Third Session- Thirty-Sixth Legislature of the Legislative Assembly of Manitoba DEBATES and PROCEEDINGS Official Report (Hansard) Published under the authority of The Honourable Louise M. Dacquay Speaker Vol. XLVII No. 27-1:30 p.m., Wednesday, April16, 1997 4 - MANITOBA LEGISLATIVE ASSE�mLY Thirty-Sixth Legislature Member Constituency Political Affiliation ASHTON, Steve Thompson N.D.P. BARRETT, Becky Wellington N.D.P. CERILLI, Marianne Radisson N.D.P. CHOMIAK, Dave Kildonan N.D.P. CUMMINGS, Glen, Hon. Ste. Rose P.C. DACQUAY, Louise, Hon. Seine River P.C. DERKACH, Leonard, Hon. Roblin-Russell P.C. DEWAR, Gregory Selkirk N.D.P. DOER, Gary Concordia N.D.P. DOWNEY, James, Hon. Arthur-Virden P.C. DRIEDGER, Albert Steinbach P.C. DYCK, Peter Pembina P.C. ENNS, Harry, Hon. Lakeside p C. ERNST, Jim Charleswood P.C. - EVANS, Clif Interlake N.D.P. EVANS, Leonard S. Brandon East N.D.P. FILMON, Gary, Hon. Tuxedo P.C. ' FINDLAY, Glen, Hon. Springfield P.C. FRIESEN, Jean Wolseley N.D.P. GAUDRY, Neil St. Boniface Lib. GILLESHAMMER, Harold, Hon. Minnedosa P.C HELWER, Edward Gimli P.C. HICKES, George Point Douglas N.D.P. JENNISSEN, Gerard Flin Flon N.D.P. KOWALSKI, Gary The Maples Lib. LAMOUREUX, Kevin Inkster Lib. LATHLIN, Oscar The Pas N.D.P. LAURENDEAU, Marcel St. Norbert P.C. MACKINTOSH, Gord St. Johns N.D.P. MALOWA Y, Jim Elmwood N.D.P. MARTINDALE, Doug Burrows N.D.P. McALPINE, Gerry Sturgeon Creek P.C. McCRAE, James, Hon. Brandon West P.C. McGIFFORD, Diane Osborne N.D.P. MciNTOSH, Linda, Hon. Assiniboia P.C. - MIHYCHUK, MaryAnn St. James N.D.P. River East P.C. MITCHELSON, Bonnie, Hon. " NEWMAN, David, Hon. Riel P.C. PALLISTER, Brian Portage Ia Prairie P.C. PENNER, Jack Emerson P.C. PITURA, Frank, Hon. Morris P.C. PRAZNIK, Darren, Hon. Lac du Bonnet P.C. RADCLIFFE, Mike, Hon. River Heights P.C. REID, Daryl Transcona N.D.P. REIMER, Jack, Hon. Niakwa P.C. RENDER, Shirley St. Vital P.C. ROBINSON, Eric Rupertsland N.D.P. ROCAN, Denis Gladstone P.C. SALE, Tim Crescentwood N.D.P. SANTOS, Conrad Broadway N.D P. STEFANSON, Eric, Hon. Kirkfield Park P.C. STRUTHERS, Stan Dauphin N.D.P. SVEINSON, Ben La Verendrye P.C. TOEWS, Vic, Hon. Rossmere p C. TWEED, Mervin Turtle Mountain P.C. VODREY, Rosemary, Hon. Fort Garry P.C. WOWCHUK, Rosann Swan River N.D.P. 1499 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA Wednesday, April16, 1997 The House met at 1:30 p.m. Motion agreed to. PRAYERS Bill 20--The Summary Convictions Amendment Act ROUTINE PROCEEDINGS Hon. Vic Toews (Minister of Justice and Attorney General): I move, seconded by the Minister ofNatural PRESENTING REPORTS BY Resources (Mr. Cummings), that leave be given to STANDING AND SPECIAL COMMITTEES introduce Bill 20, The Summary Convictions Amendment Act (Loi modifiant Ia Loi sur les Committee of Supply poursuites sommaires), and that the same be now received and read a firsttime. Mr. Marcel Laurendeau (Chairperson of the Committee of Supply): Madam Speaker, the His Honour the Lieutenant Governor, having been Committee of Supply has adopted certain resolutions, advised of the contents of this bill, recommends it to directs me to report the same and asks leave to sit the House, and I would like to table the Lieutenant again. Governor's message. I move, seconded by the honourable member for La Motion agreed to. Verendrye (Mr. Sveinson), that the report of the committee be received. Introduction of Guests Motion agreed to. Madam Speaker: Prior to Oral Questions, I would like to draw to the attention of all honourable members TABLING OF REPORTS the public gallery, where we have this afternoon twenty-five Grade 11 students from Technical Hon. Eric Stefanson (Minister of Finance): Madam Vocational High School under the direction of Mr. Speaker. I have three reports to table. The firstone is Mike Gartner. This school is located in the the 1997-98 Departmental Estimates for the constituency of the honourable member for Wellington Department of Finance. I also have the 1997-98 (Ms. Barrett). Departmental Expenses for Manitoba Community Support Programs. I also have the 1997-98 On behalf of all honourable members, I welcome you Departmental Expenditures fo r Manitoba Sport. this afternoon. INTRODUCTION OF BILLS * (1335) Bi1119-The Human Rights Code ORAL QUESTION PERIOD Amendment Act Home Care Program Hon. Vic Toews (Minister of Justice and Attorney Privatization General): Madam Speaker, I move, seconded by the Minister ofFinance (Mr. Stefanson), that leave be given Mr. Gary Doer (Leader ofthe Opposition): Madam to introduce Bill 19, The Human Rights Code Speaker, my question is to the First Minister. On Amendment Act (Loi modifiant le Code des droits de March 21, 1996, when the Premier was justifying his Ia personne), and that the same be now received and decision to privatize all of the home care services in the read a firsttime. city of Winnipeg, he stated to the public that this 1500 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA April 16, 1997 proposal, this extreme proposal to bring profit into quality of care instead of into the profit of some home care would result in a savings of some $10 company. We do not have any problem with that million to the taxpayers of Manitoba. Just this last thought. Maybe the Premier does. month his own new Minister of Health (Mr. Praznik) said: Generally speaking, our home care system is I would like to ask a further question in light of the relatively well run on the cost side. fact of the position of Manitoba seniors, and today Mrs. Duval said that you are a dictator in the way in which Who was telling the people the truth, the Premier last you are making this decision, that it is despicable that year when he said he would save $I 0 million or the you are making this decision to go to a profit system. Minister of Health a couple of weeks ago? These are her words. not mine. In light of the fact that the Mennonite Central Committee, the Catholic Hon. Gary Filmon (Premier): Madam Speaker, of Church, the United Church, the Anglican Church last course the member opposite, in quoting from the news year in the public hearings all recommended against release that was put out by the union today, makes the going to a profithome care system, why is the Premier comparison of $I0 million for privatizing an entire denying the wishes of the public, the clients and the system versus half-a-million dollars fo r privatizing 25 churches across Manitoba with his ideological percent of two quadrants. Clearly there might be more decision? economies of scale, but the department in its wisdom, after public consultation and various discussions, chose Mr. Filmon: Madam Speaker, without accepting the not to go with the fullprivatization, the full contracting truthfulness of any of the preamble, I would say that the out. I would think that the member opposite would be main reason that we would be looking at opportunities supportive of that. for being able to save a half million dollars is so that we can direct that half-million dollars into better patient Mr. Doer: Madam Speaker, I was quoting from the care, that we can provide better services fo r the people Premier's own words of last year that have been of Manitoba who require those health care services. I contradicted by his new Minister of Health. The cannot fo r the life of me imagine how New Democrats government's own advisory committee, the Connie can reason that that half-million dollars not being able Curran committee, Dr. Evelyn Shapiro, Manitoba's to be put into better services will somehow improve the seniors, all of which had examined the issue of profit in quality of care in our province. our home care system, examined costs and quality, have all come to the same conclusion that when you look at both costs and quality of services, a profit home Home Care Program care system is not desirable for Manitobans. Privatization Why has this Premier approved a private profit Mr. Dave Chomiak (Kildonan): Madam Speaker, contract that runs contrary to the advice that he since last year and since the Premier has changed his received by all the committees in his Department of Minister of Health-and the Minister of Health (Mr. Health that advised against it? Praznik) seems to have a new philosophy; at least he now supports home care publicly-still the government Mr. Filmon: Madam Speaker, because it saves half-a­ has persisted in privatizing a portion of home care. The million dollars for the taxpayers of Manitoba and government is privatizing food services. The provides an equivalent level of service. I would think government has privatized the home oxygen service. that those are things that everybody would be The government is privatizing the public lab system and supportive of, including New Democrats, no matter is on the way to privatizing the home care equipment. how convoluted their thinking is. Madam Speaker, everybody, even the mayor of Mr. Doer: Madam Speaker, it is not convoluted at all. Winnipeg who today issued a proclamation calling it In fact, we believe it makes a lot of sense to keep all Public Home Care Week, recognizesthe importance of the money, the publicly administered money into the public home care system. April 16, 1997 LEGISLATIVE ASSEMBLY OF MANITOBA 1501 Will the Premier not admit that Manitobans want and way. The question is: Will the Premier or the Minister demand not a private system but a public, fully of Health today, in light of the public concern, in light operated nonprofithealth care system? Can he not utter of what the tendering process showed, in light of the the words "public nonprofit"? privatization, say, and in light of the need for quality of care,ensure us that there will be no furtherprivatiza tion * (1340) of our home care system? Hon.