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Smithwick Tribunal - 28 June 2011 - Day 13 1 A P P E A R A N C E S The Sole Member: His Honour Judge Peter Smithwick For the Tribunal: Mrs. Mary Laverty, SC Mr. Justin Dillon, SC Mr. Dara Hayes, BL Mr. Fintan Valentine, BL Instructed by: Jane McKevitt Solicitor For the Commissioner of An Garda Siochana: Mr. Diarmuid McGuinness, SC Mr. Michael Durack, SC Mr. Gareth Baker, BL Instructed by: Mary Cummins CSSO For Owen Corrigan: Mr. Jim O'Callaghan, SC Mr. Darren Lehane, BL Instructed by: Fintan Lawlor Lawlor Partners Solicitors For Leo Colton: Mr. Paul Callan, SC Mr. Eamon Coffey, BL Instructed by: Dermot Lavery Solicitors For Finbarr Hickey: Fionnuala O'Sullivan, BL Instructed by: James MacGuill & Co. For the Attorney General: Ms. Nuala Butler, SC Mr. Douglas Clarke, SC Instructed by: CSSO For Freddie Scappaticci: Niall Mooney, BL Instructed by: Michael Flanigan Solicitor For Kevin Fulton: Mr. Michael O'Higgins, SC Instructed by: John McAtamney Solicitor For Breen Family: Mr. John McBurney For Buchanan Family/ Heather Currie: Ernie Waterworth McCartan Turkington Breen Solicitors NOTICE: A WORD INDEX IS PROVIDED AT THE BACK OF THIS TRANSCRIPT. THIS IS A USEFUL INDEXING SYSTEM, WHICH ALLOWS YOU TO QUICKLY SEE THE WORDS USED IN THE TRANSCRIPT, WHERE THEY OCCUR AND HOW OFTEN. EXAMPLE: - DOYLE [2] 30:28 45:17 THE WORD “DOYLE” OCCURS TWICE PAGE 30, LINE 28 PAGE 45, LINE 17 I N D E X Witness Page No. Line No. DAVID McCONVILLE EXAMINED BY MR. DILLON 5 1 CROSS-EXAMINED BY MR. McGUINNESS 72 23 RE-EXAMINED BY MR. DILLON 79 7 Smithwick Tribunal - 28 June 2011 - Day 13 1 1 THE TRIBUNAL RESUMED ON TUESDAY, 28TH OF JUNE, 2011, 2 AT 11 A.M. AS FOLLOWS: 3 4 CHAIRMAN: Good morning, Mr. Dillon. 5 6 MR. DILLON: I am sorry for having been delayed arriving 7 here. Today is what one might call a day for documents, 8 and these are documents which have been provided to us by 9 the PSNI. And we have one witness who will act as a 10 conduit for the presentation of these documents, 11 Mr. McConville. 12 13 One or two issues have arisen in the presentation of the 14 documents, and they arose just this morning and very 15 recently, and it would be helpful, and I am sorry to have 16 to trespass on your time, if we could have maybe 15 or 20 17 minutes to deal with the matter, and if you wouldn't mind 18 maybe rising for that period of time, it would be very 19 helpful. 20 21 CHAIRMAN: Very good. Let's be sensible and say half past 22 eleven. 23 24 MR. DILLON: Very good. 25 26 THE TRIBUNAL ADJOURNED BRIEFLY AND THEN RESUMED AS FOLLOWS: 27 28 MR. DILLON: Thank you very much for the time. It has 29 enabled us to resolve a few matters. And my apologies for 30 taking your time and, indeed, the time of everybody else Doyle Court Reporters Ltd. Smithwick Tribunal - 28 June 2011 - Day 13 2 1 here, who has come here to deal with the matter or to hear 2 matters. We are now in a position to proceed. 3 4 Today is essentially what I might call a documents day. 5 The background to this is that your team was able to 6 inspect documents held by the PSNI, as the successor to the 7 RUC, documents relating to the matter which you are tasked 8 to inquire into. And the best way I can introduce the 9 matter is by reminding you of what was said in the Opening 10 Statement, which was that, "The first documents we sought 11 were copies of the materials with which Judge Cory was 12 provided and to which he refers in his report." And then 13 we went on to say, "One might have expected that this 14 material would have been made readily available to us at 15 the outset of our preliminary investigation. It is with 16 some regret, therefore, I have to report that a significant 17 initial delay in the private investigation was caused by 18 the fact that some months passed from March 2006 before we 19 had sight of the very material upon which Judge Cory relied 20 to recommend the Tribunal's establishment. Nevertheless, 21 that is now water under the bridge, and I can confirm that 22 we sought and ultimately obtained the cooperation of public 23 authorities in the State and in the United Kingdom in order 24 to access materials which had been given to Judge Cory." 25 26 I think it's appropriate at this point if I might record 27 the Tribunal's appreciation to the -- the contribution made 28 by the former Chief Constable Sir Hugh Orde and Assistant 29 Commissioner Alistair Finlay in resolving these matters 30 and, indeed, to their administrative staff, who greatly Doyle Court Reporters Ltd. Smithwick Tribunal - 28 June 2011 - Day 13 3 1 facilitated us in the inspection of the documents. We were 2 given access to a wide range of documents in unedited form, 3 the understanding being that when the documents selected 4 were put in the public domain that they may have to be 5 edited for practical reasons, but we are extremely grateful 6 for the fact that we were able to examine all documentation 7 in unedited form. 8 9 Now, the documents which will be put in evidence before you 10 are a selection of documents. They do not represent by any 11 means the totality of the documents which we had an 12 opportunity to inspect; I think it's fair to say it may be 13 in the order of about ten percent of the documents. 14 Because, of course, the great bulk of documents we 15 inspected related to the RUC's forensic inquiry into the 16 possible criminal prosecution of individuals responsible 17 for the matter under investigation, and that, of course, is 18 not part of your remit. What your team has done is to 19 select a number of documents which, I think I am right in 20 saying this, don't touch directly on the issue of 21 collusion, save for one document, but nonetheless, these 22 documents contained information which you might find of 23 assistance to you in coming to a conclusion; they might 24 serve to form building blocks, as it were, leading up to a 25 conclusion that you might reach in this matter. 26 27 Now, as I said, we haven't chosen all the documents, we 28 made a selection. Secondly, omitted from our selection are 29 most of the intelligence material that we were able to 30 inspect. That would be put in evidence before you as and Doyle Court Reporters Ltd. Smithwick Tribunal - 28 June 2011 - Day 13 4 1 when either the witness or the issue arises. 2 3 There are certain documents which I understand through just 4 human oversight, we did select but didn't make their way 5 into the documents that were sent to us. We will sort that 6 out as soon as possible, hopefully sometime next week, when 7 we have a week when there are no public sittings. 8 9 And then lastly, there are certain documents that were sent 10 to us and they were so heavily redacted that it must be 11 said we don't recognise what the documents are. Again, we 12 will be going back to see what documents they are and take 13 the matter forward from there. 14 15 Now, the manner in which these documents will be put into 16 evidence is through a witness who has been proposed to us 17 by the northern authorities, a Mr. David McConville, a 18 retired member of the PSNI, a retired Detective 19 Superintendent, and he is here today to assist insofar as 20 possible. I think it's important to say at the outset that 21 he is not in a position, as I understand it, to deal with 22 the content of the documents, because he had no involvement 23 in the matters which you are inquiring into. However, he 24 might be in a position to assist either the Tribunal or 25 other parties with maybe certain terms of reference or 26 terms of art with which we are not familiar. 27 28 So, subject to those preliminary comments, I now ask 29 Mr. David McConville, please. 30 Doyle Court Reporters Ltd. Smithwick Tribunal - 28 June 2011 - Day 13 5 1 DAVID McCONVILLE, HAVING BEEN SWORN, WAS EXAMINED BY 2 MR. DILLON AS FOLLOWS: 3 4 CHAIRMAN: Thank you very much for coming here today. Your 5 presence is greatly appreciated. 6 7 1 Q. MR. DILLON: Mr. McConville, I understand you joined, I 8 suppose it was the RUC in those days in 1982, is that 9 right? 10 A. That is correct. 11 2 Q. And in 1989 you were a constable serving in Cookstown? 12 A. That is correct. 13 3 Q. And that as a consequence, you had no involvement in the 14 investigation of the murders under inquiry here, is that 15 right? 16 A. That is correct. 17 4 Q. And I think ultimately you retired this year, having 18 reached the rank of Detective Superintendent? 19 A. That's correct. 20 5 Q. And since then, you have resumed employment with the PSNI 21 in a civilian capacity? 22 A. Yes. 23 6 Q. And I think that you are now working on what I think are 24 called 'cold cases', is that right? 25 A.
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