Vol. 664 Thursday, No. 1 16 October 2008

DI´OSPO´ IREACHTAI´ PARLAIMINTE PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES

DA´ IL E´ IREANN

TUAIRISC OIFIGIU´ IL—Neamhcheartaithe (OFFICIAL REPORT—Unrevised)

Thursday, 16 October 2008.

Requests to move Adjournment of Da´il under Standing Order 32 ……………… 1 Order of Business ……………………………… 2 Double Taxation Relief (Socialist Republic of Vietnam) Order 2008: Motion ………… 29 Double Taxation Relief (Isle of Man) Order 2008: Motion ………………… 29 Double Taxation Relief (Republic of Macedonia) Order 2008: Motion …………… 30 Council Framework Decision on Sentencing: Motion ………………… 30 EU-US Agreement on Extradition: Motion ……………………… 30 Council Decision on EUROPOL: Motion ……………………… 30 Private Members’ Business Farm Waste Management Scheme: Motion …………………… 31 Financial Resolutions 2009 Financial Resolution No. 15: (General) (resumed) ………………… 79 Adjournment Debate Medical Cards ……………………………… 138 Planning Issues ……………………………… 140 School Building Projects …………………………… 142 Questions: Written Answers …………………………… 145 DA´ IL E´ IREANN

DI´OSPO´ IREACHTAI´ PARLAIMINTE PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES

TUAIRISC OIFIGIU´ IL OFFICIAL REPORT

Imleabhar 664 Volume 664

De´ardaoin, 16 Deireadh Fo´mhair 2008. Thursday, 16 October 2008.

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Chuaigh an Ceann Comhairle i gceannas ar 10.30 a.m.

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Paidir. Prayer.

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Requests to move Adjournment of Da´il under Standing Order 32. An Ceann Comhairle: Anois, iarratais chun tairisceana a dhe´anamh an Da´il a chur ar athlo´ faoi Bhuan Ordu´ 32. Now we come to deal with requests to move the adjournment of the Da´il under Standing Order 32.

Deputy Fergus O’Dowd: I seek the adjournment of the Da´il under Standing Order 32 to raise a matter of urgent national importance, namely, the need for the Government to give greater financial assistance, advice and support to mortgage holders who fall into arrears as a result of loss of employment or serious illness, and to examine the aggressive practices that some sub-prime lenders such as Start Mortgages use to deal with such mortgage holders.

Deputy Brian O’Shea: I seek the adjournment of the Da´il under Standing Order 32 to discuss the following specific and important matter of public interest requiring urgent attention, namely, the need for the Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment to take all necessary measures to ensure the retention of the maximum possible number of jobs at Waterford Crystal in view of the announcement of a further 280 redundancies at the company.

Deputy Joe McHugh: I seek the adjournment of the Da´il under Standing Order 32 to raise a matter of national importance, namely, to discuss the ongoing concerns on the outsourcing of smear testing to the USA and, furthermore, to discuss the cervical screening programme 1 Order of 16 October 2008. Business

[Deputy Joe McHugh.] plan to initially limit colposcopy treatment to 11 centres and to assure the colposcopy team and constituents in Donegal that the service at Letterkenny General Hospital will remain.

An Ceann Comhairle: Tar e´is breithnithe a dhe´anamh ar na nithe ardaithe, nı´l siad in ord faoi Bhuan Ordu´ 32. Having considered the matters fully, they are not in order under Standing Order 32.

Order of Business. The Ta´naiste: It is proposed to take No. 10, motion re proposed approval by Da´il E´ ireann of the Double Taxation Relief (Taxes on Income) (Socialist Republic of Vietnam) Order 2008, back from committee; No. 11, motion re proposed approval by Da´il E´ ireann of the Exchange of Information relating to tax matters and Double Taxation Relief (Taxes on Income) (Isle of Man) Order 2008, back from committee; No. 12, motion re proposed approval by Da´il E´ ireann of the Double Taxation Relief (Taxes on Income) (Republic of Macedonia) Order 2008, back from committee; No. 13, motion re proposed approval by Da´il E´ ireann for a Council Frame- work Decision on the recognition and supervision of suspended sentences, alternative sanctions and conditional sentences, back from committee; No. 14, motion re proposed approval by Da´il E´ ireann of the Agreements on Extradition and on Mutual Legal Assistance between the European Union and the United States of America, back from committee; No. 15, motion re proposed approval by Da´il E´ ireann for a Council Decision establishing a European Police Office (EUROPOL), back from committee; and No. 22, Financial Motions by the Minister for Finance, 2008, motion 15 (resumed). It is proposed, notwithstanding anything in Standing Orders, that (1) the Da´il shall sit later than 4.45 p.m. today and business shall be interrupted not later than 7.30 p.m; (2) Nos. 10, 11, 12, 13, 14 and 15 shall be decided without debate; (3) the Da´il shall sit tomorrow at 10.30 a.m. and shall adjourn not later than 3 p.m., there shall be no Order of Business, that is, within the meaning of Standing Order 26, and the business to be transacted shall be No. 15a — motion re approval by Da´il E´ ireann of the terms of the draft scheme entitled Credit Institutions (Financial Support) Scheme 2008, which shall, if not previously concluded, be brought to a conclusion at 3 p.m. and the following arrangements shall apply: the speech of a Minister or Minister of State and of the main spokespersons for the Fine Gael Party and the Labour Party, who shall be called upon in that order, shall not exceed 15 minutes in each case; the speech of each other Member called upon shall not exceed ten minutes in each case; Members may share time; a Minister or Minister of State shall take questions from 1 p.m. until 3 p.m. Private Members’ business shall be No. 49, motion re farm waste management scheme, to be taken after the Order of Business and to conclude after three hours, if not previously concluded.

An Ceann Comhairle: There are three proposals to be put to the House today. Is the proposal that the Da´il shall sit later than 4.45 p.m. today agreed to?

Deputy Enda Kenny: That is not agreed. I do not want to agree to anything in the Order of Business until we get clarification from the Ta´naiste on behalf of the Government about what amounts to the most stupid, callous own goal ever——

Deputies: Hear, hear.

Deputy Brendan Howlin: Vicious.

Deputy Enda Kenny: ——perpetrated by a Government on elderly folk in regard to the medical card issue announced in the budget on Tuesday. There has been nothing but confusion 2 Order of 16 October 2008. Business and laying blame from one Minister to another over this matter. Even this very morning from Brussels the Minister for Finance said the Minister for Health and Children would have ample time between now and January to sort out any difficulties that might arise.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: The Minister for Defence, Deputy O’Dea, said the same thing on “Morning Ireland”.

Deputy Enda Kenny: The difficulty is that the decision made by the Government and announced in the budget has driven a stake through the integrity of older folk in Ireland.

Deputies: Hear, hear.

An Ceann Comhairle: Deputy Kenny.

Deputy Enda Kenny: The Government has taken away their medical cards.

An Ceann Comhairle: I am sorry, Deputy Kenny.

Deputy Enda Kenny: This is more serious than the rules of the House.

Deputies: Hear, hear.

An Ceann Comhairle: Please. The difficulty I have is that we are having a budget debate at the present time——

Deputy Enda Kenny: The Government proposed to take away nine tenths of the medical cards granted to people over 70——

Deputies: Hear, hear.

Deputy Enda Kenny: ——who lived in that comfort zone and who have now pointed out all of the anomalies that arise since.

An Ceann Comhairle: Deputy Kenny.

Deputy Enda Kenny: For instance, in the assessment for their medical cards people’s savings, investments or properties that are not mortgaged will now be taken as part of their income and will expose them to the 2% income levy as well.

Deputy Paul Kehoe: Shame on you.

Deputy Enda Kenny: The Government only charged the banks \500 million when it could have charged a much higher amount and forget this nonsense of taking away people’s medi- cal cards.

Deputy Noel Dempsey: That is all lies.

An Ceann Comhairle: Deputy Kenny, I must intervene.

Deputy Enda Kenny: I might make another suggestion. What the Ta´naiste could do——

An Ceann Comhairle: Deputy Kenny must please allow me to intervene. He will have to respect the Chair.

Deputy Enda Kenny: I will make this point and then I will sit down. 3 Order of 16 October 2008. Business

An Ceann Comhairle: Deputy Kenny will have to allow the Chair to intervene and say something at this point.

Deputy Enda Kenny: I am speaking for all those people over 70 who were granted medical cards that are now being taken away.

An Ceann Comhairle: Deputy Kenny will have to allow me to speak. The Chair is on his feet.

Deputy Enda Kenny: This is my last point.

An Ceann Comhairle: The Chair is on his feet. I must ask Deputy Kenny to allow me to speak.

Deputy Paul Kehoe: Let him finish.

Deputy Enda Kenny: I make this point. The Government could change the regulations whereby pharmacies would be able to prescribe generic drugs instead of branded drugs and save \150 million and forget this callous proposal.

Deputies: Hear, hear.

An Ceann Comhairle: Before I call Deputy Gilmore I want to make something clear.

A Deputy: Let them listen to their backbenchers.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan: The medical cards are gone.

Deputy Paul Kehoe: Shame on you.

Deputy James Bannon: A club of 22 will give the Government the same walking papers as Mr. McCreevy was given.

A Deputy: They will give them a standing ovation.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan: How about a standing ovation this morning?

An Ceann Comhairle: Deputy Bannon, please. Let us please deal with this calmly. A proposal by the Taoiseach, or the Ta´naiste in this case, on how the items of business are to be taken is a technical motion of very narrow scope and the merits and demerits of the item do not arise at this stage.

A Deputy: The Government has put the fear of God into our old people.

An Ceann Comhairle: This is a technical motion of a very narrow scope.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: The Government is attacking the elderly.

An Ceann Comhairle: The merits and demerits of the item do not arise at this stage.

Deputy Dinny McGinley: The Government is attacking the old people of this country.

An Ceann Comhairle: If under Standing Order 26 the proposal is opposed——

Deputy James Bannon: The Members on the Government side of the Houses all clapped when the budget was introduced so they can all take the blame now. 4 Order of 16 October 2008. Business

An Ceann Comhairle: ——the Chair is obliged to permit a brief statement from each party in opposition and from the Ta´naiste before I put the question. The proposal is a narrow one.

Deputy Jim O’Keeffe: The Government wishes to blame the one Progressive Democrats member that is left.

Deputy Dinny McGinley: The Government abandoned the old people of the country.

An Ceann Comhairle: Deputy Kenny has made a statement on an issue and if Deputy Gilmore wishes to oppose the Order of Business on No. 1 he may do so with a brief statement.

(Interruptions).

An Ceann Comhairle: I call Deputy Gilmore, without interruption, please.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore: I thank the Ceann Comhairle for inviting me to oppose the Order of Business this morning.

An Ceann Comhairle: I allow the Deputy the opportunity to do so. The alternatives are available as well.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore: I wish to oppose the Order of Business and I will explain my reasoning. I oppose the Order of Business until the Government can remove the anxiety, uncertainty and worry that exists among pensioners and older people across the country, from whom the Government intends to take away the medical card. The Government says it will save \100 million as a result of removing the medical card from pensioners. This means older people throughout the county will be collectively faced with a medical bill in the amount of \100 million next year. Older people are worried about this and about the means test the Government intents to apply——

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: Backbenchers are worried.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore: ——what the Government is looking for, who will get the medical card, who will get the GP card, who will qualify for the subsidy and who will not have a card. This is causing significant concern to people. In addition to the concern about the loss of the medical card, there is the information Deputy Jan O’Sullivan brought to the attention of the House last night, namely, that the Government is proposing to change the previous, traditional method by which older people were assessed for a medical card before the medical card scheme was introduced. Meanwhile, Fianna Fa´il Ministers are running like frightened foxes from a forest fire and leaving this in the hands of the Minister for Health and Children. The Minister for Finance was at it yesterday. The Minister for Defence on the radio this morning——

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: Soon they will be blaming Deputy Noel Grealish.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore: ——said this was all to do with the Minister for Health and Chil- dren. I wish to know——

An Ceann Comhairle: The brief statement from Deputy Gilmore has been made.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore: I am perfectly in order.

An Ceann Comhairle: The Deputy is not in order. 5 Order of 16 October 2008. Business

Deputy Eamon Gilmore: The scheme of medical cards for the over 70s was introduced by legislation.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan: Yes.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore: It was contained in the Health (Miscellaneous Provisions) Act 2001 and it can only be removed by legislation. Will the Ta´naiste say if the Government has approved the legislation to remove the medical card for the over 70s? When will this legislation be brought to the House? Will the Government do the decent thing, which is to withdraw this measure from the budget and provide some relief and some peace of mind for older people?

An Ceann Comhairle: Before I call Deputy O´ Caola´in, technically the proposal for a late sitting is to allow the budget debate beyond the time set out, no more and no less. However, I will allow brief statements from the parties commenting on and opposing item No. 1. I must then move on.

Deputy Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in: I oppose the Order of Business as presented by the Ta´naiste because it does not provide an opportunity for the House to hear directly from the Minister for Health and Children and to question her on the detail of her proposal. There is a most callous proposition to take from our elderly citizens in their 70s, 80s and older the medical card that they have enjoyed in recent years. It is absolutely inconsistent and inequitable and shows the absolute confusion at the heart of the delivery of the health system in this State. I call on the Government to withdraw this proposition immediately. Will the Minister for Health and Children come to the House today? Will the Government provide an opportunity for a proper and detailed exchange on the outworking of this proposition? Preferably, will the Government announce the decision not to proceed? If it is the case that the Minister for Health and Children will not facilitate an opportunity for the House to address this very disturbing matter today, I appeal to the Ceann Comhairle, as a facilitator of debate in this House, to allow for a Private Notice Question to be accepted and for all-party participation in order that we may as quickly as possible get to the kernel of what the Government intends, to clear up the confusion between the Minister for Finance and the Minister for Health and Children on the outworking of the proposal in the coming months and, hopefully, that we can impress some sense on them and have this matter withdrawn. Has the Government, in any way, taken into account the administrative nightmare that this measure will land on the desks of the HSE, which is expected to go through the process of review of each individual’s entitlement at a time when there is already a curtailment of frontline staff in the provision of personal social services and health care entitlement?

An Ceann Comhairle: We must move on.

Deputy Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in: It is absolutely inconsistent and inequitable. I join other voices here in urging the Government to withdraw this measure immediately.

An Ceann Comhairle: I point out to Deputy O´ Caola´in that there is no provision parliamen- tary questions today. The debate is part of the ongoing budget debate.

The Ta´naiste: I hope I will be afforded the same latitude as others in the House, given that this matter is out of order.

Deputy James Reilly: As much rope as the Ta´naiste wishes.

The Ta´naiste: I wish to clarify the matter. This is a Government decision. 6 Order of 16 October 2008. Business

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: One would not think it, given the body language on that side of the House.

The Ta´naiste: I ask for the indulgence of the House, given that we need clarity on this issue. Of the savings of \100 million, \86 million is for GPs and \30 million is for pharmacists.

Deputy Jim O’Keeffe: Those figures do not add up.

The Ta´naiste: There are 355,000 people over 70 years of age in the country, of which 215,000 have a medical card, having gone through the process of a means test. Those people will continue to have a medical card.

Deputy P. J. Sheehan: Not at all.

The Ta´naiste: There are 140,000 people who have a medical card. If Deputy Bannon knows more than I do, he should tell the people of his constituency that when he goes home on Saturday. Let me address the House, please. There are 140,000 who have a medical card with- out a means test and these are the people to which we refer.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: Every one over 70 years of age has a medical card.

The Ta´naiste: The starting point at which there is a means test per person over 66 years of age is \201.50. That is the starting point.

Deputy Emmet Stagg: That is less than the State old age pension.

The Ta´naiste: That is based on net income. As public representatives, all Deputies are acutely aware that ongoing expenses for rent, mortgage, medical costs and so on are taken into con- sideration prior to making a decision on a means test. All social welfare pension recipients——

(Interruptions).

The Ta´naiste: It is important, as legislators, that we give the facts because Deputies are adding to the confusion in this House and I will not stand for that.

Deputy Tom Hayes: The Ta´naiste is making up the facts as she goes along.

The Ta´naiste: All social welfare recipients——

Deputy Noel Dempsey: Pensioners.

The Ta´naiste: Pensioners will have an entitlement to their medical card——

(Interruptions).

An Ceann Comhairle: I remind Members that this is a democratic forum where Members are entitled to make their points, and the Ta´naiste is entitled to make her point.

Deputy Paul Kehoe: Deputy Johnny Brady is very quiet this morning.

An Ceann Comhairle: It is as simple as that. Allow the Ta´naiste to make her contribution. In a democratic forum, we must have that.

Deputy Emmet Stagg: She is provoking us.

An Ceann Comhairle: I ask the Ta´naiste to proceed. 7 Order of 16 October 2008. Business

The Ta´naiste: I will clarify the matter once again. All those who have a means-tested medical card will continue to have that entitlement.

Deputy Pat Rabbitte: We know that.

Deputy Seymour Crawford: Some 52% of people in County Donegal and 32% of people in County Monaghan——

The Ta´naiste: A person whose sole income derives from a social welfare pension——

Deputy Emmet Stagg: What about the Bo´ rd na Mo´ na pension?

The Ta´naiste: ——will continue to be entitled to a medical card.

Deputy Emmet Stagg: If one is getting \5 from Bo´ rd na Mo´ na, one will lose it.

The Ta´naiste: The 140,000 people who are not in that category will be subject to a simplified means test. The HSE will provide a simplified form.

Deputy Fergus O’Dowd: It is trying to grab people’s cards.

The Ta´naiste: The starting point for that means test will be \201.50. All other expenses will be taken into consideration.

Deputy James Bannon: It is all spin.

The Ta´naiste: As Members of the Oireachtas, we are acutely aware of these issues, as we all fill in forms for our constituents.

Deputy Emmet Stagg: There are nine——

The Ta´naiste: The first \20,000 of cash savings are exempt.

Deputy Emmet Stagg: Nine.

The Ta´naiste: To be fair to Deputy Jan O’Sullivan, she raised this issue to get some clarity. She mentioned that provision has been made on the basis of automatic entitlement when a person who is over the age of 70, but whose spouse is not yet 70, has applied for a medical card.

Deputy Emmet Stagg: We know about that.

The Ta´naiste: In such cases, the assessment has been made under a higher net threshold, solely on the basis of the automatic entitlement. As there is no longer an automatic entitlement——

Deputy James Reilly: Shame.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan: It was cut.

The Ta´naiste: ——this facility, which existed on the basis of that entitlement, is no longer relevant.

Deputy Jan O’Sullivan: The Ta´naiste should stop digging.

The Ta´naiste: However, it is important to say that those who went through the means testing process will continue to get a medical card. 8 Order of 16 October 2008. Business

Deputy Emmet Stagg: If they are getting less than \201.

The Ta´naiste: No.

Deputy Brian Hayes: It is as clear as mud.

The Ta´naiste: It is important to clarify that those who have an entitlement under a means test will continue to have that entitlement.

Deputy Paul Kehoe: Spin.

The Ta´naiste: I will conclude by answering the half-relevant question that was asked about legislation.

Deputy Ulick Burke: The Ta´naiste should bring her response back to the typist.

Deputy Brian Hayes: Bring back Deputy Michael Woods, all is forgiven.

The Ta´naiste: The legislative framework in which this will be dealt with will be facilitated through the social welfare Bill.

An Ceann Comhairle: I am putting the question.

Deputy James Reilly: Some 125,000 people over the age of 70 will not have a medical card. That is the reality.

Deputy Enda Kenny: The Ta´naiste has misled the Da´il.

Question put: “That the proposal for dealing with the late sitting be agreed to.”

The Da´il divided: Ta´, 74; Nı´l, 62.

Ta´

Ahern, Michael. Fleming, Sea´n. Ahern, Noel. Flynn, Beverley. Andrews, Barry. Gallagher, Pat The Cope. Andrews, Chris. Gogarty, Paul. Ardagh, Sea´n. Gormley, John. Aylward, Bobby. Grealish, Noel. Behan, Joe. Hanafin, Mary. Blaney, Niall. Harney, Mary. Brady, A´ ine. Haughey, Sea´n. Brady, Cyprian. Healy-Rae, Jackie. Brady, Johnny. Hoctor, Ma´ire. Browne, John. Kelleher, Billy. Byrne, Thomas. Kelly, Peter. Carey, Pat. Kenneally, Brendan. Collins, Niall. Kennedy, Michael. Conlon, Margaret. Kirk, Seamus. Connick, Sea´n. Kitt, Michael P.. Coughlan, Mary. Lenihan, Conor. Cregan, John. Mansergh, Martin. Cuffe, Ciara´n. McEllistrim, Thomas. Cullen, Martin. McGrath, Finian. Curran, John. McGrath, Mattie. Dempsey, Noel. McGrath, Michael. Devins, Jimmy. McGuinness, John. Dooley, Timmy. Moynihan, Michael. Fahey, Frank. Mulcahy, Michael. Finneran, Michael. Nolan, M. J. Fitzpatrick, Michael. O´ Cuı´v, E´ amon. 9 Order of 16 October 2008. Business

Ta´—continued

O´ Fearghaı´l, Sea´n. Power, Peter. O’Brien, Darragh. Power, Sea´n. O’Connor, Charlie. Ryan, Eamon. Scanlon, Eamon. O’Dea, Willie. Smith, Brendan. O’Flynn, Noel. Treacy, Noel. O’Hanlon, Rory. Wallace, Mary. O’Keeffe, Batt. White, Mary Alexandra. O’Rourke, Mary. Woods, Michael. O’Sullivan, Christy.

Nı´l

Bannon, James. Lynch, Ciara´n. Barrett, Sea´n. McCormack, Pa´draic. Breen, Pat. McEntee, Shane. Broughan, Thomas P. McGinley, Dinny. Burke, Ulick. McHugh, Joe. Burton, Joan. McManus, Liz. Byrne, Catherine. Morgan, Arthur. Carey, Joe. Naughten, Denis. Connaughton, Paul. Noonan, Michael. O´ Caola´in, Caoimhghı´n. Costello, Joe. ´ Coveney, Simon. O Snodaigh, Aengus. O’Donnell, Kieran. Crawford, Seymour. O’Dowd, Fergus. Creed, Michael. O’Keeffe, Jim. Creighton, Lucinda. O’Mahony, John. D’Arcy, Michael. O’Shea, Brian. Deenihan, Jimmy. O’Sullivan, Jan. Doyle, Andrew. Perry, John. Durkan, Bernard J. Rabbitte, Pat. English, Damien. Reilly, James. Enright, Olwyn. Ring, Michael. Feighan, Frank. Sheahan, Tom. Ferris, Martin. Sheehan, P.J. Flanagan, Charles. Sherlock, Sea´n. Flanagan, Terence. Shortall, Ro´ isı´n. Gilmore, Eamon. Stagg, Emmet. Hayes, Brian. Stanton, David. Hayes, Tom. Timmins, Billy. Hogan, Phil. Tuffy, Joanna. Howlin, Brendan. Upton, Mary. Kehoe, Paul. Wall, Jack. Kenny, Enda.

Tellers: Ta´, Deputies Pat Carey and John Cregan; Nı´l, Deputies Deputies Paul Kehoe and Emmet Stagg.

Question declared carried.

An Ceann Comhairle: Is the proposal for dealing with Nos. 10 to 15, inclusive, namely, motions re proposed approval by Da´il E´ ireann of double taxation relief orders, exchange of information relating to tax matters, a Council framework decision, agreements on extradition and a Council decision establishing a European police office, Europol, agreed?

Deputy Enda Kenny: I will not agree to this until I get clarification from the Ta´naiste on the Government’s decision on medical cards for over 70s. The Ta´naiste said that she wished to clarify Deputy O’Sullivan’s comments on means testing and the categories of people who were to have their cards withdrawn. Seventy-four Members of the Government parties have just voted to take away these medical cards by refusing to reverse—— 10 Order of 16 October 2008. Business

(Interruptions).

Deputy Mary Coughlan: We voted to sit until 7.30 p.m. tonight.

Deputy Enda Kenny: I will remind them of that continuously.

An Ceann Comhairle: I ask Deputy Kenny to be brief.

Deputy Enda Kenny: I accept the Ta´naiste is here to give clarification on this matter. I want her to withdraw her statement that the automatic entitlement has ended. It has not. She said it was a Government decision to introduce it and that the automatic entitlement is gone, but it is not gone. I want her to clarify that and withdraw her comment to that effect. I want to ask a question about EC Regulation 1408/71, which was mentioned in a response to a question tabled by Deputy Jim O’Keeffe on 24 June 2008. The Deputy asked whether EU nationals over 70 living in this country are entitled to health benefits and medical cards. He was told that such persons receive a medical card as evidence of their entitlement. 11 o’clock Is it now the position that EU citizens over 70 living in Ireland are automatically entitled to an Irish medical card? Will we be in a situation where the only people under the Government’s proposal not to undertake a means test are EU citizens over 70 living in this country? The Government parties have reduced elderly Irish citizens to economic statis- tics rather than people. They have offended them, hurt their integrity and driven a stake through what they did for this country. The Government must reverse that decision and I have provided the answer. The health (miscellaneous) Bill can change the regulations that will allow for pharmacists to prescribe generic drugs instead of branded drugs. That will bring in \150 million and save the blushes of Fianna Fa´il, the Green Party, the Progressive Democrats and the Independents. The Govern- ment can restore some sense of credibility and peace of mind to elderly people who are fright- ened about the letters they will receive from the Minister for Health and Children in the next fortnight.

An Ceann Comhairle: Deputy Gilmore, briefly.

Deputy Paul Kehoe: Where are the Greens now?

Deputy Eamon Gilmore: On behalf of the Labour Party I too oppose No. 2 and I support Deputy Kenny in the reasons he has given. The Government is now desperately trying to spin and explain its way out of the decision it made to take away the medical card from old age pensioners. Nine out of every ten people over 70 who currently have an automatic medical card once will lose it. This is a fact. All of the things they are talking about putting into place is being done to recover \100 million.

(Interruptions).

Deputy Eamon Gilmore: Whether Members of this House think they voted for it or against it a couple of minutes ago, it is manifestly clear that every Member of this House will have to vote on whether they want to take the medical card from pensioners.

Deputy Ma´ire Hoctor: That is not true.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: It is true.

Deputy Ma´ire Hoctor: The Deputy should read the facts. 11 Order of 16 October 2008. Business

Deputy Eamon Gilmore: There is a legal entitlement under the Health (Miscellaneous Provisions) Act 2001 for people over 70 to hold a medical card automatically. The Government will have to introduce legislation to change that. I was interested to hear the Ta´naiste say that this task will now be landed in the hands of the Minister for Social and Family Affairs.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: Pass it to the women.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore: I sympathise with any Minister who will go down in history as the Minister who took the medical card from the pensioners.

Deputy Paul Gogarty: ——playing on the fears of the elderly.

Deputy Michael Creed: Empty vessels make the most noise.

An Ceann Comhairle: I must call Deputy O´ Caola´in now. I remind Deputy Gilmore that a brief statement is all that is allowed.

Deputy Paul Kehoe: Where is Deputy Gogarty now?

An Ceann Comhairle: Allow Deputy Gilmore to finish without interruption.

(Interruptions).

An Ceann Comhairle: I say to Members on the benches on my right, that it is very difficult to be impartial between the dancer and the dance but I am trying and Members must allow Deputy Gilmore to finish. I must move on to Deputy O´ Caola´in. I remind Deputy Gilmore a brief statement is all that is allowed.

Deputy Michael Ring: They put the old people on bicycles and took the medical card off them.

An Ceann Comhairle: I ask Deputy Gilmore to proceed and bring this to finality because he is only allowed a brief statement and I must call Deputy O´ Caola´in.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore: We can bring all of this to finality very easily if the Government——

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: The three Marys are in trouble.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore: ——does what it will be eventually forced to do which is to back off this proposal. I invite the Ta´naiste to clarify the matter. The Minister for Finance said this morning that the proposal is intended to proceed regardless. The Government will take the medical card off pensioners and not only take the medical card off them but halve the income limits for the means test that will be applied to them if they have to apply for it.

An Ceann Comhairle: I call Deputy O´ Caola´in for a brief statement. I presume his is oppos- ing item No. 2.

Deputy Paul Kehoe: The Minister of State with responsibility for older people is texting on her mobile phone. She has no interest in older people. She should resign.

An Ceann Comhairle: Please, Deputy Kehoe.

Deputy Ma´ire Hoctor: I know rubbish when I hear it.

Deputy Paul Kehoe: She should resign. 12 Order of 16 October 2008. Business

Deputy Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in: In joining colleagues in oppositionto the second proposed grouping of propositions on the Order of Business, having been asked over yesterday and last night by several people who have telephoned me I wish to raise an issue that has not been addressed or highlighted here this morning or heretofore. I refer to a large number of those people who currently hold the over-70s entitlementto medical cards whose medical cards expire at the end of this month or at the end of November. What is the situation with regard to the signalled end of this scheme if the Government parties and their Independent supporters continueto vote as they have already done this morning? What is the position with regard to the automatic renewal of those medical cards that will expire between now and the change the Government appears to be hell bent on bringing in? Shame on the Government for it? Will these medical cards be renewed? The entitlement is there, at least until such time as the Government applies its guillotine on that entitlement. It needs to be noted by hospitals, by general practitioners, by those providing the prescription needs of these people, that on the expiry of those cards and until such time as the decision is finally taken — if that is to happen and God forbid it does — these people’s entitlement continues irrespective of whether the card has expired and no new card has issued. Will the Ta´naiste clarify that point and will she at least give some temporary respite to those who fear that they will not get a renewed card over the intervening period?

The Ta´naiste: On the issue of the Leader of the Opposition——

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: That is the worst of letting the civil servants write the budget.

An Ceann Comhairle: The Ta´naiste without interruption, please.

The Ta´naiste: As of 1 January next year, there will be a new methodology. The question I referred to was raised by Deputy Jan O’Sullivan in the context of a methodology in which an entitlement was made available. That methodology will no longer be relevant in due course on the basis that there will be no automatic entitlement to a medical card for those over 70. That is the way in which I referred to the issue raised by Deputy O’ Sullivan yesterday evening——

Deputy Ro´ isı´n Shortall: On a point of order. The Ta´naiste is incorrect.

The Ta´naiste: That is the methodology which is no longer relevant——

Deputy Ro´ isı´n Shortall: On a point of order.

Deputy Emmet Stagg: Is the Ceann Comhairle deaf?

The Ta´naiste: I can appreciate that people——

Deputy Emmet Stagg: A point of order.

An Ceann Comhairle: Who is calling for a point of order? I will allow Deputy Shortall on a point of order.

Deputy Ro´ isı´n Shortall: The Ta´naiste is wrong——

An Ceann Comhairle: That is not a point of order.

Deputy Ro´ isı´n Shortall: The increases to the means test for over-70s were introduced in 1999——

An Ceann Comhairle: That is not a point of order. 13 Order of 16 October 2008. Business

Deputy Ro´ isı´n Shortall: ——as an initiative under the year of the elderly.

An Ceann Comhairle: That is not a point of order.

Deputy Ro´ isı´n Shortall: What the Ta´naiste is saying is incorrect. The increases to the means test for over 70s were introduced in 1999 as an initiative under the year of the elderly so what the Ta´naiste is saying in incorrect.

An Ceann Comhairle: That is not a point of order. The Ta´naiste may proceed.

The Ta´naiste: I can appreciate——

Deputy Ro´ isı´n Shortall: It is nothing to do with the automatic entitlement.

Deputy Enda Kenny: On a point of order. Under the Standing Orders of the House the Ta´naiste is expected to give the House valid information. She said five minutes ago——

The Ta´naiste: The methodology.

Deputy Enda Kenny: ——that the automatic entitlement is no longer there. It is there.

The Ta´naiste: It will be no longer available.

An Ceann Comhairle: That is not a point of order, Deputy Kenny.

Deputy Enda Kenny: The Ta´naiste has not clarified it and she has misled the Da´il.

The Ta´naiste: I did clarify it.

An Ceann Comhairle: That is not a point of order either, Deputy Kenny.

Deputy Enda Kenny: She has added further fears to the older people.

An Ceann Comhairle: That is not a point of order. I ask Deputy Kenny to allow the Ta´naiste to finish.

(Interruptions).

The Ta´naiste: I can appreciate——

Deputy Ro´ isı´n Shortall: On a point of order.

An Ceann Comhairle: No, it is not a point of order. This is a democratic forum and the Deputy should please allow the Ta´naiste to finish.

The Ta´naiste: ——that as politicians people can have political banterand they can say what- ever they have to say——

Deputy Charles Flanagan: It is not banter; this is beyond banter.

(Interruptions).

The Ta´naiste: However, those of us on this side of the House should at least be afforded the opportunity to give clarification and equally that we rise—— 14 Order of 16 October 2008. Business

(Interruptions).

The Ta´naiste: ——above the muddying of the waters that is currently taking place in this House and which is unfair to many people who are probably watching us on TG4 this morning.

(Interruptions).

The Ta´naiste: It is important to deal with the facts. The leader of the Labour Party indicated he had an issue——

Deputy Eamon Gilmore: On a point of order.

The Ta´naiste: ——on fairness and equity. I put it to him that on the basis of fairness and equity, on what basis does he see fairness and equity in the case where someone is getting a medical card and whose GP is getting \161 for the service and others——

Deputy Michael Creed: It was the Ta´naiste’s Government who introduced in the scheme.

The Ta´naiste: ——who are outside the scheme are getting \640. Where is the fairness and equity in that?

(Interruptions).

The Ta´naiste: The Leader of the Opposition would equally be of the view that he needs to see fairness and equity in the way in which scarce resources are allocated. Can he justify a change by his members’ on the basis that a Government decision to offer medical cards to well-off pensioners, to senior civil servants, High Court judges, property tycoons, Ministers of State and hospital consultants has been condemned? Let the Opposition tell me where there is fairness and equity in that.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore: On a point of order.

An Ceann Comhairle: Does Deputy Gilmore have a genuine point of order? I call Deputy Gilmore.

Deputy James Reilly: The Government took it away. I cannot help if the Government members are so incompetent they cannot count and do not know how to do deals. I will stand for the elderly and make sure they get a proper deal.

(Interruptions).

An Ceann Comhairle: If Deputy Gilmore has a point of order.

Deputy James Reilly: May I say——

An Ceann Comhairle: Deputy Reilly may not. Deputy Gilmore on a point or order.

Deputy James Reilly: Deputy Kenny has asked me to sort this out. As a new Deputy, I do not understand how the Government can do this. I have been asked to sort it out and I will sort it out.

(Interruptions).

An Ceann Comhairle: If this continues the House cannot continue.

Deputy Billy Kelleher: That money kept Deputy Reilly in business. 15 Order of 16 October 2008. Business

Deputy Charles Flanagan: Deputy Kelleher has given Deputy Reilly a standing ovation.

An Ceann Comhairle: Deputy Gilmore may proceed.

Deputy Paul Kehoe: The Government is robbing the elderly.

Deputy Shane McEntee: The Government is bouncing the cheque it wrote to the elderly.

An Ceann Comhairle: Perhaps some do not understand, although I am sure they do, that this is a democratic forum where people are entitled to make their points of view known. We must operate within Standing Orders. I am doing my best. If this continues, I will have to suspend the House, unfortunately.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: Let the Government suspend the scheme and we will all be happy.

An Ceann Comhairle: Deputy Gilmore has long-standing experience and I hope his is a point or order and not a point of provocation.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore: I have also been standing here a long time trying to make this point. It is a point of order. The issue the Labour Party has raised has to do with the income limits for the medical card means test. In addition to taking the medical card from pensioners——

An Ceann Comhairle: That is not a point of order.

Deputy Jan O’Sullivan: It is.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore: I want to talk. Will the Ceann Comhairle please hear me out? We raised the issue of the income limits for the means test. In reply, the Ta´naiste has told the House the income limits are directly related to the medical card scheme for the free medical card for the over 70s. That is not the case.

An Ceann Comhairle: That is not a point of order. I have already made that quite clear.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore: I have here the extract——

An Ceann Comhairle: I have ruled it out of order.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore: The Ceann Comhairle is not hearing me.

An Ceann Comhairle: I am hearing the Deputy.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore: I have here the extract from the budget speech by former Minister for Finance, Mr. Charlie McCreevy, in 1999, two years before the free medical cards came in, in which he said the income guidelines used to establish medical card eligibility for persons aged 70 and over will be doubled over the next three years, beginning with an increase of one third in the coming year. That is being reduced. In addition to taking the automatic medical card, the Government is reversing what Mr. McCreevy did in 1999 and cutting the income guideline in half.

An Ceann Comhairle: That is not a point of order.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore: Not only is the Government removing the medical card, it will also make it more difficult for them to get a medical card. 16 Order of 16 October 2008. Business

An Ceann Comhairle: That is not a point of order.

Deputy Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in: On a point of order——

An Ceann Comhairle: I am putting the question.

Deputy Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in: The Ceann Comhairle is out of order——

Question put: “That Nos. 10 to 15, inclusive, be taken without debate.”

The Da´il divided: Ta´, 73; Nı´l, 61.

Ta´

Ahern, Michael. Kelleher, Billy. Ahern, Noel. Kelly, Peter. Andrews, Barry. Kenneally, Brendan. Andrews, Chris. Kennedy, Michael. Ardagh, Sea´n. Kirk, Seamus. Aylward, Bobby. Kitt, Michael P. Behan, Joe. Lenihan, Conor. Blaney, Niall. Mansergh, Martin. Brady, A´ ine. McEllistrim, Thomas. Brady, Cyprian. McGrath, Finian. Brady, Johnny. McGrath, Mattie. Browne, John. McGrath, Michael. Byrne, Thomas. McGuinness, John. Carey, Pat. Moynihan, Michael. Conlon, Margaret. Mulcahy, Michael. Connick, Sea´n. Nolan, M. J. Coughlan, Mary. O´ Cuı´v, E´ amon. Cregan, John. O´ Fearghaı´l, Sea´n. Cuffe, Ciara´n. O’Brien, Darragh. Cullen, Martin. O’Connor, Charlie. Curran, John. O’Dea, Willie. Dempsey, Noel. O’Flynn, Noel. Devins, Jimmy. O’Hanlon, Rory. Dooley, Timmy. O’Keeffe, Batt. Fahey, Frank. O’Keeffe, Edward. Finneran, Michael. O’Rourke, Mary. Fitzpatrick, Michael. O’Sullivan, Christy. Fleming, Sea´n. Power, Peter. Flynn, Beverley. Power, Sea´n. Gallagher, Pat The Cope. Ryan, Eamon. Gogarty, Paul. Scanlon, Eamon. Gormley, John. Smith, Brendan. Grealish, Noel. Treacy, Noel. Harney, Mary. Wallace, Mary. Haughey, Sea´n. White, Mary Alexandra. Healy-Rae, Jackie. Woods, Michael. Hoctor, Ma´ire.

Nı´l

Bannon, James. Creighton, Lucinda. Barrett, Sea´n. D’Arcy, Michael. Breen, Pat. Deenihan, Jimmy. Broughan, Thomas P. Doyle, Andrew. Burke, Ulick. Durkan, Bernard J. Burton, Joan. English, Damien. Byrne, Catherine. Enright, Olwyn. Carey, Joe. Feighan, Frank. Clune, Deirdre. Ferris, Martin. Connaughton, Paul. Flanagan, Charles. Coveney, Simon. Flanagan, Terence. Crawford, Seymour. Gilmore, Eamon. Creed, Michael. Hayes, Brian. 17 Order of 16 October 2008. Business

Nı´l—continued

Hayes, Tom. O’Keeffe, Jim. Hogan, Phil. O’Mahony, John. Howlin, Brendan. O’Shea, Brian. Kehoe, Paul. O’Sullivan, Jan. Kenny, Enda. Perry, John. Lynch, Ciara´n. Rabbitte, Pat. McCormack, Pa´draic. Reilly, James. McEntee, Shane. Sheahan, Tom. McGinley, Dinny. Sheehan, P. J. McHugh, Joe. Sherlock, Sea´n. McManus, Liz. Shortall, Ro´ isı´n. Morgan, Arthur. Stagg, Emmet. Naughten, Denis. Stanton, David. Noonan, Michael. Timmins, Billy. O´ Caola´in, Caoimhghı´n. Tuffy, Joanna. O´ Snodaigh, Aengus. Upton, Mary. O’Donnell, Kieran. Wall, Jack. O’Dowd, Fergus.

Tellers: Ta´, Deputies Pat Carey and John Cregan; Nı´l, Deputies Paul Kehoe and Emmet Stagg.

Question declared carried.

An Ceann Comhairle: I must now ask if the proposal for the sitting tomorrow is agreed. Agreed.

Deputy Joan Burton: No, it is not.

Deputy Enda Kenny: The Ceann Comhairle moved very fast there, like a good Kerry forward.

An Ceann Comhairle: I was not fast enough.

Deputy Enda Kenny: The Ta´naiste, speaking on behalf of the Government this morning, only added to the confusion about medical cards.

The Ta´naiste: I did not add to the confusion.

Deputy Enda Kenny: She did not answer the question about European citizens. We know that the British Government pays \450 million, as outlined to Deputy Ring, for their citizens living here who have Irish medical cards but the Ta´naiste did not refer to the Europeans. The former Minister for Finance, Mr. Charlie McCreevy, introduced this scheme and said that he was doing so to repay the people who built this country and maintained it in hard times. The Government is now taking away that automatic entitlement. The Government offends elderly people with what it has done here. It will put the decision of the late Mr. Ernest Blythe into the shade when it is implemented. The confusion that has arisen from the Ta´naiste’s statement in the House and from the Minister for Finance’s statement in Brussels this morning means that Deputies will be going around the country unable to answer questions about this decision. The Minister for Health and Children should be given some time in the Da´il today to clear up the confusion relating to the Government’s intention to implement the decision. We can then decide the battleground upon which Deputies will have to vote on this measure — they will have to vote on this, as Deputy Gilmore pointed out.

An Ceann Comhairle: Deputy Kenny has made his point. 18 Order of 16 October 2008. Business

Deputy Enda Kenny: It is important to note that Deputies Finian McGrath and Jackie Healy- Rae were among the 73 Deputies who voted “Yes” in the last vote, as a precursor to taking away medical cards from elderly people. That should not be forgotten in their constituencies. I suggest, in view of this appalling decision by the Government, that we adjust our business today so that the Minister for Health and Children can take charge of this issue. It is clear that the Ta´naiste does not have the answers to all the questions that were raised, nor does the Minister for Finance.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: The Minister, Deputy Willie O’Dea, does not have the answers either.

Deputy Enda Kenny: Perhaps the Minister for Health and Children, who has been blamed by the Minister for Finance and most other Fianna Fa´il Deputies in the corridors of this House——

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: That is right. The Minister, Deputy O’Dea, was at it this morning.

(Interruptions).

Deputy Enda Kenny: They have decided to blame the Minister, Deputy Mary Harney, for this when clearly it is another part of the Lenihan levy and a consequence of a Government that does not know what it is at.

An Ceann Comhairle: We must move on. The Deputy has made his statement.

Deputy Billy Kelleher: People are talking about Deputy Kenny in the corridors too. They were talking about him over breakfast this morning.

Deputy Enda Kenny: I suggest, with the Ta´naiste’s agreement, that we adjust the Order of Business for today and give the Minister for Health and Children half an hour or more to clear up any confusion that exists on the Government’s intention to go ahead with this decision.

(Interruptions).

Deputy Enda Kenny: I am glad to see that the Minister of State, Deputy Michael Finneran, is here and is wide awake for this very important debate.

An Ceann Comhairle: Let us leave that now. The Deputy has made his point.

Deputy Enda Kenny: I know the Deputy was awake yesterday. It was only a long blink he was having. I put that suggestion to the Ta´naiste.

Deputy Noel Dempsey: It would take longer than half an hour to explain things to those on Deputy Kenny’s side of the House.

Deputy Joan Burton: Regarding No. 3, the arrangements for a limited debate tomorrow are not to the satisfaction of the Labour Party. I met officials of the Department of Finance last night who told me the basis of the calculation of the levy is the cost of the increase in the national debt over ten years of the State guarantee to the banks. That is \1 billion divided by ten, which is \100 million per year, to be paid over two years, in two instalments of \50 million. Interestingly, that is the same cost as that which old age pensioners are paying in this budget. The banks will claim \100 million back from their customers but the old age pensioners will not be able to claim their money back from anybody. 19 Order of 16 October 2008. Business

Deputies: Hear, hear.

Deputy Joan Burton: We are not accepting this arrangement.

An Ceann Comhairle: The Deputy has made her point.

Deputy Joan Burton: We have, once again, a cosy back-door deal for the bankers and the richest people in Irish society.

Deputies: Hear, hear.

An Ceann Comhairle: The Deputy has made her point.

Deputy Joan Burton: A cut-price guarantee scheme will be brought into this House tomor- row and that is a disgrace. There is no equity for the Irish taxpayer. It is \100 million per year for ten years——

An Ceann Comhairle: We can talk about that tomorrow.

Deputy Joan Burton: It is a disgrace, a steal and a give-away.

An Ceann Comhairle: We will have a debate on that tomorrow. We must move on.

Deputy Joan Burton: The proposal for tomorrow’s business states: “A Minister or Minister of State may reply to questions.” Fortunately, I share the same constituency as the distinguished Minister for Finance and I have had to cancel attendance at constituency functions tomorrow but the Minister will go to those functions. I want an assurance from the Government, in the context of the most expensive deal that the Irish taxpayer has ever undertaken, that the Mini- ster for Finance will be in this House to answer our questions.

Deputies: Hear, hear.

An Ceann Comhairle: I call Deputy Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in.

Deputy Joan Burton: I do not want some cack-handed Minister for State who has not even read the——

An Ceann Comhairle: The Deputy cannot have a second bite of the cherry. She has had her run.

Deputy Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in: With regard to the proposed arrangements for tomorrow, I find the last point made by Deputy Burton very disturbing. That there is any prospect of the Minister for Finance not being here for the entirety of the scheduled debate on the measures relating to the Credit Institutions (Financial Support) Bill, just recently past, is absolutely unacceptable. The idea that the Minister for Finance might be absent, carrying out the function and responsibility of another Minister in Government is absolutely insulting to this House and raises a question as to his sincerity and the Government’s real intent regarding the measures involved in the proposals to be put before us as Members of this Da´il. As the Ta´naiste did not reply to the points I made earlier regarding the entitlement of over 70s to medical cards that will expire between now and 1 January, the thought occurred to me to describe this budget as a programme for emigration with the Minister for Finance at the departure gates taking further moneys out of the pockets of those given the privilege to leave.

Deputy Ma´ire Hoctor: Deputy O´ Caola´in was on Wall Street last week. 20 Order of 16 October 2008. Business

Deputy Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in: Earlier Deputy Kenny made the point that EU nationals of other countries living here who are over 70 and in all age groups will continue to enjoy auto- matic access to a full medical card.

Deputy Noel Dempsey: They do not.

Deputy Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in: What are we recommending here, that all Irish over 70s should move to other member states where they will equally then be entitled to a full medi- cal card?

Deputy Noel Dempsey: It is untrue. The Deputy is being racist.

An Ceann Comhairle: Deputy O´ Caola´in has had his say.

Deputy Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in: The idea that this is a programme for emigration is particular and specific to those over 70 years of age.

An Ceann Comhairle: Deputy O´ Caola´in has had his run. The Ta´naiste to respond on No. 3.

Deputy Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in: Maybe we will start by offering Jackie his one-way flight.

The Ta´naiste: No EU citizen may have an entitlement which is not afforded to an Irish citizen.

Deputy Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in: That is not the case.

Deputy Michael Ring: The British Government pays \450 million a year to them.

An Ceann Comhairle: Let the Ta´naiste finish.

The Ta´naiste: I was the one who negotiated the new regulation 1408 during our Presidency.

Deputy Pat Rabbitte: How many Commissioners were there at the time?

The Ta´naiste: Deputy Rabbitte will never be one so get on with it.

Deputy Paul Kehoe: The Ta´naiste could be gone sooner than she thinks.

Deputy Damien English: The Ta´naiste is getting nasty.

An Ceann Comhairle: Allow the Ta´naiste to speak. The Ta´naiste listened.

The Ta´naiste: I sincerely hope——

Deputy Paul Kehoe: We sincerely hope the Government will reverse the decision taken.

An Ceann Comhairle: The Ta´naiste was asked some questions and Deputy Kehoe should allow her to answer them.

The Ta´naiste: ——that the people of this country and those outside of this nation do not see the antics which have taken place this morning——

Deputy Enda Kenny: All caused by the Ta´naiste.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan: The Ta´naiste should look in her own back yard. 21 Order of 16 October 2008. Business

The Ta´naiste: ——as a reflection of the way in which we will deal with the economic diffi- culties we now have to face and address.

Deputy Paul Connaughton: What did the Government do last Tuesday?

Deputy Paul Kehoe: Zero tolerance.

The Ta´naiste: This House did a good job in the context of the banking issues raised in the crisis——

Deputy James Bannon: Time will tell.

Deputy Damien English: We will see.

The Ta´naiste: ——which has been accepted by the European Union——

Deputy Damien English: Is this a lecture?

The Ta´naiste: ——and has been followed by many other member states on the basis of the decisions made here.

Deputy James Reilly: Now the Government is doing a job on the elderly. Not a good job, just a job.

The Ta´naiste: If the Opposition wishes to drive political wedges among those in the Government——

Deputy Brian Hayes: Splinters more like.

The Ta´naiste: ——I am sorry——

Deputy Paul Kehoe: Sorry for doing it I would say.

The Ta´naiste: ——but it will not happen.

Deputy Paul Kehoe: The backbenchers will revolt.

An Ceann Comhairle: Allow the Ta´naiste to finish.

The Ta´naiste: Regarding the request made by a number of Members of the Opposition, the Minister for Health and Children will not be coming to the House because we will deal with the issues as ordered today.

Deputy Paul Kehoe: It is because she is afraid to come in.

The Ta´naiste: However, I am sure I could impress upon her to make available some of her officials to carry out tutorials for those who are inept and unable to read what is on the HSE website.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan: The Minister should stand up and be accountable.

Question put: “That the proposal for the sitting of the Da´il tomorrow be agreed to.”

22 Order of 16 October 2008. Business

The Da´il divided: Ta´, 73; Nı´l, 63.

Ta´

Ahern, Michael. Hoctor, Ma´ire. Ahern, Noel. Kelleher, Billy. Andrews, Barry. Kelly, Peter. Andrews, Chris. Kenneally, Brendan. Ardagh, Sea´n. Kennedy, Michael. Aylward, Bobby. Kirk, Seamus. Behan, Joe. Kitt, Michael P. Blaney, Niall. Lenihan, Conor. Brady, A´ ine. McEllistrim, Thomas. Brady, Cyprian. McGrath, Finian. Brady, Johnny. McGrath, Mattie. Browne, John. McGrath, Michael. Byrne, Thomas. McGuinness, John. Carey, Pat. Mansergh, Martin. Collins, Niall. Moynihan, Michael. Conlon, Margaret. Mulcahy, Michael. Connick, Sea´n. Nolan, M. J. Coughlan, Mary. O´ Cuı´v, E´ amon. Cregan, John. O´ Fearghaı´l, Sea´n. Cuffe, Ciara´n. O’Brien, Darragh. Cullen, Martin. O’Connor, Charlie. Curran, John. O’Dea, Willie. Dempsey, Noel. O’Flynn, Noel. Devins, Jimmy. O’Hanlon, Rory. Dooley, Timmy. O’Keeffe, Edward. Finneran, Michael. O’Rourke, Mary. Fitzpatrick, Michael. O’Sullivan, Christy. Fleming, Sea´n. Power, Peter. Flynn, Beverley. Power, Sea´n. Gallagher, Pat The Cope. Ryan, Eamon. Gogarty, Paul. Scanlon, Eamon. Gormley, John. Smith, Brendan. Grealish, Noel. Treacy, Noel. Hanafin, Mary. Wallace, Mary. Harney, Mary. White, Mary Alexandra. Haughey, Sea´n. Woods, Michael. Healy-Rae, Jackie.

Nı´l

Bannon, James. Gilmore, Eamon. Barrett, Sea´n. Hayes, Brian. Breen, Pat. Hayes, Tom. Broughan, Thomas P. Hogan, Phil. Burke, Ulick. Howlin, Brendan. Burton, Joan. Kehoe, Paul. Byrne, Catherine. Kenny, Enda. Carey, Joe. Lynch, Ciara´n. Clune, Deirdre. McCormack, Pa´draic. Connaughton, Paul. McEntee, Shane. Coonan, Noel J. McGinley, Dinny. Coveney, Simon. McHugh, Joe. Crawford, Seymour. McManus, Liz. Creed, Michael. Morgan, Arthur. Creighton, Lucinda. Naughten, Denis. D’Arcy, Michael. Noonan, Michael. Deenihan, Jimmy. O´ Caola´in, Caoimhghı´n. Doyle, Andrew. O´ Snodaigh, Aengus. Durkan, Bernard J. O’Donnell, Kieran. English, Damien. O’Dowd, Fergus. Enright, Olwyn. O’Keeffe, Jim. Feighan, Frank. O’Mahony, John. Ferris, Martin. O’Shea, Brian. Flanagan, Charles. O’Sullivan, Jan. Flanagan, Terence. Perry, John. 23 Order of 16 October 2008. Business

Nı´l—continued

Rabbitte, Pat. Stagg, Emmet. Reilly, James. Stanton, David. Ring, Michael. Timmins, Billy. Sheahan, Tom. Tuffy, Joanna. Sheehan, P. J. Upton, Mary. Sherlock, Sea´n. Wall, Jack. Shortall, Ro´ isı´n.

Tellers: Ta´: Deputies Pat Carey and John Cregan; Nı´l: Deputies Paul Kehoe and Emmet Stagg.

Question declared carried.

Deputy Enda Kenny: I want to give the Ta´naiste and the Government notice that the Oppo- sition parties — I am sure I can say this on behalf of the Labour Party — will continue to pursue the Government’s crazy decision on medical cards for the over 70s. In respect of tomorrow’s debate on the bank guarantee scheme, as published by the Govern- ment and given approval by the European Commission, Deputy Joan Burton pointed out that this is an expensive guarantee to the banking institutions. Will the Ta´naiste confirm that the Minister for Finance will be in the Chamber for the entire debate tomorrow? We do not want a farcical situation where, in the middle of a critically important matter such as this, the Minister for Finance absconds from the House to attend some constituency function or other. Nothing in his constituency is more important than tomorrow’s debate. He must take it in its entirety. Will the Ta´naiste confirm he will be here for the entire debate? Fears have been expressed by Fianna Fa´il Members and others that if this guarantee were to be called in, the banks would pass on the charge to their customers. The Taoiseach made it clear that the banking sector would have to pay for this deal if it were to be called in. Will the Ta´naiste confirm that the customer, the taxpayer and those who use the banking system will not be liable for the charges that may arise if the guarantee were to be called in inside its two year period? I understand the deal, as published, cannot be amended because it has been agreed to by the European Commission. That means Deputies on this side of the House will have to ask questions of concern to them. One question that must be raised is the extent of parliamentary scrutiny of the regulations that will apply.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan: Hear, hear.

Deputy Enda Kenny: I see no reason that the principle adopted by Fine Gael some time ago where those persons, as was mentioned by the Financial Regulator last week, who will attend on behalf of State on the banks’ boards and risk management committees should not be able to attend the Committee of Public Accounts to give their views on what service 12 o’clock they can give the State from attending such boards. Will the Ta´naiste explain how parliamentary scrutiny, which is not written into the scheme, will apply when the Minister for Finance claims we are deep into the banking sector? If we are in that deep, we need to know what is going on, the extent of bad debt, rolled up interest and the actual liabilities. Will all these be given by the Minister for Finance tomorrow when he attends for the entire debate?

An Ceann Comhairle: Deputy Kenny will accept and understand that the Ta´naiste cannot be expected to be able to go into the detail of the scheme itself. That is a matter for tomorrow which we must accept. 24 Order of 16 October 2008. Business

Deputy Enda Kenny: She knows everything.

An Ceann Comhairle: The attendance of the Minister for Finance is another matter. I will ask the Ta´naiste to address the other matters.

The Ta´naiste: We have agreed there will be statements by the Minister for Finance and the relevant spokespersons. Everyone will then be afforded the opportunity for two hours to ask questions on the matter.

Deputy Enda Kenny: Will we be able to ask the Minister for Finance these questions?

The Ta´naiste: The Minister will answer the questions to the best of his ability for the benefit of all Members. The Leader of the Opposition is correct that the terms of the guarantee cannot be amended. I listened to the Fine Gael spokesperson on this and he appreciated that point.

Deputy Enda Kenny: What about a bank calling in the guarantee and then passing the charge on to its customers?

An Ceann Comhairle: That is a matter for tomorrow because it relates to the content of the scheme. It is a matter Deputy Enda Kenny will no doubt bring up tomorrow as Leader of the Opposition.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore: On promised legislation, the Ta´naiste informed the House earlier that the legislative measure to remove medical cards from old age pensioners will be contained in the social welfare Bill. When will the Bill be published? I encourage all pensioners to ask their Deputy how he or she will vote on the measure when it comes before the Da´il. It is clear that the removal——

An Ceann Comhairle: Deputy Eamon Gilmore is well aware that he cannot call for that on the Order of Business.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore: ——of the medical card from pensioners will be done by legislation passed in this House.

An Ceann Comhairle: The Deputy should stay on the Order of Business.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore: That legislation will have to be voted on by every Member. Pen- sioners and their families should get an assurance from their Deputy that he or she will not vote——

An Ceann Comhairle: The Ta´naiste on the social welfare Bill. Deputy Eamon Gilmore I have given much latitude already this morning.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore: ——for the removal of the medical card from pensioners. When will the Government move the writ for the Dublin South by-election?

The Ta´naiste: The social welfare Bill will be available in two weeks. It will not just include the measures to which the Deputy referred. It will also ensure the \400 payment scheme will be introduced and the measure to exclude those over 70 from the health levy. I am sure he will agree with these measures.

Deputy Emmet Stagg: It is the first step on the road to back down on this measure. 25 Order of 16 October 2008. Business

The Ta´naiste: All Members will have their constituency clinics on Saturday and I am sure we will facilitate everyone who comes with a question. There has been no decision on the Dublin South by-election.

Deputy Jan O’Sullivan: The Health (Miscellaneous Provisions) Act 2001 is an Act of Parlia- ment. The Minister for Health and Children said this Act will be amended by way of the social welfare Bill. Has this been put to and agreed by the Cabinet? Will the Ta´naiste tell the Minister for Health and Children to instruct the Health Service Executive to take down the illegal information on medical cards from its website?

An Ceann Comhairle: We cannot talk about websites today.

Deputy Jan O’Sullivan: This is still a democracy and the legislation has not been amended.

An Ceann Comhairle: I have been talking about democracy all morning.

Deputy James Reilly: We have been listening attentively too.

Deputy James Bannon: We do not disagree with you, a Cheann Comhairle.

Deputy Jan O’Sullivan: The website claims the medical card scheme will be changed on 1 January but that has not been passed by legislation. We live in a democracy. Will the Health Service Executive take the illegal information off its website?

An Ceann Comhairle: Sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander.

The Ta´naiste: It is proposed to introduce these measures under the social welfare Bill.

Deputy Jan O’Sullivan: Has it been agreed by Cabinet to amend the Health (Miscellaneous Provisions) Act 2001?

The Ta´naiste: The social welfare Bill has not been brought to Cabinet yet; therefore, we could not discuss it.

Deputy Jan O’Sullivan: That means there is no agreement that the medical card system will be amended.

The Ta´naiste: There is agreement on the matter. Its implementation and the methodologies by which it will be dealt with will be done through the social welfare Bill.

Deputy Eamon Gilmore: That is very unfair.

Deputy Jan O’Sullivan: It has been agreed to amend the Act.

The Ta´naiste: It will be done through the social welfare Bill and the Parliamentary Counsel will deal with that.

Deputy Jan O’Sullivan: Public representatives better deal with it as well.

Deputy James Bannon: In light of the appalling——

An Ceann Comhairle: I do not think this is the Deputy’s first contribution this morning.

Deputy Noel Dempsey: He is wearing a nice tie though. 26 Order of 16 October 2008. Business

Deputy James Bannon: ——and savage attack on elderly people and the dreadful cutbacks in health services announced in the budget, much information is being put out in the media by various Ministers, each one contradicting the other.

Deputy Noel Dempsey: There surely is.

Deputy James Bannon: Who will give the correct definition of what is happening in the Government?

An Ceann Comhairle: We are not into definitions here.

Deputy Michael Creed: They are tutorials.

An Ceann Comhairle: The Deputy can take that up with the Ta´naiste later. I call Deputy Shortall.

Deputy Ro´ isı´n Shortall: I seek your assistance on a matter, a Cheann Comhairle. Earlier, the Ta´naiste misled the House concerning the circumstances surrounding the setting of income limits for medical cards.

An Ceann Comhairle: We cannot go back on that now.

Deputy Ro´ isı´n Shortall: I am asking for your assistance on this matter.

An Ceann Comhairle: Right.

Deputy Ro´ isı´n Shortall: Will you request the Ta´naiste, now or later today, to correct the record of the House in that regard?

An Ceann Comhairle: If the Deputy wishes to make a substantive allegation concerning a Minister, Minister of State or any other Member misleading the House, it may be done by a substantive motion, but it cannot be done across the floor of the House or by innuendo. That is my ruling on it and we cannot go any further. It is a ruling on which I have been entirely consistent.

Deputy Ro´ isı´n Shortall: I look for your direction on this.

An Ceann Comhairle: If the Deputy is of the view that somebody misled the House, that would be an allegation of a serious nature against an office holder. It can be brought before the House by way of a substantive motion. That is the assistance I offer the Deputy. That is as far as I can put it.

Deputy Ro´ isı´n Shortall: What opportunity will I have to bring this motion before the House?

An Ceann Comhairle: I strongly suggest that the Deputy visit the office of the clerk and she will be assisted in the procedure that must be followed in laying a substantive motion before the House.

Deputy Ro´ isı´n Shortall: Thank you, a Cheann Comhairle.

Deputy Joan Burton: I want to ask the Ta´naiste about two points. First, the Finance Bill has to be enacted within 100 days of the budget.

The Ta´naiste: Yes. 27 Order of 16 October 2008. Business

Deputy Joan Burton: Because the budget was brought forward this year and because of the Christmas recess, we are in a very tight deadline. When will the Bill be published? It would need to be published by 1 November to give us an opportunity to consider it properly. I heard Deputy Fleming speaking on “Tonight with Vincent Browne” last night——

An Ceann Comhairle: Never mind Vincent Browne now.

Deputy Joan Burton: ——saying the reason for the fiasco over medical cards was that the Estimates had not been published. When will we get the Finance Bill? Second, will the Ta´naiste clarify one matter before that Bill is published? From what the Minister for Finance, Deputy Brian Lenihan, said the other day, people on an occupational pension over 70 will be subject to the new 1% income tax levy. Other members of the Government have been appalled at that and did not appreciate that was so.

An Ceann Comhairle: Deputy Burton knows that I cannot go into the content of the Finance Bill here this morning. It would not be possible for the Ta´naiste to answer that question.

Deputy Joan Burton: She said that people with a social welfare pension will be exempt from the 1% income tax levy.

An Ceann Comhairle: Deputy Burton has had several bites of the cherry, Please allow the Ta´naiste to answer the question on the Finance Bill. When will the Finance Bill be published?

The Ta´naiste: On the issue of the Finance Bill, I will get absolute clarity on the date, but it will be approximately 22 October. However, we are cognisant of the fact that it has to be available in time. The other issues are matters for the Bill.

Deputy James Reilly: I wish to raise two things. There is terrible confusion about the 2% health levy.

An Ceann Comhairle: We cannot resolve it here this morning.

Deputy James Reilly: It is important to clarify this in the context of the Bill.

An Ceann Comhairle: Loads of things are important.

Deputy James Reilly: We must clarify whether this will happen under the social welfare legislation. The Minister for Finance told me yesterday that it will not apply, but on the radio today he did not answer that question.

The Ta´naiste: The 2% health levy will not apply.

An Ceann Comhairle: The Ta´naiste should not deal with that.

Deputy James Reilly: I have a second point, if I may. I hope the 10% cut Ministers and public servants are taking will be ring-fenced and put into something real, such as isolation rooms for cystic fibrosis sufferers, instead of being used to pay bonuses for HSE bosses.

An Ceann Comhairle: That is definitely not in order.

The Ta´naiste: We look forward to the Deputy surrendering 10% of all his income, as well.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan: On 9 October, I received a letter from the HSE concerning the health repayment scheme. The letter said the HSE could not give me any information due to 28 Double Taxation Relief (Isle 16 October 2008. of Man) Order 2008: Motion the data protection laws governing the scheme. I got the same reply last May and this time last year.

An Ceann Comhairle: The Deputy should take it up with the HSE.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan: This concerns legislation. I got the same correspondence in 2005, 2006 and 2007.

An Ceann Comhairle: That is not in order at all.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan: I got a reply from the Minister.

An Ceann Comhairle: Does the Deputy have a question on legislation?

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan: I want to qualify the point because I am coming to the legislation. The administration of this scheme is a disgrace.

An Ceann Comhairle: What legislation is the Deputy talking about?

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan: The only legislation that I can find dealing with this is the Health (Information) Bill. Perhaps, in her own inimitable fashion, the Ta´naiste might be able to elucidate how this Bill can be brought forward as a matter of urgency, so that we can highlight this atrocity.

An Ceann Comhairle: We have to move on.

The Ta´naiste: The consultation process has been completed and the matters are being considered.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan: That is not good enough.

Double Taxation Relief (Socialist Republic of Vietnam) Order 2008: Motion. Minister of State at the Department of the Taoiseach (Deputy Pat Carey): I move:

That Da´il E´ ireann approves the following Order in draft:

Double Taxation Relief (Taxes on Income) (Socialist Republic of Vietnam) Order 2008,

a copy of which was laid before Da´il E´ ireann on 15 September, 2008.

Question put and agreed to.

Double Taxation Relief (Isle of Man) Order 2008: Motion. Minister of State at the Department of the Taoiseach (Deputy Pat Carey): I move:

That Da´il E´ ireann approves the following Order in draft:

Exchange of Information relating to tax matters and Double Taxation Relief (Taxes on Income) (Isle of Man) Order 2008,

a copy of which was laid before Da´il E´ ireann on 15 September, 2008.

Question put and agreed to. 29 Council Decision on EUROPOL: 16 October 2008. Motion

Double Taxation Relief (Republic of Macedonia) Order 2008: Motion. Minister of State at the Department of the Taoiseach (Deputy Pat Carey): I move:

That Da´il E´ ireann approves the following Order in draft:

Double Taxation Relief (Taxes on Income) (Republic of Macedonia) Order 2008, a copy of which was laid before Da´il E´ ireann on 15 September, 2008.

Question put and agreed to.

Council Framework Decision on Sentencing: Motion. Minister of State at the Department of the Taoiseach (Deputy Pat Carey): I move:

That Da´il E´ ireann approves the exercise by the State of the option or discretion provided by Article 1.11 of the Treaty of Amsterdam to take part in the adoption of the following proposed measure:

a proposal for a Council Framework Decision on the recognition and supervision of sus- pended sentences, alternative sanctions and conditional sentences,

a copy of which proposed measure was laid before Da´il E´ ireann on 27 February, 2007.

Question put and agreed to.

EU-US Agreement on Extradition: Motion. Minister of State at the Department of the Taoiseach (Deputy Pat Carey): I move:

That Da´il E´ ireann approves the exercise by the State of the option or discretion provided by Article 1.11 of the Treaty of Amsterdam to consent to the adoption of the following proposed measure:

a proposal for the adoption by the European Union of the Agreement on Extradition between the European Union and the United States of America, done at Washington on 25 June, 2003 and the Agreement on Mutual Legal Assistance between the European Union and the United States of America, done at Washington on 25 June, 2003, copies of which Agreements were laid before Da´il E´ ireann on 24 April, 2008.

Question put and agreed to.

Council Decision on EUROPOL: Motion. Minister of State at the Department of the Taoiseach (Deputy Pat Carey): I move:

That Da´il E´ ireann approves the exercise by the State of the option or discretion provided by Article 1.11 of the Treaty of Amsterdam to take part in the adoption of the following proposed measure:

a proposal for a Council Decision establishing a European Police Office (EUROPOL), a copy of which proposed measure was laid before Da´il E´ ireann on 18 July, 2008.

Question put and agreed to. 30 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

Private Members’ Business.

————

Farm Waste Management Scheme: Motion Deputy Michael Creed: I move:

“That Da´il E´ ireann:

considering:

— the extensive response the farm waste management scheme has generated, with over 42,200 farmers approved to proceed with work under the scheme;

— the added value the scheme is bringing to the economy by generating additional employment for the construction industry at a time of economic uncertainty; and

— the importance of the environmental benefits associated with full delivery of the scheme;

noting:

— the Government’s previous decision to suspend the Farm Improvement Scheme;

— the considerable levels of personal financial risk undertaken by farmers in acquiring bank loans for completion of works under the scheme;

— the unseasonal inclement weather in the last number of months which has hampered the progress of building projects;

— deferred planning decisions have delayed the commencement of works;

— a substantial number of farmers report they will not be able to complete work by the end of year deadline;

— the Irish Farm Building Contractors’ Association suggest up to 10,000 construction jobs will be lost by the end of the year unless the deadline is extended; and

— the rush to complete works may result in health and safety risks on site;

calls on the Government to:

— ensure all payments due under the scheme are paid in line with commitments outlined in the Charter of Rights; and

— take all necessary steps to extend the deadline for completion of works to 30 June 2009.”

In view of the extraordinary interest in this motion by my colleagues representing rural con- stituencies, I propose, with the approval of the House, to share my time with Deputies P. J. Sheehan, John O’Mahony, Tom Hayes, Tom Sheahan, Michael D’Arcy, John Perry and Jimmy Deenihan.

An Ceann Comhairle: Is that agreed? Agreed.

Deputy Michael Creed: In the history of grant aid schemes introduced by the Department of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food, the farm waste management scheme is probably one of the 31 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

[Deputy Michael Creed.] best and most innovative. The response by farmers provides evidence of that fact. The level of grant aid is 60%, while in some Border counties it is up to 70%. The top up available under the grant scheme is specifically focused on young farmers, which is in stark contrast to the body blows delivered to them in the budget. However, in the context of the scheme, the top up for such farmers was particularly welcome. It must be recalled that in responding to the incentives there is not any direct financial gain. In fact, it is a condition of the scheme that farmers should not be able to increase their productivity, and consequently their profitability, by virtue of these works. Therefore these works are driven primarily by the nitrates directive. Consequently, farmers who complete works under the farm waste management scheme will have freedom to farm without fear of prosecution by local authorities or the Environmental Protection Agency because of effluent problems on their farms. In the history of such schemes introduced by the State, it is probably one of the best that I can recall and, as I stated, farmers responded in their droves. Over 42,200 farmers were approved for benefit under the scheme. Farmers do not lightly go to the trouble of making applications if they do not proceed, particularly given that they are required to get planning permission for many of the schemes approved under the farm waste management grant aid. They have also, at considerable personal financial risk and exposure at a time when it is not easy to organise finance, committed probably in the region of \2 billion of their own money to improve their farm holdings and farm waste management, with consequent benefits for every- body from that environmental improvement. Our motion deals with a number of those applicants, a substantial minority. A briefing I received from the Department some weeks ago in the context of the Supplementary Estimate put the figure for the number of farmers who have not notified the Department yet that they intend to commence works at approximately 12,000. The likelihood in any such scheme is that there would be a number, a fraction of that 12,000, who probably would not proceed anyway for a variety of reasons. There is a substantial majority of the 12,000 outstanding who are committed by virtue of their actions to date, such as planning permission, and who would proceed if they thought they could complete the work within the timeframe, but are now considering whether it is worthwhile proceeding and running the risk of not being completed on time and therefore losing the grant with the additional consequent financial exposure. This motion, to use a term that has a wide political currency at present, is about bailing out those 12,000 farmers. This House has in recent weeks seen the developers bailed out by the banks and the banks bailed out, through this House, by the taxpayer. What is at issue here is whether the Government will bail out those 12,000 farmers. The farmers came to the Govern- ment’s assistance in bailing it out during the week, albeit without consultation, in a range of schemes that were withdrawn from them. At issue is whether we will bail out those farmers and enable them to proceed with those beneficial environmental works. As I stated, environment improvement is at the core of the raison d’eˆtre for the scheme. I await to see whether the Green Party will make any contribution to this debate given the key environmental objective for which the scheme was introduced. We know from recent EPA reports that, regrettably, there are issues of water quality that need to be addressed. This scheme is part of the jigsaw that will ensure the farming community meets its requirements. The consequences for those 12,000 farmers, if it is not extended, are an adverse impact on the environment, which is not acceptable. Those 12,000 farmers will have to reduce their pro- ductivity and, consequently, their profitability which is not an acceptable scenario, or that they would have to be obliged to fund the entire scheme themselves which, in the current difficult environment in which all sectors of agriculture find themselves, is not a runner either. 32 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

The sole solution for those 12,000, and the consequences for others who are directly impacted by those works, is for the Minister to go to the European Commission to seek an extension of the deadline by six months, from the end of December 2008 to the end of June 2009. On two occasions over the past number of days I have seen on the Department’s website instances where the Minister patted the Commission on the back and thanked it for acceding to his requests for deadline extension or for bringing forward single farm payments. The slurry deadline was due to expire on 15 October last and the Minister issued a press statement last week weekend stating that Commissioner Fischer Boel had acceded to his request, and rightly so. In fact, if we were to be critical, the Minister did not extend it far enough and I hope he will go back again to have it extended, as his compatriots over the Border in Northern Ireland did, up until the end of December 2009.

Deputy P. J. Sheehan: Hear, hear.

Deputy Michael Creed: Commissioner Fischer Boel also acceded to the Minister’s request to bring forward single farm payments. There is an open door because it does not make any difference to the Commission. They approved the terms and conditions of the scheme in March 2006 and they approved the finan- cial package that goes with it. It is of no material difference to the Commission whether those farmers complete their works in December of 2008, a deadline in all of them, in good faith, would earnestly like to meet but, due to circumstances outside of their control, are unable to meet. It is immaterial to the Commission. The key to this debate is the Minister’s reluctance to go to Brussels to state to Commissioner Fischer Boel the range of circumstances that have led us into a situation where 12,000 farmers will not be able to complete the works, the consequences of their freedom to farm without fear of prosecution and the environmental benefits of work that cannot be attained, and ask for an extension of the deadline by six months. I have no doubt from the soundings which I have made in the Commission that there is an open door. I fail to see why, given that the Commission approved the scheme initially, the Minister is not prepared to make that request. The Minister has hidden behind the Commission. He has stated that the Commission says “No”. However, it has not said “No”. We in this House set up a committee to reflect on the reasons the people said “No” to the Lisbon treaty. One of the reasons is that politicians cannot have it both ways; when we want to take credit for something, we do it all ourselves, but when there is some blame to be apportioned, we blame the Commission. The Commission is blameless in this matter. The blame rests fairly and squarely in Agri- culture House and it is the Minister’s responsibility, on behalf of those 12,000 farmers, to go to Brussels to explain the circumstances. As in the case of the early payment of the single farm payment and the extension of the slurry spreading deadline, no doubt the Minister will receive a favourable response from the Commission. People are not meeting this deadline for a variety of reasons that I will briefly outline. I came across an instance in my constituency of somebody who has planning permission to pro- ceed with a development which has been with An Bord Pleana´la for ten months. However, it has yet to get clearance from that board to proceed with the scheme. I have a letter here from a farmer in Athenry, County Galway, who states that on his third attempt, due to third party appeals and objections, he got planning permission in the summer of 2008 but, due to the weather and time constraints, now feels he cannot proceed with those works. The terms force majeure is used in the Department in those circumstances. I appeal to the Minister to consider, under force majeure, those particular circumstances to extend the deadline. 33 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

[Deputy Michael Creed.]

The broader economic issue is the thousands of people outside the farm gate. The construc- tion industry is on its knees, and we have seen 70,000 people added to the dole queues in recent months. The farm contractors’ association states that 10,000 jobs will be lost as a result. I implore the Minister to do the mathematics on this. It will cost \100 million a year to put 10,000 on the dole. If one adds to that the VAT receipts and the income tax generated by keeping those people at work for an additional six-month period into 2009, I would suggest the net cost to the Exchequer is minimal. There are also health and safety reasons. There are farm building sites where people are working long hours late into the night shuttering, pouring concrete and erecting sheds. All of this is being done at high risk because of this artificial deadline that the Minister, at the stroke of a pen, by virtue of a request to the Commission in Brussels, could resolve. I implore the Minister, for the variety of reasons I outlined, many of which are beyond the resolution of individual farmers, to come to their aid. Weather, materials, contractors and litigation are some of the considerations, but the broader economy and employment is a major consideration as well. I am pleased to move the motion. I ask all Deputies in the House for their support on it.

Deputy P. J. Sheehan: I support the remarks of our spokesperson on agriculture, Deputy Creed. None of the Minister’s party colleagues is here in the House to hear me give this address. I hope they will be in later and that they will take heed of what I say. They have been whipped into voting against their constituents who elected them, or have they? Will the Mini- ster take a stand against the farmers he represents both in his constituency and throughout this country? Is he voting in the best interests of his constituents or is he hiding behind the whip? Has he thought about what he is voting for and what he is voting against? I remind him that some years ago we had a brave Minister for Finance, Deputy Ruairı´ Quinn, who was not afraid to make the right decision when the civil servants in that Department responded to a proposal with the words: “On balance, Minister, we can find no good reason to recommend against this proposal”. The Minister and I know the same applies to Deputy Creed’s proposal. How can the Minister vote against a proposal that makes sense? However, as I have said previously, common sense is not very common on the Government side of the House. I will explain the situation. The central structure of most farm waste management systems is an underground effluent tank. This tank is the first part of the structure to be constructed, with the slatted house then erected over the tank. The construction of these tanks was jeopardised this year by the wettest summer on record. The health and safety of workers were put at risk with excavations collapsing, sides slipping into the excavation and, in thousands of cases, flood- ing rendering the sites unworkable for weeks at a time. However, even before this stage could be reached, a mountain of bureaucracy had to be climbed, involving the planning authorities, the farm waste management scheme bureaucracy, waste management authorities, health and safety bodies and the Revenue Commissioners. Last, but not least, it was necessary to secure the finance in the middle of a credit crunch. The fact that this bureaucratic mountain was not factored into the timescale for these projects is the root of the problem we are debating. If the new Oireachtas committee on Ireland’s future in Europe wishes to investigate the reasons for the rejection of the Lisbon treaty, there is no better example of why scepticism of the European model has gripped people than the typical use by Fianna Fa´il of yet another three card trick. The first card in this case is that Europe set new standards for the farm waste management scheme. The second card is delivered under protest where a grant system is introduced with 34 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion multiple bureaucratic conditions and tight deadlines. The third card, as we all know, disappears; nobody knows where it went. The Minister might wish to blame Brussels but has anybody sought a reaction in Brussels to this proposal, as there might be more common sense over there? In fact, why has nobody asked Brussels for its reaction to this proposal?

Deputy John O’Mahony: I am glad to have the opportunity to speak on the farm waste management issue and the urgent need for an extension to the 31 December deadline for the completion of works. I compliment Deputy Creed for keeping this matter on the agenda over recent months on behalf of the farming community. There is a sense of panic and fear among farmers who face the impossible task of trying to complete the approved work before 31 December. The fault for this lies with the Government, which put in place a system that was clearly unable to cope with the volume of applications. Although they received an extended deadline, farmers could not take advantage of it because the processing of applications took place at a snail’s pace in the Department. The process was delayed even further as a result of planning difficulties in many cases. Any hope the thousands of farmers had of finishing the work on time ended with the summer rainfall. Ireland had its wettest summer in 70 years, and this compounded the problem. The Government’s mismanage- ment of the scheme has landed farmers in this mess. The Minister has indicated on numerous occasions in recent months that he is unwilling to seek a further extension from Europe. What is the logic of this stance, when it is obvious a good case can be made about the extraordinary circumstances? How is it that the bankers could be bailed out by the House with billions of euro but the farmers cannot be given an extra six or nine months to complete this work? Is it any wonder the public has become cynical? There is a win-win situation here. The construction industry, which has been devastated in the last 12 months, could provide many jobs in the short term if there was an extension of the deadline for the scheme. If the Minister seeks an extension, he can support farmers and remove the risk to jobs in construction in one fell swoop. In recent weeks, some Government Deputies have made comments which effectively support the motion before the House. I presume they will vote accordingly. The second issue with the farm waste management scheme is the delays being experienced by farmers who have already completed their projects. They have loans from banks and other lending institutions and are being put under pressure to fulfil the commitments they made on the assumption they would get their money from the Department when the works were com- plete. Everything is in order within the Department but the cheques are not being signed.

Deputy Brendan Smith: That is not correct.

Deputy John O’Mahony: On the one hand applicants are being told they must meet the 31 December deadline or they will not get paid but on the other hand farmers who have completed the works are not being paid. The Minister cannot have it both ways. There was much bad news for farmers in the budget. The Minister should give them good news today by seeking an extension of the scheme.

Deputy Tom Hayes: I compliment Deputy Michael Creed for putting forward this important motion. Earlier this year the Oireachtas committee on agriculture discussed this motion and members from all sides of the House agreed that an extension of the scheme was necessary and should be granted. It is unfair of the Government to put forward an amendment to the motion; it is equally unfair of the Government Deputies to say one thing in the joint committee and do the opposite in the House. I challenge Members on all sides of the House to support the motion proposed by Deputy Creed. 35 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

[Deputy Tom Hayes.]

Previous speakers have offered reasons from a farming point of view for an extension. I can offer the point of view of a little village in a rural area in the heart of County Tipperary, which I represent. In the 1950s O’Dwyer Steel was set up by a native of the village. Today, the company employs 100 people. Local people have trained as welders, fitters and steel erectors. The company has provided huge employment for many years and is now owned by some of the people who started as employees there years ago. Every Member of the House would consider that company a real example of how to protect rural Ireland. The Government talks about an endless list of programmes to show what it is doing for rural areas but this is an example of how to protect jobs in those areas. The concrete, steel and so forth for each simple project are produced in the rural area. Now the Government has failed to seek an extension to this scheme, which has had such an impact on this rural village. The scheme does much for the environment and is important for the rural environment protection schemes and the nitrates directive. That is the reason it was put in place. However, there have been problems with bad weather, delays with planning permission and so forth. I have never previously spoken on a motion before the House that was so simple to deal with and had such an impact on a rural area. I urge the Minister to go to Brussels to protect jobs in rural areas. The situation in Dundrum, County Tipperary, is mirrored in many parishes throughout Munster and the rest of the country. This is a time of great economic difficulty. Never has the Minister had such an opportunity to go to Brussels with a very simple request, that is, to extend the scheme, allow people to work in rural areas and allow farmers to construct sheds and tanks that are essential to the future of the industry. The reality is that many things are falling around us. There is hope for the agriculture sector if we protect it and work to develop it. I ask the Minster to consider what he is doing for people in rural areas.

Deputy P. J. Sheehan: Ask Brussels and you shall receive.

Deputy Tom Sheahan: On the issue of the farm waste management scheme, there is one question to be asked of the Minister. Has he asked the EU authorities directly for an extension? My colleagues have described the weather we have had this year. During the boom in the construction industry, which is now paling into insignificance, one could not get steel. A friend of mine working in a steel company told me recently that five of his colleagues were let go and that there are five more to be let go. Those jobs will be lost before Christmas. There are many reasons for extending the scheme and there is much merit in doing so. As outlined by other Deputies, an extension of six months is required by farmers because of safety issues and the nature of the ground over the summer. Extending the scheme would be cost neutral. In the outside world, it would be called a “no-brainer”; it is a win-win situation. I will outline how this problem arose and why there should be an extension. The Office of the Revenue Commissioners made life very difficult for farmers in that it was taking five to six weeks for VAT receipts to be returned. The planning authorities were to deal with this sympathetically and expediently. I encountered a case in which a man had to build a slatted unit 12 miles from his house after three months of negotiations. A planner dictated to the farmer that he did not need a unit of the size requested although the latter had 100 cattle. The planner was wrong and the farmer had to build two slatted units. I know farmers and have been contacted by them on this matter. There is something very fishy going on. The Minister and his officials are adopting a partisan approach in favour of Members on the Government side of the House. I made representations on behalf of farmers who had their slatted units inspected last July but who have not got a bob yet. They have not 36 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion been paid. Deputies on the other side of the House seem to be able to make progress and cases are being fast-tracked for them. I call on the Minister to ensure a level playing pitch for farmers. Six months should be granted in which farmers, contractors, steel companies and everybody else involved can get the job done on a cost-neutral basis. Will the Minister please ask the Commission for an extension?

Deputy John Perry: I thank Deputy Creed for tabling this important motion on the extension of the farm waste management scheme. We have just come through one of the most difficult and challenging summers the agriculture sector has ever experienced. The unprecedented con- ditions left many farmers on the brink of extinction. That has been compounded by the cuts in the budget to farm installation aid and in respect of the early retirement scheme. The Govern- ment, through its action and inaction, seems intent on allowing the lifeblood of rural communi- ties to haemorrhage irreparably. In these conditions, it is critical that the Minister obtain an extension to the deadline for the full implementation of the farm waste management scheme. The summer weather conditions were such that it has been nigh on impossible to make progress in farm building construction. The flooding in early August was such that farmers in Sligo and north Leitrim are experiencing extreme pressure regarding their storage capacity for farm waste. Weather and delays in processing planning applications and VAT receipts have contrived to ensure they will not have a realistic chance of meeting the deadline for the com- pletion of work on their farm buildings. It is highly unreasonable to expect the deadline of 31 December to be met given the scale of investment required to have farmers operate at the highest possible environmental standards. If the Government is intent on making environmentally friendly changes in the agriculture sector, all efforts should be made to extend the deadline of the scheme to ensure full com- pletion, if possible. Farmers are investing over \1.5 billion this year in improving their farmyard facilities. This has a considerable economic impact in rural areas and there is an added value of \1 billion. The employment spin-off in the supply and services sectors amounts to approxi- mately 20,000 jobs per year, which is considerable. What will become of them? In my constituency, in which jobs in the construction sector are being lost daily, the construc- tion of farm buildings under the farm waste management scheme is a vital lifeline to hundreds of jobs. This point must be made because the construction industry is on its knees. This is a genuine chance for the Progressive Democrats-Independents-Fianna Fa´il-Green Party Govern- ment to effect real environmental changes that will have a genuine impact without forcing people on to bicycles or to change their light bulbs. I seek immediate action on the part of the Minister. I ask him to seek an immediate extension because, as Deputy Tom Sheahan stated, it is a no-brainer. I want to safeguard thousands of jobs in rural communities and want to see real efforts being made to protect the livelihoods of farmers, who remain the custodians of the rural economy. When one considers the number of jobs being lost in every constituency, one realises the Minister must extend the deadline. One should consider the pressure on farmers. Money has been advanced by banks but the farmers now feel they cannot meet the deadline. They feel very much threatened by banks with regard to repayments. The are being asked by the banks whether there is any risk that they will not be paid but they cannot give a genuine guarantee that they will. The Minister is placing considerable pressure on rural communities. In light of the guarantee given by the State to banks last week, which will be discussed in the Parliament tomorrow, we are asking that a guarantee be given to those who comprise the backbone of the economy. The growth of the economy depends very much on the success of the rural community. 37 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

[Deputy John Perry.]

It is critical that the Minister cut out the doublespeak. Deputies on the backbenches are offering their support. Deputies were on local radio today highlighting the benefits of the budget. The Minister’s decision represents a death knell for farming. The Progressive Democrats-Independents-Fianna Fa´il-Green Party Government is talking about putting people on bicycles and changing light bulbs but I refer to a matter that will have a considerable impact. The Minister has an opportunity to extend a real benefit to the rural economy but, sadly, he is failing to do so. The deadline can be extended. I am Chairman of the Joint Committee on European Scrutiny. Our spokesperson says the European Union is blamed for all the wrong reasons and that is why there was so much apathy towards the Lisbon treaty. The electorate did not vote in favour of it because it felt diktats were coming from the European Union. Control can be exercised here in the national Parliament. The Minister does not need permission from Brussels to extend the deadline; he can do so without a shadow of doubt.

Deputy Brendan Smith: No.

Deputy John Perry: He can. I am a member of the Joint Committee on European Scrutiny——

Deputy Brendan Smith: The Deputy is wrong.

Deputy John Perry: I assure him he has the power to change the deadline. Brussels is blamed for the wrong reasons. I assure the Minister that, if he approached the Commissioner, he would be told he has complete authority to make the change.

Deputy Brendan Smith: On the one hand, the Deputy is stating that we can make the decision while, on the other, he is asking me to go to the Commissioner.

Deputy John Perry: The Minister is giving ten reasons that he cannot change it but I want one reason that he can. It should be changed without delay.

Deputy Michael D’Arcy: This is not an unfair or unreasonable request. Common sense must enter the equation at some stage and I therefore ask the Minister to consider extending the deadline. Hundreds of millions of euro have been spent on farm waste management facilities. If the Minister is threatening farmers that he will not pay the grants if the work is not completed by 31 December, he is not acting in the national or public interest. Having watched the budget speech, which has been appalling in respect of agriculture, I believe that if the Minister is to close down the industry, he should at least do so in stages. He should not close it all down in the weeks between the launch of the budget and 31 December. The Chairman of the Joint Committee on European Scrutiny said the Minister can go to the European Commission to seek an extension of this date.

Deputy Brendan Smith: He said there was no need to go.

Deputy Michael D’Arcy: We were told in regard to the nitrates directive that these dates cannot be extended. Curiously, if one crosses the Border into Northern Ireland, the extension date there has been put back to 31 December for the spreading of slurry and farmyard manure. The Minister should not tell us it cannot be done. He should at least be honest and tell us he 38 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion will not do it because he chooses not to and because his intention is to close down agriculture, as was seen in the budget debacle. The Minister is a rural Deputy and he should be doing more for rural Ireland. What he has done today is a complete abdication of his responsibility to the rural community. Farmers are the only people spending money on building and construction at this time but the Minister is turning his back on them and ignoring all the good work being done to benefit the environment. Farmers are putting their hands into their pockets. All the Minister is being asked to do is to match that with a grant and to allow farmers to benefit by claiming VAT back. The Minister should not turn his back on farmers. His role is to support them, not ignore them.

Deputy Jimmy Deenihan: Of the 42,350 applications that have been approved, work has not begun on over 12,000 and it will be very difficult for those projects to be completed at this stage. A number of reasons for delay were put forward by previous speakers. There has been exceptionally heavy rainfall in the past two summers, with which we are all familiar. There is also a shortage of contractors because not all builders specialise in farm buildings and a differ- ent type of contractor is involved than the type who would build houses, for example. In a few cases, there have been hold-ups due to difficulties in the determination of An Bord Pleana´la appeals. A further reason for delay was that in a large number of cases throughout the country, animals had to be fed indoors this summer. It was physically impossible for farmers to demolish buildings where they were feeding cattle and they could not carry out infrastructural work in their farmyards. Another important point is that health and safety officers often visit sites where builders are carrying out this work. As the work can be dangerous, contractors are wary of, for example, allowing their workers to work in the rain, which is falling most of the time at present. On several occasions, workers had to stop work and leave the site. The credit squeeze is also a factor which made it very difficult for a number of farmers to get credit for long periods and they had to go to several banks to try to obtain credit. Based on the EU guidelines for state aid to agriculture and forestry, the Minister should go to the Commission and ask that where there is a legally binding contract between a contractor and a farmer to carry out this work, the deadline should be extended to 30 June, as proposed by Deputy Creed, which is not unreasonable, and if it is possible to extend it until December, so much the better. Deputy Creed’s proposal is a generous and responsible one. The reliance on a legally binding contract is often used as a procedure for the phased termin- ation of tax relief measures. As the Minister knows, we have used this procedure several times, for example, with regard to the phased ending of the hotels scheme and the urban renewal scheme. There is no great difference in this regard. It is state aid in a different way. The procedure can be easily put to the Commission by the Minister and his Department and it would meet the guidelines set down by the EU for state aid. The fact that there would be legal certainty and a contract in place should strengthen the Minister’s case with the Commission. To repeat a point made by Deputy P. J. Sheehan and previous speakers, will the Minister explain to the House why he has not gone to the Commission with this request, if he has not done so? Some 12,000 farmers will not start work before Christmas, which will cause a problem in the future because they will find it very difficult to control their effluent and they will not have storage capacity. Surely the Minister would be making the case for the nitrates directive if he explained to the Commission that the more farmers who have proper holding facilities, the less pollution will result. That is a very sensible argument which anyone would accept. 39 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food (Deputy Brendan Smith): I move amendment No. 1:

To delete all words after “Da´il E´ ireann” and substitute the following:

“notes:

— the introduction of an extensive farm waste management scheme to facilitate Ireland’s compliance with the nitrates directive and to assist farmers meet the obligations under the directive;

— the extraordinary success of the scheme, with over 42,000 approvals issued to date;

— the unique attractiveness of the scheme, which provides a standard grant-rate of 60%, with a 70% grant rate in counties Cavan, Monaghan, Leitrim and Donegal;

— the payment by the Department of almost \330 million in grant-aid to thousands of Irish farmers in 2007 and 2008 to date;

— the agreement of Da´il E´ ireann to a Supplementary Estimate for the Department of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food of \195 million in additional funding for the scheme in 2008;

— the extension granted to Ireland by the European Commission on an exceptional basis, until 31 December 2008, for the completion of work under the farm waste management scheme which acknowledged the specific situation in Ireland; and

— the commitment of the Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food that all projects completed in accordance with the terms and conditions of the scheme by 31 December 2008 will be grant-aided;

acknowledges:

— that the 31 December 2008 deadline for the completion of the work and the sub- mission of the relevant documentation has been explicitly stated on a number of occasions since March 2006 to all those holding an approval from the Department of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food to proceed under the scheme; and

— the decision of the Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food to write to all approval holders clarifying those discrete elements of work which will be grant-aided in the event that the farmer, for whatever reason, decides not to proceed with the entire project for which s/he was approved;

urges all farmers holding a valid approval and who have not yet completed their work to:

— complete the work for which they have approval;

— consider completing discrete units of work, for which they will be grant-aided, in accordance with the clarification provided by the Department of Agriculture, Fisher- ies and Food; and

— note that the deadline date of 31 December 2008 will not be changed.”

I wish to share time with Deputies Johnny Brady, Margaret Conlon, Thomas Byrne and Noel Treacy. 40 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: Is that agreed? Agreed.

Deputy Brendan Smith: I welcome this opportunity——

Deputy Seymour Crawford: The Minister should not move it.

Deputy Brendan Smith: I did not hear my colleague, Deputy Crawford, support my amendment.

Deputy Margaret Conlon: He did.

Deputy Brendan Smith: Did he? I agree with Deputy Crawford.

Deputy Johnny Brady: He supports the Minister now.

Deputy Michael Creed: Deputy Brady was supporting us in the agriculture committee. He says one thing in the committee and a different thing here.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: The Minister, without interruption.

Deputy Jimmy Deenihan: The Green Party has an awful influence. Deputy Brady is very much influenced by the Green Party.

Deputy Johnny Brady: The Deputy should not worry about that. I am not like the Members opposite.

Deputy Jimmy Deenihan: There was a green scare before the election. What is happening now with the Green Party?

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: A series of Fine Gael speakers were allowed to address the House and they should allow the Minister to speak without interruption.

Deputy Brendan Smith: Thank you. Deputy Deenihan and other speakers referred to the fact that perhaps up to 12,000 farmers would not have their projects completed by the end of the year. To clarify, of those who applied for on-farm investment schemes over the years, approximately 80% proceeded with the projects, leaving a shortfall of 20%. The Irish Farmers Association carried out a survey which showed a drop-out or non-take-up rate of approximately 18%. That would bring the number of applicants likely to go ahead with their work to approxi- mately 34,000. The Department has received in excess of 31,000 A cards, which indicates that more than 31,000 projects——

Deputy Michael Creed: That is all the more reason to extend the deadline.

Deputy Brendan Smith: The figure of 12,000 has been bandied about but I do not know where it came from. I just want to correct this issue.

Deputy Jimmy Deenihan: We are doing simple mathematics.

Deputy Brendan Smith: I am explaining the normal take-up, which Deputy Deenihan would have known from his time as Minister of State in the Department. I welcome this opportunity to restate the tremendous success of the farm waste management scheme as an indication of the Government’s support for the farming sector in Ireland through an unprecedented level of investment. As Deputies will be aware, a revised version of the 41 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

[Deputy Brendan Smith.] scheme was introduced by my Department in March 2006 to assist farmers in meeting the requirements of the EU nitrates directive. The revised scheme followed the introduction of an original scheme introduced in 2001, which was revised in 2004. The revised and improved scheme was introduced in the context of the finalisation of Ireland’s nitrates action plan which had been approved by the Commission. The major changes introduced to the scheme in March 2006 included an increase in the standard grant rate to 60% from the previous 40%, the extension of the scheme for the first time to the pig and poultry sectors, an increase in the maximum eligible investment ceiling from \75,000 to \120,000 and the removal of any minimum income requirement, subject to certification of economic viability, so that all small farmers could participate. A higher grant rate of 70% was available to farmers in the four zone C counties of Donegal, Cavan, Monaghan and Leitrim. Additional support was also available to young farmers in particular circumstances. Due to the exceptionally generous level of the grant rates, the scheme required specific EU state aid approval before it could be introduced. Negotiations with the European Commission were lengthy and detailed as we sought to secure the most favourable outcome possible for Irish farmers. The specific situation in Ireland was central to our negotiating position at the time. In granting the extension, the Commission took into account the likely high number of applicants for the scheme, the 100% pre-approval inspection by the Department, the restric- tions because of bad weather on the construction of farm buildings and that, as most of the applications involved new building, planning permission would be required before any appli- cation could be considered, and the shortage of building contractors at the time. Deputies on the Opposition benches referred to the fact that the construction industry is not working at that capacity currently — far from it. The European Union state aid approval, which included the deadline for completion of works by 31 December 2008, was based on the clear and often-repeated understanding that the scheme represented a once-off opportunity to enable Irish farmers to meet the requirements of the nitrates directive. In doing so, they would also, of course, be protecting their single payment scheme entitlements, which are now subject to cross-compliance requirements. The closing date for the submission of applications was 31 December 2006. The scheme proved to be extremely attractive to farmers. A total of 48,580 summary applications were received from farmers prior to the closing date, of which more than 30,000 were received in the final month before the deadline. To accommodate as many farmers as possible, the Department allowed farmers to submit fully documented applications up to 29 June 2007. This flexibility ensured that all farmers who wished to avail of the scheme were afforded every opportunity to do so. A total of 46,132 completed applications were received and about 42,500 approvals to commence work have issued. The facilitation of applications is in direct contrast to the misleading comments made by Deputy O’Mahony. The scheme has been an outstanding success, as demonstrated by the high level of appli- cations received and approvals granted. In the 2008 Estimates we provided funding of \150.6 million, with a commitment to keep that figure under review until we had a clearer picture of what our liabilities would be for the year. Already, I have ensured that savings of \31.2 million from elsewhere in my Department’s Vote have been reallocated to supplement the original allocation. However, on the basis of the information available to my Department, in terms of confirmed completions and indications of ongoing work, we sought additional funding. I am very pleased, first, that the Government recognised the value of this scheme and provided substantial funding 42 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion this year and, second, that in the current economic circumstances, the Minister was prepared to provide an additional \195 million to meet our liabilities, which was approved by this House last week.

Deputy Paul Connaughton: The Government took that off the farmers last Tuesday.

Deputy Brendan Smith: Deputy Connaughton should allow me to continue. By the end of last week, the Department had paid out \212.7 million in grant aid this year alone. That is in great contrast to the statement issued by Fine Gael in August that no payments would be made between the end of August and December.

Deputy Michael Creed: That is only because of the Supplementary Estimate.

Deputy Brendan Smith: No. Funding was issued at that time under the original Estimate. Again, we have misinformation from the Opposition.

Deputy Seymour Crawford: The payments were frozen.

Deputy Brendan Smith: They were not frozen. All farmers who complete approved work in accordance with the terms and conditions of the scheme can be assured they will receive grant aid. Total expenditure in 2008 on this scheme will be approximately \377 million. That follows on expenditure of almost \114 million in 2007 and a provision of \125 million for the scheme next year. That is further evidence of the Government’s continuing strong commitment to the farming sector and represents a massive level of public support by any standards. Besides exercising prudence in the use of the funding available we must focus investment on measures that will contribute to the development of a sustainable agrifood sector. The scheme meets those important criteria. We must compete on the basis of quality, productivity and efficiency and ensure that we meet the needs of consumers and society generally. We must also ensure that the sector operates in a manner that is consistent with the preservation of the natural environment. This major investment by Government and by the farming community in the past two and half years will be beneficial for many years to come. Investment in the farm waste management scheme is consistent with all of those priorities. The scheme represents the biggest ever investment in farm infrastructure and is an enormous vote of confidence in the sector, as too is the investment being made by farmers. That is well justified on the basis of our export performance. In each of the past two years Irish agrifood exports rose by more than 10% and 5%, respectively, to reach in excess of \9.2 billion in 2007. More importantly, a recent analytical study showed that the agrifood industry contributed over 30% of net foreign earnings from the manufacturing sector. While commodity prices have eased somewhat in 2008, following the peaks of 2007, the medium-term price outlook remains strong and there is general agreement from both the OECD and the FAO that prices are unlikely to return to their historically low levels prior to that recent period. It is estimated that global demand for meat and milk will double over the next 40 years and Irish agriculture, with the benefit of the investment under the farm waste management scheme, will be well positioned to take advantage of these trends. The Department has operated the scheme in a pragmatic manner in so far as possible. It has shown maximum flexibility in facilitating the receipt of completed application up to end June 2007. That ensured every farmer wishing to participate in the scheme had the opportunity to do so. The high number of applications received and approvals granted confirm that. 43 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

[Deputy Brendan Smith.]

The EU state aid approval, to which I referred, allowed us, as an exceptional measure in the context of the nitrates action plan, to offer very generous grant aid under the scheme as a once-off concession on the strict condition that works would be completed by end 2008. Agree- ment was reached only after protracted negotiations with the European Commission and the closing date was a key element in the negotiations on the state aid approval. We agreed at the time to abide by the date and we have operated the scheme on that basis from the outset, as has the Department of Agriculture and Rural Development in Northern Ireland in respect of its less generous scheme. The position in regard to the deadline was made clear from the start. It was included in the terms and conditions of the scheme and was widely publicised to all those involved. Farmers, planners and builders were clearly aware of the critical need to adhere to it.

Deputy Seymour Crawford: The weather changed that.

Deputy Brendan Smith: The special situation of Ireland, including circumstances such as bad weather, referred to earlier, were fully taken into account and were obviously a significant factor in achieving the exceptional extension. I and my predecessor have consistently stressed to farmers the need to meet the deadline. In recent weeks the Department wrote to every applicant outlining the possibility of completing discrete units of work so that people who did not wish to complete the entire project as orig- inally envisaged could complete parts of the project and receive grant aid for that work. Deputy Tom Sheahan suggested that Department officials dealt with representations on the basis of the political source from which they came. I presume he does not want that allegation to remain on the record. I am sure he would not cast political aspersions on the work of individuals. That is not the way the officials in the Department work.

Deputy Michael Creed: Deputy Sheahan was referring to the Minister.

Deputy Tom Sheahan: I was talking about the Minister.

Deputy Paul Connaughton: No one was talking about the officials.

Deputy Brendan Smith: That is not the way the officials work.

Deputy Noel Treacy: Withdraw it.

Deputy Tom Sheahan: I was talking about the Minister.

Deputy Brendan Smith: I am not a civil servant. That remark should be withdrawn. I defend——

Deputy Tom Sheahan: Why has a man, whose farm was inspected last July, not received his cheque yet?

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: No adverse comments should be made about persons not in the House.

Deputy Michael Creed: Absolutely. They have not been made either. 44 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

Deputy Brendan Smith: Deputy Sheahan made the allegation. The last time there was a Fine Gael——

Deputy Tom Sheahan: A man had an inspection carried out last July, yet he has not received payment.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: The Minister is in possession.

Deputy Michael Creed: The Minister is the weakest link.

Deputy Brendan Smith: Deputy Sheahan made an allegation against civil servants and he should withdraw it. The last time there was a Fine Gael Minister for Agriculture——

Deputy Michael Creed: Those kinds of smear tactics will not get the Minister anywhere.

Deputy Brendan Smith: They are not smear tactics, I am stating the truth. Deputy Creed is the man using smear tactics with the arguments and rubbish he comes out with.

Deputy Michael Creed: On a point of order, Deputy Sheahan made no allegation——

Deputy Brendan Smith: He did.

Deputy Michael Creed: ——against any official in the Department and the Minister should withdraw his accusation that he did. The record will show he made no accusation.

Deputy Brendan Smith: Deputy Sheahan said the representations were dealt with in the Department in a manner——

Deputy Michael Creed: He made a political charge against the Minister.

Deputy Brendan Smith: That is not the case. He did not.

Deputy Michael Creed: The record of the House will show that.

Deputy Brendan Smith: Yes.

Deputy Michael Creed: The Minister should withdraw his allegation.

Deputy Brendan Smith: The last time there was a Fine Gael Minister for Agriculture——

Deputy Seymour Crawford: It is a smokescreen.

An Leas-Cheann Comhairle: The Minister should be allowed to conclude.

Deputy Brendan Smith: ——he abolished the then farm modernisation scheme.

Deputy Michael Creed: The Minister is a disgrace.

Deputy Brendan Smith: Not only that, but the applications of 12,000 existing applicants were abolished and Fine Gael Deputies trooped into the lobbies to support it. I recommend the amendment to the House.

Deputy Johnny Brady: The deadline of 31 December 2008 for completion of work by farmers under the revised farm waste management scheme introduced by the Department in March 2006 is a condition of EU state aid approval for the scheme. The European Commission has 45 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

[Deputy Johnny Brady.] since reaffirmed that it expects Ireland to respect strictly that deadline. The terms and con- ditions of the scheme made it clear that payments of grant aid were conditional on the time limit being respected. The Department of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food has consistently held this position since the commencement of the scheme.

Deputy Michael Creed: The Deputy has not held that position.

Deputy Johnny Brady: As Chairman of the Joint Committee on Agriculture, Fisheries and Food, I have sought additional funds for the farm waste management scheme on account of the inclement weather experienced this year. The Minister for Finance gave approval to the Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food, Deputy Brendan Smith, to introduce a Sup- plementary Estimate for the farm waste management scheme. The scheme was introduced in February 2001 under the national development plan and it has proved to be a great success. The Joint Committee on Agriculture, Fisheries and Food, knowing that Irish farmers need additional funding to complete even more farm waste projects, requested \195 million in funds for the scheme this year. Farmers have responded well to the scheme. Further funding will assist in completing the work and ensuring that we meet our requirements under the European Union nitrates directive. It is crucial that we continue to provide practical support for farmers. The farm waste manage- ment scheme is an essential part of that support. Farmers will continue to receive 1 o’clock payments under the scheme for approved work, which has proved very successful with farmers. It is only right that we are supporting them in their bid to manage waste in an environmentally friendly and responsible way. It also assists farmers to meet the requirements of the nitrates directive. The popularity of the scheme and the practical support it has given to farmers is evident in the rate of take-up by farmers. Farmers and farm families form the backbone of our rural communities. The Government will continue to support farmers in practical ways. Total expenditure by the Department of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food in support of the agriculture, fisheries and food sectors next year will amount to \3.26 billion. Spending on the rural environment protection scheme, REPS, is being increased to \355 million to ensure that the scheme, which already has 60,000 partici- pants, is open to new entrants. The grant rate paid under REPS 4 has been increased by 17%. Agriculture is still at the heart of our country, and will always retain a special place. The Government is focused on securing the future of farming families, who should have both the freedom to farm and to avail of all of the necessary supports, in recognition of the importance of agriculture to this country. The Government is committed to implementing the rural development programme so that farmers will benefit to the maximum from increased payments and new schemes that have been initiated. Farmers and their families on low income will continue to be supported through the farm assist scheme and there is a commitment to reducing the regulatory burden on farmers. Rural life is still an important part of Irish life and that is something we should all recognise. I compliment the Minister, Deputy Smith, and his officials on their work in the agriculture area.

Deputy Michael Creed: For the withdrawal of the installation scheme and the early retire- ment scheme.

Deputy Johnny Brady: The Minister and his officials will not be found wanting if this scheme could be extended.

Deputy Michael Creed: The Deputy has changed his tune. 46 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

Deputy Johnny Brady: I never change my tune.

Deputy Margaret Conlon: I am pleased to speak on the motion. The Minister, Deputy Smith, has outlined the position. The farm waste management scheme was set up in February 2001. It enabled farmers to respond to the requirement of the nitrates directive and thereby protect their single farm payments. Fianna Fa´il-led Governments spent just under \66 million on this scheme between 2000 and 2005. The scheme was due to close in 2006. However, after protracted negotiations with the Euro- pean Commission, the scheme was extended for a further two years. The deadline of 31 December 2008 is a condition of EU state aid approval and the Commission has, time and time again, reiterated its expectation that Ireland will keep to this deadline. This was a once-off concession. All projects that are completed and which have all the correct and proper docu- mentation returned to the Department by 31 December 2008 will be paid in full. People may have no worries about that specific aspect. Furthermore, as a Member from a Border constitu- ency, I wish to highlight that the Department’s scheme is far more comprehensive than the corresponding scheme in Northern Ireland. The eligible investment ceiling is higher in the Twenty-six Counties than in the North. Added to this, more eligible items come under the remit of our scheme. The scheme has been an outstanding success with 46,000 completed applications received by the June 2007 deadline. More than 42,000 approvals have been issued to farmers and approxi- mately 30,000 farmers have indicated that they have commenced work. Despite scurrilous rumours in the past week, there is no truth in the suggestion that any farmer participating in the scheme will be unable to reclaim VAT on their costs. Everyone should make this point clearly.

Deputy Tom Hayes: The Deputy should address the motion.

Deputy Margaret Conlon: Where discrete units are completed — Deputy Crawford has his work finished — and documentation is submitted by 31 December, they will also be compen- sated. No individual farmer has contacted me about this scheme.

Deputy Tom Hayes: The Deputy is out of touch.

Deputy Tom Sheahan: They are contacting the rest of them.

Deputy Margaret Conlon: Many farmers realised the deadline of 31 December was fast approaching and, in view of that fact and instead of going to the media, they got on with the necessary work to have it completed——

Deputy Tom Hayes: They will not be contacting the Deputy after last Tuesday’s budget.

Deputy Margaret Conlon: ——so they could submit their documentation and be eligible for their money.

Deputy P. J. Sheehan: What about the red tape fee?

Deputy Thomas Byrne: That is the reason Deputy Crawford has not finished his application.

A Deputy: The poor young farmer.

Deputy Margaret Conlon: With limited resources, awkward and most difficult choices have to be made. I am pleased that REPS will continue and accommodate farmers wishing to join in 2009. The allocation for 2009 will be increased to \355 million. 47 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

[Deputy Margaret Conlon.]

I encourage my Cavan-Monaghan constituency colleague, the Minister, Deputy Brendan Smith, to continue working as hard as he is at present in his new brief. He stated that the scheme ends on 31 December 2008 and that is still the position. The farming community will continue to form the backbone of society and we will continue to support the agrifood sector. We are committed to continuing investment in this sector. It is important that farmers complete their projects and get their documentation submitted——

Deputy Tom Sheahan: They do not have time.

Deputy Seymour Crawford: The weather has not allowed it.

Deputy Margaret Conlon: ——by 31 December 2008. The Minister, Deputy Smith, is not responsible for the bad weather.

Deputy Michael Creed: The Deputy is totally out of contact.

Deputy Thomas Byrne: I am pleased to speak on the motion today and, with my colleagues and under the leadership of the Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food, Deputy Smith, to bring some realism to the debate. It is totally unrealistic to come to the Chamber to call for the extension of a scheme which has been agreed and subject to the approval of the European Commission. The Commission’s approval would be needed for any extension and it would never have been granted because of the exceptional nature of the scheme. This has always been the date and there is no use telling constituents that a motion will be tabled in the Da´il to get it changed. That is not the reality.

(Interruptions).

Deputy Thomas Byrne: The scheme was always going to end at the end of this year, and what a good scheme it was.

Deputy Paul Connaughton: The Deputy is not long here.

Deputy Thomas Byrne: I am here as long as the Deputy and I was elected by the people, including the farmers, of my constituency. Where other parties considered my constituency to be a commuter belt area, the Fianna Fa´il Party knew it was an agricultural area and a very rural constituency. This was not appreciated by any of the other parties in the constituency. I am glad to represent all the people of my constituency and to be elected in the same way as Deputy Connaughton. My constituents have benefited from the programme and the constituency has benefited from agriculture by some \66 million up to 2005 from 46,000 completed applications. All of these applicants were told at the beginning what the deadline would be. The scheme has been an outstanding success and the officials who negotiated this with the European Commission — as we know from the recent banking guarantee, these negotiations are not easy — did an excellent job. The officials told people from early on what the timing would be. When I first became a candidate for election, the nitrates directive was an issue and this scheme came into being. Coming from a town, I was only beginning to learn about agriculture. I have learned a good deal from my colleague Deputy Johnny Brady and from the Minister, Deputy Smith, for which I am glad.

Deputy Tom Sheahan: The Deputy has much to learn yet. 48 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

Deputy Thomas Byrne: Deputy McEntee assists me if Deputy Brady is not available from time to time. This has proved to be an excellent scheme with \113.8 million in grants-in-aid paid to date. Some \212 million has been paid this year and another \195 million under the Supplementary Estimate. This represents a sizeable investment in rural Ireland which is being used and utilised. It will be finalised before the end of the year. The investment shows the confidence the Government has in agriculture and its importance not only to my constituency, but to the economy as a whole. It is very important in these difficult times that this sector can thrive and improve and I encourage more people to stay in it. I commend the Government amendment and I commend the Minister, Deputy Smith, and his officials for their work. I ask everyone to urge farmers to complete the work for which they have approval and to do what- ever is necessary to get this wrapped up by the end of this year.

Deputy Noel Treacy: I support the amendment that has been moved by the Minister, Deputy Smith. As public representatives and legislators, we have the responsibility and privilege of representing the people in this House. It is important that we do not mislead communities throughout the country.

Deputy Seymour Crawford: We would not dare.

Deputy Noel Treacy: In particular, we should not mislead the farming organisations. I com- mend and salute the outstanding leadership capacity that has been shown by the Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food since he took office. Deputy Smith is an outstanding Minister. He showed his negotiating skills when he got this scheme agreed at Council of Ministers level.

Deputy Seymour Crawford: It was too late when he started.

Deputy Noel Treacy: He got the Commissioner to change various schemes. He showed flexi- bility when it was needed by Irish farmers. He secured early payments to assist farmers who needed cash at particular times. We have brought forward the single farm payments. We have delivered them. We are continuing to make payments. This scheme represents an investment of over \500 million in rural and agriculture infrastructure. It is a massive investment in rural Ireland. It is hypocritical of those who are misleading farmers to suggest we can persuade the Commission to revisit and change this scheme.

Deputy Tom Hayes: Of course we can.

Deputy Paul Connaughton: The Government has not even tried.

Deputy P. J. Sheehan: It has not made a request.

Deputy Noel Treacy: When that was done some years ago, before Ireland joined the Euro- pean Union, it nearly bankrupted the country. When Fianna Fa´il came into government in 1987, this country’s debt represented 120% of its gross domestic product.

Deputy Michael Creed: The Deputy has some neck to talk about bankruptcy given what is happening in the country today.

Deputy Noel Treacy: Deputy Creed is a young man. It is important for him to understand the reality of the facts.

Deputy Seymour Crawford: Some of us are not that young.

Deputy Michael Creed: Deputy Treacy has some neck. 49 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

Deputy Noel Treacy: Fine Gael abolished the Irish Land Commission. It left farmers with serious annuity arrears. It almost bankrupted the farmers who were unable to pay for expensive land. It did not deal with the matter when it was leaving office.

Deputy Shane McEntee: The Deputy’s party put them in jail.

Deputy Noel Treacy: Sit down, Deputy McEntee. Do not be annoying and interrupting me.

Deputy Shane McEntee: The Deputy’s party put the farmers of this country in jail.

Deputy Noel Treacy: We had to come into office to abolish the annuities and give fair play to the farmers.

Deputy Shane McEntee: The deposed Taoiseach was responsible for that.

Deputy Johnny Brady: Sit down.

Deputy Shane McEntee: The farmers of this country were jailed.

Deputy Noel Treacy: Fine Gael suspended the farm modernisation scheme.

Deputy Shane McEntee: This is typical.

Deputy Noel Treacy: It then abolished the scheme.

Deputy Shane McEntee: Fianna Fa´il jailed the farmers who were fighting for their families.

Deputy Noel Treacy: Fine Gael caused Irish farmers to lose a huge amount of money when it suspended the farm modernisation scheme.

Deputy Shane McEntee: Fianna Fa´il jailed them.

Deputy Johnny Brady: Deputy McEntee is not at a football match.

Deputy Noel Treacy: We had to come back into office and renegotiate it.

Deputy Shane McEntee: I should not have to listen to rubbish from the party that jailed the farmers of this country.

Deputy Johnny Brady: We know the Deputy loses the head at football matches, but he should not do it in here.

Deputy Shane McEntee: Now it is driving them off the land.

Deputy Noel Treacy: Can the Chair protect my rights in this House?

Deputy P. J. Sheehan: One more cow, one more sow, one more acre under the plough.

Acting Chairman (Deputy Sea´n Ardagh): Gentlemen, ladies, a little bit of order. You have made your point.

Deputy Noel Treacy: I am telling the truth.

Deputy Shane McEntee: You put decent men in jail.

Deputy Noel Treacy: When Fine Gael was in office, the super levy was challenged. 50 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

Deputy Tom Hayes: The Deputy should address the motion.

Deputy Noel Treacy: Fine Gael told the farmers of Ireland that it was nervous about the situation. It agreed a super levy and imposed it on Irish farmers.

Deputy Paul Connaughton: I suppose Fianna Fa´il was never wrong.

Deputy Noel Treacy: It almost put the farmers out of business again. What did Fine Gael do the last time it was in office, with the Labour Party? It put a preservation order on this country’s bogs. You denied farmers the right to cut turf. Now you are trying to change that again.

Acting Chairman: I ask Deputy Treacy to speak through the Chair. It is important to speak in an independent and objective manner, rather than pointing to any other individual Member.

Deputy Noel Treacy: They started it.

Deputy Seymour Crawford: You started it.

Acting Chairman: Gentlemen, if you wish to interrupt, I ask you to do so in an orderly fashion.

Deputy Paul Connaughton: Good man.

Deputy Noel Treacy: I seek the protection of the Chair.

Deputy Tom Hayes: On a point of order, I ask the Chair to insist that Deputy Treacy addresses the motion before the House——

Deputy Paul Connaughton: He has never done that in his life

Deputy Tom Hayes: ——rather than going away from it.

Deputy Noel Treacy: That is one thing you never did, Paul.

Deputy Paul Connaughton: You never did it in your life.

Deputy Tom Hayes: We want him to address the motion.

Acting Chairman: That is not a point of order.

Deputy Noel Treacy: We are familiar with Deputy Connaughton’s record.

Deputy Tom Hayes: The Chair should ask the Deputy to address the motion.

Deputy Billy Kelleher: Freedom of speech is a fundamental part of this House.

Acting Chairman: I ask Deputy Treacy to continue to address the motion, as he has done to date.

Deputy Noel Treacy: I am addressing the amendment to the motion. We have spent over \500 million on this scheme. It is unfair to mislead the farmers of this country by saying that the closing date for the scheme can be extended. It has been clearly negotiated by the Minister. It is impossible to change the closing date. We must make it clear that the scheme will terminate on 31 December. The cash will be paid. Over \500 million will be paid to the farmers of this country. Some \125 million has been included in the budget that was agreed this week to ensure that payments will be made on foot of claims which are made before 31 December. 51 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

[Deputy Noel Treacy.] These are the facts. The Opposition has misled people on this issue. It misled them in other ways in the past. We have to deal with the facts of the situation. Fine Gael took decisions that it was unable to follow up. It left farmers in a serious crisis. We had to renegotiate in Europe to save Irish agriculture.

Deputy Paul Connaughton: The Government has not saved it.

Deputy Noel Treacy: We will continue to support our farming communities, which are the grass roots and the bedrock of rural Ireland.

Deputy Tom Sheahan: The Government did not do much for farmers last Tuesday.

Deputy Noel Treacy: We have always supported them and we will continue to do so.

Deputy Shane McEntee: What about the Green team? We all know what they want to do to Irish agriculture.

Deputy Billy Kelleher: Fine Gael wanted the Green Party as well.

Deputy Sea´n Sherlock: I wish to share time with Deputies O’Shea and Ferris.

Acting Chairman: Is that agreed? Agreed.

Deputy Sea´n Sherlock: I wish to speak about the subject of this motion. I will stick to the point of this debate, which has gone all over the shop, quite frankly. The purpose of the motion is to seek an extension to the farm waste management scheme. The Labour Party would support such an extension, not for political expediency or point-scoring, but because we realise that a certain number of farmers will not be able to make the deadline. We support such farmers for reasons of common sense and pragmatism, some of which have already been outlined. I am aware of farmers who have not been able to get contractors to do the works which are required under the scheme. The poor weather we have endured this year has delayed some building works. Many farmers will not be able to meet the deadline as a consequence of a myriad of other circumstances, which I will not repeat. There is merit in raising, in a genuine way, the possibility of an extension to the deadline. Some people will be adversely affected if a change is not made. The valid point made earlier by Deputy Deenihan, which has also been raised by the Irish Creamery Milk Suppliers Organisation, ICMSA, deserves further examination. I refer to the interpretation of State aid and the interpretation of the scheme. I wish to quote from a letter sent by the president of the ICMSA to the Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food on 25 August last. The letter, which gets to the heart of the debate on this motion, reads:

Dear Minister

I wish to refer again to the 31 December 2008 deadline under the Farm Waste Management Scheme. While we are all aware of the background to the scheme and the setting of the December 2006 and December 2008 deadlines, there is clearly a major problem for a growing number of farmers if the 31 December 2008 deadline is to be interpreted as meaning that the work must be completed and approved by your Department on or before that date. We do not accept that this is the only interpretation. I believe, based on the EC Guidelines for State Aid in the Agriculture and Forestry Sector, that Ireland should propose that the 31 December 2008 deadline can be met by an individual farmer where the building work is to be completed or commenced after the 31 December 2008 if that farmer has a legally binding 52 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

contract for the construction of the building and or supply of materials in place on or before 31 December 2008. This procedure, reliance on a legally binding contract, is used quite often for the phased introduction or termination of tax relief measures. I believe that this procedure can be readily adopted by your Department and would meet the requirements set down in the EC Guide- lines for State Aid in the Agriculture and Forestry Sector. That proposal, which is based on a valid interpretation of the state aid guidelines, represents common sense. I echo Deputy Deenihan’s comments on it. In his response to this motion, the Minister, Deputy Smith, did not respond to Deputy Deenihan’s point. I call on one of the Government Deputies to respond to the issue that has been raised in an honest manner. Is this interpretation of the guidelines valid? I do not wish to play politics with this issue. A balanced and reasonable view is being put forward by a group of farmers who will not be in a position to submit the card A due to genuine reasons. It is reasonable for us to echo the views of those farmers, notwithstanding what Deputy Conlon and others have said in support of the scheme. We have had superfluous speeches by Government backbenchers, but there is a genuine issue that needs to be addressed. Before the clock runs down on this debate, I hope that the Government will come back with a response to the points that I and Deputy Deenihan have raised. There is a genuine concern among a small minority of farmers and that must be addressed.

Deputy Brian O’Shea: Ar an gce´ad dul sı´os, ba mhaith liom an Teachta Michael Creed agus Pairtı´ Fhine Gael a mholadh as ucht an ru´ nta´bhachtach seo ar an sce´im bhainistithe dramhaı´ola feirme a chur sı´os. Baineann an sce´im leis an treoir um nı´otra´itı´.Ta´ dha´ thairbhe mo´ ra ag teacht as an sce´im — ceann amha´in i dtaobh an chomhshaoil agus ceann eile i dtaobh an obair i dtionscal na to´ ga´la faoin tuath. Ta´ muintir na to´ ga´la ag ra´ go gcaillfear 10,000 post ag deireadh na bliana muna gcuirtear leis an am ata´ ar fa´il chun an obair faoin sce´im seo a chrı´ochnu´ . Ina theannta sin, beidh airgead a´ chaitheamh san eacnamaı´ocht faoin tuath, a chabhro´ idh le siopaı´, tithe tabhairne agus a leithe´id. Ta´ se´ sin ag teasta´il go ghe´ar i ngach chuid don tı´r agus ta´ se´ ag teasta´il go mo´ r faoin tuath. This is a reasonable motion and I would like to take a line from my party’s spokesperson on agriculture, Deputy Sherlock, when he quoted the president of the ICMSA, Jackie Cahill. It seems that 10,000 people approved under this scheme cannot finish the work in time for the deadline on 31 December 2008. The reasons have been explained by other speakers, such as the inclement weather, the high level of activity in thisconstruction sector and the unavailability of contractors, as well as the fact that there was a scarcity with materials. Problems also arise when local authority planning offices are loaded with more applications than usual, which can slow up the process. It has often been impossible to carry out work on a farm this year due to the bad weather and the state of the ground. It can be difficult to organise the work in such conditions. Therefore, there are people with genuine reasons for not being able to finish on time. Mr. Cahill makes a point in his letter about allowing people to finish where there is a binding contract or a supply of materials prior to the deadline of 31 December 2008. He provides precedents for this with some Government schemes. It is perfectly reasonable for him to ask that this matter be explored again. If it is the case that 10,000 jobs will be lost in the construction industry if we are not able to move a deadline, this is a no-brainer. There is only one road to go. These points are worth exploring and raising with the EU. 53 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

[Deputy Brian O’Shea.]

There are also health and safety aspects in rushing to complete the construction work before the deadline. Unfortunately, there are too many accidents in construction in Ireland. Accidents are always more likely to happen when there is haste, which appears to be what will happen in many of these cases due to the deadline. I welcome the fact that there has been such a great take-up of the scheme. I understand that \330 million has been paid in grant aid since 2007. In his speech, the Minister said that \217 million has been paid out so far this year. However, there is a Supplementary Estimate of \195 million for an estimated 6,500 farmers for whom the works have been approved but who have not yet been paid in line with the charter of rights, namely, within five weeks of the date of approval. That should be urgently addressed. Keeping people waiting for payment in today’s world will result in additional bank charges and that is something from which every citizen should be protected. The motion seeks an extension until 30 June 2009. The IFA suggested an extension until 30 September, while Mr. Cahill of the ICMSA suggested an extension to 31 December 2009. We are open-minded on this, but a date must be given so that people can finish in time to claim the grant aid under this system. This is a good scheme. It brings us into compliance with the nitrates directive. It provides for additional storage of slurry, something that is badly needed. There has been an enthusiastic take-up by farmers, but it would be a pity if 10,000 farmers who were approved under the scheme were prevented from doing the work. The benefit to them and to the country would be lost and all because we could not move a deadline. I compliment Deputy Creed and the Fine Gael Party on bringing this issue before the Da´il. It should certainly not be an issue for division and rancour. It should be discussed reasonably. It should bring us to a solution that is good for the environment, the rural economy, the construction industry and the farmers who undertake the work. Those farmers have borrowed to carry out the work and that is difficult in today’s world. A figure arrived at by the IFA is quite impressive in regard to this issue. It shows the improvement of farmyard facilities in 2008 will involve spending of \1.5 billion, a considerable amount of money which creates employment through construction and the purchase of materials. Money coming to farmers tends to be spent in the local community for the benefit of that community. Given the uncertainty which prevails at the moment, any way in which economic activity can be stimulated, particularly in rural Ireland, is to be welcomed. It is a cause of regret that such stimulation should be retarded because of a deadline which, like all deadlines, is arbitrarily set and cannot be moved. It is lamentable and the Government should accept the Fine Gael motion. It should explore with the EU the suggestion of Mr. Cahill of the ICMSA that a formula be found for an extension.

Deputy Martin Ferris: I support this motion. In common with probably all rural Deputies from every party I have made a number of representations over the past year with a view to having the waste management scheme extended. The scheme is generally recognised to have been both widely popular and successful in encouraging farmers to make the necessary changes to their on-farm facilities. These changes were, of course, required because of the need to ensure compliance with the nitrates directive, a directive which several Governments, going back to the early 1990s, had put on the long finger before being forced to comply. This meant farmers came under pressure to make extensive and expensive structural investments in a short period of time that could have been introduced gradually, had the directive been dealt with over those 15 years. The fact 54 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion that those works had to be completed in a relatively short period has meant that a significant number of farmers will not be able to complete them before the end of this year. As the motion states, this has been exacerbated by a variety of factors, including the terrible weather over much of this year and difficulties in securing the required finance and planning permission. Everybody in the House will accept that this has been an exceptional year for wet weather and heavy rainfall, making land in many areas impassable. The weather has also restricted developments which had been granted approval to start, of which there have been 42,200. In addition, the sector of the construction industry involved in building farm waste management buildings and installing tanks comprises a small number of contractors in various counties. Dependency on those companies has resulted, in many cases, in a number of contractors carry- ing out between five and eight jobs at the one time. Many of those jobs are only starting now and will not be completed by 31 December 2008. Should the scheme be closed there will be a detrimental impact on the construction sector in rural areas. Many small construction firms are experiencing the effects of the downturn in house building and the on-farm works associated with the waste management scheme have provided a much needed boost, saving many local construction jobs in the process. Since the downturn in the housing sector some workers previously employed in building have found employment in the waste management construction scheme. If it had not been for the scheme there would be many more in our dole queues and more people would emigrate. An extension of the scheme would provide a significant injection of money and confidence into the construction sector, together with all the other benefits it would bring to the local economy, so this is an issue on which the Government ought to make a strong stand. The deadline will not be met and more than 10,000 jobs remain to be completed. Many of them have not yet started and they will not be completed before 31 December, not through any fault of construction workers or farmers but because of weather conditions throughout the year and the enormous take-up of the project. In the context of the budget’s impact on agriculture, the Government is obviously not think- ing along the lines I suggest. Cutting the money available for research and development through Teagasc may represent a short-term revenue saving but, in the long term, the damage caused by this withdrawal of expertise from the farming sector may well outweigh those savings. At a time when farming is under severe pressure, and when farmers are constantly being urged to use the new situation created by the single farm payment to venture into new production areas such as energy crops, it makes little sense to deny them the expertise and research found in Teagasc. As with the farm waste management scheme, the cash investment which funding for Teagasc represents can have a multiplier effect throughout the rural economy by boosting farm invest- ment and in areas such as energy crop production, which encourages off-farm enterprise in the processing of bio-fuels. In the current climate, with question marks hanging over the future of a significant element of current foreign investment, it makes sense for the State to encourage indigenous investment and indigenous enterprise, whether through the waste management scheme or by stimulating the development of alternative farm production systems, such as energy crops, and their tie-in with the broader rural economy. I was struck by the references in some of the submissions to the report of the Joint Commit- tee on Agriculture, Fisheries and Food on the future of farming and fishing in the west to the emphasis placed by many on local sustainable businesses, many of them supported by the Leader programme. For example, Tuatha Chiarraı´ Teoranta points out that, while 21% of jobs in Kerry are in IDA-supported companies, more people are employed by local businesses supported by Leader and 70% of such companies were successful. In the current climate, boost- 55 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

[Deputy Martin Ferris.] ing local investment in sustainable enterprises, many of them directly tied in with farming and fishing, is the way to proceed. Most of the employment in many areas of rural Ireland has been built around the construction sector and a significant number in that sector work in the waste management scheme project. There is a knock-on effect on local businesses, such as those which supply concrete or other materials for the projects. We were told during a meeting with officials from the Department that a scaled-down version would be acceptable. I question their claim in this regard because when one is given planning permission for a project which will not be completed, or even started, by 31 December, a scaled-down version will mean that only part of the project will be completed or planning permission will have to be reapplied for on a scaled-down basis.

Deputy Brendan Smith: My understanding is that, from the point of view of planning, it is possible to carry out part of the project.

Deputy Martin Ferris: That is not the way to proceed. The nitrates directive has had an impact on the environment and the obligations it has placed on farmers in respect of a building have all been dealt with in the planning process. To go to a situation where a farmer will get a scaled-down grant for the phased section will mean that, in the current circumstances within the farming community, they will not be able to complete their projects because they will not be able to afford it. They will not have their grant aid which is essential for them to complete that project. That is a great mistake. It would be possible to allow an extension, which is the correct approach. An extension until June 2009 as proposed in the Fine Gael motion, which I fully support, would be the remedy and would allow farmers to meet their obligations and compliance as well as facilitating the best decision for our environment and the way forward for farming. In the current economic climate, the Minister should take into account that some farmers have approval. In order to complete their projects, they need to get loans from banks to pro- ceed but they are experiencing difficulty. Every Deputy will have met somebody who is finding it difficult to get the money from the bank even though 60% of the outtake is guaranteed. It may take time. They may not be able to get it immediately. They may need to guarantors, etc., in order to draw that money down. If they cannot draw it down, they will also be caught. It is a no-win situation for some people. Some 10,000 have approval and if they can get their work done, it should be supported. I ask the Minister to do what he can in his negotiations with his EU counterparts to put pressure on so that it can be extended for the necessary six months.

Deputy Eamon Scanlon: I wish to share time with Deputies Christy O’Sullivan, Sea´n Con- nick, Bobby Aylward, Joe Behan and Mary Alexandra White.

Acting Chairman: Is that agreed? Agreed.

Deputy Eamon Scanlon: The deadline of 31 December 2008 for completion of work by farmers under the revised farm waste management scheme introduced by the Department in March 2006 is a condition of the EU state aid approval for the scheme. The European Com- mission has since reaffirmed that it expects Ireland to respect strictly this deadline. The Depart- ment of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food is continuing to process payments under the scheme and all farmers who completed investment works in accordance with the terms and conditions of the scheme will be paid their full entitlements. The scheme already has dramatically transfor- med the farming infrastructure through the major injection of capital and will leave the sector well positioned to meet the highest international environmental standards required of farming, 56 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion as well as the changing market requirements. It will also continue to strengthen the competi- tiveness of Irish agriculture into the future. The financial commitment of the Government to the scheme is very substantial, particularly during these challenging economic times. This is demonstrated by the fact that more than \180 million has been paid out to farmers under the scheme so far this year, compared to \21 million in 2006 and \114 million in 2007. The terms and conditions of the scheme made it clear that payment of grant aid was conditional on the time limit being respected and the Department has consistently held this position since the commencement of the scheme. I understand the Department has sent written reminders to all farmers approved to com- mence work under the scheme to ensure that all work is completed and a payment claim submitted to the Department by the end of this year, which indicates to all farmers the import- ance of meeting this deadline. It is better for people to know where they stand. Whatever happened last weekend in Sligo and north Leitrim, there was a rumour that unless farmers submitted their VAT estimates before the budget, it would be discontinued. I know people who travelled from Leitrim and Sligo to Limerick to hand in VAT receipt forms because they were fearful they would not receive their VAT rebate. It is very unfair and people are very concerned. I received a number of telephone calls last week on the matter. It is wrong to send out the wrong message. People should be told exactly the situation and in fairness that is what the Government has done on this scheme. The farm waste management scheme has proved to be very successful. The scheme was introduced in February 2001 under the national development plan and farmers have responded well to it. The funding provided assists farmers in completing the work and ensuring that Ireland meets our requirements under the EU nitrates directive. Farmers have benefited under the farm waste management scheme and it is vital that we continue to provide practical support to them. This funding is an essential part of that support. The scheme’s success has been the result of one of the biggest ever State-supported investments in farm infrastructure. The scheme has significant environmental benefits and assists farmers to meet the requirements of the nitrates directive. The scheme has been heavily promoted by Government as a way to meet the requirements of the EU nitrates directive and offers participating farmers up to 70% grant aid to complete necessary works before the year-end. I understand the poor weather has created difficulties for some farmers to get works com- pleted, but as matters stand the terms and conditions of the scheme make it clear that payment of grant aid is conditional on the time limit being respected. The last decade has been a time of great change for our country as a whole. The opportunities available to our people have expanded incredibly and farming is no longer a dominant industry. However, that does not mean that farming is a part of our past. The interests of farmers are still supported and pro- moted in this country. Farmers have witnessed significant change throughout their sector over recent years. Investment in agriculture is always crucial. Ireland is still known as a green island, a place where agriculture runs deep, where the connection between the people and the land will never be broken. Investment in the sector will allow farmers, processors and all entre- preneurs in the sector to develop and market new products and avail of new opportunities. Innovation is key to all sectors in society and agriculture is no exception. A combination of strong leadership and a close working relationship with farmers and the wider agrifood sector is in all of our interests. We should all be committed to ensuring that farming realises its full potential and retains its position at the cornerstone of life in rural Ireland. This scheme has been a fantastic success. It will end up costing close to \800 million as the work is completed next year. This funding is provided by the Government. It is not European 57 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

[Deputy Eamon Scanlon.] money, as some people believe. It is Irish taxpayers’ money provided to improve farming and I commend the Government’s amendment to the House.

Deputy Sea´n Connick: I welcome the opportunity to speak briefly on this motion. Since the Government was returned to office last year, we have consistently acted in the best interests of farmers and have taken many initiatives to keep the farm family at the centre of Irish rural life. I have worked closely over that time with the Minister, Deputy Smith, and with his predecessor, the current Ta´naiste, Deputy Coughlan, on issues concerning both farmers and fishermen in County Wexford. I have found both Ministers and their Ministers of State to be completely committed to building a strong and sustainable farming sector. In the past week alone, the Minister, Deputy Smith, has made a number of announcements which show the Government’s commitment to agriculture. The Minister’s decision, in consul- tation with the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government, Deputy Gormley, to extend the time period allowed to spread slurry this year was a practical response to the bad weather that we witnessed over the past few months and to the difficulties that farmers faced as a result. Yesterday, the Minister announced that he has secured agreement from the European Com- missioner for Agriculture and Rural Development to begin issuing advance payments, worth \532 million, under the single payment scheme to 90% of single payment scheme applicants. These payments are starting to issue six weeks before the normal commencement date for single payment scheme payments and are again a response by the Government to the weather conditions we experienced this year.

Deputy Michael Creed: The Deputy is singing my tune. The Commission agreed to it. It was only a case of asking.

Deputy Sea´n Connick: This earlier payment will be of considerable assistance to farmers in my constituency in Wexford and will be a welcome boost to their cash flow at this time of the year. This week’s budget again showed that the Government is committed to the development of agriculture and the Minister, Deputy Smith, should be congratulated on a number of initiatives he has taken in the budget. I particularly welcome the decision to increase the investment in REPS to \355 million. This will not only increase the grant aid payable under REPS 4 by 17% but will also allow the scheme to accept new entrants. I also welcome the Minister’s decision to extend the farmer’s stock relief, the farm pollution control relief and the stamp duty relief for farm consolidation for a further two years and the stamp duty relief for young trained farmers for an extra four years.

Deputy Michael Creed: What about installation aid?

Deputy Sea´n Connick: Each of these reliefs is particularly aimed at young, progressive farm- ers and is an investment in the future of agriculture.

Deputy Seymour Crawford: What about installation aid?

Deputy Sea´n Connick: The Deputies opposite have all the answers but none of the solutions.

Deputy P. J. Sheehan: The Government has none either.

Deputy Sea´n Connick: They should be calm. The decision to extend them is a recognition of the Government’s aim to give a future in agriculture to young farmers. The farm waste manage- 58 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion ment scheme has been one of the most successful agricultural schemes the Government has introduced in recent years.

Deputy Paul Connaughton: That is why we want it.

Deputy Sea´n Connick: A total of 46,000 farmers have applied. More than 42,000 approval letters have been issued and 30,000 have started work.

Deputy P. J. Sheehan: What about the other 8,000?

Deputy Sea´n Connick: As a result of today’s debate many more will issue their announce- ment in the coming days and weeks that they have started work. The fact that we are debating it here today shows how important this scheme is to rural Ireland. The 60% grant aid available to farmers in Wexford and elsewhere has allowed many farmers to carry out important improvements to their farms which they would not otherwise have been in a position to do. It has also been an important boost to the construction industry in Wexford and around the country over the past year in particular. Last year, almost \114 million was paid in grant aid under the farm waste management scheme and this year the spend will be approximately \377 million. This is an important injection of cash into the rural economy and has been of major assistance to both farmers and builders throughout Ireland. The Opposition’s motion today on the farm waste management scheme is completely oppor- tunistic and the Deputies on the other side of the House know it.

Deputy Paul Connaughton: Tell that to the farmers in Wexford.

Deputy Sea´n Connick: The Minister for Agriculture Fisheries and Food, Deputy Brendan Smith, has consistently stated that all projects which are completed and have their docu- mentation with the Department by 31 December will be paid in full. The Minister could not have been any clearer on this point and I do not understand why Fine Gael sees the need to seek clarification on this matter when the Minister has stated several times over the past few months that these farmers will be paid. The Da´il has already approved a Supplementary Esti- mate to provide \195 million for the scheme to ensure payment. The only thing Fine Gael will gain by its opportunistic approach on this is to spread fear among farmers that their payments are in doubt. How many times does the Minister have to say that works completed and docu- mented by the end of the year will be paid for before Fine Gael is willing to accept his word and stop spreading unfounded fear among farmers?

Deputy Mary Alexandra White: Hear, hear.

Deputy Sea´n Connick: The 31 December deadline was brought in to recognise the specific weather conditions that exist in Ireland. It is an absolute condition from the Commission that this deadline is adhered to if we are to seek grant aid for this scheme. I and many other rural Fianna Fa´il Deputies have spoken to the Minister on this matter. He has obtained several important concessions from the European Commission to date. He has been able to bring forward the date for the single payment scheme. He has had the testing age for BSE increased to 48 months. If it were possible to extend the deadline for the farm waste management scheme, he would have achieved this as well.

Deputy Michael Creed: He did not even try.

Deputy Sea´n Connick: The Fine Gael Members know this and all they are doing in bringing forward this motion today is raising false hopes among farmers that the deadline can be extended. 59 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

[Deputy Sea´n Connick.]

Fianna Fa´il has always protected our rural and farming communities. We have done so in the past and will continue to do so well into the future.

Deputy Paul Connaughton: I hope the Wexford farmers are happy.

Deputy Mary Alexandra White: I live among farmers in the Blackstairs Mountains on the Carlow-Kilkenny border. They are trying to comply with the deadline. That is a great start. The farm waste management scheme is a huge issue for the agriculture sector and for environmental protection, particularly of our rivers and lakes. Other Deputies outlined that the scheme has been a huge success. Under the National Development Plan 2000-06, some \66 million was allocated. A total of \113.8 million was spent last year, while \377 million will be spent this year and \125 million next year. Farmers have enthusiastically availed of the scheme. It is great to see the positive results, facilitating the implementation, albeit late and sometimes enforced, of the nitrates directive. A total of 30,000 farmers have commenced work on this scheme. I am pleased that a further 12,000 approvals have been issued, that the smallest farmers, those below 20 income units, were included in the scheme and that the large dairy farmers who were previously excluded were brought into the scheme through the doubling of income units by the inclusion of milk partner- ships. Funding under the scheme, such as storage facilities for slurry, silage, soiled water, mush- room compost or other farm manures and specialised slurry and soiled water handling equip- ment, have all played their part in cleaning up Ireland’s agricultural practices when it comes to environmental protection. However, despite all this, I believe there has been adequate notice by the Government since March 2006 that this scheme would have to come to an end. Fine Gael is well aware that the 31 December deadline was a condition of the EU state aid approval and the Commission expects us to adhere to this deadline. Given the extraordinary and perhaps excessive generosity of the EU in regard to Ireland’s adherence, or lack of, to the nitrates directive, Irish agriculture must respect the finality of this dispensation from Europe. The nitrates directive has been a thorn in the side of the Irish authorities and Irish agriculture for many years. The directive has been in place in Europe since 1991 and it has reduced nitrate pollution in Ireland, which is particularly important. Recent years have shown some resistance to compliance, resulting in the threat of penalties from the European Court of Justice. Last year, my colleague, the Mini- ster for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government increased the maximum penalties which would be applied to those convicted of offences under the directive. He did so within the context of proceedings being taken against Ireland for inadequate implementation of the directive. There are lessons to be learned from the experience of the success of the farm waste manage- ment scheme, but I believe we need a higher report card than that. By 2015, all our waters must be of good status to comply with the water framework directive. This target must be achieved so that we can hold up our heads with pride. The recent report on our water quality should make us think, given that 15% of our lakes are contaminated to some extent and there are worrying levels of nitrates in the east and south east. I hope that farmers everywhere will not just ensure compliance because of an EU big stick, but because they know that to maintain a quality environment, protecting our water courses and our rivers, is an instinctively good thing to do for farmers, for our environment and for our Government.

Deputy Christy O’Sullivan: I welcome the opportunity to speak on this motion, This farm waste management scheme has been an outstanding success, with 46,000 completed applications 60 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion received by the end of June 2007 deadline. To date, more than 42,000 approvals have issued to farmers and some 30,000 farmers have indicated they have commenced work. Last year, \113.8 million was paid in grant aid and, to date, \212 million has been paid this year, while the Da´il has approved a Supplementary Estimate to provide an additional \195 million in grant aid for this year, bringing it to a total spend on the scheme of approximately \377 million. In addition, the 2009 Estimates, published on Thursday, provide a further \125 million to be paid next year. This will bring total expenditure in grant aid between 2007 and 2009 to well in excess of \615 million. This is an enormous commitment by the Government to Irish agriculture. Farmers are also investing hundreds of millions as a statement of their confidence in their own industry and who knows the industry better than the farmers. There is absolutely no truth in the suggestions and rumours that farmers participating in the scheme will be unable to reclaim VAT on their costs. The Department’s experience of similar on-farm investment schemes suggest that approximately 80% of those with approval will pro- ceed with the work. Thus, there is no basis to the Opposition’s claims that the 31 December deadline will deny up to 12,000 farmers the opportunity to avail of the scheme.

Deputy P. J. Sheehan: Has the Deputy got his ear to the ground in west Cork? He is up on cloud nine.

Deputy Christy O’Sullivan: The 31 December deadline is a condition of EU state aid approval and the Commission has consistently indicated its expectation that Ireland will adhere strictly to that deadline. It is particularly significant that the 31 December 2008 deadline was introduced as an exceptional measure, having regard to the specific conditions that applied in Ireland, including the weather, and the then lack of capacity in the building industry to get jobs started. All projects that are completed and have their documentation with the Department by 31 December will be paid in full. There should be no concerns about that. However, in recognition of the fact that some farmers, for whatever reason, may not be able to proceed with the full project for which they have approval, the Minister has decided the Department 2 o’clock will grant aid particular discrete elements of work. The Department has written to all approval holders to clarify those discrete units that will attract grant aid. This was a very practical intervention by the Minister to ensure that those proceeding with a more limited project would not lose their grant. It is worth noting that a similar scheme in Northern Ireland also has a deadline of 31 December 2008. Despite the particularly difficult economic situation, the Department of Agriculture, Fisher- ies and Food will, through Exchequer and EU funding, invest \3.26 billion in support of the agrifood sector in 2009. This includes \335 million for REPS and its 60,000 participants and provides for a 17% increase in payments under REPS 4. In addition, the Minister has ensured that the \250 million for the suckler welfare scheme agreed in partnership will be honoured in full, though the rate of payment per head will have to be reduced if the current level of participation in the scheme is maintained over its remaining four years. The Minister for Finance has confirmed the renewal of four very important tax reliefs of great benefit to farmers, particularly young farmers.

Deputy P. J. Sheehan: Yet he cannot extend the scheme for six months.

Deputy Christy O’Sullivan: These are the farmers’ stock relief, farm pollution control relief, stamp duty relief for farm consolidation and stamp duty relief for young trained farmers. In 61 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

[Deputy Christy O’Sullivan.] addition, the Minister for Finance has indicated his willingness to consider the possibility of further measures aimed at young farmers in the context of the forthcoming Finance Bill.

Deputy P. J. Sheehan: The construction industry in west Cork.

Deputy Christy O’Sullivan: The farmers of this country need not be concerned for the future of agriculture under this Government and particularly under the leadership of the Minister, Deputy Brendan Smith.

(Interruptions).

Deputy Joe Behan: The farm waste management scheme was always deadline-specific. Farm- ers and the IFA knew that, as did Deputy Creed and his colleagues. The scheme has been a fantastic success and has transformed rural Ireland in terms of investment and modernisation. The Government has put over \600 million in funds into rural Ireland as part of this scheme and this money has been virtually matched by the over 40,000 progressive farmers who saw the opportunities available within the scheme. They have brought their farms up to the environ- mental and animal husbandry standards required under the EU nitrates directive and, in the process, have secured the competitiveness of the Irish agricultural sector for decades to come. I applaud those progressive farmers and their leaders for taking the opportunities which the scheme provided to modernise their farms. Their far-sightedness and willingness to invest in their farming businesses, in tandem with the Government, has been a boon for rural Ireland and for the overall economy. The farm waste management scheme was always deadline-specific and will end in December. However, in recognition of the fact that some farmers, for whatever reason, may not be able to proceed with the full project for which they have approval, the Minister has, quite rightly, decided that the Department will grant-aid particular discrete elements of work. Indeed the Department has written to all approval holders clarifying those discrete units that will attract grant aid. I commend the Minister on that practical and welcome intervention to ensure that those with a more limited project would not lose their grant. The Minister is at least approach- ing the deadline question with a degree of reasonableness which was not demonstrated the last time Fine Gael had the tenancy at Agriculture House. I am not very familiar with the world of agriculture but everyone in the agriculture world will remember how Mr. Ivan Yates, the then Minister for Agriculture, implemented the control of farm pollution scheme in 1995.

Deputy Paul Connaughton: He was the best Minister ever.

Deputy Joe Behan: Some Members opposite were on the benches with him at the time. He did it with a very sharp guillotine, chopping down new applicants to the scheme and leaving 12,000 already approved farmer applicants to fend for themselves. In the circumstances, we could be forgiven on this side of the House——

Deputy Seymour Crawford: What happened in 2007?

Deputy Joe Behan: ——for demurring from taking lectures from Deputy Creed and his colleagues on the question of deadlines——

(Interruptions).

Acting Chairman (Deputy Johnny Brady): The Deputies should desist. 62 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

Deputy Joe Behan: ——and how to implement them. We would be forgiven if we did not take any lectures from that side of the House on that issue.

(Interruptions).

Deputy Joe Behan: The Deputies opposite can shout but I will shout louder. I have listened to them every morning. I do not often have the opportunity to shout them down but I have the floor now. They must listen and I will keep speaking.

Deputy Pat Breen: Deputy Behan got that from his boss.

Deputy Joe Behan: No Member of this House from any side could deny that Irish agriculture has been in stalwart hands for the past ten years. The Minister, Deputy Brendan Smith, has defended Irish farming interests at national, European and world trade talk levels with con- siderable skill and political ingenuity.

(Interruptions).

Deputy Joe Behan: His predecessor, Deputy Mary Coughlan, was an exceptional Minister for Agriculture, who was widely acknowledged for leading the farming sector from the front. In her new role at the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment, she continues to be a conspicuous defender of farming interests, especially in the agrifood sector where her Depart- ment has an impressive investment programme, which will underpin the livelihoods of those in the agrifood sector and those of all farmers, and that is to be welcomed by all. The Minister, Deputy Brendan Smith, is producing the goods for Irish agriculture and Irish farmers. Nothing will change the simple fact of life that Fianna Fa´il has been good for Irish agriculture and will continue to be good for it as we work our way through this current global economic crisis.

Deputy Michael Creed: The Deputy should not go there.

Deputy Brendan Smith: Fine Gael abolished the scheme.

Deputy Bobby Aylward: I am pleased to have an opportunity to speak on the farm waste management scheme and, in particular, I am delighted to be able to clarify the exact position of the scheme and the terms on which it will continue to operate to the end of the year. I want to dispel some of the many myths and untruths that have been circulating for some time. Those lies have been fuelled by the Opposition for their own devious ends. I compliment the Minister, Deputy Brendan Smith, on his Trojan efforts to ensure the success of the farm waste manage- ment scheme for Irish farmers in particular and for the rural community in general. Like every other sector in the open Irish economy, agriculture is bedevilled by its own challenges and its own pressures. Agriculture is an integral part of our market economy and the farming way of life is a proud institution in this country. Farming is a very serious business, run on very strict business guidelines. We have to remain competitive, we have to continue to invest prudently and we have to explore new markets for our excellent produce. We constantly have to adapt our methods of farming to remain efficient, we have to ensure good husbandry and there is the critical EU dimension to all our farming activities. As a farmer, I am happy to say that Irish farmers are a sturdy, hard-working bunch of people and they have always risen to meet the challenges put in front of them. Farmers in this country are progressive, they have a sound business head and they always recognise the important role they play in the community. Farmers are the real custodians of our environment and they know they occupy a special place in ensuring that the environment is treated with respect, that it is 63 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

[Deputy Bobby Aylward.] adequately protected and that it is handed on intact to the next generation. Farmers know that they have a moral duty to uphold the integrity of the land and the environment and they act on that fact. The EU directive on nitrates placed a particular onus on the farmer in terms of proper waste disposal methods. To comply fully with the various provisions of the directive, Irish farmers were obliged to take on a lot of extra work and a lot of additional expense. The intensive investment in new facilities for waste collection on the farm has been very substantial and very extensive. The farm waste management scheme was innovative and it has been an unparalleled success. It was introduced specifically to help farmers to comply with the terms and conditions of the nitrates directive and the generous grant aid under the scheme has been very welcome. In 2001, the original scheme came into play and in the five years up to 2005, \66 million was paid out by the Department of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food, to Irish farmers, a handsome amount by any standards. The revised scheme received over 46,000 applications by mid 2007 and over 42,000 approvals have been notified to farmers, while approximately 30,000 have actually commenced the work on the new farm facilities. In 2007, \113.8 million was paid and in 2008, \212 million has been paid out to date. I am delighted that the Minister, Deputy Brendan Smith, has secured the approval of the Da´il for the Supplementary Estimate to extend additional funding of \195 million for this year. According to my calculations, this represents approximately \377 million in State aid to farmers in this year alone. The Estimates for 2009 provide for another \125 million to be made available next year. Overall, State funding committed to farmers in the two years 2007-09 is in excess of \615 million. That is a very significant sum of money which signals the Government’s absolute commitment to farmers as vital contributors to our economy and our social and economic well-being. The Government recognises the pivotal importance of the farming sector and is prepared to make very substantial funds available to assist that sector in investing in its future. The Govern- ment is confident that the future prospects of agriculture are very good. It is concerned to ensure that farmers remain competitive, that they can invest in the infrastructure which they need and that they can adapt quickly to the many demands which they meet. The farm waste management scheme is a very generous scheme when compared with other schemes operated elsewhere and, particularly, relative to the scheme operating in Northern Ireland. The Irish taxpayer is footing this hefty bill and farmers are laying out hundreds of millions of euro and are investing in their long-term livelihood while at the same time adopting a responsible atti- tude when it comes to the environment. I am disgusted by the usual scare-mongering which has surrounded the farm waste management scheme. I dismiss all the mischievous blather about what will be paid out and what will not.

Deputy Tom Sheahan: What did Deputy Aylward say at the Joint Committee on Agriculture, Fisheries and Food? He supported it.

Deputy Bobby Aylward: I reassure Irish farmers. Many of them are understandably worried about the VAT element of their costs. Read my lips, as they say: farmers will be entitled to reclaim the VAT on their costs and let nobody say otherwise. That is a statement of fact.

Deputy Tom Sheahan: Deputy Aylward is a man for action.

Acting Chairman: Will Deputy Sheahan have some respect please? Deputies should have respect for any speaker. They have been at it all day. 64 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

Deputy Bobby Aylward: The Opposition has been peddling rumours non-stop over this scheme. I condemn that as dishonest and disingenuous. It is despicable to worry farmers need- lessly by spreading stories which have no foundation in reality. Farmers were concerned about the impending end-of-December deadline. The atrocious weather and torrential rains certainly made conditions very difficult at one point and there were big delays in carrying on the work. This problem was further compounded by the scarcity of suitable builders and contractors to undertake the necessary work on the structures. There has been considerable relief from this in recent weeks and farmers have redoubled their efforts to complete all the work satisfactorily and on time. Farmers are very serious about their obligation and with the increased availability of contractors, they will be well able to meet their deadline with some comfort. The deadline imposed was not some whimsical notion on the part of the Minister. The deadline is an absolute condition of the EU state aid approval. The European Commission has been strict on this deadline; there is no room for flexibility here.

Deputy Seymour Crawford: How does the Deputy know? They were not asked.

Acting Chairman: Will Deputy Crawford please let the Deputy continue?

Deputy P. J. Sheehan: The Acting Chairman is very impartial.

Acting Chairman: Deputy Sheehan will withdraw that.

Deputy Bobby Aylward: We should remember that the 31 December deadline was intro- duced as an exceptional measure in the first place. It was a special facility extended to us and it was put in place specifically to accommodate Irish farmers. We were given some latitude because it was accepted that we suffer exceptional conditions here, particularly with regard to inclement weather and the difficulty in getting a builder to do the work. There is no flexibility to be had on this deadline but I am confident that farmers will have sufficient time and suitable conditions to enable them to finish the work in good time. I speak as a farmer who understands the peaks and valleys of farming activity in the current economic and fiscal climate. When one considers the generous resources this Government has made available to the farming community, it is abundantly clear that farmers are doing well and are getting their fair share of State aid. At a time when we are confronted by swingeing economic circumstances, it is very heartening to see that agriculture continues to hold its own — and deservedly so — on the top of this Government’s policy agenda. I am delighted to compliment the Minister, Deputy Smith on the generous financial under- takings he has given to Irish farmers. We endorse the farmer and are signalling our confidence in the future viability of farming. We know that with the correct financial measures, farmers can have a good return on their efforts and their investments. Farming has always been central to our economy and I am very pleased that this Government is putting its money where its mouth is: four square behind agriculture and the rural community.

A Deputy: Well done to Deputy Aylward.

Deputy Bobby Aylward: The truth hurts.

Deputy Andrew Doyle: I wish to share time with Deputies Connaughton, Crawford, Joe Carey, Breen and Burke. Everybody spoke about how wonderful the farm waste management scheme is. It was first put in place to assist farmers to meet the nitrates directive. It is good for the environment. From a commercial point of view it is good for the building industry. I am 65 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

[Deputy Andrew Doyle.] surprised Deputy White did not mention that it is good for animal and human welfare in so far as it improves conditions for man and beast. Much has been said about this motion being mischievous. Even taking the Minister’s figures, that there has been an 80% take-up on applications, that means that at 46,132 applicants, approximately 37,000 valid applicants intend proceeding. He said he had 31,000 card A receipts. By my figures, that leaves 6,000, which is 50% of other figures, who are unsure and have not started work. The reason they have not started work is not that they did not want to or they knew they could get an extension. They have not started work because they are not able to start work. We heard the phrase force majeure used earlier. We heard this was extended until the end of December 2008 because of the weather, among other factors. The date of that extension was set long before this summer began, so the Government knew the weather would be bad from June until October and said it was sufficient.

Deputy Bobby Aylward: The farmers also knew, but they signed up.

Deputy Paul Connaughton: The farmers did not predict the weather we had. They are not such good weather forecasters.

Deputy Andrew Doyle: When it was extended until the end of this year the weather con- ditions were not anticipated. Even if only 6,000 have not started work, none of them is in this position because they want to be on the last minute. We have heard of people whose planning permission’s are subject to appeals at Bord Pleana´la. We have heard all the reasons specialised construction contractors cannot be got. They are not there because they knew they would get an extension. May I make a specific point on Wicklow? In February I asked if the Minister could state that the charter of rights commitments had been honoured regarding the approval work com- pleted and payments grants in Wicklow. She replied as follows:

My Department makes every effort to meet such deadlines. However, I accept that, in the case of applications under the farm waste and farm improvement schemes, these deadlines in some instances have not been met in . . . Wicklow due to particular circumstances arising from the office because of staff shortages . . . 874 applications received under the farm waste management scheme and the 262 applications under the farm improvement scheme. To address this difficulty, a number of officers have been redeployed to the Wicklow area in recent weeks to alleviate the pressure which has been encountered . . . The situation in Wicklow, of course, continues to be monitored on an ongoing basis.

This is not force majeure but the Department’s problem. There is another reason people have not been able to continue.

Deputy Michael Creed: Does Deputy Behan hear that?

Deputy Andrew Doyle: In its amendment the Government does not say the closing date cannot be extended, but that it will not be extended. I do not know whether I dreamt it or whether the Government side of the House who were at our agriculture committee meeting are all suffering from amnesia, but as far as I remember we had an all-party agreement to ask the Minister to seek this extension. We still have not heard whether the Minister saw it because at all times it has been said that it cannot and will not be done. The Government Deputies have said it. They are defending the indefensible. The IFA knew it. 66 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

I have an issue with what Deputy White said about 15% of lakes and rivers being contami- nated. This is where the green agenda keeps coming in. The farmers are seen as the only ones responsible for that. It is nothing to do with industry or local authorities that are not getting money to upgrade their waste treatment plants. One would think it is all the fault of the farmers. She proudly stated that the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Govern- ment has increased the penalties, and rightly so, for people who are negligent. Between 6,000 an 12,000 people who are trying to comply with the nitrates directive, and in good faith signed up to a scheme and secured loans, are being denied it. The Government members have the gall to stand there and lecture us saying we are here to raise people’s hopes or concerns. We are only trying to secure their position and let them know that because they behaved in good faith, the Government will behave in good faith and do its utmost to facilitate them to complete their works. What will happen? Discrete works will be considered fine. Farmers can put in a shed but no tank and cover the floor. Next spring they can clean out the straw, dig a hole in the floor and put in a tank. I will not say what that is. Deputy Gogarty used the appropriate phrase earlier. It is nonsense. This is double trouble and a waste of time. Force majeure was cited, but in Wicklow it was the Department’s fault because it could not get the applications processed in time, in line with the charter of rights. I know it is difficult and that people, especially those from farming backgrounds, in their heart of hearts, know this motion from the Fine Gael side of the House is valid and honest.

Deputy Paul Connaughton: Last Tuesday this Government mauled every Irish farmer. It put its hand down in their pockets and robbed them. It is about to do the same with 10,000 others who will not be able to finish their slatted houses and ancillary works. I cannot understand the attitude of the Fianna Fa´il backbenchers today. All over the country for the past six or eight months I have heard they would put pressure on the Minister because they believed it could be done.

Deputy Tom Sheahan: They knew it would be vetoed.

Deputy Paul Connaughton: They said this up and down the country. Like everybody else I have only a couple of minutes, so I can touch only the high spots. My experience in this regard is that the driver of a lorry had to come back to my farm three times in the last two months with a delivery of concrete because the deluge of rain was such that he could not operate. A farmer outside Athenry dug his pit a few months ago but he buried the Hi-Mac machine when he was back-filling the soil and it took four days to pull it out. It has been raining since then. Can the Minister imagine how difficult it will be for that farmer to have the work completed by 31 December? It is about time some common sense was brought into this debate. The Green Party Deputies spoke about the nitrates directive. This scheme is linked to that directive, which is why farmers wanted to comply. The 10,000 farmers the Government will now exclude from the scheme also wanted to comply. How has the Government treated them? Farmers are finding it hard enough to find the money to fund 40% of the work but if they must find 100% of the cost of building those tanks next year they will not be able to afford it and the work will not be done. Politics is the art of the possible. That is what we are all here for. The western drainage scheme was extended twice or three times. The farm improvement scheme was also extended with no problems whatsoever. What is wrong this time? I am surprised at the Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food, Deputy Brendan Smith, because I expected more of him. I cannot understand why he does not make a bee line for Brussels and make a case for the 67 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

[Deputy Paul Connaughton.] extension of this scheme. Is it the case that we have no friends in Europe anymore? Is the Minister afraid to go to Brussels because he knows he will be refused? The Minister should be ashamed, as should every Fianna Fa´il backbench Deputy, who came in here and backed the Minister. I hope the IFA delegation that is here has taken note of that because they have heard of the problems all over the country.

Deputy Bobby Aylward: The Deputy is playing to the Gallery now.

Deputy Paul Connaughton: I am sure they heard it in Kilkenny as well. They hoped to be able to put pressure on the Minister to change the date. Let us leave the politics out of this issue. There are 10,000 Irish farmers who will do a wonderful job of improving the environmental standards on their farms if they are given the opportunity. If they are given an additional six months, in the driest part of next year, every- body will be happy. It will not cost the Exchequer anything extra because had the work been completed, the money would have been paid to them anyway. They are not ready, through no fault of their own. I ask the Minister for Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs, Deputy O´ Cuı´v, to go back to Brussels and do whatever is humanly possible to ensure the deadline for the scheme is extended and then everybody will be happy. It has been argued that farmers were told about the deadline, which is true. However, there was no way of knowing two years ago that farmers would not be able to get a builder no matter what they paid, because builders were working on the big Government projects that eventually went wallop. When builders were available, many farmers could not get their bank managers to give them a loan, particularly in the last six months. They practically had to sign in blood. In one small area of north Galway six small building contractors told me that if the scheme is not extended, they will lay off 130 people between them, including welders, carpenters and scaffolders. Who will take the blame for that? These are unnecessary redundancies that must be laid at the feet of the Government, should they happen.

Deputy Seymour Crawford: I congratulate Deputy Creed for tabling this motion and for his efforts to bring some common sense to this debate over the last number of months.

Deputy P. J. Sheehan: That is a lot more than can be said for those on the other side of the House.

Deputy Seymour Crawford: The weather conditions this year were the worst for 70 years. I find it extremely difficult to understand how the Minister could claim that in the negotiations that took place two years ago, weather conditions were taken into account. We must be realistic and admit that this is an extraordinary situation. This was proven when the Ministers for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food and the Environment, Heritage and Local Government reached an agreement on a two-week extension to the farm slurry spreading scheme, followed by a further extension. Admittedly, that does not compare with what happened in Northern Ireland and clearly the Green Party Minister had control at the end of the day. The Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food thanked the European Commission for agreeing to the aforementioned extension. He also thanked the Commission for acceding to other requests from Ireland in the recent past. He is obviously pushing an open door. Why will he not apply for an extension to this scheme? There is no justification, other than that the Government is trying to save money. The Department wants to make sure this scheme is blocked at the earliest possible date to reduce the amount of money spent on it. 68 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

The Minister mentioned that 20% was the normal fallout with such schemes, which may have been the case in the past. However, we are in a new situation now and farmers have to deal with this issue. They must improve their slurry tanks and animal accommodation in order to meet the nitrates directive. Farmers who do not complete this work are likely to lose their entitlements and go out of business. The Acting Chairman, Deputy Johnny Brady, has a fine record in mediating on behalf of the IFA. He chaired a meeting of the Joint Committee on Agriculture, Fisheries and Food which unanimously agreed to ensure that the Minister got the message on this issue. I do not know if the committee ever received a reply from the Minister. Will the IFA continue to include Deputy Brady in slots in its publications because it has been let down badly by him on this occasion? My constituency of Cavan-Monaghan is no different to others. Approximately 51% of farm- ers have completed the necessary work, 11% are halfway there, another 11% have just started, 3% are intending to proceed, 7% are not intending to proceed and the final 17% do not know what their position is because they do not know if they can complete the work or obtain the necessary finance. That is the best independent evidence I can get on the current situation. The scheme, which nobody on this side of the House would condemn, is exceptionally good and was absolutely necessary given that the Government failed for 13 years to sort out issues relating to the nitrates directive. I would laugh at Deputy Noel Treacy were it not for the fact that the issue is so serious. He went back 15 or 20 years and spoke about what happened in the past. The farm improvement scheme introduced only last year was supposed to run for five years but was dropped in seven weeks. Thousands of farmers have submitted applications for that scheme which have not even been processed. Deputy Margaret Conlon compared this scheme to one that operates in Northern Ireland. However, she failed to take into account what has been done in Northern Ireland over a long number of years. In that context, she was not comparing like with like. The farm retirement scheme, the young farmers’ installation scheme, area aid payments and the new suckler scheme were all cut back by this Government as soon as things got difficult. I spoke to a young farmer this morning who has invested heavily in the farm waste management scheme. He did so on the understanding that his father would be eligible for money under the farm retirement scheme and that he would receive money under the installation aid scheme but both have now been dropped. Where does his future lie? We have heard a lot about the great job that Fianna Fa´il has done for farmers. I urge the Minister to take some degree of responsibility and to extend the scheme for at least a few weeks, but preferably a few months, to allow people to ensure they have a future in farming.

Deputy Joe Carey: I welcome the opportunity to speak on this Private Members’ motion proposed by Deputy Michael Creed and the Fine Gael Party which states the Government should take all necessary steps to extend the deadline for completion of works under the farm waste management scheme to 30 June 2009 and that the Government should ensure that all payments due are paid in line with commitments outlined in the farmers’ charter of rights. The original statutory instrument under which this scheme was devised was issued by the Government on behalf of the EU is SI No. 788 of 2005, also known as the European Communi- ties (Good Agricultural Practice for Protection of Waters) Regulations 2005 and more com- monly known as the nitrates directive. This has some interesting content in that it does not mention dates other than that the aim of the water framework directive is to prevent any deterioration in the existing status of our waters, including the protection of good and high status where it exists, and to ensure that all waters are restored to at least good status by 2015. 69 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

[Deputy Joe Carey.]

Surely an extension of six months to finish this scheme would allow work to be completed in a quality manner. An extension of six months would dramatically reduce the possibility of buildings literally being thrown up for which we may pay dearly in the years to come. In my constituency of Clare if one takes the rainfall for this year as measured by the official Met E´ ireann station at Shannon Airport one can see that by the middle of October, with two and a half months left to record, we have already experienced a 10% increase on 2007. To date we have had 1,010.5 mm of rainfall. The total annual rainfall for 2007 recorded at the same station was 921.5 mm. Many capital projects including roads, hospitals and housing undertaken on behalf of the Government include a force majeure clause. The Minister, for reasons of environmental improvement and maintaining construction employment should introduce a clause such as this as outlined in the text of the motion and allow the scheme conclude naturally. Of all the sectors that impact on water quality, the agriculture sector has done the most to clean up its act in recent years. This has been acknowledged in reports from the EPA. It would be a pity if this commitment to good practice would not be acknowledged for the want of a six month extension. The Government has been tardy in its responsibility for improvement of water quality here. We have many villages, towns and urban centres with inadequate sewage treatment facilities. We have been fined and warned by the EU because of this tardiness. The Water Services Act 2007 which outlines the Government’s commitment and responsibility towards the improve- ment of water quality contains many ambiguities and attempts to transfer the responsibilities to other bodies. The farm waste management scheme has seen 42,200 farmers step up to the plate and commit to environmental improvements. At this stage, we should not run the risk of undoing the good work done to date. The Government has never been slow to seek derogation from Europe when it is required. This issue stands out from a purely common sense point of view as one that should enjoy the same type of Government commitment shown in the extension and reintroduction of various construction tax breaks. I urge the Minister to accept the terms of this motion and go to Dublin Airport, possibly on his bicycle, pay the \10 air tax recently imposed, and look for this dero- gation from Europe.

Deputy Pat Breen: Like everybody else, the farming community suffered in last Tuesday’s budget and took a huge hit. I was amazed to hear Deputy Treacy state that Fianna Fa´il is the farmers’ friend. Where was he last Tuesday when the budget was announced and the early retirement scheme and the installation aid for young farmers were axed, the suckler cow scheme was reduced and other stealth taxes were introduced including removing medical cards from elderly farmers? Deputy Creed’s motion is timely. Are our farmers expected to take a further hit? I am sorry the Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food, Deputy Brendan Smith, is no longer in the Chamber. When he served his time in the Department of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food as a Minister of State he visited the World Ploughing Championships in County Carlow and urged all farmers to sign up to this scheme. It is ironic that now that he has the top job he refuses to budge and extend the date with the result that many of the people he encouraged to join will be excluded. Some of the Fianna Fa´il backbenchers have issued press releases in recent times reminding farmers about the deadline and even calling for the scheme to be extended. It is a typical Fianna Fa´il tactic to act like it is in opposition and blame Europe. Farmers do not need to be 70 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion reminded about the deadline. They are well aware of the D-Day. What they want is an announcement that the date will be extended. I urge Fianna Fa´il backbenchers, particularly those who spoke today, to think seriously about what they say. I see in these morning’s newspapers that the backbenchers are unhappy with the situation regarding medical cards for the over 70s. It is time for the backbenchers in Fianna Fa´il to stand up and be counted. Will they continue with their age-old Fianna Fa´il double-speak, saying one thing in the constituency and the opposite when they come to the Da´il in Dublin? The current scheme has been a major success and has made a significant contribution in terms of improving the environment. I am amazed that the Ministers from the Green Party have not been in the House to show a greater interest in this debate, considering the concerns they have for the environment. The environment is their hobby horse. These days, they are only concerned with pushing bicycles and changing light bulbs. The scheme has been a major boost to the construction sector and it can make an even more significant contribution to this industry now that it is in crisis. At the height of the boom it was impossible for farmers to get work done. To compound this, the bad weather placed further strain on farmers trying to get this work done. As my colleague, Deputy Carey, stated, none of us need to be reminded about the extraordinary weather we had, particularly in August when villages and towns throughout the country were flooded. I have been inundated with requests from farmers about problems with regard to planning applications. They were concerned they would not meet the deadline and are under enormous pressure. The reality is that this is about funding. The Government failed to have meaningful discussions with the EU Commission on behalf of Irish farmers. It is time it came clean with the electorate and the Opposition parties. The Minister is trying to save Exchequer funds and deny farmers their entitlements. Earlier this year the Department huffed and puffed on whether to support Irish farmers at the WTO talks. Eventually it was embarrassed into supporting them in an effort to secure a “Yes” vote for the Lisbon treaty. Many farmers fear that they will not be paid because the allocation for the scheme has already been spent this year. I urge the Government, including the Green Party to ease the pressure on the farming community and make an extreme hardship case to the European Commission. Europe needs us. Europe has a heart. The Government should not blame it for this. Otherwise, the farmers of County Clare and elsewhere will pay a huge price for Government inaction in not protecting the agriculture industry here.

Deputy Ulick Burke: I wish to share time with Deputy Frank Feighan. Already, the Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food, Deputy Brendan Smith, has shown himself to be a failure. He has failed 10,000 Irish family farmers by not getting an extension on the scheme and many people doubt whether he has made any effort at European level to do so. The Minister’s failure at Cabinet level is further exemplified with the abolition of the installation grant for young farmers, the farmers’ retirement pension, the cow welfare scheme and the reduction of the compensatory allowance for disadvantaged areas. These are serious blows to farming communities and incomes, particularly in the west. Has the Minister any realisation of the difficulties these measures will cause in rural areas? The knock-on loss of jobs in construction and builders’ suppliers in rural areas is also a serious blow. The banks are pressurising farmers for their loans and calling them in. The current shortage of cash is an additional pressure for many farmers. The greatest need for waste management works to be carried out is in the many small farms in the west that need to be upgraded yet the Minister does not realise this. I support Deputy 71 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

[Deputy Ulick Burke.] Creed’s motion. The Minister must realise the seriousness of this issue and request an extension on the deadline from the EU. His failure in other areas will be for another day’s debate.

Deputy Frank Feighan: Six months ago I was taken aback when the then Minister for Agri- culture, Fisheries and Food, Deputy Mary Coughlan, informed me she had no intention of seeking an extension to the deadline for completion of work under the farm waste management scheme. This effectively was giving the two fingers to farmers. There are many reasons the extension should be granted. The EU would give an extension if asked but I cannot understand why the Government refuses to request one. The cost of building materials is being pushed through the roof by this deadline, causing serious hardship for farmers. The price of steel has risen from \300 per tonne five years ago to \1,000 per tonne. The construction industry in rural areas needs this employment. In New- towngore, County Leitrim, in my constituency, an agricultural engineering factory employs 60 people and if this were to fail because of a refusal to extend the scheme, it could have a huge impact on the area’s economy. Will the Minister request an extension to the deadline? I am certain it will be granted so we cannot blame Europe on this occasion. The only people to blame is the Government.

Minister for Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs (Deputy E´ amon O´ Cuı´v): I thank Deputies for contributing to the debate on the deadline of 31 December 2008 for completion of work under the farm waste management scheme. The importance of the scheme has been well demonstrated by the number of Deputies who have contributed to the debate. Regarding the timely issue of payments under the scheme, all farmers who complete approved works in accordance with the terms and conditions of the scheme will be paid. Deputy O’Shea raised the issue of payments. I reassure Members that by the end of next week, the Department will have issued payments in respect of all approved payment claims up to and including Friday, 10 October 2008. The payments will be kept up to date now that the Sup- plementary Estimate has been made available. This will result in expenditure of approximately \377 million under the scheme in 2008, compared with \114 million in 2007 and \21 million in 2006. By any measure, this is a significant level of investment by the taxpayer and represents a strong vote of confidence in the farming sector. Substantial expenditure will also be incurred in 2009 under the scheme when all pay- ments have been made. The scheme will dramatically modernise the agricultural infrastructure. The deadline of 31 December 2008 for completion of work under the scheme has to be considered in light of the overall agreement secured by Ireland with the European Commission. Members will be aware the nitrates directive posed particular difficulties for Ireland as a result of a finding by the European Court of Justice in 2004 that Ireland was in breach of the terms of the directive. It was recognised that a very substantial body of investment needed to be undertaken on farms in order that Ireland would comply with the higher environmental stan- dards required by the directive. Deputies Jimmy Deenihan, Sea´n Sherlock and Brian O’Shea referred to the ICMSA pro- posal that a legally binding contract between farmers and the Department to complete all work under the scheme would meet state aid requirements and allow for an extension of the deadline. The position is clear on this — the deadline must be maintained. In correspondence, the Com- mission stated the applicable state aid rules appear to deny such an extension. It also pointed out that the deadline granted was an exceptional one, taking account of Ireland’s specific situation. 72 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

The revised farm waste management scheme, introduced in March 2006 following a wide- ranging consultative process, was the driver which enabled farmers to tackle substantial levels of investment required. The changes included an increase in the standard grant rate from 40% to 60%, with a grant rate of 70% in the four zone C counties of Cavan, Donegal, Leitrim and Monaghan. It gave additional support for young farmers; an increase in the maximum eligible investment ceiling; and removed the minimum income requirement from the scheme so that all small farmers could participate. For the small farmers on the west coast, that was an important and welcome measure. As Deputies acknowledged, the scheme has been a tremendous success, with 48,580 appli- cations received from farmers. This led to 46,132 completed application forms from farmers prior to the closing date. Some 42,500 approvals to commence work under the scheme have issued to farmers, with the balance being accounted for by withdrawn applications, failure to secure planning permission or the receipt of multiple applications from a single farmer. Some Members suggested that between 10,000 and 12,000 farmers would not be in a position to complete works under the scheme by the deadline. However, we know that time and again where a large number of applications are approved, only approximately 80% complete the scheme. In the case of this scheme, 80% of 42,500 approvals is approximately 34,000 job com- pletions. To date, 31,000 farmers have confirmed they have started work. We must encourage the remaining 3,000 farmers who were likely to complete the work in any case to complete it by the deadline. By creating false expectations that there may be an extension, some people may hold back whereas if they began work now, they could complete it within the deadline and draw down the grant. We know that in Ireland, particularly rural Ireland, when a deadline is in place, people have a habit of going right up to it. There are many builders willing to work. There is a great ability in Ireland to meet a deadline on the last day. I encourage those farmers who are anxious to proceed with their works to get them completed and draw down the grant. The moneys are in place to pay any farmer who complies with the scheme by 31 December 2008.

Deputy Seymour Crawford: Does the Minister have any idea what the weather has been like?

Deputy Shane McEntee: Acting Chairman, you may have been correct earlier when you said debating farming issues is like football — it brings the worst out of people. I apologise for some of my actions. I wish to share time with Deputies Joe McHugh and Noel J. Coonan.

Acting Chairman: Is that agreed? Agreed.

Deputy Shane McEntee: As we speak, a group of farmers is meeting in my County Meath constituency, not just to discuss this issue, but farming in general. This time last year, they were receiving 44 cent per gallon for winter milk and 40 cent for spring milk. The corresponding figures this year are 38 cent and 27 cent. Beef, lamb and pork prices have remained stagnant, while winter crops are down by \100 per tonne. Last year there was a great lift in farming due to price rises, favourable weather conditions and the installation grant. The latter grant and others encouraged young farmers’ endeavours. Since I became a farmer, after leaving school aged 15, the agricultural sector has varied through good times and bad. If there was a chance of progressing, farmers always pumped all their money into the land, even neglecting the kitchen, so their wives suffered. Thanks to those grants over the past two years many young people decided to return home and engage in farming. They did not want to do so under the old conditions, however, preferring to up-date farming methods like their counterparts in other countries. 73 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

[Deputy Shane McEntee.]

Ireland has the best food in the world so it is a shame that there should be any suggestion of stopping the growth that began in the farming sector two years ago. The world’s population is growing exponentially and food is the game to be in. Ireland has a good name in that regard, but the budget has stagnated everything in the one industry that has built up this country. Many people left farming to engage in the building industry, but they will now have to return to their farms. In the coming decades, we will have a population of 6.5 million. A shortage of food is forecast internationally so there is no point in cutting agricultural subsidies here. The sector should be allowed to continue to grow by pumping in Government aid. We have the land, skills and qualities required so it is unacceptable to cut assistance to farmers. It is the wrong time to do so. The Acting Chairman, Deputy Johnny Brady, and I come from similar parishes in the same county where eight out of ten people have left farming. Some of the best farmers in the country have chosen to leave, and the acting Chairman knows who I am talking about. In addition, their sons did not go into farming. Installation and other grants persuaded a few to remain in farming, but I know several young farmers who plan to quit the agricultural sector next year. I urge the Government to encourage the greatest industry this country has ever had. It should not stop half way, like a cow we used to have. She would fill a bucket of milk and then kick it over. That is basically what this budget was about — it kicked the bucket when it was full of milk, leaving farmers high and dry. I urge the Government to use its power to get the agricul- tural industry back on track. We should have a two-day debate on the agricultural sector, which will put this country back on the road to recovery when everything else has failed.

Deputy Joe McHugh: I thank Deputy Creed for moving this motion on the farm waste management scheme. It is timely for ongoing projects and farmers who find themselves in limbo. This is more than just an argument about farmers, it is an economic argument in light of the downturn which has also hit the construction sector. Men who were employed in the housing construction sector are now finding substitute work plastering and building slatted sheds. Government backbenchers may hear what farmers and local communities generally are saying, but they are not listening. People are dreading the approach of January and February because things will get worse then. If there is no plastering or roofing work, things will go pear- shaped. The Fianna Fa´il Party will have to deal with this, although it is not reading what is happening out there. The urban myth about farmers is that they are always getting hand-outs, but let us have a reality check. Farmers form the backbone of the country. While houses were being built and 40% of that revenue was going into the Exchequer, farmers were still engaged in primary production. They were the only people doing so because the Government had already shafted the fishermen. However, farmers were working against a background of losses and they still continue in that way. As the Minister knows from his area, store lambs are being given away for \35 or \40. Nonetheless, Tuesday’s budget removed the disadvantaged area payment, raised VAT and put an extra 1% levy on farmers. In addition, the budget increased university regis- tration fees for farmers’ sons and daughters. The Minister said that farmers have the ability to get this done between now and the end of December, but let us set the record straight. My colleagues spoke strongly about the effect of poor weather conditions this year. While the sun was shining the Government took the credit, but when it rained it blamed the Opposition. It rained this summer, which was the worst in 70 years, so how in the name of God does the Minister expect farmers to be ahead of schedule?

Deputy E´ amon O´ Cuı´v: For 31 days a year. 74 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

Deputy Joe McHugh: A constituent of mine received a letter, which states:

Grant aid will only be paid for structures completed by the end of the year to the required minimum, as outlined above. Where items such as scrapers, sliding doors, venting, cladding, etc., are not completed then the structure as completed will be grant aided less the items not undertaken. No grant payment will be made on structures that are only partially completed. Example: those not having a floor, a roof or barriers.

Steel companies in Donegal have an eight-week waiting list for roof sheeting. How can the Minister say that farmers have the ability to get this done when there is such a waiting list? Can the Minister answer that question? Government backbenchers are not doing their job because they are not in touch with the people. They are not listening to what is going on and that is why the Minister is making such a nonsensical point. Unless he brings in Paul Daniels with a magic wand, men who are not supplied with sheeting cannot put roofs on. The Minister should explain how he intends to get around that point.

Deputy Noel J. Coonan: I support the motion tabled by Deputy Creed. The Minister should not be afraid to go to Europe and get an extension for this scheme for the farmers concerned. The numbers do not really matter because following the budget, farmers are an endangered species. Every farmer is vital to the well-being of this country. Look at what the French did. They were never afraid to protect their agriculture and do not stand on ceremony because of bureaucracy. Look at the way President Sarkozy put Mandelson back in his box on the WTO negotiations. Europe wants the Lisbon treaty to be passed by the extended farming community, which is the backbone of rural Ireland, so Europe will listen. We were told that the Lisbon treaty could not be changed and was written in stone, but now we know it will be changed. This can be done in Europe so the Minister should go there with confidence. Part of the problem is that the Green tail is wagging a toothless Fianna Fa´il dog. The Green Party’s priorities are bicycles and bulbs. If they get their way in rural Ireland, which they are getting from this Fianna Fa´il-led Government, all that will be left are bachelors, briars, bullocks and bushes to throw them into.

A Deputy: Like it was 20 years ago.

Deputy E´ amon O´ Cuı´v: A good line, I like that.

Deputy Noel J. Coonan: I listened to the hypocrisy of Government backbenchers shouting across in a mealy-mouthed way at Fine Gael, the party that supplied Ministers of the highest standard to the Department of Agriculture. At the same time, they conveniently forget, like Deputy Treacy did, that Michea´lO´ Cinne´ide, as Minister for Agriculture and 3 o’clock Food, closed the sugar factory in Tuam. That was quickly followed by Thurles, Carlow and Mallow, which was finished off by the former Minister for Agriculture and Food, Deputy Mary Coughlan. They devastated the sugar beet industry, but the backbench- ers conveniently forget that. I finish on a word of warning to the Minister, Deputy Smith, because he is a decent man and I wish him well in agriculture. It is important he does well, for farmers and for the country. He should beware. He should not be looking at this side for enemies. Look behind you, Minister, because your backbenchers are in the corridors of this House, and out on the highways and by-ways of rural Ireland, saying something different to what they are saying in here. They are saying that the Minister is the weakest link and we know what happens the weakest link.

A Deputy: Bye, bye. 75 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

Deputy Michael Creed: I thank my colleagues for their support for the motion. I thank all the Deputies who contributed. In particular, I thank the Labour Party and Sinn Fe´in for their support for the motion. I am particularly disappointed at the level of Government backbench interest in the motion. Apart from coming in delivering prepared scripts and disappearing, there does not appear to be any grasp of the magnitude of the issue with which we are dealing. I will come to the issue of the numbers game. Whether it is 3,000, 5,000, 9,000 or 12,000 is not the material point. The issue is quite simple. What is abundantly obvious is, as Deputy McHugh stated, that this is a financial issue. This side of the House is saying that on balance this is, as Deputy Tom Sheahan stated, a “no-brainer” financially. If one takes the Minister’s supposition that it could be as few as 3,000 farmers——

Deputy E´ amon O´ Cuı´v: It is.

Deputy Michael Creed: ——what is the future for those 3,000 farmers who cannot meet their legal requirements under the nitrates directive?

Deputy E´ amon O´ Cuı´v: They will.

Deputy Michael Creed: They will go out of business because they will not be able to afford to 100% fund it themselves, or else they will operate outside the law with all of the consequent detrimental impact on the environment which none of us in this House wants to see happening. Whether it is 3,000 or 12,000, or as I suggest somewhere in between, those farmers will be put out of business. That is the legacy that hangs on this motion, that so many farmers will be forced to shut the gate, put the place up for sale and get out of the business. That is what we want to avoid and that is what the Government is forcing those farmers to do ultimately. It will not happen on 31 December, but it will happen over a protracted period of time because they will be hounded out of business by virtue of those whose job it is, rightly, to police the environment, and that is the consequence. Regardless of whether it is 3,000 or 12,000, that is the real human tragedy in this motion. There are immediate consequences for more than just those farmers. The association of contractors representing those involved in construction of farm buildings has stated quite clearly that some 10,000 people will be added to the dole queues in January if the scheme is not extended. I have a letter from a small west Cork concrete company which clearly states, as has been instanced by many speakers in this debate, that it will lay off 40 people on Christmas week. Deputy Tom Hayes outlined the case of a long-established company in County Tipperary involved in the business of steel-shed erection. That is replicated all over the country and those are the 10,000 workers who, in terms of social welfare alone, would cost in the region of \100 million to the Exchequer to keep paid to do nothing when there is work that can be done, whether for 3,000 or 10,000 farmers, if the deadline was extended. We are confident if the Minister went to Europe that the Commission would say “Yes” to a request to extend it. I do not buy all of this argument, that in March 2006 the Commission factored in the weather for 2008. That is an absurdity that the Minister for Agriculture, Fisher- ies and Food came out with, and an insult to the intelligence of all of us around the table. The Commission would respond. It is the typical sleeveen politics of Fianna Fa´il that if there is credit going for anything that comes from Europe we will take it, but if there is blame to be dished out we will hide behind the Commission and let it take the flak. That is what substan- tially contributed to the Lisbon treaty going down the Swanee. I would be pleased to take our chances if Deputy O´ Cuı´v’s colleagues in Government decided — even if he does not want to pay the departure tax in Dublin Airport and get on his bike to cycle out there — to put a stamp on an envelope and write to the Commission, or send an e- 76 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion mail, requesting it. I am absolutely confident the Commission will respond favourably to a well-argued case, and the Minister should send the Commission the contributions from this side of the House. I am glad Deputy Treacy has come back in because I never heard more ra´ime´is and failure to address the issue before the House than in his contribution.

Deputy Noel Treacy: I listened to a fair bit of it from Deputy Creed.

Deputy Michael Creed: At least Deputy Behan concluded his remarks by stating that he did not know much about farming, and that probably explained much of it. A deal of what I heard from others, but particularly from Deputy Treacy, showed a clear failure to grasp what is at stake in terms of this motion. All of the points have been made quite clearly. The Government has form on this one, as somebody referred to previously, in that the suspension of the farm investment scheme has been backdated so there are now in limbo thousands of farmers who had their applications submitted between 20 and 30 October last.

An Ceann Comhairle: The Deputy has one minute remaining.

Deputy Michael Creed: We will take no lectures or lessons from Deputy Treacy about the merits of Fianna Fa´il and, as Deputy Coonan articulated, the closure of the sugar industry by a series of Fianna Fa´il agriculture Ministers. I am disappointed, for example, that the two Independent Deputies who represent rural constituencies have not seen fit to attend at all, namely Deputy Healy-Rae and Deputy Lowry, the latter of whom obviously would have an interest in the points made on local employment by Deputy Tom Hayes. This has been a bad week for farmers. Most Fianna Fa´il Deputies refused to address the issue at the heart of this debate about the farm waste management scheme. Let me digress and take the same liberty for a moment. It has been a bad week for young farmers. Some 92% of farm holdings are held by persons who are over 35 years and in one fell swoop the three-legged stool there to encourage land mobility — installation aid, the early retirement scheme and stamp duty exemption — has been cropped to a one-legged stool that will collapse in terms of transferring land to young farmers.

An Ceann Comhairle: The Deputy’s time has expired.

Deputy Michael Creed: This is an opportunity for the Government to redeem itself in the eyes of farmers and the wider community whose jobs in construction depend on it. I recom- mend the motion to the House.

Amendment put.

The Da´il divided: Ta´, 70; Nı´l, 61.

Ta´

Ahern, Michael. Brady, A´ ine. Ahern, Noel. Brady, Cyprian. Andrews, Barry. Brady, Johnny. Andrews, Chris. Browne, John. Ardagh, Sea´n. Byrne, Thomas. Aylward, Bobby. Carey, Pat. Behan, Joe. Collins, Niall. Blaney, Niall. Conlon, Margaret. 77 Farm Waste Management Scheme: 16 October 2008. Motion

Ta´—continued

Connick, Sea´n. Lenihan, Conor. Coughlan, Mary. Mansergh, Martin. Cregan, John. McEllistrim, Thomas. Cuffe, Ciara´n. McGrath, Finian. Cullen, Martin. McGrath, Mattie. Curran, John. McGrath, Michael. Dempsey, Noel. McGuinness, John. Devins, Jimmy. Moynihan, Michael. Dooley, Timmy. Mulcahy, Michael. O´ Cuı´v, E´ amon. Finneran, Michael. O´ Fearghaı´l, Sea´n. Fitzpatrick, Michael. O’Brien, Darragh. ´ Fleming, Sean. O’Connor, Charlie. Flynn, Beverley. O’Dea, Willie. Gallagher, Pat The Cope. O’Flynn, Noel. Gogarty, Paul. O’Hanlon, Rory. Gormley, John. O’Keeffe, Edward. Grealish, Noel. O’Rourke, Mary. Hanafin, Mary. O’Sullivan, Christy. Harney, Mary. Power, Sea´n. Haughey, Sea´n. Ryan, Eamon. Hoctor, Ma´ire. Scanlon, Eamon. Kelleher, Billy. Smith, Brendan. Kelly, Peter. Treacy, Noel. Kenneally, Brendan. Wallace, Mary. Kennedy, Michael. White, Mary Alexandra. Kirk, Seamus. Woods, Michael. Kitt, Michael P.

Nı´l

Bannon, James. McEntee, Shane. Barrett, Sea´n. McGinley, Dinny. Breen, Pat. McHugh, Joe. Broughan, Thomas P. McManus, Liz. Burke, Ulick. Morgan, Arthur. Burton, Joan. Naughten, Denis. Byrne, Catherine. Noonan, Michael. Carey, Joe. O´ Snodaigh, Aengus. Clune, Deirdre. O’Donnell, Kieran. Connaughton, Paul. O’Dowd, Fergus. Coonan, Noel J. O’Keeffe, Jim. Costello, Joe. O’Mahony, John. Coveney, Simon. O’Shea, Brian. Crawford, Seymour. O’Sullivan, Jan. Creed, Michael. Perry, John. Creighton, Lucinda. Rabbitte, Pat. Deenihan, Jimmy. Reilly, James. Doyle, Andrew. Ring, Michael. Durkan, Bernard J. Shatter, Alan. English, Damien. Sheahan, Tom. Enright, Olwyn. Sheehan, P. J. Feighan, Frank. Sherlock, Sea´n. Ferris, Martin. Shortall, Ro´ isı´n. Flanagan, Charles. Stagg, Emmet. Flanagan, Terence. Stanton, David. Hayes, Brian. Timmins, Billy. Hayes, Tom. Tuffy, Joanna. Higgins, Michael D. Upton, Mary. Hogan, Phil. Varadkar, Leo. Lynch, Ciara´n. Wall, Jack. McCormack, Pa´draic.

Tellers: Ta´, Deputies Pat Carey and John Cregan; Nı´l, Deputies David Stanton and Emmet Stagg.

78 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

Amendment declared carried.

Motion, as amended, put and declared carried.

Financial Resolutions 2009.

————

Financial Resolution No. 15: (General) Resumed.

Debate resumed on the following motion: THAT it is expedient to amend the law relating to inland revenue (including value-added tax and excise) and to make further provision in connection with finance. (The Taoiseach). An Ceann Comhairle: It has been agreed that Deputy Noonan is to share his time with Deputy Varadkar. There are 17 minutes remaining in the slot.

Deputy Michael Noonan: I will proceed to specific issues that arise from the budget. We had a good rehearsal of the issues surrounding health this morning. I stated yesterday evening that this was a rough budget and that it was particularly rough on the elderly. This, as we all know, implies that people over 70 are to lose their medical cards. This was debated this morning and I will not elaborate on it. The Ta´naiste offered the Members on the Opposition benches tutorials to inform them of the issues. She said the matter was very simple and that the \100 million comprised \86 million paid to doctors and \30 million paid to chemists. The sums of \86 million and \30 million amount to a little more than \100 million and, therefore, one wonders who needs the tutorials. It is a rough-hewn budget and there is no doubt but that it was thrown together. Ministers are unable to explain its details in the House or answer the questions being put legitimately by the Opposition. I have two local issues to raise, the first of which is the impact of the travel tax on Shannon Airport. I do not understand why the cut-off point for the \2 travel tax was pitched at 300 km. If one is travelling from Dublin Airport to Blackpool, Cardiff, Glasgow, the Isle of Man or Manchester, one pays \2 but if one is travelling out of Shannon to any airport in the United Kingdom, one must pay \10. A Government that is supposed to be committed to regional policy should not apply travel taxes in an arbitrary fashion such as this. The only place to which one can travel from Shannon for \2 is Dublin Airport. One can make all the internal flights from Dublin for \2 and one can also go to the aforementioned locations in the United Kingdom. This information is in the summary to the budget. It seems the Ministers from my side of the country were asleep on their watch because they do not seem to stand up for the interests of the region, even in respect of issues such as this, where a clear competitive disadvan- tage is being written into the budget. My final question is for the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government, Deputy John Gormley. There was great publicity surrounding the new regeneration programme for Limerick city. North side and south side agencies were to change the face of the city and enormous sums of money were committed. I have searched the 2009 Estimates and the only Vote I can find related to this matter is Vote 25. Under subhead H3, it is stated that \20,153,000 was allocated for urban regeneration in 2008, principally in Dublin. The allocation for 2009 has decreased to a notional sum of \1 million, which represents a reduction of approximately 95% . Is the Limerick regeneration project to be stopped or is it to be funded in some other fashion that is not transparent in the Estimates? Is there some kind of bloc grant being allocated to 79 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

[Deputy Michael Noonan.] the local authorities? There is certainly no money in the regeneration Vote in the budget and there is no statement that corresponds to the promises made. There are people whose houses are literally being knocked down and we need capital funds to replace them in the parts of the city that are affected.

Deputy Leo Varadkar: Over recent years, we have witnessed a classic example of “boom and bust”. The Government pursued an economic policy the reverse of the one it should have pursued during the boom, which was caused by both domestic and international factors. Spend- ing was increased and taxes were cut and the boom was fuelled at a time when a good Govern- ment would have taken the foot off the accelerator and pulled the reins a little. I accept that one or two steps were taken in this regard, for example, investment in the National Pensions Reserve Fund. However, this is the smaller picture; the bigger picture shows much more was injected into the economy in the past four budgets than was invested. I refer to the budgets of the Taoiseach, Deputy Cowen, which helped create the recession and certainly created the deficit. Spending increased at twice the rate at which the economy was growing. Anyone who understands anything about budgeting, even household budgeting, will under- stand that when an economy is growing, one does not increase spending at twice the rate of economic growth. As some Members opposite stated, one or two prudent steps were taken but, in the main, the budgets of the past four years were imprudent. Had they been prudent and had spending been kept under control, increasing at a rate of no more than 5% or 6% per year, we would not have half the deficit we have today. There are one or two good points in the budget that should be acknowledged. The increase for the schools building programme is worthy and I hope the Department will achieve better value for this money than it achieved in the past. There is a tax break for new businesses, which is welcome, and initial steps, albeit tiny, have been made towards reducing the number of State agencies and quangos. I hope these changes will be made and followed by a much greater cull. By and large, the budget does everything it should not do. Pretty much every mistake is made in it and it is certain that it will deepen and prolong the recession and make recovery harder. They have increased taxes, which will take money from people’s pockets, depress the economy further and damage consumer confidence. More than anything anyone might suggest, taking money directly from people’s pockets will damage the economy, and taking it from the poor will damage it most. Instead of introducing the Lenihan levy, if the Government had increased the higher rate of income tax, it would have focused on money which would poten- tially have been spent on products such as foreign holidays, cars or luxuries. When money is taken from the pockets of the poor, which has happened to those on the minimum wage, pensioners and others, it applies to money which generally would have been spent in the domestic economy. This is why the tax increases in the budget make no sense. In addition to the Lenihan levy are the VAT increases. We should cut VAT, not increase it, because this will have a damaging effect on business. I do not know whether black hair dye is included at the higher rate of VAT but even that seems to be going up in this budget. There is no increase in the tax credits, which again particularly hits those on middle to low incomes. It would have been better had the credits been increased and the bands widened if that was the choice that had to be made. Deputy Noonan referred to the travel tax. This will do more damage to Shannon Airport than the abandonment of the Heathrow routes and will potentially kill the Ryanair operation at Shannon. If the Government had to introduce a travel tax, the better option would have been to apply it as a percentage of the airline ticket price. In this way, people flying to Hong 80 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

Kong with a \300 ticket would pay more than those flying on short Ryanair flights from, for example, Shannon to Carcassonne. This was a big mistake. We do not know how the car parking tax will work but I am sure it will increase every year if it comes in, and the same applies to the property tax. There are indications that more will follow next year, for example, that the PRSI ceiling will increase, the property tax will be expanded and the carbon levy will be introduced. All the mistakes of the 1980s are being repeated. It is sad that politicians never seem to learn from history. The Government made a huge mistake in cutting the capital programme. It has cut back on transport and has cut back on broadband by 25%, which is a particularly bad mistake. If Ireland is to recover and if there are to be any benefits from the upturn, when it comes in five or six years, we will have to be ready to compete in the modern knowledge economy. This is why we should look to countries like South Korea, for example, where broadband speeds are 30 times faster than they are in Ireland. If we want to make Ireland part of the new economy, where instead of being the bridge between Europe and America we become the attraction centre and the European centre of operations for Asian companies, we cannot be backward. We must invest in areas like transport and broadband. People who come here from Malaysia, South Korea or Taiwan are shocked when they arrive. Dublin Airport is a mess, there is no metro from the airport, they have to spend a fortune on taxis travelling through traffic-clogged streets and their 3G mobile phones do not work. From being a country that used to be ahead of the world ten years ago, we are falling behind at an alarming rate, which will damage prospects for future growth. The failure to close the deficit is the worst aspect of the budget. Despite all the tax increases, cutbacks and pain, the Government is still planning to borrow more money next year than it did last year. The deficit will increase from 5.5% of GDP to 6.5% and the Government will borrow \1 billion more next year, based on its very optimistic projections that the economy will only shrink by 1% and that unemployment will only rise to 7.3%. The ESRI suggests that unemployment will rise to 8% and Davy Stockbrokers suggest the economy will shrink by 3% . If the truth is halfway in between, the budget deficit next year will be \20 billion, more than the entire value of the National Pensions Reserve Fund. That is where we are heading. It would not surprise me if we are heading for a mini-budget before the summer. I will return to the issue of the deficit later. The sad point about all the tax increases and cuts is that they did not have to be made. The Government could have followed the Fine Gael alternative budgetary proposals, among which were the scrapping of decentralisation. The Minister, Deputy O´ Cuı´v, stood in the House yesterday to praise himself and the fact decentralisation was continuing. I would invest in broadband and transport any day before I would invest in decentralisation. This could have been done. A windfall tax on the ESB and the other energy generators could have been intro- duced. The Government could have used the National Pensions Reserve Fund to invest in the economy and infrastructure. There is no evidence yet that there is anything behind the talk. The Government talked about going after waste but there is no evidence it intends to do so. The proposed levy on the banks that will be introduced tomorrow is \500 million a year. The Minister, Deputy Brian Lenihan, in one of his many untruths, promised in the House last week that this would be charged at the commercial rate. At a conservative estimate, the commercial rate of that guaran- tee would be 0.5% on wholesale deposits and 0.25% on retail deposits, which would bring in \1.5 billion a year. This has not been done. If the banks could not pay \1.5 billion, that is fair enough — the Government could take equity in exchange. Instead, the Government will allow the banks to steal money from us by charging them so little for such a valuable guarantee. 81 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

[Deputy Leo Varadkar.]

The most important issue, which needs to be addressed, is that the Government failed to make decisions that had to be made in regard to public sector pay, which accounts for 60% to 70% of the current budget. Spending cannot be brought under control if the Government does not go after this. It could have done this by implementing a public sector pay freeze but it did not do so. Next year, not only will there be a 3.5% increase in August, when half a year’s worth will have to be paid, all staff will also get their annual increments. For example, if I was not a Deputy — I point out I am taking the pay cut — I would still be a doctor in the HSE. I would get my annual increment in July, which is worth 2% or 3%, and I would get a pay increase in August of 3.5%. This would be on top my junior doctor’s salary, which at that stage was approximately \65,000. Only in Ireland would people believe a 5.5% increase represents a pay pause. It does not. There is no public sector pay pause. It is totally phony. The Govern- ment could and should have done this. If it had, we would not need these tax increases and cutbacks. The Government could also have stopped recruiting to the public service. I have learned that this year alone an extra 8,000 public servants have been taken on unnecessarily. If the Government had taken the hard decisions that need to be made in regard to public sector pay and the numbers in the public service, we would not have needed these tax increases and cuts. Instead of doing what was needed, the Government went after the old, the poor, the sick, the middle classes and those on the minimum wage. The Government will not do what needs to be done, which is challenge the social partnership structure. I am not ideologically opposed or ideologically committed to social partnership. In the past, it may have been useful. In the late 1980s, certainly, unions, employers and Govern- ment came together to make decisions in the interests of the nation and to make patriotic decisions. Since then, social partnership has become something very different. It has become an industry of its own and a system by which the social partners meet on an almost annual basis to distribute the proceeds of the country’s wealth among themselves. If social partnership is worth anything, it must be able to respond to the needs of the nation in times of crisis. That means the social partners agreeing to a pay freeze on this occasion. Let us not forget who are the social partners. Social partnership is a nice term but it is a media or a PR term. The correct term for social partnership is of course corporatism or tripartitism, as it is called in Germany. The social partners are Fianna Fa´il, the Government, the public sector unions and the employers, such as IBEC, the bankers, the builders and so on. Let us be honest about who the social partners are. What we demand from the builders, bankers, other employers, public service unions and Fianna Fa´il is that they respond to the call to patriotism which the Minister, Deputy Brian Lenihan, made in his budget speech and agree to a pay freeze. We can then reverse these tax increases and cuts. The deficit projections are optimistic. It is probable the deficit next year will be more than \13 billion and could be between \16 billion an \20 billion. It could be so big it will be a third of what we spend. Members opposite no longer come out with the nonsense about the fundamentals of the economy being sound. However, they liked to boast about the fact the national debt was reduced in recent years, which was correct and one of the good things done in recent years. The national debt is now 25% of our national wealth but the Government is now to reverse this trend, just as it reversed all the other gains that have been made in recent years, such as medical cards, employment and so on. On the Government’s figures, the national debt will rise to 43% of our national wealth this year but I believe it will be close to 50%. It is almost certain that by 2010 or 2011 the national debt will be a higher proportion of our GDP than when the Government came into office in 82 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

1997. Within a few months there will be more people on the live register than in 1997. Within a year the percentage of people unemployed will be higher than it was at that time. Already the stock market is lower than it was when the Government came to office in 1997. It is an appalling record that after ten years of gain the Government has managed to reverse it all in approximately two years. That would not surprise me. I have often heard Members opposite talking about Fine Gael doubling the national debt in the 1980s because it would not take the tough decisions that had to be made. It took former Taoiseach, Garrett FitzGerald, five years to double the national debt, and he was in coalition with the Labour Party. The Minister, Deputy Brian Lenihan, will do it in two years. What an appalling indictment of the Govern- ment’s economic policy. We have a budget but no plan. It is a bit of this and a bit of that, tax increases, the odd cut here and there but no overarching strategy as to how we will get the country out of the mess. What we need to is a four year plan showing how we will reduce the deficit, keep tax under control and restore competitiveness so that we can grow our way out of the recession. Thank- fully for Ireland, an alternative exists. Fine Gael has an alternative set of policies and it will provide an alternative political leadership. I have no doubt the only solution, given the failure of the Members opposite will be for the public to turn to Fine Gael to fulfil our historical role, which is to clean up the mess the Government has made.

Minister of State at the Department of Finance (Deputy Martin Mansergh): I wish to share time with the Minister of State, Deputy Sea´n Power.

An Ceann Comhairle: Is that agreed? Agreed.

Deputy Martin Mansergh: The backdrop to the budget is the serious financial situation at home and the turmoil on the global markets. Even after the budget measures are implemented the projected general Government debt is \12 billion or 6.5% of GDP. If nothing had been done the deficit would have been 8%. That has necessitated serious expenditure reductions but also \2 billion in tax increases. It will take us until 2011 to get back on track in terms of getting the deficit down below the 3% threshold. Growth should resume when the contraction in the housing sector is out of the system. The prosperity of the past 20 years was based on the decision in 1987 and 1988 to put the public finances on a healthy footing. The credit for that goes to the then Taoiseach, Charles Haughey, and the then Minister for Finance, Ray MacSharry, with the support of Alan Dukes and the Tallaght strategy from the Opposition benches, given that there was a minority Govern- ment. The public finances went remarkably quickly on to a solid foundation. That has been one of the principal bases for the spectacular employment growth, the substitution of a low tax system for a high tax system and the vastly increased expenditure and improvement in public services. I make that point to underline the fact that we have to pull back the rapid deterior- ation and not allow it to become a runaway horse, otherwise we will spend years trying to correct the situation, as happened through most of the 1980s. At the same time, the Government does not want to put the economy into a deeper depression. The budget has involved difficult and painful decisions. It is undoubtedly an observ- able fact that different sections of the community and different interests of all types always feel they are a special case and that the burden should fall on somebody else. The favourite scape- goats seem to be either the rich or, increasingly, the public service. The reality is it falls on everyone to make a contribution. I understand the Opposition parties feel no particular obli- gation to come up with a coherent alternative concept and Governments are there to take responsibility. However, I certainly find the Fine Gael position as incredible as the Taoiseach did yesterday. 83 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: We find the Government’s position incredible as well.

Deputy Martin Mansergh: Fine Gael wants a lower borrowing requirement, no tax increases and no reductions in capital expenditure.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: That is not so.

Deputy Martin Mansergh: It seems the entire burden is to fall on reform of the public sector, which is not capable of producing results as quickly as Fine Gael suggests.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: The Government plans to take on more public sector employees.

Deputy Martin Mansergh: I well remember in 1994 the Fine Gael Party opposed the then partnership agreement and when, unexpectedly, it came into office the following year it executed very smartly a complete U-turn on the subject and supported the agreement. The reality is that the Fine Gael position——

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: Fianna Fa´il opposed the Sunningdale agreement and every- thing we ever proposed——

Deputy Martin Mansergh: ——has no support from the Labour Party benches and would not be followed through if Fine Gael were to find itslef in coalition government.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: ——but that was before the Minister of State’s time.

Deputy Martin Mansergh: I wish to address the broad principle of the issue of the day, the withdrawal of automatic entitlement to medical cards——

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: Hear, hear.

Deputy Martin Mansergh: ——for people over 70 years. Even with this measure the cost of medical cards will rise by 14% next year. I favoured its introduction, mainly on grounds of the reassurance it would give to people whose medical problems, on average, increase with age. Going back to the 1940s and the 1950s the medical profession mostly opposed, with success, the introduction of a universal health care system here such as the national health service across the water. As Parliamentary Secretary, Dr. Ward, was responsible for pioneering the health service here from 1932 to 1946 but he was brought down by a so-called scandal induced by medical interests. A few years later Dr. Browne was also effectively brought down by the same profession that earned, and still does earn, a very comfortable income from the better off members of the community. For better or for worse, therefore, we did not opt for an NHS-type of service, although those systems also have plenty of problems of their own, as do mostly private or insurance-based systems. We ended up with what can best be described as a dual, mixed system with consider- able overlaps. Approximately 50% of the population, if not more, have health insurance assisted by tax breaks together with some public entitlements. Should this system be departed from, let us say for the under 18s or the over 70s the case can certainly be made, especially when resources are abundant, but there is also an argument as to whether either constitute the best use of resources. The medical card was introduced a few years ago for the over 70s but it faced palpable reluctance from the medical profession then led by an IMO president who is now the Fine Gael health spokesperson, who insisted on disproportionate compensation.

Deputy Phil Hogan: He got it. 84 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

Deputy Martin Mansergh: To be fair——

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: I am surprised the Minister of State is taking the Minister, Deputy O’Dea’s line.

Deputy Martin Mansergh: ——it obtained it. That does not mean it was the right decision.

Deputy Phil Hogan: The Government introduced that scheme.

Deputy Martin Mansergh: It was a bridge too far——

Deputy Phil Hogan: There was an election.

Deputy Martin Mansergh: I am trying to argue this rationally——

Deputy Phil Hogan: It is irrational.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: The Deputy should stick to his own.

Deputy Martin Mansergh: ——as, arguably, was free university fees even for higher income brackets. In hindsight, I believe it was a mistake.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: The Deputy agreed with it then.

Deputy Martin Mansergh: It is not simply a question of the \100 million which will be saved this year, but the prospect of escalating costs in future years. It is important that those who left VHI schemes should be able to return without delay and with minimum difficulty.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: That is only if they pay seven years’ back pay.

Deputy Martin Mansergh: People comfortably situated, owning their own home with no child dependants and an income well above the State pension, can continue as previously with insurance and the various schemes that limit, reimburse or give credit for higher levels of medical expenses. I accept in individual cases financial difficulty, worry and sacrifice may be involved.

Deputy Phil Hogan: The Deputy should stop digging.

Deputy Martin Mansergh: Ultimately, it is a question of what level of social services we can provide with the sort of finances available. I regret that some people of a certain age group were given expectations which it is now not possible for us to fulfil, and this is a warning to those on all sides of the House——

Deputy Phil Hogan: A warning by whom?

Deputy Martin Mansergh: ——that when one is in Government, one should not introduce measures which may gain considerable kudos at the time, but which prove to be unsustainable.

Deputy Phil Hogan: It was to win an election.

Deputy Martin Mansergh: Another controversial issue is the 1% levy. This was introduced albeit with a threshold both in 1983 by the Fine Gael and Labour coalition and in 1993 by the Fianna Fa´il and Labour coalition.

Deputy Phil Hogan: Abolish the rates. 85 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

Deputy Martin Mansergh: I remember the 1% levy in the first budget of the Fianna Fa´il and Labour coalition was the centrepiece——

Deputy Phil Hogan: The Deputy was advising the Government at the time and it took his advice.

Deputy Martin Mansergh: ——of the financing of that budget. The view behind it is that anyone with an income outside of State benefits should be in a position to contribute 1%——

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: The Government is charging everyone.

Deputy Martin Mansergh: This is because if one has a small income, the amount is only nominal. Let us say one works two or three hours per week outside of other entitlements and earns, for example, \60. The 1% levy amounts to 60 cent. The idea that this will bring ruin and tribulation on anyone is not the case.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: It is the unfairness of it.

Deputy Martin Mansergh: At higher levels it does, which is the whole point. It raises substan- tial amounts of income. If one earns \100,000 per year, the levy raises \1,000 and if one earns \200,000, it raises \3,000. It is calculated on gross income and there are no allowances, exemp- tions or whatever to get in the way of collecting the money.

Deputy Phil Hogan: That is why it is so unfair.

Deputy Martin Mansergh: It brings home the point that we all benefit from society and all must contribute in however small a way. I welcome the budget measures which mean that, apart from the levy, those on the minimum wage will stay outside the tax net. Similarly, those on the average industrial wage will be exempt from the standard rate band.

Deputy Phil Hogan: They will not. They will pay the 1% levy.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: That is not so.

Deputy Martin Mansergh: It is correct.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: I give up. I will not interrupt any more.

Deputy Martin Mansergh: The affirmation of no change to the corporation tax rate is very important in retaining Ireland’s attractiveness for inward investment and, given the other tax changes, it is important to state this fact. This has been amplified by the research and develop- ment incentive which will reduce the impact of the 12.5% corporation tax in real terms. I am pleased that substantial funding continues to be provided for research, infrastructure improve- ments and school buildings among the budget priorities. Since June 2007, several thousand extra teachers have been recruited.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: They will be let go now.

Deputy Martin Mansergh: In comparing the situation to the past, one needs to take into account that there has been much improvement and we now have special assistants, resource teachers and so on. They alleviate the burden on the classroom teacher. Changes in the social welfare package amounted to \0.5 billion. The main increases were more than 3%, ahead of the rate of inflation. This amounts to an 8.4% increase in social welfare spending, which allowed the pension to increase by \7to\230 per week. I also welcome the 86 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed changes, if modest, in the fuel allowance. The significant improvements made in the past ten years in child benefit and the introduction of the early childhood supplement have, for the vast majority of people, been maintained. There has only been a little trimming at the edges. I especially welcome the reduced excise on low-alcohol beer and cider. Bulmers cider is very important in my constituency.

Deputy Phil Hogan: Well done, Deputy Mansergh.

Deputy Martin Mansergh: The increase of 8 cent on petrol will be avoided by those with diesel vehicles and it will encourage a movement in that direction. This is one of many environ- mental measures and incentives in the budget.

Deputy Phil Hogan: People can put cider in the car.

Deputy Martin Mansergh: I welcome the maintenance of the commitment to development aid. I return to the subject of the public service. There is a notion propagated, more outside the House than inside, in certain newspapers that we have a vast, bloated public service. The reality is that compared to other countries the numbers in the public service are limited. It is barely more than 10% of the workforce, or if one includes teachers and those who work in hospitals, between 14% and 15%. There is an ideological bias and I am sorry that Fine Gael seems to have bought into this thinking to a certain extent.

Deputy Phil Hogan: What about the Taoiseach, Deputy Brian Cowen, and the Minister of State, Deputy John McGuinness? On a point of order, is the Minister of State repudiating his Government’s policy?

Deputy Martin Mansergh: I have not repudiated anything. What Government policy is this?

Deputy Phil Hogan: The Taoiseach has an OECD report——

An Ceann Comhairle: The Minister of State should address any comments to the Chair and proceed with his speech.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: He might give way to the Deputy.

Deputy Martin Mansergh: No.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: He is doing enough harm, we will let him go.

Deputy Martin Mansergh: The public service in recent times has served the country remark- ably well.

Deputy Phil Hogan: Hear, hear.

Deputy Martin Mansergh: I had an opportunity to observe this at close quarters when attending the IMF World Bank meeting in Washington in recent days. Officials there worked in tandem with officials on this side of the Atlantic in preparation for a meeting in Paris. Along with the political leadership given, we have been very well served in underpinning and sustain- ing our financial system under remarkable pressures. Some people talk about the public service without having any close experience of it. However, the public service is facing reform, but it is not a short-term exercise. The budget is reducing and amalgamating several agencies. This is not a reflection on the people involved 87 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

[Deputy Martin Mansergh.] or the good work they have done in the past, but a question of how the work is best carried on in future with the amount of resources available. I am also pleased to say something which is only half comprehended by some organs of opinion and some people in the House. The decentralisation process has been consolidated. Some 6,000 jobs will be decentralised. It was originally planned to relocate approximately 11,000 jobs.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: The programme has been deferred until 2011.

Deputy Martin Mansergh: There are many projects in progress. They are of significant value to the towns in which they are located. Deputy Varadkar said he would prefer to scrap decen- tralisation and concentrate on broadband. While broadband is important, that view is not shared by the people of my home town. I am glad the budget for flood relief works has been maintained. The Office of Public Works will continue to service its various properties through its heritage service. Like all other budgets, the arts budget has had to bear some sacrifices. The allocation that has been made will help us to maintain a broad range of cultural activity and employment. I wish to pay tribute to the Ceann Comhairle for the work he did when he served as Minister for Arts, Sport and Tourism. The Government recognises that the arts are integral to the well-being and identity of our society, rather than an optional extra or a luxury to be dispensed with in difficult times.

Deputy Billy Timmins: The Minister of State, Deputy Mansergh, is the fourth Minister of State with responsibility for public works to fail to do something about flooding in Arklow.

Minister of State at the Department of Communications, Energy and Natural Resources (Deputy Sea´n Power): The budget measures which were introduced this week by my colleague, the Minister for Finance, constitute a necessary response to the serious economic downturn Ireland is experiencing. The budget represents the best possible way of tackling 4 o’clock the challenges we face within the limited resources available to us for the coming year. It has been devised to place the public finances on a stable and sustainable path. It will protect the most vulnerable people in society from the expenditure adjustments which have to be made. The Government will continue to invest in a way that leads to sus- tainable economic development. When this country faced similar circumstances 20 years ago, Charles Haughey was Taoiseach and Ray MacSharry was Minister for Finance.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: Two gentlemen.

Deputy Sea´n Power: They took the tough decisions which needed to be taken then.

Deputy Phil Hogan: What about Alan Dukes?

Deputy Sea´n Power: I will speak about Alan Dukes. I am more than happy to give him the credit he deserves. Some of Deputy Hogan’s colleagues might not have been happy to do that at the time.

Deputy Phil Hogan: We walked the walk.

Deputy Sea´n Power: Tough decisions needed to be taken at that time.

An Ceann Comhairle: Deputy Hogan is next to speak.

Deputy Sea´n Power: They were taken. 88 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

An Ceann Comhairle: He will have the luxury of talking about everything that the Ministers of State, Deputies Mansergh and Sea´n Power, have said.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: It will be a pleasure for him.

An Ceann Comhairle: If Deputy Hogan does not let them make their speeches first, he will not be able to talk about what they have said.

Deputy Sea´n Power: Alan Dukes was Leader of the Opposition 20 years ago. He recognised the difficult position the country was in. He understood what was at stake. He supported the Government’s strategy, in principle. The personal sacrifices he was making were not appreci- ated by many of his colleagues at the time.

Deputy Phil Hogan: They were not appreciated by Fianna Fa´il.

Deputy Sea´n Power: He did what was right for the country. The decisions which were made then were not fully appreciated until long after they were implemented.

Deputy Phil Hogan: The Minister of State should talk about what is happening today.

Deputy Sea´n Power: There can be no argument about the fact the actions of that time laid the foundation for much of the success we enjoyed in the following years.

Deputy Phil Hogan: I agree.

Deputy Sea´n Power: Fine Gael’s approach at that time contrasts with the position it is taking now. The Leader of the Opposition is making policy on the hoof. When he was on his way to a press conference last week, he heard the Government was planning to reduce ministerial wages by 10%.

Deputy Billy Timmins: That does not say much for Cabinet confidentiality.

Deputy Sea´n Power: Deputy Kenny decided there and then he would offer to sacrifice 5% of his own salary.

Deputy Billy Timmins: Cabinet confidentiality must not have been too strong.

Deputy Sea´n Power: That put his colleagues in an awkward position.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: No.

Deputy Sea´n Power: We need to be sensible about this. I do not expect any response or reaction from the Deputies opposite because they are embarrassed about what has happened.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: The Minister of State can speak for himself.

Deputy Sea´n Power: Deputy Kenny should have consulted his party before making any decision. I know how the Deputies on the Fine Gael benches feel about this matter. They do not need to come here and try to put on a different front.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: We are not.

Deputy Sea´n Power: Many of them were embarrassed.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: It is the Ministers and Ministers of State who are embarrassed. 89 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

Deputy Sea´n Power: They did not know what to do about it. Deputy Kenny likes to make policy on the hoof.

Deputy Billy Timmins: It makes a change from policy being made on the bicycle.

Deputy Sea´n Power: As Minister of State with responsibility for natural resources, I recently learned of the discovery of a new species of wasp in the west of Ireland. We are going to call it the Kenny wasp because——

Deputy Billy Timmins: It has a good sting.

Deputy Sea´n Power: ——it has no sting.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: That is not a good one.

Deputy Sea´n Power: We need leadership of the type displayed by Alan Dukes 20 years ago. One would think the current Leader of the Opposition would do something similar.

Deputy Phil Hogan: In other words, you need to be bailed out again.

Deputy Sea´n Power: We do not need any bailing out.

An Ceann Comhairle: I ask Deputy Hogan to address his remarks through the Chair.

Deputy Sea´n Power: I listened to the speech Deputy Kenny made yesterday.

An Ceann Comhairle: If Deputy Hogan listens to the Minister of State, he will have an opportunity to respond to him in a moment.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: The Government has caused this mess.

An Ceann Comhairle: I ask Deputies to let the Minister of State finish.

Deputy Sea´n Power: Yesterday, the Leader of the Opposition criticised every decision that had been announced by the Minister, Deputy Brian Lenihan, in the previous day’s budget.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: The Minister for Finance did not know what he was talking about.

Deputy Sea´n Power: I expect constructive criticism from the Opposition.

Deputy Phil Hogan: Fianna Fa´il has never done that when it has been in opposition.

Deputy Sea´n Power: When one is in government, one does not mind listening to such criti- cism because it is part and parcel of the job. However, one expects the Opposition to make some real proposals for dealing with matters of this nature.

Deputy Phil Hogan: We have done that.

Deputy Sea´n Power: It is unfortunate. If ever a man deserved to be left in opposition, it is Deputy Kenny.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: The Minister of State and his colleagues will find out what it is like soon enough. 90 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

Deputy Sea´n Power: He has won that crown over recent weeks. The Government has had to make difficult decisions on expenditure and tax. It has decided to maintain investment in certain key productive areas. Such investment will continue in the sectors of communications, energy and natural resources. My colleague, the Minister, Deputy Eamon Ryan, has given the House details of vital investment projects in areas like energy efficiency, renewable energy and broadband.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: Bicycles.

Deputy Sea´n Power: The projects will play a major role in promoting sustainable develop- ment and competitiveness. Ireland is not alone in facing a severe economic downturn. As a small open economy, it is particularly vulnerable to the downturn. The Government is tackling the challenges we face in a prompt and decisive manner. It is asking everyone in Ireland to make a sacrifice, which we hope will be of a temporary nature. The Government has shown leadership in this regard. It is natural that tough decisions will create certain hardships for people. There are no easy solutions in these difficult times. It has been necessary to take steps to achieve savings in the 2008 and 2009 budgets of the Department of Communications, Energy and Natural Resources and its agencies. The 2009 allocations demand that certain efficiencies be achieved in the area of current expenditure. These efficiencies will be delivered to ensure we live within our budget. I acknowledge the responsible role that has been played by the Green Party in recent times. As Deputies are aware, this is the Green Party’s first experience of government. It has had to take tough decisions and live with them. I am sure some of those decisions have not pleased its supporters. I acknowledge that it has done what is right, in the national interest. Members are aware that the Government has decided to restructure certain State agencies. Under the restructuring programme, the central and regional fisheries boards are to be replaced by a single national fisheries authority, in line with a recommendation made in the 2005 Farrell Grant Sparks report on the fisheries sector. This measure will promote greater flexibility in the use of inland fisheries resources and maintain a regional focus on such matters. The rationalis- ation will strengthen this valuable sector, which plays an important role as the guardian of our inland fisheries’ environment. Attention must turn immediately to the implementation of the Government’s policies in this area. It is obvious that such implementation will require new primary legislation, which will be drafted and enacted as soon as possible. In the meantime, the Minister and I want interim steps to be taken with a view to providing for a smooth transition to the new structure. I assure staff that the new structures will be designed to consoli- date and strengthen the service and improve its efficiency and effectiveness. Discussions on the implementation of this Government decision, and its implications, will take place in due course. The Minister, Deputy Ryan, and I will meet the chief executive officers of the fisheries boards tomorrow to initiate the transition process. I wish to mention the salmon hardship scheme in the context of the inland fisheries budget. By the end of this year, over \24 million will have been paid out under the scheme. The allocation for the scheme in the Department’s 2009 Vote is \4.7 million. When the payments which are due in 2010 are made, the \30 million hardship fund that was established by the Government will have been brought to a successful conclusion. I am pleased this year’s budget makes provision for the continuation of the national seabed survey, known as the INFOMAR project. The survey, which is being undertaken by committed and dedicated people, is produc- ing valuable and useful information. This important strategic programme provides vital baseline mapping for a range of offshore initiatives, such as the marine renewable energy developments which are supported by the Department of Communications, Energy and Natural Resources. It underpins activities such as offshore exploration, fisheries, aquaculture, aggregates and 91 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

[Deputy Sea´n Power.] safety. This project is acknowledged as being best practice worldwide and is carried out by the Geological Survey of Ireland in conjunction with the Marine Institute. It has been run very efficiently and within budget for its first three years. It is the envy of many countries around the world and we are aware of several that are trying to replicate what we are doing here. As Minister of State with responsibility for the knowledge society, I am acutely aware of the importance of encouraging people to participate in the knowledge society. What we call “e- inclusion” has the potential to be positive in many ways. Information and communication technologies have transformed the lives of many people and they make it easier, quicker and sometimes cheaper to access services. If we are to ensure that this country thrives again, it is necessary that we use information and communication technology in the best and most efficient way possible. As we develop such technology, it is important to ensure that nobody is left behind and that it is made available to everyone. That is why we are keen to see the roll out of broadband around the country. Only 18% of Irish people between 65 and 74 have used the Internet. Older people represent a key group that is in danger of being left behind in the knowledge society, and most do not have the experience of using technology and are not in a position to pay bills, book tickets on- line or avail of other advantages like the rest of us. Many of these people do not realise the extent of the potential benefits they are missing. That is something we want to change and I acknowledge the tremendous contribution that voluntary organisations are making around the country in educating older people in this area. We will be more than happy to continue our support for them in providing this technology.

Deputy Phil Hogan: I am glad to hear the Government is supporting the elderly. I wish to share time with Deputy Timmins and Deputy McCormack. It is often with trepidation I talk about a budget in the House, because I read the budget in the Evening Herald last year and this year, long before it was delivered in this House. No responsibility was taken and no inquiries were made about this, but in my time many inquiries were made about how such sources of information emerged.

Deputy Martin Mansergh: The Deputy has our sympathies.

Deputy Phil Hogan: I note the budget information was reported word for word. The hypoc- risy in this House from time to time is quite interesting. Deputy Mansergh also shed some crocodile tears about the over 70s and their medical cards. He has reflected the double speak that we will hear over the next few days until the Government has a rethink about this issue. There is no justification for getting this policy position wrong. People over 70 were automati- cally entitled to a medical card. It did not cost an awful lot of money. There are high rollers given tax exile status in Ireland who are well able to pay, but they have not been touched at all.

Deputy Sea´n Power: What is the Deputy’s definition of a tax exile?

Deputy Phil Hogan: It is in the Finance Bill, but I have not brought it with me. They are well off people and they are enjoying the status they have obtained, due to decisions made in the House with which I do not agree.

(Interruptions).

An Ceann Comhairle: The Deputy, without interruption.

92 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

Deputy Phil Hogan: The Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government throws money away on discredited voting machines at a cost of \52 million, as well as a cost of \500,000 per annum for storing them. Why not provide savings from the e-voting fiasco by financing better housing insulation through the warmer homes scheme that only got \1 million extra and thus save money on energy bills for those who participate in the scheme? What is stopping the Minister from selling off those machines? It has perplexed me and the rest of the public. Has he not received permission from Fianna Fa´il to do so? Why is that? The people of Ireland expected that the participation of the Green Party in Government would mean a genuine change in patterns of behaviour relating to the environment. We were told that the party had a solemn commitment in the programme for Government to a green energy revolution, that we could expect to see radical policies to tackle climate change and that the tax system was to be used to drive change and reduce our greenhouse gas emissions. We were all told that climate change is one of the most important issues to face the planet. However, all we have seen in this budget is a change in the tax code at the behest of the Green Party to provide relief to the purchase of a bicycle to the value of \1,000. The Green Party has signed up with Fianna Fa´il to increasing taxes on everything and on everyone, including the income of the lower paid, and on withdrawing medical cards from pensioners over 70 years of age. The Minister of State, Deputy Mansergh, mentioned the considerable progression of the 1% income levy that was implemented in 1983 and 1993 by successive Governments, in which the low paid were exempted. There was no question of doing that this time because the Minister for Finance needed the money. He took the easy option to tax everybody irrespective of means, including people on the minimum wage. I wonder how that will give people an incentive to work. The Green Party leader has justified his mantra of tax increases for commuters in this budget by extolling the decisions to raise motor tax, to raise tax on petrol, to impose car parking charges wherever he can, especially in the private sector, to introduce a new airport tax and to cut the public transport investment programme by \70 million. At a time when the people of the commuter belt are stressed enough, we are saddling about \2,500 in taxes per annum on families who are struggling to make ends meet. These are the coping classes of our country and they are certainly going to suffer as a result of these decisions. At a time of increasing costs in business and employment, Fianna Fa´il and the Green Party announce a car park levy of \200 for workers, but did nothing about the \9 million in expendi- ture for renting 4,000 spaces for public servants. Instead of starting with the private sector with a car parking levy, why not start with the public sector? The Minister should clarify to the House how this \200 per space scheme will be administered, because I believe that it will be an administrative nightmare. We would have looked very carefully at the need to introduce a scheme where we could save the taxpayer a considerable amount of money on spaces for public servants, rather than implementing it in a ham-fisted way in the private sector. The Minister should have aimed to make an impact on national carbon emissions. The national climate change strategy, revealed before the last general election, should be torn up at this stage. It is well out of date and the policies being pursued are doing nothing to hit the 3% average reduction in greenhouse gas emissions that was promised in the programme for Government. We could do a lot more by getting more buses on the road and by allowing bus competition. The buses are there, but the political will is not. We should not be scaling back on public transport investment programmes and cutting back on the national development programme, which we were told was sacrosanct by the then Minister for Finance before the 93 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

[Deputy Phil Hogan.] last election. We in Fine Gael have pointed out ways in which we can bring income into this programme, but that has been ignored by the current Minister for Finance. The Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government was quite boastful in the last budget about the level of support he was giving to the Environmental Protection Agency and the National Heritage Council, who were doing outstanding work. It is regrettable that he has agreed to impose substantial cuts in respect of those agencies in 2009. The Minister also spoke at length on the issue of public transport last month and stated that the Green Party’s priority was to invest heavily in public transport and away from roads. His comments in recent days suggest that he has given up on that priority as well. We all hear about plans for metro north and metro west, but we all know that these projects are being put back and will be staggered over a period of years rather than receive any meaningful expenditure in the short term. That may be the right thing to do, but we cannot promote public transport and implement policies for commuters when they have no option but to use a car. If the Minister, Deputy Gormley, and the Green Party get their way, those people will have no option but to go on a bicycle. That seems to be their priority. This budget has received a lot of air time and mileage in the media. A surplus of \3 billion was turned into a deficit of \16 billion in a matter of three years. People are asking where all the money went. Where did it all go wrong? We cannot blame international factors all of the time for the fact that we have such a gaping black hole in our nation’s finances. There was an opportunity over the past ten or 15 years to invest heavily to cure the deficits in our infrastruc- tural capacity and to build a platform of sustainability. The Government refused to do that because it was hell bent on making sure that the investors in housing stayed in the market place. The Government was hell bent on ensuring we had 25% of all our tax take in the construction sector. Many people have been disappointed by this budget with regard to the pupil-teacher ratio in education, cuts in the early retirement scheme and the farm installation aid scheme for young people in agriculture. There have been cutbacks in many of the promises that were made only a short time ago. I refer to the budget speech made by the then Minister for Finance, Deputy Brian Cowen, when he stated that the fundamentals of the economy were strong, that we were in a stable financial position, that the nation’s finances were on an even keel and that no adjustments were required. We now see that the chickens have come home to roost. The wrong emphasis and the wrong policies were pursued for short-term gain. In the run-up to the two elections in 2002 and 2007, the public expenditure which was out of control on those occasions brought about a situation where public servants were pumped into the Departments for politi- cal expediency. Those people are now coming under the microscope and will be taken out of the system by possible generous redundancy packages to be announced in due course. The question of public sector reform is an issue that is high in the minds of the Taoiseach, Deputy Cowen and the Minister of State, Deputy McGuinness who accused people of being square pegs in round holes. However, the budget speech contained nothing about public service reform. There were no plans announced to give people an incentive to give greater productivity in both the public and private sectors. This is the challenge for the future if we want to bring our nation’s finances back on an even keel. It is ironic and interesting that the problem for the Fianna Fa´il backbenchers of the over-70s medical card comes from the same ministry where in 2001 the Minister did not know the extent of the problem with regard to the financing of nursing homes. That Minister, Deputy Michea´l Martin, was a man who did not read his brief properly.

An Ceann Comhairle: Deputy Timmins has 12 minutes speaking time. 94 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

Deputy Billy Timmins: Is that 12 minutes for me?

An Ceann Comhairle: Yes.

Deputy Billy Timmins: This Government makes Houdini look like a one stroke banjo player. How it could turn a surplus of \3 billion into a deficit of \16 billion over a few short years and this is nothing short of remarkable. Perhaps when the Government Deputies, Fianna Fa´il, the Green Party, the Progressive Democrats and others, were giving a standing ovation to the Minister for Finance, Deputy Brian Lenihan, it may have been in recognition of how he perfor- med the magic trick of turning the finances around so quickly. During that standing ovation, I had in mind the images of polling day in 2002 and in 2007. I was outside the polling station in Greystones on both occasions. I observed the young people going in to vote for the Government. The people living in the Dublin commuter belt came in their droves in the last hours of polling day to vote for the Government during the good times. I had another image of the public spending for 2001 and 2006. There is a strong correlation between the outcome of those elections and the public spending in the years preceding them. In many respects this is a lucky Government. There is a current global crisis which in part disguises the mess the Government has made of the public finances. The Government has contributed greatly to the crisis by allowing a money bubble rather than a property bubble to exist and develop. We allowed a money bubble to develop by a failure to regulate and to take measures to deal with it. We failed to see what was coming down the line because we were too busy partying, too busy spending the public’s money. I read the first paragraph of the Taoiseach’s article in today’s newspaper. He wrote about the stark choices facing the public. We have always had choices and over the past 11 years this Government availed of the choice to spend like a drunken sailor as if there was no tomorrow. It is not as if people were not articulating an alternative view. My party leader, Deputy Enda Kenny and the finance spokesperson, Deputy Richard Bruton, have for the past six years outlined the dangers coming down the track but their voices were drowned out by the applause and the popping of champagne corks. The waste has been unbelievable and we have only seen the tip of the iceberg. The prog- ramme-makers in “Prime Time Investigates” need not worry about finding subject matter for several years, with PPARS and e-voting and many new projects coming on stream. My constituency has suffered as a result of the waste of public money. I am sorry that the Minister of State, Deputy Mansergh, has left the Chamber. He arrived in Arklow a few weeks ago to inspect the water. He was the fourth Minister over the past 11 years to inspect the flooded households in Arklow but nothing has been done. In 2002, the then Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government, Deputy Cullen, gave a commitment that if a scheme and a report were produced, funding would be available for flood relief but nothing has happened. The Minister for Transport, Deputy Dempsey, has withdrawn funding for the N11. The former Taoiseach gave a commitment in the weeks preceding the last general election that this very dangerous stretch of 11 km or 12 km from the Beehive pub to the Arklow bypass would be dealt with. This is one of the most dangerous stretches of road in the country where people have lost their lives. However, the work has been shelved. The commitment was given but it was broken. I will not list all the school building projects. One small rural school in Lacken was granted \800,000 to build a school. They employed architects, obtained planning per- mission and the agreement of local landowners but the project was shelved. The farming com- munity has been decimated. In the budget of 2001, the roll over relief and disease levies were 95 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

[Deputy Billy Timmins.] withdrawn and farmers reacted with a tractorcade. I am sure the farming community is feeling pretty sore this morning. Deputy Hogan alluded to the fact that most of the details of the budget appeared in the newspapers in days preceding its announcement. Before the Budget Statement was read, the Ceann Comhairle issued a warning that all the contents of the Minister’s speech were confiden- tial and should not be divulged outside the House until the Minister had delivered it. Yet, virtually every aspect of the budget had been available in the weeks beforehand. This gives me cause for concern because I am conscious of the strict rules about Cabinet confidentiality, as epitomised by the Ceann Comhairle’s warning, but these rules are completely blown away. I ask the Taoiseach to come to the House and along with the Minister for Finance, to outline how these details were made public. Mistakes have been made in the budget and these have been highlighted by many speakers. The Executive is too powerful in this Parliament. The Oireachtas has virtually no power because all power lies with the Executive. The Fine Gael finance spokesperson put forward proposals that the budget details should be debated beforehand and there was no debate on the Estimates this year. An open and frank debate is desirable. The confidentiality issue is clearly irrelevant because the information is given out to the media beforehand. If we had debated the issues the Government might not have run into the difficulty over the medical card issue. I am sure the vast majority of Members disagree with the proposal introduced by the Executive. It gives rise to a poor democracy when an Executive can overrule the views of the majority of the Parliament. Although I am not privy to what happens at the meetings of the parliamentary parties of this House, I could confidently predict that if there was an open vote on the medical cards issue it would not get through this House. We must examine this. Instead of investing all the power in the Executive, we should have a more open debate on such issues and the Government should be willing to chop and change. Budgets are about stark choices, especially this one. It did not have to be a stark choice. It was a stark choice because when the Government looked at two roads in a yellow wood it took the road that was more, not less, travelled by. It made no difficult decisions. It has bought and appeased the electorate over the past decade, bringing in many measures that were unsustainable in good or bad times. In many respects the medical card is a very emotive and serious issue. To me it is the red flag issue in this budget but it disguises very serious issues elsewhere. The 1% income levy is the most draconian measure in the budget. Let us assume the Government had to get the funding that would bring in. Why did it not develop it differently by starting the 1% at \40,000 or \45,000 and move on to 2% after \60,000 or \70,000? Someone on the basic industrial wage will be hit by a 1% levy. Despite claims that this budget protects the most vulnerable, the 1% levy does not; it treats rich and poor almost equally. The Government should have examined putting this on a band level, rather than the 1% catching everybody up to \100,000. It is completely unfair and I ask the Minister for Finance to go back and examine restructuring this 1% levy, notwithstanding that we on this side of the House do not agree with the increased taxes. The capital gains, the levy, DIRT, VAT and the increase in petrol tax will all contract the economy and help dampen consumer confidence. When we want to reward confidence, enterprise and innovation the Government has come with draconian measures to further sup- press the economy. Foreign affairs was one of the few areas that went untouched, albeit funding for overseas development aid was reduced. Tax relief has been provided for cycling to work. I questioned the Minister here and sought to provoke him into giving me an explanation on how this will operate. It sounds nice in the budget but I predict it will never come to fruition because it cannot be managed. How will we 96 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed manage a tax relief for cycling to work? I see Deputy Sargent coming in with his bicycle and holdall bag. I see Deputy Gormley hopping on his bicycle and coming into Government Build- ings. Conveniently he always seems to cycle towards the cameras. How will this operate? If a provision is in the budget the Government should be able to outline how it will operate, not say the Department is devising a system. How can one make an announcement without know- ing how it will operate? I will make another prediction: the \200 charge per car parking space will not come to fruition. It is virtually impossible to police and to draw up a guideline for it. There are many people in this city who go to work at certain times for whom there is no way to get to work other than by car. Again, I call on some Government speaker to outline how these proposals will be implemented. They cannot and will not. Those measures are there as a kind of psycho- logical sop to the green element of this budget. There have been massive increases in school transport, particularly at primary level but also at secondary level and this flies in the face of the so-called attempt to cut down on the use of private transport and use public transport. College registration fees have increased from \900 to \1,500. The Minister for Education and Science, Deputy Batt O’Keeffe, need not worry about reintroducing university fees because they are being brought in by the back and front doors. The first time I spoke on a budget here I welcomed certain aspects of it, but there is nothing in this budget I can welcome. It will help ensure the economy contracts further. It will dampen consumer confidence. Over the last year Fine Gael has outlined what should have been done through our document Recovery Through Reform. This Government has made one more mis- take and I only hope the public remembers what it has done. I will finish where I started, saying the Government put Houdini in the halfpenny place.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: This budget was brought forward by two months. It was a rush job and, like all rush jobs or rushed legislation, it turned out very badly. It is clearly a budget drawn up by civil servants. The Minister who presented it clearly did not understand it or its implications. I will cite some of the Minister’s indecisive waffle. About the public sector pay bill he said others might want to consider a pay cut. About spiralling HSE staffing levels he admitted that 1,900 administrative workers had joined the HSE, but offered no solutions. There were no measures on the decentralisation programme. He said he would decide on the future of the programme in 2011. There was no move on payments of child benefit. He said he would examine proposals the Commission on Taxation may have in this area. On student fees, the Minister, Deputy Brian Lenihan, said the Minister for Education and Science, Deputy Batt O’Keeffe, would draw up appropriate legislation to ensure students contribute to third-level education. It is all very vague. This is a lazy budget brought in by a lazy Minister who read out the script he was given. I will deal with a few points in the script, for example the 1% levy on all workers. This is a very unfair tax on the lower paid. If one earns \100 per week one pays 1% and if one earns \30 per week one pays the same proportion. That is very unfair. The 8 cent per litre tax on petrol is another anti-worker penalty and is a penalty on every worker driving to work. In areas such as Galway city people drive from a 50 mile radius from places such as Clifden, Lettermore, Carraroe and Clonbur. They have no other option. Deputy Gormley says they should cycle to work. It is much he knows about it. I would like to see him cycling from Clifden to work in Galway on a windy day. When they arrive in Galway to work at a factory, county council, hospital or school, the Government will charge them \200 for parking there. Another tax on the list is 4.5% added to their motor tax. It is a complete penalty on the worker driving to work. 97 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

[Deputy Pa´draic McCormack.]

I will deal with another list of charges in this budget. Accident and emergency charges are up \34 to \100. Charges for public beds in hospitals are up \9to\75. Charges for private beds in public hospitals are up by 20%. Long-stay charges are up by \31 to \151. Higher education registration fees are up from \900 to \1,500. The pupil-teacher ratio in primary schools has increased, although they are already over-crowded. This means pressure on teachers teaching in big classes. Medical cards for the over-70s will be means-tested, which I will deal with. Child benefit for over-18s is to be halved in 2009 and eliminated in 2010. Now for the cruellest decision of all: the withdrawal by means test of medical cards to over- 70s. They are the fathers and mothers who have built this country and who deserve more respect than they are given by this Government. In this budget the Government wants to penalise them for its mistakes. There is one more mean provision in the budget that will cost the over-70s \100 million per year, as well as the stress and worry about what will happen to them when they get sick or have to go to hospital. The over-70s have had the benefit and comfort of a medical card since 2001 and the Government wants to take it back. A good many years ago when I first started school we had a nursery rhyme in the school yard when a child gave one something and wanted to take it back after a couple of days:

Give a thing, take it back,

God will ask you, “Where is that?”

You will say you don’t know,

God will send you down below.

I could add another line to that rhyme:

And you know what I will say,

The electorate will send you on your way.

I am giving that message to the Government because that is the message I am getting. What will happen to those senior citizens approaching 70 or over 70 who have their life savings put by for a rainy day? Fearing the new means test, they will withdraw their savings, with all the added danger and worry that will bring. They will keep their savings in their homes because they will be means tested for the medical card. There was no need for the Government to make that decision. There were many other ways to save \100 million without launching this attack on a vulnerable section of our community who the Government promised would not be affected by the budget. It is no good for the Minister for Finance or the Minister for Defence to lay the blame for this on the Minister for Health and Children. This was a Government decision. Where is the collective Government responsibility in this matter? Where now stand the Government backbenchers who gave a standing ovation to the Minister at the end of his speech? They are now saying that they do not agree with this decision. However, they voted several times this morning to support that move and will be given the opportunity to vote on it when the necessary legislation comes before the House. I can tell them all they will be watched. I appeal to the Government to withdraw this measure. Information on the effect of the measure is being drip-fed to the public. Indeed, the entire budget is being drip-fed, with bits of information here and there and no coherence. I telephoned the HSE a number of times since the budget announcement but have not been able to obtain clear information on the 98 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed guidelines for the over-70s medical card. This is driving people silly. My office has been inun- dated with calls from people wanting to know how they stand with regard to the medical card. The Government is making it up as it goes along. That is just further proof that the Government does not know what it is doing. I appeal to the Minister to let common sense prevail on this matter and to ease the worries of our senior citizens, who deserve our support. They worked hard for this country in bad times to enable us, the generation that followed, to enjoy the good times that we have enjoyed in recent years. This is the most cruel aspect of the Minister’s budget. The Minister of State, Deputy Sea´n Power, asked the Opposition to be constructive, although he was not very constructive during his contribution. I will be constructive and outline what Fine Gael would do in these circumstances. My party took the unprecedented step, before the budget, of spelling out what we would do, were we in government, including implementing a 3% reduction in current spending for 2009, with the exception of the Department of Social and Family Affairs. We would impose a fee of \1.5 million on banks using the Government guaran- tee scheme. We would also freeze public sector pay and increments for 12 months for those earning over \50,000.

An Ceann Comhairle: The Deputy’s time has elapsed.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: My party would switch off the life support machine for the decentralisation programme, which the Government is still pursuing. We would eliminate 30 quangos and their annual budget of \50 million as well as incentivise research and development, upskilling and retraining programmes. We would double support for distressed home owners and increase the winter fuel allowance by 50%. That is what my party spelled out——

An Ceann Comhairle: The Deputy is way over time. We must move on.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: That is what we spelled out before the budget, which proves we were constructive in this matter.

Minister of State at the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment (Deputy Jimmy Devins): I wish to share time with the Minister of State, Deputy Barry Andrews. The future requires us to compete internationally in a global and increasingly knowledge- based world economy. It requires that we return to sustainable growth fuelled by our capacity to trade competitively by offering the world competitive and innovative goods and services. This budget sets us on that path. The pace of growing international competition has created pressure for greater efficiency, quality and productivity. We are in the midst of a difficult international financial situation, as we all know, but in such times, the pace of change and the demands of customers become even more important and require Irish business to be creative, flexible and adaptable. In response to competitive pressures of recent years, our economy has changed radically and continues to do so. It is with our eyes fixed firmly on the future needs of this country that the Government remains so committed to supporting Ireland’s capacity to compete as a know- ledge economy. As Minister of State with responsibility for science, technology and innovation, I strongly welcome the provision for science, technology and innovation provided in this year’s budget for the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment of \335 million, an increase of 3% on the 2008 allocation. We must appreciate that this allocation is over nine times what it was as recently as 2000 when we had an allocation of £27 million for Enterprise Ireland and an 99 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

[Deputy Jimmy Devins.] allocation of just £400,000 as a precursor investment to the establishment of Science Found- ation Ireland. I also welcome the allocation within the Department of Education and Science Vote of \265 million, an increase of 44%, for infrastructural investment for higher education, including additional capital funding for strategic research as part of the strategy for science technology and innovation, as announced in the budget. These allocations are synergistic and my assignment to both Departments as Minister of State reflects the critical whole-Government approach. Critically, this budget also enhances the fiscal environment for research and development in Ireland, a point to which I will return later. This budget and the Estimates announcement are the third in a series that clearly demon- strates the Government’s commitment to investment underpinning a clear and cohesive Government strategy for science, technology and innovation. This budget in particular, set as it is against the backdrop of extreme financial difficulties, sends the strongest signal possible of the determination of the Government to maintain the already substantial effort to build a knowledge economy in Ireland. The Government has placed research and development at the heart of its economic development strategy because the ability to create and exploit knowledge is an essential feature of an advanced economy. The level of support provided in the budget for the augmentation of research and develop- ment programmes sends a clear signal to Irish businesses that the Government is continuing to support their efforts to develop new products, to stay competitive and win new markets in a challenging environment. The process of developing and exploiting new ideas has a crucial role to play in bolstering Ireland’s economic and social advancement. The Government’s strategy for science, technology and innovation is driven by the principle that we must produce and attract world-class talent and have dynamic firms that use that talent to innovate and compete on world markets with world-class products and services. Wealth and employment creation in Ireland will be achieved in global markets by Irish companies that are operating at the cutting edge. The strategy has a strong focus on the role that research and development can play as a provider of innovative, market-led products and services that are essential for economic competitiveness and growth. We have committed the economy to a high level of investment in innovation in all its forms with the aim of making Ireland a dynamic, knowledge-driven economy. The Government sees this investment as a priority to underpin Ireland’s competitiveness in a knowledge-driven global economy and has delivered on this commitment in the budget. The investment provided for in the 2009 budget will continue to drive our targets under the Government’s strategy for science, technology and innovation. The funding will be used by the development agencies, Science Foundation Ireland and Enterprise Ireland and will be sup- plemented with IDA Ireland funding to increase in-company research and development; help small and medium enterprises to innovate and remain competitive; continue to build Ireland’s third level research base; strengthen collaboration between industry and the education sector; promote the commercialisation of research; and bring the outputs of Ireland’s growing research base to the marketplace. Three State agencies under the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment, namely IDA Ireland, Enterprise Ireland and Science Foundation Ireland, are responsible for delivering the science and technology strategy to the business and research communities. Funding is pro- vided for Science Foundation Ireland and Enterprise Ireland for research and development through the allocation of \335 million under subhead F of my Department’s 2009 Vote, while 100 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

IDA Ireland research projects, which are expected to involve support of about \50 million, is provided for separately under subhead D. Funding allocated to Enterprise Ireland will be used to transform research and development activity in enterprise to drive productive collaborations between industry and enterprise and secure the commercial potential of Ireland’s research community. In 2009, Enterprise Ireland will receive a science, technology and innovation budget increased by 1.5% over the 2008 level at \134.5 million. The funding allocation to Enterprise Ireland will enable the agency to focus on growing the quality and quantity of research and development performed in enterprise by supporting collaboration between its client companies and third-level institutions and maximis- ing the commercial outputs such as spin-out companies and intellectual property licences from the enhanced research activity in third-level institutions. Enterprise Ireland is charged with the particular responsibility of delivering support to Irish enterprises in what are termed “close to the market” activities. Enterprise Ireland will continue to work with industry and with the universities and institutes of technology to foster research and development activity through financial support and advisory assistance. This funding will build a robust research system and supports the efforts of the enterprise community to stay relevant and competitive in a harsher global environment. By encouraging greater investment in research and development and through building effec- tive collaboration between industry and third level research, small and medium enterprises in our country are helped to innovate and stay competitive. The development of an international reputation for familiarity with cutting edge technology means foreign direct investment com- panies are attracted to establish a research base here, often in collaboration with Irish home- grown companies. Science Foundation Ireland funding will increase by 4.3% to \191.5 million . The focus of Science Foundation Ireland is on research excellence to enhance Ireland’s human capital in strategic areas of scientific endeavour relevant to the future competitiveness of industry and enterprise. Since its establishment, the remit of Science Foundation Ireland has been in the areas of information and communications technologies and biotechnology. In May, its remit was expanded to include the area of sustainable energy and energy efficient technologies. Science Foundation Ireland will continue to add world-class principal investigators and their teams to those already established. Science Foundation Ireland will continue to support strategic partnerships between industry and academia through centres for science technology and engineering, referred to as CSETS, and strategic research clusters. These Science Foundation Ireland funded projects involve part- nerships with more than 300 distinct indigenous and multinationals companies. The rapidly growing reputation of Ireland’s research base and the availability of world-class researchers, high quality graduates and our increasing PhD output is greatly assisting IDA Ireland in winning highly competitive research investments for Ireland. In 2007, the IDA sup- ported 45 research and development projects and the figures for 2008 and 2009 are expected to be close to 60. Global leaders now choose this country as a location for cutting edge research and development activities, a testament to the Government’s foresight and clear evidence of the long-term dividend to Ireland of this investment. The companies established here during the past year include Business Objects, IBM, Boston Scientific, CITI, Pfizer and Houghton Mifflin Harcourt. It is critical that the fiscal environment encourages private sector investment in research and development and for this reason I strongly welcome and endorse increasing the research and development tax credit which can be offset against a company’s corporation tax liability from 20% to 25%. 101 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

[Deputy Jimmy Devins.]

This measure will enhance our competitiveness as a location for new internationally mobile research-related investment, and also encourage existing overseas and indigenous firms to add research functions to their operations in Ireland or to increase their level of research activity. This initiative is particularly significant for Ireland as the level of research and development undertaken by business here has traditionally been low for an economy whose output and exports are dominated by high technology sectors. Private sector investment in research and development has begun to increase significantly since the tax credit was first introduced in the Finance Act 2004. Research and development performed in the business sector rose to an estimated \1.56 billion in 2006, almost double the level recorded in 2000. While this represents a significant investment and achievement, unfortunately our level of expenditure is still below the OECD average of 1.54%. The Finance Act 2004 introduced a 20% tax credit, which is now 25%, for incremental expenditure on research and development. It also provided that where a company incurs expen- diture on the construction or refurbishment of a building to be used for research and develop- ment, the company is entitled to a tax credit on the cost of construction or refurbishment. The credit is in addition to any normal tax deduction available to a company for research and development expenditure and is additional to and complements the various direct research and development grant supports, which are also available through agencies. Subcontracting research and development work to unconnected parties qualifies under the tax credit scheme up to a limit of 10% of expenditure incurred by the company in any one year. This is also true of sums paid to a university or third level institution to carry out research and development, provided the amounts paid do not exceed 5% of the total expenditure incurred by the company on research and development. Investment in research and development helps us to compete in highly competitive global markets and grow quality employment and productivity in innovative firms. As we enter a difficult economic period and face higher costs, the need for firms to innovate and add value across all aspects of business is greater than ever. Past experience has shown us 5 o’clock that countries with long-term competitiveness have high levels of research and development and have dynamic firms which use their talents to innovate and compete on world markets with world-class products and services. There is clear and encourag- ing evidence that the investment being made is helping Ireland to compete. This is the route the Government must support so the Irish economy can return to export-led growth in the years ahead. I commend the budget to the House.

Minister of State at the Department of Health and Children (Deputy Barry Andrews): It is a great honour to speak on the budget for the first time as a Minister of State with responsibility for children and youth affairs. As Members know we presented the budget on Tuesday at an extremely difficult time for the Irish and global economy.

Deputy James Bannon: Brought about by Fianna Fa´il.

Deputy Barry Andrews: As I mention the global economy, Deputy Bannon should be aware this is not confined to Ireland and anybody who is not wearing blinkers like Deputy Bannon is fully aware of it. The Irish people are aware of it as are those with common sense. Some, like Deputy Bannon, would like to fool a few people with their narrow vision of what the problems are but most of us realise we are in a difficult time.

Deputy James Bannon: It was brought about by Fianna Fa´il and the Progressive Democrats. 102 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

Deputy Barry Andrews: We are taking prudent and sustainable decisions——

Deputy James Bannon: They squandered taxpayers’ money over the past decade.

Deputy Barry Andrews: ——and the budget rose to these challenges and well Deputy Bannon knows it.

Deputy James Bannon: They squandered the good times and never provided for the rainy day.

Deputy Barry Andrews: He is sore that he did not have an opportunity to do it himself and I am quite sure he never will have.

Acting Chairman (Deputy Charlie O’Connor): In time the Chair will protect Deputy Bannon but I ask him to allow the Minister of State to make his contribution.

Deputy Barry Andrews: I would like to outline the key aspects of the budget that impact on the Vote for my office as the Minister with responsibility for children and youth affairs. A key area of Government policy implemented by my office is the National Childcare Investment Programme 2006-2010, NCIP, which has a total allocation of \575 million over the period 2006- 10, of which \358 million is in respect of capital and \217 million is for current funding. This programme was launched in December 2005 as a successor programme to the equal opportunities child care programme which was introduced in 2000 and continued to operate until the end of 2007. The introduction of the NCIP at that time and its inclusion in the national development plan demonstrated a clear and ongoing commitment by the Government to meet- ing the needs of parents and their children for quality child care services. The commitment to the NCIP and to funding commitments until 2010 will continue to be met. However, in the context of a reduction in public expenditure during 2009 and 2010, it is considered appropriate to target the programme’s resources in a way which ensures the con- tinued delivery of quality child care services as well as ensuring sufficient resources to meet existing capital commitments. As a result, the current funding allocation of the national child- care investment programme is being sustained in 2009 at its full 2008 level of \73.578 million. This will enable my office to continue to support child care across the State, as well as providing sufficient funding for the community child care subvention scheme. This scheme enables dis- advantaged parents using community-based child care services to avail of reduced child care fees. There is already a significant commitment of over \50 million per annum to the com- munity child care subvention scheme from 2008 to 2010. The current funding allocation will be accompanied in 2009 by a capital allocation of \60 million. This capital allocation will meet the expected capital funding requirement expected to arise in 2009. Capital expenditure under the national childcare investment programme in 2008 is expected to amount to less than \80 million. Capital expenditure to develop a quality child care infrastructure will continue under the national childcare investment programme and grant applications will continue to be processed by my office. The intention is to extend the capital programme beyond its original timeframe of 2010. This approach was adopted under the Equal Opportunities Childcare Programme 2001-2006, which was extended by an additional year to 2007. This allowed the programme to provide additional flexibility to child care projects, in particular those in the community-based not-for-profit sector who qualify for large-scale grants of up to \1.2 million. These applicants generally require a significant period to bring their proposals for grant funding through to the point at which they are in a position to draw down funding. Extending 103 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

[Deputy Barry Andrews.] the timeframe for expenditure is also likely to bring each year’s allocation of funding more closely in line with the actual demand for grant draw-down each year, thereby ensuring all the capital allocation for that year is fully utilised. The national childcare investment programme is well on the way to achieving its targets of creating 50,000 additional child care places. A total of some \200 million has been approved to date in capital grant funding and will result in approximately 30,000 additional child care places being created and a further 44,000 existing places being supported. Over the next four years, I hope to see the programme’s capital allocation being fully utilised with many more capital projects approved and completed. In addition, more than \16.6 million is provided under national childcare investment prog- ramme current funding to support the network of 33 city and county child care committees and eight major child care organisations, such as the National Children’s Nurseries Association which I met today. The extension of the national childcare investment programme will continue this support during 2011 and 2012. The child care committees are an important support struc- ture for the implementation of the national childcare investment programme at local level and work closely with the child care organisations supported under the programme. As is the case across the board, in 2009 the support funding provided to the child care committees and the organisations, will be subject to a reduction of 3%. As the national childcare investment programme is expected to continue in place until the end of 2012, the review process proposed for 2010 to consider any successor programme is expected to be undertaken in 2012. In this regard, the development of future policy for early years care and education will benefit from the additional expertise which will be available to my office following the closure of the Centre for Early Childhood Development and Education. The location of this expertise within the early years policy unit of the Department of Edu- cation and Science, co-located in my office, will provide a clearer focus for early years care and development at central level. I have already asked officials in my office to draw up proposals which will ensure a more effective use of our existing framework and resources, taking account of the deployment of this expertise. A further important area of direct support which my office oversees for parents with young children is the early childhood supplement. The supplement was introduced in 2006 as an additional and direct quarterly payment, in arrears, of \250 per quarter, or \1,000 per annum, to parents of children aged under six years. This payment was increased in January of this year by 10%, bringing it to a payment of \275 per quarter, or \1,100 per annum. This payment will continue to be made to assist parents with the high costs associated with caring for young children in their preschool years. Arising from the budgetary changes which have been introduced, with effect from January 2009, the supplement will move to monthly payments. This change should make it easier for parents to manage their ongoing costs in providing for the care of their children, many of which are incurred on a monthly basis. As a result of this change, parents will receive a supplement payment for January 2009 in February and so forth rather than having to wait for the three payments to be made as one single payment in April. As the monthly payment will be rounded up to \92, the annual pay- ment will increase to \1,104. It is proposed to have the payments made to parents on the second Monday of each month. As the supplement was implemented as a quarterly payment, it was decided that the quar- terly payment in respect of the final quarter of each year, October to December, would be paid in December rather than January. As the payment from January 2009 will be made on a 104 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed monthly basis, the question of making an advance payment for the final quarter will not arise. As a result, a once-off saving to the Exchequer amounting to \40 million is expected to arise in 2009. In addition, as a quarterly payment, despite being a payment made in arrears, the decision was taken to assist parents during the first quarter of their child’s life. As a result, parents received the payment in respect of both that first quarter and the quarter in which their child ceased to qualify. As a monthly payment, and like child benefit, this issue will not arise. This is expected to result in an annual saving to the Exchequer of \18 million. Savings arising from moving the early childhood supplement to a monthly payment have made it necessary to introduce a further budgetary change to the scheme. This is expected to yield a further saving of \35 million in a full year. This saving will be made from the reduction of the period for which children qualify for the payment, from zero to six years to zero to five years and six months. This change has been introduced having regard to the fact that the early childhood supplement was introduced as an additional, targeted measure supporting parents caring for young children in their preschool years. In general, children start primary school at the age of four or five years and their parents will continue to receive early childhood supplement payments for them during this period. Given that the compulsory age to commence primary school is six years, all children aged more than five and a half years in September of each year, are school-going. This measure is not, therefore, expected to impact significantly on parents of preschool children. An increased resource allocation of just over \3 million is being made available from the dormant accounts fund to support a range of targeted measures for children and young people. The additional funds, bringing the total allocation to \6.15 million in 2009, will assist in support- ing the continuation of the prevention and early intervention programme and the implemen- tation of the national play and recreation policies. The prevention and early intervention programme, initially announced in 2006, is primarily aimed at promoting better outcomes for children through innovation and improved planning, integration and delivery of services. The programme uses international evidence of what works to support activities chosen. This requires a range of statutory and non-statutory agencies, working across sectors, to collaborate in both service design and interagency delivery. The programme is being managed by my office and the administration of funds overseen by it. It will run for five years with a fund amounting to \36 million in total, of which \18 million is being provided by the Government and the balance by The Atlantic Philanthropies. The Government agreed the best use of this funding would be to focus initially on a small number of projects in severely disadvantaged areas. Accordingly, the funds have been committed to projects in Ballymun, west Tallaght and Darndale-Belcamp based on plans drawn up over a two-year period by local statutory and community bodies. Some \4.9 million has been allocated to this programme in 2009. Initially, we will focus on a small number of projects. In general, service implementation for the three projects will typically require action among a range of local service providers in collaboration with their local communities. This will entail a range of statutory and non-statu- tory agencies, working across sectors, collaborating in both service design and interagency delivery. A key element of the programme will be the ongoing monitoring and evaluation of both the outcomes of the activities undertaken and learning from the individual projects. This will provide an important input to policy and service development. If these projects prove successful, the results will provide the basis for policy changes which will improve the outcomes for every child. 105 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

[Deputy Barry Andrews.]

There has been growing recognition in recent years of the importance of play for children’s development. Ready, steady, play, the national play policy launched in 2004, aims to improve the lives of children through creating more and better public play facilities for them. To date over \28 million has been expended on improving play infrastructure. This has resulted in an increase from less than 200 to over 500 playgrounds with a further 116 planned over the next two years. I am pleased to say that the additional resources being made available in 2009 through the dormant accounts fund will provide \300,000 towards the playbus scheme, initiated this year in the national play policy. The scheme is intended to provide interventions that support the family unit, particularly those parents and children experiencing social exclusion, through play development and parenting development outreach services in disadvantaged and isolated areas. The funding measure aims to provide a play area for children to support spontaneity and creativity, and a resource area on the bus for parents and guardians in order to support skills development. A resource allocation was made available to cover costs associated with the adaptation and/or purchase of a bus to meet agreed standards suitable for play for children and for the provision of parenting supports. In building on the success of the national play policy, which was instrumental in improving the national play infrastructure for children in Ireland, Teenspace — A National Recreation Policy for Young People was launched in September 2007. The policy provides a strategic framework for the promotion of positive recreational opportunities aimed principally at young people aged 12 to 18. The launch of the policy highlighted the Government’s commitment to the development of youth cafe´s. In this regard, a sum of \750,000 is being made available in 2009 to support the development of a structured youth cafe´ programme for young people. There are already a number of youth cafe´s in operation around the country. Funding for these existing initiatives is provided through a number of bodies, including local city and county councils and the Health Service Executive. The Department of Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs also operates a number of relevant funding programmes aimed at supporting community development, locally based community and voluntary groups, as well as programmes aimed specifically at supporting projects for disadvantaged youth. At this stage, the focus is to bring better coherence to the approach taken to date, retaining the strong inter-agency element and identifying an appropriate model or models for youth cafe´s for future development. In recent months my office has undertaken a small survey of some of the existing cafe´s looking at mission statements, objectives, management and organisation, service levels and the role played by young people. The National Children’s Advisory Council recently completed research on the development of a youth cafe´ model and the report is currently under consideration. This work will guide the Government in ensuring that funding is targeted and co-ordinated most effectively on a model or models of youth cafe´s which meet the needs identified by young people themselves. Dis- cussions are under way with relevant Government Departments regarding a youth cafe´ prog- ramme and appropriate funding mechanisms. Consideration is being given as to which agency could best lead on the programme and how to ensure any funding which might be made avail- able will augment, without displacing, the existing inter-agency resources. A sum of \8.114 million is being made available in 2009 to support costs associated with the national longitudinal study of children in Ireland, and a range of other programmed activities by my office to support the implementation of the three goals of the national children’s strategy. My office is fully committed to implementing goal one of the strategy, which states, “Children 106 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed will have a voice in matters which affect them and their views will be given due weight in accordance with their age and maturity.” Goal two of the national children’s strategy provides that “Children’s lives will be better understood; their lives will benefit from evaluation, research and information on their needs, rights and the effectiveness of services.” This goal is to achieve a better understanding of how children grow up in Ireland, including both their individual and shared needs. “Growing Up in Ireland” is the Government’s landmark national longitudinal study of chil- dren in Ireland and is the most important of its kind ever to take place in this country. The study will follow the development of two different age groups of children: 10,000 nine-month- old infants and 8,500 nine-year-old children, thus yielding important information about each significant transition throughout their young lives. “Growing Up in Ireland” reached its first major milestone in September 2008 by completing the first wave of data collection. The funding provision to support the study in 2009 is \4.852 million. A sum of \3 million has been allocated to support costs which may arise in connection with the holding of a constitutional referendum on children’s rights in 2009. The joint committee submitted an interim report to the Oireachtas on 11 September 2008, which recommended that the Government establish a statutory scheme for Garda vetting, for the regulation of the collation, exchange and deployment of hard and soft information for the purpose of child protection. I am glad to see that the committee is making such rapid progress on achieving consensus on these complex issues. As regards the rationalisation of agencies and further to the OECD report on public sector reform, the Children Acts Advisory Board, CAAB, is to be subsumed into my office. I take this opportunity to thank the staff of CAAB for all the work they have done since the board’s establishment, in particular, Ms Jacinta Stewart and Mr. Aidan Browne. I commend the budgetary measures to the House.

Deputy Martin Ferris: I wish to share time with Deputy O´ Snodaigh.

Acting Chairman: Is that agreed? Agreed.

Deputy Martin Ferris: The first measure I wish to note in the budget is the 13% cut in the allocation to the Department of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food. Almost the entire burden of that cut falls on the programme side of that Department. The largest cut in administration is to laboratory equipment, which presumably reflects the curtailing of research and training where the allocation is down by over \5 million. The closing off of the early retirement scheme and installation aid for young farmers rep- resents a saving of over \9 million. That is certain to have a malign impact on those farmers in the process of transferring responsibility for the family farm. It may be a small cut in the overall scheme of things, but it is significant nonetheless. Earlier I was contacted by the chair- person of the IFA in Kerry. He brought to my attention the impact these cuts would have on one family farm over a ten-year period which, with the early retirement scheme — plus instal- lation aid, transferred to his younger son — amounts to \165,000. Where is the incentive for an elderly farmer to hand the farm over to a son or nephew, as has been the case in recent years due to the early retirement scheme, if that is no longer the case? All it will do is ensure that will not happen. It will be totally counterproductive. However, it is in the area of programmes designed to develop the farming and fisheries sectors that the axe has fallen most heavily. Teagasc, in particular, has played an invaluable role in providing up-to-date research and practical support for farmers. At a time of radical change within the sector, which is subject to the pressures of structural change and challenges 107 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

[Deputy Martin Ferris.] presented by the reformed Common Agricultural Policy, in addition to facing possible further changes under the health check, it is vital that the research and development resource, mainly centred on Teagasc, is capable of rising to those challenges. Much has been said about the potential for farmers to expand into new areas of production, such as energy crops. While that potential exists, the level of participation to date has been low. That is why it is all the more important to encourage this through the provision of infor- mation and practical assistance. The cuts made in Teagasc will severely curtail that ability. Some will defend the cuts on the basis that savings need to be made. In reality, however, by reducing the research and development capacity of the sector one is actually creating further negative impacts downstream. In a period of international economic recession and the pressures placed on an economy such as Ireland’s by the vagaries of international fuel supplies and costs, it makes sense to ensure that we will have a viable domestic renewable energy sector based on the processing of crops suitable for the production of biofuels. Apart from the issue of supply, investment in that sector, which includes the grant scheme for growing energy crops, can help to stimulate pro- duction and processing, thereby creating new indigenous enterprise and employment. A short- term saving is, therefore, closing off a potential avenue to encourage localised economic growth. However, as Deputy Morgan stated in his reply to the budget, that is applicable to other sectors as well. There is clearly a strong argument for using the relatively healthy position of the State regarding foreign debt to borrow, if the money borrowed is used to stimulate the domestic economy and concentrate more on indigenous enterprise, rather than the increasingly precari- ous world of foreign direct investment. While reading some of the submissions to the report compiled by the Committee on Agri- culture, Fisheries and Food, I was struck by references to that issue. For example Tuatha Chiarraı´ Teoranta’s submission made the point that while 21% of those in employment in Kerry are working in IDA supported firms, Leader-supported enterprises actually employ more people in the county and have a 70% success rate. That figure is even more remarkable given that Leader does not take in the whole county. That indicates that the Leader programme has succeeded in identifying indigenous enterprise that is not only effective in providing jobs and profits, but is for the most part sustainable. That clearly points to the opportunity that exists in promoting such enterprise on a wider scale and perhaps shifting some of the resources targeted through IDA Ireland at foreign business into the domestic sector, particularly at a time when there are grave concerns over the security of many of the jobs currently in foreign- owned businesses and especially those most vulnerable to the current financial crisis. Such a shift in policy could have been made part of the strategy that underlies this budget, if one exists, but it should certainly have informed official thinking on the economy over the prosperous years of the Celtic tiger when successive Governments and successive Ministers for Finance had the luxury and the revenue flow to attempt a different approach, namely, to address the imbalance in the economy in favour of foreign direct investment supported by public money. Another proposal which Sinn Fe´in made in our pre-budget submission, referred to by Deputy Morgan in his speech, is that in return for the State’s intervention to support the banking sector through the Credit Institutions Bill, the State should take a stake in the Irish banks which, in combination with a levy on their turnover or profits, would ensure that the State is adequately compensated for its provision of such a vital service to the private banking sector. The notion of bailing out banks is far from popular with many people who have been sup- porting the banks most generously for a number of years through mortgage and loan repay- 108 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed ments, not to mention random and regular increases in alleged service charges. The notion of the State intervening in such a way would have been unthinkable up to a few weeks ago, but several states have gone further than the Government in doing what we propose, in taking a stake in those institutions, even to the extent of effectively taking them into state ownership. Not only would our proposal provide a guarantee of a future payback, assuming the banks recover, but it would also provide the State with leverage on some of the issues to which I referred, including bank charges, the way in which they handle credit and mortgages and the large dividends that accrue to top bank officials and major shareholders. The fact that governments, which are far from being ideologically disposed to nationalising or taking a major stake in the banking system, have proceeded in that direction is an illustration of the seriousness of the crisis and there is nothing to prevent the Government from taking such steps. Indeed, there are good precedents from the history of the Fianna Fa´il Party for such bold interventions. The Minister referred on Tuesday in his opening remarks to the role played by the Sea´n Lemass led Government in the late 1950s in attempting to stimulate econ- omic development. He could have gone further back to the 1930s when his party also gave the State a leading role in such matters. The reason they did so was not that they were ideologically committed to State-led develop- ment but to compensate for the failures of native capitalism and capitalists who, as the late Kevin Boland once said, thought that patriotism consisted of breeding the winner of the English Derby. The people who had money in this country in those days — their successors are among our current banking dynasties — simply had no interest in this State. They much preferred to invest their money in the London Stock Exchange than provide much needed capital for indus- trial development here, so successive Governments had to compensate for that through State investment and attracting foreign investment. In the banking system in this State and further afield the priority is to maximise profit only and the banks have no scruples in playing roulette with hard-earned savings of decent people or in abusing the victims of their scrupulous greed. Now the same people have landed them- selves in a terrible mess, after a period in which they got more than their fair share of the wealth produced during the boom years. They ought to be damn grateful, therefore, to the people for helping them out of this jam, something few bankers are willing to do when the boot is on the other foot. We have seen daily the repossession of homes of people who were experiencing difficulty in repaying their mortgages, but no such flexibility or sympathy is shown to them. In case the bankers forget about us, the best way to ensure a return is surely for the State to take an active stake in the Irish banks and ensure that part of their profits will flow back into the Exchequer. If the State takes a substantial stakeholding and imposes a levy, hundreds of millions of euro would accrue to the State. The relevance of that in the current budget is obvious as it would mean that many of the inroads into ordinary people’s standards of living made this week would not be necessary. Instead of having to save \100 million by denying people over the age of 70 a medical card, the State, while at the same time underwriting the private banks, could ensure a revenue income far in excess of that brought about by attacking the most vulnerable in society. This is the most disgraceful measure taken since I came into this House. Many people today and yesterday withdrew their savings from the banks for fear of losing their medical card. Many had health insurance up to the age of 70 and then, having had the comfort of knowing that their health would be protected by the medical card, find themselves today between a rock and a hard place. The Government must revisit this matter and look at the enormous pain and anxiety being caused to the elderly in society. It is a shame that a government would attack the most vulner- 109 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

[Deputy Martin Ferris.] able in society as this Government has done this week. I know full well from backbench Deputies on the Government side of the House that they have been inundated with telephone calls from the elderly all over the country. These are people at the end of their lives who have supported this State, who have built this State and who contributed to the Exchequer in recent decades and they now find themselves victims of a greedy unscrupulous Government which mismanaged the economic boom. It squandered billions of euro, yet penalises the most vulner- able, the poor and the aged. The 1% levy applies effectively down the line to people on the minimum wage and below it. Whereas the 2% levy means absolutely nothing to multi-millionaires, the 1% levy is a signifi- cant imposition on the most vulnerable in society. Fianna Fa´il once stated it was the party of the poor, but it is now, with the Green Party, the party of the rich. Robbing the poor to support and pay the rich is what was done in this budget. I spent half of this morning in contact with farmers all over my county and, indeed, in other parts of Munster. They are devastated with the significant cuts to the Department and to the future of Irish farming. The Government has almost written off the fishing industry. What has happened and what has been done here this week is a shame. It is the worst undertaking that I have ever seen a government attempt. The Minister stated that he personally believes senior bankers should receive no more than \500,000 per year, and here we have the Government penalising old age pensioners. Surely in the current situation, with the Irish taxpayers basically saving their necks, he might do more than hint. After all, the Minister did not hint to the over 70s that they might not be entitled to a medical card, nor did he hint to people on the minimum wage that they might like to pay tax, which is what the income levy is. Indeed, if one misses a mortgage repayment or a loan repayment the banks do not send a letter hinting that you might like to catch up on it whenever you feel like it. They send a solicitor’s letter stating that they are foreclosing on your mortgage and repossessing your property. No one denies we are in a crisis that requires addressing, but while we are doing so we must ensure that those who have benefited most from the good times and those whose greed was in large measure responsible for ending the good times pay their fair share, and not place the burden on those who even in the best of times were struggling, such as people on low wages, the elderly and working class people employed by those such as developers who made vast profits. The elderly are now to be denied a medical card as well. This budget, what has been proposed and what has been done in the past couple of weeks in this House has done nothing for the betterment of the people most in need in our society and in our communities.

Deputy Aengus O´ Snodaigh: Is trua nach bhfuil nı´os mo´ ama agam mar ta´ muid ag de´ilea´il le buise´ad ata´ chomh dona sin gur cho´ ir du´ inn mionscru´ du´ a dhe´anamh air. Is ar e´igean a bhfuil aon rud maith sa bhuise´ad, rud no´ dho´ anseo agus ansiu´ d, ach seachas sin is ceann de na buise´id is measa riamh e´. Tuigimid ar fad go bhfuil cruacha´s ann faoi la´thair, ach bhı´ seans ag an Aire athruithe bunu´ sacha a dhe´anamh i dtaobh maoiniu´ na n-eagras deonacha timpeall na tı´re. D’fhe´adfadh se´ difrı´ocht mo´ r a dhe´anamh do´ ı´bh siu´ d ata´ bocht no´ i gcruacha´s. Sa tslı´ sin d’fhe´adfadh se´ athru´ a dhe´anamh o´ n bun anı´os agus cuidiu´ leis na daoine is leochailı´ sa tı´r. Nı´ dhearna se´ sin. Uair amha´in eile ta´ an Rialtas tar e´is buise´ad a thabhairt isteach a thugann bunta´istı´ don lucht saibhir. Over the last three days my colleagues have dealt in detail with various aspects of this bad budget. I will not repeat what they have said. As Sinn Fe´in spokesperson on justice, equality and human rights, I will focus on those areas. What does the budget mean for equality and human rights and the organisations that promote them? It is a roll back from where we had 110 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed reached as a society. Progress had been made but it will be undermined and those groups who are most vulnerable to discrimination will become more vulnerable as a result. What does the budget’s rationalisation of State agencies mean for equality and human rights? The Combat Poverty Agency, a protector of the poor, has been axed. The Equality Authority and Human Rights Commission, and their facilities, back office, administrative services and access for citizens, are to be fully integrated. This is combined with a budget cut of over \3 million. The two organisations had an allocation between them of \8 million in 2008, so there is a 40% cut in funding. The Government claimed it had withdrawn its proposal during the summer to merge the two agencies, but the consequence of this budget is akin to an amalgama- tion which, with the budget cut, will dilute the ability of these important watchdogs to carry out their functions and will restrict their activities. What did the Human Rights Commission do to deserve such an assault on its budget and independence? It put Government complicity with serious human rights abuses under the spot- light. Its recent report on extraordinary rendition and Shannon Airport springs to mind. What will the 43% cut in funding to the Equality Authority mean? The ESRI has demonstrated that just 6% of those who report discrimination make a formal complaint or take legal action. In 2007, the Equality Authority dealt with 737 case files, yet that represented only a fraction of those who contacted it for assistance. The 43% cut means that the gap between the high level of need in seeking redress against discrimination and the level of advocacy available will grow even further. There is a 5% cut in funding for the free legal advice centres. Some might consider that small but given that the centres were already underfunded it means important legal rights to equality will simply not be realised. The budget means that important cases will not be brought before the courts to protect fundamental public interest issues. Public interest cases that high- light and force progressive changes to legislation and policy might never be taken. Cases that oppose discrimination on age grounds, such as the prohibition on persons over 70 serving on juries, cases that oppose physical barriers to persons with disabilities, such as the failure of pubs and hotels to provide accessible toilets, cases that force the provision of education to children with special needs and cases aimed at achieving legal recognition for transsexual people might never be taken if the Minister proceeds with this punitive budget cut. The budget jeopardises the future of public interest legal activism. It means that more people, who are by definition vulnerable because their fundamental rights have been compromised, will have to fight their battles alone, if at all. The Children Acts Advisory Board is to be subsumed into the Office of the Minister for Children. This is regrettable as the independence of this important statutory body may be compromised. Hopefully, it will not. The Minister has the best interests of children at heart but it is often difficult for an organisation or body that is subsumed into the Department to have the same independence. I notice a theme to the Government’s rationalisation agenda — it is to sideline or subsume oversight functions. With regard to funding for disabilities under the Department of Justice, Equality and Law Reform Vote, there are cuts across the board and in terms of service delivery. The Minister for Health and Children, Deputy Mary Harney, has also announced monumental cuts. In 2005, the Government detailed a multi-annual funding package which committed \50 million to dis- ability and mental health services. This was a sop to make up for its refusal to give services as a right to the disabled. However, only \10 million is being allocated in budget 2009. This reduction is additional to the \83 million earmarked for these services but which were redirected elsewhere in the black hole of the HSE last year. As was highlighted by the Disability Federation of Ireland, the impact of the promised \10 million will be wiped out by the 1% cut 111 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

[Deputy Aengus O´ Snodaigh.] in the funding allocation for voluntary service providers, which was announced by the HSE earlier this year. Deputy Finian McGrath, who is propping up this Government, should take note of my remarks. Funding related to gender equality and women’s issues is also to be cut. Grants to national women’s organisations are down 5% and funding for equality proofing is down 30%. Interestin- gly, funding for the new COSC office to address domestic, sexual and gender based violence is down 18%, while funding for equality monitoring is down 8% and funding for gender main- streaming and positive action for women is down 45%. This is happening at a time when the gender pay differential remains high, women still get sacked for being pregnant, the rate of attrition for sexual offences is unrivalled and domestic violence continues to be a common occurrence. The right to privacy and to the protection of one’s identity is also on the chopping block. Resources for the Office of the Data Protection Commissioner are being cut by 9% despite weekly revelations of departmental laptops going missing, failures by Departments, State agen- cies and private companies to encrypt sensitive personal data and Garda warnings of identity theft. Ever greater quantities of personal data are being retained by more agencies, from more people, for longer periods. Data is being transferred across borders at an unprecedented rate without adequate protection. To pare back resources for this office is to expose innocent people to serious risks with little hope of redress. Another victim of the budget in the human rights area is the Garda Ombudsman Com- mission. The various reports published this year, including the Morris reports and Hartnett report, demonstrate the indispensability of an effective and independent mechanism to deal with complaints made against the Garda Sı´ocha´na. The Garda Sı´ocha´na Ombudsman Com- mission is vital to the recovery of public confidence in the Garda, to the prevention of Garda abuses and to redress where they occur. As a result of inadequate funding the commission is not capable of carrying out its mission. The 5% cut to its budget will compound the problem. It has been so under-resourced that it has been mooted that proposals have been made to lease back responsibility for investigation to the Garda itself. This must not happen. The commission was set up because the existing body, the Garda Complaints Board, was so ineffective as to warrant no expenditure. The Government should increase funding for the commission substan- tially for the good of communities and for the force itself. I will turn now to the speech of the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform, Deputy Dermot Ahern. Yesterday in the Da´il he engaged, not for the first time, in the worst type of gutter politics and used parliamentary privilege to repeat lies published in a Sunday newspaper. I remind the Minister that Sinn Fe´in is the only party to publish its audited accounts on an annual basis. It is Sinn Fe´in that has been calling on the Government to publish legislation to compel political parties to publish their accounts. Fianna Fa´il has rejected this. Where are the Fianna Fa´il accounts? Why is it afraid to publish them? Who are the people filling the coffers of the Fianna Fa´il party? Should we just look to those who benefited most from the most recent budgets? Sinn Fe´in will not take any lectures from a Minister in a Govern- ment that has just condemned, in the budget, the most vulnerable people in our society to pay for its economic incompetence. It is not just a reaction to a global economic downturn because particular problems have arisen in Ireland as a result of economic incompetence on the part of successive Fianna Fa´il-led Governments. Aside from that nonsense, the Minister had precious little to say for himself and on behalf of his Government yesterday. He had nothing to say about the implications of the budget for equality and human rights, the implications of which I have just outlined. He could not defend 112 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed the indefensible. He did say that his “greatest priority is the fight against crime” and that this was why he “put the money where it should be”. I beg to differ. Crime prevention measures are being cut by a whopping 32%. The Minister has made much in recent months of his so-called victims initiative. Rather than attacking long-established and fundamental due process rights, he would do better reducing the number of victims in the first instance through investing in the prevention of crime. Ultimately, investing in crime prevention would more than pay for itself. The prisons budget is to remain unnecessarily high. Had the Government progressed the long-promised enforcement of fines Bill instead of kicking it to touch, as it did again by way of the legislative programme, spending on prisons could have been greatly reduced. That Bill could have provided alternatives to incarceration for the non-payment of fines. Community service orders cost a fraction of their custodial equivalents and have also been proven to more effectively prevent re-offending, thereby offering the potential of significant savings. Instead, the Government dumped that Bill from the legislative programme for this session and is now cutting the allocation for probation services for offenders by 7% and for the probation and welfare service as a whole by 3%. This is a foolish and expensive policy choice. The Govern- ment has consciously chosen to pursue this costly and ineffective approach to crime with tax- payers’ money, which is criminal. I would like to have had the time to address the scandalous cuts associated with medical cards. Drugs are at the root of so much crime that any effective approach is necessary. It is a testament to the failure of the Government that cuts in the order of 5% are to affect the drugs initiatives and young people’s facilities and services fund at a time when drugs are becoming increasingly rampant. The funding should have been increased by 100% or 200%. Not doing so demonstrates how ineffective and stupid the Government is in its approach to the budget. I condemn it.

Minister of State at the Department of the Environment, Heritage and Local Government (Deputy Michael P. Kitt): I wish to share my time with Deputy Cyprian Brady and the Minister of State at the Department of Foreign Affairs, Deputy Peter Power.

Acting Chairman: Is that agreed? Agreed.

Deputy Michael P. Kitt: I am glad of the opportunity to speak on the budget. There was a general welcome for the fact that it has been brought forward to address matters in a decisive manner. There is need to restore order and stability in the public finances and that is why it was announced on 14 October this year. We are confronted with severe budgetary pressures and negative economic growth and need to——

Deputy James Bannon: Whose fault is that?

Deputy Michael P. Kitt: ——pursue prudent and sustainable policies that will help us through this extremely challenging period. I particularly welcome the fact that the Department of the Environment, Heritage and Local Government is continuing to prioritise areas in which I have responsibility, including fire services, the rural water programme and library services. The fund- ing provisions reflect continued Government support for these very important areas. There is an increased allocation for the Department’s water services investment programme. In respect of the rural water programme, there will be an ongoing campaign to provide all group schemes with quality water supplies. We will continue to push this forward in 2009 and the years thereafter. Funding for water services will consolidate the substantial advances being 113 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

[Deputy Michael P. Kitt.] made with the provision of new treatment facilities for sub-standard group water schemes and will ensure further improvement in compliance with drinking water standards in 2009. I wel- come this in particular because the water supply in County Galway has been the focus of much criticism recently. The objective of the current rural water programme is to provide all group water schemes falling within the remit of the drinking water directive with a quality treated water supply. The rural water programme is being implemented under a partnership framework involving the National Federation of Group Water Schemes, rural organisations, including the IFA, ICMSA and ICA, and local authorities and the Department of the Environment, Heritage and Local Government. I commend all the organisations, which have worked so closely to meet the targets under the programme. Capital funding of \135 million has been provided for the water programme in 2008 and there are now over 5,500 group water schemes throughout the country. Some 728 of the schemes use private water sources and, where they do not have proper water treatment and disinfection equipment, an upgrade is possible under the rural water programme. Of the 728 group water schemes, 545 have been completed to date and 87 are under way. Other schemes are in the planning stage and will begin in 2009, which I very much welcome. The rural water programme comprises a number of measures. Group water schemes consti- tute the first and involve the provision of a supply for new groups, the treatment of water in existing schemes, the provision of connections to the local authority mains and, importantly, the taking in charge of schemes by local authorities. The programme also includes group sewer- age schemes and small public water and sewerage schemes, with a particular focus on their upgrade. Where there is neither a public nor a group scheme, grants are available to individual houses from local authorities to assist with the provision or upgrade of their water supply. I very much welcome the increases provided under all the headings pertaining to the rural water programme. I launched the national fire safety week on Monday, 6 October in the Dublin Fire Brigade training centre in Marino. The launch was a joint venture with the Northern Ireland Fire and Rescue Service. The theme of the week was “Fire safety is your safety”. Some key messages were emphasised at the launch, particularly that there are still homes without working smoke alarms and that a routine fire safety check only takes a few minutes but could mean the differ- ence between life and death. The event was well advertised in the media, particularly on RTE’s “The Afternoon Show” and “About the House”, and fire safety leaflets, booklets and posters were supplied to fire authorities throughout the country. Unfortunately, on average 46 people die in Ireland each year from fire, with house fires accounting for the majority — more than 90% of fire fatalities. In most of these incidents, a level of fire safety education and awareness could have prevented the loss of life in a fire or limited the damage. At the end of September I launched a fire safety DVD for primary schools entitled “Tintea´n Sla´n” or “Safe Fireplace” at Galway Educate Together primary school. The DVD contains five stories with specific messages on different aspects of fire safety and a demonstration on how a school fire drill should be carried out. I am glad to note the DVD will be distributed directly to every primary school in the country in the coming weeks. Through this programme children will learn to protect themselves and others from the terrible consequences of fire. The material is suitable for middle and senior classes but can also be used for first and second class. The Department has given much attention to the fire services programme. We want to main- tain a modern and well-equipped fire service, which is essential to safeguarding and protecting the community. The service is operated at local level through 37 fire authorities. 114 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

The Government has overseen substantial capital investment of more than \174 million in the fire and rescue services in the past decade, and this investment programme will be main- tained in the coming year. The capital provision of \23 million in 2009 will enable new fire stations to be built and facilitate the purchase of fire appliances and specialised ancillary equip- ment. It is anticipated that up to 26 fire appliances will be delivered to fire authorities during the coming year with a further five stations built or upgraded. The Department’s fire service capital programme is designed to put in place the infrastructure, including stations and fire appliances, to support the local fire authorities in the development and maintenance of a quality fire-fighting and rescue service. This commitment to and increased investment in the fire service has brought major improve- ments in the fire service infrastructure nationally. The capital programme for fire station build- ing and refurbishment and new appliance acquisition is financed from the Exchequer grant. In the past 25 years, almost \247 million has been provided to local fire authorities under the fire service capital programme for the provision of new and refurbished fire stations and the pur- chase of fire appliances and other equipment. In recent years there have been significant improvements in library developments both in terms of facilities and service. Some 72 library buildings, co-funded by the local authorities and my Department, have been built or are at construction or planning stages.

Deputy James Bannon: How many years will the Minister of State go back?

Deputy Michael P. Kitt: Some 52 grant-aided libraries, including nine headquarters, are pro- viding a much-needed service to the public. This is a huge boost to the delivery of a vital public service at community level and, within the resources available to me, these developments will continue to have my support in future years. The capital allocation of \10 million for 2009 will enable the Minister to provide funding for the commencement of some library building projects around the country. The Department is currently examining the priority projects proposed by the various local authorities in the con- text of the capital available for allocation. It is anticipated that the Minister will be in a position to announce a list of targeted library projects to be included in the capital programme 2009-12 towards the end of the current year.

Deputy James Bannon: I thought the Minister of State was in charge.

Deputy Michael P. Kitt: This will be in addition to meeting ongoing capital commitments of approximately \6 million from the current programme which are under construction.

Minister of State at the Department of Foreign Affairs (Deputy Peter Power): The budget allocation for Vote 29, overseas aid and international development, amounts to \753,942,000. This represents a hugely important statement by the Government at a time of economic diffi- culty at home and abroad. Administration of the budget amounts to \35,642,000, which rep- resents 4.6% of the budget and, by international standards, would be considered positive. Bilat- eral and other co-operation grant-in-aid amounts to \516,150,000, emergency humanitarian assistance amounts to \87 million and payments to international funds amount to \31 million. Contributions to the United Nations and other development agencies amount to \84,350,000. This effort means Ireland will remain at the forefront of the fight against global poverty and hunger.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: What about home poverty? 115 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

Deputy Peter Power: Over the years, in difficult and in good times, the Irish people have demonstrated their generosity and their commitment to the world’s most vulnerable people. They have contributed as individuals and as communities with their time and their financial resources. The Government has matched this commitment and, with the budget for 2009, has underlined our clear view that the poorest and most vulnerable people of the developing world must not become the chief victims of the international economic downturn.

Deputy James Bannon: What about old age pensioners here in Ireland?

Deputy Peter Power: We will get to that.

Acting Chairman: The Minister of State should be allowed to speak without interruption.

Deputy Peter Power: On the basis of the budget allocations, we are moving towards our commitment to spend 0.7% of GNP on overseas development. On current estimates, we will spend some 0.54% of GNP on overseas development aid in 2008. I am confident our spending on development assistance will maintain our position as the sixth most generous donor in the world in per capita terms, which has been confirmed by the OECD for 2007. The overall focus of the Irish aid programme is on global poverty reduction, in line with our commitment to the Millennium Development Goals which aim to halve global poverty by 2015. I attended the high level Millennium Development Goals event in New York last month with the Taoiseach and the Minister for Foreign Affairs. There was a clear recognition 6 o’clock there that more needs to be done by the international community if the ambitious goals are to be achieved. We committed the Government to ensuring Ireland plays its part and takes a leadership role in the world in this area. Our priorities in the coming year will continue to focus in particular on the poorest countries of sub-Saharan Africa, on the hunger crisis, on investment in education, health and the fight against HIV and AIDS, and on good governance and the promotion of gender equality. We are determined to concentrate on those areas which affect those least able to cope, namely, the world’s poorest people. Ireland’s aid programme, Irish Aid, has grown significantly and consistently over the last decade. We now have bilateral programmes of long-term strategic development assistance in nine priority countries. These programmes support the provision to millions of people of basic but life-saving services, such as health care, education and sanitation. We have effective part- nerships in place with NGOs and missionaries to aid their important work on the ground. At an international level, we are playing our part in funding the development work of the United Nations and the European Union. The scale of this commitment to international development should not be underestimated. In difficult budgetary times, Ireland remains one of the world’s most generous donor nations. The provision of \754 million to Vote 29, international co-operation, of the Department of Foreign Affairs emphasises the growth in terms of quality and volume of the aid programme administered by Irish Aid. Taken together with an estimated aid contribution of \137 million from other Departments, Ireland’s overseas aid total in 2009 will be \891 million, approxi- mately the same overall level as for 2008. This is more than twice the aid budget in 2002, only six years ago. With this commitment we are seeing real progress in many of the countries in which we operate. Let me give some examples of what Irish taxpayers’ money is achieving. Our support for the Global Fund to Fight AIDS, Tuberculosis and Malaria has allowed 6.4 million people in Uganda to receive HIV testing and counselling in recent years. In Zambia, Irish Aid has 116 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed financed a programme of well and borehole building, providing a long-term source of clean water to more than 100,000 people. In Lesotho, our support has helped the government increase primary school enrolment by a third over the last decade. The allocation in the budget will allow us to support further progress in these countries and to respond to humanitarian disasters as they occur in 2009. It will allow us to maintain and develop our successful partnerships with Ireland’s NGOs and missionary organisations engaged in overseas development. The major international conference organised by Concern in Dublin, at which I spoke this morning, highlights the growing scandal of global hunger, which has been the subject of an important initiative by the Government in the past year. We recently received the hunger task force’s report on world hunger. Although we contribute generously to the poorest of the poor in the world, 862 million people will go to bed hungry tonight. We are taking a leadership role on the world stage in this regard. We launched the report of the hunger task force three weeks ago before the Secretary General of the United Nations at its headquarters in New York. Leaders of multinational organisations were also present. That is a measure of our contribution to the international aid effort. The report of the hunger task force, which was agreed by all parties in the House, challenges us all to focus more effectively on the hunger crisis. I said it before, but it bears repeating — it is simply unacceptable that more than 862 million people go hungry every day. The Government is now examining the important recommendations made by the task force with a view to deciding how they can best be addressed across the Irish aid programme and in our international engagements. We face difficult times at home but we must remain committed to helping the most vulner- able across the world, whose lives remain on a thread every single day. Irish people have a long and proud history of commitment to alleviating the problems of the poorest of the poor. Notwithstanding the difficult circumstances in which we now find ourselves, it is not a time to let down those who are in an infinitely worse position. I am sure Members will agree that no matter how challenging we perceive the situation, we should not let down those who would give everything, no matter how bad their circumstances, to put themselves in our position. Taxpayers have a right to be proud of the contribution they make and the leadership role we play on the world stage. Ireland is recognised as one of the top countries for international aid, not alone in terms of the amounts we give but because our programmes are recognised internationally as some of the most effective in the world. I am proud that the commitment remains at the highest levels to build on the achievements of the Irish aid programme to date, to protect its strong international reputation and to deliver value for money to the taxpayer as we work towards the millennium development goals. I am confident that the measures taken by the Government in Tuesday’s budget will put Ireland in a stronger position to restore economic growth and protect future funding of our aid programme. Ireland will continue to demonstrate leadership in development and in solidarity with the world’s poorest people. We meet in extremely difficult and challenging times as most economies will be heading for recession in the next 12 months. These are unprecedented times and there is unprecedented turmoil in the financial markets. Difficult policy choices will need to be made and have been made. The Taoiseach stated earlier in the week that the choices we make now represent a defining moment for our country. We must remember that this is not the first time we have been in this position. Our country has faced serious challenges in the 1950s, the 1970s and especially the 1980s. The economic cycle is a fact of life. It comes and goes. We have had 15 years of some of the most unprecedented economic boom, which could not last forever. That is an economic fact. 117 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

Deputy James Bannon: The Government blew the bubble.

Deputy Peter Power: We have repositioned our economy in recent years to take advantage of the global trading environment.

Deputy James Bannon: That is nonsense. I have never heard such nonsense from the Minister of State.

Deputy Peter Power: That has brought huge benefits to our economy but it also carries huge risks. The key question is how we react and how we position ourselves. History has shown that we must learn from the lessons of the past. If we shirk difficult decisions, they will become more difficult to take and more painful for our citizens. Painful though they are now they would become infinitely more painful in the years to come. That is why we have made our choices. It behoves the Opposition to say how it will achieve its stated policy position of a 5.5% Government deficit next year. No member of the Opposition has stated in his or her contri- bution what he or she would do to reach the 5.5% rate.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: I did, but the Minister of State was not listening.

Deputy Peter Power: Nobody has done that. We have made our choices.

Deputy Michael Ring: Did the Minister of State not hear Deputy Richard Bruton?

Acting Chairman (Deputy Jan O’Sullivan): The Minister of State should be allowed to conclude.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: On a point of order, a Chathaoirligh——

Deputy Peter Power: We have set out our position. The reality is Fine Gael has not set out its position. That is the difference between that side of the House and this side.

Deputy Michael Ring: The Government side does not listen.

Deputy James Bannon: The Government side has crucified old age pensioners.

Acting Chairman: I am sorry but I must take a point of order.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: Will the Minister give way because he has told an untruth?

Acting Chairman: That is not a point of order.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: It is an untruth and I want him to correct it.

Deputy Martin Mansergh: It must be a legitimate debating point.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: I set out the Fine Gael policy and what we would do but the Minister of State has not been listening to the debate. He walked into the Chamber with a prepared script.

Acting Chairman: I am sorry, Deputy McCormack, but that is not a point of order. There are ways in which the Deputy can raise the issue.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: I ask the Minister of State to give way for an intervention. 118 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

Acting Chairman: Deputy McCormack will have an opportunity in a few minutes. I call Deputy Cyprian Brady.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: Will the Minister of State give way for an intervention?

Acting Chairman: The Minister of State has concluded.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: Will Deputy Brady give way for an intervention?

Acting Chairman: Deputy McCormack’s party will have the next slot.

Deputy Cyprian Brady: I have only a short time.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: I will not let any Minister away with telling an untruth.

Acting Chairman: Deputy Brady should be allowed to speak without interruption.

Deputy Cyprian Brady: If I can, I wish to make a few points.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: The Minister of State, Deputy Peter Power, does not know what he was talking about. He did not talk about the budget until the end of his contribution.

Deputy Cyprian Brady: I am delighted to make a contribution in support of the budget. In time to come it will be seen as one of the most important measures introduced by the Govern- ment. Two weeks ago our economic system was on the brink of an abyss and decisive and clear action was taken at that time. We are now facing into a very difficult period. The budget is about stabilising our economy and putting in place measures that will enable us to take advan- tage of conditions when they improve. Anyone with a basic knowledge of economics realises that economics is about a series of peaks and troughs.

Deputy James Bannon: After Deputy Brady’s stable companion wrecked it.

Deputy Cyprian Brady: We are currently in a trough. Not even the most pessimistic of com- mentators on any side of the House anticipated the current slowdown. The national develop- ment plan was based on a forecast of economic growth of 4.6%. That figure was a median based on the projections of a variety of commentators. We are now facing negative growth and must reprioritise accordingly, but we must continue to help those less well-off in society. I am pleased that despite the current difficulties the Minister announced increases in social welfare and other areas.

Deputy James Bannon: The Government took medical cards from the over 70s.

Deputy Cyprian Brady: In this digital age, in recent weeks we have watched events unfold on a daily basis in world financial markets. The global credit crunch is affecting the entire developed world. Rising fuel and food prices and volatility in financial markets is having a negative impact on growth in the United States, the United Kingdom and mainland Europe. The adverse changes in exchange rates and the weakness in sterling and the dollar compared to the euro are also hurting Irish exports and impacting on the real economy. As a result of the global slowdown, this is the first year in the past 11 years that the tax take, which is the income that accrues to the Government, is larger than Government expenditure. The main reasons for that are external and outside our jurisdiction and control. As a small, open economy we are subject to what happens outside our borders. The stupidity and greed of 119 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

[Deputy Cyprian Brady.] certain bankers which led to the sub-prime mortgage crisis and increase in foreclosures in the USA has had a major impact on our economy. However, in the budget, we are putting in place measures to help stimulate the economy. We must do this and look forward to where we will be in six months, one year, 18 months and two years’ time. Such measures as corporation tax remaining at 12.5% will send a strong message to foreign multinationals wishing to do business, and to maintain business operations, here. Foreign direct investment, FDI, remains strong here and FDI will play a key role in driving the economy in 2009. As the Minister for Finance stated, we continue to attract a disproportionate amount of all foreign direct investment in Europe. We must continue this and take measures to sustain it. As the Minister of State, Deputy Devins, stated earlier, the increase in funds in research and development are welcome and will also help stimulate the economy. Such measures as the tax credit for research and development will increase from 20% to 25% and will increase Ireland’s attractiveness as a location for such activities as it has done in recent times. We are also trying to encourage new and start-up companies here and, in this respect, we have introduced remission in corporation tax and capital gains tax for such compan- ies in their first three years of operation. Despite everything that has been said, this is not about trying to prop up anyone in the economy. This is about creating jobs and keeping them here for the young, well-educated people coming out of schools and colleges and this will continue for some time to come. I also welcome the reduction in stamp duty on commercial property, as this will help stimu- late business activity and lead to job creation. These overall measures will stimulate the econ- omy and will allow us to take advantage of the upturn when it occurs. We examine news around the world every day. Consider how other countries have reacted to the current crisis and the $700 billion bailout plan passed by the congress in the USA and the funds committed by the ECB last weekend. These should help stimulate activity in the global markets and help unfreeze the credit markets which at the moment are suffering a severe lack of liquidity. This, in turn, is making it more difficult for businesses and people here to take out mortgages and loans. In the budget, measures were put in place for first-time buyers which will encourage activity in this area and help such buyers to get onto the property ladder. For 2009, the Government is allocating over \1.65 billion in Exchequer funding for a range of housing programmes. First-time buyers will now get tax relief at 25% instead of 20%. Many affordable housing schemes in place will now be revamped and a single umbrella system known as the Government equity initiative will be set up. Under this scheme the Government will help people who need affordable housing by providing an equity share and the maximum loan available to people who cannot get financing for a new home will also be increased. In the budget there is continued investment in infrastructure. Despite the economic down- turn, gross expenditure for the Department of Transport in 2009 is \3.613 billion. This is evident in my constituency where there are several projects which are in the planning stage and others which are under way. For instance the metro north project is still in planing and will go to tender in 2010. The Luas extensions will be completed this year and next year. The rail inter- connector which is a sizeable plan for the north docks area of Dublin will link into the rail system and progress continues. There is a new signalling system planned for Dublin city and integrated ticketing will come into effect next year. These are all sizable projects that have an ongoing input into how we do business in the city and country. Despite everything, it is com- mendable that these plans are continuing. 120 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

Despite the challenging outlook, there have been large increases in such areas as social welfare and this will continue. Gross current spending will grow by no more than 3.6% in 2009. However, spending on social welfare will grow by 8.4% to \19.6 billion and the education and health sectors will also see an increase.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: Spending on welfare is only 3%.

Deputy Cyprian Brady: Overall, I believe the budget is fair given the current circumstances. We are facing turbulent times and we must act accordingly. I believe the budget will restore order and stability in the public finances and despite the feigned outrage from the Opposition, we will continue to support the sections of the community that need support.

Deputy Michael Ring: The builders.

Deputy Cyprian Brady: I have no doubt the budget will be seen in time to be one of the most important.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: Deputy Brady never mentioned the pensioners at all.

Deputy Michael Ring: Last Tuesday, when the budget was announced, what sickened me most was seeing the Fianna Fa´il backbenchers and independents standing up and clapping the Government. The only thing they did not do was sing the song of the Fianna Fa´il choir, “Sinne Fianna Fa´il”. They were so delighted about the budget I thought they were going to start singing. When they go home this weekend they will not be singing that song. They will be singing sad songs because they will have the blues.

Deputy Jimmy Deenihan: Perhaps they will sing “Where is my money gone?”

Deputy Michael Ring: Yes, “Where is my money gone?”. The pensioners, people who will have to pay the 1% levy, people on social welfare, the sick and the underprivileged of the country will be waiting for the backbenchers and the Fianna Fa´il Ministers. By next week, the over 70s will have their medical cards back because when these backbenchers go home next weekend, they will get the backlash from the people. The backbenchers will not be clapping and they will not be singing “Sinne Fianna Fa´il” in the Da´il with the Fianna Fa´il choir that was here last Tuesday. I remember when the Deputy’s colleague from Cork, the Minister, Deputy Michea´l Martin, introduced the medical card scheme in 2001. Deputy Martin was one of the greatest disasters as a Minister in the Departments of Education and Science and Health and Children. He announced free medical cards for the over 70s and he told the people of the country this would happen before reaching a deal with the doctors. They are paid \197 for a person under 70 years who has a medical card but over \640 for a person over 70 years, which is a scandal. It is no wonder that country is in this mess. The Government is responsible for one scandal after another. Consider the nursing home debacle where the Government took money off pensioners; it must return that money now. Consider the people who prop up the Government on a weekly basis, namely, the Fianna Fa´il backbenchers and Independents, Deputies Finian McGrath, Jackie Healy-Rae and Michael Lowry. I say to those who will be talking to the Fianna Fa´il backbenchers in the coming days that these people said before the election that this would not happen. They said last week it would not happen. However, on Tuesday the Minister for Finance came to the House and targeted the people that suffered in this country. These are the people who in the 1930s, 1940s 121 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

[Deputy Michael Ring.] and 1950s paid 60% and 70% tax when the country was going down the drain. What happens when the time comes that such people need something back, such as their medical card? It is taken off them. I look forward to talking to my colleagues after they go home this weekend. I suspect what they will hear is something like the calls my staff and I have received in my office or the discussions on national and local radio. People are appalled that the great republican party, Fianna Fa´il, which has always said it would look after the old, sick and weak, is looking after the builders and the bankers again this week. There will be legislation tomorrow to save the bankers.

Deputy James Bannon: B&B.

Deputy Michael Ring: I would love it if the officials from the Financial Regulator and the Central Bank who did not do their jobs were sacked. Fianna Fa´il will never sack anybody. I do not know why. Although I would not like to name anybody outside the Da´il, I probably know why certain people are paid massive money for jobs they cannot do. The Government’s next scandalous attack will not take place until the new year. It will be the meanest of the mean. I do not understand why the income levy is not confined to people earning more than \70,000. People earning less than \100,000 will be subject to a levy, or double taxation, of 1%. Those earning more than \100,000 will have to pay 2%. The Govern- ment should have attacked the super-rich. Young people often take jobs in supermarkets to pay for their education or help their families. They will have to pay the 1% levy, even though they might earn as little as \3,000 a year. It is the greatest scandal of all time. Middle class people, who are already under pressure to pay for health care, education, child care and mort- gages, will face major difficulties as a result of this decision. The Da´il will meet in January or February, when people are starting to realise that money is coming out of their pay packets. The levy will affect their ability to meet their fuel costs and pay their mortgages — in other words, to keep their families going. Meanwhile, the taxpayers will have to keep the banks afloat, whose chief executives earn more than \1 million per annum. My constituency colleague, Deputy O’Mahony, mentioned a scandal affecting my part of the country which I planned to raise this evening. What does Fianna Fa´il and its Government partners have against the west of Ireland? Why do they always keep us down? Why are we always blackguarded? I refer on this occasion to the scheme the Government has drawn up to charge people to leave this country from our airports. If one travels from Dublin Airport to Glasgow, London or Edinburgh, one will have to pay \2. If one travels to the same locations from Knock Airport, one will have to pay \12. What kind of thinking is that? Where are the Fianna Fa´il backbenchers from County Mayo? What will Deputies Calleary and Flynn do about this scheme? Will they allow the Government to put Knock Airport at a disadvantage once more? Why is the Government doing this? Many people had to emigrate from this country in years gone by. Now that the ship is sinking once more, thanks to Fianna Fa´il, those who are emigrating will have to pay the Government \12 to leave the country.

Deputy Billy Kelleher: Fine Gael did not want to build Knock Airport in the first place.

Deputy Michael Ring: What is the Minister of State saying?

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: People will have to pay \12 to leave from Cork Airport too. 122 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

Deputy Michael Ring: The Government wasted \50 million on electronic voting machines.

Deputy Pa´draic McCormack: It costs \1 million to store them.

Deputy Michael Ring: Last year, the Department of Health and Children spent \61,000 designing and printing a national action plan. I do not know what the plan was, but it certainly did not work because the Department is in disarray. A further \57,000 was spent on a booklet giving people information about the family income supplement. The Department of Communi- cations, Energy and Natural Resources spent \72,000 on a booklet explaining the “makeITsec- ure” campaign. The Department of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food spent \1 million on mobile phones. In light of the information I have given, it is a disgrace that the Government is trying to take medical cards from those over the age of 70. When the Fianna Fa´il backbenchers go home this weekend, they will know all about it.

Deputy James Bannon: It is scandalous.

Deputy Michael Ring: I will talk about child benefit, a matter the previous speaker would not understand, if the constituency he represents is anything to go by. I am sure he is always talking to builders, attending race meetings and associating with the super-rich. The half-rate child benefit payment will no longer apply to those aged 18 and over and those who have moved on to third level education. An increase of \7 in child benefit is proposed at a time when inflation is 4%. I note that Deputy Ned O’Keeffe is in the Chamber. I am surprised he will allow his Government colleagues to take the medical card from the over 70s. This after- noon, the Minister for Health and Children gave the Deputy’s backbench colleagues the wooden spoon on the backside and they had to take it. The Minister, Deputy Harney, told them to sit down and be quiet. It is no wonder the Progressive Democrats are in disarray. They are almost gone. After this week, we will not hear “Sinne Fianna Fa´il” any more. We will say goodbye to Fianna Fa´il because that party is on the way out as well. What does the Government have against farmers who have had to endure one cut after the other? The only increase the Minister, Deputy O´ Cuı´v, has secured in the Department of Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs relates to the payment given to those who teach Irish outside the Gaeltacht. There have been no increases in any other schemes. The budget of the Western Development Commission has been cut by almost half. The allocations to all the other rural schemes have been cut by half. The payment given to people to heat their homes has been cut. I do not know where the Ministers, Deputies O´ Cuı´v and Smith, were when these cuts were agreed. Perhaps they were not at the Cabinet meeting that day. If so, they are like their ministerial colleagues who claim they were in Ireland when EU directives were being agreed in Europe. Some Ministers complain when we refuse to offer them pairs for Da´il votes, even though they are not always present at the EU meetings they are supposed to be attending. This is the cruelest, meanest and lousiest budget this State has ever seen. I do not mind when the rich are affected by budgetary changes, but I hate it when the Government targets the poor. The rich are always looked after. The rich get richer as the poor get poorer. Fianna Fa´il’s new policy is to keep the working class down. We will have many more debates on this budget. I assure Deputy Ned O’Keeffe, in case he is worried, that Fine Gael will table a simple motion on medical cards next week. I am sure many Members of this House, including Deputies Healy- Rae, Finian McGrath and Lowry and some of their Progressive Democrats and Fianna Fa´il colleagues, will go on local radio this weekend to tell their constituents they do not agree with the proposed changes to the medical card system. Next week, we will give them an opportunity to vote against the proposals when we table a simple motion. 123 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

Deputy Jimmy Deenihan: When one shares a speaking slot with Deputy Ring, one has to be ready to bring the tone down a little. Having listened to several Government speakers over the course of the afternoon, it seems to me that they are almost trying to blame Fine Gael for the current crisis. They suggest in some way that Fine Gael Deputies should vote in favour of the Government’s budgetary policies. Deputies referred to the 1980s. I remind the many Fianna Fa´il Deputies who were not in this House at this time that Fianna Fa´il was in power for five and a half years in the 1980s. When Fianna Fa´il went into government in 1977, the national debt was approximately £4 billion. When that party left office in 1981, the national debt had increased to £12 billion. Previous speakers mentioned that the national debt doubled under Fine Gael in the 1980s, which is fair enough, but I remind them that the increase resulted from the economic policies pursued by Fianna Fa´il when it was in government between 1977 and 1981. We all remember the auction politics of 1977. I was a young teacher at the time, so I was delighted not to have to pay tax on my car or pay rates on my house as a result of the give-away budget of 1978. When Albert Reynolds was interviewed not long after he became Taoiseach, he dissociated himself from the budget in question. History is being repeated. The reckless decisions made since 1997, when Fine Gael was last in government, are coming home to roost. This crisis has resulted from the bad governance of the past ten years. I accept that the banking crisis is having an effect throughout the world. It is worrying to note that Bank of Ireland’s share price, which was almost \20 at one stage, decreased to \1.85 today. The Irish banks, with the full encouragement of the Government, gave money to Irish speculators and investors so they could become the main competitors for property in places like Manhattan in New York, London, Los Angeles and eastern Europe. Now that the property bubble has burst, the banks in question are left with very bad debts. I hope we will not have to come back here in a few weeks not to merely secure the banks’ loans, but to invest money in the banks to keep them afloat, which is what other European countries have had to do. I will get a chance to comment further on the issue of economic recklessness during tomor- row’s debate. I will pick up on a point made by Deputy Ring. I hope the people the Government intends to appoint to supervise the banks will be the best people available. I accept that some of those who work for semi-State and State bodies are good at their jobs, but one of the reasons this country is facing such difficulties is that most of the people in question were appointed because they are affiliated with Fianna Fa´il. I was in Government for a short period as a Minister of State. I had responsibility for the appointment of one chairman of a State body. I thought I made a good decision and I did not even ask the man his politics. That is not the case with Fianna Fa´il Governments, as they make sure that their appointments are of the right colour most of the time. I hope they put the right people in these banks in future. The percentage of GDP spent on defence in Ireland is the lowest in Europe. After this budget, it will have been reduced to 6.5%. We were actually spending more on defence 20 years ago as a percentage of GDP than we are spending now. There are some aspects of the defence budget to which I would like to refer. It was announced in the budget that the barracks in Longford, Monaghan, Rockhill and Lifford will be closed. There may be some merit in closing barracks due to the pressure on the Defence Forces to provide personnel. However, the staff in these locations have been told today that they must be out of the barracks by the end of January. That is just 14 weeks to close these barracks. Many of these barracks have been in place for a long time. No consideration has been given to those who will have to travel to places likes Finner Camp in Donegal, even though it will involve a round trip of 150 miles 124 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed for some of the people involved. There is no consideration at all for family disruption and for the changes in living circumstances. Some of these barracks contain cavalry squadrons and equipment will have to be moved. The staff of Clancy Barracks were transferred to the Curragh ten years ago, yet there is still equipment that remains to be transferred. However, the Government expects the 650 army personnel to move in 14 weeks. This is disgraceful. It is an awful way to treat people who have served the State very well. There is a proposal to decentralise the Department of Defence to the Curragh. The preparations for this have been ongoing for four years, but not one person has been moved yet. It just does not add up and the military people are absolutely disgusted at what is happening. There are no living quarters in Finner Camp, so many of the people being forced to move there will eventually be moved to Ballyshannon and Bundoran. That will mean changing schools and houses, and this will cause major disruption in their lives. There are also personnel from these barracks who are overseas. Will the Minister allow them to come back so that they can make arrangements? The whole thing is very badly thought out, and I would like the official here tonight to deliver that message to the Minister, who has admitted before that he would prefer to be in some in other Department. Every Minister should be enthusiastic about his or her Department, no matter what one it is. However, the current Minister for Defence has shown total indifference to this major issue. The Government has been asking us to come up with proposals to save money. I have a proposal for the Minister of State here tonight, Deputy Kelleher, and he is a practical individ- ual. The Asgard II sank off the coast of France. Fortunately, nobody was injured and there was no loss of life. The Asgard II lies about 70 metres under water off the French coast and it will be very difficult and expensive to salvage. According to the newspapers it would cost \5.6 million to replace the ship, but we already have a superior ship. The cost of building the Jeanie Johnston was the subject of much criticism when it was launched in 2002. The Dublin Dock- lands Development Authority now owns the ship. It is an ideal opportunity for this ship to become the State training vessel. It would save the State more than \5.6 million and we would get value for the investment in the Jeanie Johnston. The ship has figured prominently in many of the major sailing events all over Europe and the world. It sailed via the Canaries and the Caribbean to the east coast of the US, and then came back across the North Atlantic. It was hit by very hard winds and sailed through tough maritime conditions, but it survived and showed itself to be a very sturdy vessel. This is an ideal opportunity for the Government to use the ship. There is a decrease of around 11% in the arts budget this year. The Estimate for the Depart- ment last year was \85 million, but it is marked down here as \82 million. I remember the Minister bringing in a supplementary budget before Christmas of \3 million, which was added to the arts budget. Therefore, the reduction is closer to 11% than the 8% stated. The Arts Council will be under major pressure to keep its programmes going. The time to invest in arts is when our economy is in trouble, because it is an investment in creativity. We are looking at high-end jobs. What better way to obtain that creativity than by investing in the arts?

Deputy James Bannon: I feel I am addressing a wake. There has undoubtedly been a death and, as everyone knows, this is a case of murder most foul, a deliberate act that has left the mourners lost and suffering. Everyone knows the identity of the guilty parties — Fianna Fa´il and the Green Party. The death I speak of is that of the Irish economy, which was in robust 125 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

[Deputy James Bannon.] health and well tended by the hard work of the Irish taxpayer, until it was wantonly and ruthlessly brought down by the current Government. This death was no accident. Previous speakers have spoken at length about Government blame and about the harsh realities of the budget cutbacks. I would like to look at the threat to our heritage posed by a wilting Green Party Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government, who has failed yet again to take measures to protect our cultural and historic past, our environmental future and who allowed the Minister for Finance to strike a stunning blow to our heritage. I am particularly disgusted that the Army barracks in Longford is to close as part of cutbacks to make good the Government’s squandering of the wealth of the boom years. However, the people of Longford have fought to save the barracks before and we will fight again. We will take to the streets in protest. The voice of the people will be heard. Connolly Barracks is an essential part of the economic profile of County Longford and its closure, with the removal of 180 jobs, plus 160 reserve personnel, from the local economy is equivalent to the loss of two major industries in the county. The people of Longford have been let down by Fianna Fail’s Deputy Peter Kelly who, on several occasions and in the company of the Minister for Defence, gave assurances that the Barracks was secure as long as he was in the Da´il. Deputy Kelly said this on more than one occasion. How could the Deputy and the Minister for Defence, Deputy Willie O’Dea, be such hyp- ocrites? If our economy was dependent on the so-called help of Deputy Kelly, Longford would be on the breadline. Shame on him for letting his Government treat the people of Longford in such a way. He has pulled down the shutters on Longford. Ballymahon lost ten jobs today. This proves again that this Government is not committed to Longford. With jobs going in Longford, perhaps Deputy Kelly’s should be the first to go. He got away with another gimmick in the run-up to the 2002 general election when he promised that an American company, Cardinal Health, would deliver 1,300 jobs to Longford. This never materi- alised and he never explained to the people of Longford why this did not happen. The loss of 180 jobs, plus 160 reservists, plus ten jobs in Ballymahon, at a time of major economic down- turn, will impact on all sectors of our community. Local shops, restaurants, hotels and bars will feel the knock-on effects of the departure of these personnel, with long-term implications for our economic well-being. As a working barracks situated in an historic building of note, Connolly Barracks generated tourism income, which will also be lost to the area. There was a very small reduction of eight jobs in the live register figures for September with the August figure of 3,286 unemployed standing at a revised figure of 3,278. This hope of improved times ahead has been dashed by the loss of the 180 jobs at the barracks plus ten jobs, leading to a revised figure of 3,468 jobs lost to Longford. Generations of soldiers and their families have lived and worked in the barracks since the foundation of the State. It is part of the local community. As well as its military role, the barracks is used for many important community and charitable functions. Connolly Barracks has also played an important part in the history of County Longford. It was established as a cavalry barracks in the 18th and 19th centuries and was renamed Sea´n Connolly Barracks in 1922. It is currently the home of the 4th cavalry squadron. The barracks is one of the oldest buildings in Longford and is located on the site of the original castle and market house which were erected in 1619. 126 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

Granard courthouse was earmarked for closure and now Longford barracks is to go, all this because the Government squandered billions of euro of the taxpayers’ money and wants them to make good its losses at huge expense to the local communities. It is disgusting that Longford is being stripped of these unique heritage assets and local employment. It has contributed to the well-being of the area for many years and has been such an important part of the county’s identity. Such cutbacks will see the pattern repeated throughout the country, as my colleague, Deputy Deenihan said. The Minister’s disregard for our heritage, which is demonstrated by the 40% budgetary cutback in funding, is also set to affect an unusual historical artefact. The preserved animals in the National Museum of Ireland have fallen victim to recession and cut-backs and will not now get their restorative touch up, leaving rarities such as extinct dodos, who many people insist are alive and well and living in Leinster House, and which has been amply demonstrated by the Government, forced to wait for essential restoration despite their attraction both at their home base and for tourists. This budget is merely the preliminary round in a succession of measures designed to launch what will be called the Cowen great depression of the new millennium’s first decade, caused by Government squandering and wasting the years of plenty, to be followed now by years of famine. We have no cheer to look forward to. The winter of discontent will in due course come to its natural conclusion at the polls. As things stand, it looks like the grey vote will be the driving force behind the Government’s downfall. Thousands of pensioners who have previously held a medical card have had it whipped out of their hands by a heartless and uncaring Government which is now demanding \100 per hospital visit from the sick and vulnerable. How does that balance out with a meagre \7 increase in pensions? There is huge discontent within the Government ranks, with Ministers falling over themselves to justify the indefensible. How can any Government justify saving \100 million at the expense of the deaths of pensioners unable to afford medical care? The opportunity cost for many pensioners of purchasing medical care will be food and fuel; the opportunity cost of food and fuel will be medical care. This is a lose-lose situation. The Government, however, will bring itself down, with Deputy Brian Lenihan blaming Deputy Mary Harney and so on. I predict they will shaft Deputy Mary Harney——

Acting Chairman: The Deputy’s time has concluded.

Deputy James Bannon: ——as surely as they shafted Charlie McCreevy. The gang of 22 is waiting in the wings and we will hear more about this when they come back here next week.

Acting Chairman: I must ask the Deputy to conclude.

Deputy James Bannon: This is a budget where those who saw none of the benefits of the boom years are being hit yet again. What about the disabled?

Acting Chairman: I must remind the Deputy his time has concluded.

Deputy James Bannon: I wish to draw attention of this House to the plight of an intellectually disabled young adult who, having finished school, is left with no provision for his future.

Acting Chairman: I have to ask the Deputy to conclude. 127 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

Deputy James Bannon: I am thinking here of a letter I received recently from a lady whose son will graduate from a special school next June and, much to her despair, there is no guaran- tee of funding for him beyond this date. There is no guaranteed respite services, no funding for the opening of residential services and no future for either this boy or his parents.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan: It is shameful.

Deputy James Bannon: There is further bad news concerning education. The Minister for Education and Science had the power to remove the onus on middle income earners and re- introduce third level fees for top earners. Instead the reality is a shameful half measure of increasing registration fees, which will once again adversely impact on middle income earners who are already bearing the brunt of this budget.

Acting Chairman: I cannot allow the Deputy to continue as his time has concluded. I must call the Minister of State.

Deputy James Bannon: This Government backed off once again from making the wealthy pay their way. So much for the promise that any increase would only impact on those on an income in excess of \120,000.

Deputy Michael Finneran: He is showing no respect for the Chair.

Acting Chairman: The Deputy’s time has concluded.

Deputy James Bannon: No matter what this increase is called, it is fees by the back door and Deputy Finneran will have to bear the brunt when he goes back to Roscommon tomorrow evening.

Acting Chairman: Thank you, Deputy, your time is concluded.

Deputy James Bannon: It is a case of stealth and more stealth. That is all that can be expected from a Fianna Fa´il Government. They act like a shower of hypocrites in this Chamber.

Minister of State at the Department of the Environment, Heritage and Local Government (Deputy Michael Finneran): I wish to share my time with the Minister of State, Deputy Billy Kelleher. As we are all only too well aware, the events of the last few weeks in the international financial markets are without precedent in modern times. The prevailing economic and fiscal environment is more adverse than any we have faced for many years. As the Minister for Finance made clear yesterday, across all areas of public spending, we now need to consolidate the gains we have made in recent years in transforming the economic, social and environmental well-being of the country——

Deputy James Bannon: By taking it from the old age pensioners.

Deputy Michael Finneran: ——by ensuring we are clear about the areas of greatest priority that have to be the focus of our attention in the period immediately ahead. In short, dealing with a recession does not mean we have to stop trying to build a fairer society. Even in difficult and uncertain times, there are certain priorities which must always remain at the top of the political agenda. When we speak in times like these of prioritisation, the reining in of public spending, tightening our belts and so on—— 128 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

Deputy James Bannon: Charlie Haughey did the same with Charvet shirts.

Deputy Michael Finneran: ——we must always be mindful that for the most vulnerable in our society, the phrase book of recession rings hollow if front line services on which they depend are seriously compromised. Our focus in shaping the overall financial provision for housing in 2009 is on utilising available resources in a way which will most benefit those house- holds facing the greatest challenge in meeting their own accommodation needs. Against the background of the overall fiscal environment, next year’s housing Estimate pro- vides a very credible basis for achieving this. The total Exchequer provision for housing in 2009 will be almost \1.66 billion in current and capital finance. This represents a reduction of 4% on the record provision for 2008, which, it is worth recalling, was an increase of 16% on the 2007 Estimate. In addition and in line with my objective of prioritising the needs of the most vulnerable households, the social housing budget across capital and current funding is facing a reduction of just 1.7%. In the circumstances, this is a good outcome, particularly when account is taken of the fact that we have taken some of the pressure off the programme in 2009 by securing an additional \80 million of investment this year under the capital loan and subsidy scheme for voluntary housing. This means funding for affordable housing and other private housing measures is facing, proportionally, a more significant pulling back. However, significant resources have been provided in this area in recent times and the main housing market has, in parallel, gone through significant change. I will return to this issue later. By any measure, the provision for 2009 is very significant. Representing an average of over \4.5 million per day, it gives a clear signal of the continued priority attached by the Government to housing in general. It is also a reflection of our continued determination to build on the considerable progress made in recent years in meeting the needs of households through a range of social and affordable housing programmes. In total last year over 13,000 social and affordable homes were delivered and, overall, the needs of almost 18,300 households were met through the broad range of social and affordable housing programmes. That represents a very significant increase of 24% on the level of needs met in 2006 and marks a major advance towards meeting our commitments. The record resources available to us this year allow us to build very signifi- cantly on this progress and I am confident that the \1.66 billion provided for in next year’s Estimates will ensure we maintain strong momentum towards meeting our commitments in Towards 2016 and our longer-term goals under the national development plan. In earmarking the resources available to us in 2009, I will ensure the most vulnerable sections of society from a housing perspective, namely, the homeless, Travellers, the elderly and people with a disability, are accorded very clear priority. I will turn to some specific areas of focus within the housing provision for 2009. While I have worked hard to minimise the impact of the tighter financial situation on the social housing programme, clearly even small-scale reductions present challenges for us and for local auth- orities in maintaining current levels of activity. Therefore, we must make every effort to optim- ise the use of available resources, particularly in light of the 2008 local authority housing needs assessment which, when finalised, is likely to show a substantial increase in net need. The extent of current housing need, notwithstanding the debate around how we best define it, demands a flexible and imaginative response to the structuring of our investment programme. In the context of a difficult economic transition, we must seek to maximise the return on public investment, as measured by the extent to which we are meeting housing needs. More than ever we need to question the accepted ways of doing things. One option which my Department will be pursuing over the coming months will be the use of long-term lease 129 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

[Deputy Michael Finneran.] arrangements for social housing purposes to supplement traditional local authority construction or acquisition. This would provide a more cost effective, targeted approach, in line with the principles of the life-cycle approach endorsed by the social partners. It also presents an oppor- tunity for local authorities to get more for less, to take advantage of the greater value to be had in the current market. We must always aim to achieve value for money, but the tightened financial position, combined with the likelihood of our funding now going further, make it even more pressing. Output under the voluntary housing programmes will again form a major part of the overall social housing investment programme. The capacity of the voluntary sector has been ramped up incrementally in recent years to such an extent that output in 2007 was ahead of the Towards 2016 targets. This year looks set to be another very successful year based on activity levels to date, which, as I indicated, have been bolstered beyond what was planned through an additional \80 million of investment under the capital loan and subsidy scheme. The overall social housing provision for 2009 will ensure that the capacity that has been built up in the sector will continue to be deployed to the fullest extent possible. At a broad level, I will be continuing to maintain a high level of ambition for the regeneration and remedial works programmes of local authorities in 2009. The communities in regeneration areas are clearly deserving of support; they deserve to live in vibrant, sustainable communities. Nevertheless there are significant competing demands on the resources likely to be available for regeneration in 2009. Alongside existing projects under way, I am particularly keen to engage with the Limerick regeneration agencies as they bring the initial, crucial planning phase of their work to an advanced stage. Notwithstanding the difficulties experienced in certain public private partnership projects in recent times, notably in Dublin, it is important that we continue to explore ways in which we can secure private finance to supplement public funds. This is crucial not just from a funding point of view, but also because of its capacity to deliver the mixed development that is so crucial if the communities that are rebuilt are to be truly sustainable for the long term. As I indicated at the outset, prioritisation of the most vulnerable in society will be an overrid- ing objective in how we use the resources available to us next year. Against that background and with new Traveller accommodation programmes to be adopted by local authorities in early 2009, I will maintain a strong financial commitment to meeting the accommodation needs of Travellers in 2009 by matching the provision for 2008. Tackling homelessness, undoubtedly one of the most complex areas of my overall brief, will also continue to be one of my top priorities in 2009. When I launched the Government’s new homeless strategy in August, I outlined my vision for ending long-term occupation of emer- gency accommodation and the need to sleep rough, two challenging but achievable targets. Like any strategy, its success will be determined primarily by the effectiveness of its implemen- tation. For my part, I will ensure that the resource requirements of the new strategy are taken into account when it comes to the distribution of funds from within the overall housing budget. I will therefore be increasing the provision for homeless services by over 5%. However, I am equally concerned to ensure that we use our resources efficiently and achieve optimum value for money, and I will be placing considerable emphasis on that in the months ahead. Adaptation grants for older people and people with a disability play a vital role in the context of an overall continuum of care for the groups at which they are targeted. The high level of publicity surrounding the revised grant schemes since their launch in November 2007 has led to an increased level of activity being experienced by local authorities this year. I fully appreci- 130 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed ate the importance of these schemes in supporting independent living at home and an 8% increase in funding for their operation in 2009 demonstrates the Government’s concern for protecting the vulnerable in the challenging times ahead. Support for first-time buyers also remains a significant priority for the Government. However, despite almost two years of cooling in the housing market which has seen house prices moderate significantly, returning to 2005 levels, there is still a widely held view that the process of correction is ongoing. It is vital that we do not arbitrarily interfere with that process. Sentiment in the housing market is heavily dependent on wider sentiment in the economy. Our approach must therefore be to focus on getting the broader economic fundamentals right and ensuring ultimately that the housing market is underpinned by these rather than by artificial interventions which are questionable in principle and dubious in terms of their likely impact in practice. In other words, given the current market situation, it is important that prospective purchasers are not incentivised into making decisions to enter the housing market at a time that would otherwise not be of their choosing. While affordability may have eased significantly, the ongoing tightening in credit markets has resulted in a situation where people, who would previously have had ready access to a mortgage from one of the financial institutions, do not have such access. As the Minister for Finance announced yesterday, the Government decided to extend a line of credit 7 o’clock to first-time buyers affected by the credit squeeze by introducing a new mortgage product for a limited period until the credit situation eases. The new home choice loan will be available to first-time buyers of new properties subject to a maximum loan of \285,000 and a maximum loan to value ratio of 92%. The scheme will be operated on a regional basis by a small number of local authorities, four in total, with support from the affordable homes partnership. A website at www.homechoiceloan.ie and a telephone line providing pre- liminary details of the product are live as of today. Prospective applicants can register their interest now and the final details and arrangements relating to the loan product will be finalised in the coming weeks, with a view to its full introduction from early November. This arrange- ment is designed to respond to a very specific set of circumstances in the housing market, fully in line with the Government’s policy of only intervening in a targeted way, to achieve specific outcomes. It is about facilitating, rather than incentivising, first-time buyers who wish to pur- chase a home. I will also be bringing forward significant changes to the way in which affordable housing is provided. A new single, streamlined, Government equity product is to be introduced. Under this new approach, the purchase transaction would be largely unchanged from the purchaser’s point of view. However, instead of selling the units at a discounted price with the value of the discount to be subject to a reducing clawback, the Government would take an equity stake in affordable units sold, which the purchaser can either buy out in steps or at the end of a fixed period. This will replace the current approach through which affordable housing is made avail- able under Part V, the 1999 affordable housing scheme and the affordable housing initiative. Its implementation will introduce greater equity into the system and provide a basis for achiev- ing greater consistency across the schemes and across different areas of the country. The greater protection of the State’s investment will also mean that funds would be recycled in order to assist further households with affordable housing. The issue of introducing an open market component of the scheme will be kept under review in light of developments in the housing market. The introduction of the new home choice loan and changes to the provision of affordable housing will ensure that there is now a closed loop in terms of housing supports and appropriate housing responses in place to respond to the needs of households from across the low to middle 131 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

[Deputy Michael Finneran.] income spectrum, by enabling them to withstand the worst effects of the economic downturn and the credit crunch. For disadvantaged households at the lower end of that income spectrum, the continued strong output from the social housing investment programme will provide access to a quality housing environment in sustainable communities, with a possible subsequent avenue to home ownership through tenant purchase. A further route to home ownership will also be provided for low-income households through a new incremental purchase scheme. This will support home ownership for existing social housing tenants and households qualified for social housing support, whose incomes are too low to qualify for affordable housing but who could, over time and with appropriate supports, become the outright owners of houses newly built by local authorities or voluntary bodies. For households ready to take the step into home ownership but who require a modest level of support, the various affordable housing schemes provide a welcome means of bridging the affordability gap. The changes I have announced today to affordable housing delivery will provide a more equitable basis for the operation of the schemes and achieve greater consistency of implementation nationally. Finally, for middle-income households at the far end of that spectrum who can afford to enter the market now and to service a mortgage of close to \300,000, but for whom home ownership is currently closed off due to the so-called “credit crunch”, the new home choice loan provides a targeted and time limited option to get over a temporary accessibility issue. Of course, all of these provisions are in addition to the various priority supports for the most vulnerable sections of society from a housing perspective, that is, the homeless, travellers, the elderly and people with a disability. As I have already made clear, the current economic pressures require a prioritisation of funding and difficult choices to be made. My focus has been on maximising resources available for social and affordable housing next year. To achieve this and to ensure consolidation in the Department’s other key funding programmes, a deferral of the new urban renewal programme for 2009 is required. I will be working next year to ensure that the new programme can be triggered early in 2010. I will also ensure, in collaboration with my colleague, the Minister for Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs, Deputy O´ Cuı´v, that the programme is structured to complement his Department’s rural development programme so that both programmes are deployed in a way that has maximum effect on the ground. Even in a buoyant economy, there is always a need to find smarter, more cost-effective and quicker ways to deliver schools, community facilities, parks, as well as the basic water and access infrastructure to support the development of new sustainable communities. This need is even more pronounced in the context of the budgetary pressures that we face. Under the developing areas initiative, we have put in place a sound basis for the future planning for our schools, in collaboration with the Minister for Education and Science and local authority man- agers. We are focusing now on the other areas and developing better processes and co- operative models of planning and delivery between central and local government and between the public and private sectors. I expect to be able to advance further proposals for action under the initiative by the end of the year. Looking forward, it is clear to everyone that we are facing serious constraints on public expenditure in comparison to recent years. We have to cut our cloth to suit our measure and must do this in a targeted and prioritised way. We must also place a strong focus on obtaining value for money within the resources available and likely to be available to us. 132 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

We will be judged as a Government and as a nation by how we use the phenomenal gains we have made in the last two decades to protect the most vulnerable in our society over the coming years. The financial provision for housing for 2009 reflects the fact that we are in a phase of prioritisation, but above all it reflects our determination to maintain complementarity between our economic and social objectives. I commend the budget, the 2008 Estimates and the very significant housing provisions con- tained therein to the House.

Minister of State at the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment (Deputy Billy Kelleher): I spoke in the Seanad yesterday about the issue of unemployment, on a motion tabled by the Opposition. I will now take this opportunity to highlight some of the issues to which I referred during that debate. The global economic environment is very different from what it was in the very recent past. The environment is much more challenging and Members from both sides of the House will accept that much of what is happening now was unforeseen, particularly the global credit crisis. Coupled with that credit crisis is a downturn in the global economy, with some countries slip- ping into recession. As a small, open economy, trading on the international markets, the envir- onment is particularly challenging for Ireland. In the context of the Minister’s budget speech, it is important that we send out a positive message about Ireland. Our low corporation tax rate, at 12.5%, is a fundamental plank of this Government’s policy, and that of many Governments since the 1950s, of ensuring that we attract a lot of foreign direct investment. This tax rate, coupled with our highly educated, skilled and motivated workforce, which is extremely flexible, are important factors in attracting inward investment. It is incumbent on all Members, in whatever context, to highlight the positive aspects of investing in Ireland. Emphasis should be placed on our low corporation tax rate, our infrastructural investments and, primarily, on our human capital, to which I will return later. Tomorrow we will debate the scheme devised by the Government to safeguard the liquidity of Irish banks. The Minister’s decision in this regard was a very brave one. Most Members agree that the legislation drawn up is fundamentally important to ensure the survival of the banking sector in this country. It is important to point out that we are not bailing out the banks. In order to have a functioning economy, with capital and funding available to businesses, we must have a banking system that has liquidity and access to capital.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan: We must also keep it that way.

Deputy Billy Kelleher: Yes, we must keep it that way.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan: What happens if it does not remain so?

Deputy Billy Kelleher: It is very important that the banks realise that they are in a very different relationship with the Government, the Houses of the Oireachtas and the Irish people, a relationship that was never envisaged heretofore.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan: Actually, it was envisaged.

Deputy Billy Kelleher: It is incumbent on the banks to ensure that when they are attempting to claw back credit to balance their books they do not go chasing the overdrafts and current accounts of small businesses. 133 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan: They are doing that already.

Deputy Billy Kelleher: I will be watching the banks very closely to ensure they do not target those small and medium sized businesses which are finding it difficult to survive at present and which need access to credit.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan: I agree with the Minister of State but, unfortunately, they are doing that already.

Deputy Billy Kelleher: The banks should not try to claw back on the overdrafts of such companies to make their own accounts look good and to cover up for the deflated property assets they have on their books. This is fundamentally important and I urge all sides to ensure this is the case. I know the banks will listen to the views of the House and this is one fundamen- tal issue we must address.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan: I suppose there is a first time for everything.

Deputy Billy Kelleher: This budget had a backdrop of challenging times. However, it pro- tected the vulnerable against inflation which is welcome and shows the commitment of the Government not only to sustaining sound public finances but also to ensuring resources are made available to the most vulnerable in society. We are changing and it is regretted that unemployment is rising and is projected to be at 7.3% next year. This will cause major chal- lenges not only for the Department of Social and Family Affairs but also for training, upskilling and redeployment of people who find themselves unemployed. As Minister of State with responsibility for labour, I am conscious of the importance of ensuring we do not spiral into the situation we had in the 1980s when people entered long- term unemployment with no training, upskilling or potential for other job opportunities. We are working with State agencies, particularly FA´ S, to ensure that when people go on the live register, training and upskilling opportunities are made available to them along with redeploy- ment into other areas of the labour market about which they would not have known much. We must be committed to this to ensure we do not have people spiralling into long-term unem- ployment. Last March and April we took part in negotiations on a European directive on equality for temporary agency workers. Ireland was never opposed to the fundamental principle of equality. We wanted to ensure we had a level playing pitch with other European states which have collective bargaining in place. We wanted to ensure that temporary agency workers, who are a fundamental plank in the flexibility of our labour market, have protections while at the same time ensuring Ireland has equality with other European countries in order that we are not at a competitive disadvantage. With regard to the social partnership process, I urge the social partners consider what we achieved in the negotiations at EU level and recognise that we now have in place a system whereby the social partners decide the priorities with regard to temporary agency workers and in many other areas. We should be proud of this achievement. However, it is now up to the unions, employers and other stakeholders in social partnership to sit down and analyse how best to ensure equality of treatment and protection of workers’ rights while ensuring the flexibility in the labour market which is fundamental to our success in trading and competing with other countries in the global market. I urge them to examine the challenges in the coming months and ensure we have competitiveness, protection of workers’ rights and flexibility. 134 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

In recent days, a great deal of misinformation was put out about medical cards. When the Minister for Finance announced in his budget speech the withdrawal of medical cards and a means test for those aged over 70 it led to a great deal of concern. It was churned and used emotively by Members opposite which did a disservice to the calm and rational debate we wanted to outline the changes made by the Government with regard to means tests. For those aged over 70, the income limit will be \240.30 for a single person and \480.60 for a couple. This is the same as the highest amount of the State contributory pension following the increase in the budget. A single person whose sole weekly income is \240.30 or a couple whose sole weekly income is \480.60 or less will qualify for a medical card. Other social welfare payments such as fuel allowance or the living alone allowance are not counted in the means test. A person whose income is more than these amounts will be asked for additional information. I am sure many people contacted Members on all sides of the House with regard to the means test. It is important that we put the facts in front of the people. The means test income is income after expenses. Full account is taken of the real expenses a person can expect to have in the following year, such as rent, mortgage, GP costs, medicines, medical appliances, nursing home fees, maintenance payments, income tax or PRSI. It is fundamentally important that when people speak on these issues that they speak in a factual way and do not strike fear into people. The Government has explained the reasons for introducing means testing for those aged over 70. The majority of people who received medical cards after a means test will not even be contacted by the HSE. It is those who acquired them by reaching 70 years of age who are involved. Queries were also raised with regard to the health levy and whether people would pay it. The health levy will not be payable by people aged 70 and over. When we debate in this House it is important that we debate the facts and not ramp up emotive debates for cheap political gain. There was a reason for making the changes and when people analyse the decisions taken in the budget and the clarification in the guidelines for means testing they will see we do not want to take from those on social welfare payments. The guidelines published today show the sliding scale from medical cards to GP only medical cards to the grant of \400 for medical expenses for people who do not qualify for either medical card. I compliment the Minister for Finance, Deputy Brian Lenihan, on the budget. He took difficult and brave decisions. We know the backdrop and the challenges we face. In the coming years this budget will be seen as having been taken in difficult circumstances to ensure sound finances and, most importantly, to protect our competitiveness. An upturn will come, although we may face challenges in the foreseeable future, and the budget will ensure we are well placed to take advantage of it. In the meantime, we will protect the vulnerable and invest in infrastructure, health and education as was outlined in the capital spend of the budget. We know where we are and what we want to achieve in the coming years. The budget is the first step in weathering the difficult storms out there and it will leave us in good stead in time to come.

Deputy John O’Mahony: I wish to share time with Deputy Bernard Durkan. I am glad to have an opportunity to make a few points on the budget introduced by the Minister for Finance on Tuesday. We were well conditioned in recent months by the Govern- ment telling us about the difficult conditions of the economy. A few moments ago, I heard the Minister of State, Deputy Kelleher, tell the House that the vulnerable, the old and the edu- cation sector would be protected. 135 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed

[Deputy John O’Mahony.]

We were assured that because of the importance of education to our economy and the need for a well-educated workforce that few cutbacks would be made in the sector. How naive were those who believed this? We were also told prior to last year’s general election that there were no problems and that the good times would continue to roll. I will concentrate on the serious effects on education following the announcements made in recent days. The devil is in the detail and there seems to be a new budget emerging each time we seek clarification. Class size has been an emotive issue for many years. Prior to last year’s general election, the present Government’s Fianna Fa´il Members made solemn pledges in halls packed with parents throughout the country to reduce class sizes gradually over the next few years.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan: Hear, hear.

Deputy John O’Mahony: Not only have these promises been reneged on, but class sizes are increasing. We cannot even compete with eastern European countries who are in the early stages of development. How can we claim we have the best education system in the world if we have the largest class sizes in Europe? I will not spend too long discussing the reduced schools building programme because those from rural Ireland did not have to wait until the budget to realise this. In County Mayo thousands of children attend classes in either prefabs or rooms with Third World conditions with no prospect of getting a new or refurbished school building even though they have been waiting for more than ten years. However, it is some of the smaller cutbacks in courses, subjects and critical posts that so far have gone unnoticed. These will have serious implications for the delivery of a top-class edu- cation system. Grant payments for physics, chemistry, home economics, the leaving certificate vocational programme and transition year are all being abolished. At national level these cut- backs amount to \5.35 million. While it may seem a small amount in the big picture, it is a vital amount to each school and teacher working in these areas. In recent times there has been much ado about encouraging students to take science subjects at post-primary level with moneys being allocated for roadshows and so forth. The budget cutbacks will make it difficult to deliver on this. Obesity is a problem with younger generations. We need children to eat the right foods and stay active. Yet the vehicle which could have delivered that knowledge to students, the home economics grant for equipment, has been withdrawn. When I was teaching, we were told the chalk-and-talk era was coming to an end and there needed to be more emphasis on practical teaching. A good and well-resourced home economics course would be more than just a subject; it would prepare students for a healthy lifestyle. These courses could easily be delivered with less money but instead full cutbacks have been introduced. Leaving certificate applied and transition year programmes are provided to encourage students to complete school programmes. In the process they become more mature and experi- ence the workplace. Is there any joined-up thinking in cutting these back? On the one hand, the Government promotes certain ideals but then puts obstacles in the way of the cheapest and most successful delivery of them. Under the budget, teacher substitution arrangements are not allowed even for school busi- ness absences in post-primary schools. The real truth of this cutback is that in-service courses are now withdrawn. Another hidden cutback in the latest information we have received is that home-school liaison officer posts will go in schools which lost their DEIS status prior to the 136 Financial Resolution No. 15: 16 October 2008. (General) Resumed general election but were allowed to keep them when a furore was created at the time. Nine such schools will be affected in the Mayo constituency alone when these cuts are implemented. The officers provide not just an education but a social service. The officers can be the first to notice dysfunctional families, acting as a sort of early warning system in that respect. The increase in the registration fees for students entering third level is the re-introduction of fees by the back door. Those parents forking out for these fees will already have been hit with the increased charges for transport, etc., at second level. The back to education grants were already restrictive in the case of young people who left school early to join the workforce in the now dead and gone Celtic tiger. Many of these young people are now unemployed with no prospect of a job. Many of them will have to wait six months before they can apply for the grant. On top of that, there are 500 fewer places available. We all expected some pain in the budget but the least we could have expected was that it would be implemented with some equity. Under the travel tax proposal, \2 will levied on a journey less than 300 km and \10 for a journey over 300 km. A flight from Ireland West Airport Knock to Liverpool, Glasgow or Manchester will be taxed at \10 but a similar flight from Dublin Airport will be taxed only \2. Where is the equity in that? This is anti-competitive and anti-west. This morning I was glad to hear the Minister for Finance, Deputy Brian Lenihan, say on radio that any anomalies in the medical card provisions will be ironed out. I presume the same will apply to the travel tax.

Deputy Brian Lenihan: The Deputy should be careful about the accuracy of media reports.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan: That is not the case in here.

Deputy John O’Mahony: I heard the Minister speaking about this on “Morning Ireland”. The west has suffered long enough. If budgetary pain is to be imposed, it should be done so with some equity. The travel tax will affect all regional airports and it should be changed. Earlier, I took a telephone call from a farmer in my constituency who was concerned about the reduction in the disadvantaged area grant. He stated his income for next year will be reduced by \2,500. Cutbacks are acceptable if they are fair and equitable. Many of those announced in Tuesday’s budget were not.

Deputy Bernard J. Durkan: I welcome the Minister for Finance back to the House. I am sure he was taking the reaction to the budget in the community and on the European scene. I know there is some considerable turmoil outside the House but there has been turmoil here today too. Confusion exists about some of the budget’s provisions and I hope the Minister will shed some light on them. “Health cuts hurt the elderly, the sick and the handicapped” was an election slogan some years ago. It was before the Minister first entered the House so I cannot accuse him of drawing up the slogan. However, he and his colleagues have been the beneficiaries of an electoral advantage gained from policies pursued over the past seven years. One of the Minister’s prede- cessors, Charlie McCreevy, knew before the 2002 general election of the spree in public spend- ing. However, he could not arrest it until after the general election. I remember the pilgrimage to the plinth from the backbenchers on that side of the House to protest at the callousness of the then Minister for Finance as he attempted to haul the public finances into a proper kilter. He failed and that is where it all went wrong six years ago. The Government can claim all it likes that these current public finance problems are all part of an international crisis. While it 137 Medical 16 October 2008. Cards

[Deputy Bernard J. Durkan.] is an added difficulty, these problems originated in this country. Some of the remedies proposed will cause further difficulties. I have every respect for the Minister of State at the Department of the Environment, Heri- tage and Local Government with responsibility for housing, Deputy Michael Finneran. Any attempt, however, to off-load over-priced housing on to the already hard-pressed consumer will simply be regurgitated in 18 months as negative equity. That is a dangerous route to follow. I accept there are compelling reasons to tackle housing such as the large number of people on local authority housing lists. Over the past several years large numbers of people could have availed of housing but were not facilitated. If they had been, we would not have the bank of closed down building sites as we now have in my constituency and in the Minister’s.

Debate adjourned.

Adjournment Debate.

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Medical Cards. Deputy Jan O’Sullivan: I welcome the opportunity to raise this issue which has pretty much occupied the minds of everybody in this country for the past 24 hours. With all due respect to the Minister of State, Deputy Barry Andrews, I am disappointed that the Minister for Health and Children is not in the House to respond to this issue. We have seen panic measures throughout the country concerning the Government’s response. The HSE’s website has changed its position three times in the course of the day in terms of what the income limits might be. While it may change again tomorrow, the latest position is that they have now raised the limit for single people by approximately \40 and by a little bit more for a married couple. It is clearly a panic measure in response to the outrage of elderly people throughout the country who have been phoning us all day and speaking on the airwaves. These people have given their life’s work to the country and have paid their taxes when taxes were high. They were given medical cards in 2001 prior to the 2002 general election, which was clearly a ploy to win that election, but they now learn that their cards will be withdrawn. Those people do not need any lectures on patriotism from anyone in the Government, including the Minister for Finance. They know what it is to be patriotic. They were told that the weak would not have to pay for the problems the Government has led us into. Clearly, however, the weak have paid. The very people who devoted their lives to this country and who now require medical care in their later years, will have their medical cards taken away. In last night’s debate, I pointed out that the income threshold for a couple — where one was under 70 and the other over 70 — had been halved by the stroke of a pen in this budget. The threshold has been slightly raised today as a result of the furore it caused. I urge the Govern- ment to go back to the drawing board on this measure. It is not over by any means. There may be a feeling in Government circles that because this panic measure was taken it will appease people somehow or other, but it will not. Many people remain outside the limits and will suffer hardship as they will not be able to pay for their medical needs. As a result they will be in poorer health. Studies have shown that the removal of the means test improved circumstances for a con- siderable number of people, as well as improving health outcomes. It provided access to flu vaccinations and community-based therapies. A doctor-only medical card will not provide the 138 Medical 16 October 2008. Cards kind of holistic care elderly people require if they are to remain in the community. It is meant to be Government policy to encourage people to stay in the community, rather than going into institutional care or hospital. This measure will turn the situation around completely, however. I strongly urge the Government to re-examine this matter. It should renegotiate the issue with the Irish Medical Organisation because doctors were paid a hugely inflated amount of money. The decision was announced before negotiations were completed, purely to win the votes of those who, as the Government knew at the time, are the kind of people who actually go out to vote. Those people are outraged and feel let down. They feel they have not been respected or cared for. They will not accept this measure which is a mealy-mouthed effort to appease them. Many items in the budget have caused concern by inflicting damage on the poor, particularly the working poor. However, of all the budgetary measures, this one concerning medical cards is truly the harshest and most uncaring. It simply needs to be withdrawn. While he is not directly responsible, I urge the Minister of State and his colleagues in the three Government parties to go back to the drawing board. The Minister for Social and Family Affairs, who is a constituency colleague of the Minister of State, will have to amend the Social Welfare Bill. It will not require the Minister for Health and Children to amend the Health (Miscellaneous Provisions) Act 2001, but does concern the Social Welfare Bill. There will be major opposition to this measure, which is unfair because it attacks those whom we should protect. They have devoted their lives to the country and are particularly outraged by the call to patriotism, which was made on the same day at this blow was struck against them.

Minister of State at the Department of Health and Children (Deputy Barry Andrews): I thank Deputy Jan O’Sullivan for raising this Adjournment matter, which I take on behalf of my colleague, the Minister for Health and Children, Deputy Mary Harney. In the budget, the Government decided to end the automatic entitlement to a medical card for persons aged 70 and over, with effect from 1 January 2009. This was done to ensure that public health funding is used to help those most in need. Some people have a medical card as a result of a means test, while others received a medical card automatically, without a means test, when they turned 70. I wish to clarify the following points. Any person with a medical card as a result of a means test is not affected by this decision, irrespective of age, what means test the person did or when they did it. Their medical card benefits are not affected. They will not now be asked to do a new means test, nor will they be written to by the HSE as a result of the budget decision. For any person aged 70 or over who got a medical card without a means test, the budget decision is important because their present medical card will expire on 31 December this year. The HSE will write to them between 31 October and 14 November asking them to complete a simple means test to decide the benefits they may receive. They will be asked to return this form to the HSE within two weeks. On that basis, the HSE will be able to complete all assess- ments by 31 December this year. Depending on the means test, a person may qualify for a medical card, or a GP visit card, or the new health support payment of \400 for a single person, or \800 for a couple. I will now deal with the issue of the means test. The weekly income limit for a medical card will be \240.30 for a single person or \480.60 for a couple. This is the same as the highest amount of a State contributory pension following the increase in the budget. If a person’s sole weekly income is \240.30 for a single person or \480.60 for a couple, or less, they will qualify for a 139 Planning 16 October 2008. Issues

[Deputy Barry Andrews.] medical card. Other social welfare payments like the fuel allowance or the living alone allow- ance are not counted in the means test. If a person has a weekly income of more than \240.30 for a single person or \480.60 for a couple, they will be asked for some additional information. The means test income amount is income after expenses. Full account is taken of real expenses a person has, or can expect to have, next year. These are, for example, rent or mortgage, GP costs, medicines costs, medical appliances, nursing home fees, maintenance payments made, and any income tax or PRSI paid. Any savings up to \36,000 for a single person or \72,000 for a couple will not be counted in the means test. The family home will not be counted in the means test. The GP visit card entitles a person to free visits to their GP without limit. The weekly income limit will be \360.45 for a single person or \720.90 for a couple. This is 50% higher than the income limit for the medical card. If a person’s sole weekly income is \360.45 for a single person or \720.90 for a couple, or less, they will qualify for a GP visit card. Other social welfare payments like the fuel allowance or the living alone allowance are not counted in the means test. This income limit is also income after expenses. The same allowances and exemptions will apply as for the medical card means test. A person who does not qualify for a GP visit card can still qualify for the new health support payment if their gross weekly income is less than \650 for a single person or \1,300 for a couple. The HSE will use the same means test form to assess this. There will be no need to fill in another form. The health support payment is \400 for a single person or \800 for a couple. It will be paid annually, will not require medical receipts and will not be taxable. Medical cards and GP visit cards may still be granted by the HSE to those not qualifying on a means test on particular hardship grounds. The health levy will not be payable by people aged 70 and over. I am glad of this opportunity to be able to clarify the Government’s decision on this important matter.

Planning Issues. Deputy Michael Creed: I thank the Ceann Comhairle’s office for the opportunity to raise this matter and to express my disappointment that I do not have the Minister or a Minister of State from the Environment, Heritage and Local Government to take the issue — no reflection on the Minister of State, Deputy Barry Andrews. I would appreciate it if the issue was brought to the attention of the relevant Ministers responsible. Having been a member of a local authority for more than 20 years, I believe in the integrity of the planning process. However, I believe, as the old maxim states, that justice delayed is justice denied. I equally believe that a planning application not adjudicated upon within a defined period leads the planning process into disrepute. I raise this issue because of a specific instance, but I am also aware anecdotally of extraordinary delays in An Bord Pleana´la which, in fact, were confirmed to me in a parliamentary question which I raised on 1 July last. The reply confirmed that the average delay in An Bord Pleana´la in 2008 has been almost six months. I have a case in my town of Macroom. I will not name the individuals involved but I will give the reference number for the Minister of State to take back to his ministerial colleagues. It is PL69226787. This relates to a fairly significant development in Macroom town which is integral to the decentralisation programme that the Government, as of Tuesday last, has sus- pended. This process would have been signed, sealed and delivered if An Bord Pleana´la had made the decision because the Department of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food was prepared 140 Planning 16 October 2008. Issues to sign contracts if planning was produced. There was a third party appeal, and while I defend third parties’ rights to appeal, the point I raise is that such an application, which was appealed on 4 December 2007 to An Bord Pleana´la, would be undecided in mid-October 2008. I will outline the sequence of events for the record. It was appealed originally by a third party on 4 December last and, as I stated, I uphold and defend third party’ right to do so. On 13 April last, a decision was due and it was deferred on that day. It was indicated that decisions would have been reached on 13 May, on 13 June and on 20 June, but it was not reached and was further deferred. On 20 June, the board refused to give a future date by which time a decision would be reached. In early July, An Bord Pleana´la wrote seeking extra information, which was replied to on 20 July, and a new date was determined for 20 August by An Bord Pleana´la. It was deferred on 20 August until 27 August. On 27 August, it was further deferred and no indicative date was set for a decision to be reached. In early September, An Bord Pleana´la wrote again seeking further information. This was submitted on 28 September and a date has been indicated for 30 October. The unfortunate reality is that this project was part of the planned decentralisation of the Department of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food to Macroom, which has now gone by the way- side. It is indicative of the delays, and I am sure this is but one of many projects throughout the country that were delayed in An Bord Pleana´la. The town of Macroom will pay a consider- able price, even if that outcome were to be successful in An Bord Pleana´la, because the Depart- ment has now pulled the plug on the decentralisation programme. It leads one to suspect, and to be suspicious of, the motivation for the delay. I say that having given much consideration to it. The entire sequence of delays is unjustifiable by any other analysis. Under section 126 of the Planning and Development Act 2000, An Bord Pleana´la has a statutory objective to deter- mine appeals within 18 weeks. That is a reasonable timeframe in which to make a decision. In this case, it has been going on over ten months. That is entirely unforgivable. When one considers the state of the construction industry, this is a project, as I would imagine are many of the other projects before An Bord Pleana´la, where construction would commence as soon as planning could be resolved, and yet there are unforgivable delays. I implore the Minister at this late stage to be cognisant of the specific and the general issues involved and to bring them to the attention of his Government colleagues.

Deputy Barry Andrews: I will take this matter on behalf of my colleague, the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government. An Bord Pleana´la has a key role as an independent planning appeals body in ensuring physical development and major infrastructure projects respect the principles of sustainable development and are planned in an efficient, fair and open manner. In recent years, the board has operated in a challenging environment that saw sustained record levels of appeals and the implementation of the Planning and Develop- ment (Strategic Infrastructure) Act 2006. Any examination of the performance of the board in the disposal of cases must be viewed in the context of the record levels of case intake over successive years, from 2004 to 2007, and the assumption of significant new functions under the 2006 Act. During 2007, An Bord Pleana´la received 6,664 new cases, an increase of 12% on 2006, and determined 6,163, which represented a 10% increase on the number determined in the previous year. The high intake of new appeal cases in 2007 coupled with the high level of strategic infrastructure cases received resulted in a significant rise in the workload in hand at the board by the end of 2007 and I am aware that there has been deterioration in appeal disposals within the normal 18-week statutory objective period in 2008. 141 Schools Building 16 October 2008. Projects

[Deputy Barry Andrews.]

For its part, the Government has given the board practical support in these challenging times. In 2007, approval was given for a considerable increase in the board’s staffing resources and the total authorised staff complement increased by 35.5 to 172. At that time, the board member- ship also increased from ten to 11 on a temporary basis. I am advised that with the predicted lower intake of cases in future, the increased resources made available, greater experience with the operation of the Planning and Development (Strategic Infrastructure) Act 2006 and other measures to improve throughput, progress will be made over the coming months towards reducing the turnaround time for cases so that a greater percentage are determined within the statutory objective period. Let me say a bit more about the Planning and Development (Strategic Infrastructure) Act 2006 as it is important in considering the employment issue raised by the Deputy. The key policy objective of the Act is to provide for a streamlined, single-stage consent process for certain classes of infrastructural development of national importance by statutory bodies and private promoters. In addition to motorways and local authority projects, which were already handled by An Bord Pleana´la, this now includes heavy and light rail and metro, other infra- structure requiring environmental impact assessments such as significant airport or port devel- opments, waste infrastructure, and major energy infrastructure such as electricity transmission lines, strategic upstream and downstream gas pipelines, liquefied natural gas facilities, oil refineries and large onshore wind farms. Since January 2007, the board, which now has a strategic infrastructure division, has received 97 requests for pre-application consultations and arranged 144 meetings, with the promoters in these cases, and concluded 63 pre-application consultation cases and received 16 formal stra- tegic infrastructure applications under the new process. To date, six formal applications have been decided by the board under the Act to which I referred and these have been decided within the statutory period of 26 weeks. All these were the subject of an oral hearing. In view of the size and complexity of projects determined such as the Citywest Luas extension, the natural gas Powergen plant at Toomes, the liquefied natural gas import storage terminal at Tarbert, or the railway line between Clonsilla and Pace, and achieving decisions within 26 weeks while ensuring all environmental and public participation considerations are taken into account is a major step forward. It is also an important development from the perspective of employment provision as these types of major projects lead to major employment opportunities in their construction and operation.

Deputy Michael Creed: Will the Minister of State take up the specific case?

Deputy Barry Andrews: I have taken a note of it.

Schools Building Projects. Deputy James Bannon: I thank the Ceann Comhairle for affording me the opportunity to speak on this important matter, namely, the need for the Minister for Education and Science to provide an update on the commencement date for building the new school building for Forgney national school, County Longford, which is urgently required to replace the school’s 40 year old wooden structure. The new school building was approved two years ago, in November 2006, in an announcement by the then Minister for Education and Science of a new building programme under which 72 primary schools nationwide were allocated funding.

142 Schools Building 16 October 2008. Projects

Forgney national school has gone from the heights of elation to the depths of despair in the past two years. There was elation in November 2006, almost two years ago, with the announce- ment that after a 40-year wait the school was given the go-ahead by the Department for a new school building. However, as time passed with no follow through, this has turned to despair. The Minister might be unable to imagine such despair but I can assure him it is extreme. It is the culmination of raised hopes that have been dashed and the reality of hard work by pupils, teachers and parents coming to nothing. Forgney national school has been accommodated for an unbelievable 42 years in an old wooden, flat-roofed army-type building which is very near collapse. It is well past its sell-by date. This is a huge health and safety risk for children and teachers. As I asked recently in this House when speaking about the conditions in another school, would the Minister and his Government colleagues be happy to work in accommodation that has deteriorated to such an extent? I am sure they would not and that the Office of Public Works would be called in immediately to upgrade facilities. Government spin, particularly with regard to school building projects, is also well past its sell-by date. Communities with schools such as that in Forgney are sick and tired of having the wool pulled over their eyes and promise after promise without action. Forgney national school is a small two-teacher school at the heart of the community in Forgney, County Longford. Although the postal address is County Westmeath, this is a Long- ford school which is under the capable direction of its principal, Mr. Adrian Coughlan. If anything should happen to the temporary structure, the school would be forced to copy the hedge schools of old as no other accommodation is available in the area. The pupils would be at the mercy of the elements. Forgney is a developing catchment area on the outskirts of Ballymahon. The school is the only primary school in the parish and as such it is a focal point of parish activities. While the area has not been over-developed in recent years, it is beginning to attract some development. Although it is a small school, zoning for housing in the area will lead to an increase in the number of school-going children in coming years. A recently completed building scheme situated on the border of Forgney and Ballymahon will lead to a significant increase the school-going population. The school has a projected enrolment of more than 30 pupils by 2010. The local people have worked tirelessly and have vigorously campaigned for a new school building to replace the difficult physical conditions in which Forgney national school has pro- vided an excellent education for the children of the area for many years. Currently, the principal assumes the building project has reached the design stage and it is accepted that it will not now go to tender in the first six months of 2009. I urge the Minister to give an assurance, without clouding the issue, that it will be certain to go to tender in the second half of next year.

Minister of State at the Department of the Environment, Heritage and Local Government (Deputy Michael Finneran): I am responding on behalf of my colleague, the Minister for Edu- cation and Science. I thank the Deputy for raising this matter as it provides me with the opportunity to outline the position with regard to the application for large-scale capital funding from Forgney national school. The school has a staffing of a principal, one mainstream teacher and a shared resource teacher. The school’s enrolment at 30 September 2007 was 22 pupils. The school authority has applied to the Department of Education and Science for capital funding for a new school building. In the context of this application, the local inspector has confirmed that the school is expected to maintain its current enrolment and staffing level. It is 143 The 16 October 2008. Adjournment

[Deputy Michael Finneran.] not, therefore, experiencing the rapid increase in enrolments that has occurred in other schools throughout the country. The Deputy will appreciate that modernising facilities in 3,200 primary and 750 post-primary schools is not an easy task given the decades of underinvestment in this area as well as the need to respond to emerging needs in areas of rapid population growth. The Government has a sincere determination, however, to ensure that all children are educated in appropriate facili- ties to enable the implementation of a broad and balanced curriculum. This is evidenced by the scale of funding made available under the former and the current national development plans and the capital funding for school buildings announced in the budget this week. The Department of Education and Science must prioritise how it spends its capital funding to ensure that it is targeted at areas and schools most in need. That is the reason prioritisation criteria were introduced and published. These criteria show how projects are categorised and how they are selected for inclusion in a capital programme. Under the criteria, the proposed project for Forgney national school has been assigned a band two rating reflecting the fact that the standard of its existing accommodation is such that it needs to be replaced by a new building. Thousands of building projects were carried out under the last national development plan to provide new and modernised educational infrastructure and thousands more will be carried out under the new plan. However, there must be order in how this happens and a realisation that not all building projects can proceed together. The extent of the demand on the capital budget is enormous. That budget is providing accommodation for new communities together with accommodation for the unprecedented number of extra teachers the Government has put into the system. The Department of Education and Science also must modernise much of the exist- ing stock as a result of the historic underinvestment in that stock. All this work will not be achieved overnight. However, the Department has made huge inroads and will continue to build on the success of the last national development plan, when the Department delivered 7,800 building projects. As the Minister, Deputy Batt O’Keeffe, said, this must be done in an orderly and planned manner and on the basis of the most pressing need. Projects will be advanced incrementally through the system, over time, consistent with the priority attaching to them which is reflected in the band rating assigned to them. Individual projects will be allowed to proceed, in order of priority as and when the funding situation permits. The school building project for Forgney national school will be considered for pro- gression in this context. I again thank the Deputy for raising this matter. The Department’s planning and building unit will be in contact with the school authority as further progress is made on its project.

The Da´il adjourned at 7.55 p.m. until 10.30 a.m. on Friday, 17 October 2008.

144 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

Written Answers.

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The following are questions tabled by Members for written response and the ministerial replies as received on the day from the Departments [unrevised].

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Job Losses. 1. Deputy Michael Ring asked the Ta´naiste and Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employ- ment the number of contractual workers laid off on a county basis in an organisation (details supplied); and when these persons who were laid off were initially taken on. [35193/08]

Ta´naiste and Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment (Deputy Mary Coughlan): The employment of contractual workers is a day-to-day operational matter for FA´ S.

Community Employment Schemes. 2. Deputy Paul Connaughton asked the Ta´naiste and Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment if she has plans to allow persons who have completed their term on community employment schemes, who are reaching their 60th birthday and who have no hope of getting other employment, to participate in further community employment schemes until they reach their pension age; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35213/08]

Ta´naiste and Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment (Deputy Mary Coughlan): Community Employment (CE) is an active labour market programme designed to provide eligible long term unemployed people and other disadvantaged persons (including those with a disability) with an opportunity to engage in useful work within their communities on a fixed term basis. To cater for older workers in particular, in November 2004 I revised the 3 year CE capping to allow those of 55 years of age and over to avail of a 6-year period on CE (based on partici- pation since 3rd April, 2000). These measures were introduced in recognition of the fact that older participants may find it more difficult to progress into the open labour market. Participation on Community Employment has an upper age limit of 65 years of age, i.e. a CE participant/Supervisor can remain on CE until the day before their 66th birthday, provided they meet all other eligibility requirements. FA´ S cannot make funding available to a Sponsor for any participant or Supervisor aged 66 years or over. To do so would mean that the state 145 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

[Deputy Mary Coughlan.] would effectively be double-funding both the CE place and the participant’s state pension sim- ultaneously. The aim of CE still remains as an active labour market programme with the emphasis on progression into employment. The programme is managed within this context, with consider- ation to the availability of resources and the needs of participants and the community. FA´ S makes every effort to ensure that differing levels of demand between neighbouring schemes are equalised. FA´ S also operates the programme flexibly as far as possible to ensure the con- tinuation of community projects. For a person to be considered for re-entry to Community Employment 12 months need to have elapsed since any previous participation and he/she must have been on the Live Register for that 12 month period. This is entirely subject to the availability of places, local demand and equity of opportunity to eligible long term unemployed people. In conclusion then, I would say that this Government will continue to support the positive role of CE in meeting the needs of long-term unemployed persons while at the same time providing essential services to communities. In this regard, we are keeping the operation of the Scheme under constant review.

Work Permits. 3. Deputy Joe Costello asked the Ta´naiste and Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employ- ment the reason a person (details supplied) in Dublin 7 was refused a work permit; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35220/08]

Minister of State at the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment (Deputy Billy Kelleher): The Employment Permits Section of my Department informs me that a renewal permit has now issued in this case.

4. Deputy Finian McGrath asked the Ta´naiste and Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment if she will support a person (details supplied) in Dublin 3. [35275/08]

Minister of State at the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment (Deputy Billy Kelleher): The Employment Permits Section of my Department informs me that there is no current valid application made on behalf of the above named person. However, if the above named wishes to submit an application it will be considered on its merits.

Appointments to State Boards. 5. Deputy Ciara´n Lynch asked the Ta´naiste and Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employ- ment if she will confirm that persons appointed to positions under the Consumer Protection Act 2007, the Personal Injuries Assessment Board Act 2003, the Industrial Development (Science Foundation Ireland) Act 2003 and the Communications Regulation Act 2002 were appointed in accordance with the regulations set out in those Acts; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35292/08]

Ta´naiste and Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment (Deputy Mary Coughlan): The Consumer Protection Act 2007 The Consumer Protection Act 2007 provides that the National Consumer Agency shall con- sist of a chairperson and 12 ordinary members. Since its establishment on a statutory basis on the 1st May 2007, all appointments to the Board of the National Consumer Agency have been 146 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers undertaken by the Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment in strict accordance with the legislative provisions of Sections 10 and 11 of the Consumer Protection Act 2007. Section 14 of the Act provides that the Agency shall appoint a Chief Executive with the approval of the Minister. I am satisfied that all the appointments made under the Consumer Protection Act, 2007, have been made in accordance with the requirements laid down in the Act.

Personal Injuries Assessment Board Act, 2003 Since its establishment in June 2004, all appointments to the Personal Injuries Assessment Board including the CEO, Chairperson and Members, have been undertaken by the Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment in strict accordance with the legislative provisions of Sections 56-59 of the Personal Injuries Assessment Board Act 2003. I am satisfied that these appointments have been made in accordance with the provisions of the legislation.

Industrial Development (Science Foundation Ireland) Act 2003 Since its establishment on a statutory basis in July 2003 all appointments to the Board of Science Foundation Ireland have been undertaken by the Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment in strict accordance with the legislative provisions of Sections 8 to 10 inclusive of the Industrial Development (Science Foundation Ireland) Act 2003 and, where applicable, with the consent of the Minister for Finance and following consultation with the Minister for Edu- cation and Science.

The Communications Regulation Act, 2002 The Communications Regulation Act, 2002 is not the responsibility of my Department.

Wastewater Treatment Systems. 6. Deputy Leo Varadkar asked the Ta´naiste and Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employ- ment if her attention has been drawn to the fact that CB6 biocylce units were being sold without correct NSAI/IAB certification, that such units have been installed in homes here and that householders who have installed these units have not been informed that their units are not compliant; the action she will take on the matter; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35298/08]

Ta´naiste and Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment (Deputy Mary Coughlan): I assume that the Deputy is referring to domestic wastewater treatment systems. I understand that National Standards Authority of Ireland/ Irish Agreement Board (NSAI/IAB) certification is a voluntary, not mandatory, certification process that may be applied to innovative products within the construction sector. This certification is identified within the National Building Regulations as one of a number of methods of demonstrating compliance with the requirement of the Regulations that materials are fit for the use for which they are intended and for the conditions in which they are to be used. These wastewater systems are monitored by the Local Authorities through their enforcement of the Building Regulations. The NSAI has no role in the enforcement of these Regulations. The NSAI has advised me that on 16 July this year it received a complaint regarding IAB certification of one of these systems sold to a member of the public by a particular company. The matter was raised by the IAB during a previously planned audit of this company on 17 July 2008. The IAB then formally wrote to the company concerned on 22 July instructing them 147 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

[Deputy Mary Coughlan.] to remove all inappropriate references to IAB certification from their website. I understand that the company complied with this request. Subsequently on 8 August 2008 the IAB placed a notice on the NSAI website informing the public of recent incidents involving the misuse of IAB certification concerning wastewater treatment systems. The notice informed the public that products not conforming to the conditions of certification should not be advertised, sold or marked as IAB certified. I understand that contacts between the NSAI and the company concerned are continuing. I understand that a separate complaint was made to the National Consumer Agency and is being investigated. As the matter is under ongoing investigation by the Agency I cannot com- ment further on the matter.

Industrial Relations. 7. Deputy Leo Varadkar asked the Ta´naiste and Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employ- ment her view on the industrial relations dispute at Aer Lingus; if she will intervene; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35303/08]

Minister of State at the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment (Deputy Billy Kelleher): The Government very much regrets that Aer Lingus has found itself compelled to consider radical measures in order to remain competitive in the environment in which it is operating. The context in which these developments arise is primarily one of rapid change in the international aviation and wider transport sector. It underlines once again the severity of the challenges being faced across our economy. Obviously, as Minister of State with responsi- bility for Labour Affairs, I am concerned for employees who feel their jobs may be under threat by what has been proposed. The industrial relations machinery of the State is, of course, available to provide any possible assistance in resolving the challenges now faced by the management and employees. In this context, I am pleased to note that all sides are co-operating with a process under the chairman- ship of the Director of Conciliation of the Labour Relations Commission.

Employment Rights. 8. Deputy Leo Varadkar asked the Ta´naiste and Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employ- ment the legal protection that exists for employees who agree to transfer from one employer to another under the transfer of undertakings; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35304/08]

Minister of State at the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment (Deputy Billy Kelleher): The current Irish law in the area of “transfer of undertakings” is the European Communities (Protection of Employees on Transfer of Undertakings) Regulations 2003 — Statutory Instrument (S.I.) No. 131 of 2003. The Regulations implement the mandatory (i.e. mandatory to transpose) provisions of EU Council Directive 2001/23/EC of 12 March 2001 which is aimed at safeguarding the rights of employees in the event of a transfer of an under- taking, business or part of a business to another employer as a result of a legal transfer (including the assignment or forfeiture of a lease) or merger. Also, a further provision of the European Directive (a provision relating to the information to be provided by the original employer to the new employer) was transposed into Irish law by Section 21 of the Employees (Provision of Information and Consultation) Act 2006. 148 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

The Regulations provide that all the rights and obligations of an employer arising from a contract of employment (including terms inserted by collective agreements) other than pension rights, existing on the date of a transfer, are transferred to the new employer on the transfer of the business or part thereof. Another provision of the Regulations is that both the outgoing and incoming employers are obliged to inform their respective employees’ representatives of, inter alia, the date or proposed date of the transfer, the reasons for the transfer and the legal, social and economic implications of the transfer for the employees. Where there are no representatives, employers must arrange for the employees to choose representatives for this purpose. Under the Regulations, an employee may take a case to a Rights Commissioner or (on appeal) to the Employment Appeals Tribunal if the employee considers that an infringement of rights has occurred. It is a matter for a Rights Commissioner or (on appeal) the Employment Appeals Tribunal to interpret the provisions of the Regulations and a legal interpretation would only be given if an employee took a case to a Rights Commissioner under the Regulations.

Icelandic Investments. 9. Deputy Ciara´n Lynch asked the Ta´naiste and Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employ- ment if public bodies here have invested funds in Icelandic financial products; the status of such investments; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35506/08]

Ta´naiste and Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment (Deputy Mary Coughlan): The question of where individual investments are made by the Agencies coming under the remit of my Department is a day-to-day matter for the Agencies concerned and would not be a matter over which I exercise any functions. Nonetheless, I understand that none of my Department’s Agencies has any investments in Icelandic financial products.

10. Deputy Ciara´n Lynch asked the Minister for Finance if public bodies here have invested funds in Icelandic financial products; the status of such investments; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35195/08]

Minister for Finance (Deputy Brian Lenihan): In response to the Deputy’s question none of the bodies under the remit of my Department have funds invested in Icelandic financial products.

Tax Code. 11. Deputy Pat Breen asked the Minister for Finance further to Parliamentary Question No. 143 of 2 July 2008, if progress has been made in agreeing an alternative scheme to replace the fuel excise refund scheme for bus transport operators which is due to terminate on 31 October 2008; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35208/08]

Minister for Finance (Deputy Brian Lenihan): As the Deputy is aware, the fuel duty rebate is to be withdrawn with effect from 1 November 2008 following the ending of a special dero- gation under the EU Energy Tax Directive 2003. A similar situation affects all Member States who had derogations under the Directive. The Department of Transport and other relevant Departments, in conjunction with my Department, have examined and considered options at length. As I indicated in my answer to your July question this has not been a straightforward 149 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

[Deputy Brian Lenihan.] matter. In the end, it was not found feasible to introduce an alternative non-tax scheme on a cost-neutral basis and within EU rules.

Strategic Development Zones. 12. Deputy Enda Kenny asked the Minister for Finance his views on the development of a strategic development zone in the area of Ireland West Airport, Knock; if he has received an application for consideration of tax allowances in respect of eco friendly developments subject to strict conditions; if his attention has been drawn to the potential that exists arising from same in this locality; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35251/08]

Minister for Finance (Deputy Brian Lenihan): Under Part IX of the Planning and Develop- ment Act 2000, the Government may by Order, on foot of a proposal from the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government, designate a site or sites as a Strategic Development Zone (SDZ) to facilitate development which is considered, in the Government’s opinion, to be of economic or social importance to the State. I understand that initial dis- cussions have taken place between officials from the Department of the Environment, Heritage and Local Government and representatives from Mayo County Council and Ireland West Air- port to explore the scope for such a designation. My Department has recently received a proposal for a tax incentive scheme in relation to an Eco-Business & Renewable Energy Park beside Ireland West Airport, Knock. The Deputy will be aware that following a major review of various property and area based tax incentive schemes it was announced in Budget 2006 that most of the existing reliefs either had achieved the objectives set for them or were no longer considered to be cost effective in terms of the objectives set for them and were therefore terminated subject to certain transitional provisions. The role that time-limited tax relief schemes can play in supporting public policy objectives is assessed continually in the formulation of tax policy.

Appointments to State Boards. 13. Deputy Ciara´n Lynch asked the Minister for Finance if he will confirm that persons appointed to positions under the Public Service Management (Recruitment and Appointments) Act 2004 and the Central Bank and Financial Services Authority of Ireland Act 2004 were appointed in accordance with the regulations set out in these Acts; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35296/08]

Minister for Finance (Deputy Brian Lenihan): In response to the Deputy’s question the persons appointed under the Public Services Management (Recruitment and Appointments) Act 2004 and the Central Bank and Financial Services Authority of Ireland Act 2004 were appointed in accordance with the relevant statutory provisions outlined in the Acts.

Banking Sector. 14. Deputy Leo Varadkar asked the Minister for Finance if, in view of his reply to Parliamen- tary Question No. 208 of 7 October 2008, he has sought assurances from the banks that asset to liability values as published in the end of 2007 accounts accurately reflect the current asset to liability in October 2008; if he sought such an assurance before agreeing to provide a guaran- tee to the banks; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35305/08]

150 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

Minister for Finance (Deputy Brian Lenihan): The figure referred to by the Deputy was compiled on the basis of published audited annual financial statements for the institutions concerned for 2007. The relevant figures for covered liabilities are now being updated for end- September 2008 in the context of the guarantee charging model included in the draft Scheme laid before both Houses of the Oireachtas on 15th October 2008. In relation to asset figures for the institutions concerned, in addition to standard company law reporting obligations to publish audited accounts and those arising under the Building Societies Acts as well as disclos- ure requirements which apply to public limited companies under Stock Exchange rules, under paragraph 24 of the Scheme a covered institution shall submit such reports as are requested by the Regulatory Authority on behalf of the Minister which the Regulatory Authority considers are necessary to monitor compliance with the terms and conditions of the Scheme and the achievement of the purposes of the Act of 2008. These reports will address liquidity require- ments, capital ratios, asset quality, risk exposures and funding costs. As the Deputy will be aware the guarantee provided by the Government relates to certain liabilities of covered insti- tutions as set out at paragraph 10 of the Scheme which will be published in aggregate quarterly in Iris Oifigiu´ il.

Cancer Screening Programme. 15. Deputy Joe McHugh asked the Minister for Health and Children the number of women in County Donegal who have been called for appointments under the BreastCheck programme to date; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35196/08]

Minister for Health and Children (Deputy Mary Harney): The Deputy’s specific question in relation to BreastCheck in County Donegal is the responsibility of the National Cancer Screen- ing Service. Accordingly, my Department has requested the Chief Executive Officer of the Service to respond directly to the Deputy in relation to the matter raised.

Health Service Expenditure. 16. Deputy Olivia Mitchell asked the Minister for Health and Children the reason people hiring equipment from the Health Service Executive have not been refunded for months; if his attention has been drawn to the fact that many people are out of pocket and suffering hardship as the result of the stopping of all refund payments; if she will pay out a portion of the money due to alleviate hardship being caused by this dispute; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35201/08]

Minister for Health and Children (Deputy Mary Harney): As the Health Service Executive has the operational and funding responsibility for Primary Care Services, it is the appropriate body to consider the particular case raised by the Deputy. My Department has therefore requested the Parliamentary Affairs Division of the Executive to arrange to address this matter and to have a reply issued directly to the Deputy.

Adoption Services. 17. Deputy Tom Hayes asked the Minister for Health and Children if the grandfather clause has been eliminated from the legislation ratifying the Hague Convention; if she will re-consider eliminating it; if bilateral agreements are in the process of being drawn up as soon as possible to deal with couples wanting to adopt from countries not ratifying the convention; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35202/08] 151 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

Minister of State at the Department of Health and Children (Deputy Barry Andrews): The purpose of ratifying the Hague Convention is to protect children in the process of adoption. It is the intention that the proposed adoption legislation will ensure all intercountry adoptions meet standards of the Convention either through ratification of the Convention or through bilateral agreements which meet the standards of the Hague Convention. After giving the matter detailed consideration during the drafting process, I have decided not to include a ‘grandfather clause’ in the Adoption Bill, 2008. I am concerned that such a provision would result in a considerable dilution of the intent of the legislation in the short and medium term. My priority is to conclude bilateral agreements in those non-Hague countries which Ireland has a tradition of adopting from, where this is possible. My officials are working with the Department of Foreign Affairs on this basis. Where bilateral agreements have not been completed prior to commencement every effort will be made to manage cases that may arise acting in the best interests of the children involved. Information on progress on the proposed Bill and the changes contained within it will be made available to applicants over the period prior to commencement to minimise the number of cases and to ensure the best possible management of such cases where they arise. My officials, and officials from the Adoption Board are working to ensure an orderly transition to the new arrangements as well as working proactively to minimise the impact on families who hope to adopt from countries which have not yet ratified the Convention. I would like to assure the Deputy of my attention to this issue.

Nursing Homes Repayment Scheme. 18. Deputy Ciara´n Lynch asked the Minister for Health and Children the status of a claim for repayment under the long-term care scheme in respect of a person (details supplied) in County Cork; if a date has been set for an oral hearing; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35207/08]

Minister for Health and Children (Deputy Mary Harney): The Health Repayment Scheme Appeals Office is an independent office established to provide an appeals service to those who wish to appeal the decision of the Scheme Administrator under the Health (Repayment Scheme) Act 2006. The Health Repayment Scheme Appeals Office has advised my Department that the claim- ant referred to by the Deputy lodged an appeal form with the Health Repayment Scheme Appeals Office on 21 April 2008 and lodged an oral hearing form on 30 April 2008. An oral hearing will be arranged for the claimant in Cork. When the Appeals Officer has made a determination on this appeal he/she will write to the claimant and will provide the claimant with the reasons for the decision.

Cancer Screening Programme. 19. Deputy Bobby Aylward asked the Minister for Health and Children the reason for the delay in having the national breast screening programme extended to Waterford; and when this service is expected to be available. [35219/08]

Minister for Health and Children (Deputy Mary Harney): The Deputy’s specific question in relation to the roll out of BreastCheck to County Waterford is the responsibility of the National Cancer Screening Service. Accordingly, my Department has requested the Chief Executive Officer of the Service to respond directly to the Deputy in relation to the matter raised. 152 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

Hospital Services. 20. Deputy Joe Costello asked the Minister for Health and Children if her attention has been drawn to the case of a person (details supplied) in Dublin 1; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35222/08]

Minister for Health and Children (Deputy Mary Harney): I was not aware of this particular case and I sympathise with the person concerned. My Department has requested the Parliamentary Affairs Division of the Health Service Executive, as the appropriate body to arrange to have the case investigated as a matter of urgency and to have a reply issued directly to the Deputy.

Hospital Hygiene Standards. 21. Deputy Tom Hayes asked the Minister for Health and Children her views on the com- pliance rates with hand-hygiene policy regarding MRSA in hospitals here which her Depart- ment informed this Deputy is estimated at 60 to 70%; the policy being undertaken in her Department specifically, and in the Heath Service Executive to improve this; and her views on same in the context of two infants becoming infected here in recent weeks while in hospital. [35227/08]

Minister for Health and Children (Deputy Mary Harney): Achieving and maintaining the highest possible standards of hygiene in our hospitals and healthcare facilities generally is a priority for this Government and for the Health Service Executive (HSE). Hygiene and infec- tion control measures are key to the prevention of the spread of Health Care Associated Infections in our hospital system. Hand hygiene surveys were carried out recently in HSE funded acute hospitals. Audit results are available in respect of approximately 60% of the hospitals participating in the survey. Of those, 50% or 15 hospitals achieved a compliance rate of 70% or more in relation to hand hygiene. The HSE Infection Control Steering Group has now tasked every hospital in the HSE to undertake audits of hand hygiene in every clinical area in their institution by the end of 2008. The Steering Group has indicated that it intends to introduce a mandatory scheme of hand hygiene audits in 2009, the results of which are expected to be published at the end of that year and thereafter on an annual basis. Further data collected by the Health Protection Surveillance Centre in its national surveil- lance system on HCAIs, show that there was a statistically significant (43%) increase in the median rate of alcohol hand gel usage between 2006 and 2007. The overall level of alcohol hand gel usage is similar to levels reported from successful hand hygiene campaigns internationally. The Health Information and Quality Authority (HIQA) which is the statutory body respon- sible for independently setting and monitoring healthcare standards generally undertook a com- prehensive review of hygiene in our acute hospitals in 2007 and published its report last November. This review was based on hygiene standards which were accredited by the Inter- national Society for Quality in Healthcare. The report represents a thorough assessment of how hygiene services are provided and managed in 51 HSE-funded acute care hospitals. During 2008, HIQA followed up on this review to ensure that deficits identified during that process were being rectified and the Authority has already commenced a further national review last month. In addition, HIQA is due to publish Infection Prevention and Control Standards later this year. These standards are consistent with international best practice. When finalised, these, 153 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

[Deputy Mary Harney.] along with the National Hygiene Standards, will provide a comprehensive framework to control infection in all healthcare settings.

Health Services. 22. Deputy Tom Hayes asked the Minister for Health and Children the reason she stated in a reply to Parliamentary Question No. 316 on 30 September 2008 that the newborn screening programme for cystic fibrosis was going ahead in 2008 in view of the fact that the relevant reply from the Health Service Executive says that the HSE are looking for funding for this programme for 2009; if her attention has been drawn to this change of date for this essential programme; her views on the length of time it has taken for this programme to be implemented; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35228/08]

Minister for Health and Children (Deputy Mary Harney): I advised the Deputy in my reply of 30th September that the Health Service Executive Service Plan for 2008 included provision for the implementation of a plan for screening newborns for cystic fibrosis and commencement of screening by the end of 2008. My Department is now advised that it will not be possible to commence the screening prog- ramme as planned in 2008. The position will require to be reviewed in the context of the total level of funding available to the HSE in 2009.

Nursing Homes Repayment Scheme. 23. Deputy Edward O’Keeffe asked the Minister for Health and Children the reason specific type accommodation is not included in the long stay repayment scheme; and if her attention has been drawn to the case of a person (details supplied) in County Cork. [35261/08]

Minister for Health and Children (Deputy Mary Harney): The Health Service Executive has responsibility for administering the Repayment Scheme and the information sought by the Deputy relates to matters within the area of responsibility of the Executive. My Department has requested the Parliamentary Affairs Division of the Executive to arrange to have the matter investigated and to have a reply issued to the Deputy.

Health Services. 24. Deputy Finian McGrath asked the Minister for Health and Children if he will support a person (details supplied) in Dublin 5. [35273/08]

Minister of State at the Department of Health and Children (Deputy Ma´ire Hoctor): Oper- ational responsibility for the management and delivery of health and personal social services was assigned to the Health Service Executive under the Health Act 2004. Therefore, the Execu- tive is the appropriate body to consider the particular case raised by the Deputy. The Depart- ment has requested the Parliamentary Affairs Division of the Executive to arrange to have the matter investigated and to have a reply issued directly to the Deputy.

25. Deputy Finian McGrath asked the Minister for Health and Children if she will support a matter (details supplied). [35274/08]

Minister of State at the Department of Health and Children (Deputy John Moloney): The Deputy raised a question regarding the same case in September. At that time I advised that the matter had been referred to the Parliamentary Affairs Division of the Health Service 154 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

Executive (HSE) for direct reply to the Deputy, as the question related to the management and delivery of health and personal services, which are the responsibility of the Health Service Executive under the Health Act 2004. I understand that the HSE replied to the Deputy on 23rd September last. However, I have requested the Parliamentary Affairs Division of the Executive to provide a further update directly to the Deputy.

26. Deputy Finian McGrath asked the Minister for Health and Children if she will support a case (details supplied). [35276/08]

Minister for Health and Children (Deputy Mary Harney): Operational responsibility for the management and delivery of health and personal social services is a matter for the Health Service Executive and funding for all health services has been provided as part of its overall vote. Therefore, the Executive is the appropriate body to consider the particular case raised by the Deputy. My Department has requested the Parliamentary Affairs Division of the Execu- tive to arrange to have the matter investigated and to have a reply issued directly to the Deputy.

27. Deputy Finian McGrath asked the Minister for Health and Children if she will support a matter (details supplied). [35277/08]

Minister of State at the Department of Health and Children (Deputy John Moloney): The Deputy’s question relates to the management and delivery of health and personal services, which are the responsibility of the Health Service Executive under the Health Act 2004. Accordingly, my Department has requested the Parliamentary Affairs Division of the Execu- tive to arrange to have this case investigated and to have a reply issued directly to the Deputy.

Nursing Homes Repayment Scheme. 28. Deputy Denis Naughten asked the Minister for Health and Children, further to Parliamentary Question No. 327 of 8 July 2008, the position regarding the issue of interest owing to long stay patients and the recommendations and conclusion as a result of these meet- ings; the estimate of the value of interest which is owed to patients; when repayment will commence: the cost of the administration of this repayment programme; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35282/08]

Minister for Health and Children (Deputy Mary Harney): The Department has been advised by the Health Service Executive (HSE) that it is progressing with the task of transferring past interest retained on invested patient private property accounts and a process to undertake this transfer, initially for the period 2005-2006 has been agreed. The HSE has advised that the issue of tax liability for clients in receipt of such payments has now been clarified by the Revenue Commissioners and that the refund will not give rise to any tax implications for either the individual client or the HSE. The HSE advises that initial testing of the computer programme to calculate payments to clients is now complete and that the validation of data on details of clients and their patient private property account balances for the first planned tranche of payments is also complete. The HSE also advises that the final proposal on the process and rules around making pay- ments is currently being completed. Proposals on a number of key issues have been considered including, dealing with very small payment amounts, situations where it is not possible to locate the person entitled to receive the payment and situations where complete information is not 155 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

[Deputy Mary Harney.] available. Final agreement on these processes will then allow for an estimation of the overall cost of administering the refund process. The overall estimate for total refund of interest remains as previously advised, approximately \31m or approximately \48m when adjusted for inflation by reference to the Consumer Price Index.

Services for People with Disabilities. 29. Deputy Jan O’Sullivan asked the Minister for Health and Children when Revenue fund- ing will be provided to open two residential centres (details supplied) in County Limerick for persons with disabilities; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35283/08]

Minister of State at the Department of Health and Children (Deputy John Moloney): The Deputy’s question relates to the management and delivery of health and personal services, which are the responsibility of the Health Service Executive under the Health Act 2004. Accordingly, my Department has requested the Parliamentary Affairs Division of the Execu- tive to arrange to have this matter investigated and to have a reply issued directly to the Deputy.

Hospital Services. 30. Deputy Edward O’Keeffe asked the Minister for Health and Children if she will arrange for a person (details supplied) in County Cork to be admitted to hospital for a procedure or if she will refer them to the National Treatment Purchase Fund. [35287/08]

Minister for Health and Children (Deputy Mary Harney): Operational responsibility for the management and delivery of health and personal social services is a matter for the Health Service Executive and funding for all health services has been provided as part of its overall Vote. Therefore, the Executive is the appropriate body to consider the particular case raised by the Deputy. My Department has requested the Parliamentary Affairs Division of the Execu- tive to arrange to have the matter investigated and to have a reply issued directly to the Deputy. Patients waiting more than three months on a surgical waiting list may qualify for treatment under the National Treatment Purchase Fund. It is open to the person in question or anyone acting on their behalf to contact the Fund directly in relation to their case.

Health Services. 31. Deputy Frank Feighan asked the Minister for Health and Children the position regarding the moneys put in place for a development (details supplied); the progress made on this development to date; and when it if expected to come to fruition. [35301/08]

Minister for Health and Children (Deputy Mary Harney): Under the Health Act 2004, the management and delivery of health and personal social services is the responsibility of the Health Service Executive. This includes operational responsibility for the establishment of Primary Care Teams and Primary Care Centres. Accordingly, my Department has requested the Parliamentary Affairs Division of the Executive to arrange to have this matter investigated and to have a reply issued directly to the Deputy.

Pre-school Services. 32. Deputy Leo Varadkar asked the Minister for Health and Children the options available 156 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers from her Department or it agencies for preschools in respect of children with autism or autistic spectrum disorder; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35308/08]

Minister of State at the Department of Health and Children (Deputy John Moloney): The provision of pre-school facilities for children with intellectual disabilities is primarily a matter for the Department of Education and Science. That Department provides some pre-school provision for children with special educational needs through the visiting teacher service and, more recently, through the expansion of the home tuition scheme to provide funding for home programmes for pre-school children on the autistic spectrum. In addition, the Department of Education and Science fund a number of early intervention classes for children with autism, with these classes attached to mainstream schools.

Illegal Substances. 33. Deputy Leo Varadkar asked the Minister for Health and Children the action she is taking to address the issue of head shops selling BZP, cannabis seeds, smilers, jokers and other psychotropic products in retail outlets and on-line; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35309/08]

Minister for Health and Children (Deputy Mary Harney): I am aware that a range of sub- stances often referred to by the generic term “legal highs”, which mimic or cause effects similar to illicit substances, are available and are not currently scheduled under Misuse of Drugs legis- lation. As “legal highs” are not controlled substances, there is no basis at present to prevent their advertisement and sale in “head shops” or on-line. While the cultivation of cannabis itself is prohibited, except under licence for the purposes of research, the sale of cannabis seeds as novelty items is not prohibited. The Misuse of Drugs Act 1977 and regulations made thereunder regulate and control the import, export, production, supply and possession of a range of named narcotic drugs and psychotropic substances listed in the Schedules to the Act. Substances are scheduled under the Act in accordance with Ireland’s obligations under international conventions or where there is evidence that the substances are causing significant harm to public health in Ireland, which could merit the criminalisation of their sale and use. The list of scheduled substances is kept under review on an ongoing basis. In particular, my Department reviews any evidence that substances are being abused and are causing significant harm to public health. For example, in 2006 psychotropic (magic) mushrooms were brought under control and their possession and sale are now an offence. Furthermore, following the European Council of Ministers’ decision in March 2008 to bring Benzylpiperazine (BZP) under control, which was deemed to pose an excessive risk as a party pill, my Department will be introducing regulations to restrict the availability of BZP.

Organ Retention. 34. Deputy Leo Varadkar asked the Minister for Health and Children the legal situation regarding the retention of organs by pathologists without the consent of the next of kin and their subsequent sale by hospitals; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35310/08]

35. Deputy Leo Varadkar asked the Minister for Health and Children when she will intro- duce legislation with regard to consent for the retention of organs by pathologists and hospitals; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35311/08] 157 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

Minister for Health and Children (Deputy Mary Harney): I propose to take Questions Nos. 34 and 35 together. The Deputy may be referring to the supply of pituitary glands by hospitals to pharmaceutical companies for the production of human growth hormone between 1976 and 1988. Dr Deirdre Madden, a distinguished expert on medical law, was appointed by Government in May 2005 to provide a report on key issues in paediatric post mortem practice and procedures, including the issue raised by the Deputy. Dr. Madden addressed the matter in detail in Chapter 6 of her report (the Madden Report) and concluded that “These glands were consistently taken at post- mortem examination without any specific consent of parents or next-of-kin and without any statutory regime in place for so doing.” In relation to the question of payment she stated that “The payment made was modest and was not a payment for the pituitary gland itself but for the additional work required in its recovery and storage, pending delivery to the pharmaceutical companies concerned.” The Madden Report recommended that:

1. No human organs removed from a deceased child at post-mortem examination should be supplied by hospitals to any pharmaceutical company or other third party without the knowledge and authorisation of the parents.

2. Where such organs are supplied, arrangements should be clearly approved by hospital management and documented, and all information supplied to the parents on request.

3. The use of human organs derived from post-mortem examinations should be regulated by law.

On 23 September last, the Government approved the preparation of the General Scheme and Heads of a Human Tissue Bill to regulate post-mortem examination, including the removal, retention, storage, use and disposal of tissue; anatomical examination; public display; import/export of human tissue from deceased donors and consent for the use of donated tissue from living and deceased persons for the purpose of transplantation and research. It is also proposed that the legislation will prohibit the commercialisation of human tissue from living and deceased donors for transplantation. The proposed legislation will address hospital post-mortems, which are voluntary procedures, as distinct from coroners’ post-mortems which are part of the legal process of determining the cause of death and which come within the ambit of the Coroners Act 1962. The legislation will take account of the recommendations made in the Madden Report and consent/authorisation will be the defining principle underpinning any of the specified activities involving human tissue.

Health Services. 36. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Health and Children if and when provision will be made for speech and language services and occupational therapy services in a school (details supplied) in County Kildare which is in need of same; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35324/08]

Minister of State at the Department of Health and Children (Deputy John Moloney): The Deputy’s question relates to the management and delivery of health and personal social services, which under the Health Act, 2004 are the responsibility of the Health Service Execu- tive. Accordingly, my Department has requested the Parliamentary Affairs Division of the 158 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

Executive to arrange to have this matter investigated and to have a reply issued directly to the Deputy.

Medical Cards. 37. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Health and Children the reason a full medical card has been withdrawn in the case of a person (details supplied) in County Kildare; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35325/08]

Minister for Health and Children (Deputy Mary Harney): As the Health Service Executive has the operational and funding responsibility for the medical card benefit, it is the appropriate body to consider the particular case raised by the Deputy. My Department has therefore requested the Parliamentary Affairs Division of the Executive to arrange to address this matter and to have a reply issued directly to the Deputy.

38. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Health and Children when a medical card will issue in the case of a person (details supplied) in County Kildare; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35326/08]

Minister for Health and Children (Deputy Mary Harney): As the Health Service Executive has the operational and funding responsibility for the medical card benefit, it is the appropriate body to consider the particular case raised by the Deputy. My Department has therefore requested the Parliamentary Affairs Division of the Executive to arrange to address this matter and to have a reply issued directly to the Deputy.

39. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Health and Children if and when a medical card will issue in the case of a person (details supplied) in County Kildare; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35327/08]

Minister for Health and Children (Deputy Mary Harney): As the Health Service Executive has the operational and funding responsibility for the medical card benefit, it is the appropriate body to consider the particular case raised by the Deputy. My Department has therefore requested the Parliamentary Affairs Division of the Executive to arrange to address this matter and to have a reply issued directly to the Deputy.

Cancer Screening Programme. 40. Deputy Joe McHugh asked the Minister for Health and Children if she will make a statement on the outsourcing of smear testing to the USA; if she will explain the cervical screening programme plan to initially limit colposcopy treatment to 11 centres; and if she will assure the colposcopy team and people of County Donegal that the colposcopy service at Letterkenny General Hospital will remain permanently; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35360/08]

Minister for Health and Children (Deputy Mary Harney): In June 2008 the National Cancer Screening Service (NCSS) awarded the contract for cytology laboratory testing for the national cervical screening programme to Quest Diagnostics. Quest Diagnostics successfully met all the required criteria set out under the procurement process which was open to local and inter- national laboratories. Quest Diagnostics was previously contracted by the Health Service Executive (HSE) to clear significant backlogs of smear tests in the Irish system. 159 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

[Deputy Mary Harney.]

Colposcopy services are an integral part of a population based screening programme. Women who have pre-cancerous cell changes detected by their smear test are referred for colposcopy. The NCSS is making a significant investment to enhance colposcopy services. This will ensure timely access to a quality assured colposcopy service for women who require further inves- tigation. It is important to ensure that as part of CervicalCheck, women can access colposcopy services within international best practice timeframes, based on adherence to quality assured clinical practice and the achievement of best clinical outcomes for women. The NCSS has identified 11 colposcopy services to support CervicalCheck initially. The col- poscopy service at Letterkenny General Hospital (LGH) has not been identified for initial referrals of women. However, in the interim LGH will continue to provide colposcopy services to women already attending or awaiting colposcopy. The provision of additional colposcopy services to women in the North West is being exam- ined. The colposcopy service at LGH requires a number of enhancements to meet the quality assurance standards defined by the NCSS. The NCSS is working with LGH and the question of the hospital’s future participation in the colposcopy service for CervicalCheck will be con- sidered in this context. Discussions between the hospital and the NCSS are due to take place this week.

Health Care Funding. 41. Deputy Olwyn Enright asked the Minister for Health and Children the amount of money that was ring-fenced in 2008 for rape crisis centres; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35368/08]

Minister of State at the Department of Health and Children (Deputy Mary Wallace): The Deputy’s question relates to the funding, management and delivery of health and personal social services, which are the responsibility of the Health Service Executive under the Health Act 2004. Accordingly, my Department has requested the Parliamentary Affairs Division of the Executive to arrange to have this matter investigated and to have a reply issued directly to the Deputy.

Icelandic Investments. 42. Deputy Ciara´n Lynch asked the Minister for Health and Children if public bodies here have invested funds in Icelandic financial products; the status of such investments; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35508/08]

Minister for Health and Children (Deputy Mary Harney): The Public Bodies under the aegis of and funded by my Department, have informed my Department that they have not invested funds in Icelandic financial products. Funding for these agencies is made available in accordance with allocations notified to them, to enable them to carry out their statutory functions and it would therefore not be in accord- ance with policy to provide cash to them for investment purposes.

Ministerial Appointments. 43. Deputy Ciara´n Lynch asked the Minister for Transport if he will confirm that persons appointed to positions under the Road Safety Authority Act 2006, the Railway Safety Act 2005 160 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers and the Taxi Regulation Act 2003 were appointed in accordance with the regulations set out in those Acts; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35294/08]

Minister for Transport (Deputy Noel Dempsey): Under the Railway Safety Act 2005, 14 members of the Railway Safety Advisory Council were appointed by my predecessor, Martin Cullen, as Minister for Transport. He also appointed the Chief Investigator of the Railway Accident Investigation Unit of the Railway Safety Commission under that Act. Under Section 14(2) of the Road Safety Authority Act I appointed the board of the Road Safety Authority for a five-year period with effect from 1 September 2006. Persons appointed as Commissioner for Taxi Regulation or as staff of the Commission for Taxi Regulation are appointed in accordance with the provisions of sections 14 and 18 of the Taxi Regulation Act 2003 by the Minister for Transport and the Commission respectively. Appointments to the Advisory Council to the Commission for Taxi Regulation are made by the Minister for Transport in accordance with the provisions of section 54 of the 2003 Act. I can confirm that all appointments were made in accordance with the provisions of the Acts and with all other legal requirements.

Icelandic Investments. 44. Deputy Ciara´n Lynch asked the Minister for Transport if public bodies here have invested funds in Icelandic financial products; the status of such investments; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35511/08]

Minister for Transport (Deputy Noel Dempsey): The question of investments by public bodies under the aegis of my Department is a day to day matter for the bodies concerned. I have no statutory function in the matter.

Services for People with Disabilities. 45. Deputy Aengus O´ Snodaigh asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the position regarding the implementation of the National Disability Strategy. [35230/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): Since its launch in 2004, considerable progress has been made by my Department on the implementation of the National Disability Strategy, which underpins the participation of people with disabilities in Irish society by building on existing policy and legislation. My Department is responsible for the provision of the framework for the implementation of the Strategy, including cross-Departmental co-ordination, and reports to the Cabinet Commit- tee on Social Inclusion on progress of the Strategy. The Strategy is now also the agreed focus of disability policy under the Partnership Agreement, Towards 2016, under which the National Disability Strategy Stakeholder Monitoring Group was established in November 2006 to moni- tor progress on the overall implementation of the Strategy. The Group comprises representa- tives of stakeholder groups, trade unions, senior officials and the National Disability Authority (NDA). My Department serves as Secretariat to the Group. Towards 2016 contains a commitment to publish a strategic document on the Strategy which will outline the vision, mission and strategic objectives under the Strategy. The draft document has been prepared by my Department and forwarded to all of the relevant partners. It is due to be finalised later in the year and will be published as soon as possible after that. 161 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

[Deputy Dermot Ahern.]

A new Office for Disability and Mental Health was established in January this year to sup- port the Minister of State for Equality, Disability Issues and Mental Health at the Department of Health and Children. This new office has cross-cutting responsibilities in a number of Departments, including my Department. Key elements of the National Disability Strategy continue to be the Disability Act 2005 and the Sectoral Plans of key Departments for service provision for people with disabilities. The National Disability Authority is also concerned with the implementation of important aspects of the Strategy and works closely with my Department to meet relevant objectives. The accessibility provisions of the Disability Act are supported by the ‘Code of Practice on Accessibility of Public Services and Information provided by Public Bodies’ which was pub- lished in July 2006. The Code of Practice was developed by the NDA in consultation with my Department and helps public bodies to make services and information accessible to people with disabilities and provides them with guidance on meeting their obligations under the Act. The NDA has developed and circulated a monitoring questionnaire to assist the evaluation of the implementation of this code by public bodies, and will report on the matter in due course. The Act also gives statutory effect to the 3% employment target for people with disabilities in the public sector and my Department has a key role in relation to the implementation of these provisions. The Act provides for a framework for monitoring this target through monitor- ing committees in each Government Department and the NDA has an overall monitoring and reporting role under the Act. The first statutory report on the compliance by the public service with the employment target for people with disabilities was published on 4 January 2008, and the second report by the NDA which concerns compliance with the target in 2007 is due to be submitted to me by the end of November. Again, under the Act, a Centre for Excellence in Universal Design has been established within the NDA with the support of my Department (2007). The Centre has an important role in contributing to the development and promotion of standards in universal design.

Legal Costs. 46. Deputy Michael Ring asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform if he will ascertain from the Chief State Solicitor’s Office the reason legal costs have not been granted in a case (details supplied) as per the High Court Order. [35231/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): A Payable Order for payment of the costs awarded to the applicant in this case was forwarded to the Chief State Solicitor’s Office on 6 October 2008 for onward transmission to the Solicitor concerned.

Visa Applications. 47. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the position in relation to an application for family reunification in the case of a person (details supplied) in County Dublin; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35238/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): I am informed by the Immigration Division of my Department that an application for Family Reunification was made in April, 2006. The application was forwarded to the Refugee Applications Commissioner for investigation as required under Section 18 of the Refugee Act 1996. This investigation is completed and the 162 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

Commissioner has forwarded a report to my Department. This application is in the final stages of processing and a decision will issue shortly.

48. Deputy Catherine Byrne asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the status of visa applications in respect of persons (details supplied); if these visa applications will be expedited in view of their age and desire to reunite with family members here; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35254/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): The visa appli- cations referred to by the Deputy were received in the Visa Office, New Delhi on 27 December 2007. Both were refused by the Visa Officer on 5 February 2008. The visas were sought to allow the applicants to join their adult children in Ireland, as dependants, on a long term basis. Taking into account migration patterns which would result in an unnecessary burden on public funds, and allowing for special procedures applied in the case of families of EU nationals resident in Ireland, it is the general policy of my Department not to grant visas that would enable parents to join their adult children in Ireland, as depend- ants, on a long term or permanent basis.

Probation and Welfare Service. 49. Deputy Denis Naughten asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform if he will publish the independent evaluation which has been completed into a centre (details supplied) in County Roscommon; the provisions which are being made for the existing staff; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35263/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): I refer the Deputy to my detailed reply to him on 14 October 2008. The report prepared by the independent evaluators contains personal and commercially sen- sitive information and was not intended for general publication in its current format. However, the consultants have been asked to provide a version for general publication which I expect will be available to me shortly, making it possible to publish it on my Department’s website early next week. The Probation Service will work with the Board of Management to effect the orderly closure of the project in its present form including redundancy payments to staff paid out of Service funding.

Citizenship Applications. 50. Deputy Paul Kehoe asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the reason a residency requirement was not met in respect of a person (details supplied in County Wexford; the number of months by which the application was short; when a new application will be valid; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35289/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): An application for a certificate of naturalisation from the person referred to in the Deputy’s Question was received in the Citizenship Section of my Department in February 2008. Section 15 of the Irish Nationality and Citizenship Act, 1956, as amended provides that the applicant must have been resident in the State for a period of one year immediately prior to the application and four years in the eight year period before that, sixty months in total. On 163 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

[Deputy Dermot Ahern.] examination of the application it was determined that the person concerned did not meet this requirement, being some 16 months short. However, it was noted that the person concerned is the spouse of an Irish National. Section 15A of the Irish Nationality and Citizenship Act, 1956, as amended, provides that the Minister may grant a certificate of naturalisation to the non-national spouse of an Irish citizen, if among other things, the applicant has been married to that citizen for a period of not less than three years and has been resident in the State for a period of one year immediately prior to the application and two years in the four year period before that, thirty six months in total. The person in question was informed of this and invited to submit an Affidavit in a letter issued by registered post on 10 July, 2008. This letter was returned to my Department and was re-issued on 25 July, 2008. A final reminder letter was issued on 12 September, 2008, this letter was also returned to my Department. I am informed by my officials that as the applicant did not reply to this correspondence the file has now been closed. The address the Deputy has supplied corresponds with the address given to my Department by the applicant. It is open to the person concerned to lodge a new application if and when he is in a position to meet the statutory residency requirement applicable at that time.

Departmental Expenditure. 51. Deputy Denis Naughten asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the amount of his budget allocation to the Minister for Integration which has been carried out; and the breakdown of the main expenditures in 2008. [35316/08]

Minister of State at the Department of Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Conor Lenihan): The amount disbursed from Subhead E.8 of the Justice, Equality and Law Reform Vote to end-September was approximately \3.081 million. The main expenditures have been: Miscellaneous Grants: \1.45 million; Grant to the National Consultative Committee on Racism and Interculturalism (NCCRI): \373,000; National Action Plan Against Racism: \378,000; Sal- aries, Wages and Allowances charged to the Subhead: \385,000; and Incidental Expenses: \353,000. I expect there will be further substantial expenditure before year-end which will include funding for local authorities and to certain major sporting bodies for measures to promote integration. Further substantial payments will also be made by my Office to bodies directly involved in tackling racism and promoting interculturalism.

Garda Stations 52. Deputy Joanna Tuffy asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the steps he will take to provide a new full-time Garda station in Rathcoole, County Dublin; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35318/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): I am informed that the Garda authorities that a Garda Accommodation Programme Board has been established under the chairmanship of the Chief Administrative Officer to prepare a long-term accom- modation strategy for the Force. The policing accommodation needs of Rathcoole will be con- sidered in the context of this strategy. I am further informed by the Garda Commissioner that Garda personnel assigned through- out the country, together with overall policing arrangements and operational strategy are con- 164 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers tinually monitored and reviewed. Such monitoring ensures that optimum use is made of Garda resources and the best possible service is provided to the public. In that regard, the require- ments of Rathcoole Garda Station will be fully considered by the Commissioner within the overall context of the needs of Garda Divisions throughout the country.

Residency Permits. 53. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the progress to date in regard to residency in the case of a person (details supplied) in County Kildare; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35328/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): I am informed by the Immigration Division of my Department that the person referred to by the Deputy was granted permission to remain in the State on 16 February, 2005, following a Family Reunifi- cation application. I am also informed that the person’s permission to remain was renewed on 21st July, 2008 and will expire on 21 July, 2009.

Asylum Applications. 54. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the progress to date in regard to a residency application in the case of a person (details supplied) in County Wexford; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35329/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): The person con- cerned applied for asylum on 11 April 2007. His application was refused following consideration of his case by the Office of the Refugee Applications Commissioner and, on appeal, the Refu- gee Appeals Tribunal. Subsequently, in accordance with Section 3 of the Immigration Act 1999 (as amended) the person concerned was informed, by letter dated 21 August 2008, that the Minister proposed to make a Deportation Order in respect of him. He was given the options, to be exercised within 15 working days, of leaving the State voluntarily, of consenting to the making of a Deportation Order or of making representations to the Minister setting out the reasons why he should be allowed to remain temporarily in the State. In addition, he was notified of his entitlement to apply for Subsidiary Protection in the State in accordance with the European Communities (Eligibility for Protection) Regulations 2006 (S.I. No. 518 of 2006). The person concerned submitted an application for Subsidiary Protection in the State in accordance with these Regu- lations and this application is under consideration at present. When consideration of this appli- cation has been completed, the person concerned will be notified in writing of the outcome. In the event that the Subsidiary Protection application is refused, the case file of the person concerned, including all representations submitted, is passed to me for decision.

55. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform when the necessary residency status will be approved in the case of a person (details supplied) in Dublin 2; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35330/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): The person con- cerned applied for asylum on 21 April 2004. His asylum application was refused following consideration of his case by the Office of the Refugee Applications Commissioner and, on appeal, the Refugee Appeals Tribunal. 165 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

[Deputy Dermot Ahern.]

Subsequently, in accordance with Section 3 of the Immigration Act, 1999 (as amended), the person concerned was informed, by letter dated 30 September 2005, that the Minister proposed to make a Deportation Order in respect of him. He was given the options, to be exercised within 15 working days, of leaving the State voluntarily, of consenting to the making of a Deportation Order or of making representations to the Minister setting out the reasons why he should be allowed to remain temporarily in the State. Representations have been submitted on behalf of the person concerned and will be fully considered before the file is passed to me for decision.

Deportation Orders. 56. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the progress in the past year in the case of an application for residency and citizenship in the name of a person (details supplied) in County Kildare; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35331/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): The person con- cerned arrived in the State on 7 May 2002. He claimed asylum on 31 May 2002 and his appli- cation was refused following consideration of his case by the Office of the Refugee Applications Commissioner and, on appeal, by the Refugee Appeals Tribunal. The person concerned was informed by letter dated 24 May 2004 that the Minister proposed to make a Deportation Order in respect of him and afforded him three options in accordance with Section 3(3)(b)(ii) of the Immigration Act, 1999 (as amended), namely to leave the State voluntarily, to consent to the making of a Deportation Order or to submit, within 15 working days, written representations to the Minister setting out the reasons why he should be allowed to remain temporarily in the State i.e why he should not be deported. His case was examined under Section 3(6) of the Immigration Act, 1999 (as amended), and Section 5 of the Refugee Act, 1996 (as amended) on the Prohibition of Refoulement. Consider- ation was given to all representations submitted on his behalf for permission to remain in the State. On 21 July 2005 one of my predecessors refused permission to remain temporarily in the State and instead signed a Deportation Order in respect of him. Notice of this order was served by registered post requiring the person concerned to present himself at the Garda National Immigration Bureau (GNIB),13-14 Burgh Quay, Dublin 2 on Thursday 4 August 2005 in order to make travel arrangements for his removal from the State. He presented as required and was given further presentation dates which he kept. By letter dated 23 July 2008, the legal representatives of the person concerned applied for the revocation of his Deportation Order. On 9 October 2008 I affirmed the Deportation Order in this case. Notice of the affirmed Deportation Order was served by registered post requiring the person concerned to present himself at the Garda National Immigration Bureau (GNIB),13-14 Burgh Quay, Dublin 2 on Thursday 6 November 2008 in order to make travel arrangements for his removal from the State. The effect of the Deportation Order is that the person concerned must leave the State and remain thereafter out of the State. The enforcement of the Deportation Order is an operational matter for the Garda National Immigration Bureau.

57. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the progress since 7 May 2008 in the case of an application for leave to remain or other status in 166 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers the case of a person (details supplied) in County Kildare; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35332/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): The person con- cerned arrived in the State on 20 December 2004 and applied for asylum. Her application was refused following consideration of her case by the Office of the Refugee Applications Commissioner and, on appeal, by the Refugee Appeals Tribunal. Subsequently, in accordance with Section 3 of the Immigration Act 1999 (as amended), the person concerned was informed, by letter dated 24 March 2006, that the Minister proposed to make a deportation order in respect of her. She was given the options, to be exercised within 15 working days, of leaving the State voluntarily, of consenting to the making of a Deportation Order or of making representations to the Minister setting out the reasons why she should be allowed to remain temporarily in the State i.e. why she should not be deported. Her case was examined under Section 3(6) of the Immigration Act, 1999 (as amended), and Section 5 of the Refugee Act, 1996 (as amended) on the prohibition of Refoulement. Consider- ation was given to representations received on her behalf. On 9 October 2008, I refused per- mission to remain temporarily in the State and instead signed a Deportation Order in respect of the person concerned. Notice of this order was served by registered post requiring the person concerned to present herself at the Garda National Immigration Bureau (GNIB) 13-14 Burgh Quay, Dublin 2 on Tuesday 4 November 2008 in order to make travel arrangements for her removal from the State. The effect of the Deportation Order is that the person concerned must leave the State and remain thereafter out of the State. The enforcement of the Deportation Order is an operational matter for GNIB.

Residency Permits. 58. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform when a application for residency and citizenship will be concluded in the case of a person (details supplied) in Dublin 15; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35333/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): The most recent permission to remain in the State, granted to the person concerned on the basis of parentage of an Irish citizen child, expired on 30 September, 2008. I am informed that the person has presented to the Garda National Immigration Bureau for renewal of this permission, but failed to produce a valid passport. The registration of permission to remain is a matter for GNIB, and a valid passport is a requirement for registration. If a person’s passport has been lost, that person is required to obtain a new passport from the relevant authorities of the issuing country. The Embassy of DR Congo in London is accredited to Ireland, and the person concerned should firstly contact that Embassy to establish what facilitation they will provide to enable the person travel to London should that be required in order to obtain a new passport.

59. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform when the necessary documentation will issue to the local emigration office to facilitate the extension of leave to remain in the State in the case of a person (details supplied) in County Louth; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35334/08]

167 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): As an exceptional measure and subject to certain stated conditions, the person concerned has been granted Leave to Remain in the State for the period to 8 April 2009. This decision was conveyed in writing to the person concerned by letter dated 8 October 2008. This communication also outlined the registration process involved i.e. to attend the local Garda District Headquarters station where, upon presentation of appropriate identification documentation and payment of the relevant registration fee, the registration process is completed.

Asylum Applications. 60. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform when the process of an application for residency and naturalisation will be concluded in the case of a person (details supplied) in Dublin 8; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35335/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): The person con- cerned applied for asylum on 7 September 2000. His application was refused following consider- ation of his case by the Office of the Refugee Applications Commissioner and, on appeal, the Refugee Appeals Tribunal. Subsequently, in accordance with Section 3 of the Immigration Act, 1999 (as amended), the person concerned was informed, by letter dated 26 February 2003, that the Minister proposed to make a Deportation Order in respect of him. He was given the options, to be exercised within 15 working days, of leaving the State voluntarily, of consenting to the making of a Deportation Order or of making representations to the Minister setting out the reasons why he should be allowed to remain temporarily in the State. Representations have been submitted on behalf of the person concerned and will be fully considered before the file is passed to me for decision.

61. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the position in regard to residency in the case of a person (details supplied) in Dublin 22; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35336/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): I refer the Deputy to my reply to his recent Parliamentary Question, No. 865 of Wednesday 24 September 2008. The position in the State of the person concerned is as set out in that Reply.

62. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform if reconsideration on humanitarian grounds will be given in the matter of residency in the case of a person (details supplied) in Dublin 2; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35337/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): The person con- cerned arrived in the State on 28 September 2004 as an unaccompanied minor. He applied for asylum on 13 January 2005. His application was refused following consideration of his case by the Office of the Refugee Applications Commissioner and, on appeal, by the Refugee Appeals Tribunal. The person concerned was informed by letter dated 14 November 2005, that the Minister proposed to make a Deportation Order in respect of him and afforded him three options in accordance with Section 3(3)(b)(ii) of the Immigration Act, 1999, as amended, namely to leave the State voluntarily, to consent to the making of a Deportation Order or to submit, within 15 168 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers working days, representations to the Minister, in writing, setting out the reasons why he should be allowed to remain temporarily in the State i.e. why he should not be deported. On 10 October, 2006, regulations known as the European Communities (Eligibility for Protection) Regulations, 2006, S.I. No. 518 of 2006, came into force. The person in question was notified by letter dated 23 May, 2007 of the new regulations and invited to apply for Subsidiary Protection and to update his representations to remain temporarily in the State . By letter dated 14 June 2007, the legal representatives of the person concerned lodged an application for Subsidiary Protection in the State on his behalf and in accordance with the Regulations. By letter dated 17 April 2008, the person concerned was advised that following consideration of his application, it was determined that he was not eligible for Subsidiary Protection. The letter went on to advise him that he would be considered under Section 3(6) of the Immigration Act, 1999, as amended, to see whether a Deportation Order should be made in respect of him. New legal representatives were engaged by the person concerned and updated representations under the said Act were lodged under cover letter dated 22 August 2008. His case was examined under Section 3 (6) of the Immigration Act, 1999, as amended, and Section 5 of the Refugee Act, 1996, as amended, on the Prohibition of Refoulement. Consider- ation was given to representations received on his behalf for permission to remain in the State. On 18 September 2008, I refused permission to remain temporarily in the State and instead signed a Deportation Order in respect of him. Notice of this order was served by registered post requiring the person concerned to present himself to the Garda National Immigration Bureau (GNIB), 13/14 Burgh Quay, Dublin 2, on Tuesday 14 October 2008, in order to make travel arrangements for his removal from the State. He presented as required and was given a further presentation date. He is due to present again on Thursday 6 November 2008. By letter dated 14 October 2008, the legal representatives of the person concerned applied to have his Deportation Order revoked. This application is currently under consideration in my Department and I expect to decide on the matter in due course.

63. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the degree to which an application for residency has been processed in the case of a person (details supplied) in County Cork; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35338/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): The person con- cerned applied for asylum on 9 June 2005. Her asylum application was refused following con- sideration of the case by the Office of the Refugee Applications Commissioner and, on appeal, the Refugee Appeals Tribunal. Subsequently, in accordance with Section 3 of the Immigration Act, 1999 (as amended), the person concerned was informed, by letter dated 31 May 2006, that the Minister proposed to make a Deportation Order in respect of her. She was given the options, to be exercised within 15 working days, of leaving the State voluntarily, of consenting to the making of a Deportation Order or of making representations to the Minister setting out the reasons why she should be allowed to remain temporarily in the State. Representations have been submitted on behalf of the person concerned and will be fully considered before the file is passed to me for decision.

64. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform if he will review the case for residency in the case of a person (details supplied) in County Meath; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35339/08] 169 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): The person con- cerned arrived in the State on 17 December 2004 and claimed asylum on 29 December 2004. Her application was refused following consideration of her case by the Office of the Refugee Applications and, on appeal, by the Refugee Appeals Tribunal. Subsequently, in accordance with Section 3 of the Immigration Act 1999 (as amended), the person concerned was informed, by letter dated 13 September 2005, that the Minister proposed to make a deportation order in respect of her. She was afforded the options, to be exercised within 15 working days, of leaving the State voluntarily, of consenting to the making of a Deportation Order or of making representations to the Minister setting out the reasons why she should be allowed to remain temporarily in the State i.e. why she should not be deported. Her case was examined under Section 3(6) of the Immigration Act, 1999 (as amended), and Section 5 of the Refugee Act, 1996 (as amended) on the prohibition of Refoulement. Consider- ation was given to representations received on her behalf from her legal representatives. On 9 February 2006 the then Minister refused permission to remain temporarily in the State and instead signed a Deportation Order in respect of her. Notice of this order was served by regis- tered post requiring the person concerned to present herself at the Garda National Immigration Bureau (GNIB) 13-14 Burgh Quay, Dublin 2 on Thursday 9 March 2006 in order to make travel arrangements for her removal from the State. She presented as required and has continued to meet the presentation requirements of the GNIB. On 8 March 2006 legal proceedings were instituted in the High Court on behalf of the person concerned challenging the decision of the then Minister to deport her. The hearing in this regard took place on 27 July 2007. The outcome of said hearing was that Leave was refused and the decision of the Minister upheld. A Subsidiary Protection application is currently under consideration in respect of the son of the person concerned. Legal proceedings, initiated on 9 May 2008, in respect of the daughter of the person concerned, challenging the refusal of her asylum claim, are currently outstanding. My Department has provided an undertaking in respect of the person concerned not to deport her from the State until a decision has been reached in respect of the immigration status of her two children. The enforcement of the Deportation Order is an operational matter for the GNIB.

65. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the progress to date in the case of an application for residency and leave to remain in the name of a person (details supplied) in County Mayo; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35340/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): The person con- cerned applied for asylum on 30 July 2004. Her asylum application was refused following con- sideration of the case by the Office of the Refugee Applications Commissioner and, on appeal, the Refugee Appeals Tribunal. Subsequently, in accordance with Section 3 of the Immigration Act, 1999 (as amended), the person concerned was informed, by letter dated 29 December 2005, that the Minister proposed to make a Deportation Order in respect of her. She was given the options, to be exercised within 15 working days, of leaving the State voluntarily, of consenting to the making of a Deportation Order or of making representations to the Minister setting out the reasons why she should be allowed to remain temporarily in the State. Representations have been submitted 170 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers on behalf of the person concerned and will be fully considered before the file is passed to me for decision.

Citizenship Applications. 66. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the position in regard to an application for citizenship in the case of a person (details supplied) in Dublin 15; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35341/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): I refer the Deputy to my Reply to Parliamentary Question 549 of 1 July 2008. The position remains as stated.

Asylum Applications. 67. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the progress in regard to a residency application in the case of a person (details supplied) in Dublin 6; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35342/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): The person con- cerned applied for asylum on 20 September 2006. Following investigation by the Office of the Refugee Applications Commissioner, it was established that the person concerned had pre- viously made an asylum application in Germany and, as such, a determination was made, in accordance with the provisions of the Dublin II Regulations, that the person concerned should be transferred to Germany for the purposes of having his asylum application examined there. This determination was upheld following an appeal to the Refugee Appeals Tribunal. Conse- quently, a Transfer Order was signed in respect of the person concerned on 22 November 2006. This Order was subsequently served on the person concerned, by letter dated 23 November 2006, which placed a legal obligation on him to ‘present’ himself at the Offices of the Garda National Immigration Bureau (GNIB), on Wednesday 29 November 2006, to make arrange- ments for his formal transfer to Germany. The person concerned failed to ‘present’ on this occasion and was therefore classified as having ‘evaded’ his transfer. The person concerned became illegally resident in this State at that time. The person concerned continued to evade his transfer with the consequence that the Transfer Order ultimately expired leaving Ireland responsible for processing the asylum application of the person concerned. At this point the case of the person concerned was referred back to the Office of the Refugee Applications Commissioner for the purposes of having his asylum claims investigated. Subsequently, the Office of the Refugee Applications Commissioner made a recommendation that the person concerned be refused a declaration of refugee status. This recommendation was, on appeal, upheld by the Refugee Appeal Tribunal. In accordance with Section 3 of the Immigration Act, 1999 (as amended), the person con- cerned was informed, by letter dated 26 September 2008, that the Minister proposed to make a Deportation Order in respect of him. He was given the options, to be exercised within 15 working days, of leaving the State voluntarily, of consenting to the making of a Deportation Order or of making representations to the Minister setting out the reasons why he should be allowed to remain temporarily in the State. In addition, he was notified of his entitlement to apply for Subsidiary Protection in the State in accordance with the European Communities (Eligibility for Protection) Regulations, 2006 (S.I. No. 518 of 2006). To date no response has been received in my Department to this letter. The 15 day period referred to in my Department’s letter of 26 September 2008 expires on 17 October 2008. It is open to the person concerned to make representations and/or to apply 171 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

[Deputy Dermot Ahern.] for Subsidiary Protection in the State within that period. The case of the person concerned will be considered further upon receipt of a response to my Department’s letter of 26 September 2008.

68. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform when an application for residency status and refugee status will be concluded in the case of a person (details supplied) in County Meath; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35343/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): It is not the practice to comment in detail on individual asylum applications. As the Deputy will be aware, applications for refugee status in the State are determined by an independent process comprising the Office of the Refugee Applications Commissioner and the Refugee Appeals Tribunal which make recommendations to the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform on whether such status should be granted. A final decision on each application is made following receipt of the recommendation of the Refugee Applications Commissioner or the decision of the Refugee Appeals Tribunal, as appropriate.

69. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform when an application for residency status will be concluded in the case of persons (details supplied) in County Meath; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35344/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): The first named person concerned arrived in the State with her daughter and applied for asylum on 26 January 2005. She included her daughter in her application. The application was refused following consideration of their case by the Office of the Refugee Applications Commissioner and, on appeal, the Refugee Appeals Tribunal. Subsequently, in accordance with Section 3 of the Immigration Act, 1999 (as amended), the first named person concerned was informed, by letter dated 14 August 2008, that the Minister proposed to make Deportation Orders in respect of her and her daughter. She was given the options, to be exercised within 15 working days, of leaving the State voluntarily, of consenting to the making of Deportation Orders or of making representations to the Minister setting out the reasons why they should be allowed to remain temporarily in the State. In addition, she was notified of her entitlement to apply for Subsidiary Protection in the State in accordance with the European Communities (Eligibility for Protection) Regulations, 2006 (S.I. No. 518 of 2006). The first named person concerned submitted an application for Subsidiary Protection in the State in accordance with these Regulations and this application is under consideration at present. When consideration of this application has been completed, the first named person concerned will be notified in writing of the outcome. In the event that the Subsidiary Protection application is refused, the case file of the first named person concerned, including all representations submitted, will then be considered under Section 3(6) of the Immigration Act, 1999 (as amended) and Section 5 of the Refugee Act, 1996 (as amended) on the prohibition of refoulement. When this latter consideration has been completed, the case file of the first named person concerned is passed to me for decision.

172 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

The second named person concerned, a child of the first named person concerned, has lodged a separate asylum application. It is not the practice to comment in detail on individual asylum applications where a final decision has not been made. As the Deputy will be aware, applications for refugee status in the State are determined by an independent process comprising the Office of the Refugee Applications Commissioner and the Refugee Appeals Tribunal which make recommendations to the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform on whether such status should be granted. A final decision on each application is made following receipt of the recommendation of the Refugee Applications Commissioner or the decision of the Refugee Appeals Tribunal, as appropriate.

Citizenship Applications. 70. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the position in regard to an application for citizenship in the case of a person (details supplied) in County Kildare; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35345/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): I refer the Deputy to Replies to Parliamentary Questions, 159 of 27 September 2007, 210 of 6 February 2007 and 136 of 23 November 2006. The position remains as stated.

Asylum Applications. 71. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the progress to date in the application for residency in the case of a person (details supplied) in County Meath; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35348/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): The person con- cerned applied for asylum on 8 June 2005. Her asylum application was refused following con- sideration of the case by the Office of the Refugee Applications Commissioner and, on appeal, the Refugee Appeals Tribunal. Subsequently, in accordance with Section 3 of the Immigration Act, 1999 (as amended), the person concerned was informed, by letter dated 12 May 2006, that the Minister proposed to make a Deportation Order in respect of her. She was given the options, to be exercised within 15 working days, of leaving the State voluntarily, of consenting to the making of a Deportation Order or of making representations to the Minister setting out the reasons why she should be allowed to remain temporarily in the State. Representations have been submitted on behalf of the person concerned and will be fully considered before the file is passed to me for decision.

Residency Permits. 72. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the position in respect of family reunification in the case of a person (details supplied) in County Kildare; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35349/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): I am informed by the Immigration Division of my Department that at present there is no Family Reunification application pending in respect of the person named in the details provided by the Deputy.

Asylum Applications. 73. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the 173 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

[ Deputy Bernard J. Durkan.] position in respect of residency and other status in the case of a person (details supplied) in County Limerick; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35350/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): The person con- cerned applied for asylum on 10 January 2006. Following investigation by the Office of the Refugee Applications Commissioner, it was established that the person concerned had pre- viously made an asylum application in the United Kingdom and, as such, a determination was made that, in accordance with the provisions of the Dublin II Regulations, the person con- cerned should be transferred to the United Kingdom for the purposes of having his asylum application examined there. This determination was upheld following an appeal to the Refugee Appeals Tribunal. A Transfer Order was signed in respect of the person concerned on 11 May 2006. This Order was served on the person concerned, by letter dated 12 May 2006, which placed a legal obligation on him to present himself at the Offices of the Garda National Immi- gration Bureau (GNIB) on Tuesday 16 May 2006 to make arrangements for his formal transfer to the United Kingdom. The person concerned failed to ‘present’ on this occasion and was therefore classified as having ‘evaded’ his transfer. The person concerned became illegally resident in this State at that time. The person concerned continued to evade his transfer with the consequence that the Transfer Order ultimately expired leaving Ireland responsible for processing the asylum application of the person concerned. At this point the case of the person concerned was referred back to the Office of the Refugee Applications Commissioner for the purposes of having his asylum claims investigated. The Office of the Refugee Applications Commissioner made a recommendation that the person concerned be refused a declaration of refugee status. In accordance with Section 3 of the Immigration Act, 1999 (as amended), the person con- cerned was informed, by letter dated 23 January 2008, that the Minister proposed to make a Deportation Order in respect of him. He was given the options, to be exercised within 15 working days, of leaving the State voluntarily, of consenting to the making of a Deportation Order or of making representations to the Minister setting out the reasons why he should be allowed to remain temporarily in the State. To date no such representations have been made by, or on behalf of, the person concerned. My Department has no knowledge of the arrest and imprisonment of the person concerned.

74. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform when an application for refugee status and residency status will be concluded in the case of a person (details supplied) in County Galway; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35351/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): I refer the Deputy to the written reply to Question No. 814 of Wednesday, 24 September 2008. The person con- cerned applied for asylum on 8 July 2005. His application was refused following consideration of his case by the Office of the Refugee Applications Commissioner and, on appeal, the Refu- gee Appeals Tribunal. Subsequently, in accordance with Section 3 of the Immigration Act 1999 (as amended), the person concerned was informed, by letter dated 18 August 2008, that the Minister proposed to make a Deportation Order in respect of him. He was given the options, to be exercised within 15 working days, of leaving the State voluntarily, of consenting to the making of a Deportation Order or making representations to the Minister setting out the reasons he should be allowed to remain temporarily in the State. In addition, he was notified of his entitlement to apply for Subsidiary Protection in the State in accordance with the European 174 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

Communities (Eligibility for Protection) Regulations, 2006 (S.I. No. 518 of 2006). The person concerned submitted an application for Subsidiary Protection in the State in accordance with the Regulations and this application is under consideration at present. When consideration of this application has been completed, the person concerned will be notified in writing of the outcome. If the Subsidiary Protection application is refused, the case file of the person con- cerned, including all representations submitted, will be considered under Section 3(6) of the Immigration Act 1999 (as amended) and Section 5 of the Refugee Act 1996 (as amended) on the prohibition of refoulement. When this latter consideration has been completed, the case file of the person concerned is passed to me for decision.

Residency Permits. 75. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform when an application for family reunification will be concluded in the case of a person (details supplied) in County Kildare; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35352/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): An application for Family Reunification was received in June 2007 from the person in question on behalf of his wife. The application was forwarded to the Refugee Applications Commissioner for investi- gation as required under section 18 of the Refugee Act 1996. This investigation is completed and the Commissioner has forwarded a report to my Department. The application will be considered by my Department and a decision will issue with in the next four weeks.

Asylum Applications. 76. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform when an application for residency will conclude in the case of a person (details supplied) in County Sligo; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35353/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): The person con- cerned applied for asylum on 31 January 2005. His application was refused following consider- ation of his case by the Office of the Refugee Applications Commissioner and, on appeal, the Refugee Appeals Tribunal. Subsequently, in accordance with Section 3 of the Immigration Act 1999 (as amended), the person concerned was informed, by letter dated 17 November 2005, that the Minister proposed to make a Deportation Order in respect of him. He was given the options, to be exercised within 15 working days, of leaving the State voluntarily, of consenting to the making of a Deportation Order or of making representations to the Minister setting out the reasons why he should be allowed to remain temporarily in the State. Representations have been submitted on behalf of the person concerned and will be fully considered before the file is passed to me for decision.

Citizenship Applications. 77. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform when an application for residency and citizenship will conclude in the case of a person (details supplied) in County Kildare; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35354/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): An application for a certificate of naturalisation from the person referred to in the Question was received in the Citizenship Section of my Department in July 2006. Processing of the file has been completed 175 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

[Deputy Dermot Ahern.] and I have reached a decision. The person in question will be informed of that decision in due course.

Deportation Orders. 78. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform when the necessary documentation will issue in the case of an application for residency in the name of a person (details supplied) in County Kilkenny; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35355/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): I refer the Deputy to the written reply to Question No. 219 of Thursday, 15 May 2008. The person concerned applied for asylum on 25 November 2002. His application was refused following consideration of his case by the Office of the Refugee Applications Commissioner and, on appeal, the Refu- gee Appeals Tribunal. Subsequently, in accordance with Section 3 of the Immigration Act 1999 (as amended), the person concerned was informed, by letter dated 27 February 2004, that the Minister proposed to make a Deportation Order in respect of him. He was given the options, to be exercised within 15 working days, of leaving the State voluntarily, of consenting to the making of a Deportation Order or of making representations to the Minister setting out the reasons he should be allowed to remain temporarily in the State. Representations have been submitted on behalf of the person concerned and will be fully considered before the file is passed to me for decision. When a decision has been made in the case of the person concerned, this decision and the consequences of that decision will be conveyed in writing to the person concerned.

Asylum Applications. 79. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the progress in the case of an application for leave to remain in the State on humanitarian grounds for a person (details supplied) in Dublin 8; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35356/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): I refer the Deputy to my reply to Question No. 787 of Wednesday, 24 September 2008 on this matter. The position in the State of the person concerned is as set out in that reply.

Residency Permits. 80. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform the progress in the case of an application for residency and other status in the name of a person (details supplied) in County Kildare; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35357/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): I am pleased to inform the Deputy that the permission granted to the person concerned under the IBC/05 Scheme has been renewed until 21 October 2010, subject to registration with the Garda National Immigration Bureau. I have arranged for the letter informing the person of this decision to be reissued.

Residency Permits. 81. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform if 176 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers he is satisfied that due process is being followed in the case of a person (details supplied) in County Louth; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35358/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): I refer the Deputy to the Reply I gave to his Parliamentary Question no. 929 of Wednesday 24 September 2008. The status of the person concerned remains as set out in that Reply. I am satisfied that the applications made by the person concerned for asylum and subsequently for temporary leave to remain in the State, together with all refoulement issues, were fairly and comprehensively examined and, as such, the decision to deport him is justified. The enforcement of the Deport- ation Order is an operational matter for the Garda National Immigration Bureau.

Icelandic Investments. 82. Deputy Ciara´n Lynch asked the Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform if public bodies here have invested funds in Icelandic financial products; the status of such investments; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35509/08]

Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform (Deputy Dermot Ahern): I wish to inform the Deputy that my Department has no record of having any funds invested in Icelandic finan- cial products.

Overseas Development Aid. 83. Deputy Darragh O’Brien asked the Minister for Foreign Affairs the amount of overseas development and humanitarian aid given to the Palestinian Territories in the years 2005, 2006, 2007 and up to September 2008. [35260/08]

Minister of State at the Department of Foreign Affairs (Deputy Peter Power): Development and humanitarian assistance is provided to Palestine under a range of headings and, while the bulk of the funding is spent in the Palestinian Territories, an element is dispersed outside those territories, for instance, through the UN Relief and Works Agency (UNRWA) for Palestinian refugees in some of the neighbouring States. Assistance is also provided to NGOs like Tro´ caire and Christian Aid in support of programmes in both Israel and the Palestinian Territories. Over the period in question, development and humanitarian funding has been dispersed as follows:

2005 2006 2007 2008 (to 30 Sept)

\4.4 million \6.2 million \7.5 million \4.9 million

This funding included support for the UN Relief and Works Agency (UNRWA) which provides basic services including health and education for Palestinian refugees; support for basic edu- cation services provided by the Palestinian Authority; support for a range of UN Agencies including the UN Development Programme (UNDP) and the UN Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs (UNOCHA); and support for a range of NGOs and Civil Society Organisations to promote human rights. The figure for 2008 is for actual spending to the end of September. Further assistance will be delivered before the end of the year.

Human Rights Issues. 84. Deputy Finian McGrath asked the Minister for Foreign Affairs if he will support a group 177 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

[ Deputy Finian McGrath.] (details supplied); and if he will raise the recent massacre of 46 young men in the North-east of Colombia with the Colombia authorities and at the U.C.. [35264/08]

Minister for Foreign Affairs (Deputy Michea´l Martin): As the Deputy is aware, Grupo Raı´ces is a group of Latin American and Irish citizens concerned about the situation in Colombia. In relation to the first part of the Deputy’s question, the Irish government supports both the Colombian government and civil society groups in their efforts to support the peace process in Colombia. Irish Aid currently funds local NGOs working to protect children’s rights and human rights in Colombia. In 2008, Irish Aid has already provided a total of \1,122,713 to Tro´ caire and Christian Aid for projects in Colombia. Irish Aid also funds Irish Missionaries in Colombia through the Irish Missionary Resource Service. I am keenly aware of the very serious issue of civilian deaths attributed to the security forces in Colombia, including the killings referred to in the Deputy’s question. This matter is the subject of ongoing action at EU and UN level. The February 2008 annual report of the United Nations High Commissioner for Human Rights (UNHCHR) on the situation of human rights in Colombia states that the UNHCHR’s office in Colombia continues to receive reports of extrajudicial killings attributed to the security forces. Under its current mandate, the focus of the UNHCHR’s office in Colombia is the fight against impunity, including advice and training on prevention and investigation of incidents of torture, enforced disappearances, extrajudicial killings, illegal detentions and sexual violence. In relation to action at EU level, as the Deputy will be aware, the EU has expressed its support for the Colombian Government in its efforts to ensure the rule of law, legality, security of persons and human rights. The EU has also condemned systematic breaches of the most fundamental human rights, including the right to life and to liberty, in Colombia. The General Affairs and External Relations Council of the European Union most recently adopted Conclusions on Colombia on 19 November 2007. Ireland was actively involved in the negotiation of these Conclusions. The Council encouraged the Colombian government’s determination to improve the armed forces’ respect for human rights and welcomed the pro- gress which has been made in this respect. However, the Council noted with real concern the persisting problem of human rights violations by some members of the security forces, including extra-judicial killings. My Department continues to monitor the situation in Colombia through our Embassy in Mexico City, which is accredited to Colombia, as well as in cooperation with our EU partners with resident diplomatic missions in that country.

Diplomatic Representation. 85. Deputy Finian McGrath asked the Minister for Foreign Affairs if he will support the case of a person (details supplied). [35265/08]

Minister for Foreign Affairs (Deputy Michea´l Martin): My Department became aware on 11 September of this case mentioned by the Deputy when the person concerned emailed our Embassy in Paris outlining the incident as set out in the letter by the Deputy. Our Embassy immediately contacted JWT on the same day to ensure that the person concerned had filled out a police report with one of their representatives. The Embassy also then contacted the police who confirmed that they were investigating the incident.

178 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

The Embassy has been in contact with the police on three further occasions during the month of September seeking updates on the status of the investigation. On 7 October the Police informed the Embassy that they had completed their report on 1 October and forwarded it to the Tribunal de la Police, where a decision will be made as to whether there are grounds to charge the Hotel owner/employee. The Embassy contacted the person concerned to keep him updated on these developments and assured him that they would continue to provide him with any updates received from the Tribunal de la Police. On my instructions the Embassy has written to the Tribunal de la Police requesting an update on this case.

Icelandic Investments. 86. Deputy Ciara´n Lynch asked the Minister for Foreign Affairs if public bodies here have invested funds in Icelandic financial products; the status of such investments; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35507/08]

Minister for Foreign Affairs (Deputy Michea´l Martin): There are no investment funds operating under the responsibility of my Department.

Arts Funding. 87. Deputy Joe McHugh asked the Minister for Arts, Sport and Tourism if he will guarantee that there will be no cuts in his funding of a theatre (details supplied) in County Donegal, in the next 36 months; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35210/08]

Minister for Arts, Sport and Tourism (Deputy Martin Cullen): The theatre referred to by the Deputy received \65,000 in capital funding from my Department under the ACCESS II (Arts and Culture Capital Enhancement Support Scheme) scheme. This grant was fully drawn down in 2007 and there is, therefore, no question of cutting the capital funding provided to the theatre. The ACCESS scheme continues to be a significant intervention in the provision of high quality arts and cultural infrastructure throughout the country. The theatre is also in receipt of current funding from the Arts Council and was provided with \150,000 in 2008. The Arts Council makes funding decisions on an annual basis and the levels of grants provided are dependent on the annual Estimates process. The Arts Council are statutorily independent under the Arts Act 2003 and I have no role to play in the allocation of their grants or their executive decisions.

Appointments to State Boards. 88. Deputy Ciara´n Lynch asked the Minister for Arts, Sport and Tourism if he will confirm that persons appointed to positions under the National Sports Campus Development Authority Act 2006 were appointed in accordance with the regulations set out in the Act; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35293/08]

Minister for Arts, Sport and Tourism (Deputy Martin Cullen): The provisions of the National Sports Campus Development Authority Act were applied in relation to appointments to posi- tions made under that Act.

Icelandic Investments. 89. Deputy Ciara´n Lynch asked the Minister for Arts, Sport and Tourism if public bodies here have invested funds in Icelandic financial products; the status of such investments; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35501/08]

179 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

Minister for Arts, Sport and Tourism (Deputy Martin Cullen): The Department, including the National Archives, has not invested any funds in Icelandic financial products. In respect of the agencies under the aegis of the Department, the investing of funds is a matter for the agencies themselves. However, I understand that these agencies have similarly not invested any funds in such products.

Appointments to State Boards. 90. Deputy Ciara´n Lynch asked the Minister for Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs if he will confirm that persons appointed to positions under the Dormant Accounts Acts were appointed in accordance with the regulations set out in these Acts; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35296/08]

Minister for Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs (Deputy E´ amon O´ Cuı´v): Appoint- ments to the Dormant Accounts Board are governed by the requirements set out in the Dor- mant Accounts Acts 2001-2005. The Acts provide that the Board will consist of a chairperson and 10 ordinary members with the necessary knowledge of, and experience relating to, the purposes for which disbursements are made from the Dormant Accounts Fund. I am satisfied that the appointments made by me to the Board are in accordance with the provisions of the Dormant Accounts Acts 2001-2005. The membership of the Board as of today is set out in the following table.

Dormant Accounts Board Membership

Name Background

Mr Michael Morley (Chairperson) Retired Co-operative Financial Controller Ms Kate Feely Principal Social Worker (Mental Health Services) Ms Rosaleen Glackin Retired Trade Union Official Mr Des Gunning Governor — Incorporated Orthopaedic Hospital of Ireland Ms Marian Hackett School Principal Ms A´ ine Hyland Retired Vice President (University College Cork) Mr Noel McPartland Company Director Ms Mary Maguire Community Employment Administrator Mr David Martin Company Director Ms Eimer O’Rourke Irish Banking Federation Mr Colin Wilson Tax Consultant

Inland Waterways. 91. Deputy Finian McGrath asked the Minister for Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs if the Government has applied for EU funding for progression of works on the Ulster Canal; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35267/08]

Minister for Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs (Deputy E´ amon O´ Cuı´v): I can confirm that my Department has not applied for EU funding for the progression of works on the Ulster Canal. The restoration of the south west stretch of the Ulster Canal, from Upper Lough Erne to Clones, is being funded from within Waterways Ireland own resources.

Architectural Heritage. 92. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Community, Rural and Gaeltacht 180 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

Affairs if his attention has been drawn to the historical, cultural and recreational significance of Donadea Forest Park, Donadea, County Kildare in the ownership of Coillte Teo; if he has received communication from his ministerial colleagues or local community support groups in the context of a comprehensive development plan to acquire the property for development as a national park similar to a number of other such projects throughout the country and which would involve the restoration of Donadea Castle and ancillary buildings, having particular regard to the potential benefit, locally and nationally; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35323/08]

Minister for Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs (Deputy E´ amon O´ Cuı´v): I refer the Deputy to Question no. 334 of the 7th October 2008. I can confirm that I have received no such communication from my Ministerial colleagues or local community support groups.

Icelandic Investments. 93. Deputy Ciara´n Lynch asked the Minister for Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs if public bodies here have invested funds in Icelandic financial products; the status of such invest- ments; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35503/08]

Minister for Community, Rural and Gaeltacht Affairs (Deputy E´ amon O´ Cuı´v): I have been advised that none of the public bodies funded by, or within the ambit of my Department have invested funds in Icelandic financial products.

Court Proceedings. 94. Deputy Jack Wall asked the Minister for Social and Family Affairs when her Department will present papers in relation to a Supreme Court case (details supplied) which was listed as a priority in view of the concerns of the appellant in the case; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35217/08]

Minister for Social and Family Affairs (Deputy Mary Hanafin): Preparation and presentation of papers to a court in respect of cases involving the State is a matter for the Office of the Chief State Solicitor. The position in relation to the case referred to by the Deputy is that the Department has made enquiries of that Office and it is my understanding that the book of appeal has been lodged and that a certificate of readiness will be lodged within a week or so. I also understand that the Office of the Chief State Solicitor has been in contact with the solicitor for the person concerned.

Departmental Agencies. 95. Deputy Brian O’Shea asked the Minister for Social and Family Affairs the consultation process that was involved and the person who was consulted in the high level review, value for money and policy review of the Combat Poverty Agency; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35240/08]

96. Deputy Brian O’Shea asked the Minister for Social and Family Affairs when she will bring the recommendations contained in the high level review of the Combat Poverty Agency to Government; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35241/08]

97. Deputy Brian O’Shea asked the Minister for Social and Family Affairs the reason it was necessary to have three reviews of the Combat Poverty Agency carried out in the past two years; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35242/08]

181 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

98. Deputy Brian O’Shea asked the Minister for Social and Family Affairs the cost of the three reviews carried out in the past two years on the Combat Poverty Agency, including the staff time in the OSI; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35243/08]

99. Deputy Brian O’Shea asked the Minister for Social and Family Affairs if, in regard to the review of programmes that facilitated participation of the voluntary and community sector, the consideration is finalised; the action he will take at this juncture; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35244/08]

Minister for Social and Family Affairs (Deputy Mary Hanafin): I propose to take Questions Nos. 95 to 99, inclusive, together. Over the last two years my Department has coordinated the conduct of three reviews of the Combat Poverty Agency. These included a review of its research programme and a review of its programmes to facilitate the participation of the community and voluntary sector and people experiencing poverty in the policy-making process. The third and most recent review, conduc- ted on an interdepartmental basis, examined the role of the Agency in the light of recent strategic and institutional developments to support social inclusion. It was undertaken by my Department as part of its Value for Money and Policy Review initiative 2006-2008 and com- pleted in September last. In the course of the review, bilateral meetings took place between sub-groups of respectively, the review Steering Committee and five members of the CPA Board, following which written submissions were made by the Agency. Seven other bilateral consultations were undertaken with a total of thirteen officials from Departments represented on the Steering Committee and with the Chairs and Directors of NESF and NESC. While the Steering Committee did not consider that its terms of reference envisaged a wider external consultation, its findings were informed by extensive stakeholder consultations undertaken by independent consultants in connection with other recent reviews of the CPA, in particular, the review of the CPA’s Research programme finalised in March 2008 by Goodbody Economic Consultants and the review of the Agency’s 2005-2007 Strategic Plan completed by Eustace Patterson Ltd. in June 2007. The review, which reported in September, essentially put forward two options — a merger between the Combat Poverty Agency and NESDO or a merger with the Office for Social Inclusion. The review steering committee identified certain imbalances that would have to be overcome if the NESDO option were chosen. For example, the role and focus of NESDO is on the wider strategic economic and social issues which need to be addressed in order to drive the country forward. In this environment, the specific role of addressing issues of poverty and social inclusion, as pursued by the Combat Poverty Agency and the Office for Social Inclusion, could become marginalised. The steering committee recommended the merger with the Office for Social Inclusion as, in their view, it was the most likely to achieve the best outcomes. I received detailed submissions on the report from the Board of the Combat Poverty agency which I fully and carefully considered. The Government, having considered the review report, decided to integrate the Combat Poverty Agency with the Office for Social Inclusion. It is not my intention that Combat Poverty will simply be absorbed into the Office for Social Inclusion in its existing form. Rather a new strengthened division will be created which will make the best use of the considerable experi- ence and expertise of the staff of both existing bodies and will seek to address the weaknesses identified by the Review in relation to both. I believe that this new division will provide a stronger voice for those affected by poverty and social inclusion issues.

182 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

The work of the new division will be informed by an enhanced role for high quality research, both by utilising the research skills which the staff of the Combat Poverty Agency will bring with them and by commissioning external organisations to carry out projects as appropriate. Other key functions will include providing supports through data availability, communications, poverty impact assessment and the strengthening of implementation at regional and local level. I am conscious of the concerns about the need for independent scrutiny of public policy that have been expressed by some interest groups. I absolutely agree that independent critique is very important and this move is no way intended to reduce the scope for such work. As the review report notes, the function of independent reporting on poverty is no longer as dependent on Combat Poverty as it was in earlier years. This is due for example to the emergence of other independent data sources such as the statistics on poverty reported by the CSO, and independent analysis by bodies such as the ESRI and NESC and on the international front by the EU and OECD. And of course, Ireland is well-served by the social partners, and a wide range of NGOs and other groups who have a strong voice in public debate about poverty and related issues. I intend to prioritise putting in place procedures to ensure that the views of these and other stakeholders, including people experiencing poverty, continue to be available to Government in developing and monitoring the social inclusion strategies. The Department is currently finalising proposals as to how this might be achieved. I am aware that for the staff of the Combat Poverty Agency there has been a period of uncertainty while the review was taking place and this will continue during the transition phase. I can assure Deputies that I and my officials will work with the Board and staff to address any concerns they may have. They can be assured of a warm welcome and a valued place in the Department, as they pursue their continuing role in working to develop and monitor our future strategies to address poverty and social exclusion. The review of Combat Poverty’s Research Programme was carried out by Goodbody Econ- omic Consultants during the period May 2007 to March 2008. The report of the review has been submitted to the CPA Board and to the Department and in addition to the Inter-Departmental Committee will also be considered in the context of the integration of the Agency with the OSI. The direct cost arising from this review is the consultant’s fee of \50,561 paid by the Agency. The review of the CPA’s programmes that facilitate the participation of the community and voluntary sector and people experiencing poverty in the policy- making process was progressed over the period 2006 and 2007 by an official of my Department as part of his participation in the IPA’s Masters (Policy Analysis) Programme. As some aspects of this review remained to be considered when the review of the overall role of the Agency was commenced it was decided to subsume this work within the broader review of the Agency’s work. There were no direct costs involved in this work. The direct cost arising from the interdepartmental review of the Combat Poverty is the fee of \18,000 which was paid by the Department to the independent Chair of the Steering Com- mittee, Mr. Niall Callan. The Office for Social Inclusion provided secretarial support for the review and was represented on the Steering Committee. However this work was undertaken as part of the normal work of the office and separated costs are not available.

Social Welfare Benefits. 100. Deputy Michael Ring asked the Minister for Social and Family Affairs when a person (details supplied) in County Mayo will be approved and awarded jobseekers benefit. [35297/08]

183 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

Minister for Social and Family Affairs (Deputy Mary Hanafin): The person concerned applied for jobseeker’s benefit on 7 October 2008 and his claim is being examined currently. A decision will be made as soon as possible and he will be notified of the outcome. Under Social Welfare legislation decisions in relation to claims must be made by Deciding Officers and Appeals Officers. These officers are statutorily appointed and I have no role in regard to making such decisions.

Social Welfare Code. 101. Deputy Leo Varadkar asked the Minister for Social and Family Affairs if a community welfare officer may approve an exceptional needs payment for the maintenance of a diet for cultural rather than medical reasons; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35359/08]

Minister for Social and Family Affairs (Deputy Mary Hanafin): Under the supplementary welfare allowance scheme, which is administered on behalf of the Department by the com- munity welfare division of the Health Service Executive, a diet supplement may be paid where a special diet is prescribed for an individual as a result of a specified medical condition. Any person receiving a Social Welfare or Health Service Executive payment and who has been prescribed a special diet for medical reasons and whose means are insufficient to meet their needs, may qualify for a diet supplement. Under the supplementary welfare allowance scheme an exceptional needs payment may be made to help meet an essential, once-off cost which the applicant is unable to meet out of his/her own resources. There is no automatic entitlement to this payment. Each application is determined by the Executive based on the particular circumstances of the case and for that reason, it is not possible to state categorically that an exceptional needs payment would or would not be made in respect of any particular once-off essential need. However exceptional needs payments would not normally be made in respect of the maintenance of a particular diet for cultural reasons.

102. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Social and Family Affairs the basis on which rent supplement has been refused in the case of a person (details supplied) in County Kildare; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35363/08]

Minister for Social and Family Affairs (Deputy Mary Hanafin): Rent supplement is adminis- tered on behalf of the Department by the community welfare division of the Health Service Executive (HSE), as part of the supplementary welfare allowance scheme. One of the conditions for receipt of rent supplement is that the Executive must be satisfied that “the claimant is in need of accommodation and is unable to provide for it from his or her own resources”. The Executive has advised that the person concerned was refused rent supplement as it was not satisfied that he was in need of accommodation. This decision was upheld by both the HSE Appeals Office and the Social Welfare Appeals Office.

Icelandic Investments. 103. Deputy Ciara´n Lynch asked the Minister for Social and Family Affairs if public bodies here have invested funds in Icelandic financial products; the status of such investments; and if she will make a statement on the matter. [35510/08]

Minister for Social and Family Affairs (Deputy Mary Hanafin): Neither the Department nor the agencies under the aegis of the Department have invested any funds in Icelandic financial products.

184 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

104. Deputy Ciara´n Lynch asked the Minister for Defence if public bodies here have invested funds in Icelandic financial products; the status of such investments; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35504/08]

Minister for Defence (Deputy Willie O’Dea): No public bodies under the aegis of my Depart- ment have invested funds in Icelandic financial products.

105. Deputy Ciara´n Lynch asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government if local authorities and public bodies here have invested funds in Icelandic finan- cial products; the status of such investments; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35195/08]

Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government (Deputy John Gormley): Banking and investment arrangements with financial institutions for the prudent management of money are matter for individual local authorities under section 98 of the Local Government Act 2001. Following enquiries made my Department, I am advised that local authorities and bodies that come under the aegis of my Department do not have funds invested in Icelandic financial products.

Anti-Social Behaviour. 106. Deputy A´ ine Brady asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government the recourse open to persons (detailed supplied) in County Kildare whose neigh- bours are involved in anti-social or abusive behaviour; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35212/08]

Minister of State at the Department of the Environment, Heritage and Local Government (Deputy Michael Finneran): Action to deal with anti-social behaviour is primarily a matter for An Garda Sı´ocha´na. Landlords are, however, responsible for enforcing the obligations that apply to their tenants under the Residential Tenancies Act, 2004. The Act, in this regard, prohibits a private rental tenant engaging in anti-social behaviour in, or in the vicinity of, a dwelling to which the Act applies and allows a landlord to terminate any tenancy where the tenant is engaging in or allowing others to engage in such behaviour, subject to a notice period of only 7 days in the case of serious anti-social behaviour or 28 days in the case of less serious but persistent behaviour. The Residential Tenancies Act also provides for a third party affected by anti-social behav- iour to, subject to certain conditions, take a case to the Private Residential Tenancies Board against a landlord who has failed to enforce tenant obligations. The Board can direct the landlord to ensure that tenants comply with their obligation and can enforce compliance through the Courts. A specific condition is that the third party complainant must have taken all reasonable steps to resolve the matter by communicating or attempting to communicate with the parties to the tenancy concerned. The Private Residential Tenancies Board may furnish to a person proposing to make a third party complaint the name and address of the landlord concerned or his or her agent. The Board may be contacted at their offices at O’Connell Bridge House, Dublin 2, or by phone or email, contact details of which are available on their website.

Waste Management. 107. Deputy Phil Hogan asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local

185 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

[ Deputy Phil Hogan.] Government the name of the environmental consultant that he met in respect of a proposal to construct a thermal treatment facility at Rathcoole, County Dublin; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35214/08]

Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government (Deputy John Gormley): In July 2007 I met with Ms. Anne Butler, an environmental consultant acting on behalf of the proposers of the project. The purpose of this meeting, and of a separate meeting with my Department, was to outline a form of thermal treatment of waste which differs from conven- tional municipal waste incineration. There was, of course, no question of these discussions comprehending matters proper to the physical planning or environmental licensing processes from which I, and my Department, are precluded from involvement. My Department and I hold regular consultations with stakeholders in the context of the ongoing implementation of Government policy on waste management. Consulting widely, with a range of stakeholders, is designed to ensure that my Department and I have as full as possible an understanding of the issues and concerns of stakeholders and are therefore in a position to address them, where it is possible and appropriate to do so. Such consultations are also useful to assist me and my Department in keeping up to date on alternative technologies to landfill and to traditional incineration. The Programme for Government clearly sets out the approach to waste management that will be reflected in national policy in the years ahead. It is firmly grounded in a continuing commitment to the waste hierarchy with a renewed drive towards the achievement of inter- national best practice in the reduction, re-use and recycling of our waste. This, coupled with an increasing emphasis on technologies for the mechanical and biological treatment of waste, will significantly reduce potential reliance on landfill and incineration.

108. Deputy Phil Hogan asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government if he will introduce guidelines in respect of a national waiver scheme for waste collection for the public which will provide a level playing pitch for public and private contrac- tors; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35215/08]

Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government (Deputy John Gormley): Waste management services have traditionally been provided at a local level, with individual arrangements being locally determined and tailored to local circumstances. The present legal framework, as determined by the Oireachtas, reflects this. In accordance with section 52 of the Protection of the Environment Act 2003, the determination of waste management charges, and any associated waiver scheme, is a matter for the relevant local authority, where it acts as the service provider. Similarly, where a private operator provides the collection service, it is a matter for that operator. Significant regulatory issues have emerged as waste management services have rapidly evolved in recent years. These issues, which have been the subject of a formal public consul- tation, include the need to ensure that necessary public service criteria in relation to the pro- vision of services in particular areas or in respect of specific households are properly reflected. The existing regulatory framework requires modernisation. The identification of the changes necessary will be greatly assisted by the recent OECD report on the review of the public service, which includes a specific case study on waste management. It is also the case that the revised approach to the collection of household waste being taken by the Dublin local authorities will further inform what measures may be necessary to underpin sustainable waste collection services, whether delivered by the private or public sectors. In

186 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers these contexts the appropriate policy responses will be developed and elaborated to address the concerns raised.

Planning Issues. 109. Deputy Joe McHugh asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government if there are plans to build a crematorium in the north-west; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35216/08]

Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government (Deputy John Gormley): I am not aware of any proposals to build a crematorium in the north-west at this time. The establishment and operation of a crematorium would require planning permission under the Planning and Development Acts, 2000-2006 and may also be subject to the provisions of other environmental and health legislation.

Urban Renewal Schemes. 110. Deputy James Bannon asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government the reason for the delay in a person (details supplied) in County Longford being awarded a grant under the urban renewal scheme ; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35253/08]

Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government (Deputy John Gormley): The Urban and Village Renewal Grant Scheme operated by my Department was to support local authority projects designed to improve the quality of the environment for persons living, visiting and working in the area. The grant scheme did not relate to housing or the refur- bishment of housing units: separate schemes are operated by the local authorities for refur- bishment or repair of housing units under specific circumstances. My Department has contacted the local authority in question, Longford County Council, who have confirmed that they have no record of having received an application from the person named.

Departmental Bodies. 111. Deputy Joanna Tuffy asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government the number of staff employed by An Bord Pleana´la; if his attention has been drawn to the delays in processing appeals; if he will allocate additional staff to an Bord Pleana´la to alleviate the problem; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35259/08]

Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government (Deputy John Gormley): In recognition of the key role An Bord Pleana´la plays in relation to delivery of local and national infrastructure, the demands arising from sustained record levels of appeals over recent years and the implementation of the Planning and Development (Strategic Infrastructure) 2006 Act, sanction was given in 2007 for a considerable increase in the Board’s staffing resources. The total authorized staff complement has increased by 35.5 to 172, while Board membership rose from 10 to 11 with the appointment of an additional temporary Board member. Under Section 126 of the Planning and Development Act 2000, An Bord Pleana´la has a statutory objective to determine appeals within 18 weeks. Where the Board does not consider it possible or appropriate to reach a decision within 18 weeks (e.g. because of delays arising from the holding of an oral hearing), it will inform the parties of the reasons for this, and will indicate when it intends to make its decision. The performance of the Board in relation to the disposal of appeals within the statutory objective period must be viewed in the context of record levels of case intake over successive

187 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

[Deputy John Gormley.] years 2004 — 2007 and the assumption of significant new functions under the 2006 Act. The introduction of the new functions under the 2006 Act necessitated a restructuring of the Board’s operations and the creation of a dedicated Strategic Infrastructure Division. During 2007, An Bord Pleana´la received 6,664 new cases, an increase of 12% on 2006 and determined 6,163 which represented a 10% increase on the previous year. The high intake of new appeal cases in 2007 and the high level of Strategic Infrastructure cases received resulted in a significant rise in the workload on hands by the end of 2007. Nearly half of all cases were determined within the statutory objective period in 2007 but there has been deterioration in appeal disposals within the statutory objective period in 2008. With the predicted lower intake of cases going forward, the increased resources made avail- able and other measures to improve throughput, it is expected that progress will be made over the coming months towards increasing the percentage of cases that are determined within the statutory objective period.

Turbary Rights. 112. Deputy Frank Feighan asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government the position regarding the completion process for a person (details supplied) in County Roscommon relating to the sale of bog under cessation of turf cutting scheme in bogs situated in special areas of conservation in County Roscommon: and when this case will be finalised and payment approved. [35279/08]

Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government (Deputy John Gormley): A letter of offer issued to the vendor in October 2006 in this case. However, my Department is advised by the Chief State Solicitor’s Office that contracts have not yet been received from the vendor’s solicitor in response to this offer.

Local Authority Housing. 113. Deputy Ciara´n Lynch asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government when funds will be released under the regeneration programme to complete the refurbishment project in a housing estate (details supplied) in County Tipperary and in which 14 houses have been refurbished to date; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35281/08]

Minister of State at the Department of the Environment, Heritage and Local Government (Deputy Michael Finneran): My Department has already supported a pilot phase in relation to this scheme at Ballylynch Housing Estate. The Council has submitted, in September 2008, proposals for an extensive remedial works project, based on the pilot phase. These proposals will be considered under the new call for proposals for remedial works schemes for funding in 2009; the closing date for receipt of applications is 31 October, 2008.

Planning Issues. 114. Deputy Aengus O´ Snodaigh asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government if it is within the powers of local authorities here to abolish planning objec- tion fees; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35312/08]

Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government (Deputy John Gormley): Any proposed changes to the fees payable to planning authorities in relation to the making of

188 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers submissions or observations respecting applications would require the prior approval of the Oireachtas to regulations made under Section 262 of the Planning and Development Act 2000.

115. Deputy Aengus O´ Snodaigh asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government if he will introduce a 10 year planning cycle with three mid-cycle reviews; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35313/08]

Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government (Deputy John Gormley): Part II of the Planning and Development Act 2000, as amended, sets out the planning frame- work and processes at regional, city and county, and local area plan levels. These requirements take account of the aims and objectives of the National Spatial Strategy, the 20-year spatial planning framework published in 2002. The Act provides that Regional Planning Guidelines have a lifespan of not less than twelve years and not more than twenty years, and that they must be statutorily reviewed every six years following their adoption. Development plans, which are required to have regard to the relevant Regional Planning Guidelines in force for the area, must be prepared every six years and must be reviewed not later than four years after adoption i.e. two years prior to a new plan coming into force. Furthermore, not more than two years after the making of a develop- ment plan, the manager of a planning authority is required to give a report to the elected members on the progress made in securing the objectives set out in the plan. Local area plans are required to be consistent with the objectives of the development plan for the area. The consistency between these various layers of plans, together with the scope currently provided for in legislation to vary or amend existing development plans and local area plans where it is deemed necessary, provides the appropriate structure to proactively manage development. I have no proposals, therefore, for any further legislative provision in regard to this matter.

116. Deputy Aengus O´ Snodaigh asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government if it is within the power of local authorities to impose index-linked bonds on developers, refundable within the event of full compliance with by-laws during devel- opments; and if not, the legal impediment to doing so. [35314/08]

Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government (Deputy John Gormley): Sections 34(4)(g) and 180(2)(b) of the Planning and Development Act 2000 provide respec- tively that a planning authority may attach conditions to a planning permission requiring the giving of adequate security for the satisfactory completion of a proposed development and, if a development is not subsequently completed satisfactorily, empowers the Authority to apply a security given under section 34 for the satisfactory completion of that development. My Department’s Development Management Guidelines (June 2007) and policy guidance on the Taking in Charge of Residential Developments (February 2008) advise that it is essential that planning permissions for residential developments are subject to conditions under which an acceptable security is provided by way of bond, cash deposit or otherwise so as to secure the satisfactory completion of those developments. The security given should be adequate to ensure the proper completion of roads, footpaths, water mains, sewers, lighting and open space and the lodgment of the security should be coupled with an agreement that would empower the authority to realise the amount of the security at an appropriate time. Security conditions should also provide for the recalculation of the amount in question by reference to the House Building Cost Index (or other appropriate index) if the development to which the permission relates is not commenced within a specified period after the granting of the permission.

189 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

117. Deputy Aengus O´ Snodaigh asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government if it is within the power of local authorities to introduce a penalty points system applicable to developers for unfinished estates and developments; and the legal impedi- ments if not within local authority powers. [35315/08]

Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government (Deputy John Gormley): Under section 35 of the Planning and Development Act 2000 as amended, a planning authority is empowered to refuse to grant planning permission where it forms the opinion that the appli- cant for such permission has substantially failed to comply with a previous planning permission. No appeal shall lie to an Bord Pleana´la from a decision of a planning authority in this regard. However, an applicant may apply to the High Court for an order annulling such a decision. I am satisfied that the above power and the power to attach planning conditions requiring the giving of financial security for the satisfactory completion of developments are adequate and I have no proposal at this time for any further legislative provision in this regard.

Greenhouse Gas Emissions. 118. Deputy Joanna Tuffy asked the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government the breakdown of expenditure in respect of carbon offsets; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35319/08]

Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government (Deputy John Gormley): My Department is finalising arrangements for a scheme to offset carbon dioxide emissions from air travel on Government business by Ministers, civil servants and officials. This will apply retrospectively to air travel since June 2007, but no expenditure has as yet been incurred. I am aware that some Ministers, including myself, have also made individual arrangements to offset particular journeys pending the introduction of the Government scheme, but details of this expenditure have not been collated.

Grant Payments. 119. Deputy Ciara´n Lynch asked the Minister for Communications, Energy and Natural Resources the grants available to encourage the installation of solar panels and geothermal heating in new house construction; the procedures which must be followed to avail of such grants; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35194/08]

Minister for Communications, Energy and Natural Resources (Deputy Eamon Ryan): The Greener Homes Scheme, administered by Sustainable Energy Ireland (SEI), provides support to individuals wishing to install renewable energy heating technologies in their homes. Since 2006 the scheme has already helped to establish the supply sector for renewable energy prod- ucts, services and fuels. Strict product standards and installer training and quality schemes have also supported consumers. New houses were removed from the Greener Homes scheme to reflect the new ‘part l’ Building Regulations by the Minister for Environment, Heritage and Local Government. The Revised Building Regulations include a compulsory renewable energy component for all new houses. This will not only ensure that renewables are integrated into the housing stock but will also encourage developers and purchasers to take account of a range of renewable options when purchasing a new home including solar panels and geothermal heating. This is further underpinned by the introduction of the Building Energy Rating which provides infor- mation to house purchasers on energy performance.

190 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

A call for expression of interest is currently open for the new Low Carbon Housing Prog- ramme, which is also administered by SEI. This programme is targeted at housing devel- opments of between five and 15 homes. In addition to having a minimum requirement of a Building Energy Rating of A2 or higher, the Programme also includes provision for onsite generation.

Icelandic Investments. 120. Deputy Ciara´n Lynch asked the Minister for Communications, Energy and Natural Resources if public bodies under his Department’s aegis have invested funds in Icelandic finan- cial products; the status of such investments; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35502/08]

Minister for Communications, Energy and Natural Resources (Deputy Eamon Ryan): The day to day management of funds by the bodies operating under the aegis of my Department is a matter for those bodies and one in which I have no involvement. I can assure the Deputy that my Department is in regular dialogue with the bodies operating under its aegis and this issue has not surfaced in those contacts.

Departmental Appointments. 121. Deputy Ciara´n Lynch asked the Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food if he will confirm that the persons appointed to positions under the Sea Fisheries and Maritime Juris- diction Act 2006 were appointed in accordance with the regulations set out in the Act; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35295/08]

Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food (Deputy Brendan Smith): I can confirm that all persons appointed to positions under the Sea-Fisheries and Maritime Jurisdiction Act 2006 were appointed legally and in accordance with the regulations set out in the Act.

Foreshore Licences. 122. Deputy Michael Ring asked the Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food if a local authority (details supplied) has abided by the foreshore legislation, following their alleged non- adherence to the conditions of a foreshore licence; and the position regarding his Department in this matter. [35200/08]

Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food (Deputy Brendan Smith): My Department has concerns regarding the works undertaken by Mayo County Council at Achill Sound and specifi- cally that all the terms of the Foreshore consent issued may not have been complied with. My Department’s Engineering Division has been in close contact with the Council regarding this matter and has specified certain measures regarding the works which remain to be completed. The works to be completed involve the removal of a temporary causeway and a method statement in relation to these works has been received from the Council. The method statement submitted has been examined by my Department’s Engineering Division and the Council has been informed that amendments to the statement are required. In addition, the Council has been instructed that no further works be undertaken without prior notice being given to my Department and approval of the method statement by my Department’s Engineering Division.

191 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

Grant Payments. 123. Deputy Joe McHugh asked the Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food the amount of money farmers here have drawn down to date from the sheep farmers scheme; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35205/08]

Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food (Deputy Brendan Smith): Rather than a single scheme to support sheep farmers, there is a series of measures in place, based on the recom- mendations of the Sheep Strategy Development Group report. These measures, which were announced by my predecessor, form a comprehensive package of support to address the chal- lenges and opportunities that lie ahead for the sheep industry as a whole. Good progress is being made in implementing the various measures. These include the fol- lowing. National Reserve Payments of an additional \6m to qualifying sheep farmers were issued under the 2007 National Reserve.

REPS My Department secured European Commission approval for a new supplementary measure in REPS 4 promoting mixed grazing of cattle and sheep. Under this supplementary measure a farmer can qualify for an annual payment of up to \1,000 in addition to his or her basic REPS payment. There have so far been some 12,000 farmers taking up REPS 4 of whom some 600 qualify for the supplementary measure.

Breed Improvement Programme An Interim Sheep Breeding Board has been established representing my Department, pedi- gree breeders and producers and responsibility for the Pedigree Sheep Breed Improvement programme is currently being transferred to ICBF.

Mechanical Grading Trials have been carried out on the use of new technology to allow for the mechanical grading of carcases in the sheepmeat sector and the results are being assessed.

Lamb Quality Assurance Scheme The lamb quality assurance scheme, which was established in 2007, has seen some 6,000 farms being registered to date.

Bord Bia Bord Bia is continuing to organise strategic marketing campaigns in selected European markets. Along with its French and British counterparts Bord Bia is undertaking a 3-year generic lamb promotion on the very important French market to promote lamb to younger consumers.

Teagasc Teagasc have developed a comprehensive plan to restructure their sheep support services, including a programme for Technology Evaluation and Transfer farms, which includes hill and lowland areas. These measures complement those to be taken by the industry itself in implementation of the Malone Report. I am satisfied that my Department is dealing satisfactorily with the areas of the report within its remit.

192 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

At EU level, the proposals in the Aylward Report to assist the sector were considered at a conference in Limoges, on 4 and 5 September which I attended. At that conference I made known my concerns for the future of the sheep industry both in Ireland and in Europe and fully supported moves by the French Presidency to pursue possible solutions to help the sector.

Disadvantaged Areas Scheme. 124. Deputy Edward O’Keeffe asked the Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food when an area (details supplied) in County Cork will be reclassified as severely disadvantaged. [35236/08]

Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food (Deputy Brendan Smith): The EU Commission is currently conducting a review of the Disadvantaged Areas Scheme across the Community. Council has mandated the Commission to conduct the review, with the intention of introducing a new system with effect from 2010. The proposal represents a move away from designation based on socio-economic factors, (declining rural population, low productivity and low farm incomes), to a methodology favouring physical characteristics, (soil type, poor climate, slope and altitude of land). Bi-lateral meetings between the Commission and Member States are taking place and following their conclusion the Commission intends to prepare a proposal for submission to the Council of Ministers. It is likely that the proposal will, if adopted by the Commission, be presented to the Council in Spring 2009. My officials and I will continue to work very closely with the Commission and through the Council of Ministers with a view to achieving the optimum outcome for Ireland.

Farm Waste Management. 125. Deputy John Cregan asked the Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food the progress made in relation to an application by a person (details supplied) in County Limerick under the farm waste management scheme; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35237/08]

Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food (Deputy Brendan Smith): The person named is an applicant under the Farm Waste Management Scheme. Payment will be made by my Depart- ment to the person concerned shortly.

Sugar Beet Sector. 126. Deputy Paul Kehoe asked the Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food the status of the sugar beet compensation in respect of a person (details supplied) in County Wexford; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35245/08]

Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food (Deputy Brendan Smith): The various elements of the EU Sugar Reform package were designed to compensate former sugar beet growers and to assist them in diversifying into other farming activities, with the initial payments under the Sugar Restructuring Scheme, the first of the four elements of the compensation package, being made in June 2007. While the person named did hold a sugar beet quota in 2004, as he retired from farming by joining the Early Retirement Scheme in 2005, he is not eligible for the pay- ments in question.

Farm Waste Management. 127. Deputy Paul Kehoe asked the Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food his views on extending the date for spreading slurry on agricultural land in view of recent heavy rainfall and poor ground conditions; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35246/08]

193 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food (Deputy Brendan Smith): The spreading of animal manures and slurry is governed by the European Communities (Good Agricultural Practice for Protection of Waters) Regulations made by the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government. In view of the poor weather conditions in recent months, with the exceptional rainfall making land unsuitable at times for the spreading of livestock manures and slurry, I obtained the agreement of the Minister Gormley to an extension of the spreading period to 31 October. I am confident that this extension will give respite to those who felt unable to meet the deadline of 15 October laid down in the Regulations. I would remind farmers that this is an extension of time only and all other rules remain in place. All landspreading activity is conditional on weather and ground conditions being suitable as set out in the European Communities (Good Agricultural Practice for Protection of Waters) Regulations. Livestock manures or any fertilisers may not be landspread when, for example, land is waterlogged, flooded or likely to flood, or frozen; or if heavy rain is forecast within 48 hours. Buffer zones are specified for different kinds of water bodies and fertilisers may not be applied within those buffer zones. In addition, the absolute prohibition on landspreading during the months of November and December remains.

Disadvantaged Areas Scheme. 128. Deputy Paul Kehoe asked the Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food the status of the single farm payment and disadvantaged area payment in respect of persons (details supplied) in County Wexford; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35247/08]

Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food (Deputy Brendan Smith): The 2008 Single Pay- ment Scheme/Disadvantaged Areas application in this case was selected for an eligibility inspection by satellite. The inspection results have been returned and the application has been fully processed. Any payment due will issue shortly.

Grant Payments. 129. Deputy Ulick Burke asked the Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food when a person (details supplied) in County Galway will be awarded their area aid from his Depart- ment; and the reason for the delay in issuing this payment. [35250/08]

Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food (Deputy Brendan Smith): The person named submitted a Single Payment Scheme/Disadvantaged Areas application in 2008 and his appli- cation was selected for an eligibility inspection by satellite. The inspection results have been returned and the applications for the person named have been fully processed. Any payment due will issue shortly.

National Parks. 130. Deputy Bernard J. Durkan asked the Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food if his attention has been drawn to the historical, cultural and recreational significance of Donadea Forest Park, Donadea, County Kildare in the ownership of Coillte Teo; if he has received communication from his ministerial colleagues or local community support groups in the con- text of a comprehensive development plan to acquire the property for development as a national park similar to a number of other such projects throughout the country and which would involve the restoration of Donadea Castle and ancillary buildings, having particular regard to the potential benefit, locally and nationally; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35321/08]

194 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food (Deputy Brendan Smith): Donadea Forest Park is owned and managed by Coillte Teoranta, which was established as a private commercial company under the Forestry Act, 1988. Day-to-day operational matters, such as the manage- ment of parks, are the responsibility of the company. I have been advised by the company that this park is one of the most widely used Coillte Forest Parks and is a popular recreation area with visitor numbers estimated in excess of 100,000 per annum. As regards the acquisition of the property for development as a national park, as mentioned by the Deputy, I wish to advise that I have not received any such communication.

Icelandic Investments. 131. Deputy Ciara´n Lynch asked the Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food if public bodies here have invested funds in Icelandic financial products; the status of such investments; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35500/08]

Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food (Deputy Brendan Smith): While this is an oper- ational matter for the individual State Agencies under the aegis of the Department of Agri- culture, Fisheries and Food, I understand that none have funds invested in Icelandic financial products.

School Transport. 132. Deputy Caoimhghı´nO´ Caola´in asked the Minister for Education and Science if his attention has been drawn to the fact that the new catchment areas in and around Wicklow town are forcing some families to drop off their children in two separate locations in order to avail of the bus service, with some children being able to get their bus in Wicklow town while others must be dropped off in Ashford village; if his attention has further been drawn to reports that officials are telling parents of children in the local Gaelscoil that they should send their children to an English speaking school if they have difficulty with the bus service; if he will intervene; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35192/08]

Minister of State at the Department of Education and Science (Deputy Sea´n Haughey): Under the terms of my Department’s Post Primary School Transport Scheme, pupils are eligible for transport if they reside 4.8 kilometres or more from and are attending their nearest Gael Chola´iste. Parents who choose to enrol their children in a Gael Chola´iste, other than the nearest are not eligible for school transport. Eligibility for transport for new applicants residing in the Wicklow area was reviewed following the recent establishment of a new Gael Chola´iste in Arklow.

State Examinations. 133. Deputy Ruairı´ Quinn asked the Minister for Education and Science the amount of fees collected in respect of the junior certificate and the leaving certificate examination for each of the years 2002 to 2008; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35197/08]

Minister for Education and Science (Deputy Batt O’Keeffe): Operational responsibility for the Junior and Leaving Certificate examinations, including the collection of fees, is a matter for the State Examinations Commission. The amount of fees collected for each of the examination years 2002 to 2008 is as follows;

195 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

[Deputy Batt O’Keeffe.]

Year \

2002 6,732,834.12 2003 6,848,749.23 2004 7,396,293.06 2005 8,084,004.95 2006 7,962,013.83 2007 8,117,638.38 2008 7,939,283.70

This covers fee income for the Junior and Leaving Certificate examinations in respect of all students, other than those entitled to a waiver of fees, including repeat and external candidates. A separate breakdown is not available in respect of the Junior and Leaving Certificate. Holders of medical cards, or their dependants are entitled to a waiver of fees.

Schools Building Projects. 134. Deputy Ruairı´ Quinn asked the Minister for Education and Science the way the standard procurement system for the building of new schools works; the role of an architect in this system; if he will explain the bidding process; the amount architects are paid for their involve- ment in school building projects under this system; the services included within these architects fees; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35198/08]

Minister for Education and Science (Deputy Batt O’Keeffe): Since January 2007, all new construction consultancy appointments have been on a competitive fee basis using the new Government Conditions of Engagement. The level of fees will, therefore, vary from project to project. With regard to construction contracts, my Department has also implemented fixed price tendering in accordance with Department of Finance guidelines on Construction Procure- ment Reform. The role and scope of services for an architect is as specified in the invitation to tender documents for consultants for that project, which on most projects will be in accordance with my Department’s Design Team Procedures 2007, which are available on my Department’s website.

Departmental Correspondence. 135. Deputy Ruairı´ Quinn asked the Minister for Education and Science the recent contacts he has had with the Royal Institute of the Architects of Ireland or official representatives thereof; the issues or topics he has discussed with the RIAI, including his recently expressed concerns regarding the high level of architectural fees for school buildings; the outcomes reached during communication with the RIAI; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35199/08]

Minister for Education and Science (Deputy Batt O’Keeffe): I recently received a letter from the President of the Royal Institute of the Architects of Ireland on the issue of architectural fees for school buildings. I have issued a reply to this letter. In my reply, I noted the need to ensure better value for money in the procurement and construction of schools. At all times, but in particular in the current economic circumstances, value for money in the delivery of the Capital Programme is essential to ensure that the 196 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers maximum benefit accrues to the greatest number of schools, their pupils, their teachers and the parents. I also referred to the new competitive process for the procurement of Design Consultants and pointed out that my Department has pioneered the appointment of Design consultants on a competitive basis with fee bidding for Consultants for my Department’s Generic Repeat Design schools introduced in early 2004. My reply also notes that my Department operates in accordance with the relevant national regulations, EU Directives and the Technical Guidance Documents published by the Depart- ment in relation to the procurement of consultants for construction projects. I look forward to working with the RIAI and other partners in the construction industry to ensure that value for money is achieved for the taxpayer in the implementation of the school building programme.

School Accommodation. 136. Deputy Phil Hogan asked the Minister for Education and Science if he will approve and sanction a second Gaelscoil for Kilkenny City in view of the increasing demand for same by parents and pupils; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35209/08]

Minister for Education and Science (Deputy Batt O’Keeffe): As the Deputy will be aware, I have recently announced a review of the procedures for the establishment of new primary schools under the Commission on School Accommodation. I intend to establish a Technical Working Group under the Commission to undertake a full review of the criteria and procedures for the recognition of new primary schools. This working group will begin work in the coming weeks and it is expected that the review of procedures for recognising primary schools will be completed and revised arrangements in place within a two year timeframe. In the interim period it is not proposed to recognise any new primary schools, except in areas where increases in pupil numbers cannot be catered for in existing schools and which require the provision of new schools. This means that new schools will not be established for reasons not related to demographic growth in areas where there is already sufficient school accom- modation or where increases can be catered for by extending existing school accommodation.

Special Educational Needs. 137. Deputy Joe McHugh asked the Minister for Education and Science the secondary schools in County Donegal that are using assistive technology geared toward specific literary support for students with dyslexia; the schools in County Donegal that have applications with his Department for such technology; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35211/08]

Minister for Education and Science (Deputy Batt O’Keeffe): My Department provides for a scheme of grants towards the purchase of equipment for the use of students in second-level schools who have been diagnosed as having serious physical and/or communicative disabilities of a degree which makes ordinary communication through speech and/or writing impossible for them. The purpose of the grant-aid is to provide the students in question with equipment of direct educational benefit to them. Examples of such equipment include computers, word processors, tape recorders, software, etc. The scheme is driven by applications from schools on behalf of individual students, as and when specific needs present. Following the establishment of the National Council for Special Education (NCSE), all applications for assistive technology are submitted by school manage-

197 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

[Deputy Batt O’Keeffe.] ment to the Special Educational Needs Organiser (SENO) with assigned responsibility for the school. The SENO examines applications and makes a recommendation to my Department. My Department only maintains records of applications for the Assistive Technology Grant. Since 2003 the following second level schools in Donegal have been approved for an Assistive Technology Grant to purchase equipment and/or software to assist students with dyslexia:

• Errigal College, Letterkenny

• Abbey Vocational School, Donegal Town

• St Catherine’s Vocational School, Killybegs

• Scoil Mhuire, Buncrana

• Magh E´ ne College, Bundoran

• Carrick Vocational School

• Cola´iste Cholmcille, Ballyshannon

• St Columba’s Comprehensive, Glenties

• Carndonagh Community School.

My Department has no current applications for assistive technology from second level schools in Donegal.

Higher Education Grants. 138. Deputy Damien English asked the Minister for Education and Science when an appli- cation for a higher education grant will be decided on for a person (details supplied) in County Meath; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35224/08]

Minister for Education and Science (Deputy Batt O’Keeffe): The decision on eligibility for student maintenance grants is a matter for the relevant assessing authority, either the local authority or VEC, as appropriate. These bodies do not refer individual applications to my Department, except in exceptional circumstances. If an individual applicant considers that she/he has been unjustly refused a maintenance grant, or that the rate of maintenance grant awarded is not the correct one, she/he may appeal, in the first instance, to the relevant local authority or VEC. Where an individual applicant has had an appeal turned down, in writing, by the relevant local authority or VEC and remains of the view that the body has not inter- preted the schemes correctly in his/her case, an appeal form outlining the position may be submitted by the applicant to my Department.

Institutes of Technology. 139. Deputy Brian Hayes asked the Minister for Education and Science the cost to his Department in respect of paying funds to the DIT for the purposes of protecting the existing buildings on the Grangegorman site; when his Department will commit funds for the transfer of the existing DIT campus to the new Grangegorman site; and the costs involved for his Department to date. [35226/08]

Minister for Education and Science (Deputy Batt O’Keeffe): The Grangegorman site is cur- rently in the ownership of the Health Service Executive and any costs associated with the

198 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers maintenance of buildings on the site is therefore a matter for the HSE. As the Deputy is aware the Grangegorman Development Agency was established under Section 8 of the Grange- gorman Development Agency Act 2005. The general aim of the Agency is to oversee the development of the lands at Grangegorman on behalf of the Departments of Education and Science, Health and Children, Dublin Institute of Technology and the Health Service Executive. Section 12 of the Act provides that the Agency following its establishment must prepare a Strategic plan consisting of a written statement and a plan indicating the objectives for the development of the Grangegorman site, including the setting of a budget for the strategic plan subject to the approval of the Minister for Education and Science together with a strategy for its delivery within the set budget. A total of \3.6 million was provided to the Agency during the period 2006-2007 with a further allocation of \7m being provided in 2008 for the preparation of the Strategic Plan. The draft Strategic plan has been received by my Department and is cur- rently being considered. It is my intention that the plan will be submitted to Government as quickly as possible.

Schools Building Projects. 140. Deputy Phil Hogan asked the Minister for Education and Science when a new school (details supplied) in County Carlow will be sanctioned; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35229/08]

Minister for Education and Science (Deputy Batt O’Keeffe): The building project for the school to which the Deputy refers is at an early stage of architectural planning. The progression of all large scale building projects, including this project, from initial design stage through to construction phase will be considered in the context of my Department’s multi-annual School Building and Modernisation Programme. However, in light of current competing demands on the capital budget of the Department, it is not possible to give an indicative timeframe for the progression of the project at this time.

141. Deputy Thomas Byrne asked the Minister for Education and Science the plans to develop a new building at a school (details supplied) in County Meath. [35232/08]

Minister for Education and Science (Deputy Batt O’Keeffe): The project for the schools referred to by the Deputy has advanced to the stage that the school authorities have agreed the Schedules of Accommodation for two 24 classroom schools. The progression of all large scale building projects from initial design stage through to tender and construction, including this project, will be considered on an on-going basis in the context of my Department’s Multi- Annual School Building and Modernisation Programme. In light of current competing demands on my Department’s capital budget, it is not possible to give an indicative timeframe for the further progression of the project at this time.

Psychological Service. 142. Deputy Catherine Byrne asked the Minister for Education and Science, further to Parliamentary Question No. 566 of 30 September 2008, if there have been recent transfers of staff from County Dublin VEC psychological services to the National Educational Psychologi- cal Service; if the resulting vacant positions within County Dublin VEC have been filled; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35255/08]

Minister for Education and Science (Deputy Batt O’Keeffe): County Dublin VEC has operated a Psychological Support Service since 1992. I understand that a number of psychol-

199 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

[Deputy Batt O’Keeffe.] ogists have left positions with this Psychological Support Service to take up posts with the National Educational Psychological Service (NEPS). My Department has been informed by the VEC that there are currently three vacancies within County Dublin VEC’s Psychological Support Service which have recently arisen as a result of individuals taking up employment with NEPS. Recruitment of staff to fill these vacancies is entirely a matter for the VEC. My Department understands that recruitment for these positions is due to commence shortly.

143. Deputy Catherine Byrne asked the Minister for Education and Science the number of people currently on waiting lists for psychological services within the County Dublin VEC; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35256/08]

Minister for Education and Science (Deputy Batt O’Keeffe): County Dublin Vocational Edu- cation Committee has responsibility for operational matters relating to the psychological services to which the Deputy refers. In view of this, I have forwarded your query to the Chief Executive Officer of Co Dublin VEC for direct reply to you.

Schools Building Projects. 144. Deputy Finian McGrath asked the Minister for Education and Science the position regarding a school (details supplied) in Dublin 5. [35268/08]

Minister for Education and Science (Deputy Batt O’Keeffe): I am pleased to inform the Deputy that on 29 September, I announced that the project in question could proceed. My Department has contacted the school authorising them to progress the project. As the Deputy will be aware, from February 2008 all Capital Works Projects must use the new GCCC Forms of Construction Contracts for Public Works and, as a result, the school have been informed that the tender documents for this project will have to be revised prior to proceeding to tender.

Bullying in Schools. 145. Deputy Finian McGrath asked the Minister for Education and Science if he will support a matter (details supplied). [35269/08]

Minister for Education and Science (Deputy Batt O’Keeffe): My Department funds and provides a range of supports to address the eradication of bullying in schools. Disaggregating all costs related to bullying across these measures that are sometimes part of an integrated policy, is not fully possible. Each school is required to have in place a policy which includes specific measures to deal with bullying behaviour, within the framework of an overall school Code of Behaviour and Discipline. Such a code, developed through consultation with the whole school community and properly implemented, can be the most influential measure in countering bullying behaviour in schools. My Department has issued guidelines and templates to schools in devising measures to prevent and deal with instances of bullying behaviour and to increase awareness among school management authorities of their responsibilities in this regard. “Guidelines on Countering Bullying Behaviour” were issued in 1993 and drawn up following consultation with representa- tives of school management, teachers and parents, and are sufficiently flexible to allow each school authority to adapt them to suit the particular needs of their school. In 2007 my Department published policy templates for post-primary schools in five key areas, including anti-bullying on its website as part of our ongoing efforts in this regard. The template

200 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers documents are not prescriptive, but rather highlight possible approaches and potential material for inclusion in school policies and takes account of more recent legislative and regulatory changes. Reference is also made to issues of contemporary concern such as the need to tackle text bullying, cyber-bullying and homophobic bullying. The National Educational Welfare Board (NEWB) has developed further guidelines for schools on Codes of Behaviour, as provided for under section 23 of the Education (Welfare) Act 2000. These guidelines have been informed by broad consultation. Once schools have had an opportunity to familiarise themselves with the NEWB Guidelines, my Department will commence the process of revising and updating its own Guidelines. This review will take into account issues such as legislative developments, the involvement of the support services available to schools, technological advancements such as use of the Internet, e-mail, mobile phones and camera phones and the latest developments in international best practice on dealing with bullying behaviour. The National Behaviour Support Service (NBSS) was established in 2006 in response to the recommendation in “School Matters”, the report of the Task Force on Student Behaviour in Second Level Schools. The NBSS is currently working with 50 Post Primary Schools to promote and support positive student behaviour. The work of the NBSS is carried out by a multi-disciplinary professional team comprising a National Co-ordinator, Assistant National Co-ordinators, Psychologists, Regional Develop- ment Officers, Literacy Development Officer, Research and Development Officer and Associ- ates. Their current annual allocation is approximately \2 million. The education of students in both primary and post-primary schools in relation to anti- bullying behaviour is part of the SPHE curriculum. SPHE is now a compulsory subject both at primary level and in the junior cycle of post-primary schools. Funding is provided to support the provision of continuing professional development to enable teachers counter bullying. In 2008, \133,850 is being allocated towards the Dublin Cool Schools Pilot Project (DCSPP) which is a pilot anti-bullying support service for second-level schools. The DCSPP promotes a whole school approach to the management of bullying; using the Cool School Programme it provides training and support at school, class and individual levels. It is consistent with the Department of Education and Science Guidelines on Countering Bullying in Primary and Post-Primary Schools. This project recognises that SPHE is the over- arching context for dealing with bullying in schools and indeed, in that context the Primary Professional Development service and SPHE Support Service also provide support to schools in addressing the issue of bullying within the context of SPHE and the Health Promoting School. Other training in the area of bullying includes a range of summer courses. An online summer course Awareness & Prevention of Bullying among Adults & Children was run, in 2008, by Hibernia College with 274 participants. The Drumcondra Education Centre, ran several courses summer courses for 1,300 participants during 2008, which had elements of anti bullying included in their content. These included Promoting Positive Behaviour and Managing Classroom Behaviour. My Department through the National Centre for Technology in Education addresses the issue of cyberbullying in the context of its programme of initiatives in the area of internet safety and provides funding in relation thereto. The initiatives often cover a range of issues in addition to cyberbullying.

201 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

School Curriculum. 146. Deputy Finian McGrath asked the Minister for Education and Science if he will support a school (details supplied) in Dublin 5. [35270/08]

Minister for Education and Science (Deputy Batt O’Keeffe): The syllabus for the Leaving Certificate Technical Drawing was revised by the National Council for Curriculum and Assess- ment (NCCA). The name of the subject was changed to Design and Communications Graphics and the new subject was introduced in September 2007, into a number of selected Post-Primary schools, for examination for the first time by the State Exams Commission (SEC) in June 2009. The implementation of a revised syllabus for an existing subject and / or the implementation of a new subject into the school curriculum require careful planning and considerable financial resources. The extension of this syllabus into further schools will be considered in light of current competing demands on the capital budget of the Department My Department has no record of correspondence from this school seeking funding to intro- duce the new curriculum in Design and Communications Graphics. When schools were initially assessed for the new syllabus, this school had no pupils taking Junior Cert Technical Drawing at that stage. Therefore the school would not have a cohort of pupils in September 2007 to whom the new Design and Communications Graphics course could be offered. In these circum- stances the school was not considered for the first phase of introduction of the new syllabus.

147. Deputy Finian McGrath asked the Minister for Education and Science the position regarding a matter (details supplied). [35271/08]

Minister for Education and Science (Deputy Batt O’Keeffe): Physical education is part of the primary curriculum and is taught by primary teachers in schools throughout the country. My Department has no plans to introduce additional resources in primary schools such as those referred to by the Deputy.

Schools Building Projects. 148. Deputy Finian McGrath asked the Minister for Education and Science if he will support a school (details supplied) in Dublin 3. [35272/08]

Minister for Education and Science (Deputy Batt O’Keeffe): The building project for the school to which the Deputy refers is at an advanced stage of architectural planning. The progression of all large scale building projects, including this project, from initial design stage through to construction phase will be considered in the context of my Department’s multi-annual School Building and Modernisation Programme. However, in light of current competing demands on the capital budget of the Department, it is not possible to give an indicative timeframe for the progression of the project at this time.

Weight of Schoolbags. 149. Deputy Deirdre Clune asked the Minister for Education and Science his views on introd- ucing an ebook initiative to reduce the cost and weight of school books; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35278/08]

Minister for Education and Science (Deputy Batt O’Keeffe): Apart from a small number of prescribed texts at second level (mainly in the case of language subjects) school textbooks are not approved or prescribed by my Department at first or second level. Decisions on which books to use are taken at school level.

202 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

The publication and sale of school books are in the hands of independent commercial enterprises and it is not open to me to compel publishing companies to produce texts in a particular format. The Report of a Working Group to examine potential problems caused by the weight of schoolbags, which was presented in July, 1998, acknowledged that many of the solutions belong at local school level. One of the main recommendations of the report related to the need to heighten the aware- ness of the potential health hazards posed by excessively heavy schoolbags and in this regard, my Department initiated an awareness-raising campaign by disseminating the report, with an accompanying circular, to all primary and post-primary schools. A further circular was issued in 2005, again highlighting the potential health hazard of heavy schoolbags and outlining a range of measures that could be adopted at school level in order to alleviate the problem. Ultimately it is a matter for each individual school to choose those measures that would be most suited to its individual needs and that fit with how the school organises teaching and learning. The Report of the Working Group makes various recom- mendations in this regard, such as optimum use of storage facilities, developing pupil organis- ation skills and timetabling. My Department is aware that positive action has been taken by many schools on these issues. Actions taken consist of a range of measures including the provision of lockers and in the case of second level schools the arrangement of the timetable into double class periods, active liaison with parents and the co-ordination of homework by subject teachers. A copy of the report of the Working Group on the Weight of School Bags and all current circulars in relation to this issue are available on my Department’s website at www.education.ie.

Telecommunications Services. 150. Deputy Brian Hayes asked the Minister for Education and Science if he will provide details of the student email project undertaken by HEANet, Ireland’s National and Education Research Network, including the full details of all moneys expended on the project to date including current maintenance or support contracts; when this money was paid along with full details of the uses made of the student email project to date; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35280/08]

Minister for Education and Science (Deputy Batt O’Keeffe): My Department is providing broadband connectivity to recognised primary and post-primary schools under the Schools Broadband Access Programme. This programme is being undertaken in partnership with indus- try in the context of a Government — IBEC/TIF (Telecommunications and Internet Federation) Agreement to provide local broadband connectivity to schools. The Programme has three elements — local connectivity to schools, a national broadband network and a broad- band support service desk. Schools connectivity is being routed to the Internet through a national broadband network, which is supported by HEAnet. The broadband support service desk has been established to interface between the network, the local broadband service Access Providers and schools. It is managed by the National Centre for Technology in Education (NCTE). In addition to connectivity, the National Broadband Network, supported by HEAnet, provides centrally managed services for schools such as security, anti-spam/ anti-virus and con- tent filtering. Tenders were invited for the delivery, installation, commissioning and maintenance of an email service for the National Broadband Network in September, 2004 and the subsequent contract was signed in November, 2005. Following the infrastructural build for the project and

203 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

[Deputy Batt O’Keeffe.] the piloting of the system, HEAnet signed-off on the service in September, 2006. While the contract provided for the system management for the first year, HEAnet have been supporting the system in-house from the first renewal date. The costs of the email service to date are \476,750 (exclusive of VAT) which include the hardware and software components and the professional services for build and training on the system. A further \72,000 was expended on the first year externally managed service, as was provided for in the contract. As the email service is built primarily of open-source software components, there are no ongoing software license fees other than that which applies for the commercial anti-spam service element (currently \5,000 per annum). HEAnet hosts the email service hardware, along with the other hardware associated with the Schools Broadband Net- work, at a HEAnet data centre facility and my Department meets the associated hosting costs. The particular costs of hosting the hardware acquired for the email service is approximately \60,000 per annum. While the spam scanning component of the service is generally available to schools, only those schools that participated in the pilot phase currently have access to the email service. My Department will continue to consider the future potential for the wider application of the email service.

Special Educational Needs. 151. Deputy Michael Ring asked the Minister for Education and Science the arrangements that have been explored in relation to providing a visiting teacher for visually impaired children in County Mayo. [35284/08]

152. Deputy Michael Ring asked the Minister for Education and Science the number of people who had been availing of the visiting teacher service for visually impaired people in County Mayo prior to its cessation. [35285/08]

153. Deputy Michael Ring asked the Minister for Education and Science the annual costs, in each of the past five years, of providing a visiting teacher service for visually impaired children in County Mayo. [35286/08]

Minister for Education and Science (Deputy Batt O’Keeffe): I propose to take Questions Nos. 151 to 153, inclusive, together. In relation to Co. Mayo, referral agencies, schools and parents of pre-school children with visual impairment currently are being informed by Visiting Teacher management of an interim telephone advisory service that is now being provided while alternative arrangements for a Visiting Teacher presence in Co. Mayo are examined. New referrals to the service continue to be accepted and assessed. Most recent caseload figures for Co. Mayo show a total of 51 children who are eligible for support from the Visiting Teacher service on current criteria. These break down as follows: 6 of pre-school age, 23 in primary schools, 8 at second-level and 14 in special schools. Costs relating to the provision of the Visiting Teacher service in Co. Mayo are being calcu- lated in my Department and the relevant details will be sent to the Deputy as soon as they have been compiled.

Schools Recognition. 154. Deputy Leo Varadkar asked the Minister for Education and Science the reason he

204 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers refused a request from a school (details supplied) in Dublin 15; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35306/08]

Minister for Education and Science (Deputy Batt O’Keeffe): The Department was made aware of proposals to establish a new Gaelscoil to serve Tyrellstown/Hollystown in August 2008. A formal ‘Notification of Intent’ to establish this new school was received from the proposed Patron, An Foras Patrunachta in September 2008. However, as the Deputy will be aware, I announced a review of the procedures for recog- nising primary schools on 14th September last. In the interim period, it is not planned to recognise any new primary schools except in areas where increases in pupil numbers that cannot be catered for in existing schools require the provision of new schools. This means that new schools will not be established for reasons not related to demographic growth in areas where there is already sufficient school accommodation or where the increases can be catered for by extending the existing school accommodation. The application to establish a new Gaelscoil to serve Tyrellstown/Hollystown will be con- sidered in this context. If the school receives provisional recognition the provision of suitable temporary accommodation is a matter for the Patron/Board of Management. In that context and on the basis that the school has not yet received recognition, the founding Committees application for direct provision of accommodation by the Department was refused.

Special Educational Needs. 155. Deputy Leo Varadkar asked the Minister for Education and Science the options avail- able from his Department or its agencies for preschools in respect of children with autism or autistic spectrum disorder; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35307/08]

Minister for Education and Science (Deputy Batt O’Keeffe): As the Deputy may be aware, the vast majority of support for childcare, including pre-school education, is not provided by my Department, but is now provided by the Office of the Minister for Children under the National Childcare Investment Programme 2006-2010 which is the successor programme to the Equal Opportunities Childcare Programme. The Deputy will be aware of my commitment to ensuring that all children, including those with autism, receive an education appropriate to their needs. There are now 35 early inter- vention classes for children with autism attached to mainstream schools that are funded by my Department. Funding is also provided through the home tuition programme for children with autism aged 1 1 from 2 2 years to 5 who are unable to access an early intervention class. A child aged 22 years of age is funded for ten hours per week for an early intervention home based programme. This increases to 20 hours per week once the child is 3 years of age.

Schools Building Projects. 156. Deputy Olwyn Enright asked the Minister for Education and Science the status of an application by a school (details supplied) in County Offaly; when the school will be advised of the way to proceed on this matter; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35367/08]

Minister for Education and Science (Deputy Batt O’Keeffe): I can confirm that the school to which the Deputy refers has applied to my Department for large scale capital funding for a new school building. My Department will be in contact with the school authority when an assessment of the application has been completed.

205 Questions— 16 October 2008. Written Answers

Icelandic Investments. 157. Deputy Ciara´n Lynch asked the Minister for Education and Science if public bodies here have invested funds in Icelandic financial products; the status of such investments; and if he will make a statement on the matter. [35505/08]

Minister for Education and Science (Deputy Batt O’Keeffe): My Department has no such investments and is not aware of any such investments held by bodies under its aegis.

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