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Australian Vaccination Network The following email has just been sent to Greens... - Australian Vaccination Network Patrick Stokes Sponsored Create Advert Australian Vaccination Network · 6,973 like this. 28 August 2013 at 18:08 · Sit back, relax and enjoy the... youtube.com/telstracorp Did you have a fabulous NYE? If things are a bit hazy then here's your The following email has just been sent to Greens senator Richard Di Natale: chance to re-live t... Hi Richard Last Minute Cruise Deals This email will be posted publicly as many are awaiting your response. ozcruising.com.au Relax on this unforgettable holiday. Find the perfect As things stand your statements about Greens policy on vaccination and compulsion are misleading cruise to take friends or and in conflict with your party's actions. There is a need for immediate clarification. Should you family. continue to avoid responding I will conclude, as I'm sure others will, that the deception is deliberate. 31,561 people like this. To avoid such judgement befalling the whole party, the option is available for your leader or deputy leader, both of whom have been copied in on these emails, to respond in your place. Oscar Hunt Tailors by Appointment Revive your work Best wishes wardrobe with a tailored suit, shirt or overcoat. Greg Beattie Appointments available Like · · Share Like · 7,613 people like Oscar Hunt. 137 people like this. Explore eBay ebay.com.au This comment has been hidden. Discover something new Unhide · Report · Block Joce on eBay! 2 Replies This comment has been hidden. Unhide · Report · Block Anne International NY Times 2 Replies nytimes.com Get unlimited digital This comment has been hidden. access to the new Unhide · Report · Block Sharon International NY Times. Just 99¢ for 12 weeks. This comment has been hidden. Unhide · Report · Block Jane This comment has been hidden. Unhide · Report · Block Suzy GO PUCK Australia This comment has been hidden. Portable power Unhide · Report · Block Nikki anywhere, anytime! This comment has been hidden. Unhide · Report · Block Daisy Like · 177 people like GO PUCK Australia. Patrick Stokes Honestly, what is this country coming to when a Senator doesn't immediately drop everything STUDY CLOSE TO HOME in the middle of an election campaign to respond to a citizen (who has previously by his own admission vu.edu.au recorded a phone conversation with said senator without the latter's consent) who's accusing him of lying on the Study a Bookkeeping basis of the AVN's own apparently idiosyncratic and self-serving definition of 'compulsory'? I am shocked - Chat (21) course from VU shocked! - that Dr Di Natale didn't respond right away, especially given the highly professional and politically conveniently in Sunbury. savvy way AVN has managed its relationships with politicians like him. After all, Greg is President of the AVN - Info session 16 January. surely a President outranks a mere Senator! Like · Reply · 19 · 28 August 2013 at 19:02 Australian Vaccination Network Patrick Stokes - I wonder why you bother to make comments about issues when you are completely ill-informed? Ah, that's right - you celebrate ignorance because you're not Big Day Out 2014 qualified. Well, it shows! Greg has been writing to the Greens for over 2 months. And Di Natale has told bigdayout.com absolute lies about this organisation, what we stand for and what our information consists of. I think he Pearl Jam, Arcade Fire, https://www.facebook.com/....living.wisdom/posts/10151677624316925?comment_id=27392333&reply_comment_id=28896679&offset=0&total_comments=525[1/01/2014 8:37:42 PM] The following email has just been sent to Greens... - Australian Vaccination Network owes us an explanation. If he has time to make things up in his media interviews, he has time to answer Beady Eye, Deftones, honest and genuine questions. Major Lazer, Steve B52 Angello, Flume and more. Like · 6 · 28 August 2013 at 19:27 · Edited Patrick Stokes Accusing a senator of lying is a pretty big deal, B52. Perhaps you could point out which of his public statements about you is factually untrue? Like · 6 · 28 August 2013 at 19:30 Anita Rush Really Patrick if you cannot read between the lines into the Greens statement `do not Facebook © 2014 support compulsory vaccination` as we are going to support everything else so as to back people into a corner. You really are quite gullible. And as for the Greens who truly are on a knife edge of being redundant English (UK) · Privacy · Terms · Cookies · as a political force. I would think answering a question that requires clarification from their constituants More during an election campaign may perhaps be important! Like · 8 · 28 August 2013 at 20:40 via mobile · Edited Patrick Stokes Well I'd refer you to my comment above on the difference between compulsion and policies designed to stop people making objectively bad decisions, but I believe the admins have hidden it. Like · 1 · 28 August 2013 at 20:39 Greg Beattie Hi Patrick Some problems you may not have thought about when you wrote: 1. Drop everything in the middle of an election campaign? Well... that's what he did to send us the misleading email. Obviously the issue is important enough to clarify. 2. I recorded a phone conversation? No. Please review what I wrote. I recorded *my own voice* only. Shocking thing to do, hey? 3. I accused him of lying? Where? 4. "self-serving definition of 'compulsory'"? What's yours? Explain it in terms of 'compulsory voting'. 5. "surely a President outranks a mere Senator"? What's your point? Do constituents need to outrank him to ask something? Like · 17 · 28 August 2013 at 21:04 Anita Rush Objectively bad decisions ha ha Patrick are you sure YOU are not in politics lol May I ask whose objective are we using? Yours? You made me giggle! Thanks Like · 3 · 28 August 2013 at 21:20 via mobile Karen Little PS, as a Philosopher, how do you reconcile the necessity to legally give informed consent to vaccination (which carries risks), with financial incentives such as Family Tax Benefits or disincentives such as exclusion from child care to achieve that end. How is that ethical or indeed legal? Like · 9 · Yesterday at 04:10 · Edited Travel-one Anna PATRICK STOKES Natale is a LIAR and shoud be fired for his systematic hate campaign of the AVN doesn't he actually have anything better to do? Like · 6 · 28 August 2013 at 23:03 Patrick Stokes Hello Greg, good to see you on Facebook. Thanks for the numbered points, that always makes things much more manageable. 1. He's made a clear statement that the Greens do not support compulsory vaccination. You now demand "immediate clarification." What exactly is he going to say other than to repeat himself? And does he really need to make 'clarifying' his already clear remarks a priority at this time simply because you aren't satisfied with them? 2. Yes I'm aware that you only recorded your own voice. Legally, I expect that's a sensible move. Morally? Not sure it makes a radical difference. And I'm honestly quite confused as to what you thought releasing the recording would achieve. 3. He's said unambiguously that he does not support compulsory vaccination. You insist that he has said something differently in private (in support of which you've cited, to date, a second-hand account of a conversation with an unnamed AVN member), refer to his email as "misleading" and add "Should you continue to avoid responding I will conclude, as I'm sure others will, that the deception is deliberate." I'm not sure how to construe that as anything other than an accusation of dishonesty. If you want to use a more nuanced taxonomy of dishonesty than 'lying/not lying', great (I find Frankfurt's distinction between 'lying' and 'bullshit' extraordinarily helpful in that regard and can well recommend his paper on that topic). 4. I'd understand 'compulsory vaccination' to mean being forced to have a vaccinations or face legal penalty. Quite different to not getting a payment, or not being able to enrol your child in the preschool of your choice. To be clear, these are coercive policies in a sense (in the same sense that e.g. higher excise on tobacco products or congestion charges on roads are coercive) but that doesn't mean they are compulsory in the sense of mandatory. 5. Just a rhetorical flourish - a weakness of mine - but there is a half-serious point in there: the guy's a senator, and minor party senators, simply by dint of there not being many of them, get lumped with massive https://www.facebook.com/....living.wisdom/posts/10151677624316925?comment_id=27392333&reply_comment_id=28896679&offset=0&total_comments=525[1/01/2014 8:37:42 PM] The following email has just been sent to Greens... - Australian Vaccination Network portfolio responsibilities and end up working insane hours during normal periods, let alone during campaigns. I know this issue is extremely important to you and your membership - and that's fine, we're all here because we care deeply about this one way or another - but do you not see how demanding 'immediate clarification' two weeks from an election might not seem just a tad overblown to outside observers? Like · 3 · 29 August 2013 at 01:15 Kaye Payne when I saw Di Natale's address to parliament on youtube there were a lot of untruths sprouting from his mouth; and he along with many other SAVNer's should be held accountable for this.
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