and raped at Kirkgate train station by a Romanian foreign nationals, and by November this year that figure national, Ali Majlat, who has been given an indeterminate will be 75,000. The hon. Gentleman might want to wish sentence and will serve a minimum of five years. What the scheme away, but it exists in this country now. I reassurance can my hon. Friend give my constituents believe, given the level of support that we have consistently that this evil man will be deported as soon as he leaves maintained for identity cards, that a sane Government prison, with no leave to return? Will my hon. Friend will recognise the benefits to individuals of being able also please knock some heads together at Northern Rail to find a more secure, more convenient way of proving and Network Rail, to ensure that we get a live CCTV their identity, which many of us have to do often in our monitoring system so that the British Transport police lives. When we put that alongside the security that can monitor what is going on at Kirkgate station? 1197 Oral Answers18 MAY 2009 Oral Answers 1198

Mr. Campbell: This was a grave and hideous crime, Trafficking (Children) and my sympathies go to the victim. As my hon. Friend says, the perpetrator is in prison—and I think most people would expect him to serve his sentence in full 8. Mr. Stephen Crabb (Preseli Pembrokeshire) (Con): and then be considered for deportation, which is exactly What her most recent estimate is of the level of what is happening. On my hon. Friend’s other points, I trafficking of children into the UK. [275717] would be happy to meet her to see what else can be done. The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Home Department (Mr. Alan Campbell): The Child Sir Nicholas Winterton (Macclesfield) (Con): Although Exploitation and Online Protection Centre’s “Strategic the Government gave a very reassuring answer to the Threat Assessment” published last month, is the most original question, does the Minister agree that many recent study into child trafficking. It found that 325 children railways stations and even bus stations are unmanned at were identified as being potential victims of trafficking night and that in many cases those stations are very or exploitation from data supplied covering the period 1 dark—almost like a morgue—and that there is a huge March 2007 to 29 February 2008. backlog of expenditure required to install the CCTV cameras and lighting that would make those stations Mr. Crabb: I am grateful for that reply, but the much safer, particularly for the young and the elderly Minister will have seen the report from the Home who are frightened to use public transport at night? Affairs Committee last week, which painted a grim picture of a growing modern slave industry here within Mr. Campbell: The hon. Gentleman raises an important the UK, where abused children are some of the principal matter on behalf of his constituents. Policing at stations victims. What practical steps is he, along with other and, indeed, station security is, of course, the responsibility ministerial colleagues, taking to ensure that all relevant of the Secretary of State for Transport, but I would be agencies coming into contact with trafficked children quite happy to raise the hon. Gentleman’s point with are aware of the issues, to end the culture of disbelief my colleagues. that unquestionably still exists among some professionals, and, most of all, to put a stop to our care homes Mr. Neil Gerrard (Walthamstow) (Lab): The safer effectively becoming holding pens for trafficked children? transport team based at Walthamstow Central bus and tube station has had a really good effect on bringing Mr. Campbell: We are concerned about children who down crime levels in the area, but one issue that does are suspected of being trafficked, particularly if they go not help to persuade people that this is actually happening missing from care. The national referral mechanism is is the diversion created in people’s minds by the use of an important part of identifying those who may be section 44 of the Terrorism Act 2006 to stop and search victims of child trafficking. The young runaways plan people who have been taking photographs in and around brings together, across government, partners that are the bus station. Will the Minister look at how that law is important in that process. The hon. Gentleman mentions operating? We recently had a ludicrous incident when local authorities; there will be increased guidance to an Austrian tourist who was taking photographs of them. They, at the end of the day, are responsible for buses was stopped and searched. That does not help. children in such situations. Mr. Campbell: We are looking at that. The Minister for Security, Counter-Terrorism, Crime and Policing, Keith Vaz (Leicester, East) (Lab): The hon. Member my hon. Friend the Member for Gedling (Mr. Coaker), for Preseli Pembrokeshire (Mr. Crabb) is absolutely is in discussions on exactly that issue. right to raise the issue of care homes. Last week, The Guardian reported that 77 trafficked Chinese children Mr. David Ruffley (Bury St. Edmunds) (Con): We all went missing from a home in Hillingdon, and hundreds know that if police officers spend more time on the more have gone missing in the past 10 years. I am beat, crime will be cut. Four years ago, the Home Office grateful to the Home Secretary for coming to the Select told us that police officers spent only 19 per cent. of Committee seminar last week, but will the Minister tell their time on the beat. Can the Minister tell us today the House when she will be in a position to report back what the latest figure is? to the Prime Minister, who has asked her for an urgent report on the situation in care homes? Does the Minister Mr. Campbell: What we need to be measuring is the not agree that the way to stop children being trafficked length of time that police officers spend on front-line is to bring together the origin, destination and transition duties, not simply “on the beat”. The hon. Gentleman is countries and put our faith in organisations such as aware that if police are literally on the beat, they are Europol, which exist to try to stop this horrible practice obviously not involved in front-line policing. As soon as continuing? officers undertake some policing, it means they are carrying out front-line duties, which is subject to a Mr. Campbell: My right hon. Friend is exactly right, different measurement altogether. The figures have been and I pay tribute to the work of his Committee and to rising in that respect. What we need to do is not just the important opportunity offered by last week’s seminar, have police officers with more time for front-line police which my right hon. Friend the Home Secretary attended. services, but we need to guarantee the number of those There was an important sharing of views on these officers. Given the funding commitments—or lack of matters. He asks when the Home Secretary, and indeed them—from the Conservative party, I am not sure the Secretary of State for Children, Schools and Families, whether police officers will be there to spend time on will report back to the Prime Minister. I believe that whatever duties. that will happen shortly—within the next few weeks. 1199 Oral Answers18 MAY 2009 Oral Answers 1200

Mr. Anthony Steen (Totnes) (Con): Are the Government DNA Database aware that they may be on the wrong point, as most children are trafficked from China and Vietnam? That 11. Andrew Stunell (Hazel Grove) (LD): What factors being the case, should not the asylum-seeking provision her Department took into account in deciding on the be lifted for those children, because what we need for all options of retaining DNA samples for six and 12 years Chinese and Vietnamese children is special screening by in its consultation on the national DNA database. the border and immigration services; otherwise, children [275721] will always go missing from care homes? Mr. Campbell: May I first place on record our The Minister for Security, Counter-Terrorism, Crime appreciation of the hon. Gentleman’s efforts? Few in and Policing (Mr. Vernon Coaker): We will be retaining the House have done more to achieve progress on this samples for a maximum of six months, after which time matter and I pay tribute to him. That screening, I am they will be destroyed whether the person is convicted advised, is in place, but it is important that we have the or not. On DNA profiles, the public consultation paper closest scrutiny, particularly of the groups that he refers “Keeping the Right People on the DNA database”, to. That is why it is important that we work in those published on 7 May 2009, sets out our proposals and countries to stop the flow of those people. We must the thinking behind them. Our approach is supported also work hard here: it is not always easy to identify by evidence on the propensity to offend, which indicates the age of a trafficked child, so we must have the that there is a span of four to 15 years within which mechanisms in place to proceed to identify exactly who retention periods can be justified. the individuals are. Our key consideration is implementing the judgment of the European Court of Human Rights in the case of Mrs. Ann Cryer (Keighley) (Lab): Does my hon. S and Marper in a way that balances the need to protect Friend agree that, were we to reintroduce the recording the public with the need to safeguard the rights of the of embarkation details—I think we are going to do individual. it—that would help enormously in stopping the trafficking of children, because we would know whether a person Andrew Stunell: Will the Minister not act to remove had travelled out alone and returned accompanied by immediately from the DNA database those who have five or six children? been falsely accused? I draw to his attention the case of my 50-year-old constituent who challenged a group of Mr. Campbell: Yes, we are doing that, and it is an unruly youths and faced false accusations. His DNA is important step forward, as are the operations that we now stuck on that database for ever. Can the Minister run at key airports, which are having an effect on the not assure the House that those falsely accused will be number of children whom we suspect are being brought taken off the DNA database and the Court’s ruling into the country and trafficked. complied with immediately? Community Policing Mr. Coaker: I do not know the particular case that 10. Mr. Lindsay Hoyle (Chorley) (Lab): What recent the hon. Gentleman refers to, but of course people can assessment she has made of the role of police appeal to a chief constable to be taken off the DNA community support officers in supporting community database, and indeed new guidance will be prepared to beat managers. [275720] try to ensure that people in certain situations, maybe such as the situation that he refers to, will be able to get The Minister for Security, Counter-Terrorism, Crime their DNA taken off the database. and Policing (Mr. Vernon Coaker): In performing that role as part of neighbourhood policing teams, PCSOs Topical Questions offer valuable support to their community beat managers. The PCSO review, published in 2008, and the policing T1. [275734] Richard Ottaway (Croydon, South) (Con): Green Paper were both broadly supportive of the PCSO If she will make a statement on her departmental role. In addition, the 2006 evaluation of PCSOs found responsibilities. that they had a key role to play in neighbourhood policing, and their provision of reassurance and visibility The Secretary of State for the Home Department was welcomed by local communities. (Jacqui Smith): The Government continue to make Mr. Hoyle: I thank my hon. Friend for that reply. progress against the threat that drugs pose to communities Does he agree that PCSOs have a role to play—as he and families. Since publishing the drug strategy in February says, an important role—in backing up policing? Will last year, we have made record numbers of drug seizures he ensure that we do not see PCSOs replacing real in England and Wales, we have seized more of the cash bobbies as a way of saving money? and assets of criminals and we have helped more people than ever before to access drug treatment. We have seen Mr. Coaker: We of course understand the fact that overall drug use fall to its lowest level since British there is a real difference between PCSOs and full-time crime survey measurements started, and we have seen warranted police officers, and we want to maintain that drug-related crime fall, but we will continue to build on distinction, but my hon. Friend is also right to point out that progress and respond to emerging threats. That is that PCSOs—integrated particularly in neighbourhood why I will be launching a public consultation on the policing teams, working side by side with warranted control of GBL later this month. As tragically shown police officers, specials and, indeed, neighbourhood by the recent death of Hester Stewart, controls are wardens—make a huge contribution to keeping necessary to prevent the use of such precursor chemicals, communities safe and reassuring people out and about and we will work to determine the best controls of that in different communities. substance. 1201 Oral Answers18 MAY 2009 Oral Answers 1202

Richard Ottaway: The Home Secretary goes on about retain samples, which are genetic material, for longer her drugs policy at length, but is she aware of the than six months. As for profiles, to which I think he is damning indictment of it by the Centre for Policy referring, we know that keeping the profiles of those Studies? It said: who have been arrested will enable us to solve crimes in “Labour’s War on Drugs has not, despite the rhetoric to the the future. That is a proportionate approach. contrary, been fought. It has been a Phoney War—and an expensive If the hon. Gentleman reads what was actually said failure.” in the European Court judgment, he will find that the When will the Government adopt the Conservative objection was to the indiscriminate, blanket nature of party’s proposals, and stop managing addiction and our policy, and that keeping DNA from those who had instead focus on its root causes? been arrested was not considered necessarily to be Jacqui Smith: There are many inaccuracies in the wrong. report that the hon. Gentleman refers to. Overall, drug T5. [275739] Christine Russell (City of Chester) (Lab): use is at its lowest level since measurements through the Most people find the presence of CCTV in their BCS began. As I said, we have seized more cash and neighbourhoods reassuring, and most police officers assets in the past year than ever before. We made a find them very helpful in assisting the detection of record 216,792 drug seizures in England and Wales in crime and the reduction of antisocial behaviour. the past year, and the Serious Organised Crime Agency However, there is also a strong view out there that they seized more than 90 tonnes of class A drugs. We have can result in a real invasion of an individual’s personal seen the wholesale price of cocaine rise as a result of the liberty. Has the Department commissioned, or will it impact of its work. We have got more support and consider commissioning, a fully independent survey of treatment to young people than ever before and helped the effectiveness of CCTV cameras? more people to access drug treatment, with more than 200,000 people now able to do so. We have also introduced Mr. Coaker: My hon. Friend has raised an important well regarded campaigns to tackle drug use, and we are point about the balance between the rights of the considering how to reform drugs education in our schools. individual and the protection of the community. The That is a comprehensive list of progress. Home Office is examining the way in which we manage T2. [275736] Martin Salter (Reading, West) (Lab): One CCTV systems throughout the country, and also the organisation that has been actively campaigning possibility of establishing a national CCTV board. against settlement rights for the brave Gurkha soldiers According to a recent report from the Campbell is the odious British National party, which is Collaboration crime and justice group, CCTV has circulating a leaflet defacing the image of the recently “a modest but significant desirable impact on crime”. fallen Corporal Kumar Pun, a man who gave his life The report says that it is most effective in reducing for this country. Would the Minister not agree that it is crime in car parks and targeting vehicle crime, and that high time that the Gurkha settlement issue was it is more effective in reducing crime in the United resolved in favour of the historic debt of honour that Kingdom than in other countries. I think that that is an this country owes Corporal Pun and his comrades? endorsement of CCTV, but we must of course consider The Minister for Borders and Immigration (Mr. Phil the impact on the privacy of the individual as well. Woolas): I thank my hon. Friend for his question and repeat the assurance that we gave the House on 29 April T4. [275738] Mr. John Leech (Manchester, Withington) that we are working on new proposals. I am grateful to (LD): In south Manchester we face the prospect of the Home Affairs Committee, of which my hon. Friend losing PC Steve Hobson as our crime reduction is a member, for its facilitation of that discussion. adviser. Steve has done more than any other police On the British National party, all of us in the House officer in Manchester to help combat crime. Will the would recognise that the increased scrutiny of that Minister join me in supporting the Save Our Steve party is now exposing the true nature of its policies. I campaign, which aims to persuade Greater Manchester imagine that we would all wish to condemn wholeheartedly police to keep Steve on after his 30 years of service? its policy of instructing its members not to describe Jacqui Smith: It is officers such as PC Steve Hobson people as being “black British” or “British Asian”, and who—particularly through neighbourhood policing its comments regarding the footballers Ferdinand, Walcott teams—are helping communities all over the country to and James as not being English, feel more confident and helping to make crime fall, and T3. [275737] Norman Baker (Lewes) (LD): Following it is the actions of this Government that have ensured the question from my hon. Friend the Member for that there are 14,000 more police constables like Steve Hazel Grove (Andrew Stunell) about DNA samples, Hobson across the country now. Our difficulty is that may I ask whether the Minister really thinks it Conservative Members have steadfastly refused to commit appropriate to keep samples for six or 12 years, given themselves to safeguarding those numbers. that the European Court of Human Rights has lauded the Scottish model in which no samples from innocent Nia Griffith (Llanelli) (Lab): We all understand that people are kept except samples from those who have we need the strictest possible border controls to deal been acquitted of a sexual or violent offence, which are with immigration, but can my hon. Friend the Minister kept for three years? Why do we not adopt that model? for Borders and Immigration offer any reassurance to a constituent of mine who holds dual nationality that if The Minister for Security, Counter-Terrorism, Crime she leaves this country using her New Zealand passport and Policing (Mr. Vernon Coaker): The hon. Gentleman’s she will not encounter any difficulties, or any threat of question gives me another opportunity to put on record deportation, when trying to return here using her the Government’s categorical statement that we will not British passport? 1203 Oral Answers18 MAY 2009 Oral Answers 1204

Mr. Woolas: I can do my best to give that reassurance. Jacqui Smith: Neighbourhood Watch has a fundamental Certainly no aspect of policy should produce a problem. role to play alongside the neighbourhood policing teams However, I am sure that if there is a problem, my hon. that are now in every community in this country. That is Friend, as a hard-working Member of Parliament, will why we are investing an extra £1 million to help be on the phone to me immediately. Her question also Neighbourhood Watch maintain that important role, gives me an opportunity to reassure her about the alongside that performed by increased numbers of police merits of the border control policy, including the electronic officers and of PCSOs. borders that now count people in and out of our country, and I ask all Members to support us in that Mark Pritchard (The Wrekin) (Con): The Secretary endeavour. of State will know that the vast majority of police officers and PCSOs in the West Mercia police area, and T6. [275740] Sandra Gidley (Romsey) (LD): Owners of also those covering Shropshire, are hard-working and weapons deactived prior to 1995 hold certificates to say dedicated. Will she therefore give a commitment to the that they are, in fact, non-weapons, and only a handful House today that there will be no cuts in front-line of crimes have been committed in reactivating the officers in the next financial year? “deacs”—the deactivated weapons. Would not Government time be better spent in tackling illegal gun Jacqui Smith: I agree with the hon. Gentleman that sales than in trying to penalise law-abiding members of the police officers in West Mercia do a very good job, the community further? which is why crime has come down in his area and in mine. I have given a commitment to maintain our Jacqui Smith: I believe that we need to do both. That increased funding for the police grant, which will enable is why we have taken action, not least internationally us at least to maintain police numbers. Unfortunately, through the Serious Organised Crime Agency and with the shadow Home Secretary has refused to give me a Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs, to tackle the commitment that his spending plans, which would have import of guns, and why we are working with the reduced spending to the equivalent of about 3,500 National Ballistics Intelligence Service—NABIS—and police officers this year, would not be instituted. I can its database in order to be able to track guns and where give a commitment to maintain police funding; the hon. they come from more clearly. It is also why we will take Gentleman’s Front-Bench colleagues cannot. action against deactivated firearms and why we have had a 16 per cent. fall in gun crime over the last year. Mr. Peter Bone (Wellingborough) (Con): The Home Secretary refers to police numbers, but it is no good Mr. David Heathcoat-Amory (Wells) (Con): Why is having policemen if they are not out on the beat. Why is the Home Office still proposing to retain the DNA it that under her Government the amount of time the profiles of innocent people for six years? Is the Secretary police spend on the beat is falling? In my county it is of State aware of correspondence that I and many down to 10 per cent. others have sent to the Department about entirely innocent people who have been not only not convicted, but not Jacqui Smith: I am sorry, Mr. Speaker, but that is just even charged with any offence, and who believe that the wrong. Not only do we have— march of the state and the surveillance society must be stopped, and that this is a very good place to start? Mr. Bone: It is not wrong!

Mr. Coaker: As I said to the hon. Member for Lewes Jacqui Smith: Ooh! (Norman Baker), the European Court judgment actually Not only do we have more police officers and a said that the indiscriminate blanket nature of the retention funding commitment that the hon. Gentleman’s party of DNA was the issue and that that meant we were in has signally failed to match, but, through cutting breach of our human rights obligations. It did not say bureaucracy and providing handheld computers, we that we should not keep any DNA on arrest. As a result have more police officers and more PCSOs with more of the consultation we brought forward last week the time to spend on their duties, which is why we continue Government have given a proportionate response to the to see crime in this country falling. judgment of the courts as we try to balance retaining DNA with our ability to solve crime. We have all seen Bob Spink (Castle Point) (Ind): May I thank the that the retention on the DNA database of the DNA of Government for their action over the past 10 years on those arrested but not convicted has led to a large Gurkhas’ resettlement rights, while encouraging them number of crimes being solved that otherwise would to ensure that their new proposals are much more have remained unsolved, including rapes and murders. generous and give the necessary concessions? Will those That is something the right hon. Gentleman must also proposals be implemented in time for us to celebrate consider. them during the armed forces celebration day on 27 June?

Bob Russell (Colchester) (LD): Further to the earlier Mr. Woolas: The hon. Gentleman, like the rest of the question from the hon. Member for Chorley (Mr. Hoyle) House, will have to be patient. As I said on 29 April and about police community support officers, what is the as has been said in evidence to the Select Committee, we Government’s policy on Neighbourhood Watch? Does are putting in place new proposals to move towards the it have a role to play in the fight against crime, and if so, point that was made by the House in that debate, and I what support are the Government giving it? am optimistic. 1205 18 MAY 2009 Speaker’s Statement 1206

Speaker’s Statement in you. When will Members be allowed to choose a new Speaker with the moral authority to clean up Westminster 3.30 pm and the legitimacy to lift this House out of the mire? Mr. Speaker: I would like to make a statement on Mr. Speaker: I know that that the hon. Gentleman Members’ allowances. We all know that it is the tradition has taken—[Interruption.] I will answer. I know that of this House that the Speaker speaks to the whole the hon. Gentleman has taken advice, but it is not a House, but in doing so please allow me to say to the substantive motion. It is an early-day motion— men and women of the United Kingdom that we have [Interruption.] The hon. Gentleman is telling me that it let you down very badly indeed. We must all accept is not. Please give me credit for having some experience blame and, to the extent that I have contributed to the in the Chair. It is not a substantive motion; it is an situation, I am profoundly sorry. Now, each and every early-day motion. The hon. Gentleman knows— Member, including myself, must work hard to regain your trust. Mr. Richard Bacon (South Norfolk) (Con): It is a As a matter of urgency, and within 48 hours, I am substantive motion. The Deputy Leader of the House calling the Prime Minister and party leaders, including just told me that it is a substantive motion. those of the minority parties, to meet me and the other members of the House of Commons Commission. Also Mr. Speaker: Order. Let me ask the Clerk; if I am present will be the right hon. Member for Islwyn wrong I will say so. It is a motion on the remaining (Mr. Touhig). orders, and can only be proceeded with if it becomes a Leaders of all parties have made announcements on substantive motion. what should be done. Some of their proposals are very similar to those put to the House on 3 July last year by Mr. David Winnick (Walsall, North) (Lab): Further the Members Estimate Committee—which I chair—copies to that point of order, Mr. Speaker. There is, as you say, of which are lodged in the Vote Office. I want discussion great public anger outside that undoubtedly has harmed to centre on the additional costs allowance and all those the reputation of this House. We all bear responsibility; matters that have caused the greatest controversy and I take my share of the responsibility, like any other hon. most anger with the public, and I include in that the Member. I am not associated with the motion, Sir, but early publication of the additional costs allowance, will you bear in mind that it would be very useful for the office costs and travel material. reputation of this House—I say this with reluctance, While we await the work of the Committee on Standards but I say it all the same—if you gave some indication of in Public Life, we must search for agreement, so that the your own intention to retire? Your early retirement Leader of the House can bring forward resolutions to would help the reputation of the House. give an opportunity for the House to deal with the immediate situation. In the meantime, I do urge all hon. Mr. Speaker: The hon. Gentleman has served under Members not to submit claims for approval. Last week, more Speakers than I have and he knows that that is not I had a most productive meeting with Sir Christopher a subject for today. Kelly, who explained to me his hopes to bring forward reasoned proposals in the autumn. While we await the Mr. Winnick: It should be answered by you, Sir— outcome of his work, it is imperative that we continue to improve our accounts and practice in the interim, Mr. Speaker: Order. and get in place measures that work and are seen to be working. I say again that we all bear a heavy responsibility Mr. David Heath (Somerton and Frome) (LD): Further for the terrible damage to the reputation of this House. to that point of order, Mr. Speaker. I have a great deal We must do everything we possibly can to regain the of personal sympathy for the impossible situation in trust and confidence of the people. which you find yourself. I have to say that the statement you have made would have been extremely welcome had Several hon. Members rose— it been made a few weeks or months ago, but I have very grave doubts, given the appalling situation in which we Mr. Speaker: I call Mr. Prentice. find ourselves—this midden of the House’s own making— that any action taken by Members of this House will Mr. Gordon Prentice (Pendle) (Lab): On a point of restore the trust that we need. Is it not therefore necessary— order, Mr. Speaker. A motion of no confidence in you, can you assist us in this, Mr. Speaker—for this House to Sir, will appear on the Order Paper tomorrow. Am I resolve to accept unequivocally the results of Sir Christopher right in thinking that it will be debated tomorrow and Kelly’s decisions— voted upon? Mr. Speaker: Order. I must stop the hon. Gentleman. Mr. Speaker: This is not a point of order— I cannot give an assurance as to whether the proposals Mr. Prentice: Oh yes it is— of any organisation will be accepted by this House. This House must make that acceptance. Mr. Speaker: Order. Please allow me to answer. These are matters for debate on an appropriate motion. Mr. Heath rose—

Mr. Douglas Carswell (Harwich) (Con): Further to Mr. Speaker: Let me finish. I think that I must clarify that point of order, Mr. Speaker. As you will be aware, a certain situation. I said it in the statement— Members on both sides of the House have now tabled a Sir Christopher Kelly will not report until the autumn substantive motion calling for a vote of no confidence and therefore steps have to be taken within this House. 1207 Speaker’s Statement18 MAY 2009 Speaker’s Statement 1208

Mr. Heath: Further to that point of order, Mr. Speaker. there will not believe that we are serious about the What I was asking was that the House be given an changes that are necessary as long as you are in the opportunity to resolve to accept the recommendations Chair. That is the terrible situation that we are in. I feel of that independent committee, to resolve to remove the the greatest sadness that I have even had to raise this remaining barriers to transparency so that everything point. There is a motion on the Order Paper, and it can be revealed as soon as possible, and to accept that should be debated, and the Government should those right hon. and hon. Members who put us into this acknowledge that it will be debated. position by resisting reform cannot possibly be the right people to lead us out of the mire. Mr. Speaker: What the hon. Gentleman is doing, through a point of order, is debating the matter. Mr. Speaker: I say to the hon. Gentleman that until [Interruption.] Order. He has a point of view, and I do resolutions are put forward—I hope that they come not deny him that right, but he knows the rules of the forward in the meeting that I have proposed—for which House. That is not a debate that he can enter into the Leader of the House will have responsibility, and through a point of order. only then, will the House be able to proceed. He mentioned transparency, and, yes, as I have stated, I have heard Mr. Shepherd: How do we discuss things in this leaders of the parties and others talk about many issues, House if— some of which were brought up on 3 July by the Committee that I chair. What I can say about that point Mr. Speaker: If the hon. Gentleman does not know is that anything about transparency can be on the that, no one will know. [Interruption.] Order. agenda at the meeting that will take place within 48 hours and can hopefully be translated into a resolution that Sir Stuart Bell (Middlesbrough) (Lab): Further to this House can consider. that point of order, Mr. Speaker. The majority in this House will fully support the statement that you made Sir Patrick Cormack (South Staffordshire) (Con): today. The majority in the House will fully accept that Further to that point of order, Mr. Speaker. The times there has never been, in the history of our land, such an that we are living in are unprecedented, as far as attack on the Speaker of the House of Commons. Parliament is concerned. What is at stake is the institution There has never been such an attack on the chairmanship of Parliament and its integrity. May I just say that I very and speakership of this House. Are not that the steps much hope that you will take account of the fact that that you are taking, with the steps that Sir Christopher profound concern is voiced in the motion that is to go Kelly is taking, the steps that the Prime Minister has down tomorrow? May I ask you to bear in mind that asked for and the review of four years of our expenses, the condition of the House today is rather like the all designed to restore public confidence and public condition of the country at the time of the Norway trust? Should not the House calm itself down, have a debate, and could you reflect on that? period of reflection, and support you, as the Speaker is entitled to be supported? Mr. Mike Hancock (Portsmouth, South) (LD): Further to that a point of order, Mr. Speaker. [Interruption.] Mr. Speaker: All I say to the hon. Gentleman is that the House of Commons Commission, which this House Mr. Speaker: I cannot hear the hon. Gentleman. created—[Interruption.] Order. As far as I know, the Mr. Hancock: At the meeting that you, Mr. Speaker, Commission was created under statute. The House of will convene within 48 hours, will you ask Sir Christopher Commons Commission has a responsibility. The party Kelly what resources he would need to bring his report leaders—all of them, including the leaders of the minority forward from the autumn, because that date seems parties—have a responsibility. What I am saying is: let wholly unacceptable? If it is a question of resources, all the parties involved meet and discuss the matter. they should be made available to enable him to do the That has never happened. What has happened is that work, certainly so speedily that it is done one month one party has said one thing, the Prime Minister has from now. I urge you to discuss that with the party said another, and the Liberal party another. Other leaders and the House of Commons Commission. individual Members have had a point of view, too. For the first time, people will be under the one roof, talking Mr. Speaker: I take on board what the hon. Gentleman about this matter. has to say. David Davis (Haltemprice and Howden) (Con): Further Mr. Lindsay Hoyle (Chorley) (Lab): Further to that to that point of order, Mr. Speaker. It is a sad day for all point of order, Mr. Speaker. Would it not be possible of us. The point that you made earlier is, I am sure, for Kelly to bring forward a very early interim report, absolutely right: the motion is an early-day motion, not with something that we could adopt, to make the changes a substantive motion. Is it within the power of a Back more immediate? Bencher to put down a substantive motion, and if so, how? Mr. Speaker: I have heard what the hon. Gentleman had to say. Mr. Speaker: It has to be on the Order Paper, and not under the remaining orders. That is a matter for the Mr. Richard Shepherd (Aldridge-Brownhills) (Con): Government, not for the Chair. [HON.MEMBERS: “Ah!”] Further to that point of order, Mr. Speaker. The reputation Order. and standing of the House, in the views of those who send us here, are at the lowest point that I can ever Bob Spink (Castle Point) (Ind): Further to that point remember. This is a constitutional crisis, and we now of order, Mr. Speaker. I welcome, as I am sure the have to hear a statement about the future. Many out House must do, your statement today—[Interruption.] 1209 Speaker’s Statement18 MAY 2009 Speaker’s Statement 1210

Mr. Speaker: Order. Given the difficulty we are in, I Mr. Speaker: To be helpful, I call Sammy Wilson. should be able to hear an hon. Member who is speaking. Sammy Wilson (East Antrim) (DUP): Further to that Bob Spink: Thank you very much, Mr. Speaker. The point of order, Mr. Speaker. First, may I say that I whole House must welcome your statement today, so welcome the opportunity not just for the main parties in thank you. the House but for the minority parties to have a discussion Sir, in view of the Whit recess next week, will you be on the issue with you and to make recommendations? I able to come to the House and make a further statement believe, as other Members have said, that the very following your meeting with the party leaders? Following reputation not just of the House but of the future of that statement, may we have a debate, so that I can good governance in the United Kingdom is at stake. make it plain that my constituents, like most people’s May I ask, Mr. Speaker, whether you can give us an constituents, do not want to see you made a scapegoat assurance that, after those discussions, a report will for the actions of these Members? quickly be given to the House as to their outcome so that the matter can be put behind us and settled? Mr. Speaker: I will make a statement as soon as I am in a position to do so regarding the report back, but I Mr. Speaker: I will do that—I promise that I will do assure the hon. Gentleman that I will keep the House that. informed in every way possible. Mr. Mark Field (Cities of London and Westminster) (Con): Further to that point of order, Mr. Speaker. The Susan Kramer (Richmond Park) (LD): Further to right hon. Member for Scunthorpe (Mr. Morley) and that point of order, Mr. Speaker. I ask for your guidance the hon. Member for Bury, North (Mr. Chaytor) have as to whether there is anything in your power to guide confessed to claiming fraudulently tens of thousands of the Government to provide us with an Opposition day pounds of taxpayers’ money for phantom mortgage debate in which this matter, which most of the House claims.—[Interruption.] wishes to debate, could be introduced as a substantive motion? Mr. Speaker: Order. Please—[Interruption.] Order. We have to be careful about what we say. There are Mr. Speaker: I have no responsibility for the subject things that I could have said from the Chair expressing of debate. I have to make it clear that I am not continuing anger about certain things, but I had to be careful. I with what seems to be a debate on this matter. I have must ask hon. Members to do so, too. I caution the made a statement. hon. Gentleman, not for my sake, but for his sake: he should not say this. In fact, I have to stop him saying it, Several hon. Members rose— and I give him good advice. 1211 18 MAY 2009 Skills in the Recession 1212

Mr. Willetts: My hon. Friend makes a valid point. It Opposition Day is certainly an idea that needs to be considered. Although the recession has increased unemployment [11TH ALLOTTED DAY] already, it is worth remembering that even in the boom years when the economy was growing, we were suffering Skills in the Recession from an increase in the rate of youth unemployment. The rate of unemployment among people aged 16 to Mr. Speaker: I inform the House that I have selected 24 grew from 13.4 per cent. in 1997 to 14.4 per cent. in the amendment in the name of the Prime Minister. 2007, so even in the good times before the recession hit we were already going backwards and losing ground, 3.48 pm compared with other OECD countries. Mr. David Willetts (Havant) (Con): I beg to move, Mr. Lindsay Hoyle (Chorley) (Lab): The hon. Gentleman That this House regrets the Government’s failure to deliver the is very generous with his time. I agree that skills are skills training and education needed if the economy is to emerge important, not only for young people but for everyone. stronger from the recession; condemns the incompetent management Does he share my belief that we should be investing in of further education colleges’ capital projects; is concerned that skills and keeping people in employment through the the percentage of young people not in education, employment or short-time working subsidy, rather than allowing them training has risen significantly since the start of the decade; notes to go to the job centre and trying to reskill them there? the concerns of training providers that funding allocations for 2009-10 will not support current apprentices to the end of their Would we not be better off investing in employment training; is disappointed that an estimated 1.4 million adult through the short-time working subsidy? learning places have been lost since 2005; and urges the Government Mr. Willetts: That is an interesting idea that is worth to set out, in consultation with the Association of Colleges, clear considering. Indeed, that is something else—going back criteria for the prioritisation of funding for college building to the intervention from my hon. Friend the Member projects, to provide support for more Masters degrees in science, technology, engineering and mathematics (STEM) subjects during for North-East Hertfordshire (Mr. Heald)—that we the downturn, to fund learners over the age of 25 in level 3 STEM introduced in the early 1980s, when unemployment was skills and to help apprentices at risk of losing their places to find high before. new employers or new training places. John Bercow (Buckingham) (Con): I have an unresolved Our motion is about the economic crisis facing our concern about clause 84 of the Apprenticeships, Skills, country, but I sense that it is not the House’s preoccupation Children and Learning Bill. My hon. Friend has at least at this very moment. However, the situation that we are two brains and probably an exemplary memory, so I in is perilous, because we face serious economic difficulties, trust he will recall that both on Second Reading of that which is the subject that we are debating, at a time when Bill and at questions to the Department for Innovation, the country has clearly lost confidence in us as the Universities and Skills—that is to say, on two separate House of Commons. We have to reflect on the seriousness occasions—I raised my concern that clause 84 as it of the constitutional challenges that we face, as well as stands is overly prescriptive because it would preclude the economic challenges. It is the combination of the from participation in apprenticeship schemes people two that makes our situation so serious. with special educational needs, who might be well suited The seriousness of the economic situation was brought to an apprenticeship but who do not have level 2 and home to us by last week’s unemployment figures, which level 3 qualifications. The Under-Secretary of State for showed an increase of 250,000 in three months—the Innovation, Universities and Skills, the hon. Member fastest quarterly increase on record, taking unemployment for Birmingham, Erdington (Mr. Simon), and the Minister to the level it was when Labour came to office in 1997. of State, the right hon. Member for Tottenham The Opposition’s fear is that young people in particular (Mr. Lammy), said that that concern would be addressed. will be the victims of the recession, one estimate being I hope that in the other place it will be. that if, tragically, unemployment were to rise to 3 million, Mr. Willetts: For a terrible moment I thought my more than 1.25 million of those unemployed people hon. Friend expected me to remember what was in that would be aged under 25. clause, without jogging my memory. I am grateful to him for reminding us. It is an issue about which he is Ian Stewart (Eccles) (Lab): If unemployment is a rightly passionate, and he is correct. One of our concerns tragedy now, why would the hon. Gentleman not accept about the Government’s approach to skills is that they and admit it was a tragedy for 3 million people to be are so obsessed with funding only the production of unemployed when he was in government? paper qualifications that people who, for whatever reason, Mr. Willetts: Indeed, it was a tragedy when 3 million may not be capable of getting a national vocational people were unemployed before. The aim of our debate qualification level 2 are often deprived of access to today is to identify the measures that can avoid that training under the Government’s new model. happening again. That is what we are focusing on. I remember a conversation at, I think, Coventry college, with a young lady with learning difficulties who Mr. Oliver Heald (North-East Hertfordshire) (Con): was doing a course in horticulture. Because that course I do not know whether my hon. Friend had an opportunity would not get her to an NVQ level 2, it was no longer to see the recent statement by the Association of Learning going to be provided because of the priorities that the Providers, pointing out how excellent the community Government had set for the Learning and Skills Council. programme under the Conservatives in the 1980s was, It is very important that people who can benefit from and saying that something similar, coupled with learning and from the most basic training, even if it will apprenticeships, could be a way of ensuring that apprentices not get them an NVQ level 2, continue to have access to do not lose their education and skills because they are training and apprenticeships. My hon. Friend is absolutely thrown out of work. Will he look at that idea? right on that. 1213 Skills in the Recession18 MAY 2009 Skills in the Recession 1214

Lembit Öpik (Montgomeryshire) (LD) rose— Dr. Lewis: When my hon. Friend turns to that horrific topic, will he make reference to Brockenhurst college in Rob Marris (Wolverhampton, South-West) (Lab) rose— my constituency, which I think he knows a considerable amount about, and the terrible position it has been left Mr. Willetts: I shall give way to the hon. Member for in as a result of the LSC’s appalling mismanagement? Montgomeryshire (Lembit Öpik). Mr. Willetts: My hon. Friend is absolutely right: I did Lembit Öpik: I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for indeed visit Brockenhurst college recently for a briefing making just that point. It strikes me, as a former training on the problems that it faces. I hope to turn to that and development manager, that the worst thing we can specific issue in a moment, but, first, I should like to do is to be over-prescriptive on the process and outcomes make some progress, because I have a bone to pick with from a distance. Does he agree that the best thing we the Secretary of State. can do is find a system that delivers high-quality training but allows training providers to provide what is needed Ian Stewart: Will the hon. Gentleman give way? to achieve the outcome we all want—namely, employment? Mr. Willetts: I shall take the hon. Gentleman’s Mr. Willetts: The hon. Gentleman may have been intervention in a moment. studying the widely read green paper that we produced The bone that I have to pick concerns what is happening on the subject, because that is absolutely our approach to the number of young people not in education, on the Conservative Benches. employment or training. On the Government’s own figures, which we obtained in a parliamentary answer, Rob Marris rose— and which have been constructed in a consistent series only since 2000, the number of young people not in Mr. Willetts: I shall take one more intervention and education, employment or training in 2000 was 630,000. then try to make some progress. In 2008, eight years later, the figure had increased Rob Marris: I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for shockingly to 860,000. When I released the Government’s his generosity. Further to his response to the intervention figures, the Secretary of State responded by saying that by the hon. Member for Buckingham (John Bercow), there had been a “straightforward deception”. He added: will he have a word with the Conservative-run council in “What the Conservatives don’t take into account is that there Wolverhampton, which has cut £640,000 from the adult are far more young people of that age group in our society than there were 10 years ago.” education service budget over a two-year period? That is absolutely monstrous, because it cuts courses for the He therefore says that, because there has been such a very people whose access to education and training the big increase in the number of young people, it is misleading hon. Gentleman supports. to count the absolute figures. However, I invite him to make that point to the Prime Minister, who, when Mr. Willetts: There have been savage reductions in challenged in this Chamber on the number of NEETs, adult education because of the priorities of the hon. said: Gentleman’s Government and the way in which the “In 1997, 5.2 million 16 to-24-year-olds were in full-time Learning and Skills Council allocates funding only to education or employment. The figure is now 6.1 million.”—[Official those courses that produce paper qualifications. If the Report, 22 April 2009; Vol. 491, c. 229.] hon. Gentleman cares so much about the subject, he If the Secretary of State believes that referring to absolute should sign the early-day motion that I and my hon. figures is a straightforward deception, I invite him to Friends have tabled, supporting adult learning and asking agree that the Prime Minister’s use of absolute figures the Government to change their approach so that the in that answer in the House was clearly a straightforward cuts of 1.5 million places in adult learning over the past deception. If the Secretary of State looks not simply at few years are reversed. the absolute figures but at the proportions in respect of what is indeed a growing number of young people, he Mr. Heald: Does my hon. Friend not think it a real will find that in 2000—the base from which we have to cheek for the hon. Member for Wolverhampton, South- take these statistics—12.3 per cent. of young people West (Rob Marris) to talk that way when the LSC has were NEETs, and that by 2008 that proportion had said that the Hitchin campus of North Hertfordshire gone up to 14.2 per cent. college cannot go ahead with the building project that it There has been an increase in both the absolute figure has been encouraged to put up? The hon. Gentleman and the proportion of young people not in education, tells us about cuts, but, goodness gracious, this Government employment or training—and it happened even during have cut back hard. My constituents really use the the boom years. It is important that the Government facilities, and we in Hitchin need the building programme recognise the scale of the problem over which they have to go ahead. presided and do not attempt to avoid the implications of the failure of their own policies. Mr. Willetts: My hon. Friend speaks for many Members, from all parts of the House, who are very concerned Ian Stewart rose— about what is happening to the proposals for their local further education colleges and their capital programmes. Mr. Willetts: I now give way to the hon. Member for Eccles (Ian Stewart). Dr. Julian Lewis (New Forest, East) (Con): Will my hon. Friend give way? Ian Stewart: I thank the hon. Gentleman, who has been extremely kind in allowing me to intervene again. Mr. Willetts: Before dealing with that issue, I give He will not know of my personal interest in these way to my hon. Friend. matters, although some of his colleagues will, and I 1215 Skills in the Recession18 MAY 2009 Skills in the Recession 1216 should say that at times I am not an uncritical friend of However, as in the example of those with learning the Government. My point is meant constructively. I difficulties, I was told that when the programmes do not recruited and served youth training scheme trainees, yield a level 2 or level 3 national vocational qualification youth opportunities programme, or YOP, trainees, rapidly enough, the LSC cuts back the funding. A lot of community enterprise scheme trainees and community programmes help to get young NEETs doing something— programme participants. I have to say to the hon. motorbike repair or whatever. However, programmes Gentleman that in those days, his Government’s provisions that do not immediately get students a paper qualification were make-work programmes without technical and of the type that the LSC is willing to fund are suffering. training content. Does he agree that the Government That is partly why the number of NEETs is going should spend more money, because training and skills up—it has gone up in absolute terms and as a percentage are expensive? Would he spend more money on the of the number of young people—and why the Secretary training and skills element? of State’s attempt to escape the implications of those figures was so irresponsible. Mr. Willetts: We have put forward practical proposals on how, in this very financial year, we could put in more Mrs. Ann Cryer (Keighley) (Lab) rose— money—particularly, for example, to help young people who need training in science, technology, engineering or Mr. Willetts: I will give way to the hon. Lady, although maths, also known as the STEM subjects. However, we I seem to be giving way a lot at the moment. need a mix. We need work experience; it is better to be doing something than to be doing nothing. If we are to Mrs. Cryer: The hon. Gentleman mentioned Keighley, emerge from this recession with a stronger and better my constituency. I understand that he was recently balanced economy, it is absolutely essential that we there, but is he aware that Keighley now has a £35 million invest in training and skills. That is why the Department LSC-funded capital build programme due to be completed for Innovation, Universities and Skills is so important next year, and within budget? I look forward to that and why my hon. Friends and I have called this debate. development, which will form part of Leeds City college, and I hope he will wish it well. We are heading in a new Mr. Mark Lancaster (North-East Milton Keynes) direction in Keighley, and I am very proud of what is (Con): On a more positive note, I am sure my hon. going on. Friend will join me in commending the innovative work of the Open university when it comes to reskilling Mr. Willetts: I am pleased for the hon. Lady that that young people. Does he share my concerns that that fine capital programme is going on in her area. There is a institution has not been well served by the Government lively debate about the Leeds City college plan. I personally in the past couple of years? think it is important that the merger mania in further education does not go too far. I am here to speak on Mr. Willetts: My hon. Friend is an eloquent advocate behalf of the 144 colleges with capital projects that are of the Open university, which I have enjoyed visiting not being funded in the same way as in her area. with him. He is absolutely right: the Open university, which has an enormous role to play, has suffered from Mrs. Maria Miller (Basingstoke) (Con): As a fellow the Government’s reductions in funding through the Hampshire MP, my hon. Friend may be aware of an notorious equivalent or lower qualification, or ELQ, organisation called ITeC in my constituency. It has a cuts. To be doing that during a recession seems absolutely fantastic record of success—87 per cent. of its students, extraordinary. who are between the ages of 16 and 24, go forward to be placed in employment—yet it is facing significant cuts Mr. Eric Illsley (Barnsley, Central) (Lab) rose— because of LSC funding problems. It is also facing the prospect of cutting up to 50 places before the end of Mr. Willetts: I give way to the hon. Gentleman, who I July—the sorts of places that would help my constituents hope will speak eloquently in favour of the case for his to get back into work. Would he care to comment on college. that? Mr. Illsley: I hope to do that a little later. For now, I just want to address the hon. Gentleman’s point about Mr. Willetts: My hon. Friend is absolutely right. The young people not in education, employment or training. reason for this debate, and the point that we make in It is not true that the Government did not make efforts the motion, is that there is an enormous gap between to reduce the figures. My area of Barnsley has traditionally the rhetoric from the Prime Minister, the Chancellor had a low take-up of post-16 education and training; and the Secretary of State, which is all about the importance last year, however, it managed to reduce its number of of investing in skills in the recession, and the reality on NEETS from about 15 to 8 per cent. thanks to the the ground, which is the complete opposite of what they valiant efforts of the Connexions service and Government talk about in this Chamber. Further education colleges funding. If a constituency such as mine can do that, cannot secure the capital funding that they need to other areas obviously can. We managed to do it through improve their provision, and many practical training Government funding and very hard work by our local courses are being cut because of the inability of DIUS Connexions service. and the LSC properly to manage their funding streams. Undoubtedly the most serious crisis in skills provision Mr. Willetts: I completely agree that it is possible to is in the financing of further education capital projects. reduce the number of NEETs. Indeed, I have visited I would like—on behalf, I am sure, of Members on both some fantastic programmes, often run by social enterprises, sides of the House—to pay tribute to the work that that do just that. I remember going to one in Keighley, colleges do. Many of us who visit colleges in our own for example, that was clearly reducing the number of constituencies and around the country realise that they young people not in education, employment or training. are crucial in improving social mobility, providing practical 1217 Skills in the Recession18 MAY 2009 Skills in the Recession 1218

[Mr. Willetts] The Secretary of State for Innovation, Universities and Skills (Mr. John Denham): The hon. Gentleman has training and giving people hope that they can emerge said several times in the House and outside that Ministers from this recession with more skills and better opportunities have encouraged colleges to submit inflated or over-grand in life. I am sure that we all also appreciate the excellent bids. Will he give me just one example of a Minister work that the Association of Colleges does on behalf of going to a college and asking it to withdraw its bid and colleges. submit a new one? If he cannot, I would be grateful if he stopped making that allegation. Mr. Gordon Marsden (Blackpool, South) (Lab) rose— Mr. Willetts: I will just make a tiny bit more progress, Mr. Willetts: I shall deal with the Secretary of State’s and then give way. responsibility in a moment. He has to accept some I have been visiting a range of colleges that are responsibility for the LSC’s actions. As with his denial suffering from the capital funding crisis, and I have been of the figures for NEETs, it is not good enough for him shocked by what I have discovered. Last week, I was at to try to escape responsibility for the policy, when he Huntingdon college, where I was briefed at first hand must have known what was going on. If he intends to about the problems that it faces. It clearly needs to move tell us that, for the past 18 months, when the LSC was to a new site, which it has already secured. It is part of a telling colleges to bid for more capital, he knew nothing regeneration project that now has a question mark about it, he is admitting to incompetence and failure to over it. discharge his responsibility as Secretary of State. Mr. Jonathan Djanogly (Huntingdon) (Con) rose— Justine Greening (Putney) (Con): South Thames college, which is just outside my constituency and used by many Mr. Willetts: My hon. Friend, who represents that of my constituents, received the other piece of bad constituency, is catching my eye, and I happily give way advice that colleges got. It had an ambitious project and to him. was advised to submit it in two halves. It got funding for Mr. Djanogly: I am pleased that my hon. Friend is the first half, but funding for the second has been put on mentioning the college in my constituency, which was hold, so it is stuck with a half done project that is no use grateful to him for visiting and taking the time to hear to anyone. about what is going on there. He will have seen the state of its dilapidated 1960s buildings, where the staff are Mr. Willetts: My hon. Friend is right. Some colleges doing the best they can. Does he therefore understand have already started demolishing part of their fabric, why my constituents and staff at the college are appalled and lessons are taking place in temporary classrooms as that they have lost out on £40 million that was promised they wait for permission for a capital project. In other for redevelopment at a time when we need to be investing colleges, the new project was to be part of the wider in training, not taking money away? regeneration of an area. Many serious problems face at least 144 colleges. Mr. Willetts rose— I want to ask the Secretary of State some specific Mr. Deputy Speaker (Sir Michael Lord): Order. Before questions on behalf of many of those colleges about the hon. Gentleman responds, may I say that some of what is going on. My first question follows from his the interventions are now long enough to be mini-speeches? intervention. Why did it take so long for the Department A large number of Members will be seeking to catch my for Innovation, Universities and Skills, for which he is eye, and this is a half-day debate. Although interventions responsible, to realise what was happening? are important, contribute to the debate and help the We know from Sir Andrew Foster’s excellent report whole thing along, every one means that it is less likely that alarm bells were sounding as early as February that an hon. Member will have the opportunity to make 2008, when the LSC’s director of property and infrastructure his speech. prepared a report. Its analysis of the capital promises being made concluded: Mr. Willetts: My speech is being cut even more rapidly than the FE capital programme. “This simply proves that the continuation of the current payment profile of projects is unaffordable to the Council.” I accept the point that my hon. Friend the Member for Huntingdon (Mr. Djanogly) makes—I have listed We know that that report from February 2008 was other colleges, which have a similar story to tell. One discussed by the LSC’s capital policy group in April example is Brockenhurst—my hon. Friend the Member 2008. We also know from Sir Andrew Foster’s report for New Forest, East (Dr. Lewis) is in his place—to that the Department attended all the meetings of these which a clear commitment was made to provide new groups at a senior level as an observer. Nevertheless, the training opportunities. Colleges have often been encouraged Secretary of State said, and I accept his word, that he to bid and then told, “Ah, you’re only bidding for knew about the problems with the capital funding of £20 million—that’s pathetic. Have you thought of bidding FE only in November 2008. for £50 million or £60 million?” They have been actively How on earth can we have a Department in which encouraged to do that. Even when the original idea was senior officials are aware from April, possibly February, for refurbishment or a modest set of improvements, that they have an unaffordable set of capital they were told, “No, knock the whole thing down and commitments—we know from the minutes, which I go for a grandiose capital project.” Having had their obtained through freedom of information requests, that hopes raised by the LSC, the Department and Ministers, members of the Department’s top management team they now find those hopes dashed. That is a cruel trick attended the meetings—and the Secretary of State seems to play on a crucial part of training and skills in our to have been kept in ignorance for six months? That is country. an extraordinary way to run a Department. 1219 Skills in the Recession18 MAY 2009 Skills in the Recession 1220

Mr. Marsden: rose— Ian Stewart rose—

Mr. Willetts: If the Secretary of State will not answer Mr. Willetts: Let me make some more progress. that challenge, I will happily accept the hon. Gentleman’s The problem is worse than that, however. We know, intervention. from the freedom of information requests that we have made and from the minutes that we have read, that the Mr. Marsden: The hon. Gentleman’s litany of concern “no bad news” culture spread as far as giving deliberately for colleges would have rather more force if the Government misleading accounts of what happened at some of the whom he supported in the 1990s had done anything crucial meetings of the Learning and Skills Council. about their funding. Does the shadow Secretary of The minutes of the meeting on 17 December 2008, State agree that his position is greatly undermined by which was attended by the Secretary of State’s senior the fact that last year the National Audit Office pointed officials, as all the previous ones were, show the following out the appalling lack of investment from his Government crucial item, when the problem was finally confronted: before 1997? “Council asked that a correction” be made to the minutes of the previous meeting. The Mr. Willetts: The one thing that colleges all say is that minutes continued: when they were funded by the Further Education Funding Council, they were trusted to exercise discretion, which “The report stated that ‘Atits meeting on 5 November 2008 the Council did not have time to consider and determine the project meant that they could tackle local problems such as proposals…recommended at the…October Capital Committee NEETs without being funded by the Learning and meeting’.” Skills Council simply to produce paper qualifications. That was what the minutes of the November meeting Colleges look back upon that freedom to run their own stated. This is what was added subsequently: affairs very fondly indeed, and we are committed to restoring it to them. The best way to ensure efficiency “It was noted and acknowledged that the main underlying and high performance from colleges is to give them the reason had been concern over affordability.” freedom to run their own affairs, and that is what we are In other words, it was recognised that the minutes of the committed to doing. previous meeting had been misleading. The council had pretended that the problem was that there was no time I want to pursue the important question of exactly to discuss the capital projects; they admitted, at the why it took almost a year, from the first report by the subsequent meeting, that the underlying reason was Learning and Skills Council, in February 2008, for the “concern over affordability”. Secretary of State to make his first public comment on the matter, which he did in late January 2009. Indeed, The problem reached the stage that the minute-taking even now we are still waiting for him to come to the in the Learning and Skills Council was deceitful, in that House to make a proper oral statement about what is it was not willing to acknowledge the capital problem. happening to college funding. It is now 15 months since That is why there was a failure of management in the the problem was first identified. When he last made a capital project. At no stage was anyone openly reporting written statement to the House, he said: between the LSC and DIUS or between DIUS officials “I will make a further statement to the House after the recess”.— and Ministers about what was happening. The Secretary [Official Report, 1 April 2009; Vol. 490, c. 72WS.] of State has to take responsibility for that culture, and for the way in which the Learning and Skills Council We have already had that recess; in fact, we are about to functions. have another one, and still there is no sign of the Secretary of State volunteering any information. At every stage, the information has had to be secured by us, Ian Stewart: I thank the hon. Gentleman for giving making freedom of information requests, tabling written way; he has been generous with his time. This is an questions and calling debates. It is a pity that at no important issue, and it is important for us to get to the point has he felt able to come to the House to volunteer bottom of it. I am intrigued by the details that he has information in Government time about what is happening put forward today, but is he aware that, when the to our colleges. former chief executive of the Learning and Skills Council stood down, he went on record to say that he did not Mrs. Cryer: Will the hon. Gentleman give way? become aware of the issue until October, and that the reason for that was, he claimed, that the council was looking at in-year figures? The hon. Gentleman has hit Mr. Willetts: I am going to make some progress. on some interesting points today, and perhaps we can We know from Sir Andrew Foster’s excellent report get to the bottom of this. why the problem built up in the way that it did. Sir Andrew gave one reason why the information was not Mr. Willetts: There were clearly managerial failings percolating through to the Secretary of State: within the Learning and Skills Council, but I do not “I am left with a distinct feeling that bad news was itself bad think that it is feasible to say that the problem was news, too difficult to handle; yet this is exactly what management simply a matter of those failings. We, the Opposition, has to do.” are trying to hold the Government to account and to People were not willing to bring to the Secretary of find out why there was a culture of bad news not being State the bad news about what was happening in the reported, of minutes of meetings being misleadingly Learning and Skills Council and in further education reported, and of crucial information not being conveyed. capital projects. I regard that as a serious dereliction of We need to find out why there was almost a year duty. between the problem first being identified and any public statement being made by the Secretary of State, Rob Marris rose— and why we still have not had the statement that was 1221 Skills in the Recession18 MAY 2009 Skills in the Recession 1222

[Mr. Willetts] ahead, that money could count as current expenditure instead. Counting it as current expenditure could drive promised before the last recess. As hon. Members in all colleges into deficit. I see my right hon. Friend the parts of the House understand from other contexts, Member for North-West Hampshire (Sir George Young) there is a need for openness, and a lack of openness has in his place. He, too, has raised that matter, because it contributed to the scale of this problem. affects his local college. Some colleges might find themselves in breach of banking covenants if their current expenditure Rob Marris: Will the hon. Gentleman give way? budgets are suddenly hit. Therefore, we need authoritative advice about the accounting treatment in these Mr. Willetts: I am going to try to make some progress, circumstances and about the prospects for colleges to because many other Members want to speak. get redress for the costs that they have already incurred. I want the Secretary of State to comment on certain It is interesting to look through the minutes, because other crucial points. We need him to tell us, authoritatively, another revealing item from them suggests one of the how many colleges are affected by this problem. The reasons for the secrecy surrounding all these matters. figure of 144 comes from a letter that I received from The minutes state: the Learning and Skills Council after I had asked questions in the House, but we need the Secretary of “Members asked that a clear action plan be in place to respond to any legal challenges arising from its decision to carryover State to give us an updated account. As soon as the list project approvals from its December 2008 meeting”. of colleges was released, I started getting e-mails from people asking why their college was not on it. We then One suspects that the LSC is legally vulnerable when discovered that there were other colleges involved that colleges have incurred these items of expenditure; again, had not been on the first, official list, but we have not we are waiting to hear some authoritative guidance had a further, authoritative update from the Department from the Secretary of State. on how many colleges it thinks are affected by the crisis. Members of all parties will be concerned about the May I also ask the Secretary of State what criteria problems facing colleges in their constituencies and I will be applied as he tries to get the further education want to give as many of them as possible the opportunity colleges out of the appalling mess that they find themselves to raise their specific concerns. However, as well as in? We realise that there will have to be priorities, noting the individual injustices and grievances, we should because there is a capital overhang of £3 billion or not lose sight of what this tells us about the importance more, and that the needs of all the colleges cannot be of investing in skills in a recession and this Government’s met easily or rapidly. However, there needs to be far failure to give FE colleges the opportunity to do just more public information than we have had so far on the that. criteria that will be applied and on how the limited If we wanted to know what was wrong with this amount of money will be dispensed. Government’s approach to skills, I could think of no more vivid example than the recent report from the UK Mr. Marsden: Will the hon. Gentleman give way? Commission for Employment and Skills. The Secretary of State would not need to read even the executive Mr. Willetts: No, I want to make some more progress. summary; all he needs to read are the statistics on the We are told that one criterion will be whether a cover, which show the international ranking for the project is shovel-ready, but there will be others. What three levels of skills. For the highest level, the UK’s about the projects that are part of the wider regeneration position is 12th internationally.The Government’s ambition of a town or district, for example? What priority will go is that we should be eighth by 2020, but the report to them? We also need to know what will happen to projects that, on current policies, we will be 10th. For those colleges that have made commitments to buy land intermediate skills, we are currently 18th in the international or commitments to move. How much weight will be league table. The Government’s aim is for us to be in the attached to that consideration? top eight, but the report says that on current policies we It will be tempting—and I suspect that the Secretary will go down to 21st by 2020. As regards low skills—we of State will succumb to the temptation—to say that the have a particular obligation to people with low skills crucial issue will be to knock down the building costs because the issue is fundamental to social mobility—our charged by the building industry, and indeed there current international position is 17th. The Government’s might be some savings to be made in that way. Will he aim is for us to be eighth by 2020, but the independent acknowledge, however, that one reason that these projects report suggests that, at this rate under this Government’s have turned out to be so expensive is the extraordinarily policies, we will be 23rd internationally in 2020. That is cumbersome regulatory procedures surrounding them, why we need a different approach and why I commend involving preferred builders and preferred planning the motion to the House. consultants who might be approved of for one region but not for another? Many colleges have told me that 4.27 pm they could have delivered their capital project at a much more modest price than it was ultimately billed The Secretary of State for Innovation, Universities for, if only they had been free from the bureaucracy of and Skills (Mr. John Denham): I beg to move an the LSC. amendment, to leave out from “House” to the end of the Question and add: Will the Secretary of State also explain exactly how costs that have already been incurred by colleges will be “notes the Government’s belief that in a recession it is important to give people the skills they and their employers need to recover treated? According to the Association of Colleges, from the downturn; commends this year’s Budget for investing £187 million worth of expenditure that was thought to £1.2 billion in creating jobs and providing training to young be part of capital projects might already have been people who have been unemployed for 12 months; further notes incurred, but if those projects are no longer going that there are now more 18 to 24 year-olds working or engaged in 1223 Skills in the Recession18 MAY 2009 Skills in the Recession 1224 full-time education compared to 1997; commends the Government evidence we have on the Opposition’s record and their for its sustained investment in skills with record numbers of current plans, they pose a threat to everything that has people now receiving training, far more than was originally been achieved in recent years. planned for this year; further commends the Government for spending over £5 billion on adult skills this year, helping three I warn any Conservative Member who plans to intervene million learners, and for increasing investment in higher education on me that I will challenge them to tell their constituents by 24 per cent. in real terms since 1997; further notes that the the truth about how Conservative plans would hit their Government is prioritising helping people to gain employability constituents and their colleges. skills; further notes that the Train to Gain budget has risen to £925 million this year; further notes the budget for apprenticeships is over £1 billion this year and that there are 250,000 starts Rob Marris: Does my right hon. Friend find it surprising planned; commends the Government for confirming that no that the hon. Member for Havant (Mr. Willetts) lambasted current learner will lack the funds to complete their course; rhetoric, but then proceeded—in speaking to a motion further notes that this Government is spending £2.6 billion on containing some good points, albeit not many—to put further education capital projects over this spending review period; no flesh whatever on the bones of how the worthy and further notes that Sir Andrew Foster has recently produced proposals that he might propose would be funded? It is an independent review of the Building Colleges for the Future just rhetoric unless the Opposition say how much they programme.” would spend and how they would raise that money. I welcome this debate, but I am surprised by the temerity of the hon. Member for Havant (Mr. Willetts) Mr. Denham: My hon. Friend makes a good point in raising it. The hon. Gentleman quite often repeats that I will come to later, but I make the point now that, unfounded allegations that, as the House heard earlier, having read the Opposition motion, I was looking he is unable to justify. That is a shame, because the forward to a detailed explanation of the plans for young issues we are debating are of real importance to our people that were announced with a flourish a few weeks society and they are better conducted by not making ago and of where the £600 million that is to be invested allegations that cannot be substantiated. would come from. Despite speaking for the best part of It is true that, as this country works to recover from 50 minutes, the hon. Member for Havant did not even the impact of the global recession, it is going to be mention his party’s policies, where the money would British business and the skills of the British people that come from and how it would be funded. I will explain ultimately ensure that the upturn comes as quickly, as why he—despite what I have said, he is a man of strongly and as sustainably as possible. Investing in the integrity, honesty and intelligence—could not bring skills of the British people is one of the most important himself to discuss those policies in the House. things we can do. Through training, we can improve their productivity and the productivity of their companies. Mr. Marsden: Among the rather curious lacunae in Through training, we can give individuals the skills they the shadow Secretary of State’s speech was any reference need—skills to keep their jobs, skills to get new jobs and to the importance of higher education delivered via skills to develop their careers and provide a decent life further education, yet we know that 12 per cent. is so for themselves and their families. delivered in this country, notably in my constituency at Blackpool and The Fylde college. Mr. Heald: When I was a Minister, I expected my Does my right hon. Friend the Secretary of State officials to tell me as soon as they knew something was agree that if we were to take the previous Government’s going wrong, in case the Opposition spokesman gave record of investment in higher education from 1992 as me a hard time. In fact, it was the right hon. Gentleman. an indication of what this Conservative party would do I would like to know whether he works on the same for higher and further education, my constituents and basis; and, if so, what went wrong? Was the junior my college in Blackpool would be right to be concerned? Minister not told about the meetings that officials were attending where all the money was obviously wrong? Mr. Denham: My hon. Friend is absolutely right. The Government’s record of investment over 10 years and Mr. Denham: We will come on the Learning and of increasing real spending in higher education stands Skills Council in due course, but I point out to the hon. in sharp contrast to what happened in the previous Gentleman that, yes, I do expect to be told. One of the 10 years, when funding per student fell by 30 per cent. reasons I commissioned the Foster report—it did not The expansion of colleges such as his, which bring the just appear out of nowhere; I commissioned it before opportunity of higher education to many students who, anyone had a clear picture of the size and scale of the for all sorts of reasons, either choose not to or cannot problem—was that I wanted to understand what had travel away from home to go to university, has been an happened. That is the way I have always worked as a enormous achievement over that period. Minister. I gave him a hard time when he was a Minister The truth is that much of the speech made by the and I was Opposition spokesman, and I think I often hon. Member for Havant was made up of complaints told him things that he did not know, but Ministers do that we are not spending enough money on something and should expect to be informed. Where that does not when everybody knows that the Opposition’s policy is happen, clearly it is a matter of regret and we usually to spend less money on everything. follow such things through. The hon. Member for Havant set out a series of David Tredinnick (Bosworth) (Con): I understand charges. I intend to rebut each one. I will set out clearly that the Secretary of State is trying to blunt the attack why he is wrong and why his criticisms are misplaced, from this side of the House, but we are the Opposition and say why the Government should be proud, although and it is our job to bring the problems to his attention. I never complacent, about our record. I will do more was at North Warwickshire & Hinckley college on than that: I will set out why, according to all the Thursday, at the college’s request. It is confronted with 1225 Skills in the Recession18 MAY 2009 Skills in the Recession 1226

[David Tredinnick] There has also been a huge increase in apprenticeships for the over-25s. We expect 60,000 over-25s to start a £2.5 million cut in expenditure to which it is already apprenticeships this year, compared with the 29,000 committed, including £1.5 million on Train to Gain, that we had planned. That, too, is good news, and we which is 30 per cent. of the budget. Will he please be still have sufficient money—more than £1 billion—to generous enough to allow me a short meeting with him start 250,000 apprenticeships in the coming year. to explain the situation at the college, where a little In relation to the point made by the hon. Member for extra money would solve a lot of problems to do with Bosworth (David Tredinnick) about north Warwickshire, committed expenditure? the very success of the programme, which is doing so much for the country and for learners, has meant the Mr. Denham: Given the motion, I rather expected LSC adjusting and readjusting contracts with colleges some reference to be made to these issues by the and providers. That has created uncertainty for some Conservative spokesman, but he missed them out entirely. colleges and other providers. The LSC is writing to If I may, I shall turn straight away to the position of providers today, giving a similar message to mine about Train to Gain and the apprenticeships programme, and the coming year. It is working quickly with individual the hon. Gentleman may then feel that he has been providers to resolve funding allocations for the rest of reassured. the year. I refer to the Opposition motion in saying that The most important and fastest-growing programme that letter will include an absolute guarantee that the of training for people at work is Train to Gain. It funding will be there for every learner who has started a provides training at work, chosen by employers and course or apprenticeship to complete it. described by the deputy director general of the CBI as “exactly the product we need at this time.” Joan Walley (Stoke-on-Trent, North) (Lab): I am Last summer, of course, the Opposition promised to heartened by the news that we have just heard, but in abolish Train to Gain. In the two years 2008 to 2010—this view of the announcement that he has just made, can academic year and the next—we set out to train 1.291 my right hon. Friend give me an undertaking that where million people. Train to Gain has been hugely successful—so there is uncertainty about local colleges having sufficient successful that overall we will deliver 100,000 more funds to carry on providing all these wonderful training starts and learners over those two years than we had opportunities, there will not be any need to make previously planned. That success means that we are redundancies of any kind? training tens of thousands of people today who might Mr. Denham: The Learning and Skills Council is otherwise have started their training only late this year working with colleges as quickly as possible in order to or next year, and who would not have been trained at all provide certainty. What I wanted to do today was give if the Opposition had their way. We need as much the headline news that the number of learners whom we training as possible in the recession, so that people expect to start on Train to Gain in the coming year is being trained and their employers can benefit now and the same as the number that people will have seen in make the recovery stronger. published plans. It is hard for me to give details of each Rob Marris: My right hon. Friend is making a powerful college, but I have at least been able to specify the global case in relation to the official Opposition, the Conservative amount of training that is available. party. May I urge him, when he has finished wisely and carefully savaging the official Opposition, to turn his Mr. David Anderson (Blaydon) (Lab): The Secretary attention to savaging the Liberal Democrats? In this of State has referred to the policy vacuum in the debate on skills in the recession, they can muster one Conservative party. What does he think are the party’s MP for a debate that has now been going on for more plans for the 22,000 union learning reps or the 250,000 than 45 minutes. Does he not agree that that indicates learners who went to learn at work last year? Does he what a low priority the Liberal Democrats place on think that it has any plans for them? skills in the recession? Mr. Denham: As far as I know, the Conservatives are Mr. Denham: I am grateful to my hon. Friend for completely silent on the issue. On Friday I presented drawing that to my attention, because I must admit that certificates to learners at the town depot union learning I had not noticed the Liberal Democrat. centre in Southampton, in my constituency, and everyone there was well aware that it was the Government who I return to the success of Train to Gain and the had invested in union learning reps and made it possible Opposition’s plans to abolish it and prevent 1.291 million for so many people to learn. people from learning at work over two years. It is a huge tribute to colleges, training providers and employers Mr. Marsden: I thank my right hon. Friend for being that they have done so much to expand training. That so generous in giving way.Is he aware that the Conservatives backs up the changes that we made to make Train to recently produced a lengthy policy document on skills Gain more flexible and better tailored to company in which union learning reps were not mentioned once? needs, particularly those of small businesses. Obviously Given their failure to make any commitment, is it not no budget can be unlimited, and in the longer term we the case that we can have no trust or belief in their need to ensure that the commitments made do not ability to support the programme if they ever came outstrip our resources. Because the programme has to office? been so successful, I have considered every way in which I can find more resources. Today, I am confident that Mr. Denham: My hon. Friend makes a very good the number of people who start Train to Gain this year point, which I am sure will be noted by all who care will be in line with our published plans. As I have said, about the future of union learning reps. Incidentally, overall there will be 100,000 more starts and learners in that does not apply only to union learning reps themselves. 2008-09 and 2010-11 than we first planned. One of the interesting aspects of the programme is the 1227 Skills in the Recession18 MAY 2009 Skills in the Recession 1228 number of employers who say that it has transformed sustain investment to grow our way out of recession, so their productivity and the quality of service they provide they could not have introduced the guaranteed offer of for the people to whom they sell products. work or training for young people who are out of work for a long period. As part of that package of £1.7 billion Mr. Willetts: The Secretary of State is trying to of investment, my Department will be able offer more address what is indeed a serious worry felt by many than 80,000 training places for young adults who have learning providers about their funding for 2009-10, but been unemployed for more than 12 months. We will may I ask him to clarify one key point? When he refers start that from the autumn. The Opposition also could to 2009-10, does he mean the Government’s financial not match the extra £250 million we are already putting year or the academic year, which is what many providers in place to help people with flexible training and advice use for the purposes of their planning? The letters that to improve employability skills and to get them back they received recently from the Learning and Skills into work, including 75,000 training places for people Council concern the academic year 2009-10. who have been out of work for six months. People will be able to start that training when they are out of work Mr. Denham: I am glad that the hon. Gentleman has by going to college, and then continue it when they are raised that point now. His motion refers to it, but he in work through Train to Gain. forgot to mention it in his speech. That will suggest to many providers that he does not consider it a particularly Mrs. Cryer: Keighley is doing very well, with a new-build important issue and would rather spend his time reading college, which will be excellent, and I appreciate that. out large chunks of the Foster report, which all Members Does my right hon. Friend remember, however, that the have been able to read for themselves. Thatcher Government got rid of the industrial training The answer to the hon. Gentleman’s question is that boards, which were wonderful organisations for producing the figures that we published, which I have described as training for skills? What will the Conservatives’ demolition planning totals, relate to academic years. The Department job be next time if, unfortunately, they get elected obviously works in the context of financial years, as do again? all of us who come under the Treasury’s remit, but the figures to which I referred related to the current academic Mr. Denham: The reality is that everything we hear year. I made that clear at the time, but I have now from the Conservatives suggests that they will return clarified it again. pretty much to the same position, which is that if employers are not prepared to pay for skills training, Mr. Mark Hoban (Fareham) (Con): The Secretary of that should not happen. State spoke of the uncertainty of funding for colleges for the next academic year. Fareham college in my Mrs. Maria Miller: The Secretary of State talks a constituency expects to recruit another 100 to 150 16-to- great deal about the investment he plans to put into this 18-year-olds in line with increasing participation, but sector but, as my hon. Friend the Member for Fareham there is currently no certainty in regard to whether that (Mr. Hoban) pointed out, that does not marry with the increase will be funded by the Hampshire branch of the reality on the ground. What message would the Secretary Learning and Skills Council. of State give to organisations, such as ITeC in my constituency, which are cutting places before the summer Mr. Denham: I shall deal with that point later, but I comes because the money he is talking about simply is shall deal with it now as well. The hon. Gentleman not forthcoming? should know that the budget for the next two academic Mr. Denham: The hon. Lady clearly has not quite years includes a total of £655 million for the sixth-form grasped the gist of the debate so far. What I have and 16-to-18 college sector to enable those colleges to said—very clearly—is that we have far more people in expand and offer additional places. That is a very training today than we had planned to have in training significant investment in the future of young people, today. I have also said that in the coming year we will but the Conservative party’s policy of refusing to borrow train the same amount of people that we had planned and refusing to invest so that we can grow our way out to train. Because we have had the great success of of the recession means that it could not be made if it training people early and because budgets are not unlimited, came to power. The hon. Gentleman should tell Fareham we are having to adjust the budgets of training providers, college that the Labour Government is to invest £655 million but I say to the hon. Lady that this is not a cut. We are in young people over the next two years, and then say not reducing the number of people being trained. More “If you vote Conservative in Fareham you will not get people will have been trained over this two-year period the money.”That would be the honest way of approaching than we had planned. Next year, as many people will be his constituents. planned for as the providers would have been expecting. It is our belief in a demand-led training system that I have acknowledged tensions in the handling of that, has enabled the successful expansion of Train to Gain but that is the picture that she needs to take back to her and adult apprenticeships. As I acknowledged, it has college. She should say to it, “The good news is that, created tensions between the dynamic entrepreneurial despite the fact that the training system in this country training system we want and the need to manage public is currently training more people than it had planned, it finances, and I know that the LSC wants to work out is still confident that it will be planning for as many with providers how those tensions should be managed people next year as it had set out.” That is enormously in future. good news, and I hope I can rely on the hon. Lady—I Our work is not just about delivering the promises we am absolutely sure that I can—to take that message made in the past. The recent Budget gave us new back to Basingstoke, rather than to return there and say resources to invest, but the Opposition could not do that the situation is different. The LSC will send the that; they oppose our decision to use borrowing to detailed allocations out to colleges as soon as possible. 1229 Skills in the Recession18 MAY 2009 Skills in the Recession 1230

[Mr. Denham] have happened. I have made that clear and, as Secretary of State, I have also come to the House to apologise to I have talked about the investment that the Budget those who have been affected. It was me who asked enables us to make in the future of young people, and Sir Andrew Foster to carry out the review, and I, like which the hon. Member for Havant and his party would the hon. Member for Havant, think that his report has not match. That is why it is so extraordinary that the set out fairly the mismanagement that led to the problem. hon. Gentleman raises the NEETs issue. There is an old But let us be clear about the background to this debate. debate here, and at the crux of it are two issues. The first Twelve years ago, when the Opposition were in power, issue is the hon. Gentleman’s reluctance to give the there was no budget for FE capital. [Interruption.] This Government the credit for having 1 million more young is rather important, because when hon. Members talk people in education, work and training than 10 years movingly about their dilapidated 1960s buildings, as ago. That was not an act of God or an accident; it was happened today, we must ask how long buildings— something that Government policy set out to achieve. sometimes those much older than that—were left to be The second reason we have disagreed with him is that he dilapidated. It is relevant that the starting point— has always made the most of the figures by including in [Interruption.] his list of NEETs young mothers who are at home bringing up families. I always feel that he comes here to Adam Afriyie (Windsor) (Con): He’s had 12 years to attack the Government over NEETs and then goes sort it out but failed. outside to make speeches about the importance of family policy. I have always acknowledged that we Mr. Denham: The hon. Gentleman asks me about should focus on a smaller group of young people who 12 years and whether a Government should have seriously are detached from the labour market—from managed, within that period, to transform all the legacy education, work and training. In some ways, that is the that his party left. I have to say no, but we have made a debate that he and I have had with great regularity over very good start—we have done much better than we the past two years. would have done with the zero capital budget that we Let us acknowledge that today there is a more pressing found. debate, because times are harder for young people. We The second point to make about the background is are determined not to write off a generation of young that the Conservative party, despite its history, fails to people, as the Conservative party did in the recession of give any credit—ever—to the huge scale of investment the late 80s and early 90s. That is why we are raising the that has been and is being made in FE capital. I would participation age over the next few years to keep young have a lot more time for the criticisms that are made by people in education and training and work with training— the Conservatives if they acknowledged the scale of that practical measure to help young people is opposed what is being achieved. Since 2001, 700 projects, at by the Conservatives—and why we are putting a further nearly 330 colleges, have been funded and in those areas £655 million into 16 to 18 learning this year and next to that has transformed the FE estate for learners. In the enable colleges and sixth forms to meet rising demand. current spending review we were committed to, and will The Conservatives’policies could not match that investment, spend, £2.3 billion, and that was on top of the £2 billion and the hon. Gentleman cannot honestly match our spent between 1997 and 2008. It is true that despite the guaranteed offer of work and training to young people huge scale of that programme, its management by the who cannot find work for a long time. I am happy to LSC has raised the expectations and hopes of colleges. I debate NEETs. It is a serious issue and we recognise the can understand the feelings of those who do not know challenges facing young people today, so I must say to where they stand or feel that they might not get their him that investing in those young people and creating colleges within the time scale that they had hoped. That opportunities for work, for training and for education is is why, in the recent Budget, my Department was allocated how we must tackle the number of young people who £1.2 billion on top of the investment that we had are doing none of those things, not cutting the support already received, enabling us to get vital schemes going we provide for them. within the next two years and to plan for the future. Mr. Marsden: Does my right hon. Friend acknowledge By contrast, the hon. Member for Havant went to the that work-based learning is a key element and that in Association of Colleges conference last October, where my own county of Lancashire that grew by 30 to 35 per he was asked whether he could guarantee that the cent. between 2006 and 2007? Does he also agree that Conservatives would deliver the planned spending even part of this is about using frameworks and structures in for 2010-11. He told the conference that he could not. which employers and the general public can have confidence That is the truth. While we are working through the and that the Conservative party, by its failure to get LSC and with the AOC to begin to prioritise more wholeheartedly behind the diplomas process and, indeed, schemes and to get them under way, a Government with aspects of the apprenticeships process, has hindered the hon. Gentleman in it would cut the schemes that are rather than assisted the process? already under way. We are doing what the resolution calls for—or, rather, Mr. Denham: Yes, it has always been a matter of the LSC is working with the AOC to work out priorities shame that the Conservative party has blown so hot and and to deal with the difficult task of prioritisation. The cold on the development of the diplomas. For many LSC is out to consultation at the moment and is working young people, they provide a range of options of learning with the AOC on those criteria. When I have received that has not been in place previously, including the advice from the LSC on that, it will be in a position to important work-based learning. publish the criteria. Let us turn to the further education capital programme. The position we are in, with over-commitments made Mr. John Hayes (South Holland and The Deepings) and expectations raised unrealistically high, should not (Con) rose— 1231 Skills in the Recession18 MAY 2009 Skills in the Recession 1232

Mr. Denham: The hon. Gentleman is trying to intervene on that. The Stoke-on-Trent college application related as if there is a major issue here. This has to be got right. to a phased programme, which included two new builds We know that large numbers of colleges are anxiously on the Shelton and Burslem sites. It is critical that awaiting these decisions and that is why it is important regeneration and the ability of people to change their that the LSC, working with people in the sector, gets aspirations and skills are part of the new review, so that this right. the much-needed investment in the Burslem campus in Stoke-on-Trent can go ahead, too. Mr. Hayes: I acknowledge the investment that the Government have made in FE capital in the past, but Mr. Denham: I recognise the points that my hon. there is a major issue, so will the Secretary of State Friend raises, and the way in which she has argued the answer two very simple questions? First, how many case for her constituency. Of course she is right that the colleges are affected—140, 150, 180 or 200? Secondly, relationship between a college programme and regeneration did the officials in his Department know about the must be one of the criteria. I do not want to get drawn problem in the first half of last year? into the criteria debate. I simply say, and I hope that the House will understand, that it is relatively simple to list Mr. Denham: The figure of 144 colleges that we have the issues that should be taken into account; the challenge published is the information supplied to us in March by is to decide what weighting should be given to the the LSC through its analysis. I understand that it has different factors, so that when everybody looks at the been suggested that other colleges felt that they had final outcome, people at least feel that it is fair and schemes in preparation, regarded those schemes as being consistent, although it will be impossible to produce an in the pipeline, had been in discussions and so on. In outcome in which everybody is happy. That work is reality, that is the latest and most accurate figure with going on at the moment. which I have been provided by the LSC. I should make some progress, and bring my remarks The Foster report sets out in some detail the meetings to a close. The hon. Member for Havant repeated his that took place where my Department was represented criticism about the reduction in the number of non- at official level in the early part of last year. Foster’s vocational leisure courses as a result of our having conclusion is that opportunities were not taken to prevent prioritised training for work. That is one of the reasons this problem from happening. That is undoubtedly a he wants to scrap Train to Gain, but his priority is fair judgment. I would say two things about that. First, wrong. It is not just me saying so; the CBI and the there is no ambiguity that Ministers were first alerted to Institute of Directors have both said that Train to Gain the existence of a problem—not the problem as we now is the right policy. The CBI said that it was define it, but a potential or emerging problem—in “concerned by plans”— November. Secondly, Foster raised the core issue of the that is, Opposition plans— clarity or otherwise of how accountability is exercised “to divert money from the Train to Gain programme, as this is between a Department and its non-departmental bodies. designed to ensure that public funds are invested in training that The hon. Member for South Holland and The Deepings delivers improved business and workforce performance.” (Mr. Hayes) will know that when we published the The Institute of Directors said, in response to the Foster review, I asked the permanent secretary of my Opposition’s proposal: Department to carry out a view of the accountability “The Train to Gain scheme is not perfect, requires greater arrangements. We have many non-departmental bodies, flexibility and needs to promote higher level skills as well as the and they are all different in nature. It is critical that basics. But the principle of the initiative has great merit and the officials know precisely what level of authority they are focus of policy should be on improving the service rather than expected to exercise. diverting funds away.” The hon. Gentleman will know that in the case of the I am as keen on learning for its own sake as anyone. LSC the previous chief executive, who was himself not That is why I worked across Government to launch the informed until late in the day, took responsibility for White Paper, “The Learning Revolution”, and why we what happened and left the LSC. The hon. Gentleman have just opened bids for a £20-million fund to get will also know that the LSC is being replaced by the informal learning going in new ways and new venues. Skills Funding Agency, which will not be a non- However, the real priority today must be the skills that departmental public body. I think that that will help. I we need to get Britain out of recession. hope that something like this will not happen in the Finally, let me turn to the hon. Gentleman’s proposals future, but in such a situation the lines of accountability for new investment, because I find them a little distasteful. and responsibility will be much clearer. We are talking about not party political point-scoring, but the hopes and aspirations of an anxious generation Joan Walley: I recognise that the Secretary of State of young people, who deserve to be treated honestly has come to the House and said that there are problems, and with respect. When he announced his £600-million and that he takes responsibility for putting those problems package, we could not understand where the money was right. However, in respect of the Foster review and the coming from. Then the Conservatives told us: it was to discussions taking place between the Learning and Skills come from the cuts that they had already announced—the Council, further education colleges and their associations, £610 million of cuts to my Department’s budget for this it is critical that he looks at the role of regeneration in year, announced by the Leader of the Opposition on places where communities need to be transformed. I 5 January. I wrote to the hon. Member for Havant on welcome the fact that on 4 March he announced to the 15 January, asking what he would cut. He never replied. House that detailed consent would now go ahead for That is the disgraceful scam revealed. The idea is to the Building Colleges for the Future programme in claim that one could cut £600 million without saying Stoke-on-Trent and for seven other colleges. I have how, and then publish a really attractive list of proposals already had a meeting with a Minister in his Department funded from the same non-existent cuts. The point is 1233 Skills in the Recession18 MAY 2009 Skills in the Recession 1234

[Mr. Denham] health problems through the medium of art. It invited me to do a drawing, and I did a not-very-good illustration that that is not the way to treat young people or their of the Houses of Parliament as seen from the other side parents. They deserve to be treated honestly and with of the Thames. None the less, the work that the charity respect. The hon. Gentleman proposed this debate, but does is important, and learning does not necessarily I think that he made a mistake. need to lead to an accredited qualification—it has other purposes as well. 5.4 pm The motion tabled by the hon. Member for Havant Stephen Williams (Bristol, West) (LD): Investment in (Mr. Willetts) rightly mentioned the fact that far too skills and training is always important, whether we are many people are not in education, employment or training. in the middle of a period of prosperity or a recession; We can have a debate about the number of people the latter is the background to this debate. I am sure involved and what the situation was in 1997, and what that all three Front-Bench spokesmen visit many further the situation is in 2009, but I must tell the Secretary of education colleges as part of our work. I certainly visit State that the Education and Skills Act 2008, which the City of Bristol college and Filton college in Greater raises the age of compulsory participation in education Bristol, and see the important work that is done in and training, is not the answer. Engagement, particularly those colleges to upskill the population of Bristol. I with young people, is much more important. If, at the have seen the skills work that they do in construction, age of 14, people have mentally dropped out of education and in catering. I have even had several lunches at City and at 16 are deemed to have failed the academic of Bristol college prepared by its excellent catering education offered to them under existing arrangements, students, and served by those who are learning waitressing forcing them to stay until they are 17 or 18 is probably and waitering skills, if that is the right word, in the not going to lead to a significant improvement in their college. life chances. Positive engagement with those young people, however, could make a difference. Many of us are well I have even been offered hair and beauty treatments aware of the work of the Prince’s Trust, and in my on some of those visits. You and I have something in constituency, the charity Fairbridge does excellent work common, Mr. Deputy Speaker, and I do not think that with young people who have been marginalised, perhaps tonsorial assistance in those matters would be very from their families, and have certainly not achieved well productive. I have had to decline several offers to have in education. my legs waxed. However, I was interested to learn that accountancy training was offered in further education There is an important role, too, for social enterprise—a colleges. I am the only Member of the House to hold a new type of business model that should be encouraged. professional qualification in taxation and business as a Last week, I visited the social enterprise, Aspire Bristol. member of the Chartered Institute of Taxation. Given It works with adults who have been unemployed for a Mr. Speaker’s earlier statement, an innovation urgently significant time, or people who have recently been homeless required for all hon. Members would be a crash course but who are now seeking to return to a productive role in accountancy, audit, transparency, disclosure and perhaps in society. It takes them on and pays them just above the in some cases, professional ethics. The reputation of the national minimum wage in order to learn such skills as House and the skills sets of all hon. Members would window cleaning, gardening and decorating. Social benefit from such a course. enterprise could be more encouraged and would be able Last week was adult learners week, and the Under- to earn a decent income that it could pass on to participants Secretary of State for Innovation, Universities and Skills, if local government and central Government were able the hon. Member for Birmingham, Erdington (Mr. Simon), to find more of a place for it in their multimillion the hon. Member for South Holland and The Deepings pound—or, in the case of central Government, multibillion (Mr. Hayes) and I spoke at the excellent reception on pound—contracts and procurement programme. the Terrace to promote adult learning. Several reports I turn briefly to the further education capital programme. from the National Institute of Adult Continuing Education I shall not repeat everything— were discussed. One stark finding was that after 12 years of a Labour Government, while much has indeed been Mr. Hayes: The hon. Gentleman, as ever, is making a done, there is still a real social mobility gap affecting well-informed case, but before he moves on to the nub those who participate in adult education and learning. of the FE issue, will he acknowledge what the Secretary People from the top two social classes are twice as likely of State did not acknowledge—that many of what the to participate in learning post-school as people from the Secretary of State calls non-vocational, recreational two lower socio-economic groups. At the reception, I courses are the very routes by which some of the most quoted Helena Kennedy, a Member of the other place, difficult disengaged people are able to re-engage in who some time ago said that the problem with English education and training, and that they provide opportunities education in particular was as follows: for further training, leading to employment, for those “If at first you don’t succeed, you don’t succeed.” such as women returning to work after having time out? That is a serious problem with English education and skills. Stephen Williams: As usual, the hon. Gentleman That is not helped by the Government’s fixation on makes a pertinent point. I could be cruel and mention the belief that learning should lead to an accredited the mistake that the Government made in their decision qualification or certificate. Learning, as the Secretary of on equivalent and lower qualifications cuts last year. State acknowledged in his closing remarks, can have One consequence is that the ability of universities to other purposes relating to emotional well-being. This offer evening classes to their community—for instance, morning, in Bristol, I visited the charity Studio Upstairs, in Bristol, where people from all walks of life can come which works with adults with emotional and mental together to study for a course that does not necessarily 1235 Skills in the Recession18 MAY 2009 Skills in the Recession 1236 lead to a certificate at the end of it—will be taken away. qualification. We are in a time of recession and the Many universities will probably start closing down work force are ageing, and people in a dynamic economy, continuing education departments in the future as a whether in a recession or prosperous, will have to retrain direct result of a decision that the Secretary of State throughout their working lives, so enabling adults over instructed the Higher Education Funding Council to the age of 25 to acquire a level 3 qualification free of take, and many people will lose out on the introduction cost should be a priority. to learning that the hon. Member for South Holland There is also the question of encouraging employers and The Deepings (Mr. Hayes) mentioned. to take on more apprentices. For small employers, in I come back to further education colleges. I shall not particular, the cost of off-the-job training is often an repeat everything that the hon. Member for Havant important barrier, so re-allocating the growth in the said, or all the many points that have been made as we Train to Gain budget of £500 million over the forthcoming discussed the issue over recent months, both in the years would make an enormous difference to employers Chamber and in Westminster Hall. Last week I visited and their ability to take more people into adult Sussex Downs college and met the principal there, and apprenticeships. The Government have set themselves the principal of Plumpton college, along with my hon. some ambitious training and educational attainment Friend the Member for Lewes (Norman Baker). These targets for 2020 as a result of the Leitch report. However, colleges are in a difficult situation. They have not, under they will be much harder to realise if we do not have the Learning and Skills Council’s criteria, got as far as investment in further education and skills or ensure that approval in detail, but none the less, they have well it is secure for the future. worked-up schemes. One of the most interesting parts of the hon. Gentleman’s Plumpton college had a three-stage scheme. Stages motion which, again, he seemed to skate over in his one and two have already progressed and stage three speech, was the section about science, technology, was the conclusion. Sussex Downs college has invested engineering and maths—STEM—subjects. Last week, millions of pound in professional fees in building up the it was my pleasure to welcome to the House some case that the LSC required for it to make its application. Bristol university young engineers and a graduate engineer It was specifically encouraged by the LSC to come who are working with Airbus in Bristol. They are taking forward with ambitious plans. The Secretary of State part in a national project, sponsored by Airbus, to asked the hon. Member for Havant for an example of discuss the relationship between aviation and climate encouragement having been given to a college to come change. I have said many times in such debates that forward with ambitious plans. There is one for him. But there is a consensus around what we are going to do now those ambitious plans do not look as though they about our other 2020 targets—apart from the Leitch will be realised. Many other colleges throughout the targets—on climate change. If we are to meet our country are in the same situation. ambitious targets for a carbon neutral economy, or for a much lower dependence on carbon, we will need more We need certainty from the Government soon as to scientists, engineers and technicians. Otherwise, it will what will happen both to those capital schemes and to be impossible to realise those aims. If we do not have the professional costs that the colleges have already the people to construct the wind farms, service the incurred in working up their plans. As the hon. Gentleman dynamos or expand nuclear energy, although my party said, we also need some transparency from the Learning does not support that, we will not be able to meet our and Skills Council. Unlike the Higher Education Funding 2020 climate change targets. Council for England, the LSC does not routinely publish The problem with STEM subjects begins right the its minutes on its website to show how it arrived at its way back in our secondary schools, as do many of our decisions. problems in education, so we need to enthuse children The Budget, which has not featured much in the to take part in science and engineering subjects. In that discussion so far, announced a further £300 million in respect, I praise the work of Bristol university’s ChemLabS order to try and apply some sticking-plaster solutions outreach programme, which goes to schools all over the to the further education capital funding fiasco. As well west country and invites pupils and teachers into the as that sum being given to the FE sector, the Budget chemistry laboratories at Bristol university to show contains a target for efficiency gains for the Department children experiments, retrain teachers in experimentation for Innovation, Universities and Skills to find. I understand and make science exciting and appealing. As ever, that the target over the rest of the comprehensive spending information, advice and guidance are absolutely review period for the FE and skills part of the Department essential, too. is £340 million. On the one hand, the Government There is a big gender balance in engineering. When I promise something to sort out a problem that they have met those five individuals last week, I said to them, created, but, on the other, they are going to take it away “There’s only one problem with you: you’re all men.” through efficiency savings. That is a problem for the engineering profession, but The provision of adequate buildings is not the only the profession itself has to do some work, too. Government barrier to participation in learning; there are other is not always the answer to every problem; the engineering costs, too. The motion refers to the training costs of profession must do more to raise the esteem in which it those who are is held. Two or three years ago in Bristol, we commemorated the bicentenary of Brunel’s birth. In the 19th century, “over the age of 25”, Brunel was a celebrity figure comparable to many well- although I do not remember the hon. Gentleman speaking known politicians, authors and artists, but we do not to it specifically in his speech. There is, nevertheless, an have a celebrity engineer at the moment. There is a absurd anomaly in our financial structure, whereby, gender balance and high participation in catering; perhaps once someone reaches 25, it is not deemed appropriate engineering needs to find equivalents to Jamie and for the state to fund their first participation in a level 3 Delia to encourage young people to take part. 1237 Skills in the Recession18 MAY 2009 Skills in the Recession 1238

[Stephen Williams] what follows on from it. We Barnsley MPs have had meetings with Ministers and the Prime Minister to try There is a national emergency; we are in a deep to find a way forward. We have a real difficulty: there is recession. In his concluding remarks, the Secretary of a demolition site where part of the college once was. State referred to the “anxious generation” of young The building programme has been delayed for several people who are leaving school and do not know what is months and it looks as if that will continue. ahead of them—particularly if they aspire to go to When we met with representatives of the Yorkshire university. As we already know, there is to be a crisis in and the Humber learning and skills council, we were respect of finding sufficient places for those who get the told that the Foster review would draw up criteria that, right A-levels or other level 3 qualifications sufficient hopefully, would be considered by the end of April. We for university entry in September this year; it looks as if were also told that decisions would be made by the there will not be enough university places to meet the beginning of May. That has not happened. The Foster demand. Those who will leave as graduates in just a report has been produced, the criteria are being drawn couple of months’ time, after doing their finals and up and the meetings are being held. However, the receiving their degrees, will enter the most uncertain announcement on which colleges will go forward will be graduate job market for decades. made, we hope, on 3 June—that, at least, is what the There is a stark statistic from the last deep recession colleges were led to believe. Since then, it looks as of the 1980s. I hope that we will not see in this recession though the timetable may have been reviewed. In discussions a mirror image of what happened to adults, particularly with the college principal as recently as Friday, it came those over 40, who lost their jobs in previous recessions. to light that perhaps the decisions will be made only Many such people in south Wales, where I grew up, and tentatively on 3 June. It should be borne in mind that other depressed industrial areas of the country, did not the applications of 145 colleges will be decided on, and find another job for a couple of decades afterwards; only a handful will go forward. We are obviously anxious, they were never able to return to full productive work. as are all the other colleges, that our application should In this recession, we must all agree that investment in be proceeded with, because we do not have accommodation skills for those people is absolutely essential. The issue for our students. We will have temporary buildings, but is not only about young people. not the buildings that we had hoped for. Mr. David Anderson indicated assent. The LSC drew up its so-called “Key Steps and Timetable”, with five steps and a timetable for progressing Stephen Williams: I see that the hon. Gentleman the situation: agrees. “Cross LSC National Officers group meeting to score potential We need investment in capital and skills now. We projects against criteria w/c 18 May…LSC National Officers need a new, sustainable and ethical business model for group send recommendations on projects to be funded to LSC the future. Above all, we need to give everyone in this National Capital Committee enhanced with regional council country a sense of urgency and of hope that we are chairs attending w/c 18 May…LSC National Capital Committee meeting to score potential projects against criteria enhanced with going to solve the crisis in our economy and in our regional council chairs attending w/c 25 May…National Capital politics as well. Committee send recommendations to LSC National Council 27 May…LSC National Council meeting to approve National Several hon. Members rose— Capital Committee recommendations 3 June.” Mr. Deputy Speaker: Order. I remind the House that So far, so good. However, that appears to have been there is a 15-minute limit on Back-Bench speeches. That amended, with the contractors to the LSC now stating: starts from now. “3rd June 09—Discussion on how many and which projects will be selected as the initial (Priority 1) tranche to go forward 5.22 pm (selection only—not approval)…The selected colleges will then Mr. Eric Illsley (Barnsley, Central) (Lab): I want to have to go through the VfM”— make a few comments about Barnsley college in the value for money— context of the motion and the amendment to it. Obviously, “process to reduce costs which will comprise…5 week period post I will speak about the Building Colleges for the Future 3rd June to sort out project/tender costs and achieve savings as programme as it affects the college. I shall go on to say a required…6 weeks after that to finalise all costs…Final approval little about the college’s performance in relation to the during August 09…September 09 Start on site.” motions before the House. If that timetable is applied to Barnsley college, assuming As the House knows from previous debates, Barnsley that we are successful in getting our programme back college was part of the Building Colleges for the Future on track, that will mean a nine-month delay in the programme. Like other colleges, it had a four-phase programme going forward. None of the colleges decided college programme. Two phases have been completed upon on 3 June will be able to start work until September. on budget and to time, but unfortunately the third It is possible that because Barnsley college is halfway phase, which started towards the end of 2008, was through the programme and has already gone through halted in January when the funding was stopped. most of the paperwork, planning process and so on, Unfortunately, the college had started demolition work those post-3 June criteria may not apply. I sincerely on its Old Mill Lane site. The town centre has been left hope not. We hear about a value for money process to with a completely demolished area, which was the flagship reduce costs and to achieve savings, but Barnsley college part of Barnsley college. has already been required by the Foster review to reduce Construction stopped. Miller Construction, the the third-phase costs from £42 million to £33 million, contractors, had to stop work; its contractors have been and the programme had to be quickly redesigned to laid off and some have been made redundant. We are accommodate that, so we have already lost £9 million of now waiting for the results of the Foster review and our project funding through the consultation process 1239 Skills in the Recession18 MAY 2009 Skills in the Recession 1240 and the problems that have been created. In addition, skills base of long-term unemployed people who live in the college has spent £12 million of its reserves and Barnsley. That is great news and a success story for borrowings and has a substantial interest bill to meet in Barnsley college. 2010. If our college is not selected on 3 June, it will face However, all that will go to waste if we get it wrong or real financial difficulties, because it cannot expand its if the capital programme is not reinstated quickly. We student base on the basis that it had hoped in order to have already considered redundancies for the college’s meet the extra costs. The refurbishment and redevelopment construction programme. I am concerned about whether were carried out on the basis that the student body we can deliver all that increased education provision in would increase and the college would receive further the forthcoming academic year and the subsequent one. funding to help to meet the costs of what has been Without the college rebuilding programme, we will struggle. spent. Again, I urge my right hon. Friend the Secretary of It is extremely important to Barnsley that the college State to examine the timetable and try to encourage the capital rebuilding programme is completed. We are LSC to stick to the time scales that it has set out in its extremely concerned not only for the third phase, which programme. I also urge him to try to get decisions made is to rebuild a demolition site, but for the fourth phase, and, particularly for Barnsley, allow the programme to which is to rebuild the sixth-form college provision. continue. Otherwise, we have only half a college. Barnsley college deals with 90 per cent. of sixth-form teaching in Barnsley, yet we are contemplating not 5.34 pm having a sixth-form college if the final phase of the Mr. David Curry (Skipton and Ripon) (Con): Although project goes by the wayside. It is important to look at we are, of course, all interested in how we got into this those items, and the time scale and the reason for its mess, I am much more interested in how we get out of sliding further from 3 June—as far as September. Given it. It would be easy to give a litany of complaints and the intervention of summer holidays and so on, that simply recite the virtues of one’s own college—I will not start date is likely to slip even further. omit to do that. However, I want to pay tribute to the The refurbishment programme is important to Barnsley LSC’s regional staff, who deal with Yorkshire and Humber. college because our record on post-16 education has They are deeply embarrassed by what has happened, historically never been good, but it has improved in they are doing their best to help and I would not like the recent years and continues to improve, and the college is contamination of mismanagement at the centre to be in a strong position to ensure that it meets Government attributed to everybody who works for that organisation, and local priorities. That was shown in its annual Ofsted which will be replaced in any case. inspection, which took place in March and resulted in I want to begin by talking about the district of four “significant progress”and three “reasonable progress” Craven. The north Pennines is fairly remote and has an judgments—one of the best results in the country. The economy that rests on extremely fragile pillars. A lot of college has an ambitious business plan to consolidate the area is a national park, but tourism has a relatively and grow its success in surpassing targets and meeting low value and is predominantly made up of day visitors— national and local priorities. indeed, many people spend precious little when they get We will have 300 more FE-funded learners later this into the dales. The area depends on agriculture, and we year—a 9 per cent. increase on last year. Student numbers all know that some sectors have experienced extraordinary in that category are currently 241 above the LSC target. difficulties. Indeed, the Rural Payments Agency was We have recruited 1,830 adult FE-funded learners— probably ahead in the charts as the agency that had 100 more than the LSC target. There are approximately made the biggest financial mess, until the Learning and 150 more learners than the previous year in that category—a Skills Council came along as a late competitor for that 6 per cent. increase. We have heard much about Train to accolade, and there are still problems in getting the Gain this afternoon. The number of learners under that money to farmers. scheme is 198 more than the LSC target. There is also the hidden industry of all areas of the There are currently 20 per cent. more applications for countryside, which is looking after the elderly. Anyone the 16-to-18 programmes. That is wonderful news for who goes to any significant village in my constituency Barnsley. We have heard about the problems of NEETs— will find households looking after elderly people and an indeed, I intervened on the Opposition spokesperson awful lot of people working part time to make money to because we have worked hard in Barnsley to try to supplement low income being earned elsewhere in the reduce the number of young people in that category. A family, enabling people to maintain, for example, an 20 per cent. increase in the number of applications for agriculture holding. There is also a host of small businesses. post-16 education is therefore encouraging. We have the Skipton building society, which is the giant Adult success rates have improved by 8 per cent. in in the area—a very prudent giant, as a matter of fact—but the past three years. The Train to Gain success rate is there is also a huge constellation of small businesses, 91 per cent.—well above the national average. That is ranging from micro breweries, of which there has been a not something that one has associated with Barnsley’s refreshing multiplication, to those involved in package education in the past few years. recycling and other tiny operations. The apprenticeships programme has rapidly expanded, Craven is therefore an area of high employment. I do with success rates of 81 per cent.—again, well above the not claim that the demands of Craven rest on economic national average. The college will deliver the diploma hardship in the way that it might be experienced in programme—10 separate diploma lines—in September. places such as Barnsley, which the hon. Member for It has been approved to provide 14 diploma lines, and Barnsley, Central (Mr. Illsley) spoke about. However, the remainder will start in September 2010. although there is high employment, there is also low On worklessness, the college has just been successful pay and a lot of part-time employment. If anything in winning a contract to improve the employability and were to illustrate the vulnerability of Craven’s economy, 1241 Skills in the Recession18 MAY 2009 Skills in the Recession 1242

[Mr. David Curry] A further disadvantage of being in a rural catchment area is that it is often difficult to achieve the necessary it is foot and mouth disease, which simultaneously shut critical mass of students to make a course viable. It down agriculture and tourism. That demonstrates the might not be too difficult to assemble nine or 10 people urgency of finding an economic base that is more who want to study the same subject at the same time diversified and less vulnerable to catastrophic events. and in the same place in a metropolitan area, but it is difficult to do so in a rural area. That means that the Many people in Craven would also complain of a college is punished in the sense that it does not get the draining of public services from the area, as there has funding, but there are also fewer opportunities because been pressure to introduce economies in public expenditure. it cannot achieve the critical mass necessary to realise The police presence, as well as the rank of the police them. The rurality issue has not been addressed in the establishment, and many other public services, if not funding of colleges of further education. the ability of the people doing the serving, have been seen to be reduced. I said that Craven college was at the heart of the regeneration programme for the Craven area. There is a What Craven needs is a much better skills base. new campus planned. It is in the third tier of progress; Indeed, Skipton building society and the smallest small the work is awaiting approval, but the plan is very well businesses both complain about their difficulty in recruiting developed. It is part of one of the wider regeneration people with sufficient skills, whether they be IT or more programmes that so many colleagues have mentioned basic skills. Craven also needs much better facilities in today. In particular, it will incorporate a complex for winter, so that there is a tourist offer in the winter climbing and caving. That might sound eccentric, but months to supplement the tourist offer in the summer, climbing and caving are major tourist attractions in that and a vigorous small business sector that can take part of the Pennines and the Yorkshire dales, and a advantage of the spread of broadband, which is not yet knowledge of those subjects will assist the development universal in my constituency, and the exceptional of winter facilities and enhance what is a unique selling environmental advantages of Craven. Broughton hall, point economically in the area. with its sophisticated business park, is the exception, not the rule. If the activities of the college could be brought together on one site, it would gain through much greater There are also particular needs that stem from the economies of scale in terms of costs and teaching fact that Craven is not merely a rural area; rather, a efficiency, and such a move would also make a huge great deal of it is upland, which is the most difficult difference to the social environment of the college. It kind of rural area. There is a huge difference between a would enable all sorts of interactions to take place rural area in East Anglia, where someone could strike a between the students that are impossible if they end billiard ball and watch it go for miles, and my constituency, their day in 11 different places around the town. which straddles the Pennines. In addition, Craven is the So what is going to happen? There have been two only area in North Yorkshire that has selective education. recent events, on the first of which I would like the The two excellent selective schools in Skipton—Ermysted’s advice of the Minister. Within the past few days, and Skipton girls high school—are outstanding, but the Learning and Skills Council has offered to pay half they ought to be outstanding, given the sociology of the £356,000 fees that have been spent on developing North Yorkshire and the selection process. However, the Craven college project, provided that the head of that means that it is incredibly important to ensure the college signs on the dotted line by noon tomorrow. adequate provision for the 16 to 18-year-olds who do Should he sign, or is the LSC offering an out-of-court not come out of the selective system. settlement against the threat of a legal action to recover That brings me to Craven college in Skipton, which is a greater proportion of the fees, such as I understand at the heart of a series of interlocking programmes some colleges are nurturing? designed to address the broad economic disadvantages I have had discussions with Craven college, with and the particular sociology of Craven. Ten years ago, which I have dealt in every year since I have been a Craven college had between 500 and 600 full-time Member of Parliament, and I have to say that we have students in one year group, and about 2,000 part-time not carried the fiery cross around the countryside. We students. Now it has 1,600 full-time students, of whom have not said that the college was going to collapse or 1,250 are 16 to 18-year-olds drawn from some 80 schools— that further education in Craven was going to come to a the college serves not only Craven but a huge rural halt. We will struggle through, as we have always done. constituency that goes way beyond the boundaries of So we are not being alarmist. We are trying to be Craven itself—and some 5,000 people in part-time responsible in dealing with this very real issue, but the employment in any one year. head of the college faces a real dilemma over how he So the college’s expansion has been constant, and it should respond to that offer. I pay tribute to the regional has taken place using very limited resources and in the staff of the LSC for that offer, because I think they are context of certain disadvantages, which I shall explain. trying to be helpful. First, it operates on 11 sites. My hon. Friend the Member We have also talked about Train to Gain. Craven for Huntingdon (Mr. Djanogly) was complaining that college was harried to step up its Train to Gain activities. his college had to operate in 1960s buildings. How lucky It was positively cajoled to expand its programme. It it is! Two of our buildings are Victorian, and the college has done so, and it was expecting to spend about operates in 11 sites across Skipton. This has two £1.6 million on such provision up to the end of the implications: the first relates to costs and the division of academic year that we have been talking about. That effort; the second is the very real health and safety money has been stopped in its tracks overnight, and the problem of operating in buildings that are far from provision has been capped at some £1 million. There being fit for purpose. was no warning of that at all. So having gone out to 1243 Skills in the Recession18 MAY 2009 Skills in the Recession 1244 employers to persuade them to sign up to the Train to and financial services sector these days, and it was Gain programme, the college now has to go back and amplified by light-touch regulation in this and other say, “Sorry, we can’t deliver on the very programmes OECD countries. One of the lessons to be learned from that we encouraged you to sign up for a short while ago.” this recession is that the Thatcher-Reagan doctrine that What is the way forward? We know that the Government private institutions are always best regulated by themselves have promised £300 million a year in capital expenditure rather than the state has come to an end. I do not want until 2013, and we also know that there are going to be more regulation, but I do want smarter regulation so some transparent new criteria based on need rather that the lessons of the recession are learned. than on “first come, first served”, with the deadline set Before I turn specifically to deal with further education, for spring 2010—still a long way away. I ask the Minister let me say that I chair the Economics and Security to ensure that when those criteria are drawn up, there is Committee of the NATO Parliamentary Assembly. The a fair assessment of rural needs. week before last, our committee was in Washington DC Rural needs are not simply an offshoot of a national to meet the International Monetary Fund and the World need; they respond to difference economic and social Bank to discuss the recession. They predicted that, from circumstances, and entirely different definitions of how the peak to the trough of the recession, global output is to be efficient apply in serving the sort of wide rural likely to fall by 3 to 4 per cent. They also say that if area that my college serves. I do not want to do down Governments such as ours and other OECD Governments any of the metropolitan areas; we are on the edge of had not adopted fiscal stimulus packages, global output Keighley, and we take students from Keighley as a would fall by something like 9 per cent. matter of fact. What I do want to ensure, however, is Let me explain the difference. If global output falls that there is fair crack of the whip for the rural areas I by 3 or 4 per cent., it will mean a very severe recession— am talking about. In other words, whether we are more severe than any since the second world war. But if judged to have succeeded or not, we want to able to say output falls by 9 per cent., we will be in the territory that at least it was a fair call and a fair judgment. We that existed between the two world wars when there was want to be judged by meaningful criteria that we are a decade-long depression and unemployment soared capable of delivering and fulfilling, not against criteria for years at a time. The fiscal stimulus is a necessary that are designed for entirely different circumstances. response and it is right to put Government funding I would ask that all programmes be started from behind education and training, particularly vocational scratch. We should start with a blank sheet of paper training. I was pleased to see hundreds of millions of and the all programmes that have reached a certain pounds being set aside in the Budget for that purpose. degree of maturity should be examined in the light of It is extremely important to invest in skills—both in those different criteria in the different circumstances. A vocational training and in broad liberal education—so set of programme priorities should be drawn up that that we see benefits in our national economy and so that reflect the new criteria—not simply the “first come, first individual citizens in our country see the benefits of served” basis. If the Government really want the best jobs and job security. It is important to do so now, so bang for their buck, if they really want to ensure that that the country benefits when the upturn comes. We do their money is being spent as well as possible and if they not want to make the same mistake as was made when really want to be assured of value for money, they must the Conservatives were in power and people were simply do that. If they want to be able to turn around and say parked on benefits during the recession, without the they have sorted out an appalling mess in an equitable funding for training, and vocational training in particular, way so that people feel that fairness has been applied to that we have at the moment. all sections of the country in all the different circumstances of the country, that is what they should do. During the 12 years that the Labour party has been in government, a strong platform has been created within I hope that the Government will be fair in addressing further education to provide the skills training that we those problems. I have not gone into too much detail need. In my constituency, in 1996-97, some £12.1 million today, as we will be joining the long procession of was allocated to York college and the York sixth-form people intending to meet the poor Minister—he will be college, which was a separate institution. Since then, the able to do a “Mastermind”on colleges of further education, two have merged, and in 2008-09, the budget was I suspect, in a couple of months’ time—and we can £20.5 million—an increase of £8.4 million, or 69 per provide the detail then. If the Minister does do what I cent. have suggested, Craven will continue to give him, as it has always has done, the biggest possible bang for the It is not just in York that additional resources have buck. The benefits will then be spread over a huge area gone into further education. There are eight colleges in of rural England. York and North Yorkshire. Two are specialist colleges— Henshaws college, a specialist college in Harrogate that provides education and training for people with visual 5.47 pm impairment and additional physical or learning difficulties, Hugh Bayley (City of York) (Lab): It is a great and Askham Bryan college, one of the largest land-based pleasure to follow two other Yorkshire Members in this colleges in the country—and there are six more general debate. further education or sixth-form colleges. Between them, Our country is in the middle of an extremely severe and including Craven college, which the right hon. recession—the first global recession since the 1930s. It Member for Skipton and Ripon (Mr. Curry) spoke is global in the sense that, for the first time since the about, they work with some 50,000 young people and 1930s, global output is likely to fall. This recession, as have a combined turnover of £70 million a year. we all know, was triggered by the sub-prime mortgage In the past five years, the Government have allocated crisis in the United States. It spread quickly around the some £80 million of capital to improve the colleges. world because of the globalised nature of the banking They have partnerships with almost 10,000 businesses 1245 Skills in the Recession18 MAY 2009 Skills in the Recession 1246

[Hugh Bayley] in education, employment or training. Archbishop’s sixth form is making a real contribution in that field, and train some 7,000 employees a year. They have focusing on the needs of the NEET group and of young degree and higher-level programmes for more than 2,000 people aged 16 to 18 who have disabilities. students. The colleges in York and North Yorkshire However, there are other schools—good schools—in educate nearly 12,000 16 to 18-year-olds—more than all York seeking sixth forms. If they were all to take the school sixth forms in York and North Yorkshire put individual decisions, we could end up with poorer 16-to-19 together. provision overall. There is a tension between school It is important to have the right balance of numbers choice on the one hand and the LEA’s commissioning to guarantee choice for young people at the age of 16 role on the other. I believe that a different balance is between courses and between settings—school and further needed on who can take a decision. The Government’s education. The two Departments—the Department for decision to give LEAs responsibility for further education Innovation, Universities and Skills and the Department and schools will help a new balance to be struck. for Children, Schools and Families—need to talk further It is important for the Government and LEAs to about how the school sixth form presumption works. In recognise that learner choice is not the same as school 2007-08, which is the latest year for which I have figures, choice. We need learner-centred provision so that young there were 4,129 16 to 19-year-olds from York in college people in York and the surrounding area can choose and 1,079 in school sixth forms. Each individual 16-year-old between school or sixth-form college and between a has a choice about whether to attend one of the five wide range of subjects—not just A-levels, but vocational schools in York that has a sixth form or whether to go provision. to York college, or indeed one of the other colleges, such as Askham Bryan or another further education I also want to say a word or two about the discrepancy college close to York. in funding between school sixth forms and further education. School sixth forms receive a premium of The schools provide continuity and familiarity for about 5.6 per cent. If York college received the same the students. They are smaller and, as a result, provide a funding as school sixth forms, it would get about £900,000 narrower range of subjects. They provide extremely more per year. Quite quickly, as I have been raising the good education. York college, like the schools, achieves matter for several years, I would like to see that gap excellent A-level results, but its curriculum provides being closed. It is more likely that that will be achieved about 40 subjects, including a full range of modern now that LEAs have responsibility for further education languages, which none of the school sixth forms can as well as schools. provide; specialist subjects such as archaeology and ancient history, which have a particular purpose and which I congratulate the Government on their capital funding we have a need for in a city such as York; and specialist for schools and for colleges. In 1996-97, schools in York art courses such as photography. Indeed, Freddy Bulmer, received capital funding of less than £1 million a year. an 18-year-old at York college, has just won first prize In the 12 years since then, they have received, on average in the national Colleges on Camera competition. His each year, more than £10 million—a tenfold increase for winning photograph shows the impact that the £65 million York’s schools. As I said, we have a brand new York investment by the Government and the college in the college, built at a cost of £65 million, more than £20 million new York college has had on him and his fellow students. of which came in the form of Government grant. It is good to see excellence coming from a further Once again, however, there is a gap between the education college. capital regime for further education and that for school Perhaps I should tell hon. Members that four years sixth forms, which receive 100 per cent. capital funding ago, after the general election, I did what I usually do whereas further education does not. In order to build a after elections—commissioned a local artist to make a new college building, York college had to borrow some limited-edition print to celebrate life in York. The artist £4.5 million on its own account, and a proportion of its I commissioned on that occasion was a young man general income is used to pay back that loan. Schools from York college, Michael Kirkman, who produced a do not pay VAT on services and equipment, but colleges fabulous print of building work at York hospital. That do. Although both school and college-goers receive the was his choice of subject, which he felt summed up the education maintenance allowance, which is an important type of life that people live in York now. I am pleased to Labour innovation because it makes it possible for say that one of his prints is in the collection of York art people from low-income families to continue in education gallery while another hangs in the boardroom of York after 16, in schools young people from low-income hospital. Several others hang in GP surgeries around families also receive the benefit of free school meals, the city—it is marvellous work. That, again, shows that which are not available in FE. If one takes all the colleges can provide excellence at the highest level. funding differences together, the gap is not 5.6 per cent., Recently, Archbishop Holgate’s school used the sixth- which is what the Government acknowledge, but rather form presumption to establish its own sixth form. There more—possibly as much as 15 per cent. were concerns from other 16-to-18 educational providers Colleges admit a greater proportion of students from in the area that it might dilute provision elsewhere. disadvantaged neighbourhoods. Some 29 per cent. of There were discussions between the head of Archbishop those in FE come from such neighbourhoods, compared Holgate’s school—an old and venerable institution headed with 19 per cent. of those in school sixth forms and, for by John Harris, who is a head teacher I respect comparative purposes, some 20 per cent. of those in enormously—and the local education authority. They universities. It is important that students from more agreed that there was already good level 3 A-level disadvantaged neighbourhoods get the same quality provision in York, but that more level 1 provision was and level of funding as those in schools, and LEAs must needed for the 4 or 5 per cent. of students who are not address that. 1247 Skills in the Recession18 MAY 2009 Skills in the Recession 1248

I should say a word in response to what the Conservative administrative building would be knocked down and spokesman said about the problem of overstretch in the replaced because it looked dreadful. It was not, and that Building Colleges for the Future budget. York is very is not in the plan at the moment. fortunate to have its new college, and I want other The college applied for in-principle approval in Andover people, such as those in Barnsley, to have that benefit, last November, expecting the go-ahead in February or too. I have tabled an early-day motion expressing my March. In the meantime, it got planning consent from concern about the cuts in Building Schools for the Test Valley borough council. The scheme was an integral Future, and I urge hon. Members to sign it. It makes the part of the regeneration of Andover town centre, case for increasing Government funding for FE capital complementing plans that have already been introduced projects. In an economic downturn, there is a strong in one part of the town and are about to be in another. case for investment in public infrastructure. Then, along with 143 other colleges, in March we were I regret that the Conservative spokesman did not told that the deal was off. There is great disappointment welcome the level of investment that the Government in the town. are putting into colleges—some £2.6 billion in the current To pick up on points that have been made in the spending period. I see that he is coming back into the debate, I understand that decisions are about to be Chamber, and I hope that he will commit to a fiscal taken on how to spend the money that is available, stimulus package to counter the recession, including topped up by the funds announced in the Budget, which further investment in further education. I welcome. It seems that schemes that are “shovel-ready”, to use the words of my hon. Friend the Member for 6.2 pm Havant, will get the go-ahead, while other schemes that Sir George Young (North-West Hampshire) (Con): I might have progressed in the near future will go to the commend the hon. Member for City of York (Hugh back of the queue. It would be helpful if the Minister Bayley) for his tradition of commissioning an important said a little more in his winding-up speech about the work of art from a local artist following his election to criteria that will be applied when deciding who goes Parliament. I am sure that his successor will wish to first and who comes last, and if he could indicate for follow that tradition. local consumption the earliest date at which the project I want to drag the debate south from Yorkshire, in Andover might now get the go-ahead. where it has been for the past three speeches, to Hampshire, On top of the capital debacle, there is also a revenue where it began with an excellent speech by my hon. headache as a result of the gamble that colleges were Friend the Member for Havant (Mr. Willetts). I wish to encouraged to take by the LSC in bidding for funds. pick up the point that the hon. Member for City of Some will now turn in financial deficits, which would York and my right hon. Friend the Member for Skipton not have been the case, unless the LSC is able to step in and Ripon (Mr. Curry) made about the fiasco of the and refund their fees. I was interested to hear my right Building Colleges for the Future programme. hon. Friend the Member for Skipton and Ripon say Many of us took part in a debate in Westminster Hall that his local college has had an offer of a contribution in March, when the Under-Secretary of State for towards abortive fees, although I am not quite sure why Innovation, Universities and Skills had an uncomfortable it has to decide so quickly. In the case of Andover, 90 minutes being beaten up by Members of all parties. about 70 per cent. of the £2 million spent in fees is now If I may give him some respectful advice, perhaps his abortive. That risks turning a potential surplus of £500,000 response to this debate might be less pugnacious than it into a potential deficit of £900,000. Will the Minister was on that occasion and a little more constructive, say something about which colleges are getting help, bridge-building and conciliatory. Whereas other Ministers and of what sort, in meeting the abortive fees? have come to the House and told us that they are The other frustrating thing is that the LSC is responsible bringing forward the capital programme for counter-cyclical for monitoring the financial health of colleges. In many reasons, he has had to tell us of a freeze in the further cases, the reason for the deterioration has nothing to do education capital programme with projects, far from with the college but is entirely due to the LSC. Unless it being brought forward, being indefinitely postponed. can come up with the necessary help with abortive fees, Two years ago Cricklade college in Andover merged some colleges will go into deficit and may breach financial with Sparsholt college, just outside Winchester. Thanks covenants. Many will have to borrow funds from the to the energy and commitment of the principal, Tim bank, incurring interest payments. Jackson, and his team, the quality of education in I move on to a subject that has not been touched on Andover has been driven up since the merger. They are at all—provision for adults with learning difficulties doing a fantastic job in challenging circumstances, but and disabilities. There is a need for much greater clarity they have not been assisted by recent events. At the time about what is done for adults on the education side of of the merger, the LSC wrote to me: the equation and what is done by social service departments “Current thinking is that there will be a required investment of on the social and personal development side. A few up to £30 million in Andover and £20 million in Winchester.” years ago, colleges would accept those with learning It went on to say that those figures were indicative at difficulties on courses, and would interpret the rules that stage, but concluded: broadly. People would continue to attend college year “I would wish to reiterate the LSC’s commitment to ensuring after year, even though they were not really progressing. an appropriate level of investment is forthcoming to support the It was an important part of their life and self-development. ambitions of the merged college.” A few years ago the rules were tightened, and colleges The scheme grew to £100 million, reflecting the are now required to ensure that courses attended by encouragement given to colleges by the LSC to raise adults with LDD lead to clear, successful outcomes in their sights and build for the 21st century. On one visit, qualifications. When an adult has fulfilled the requirements the LSC officer told the college that he hoped the main of a particular qualification and there is not necessarily 1249 Skills in the Recession18 MAY 2009 Skills in the Recession 1250

[Sir George Young] staff are required, the stop-start approach to funding is very difficult to manage. As all Members have pointed anything appropriate for them to progress to, they are out, colleges are crucial to the economic and social unable to be recycled year after year, so they stop going. well-being of the areas in which they operate. They That change was made a few years ago at the point of cannot be expected to operate as a very small business transition. That issue might not be one for the Minister, might be expected to, moving resources in and out from but it is certainly one for the Government if we are to one week to the next. have joined-up government. I hope that the Government will exercise continuing This morning I was rereading “Valuing people now”, stewardship over the financial well-being of colleges. the Government’s three-year strategy for people with That is especially important when the commissioning of learning disabilities. It is very much a health-focused much of their work switches to local authorities, with document, with not a lot in it about education, but I funding supplied via the Department for Children, Schools found one sentence about education that I will have to and Families, while the overarching stewardship of colleges read out, in the hope that the House will understand rests with the Department for Innovation, Universities what it means better than I can. It states: and Skills. “The cross-government Work, Education and Life Group will Finally, let me say to my hon. Friend the Member for also lead implementation of ‘Progression through Partnership’ Bexleyheath and Crayford (Mr. Evennett), who will (the post-16 education strategy) and the Getting a Life project, wind up the debate, that it would be interesting to hear which aims to achieve an integrated assessment and decision-making process that will allow people to use public resources flexibly to whether he considers that we are totally satisfied with get the outcomes they want”. the rather blurred responsibility for the age group that we are discussing, or whether he thinks that the issue I hope that that means that folk will be able to go on might need to be revisited in a year’s time. courses that are suitable for them, but I say to the Minister that it is by no means clear how the education- social services interface will work. I hope that he will 6.12 pm ensure that there are suitable courses for people with learning difficulties that are provided either by social Mr. David Anderson (Blaydon) (Lab): It is possible services or by education. that I am the only Member present who served a full apprenticeship, although I stand to be corrected on I turn briefly to some other issues in the motion. The that. When I served an apprenticeship as a mechanic, number of NEETs in my constituency, as in those of there was respect for the traditions of people who had other colleagues, has risen. It is now at 185, having risen served apprenticeships for many years. We felt, as from 135 in December, five months ago. Many fewer apprentices and as craftsmen, that we were part of a adults are now attending training courses at Andover culture in which what was learnt was passed on, and it college than was the case in 2005. I suspect that that is was part and parcel of the pride that we took in doing because in some cases there is a real issue of affordability the job that young people were introduced to it. It was when it comes to the fees. There was a 29 per cent. drop heartening for me to become a time-served craftsman in 2007-08 compared to 2006-07, and a 41 per cent. and work with young people in learning skills. However, drop in 2007-08 compared to 2005-06. I hope that the it was disheartening for me to be part of a generation Minister will say a little about the Government’s response that saw the last of the apprenticeships in the industry to that. in which I worked, the coal industry. We heard a great deal from the Secretary of State It was directly owing to the policy of the Conservative about Train to Gain, which, in a sense, has been too party that we saw a decline in apprenticeships. It made successful. In my constituency, as in Skipton and Ripon, policy decisions that largely destroyed the coal industry, we now have a moratorium on new starts. Private providers decimated the railway industry, did away with the shipyards, and colleges have been told to stop, current activity cut back the steelworks and privatised British Gas, the with employers has been curtailed, and future contracts electricity boards, the water boards and BT. All those are being held back to avoid over-commitment in the were national companies with major training schemes, forthcoming year. There is considerable frustration about which employed many, many young people. What happened the fact that after everyone has been geared up, they are to young people in my village was that, instead of having to be geared down again. working with people like me—as apprenticeship mechanics, The subject of unfunded students was raised earlier, electricians or welders—they ended up as apprentice and I need to see what the Secretary of State said in burglars and apprentice drug-takers, and became very response. At present there are about 120 unfunded good at taking cars without the owners’ consent and places for the autumn in my constituency. The college taking radios from cars. That is not much to pass on to has submitted a bid. The Secretary of State’s speech the next generation. suggested that we might be given answers about the In the days when I trained with the National Coal bids; perhaps the Minister could shed some light on Board, everyone had some form of education, right up that. As for apprentices, there is understandably less to degree level. People were not just given vocational capacity in the workplace to take on, in particular, training; they were taught how to stay alive underground young and inexperienced trainees. Sadly, in Andover we and, importantly, how to keep their fellow workers have seen a rise in the number of apprenticeship alive. A huge vacuum was created at the end of the redundancies, which has pushed up the number of 1980s and during the 1990s, but I am thankful that my NEETs. party’s Government have begun to fill it. It is true that Let me make a general point. Further education things are not perfect, but we have, without a doubt, colleges find sudden changes in funding flows very modernised and restructured apprenticeships in a way challenging. When commitments to engaging additional that addresses the challenges of the 21st century. Those 1251 Skills in the Recession18 MAY 2009 Skills in the Recession 1252 challenges are, and will continue to be, different from problems, and it would be wrong for me or any other the challenges that I faced when I became an apprentice. Member to deny that the LSC has let people down, but The fact remains that the Government have invested I do not think that the Secretary of State intends to do additional money this year. They have agreed to provide the same. a further £140 million, which will fund 35,000 Last week I met representatives of Balfour Beatty, apprenticeships. That is good for the public, and for the who are worried about what may happen if we do not people for whom the apprentices are working. In 1997 put right what has gone wrong in the last few months. I there were only 65,000 apprenticeships in the country; know that the Conservatives do not agree with this, but today there are a quarter of a million, and completion I strongly believe that we should be building our way rates are at an all-time high. That is something we can out of the recession. We should be using that terrible be very proud of. term “fiscal stimulus”, and companies such as Balfour During the Secretary of State’s speech, I raised the Beatty—along with many other people—should be subject of union learning reps, which is never mentioned rebuilding colleges and schools. The Balfour Beatty by the Conservative party. That may appear unsurprising, representatives told me that a potential 40,000 jobs are given its attitude to trade unions. There are 22,000 available to people who could be employed in the building accredited union learning reps out there working with industry, but may not be. The Government must start to people. I was involved, with the National Union of address that. I hope that, when he responds, the Minister Public Employees, in a scheme called Return to Learn, will go some way towards allaying my fears. which helped people many of whom had no literacy or Like every other Member who has spoken so far, I numeracy skills, and experienced great problems even in shall say something about the colleges in my area. I reading or writing. For the first time since leaving want to tell the success story of Gateshead college, school, in many cases as young as 15, people were told which has never been afraid of embarking on partnerships. “We value you. You may only be doing menial, manual It does not believe in standing about whingeing, or in work in society’s eyes, but your contribution is important, promoting doom and gloom. It wants to get on with the and because of that we want you to become re-engaged real work. That is why last year it moved out of the in the world of education.” Such schemes have been one building in Durham road where it had been for many of the keystones of workplace learning in this country. years, sold that building and went forward in partnership. Last year, a quarter of a million people were given It has been given £60 million by the Government to access to learning at work through union learning reps. build the new Baltic college on the regenerated Gateshead quayside. It has been a tremendous success. There are Mr. Willetts: I can assure the hon. Gentleman that I 7,000 students and 500 staff, working at a college that is had a most enjoyable meeting with TUC representatives a source of great pride to me and the people who live in only the other week, during which they made the case the area. for union learning reps almost as eloquently as the hon. A £5.5 million skills academy on a nearby industrial Gentleman is making it now. estate has done tremendous work with companies such Mr. Anderson: I am very glad to hear that, but I did as Nissan and others in the automotive industry, which not hear the hon. Gentleman say “I agreed with what is so important to our local economy. A £15 million they said, and I will continue to provide and develop the academy for sport has also been developed on the union learning scheme.” I will sit down and let him say former Gateshead stadium site, and I hope it will play a it if he wants to, but it appears that he has no reply. major part in the development of Olympic athletes for this country. Mr. Willetts: I was very sympathetic to the case that The college has been recognised across the board. In they made. the last two years it gained “outstanding” grade 1 marks in Ofsted inspections in all six areas tested. It has Mr. Anderson: I love the hon. Gentleman’s use of the a success rate of 83 per cent. and it is within the top word “sympathetic”. I realise that he has two brains, 10 per cent. of colleges in the country. but it does not take two brains to understand what the The college completed the renovation of its estate word “sympathetic” means. What I am asking him for is with the opening of the Baltic campus and the skills action, but he is clearly not prepared to commit himself academy, the result of a £60 million investment. It has to that. been recognised by the LSC for outstanding financial Last week, I was not talking to the TUC; I was performance in a very challenging environment, and by talking to learning reps on the ground at Gateshead Ofsted for providing outstanding value for money. It council. I was talking to people such as David Smith, has provided more than £10 million to local companies who has helped many young people, as well as older for Train to Gain, and turnover has increased by more people, into the workplace. They benefited from real than 25 per cent. In 2008-09, it also achieved growth in dedication and real praise from their employers and the number of full-time 16 to 18-year-old students, others who took part in the schemes. Last year I was which rose from 1,757 to 2,272. It has been officially very proud when an old colleague of mine, Felicity named as the top college in the region for delivery of Mendelson, who works for Newcastle city council, was apprenticeships and the lead provider for the National recognised by the Queen for the great work that she had Skills Academy for Manufacturing. It secured the Ford done as a union learning rep. She was awarded the master apprenticeship programme for the north-east MBE. and it is the preferred training provider for Nissan. It Real credit has been given to people who have done has also been awarded many other accolades. real work for people on the ground. But credit must We are proud of Gateshead college, and so we should again be given to the Government for the money that be, but the outside world is also proud of it. It entered they have invested in the foundations of building colleges, the culture for success competition, and Andrew Dixon, and expanding further education. I am aware of the chief executive and judge, said this about it: 1253 Skills in the Recession18 MAY 2009 Skills in the Recession 1254

[Mr. David Anderson] difficult step of deciding to learn to read and write and had filled in all the forms. Some of them were motivated “Gateshead College is a shining example of cultural success to do so because they wanted to start to do homework alongside tremendous facilities and a huge range of effective with their children, some because they wanted to expand external business partnerships. This is a business that has grown their businesses, while others just wanted to achieve fast and is loved by its customers—thoroughly deserving of the their potential. They went to their local FE college and, Culture for Success Overall Winner award.” to its credit, they found a great class that they enjoyed, This is not a doom and gloom story, therefore; it is a but there was a problem: the Government’s policy to story of real success on the back of hard work by many phase out funding on equivalent or lower qualifications. people. They had taken a huge step in admitting that they could The college is continuing that work. Shortly before not read or write, and had grasped the basics, but they Christmas, it answered the call; Nissan was facing serious wanted to do more advanced things such as write job problems and it asked the college to help it try to keep application letters. That was deemed to be a bit too people in work. Working with MPs, and with a great advanced to be funded, however. Indeed, the policy contribution from the Secretary of State concerned, the required members of the group to learn individually college and Nissan drove forward training programmes using a specially designed computer programme. The from this year to the back end of last year, which group set itself up in a local church hall, and a saint-like extended the working life of hundreds of Nissan employees teacher from the local college agreed to work on a much in Sunderland. Although for some of them it was lower rate of pay. Some of the adult learners valued extended only for a short period, it at least meant they what they were learning so much that they funded the were able to get to Christmas without facing the threat course from their benefit payments. I am delighted that of the dole. this community group was able to fund and deliver that The college is also working closely with the Department learning and development, and such community-organised for Work and Pensions, the regional development agency solutions are always refreshing, but do we want motivated and local authorities to establish an early warning system, people to be turned away from training? so that when people may be about to lose their jobs, or have lost their jobs and have been made redundant, the Another group I wish to highlight is those who are college and other partners are there to pick up the already skilled but who want to retrain for work in pieces and help them get back into work as quickly as sectors that are offering jobs. Let me offer the examples possible. The college is working closely with the local from Gravesham of a construction worker who had a council, which has decided to bring forward its capital back injury and a bus driver who had suffered a stroke, programme. It is helping the council create 500 new which prevented them from performing manual work apprenticeships, and it is also working with local businesses and driving. Both men enjoyed computing and wanted to get even more apprentices into work. If we want to to be retrained in that field, where one could expect a use a slogan that many people may well have heard of, motivated and qualified person to find a job. The man we could say that this is an example of “Real help now”. with the stroke was expected to recover fully over about three years and, rather than sit around on disability This is all about creating choices, and about denying benefits during that period, he wanted to spend the time the official Opposition’s narrative that everything is retraining. He faced some hurdles, however. Under the doom and gloom and we should stand back and do current rules, jobseekers can wait up to 18 months nothing. We will not stand back and do nothing, either before they are able to take a full-time training course in this party, in this Government or in the place that I while claiming benefits. Nevertheless, jobcentres can come from. We are going stand up for people, and stand help to arrange shorter training courses sooner than by them; we are not going to stand back. The official that. The problem is that the choice is fairly limited Opposition may be led on this issue by a man with two unless one wants training in basic English or maths, brains, but the leaders on the issue should be people which many newly unemployed people do not need. with some heart. I can also offer the example of a man who was a 6.24 pm service manager in a car dealership, which is not a good Mr. Adam Holloway (Gravesham) (Con): The importance organisation to be employed in right now. He therefore of this debate is underlined by the OECD’s economic wants to reskill as a locksmith as he has identified a gap outlook; it says that unemployment in our country in the market, but he is finding it very difficult to get could rise to 10 per cent., and it said in November that help to retrain to do that. it could rise faster than in any other G7 country. Accurate Another problem is that any additional training can and promptly published analysis of unemployment trends be limited to what are described as “growth areas”. I is important for the providers of training and further identified Gravesham’s only growth area when making education, particularly in a recession, which is also an representations following a visit to 50 employees who opportunity for reskilling. In terms of the data available had worked for the local branch of Woolworths. They to inform training providers, the jobseeker figures provided were mainly women in their mid-40s and 50s, and a fair by Jobcentre Plus and the Office for National Statistics number of them had left school without qualifications, seem to vary by between 10 per cent. and 15 per cent. and had gone to work for Woolworths after raising a That is concerning in itself, but when we add in the family. I made inquiries on their behalf at our jobcentre number of those who are economically inactive but who to determine what training they would receive, and was want a job, the unemployment figure in Gravesham is told that the only identified growth area was the care almost trebled. sector. The care sector offer good careers in Gravesham, I wish to highlight a group of motivated adults who of course, but what struck me was the idea that that was could not read or write but were turned away by their the only available option, because not everybody is college of further education. They had all taken the suited to working in the care sector. 1255 Skills in the Recession18 MAY 2009 Skills in the Recession 1256

Training opportunities for people should be not only Stephen Williams: I owe the hon. Gentleman an rational, but flexible; they should not simply be linked apology, because it was of course he who spoke at the to the main growth areas. We must keep the recently adult learners week reception last week. I had got the unemployed keen, motivated and focused and then get constituencies muddled and said that the hon. Member them back into work. The Government must do more for South Holland and The Deepings (Mr. Hayes), who to distinguish between the recently unemployed and the does so many joint events with me on such occasions, long-term unemployed. Of course all unemployed had done so. I just wanted to correct that point. people should remain on our radar, but we must avoid the recently, first-time unemployed joining the long- Mr. Evennett: I am very grateful for that. There are term unemployed—their needs are not very subtly real concerns within our society and across the country different. The newly unemployed need rapid training to about skills, training, opportunities and employment. avoid their joining the benefits-cycle club. As has been said, in every constituency, whatever its In conclusion, we need more accurate data; a political colour, there are real concerns for the future. I streamlined funding model for further education that is congratulate my right hon. Friend the Member for flexible to the needs of the local community and Skipton and Ripon (Mr. Curry) on his excellent speech, individuals; and rapid retraining, specifically of in which he gave an account of the issues facing Craven the recently unemployed. Finally, I would be grateful college in his constituency and small businesses in the if the Minister could update me on the position of area. the building works at North West Kent college in My right hon. Friend the Member for North-West Gravesend. Hampshire (Sir George Young) made an excellent contribution, highlighting, in a powerful speech, the 6.30 pm issues of further education capital funding and regeneration, Mr. David Evennett (Bexleyheath and Crayford) (Con): and the disappointment in his constituency at the situation This has been an important and interesting debate on in which the constituency and the college find themselves. the vital subject of skills in the recession. Regrettably, He also raised the situation of adults with learning Britain is in a serious recession and there is a serious difficulties, on which he made some effective and skills shortage within our society. A new approach is constructive points. May I reassure him, as he wanted absolutely necessary, because this Government have Conservative Front Benchers to do, that our further undoubtedly failed in their attempt to improve skills. In education funding council will have a simple funding the main, we have had a constructive debate about the flow? It will be one body and it will be less bureaucratic. issues highlighted in our motion, and Conservative I hope that that provides the reassurance that he sought Members have presented the Government’s failings in on that matter. the areas of college capital funding, apprenticeships, My hon. Friend the Member for Gravesham training, skills shortages and adult education. In our (Mr. Holloway), who is my near neighbour, also made a motion and in a number of speeches made by my powerful contribution, in which he spoke with real Conservative colleagues, we have put forward an alternative passion about his constituency, community groups, funding approach with policies designed to ensure that we have issues and North West Kent college—he was obviously the necessary skills for the future. particularly concerned about that. I also wish to note My hon. Friend the Member for Havant (Mr. Willetts) the contributions made by Labour Members, as they opened the debate with a characteristically analytical also highlighted the problems in their constituencies approach to the failings of the Secretary of State and caused by the funding situation for the colleges. his team, highlighting the real problems facing us, noting The hon. Member for Barnsley, Central (Mr. Illsley) the failings of Labour in government and presenting made a powerful contribution, raising serious points our approach. My hon. Friend’s excellent speech raised about what would happen if the refurbishment and the concerns of colleges, employers, students, workers redevelopment did not take place in his area and his and adult learners. Regrettably, in his speech, the Secretary college. The hon. Member for City of York (Hugh of State floundered and gave the usual Government Bayley) talked about the economic situation and the gloss—[Interruption.] The hon. Member for West Ham need for smarter regulation, rather than a lack of regulation. (Lyn Brown) laughs, but he did flounder and did give a He went on to discuss NEETs and young people with gloss, and he was very selective in his responses. He was disabilities, all of which are crucial issues that we should terribly party political, backward-looking, disappointing, be addressing, as we have tried to do today. I did not faltering and unconvincing—[Interruption.] And he agree with him on local education authorities taking enters the Chamber at this very moment. Even he did responsibility for 16 to 19-year-olds, as per the not appear to be convinced of his arguments and Apprenticeships, Skills, Children and Learning Bill, explanations, let alone the rest of us. Regrettably, he which is going through Parliament at this time. We made wide generalisations and, as always, his contribution think that that is a retrograde step and not one that we was rather lacking in detail. He said that the college could support. The hon. Member for Blaydon failings should not have happened, but they did—they (Mr. Anderson) spoke with real passion about the issues happened on his watch. Why was that? We heard too in his area, and I listened with great interest to him. much history, not enough of the contemporary and not a lot for the future—it was very disappointing. Hugh Bayley: Even though the hon. Gentleman and I The hon. Member for Bristol, West (Stephen Williams), disagree on whether LEAs should take responsibility who spoke for the Liberal Democrats, made some very for the funding of FE colleges, does he agree that there good points and covered, with a broad brush, most of should be a level playing field in terms of funding—the the points in our motion. I agreed with some of what he same amount per pupil unit for sixth-formers in schools said, but not with all of it. and colleges? 1257 Skills in the Recession18 MAY 2009 Skills in the Recession 1258

Mr. Evennett: This is an area that we need to look at. The recession will result in there not being enough Everything has to be looked at on its merits, but we jobs for people to go to for people leaving school, always want a fairer funding system. colleges and universities. We need to support those people along with the recently unemployed, and to give Mr. David Anderson: The hon. Gentleman said that them advice, perhaps access to further training and he was interested in what I had to say in my contribution, opportunities for employment and new careers so that but is he interested enough to tell us whether he will they are prevented from becoming long-term claimants. commit to continue the funding of the union learning The Conservatives are very concerned about how we reps scheme? can help young people coming out of colleges and universities to get into jobs. Mr. Evennett: My hon. Friend the Member for Havant has already answered that by saying that we are looking Britain, regrettably, starts from a weak skills base. We at things very sympathetically. We must move on, because hear too often how many people—5 million or whatever— the time available to us is very short. [Interruption.] are classed as functionally illiterate, and millions more The hon. Member for West Ham, who is a Parliamentary struggle with basic literacy and numeracy. The Secretary Private Secretary, seems to want to make a contribution— of State scratches his head, and he might well do so, she has made more of a contribution from a sedentary because such problems are real in today’s society. position than many others. [Interruption.] He can make comments from a sedentary In the short time available I wish to concentrate on position, but people matter and there is no point in two things: NEETs; and the college capital programme. being flippant about these situations. Unemployment is a real tragedy and the failure of We are looking to train more people. We heard that young people to be in training, education or employment there has been a cut in adult learning places. My hon. is a real concern. This current recession is hitting the Friend the Member for South Holland and The Deepings younger people in our community even harder. The (Mr. Hayes) intervened and made it quite clear that it is level of youth unemployment is rising and we are very often vital for many people to go to adult education and concerned that it will continue to rise, with the result get some qualifications before they can go on to get that there will be more people in this situation. A record further qualifications. Women returners, in particular, number of people are not in any form of education, as well as other people, need that opportunity and focus employment or training, as shown in the official figures. to go into education again. The Government have cut That is a tragedy for individuals, for local communities those opportunities and we have seen the number of and for our country’s future, thus it is so important that places dramatically reduce in the past few years. we look constructively at dealing with the situation. In the past, the UK’s position on youth unemployment Mr. Hayes: By 1.4 million. was a lot better than the OECD average, but I regret to say that it is deteriorating. We have heard in speeches Mr. Evennett: Yes, by 1.4 million. I will reiterate the today how much more it will deteriorate—even by the figure yet again to highlight the catastrophe. Government’s own admission—in the forthcoming future. Let me go on to the disaster of the capital funding for This is a disaster and it is an indictment of what the colleges. We have heard concerns today from both sides Government have failed to do in their term in office. of the House that have highlighted the impact of the The Prime Minister, long before entering No. 10, mismanagement of the capital programme, which has stated that youth unemployment would be one of his had consequences for the colleges and the young people priorities. As my hon. Friend the Member for Havant who are learning or hoping to learn. We have heard the said, this Government always have good intentions and numbers—144 colleges were going ahead with major they are good on rhetoric, but the reality is always building work and are now at a standstill, incurring, as something quite different. That is terribly disappointing. we understand it, an average of about £1.2 million in The Association of Colleges says that existing problems expenses. Many colleges have spent much more. include a funding system that is “too slow”, rules that restrict the movement of “money between funding pots” We welcome the report by Sir Andrew Foster for the and an obsession with Department. He was particularly damning of the Government’s handling of the capital programme and “full level qualifications that are not appropriate in the current economic situation.” suggested that the reorganisation of DIUS led directly to confusion and the prevailing financial problems in It has also said that FE. He said that the “there is a major disincentive for Colleges to deliver flexible packages of training which fall outside the rules.” “the demise of the LSC and uncertainty about arrangements for the new agencies should not be underestimated.” Restrictions on other training providers are also causing problems. A number of training providers with tried- There is a continuing problem. It is not just about the and-tested ways of helping young people engage with past, but about what will happen as we go forward. learning and the labour market have found that they are I have been privileged enough to visit Thanet college ineligible for public funding because they do not tick and to have seen the problems there. There was regeneration the right boxes. In some instances, they have had to halt and new building, which have been stopped. I have been all provision as a result. Training providers face a difficult to the Wellingborough, Corby and Kettering campuses and uncertain future due to constant internal reorganisation to see the problems with their capital programmes. at the LSC and the Government’s education Bill, which There are regeneration projects, too, as we heard from is going through Parliament at the moment and will Members from both sides of the House. The college create more new quangos, more bureaucracy and more rebuilding programme and the capital programme are ineffective delivery of facilities for training and opportunities part of regeneration. I met some people from the college for our young people. in King’s Lynn in Norfolk who highlighted the problems. 1259 Skills in the Recession18 MAY 2009 Skills in the Recession 1260

My hon. Friend the Member for North-West Norfolk 6.47 pm (Mr. Bellingham) has given me more details. The college The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for is in partnership with others—with businesses and the Innovation, Universities and Skills (Mr. Siôn Simon): local community—to regenerate the centre of King’s This has been an interesting, serious, and slightly sombre Lynn. It cannot do that if it does not get its part of the debate. There has not been a lot of levity. The most that funding. That is the reality on the ground. I can recall is the hon. Member for Bristol, West (Stephen The Secretary of State is always unwilling to answer Williams) telling us about his leg waxing and— direct questions on these matters, but I want to put a couple to him. He did not answer my hon. Friend the Stephen Williams: Non-leg waxing. Member for Havant on the subject of the criteria that will be set, which the Secretary of State highlighted and Mr. Simon: About his non-leg waxing and tonsorial which will go through shortly. I want his colleague, the treatments at his local FE college. Amusing though that Under-Secretary, to respond to three points to do with was, he went on to make the point, “My local FE the criteria. First, what are the criteria? Will regeneration college even does accountancy.”That was a good point, be a top priority for the funding that will be available well made. People can do more at an FE college now for the colleges’ future? What is the chronology, and will than was traditionally the case. I recently went to Matthew it be the people who put in first—those who are “shovel Boulton college in Birmingham city centre. It is a fantastic ready”—who get the funding or not? What will be the college that was built four years ago but is still a effect on the other players, providers and agencies? state-of-the-art beacon of what can be done—and of what we have done all over this country, as we have built Most importantly, as mentioned in a brief from the new FE colleges to allow vocational learners to do all Association of Colleges, the Government must confirm kinds of training. At Matthew Boulton, students can what happens to the money. For example, £215 million not only do accountancy but dentistry, too. There are is being spent on capital expenditure on stalled projects; mini operating theatres and a state-of-the-art broadband £187 million will be written off in colleges’ accounts if wireless fitting thing on which all the Sky installation the projects do not go forward, which will put most engineers in the country are trained. colleges in deficit and wipe out their reserves; and there That is what one can do in an FE college these days, will be £269 million spent on extra costs, such as and that is what people are doing, up and down the maintenance, in the next five years. There needs to be a land, in the colleges that we have built and that we are full, fair and fast compensation scheme that we run to a continuing to build. However, having said that, there clear timetable and the Government need to get a grip has been a serious problem in the future funding for the of that—they should do so now—and to let us know FE colleges that we plan to build. The hon. Member for openly what their priorities will be. Bristol, West began the debate on that subject by talking In conclusion, because time goes so quickly— about the numbers of colleges involved in the current difficulties. It was also mentioned by the hon. Member Lyn Brown (West Ham) (Lab): It is not going quickly for Havant (Mr. Willetts) and a couple of other Members, over here. and I shall come back to it. Before I mention the capital, which is the next issue Mr. Evennett: The hon. Lady calls out again from the that I shall deal with, I want to mention the thrust of Parliamentary Private Secretary’s Bench—she is an the speech made by my hon. Friend the Member for entertainment in herself. Blaydon (Mr. Anderson). He spoke with great passion, What do we really need? The capital funding programme and from experience, about the union learning fund, its should have fairness, transparency and clarity, and rigorous representatives, what they do and achieve, and how criteria should be applied to the projects awaiting approval. important they are. The Secretary of State mentioned On apprenticeships, we need an expansion of real, them in his opening speech, and said that he had work-based programmes. We must make it easier for recently been to a union learning facility in his constituency. companies to mix apprenticeships by cutting excessive A week or two before I was appointed to my current paperwork, instituting direct payment to employers and job, I visited a union learning facility in my constituency. injecting support for apprentices of all ages, delivered It is notable that the shadow Secretary of State did through lifelong learning accounts. We need more not mention union learning in his speech, and his community learning and employability, and to provide party’s lengthy documents never mention it. He intervened funds specifically for NEETs, targeting help to those on my hon. Friend the Member for Blaydon to say that most in need after leaving school. We also need investment he had recently had a meeting with the Trades Union in an adult and community learning fund for much-needed Congress, at which his attitude had been sympathetic. I courses to help people to update their skills or to gain have to say that to those of us on the Labour Benches it new skills. We need to set FE colleges free from the seemed more pathetic than sympathetic that he would bureaucracy of the LSC and its planned successors. We not guarantee the £21.5 million that we invest in that need a revolution to improve the careers service, which learning. There was even a parliamentary question tabled is, at present, inadequate. In too many areas, the focus is by an hon. Member from his party about unionlearn, just on universities. Funds should be refocused from the the thrust of which was, “Why are we spending public current provision to provide a new all-age service and to money funding people to learn about how to be trade set up a new web-based skills matching service. unionists?” As hon. Members will know, that is not The Government have failed to deliver the skills, what unionlearn is about. It is about union representatives training and education needed if the economy is to in the workplace signposting and directing into learning emerge stronger from the recession. The Secretary of workers who otherwise would not get there. It is a great State and his team have neither the vision nor the programme, and my hon. Friend the Member for Blaydon constructive policies to deal with the situation. does great work by bringing it up. 1261 Skills in the Recession18 MAY 2009 Skills in the Recession 1262

[Mr. Simon] agree with him: all the college principals I meet—and I meet dozens and dozens of them to talk about the I have a feeling that in the time available to me, I issue—make it clear, time and again, that the regional might not get very much further than the subject of LSC staff with whom they deal are doing a good job. capital. The hon. Member for Bristol, West, talked They have no problems with those staff at all. This is a about the number of colleges affected by the current good opportunity to congratulate regional LSC staff problem. There are 144 colleges directly affected; 79 have from the Dispatch Box on the work that they do in a already received approval in principle, and a further 65 committed and successful way. have submitted their applications in principle but have The right hon. Gentleman talked about Craven college not yet received approval. As I have said on many and the importance of the rural. He has mentioned that occasions in this House and elsewhere, and to many issue before. I have spoken to principals who were on college principals whom I have met, many other colleges the reference panel that drew up the criteria. One principal will have invested time, money in some cases, and of a land-based college assured me that he had raised certainly energy and commitment in drawing up putative the issue, that it had been considered by the reference plans for future investment, but will not yet have submitted panel, and that it would go forward and influence the their papers. We are, and have always been, conscious—I decision on the criteria that college principals come up have said this many times in the House—that in addition with. to the 144 colleges mentioned, another subset of colleges My hon. Friend the Member for City of York (Hugh is affected in a real but lesser way. The 144 colleges Bayley) made the case for his local colleges, at least two mentioned are those that are directly involved in the of which I have visited; both are, as he says, extraordinary. current scheme. He made slightly mistaken use of the word “cuts” when talking about his early-day motion. I hope it does not Mr. Hayes: The Minister is indeed giving a less say “cuts” in his early-day motion; we should be clear pugnacious summing-up than he did on a previous that we were going to spend £2.3 billion on college occasion, as my right hon. Friend the Member for capital this year anyway, and we are now going to spend North-West Hampshire (Sir George Young)recommended £2.6 billion. he should. The Minister must by now have come to a The right hon. Member for North-West Hampshire conclusion about what that extra number is. It is (Sir George Young), who I see is in the Chamber, and inconceivable that the civil servants working with him who bizarrely said that I was pugnacious in the Westminster would not have come up with a figure. How many Hall debate, asked whether the schemes that do not go colleges are we talking about? Is it 160, 180 or 200? He ahead in the current tranche will go to the back of the must know; it is time that he came clean. queue. It is important for people to understand that that is not the case. There will be two processes, one of Mr. Simon: I was about to deal with the “pugnacious” which starts now; the gateway criterion for that process slur, but then I found myself wanting to respond that if is shovel readiness, if I may use that phrase. There will the hon. Gentleman had the slightest understanding of then be a second process, using the same criteria that the issue, he could not possibly ask such a daft question. were drawn up in the first process except that of shovel Of course we could not possibly put a figure on the readiness. Through that second process, the second set number of people who may have been thinking about of colleges will be put through. It is not a question of applying to have a new college in future. those colleges going to the back of the queue; they will Moving on to the serious points made on the issue, effectively be dealt with in the same way as the first lot, my hon. Friend the Member for Barnsley, Central but more slowly and later. (Mr. Illsley) asked about the timetable. Again, we have I do not have time to deal with apprenticeships or gone through that subject on several occasions. The NEETs, or the many other issues that hon. Members Learning and Skills Council has convened a panel of raised. All that I would say in conclusion is that I hope college principals, which has met and is looking into the today’s debate has caused the hon. Member for Havant issue. The LSC will write to college principals shortly, to reconsider his calls for cuts in the skills budget, and letting them know what the prioritisation criteria will caused him to recognise, as we do, that skills are the be. Subject to the publication of those criteria, decisions bedrock of our economic future. Neither issue—neither will be made very quickly about which colleges can go skills nor our economic future—can be trusted to the forward with the work. My hon. Friend suggested that Tories. that might be done not in one hit, but in a two-stage Question put (Standing Order No. 31(2)), That the process. He suggested that in the first instance, a larger original words stand part of the Question. number of colleges would be deemed to have met the criteria, and then a value for money process would be The House divided: Ayes 195, Noes 277. undergone before there was a second phase, in which a Division No. 131] [6.59 pm final, formal allocation was made. As far as I am aware, the LSC has not made that decision yet, although I am AYES aware that it has been having discussions of that nature. Afriyie, Adam Baker, Norman The fundamental point remains that it and we have Ainsworth, Mr. Peter Barker, Gregory committed to giving firm answers to colleges about the Alexander, Danny Beith, rh Sir Alan first tranche, or this year’s tranche, of funding by the Amess, Mr. David Bellingham, Mr. Henry early summer—that is, imminently. Ancram, rh Mr. Michael Benyon, Mr. Richard The right hon. Member for Skipton and Ripon Arbuthnot, rh Mr. James Bercow, John (Mr. Curry), who I see is in the Chamber, mentioned Atkinson, Mr. Peter Beresford, Sir Paul regional LSC staff. I want to take this opportunity to Bacon, Mr. Richard Binley, Mr. Brian 1263 Skills in the Recession18 MAY 2009 Skills in the Recession 1264

Blunt, Mr. Crispin Howarth, David Smith, Sir Robert Villiers, Mrs. Theresa Bone, Mr. Peter Howarth, Mr. Gerald Soames, Mr. Nicholas Walker, Mr. Charles Boswell, Mr. Tim Howell, John Spelman, Mrs. Caroline Wallace, Mr. Ben Brazier, Mr. Julian Huhne, Chris Spicer, Sir Michael Watkinson, Angela Brokenshire, James Hunter, Mark Spink, Bob Webb, Steve Brooke, Annette Hurd, Mr. Nick Spring, Mr. Richard Whittingdale, Mr. John Browning, Angela Jack, rh Mr. Michael Steen, Mr. Anthony Widdecombe, rh Miss Bruce, rh Malcolm Jackson, Mr. Stewart Streeter, Mr. Gary Ann Burns, Mr. Simon Jenkin, Mr. Bernard Stuart, Mr. Graham Wiggin, Bill Burstow, Mr. Paul Jones, Mr. David Stunell, Andrew Willetts, Mr. David Burt, Alistair Kawczynski, Daniel Swayne, Mr. Desmond Williams, Mark Burt, Lorely Kennedy, rh Mr. Charles Swinson, Jo Williams, Stephen Cable, Dr. Vincent Key, Robert Swire, Mr. Hugo Wilshire, Mr. David Campbell, rh Sir Menzies Kirkbride, Miss Julie Syms, Mr. Robert Wilson, Mr. Rob Carmichael, Mr. Alistair Knight, rh Mr. Greg Tapsell, Sir Peter Winterton, Ann Carswell, Mr. Douglas Kramer, Susan Taylor, Mr. Ian Winterton, Sir Nicholas Cash, Mr. William Laing, Mrs. Eleanor Taylor, Matthew Wright, Jeremy Clark, Greg Lamb, Norman Teather, Sarah Young, rh Sir George Clarke, rh Mr. Kenneth Lancaster, Mr. Mark Timpson, Mr. Edward Clegg, rh Mr. Nick Lansley, Mr. Andrew Tredinnick, David Tellers for the Ayes: Clifton-Brown, Mr. Geoffrey Laws, Mr. David Turner, Mr. Andrew Mr. John Baron and Cox, Mr. Geoffrey Leech, Mr. John Vara, Mr. Shailesh Mr. Philip Dunne Crabb, Mr. Stephen Leigh, Mr. Edward Curry, rh Mr. David Lewis, Dr. Julian NOES Davey, Mr. Edward Lidington, Mr. David Davies, David T.C. Lilley, rh Mr. Peter Abbott, Ms Diane Clarke, rh Mr. Tom (Monmouth) Llwyd, Mr. Elfyn Ainsworth, rh Mr. Bob Clelland, Mr. David Davies, Philip Loughton, Tim Allen, Mr. Graham Coaker, Mr. Vernon Davis, rh David Mackay, rh Mr. Andrew Anderson, Mr. David Coffey, Ann Djanogly, Mr. Jonathan Main, Anne Armstrong, rh Hilary Cohen, Harry Duddridge, James Malins, Mr. Humfrey Atkins, Charlotte Cooper, Rosie Duncan, Alan Maples, Mr. John Austin, Mr. Ian Cooper, rh Yvette Duncan Smith, rh Mr. I Mates, rh Mr. Michael Austin, John Corbyn, Jeremy ain McLoughlin, rh Mr. Baird, Vera Cruddas, Jon Evans, Mr. Nigel Patrick Balls, rh Ed Cryer, Mrs. Ann Evennett, Mr. David Mercer, Patrick Banks, Gordon Cummings, John Fabricant, Michael Miller, Mrs. Maria Barlow, Ms Celia Cunningham, Mr. Jim Field, Mr. Mark Milton, Anne Barron, rh Mr. Kevin Cunningham, Tony Foster, Mr. Don Mitchell, Mr. Andrew Battle, rh John Darling, rh Mr. Alistair Fox, Dr. Liam Moore, Mr. Michael Bayley, Hugh David, Mr. Wayne Fraser, Christopher Moss, Mr. Malcolm Beckett, rh Margaret Davidson, Mr. Ian Gale, Mr. Roger Murrison, Dr. Andrew Begg, Miss Anne Davies, Mr. Dai Garnier, Mr. Edward Neill, Robert Bell, Sir Stuart Davies, Mr. Quentin Gauke, Mr. David Newmark, Mr. Brooks Benn, rh Hilary Dean, Mrs. Janet Gibb, Mr. Nick O’Brien, Mr. Stephen Benton, Mr. Joe Denham, rh Mr. John Gidley, Sandra Oaten, Mr. Mark Betts, Mr. Clive Devine, Mr. Jim Gillan, Mrs. Cheryl Öpik, Lembit Blackman, Liz Dhanda, Mr. Parmjit Goldsworthy, Julia Paice, Mr. James Blackman-Woods, Dr. Dismore, Mr. Andrew Goodman, Mr. Paul Paterson, Mr. Owen Roberta Dobson, rh Frank Grayling, Chris Pelling, Mr. Andrew Blears, rh Hazel Donohoe, Mr. Brian H. Green, Damian Penning, Mike Blizzard, Mr. Bob Doran, Mr. Frank Greening, Justine Penrose, John Blunkett, rh Mr. David Drew, Mr. David Grieve, Mr. Dominic Pickles, Mr. Eric Bradshaw, Mr. Ben Eagle, Angela Gummer, rh Mr. John Pritchard, Mark Brennan, Kevin Eagle, Maria Hague, rh Mr. William Pugh, Dr. John Brown, rh Mr. Gordon Efford, Clive Hancock, Mr. Mike Randall, Mr. John Brown, Lyn Ellman, Mrs. Louise Hands, Mr. Greg Redwood, rh Mr. John Brown, rh Mr. Nicholas Engel, Natascha Harper, Mr. Mark Rennie, Willie Bryant, Chris Ennis, Jeff Harvey, Nick Robathan, Mr. Andrew Buck, Ms Karen Etherington, Bill Hayes, Mr. John Robertson, Mr. Laurence Burden, Richard Field, rh Mr. Frank Heald, Mr. Oliver Rogerson, Dan Burgon, Colin Fisher, Mark Heath, Mr. David Rosindell, Andrew Butler, Ms Dawn Flello, Mr. Robert Heathcoat-Amory, rh Rowen, Paul Byrne, rh Mr. Liam Flint, rh Caroline Mr. David Ruffley, Mr. David Caborn, rh Mr. Richard Flynn, Paul Hemming, John Russell, Bob Cairns, David Foster, Mr. Michael Hendry, Charles Sanders, Mr. Adrian Campbell, Mr. Alan (Worcester) Herbert, Nick Scott, Mr. Lee Campbell, Mr. Ronnie Foster, Michael Jabez Hoban, Mr. Mark Selous, Andrew Caton, Mr. Martin (Hastings and Rye) Hogg, rh Mr. Douglas Shapps, Grant Chapman, Ben Francis, Dr. Hywel Hollobone, Mr. Philip Shepherd, Mr. Richard Clapham, Mr. Michael Gapes, Mike Holloway, Mr. Adam Simmonds, Mark Clark, Paul Gardiner, Barry Horam, Mr. John Simpson, Mr. Keith Clarke, rh Mr. Charles Gerrard, Mr. Neil 1265 Skills in the Recession18 MAY 2009 Skills in the Recession 1266

Gibson, Dr. Ian Lloyd, Tony Simon, Mr. Siôn Trickett, Jon Gilroy, Linda Mackinlay, Andrew Simpson, Alan Truswell, Mr. Paul Godsiff, Mr. Roger MacShane, rh Mr. Denis Singh, Mr. Marsha Turner, Dr. Desmond Goodman, Helen Mann, John Skinner, Mr. Dennis Turner, Mr. Neil Griffith, Nia Marris, Rob Slaughter, Mr. Andy Twigg, Derek Griffiths, Nigel Marsden, Mr. Gordon Smith, rh Mr. Andrew Ussher, Kitty Grogan, Mr. John Marshall-Andrews, Mr. Smith, Ms Angela C. Vaz, rh Keith Gwynne, Andrew Robert (Sheffield, Hillsborough) Walley, Joan Hain, rh Mr. Peter McAvoy, rh Mr. Smith, Angela E. (Basildon) Waltho, Lynda Hall, Mr. Mike Thomas Smith, Geraldine Ward, Claire Hamilton, Mr. David McCabe, Steve Smith, rh Jacqui Wareing, Mr. Robert Hamilton, Mr. Fabian McCafferty, Chris Snelgrove, Anne N. Hanson, rh Mr. David McCarthy, Kerry Soulsby, Sir Peter Watson, Mr. Tom Harman, rh Ms Harriet McCarthy-Fry, Sarah Southworth, Helen Watts, Mr. Dave Harris, Mr. Tom McCartney, rh Mr. Ian Spellar, rh Mr. John Whitehead, Dr. Alan Havard, Mr. Dai McDonnell, John Spink, Bob Wicks, rh Malcolm Healey, rh John McGovern, Mr. Jim Starkey, Dr. Phyllis Williams, rh Mr. Alan Henderson, Mr. Doug McIsaac, Shona Stewart, Ian Wills, rh Mr. Michael Hendrick, Mr. Mark McKechin, Ann Stoate, Dr. Howard Wilson, Phil Hepburn, Mr. Stephen McKenna, Rosemary Straw, rh Mr. Jack Winnick, Mr. David Heppell, Mr. John McNulty, rh Mr. Tony Stringer, Graham Woodward, rh Mr. Hesford, Stephen Meacher, rh Mr. Michael Stuart, Ms Gisela Shaun Hewitt, rh Ms Patricia Merron, Gillian Sutcliffe, Mr. Gerry Woolas, Mr. Phil Heyes, David Michael, rh Alun Tami, Mark Wright, Mr. Anthony Hill, rh Keith Miliband, rh David Taylor, Ms Dari Wright, David Hodgson, Mrs. Sharon Miller, Andrew Taylor, David Wright, Mr. Iain Hoey, Kate Mitchell, Mr. Austin Taylor, Dr. Richard Wright, Dr. Tony Hood, Mr. Jim Moffatt, Laura Thornberry, Emily Wyatt, Derek Hoon, rh Mr. Geoffrey Mole, Chris Timms, rh Mr. Stephen Hope, Phil Moon, Mrs. Madeleine Tipping, Paddy Tellers for the Noes: Howarth, rh Mr. George Morgan, Julie Todd, Mr. Mark Ian Lucas and Howells, rh Dr. Kim Munn, Meg Touhig, rh Mr. Don Mr. Frank Roy Hoyle, Mr. Lindsay Murphy, Mr. Denis Hughes, rh Beverley Murphy, rh Mr. Paul Question accordingly negatived. Humble, Mrs. Joan Naysmith, Dr. Doug Iddon, Dr. Brian Norris, Dan Illsley, Mr. Eric O’Hara, Mr. Edward Question put forthwith (Standing Order No. 31(2)), Ingram, rh Mr. Adam Olner, Mr. Bill That the proposed words be there added. Irranca-Davies, Huw Osborne, Sandra Question agreed to. James, Mrs. Siân C. Owen, Albert The Deputy Speaker declared the main Question, as Jenkins, Mr. Brian Palmer, Dr. Nick Johnson, Ms Diana Pearson, Ian amended, to be agreed to (Standing Order No. 31(2)). R. Plaskitt, Mr. James Resolved, Jones, Helen Pope, Mr. Greg That this House notes the Government’s belief that in a Jones, Mr. Kevan Pound, Stephen recession it is important to give people the skills they and their Jones, Lynne Prentice, Mr. Gordon employers need to recover from the downturn; commends this Jones, Mr. Martyn Primarolo, rh Dawn year’s Budget for investing £1.2 billion in creating jobs and Jowell, rh Tessa Prosser, Gwyn providing training to young people who have been unemployed Joyce, Mr. Eric Purchase, Mr. Ken for 12 months; further notes that there are now more 18 to Kaufman, rh Sir Gerald Purnell, rh James 24 year-olds working or engaged in full-time education compared Keeley, Barbara Raynsford, rh Mr. Nick to 1997; commends the Government for its sustained investment Keen, Alan Reed, Mr. Andy in skills with record numbers of people now receiving training, far Keen, Ann Reed, Mr. Jamie more than was originally planned for this year; further commends Kemp, Mr. Fraser Reid, rh John the Government for spending over £5 billion on adult skills this Kennedy, rh Jane Riordan, Mrs. Linda year, helping three million learners, and for increasing investment Kidney, Mr. David Robertson, John in higher education by 24 per cent. in real terms since 1997; further notes that the Government is prioritising helping people Kilfoyle, Mr. Peter Robinson, Mr. Geoffrey to gain employability skills; further notes that the Train to Gain Knight, rh Jim Rooney, Mr. Terry budget has risen to £925 million this year; further notes the Kumar, Dr. Ashok Roy, Lindsay budget for apprenticeships is over £1 billion this year and that Ladyman, Dr. Stephen Ruane, Chris there are 250,000 starts planned; commends the Government for Lammy, rh Mr. David Ruddock, Joan confirming that no current learner will lack the funds to complete Laxton, Mr. Bob Russell, Christine their course; further notes that this Government is spending Lepper, David Sarwar, Mr. Mohammad £2.6 billion on further education capital projects over this spending Levitt, Tom Seabeck, Alison review period; and further notes that Sir Andrew Foster has Lewis, Mr. Ivan Sheerman, Mr. Barry recently produced an independent review of the Building Colleges Linton, Martin Sheridan, Jim for the Future programme. 1267 18 MAY 2009 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 1268 Trust Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation Trust course, the issue goes further. Indeed, the issues under discussion range widely: many people, wherever they Mr. Deputy Speaker (Sir Alan Haselhurst): I advise live, were shocked by what they read in the Healthcare the House that Mr. Speaker has selected the amendment Commission’s report and wanted to know not just what in the name of the Prime Minister. happened but why it happened; and people in the hospital knew what was happening but were not listened to when they tried to do something about it, or they did 7.16 pm not have an opportunity to do so. Mr. Andrew Lansley (South Cambridgeshire) (Con): I beg to move, Michael Fabricant (Lichfield) (Con): Will my hon. That this House calls for an independent inquiry under the Friend give way on that point? Inquiries Act 2005 into the failings of the Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation Trust. Mr. Lansley: If I may, let me just make this point. I understand that the Secretary of State is with the The Government promised an oral statement on the World Health Organisation in Geneva. He spoke to me two reviews that were published on 13 April, and I wish last week about that. We entirely accept that that is the not that we had had to table this motion, but that the proper thing for him to do, so I welcome the Minister of Government had made an oral statement and accepted State, the hon. Member for Exeter (Mr. Bradshaw) to that the reviews did not answer the questions before us, move the amendment and speak on behalf of the and that the Secretary of State had come to the House Government. and said that he was going to institute a public inquiry This morning I visited Stafford again, the fourth time on the terms we seek. I am sorry that we have had to that I have done so in two months. I wanted to make move the motion, but it now seems to be necessary. sure that I had had an opportunity to talk with those who have been most closely concerned with the failings Michael Fabricant: Does my hon. Friend accept that in care identified at Stafford general hospital, and with people in Staffordshire who have been personally affected efforts to ensure that lessons have been learned. I wanted by the matter ask for an inquiry, which needs to be to discuss with them their view of the reviews published independent, not to apportion blame, but to ensure that at the end of April by Professor Sir George Alberti and something like this can never happen again—not just in Dr. David Colin-Thomé on behalf of the Department Staffordshire hospitals but in other hospitals? Rightly of Health. or wrongly, they believe that if the inquiry is not The conclusion reached by those to whom I spoke, by independent, it will be a whitewash. us and by many Members across the House who know most about these issues is that those reports to the Mr. Lansley: I understand exactly what my hon. Department of Health were not independent, were not Friend says, and he knows the matter very well through sufficient, and did not go beyond a superficial examination, his constituency and his constituents who visit Staffordshire in Dr. Colin-Thomé’s case, of the role of external general hospital and those who, no doubt, work there. agencies. In Professor Sir George Alberti’s case, the His point is right, because Peter Carter, general secretary report was no more than a snapshot of what is happening of the Royal College of Nursing, visited Staffordshire in relation to Stafford general hospital. general a few weeks ago and met nurses from throughout In sum, the reports do not go beyond the Healthcare the hospital. He told me that the RCN itself now wants Commission investigation and report to set out clearly, a public inquiry. Although it represents the largest for the benefit of the public in Staffordshire and south group of staff employed at the hospital, it does not Staffordshire, not only what happened, but why it happened consider a public inquiry being for one minute a distraction and why the organisations and the senior executives in or diversion from the delivery of the best quality of care the health service who were charged with managing the in that hospital. From its point of view, finding out not trust’s performance, with monitoring and performance- only what happened but why, and learning those lessons managing the trust at a senior level, and with its for the future at Staffordshire general and in the wider performance assessment failed in their task of ensuring NHS community, is absolutely vital. The RCN was that the lamentable failings in the standards of care at quite right to make that point. the trust were identified earlier and stopped. Mr. Patrick McLoughlin (West Derbyshire) (Con): Lembit Öpik (Montgomeryshire) (LD): Although I My hon. Friend knows, because I have told him, that very much agree with what the hon. Gentleman has said my mother died at Staffordshire general hospital just so far, he said that the people of Staffordshire would be over 15 years ago. She received fantastic treatment and concerned about the matter. Is he aware, as my constituent care at the hospital, and, importantly, many people who Trudy Hill has pointed out, that the gravitas of it is have worked there for a very long time and dedicated exacerbated by the fact that it was of national importance? their lives to giving public service to the health service Many of my constituents from Montgomeryshire also are, whether we like it or not, blighted by that period. depended on the services of Staffordshire, especially the For their sake as well as the sakes of the people who specialist services. I imagine that the large turnout for rightly feel most aggrieved, a public inquiry must take the debate reflects both the hon. Gentleman’s concerns place. and those of people in a radius of well over 100 miles of the trust. Mr. Lansley: I am very grateful to my right hon. Friend, who is absolutely right. I hope that he and Mr. Lansley: I understand the hon. Gentleman’s point. Members from all parts of the House will understand Forgive me, Mr. Deputy Speaker, because I should have that I bow to no one in my support for national health referred not only to south Staffordshire, because, of service staff, for what they do and for how they do it. 1269 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 18 MAY 2009 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 1270 Trust Trust [Mr. Lansley] adversely, were exactly the same in 2008. Up until the trust became a foundation trust, the SHAs were responsible However, they, like anyone, know that the performance for the scrutiny of its performance, and they, in particular, and failings of organisations are often systemic rather clearly failed to address themselves to the quality of than personal. We therefore want not only to identify care that the trust provided—to the point at which, in personal responsibility on the part of senior executives, March 2008, when the SHA board received the University a point to which I shall return, but to understand the of Birmingham’s report on data, it said that systemic problems that meant that good staff, trying to “there appeared to be nothing to indicate that anything out of the do their best, found that they were unable to do so, ordinary was taking place on mortality.” because of either staffing and financial decisions, or a There was a woeful failure on the part of the SHA lack of performance management and scrutiny by other and the PCT. Notwithstanding the fact that Dr. Colin- organisations. Thomé makes it clear that there was such a failure, there My right hon. Friend makes an important point. One is no indication in his review of who was responsible. clear example of what the published reviews lack is that On the issue of who was responsible, we are talking Dr. Colin-Thomé, in his report, addressed three about David Nicholson, for about a year, who is now recommendations to the Department of Health, as chief executive of the NHS, and Cynthia Bowers, though the Department has serious responsibilities to subsequently, who is now chief executive of the Care ensure that the system must change, but no part of it to Quality Commission. Standing at the Dispatch Box, I whether the Department, in the past, took its responsibilities do not know whether I can say that they were directly— seriously and discharged them. It is as if the Department personally—responsible for those failings in a way that did not exist before now—that, somehow, it is the should be substantively criticised; I do know, however, solution for the future but did nothing in the past. The that the motion is not about criticising any individual, Department, however, did a great deal in the past that but about establishing a public inquiry. However, I do may have contributed directly to the matter. not want anyone to think that, by calling for an inquiry, we have neglected the fact that the proper purpose of Mr. William Cash (Stone) (Con): Will my hon. Friend such a public inquiry is to find out whether two of the give way? most senior people in the NHS, with responsibility for its services, have shown that they are credible or capable Mr. Lansley: I shall of course give way in a second, of such responsibility. but let me clarify what I mean. For example, it is abundantly clear that strategic health authorities and Mr. Cash: The minutes, which I have with me, will primary care trusts, whatever their failings, were significantly demonstrate some of the connections to which my hon. damaged by NHS reorganisations and the utter chaos Friend refers. that flowed from them. The Department and the previous Secretary of State were directly responsible for sending Mr. Lansley: Yes. I look forward to hearing from my the foundation trust’s application to Monitor, but, in hon. Friend if he manages to catch your eye, Mr. Deputy Dr. Colin-Thomé’s report, there was no evidence of the Speaker. scrutiny that should have been applied, or any reason why it was not. The appointment to SHAs and PCTs of I know that other colleagues across the House want senior staff, and their performance, is a responsibility of to contribute, so I shall try to be quick. I want to the Department, but that was not discharged. Indeed, I illustrate further why I feel that the reviews thus far have shall come on to the central issue of targets and the not answered the questions that must be answered. In responsibility of the Department. his report, Dr. Colin-Thomé says: “I feel very strongly that a lack of good patient engagement is Mr. Cash: My hon. Friend quite rightly refers to the the key to why Mid Staffordshire hospital trust continued to past and its connection with the present. He will also be provide poor care for a protracted period of time.” aware that the current NHS chief executive is David That may well be true, but is there any analysis that goes Nicholson, who, at the critical time, was chief executive beyond that? Is there any analysis of how the Government, of Shropshire and Staffordshire strategic health authority through the abolition of community health councils and West Midlands South strategic health authority, and the emasculation of patients’ forums, led to a and that there is a direct connection between those two reduction of patient engagement in a way that was a matters. tragic failure? Is there any examination of how foundation trusts are engaging or failing to engage with the public? Mr. Lansley: I am grateful to my hon. Friend, who The many of us who represent foundation trusts understands these matters extremely well. He is right believed that they should be a mechanism for engaging about that, but let me anticipate what I was in any case the public, as members of the trusts, more effectively. going to say. Dr. Colin-Thomé points out how the SHA Clearly, that mechanism failed in this case, but Dr. Colin- and the PCT failed to meet their responsibilities, saying Thomé gives us no sense of that. Frankly, all we have that the from him is what seems to be no more than a bland “PCTs past and present and SHAs past and present do not expression of hope that local involvement networks, or appear to have taken notice of signs that were present in the LINks, which were set up by the Department under survey data and in complaints that indicated poor patient care. recent legislation, will somehow be better at all this— Evidence of poor care has emerged that was not collated or without independent powers to investigate, follow up challenged by the PCTs or SHAs at the time.” complaints or act as an advocate. In his report Dr. Colin- We know from the Healthcare Commission’s report Thomé seems to think that LINks will be useful, but he that clinical governance issues that were raised in 2002, did not meet LINks representatives in Stafford, so it is and on which its predecessor organisations commented all pure pie in the sky. 1271 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 18 MAY 2009 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 1272 Trust Trust Mr. John Gummer (Suffolk, Coastal) (Con): Will my will somehow make things better. There is no evidence hon. Friend make it clear that the investigation would to suggest that. On the contrary, there is the idea that be of considerable importance to the whole country? In the new Care Quality Commission will not have a my constituency, we face the imposition of a new system responsibility in the scrutiny of second-stage complaints; that will rip proper, emergency heart care from Ipswich that will disappear off to the ombudsman. That undermines hospital without there having been any discussion whatever. further, as compared with the past, the ability of Care My constituents are left having to go from Leiston to Quality Commission performance assessment to be Papworth if they are to have emergency treatment. Such combined with intimate knowledge of what is happening a situation arises if there is no discussion with patients inside a trust. and no concern for them. We need the investigation not Frankly, there are already questions about the extent just for Staffordshire, but for the whole country. to which the Healthcare Commission acted; second-stage complaints should have been getting to it, but they were Mr. Lansley: I am grateful to my right hon. Friend. not. Where were the complaints going? That is the As he knows, I have visited Ipswich hospital to discuss interesting question. The Healthcare Commission report the removal of its maxillofacial treatment services. I am says that some of them were going to strategic health aware of what my right hon. Friend has described. If he authorities, others to the National Patient Safety Agency and other colleagues permit me, I will make it my and some to the Healthcare Commission itself—there business to visit Ipswich hospital to discuss the issue was no rhyme or reason about it. The system in relation with its representatives. The services that patients would to the complaints is dysfunctional, and the Healthcare receive at Papworth hospital would be among the finest Commission, which most needed to know—its statutory anywhere in the world, as it is in my constituency. responsibility is to investigate when patients’ quality of However, that is not to say that we do not believe that care is being compromised—did not know. If it did, we such services should be provided in more accessible need to understand to what extent it was acting on the locations if they can be and if they are of good quality. complaints. Norman Lamb (North Norfolk) (LD): Does the hon. Individual complaints were investigated by the Gentleman share my concern at the apparent drift commission; one has come to me. The commission towards more secrecy for board meetings at foundation concluded that there had been gross professional negligence trusts? More and more foundation trusts are routinely and demanded that Staffordshire hospital prepare an excluding the public and hospital governors. That is a action plan in response within five weeks. That happened trend in the wrong direction; there should be more in October 2008, but did the commission get such a openness and more accountability. response? Not at all—there was no response. Even as recently as the early part of this year, Mid Staffordshire Mr. Lansley: I do share that concern. In that context, NHS Foundation Trust was failing to respond to serious I should like to make another important point on which conclusions drawn by the Healthcare Commission. That a public inquiry would further add to our knowledge. is another reason why it seems to us that the Healthcare Just before the Healthcare Commission report was Commission was not by any means the last word. published, Martin Yeates, then chief executive of Mid I said that I would also refer to targets. When the Staffordshire NHS Foundation Trust, “stepped down”— Healthcare Commission’s report was published, the Minister that, apparently is a term of art. After the commission’s said that the issue had nothing to do with targets. Will report was published, the board took the view that he he accept that, as Dr. Colin-Thomé makes clear in his should be suspended. It instituted an investigation by report: Peter Garland, a senior former NHS chief executive. “A key lesson is that all organisations should be focused on Apparently, Mr. Garland has reported to the trust prioritising high quality patient care as judged by outcomes, and board and told its members the extent to which he whilst process targets are very helpful on the journey, they must believes Mr. Yeates met or did not meet his duties to the not become a distraction from the bigger picture”? board and the trust. That report, however, has not been What have we been doing for the past two years? We published and, as I understand it, the trust board does have been talking endlessly about the importance of not intend to publish it. focusing on outcomes rather than targets. What have Yet on Friday afternoon—we all know what happens Ministers been doing? They have been talking about the to Friday afternoon press releases—the board announced desirability of using targets as the be-all and end-all. that Mr. Martin Yeates had tendered his resignation, Even now, as the new Health Bill is discussed in another which the board had accepted. As a consequence, Mr. Yeates place, there is a view that emergency services are measured will receive his notice period; in addition to his two sufficiently by simple reference to whether the four-hour months’ pay on gardening leave, he will get six months’ A and E target is adhered to or not. That ignores the pay. He has effectively been put beyond the scope of enormous spike when people are discharged from accident disciplinary action, unless a breach of duty can be and emergency departments after three hours and demonstrated. Clearly, that will not happen unless all 59 minutes. Furthermore, the Healthcare Commission the evidence is brought out in a public inquiry. I am not report makes it clear that patients were being discharged accusing Mr. Yeates of anything, but we are not being elsewhere rather than getting the treatment that they given access to any of the information on which a needed at the time they needed it in the emergency judgment can be based. department. I turn to another important point, to which Dr. Colin- One of the questions that must be resolved is why Thomé referred. It is about complaints. Again, Dr. Colin- staff in the hospital who raised these matters did not get Thomé did not put forward any suggestion about what anything done about it, and why others did not blow the should be done. All he said was that the Government’s whistle when they should have done. I find no evidence reform of the complaints system in recent legislation in what Dr. Colin-Thomé has reported, or in what 1273 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 18 MAY 2009 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 1274 Trust Trust [Mr. Lansley] Safety Agency. There was no discussion of how the complaints processes have worked or how patient Sir George Alberti has written, to explain that. Dr. Colin- engagement has worked, and no substantive proposals Thomé simply says that it happened—he does not know about how they can be reformed in future, as they why. As I am sure that my hon. Friend the Member for clearly must be. Instead of robust criticism, all we have Stone (Mr. Cash) will agree, the starting point in finding is a bureaucratic process. Dr. Colin-Thomé’s report, in out what really happened, and why, is to ensure that particular, suggests that the things that the Government people at the trust—some of whom, until very recently, were already planning to do, such as practice-based felt too intimidated to speak out—feel that they have commissioning, world-class commissioning and LINks, the protection of giving evidence to a public inquiry will somehow solve everything. There is no evidence under oath, with all the statutory powers that go with that that will happen—far from it. Indeed, some initiatives, that. We have proposals for improving whistleblowing. such as practice-based commissioning and LINks, are The Government should have the humility to recognise stalling rather than making the progress that they should. that nobody contacted Public Concern at Work and Because of all that, the reports do not shed light on nothing was done to bring forward into the public why those in the hospital and elsewhere failed to stop domain the concerns that were clearly held by staff at the tragic events that have killed, or caused avoidable the trust. deaths among perhaps hundreds of patients, with all the distress that that has meant for their families. I again Norman Lamb: The hon. Gentleman raises concerns pay tribute to Julie Bailey and all her colleagues at the about a bullying culture. There is also the issue of the Cure the NHS campaign, who persisted when the situation duty, or responsibility, of the clinicians themselves. It was very difficult and it took courage to do so in the appears that some clinicians ultimately failed to meet face of a bureaucracy that was determined that they that duty by reporting the serious concerns that they would not expose what was happening at Stafford hospital. must have had. Does not that also need to be addressed, They want an inquiry now, and say that only when we because someone needs to be held to account in terms know why and how this happened will the commitment of clinical behaviour? to say “Never again” truly be credible. Ministers have been to see them and have promised to think again, but Mr. Lansley: Yes, it does. It may be excessive to I do not see the evidence that they have done so. It is expect that even a public inquiry would be able to therefore incumbent on Parliament to require them to identify, in all cases, where and to what extent that had think again, and I commend the motion to the House. happened. However, if a review of case notes gives rise to serious concerns about a significant number of cases, Several hon. Members rose— at least a public inquiry would provide a mechanism for those to be considered in the round in terms of what Mr. Deputy Speaker: Order. Before I call the Minister that tells us about the clinical governance that was of State, I should remind the House, because it has not being undertaken and how it may need to be reformed been stated on the Annunciator for other reasons, that in future. there is a 15-minute limit on Back-Bench speeches. I want to make a specific point about what has not After the end of the Front-Bench speeches, that might been achieved by these reviews. For several years, the have to be adjusted in a downward direction. Government have had the National Patient Safety Agency. One of its principal tasks involves the national reporting and learning system, which should in itself give rise to 7.46 pm alerts about the compromise of patient care and errors The Minister of State, Department of Health (Mr. Ben and inefficiencies. I have failed to see any evidence Bradshaw): I beg to move an amendment, to leave out anywhere in the reviews that the National Patient Safety from “House” to the end of the Question and add: Agency exists, let alone that it has done anything. If a “notes the independent report by the Healthcare Commission public inquiry were to look into failings of policy, and which identified severe failings at the Mid Staffordshire NHS needs for the future, that would clearly be one of them. Foundation Trust and the follow-up reports by the National I hope that, in the course of the past few minutes, I Clinical Director for Emergency Care and the National Clinical have made it clear that the questions about why Stafford Director for Primary Care which state that Stafford Hospital’s hospital failed its patients in emergency services and accident and emergency department is now safe but that further improvements must be made at the Trust and lessons learnt by the admissions, as identified in the Healthcare Commission whole NHS; further notes that the hospital has offered independent report, have not been answered, and why a public reviews of clinical records to all concerned; agrees that at the inquiry is therefore needed. The reports thus far have present time it would not be appropriate to establish an independent not given the public in Staffordshire a voice, and they public inquiry; further agrees that management and staff at the have not provided a public opportunity, with protection, hospital must remain focused on delivering high quality patient for evidence to be taken. The reports were not independent, care; and further agrees that an independent public inquiry could and they have failed to investigate the direct role of the add undue delay to implementing the recommendations of the Department of Health and its policies. Until recently, above reports and therefore to the hospital delivering high quality and safe services for the local community .” both the authors were civil servants in the Department of Health: they are not independent, and we should not I am grateful for the shadow Health Secretary’s see them as such. Neither report contained critical understanding of the fact that my right hon. Friend the scrutiny of the impact of targets. There was no critical Secretary of State cannot be with us this evening because examination of the role of the chief executives of the of the assembly of the World Health Organisation. strategic health authorities over the period in question. On 17 March 2009, the Healthcare Commission, There was no discussion of the roles of the national then the independent health regulator, published its reporting and learning system or of the National Patient report into the failings in emergency care at Mid 1275 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 18 MAY 2009 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 1276 Trust Trust Staffordshire NHS Foundation Trust between 2005 and Mr. Bradshaw: As my hon. Friend knows from the mid-2008. It was a catalogue of appalling management many discussions that the Secretary of State and I have and failures at every level, for which the Secretary of held with him, we are always open and willing to discuss State apologised unreservedly on behalf of the Government any ideas that he has, but I shall address the specific and the NHS in his statement to the House the next day. matter of a public inquiry at some length later. The Government immediately announced a range of The Government accepted all the recommendations measures, including two swift reviews of the circumstances of both reports and have begun to implement them in at Stafford hospital, to be led by Professor Sir George full. In summary, the reports found that, first, significant Alberti, the national clinical director for emergency improvements had already been made at Stafford hospital. care, and Dr. David Colin-Thomé, the national clinical Services in accident and emergency were now safe, but director for primary care. Professor Alberti looked into there was an urgent need to make further improvements the hospital’s current procedures for emergency admissions to other services and to rebuild local confidence in the and treatment, its progress against the recommendations trust. Secondly, in the past, patients’ views were not in the Healthcare Commission’s report, while Dr. Colin- taken seriously enough and were too easily dismissed. Thomé looked into the circumstances surrounding the Thirdly, there was a lamentable failure of clinical leadership Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation Trust prior to the in the trust and the wider health community. Fourthly, Healthcare Commission’s investigation to learn lessons the commissioners of local health services were not about how the primary care trust and strategic health sufficiently aware of the poor-quality care in the hospital authority, within the commissioning and performance or active in addressing it. Fifthly, all parts of the system management systems that they operated, had failed to should have worked together better in the interests of expose what was happening at the hospital. Copies of patients. those reports were placed in the Library on 30 April, as Some have attempted to suggest that what happened was the Government’s response. at Stafford hospital is typical of the NHS as a whole, or I heard what the hon. Gentleman said about the lack was a result of targets or some other national policy. It of an oral statement. He will know that providing an is important to recognise, not least because of the oral statement is not in the gift of an individual Secretary fantastic job that NHS staff do in hospitals throughout of State. The Secretary of State has gone out of his way the country, that the Healthcare Commission and the to keep the House informed, but it is up to the business two subsequent reports found that what happened at managers. The hon. Gentleman may also recall that on Stafford hospital was the result of catastrophic local that day Members were discussing MPs’ expenses at failure. Every NHS nurse, doctor and manager in the some length. I personally would have very much welcomed country to whom I have spoken is as horrified by events the opportunity for an oral statement to be made, but it there as we all are. was not agreed to by the business managers. The onus must, therefore, be, first and foremost, on Mr. Cash: The Minister knows very well that I had a Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation Trust, together personal conversation with the Secretary of State where with its local partners and South Staffordshire primary he clearly understood that an oral statement was to be care trust, to address the recommendations relevant to given. Furthermore, just before business questions a them in the reports, make further improvements in the week last Thursday, I received a letter from the Leader quality of care and rebuild local confidence. of the House saying, in effect, that she apologised for the fact that an oral statement had not been given Charlotte Atkins (Staffordshire, Moorlands) (Lab): because the matter had already been dealt with by a Does the Minister have confidence in the procedure that ministerial written statement. The Minister is being Monitor adopted to secure foundation status for Stafford disingenuous, to put it mildly. hospital? What worried me when Bill Moyes appeared before the Health Committee was that he talked about Mr. Bradshaw: The facts as the hon. Gentleman looking at press reports in future to get intelligence states them are not correct. The Secretary of State about hospitals. I would have hoped that the investigation wanted to deliver an oral statement, as he made absolutely would be much more robust. I am concerned about clear when he made the original oral statement. The what that means for the process that University hospital hon. Gentleman has been long enough in this House to of North Staffordshire may undergo soon. It, too, know that oral statements are not in the gift of an wants foundation status. individual Secretary of State. Mr. Bradshaw: As my hon. Friend knows, Monitor Mr. Cash rose— has changed and made more robust its process for Mr. Bradshaw: I will not give way again now. I will do assessing candidates for foundation trust status. Even at so later to the hon. Gentleman, who has had much the time, it considered quality of care. As she knows, the opportunity to raise the issue in the House, of which he Healthcare Commission’s announcement of a formal has not always taken advantage. investigation came after foundation trust status had been granted to Stafford hospital. However, I will raise Mr. David Kidney (Stafford) (Lab): I would like to her concerns with Bill Moyes on her behalf, and I trust move on to the big issue of an inquiry. I want to discuss that she will do so about University hospital of North some elements of the amendment, which states that Staffordshire. there should not be an inquiry at this time. Is my hon. We all understand the need for the relatives of patients Friend willing to start talking to those with an interest—me, who died at Stafford hospital to know whether there is other Staffordshire Members of Parliament, Opposition any suggestion that death was attributable to the poor parties—about the form and terms of reference of an care described in the Healthcare Commission’s report. inquiry in the near future? The primary care trust has a widely publicised confidential 1277 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 18 MAY 2009 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 1278 Trust Trust [Mr. Bradshaw] Mr. Bradshaw: I have sympathy with my hon. Friend’s comments about the importance of going back and helpline, on which concerned relatives can request a ensuring that Stafford hospital has acted on the thorough and independent review of the clinical records recommendations of the Healthcare Commission report of the patient in question. and the other two reports. However, she knows that the The coroner in South Staffordshire, who was also independent regulator’s report and the others stated mentioned in the Healthcare Commission report, has that they were satisfied that the problems in Stafford said that he will consider any requests for an inquest hospital were not systemic in the NHS as a whole. To from the relatives of patients who died at Stafford claim that would be a great mistake and do a great hospital. disservice to NHS staff throughout the country—the vast majority of hospitals manage to hit the A and E Norman Lamb: It is encouraging to hear about the four-hour waiting target and deliver high-quality and coroner’s change of heart, but is not a change to legislation safe care to their patients every day. We have ascertained required to ensure that, in future, there is no refusal to the lessons to be learned for the rest of the service from co-operate with an inquiry, as happened in this case? the Healthcare Commission report and the other reports, Mr. Bradshaw: The coroner disputes that allegation—I and they are already being implemented. However, I do simply point that out to the hon. Gentleman. The not believe that the Opposition and some other hon. coroner does not accept that version of events. The hon. Members are calling for an inquiry into that. They want Gentleman knows that a measure is currently being an inquiry into the specific circumstances at Stafford considered in Parliament, which addresses some of the hospital and I shall shortly cover why that would not issues that he raises. necessarily be sensible at this stage. The reports of both Dr. David Colin-Thomé and the Mr. Gummer: Will the Minister help me and explain Healthcare Commission were highly critical of the closed to my constituents how we can believe in the new culture that operated at Stafford hospital. All NHS attitude to complaints when my people have been told organisations must ensure that they operate in accordance that the minimum time for a journey from their home to with the current guidance, which promotes openness, emergency heart operations is 160 minutes? My constituents transparency and accountability to their local populations. complained before the changes were made, yet it has That includes boards holding meetings in public. The been announced that there is no need for public consultation new board of the hospital now holds its quarterly on the changes. The Minister must accept that we need meetings in public. a report on the subject that we are considering to raise It is clear from the reports that complaints were not the bigger problem throughout the country that complaints tackled satisfactorily at Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation are not being heeded—either after changes are made or Trust. The high number of upheld complaints was one before they are implemented. Strategic health authorities of the things that first worried the Healthcare Commission. currently issue a diktat. He must understand that complaints As of 1 April this year, we have reformed and strengthened must be listened to. the NHS complaints system. Hospitals need to do Mr. Deputy Speaker: Order. The interventions are better at resolving complaints locally. The independent getting a little long and we have a limited time for hon. parliamentary and health service ombudsman remains Members who wish to speak on the subject from the the ultimate arbiter on patient complaints. Information Back Benches. on complaints is already available from the Care Quality Commission, the ombudsman and the NHS information Mr. Bradshaw: I shall take your advice, Mr. Deputy centre—[Interruption.] The hon. Member for South Speaker, and be a little more conservative in my tolerance Cambridgeshire (Mr. Lansley) is chatting. When he of interventions. talked about complaints, he referred only to the content The right hon. Member for Suffolk, Coastal of the reports; he did not mention the series of actions (Mr. Gummer) confuses complaints about individual that the Government announced to address them at the poor care with service changes. I think that he referred same time as the reports were published. I am explaining to a proposed service change by his local hospital or that to him now, if he has the courtesy to listen. PCT. I am sure that he knows that there is a robust and We are discussing with the health ombudsman publishing formal consultation process for such a change. One of the number of complaints from each trust referred to the most effective things he can do is persuade his and upheld by her. All that information will be placed local—probably Conservative—councillors, who dominate on the NHS Choices website, allowing easier comparisons the overview and scrutiny committee in his area— between hospitals. Mr. Gummer: No. Joan Walley (Stoke-on-Trent, North) (Lab): I welcome Mr. Bradshaw: Is not Suffolk county council a my hon. Friend’s comments about examining local Conservative authority? The councillors can raise concerns improvements that need to be made. I have read the two and refer a major service change, with which the right reports and I welcome the fact that, in three months, the hon. Gentleman is unhappy, to an independent national PCT, Monitor and the Healthcare Commission will panel. examine the way in which local services have improved. Another thing that alerted the Healthcare Commission Does he share my concern that, although that covers to potential problems at Stafford hospital was its very examining local improvements, in the fullness of time poor performance in the annual NHS staff survey. The we need a full inquiry to consider systemic problems on question of whether staff would be happy to be treated a national basis so that we can all learn from a tragic in the hospital where they worked was dropped by the incident that involves many people? We need to ensure Healthcare Commission in 2007 because of concerns that we learn from that, not only in one local area but that its wording could lead to distorted results for some throughout the country. providers. 1279 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 18 MAY 2009 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 1280 Trust Trust Mr. Lansley: Rubbish. Mr. Bradshaw: I will give way in a second. I have been very generous in giving way; the hon. Gentleman does Mr. Bradshaw: The hon. Gentleman, again from a not need to nag me to give way. sedentary position, says, “Rubbish.” The Healthcare Commission—the independent regulator—made that I would also remind hon. Members that public inquiries decision because of the danger that if, for example, take a long time. The Bristol inquiry took three years those working in a psychiatric hospital were asked and the Shipman inquiry took five. We have concerns whether they would like to be treated in their hospital, a that, as well as not adding to the sum of our knowledge lot would obviously say no. We have agreed with the of what happened at Stafford hospital, a public inquiry Care Quality Commission to reintroduce the question could distract the new management and the staff at the asking staff how they rate the quality of care in their hospital from focusing on further improving the quality hospitals, albeit avoiding the problematic wording of of care for local people. the question contained in the earlier survey. Norman Lamb: I am grateful to the Minister for Mr. Lansley: The hon. Gentleman said the decision giving way and apologise for nagging him. The was taken by the independent health regulator, but will Government’s amendment says that an inquiry would he confirm that the decision to drop the question—not not be appropriate “at the present time”. Earlier in his the decision to reform it—was made in direct consultation speech he said that an inquiry would not be appropriate with his Department? “at this stage”. He seems to be leaving the door open. Is that the case and will he consider further representations Mr. Bradshaw: No, the survey belongs to the independent about the possibility of establishing a public inquiry? regulator. The regulator consulted the Department and, for the reasons that I have explained to the hon. Gentleman, Mr. Bradshaw: As I hope the Secretary of State and I we accepted its concern that the wording could distort have made clear, we are always open to representations. the responses of those working in psychiatric hospitals, We have listened carefully to those that have already in mental health and so on. been made, both by hon. Members from all parts of the The hon. Gentleman also talked about whistleblowing. House and Julie Bailey, whom I join the Opposition Although the board at Mid Staffordshire did not listen spokesman in paying tribute to. However, so far we to the concerns of patients or staff, we share his surprise remain unconvinced, and that is as far as I can go. that more professionals in the trust did not put their In a letter to my hon. Friend the Member for Cannock concerns on the record. The NHS exists to meet the Chase (Dr. Wright) from Sir Ian Kennedy, the outgoing needs of patients. Individual members of staff have a chairman of the Healthcare Commission who chaired right—indeed, a duty—to raise any concerns that they the Bristol babies inquiry, Sir Ian said that he did not may have about the quality of patient care with their think that a public inquiry would be justified in this employer. It is important to remind all staff who work case. However, as we have repeatedly made clear to hon. in the NHS and their managers that whistleblowers Members and to the local patients organisations and have full protection under the Public Interest Disclosure others, if there are significant issues or lines of inquiry Act 1998. Furthermore, the new NHS constitution includes that they do not think have been addressed, either by an explicit right for staff who report wrongdoing to be the Healthcare Commission report or by the subsequent protected. reviews, the Secretary of State will be only too happy to Let me deal with the central issue of the Opposition consider them. motion, which is the call for a public inquiry. Public inquiries can be an important mechanism to establish Mr. Cash: Is the Minister aware of the fact that, independently the cause of a problem or disaster. I can before he became the chairman of the Healthcare understand that there are many who consider that a Commission, on the Bristol inquiry, Sir Ian Kennedy public inquiry into the events at Mid Staffordshire is said that the importance of a public inquiry is that it both appropriate and necessary. A number of people offers an opportunity for people to be heard and to have recalled the Bristol heart babies inquiry. In our listen to others? He also said that a public inquiry view the critical difference is that that inquiry was “allows for the public venting of anger, distress and frustration; it initiated when, under the previous Conservative provides a public stage on which this can take place.” Government, there was no independent watchdog or Sir Ian Kennedy thoroughly endorsed the idea of a regulator for the NHS. public inquiry. If Bristol, why not Stafford? The whole point of establishing the Commission for Health Improvement in 2000 and the subsequent regulators Mr. Bradshaw: For once I am grateful for the hon. since was to provide the public with the confidence that Gentleman’s intervention, because it makes my case any concerns that they might have about NHS care in exactly for me. If someone such as Sir Ian Kennedy, their areas would be properly and independently who said that about the importance of public inquiries, investigated. I have not heard any criticism of the does not believe that a public inquiry is necessary or Healthcare Commission’s investigation or any suggestions desirable in this case, that absolutely makes the point that it did not get to the bottom of what went wrong at for me. I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman. Stafford hospital. Given that, as well as the two subsequent inquiries and the action flowing from them, the Government Martin Yeates, the former chief executive at the remain unconvinced at this time that a public inquiry foundation trust, stepped down from his post on 3 March would add anything to our understanding of what went 2009. The interim chair of Mid Staffordshire, David wrong or of what needs to be done to prevent such Stone, subsequently suspended Mr. Yeates, pending an terrible events from happening again. investigation. That investigation has now concluded and the foundation trust has decided to accept Mr. Yeates’s Norman Lamb: Will the Minister give way? resignation, with no disciplinary procedures being invoked. 1281 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 18 MAY 2009 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 1282 Trust Trust [Mr. Bradshaw] The words that he used in his speech seemed to suggest that there was a chink of light there. It seemed to me I accept that that is a matter for the foundation trust’s that the Government might just be open to persuasion. board, in conjunction with Monitor. Both the Secretary of State and I have been clear all along that the proper Michael Fabricant: I am pleased that the hon. Gentleman process must be followed in relation to any individuals. thinks the Government might be open to persuasion, However, given the grave events at Stafford hospital but what I heard from the Minister—I hope he will and the understandable level of public concern, I find it correct me if I misheard him—was that the Government hard to understand why the decision was made not to were always willing to entertain representations. That is go through a disciplinary process. The Secretary of fine, but he also said that a public inquiry would be a State has accordingly written to Monitor today, asking distraction to the management. To me, that certainly to see a copy of the investigation into Mr. Yeates. If we does not suggest a chink of light; it merely suggests that still have concerns after we have seen that report and the Government will listen but take no action. heard the explanation, we will consider what further action needs to be taken. The Secretary of State could Norman Lamb: I understand that concern, and all not have made it clearer that there can be no rewards for hon. Members on both sides of the House who feel failure in the NHS. strongly about this should combine together to put the We did that in the case of Rose Gibb, the former chief maximum pressure on the Government, not only in executive of Maidstone and Tunbridge Wells hospital, tonight’s vote but subsequently, to ensure that the issue and we won. We expect the whole of the NHS to does not just go away. There is always a danger, as understand that the public will not tolerate cosy deals events move on, that these issues can slip down the when they have suffered from such abject management agenda, but we must not let that happen in this case. failure. Mr. Cash: Does the hon. Gentleman accept that, Norman Lamb: Would the Minister undertake to when this matter comes before the Health Select Committee, publish that report, so that everyone can see what it says as I understand it will, the preliminary debate that takes about the governance of that hospital? place here will be followed by significant evidence that will be impossible for the Government to ignore? Mr. Bradshaw: I am sure that the Secretary of State will want to consider that question, but given that he Norman Lamb: I am sure that that is the case. I agree commissioned that work—just as he did all the other that it should be impossible for the Government to reports, all of which have been put in the public domain—I ignore that evidence. should be very surprised if he did not agree. However, To date, the Government’s response has been to we need to see the report first. scapegoat the local leadership. The local leadership The Healthcare Commission’s report laid bare appalling absolutely has to take responsibility for what happened, failure at Mid Staffordshire. The two subsequent reports but the Government’s strategy appears to be to apologise made further and far-reaching recommendations, which on its behalf and to move on. That will not do. It is right are being implemented locally and nationally, in order that those in a position of leadership at the hospital to ensure what every hon. Member will be satisfied that should be held to account, but that strategy fails to such terrible failure can never be allowed to happen recognise that wider lessons need to be learned from again. this awful horror. The former chairman of the Healthcare Commission described the events as the worst care ever 8.9 pm witnessed in the NHS. That in itself is a pretty compelling reason for a public inquiry in this case. Those wider Norman Lamb (North Norfolk) (LD): I welcome this lessons seem to have been brushed aside by the Government, debate and I am pleased that it has been called. I join reflecting their stubborn resistance to recognising that, the Minister and the Conservative spokesman in paying for example, the four-hour target played any part in tribute to the work of Julie Bailey who, together with what happened. others, has been persistent in refusing to be fobbed off I want to run through some of the key reasons for in the pursuit of complaints. They are to be applauded holding a public inquiry. They relate to the specific for their persistence. situation at the hospital and to the wider issues involved. On the very day that the Healthcare Commission The first involves the position of Mr. Yeates. The Minister report was published and a statement was made in the said that he was concerned because the board had House, I called for a public inquiry, as, I think, did the allowed Mr. Yeates to resign without going through a hon. Member for Stone (Mr. Cash). disciplinary process. I am pleased that the Minister said he expected the report into these events to be published. Mr. Cash: No, the day before. He said that the Government would need to see it first, but it should be placed in the public domain irrespective Norman Lamb: I apologise; the hon. Gentleman beat of what it says. It was commissioned by the Secretary of me to it. State to look into what led to this awful disaster, and to Ever since then, I have maintained my view that a examine Mr. Yeates’ role in it, and that information public inquiry must be set up. There are Labour Members should be put into the public domain straight away. who feel the same way, and it is important that we all maintain the pressure on the Government to accept our Mr. Lansley: Is the hon. Gentleman perplexed, as I pleas. It was interesting to hear the Minister’s response am, about why, if the Secretary of State commissioned regarding the wording of the Government’s amendment. Peter Garland to undertake this work, Peter Garland 1283 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 18 MAY 2009 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 1284 Trust Trust did not report to the Secretary of State? If the foundation The other issue relating to clinicians is the culture of trust has the degree of independence that I think it bullying that appears to exist. The Sunday Telegraph does, and it has now made its decision, the Secretary of this weekend reported concerns raised by a nurse who State must surely be powerless to do anything about had previously worked in the A and E department at it now. the hospital. She raised those concerns in November 2007, yet nothing appears to have been done. She referred Norman Lamb: I think so. to “racist abuse”, and to the fact that nurses were In regard to the resignation, it is now too late to “routinely ordered to lie about how long patients had been institute disciplinary proceedings. We have been presented waiting”. with a fait accompli, and the former chief executive is She also reported: now being paid to be on gardening leave for the rest of his notice period. The NHS is paying for that, despite “Junior doctors were bullied into discharging patients before the fact that there appears to be good evidence to justify they had been properly examined in order to meet targets”. a disciplinary inquiry.I also agree with the hon. Gentleman that the report should have gone to the Secretary of Mr. Cash: The hon. Gentleman might know that State, given that it was commissioned by him. many of those allegations were also made during Simon Cox’s programme on Radio 4, which many of us have Mr. Lansley: I hesitate to intervene on the hon. on disc. These questions must be looked into properly Gentleman again, because he is an employment lawyer because they are so grave, as some of the quotations by profession. Mr. Yeates might not necessarily be that I shall give the House from the statement by that beyond disciplinary action, but would there not need to nurse will amplify. be substantive evidence of a breach of his fiduciary duties to the board in order for such penalties to be contemplated? A public inquiry might be a principal Norman Lamb: I agree. I am making the point that mechanism by which such evidence could be gathered. this is another reason for the whole issue to be the subject of a public inquiry. Norman Lamb: I agree with the hon. Gentleman It is easy to say that this culture exists in only one entirely. That is one of my reasons for arguing that a hospital and could not exist in any other, but we hear public inquiry should take place. too many stories of a similar culture existing elsewhere. That is why the wider implication of the management of Mr. Bradshaw: It might be helpful to both hon. the NHS and the extent to which clinicians and other Members if I clarify who commissioned the report. As hospital staff feel constantly under pressure because of a foundation trust was involved, the report was of targets imposed from above, and the way those targets course commissioned by the trust itself, but that decision are enforced, should be looked into by a public inquiry. came out of the overall response to the Healthcare The third reason why there should be a public inquiry Commission inquiry by the Secretary of State, in is to secure justice for the families that have been so conjunction with Monitor. So in legal terms, it is absolutely horrendously affected by this awful scandal. So many of right that the report should go back to the trust, but them have refused to be fobbed off, but the fundamental that does not take away from the points that I made question remains about how justice will be secured for earlier about what needs to happen now. families of the victims of this dreadful care. That is another issue that is not being properly addressed in Norman Lamb: I am grateful to the Minister for that any systematic way other than by this review of patient clarification. notes—a review that looks at each case individually, The second reason there should be a public inquiry is which is not sufficient if we want to see the whole the role of the clinicians in the hospital. Many people picture and understand how this happened. We need to have expressed their concern that, despite the awful give those families a real sense that their concerns are things going on there—the dreadful care to which the being properly addressed. former chair of the Healthcare Commission referred—it appears that no clinician saw fit to report their concerns The fourth issue, which I raised in an intervention on to senior management or elsewhere, with the possible the Minister, is the role of the coroner. The Minister exception of one nurse, about whom we heard last made the point that there appears to be some challenge weekend. It could be argued that they felt prevented to the conclusions of the Healthcare Commission report; from doing so by the bullying culture in the organisation. I understood the Minister to dispute the fact that the However, they have a professional clinical duty to their inquiry was obstructed in some way. Surely, however, patients, and, irrespective of the extent to which the we need to address the fact that there is potential for unit was understaffed, if they saw that there was inadequate coroners to obstruct inquiries, so we need clear rules care, it was their duty to report their concerns and to get and clear guidelines about coroners’ responsibilities to something done about it. That did not happen, and that co-operate fully in such circumstances. in itself is a scandal that should be investigated by way When the Minister referred to legislation going through of a public inquiry. It is not being looked at in any other Parliament, I assume he meant the Coroners and Justice way. None of the reports that the Secretary of State has Bill. He said that there were measures in it to address commissioned has looked at that issue. As things stand, some of these concerns, but will he clarify whether any those clinicians who participated in the care that has thought is being given to the possibility of tabling an been so heavily criticised are presumably continuing amendment to place a specific statutory duty on coroners to work in the NHS. Should we not be concerned to co-operate in inquiries of this sort? I would be happy about that? That issue is not being addressed, and it to allow him to intervene—now or later—to confirm ought to be. that it will be possible to amend this draft legislation. 1285 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 18 MAY 2009 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 1286 Trust Trust [Norman Lamb] departments, and this is a credit to the Government, is that the four-hour target has transformed how A and E The next reason why we need a public inquiry relates and hospitals operate. I accept that it has been to the roles of the PCT and the SHA in the context of transformational: we all know it was unacceptable for what this whole scandal means for commissioning. We people to be left waiting in corridors on trolleys for hear a lot about the pursuit of world-class commissioning, 10 or 11 hours. The Minister must recognise that there but in this particular case it is clear that the PCT and are nevertheless concerns in hospitals up and down the the SHA failed abysmally to play an adequate role as country about how the target is enforced, particularly commissioners of care at this hospital. when it becomes a straitjacket. If the Minister talks to clinicians, as I know he has done, I am sure he will also Greg Mulholland (Leeds, North-West) (LD): Does be aware of concerns expressed about the operation of this case not show that this health authority tier or level this target in many hospitals. The Royal College of is, frankly, unnecessary? We know that the health service Nursing has made it very clear that strict adherence to needs to rationalise and save money, so is it not time to 98 per cent. compliance with the four-hour target has abolish a failing tier of the NHS that did not do its job caused real difficulties. in this case? Michael Fabricant: Is the hon. Gentleman aware that Norman Lamb: I certainly agree with my hon. Friend. a nearby hospital in Westminster provides an example? Sir Ian Kennedy, in a letter that followed the publication The system there is that when people enter a room, of this report, said: there is effectively no system until they eventually get to “The responsibility for managing performance, including effecting see a nurse for triage—and it is fairly chaotic at times. necessary improvements, lay and lies with the trust and its performance When I asked why it was like that, I was told that if manager, the Strategic Health Authority, the commissioning PCT people were given a number as at a delicatessen counter and, after the award of Foundation Trust status, Monitor. These in a supermarket, the four-hour clock would have to performance managers”— start. What happens, then, is that the patient dripping it seems to me that there are too many of them— with blood fails to get to see the triage nurse; meanwhile, “are able to visit any trust and call for whatever information that the patient who is relatively fit does get to see that nurse they believe is necessary from the Trust to carry out their duties.” when the four-hour clock starts ticking. That is the sort Well, what did they do to carry out those duties? What of distortion that occurs. visits did they undertake, or was it simply a paper exercise, considering those excessive death rates from Norman Lamb: I am grateful for that intervention, as afar? That is a central question. precisely that point was made in the Healthcare Commission Sir Ian went on to say in the letter: report: “Following normal practice, efforts were made” “Doctors were moved from treating seriously ill patients to deal with those with more minor ailments, in order to avoid by the Healthcare Commission as part of its investigation breaching the four-hour waiting time target. Patients were moved “to liaise with the trust and the SHA to explore what was to the clinical decision unit to ‘stop the clock’ but were then not needed”. properly monitored, since this area was not staffed.” So what co-operation did it receive? Was the response The hon. Member for Lichfield (Michael Fabricant) has adequate, particularly that of the SHA? Sir Ian continued: made that point, but the Minister seems blind to the “The investigation team at the Commission did not know that possibility that such concerns might exist elsewhere and the Trust was being considered for this status”— that patient care might have been compromised. That is that is, foundation status, which seems quite extraordinary— a fundamental reason why a public inquiry needs to “and was not asked whether there were concerns about the explore that issue. performance of the Trust in terms of the safety and quality of The Healthcare Commission report also included a care... We understand that Monitor asked the Strategic Health graph showing a spike just before the four-hour point, Authority for its views; the SHA was aware of our work on with large numbers of patients being discharged as the mortality outliers and ‘alerts’ by then”, clocked ticked away towards it. Surely we need to explore yet it did not say anything—again, quite extraordinary. whether the same pattern of discharge applies in other That, of course, raises questions about the chief hospitals to see whether the same pressures might be executive of the SHA, who was Cynthia Bower. I should applying elsewhere. The Government seem blind even say that she has been to see me and that I had a very to considering that possibility and so defensive about helpful meeting with her; she was very candid. It nevertheless the four-hour target that they are not prepared even to seems to me of fundamental importance that because consider whether any potentially adverse aspects apply she was the chief executive of the SHA—one of the to it. The conclusions of the Colin-Thomé report appear performance managers of this hospital—there is a conflict also to contradict the Minister with regard to the role of of interest so far as any internal investigation is concerned. the four-hour target and how it has been implemented. That is another clear reason why we must have an The next reason there needs to be an independent independent public inquiry. inquiry is the implications of the scandal for the regulators. The next reason is the role of targets, particularly the The process that this hospital went through to become a four-hour target. The Minister steadfastly sticks to the foundation trust without anyone stopping the hospital line that it is all down to just this hospital and the outrageous in its tracks to demand improvements before it happened way its management behaved. When visiting hospitals beggars belief. It is extraordinary that it was signed off around the country—I am sure other hon. Members by the primary care trust, the strategic health authority, will have noticed the same thing on their visits—I have the Department of Health, the Secretary of State himself, found that one of the things clinicians say in A and E as I understand it, and the Monitor board. 1287 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 18 MAY 2009 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 1288 Trust Trust Did no one notice what was going on in that hospital, Mr. Deputy Speaker (Sir Michael Lord): Order. The right under their noses? It smacks of an appalling clock is moving on, and, given the number of Members tick-box culture whereby, provided those on the ground seeking to catch my eye, I propose to reduce the limit on have ticked the box to say that something is working speeches to 10 minutes as from now. properly, everybody accepts it and the hospital gets its star rating. That is exactly the same as the culture that 8.36 pm applied in Haringey, which gave the local authority Mr. David Kidney (Stafford) (Lab): As a Labour three stars at the time when baby P was dying in tragic Member of Parliament I am committed to the NHS, circumstances. The way in which hospitals achieve secure and as Stafford’s Member of Parliament I am committed foundation trust status must surely be further explored. to a hospital in Stafford, so it broke my heart to read in the Healthcare Commission’s report that patients had Mr. Cash: Does the hon. Gentleman accept what I been severely, appallingly let down by the NHS and the said earlier about the paper trail and the minutes going local hospital. right back from the current chief executive of the NHS I support a full, independent public inquiry into and the chief executive of the Care Quality Commission every aspect of what went wrong, why, and how it can to Shropshire and Staffordshire strategic health authority be put right for the future. I shall vote for an inquiry and the West Midlands strategic health authority? At tonight. Yes, an inquiry will take some time to complete the critical time when all these things were happening, its investigations and deliberations and produce a report, the right hon. Member for Leicester, West (Ms Hewitt) and, yes, it can be distracting for people who have a job was Secretary of State and 17,000 jobs were being cut to do at the hospital while the investigations are ongoing. out of the health service. This is a continuous paper However, the work has to be done. One thing we can trail, which can be demonstrated. usefully do is talk about the form and terms of reference of the inquiry. If the Government will not give way on Norman Lamb: That is the sort of evidence that needs this today, one way in which we can continue the to be properly and fully considered by a public inquiry. pressure is to start to get ready for an inquiry. A few weeks ago, the press reported on the fact that some 22 hospital trusts have been given foundation I wish to say a word about my hospital—if I may call trust status despite failings, sometimes of a serious it that—and what my public and my patients want nature, in meeting basic health care standards. today. An inquiry will take some time, but there are things that need urgent attention at Stafford hospital, A lot of work on Staffordshire hospital has been and I do not want us to lose sight of that urgency done by The Sunday Telegraph, which reported: because we are also talking about a public inquiry. For “At the point the authorisation was made, the trust was missing example, the Healthcare Commission’s report told us government targets to reduce MRSA, had long waits in A&E, and for clot-busting treatment for heart attack victims, the documents about the severe understaffing on wards and the urgent from Monitor, the regulator, show. need for more staff. It told us about missing medical A further 21 trusts were also given” equipment and the urgent need for it to be provided. Six weeks later, Professor Alberti produced his report and foundation trust status said that there were staffing shortages and that more “despite concerns about the quality of the care they provided.” staff urgently needed to be appointed. He said that What happened in those cases? They were issued with there was an urgent need to provide some medical side letters by Monitor requiring them to take corrective equipment that was still missing. Six weeks on, the action to remove those concerns, but they still secured urgency had not been accepted and implemented. We foundation trust status. Was that made public? Were the must not overlook the fact that those things are still public ever told in all those cases that there were concerns urgent today. about patient care quality? That is very much not the I remind the House that the Healthcare Commission message that the Government gave when foundation produced damning evidence about three aspects of the trusts came into being. That status was supposed to be a hospital: accident and emergency, emergency care and symbol of absolute quality—quality assurance. some nursing care. However, in the same report it We must bear it in mind that for the chief executives mentioned positive things about the hospital. There of hospital trusts there is a big financial incentive. They were no concerns about elective care, and during the invariably receive substantial pay increases when their three-year period investigated there was a decline in the hospital becomes a foundation trust. That needs to be number of complaints about out-patient care. There looked at in a full public inquiry. was praise for the acute coronary care unit and the The Conservative spokesman mentioned the handling critical care unit. It is important to retain a sense of of complaints. He said that complaints ended up at a balance. People going into that hospital had good range of different destinations, which is surely completely experiences in some parts of it at some times, just as unacceptable. The public must understand exactly what others had bad, sometimes appallingly bad or fatal will happen to their complaint if it is not accepted and experiences. I ask the House to bear that in mind. upheld at trust level. When Professor Alberti went in after the Healthcare There are vital lessons that need to be learned from Commission, he was able to talk about improvements in this awful scandal. It is all very easy simply to place all A and E and say that there had been some improvements the blame on the local leadership, but there are clearly in emergency care, although not enough. He mapped lessons that the wider NHS and the Department of the way to continuing that improvement. He said that Health need to learn. It is surely our duty to all patients even when he was there, there were still instances of in the NHS to ensure that those lessons are learned. For poor nursing care that needed addressing. He made a that reason, there must be a public inquiry. warts-and-all assessment, which showed that we still need urgent attention given to some things. It is very Several hon. Members rose— important to remember that. 1289 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 18 MAY 2009 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 1290 Trust Trust [Mr. David Kidney] accept that the plan will require full public consultation and approval. I am sure we will make certain that that Imagine the effects of working at that hospital today, happens. given all the bad publicity that has appeared nationally, I should like to say much more about staffing levels, and the likelihood that people will complain about but we are short of time. Although there is no agreed anything for fear it will not be spotted if a complaint is level for wards in this country—or internationally—the not made about it. Imagine every story that someone Royal College of Nursing has valuable policy guidance, chooses to publicise becoming a headline in the local which reminds us that a number of factors must be newspaper. Morale is very low at the hospital. There are taken into account. In my view, the dependency levels fears that even now, as it recruits extra staff, some of patients are an especially important factor; but so, of people will not want to work there because they have course, are nursing experience, a skills mix, a settled seen the publicity. staff, minimum sickness and absenteeism and less reliance Into that worrying situation I stepped, with four on agency cover, and all those factors affected hospital simple proposals. I wrote to my constituents asking staff during the time we are discussing. whether they agreed with them. I proposed that those I agree that the handling of complaints was atrocious, responsible for the management of the hospital on and that we must adopt an “open and learning” culture. whose failings the Healthcare Commission reported That will require constant dialogue between patients, should be replaced, that staffing levels should be corrected their relatives, the public, and those who work at the and retained, that there should be stronger powers for hospital. It should not be a big thing to say that something patients and the public, and that there should be an is wrong at the hospital: people should be able to accept independent inquiry. So far more than 3,500 constituents that and act on it. I have told Ministers before today have responded, and more than 90 per cent. of them that the LINk in Staffordshire is particularly poorly agree with my proposals. I emphasise to the Minister developed. We need to be helped to make it the best of that 3,500 people in the Stafford constituency think that its kind, not one of the weaker of its kind. there should be an independent inquiry. Let me now deal with the arguments for an inquiry. Let me say something about the rebuilding of the We do need an inquiry. The trust pulled the wool over trust board. We heard that the chair had resigned just the eyes of the Healthcare Commission for three years. before the publication of the Healthcare Commission’s In each of those three years, the commission produced report. I shall not elaborate on what was said by the improving assessments of a trust that it later said was so hon. Member for South Cambridgeshire (Mr. Lansley) bad. Is the problem self-assessment? Does it constitute about the treatment of the chief executive. Let me a failing of the commission itself that it received more merely say how angry local people are about the fact complaints about this trust, in relation to its size, than that “step down” did not mean “resign” at the outset, about any other, and that it produced action plans in the fact that he received pay while suspended, and the response to stage 2 complaints but did not pursue them fact that he is now apparently being allowed to resign to establish whether they were implemented? The chairman with no consequences while still receiving that pay. of that body said there was no need for a public inquiry, People are very, very angry about that. but one of the things such an inquiry would look into is We are recruiting a new chair, a new chief executive the performance of his organisation. and new non-executive directors, and there will be a There should be an investigation. The trust pulled the new board. At present, however, the trust faces the wool over the eyes of Monitor, as we have heard. The greatest challenges. An interim chair with another job big black hole was about clinical care, where Ministers in Sheffield and an interim executive with another job now accept there was a lacuna, but that has now been in Chesterfield are managing and leading the hospital. put right. Even in terms of Monitor’s expert area of It is still a worrying time, and I ask for Members’ governance, management and leadership, the Healthcare support for the management and staff of the hospital as Commission report tears the trust apart for secrecy, for they try to do all the things that need to be done in the as little as possible being reported to the board, and for present circumstances. as little as possible of the board’s conduct being made It is true that the board needs to move from a closed public. Those issues should be investigated. to an open culture, but it has reverted to holding its For me, the biggest issue is the independence of the meetings in public, and at the first of those meetings it case reviews for the relatives of deceased patients, because reaffirmed its policy on whistleblowing. I showed the the trust has organised those reviews—albeit while bringing whisteblowing policy to Public Concern at Work, which in outside clinicians who are independent of it. How made constructive suggestions for its improvement. The can people feel trust in that system? Such reviews should trust has agreed to write to every employee about the be anchored in a public inquiry; and if there is a role to policy in this month’s pay packet, confirming that people be considered for the coroner, that needs to be looked are free to make their concerns known if they have into as well. them. Those are all valuable developments. All I want to say in conclusion is that 3,500 of my It should also be remembered that the board is yet constituents have said there should be an inquiry, and still to present its action plan in response to the report. the local councils—Stafford borough and Cannock Chase It is now calling the plan its transformation programme, district—have resolved that there should an inquiry as and I understand that it was agreed with Monitor at the well. The Patients Association has a national petition end of last week. There have been some public that people are signing, and the RCN supports this, and presentations—for instance, to the overview and scrutiny P.A.C.E. 2000, an organisation of elderly people in my committee, which has been dealing with the plan—but constituency, also thinks there should be an inquiry. if we seriously believe that the public and patients That is a lot of people, and the Minister should listen should be involved in the trust in the future, we must to them. 1291 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 18 MAY 2009 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 1292 Trust Trust 8.46 pm The statement then contains reference to another patient and quotes that involve some effings here and there. Mr. William Cash (Stone) (Con): This is a debate Then she says in respect of a particular patient about freedom of information. It is a tale of cover-ups by two closed cultures: a cover-up by the hospital and “I have heard”— its superior organisations, and a cover-up by the a nurse— Government and their subordinate public organisations. That has resulted in a pincer movement of both death “state that she was going to get rid of him. Most recently and despair. My constituents and the people representing following his hospital admission after taking an overdose I was the interests of the victims and the bereaved demand present when she said ‘He should have taken a few more pills and justice, and they will get justice only if they have a done the job properly.’” proper inquiry under the Inquiries Act 2005 because The hon. Member for North Norfolk (Norman Lamb), that will call for evidence on oath, and have compulsion who spoke for the Liberal Democrats, mentioned racism. of witnesses and proper legal protection for whistleblowers, The following quotes are mentioned in the statement: which is not available under the Public Interest Disclosure Act 1998 as it is bypassed. I am saying not that the “‘what have you got in that ruck-sack Doctor, is it a bomb?’…‘Him 1998 Act is bad in itself, but that it does not operate with the turban’ or ‘Her with the yashmak.’…‘Him over there— when certain people get to work on it. There are also Osama’s mate’”. good people at the hospital who need to be exonerated, Things continue in the same manner. These allegations and a public inquiry would provide for that. clearly have to be properly examined. There is now to be a Select Committee inquiry. That I am not using the names of the people involved, for will give us the opportunity to present measured evidence, reasons that I shall come to in a minute. The Minister which we cannot do in 10 minutes tonight. I also ask my will not deny that he has said to me that if I have the party’s shadow Secretary of State to assure us that we evidence—for which people were shrieking when I raised would be able to have a public inquiry if and when we the matter when objecting to our being prevented from get into government next year, because that would be a having an oral statement—“Why don’t you anonymise good opportunity. I strongly suggest that the credibility it?”. I shall tell both him and the House why: when I did of the Government is at stake—and I must say that I anonymise it, in a letter to the Secretary of State relating dismiss with contempt the Minister’s recent trivial speech. to a hospital nearby, the next thing I knew, after a Already, two governors have called for a public inquiry considerable pause, was that the consultant in question of the kind that is required and, as the hon. Member for had been suspended. Only last week, he was summoned Stafford (Mr. Kidney) has said, Stafford borough council for a Kafkaesque trial as if he needed to have a psychiatric was unanimous in its demand for one. assessment. I can tell the House that that consultant I would like to quote from a statement from one of and the patient in question are constituents of mine and the nurses at this hospital. I want to read it out because that consultant had saved the child’s life. I am so furious it is very important. “X” and “Y” are my terms for two that I cannot speak about it. This is the way things are nurses: carrying on and we hear these platitudes about whistleblowers being protected under the legislation. “I spoke to X. I explained to her the situation and asked her to relay this information to Y.Whilst she did this she kept me on the The marvellous Public Concern at Work charity has phone. I heard her tell Y that I had discovered that several made its criticisms, as the hon. Member for Stafford patients had breached. I then heard Y tell X to tell me to lie. X came back on to the phone and told me that Y’s advice to me was knows because we have been given the same material. to lie. I told her I was not happy to do this and explained that I The fact is that the whistleblowing policy being conducted had informed the clinical site manager of the breaches.” in this particular hospital has to be reformed along the lines that we will explain later in the Select Committee— She went on to make another statement, again at a unfortunately, I have not time to go into this tonight. critical time. She said: “I have become increasingly frightened in my place of work,” I am holding a paper written by another consultant, who was suspended at one and a half hours’ notice and am because he had had the temerity to complain about “feeling more and more threatened.” antibiotic policy—he had been with the hospital for She quotes one of the nurses saying that many years. I must be careful, because I do not want to expose others to the kind of treatment that the consultant “you want to watch being in with her, a lot of people are getting to whom I have referred has received. He was suspended fed up with her and she is going to get what’s coming to her. You with after such a short a notice period on the issue of want to watch your back and be careful or you’ll go down with her!” antibiotic policy and the non-availability of nurses on consultant ward rounds. This is a national disgrace and She also refers to “the cumulative effect” and says the legislation does not protect such people properly. that The reality is that the allegations that I am making need “the net result has led me to feel quite terrified given the present to be properly examined by the Select Committee, when context.” we have more time to do the job. Then she talks about lying about the breach time and an I move on to the question of the manner in which the occasion about which she said: Government have covered up. I mentioned, much to the “This incident led me to feel profoundly shocked that a senior Minister’s hilarity, which I thought pathetic, that Ian colleague could firstly blatantly lie about a patient’s breach time, Kennedy—he wrote the foreword to the Bristol inquiry— and secondly submit documentation, altered by her, in my name subsequently became chairman of the Healthcare thereby knowingly leaving me open to disciplinary action.” Commission, produced the Stafford report and came 1293 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 18 MAY 2009 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 1294 Trust Trust [Mr. William Cash] Moyes, now of Monitor, who gave this trust status, said in the vital board-to-board meeting on 5 December up with a different version about the value of public 2007 that inquiries. That was the point I was making. Ian Kennedy “questioning would concentrate on the financial viability and had said: governance of the Trust.” “A Public Inquiry cannot turn back the clock. It can, however, It is a disgrace. offer an opportunity to let all those touched by the events, in our case Bristol, be heard and to listen to others.” He had gone on to talk about the 8.58 pm “public venting of anger, distress and frustration; it provides a Dr. Tony Wright (Cannock Chase) (Lab): It might public stage on which this can take place.” not be entirely evident from the previous contribution, I say again that if it is good enough for Bristol, it is but we Staffordshire MPs are a rather happy and consensual good enough for us. He has obviously changed his mind bunch. We meet regularly on a cross-party basis, and since he became chairman of the Healthcare Commission, that is certainly unusual—it might even be unique in the and I would like to get all that on the record. House. We have been doing so for many years. When we Mr. Lansley: Does my hon. Friend agree that Ian met just last week, we obviously discussed this topic, Kennedy—understandably, in the case of Stafford—was and we came up with what we thought was a positive defending the Healthcare Commission, not least because idea, which was that we should get all the various when the Healthcare Commission undertook an people involved in the case—the hospital trust, the investigation it would like not to feel that a precedent primary care trust, the strategic health authority and had been set that meant that it could be second guessed the regulator—into a room to ensure that they were by a call for a public inquiry? Does my hon. Friend making things better. The emphasis today—quite rightly, accept that I do not see this necessarily as setting a as it is the focus of the motion—has been on settling the precedent? We did not ask for an inquiry after Maidstone issues with the past. The other, and in some ways more and Tunbridge Wells, nor would we set out to do so in pressing, side of the argument is the need to settle the other cases. The evidence in this case seems to point to issues with the future. such a wide range of unresolved issues that it demands What the people we represent want is an absolute thatwegodownthatpath. assurance that the problems in Stafford hospital are Mr. Cash: I absolutely agree with my hon. Friend, being sorted out, and that the kind of experiences that and so does the Royal College of Nursing, which said the Healthcare Commission report documented are not that the focus on achieving financial targets at Mid being repeated. We know that in some respects, at least, Staffordshire was at the expense of appropriate and safe they are still being repeated. In some respects, however, staffing levels and talked about cuts in the number of they are not: as far as we can tell, the particular acute nurses. problems in the accident and emergency department have been resolved by increased staffing, better organisation As I said, the real question is also one of a Government and so on. However, the Alberti report tells us that cover-up. It has caused me a lot of difficulty to get some there are still problems on the medical wards. The kind of these minutes, but there is no doubt that the minutes of problems that people come to my hon. Friend the of the various strategic health authorities—I have them Member for Stafford (Mr. Kidney) or to me with are all, so I shall be able to go into them in due course, basic care issues on the wards. Indeed, this weekend I although not tonight—show a direct paper trail from was dealing with a problem, relating to exactly those the decisions that were made when David Nicholson issues, that is happening now. was chairman of certain of these authorities that continued all the way through under the aegis of the right hon. Alberti tells us that there is still a real staffing issue on Member for Leicester, West (Ms Hewitt) and also under those wards. The implication is that the care is not good that of the present Secretary of State. They are all about enough. It is to that that we must urgently turn our targets, finance and matters of that kind. Also involved attention. As my hon. Friend the Member for Stafford is Mr. Bill Moyes. There is a conflict of interest for the said, Alberti also tells us that there are issues with staff university of Birmingham, which was commissioned by not wanting to work in the hospital. “Who wants to the West Midlands strategic health authority, and a work in Stafford hospital?”—so it goes inside the system. conflict of interest for Mrs. Cynthia Bower, who is now The hospital is desperately trying to get agency nurses chief executive of the Care Quality Commission. in, because it cannot recruit normally. Real reputational The problem that troubles me is the continual conflicts damage has been done to the hospital, and there has of interest. For example, the university of Birmingham been a real loss of public confidence locally. Those are study was funded by the SHA, which set up the steering all matters that need to be attended to. committee to guide the study. The people who were on As for the reports published so far, I have found them the study that led to the analysis of the mortality rates useful. It is difficult for people to say, in a general sense, in Mid Staffordshire included the medical director of that we do not know what happened at Stafford. I am the SHA and people from the trusts, including the afraid that we do know what happened at Stafford. It is information manager of the Mid Staffordshire NHS difficult to say that we do not know why it happened; Foundation Trust. That is a blatant example of conflict having read those reports, I think I do know why it of interest. happened. It is difficult to say that we do not know what In conclusion, although there is much more information to do, because we do know what to do to remedy the that I would like to get out, I shall simply say that we problems identified. I agree that there are outstanding should consider the opening remarks and the constant issues; in a sense, there always will be. There are questions references to finance, finance, finance in the Mid to which we still need answers, and some of them have Staffordshire challenge-to-challenge board meeting. Bill been raised today. However, on the essence of the 1295 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 18 MAY 2009 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 1296 Trust Trust matter, I do not think that anybody can claim that we day on which the Healthcare Commission report was do not know what happened, why it happened, or what published, its chairman, Sir Ian Kennedy, to whom we need to do. reference has been made, went on the radio to say For me, the devastating part of the reports—devastating that the NHS was steadily improving. I believe that because it confirms the impression that I formed of the that is the case, and I speak as someone who uses the hospital from cases I had dealt with—was that there NHS heavily. Indeed, I was in hospital this morning was a complete inattention to patients. There was a being attended to. My experience over the past 10 years preoccupation with process. All the reports that have is that it is steadily improving. However, there is no been produced say that. They all identify that as the key question of its improving over the years in Stafford, issue. That raises many questions about how on earth a because the trust did not understand the centrality of hospital could have taken its eye off the ball so patient care. comprehensively as far as patients were concerned. I want to spend the last couple of minutes on the How could it not have understood that the quality of inquiry. I am not going to vote against the motion, but I patient care is central to all that it does? The reports am not going to vote for it, either. There is a real talk about the problem of culture inside the institution. problem with capturing the advantages of a further “Problem of culture” means not understanding that inquiry, given some pretty demonstrable disadvantages. patient care is central. It means not having set a standard The advantages are clear: there are questions still to be of patient care, around which everything is organised. I answered, and there are certainly people on the ground am afraid that what the reports tell us about the failure who have been personally affected and whose questions to use complaints intelligently is simply part of that. I remain unresolved. However, we must not think that a speak as someone who has taken a perverse, obsessive further inquiry does not involve costs. If we are to interest in complaints over many years. achieve a relentless focus on improvement, I am not We all know, if we are honest, that we never got the sure that that will be aided by a relentless focus on the system of complaints inside the health service right. I past. I want assurances that we can have a further remember sitting on inquiries into complaints in the inquiry to tell us things we do not know, but without it health service under the previous Government, when it carrying the great disadvantage of our taking our eye was widely recognised that we had a problem. There off the ball and failing to do the things locally that we have been endless inquiries since then into how we can have to do. improve complaints systems. We have set up different Five years ago, the Committee that I have the privilege systems and tried them out; they have failed, and we of chairing produced a big report on the whole have tried new ones. question of inquiries. The Inquiries Act 2005 was being I remember listening a few years ago to the permanent introduced, and the Government gave evidence to us. secretary of the Department of Health, I think it was, We had asked them in what circumstances they would describing how he wanted every patient who came into hold an inquiry, and they said: an NHS hospital to be given what he called a “three Cs” “There is no standard blueprint for the type of circumstances form. The three Cs were comment, complaint and in which an inquiry might be needed. Matters triggering inquiries congratulation. I thought that that was sensible, but are by their nature difficult to foresee.” when I asked him whether the forms would be universally available in every hospital, he said no; they would They added: simply be available if people wanted to use them. I “A common theme tends to be that the subject matter of the think we ought systematically to make sure that every inquiry has exposed some possible failing in systems or services, in-patient in every hospital in the country is asked for and so has shaken public confidence in these systems or services their comments, complaints and congratulations. Having either locally or nationally”. done that, however, we must ensure that in every institution On those grounds, there is no question but that Stafford we learn in a systematic and serious way. It is no good fits: it has shaken public confidence, and the problem is simply getting people to tell us things if we do not learn of sufficient severity. We tried to do a little better—I do from what they have told us and act on it. There is no not have much time, so I shall abbreviate my remarks—by reason at all not to do so. Lord Darzi’s intervention is producing a checklist of questions that were sensible to extremely valuable in reminding us of something of ask when the issue of an inquiry arose. As MPs, we ask which we should not need to be reminded: that the for inquiries like children ask for sweets—it is what we quality of patient experience is absolutely central to do—so there is a discipline in having to ask such questions. what the health service ought to be about. I do not have time to recite them all.

Mr. Cash: I thank the hon. Gentleman for giving way Mr. Lansley: Given the point that the hon. Gentleman in the interests of comity in Staffordshire. Does he agree made about diversion, does he not accept that nurses that there is a serious problem with targets and money? working at Staffordshire general hospital, as reported Although he may not have seen the report, in the to me by the general secretary of the Royal College of board-to-board meeting on 5 December, which was Nursing, wanted a public inquiry? decisive for the purposes of granting foundation trust status and was chaired by Mr. Moyes, nine out of 46 questions were about matters other than money— Dr. Wright: Indeed, and I want an inquiry that tells some 35 questions were about money, targets and such us some of the things we do not know, but if we are things. We must learn from that, as that was where the being fair, those people urging a further inquiry have problem lay. also to be fair and recognise that there are potential risks and dangers in having one. We all want to settle Dr. Wright: My view is that that was overwhelmingly accounts with the past, but we also want to make sure a particular problem in that institution. Indeed, on the that urgent improvements are made now. 1297 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 18 MAY 2009 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 1298 Trust Trust [Dr. Tony Wright] The report came out a few months ago and spoke of systemic weaknesses that have existed over the past I end by quoting from Professor Alberti at the end of three or four years. However, I spent a day with a this report. With reference to Stafford he says: paramedic crew from the old Staffordshire ambulance “The Trust has the potential to become a model small to service, before it became a part of the West Midlands medium-sized hospital of the future with care delivered promptly ambulance service. The crew said to me in 2000, and appropriately both in the community and in the hospital—and “Mr. Fabricant, if, God forbid, anything happens to with poor patient experience a dim and distant memory.” you or your dearest, don’t send them to Stafford. If you That has to be our objective. have to go to A and E, go to Burton hospital, because In talking about inquiries, the question is whether we the survival rate is far greater there.” I believe that the can capture some of the advantages of holding a further problem has existed for many years and is not just a inquiry while offsetting the very evident possible recent occurrence. disadvantages in pursuit of that objective. That is the We have heard about the evidence from nurses. One conversation I intend to have continually with the nurse provided senior managers with details of her Government. The Secretary of State has said several concerns in November 2007, but they were ignored. Her times to several of us that he would be happy to have a report talked about doctors and nurses being ordered to further inquiry if he thought it would do any good. It is discharge people who were critically ill and, as we have our job to explain to him that it might do some good already heard from my hon. Friend the Member for without doing some harm. Stone (Mr. Cash), to lie about how long others were waiting. 9.11 pm The nurse documented cases, including that of an elderly patient who died the day after being sent home Michael Fabricant (Lichfield) (Con): The hon. Member against her doctor’s wishes. The lady concerned, who for Cannock Chase (Dr. Wright), whom it is my privilege suffered from a bowel condition, had been taken to to follow, spoke about the criteria that the Government A and E suffering from acute abdominal pain, and believe in for a public inquiry. One of the criteria he anyone who has been to medical school for just a year mentioned was that of systemic failure. The problem and a half, let alone longer, will know that acute abdominal that faces us in Staffordshire is one of systemic failure, pain needs to be examined very seriously. It turned out but it is systemic failure that exists in other hospitals that she had a perforated bowel, but she was sent home too. because that was the ethos at Stafford general hospital. Before I go any further, I echo the opening words of The nurse said: my friend the hon. Member for Stafford (Mr. Kidney) “I will never forgive the moment when the patient clasped my by saying that, as a Conservative MP, I support the hand and said ‘Am I going to die?’ I can’t say that she would national health service, and as a Conservative MP, I definitely have been saved if she had been given the right care, but support the workers in the NHS, particularly the workers at the very least she should have been given some comfort and in Stafford hospital, who at present work under such dignity.” difficult conditions and who, I am sure, will look at the Despite the disadvantages that the Minister and the contents of this debate. hon. Member for Cannock Chase have pointed out, I I said that there have been systemic failures. My hon. passionately believe that we still need a public inquiry, Friend the Member for South Cambridgeshire not to look to the past, but to provide lessons so that we (Mr. Lansley), the shadow Secretary of State for Health, can avoid the situation in the future at Stafford general mentioned the problem of whistleblowers. At a previous hospital and stop the instances that I discussed a few Health questions I said to the Secretary of State for moments ago which prevent whistleblowers in other Health that there was another example provided by two hospitals making their views known. A public inquiry is people who work in my constituency—I did not give important for our constituents, and I commend the their names because they are terrified that if their hon. Member for Stafford for having the courage of his names were known, they would lose their job. They convictions and saying that he will vote tonight for an work at another hospital in the west midlands and inquiry. His constituents, like mine and others in showed me photographs that show disgraceful and Staffordshire, all want to feel that justice will not only unhygienic conditions in that hospital, but they would be done, but be seen to be done, and that there will be not leave the evidence with me, which left me in a lessons learned and additional protections not only at paralysed situation because I could not do anything Stafford general hospital but at hospitals in other parts without the evidence. of the country. At the time, the Secretary of State told me that he The Under-Secretary of State for Health needs to was amazed that despite the protections that exist for answer some questions, and I should be grateful if she whistleblowers, such huge fear still exists. Once again, addressed them in her winding-up speech. First, does the Secretary of State, who, I have no doubt, is a good she think it right that the former chairman of the West man and has the best interests of the national health Midlands strategic health authority, Cynthia Bower, is service at heart, said that he was “amazed” that now in charge of the Care Quality Commission, the whistleblowers did not speak out at Stafford hospital. actual body that is responsible for monitoring the As my constituents said to me, with nurses, doctors and progress of Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation Trust? even consultants being made redundant, would they be Surely that is a conflict of interest. If there is not a next? That is the issue that faces all those who work at public inquiry, what action can the Minister take to Stafford hospital or other hospitals that may not have restore faith in Stafford general hospital among the such acute problems but nevertheless require the shining residents not only of Stafford but of other parts of light of publicity, or at least exposure. Staffordshire? 1299 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 18 MAY 2009 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 1300 Trust Trust How will we recruit nurses? We have already heard mentions that the regional postgraduate dean drew that there is a recruitment problem, because Stafford attention to problems of the training and supervision of general is now branded a hospital that we would not middle-grade doctors. wish it to be. One has only to read the comments in Page 47 contains a long paragraph, which I am afraid Staffordshire newspapers, such as the Stoke Sentinel, I am going to quote: the Staffordshire Newsletter, and the Express and Star, to know the very real concerns that people continue to “In April 2005, the medical division identified a risk that there would be too few staff to support the service due to failing to have about health care in the area. replace staff who terminated their employment. This was recorded What progress is being made towards a coherent on the risk register, but no review date was provided. In July 2005, five-year plan for the trust, as recommended by the it was noted that future demands of the service may not be met Alberti report? Still we hear that medical care on the due to insufficient levels of staff in the department. From these wards is not as it should be. What progress is being entries, it is evident that staffing levels were considered to be made towards recruiting experienced surgeons for night inadequate as far back as 2005.” shifts at the hospital? That is still a real problem for a Page 47 also refers to a review by the Heart of England hospital with an accident and emergency department. NHS Foundation Trust that was critical of the level of Finally, can the Minister give assurances that, at hospitals nursing supervision. Page 62 describes reconfiguration nationwide and not just at Stafford, patients are not of the medical wards in 2006, which led to changes in simply being dumped outside accident and emergency the skills mix of the nursing staff that were unacceptable wards so that the four-hour waiting-time targets can to many consultants. be hit? As I mentioned earlier in an intervention, such things Mr. Cash: Does the hon. Gentleman accept that the happen not only at Stafford hospital, but here in details of the Healthcare Commission report clearly Westminster—I have seen it for myself. Yes, targets demonstrate that the board was spending too much can be good; I am not saying that we should have no time on finance and matters of that kind? As I demonstrated targets at all. But not to accept that targets can endanger from the minutes, this goes right the way back to the and distort clinical care is to live in a dangerous fantasy early decisions that were taken by the strategic health that puts the lives of all our constituents at risk. authorities, which were based on targets that are part and parcel of the national health system as a whole, as 9.21 pm run by the current chief executive of the NHS. Dr. Richard Taylor (Wyre Forest) (Ind): I commend the hon. Member for Stone (Mr. Cash) for his powerful Dr. Taylor: I thank the hon. Gentleman for that comments. He has been attacked because he did not intervention. I will come to exactly that point a little come to my debate on whistleblowing; it was said that later, because there is a quote about it in the report. he had not taken every opportunity to participate in Another important part of the report, on page 63, debates. I should defend him. As that debate was so concerns high levels of staff sickness and complaints to short, I said that I would not take any interventions and the commission that had not been taken up. On page 93, I encouraged him not to come. there is an absolutely vital table that summarises some Having got that off my chest, I turn to the Minister’s of the findings about the trust’s approach to levels of contribution. He said that he might change his mind. nursing staff. It says: The whole point of debates in this place is to give “In 2002, the review of clinical governance by the Commission people a chance to change their minds. I have changed for Health Improvement pointed out that the number of nurses the mind of only one MP during my whole career was low compared with other similar hospitals.” here—but as I have done it once, I have every hope of It also says: doing it again. My presence here shows that the concerns go wider than Stafford. The hon. Member for Cannock “In 2005, the trust had more wards with below the national average number of nurses than wards with above the average, by Chase (Dr. Wright) implied that we know why it all almost two to one.” happened, but I do not think that we know enough. We have to find out more, so that the same does not happen Anybody who reads page 93 can pick up on several anywhere else. similar points. I have looked through the Healthcare Commission Why did all the long-standing concerns that had been report in some detail because I am very bothered about expressed never get through? We have to find out where why there were no whistleblowers. The Minister himself the blockage was. Was it between the working doctors stated that staff did not put their concerns on record, and nurses and their clinical directors or nurse managers, and the hon. Member for North Norfolk (Norman or between the clinical directors or nurse managers and Lamb) also implied that. Actually, what they say is not the medical director and the director of nursing? Was it correct; the report shows that concerns were raised. I held up above that level, by the chief executive preventing shall pick out some bits of it to show that. Page 37 it from getting to the board? There are some clues about states that why senior staff perhaps did not make more effort to “Many clinical staff told us of their concerns about the quality take matters wider. Page 101 of the report says: of care at the trust and gave specific examples.” “Staff, including senior staff, had little confidence that the Further on, the report states: trust learned from incidents.” “In September 2006, a paper to the hospital management On page 106, the Healthcare Commission says: board highlighted how the one in two on-call rota, with the two “We did not gain an impression from staff that the trust had consultants taking turns to cover, was not tenable.” had an open culture in which concerns could be raised, were Page 45 refers to the same paper’s reference to the welcomed and resolved. We have noted above that several consultants inadequate level of middle-grade staffing. Page 46 considered that the trust did not welcome criticism or concerns.” 1301 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 18 MAY 2009 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 1302 Trust Trust [Dr. Richard Taylor] My hon. Friends and Labour Members who are present, for whom I have great respect, have called for a On page 108, we see the point raised by the hon. public inquiry and there is a general view that we need Member for Stone: to examine the matter more deeply and reflect on the “The minutes of the board show that finance and achieving issues that have been raised. foundation trust status were given high priority. There was little There are several concerns. I broadly welcome foundation recorded discussion about quality of care.” trusts, but, as has been said, I was amazed that we There are still questions about where these complaints ended up with a foundation trust, when, apart from the were held up. Why were whistleblowers not going higher Secretary of State’s recommendation, the evidence was to the Royal College of Nursing or direct to the strategic based on various tiers and organisations in the NHS, health authority? I hope that we will ask those questions which were all thought to be robust. That turned out at the Health Committee meeting dedicated to this not to be the case when foundation trust status was problem. granted in 2008. The Health Secretary has made some useful suggestions I welcome the Minister’s comments at the beginning for the future, but I am currently much more interested of the debate about the steps that have been taken to in the past. That is why I believe that an independent improve the service. The Care Quality Commission, the inquiry is essential and should not be deferred. We want PCT and Monitor will monitor the hospital after three the people who have got us into this state, not those who months and six months and devise further action plans are trying to get us out of it, to appear before an to improve its outcomes. inquiry. We know that many new young consultants I welcome the comments of my hon. Friend the have been appointed who have nothing to do with what Member for South Cambridgeshire about the need for has happened and that there are new interim executives. tougher inspection to root out failure and for a much Surely we could separate the people responsible for stronger voice for patients. The old community health what has happened from those who are interested in the trusts were a pain in the arse, if I can say that— future. I strongly support the plea for an independent inquiry to satisfy staff—and exonerate those who had Mr. Stephen O’Brien (Eddisbury) (Con): In quotation nothing to do with it—relatives and patients. At the marks. same time, it is crucial to continue to make improvements for the future. However, I believe that different people Mr. Syms: Mr. Deputy Speaker is reflecting on that. are making the improvements from those who caused the problems in the past. However, the community health trusts were the genuine voice of the patients. We have moved through various different models and, to be honest, there is not a big 9.31 pm enough voice for patient organisations, which pick up what is being said at the grass roots. If the Government Mr. Robert Syms (Poole) (Con): As a member of the had not been so quick to get rid of the community Select Committee on Health, I intend to make only a health trusts, the warning signals would have gone off brief contribution. Like the hon. Member for Wyre rather earlier. Forest (Dr. Taylor), who is also a member, I look forward to taking evidence and listening to what people We need powers for patients to hold failing hospitals have to say. to account. We need an end to box-ticking and targets. Indeed, we have heard the reverse: that outcomes are I thank my hon. Friend the Member for South important, not targets, because when people are under Cambridgeshire (Mr. Lansley). The subject is unusual pressure, they will be made to get round targets. We for Opposition day debates, but the issues that it raises need to expose hospitals that are failing their communities are important for us all and the NHS generally. At least, to public scrutiny. we have put pressure on the Government and asked them more questions about outcomes and what is This has been a reasonable debate and there have happening. been some good contributions. I agreed with a lot of what the Minister said earlier, but I did not agree with Four hundred people may have died as a result of his stubbornness. I am sure that the civil servants are what happened. If a jumbo jet had fallen out of the sky saying, “Don’t go for a public inquiry, Minister. It’d or been blown up, or a major train crash had occurred, take too long and be expensive, and things are happening there would be a public inquiry.I understand the Minister’s already.” I intend to support my hon. Friends in the comments about the length of time we have spent and Lobby. Even if the Government win the vote this so on, but we are considering individual and family evening—it would be very surprising if they did not—I tragedies, about which people want their say. They want hope that Ministers will go away and reflect on what to listen to other people’s evidence. That is important opinion in all parts of the House is saying on the for not only the grieving process, but the community matter. around the hospital, who look to it to care for their family and friends, and feel let down. 9.36 pm We also need a public inquiry because staff have been put under tremendous pressure in the hospital. We have Mr. Stephen O’Brien (Eddisbury) (Con): We have had heard many examples of people who have been forced an important and comprehensive debate that has been to input data into computers and use all sorts of methods characterised by cogent, balanced and sincere to deal with the target regime. I appreciate that staffing contributions—indeed, one could almost described them levels have improved, but when a hospital gets a bad as pleas—from all parts of the House, as befits such a name, it is difficult to get people of high quality and gravely serious issue. It is an issue that must reach calibre back into that hospital to turn things around. beyond party politics. 1303 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 18 MAY 2009 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 1304 Trust Trust We must remember that, at its heart, we are talking I emphasise that today’s debate is taking place because about the avoidable deaths of up to 1,200 people. Each the people of Staffordshire and beyond want an inquiry of those deaths represents family and friends who are to be set up now, so our efforts need to be focused on left with the heavy burden of grief, which is only intensified that, not least to persuade the Government to do just by the serious questions that need answering. Furthermore, that. those deaths can only be correlative to many hundreds My hon. Friend the Member for Lichfield (Michael more patients who did not receive the treatment that Fabricant) focused on the justice of the case, and on they deserved—treatment that they rightly expect of what lessons could be learned straight away, right across our NHS. Before going any farther, we must take a the NHS. He said that it was necessary to have an moment to remember all those who have suffered and inquiry in order to assuage the public’s concerns from who continue to suffer and grieve because of the failings the past and to learn all the necessary lessons for the at the Mid-Staffordshire trust. Equally, let us keep in future. With local and national health officials, Ministers mind the wonderful work of the individuals and teams and Government policy implicated in the problems, it is working across the NHS who have been so badly let difficult to contend that a review conducted by officials down by what has happened in Stafford general hospital. in the Department of Health will deliver the thorough, We have brought a very simple motion before the all-encompassing, plain appraisal needed to reduce the House today. This is not the moment to knock the chance of this happening again. Government particularly harshly, although it is clear that there is a continuum of culpability, which extends Mr. Cash: I want to take my hon. Friend one tiny from the local decision makers to Ministers and, more stage further in his answer to my question. Will he also significantly, calls into question Government policies. bear it in mind that the Leader of the Opposition, my Our motion this evening does not seek to apportion right hon. Friend the Member for Witney (Mr. Cameron), blame for the Mid-Staffordshire tragedy. Indeed, every was a parliamentary candidate in Stafford, and that he speaker has agreed with us and with our motion, other has taken a specific interest in this hospital, for all the than the Minister and the honourable exception of the right reasons? I am sure that my hon. Friend and the Chairman of the Public Administration Committee, the shadow Secretary of State will want to have a word with hon. Member for Cannock Chase (Dr. Wright). He said him about this. that he would not vote against the motion. He remains to be convinced whether to join us in the Lobby and Mr. O’Brien: I am absolutely sure that such words might just be able to be persuaded, and I hope to try. will be had. My right hon. Friend the Leader of the Our motion simply calls for an independent inquiry, Opposition went to see for himself on 14 April, which is which the relatives of those who died and the survivors testimony to the deep personal concern that he has for of poor care at the trust both need and deserve. The this matter. important point is not just what went wrong, but how My hon. Friend the Member for South Cambridgeshire, and why it did—a point forcefully made by the hon. in his close exegesis of the Colin-Thomé and Alberti Member for Wyre Forest (Dr. Taylor), who, with his reviews, described why both reviews were limited in professional point of view, has a double interest in their scope. He said that the reports lacked the independence understanding that—and what must now be done to required to give them sufficient perspective on the events, prevent it from happening again. That is a point to to call people properly to account, or to satisfy the impress upon the hon. Member for Cannock Chase, needs of families and survivors in Staffordshire and because unless one understands the past, it is very beyond. The reports have not given the people of difficult to move on and ensure that the right things are Staffordshire an opportunity to make the points and to done for the future. ask the questions that they feel are important. Neither Despite those wonderful NHS staff, Mid-Staffordshire Colin-Thomé nor Alberti held public evidence sessions and Stafford general hospital have been blighted, as my to provide an opportunity for depositions and questions right hon. Friend the Member for West Derbyshire to be asked by the bereaved and the survivors. As a (Mr. McLoughlin) said in an intervention, when he gave result, the reports do not show the necessary rigour in personal testimony of the most wonderful care that his relation to the culpability of NHS officials, the Department mother received. The problem extends way beyond the and the Government, either in political or executive people in Staffordshire, but we heard powerful arguments terms. Such rigour is necessary to provide the answers from my hon. Friend the Member for Stone (Mr. Cash), for the people of Staffordshire, and to prevent such a whose speech not only carried the House, but was tragedy from occurring again. redolent of what it means to try to seek justice. He argued forcefully, using evidence that he was able to give Mr. Kidney: I cannot fully answer the hon. Gentleman’s only partially, but which would be available in a public question, but I am sure that he will be pleased to know inquiry, that the only way to secure that justice would be that Dr. Colin-Thomé and Professor Alberti have agreed in a public and independent inquiry. to come to Stafford and to face an audience consisting The Government have said that they remain unconvinced, of members of the public and the relatives of those who which carries the implication that they could be convinced, died, in order to answer their questions. I am sure that and we all hope that they will be, following tonight’s the hon. Gentleman will welcome that as a good step debate. They will only have had to listen to the excellent forward, although it does not provide a complete answer speech of my hon. Friend. He asked directly whether to his question. the official Opposition would consider initiating an independent public inquiry, and I can tell him that we Mr. O’Brien: I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for do not exclude the possibility of us, if we are in office, that intervention. He made an important speech on establishing such an independent public inquiry. However, behalf of his constituents this evening, and I look 1305 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 18 MAY 2009 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 1306 Trust Trust [Mr. Stephen O’Brien] (Mr. Syms), I hark back to the late lamented community health councils that were killed off by this Government, forward to welcoming him into our Lobby this evening. as they were independent and able to aggregate individual I also welcome the opportunity for questions that he circumstances to draw general conclusions that were has just mentioned. However, as I have just said, the extremely helpful in advising Governments and the opportunity for those people to answer is limited by the public about the performance of the NHS. We also have scope of their reviews, which is never going to be as to remember the failure to act on events at Maidstone wide or as deep as that of an independent public and Tunbridge Wells. They all had a part to play in the inquiry. tragedy. We need to ensure that we keep our discussion focused It is vital to remember that, in his opening remarks, on the Ministers who have the power to make this the Minister mentioned that there was continuing decision, rather than on two well-respected people from contempt—certainly on the basis of the discussions we civil service and departmental backgrounds. I hope that have had—for a real complaints process in the Care the Minister will recognise that we need to understand Quality Commission and the Healthcare Commission. why lacunae exist in both reports, and tell us what role We have advocated proper complaints processes, but Ministers had to play in that. David Colin-Thomé and they were refused by the Government, who have relied Sir George Alberti are civil servants employed by the on an over-burdened and under-resourced health services Department of Health, and have been for a number of ombudsman. An independent public inquiry would be years. They may take to heart the independence of the able to demonstrate how these processes should work. civil service, but I think that the House would agree that In arguing the case for an independent public inquiry, they lack independence so far as their interest as members it is important that both the policy and the individuals of the Executive, through the Department, is concerned. are properly scrutinised. The Secretary of State said For example, the House will be aware that the chief that he remained unconvinced, but we hope that the executive of the Shropshire and Staffordshire strategic right hon. Gentleman, who promised Julie Bailey of the health authority in 2005 to 2006 is now the chief executive Cure the NHS campaign that he would think again, will of the NHS, and that the subsequent chief executive of actually do so. We salute that campaign and we hope West Midlands SHA is now the chief executive of the that when the Under-Secretary replies, she will do the Care Quality Commission. A necessary requirement of right thing, support our motion and launch the public any review should be to lay bare the management of the inquiry. On behalf of all those who are grieving and SHA between 2002 and 2008, and to provide an opportunity those who have suffered, we hope that she makes the for the reputations of these two very senior civil servants best and shortest speech she has ever made and simply in our NHS and the Care Quality Commission to be says “yes”. cleared. 9.48 pm It is clear that West Midlands SHA failed in its duty of performance management; it was more bothered The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Health about Department of Health initiatives, finance and (Ann Keen): The events at Stafford hospital were totally reconfigurations and relied on performance assessment unacceptable. The hospital badly let down its patients bodies to consider the quality of patient care. Cynthia and their families, and it has let down our national Bower, now of the Care Quality Commission, only once health service—an institution that has been providing raised mortality rates, for instance, in her routine briefings the very highest standards of care for more than 60 years. to the board. It would be helpful to have an independent I worked as a nurse in the NHS for more than 25 years public inquiry at which many other issues could be and whenever the tragedies, complaints and reality of addressed and Cynthia Bower and others would have what happened at Mid Staffordshire become clear to us an opportunity to give their side of the story. when we read these reports, we feel shame and we feel In the Alberti and Colin-Thomé reports, there is little that we have let many people down. evidence of any rigorous treatment of the impact of the I would like to thank Professor Alberti and Dr. Colin Government’s policies on the trust. Although Ministers Thomé for their timely and informative investigations. I might say that the policies are in no way linked to the am sorry that the Opposition Front-Bench team feel events that occurred, if they were that confident, would that their lack of independence in any way deflects from not an independent public inquiry provide a stronger their absolutely renowned work as well-respected clinicians. opportunity for them to disprove any such link between I feel that the reports have, quite rightly, been critical. their policies and anything that took place at Stafford Those, combined with the original report of the Healthcare general hospital? Commission and the ongoing reviews of individual patient records have brought, and continue to bring, Three of the solutions identified by David Colin-Thomé rigour, clarity and understanding about what happened are actions that should be taken by the Department of at Mid Staffordshire and the reasons behind it. Health. That suggests that, in his mind, there are three actions that the Department might have taken to avoid Mr. Cash: Will the Minister give way? the tragedy happening. Hon. Members might assume from that that the Department of Health would be Ann Keen: My hon. Friend the Minister of State gave mentioned at least three times in the body of the review—yet way so many times and I have only a few moments. I the Department of Health is not mentioned once in its will consider giving way as I continue. substantive body. I believe, however, that the hospital has, importantly, Clearly, we can see the effect of the chaos arising begun to start to make the significant improvement to from the near-perennial reorganisations of the NHS patient care and safety that we were looking for and and the suppression of a powerful patient and public that, certainly, those who use Stafford as their hospital voice. Like my hon. Friend the Member for Poole were looking for. 1307 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 18 MAY 2009 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 1308 Trust Trust The Healthcare Commission, the independent regulator Mr. Cash: Will the Minister give way? expressly established by Parliament to scrutinise and investigate the NHS, has conducted a full investigation Mr. Deputy Speaker: Order. I understand the hon. and produced a detailed report laying bear the failures Gentleman’s strength of feeling on this matter, but that at Stafford hospital. The reviews from Professor Alberti is shared by colleagues across the House. The Minister and Dr. Colin-Thomé provide us with further reassurance must be allowed to make her winding-up speech. in relation to the trust and greater insight into the reasons why those failures remained undetected for so Ann Keen: Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker. long. In addition, the trust has invited in people who are Mr. Stephen O’Brien: On a point of order, Mr. Deputy not just concerned, but devastated, about the care that Speaker. Before there is any danger of a possible distortion they or a close relative—a mum or a dad—received. of any words and any commitment that we have given, I What those relatives feel about the care at Mid Staffordshire hope that you can assist me in ensuring that the record, goes right to the core of us as people. including that of the debate, shows that we gave an On the request for an independent clinical review, undertaking that we would look at ordering an independent that process is under way and, to date, about 85 reviews public inquiry in the absence of the Government ordering have been requested. Those will be difficult and painful, one now, which is where our efforts are focused. but I believe, like many others, that the fact they are being taken in this way shows that this is the best way Mr. Deputy Speaker: The hon. Gentleman is also forward. seeking to pursue the debate. I am quite sure that the record will be accurate. Mr. Cash: Will the Minister give way? Ann Keen: The record will show, Mr. Deputy Speaker. Ann Keen: In the light of that, we believe that a public I wish in particular to mention the Royal College of inquiry would, at this stage, be time consuming— Nursing. It is our understanding that since the publication Mr. Cash: On a point of order, Mr. Deputy Speaker. of the two reviews, the RCN is calling no longer for a The Minister has been talking about the question of full public inquiry but rather for a review of any new how these matters should be conducted, but, unfortunately, issues. the governance for NHS foundation trusts says that the Many hon. Members have taken part in the debate, board of directors of a trust— but the issues that the Opposition Front Benchers raised shared the theme of whistleblowing. I intend to address Mr. Deputy Speaker: Order. Really, the hon. Gentleman that, but I am sure that hon. Members will understand knows well enough that he is trying to gain an intervention it if I praise my hon. Friend the Member for Stafford on the back of a point of order, which is not valid. (Mr. Kidney). Ann Keen: Thank you, Mr. Deputy Speaker. I hope Mr. Lansley: Will the Minister give way? that the House understands that I have many points, raised by hon. Members, that I want to respond to. I Ann Keen: I have said that I will not give way. would like very much to try to do that. The reality is that Sir George Alberti and Dr. Colin- In the light of that, we believe that a public inquiry Thomé have agreed to present their findings about what would, at this stage, obviously be very time consuming. happened at Stafford at a public meeting in Staffordshire. It would add little more to our understanding of what I understand that my hon. Friend the Member for happened and distract the new management and staff Stafford is facilitating that meeting, and I congratulate from improving the quality of care for local people, him on that. He is aware of the importance of the which we so want them to do. recruitment of good-quality staff at Mid Staffordshire, Public inquiries can be an important mechanism and that issue was raised by the hon. Members for independently to establish the cause of a problem or a Lichfield (Michael Fabricant), for Stone (Mr. Cash), for disaster, and I can understand that there are many who Wyre Forest (Dr. Taylor) and for Poole (Mr. Syms). My consider a public inquiry into the events at Mid Staffordshire hon. Friend the Member for Cannock Chase (Dr. Wright) to be appropriate and necessary, but in this case, even reminded the House of how we have to work together Sir Ian Kennedy, who we respect so much and who to see that these incidents do not happen again. chaired the public inquiry into the tragic events at If I go may into the heart of the problem at Mid Bristol royal infirmary, has said that he does not feel Staffordshire, it is about reporting bad care and that one is necessary. whistleblowing. Our next stage review by Lord Darzi is There has already been an independent examination about quality and safety. We cannot have quality and of what went wrong and a public account of the failure safety in patient care, which is paramount to every at Mid Staffordshire, but if hon. Members believe that health professional, if we do not have the appropriate there are significant issues or lines of inquiry that have work force. Every patient journey must start by having not been addressed, either by the Healthcare Commission quality and being safe. We cannot have safety if we do report or by the subsequent reviews, the Secretary of not operate in an environment of an open culture and a State will be only too happy to consider that. That also management who show real leadership. That encouragement appears to be the view of Opposition Front Benchers. of leadership at all times throughout the review has The hon. Member for Eddisbury (Mr. O’Brien) said raised the quality of leadership within the Mid Staffordshire that even Opposition Front Benchers have not ruled out trust. that possibility, so I am at a loss to see what is the It was this Government who brought in a whistleblowing difference between the two sides of the House. charter. [Interruption.] Opposition Members may shout, The report commissioned by the Secretary of State but if they are concerned about the reality and quality tells us— of patient care and safety, I suggest that they work 1309 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 18 MAY 2009 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 1310 Trust Trust [Ann Keen] Goodman, Mr. Paul Moss, Mr. Malcolm Goodwill, Mr. Robert Mulholland, Greg within the next stage review at all times, because the Grayling, Chris Murrison, Dr. Andrew quality and safety of patient care are paramount. I Green, Damian Neill, Robert appeal to the new leadership that is in place at Mid Greening, Justine Newmark, Mr. Brooks Staffordshire to get in place the consultants, nurses and Grieve, Mr. Dominic O’Brien, Mr. Stephen Gummer, rh Mr. John Oaten, Mr. Mark health professionals who can provide a quality work Hague, rh Mr. William Öpik, Lembit force, so that they can lead quality patient care and so Hammond, Mr. Philip Osborne, Mr. George that Mid Staffordshire is known as a centre of excellence Hammond, Stephen Ottaway, Richard in future. We shall bring that about through our education Hancock, Mr. Mike Paice, Mr. James and training system. Hands, Mr. Greg Paterson, Mr. Owen The Prime Minister has commissioned a commission Harper, Mr. Mark Pelling, Mr. Andrew on nursing and midwifery, which I am privileged to Harris, Dr. Evan Penning, Mike chair. I shall attend Mid Staffordshire trust to consult Harvey, Nick Penrose, John nurses about how they feel things went wrong. With the Hayes, Mr. John Pickles, Mr. Eric serious comments that have been made in the House, we Heald, Mr. Oliver Prisk, Mr. Mark Heath, Mr. David Pritchard, Mark need to address why people did not feel they could Heathcoat-Amory, rh Pugh, Dr. John report such serious incidents. From the top doctors to Mr. David Randall, Mr. John everyone else who works at the hospital, from the ward Hemming, John Redwood, rh Mr. John to the board, every one of us is responsible for patient Hendry, Charles Rennie, Willie care, and every one of us will continue to administer the Herbert, Nick Rifkind, rh Sir Malcolm quality and safety that our national health service should Hoban, Mr. Mark Robathan, Mr. Andrew deliver, and that our patients have every right to expect Hogg, rh Mr. Douglas Robertson, Mr. Laurence us to deliver. Hollobone, Mr. Philip Rosindell, Andrew Question put (Standing Order No. 31(2), That the Holloway, Mr. Adam Rowen, Paul Holmes, Paul Ruffley, Mr. David original words stand part of the Question. Horam, Mr. John Russell, Bob The House proceeded to a Division. Howarth, David Sanders, Mr. Adrian Howarth, Mr. Gerald Scott, Mr. Lee Mr. Deputy Speaker: I ask the Serjeant at Arms to Howell, John Selous, Andrew investigate the delay in the Aye Lobby. Huhne, Chris Shapps, Grant Hunt, Mr. Jeremy Short, rh Clare The House having divided: Ayes 217, Noes 260. Hunter, Mark Simmonds, Mark Division No. 132] [9.59 pm Hurd, Mr. Nick Simpson, Mr. Keith Jack, rh Mr. Michael Smith, Sir Robert AYES Jackson, Mr. Stewart Soames, Mr. Nicholas Jenkin, Mr. Bernard Spelman, Mrs. Caroline Afriyie, Adam Cash, Mr. William Jones, Mr. David Spicer, Sir Michael Ainsworth, Mr. Peter Clark, Greg Kawczynski, Daniel Spink, Bob Alexander, Danny Clarke, rh Mr. Kenneth Kennedy, rh Mr. Charles Spring, Mr. Richard Amess, Mr. David Clifton-Brown, Mr. Geoffrey Key, Robert Steen, Mr. Anthony Ancram, rh Mr. Michael Cox, Mr. Geoffrey Kidney, Mr. David Streeter, Mr. Gary Arbuthnot, rh Mr. James Crabb, Mr. Stephen Kirkbride, Miss Julie Stuart, Mr. Graham Atkinson, Mr. Peter Curry, rh Mr. David Knight, rh Mr. Greg Stunell, Andrew Bacon, Mr. Richard Davey, Mr. Edward Kramer, Susan Swayne, Mr. Desmond Barker, Gregory Davies, Mr. Dai Laing, Mrs. Eleanor Swire, Mr. Hugo Beith, rh Sir Alan Davies, David T.C. Lait, Mrs. Jacqui Syms, Mr. Robert Bellingham, Mr. Henry (Monmouth) Lamb, Norman Tapsell, Sir Peter Benyon, Mr. Richard Davies, Philip Lancaster, Mr. Mark Taylor, David Bercow, John Dean, Mrs. Janet Lansley, Mr. Andrew Taylor, Mr. Ian Beresford, Sir Paul Djanogly, Mr. Jonathan Leech, Mr. John Taylor, Matthew Binley, Mr. Brian Duddridge, James Leigh, Mr. Edward Taylor, Dr. Richard Blunt, Mr. Crispin Duncan, Alan Lewis, Dr. Julian Teather, Sarah Bone, Mr. Peter Duncan Smith, rh Mr. Iain Lidington, Mr. David Thurso, John Boswell, Mr. Tim Evans, Mr. Nigel Lilley, rh Mr. Peter Timpson, Mr. Edward Bottomley, Peter Evennett, Mr. David Loughton, Tim Turner, Mr. Andrew Brake, Tom Fabricant, Michael Luff, Peter Vaizey, Mr. Edward Brazier, Mr. Julian Farrelly, Paul Mackay, rh Mr. Andrew Vara, Mr. Shailesh Brokenshire, James Field, Mr. Mark Main, Anne Villiers, Mrs. Theresa Brooke, Annette Fisher, Mark Malins, Mr. Humfrey Walker, Mr. Charles Browning, Angela Foster, Mr. Don Maples, Mr. John Wallace, Mr. Ben Bruce, rh Malcolm Fox, Dr. Liam Burns, Mr. Simon Francois, Mr. Mark Mates, rh Mr. Michael Walley, Joan Burrowes, Mr. David Fraser, Christopher May, rh Mrs. Theresa Watkinson, Angela Burstow, Mr. Paul Gale, Mr. Roger McIntosh, Miss Anne Webb, Steve Burt, Alistair Garnier, Mr. Edward McLoughlin, rh Mr. Patrick Whittingdale, Mr. John Burt, Lorely Gauke, Mr. David Mercer, Patrick Widdecombe, rh Miss Ann Cameron, rh Mr. David Gibb, Mr. Nick Miller, Mrs. Maria Wiggin, Bill Campbell, rh Sir Menzies Gidley, Sandra Milton, Anne Willetts, Mr. David Carmichael, Mr. Alistair Gillan, Mrs. Cheryl Mitchell, Mr. Andrew Williams, Mark Carswell, Mr. Douglas Goldsworthy, Julia Moore, Mr. Michael Williams, Mr. Roger 1311 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 18 MAY 2009 Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation 1312 Trust Trust Williams, Stephen Wright, Jeremy Jones, Lynne Reed, Mr. Andy Wilshire, Mr. David Young, rh Sir George Jones, Mr. Martyn Reed, Mr. Jamie Wilson, Mr. Rob Tellers for the Ayes: Joyce, Mr. Eric Reid, rh John Winterton, Ann Mr. John Baron and Kaufman, rh Sir Gerald Riordan, Mrs. Linda Winterton, Sir Nicholas Mr. Philip Dunne Keen, Alan Robertson, John Keen, Ann Robinson, Mr. Geoffrey Kemp, Mr. Fraser Rooney, Mr. Terry NOES Kennedy, rh Jane Roy, Mr. Frank Abbott, Ms Diane Dobson, rh Frank Kilfoyle, Mr. Peter Roy, Lindsay Ainsworth, rh Mr. Bob Donohoe, Mr. Brian H. Knight, rh Jim Ruane, Chris Allen, Mr. Graham Doran, Mr. Frank Kumar, Dr. Ashok Ruddock, Joan Anderson, Mr. David Dowd, Jim Ladyman, Dr. Stephen Russell, Christine Anderson, Janet Drew, Mr. David Lammy, rh Mr. David Ryan, rh Joan Armstrong, rh Hilary Eagle, Angela Laxton, Mr. Bob Salter, Martin Austin, Mr. Ian Eagle, Maria Lepper, David Sarwar, Mr. Mohammad Austin, John Efford, Clive Levitt, Tom Seabeck, Alison Balls, rh Ed Ellman, Mrs. Louise Lewis, Mr. Ivan Sharma, Mr. Virendra Banks, Gordon Engel, Natascha Linton, Martin Sheerman, Mr. Barry Barlow, Ms Celia Ennis, Jeff Lloyd, Tony Sheridan, Jim Barron, rh Mr. Kevin Etherington, Bill Lucas, Ian Simon, Mr. Siôn Battle, rh John Flint, rh Caroline Mackinlay, Andrew Simpson, Alan Bayley, Hugh Flynn, Paul MacShane, rh Mr. Denis Singh, Mr. Marsha Beckett, rh Margaret Foster, Mr. Michael Mactaggart, Fiona Skinner, Mr. Dennis Begg, Miss Anne (Worcester) Mallaber, Judy Slaughter, Mr. Andy Benn, rh Hilary Foster, Michael Jabez Mann, John Smith, rh Mr. Andrew Benton, Mr. Joe (Hastings and Rye) Marris, Rob Smith, Ms Angela C. Betts, Mr. Clive Francis, Dr. Hywel Marsden, Mr. Gordon (Sheffield, Hillsborough) Blackman, Liz Gapes, Mike Marshall-Andrews, Mr. Robert Smith, Angela E. (Basildon) Blackman-Woods, Dr. Roberta Gardiner, Barry McAvoy, rh Mr. Thomas Smith, Geraldine Blears, rh Hazel Gerrard, Mr. Neil McCabe, Steve Smith, rh Jacqui Blizzard, Mr. Bob Gibson, Dr. Ian McCarthy, Kerry Snelgrove, Anne Blunkett, rh Mr. David Gilroy, Linda McCarthy-Fry, Sarah Soulsby, Sir Peter Bradshaw, Mr. Ben Godsiff, Mr. Roger McDonagh, Siobhain Southworth, Helen Brennan, Kevin Goodman, Helen McDonnell, John Spellar, rh Mr. John Brown, Lyn Griffith, Nia McGovern, Mr. Jim Starkey, Dr. Phyllis Brown, rh Mr. Nicholas Griffiths, Nigel McIsaac, Shona Stewart, Ian Brown, Mr. Russell Grogan, Mr. John McKechin, Ann Stringer, Graham Browne, rh Des Gwynne, Andrew McKenna, Rosemary Stuart, Ms Gisela Bryant, Chris Hain, rh Mr. Peter McNulty, rh Mr. Tony Sutcliffe, Mr. Gerry Buck, Ms Karen Hall, Mr. Mike Meacher, rh Mr. Michael Tami, Mark Burden, Richard Hamilton, Mr. David Merron, Gillian Taylor, Ms Dari Burgon, Colin Hamilton, Mr. Fabian Michael, rh Alun Tipping, Paddy Burnham, rh Andy Hanson, rh Mr. David Miliband, rh David Todd, Mr. Mark Miller, Andrew Butler, Ms Dawn Harman, rh Ms Harriet Touhig, rh Mr. Don Byrne, rh Mr. Liam Harris, Mr. Tom Mitchell, Mr. Austin Trickett, Jon Caborn, rh Mr. Richard Havard, Mr. Dai Moffatt, Laura Truswell, Mr. Paul Cairns, David Healey, rh John Mole, Chris Turner, Dr. Desmond Campbell, Mr. Alan Henderson, Mr. Doug Moon, Mrs. Madeleine Turner, Mr. Neil Campbell, Mr. Ronnie Hendrick, Mr. Mark Morgan, Julie Caton, Mr. Martin Hepburn, Mr. Stephen Mullin, Mr. Chris Twigg, Derek Cawsey, Mr. Ian Heppell, Mr. John Munn, Meg Ussher, Kitty Chapman, Ben Hesford, Stephen Murphy, Mr. Denis Vaz, rh Keith Clapham, Mr. Michael Heyes, David Murphy, rh Mr. Paul Vis, Dr. Rudi Clark, Paul Hill, rh Keith Naysmith, Dr. Doug Waltho, Lynda Clarke, rh Mr. Charles Hodgson, Mrs. Sharon Norris, Dan Ward, Claire Clarke,rhMr.Tom Hood, Mr. Jim O’Hara, Mr. Edward Whitehead, Dr. Alan Clelland, Mr. David Hoon, rh Mr. Geoffrey Olner, Mr. Bill Wicks, rh Malcolm Coaker, Mr. Vernon Hope, Phil Osborne, Sandra Williams, rh Mr. Alan Coffey, Ann Howarth, rh Mr. George Owen, Albert Wills, rh Mr. Michael Cooper, Rosie Howells, rh Dr. Kim Palmer, Dr. Nick Wilson, Phil Cooper, rh Yvette Hoyle, Mr. Lindsay Pearson, Ian Winnick, Mr. David Corbyn, Jeremy Hughes, rh Beverley Plaskitt, Mr. James Woolas, Mr. Phil Crausby, Mr. David Humble, Mrs. Joan Pope, Mr. Greg Wright, Mr. Anthony Cruddas, Jon Iddon, Dr. Brian Pound, Stephen Wright, David Prentice, Mr. Gordon Cummings, John Illsley, Mr. Eric Wright, Mr. Iain Prescott, rh Mr. John Cunningham, Mr. Jim Ingram, rh Mr. Adam Wyatt, Derek Cunningham, Tony Irranca-Davies, Huw Primarolo, rh Dawn Prosser, Gwyn David, Mr. Wayne James, Mrs. Siân C. Tellers for the Noes: Purchase, Mr. Ken Barbara Keeley and Davidson, Mr. Ian Jenkins, Mr. Brian Raynsford, rh Mr. Nick Mr. Dave Watts Davies, Mr. Quentin Johnson, Ms Diana R. Denham, rh Mr. John Jones, Helen Dismore, Mr. Andrew Jones, Mr. Kevan Question accordingly negatived. 1313 18 MAY 2009 Business without Debate 1314

[Mr. Deputy Speaker] MEMBERS’ ALLOWANCES Motion made, Question put forthwith (Standing Order No. 31 (2)), That Mr Nigel Dodds be discharged from the Committee on That the proposed words be there added. Members’ Allowances and Mr Jeffrey M. Donaldson be added.— Question agreed to. (Rosemary McKenna, on behalf of the Committee of Selection.) The Deputy Speaker declared the main Question, as amended, to be agreed to (Standing Order No. 31(2)). Hon. Members: Object. Resolved, Mr. Deputy Speaker (Sir Alan Haselhurst): Order. That this House notes the independent report by the Healthcare Commission which identified severe failings at the Mid Staffordshire Will hon. Members leave quickly and quietly, as there is NHS Foundation Trust and the follow-up reports by the National still some business to be completed? Clinical Director for Emergency Care and the National Clinical Director for Primary Care which state that Stafford Hospital’s accident and emergency department is now safe but that further PETITION improvements must be made at the Trust and lessons learnt by the whole NHS; further notes that the hospital has offered independent reviews of clinical records to all concerned; agrees that at the HIV and the G8 present time it would not be appropriate to establish an independent public inquiry; further agrees that management and staff at the hospital must remain focused on delivering high quality patient 10.18 pm care; and further agrees that an independent public inquiry could add undue delay to implementing the recommendations of the David Lepper (Brighton, Pavilion) (Lab/Co-op): I above reports and therefore to the hospital delivering high quality present a petition on behalf of Rebecca Rust, Andy Au and safe services for the local community. and 31 members of the City Gate church in Brighton. The petition states: Business without Debate The Petition of members of City Gate Church, Brighton, Declares that almost every minute of every day a baby is born DELEGATED LEGISLATION with HIV, and that almost all of these babies are born in the world’s poorest countries; further declares that nine out of ten of Motion made, and Question put forthwith (Standing all new HIV infections in children are as a direct result of mother Order No. 118(6)), to child transmission; further declares that the impact of HIV on infants is appalling and that without specialised treatment half CONSTITUTIONAL LAW will not live to see their second birthday; notes that in a number of countries, HIV and AIDS is the number one cause of death in That the draft National Assembly for Wales (Legislative under-five year olds. Competence) (Agriculture and Rural Development) Order 2009, which was laid before this House on 1 April, be approved.— Further declares that in rich countries the transmission of HIV (Mr. Blizzard.) from mothers to their babies has been virtually eliminated due to Question agreed to. the availability of health care and the right drugs; notes, however, that in many low-income countries pregnant women and their babies are not receiving the same degree of care and protection; BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE further notes that despite efforts to increase coverage of services to prevent mother to child transmission of HIV, figures from Ordered, 2006 show that in low-income countries only 1 in 5 pregnant That, at the sitting on Wednesday 20 May, women with HIV had access to the necessary antiretroviral drugs (1) the Speaker shall put the Questions necessary to dispose of to protect their babies. proceedings on the Motion in the name of Secretary Hazel Blears Further notes that this shortfall is now attracting global attention relating to Planning: National Policy Statements not later than and that in 2007 leaders at the G8 Summit in Heiligendamm three hours after the commencement of proceedings on the recognised the importance of preventing mother to child transmission Motion; such Questions shall include the Questions on any of HIV and promised 1.5 billion dollars to provide access to Amendments selected by the Speaker which may then be moved; services for all pregnant women; and believes that the UK has a the Questions may be put after the moment of interruption; and key role to play in turning this G8 commitment into reality. Standing Order No. 41A (Deferred divisions) shall not apply; and The Petitioners therefore request that the House of Commons (2) the Motion in the name of Mr David Cameron relating to urges the Government to outline how it intends to contribute to the Communications (Television Licensing) (Amendment) Regulations G8 commitments on preventing mother to child transmission of 2009 may be proceeded with as if Standing Orders Nos. 16 HIV, and to encourage other G8 countries to take similar action (Proceedings under an Act or on European Union documents) And the Petitioners remain, etc. and 17 (Delegated legislation (negative procedure)), were applicable thereto.—(Mr. Blizzard.) [P000368] 1315 18 MAY 2009 River Forth Crossing 1316

River Forth Crossing On my tours of firms in Fife just after the new year and at Easter, I came across business after business that Motion made, and Question proposed, That this House was deeply concerned about the crossing. They want an do now adjourn.—(Mr. Blizzard.) assurance that a bridge will be built, but they have not received one. Two years ago, John Swinney, the Cabinet Secretary for Finance and Sustainable Growth, agreed: 10.21 pm “However, the Government has yet to decide on the type of Willie Rennie (Dunfermline and West Fife) (LD): It is crossing that will be built and the method of financing. Those decisions will be made during the autumn”— a pleasure to open this debate. I have been seeking a debate on this subject for about five months, and I am of 2007— delighted to have finally secured it, but it is disappointing “so that we can make early progress on the replacement crossing that the issue has not moved on in those five months. and avoid having a question mark over the existence of a Forth We are still debating the funding of the crossing over crossing in the future”. the River Forth. This time five months ago, I was deeply Those were eminently sensible comments from the Cabinet concerned about the arrangements that were in place, Secretary, but he has not followed through. and the worry that the issue was causing within the In 2006, before the Scottish parliamentary elections, community in Fife. The slow pace of progress on this the leader of the Scottish National party, the right hon. important issue is matched only by the increasing concern Member for Banff and Buchan (Mr. Salmond), told the in the local community. The longer the process takes, Edinburgh Evening News: the more that concern grows. “If we have a new bridge,”— The Forth bridge was opened by the Queen in 1964, I can just imagine the right hon. Gentleman saying replacing the ferry from north to south. At the time, that— there were about 4 million crossings a year. Now the “a bond issue is definitely the way to do it. Compared like for like, figure is about 21 million, which is much more than bond issue against PFI, the savings would be in tens of millions, was expected when the bridge was constructed. That maybe even hundreds of millions. Because it’s such an iconic fivefold increase has put a huge strain on the bridge, project, that would have a wonderful take up and resonance not leading to deterioration that means it cannot support just in Scotland but worldwide.” the current volume of traffic for more than a further That is the so-called patriotic bonds speech. I can decade. If action is not taken to build a new crossing, almost hear the pipes and drums battering away as the we may be asking the Queen to return to launch a new right hon. Gentleman made those remarks. Two years set of ferries to secure the lifeline link between Fife and on, not one patriotic Scot has paid a single penny for Edinburgh. those bonds. It is not because we lack patriotic Scots, The bridge is a crucial part of the east coast transport but because there is a lack of sensible thinking in the artery. A blockage at Queensferry would have major SNP. As a result, the SNP has not built one school, one consequences for the economy of the whole of Scotland. road, one railway or one hospital since it came to power, Many businesses locate in Fife because of the transport through that method—absolutely nothing. links to Edinburgh, Glasgow and the north, and because it has easy access to the east coast main line and the Stewart Hosie (Dundee, East) (SNP): I obviously airport. Thousands of commuters have moved from want to stick to the narrow remit of the debate, but the Edinburgh to Fife to enjoy the benefits of living in Fife hon. Gentleman will understand that the ability to take while maintaining their jobs in the capital. There is no money for bonds is not permitted at the moment by the doubt that the bridge is essential, no matter what some UK Government. I am sure he will confirm that the protesters say. We cannot do without the bridge at First Minister has since made the position clear, and Queensferry. has described the project as The technical problem is that the hundreds of little “publicly funded and procured through a conventional design cables that hold the bridge up are snapping. The and build contract.” deterioration is considerable, but the rate of decline is The commitments to deliver the bridge on time are unknown, as the snapping was discovered only about definitely there. four years ago. Current estimates are that the bridge has only another decade of life in it. Those estimates may Willie Rennie: I am highly sceptical about those remarks, change, however, as we get a better assessment of how because of the First Minister’s hyperbole in 2006: he the deterioration is advancing. If the deterioration is knew the rules—he knew the game—but he made those discovered to have slowed, the length of the life of the overblown, overcommitted comments, giving people bridge will be longer. However, by the time that we confidence that things would happen. The hon. Gentleman know for sure how long the bridge has, it will be too should not be surprised that I do not have a great deal late, so we need to construct the bridge as soon as of confidence in the First Minister’s remarks or in the possible. Cabinet Secretary’s comments that it would be through Despite the need to start building the bridge in 2011, capital spending that the bridge would be constructed. there remains considerable uncertainty about the funding The First Minister must give us a greater assurance, and package. I simply do not buy the assurances of the must spell out the sacrifices required, which he has so Scottish Government that they have the funding in far refused to do. If, over three years, we spend £700 million place. Some may say that we do not need to have the a year, there will be massive consequences for infrastructure funding in place until about 2011, but businesses crave projects—hospitals and schools—throughout Scotland certainty, especially in these difficult economic times. during that period. Almost nothing else will be built. We need absolute certainty so that we can give businesses The First Minister, however, has refused to spell that in Fife the confidence that they need. out, and will not name the projects that will be cancelled. 1317 River Forth Crossing18 MAY 2009 River Forth Crossing 1318

[Willie Rennie] present circumstance they should help the Scottish Government out of their difficulties. The trouble is that The hon. Gentleman will therefore understand why I do that was not new money. About £500 million was from not have a great deal of confidence in the First Minister’s Crossrail, which was coming anyway, and other moneys remarks in that regard. were always designated as Scottish Government funds. The Civil Engineering Contractors Association confirmed So the Westminster Government were not assisting with my belief and is deeply concerned about the situation: the difficulty. None the less, I welcome the fact that they “CECA is concerned that if the Forth Replacement Crossing is have accepted in principle that they should help the paid for during the course of the works Transport Scotland will Scottish Government out of their obvious difficulties. find itself unable to do much else during the forecast…years of I plead with the Minister to come up with a new the bridge’s construction. This would mean cutting many smaller package of support so that we can get this essential projects designed to enhance the fabric and safety of the transport bridge built across the Forth—some real new money network across Scotland—schemes not on the same scale as the Crossing, but of equal importance to…local communities and that would resolve the difficulty. The Westminster local economies”. Government have accepted in principle. Now it would So CECA understands the consequences of the First be nice to see some real cash that could get us out of the Minister’s commitment. present difficulties. I do not wish this contribution to be dominated by However, there is a second option that the Minister Scottish Executive powers, so I shall move on to the could consider. If the Government were to legislate reasons why we need to reach some kind of resolution. quickly, we could introduce new borrowing powers. If the SNP refuses point blank to use the powers it has They have been considered by the Calman commission within its grasp, we must seek alternative methods. which has been set up by the Conservatives, the After two years in power, during which the SNP Liberal Democrats and the Labour Government. We Government pondered their Scottish future strategy are considering all the options—all the funding and eventually decided that that would not be possible, mechanisms—that could be given to the Scottish they have come cap in hand to the Westminster Government Parliament so that it might have the real powers of a for additional support. That is a humiliating U-turn on real Parliament. If the Scottish Parliament did have which, unsurprisingly, the SNP has gone silent. them, the Scottish Government would be able to use the borrowing powers to spread the cost of building that I give credit to Gavin Brown, a Conservative Member massive bridge—about £1.7 billion to £2.3 billion—over of the Scottish Parliament, for this analogy—there seems quite a long period. There would be a benefit in giving to be a dangerous game of chicken going on between the Scottish Government the necessary powers to deliver the Westminster Government and the Scottish Government. the bridge on time, because building it on time is the Who blinks first? Who ducks out of the road of the absolute priority. oncoming juggernauts? Meanwhile, uncertainty in Fife and the east of Scotland grows. Because the stakes are On behalf of the east coast of Scotland, I am therefore so high, it is essential that we achieve a resolution to the pleading—almost begging—with the Westminster problem as soon as possible. Government to help the Scottish Government out of their difficulties, either by coming up with real money Stewart Hosie: When the hon. Gentleman describes a that will make a difference to the construction and the humiliating U-turn, I take it that he is describing the costs, or by considering, through the Calman commission, rather sensible proposal to go to the UK Government the possibility of new powers for the Scottish Parliament, and ask to pay for a major capital project over a longer so that it might spread the cost of borrowing over a period than the two or three years for which the UK long period. Such an offer would bring certainty to the Government have allowed. I hope the hon. Gentleman businesses and commuters of Fife, who need it, and will agree that that is not humiliating. It is a rather avoid the childish game of chicken that seems to be sensible way to repay the cost of a major capital project. taking place between the Westminster and Scottish Governments. Willie Rennie: Spreading payment over 20 years is not I hope that the Minister will consider those the way the Westminster Government usually work. I recommendations. The final points are really important do not think most Governments would commit future to the east coast of Scotland, because we need that Governments to such spending, so it is not particularly bridge and we need it soon. sensible. It is humiliating, because of the First Minister’s overblown hyperbole in 2006 and 2007. That is why the SNP Administration should reflect on their ideological 10.36 pm obsession with opposing public-private partnership. I The Exchequer Secretary to the Treasury (Angela am not a strong advocate of PPP, but I recognise that it Eagle): I congratulate the hon. Member for Dunfermline is the only game in town. It is a way of delivering and West Fife (Willie Rennie) on securing this important projects for our communities. debate about funding for the new crossing over the Rather than maintaining their ideological opposition, Forth. I should clarify at the outset, however, that the and their support for alternative methods, the SNP Forth bridge is a devolved project, so its funding, as I Administration should recognise that the bridge is more think those listening to the debate will have worked out important than their ideology. Patriotic bonds sound by now, is also a devolved matter. That said, everybody great in opposition, but in practice they have turned out recognises the importance of the project and is keen to to be patriotic tosh. We need an alternative way forward. see it move forward. I am almost pleading with the Westminster Government, The existing Forth road bridge, as the hon. Gentleman who I believe have a significant responsibility. By offering said, has served Scotland well. I was slightly horrified to £1 billion, they have accepted the principle that in the realise that I am slightly older than the bridge, but I 1319 River Forth Crossing18 MAY 2009 River Forth Crossing 1320 hope that I am managing to wear my age a bit better coming to the Scottish Government anyway. The Minister than the first crossing—although I think that there has has accepted the principle that new funding should been slightly less pressure on me. come from Westminster. Perhaps she will consider a The new Forth crossing is an ambitious project. Its new package. estimated cost is £1.8 billion, and its planned completion date is, as the hon. Gentleman said, 2017. The project is Angela Eagle: The principle that has been accepted is designed to enhance the connections between the transport in respect of increased flexibilities, some certainty on networks of south-east and central Scotland, improving end-of-year funding, the Barnett consequentials of Crossrail journey times and contributing to the growth of the and a range of other things. We are trying to say in Scottish economy. Given the position of his constituency, advance to the Scottish Executive that if they were to I can see why he is keen to see the project go forward as put together a package in such a way, there would be no quickly as possible. That is why the Government have doubt about some of the decisions on end-of-year flexibility, taken steps to support the Scottish Executive in proceeding so they could act with confidence. with the second crossing, but, because the Government It is easy to say that the flexibilities contain no new recognise that this is a devolved issue, it is for the money, but they account for nearly £1 billion of extra Scottish Executive to decide whether the new bridge is assistance. Obviously, £500 million of Crossrail-Barnett necessary, which designs they should follow and how to consequentials were going to Scotland anyway. It is fund it. perfectly reasonable of the Government to say that if I should like to make a couple of points about the the Scottish Executive wish to use that money to bring UK Government’s record of support for public sector forward the second Forth bridge, they can do so. Some investment in Scotland, a record of which we are very of the other parts of that package would have given proud. Since devolution in 1999, the capital provision certainty about the consequences of extra efficiency made available to the Scottish Executive has more than savings or the income from extra asset disposal. If we tripled from £1 billion to more than £3 billion a year gave certainty, that money would, under the waiving of today. That increase is enabling the Scottish Executive normal Treasury rules, be allowed to be put into the pot to modernise Scotland’s infrastructure—its schools, for funding the bridge. Saying that there is no new hospitals, transport—and provide sound foundations money is a possible analysis, but I dispute it. for future growth and prosperity. In the pre-Budget report, the Government announced Stewart Hosie: Measures were certainly suggested, that they would agree to the Scottish Executive bringing but they included end-of-year funding, as the Minister forward capital spending from 2010-2011 to 2008-09 rightly said. To raise the funds required for the bridge and 2009-2010 as part of a major fiscal stimulus. In on that basis would require the Scottish Government to total, the PBR fiscal stimulus was worth about £2 billion underspend by about £275 million a year between now for Scotland, including reduced VAT. I am pleased that and 2016-17. That would be rather foolish. It would be the Scottish Executive announced in January that, through much better if we could simply repay the cost of the their Scottish economic recovery programme, they are bridge over a longer period. accelerating £227 million of capital spending and supporting almost 4,700 jobs in the Scottish economy. Beyond that, we recently announced in the Budget a further £104 million Angela Eagle: That is the hon. Gentleman’s interpretation. for the Scottish Executive to strengthen investment in In England, the Government require efficiency savings Scotland during the recession. of 3 per cent. a year; in Scotland, I note, efficiency savings of only 2 per cent. are required. With a more The Government are working with the Scottish Executive radical look at efficiency savings, money for the bridge to deliver improved infrastructure and to tackle the might be freed up. There are ways to help to put the recession. If they wish, the Scottish Executive can seek funding together. My right hon. Friends’ meeting with funding for private finance initiative projects from the the Scottish Minister was about trying to give certainty Treasury’s new PFI fund, to assist projects adversely in these circumstances. Efficiency savings often go straight affected by the current financial conditions to come to a back to the Treasury. Part of the reason for the meeting successful conclusion. To date, the Executive have chosen was to say that if such efficiency savings or asset disposals not to do that; I suspect that that is due to an ideological were successful, the Scottish Executive could keep the objection to PFI. However, PFI is a potential route for money. There are many areas where such pledges are the Executive. not forthcoming from the Treasury; it was an attempt to As I have said, the UK Government are keen to be helpful. The Scottish Executive have called for borrowing support progress on the new Forth crossing, and we against 20 years of future public funding by the Barnett have been proactive in seeking innovative solutions. To formula. That is not a way that we can fund public be helpful, my right hon. Friends the Secretary of State expenditure across the UK, in Scotland or anywhere for Scotland and the Chief Secretary to the Treasury else: the systems do not work in that manner and it is initiated a meeting with the Scottish Cabinet Secretary not a viable option. We had the meeting to try at least to for Finance and Sustainable Growth on 4 March to see whether we could explore a way forward, and all discuss methods of funding that the Scottish Executive those issues remain on the table. might choose; the hon. Member for Dunfermline and West Fife was right to point out that that would bring It is also open to the Scottish Executive to propose an nearly £1 billion to bear. The package was one of asset disposal plan for assets such as land and buildings innovative flexibilities and it was designed to try to that are no longer required. I can reconfirm that in this facilitate the development of the funding package. context the Treasury would be happy to consider the Scottish Executive’s retention of the increased receipts Willie Rennie: I recognise that there is some flexibility that would follow in order to fund the bridge. For within the funding, but the biggest chunk of it was example, disposing of 1 per cent. of the Scottish Executive’s 1321 River Forth Crossing18 MAY 2009 River Forth Crossing 1322

[Angela Eagle] mechanism that will allow the bridge to proceed, and I hope that they will now be able to make some progress assets in the national assets register could yield £230 million with that. to assist in providing the funding necessary to turn the The hon. Member for Dunfermline and West Fife bridge into reality. The Treasury also offered the Scottish asked about the Calman report. It is not sensible for me Executive the flexibility to switch from resource budget to anticipate what may be in that report when it is provision to capital, which provides further options for published, much less, from the Front Bench in an choosing how a funding package for the bridge might Adjournment debate, to expand on what the Government’s be put together. The package that has been offered is position on any such proposal might be. However, we potentially worth £1 billion, and it illustrates how it know that the report is imminent, and we await its might be possible to take the Forth bridge forward, even suggestions with interest. within the genuine constraints under which we are all operating, which must not be underestimated. I look forward to being around to see the second Forth bridge become a reality. I know that the hon. It is therefore disappointing that the Scottish Executive Gentleman has been a doughty advocate of that. I hope have not come forward with practical proposals for that the Scottish Executive can find a sensible way adopting that or similar packages to fund the bridge. forward to put the funding in place, and we stand ready The UK Government remain ready to work in partnership to assist. with the Scottish Executive, and the proposals put forward by my right hon. Friends the Chief Secretary Question put and agreed to. and the Secretary of State for Scotland remain on the table. We look forward to working with the Scottish Executive to find a way forward. There are clearly 10.47 pm choices and priorities to decide on as regards the funding House adjourned. 69WS Written Ministerial Statements18 MAY 2009 Written Ministerial Statements 70WS Written Ministerial HEALTH Written Answer (Correction) Statements The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Health (Ann Keen): I regret that the written answer given to the Monday 18 May 2009 hon. Member for Halton (Derek Twigg) on 30 March, Official Report, column 896w, was incorrect. Data provided were not validated and this did not come to light until queries were raised about data for a subsequent question. In addition, it is worth noting that BUSINESS, ENTERPRISE AND REGULATORY Wakefield sits outside the North West catchment area REFORM and should not have been included in the previous table. The correct information is given in the following table.

Companies House The number of severe/complex burn cases treated by each burn centre in the North West in each year since 2003! North West Catchment The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Business, Area 2003 2004 2005 2006 2007 2008 Total Enterprise and Regulatory Reform (Ian Pearson): Ihave set Companies House the following targets for the year Paediatrics 2009-10: Manchester 10578121355 Customer Liverpool 35323521 Preston 000000 0 To achieve a score of more than 86 per cent. in each quarterly Paediatrics 13 10 10 10 15 18 76 Companies House customer satisfaction survey. total To achieve on average a monthly compliance rate for accounts Adults submitted of 95.3 per cent.. Manchester 9 10 13 16 16 19 83 To achieve an electronic filing target for accounts of 20 per Liverpool 7 5 8 11 10 15 56 cent.. Preston 000000 0 To achieve an electronic filing target for other transactions of 67 per cent.. Adult total 16 15 21 27 26 34 139 Uncoded 1————— 1 To ensure that 95 per cent. of electronic documents can be data2 accessed within 60 seconds by search customers from the Companies House Direct download area. NW total 66 25 31 37 41 52 216 To resolve 97 per cent. of all complaints within 5 days. The chief executive to reply within 10 days to all letters from members of Parliament delegated to him to reply. Source: The National Burn Injury Database (NBID) was established in 2003 Process and had no data available before this time. To ensure that 95 per cent. of electronic transactions received 1: Data do not include readmissions. 2: Uncoded for paediatric or adult case. are available to view on the public record within 72 hours. Health Inequalities To ensure that 95 per cent. of paper transactions received are available to view on the public record within 8 days. To ensure that 99.5 per cent. of images placed on the Companies The Secretary of State for Health (Alan Johnson): House image system are legible and complete. The House of Commons Health Select Committee To ensure that Companies House Direct, WebCheck and WebFiling published its report on health inequalities on 15 March are available for 99 per cent. of the time between the hours of 2009. The Government response to this report (Cm 7621) 7.00 am and midnight. has been laid before Parliament today. People The Government response welcomes the Committee’s support for its work on health inequalities. Cross- To ensure that our average work days lost per person is no more than 10. Government action on health inequalities has helped contribute to major improvements in the health of the To improve the operational energy efficiency rating of Companies people in disadvantaged groups and areas over the last House’s headquarters building by 10 per cent.. 10 years. The Government also welcome the Committee’s Finance support for the health inequalities target, for the post-2010 To achieve by 2010-11 a reduction, in real terms, of 15 per cent. strategic review of health inequalities announced on compared to 2007-08 in the operational monetary cost of the 6 November 2008, and for the practical suggestions registry per company on the register (three-year target). contained in the report. To achieve taking one year with another, a 3.5 per cent. average The Government have used the experience of the last rate of return based on the operating surplus expressed as a 10 years to shape their approach to the health inequalities percentage of average net assets. agenda and develop practical, evidence-based programmes To pay invoices within 10 days. and policies. We are committed to continue this work.

17P Petitions18 MAY 2009 Petitions 18P Petitions INNOVATION, UNIVERSITIES AND SKILLS

Further Education (Wirral) Monday 18 May 2009 The Petition of residents of Wirral, Declares that the proposed closure of Carlett Park OBSERVATIONS Campus, a major site of Wirral Metropolitan College, would have a detrimental effect on current further education provision in South Wirral and beyond, would present difficulties to those wishing to pursue further CHILDREN, SCHOOLS AND FAMILIES education courses at Wirral Metropolitan College, fails to take account of the history and local importance of Schools (Liverpool) the site, and would discriminate against those whose circumstances dictated against travelling to an alternative The Petition of Parents Against Closure (PAC), and site further away from the Carlett Park campus. other supporters of Croxteth Community Comprehensive, The Petitioners therefore request that the House of Declares that Croxteth Community Comprehensive, Commons urges the Secretary of State for Children, a specialist college for business and enterprise, has been Schools and Families to make representations to Wirral earmarked for closure; notes that the college plays a Metropolitan College to encourage the continued existence vital role in the local community; and further declares of the Carlett Park site. that the proposed closure of the college would be highly detrimental to the local community and at odds with And the Petitioners remain, etc.—[Presented by Ben Liverpool’s role as the European Capital of Culture. Chapman, Official Report, 17 November 2008; Vol. 483, c. 98.] The Petitioners therefore request that the House of Commons urges the Secretary of State for Children, [P000288] Schools and Families to take action and engage with Observations from the Secretary of State for Innovation, the local authorities to ensure that Croxteth Community Universities and Skills: Comprehensive remains open and continues to be able Further education colleges are key to ensuring that to serve its community. every local community has a resource at its heart, And the Petitioners remain, etc.—[Presented by charged with delivering high quality opportunities to Mr. Robert N. Wareing, Official Report, 5 March 2009; learners and employers. Vol. 488, c. 1090.] As with any business, further education colleges will [P000319] continue to reassess their future position and the local circumstances in which they operate. They will want to Observations from the Secretary of State for Children, continue to ensure that they can respond to changing Schools and Families: needs of the community and the demands of learners Government appreciates that proposals to change and employers. This may result in some colleges reviewing local school provision can be upsetting and often unsettling their mission, their organisation, the models of delivery for those involved. However, school place planning is and the long-term sustainability of colleges’ sites. the statutory responsibility of the Local Authority (LA). As colleges are independent institutions, matters relating This includes making sure there are sufficient school to the policy and operation of a college are matters for places, and also removing surplus places when this is the governing body. As such it is for the college governing required. To facilitate this, LAs have the power to body to make decisions on the future of a site or propose the closure of any type of maintained mainstream campus for which a college has responsibility. school. However we would expect a college to ensure Where the LA proposes to make any changes to local opportunities for high-quality learning are maintained school provision, including closure, they must follow a and the particular needs of all students continue to be statutory process, which is then decided under established addressed. local decision making arrangements. Government has no direct role in the process. As part of its Building Schools for the Future programme Universities (Cumbria) Liverpool LA is planning to reorganise its school provision. Croxteth Community Comprehensive School was proposed The Petition of residents of Cumbria and others, for closure because of, among other things, its poor Declares that the proposed closure of the University academic standards and it being consistently and of Cumbria’s Ambleside Campus to undergraduate students significantly undersubscribed. There are currently only in 2012 would be a huge blow to the town of Ambleside 462 pupils on roll (Capacity is 875) and this is expected and would remove opportunities from future generations to fall below 300 by 2015. of students. On 13 February 2009, having followed the statutory The Petitioners therefore request that the House of process, the proposals to close the school were approved Commons urges the Secretary of State for Innovation, and the LA is now under a duty to implement the Universities and Skills to place pressure on the University proposals. We understand that the closure was originally of Cumbria to ensure the viability of Ambleside Campus planned for 2010, but that this has subsequently been for all students and to scrap the plans for its closure to modified to 2012. undergraduate students. 19P Petitions18 MAY 2009 Petitions 20P

And the Petitioners remain, etc.—[Presented by Tim economic needs of their institution. The Higher Education Farron, Official Report, 10 November 2008; Vol. 482, Funding Council for England (HEFCE) is aware of the c. 609.] University’s plans for its estate. [P000283] I welcome the commitment of the university to work Observations from the Secretary of State for Innovation, with local partners as it develops its plans. I note that it Universities and Skills: has no plans to cut its provision overall, and that it will I understand the concerns that have been raised about relocate all the courses it currently runs at Ambleside to the University of Cumbria’s plans for its Ambleside other sites. I also note that the university proposes to site. I do not believe that this is a matter in which use the Ambleside campus for the benefit of its postgraduate Government should seek to intervene. Universities are students, who are an important part of the university’s autonomous bodies. It is right that they should be free life. The Higher Education Funding Council for England to manage their estates to support the mission and (HEFCE) is aware of the university’s plans for its estate. 1115W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1116W Written Answers to Departmental Official Hospitality Bob Spink: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy Questions and Climate Change how much his Department has spent on (a) conference services and (b) banqueting services since its creation. [274507] Monday 18 May 2009 Mr. Mike O’Brien: Since its creation on 3 October 2008 the Department has spent (a) £64,800 on conference services and (b) nothing on banqueting services. ENERGY AND CLIMATE CHANGE Departmental Stationery

Carbon Sequestration: Finance Bob Spink: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change what proportion of office supplies Stephen Hammond: To ask the Secretary of State for purchased by his Department were recycled products in Energy and Climate Change from which budgets the the latest period for which figures are available. £90 million allocated in Budget 2009 for research into [275347] carbon capture and storage will be drawn. [276151] Mr. Mike O’Brien: DECC does not separately account Mr. Mike O’Brien: £60 million is transferred from the for purchases of office supplies made from recycled Department of Transport and £30 million from the products. Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs. Mineral Resources: International Cooperation

Departmental Billing Dr. Gibson: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change what discussions he has had with Mr. Philip Hammond: To ask the Secretary of State the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth for Energy and Climate Change how much his Department Affairs on the Government’s strategy for preservation has paid in interest to suppliers under the Late Payment of global mineral resources. [264697] of Commercial Debts (Interest) Act 1998 since its creation. [275204] Mr. Mike O’Brien: My right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change has not had Mr. Mike O’Brien: Nil. any discussions with his right hon. Friend the Foreign Secretary on the Government’s strategy for preservation Departmental Contracts of global mineral resources. Natural Gas: Waste Disposal Bob Spink: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change what services his Department has Mr. Drew: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy outsourced since its establishment; and if he will make and Climate Change what percentage of mains gas a statement. [275635] supply is accounted for by production from anaerobic digester plants. [275790] Mr. Mike O’Brien: None. Mr. Mike O’Brien: Currently no gas in the mains Departmental Correspondence system is provided by anaerobic digester plants.

Bob Spink: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change what procedure his Department CULTURE, MEDIA AND SPORT follows for dealing with complaints received (a) by Copyright: Internet e-mail, (b) by post, (c) by telephone and (d) via his Department’s website. [274526] Dr. Howells: To ask the Secretary of State for Culture, Mr. Mike O’Brien: Complaints to DECC, received by Media and Sport (1) if he will bring forward legislative whatever means, i.e. by (a) e-mail, (b) by post, (c) by proposals to replace self-regulation in respect of digital telephone or (d) via the Department’s website, should content and copyright into a statutory system; [275928] be dealt with within 15 working days of receipt. (2) what recent discussions he has had with internet Where possible, complaints should be resolved at the service providers on measures to reduce levels of point of receipt. Where this is not possible, the complaint copyright theft and infringement; [275929] is passed to the unit within the department responsible (3) what discussions he has had with the Secretary of for the area of work complained about, to be dealt with State for Business, Enterprise and Regulatory Reform there. If a complainant is not satisfied with the outcome, on proposals to vest in Ofcom a statutory power to the complainant is given the option to escalate the create a code of practice on terms for transfer of shares complaint to DECC’s impartial Service Standards of revenues generated by the use of copyrighted Adjudicator if it’s about standards of service; or to material; [275930] DECC’s Secretary of State or a DECC Minister via a (4) what steps he is taking to investigate the effects of Member of Parliament for complaints about DECC copyright piracy on the economic viability of the policy or legal issues. digital content business sector; [275931] 1117W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1118W

(5) what discussions he has had with (a) Ministerial Andy Burnham: Digital UK and the Switchover Help colleagues and (b) the UK Film Council on the Council’s Scheme are the organisations responsible for implementing proposal for a legislative structure to support a graduated the digital switchover and providing assistance to those response approach to online copyright theft and who may need it. infringement; [275932] The Scottish information campaign began in October (6) what steps he plans to take to maintain the 2007. Since then leaflets have been sent to every Scottish economic viability of the UK’s digital content business home and TV, radio and press campaigns have been sector; [275933] running at intervals to inform viewers about their options (7) what discussions he has had with (a) the Digital for switchover. Over the past two years, Digital UK’s Rights Agency and (b) other digital rights representatives Scotland team has carried out a number of public and on amendments to the present regulatory regime on stakeholder meetings and events to ensure that residents infringements of copyright in respect of digital rights; and key stakeholders in Scotland are prepared for the [275934] switchover. (8) if he will assess the merits of a deterrence scheme The Switchover Help Scheme will begin operating in to ensure that higher broadband speeds do not lead to each transmitter group area up to eight months prior to an increase in illegal file sharing and copyright theft. switchover to offer practical help to those who are [275935] eligible. Additionally, national, regional and local charities will begin a programme of community outreach across Andy Burnham: The Government recognise the damaging Scotland to support individuals through the switchover economic impact of copyright theft and infringement, process. Project management, materials and grants are and unlawful peer-to-peer file-sharing in particular, on funded through Digital UK. Digital UK also runs a the creative sector. Although the music industry is currently website providing information on switchover at: affected most by this, other industries—such as film, http://www.digitaluk.co.uk/ computer games and publishing—will be increasingly affected as higher broadband speeds are introduced. Future Jobs Fund Last year we set up a memorandum of understanding (MOU) between the Government, internet service providers Mr. Hunt: To ask the Secretary of State for Culture, (ISPs) and rights holders, as a first step to finding Media and Sport how much funding his Department agreement on a way forward. Outcomes from the MOU has available as part of the Future Jobs Fund. [276171] informed the proposals set out in the Digital Britain Interim Report (DBIR) in January. The DBIR proposed Andy Burnham: The Future Jobs Fund is held by the a requirement for ISPs to notify their customers when Department for Work and Pensions. The Secretary of rights holders identified them as engaging in unlawful State for Work and Pensions and I announced in May, file sharing. Information on the most serious infringers plans to create 5-10,000 jobs in the cultural and creative would then be made available to rights holders (based sector. Sports organisations have already pledged to bid on the collection of data on the notification requests for at least 5,000 jobs. from rights holders, and subject to a court order) to help them prioritise legal action against those infringers. Tourism Advisory Council This would provide a form of graduated response up to prosecution for the most serious infringers. Other forms Mr. Ellwood: To ask the Secretary of State for Culture, of graduated response have been suggested to us in Media and Sport what representation from local authorities response to consultations on this issue, and we are there is on the Tourism Advisory Council. [274683] considering the merits of these. We have also consulted on the idea of creating a rights agency, the establishment Barbara Follett [holding answer 12 May 2009]: There of a code of practice and Ofcom’s possible involvement is currently no representation from local authorities on in this. We have discussed these issues and ideas at the Tourism Advisory Council (TAC). The first meeting ministerial and official level both between Departments of the council took place on 30 April 2009 and was and with many interested parties, including ISPs, the established to draw together senior practitioners primarily UK Film Council and other rights holders’ representatives. from the tourism industry to engage with the Government We will issue a further consultation on the legislative Departments whose policies impact on tourism. proposals shortly. However, after consultation with Visit England’s chair, More generally, the DBIR acknowledged the structural we are currently reviewing the local authority representation and cyclical pressures on the UK’s media industry and on the TAC. the threats to continued investment in UK-originated content in the digital world. We recognise the challenges and opportunities presented by the transition to digital, and the DBIR made a commitment to investigate ways OLYMPICS to address these issues further. Our conclusions will be published in the final Digital Britain report. Olympic Games 2012: Caravans

Digital Broadcasting: Scotland Mr. Amess: To ask the Minister for the Olympics what discussions she has had with (a) the Mayor of Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for London and (b) Transport for London on the provision Culture, Media and Sport what steps his Department is of caravan sites for those attending the Olympic games taking to ensure that residents of Scotland are in 2012 since December 2008; and if she will make a prepared for the digital switchover. [275697] statement. [275611] 1119W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1120W

Tessa Jowell: There are no plans for spaces for recreational March 2009, although the hon. Member should note caravans in the Olympic Park. However, we recognise that the figures are recorded on the basis of 12 financial that motor home and caravan users may wish to attend periods, not calendar months. the 2012 games and we expect that, closer to the time, the Olympic Delivery Authority will wish to follow up Café/snack Total cafeterias, initial discussions it has had with the Caravan Club to Cafeterias venues café/snack bars explore the potential for games-time integration of public Period 1 81,914 15,568 97,482 transport provision and licensed caravan sites. Period 2 96,733 17,164 113,897 Olympic Games 2012: Southend on Sea Period 3 116,888 20,828 137,716 Period 4 101,617 18,950 120,567 Period 5 51,991 16,607 68,598 Mr. Amess: To ask the Minister for the Olympics Period 6 66,055 21,851 87,906 what discussions her Office has had since January 2008 Period 7 93,054 17,301 110,355 with Southend borough council to enable it to (a) Period 8 107,559 19,498 127,057 participate fully in and (b) receive a legacy from the Period 9 109,845 19,418 129,263 London 2012 Olympic games; and if she will make a Period 10 68,936 11,367 80,303 statement. [275615] Period 11 98,048 17,540 115,588 Period 12 144,846 25,507 170,353 Tessa Jowell: Although the Government Olympic Totals 2008-09 1,137,486 221,599 1,359,085 Executive has had no direct discussions with Southend borough council about the legacy of London 2012 in Southend, I meet regularly with the chair of the Local Drinking Water Government Association (LGA) and my officials work closely with their LGA counterparts. Mr. Burstow: To ask the hon. Member for North We are fully committed to ensuring that everyone in Devon, representing the House of Commons Commission the UK can be part of the London 2012 Olympic and what estimate the Commission has made of the number Paralympic games. The Legacy Action Plan which I of plastic bottles of water sold in House of Commons published in June last year sets out more details on how cafeterias in each of the last 12 months. [275515] we propose to deliver this vision. I am especially keen Nick Harvey: A month-by-month breakdown of the for regions to identify what is important to them. At a number of plastic water bottles sold in the House of regional level this work is being taken forward by the Commons cafeterias and other catering venues in the Nations and Regions Group (NRG) who are working 12 months from April 2008-March 2009 is set out as hard to optimise local benefits of the games. follows. The hon. Member should note that the figures In December 2008 I addressed the LGA conference are recorded on the basis of 12 financial periods, not which had an Olympic focus. I regularly attend meetings calendar months. with the London councils and meet the five London host borough representatives. I also undertake a programme Cafeteria Other venues Total of regional visits where I meet with local representatives and businesses to highlight the potential benefits and Period 1 7,253 773 8,026 opportunities of London 2012. Period 2 9,309 1,205 10,514 Period 3 10,302 1,462 11,764 We are already seeing great progress in a lot of these Period 4 8,774 1,366 10,140 areas, for example 23 of the Olympic Delivery Authority’s Period 5 4,569 1,295 5,864 suppliers are businesses registered in Essex. 66 facilities Period 6 4,837 1,279 6,116 from the region, including Southend Leisure and Tennis Period 7 6,607 895 7,502 Centre in Essex are included in the official London 2012 Period 8 7,046 785 7,831 Pre-Games Training Camp Guide. Additionally, I am Period 9 7,019 637 7,656 delighted that Southend Unitary Authority is offering Period 10 4,477 389 4,866 free swimming to the over 60s and under 16s. Period 11 6,372 670 7,042 Period 12 10,334 1,214 11,548 Totals 2008-09 86,899 1,970 98,869 HOUSE OF COMMONS COMMISSION Catering Energy Mr. Burstow: To ask the hon. Member for North Devon, representing the House of Commons Commission Mr. Burstow: To ask the hon. Member for North what estimate the House of Commons Commission has Devon, representing the House of Commons Commission made of the number of meals purchased in House of (1) what the energy consumption was of each building Commons cafeterias in each of the last 12 months for on the House of Commons part of the parliamentary which figures are available. [275499] estate in each of the last three years; [275505] (2) what his most recent estimate is of the level of Nick Harvey: The House of Commons catering service electricity consumption of each building on the does not record the number of meals purchased in its parliamentary estate. [275599] cafeterias but instead records the number of sales transactions. A transaction is defined as a customer sale Nick Harvey: The energy consumption of each building and may be for one meal, several meals, or merely a on the parliamentary estate, broken down by gas and drink or snack. The number of cafeteria transactions is electricity usage, for each of the last three years is as set out below for the 12 months from April 2008 to follows: 1121W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1122W

Energy consumption MWh 2006-07 2007-08 2008-09 Building Gas Electricity Total Gas Electricity Total Gas Electricity Total

Palace of Westminster 17,851 15,138 32,989 18,593 14,662 33,255 20,634 15,278 35,912 Portcullis House 3,126 3,910 7,036 3,339 3,790 7,129 3,676 3,728 7,404 Norman Shaw N and S 2,430 2,070 4,500 3,011 2,108 5,119 3,214 2,130 5344 1 Canon Row — 832 832 — 830 830 — 818 818 1 Parliament Street 1,986 2,310 4296 2,117 2,260 4,377 2,135 2,303 4,438 Parliamentary Bookshop — 34 34 — 25 25 — 23 23 7 Millbank 1,651 3823 5,474 1,737 3,938 5,675 2,107 4,087 6,194 2 The Abbey Garden 91 55 146 72 53 125 101 52 153 Underground Car Park — 251 251 — 314 314 — 354 354 22 John Islip Street 51 32 83 83 29 112 73 24 97 Total 27,186 28,455 55,641 28,952 28,009 56,961 31,940 28,797 60,737

Food: Waste Disposal Nick Harvey: Figures for the monetary value of office furniture purchased in each of the last three years are: Mr. Burstow: To ask the hon. Member for North £380,557 (2006), £1,079,461 (2007) and £392,387 (2008). Devon, representing the House of Commons Commission The monetary value of office furniture disposed of in what estimate the Commission has made of the amount the same period is recorded only back to 2008; the of food waste by weight arising from House of Commons figure in that year was £2,614.91. The weight of items is cafeterias in each of the last 12 months; and by what not recorded and so cannot be quantified per annum. means such waste is disposed. [275514] Members: Allowances Nick Harvey: No record is kept of the amount of food waste by weight but a record is kept of the value of John Mann: To ask the hon. Member for North food waste. The cost of food wastage is set out as Devon, representing the House of Commons Commission follows for the House of Commons cafeterias for each at what meetings the House of Commons Commission of the 12 months from April 2008-March 2009. The has considered implementation of amendment (f) of 3 hon. Member should note that the figures are recorded July 2008 on the designation of second homes and on the basis of 12 financial periods, not calendar months. capital gains tax; what decision was reached; what legal advice was sought and given; and which Members were £ in attendance. [276173]

Period 1 6,394 Nick Harvey: Matters which relate to the Members Period 2 5,845 Estimate are considered by the Members Estimate Period 3 11,382 Committee rather than the House of Commons Period 4 9,501 Commission. I will contact the hon. Member. Period 5 6,928 Period 6 4,762 Palace of Westminster: Repairs and Maintenance Period 7 7,510 Period 8 7,761 Mr. Davidson: To ask the hon. Member for North Period 9 7,347 Devon, representing the House of Commons Commission Period 10 4,694 how much has been spent on improving or renovating Period 11 5,386 accommodation in the House of Commons part of the Period 12 7,414 Palace of Westminster in each of the last five years. Total 2008-09 84,924 [274678] Food waste is currently mixed with the general waste Nick Harvey: The amount spent by the House of stream and sent to disposal facilities in the London area Commons on improving and renovating the Palace of obtaining energy from waste. A review of alternative Westminster has been: schemes, such as the commercial collection of food waste for transportation to an anaerobic digestion facility, £000 has been scheduled for 2009-10. 2004-05 6,183 2005-06 7,524 Furniture 2006-07 10,057 2007-08 9,743 Mr. Burstow: To ask the hon. Member for North 2008-09 2,559 Devon, representing the House of Commons Commission how many items of office furniture were (a) purchased This excludes general maintenance costs, some of and (b) disposed of by the House of Commons which are incurred across the whole Estate, and expenditure Commission in each of the last three years; and what on security related projects. The Palace is shared with estimate the Commission has made of the (i) weight the House of Lords who account for their share of the and (ii) total value of each category. [275510] costs incurred separately. 1123W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1124W

Pay However, the machines are scheduled for replacement later this year and energy efficiency, including the use of Sir Nicholas Winterton: To ask the hon. Member for timers and sensors, will be taken into account when North Devon, representing the House of Commons selecting replacement models. Commission what the (a) gross annual income from the House of Commons and (b) job title was of each of the (i) officers and (ii) staff of the House of TRANSPORT Commons who earned more than a backbench hon. Member in 2008-09. [275706] A64

Nick Harvey: The basic salary payable to Members is Mr. Goodwill: To ask the Secretary of State for £63,291 per annum as at 31 March 2009. As at that date, Transport (1) what the cost of the recent installation of 89 employees were paid a gross annual salary above this warning signs for overhead cables on the A64 York to figure; of these 82 were Officers of the House and seven Scarborough road was; [276027] were staff of the House. (2) how many (a) road traffic and (b) other The provision of a list of these posts would allow accidents or incidents there have been on the A64 York individual staff to be identified which is contrary to to Scarborough road caused by or involving vehicles House policy on data protection. A list of the posts in hitting overhead lines in the last three months; [276028] the House of Commons senior structure and at pay band Al, which have pay band maxima higher than (3) what risk assessment was carried out prior to the Members’ current salary was placed in the Library in installation of overhead cable warning signs on the April 2009 in response to the question from the right A64 York to Scarborough road; [276029] hon. and learned Member for Sleaford and North Hykeham (4) how many individual overhead cable warning (Mr. Hogg), on 22 April 2009, Official Report, column signs have been erected on the A64 since 1 January 739W. 2009. [276111] Details of the staff pay bands and staff pay arrangements are available on the parliamentary intranet. The salaries Paul Clark: 424 overhead cable warning signs have of Members of the Management Board are disclosed in been erected on the A64 since 1 January 2009 at a cost the House of Commons: Administration annual accounts. of approximately £50,000. There have been no road traffic accidents or other Procurement incidents on the A64 York to Scarborough road caused by or involving vehicles hitting overhead lines in the last three months. Mr. Burstow: To ask the hon. Member for North A project specific risk assessment was undertaken to Devon, representing the House of Commons identify a safe method of erection and maintenance of Commission how many paper receipts were issued to these signs. Prior to any maintenance activity on the suppliers by the House authorities in each of the last A64 a scheme specific risk assessment is undertaken to three years. [275506] identify hazards, including overhead power cables, and to ensure risks to road workers are mitigated. The Nick Harvey: Receipts are issued at catering and marker posts also enable the emergency services to retail outlets in the House of Commons but there is no more easily identify overhead power lines as part of business need to keep records of numbers. During the their risk assessment when attending an incident. summer opening of the Palace of Westminster to the public, receipts are issued to visitors purchasing tickets British Transport Police: ICT by credit card but the numbers are not readily available. The Parliamentary Bookshop issued the following number Tim Loughton: To ask the Secretary of State for of paper receipts based on till transactions: Transport on how many and what proportion of 2008-09: 20,734 British Transport Police computers malware was 2007-08: 19,991. detected in 2008. [275392] Information about the bookshop in 2006-07 is not available in the form requested, but is believed to be Paul Clark: It is not in the interests of the UK’s similar to the later years. national security for Departments to confirm information on the number of malicious attacks against their IT Vending Machines systems and those of the bodies for which they are responsible. The British Transport police have a policy on managing Mr. Burstow: To ask the hon. Member for North risks posed by all forms of malicious software (‘malware’). Devon, representing the House of Commons Commission how many vending machines there are on Bus Services: Concessions the House of Commons estate; and what the energy rating of each such machine is. [275513] Mr. Sanders: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport what assessment he has made of the (a) Nick Harvey: There are a total of 13 vending machines administrative and (b) financial consequences of in operation on the House of Commons estate. reimbursement being made by central Government to No information is available about the energy rating bus operators for the concessionary bus fare scheme. of each machine. [275543] 1125W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1126W

Paul Clark: The Department for Transport has recently Greater London, (b) Greater Manchester and (c) published a consultation paper on possible changes to Strathclyde in the 2008-09 financial year; and how the administration of concessionary travel. Option 3 many of the assessments in each area found the quality within this consultation paper is for the administration of driving to be unacceptable. [275215] of the statutory minimum bus concession to be moved to central Government and for bus operators to be Jim Fitzpatrick [holding answer 13 May 2009]: The reimbursed through national negotiation with the following assessments were conducted under the Driver Department. Quality Monitoring Scheme in 2008-09. If this option was chosen following the consultation, the Department would need to undertake further detailed Greater London Greater Manchester assessment of the administrative and financial consequences Assessments 7,237 908 of such a model. Unacceptable drives 1,591 387 The draft impact assessment that was published alongside Percentage 21 42 the consultation sets out the Department’s initial assessment of such a move. A move to central administration and The Driving Standards Agency’s last Driver Quality reimbursement would bring with it a number of Monitoring contract in Strathclyde terminated in January complexities, including the potential for duplication of 2007. reimbursement negotiations if enhanced concessions The data from the assessment is collated and reported continue to be offered at a local level. In addition to any back to the client on the next day, for potential remedial transitional start-up costs, the Department currently action. For those assessments recording dangerous faults estimates a move to central administration would have the bus company is notified on the day of the assessment. an average annual cost of £8 million, offset by average In all cases the client is responsible for any further annual savings to local authorities of £10.6 million. action. Departmental Pay Ferries Mr. Philip Hammond: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport how much (a) his Department and (b) Mr. Andrew Turner: To ask the Secretary of State for its agencies paid in end-of-year performance bonuses to Transport what requirements there are on UK ferry (i) all staff and (ii) senior Civil Service staff in 2008-09; operators on routes of less than 20 miles in terms of and how many such payments were made. [275247] (a) passenger loading limits and (b) records to be kept of the numbers of people boarding their vessels. Mr. Hoon: The amount of end-of-year non-consolidated [276112] performance payments paid to all staff and senior civil service staff in the Department for Transport is shown Jim Fitzpatrick: I refer the hon. Member to my in the table. answer of 2 April 2009, Official Report, columns 1420-421W. In addition: All staff SCS Passenger loading limits Overall number of staff 19,493 187 The Department for Transport places no absolute Number receiving end year non- 13,332 139 limit on the number of passengers that may be carried consolidated performance on any class of passenger ships (with the exception of payments classes VI and VIA, which have very restricted operations End year non-consolidated 9,813,937 1,344,831 and are limited to a maximum of 250 and 50 passengers performance payments amount (£) respectively). In general the vessel operator may design Total pay bill was £643,685,777, of which 1.73 per and equip the vessel to carry the number of passengers cent., was used for non-consolidated performance payments they believe there is market demand for. to staff. The mean payment made was £736 for all staff Regulations then require that appropriate standards and £9,675 for senior civil service. of safety are provided to meet the risks posed by the vessel’s service and the number of passengers carried. Driving: Licensing These address areas such as intact stability, freeboard, damage survivability, fire protection, provision of lifesaving Bob Spink: To ask the Secretary of State for appliances, manning levels, safety management, pollution Transport what proportion of applications for driving prevention—in each case, the greater the number of licence renewals were rejected by the Driver and Vehicle passengers and the longer the voyage, the more Licensing Agency in each of the last five years; and comprehensive the technical requirements so as to ensure what proportion of such rejected applications resulted a level of safety appropriate to the risk. Other regulations in a retest in each of those years. [275496] also apply, but are independent of the number of passengers on board, e.g. for safety of navigation or provision of Jim Fitzpatrick: This information is not held in the radios. form requested. Instructions to surveyors and other departmental guidance lay down requirements for passenger Driving: Standards accommodation and seating, provision of sanitary facilities, and provisions for persons of reduced mobility. While John McDonnell: To ask the Secretary of State for this guidance does not have the force of law, surveyors Transport how many assessments under the Driving will not recommend issue of a passenger certificate Quality Monitoring scheme were conducted in (a) unless the vessel meets the required standards. 1127W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1128W

On completion of surveys which take account of the against the provisions of that agreement. First Great above factors, the end result is the issue of a Passenger Western is currently compliant with the cancellations Certificate, which stipulates the maximum number of reduction trajectory contained in the remedial agreement. passengers and the total number of persons on board (including crew) that can be safely carried, and the Government Car and Despatch Agency: Fines minimum freeboard corresponding to the maximum draught (loading limit) which is marked on the side of the ship. Dr. Cable: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport how many (a) speeding fines, (b) London congestion Passenger counting charge fines and (c) parking fines were incurred by the The Master is prohibited by The Merchant Shipping Government Car and Despatch Agency in each of the (Survey and Certification) Regulations 1995 from having last four years for which information is available; how on board a greater number of passengers than that much was incurred in total in each category; and if he stated on the ship’s Passenger Certificate. He is assisted will make a statement. [275833] in meeting this obligation by the Merchant Shipping (Counting and Registration of Persons on Board Passenger Jim Fitzpatrick: I refer the hon. Member to my Ships) Regulations 1999 (SI 1999 No. 1869), supported answer of 24 March 2009, Official Report, column by Merchant Shipping Notice 1794, which describes 204W, given to the hon. Member for Welwyn Hatfield practical methods for counting and registering passengers. (Grant Shapps). For voyages of less than 20 miles, the regulations require a count of passengers and crew and for this Lighting information to be held ashore for the duration of the voyage. This information is used to check compliance with Mr. Gordon Prentice: To ask the Secretary of State safety regulations, and for search and rescue authorities, for Transport what information his Department holds in the event of an incident. on the number of lamp posts maintained by local authorities in England and in use which are beyond First Great Western: Finance their design life; and if he will make a statement. [276038] Mr. Drew: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport what steps his Department has taken to monitor First Paul Clark: It is for each local authority to decide Great Western’s performance in delivering its financial how to manage its street lighting systems and the commitments since the last review. [272996] Department for Transport does not regularly collect information on street lighting column age. In order to Paul Clark: Officials meet First Great Western at inform the local transport plan capital allocations, in least every four weeks to review progress of the franchise. 2006 the Department asked English local authorities The franchise agreement sets out a standard agenda for outside London to report the number of columns they these meetings, which includes financial performance had aged 40 years or more. At that time, authorities and performance of the franchisee in meeting its contractual reported 771,900 columns; but this figure has not been commitments. The Department for Transport is satisfied independently verified, and may include some columns that First Great Western is meeting its financial no longer in use. commitments. The Department encourages local authorities to adopt an asset management approach to maintaining their First Great Western: Standards highways assets, including basing decisions on accurate inventory and condition data rather than notional design Mr. Drew: To ask the Secretary of State for lives. Transport how many train services have been cancelled by First Great Western in the last 12 months. [272997] Parking: Disabled

Paul Clark: In the 12 months to 30 March 2009, Mr. Sanders: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport 7,024 First Great Western trains were cancelled. Of this if he will make an assessment of the adequacy of the total, 3,055 cancellations were attributable to First Great level of provision of disabled parking spaces in England. Western itself, the others being caused by Network Rail [275811] or by other train operators. These figures include partial cancellations (where a train departs but does not complete its planned journey). Paul Clark: Provision of disabled parking spaces is covered by Disability Discrimination Act (DDA) legislation. Mr. Drew: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport The Department for Transport has published the ‘Inclusive what assessment he has made of the performance of Mobility’ guidance document to help service providers First Great Western in delivering its commitment to (such as local authorities and car park operators) to improve service reliability. [272998] meet their requirements under the DDA. Powers exist for disabled people to challenge service providers who Paul Clark: Officials meet First Great Western at they believe do not meet their DDA requirements. least every four weeks to review overall progress of the We are working with the British Parking Association franchise. Officials also meet First Great Western at the and British Council of Shopping Centres to look at the milestone reporting sessions contractualised in the remedial adequacy of existing provision of off-street disabled agreement to review progress in reducing train cancellations parking spaces. 1129W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1130W

Railways: EU Countries current system, it would require Government subsidy. There is no current evidence that such a railcard would Mr. Sanders: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport generate revenue. what estimate he has made for benchmarking purposes Some season tickets already offer loyalty style discounts, of the proportion of travel undertaken by rail in continental such as the “gold card” for annual season tickets in the European countries. [275480] south-east—offering one third off off-peak travel in the south-east. Paul Clark: The Department for Transport has not Railways: Franchises made an estimate for benchmarking purposes of the proportion of travel undertaken by rail compared to continental European countries. The Eurostat publication, Norman Baker: To ask the Secretary of State for “Key figures on Europe 2009 edition”contains a selection Transport what recent representations his Department of key transport statistics including estimates of rail has received from train operating companies on the travel by country. It can be found on the Eurostat financial viability of extant rail franchises. [274389] website at Paul Clark: The Department for Transport has regular http://epp.eurostat.ec.europa.eu/cache/ITY_OFFPUB/KS-EI- 08-001/EN/KS-EI-08-001-EN.PDF discussions with all train operators who have franchise contracts with the Government as part of our ongoing monitoring system. Railways: Fares Mr. Graham Stuart: To ask the Secretary of State for Helen Southworth: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport how many train services on the East Coast Transport if he will take steps to establish a Main Line have been cancelled by National Express nationally-available frequent user railcard. [272849] since it assumed the franchise; how many were cancelled by GNER in each of the last five years of its Paul Clark: It is not our intention to establish a existence; and if he will make a statement. [275033] nationally available frequent user railcard. Any new railcard offering discounts, would need to be revenue Paul Clark: The following table shows the number of generative for the industry as otherwise, under the cancellations.

Franchisee Reporting period Full cancellations

GNER 1 April 2003 to 31 March 2004 661 1 April 2004 to 31 March 2005 559 1 April 2005 to 31 March 2006 546 1 April 2006 to 31 March 2007 805 1 April 2007 to 8 December 2007 763

NXEC 9 December 2007 to 31 March 2008 234 1 April 2008 to 31 March 2009 625

In the last five years of its existence, GNER cancelled Jim Fitzpatrick: The information requested is not an average of 55 trains per month. Since taking over the held centrally. East Coast franchise, National Express East Coast (NXEC) Virgin Trains have cancelled an average of 51 trains per month. This is against a backdrop of an increased number of services. Norman Baker: To ask the Secretary of State for Having established themselves in the franchise, NXEC Transport what topics were raised in the discussions his have significantly improved performance. Department has had with Virgin Trains in the last six Since the start of the NXEC franchise, the PPM months. [274390] Moving Annual Average (MAA) has risen from 81.2 per cent. to 86.9 per cent. In the last four weeks, period Paul Clark: In the last six months, Department for ending 31 March 2009, NXEC cancelled 37 trains and Transport officials met Virgin West Coast every four achieved a record PPM of 91.9 per cent. weeks to review the financial, operational and contractual performance of the franchise. In addition, Ministers and senior officials from the Department held separate Roads: Accidents meetings with Virgin West Coast to discuss implementation of the December 2008 timetable and subsequent performance issues. Mr. Frank Field: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport pursuant to the answer of 8 May 2009, Official Report, columns 488-89W, on roads: accidents, ENVIRONMENT, FOOD AND RURAL AFFAIRS how many drivers of each type of vehicle involved in Agriculture incidents causing cyclists’ deaths in the last five years had (a) aUKand(b) a non-UK driving licence. Mr. Drew: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, [276214] Food and Rural Affairs how many (a) rural farms and 1131W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1132W

(b) smallholdings each local authority holds; and how information regarding the number of smallholdings many have been vacant for longer than (i) three and (ii) that are vacant or the duration of vacancies, and it six months. [275804] would be for individual local authorities to provide these details. Jane Kennedy: The annual report to Parliament on smallholdings in England provides details of the numbers The latest published annual report is the 57th Report of statutory smallholdings held by local authorities for the period 1 April 2006 to 31 March 2007, which is analysed according to size of holding. This information available in the Library of the House and can also be is set out in the following table. DEFRA does not hold seen on the DEFRA website.

Analysis of smallholdings by size at 31 March 2007 Number of holdings County/unitary authority 0 to 20 ha 20 to 40 ha Over 40 ha Total

Bedfordshire 83 30 25 138 Berkshire West — 2 1 3 Bournemouth 5 1 1 7 Brighton and Hove 24 4 23 51 Buckinghamshire 35 17 14 66 Cambridgeshire 137 67 140 344 Cheshire 58 51 28 137 City of York 2 — 2 4 Cornwall 10 51 51 112 Cumbria 6 8 — 14 Devon 6 32 53 91 Dorset 6 28 32 66 Durham 1 2 12 15 East Riding of Yorkshire 65 54 17 136 East Sussex — 1 1 2 Essex 8 3 — 11 Gloucestershire 56 49 31 136 Hampshire 40 8 18 66 Hartlepool — 1 1 2 Herefordshire 4 48 9 61 Hertfordshire 23 18 21 62 Lancashire 2 — — 2 Leicestershire 10 52 20 82 Lincolnshire 120 84 76 280 Medway 2 — 1 3 Milton Keynes 5 2 5 12 Norfolk 116 54 70 240 Northamptonshire 8 5 2 15 North Lincolnshire 17 1 — 18 North Somerset 5 1 5 11 Northumberland 1 — 6 7 North Yorkshire 16 44 18 78 Nottinghamshire 12 6 1 19 Oxfordshire 34 5 2 41 Peterborough 12 1 15 28 Shropshire 25 17 1 43 Slough 1 — — 1 Somerset 17 41 31 89 South Gloucestershire 8 6 4 18 Staffordshire 48 68 19 135 Suffolk 15 20 67 102 Surrey 41 13 6 60 Swindon 4 9 6 19 Thurrock 6 3 2 11 Torbay2—— 2 Warrington 3 2 — 5 Warwickshire 36 19 20 75 West Sussex 14 2 5 21 Wiltshire 22 27 22 71 Worcestershire 96 20 10 126 Total 1,267 977 894 3,138 Note: Extract from the 57th annual report to Parliament on smallholdings in England. 1133W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1134W

Agriculture: Land there is no alternative to issuing a licence (i.e. other methods have been shown to be ineffective or impractical and not just Mrs. Spelman: To ask the Secretary of State for difficult to implement); and Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how many hectares the activity to be licensed is likely to resolve or contribute to of farmland of best and most valued status in England resolving the matter for which it has been issued. have changed to a developed use since 1996-97. [275764] Bob Spink: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how long on average elapsed Mr. Iain Wright: I have been asked to reply. between the end of the badger winter hibernation season Information is not held centrally on the area of and the commencement of approved work to remove farmland of best and most valued status that has changed badgers from unsuitable situations in the last five years. to developed use. The Department’s Land Use Change [275680] Statistics (LUCS) can provide estimates for changes to developed use from all agriculture, in hectares. Huw Irranca-Davies: Badgers do not hibernate as Estimates up to 2006 are available in LUCS Live such but the licensing approach is attuned to sensitive Table 261 periods such as the breeding season. Natural England, http://www.communities.gov.uk/documents/ as the licensing authority, does not however record the planningandbuilding/xls/1133773.xls time elapsed between the end of the badger breeding season and the commencement of licensed action. Animal Welfare Act 2006 Bluetongue Disease: Vaccination Mr. Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs when he expects Mr. Drew: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, to bring forward those provisions of the Animal Welfare Food and Rural Affairs on what date the decision was Act 2006 which are not yet in force; and if he will make made to reduce the cost of bluetongue vaccine to livestock a statement. [273876] holders; and what the reasons for the decision were. [275801] Jane Kennedy: The following provisions of the Animal Welfare Act 2006 have yet to be brought into force: Jane Kennedy: DEFRA announced on 7 May that remaining bluetongue vaccine stocks will be discounted Section 8(3) to (6) on recordings of animal fights; by 50 per cent. Schedule 3 in so far as it relates to the repeal of Section 2 of the Pet Animals Act 1951 (which makes it an offence to sell a pet in Reduced uptake during 2009 may leave the national the street); herd and flock vulnerable to further incursions of BTV-8. Schedule 4 in so far as it relates to the repeal of Section 2 of the The Government hold unused stocks which are reaching Pet Animals Act 1951 and the repeal of Sections 37 to 39 (which their expiry dates, leaving the tax payer with a potential provides that Ministers may make orders relating to the transport liability of £3.3 million if unsold. and export of animals) and paragraph 8 of Schedule 5 (Consequential The decision to cut the price of Government-owned Amendments) of the Animal Health Act 1981. vaccine has not been taken lightly. The situation is now There is no timetable in place for the commencement very different to early 2008, when Government-owned of these provisions. vaccine was the only product available to protect livestock from BTV-8. Government-owned surplus is now competing Animals: Clones against vaccines available on the open market, and the pricing is extremely competitive. There is also a need to Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for remove Government-owned stock from the supply chain Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how many (a) to allow the market place to operate as normally as cloned animals and (b) offspring of cloned animals possible. there are in England. [275939] A number of options were investigated and after careful consideration with industry and veterinary Jane Kennedy: All cloning of animals for research, stakeholders on the Bluetongue Core Group, we decided medical or agricultural purposes in the UK must be that dropping the price of the vaccine was the best approved by the Home Office under the strict controls approach in order to mitigate financial losses to the of the Animals (Scientific Procedures) Act 1986. taxpayer and reduce vaccine wastage. This information is not collated by DEFRA. Bovine Tuberculosis Badgers Mr. Drew: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, Bob Spink: To ask the Secretary of State for Food and Rural Affairs what research he has (a) Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what criteria are commissioned and (b) evaluated on the transmission of used to assess applications for removal licences in bovine tuberculosis to (i) pigs and (ii) domestic animals respect of badgers. [275441] from wildlife. [275802]

Huw Irranca-Davies: The Protection of Badgers Act Jane Kennedy: DEFRA has not commissioned any 1992 includes provision for licences to be issued for research into the spread of bovine TB from wildlife to specific listed purposes. Licences are issued only where pigs and other domestic animals. However, DEFRA it is demonstrated that three conditions are met: has been funding passive surveillance in domestic and a licence is required (i.e. badgers or their setts are causing or zoo animal species for several years. This consists of a likely to cause a serious problem or are preventing legitimate free post-mortem and culture service for suspect cases operations); of TB provided by the Veterinary Laboratories Agency. 1135W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1136W

The principal species affected by bovine TB in Great The control of endemic diseases such as mastitis, that Britain are cattle and badgers. While small numbers of mainly affect the health and productivity of individual companion animal species and many wild animal species cattle herds, are primarily the responsibility of the have been shown to be infected with bovine TB, most owner and his veterinary surgeon. Industry milk recording are spillover hosts. There is some indirect evidence of organisations provide recording through monitoring of transmission from spillover hosts though it is uncertain somatic cell counts in milk samples, which gives an how often this is occurring. indication of the presence of mastitis when somatic cell TB is not normally considered to be particularly counts are elevated. DairyCo is the relevant levy-funded contagious amongst pigs or to spread easily from pigs industry body with responsibility for promotion of the to other animals. In most cases, the disease is self-limiting dairy industry and they keep national data on milk and no extensive TB control measures are required. We recording results. are, however, likely to continue to observe sporadic incidents of porcine TB due to M. bovis on farms where Departmental ICT pigs and cattle are co-located and in outdoor breeding- fattening units in the south-west of England and west John Thurso: To ask the Secretary of State for midlands. Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what steps he has taken to reduce the level of carbon dioxide emissions Even in areas where TB in cattle and badgers is quite arising from the operation of ICT systems in his common, not all badgers or family groups will be Department under the Greening Government ICT Strategy. infected. Even in areas of high TB incidence in cattle and badgers, TB in domestic animals is rare. [273559] Cattle: Mastitis Jane Kennedy: I refer the hon. Member to my earlier reply given to the hon. Member for Cardiff Central Mr. Roger Williams: To ask the Secretary of State for (Jenny Willott) on 11 May 2009, Official Report, column Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what estimate he 506W. has made of the cost of mastitis in dairy cattle to the dairy industry in each of the last three years; how many Domestic Waste: Waste Disposal cases of mastitis there were in each such year; and if he will make a statement. [274925] Mrs. Spelman: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what assessment Jane Kennedy: Mastitis is not a notifiable disease has been made of the effect on the management of hence reporting of mastitis diagnoses is voluntary. The bio-waste in the European Union on household waste levels of endemic diseases, such as mastitis in the cattle collections in England of implementation of the population of Great Britain (GB) are monitored through proposals in the European Commission’s Green Paper. the DEFRA-funded Veterinary Laboratories Agency’s [275763] (VLA) Endemic Disease Surveillance Programme. This is performed by analysis of test results from clinical Jane Kennedy: The European Commission’s Green diagnostic samples (usually milk samples in the case of Paper explores a wide range of options in relation to the mastitis cases) submitted by veterinary surgeons to the management of bio-waste in the EU, but contains no VLA regional laboratories and to the Scottish Agricultural firm proposals. Therefore the Government have made College (SAC) disease surveillance centres for investigation. no assessment. The VLA surveillance provides information on the The Commission will undertake a formal impact causes of mastitis and their trends. The relative proportions analysis of possible policy or legislative proposals later of GB mastitis diagnoses attributed to a specific pathogen this year. The Government do not expect any firm are monitored—results for 2008 are shown in the following proposals before 2010. table. The proportions of infection were similar for recent years. Charles Hendry: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs pursuant to the Percentage answer of 29 April 2009, Official Report, column 1302W, on domestic waste: waste disposal, what the volume of Staphylococcus aureus 15 waste for recycling collected from doorsteps was as a Streptococcus uberis 23 proportion of the total volume of waste collected from Streptococcus dysgalactiae 6 doorsteps in each local authority area in the latest Streptococcus agalactiae 1 period for which information is available. [276113] Escherichia coli 18 Other organism(s) 20 Jane Kennedy: A table showing waste collected for No microbial growth 5 recycling and reuse from kerbsides as a percentage of Sample contamination 12 total household waste collected as part of the ordinary Source: waste collection service has been placed in the house GB Surveillance Cattle Diseases Quarterly Report October to December Library. The table provides figures for each English 2008. local authority for the financial year 2007-08. The data available shows the mastitis pathogens isolated as a result of veterinarians submitting samples to these Floods: Property Development government laboratories and therefore do not provide an unbiased or comprehensive estimate of the occurrence Bob Spink: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, of the condition in GB. The VLA is not contracted to Food and Rural Affairs what data the Environment determine the cost of mastitis to the dairy industry and Agency obtains about proposed developments to assess cost cannot be determined from this data. the implications of flood risk. [275475] 1137W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1138W

Huw Irranca-Davies: The Environment Agency is a Jane Kennedy: We have not received any recent consultee in the planning process. The data the Environment representations on the introduction of value added tax Agency receives about proposed development from local on non-fresh food products and have made no assessment planning authorities includes its location and nature of the effect of introducing such a tax on food or the and assessments of flood risk. This should demonstrate retail price index. that the type of development is appropriate for that location and will be safe from flooding over its lifetime, Food: Waste Disposal while not increasing flood risk to others. Bob Spink: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs if he will commission research Fly Tipping into the amount of food waste used in ways other than being sent to landfill; and if he will make a statement. Mrs. Spelman: To ask the Secretary of State for [275854] Environment, Food and Rural Affairs pursuant to the answer to the hon. Member for Romford of 20 April Jane Kennedy: WRAP will commission a new survey 2009, Official Report, column 99W, on fly-tipping, if he that will aim to capture the amount of the UK’s food will place in the Library a copy of the CD-ROM being waste currently going through in-vessel composting and distributed to local authorities. [275777] anaerobic digestion facilities. The six-month survey will start at the end of 2009 and is currently planned to end Jane Kennedy: The CD-ROM has not yet been distributed in early 2010. to local authorities, as some additions are currently being made to the content. A copy will be placed in the Recycling Library as soon as it is published, which will be shortly. Bob Spink: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, Joan Ryan: To ask the Secretary of State for Food and Rural Affairs if he will commission research Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (1) how many into the effectiveness of local authorities’ recycling schemes; incidents of fly-tipping were reported in each local and if he will make a statement. [275449] authority area in London in each of the last five years for which figures are available; [275989] Jane Kennedy: Neither DEFRA nor the Waste and Resources Action Programme plans to commission any (2) how many enforcement actions relating to research into the effectiveness of local authorities’ recycling fly-tipping have been taken in each local authority area schemes. in London in each of the last five years for which figures are available; [275990] Sheep: Lameness (3) how many prosecutions for fly-tipping offences in each local authority area in London have been brought in each of the last five years for which figures are Mr. Roger Williams: To ask the Secretary of State for available. [275991] Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what funding his Department has provided for research into lameness in sheep in each of the last three years; and if he will Jane Kennedy: I am placing information in the Library make a statement. [274926] of the House on the number of incidents of fly-tipping, the number of prosecutions taken against fly-tippers Jane Kennedy: DEFRA recognises the severe effect and the number of other enforcement actions relating on farmers of lameness in sheep and has produced an to the prevention of fly-tipping reported as being taken advisory booklet on its control. Over the past three in each local authority in London in each of the last years DEFRA has provided funding for two research four years. Data on fly-tipping in 2008-09 will be published projects on this subject with a total expenditure of: later this year. 2006-07: £196,879 Other enforcement actions that can be taken against 2007-08: £69,891 suspected fly-tippers and to prevent incidents are investigations, warning letters, statutory notices, fixed 2008-09: £17,477. penalty notices, duty of care inspections, stop and One of the two projects was carried out jointly with searches, formal cautions and injunctions. From 2009-10, the Scottish Executive and industry, and the level of data will also be collected on the number of vehicles expenditure referred to above represents the DEFRA seized from those suspected of involvement in fly-tipping. contribution only. The Biotechnology and Biological Sciences Research Council has also funded work on this topic. Food: VAT Waste and Resources Action Programme Miss McIntosh: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what recent (a) Mrs. Spelman: To ask the Secretary of State for representations he has received on and (b) assessment Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how much the he has made of the effect of the introduction of value Waste and Resources Action Programme (WRAP) has added tax on non-fresh food products in shops on (i) paid to the Association of Cities and Regions for Recycling food prices and (ii) the retail prices index; and if he will and Sustainable Resource Management since WRAP’s make a statement. [273130] establishment. [275762] 1139W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1140W

Jane Kennedy: The only payment the Waste and Mr. Dai Davies: To ask the Leader of the House into Resources Action Programme has made to the Association which budget monies paid back to the Fees Office by of Cities and Regions for Recycling and Sustainable hon. Members relating to their expenses and Resource Management is a membership fee of £1,125. allowances claims are paid. [276304]

Water Supply Chris Bryant: All repayments will be credited to the House of Commons: Members Estimate. Norman Baker: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what discussions he has had with South East Water on (a) its plans to NORTHERN IRELAND reduce leakage and (b) its proposal for a reservoir to increase water capacity. [276302] Civil Service Agencies: Employment

Huw Irranca-Davies: Ofwat sets the water companies Dr. Alasdair McDonnell: To ask the Secretary of targets to reduce their leakage to the Economic Level of State for Northern Ireland what procedures his Department Leakage (ELL), the level of leakage at which it would has in place to monitor compliance by its agencies with cost more for a water company to further reduce its procedures on employment matters stipulated by the leakage than to produce water from an alternative source. Civil Service Handbook; and how many cases of (a) South East Water has met its leakage targets since 2002 unfair dismissal and (b) suspension have been upheld and is currently operating at the ELL. Since 1997, total against the YouthJustice Agency by employment tribunals leakage has been reduced by 30 per cent. in South East in each of the last three years. [273981] Water’s area of supply. The Secretary of State will shortly be making a Paul Goggins: There are personnel service agreements decision on how preparation of the water resource between the various agencies and personnel services management plan, which includes proposals for a reservoir division which set out the agreed working arrangements near Ringmer, should proceed. Ministers have not met on personnel matters. In addition all recommendations directly with South East Water to discuss its plan, for dismissal must be submitted to the establishment although officials, especially at the Environment Agency, officer, DFP, who has responsibility for termination of have done so. employment. There have been no cases of (a) unfair dismissal or (b) suspension upheld against the Youth Justice Agency by employment tribunals in any of the last three years. LEADER OF THE HOUSE Departmental Complaints Members: Allowances Bob Spink: To ask the Secretary of State for Northern John Mann: To ask the Leader of the House how Ireland what procedure his Department follows for many current hon. Members have redesignated their dealing with complaints received (a) by e-mail, (b) by main home for the purposes of the additional costs post, (c) by telephone and (d) via his Department’s allowance on three or more occasions. [276044] website. [274519]

Chris Bryant: It is not possible to provide this information Paul Goggins: The Northern Ireland Office’s complaints without going through each individual Member’s paper procedure is fully documented on the website at: records as the information as requested is not held http://www.nio.gov.uk/index/complaints.htm electronically and nomination forms, indicating where a The procedure covers complaints by telephone or in main and second home are located, were only required writing by letter or e-mail. from 2003 onwards. The facility to make a complaint via the website is The answer could therefore be provided only at not available. disproportionate cost. Departmental Pay John Mann: To ask the Leader of the House how many hon. Members have redesignated their main home Mr. Philip Hammond: To ask the Secretary of State for the purposes of the additional costs allowance since for Northern Ireland how much (a) his Department 3 July 2008. [276056] and (b) its agencies paid in end-of-year performance bonuses to (i) all staff and (ii) senior Civil Service staff Chris Bryant: 10 hon. Members have redesignated in 2008-09; and how many such payments were made. which of their homes is their main and which is their [275249] second home since 3 July 2008. Paul Goggins: Non-consolidated performance payments John Mann: To ask the Leader of the House how for Northern Ireland Office senior civil servants (SCS) many hon. Members submitted claims for reimbursement are distributed in line with Cabinet Office guidance. The of mortgage payments on homes outside London under size of the consolidated performance pot is based on the additional costs allowance in the last 12 months. recommendations of the independent senior salaries [276057] review body. In 2008, 42 members of the SCS received end of year performance payment totalling £371,200 Chris Bryant: 134 Members currently claim costs for which is 8.6 per cent. of the pay bill. In line with current homes that are outside London. Of these, 95 have economic conditions the SCS non-consolidated claimed reimbursement of mortgage interest payments. performance payment pot for 2008-09 has been frozen. 1141W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1142W

Non-consolidated performance payments for staff operations on the Government Estate targets are met below the SCS have been awarded to 20 per cent. of and that its sustainable procurement action plan is staff who are considered to meet the criteria for an implemented. He reports to the Parliamentary Under- award. In 2008, 367 staff received an end year performance Secretary for the Cabinet Office on his work. payment totalling £292,675 which is 0.54 per cent. of The Chief Executive of OGC (Nigel Smith) is the the pay bill. Awards to be made in respect of 2008-09 civil servant responsible for all other aspects of Central remain at 0.54 per cent. and are funded within existing Government procurement (including the promotion of pay bill controls, have to be earned each year against social and economic elements of sustainable development). pre-determined targets and as such do not add to future He reports to the Exchequer Secretary to the Treasury. pay bill costs. The award of performance payments help Within central Government Departments, from 2008-09 drive high performance. all Permanent Secretaries’ responsibility for improving Departmental Training sustainability has been highlighted in their personal objectives. Bob Spink: To ask the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland how much his Department has spent on IT training for its staff in each of the last five years. SCOTLAND [274224] Departmental Complaints Mr. Woodward: The following table shows expenditure on IT training for its staff by the Northern Ireland Office, excluding its agencies and Executive NDPBs, in Bob Spink: To ask the Secretary of State for Scotland each of the last five years: what procedure his Department follows for dealing with complaints received (a) by e-mail, (b) by post, IT training (£000) (c) by telephone and (d) via his Department’s website. [274518] 2004-05 30 2005-06 98 Ann McKechin: Complaints to the Scotland Office, 2006-07 113 where they cannot be resolved immediately, whether 2007-08 113 face-to-face or on the telephone or in writing, are 2008-09 1— allocated to a senior member of staff. Their responsibility 1 Not yet available is to investigate and provide a full reply in writing within 10 days of receipt of the complaint. Where it proves impossible to provide a full reply within 10 days, PRIME MINISTER an interim reply is sent explaining the need for more time and indicating when the full reply will be sent. Departmental Responsibilities Details of the complaints procedure will shortly be posted on the Scotland Office’s internet site, which is Mr. Kidney: To ask the Prime Minister which (a) currently in the process of being updated. Minister and (b) civil servant has cross-departmental responsibility for the promotion of sustainable Departmental Drinking Water development in respect of public sector procurement policy. [272304] Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for Scotland how much his Department has spent on Angela Eagle: I have been asked to reply. bottled water in each of the last five years. [275700] There are three pillars of sustainable development: environmental; social; and economic. Ann McKechin: The Scotland Office spent the following The Parliamentary Under-Secretary for the Cabinet on bottled water, for water coolers in its premises in Office (Mr. Watson) has responsibility for the promotion London and Edinburgh: of the environmental elements of sustainable development in departments’ procurement activities and the operation Cost (£) of their estates. 2003-04 2,382 I, as Exchequer Secretary to the Treasury, have 2004-05 2,418 responsibility for all other aspects of Central Government 2005-06 1,879 procurement policy, including the promotion of the social and economic elements of sustainable development 2006-07 2,451 in departments’ procurement activities. 2007-08 2,880 The Secretary of State for the Environment (Hilary These figures do not include any bottles of water that Benn) is responsible for policy on sustainable development may have been supplied for ministerial hospitality events, in Government and sustainable products. He is also as they would have been subsumed within suppliers’ responsible for the sustainability policy underpinning overall invoices and not recorded separately. Government’s sustainable procurement commitments, with input from procurement experts in the Office of Departmental Furniture Government Commerce and other relevant organisations. The Chief Sustainability and Operating Officer (William Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for Jordan) is the civil servant responsible for working with Scotland how much his Department spent on furniture Departments to ensure that the Government’s sustainable in each of the last five years. [273748] 1143W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1144W

Ann McKechin: The combined Scotland Office and Ann McKechin: The Government have been leading Office of the Advocate-General expenditure on furniture work to review the working arrangements with the for departmental buildings in the last five years is as devolved Administrations. We are close to finalising an follows: updated version of the memorandum of understanding which governs the relationship between the UK Cost (£) Government and the three devolved administrations. 2003-04 4,454 Departmental Stationery 2004-05 25,096 2005-06 16,995 Sarah Teather: To ask the Secretary of State for 2006-07 0 Scotland how much his Department has spent on branded 2007-08 2,384 stationery and gifts for (a) internal and (b) external promotional use in each of the last five years. [273771] Departmental Internet Ann McKechin: The Scotland Office has incurred no Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for costs on branded stationery and gifts for internal or Scotland how much his Department has spent on the external promotional use in the last five years. maintenance of its website in each year since 1997. Departmental Training [275701]

Ann McKechin: The Scotland Office only came in to Bob Spink: To ask the Secretary of State for Scotland existence on 1 July 1999. We do not hold a separate how much his Department has spent on IT training for record of the cost of maintaining the Scotland Office its staff in each of the last five years. [274225] website for the period 1999 to 2007. Ann McKechin: The Scotland Office does not hold I refer the hon. Member to the answer given on 19 information in the form requested. The staff in the November 2008, Official Report, column 471W, to the office are on secondment from the Scottish Executive or hon. Member for North-East Hertfordshire (Mr. Heald) the Ministry of Justice, both of whom provide free for the latest period for which figures are available. access to training and development opportunities, including Departmental Older Workers a range of IT training specific to the software used. Industrial Health and Safety Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for Scotland how many staff over the age of (a) 55 and Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for (b) 65 years of age are employed by his Department. Scotland how much his Department has spent on [275694] health and safety training for its staff in each of the last five years. [275693] Ann McKechin: All the staff in the Scotland Office are on secondment from the Scottish Executive or the Ann McKechin: The Scotland Office does not hold Ministry of Justice who hold individual staff personnel information in the form requested. The staff in the records, including details such as dates of birth. The Office are on secondment from the Scottish Executive Office does not maintain a central record of dates of or the Ministry of Justice, both of whom provide free birth of staff. access to training and development opportunities, including Departmental Pay a range of health and safety events. Isle of Lewis Mr. Philip Hammond: To ask the Secretary of State for Scotland how much his Department paid in Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for end-of-year performance bonuses to (a) all staff and Scotland how many visits he has made to the Isle of (b) senior Civil Service staff in 2008-09; and how many Lewis in an official capacity in the last 24 months. such payments were made. [275248] [275696]

Ann McKechin: All staff in the Scotland Office are on Mr. Jim Murphy: My hon. Friend the Member for secondment from the Scottish Executive or the Ministry Glasgow, North the Under-Secretary of State for Scotland, of Justice. Staff may be eligible for end of year performance (Ann McKechin) visited the Isle of Lewis on the 7 and bonuses under their parent Department’s performance 8 May 2009 and I intend to visit next month. management arrangements. The Scotland Office does not itself make the end of year awards and does not Olympic Games 2012 hold information centrally on end of year bonus payments made to its secondees. Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for Scotland what recent discussions he has had with the Departmental Responsibilities First Minister on Scotland’s role in hosting events and facilities associated with the London 2012 Olympic Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for Games. [275698] Scotland what recent assessment he has made of the effectiveness of the operation of the concordats Ann McKechin: My right hon. Friend has not had between the Government and the Scottish Executive. any recent discussions with the First Minister. Earlier [273475] this month I met the Minister for the Olympics on her 1145W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1146W visit to Glasgow and discussed Scotland’s role in hosting The specific mission of the Afghanistan Group within events, during our visit at Scotstoun Leisure Centre and the wider directorate is to help Afghanistan achieve National Badminton Centre, which has been listed as stability, security, prosperity, to the benefit of the Afghan one of the 30 facilities in Scotland as potential pre-Games people, the UK and the world community. training camps. Conflict Prevention Sheep Mr. Moore: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for and Commonwealth Affairs pursuant to the written Scotland how many sheep farms in Scotland he has ministerial statement of 25 March 2009, Official Report, visited in an official capacity in the last 12 months. columns 17-19WS, on conflict resources 2009-10, under [275703] the 2007 Comprehensive Spending Review, what the original planned total allocation was for (a) South Mr. Jim Murphy: I have not visited a sheep farm in Asia, including Afghanistan, (b) Africa, (c) Europe Scotland in my official capacity. and (d) the Middle East; and if he will make a statement. Whisky [267724]

Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for Bill Rammell: The UK’s total available conflict resource Scotland what recent discussions he has had at EU for FY 2009-10 (leaving aside the cost of UK military level on the future prospects for the whisky industry. operations in Afghanistan and Iraq) is £627 million, [275692] compared with the original planned total allocation of £556 million. Mr. Jim Murphy: DEFRA Ministers represent the As set out in the written ministerial statement of 25 UK Government in EU discussions on the whisky March 2009, Official Report, column 17WS, £456 million industry. I and my officials continue to have regular will be set aside for assessed peacekeeping activity, discussions with DEFRA and with the Scotch Whisky leaving £171 million to fund all conflict prevention, Association on issues affecting the Scotch Whisky industry. stabilisation and discretionary peacekeeping activity. As part of my recent trade mission to China, I visited Individual country/regional allocations were not set the Edrington Group HQ in Shanghai and made out in the comprehensive spending review. These were representations to the Chinese Government on the agreed after an annual tri-departmental (Department importance of their taking steps to deal with counterfeit for International Development, Foreign and Scotch Whisky. Commonwealth Office and Ministry of Defence) review Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for of planned activity across all three funds. Scotland how many whisky distilleries in Scotland he has visited in an official capacity in the last 12 months. Departmental Air Conditioning [275695] Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr. Jim Murphy: My predecessor, the right hon. Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs how much has Member for Kilmarnock and Loudoun (Des Browne) been spent by his Department on carrying out inspections visited the Isle of Arran distillery in August. I met with of air conditioning systems within departmental buildings Gavin Hewitt of the Scotch Whisky Association in in accordance with the Energy Performance of Buildings November and my predecessor met with Mr. Hewitt in (Certificates and Inspections) (England and Wales) September. In December I hosted and spoke at a Scotch Regulations 2007. [272118] Whisky Association reception at the Scotland Office. I will be visiting a distillery with the Scotch Whisky Gillian Merron: The Foreign and Commonwealth Association in June. On a trade mission to China in Office (FCO) has not incurred any expenditure to date March I visited Edrington Group, a Scottish international on carrying out inspections of air conditioning systems premium spirits company. I am currently in discussions within departmental buildings in accordance with the with Diageo and will be visiting one of their distilleries Energy Performance of Buildings Regulations (2007/991). in the near future. A registered inspector was booked to carry out the inspections on 15 May 2009. The costs will be covered in the FCO’s overarching facilities management contract, FOREIGN AND COMMONWEALTH OFFICE at no further cost to the Department.

Afghanistan Departmental Art Works Daniel Kawczynski: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what the mission Daniel Kawczynski: To ask the Secretary of State for statement for employees of his Department in Afghanistan Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs pursuant to the is. [275464] answer of 24 March 2009, Official Report, columns 188-89W, on departmental art works, in which of the Bill Rammell: The Mission of the Foreign and official residences used by his Department each of the Commonwealth Office (FCO) South Asia and Afghanistan works of art mentioned is. [273706] Directorate is to promote the national interests of the UK in South Asia, to contribute to regional stability Gillian Merron: All of the Government art collection and the FCO’s strategic priorities, managing an effective works listed in my previous answer are located in Flat 2, network of posts in the region. Admiralty House. 1147W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1148W

Departmental Billing also looking at how use of ICT will enables savings outside of ICT itself through videoconferencing and Daniel Kawczynski: To ask the Secretary of State for collaboration initiatives that reduce the need for travel. Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what the names This process is integrated into our ICT strategy. and addresses are of each organisation which has Departmental Official Cars supplied goods and services to his Department in 2009. [273703] Daniel Kawczynski: To ask the Secretary of State for Gillian Merron: I refer the hon. Member to the written Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what guidelines answer given to the hon. Member for Rochford and his Department has in place on the procurement of Southend, East (James Duddridge) on 22 October 2008, cars for official use (a) in the UK, (b) in UK Overseas Official Report, column 387W. Territories and (c) at diplomatic posts overseas. [273681] Departmental Dismissal Gillian Merron: Foreign and Commonwealth Office Chris Huhne: To ask the Secretary of State for (FCO) guidance for the procurement of cars for official Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs how many use in the UK, in UK Overseas Territories and at members of staff in his Department and its agencies diplomatic posts overseas is as follows: were dismissed (a) for under-performance and (b) in Purchasing flag vehicles total in each of the last 10 years. [274304] Procurement of vehicles for the FCO is based on achieving value for money and in a manner which conforms to appropriate Gillian Merron: 19 members of Foreign and UK regulations and EU directives. Where they are readily available Commonwealth Office (FCO) staff have been dismissed and represent value for money, we prefer the FCO in the UK and for inefficiency (which covers failure of sick absence British missions abroad to buy British cars. procedures and poor performance) and eight members Currently the FCO’s preferred supplier for flag vehicles is of FCO Services (FCOS) staff have been dismissed for Jaguar for saloon cars, and Land or Range Rover where four under-performance. wheel drive capability is essential. The FCO maintains central contracts with these companies, negotiated to ensure value for 43 members of FCO staff have been dismissed since money. In general flag vehicles will be on a par with the vehicles 2004 and 24 members of FCOS staff have been dismissed allocated to Government Ministers in London. The particular in total over the last 10 years. model allocated to individual posts will reflect local circumstances. Posts which consider that there are overriding reasons not to Departmental Finance purchase flag cars manufactured by our preferred suppliers, have to submit a detailed case for ministerial approval in London. Daniel Kawczynski: To ask the Secretary of State for Purchasing pool vehicles Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what changes to Posts have delegated authority to purchase pool vehicles within services provided by his Department he anticipates agreed costs for vehicle purchase. Decisions taken under this following the efficiency savings outlined in the Budget delegation have to meet value for money criteria and must always Red Book 2009. [273682] include examination of the option to buy suitable vehicles available under the central contracts referred to above. Gillian Merron: The Foreign and Commonwealth Departmental Official Hospitality Office (FCO) will deliver the government target for comprehensive spending review (CSR) value for money savings (CSR07) and the additional savings allocated Bob Spink: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign for 2010-11 whilst continuing to provide a global network and Commonwealth Affairs how much his Department for the Government overseas. We will continue to deliver has spent on (a) conference services and (b) on FCO priorities including our departmental strategic banqueting services in each of the last five years. objectives (DSOs), public service agreements (PSAs) [274505] and the long-term international challenges facing the UK as outlined in the FCO’s Strategic Framework. Gillian Merron: The Foreign and Commonwealth Office (FCO) operates through a network of overseas Departmental ICT posts and directorates in London who may independently contract conference and banqueting services. The John Thurso: To ask the Secretary of State for information requested therefore is not held centrally by Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what steps he has the FCO and to obtain it for the last five years would taken to reduce the level of carbon dioxide emissions incur disproportionate cost. arising from the operation of ICT systems in his Department under the Greening Government ICT Departmental Work Experience Strategy. [273557] Bob Spink: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign Gillian Merron: The Foreign and Commonwealth and Commonwealth Affairs how many work Office (FCO) has taken an active role in the Greening placements his Department offered to (a) school Government Information and Communications Technology pupils, (b) university students and (c) graduates in (ICT) strategy by providing a detailed plan for the each of the last five years. [274485] FCO. The plan includes the baseline of the FCO’s current carbon footprint and a number of initiatives Gillian Merron: Foreign and Commonwealth Office that cover the full life-cycle of our ICT, including how (FCO) Human Resources Directorate offered the following we procure, operate and dispose of equipment. We are numbers of work placements: 1149W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1150W

Felipe Calderón, President, Mexico Number Jan Peter Balkenende, Prime Minister, The Netherlands University School Pupils Students Graduates Dmitry Medvedev, President, Russia HRH King Abdullah bin Abdul Aziz al Saud, Saudi Arabia 2008 10 45 10 Kgalema Motlanthe, President, South Africa 2007 10 35 20 José Luis Rodriguez Zapatero, Prime Minister, Spain 2006 10 34 20 Recep Tayyip Erdogan, Prime Minister, Turkey These figures do not include ad-hoc placements organised Barack Obama, President, United States of America by individual directorates. Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva of Thailand, Chair of ASEAN To collect this information would incur disproportionate Prime Minister Mirek Topolanek of the Czech Republic, EU cost. Presidency Our records before 2006 are incomplete and as a José Manual Barroso, President, European Commission result we do not hold information on the educational Prime Minister Meles Zenawi of Ethiopia, Chair of NEPAD status of individuals to whom we offered work placements Mario Draghi, Head of Financial Stability Forum in 2005 and 2004. From 1999 to 2008, FCO Services, a Dominique Strauss-Kahn, Managing Director, IMF trading fund of the FCO, participated in the Equal Choices Schools Initiative programme. They take 16 children Yousseff Boutros-Ghali, Chair of IMFC annually from ethnic minority backgrounds, who spend Ban Ki-moon, UN Secretary General two days gaining an insight into their work. Robert B. Zoellick, President, World Bank Group All individuals undertaking work experience at FCO Pascal Lammy, Director General, World Trade Organisation. Services were in full-time education. Gifts were only given to heads of delegations and France their spouses. These were hampers of British products. The total amount spent for all gifts was £3,566.23. Mr. Jim Cunningham: To ask the Secretary of State At present we are unable to provide a final figure for for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what recent the costs of the catering for the summit, but hope to be discussions he has had on international security with able to publish those figures in the coming weeks along the French government. [276060] with the total costs of the London summit. Copies of the menus for each official dinner will be Caroline Flint: My right hon. Friend the Foreign placed in the Library of the House. Secretary has regular in-depth discussions with the French Government on international security issues. Germany Most recently, at the General Affairs and External Relations Council of the European Union on 18 May Mr. Jim Cunningham: To ask the Secretary of State 2009, he had a wide ranging discussion with French and for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what recent other European counterparts. discussions he has had on international security with G20: Greater London the German Government. [276059]

Mr. Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign Caroline Flint: My right hon. Friend the Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs who he expects to Secretary has regular in-depth discussions with the participate in the G20 summit in London in March German Government on international security issues. 2009; what gifts each participant will receive; what the Most recently, at the General Affairs and External cost of each such gift is; how much is being spent on Relations Council of the European Union on 18 May (a) catering and (b) catering facilities; if he will place 2009, he had a wide-ranging discussion with German in the Library a copy of the menu for each official and other European counterparts. dinner during the summit; how much is being spent per person at each dinner; and if he will make a statement. Israel: Anniversaries [268581] Mr. Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign Gillian Merron: All of my right hon. Friend the and Commonwealth Affairs to what events held in Prime Minister’s counterparts who were invited participated Israel to commemorate the 100th anniversary of the in the G20 summit in London on 2 April 2009. These founding of Tel Aviv HM Ambassador to Israel he has were as follows: been invited; what such invitations the Ambassador Cristina Fernandez de Kirchner, President, Argentina has (a) accepted and (b) declined; and if he will make Kevin Rudd, Prime Minister, Australia a statement. [275616] Luiz Inácio Lula da Silva, President, Brazil Stephen Harper, Prime Minister, Canada Bill Rammell: Our ambassador has received several Hu Jintao, President, China invitations to attend events relating to the 100th anniversary Nicolas Sarkozy, President, France of Tel Aviv. So far he has been able to attend the opening of “The British Season”, a specially created Angela Merkel, Chancellor, Germany programme of film and music events by the British Manmohan Singh, Prime Minister, India Council designed to mark the anniversary; a reception Susilo Bambang, President, Indonesia in the Sarona gardens organised by Tel Aviv Municipality; Silvio Berlusconi, Prime Minister, Italy and the dedication of a school for children with neurological Taro Aso, Prime Minister, Japan difficulties built with the assistance of the UK Friends Lee Myung-Bak, President, Republic of Korea of the Tel Aviv Foundation. 1151W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1152W

Mr. Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign Pakistan: Politics and Government and Commonwealth Affairs to what events held in (a) the UK and (b) Israel to commemorate the 61st Mr. Ancram: To ask the Secretary of State for anniversary of the founding of the State of Israel he Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what recent has been invited; what such invitations he has (i) discussions he has had with the US Administration on accepted and (ii) declined; and if he will make a the military and political situation in Pakistan. [273319] statement. [275617] Bill Rammell: My right hon. Friend the Foreign Bill Rammell: My right hon. Friend the Foreign Secretary last discussed the situation in Pakistan with Secretary accepted an invitation to deliver a speech on 5 US Secretary of State Hillary Clinton on 12 May 2009. May 2009 at an event hosted by the Israeli embassy in We shared our concerns about the threat violent extremism London to commemorate the 61st anniversary of the poses to the Pakistani state. Foreign and Commonwealth founding of the State of Israel. Office officials also continue to hold frequent discussions about the situation in Pakistan with a wide range of US Mr. Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign officials. and Commonwealth Affairs to what events held in (a) the UK and (b) Israel to commemorate the 61st Somalia: Piracy anniversary of the founding of the State of Israel the Prime Minister has been invited; what such invitations Mr. Hague: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign he has (i) accepted and (ii) declined; and if he will make and Commonwealth Affairs what reports he has a statement. [275619] received on the effect of payments of ransom money following pirate attacks in the Gulf of Aden on the Bill Rammell: My right hon. Friend the Prime Minister activities of (a) Islamic militants in Somalia and (b) did not attend any events commemorating the 61st terrorist groups in the region; and if he will make a anniversary of the founding of the State of Israel. statement. [270993] However, my right hon. Friend the Foreign Secretary attended an event hosted by the Israeli embassy in David Miliband: We are aware that the majority of London on 5 May 2009 where he delivered a speech. pirates operating off the coast of Somalia organise their activities in the Puntland region. However, we do not Middle East: Armed Conflict have the capabilities within Somalia to monitor the movement of ransom monies around Somalia. Mr. Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what reports he has Mr. Gregory Campbell: To ask the Secretary of State received of the alleged take-over by Hamas of a ward for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what recent in Shifa Hospital, Gaza, and its use by Hamas as a discussions he has had with the Government of command and control centre; and if he will make a Somalia on the number of piracy incidents in the Gulf statement. [275526] of Aden in recent months. [273144]

Bill Rammell: We are aware of reports of Hamas Gillian Merron: Piracy has been discussed in many representatives operating out of Shifa hospital during meetings with the Transitional Federal Government the recent conflict. We condemn any use of hospitals for (TFG) of Somalia. In addition to regular meetings non-medical purposes that could endanger the patients between officials at our high commission in Nairobi and staff. The UK continues to regard Hamas as a and representatives of the TFG, my noble Friends the terrorist organisation and to call for it to renounce all Minister for Africa, Asia and the UN (The Lord Malloch- violence, recognise Israel and adhere to previous agreements Brown), the Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State at with the Palestinians. the Home Office, (The Lord West of Spithead), and my hon. Friend the Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State Middle East: Diplomatic Relations for International Development (Mr. Lewis) all discussed piracy with the Somali Deputy Prime Minister, Sharif Mr. Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign Hassan Sheikh Adan, during his visit to the UK on 20 and Commonwealth Affairs what recent discussions April 2009. Sharif Hassan confirmed the TFG is committed (a) he, (b) Ministers and (c) officials in his to helping tackle this issue. Department have had with Arab governments on (i) economic and (ii) diplomatic relations between Arab Tim Farron: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign governments and the State of Israel; and if he will and Commonwealth Affairs what assessment his make a statement. [275527] Department has made of the effects of poverty in the region on numbers of acts of piracy in the Gulf of Bill Rammell: We believe that the Arab peace initiative Aden. [274324] (API) provides the best path towards achieving normal economic and diplomatic relations between Arab Gillian Merron [holding answer 11 May 2009]: Piracy Governments and the state of Israel. The API offers full in the Gulf of Aden and off the Coast of Somalia is a normalisation of relations with Israel in exchange for symptom of the ongoing instability and lack of economic withdrawal from occupied land. We frequently emphasise opportunities in the horn of Africa. Although the security the importance of the API, including in discussions situation makes it difficult to access the region to conduct with Israel and Arab Governments; my right hon. Friend a full assessment, it is likely that poverty in rural the Foreign Secretary did so in his UN Security Council communities in Puntland is one of several contributing intervention on 11 May 2009. factors. 1153W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1154W

The UK is taking a leading role in the international Gillian Merron: The Foreign and Commonwealth response to piracy by offering the Operation HQ and Office (FCO) provides each recognised trade union Commander for the EU’s Counter Piracy operation. We representative with their own furnished office, networked also Chair a working group looking to enhance regional computer with e-mail/internet access and a telephone. co-operation and co-ordination. This working group is Trade union representatives have shared access to also looking to highlight regional capacity-building photocopiers, duplicating and printing services, file storage requirements that will aim to address the longer term and fax machines. The FCO meets day-to-day running causes of piracy. costs within the rules of public expenditure set out in Somalia: Politics and Government FCO guidance. Such costs include: rents; building maintenance; stationery; office and IT equipment; telephone charges; official travel; security; corporate overheads; Tim Farron: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign capital charges and depreciation. and Commonwealth Affairs what assessment his Department has made of the ability of the transitional Based on full economic cost figures (calculated in line government in Somalia to provide for its citizens. with HM Treasury requirements) for the 2008-09 financial [274323] year, the notional annual value of this provision for each recognised trade union is: Gillian Merron [holding answer 11 May 2009]: The Transitional Federal Government have stated that its £ priorities are reconciliation, security and the development Public and Commercial Services 80,900 of governmental institutions. Given Somalia’s recent Union (2 officers) history, it faces considerable challenges. However, it is The Diplomatic Service Association 40,450 receiving international support and has produced an (DSA) (1 officer) initial three-month budget, which harnesses port revenue Prospect (1 officer) 40,450 to enable the re-establishment of key Ministries in Mogadishu to take its priorities forward. In addition to trade union representatives, the FCO provides four full-time support posts in London for Tibet: Human Rights Trade Union Secretariat (TUS) work. These posts are held by members of FCO staff who are elected to their Harry Cohen: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign respective roles (with the exception of the TUS registry and Commonwealth Affairs pursuant to the answer of post which is filled using the normal FCO appointment 23 April 2009, Official Report, columns 807-08W, on process). Based on FY2008-09 figures, the total notional Tibet: human rights, what reports he has received on value of the Trade Union Secretariat posts is £161,800. the compliance with international standards of the These arrangements comply with the facilities agreement trials of individuals arrested in connection with the between the Foreign and Commonwealth Office and disturbances in Tibet in March 2008. [272629] the trade unions which undertakes to: Bill Rammell: We have received a number of reports “provide such resources as are reasonably necessary to enable from non-governmental organisations (NGOs) stating Trade Union representatives to carry out their duties efficiently.” that the trials of those connected with the disturbances UN World Conference against Racism in Tibet in March 2008 were not compliant with international standards, and that the evidence against Mr. Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign the individuals concerned was unsound and the convictions and Commonwealth Affairs what reports he has therefore unsafe. We have consistently expressed our received on the number of persons who walked out concern at the need for proper due process for all those during the speech of the Iranian President at the UN detained, and our belief that any trials should be conducted Durban 2 anti-racism conference; and if he will make a justly, fairly and transparently. The fact that independent statement. [272179] observers were not allowed at these trials means that we have been unable to verify that the human rights of the Gillian Merron: The Government are aware that all defendants were respected, and that the trials were free EU delegations who attended the Durban review from political interference. This, together with the reports conference, and the representative of St. Kitts and from NGOs, does give us real cause for concern, as does Nevis, left the hall when the Iranian President made the verdict of the death penalty, to which the UK is comments deemed to be offensive. A number of non- opposed in principle. As a consequence, and working governmental organisation delegates also left the hall. closely with our EU counterparts, we are urging the Many delegates, including the UK’s Permanent Chinese authorities not to carry out the sentences imposed Representative to the United Nations in Geneva, on those convicted. I made these points in similar terms subsequently condemned the Iranian President’s remarks. in my written response to Free Tibet and the Tibet Society at the beginning of May. My right hon. Friend the Foreign Secretary issued a ministerial statement on the Durban review conference Trade Unions on 28 April 2009, Official Report, columns 41-42WS. Mr. Maude: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign Zimbabwe: Politics and Government and Commonwealth Affairs pursuant to the answer of 12 March 2009, Official Report, column 634W, on trade Mr. Gregory Campbell: To ask the Secretary of State unions, what office facilities his Department provides for Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs what plans he for the exclusive use of each recognised trade union; has to have discussions with the President of South and what the notional annual value of such provision is. Africa on the political and human rights situation in [271932] Zimbabwe. [273147] 1155W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1156W

Gillian Merron: My right hon. Friend the Foreign Identity Cards Secretary currently has no planned meetings with President elect Zuma to discuss Zimbabwe, although Zimbabwe 14. Mr. Baron: To ask the Secretary of State for the will certainly be among the issues which Ministers will Home Department what recent assessment she has wish to discuss with the incoming South African made of progress on the introduction of identity cards. Administration over the coming weeks. South Africa [275724] remains key to the power-sharing agreement, brokered by the Southern African Development Community. 23. Mr. Evennett: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department what her most recent assessment is of progress on the introduction of HOME DEPARTMENT identity cards. [275733] Gurkhas Mr. Woolas: Progress is well on track with identity cards for foreign nationals being introduced from November 12. Danny Alexander: To ask the Secretary of State 2008 and identity cards being rolled out from autumn for the Home Department what recent steps her 2009 to British citizens resident in Manchester and also Department has taken to reformulate its policy on to airside workers at Manchester and London City settlement rights for Gurkhas. [275722] airports. Mr. Woolas: Following the debate on 29 April, the date for determining outstanding applications was brought Front-line Policing forward to the end of May. Based on this work, and recognising the strong feeling 15. Mr. Bone: To ask the Secretary of State for the of the House, we will come forward with proposals for Home Department what her most recent estimate is of the next stage of our reform of the rules before the the proportion of police officers’ time spent on summer recess. front-line policing. [275725] 17. Martin Salter: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr. Coaker: We estimate that at the end of March the Home Department what assessment she has made 2008, 64.9 per cent. of police officer time was spent on of the effect on the settlement rights of Gurkhas of the front-line duties. This information is no longer collected implementation of the points-based immigration by the Home Office as part of work to reduce bureaucracy. system. [275727] Having delivered the funding for record numbers in the work force it is important that the police service Mr. Woolas: The settlement rights of Gurkhas are make the best possible use of their work force’s time. entirely separate from the routes to enter the United The effective deployment of officers and staff will enable Kingdom through the points based system. them to be in the right place at the right time to deliver It will therefore have no effect on the implementation for the public when they most need the police’s help. of the points based immigration system. DNA Database Nazi War Crimes

13. Mr. Heathcoat-Amory: To ask the Secretary of 16. Mark Pritchard: To ask the Secretary of State for State for the Home Department what assessment she the Home Department what estimate she has made of has made of the compatibility of her proposal on the number of UK residents who are suspected of retention of the DNA profiles of persons arrested but having committed war crimes under the Nazi regime. not convicted with the jurisprudence of the European [275726] Court of Human Rights. [275723] Mr. Woolas: The Home Office does not collate figures Mr. Coaker: Our proposals, set out in the public on the total numbers in the UK who are suspected of consultation paper “Keeping the Right People on the these crimes. DNA database” published on 7 May 2009, were drawn Any allegations received concerning crimes under the up against the background of the judgment of the Nazi regime are referred to the Metropolitan police for European Court of Human Rights in the S and Marper. investigation. They aim to implement the judgment in a way which continues to protect the public while safeguarding the Antisocial Behaviour: Swindon rights of the individual. Mr. David Jones: To ask the Secretary of State for the Anne Snelgrove: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department what estimate she has made of the Home Department what steps her Department is number of crimes detected using DNA profiles held on taking to tackle antisocial behaviour in Swindon. the national DNA database in the last 12 months. [275728] [275729] Mr. Alan Campbell: We have given practitioners the Mr. Alan Campbell: In 2007-08, 33,034 crimes were tools and powers they need to do their job effectively. detected in which a DNA match was available or played When I visited Swindon recently I met the local partnership a part in solving the crime. They included 83 homicides including police and the local authority to both support and 184 rapes. Figures for the 2008-09 financial year and challenge them to do more to make communities will be available shortly. across Wiltshire safer. 1157W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1158W

Human Trafficking Mr. Alan Campbell: The information is as follows: (a) The Advisory Council on the Misuse of Drugs (ACMD), 20. Mr. Steen: To ask the Secretary of State for the as an independent advisory body sets it own programme of work Home Department what recent assessment she has responding to both to requests for advice from the Home Office made of progress in implementing the provisions of the and other Government Departments and conducts work of its own choosing. However, the ACMD has indicated to the Home Council of Europe convention on action against Department that in the coming 12 months they will be conducting trafficking in human beings. [275730] work in the areas of ‘legal highs’ (including ‘Spice’), cognitive enhancers, poly-drug use, treatment effectiveness and development Mr. Alan Campbell: I am pleased to say that the of an early warning system to provide timely information to convention entered into force in the UK on 1 April this Ministers of emerging/new drugs and associated risks. year. A Home Office-led multi agency task force has (b) The ACMD Technical Committee supports the work of been established to monitor its implementation and will the ACMD. Therefore, the Home Department understand that its report later this year. primary work will be supporting the working groups to address the areas identified above. The work of the ACMD Technical Public Confidence: Police Committee will also include responses to priority requests for advice from Government Departments and considering issues of 21. Siobhain McDonagh: To ask the Secretary of their own volition. State for the Home Department what assessment she has made of the effectiveness of steps taken by police Antisocial Behaviour Orders: Wales forces to increase public confidence in the police. [275731] Mrs. Gillan: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department how many antisocial behaviour Mr. Coaker: Through the single confidence target, we orders have been (a) imposed and (b) breached in expect the police, working with partners, to significantly each police force area in Wales in each year since they increase public confidence that the issues that matter were introduced. [270664] locally are being addressed. We will regularly monitor the performance of all forces and authorities against this target. HMIC will also consider the steps forces Mr. Alan Campbell: The latest available information have taken to increase confidence. on the number of ASBOs issued and breached in Wales goes up to 31 December 2006. The available information Advisory Council on the Misuse of Drugs is shown in the following tables. The first table shows the number of orders issued (by year and by area) and Jim Dobbin: To ask the Secretary of State for the the second the number of orders breached in each year Home Department what the planned programme of by area. It is important to note, however, that an ASBO work is of the (a) Advisory Council on the Misuse of can be issued in one Criminal Justice System (CJS) area Drugs (ACMD) and (b) Technical Committee of the and breached in another. Therefore the two tables are ACMD for the next 12 months. [274642] not directly comparable.

Table 1P: Number of antisocial behaviour orders issued at all courts, as reported to the Home Office by the Court Service, by CJS area and year, April 1999 to December 2006 April 1999 to June to CJS area Total issued May 2000 December 2000 2001 2002 2003 2004

Dyfed Powys 43 — ———128 Gwent121——22827 North Wales 255 — 1 — 7 15 42 South Wales 201 — 1 4 3 29 46 Total Wales 620 — 2 6 12 64 123

2005 2006 April January to July to October to January April July to October to CJS area to March June September December Total to March to June September December Total

Dyfed 1 2 5 7 15 6 1 — 1 8 Powys Gwent 7 14 7 5 33 15 9 10 15 49 North 23 31 29 20 103 25 17 20 25 87 Wales South Wales 15 15 18 16 64 19 16 10 9 54 Total Wales 46 62 59 48 215 65 43 40 50 198 Notes: 1. Previously issued data have been revised. 2. Every effort is made to ensure that the figures presented are accurate and complete. However, it is important to note that these data have been extracted from large administrative data systems generated by the courts. As a consequence, care should be taken to ensure data collection processes and their inevitable limitations are taken into account when those data are used. 3. Prepared by OCJR. 1159W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1160W

Table 7: ASBOs proven in court to have been breached for the first time within the periods shown1 by CJS area2 from 1 June 2000 to 31 December 2006 CJS area 2000-023 2003 2004 2005 6 2006 Total

Dyfed Powys 05561026 Gwent 3 216241762 North Wales 3 7 12 50 51 123 South Wales 4 11 12 29 30 86 Total Wales 10 25 45 109 108 297 1 ASBOs may be breached more than once and in more than one year. In this table ASBOs are counted once only within the period when they were first breached. 2 ASBOs may be issued in one area and breached in another. Breaches are counted in this table by area of issue. 3 From 1 June 2000. Note: Every effort is made to ensure that the figures presented are accurate and complete. However, it is important to note that these data have been extracted from large administrative data systems generated by the courts and police forces. As a consequence, care should be taken to ensure data collection processes and their inevitable limitations are taken into account when those data are used. Source: OCJR Court Proceedings Database.

Asylum Crime and Disorder Partnerships

Greg Mulholland: To ask the Secretary of State for Alun Michael: To ask the Secretary of State for the the Home Department what steps her Department has Home Department what recent discussions she has had taken to increase the speed with which asylum with police commanders on the effectiveness of local applications are handled. [275719] crime and disorder partnerships. [275710]

Mr. Woolas: We are succeeding in our goal of handling Mr. Coaker: Significant reductions in crime since applications faster than ever before. 1997 have been delivered by local agencies working 60 per cent. of new cases were concluded within six together in Crime and Disorder Reduction Partnerships months by the end of last year. We are committed to and Community Safety Partnerships. Last week the conclude 90 per cent. of new asylum cases within six Home Secretary met local partners from across the months by 2011. country, including the ACPO partnership lead, to discuss the role of effective partnerships in increasing public Carnage UK confidence. Crime Prevention Mrs. Betty Williams: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department what recent representations Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for the she has received on the activities of Carnage UK. Home Department what expenditure under what [274635] budgetary headings was incurred by her Department in relation to the Crime Prevention Summit held on Mr. Alan Campbell: The Home Office has received no 4 February 2009; and what topics were discussed at the formal representations on the activities of Carnage summit. [270564] UK. Mr. Alan Campbell: The Home Office incurred £328.76 Community Relations from the programme budget in relation to the Real Help in Hard Times crime prevention summit on 4 February. Paul Rowen: To ask the Secretary of State for the The summit discussed how the Government and partners Home Department what recent discussions she has had from the statutory, voluntary and private sectors can with the Secretary of State for Communities and Local best work together to stay on the front foot to keep Government on (a) the long-term aims and (b) the burglary down and reassure the public in more challenging involvement of the Muslim community in the economic circumstances. The actions identified at the implementation of the revised Contest strategy; and if summit were announced as the Securing Homes: Action she will make a statement. [274423] Against Burglary initiative on 7 April.

Mr. Coaker [holding answer 11 May 2009]: Discussions Criminal Records: EU Nationals were held with all Government Departments involved in countering terrorism. The long-term aim of the Mr. Sarwar: To ask the Secretary of State for the Contest strategy is to reduce the risk to the UK and its Home Department what protocols her Department has interests overseas from international terrorism, so that established with each EU member state on monitoring people can go about their lives freely and with confidence. the movement of known criminals. [273617] All communities continue to play a role in helping to ensure the success of the strategy by rejecting violent Mr. Alan Campbell: There is no agreement between extremism and challenging it. Strong and empowered all member states of the European Union to monitor communities are better equipped to effectively reject the the movements of known criminals within the EU but ideology of violent extremism, isolate apologists for the UK does contribute to the Europol Information terrorism and provide support to vulnerable individuals System (EIS), a database where each member state can and institutions. input details of any known criminal that it wishes to 1161W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1162W share with other European States. If a person is wanted Profiles of under 10s removed from the NDNAD since 16 December in any member state that country can also issue a 2008, broken down by police force area European arrest warrant which will ensure that if the Force Total profiles deleted person comes to the notice of the law enforcement Avon and Somerset 3 authorities in any member state they can be arrested British Transport 1 and returned to the country that issued the European Cambridgeshire 2 arrest warrant. In addition, SOCA has been appointed Cheshire 1 to operate the UK Sirene Bureau which will have access to the European wide Schengen Information System. City of London Police 1 This contains details of all wanted persons throughout Derbyshire 6 the European Union. It is planned that the Sirene Devon and Cornwall 1 Bureau will go live in 2010. Dyfed-Powys 1 Essex 1 The Interpol Notice system also provides a monitoring Greater Manchester Police 6 facility. Green Notices are used to provide warnings and criminal intelligence about persons who have committed Gwent 4 criminal offences, and are likely to repeat those offences Hampshire 4 in other countries. A Green Notice is often issued by the Humberside 2 UK for known travelling sex offenders. The Notice Kent 7 system is not limited to Europe and 187 states have Lancashire 2 access to it. Metropolitan Police 11 The United Kingdom has a Memorandum of North Wales 1 Understanding with Ireland to ensure that information North Yorkshire 1 is shared between the two countries regarding sex offenders Northamptonshire 1 travelling between the two. Northumbria 4 Nottinghamshire 2 Cybercrime South Wales Constabulary 1 South Yorkshire 11 James Brokenshire: To ask the Secretary of State for Staffordshire Police 1 the Home Department what further steps are required Suffolk 4 for ratification by the UK of the European Convention Surrey 2 on Cybercrime; and when she expects ratification to be Sussex 5 completed. [274071] Warwickshire Police 1 West Mercia 2 Mr. Alan Campbell: The Government are committed West Midlands 1 to ratifying the Council of Europe cybercrime convention. West Yorkshire 8 We are currently working through the formal UK process Total profiles removed by England and 98 of ratification, during which we will lay the required Wales forces since 16 December 2008 explanatory memorandum before Parliament to obtain approval for ratification. If Parliament agrees to ratification, Gamma Butyrolactone the Foreign and Commonwealth Office will then commence the formal ratification process with the Council of Europe. Mr. Evans: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department (1) what estimate she has made of The Government hope to complete the parliamentary the volume of sales of liquid gamma butyrolactone for process by the summer recess and the Council of Europe (a) illicit and (b) non-industrial use in each of the last process within two months of that. three years; [272887] DNA: Databases (2) what the legal status of liquid gamma butyrolactone in the UK is; and if she will make a statement; [272888] Jenny Willott: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department how many and what proportion of (3) what advice she received from the Advisory profiles of children aged under 10 years-old have been Council on the Misuse of Drugs on the classification of removed from the national DNA database (a) in total liquid gamma butyrolactone in (a) 2006, (b) 2007, (c) and (b) in each police force area; and if she will make 2008 and (d) 2009; and if she will make a statement. a statement. [271104] [272889]

Mr. Alan Campbell: On 16 December 2008 the Home Mr. Alan Campbell [holding answer 7 May 2009]: Secretary announced that all DNA profiles belonging Gamma butyrolactone (GBL) is a precursor chemical. to children aged under 10 would be removed from the It is not a controlled drug under the Misuse of Drugs National DNA Database (NDNAD). All such profiles Act 1971. loaded by England and Wales forces have been removed The Advisory Council on the Misuse of Drugs (ACMD) and the profiles of under 10s are no longer retained on provided advice on the classification of GBL in its 2008 the NDNAD. report ‘GBL & 1,4-BD: Assessment of Risk to the The following table shows the number of profiles of Individual and Communities in the UK’. This advice children aged under 10 removed from the NDNAD can be found at: since 16 December 2008, broken down by police force http://drugs.homeoffice.gov.uk/publication-search/acmd/ area. report-on-gbl1?view=Binary 1163W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1164W

This advice followed the ACMD’s earlier 2007 report Police: Bureaucracy on ‘Drug Facilitated Sexual Assault’ in which the ACMD undertook to provide further advice on GBL This report Chris Grayling: To ask the Secretary of State for the can be found at: Home Department (1) what the current status is of the http://drugs.homeoffice.gov.uk/publicationsearch/acmd/ information reduction pilots in Surrey, Staffordshire, drugfacilitatedsexualassault/ACMDDFSA.pdf?view=Binary West Midlands and Leicestershire police forces; what No advice on GBL was received from the ACMD in assessment has been made of the time each pilot will either 2006 or in 2009 to date. take to achieve its targets; what analysis has been The Government will shortly be publishing a three-month undertaken of the resultant savings in police officer public consultation which brings forward options to time; and what plans she has for further roll-out of control GBL and its like precursor chemical, 1,4-butanediol. such schemes; [272986] Consultation will look to elicit a better understanding (2) whether the target date set for national roll out of of the scale and scope of the availability for misuse of the shortened crime recording and stop and account GBL and 1,4- butanediol in the UK. procedures has been met. [272987]

Immigration Jacqui Smith: The proportionate crime recording pilots are now complete, and the National Policing Improvement Mr. Byers: To ask the Secretary of State for the Agency (NPIA) expects to complete their evaluation Home Department when she expects to make a next month. The interim findings have highlighted the decision on the immigration case of Mrs Mohinder potential benefits, with Staffordshire police reporting a Kaur. [271298] reduction of up to 80 per cent. of the time it takes to record 80 per cent. of incidents. Mr. Woolas [holding answer 27 April 2009]: The UK I announced on 22 December 2008 that, following Border Agency is currently seeking further information the pilots, all forces in England and Wales should now in order to be able to decide this case. be working to replicate these significant savings by streamlining their crime recording processes, and we are Members: Correspondence supporting forces in their efforts to do so. On 1 January 2009 PACE Code A was amended in Sir Gerald Kaufman: To ask the Secretary of State for respect of recording Stop and Account, to remove the the Home Department (1) when she plans to reply to requirement to record data other than on ethnicity. the letter of 22 December 2008 from the right hon. Member for Manchester, Gorton with regard to Folake Police: Complaints Surat Odetunde; [253871] (2) when she plans to reply to the letter of 22 December Mr. Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for the 2008 from the right hon. Member for Manchester, Home Department (1) if she will bring forward proposals Gorton, on Folake Surat Odetunde; [271023] to require individual police forces to (a) accept, (b) (3) when she plans to reply to the letter from the right respond to and (c) implement in full recommendations hon. Member for Manchester, Gorton of 22 December made by the Independent Police Complaints Commission 2008, regarding Folake Surat Odetunde. [259873] (IPCC); and what (i) representations she has received from and (ii) discussions she has had with (A) police Jacqui Smith: I wrote to my right hon. Friend on 11 forces, (B) the IPCC and (C) members of the public on May 2009. this issue; [273868] (2) if she will bring forward proposals to monitor the Sir Gerald Kaufman: To ask the Secretary of State for responses of police forces to the findings of the Independent the Home Department when she plans to reply to the Police Complaints Commission (IPCC) which affect letter of 23 March 2009 from the right hon. Member them; what recent discussions she has had with the for Manchester, Gorton with regard to Mrs N. Akhtar. IPCC on this issue; and if she will make a statement; [275150] [273882] (3) if she will bring forward proposals to require the Jacqui Smith: I wrote to my right hon. Friend on 6 Independent Police Complaints Commission to inform April 2009. her Department of the number of recommendations made by the Commission which have been (a) rejected Passports: Overseas Residence and (b) implemented by the police force to which they are addressed; and if she will make a statement; [274052] Chris Grayling: To ask the Secretary of State for the (4) how long on average police authorities have taken Home Department what the cost is to British nationals to make a response to recommendations of the resident overseas of renewing their British passports. Independent Police Complaints Commission (IPCC) in each of the last three years; what recent discussions she [270236] has had with (a) the IPCC and (b) police authorities on this issue; and if she will make a statement. [273883] Gillian Merron: I have been asked to reply. The information requested is as follows: Mr. Coaker: The information sought is not currently Adult passport: £124 collected or held by the Home Office or the Independent Child passport: £79. Police Complaints Commission (IPCC). 1165W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1166W

The Public Accounts Committee’s 15th report on the Retail Trade: Crime Independent Police Complaints Commission published on 31 March 2009, recommended that the Home Office Mr. Dunne: To ask the Secretary of State for the should clarify who is responsible for monitoring the Home Department what progress her Department has implementation of IPCC recommendations. We are made towards the introduction of a specific measurement working with the IPCC to take the recommendation of commercial (a) robbery and (b) burglary. [274956] forward. Police: Standards Mr. Alan Campbell [holding answer 12 May 2009]: The Commercial Victimisation Survey (CVS) has been Chris Grayling: To ask the Secretary of State for the conducted by the Home Office on two occasions—once Home Department what practical steps are being taken in 1994 and again in 2002. The Home Office have to align the performance targets of police forces and recently commissioned a study to consider and make the Crown Prosecution Service; and what timetable has recommendations about the coverage and methodology of a further survey of crime against commercial victims. been set for such changes. [273032] This will report later in the year and inform decisions Jacqui Smith: The Home Office no longer sets top about the scope of another survey. down numerical targets for the police (with the exception of a single target to raise public confidence) and local Serious Organised Crime Agency: Manpower target setting is therefore a matter for local criminal justice boards (LCJBs). The Police and the Crown Damian Green: To ask the Secretary of State for the Prosecution Service (CPS), along with other partners, Home Department how many staff of the Serious and are members of LCJBs which co-ordinate criminal justice Organised Crime Agency are based overseas. [274004] planning and activity at the local level. LCJBs are required to agree local targets to improve their efficiency Mr. Alan Campbell: As of 30 April 2009, there were and effectiveness in bringing crime, in particular the 140 staff employed by the Serious Organised Crime most serious acquisitive, sexual and violent offences to Agency based overseas. justice. Powers of Entry

Mrs. Spelman: To ask the Secretary of State for the DEFENCE Home Department whether Lord West’s review of powers of entry will extend to reviewing the existing Afghanistan: Peacekeeping Operations powers of entry of bailiffs. [271281] Ms Abbott: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence Mr. Alan Campbell: The review covers powers of what steps his Department is taking to ensure that entry provided for by statute and aims to establish a detention facilities run by international military forces framework of powers to ensure that the right balance is in Afghanistan meet the standards required under achieved between the statutory investigative and international law in the treatment of women and enforcement functions of relevant organisations and children. [275861] safeguards and protections for the public. Existing powers of entry and associated provisions and safeguards can Mr. Bob Ainsworth: The Ministry of Defence can be found at: only answer this question in respect of UK run facilities. http://police.homeoffice.gov.uk/operational-policing/powers- pace-codes/powers-of-entry-review/ The UK takes its human rights obligations very seriously and has policy and procedures in place regarding The review is expected to report in autumn 2009. the standards within military detention facilities. All Details on the role of bailiffs can be found at: our facilities are regularly inspected to ensure that they http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/MoneyTaxAndBenefits/ meet our obligations under international law. The ICRC ManagingDebt/DebtsAndArrears/DG_10034289 and the Afghan Independent Human Rights Commission Racially Aggravated Offences: Young People have access to all the UK’s operational detention facilities in Afghanistan. Keith Vaz: To ask the Secretary of State for the When any females or juveniles are detained they are Home Department (1) how many racist incidents separated from male prisoners and/or adult prisoners, involving persons under the age of 18 years were unless they are housed with family members. All persons, reported to the police in each of the last five years; especially those under 18 are only detained if absolutely [273575] essential and in Afghanistan, detainees are held for a maximum of 96 hours before being released or transferred (2) how many reports police forces received of racist to the Afghan authorities. incidents in schools in each of the last five years. [273576] Armed Forces: Aviation Mr. Alan Campbell: The information requested is not collected centrally. The Ministry of Justice collect and Dr. Fox: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence publish statistics of racist incidents by police force area. how many charter flights to theatres of operation have However, no information is available on the age of taken place in each year since 2003, broken down by either the victim or the alleged offender or on the (a) location, (b) type of aircraft and (c) reason for location of the incident. flight. [275054] 1167W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1168W

Mr. Bob Ainsworth: Charter flights to theatres of Op Herrick Afghanistan operation in Iraq and Afghanistan since 2003 are: Type of Aircraft used Flights Op Telic IRAQ 2006 A300, AN124, B737, B757, DC8, IL76 113 Type of Aircraft used Flights 2007 B737,A300,A310,A320, AN124, B757, 329 B767, DC10, BL76 2003 AN124,A330, B737, B747, B757, B767, 518 20082 A300,A319,A321,A330, AN124, B737, 516 DCIO, DC8, EL76, LI0-11, MD11 B747, B757, B767, DC10,DC8,DL76 2004 AN124,A330,B747, B757, DC8 89 A300, A321, A330, AN124, B737, B747, 407 2005 AN124, A330, B747, DC8 25 B757, B767, DC8, IL76 2006 A300, AN124, B747, B767, DC10, IL76 212 1 No charter recorded for Op Herrick 2007 A300, A310, A330, AN124, B747, B767, 786 2 1 January to 30 April DC10, IL76, B737, MD11 All flights are for the carriage of either passengers or 2008 A300, DC8, AN124, B747, B767, DC10, 737 IL76 freight or a combination of both. 20091 A300, A310, AN124, B757, B767, DC8 186 1 1 January to 30 April Dr. Fox: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence Op Herrick Afghanistan how much his Department has spent on charter flights Type of Aircraft used Flights to each destination in each theatre of operation in each year since 2003. [275055] 2003 1— 1— 2004 1— 1— Mr. Bob Ainsworth: The spend on charter flights to 2005 1— 1— Iraq and Afghanistan since 2003 is:

£ Theatre of operation 2003-04 2004-05 2005-06 2006-07 2007-08 2008-09

Iraq 41,350 19,569 17,983 40,186 67,079 53,551 Afghanistan 971 21,555 1,998 29,113 62,594 109,921

Armed Forces: Labour Turnover Armed Forces: Manpower

Mr. Jenkin: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence Dr. Fox: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence (1) what the average length of service of personnel opting what percentage of force elements have reported (a) no for voluntary outflow from the armed forces was in the serious weaknesses, (b) no critical weaknesses and (c) latest period for which figures are available. [275181] no serious or critical weaknesses against required peacetime readiness levels in each of the last four quarters; [275014] Mr. Bob Ainsworth: Information on the length of service of armed forces personnel from 2006-07 onwards (2) what percentage of force elements have reported is currently unavailable since the introduction of the no serious or critical weaknesses against the ability to joint personnel administration system. deploy, sustain and recover force elements at the most demanding level of the Defence Planning Assumptions The following table provides the average length of for contingent operations in each of the last four service (in years) of personnel who voluntary outflowed quarters; [275015] from the trained UK Regular Forces in the financial (3) what percentage of force elements have reported year 2005-06. (a) no serious weaknesses, (b) no critical weaknesses and (c) no serious or critical weaknesses against the Years ability to move from peacetime readiness to immediate Service Officers Other ranks readiness for deployment on operations in each of the All Services 15.0 9.4 last four quarters. [275016] Navy 16.1 10.1 Army 13.2 7.9 Mr. Bob Ainsworth: We have previously sought to RAF 18.5 12.6 measure our ability to bring force elements from their peacetime readiness levels up to the level required to UK Regular Forces excludes Gurkhas, full-time reserve deploy on potential contingent operations at the most personnel and mobilised reservists. demanding scale of effort, known as force generation, and to deploy them on such operations, sustain them there and recover them to their home base thereafter. Mr. Jenkin: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence This system has been predicated on the assumption what percentage of servicemen and women leaving the that, for the most part, the armed forces will be operating armed forces in each of the last seven years had combat below the concurrency level envisaged in defence planning experience. [275182] assumptions and mat they should therefore be working to maintain their capacity to deploy on potential contingent Mr. Bob Ainsworth: Information on servicemen and operations. The longer we have been operating above women leaving the armed forces who had combat experience that concurrency level, the more theoretical this has is not held centrally and could be provided only at become. By definition we have consistently, over several disproportionate cost. years, been successfully generating, deploying, sustaining 1169W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1170W and recovering force elements above the long term Mr. Kevan Jones: A discharge medical assessment is concurrency levels assumed in our long term planning. undertaken 90 days prior to discharge. This detailed The metrics we have been using to measure and report examination is undertaken by a doctor and the results our hypothetical capability have consequently provided are recorded on the individual’s F-Med-1 form. This little or no meaningful management information. We form contains a specific assessment of the mental capacity are therefore working to develop a more useful way of and emotional stability of the individual. A reassessment measuring and reporting performance in this area for is carried out seven days prior to discharge to confirm the time when the operational tempo has reduced and the record or reflect any further changes. the forces structure is recuperated to the point where it A summary of each individual’s medical history while is appropriate once more to seek to measure our contingent in the armed forces, including the results of the discharge as opposed to our current capability. medical, is recorded on an F-Med-133 form which is Statistical reporting against the graduated readiness given to the individual to pass on to their civilian GP. profiles is published in the MOD public service agreement The F-Med-133 also contains information on how the reports. The most recent report, setting out the Q3 GP can gain access to the individual’s complete service 2008-09 position, was published on the MOD website medical records if required. on 5 May 2009 and can be found at the following link: Armed Forces: Pay http://www.mod.uk/DefenceInternet/AboutDefence/ CorporatePublications/FinancialReports/ModPublicService AgreementQuarterReportsapril2008ToMarch2011.htm Daniel Kawczynski: To ask the Secretary of State for The critical and serious weakness scores, as published, Defence what levels of Operational Allowance are for each of the last four quarters are provided in the payable to troops in (a) Afghanistan, (b) Iraq and (c) following table. each other country in which Operational Allowance is payable. [275455] Percentage No serious or Mr. Bob Ainsworth: The operational allowance is No serious No critical critical paid at the same rate for all qualifying locations. The weakness weakness weakness allowance amounts to £2,380 for a six month operational tour, equating to £13.08 per day. Operational allowance Q4 2007-08 55 92 49 is paid at a flat rate, recognising that all service personnel Q1 2008-09 48 92 39 serving in the most challenging and dangerous operational Q2 2008-09 49 92 42 circumstances are facing a broadly similar risk. The Q3 2008-09 50 93 43 operational allowance is paid to all service personnel (regular, mobilised reserves and those on full-time reserve Armed Forces: Mental Health Services service) who are serving in specified operational locations, predominantly Afghanistan, Iraq and Iraqi territorial waters. Mr. Jenkin: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence (1) what research he has (a) commissioned and (b) Entitlement is also extended to those undertaking evaluated on the relationship between experience of flying sorties over or into Iraq and Afghanistan. combat and evidence of psychological wounding; Armoured Fighting Vehicles [275184] (2) what research he has (a) commissioned and (b) Ann Winterton: To ask the Secretary of State for evaluated on the relationship between levels of Defence what the cost has been of upgrades to the psychological wounding of service personnel and the Panther Command and Liaison vehicle in the last number of contacts with the enemy. [275185] 12 months. [276177]

Mr. Kevan Jones: The Department fully supports the Mr. Quentin Davies: The Panther Command and need for high quality research which examines the Liaison vehicle has been modified under an urgent psychological health of personnel engaged on operational operational requirement to a theatre entry standard duties. The King’s Centre for Military Health Research appropriate for deployment to operations in Afghanistan, (KCMHR) and Academic Centre for Defence Mental at a cost of approximately £20 million. Health website Ascension Island www.kcl.ac.uk/kcmhr contains links to a wide range of individual research Mr. Lancaster: To ask the Secretary of State for papers. The 2006 KCMHR 10-year report provides a Defence what the estimated value is of each of his particularly useful summary of research during the first Department’s properties on Ascension Island; and 10 years since its foundation in 1996. These studies when the last valuation was carried out. [276174] examine the psychological health of Armed Forces personnel and veterans including intensity of operations, Mr. Kevan Jones: The Ministry of Defence has some but there is no specific study of psychological health 200 individual property assets on Ascension Island correlated with number of contacts. recorded on its asset registers ranging from stores to accommodation blocks. Valuations are carried out on a Mr. Jenkin: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence rolling five-year basis based on the depreciated replacement if he will introduce psychometric screening as part of cost of the assets. The last formal valuation of the the service discharge medical examinations for all assets was carried out in 2005-06 and the next will take military personnel. [276063] place during 2010-11. 1171W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1172W

The assets on Ascension Island valued at more than Mr. Kevan Jones: The Department keeps all of its £1 million in 2005-06 were disclosed as part of the 2007 business under regular review. As a result, a wide range National Asset Register which is available on the HM of reviews are in hand at any given time. Information on Treasury website, with a total value at that time of these is not held centrally and could be provided only at £25.7 million. disproportionate cost.

Clyde Submarine Base Departmental Vehicles

Nick Harvey: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence Nick Harvey: To ask the Secretary of State for when his Department plans to change to Faslane the Defence (1) how many white fleet contract cars his homeport of (a) HMS Trenchant, (b) HMS Talent Department owns; [275228] and (c) HMS Triumph; and when each vessel will have its mid-commission major maintenance period. [275219] (2) how many civilian vehicles owned by his Department are based at each of its estates. [275229] Mr. Quentin Davies: HMS Trenchant, HMS Talent and HMS Triumph will transfer progressively to HM Mr. Quentin Davies: The Ministry of Defence does Naval Base Clyde between 2014 and 2017 upon completion not own any White Fleet contract cars. We do, however, of their mid commission major maintenance periods. have two lease agreements in place for the provision of the majority of non-operational cars (White Fleet Vehicles). Departmental Billing As at 12 May 2009 there were 8,376 cars leased under the UK and British Forces Germany White Fleet contracts. Mr. Philip Hammond: To ask the Secretary of State Under the UK White Fleet contract, the number of for Defence how much (a) his Department and (b) its vehicles (including vans, trailers, minibuses, motorbikes agencies paid in interest to suppliers under the Late and coaches) based at each of the estates in England, Payment of Commercial Debts (Interest) Act 1998 in Scotland and Wales is currently 15,228. The breakdown the last three years for which figures are available. of this information is not held centrally and could be [275205] provided only at disproportionate cost.

Mr. Quentin Davies: Information on interest paid to European Fighter Aircraft suppliers under the Late Payment of Commercial Debts (Interest) Act 1998 is published in the Ministry of Nick Harvey: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence Annual Report and Accounts. Payments made Defence what recent estimate he has made of the in the last three years are provided in the following through-life running cost per aircraft of the Tranche 3 table: Eurofighter in each year of operation. [275270]

£ Mr. Quentin Davies: This matter is currently the 2005-06 14,709 subject of negotiations with our partner nations and 2006-07 8,603 industry. 2007-08 9,956 Ex-servicemen The information contained in the table does not include those interest payments made by the four MOD Mr. Jenkin: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence Trading Funds. This information is summarised as follows. if he will consider the merits of conducting a veterans’ In 2007-08 Defence Science and Technology Laboratory population study analysis similar to that undertaken by (DSTL) made interest payments totalling £15,783. No the US administration following the Vietnam War. interest payments have been recorded for 2005-06 or [276062] 2006-07. The UK Hydrographic Office does not separately Mr. Kevan Jones: The Ministry of Defence has record details of interest paid to suppliers and this commissioned a number of studies into veterans’ issues information could be provided only at disproportionate and we will continue to do so. cost. The Meteorological Office and Defence Support Group Kenya: Piracy have no record of any payments being made to suppliers in the last three years in respect of interest arising under Mr. Hague: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence the Late Payment of Commercial Debts (Interest) Act what seized property has been transferred to the Kenyan 1998. authorities by the EU-led naval force under the Provisions of Transfer of Suspected Pirates and Seized Property Departmental Reviews published the Official Journal of the European Union of 25 March 2009; and if he will make a statement. Mr. Vara: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence [273355] how many (a) review and (b) taskforce projects his Department has commissioned in each of the last five Mr. Bob Ainsworth: Operation Atalanta is an EU led years; what the purpose of each such project is; when operation and the operational detail requested is held each such project (i) began and (ii) was completed; what by the EU Operation Commander for Atalanta, who the cost of each such project was; and if he will make a reports to EU member states sitting in the Political and statement. [275984] Security Committee in Brussels. 1173W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1174W

The EU-led naval force (EUNAVFOR), Operation Number of fuel leaks Atalanta, where practicable, has handed over seized property such as skiffs (small boats) and other pirate 2009 220 related paraphernalia such as ladders, buoys and weapons. Notes: In some cases the skiffs and weaponry have been destroyed 1. Includes one fuel leak reported since the figure given in the written by the detaining ship for navigational and safety of life answer on 22 July 2008,Official Report, columns 1060-1061W. 2 reasons. All of the incidents in which suspected pirates Up until 31 March, the last full month for which validated data are available. have been detained by EUNAVFORare currently being 3 A fuel leak is defined as any leakage of fuel from aircraft couplings, prosecuted by the Kenyan authorities and therefore a pipes or fuel tanks. more specific answer is not possible without jeopardising 4 These figures do not include fuel leaks which are caused by scheduled the court proceedings. maintenance activity, as we disturb the fuel system. In these cases, the leak is both caused and rectified while on the ground. Land Mines Pakistan: Military Aid Nick Harvey: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence how many service personnel have been (a) killed and Mr. Hayes: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence (b) injured as a result of landmine detonation in each how much aid was given to Pakistan for military theatre in each of the last 12 months. [275231] purposes between 1997 and 2008. [273848]

Mr. Bob Ainsworth: I am withholding the information Mr. Bob Ainsworth: The MOD provides military as its disclosure would, or would be likely to prejudice advice and assistance to Pakistan as part of normal the capability, effectiveness or security of the armed security cooperation, as it does with many countries forces. worldwide.

Navy Rosyth Dockyard

Willie Rennie: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence Willie Rennie: To ask the Secretary of State for pursuant to the written ministerial statement of 6 May Defence what assessment his Department has made of 2009, Official Report, columns 16-18WS, on maritime the effect on Rosyth Dockyard of the implementation change programme, when he expects (a) the Strategic of the Maritime Change Programme. [275488] Environmental Assessment and (b) the Submarine Dismantling Project to be completed. [274734] Mr. Bob Ainsworth [holding answer 14 May 2009]: Rosyth dockyard, which is owned and operated by Mr. Quentin Davies: The main element of the strategic Babcock, currently has a strong order book of MOD environmental assessment (SEA) will be completed when work: it is a key location for surface ship upkeep work the formal public consultation has ended and the MOD through the Surface Ship Support Programme and is at has published its response to the consultation findings. the heart of the build programme for the two new This is currently scheduled for spring 2010. Queen Elizabeth Class aircraft carriers. In accordance with statutory guidance, however, the As work on the new aircraft carrier programme at SEA will not have a formal completion date, as monitoring Rosyth increases, it is envisaged that deep maintenance of significant environmental effects will be ongoing surface ship work will be predominately undertaken at throughout the life of the Submarine Dismantling Project Devonport dockyard (which is also owned by Babcock). (SDP). This is to ensure best use of industry wide resources. The SDP is planned to run until circa 2060 when the intermediate level waste from all 27 submarines included Somalia: Piracy in the project has been sent to the proposed National Geological Disposal Facility. Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for Nimrod Aircraft Defence what steps is he taking to protect UK-registered vessels in the Gulf of Aden from pirate attacks. [272958] Dr. Fox: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence how many Nimrod fuel defects have been reported in Mr. Bob Ainsworth: There has been much collaboration each year since 2003. [275010] and co-operation between the UK shipping industry, the military and from across Government. Mr. Bob Ainsworth: We have interpreted ‘fuel defects’ to mean fuel leaks. The number of fuel leaks reported The UK military is working alongside the shipping on the RAF Nimrod fleet since 2006 are stated in the industry to provide safe passage of traffic in the Gulf of following table. Aden. International naval forces are expending significant effort on counter-piracy operations, and are playing a Information on the number of fuel leaks prior to role in protecting vulnerable shipping. For instance, the 2006 is not held centrally and could be provided only at UK-commanded EU naval operation is utilising an disproportionate cost. internationally recognised transit corridor through the Gulf of Aden. All merchant shipping, including Number of fuel leaks UK-registered vessels, are encouraged to use this route. 2006 170 Best practice guidelines have been agreed with industry 2007 1278 bodies on speed, self-protection, and registration with 2008 146 the Maritime Security Centre (Horn of Africa) website. 1175W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1176W

Those ships registered with the website and following Ian Pearson: Under the recapitalisation scheme best practice have been considerably more successful in announced on 8 October 2008, the Government have to evading pirate attacks. date invested a total of £37 billion in Lloyds Banking Moreover, the UK Maritime Trade Office acts as the Group (Lloyds) and the Royal Bank of Scotland Group interface between merchant shipping and the military, (RBS). There will be further investment alongside their and has become the focal point for UK-registered vessels participation in the Asset Protection Scheme. seeking advice and guidance. The Government’s shareholdings in RBS and Lloyds are managed on a commercial basis by UK Financial Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for Investments Ltd (UKFI). UKFI’s objective is to protect Defence what recent discussions has he had with the and create value for the taxpayer as shareholder with US administration on the activities of pirates off the due regard to the maintenance of financial stability, coast of Somalia. [272959] and consistent with HM Treasury’s stated aim that it should not be a permanent investor in UK financial Mr. Bob Ainsworth: We have worked closely with the institutions. US in the Gulf region for many years, and continue to Banks: Iran do so to tackle piracy. The Combined Maritime Force, which conducts maritime security operations, including counter-piracy and counter-terrorism, is commanded Mr. Hague: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer by a US Admiral with a UK Royal Navy deputy. what steps his Department has taken to implement the provisions in UN Security Council Resolution 1747 of In response to the recent increase in pirate activity, 2007 on the prevention of new grants, financial we have engaged with the US along military and diplomatic assistance and concessional loans to the Government channels in order to develop a comprehensive approach, of Iran, other than for humanitarian and as part of an international response. developmental purposes. [270988] We also work closely with the US and other parties through the international Contact Group on Piracy off David Miliband: In line with paragraph seven of UN the Coast of Somalia (CGPCS). As part of this, the UK Security Council Resolution 1747, adopted on 24 March chaired a separate working group on 7-8 May 2009 to 2007, the Government make available no new grants, continue discussions on military co-ordination and financial assistance or concessional loans to the Government capability building in the region. The meeting was attended of Iran. by other members of the CGPCS as well as industry representatives. Banks: Regulation

Mr. Dai Davies: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer what changes he plans to make to the TREASURY arrangements for (a) registration, (b) supervision and (c) accountability of credit rating agencies in light of the Turner Report on the regulatory response to the Adjudicator’s Office global banking crisis. [267591]

Mr. Graham Stuart: To ask the Chancellor of the Ian Pearson: The Government support registration Exchequer how many complaints made to the and supervision of credit rating agencies. The European Adjudicator’s Office were outstanding on 22 April Commission proposed a regulation of credit rating 2009; and if he will make a statement. [271783] agencies in November 2008. Following negotiation the Council of the European Union and the European Mr. Timms: On 27 April 2009 there were 2,029 complaints Parliament both adopted the text of the regulation in yet to be settled. April 2009, as envisaged by the Turner Review. The regulation is expected to enter into force later this Banks: Finance calendar year.

Dr. Cable: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer Mr. Sanders: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer what recent estimate he has made of the administration what plans he has to amend the regulatory regime costs of the Asset Protection Scheme in 2008-09; and if applying to the banking sector following the economic he will make a statement. [268087] downturn. [275555]

Ian Pearson: Figures for the Treasury’s spending in Angela Eagle: As stated in Budget 2009: Building 2008-09 will be available in the Department’s resource Britain’s future, the Government will issue a paper on accounts 2008-09 after the conclusion of the Comptroller renewing financial markets for the long-term before the and Auditor General’s audit. summer recess. This will include proposals to strengthen financial services regulation, and build on the work of The cost of establishing the asset protection scheme the Turner Review as well as action taken at an international will be shared between the banks participating in the level. scheme. Coinage John Mann: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer what provision he has made for the repayment of sums Mr. Amess: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer paid to support UK banks in each of the next six years. how many pound sterling coins he estimates are in [271776] circulation in the United Kingdom. [275608] 1177W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1178W

Ian Pearson: The information requested can be found EU Budget on the Royal Mint’s website at: http://www.royalmint.com/Corporate/facts/circulation.aspx Mr. Hands: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer whether he plans to have discussions with his EU Departmental ICT partners on reassessing the UK’s contributions to the EU budget. [274674] Tim Loughton: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer on how many and what proportion of Ian Pearson: No timetable has yet been set for the computers in his Department malware was detected in commencement of discussions on the next financial perspective. 2008. [275395] The arrangements by which member states finance Angela Eagle: Malware was detected, and safely removed the EC Budget are set out in the European Communities’ from, four of the Treasury’s total of approximately Own Resources Decision. A new Own Resources Decision 1,600 computers during 2008. was agreed in June 2007 and has since been ratified by all member states in accordance with their own Departmental Official Hospitality constitutional requirements. In the UK, ratification was by means of a European Communities (Finance) Bill which was taken through both Houses between 7 November Grant Shapps: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer 2007 and 18 February 2008 receiving Royal Assent on how much has been spent on (a) departmental Christmas 19 February 2008. parties and (b) staff entertainment in the last three years. [243745] Non-domestic Rates Angela Eagle: For information on departmental Christmas parties, I refer the hon. Member to the Justine Greening: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer answer I gave on 21 April 2008, Official Report, column (1) if he will place in the Library a copy of his Department’s 1669W,to the hon. Member for Runnymede and Weybridge analysis of the (a) 2005, (b) 2000, (c) 1995 and (d) (Mr. Hammond). 1990 non-domestic rating lists rateable values by (i) detailed property type by country, (ii) property type and Treasury staff have organised a number of grass (iii) region and property type; [271835] roots events in the period concerned. Those are self-funding and details of costs are not available. (2) if he will place in the Library a copy of his Department’s analysis of the distribution of changes in rateable value by (a) property type and (b) region Departmental Postal Services between the (i) 2005 and 2000, (ii) 2000 and 1995 and (iii) 1995 and 1990 non-domestic rating lists; [271836] Mr. Jenkins: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer (3) if he will place in the Library a copy of the how many items of correspondence his Department Valuation Office Agency’s (VOA) (a) primary description sent by (a) Royal Mail and (b) other commercial code and (b) special category code analysis by (i) delivery services in each of the last five years; and what economic region, (ii) billing authority and (iii) VOA the reasons were for the use of delivery services other group office of the movements in rateable value between than Royal Mail. [264524] the (A) 2000 and 2005, (B) 1995 and 2000 and (C) 1990 and 1995 rating lists. [276110] Angela Eagle: I refer my hon. Friend to the answer that I gave him on 23 July 2007, Official Report, columns Mr. Timms: The analysis and distribution of changes 662-63W. The table provides the figures for subsequent by ratable value by property type for 2005 and 2000 are years. available on the Valuation Office Agency’s website at: http://www.voa.gov.uk/business_rates/DraftListStats/ Number of items sent by Number of items sent by other Royal Mail commercial delivery services index.htm. The 1995 and 1990 information could be provided 20071 86,391 186 only at disproportionate cost. 2008 54,371 470 1 From this year, HM Treasury combined its postal services with the Revenue and Customs: Closures Office of Government Commerce, which moved into the Treasury building in September 2007. Daniel Kawczynski: To ask the Chancellor of the Departmental Training Exchequer (1) which HM Revenue and Customs offices are planned to close under the Workforce Change Mike Penning: To ask the Chancellor of the programme; [273237] Exchequer whether his Department has provided voice (2) which HM Revenue and Customs offices coaching to any of its employees in the last 12 months. originally scheduled for closure under the Workforce [260645] Change programme are now planned to stay open; and for what reasons in each case. [273330] Angela Eagle: The information requested is not available. HM Treasury only holds records centrally of core training Mr. Timms: The aim of HM Revenue and Customs provision, which does not include this type of training. (HMRC) Workforce Change regional review programme Details of other training provided or funded locally was to match its accommodation with its future business could be provided only at disproportionate cost. needs. The following table provides a list of the HMRC 1179W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1180W offices announced for closure under the regional review HMRC offices announced for closure under HMRC’s Workforce programme. Decisions made to close these offices remain Change Regional Review process unchanged. Town Building HMRC has however looked again at the timing of Chichester 6, Southgate the closures of a number of these offices in the light of Chippenham Kilvert House budgetary constraints, and has decided that the vacation Chorley Lingmell House of some offices will not now take place in 2009-10 as Clacton-on-Sea Harlech House originally planned. This does not affect the strategic Coatbridge Muiryhall Street decision to close these buildings, which HMRC aims to Colchester Northgate House complete in 2010-11. Coleraine Mill House Where an office housing an inquiry centre closes, the Cowes Watchhouse inquiry centre services will be retained at or near the Crewe Crewe House current location so face to face services to HMRC’s Darlington Regent House customers will not be affected. Derby St. James House Dewsbury Empire House HMRC offices announced for closure under HMRC’s Workforce Change Regional Review process Doncaster St. Peters House Town Building Doncaster Weston House Dorchester Vespasian House Aberystwyth Crown Buildings Dumbarton Meadowbank Street Accrington Castle House Dumfries Brooms Road Alfreton Horsefair House Dunfermline Merchiston House Alnwick Bondgate Hall Dunoon Auchencraig Altrincham Roberts House Durham Wycliffe House Andover London Street East Dereham Revenue Building Ashford Wellesley Road Edinburgh Argyle House Ashton-under-Lyne Oakglade House Edinburgh Clarendon House Aylesbury Kingfisher House Edinburgh Saughton House Ayr Russell House Edinburgh Spitfire House Ballymena Kilpatrick House Edinburgh York Place Banbridge Bridgwater House Elgin Phoenix House Banbury Crown Building Enniskillen Custom House Bangor Ty Glyn Evesham Lower Leys Barrow in Furness Furness House Falkirk Grahame House Basildon Kelting House Farnham Woolmead House Basildon Regent House Frome Edwin Sims House Bath Royal Mead Gainsborough Crown House Bedford Portman House Galashiels New Reiver House Belfast Olivetree House Glasgow Blythswood House Belfast Windsor House Grangemouth Custom House Bideford North Bank House Grantham Crown House Birkenhead Birchen House Gravesend Stephenson House Bishop Auckland Vinovium House Grays Crown Building Blackpool Mexford House Great Yarmouth Havenbridge House Boston Chantry House Greenock Custom House Brecon Government Buildings Greenock Dalrymple Street Bridgend Tremains Road Grimsby Heritage House Bridgwater Westgate House Halifax Dean Clough Mill Bridlington Crown Building Halifax Southgate House Brierley Hill Capstan House Hamilton Barrack Street Bristol The Pithay Harlow Beaufort House Bristol Woodlands Court Harlow Terminus House Buckie Moray House Hastings Ashdown House Burnley Towneley House Hatfield Gracemead House Burton upon Trent Crown House Haverfordwest Government Buildings Bury Minden House Hawick Crown Building Bury St. Edmunds Triton House Cannock Rogers House Haywards Heath Oaklands Cardiff Portcullis House Hemel Hempstead Lord Alexander House Carmarthen Ty Myrddin Hereford Broadway House Cheadle Boundary House Hertford Sovereign House Cheltenham Inland Revenue House Hexham St. Andrews House Chester Eden House High Wycombe Thame House Chester Norroy House Horsham Exchange House Chesterfield Dents Chambers Horsham Tower Court 1181W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1182W

HMRC offices announced for closure under HMRC’s Workforce HMRC offices announced for closure under HMRC’s Workforce Change Regional Review process Change Regional Review process Town Building Town Building

Hove Martello House Newcastle upon Tyne North Star House Huddersfield Crown House Newcastle upon Tyne Warwick House Huntingdon Chequers Court Newport Crown Building Inverness Longman House Newport IOW 88-91 St. James Street Keighley Worth House Newport IOW Apex Kendal Eskdale House Newry Downshire House Kendal Kentmere House Newton Abbot Sherborne House Kettering Cytringan House Northampton Beaumont House Kettering Montagu Court Northwich Dane House King’s Lynn Custom House Norwich Roseberry Court Lancaster Charter House Nottingham Bowman House Launceston Madford House Nottingham Huntingdon Court Leeds Century House Nuneaton Powell House Leeds Jefferson House Oban Mathieson House Leeds Pennine House Oldham Phoenix House Leek Britannia Chambers Oswestry Plas Ffynon Leicester Attenborough House Oxford Sterling House Leicester Enkalon House Paisley Gilmour House Leigh Boardman House Pembroke Custom House Lewes Medwyn House Penrith Voreda House Lincoln Ceres House Penzance Penlowarth Liverpool Graeme House Perth Water Vennel Liverpool Norwich House Peterborough Ashurst House Liverpool Regian House Peterborough Hereward House Llanelli Crown Building Peterborough Stuart House London (Central) Belgrave Road Peterhead Keith House London (Central) Haymarket House Plymouth Custom House London (Central) New Kings Beam House Plymouth Westpoint London (Central) Thomas Paine House Pontefract Micklegate House London (Central) Towergate Pontypool Ty’r Felin London (Central) Towergate Garage Pontypridd Taff Vale House London (Outer) 3 Brook Street, Kingston upon Preston Cop Lane Thames Prestwick Liberator House London (Outer) Church Hill, Walthamstow Reading Eaton Court London (Outer) Collingwood Business Centre, Reading Eldon Court Tufnell Park Redditch Threadneedle House London (Outer) Gateway House, Finchley Retford Kings Park House London (Outer) Helena House, Sutton Rhyl Llys Anwyl London (Outer) Lyndhurst House, Mill Hill Ripon Athelstan Court London (Outer) Majestic House, Staines Rochdale Newgate House London (Outer) Northside House, Bromley Rothesay King Street London (Outer) Station House, Colindale Rugby Bennfield House London (Outer) Valiant House, Wembley Salford Anchorage 2 Louth Revenue Buildings Salisbury Alexandra House Ludlow Riddings Road Scarborough Albion House Luton Jansel House Scunthorpe Station House Macclesfield Craven House Shipley Crown House Maidenhead Bell Tower House Maidstone Concorde House Shipley Hockney House Manchester Royal Exchange Building Shrewsbury New Mayfield House Mansfield Chaucer House Skipton Cavendish House Margate Capital House Southampton 8 Ogle Road Melton Mowbray Crown House Southampton Portcullis House Middlesbrough Fountain Court Southampton Queen’s Keep Morpeth Back Riggs Southend Dencora Court Motherwell Civic Square Southend Portcullis House Newark Millgate Southport Dukes House Newbury Elizabeth House Spalding Government Buildings Newcastle upon Tyne Aidan House Spalding Holland House Newcastle upon Tyne Cale Cross House St. Albans Beauver House Newcastle upon Tyne Eagle Star House St. Annes Petros House 1183W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1184W

HMRC offices announced for closure under HMRC’s Workforce Tax Avoidance Change Regional Review process Town Building Mr. Meacher: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer Stafford Greyfriars House if he will bring forward legislative proposals to (a) Stirling Spittal Street make illegal the design and promotion of schemes Stockport Wellesley House intended solely or mainly as a vehicle for tax avoidance Stockton Dunedin House and (b) establish penalties for all those involved in the Stratford upon Avon Crown Building design and promotion of such schemes. [275881] Sudbury Newton Road Sunderland Gilbridge House Mr. Timms: Tax avoidance has the potential to damage Sunderland Shackleton House the public finances and the provision of public services Swansea Custom House in the UK. For this reason, HM Revenue and Customs Swindon Spring Gardens (HMRC) monitors tax avoidance closely at all times. Taunton Riverside Chambers Since 1997, the Government have been taking steps Tonbridge Douglas House to tackle avoidance, by reforming the tax system, closing Torquay Tor Hill House loopholes and introducing the disclosure regime. Anti- Truro Pydar House avoidance measures brought in as a result of the disclosure Tunbridge Wells Longford House rules have closed over £11 billion in avoidance opportunities. Tunbridge Wells Union House The disclosure regime ensures that should further avoidance Wakefield Crown House schemes emerge, the Government can quickly take action Washington Cheviot House to protect tax revenues. Washington Weardale House The Government agree that more action is still needed Wellingborough Christchurch House to mitigate the effects of tax avoidance. Budget 2009 Wells Priory Road sets out measures to close down avoidance schemes, Welshpool Dolanog House including principles-based legislation on financial product Weston Super Mare Parkside avoidance, the successful introduction of which could Whitehaven Blencathra House facilitate this approach being applied to other areas, and work to further extend and improve the disclosure Wick Government Buildings regime. These measures raise over £1 billion during the Widnes Kingsway House period 2009-10 to 2011-12, and protect a further £3 Wigan Bridgeman House billion per year of tax receipts by 2010-11. The Government Winchester Cromwell House keep the need for further measures under review. Witham Iceni House Worthing Teville Gate House Mr. Meacher: To ask the Chancellor of the Yeovil Maltravers House Exchequer if he will bring forward legislative proposals York Swinson House for a general anti-tax avoidance provision on the Australian equitable model or a similar model. [275882] Bob Spink: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer how many HM Revenue and Customs offices are Mr. Timms: The Government consulted extensively planned for closure in the next 12 months. [275485] on the possibility of a general anti-avoidance rule in 1998. Based on the outcome of that consultation, we Mr. Timms: HM Revenue and Customs plans to made the decision not to introduce such a rule at that vacate 58 properties during 2009-10, and of these 47 are time, although the situation would be kept under review. offices. It will reduce the size of a further 70 offices by That position is unchanged. relinquishing space that is no longer needed. Tax Collection Royal Bank of Scotland: Finance Mr. Gordon Prentice: To ask the Chancellor of the Daniel Kawczynski: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer on how many occasions HM Revenue and Exchequer how much money the Government has Customs has accepted money from taxpayers other provided to the Royal Bank of Scotland in the last than in response to a demand for payment of tax in the 12 months. [267761] last 12 months. [276101]

Ian Pearson: Following the conversion of the Treasury’s Mr. Timms: The information requested is not available, £5 billion preference shares to ordinary shares, announced as HM Revenue and Customs (HMRC) systems do not on 19 January 2009 and completed on 14 April 2009, separately identify those payments received before and the Government have now invested £20.3 billion in the after formal demands have been issued. Royal Bank of Scotland (RBS) (including additional Much of the operation of the tax system depends on amounts to cover the accrued dividend on the repurchased payments being made to HMRC other than in response preference shares, and the underwriting fee on the new to a demand for payment. This would include, for ordinary shares). example, payments where the taxpayer makes a self- With RBS’ participation in the asset protection scheme, assessment, payments that employers make throughout the Government will make a further investment of the year of the amounts due under PAYE, payments on £19.5 billion, and will make available a further £6 billion account or in advance of future liabilities and payments at RBS’ option. in respect of VAT due from traders. 1185W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1186W

Tax Havens Office Agency (VOA) staff to visit properties in order to undertake their functions. It also allows the VOA to Mr. Sanders: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer source the information it needs at minimal inconvenience when he expects the tax information exchange to taxpayers. There is no provision in the contract for agreements sought by the G20 to be in operation. extension into 2010. [274411] VAT: Bingo Mr. Timms: In keeping with the G20 London summit communiqué, we expect swift implementation of the John Hemming: To ask the Chancellor of the international standard of exchange of information by Exchequer if he will estimate the annual revenue which all countries. The G20 summit stated its readiness to would be forgone by the Exchequer from the removal apply sanctions against countries that fail to implement of value added tax on mainstage bingo. [258691] the international standard. G20 Leaders and Finance Ministers will meet again this year to review progress on Mr. Timms: It is estimated that the removal of value commitments. added tax on mainstage bingo would forego around £20 million in revenue in 2009-10. This includes the impact Taxation of value added tax removal on excise duty revenues from bingo and other gambling sectors. Mrs. Spelman: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer with reference to the ruling on the capping of input tax claims by HM Revenue and Customs, what refund INTERNATIONAL DEVELOPMENT payments have now been made to each local authority; and what the total estimated Exchequer liability is for Developing Countries: Climate Change such payments. [275758] Mr. Sharma: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr. Timms: HM Revenue and Customs (HMRC) International Development what steps his Department does not disclose the details of individual taxpayers, so is taking to assist developing countries tackle the I am unable to provide details of refunds paid to each adverse effects of climate change. [274715] local authority in light of legal rulings on the capping of input tax. No specific estimate of the total liability to Mr. Thomas: Information on the Department for the Exchequer for such payments to local authorities is International Development’s (DFID) climate change available. policy and the steps being taken are available on the DFID website: Valuation Office: ICT http://www.dfid.gov.uk/Global-Issues/How-we-fight-Poverty/ Climate-and-Environment/Climate-Change/What-DFID-is- Mrs. Spelman: To ask the Chancellor of the doing/ Exchequer on what date the Valuation Office Agency’s automated valuation model was last calibrated. Developing Countries: HIV Infection [275757] Mr. Sharma: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr. Timms: I refer the hon. Member to the answer International Development what his Department’s policy given to the hon. Member for Brentwood and Ongar is on measures to tackle HIV/AIDS in the developing (Mr. Pickles) on 6 May 2008, Official Report, column world; and if he will make a statement. [275001] 828W. Mr. Thomas: In June 2008 the UK Government Valuation Office: Rightmove launched “Achieving Universal Access”—the UK’s strategy for halting and reversing the spread of HIV in the Mrs. Spelman: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer developing world. This is available in the Library of the how much the Valuation Office Agency (a) paid House and on the DFID web-site: Rightmove.co.uk in 2008-09 and (b) plans to pay to www.dfid.gov.uk. that company in 2009-10. [275767] Pakistan: Armed Conflict Mr. Timms: I refer the hon. Member to the answer given on 12 March 2009, Official Report, columns 723-24W. John Hemming: To ask the Secretary of State for International Development what reports he has received Mrs. Spelman: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer on the humanitarian situation in the Swat Valley region pursuant to the answer to the hon. Member for of Pakistan following the recent conflict between Pakistani Peterborough (Mr. Jackson) of 10 March 2009, Official security forces and the Taliban; and what assistance the Report, column 262W,on the Valuation Office: Rightmove, Government plan to provide to displaced civilians in for what reasons the contract with Rightmove.co.uk that conflict zone. [275536] and HM Revenue and Customs, on behalf of the Valuation Office Agency, was extended; and whether the contract Mr. Michael Foster: The UK Government are deeply will be extended into 2010. [275851] concerned by the growing humanitarian crisis in the Swat Valley and neighbouring districts. We are in close Mr. Timms: The contract between HM Revenue and discussion with the Government of Pakistan, humanitarian Customs and Rightmove was extended because it provides agencies and other donors to monitor the situation. The good value for money by reducing the need for Valuation number of registered people displaced by the conflict 1187W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1188W now stands at over 1 million and this figure is sill called for full UN access to the conflict zone, and for a growing. The United Nations (UN) is currently revising UN team to be allowed to make a full humanitarian its appeal to meet the needs of up to 1.5 million people. assessment of the needs there. The UN Secretary General’s The Department for International Development (DFID) Chief of Staff, Vijay Nambiar, went to Sri Lanka on 15 has so far provided £12 million for humanitarian assistance May to press for full humanitarian access and respect to help those who have been displaced from their homes. for international humanitarian standards. This includes £10 million that was released at the end of April. Our funds are being used to provide shelter, Sri Lanka: Internally Displaced Persons water, sanitation, food and medical services. We will take a decision about the provision of further support once the revised humanitarian appeal is launched next Mr. Keith Simpson: To ask the Secretary of State for week and funding gaps are clear. International Development what recent estimate he has made of the number of Tamil people who have been Palestinians: Politics and Government able to return to their homes in former battle areas in the conflict in the northern region of Sri Lanka. [275320] Mr. Sharma: To ask the Secretary of State for International Development what his most recent assessment is of the humanitarian situation in Gaza. Mr. Michael Foster: Only a few hundred people have [275062] been able to return to their homes in Mannar district— formerly longer term residents of two small camps Mr. Michael Foster: I refer my hon. Friend to the which pre-date the present exodus of civilians. The UK answer given to the hon. Member for Ealing, Southall Government have consistently pressed the Government (Mr. Sharma) on 13 May 2009, Official Report, column of Sri Lanka to abide by its commitment to return 80 855W. per cent. of the new displaced population by the end of the year. Sri Lanka: Armed Conflict Mr. Keith Simpson: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr. Keith Simpson: To ask the Secretary of State for International Development what recent assessment he International Development what reports he has has made of the feasibility of delivering humanitarian received of the nature of the screening process for aid by sea to Tamil people displaced by the conflict in Tamil people displaced by the conflict in the north of the northern region of Sri Lanka; and what discussions the country upon entering the camps established by the he has had with the government of Sri Lanka on this government of Sri Lanka; and if he will make a matter. [275321] statement. [275315] Mr. Michael Foster: The only deliveries of aid to the Mr. Michael Foster: Security screening for civilians conflict zone since February have been made by sea, all escaping the conflict zone initially takes place in an area under the auspices of the International Committee of of the Vanni to which no international humanitarian the Red Cross (ICRC). Recently, only very small agencies have access. Secondary screening takes place at consignments of 25 tonnes at a time have been possible. Omantai checkpoint where the United Nations High The overwhelming constraint is the reluctance of both Commissioner for Refugees has only limited access to parties to allow humanitarian access and permit the observe the screening process. There is no established ICRC ships to enter the zone and unload supplies security screening process in the IDP camps and there safely. The UK Government have continually pressed are reports of people being removed for questioning the Government of Sri Lanka to allow full humanitarian and detention. This lack of international observation access to the conflict zone, including guaranteeing safe continues to cause concern and the UK Government passage for a 1,000 tonne vessel which has not been able have repeatedly called for full access for international to return since last unloading on 8 April. humanitarian agencies to assist and protect all displaced people on their journey to the camps. Mr. Keith Simpson: To ask the Secretary of State for International Development what recent estimate he has Mr. Keith Simpson: To ask the Secretary of State for made of the number of camps established by the Sri International Development how many UN High Lankan Government for Tamil people displaced by the Commission for Refugees (a) emergency and (b) field conflict in northern Sri Lanka; and what recent monitoring experts have been granted access to former estimate he has made of the number of people (a) in battle areas in the conflict in the northern region of Sri such camps and (b) whose deaths are attributable to Lanka. [275324] conditions in such camps. [275325]

Mr. Michael Foster: The United Nations High Mr. Michael Foster: As at 12 May 194,303 people Commissioner for Refugees (UNHCR) has not had a have been registered in more than 40 camps for displaced permanent presence in the Vanni since September 2008 persons. More than 173,000 of these are in Vavuniya, when the Government of Sri Lanka required all UN most of them in three very large camps at Menik Farm. agencies and NGOs to leave. Until January 2009 there The conditions are far from ideal but starting slowly to were occasional visits of UNHCR personnel aboard improve. There is no reliable data available for deaths in humanitarian convoys into the Vanni. But since January the camps or to what extent those could be attributable there has been no UNHCR access to the Vanni except to the conditions there. By far the greatest concern is restricted access to the IDP security screening centre at the terrible loss of life in the conflict zone and in Omantai checkpoint. The UK Government have repeatedly hospitals overwhelmed with sick and wounded patients. 1189W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1190W

Mr. Keith Simpson: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr. Michael Foster: Although the situation is far International Development what recent assessment he from ideal the 194,303 internally displaced people registered has made of the compatibility with international in camps in Vavuniya, Jaffna and Mannar do have standards of the humanitarian conditions of the camps access to humanitarian assistance. The situation is improving established by the Sri Lankan government for Tamil slowly. However, the population trapped in the conflict people displaced by the conflict in the north of Sri zone in Mullaitivu district is almost entirely isolated Lanka. [275329] from any humanitarian assistance. Only the International Committee of the Red Cross (ICRC) has any kind of Mr. Michael Foster: In terms of international standards access and is able only to deliver 25 tonnes of food and for assistance such as shelter, water and sanitation, other emergency items three times a week to a population food, health and education, the camps started from a of at least 50,000—barely three days of food each week. very low standard but are gradually improving. Large The UK Government repeatedly press at the highest influxes such as more than 113,000 people in one week level for an immediate humanitarian ceasefire to enable made camp conditions very difficult to manage, particularly the ICRC to evacuate the sick and wounded and to their sanitation. The UK Government have repeatedly deliver sufficient humanitarian aid. pressed the Government of Sri Lanka to abide by international humanitarian standards and to work with Sri Lanka: Politics and Government humanitarian agencies to improve both protection and assistance, with a view to meeting their commitment of Mr. Sharma: To ask the Secretary of State for early return of at least 80 per cent. of the displaced International Development what recent assessment he population before the end of the year. has made of the humanitarian situation in Sri Lanka; and if he will make a statement. [275067] Mr. Keith Simpson: To ask the Secretary of State for International Development what mechanisms are in Mr. Michael Foster: I refer my hon. Friend to the place to ensure that humanitarian aid from his Department answer I gave to the hon. Member for Clwyd, West to assist Tamil people displaced by the conflict in the (Mr. Jones) and the hon. Member for Mid-Worcestershire north of Sri Lanka is not misappropriated; and if he (Peter Luff) on 13 May 2009, Official Report, column will make a statement. [275330] 844. Mr. Michael Foster: Department for International Zimbabwe: Politics and Government Development (DFID) assistance is provided directly only to United Nations and independent humanitarian Mr. Sharma: To ask the Secretary of State for organisations such as the International Committee of International Development what recent steps his the Red Cross, International Organisation for Migration Department has taken to meet the need for humanitarian and reputable international and national NGOs. DFID assistance in Zimbabwe. [275063] follows rigorous grant management procedures. Its humanitarian staff in Sri Lanka and London monitor Mr. Thomas: I refer my hon. Friend to the answer and evaluate its programmes. No DFID humanitarian provided to my hon. Friend the Member for Dundee, funding is transferred to the Government of Sri Lanka West (Mr. McGovern) on 13 May 2009, Official Report, or any other governmental organisation in Sri Lanka. column 841W.

Mr. Keith Simpson: To ask the Secretary of State for International Development what recent estimate he has made of the number of international aid workers who COMMUNITIES AND LOCAL GOVERNMENT have access to the camps established by the Sri Lankan Council Housing government for Tamil people displaced by the conflict in the north of Sri Lanka; and if he will make a statement. [275331] Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government how many new Mr. Michael Foster: We have no firm figure. Access to lets there were by (a) local authorities and (b) Government of Sri Lanka controlled camps was a registered social landlords in each year since 1997. serious concern earlier this year, especially with regard [273402] to non-governmental organisations (NGOs). United Nations (UN) agencies, the International Committee of Mr. Iain Wright: New lets are defined as the number the Red Cross (ICRC) and the International Organisation of lets to new social housing tenants. of Migration (IOM) generally had better access to the New lets are reported by local authorities annually, camps. The UK Government repeatedly pressed the through the Housing Strategy Statistical Appendix (HSSA), Government of Sri Lanka for greatly increased access covering the period 1 April to 31 March. The number of to the camps, especially for NGOs. new lets made by local authorities in each year since 1996-97 is provided in Table 1. Mr. Keith Simpson: To ask the Secretary of State for Table 1: Number of new lets1 by local authorities since 1996-97, International Development what recent estimate he has England made of the number of people in the camps established Number of new lets (Thousand) by the Sri Lankan government for Tamil people displaced by the conflict in the (a) Wanni region and 1996-97 260 (b) Mullaitivu district who do not have access to 1997-98 259 humanitarian aid; and if he will make a statement. 1998-99 249 [275332] 1999-2000 235 1191W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1192W

Table 1: Number of new lets1 by local authorities since 1996-97, Payment of Commercial Debts (Interest) Act 1998 in England the last three years for which figures are available. Number of new lets (Thousand) [275207] 2000-01 222 2001-02 198 Mr. Khan: The Department and its agencies have made no payments under the Late Payment of Commercial 2002-03 191 Debts (Interest) Act 1998 in the last three years. 2003-04 162 2004-05 149 Departmental Official Hospitality 2005-06 133 2006-07 124 Bob Spink: To ask the Secretary of State for 2007-08 111 Communities and Local Government how much her 1 New lets includes both general needs and supported housing Department and its predecessor has spent on (a) Source: conference services and (b) banqueting services in each Housing Strategy Statistical Appendix of the last five years. [274510] New lets by registered social landlords are available via the Continuous Recording of Lettings system (CORE), Mr. Khan: The Department has spent the following covering the period 1 April to 31 March. The number of amount on (a) conference services for the last three new lets made by registered social landlords in each years: year since 1996-97 is provided in Table 2. Table 2: Number of new lets1,2 by registered social landlords since Conference services (£) 1996-97, England 2006-07 1,450,377 Number of new lets (Thousand) 2007-08 1,836,863 1996-97 118 2008-09 1,338,590 1997-98 128 Owing to changes to the coding structure on the 1998-99 137 Department’s finance system, figures for earlier years 1999-2000 139 could be provided only at disproportionate cost. 2000-01 140 The cost of any working meals cannot be disaggregated 2001-02 146 without disproportionate cost. I refer the hon. Member 2002-03 146 the answer I gave to the right hon. and learned Member 2003-04 147 for Devizes (Mr. Ancram) on 27 October 2008, Official 2004-05 141 Report, column 717W. 2005-06 143 2006-07 147 Empty Property: Essex 2007-08 146 1 New lets includes both general needs and supported housing. Bob Spink: To ask the Secretary of State for 2 Registered social landlords with less than 250 stock are not required Communities and Local Government what proportion to complete CORE returns. of properties were vacant in (a) Essex and (b) Castle Source : Point in each of the last five years. [275832] Continuous Recording of Lettings (CORE) Departmental Billing Mr. Iain Wright: The information requested is provided in the following table. Mr. Philip Hammond: To ask the Secretary of State The table shows the number of empty homes for each for Communities and Local Government how much year between 2003 and 2008 for Essex and Castle Point (a) her Department and its predecessor and (b) its with the number of those in the private sector empty for agencies paid in interest to suppliers under the Late more than six months.

2003-04 2004-05 2005-06 2006-07 2007-08 Total

Local authority (incl. owned by others) Castle Point 15 13 8 9 11 56 Essex 1,730 1,296 1,205 733 775 5,739

Registered social landlord Castle Point 7 8 4 13 9 41 Essex 305 388 531 550 653 2,427

Other public sector Castle Point 000000 Essex 528 345 335 729 85 2,022

Private sector (non-RSL)

Castle Point 767 889 927 1,070 994 4,647 Essex 16,420 16,292 19,248 17,918 19,282 89,160 1193W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1194W

2003-04 2004-05 2005-06 2006-07 2007-08 Total

Total empty Castle Point 789 910 939 1,092 1,014 4,744 Essex 18,983 18,321 21,319 19,930 20,795 99,348

Private sector (non-RSL) + six months Castle Point 304 529 588 693 649 2,763 Essex 8,458 7,451 8,488 8,426 8,932 41,755 Source: The Housing Strategy Statistical Appendices for 2003-04, 2004-05, 2005-06, 2006-07 and 2007-08 and can be accessed via the Communities and Local Government website.

Energy Performance Certificates Mr. Iain Wright: A written ministerial statement on housing and planning delivery grant was made to the Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for House by my right hon. Friend, the Minister for Housing Communities and Local Government pursuant to the and Planning, on 12 May 2009, Official Report, columns answer to the hon. Member for Buckingham of 5 May 45-46WS. 2009, Official Report, column 128W,on energy performance certificates, from which organisation her Department Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for has commissioned research relating to the implementation Communities and Local Government how much is of the EU Energy Performance of Buildings Directive. planned to be spent on housing and planning delivery [275179] grant in each of the next three years. [276164]

Margaret Beckett: Communities and Local Government Mr. Iain Wright: £135 million is to be spent on has commissioned AECOM (formerly Faber Maunsell) housing and planning delivery grant in 2009-10 and to undertake the research relating to the implementation £200 million in 2010-11. No funding has been agreed of the energy performance of buildings directive. beyond the current spending review period.

Fire Services: South West Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government how much was Mr. Sanders: To ask the Secretary of State for spent on (a) planning delivery grant and (b) the Communities and Local Government what her latest housing and planning delivery grant in each year since estimate is of the cost of the South West fire control 2003. [276166] centre project. [275442] Mr. Iain Wright: The information is as follows. Mr. Khan: The full business case for the FiReControl Planning delivery grant allocations 2003-04 to 2007-08 project was published on 6 May. This sets out in detail Financial year PDG (£ million) the forecast costs of project implementation, and contains a South West specific annex. Copies of the business case 2003-04 50 have been placed in the Libraries of the House and can 2004-05 130 be found on our website at: 2005-06 170 http://www.communities.gov.uk/publications/fire/ 2006-07 135 firecontrolfullbusinesscase 2007-08 120 PDG total during SR02 and SR04 605 Fire Stations: ICT period Housing and planning delivery grant allocations Tim Loughton: To ask the Secretary of State for Financial year HPDG (£ million) Communities and Local Government on how many 2008-09 101 and what proportion of computers in fire stations 2009-10 (to be allocated) 135 malware was detected in 2008. [275401] 2010-11 (to be allocated) 200 HPDG total during CSR07period 436 Mr. Khan: The information requested is not held centrally and could be provided only at disproportionate cost. Housing: Low Incomes Housing and Planning Delivery Grant Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr. Burstow: To ask the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government (1) which HomeBuy Communities and Local Government what estimate agents have suspended applications for MyChoice her Department has made of the effect of the recession HomeBuy; [275568] on the level of housing and planning delivery grant to (2) which regions have filled their MyChoice HomeBuy be paid to each planning authority in 2009-10; and if allocations for 2009-10; and when she expects the scheme she will make a statement. [273545] to be opened to applicants again. [276163] 1195W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1196W

Margaret Beckett: Mychoice homebuy providers have Inland Waterways: Planning Permission fully committed their current funds for the scheme. To date the Government have invested £126 million in the Mr. Brazier: To ask the Secretary of State for scheme this year and are considering the next steps for Communities and Local Government what policies her funding. In managing the Affordable Housing programme, Department has in place for the protection of wharfs the Government need to strike the right balance between north of Prescott Lock from housing development. this scheme and other programmes that support the [275666] delivery of new homes, including social rented homes, which also support new supply and jobs. Applicants Mr. Iain Wright [holding answer 14 May 2009]: The who are eligible for assistance to purchase a home protection of wharves for river-related use is a matter under my choice homebuy are also eligible for our other for the Mayor of London and the relevant local authority, homebuy products including homebuy direct and new which in this case is the London borough of Newham. build homebuy. The London Plan contains policies to protect a number of safeguarded commercial wharves on the Thames and Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for the Lower Lea and to require referral to the Mayor of Communities and Local Government on what date the any proposals for non river-related uses of these wharves, Rent to Homebuy scheme became operational. [276165] including housing development. The borough development plans are required to reflect the strategic policies through Margaret Beckett: The rent to homebuy scheme became the inclusion of detailed development control policies. operational on 16 July 2008. In the case of the Lower Lea, north of Prescotts Lock, there are two safeguarded wharves, Mayer Parry and Priors wharves and these are protected through the Housing: Rents saved policies of the Newham Unitary Development Plan of 2001. Change of use of unprotected wharves Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for would be subject to the borough’s general policies and, Communities and Local Government what average (a) in determining applications for housing development, it local authority, (b) registered social landlord and (c) would be for the council to judge the suitability of the private sector rental levels were as a percentage of proposal. average earnings in each year since 1997. [275949] Owner Occupation: Social Mobility

Mr. Iain Wright [holding answer 15 May 2009]: Mr. Sanders: To ask the Secretary of State for Estimates of average rents, for local authority, registered Communities and Local Government what recent social landlord and private sector tenants, as a percentage research her Department has commissioned on links of average earnings are given in the following table for between home ownership and social mobility. [275556] each year from 2002 to 2007. Comparable data prior to 2002 are not available. Mr. Iain Wright: The Department published in February The estimates are based on average rent data from a 2007 research on the links between home ownership number of sources: CLG Housing Subsidy Claim Form; and social mobility. The final research report is entitled: Housing Corporation (now Tenants Services Authority) “Social Mobility and Homeownership: A Risk HAR/10 and RSR; and Survey of English Housing Assessment—final report” and is available on the (private rents). For each tenure, the percentage is calculated Communities and Local Government website at: as the average rent for that tenure divided by the average http://www.communities.gov.uk/publications/corporate/ earnings for England (all tenures). newhorizonsresearch Average rent as a percentage of average earnings, England, 2002-07 Rented Housing Percentage Tenure 2002 2003 2004 2005 2006 2007 Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government (1) what estimate Local 12 12 12 13 13 13 she has made of the percentage of (a) registered social authority landlord and (b) local authority residential properties Registered 14 14 14 14 14 14 which were built before (A) 1919, (B) 1965, (C) 1980 social [274839] landlord and (D) 1990; Private 29 29 28 28 29 29 (2) how many dwellings owned by (a) local renters authorities and (b) registered social landlords were Note: built prior to 1980. [275580] All percentages (for all tenures) are based on the mean gross earnings for England. Mr. Iain Wright: The following table shows an estimate Sources: of the percentage of registered social landlord and local Local authority rents—CLG Housing Subsidy Claim form authority residential properties which were built before Registered social landlord rents—Housing Corporation HAR/10 and RSR (Regulatory and Statistical Return) 1919, 1965, 1981 and 1990, and the number of dwellings Private rents—Survey of English Housing (free market rents) owned by local authorities and registered social landlords Earnings—ONS Annual Survey of Hours and Earnings which were built prior to 1980.

Dwellings owned by local authorities and registered social landlords by age, 2006 Local authorities Registered social landlords All social landlords Dwelling age (Thousand) Percentage (Thousand) Percentage (Thousand) Percentage

Pre-1919 96 5 182 10 278 7 1197W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1198W

Dwellings owned by local authorities and registered social landlords by age, 2006 Local authorities Registered social landlords All social landlords Dwelling age (Thousand) Percentage (Thousand) Percentage (Thousand) Percentage

Pre-1965 1,252 60 821 44 2,073 53 Pre-1981 1,955 94 1,288 70 3,243 82 Source: English House Condition Survey, 2006.

Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for A comparison between the figures provided for local Communities and Local Government what the annual authorities (LAs) and registered social landlords (RSLs) turnover rate of (a) local authority and (b) registered is not possible, because RSL figures cover general needs social landlord tenancies was in each region in each households, while LA figures also include supported year since 1997. [274860] needs. The amount of local authority stock and number of lettings are reported annually by local authorities through Mr. Iain Wright: The annual turnover rate has been the Housing Strategy Statistical Appendix. Table 1 gives produced by calculating the number of lettings as a turnover rates by region for all local authority stock for percentage of total stock for each year. each year since 1997-98.

Table 1: Number of lettings as a percentage of total stock owned by local authority landlords, for each year since 1997-98, by region Percentage 1999- Region 1997-98 1998-99 2000 2000-01 2001-02 2002-03 2003-04 2004-05 2005-06 2006-07 2007-08

North East 14.2 13.8 14.0 15.6 13.1 13.0 11.2 11.5 10.7 9.7 11.1 North West 13.9 14.1 14.5 13.8 12.8 13.6 11.9 11.6 10.4 11.3 10.4 Yorkshire and 13.1 13.1 13.3 13.4 12.8 14.2 11.4 11.8 9.4 9.6 8.3 the Humber East Midlands 13.2 13.4 12.8 12.6 12.1 12.9 10.3 10.3 10.3 10.1 10.0 West Midlands 13.2 12.9 12.8 12.7 11.2 12.1 10.5 10.1 9.9 9.3 8.9 East of 10.6 10.4 10.4 10.0 10.2 9.8 8.9 9.2 9.5 8.8 9.1 England London 9.7 8.4 7.7 7.4 6.9 6.9 6.7 6.7 6.3 5.9 5.5 South East 10.9 10.5 10.2 10.1 9.1 9.6 9.6 9.2 9.1 8.8 8.6 South West 11.3 11.6 11.0 10.6 10.1 9.7 9.9 9.6 9.2 9.6 8.9 England 12.2 11.9 11.8 11.6 10.8 11.1 9.8 9.7 9.0 8.8 8.4 Notes: 1. Lettings are recorded over the period 1 April to 31 March. Stock figures are reported as at 1 April following this period. 2. Stock and lettings include both general needs and supported housing. Source: Housing Strategy Statistical Appendix, Sections A and D

The amount of RSL stock and the number of lettings owned by registered social landlords (RSLs) for each are reported annually through the Regulatory Statistical year since 1997-98. This covers general needs households Return. Table 2 gives turnover rates by region for stock only.

Table 2: Number of general needs lettings as a percentage of general needs stock owned by registered social landlords, for each year since 1997-98, by region Percentage 1999- Region 1997-98 1998-99 2000 2000-01 2001-02 2002-03 2003-04 2004-05 2005-06 2006-07 2007-08

North East 21.9 18.9 18.8 19.1 16.1 13.4 10.9 11.1 10.4 10.7 9.6 North West 17.5 15.9 14.4 14.8 16.2 12.7 12.1 10.4 10.2 9.4 8.9 Yorkshire and 21.7 20.1 19.5 17.8 18.3 14.1 15.0 10.5 11.3 10.5 10.8 the Humber East Midlands 24.9 19.6 17.7 18.4 17.2 15.6 16.4 16.2 14.0 14.3 12.0 West Midlands 15.8 14.1 13.7 13.8 14.1 11.7 11.3 10.5 10.1 9.8 9.7 East of 16.0 15.5 13.6 13.2 12.4 11.6 10.8 9.7 9.2 9.5 10.1 England London 11.0 10.0 8.9 9.2 9.9 8.8 8.9 9.1 7.7 8.9 9.3 South East 13.9 12.5 11.6 10.7 11.9 11.2 11.3 11.1 11.1 9.5 9.1 South West 16.0 10.8 12.0 11.5 13.3 11.9 11.4 11.3 10.8 10.5 10.6 England 15.8 13.9 13.1 12.9 13.6 11.8 11.5 10.7 10.1 9.9 9.7 Notes: 1. Stock figures are reported as at 31 March each year; lettings are recorded over the period 1 April to 31 March. 2. Figures from 2000-01 and earlier relate to self-contained stock only. Source: Regulatory and Statistical Return Part N (1998 to 2001), part 0 (2002 to 2008). 1199W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1200W

Repossession Orders: South Yorkshire Urban Areas: Regeneration

Jeff Ennis: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr. Sanders: To ask the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government how many home Communities and Local Government what recent steps repossessions initiated by (a) building societies and her Department has taken to provide (a) guidance and (b) banks there were in (i) Barnsley, (ii) Doncaster and (b) assistance to (i) regional and (ii) local organisations (iii) South Yorkshire in each of the last five years. in relation to town centre regeneration projects. [275447] [275819] Mr. Khan: On 14 April we published ″Looking after Mr. Iain Wright: I refer my hon. Friend to the answer our town centres″, which sets out the range of powers, I gave my hon. Friend the Member for Crosby guidance and approaches that can help local authorities (Mrs. Curtis-Thomas) on 13 May 2009, Official Report, and their partners promote the vitality and viability of column 818W. town centres, and explains additional steps that the Government are taking to enable further positive action Social Rented Housing to be taken, particularly through the temporary use of empty shops. Mr. Sanders: To ask the Secretary of State for We also recently issued, for public consultation, “Planning Communities and Local Government if she will assess for Prosperous Economies”, a new Planning Policy the merits of transferring social housing stock from Statement streamlining planning policy for economic local authority to registered social landlord control. development. This includes policy on town centres currently in Planning Policy Statement 6. We are also consulting [275482] on associated guidance. Together these will strengthen the Government’s “town centre first” policy and support Mr. Iain Wright: Local authorities who wish to consider regeneration schemes. transferring their social housing to a registered social landlord (RSL) need to ensure that there are clear We also set out clear principles for working at regional benefits from doing so and that the proposal would and local levels when we launched the next stage of the have the support of tenants. The Department has published Regeneration Framework on 11 May. This explains the guidance to local authorities, the Housing Transfer Government’s vision for regeneration and the steps we Manual 2005 and a 2006 supplement, which sets out the are now taking to keep regeneration moving in the process and assessments required. current economic conditions. It takes a holistic approach— ensuring physical, social and economic regeneration are The Homes and Communities Agency has a planned and delivered together. responsibility to consider housing transfer applications from local authorities, and the Tenant Services Authority considers from a regulatory perspective the position of the RSL to whom the housing is proposed to be transferred. Housing transfer only takes place where it has the WORK AND PENSIONS support of tenants, and has the legal consent of the Secretary of State. Cold Weather Payments: Fife

Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for Sir Menzies Campbell: To ask the Secretary of State Communities and Local Government what the average for Work and Pensions how many people resident in age of a dwelling owned by a (a) local authority and North East Fife constituency qualified for cold weather (b) registered social landlord was in each of the last payments in each of the last five years. [270859] five years. [275573] Kitty Ussher: No cold weather payments were triggered Mr. Iain Wright: Provisional figures for the average for eligible people living in the post code area covering age of social housing in England, as at May 2009, are: the North East Fife constituency in the years 2004-05 to (a) Local authority dwellings—53 years; 2006-07. Cold weather payments were triggered once (b) Housing association dwellings—44 years. for this post code area in 2007-2008 and either once or twice in 2008-09, dependent on the relevant weather Equivalent statistics for previous years are not available station. However, it is not possible to give a figure for but it should be noted that there is little change in the the number of people who qualified for a cold weather age profile of the stock from year to year. payment, as this information is not available at constituency level, only by weather station. Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government how many (a) registered social landlords and (b) local authority tenants Crisis Loans: Essex received a cash incentive to vacate their home in each of the last five years. [276145] Mr. Burns: To ask the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions how much was paid out in crisis loans by Mr. Iain Wright: I refer the hon. Member to the each Essex Jobcentre in each year since 2005. [271987] answers I gave my hon. Friend the Member for Regent’s Park and Kensington, North (Ms Buck) on 10 March Kitty Ussher: The information is not available in the 2009, Official Report, column 322W,and on 24 February format requested. Information on crisis loan expenditure 2009, Official Report, columns 554-56W. is not available by Jobcentre Plus office. 1201W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1202W

Foreign Workers The statistics show the total number of national insurance numbers allocated—not the number of migrants Sarah Teather: To ask the Secretary of State for Work living in the UK. We know that many people come to and Pensions how many (a) non-UK and (b) non-EU work for a short period and then return—the national citizens applied for a national insurance number in each insurance number statistics do not measure people leaving region in each of the last five years. [268452] the UK. They should not be used to make estimates about the number of foreign nationals living in the UK Mr. McNulty: The available information is in the at a particular time. tables.

Total number of non-UK and non-EU registrations for national insurance numbers in each Government office region Thousand 2003-04 2004-05 2005-06 Government office region Non-UK total Non-EU Non-UK total Non-EU Non-UK total Non-EU

Total 373.5 258.51 435.35 237.19 663.06 287.97 Scotland 15.96 10.3 23.44 11.02 41.40 13.82 North East 5.88 4.69 7.36 5.08 10.93 5.84 North West 23.67 18.21 31.22 17.32 48.81 18.71 Yorkshire and the 18.92 15.5 19.98 11.91 36.50 14.53 Humber Wales 7.09 4.95 10.04 4.87 16.64 5.91 West Midlands 23.5 18.84 28.01 16.80 42.04 17.62 East Midlands 16.55 12.56 23.56 11.69 38.72 12.78 East of England 26.48 17.85 34.62 15.92 52.78 18.48 South East 43.49 30.4 51.00 26.61 80.24 33.38 London 157.42 107.63 169.71 100.36 235.44 129.09 South West 16.07 10.71 22.57 10.77 34.06 11.83 Northern Ireland 4.58 2.12 5.74 2.23 16.06 3.04 Overseas residents 13.89 4.76 8.11 2.66 9.43 2.95

Thousand 2006-07 2007-08 Government office region Non-UK total Non-EU Non-UK total Non-EU

Total 705.84 285.13 733.09 292.70 Scotland 51.89 16.33 52.41 17.36 North East 13.33 6.49 12.23 6.42 North West 51.12 18.47 51.18 19.42 Yorkshire and the Humber 41.33 15.20 42.16 15.68 Wales 16.72 5.82 16.35 6.21 West Midlands 47.23 17.81 46.63 18.01 East Midlands 40.72 11.89 38.45 11.19 East of England 52.73 17.42 51.79 17.09 South East 79.33 32.96 82.83 33.16 London 240.93 124.31 272.71 132.49 South West 41.23 12.59 38.90 11.83 Northern Ireland 19.68 2.70 17.64 2.35 Overseas residents 9.58 3.15 9.80 1.44 Notes: 1. Figures are rounded to the nearest ten and displayed in thousands. Some additional disclosure control has been applied. 2. Registration date is derived from the date at which a national insurance number is maintained on the National Insurance Recording System. 3. Government Office region improvements have been made to the allocation of migrants whose residential address is incomplete. Figures reflect the best estimate of an overseas national’s locality at the time of registering for a national insurance number. 4. Financial year of registration date years are financial based (1 April to 31 March). 5. Non-EU registrations are included in the non-UK total figures. 6. Data are published at http://www.dwp.gov.uk/asd/tabtool.asp 7. Non-EU nationals—based on a client’s nationality. The mapping for “world areas” is based on the present day. 8. Bulgaria and Romania are listed as EU accession states for the entire Back Series. “European Union” excludes the accession states. 9. The latest year that full year data is available is 2007-08. Source: 100 per cent. extract from National Insurance Recording System.

Housing Benefit Kitty Ussher: Information is not available for 1 April each year; the available information is in the table. Number of recipients of housing benefit in England: as at May each year Mr. Sanders: To ask the Secretary of State for Work Number and Pensions how many people in England were in receipt of housing benefit on 1 April 2009 in each of 2003 3,161,300 the last five years. [275478] 2004 3,232,600 1203W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1204W

Number of recipients of housing benefit in England: as at May each year Mr. McNulty: Programme Centre provision is delivered Number via a range of job search modules and soft skill development 2005 3,314,900 modules to reflect the needs of employers and the local 2006 3,358,000 labour market. Provision is tailored to meet the individual 2007 3,401,600 needs of the customer. The following table lists the Notes: modules available. However, it is not exhaustive as 1. The data refer to benefit units, which may be a single person or a couple. providers may develop new modules subject to the 2. The figures have been rounded to the nearest hundred. approval of Jobcentre Plus. 3. Figures for any non-responding authorities have been estimated. 4. The figures are for May which relate to the second Thursday of May each Jobsearch Modules year. Induction 5. Housing benefit figures exclude any extended payment cases. 6. From February 2007, DWP has been collecting more detailed HB/CTB data Contract Setting electronically from local authorities. Over time this will improve the accuracy, Employment/Unemployment timeliness and level of detail available in the published statistics. However, until the new data have been fully quality assured to National Statistics standards, Overcoming hurdles to finding work the most recent summary statistics available are for August 2007. Action Planning Source: http://www.dwp.gov.uk/asd/hbctb.asp Labour Market Intelligence Housing Benefit: East of England Personal Stocktaking - Skills/Strengths/Experience Individual Advice and Guidance Mr. Vara: To ask the Secretary of State for Work and Setting Job Goals Pensions how many people have claimed housing CV’s benefit in (a) Cambridgeshire and (b) the East of Job Leads (Where to find the hidden vacancies) England in each of the last 10 years. [275224] Analysing Vacancies Telephone Techniques Kitty Ussher: The available information is in the Letters of Application following table. Preparation for Interviews Housing benefit recipients in Cambridgeshire and the East of England as at August each year Mock Interviews Cambridgeshire East of England Training Opportunities/Individual Learning Accounts/Life Long Learning 1998 26,300 311,300 Managing Time 1999 24,600 295,500 Back to Work Benefits 2000 23,500 275,500 Starting Your Job 2001 22,500 270,800 2002 22,400 267,900 Keeping Your Job 2003 22,800 271,400 Coping With Setbacks 2004 23,900 282,100 Assertive Jobseeking 2005 24,600 289,200 Self-Employment 2006 25,100 297,100 Soft Skill Development Modules 2007 25,600 302,100 Attitude - Lifeskills/Learning Culture Notes: 1. The data refers to benefit units, which may be a single person or a couple. Financial awareness, money handling, paying bills 2. The figures have been rounded to the nearest hundred. Work Ethic 3. Figures for any non-responding authorities have been estimated. 4. Housing benefit figures exclude any extended payment cases. Grooming/Personal appearance, interpersonal skills 5. From February 2007, DWP has been collecting more detailed HB/CTB data Motivation - Job appropriate/worthwhile electronically from local authorities. Over time this will improve the accuracy, timeliness and level of detail available in the published statistics. However, until Redressing low aspirations the new data has been fully quality assured to National Statistics standards, the Recruitment systems/processes most recent summary statistics available are for August 2007. Source: IT awareness (not occupational skills) essentials - keyboard, Housing Benefit and Council Tax Benefit Management Information System navigation, email, internet Employer Visits Quarterly 100 per cent. taken in August 1997 to August 2001. Information for August 2002 to August 2007 has been taken from: Occupational expectations (realism) http://www.dwp.gov.uk/asd/hbctb.asp Telephone skills Housing Benefit: Fraud Customer care Life skills - turning up, time keeping, getting to work/travel Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for Work support mechanisms, lunch, concentration, stamina, routine and Pensions how many social housing tenants in receipt Working with colleagues of housing benefit had their access to benefit withdrawn following a determination that they had been subletting National Insurance a social home in each of the last three years; and if he will make a statement. [274875] Sarah Teather: To ask the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions how many applications from (a) Kitty Ussher: The information is not available. British citizens, (b) EU citizens and (c) citizens from countries outside the EU for a national insurance Jobcentre Plus number were received by each office issuing national insurance numbers in London in each of the last five Mrs. May: To ask the Secretary of State for Work years; how many staff were employed at each such and Pensions what courses are delivered by Jobcentre office in each such year; and what the cost was of Plus programme centres. [271701] operating each office in each such year. [268389] 1205W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1206W

Mr. McNulty: The available information on national Parliamentary Questions: Government Responses insurance number (NINo) registrations in London Government office region is in the table. Mr. Burns: To ask the Secretary of State for Work NINo registrations to adult overseas nationals entering the UK, in and Pensions when he plans to reply to Question 254755, London Government office region by EU/Non-EU status on cold weather payments, tabled on 3 February 2009; Thousands and what the reasons are for the time taken to reply. Financial year EU nationals Non-EU nationals [271999]

2003-04 49.49 107.63 Kitty Ussher [holding answer 30 April 2009]: I replied 2004-05 69.06 100.36 to the hon. Member’s question on 13 May 2009, Official 2005-06 106.12 129.09 Report, columns 866-7W. 2006-07 116.43 124.31 2007-08 140.05 132.49 Notes: Welfare Tax Credits: Lone Parents 1. Figures are rounded to the nearest ten and displayed in thousands. Some additional disclosure control has been applied. Mr. Rooney: To ask the Secretary of State for Work 2. Registration date is derived from the date at which a NINo is maintained on the National Insurance Recording System. and Pensions what the cost would be of paying a 3. Government office region improvements have been made to the work-related activity premium of (a) £10, (b) £20 and allocation of migrants whose residential address is incomplete. Figures (c) £30 per week to lone parents with children aged reflect the best estimate of an overseas national’s locality at the time under 7 years in 2009-10. [270109] of registering for a NINo. 4. The mapping for “world areas” is based on the present day. Bulgaria and Romania are listed as EU accession states for the entire Kitty Ussher [holding answer 22 April 2009]: There Back Series. European Union excludes the accession states. are approximately 460,000 lone parents on income support 5. Financial year of registration date years are financial based (1 with a youngest child under the age of seven. April to 31 March). 6. The latest year that full year data is available is 2007-08. In the first Assuming that this remains constant, the annual cost two quarters from April to September 2008, there have been some of paying all lone parents with a child aged under seven 69.74 thousand national insurance numbers allocated to EU nationals a work-related activity premium is in the table. and 66.4 thousand allocated to non-EU nationals. Cost of paying a work-related activity premium to all lone parents on Source: income support with a youngest child under the age of seven 100 per cent. extract from National Insurance Recording System. Work-related activity premium Annual cost (£ million) The statistics show the number of adult overseas nationals (by Government office region) entering the £10 per week 240 UK and registering for a NINo in order to work or to £20 per week 480 claim benefits and tax credits. As such they are one £30 per week 720 measure of in-migration to the UK. However, they do Notes: 1. Costs are rounded to the nearest £5 million. not represent the number of migrants living in the UK 2. Costs depend upon case loads. The average number of lone parents at a point in time, nor are they consistent with estimates on income support over the last year was 460,000, but higher numbers of Government office region migrant populations. Nor would mean higher costs, and vice versa. do they represent the distribution of employment of As this is not Government policy these costs assume migrants—as they provide information on where the all lone parents with a youngest child under the age of individual lived at the time they registered for a NINo; seven receive a work-related activity premium. they may have since moved. They reflect only the additional cost of paying the Information on full-time equivalent staff numbers premium, and not any additional costs associated with and operating costs is not collated for each individual ensuring additional provision is made available through, office and could be obtained only at disproportionate for example, the new deal for lone parents programme. cost.

Natural Gas: Safety BUSINESS, ENTERPRISE AND REGULATORY REFORM Dan Rogerson: To ask the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions what the terms of the contract Business: Advisory Services agreed with Capita for the operation of the Gas Safe Register are; what the key performance indicators are; John Penrose: To ask the Minister of State, and how (i) performance and (ii) value for money will Department for Business, Enterprise and Regulatory be reviewed. [276284] Reform what progress has been made in piloting an insured advice helpline for employment and health and Kitty Ussher: The Services Concession Agreement safety regulations as referred to in the Government’s entered into by the Health and Safety Executive (HSE) response to the Anderson Review of Good Guidance. with Capita Gas Registration and Ancillary Services [274368] Ltd. for the operation of the Gas Safe Register is a commercially confidential document. The performance Mr. Thomas: In its response to the Anderson Review and value for money of the Gas Safe Register will be the Government undertook to develop an approach to measured against eight key performance indicators, which this recommendation by spring 2009. We will shortly be are published on the HSE website. making an announcement on our piloting strategy. 1207W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1208W

Departmental Billing I have approached the chief executives of the Insolvency Service and Companies House and they will respond to the hon. Member directly. Mr. Philip Hammond: To ask the Minister of State, Department for Business, Enterprise and Regulatory Letter from Gareth Jones, dated 18 May 2009: Reform how much (a) his Department and its predecessor I am replying on behalf of Companies House to your Parliamentary and (b) its agencies paid in interest to suppliers under Question tabled on 5 May 2009, UIN 273745, to the Minister of the Late Payment of Commercial Debts (Interest) Act State for Business Enterprise and Regulatory Reform. 1998 in the last three years for which figures are available. Companies House has spent the following amounts on furniture [275210] in the last five years:

Financial Year Amount (£) Mr. Thomas: The Department has made the following payments covering interest for late payment of invoices 2004-05 548,761 under the Late Payment of Commercial Debts (Interest) 2005-06 83,999 Act 1998: 2006-07 37,406 2007-08 41,554 Financial year Amount (£) 2008-09 12,825 2006-07 1,116 The high costs in 2004-05 and 2005-06 were as a result of 2007-08 0 establishing a new office in Nantgarw, north of Cardiff. 2008-09 0 Letter from Stephen Speed, dated 18 May 2009: Prior to the creation of BERR in June 2007, the I refer to your question to ask the Minister of State, Department for Business, Enterprise and Regulatory Reform, how much (a) payments covering interest for late payment of invoices his Department spent on furniture in 2008-09 and (b) his Department’s relate to payments made by the Department of Trade agencies spent on furniture in each of the last five years. and Industry. The Insolvency Service expenditure on furniture for the last I have approached the chief executives of the Insolvency five years is shown in the table below: Service and Companies House and they will respond to the hon. Member directly. Year Expenditure (£) Letter from Gareth Jones, dated 18 May 2009: 2008-09 869,363 I am replying on behalf of Companies House to your Parliamentary 2007-08 683,666 Question tabled on 8 May 2009, UIN 275210, to the Minister of 2006-07 678,952 State for Business Enterprise and Regulatory Reform. 2005-06 526,985 Companies House has not paid any interest to suppliers under 2004-05 149,160 the Late Payment of Commercial Debts (Interest) Act 1998 in the last three years. Departmental Mobile Phones Letter from Stephen Speed, dated 18 May 2009: The Minister of State, Department for Business, Enterprise and Regulatory Reform has asked me to reply to your question Mr. Hoban: To ask the Minister of State, Department how much (a) his Department and its predecessor and (b) its for Business, Enterprise and Regulatory Reform how agencies paid in interest to suppliers under the Late Payment of many (a) BlackBerry devices and (b) mobile telephones Commercial Debts (Interest) Act 1998 in the last three years for have been lost by (i) Ministers, (ii) special advisers and which figures are available. (iii) civil servants in his Department and its predecessor The Insolvency Service Executive Agency of The Department in each year since 2005. [274457] for Business, Enterprise and Regulatory Reform made no payments of interest to suppliers for late payment of invoices in the last Ian Pearson: In 2008, one Blackberry was lost by a three years. Minister and one by a Special Adviser. The numbers lost by Civil Servants are shown in the following table. Departmental Furniture Mobile Phones Blackberry’s Grant Shapps: To ask the Minister of State, Department 2005 11 3 for Business, Enterprise and Regulatory Reform how 2006 14 3 much (a) his Department spent on furniture in 2008-09 2007 2 12 and (b) his Department’s agencies spent on furniture in 2008 2 13 each of the last five years. [273745] 20091 05 1 30 April Mr. Thomas: This Department’s published “Annual Report and Accounts” contains information on its tangible Departmental Public Expenditure fixed assets, which includes an additions category entitled “furniture, fixtures and fittings”. Grant Shapps: To ask the Minister of State, Department These accounts can be found on the BERR website at for Business, Enterprise and Regulatory Reform pursuant the following address: to the answer of 17 March 2009, Official Report, column 1128W, on the economic situation, what expenditure www.berr.gov.uk. was incurred by his Department under each budgetary Information for 2008-09 is still subject to audit and heading for each of the summits, conferences and seminars will be published in the 2008-09 Annual Report and held for which the primary focus was the effects of the Accounts on 17 July 2009. economic situation. [270696] 1209W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1210W

Mr. Thomas [holding answer 23 April 2009]: Information Departmental Telephone Services on expenditure on summits was provided in my right hon. Friend the Minister for Employment Relations Mike Penning: To ask the Minister of State, and Postal Affairs (Mr. McFadden) answer to the hon. Department for Business, Enterprise and Regulatory Member on 11 May 2009, Official Report, column 557W. Reform what the rate (a) per minute and (b) per three minutes charged to a caller to a number operated by his Information on expenditure on the conferences and Department and its agencies beginning with (i) 084 and seminars referred to in my right hon. Friend the Minister (ii) 03 is. [275145] for Employment Relations and Postal Affairs (Mr. McFadden) answer to the hon. Member on 17 Ian Pearson: This Department is unable to confirm March 2009, Official Report, column 1128W,is as follows: the cost of calling the 084 numbers in use, as rates will vary dependent upon the tariffs applied by each caller’s £ telephone service supplier. The Department does not Total Venue Catering deploy any 03 numbers. Conferences Mike Penning: To ask the Minister of State, Small Business 777.25 490.00 287.25 Department for Business, Enterprise and Regulatory Forum Reform what the average duration of a call to a Prompt Payment 174.60 137.50 37.10 telephone number beginning with (a) 084 and (b) 03 Forum operated by his Department and its agencies was in the S.O.S Panel on 1,506.25 392.50 1,114.00 last period for which figures are available. [275146] Monitoring the Economy (four Ian Pearson: The information available on call duration occasions) to the Department’s 084 numbers is limited to the three 1,197.40 343.75 854.00 numbers supplied by the main telephone supplier, Global 783.75 343.75 440.00 Crossing. For the first quarter of 2009 the average call 747.50 305.00 443.00 duration for these 084 numbers was two minutes and nine seconds. The Department does not use 03 numbers. S.O.S Meeting with 784.00 287.00 497.00 Automotive Industry Departmental Training Lord Davies (no 131.00 110.00 21.60 meeting title) Bob Spink: To ask the Minister of State, Department Economic 1,767.50 1,125.00 642.50 for Business, Enterprise and Regulatory Reform how Integration much his Department and its predecessor has spent on Conference IT training for its staff in each of the last five years. RDA Chairs 332.90 275.00 57.90 [274211] Ministers Meeting (two occasions) Mr. Thomas: The Department’s budgets for training 519.30 410.00 109.30 are devolved to individual directorates. IT training, Round Table Meeting 441.45 303.40 138.00 whether it relates to routine or project-related activities, Ministerial Advisory 384.80 328.00 56.80 is not separately itemised on the Department’s accounting Group on system and the amount that was spent on it within Manufacturing (two occasions) overall training budgets could be ascertained only at disproportionate cost. 368.85 328.00 40.85 Employment Tribunals Service Seminars Judy Mallaber: To ask the Minister of State, Department Economic Impact of 368.25 328.00 40.25 Migrant Workers for Business, Enterprise and Regulatory Reform (1) how many of the 678 equal pay claims upheld at an Knowledge Sharing 820.00 820.00 — employment tribunal in 2007-08 related to the employer Senior Economist 109.05 82.50 26.55 with the greatest number of cases reaching an employment Meeting (four occasions) tribunal in that year; [275376] 159.65 137.50 22.15 (2) how many employers had equal pay claims upheld against them in 2007-08. [275377] 168.20 137.50 30.70 168.20 137.50 30.70 Maria Eagle: I have been asked to reply. Senior Whitehall 600.50 410.00 190.50 The Employment Tribunal does not keep the information Stakeholder Group which the hon. Member has requested in a readily for Business (two available format. This information could be provided occasions) only at disproportionate cost. 474.00 410.00 64.00 Food

The events listed pertained to a broad range of different Tim Farron: To ask the Minister of State, Department issues within Ministers’ briefs—from small business to for Business, Enterprise and Regulatory Reform if he consumer protection and the automotive industry. It will make an estimate of the (a) monetary value and also includes interdepartmental meetings between Whitehall (b) quantity of waste food disposed of from his economic experts. Department’s premises in the last 12 months. [273443] 1211W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1212W

Mr. Thomas: Over the last 12 months up to the end of We believe that an estate agent acting for a consumer April 2009, it is estimated that 16,350 kgs of waste food seller would not normally breach the rules on misleading was disposed of by BERR’s catering service provider omissions in the CPRs where the PIQ had been completed from its restaurant facility at 1 Victoria street. by the seller. It is not possible to estimate the monetary value of Housing: Sales this waste as information is not held centrally and collating this information would incur disproportionate costs. Mrs. Spelman: To ask the Minister of State, Department for Business, Enterprise and Regulatory Reform what guidance his Department has issued on the effect of (a) Gambling Commission the Cancellation of Contracts Made in a Consumer’s Home or Place of Work Etc Regulations 2008 and (b) Mr. Moss: To ask the Minister of State, Department Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations for Business, Enterprise and Regulatory Reform which 2008 on the (i) sale and (ii) marketing of (A) homes and review model was used by the Hampton Review Team (B) home information packs. [272340] in its assessment of the Gambling Commission; and on how many occasions the Review Team met the Gambling Mr. Thomas: The Department for Business, Enterprise Commission for the purposes of the assessment. and Regulatory Reform has produced general guidance, [274173] available on the BERR website at: www.berr.gov.uk Ian Pearson: Under the Hampton Implementation about the Cancellation of Contracts Made in a Consumer’s Review framework, regulators are reviewed under one Home or Place of Work etc. Regulations 2008. The of two models, depending on their size, scope and Office of Fair Trading has published joint OFT/BERR impact, to ensure that reviews are proportionate to the branded general guidance, available on the OFT website at: organisation in question. www.oft.gov.uk The Gambling Commission was assessed under the about the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading ’Model 1’ framework whereby a review team of experienced Regulations 2008. The guidance details the steps that individuals from the Better Regulation Executive, National any business, that is subject to the regulations, must Audit Office, the Security Industry Authority and the take to comply with the regulations. EEF assessed the work of the Commission over a one-week period. The review team conducted a combination Motor Vehicles: EU Law of interviews with senior staff, with representatives of the gambling sector, and with individual regulated Norman Baker: To ask the Minister of State, businesses, as well as shadowing the work of Commission Department for Business, Enterprise and Regulatory inspectors. Reform what his policy is on whether the Motor Vehicle Block Exemption Regulation (EC) 1400/2002 The review framework and both the Model 1 and should expire in 2010; and what discussions he has had Model 2 methodologies are set out on the BERR website with the motor repair industry on this matter. [274351] at http://www.berr.gov.uk/whatwedo/bre/inspection- Mr. Thomas: On the basis of detailed discussion with enforcement/implementing-principles/reviewing-regulators/ EU member states, the Motor Vehicle Block Exemption page44054.html. Regulation will be extended or otherwise by the European The review team met with a wide range of Commission Commission as this falls within their competence under staff, including both Commission members and Executive Article 81 (3) of the European Treaty. We have expressed staff ranging from the Chief Executive to their compliance concerns about access to information, particularly technical and advisory staff over the course of 6 October to 10 information, and parts for the independent aftermarket, October. and have made several representations to the European Commission on the subject. Most other EU member Home Information Packs states have expressed similar concerns. I would expect these concerns to be addressed in any formal proposals by the European Commission. Mrs. Spelman: To ask the Minister of State, Department Officials from BERR and the Office of Fair Trading for Business, Enterprise and Regulatory Reform whether (OFT) have been in discussion with representative groups the rules against misleading omissions under the Consumer from the motor vehicle industry including the ‘Right to Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 will Repair’ campaign throughout the review of the Motor apply to property information questionnaires in home Vehicle Block Exemption Regulation and these helpful information packs. [273720] contacts will continue.

Mr. Thomas: The rules on misleading omissions in Motor Vehicles: Manufacturing Industries the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 (CPRs) will apply to Property information Bob Spink: To ask the Minister of State, Department questionnaires (PIQs) where they constitute a marketing for Business, Enterprise and Regulatory Reform if he communication between a trader (as part of his business) will hold an inquiry into the actions of Visteon UK and and a consumer. The rules prohibit the provision of Ford UK to establish responsibility for pension and unclear material information or the hiding or omission redundancy payments for employees made redundant of material information which the consumer needs in by each company; and if he will make a statement. the circumstances. [269820] 1213W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1214W

Ian Pearson: As indicated during the debate in the Where the Local Better Regulation Office has registered House on 30 April, BERR is in contact with Visteon a Primary Authority, any other local authority that UK. I understand that the unions and the Visteon proposes to take enforcement action against an organisation Corporation have agreed a much improved redundancy must contact the Primary Authority first. The Primary package and that staff at the three Visteon UK plants Authority can then block the proposed enforcement voted overwhelmingly to accept it. I hope that the action if it believes that it is inconsistent with advice or necessary payments can be made as soon as is possible. guidance that it has previously given. In situations We will continue to monitor the situation. where action is urgently required to prevent harm, the Act allows local authorities to proceed immediately and Post Offices: Bank Services inform the Primary Authority as soon as possible after taking the action. Under the scheme, a local authority Mr. Oaten: To ask the Minister of State, Department may reclaim costs incurred while acting as a Primary for Business, Enterprise and Regulatory Reform how Authority on a cost recovery basis. many times Ministers in his Department have met representatives of the Post Bank Coalition in the last Retirement: Age six months. [269074] Mr. Sanders: To ask the Minister of State, Ian Pearson [holding answer 20 April 2009]: My right Department for Business, Enterprise and Regulatory hon. Friend the Minister for Employment Relations Reform if he will bring forward proposals to prevent and Postal Affairs attended the Post Bank Coalition’s employers using mandatory retirement ages. [275857] launch event on 17 March and regularly meets representatives of a range of post office network Ian Pearson: The UK does not have a national mandatory stakeholders and other interested parties. retirement age. The Employment Equality (Age) Regulations 2006 introduced a default retirement age of Regulatory Enforcement and Sanctions Act 2008 65, which allows employers to use retirement at 65 as a tool for workforce planning. However, employers do Mrs. Spelman: To ask the Minister of State, Department not have to retire employees once they reach 65. They for Business, Enterprise and Regulatory Reform what are free to continue to employ them for as long as they new powers the provisions of the Regulatory Enforcement like, and employees are entitled to request to continue and Sanctions Act 2008 will provide for local authorities. working beyond 65. [272412] As the Government clearly stated when the regulations Mr. Thomas: Part 3 of the Regulatory Enforcement were introduced, we are committed to undertaking an and Sanctions Act 2008 allows a Minister, by order, to evidence based review of the default retirement age five give local authorities and other regulators access to four years after its introduction. This provides sufficient new civil sanctions: time for the regulations to bed in and helps business to plan with certainty. We will be gathering the evidence Fixed monetary penalties needed to enable us to undertake this review in 2011. If Discretionary requirements the conclusion of the review is that the evidence which will enable a regulator to impose, by notice, one or more demonstrates a default retirement age is no longer of the following: necessary, we will take the necessary steps to remove it. a variable monetary penalty determined by the regulator; a requirement to take specified steps within a stated period to WPP secure that an offence does not continue or happen again; and a requirement to take specified steps within a stated period to Norman Baker: To ask the Minister of State, secure that the position is restored, so far as possible, to what it Department for Business, Enterprise and Regulatory would have been if no offence had been committed. Reform pursuant to the answer of 31 March 2009, Stop notices Official Report, column 1186W, on WPP, what matters which will prevent a business from carrying on an activity were discussed at the meeting. [269033] described in the notice until it has taken steps to come back into compliance. Ian Pearson [holding answer 20 April 2009]: I understand Enforcement undertakings general business issues were discussed. which will enable a business, which a regulator reasonably suspects of having committed an offence, to give an undertaking to a regulator to take one or more corrective actions set out in the undertaking. JUSTICE To date, no orders have been made under part 3 and Council Tax: Non-payment so local authorities cannot yet access the new powers. Part 2 of the Act, which commenced on 6 April 2009, Mr. Bellingham: To ask the Secretary of State for established the Primary Authority scheme. The scheme Justice how many council tax liability orders have been allows businesses, charities or other organisations that issued by magistrates to local authorities in England operate across more than one site, to enter into a and Wales in each year from 1998 to 2008. [273674] partnership with a local authority for it to become a Primary Authority. As well as promoting consistency, Mr. Straw: Statistics on the number of orders issued, the scheme is intended to help local authorities decide as opposed to the number of applications made, are not what action will be necessary and proportionate in a available. The following table shows the number of given circumstance to bring about a successful outcome applications for council tax and business rate liability with the minimum burden to an organisation. orders made to magistrates courts during the financial 1215W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1216W years 2005-06 to 2008-09 inclusive. These liability orders Publications and follow-up reports on the Department’s attract the same fee charge, and are therefore recorded regular research programme, as well as any special on the internet fees accounting system (IFAS) in the projects that MOJ initiates can also be found at: same way. It is not possible to distinguish between http://www.justice.gov.uk/publications/research.htm applications for liability orders made in relation to Information on MOJ consultations, both open and council tax and business rates. closed, can be found at: Number of applications for council tax and business rate liability http://www.justice.gov.uk/consultations.htm orders made to magistrates courts in England and Wales, 2005-06 to 2008-09 Number of applications made Land Registry: Fraud

2005-06 2,438,305 2006-07 2,632,923 Mrs. Laing: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice 2007-08 2,867,390 how much compensation has been paid by HM Land 2008-09 3,124,406 Registry in respect of property fraud in each of the last 10 years. [275155] Centrally-held figures are not available for earlier years because HM Courts Service only assumed direct Mr. Wills: The figures requested are shown in the responsibility for the magistrates courts with effect from following table. The increase in the level of payments in April 2005. 2005-06 was principally caused by one fraudulent transfer Damages which resulted in payments of more than £8.1 million. The raised level of payments in subsequent years is attributable to a range of factors—including increasing Mr. Bellingham: To ask the Secretary of State for numbers of registered transactions, greater availability Justice when he plans to publish his response to the of credit providing more opportunities for fraudsters, consultation on the law on damages; what the reasons increases in property values resulting in the losses from are for the time taken; and if he will make a statement. each fraud being higher, and more professional as opposed [274733] to domestic frauds. The number of frauds must be seen against the overall numbers of transactions processed Bridget Prentice: I refer the hon. Member to my in each year. For example, in 2007-08, Land Registry answer of 28 April 2009, Official Report, column 1253W, processed 5,638,226 applications to alter the register to his earlier question on this subject. and there were 60 successful indemnity claims based on The consultation on the law on damages closed on 27 fraud. July 2007. The consultation paper considered proposals put forward in a series of Law Commission reports and Number of fraud consequently covered a number of distinct and complex Indemnity payments related indemnity issues. There were 103 responses, many very detailed, relating to fraud (£) claims that required careful consideration. This work has taken 1998-99 231,540 17 longer than planned, partly because of the scale or the 1999-2000 89,226 15 response and the inherent complexity, and partly because 2000-01 245,457 9 of by the need to divert resources to deal with other 2001-02 99,320 7 pressing issues. The Government do, however, intend to 2002-03 254,930 4 publish a response paper outlining the way forward as 2003-04 151,626 12 soon as possible. 2004-05 293,599 15 Departmental Reviews 2005-06 8.6 million 31 2006-07 2.1 million 24 Mr. Vara: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice 2007-08 3.9 million 60 1 how many (a) review and (b) taskforce projects his 2008-09 5.07 million 62 Department and its predecessor have commissioned in Total 21.04 million 256 each of the last five years; what the purpose of each 1 The figures for 2008-09 are based on information currently available to be finalised when Land Registry’s audited accounts are published such project is; when each such project (i) began and later this year. This figure can change. The Audit Committee are due (ii) was completed; what the cost of each such project to sign off the accounts in June. was; and if he will make a statement. [275970] Mrs. Laing: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice Mr. Wills: The Ministry of Justice does not hold this what estimate he has made of the number of (a) title information centrally. To collate this level of information registries and (b) deeds for properties which have been would require a detailed trawl across the Department altered by fraudulent means in each of the last 10 years. which would entail disproportionate cost. [275159] However, information on major reports and reviews undertaken by the Department on a wide range of Mr. Wills: It is not possible to provide these figures as issues can be accessed at the following link from the no such estimates have been made. Land Registry tracks MOJ website: the level of fraudulent alterations to the register by http://www.justice.gov.uk/publications/policy-reports.htm reference to claims received for indemnity based on It also contains Green Papers, White Papers and fraud rather than against estimates of the number of Government responses to parliamentary committee reports fraudulent alterations which would necessarily be on major policy reviews. speculative. 1217W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1218W

Mrs. Laing: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice Foreign Foreign what estimate he has made of the cost to the economy All prisoners nationals nationals of property fraud in each of the last 10 years. [275169] (number) (number) (percentage)

Mr. Wills: No such estimates have been made. 2004 74,488 8,941 12 2005 76,190 9,651 13 Offenders: Mental Health Services 2006 77,982 10,879 14 2007 79,734 11,093 14 Mr. Burrowes: To ask the Secretary of State for 2009 83,194 11,498 14 Justice what plans he has to ensure that the mental health needs of ex-service personnel involved in the These figures include foreign national prisoners serving criminal justice system are met. [275918] their sentence, those on remand pending prosecution and those being held under immigration powers pending Phil Hope: I have been asked to reply. deportation action. Ex-service personnel, including those within the criminal These figures are available on the Ministry of Justice justice system, have access to national health service website: treatment and services. Prison mental health care transferred For the period 2004 to 2007: fully to primary care trusts in 2006, and all prison http://www.justice.gov.uk/publications/ mental health services are now mainstreamed within prisonandprobation.htm the NHS. On entering custody, the reception screening For 2008: tool assesses all prisoners’ health concerns, including http://www.justice.gov.uk/publications/populationincustody- mental illness, and can refer them to mental health 2008.htm in-reach teams within the criminal justice system. A person whose mental illness is too severe to justify their Data on foreign national prisoners are published remaining in prison can be transferred to NHS secure quarterly in the population in custody bulletin, again on services. the Ministry of Justice website: http://www.justice.gov.uk/publications/populationincustody .htm In its response to Lord Bradley’s report on people with mental health problems or learning disabilities in These figures have been drawn from administrative the criminal justice system, the Government make it IT systems which, as with any large scale recording clear that veterans involved in the criminal justice system system, are subject to possible errors with data entry is an important group, and whose needs will also be and processing. taken into account as the delivery plan to address Lord Bradley’s recommendations is developed. Prisons: Discipline Orchard Lodge Secure Unit Mr. Garnier: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice how many prison disturbances requiring the deployment Mrs. Lait: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice of (a) Tornado support officers and (b) the police for what reasons the Youth Justice Board decided to there have been in prisons in England and Wales in each close the Orchard Lodge Unit in Anerley. [275557] of the last 12 years for which figures are available; and what the (i) cause, (ii) nature and (iii) cost to the public Mr. Hanson: The Youth Justice Board will be purse of the disturbance was in each case. [272821] commissioning 191 beds in Secure Children’s Homes in England and Wales from 1 July 2009. This figure was Mr. Hanson: The information is not held in the form determined by examining the average level of demand required and could be obtained only at disproportionate for secure training centre and secure children’s home cost. There are a variety of types of incident where beds over a three-year period and determining the Tornado teams may be deployed, predominantly concerted optimum number of secure children’s home beds to be indiscipline, hostage taking and incidents at height. As commissioned in the current contracting round. Tornado teams will not have been deployed to all of The YouthJustice Board’s decision not to offer Orchard these incidents, the information could be obtained only Lodge a new contract was taken following a comprehensive by examining each incident in detail. Similarly police evaluation of a tender exercise. The evaluation panel presence at incidents is not centrally recorded. assessed the quality of all tenders received based on the There have been just four major incidents of disorder quality of the responses to the specifications issued, and since 1996, and the incident at Ashwell in April was the a financial evaluation on submitted bed prices. Any first since the disturbance at Lincoln in October 2002. decision about the future of Orchard Lodge will be Between 1990 and 1995 there were 11 major incidents of taken by the private operator, Glen Care. disorder, including Manchester, which lasted 25 days, and Pucklechurch, where the entire prison was destroyed Prisoners: Foreigners (both in 1990).

Mr. Grieve: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice Probation Boards: Pay what percentage of the prison population foreign nationals comprised in each of the last five years. [274194] David Taylor: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice (1) what average percentage of probation board Mr. Straw: The following table provides the numbers and trust expenditure was incurred on salaries paid in of prisoners held in all prison establishments in England respect of management positions higher than Band 4 and Wales as at 30 June in each year from 2004 to 2008, on the national job evaluation scheme in (a) England showing the percentage of foreign national prisoners: and (b) Wales in 2008-09; [275385] 1219W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1220W

(2) what average percentage of probation board and The following table shows the number of mortgage trust expenditure was on probation board members’ possession orders made in England and Wales and each (a) salaries and (b) associated expenses in (i) England Government office region in the last five years and in and (ii) Wales in the last 12 months. [275386] the first quarter of 2009. This breakdown is based on the location of the court Mr. Hanson: This information is not held centrally which heard the case, rather than the exact location of and is not available in the format requested in the 42 the property which was the subject of the case. probation areas where it is held. To obtain this information would therefore incur a disproportionate cost. The Ministry of Justice does not hold information centrally on the breakdown of mortgage possession Repossession Orders: Mortgages orders according to the nature of dispute. This is because one of the main administrative computer systems used Ms Keeble: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice in the county courts for possession cases (CaseMan) (1) how many court orders for action in relation to does not identify the specific nature of dispute for these mortgage arrears have been issued in each of the last orders. Changing the administrative system to create five years; [275537] the necessary field to capture this information would incur disproportionate cost. (2) how many court orders were issued in respect of mortgage arrears in each region in the latest period for The number of mortgage possession orders made in which figures are available; [275538] each county court of England and Wales in each year (3) how many repossession orders have been issued from 1987 to 2008 can be viewed using the following by courts in England and Wales in respect of mortgage web link: arrears in each of the last five years; [275539] http://www.justice.gov.uk/publications/mortgateland lordpossession.htm (4) how many repossession orders have been issued by the courts in each of the English regions in respect The civil procedure rules state that all claims for the of mortgage arrears in each of the last five years. repossession of land must be commenced in the district [275540] in which the land is situated. However, geographical boundaries of county courts may not necessarily be Bridget Prentice: The number of mortgage possession consistent with other administrative or constituency orders made in each year from 1990 and in each quarter boundaries. from 2004 are available via the Ministry of Justice These figures do not indicate how many homes have website at: actually been repossessed. Repossessions can occur without http://www.justice.gov.uk/publications/docs/stats-mortgage- a court order being made while not all court orders land-q1-2009.pdf result in repossession.

Number of mortgage1 possession orders made2, 3 in the county courts of England and Wales, by Government office region in which the court is located, 2004-08 2004 2005 2006 2007 2008* 2009 Qtr 1 4

East 4,647 7,058 8,421 8,212 10,334 1,604 East Midlands 3,619 5,511 7,179 7,807 9,690 1,401 London 7,788 13,110 15,214 14,120 15,318 2,274 North East 2,145 3,290 5,211 5,698 7,059 1,184 North West 6,492 9,115 13,222 14,968 19,150 2,903 South East 6,682 10,024 11,629 11,548 13,018 2,274 South West 3,254 4,956 5,776 5,763 7,736 1,065 West Midlands 5,318 7,606 10,223 11,290 14,342 1,789 Yorkshire and the Humber 4,091 6,349 8,511 9,459 12,112 1,821

England 44,036 67,019 85,386 88,865 108,759 16,315

Wales 2,647 3,945 5,440 6,048 8,113 1,272

England and Wales 46,683 70,964 90,826 94,913 116,872 17,587 1 Includes all types of mortgage lenders. 2 The court, follow hg a judicial hearing, may grant an order for possession immediately. This entitles the claimant to apply for a warrant to have the defendant evicted. However, even where a warrant for possession is issued, the parties can still negotiate a compromise to prevent eviction. 3 Includes outright and suspended orders, the latter being where the court grants the claimant possession but suspends the operation of the order. Provided the defendant complies with the terms of suspension, which usually require the defendant to pay the current mortgage or rent instalments plus some of the accrued arrears, the possession order cannot be enforced. 4 Figures for the latest quarter are provisional. Note: The Mortgage Pre Action Protocol for possession claims relating to mortgage or home purchase arrears was introduced on 19 November 2008. Its introduction has coincided with a substantial fall in the number of new mortgage possession claims in 2008 quarter 4 and subsequently in the number of mortgage possession orders in 2009 quarter 1. Source: Ministry of Justice 1221W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1222W

Terrorism: Compensation Phil Hope: We are informed by the Care Quality Commission (CQC) that the numbers of services operating Mr. McCartney: To ask the Secretary of State for in Leicester city council area and in England are as Justice pursuant to the answer of 11 May 2009, Official shown in the following table. Report, column 533W, on terrorism: compensation, Leicester city which (a) Departmental officials and (b) Ministers Ownership type council England have been appointed to the working group on support for victims of terrorism abroad; what options are being Charity 3 843 considered by that working group; what timetable has Local authority 11 1,055 been set for that working group to report; and when he National health service — 193 next expects that working group to meet. [275950] Other — 102 Private 90 14,052 Mr. Straw: The working group brings together officials Voluntary 9 2,168 from across Government and includes representatives Total 113 18,413 from the following Departments: Note: Services include care and nursing homes inspected against the national minimum Humanitarian Assistance Unit standards for care homes for older people (aged 65 or over) and care homes for Foreign and Commonwealth Office younger adults (aged 18-64). Source: Office for Criminal Justice Reform CQC registration and inspection database. Data as at 8 April 2009. Ministry of Justice Information on the total numbers of residents, those Criminal Injuries Compensation Authority aged over 60 and those whose care is privately funded in Ministry of Defence care homes is not collected centrally. Northern Ireland Office Information about the number of people aged 65 and Scotland Office over in residential care, funded fully or in part by HM Treasury. councils with adult social services responsibilities, is collected by the NHS Information Centre for health There will be a separate ministerial group which will and social care. This information is shown in the following include the Minister with responsibility for Humanitarian table. Assistance, a Foreign Office Minister, the Home Secretary, the Attorney-General and the Justice Secretary. Council supported residents aged 65 and over at 31 March 2008 Independent The working group of officials will look at all available Area Residential care homes nursing homes options and put together detailed proposals for Council Independent consideration by the ministerial group. The working group will meet regularly and is expected England 18,000 106,600 57,700 Leicester city 300 700 200 to report to Ministers in the summer. council Note: Figures exclude unstaffed homes and adult placements. Source: NHS Information Centre. HEALTH Dementia Abortion Mr. Laurence Robertson: To ask the Secretary of Mr. Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for Health State for Health what support is available from his (1) if he will place in the Library a copy of each Department to (a) those diagnosed with dementia and document in his Department’s file CPO 2/25 Lord (b) the carers of those with dementia; whether he Braine of Wheatley’s Partial Birth Abortion (Prohibition) plans to increase this support; and if he will make a Bill; and if he will make a statement; [264612] statement. [275888] (2) if he will place in the Library a copy of each document in his Department’s file CPO 2/6 Lord Robertson Phil Hope: The Department published the first National of Oakridge, Abortion Amendment Bill Briefing for Dementia Strategy on 3 February 2009, which will Legislation Committee and Second Reading Debate; improve services for people with dementia and their and if he will make a statement; [264614] carers. The strategy to be implemented over five years (3) if he will place in the Library a copy of each will focus on three key areas in relation to dementia document in his Department’s file CPO 2/4 10 Minute services: improved awareness, earlier diagnosis and Rule Bill (Jo Richardson) NHS Act 1977 (Amendment) intervention, and a higher quality of care. Bill; and if he will make a statement. [266970] The Carers’ Strategy, “Carers at the heart of 21st century families and communities”, published in June Dawn Primarolo: A copy of the files has been placed 2008, recognises the increasingly important role that in the Library. carers play in our society and acknowledges that all Care Homes carers, including carers of those diagnosed with dementia, need more help and support than has been available in Keith Vaz: To ask the Secretary of State for Health the past. The strategy contains a number of commitments how many care homes in (a) England and (b) Leicester including information and advice, new break provision are operated by (i) local authorities and (ii) private and a recognition that family carers should be involved enterprises; and what estimate he has made of the in decisions about treatment and support. number of persons over 60 years old resident in each Copies of both publications have already been placed category of home. [273693] in the Library. 1223W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1224W

Departmental ICT Hertfordshire primary care trusts (PCTs). Therefore the PCTs retain all the statutory functions of those Tim Loughton: To ask the Secretary of State for organisations. Health on how many and what proportion of computers in his Department malware was detected in Mike Penning: To ask the Secretary of State for 2008. [275393] Health what role the Care Quality Commission will play in the regulation of the arms-length organisation Mr. Bradshaw: There were no instances of malware Hertfordshire Community Health Services. [275373] being detected on the Department’s computers in 2008. Mr. Bradshaw: All national health service providers Health Professions: Registration of health care, including primary care trusts (PCTs), have been registered with the Care Quality Commission Mr. Burstow: To ask the Secretary of State for since 1 April 2009 against a single registration requirement Health which professional organisations have applied relating to the prevention and control of health care to be registered by the Health Professions Council; acquired infections. From April 2010, NHS providers when each such application was made; and if he will of regulated activities will be required to register with make a statement. [275598] the Care Quality Commission against a full set of registration requirements. The Care Quality Commission Mr. Bradshaw: The following organisations have applied will also assess PCT provider services as part of its for their professionals to be registered by the Health organisational assessment of PCTs. Professions Council (HPC). 2 April 2003. The Association of Operating Department Mike Penning: To ask the Secretary of State for Practitioners. Operating Department Practitioners. Recommended Health how much (a) has been allocated and (b) is to the Secretary of State, on the HPC register since 2004; expected to be spent on renaming (i) West Hertfordshire 4 June 2003: The British Psychological Society. Applied Primary Care Trust and (ii) East and North Hertfordshire Psychologists. Recommended to the Secretary of State, on the Primary Care Trust. [275374] HPC register from 1 July 2009; 17 September 2003. The Society of Clinical Perfusion Scientists of Great Britain. Clinical Perfusion Scientists. Recommended Phil Hope: Allocations are made to primary care to the Secretary of State; trusts (PCTs) and it is their responsibility to ensure that 8 October 2003. The Registration Council for Clinical Physiologists. those allocations are used to commission services to Clinical Physiologists. Recommended to the Secretary of State; meet the needs of the communities that they serve while 2 March 2004. The Association of Dance Movement Therapy. at the same time giving value for money. The East of Dance Movement Therapists. Recommended to the Secretary England Strategic Health Authority (SHA) reports that of State; the cost implications for renaming West Hertfordshire 13 May 2004. The Voluntary Register of Clinical Technologists. PCT and East and North Hertfordshire PCT will be Clinical Technologists. Recommended to the Secretary of State; very limited and restricted largely to the production of 14 September 2004. The Institute of Medical Illustrators. new name badges for staff. There are no immediate Medical Illustrators. Recommended to the Secretary of State; plans to replace any premises signage. The SHA also 13 September 2005. The Institute of Maxillofacial Prosthetists reports that there will be little or no cost to making the and Technologists. Maxillofacial Prosthetists and Technologists. name change in other areas such as email signatures, Recommended to the Secretary of State subject to clarifying websites and stationery reprints, the latter only taking the education routes to registration and also the nature of the place as stationery stocks diminish. profession’s continuing professional development and that they engage in discussions with one of the professions already regulated by the HPC with a view to being regulated under Mike Penning: To ask the Secretary of State for their umbrella; Health what his most recent assessment is of the 1 March 2006 and 11 May 2006. The Society of Sports Therapists. performance of the Hertfordshire Community Health Sports Therapists. Recommended to the Secretary of State; Service. [275551] 3 July 2008. Society and College of Radiographers. Sonographers. Outstanding, awaiting publication of extending professional Phil Hope: The Care Quality Commission will continue regulation working group report; and to assess the provider services of primary care trusts 11 September 2008. The HPC considered the report of the (PCTs) as part of their assessment of PCTs. The Healthcare Department of Health working group on acupuncture, herbal Commission’s annual health check ratings for West medicine, traditional Chinese medicine and other traditional Hertfordshire PCT and East and North Hertfordshire medicine systems practised in the United Kingdom as if it were PCT is shown in the following table. a new professions application. Recommended to the Secretary of State. West Hertfordshire East and North PCT Hertfordshire PCT Hertfordshire Community Health Services 2006-07 Mike Penning: To ask the Secretary of State for Quality of service Weak Weak Health what statutory functions will be undertaken by Use of resources Weak Weak the arms-length organisation Hertfordshire Community Health Services. [275372] 2007-08 Quality of service Fair Fair Phil Hope: Hertfordshire Community Health Services Use of resources Fair Fair is the provider arm of the West and East and North 1225W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1226W

Hospitals: ICT Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation Trust

Mr. Godsiff: To ask the Secretary of State for Health Mr. Kidney: To ask the Secretary of State for Health what the financial implications for the NHS are of BT what steps his Department is taking to scrutinise the not installing core IT systems at (a) all major hospital performance of Mid-Staffordshire NHS Foundation trusts in London and (b) all major hospital trusts in Trust in dealing with complaints; and if he will make a Birmingham. [275707] statement. [274917] Mr. Bradshaw [holding answer 14 May 2009]: In London, four acute trusts, Barnet and Chase Farm Mr. Bradshaw: The primary care trust (PCT) monitors Hospitals, Queen Mary’s Sidcup, Barts and the London, performance and scrutinises complaints through the and the Royal Free Hampstead NHS Trusts are already Commissioning Quality Review Committee meetings. live with the Cerner Millennium system supplied by the The complaints report is presented at the PCTs Quality local service provider, BT. Scrutiny Committee, which looks at the response rates, key themes and any trends. This is then reported through BT is not responsible for the implementation of systems the Governance Group meetings at the PCT. The PCT in Birmingham. reports complaints at its monthly trust board as part of While the scale of the challenge in implementing new the performance report. As a result of the situation in IT systems into acute trusts must not be underestimated, Mid Staffordshire, the PCT offered to advocate on and initial experience with the new systems in London behalf of patients and will continue to offer this service. was not without difficulties, significant progress has More generally, the Department has reformed and since been made. strengthened the national health service complaints system Information about the local financial and resource from 1 April this year. This sets the expectation that impact on national health service organisations resulting hospitals need to do better at resolving complaints at from implementation of, or failure to implement, computer the local level and, importantly, take appropriate action systems is not held centrally, and could be obtained in the light of the outcome of a complaint. only at disproportionate cost. Information on complaints is already available from Under the national programme for information the Care Quality Commission, the ombudsman and the technology central contracts, suppliers are only paid Information Centre, but we will now require hospitals when systems have been successfully deployed and are to publish annually the number of complaints they working satisfactorily. The cost of failure is therefore receive, and how many were successfully resolved locally. met by the supplier rather than the taxpayer. We will also discuss with the health ombudsman publishing the number of complaints from each trust referred to Mental Health Services: Prisons and upheld by her. All this information will also be placed on the NHS Choices website allowing easier Keith Vaz: To ask the Secretary of State for Health comparisons between hospitals. what his estimate is of the number of prisoners with a A written ministerial statement was issued on 30 diagnosed mental health disorder; what percentage of April 2009 setting out the Government response to the prisoners who (a) had a diagnosed mental health reports on care at Mid-Staffordshire NHS Foundation disorder prior to conviction and (b) have been Trust submitted by Professor Sir George Alberti and diagnosed with schizophrenia; and what proportion of Dr. David Colin-Thome. prisoners diagnosed with (i) schizophrenia and (ii) another mental health disorder had been convicted of In line with the recommendations in Dr. David Colin- an offence involving violence. [274625] Thome’s report, officials will undertake an assessment of the new complaints system in due course. Phil Hope: This information is not collected by the Department. Mr. Kidney: To ask the Secretary of State for Health On 30 April 2009, Lord Bradley published his review what recent guidance his Department has issued to of people with mental health problems or learning Mid-Staffordshire NHS Foundation Trust on the disabilities in the criminal justice system. The “Bradley exercise of the statutory powers of the trust’s Report” found that too many people pass through the governors; and if he will make a statement. [274919] criminal justice system without their mental health needs or learning disabilities being recognised. This Mr. Bradshaw: The statutory powers of an NHS means that their specific needs are not met and too Foundation Trust’s board of governors are set out in often this leads to a cycle of re-offending. the National Health Service Act 2006 (c41) Schedule 7 The prevalence among suspects and offenders, of —“Constitution of public benefit corporations”. mental disorders, learning disabilities, and drug and In general, the governors of a foundation trust are alcohol problems is very high. Around 20 per cent. will expected to represent the interests of the membership, either currently be in contact with, or have a history of and to act as a bridge between the Board of Directors psychiatric treatment. and the membership. Governors must act in the best The Government published their response to the interest of the trust, and hold the board of directors to recommendations alongside Lord Bradley’s report. The account for the performance of the trust. This includes report has been welcomed by Ministers across Government reviewing the annual report and accounts. The governors who recognise the need for reform in this area and the have a legal duty to appoint the non-executive directors necessity for more joined up services to strengthen and chair of the trust, and are responsible for appointing capacity and take forward this work. the external auditors. 1227W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1228W

It is for the governors of an NHS Foundation Trust, Department has made it clear that every NHS trust acting on behalf of the trust’s membership, to consider must have in place local policies and procedures that whether and when to act in accordance with their legal comply with the Act. The Government expect a climate powers. The Secretary of State does not have a power of of openness and dialogue in the NHS that encourages direction. NHS Foundation Trusts were established to staff to feel able to raise concerns about health care increase the level of local accountability and the Department matters sensibly and responsibly without fear of has not issued any guidance to Mid-Staffordshire NHS victimisation. The NHS Constitution published on Foundation Trust on the exercise of the statutory powers 21 January 2009, also sets out how staff should have of the trust’s governors. “protection from detriment in employment and the A written ministerial statement on Mid-Staffordshire right not to be unfairly dismissed for ‘whistleblowing’ NHS Foundation Trust was issued on 30 April 2009 in or reporting wrongdoing in the workplace.” response to the reports of the independent reviews We have taken out a contract with the charity “Public undertaken by Professor Sir George Alberti and Dr. Concern at Work” to provide a helpline that is manned David Colin-Thome. by lawyers with expertise on whistleblowing law who can provide confidential advice and support to NHS NHS Foundation Trusts: Pay staff.

Mr. Gordon Prentice: To ask the Secretary of State NHS: Information and Communications Technology for Health what requirements there are on NHS Foundation Trusts to publish details of the salaries and Tim Loughton: To ask the Secretary of State for remuneration packages offered to their chief executives Health on how many and what proportion of and senior managers; and if he will make a statement. computers in NHS hospitals malware was detected in [276039] 2008. [275400]

Mr. Bradshaw: The independent regulator (Monitor) Mr. Bradshaw: The information requested is not held requires foundation trusts to produce annual reports centrally and could be obtained only at disproportionate including annual accounts. These include details of cost. salaries and remuneration packages of chief executives Tranquillisers and senior managers. Copies of these documents are placed in the House of Commons Library. As a public benefit corporation, NHS Foundation Trusts have a Jim Dobbin: To ask the Secretary of State for Health duty to make this published data available to any person how many (a) prescriptions and (b) in-patient who requests it. prescriptions were issued for each (i) benzodiazepine and (ii) Z tranquilliser in (A) 2007 and (B) the last NHS: Disclosure of Information quarter of 2008. [274692]

Mr. Kidney: To ask the Secretary of State for Health Dawn Primarolo: Information is not held centrally for if he will bring forward proposals to amend the law to the number of prescription items issued, only for increase levels of protection for whistleblowers in the prescription items dispensed. Similarly, information on NHS; and if he will make a statement. [274916] the number of in-patient prescriptions is not held in the format requested. Mr. Bradshaw: We have already introduced legislation The following table provides prescriptions for to protect whistleblowers. The Public Interest Disclosure Benzodiazepine items, dispensed in the community, in Act 1998 (PIDA) gives the full protection of the law to England, and written in the United Kingdom, for 2007 national health service staff who blow the whistle. The and 2008, by quarters (Q1-Q4), in thousands.

Benzodiazepines items Thousand Q1 Q2 Q3 04 Full year

2007 Alprazolam — — — <0.1 <0.1 Chlordiazepoxide Hydrochloride 69.9 68.4 68.0 66.3 272.6 Clobazam 35.3 36.4 37.4 38.9 147.9 Clonazepam 113.6 116.5 119.0 125.0 474.1 Diazepam 1,160.4 1,169.8 1,192.2 1,200.1 4,722.5 Flurazepam Hydrochloride — ———— Loprazolam Mesilate 27.9 26.8 26.5 26.9 108.1 Lorazepam 215.0 218.0 221.9 226.9 881.8 Lormetazepam 32.6 30.4 28.3 27.8 119.1 Midazolam — — 0.2 1.6 1.9 Midazolam Hydrochloride 11.1 12.1 12.5 13.5 49.2 Midazolam Maleate 0.7 1.0 1.8 0.8 4.3 Nitrazepam 318.6 311.8 308.0 311.5 1,249.9 Oxazepam 47.6 47.2 46.9 47.1 188.8 Temazepam 829.5 803.9 802.8 818.6 3,254.8 1229W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1230W

Benzodiazepines items Thousand Q1 Q2 Q3 04 Full year

2008 Alprazolam <0.1 <0.1 <0.1 <0.1 <0.1 Chlordiazepoxide Hydrochloride 64.8 64.6 65.9 63.9 259.2 Clobazam 37.9 39.3 40.6 42.3 160.1 Clonazepam 123.8 126.4 132.5 138.1 520.8 Diazepam 1,178.1 1,201.5 1,236.8 1,246.8 4,863.1 Flurazepam Hydrochloride <0.1 <0.1 <0.1 <0.1 <0.1 Loprazolam Mesilate 26.4 26.0 25.8 26.0 104.2 Lorazepam 219.2 221.6 225.8 232.0 898.6 Lormetazepam 25.1 23.4 22.3 21.2 92.0 Midazolam 1.0 0.8 0.5 0.2 2.6 Midazolam Hydrochloride 13.2 14.3 15.0 16.3 58.9 Midazolam Maleate 0.7 0.7 1.5 2.3 5.2 Nitrazepam 296.3 292.4 290.2 293.9 1,172.8 Oxazepam 44.9 45.0 44.9 45.3 180.0 Temazepam 792.2 770.7 772.2 787.1 3,122.2 Notes: 1. Where there were fewer than 50 prescriptions dispensed this is indicated by “<0.1”. 2. “—” indicates that there were no prescriptions dispensed in the time period. 3. Aggregated figures may not match full-year volumes due to rounding. Source Prescription Cost Analysis (PCA) system

The following table provides prescriptions for “Z” Membership of the CHM and the expert advisory tranquilliser items, dispensed in the community, in England, groups is available on the Medicines and Healthcare and written in the UK, for 2007 and 2008, by quarters products Regulatory Agency website at: (Q1-Q4), in thousands. www.mhra.gov.uk/Committees/Medicinesadvisorybodies/ “Z” tranquilisers items CommissiononHumanMedicines/Members/index.htm Thousand Jim Dobbin: To ask the Secretary of State for Health Full Q1 Q2 Q3 Q4 year what research his Department has (a) commissioned and (b) evaluated on the potential permanent effects 2007 on health of long-term tranquilliser use in the last 10 Zaleplon 8.5 7.7 7.8 7.8 31.9 years; and what assessment he has made of the Zolpidem 172.5 168.2 170.5 175.5 686.6 conclusions of such research. [276015] Tartrate Zopiclone 1,097.1 1,073.1 1,094.3 1,150.4 4,414.9 Dawn Primarolo: Neither the Department’s National Institute for Health Research nor the Medical Research Council has funded research into the permanent effects 2008 on health of long-term tranquilliser use. Both organisations Zaleplon 7.5 7.0 7.1 7.4 29.0 welcome applications for support for research into any Zolpidem 173.3 169.9 173.0 179.5 695.8 aspect of human health. Applications are judged in Tartrate open competition with other demands on funding, with Zopiclone 1,151.2 1,136.0 1,172.4 1,232.1 4,691.7 awards being made on the basis of the scientific quality Note: of the proposals made. Aggregated figures may not match full-year volumes due to rounding. Source: Prescription Cost Analysis (PCA) system INNOVATION, UNIVERSITIES AND SKILLS Jim Dobbin: To ask the Secretary of State for Health if he will consider the merits of introducing specialist Building Colleges for the Future Programme tranquilliser withdrawal clinics. [274693] Mr. Hayes: To ask the Secretary of State for Innovation, Universities and Skills (1) which colleges Dawn Primarolo: The provision of treatments/services will receive funds from the £300 million allocated to that reflect local needs and priorities is a matter for Building Colleges for the Future in the 2009 Budget; local decision. [274038] (2) how many projects will receive funds from the Jim Dobbin: To ask the Secretary of State for Health £300 million allocated to Building Colleges for the which members of the Commission on Human Future in the 2009 Budget. [274039] Medicines provide scientific advice on tranquillisers to his Department. [274966] Mr. Simon: Budget 2009 announced that an additional £300 million of capital funding will be made available in Dawn Primarolo: The Commission on Human Medicines the current spending round and will allow a limited (CHM) provides its advice to the Secretary of State as a number of projects to start within this spending review collective body and not through individual experts. period. Capital investment between 2007-08 and 2010-11 1231W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1232W will total £2.6 billion on top of the £2 billion invested capital programmes in 2009-2014 he estimates will be between 1997-98 and 2007-08. It is not possible to say allocated for outstanding costs of existing capital the exact number of, or the names of the specific programmes. [276281] projects, that will be funded as the selection of projects will be based on objective criteria that the LSC is Mr. Simon: Budget 2009 announced that an additional developing in consultation with the sector. The LSC £300 million of capital funding will be made available in plan to confirm which projects will be taken forward the current spending round and will allow a limited during this spending review period at the beginning of number of projects to start within this spending review the summer. period. Capital investment between 2007-08 and 2010-11 will total £2.6 billion on top of the £2 billion invested Mr. Evennett: To ask the Secretary of State for between 1997-98 and 2007-08. It is not possible to say Innovation, Universities and Skills if he will place in the exact number of, or the names of the specific the Library a copy of the minutes of the meeting held projects, that will be funded as the selection of projects on 29 April 2009 of the panel of college principals will be based on objective criteria that the LSC is established to discuss prioritisation of further developing in consultation with the sector. The LSC education capital funding. [274234] plan to confirm which projects will be taken forward during this spending review period at the beginning of Mr. Simon: The minutes of this meeting were published the summer. on the Learning and Skills Council’s website on 30 April, at: Mr. Willis: To ask the Secretary of State for Innovation, http://readingroom.lsc.gov.uk/lsc/National/nat- Universities and Skills what his latest estimate is of the Minutes_capital_reference_group_29_april_2009.pdf level of non-recoverable costs incurred by further education I will ensure copies of the minutes are placed in the and other colleges resulting from the reused allocations House Libraries. of capital funding by his Department; and what arrangements he has made to compensate colleges for Energy Performance Certificates such costs. [276282]

Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr. Simon: To be clear, the Department has not Innovation, Universities and Skills what responsibilities withdrawn any capital funding. In actual fact, in addition the National Measurement Office has for enforcement to the already record level of capital funding that we are of the provisions of the Energy Performance of Buildings investing in this spending review period, Budget 2009 (Certificates and Inspections) (England and Wales) announced that an additional £300 million of capital Regulations 2007. [276167] funding will be made available in the current spending round. Mr. Lammy: The National Measurement Office has Capital funding for further education colleges is no responsibilities for the enforcement of the provisions administered by the Learning and Skills Council (LSC). of the Energy Performance of Buildings (Certificates As the information requested is with regard to an and Inspections) (England and Wales) Regulations 2007. operational matter for the council, I have asked Geoffrey The Regulations themselves are the responsibility of the Russell, the acting LSC chief executive, to write to the Department for Communities and Local Government hon. Member with the further information requested. and enforcement is a matter for local authorities with A copy of his letter will be placed in the House Libraries. trading standards functions. Like any other part of government the Office is Mr. Willis: To ask the Secretary of State for responsible for complying with the regulations in respect Innovation, Universities and Skills how much funding of its own building. each further education college which has not received Further Education: Finance an approval in detail for capital redevelopment has been guaranteed by the Learning and Skills Council to cover their start-up costs. [276283] Mr. Willis: To ask the Secretary of State for Innovation, Universities and Skills how much funding Mr. Simon: Capital funding for further education has been allocated by his Department to cover the colleges is administered by the Learning and Skills start-up costs of each further education college which Council (LSC). As the information requested is with received approval in principle for capital development regard to an operational matter for the council, I have from the Learning and Skills Council. [276280] asked Geoffrey Russell, the acting LSC chief executive, to write to the hon. Member with the further information Mr. Simon: Capital funding for further education requested. A copy of his letter will be placed in the colleges is administered by the Learning and Skills House Libraries. Council (LSC). As the information requested is with regard to an operational matter for the Council, I have asked Geoffrey Russell, the acting LSC chief executive, Further Education: Finance to write to the hon. Member with the further information requested. A copy of his letter will be placed in the Adam Afriyie: To ask the Secretary of State for House Libraries. Innovation, Universities and Skills pursuant to the answer of 30 April 2009, whether Matthew Boulton College in Mr. Willis: To ask the Secretary of State for Birmingham has submitted plans to the Learning and Innovation, Universities and Skills how much of the Skills Council for developing the campus in the £1.2 billion funding available for new further education Birmingham, Erdington constituency. [273122] 1233W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1234W

Mr. Simon [holding answer 18 May 2009]: Capital LSC office Occupancy funding for further education colleges is administered by the Learning and Skills Council (LSC). As the Lancashire—Preston 27 information requested is with regard to an operational Cheshire and Warrington 14 matter for the council, I have asked Geoffrey Russell, Cumbria 16 the acting LSC chief executive, to write to the hon. Birmingham 228 Member with the further information requested. A Stoke on Trent 30 copy of his letter will be placed in the House Libraries. Shropshire 0 Black Country Castlegate 29 Adam Afriyie: To ask the Secretary of State for Black Country Oldbury 0 Innovation, Universities and Skills what estimate his Hereford/Worcester 40 Department has made of the effect on Sutton Coldfield Coventry and Warwickshire 27 and Matthew Boulton colleges arising from the freeze London—Central 195 on capital spending on their Erdington campus. London—West 32 [273282] London—East 54 Mr. Simon [holding answer 7 May 2009]: Capital London—North 26 funding for further education colleges is administered London—South 29 by the Learning and Skills Council (LSC). As the Gateshead 165 information requested is with regard to an operational Billingham—Tees Valley 40 matter for the council, I have asked Geoffrey Russell, Durham 0 the acting LSC chief executive, to write to the hon. Bradford 165 Member with the further information requested. A Sheffield 107 copy of his letter will be placed in the House Libraries. Hull 27 Yo rk 2 7 Mr. Paul Goodman: To ask the Secretary of State for Cambridge 20 Innovation, Universities and Skills when the Learning Bedfordshire 55 and Skills Council and its external property advisers Suffolk—Ipswich 82 plan to meet representatives of Wycombe and Hertfordshire 32 Amersham college. [273431] Essex 27 Norfolk—Norwich 23 Mr. Simon [holding answer 7 May 2009]: Capital Leicester 147 funding for further education colleges is administered Derbyshire 29 by the Learning and Skills Council (LSC). As the Lincoln 18 information requested is with regard to an operational Northampton 16 matter for the council, I have asked Geoffrey Russell, Nottingham 32 the acting LSC chief executive, to write to the hon. Bristol 76 Member with the further information requested. A copy of his letter will be placed in the House Libraries. Bournemouth 17 Plymouth Devon and Cornwall 81 Learning and Skills Council Truro—Devon and Cornwall 11 Exeter—Devon and Cornwall 9 Mr. Evennett: To ask the Secretary of State for Gloucester 14 Innovation, Universities and Skills how many people Taunton—Somerset 18 are employed in each office of the (a) Learning and Swindon 24 Skills Council and (b) Higher Education Funding Reading 97 Council for England. [274232] East and West Sussex—Brighton 70 Fareham 56 Mr. Simon: The Higher Education Funding Council Woking—Surrey 33 for England employs 263 full-time equivalent staff; 259 Milton Keynes 14 in Bristol and four in London. Kent/Medway—West Malling 53 The management of the Learning and Skills Council Total 3,208 (LSC) estate is a matter for the LSC. As at March 2009 the LSC had 3,046.41 full-time equivalent (FTE) staff Space Technology in post. A breakdown of the number of staff based in each office of the LSC is provided as follows. The total Adam Afriyie: To ask the Secretary of State for occupancy varies slightly from the FTE figure as the Innovation, Universities and Skills what progress there FTE figure incorporates data on part time workers as a has been on the British National Space Centre’s review proportion of one FTE depending on individual working of the space licensing regime. [274001] patterns. Mr. Lammy: In recent years a number of changes LSC office Occupancy have been made to improve operation of the space licensing regime. Such changes include: National Office Coventry— 593 Cheylesmore House Extension of the Outer Space Act to Bermuda (2006) Manchester 240 Introduction of improved assessments of collision risk in-orbit Liverpool 43 and for the satellite’s transfer from the launch vehicle to its final working orbit (2006) 1235W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1236W

Improved guidance and planning information for applicants Jim Knight: We do not hold this information centrally. on BNSC website (2007) Officials from the Department have regular contact Agreement of the Isle of Man to share contingent liability with academies and this often includes attendance at (2007) governing body meetings. Agreement of Bermuda to share contingency liability (2008) Measures to enable the introduction of temporary licences for Apprentices operating spacecraft belonging to others (for maintenance or emergency intervention) (2008) Mr. Stephen O’Brien: To ask the Secretary of State Students: Low Incomes for Children, Schools and Families what estimate he has made of the average duration of an apprenticeship Rosie Cooper: To ask the Secretary of State for under the apprenticeship programme for 16 to 18-year- Innovation, Universities and Skills what steps his olds. [272679] Department is taking to (a) encourage and (b) provide financial support for students from low-income socio- Sarah McCarthy-Fry: Apprenticeship frameworks economic backgrounds entering higher education; and typically take between one to three years to complete if he will make a statement. [275745] depending on the level and type of framework, the prior attainment and needs of the apprentice. These factors Mr. Lammy: The information is as follows: and an individual’s speed of learning mean that length of time as an apprentice can vary enormously. Our (a) This Government are fully committed to ensuring primary measure of quality is the completion rate which every young person has a fair chance of attending last year was 64 per cent.; up from 37 per cent. in university. We are making progress with the proportion 2004/05. of young entrants from lower socio economic groups going to university increasing steadily, reaching almost The Government are committed to rebuilding 30 per cent. in 2007. This year we are investing £89 apprenticeships. Since 1997, we have witnessed a renaissance million in the Aimhigher programme which raises the in apprenticeships from a low point of 65,000 to a aspirations of young people to progress further and record 225,000 apprenticeship starts in 2007/08. enter HE, and launched Aimhigher Associates across Building Schools for the Future Programme England with 5,500 undergraduates from state schools mentoring 21,000 learners to promote progression to HE from state schools. Alan Simpson: To ask the Secretary of State for As part of the New Opportunities White Paper, we Children, Schools and Families how many of the schools also announced further measures to ensure every young built or refurbished under the Building Schools for the (a) person from a low income background, who could Future programme incorporate forms of renewable (b) benefit from going to university, is given the opportunity energy generation and rainwater harvesting and to do so. This includes a group of 11 research intensive recycling. [275628] universities working together to look at ways to reach out to talented students from disadvantaged backgrounds. Jim Knight: The Department does not routinely collect information on the numbers and types of renewable (b) Around two-thirds of new students are expected energy systems, rainwater harvesting installations or to benefit from a non-repayable maintenance grant of grey water recovery systems that are included within up to £2,906 (2009/10 figure). school projects delivered though the Building Schools Students are also able to take out a loan for their for the Future programme (BSF). living costs. Student loans have a more favourable interest Since December 2007 we have required that newly rate compared to commercial loans, and borrowers are constructed schools within BSF meet challenging targets not required to make repayments until they are earning for reducing carbon emissions. The Department has over £15,000 a year once they have left university. provided additional funding for more than 200 schools Bursaries are an extra source of non-repayable support to invest in energy efficiency and renewable energy that universities are required to provide to all students measures on school sites to enable this requirement to entitled to the full maintenance grant. be met. Other help is available for students with disabilities, We will be monitoring carbon emissions for new and and for students with children or adult dependants. The refurbished schools as part of post occupancy evaluations access to learning fund (available through universities to be carried for all BSF schools. Typically these evaluations and colleges) provides help for students in hardship take place one full calendar year after the school has who may need extra financial support for their course opened, and so they are only now beginning to take and to stay in higher education. place for schools that have been delivered within BSF.

Mr. Gibb: To ask the Secretary of State for Children, CHILDREN, SCHOOLS AND FAMILIES Schools and Families what recent progress has been made in confirming approval for revision to the Academies primary capital programme for schools to 2008-11. [276237] Mr. Laws: To ask the Secretary of State for Children, Schools and Families how many meetings of governing Jim Knight: We have now completed our assessment bodies academies have been attended by officials from of revised or modified primary strategies for change his Department in each year since 2000; and if he will from all of those local authorities required to resubmit make a statement. [275094] following initial assessment last November. All but four 1237W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1238W have now been confirmed as fully approved. The remainder been estimated. However, Sir Jim Rose is taking into have been approved subject to further modification. account the evaluation report of the programme’s first The relevant local authorities have been notified of the two-years, which was published in February, as part of outcome. developing recommendations on the identification and teaching of children with dyslexia. We are looking Children: Literacy forward to Sir Jim Rose publishing his recommendations in June. Mrs. Maria Miller: To ask the Secretary of State for Children, Schools and Families (1) what steps his Department plans to take to publicise the results of the Children: Mental Health Services Partnership for Literacy pilot scheme; [276168] (2) what assessment he has made of the outcome of Tim Loughton: To ask the Secretary of State for the Partnership for Literacy pilot scheme; [276169] Children, Schools and Families how many children (3) what plans are in place to implement the were placed on adult mental health wards in each of Partnership for Literacy scheme; [276170] the last five years. [275651] (4) what estimate has been made of the cost of implementing the Partnership for Literacy scheme on a Phil Hope: I have been asked to reply. national basis. [276172] The following table gives figures for the number of bed days for children on child and adolescent mental Sarah McCarthy-Fry: The cost of implementing the health wards and for children aged under 16 and 16-17 Partnership for Literacy scheme nationwide has not on adult mental health wards.

Bed days - under 18s on Quarter Bed days - under 16s on adult ward Bed days -16/17s on adult ward CAMHS ward

2005-06 1 589 10,269 38,761 2 349 5,958 26,351 3 880 8,818 40,460 4 353 4,261 36,039 2006-07 1 75 4,697 34,609 2 25 4,780 28,171 3 38 4,679 34,430 4 53 4,511 39,049 2007-08 1 81 3,954 38,359 2 112 3,893 37,956 3 49 4,255 39,630 4 133 5,028 40,651 2008-09 1 16 3,316 35,431 2 14 4,024 35,482 3 0 2,918 40,734 1 Five bed days were initially reported but one (Berkshire Healthcare NHS Foundation Trust) was a data error. Notes: Data on this issue was first collected in 2005-06 but data up until Quarter 3 of 2005-06 is not comparable with the data for Quarter 4 2005-06 onwards as information was collected on a different basis.

Class Sizes: Tamworth Maintained primary1 and state-funded secondary1, 2 schools: average class size3, as at January each year, in Tamworth parliamentary constituency. Mr. Jenkins: To ask the Secretary of State for Primary schools Secondary schools Children, Schools and Families what the average class size in (a) primary and (b) secondary schools in 2008 25.4 19.3 Tamworth constituency was in each of the last five 1 Includes middle-schools as deemed. 2 Includes CTCs and academies. [274136] years. 3 One teacher classes as taught during a single selected period in each school on the day of the census in January. Jim Knight: The requested information is shown in Source: the table. School Census Maintained primary1 and state-funded secondary1, 2 schools: average class size3, as at January each year, in Tamworth parliamentary Departmental Assets constituency. Primary schools Secondary schools Bob Spink: To ask the Secretary of State for 2004 25.4 20.9 Children, Schools and Families when his Department 2005 25.7 21.0 last reviewed its assets and land and property holdings 2006 25.5 20.3 with a view to identifying and disposing of surpluses. 2007 25.4 20.5 [269857] 1239W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1240W

Sarah McCarthy-Fry: The Department for Children, Sarah McCarthy-Fry: Details of expenditure on Schools and Families (DCSF) Property Asset Management conferences incurred by the Department for Children, Plan was revised in October 2008. Schools and Families (DCSF) in the last five years are The Department’s Business Plan includes challenging as follows: efficiency targets to reduce the size and cost of its estate while improving the quality of our working environments. £ Both of these objectives are addressed in DCSF’s Property 2008-09 978,338 Asset Management Plan. 2007-08 692,232 DCSF has already made significant progress in efficiency 2006-07 1,284,335 and effectiveness as shown in “Improving the Efficiency 2005-06 945,416 of Central Government’s use of office property” released 2004-05 1,082,099 by the NAO recently. DCSF is unable to separately identify the costs for Departmental Billing conference services and banqueting services as such expenditure is recorded under the general heading of Mr. Philip Hammond: To ask the Secretary of State ‘Conference Costs’ on the Department’s financial system. for Children, Schools and Families how much his DCSF was established under Machinery of Government Department and its predecessor paid in interest to changes on 28 June 2007. The expenditure recorded suppliers under the Late Payment of Commercial Debts also relates to that of its predecessor Department, the (Interest) Act 1998 in the last three years for which Department for Education and Skills. figures are available. [275208] Departmental Press Releases Sarah McCarthy-Fry: I can confirm that the Department for Children, Schools and Families and its predecessor Mr. Laws: To ask the Secretary of State for Children, did not make any interest payments to suppliers under Schools and Families to which media organisations his the Late Payment of Commercial Debt (Interest) Act Department sends press releases. [272610] 1998 in the last three financial years from 2006-07 to 2008-09. Sarah McCarthy-Fry: The Department’s press releases are sent to all organisations representing national and Departmental Contracts regional TV, radio and newspapers, and a range of other media companies. All press releases are also posted Bob Spink: To ask the Secretary of State for Children, on the Department’s website. A list of all of the Schools and Families which services his Department organisations will be placed in the House Libraries. and its predecessors have outsourced in each of the last five years; and if he will make a statement. [274453] Departmental Public Expenditure

Sarah McCarthy-Fry: Since April 2004, the Department Michael Gove: To ask the Secretary of State for for Children, Schools and Families and its predecessor Children, Schools and Families with reference to table has not outsourced any services. All services currently 8.3 of his Department’s annual report 2008, pages 88-9, outsourced went through the process prior to this date. Detailed breakdown of expenditure by function within Departmental Furniture departmental expenditure limit, 2002-03 to 2010-11, which individual programmes and corresponding Grant Shapps: To ask the Secretary of State for allocations are aggregated as other miscellaneous Children, Schools and Families how much his programmes for 2010-11; which grants and corresponding Department and its predecessors spent on furniture in allocations are aggregated as other standards funds for (a) 2007-08 and (b) 2010-11; and which grants and each of the last five years. [273746] corresponding allocations are aggregated within area-based Sarah McCarthy-Fry: Expenditure by the Department grants for 2010-11. [271731] for Children, Schools and Families and its predecessors on furniture in each of the last five years is shown as Sarah McCarthy-Fry: The Department’s grants and follows: programmes aggregated as within other miscellaneous programmes for 2010-11 are provided in Table 1: Total cost (£) Table 1: Departmental report allocation—2010-11 Schools: £ million 2004/05 524,490 2005/06 315,124 Music and Dance 37 2006/07 123,703 Redundancy Costs 12 2007/08 1,297,092 TDA 593 2008-09 1,228,197 NCSL 84 Partnership for Schools 1 Departmental Official Hospitality Teachers TV 9 National Strategies 473 Bob Spink: To ask the Secretary of State for Children, Total 1,209 Schools and Families how much his Department and its predecessors has spent on (a) conference services and The Department’s grants and programmes aggregated (b) banqueting services in each of the last five years. as within Other standards funds for (a) 2007-08 and [274511] (b) 2010-11 are provided in Table 2: 1241W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1242W

Table 2: Departmental report allocation—2007-08 to 2010-11 Head Teachers: Retirement £ million Other Standards Mr. Graham Stuart: To ask the Secretary of State for Fund 2007-08 2010-11 Children, Schools and Families what estimate he has Schools 1,898 2,133 made of the number of head teachers in post in 2009 Development Grant who will have retired by (a) 2010, (b) 2015 and (c) Local Area 166 — 2020; and if he will make a statement. [275037] Agreement Grant Total 2,064 2,133 Jim Knight: As we said in the Children’s Plan, over 60 per cent. of head teachers are now over 50, which The Department’s grants and programmes aggregated means that within the next decade a whole generation as within area based grants for 2010-11 are provided in of head teachers will be retiring. Of the number of head Table 3: teachers in post in 2009 we estimate that by 2010, 6 per Table 3: Departmental area based grants figures—2010-11 cent. will have retired, by 2015 this will have risen to 38 1 DCSF grants to local authorities £ million per cent. and by 2020 it will have reached 55 per cent. Dealing with the loss of their skills and experience will Connexions 467 be a challenge but also an opportunity for innovation Extended Schools - Start Up 71 and reform. We have invested £30 million in the National School Development Grant (LA 168 College for School Leadership’s succession planning retained element) strategy which is working with schools, local authorities Children’s Fund 132 and faith bodies around the country to develop local Positive Activities for Young 95 solutions to find, develop and keep great head teachers. People 1 The estimates assume that the head teachers in post in 2009 will Care Matters 55 choose to retire at the current average age of 58 years. This Secondary National Strategy: 30 estimate is therefore a predictive trend of retirement as we cannot Central Co-ordination forecast with certainty the future retirement behaviours of individuals. Primary National Strategy: 30 Central Co-ordination Teenage Pregnancy 28 History: Primary Education School Improvement Partners 24 Extended Rights for Free Travel 29 Dr. Kumar: To ask the Secretary of State for Children, Children’s Social Care 18 Schools and Families what steps his Department is Workforce taking to improve the teaching of (a) history and (b) School Intervention 15 British history in primary schools. [274086] Flexible 14 to 19 Partnerships 15 Funding Sarah McCarthy-Fry: We asked Sir Jim Rose to review Secondary Behaviour and 14 the primary curriculum in order to reduce prescription Attendance: Central and give schools more time to teach essential knowledge Co-ordination and skills in greater depth. In the revised primary Education Health Partnerships 13 curriculum, it is proposed that, from 2011, schools will Child Death Review Processes 8 be required to teach children the broad chronology of Youth Substance Misuse 7 major events in the UK, from ancient civilisations to School Travel Advisers 7 present day. At least two key periods of history that Choice Advisers 6 were significant to the locality and the UK must be Youth Taskforce 4 studied in depth. A consultation on these proposals will General Duty on Sustainable 4 run until 24 July. Travel To School More specifically on support for teachers, the Training Designated Teacher Funding 3 and Development Agency (TDA) has supported History Child Trust Fund 1 initial teacher training (ITT) by providing access to Total area based grants 1,242 specialist subject knowledge for ITT tutors and mentors. This is delivered via the History subject resource network, The total in this table contains figures that have been led by the Historical Association. In 2008 TDA also updated since the publication of the 2008 Departmental funded the Historical Association to develop subject Report. specific online CPD opportunities. The e-CPD modules offer a package of support and a programme of professional Departmental Publications development activity for history tutors and teachers undertaking subject development or improvement projects Tim Loughton: To ask the Secretary of State for in their own schools. Children, Schools and Families how much his Department has spent on placing supplements in (a) Children and International Baccalaureate YoungPeople Now magazine and (b) Community Care magazine in the last 12 months. [274264] Michael Gove: To ask the Secretary of State for Children, Schools and Families how many pupils at (a) Sarah McCarthy-Fry: Since 1 May 2008, the Department maintained schools, (b) sixth form colleges, (c) independent has placed two items in Community Care magazine, at a schools and (d) comprehensive schools were entered cost of £6,228, and two in Children and Young People for the International Baccalaureate examination in each Now magazine, costing £27,861. of the last five years. [262264] 1243W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1244W

Jim Knight: The information is provided in the following local needs. Through good asset management processes, table. Data was not collected prior to 2005/06 and so they are encouraged to plan for future accommodation the information is available only for the past three years. requirements. Temporary accommodation is appropriate where there 2005/06 2006/07 2007/08 is too little time to construct permanent accommodation, Maintained schools 607 755 726 or where the need is likely to be short term. In such Comprehensive 365 510 452 circumstances, modern, high-quality temporary buildings Independent 922 1,152 1,313 provide a good environment for teaching and learning. Sixth form college 55 112 176 Where they are new or relocated, they are required to Other FE college 206 242 270 meet building environmental standards similar to those which apply to permanent buildings. Total 1,790 2,261 2,485 Notes: 1. Figures relate to 16 to 18-year-olds (age at start of academic year, Pupils: Obesity i.e. 31 August). 2. ‘Maintained schools’ include comprehensive, selective, modern, PRUs and hospital schools. Mr. Burstow: To ask the Secretary of State for Children, Source: Schools and Families what steps his Department is School and College Achievement and Attainment Tables data. taking to tackle childhood obesity; what proportion of school-age children he estimates are (a) overweight and (b) obese; and if he will make a statement. [269297] Primary Education Sarah McCarthy-Fry: In the year since the £372 Mr. Frank Field: To ask the Secretary of State for million “Healthy Weight, Healthy Lives: a Cross Children, Schools and Families what his most recent Government Strategy for England” was published there estimate is of the number of primary school places has been substantial progress. The “Healthy Weight, required for the academic years (a) 2009-10, (b) Healthy Lives: One YearOn”annual report was published 2010-11 and (c) 2011-12. [273857] last month, which sets out in detail our progress to date and also the areas we need to focus on over the next Sarah McCarthy-Fry: Local authorities are responsible year. A copy of the report is available on the DCSF and for planning the creation of new school places and are DH websites. under a duty to ensure sufficient school places are The two main sources of data on childhood obesity available to meet local needs. The Department allocates are the Health Survey for England (HSE) and National basic need funding to enable local authorities to provide Child Measurement Programme (NCMP). In 2008, the the additional places needed in response to a growth in HSE data showed that the estimated prevalence of pupil numbers. For funding the additional school places overweight among 2 to 15-year-olds was 14.0 per cent. the Department relies on authorities’ own estimates of and the prevalence of obesity was 16.5 per cent. The future primary and secondary pupil numbers, which 2007/8 NCMP results showed that in reception year they provide to the Department annually through the 13.0 per cent. of children were overweight and 9.6 per Surplus Places Survey. At January 2008 there were cent. were obese and that in Year 6 14.3 per cent. of 3.823 million pupils in primary schools in England and children were overweight and 18.3 per cent. were obese. local authorities estimated the primary school population would increase by around 2.5 per cent. over the following Michael Gove: To ask the Secretary of State for four academic years as follows: Children, Schools and Families what guidance his Department has issued on the education of highly LA estimated number of Annual increase obese children in each of the last three years. [274590] primary pupils (million) (percentage) 2008-09 3.833 +0.26 Sarah McCarthy-Fry: The Government’s strategy for 2009-10 3.847 +0.37 addressing overweight and obesity is set out in “Healthy 2010-11 3.875 +0.73 Weight, Healthy Lives: A Cross-Government Strategy 2011-12 3.919 +1.14 for England” and in the recent progress report “Healthy Source: Weight, Healthy Lives: One Year On”. The latter report Surplus Places Survey 2008 sets out how we can continue our drive to combat obesity by helping people to make healthier choices, Mr. Frank Field: To ask the Secretary of State for creating an environment that promotes healthy weight, Children, Schools and Families how many schools in providing quality services that identify, advise, refer and each local authority will require temporary accommodation treat those at risk, and strengthening the delivery system. to be constructed in order to provide additional state The initial focus of the strategy is on children. sector primary school places in the academic year (a) The most recent data from the National Child 2009-10, (b) 2010-11 and (c) 2011-12. [273858] Measurement Programme for 2007/08 and from the Health Survey for England for 2007 suggests that the Sarah McCarthy-Fry: The Department does not hold trend in obesity prevalence may have begun to flatten estimates of the amount of temporary accommodation out over the last two to three years. The Cross-Government that may be required by schools. Obesity Unit provides primary care trusts and schools Local authorities are responsible for planning the with annual guidance on the National Child Measurement creation of new school places and are under a duty to Programme which includes information on sending the ensure sufficient school places are available to meet results from the programme back to parents. 1245W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1246W

There is no evidence that there are large numbers of Class Sizes in Maintained Schools in England: January children who need special arrangements for their education 2008” which can be accessed at: on the grounds that they are obese, and the Department http://www.dcsf.gov.uk/rsgateway/DB/SFR/s000786/ has not issued guidance on the specific topic of education index.shtml of obese children. If school nurses or other health The latest available published information about professionals are concerned about a child’s health because permanent and fixed period exclusions, which includes of his or her apparent weight status they should take information for local authorities, is published as SFR action according to standard local care pathways. However, 14/2008 “Permanent and Fixed Period Exclusions from children with health problems related to obesity may Schools in England 2006/07” which can be accessed at: need support at school in managing these conditions, and for these pupils schools should have policies in http://www.dcsf.gov.uk/rsgateway/DB/SFR/s000793/ index.shtml place on the management of pupils’ medicines and on supporting pupils with medical needs. The Department Information is collected on unauthorised absence. for Children, Schools and Families and Department of Unauthorised absence is absence without leave from a Health have published joint guidance, “Managing Medicines teacher or other authorised representative of the school. in Schools and Early Years Settings”, to help schools This includes all unexplained or unjustified absences, and their employers develop such policies. such as lateness, holidays during term time not authorised by the school, absence where reason is not yet established There may be a small number of children whose and truancy. Information collected by the Department weight gives rise to mobility problems and who might on absence is a more comprehensive measure of children’s also meet the Disability Discrimination Act 2005 definition missed schooling. of a disabled person. Guidance has been issued to schools and local authorities on their responsibilities The Department’s focus is on reducing all forms of under the Act: this and can be found at absence, not just a small subset. The issue is not whether http://www.teachernet.gov.uk/wholeschool/disability/ the pupil had permission to be absent; it is how much disabilityandthedda/ absence the pupil has. The absence SFR provides information on absence, Schools which includes authorised and unauthorised absence, and highlights the numbers of pupils who are persistent absentees missing 20 per cent. or more of their schooling, Chris Ruane: To ask the Secretary of State for whether with permission or not. Children, Schools and Families what the average (a) class size, (b) number and percentage of pupils with The latest available published information on absence, special educational needs, (c) free school meal which includes information for local authorities, is published entitlement percentage, (d) suspension rate, (e) as SFR 03/2009 “Pupil Absence in Schools in England, exclusion rate, (f) expenditure per pupil, (g) truancy including Pupil Characteristics: 2007/08” at: rate and (h) punctuality rate was in (i) schools in http://www.dcsf.gov.uk/rsgateway/DB/SFR/s000832/ England and (ii) each national challenge school in each index.shtml seaside town in the latest period for which information is available. [257334] Schools: Playing Fields

Sarah McCarthy-Fry [holding answer 23 February Bob Spink: To ask the Secretary of State for 2009]: To provide all of the requested information for Children, Schools and Families if he will make it his England and each national challenge school in each policy to retain for community sport and leisure use seaside town would incur disproportionate cost. school playing fields which are surplus to requirements. Information on special needs, free school meal eligibility [274243] and expenditure per pupil for each national challenge school in each seaside town has been placed in the Sarah McCarthy-Fry: When we consulted on the House Libraries. effects of the disposal of school playing fields, local The latest available published information on average authorities and schools expressed concerns about the class sizes, which includes information for local authorities, financial implications of maintaining school playing is published as SFR 09/2008 “Pupil Characteristics and fields that were genuinely surplus to requirements. The Class Sizes in Maintained Schools in England: January Department does, however, encourage schools and local 2008” which can be accessed at: authorities to consider arrangements whereby such playing http://www.dcsf.gov.uk/rsgateway/DB/SFR/s000786/ fields could be maintained by other local organisations index.shtml and managed to benefit their local communities. When The latest available published information on pupils considering any application to dispose of school playing with special educational needs, which includes information fields, the views of any authorised community users of for local authorities, is published as SFR 15/2008 “Special the land are fully taken into account. Educational Needs in England: January 2008” which can be accessed at: Schools: Training http://www.dcsf.gov.uk/rsgateway/DB/SFR/s000794/ index.shtml Kelvin Hopkins: To ask the Secretary of State for The latest available published information on the Children, Schools and Families what recent assessment number and percentage of pupils eligible for free school he has made of the adequacy of the amount of time meals, which includes information for local authorities, provided by schools for staff training in new is published as SFR 09/2008 “Pupil Characteristics and technologies and initiatives. [274704] 1247W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1248W

Jim Knight: Decisions about the appropriate amount Teachers: Training of time allocated for training individual members of school staff, including training in new technologies and Mr. Graham Stuart: To ask the Secretary of State for initiatives, are made at school level. For teachers these Children, Schools and Families what steps he is taking decisions will be taken in the context of the revised to increase the number of school-based teacher performance management arrangements we introduced training mentors; and if he will make a statement. in September 2007. In many schools similar arrangements [275035] have been introduced for all school staff. The Department works to support the professional Jim Knight: Between 2001 and 2009 the Training and development of school staff and recently, for example, Development Agency for Schools (TDA) has supported made provision during the 2007/08 academic year for a significant number of initiatives to increase both the schools to reduce their school sessions from 190 to 189 number and quality of school based mentors in initial days to provide additional opportunities for staff training teacher training (ITT) and in continuing professional on the secondary curriculum changes. On 30 April, we development. Since 2001 the number of trainee teachers announced that similar provision would be made for has risen from 27,000 to over 36,000 this year. In order primary schools in 2010 to provide training to staff in to ensure that all trainees have a well trained mentor in advance of a new primary curriculum being introduced their placement schools the TDA has invested in significant from 2011. A comprehensive package of guidance and programmes: support for schools to aid introduction of a new primary 2002 to 2006—the National Partnership Project (over £20 curriculum will be available from January 2010. million over the lifetime of the project)—a wide-ranging programme In addition, the Department is working with the of support for mentor training, including sharing of best practice; QCA and BECTA to consider what additional support direct funding for higher education institution mentor training teachers will need to meet the raised expectations of with schools and support for the building of regional sharing of children’s ICT capabilities, and the use of technology to mentors and training between ITT providers. enrich learning across the curriculum, as set out in the 2006 to 2009—Partnership development schools (over £6 final report of Jim Rose’s review of the primary curriculum. million)—worked with over 600 schools on national priority areas focusing on mentoring on a local level. From 2009—Beyond Partnership—the TDA is opening out a consultation process with the ITT sector to explore best use of the Science: General Certificate of Secondary Education investment made and how further support can be developed and delivered. Michael Gove: To ask the Secretary of State for Evidence of Ofsted inspections and feedback from Children, Schools and Families how many pupils who ITT providers, schools and regional field-forces indicates were (a) eligible and (b) ineligible for free school that this investment has had a significant impact ensuring meals took GCSEs in (i) science, (ii) science and that all trainees receive high quality training during additional science and (iii) separate science subjects in their school experience, including the support of a 2008. [262486] well-trained mentor. In response to the recommendations made in Lord Sarah McCarthy-Fry: The number of pupils at the Sainsbury’s report “The Race to the Top”, the TDA has end of KS4 who attempted the following science subjects put into place an Early Career Mentoring project for in 2008 by free school meals eligibility. science and mathematics teachers. This project is a two-year evaluative pilot, being delivered by the Learning FSM Non-FSM and Skills Network that will provide face-to-face, telephone Physics 2,100 50,600 and e-mentoring for 600 (rising to 800 in the second Chemistry 2,100 51,000 year) science and mathematics trainee teachers, newly qualified teachers and teachers in their second year of Biological sciences 2,700 55,700 teaching. The programme will start in September 2009. Core science 56,100 409,600 Core and additional 31,800 299,100 The Professional Standards for Teachers also make science clear that being a coach and mentor are key aspects of teacher professional development, and this is referenced more strongly as the individual progresses up the career Special Educational Needs: Disadvantaged ladder. The Government are committed to the introduction of the Masters in Teaching and Learning programme from 2009/10, an initiative that will establish teaching as Tim Loughton: To ask the Secretary of State for a masters-level profession. A key element of that will Children, Schools and Families how many pupils who include the identification and training of in-school coaches. were eligible for free school meals had statements of special educational needs in each local authority area Trade Unions in each year since 1997. [264874]

Sarah McCarthy-Fry [holding answer 20 March 2009]: Mr. Maude: To ask the Secretary of State for Pupil level data has only been collected since 2002. Children, Schools and Families pursuant to the answer of 12 March 2009, Official Report, column 715W, on The earliest and latest available data has been placed trade unions, what office facilities his Department in the House Libraries. provides for the exclusive use of each recognised trade Data for further years could be provided only at union; and what the notional monetary value of such disproportionate cost. provision was in 2008-09. [271927] 1249W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1250W

Sarah McCarthy-Fry: The Department provides a Sarah McCarthy-Fry: The Department’s strategy on small office, with furniture, for the exclusive use of the school attendance aims to reduce all forms of absence, trade unions on each of our four sites. This can be used not merely absence which schools do not authorise for confidential phone calls and meetings with individual (which includes truancy). Our particular focus is on union members. Other facilities, such as IT and individual pupils who are persistent absentees, who photocopying facilities, are provided on a shared basis, miss 20 per cent. or more of their schooling, whether similar to that provided to our other staff. with permission or not. The notional cost apportioned to the office space This year the Department is working closely through provided is as follows: the National Strategies with 42 local authorities with high levels of persistent absence. The National Strategies Site Cost per annum (£) are providing intensive support and challenge to minimise absence, particularly in 360 secondary schools in those Sheffield 11,030 authorities with high persistent absence. A further 102 London 23,800 local authorities with lower rates of persistent absence Runcorn 3,170 are receiving support to reduce persistent absence in Darlington 2,770 795 secondary schools with high levels of persistent absence. Total 40,770 Our work on reducing absence, and persistent absence, has been successful. Overall absence rates in 2007-08 Truancy were 6.29 per cent., down from 7.41 per cent. in 1996-97, equivalent to some 70,000 more pupils in school every day. Michael Gove: To ask the Secretary of State for Children, Schools and Families how many schools have The total number of persistent absentees in 2007-08 pupil populations in which more than (a) five, (b) 10, was 233,000, down from 273,000 in 2006-07, a reduction (c) 15, (d) 20, (e) 25, (f) 30, (g) 35, (h) 40, (i) 45 and of 14.5 per cent. (j) 50 per cent. of pupils are persistent absentees (i) Truancy: Tamworth overall and (ii) in year (A) nine, (B) 10 and (C) 11. [262478] Mr. Jenkins: To ask the Secretary of State for Children, Schools and Families how many days of Sarah McCarthy-Fry: The requested information is unauthorised absence were recorded in (a) primary shown in the table. and (b) secondary schools in Tamworth constituency in each of the last five years. [274134] Primary, secondary and special schools1, 2, 3: Number of schools by percentage of 4 persistent absentees , 2007/08 Sarah McCarthy-Fry: Information is not available in Number of schools the form requested. The available information on the Percentage of persistent number of days of unauthorised absence in Staffordshire absentees5 Overall Year 9 Year 10 Year 11 local authority for the last five years is shown in the table. To provide pupil absence data at constituency More than 5% 3,348 1,825 2,453 2,881 level would incur disproportionate cost. More than 10% 788 635 1,011 1,612 More than 15% 332 319 459 730 Absence data is normally reported in terms of sessions. More than 20% 182 191 251 392 There are two sessions per day. More than 25% 127 131 175 231 Primary and secondary schools1, 2, number of days of unauthorised More than 30% 95 106 143 181 absence 2003/04 to 2007/08, Staffordshire local authority More than 35% 71 80 112 140 Primary1 Secondary1, 2 More than 40% 43 49 88 114 2007/08 16,880 69,690 More than 45% 27 39 73 105 2006/07 17,900 64,380 More than 50% 19 24 45 75 2005/06 317,300 57,780 1 Includes maintained secondary, city technology colleges and academies (including all-through academies). 2004/05 315,050 352,260 2 Includes maintained and non-maintained special schools. Excludes general 2003/04 315,900 353,740 hospital schools. 1 3 Includes schools with at least one enrolment aged between five and 15. Includes middle schools as deemed. 2 4 Persistent absentees are defined as having more than 63 sessions of absence Includes city technology colleges and academies. (authorised and unauthorised) during the year, typically over 20 per cent. 3 Figures in italics have been sourced from the Absence in Schools overall absence rate. Survey. Other figures are derived from School Census returns. 5 Number of persistent absentees as a percentage of total enrolments. Note: Source: Figures have been rounded to the nearest 10. School Census Source: The information is a variation of table 4.4 in SFR03/2009, Absence in School Survey and School Census3 which was reissued with revised row delimiters on 21 April 2009. However, the above information is taken from a dataset which contains a minor amendment and is now DUCHY OF LANCASTER being used for all pupil absence analysis. 10 Downing Street: Security

Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr. Pickles: To ask the Chancellor of the Duchy of Children, Schools and Families what recent steps his Lancaster whether (a) Mr. Derek Draper and (b) Department has taken to reduce the rate of truancy. Mr. Charlie Whelan has a security pass for 10 Downing [273090] Street. [274985] 1251W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1252W

Kevin Brennan: I refer the hon. Member to the answer fertility, mortality and emigration assumptions unchanged. It the Prime Minister gave to the hon. Member for should be noted that, in practice, this may not be a realistic Hammersmith and Fulham (Mr. Hands) on 6 May scenario: if immigration fell permanently to levels well below 2009, Official Report, column 182W. those experienced in recent years, it is likely that this would, in time, lead to a reduction in the level of emigration as well. 12 Downing Street Projected number of births, United Kingdom, 2008 to 2031 2006-based population projections (thousands) Mr. Maude: To ask the Chancellor of the Duchy of Published projections Special variant projections1 Lancaster what the cost to the public purse was of Net establishing the new open plan office in 12 Downing migration 6 Net Street. [272016] Zero per cent. migration Year migration lower than 60,000 a to Principal variant principal year Kevin Brennan: I refer the right hon. Member to the answer given to his question on 11 November 2008, Mid- 769 756 769 766 Official Report, column 1131W. 2008 Mid- 781 757 780 772 Business: Government Assistance 2009 Mid- 790 756 789 776 Mr. Maude: To ask the Chancellor of the Duchy of 2010 Lancaster what budget the Cabinet Office has set for Mid- 797 753 795 777 2011 the real help now website for 2009-10. [269896] Mid- 799 745 798 774 2012 Mr. Byrne: I refer the right hon. Member to the Mid- 799 735 797 770 answer given to the hon. Member for Welwyn Hatfield 2013 (Grant Shapps) on 20 April 2009, Official Report, column Mid- 798 726 796 765 355W. 2014 Mid- 799 717 796 761 Childbirth: Migration 2015 Mid- 801 711 798 760 Mr. Frank Field: To ask the Chancellor of the Duchy 2016 of Lancaster pursuant to the answer of 30 March 2009, Mid- 804 706 800 759 Official Report, columns 956-7W, on child birth, what 2017 forecast he has made of the number of births there Mid- 805 700 801 757 would be if (a) net migration were six per cent. lower 2018 than the principal projection, (b) migration equalled Mid- 806 695 802 755 emigration and (c) net migration were 60,000 in each 2019 year to 2031. [276294] Mid- 806 689 801 752 2020 Kevin Brennan: The information requested falls within Mid- 804 682 799 748 the responsibility of the UK Statistics Authority. I have 2021 asked the authority to reply. Mid- 802 676 797 744 2022 Letter from Karen Dunnell, dated May 2009: Mid- 799 670 793 739 As National Statistician I have been asked to reply to your 2023 question, pursuant to the answer of 30 March 2009 (Official Report, columns 956-7W) on child birth, regarding what forecast Mid- 796 665 791 735 2024 the Office for National Statistics has made of the number of births there would be if (a) net migration were six per cent lower Mid- 794 660 788 732 than the principal projection (b) migration equalled emigration 2025 and (c) if net migration was 60,000 in each of the years to 2031 Mid- 792 657 786 729 [276294]. 2026 Migration assumptions for national population projections are Mid- 790 653 784 726 conventionally expressed in terms of net migration (immigration 2027 less emigration). The 2006-based principal (or central) projection Mid- 788 650 783 724 assumed a long-term annual net inflow to the UK of +190,000 2028 persons a year. The attached table shows the projected number of Mid- 788 647 782 722 births in the UK for each year from mid-2008 to mid-2031 2029 according to this 2006-based principal national population projection which is included for the sake of completeness. Mid- 788 645 781 721 2030 The 2006-based ‘zero migration’ variant projection makes the same assumptions about future fertility and mortality as the Mid- 788 643 782 720 principal projection, but assumes that immigration will equal 2031 emigration, and thus net migration will be zero, at all ages from 1 Additional population projections produced using reduced immigration mid-2006 to the end of the projection period. The projected assumptions compared to the principal projection. numbers of births in the UK for each year from mid-2008 to Using this method, two further projections have been produced; mid-2031 according to this variant projection are also shown in one assumes annual net migration inflows to the UK six per cent the table. lower than those assumed for the principal projection, whilst the To fully answer your question, further population projections other assumes annual net migration inflows of +60,000 persons a have been produced by reducing the nominal immigration totals year. The table therefore also shows the projected number of applied in the 2006-based principal projection, but leaving the births in the UK for these two additional projections. 1253W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1254W

Civil Servants: Codes of Practice Departmental Manpower

Nadine Dorries: To ask the Chancellor of the Duchy Nadine Dorries: To ask the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster (1) what recent discussions he has had of Lancaster who is responsible for the line management with the Cabinet Secretary and Head of the Home of civil servants based in 10 Downing Street; and if he Civil Service on changes to the code of conduct for will make a statement. [271098] civil servants and political advisers; and if he will make a statement; [271095] Mr. Maude: To ask the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster (1) what the job title of each employee (2) what recent discussions he has had with the Prime within 10 Downing Street is; [272014] Minister on changes to the code of conduct for civil servants and political advisers; and if he will make a (2) what the organisational structure of the posts in [272012] statement. [271096] 10 Downing Street is. Kevin Brennan: Jeremy Heywood is the most senior Mr. Byrne: Information relating to internal discussion civil servant in the Prime Minister’s Office reporting to and advice is not normally disclosed. the Cabinet Secretary. Further information on the Prime Minister’s Office is available in Dodd’s publications, Damian McBride copies of which are available in the Libraries of the House. Mr. Dai Davies: To ask the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster what severance package has been agreed Mr. Maude: To ask the Chancellor of the Duchy of upon in respect of the departure of Damian McBride Lancaster how many (a) civil servants, (b) secondees, from the staff of his Department. [271804] (c) contractors, (d) consultants, (e) fee-paid staff, (f) agency staff, (g) Downing Street Political Office staff and (h) other staff worked in 10 Downing Street as at Mr. Byrne: Special advisers are employed under terms April 2009. [272013] and conditions set out in the Model Contract for Special Advisers. Kevin Brennan: The total number of staff on the No. Mr. McBride received no severance package on leaving 10 payroll as at 1 April 2009 is 200. The staffing and office. associated costs for the Political Office are met by the Labour party. As has been the case under successive Mr. Pickles: To ask the Chancellor of the Duchy of Administrations, marginal costs associated with the Lancaster (1) whether the resignation of Damian Political Office are met from within the overall budget McBride from his position as a special adviser had for 10 Downing Street. immediate effect; [274987] Departmental Ministerial Policy Advisers (2) on what date each Minister in the Cabinet Office was informed of the emails sent by Damian McBride Mr. Amess: To ask the Chancellor of the Duchy of to Derek Draper. [275144] Lancaster which special advisers (a) were dismissed, (b) resigned, (c) were demoted and (d) were Mr. Byrne [holding answer 12 May 2009]: Mr McBride disciplined in each year since June 2007. [270079] resigned with immediate effect. I refer the hon. Member to the answer given by my Mr. Byrne: Special advisers are employed under the right hon. Friend, the Prime Minister, on 7 May 2009, terms and conditions set out in the “Model Contract Official Report, column 379W. for Special Advisers”. Since 2003, the Government have published, on an annual basis, a list of special advisers Departmental Furniture by Department. The next list will be published before the summer recess. Personal information about individual special advisers is not normally disclosed. Grant Shapps: To ask the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster (1) how much was spent by the Cabinet Departmental Publications Office on furniture for 10 Downing Street in each of the last five years; [273708] Mr. Maude: To ask the Chancellor of the Duchy of (2) how much was spent by (a) the Cabinet Office Lancaster if he will place in the Library a copy of the and (b) its agency on furniture in each of the last five Central Office of Information White Book, March years. [273709] 2009 edition. [271962]

Kevin Brennan: The Prime Minister’s Office is an Mr. Byrne: A copy has now been placed in the integral part of Cabinet Office. The cost for the Cabinet Library of the House. Office for the financial year 2007-08 was £139,887. Departmental Security For information for previous years I refer the hon. Member to the answers given to the hon. Member for Nick Harvey: To ask the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lewes (Norman Baker) on 29 March 2006, Official Lancaster on how many occasions the Cabinet Office’s Report, column 1031W,and on 23 October 2007, Official head of departmental security has invited the Director- Report, columns 295-96W. General of the International Bodyguard Association to Figures for the financial year 2008-09 will be available assess his Department’s security in the last three years. once the Cabinet Office accounts have been audited. [275268] 1255W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1256W

Kevin Brennan: The Director-General of the International Authority (ODA), and their 2012 supply chain. Under Bodyguard Association was invited, on just one occasion the project ‘Winning with social enterprise’, SEL promotes in 2008, to act as an independent reviewer on part of commercial opportunities to social enterprises across one small ad hoc review being undertaken by the Cabinet the country, encouraging them to bid for the contracts Office. and signposting to relevant sources of business support The Department has no on-going business relationship when necessary. with The Director-General of the International Bodyguard Funding from the project enables SEL to engage with Association. London 2012 to promote social enterprise as a potential contractor. SEL also delivers regional workshops about Departmental Stationery 2012 commercial opportunities to social enterprises across England. The workshops provide detailed Bob Spink: To ask the Chancellor of the Duchy of information about how social enterprises can register Lancaster what proportion of office supplies on the CompeteFor system, and where they can obtain purchased by his Department were recycled products in further support and guidance. the latest period for which figures are available. [275352] Redundancy Kevin Brennan: The Cabinet Office purchases the majority of its office supplies through two contracts for Mr. Vara: To ask the Chancellor of the Duchy of paper and other stationery items which include a wide Lancaster how many (a) men and (b) women in each range of recycled products. Between May 2008 when age group in each local authority area in England and the current contracts started and March 2009, 84 per Wales were made redundant in each of the last five cent. of paper and 20 per cent. of other items purchased years. [275266] via these contracts were recycled products. Kevin Brennan: The information requested falls within Honours: Arts the responsibility of the UK Statistics Authority. I have asked the authority to reply. Mr. Soames: To ask the Chancellor of the Duchy of Letter from Karen Dunnell: Lancaster who appoints the Chair of the Arts and As National Statistician, I have been asked to reply to your Media Honours Committee. [273104] Parliamentary Question asking how many (a) men and (b) women in each age group were made redundant in each local authority in Mr. Byrne [holding answer 6 May 2009]: The England and Wales in each of the last five years. (275266) independent chairs of the eight honours committees are The Office for National Statistics (ONS) compiles labour appointed by the Cabinet Secretary after a process of market statistics for local areas from the Annual Population open advertising, written application and interview. Survey (APS) and its predecessor the annual Labour Force Survey (LFS) following International Labour Organisation (ILO) definitions. Members: Correspondence However, this source does not support analysis of redundancies at these geographic levels and no alternative source is available. Mr. Burns: To ask the Chancellor of the Duchy of Lancaster if he will instruct Ministers, their Unemployment Departments and Government agencies to correspond with hon. Members at their House of Commons offices Peter Bottomley: To ask the Chancellor of the Duchy unless they have been instructed otherwise by hon. of Lancaster in which parliamentary constituencies the Members. [272198] (a) number and (b) proportion of people out of work was greater in the latest month for which figures are Mr. Byrne: The Cabinet Office guidance ‘Handling available than in the equivalent month of 1997. Correspondence from Members of Parliament, Members [275446] of the House of Lords, MEPs and Members of Devolved Assemblies’ makes clear that replies to letters from hon. Kevin Brennan: The information requested falls within Members should be sent to the originating office of the the responsibility of the UK Statistics Authority. I have correspondence unless indicated otherwise by the hon. asked the Authority to reply. Member concerned. Copies of the guidance are available in the Libraries of the House. Letter from Karen Dunnell, May 2009: As National Statistician, I have been asked to reply to your Non-profit Making Associations: Olympic Games 2012 Parliamentary Question asking in which parliamentary constituencies the (a) number and (b) proportion of people out of work was greater in the latest month for which figures are available than in Mark Lazarowicz: To ask the Chancellor of the the equivalent month of 1997.(275446) Duchy of Lancaster what steps the Government is The Office for National Statistics compiles unemployment taking to encourage social enterprises to take up statistics in line with International Labour Market Organisation commercial opportunities arising out of the London definitions, for local areas from the Annual Population Survey 2012 Olympics. [272602] and its predecessor the Annual Labour Force Survey. Unfortunately, due to small sample sizes at this level of geography Kevin Brennan: The Office of the Third Sector (OTS) it is not practicable to produce the requested analyses. works closely with Social Enterprise London (SEL), as As an alternative, Table 1 shows the Parliamentary Constituencies a strategic partner, whose remit is to promote the work where the number of persons claiming Jobseeker’s Allowance of social enterprises to the London Organising Committee (Claimant Count), the main unemployment related benefit, was for the Olympic Games (LOCOG), the Olympic Delivery higher in April 2009 compared to April 1997-Table 2 shows the 1257W Written Answers18 MAY 2009 Written Answers 1258W

Parliamentary Constituencies where the proportion of persons Although not a change to the definition of the claimant count, claiming Jobseeker’s Allowance was higher in April 2009 compared the introduction of the system of joint claims for Jobseeker’s to April 1997. Allowance from 2001 has meant that both members of certain couples are now required to claim JSA jointly and both are A copy of the tables has been placed in the Library of the required to look for work. This change has led to certain claims House. being counted as two separate claims when they would previously The definition of the claimant count has not changed since have appeared as one claim. Without this change, the current level 1997, following the introduction of Jobseeker’s Allowance in of the unemployment claimant count would be about 9,000 lower 1996. than it currently is. ORAL ANSWERS

Monday 18 May 2009

Col. No. Col. No. HOME DEPARTMENT ...... 1187 HOME DEPARTMENT—continued Community Policing ...... 1199 Michael Savage ...... 1190 Crime (Public Transport) ...... 1196 Sexual Assault Referral Centres ...... 1187 DNA Database ...... 1200 Topical Questions ...... 1200 Identity Cards ...... 1194 Trafficking (Children) ...... 1198 Illegal Immigrants...... 1192 Water Cannon...... 1187 WRITTEN MINISTERIAL STATEMENTS

Monday 18 May 2009

Col. No. Col. No. BUSINESS, ENTERPRISE AND REGULATORY HEALTH...... 70WS REFORM ...... 69WS Health Inequalities...... 70WS Companies House...... 69WS Written Answer (Correction)...... 70WS PETITIONS

Monday 18 May 2009

Col. No. Col. No. CHILDREN, SCHOOLS AND FAMILIES...... 17P INNOVATION, UNIVERSITIES AND SKILLS— Schools (Liverpool)...... 17P continued Universities (Cumbria)...... 18P INNOVATION, UNIVERSITIES AND SKILLS ..... 18P Further Education (Wirral)...... 18P WRITTEN ANSWERS

Monday 18 May 2009

Col. No. Col. No. BUSINESS, ENTERPRISE AND REGULATORY CHILDREN, SCHOOLS AND FAMILIES—continued REFORM ...... 1206W Departmental Contracts ...... 1239W Business: Advisory Services ...... 1206W Departmental Furniture...... 1239W Departmental Billing ...... 1207W Departmental Official Hospitality...... 1239W Departmental Furniture...... 1207W Departmental Press Releases...... 1240W Departmental Mobile Phones ...... 1208W Departmental Public Expenditure...... 1240W Departmental Public Expenditure...... 1208W Departmental Publications ...... 1241W Departmental Telephone Services ...... 1210W Head Teachers: Retirement ...... 1242W Departmental Training ...... 1210W History: Primary Education...... 1242W Employment Tribunals Service...... 1210W International Baccalaureate ...... 1242W Food ...... 1210W Primary Education...... 1243W Gambling Commission ...... 1211W Pupils: Obesity ...... 1244W Home Information Packs...... 1211W Schools ...... 1245W Housing: Sales ...... 1212W Schools: Playing Fields ...... 1246W Motor Vehicles: EU Law...... 1212W Schools: Training ...... 1246W Motor Vehicles: Manufacturing Industries...... 1212W Science: General Certificate of Secondary Post Offices: Bank Services ...... 1213W Education ...... 1247W Regulatory Enforcement and Sanctions Act 2008 .. 1213W Special Educational Needs: Disadvantaged...... 1247W Retirement: Age ...... 1214W Teachers: Training...... 1248W WPP...... 1214W Trade Unions ...... 1248W Truancy...... 1249W CHILDREN, SCHOOLS AND FAMILIES ...... 1235W Truancy: Tamworth ...... 1250W Academies...... 1235W Apprentices...... 1236W COMMUNITIES AND LOCAL GOVERNMENT.. 1190W Building Schools for the Future Programme ...... 1236W Council Housing...... 1190W Children: Literacy...... 1237W Departmental Billing ...... 1191W Children: Mental Health Services ...... 1238W Departmental Official Hospitality...... 1192W Class Sizes: Tamworth ...... 1237W Empty Property: Essex...... 1192W Departmental Assets...... 1238W Energy Performance Certificates...... 1193W Departmental Billing ...... 1239W Fire Services: South West...... 1193W Col. No. Col. No. COMMUNITIES AND LOCAL GOVERNMENT— ENVIRONMENT, FOOD AND RURAL continued AFFAIRS...... 1130W Fire Stations: ICT ...... 1193W Agriculture...... 1130W Housing and Planning Delivery Grant...... 1193W Agriculture: Land ...... 1133W Housing: Low Incomes ...... 1194W Animal Welfare Act 2006 ...... 1133W Housing: Rents ...... 1195W Animals: Clones...... 1133W Inland Waterways: Planning Permission ...... 1196W Badgers ...... 1133W Owner Occupation: Social Mobility...... 1196W Bluetongue Disease: Vaccination ...... 1134W Rented Housing ...... 1196W Bovine Tuberculosis ...... 1134W Repossession Orders: South Yorkshire...... 1199W Cattle: Mastitis ...... 1135W Social Rented Housing...... 1199W Departmental ICT ...... 1136W Urban Areas: Regeneration...... 1200W Domestic Waste: Waste Disposal ...... 1136W Floods: Property Development ...... 1136W CULTURE, MEDIA AND SPORT ...... 1116W Fly Tipping ...... 1137W Copyright: Internet ...... 1116W Food: VAT ...... 1137W Digital Broadcasting: Scotland ...... 1117W Food: Waste Disposal ...... 1138W Future Jobs Fund...... 1118W Recycling ...... 1138W Tourism Advisory Council ...... 1118W Sheep: Lameness...... 1138W Waste and Resources Action Programme...... 1138W DEFENCE...... 1166W Water Supply ...... 1139W Afghanistan: Peacekeeping Operations...... 1166W Armed Forces: Aviation ...... 1166W FOREIGN AND COMMONWEALTH OFFICE .... 1145W Armed Forces: Labour Turnover...... 1167W Afghanistan ...... 1145W Armed Forces: Manpower ...... 1168W Conflict Prevention ...... 1146W Armed Forces: Mental Health Services...... 1169W Departmental Air Conditioning...... 1146W Armed Forces: Pay...... 1170W Departmental Art Works ...... 1146W Armoured Fighting Vehicles ...... 1170W Departmental Billing ...... 1147W Ascension Island...... 1170W Departmental Dismissal...... 1147W Clyde Submarine Base ...... 1171W Departmental Finance ...... 1147W Departmental Billing ...... 1171W Departmental ICT ...... 1147W Departmental Reviews ...... 1171W Departmental Official Cars...... 1148W Departmental Vehicles ...... 1172W Departmental Official Hospitality...... 1148W European Fighter Aircraft ...... 1172W Departmental Work Experience...... 1148W Ex-servicemen...... 1172W France...... 1149W Kenya: Piracy...... 1172W G20: Greater London ...... 1149W Land Mines...... 1173W Germany...... 1150W Navy ...... 1173W Israel: Anniversaries...... 1150W Nimrod Aircraft...... 1173W Middle East: Armed Conflict...... 1151W Pakistan: Military Aid ...... 1174W Middle East: Diplomatic Relations ...... 1151W Rosyth Dockyard ...... 1174W Pakistan: Politics and Government ...... 1152W Somalia: Piracy ...... 1174W Somalia: Piracy ...... 1152W Somalia: Politics and Government ...... 1153W DUCHY OF LANCASTER ...... 1250W Tibet: Human Rights ...... 1153W 10 Downing Street: Security...... 1250W Trade Unions ...... 1153W 12 Downing Street ...... 1251W UN World Conference against Racism...... 1154W Business: Government Assistance ...... 1251W Zimbabwe: Politics and Government ...... 1154W Childbirth: Migration ...... 1251W Civil Servants: Codes of Practice ...... 1253W HEALTH...... 1221W Damian McBride ...... 1253W Abortion ...... 1221W Departmental Furniture...... 1253W Care Homes ...... 1221W Departmental Manpower...... 1254W Dementia ...... 1222W Departmental Ministerial Policy Advisers...... 1254W Departmental ICT ...... 1223W Departmental Publications ...... 1254W Health Professions: Registration ...... 1223W Departmental Security ...... 1254W Hertfordshire Community Health Services ...... 1223W Departmental Stationery...... 1255W Hospitals: ICT ...... 1225W Honours: Arts...... 1255W Mental Health Services: Prisons...... 1225W Members: Correspondence ...... 1255W Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation Trust ...... 1226W Non-profit Making Associations: Olympic Games NHS: Disclosure of Information ...... 1227W 2012 ...... 1255W NHS Foundation Trusts: Pay ...... 1227W Redundancy...... 1256W NHS: Information and Communications Unemployment ...... 1256W Technology ...... 1228W Tranquillisers ...... 1228W ENERGY AND CLIMATE CHANGE...... 1115W Carbon Sequestration: Finance ...... 1115W HOME DEPARTMENT...... 1155W Departmental Billing ...... 1115W Advisory Council on the Misuse of Drugs...... 1157W Departmental Contracts ...... 1115W Antisocial Behaviour Orders: Wales...... 1158W Departmental Correspondence ...... 1115W Antisocial Behaviour: Swindon...... 1156W Departmental Official Hospitality...... 1116W Asylum ...... 1159W Departmental Stationery...... 1116W Carnage UK ...... 1159W Mineral Resources: International Cooperation ...... 1116W Community Relations ...... 1159W Natural Gas: Waste Disposal ...... 1116W Crime and Disorder Partnerships...... 1160W Col. No. Col. No. HOME DEPARTMENT—continued NORTHERN IRELAND ...... 1140W Crime Prevention ...... 1160W Civil Service Agencies: Employment ...... 1140W Criminal Records: EU Nationals ...... 1160W Departmental Complaints ...... 1140W Cybercrime ...... 1161W Departmental Pay ...... 1140W DNA Database ...... 1155W Departmental Training ...... 1141W DNA: Databases...... 1161W Front-line Policing ...... 1156W OLYMPICS ...... 1118W Gamma Butyrolactone...... 1162W Olympic Games 2012: Caravans...... 1118W Gurkhas...... 1155W Olympic Games 2012: Southend on Sea...... 1119W Human Trafficking ...... 1157W Identity Cards ...... 1156W PRIME MINISTER...... 1141W Immigration...... 1163W Departmental Responsibilities ...... 1141W Members: Correspondence ...... 1163W Nazi War Crimes...... 1156W SCOTLAND...... 1142W Passports: Overseas Residence ...... 1163W Departmental Complaints ...... 1142W Police: Bureaucracy...... 1164W Departmental Drinking Water ...... 1142W Police: Complaints ...... 1164W Departmental Furniture...... 1142W Police: Standards...... 1165W Departmental Internet ...... 1143W Powers of Entry ...... 1165W Departmental Older Workers...... 1143W Public Confidence: Police...... 1157W Departmental Pay ...... 1143W Racially Aggravated Offences: Young People ...... 1165W Departmental Responsibilities ...... 1143W Retail Trade: Crime...... 1166W Departmental Stationery...... 1144W Serious Organised Crime Agency: Manpower...... 1166W Departmental Training ...... 1144W Industrial Health and Safety...... 1144W HOUSE OF COMMONS COMMISSION...... 1119W Isle of Lewis...... 1144W Catering ...... 1119W Olympic Games 2012 ...... 1144W Drinking Water...... 1120W Sheep ...... 1145W Energy...... 1120W Whisky...... 1145W Food: Waste Disposal ...... 1121W TRANSPORT ...... 1124W Furniture ...... 1121W A64 ...... 1124W Members: Allowances ...... 1122W British Transport Police: ICT...... 1124W Palace of Westminster: Repairs and Maintenance.. 1122W Bus Services: Concessions ...... 1124W Pay...... 1123W Departmental Pay ...... 1125W Procurement...... 1123W Driving: Licensing...... 1125W Vending Machines...... 1123W Driving: Standards...... 1125W Ferries...... 1126W INNOVATION, UNIVERSITIES AND SKILLS..... 1230W First Great Western: Finance ...... 1127W Building Colleges for the Future Programme ...... 1230W First Great Western: Standards...... 1127W Energy Performance Certificates...... 1231W Government Car and Despatch Agency: Fines ...... 1128W Further Education: Finance...... 1231W Lighting ...... 1128W Further Education: Finance...... 1232W Parking: Disabled...... 1128W Learning and Skills Council...... 1233W Railways: EU Countries...... 1129W Space Technology ...... 1234W Railways: Fares ...... 1129W Students: Low Incomes...... 1235W Railways: Franchises ...... 1130W Roads: Accidents ...... 1129W INTERNATIONAL DEVELOPMENT...... 1186W Virgin Trains ...... 1130W Developing Countries: Climate Change ...... 1186W Developing Countries: HIV Infection ...... 1186W TREASURY ...... 1175W Pakistan: Armed Conflict ...... 1186W Adjudicator’s Office...... 1175W Palestinians: Politics and Government ...... 1187W Banks: Finance ...... 1175W Sri Lanka: Armed Conflict ...... 1187W Banks: Iran ...... 1176W Sri Lanka: Internally Displaced Persons ...... 1188W Banks: Regulation...... 1176W Sri Lanka: Politics and Government ...... 1190W Coinage...... 1176W Zimbabwe: Politics and Government ...... 1190W Departmental ICT ...... 1177W Departmental Official Hospitality...... 1177W Departmental Postal Services...... 1177W JUSTICE...... 1214W Departmental Training ...... 1177W Council Tax: Non-payment...... 1214W EU Budget ...... 1178W Damages ...... 1215W Non-domestic Rates...... 1178W Departmental Reviews ...... 1215W Revenue and Customs: Closures ...... 1178W Land Registry: Fraud...... 1216W Royal Bank of Scotland: Finance ...... 1183W Offenders: Mental Health Services...... 1217W Tax Avoidance ...... 1184W Orchard Lodge Secure Unit ...... 1217W Tax Collection...... 1184W Prisoners: Foreigners...... 1217W Tax Havens ...... 1185W Prisons: Discipline ...... 1218W Taxation...... 1185W Probation Boards: Pay ...... 1218W Valuation Office: ICT...... 1185W Repossession Orders: Mortgages...... 1219W Valuation Office: Rightmove...... 1185W Terrorism: Compensation ...... 1221W VAT: Bingo ...... 1186W

LEADER OF THE HOUSE...... 1139W WORK AND PENSIONS ...... 1200W Members: Allowances...... 1139W Cold Weather Payments: Fife ...... 1200W Col. No. Col. No. WORK AND PENSIONS—continued WORK AND PENSIONS—continued Crisis Loans: Essex ...... 1200W Jobcentre Plus ...... 1203W Foreign Workers...... 1201W National Insurance ...... 1204W Housing Benefit ...... 1201W Natural Gas: Safety ...... 1205W Housing Benefit: East of England...... 1203W Parliamentary Questions: Government Responses. 1206W Housing Benefit: Fraud...... 1203W Welfare Tax Credits: Lone Parents...... 1206W Members who wish to have the Daily Report of the Debates forwarded to them should give notice at the Vote Office. The Bound Volumes will also be sent to Members who similarly express their desire to have them. No proofs of the Daily Reports can be supplied, nor can corrections be made in the Weekly Edition. Corrections which Members suggest for the Bound Volume should be clearly marked in the Daily Report, but not telephoned, and the copy containing the Corrections must be received at the Editor’s Room, House of Commons,

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CONTENTS

Monday 18 May 2009

Oral Answers to Questions [Col. 1187] [see index inside back page] Secretary of State for the Home Department

Speaker’s Statement [Col. 1205]

Opposition Day [11th allotted day] Skills in the Recession [Col. 1211] Motion—(Mr. Willetts)—on a Division, negatived Amendment—(Mr. Denham)—agreed to Motion, as amended, agreed to

Mid Staffordshire NHS Foundation Trust [Col. 1267] Motion—(Mr. Lansley)—on a Division, negatived Amendment—(Mr. Bradshaw)—agreed to Motion, as amended, agreed to

Petition [Col. 1314]

River Forth Crossing [Col. 1315] Debate on motion for Adjournment

Written Ministerial Statements [Col. 69WS]

Petitions [Col. 17P] Observations

Written Answers to Questions [Col. 1115W] [see index inside back page]