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Evidence Témoignages 12-12-2019 Régie interne, budgets et administration 1:1 EVIDENCE TÉMOIGNAGES OTTAWA, Thursday, December 12, 2019 OTTAWA, le jeudi 12 décembre 2019 The Standing Committee on Internal Economy, Budgets and Le Comité permanent de la régie interne, des budgets et de Administration met this day at 9 a.m., pursuant to rule 12-7(1), l’administration se réunit aujourd’hui, à 9 heures, conformément to consider financial and administrative matters; and, in camera, à l’article 12‑7(1) du Règlement, pour étudier des questions pursuant to rule 12-7(1), to consider financial and administrative financières et administratives, et à huis clos, conformément à matters. l’article 12‑7(1) du Règlement, pour étudier des questions financières et administratives. Senator Sabi Marwah (Chair) in the chair. Le sénateur Sabi Marwah (président) occupe le fauteuil. [English] [Traduction] The Chair: Good morning and welcome to this meeting of Le président : Bonjour et bienvenue à cette séance du Comité the Standing Committee on Internal Economy, Budgets and permanent de la régie interne, des budgets et de l’administration. Administration. My name is Sabi Marwah, and I have the Je m’appelle Sabi Marwah et j’ai le privilège de présider le privilege of acting as chair of this committee. I will ask senators comité. J’invite les sénateurs à se présenter. to introduce themselves. Senator Munson: Jim Munson, Ontario, and I am the deputy Le sénateur Munson : Jim Munson, de l’Ontario, et je suis chair of this committee. vice-président du comité. [Translation] [Français] Senator Forest: Éric Forest from the Gulf region of Quebec. Le sénateur Forest : Éric Forest, de la division du Golfe, au Québec. Senator Dawson: Dennis Dawson from Quebec. Le sénateur Dawson : Dennis Dawson, du Québec. Senator Gold: Marc Gold from Quebec. Le sénateur Gold : Marc Gold, du Québec. Senator Saint-Germain: Raymonde Saint‑Germain from La sénatrice Saint-Germain : Raymonde Saint-Germain, du Quebec. Québec. Senator Moncion: Lucie Moncion from Ontario. La sénatrice Moncion : Lucie Moncion, de l’Ontario. Senator Dalphond: Pierre Dalphond from Quebec. Le sénateur Dalphond : Pierre Dalphond, du Québec. Senator Verner: Josée Verner from Quebec. La sénatrice Verner : Josée Verner, du Québec. [English] [Traduction] Senator Plett: Don Plett, Manitoba. Le sénateur Plett : Don Plett, du Manitoba. Senator Loffreda: Tony Loffreda, Quebec. I’m here just as Le sénateur Loffreda : Tony Loffreda, du Québec. Je suis an observer this morning to learn. ici, ce matin, seulement à titre d’observateur pour apprendre. Senator Boehm: Peter Boehm, Ontario. Le sénateur Boehm : Peter Boehm, de l’Ontario. Senator MacDonald: Michael MacDonald, Nova Scotia. Le sénateur MacDonald : Michael MacDonald, de la Nouvelle-Écosse. Senator Seidman: Judith Seidman, Montreal, Quebec. La sénatrice Seidman : Judith Seidman, de Montréal, au Québec. Senator Tannas: Scott Tannas, Alberta. Le sénateur Tannas : Scott Tannas, de l’Alberta. 1:2 Internal Economy, Budgets and Administration 12-12-2019 Senator Marshall: Elizabeth Marshall, Newfoundland and La sénatrice Marshall : Elizabeth Marshall, de Terre- Labrador. Neuve‑et‑Labrador. Senator Tkachuk: David Tkachuk, Saskatchewan. Le sénateur Tkachuk : David Tkachuk, de la Saskatchewan. The Chair: Thank you and welcome, everybody. I must Le président : Merci et bienvenue à tous. Je dois admettre admit, I didn’t realize that we have such an exciting agenda. I’ve que je ne m’étais pas rendu compte que nous avions établi un never seen so many senators or staff at a meeting ever. ordre du jour aussi emballant. Je n’ai jamais vu autant de sénateurs ou de membres du personnel présents à une réunion. The first item is the public minutes from November 7, 2019. Le premier point concerne le procès-verbal de la séance Colleagues, you will recall that on November 7, a decision was publique du 7 novembre 2019. Chers collègues, vous vous made by this committee to no longer cover transportation costs souviendrez que le 7 novembre dernier, le comité a pris la associated with sponsored travel. A question was raised and they décision de ne plus couvrir les frais de transport reliés à des would like that issue to be revisited. It has been revisited as item voyages parrainés. Une question a été soulevée, et on aimerait no. 5. It’s not a change to the minutes — the minutes are qu’elle soit réexaminée. Elle a donc été réinscrite au cinquième correct — but I want to let you know that it’s being resurfaced in point de l’ordre du jour. Ce n’est pas un changement au procès- item no. 5. Any there any questions or changes? If not, can I verbal, dont le contenu demeure exact, mais je tenais à vous have a motion to adopt the minutes? Moved by Senator signaler que cette question a refait surface et qu’elle figure au Dalphond to adopt the minutes. Agreed? cinquième point. Y a‑t‑il des questions ou des modifications? S’il n’y en a pas, quelqu’un voudrait‑il présenter une motion pour faire adopter le procès‑verbal? Le sénateur Dalphond en propose l’adoption. Êtes-vous d’accord? Hon. Senators: Agreed. Des voix : D’accord. The Chair: Agreed. Carried. Le président : D’accord. La motion est adoptée. Item no. 2, honourable senators, is the allocation of caucus/ Honorables sénateurs, le deuxième point porte sur l’allocation group and the house officer budgets. At the last CIBA meeting, des budgets des caucus, des groupes et des agents supérieurs. À the committee decided to let the leaders consult and make a sa dernière réunion, notre comité, aussi connu sous l’acronyme proposal on the allocation for caucuses and parliamentary CIBA, a décidé de laisser les leaders se consulter entre eux avant groups. It is my understanding that no agreement has yet been de faire une proposition sur l’allocation pour les caucus et les reached. To support this decision, you may wish to refer to the groupes parlementaires. Je crois comprendre que les leaders ne financial tables that are in your package. sont pas encore arrivés à une entente. Pour appuyer cette décision, vous voudrez peut-être consulter les tableaux financiers qui se trouvent dans votre liasse. Colleagues, in the current circumstances, I believe it is Chers collègues, dans les circonstances actuelles, je crois qu’il appropriate to follow the rules approved by the Senate to allocate convient de suivre les règles approuvées par le Sénat pour to the Canadian Senators Group the funding established by the attribuer au Groupe des sénateurs canadiens le financement Senate Administrative Rules. I understand that the prorated établi par le Règlement administratif du Sénat. Si je comprends amount represents $191,667, until March 31, 2020. bien, le montant calculé au prorata est de 191 667 $ jusqu’au 31 mars 2020. The Chief Financial Officer has indicated that the caucus Le dirigeant principal des finances a indiqué que les fonds group — the unused funding — can be reallocated to ensure the inutilisés des caucus et des groupes peuvent être réaffectés pour Senate remains within budget. The remaining budgets, since we s’assurer que le Sénat respecte le budget. Enfin, puisque nous have not heard anything from the leaders, will remain at the level n’avons rien entendu de la part des leaders, les autres budgets agreed to by the leaders at the beginning of the 2019-20 fiscal demeureront au niveau convenu par les chefs au début de year, with the exception of the independent Liberals, which is no l’exercice 2019‑2020, sauf dans le cas des libéraux indépendants, longer eligible for funding as a group. Are there any questions or dont le groupe n’est plus admissible au financement. Y a‑t‑il des comments on that? questions ou des observations à ce sujet? Senator Plett: I’m a little perplexed. The CSG asked for Le sénateur Plett : Je suis quelque peu perplexe. Le Groupe $120,000, and the suggestion was made that there was not des sénateurs canadiens, ou GSC, a demandé 120 000 $ et, à ce agreement by the leaders, so, in that case, let’s give them qu’il paraît, les leaders ne seraient pas parvenus à une entente. 12-12-2019 Régie interne, budgets et administration 1:3 $70,000 more instead of less. I don’t think any disagreement that Or, voilà que nous donnons 70 000 $ de plus au GSC. Je doute existed wasn’t because they were asking for not enough money; qu’il y ait eu désaccord parce que le montant demandé n’était pas let’s give them more. The request was for $120,000, and there suffisant; donnons‑en plus. Il s’agissait d’une demande de 120 was agreement by the leaders to give them $120,000. The 000 $, et les leaders se sont entendus là‑dessus. Le désaccord disagreement was giving the Liberals money, not the CSG. The portait sur le financement des libéraux, et non celui du GSC. Les leaders agreed to give the CSG $120,000, so I’m not sure where leaders ont accepté d’accorder 120 000 $ au GSC, alors je ne sais this report is coming from. pas sur quoi repose ce rapport. The Chair: To be honest, Senator Plett, we weren’t aware an Le président : À vrai dire, sénateur Plett, nous ne savions pas agreement had been reached at $119,000. I’m quite happy with qu’il y avait eu entente sur le montant de 119 000 $. Cela me $119,000; the 191 is the date from November 9, when the CSG convient parfaitement; la somme de 119 000 $, c’est à partir du 9 was set up. But I’m happy to leave it at 119.
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