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Home , Dennis Hopper, George Hickenlooper, Polly Platt, Rodney Bingenheimer, The Big Brass Ring

( cr a f t ) PHOTO BY: KateMcCallum WALKING BETWEEN

The Feature

Writer as Documentarian interviews Dennis Hopper

An Interview with Award-Winning Writer-Director

George Hickenlooper by Kate McCallum

t’s somewhere in the summer of 1988 in and the making of . He’s Prior to that, I was scraping by writing Venice, . I’m standing quietly credited as writer-director on the follow- liner notes for adult films at a company Ibehind my affable Pasadena neighbor, ing documentaries: Picture This: The Times called Image Entertainment. They were a George Hickenlooper, as he interviews the of in Archer City; Monte laserdisc distribution company trying to legendary actor Dennis Hopper for what Hellman: American Auteur; and the feature become legitimate by licensing mainstream will eventually become Art, Acting and the films: The Killing Box, Lowlife, Dogtown, titles from the studios. Having studied at Suicide Chair, George’s first documentary. ; and as a director of the Yale and worked on the Yale Daily News, George had asked me to take still photos of features Persons Unknown and The Man I used my journalistic skills to get access the shoot; and, of course, I jumped at the From Elysian Fields. The latter was released to the film directors because the laserdiscs opportunity. Between clicking off shots, I last fall by Samuel Goldwyn Films to spec- in 1987 were a new medium, and directors listened as George questioned this famous tacular reviews. cited it as being loved them. This was the dawn of ancillary actor, and was very impressed with the one of the best films of 2002. George also material, which is now very common on intelligence of his questions and the ease he produced, directed and edited the short film DVDs; so I knew that if I went to a direc- exuded while he carried on the interview. As Some Folks Call It a Slingblade, which went tor and asked if I could do an interview, I I watched and listened, I had an intuitive on to become the feature film by Billy Bob would get access. knowing that George was going to realize Thornton. His next project is directing the I interviewed people like , his dreams of becoming a storyteller in the feature Diary for Columbia Pictures. Louis Malle—he even came to my office on film medium. Boulevard himself because he CUT TO: scr(i)pt: You started your career writing and loved this technology. They loved the art. Present day. A post-production house, directing documentaries. Was this intentional? I shot Dennis Hopper on video. That was somewhere in the heart of Hollywood. I’m George Hickenlooper: Absolutely not. I the first thing I did, and then, armed with standing quietly behind George once again. fell into it accidentally. I always intended these interviews, I was able to talk Peter George is deep in the mix of his latest docu- to make fictional films. I had made student Bogdanovich into doing the documentary. mentary Mayor of Sunset Strip, a feature- films in high school and college. I came to [The project] was initially meant to be an length exposé examining the history of fame after having graduated from EPK (electronic press kit); but the narra- through the eyes of pop star impresario and Yale and worked for with tive throughline was told from the point radio DJ, Rodney Bingenheimer. the hope of finding a place working in of view of his estranged wife, Polly Platt. It Since that day in 1988, George has fictional film. Through Roger I met Peter turned into a sort of visceral deconstruction been prolific. He authored the book Reel Bogdanovich, and, ultimately, was able to of Peter’s life ... I think much to his dismay. Conversations, has written and directed sort of con my way into doing a documen- That project led to Hearts of Darkness. (and even acted in) several documentaries tary about the making of The Last Picture and features and was awarded an Emmy® Show while [Bogdanovich] was shooting scr(i)pt: How did you get involved with for directing the documentary Hearts of . [Picture This] was my first fea- Hearts of Darkness? Darkness, the story of ture-length documentary. GH: had shot all this

24 s c r ( i ) p t scriptmag.com (2003) MAY/JUNE s c r ( i ) p t 25 ( cr a f t ) footage in the Philippines in 1976 while her in the sense that you’re trying to tell a story scr(i)pt: Can you speak about the writing husband was shooting Apocalypse Now. She that emotionally moves people, and at the process for documentaries? had seen my Bogdanovich documentary. She same time is informational. GH: It’s basically like writing a really long didn’t feel that she had the wherewithal to do In a documentary, obviously, you’re taking research paper. I apply my journalistic back- [a documentary] by herself, so I was brought material and you’re creating a story out of ground when I interview a subject. Let’s on by George Zaloom, the producer, who the material. It’s almost like sculpting out of talk about Mayor of Sunset Strip. I was inter- had a company called ZM Productions. clay—whereas making a fictional film is like ested in making a film about this character, having blueprints and building an architec- Rodney Bingenheimer; but I was also inter- scr(i)pt: They had already set up a deal some- tural structure. ested in Rodney becoming a doorway to where? This is my third feature-length documen- exploring a much larger question of celeb- GH: Yes, they had the deal set up at tary, and I find it more creatively intensive rity. Knowing Rodney’s accomplishments, Showtime. Originally, it was meant to be a and very laborious, but rewarding. You really I saw him as a metaphor for American one-hour TV special. Once I got involved, are creating magic out of nothing; it’s like culture at the beginning of the 21st century. we went through all the material; and we sculpting in that sense. You really come to We have become a culture that is completely realized what we had. We talked them into appreciate and understand the power of the obsessed by celebrity, and I wanted to ask: upping the budget and turning it into a medium, the power of montage—which Why is that? I think it has a lot to do with feature. [Hearts of Darkness] was released is really cinema. [Documentary making] is the breakdown of the nuclear family, and theatrically and premiered at the Cannes one of the plastic arts, but montage editing fragmentation of society and religion, and Film Festival. I think it aired on Showtime at is what sets it apart because you’re manipu- all that; but I was trying to address all these midnight one night before it was released. lating time, and also the perception of questions through Rodney’s life. space. You really get a sense of filmmaking’s Through Rodney I had access to all these scr(i)pt: And you won an Emmy for that? strength through making documentaries, as pop stars and celebrities; so I would ask GH: Yes. opposed to fictional film where it’s a little these questions relevant to this theme I was more linear in the process. You start with a trying to deconstruct, and I would interview scr(i)pt: What would you say is the primary script. You shoot the script; and if the script a subject and ask them all these questions difference between documentaries and fictional doesn’t work, then sometimes you have to about the phenomenon of celebrity. That features? apply some documentary methods to make a subject itself is completely relative to any GH: They are both the same, and they are fictional piece work. question about life and death. Such a broad both completely different. They’re the same subject, it’s a sort of function of human exis-

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scr(i)pt: Then you and Chris took this project script wasn’t taken as far as it could be, so I to whom for financing? introduced a major character, the Sean Astin GH: A single investor. You never know character. That was my contribution. who you’re going to meet in Hollywood. I was single and going to this bar called The scr(i)pt: Can you talk about the Big Brass Atlantic all the time, and I met Tommy Ring? Perna there, who was bartending. I told GH: It was an unproduced ’ him I had this idea for a documentary and script. I loved the original screenplay. he said, “I can get you money.” Tommy My great uncle had been a Senator and introduced me to a very supportive friend of Governor of the state of Iowa, and his his, and he’s been financing the movie over private life was very different from his the last five years. We plan to get distribu- public life, so I was very interested in that tion for it. We’ll finish it and probably have milieu—in the political world where you a premiere this summer at the Hollywood have to be someone completely different Writer-director George Hickenlooper Cinerama Dome. There are a lot of major in the public eye. I loved Welles’ original distributors very interested in this picture. script; but I had the audacity to make it tence, wanting attention, wanting love and The soundtrack potential of this film alone my own. I treated it like an adaptation, as questions of mortality; I had a plethora of is huge. Everybody’s in it from to you would adapt or questions I would ask the subject. Bowie to to to The any great writer for the screen. After interviewing over 50 people or Monkees. It’s very cool and eclectic. College so, I created this 12-and-a-half to 13- kids to adults will love it. scr(i)pt: How did you acquire the script? hour version of the movie. Then my edi- GH: We optioned it from the Orson Welles’ tor, Julie Janata, and I broke it down into scr(i)pt: Who would be your ideal buyer? estate. It took awhile to get it made. I subjects and themes and kept cutting it GH: I would be happy to make a deal with worked on it a long time, from ’91, and we down and cutting it down, molding it, Lion’s Gate, Sony Classics or Artisan; gener- finally got it financed in ’97. My learning and shaping it, and finally ended up with ally, the distributors who pick up documen- curve as a writer was through Orson Welles a 93-minute film. taries. When I did Hearts of Darkness, the because the more I worked on the Big Brass model for that film was Burden of Dreams, Ring, the better I got as a writer. Eventually, scr(i)pt: On what format did you shoot this? the Les Blank documentary. The model for I brought in FX Feeney, who’s a wonderful GH: It was shot on every medium you can this one is Crumb. There’s something very screenwriter, a critic for the LA Weekly; and imagine, and we will finish it on HD. Crumb-like about this movie. he’s got a book coming out about Orson Welles this summer. I think I learned a scr(i)pt: Can you describe how you pitched this scr(i)pt: What did you present to the investor? great deal from FX. and sold it, where your financing came from? GH: We put together an extended proposal GH: One of the producers, Chris Carter, about Rodney’s life with his collection of scr(i)pt: If a writer is interested in breaking is a DJ on a KLSX here in L.A. and hosts photographs with all these incredible people into documentaries, does he or she also have to Breakfast with on Sunday morn- and a copy of Hearts of Darkness. put on the director’s hat? ing. He was in a very popular 80’s band GH: I don’t think you “break into” called and was very friendly scr(i)pt: Were you writing screenplays at the documentaries. It’s not like mainstream with Rodney, because Rodney had launched same time, and was writing or directing your Hollywood. Anyone can make documenta- his band’s career. I knew about Rodney on primary focus? ries. In terms of making a sustained living in the Roq from listening to him on KROQ, GH: I was always trying to write screen- documentaries, that’s very tough. It would and he always had this very unprepossess- plays, but a lot of them were not very even be tough for me if that’s what I wanted ing kind of voice, a very child-like voice. I successful scripts. I think I’ve always been to do full time. Most documentaries are wanted to meet him. Chris was also writing a stronger director. I thought I was a writer, funded by private foundations or political a book about [Rodney] and was making a but I really wasn’t. I’ve written a least a groups; and in order to really make a market documentary on his home video camera. dozen unproduced scripts, but each one’s documentary, you have to be leaning heavily I went to Rodney’s apartment. He lives in gotten better. I have a couple of studio deals to the left, almost to the point of driving a one-room apartment in a very seedy part now, so obviously somebody thinks I’m in circles. Propaganda. Michael Moore is a of Sunset surrounded by photos of himself doing something right. case in point. with just about everyone you can imagine. He was almost like this Forest Gump, Zelig- scr(i)pt: Was Dogtown your original script scr(i)pt: Are there any organizations or like creature. I thought, “This was interest- and your first produced screenplay? resources you would recommend for someone ing.” I didn’t think Rodney’s success in the GH: Yes, it was my first solely credited, wanting to step into documentary making? music industry itself would sustain a riveting, produced screenplay. I was a co-writer on GH: Well, keep as far away from Michael compelling documentary; but these other the Low Life, which was a script that was Moore as possible. That’s my advice. That questions about celebrity made it a universal originally written by a fellow named John guy absolutely irritates me. As a documenta- story, one I was interested in telling. Enbom, a very funny, talented guy. I felt the ry filmmaker, he is guilty of being consistent

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with the political left’s inability to separate my career, for the first five years of my work, I don’t think you “break emotion from facts. Sure, he means well, I went to every city in the continental U.S., but his fudging of the truth to make a case and it was fun meeting people. into” documentaries. for his liberal views is typical. scr(i)pt: Is DVD enhancement production scr(i)pt: What about the IDA? another good route for writers? It’s not like mainstream GH: The IDA* treated me very shabbily after GH: I don’t know what it’s like now, but I the making of Hearts of Darkness, so I have imagine. When I started at ZM Productions, Hollywood. Anyone can very little respect for them. It’s very political, there were a lot of directors there; for and my experience with them left me hurt instance Peyton Reed, who just directed and angry. I also think their calling Michael Down With Love, the Renée Zellweger and make documentaries. Moore’s film the greatest documentary of all Ewan McGregor film, and also Bring It On, time was just plain silly. What about Nanuck the of cheerleading movies he screenplays, you’re narrowing your view of of the North? I mean, come on. calls it—great guy. John Schultz, a very well- the world. I think a lot of films today are so [*The International Documentary Association, respected director, started at ZM. Fax Bahr, derivative of other movies because of that. www.documentary.org, is a membership organization dedicat- who was my partner on Hearts of Darkness, Expose yourself to art history and history. ed to the making of documentaries. Their web site contains a has The Jamie Kennedy Experiment. So, for Get a really solid liberal arts background, and comprehensive list of resources for festivals and funding sources me in the early 90s, coming out of the EPK your work will be richer and more nuanced as well as other pertinent information.] world was fantastic. because of it. Anyone can be a writer if you have a type- scr(i)pt: How did you come to write the book scr(i)pt: Are there any particular issues or writer or a computer. Today, all you need is Reel Conversations? themes you would like to address in your a home video camera. For a screenwriter just GH: The book came about because I com- future work? starting out, if you want to direct or write, piled all the interviews I had done for the GH: My childhood [laughs]. That’s a good do it yourself and have the will and desire to laserdisc company, wrote little introductions question. I am interested in dealing with the do it. You’re better off if you’re in for each one and sold it to Citadel Press. phenomenon of cultural narcissism that has or Los Angeles, preferably Los Angeles. Try taken over this country, which I think is the to get your work seen. Storytelling is about scr(i)pt: What are you writing now? direct result of what happened in the . life experience. Don’t waste your money on GH: I just turned Diary in today, which I’m The 60s has been sort of celebrated as this film school. It’s a complete sham. Use the very excited about. This is the Columbia romantic, great period; but I think it was a tuition money to make a film. movie I’m directing. It was written by a very dark, cynical period, which led to this Finally, if you really want to do this—be a fellow named Eric Nichols, and I just did a eruption of narcissism, which has led to a screenwriter, a filmmaker—for a living then polish on it. sort of very cynical post-modern world. you have to ask yourself one question, and Particularly in the art world. Post-modern- that is: “Is this the only thing I really want scr(i)pt: And that was part of the deal? ism is the thing that really irks me the most. to do with my life, and am I going to be GH: Yes, I am able to do rewrites, the In order to be a filmmaker today, you have to absolutely miserable if I don’t do it?” If so, director’s prerogative. The translation of be perceived as A) politically correct, and B) then you have to dedicate your whole body, [the script] onto the screen is completely just cynical and emotionally detached enough your soul, your whole mind to it. Because different from what the material is liter- that will like you. I think it’s hard. It’s not easy. If there is anything else ally on the page. I can’t tell you how many that if you want to make films that deal with you even think about doing—doctor, lawyer, scripts I’ve directed that I’ve written on; like real, honest human emotions and don’t pan- teacher—then go do that. It’s much easier. The Man From Elysian Fields. I got no writ- der to the dark sensibilities of the New York Be a teacher—we need great teachers. It’s a ing credit, but I rewrote about 50 percent literati, then you’re screwed. Filmmakers like more worthy profession … of that script. George Cukor, or John Ford, or William Wyler would have a hard time getting any KATE MCCALLUM is an independent producer- scr(i)pt: attention today because of that. What about submitting to festivals? writer-consultant and photographer. She was GH: If you have a documentary and you producer on the NBC TV movie What Kind of want to premiere it in a festival, Sundance, scr(i)pt: Any advice to aspiring writers? Toronto and the Los Angeles Film Festival GH: My best advice to writers today is Mother Are You?, and is currently developing are probably the three premiere film festivals to read, read, read. Don’t watch movies. The Emmett Till Story at Showtime with for documentaries. Maybe Tribeca and the Read Anton Chekov, read Henrik Ibsen, Gregory Hines and Diane Keaton while working New York Festival, too. If you really want Arthur Miller, Tennessee Williams, read with Showrunner-Executive Producer Michael to get your film seen, get distribution, you Shakespeare and William Faulkner. Read Chernuchin on the TV series Law & Order. She is need to get it into a premiere film festival. It’s all the great writers so that you have a huge great to play the [smaller film festivals], but canvas from which to draw. pursuing an MA in Consciousness Studies with an it’s not going to move your career forward. If you only watch or just read Steven emphasis on the creative process and is available It’s just going to get you a pat on the back Spielberg, George Lucas, Ron Bass or as a personal writing/career consultant. Contact from audiences, which is fun, too. Early in Stephen Gaghan; if you’re only reading her at www.lifeonthedrawingboard.com

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