2470 2470ASSEM3BLY.] ?irgitati A0Brnnblg OONTENTS--coinuited QUESTIONS ON NOflCE-contiPage Wednesday, the 11th November, 1964 Fishing- CONTENTS Fisheries Returns : Responsibility for Page Submission ._ .1 .. .. 2475 ANNUAL ESTIMATES, 1964-65- Fish Traps : Use in Shark Bay I.. 2475 Committee of Supply : General Debate- Fodder Plants : Growth in Combinations- Speakers on Financial Policy- Agricultural Department Experiments .... 2477 Mr. Han...... 2510 Health-Government Hospitals: wages Mr. Sewell...... 2518 Paid to Runners and Nurses ".. 2471 BILLS- Housing-Building Blocks at Merrodiji: Agricultural Products Act Amendment ownership and Acquisition by State Dill {No. 2)- Housing Commission ... .. 2478 2r. .... 3469 land- Cor.; Report; Sr...... 2499 Narrows Bridge : Southern Approach Doer to Doer (Sales) Bill- -Responsibility for Development 2473 Zr...... 2500 Shannon River Mill Club:, Ownership Corn...... 2504 of Clubhouse Land ...... 2475 Report ...2510 South Perth Waterfront : Rhsponsi- Fisheries Act Amendment 1ll-2r. .2481 bility for Control ...... 2474 Interstate Maintenance Recovery Act Murdier of Jlillian Brewer- Amendment Bill- Contents of Punse ...... 2479 Intro. ; Ir...... 2471 Statement by Eric Edgar Cooke _.2479 2r...... -...... 2485 Railways-- Justices Act Amendment 1W1(No. 2)- Flashing Lights: Installation at Intro. ; fr...... 2471. Verna Street Railway Crossing, 2r...... - .. 2485 Gosneils .. .2478 Married Persons (Summary Relief) Act Long Service Leave :Conditions Amendment Bill- Applying to Railway Employees ... 2478 Intro. ; r. ... 2471 Road System Adjacent to Parliament ar. -'2483 House:. Current Plans...... 2477 Statute Law Revision Bill-- Sewerage~ 2r. 24r. Glendalough- Cor.; Report; .. .. 3r487 Boundaries and Commencement 2478 Traffic Act Amendment Bill-2r. .. .. 2482 Finance Allocated for Construc- tion ...... 2473 Wheat Products (Pries Fixation) Act Merrein : Completion and Approxi- Amendment Bill- mate Cost...... 2477 Zr...... 2487 Coin...... 2499 Tobacco Growing : Representation at Report; Sr...... 2469 Federal Conference ...... 2475 Traffi-- QUESTIONS ON NOTICE- Pedestrian Traffi-- Boxing Day : Granting of Paid Holiday in Cost of Bridge and Ramp ...2479 Lieu ...... 2472 Cost of Supervision of Crossings 2479 Protection by Overweys . 479 Caravan Park at Exmouth : Enforcement Suspended Flashing Lights : W.A. of Caravan Annex Regulations ...2474 Experiments, and Installation at Pecentralisatlon- liurliugham Hil4.111.. 2473 Establishment of Portfolio:- Min- Ister's Criticism ...... 2476 QUESTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE- Inquiries In New South Wales .. 2475 Capital Punishment : Hanging of a Com- Drainage at Merredin : Improvement and monwealth Prisoner...... 2479 Assistance to Shire Council...... 2477 Decentralisation- Education- Interpretation of Minister's Remarks 2480 Country High School Hostels Author- New South Wales Proposal:. Applica- ity : Expenditure and Construction 2471 lion to Western Australia .. 2480 Bentley High School- Murders in Western Australia : Con- Factors Governing Rise in Status 2472 fessions by Eric Edgar Cooke ... -. 2461 Raising to Five-year Status ... 2472 Senate Vacancy : Filling ...... 2480 High Schools : Establishment in Albany Electorate .. .. -. 2478 SItting of the House : Wednesday Start- Single Teachers : Number Outside Ing and Finishing Times .. ...2480 Metropolitan Area ...... 2479 SITTINGS OF THE HOUSE- Electricity Supplies-- Closing Days of Session: Wednesday Alcoa- Starting Time ...... 2471 Cost of Provision .2476 Generation by Company .... 2478 WHEAT PRODUCTS 4PRICES FIXATION) Farming Properties : Details of Con- ACT- tributory System ...... 2478 Tabling of Departmental Files .. .. 2471 [Wednesday, 11 November, 1984.]

The SPEAKER (Mr. Hearman) took the (4) At what centres are hostels Chair at 4.30 p.m., and read prayers. planned for the years 1964-65, 1965-66, and 1966-67? SITflrNGS OF THE HOUSE (5) What is the maximum amount Closing Days of Session: Wednesday of money which the authority Starting Time can acquire for expenditure In MR. NALDER (Katanning-Deputy the years 1964-65, 1965-68, and Premier) [4.34 p.m.]: On behalf of the 1966-67? Premier, Mr. Speaker, I wish to inform Mr. LEWIS replied: the House that as from, and including, next Wednesday, the House will sit at f 2.15 p.m. (1) 1960-61 380 The SPEAKER (Mr. Hearman): I would 1961- 62 129,439 like to make one query of the honourable 1962-63 145,003 Minister. Does he mean that on Wednes- 1963- 64 302,916 days and Thursdays we will be meeting (2) Hostels have been built asfol- at 2.15 p.m., or on Tuesdays as well? low:- Mr. NALDER: No; I said that we will Cast be sitting at 2.15 p.m. every Wednesday, f including next Wednesday, from now on. Merredin .. .115,295 The SPEAKER (Mr. Hearman): On all Narrogin .82,144 Wednesdays In the future we will meet Geraldton ... . 72,045 at 2.15 p.m.? Mr. NALDER: Yes. Carnarvon .. -. 73,935 Katanning ...... 57,695 Northam Administra- WHEAT PRODUCTS (PRICES tion Block ...-.. 55, 383 FIXATION) ACT in addition, buildings have been acquired and converted for hostel Tabling of Departmental Files purposes at:- MR. NALDER (Katanning-Minister for £ Agriculture) (4.37 p.m.]: At this stage I cost wish to table some papers on the Wheat Albany ... Products (Prices Fixation) Act Amendment ...14,263 Bill, in response to a question asked yes- Narrogin terday. These papers will remain on the (3) Bunbury. Table for seven days. Narrogin (extensions). The papers were tabled. (4) 1964-65---Bunbury; Narrogin-ex- tensions. 1965-66; 1066-67-The Country BILLS (3): INTRODUCTION AND High Schools Hostel Authority FIRST READING has not yet drawn up a pro- 1. married Persons (Summary Relief) gramme for these years. Act Amendment Bill. (5) Par the years stated the autho- rity's borrowing powers are at 2. Interstate Maintenance Recovery Act present limited to the follow- Amendment Bill. ing:- 3. Justices Act Amendment Bill (No. 2). 1964- 65-£ 100,000. Bills introduced, on motions by Mr. 1965-66--E100.000. Court (Minister for Industrial De- velopmnent), and read a first time. 1966-67-f 100,000.

QUESTIONS ON NOTICE GOVERNMENT HOSPITALS COUNTRY HIGH SCHOOL HOSTELS AUTHORITY wages Paid to Runners and Nurses Expenditure and Construction 2. Mr. CURRAN asked the Minister for Health: 1. Mr. KELLY asked the Minister for (1) What is the wage paid to a runner Education: in government hospital employ (1) What amount has been spent by until date of entering first-year the Country High School Hostels training as a nurse? Authority in the years 1960-61, (2) What is the wage paid 1961-62, 1962-63, 1963-64? to- first-year nurse; (2) Where were hostels built, and at what cast? second-year nurse: (3) At what centres are hostels under third-year nurse; course of construction? staff nurse? [ ASSEMBLY.]I

Mr. ROSS HUTCHINSON replied: of Anzac Day and Boxing Day, (1) 15 years of age-EV 7s. 2d. per both of which fall on a. Saturday? week. (2) What was the Government's de- 16 years of age-ES los. 7Id. per cision in respect of each of these week. days? of age-09 4s. 5d. per (3) Is it a fact that the New South 17 years Wales, Victorian, and Tasmanian week. Governments have already (2) 1st-year student nurse-tIC Os. 4d. granted a day in lieu of Boxing per week, Day? 2nd-year student nurse-ElO 11s. (4) As various industrial organisa- ld, per week. tions are perturbed at the Posi- 3rd-year student nurse-Eli 16s. tion which will arise in 1965- 7d. per week. 1966 when Anzac Day, Christmas, Staff nurse- and New Year's Day will fall on a Saturday and Boxing Day on a. 1st year-E18 Os. Ild, per week. Sunday, will he reconsider the 2nd year-18 8s. 5d, per week. decision not to grant a day in Board and lodging deducted from lieu of Boxing Day 1964? above rates if employee lives tn. (5) If not, what excuse can he advance? BENTLEY HIGH SCHOOL Factors Governing Rise in Status Mr. WILD replied: (1) Yes. 3. Mr. D. G. MAY asked the Minister (2) The request was refused. for Education: (3) I understand that this is the posi- (1) In view of the answers given to tion. question 26 dated Thursday, the 5th November, 1964, will he advise (4) No. if the Bentley High School con- (5) In regard to Anzac Day, the Anzac forms to the three qualifications Day Act specifically provides that detailed in his reply? that day shall be celebrated on (2) If not, will he indicate the par- the 25th April. ticular category in which the In regard to Boxing Day, there is Bentley High School does not no power to declare an alternative qualify? public holiday. The same posi- Raising to Five-year Status tion operated in 1959, and no alternative day was granted. The (3) Can he give an assurance that the attention of the honourable mem- Bentley High School will ulti- ber is drawn to the decision of mately be raised to a five-year the President of the Arbitration school? Court in the 1961 inquiry into Mr. LEWIS replied: holidays, in which he said (and this principle is now included in (1) The Bentley High School does the majority of our awards and not conform with all of the quali- agreements, plus our Factories and fications detailed in my reply of Shops Act)- the 5th November. The next claim by the Unions 42) (a) Kent Street Senior High was designed to standardise School can cater for upper the practice when any of the school students from Bentley named days (with the excep- High School. tion of Anzac Day) falls on a (bi The availability of specialist Saturday or Sunday. Under staff is a criterion applying to the Bank Holidays Act all high schools. Amendment Act, 1893, where (3) It is anticipated that ultimately Australia Day, Labour Day. most metropolitan high schools Foundation Day or the Sover- will become senior high schools. eign's Birthday (and also some other bank holidays- not generally prescribed as BOXING DAY holidays under industrial Granting of Paid Holiday in Lieu awards) falls on any day other than a Monday, the 4. Mr. W. HEGNEY asked the Minister next succeeding Monday is for Labour: observed in lieu of the actual (1) Were representations made to day, so that this claim only him earlier this year by the affects three of the public Trades and Labour Council re- holidays usually described, questing that the Government viz. Christmas Day, Boxing take necessary action to ensure Day and New Year's Day. The paid holidays to workers in lieu practice as to the observance [Wednesday, 11 November, 1964.] 2473

of these days when they fall out in Western Australia in re- on a Saturday or Sunday has spect of this type of warning varied from time to time in signal? this State and there is no (2) Will he investigate the advisability uniform practice in the other of having such a signal installed States which we could adopt on Canning Highway, at Hurling- as a model. On the whole, I think that when any of those ham Hill, instead of the type three days falls on a Sunday. which is operating there at pre- the following working day sent? should be granted in lieu Mr. CRAIG replied: thereof and, similarly, when Christmas Day or New Year's (1) 1 ani not aware that the effective- Day falls on a Saturday, but ness of overhead flashing lights in that when Boxing Day falls some eastern States is proved. No on a Saturday it should be experiments of this type of flash- observed on that day. ing warning device are in train in It will be noted that the president Western Australia. However, the was definite that when Boxing Main Roads Department has st Day falls on a Saturday it should up an experimental installation of be observed on that day. overhead traffic signals and the Perth City Council is also experi- SEWERAGE FOR GLENDAWOUGH menting on these lines. Mandatory signals of this type Finance Allocated for Construction should not be confused with flash- 5. Mr. W. HEGNEY asked the Minister ing (i.e., warning) devices. for Water Supplies: (2) I will refer this matter to the (1) What amount has been allocated Main Roads Department for con- for sewerage construction in the sideration. Glendalough district? Boundaries and Commencement NARROWS BRIDGE: SOUTHERN APPROACH (2) What will be the approximate boundaries within which construc- Responsibility for Development tion will proceed during the pre- ent financial year? 7. Mr. GRAYDEN asked the Minister for 0 Works: (3) When is it proposed to commence (1) What land on the southern ap- such construction? proach to the Narrows Bridge is Mr. WILD replied: the responsibility of the Public (1) £75,000 for 1964-65. Works Department and what por- (2) An area bounded on the south by tion is the responsibility of the Powis Street, on the east by Raw- South Perth City Council? lins and Pollard Streets and In- (2) Has any delay been experienced cluding Glendalough Home: lots in having some of this land vested an the western side of Harborne in the South Perth City Council Street from one lot south of Lee- and, if so. what portion? der Street and north to the Balgay (3) How does the department plan to drain reserve. Also a small area beautify the area of land for south of Baden Street to Scar- which it is responsible and when borough Beach Road approxi- is this likely to eventuate? mately between Donovan Street and the alignment of the proposed (4) Is It intended to bore for water in the area referred to and, if so, northern access road. approximately when and where (3) Construction is at present pro- will this take place? ceeding. Mr. WILD replied: SUSPENDED FLASHING LIGHTS (1) There are two main areas of land, W.A. Experiments, and Installation at excluding alienated land, which Hurlinghflm Hill comprise the area immediately south of the Narrows Bridge. They 6. Mr. ORAYDEN asked the Minister for are the freeway reserve and the Police: areas to the west and east of the (1) in view of the effectiveness in the bridge approaches, The fenced Eastern States of flashing lights area of the freeway is under the which are suspended over the control of the Main Roads De- centre of roads instead of being partment and the other two areas placed on either side at danger are, for the time being, under the spots, will he outline what experi- control of the Lands Department. ments, if any, are being carried Until these areas are vested in the 2474 2474ASSEMBLY.I

South Perth City Council it has (2) In respect of families who are no responsibility for their beauti- employed on the V.L.F. project at fication. Exmouth, is there any time limit (2) There has been some delay in on their stay in the caravan park vesting in the South Perth City and, if so, what is it? Council the land at present under (3) As there is no alternative accom- the control of the Lands Depart- modation for families in the area ment. A survey was necessary to and as building blocks are not Properly delineate the areas con- available for home building, is it cerned, and due to the complex his intention to rigidly enforce nature of the survey this has any regulations regarding Period taken some time to complete. How- of residence and structure of an- ever, the Lands Department now nexes Providing that these are advises that the survey is finished neat and tidy? and that design plans are being (4) If the answer to (3) is "Yes," drawn, and when these are com- what are his reasons, taking in pleted the Lands Department will all factors such as isolation, have further discussions with the climate, and the anticipated South Perth City Council. The length of employment? areas the South Perth City Coun- cil is interested in comprise a strip Mr. NALDER replied: along the foreshore to the west of (1) The by-laws of the Exmouth the freeway and the open space Shire Council include the follow- to the east overlooking Perth ing:- Water. By-law No. 1 (Q)- (3) The Main Roads Department is the word 'annex', when preparing a plan for improving used in reference to a the appearance of the freeway. caravan, shall mean a Boring is being undertaken to as- framework of tubular certain the availability of suitable steel or other material water for reticulation purposes. constructed so as to be (4) Answered by (3). easily and readily dis- mantled, with a canvas, SOUTH PERTH WATERFRONT plastic, oil silk or similar materials approved of in Responsibility for Control writing by the manager, 8. Mr. GRAYDEN asked the Minister for so made as to fit neatly Lands: over the framework; and Which portion of the undeveloped the maximum dimensions waterfront land in Southi Perth, of an annex shall not which Is bounded in the north by exceed the overall dimen- the river, in the east by Coode sions of the caravan to Street, in the south by Mill Point which it is attached. Road and in the west by the By-law No. 1 (10)- Mends Street jetty, is the respon- No person shall.. sibility of the Government and (c) erect any structure, which portion is the responsibility whether temporary of the South Perth Council? or otherwise, except Mr. BOVELL replied: pursuant to and in The foreshore strip, varying in accordance with the width between two and five chains, conditions of a lic- and containing about 18 acres, is ense granted under vacant Crown land. this by-law: The balance of the land, extending fly-law No. 1 (15) (3)- to Mill Point Road and contain- Licensee may apply to ing 36 acres 1 rood 27 perches, is the manager for permis- held in fee simple by the City of sion to erect a light South Perth. annex, but all such re- quests must be accom- CARAVAN PARK AT EXMOUTH panied by details of the Enforcement of Caravan Annex structure. Erection may Regulations not be commenced before permission is granted: 9. Mr. NORTON asked the Minister rep- such erection without resenting the Minister for Local Gov- permission may result in ernment: the Council requesting or (1) What regulations, if any, are authorising the structure there in respect of annexes at- removed, and the costs tached to caravans on the cara- thereof will be a charge van park at Exmouth? 3n the licensee. Any [Wednesday, 11 November, 1964.1 2475

annex erected under this to furnish returns. However, in condition must be dis- practice it is the skipper who mantled on departure of submits the necessary informa- the licensee from the tion. park, and any concrete laid must be also re- moved. SHANNON RIVER MILL CLUB (2) A time limit is fixed by the Ownership of Clubhouse Land model by-law relative to caravan parks, which was adopted by the 12. Mr. ROWBERRY asked the Minister shire council, this being three for Lands: months in any one year, but with (1) What progress has been made in power to have this extended with the consideration of a grant in the express approval In writing of fee simple of the land on which the Minister for Local Govern- the Shannon River Mill Club ment. House stands, viz., Reserve No. (3) It is not the Minister's preroga- 13305? tive to enforce or otherwise the (2) As application for the above was by-lawvs. This is a matter for the made on behalf of the club by Exmouth Shire Council which is Mr. R. Brett Asplin, solicitor, of at Present administered by a Bridgetown, on the 28th Febru- commissioner. ary, 1982, can he indicate when (4) Answered by (3). a decision will be made In this matter? FISH TRAPS (3) Has any material alteration in Use in Shark Bay the status of Reserve No. 13305 occurred in the meantime? 10. Mr. FLETCHER asked the Minister for 71sheries: Mr. HOVELL replied: Will he make known departmental (1) and (2) It is not proposed to intentions regarding use of fish grant the fee simple of the land traps in Shark Bay area- on which the Shannon River Ca) continued use; Workers' Club is erected. The Cb) partial use; or site is on sawmilllng site permit (c) abolition when? No. 169-33 granted to Hawker Siddeley Building Supplies, and Mr. ROSS HUTCHINSON replied: the company advised the Con- Recently a deputation from the servator of Forests on the 25th Fremantle Fishermen's Co-opera- August, 1964, that arrangements tive requested that fish traps be were being made to lease club banned for the catching of Premises on suitable terms. snapper. In addition evidence submitted by fishermen to the (3) No. Fishermen's Advisory Committee recently in opposition to the use TOBACCO GROWING of traps is being checked and analysed. Representation at Federal Conference The honourabie member is ad- 13. Mr. ROWBERRY asked the Minister vised, therefore, that the whole for Agriculture: question of the use of snapper traps in Shark Bay is now under (1) Was the State of Western Aus- consideration. tralia, represented at the recent talks between the Minister for Primary Industry and representa- FISHERIES RETURNS tives of tobacco growers on the question of stabilisation which Responsibility for Submission took Place recently in the Eastern 11. Mr. FLETCHER asked the Minister States? for Fisheries: (2) If not, why not? Who is the person responsible for Mr. NALDER replied: submitting a fisheries return- (l) NO. (a) the owner; Cb) the part-owner; (2) Western Australia could not (c) the owner-skipper: expect representation at discus- (d) the skipper; or sions on a tobacco stabiulsation (e) a registered accountant on scheme while It is not a tobacco- behalf of any of the above? Producing State. However, representations have Mr. ROSS HUTCHINSON replied: been made to the Minister for Under section 18 of the Fisheries Primary Industry for provision for Act, all persons engaged in the Possible Production of tobacco in taking of fish for sale are required Western Australia if, and when, (ASSEMBLY.]

consideration is given to the task in Western Australia our per- question of tobacco production formiance as a State compares quotas for individual States. favourably. Mr. Hawke: A very poor effort. DECENTRALISATION Mr. Tonkin: It is a masterpiece of Establishment of Portfolio: Minister's evasion. Criticism 14. Mr. TONKIN asked the Minister for ELECTRICITY SUPPLY FOR ALCOA Industrial Development: Cost of Provision (1) Upon what criteria did the Gov- ernment come to the decision 15. Mr. TONKIN asked the Minister for which he announced at the Electricity: annual south-west conference (1) What was the cost involved in that a Minister for decentralisa- providing for electricity to be. tion would prove to be a first-class supplied to Alcoa? farce? (2) Dloes this opinion of the Govern- Generation by Company ment refer only to a Minister for (2) Has the company been taking a decentralisation in Western Aus- reasonable supply or is it generat- tralia or to such a portfolio gener- ig some or all of its require- ally? ments? inquiries in New South Wales Mr. NALDER replied: (1) and (2) Alcoa generates its own (3) Has the Government made an in- electricity requirements. The quiry at all concerning the work State Electricity Commission pro- of successive Ministers for Dle- vides emergency Supply Only. All centralisation in New South costs were met by Alcoa. Wales? Mr. Tonkin: By Jove, that is pretty (4) If "Yes," with what result? rough!I What did it cost to put Mr. COURT replied: the supply on? (1) The comment reported was my The SPEAKER (Mr. Hearman): Order! own and not the result of a speci- fic government decision. The reason for my comment was BUILDING BLOCKS AT MERREDIIN that one Minister trying to imple- Ownership and Acquisition by State ment a role of decentralisation Housing Commission would be in a most difficult and, under some circumstances, an in- 16. Mr. KELLY asked the Minister re- tolerable position. presenting the Minister for Housing: In any government committed to (1) How many unbuilt-on building a Policy of decentralisation this blocks in Merredin are owned by policy can only be implemented if the State Housing Commission? all Ministers in a government (2) Is the commission interested in work to that objective. The de- purchasing lots 492 and 493 com- centralised development achieved prising roughly 10 acres? by the Present Government is be- (3) As there is a considerable housing cause of this approach. lag at present, what is the delay In arriving at a decision to pur- (Laughter front Opposition members.] chase these lots? Mr. COURT: I did not think honour- Mr. ROSS HUITCHINSON replied: able members Opposite would like (1) The commission owns 15 sites and that a bit, but it happens to be is finalising the acquisition of ap- true. To continue with the proximately 140 more. answer- (2) Yes; and inquiries have been made (2) MY comments referred specifically and should be finalised in the near to Western Australia but would future. be equally applicable to most (3) As there are at Present 33 appli- States or countries. cants with 10 houses under con- (3) and (4) The Government ex- tract and a vacancy rate of 25 amines efforts at decentralisation per annum, it is considered that attempted in other States and the position is reasonable, but it countries in a search for practical will be kept under review. Investi- ideas suitable to this State. gations regarding Lots 492 and 493 Tt is fair to say that, within the have been proceeding together resources at our disposal and hav- with the negotiations to acquire ing regard to the magnitude of the other land. [Wednesday, 11 November, 1964.] 247?"

SEWERAGE AT MERREDIN alone and in mixtures. A breed- ing and testing programme is Completion and Approximate Cost carried out with linseed which is 17. Mr. KELLY asked the Minister for grown as a crop for oil and meal Water Supplies: production. The varieties, species, (1) What stage has been reached in or mixtures which can be grown sewerage extensions in Merredin- in an area, and the results ob- tained, vary with climatic con- (a) in the area bounded by Grow- den, Fifth, Duff, and Bates ditions. Streets; DRAINAGE AT MERREDIN (b) area bounded by Bates, Duff, Coronation, and Mary Streets; Improvement and Assistance to Shire (c) area bounded by Queen, Mit- Council chell. Mary Streets, and Great 19. Mr. KELLY asked the Minister for Eastern Highway? Water Supplies: (2) When is it anticipated each sec- (1) Has the Government a definite tion will be completed? plan to carry out an overall drain- (3) What is the approximate cost in age improvement scheme to serve each section? Merredin? (4) In view of the extreme urgency (2) If so, will the Government- of sewerage to this fast develop- (a) totally finance the necessary ig centre, would It not be possible works; to speed up the completion of the (b) find two-thirds of the neces- three sections? sary finance; Mr. WILD replied: (c) assist the Merredin Shire (1) Survey data is available to the Council on a £1 for £1. basis? department for the areas men- (3) If a definite plan has not already tioned and within the next few been developed, could he advise months design will be prepared what action the Government is and financial aspects considered. prepared to take? If these are satisfactory the work WILD replied: will be listed for consideration in the 1965-66 financial year. NO. (2) Completion date depends on the (2) Answered by (1). date of commencement of con- (3) Government policy is that town struction. stormwater drainage is a local authority responsibility. Follow- (3) (a) C8,000. Ing a ministerial visit on the 23rd (b) £6,000. July. 1983. arrangements were (c) £3,000. made for an investigation of the (4) No provision has been made in town drainage to be made by the 1964-65 loan programme for officers of the Public Works De- this work but the matter will be partment; and, as a result, a re- reviewed in January, 1965. port thereon was forwarded to that authority on the 24th October, 1963. FODDER PLANTS: GROWTH IN COMBINATIONS ROAD SYSTEM ADJACENT TO HOUSE Agricultural Department Experiments PARLIAMENT 18. Mr. KELLY asked the Minister for Current Plans Agriculture: 20. Mr. GRAHAM asked the Minister Has the Agriculture Department representing the Minister for Town carried out conclusive experiments Planning: to ascertain what yield advantages What are the current plans for are possible by growing certain the road system embraced by fodder plants together, such as in Harvest Terrace, Parliament combinations of clovers, ryes, Place, and Havelock Street be- linseed, paspalum, etc., and, if so. tween Hay Street and King's Park with what conclusions? Road? Mr. NALDER replied: Mr. LEWIS replied: The Department of Agriculture Is Closure of Harvest Terrace be- continually testing fodder crops tween Malcolm Street and Parlia- such as maize, sorghum, sudan ment Place was provided for in grass, and millets. Pasture species the Road Closure Act, 1961, sub- such as the subterranean clovers, ject to proclamation of the date rose clovers, strawberry clovers, at which closure was to take lucerne, rye grasses, brome effect. Such proclamation has grasses, anid cocksfoots are tested not, however, been made. [ASSEMBLY.)

Further traffic studies and advice (2) Is he further aware that the in- from traffic consultants retained stallation. of these lights was to by the Main Roads Department, receive high priority? with regard particularly to traffic (3) In view of the mentioned informa- which will be associated with the tion, is he in a position to indi- new government office develop- cate when the installation of these ment and to the design of access flashing lights will be effected? to and from the proposed Mitchell F'reeway led the Main Roads Mr. COURT replied: Commissioner to recommend that (1) Yes. it will be essential for effective (2) Yes. traffic circulation to retain Har- vest Terrace as a through road (3) Installation date is dependent on between Malcolm Street and Hay supply of material which is on Street. order. Efforts will be made to try to expedite. The current traffic plans as sug- gested by the Main Roads Depart- ment are therefore for Harvest HIGH SCHOOLS Terrace, Parliament Place, and Establishment in Albany Electorate Havelock Street to be two-way asked the Minister for roads. Havelock Street between 23. Mr. HALL King's Park Road and Parliament Education: Place is proposed to be widened (1) Has the Government made provi- on the east side and Parliament sion for the erection of a high Place widened on the south side. school in the Marbellup-Elleker Turning movement at the inter- catchmient area? section of Harvest Terrace and (2) What provision has been made in Malcolm Street should, it is sug- the Lower King-Bayonet Head gested, be limited to left-hand area for the establishing of a high turns into and out of Harvest school? Terrace. (3) Has any Provision been made in the little Grove area. Albany, for ELECTRICITY SUPPLIES TO establishing a high school in the FARMING PROPERTIES overall education planning? (4) Is there any proposal for the Details of Contributory System erection of a high school in the 21. Mr. H. MAY asked the Minister for Frenchmen's Bay area in the Electricity: overall education planning? (1) What are the conditions which (5) Has the Government a proposal to People, living in rural areas, are erect a high school to serve the required to comply with when Chester Pass area. Albany? seeking extensions of power Mr. LEWIS replied: to farming Properties under the contributory system operating in (1), (3), (4), and (5) No. the south-west of Western Austra- (2) None. lia? (2) Will he give the details of the LONG SERVICE LEAVE minimum extensions of Power lines Conditions Applying to Railway to farming properties? Emp~loyees Mr. NALDER replied: 24. Mr. BRADY asked the Minister for (1) People seeking extensions must Railways: apply to the commission and give (1) Are salaried staff and wages staff their full name, Postal address, long service leave based on dif- and lot or location number of the ferent methods: e.g., is leave Property on which electricity will period included in service period be used. from salaried staff but excluded (2) There is no minimum extension. from wages staff? (2) Why does wages staff have to work longer periods than salaried FLASHING LIGHTS staff for each term of long service Installation at Verna Street Railway leave to be cleared? Crossing, Gosnells (3) When were existing agreements 22. Mr. D. G. MAY asked the Minister made? for Railways: Mr. COURT replied: (1) Is he aware that approval was (1) Yes. given to the Provision of flashing (2) The condition under which the lights at the Verna Street railway period of long service leave is ex- crossing. Gosnells, last April? cluded in subsequent calculations [Wednesday, 11. November, 1964.1 272479*

has applied in respect of wages SINGLE TEACHERS staff since wages staff were granted long service leave in 1927, Number outside Metropolitan Area In this connection conditions are 27. Mr. DAVIES asked the Minister for common throughout government Education: departments. What is the total number of single teachers employed by the Long service leave conditions were Education Department outside the first granted to salaried staff metropolitan area? under provisions included in the Salaried Staff Regulations, 1905, Mr. LEWIS replied: and later by awards issued by the Approximately 1,100. Railways Classification Board, pursuant to Powers vested in the board by the Railways Classifica- MURDER OF JIELLIAN BREWER tion Board Act, 1920-1959. These Contents of Purse conditions have never stipulated 28. Mr. GRAHAM asked the Minister for that the period of long service Police: leave taken should be excluded in (1) Was a pure found in the flat of subsequent calculations. Jillian Brewer following her mur- (3) Salaried staff-OOS. der? Wages staff-1927. (2) If so, what were its precise con- tents in detail? 25. This question was Postponed. Statement by Eric Edgar Cooke PEDESTRIAN TRAFFIC (3) What was the statement of E. E. Cooke regarding the contents of Protection by Overways the purse? 26. Mr. BRADY asked the Minister for Mr. CRAIG replied: Transport: (1) No. (1) When will the Transport Depart- ment be in a position to state if (2) Answered by (1). overways will be used to protect (3) No statement was made to the civilians crossing roads? police by Eric Edgar Cooke in re- ference to a purse. (2) What is the reason for not trying In an affidavit to his solicitor, on out overways at present? page 13, Cooke states he found a zipper purse containing 4s. 7Id. in money and a cheque for about Cost ol Supervision of Crossings £6 with the name "J1.Brewer' t (3) What is the approximate cost of written on it;, all of which he put police supervision and traffic in- back in the purse. He then put spectors yearly on school and the purse and contents back where other crossings in the metropoli- he found it, either on a cupboard tan area? or draining section of the sink.

Cost of Bridge and Ramp QUESTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE (4) what would a steel bridge, 30 feet CAPITAL PUNISHMENT long, 5 feet wide, and 18 feet high cost with ramp for ingress and Hanging of a Commonwealth Prisoner egress to and from bridge? 1.Mr. HEAL asked the Deputy Premier: Mr. CRAIG replied: Is there any truth in the rumour that due to the terrific outcry (1) Provision of overways for pedes- from the centre of Darwin, the trians is at present under serious Commonwealth Government has consideration and investigation. made an approach to the State (2) The matters of siting, fencing and Government to carry out aLcertain user control are so important in hanging? respect of these structures that The SPEAKER (Mr. Hearrnan): I do extensive investigations are neces- not think I can allow that ques- sary before funds are committed. tion. It does not Come under the (3) This information is not available administration of the Deputy at present but will be supplied to Premier. It is a Federal matter. the honourable member at a later Mr. HEAL: If the Commonwealth date. Government has made an ap- (4) A structure as described would proach to the State Government, cost about £10,000 to construct in I amn entitled to ask a question in a 66-foot road reserve. relation to that. 2480 2480[ASSEMBLY.]

Mr. Graham: Of course he is! finish at 5 O'clock to enable hon- to bring their Mz. NALDER replied: ourable members There is no truth whatever in the wives to the dinner? rumour. Mr. NALDER replied: M r. Graham: It will not be long! I have already, on behalf of the Premier, notified honourable SENATE VACANCY members that the House will be sitting at 2.15 p.m. next Wednes- Filling day. The time at which it will 2. Mr. HAWKE asked the Deputy Pre- conclude will be announced later. mier: Mr. Hawke: It will depend on how Has the Government of Western we get on with the Local Govern- Australia received advice from ment Bill. the Governor-General that a vacancy exists in the Senate due to the death of Senator Vincent: DECENTRALISATION and, if so, what action does the Government propose to take to New South Wales Proposal: Application have the vacancy filled? to Western Australia Mr. NALDER replied: 5. Mr. CORNELL asked the Minister for industrial Development: No. In The Australian of yesterday appears this item- DEC ENTRA LISATION The N.S.W. Government Interpretation of Minister's Remarks would consider any reasonable 3. Mr. CORNEILL asked the Minister for proposition to promote the de- Industrial Development: centralisation of industry, the With reference to remarks he Premier, Mr. J. B. Renshaw, passed at Busselton on Friday said in Goulburn yesterday. last during which he coriticised Mr. Renshaw said that people and suggested they get £200,000, and possibly more. off the soap box in regard to was available from the Gov- decentralisation, am I to assume ernment for the construction that that was an all-sweeping of factories in country areas. statement and that those who This meant that industry advocate the situation of indus- need not find initially the tries in country areas are also to capital for factory construc- be categorised as soap-box ora- tion. tors: or did he only intend it to apply to those who criticise the The Premier said that the Government's policy of decen- Government was prepared to tralisation? build houses for key person- nel and to train operators for Mr. COURT replied: any new decentralised Indus- The answer is simply that it was try. not meant as sweeping criticism Would the Minister Pursue in- of those contemplating industry quiries with the Government of in the country, because that Is the New South Wales to get more Policy of the Government. information on that proposal with Mr. Hawke: That was not the ques- a view to investigating the feasi- tion. bility of its implementation in Mr. COURT: Yes it was! this State? Mr. Hawke: Of course it wasn't. Seeing I am advocating the estab- Mr. COURT: lishiment of a super works in Mer- Have a look at the redin, I hope I am not to be transcript. categorised as a tub-thumper.

SITTINGS OF THE HOUSE Mr. COURT replied. The policy of the New South Wednesday Starting and Finishing Wales Government in these mat- Times ters is well known to the State 4. Mr. BRADY asked the Deputy Pre- Government, and if honourable mier: members examine the Govern- ment's efforts in respect of decen- In view of the fact that honour- able members of both Houses have trallsation of industry, they will find it has done similar things- a very important dinner engage ment next Wednesday evening at- in fact, better-in our own State 6.30, would it be nassible for in the last few years. the House to meet at 2.15 p.m. and Mr. Hawke: Don't be so modest!I [Wednesday, 11 November, 1984.) 248148

MURDERS IN WESTERN AIJSTRALIA said, their movements are largely predict-- able, and they have favourite bays or Confessions by Eric Edgar Cooke beaches which they visit each season. G. Mr. HAWKE asked the Deputy Pre- Fishermen for generations have known of mier:. these places, and the industry has more or less flourished according to the type of- Yesterday, without notice, I asked the season. the Deputy Premier four questions in the one set of questions about Up till recent years no human activity; the confession made in the Pre- or, at the most, little human activity, dis- mantle Prison by Eric Edgar turbed the serenity of the industry. Of Cooke. The Deputy Premier course some people knew of the salmon partly answered the questions. I run and the favoured beaches, but these places were rather remote and the people now ask him- who did go to them were sensitive to the (1) Can he tell me which are the situation that nothing should be done to two murders to which Cooke frighten the fish away, and not infre- made his confession a few quently assisted fishermen to haul their moments before going to the nets. gallows? Recently, however, there has been a (2) If not, will the Deputy Pre- tendency for some people to use speed mier make inquiries and try boats or boats with outboard motors at to have the information made the very time when schools of salmon have available to the House tomor- been sighted approaching their favourite row? haunts. Also, some people in a rather irri- Mr. NALDER replied: tating and frustrating fashion have in cer- tain ways tried to prevent the fishermen (1) and (2) I will endeavour to have from engaging in their craft. Any actions the information made available to of this kind, or of the kind that will the Leader of the Opposition. frighten the fish away, of course, affect the livelihood of the fishermen and the FISHERIES ACT AMENDMENT future of the canning industry at Albany, BILL and they deleteriously affect decentralisa - tion and to an extent the State's economy Second Reading The prime feature of the legislation, MRt. ROSS HUTCHINSON (Cotteslose therefore, is to enable the Governor to -Minister for Fisheries) [5.7 P.m.]: I proclaim a defined area a fishing sone in move- charge of an inspector. In this zone for That the Bill be now read a second a specified period of approximiately two time. and a half months no person would be The purpose of this Bill is to protect allowed to prejudice the salmon run by salmon fishing beaches, and so enable such actions as I have mentioned unlesE salmon fishermen working at their age- such actions are approved by the inspec- old craft to be able to continue their in- tor. By this I mean that when there i! dustry. Most people know of the rather no salmon in the immediate vicinity, there wonderful natural phenomenon of the an- will be a relaxation of the restrictions- nual salmon and herring run. These fish according to the situation. are migratory in their habits, and in the Mr. Janmeson: You are giving the inspec- main their comings and going are predict- tor greater powers than you have yourself able. Mr. ROSS HUJTCHINSON: These are For a long number of years fishermen delegated powers. along Western Australia's south coast, and Mr. Jamieson: They are extremely well to a somewhat lesser extent on the deep delegated, too. south-west coast, have engaged in an im- portant industry-one in which they them- Mr. ROSS HUTCHINSON: The honour- selves earn a livelihood by helping to satis- able member will have an opportunity to fy a keen public demand for the fish and, study this matter and determine whethei in addition, keeping alive a valuable can- the action contemplated is warranted. 01 ning factory in the town of Albany. This not; and depending on his assessment of factory in itself has value in that it pro- the situation so he will either support the vides a valuable source of employment. In provision, or not. short, the salmon fishing and canning Mr. Jamnieson. This is a greater powei industry is a decentralised. industry which than the defence Powers. is not only of considerable importance to Albany and its people, but also materially Mr. ROSS HUTCHINSON: I have just assists in helping to balance the State's tried to describe the position. The hon- economy. The salmon run takes place ourable member can determine his course from approximately mid-February to the of action according to how he considere end of April each year. and at various this Provision fits the circumstances, Thai beaches fishermen keep watch for the is his privilege, and I will be Interested schools of salmon to appear. As I have to hear what he has to say about It. 2482 [ASSEMBLY.]

No great hardship should be caused to honourable member for Halcatta then sub- tourists, as comparatively few spots will mitted an amendment to delete completely be proclaimed fishing zones, and then only that section of the Act-as no doubt he In the interest of the fishing industry and recalls- its continuation at such places as Cheyne Mr. Graham: My word! Beach, or Hassell's Beach as it is sometimes called, and possibly Eagle Bay between Mr. CRAIG: -it being claimed that it Busselton and Cape Naturaliste. wvas often inconvenient for People to pre- sent the license within the required period I point out for the information of the of three days. House that earlier this Year a widely rep- resentative committee was formed to dis- At the time I expressed opposition to cuss the matter of protecting salmon the proposed deletion of this section of beaches and also, although it has no bear- the Traffic Act because of the difficulties ing here, certain other matters concern- that would arise if the police or traffic in- spectors did not have the right to demand ing townsites, but those matters have no the production of the license by the driver bearing on the Bill. This committee comn- wvhen requested to do so. In the inter- prised- vening period, the views expressed have (1) Representatives of all local gov- been shown to be well-based and, as a re- erning authorities whose districts sult, the Traffic Branch has now become touched on the south coast as far responsible for satisfying inquiries made east as Doubtful Bay (east of not only in the metropolitan area but also Bremer Bay); from all country shires. (2) a representative of the local fish- We have something like 300,000-odd ermen; motor drivers' licenses in existence. It has (3) a representative of the canning become abundantly clear that where some industry: 125 authorities are enforcing the provi- sions of the Act and regulations, with (4) representatives of the Fisheries. only one of them having a record of Lands, and Town Planning De - drivers' licenses, a chaotic state of affairs partments; and must result whilst the other 124 have no (5) a representative of the Govern- means of knowing whether or not a ment Tourist Authority. person- This committee, in brief, recommended (a) is the bolder of a current driver's that legislation be introduced to protect license; the salmon fishing beaches during the vital (b) is the holder of a license appro- salmon run period, and it is largely be- priate to the vehicle he is then cause of this recommendation, and because driving; the department felt there was a necessity to introduce this proclamation of fishing (c) if the holder of a license holds it zones that the Bill is before the House at on probation; the moment. (d) if over '75 years of age, has been re-ex amined as required by the Mr. Norton: Does it include beaches Act; and where whiting are netted? (e) is the holder of a probationary Mr. ROSS HUTCHINSON: No. license. Mr. Norton: It just says "any beaches". Apart from any increase in the number of Mr. ROSS HTJTCHINSON: The beaches vehicles in use, this situation will be ag- will be proclaimed. They are salmon fish- gravated by the growing number of licenses to be issued on probation, and by ing beaches. persons reaching the over '75 years of age Debate adjourned, on motion by Mr. group. Hall. With the Act as it now is, practically every shire in the State has been caused TRAFFIC ACT AMENDMENT HILL inconvenience and the Police Traffic Second Reading Branch has had a considerable burden of work placed on it and has requested that MR. CRAIG (Toodyay-Minister for this provision be restored to the Traffic Police) [5.15 pm.]; I move- Act. Many of the country shires and the That the Hill be now read a second Local Government Association have made time. similar approaches. I might say, too, Honourable members will no doubt recall that this work now occupies an extra staff that in the last parliamentary session. of three, full-time, to supply the informa- whilst a Bill to amend the Traffic Act wvas tion sought by the country shires and before the House it included an amend- local police officers. ment to shorten the period from three to In the proposed amendment it is not two days by which a motor vehicle driver suggested that the license be produced was required to produce his license, if within a period of two or three days, If not asked to do so by a Police officer or traffic in the possession of the driver at the time, inspector. This amendment was to con- but rather seeks to fulfil this requirement form with the National Traffic Code but it within a reasonable time. In other words, was not agreed to by the House. The it seeks to restore the authority to the [Wednesday, 11 November1 1964.1 2483* police or to a traffic inspector to request There are three Bihls which are completey- the driver to produce his license when interrelated; namely, the ]Interstate Main- called upon to do so. By this means it tenance Recovery Act Amendment Bill, is felt than no-one will be inconvenienced the Married Persons (Summary Relief) by the request, and country shires and Act Amendment Bill, and the Justices Act the Police Traffic Branch will then be en- Amendment Bill. Normally a Bill to abled to secure this necessary information amend the Interstate Maintenance Re- with the minimum amount of trouble and covery Act, 1959-62, would be handled by inconvenience. the Minister representing the Minister for' The Bill also seeks to tidy up an Local Government; but in view of the' anomaly created by legislation passed in fact that these Bills are so closely inter- the last session of Parliament. During related it has been thought Preferable to that session the Motor Vehicle (Third have the three of them handled by the Party ]Insurance) Act was amended to one Minister; namely, the Minister rep- restrict the field of liability upon the resenting the Minister for Justice. vehicle insurance trust. This was This Bill-the Married Persons (Sum- achieved by amending the definition of mary Relief) Act Amendment Bill-con- "motor vehicle" which has had the effect tains some important amendments to the of excluding from its ambit a wide range Married Persons (Summary Relief) Act of vehicles which previously were sub- which have been sought by the mnagis- jected to third party insurance, particu- trates of the Married Persons Relief Court. larly road-making and earth-moving The Minister for Justice had hoped to vehicles and street-cleaning vehicles used introduce to Parliament this session a BiDl by local authorities. to repeal and re-enact the parent Act as Secondly, the traffic regulations were a consequence of investigations which amended for the issue of permits subject have been going on for some considerable to the production of insurance policies time past, and which are now being indemnifying the owners in an amount examined by the Law Reform Committee of not less than £100,000 against liability of the Law Society. The society con- at common law in respect of the move- siders, however, at this stage, that the ment or use of such an "off-road vehicle" Major changes should be allowed to stand on a road. Subsequently the validity of over as it is not believed to be practicable the insurance Policy required by traffic to incorporate the numerous amendments regulation 10B, which requires that the comprising substantial provisions without commissioner must be "satisfied the owner the Act becoming virtualy unintelligible. of the off-road vehicle is indemnified" As there are still questions of law arising was challenged. In this claim it was out of the changes, which it has not yet pointed out that the rights of redress of been found practicable to resolve, it has any person who might be injured by this been decided to proceed with this limited type of vehicle were considerably less thakn measure covering the most urgent require- similar rights under the Motor Vehicle ments of the magistrates to enable them (Third Party ]Insurance) Act. to better administer relief where required. Following a Crown Law examination of There is one important amendment in the matter it was agreed that an amend- addition, however, which is included in ment was necessary and it was felt that, this Hill and this refers to orders for the if the traffic authorities issued either full maintenance of dependent children. At licenses or limited licenses to all vehicles, Present, orders remain in force until a the problems of both the traffic authori- child is of the full age of 21 Years, unless ties and the trust would be solved. To do an application is made for the order to be this the draftsman has made an amend- discharged on the ground that the child ment to enable the Governor to make is no longer a dependant. This has given regulations Prescribing classes of vehicle rise to orders being enforced In respect of licenses and to designate the kinds of children who have long ceased to be vehicles to which any class of license is to dependants, and this has necessitated de- apply. The Purpose of doing this by cisions of doubtful equity. regulation is to avoid the necessity of Apart from South Australia. the other amending legislation every time a new States of the Commonwealth, and New type of vehicle comes on to the market, Zealand, provide that orders for the main- a move that would be necessary if the tenance of dependent children are effec- types were written into the Bill. tive only until the child attains the age of flebate adjourned, on motion by Mr. 16 years. After that age is reached the Graham. order needs to be extended or renewed for any further period of dependency. It is now proposed to fallow the provisions MARRIED PERSONS (SUMMARY of the other States by requiring the order RELIEF) ACT AMENDMENT BILL to be extended where the child remains a Second Reading dependent after reaching the age of 16 years. Though, on first thoughts, it might MR. COURT (Nedlands-Minister for be considered that such change could industrial Development) [5.24 pm.]: I bring about some hardship, this is not move- so, for dependency can easily be proved That the Bill be now read a second where the child continues at school, is time. undergoing training, or is an invalid. 2484 2481[ASSEMBLY.]I

The requirement for applications for period than the three months at present extension of maintenance to be made allowed, thus denying relief to the other beyond 16 years will, in most cases, be of party beyond that period. great practical advantage to the wife in- There is also provision for an interim asmuch as it will bring about a review order to lapse on the complaint being dis- of the situation of the sufficiency of the missed or withdrawn, and where proceed- order. In practice it has been found that ings have been delayed for orders to be many women are inclined to leave orders back-dated. The court should be able to undisturbed although they have become suspend the operation of an order made totally inadequate. on a warrant under section 26, because it The new procedure will also eliminate would be anomalous to give relief to a the situations where the women with person who has no means but still im- orders. who have taken no action prison him for failure to make payments for years. are required to enforce them under a suspended warrant. It is pro- before they can be considered for a Pen- posed to permit the court without limita- .sion. As an example of the present posi- tion to suspend the operation of an order tion, it was incumbent upon a wife, in retrospectively for any period necessary. the case of an order in respect of a This applies in particular where the person married daughter of 18 years of age, to against whom it was have action taken for the arrest of the made has been un- girl's father. When the defendant was employed for a long Period and there has arrested the warrant could only be satis- been a delay in making the application. fled by his application to have the order Hardship has been caused by the court discharged on the grounds that the child not being able to back-date the variation wvas no longer dependant. This incurred of an order to the happening of the event costs to both parties, inconvenience, and which gave rise to the variation. This ap- the indignity of being arrested. There plies in the case of a change in the means -have been other cases of warrants being or of the dependency of any of the parties necessary in respect of children of ages or of any child of the family. There is -up to 26, and this purely as a means of provision also for any one or more of the establishing that the order should be dis- provisions of an order to be discharged charged. The amendment will also be of without affecting the other provisions and advantage where distance and other such for such discharge to be dated back to difficulties preclude the parties making the happening of the event which gave rise application to the court. to the discharge. A further advantage will be in the mat- Section 19 of the Act would appear to ter of interstate enforcement of our orders, make a child a ward of the State and in ns, in many cases, collectors refuse to act those circumstances the parties would be on its appearing that the child is aged 16 precluded from applying to the court for and the order has not been extended. As a custody to be reconsidered on changed cir- consequence of the amendment, orders cwrnstances as the court would have no shall cease to have effect on a child further jurisdiction in the matter. An attaining the age of 16 and, when the amendment accordingly makes it clear court is satisfied that a child on attaining that custody only is to be given to the that age is still a dependant, and makes an order, the court will be required to Child Welfare Department. -specify in the order the date or the hap- Though a defaulting party may have pening of any event on wvhich the pro- known assets within the State, execution vision ceases to have effect. may not be taken against these assets if It will be appreciated, therefore, that the party is outside the State or his where- no serious change will occur by reducing abouts is unknown. An appropriate the age from 18 years to 16 years as there amendment tidies up this provision to give is power elsewhere in the Bill to extend access to all assets irrespective of where the operation of the order where the the defaulter resides. dependency continues after the child has The person who causes the most trouble turnied 16 years of age. is the persistently wilful defaulter who Turning now to other amendments never makes a voluntary payment. This which will facilitate the practical applica- type pays regularly but only on the issue 'tion of the laws in respect of relief, at of a warrant of enforcement. The added present a wife is required to go to the burden placed mainly on the complainant FPolice Court under the Justices Act if an but also on the court is quite unwarranted; interim order is required for her protec- and, on the passing of this measure, the tion. This is now being rectified. Section offender may be brought to court to answer 11 is being amended to make It clear that a charge of contempt of court. an application can be made on the original There must be power for a person complaint for a person to be bound over. against whom an enforcement warrant has Another amendment will permit the exten- been issued to be able to come back to sion of the operation of interim orders. court under extreme or unusual circum- This will have effect particularly in respect stances, which demand relief against of one Party being overseas where it is anomalous situations which arise, and this :Possible to delay the hearing for a greater Hill makes the requisite provision. [Wednesday, 11 November, 1984.1 2485

Som~e courts have been allowing con- JUSTICES ACT AMENDMENT tinual applications for progressive suspen- BILL (No. Z) sion of warrants, thus reducing the pro- cedure to a farce, so an amendment is Second Reading included to make it clear that only one MR. COURT (Nedlands--Minister for application for suspension of a warrant Industrial Development) [5.39 p.m.]: I can be made after it is executed. move- A subsection is added to section 26 to That the Bill be now read a second give the court power to reissue a warrant time. where the defaulting party has failed to This brief amendment is complementary comply with any conditions under which to the main Bill amending the Married its operation was suspended. Hardship Persons (Summary Relief) Act and Its ob- sometimes occurs where the complainant ject is to bring the enforcement Procedures is without means, and unable to meet the under the Justices Act into line with those fees which would enable court action to of the Married Persons (Summary Relief) be taken. It is therefore proposed that Act. original actions and warrants be issued Under the parent Act granting relief, it in Jorna vauvleris, or waiver of fees com- was overlooked that provision should have pletely, under other sections where hard- been made for a warrant to be reissued ship would be caused. when the defaulter failed to eonmply with the order. In order that the position may The amendments sought to be intro- now be rectified, it Is necessary to amend duced by the Bill give rise to the require- the Justices Act to empower the court by ment as a temporary measure to amend endorsement of a warrant to direct that two other Acts. The first of these is the it be put into operation when a person Interstate Maintenance Recovery Act. 1959, has failed or ceased to comply with any and the second is the Justices Act, 1902. direction or condition imposed by the It is believed that on the passing of this court. The appropriate amendment is to measure the better administration of the section 155D of the Justices Act wherein Act will be greatly facilitated as it provides it is Proposed to insert a new subsection more effective means of dealing with the (4) which Provides the necessary authority. problems which come before the court. This is the third of the three Bills which have to be considered in a related manner. Debate adjourned, on motion by Mr. Evans. Debate adjourned, on motion by Mr. Evans. INTERSTATE MAINTENANCE RECOVERY ACT AMENDMENT STATUTE LAW REVISION BILL BILL Second Reading Second Reading Debate resumed, from the 10th Novemn- ber, on the following motion by Mr. Court MRt. COURT (Nedlands--Minister for (Minister for Industrial Development): Industrial Development) 15.37 p.m.]: I move- That the Bill be now read a second time. That the Bill be now read a second time. MR,. EVANS (Kcalgoorlie) [5.40 P.m.): This Bill Is consequential to the Bill al- This Bill with a quite unpretentious title ready introduced to amend the Married contains the genesis of a plan that has Persons (Summary Relief) Act, and its been designed to bring the Statute law purpose is to ensure that all moneys paid of Western Australia into a more con- under an order must be paid in the first venient, up-to-date, and readily accessible instance to the court, so that the account- form. This is a worthy ideal. it is also ing system can be properly maintained as quite necessary. These qualities can be regards the payment of arrears and cur- best illustrated by a very thought- rent maintenance. Provoking quotation I have found in the foreword to the reprint of a Tasmanian At the present time, the court, when Statute written under the hand of the making orders for the suspension of a Attorney-General of the Tasmanian Gov- warrant with money to be paid to some- ernment (The Honourable Roy Pagan, one out of court, has no record of pay- MIL.A., and which reads as follows:- ments made as they are made in the first instance to the collector in the Child Wel- Sir Cecil Carr has said that if Eng- fare Department. Payments will in future lish law will not allow its to Plead be made into the court where the neces- ignorance of its contents the State sary accounting procedure will be carried owes a duty to its citizens to supply out prior to its being forwarded to the them with the means of knowledge. collector. With that statement there can be no disagreement. One way In which the Debate adjourned, on motion by Mr. State can supply the means of know- Evans. ledge is by Publishing with reasonable 2486 2486[ASSEMBLY.]

regularity the Statute law in a con- This Bill has already received the venient and readily accessible form, approval of another House and it only with adequate indices and tables to needs to continue its passage through this facilitate reference to it. House to complete its legislative course, The foreword then continues and says that when these inoperative Acts and Ordin- with that object in view the publication ances will receive the guillotine. of this work has been undertaken. I do not wish to delay such execution; therefore I1will conclude by indicating my The Statute law of Western Australia imprimatur and I support the second consists of Acts and Ordinances which reading of this Bill. have been passed since the year 1832 to the present time. As has been pointed cut by the Minister, in order to prepare MR. GUTHRIE (Subiaco) [5.47 p.m.]: for the publication of such a vast array It is not my wish to delay the House at of Statutes, so that we can present them all on this matter. The main purpose of in a more manageable form, the Legisla- the measure is, I understand, a first step ture ;s being asked, in respect of this piece in removing from the Statute book certain of legislation, to embark upon a pro- Statutes that are largely deadwood. gramme with vision and purpose. There are, as has been explained by the Minister, five different types of Statutes. This Bill thus seeks legislative authority for the express removal from the Statute Among the fifth type I was rather in- book of many enactments which, for terested to find there are two Statutes various reasons, are no longer effective which wvere passd but never received the and which should, therefore, be excluded Royal Assent: and, as a consequence, we from future reprints. In all, the Bill lisIts are declaring they were never deemed to 384 such enactments which have been have been passed. The thing that in- passed by the Western Australian Legisla- terested me most in this matter was the ture between 1832 and as late as 1900. explanatory memorandum. I think the Minister and his officers are to be com- Honourable members will appreciate mended for their work in producing this only too well the distinction between memorandum; and it is a great pity a Statute law revision and law reform. The lot of other Hills are also not accom- process of Statute law revision is not panied by similar information. In other directed towards making any substantial Places this is done. change in the law; and of course we know This memorandum is a very interesting that when changes in substance are made historical review of Western Australia. If in the law it is the very function of law one cares to study the Statutes that are reform. referred to from the start to the finish, This Bill, then, is not directed towards one will find that in 1835 the total revenue making any alteration in the substance in this State was only £4,565, 14s. 5d., of the law. The present state of nour1 rising to something like £5,000,000 in the Statute book, encumbered with much ob- last one that I noticed, although I do not solete and exhausted legislation, certainly say it is the last one in this schedule. requires revision; and I might add that There are also quite a number of things cur present season, to my way of thinking, that are of historical significance. One makes it propitious for us to embark upon is the fact that people could only be some very appropriate spring cleaning. naturalised by private Act of Parliament; and one sees some very famous Western In essence, the Bill seeks to repeal cer- Australian names in the list of people tain Acts and Ordinances which are comn- who were naturalised. pletely inoperative, including those which show no glimmer of life, and many in re- Mr. Evans: There is at least one un- spect of which the death certificates have usual name there, too. been delayed. Mr. GUTHRIE: I was surprised that If I may be allowed a few words of some were not of British nationality. I levity, may I hazard a guess that there think some of them may have been are many in the community who would American, but I do not know. There is contend we should not only repeal these also a rather interesting piece of informa- Statutes we have in mind, but should tion concerning the wife of a former Gov- repeal them all and start again in retro- ernor who, I understand, was living In spect and legislate for only those Statutes great penury; and after many years of that have proved their desirability and battling, this Parliament. in its generosity, necessity. passed legislation providing for an annuity of £150. It is quite a story as to how Be that as it may, I would like to re- long it took the people of Western Aus- iterate what the Minister had to say and tralia to make UP their minds that they suggest that honourable members might would give this noble lady £150 per annum. pay some attention to the memorandum supplied with this Bill, because in it they I commend this memorandum to all will note an enlightening account of the honourable members; and suggest that It social, financial, and historical develop- is worth keeping as it is an Interesting ment of Western Australia. reference for historical purposes. [Wednesday, 11 November. 1964.] 248748

MR. COURT (Nedlands-Minister for coalition Government, continued the com- Industrial Development) (5.50 pim.]: I mittee in legal operation and continued to thank the two honourable members who give effect in Executive Council to such re- have spoken for their support of this commendations as the committee put for- legislation. There is no need for me to ward from time to time even though there dwell further on it as those two honour- is a discretion in the law in relation to the able members have adequately covered the issue or otherwise of a proclamation to give objectives of the Bill and of the Minister legal effect to the recommendations of the concerned who sponsored it in another committee. In other words, no govern- place. ment could legally escape the responsibility Question put and passed. of maintaining the committee in opera- Bill read a second time. tion, even though a government might, if it were daring enough, refuse to have a proclamation issued to give legal effect to In Committee, etc. the recommendations which the committee Bill passed through Committee without might bring forward from time to time. debate, reported without amendment, and the report adopted. I think it is perfectly safe to say that no government, from the end of 1938 to Third Reading the beginning of May in 1959, refused to Bill read a third time, on motion by give legal effect to any recommendations M$1r.Court (Minister for Industrial De- which were put forward by the committee. velopment), and passed. In May of 1959, the then term of the com- mittee was due to expire under the law: and it was necessary for the Government WHEAT PRODUCT (PRICES to take action, before the term of appoint- FIXATION) ACT AMENDMENT ment expired, to reappoint the personnel of the committee as it then existed, or to BILL make such changes in the committee's per- Second Reading sonnel as might have been found neces- Debate resumed, from the 10th Novem- sary or expedient. By no stretch of imagi- ber, on the following motion by Mr. Wild nation could the Government legally re- fuse to have a committee appointed and (Minister for Labour): in operation. That the BUi be now read a second timne. On the 16th April, 1959, the Secretary for Labour (Mr. C. Reeve) signed a minute MR. HAWKE (Northam-Leader of the to the then Minister for Labour, and the Opposition) [5.53 P.M.): The Bill now be- minute reads- fore us proposes to amend the Wheat Pro- A direction is requested as to ducts (Prices Fixation) Act. The Act was whether or not it is the intention of approved by both Houses of the Parlia- the Government to reappoint Messrs. ment in the year 1938 and was assented Mathea. and Ulrich and Dr. Sutton as to on the 1st December In that year. members of the Wheat Products Prices The purposes of the Act were, briefly, to Committee. provide for the fixation of prices with re- Their present appointment lapses on gard to flour and any other product which the 9th Proximo. was manufactured from wheat. In addi- tion to flour, it included bran, Pollard, The Minister for Labour, who at that time bread, and so on. The law laid it down was Mr. Perkins, unfortunately since de- that there shall be a committee which was ceased, put up quite a substantial Cabinet to be known as the Wheat Products Prices minute addressed to the Hon. Premier in Committee. It was also laid down that the Cabinet. The last paragraph of this minute committee should consist of a chairman reads- and two other members to be appointed The practice has been to reappoint by the Governor; and, further, that the each year for a further Period of 12 chairman and members of the committee (twelve) months and the Committee should hold office for such terms as were has consisted of Messrs. Mathes, fixed by the instruments of their appoint- Ulrich and Dr. Sutton. The present ments. appointment of the Committee lapsed on the 9th May, and I would like a It is clear from a study of section 6 of *decision as to whether any reappoint- the Act that there was a legal obligation ment is desired. upon any government to set up this com- mittee, to appoi nt one of the three memn- obviously this thing was talked about bers as chairman, with all of the three in Cabinet. No decision was made upon members being appointed by the Governor- the point, but the Minister for Labour was in-Council. Every State government from asked to report back to Cabinet following the end of 1938 to May of this year car- some further inquiries which Cabinet told ried out the inescapable legal obligations him to carry out, although there is no of this law. In other words, every gov- statement on the file of what those in- ernment, including the McLarty-Watts quiries were to be, In actual fact. 2488 2488ASS8EMLY.J

Then the Bread Manufacturers Indus- That is the end of the CabineL minute. trial Union of Employers wrote to the It is clear from the Minister's minute to Minister and, in effect, said, "We want the Cabinet that he had some talkE with the existing proclamation in relation to maxi- representatives of the employers in the mumn bread prices, which was issued by industry, and those employers or their re- the previous Government, revoked." on presentatives had given an undertaking the 3rd June, 1959, the Secretary for that the employers in the industry would Labour sent a minute to the Chief In- maintain the price of bread in accord- Spector of Factories. By this time the ance with the price-fixing formula which Secretary for Labour was getting very had been used hitherto by the committee worried because the term of appointment when it operated under the law; and so a of members of the committee had expired proclamation was issued by Hisq Excel- and no new appointments had been made. lency's command on the 14th day of Oc- In part of this minute he stated- tober, 1959, revoking the proclamation which had been issued by the previous I do not want us to be accused of Government on the recommendation of letting this Board lapse if it is the the committee, and which proclamation ultimate desire of the Government to set down the maximum prices which re-appoint it. could be charged for bread In various Later, on the 5th June, 1959, the Bread parts of Western Australia. Manufacturers Industrial Union of Em- I am not suggesting the action in revok- ployers wrote to the then Minister for ing the previous proclamation was illegal, Labour requesting the revocation of the because under the provisions of the Act proclamation to which I have already re- the Governor-In-Council has power to ferred. The Solicitor-General was then take such action, He would only take asked for legal advice as to whether it was such action, of course, on advice from the necessary to operate this law. The Sobl- Government of the day; and it is tor-General, Mr. Good, in a long minute clear the Government of the day to the 'Under-Secretary for Law dated the had the necessary decision made and the 3rd August, 1959, set out his views. I necessary papers prepared and put before do not propose to read the whole of this the Governor for his signature to revoke minute, but to refer to the essence of it the then existing proclamation. dealing with the question whether there was still a legal obligation on the Gov- As Leader of the Opposition, I tried on ernment to operate the law. I quote as several occasions to get the Government follows:- to do the legal and the right thing in this matter. I tried in each of the years from in my opinion the operative provi- 1959 onwards. On at least one occasion sions of the Act are "clear and un- in each of those years I tried to persuade equivocal" without the preamble and the Government to carry out its legal therefore the preamble can have no duties in regard to this piece of legisla- effect upon those operative provisions. tion, but the success achieved until now Finally,- was exactly nil, the Government taking For the above reasons, in my opinion, the very foolish stand-the very stubborn the Wheat Products (Prices Fixation) stand-that It was not necessary for the Act is still in full force and effect. Government to issue any proclamation. Mr. Tonkin: When was that? That was not the issue at all. The issue was as to whether the Government, Mr. HAWKE: That was the 3rd Aug- under the provisions of the law, had a legal ust, 1959. This was after the Government responsibility upon it to appoint the com- had allowed the committee to lapse and mittee; and there could not be any pos- had, in fact, made it impossible for the sible doubt about the legal responsibility provisions of the law to be operated in which was upon the Government in that any respect: because, as I pointed out regard. earlier, the operations of the Act depended I do not want to indicate the several primarily and basically upon the inquiries attempts I made over the last few years which the committee would carry out, and to get the Government to do the right subsequently, of course, upon such recom- thing in this matter. I will start on and as mendations as it would make, and finally from Tuesday, the 27th August, 1963. On upon such action as the Governor-in- that occasion, by way of notice, I asked Council would take regarding the issue questions of the Premier. of a proclamation to give legal effect to the recommendations. I would like to break in here to say that I am sure all honourable members On the 31st August, 1959, Cabinet made are extremely sorry the Premier is a decision following consideration of a not enjoying goad health at this particular further minute of the Minister for Labour. time, and I am sure we all hope The Cabinet's decision reads as followvs:- he will soon recover his normal Cabinet agrees with the with- health and strength and be on the move drawal of the Proclamation, on the again. undertaking given to the Minister for My questions sought Information from Labour by the industry that the same the Government as to its reason for con- price fixing formula will be used. tinuing to, refuse to operate the provisions LWednesday, 11 November, 1964.] 2489 of the law. I also sought information as I should be pleased to have the to whether the Government proposed to views of your Government in this continue to refuse to carry out its legal matter. obligations in this matter. I posed the Kind regards, question whether the Government, if it Yours faithfully, was not going to enforce the law, would in that situation do the right and proper Leader of the Opposition. thing and introduce legislation into Parlia- That, as I have said, was on the 4th ment to repeal the law. March this year. I had not heard a word by the 15th April, and so a reminder was The questions were answered by the sent to the Premier. One would have Deputy Premier on behalf of the Premier thought an early reply would come back who, for some reason, was not present on to my letter. The issue was clear-cut. that date. The answer of the Deputy The Government had given consideration Premier-and it was, of course, made on to it on several occasions previously. How- behalf of the Premier and on behalf of the ever, we had to send a reminder on the Government-was as follows:- 15th April. On the 11th May the Premier sent me the following letter:- After full investigation in 1959 the Government decided that there was Dear Mr. Hawke, no need to reconstitute the committee I refer to your letter of 4th March or retain the price-fixing proclama- regarding the Wheat Products (Prices tion. Fixation) Act. Parliament was advised of this on The views of the Government were the 28th October, 1959, when the file set out in the answer to a Question was tabled. which you asked in the Legislative Assembly on 27th August last. It was felt unrealistic to retain price I reiterate that the Act permits, but control on bread when most other does not require, the making of a commodities are not so controlled proclamation to fix prices. and in any case only the standard loaf was controlled at the time. I took this matter to Cabinet and The Act permits but does not require it was decided that no action would the making of proclamations to fix be taken to repeal the Act this session. prices. Yours sincerely, The breadmaking industry also agreed David Brand. to give prior advice of impending in- Premier. creases and to continue the methods used by the committee for determin- Sitting suspended from 6.15 to 7.30 p.m. ing the price. Mr. HAWKE: Before tea, I had made That was not good enough from my point reference to the reply sent to me by the of view. That was dodging the real issue Premier on the 11th May of this year in altogether. That was continuing the which he stated the Act permits, but does policy of the Government of deliberately not require, the making of a proclamation refusing to operate the law, despite the to fix prices, and in which he also said- fact there was a compulsory provision in I took this matter to Cabinet and it the law for the appointment of the com- was decided no action would be taken mittee. to repeal the Act this session. On the 4th March this year, I wrote to It was obvious from the consistent atti- the Premier in the following manner:- tude which the Government was following Dear Mr. Brand, in this matter that members of the Government had no intention of carrying Wheat Products (Prices Fixation) out the law. They were dodging the real Act. issue by talking about the Act providing As you know. I have protested in that the issuance of a proclamation was Parliament on behalf of members of discretionary. They were avoiding com- the Labor Party regarding the non- pletely any reference to the compulsory operation by your Government of this duties imposed upon the Government in law. relation to the appointment of a commit- There is no justification for its non- tee, the laying down of a term, the provi- operation and it is the view of myself sion relating to the number to serve on the and my colleagues that the Govern- committee, and the other compulsory pro- ment has no legal or other right for visien which is in the law. refusing to operate the law. Obviously the stage had been reached Obviously the members of your where further appeals to the Government Government are opposed in principle were just a waste of time, so it was de- to the law itself, in which event the cided by my colleagues and myself that proper course for the Government to I should take this matter up with His Ex- follow would be to introduce a Bill to cellency the Governor (Sir Douglas Ken- repeal the legislation. drew). I did tils lin writing on the 6th 2490 2490[ASSEMBLY.]

October, this year, and I think it is appro- I think it right and fair to claim priate and justifiable in the circumstances no government would advise any Gov- to read the letter in full- ernor in Executive Council to refuse to issue a proclamation to fix prices Your Excellency, once the committee had made an ap- Continuing Refusal by the Govern- propriate recommendation. ment to Operate the Wheat Pro- So it is clear to us the Government ducts (Prices Fixation) Act, No. is avoiding its obvious legal obligation 17 of 1938. and moral duty by continuing to refuse On behalf of the members of Her to operate this law, which requires Majesty's Opposition in the Parlia- that a committee shall be appointed ment of Western Australia. I am writ- and shall make recommendations ing this letter to bring to your notice when thought necessary for the fixa- the continuing refusal of the Govern- tion of prices for wheat products. ment of the State to operate this law. By refusing to operate the law, a You will know there is a very strict refusal which is made even worse by legal, as well as moral obligation on the rejection of claims by Her a government to operate the laws Majesty's Opposition for it to be op- which have been passed by Parlia- erated, the Government is placing Her ment, Majesty the Queen, and you as her of- ficial representative in Western Aus- There is no justification whatever tralia, in a false and most unfair for a government to refuse to operate situation. a law simply because some members My deputy leader, Mr. Tonkin, would of the government might dislike the be pleased to join with me in waiting law, or because some special vested upon you at your earliest convenience interests outside the government, and to discuss this matter should you wish outside parliament, do not want the it, following the completion by you law to be operated. of such inquiries as you consider In this instance members of the necessary. Present Government decided in 1959 With kind regards, not to operate the law, by adopting Yours sincerely, the subterfuge of not reappointing the (Sgd.) Leader of the committee when the term of appoint- Opposition. ment of its then members expired. On the 14th October Lieutenant-Colonel I attach a copy of questions asked Burt, Official Secretary to the Governor, by me in Parliament on Tuesday, 27th acknowledged receipt of the letter. Ap- August, 1983, and Of the answers then parently His Excellency then had some given by the Deputy Premier on be- words to say to somebody In a high place half of the Premier. Also attached is in the Government, because on the 22nj1 a copy of a letter sent by me in this matter to the Premier on 4th March. October, 1984. the Governor wrote to me 1964, and a copy of his reply dated as follows:- 11th May, 1964. Dear Mr. Hawke, I refer to your letter of the 6th The Premier's statement "that the October, with enclosures, regarding Act permits, but does not require, the making or a proclamation to fix the Wheat Products (Prices Fixation) prices" is a rather poor attempt to Act No. 17 of 1938. dodge the real issue, which is-should I am advised by the Hon. Premier the Government operate the law which that it is the intention of the Govern- was passed by Parliament and has ment to introduce legislation dealing never been repealed? with this matter during the present session of Parliament. Even though the law gives the Gov- ernor in Executive Council discretion Yours truly, regarding the actual issue or non-issue (Sgd.) Douglas IKendrew. of a proclamation to fix prices for Governor. bread or other wheat products, it gives no discretion whatever regard- It is fair to say. I think-and I do ing the setting up of the committee not want to discuss the Governor in this which is covered in section 6 of the situation much further-that His Excel- Act. Subsection 1 of that section lency would have obtained advice from reads: "For the Purposes of this Act some reliable source as to the legal re- there shall be a committee to be sponsibilities and duties in this matter. known as the 'Wheat Products Prices Doubtless he realised it was totally wrong Committee'% for a Government to take an action which would place him, as the official representa- Sub-section 2 states: "The commit- tive in the State of Her Majesty the tee shall consist of a chairman and Queen, in a wrong position;, and I have two other members, all appointed by no doubt he would have received advice the Governor". which would indicate that the Provisions [Wednesday, 11 November, 1964.) 2491 of this law, which lays down that a corn- it was in operation for making alterations mittee shall be appointed, and that it in the price of bread from the time the shall consist of a certain number of mem- Government issued a proclamation to re- bers who shall be appointed for a certain voke the other proclamation under which term should be observed; and, as a result the maximum price of bread had been of receiving advice of that kind and of fixed. subsequently having a discussion with the or pos- Some later papers on this matter, on a Premier, or the Deputy Premier, Factories and Shops Department file No. sibly-and only possibly-with the Minis- 728/64 contained at least one very im- ter for Works, who is the appropriate portant feature. I refer to the last para- Minister, he was soon assured that action graph of a minute dated the 17th March would be taken to deal with the situation this year and written by the Acting Chief which this Government created some 54, inspector of Factories, and addressed by years ago and which It had stubbornly That continued to carry on until the time we him to the Secretary for Labour. wrote to His Excellency, who subsequently last paragraph reads- made inquiries of the Ministry as to what It should be remembered the price the Government proposed to do about the of bread was adjusted recently by the situation. Master Bakers, mainly by the pressure It will be clear that our attitude all of the realisation that the Wheat through has been that this law should be Products Fixation Act could be re- operated by the Government; or if the invoked; and it is thought that this law in principle was opposed to the beliefs could be kept in mind when consider- and policy of the Government, then the ing the desirability of repealing the Government should have taken action Act or letting it remain in its non- long ago either to repeal the law Or to operative state, to be called into effect make some alteration to it. Now the if required. Government is moving by bringing down Then on the 24th March this year, the this Bill, which, should it become law, will Minister for Labour signed a minute to leave with the Government a legal discre- the Premier which appeared on Page 35 tion as to whether the law shall be operated of this file, and which reads- in the future. Herewith comments from the Acting The Bill, in its most important Particu- Chief Inspector of Factories and lar, proposes to delete the compulsory Shops. I quite agree with his sub- requirements of the sections of the Act mission and I think that the final which lay down that a committee shall paragraph sums up the necessity to be appointed and shall consist of so many allow the Act to remain on the members, and it will substitute for those Statute book so that if the need arose provisions a new amendment which will it could be brought into operation by leave discretion with the Government as Proclamation. to whether a committee shall or shall not be established in the future. So af ter a long, long struggle and an is not extremely stubborn refusal by the Govern- I have always agreed that it ment to face up to the legal realities of altogether fair or reasonable that only one the situation, we now find the Government essential commodity in the community doing what is. at least from Its point of should be singled out for price control, view, reasonable in the circumstances. To that extent I have always considered However, it should be emphasised the the people in the baking industry have had Government is only taking this step be- a fairly good argument. However, that has cause of an approach made to the Gov- not been the issue with me or with my ernor of the State; because of an appeal colleagues. Our issue has been that the made to the Governor of the State. It is Act contains compulsory provisions mak- ever so clear from the contents of the ing it a legal obligation upon the Govern- letter which the Premier signed and for- mnent to carry out the law. warded to me on the 11th May this year I cannot believe the Government has that the Government was not going to do not known that. It has known it, because, anything about this law; was not going to as I quoted earlier, the Solicitor-General, attempt to amend it in any shape or away back in the early part of 1959, set form, but was determined to go on re- it down clearly in a minute to his under- fusing to operate the compulsory pro- secretary-which later found its way to visions of the law. using as an excuse- the Government-that there was un- and a very thin one-and also as a sub- doubtedly a very strong legal obligation terfuge, the claim that the Act permits, On the Government to operate the law. but does not require, the making of a proclamation to fix prices. Yet the Government, because it did some horse trading with the employers' Obviously, the existing law does pro- organisations in the matter allowed the vide in that manner; but over and above law to lapse altogether on an undertaking that, there are the Provisions in the law from the employers concerned that they as it now stands-and which will stand would use the price-fixing formula which until it is altered by this legislation- had been followed by the committee when which Places squarely, beyond any shadow 2492 2492[ASSEMBLY.]I of doubt, upon the shoulders of this Gov- advice that the law was not being ob- er-nment, as it placed the legal responsi- served. it would not observe it. The bility squarely upon the shoulders of Leader of the Opposition has indicated previous governments, the responsibility to the various steps which were required in set up a committee by appointing its order to force upon the Government a personnel in the shape of three persons, realisation of its obligations; and now, and by giving each of those members of some five years after a continujing breach the committee when appointed a particu- of the ministerial oath, the Government lar term of office during which they would brings legislation here, not of Its own serve as members of the committee and volition, but because it has been forced carry out the duties Imposed upon the to do so by the constitutional position. committee under this law. So in all the circumstances this move by Lest there be any doubt about the situa- the Government, although it might not tion, I propose to quote from volume 7 be 100 per cenit. In accord with what T of the third edition of Halsbury's The think should be done, is at least, on the Laws of England. On Page 230 of that part of the Government, and from Its volume we read- point of view, a move to put legally right Laws may not be suspended. The that which the Government has deliber- Crown may not suspend laws or the ately kept legally wrong for 51 years. execution of laws without the con- sent of Parliament;- MR. TONKIN (Melville-Deputy Leader The Government made no attempt to of the Opposition) (7.52 p.m.): It is not obtain the consent of Parliament for what surprising that Ministers in the Govern- it was doing, but despite protests from ment are not anxious to enter into this the Opposition: despite repeated re- debate, because their position Is in- minders that the law was not being defensible. The Leader of the Opposition observed, the Government went on its has made it clear that for more than five merry way failing to observe the law- years every Minister in the Government and, I repeat, in breach of the ministerial has been acting In breach of his minis- oath-and putting Her Majesty In the terial oath-every Minister! The Min- position that she was in breach of her isters in this Government have never coronation oath. been strong on the point of observance of I proceed to quote from page 230- the law. The first instance of which we had experience was in connection with the -nor may it dispense with laws, or Electoral Districts Act when, on behalf of the execution of laws; and dispensa- the Government, it was said here, "You tions by non obet ante of or to any cannot take a mandamus against the statute or part thereof are void and Crown. in other words, if we, as Min- of no effect, except in such cases as isters in the Government, choose not to are allowed by statute. obey the law you cannot make us." Despite the fact that it is mandatory It cost the Opposition a considerable that the Crown cannot dispense with laws sum of money to get a decision in the or the execution of laws without the con- court to prove that the Government was sent of Parliament, this Government, for not obeying the law, and then It was five years, has continued to do just that necessary to make representations to the and would still be continuing to do it if Lieutenant-Governor-in the absence of the Opposition had not made representa- the Governor-to force the Government tions to His Excellency in order that the to observe the law which had been de- ministers would be shown their plain duty clared unanimously in the court and which in the matter. had been shown not to have been observed by the Government despite assurances I would also quote from page 233 of this given to Parliament that the law would be volume of The Laws of E71gland- observed. Ministerial responsibility. Secondly, it is remarkable that the Ministers in under the conventional law of the con- this Government should think that they stitution the Crown acts only upon the can set themselves above the law because advice of its constitutional advisers, they are, in effect, the representatives of and through the recognised executive the Crown, and it is clearly set out in departments and officers. Under the the Statutes that the Crown must observe doctrine of ministerial responsibility, the law, and therefore, when a Minister some minister is responsible to the fails to observe the law he is, by his non- House of Commons and, ultimately, to observance of it, placing the Crown in the the electorate for everything done in position of not observing the law in breach the name of the Crown. of the coronation oath. What these ministers have done in the it was clear that this Government had name of the Crown is to fail to observe no intention of bringing amending legisla- the law; or, in other words, they have tion before Parliament this session be- suspended the operation of the law, con- cause a Cabinet decision was made that trary to the Constitution, and contrary it be not done. In other words, Cabinet to their ministerial oath. The extract decided that, despite the fact it had legal continues-- [Wednesday, 11 November, 1984.1 2493

All Ministers and servants of the Majesty's representative in the State-His Crown are civilly and criminally liable, Excellency the Governor-pointing out in their individual capacity, for that the Government was acting contrary tortlous or criminal acts; and this to the law. What a shocking state of liability may be enforced either by affairs! means of impeachment or by ordinary Every day in the courts individuals are criminal or civil proceedings. being punished for non-observance of the I quote from page 232 of the same volume- law, and some of them for very minor Claims made by the Crown cannot breaches of the law. I remember one oc- be supported by mere pretence of pre- casion when the Chief Justice on an appeal rogative, since the courts have Power stated that a breach of the law had oc- to determine the extent and the legal- cuarred and he had no option but to dismiss ity or otherwise of any alleged pre- the appeal; but his sympathies were with rogative; nor may illegal acts be ren- the person who had been brought before dered justifiable by the plea of the the court. There was the law and it had Sovereign's commands or State neces- to be obeyed. sity. This Government is responsible for en- It would not matter how much a govern- forcing the particular law, but so far as ment felt it was expedient or desirable to it is concerned it obeys the law only when suspend the operation of the law; it has it pleases to do so, or when somebody takes no power to do so. But for more than action to force it to do so; and that must five years this Government continued to be presumed to be the situation in this suspend the law. case, I repeat that it is a shocking indict- Back in 1250 the Sovereign sought at nment of a responsible government when the time to get around the law by issuing Ministers, who have taken an oath upon dispensation in the form of what he called the Bible to observe their obligations as non obstante, which means notwithstand- Ministers, fail to observe the law. They ing. So the Crown began to issue licenses wend their merry way, and for five years- for doing such and such a thing non not in ignorance, but deliberately-sus- liended the operation of the law. It could obstante any law to the contrary. The rot be argued in this case that the Govern- Bill of Rights soon put an end to that. At ment had cbtained legal advice, to enable the time of the accession of the Sovereign. it to rely upon such advice, because it when the Bill of Rights was presented, failed to do certain things which it was it was laid down that that sort of thing required to do. Despite everything, the had to cease. Government made a Cabinet decision But the Government of this State has which meant it did not Propose to take revised the situation. So, despite the law any action. That would still be the posi- to the contrary, it did what it wanted to tion if the Opposition had not considered do; and what it wanted to do was to sus- it requisite to apprise His Excellency of pend the operation of this particular law. the situation. because that did not suit it. I know that The result was obvious. His Excellency the Government will regard this matter could not allow Her Majesty to be placed lightly, as was shown by its conduct on in the position of not observing the law, in other occasions; but to a democratic Par- breach of her coronation oath. So things liament it could not be a more serious had to happen, and as a result we have matter. this Bill before us. The Government is Mr. Hawke: The Minister for Lands entitled to ask Parliament to amend the looks a bit embarrassed and worried. law in accordance with its views, but it was not entitled to suspend the law in Mr. Bovell: I am trying to think who anticipation of the amendment of that the monarch was at the time. law at some future date; because, whilst Mr. TONKIN: It was laid down as a the law remains on the Statute book, there result of the Bill of Rights and the corona- is an obligation on the Government to tion oath that the Sovereign could not observe it. by mere pretence of prerogative suspend The position of the Ministers in this the laws, or the execution of the laws. situation could not be worse. It is no without reference to Parliament. But that wonder that so far no attempt has been does not mean a thing to the Brand Gov- made on their behalf to explain the situa- ernment. It uses its majority in Parlia- tion or to defend it. The feature of far- ment to enable it to breach the Constitu- reaching importance is not so much the tion, and to put Her Majesty in the posi- action of the Government in this case, tion of breaching her coronation oath. Of but the indication of the attitude of the course, the oath of the Ministers does not Ministers to their ministerial oath. If it mean any more than a snap of the fingers suits them to breach their oath in this to them. instance they will do so again when it The situation is absoutely indefensibit: suits them on another occasion-as they It cannot be excused in any way whatso- have done on previous occasions. ever. The Government was placed in the How long will the democratic system of position of having to bring forward a Bill, government last if Ministers who occupy because representations were made to Her the Treasury bench suspend the operation 2494 2494ASSEMBLY.] of laws which do niot suit them? In that for more than five years, practically dur- direction lies anarchy. it is that sort of ing the whole of the life of this Govern- conduct which brings about the downfall ment. It is only at the close of this ses- of government, because the people lose sion, the last of the existing Parliament confidence in the administration of the that the Government has made an attempt law. If it is right and proper that the to legalise the situation, and only then be- law should be enforced against individuals cause it is obliged to do so-not of its owr in the community, then it is also right volition, but because it is obliged to dc and proper for the Government to observe so, the situation being untenable. the law. It is given no option or alterna- tive, because it is laid down in the Con- I would hope that this would be a lessor stitution, in the ministerial oath, and in to Ministers. They may think they art the coronation oath, that the Crown has all-powerful because they have a majorit3 no vower to suspend the operation of the and then can rely on Party discipline tc law. carry them through whether they observE the laws or not. But, fortunately, there i., But this Government did, and for five a higher power in a democratic countr3 years it acted on that assumption. The and recourse can be had to that powei Government cannot say it had not been when a situation such as this arises. On( apprised of the situation previously, would find it difficult to imagine a situa. because there were other occasions when tion which would bring more shame thar we reminded the Government that it was the one in which the Ministers now fiac not for the Government to determine, as themselves. one has only to read th( a. matter of expediency, whether the law words of the ministerial oath to appre. was to be observed. There is a clear ciate the enormity of this offence. obligation for the Government to observe the law. It is not for the Government to maki any distinction as to which laws it wil There is a classic example on record in operate and which laws it will suspend New South Wales. when the Government There is a clear obligation on the Crows of the day acted contrary to the law. The to observe all laws, and their suspensior Governor, Sir Phillip Game, drew the can be brought about only by a decliim attention of the Premier of the day to of Parliament. I hope we will not havi the fact that his Government 'was not a repetition of this. It seems at long las observing the law. As far as I can we have been able to bring the Governmen remember, his words were- to a realisatlon that it is not all-powerful By not observing the law you have and that it cannot take the stand that placed His Majesty in the position of is not going to observe a law, and no-owo not obeying the law, and that is a1 can mnake it do so. That was the attitud4 situation in which I cannot permit with the Electoral Districts Act and. ul His Majesty to be placed. Therefore to now, it has been the attitude with re I request you to observe the law, or gard to this Act. hand in your resignation. Although the Opposition may not havi Because the Government declined to sufficient numbers to make the Govern observe the law the Governor dismissed ment take any line of action which fs con the Administration, and the dismissal of trary to that which it desires to take, for. the Government was subsequently con- tunately the Constitution has sufficient re firmed by Parliament, even though the serve power to enable it to be accom. new Government was in the minority. plished. I feel that the situation calls foi Parliament itself recognised that the law an apology from the Government in con. was paramount and above government, nection with the matter and an under, and there was a responsibility upon the taking-if any reliance can be placed or Ministers to ensure the law was observed. any undertaking by this Governxnent-tha That was a clear case in which the dis- it will not do this sort of thing again. missed government had sufficient numbers am pleased that at long last an attemp In Parliament to defeat the new govern- is to be made to legalise the situatioi ment at the first vote, but Parliament which up to the present time has been recognised that the situation was one public scandal. which had to be dealt with that way, and the law of the realm had to be upheld. MR. W. HEGNEY (Mt. Hawthorn) [8.1 The position in this instance is no dif- p.m.]: I would briefly like to support mw ferent. Here in Western Australia we Leader and Deputy Leader in the senti. have had a Statute which requires certain ments they have expressed in regard tt things to be done, and the Government the introduction of this Bill to amend thi was advised by its legal advisers that they Wheat Products (Prices Fixation) Act were required to be done. However. in What the previous speakers have salt the face of that the Government made is quite true, and I am satisfied that hat a decision that it would take no action; not the Leader of the Opposition taken th4 in other words, that it would suspend the action he did in submitting the matter ti operation of the law. That suspension the Governor, this Government would no of the operation of this law has continued have moved. it would have continued t [Wednesday, 11 November, 1904.1 2495 ignore the law as it has done-as the The present Act was passed in 1938, and Leader of the Opposition stated-for the that has a very interesting history too. last 5J years. I know the Country Party members and farmers are most interested in this par- I am under no illusions Personally as to ticular measure. It contains the definition what the Government will do when it of "flour" as follows:- passes this Bill. It will take no action "Flour' means any substance pro- whatever. It has taken none up to date. duced- and its lack of action is a very definite (a) by gristing, cruishing, grind- indication of the indifference, if not the ing, milling, cutting, or other- antagonism, of the Liberal Party members wise processing wheat or by of the Government to this legislation. any one or more of those I am not going to suggest that the processes applied to wheat master bakers, as an example, have in- combined with any other creased the price of bread unfairly. They commodity.... have Increased the price of bread on a It then goes on- number of occasions: and up to the time The term includes- this Government was elected to office, the (d) any mixture of any such price of bread was fixed after an examina- substances; and tion of certain figures and a consideration (e) self-raising flour .. of the formula laid down by the Wheat Products Prices Committee. I am quite It also defines "Wheat products" as fol- satisfied that the consumers of this State- low:- more particularly of the metropolitan area "Wheat products" mean flour, bran, -were somewhat satisfied when they knew Pollard, and bread and such other that the price of bread was to be increased substances produced by gristing, as the result of a decision or recommnenda- crushing, grinding, milling, cutting tion of the Wheat Products Prices Com- or otherwise processing wheat as mittee. are declared by proclamation to be wheat products. I repeat that I am not charging the Master Bakers' Association with having in- Under that Act the government of the day was obliged to appoint a commtttee, creased prices unfairly; but I suggest'that which functioned for quite a long time. had the position as I just outlined it con- It was a very competent committee. It tinued, the public would have been more was not incumbent upon the government confident and satisfied with having to pay of the day, of course, to adopt the recom- increased prices for bread. The fact that mendations of the committee because a the Government, during the last five Years, proviso was added that the "Governor may has refused to carry out the law Is some- by prolamation"-in other words gazette what in accordance with its attitude in the recommendations of the committee. 1952. the Year before it went out of office, when the Prices Control (Continuance) Act As the Government has for the last five was introduced. That legislation was in- Years implied that it was not going to troduced to carry on price control for the carry out the law-as a matter of fact it time being; but the Government, believing is quite evident it has not carried out the that the people were going to discharge it law-it has now been forced to do some- from office, Put in the Bill a Provision thing and it is going to give Itself dis- repealing the Profiteering Prevention Act, cretion to appoint a committee. If the 1939- 1941. Government wants to give itself discretion to appoint itself a committee that is its 1 have here a copy of the Prices Control business; but as far as I am concerned. (Continuance) Act, which was No. 28 of I am perfectly satisfied that it will do 1952. It was a brief measure and gave nothing in regard to this particular mea- the Price Control Commissioner authority tire. to carry on. It contained only four sec- tions, the fourth reading- There are two differences of opinion re- garding price control, and I go a long way The Profiteering Prevention Act. with the Leader of the Opposition when 1939-1941 is repealed. he says that it is not proposed to single That is a very definite indication to me out master bakers for price control. How- of the attitude of this Government in re- ever, the Act is there and has been in gard to the protection of the People in operation for some years and I believe that this State in connection with Prices as an association the master bakers would generally. Had not the Leader of the welcome the carrying on of a formula Opposition communicated with His Excel- which has been set up over the years and lency the Governor, I am satisfied that which I do not propose to go into now. this very short Bill would not be before I am not accusing the master bakers of the Chamber, and its verbiage leads me ignoring that formula in the determina- to believe that the Government will pass tion of their prices, but what I do suggest the Bill and then do exactly nothing. if is that when a measure on the Statute the master bakers want to increase the book is designed to grant some small price of any of their commodities tomor- amount of protection to the consumers, r'ow, they will be entitled to do so. we should hesitate to remove it. [ASSEMBLY.]

I know that same members of the Goy- no-one from the Government side has so erment will say, "Why the price of far seen fit even to attempt to reply. bread?" I am quite satisfied that if There is an old saying that silence means bread were the only commodity, there consent. It would seem that by their silence might be something in the argument that Government members have admitted it did not matter much. However, there everything the Leader of the Opposition are plenty of people living on low incomes said. and they have to look twice at every penny over a period. As a Government it has fallen down badly despite the fact that the Opposition I suggest the Government would have has been drawing its attention to the posi- been well advised to carry out the provi- tion and to the fact that this Act should sions of this Act instead of ignoring it have been put into effect over the last five over so long a period. So far as I years. If the Government wanted to do know-I am open to question here, the the honest thing and repeal this Act it Minister for Agriculture not being here- should have listed it among the 300-odd the price of milk In the metropolitan area other Acts that are to be deleted from the is controlled by the Milk Board which is Statute book of Western Australia under set up under the Milk Act. What would the authority of a Bill which we have re- be the attitude In regard to that commo- cently been discussing. But the Govern- dity and in regard to the price of butter? ment has not done that. It has continued I am convinced that as the Government to ignore the fact that it is under an ob- took the action it did before in regard to ligation to go into the matter of increas- repealing the Profiteering Prevention Act, ed prices for products which are derived and it has not carried out the provisions from wheat and flour. The Government of the Act under discussion at the has not appointed a committee for this moment, it will continue to demnonstrate purpose. its inactivity, However, I agree with the It may be that the Government was Deputy Leader of the Opposition who ex- conscious of the fact that the committee pressed the view that the Ministers of the would have far-reaching powers arid, Government should be ashamed of them- among those powers, would be the author- selves for ignoring for so long the obliga- ity to investigate the activities of certain tion to carry out the law. Either this trading concerns in relation to their costs. Act should have been carried out and It could well have been that the commit- the committee should have been function- tee would be able to prove, without any ing from time to time, or the particular doubt, that the recent increases that have measure should have been repealed. But been made in prices for products made there are more than Liberal interests from wheat and flour were not justified. mixed up in the provisions in this Bill; Probably it is for and if the Government did not want to those reasons the Gov- have anything to do with the Wheat Pro- ernment did not carry out its obligations. ducts Prices Committee it should have Some other speakers have already refer- done the other thing and repealed the red to the fact that the Government is whole Act, and not introduced at this late being consistent in its attitude in regard hour a Bill which will give it discretion to legislation. It refused to carry out its to appoint a committee, or not appoint a obligations under the Electoral Districts committee, as it wishes. Act because it obviously knew such action I do not intend to have any more to say would be to its disadvantage. It had to other than to express the view that Cabi- be forced into the courts before it would net must have felt very small;, its mem- put the law into effect. Also, recently, the bers must have had to eat humble pie Government short-circuited an Act of when, after five years of ignoring the law, Parliament passed in 1959. It did this by and five years of repudiation, they had way of a regulation which was drawn up to sit around the Premier's Cabinet table within six months of an amendment to in a huddle and decide that, as they had that Act becoming law-I refer to the some indication from the Governor,' the Natives (Citizenship Rights) Act. That is time was ripe for them to sit up and take typical of the attitude of this Government notice and either repeal or amend the towards matters which have been dealt law. The few lines in the Bill are the with by this responsible Assembly and result. which affect the democratic rights of the people. That is the point with which I am concerned. MR. BRADY (Swan) [8.31 p-m.): I am disappointed that not even one member it may be that the Government is quite from the Government side is going to re- right in not appointing a price-fixing ply to the Leader of the Opposition re- committee, and it may be that the Gov- garding the matters he brought forward ernment was right in what it did in rela- when he spoke to this Bill. I think it is tion to the native welfare legislation. an appalling situation for a responsible However, it was proved that the Govern- As6sembly to find itself in. The Leader of ment was doing the wrong thing under the Opposition went to great pains to the Electoral Districts Act, and perhaps show where the Government had ignored it could be proved wrong in the other two the Parliament of Western Australia but cases to which I have just referred, and [Wednesday, 11 November, 1964.1 292497 it has not got the right to ignore the But that has nothing to do with the Parliament of Western Australia, as it did argument we have put forward. Our in this particular instance, argument is that if we are going to have I think the honourable member for Mt. a Parliament worthy of the name, and if Hawthorn was quite correct. There are we are going to have an Assembly with certain basic or stable commodities which Government members and Opposition People must have-I refer to such items members, and they are to pass legislation, as bread, milk, and a few others. Un- whether it is right or wrong the Govern- fortunately there are some families which, ment should carry that law into effect. because of their size, or their economic If it does not do that, then the Govern- circumstances, are forced to purchase a ment cannot blame anybody but itself for great many more loaves of bread than the anything that happens as a result. average family. They are the people who Whilst there is a remote possibility some should be protected by this type of legis- people in my electorate are being ex- latiwn, ploited by unscrupulous and avaricious I think it is as well to tell the House that bakers, I want to add my protest about this legislation was originally enacted to what the Government has done. I would protect the wheatgrowers. The parent Act take the same attitude whether it con- was Introduced in 1938. Although the price cerned the price of wheat products, the of flour was fixed when wheat was 9s. a price of petrol, the price of clothing, the bushel, it remained at the same price price of transport, the price of houses, or when wheat was Is. 96. a bushel; and just the price of anything else. If legislation as the farmers were being exploited in is passed we are entitled to see that the those days-and apparently that induced Government carries it into effect and does the government of the day to introduce not ride roughshod over the people simply the legislation to protect the wheatgrowera becaluse it Is the Government. -so we on this side of the House hope to see the users of wheat and flour products If in the eyes of the Government a law protected now. If it Is fair to protect is redundant it should amend it or get one section of the community affected by rid of it altogether in a similar fashion legislation of this kind in one year, it is to the Acts which were passed in the years just as reasonable to ask that the other between [835 to 1900, and which are section of the community, who are also covered by a Bill now before this Chamber. affected by this legislation, be protected. If the Government felt that the wheat The position was reached where His Ex- products legislation should have been cellency the Governor had to be asked to treated in that way it should have been consider the position. What a shocking listed along with the other Acts., position to place him in! The Queen's own As I said before, the Government does representative in this State had to be asked not want a committee prying into the by a responsible Opposition to have a look costing of certain organisations in the at the whole Position to see whether the metropolitan area. We know that in Queen's own Government was carrying out recent times bakers have increased the the laws which its members had taken an price of bread. Was that justified? I do oath to see were carried out. The Gov- not think it was. But the bakers got away ernment has not carried out the law, and with it. Such an increase was not recom- it has not said why it has not done so. mended by the price-fixing commisson;, Not one Government member has at- and therefore, from the hundreds of tempted to reply to the Opposition's case thousands of loaves of bread that are in this matter. is it any wonder that cer- baked each day, the master bakers are tain people with militant Ideas are able to getting an extra id. or 16.. as the case may get a story over to some people when re- be, and that Is going into their pockets. sponsible Governments do not carry out This is making it difficult for some fam- the laws of the land? That sort of thing ilies who are in economic difficulties to does a great deal of harm. carry on. So long as I represent people If the Government feels that it is like that I will voice my protest whether entitled to do what it is doing, why does or not hcnourable members like to hear it not Justify its actions in this H-ouse what I have to say. and let the community generally know what it is doing? But no: it continues to The parent legislation was introduced ignore the legislation; it has continued in 1938, and at the time the powers that to ignore Parlifament,, and it has gone on be considered It to be very important. its own sweet way because, apparently, That is obvious from some of the penalties certain people are getting an advantage that were provided. In one instance there from it. Maybe it could be proved, al- was a penalty of £200, or £300, for failure though I could not prove it, that those to supply certain information:, and there certain people are helping the Govern- was also a penalty of £500 for refusing to ment In a certain way, and that might be do certain other things. When in 1938 another reason why the Government will this legislation was introduced to Protect not carry the law into effect-it does not the farming community it was considered want to upset Its friends. major legislation, as can be seen.'from the 2498 2498ASSElO3LY.] penalties involved, which are far heavier reasons why the Government has nol than are provided in hundreds of other gone to the full extent and got rid ol Acts passed since that time. this Act. It could probably be sumnlec Yet, as I said previously, the Govern- up in three letters of the alphabet; namely ment has not seen fit to appoint a com- C.DL., because I should imagine thai mittee to make recommendations in re- that particular part of the coalition xnai gard to the matter now. One can only not be altogether happy because of cer- infer from this that there is some nigger Lain protections which it has for it, in the woodpile; and the nigger in the wheaten products and the People it repre. woodpile seems to be that it does not suit sents. The protection it has is there the Government to appoint a committee, but it is stored away in the back row,' Probably because some of its friends are until it is required. But that is no reasor getting a tidy rake-off to which they are to keep the Act in cold storage. not entitled. The Act is either operative or it is not It is ludicrous that it should be admin. Maybe some responsible member of the istered differently when administration: Government will get up and endeavour to change from time to time. The stage Justify the Government's action over the could be reached where administration last five years. Personally, I do not think could change rather quickly, and we coulk the Government should be allowed to get have something taking place one minute away with it. If it suits the government and something Quite different taking place of the day at one time to protect certain the next. As a result of this the people people, it is equally right for the govern- most affected do not know where the! ment of the day at some other time to stand. We should tidy this whole busi protect another section of the community ness up, and for that reason it is m: which, in this ease, would be protected by intention to vote against the Bill. Th, the appointment of a price-fixing com- Act should be repealed, or put into opera mission. tion, so that it will become an effectiv, Statute of this State. MR. JAMESON (Beeloo) (8.44 p.m.]: I would like to indicate my opposition to this Bill. One of the two amendments pro- ZMR. WILD (Dale-Minister for Labour posed is to bring the price of flour more [8.49 p.m.]: I first want to thank honour Into line with what is considered to be a able members for addressing theinselve: realistic Price, or to give the Government to this measure; although I must say the power to Proclaim a more realistic Price the Leader of the Opposition and the hon under the terms of the Act. However, I ourable member for Mt. Hawthorn wer think the other amendment is by far about the only two who mentioned thi the more important in that it will give fact that we have a Bill before us contain the Government of the day the Queen's Ing two clauses. I do not think any men prerogative to grant mercy, as It were, to tion was made about the Bill itself. A, the various people who could be affected far as the Deputy Leader of the Oppositiot by this Act. was concerned, for my part I felt I wa, receiving a lecture and I was rather gla( It is my firm belief that if an Act is no that I camie along with a thick Pair o longer required to be effective in the pants as I might have been getting community it should be repealed. There whipping for I felt like a naughty schoe is no doubt about the action that should boy. be taken by the Government. If the Gov- ernment wants to repeal the Act and does AS far as the Government is coneerne not want it enacted It should say so and in this legislation It is purely a question o repeal it. The Government should not legal interpretation of the Act. The posi be half-hearted about tion is that the Leader of the Opposiltioi this. continued writing to the Premier request It becomes more and more obvious that ing that the Act either be repealed o when a Labor Party government is in taken off the Statute book: and, as ther power certain action is taken, but when a was some division as to the legs Liberal Party coalition government is in opinion, the Government decided to pu office from time to time another course of the whole matter beyond all doubt. so w action is followed. Nothing confuses the now have two small amendments, one oe public more than to have one law inter- which has nothing to do with the mail preted In two different ways by different subject which Is the topic of discussie; parties when they are in power. We are this evening. The price of flour referree relegating this Act to the same category as to in the original Act now has no bearin the legislation dealing with capital pun- as it is considerably higher and the sectioi ishmeent. where certain action is taken by is therefore useless. one government and entirely different The honourable member for Mt. Haw action is taken by another government. thorn and the honourable member fo That is surely not desirable in the scheme Swan should get it out of their minds tha of things. the master bakers' federation, or what We must either have the Act so that ever they vail themselves, want to see thi it will work, or should work, or get rid of piece of legislation on the Statute book it altogether. We might examine the I can assure those honourable member [Wednesday. 11 November, 1964.1 249949

that if the master bakers had their way AGRICULTURAL PRODUCTS ACT they would have it off the Statute book altogether. AMENDMENT BILL (No. 2) In fairness to them, however, I would Second Reading Point out that during the 21 years I have Debate resumed, from the 10th Novem- been Minister, and on each occasion when ber, on the following motion by Mr. Nalder they have made an attempt to change the (Minister for Agriculture): Price of bread they honoured the under- taking they gave to my predecessor. Mr. That the Bill be now read a second Perkins. They have come along and indi- time. cated that there has been a slight increase in costs, or a change in the price of flour, MR. ROWBERRY (Warren) (8.56 p.m.): and they produced exactly the same type This small Bill seeks to amend the Agricul- of figures which they were producing when tural Products Act in certain ways. Mem- the Act was Proclaimed, and which they bers will recall that in 1962 an Apple Sales were compelled to produce when the com- Advisory Committee was set up for the mittee was operating. purpose of protecting the apple growing These People have honoured their under- and apple selling industries. taking and I can assure the honourable member for Swan that it has caused not flis committee was given certain powers, only myself but the officers of the Labour some of which were to inquire into the Department a considerable amount of size of the anticipated apple crop and the -worry and concern, naturally, to have these quality, grade, and types of apples being figures checked. I would say that these harvested or expected to be harvested; to people have not been given one small bit investigate and assess the demand for more than that to which they were entitled. apples to be consumed within the State; My mind goes back to some months ago and to make recommendations and submit when they requested a rise because of in- proposals to the Minister from time to creased costs; but as it is not Possible to time with respect to the grades of apples charge less than one half-pennly I was that should be marketed. able to persuade them to increase their it has been found that there is some price, on only one section of standard doubt whether the regulations set up bread. This amending Bill only validates in this section of the Act are indeed valid. action which the Government has In the They are the regulations which determine past deemed to be correct. the sizes of the various grades; but Question put and passed. whether these sizes are in fact valid under this legislation has become very much in Bill read a second time. doubt. I think it is reasonable that we should resolve that doubt, and give this in Committee committee the power that it necessarily The Chairman of Committees (Mr. I. W. requires to enforce the regulations under Manning) in the Chair; Mr. Wild (Minis- the Act. The Bill does now include in the ter for Labour) In charge of the Bill. regulation by amendment to the Parent Act a reference to the sizes and varieties Clause 1 put and passed. of apples which I think should validate Clause 2: Section 6 amended- the regulations made to determine sizes. Mr. JAMIESON: r find this clause most It should remove all doubt as to whether objectionable. I have already stated my proceedings under the Act are indeed legal. case. I saw some merit in another amend- Because of these things I support the Bill. ment that the Bill Proposes, but I see no It is necessary that the apple growers and merit in this whatever. I feel we are justi- the public should be protected from un- fled In voting against this clause. it is scrupulous people; from people who In the not at all clear whether or not the law will past have unloaded inferior fruit on to the be put into operation. We should not have market; and who have not only done harm such laws on the Statute book. I1oppose to the consumers, but who have done, and the clause. are doing, harm to their fellow growers. For these reasons I commend the Bill to Clause put and passed. the House and give it my support. Clause 3 put and passed. Question put and passed. Title put and passed. Bill read a second time. Report In Committee, etc. Bill passed through Committee without Bill reported, without amendment, and debate, reported without amendment, and the report adopted. the report adopted. Third Readting Third Reading Bill read a third time, on motion by Bill read a third time, on motion by Mr. Wild (Minister for Labour), and trans- Mr, Nalder (Minister for Agriculture), and mitted to the Council. transmitted to the Council. 2500 2500ASSEMBLY.)

DOOR TO DOOR (SALES) BILL I understand there has been discussion Second Reading between the honourable member for Can- ning and the Minister for Justice regarding Debate resumed, from the 9th Septem- this particular matter; and, although as far ber, on the following motion by Mr. D. G. as I know they have not been able to May:- reach agreement on the details of the That the Bill be now read a second amendments the Government would seek, time. nevertheless, the honourable member for Canning has been advised by the Minister for Justice that the Government is 1per- MR. COURT (Nedlands-Minister for pared to give priority to his Bill. That is Industrial Development) [9.2 p~m.): As the reason why this Bill is being proceeded the honourabie member who initiated this with in this place and the Government's Bill pointed out when introducing it, it Bill is not being proceeded with at this is, as its title implies, a measure that has juncture in another place. specific application in the matter of door- to-door sales. The honourable member Amendments that have been requested went further and stated its main purpose by the Minister for Justice and his officers is to safeguard certain credit agreements following consideration of both Bills, have Induced by high-pressure itinerant sales- been on the notice paper for some time. So men. The Bill is submitted to the House honourable members will have been able to as a measure which will permit people form an Idea of the differences in principle who have been subjected to high-pressure between the Government's Bill and the Bill sales tactics and as a consequence entered introduced by the honourable member for into contracts, to deny these contracts Canning, The honourable member's Bill is when given time to reflect. based almost entirely on the Victorian legislation. The approach of the Govern- As we know, this is not the first occasion ment to the legislation is very much the on which problems associated with door- same, but there are some very important to-door salesmen have been raised in this differences. Parliament or this Chamber. Indeed, there is a long history in Australia to give legis- It could, I think, fairly be said that the lative effect in respect of this particular basic approach of the Victorian legislation subject. If I might be permitted to digress has been followed in both Instances, but a moment, Mr. Speaker, I should ]ike to there are differences in methods that have make some passing reference to legislative been foreshadowed by the Government's action taken in other States. amendments. The Bill introduced by the honourable member for Canning applies to A Bill was introduced into the Victorian goods which are defined as including "all Parliament and was duly passed; and, from chattels personal other than money or my understanding, the Bill introduced by livestock and includes any fixtures sever- the honourable member, to a large extent, able from the realty." It will be appreci- follows the Victorian Act. Some of us are ated that the definition in the Bill which inclined to think this type of problem is applies to all chattels, real, could include a fairly new and that this sort of legislation lease; and this, I think, was not intended. is peculiar to the twentieth century when we experience high-pressure and pressur- It is noticed there is no provision in ised sales tactics. However, it is interesting any amendments for widening the scope to note that New South Wales has had a of the definition of goods by regulation Book Purchasers Protection Act since as should such necessity arise at a later time. early as 1890. I do not know whether it It is thought preferable that a6Bill of this has had any practical effect, but it is on nature should contain a definition more the Statute book of that State. restrictive to the purpose at present in mind covering such articles as books, The Government has had inquiries in engravings, pictures, and so forth, but train for a considerable period; and the with authority for the Minister in charge Minister for Justice and his Crown Law of its administration to prescribe other officers have been examining this particu- goods from time to time for the purpose lar type of legislation in the other States; of control under the Act. One of the and, as a consequence, about mid-May of reasons why this is thought to be necessary this year, did assemble the appropriate is the fact that it will give greater flexi- information and recommend to the Gov- bility and it will have less impairment to ernment that legislation be brought In, bona fide trade, or less threat to It. An appropriate Bill was, in tact, prepared; and, as a consequence, the Minister for Not all of this type of trade is harmful; Justice, in another place, moved earlier in and the Government suggests that through the session for leave to introduce a Bill the amendments on the notice paper it entitled the Purchasers' Protection (Door will obtain greater flexibility; and the Sales) Bill. Therefore, there is one Bill government of the day will have the In another place and another here which power to embrace any types of things have a similar objective, but vary in their within the legislation that come to the methods of trying to achieve a particular notice of the administration where there result. are undesirable practices. [Wednesday, 11 November, 1964.3 202501

Mr. Brady: Do you think pest control indication of the exact time that the Min- agents might come under "undesirable ister might have in mind; but I think in agents"? fairness to all concerned we should allow Mr. COURT: I could not be specific on a reasonable period so that not only the the legal interpretation and how they fit public might be forewarned of their rights into this picture; but I think the honour- and privileges under the legislation, but able member is referring to pest extermin- also traders will know that the legislation ators and not the type of person one calls will be in force on a certain date. In a pest who goes from door to door. I do other words, the Act will be proclaimed not think we would be inclined to give the and become effective on a certain date and Government power to exterminate that if traders then trade outside the law, it type of pest. will be at their peril. If a government brings down a law of Whilst this Bill only applies to credit this nature which introduces fairly drastic purchase agreements made at the place changes, if it takes effect from the date of residence of the ballee or purchaser. of the Royal assent, that government good reasons may be advanced to include could be accused of being precipitous purchases made at a pro's place of about it. When making a change such employment and also at a technical school. as this, it is better to allow for a degree I do not think I need to emphasise this of education on both sides. I do not think further because that will be self-evident it will be a ridiculously long period, but it to honourable members. will need to be a reasonable time. In the matter of the termination of When the previous Government had certain credit purchase agreements, there legislation before this Chamber in respect is no exclusive provision in the Bill for of hire purchase, I think Mr. Emil Nulsen termination by the purchaser or bailee as was in charge of the Bill, and he indicated the case may require, and it is suggested the period he had in mind before the law an appropriate amendment could be con- would operate. One of the reasons given sidered in this regard. was to allow for new forms to be printed There is need to add a provision aimed to conform with the new law. I think he at preventing circumvention of the Act stated when he would proclaim the legis- by a vendor writing into the agreement lation before the Bill left the House. I a provision that the agreement was made forget the exact circumstances, but I know as a result of an unsolicited request made a date was agreed to as being a fair thing, by the purchaser or bailee to the vendor. by which time new forms could be printed This matter is clarified in the proposed and new practices could be developed be- amendment on the notice paper. This fore the law was made enforceable. would insert into the Bill, in a very com- prehensive manner, the provisions, terms, I do not want to Iabu ur this matter, conditions, or covenants in an agreement because it is the Government's desire to to which this Act applies, or any offer in expedite consideration of this Bill, not respect of an agreement to which the only here but in another place, because purchaser or bailee is a party, which there is a common objective between the under this legislation would void such Opposition and the Government. I do agreement; and an offence under this not know the attitude of the honourable proposed section could incur a penalty of member toward the amendments on the up to £200. notice paper; and no doubt he will indicate this, either in reply to the second reading This Bill will come into operation on debate, or during the Committee stage. the Royal assent; but it is preferable- However, it is the Government's desire, at least in the opinion of the Government now there have been these discussions be- -for the measure to come into operation tween the Minister and the honourable on a date to be proclaimed to permit member concerned, to give the honourable sufficient time for notices, etc., to be member's Bill as speedy a passage as it printed, regulations made, and the busi- can, both through here and another place. ness Public forewarned of the measure before the Act comes into operation. I I think we all appreciate there are these have already made passing reference to glib persuasive people in our midst, and the desirability of inserting an appropriate we have housekeepers who, either in self clause permitting the making of regula- defence, in trying to get rid of these people, tions. or for other reasons, fall for their wiles; and we want to Introduce something prac- Mr. D. 0. May: What time do you think tical and effective to cope with the situa- would be sufficient for notification to all tion. .I support the measure and at the the firms? appropriate time will move the amend- Mr. COURT: I have not discussed this ments I have mentioned. in detail, but I know the Minister has in mind that a reasonable period of notice MR. NORTON (Gascoyne) [9.15 p.m.l: should be given before the legislation is I wish to say a few words in support of proclaimed. If the Assembly so desires this Bill, because I have had some ex- I will be more explicit and obtain some perience with door-to-door salesmen. In 2502 2502(ASSEMBLY.]

1961 1 received a Phone call from a sales- One of the company's salesmen came man asking if he could come along to see to a station and asked whether he could me. He said he had a special offer to make stay the night. He was offered the hos- to me. Being curious, I let him come along. pitality of the homestead. After tea he This man was not a salesman at all. He started on his sales talk. He finished up was simply a man who had been trained by saying, "Do you want to buy it? Thie by a firm to present its product in a is the only opportunity you will get. Take certain manner, it or leave it!" He was told that he could take his leave the first thing in the morn- When he came, he had with him a very Ing; that the people at the homestead nice satchel on which his initials were did not want to buy the encyclopaedia. printed in gold. The sachel contained quite a lot of literature. The man took If this salesman had adopted different out this literature piece by piece and told tactics the people at the homestead would a story about It. As he was telling his have bought the encyclodaedla for theli story he kept glancing at his watch. He grandchildren. However, the sales talk had said, "When I have finished this I will put them off. other companies who have have a good proposition to put to you: representatives going through outback something which is worth while." I kept areas selling books use similar tactics, al- asking him what the proposition was, but though not quite such harsh tactics as the he refused to tell me. I then put him off firm I have mentioned. his sales talk by tossing in several inter- jections while he was speaking; and once Another firm had representatives travel- he was off his line of patter he was abso- ling in the north-west selling manchester lutely lost. One salesman went around showing Mr. W. Hegney: You have been trained sampies. The price was somewhere here. around £50. I believe this was around about 1960. The salesmen were asking Mr. NORTON: That is so; but I had for a deposit of 30s. and the balance also had some experience of selling. There could be paid off In instalments of 10a is no doubt that this man could sell only to 15$. per week. However, when the par- in the manner in which he had been cels of manchester were forwarded to the trained, which was high-pressure sales- purchasers, the quality was not the same ae manship. When he came towards the end the samples; and the company refused te of his sales talk he said, "Well, do you take back the parcels when people com- want it? This is the only opportunity you plained. will get": and he tried to force me to sign an order form. I was approached by a resident of Car- I1eventually told him in clear terms that narvon to see the firm, which had given I had no intention of buying his product: an address in Murray Street. I had much that his line of talk had put me off. I difficulty in finding the address and offer was not a eventually I found an office of accountantE told him that his special on the second storey Of a building. The special offer; that it was something put office was located up a narrow stairway, up as a catch. This office of accountants admitted know- Mr. W. Hegney: Was he selling books? ing the firm concerned, but I was unable to obtain the exact address although I Mr. NORTON: He was selling encyclo:- heard somebody in the accountants' office paedlas. At that particular time I asked telephone this particular company. Even- questions in the House regarding encyclo- tually the company concerned was per- paedias, particularly in respect of various suaded to accept the parcel of manchester. statements which such salesmen made. The parcel had been forwarded to Perth One statement was that this was the only but had been returned to the sender. The encylopaedia recognised by the Education company threatened to summons the Department in connection with secondary People concerned for the balance of the schools' education. This was dented by payments. There was a certain amount of both the Minister and the Director of litigation and I was asked to look into Education. My questions received quite a the matter. However, the company eventu- lot of publicity at the time in The West ally took back the parcel and wiped off Australian. all debts connected with it. Within about 24 hours 1 had received a There was another salesman who trav- letter from the firm concerned asking elled through the north selling dresses. for an interview in order to clear up He was in the nature of a hawker. These anomalies which had appeared in The men go from house to house with these West Australian. I sent a copy of the dresses and they leave half a dozen questions which I had asked in the House. samples. They ask that for purposes of I said that I had nothing to hide and goodwill there should be a deposit of 5s. that I had nothing else to add. About or l0s. and they leave a receipt for that nine months later this same firm had amount. However, they do not return for representatives travelling through the the dresses and the people who have the pastoral areas of the north. samples receive a bill for the dresses. [Wednesday, 11 November, 1984.] 250350

The honourable member for Canning them and the wife was not in a position mentioned companies concerned with pest to commit her husband because her mental control. Some of these companies are powers were such that she had no power quite genuine. Although their charges of attorney. Eventually the company ac- are high, they do good work. However, cepted the goods by mail. there are other companies who are not Quite so genuine. Their representatives That is typical of what is going on. Re- are very persistent, and if one is not fully garding companies which specialise in pest awake one can easily get caught. These control, a woman showed me an account people should have a certificate or license for £30 which she had paid to protect her to Show that they are bona fide repre- home from white ants. However, the white sentatives and that the companies are ants practically ate out her front door and absolutely genuine. I have much pleasure she could get no redress. People should in supporting the Bill. be protected against such companies. At a later stage we may be able to do some- thing about unscrupulous pest control lMR. BRADY (Swan) (9.24 p.m.]:* I companies. As the honourable member wish to say a few words in connection with for Gascoyne said, some of them are quite this Bill. The honourable member for genuine; and they would sooner lose money Canning is to be congratulated on bringing than feel they were getting a bad name the measure before Parliament in order as pest control experts. At the same time, that there can be control over unscrupu- there are others who will make an agree- lous salesmen. ment and accept money, but then they will I do not believe that every salesman who make excuses and not live up to the agree- goes on to a Person's verandah is unscrupu- ment. I support the legislation, However, lous. In fact, I think that the majority if the honourable member so desires, I of salesmen are honest citizens who are think the ambit of the Bill could be trying to eke out an honest existence. widened to include goods other than books However, there are unscrupulous ones who in order to protect the public. prey on unsuspecting householders, whether they be women or men. We do If we include the words "other goods not want a bar of those people and the prescribed by the Minister," half a dozen sooner we get rid of them the better. smart aleck firms could go through the State and take in the general public, and Genuine salesmen will welcome this mea- by the time the Minister was approached sure. They know that their products are and regulations were Prescribed, the of- of good value and they will not resent a fenders would be In Darwin or Queensland, cooling-off period of one week. I do not and we would have no protection for the think we shall have any difficulty with public. I hope the ambit of the Bill will the genuine salesman. be widened. In my opinion this measure should not be confined to books. There are unscrupu- Mr. Ross Hutchinson: You Could not lous salesmen who sell goods other than include white ants. books, and the public must be protected against such salesmen. The honourable Mr. BRADY: Not very well, but on member for Gascoyne mentioned a firn another occasion we could bring down a which was selling women's frocks. I do Bill to deal with those people. not know whether it is the same firm, but there was a firm operating in the Midland district. MR. D. G. MAY (Canning) [9.31 p.m.): X thank the Minister and honour- A friend of mine, who recently came able members on this side of the House for out of Hcathcote, was persuaded to accept their contributions to the debate. As the some frocks and to make a deposit of a Minister said, there have been certain dis- few shillings in good faith. When her hus- cussions between the Minister for Justice band saw the price of the frocks they both and myself; and whilst we believe in the decided that the frocks were not wanted. principle of the Bill, there are certain However, the people concerned were unable amendments that we have not been able to return them to the company. The ad- to agree on. Naturally those amendments dress given at the time was Parliament will be dealt with when the Bill is in Place, but the company's doors were closed Comm-ittee. every time the couple tried to make con- tact. The man lost time from his work in The Minister mentioned that in New trying to return the frocks. He later re- South Wales this matter Is covered by the ceived a letter threatening to prosecute Book Purchasers Act, and in South Aus- him if he did not pay for them. tralia it is dealt with by the Book Pur- The man came to me and I telephoned chasers Act of that State. In Victoria- the company and explained the situation. and the Victorian legislation is the most I advised the firm that it would be better recent-the Government saw fit to extend If it accepted the goods. I explained that the prolvalons. of the Act to include all the couple could not afford to Pay for goods. 2504 25114ASSEMBLY.1

The South Australian Bill was intro- in Committee duced by a private member, and one hon- The Chairman of Committees (Mr. 1. curable member, The Hon. B. H. Teusner, W. Manning) in the Chair; Mr. D. 0, MFy on the 30th October last year, had this to in charge of the Bill. say at page 1364 of the 1963 ilansard.- I think the time may come sooner Clause 1: Short title- or later when it may be necessary to go Mr. COURT: I have an amendment on even a step further. This legislation the notice paper. This amendment is applies only to the sales of books, Pic- necessary if my second one is to be agreed tures, and similar articles, but many to, and the second amendment provides high-pressure salesmen operate in that the Act shall come into force on a South Australia selling other articles, date to be fixed by proclamation. as household gadgets. such During the second reading of the Bill I have been in touch with several mem- I gave reasons for this amendment. I bers of the Victorian Government since have since conferred with the Minister the Act came into operation-it has only concerned in regard to being more specific been operating for the last 12 months-- in respect of time. He has expressed the and they are quite happy with the wary the view that the timne necessary to give notice legislation is working out in regard to to the trade in ample form and to have goods. the regulations drafted and promulgated If we restrict the definition of "goods" to would be three months; and I suggest we what is required by the Government then accept that period. To be more specific we will leave the housewife without much we could say the 28th February or the coverage, because the Minister has indi- 15th March. 1965. Having regard for the cated in his amendment that the Governor holidays that will be intervening, the 15th may make regulatons from time to time. I March would, perhaps, be the more appro- would say that if the provision were re- priate date. I do not suggest that as the versed and certain goads were exemptedj minimum date, but the latest one by which from the provisions, we would be going a the proclamation would be issued and the long way to assisting the people who are regulations promulgated to give effect to frustrated by high-pressure salesmen. the Bill in the form that we suggest. I Quite a lot will be said on this subject move an amendment- when we are in Committee. Page 1, line 7-Insert after the The Minister did mention the termina- section number 'I" the subsection tion clause. I point out that this matter designation "(1)". is provided for in the schedule which Amendment put and Passed. states that the agreement must be signed by the purchaser or the bailee. That is Mr. COURT: I move an amendment- quite definite. There are other similar Page I-Insert, before line 9, the amendments which will have to be looked following new subelause to stand as aLt. subelause (2): Commence- (2) This Act shall Most of the Government's amendments ment. some into operation are an extension of the Bill and not a restriction of it. As the Government is on a date to be fixed Prepared to extend the Bill quite con- by proclamation. siderably, I think It should go the whole I have already explained the significance way In extending the coverage of goods. of this amendment. It seems rather strange that we should have a terrific number of amendments to Mr. FLETCHER: Line 9 of the Bill the Bill, yet we restrict the provisions seems to terminate with the word "the". relating to goods. I am having difficulty in deciding where the amendment is to be inserted. I again thank all honourable members who contributed to the debate. I feel The CHAIRMAN (Mr. I. W. Manning): everybody agrees that this is a necessary it will go in before line 9; it will be in- social measure. I know there has been serted between lines 8 and 9. quite a spate of this type of selling during the past few weeks, and I point out, as Mr. FLETCHER: Thank you. other honourable members have done, Mr. D. 0. MAY: I agree with the Min- that recently such things as frocks, electric ister, but the date in March seems to be lights, vending machines, kitchenware, a considerable way off: I do not think and other items have been peddled around it would take that long for the necessary the suburban area. I think we should machinery to be put into motion for the extend the provisions of the Bill to cover purpose of the legislation. There are the present situation. I would like the many people who are waiting to see how Minister to give some thought to that the measure will be applied, and because aspect when the measure is In Committee. of the spate of selling that we have had Question Put and Passed. recently I hope the Minister will give consideration to expediting the Proclama- Bill read a, second time. tion date. [Wednesday, 11 November, 1964.1 202505

Mr. COURT: I make it quite clear that Government proposes to insert in the Bill the Government is also anxious for the in respect Of goods. I draw the honour- legislation to become effective, It is not able member's attention to the new defi- a question of trying to delay it, but in nition that is proposed, and I think he the Past there have been difficulties in would agree that it goes as far as any Par- the drafting of regulations. Rather than liament could reasonably be expected to indicate a tighter date, such as the middle go, and does place the government of the of January or February. I would prefer to day in a position to deal with the unex- play safe on behalf of the Minister who pected situation. Also, I have to fore- will deal with this legislation. I assure shadow other amendments whereby we the honourable member that the Minister take the eff ect of the Bill further than wants to get the measure operating as was intended by the honourable member. soon as possible, He only refers to the home, whereas we Amendment put and passed. intend that this shall apply to technical schools and places of employment. How- Clause, as amended, put and passed. ever, I do not want to elaborate on, that Clause 2: Interpretation- at the moment. Mr. COURT: I move an amendment- In view of the wide nature of goods as Page 2, line 17-Delete the passage: prescribed in the new amendment, after "1or this amendment is agreed to it will be necessary to remove paragraph (d); other- (d) any agreement which relates wise we could make the law almost un- to the disposition of an estate workable and, in fact, it could laugh at or interest in land:" itself. I have on the notice paper subsequent amendments in respect of the interpreta- Mr. FILETCHER: 1, too, am a little con- tion of "goods," and they are, to a large cerned about the deletion of this clause. extent, interrelated, By law, could land be interpreted to mean goods or articles? Having in mind the The honourable member has referred to fact that some astute business person the fact that the Government proposition might take this as being the legal inter- provides for the Bill to start with books, pretation, I think it is quite conceivable and then it includes machinery for the ex- that a legal interpretation would state that tension of the measure to en almost un- land does not constitute goods or an article. limited extent, by regulation, as circum- and as such the retention of the clause stances dictate. it is felt desirable to de- in the Bill would afford protection in land lete these words, and then later I will move sales or any interest in land. the insertion of a new definition of "goods." I also have in mind the impossible prices which people are being asked to I think I can demonstrate that the Goev- Pay for land even in areas which are well erment's intention is to make the Bill more flexible and more practical in its outside the metropolitan area in con- implementation so that it will achieve the sequence of the speculation that is associ- results the honourable member seeks, and ated with the sale of land. Therefore we perhaps something more. We do not want could well afford to retain this clause in to find later that we have something so the Bill in the event of its being found restrictive that it is impossible to achieve to be some protection against speculation our original objective. The small minority in land. If it is removed and subsequently with whom we are dealing would be only it Is found that land cannot be considered too pleased to take advantage of a loop- as being goods or an article, this clause hole in the law, but with the proposal we would afford some protection. have here, by regulation the government Mr. COURT: I sukgest that if the of the day would be in a position to deal honourable member for Fremantle looks with the situation without any delay. at the earlier part of the clause he will Mr. D. G. MAY: Whilst I do not oppose realise that the deletion of paragraph (d) the amendment, it should be pointed out will not weaken the clause, but strengthen that it would be hardly likely that high- it. This is part of a list of types of agree- pressure salesman would have anything to ments that are not covered by legislation, do with that type of transaction. Firstly. and it is important that the restriction they would encounter difficulty in the should be removed. Therefore, by delet- Titles Office and other places when ing paragraph (d) we arc strengthening attempting to finalise such a sale. There- rather than weakening the Position. fore I cannot understand why the dele- tion of this passage is necessary. It has Amendment put and passed. been working quite satisfactorily in Vic- Mr. COURT: I now come to the import- toria. I feel the Minister has not given ant amendment dealing with the definition sufficient explanation to justify the dele- of "goods". Honourabie members will see tion of this passage from the Bill. from the notice paper the definition as Mr. COURT: As I said earlier, it is im- contained in my amendment. That Is a possible to consider this amendment with- wide and far-reaching definition which out considering the new definition the we favour against the more restrictive one (90) 2506 (ASSEMBLY.]

set out in the Bill, We consider it would Further on in the amendments that are give greater flexibility to the government proposed, the following provision appears, of the day in administering this particular which shall be embodied in the regula- type Of law, bearing in mind that we are tions:- not out to bedevil the trader who is fair and The Governor may make any regu- just. We are trying to legislate lations necessary or convenient for against the smart fellow. It is better to leave the carrying this Act into effect and in government of the day in a Particular may make regulations for Position to handle the situation as and all or any of the following Purposes:- when it arrives. Therefore, T move an amendment-. (a) prescribing any articles to be Page 2, lines goods for the purposes of this 21 to 23-Delete the Act. interpretation of "goods", and sub- stitute the following interpretation:- If we were to turn that Provision around in relation to the interpretation of goods "goods" means any books or parts as Set Out in the Bill and, with the ap- of a book, or engravings, proval of the Governor, exempt any article lithography or Pictures or any from this provision, we would achieve the other like matter whether intention of the Minister. If. in the case illustrated or not and includes of selling goods, we were to exempt certain any articles prescribed to be articles, we would achieve the same object, goods for the purposes of this but would still give full coverage to allow Act: the householder to know where he stands. Mr. D. 0. MAY: I must oppose this If a great deal of publicity were given to amendment from the outset, because this is the selling of a certain item and its exemp- one of the amendments I am not happy tion was justified we would be giving the with. I have not been convinced by the ex- Public what it requires. Planation given by the Minister. I have I would like the Minister to have a look discussed this provision with the Minister at this because for people who are frus- in another place and the same interpreta- trated by high-pressure salesmen it is very tion was given by him, as was given by the difficult to understand what is going on. Minister for Industrial Development. Over We have gone a long way in accepting the the past 21 years I have acquired a great amendment relating to the Period of seven deal of knowledge of these eases as be- days. Why not go the whole way and tween the housewife or householder and exempt certain goods which we feel could the People who are selling the goods, and be exempted from the provisions of the if we are going to extend the Bill we have Bill? I oppose the amendment. to make it one which will be clearly under- stood by the ordinary person. Mr. TOMS: I argee with the sentiments expressed by the honourable member for If we accept the Interpretation as pro- posed by the Minister Canning. The definition in the amend- we are getting away ment Proposed from the whole purpose of the Bill. In by the Minister rather this State, at the limits the scope, and restricts this legis- moment, salesmen who lation to Penny dreadfuls and similar are selling books are in the minority, but there is a definite articles. It relates only to books and asso- spate of selling of other ciated Publications. types of goods. High-pressure salesmen selling books have been the subject of so In these days complaints are often made much Publicity that there has been a de- of the practices indulged in by door-to- finite falling-off of their activities. The door salesmen. Some salesmen go around housewife has become so conversant with selling electrical equipment and similar this type of salesman she is now fully types of articles, and for that reason the aware of what to expect when a sales- definition should be much wider than that man comes to her door. It is the other Proposed in the amendment before us. type of salesman about whom I am wor- ried. This is the salesman who has been With the Passage of legislation govern- operating in the Eastern States but who, ing door-to-door sales, the average house- finding that the sales have reached satura- wife thinks adequate protection is pro- tion Point there, has transferred his ac- vided in respect of all types of goods. tivities to Western Australia. However, the definition in the amendment limits the type of goods to books and If we intend to amend the Bill as I- associated articles. dicated by the Minister we should go the whole Way. If the Minister considers that The Minister should realise that door- his amendment is necessary, there is the to-door salesmen offer many other types possibility that we could reverse the pro- of goods than books. He should be agree- cedure proposed in the amendment. I1feel able to a wider definition. Complaints that if we were to provide that goods have been made of sales of articles like shall include all chattels other than live- washing machines by high-pressure sales- stock; that goods include any fixtures and men to housewives. Under the definition realty we Possibly could, later in the in the amendment this type of goods amendments, Provide for exemptions. would not be covered. [Wednesday, 11 Novemrber, 1964.] 250750

Mr. PLETCHER: The amendment of the Mr. COURT: The Government's amend- Minister covers books and allied articles, ment gives the definition of "goods" a tre- but it is rather tenuous when we have in mendous scope. The honourable member mind the coverage of high-pressure sales for Fremantle and others who spoke before of many other types of articles. The him gave the impression that it is a very definition in the amendment is too limited. limited amendment; on the contrary, in In the motion previously introduced by practical eff ect it could go f urther than the the honourable member for Canning, definition in the Bill. under the definition of "goads" all types of articles were included, to cope with The sponsor of the Bill suggested that malpractices which have been adopted by wve should reverse the procedure by add- some door-to-door salesmen. ig, and then making deletions. That is well-nigh impossible. In dealing with this I refer to the case of a pensioner who type of legislation, such as in the days of paid a weekly rental of 12s. 6d. on a Price control, it was found from experience television set. When he expressed dissatis- that it was easier to add to than to make faction the firm sent out another set with deletions. If we started off with an all- mare papers for signing. Instead of being embracing definition and tried to take out charged 12s. 6d. a week, he found he was some types of goods, we would have a committed to £4-odd a month. never-ending list which should not come under the control of the legislation. I am also aware of another similar inci- dent relating to the sale of a piano under Mr. D. 0. May: Don't you think we hire purchase. Pianos are included in the should be more concerned about the Public definition of "goods" in the Bill, but not in than with administrative difficulties? that appearing in the amendment before us. An invalid pensioner who had one of Mr. COURT: As a Government we have her legs amputated was visited by a door- to have some regard for the smooth run- to-door salesman, who talked her into ning of trade. In this legislation we are not impossible financial commitments for the after the legitimate trader or salesman who hire purchase of a piano. The papers were conducts a legitimate business in a legiti- signed in haste, without study, and the mate Manner. We are after the door-to- door salesman who dodges the law and piano was delivered. takes the purchaser down. With the ex- Some months later the ostensibly new panded definition of goods, as proposed in piano was found to have a structural fault, the amendment, some of the circumstances and an expert was called in. He discovered which could arise-and these are unpre- the instrument was not new, and had been dictable when some people try to pull a repaired previously. This lady demanded a smart trick-could be coped with by the new piano, but she was told she had signed simple expediency of promulgating a regu- for the one that had been deliveired and lation. If the regulation is regarded as too the condition of the piano was attributed severe Parliament has a remedy, because it to carelessness on her part, I was called can be dealt with through the disallowance into the case to try to retrieve the and amendment Procedures. position. I found the piano was not in the The Government felt that instead of house, but had been taken away for repairs. coming down with too heavy a hand, and The lady demanded another piano, and she possibly interfering with legitimate busi- refused to pay. niess, it was better to deal with the matter in the way proposed in the amendment: Some months passed, without the instal- that is, firstly to deal with the main prob- ments, being paid, and on investigation I lem of books and associated articles, and found that as a consequence of interest then in the light of experience to deal with and the penalty clauses in the agreement the other situations. Once an illegitimate she owed More. I rang the vendor who trader knows that this legislation is on the stated that the matter was out cif his Statute book and that a remedy is avail- hands, because a hire-purchase company able to the Minister, he will think twice had acquired the debt. The vendor did before embarking on an unethical sales not want the instrument back, nor did the scheme. I think it is much better to leave hire-purchase company. The lady in Ques- the matter flexible as proposed by the tion was hounded for Payment for an Government so that legitimate trade can instrument which had been taken away for flow. Then if we find illegitimate trade repairs. Everyone regretted that she had develops we can deal wvith it quickly and signed the papers. effectively. The definition in the Bill would cover Mr. D. G. May: Like the Minister, I do transactions of that type, but the defini- not desire to labour this particular clause tion in the amendment will not until but would point out that the definition of pianos are Prescribed. Parliamentarians "1goods" which I have included has, been should not become involved in this type of in operation in Victoria for 12 months and. case. If the Bill is passed in its present from the correspondence I have received, I form parliamentarians will not he so have ascertained it is operating very well. harassed, because the range of goods will I cannot see the Minister's reasoning on be widened. this matter. I say right at the outset that 2508 2508ASSEMBLY.) if this amendment is adopted, regulations Education Act, 1928, and a will have to be introduced immediately for school registered as an effici- frocks, vending machines, kitchenware, and ent school under that Act, at so on. My proposition is a much better which the purchaser or bailee one than that suggested by the Minister. is a student: One minute the Minister talks about "the bailee" in relation to a credit administration difficulties and the next purchase agreement means the minute he immediately makes difficulties. person to whom goods are All this session I have listened to Ministers bailed under the agreement; introduce Hills and many times it has been said, "Let us see how it works. This "the purchaser" in relation to a is new legislation." I know that numbers credit Purchase agreement are what count: but, by the same token, if means the Person to whom it is good enough for a Minister to make goods are sold or agreed to that proposition, surely it is good enough be sold under the agreement; for someone in opposition to do likewise This amendment is self-explanatory. Later and ask honourable members to give it a on, "place of employment" is to be added go! and this will further extend it. The Minister should give this a lot of Mr. D. G. MAY: I am not opposing this thought because, as I have said, it has amendment, because it will extend the worked very well in the Victorian legisla- provisions of the Bill. However, I would tion. If It is necessary to alter it later on, point out that over the last few years no we have the power to do so. Therefore I reports have been received concerning strongly oppose the amendment, I hope salesmen interfering at technical schools that honourable members will vote accord- or places of employment, although it could ing to their consciences. I know that some occur. However, a lot of literature has of them have received inquiries on this been sent by the Education Department matter from people in their electorates. advising parents that these salesmen are Amendment put and a division taken operating and claiming that they have with the following result:- been authorised by the Education Depart- Ayes-21. ment to sell certain types of literature. Mr. Bovell Mr. Hutchinson M~r. Burt Mr. Lewis The reason "bailee" and "purchaser" Mr. Court Mr. W. A. Manning were not included In my Bill was that Mr. Craig Mr. Mitchell Mr. Crommella Mr. Haider I included "vendor", which means a person Mr. Dunn Mr. Nimmo by whom, or on whose behalf, the goods Mr. Garter Mr. Runciman are bailed or sold. As I have said, I have Mr. Orayden Mr. Wild no opposition to the amendment. Mr. Guthrie Mr. Williams Mr. Hart Mr. O'Nel Amendment put and passed. Dr. Henn (TCZiCT ) Noes-22 Clause, as amended, put and passed. Mr. Bickerton Mr. Kelly Mr. Brady Mr. n. a. May Clause 3: Credit purchase aigreement to Mr. Cornell Mr. Moir be in writing, etc.- Mr. Davies Mr. Norton Mr. Evans Mr. Oldfield Mr. COURT: I move an amendment- Mr. Pletcher Mr. Rhatigan Mr. Hall Mr. Howberry Page 3, line 3-Insert after the word Mr'. Hawke Mr. Sewell "residence" a passage as follows:-"-. Mr. Heal Mr. Toms Mr. W. Hegney Mr. Tonikin at his Place of employment or at any Mr. Jamieson Mr. H. May technical school", This is self -explanatory and ties in with Pairs the definition of "technical school," Ayes Noes Mr. Brand Mr. Grahama Amendment put and passed. Mr. O'Connor Mr. J. Hegney Mr. Hearman Mr. Ouraen Clause, as amended, put and Passed. Majority against-i. Clause 4: Power to terminate certain Amendment thus negatived. credit purchase agreements- Mr. COURT: I move an amendment- Mr. COURT: I move an amendment- Page 2-Add, before lie 29, the Page 3, line 20--Insert after the word "residence" the passage ". at following Interpretations:- his place of employment or at any "technical school" means a school technical school". for technical instruction whe- ther under the control of the Amendment put and passed. State Department of Educa- tion or otherwise, at which Mr. COURT: I move an amendment- the Purchaser or bailee is a Page 3. line 20-Insert after the student and includes a Uni- word "terminated" the Passage "by versity, Government school, the purchaser or the bailee, as the within the meaning of the case may require.". [Wednesday, 11 November, 1964.] 2509

Mr. D). G. MAY: This is only an exten- (c) it Provides that a dealer, sion to the Bill as it is now drafted. I or any person acting, or would point out that this is already pro- purporting to act, on be- vided for in the appendix in the schedule half of the vendor in to the Bill. I have no objection to the connection with or in the amendment, because I suppose it makes it course of any negotia- clearer. tion. transaction, or deal- Amendment put and passed. ing leading to the entering into or making Clause, as amended, put and passed. of the agreement or the Clause 5 put and passed. making of the offer is or is not, or is or is not to Clause 6: Act not to be applicable to be treated as, or declares agreements initiated at the request of the a dealer or any such purchaser or bailee- person to be or not to be, Mr. COURT: I move an amendment- the agent or servant of the vendor or to be act- Page 5, line I-Insert after the word ing under the authority "bailee" the passage ", his place of of the vendor; employment or at any technical school, (d) it provides or declares as the case may be,". that a dealer, or any This is a consequential amendment. person acting, or pur- porting to act, on behalf Amendment put and passed. of the vendor in connec- tion with or in the course Mr. COURT: I move an amendment- of any negotiation, tranls- Page 5, line 3-Insert after the word action, or dealing leading 'residence" the passage ", his place of to the entering into or employment or at any technical school, making of the agree- as the case may be,". ment or the making of the offer- This, too, is a consequential amendment. (I) called on the pur- Amendment put and passed. chaser or bailee or Clause, as amended, carried out, effec- put and passed. ted. or took part in New clause 7- any such negotia- tion, transaction, Mr. COURT: I move- or dealing at the Page 5-Insert after clause 6 the request of the pur- following new clause:- chaser or bailee: or '7. (1) A provision, term, con- (ii) is, or shall be dition, or covenant in an agree- treated as being, ment to which this Act applies, the agent of the or in any offer to enter into or purchaser or bailee. make, or relating to the entering or authorised by into or making of, such an agree- the Purchaser or ment, or In any other docu- bailee to make to ment to which the purchaser or the vendor any ballee under such an agreement offer on behalf of is a party, is void if- the Purchaser or (a) it excludes, limits, modi- bailee: fies, or restricts the right (e) it relieves the vendor to terminate the agree- from liability for any ment conferred by this act or default of the Act on the Purchaser or vendor or any other per- bailee; son acting in connection (b) it Provides or declares with or in the course of that the agreement or any negotiation, trans- offer- action, or dealing leading to the entering into. (1) was, or is to be making, signing, or ac- treated as having ceptance of the agree- been: or ment or offer: (ii) was not, or is to Cf) it Provides or declares be treated as not that the agreement or having been, offer- entered into, made, (I) is, or is not: or signed, or accepted at 04i) is or is not to be any Particular place: treated as being. [ASSEMBLY.)

subject to, or enforceable Report in accordance with, the Bill reported,' with amendments, and the law of any particular repoirt adopted. State or Territory of the Commonwealth or of any ANNUAL ESTIATES, 1964-65 Place outside the Com- monwealth: in Committee of Supply (g) it provides or declares Resumed from the 4th November, the (either expressly or 1w- Chairman of Committees (Mr. 1. W. Man- pliedly) that any war- ning) in the Chair. ranty, Privilege, right, or Vote: Legislative Council. £18,612.- protection to the benefit of which the purchaser MR. HART (Roe) (10.40 P.m.]: There or bailee would or might are several points I would like to raise otherwise be entitled by on the general debate on the Estimates, virtue of the provisions, and the first two are mainly concerned effect, or operation of any with the Minister for Health and his de- law (other than this Act) partment. Firstly, I should like to com- or of any rule of law is mend the work that the Minister has done waived, abridged, aban- during the year; and I listened with in- doned, excluded, limited, terest to the remarks made regarding the modified, or restricted; or progress achieved, particularly in regard (h) It excludes, limits, modi- to the commencement of new hospitals fies, or restricts the effect and the improvement of existing hospitals or operation of all or any throughout the State. I think we all take of the Provisions of this pride in the fact that many new hospitals Act. have been erected in Western Australia, (2) Where any agreement, offer, from the north to the south. However, or document referred to in sub- the first point I wish to raise concerns section (1) of this section con- the school dental service in country dis- tains a provision, term, condition, tricts. I think this is one aspect of the or covenant that is void under Minister's department which needs a little that subsection, the vendor under improvement and for which more money the agreement is guilty of an could be allocated. this Act. offence against The CHAIRMAN (Mr. I. W. Manning): Penalty: Two hundred pounds. Order! There is too much conversation I explained the significance of this, and and we are having great difficulty in hear- the new clause which I Propose to move ing the honourable member. after this is agreed to, during the second reading. Some of the provisions are con- Mr. HART: The number of dental clinics sequential on the amendments that have visiting schools may not have lessened but already been made. considerable progress has been made with New clause put and passed. country schools throughout the State in that many of them have been increased New clause 8- in size: more classrooms have been built. Mr. COURT: I move- and more children have to be catered for. Insert after new clause 7 the follow- Unfortunately, we all know that the ing new clause:- condition of the teeth of Western Aus- 8. The Governor may make tralian children, in the main, is very bad. any regulations necessary or con- I do not want to stress that point too much, venient for carrying this Act into but it is a fact that our children's teeth effect and in particular may make need a good deal of attention, and parents regulations for all or any of the who live in small country centres removed following purposes- from resident dentists find the problem difficult to cope with. In November 1962 (a) prescribing any articles 1 was advised by the Minister for Health to be goods for the pur- that of the 13 mobile dental clinics oper- poses of this Act; ated by the department five were laid up (b) exempting from the pro- because of a lack of dentists. I was also visions of this Act any advised by the Minister that every effort goods or any goods the was being made to get more dentists. Purchase price of which is not in excess of an I have wvatched the position since that amount Prescribed; time and I know that every effort is being (c) imposing Penalties not ex- wade to improve the service. However, ceeding fifty pounds for the position in August of this year. almost twvo years later, is that this section or breach of any regulation. the department still has only 13 units, two New clause put and passed. of which are laid up because of a lack Schedule put and passed. of dental Personnel, despite the fact that Title put and passed. many more schools have been commenced [Wednesday, 11 November, 1964.1 251121

and there are many more children to be A further point I wish to make also attended to. I understand it is depart- concerns the Minister for Health, I am mental policy to try to visit country schools very pleased in some ways that I have at least once in every two years. I put these two points of importance to put to it to you, Mr. Chairman, and to the Min- the Minister for Health, because I re- ister: Surely that is the very minimum. member seeing that he is the best spender we have. In August of this year 123 country schools had been waiting over two years Mr. Ross Hutchinson: Education beats for a visit while 35 had been waiting over rae. three years and 50 had been waiting over Mr. HART: The Minister seems to have four years. I emphasise that to show a lot of money, and I appreciate that he that this service is really falling down on has a lot to do with it. The next point its job a little; and, to emphasise the I want to make, however, is that concern- serious position regarding children's teeth, ing country hospitals and the problem of I would like to quote what Dr. Peverill staffing;, of getting nurses for these hos- of the Perth Dental Hospital told me about pitals. Several country hospitals have 12 months ago. At that time I was con- raised the Point with me, and they main- cerned about teeth and what he said to tain that the local chairman of the hos- me on that occasion brought forcibly home pital board, and the matrons of the to me the bad condition, generally speak- hospitals, have a very great load to carry ing, of children's teeth. He told me that in their endeavours to keep these hospitals he had carried out a special survey of 900 going. Perhaps some bigger incentive children to see what children's teeth gen- could be given to the nurses who go to erally were like. He took a cross-section the country, and perhaps they could be of children. required to stay there for a certain period. In that cross-sectional survey of .900 I wonder whether something cannot be children in the 6 to 15 year age group done to have a survey made to see wheth- it was found that 6,750 teeth needed at- er sufficient nurses are being trained to tention. I was also told at that time that keep pace with the requirements of country that particular group of children 'were hospitals, and the ever-increasing demands above average in their general health and being made for nurses by new hospitals so on, I now come back to the position that are being established. These must of the dental clinics in our country schools be taking a lot of extra nurses; and the and I would ask the Minister to have a look question asked is whether enough nurses at this to see what can be done to estab- are being trained. Something should be lish a visit at least once in two years for done to alleviate the burden that is being all classes. I would point out here that placed on the hospital boards and the it is not a question of finance; it is a matrons of country hospitals-particularly question of getting the dentists. the smaller country hospitals. I would be glad if the Minister would have a look It is very difficult for these people at this, and check up to see if a survey to come down to the city, because when cannot be undertaken to establish wheth- they do they first have to make an ap- er sufficient nurses are being trained to pointment, and after having their teeth keep pace with the demand from country seen to they then have to make a series hospitals. of further appointments. That is quite I would now like to refer a couple of impossible for people who live out in the matters to the Minister for Native Wel- country areas. Those who live perhaps fare. First of all I must commend the 60 or 70 miles from the larger country work he is doing. I have a great admira- towns where there is a resident dentist tion for what he is doing. He is facing also have the same trouble. They make up to a terrific task which involves all appointments and travel in with the family sorts of pressure groups, some resisting and lose a day. The dentist looks at the and others helping. There is no doubt teeth in question and then says that that that overall tbe picture is certainly im- is all he can do for the present, and that proving. The point I wish to make they must come back in a fortnight's time. concerns the problem that exists in many of our great southern country towns It is most important that the service particularly with regard to the employ- given by the school dental clinic should ment of young coloureds after they leave he stepped up. I would quote the case school. The fact is that the educational of the south-eastern wheatbelt, where facilities have been improved considerably there is a resident dentist at Katanining. for these young coloureds, and due to: He is the only dentist there. The Perth these improved conditions they are able Dental Hospital clinic gets around fairly to attend the various schools. We now frequently to the larger towns, but it does have the position where they are being not visit the smaller schools and, as I have fairly well educated in a number of our said,. the smaller schools are missing out schools in the lower great southern towns, rather badly. I would accordingly ask the but the problem is to know what to do Minister to try to improve that service. with them after they leave school. [A.SSEMBLY.]

I believe that the question of employ- I have read that letter to emphasise the mient for these young people after they point I am trying to make: namely, that leave school is something on which we we must get some new line of thought must develop a completely new line of in keeping with present-day educational thought if we are to cope with it. I standards to help these young coloured would quote the case of a town like Guowv- people find employment after they leave angerup, which is pretty well known, and school. They are pretty healthy, active, has a large coloured population. The and strong; but they do not seem to be junior high school at Onowangerup has able to make any headway; and I hope the approximately 470 scholars of whom 120 Minister and his department will do all are coloured. There are 63 pupils in the they can to assist these young people to post-primary classes of whom nine are find jobs after they leave school. I must coloured; and I would point out here that say that I acknowledge the great efforts the top girl of the school, who hopes to and achievements of the Minister. He take her Jlunor this year, is also coloured. certainly has made a great deal of Pro- The point I am trying to make is what gress. The question of employment, how- these children are going to do for em- ever, is becoming worse, particularly for ployment once they leave school. these young people who are leaving school. I have a letter which was sent to me by I would now like to touch on the ques- the Onowangerup Shire Council. I think tion of water supplies. I have been trying this letter amply covers the points I am to get better water supplies for our eastern trying to make, and it may be as well if wheatbelt country towns, particularly I ran through it. The shire council points those beyond the comprehensive scheme. out that there appears to be a grossly in- I must say that there has been quite an adequate effort to train young coloureds improvement in a number of places over to be useful citizens; and it adds that em- the last few years, and a number of small ployment opportunities in these areas for local water supplies have been installed. young males are next to non-existent, If the Government can continue as it has while the opportunity for the employment been doing over the last couple of years, of young females is completely non- it will bring to the small country towns existent. There are in that town a pretty something which they have urgently re- large group of young people who are fairly quired for many years past. well educated compared with what they were a few years ago. We have made that I would commend the Minister for the advancement, but these Young People are number of water supplies that have been in their most formative years, and they installed in the outback areas. I think are being trained to live on unemploy- honourable members would be surprised if ment benefits. The end result of this sort they knew just how many have been in- of environment is to produce a not incon- stalled. I do not know the total number. siderable core of useless individuals. although I do know those that have been installed in my area. In some of these Those are the conditions which con- towns, which are very small-not much front these unfortunate people. It is a larger than villages--their first and most simple matter to condemn their mode of urgent need is a supply Of Water, and they living, but I point out that only an indi- are being helped to some extent in this vidual of extraordinary character can regard. emerge from the squalor and social back- ground with which these folk have to I now want to touch briefly on a point contend. The council stresses the point raised the other night by the honourable that for many years it has recommended member for Avon. He put forward the the establishment of farm training centres idea that we should have an agricultural of several thousand acres, not merely to authority set up on a State-wide basis to train the People to be farm labourers or advise and promote our great potential in domestic servants but to train them in a the agricultural field. I do not wish to variety of occupations. speak in detail on this matter, because it The council contends that such re- has been covered very well by the hon- serves would provide scope for training and ourable member for Avon. He spoke at would to some extent great length on this point. I am sure that be self-supporting: such an authority would but the department, whilst condemning be of great assist- such Proposals as smacking of segregation, ance to the Government in its future Plan- is Prepared to herd these People on to ning, and especially in assisting it to put small reserves, within small townsites, forward the claims of Western Australia. with all the attendant lack of objective- At present our Department of Agriculture ness which is now obvious. The council is starved for finance, and the Federal is emphatic that in addition to farm authorities must be convinced of this fact. training centres some real effort must In making that statement I am not in be made to locate the majority of any way endeavouring to criticise the natives within, or contiguous to, large Minister or the men in his department centres of population where the people for what they are doing. I think they are can be housed and be trained to take their doing a particularly good job. I have been place in the community as self-reliant to many field days and the young men in citizens. the department that are coming forward [Wednesday, 11 November, 1964.] 2613

are doing a tremendous job; but I make on our doorsteji. We cannot ease up; w& the statement that we need a lot more must go forward with this demand and money in the light of the fact that W.A. is learn to cope with it. a tremendously big place and very wide- spread. We all know what development is I feel there is no better way to do this taking place in Western Australia. than to bring into being an overall authority. We have a Department of In- Getting back to the authority recom- dustrial Development and also a Tourist mended by the honourable member for Development Authority. We probably have' Avon, it would be of great benefit to our others about which I have not ifiqulred.. various departments in giving well co- However, I know that both of the dejizy)t-- ordinated advice on problems associated ments I have mentioned with have strongly what they are trying to do. On the proved their worth regarding the develop- Question of finance, we saw last year where ment of the the particular spheres in which Department of Agriculture was criti- they are interested. Therefore I strongly cised by the Loan Council because it spent urge this Government to set up an overall a little more money than was apparently agricultural development and promotion spent before. In my opinion, it is ridicu- authority which I feel louls would be the best to say that the expenditure by this means of furthering the objective we have department should stay at a pegged level. before us. At the present time the Department of Agriculture is trying to cope with all that MR. SEWELL (Geraldton) [11.5 pm.]: is taking place in Western Australia. At In rising to speak on these Estimates, first present the professional officers on the Of all I would like to quote some figures field staff number about 46. There are supplied by the Department of Agriculture 39 non-professional officers, and 25 general through the Oeraldton advisory district. advisers throughout the agricultural areas. These figures have been compiled from When we remember the vastness of West- statistics supplied by the Bureau of Census ern Australia, we must appreciate, on that and Statistics in Perth under the authority score alone, how inadequate 25 general of Mr. G. L. Throssell, the officer in charge advisers must be. at Geraldton. I do this to show honour- able members the progress that has been Western Australia is now a big agri- made in the district in the cultural State and many of our develop- last 12 months. mental problems are far beyond the This area comprises the shire councils of capacity of any one department to cope Geraldton-Greenough, Chapman Valley. with. By that I mean there is a need for Northampton, Mullewa, Morawa. Perenjori, a co-ordinating overall authority to dove- Three Springs, Mingenew. and Irwin, and tail activities and look back at these par- the area given is 13,087,360 acres. Anyone ticular problems from a top level, or have who is familiar with the districts at all a bird's eye view of them, in an effort to knows the best land was taken up some try to solve them. It is something that years ago and cleared; and, In later years, is beyond a particular department. the development has been in scrub country or sandplain country. I intend Another point is this: We must remem- to quote certain figures because I think ber that agriculture in Western Australia they are most important. owes a lot to men engaged in scientific Most of this research; and the further development of district is represented by the Premier; some by the Minister for' this State will be greatly dependent on Education; and some these men and other economic advisers. is in the electorate I Of Geraldton. The increase of land cleared consider a summary of their opinions during the should be available to the Government; year 1963-64 was 1,456,475 acres, which is an increase of 62.4 per cent. and that could best be effected by the Active rural authority recommended. holdings increased by 135, representing 10.1 per cent. Established In advocating and supporting the idea pastures are something, which You. Mr. that has been put forward for this over- Chairman, would regard as an important all authority, I feel that unless it is done item, particularly in the years to come. many of our departments will find them- because of the proposed establishment of selves snowed down, if one could put it abattoirs at Geraldton. We know that that way. With the progress that is being without Proper established Pastures we made departments will have to have a lot cannot do very much in the matter of get- more top-level advice and co-ordinated ting stock. advice or they will have to slow down a Established Pastures little increased by 459,851 bit. They have made tremendous acres; and top-dressed Pastures showed an strides forward over the last five or six increase of 193,842 acres. The years; sheep popu- but what they have started is now lation increase was 553,549 heads: while catching Up With them. The demand for the increase for lambs was the release of further 163,707. The land in Western Aus- wool clip was 6,461,580 lb.: Wile the tralia is unequalled in the State's history. average clip per head was The number 9.2 lb., or an in- of inquiries and applicants crease of 0.7 lb. This could have been due for land have been Pointed out recently to seasonal conditions, and we must take as most farmer advantage of the demand honourable members would know; but it 2514 [ASSEMBLY.) could prove that better husbandry has Last week I asked the minister- been going on in the area, and they are What amount of money was ex- going in more for pasture and obtaining pended by the Midland Railway Com- more wool per head of sheep. The increase pany for the Purpose of maintaining in cattle was 9,969, and in pigs it was the permanent way betwveen Midland 4,757. Junction and Walkaway for the the twelve months to the 1st July, In regard to the figures I have just 1963. quoted, we have a long way to go in order The answver to that question was- to bring them up to anything like a satis- factory level for the establishment of the Maintenance of permanent abattoirs, although the abattoirs would have a call on a far larger district than way, including sleeper re- that which I mentioned in my opening newals ... 193,163 remarks. Maintenance of bridges and culverts . .. 8,499 In dealing wvith the railways, an in- Re-laying with new 63 lb. teresting situation has arisen in the last rails- couple of years. First of all there has It is nice to knowv that they put in 63 lb. been an improvement in the whole system rails. Continuing- in the northern area, mainly on account (294,427, less credit for sale of the introduction of the diesel engines of old rails, £19,957) -.. 74,470 and the Improvements which were made to them after they nearly proved the Total .... £276,132 ruination of the country when they were put in service some few years ago. I My second question was- understand they are now giving satisfac- How much money has been ex- tory service: and the purchase of rolling pended by the W.A.O.R. on the same stock and engines has certainly helped a section since the takeover of the line lot. by the Government? The answer to that question was- I understand a cutting has been put in £ two miles out of Mullewa. Although I have Maintenance of permanent not seen it, I have it on the best authority way, including sleeper re- that the Railways Department and the newals ..... 27,166 contractors concerned have made an ex- Maintenance of bridges and cellent job of that cutting. The line has culverts . . 1,048 been lowered considerably; and it will Re-laying - .. .. 10,394 make a wonderful difference to train crews in pulling heavy loads out of the Total £..1380608 townsite and railway station at Mullewa. This job has been needed for quite a num- My third question was- ber of years, and apparently it is now com- What expenditure is anticipated by pleted in what I understand to be a very the Government to bring the men- satisfactory manner. We know from the tioned Permanent way up to the stan- Minister in this House that it is proposed dard required by the W.A.G.R. for the to go on with the reconditioning of the purpose of main line traffic for the Geraldton-Mullewa-Morawa line to carry years ended the 30th June, 1965, and the iron ore which we hope to get from June, 1966? Koolanooka hills next year. The answer was most interesting, and it is as follows:- I would now like to make reference to Estimated expenditure for 1964-65 the Purchase of the Midland railway line is:- which, I understand, was taken over by £ the W.A.G.R. on the 1st August of this Maintenance of permanent year. It would seem to me that in some way, including sleeper re- regards the Government has saddled the newals ...... 1., 137,475 W.A.G.R. with another white elephant. I Maintenance and renewal of am referring to the costs which were re- bridges and culverts . 3,750 quired to put that line in a suitable work- Re-laying .. .. .150,000 ing condition. I understand from the 1 take it they would be 60 lb. rails- Minister concerned and from officers of Reballasting ...... -. 50,000 the Railways Department that the staff New bridge at Upper Swan . .. 30,000 of the ex-Midland Railway Company are working well with the W.A.G.R. I under- Total E.311,225 stand that they are giving satisfaction generally; and it bears out what I said last That amount of money, together with the year when certain Predictions were made amount spent by the Midland Railway in regard to trouble and strife, that it Company the previous year seems to be would be only a matter of time and a lot of money to be spent so early on patience and all these things would work what should have been classed as a main themselves out. line. [Wednesday, 11 November, 1964.1 2515 '

Mr. Court: That was all provided for of the bar so that the port will be capable when we submitted it to Parliament. of taking the larger vessels which will be Mr. SEWELL: It is all to the good if calling to take away the various products it was, but it would seem to me that of the area. the Midland Railway Company did not The subject of water supplies is not only do so bady out of the deal. As far as a hardy annual as far as Western Aus- the railway system itself is concerned, I tralia as a whole is concerned, but it is think it will be. without question, a bene- also a particularly tough one for Gerald- fit to the people along the line, and it ton. We have not received any sat- will certainly be an advantage to the isfactory indication from the Govern- department in regard to staff, train crews. ment as to its intentions. I asked the and those in the goods sheds at the ter- Minister some Questions with regard to minus at Geraldton. the proposed abattoir and the service along For a great number of years a good Edward Road to Narngulu. He stated that deal of trouble has occurred in one way the proposed works would not be started and another, and it always seemed that for a while and that in the initial stages the company had the best end of the deal the water would come from Wicherina. while the W.A.G.R. was doing the work This will be all to the good at this stage, and getting nothing for it. However we because the People who live along Edward can thank our lucky stars that the com- Road, will at least, after all these years. pany is out of the picture now and the receive a water supply. That area is badly department has taken over completely. It in need of water and it is an area which seems to have set its sights at making a would grow, not first-class main line from Midland to straightaway as far as Oeraldton for which we can be very residents are concerned, but it is a very thankful. suitable area for gardeners. The bus service has continued to An amount of £25,000 has been listed for operate and my experience up to date has Geraldton, and beside this amount is an been that It is a very good and efficient explanation that this is for the Wicherina service. Of course, we do hear of bore which is the existing water supply. grumbles over this and that from people This indicates that the Allanooka area sup- In various Parts of Australia; but I think ply will be delayed for some time. I would that, In the main, the public generally ap- like to say now that I have watched the preciates the job being done. water supply position in Geraldton very The next subject about which I wish closely over a great number of years and to speak Is the Oeraldton Harbour. Hion- anyone interested in geology and earth for- ourable members will, of course, have mation, etc., would find it a very interest- heard quite a lot about the Oeraldton ing subject. I am sure that the Informa- Harbour over the last 12 months. At tion obtained by the officers up there has this time last year a motion was before been collated and recorded, but it is in- the House in connection with proposed teresting to know the amount of water improvements and dredging. AUi sorts of taken from the bores up there. people in Geraldton were trying to get on to the band wagon and were making all These bores are comparatively shallow. kinds of suggestions as to how the work being only about 200 feet deep, and at the should be done. peak period two Years ago, 1,000,000 gal1- The bar outside the harbour in the lons a day were being used. I understand ocean is still the main trouble and I that amount has increased considerably understand the Government has called since then. Anyone with any experience tenders all over the world for the removal of bore water-and particularly shallow of the bar. Whether or not it is removed bores-will realise that that is a mighty satisfactorily, we know that the port of amount of water to come out of the ground. Oeraldton will continue to function al- I do not want honourable members to though not as we would wish it to; and think that the water is artesian or sub- the town and the district generally will artesian. It is more or less surface water. continue to thrive. Even though I may be criticised in some Last year the Treasurer made available quarters in Geraldton for saying so, I be- for harbour improvements-that is, dredg- lieve we have been very fortunate over ing inside the harbour and the harbour the years that the water was discovered basin, which is quite separate from the and that the supply has continued. We bar outside-an amount of £240,757. This wonder sometimes just how much longer year an amount of £269,000 has been set the supply will remain, especially when aside for that work. It would seem to we take into consideration the growth of me that would be a reasonably satisfactory the town and district. figure considering the fact that a lot of As far as the Programme is concerned. the dredging has been done and the earth 1 think it is quite satisfactory in the main. works or the back filling of the new berth I know what the planning would be as is in progress. We only hope that the far as Allanooka and Dongara are con- work will continue expeditiously and that cerned, but it would seem to me that the a satisfactory price will be tendered, either sum of £40,000 in 1964-65 is too small an overseas or in Australia, for the removal amount to be set aside. That is the amount 2516 2516(ASSEMBLY.]

which will be spent on the Alianooka- Minister for Lands spent a great many of Narngulu water supply. Allanooka is ap- his Younger Years in Geraldton and would proximately 35 miles from Geraldton east appreciate the improvements. of WValkaway on what is called the Burma Mr. Bovell: And very happy Years they Road. An amount of £1,120,000 has been were too! allocated for that water supply and this will include the installation of machinery Mr. SE WELL: The Gerald ton High and pumps, and the supply of electricity School is a credit to the architects and from the Geraldton coun- builders. There have been additions to which will come the school, and I can tell the Minister for cil. Th2 Deputy Leader of the Opposi- Education that we are now getting used to tion will retail that when he was Minister the last addition to this school and it now for Water Supplies he was responsible, does not seem quite so bad. A high school following representations from me, for that hostel was recently erected, and also a area being tested to ascertain what water junior high school at Northampton. I was in the basin. should mention the facilities which are It would appear that the bores are quite provided by the sisters of the Presentation satisfactory; and this Government, pro- Convent Order in Geraldton. The convent poses to continue with the practice. For there is an excellent one and pupils come 1964-65 there is an amount of £40,000 set long distances to attend. There are also aside; for 1965-66 the amount is £441,000; excellent facilities at St. Patrick's College for 1966-67 the amount is £525,000; and conducted by the brothers; and students for 1967-68 the amount is £114,000. Of come from Malaysia and from all points course, included in the amount of of the compass. £40.000 would be the supply of water for I hope the honourable member for Albany Dongara which would not cost many is in his seat, because he will probably thousands of pounds. It would be pleas- have something to say about this at a later ing to the people of the district if the stage. We have heard a great deal about Minister could increase the amount to a second university in Western Australia. £60,000 or £100,000 and if an earlier start We know that this is not possible at pre- could be made than that announced by sent. There is no doubt at all that there the Treasurer. This subject is an im- is only one suitable spot in Western Aus- portant one in the district. tralia for another university, and that is The area served by the part of Gerald- Gerald ton, where there is everything. This ton is very badly off for water supplies. would be a practical location. Over 5,000,000 tons of iron ore will be Schools in my area appear to be well delivered to Japan under contract. My staffed. The grounds are well looked after, understanding is that there is a con- and the general position is quite satisfac- siderably larger quantity available for tory. We have heard and read a lot about sale to Japan if the Japanese feel like iron ore and I have mentioned the work buying it. Something will have to be being done on the harbour. Recently we done, and done quickly, to improve our authorised a Bill for the construction of water supplies. The Minister for Hous- a railway to the Koolanooka hills. We ing will tell us there is a continuous de- hope it will not be long before railway mand for government houses. There has trucks are carrying iron ore dowvn to the been quite a lot of building activity on port of Geraldton. the part of private builders and in the way of levelling for building sites. A iarge firm The discovery of oil and gas at Yard- in Perth is undertaking a building pro- arino could completely alter the face of gramme in Geraldton at the Present time. Western Australia. The company respon- If we have a long, hot, dry summer our sible for drilling operations has done a water supply will be severely tested. With good job. If we have our sights set on the new system of water rating which has something and we think it is worth while, been introduced, we would not be assisted money does not really matter. Anyone in any way should we run short of water. who has had the pleasure of being around these oil and gas derricks cannot fail to I turn now to the matter of schools. in feel optimistic. viewv of the fact that the Minister for Education is in his seat. When the Hawke Government was in office arrangements were made for the Mr. Lewis: As usual. Muja power station to supply electricity to the area. I would say that instead of Mr. SEWELL: I have travelled through- Collie supplying us with electricity, we out my district and the State and I could could supply Collie with electricity at a say that we in the Geraldtcn area would cheaper rate. I do not know where be better served for schools than any other the honourable member for Collie is, but I area of Western Australia. hope he is not in the Chamber. Mr. Lewis: They all think that. Mr. Ross Hutchinson:- Hie Is; and he is Mr. SEWELL: A new school Is being nearly exploding! erected at Bluff Point. Another has been Mr. SEWELL: We have to take these erected at flangeway. Although it is small. titngs as they come. There Is much it has been built on the right lines. The wealth along our shores so far as oil and [Thursday, 12 November, 1964.1 2517

gas are concerned; and honourable mem- the mark; because I think that is our bers do not need me to tell them what primary function, particularly in the area this means to Western Australia and to which is represented by the Premier, the Australia. We should guard against our Minister for Education, and myself, and g-as and oil being taken away. We should which is serviced by the port of Geraldton. guard against our oil being refined else- where and against our being in the Progress position of paying the same Price for it Progress reported and leave given to sit as is being paid in New Zealand or the again, on motion by Mr. Ross Hutchinson Eastern States. (Chief Secretary). I think that is something the Legislature will have to look to in the future. One House adjourned at 11.40 P.m. could say that we are being a little too optimistic, but we can only hope for the best. I certainly wish the company con- cerned, which has battled so hard, and has spent such a large sum of money- many millions of pounds--good luck in the drilling for oil and gas. There are many other matters which are of great interest to the people of the district of Oeraldton, which is the head- ?4rfibaine (llunril quarters of the area I mentioned when I Thursday, the 12th November, 1964 quoted figures from the Bureau of Census and Statistics. I cannot see how in the CONTENTS future anything but success can come to BILLS- an area such as that. There is no doubt Adoption of Children Act Amendment it will have its ups and downs because of Rlll-2r...... seasonal conditions. But with the improve- Agricultural Products Act Amendment BiDl ments that are being made every year in (No. 2)--2r...... the production of superphosphate, and Coal Mline Workers (Pensions) Act Amend- with more scientific farming, and the ment Bil- proper conservation of water-we will need 2r...... more than bore water, and honourable Corn. members will hear some more from me Report Amnden Bill-Report.. on that scare at a later stage-the dis- Companies ActAmnmn llRpr trict must go ahead. Debt Collectors Licensing Bill-Recom. the cheap- Door to Door (Sales) Bil- We in that area should have Receipt ; Ir...... est electricity, certainly in Western Aus- Government Employees (Promotions Ap- tralia if not in Australia, and that should peal) Board Act Amendment Bill- be a great help in getting the industries 2r...... that are so urgently needed to build up Corn...... the population of this State. We hear a Report, Sr...... lot about decentralisation and immigra- Iron Ore (Hamerstey Range) Agreement tion, but if we have industries and pro- Act Amendment Bil- vide the necessaries of life we will find that 2r... .. 2552 we will not have to worry unduly about Corn...... 2553 getting the right type of person to come Report; 3r...... 2553 to this country, and to stay here. Iron Ore (Mlount Goldsworthy) Agreement This year we passed legislation dealing ill!- iron ore. Two areas in the northern 2r...... 2549 with Core...... 2550 part of the State, in the district of the Report ; Sr...... 2551 honourable member for Pilbara-Mount Iron Ore (Miount Newman) Agreement Newman and Mount Goldsworthy-were Bill- referred to. Also, the pelletising of iron Rr...... -.... 2529 ore has been mentioned and in future years it is quite possible that on the shores of Corn. f-2551 2545 the Indian ocean at Champion Bay, we Report; Sr...... 2551 will have a processing plant pelletising Real Property (Foreign Governments) Act lower-grade iron ore which has been ob- Amendment Bill- tained from various parts of the Murchi- 2r. .. son, That is the sort of thing we should Corn. work for, although I think our main aim Report ; r ...... should be to see that the money provided Wheat Products (Prices Fixation) Act for in these Estimates is spent in the right Amendment nml-sr.... way. LEAVE OF ABSENCE We should do everything possible to see QUEiSTION ON NOTICE- that the growing of food for home con- Goldfieids History : Compilation by Ir. sumption and export is kept right up to Spencer Conmpton ...... 2518