Education, Lifelong Learning and Culture Committee
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EDUCATION, LIFELONG LEARNING AND CULTURE COMMITTEE Wednesday 17 June 2009 Session 3 £5.00 Parliamentary copyright. Scottish Parliamentary Corporate Body 2009. Applications for reproduction should be made in writing to the Licensing Division, Her Majesty’s Stationery Office, St Clements House, 2-16 Colegate, Norwich NR3 1BQ Fax 01603 723000, which is administering the copyright on behalf of the Scottish Parliamentary Corporate Body. Produced and published in Scotland on behalf of the Scottish Parliamentary Corporate Body by RR Donnelley. CONTENTS Wednesday 17 June 2009 Col. BROADCASTING IN SCOTLAND ......................................................................................................................... 2501 HOLOCAUST (RETURN OF CULTURAL OBJECTS) BILL....................................................................................... 2535 EDUCATION, LIFELONG LEARNING AND CULTURE COMMITTEE 19th Meeting 2009, Session 3 CONVENER *Karen Whitefield (Airdrie and Shotts) (Lab) DEPUTY CONVENER *Kenneth Gibson (Cunninghame North) (SNP) COMMITTEE MEMBERS Claire Baker (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab) *Aileen Campbell (South of Scotland) (SNP) *Ken Macintosh (Eastwood) (Lab) *Christina McKelvie (Central Scotland) (SNP) *Elizabeth Smith (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) *Margaret Smith (Edinburgh West) (LD) COMMITTEE SUBSTITUTES Ted Brocklebank (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Bill Kidd (Glasgow) (SNP) Hugh O’Donnell (Central Scotland) (LD) Cathy Peattie (Falkirk East) (Lab) *attended THE FOLLOWING GAVE EVIDENCE: Donalda MacKinnon (BBC Scotland) Ken MacQuarrie (BBC Scotland) Michael Russell (Minister for Culture, External Affairs and the Constitution) Mark Thompson (BBC) THE FOLLOWING ALSO ATTENDED: Ted Brocklebank (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) CLERK TO THE COMMITTEE Eugene Windsor SENIOR ASSISTANT CLERK Nick Hawthorne ASSISTANT CLERK Emma Berry LOCATION Committee Room 2 2501 17 JUNE 2009 2502 Scotland, including democracy live—a pilot that Scottish Parliament will seek to deliver better information for all our licence payers on the workings of the Parliament Education, Lifelong Learning and and, indeed, all the democratic institutions. Culture Committee BBC Scotland has a very positive story to tell, and this has been a momentous week for the BBC Wednesday 17 June 2009 as a whole. Mark Thompson (BBC): I will add to that on [THE CONVENER opened the meeting at 10:00] behalf of the BBC as a whole. The most important thing that I want to say to the committee is that, over the past five years, there has been a sea Broadcasting in Scotland change in the attitude of the BBC towards investment in Scotland and the improvement of The Convener (Karen Whitefield): I open the services to everyone in Scotland who pays for the 19th meeting of the Education, Lifelong Learning BBC. That can be seen in our physical investment. and Culture Committee and welcome everyone to Pacific Quay is the most advanced digital the meeting. We have received apologies from broadcast and production centre that we have Claire Baker, who is unable to attend this morning. anywhere in the world. It is a visible symbol of our commitment to finding great talent and making I welcome Ted Brocklebank to the meeting. For great programmes here. We are now engaged in the benefit of our guests this morning, who may the task of filling Pacific Quay as we ramp up not be aware of the way in which the Scottish network production here. Parliament’s committees work, I explain that members can attend meetings of any committee— As Kenny McQuarrie said, we are also keen to they do not have to be a member of the improve services to licence payers in Scotland on committee. As I am sure that you are aware, Mr quite a broad front. I was lucky enough to be Brocklebank has a long-standing interest in culture present at the launch of BBC Alba, our partnership and broadcasting in Scotland. with MG Alba. That brand new service got off to a great start. We continue to believe that there are The first item on the agenda is the committee’s reservoirs of untapped talent in this country and consideration of broadcasting in Scotland. that the BBC, with its global reach—we reach Following the committee’s scrutiny of the evidence hundreds of millions of people around the world— that was given to the Scottish Broadcasting and its global sales and distribution effort can Commission on the creative industries and make a real difference in getting Scottish talent to evidence from the Office of Communications, the audiences around the world. Along with others, we committee is now taking evidence from the BBC. It want to ensure that Scotland’s creative industries is my pleasure to welcome Mark Thompson, have the best story possible about growth and director general of the BBC; Ken MacQuarrie, development, and we are engaged in director of BBC Scotland; and Donalda conversations with the rest of the sector in this MacKinnon, head of programmes and services at country. BBC Scotland. I understand that Mr Thompson wants to make an opening statement before we This week, we signed a memorandum of ask questions. understanding with Scottish Television about a broad range of partnerships, which relate to ways Ken MacQuarrie (BBC Scotland): I will in which we can support STV and ways in which respond first. We are having a very strong year in STV can bring things to BBC Scotland and the BBC Scotland. In this calendar year, we will wider BBC. We see the pathway for the BBC in deliver between 5 and 6 per cent of all the network Scotland as one of increased commitment and output. We are on target to deliver just under 9 per investment from us and of working with the rest of cent by 2016, and our target for 2012 is to deliver the sector here to obtain the best possible result approximately 6 per cent under the Ofcom for the Scottish creative industries and the Scottish definition. We are delighted that we have made public. such good progress in delivering against the network strategy review, on which we gave The Convener: I will start by asking a couple of evidence to the Scottish Broadcasting general questions. Do you agree that Scotland Commission. We indicated that we would work should have a fair share of the BBC’s budget for within the Ofcom definition and that we would the United Kingdom on the basis of its population, deliver against the targets as outlined. so that we can stimulate and nurture the broadcasting industry here? If you agree, how do The story is also positive in terms of our news we ensure that that happens? provision. We are engaged in a number of different initiatives to deliver better news across 2503 17 JUNE 2009 2504 Mark Thompson: What you describe should be enterprise in Scotland and in the UK, to deliver the direction of travel. For example, on the critical more for less input—in other words, to achieve issue of network television supply, we have productivity gains. Part of the reason why we have committed to reaching a point at which the to do that is that we have a duty to deliver value proportion of the spend on network television for money for licence payers. We understand the programmes from Scotland—using Ofcom’s constraints on our funding and we can deliver the definition of local production—reflects the services of the future, such as democracy live, percentage of UK households in Scotland. only if we can find ways of delivering our existing services for less money. The kinds of investment that we make throughout the BBC’s services are manifest. I will New technology is arriving across the BBC, give two examples. We have a bureau with nine including at BBC Scotland, and you can see it if people in Tehran, which provides news about what you go to Pacific Quay or our operation in is going on there for BBC services here and Edinburgh. You will also see us trying hard to around the world. That is a shared facility that is deliver more for less, which sometimes means job not based in the UK. In a sense, one benefit for losses. In the debate about job losses, people— anyone who pays the licence fee in Scotland is particularly those who might be at risk of losing access to global news gathering. That is their job—will always try to argue that the fact that exogenous to your question. we are trying to run a particular operation or programme with fewer people means that we must Similarly, together with ITV, we are lucky have lost our commitment. It does not mean that; it enough to have the rights to show the 2010 world means that we are trying to drive in value for cup. We will show that live sport throughout the money. UK. As the committee knows, the world cup will be held in South Africa. The BBC’s spend on that We are trying to ensure that quality is as high as cannot be geographically apportioned to any one it has been and to find ways of investing in the part of the BBC. However, in activities such as future. You can see future investment all over the network production, we should as far as we can place in BBC Scotland. You can see it physically ensure that licence payers throughout the UK— in Pacific Quay, but you can also see it in projects that absolutely includes licence payers in such as BBC Alba and in the way that we are Scotland—can see that a fair proportion of ramping up investment in network production. investment is visibly spent in and delivers great If you look at things in the round, I believe that programmes from their part of the UK. you will see a passionate commitment to high- The Convener: I think that we all welcome the quality journalism in the BBC and BBC Scotland.