Tuesday Volume 537 6 December 2011 No. 236

HOUSE OF COMMONS OFFICIAL REPORT

PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES (HANSARD)

Tuesday 6 December 2011

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to meet the aid commitments that countries have entered House of Commons into alongside Britain but have not delivered on. The financial transaction tax which is proposed in Europe, Tuesday 6 December 2011 and which we will not accept, has been spent about four times over on domestic programmes, on the EU budget, The House met at half-past Two o’clock on climate change measures, and on aid. A far better thing for the countries of the European Union to do is PRAYERS to live up to the commitments they made on international development and deliver them out of their domestic [MR SPEAKER in the Chair] budgets.

BUSINESS BEFORE QUESTIONS Unemployment

LONDON LOCAL AUTHORITIES AND TRANSPORT FOR 2. Kate Green (Stretford and Urmston) (Lab): What LONDON (NO.2BILL)[LORDS](BY ORDER) assessment he has made of the implications for his policies of the Office for Budget Responsibility’s TRANSPORT FOR LONDON (SUPPLEMENTAL TOLL forecast for unemployment in 2012. [84781] PROVISIONS)BILL [LORDS](BY ORDER) Second Readings opposed and deferred until Tuesday The Chief Secretary to the Treasury (Danny Alexander): 13 December (Standing Order No. 20). In line with the weaker outlook for our GDP growth, the OBR has revised up the projected level of unemployment over the year term. In the autumn statement, we committed Oral Answers to Questions to important new steps to provide private sector job creation and reduce unemployment, such as nearly £1 million for the youth contract, an initial £1 billion for CHANCELLOR OF THE EXCHEQUER the regional growth fund, and a £21 billion package of credit easing to support small firms, which are an important source of employment in this difficult time. Official Development Assistance 1. Mr Tom Clarke (Coatbridge, Chryston and Bellshill) Kate Green: With unemployment set to soar to 8.7% next (Lab): What assessment he has made of the effect of year, according to the OBR, can the Chief Secretary changes in gross national income on the level of expenditure explain how meeting the rising cost of out-of-work on official development assistance. [84780 benefits helps to get public borrowing down? The Chancellor of the Exchequer (Mr George Osborne): Danny Alexander: The hon. Lady should also note This Government will honour the commitment that our that unemployment rose by nearly half a million during country made to the poorest people in the world and her party’s time in office. The fact remains that we have increase aid spending to 0.7% of gross national income. to deal with the enormous problem that was left to this To ensure that we do not exceed that target, we have country in our public finances by the previous Government. adjusted the spending plans of the Department for The one thing that would hurt the unemployed and the International Development. Its budget will now increase poorest in this country more than anything would be from £7.8 billion this year to £10.6 billion by 2014-15. stepping away from our plan and letting interest rates go through the roof, causing mortgage costs to rise, Mr Clarke: Is the Chancellor still committed to ensuring business costs to rise, and costs to the country to rise. that he places the achievement of 0.7% GNI for overseas That would be the most significant cause of unemployment aid as a specific commitment for 2013 and in the legislation that we could have. that the Government have promised? Michael Fallon (Sevenoaks) (Con): Will my right Mr Osborne: I am absolutely committed to that hon. Friend confirm that the independent OBR forecasts legislation, but more importantly, frankly, we should be that there will be 1 million more people in employment delivering the commitment on the money for the aid by 2016, even including the reduction in public sector budget. We are doing that in very difficult times. We are employment? Does he agree that the route to higher doing it, I hope, on a cross-party basis. We are, as I say, employment lies not through yet more borrowing but honouring our commitment to the poorest in the world. through getting control of our deficit and opening up Even in these difficult times, Britain has not forgotten opportunities and improving skills, not least through its obligations to the world’s poorest. the apprenticeships that the Government are introducing? Charlie Elphicke (Dover) (Con): While I congratulate the Government on holding to this spending and Danny Alexander: I wholeheartedly agree with my hon. maintaining this commitment, is the Chancellor aware Friend’s assessment. He is right that the OBR forecasts that France, Germany and other European nations have the net creation of 1 million more jobs and the creation not done so well in adhering to their commitments and of 1.7 million jobs in the private sector over the forecast are therefore pledged to, or desire, a financial transaction period. It forecasts that unemployment will fall to 6.2% by tax? Will he be trenchant in making sure that this does 2016, reflecting the fact that the commitments we have not happen, as it will damage our economy and our growth? made will deliver for the British economy. Mr Osborne: There are arguments for, and very much Pat Glass (North West Durham) (Lab): The Government against, a financial transaction tax, but a real red herring have shown that they are very relaxed about unemployment is the idea that a financial transaction tax could be used more than doubling in constituencies such as mine and 143 Oral Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Oral Answers 144 about their economic policies hurting the poorest and through work experience and additional apprenticeships. the most vulnerable the most. When will they turn their If there is any tragedy in this House, it is the economic attention to companies such as Vodafone, which is strategy of the hon. Lady and her party. I notice that allegedly failing to pay millions of pounds of tax? That she denies the deficit but does not deny the quote that I is an affront to the taxpayers who do pay their share. attributed to her. Perhaps I can recommend some holiday reading for her. “In the black Labour”, which was Danny Alexander: I am not in any way relaxed about written by three of her party’s most successful activists, unemployment increasing in the hon. Lady’s constituency states: or the constituency of any hon. Member. That is why in “It is precisely the vagueness of Labour’s position over…the the autumn statement we set out a youth contract deficit that confirms the voters’ worst suspicions about the Party’s designed to help half a million young unemployed lack of commitment to”— people to get into work and stay in work. I hope that she welcomes such measures. Mr Speaker: Order. We are grateful to the Chief Secretary, but we will move on to questions and, hopefully, Mr Philip Hollobone (Kettering) (Con): Presumably, answers that relate to the policies of the Government. the forecasts from the OBR on unemployment are very [Interruption.] I do not need any gesticulation from sensitive to interest rates. Given that interest yields in anyone. That is the purpose of the exercise, and that is Spain have hit 7% and its unemployment rate is 22%, is what is going to happen. it not the case that unemployment in Kettering and across the country would be far higher if the Government National Asset Management Agency relaxed their deficit reduction plan? 3. Ian Paisley (North Antrim) (DUP): What recent Danny Alexander: My hon. Friend is absolutely right discussions he has had with the Republic of Ireland’s in that assessment. A 1% increase in our bond yields National Asset Management Agency on its operations would cost the country an extra £21 billion in debt in Northern Ireland. [84782] interest, and a 1% increase in market rates would cost mortgage payers £10 billion and businesses £7 billion. The Financial Secretary to the Treasury (Mr Mark That is not the right solution for this country and it Hoban): Treasury officials have met NAMA officials as would certainly lead to higher unemployment. That is part of the bilateral engagement between the Irish and what the Labour party are offering. UK Governments. Day-to-day operational decisions are a matter for NAMA and its overall strategic decisions Rachel Reeves (Leeds West) (Lab): In 2010, long-term are set by the Irish Government. youth unemployment fell by 36%. Will the Chief Secretary tell us by how much long-term youth unemployment Ian Paisley: I thank the Financial Secretary for that has fallen since January 2011? answer. As of today, NAMA is the single largest property owner in Northern Ireland. It is also the single largest Danny Alexander: The hon. Lady will know that creditor operating in Northern Ireland. It threatens to youth unemployment rose by more than 40% during put 150 businesses and individuals into receivership. Labour’s time in office. It is precisely because of the rise What are the Government doing strategically to address in youth unemployment, which I do not regard as the needs of the economy in Northern Ireland to prevent tolerable any more than she does, that we have set out NAMA from aggressively putting people out of business the youth contract. Perhaps she recognises that her and taking blood from the stone? party’s strategy is not working. Perhaps she is the anonymous shadow Cabinet member who was recently Mr Hoban: I understand the concerns that the hon. quoted as saying: Gentleman has identified, and I know that the hon. “The simple fact is Ed Balls’ economic strategy is hurting but it Member for East Antrim (Sammy Wilson) has had isn’t working.” discussions with NAMA and the Irish Government about NAMA’s strategy in Northern Ireland. I encourage Rachel Reeves: I failed to hear an answer in that the hon. Member for North Antrim (Ian Paisley) to use response. The shocking truth that the Chief Secretary the mechanism that is available to Members of Parliament either will not own up to or is not even aware of is that and of the Northern Ireland Assembly to raise his instead of declining, long-term youth unemployment is concerns with NAMA directly. up by a staggering 83% since January this year. This tragedy is quickly becoming a national emergency. More Bank Lending and Credit (Businesses) and more young people leaving school, college or university are missing the chance to fulfil their potential and are 4. Chris Kelly (Dudley South) (Con): What steps he is stuck on benefits, their talents wasted and their hopes taking to reduce the cost of bank lending and credit for fading. It is no wonder that the Chancellor’s borrowing businesses. [84783] plans are out of control, with an extra £158 billion of Government borrowing. When will the Government The Chancellor of the Exchequer (Mr George Osborne): change course, abandon their failed plan and support In the autumn statement, I announced the launch of young people instead of throwing them on the scrap measures to help improve the flow of credit to businesses. heap? We expanded the enterprise finance guarantee scheme within the constraints of state aid rules, but that was Danny Alexander: I did not hear a welcome from the not enough, so we have committed to a programme of hon. Lady for our youth contract, which will help half a credit easing as well, using the low interest rates at million young unemployed people with real jobs, support which the Government can borrow to help get low 145 Oral Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Oral Answers 146 interest rates to businesses. The national loan guarantee for whatever is thrown at them in the coming months, scheme will lead to a reduction in the cost of bank loans and that they do not pay the large bonuses that used to for small businesses, while the business finance partnership be paid out. [Interruption.] They were paid out when will deliver additional finance for mid-sized business people like the hon. Member for Nottingham East through non-bank lending channels. (Chris Leslie) supported the Government.

Chris Kelly: I thank my right hon. Friend for that Stewart Hosie (Dundee East) (SNP): Bank lending answer. Can he confirm that guarantees under the funds business investment, so I welcome some of the Government’s national loan guarantee scheme are measures that the Chancellor has announced. However, contingent liabilities, and so will have no effect on the if the lack of lending is a consequence not of availability country’s balance sheet or deficit? or cost but of reduced aggregate demand, and if business investment continues to fall or be sluggish, is he not at Mr Osborne: My hon. Friend is right that the national all concerned about the fact that the vast majority of loan guarantee scheme does not add to the debt or next year’s gross domestic product growth—0.7%—will deficit; the guarantees are contingent liabilities. The be driven by business investment? Should that happen, previous Government had a contingent liability scheme where would it leave his growth forecasts? for lending between banks, but this is a contingent liability scheme for lending by banks to small businesses. Mr Osborne: Of course, the components of our GDP We are following the model of the European Investment forecast, like the forecast itself, are produced by an Bank, which has a small programme to lend to smaller independent body, the Office for Budget Responsibility, businesses in Britain. We are using that model to try to so it is not my assessment of business investment next reduce interest costs for small businesses, using the year but the OBR’s. I am confident that if we invest in credibility of the low interest rates at which we can the infrastructure that we set out last week, provide borrow to deliver those low interest rates to businesses. support for seed investment through the enterprise investment scheme that we have created and make it Mr Geoffrey Robinson (Coventry North West) (Lab): easier to hire people, as we propose to do, we will Given the urgency of getting credit flowing to small and encourage business to invest, grow and take people on. medium-sized companies again, when does the Chancellor realistically expect the first loans to be made under the Taxation (Banks) new arrangements? 5. Ian Lavery (Wansbeck) (Lab): What recent assessment Mr Osborne: We hope to get the scheme up and he has made of the level of taxation on banks. [84784] running early in the new year. We have to get state aid clearance, which is the rule that we and every other 8. Hazel Blears (Salford and Eccles) (Lab): What member state of the European Union have to abide by, recent assessment he has made of the level of taxation but by following the European Investment Bank scheme on banks. [84787] quite closely, which of course is permissible, we hope to get that state aid clearance as quickly as possible and The Financial Secretary to the Treasury (Mr Mark get the scheme up and running early in the new year. I Hoban): The Chancellor announced in his autumn do not need to be reminded of the urgency of getting statement that the bank levy would increase to 0.088% help to smaller businesses, particularly as bank credit from 1 January 2012, consistent with the Government’s conditions tighten. intention to raise at least £2.5 billion each year, as set out in Budget 2011. Mr Andrew Tyrie (Chichester) (Con): The major banks argue that they cannot be expected to strengthen their Ian Lavery: In the autumn statement last week, the balance sheets and increase net lending at the same Chancellor announced measures that will mean that the time. Does the Chancellor agree with the Governor of Government will raise three times as much from cuts in the Bank of England that that could be achieved if child tax credits than they will raise from any additional banks were prepared to cut their bonuses and dividends? taxes on the banks. Should he not hang his head in In particular, is it not time that shareholders stepped up shame at the Government’s actions? When will they to the plate and ensured that banks behaved responsibly change course and stop their relentless, ruthless attack on the matter? on those less well off in society?

Mr Osborne: The Financial Policy Committee, which Mr Hoban: The hon. Gentleman should get his facts is the body that we have established in the Bank of right, because the Government are increasing the child England to provide advice on issues that affect the tax credit by £135. whole financial system, is absolutely right to say to banks that they should be using any earnings that they Hazel Blears: Earlier this year, the Prime Minister have to strengthen their balance sheets if necessary, announced that the high street banks would commit rather than distributing them in larger bonuses. We £200 million to the big society bank to try to fill the need stronger banks, not larger bonuses, this winter. £5 billion shortfall currently faced by charities and the The advice from the Bank of England is very clear, and voluntary sector. To put it another way, that is just I would expect the banking system to follow that advice. 1.4% of the £14 billion the banks have paid out in When it comes to shareholders, it is particularly good bonuses this year. What steps will the Chancellor take, news that the Association of British Insurers has said including by providing further incentives, to ensure that this morning that it expects to see restraint in financial those financial institutions commit more to community sector pay. We have to ensure that our banks are prepared reinvestment? 147 Oral Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Oral Answers 148

Mr Hoban: The right hon. Lady should recognise said that it was looking potentially to review their that bank bonuses are a quarter of what they were when countries’ debt ratings downwards. Will the Chancellor she was in the Cabinet. The banks are doing that. The please tell us what has happened to Britain’s debt rating previous Government were in office for 13 years. They since the election and what the result has been for had no idea about introducing a bank levy. This British interest rates? Government have taken the right steps to ensure that banks pay their fair share of taxes. Mr Osborne: The UK is the only western country that has seen an improvement in its credit rating in the Dr Thérèse Coffey (Suffolk Coastal) (Con): My hon. past 18 months. When this Government came to office, Friend will be aware that banks and financial services the country’s triple A credit rating was on negative contributed more than £50 billion in taxes last year, but watch, which is where it was put by the Labour party. I has he noted that this Government’s bank levy—the am delighted that it came off negative watch, but we permanent levy—will raise more in one year than the must stay vigilant. The credit rating agencies have said previous Government’s payroll tax? that an abandonment of our deficit plan would definitely lead to a downgrade of the credit rating. Mr Hoban: My hon. Friend is absolutely right. Of course, the previous Government said that the bank John Howell: The Chancellor has already commented bonus payroll tax would be a one-off tax. This Government on the impact of low interest rates on mortgages. Does had the courage to go forward, and to say that we he share my concern that high interest rates would would introduce a bank levy unilaterally, which the affect business? Will he say a little more about the effect previous Chancellor opposed. We are taking the tough of low interest rates on business in this country? action on taxing banks that the previous Government failed to take. Mr Osborne: My hon. Friend is absolutely right that Interest Rates an increase in interest rates at this time would also hit businesses with loans and lead to an additional £7 billion of business costs, which would mean some businesses 6. Nadhim Zahawi (Stratford-on-Avon) (Con): What failing and jobs being lost. It is all the more reason why recent assessment he has made of the likely effect on we must maintain our fiscal credibility; it is all the more the economy of an increase in interest rates. [84785] reason why every single business organisation supported our business statement last week; it is all the more 16. Claire Perry (Devizes) (Con): What recent reason why international organisations are backing what assessment he has made of the likely effect on the we have done; and it is all the more reason why the economy of an increase in interest rates. [84796] shadow Chancellor cannot find a single credible party in western Europe that supports what he is doing. 17. John Howell (Henley) (Con): What recent assessment he has made of the likely effect on the Mr Dennis Skinner (Bolsover) (Lab): Why should economy of an increase in interest rates. [84797] anybody take a blind bit of notice of the Chancellor’s forecast on interest rates when he has only been in The Chancellor of the Exchequer (Mr George Osborne): power for 18 months and he has got every other economic An increase in interest rates would be particularly damaging indicator wrong? For Christ’s sake, don’t go to the to an economy with the UK’s level of indebtedness. A Prime Minister and ask him to bail you out because he one percentage point rise in interest rates would add was economic adviser to Norman Lamont, who lost around £21 billion to debt interest payments. That is £10 billion in an afternoon and never went near a why the Government are determined to keep Britain’s betting shop. fiscal credibility and to keep our interest rates low. A 1% rise in lending rates would add £10 billion to household mortgage interest repayments and £7 billion to business Mr Osborne: The hon. Gentleman is the man who costs. has supported a party that said there would be no more boom and bust and that gave us the biggest ever boom Nadhim Zahawi: Forty per cent. of households in and the largest ever bust. I will tell him what has Stratford-on-Avon—some 17,870 home owners—have happened since the general election: the deficit is coming a mortgage secured against their home. Will the Chancellor down and credibility is going up. confirm that each percentage point increase in interest rates would cost the average household £1,000, and that John Healey (Wentworth and Dearne) (Lab): The adopting Labour’s plan B and seeing our interest rates Chancellor claims that low interest rates are a sign of reach those of Italy would mean £89 million being success of his policy. Can he tell the House how many taken out of the local Stratford-on-Avon economy? months before the last election did the Bank of England set interest rates at the current 0.5%? Mr Osborne: My hon. Friend is right that a 1% rise on the average mortgage bill would add £1,000. That is Mr Osborne: What we are talking about here are the why it is particularly important at this time and in this market interest rates. Italian and Greek households and debt crisis that we try to keep our interest rates low. businesses are looking not at the European Central That is what the credibility of our fiscal policy is doing. Bank official interest rate, but at the market interest rates. The market interest rates that we are paying in Claire Perry: Yesterday, millions of families across this country are less than 2.5% and that is a sign of the Europe faced a bump up in their uncertainty in their credibility that we have earned in a debt crisis. That is financial affairs as Standard & Poor’s, the rating agency, what we have done. Instead of opposing the difficult 149 Oral Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Oral Answers 150 decisions that we have taken to put our public finances Mrs Mary Glindon (North Tyneside) (Lab): Will the in order, the right hon. Gentleman should be supporting Minister say how many more or fewer HMRC staff them. there will be over the next three years?

Chris Leslie (Nottingham East) (Lab/Co-op): The Mr Gauke: The overall trend in HMRC employment Chancellor will be aware that around 40% of Treasury has been downwards since 2005, when the organisation bonds issued this year will be bought by the Bank of was formed, and that will continue, but we are redeploying England and that the Bank concluded in its last quarterly staff, for example in enforcement and compliance, which bulletin that quantitative easing—printing money— means that additional staff are being taken on to deal accounts for a fall in gilt interest rates of around 1.25%. with tax evasion and tax avoidance. For the sake of clarity, can the Chancellor say whether he agrees with that Bank of England analysis or is he Tax Rates seriously saying that printing money has no impact whatsoever on low bond interest rates? 10. Christopher Pincher (Tamworth) (Con): Whether Mr Osborne: The low interest rates were there before he has made an assessment of the effect on the the Bank undertook its quantitative easing programme economy of setting different tax rates in each economic in the autumn. We have had low market interest rates sector. [84790] for the whole of the past 18 months, not just when the Bank of England has been undertaking its QE programme. The Exchequer Secretary to the Treasury (Mr David This is what the chief economic adviser to the Treasury Gauke): The Government’s aim is to create the most said in 2004: long-term interest rates are competitive tax system in the G20. The corporate tax “the simplest measure of monetary and fiscal policy credibility.” road map sets out a series of reforms in a single programme to give certainty to business, including by reducing the That was Mr Edward Balls. main rate of corporation tax to 23% by 2014. Where appropriate, the Government provide tax reliefs to support HMRC Contact Centres specific sectors of the economy, but simplicity is a key characteristic of a competitive tax system. 7. Tony Cunningham (Workington) (Lab): What recent discussions he has had with Her Majesty’s Revenue and Christopher Pincher: I am grateful for that answer. Customs (HMRC) on the provision of customer services One of the biggest employers in my constituency is by private sector companies in HMRC contact centres; Drayton Manor park, home of Thomas Land, and one and if he will make a statement. [84786] of the greatest challenges that it faces is the lower rate of VAT levied on the leisure sector in our continental The Exchequer Secretary to the Treasury (Mr David competitor countries. Has the Minister examined the Gauke): HMRC has kept me informed about its plans case for lower VAT for the leisure sector in this country, for a small-scale, short-term trial to test whether the use and if he has not—I appreciate the bust that we inherited— of additional resources for contact centres from third what measures is he taking to make the industry more party providers might help it to improve levels of service. competitive?

Tony Cunningham: There are obviously issues relating Mr Gauke: We continue to look at VAT in the leisure to the use of the private sector in tax offices. Will the and other specific sectors but we have to be careful to Minister meet me and other constituency MPs who are keep the tax system as simple as possible and we have to affected by this rather risky pilot? bear it in mind that such measures can simply move spending from one area to another. Furthermore, as my Mr Gauke: I am happy to meet the hon. Gentleman, hon. Friend points out, we have to ensure that the but HMRC is exploring ways in which it can improve public finances are in a sound state. I am sure that I the service in contact centres so that when taxpayers remember reading one “Thomas the Tank Engine” and tax credit claimants phone up they can get through story in which the big, unpopular engine Gordon went more easily and more reliably. I would have thought off the tracks. We do not want a repeat of that. that that was something that hon. Members on all sides of the House would welcome. Jonathan Ashworth (Leicester South) (Lab): The Exchequer Secretary will be aware that consumption is Nicholas Soames (Mid Sussex) (Con): May I ask my a major part of the economy. Given that in recent days hon. Friend to recognise that the service provided by we have seen news that retail figures have been poor and HMRC contact centres is not good enough and that the CBI has said that retail stores are laying off people many of our companies have great difficulty with continuity at the fastest rate for two years, why will he not consider of service? Anything that can be done to improve the a temporary VAT cut to boost demand and get the service is wholly to be welcomed. economy moving again?

Mr Gauke: I am grateful for those comments. It is Mr Gauke: Returning to the fundamental question, worth noting that about 70% of calls now get through the difficulty is that if we do not have credibility in the to HMRC contact centres on the first attempt, whereas public finances and if interest rates rise, it will do last year the proportion was about 40%. Progress has nothing for consumption. We have to get control of the been made, therefore, but we want to make further deficit, get borrowing down and stick to the path. We progress and it is sensible that HMRC explores what cannot grow money off the money tree, which, I am possibilities exist. afraid, seems to be the Labour party’s policy. 151 Oral Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Oral Answers 152

Regional Investment Danny Alexander: That was an excellent point, and I wholeheartedly endorse what the hon. Lady says. I join 11. Alun Cairns (Vale of Glamorgan) (Con): What her in congratulating her constituents on successfully assessment he has made of the effect of fiscal policy on acquiring regional growth fund support for that important the level of investment in the regions. [84791] project. The regional growth fund as a whole will maintain or support 325,000 jobs in the private sector across the The Chief Secretary to the Treasury (Danny Alexander): country. That is something that Members on both sides The Government continue to support investment across of the House should welcome. the United Kingdom, including through the £6.3 billion boost to infrastructure spending over this spending Mrs Jenny Chapman (Darlington) (Lab): Given the review period. As a consequence of this decision, the very sharp decline in applications for education from autumn statement made available to the Welsh Assembly adults in the north-east, how worried is the Minister Government a further £216 million of capital funding. I about the supply of skilled labour to our economy? urge the Welsh Government to consider how best to Danny Alexander: We are seeking to address that direct that funding towards growth-enhancing priorities through, for example, our policies on youth unemployment and the substantial increase in our investment in Alun Cairns: I am grateful to my right hon. Friend for apprenticeships. All that is designed to expand skills in that answer. The regional growth fund is having a the economy, which business constantly raises and the significant impact in Newcastle, Teesside, Cornwall and Government are acting to support. other parts of the United Kingdom, yet the inaction of the Labour Welsh Government means that little is Economic Growth happening there in spite of them receiving the Barnett consequentials. Will he agree to raise the matter with the Welsh Government to ensure that my constituents 12. Mike Crockart (Edinburgh West) (LD): What can benefit in the same way as other parts of the UK? assessment he has made of the reasons for the Office for Budget Responsibility’s forecast of lower economic Danny Alexander: My hon. Friend makes an important growth in 2012. [84792] point, and he will know that the additional £1 billion of The Chief Secretary to the Treasury (Danny Alexander): funding to the regional growth fund announced at the The OBR is independent, so we accept its numbers, its autumn statement generated an extra £57.6 million of forecasts and, of course, its analysis. The OBR attributes additional funding for Wales. I hope very much that the the lower growth prospects in 2012 to higher than Welsh Assembly Government will use that money for expected inflation, as a result of recent global commodity similar growth priorities. I shall certainly raise the matter price shocks, revisions to the depth of the financial with my counterpart in the Welsh Assembly Government, crisis and the crisis in the euro area. and I am sure that my hon. Friend will do the same in his own constituency. Mike Crockart: Does my right hon. Friend agree that the OBR is a key participant in ensuring the UK’s Mr George Mudie (Leeds East) (Lab): A recent report economic recovery and that its establishment by this by the Institute for Public Policy Research suggested Government marked a step change in the transparency that the economy in London and the south-east will and openness of our economic and fiscal policy making? recover by 2014, but that Yorkshire’s economy will take Further—[Interruption.] I have more. Does he share until 2018 and that of the north-east until 2020. In view my view that if Labour had won the last election, we of those figures, does the Chief Secretary not regret would still be without that independent assessment and abolishing the regional development agencies and giving thus, crucially, still in the dark about just how bad the successor bodies less than half the money? Labour’s recession is?

Danny Alexander: No, I do not, but I share the hon. Mr Speaker: May we have a brief reply to what was Gentleman’s view that the unbalanced nature of the rather a lengthily constructed essay-question? I know economy that we inherited from the previous Government that the Chief Secretary will respond pithily. is a serious problem, particularly for regions in the north of England. That is why in the autumn statement Danny Alexander: The creation of the OBR is a and the spending review we prioritised additional marked improvement, as my hon. Friend says, to fiscal infrastructure projects—on the roads, on the railways, credibility in this country. That is why other countries and so on—with a particular focus on his part of the are looking to our example, to see whether they can world. I hope that he will welcome those sorts of follow it. Other countries are not looking to the example developments. of Labour, whose prescription for more borrowing in answer to a borrowing crisis is the one policy that no Sarah Newton (Truro and Falmouth) (Con): Will my country in Europe or the world is following. right hon. Friend join me in congratulating Piran Trezise, Ian Jones and Steve Jones, who have today secured Ian Austin (Dudley North) (Lab): Since the spending regional growth funding to regenerate the iconic Goonhilly review, which the Chief Secretary took part in, the earth station, which will bring hundreds of highly skilled economy has grown by just 0.5%. In the year before jobs to Cornwall? Does he agree that regional growth that, it grew five times as quickly, and in Europe it has funding should be used to enable businesses to rebalance grown three times as fast, so is it not the case that what our economy away from London-centric financial services has brought economic growth to a standstill and pushed towards sustainable jobs in science, technology and up unemployment is the utter failure of the policies that engineering? he and the Government have pursued? 153 Oral Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Oral Answers 154

Danny Alexander: The hon. Gentleman should have rule. The Treasury now has that study; will my hon. Friend read the OBR’s report, which analysed the depth of the give me an assurance that it is under urgent consideration economic crisis during his time in office and found that for implementation at the earliest opportunity? the size of the boom and the bust—which he claimed to have abolished—was larger than forecast. As a result, Mr Gauke: I can give the hon. Member that assurance. for every £8 that we thought we would have as a We are grateful to Graham Aaronson and his distinguished country, we have only £7. [Interruption.] It is an appalling panel for studying this issue. We are looking at it. It is legacy for this country, and he ought to be apologising, important to consult properly, but we are giving urgent not chuntering from the Back Benches. consideration to the matter.

Mr Brian Binley (Northampton South) (Con): Does Owen Smith (Pontypridd) (Lab): The Government my right hon. Friend recognise that export-led growth said in August that the deal between the UK and will not reach the levels needed to match our growth Switzerland would close other tax loopholes and net the projections by 2015? Will he consider other measures, Exchequer an additional £4 billion to £7 billion in over and above those already taken, to stimulate demand revenue. Will the Minister explain why the Office for in the home market, especially to help the small and Budget Responsibility described the deal last week as a medium-sized enterprise sector, on which he is so reliant? “fiscal risk”, declined to validate the Government’s numbers, citing “significant uncertainties”, and discounted Danny Alexander: The hon. Gentleman is absolutely the revenues from its central projection for receipts? right to support initiatives to support the SME sector. I hope that he will therefore welcome the continuation of Mr Gauke: The agreement has not been ratified as the small business rate relief holiday and the credit yet; it is yet to go through the parliamentary process in easing package, which is aimed at supporting lending this country or, indeed, in Switzerland. The OBR is and reducing the cost of lending to small businesses—one rightly cautious, but even the £4 billion is likely to be of many things that we are doing to help that vital greater than the amount we would have received from sector of our economy. privatising Lloyds Banking Group and RBS. That is not an insubstantial sum of money which Members on Tax Loopholes both sides of the House should welcome. It will put an end to tax evasion through people putting their money into Switzerland. 13. Valerie Vaz (Walsall South) (Lab): What steps he is taking to close tax loopholes. [84793] Public Sector Borrowing Requirements

The Exchequer Secretary to the Treasury (Mr David 14. Mr Tobias Ellwood (Bournemouth East) (Con): Gauke): The Government have set out a strategic approach What recent assessment he has made of the public to tackling tax avoidance, with an emphasis on preventing sector borrowing requirement. [84794] avoidance before it can occur. Measures introduced in the Finance Act 2011 will bring in an additional £1 billion The Economic Secretary to the Treasury (Miss Chloe a year over the course of this Parliament and protect Smith): In the economic and fiscal outlook for November, further revenues. The Government will carefully consider the independent Office for Budget Responsibility forecast Graham Aaronson’s report on a general anti-avoidance public sector net borrowing in 2011-12 to be £127.1 billion rule and engage formally with interested parties to or 8.4% of gross domestic product. The deficit forecast establish whether that could further reduce tax avoidance. for 2015-16 is £53.2 billion or 2.9% of GDP.

Valerie Vaz: I thank the Minister for attempting to Mr Ellwood: I am grateful to the Minister for that answer my question before I have asked it. Hard-working reply. The public sector borrowing requirement was, of and hard-paying taxpayers demand fairness, but the course, affected by the size of the public sector. Under stamp duty loophole cost the Treasury almost £1 billion. the last Government, the number of public sector employees The Minister spoke earlier about redeploying staff; will ballooned by 700,000. Although many might be important he confirm that he will put more resources into enforcing jobs such as those for doctors and nurses, has the tax evasion? Minister had an opportunity to do any analysis to ascertain whether every single one of those jobs was Mr Gauke: We are putting more resources into dealing really necessary? with tax evasion and avoidance. Just this morning we have announced proposals that will extend the disclosure Miss Smith: The Treasury would not centrally manage of tax-avoidance schemes to stamp duty land tax. The changes to public sector work forces, but employers biggest measure we have taken in tackling tax avoidance have been reforming their work forces since the spending was on disguised remuneration in the last Finance Bill. review to make the necessary savings and maximise Unfortunately, Labour Members did not support us. value for money. My hon. Friend is certainly right that the last Government left us a ballooning financial disaster Stephen Williams (Bristol West) (LD): Only today my with the highest deficit since world war two. hon. Friend the Minister has had to table written statements blocking tax-avoidance schemes in derivatives, loan Benefit Changes (Women) relationships and capital allowances and many other measures. A general anti-avoidance rule would back up 15. Luciana Berger (Liverpool, Wavertree) (Lab/Co-op): the plethora of anti-avoidance measures that this and What assessment he has made of the effects on women previous Governments have had to introduce. The coalition of the changes to child tax credit and working tax agreement provided for a study of a general anti-avoidance credit proposed in his autumn statement. [84795] 155 Oral Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Oral Answers 156

The Exchequer Secretary to the Treasury (Mr David Miss Anne McIntosh (Thirsk and Malton) (Con): Gauke): The Chancellor considered the equality impacts York Handmade Brick Company is delighted by the of the changes to tax credits announced in the autumn announcement in last week’s Budget statement, and statement, which included an assessment of the effects hopes to work closely with the Government to reduce on women. emissions and ensure that we are on track to help energy-intensive industries such as brick companies. Luciana Berger: That was not an answer to my question. Figures from the House of Commons Library show Mr Gauke: I am grateful for my hon. Friend’s comments. that since the election changes to tax, pensions, pay and We do not want to export jobs in pursuit of policies that benefits are hitting women more than twice as hard as are not effective and do nothing for UK industry. they are hitting men. Of the extra £18.9 billion that is being raised, £13.2 billion comes from women, with just Topical Questions £5 billion or so coming from men. This is the biggest attack on women in a generation. Will the Minister tell T1. [84805] Mr Tom Clarke (Coatbridge, Chryston and us what his Government have against women? Bellshill) (Lab): If he will make a statement on his departmental responsibilities. Mr Gauke: Let us look at some of the measures we have taken that will help women and families—the The Chancellor of the Exchequer (Mr George Osborne): additional support for child care announced last week, The core purpose of the Treasury is to ensure that the for example. The increase in the personal allowance for economy is stable, to lay foundations for growth and income tax will take 1.1 million people out of paying employment, to reform banking, and to manage the income tax at all—and 58% of them are women. public finances so that Britain starts to live within her means. Margot James (Stourbridge) (Con): Does my right hon. Friend agree that it is important for us to target the Mr Clarke: I thank the Chancellor for his reply to my women who need the money most, and that the plans to supplementary question earlier. May I put it to him that double investment in child care and free education for his announcement last week that £1 billion was to be children from disadvantaged families must be beneficial taken from international aid over the next three years in these times? suggests that, in the Prime Minister’s words, he is balancing the books on the back of the world’s poorest?

Mr Gauke: My hon. Friend is absolutely right. We Mr Osborne: I do not agree with the right hon. are taking steps that will provide better opportunities Gentleman. I think that people should reflect on the for children, and measures such as the increase in child fact that we are making some very difficult decisions in care provision will help women in particular. the current Parliament about welfare benefits and departmental spending, and that much of that is Capital Allowances (Regional Growth) controversial. During this period, spending on aid is set to increase from £8.5 billion to £12 billion, which is a 19. Tristram Hunt (Stoke-on-Trent Central) (Lab): big increase. I think that if we start to attack that What recent assessment he has made of the effect of commitment—if we say that it is not enough, and the capital allowances on regional growth. [84800] like—the coalition of support for the increase in aid spending that I believe exists throughout the House will start to fall apart, and I do not think that we want to go The Exchequer Secretary to the Treasury (Mr David down that route. We have made our commitment to the Gauke): Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs does not poorest in the world. We will be one of the first countries have the data that are required to analyse capital allowances in the world to hit the target of spending 0.7% of our claims by region. gross national income on aid, and I think that we should all support and welcome that. Tristram Hunt: I thank the Minister for another great non-answer. Those in the ceramics sector in Stoke-on-Trent T2. [84807] Andrew Rosindell (Romford) (Con): I commend and elsewhere are concerned about the fact that the the Chancellor on the Government’s decisions to protect the Government’s package for energy-intensive industry does lowest paid in the public sector pay freeze and to take little to prevent further offshoring of jobs and businesses. 1 million people out of income tax altogether, but will Will the Government give careful consideration to the he tell us what effect that will have on working women? suggestion in the Energy Technology Criteria List that the granting of enhanced capital allowances should Mr Osborne: Sixty per cent. of the lowest-paid workers include the low-carbon equipment that is vital to the whom we have taken out of tax are women, as are 80% sustainable future of Britain’s world-class ceramics industry? of those who benefit from our policy of exempting the lowest-paid in our public sector from the pay freeze. Mr Gauke: I should have thought that the hon. Gentleman would welcome the measures announced Ed Balls (Morley and Outwood) (Lab/Co-op): In last week for energy-intensive industries. We are also October this year, the International Monetary Fund doing more to help the economy more broadly in the advised the Chancellor that tax system. A couple of hours ago I happened to meet “if activity were to undershoot current expectations and risk a the chairman of one of the leading manufacturers in his period of stagnation or contraction, countries that face historically industry, who was very supportive of the reduction in low yields (for example, Germany and the United Kingdom) corporation tax from 28% to 23%. should also consider delaying some of their planned consolidation.” 157 Oral Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Oral Answers 158

At the time when the IMF warned of the risks of Mr Osborne: The decision to freeze public sector pay growth undershooting, what were its forecasts for growth was, of course, a difficult one. I am not sure whether it in the UK in 2011 and 2012? was opposed by the Labour party; I do not think it was, but I stand to be corrected. Although it was a difficult Mr Osborne: I do not have the IMF forecast to hand, decision, in respect of our armed forces we sought to but as I remember it was absolutely in line with other double the operational allowance to give tax-free help forecasts at the time. It was very much as we expected, to those who are risking their lives at this moment but when the IMF produced that forecast it asked the fighting for us in Afghanistan. We have also sought to question again of whether Britain should change its double the council tax relief for our brave armed services deficit plan policy, and it said no. In doing so, it joins a when they go abroad. We have not changed the incremental host of other organisations, ranging from the OECD to pay increases that people—for example, those in the the CBI and the Governor of the Bank of England here Army—get through their contracts, and we are enshrining in Britain, which make it very clear that Britain must the military covenant in law. So we are absolutely aware stick to its deficit reduction plan. of the struggle and sacrifice the armed forces undertake on our behalf and we honour their sacrifice. Ed Balls: In October, the IMF said that if growth “were to undershoot current expectations” T7. [84812] Claire Perry (Devizes) (Con): I hope it is the Government should change course. The Chancellor not giving away too many House secrets to say that it did not know the answer to my question, so let me give is rumoured that the shadow Chancellor will be reprising him the answer. The IMF was forecasting UK growth his role as Father Christmas at the Westminster Christmas of 1.1% in 2011 and 1.6% in 2012. The latest Office for party tomorrow. If that is true, I am sure many children Budget Responsibility forecast is that the UK is now will tell him about their presents, and a recent survey expected to grow by just 0.9% this year and to grow next suggests that the average cost of Christmas for a child is year not by 1.6% but by 0.7%. £112.50. Is the Chancellor aware that that is almost Let me share another international judgment with exactly the same amount that this Government are the Chancellor: giving families through the council tax freeze and the reductions in fuel duty we have proposed? “Wiser policies, mixing short-term stimulus with longer-term deficit reduction, should have been embraced last year…Instead, the Cameron government persists on a failed, irresponsible course Mr Osborne: I am sure that Father Christmas tomorrow that is unlikely to lead to recovery anytime soon.” will welcome that. Given that my wife is opening the With growth undershooting IMF expectations in October, Christmas party with the shadow Chancellor tomorrow, with borrowing now set to be £158 billion higher than it will certainly be an event worth turning up to. he planned, and with even the IMF calling for a change of course, why is the Chancellor ploughing on? If even T5. [84810] Mr Adrian Bailey (West Bromwich West) across the Atlantic The New York Times can see that it (Lab/Co-op): Does the Chancellor agree with the chief is not working, why can the Chancellor not see it? executive of the Engineering Employers Federation, Terry Scouler, that Mr Osborne: The managing director of the IMF has “the biggest threat to reducing” clearly said that the “policy stance” in the United the Kingdom “remains appropriate.”The right hon. Gentleman “deficit comes from weak growth”? talks about international support, and not one single credible mainstream party in Europe is advocating the In view of the fact that growth is dependent on demand, position that he advocates in the UK. We have done that this country is confronted over the next two years some research, and we have found that the Workers with the biggest squeeze on its living standards in a very Struggle party in France supports what he is doing, as long time, and that demand in our main export market, do the Communist parties of Spain, Switzerland, Finland, Europe, is also falling, can he tell us where that growth Romania and Moldova. Those are his new fellow travellers. is coming from? If he had his own Communist manifesto, it would be “Workers of the Labour party unite! We have nothing Mr Gauke: May I point out to the hon. Gentleman to lose except our shadow Chancellor.” that Terry Scouler is supportive of the steps we are taking to get the deficit under control, and made that T4. [84809] Chris Skidmore (Kingswood) (Con): The very clear last week. He was also supportive of some of small business rate relief holiday has proved vital to the measures we announced last week, such as the many companies in Kingswood and across the country. reforms relating to R and D tax credits, which will help Does the Minister agree that many of those companies manufacturing. will welcome the extension of that holiday? Mark Pawsey (Rugby) (Con): On Friday, I met businesses The Exchequer Secretary to the Treasury (Mr David in my constituency at an event organised by our local Gauke): My hon. Friend is absolutely right. The measure enterprise partnership. They tell me that access to finance will provide support in the form of a reduction in business is one of the most important issues they face. Will the rates for more than 500,000 small businesses and 29% of Chancellor confirm that the measures introduced in the all shops for the whole of the next financial year. autumn statement will provide more and cheaper finance to businesses in Rugby? T3. [84808] Emma Reynolds (Wolverhampton North East) (Lab): Will the Chancellor tell the House and the Mr Osborne: That is absolutely the intention of the country whether it is fair for the brave men and women national loan guarantee scheme. It is designed to help of our armed forces to face a pay freeze? small businesses, in particular, with turnovers of less 159 Oral Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Oral Answers 160 than £50 million to get access to cheaper credit—in Sheila Gilmore (Edinburgh East) (Lab): Earlier, the other words, to pass on the low interest rates that we Chief Secretary to the Treasury indicated that the reason can borrow at, because of the difficult decisions we have for the slow growth in the past year was the depth of the taken, to those businesses in Rugby and elsewhere. recession. He quoted the OBR report, but it goes on to say that the recovery in 2009 was stronger than previously Mr Wayne David (Caerphilly) (Lab): Will the Chancellor reported, and that decline started only in the latter part give a commitment to the English regions that they will of 2010. Why did he not tell the House and the country receive all the European regional development fund that? money they are entitled to—or will that money end up with the Treasury? Danny Alexander: The hon. Lady should recognise that the OBR cited three reasons. It said that the bust Mr Osborne: If there are good projects that need was bigger and the boom was greater under the previous European support and we can put together a joint bid Government. I would have thought that she would and the resources to do that, of course we will do that. stand up and apologise for that, as well as recognising But let me make a broader point: disparity between the that the high costs of commodities over the past year regions of this country grew over the past decade and has slowed growth now and that the risks posed to the ultimately, what we have got to do is to help the private eurozone are what is causing a slowdown in demand at sector across the regions to grow, as well. the moment. That is what the OBR said and she should accept it. Duncan Hames (Chippenham) (LD): Unlike the previous Government, this coalition Government agreed £1 billion Sir Peter Tapsell (Louth and Horncastle) (Con): What in compensation to qualifying Equitable Life policyholders. percentage of our foreign exchange reserves are in the Yet,judging by the Minister’s written answers, as recently euro? as six weeks ago less than £500,000 had been paid out. What action will he be taking to ensure that the payment scheme finally gets compensation to policyholders without Mr Osborne: We publish, on an annual basis, a further delay? breakdown of our foreign exchange reserves, and this Government, like previous Governments, do not give a The Financial Secretary to the Treasury (Mr Mark running commentary on the composition of those reserves. Hoban): We are on track to pay out £500 million in compensation to policyholders this year. We have completed Dame Anne Begg (Aberdeen South) (Lab): Is Her a pilot testing phase to make sure that the system works, Majesty’s Revenue and Customs trying to maximise its and I can advise my hon. Friend that we have made income by not warning businesses immediately that 3,000 payments to policyholders just today. they have incurred a penalty for late payment of PAYE? Businesses in my constituency have been facing huge Tom Greatrex (Rutherglen and Hamilton West) (Lab/ bills because HMRC has taken six months before letting Co-op): In one of his earlier answers, the Chief Secretary companies know about the fines they are incurring. to the Treasury referred to the infrastructure fund announced last week. Given his comments of last week, Mr Gauke: I am grateful to the hon. Lady for raising can he confirm to the House precisely how much of the that point. I assure her that that is not a revenue-raising £1 billion allocated to carbon capture and storage will policy, but I am happy to raise her particular case with now be available for CCS projects before 2015? HMRC and find out what has happened in those circumstances, if she would like to contact me. The Chief Secretary to the Treasury (Danny Alexander): As the hon. Gentleman will know, the consequence of Philip Davies (Shipley) (Con): Which strategy does last week’s infrastructure announcement for Scotland the Chancellor think is best for dealing with a deficit is an additional £430 million to be spent in Scotland. caused by overspending: cutting expenditure by more We have said throughout this process that £1 billion is than 8% over the next four years, as the Irish Government available for the carbon capture and storage project. are doing, or increasing cash expenditure by more than The likelihood is that that project will be delayed because 5% over the next four years, as this Government are of the failure to agree the Longannet project, and we doing? will make funds available as soon as the competition is completed. Mr Osborne: I think, of course, that we have got the Harriett Baldwin (West Worcestershire) (Con): Given fiscal judgment right in this country, which is one of the that it is the festive season, will the Chancellor be able reasons for the support we have had from international to spend the proceeds of his bank tax more than 10 times investors and others. Each country must make its own over? decisions. Ireland has to had to make some very difficult decisions, although because of the interconnectedness Mr Osborne: Sadly, I am not a quack doctor who can of the British and Irish economies it is to be welcomed perform miracles and take a bank bonus tax and spend by everyone in this House that better economic news it 10 times over. What we have done is to introduce a has come out of Ireland more recently. permanent annual levy on the banks that raises in each and every year more than was ever raised in any year of Huw Irranca-Davies (Ogmore) (Lab): Given successive the previous Labour Government, net, and we are using quarters of downward revision of the growth forecasts that to pay for things like new nursery care for disadvantaged by the Office for Budget Responsibility and given that two-year-olds, and of course to deal with our deficit. eurozone countries are now outstripping the UK in 161 Oral Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Oral Answers 162 terms of upward growth figures, is the Chancellor proud substantial steps to improve their compliance with to have abolished boom and bust and to have replaced it international tax standards. We welcome that and will with bust and bust? further encourage it. Jonathan Edwards (Carmarthen East and Dinefwr) Mr Osborne: I do not know how long it took the hon. (PC): By what means will infrastructure projects in Gentleman to dream up that question, but he would Wales, Scotland and Northern Ireland access finance have spent his time better reading the economic forecasts from the pension funds element of the capital investment that he purported to give the House of Commons. They programme announced in the autumn statement? Is it a show the OBR downgrading its eurozone growth forecasts, matter for the devolved Governments to put forward and of course the OECD has forecast quite deep recessions projects or not? in some eurozone countries. The Labour party really has taken the most extraordinary position; in this week Danny Alexander: The agreement we have reached when we have the European Council meeting coming with pension funds will, in due course, set up a vehicle up, those in the Labour party are literally the only that enables pension fund investment to be made in people in Europe who think that the eurozone crisis is infrastructure projects right across the UK. Of course not having an impact on the British economy or the there are many infrastructure projects in the private other European economies. It is absolutely bizarre and sector in Wales, in Scotland and in Northern Ireland it shows why, in a week when some of the numbers have where that money can help to deliver those projects been going up, the one number that continues to fall is more quickly. The Welsh Assembly Government will be on the economic credibility of the Labour party. free to bring forward projects for which they think private sector money is suitable. I also say to the hon. Tessa Munt (Wells) (LD): What plans does the Chancellor Gentleman that we are in discussion with the Welsh have in place for peer reviews of the Crown dependencies Assembly Government about their proposals for expanding and the overseas territories, and what sanctions will be the M4, which is a significant infrastructure project in in place for individuals, banks and businesses that are its own right for Wales, for which Government money found not to be complying with international tax standards will need to be deployed. and are guilty of money laundering and tax avoidance? Several hon. Members rose— Mr Gauke: Of course we monitor these matters very Mr Speaker: Order. I am sorry to disappoint colleagues, closely and are in discussions with Crown dependencies but Treasury questions remains a popular sport, in and overseas territories, many of which are taking which demand rather heavily exceeds supply. 163 6 DECEMBER 2011 Benefits Uprating 164

Benefits Uprating To help manage expenditure, we shall be funding that above-earnings increase to the standard minimum guarantee by increasing the savings credit threshold, which means 3.34 pm that those with higher levels of income will see less of an increase. In his autumn statement, the Chancellor The Minister of State, Department for Work and told the House that we will uprate the standard minimum Pensions (Steve Webb): Mr Speaker, with permission I guarantee by £5.35 and that we would meet the cost should like to make a statement about the uprating of of the over-indexation by increasing the threshold for social security pensions and benefits for 2012-13. I shall the savings credit. That plan was correctly reflected in place in the Vote Office full details of the new rates that line 30 of table 2.1 on page 46 of the autumn statement, are due to come into force from the week of 9 April and it is indeed our plan. Unfortunately, the precise 2012 for each pension and benefit, and arrange for the thresholds, which were calculated by our Department figures to be published in the Official Report. and appear at paragraphs 1.143 and 2.24, were incorrect. As part of his autumn statement last week, my right I apologise to the House for this error, which I am now hon. Friend the Chancellor of the Exchequer announced in a position to correct. The correct thresholds for the rates of tax credits for 2012-13, and today I am savings credit from April 2012 will be £111.80 for single announcing the uprating of those social security pensions pensioners and £178.35 for couples. and benefits for which my Department is responsible. As many hon. Members will know, an important As my right hon. Friend Chancellor pointed out in his component of our plans for uprating pensions and statement, uprating in 2012-13 would protect benefits last year was the move to the consumer prices “those who have worked hard all their lives…poorer pensioners…those index— CPI. We believe that the CPI is a superior who are not able to work because of their disabilities…those who, measure of inflation for benefits and pensions uprating. through no fault of their own have lost their jobs and are trying to That is because the basket of goods on which it is based find work.”—[Official Report, 29 November 2011; Vol. 536, c. 802.] is a better match for the spending patterns of pensioners Starting with those who have worked hard all their and others on a low income, and because it takes better lives, I should like to turn to one of the early actions of account of the way in which lower income households the coalition Government: the restoration of the earnings respond to price changes. It is also the headline measure link for the basic state pension. This Government not of inflation in the UK, the target measure of inflation only made good on the pre-election promises to restore used by the Bank of England, and internationally the link with earnings, we went one step further by recognised. I am pleased to say that last week the High protecting the future value of the basic state pension Court upheld the Government’s position that the CPI with a triple guarantee—that the basic state pension can be used for pensions and benefits uprating. will rise each year by the highest of growth in earnings, The coalition will ensure that the value of other prices or 2.5%. The triple guarantee means that even in social security benefits is maintained through a rise of times of slow earnings growth, we will not see a repeat 5.2%, even in these tough economic times. This means of small rises such as, for example, 75p in 2000. for disabled people, above and below pension age, through The new rate for the basic state pension will be disability living allowance and attendance allowance, an £107.45 for a single person, an increase of £5.30 a week. increase of 5.2%; for people of working age who are not I can announce, therefore, that from April 2012, the fit for work, through employment and support allowance, basic state pension is forecast to be 17.1% of average an increase of 5.2%; and for people who have lost their earnings, a higher share of average earnings than in any jobs, through no fault of their own, through jobseeker’s year of the Labour Government since 1997. allowance, an increase of 5.2%. I turn now to additional state pensions, commonly On local housing allowance, at the emergency Budget referred to as SERPS—the state earnings-related pensions in June 2010, the Government announced that from 2013, scheme. In April 2010, one of the last acts of the local housing allowance rates will be calculated annually previous Government was to freeze SERPS pensions. by using the lower of the rent at the 30th percentile of This was in the apparent belief that pensioners had not local rents or the previous year’s rate uprated by reference experienced any inflation in the preceding year. That to CPI. This will end the monthly uprating of LHA was solely because the retail prices index was negative in rates and bring the system into line with the uprating of the year to September 2009, with the rising cost of other pensions and benefits. goods and services swamped by falling mortgage rates. As part of the preparation for this change, we need to However, in April 2011 we increased SERPS pensions fix LHA rates, to establish a baseline from which they by 3.1% and I am pleased to confirm that this year will be uprated in future. As the new cycle for uprating SERPS pensions will also rise by 5.2%. That means that LHA will be annual, we have decided that the baseline the total state pension increase for someone with a full should be one year ahead of the first uprating event. basic pension and average additional pension will be Therefore, LHA rates will be fixed from April 2012. around £6.70 a week or £348 a year. This approach means that there will be no reductions in The standard minimum guarantee in pension credit ongoing awards as a result of this change. must be increased each year at least in line with earnings. So at a time when the nation’s finances are under However, this would have implied an increase of just severe pressure, this Government will be spending an 2.8%; in other words, the poorest pensioners would extra £6.6 billion in 2012-13 to ensure that people are have got the smallest increase. We judged that unacceptable, protected against cost of living increases: no less than so instead, from April next year, the single person rate £4.5 billion extra on state pensions; over £1 billion extra of the guarantee credit will rise by £5.35, taking their on disabled people and their carers; and over £1 billion weekly income to £142.70. For couples, the increase will extra on people who are unable to work through sickness be £8.20, taking their new total to £217.90 a week. or unemployment. 165 Benefits Uprating6 DECEMBER 2011 Benefits Uprating 166

We protected the triple lock, securing the largest ever In addition, the Government’s benefits policy will cash rise in the basic state pension. We have uprated the increase child poverty. In its distributional analysis of pension credit as well, so that the poorest pensioners the autumn statement, the Treasury has admitted that benefit in full from the triple lock. We have uprated as a result of Government decisions the number of working age benefits by 5.2%, protecting the real incomes children living in households with incomes below 60% of of the poorest. Through this statement, I have outlined the median will increase by 100,000 in 2012-13, which our firm commitment to ensure that even in these means more children living in poverty. The IFS now difficult times, no one is left behind. I commend this estimates that the number of children living in poverty statement to the House. will rise by 600,000 over the next period. Surely the Government and the Minister cannot be proud of that. Gregg McClymont (Cumbernauld, Kilsyth and Let me ask the Minister some straightforward questions. Kirkintilloch East) (Lab): I thank the Minister for Minister, you signed up to the Child Poverty Act 2010. advance sight of his statement, and welcome some of Do you believe that under the terms and definitions of his announcements about the uprating of pensions. I that Act child poverty is set to rise under your Government? am delighted that on the issue of increasing the state You will have studied the IFS— pension age further, the Government have learned from some of their mistakes on the previous round Mr Speaker: Order. I gently say to the shadow Minister and will at least give adequate notice to those affected. that he knows that debate should be conducted through That is a positive move. I welcome the U-turn on the the Chair and that use of the word “you”is not encouraged mobility component of disability living allowance. The in the Chamber. We would be grateful if he addressed change should never have been proposed. We, along the Minister through the Chair. We are grateful that he with disability campaigners, have argued hard for a has some questions, but he must wrap them up pretty U-turn and we are pleased that the Government have sharpish. taken that action. Gregg McClymont: Thank you, Mr Speaker. Last year, in the wake of the autumn statement, the The Minister will have studied the IFS presentation. Minister told my predecessor that his Government had Will he confirm that its conclusion is that the people embarked on decisive action to take Britain out of the who will pay most will be those in the bottom 30%? danger zone. What a difference a year makes. The Does he agree with the Secretary of State that work Government’s economic policy has failed and is failing, incentives will be diminished by the Government’s actions and working families are paying the price. It is when a in the autumn statement and that the changes to tax Government’s back is against the wall that their true credits and public sector pay announced in the autumn character is revealed, because that is when the difficult statement will hit women disproportionately? choices have to be made. The failure is writ large in the Government’s revised borrowing forecasts. Steve Webb: I am grateful for the bits of the hon. We know that the Chancellor told the House that he Gentleman’s speech that actually responded to my is going to borrow £150 billion more than he planned— statement, because he appeared to agree with us entirely. £150 billion more. The Government are fond of the I am grateful for his support for our increase in the credit card analogy, and £150 billion is an astonishing basic state pension, our announcement on the state extra debt to add to the nation’s credit card bill. It is pension age and our changes on the mobility component the price of failure, and this failure is nowhere more of DLA. I also agree that we see the true colour of a apparent than in the extra £29 billion, largely the price Government when their back is against the wall. of rising unemployment, which the Government project Notwithstanding the huge pressure on the public finances, they will spend on benefits. What the Minister failed to for reasons he might understand, we took the view that say in his statement today is that to pay for the Government’s protecting the most vulnerable was a priority. That is own failure, they propose to take twice as much the true colour of this Government. money from children and families as they do from The hon. Gentleman asked about the distributional bankers. impact of the measures we have taken. I refer him to Chart 1.C of the distribution analysis published by the Let us look at the impact on families and women. We Treasury last week to accompany the autumn statement, are left with a benefits policy that hits the poorer which takes account of not only the measure set out in hardest. The Institute for Fiscal Studies, which used to that statement, but the cumulative impact of all that we employ the Minister, has said that measures in the are doing. I am sure that he will not want to be selective autumn statement would and will look at the whole picture. Page 4 of the analysis “take away from lower-income families with children.” includes a chart ranking people by what they spend, Even the Secretary of State had to admit to the House which shows that the proportion lost rises with income. last week that the bottom 30% do quite badly. The In other words, the smallest amounts lost are for the Government’s benefits policy will hit women harder lowest households and the largest cash amounts lost are than men. The House of Commons Library estimates for the highest households [Interruption.] Yes, cash is that of the £2.37 billion raised from tax credits and what matters to people. public sector pay changes introduced in the autumn The hon. Gentleman asked about work incentives, statement, 73%—£1.73 billion—will come from women and I am pleased to say that with his support the and 27% will come from men. Taking together all the universal credit that my right hon. Friend the Secretary changes to direct tax, benefits, pay and pensions announced of State wants to introduce will be the biggest boost to by the Chancellor since the general election, of the work incentives for many generations. Starting in 2013, £18.9 billion the Government are raising each year, we will be rewarding work instead of penalising it, and £13.2 billion comes from women. Women are being hit the best thing that we can do for low-income households twice as hard as men. is to enable them to work and to support them in that. 167 Benefits Uprating6 DECEMBER 2011 Benefits Uprating 168

[Steve Webb] Gloria De Piero (Ashfield) (Lab): Children’s well-being does not just depend on benefits; it is often about child The hon. Gentleman did not mention the many things maintenance, too. So what is fair about charging single that we are doing for low-paid working households, parents to use the Child Support Agency? such as the personal income tax allowance increases, the council tax freeze, the cuts in fuel duty and, above all, Steve Webb: The Under-Secretary of State for Work the low-interest-rate environment, which for households and Pensions, my hon. Friend the Member for Basingstoke with mortgages is crucial to their living standards. I am (Maria Miller) brought forward proposals only this grateful to him for the measures that he did welcome, week to make child maintenance more effective, because, but there was a lot more that he should have welcomed. as the hon. Lady rightly says, getting child maintenance paid is crucial. We believe that far too little is paid and Mrs Anne Main (St Albans) (Con): I am sure that the the cost of collecting it is disproportionate to what we £6.6 billion that the Minister has announced today will receive, so we need an efficient child maintenance system, be welcome to many families in the UK, but I am and that is what we propose to bring forward. extremely concerned that the European Commission is seeking to open that benefit pot to European benefit Nigel Mills (Amber Valley) (Con): Does the Minister tourists who seek to avail themselves of it. That £6.6 billion agree that rather than trapping more low-paid families will be in no way enough if we are to encompass in the complicated web of means-tested benefits, which benefits for European benefit tourists. has done so much damage already, taking them out of tax altogether is by far the better approach? Steve Webb: I can assure my hon. Friend that my Steve Webb: My hon. Friend is quite right that we right hon. Friend the Member for Epsom and Ewell have already taken, I think, just over 1 million families (Chris Grayling), the employment Minister, has quite or individuals out of tax. We have a long-term goal of a categorically stated that Britain does not believe in £10,000 tax-free allowance, which would take out millions benefit tourism, and that we will do all we can to more, but what is often not understood is that couples prevent it. in which both members go out to work to make ends Mr Frank Field (Birkenhead) (Lab): Is it not true that meet get twice as much benefit. Each benefits from the the Minister’s partial statement today will in the next personal tax allowance increase, so it helps precisely couple of years result in decreasing the incentive to those most hard-pressed families in which both parents work? If the Treasury believed in localism and had work all hours to keep their family going. given the £6.6 billion to the Department to spend on Dame Anne Begg (Aberdeen South) (Lab): People uprating as it wished to, would not the Minister have can get the uprating only if they get the benefit in the made a statement today that increased work incentives first place, and, despite what the Minister said about rather than decreased them? protecting those who have worked hard all their lives, there is a measure in the Welfare Reform Bill which Steve Webb: The right hon. Gentleman, for whom I time-limits contributory employment support allowance have a great deal of respect, will be aware that the to one year, so a large number of people who work all reward for working comes from a combination of factors, their lives but drop out of work because of ill health will one of which is the tax burden on the low-paid, and that get nothing after that. this Government have twice increased the personal tax allowance by about £1,500. That is worth more than Steve Webb: As the hon. Lady, the Chair of the Work £300 a year for a standard rate taxpayer and, for two and Pensions Committee, knows, that is a measure in members of a couple in low-paid work, is a £600 gain the Welfare Reform Bill being considered in another with more to come. That is a real reward for working place, but we have put in place two safeguards—that the which all too often they have not had in the past. most sick and the most poor are protected. In other words, those in the support group will continue on an Jenny Willott (Cardiff Central) (LD): I welcome the un-time-limited basis to get ESA, and those with no fact that the state pension and the state earnings-related other household income will continue, through income- pension scheme will rise by 5.2%, and that pension related ESA, to be helped. So, at a time when we have to credit will do so above earnings, but different levels of find savings, protecting the most vulnerable and the uprating and a complex system can make it difficult for poorest seems to us to be a priority. pensioners to understand exactly what they should expect. Will the Minister do all that he can to simplify the Mr Philip Hollobone (Kettering) (Con): Pensioners in system and bring in a flat-rate pension as soon as the Kettering constituency will warmly welcome the possible, so that pensioners are able to see clearly and £5.30 a week increase in the basic state pension to easily what pension they should expect? £107.45. Can the Minister also confirm that for periods of extreme cold he is announcing a permanent increase Steve Webb: My hon. Friend is characteristically in the cold weather payment from £8.50 to £25? persuasive. It is absolutely clear that a system in which we pay a wholly inadequate basic pension—we pay a Steve Webb: My hon. Friend is absolutely right; it pension that, even after the uprating to £107 a week, is was remiss of me not to trumpet that fact. Last year, we not enough to live on, so we will top it up—cannot be a announced that we were reversing Labour’s planned cut sustainable basis for the future. We therefore continue in the cold weather payment, which was due to fall to to develop our proposals for state pension reform, £8.50 and will now be £25 in each year of this Parliament. precisely so that we get more money to people automatically, Last year, we spent over £400 million to help the most with less reliance on complicated means tests that mean vulnerable when it is freezing cold, and that is a priority too many people do not get what they should. for this coalition Government. 169 Benefits Uprating6 DECEMBER 2011 Benefits Uprating 170

John McDonnell (Hayes and Harlington) (Lab): Many Steve Webb: I know that the hon. Lady was a Minister of my constituents may well have welcomed the increase, in our Department, and she will understand that the but they cannot because they are no longer receiving way the housing benefit system works is that people in their benefit, particularly as a result of the extremely the social rented sector, provided that they are not bizarre assessments of their disability by Atos— over-occupying, get their full rent, whether it is increased by CPI or RPI. The fact remains that including mortgage Mr Speaker: Order. I apologise for having to interrupt interest in a measure of inflation for pensioners when, the hon. Gentleman. I do not know what has come over as she rightly says, most pensioners do not have an the hon. Member for South West Bedfordshire (Andrew outstanding mortgage, is the wrong thing to do. Selous). He is normally the very model of restraint, good manners and kindness to all things human and Mr Marcus Jones (Nuneaton) (Con): How much animal, and I am sure that he will recover his poise, but better off will the average pensioner in Nuneaton be I want to hear the hon. Gentleman’s question; if he following the introduction of the triple lock guarantee wants to start it again, he can. and the restoration of the link between earnings and pensions? John McDonnell: Many of my constituents would have welcomed the increase but they cannot because Steve Webb: For someone retiring this year on a full they are no longer receiving their benefit, particularly as basic state pension, the triple lock, we estimate, will a result of the Atos assessments of disability living benefit them to the tune of about £13,000 over the allowance. In addition to that, having lost, or not gained, course of their retirement. That is a very significant their benefit, they are waiting long periods for their change whose effects we are not yet seeing in full appeals. Will the Minister look at the length of time because earnings growth is depressed, but as it returns that people are waiting for their appeals and the number to more normal times, pensioners in Nuneaton and of appeals that have been postponed as a result of lack elsewhere will see real increases year after year. of staff? Simon Danczuk (Rochdale) (Lab): As we approach Steve Webb: The hon. Gentleman is bringing together Christmas, does the Minister not think it extremely sad several different issues. It is entirely the case that at the that his latest cuts to tax credits will put a further time of the election the previous Government had given 100,000 children into poverty? Atos a contract for the work capability assessment for ESA—not DLA—and we have gone through with Steve Webb: I am glad that the hon. Gentleman has the Harrington process, independent reviews and raised that point, because it is a selective quotation recommendations for change, all implemented by the from the autumn statement. As well as making the Government. Good progress is being made on making changes to tax credits, we are over-indexing benefits the system fit for purpose, but getting the decision right relative to average incomes. As poverty is measured in first time is better than speeding up the appeals process, relation to average income and we are putting up benefits and we are doing that more and more because we are according to CPI, which is about twice the rise in reforming the system. average income, child poverty will be reduced compared with the figure that he gave. There is more to this than Philip Davies (Shipley) (Con): Further to the point meets the eye. made by the right hon. Member for Birkenhead (Mr Field), how on earth can the Minister justify increasing benefits Harriett Baldwin (West Worcestershire) (Con): The by over 5% when people who are in work are facing a Minister will be aware that many more women than pay freeze or, at best, very modest increases in their men are on pension credit and that about 60% of salary? Is not that another kick in the teeth to hard-working pensioners are women. Does this increase not therefore taxpayers, and does it not go against the Government’s disproportionately help women? priority to try to make work pay? Steve Webb: My hon. Friend is quite right. Not only Steve Webb: My right hon. Friend the Secretary of does the pensions boost help women, but the pension State is absolutely committed to making work pay credit boost helps women. Reflecting on the Opposition’s through a combination of benefit reform, with the question about the combined effect of our measures, it universal credit, with which we are pressing ahead, is worth saying that the one measure excluded from that taking people out of tax, as well as the council tax question was the VAT rise. They excluded that because freeze and the petrol duty cut. There is a whole range of men, on average, have higher incomes and higher spending. factors about whether work pays. I believe that we have In particular, they have higher spending on VATables, done a great deal for people in low-paid work, and there so the impact of the VAT rise hits men more than is much more to come. women. For some reason, the Opposition did not count that measure. Helen Goodman (Bishop Auckland) (Lab): The Minister made much of his belief that CPI protects the standard Hywel Williams (Arfon) (PC): May I welcome the of living of pensioners, but on Friday an old-age pensioner Government’s decision on the mobility component? came to see me and pointed out that the Department That is vindication of the wide campaign on this issue, for Communities and Local Government target for which included my early-day motion and the 88-odd rents in the social sector is linked to RPI. Does not that Members who signed it. On a slightly more incredulous display the fact that the problem Ministers have is that note, would the Minister claim that the move to CPI they assume that everyone is like them and is an owner- and the large savings to Government expenditure are occupier? entirely coincidental? 171 Benefits Uprating6 DECEMBER 2011 Benefits Uprating 172

Steve Webb: I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman for desperate to find employment? They should not be welcoming our decisions on the DLA mobility component. attacked by hon. Members in the way that I have Clearly, the decision on CPI was taken in a fiscal mentioned. context. However, it came after RPI was negative and CPI was positive, so the immediate context was a year Steve Webb: I have no doubt that the vast majority of in which state earnings-related pension schemes and people who are unemployed are actively looking for public sector pensions had all been frozen. I certainly jobs. Indeed, that is a condition of payment of jobseeker’s could not believe that there had not been any inflation, allowance. We would not pay people if they were not and I am yet to meet a pensioner who could. actively seeking work. The very fact that there are many unemployed people in the hon. Gentleman’s constituency—I grew up near Walsall, so I know the area well—is why Nia Griffith (Llanelli) (Lab): As we all understand, we have to get the nation’s public finances on an even with rocketing fuel and food prices these rises are not as keel. We have seen what happens to countries that do generous as they look. Has the Department assessed the not do so. impact of the £100 cut in the winter fuel allowance, combined with the fact that those on low incomes spend Jonathan Ashworth (Leicester South) (Lab): Further a lot of money on food and fuel? People will actually be to his answers to my hon. Friend the Member for worse off, particularly those with an income that puts Edmonton (Mr Love) and my right hon. Friend the them just above the bracket for claiming the cold weather Member for Birkenhead (Mr Field), who is no longer in payment. his place, does the Minister accept that the changes to working tax credits act as a disincentive to work? Does Steve Webb: It was entirely right that we went ahead that explain why, according to newspaper reports, the with Labour’s planned cut to the winter fuel payment. Secretary of State is so angry about that change and We reversed the cold weather payment cut to prioritise baffled that the Liberal Democrats pushed for it? the most vulnerable when it is most cold. I make no apology Steve Webb: There is a danger of missing the central for that. It was important to put the full 5.2% through points here, which are that people are better off in for people with no wage because of the pressures on work, and we want to go further; that the tax credits are household fuel bills and other costs. That is why it was part of a package of measures, and I have listed repeatedly vital that we stood by the most vulnerable even though the many things that make work pay; and that our money was tight. increases in personal tax allowances, for example, will make work pay far more than in the past. The coalition Mr Andrew Love (Edmonton) (Lab/Co-op): Will the is united on that. Minister take this opportunity to admit that the policies Sheila Gilmore (Edinburgh East) (Lab): The Minister of the coalition have led to a diminution of work is trumpeting the highest ever increase for pensioners, incentives? If we are to believe press reports, that appears which I am sure they welcome, but is not the truth that to be the opinion of the Secretary of State. Was there it is so high only because inflation is so high? This is not any consultation with the Chancellor about his autumn some generous gift from the Government; it merely statement? Does this not show that the Government are allows pensioners to keep up with prices. Further to in disarray over this issue? that, many pensioner groups would point out that the real types of inflation faced by pensioners are actually Steve Webb: People are still better off in work. When higher than CPI. we have the Secretary of State’s universal credit, that Steve Webb: I do not recall the previous Government will be even more the case. The hon. Gentleman is ever using something other than inflation or using a focusing on a narrow aspect of the measures that we different rate for pensioners because of factors such as have taken. Personal income tax allowance increases, those the hon. Lady mentions. Sometimes the pensioner the cuts in fuel duty compared with Labour’s escalator rate will be higher and sometimes it will be lower, but on plan and the cuts in council tax in real terms will all average it will be broadly the same. There was a lot of help people in work and make it pay to work. We have speculation—she may even have read some of it—that plans to take that further. we would not provide a 5.2% increase, that we would break the triple lock, that we would average out the Mr David Winnick (Walsall North) (Lab): The hon. figures or do all sorts of things, but we stuck by our Member for Shipley (Philip Davies), who is yet to reach promise and provided a 5.2% increase. The real value of the 19th century, attacked the unemployed. I point out the pension as a share of average earnings—that is what to the Minister that a store in my constituency had pensions are for: to replace the earnings that people 20 vacancies when it opened and 250 people applied. Is used to have—is higher than in any year under Labour, that not an illustration of people out of work and and I am proud to put my name to that. 173 6 DECEMBER 2011 Registration of Commercial Lobbying 174 Interests Registration of Commercial Lobbying in Westminster, many of them specifically lobbying for Interests health contracts, often for big, commercial health outfits based in north America. Here are a few examples: Motion for leave to bring in a Bill (Standing Order Citigate Dewe Rogerson lobbies on behalf of Benenden No. 23) and Nuffield; Grayling lobbies on behalf of Cambian, GE Healthcare and Nuffield; Lexington Communications 4.6 pm lobbies on behalf of Bupa, GlaxoSmithKline Beecham, Novartis and Pfizer; and MHP Communications lobbies John Cryer (Leyton and Wanstead) (Lab): I beg to on behalf of Ellipse, IMS Health, Lundbeck, Roche, move, Grünenthal, Hoffman-La Roche and Janssen-Cilag. That leave be given to bring in a Bill to establish a public register of organisations that carry out lobbying of Parliament Incidentally, one special adviser at the Department of for commercial gain; to make provision for disclosure of expenditure Health happens to have worked for MHP Communications by such organisations; and for connected purposes. before he went to the Department. That relationship The Bill is in a very peculiar position among private might be above board, but we do not know because it is Members’ Bills, in that it is as relevant today as it was not transparent—we do not know what goes on in the 20-odd years ago. It was first presented to the House in heart of government. 1982 by my father, who was then the MP for Keighley, Some will argue that the Bill is unnecessary because and again in 1988 when he was the MP for Bradford the Association of Professional Political Consultants South. has a code of conduct, but that argument simply holds I am not seeking to bring in the Bill on the basis that I no water. For instance, the code bars payment in cash or am looking for a place in the “Guinness Book of in kind to any parliamentarian, but Grayling public Records” for having presented the Bill with the longest affairs is owned by Huntsworth, the chief executive of gestation period in British history. The reason is that which is Lord Chadlington, who is obviously a Britain now has a £2 billion lobbying industry, much of parliamentarian, and Bell Pottinger public affairs is it centred here in Westminster. I believe that there is a owned by Chime Communications, of which Lord Bell, strong mood among the public to make lobbying more who is also a parliamentarian, is the chairman. Perhaps transparent and accountable, and that will only be they do it on a voluntary basis, but I doubt it; I suspect reinforced by the story on the front page of The Independent that they are paid by those lobbying outfits. this morning that appears to show that Bell Pottinger and perhaps other lobbying firms have profound influence That brings us rather neatly to the story in The at the centre and seat of government. I will come to that Independent today that Bell Pottinger staff have been later. secretly filmed making the most alarming claims to have influence at the very heart of government, even The Bill would require that all companies, partnerships inside No. 10 Downing street. They claim to have got or sole traders that sought to lobby Parliament in order the Prime Minister to speak to the Chinese Premier on to influence legislation or its application as their sole, behalf of their business clients at something like 12 hours’ major or subsidiary commercial purpose must be registered. notice; they boast of having access to the Foreign It would not impede the ordinary lobbyist—the ordinary Secretary, the Prime Minister’s chief of staff, Ed Llewellyn, constituent or member of the public, who has a right to and to the Prime Minister’s closest adviser, Steve Hilton; lobby his or her Member of Parliament. Nor would it and they claim to be able to get MPs—presumably from affect the ability of a company, co-operative, trade the Government Benches, although that is not made unionist or residents association to lobby Parliament. clear—to attack investigative journalists for the smallest My fear is that local groups such as residents and of errors in order to rubbish stories when journalists tenants groups do not have the financial muscle of big investigate, for example, the Uzbek Government or corporations that can bring professional lobbyists to large health conglomerates. bear on Parliament and be more successful and carry more weight as a result. Reporters from The Independent posed as agents of During the 1980s, when big consortia and companies the Uzbek Government, who have one of the worst were lobbying for contracts to build the channel tunnel, human rights records on the face of the planet. Bell one Jonathan Aitken, who was then a Conservative MP, Pottinger aimed for a contract worth £1 million. Bell said—ironically, in light of later events: Pottinger, which since its foundation 30 years ago has been close to the heart of the Conservative party, did “’What worries me most is that usually lobbying is genuine in the sense that it stems from little interest groups and concerned not hesitate to discuss signing a contract that would citizens. Here we are seeing the Panzer division of big business, include lobbying on behalf of the Uzbek Government, their heavy artillery and tanks trampling over all the small people’s who, apart from anything else, we are told, boiled two interests which I want to see better defended.” opponents alive in water, but there we are. I agree with that. It is odd that he should have said it, Tim Collins, the managing director of Bell Pottinger but I agree. Those Panzer divisions and that heavy Public Affairs, is a former MP. He is not regarded artillery are now being brought to bear on possibly a over-fondly on the Opposition Benches—if I can put it greater scale than ever before. that way—but he says in the film: Strangely enough, the Prime Minister agreed with me “I’ve been working with…Steve Hilton, David Cameron, George a few months ago about wanting to introduce a Bill that Osborne, for 20 years-plus…There is not a problem in getting the would establish a register of lobbyists, but he seems to messages through”. have changed his mind. He promised a consultation paper on establishing such a Bill by the end of November, He was talking about lobbying on behalf of the Uzbek but that consultation paper has not yet appeared. There Government when he said that there is are now many large and powerful lobbying firms busy “not a problem in getting the messages through”. 175 Registration of Commercial Lobbying 6 DECEMBER 2011 Registration of Commercial Lobbying 176 Interests Interests [John Cryer] make their case. One of the things that I despair of in politics is that increasingly politicians want to be on the Strangely, when a No. 10 spokesman was contacted last popular side of the argument and that we are in danger night by The Independent and asked about the story, he of having a generation of politicians who will argue for said: what 75% of the public want rather than the other 25%. “It is simply not true that Bell Pottinger or indeed any other Actually, the 25% also deserve to have their case heard, lobbying firm has any influence on government policy”, and lobbyists can play a useful role in allowing organisations which is a fairly strange claim. If it is true, all former that might not be immediately popular and might not MPs who are now lobbyists, all former lobbyists who even have a particularly popular message to get across are now MPs and all full-time lobbyists have wasted to have their voice heard as well. Surely, in a democracy their time all these years. They have had absolutely no all voices should be able to be heard whether or not they effect on Government policy, so why did they not go are popular. and do something else? The idea that large corporations, This Bill could lead to many organisations and Members multinational companies and big banks that hire big of Parliament becoming lobby shy. Discouraging lobbying lobbying firms to exercise influence at the heart of altogether, as the hon. Gentlemen wishes, would lead to government have absolutely no consequence and no poorer law-making. I make no apology for the fact that influence whatever is pretty difficult to stomach. I meet people who have a particular view that they want The reality is that this Government are very close to to express. It does not mean I will end up agreeing with vested interests in the City, big corporate interests and them, and I am sure it does not mean that the hon. big businesses. They have not the faintest idea what is Gentleman agrees with everybody who advocates their going on in 99% of the rest of the country, where people case to him. None the less, it is perfectly reasonable that are suffering under the cuts that are being introduced they should be able to have their say and that we should with a heartlessness not seen since the 1930s. They have be able to listen to their arguments. We can either accept absolutely no idea of the effect of the cuts in public their arguments if they are good ones or we can dismiss services, but they know big business and the City, partly them if they are not so good. I am surprised that the because the City provides more than 50% of Conservative hon. Gentleman has so little faith in people in this party finances. For the first time in British history, City House that he thinks that just because someone makes individuals and businesses finance the—[Interruption.] a case to them, they will automatically agree with it, The Chancellor is saying something from a sedentary pick it up and run with it. It does not mean anything of position. Perhaps he is contradicting what I am saying, the sort; it just means that other voices can be heard. so I shall say it again very clearly: City institutions and What was sadly lacking in the hon. Gentleman’s individuals finance more than 50% of Conservative speech was anything to do with trade unions. He had a party funds. It is just those sorts of big financial interests lot to say about the lobbying of Members of Parliament that hire lobbying firms and that then go to No. 10, and by businesses, but he was reluctant to mention the perhaps No. 11, to exercise influence there to steer importance of the lobbying of Members of Parliament Government policy in particular directions. by trade unions. His Bill talks about establishing If the Prime Minister were serious about introducing “a public register of organisations to carry out lobbying of legislation that creates a register of lobbyists, he would Parliament for commercial gain”. take on my Bill; it has certainly been around for long It seems that he has deliberately designed his words to enough. He would push it through its parliamentary exclude trade unions from his provisions. He wants a stages and put it on the statute book. It is perfectly system in which trade unions can lobby anybody as simple. If he is not prepared to do that, I will assume much as they like and spend as much money as they like that he and perhaps the Chancellor, who was mumbling on doing so, but anyone else in the commercial world a while ago about something or other, have something will not have any opportunity to do so. That is his real to hide. Perhaps they and their advisers are a bit too agenda—to push forward the trade union argument. close to powerful commercial interests. An opinion poll conducted by ComRes asked MPs about the number of approaches they typically received 4.15 pm each week from various organisations, and the results were startling: 59% of MPs said that they received 20 or Philip Davies (Shipley) (Con): I have a great deal of more approaches from interest groups, but in sheer regard for the hon. Member for Leyton and Wanstead lobbying volume the approaches from interest groups (John Cryer) who proposed this Bill. He will know that that included trade unions and non-governmental the people in the Bradford district still have a great deal organisations outnumbered those from the corporate of regard for his father, who originally brought in this world. The hon. Gentleman wants to entrench that Bill, and for his mother, too. However, I am afraid that position. In effect, he wants the trade unions to have all the Bill is typical of the Labour party’s nanny state the influence that they desire and nobody to be able to bureaucracy and its belief that the Government should argue against any of the things for which they lobby. have a role in everything. That would be a triumph not for democracy but for his Although the hon. Gentleman started by saying that own agenda. A perfectly effective self-regulatory system he just wanted to introduce a register of lobbyists, it is already in place. became increasingly clear that he was against lobbying I do not want to detain the House any further and I altogether and wanted to see an end to it, but only for certainly do not intend to call a Division, but I thought businesses and commercial enterprises. None the less, it important that the one-sidedness of the hon. Gentleman’s lobbying plays an important part in any democratic argument be made abundantly clear. The Bill is not process. It gives a voice to a whole range of groups and necessary or desirable. We should be prepared to listen interests within our democracy by allowing them to to people who want to lobby from all parts of society, 177 Registration of Commercial Lobbying 6 DECEMBER 2011 178 Interests whether they be businesses, trade unions, charities or The Economy other organisations, and we should not support a Bill that tries to prevent certain people from getting their Mr Speaker: Before I call the Chancellor, I remind message across just because he happens not to agree the House that in view of the high level of interest in the with it. debate I have imposed a six-minute limit on each Back- Question put and agreed to. Bench contribution. Ordered, That John Cryer, Natascha Engel, Mr Dennis Skinner, 4.22 pm Lisa Nandy, Kelvin Hopkins, Grahame M. Morris, Bob The Chancellor of the Exchequer (Mr George Osborne): Russell, Caroline Lucas, Mr Tom Watson and Valerie I beg to move, Vaz present the Bill. That this House has considered the matter of the economy. John Cryer accordingly presented the Bill. I am pleased that the House has been given this early Bill read the First time; to be read a Second time on opportunity to debate last week’s autumn statement Friday 20 January 2012, and to be printed (Bill 258). and to discuss the economic challenges that our country and continent face. Being conscious that many people have asked to speak, I shall try to tailor my remarks appropriately. Seven days ago I set out the Office for Budget Responsibility’s latest independent forecasts and the measures that we would take to reinforce our country’s fiscal credibility and keep our interest rates low, increase the supply of money and credit to ensure that those rates were passed on to businesses and home buyers, and lay the foundations for a more resilient, more competitive and more balanced economy. That was one week ago, and in the seven days since events have provided further confirmation of why these measures are necessary: countries such as Ireland and Italy have announced further budget measures from VAT rises to pension age increases, reminding us of the value of getting ahead of the markets not following them, and the credit ratings of 15 eurozone countries have been put on negative watch, while here in Britain interest rates have stayed low despite the deterioration of the fiscal forecast, which has meant that last week we continued to borrow at below 2.5%. [Interruption.] I thought that the shadow Chancellor was about to intervene, but we shall have to wait. Last week I answered questions from Members who wished to ask me about the detailed policy measures in the autumn statement, and I am happy to answer such questions again today, but I thought this might also be a good opportunity to address three broader issues: first, the crisis in the eurozone; secondly, how we believe that the UK banking system should respond to the ongoing crisis and the advice that we received on Thursday from the Bank of England’s Financial Policy Committee; and thirdly, given the eurozone debt crisis and the banking issues that we face, why the credibility of our fiscal policy must be constantly reinforced. Let me take each in turn. On the eurozone, our overriding responsibility is to protect and advance the interests of the United Kingdom. Those interests are best served by the countries of the euro finding a path out of the crisis, while also ensuring that our economic interests in the single market are protected. There is no doubt that the crisis is having a chilling effect on the British economy and destroying jobs here. In the words of the Governor of the Bank of England last Thursday, it is, in his judgment, the primary cause of the downward revision of the British growth forecasts, as it was one of the primary causes of the OBR’s downward revision of its growth forecast. Of course, the OBR warned us that it had assumed an orderly resolution of the crisis over the next two years. 179 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 180

[Mr George Osborne] small businesses from the higher costs of credit, we are pursuing the credit easing policy that I set out last week. This impact sadly comes as no surprise, when 40% of I have set a ceiling of £40 billion on those operations, our exports are to the euro area and £1 in every £7 that and have committed to £20 billion of guarantees through Britain exports goes to Ireland, Portugal, Greece, Spain the national loan guarantee scheme, and £1 billion or Italy. Although we must plan for all contingencies—and through the business finance partnership. Although the we are—we should not lose sight of the truth that means are different, the ends we seek are the same. Britain has a fundamental national interest in the eurozone sorting out its problems, even though we are not in the Angela Smith (Penistone and Stocksbridge) (Lab): Is euro and will not be while this Government are in office. not the Chancellor’s credit easing scheme an admission Action is required by the eurozone on three counts. that his earlier deal—the Merlin deal—has completely First, as Germany has argued, and as I made clear in and utterly failed? July, there needs to be much tighter fiscal discipline within member states and much tighter fiscal co-ordination Mr Osborne: The Merlin deal was for this year, and it within the euro. This is the remorseless logic of monetary was a commitment to increase gross lending to small union. Secondly, those reforms to economic governance businesses, which is what the banks have done. Of should provide the confidence in the future discipline course, the previous Government, having tried net lending that the European Central Bank requires to take whatever targets, then had gross lending targets with just two action is necessary to protect financial confidence. We banks. The Merlin deal extended that to all the main have been calling consistently for a big firewall, properly high street banks. It was a one-year-only deal; the credit capitalised banks and lasting structural reform, and we easing package that I have set out is, I think, what is now need that delivered. Thirdly, all this will succeed required—not least in view of the tightening credit only if there is an improvement in the competitiveness conditions across the continent of Europe and, indeed, of the whole of Europe, and also, crucially, in the across the world at the moment. The Government are competitiveness of the peripheral eurozone countries using the credibility they have in the financial markets vis-à-vis countries such as Germany. That will involve to borrow at low interest rates and passing those rates difficult change, but it is encouraging to see some European on to small businesses. As I said at Treasury questions, Governments, such as Ireland and Italy, now starting to we are seeking state aid clearance and hope to have the take the necessary steps on issues such as pensions and national loan guarantee scheme operational by early labour market reform. next year. Britain has a huge interest in all that happening and At a time like this, we also have to be alert to risks has put forward specific proposals to ensure that our across the financial system. One of the weaknesses of entire continent is not priced out of the world economy. the tripartite regime is that no one felt they had a As an open, trading nation, we benefit from the single particular responsibility for monitoring the overall health market. We would like it strengthened and deepened, of the financial system or felt they had the tools to do but we will also insist that our interests in the single anything about it. We have created a Financial Policy market are protected from any future developments, Committee to do just that. We have established it on an including our interest in financial services. That is the interim basis to get it operating as soon as possible, approach that Britain will take to the European Council instead of waiting for next year’s primary legislation. later this week. We need better regulated financial services The FPC reported last week. Let me put it on the record to protect our economy when things go wrong, which is that it is absolutely the job of the Governor of the Bank one reason why we commissioned John Vickers’s report. of England to be frank with the country about the We want a single market in Europe so that our banks, challenges we face. our insurance companies and our pension companies As the Financial Policy Committee warned very starkly: can sell their products abroad, but 70% of Europe’s “Sovereign and banking risks emanating from the euro area financial services are based in London. We will ensure remain the most significant and immediate threat to UK financial as we approach this European Council that the interests stability.” of the European Union 27 are protected and that The committee encouraged banks to improve the resilience Britain’s national interests are protected too. That is our of their balance sheets in a way that does not exacerbate obligation to the British people. market fragility or reduce lending to the real economy. Let me turn from the eurozone crisis to what all this Given what it calls means for our banks. British banks are well capitalised “the current exceptionally threatening environment, the Committee and liquid. Not one of them was identified as a cause recommends that, if bank earnings were insufficient to build for concern in the recent exercise by the European capital levels further, banks should limit distributions and give Banking Authority. I remind people that retail deposits serious consideration to raising external capital in the coming in British banks or the subsidiaries of foreign banks months.” here in Britain are protected by our country’s Financial That is the point put to me by the Chairman of the Services Compensation Scheme, which ensures that £85,000 Treasury Select Committee just an hour ago at Treasury per person per bank is protected. Individuals with deposits questions. Limiting distribution includes restricting bonuses. in a UK branch of a European bank are protected by Excessive pay in the financial sector is a concern at any their national schemes. time because of the perverse incentives it creates. The eurozone crisis is tightening credit conditions When it comes to linking pay to performance and across the world and across Europe. The Bank of England being transparent, we are implementing the most announced today the introduction of a new contingency comprehensive regime of any financial centre anywhere liquidity facility—the extended collateral term repo—which in the world. Today the Treasury launches a consultation it will make available if needed. In addition, to protect that will extend transparency arrangements at large 181 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 182 banks by requiring the eight highest-paid non-board Mr David Hanson (Delyn) (Lab) rose— executives to disclose their pay and bonus arrangements. This will cover an estimated 15 banks, including the Mr Osborne: And the right hon. Member for Delyn largest UK banks and the UK banking operations of (Mr Hanson) was a Minister in that Government. large foreign banks. Mr Hanson: Will the Chancellor give us some idea of Gordon Banks (Ochil and South Perthshire) (Lab) how many bank employees’ salaries of over £1 million rose— will not be disclosed because of his failure to implement legislation enacted by the Labour Government? Mr Osborne: I will certainly give way; I hope the hon. Gentleman will welcome this change. Mr Osborne: Anyone listening to Opposition Members would believe that under the mythical Labour Government Gordon Banks: Will the Chancellor tell us how that apparently existed, all that information was disclosed. transparency will actually reduce the income of those to But was it disclosed? There was no disclosure whatsoever. whom he refers? I suggest to the shadow Chancellor—the former City Minister—and others that they back the unilateral measures Mr Osborne: Transparency should make it clear to that we are taking, which will make the financial centre the owners of these banks—the shareholders—what the here in London the most transparent in the world. pay and bonus levels and the remuneration levels are; it The advice of the Financial Policy Committee is will then be for them to take action. I am aware of our clear. Banks should consider limiting bonuses this year responsibilities as a shareholder in some banks. As I and using profits to strengthen their balance sheets in mentioned at Treasury questions, an encouraging statement the face of the eurozone debt storm. Let me make this was made this morning by the Association of British plain: stronger banks, not larger bonuses, should be the Insurers, which represents the shareholders who own priority this winter, and money that is earned should be many of these banks, saying clearly that it does not used to build balance sheets and not to enhance payouts. accept current levels of pay in the financial sector and That is the advice from the Bank of England, and that that it expects reform. As I said, we had a very clear is the advice that the Government now expect to be warning from the Financial Policy Committee to the followed. financial system that it should be limiting its distributions at a time like this. Helen Goodman (Bishop Auckland) (Lab): Will the Ed Balls (Morley and Outwood) (Lab/Co-op) rose— Chancellor tell us what he, as a major shareholder in some of the largest banks in the country, will do about Mr Andrew Love (Edmonton) (Lab/Co-op) rose— the bank bonuses on which he can have a direct impact?

Mr Osborne: I give way first to the shadow Chancellor Mr Osborne: We restricted cash payouts in the Royal and then to the member of the Treasury Committee. Bank of Scotland in the last bonus round to less than £2,000. That is what we did when we had the opportunity. Ed Balls: Labour Members welcome the Chancellor’s The hon. Lady was a Minister in the last Government. conversion to transparency in financial affairs. He will Perhaps in 30 years’ time we will discover that she was know that, following the Walker review, a piece of sending letters to the Treasury asking “What are we legislation is on the statute book that requires the doing about transparency in pay in the City? Why do we publication of the salaries of all employees paid more not introduce a permanent bank levy?”, and saying “I than £1 million. Given that the legislation is on the am really worried about the regulation of Britain’s statute book but that this Government have chosen not financial services.” We will just have to wait for 30 years to enact it, will he now enact it and therefore bring to find out whether, when she held Executive office, she about full transparency for anyone in the City earning once raised the concerns that she now raises in opposition. more than £1 million? Both the slow repair of our banking system and the crisis in the eurozone were identified by the Office for Mr Osborne: I think that, in the interests of transparency, Budget Responsibility as causes of weaker economic the right hon. Gentleman should have told the House that activity. They are also a reminder of why it is so he was the City Minister who, for several years, had the essential for Britain to maintain its fiscal credibility as opportunity to introduce these changes. What about the we deal with a budget deficit that is higher than almost opportunity that he had to do precisely the things that any other in the world. A month ago I was told by the we are doing today? When it comes to transparency in OBR, as part of the formal preparation for the autumn pay, we have consulted David Walker and others, and forecast, that weaker economic activity would give Britain we think that this is exactly the right approach. We will a less than 50% chance of meeting the fiscal mandate introduce the changes unilaterally in the United Kingdom, and the debt target that I had set out unless we took although it is a significant financial centre, and I think further action. that they will set an example that the rest of the world I believe that at that moment the OBR proved not will follow. just its independence, but its worth. It forced the Government to confront the issues at hand, and to use Several hon. Members rose— the weeks available to us before the statement to come up with a credible response. We know that under the Mr Osborne: I will give way if one single Opposition previous forecast regime, those weeks would have been Member concedes that Labour was in government for used to fiddle the forecasts, to tweak assumptions about 13 years and presided over a banking system that collapsed. the output gap, and to pencil in over-optimistic numbers 183 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 184

[Mr George Osborne] will listen that that is their problem. Until they face up to the reality of the economic situation confronting this on tax receipts: in other words, to do all the things that country—a reality they helped to create—they will not my predecessor, in his memoirs, says were done during be listened to by anyone in this country. his dealings with No. 10 Downing street. It would The choice we faced when we saw the OBR’s first-round have been a case of choosing economic figures to fit the forecast was not whether to fiddle the figures; instead, it Government’s policies, rather than choosing Government was whether we should take action to respond to the policies to respond to the economic figures. changed economic circumstances. We could have done I believe that the existence of the Office for Budget nothing, but given international events I thought that Responsibility, which was consistently opposed by the was not a risk worth taking. It may have seemed to be shadow Chancellor in every position that he held in the the easier option, but not when we considered the last Government, has given the whole of Parliament possible consequences for the credibility of our country confidence in the integrity of the forecast. in the credit markets and the risk of a rise in interest rates of the kind that so many of our neighbours have Stephen Timms (East Ham) (Lab): Did the Chancellor experienced. The other option was to take further action use those weeks to rethink his plan, because the OBR to ensure Britain was on course to meet the fiscal was telling him that the assumptions on which his plan commitments we have made, and that was what we was based were mistaken? We were told that employment chose to do, with a package of measures designed to would rise every year, but that has not happened, and it tighten policy in the medium term while using short-term is not going to happen. We were told that the budget savings in current spending to fund one-off capital would be balanced in this Parliament, and that is not investment in our country’s infrastructure. going to happen either. Surely the whole plan should As I explained last week, we have put the total have been rethought? managed expenditure totals for 2015-16 and 2016-17 on a declining path. We have made changes to the tax Mr Osborne: The OBR was also very clear in its credit entitlements. We set pay increases in the public analysis of why there had been weaker growth. Over the sector for the two years after the freeze at an average of past seven days the shadow Chancellor and others have 1%. We have recalibrated overseas aid spending so we paraded around the TV studios citing the OBR’s numbers hit 0.7% of national income in 2013. We have also while refusing to accept the OBR’s analysis of what lies increased the state pension age to 67, starting from 2026. behind those numbers. The OBR is very clear; it gives That money saved in the short term has been used to three reasons for the deterioration in the economic fund the youth contract, new nursery provision to two- forecasts. First, it attributes the primary reason for the year-olds, new free schools and school places, and a weakness since its last forecast to the external inflation major programme of road and rail building, and to help shock of the high oil price. Secondly, it attributes the with the costs of living by extending the small business current weakness in the economic position to the lack rate relief, keeping rail fare increases low, and freezing of confidence caused by the eurozone crisis. Thirdly, it petrol duty next month, but the permanent savings— says its assessment both of the boom before 2007 and the subsequent bust and of the impact of the repair of Helen Goodman: Will the Chancellor give way? the financial system is greater than it had previously estimated. That is its independent analysis. The Opposition cannot agree that we should now have an independent body Angela Smith: Will the Chancellor give way? and accept the figures it produces, only then to reject the analysis on which those figures were arrived at. Mr Osborne: I have given way to both hon. Members, and I know that many people want to speak in this Sheila Gilmore (Edinburgh East) (Lab): The OBR debate. does not say that the cause of reduced growth is that the The permanent savings we have made reaffirm Britain’s recession was found to be deeper. It does say that the commitment to dealing with its debts. Who backs this recession was found to be deeper but, crucially, it also commitment? The international organisations do. The says the recovery during 2009 was stronger than previously OECD says that forecast and that the further decline in growth happened “the ambitious fiscal consolidation has bolstered credibility and only in the latter part of 2010. helped maintain low bond yields”. The head of the IMF, whom the shadow Chancellor Mr Osborne: The OBR is very clear that the cause of was talking about, said when she came to the UK that its downgrade of the trend growth rate is the— “strong fiscal consolidation is essential to restore debt sustainability”, [Interruption.] Is it any wonder that the economic and that the Government’s “policy stance remains credibility of the Labour party is falling week after appropriate”. week? The shadow Chancellor has backed it into the incredible position where only Communist parties in During Treasury questions, the shadow Chancellor western Europe agree with it. The reason he has done was, I think, quoting The New York Times.Whathedid that has nothing to do with the future political prospects not quote was the Financial Times, where he actually of the Labour party. Rather, it has everything to do worked. It said that with his own personal record. He cannot be the Labour “the Government’s plans for fiscal consolidation have allowed politician who admits that his party made mistakes in Britain to regain the confidence of investors at a time when all too the run-up to the 2007 crisis, because he was the Labour many countries have forfeited it”. Government’s chief economic adviser. That is the position That is the kind of editorial he would have written when the Opposition find themselves in, and Labour Members he was a leader writer there. The Economist says that the know it. They are all going around telling anyone who credibility the Government have achieved is “priceless”. 185 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 186

The CBI has supported what we have done. The Institute neighbouring countries’, as the fruits of economic success. of Directors said that we did the right thing. The Federation He boasted that the UK was borrowing money more of Small Businesses, which the shadow Chancellor often cheaply than Germany and he hailed low interest rates quotes, and the British Chambers of Commerce have as both welcomed the measures we announced for business. “the simplest measure of monetary and fiscal policy credibility”. Does he still believe that? Lisa Nandy (Wigan) (Lab): We have heard a lot about what the Chancellor thinks about the Labour party. Ed Balls: Of course, but could the Chancellor explain How many of the 100,000 additional children now why in a liquidity trap things would not operate in that growing up in poverty under his watch also support his way? plans, and what is he planning to do about that? Mr Osborne: In the situation we face at the moment, Mr Osborne: On the same measure that the hon. where countries around the world, particularly those in Lady uses, child poverty rose by 200,000 in the last the western world, face a challenge from the markets Parliament. [Interruption.] She says, “We took those about their credibility, the countries with credibility children out.” Child poverty in the last Parliament rose have been able to keep their interest rates down and by 200,000 on the exact same measure that she is using. those without credibility have seen their interest rates What we are doing is investing in nursery education rise. The right hon. Gentleman said that low “long-term provision for the poorest children, which never existed interest rates” are before, in a pupil premium, in free schools and in new school places—that is exactly what we are doing to “the simplest measure of monetary and fiscal policy credibility”. tackle the causes of poverty as well as the symptoms. I want to know whether he still believes that to be the case—yes or no? Nadhim Zahawi (Stratford-on-Avon) (Con): On the question of whom the nation blames, why does the Ed Balls: This is the second time that the Chancellor Chancellor think that a recent ICM poll showed that has not understood the question today and has therefore people thought that the debt inherited from the Labour not been able to answer it. Of course it is the case that in Government was the biggest single cause of the current a normal operating economy that is how things are, but slow-down? in a liquidity trap it is different, and that is where we are. That is why when American debt was downgraded in Mr Osborne: The reason they think that is because it August, America’s long-term interest rates fell; they did is true. This, again, is the absolutely hopeless position not rise. Let me quote to him what the chief economist that Labour under the shadow Chancellor have put at Capital Economics said this August: themselves in, but frankly, that is for them to work out. “Signs that the UK’s economic recovery has ground to a If I may declare an interest, we very much want him to standstill have led markets to revise down their interest rate stay in his post for the next three and a half years: he is expectations”. the best recruiting sergeant we have. The National Institute of Economic and Social Research The Governor of the Bank of England—appointed has said: by the right hon. Gentleman, no doubt, when he was “The reason people are marking down gilt yields is because”— the chief economic adviser—said this last week: they think that the UK— “This is exactly the right macro-economic response to the “economy is weak”. position in which we find ourselves”. In a liquidity trap, long-term interest rates are a sign of And who is left opposing this credible action, this the growth potential of the economy. It really worries macro-economic response? The Labour party, which is me that the Chancellor does not understand the economics now advancing this new theory that Britain’s low interest of this. rates in this debt crisis are a sign of policy failure, not policy success. That was the argument we heard last Mr Osborne: The right hon. Gentleman quoted the week. The shadow Chancellor talked in his response to chief economist or head of the NIESR, but did not my statement of happen to declare to the House the interest that this “the illiterate fantasy that low long-term interest rates in Britain person used to work for the shadow Chancellor. I do are a sign of enhanced credibility”—[Official Report, 29 November not agree with his analysis. 2011; Vol. 536, c. 812.] I pointed out that, on that basis, Italy’s rates of 7% were Ed Balls: Explain the economics. a policy triumph and Greece’s 30% rates were an economic miracle. Mr Osborne: I will explain the economics very simply: In the intervening week, I looked for evidence to if people do not think you can pay your debts in the support the argument that the shadow Chancellor has world, they charge you a lot more interest on those been advancing. I have not found it, but I did come debts. across the very interesting “Ken Dixon lecture” to the I have actually bothered to read the right hon. department of economics at the university of York. It Gentleman’s article in The Times today, in which he says was given in 2004 by the chief economic adviser to that Labour would take the Treasury—Mr Edward Balls. He told a no doubt gripped audience of students about the importance of “tough decisions on tax and public spending.” lower debt, of running surpluses in good times, of Will he get up and give us, either now in an intervention keeping deficits under control. He then cited the market or in his speech, just half a dozen examples of the tough interest rates that Britain was paying on its debt, versus decisions he is prepared to take? 187 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 188

[Mr George Osborne] Twelve months to the day, what did the independent Office for Budget Responsibility report? A recovery on This is the shadow Chancellor who has opposed the track? No. Growth is flatlining—downgraded this year, increase in the VAT that the previous Government were next year, the year after, the year after and the year after planning, who opposed the increase in North sea oil that. Is employment growing? No. Employment is falling, taxation and who opposed the increase in capital gains and unemployment is now expected to be 500,000 higher tax—Labour Members do not know that, but he did than the previous forecast. Are public finances on the actually oppose that. He opposes capping housing benefit, mend? No. Borrowing is disastrously off track: £158 billion which was actually in the Labour manifesto; the reform more than the Chancellor told the House exactly a year of employment and support allowance; the changes to ago. tax credits; and reforming legal aid. The Labour party The boasts of the Prime Minister and the Chancellor has campaigned against every single change to the that they would eliminate the current structural budget Ministry of Defence budget. There is not one single deficit within five years are in complete tatters—in budget in the entirety of Whitehall that the Labour complete disarray. In his March Budget, the Chancellor party has proposed cutting. claimed: That is from the shadow Chancellor who says that he “We have put fuel into the tank of the British economy.”—[Official would take “tough decisions” on tax and spending. His Report, 23 March 2011; Vol. 525, c. 965.] position is, “We would not take them now. We would take them in the medium term.” That is his argument, if It must have been the wrong kind of fuel. I understand it correctly. In the past seven days, he has It is not as though the Chancellor was not warned. In opposed our measures to restrain public sector pay his Bloomberg speech in August 2010, he claimed: after the pay freeze comes to an end; opposed the path “There are some political opponents who claim that in setting for public spending that we have set out for 2015-16 and out our decisive plans to deal with the deficit we have taken a 2016-17, which is in the medium term; opposed the gamble with Britain’s economy. In fact, the reverse is true.” raising of the state pension age, which is what is being done The Chancellor has taken an enormous gamble with the in Australia, Germany and America—the country he economy, with jobs and with people’s lives. The reality keeps citing. No wonder his economic policy has absolutely is that his gamble has completely backfired. Let me no credibility whatsoever. And, of course, he opposes quote from an editorial in The New York Times at the the Government’s active enterprise policy—lower and weekend: simpler corporate tax rates; the new enterprise zones; the “A year and a half ago, Prime Minister David Cameron of housing market changes that will revive the right to buy; Britain came to office promising to slash deficits and energise planning reforms; and the changes to employment law. economic growth through radical fiscal austerity. It failed dismally.” Let me discuss just one measure that was announced Before the election, we said that, like every country, seven days ago: the seed enterprise investment scheme. after the global financial crisis we had to get the deficit A group of entrepreneurs, including those who used to down and we needed a tough plan. We needed spending support the Labour party, wrote to the paper and said cuts and tax rises. The question was not if we did it but that the scheme will how we did it. That is why the Opposition warned the “help the next generation of British innovations to become the Chancellor that he was reckless, that he was ripping out next generation of great British businesses.” the foundations of the house, leaving our economy not This country faces some of the most serious challenges safe but deeply exposed, and that is exactly what has in its modern history. We are picking up the pieces of happened over the last year. the biggest boom which became the biggest bust, and now we face a sovereign debt crisis in the eurozone. Even judging by the one objective the Chancellor set Unlike the shadow Chancellor, we are not the quack himself for getting the deficit down, he is failing. In that doctor promising a miracle cure. The action we have CNBC interview a year ago, the Chancellor said: taken will help to take Britain through this storm and “We have taken a series of steps, increased some taxes, consumption lay the foundations of a far more sustainable and taxes, had some cuts in public expenditure, which have put us on a balanced prosperity in the future, and I commend the path to eliminate the deficit in a period of four years.” autumn statement to the House. Not only is the Chancellor now emphatically not going to eliminate the deficit in four years, but according to 4.54 pm the OBR, he is set to borrow £37 billion more than Ed Balls (Morley and Outwood) (Lab/Co-op): A year under the plan he inherited from Labour at the last ago this week, the Chancellor of the Exchequer told the general election—a plan he called “deeply irresponsible.” American news channel CNBC: The Business Secretary told The Guardian in May “We’ve already begun the reductions in public expenditure, that it was realistic for the coalition to eradicate the and it has not had the impact on demand, not had the impact on structural deficit by the end of this Parliament: economic growth that the critics said it would. So there are plenty “Our credibility hinges on it.” of people who said what we were doing was wrong, but at the moment they’re being confounded by the figures.” He was right, which is why the Government’s credibility Twelve months later, on growth, on jobs and on borrowing, is now badly undermined. The Chancellor should have it is the Chancellor who is completely confounded by the listened to the warning from the Business Secretary figures. Let me remind him of what he boasted a year before the election. This is what the Business Secretary ago on 29 November in a Conservative party press release: said when he was a Liberal Democrat MP outside the “Now the independent OBR have confirmed that the British coalition—the old kind of Liberal Democrat: recovery is on track, our public finances are on the mend, our “We must not cut Government spending too soon and risk debt is under control, employment is growing and our economy is plunging a fragile recovery back into recession. Cuts without rebalancing.” economic growth will not deal with the deficit.” 189 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 190

The Business Secretary was right before the election. It Ed Balls: Obviously the hon. Lady was not invited to was only after the election, when he took his Cabinet the drinks parties. Perhaps she should apologise to the seat, that he changed his mind. 5,400 families in her constituency who will lose from the Unemployment is up. Borrowing is up. Going further cuts in child tax credits. If she wants to talk about and faster has proved to be utterly counter-productive deserving better, let me give another example from one and self-defeating. All this pain for no gain. Eighteen of the Osborne allies: months in, plan A has failed, and it has failed decisively. “They were a bit sniffy about George. The Bullingdon is basically for Etonians. But they let him in even though he went to Nadhim Zahawi: In The Times today the shadow St Paul’s, though they did insist on him reverting to his original Chancellor wrote: name of Gideon.” “Credibility is based on trust and trust is based on honesty, so The hon. Lady tells us that the country needs better we must be clear with the British people that under Labour there than that. As for the euro, I will happily give way again will have to be cuts.” if she can give the Labour Government credit for keeping In the spirit of honesty, will he tell the House what he the country out of the single currency in 2003. would cut? Mrs Main: I am absolutely amazed that joining the Ed Balls: Of course I will. When I was the Education euro is still in the right hon. Gentleman’s party manifesto, Secretary we said that there would be over £1 billion of and that he can still plead that he kept us out of it. I am cuts in the schools budget at that time. We said, for absolutely amazed that he has the brass neck to say that example, that we would cut the police budget by 12%, he is the saviour of this country from the euro—and I but not by 20% with the loss of 16,000 police officers am sure that he will now stand up and tell us all that he throughout the country. We would have raised national no longer sees joining the euro at any point as worth insurance. We raised the top rate of tax, but we would while. not have raised VAT to 20%, precisely because it would have choked off the recovery, as it has done this year. Ed Balls: I think that the bibulous parties might be starting in the morning, Mr Deputy Speaker. The euro I can tell the hon. Gentleman and his colleagues, the is not succeeding as a single currency, which is why we friends of the Chancellor, that I was reading a profile of were right not to join in 2003. There is no possibility of the Chancellor a week ago, a few days before the a British Government joining the euro at any time in my autumn statement, in which one ally said: lifetime. “‘The autumn statement will correct the idea that we are off course’”. Charlie Elphicke (Dover) (Con): Given that the shadow Whatever were they on? One only needs to read the rest Chancellor seems to be making up policy on the hoof in of the article to understand what is really going on. It this debate, is it any surprise that one shadow Cabinet goes on to say that the Chancellor colleague has said that his policy is hurting but not “has started taking discreet steps towards the Tory leadership. . . working, and that he has no credibility? Members of the 2010 intake of MPs...areinvited to discreet drinks at No. 11. The favourites”— Ed Balls: If we want to know about hurting, we I do not know whether the hon. Member for Stratford- should think about the 9,100 families in Dover hurting on-Avon (Nadhim Zahawi) is one of the favourites; because of the cuts in tax credits. That is what hurting is perhaps he could tell us in another intervention— all about. What do we hear from the Chancellor—an “The favourites are invited to bibulous soirees at Dorneywood.” apology, or an admission that he got it wrong? If you ask me, it sounds as if they have been drinking Charlie Elphicke rose— rather too much. Let me give the House another quote from one of Ed Balls: The more publicity I can give the hon. those allies, because it was so revealing: Gentleman, the better. “Nobody in the Osborne circle is vulgar enough to talk openly enough about his leadership ambitions. . . ‘George has no agenda. Charlie Elphicke: The shadow Chancellor talks about I have never heard any talk of a timetable,’” my constituency, but let me talk about his. How does he said an ally, account for the rise in the claimant count in his constituency ‘“But the unspoken assumption is that the party would be a lot of 1,056, or 141%, in the last Parliament? Was that an safer in George’s hands than with bonking Boris.’” economic success?

Mrs Anne Main (St Albans) (Con) rose— Ed Balls: If the hon. Gentleman is quoting the figures for this year, they might be the result of the Chancellor’s Ed Balls: Whatever drinks are served at these parties policies. Let me return to concerns about Dover and in Downing street? Maybe we can find out from the Deal. While campaigning for a new hospital in Dover, back row. the hon. Gentleman said: “I am very, very concerned that Dover has not had and does Mrs Main: May I say to the shadow Chancellor, with not get its fair share of health care. I have taken this up with all due respect, that the public deserve better than this? ministers and hammered home just how angry people are”. Tittle-tattle may be a joke to him, but the public want to Perhaps he should also hammer home with his Front know what his policies are, because they have faith in Bench the failure of cuts in tax credits. our policies. Is it still the policy of the shadow Chancellor In last week’s statement, in today’s debate and in and his party to make sure that we join the euro, given every interview the Chancellor has given, we hear him the huge financial consequences, which he is no longer give excuse after excuse and blame anyone except himself. discussing? Earlier in the year he blamed the snow, the earthquake, 191 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 192

[Ed Balls] planned; now it is coming in at £158 billion more than was planned. The country is tired of the Chancellor’s the royal wedding and higher oil prices. America was excuses, and it is time he admitted that his failing plan is badly affected by the snow, and every country was hurting but not working. His reckless gamble has not affected by the Japanese earthquake and higher commodity made things better; it has made things worse. and oil prices, so why did Britain have slower growth than any other country in the G7 except Japan? Why do Richard Fuller: As the shadow Chancellor’s soon-to-be we have higher inflation than any other country except replacement, the hon. Member for Leeds West (Rachel Estonia? It was the Chancellor’s decision to raise VAT Reeves), rustles through her papers to find a data point in January that pushed up fuel and petrol prices, hit to throw back at me, may I ask him whether he has had confidence and reduced real living standards for families. the opportunity to look at McKinsey’s debt and He then blamed the euro crisis, but the fact is that our deleveraging report, which identifies that on his watch economic recovery was choked off a year ago, well and under his Government we became the most indebted before the recent crisis. major economy in the world? Does he not bear some The Office for Budget Responsibility has downgraded responsibility for the enormous pain that families are its growth forecast for Britain in 2011, but it has upgraded going through in order to remedy some of his excesses? its growth forecast for the euro area. Only Greece, Portugal, Denmark, Cyprus and Slovenia have grown Ed Balls: In the hon. Gentleman’s constituency 10,800 more slowly than Britain over the past year. As the families are actually losing out as a result of the change OBR figures show, the fact is that it is the lack of in tax credits. We look forward to seeing that in his press domestic demand that has slowed down our economy. release. It is only net trade, the contribution of exports, that has The fact is that we went into the global financial crisis kept us out of recession over the past year. If the with a lower level of national debt than France, Germany, eurozone countries fail to sort out their problems, that America and Japan— will of course have an impact, which is why it is important that they are sorted out. Far from the eurozone dragging Richard Fuller rose— us down this year, it is actually the euro that has been buoying us up. Ed Balls: If the hon. Gentleman calms down and lets me answer his point he will be able to intervene again. I Mr Tobias Ellwood (Bournemouth East) (Con): The shall be happy to take another intervention. right hon. Gentleman speaks of asking for, or demanding, an apology, but an apology is required from Labour The fact is that when we went into the financial crisis Members. To give credit where it is due, however, I our level of national debt was lower than that in America, remember that when he was Secretary of State for France, Germany and Japan—and lower than that which Education he looked for savings in that area. But he did we inherited from the Conservatives in 1997. I will give not do so right across the board. Page 15 of the OBR the House one good reason why: in 1999, when we report shows that in 2008 borrowing went up to £68 billion, raised £20 billion from the auction of the 3G mobile that in 2009 £152 billion was required, and that in 2010 spectrum and they urged us to spend the money, we another £145 billion was required: spending, spending, used the entire amount to repay the national debt. spending. It was not until this Government came in that such spending was halted. Richard Fuller: The shadow Chancellor makes potentially a fair point about Government debt, but the Government Ed Balls: The hon. Gentleman makes an important are responsible not just for Government debt but for the point: there was a major financial crisis that hit Britain total indebtedness of the nation, and he fails to understand and all countries throughout the world. The Chancellor that under the previous Government the total indebtedness always wants to blame Labour, as he does the snow, the of this country grew to become the largest of any major earthquake and the euro area. economy in the world. That is his legacy, and that is why 10,000 people in my constituency will be hearing why Richard Fuller (Bedford) (Con): Will the right hon. his policies led to the pain that they feel today. Gentleman give way? Ed Balls: Over 1 million more homeowners than in Ed Balls: In a second. I will answer the previous 1997, and over 1 million more new businesses—with intervention before I turn to the next one. overdrafts and borrowing facilities—compared with 1997! The financial crisis hit every major country in the The hon. Gentleman should be careful about giving the world, and bank regulation was not tough enough here impression that borrowing in an economy is a bad thing in Britain or in countries throughout the world—[HON. for consumers, households and businesses. Many businesses MEMBERS: “Ah!”] There is no doubt about that. The want to borrow at the moment; it is just that the banks Chancellor of the Exchequer, who was then the shadow will not lend. Chancellor, spent his whole time urging us to deregulate, What did we get last week from the Chancellor? We complaining about “burdensome, complex”regulations— got a cobbled-together package of growth measures but there we are. which he knows, and the OBR forecast confirms, does By spring 2010 the economy was growing, inflation not address the fundamental problem that his rapid and was low and unemployment was coming down. More deflationary plan has choked off the recovery and pushed people were in work and paying taxes then, so borrowing up borrowing. It is a so-called plan for growth that, came in £20 billion lower than had been forecast in the according to the Treasury’s own figures, hits women pre-Budget report of 2009. How things have changed in harder than men, pushes up child poverty and delivers 18 months! Then borrowing came in lower than was lower growth and higher unemployment. 193 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 194

Matthew Hancock (West Suffolk) (Con): Youth undershot current expectations. The Chancellor did not unemployment in my constituency is falling because of even know the figures at Treasury questions this afternoon, a work experience programme that has now been rolled but in October the IMF advised him to change course out across the country. I say that to preclude the shadow and to delay the planned consolidation if growth undershot. Chancellor’s rebuttal. He has just argued in response to At that time the IMF was forecasting 1.1% growth this my hon. Friend the Member for Bedford (Richard year; it has come in at 0.9%. For next year it was Fuller) that private sector debt is a good thing. Will he forecasting 1.6% growth; it is now forecast to be 0.7%. have the balls to say that explicitly? If that is not growth clearly undershooting expectations, I do not know what is. Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Lindsay Hoyle): Order. I am In May the OECD called for the Government to slow not quite sure we are going to allow “balls”. I am sure the pace of consolidation if the economy undershot. you can think of a better word, Mr Hancock. The Chancellor likes to quote the OECD in support of his policies, so let me tell him what its chief economist Matthew Hancock: I withdraw it. Will the shadow said only last week. He told the Chancellor to Chancellor have the weight to state explicitly what he “contemplate easing up on spending cuts” has just argued, which is that private sector debt is a if events turned out to be good thing? “a lot bleaker than even the bleak outlook that we have.” Ed Balls: The numbers for the hon. Gentleman’s That is not exactly a ringing endorsement of the constituency show that 8,600 families in his constituency Chancellor’s plans. are losing out from the cut in tax credits. [Interruption.] He is normally quite excitable, but he is really getting Mr George Osborne: The right hon. Gentleman has rattled this afternoon. just quoted the OECD’s chief economist. The same What are the facts? “We are all in this together,” yet person said on 28 November that “plan A is working”. women are being hit twice as hard as men; there has The OECD also said: been a 100,000 rise in child poverty, according to the “The ambitious fiscal consolidation has bolstered credibility Treasury’s own figures; there is a four times bigger hit and helped maintain low bond yields, leaving room for automatic for families and children than for the banks, which have stabilisers to work fully”. seen their taxes cut this year compared with last year; The person the shadow Chancellor is quoting in the not 400,000 but 710,000 public sector jobs are set to go; House of Commons in defence of his policy has said there is £158 billion more in borrowing than was planned that “plan A is working”. Will he now correct the a year ago—£6,500 more in borrowing for every household record? in this country—and there is the cost of rising unemployment. That is the cost of the failure of the Ed Balls: Only this Chancellor, out of his depth and Chancellor’s plan. As for the Deputy Prime Minister’s out of touch, could come to this House and claim that contribution, we have a cobbled-together replacement the forecasts he set out last week showed that plan A for the future jobs fund that is judged by the OBR to was working. How can it be working when we have have no impact at all on employment and zero impact record levels of unemployment? How can it be working on jobs. I have to say to the Chancellor and to the Chief when growth has flatlined? How can it be working when Secretary that protecting our economy, businesses, jobs he is borrowing £158 billion more than he planned a and family finances is more important than trying to year ago? protect a failing plan and their failing reputations. I have seen the transcript of the Sky interview that the Chancellor is quoting, and I understand the diplomacy Christopher Pincher (Tamworth) (Con): For the benefit of the OECD. However, the chief economist said that of the shadow Chief Secretary, my constituency is the Chancellor should Tamworth. [Laughter.] I see that she has found it. “contemplate easing up on spending cuts” It takes some brass neck for the man who was so if events turned out to be responsible for wrapping this country’s economy around a lamp post to stand there now and try to teach this “a lot bleaker than even the bleak outlook that we have.” Government how to drive. If he wants to be credible, How much bleaker do they have to get? How much and if he wants to be trusted about the cuts that he says bleaker for families? How much bleaker for jobs and need to take place, can he explain why he has abandoned young people? How much bleaker for borrowing? the Darling plan and wants to spend £326 billion extra We were told a year ago that the Chancellor would over the next five years? not change course because his plan was working. Now, even though it is clearly not working, the Government Ed Balls: Abandon the Darling plan? It is the Chancellor still will not change course. The Prime Minister says who is borrowing £37 billion more than under the that we cannot borrow our way out of a crisis, but that Darling plan. That is because of what is happening to is exactly what the Chancellor has been forced to do. He jobs, growth and the living standards of families in our is borrowing billions more to pay for the high country, with 9,500 families in Tamworth hit by the cut unemployment, stagnant growth and rising benefits bill in child tax credit announced last week. I will not read that his plan has delivered. The Chancellor made the the next figure out; I will spare the hon. Gentleman’s wrong choice a year ago. He is now making a second blushes. catastrophic choice in sticking to a failing plan, when As we heard in Treasury questions earlier, the IMF what Britain needs is a plan that will work. was right: growth is necessary for fiscal credibility. The Any British Government would be borrowing at the IMF urged the Chancellor to change course if growth moment. There is no doubt about that. 195 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 196

Mr David Anderson (Blaydon) (Lab): The shadow Ed Balls: Oh, I can’t resist. Chancellor makes the point that the Government are trying to borrow their way out of a crisis. I suggest that Matthew Hancock: I am very grateful. The right hon. we are actually borrowing our way into a bigger crisis. Gentleman keeps making his argument about borrowing, [Laughter.] but is it not completely undone by the fact that according Ed Balls: Government Members may laugh at an to the OBR forecasts, borrowing has fallen and is set to 80% rise in youth unemployment, but that is not a fall over the next five years, and then debt will fall once laughing matter for the young people concerned, or for it is under control? Can he answer the question that our economy. [Interruption.] I am going to make this neither the shadow Chief Secretary nor other shadow point because it is very important. It goes to the heart of Treasury Ministers can answer? How can spending more the argument. money possibly lead to lower borrowing?

Nadhim Zahawi: Will the hon. Gentleman give way? Ed Balls: The economics of this are clear and easy to understand, which is why both the IMF and the OECD Ed Balls: In a second. Any Government would be have made exactly the point that I am making. The fact borrowing at the moment. The question is whether it is is that the Government are borrowing £158 billion more better to borrow billions more to keep people out of than they planned, and the deficit is coming down much work on benefits, or to act to get people back into work more slowly than was planned, because unemployment and paying tax, which would get the deficit down. If we is going to be so much higher. let a year of stagnating growth and rising youth unemployment become a lost decade of stagnant growth The issue is the pace at which we try to get the deficit and high youth unemployment, we will pay a long-term down. If we try to get it down too fast, as the Chancellor price. It makes much more sense to act now, as the did a year ago, it blows up in our faces. Growth and International Monetary Fund has recommended, with taxes slow down, unemployment goes up, and we end temporary tax cuts and investment in jobs and growth. up borrowing £158 billion more. The right thing to do is That is the best way to reduce the bills of failure for the to have a staged and balanced approach, get the economy long term. It is the only way to get our deficit down moving, get people into jobs and get the deficit down. sustainably in the long term. That is the only plan that will work. Let me make an offer to the Chancellor. It is not too Several hon. Members rose— late to change course, and the deepening euro crisis makes it more important for him to see sense. If he Ed Balls: I will give way in a second. There is a choice. does, we will back him—a new start, a second attempt. We can either take action now and then have long-term We read in The Daily Telegraph today about the Chancellor’s fiscal discipline on the deficit, spending and our fiscal recent efforts to land a plane at Manchester airport—on rules to make our economy stronger and to get borrowing a flight simulator, I should add, to reassure Members. down, or we can have what we have now and what is There was too rapid a descent and a crash landing on forecast for next year and the year after: stagnating the runway, narrowly missing ploughing into the terminal growth, rising borrowing, including £158 billion more building. Too far, too fast—no surprises there. However, borrowing to pay for rising unemployment, and long-term the Chancellor had a second go. With a little help from youth unemployment, which will weaken our economy the experts and a steadier hand on the controls, things and make it harder to get the deficit down. worked better the second time round. Perhaps there is a Several hon. Members rose— lesson for him in that story. Perhaps the Chancellor should take my prescription Ed Balls: Not for the first time, the Chancellor’s after all. He claimed last week that a balanced plan to whipping operation is clearly in place. As I said last get our economy moving and to get the deficit down time, he knows all about a good whipping. I give way to was like the hon. Member for Stratford-on-Avon. “the promises of a quack doctor selling a miracle cure.”—[Official Report, 29 November 2011; Vol. 536, c. 810.] Nadhim Zahawi: The shadow Chancellor is obviously passionate about the subject of youth unemployment, Was not the Nobel prize-winning economist Paul Krugman so will he admit to the House that in the last Parliament, closer to the truth when he described Britain’s experiment youth unemployment in his own constituency went up in austerity as being by 151%? “like a medieval doctor bleeding his patient, observing that the patient is getting sicker, not better, and deciding that this calls for Ed Balls: Before the crisis, youth unemployment was even more bleeding”? lower than what we inherited in 1997. It then went up during the recession, but was falling a year and a half The patient is crying out for a second opinion, and all ago. It is now rising again. Unemployment was falling we hear from the Chancellor is a call for more cuts and in our economy, but now there has been an 80% rise in more leeches. long-term youth unemployment. Bob Stewart (Beckenham) (Con): Will the right hon. Several hon. Members rose— Gentleman give way? Ed Balls: I will take interventions from Members who have not already intervened twice. Ed Balls: I will not, because I have gone on too long and there are other important speeches to be made Matthew Hancock rose— today. 197 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 198

I was thinking about what other doctors the Chancellor difficult to spot—and its estimate of productivity growth resembled, and I concluded that he resembled Voltaire’s compared with its spring forecast. That radical adjustment giant. I will take an intervention from anybody on the in eight months has in turn obliged the Chancellor to Government Front Bench who knows who Voltaire’s adjust policy for the later years of the forecast period, giant doctor was—Voltaire’s great doctor, Dr Pangloss. as he pointed out, in order to meet the fiscal mandate. It does not matter what the evidence says, it simply strengthens Dr Pangloss’s opinion that his philosophy A good number of my Committee colleagues—from must be right. Britain’s rock-bottom gilts? A sign of both sides of the House—were a little sceptical of the success, not a damning verdict from the markets on the OBR’s decision. Frankly, when we look at the OBR prospects for growth. Rising unemployment? Not a bad documentation, we do not find a great deal of evidence thing, just creating more space for the private sector-led to support it. There is some evidence, and the Committee recovery when it finally arrives. The worse things get in might well return to the issue when it reports on the the rest of the world the better for Britain, because we autumn statement. are the only safe haven of prosperity. This morning’s Treasury Committee sitting brought In the Chancellor’s Panglossian world, everything is home to me and to other colleagues a couple of important working out just fine, but in the real world, with the points, the first of which is that the OBR forecast is an world economy darkening, and with the UK now forecast independent one—nobody can claim that it has been to endure stagnant growth and rising unemployment cooked up by politicians—which in itself can add confidence this year, next year and the year after, this Panglossian to markets. Secondly, the difficulties that the OBR has Chancellor is making a catastrophic error of judgment, had in supporting specific points on which the Committee refusing to learn the lessons of history, refusing even to challenged it this morning flags up the perils of all understand the lessons of economics, and refusing to economic forecasting. The one thing we can say with shift to a more balanced plan. He got it wrong 18 months some degree of certainty is that this forecast, like all ago; he is getting it so badly wrong today. He is out of others, will almost certainly turn out to be wrong. his depth and out of touch. Is it not time he changed course before it is too late? I do not have very much time. I shall end with a few words about supply side reform. The financial crisis Several hon. Members rose— exposed the structural weaknesses in the public finances and the structural deficit now appears to be much Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Lindsay Hoyle): Order. I just bigger than was originally thought. But the financial remind Members that there is a six-minute limit on crisis also exposed structural weaknesses in the real speeches. economy. As businesses struggle to recover, the full scale of the web of complicated taxation, excessive regulation and much else is being exposed to view, and 5.30 pm that is getting in the way of businesses doing better. Mr Andrew Tyrie (Chichester) (Con): I will not try so The coalition Government assembled a fully worked much of the party political stuff that we have just up agenda for action to deal with the deficit, but until heard, but I will make a short point about the central this autumn statement, we did not have a fully worked fiscal judgment, a point about the forecasts and, if I up strategy for improving long-run economic performance have time, a point about the supply side. —the supply side of the economy. I was critical of the First—we did not hear much of this in the previous Government’s earlier proposals that were published a speeches—I want to emphasise the backdrop against year ago. They reflected the fact that they were dealing which the autumn statement was made. It was undoubtedly with an inheritance from the previous Government and the most difficult backdrop since 1981, with a huge also with policies that had been thought up and planned inherited budget deficit, a dysfunctional banking sector at a time of economic abundance before the crash. The and an economy in which far too much is taken and obvious truth is that supply side reform is extremely spent by the public sector, as a result of which the difficult to accomplish. Raising the long-run growth private sector is having trouble leading the recovery. All rate is a very big and long-term job. The Thatcher parties were agreed on that before the election and all Administration did not even start to implement their had plans to reduce public spending as a proportion of major reforms in that area until their second term. GDP. On top of that, we have a severe eurozone crisis, which is our most important market. This autumn statement has taken a huge step forward in the right direction. It sets out a more consistent and I will not be popular on either side of the House for coherent agenda to support enterprise. It recognises the saying this: despite the clash of cymbals we have just crippling burden that is being imposed on energy-intensive heard, fiscal policy would not be so different whoever industries by climate change regulation and by the need was in power. There would be a little less deficit cutting to improve transport and to do something about the and probably a bit more tax and spend under Labour, planning system. There is a good deal else. The phrase but the market discipline in the world at the moment is “supply side” has also been rehabilitated. severe and biting, and the markets would demand roughly the same strategy, which it would get from any rational However, we must bear in mind the fact that so far Government. That is an important basic point to have this is largely just an agenda; it now needs to be in mind. implemented. It also needs to be complemented by My second point concerns the forecast. The Treasury reforms to bring greater simplicity and certainty to the Committee had the OBR before it earlier today. It has tax system, which is in a huge mess, thanks largely to radically adjusted its estimate of the output gap—that the previous Government and that is what I hope the was discussed a bit in earlier exchanges, although it was Budget, in only 17 weeks’ time, will be all about. 199 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 200

5.36 pm Another problem is that the Chancellor cannot change course because he has boxed himself in and cannot Stephen Timms (East Ham) (Lab): The number of budge for fear of admitting that his judgment was young people out of work has topped 1 million for the wrong. That problem was well expressed by Martin first time. If nothing else, that must be a wake-up call Wolf, the chief economics commentator for the Financial for urgent action on the economy. Last June, the Prime Times—the Chancellor quoted the Financial Times in Minister told the House that cutting the deficit faster his support—who warned after the autumn statement would revive private sector confidence. That was the last week of the danger of a lost decade. He wrote that rationale for the strategy that was set out to us. There the Chancellor would be pain but it would be worth it. Private sector investment and jobs would surge. The increase in confidence “is wrong to ignore his errors. He is trapped by his own rigid fiscal would mean that growth in the number of private sector framework. He might indeed shatter confidence if he were more jobs would more than match public sector job cuts. We flexible. But that is partly his own fault.” were told that employment would rise every year. In fact, in the past year, employment has fallen by more It seems that we will all be trapped because the Chancellor than 100,000. One thing we can say for sure, with no cannot acknowledge that he got the fundamental judgment fear of contradiction, is that that key assumption about wrong at the start. confidence underpinning the Government’s entire strategy We need to build growth in the economy and to was mistaken. create jobs for young people. That is the rationale for The Institute of Chartered Accountants’ latest business the five-point plan for jobs and growth advanced by the confidence monitor is headlined “UK business confidence Labour party. We should repeat the tax on bankers’ has collapsed”. That is its assessment of confidence. bonuses to bring in another £2 billion and we should The latest of its regular surveys states: use that to fund 100,000 jobs for young people, getting “Confidence has declined across all sectors and all regions.” them off the dole and building on the future jobs fund introduced before the election. I welcome the announcement There will be different views across the Chamber about of the young people’s contract—a watered-down version the reasons that the Prime Minister’s hope has proved of the future jobs fund—and I look forward to seeing ill-founded. The Chancellor took the view and his party the details but it simply underlines what a misjudgment seems to take the view that all the problems before the it was to shut down the future jobs fund in the first election were the fault of the UK Government and that place. all the problems since the election have been the fault of someone else. Whatever view we take of the reasons We should introduce another temporary cut in VAT that the Prime Minister’s expectation was ill-founded, to rebuild momentum in the economy—that is what the the fact that it was ill-founded is, after the autumn temporary cut did last time—and we should introduce statement, not in dispute. further investment in infrastructure, including in schools The Prime Minister told us that unemployment and other areas. We should also cut the increase in would not be too much of a problem because private university fees. At a time when youth unemployment is sector job creation would exceed public sector job cuts. In at such a catastrophic level, the last thing that we should fact, public sector job cuts are exceeding new private be doing is forcing young people out of education—we sector jobs on a ratio of about 2:1. The Office for should be encouraging them to stay in. Yet, I am Budget Responsibility has told us that more than hearing reports from colleges that significant numbers 700,000 public sector jobs will be lost. The cuts are of young people have concluded that, with fees at the going too far and too fast. Young people and women level announced by the coalition, they have no chance are bearing the brunt. Moreover, the plan is not of ever making it to university and that therefore they delivering, as far as we can see, the central goal of swiftly should not even bother staying on to study, including eliminating the deficit. That is now clear. Borrowing for A-levels. will be higher than it was under the previous Government’s We should also listen to the Federation of Small plans. Business and give small firms hiring new staff a break When a plan goes so badly wrong and when the from national insurance to encourage them to do so. expectations underpinning it are shown to have been so The Government should heed that call. We need a mistaken, surely it is time to revisit the plan. Surely, strategy for growth but as yet we have no sign of one. I when things have turned out so different from what the am pleased that the Government have retained the Government told us would happen, the case for a previous Government’s proposals for a patent box to fundamental rethink is extremely strong. improve the research-and-development environment. That was the right decision and it allowed the Prime Minister Jessica Morden (Newport East) (Lab): Last week, yesterday to make his welcome announcement about Tata steel in my constituency mothballed a hot strip support for life sciences. mill because of low demand for steel, which means that In closing, I want to draw attention to one seemingly in the past month 185 job losses have been announced minor measure announced by the previous Government. at Llanwern. Is that not further evidence that the Its significance is much greater than the initial view Government’s economic plan is not working. We have suggested. I am referring to the tax break from heard nothing today that will do anything to save those computer games announced in the last Budget by my much-needed steel jobs? right hon. Friend the Member for Edinburgh South West (Mr Darling). We have some of the most creative Stephen Timms: Unfortunately, nothing at all. This computer design businesses and talent in the world and lack of confidence is one of the problems in the economy. we should make better use of it. 201 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 202

5.44 pm Ultimately, the owner-manager will make the right decision—to train their staff or give them time off—and Julian Smith (Skipton and Ripon) (Con): I want to certainly does not need an edict from London. speak about small business—in particular micro-businesses, which are usually defined as those with fewer than Bob Stewart: In my constituency the complaint from 10 employees—and to thank the Government for their small businesses is that they want to make a profit, not support for such businesses. spend their time doing accounts or filling in regulation Since coming to power, the coalition has taken some forms. We have to minimise that and, if possible, try to significant steps on regulation. It has introduced the take it right out of the whole business—if it is small one-in, one-out policy—which Labour claimed to have enough—because one in 10 still seems to be concerned introduced, but never implemented—and the red tape with regulations. challenge, allowing the public and businesses to say Julian Smith: My hon. Friend makes a valid point. which regulations they want scrapped. The Government This is a controversial area, because although the have taken a number of specific steps for small and Government are making great strides in shared parental micro-businesses, and have begun to draw a clear distinction leave, for example—reforms that I support—we need to between the large multinational, the mid-size company, look at how Whitehall is managing the relationship with a human resources department and a legal department, with micro-businesses on issues such as maternity and and the small owner-manager. The Government have parental leave. created exemptions from all new UK regulations until 2013, delayed legislation on the right to request training There are some exciting initiatives that did not make for small businesses, extended the unfair dismissal period it into the autumn statement, but which I urge the and introduced fees for employment tribunals. All are Government to support and small businesses to show powerful measures, giving more confidence to small their interest in. They include, for instance, no-fault business to take on staff. The autumn statement also dismissal. Deciding when to finish an employment included an announcement on protected conversations, relationship as an owner-manager running a small business which, for the first time in decades, will allow a small is really difficult. The idea of a compensated no-fault business manager to have a chat with one of his employees dismissal—the equivalent of a no-fault divorce in the without the fear of litigation. Further measures, on business world—is worth looking at. compromise agreements and other matters, are on their I urge the Government to have the courage of their way. convictions on policies like that. I would encourage micro-businesses everywhere to follow the Government I am delighted that business organisations have shown on their call for evidence, as we need to make the case their support. I urge the Government to move swiftly that expectations about workers’ rights in small firms with those proposals, because it is worth reflecting on must be different. We need the small business owner to who they are trying to help with those measures. Often be confident in taking on more staff. The doers and we get a kick from the left whenever an attempt is made grafters need to know that this Government are getting to reduce workers’ rights, but when we talk about very fully off their backs. small businesses or micro-businesses, we are talking about just an owner-manager—a farmer in the dales in my constituency, for instance—setting up a business 5.50 pm and trying to take on one or two people to help run it. Mr Alistair Darling (Edinburgh South West) (Lab): I We are talking about people such as Chris and Rebecca hope that the hon. Member for Skipton and Ripon Blunstone from Pateley Bridge, who set up Helping (Julian Smith) will forgive me for not following him, Hands earlier this year while, at the same time doing given the short time I have available. two jobs each. They also have two kids, so they were The real problem we face in this country, in Europe working flat out. It is people such as the Blunstones and, to a large extent, in America too, is the lack of whom the Government are trying to support, because growth. The Chancellor opened his remarks by saying small firms and start-ups created two thirds of new jobs that the previous Government had been too optimistic nationally between 1998 and 2010. They are the backbone about some of their forecasts. He gave—how shall I put of employment across the country, in all our constituencies, it?—a somewhat incomplete précis of my book. In that and we desperately need them to succeed and take on connection, I refer the House to my entry in the Register more people. of Members’ Financial Interests. Surely the Chancellor I understand that parts of the Government want to would accept that forecasting is extremely difficult at a go further with reforms for micro-businesses, particularly time like this. Perhaps when he goes back to No. 11 at in employment law. I believe that those forces are right. night, he will reflect on the fact that he was wildly We need to make a strong case for rolling back the dead optimistic about both growth and borrowing. I do not hand of the state on the smallest businesses in our imagine for one minute that he expected to be standing country and make the argument that, despite the risk of up a week ago to announce that he was borrowing having exceptions in the labour market, there are huge £158 billion more than he thought he would be borrowing benefits for the economy. We cannot look at each measure in the summer of last year. The reason for that, substantially, through the prism of an individual impact assessment; is that we have less growth, with fewer people paying rather, it is the cumulative impact of all the reforms that tax, more people dependent on benefits and, as the we need to move forward with. That will mean making Office for Budget Responsibility set out, incomes being some radical decisions on policies that our party is squeezed. promoting in the areas of flexible working and the right All that was perfectly foreseeable. Many people—Labour to request training, because for very small businesses Members and many others—said that this would happen. such rights legislation is a real burden and a hassle. The problem was not just the rate at which public 203 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 204

[Mr Alistair Darling] the Chancellor says, because the outlook is such that the Government is going to have to at some stage accept expenditure was being cut, but the fact that the mood that at a time like this only the Government can take the music that the Government deliberately set out to action necessary to stimulate the economy and restore orchestrate last year was that everything was full of confidence. That brings me to Europe. gloom and doom, so it is not surprising that businesses did not invest and that individuals decided to hold back Mr Pat McFadden (Wolverhampton South East) (Lab): on their expenditure. That is precisely what is happening My right hon. Friend talks about the effect of the Office in this country and in Europe, to which I shall return for Budget Responsibility and the forward outlook. shortly. All this was foreseeable. How does he view its projections for returning to the trend rate of growth in two or three years’ time, given Mr Tom Clarke (Coatbridge, Chryston and Bellshill) the drastic revision that has taken place between the (Lab): Following on from my right hon. Friend’s point forecast in March and the forecast last week? about cuts, is he particularly worried about the construction industry, not least because so many small businesses are dependent on it? Mr Darling: As it happens, there is a passage in my book about the trend rate of growth. I believe that economists find it terribly difficult to work out what the Mr Darling: I am, and I shall come on to that in a right trend rate of growth is. On the point raised in minute, but I want to make a further point. If the OBR the Select Committee this morning, I am surprised that comes out with another downward revision of its figures the OBR has said that the productive capacity of the at the time of the Budget next March, does it mean that economy has been so reduced, partly because of lack of we are going to embark on yet another round of reducing productivity. Part of the OBR’s problem is that it fails expenditure? It this not the same sort of argument that to recognise that businesses have retained labour through we had in the 1930s? The prevailing orthodoxy did not this recession in the hope that they will need it when work then, and it will not work now. My guess is that recovery comes. One worry is that if businesses think this argument is going to dominate politics and economics there will not be a recovery, the people they have held over the next few months—not just here, as I said, but on to will then lose their jobs. No doubt the Select in Europe. Committee will look into that. My right hon. Friend mentioned the construction Let me touch on what is happening in Europe. I industry. I welcome some of the measures the Chancellor appreciate that it is a risky business because what is announced on infrastructure, but with this big caveat. happening today might not be what is happening tomorrow First, if he looks at some of them, particularly the road or the day after that. The Chancellor touched on it and announcements, he will see that they have been announced I hoped he would say rather more about what is being by successive Governments over many years. He will no proposed—if, indeed, he knows. doubt have been told by the Treasury that the problem with these big plans is the huge lag between the time As far as I can see, the agreement reached between they are announced and the time we see them. I remember President Sarkozy and Chancellor Merkel on Monday opening the M6 expressway and a reporter said, “This seems to be a recreation of the stability and growth must be a great triumph for the Labour Government.” I pact—and we know which were the first two countries said, “Indeed, it was. Harold Wilson would have been that actually broke it. I have a feeling that they are absolutely delighted to see it built.” That illustrates the trying to reach a sufficient political agreement to give point. Mario Draghi of the European Central Bank sufficient cover to do what we all know the ECB has to do in Although this is not a transport debate, I am glad terms of intervening in the market. It does not go any that the Government are looking at the issue of aviation, further than that. Mario Draghi made a good speech but they cannot escape from the consequences of the last week, in which he said, “Look, we’re ready to decision not to proceed with the expansion at Heathrow. intervene, but you lot have got to show willing.”Interestingly, I know this is no longer my party’s policy, but I believe that is exactly the same position that Jean-Claude Trichet that issue needs to be looked at again for the future took in the ECB at the last ECOFIN meeting I attended prosperity of the country. The High Speed 2 line is no in May 2010, to which the Chancellor is fond of referring, substitute for it. when it was necessary for Ministers in the European The Chancellor has, of course, had to change course. Union and the eurozone to decide on sufficient action He was very much against quantitative easing. When I to allow the ECB to intervene. introduced it, he said it was the last act of a desperate Government, but it now turns out that it is a jolly good I am glad that the ECB is going to intervene, but the thing and we can expect to get even more of it. I suspect agreement reached on Monday does not go far enough we will need more as the economy slows down. As I because it does not address the fundamental questions said, he has also had to introduce the infrastructure and fundamental problems of having a single currency projects to try to help—although not enough, in my without something approaching fiscal or economic union. view. I think he will have to do more, particularly about That was not addressed and neither was the Greek jobs for young people facing unemployment, which is problem, which will not go away because that fix will going to be a real economic problem as well as a real not work. The rescue fund is still a virtual one and, of social problem. Many of us here remember the lost course, there is the whole question of the recapitalisation generation in the 1980s. Many of those individuals of European banks, which remains for next summer. never got over the experience of having no job when they left school, college or university. The Government Matthew Hancock: Will the right hon. Gentleman are going to have to come back to this, no matter what give way? 205 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 206

Mr Darling: I would love to, but if think that if I do it health service—but to all our constituents and the counts against me, so I shall carry on speaking for a businesses that employ them. Historic low interest rates minute and 22 seconds, if I may. are a monetary stimulus, underpinning domestic confidence I know we will be represented in the Council at the and increasing spending and investment. end of this week. This is a debate that we cannot afford One of the coalition Government’s key objectives is to stay out of. No one is advocating that we should join to make work pay in order to expand employment, and the euro, and it is simply not going to happen in one of the key objectives that the Liberal Democrats anything like the foreseeable future, but what happens have brought to the coalition Government is a progressive to the eurozone, who is in it, the implications of a increase in the income tax threshold to £10,000 by the breakdown whether it be orderly or disorderly—all that end of the current Parliament. That will make work pay matters very much. I hope that the British Government for the low-paid in particular, and especially for women will make it clear to our European partners that we with part-time jobs, and it is fundamental to our really are partners and in that spirit try to bring about a commitment to fairness during the lifetime of this resolution. As far as I can see, the present arrangements Government. struck between the French and the Germans seem to be Last week, during a debate similar to this, I referred yet another fix. They will buy time, but they will not to the recommendations of the High Pay Commission. sort out the fundamental problems. Until those fundamental I was pleased when the Deputy Prime Minister said problems are sorted out, we will still have that dark at the weekend that he hoped that the coalition cloud of uncertainty in Europe, which would be bad for Government would be able to implement many of those Europe, bad for this country and therefore bad for recommendations. We should also tackle tax avoidance growth and for jobs. For that reason, we have a real in order to make it clear that, as well as rewarding the interest in helping to bring about a resolution to that work done by those with low incomes, the Government problem if we possibly can. are tackling high pay at the top of the income streams in the companies for which they may work. 5.58 pm Economic growth needs to be stimulated. I note that Stephen Williams (Bristol West) (LD): It is a great several Members with constituencies in the south-west pleasure to follow the former Chancellor. We can contrast are present. I am sure that none of us miss the South his thoughtful and authoritative approach with what we West regional development agency, but I have no doubt heard earlier from the shadow Chancellor, who has just that all of us, especially those representing constituencies left the Chamber. We are asked to believe that he cries in greater Bristol—including the Minister of State, during the “Antiques Roadshow”, but anyone watching Department for Work and Pensions, my hon. Friend the our debate would have cried with despair at the pantomime Member for Thornbury and Yate (Steve Webb), who is act we were treated to earlier. Before one of the shadow in the Chamber—will welcome the establishment of a Chancellor’s assistants gets up to tell me how many local enterprise partnership covering the greater Bristol people in Bristol West receive child tax credits, let me area, as well as an enterprise zone in my constituency to tell the Labour Front-Bench team that people in Bristol create new jobs in new media businesses. West are far too smart to fall for the illusion that an Bristol will benefit from the regional growth fund, increase of 5.2% in tax credits somehow amounts to a from Going Places funds, from the housing market cut. stimulus, and from a new technology innovation centre. The state of the public finances has been mentioned A couple of weeks ago, my right hon. Friend the several times. Before the coalition Government came to Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills office, the deficit as a proportion of gross domestic opened the National Composites Centre, near the product was 11.2%. In our first year of government, it constituency of my hon. Friend the Minister of State, was cut to 9.3%. According to the independent forecast and we are also to have a university technology college. from the Office for Budget Responsibility, the deficit Those are examples of real actions being taken by the will be 4.5% at the end of this Parliament. We will have coalition Government to stimulate growth, particularly effectively halved it over the lifetime of the present in new areas of the economy. Government. The Darling plan, if I may refer to it thus, has been mentioned several times during the debate. I Jonathan Edwards (Carmarthen East and Dinefwr) seem to recall that its aim was to do just that—to halve (PC): How will regional pay in the public sector help the deficit over the lifetime of this Parliament—so let us areas of Britain that are lagging behind, such as the not hear too much for the foreseeable future from south-west and Wales? Surely it will only entrench Opposition Members about cutting too fast and too regional wealth inequalities. deep. The coalition is bringing the deficit under control, Stephen Williams: That is an interesting point. The which enables us to benefit from international confidence Chancellor said in the autumn statement that a study that we can borrow cheaply and service the accumulated would be carried out so that we could assess the evidence debt that already exists in an affordable way. In 2010 and decide what to do in the future. I do not think that our credit rating was similar to those of Italy and Spain, we should form any firm conclusions at this point, but I and the fact that it is now so much stronger is due to the would point out that regional pay differentials are the decisive action taken by the coalition Government. norm in the private sector. That improved rating is important not just to the Europe has been mentioned a few times today. It is Government’s Debt Management Office—although the worth our reminding ourselves that the European Union billions of pounds that no longer need to be spent on is the world’s largest single market, that it is worth up to servicing debt interest are now available to fund our £12 trillion—the aggregate value of the EU member priorities, whether they be pensions, education or the states—that it has 500 million consumers, and that 207 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 208

[Stephen Williams] why Mervyn King told the Treasury Committee that he was surprised that there was not more public anger 50% of British trade exists with our fellow EU members. about. At this point it is all the more important for the United However, we must look forward. Britain and the rest Kingdom to play a full and constructive role as a of the western world are witnessing the death throes of member of the EU, and I know that the Under-Secretary an ideology that has dominated for 30 years. The Anglo- of State for Business, Innovation and Skills, my hon. Saxon neo-liberal market model has failed, and we must Friend the Member for Kingston and Surbiton consider adopting different models if we are to have a (Mr Davey)—who is present—plays an active role in financial services sector that is fit for purpose. We need financial services, energy, digital media and green technology. to be more innovative: we need to try out new ideas We want the single market to work in the interests of rather than adhering to traditional recipes which we our country. Now is the time for our country to engage have already tried, which have been found wanting, and positively in Europe rather than hoping for some loosening which have now been totally discredited. of our relationship with the EU, let alone the catastrophic developments that would result from withdrawal. Why, for example, should we not use RBS as a national investment bank—or call it what you will? The coalition Government have ambitious plans. We After all, we own 87% of it. Why should it not be have restored confidence in our public finances and modelled on America’s Small Business Administration, brought them under control, we have achieved international which has supplied 20 million small business men with credibility, and we will stimulate economic growth and financial help since its establishment after the second make work pay. These are difficult times indeed, but world war, or indeed on Germany’s state development sustainable growth and recovery are on the way. bank, which lent ¤30 billion to businesses in 2010 alone? Instead of printing money through co-called quantitative 6.5 pm easing and giving it to the banks—which do not lend it, but hoard it to rebuild their capital base—why should Mr Roger Godsiff (Birmingham, Hall Green) (Lab): we not give consumers money vouchers that are time-limited Ordinary people in my constituency who face massive and must be spent on household goods or on, for instance, pressures on their household budgets and look forward car scrappage schemes? We should try out some new to a bleak Christmas are not too concerned about the ideas. The fastest way to stimulate the economy is from blame game that is taking place between the parties, but the bottom upwards, and no job creation scheme could there is a smouldering resentment of the financial sector, have a more immediate effect than bringing our high including the banks and financial institutions that have streets alive. All Members know of high streets in their plunged the economy into recession, destroyed jobs and constituencies with boarded-up shops, and where the ripped people’s lives apart. That resentment is heightened only new shops are Poundland stores and charity shops. by the fact that those self-same banks and financial This is not revolutionary thinking. It has been tried institutions are once again acting as they did before before in America, Japan and China. People are looking they brought the crisis upon us. There are bonuses for new ideas for the future, and they are prepared to galore, and veiled threats that if regulations are introduced accept radical and innovative policies. They do not they will go elsewhere. want to be lectured by the Government or the Governor It is three years since the financial crisis struck, but it of the Bank of England, who can hardly be thought to needs to be said again and again that that crisis was not have had foresight in seeing the recession coming given caused by nurses and teachers. It was not caused by that he was arguing for increased interest rates right up public sector workers, or by people working in the until the end of 2008 in order to head off inflation, private sector. It was not caused by small business men, which he said was the biggest threat to the recovery. students or retired people, or indeed by the majority of We have paid homage to the Bank and financial people working in the financial sector. It was caused by institutions for too long. We must construct a better the greed and irresponsibility of a small, self-serving financial system that is fit for purpose, and we need to group of people who made the decisions and played the do that sooner rather than later. casino, and now everyone else is paying the price. Between 1992—when the United Kingdom was Several hon. Members rose— thankfully forced out of the exchange rate mechanism—and 2007, the British economy grew every year. It grew under the right hon. and learned Member for Rushcliffe Mr Deputy Speaker (Mr Lindsay Hoyle): A few Members (Mr Clarke) when he was Chancellor of the Exchequer, have risen, but I must remind colleagues that if any of and it grew under subsequent Labour Chancellors. Public them wish to catch my eye, it might help if they stand sector borrowing was consistently between 2% and 3% up. I call Mr Edward Leigh. of GDP, which was perfectly sustainable. However, in 2008 it shot up to 11% because the financial crisis caused by those I referred to earlier had resulted in a 6.11 pm full-blown recession and a collapse in tax revenues, and, Mr Edward Leigh (Gainsborough) (Con): The hon. furthermore, in the need for the Government to bail out Member for Birmingham, Hall Green (Mr Godsiff) the banking sector. I am sure that my right hon. Friend suggests that RBS should be made into a national the Member for Edinburgh South West (Mr Darling), investment bank and that it would then be our saviour. I who spoke earlier, referred in his book to an interesting wonder whether he watched a programme on BBC2 deputation that he received—when Treasury officials yesterday, which relayed the entire history of how it cost informed him that the only way of resolving the crisis the nation £20 billion. I am not sure it is an entirely was for him to nationalise the banks—and I understand good model, therefore. 209 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 210

First, I want to say a few words about what is more than 55% in real terms and, contrary to all the happening in Europe this week. An express train is political argument here today, we are cutting that by coming in our direction in the shape of the putative just 3%. The Government must decide whether they agreement between the Chancellor of Germany and the want to be liked or to deliver long-term prosperity and President of France. The shadow Chancellor said we growth. As we have also heard today, we are still borrowing should learn the lessons of history. Well, I have been £141 billion every year. The cost of servicing that debt is reading about the congress of Vienna, and it is extraordinary £43 billion every year, more than we spend on defence. how history repeats itself. Our whole national policy in This is a staggering burden. I want to hear more of an those days—and for 300 years—was to prevent an intellectual case for smaller government. Big government agglomeration of power on the continent. Indeed, Napoleon leads to big waste. Sir Philip Green calculated in his created the continental system precisely to exclude us study that £700 million could be saved on the Government from the continent. That is why we fought so many wars telephone bill alone. over the centuries. People are hit with a double whammy by all this We are now faced with a worrying situation. If the Government spending. Like a black hole, it sucks in eurozone creates fiscal and monetary union, we will, of enterprise, and it inflates prices and taxes people of all course, voluntarily exclude ourselves from that. However, their spare income so they have less to spend on their although we may exclude ourselves from the euro, because families and themselves. As a result, the economy deflates. of qualified majority voting the eurozone countries will Governments say in such circumstances that more have not just influence but enormous power over our must be done and propose a fiscal stimulus, usually financial institutions. We should be extremely worried through public works, but those works are often driven about that. Over the next few days the Prime Minister by politics not the marketplace. A better way to deliver must ensure that we have real protection from what will stimulus is to cut taxes. be going on. There has been much comment about the EU financial transaction tax. We may be able to refuse to implement Glyn Davies (Montgomeryshire) (Con): I have a lot it, or be given an opt-out. I certainly hope that that is of sympathy with the case my hon. Friend is making, the case, because the City of London is the global but can he point to any international examples of derivatives trading centre. Astonishingly, it accounts for countries or organisations that recommend going further 45% of all global trades in interest-rate derivatives, and and more quickly in terms of austerity measures? this tax could cost us £26 billion. Vague reassurances are not enough. Mr Leigh: I can point to successful economies in the The ex-head of the Financial Services Authority has world that have the taken the view that the way to get recently said that between 80% and 90% of our prudential out of the problem of a flatlining economy is to release rule book originates from Europe. In 2010-11, the FSA more money back into the economy through the stimulus has listed 29 financial regulations that come from Europe. of lower taxation. I have referred to one tax that raises All this is coming in our direction because the eurozone little money but acts as a tremendous disincentive to countries can muster 230 votes, and we will have no way enterprise: the 50% tax rate. I would abolish that, as of stopping it. We should be prepared to say no or to it achieves very little apart from bearing down on demand a treaty reassurance, and if necessary put any enterprise. proposal to the British people in a referendum. We still have the longest tax code in the world; Turning away from Europe, I want now to talk about indeed, it is longer than the tax code in India. The our woeful economic situation. It is in the interests of Centre for Policy Studies estimates that the marginal both parties to claim that the deficit reduction programme tax rate on poor people is as much as 96%, while the is tough and is hurting. It is in the interests of the marginal tax rate on higher earners is 57%. There is a Government because it shows that they are being prudent greater imperative than ever before for Government to and implementing austerity measures, and it is in the be the facilitator, not the central planner. They can, by interests of the Labour party because it is arguing that all means, deliver some public works, but they must not we are deepening the recession. In fact, however, we are be fantasy or vanity projects such as high-speed railway not doing nearly enough to address the problems we lines. Instead, they must be works such as the third face. Some 38% of all our output goes to Government. runway at Heathrow, which the market is prepared to That is a higher proportion than in the USA, Canada or build for us because the market wants it. By all means, Australia. Contrary to what we have heard, many EU let us have public works, but they must make sense in countries have a lower tax burden than ours. terms of the marketplace, and let us also have tax cuts. I support the Liberal proposal to take the lower paid out of tax, because that also delivers incentives and cuts the Mr Andrew Turner (Isle of Wight) (Con): My hon. marginal tax rate on the lower paid. I want us to have a Friend has alluded to the situation in Greece. Does he much flatter overall tax system, too. agree that much is borrowed but not accounted for? Despite all that we have tried to do, Great Britain ranks as the 72nd country in the world for Government Mr Leigh: That is absolutely right. We do not know wastefulness, which is lower than Tajikistan and Ethiopia. what is going on in a lot of areas. Many EU countries, The House may not accept all my arguments, but I including Greece and Spain, tax their economies less hope Members will accept that an intellectual case must than might be thought. at least be made for a smaller and leaner Government I apologise to Opposition Members for having to say who tax people less and deliver more vitality and this, but much of the blame lies with the previous entrepreneurship back into the economy. That is the Government. They increased Government spending by only way we will fight our way out of this recession. 211 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 212

6.19 pm For businesses to grow, they need access to affordable Gordon Banks (Ochil and South Perthshire) (Lab): I funding. Historically, most small business funding has draw the House’s attention to my declared interests. been generated from our banks, but the Institute for Family Business and the Federation of Small Businesses The Government’s economic plan is not working—if tell us that, due to the actions of the banks and small it were, we would not have heard much of what we were businesses’ distrust of them, many such businesses are subject to in last week’s autumn statement. The Chancellor seeking funding from family members or not seeking it has choked off recovery and in turn raised unemployment. at all. To do the latter damages the business and the I acknowledge that the eurozone crisis is having an economy; to do the former may place limitations on the impact on the economy now, but growth in our economy business, with the same impacts. was choked off well over a year ago. However, what is clear is that small and medium-sized I want to spend a little time looking at economic enterprises are not at ease with the banking sector. The growth and the role the construction industry can play. much-hailed Project Merlin has been a resounding failure. Labour has set out measures designed to create jobs The British Bankers Association has declared that lending and growth, and many of these would help the construction targets have been met; however, the FSB and the Federation industry: 25,000 affordable homes, 100,000 jobs for of Master Builders have other ideas. I have been told of young people and cutting VAT to 5% for home banks meeting their Merlin targets by re-signing existing, improvements. Having started my own business in 1986, unexpired deals. But the truth is, we will never know I believe that without a vibrant small business sector, how much of Merlin is re-signed and regurgitated economic recovery is impossible, and without a vibrant arrangements. Indeed, this is smoke and mirrors that construction industry, such recovery is equally impossible. the Merlin of folklore would be proud of, but I suppose The construction industry is of the private sector, but it we should not be surprised: the clue is in the name. needs both a vibrant private and public sector to survive. It is also a cash-consuming industry and as such needs I know of financing arrangements that have long the support of the UK finance industry. It is an industry been in place being removed with immediate effect, that can create jobs fairly quickly and can train people leaving a business in turmoil. Then, the bank returns to in skills that will last them a lifetime. However, in recent the business a few days later with the offer of a term years more than 300,000 construction sector jobs have loan that is new business for the bank to write—no been lost, 63,000 of those in the first three months of doubt adding to the Merlin figures—at increased rates this year. Private sector job creation is not keeping up and with arrangement fees, all paid for by the business with job losses from the public sector. If it were to do and with less capital provision for the lender, but leaving that, the Government would need the construction industry the business without any long-term funding in place. to be significantly more active than it is. Small businesses in the construction sector have been The major banks will not lend enough to the industry. victimised on two fronts: for being small, and for being in They have seen the sector weakened by Government the construction sector, which is deemed toxic by many decisions, and by their actions the banks add further to lenders. that decline. The benefits of a strong construction industry When considering finance, however, we should not are, however, great and should mean one thing: more forget first-time buyers and the crisis in mortgage lending. jobs for Britain, and more jobs for Britain means more In 2007, there were 357,000 first-time buyers in the UK, tax revenue. and as a result the British high street was boosted by An obvious indicator of a country’s economic well-being some £2.1 billion when these people kitted out their is its construction industry. Every business needs this homes. However, today, young people, who are the sector in order to expand—whether it is through bigger majority of would-be first-time buyers, are unable to offices, bigger factories, better high-tech communications, purchase their own home. Now, the average age of a or better road and rail infrastructure. However, let me first-time buyer without parental support is 38. With make this point about infrastructure to both Front-Bench 25 or 30-year mortgages, these first-time buyers could teams: major projects are very important, but I would still be paying off their mortgages as they approach argue for lower-cost, more local investments throughout their 70s. Surely, pensioners paying mortgages is not the country, as well, as they would have an impact something we want to see in Britain in years to come. throughout the UK in both their development and In my business, where investment in vehicles can cost post-development stages. Only “shovel-ready” proposals up to £130,000 each, and where forklifts and loading will have an immediate impact on our flatlining economy. shovels cost tens of thousands of pounds, the real driver for investment is the footfall of customers and Mr William Bain (Glasgow North East) (Lab): My the profit margin. Both have taken a tumble in recent hon. Friend will have noted that in Scotland recently, years, and nothing that I have seen this Government do construction output has fallen by 2.3%. What contribution or promise to do will result in more customers or a rise does he think the cut by John Swinney, the Scottish in profit margins. Government’s Finance Minister—a reduction in capital spending that is two and a half times faster than this Angela Smith: My hon. Friend is making a very Chancellor’s—has made to that slump? strong case against the Government’s economic policy. Gordon Banks: The Scottish Minister’s decision is Does he agree with Will Hutton’s comments in The responsible for the cuts that could also impact on Observer on Sunday? He said that the Chancellor investment and delivery in the construction industry. “is operating within a framework that permits no vision for how The flipside is that if we are prepared to invest in the the British economy can be re-energised and reimagined.” construction industry, it will deliver; if we cut public spending, it will destroy the industry and with it the Gordon Banks: I agree with that, and I would add to economy. that the comments of my hon. Friend the Member for 213 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 214

Glasgow North East (Mr Bain) in his intervention a On finance, I am delighted that we have the new seed moment ago: there is a lack of vision in both Scotland enterprise investment scheme, as it will make a big and No. 11. difference. The point I would make to the Treasury is Falling business opportunities equals reducing margins that we need to examine who is going to use that type of and cuts to investment and employee numbers, which support. It will be the fast-growth entrepreneur who is add further to the decline in the economy. Businesses in looking for external investment, but what about social my constituency and in the construction sector want to enterprises and what about the plumber who is setting know whether this Government see themselves as a up, having just been made redundant? Some of the driver for growth, or not. money that they will be seeking could be offered by their families, but they are excluded. It is all about priorities. As far as the SMEs in the construction sector are concerned, the comments on the David Rutley (Macclesfield) (Con): My hon. Friend is report card, sadly, are not “could do better” but more a passionate advocate for micro-businesses and I commend like “shows no interest in the subject”. her for her extraordinary efforts. Does she agree that it is vital that our micro-businesses are better at articulating 6.27 pm the problems they are facing, so that the Government can more effectively strip back the regulation that she Anne Marie Morris (Newton Abbot) (Con): The Office and I both want removed? for Budget Responsibility has shown clearly that productivity is slowing, and our recovery therefore depends Anne Marie Morris: I agree with my hon. Friend on getting productivity moving forward faster. I suggest absolutely, and that brings me nicely to the challenge that one of the key barriers is over-regulation, which I that we face in getting some of the main schemes to think is borne out by many of the surveys that the assist with finance. Project Merlin, the enterprise finance Federation of Small Businesses and the Forum of Private guarantee scheme and the regional growth fund have all Business have carried out. been aimed at the smaller business. The problem is that in practice, because there is no carve-out and no requirement The sector of the economy that is perhaps most that any percentage of those schemes goes to our very affected by over-regulation consists of the very smallest smallest businesses, these businesses by and large get left of our businesses: the micro-businesses. A micro-business, out. That is because they are perceived to be invisible, for the most part, suffers from the same level of regulation too difficult or too small, or it is perceived that they cannot but has less resource, by virtue of its size, to deal with it. write a business case or are not after a big enough loan. So why should we worry about micro-businesses? I hope that when we examine the new credit easing Because research has indicated that 90% of new jobs arrangements, we might consider a carve-out specifically after a recession come out of that sector, and because it for micros. is in our rural communities that many of those micro- Even some of our institutions that are supposed to be businesses exist. They are critical to the economic viability looking at our small businesses exclude them. I have of our rural communities. We should also be concerned spoken to officials in UK Trade & Investment, and it about the existence of micro-businesses in deprived appears that a small business of fewer than five employees urban communities, where, again, they play a key role in is, unfortunately, beyond its notice. I have talked to those terms of cohesion. in the National Apprenticeship Service, which now has What is a micro-business? The EU defines it as an a small business unit, and they say that a micro-business organisation with fewer than 10 employees, but in fact, with fewer than five employees is, again, outside its remit. 90% of our businesses have fewer than five employees. May I suggest to the Treasury that the solution, is, Therefore, they have very little managerial support and first, that we should properly recognise this group for expertise. what they are? Let us define them properly as organisations The Government have done their level best to help with four or fewer employees, as is happening around small and medium-sized businesses, and specific provision the world, and let us devise a scheme specifically for has been made to help the micro-business. So why do this group. That is perfectly possible, as the French micro-businesses feel unloved and, in the words of one, have come up with such a scheme for their smallest invisible? Perhaps I may make some suggestions to the micro-businesses. It provides limited liability, a very Treasury on how we can rectify that and support the simple form of establishing a business, simple accounting sector better. We have given a three-year moratorium procedures and a very simple tax system, and it also provides on new regulation for our micro-businesses, but the for very simple sets of regulation, particularly in respect challenge is that they are still subject to existing regulation, of employment. So something simple for our smallest a lot of which comes from Europe, and if they have only micro-businesses is just what we need. two or three people in the business, that is a very In the last minute available to me, I suggest also that, heavy burden. We need a “keep it simple” system for because much of the regulatory burden comes from micros. Europe, there is a case to be made for considering an On employment, the Government have helpfully provided exclusion for micro-businesses from European regulation. a national insurance break for start-up businesses. We I commend that to the Treasury and the Chancellor, if have also examined the tribunal system and considered and when we come to treaty negotiations, as something a simplified system for smaller businesses, but we must that might be usefully traded. remember that businesses with no employees comprise 70% of all our businesses—or about 3 million businesses 6.33 pm altogether—and if we gave those very small businesses Phil Wilson (Sedgefield) (Lab): I would like to discuss national insurance relief, we would go a long way towards the part of the autumn statement dealing with local solving our unemployment problem. public sector pay and the relationship with local labour 215 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 216

[Phil Wilson] cost of living is more convergent around the UK than it would otherwise seem to be. In addition, major private markets—in other words, regional pay. As a Member of sector companies—BT, British Gas, Waterstone’s, First Parliament for the north-east of England, I know that Great Western and Santander, to name but a few—have unemployment in the north-east is 11.6%—the highest national pay structures, although they have, for example, in the country—the average wage is just over £19,000 a allowances for workers in London. When the previous year, and the average house price is £144,000. A 25% deposit Government examined this issue they came out against on a mortgage will cost £36,000, and to obtain a mortgage regional pay bargaining for the following reasons, which for the remaining 75% someone would need an income were quoted in a Treasury guidance note in 2003. It said: of £31,000 a year. A house in the rural north-east costs “At the extreme, local pay in theory could mean devolved 8.1 times income, whereas in the urban areas of the pay…to local bodies. In practice, extremely devolved arrangements north-east it averages 7.3 times income. Average incomes are not desirable. There are risks of workers being treated differently in the north-east are 12% below the national average for no good reason. There could be dangers of leapfrogging and and are the lowest in England. Given those facts, introducing parts of the public sector competing against each other for the a regional wage structure in the public sector is the best staff.” wrong thing to do, because it is short-sighted and it That illustrates the point that has just been made by my belies the facts on regional pay disparities. If the Chancellor hon. Friend the Member for Darlington (Mrs Chapman). were really serious about pay, he would join me, and The wage disparities do not arise from an overactive many of my colleagues in the north-east of England, in public sector displacing private sector jobs; that cannot calling for a living wage, not a regional wage. be so, given that 700,000 public sector jobs are to be lost I do not believe that national pay bargaining in the in the coming years. I want to see a vibrant private public sector suppresses pay in the private sector. Although sector, with skilled jobs that are well paid and full-time, regional pay does exist in the way allowances are paid, but to achieve that we need growth. for example, for people who work in London and the south-east, the main differential is not between regions, Angela Smith: Does my hon. Friend believe for a but between London and the south-east and the rest of minute that the Government have thought through the the country. Pay disparity between the regions is about complexities of moving to local pay scales, given that it £2,000, according to Incomes Data Services, and there will inevitably involve consultants in establishing exactly is very little difference in the cost of living between where on the new pay scales the public sector employees regions. The largest disparity is between the north-east will belong? and London, where the cost of living varies by 10%. The Office for National Statistics states that the cost of Phil Wilson: My hon. Friend raises an important living in the remaining regions varies by between 1.5 and point. I do not think the Government have thought all 2.8%, depending on the goods compared. However, the these things through; I know they will be looking at wages of commuters in the London commuter belt are them in more detail, but the process seems ideologically higher than those of the people living and working in led. the commuter towns. One North East was a dynamo for private sector job The ONS and IDS believe that the only distinct creation in the north-east. To abolish it was the wrong labour market in the UK is in London and the commuter decision. We need the expertise of the public sector to belt area around the city. Is that not another reason for generate private sector jobs in the area. That is how investing in transport infrastructure projects, which will Hitachi Rail was attracted to Newton Aycliffe in my shrink distances between London and the rest of the constituency, creating hundreds of direct private sector UK, rather than encouraging a rush to the bottom in jobs and thousands in the supply chain. Hitachi did not pay rates between the public and private sectors, and come to the north-east because of the public sector, but between regions? it did have the help of the public sector. I want more Hitachis coming to the north-east, bringing highly skilled Mrs Jenny Chapman (Darlington) (Lab): My hon. jobs that will deliver good wages. That is how we shall Friend is making a superb point. I do not know whether redress wage disparities in the north-east; not by suppressing he has served on the governing body of a school or on a the wages of a section of the community but by raising board of a health trust, but I can tell him that recruiting the wages of all employees, through investment, training good, able, ambitious and talented people in the public and skills. With that will come good wages, and I call on sector can be a real challenge in the north-east. As someone the Government to promote a living wage, not a regional who lives there, I do not understand why that is, but it wage, for the north-east and the rest of the UK. seems to be the case. We need to be able to attract those quality people, and enable them to move around the There is no evidence that regional pay will rebalance country and pursue their careers as they need to. the economy. Driving down wages will only exacerbate economic disparities, not resolve them. Driving down Phil Wilson: That is absolutely right. If regional pay relative wage costs and taking money out of the economy structure went ahead, in whatever variety it may take, it is as bad for the private sector in areas such as the would just exacerbate that situation. The regions would north-east as it is for the public sector. That is why I become silos, and people would not be able to move make a special plea, not for the public sector but for all around the country. employees in the north-east of England, whatever they It is also a myth that there are major variations in the do and wherever they work. cost of living around the country. The reason why the Public sector employees face a two-year pay freeze variation is less explicit outside London is because and then two years with only a 1% increase. It has been major retailers have national pricing policies, and internet estimated that between 2010 and 2015 public sector shopping is having a similar effect in ensuring that the workers will see their incomes decrease by 14%. Average 217 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 218 pay in the north-east is just over £19,000. How low do of the autumn statement is that over the next three the Government want it to be? The policy is wrong, and years another £216 million will go to Wales for capital I believe it is ideologically led. The answer is a living projects, but projects on the border will not be considered, wage, not a regional wage. because the arrangements following devolution mean that they cannot be. For my constituency and for the 6.41 pm whole of mid-Wales, industrial development depends on access to the west midlands market and the motorway Glyn Davies (Montgomeryshire) (Con): I shall take a network. One of the biggest impediments is the stretch Welsh perspective, and to some extent a constituency of the border between Welshpool and Shrewsbury. A perspective. Debt hangover, deficit reduction and the road project there has high priority for the Welsh problems facing the eurozone have an impact in Wales, Government and would almost certainly have gone just as they do in the rest of Britain, but some issues are ahead, but the total cost is around £30 million, with a specific to Wales and I want to touch on them. significant proportion—about £5 million—over the border Much of the management of the Welsh economy is in England. Although it has huge priority in Wales it is devolved, but not completely; for example, policies on given almost no priority at all on the English side. That tax rates and international investment are still determined project has been sitting around for ages and is not going at Westminster. That inevitably means that a close working ahead, yet it should really be a priority. I could give relationship between the Governments in Cardiff Bay three or four similar examples. and at Westminster is crucial. Without one, there is the potential for damage. Enterprise zones are an important Owen Smith (Pontypridd) (Lab): I entirely agree with aspect of the Government’s policy for dealing with the the point that the hon. Gentleman is making, but would economic problems of England. I do not want to blame it not have been easier if the Government had chosen anyone, but in Wales they are still incredibly ill defined not to cut £900 million overall from the Welsh capital and the process is slow, so we need a much closer budget? Admittedly they gave back £200 million last relationship between Ministers in the Assembly Government week, but there is an overall reduction of £700 million and Ministers at Westminster. in this Parliament. Mr Angus Brendan MacNeil (Na h-Eileanan an Iar) (SNP): The hon. Gentleman said that most economic Glyn Davies: I thank the hon. Gentleman, but he control was devolved to Wales. Would he be as comfortable completely ignores my point and is going back to the with a relationship between London and Europe as partisan knockabout that produces absolutely nothing. there is currently between Cardiff and London—with There is an important point of principle relating to most powers held in Europe and London, despite the cross-border investment, and all Members of the House economy of Wales being devolved? and of the National Assembly, not just the Government, should try to focus on the issue so that we have a Glyn Davies: I thank the hon. Gentleman, although I resolution that benefits the people who actually depend am not absolutely certain that I picked up his point. on it. Governments and institutions have to work as closely Thirdly, I want to touch on the impact of proposals together as possible for the benefit of the people they all for wind farms in mid-Wales. Many of my constituents, serve. and indeed people in neighbouring constituencies, fear Inward investment has historically been strong in that there is an intention, or a desire, to sacrifice mid-Wales Wales. Yesterday the Secretary of State for Business, on the altar of onshore wind, irrespective of the Innovation and Skills told the Welsh Affairs Committee consequences for the economy. About two decades ago, that Wales was doing relatively badly. I think Wales is when I was involved in developing the economy of doing very badly indeed; last year only 3% of inward mid-Wales, strategy was based on the growth of investment in the UK went to Wales. In the two previous manufacturing industry—what today we might call years the proportion was 6%, which is about what one rebalancing the economy—after the loss of jobs from would expect given the population of each country. In agriculture and mining over a long period. Over the last the days when Lord Walker was Secretary of State for 30 or 40 years the percentage of people employed in Wales, it was 20% for two or three years in a row. There manufacturing rose from about 7% to about 24%; it was was a major focus on Welsh links to the most successful a terrific performance, but between the late-1980s and parts of Europe, such as Baden-Württemberg, Stuttgart, the mid-1990s there was less concentration on regional Barcelona and Lombardy. There was a strong relationship development and the figures probably slipped back. with Japan, which in those days was aggressively developing Today the most important developing industry in its economy throughout the world. A lot of investment Wales is probably tourism. People who work in the was going to Wales, and we need that sort of advantage. industry contact me regularly to tell me that onshore When I became a Member of this House I had been a wind is the biggest threat to the potential of their Member of the Welsh Assembly for eight years, and I business. We cannot ignore that. Planners in mid-Wales want the relationship between the two institutions to are aware of the threat. They are deeply concerned that work as well as possible. On inward investment the wind farm applications are being submitted without the working relationship has not been as close as it should necessary information about ecological or environmental be, and we need to change that. impacts. There is almost no transport planning for the Secondly, I want to touch on cross-border issues, 20 or so proposed wind farms, yet planners are under in particular their impact on my constituency of pressure to approve the applications. If they do, they Montgomeryshire. Again, it is a question of making will be sacrificing the economy of mid-Wales. Many of devolution work for the people. There is a real problem us in the House have concerns about the costs and their in terms of capital investment in Wales. A consequence impact on the fuel bills of the most vulnerable in 219 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 220

[Glyn Davies] proposals are unfair. They are unintelligent to the point of stupidity, because the propensity to consume is highest society, and we are worried about the impact on British among the poorest. Maintaining the incomes of people jobs, which will be exported as a result of those costs. on low incomes will have the fastest and greatest impact From the perspective of my constituency, the economy on demand, so even with the same level of borrowing as of mid-Wales will be destroyed at the same time. they propose and the same fiscal stance, the Government could have a bigger bang for their buck. They could have a greater impact on demand and on the growth of 6.50 pm the economy, simply by redistributing. Helen Goodman (Bishop Auckland) (Lab): I am pleased The second dimension on which the autumn statement to follow the hon. Member for Montgomeryshire (Glyn is both unfair and unintelligent is the regional distribution. Davies). I do not agree with what he said about wind The Government are switching £4 billion from current farms, but he made a thoughtful and interesting speech, to capital, of which only £4 million—that is, 0.1%—is and I hope that when he listens to what I say about the earmarked for the north-east. That is 25 times less than north-east, he may feel that things in Wales are not the £100 million that was lost from my constituency quite so bad. alone when the Building Schools for the Future programme At the weekend I received an e-mail from a constituent was cut. For example, improvements to the A1, the which said: A19, the A66 and the Tyne tunnel are not going ahead. “I wanted to apply for a crisis loan for my heating oil but when The North East chamber of commerce has described I rang up I was told this was not possible … and I would have this as “hugely disappointing”. The extension of to apply for a budgeting loan which has a three-week wait … My 100% capital allowances till 2017, the new enterprise zone problemisIamunabletopaybydirectdebit…Ihavebeen unable in the port of Blyth and the increase in the regional growth to save the money from my employment and support allowance as fund are all minuscule in comparison with the impact of I have been trying to pay my other important bills...My dilemma is that my oil will not last much longer and as I suffer the abolition of the regional development agency. from diabetes and had a heart procedure in September my health Furthermore, the infrastructure plan is old-fashioned. will suffer as a result of no heating. Only £100 million of the new money is in the What can I do to sort this out?” communications strategy and that is all concentrated in The e-mail is interesting not because of what it says the cities, whereas the lack of access is in rural areas. about the benefits system, but because of what it reveals Today the Federation of Small Businesses and the about the level of poverty being faced at present in National Farmers Union came together to point out some households, as well as the consequences of the that hundreds of thousands of people will be left behind, failure to tackle the energy giants adequately. so where it is most useful and most needed, it will be least available. There are two major themes that I want to pull out of what the Chancellor of the Exchequer announced in his In announcing his weakening of the habitats directive, autumn statement—the unfairness and the unintelligence the Chancellor seemed to be scornful of green considerations. of the proposals that he put to the House. In many After the excuses of snow and royal weddings, it seems cases they are unintelligent because they are unfair. Let to be the butterflies that are the problem, or perhaps it us look first at who is bearing the burden of the measures was the seaweed that he was complaining about. that he announced. We can see from the analysis published My hon. Friend the Member for Sedgefield (Phil by the Institute for Fiscal Studies that it is the poorest Wilson) pointed out the detrimental impact of regional who are paying the most. The IFS analysis makes it pay on our regional economy. Lower pay in the north-east clear that the measures that the Chancellor of the is a symptom of our problems. Reducing the pay further Exchequer announced will make the bottom 30% worse will take yet more money out of the demand in the off and the top 60% better off. regional economy. To set this in context, my hon. Friend the Member for Easington (Grahame M. Morris) made Mr McFadden: My hon. Friend is right in what she an excellent speech in Westminster Hall, pointing out says about the Institute for Fiscal Studies estimates. She that the cuts in incapacity benefit are already taking will also know that the IFS says that by household £170 million out of the regional economy. What may types, it is families with children who are worst hit. look like a sneeze in the south can cause pneumonia in What does she think the Government and the Chancellor the north-east. have got against families with children? 6.57 pm Helen Goodman: I cannot imagine what the Chancellor Damian Collins (Folkestone and Hythe) (Con): has against families with children, but it is obviously a Throughout the debate this afternoon we have been matter of extreme concern not just that the number of asked to consider that the debt situation that we are in is children who live in poverty will go up, but that to not as bad as it seems and that we can spend money that tackle the problem, the Government are going to redefine we do not have to try and get out of it. That argument poverty. They will find that that is a massive mistake. If lacks any credibility with the money markets. they go to an absolute measure, they will not look good against the Labour Government, who reduced the number Helen Goodman: That is not what I said. of children in absolute poverty by 2 million. Those on £14,500 will lose eight times the share of Damian Collins: The hon. Member for Bishop Auckland their income that those on £32,000 will lose. The poorest (Helen Goodman) is speaking from a sedentary position. 10% will lose four times the share of their income that I shall come to her remarks, which are pertinent to my the richest 10% lose. In other words, it is a cynical way constituency, particularly her comments on the habitats of focusing money on so-called marginal voters. The regulations and how they impact on the local economy. 221 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 222

Opposition Members have put to one side the seriousness indictment he finds after 13 years of Labour Government, of the debt situation. The other issue that has not been but it sounds pretty damning to me. The hon. Member spoken about at all—certainly not by the right hon. for Bishop Auckland talked about the habitats regulations, Member for Edinburgh South West (Mr Darling) or by which I will move on to because it is an important the shadow Chancellor, the right hon. Member for point. She was slightly dismissive, but I do not think Morley and Outwood (Ed Balls)—is the underlying that she meant to be. competitiveness of the economy. When we look at the debt situation and the world economic crisis, which are grave and severe, we should also consider that our Helen Goodman: No, you are dismissive. economy may not be as fit and competitive and as able to grow the sort of jobs that we will need in the future as Damian Collins: She was very dismissive of the we thought it was. significance of the review the Chancellor announced Statistics showing how this country has fallen behind last week on whether the habitats regulations are being in the competitiveness league tables published by the used to hamper growth and business development and World Economic Forum are often brushed aside. From whether they are being unfairly and unreasonably applied. being seventh in 1997 when the Conservative party left A particularly pertinent case in my constituency is office, we fell to 13th last year and are 10th now. That whether Dungeness nuclear power station in Kent should means that in 1997 we had the most competitive economy be allowed on the list of new nuclear power sites, and I in the European Union. We find ourselves today behind have written to the Chancellor to ask him to give it Sweden, Finland, Germany, the Netherlands and Denmark special consideration in the review. There is a huge on competitiveness. amount of local support and there are two nuclear On the broader question of infrastructure, which is power stations there already. so important to the competitiveness of our economy, Land was set aside for the creation of a third power we find that Britain lies in 28th position, according to station in the 1960s, most of which was disturbed the latest figures, not rubbing shoulders with France, during the building of the first two. The land is within a which is third, or Germany, which is 10th, but instead special protected area next to a Ramsar site that gives between Saudi Arabia and the Czech Republic. special protection not to butterflies, but to vegetation that grows on the shingle banks and to birds. The bird Sheila Gilmore: I am fascinated by the comparisons sanctuary was created largely after the building of the that have been given. Virtually all of the first group of existing power stations. The area of development for countries that the hon. Gentleman mentioned have a the new nuclear power station is less than 1% of the very large public sector and a very comprehensive welfare protected area, so it would be difficult to claim that system. It would appear that they have a competitive building it would damage the integrity of the whole site economy as well. Perhaps we should be looking more to or destroy the habitats totally. They remains within a the Scandinavian model. large, protected and conserved area and will be protected. Nevertheless, based on Natural England’s interpretation Damian Collins: The hon. Lady will be pleased to of the habitats regulations, it was recommended to the know that we are also behind Singapore, the United Government that a third power station should not be States and Japan, so there are more countries ahead of built on the site, and that is the only reason why it us than there used to be, and more than there should be. cannot be built. It would create thousands of jobs When we consider trying to create jobs in the economy, during the construction phase and 500 permanent jobs Opposition Members seems wilfully to ignore the fact for its operation. It would be an incredibly important that our competitiveness in an increasingly competitive investment, and that is an example of how the interpretation world matters. To them, competitiveness is not worth of some of these regulations is impeding growth and talking about and is irrelevant to creating jobs. If we are investment in our economy. The power station would be serious about doing what President Clinton has called built not on a greenfield site in a protected area, but getting back in the future business—his criticism of the next door to two existing power stations and on land US economy can be applied to the UK economy over that was set aside for the purpose. I obviously feel the past 10 to 15 years—we must recognise that we have strongly about this example because the new power not invested as we should have done to make our station would help my constituency directly, but it would economy as competitive as it should be. also be a new energy source in an area of high demand in the south-east of England, close to south-east London. Tom Blenkinsop (Middlesbrough South and East Another local example is Lydd airport. Extending or Cleveland) (Lab): The common denominator in all the building new regional airports is a controversial issue. European countries to which my hon. Friend the Member In my constituency the local council decided some time for Edinburgh East (Sheila Gilmore) alluded is their ago to approve a planning application to expand the manufacturing base, and Germany, Japan and China airport. There had been a previous public inquiry on are of course also manufacturing surplus economies. that in the 1990s, which had lapsed, so the process has Britain used to have such an economy, until 1979. to be gone through again. A private developer who is willing to invest money with the support of the local Damian Collins: I am not sure what the hon. Gentleman’s council, which approved the planning decision, is being critique is of the party that was in power for 13 years put through a costly and lengthy process, wasting hundreds and delivered these statistics. The point I made at the of thousands of pounds, with the prospect of possible beginning of my speech is that after 18 years of Conservative judicial review at the end. That is also because of the Government Britain’s competitiveness in Europe was way the habitats regulations have been interpreted, and much higher than it is now. I do not know what sort of during the course of the most recent planning inspector’s 223 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 224

[Damian Collins] One of the things the Chancellor has focused on, and rightly so, is the importance of keeping interest rates inquiry many of the objections were set aside. It is low, and I do not think that any Member disagrees with frustrating that these rules and regulations are hampering that. It has an impact on businesses and mortgages and investment and growth. on those who have taken out loans, so it is correct that we should be following policies that keep interest rates Angela Smith: I thought that the hon. Gentleman’s low. However, I do not accept that they have been kept party was going to form the greenest Government ever. low in the UK only because of his plan A and his austerity measures. Looking at the reasons, one sees that of Damian Collins: The hon. Lady seems to think that course economic management and confidence in it is there is something incompatible between sensible investment important, but so too is the fact that the Bank of England in growth that respects environmental regulations and has been buying up £220 billion worth of Government having no jobs or investment at all. I think that that is bonds as a result of quantitative easing. That has injected possible in this area. The contention in my constituency confidence that other European countries that have and those of many hon. Members is that the rules are been mentioned today would perhaps not have had because being applied in a way that restricts growth and investment, the European Central Bank has not done the same. largely from private investors and operators, where it is Secondly, we also have the flexibility to adjust our really needed, and that is unacceptable. exchange rate and so have a way of stimulating some The regional growth fund is a big help for constituencies, growth, whereas many European countries that are tied such as mine, where extra support is needed to attract to the euro do not have that. Thirdly, even though the investors to create new jobs. That is certainly something Government have admitted that their plan for getting we welcome in east Kent. Another point about rid of the deficit will not be fulfilled in the set period infrastructure investment, which I touched on at the and that they will have to borrow more than expected, beginning of my remarks, is the importance of the the financial markets have not deserted the UK. In fact, Government’s commitment to invest in broadband and they have remained solid. I believe that one of the improve the extent of mobile phone networks and reasons for that is that we are not regarded in the way coverage. I was pleased to hear in the Chancellor’s that some of the other European countries are, for the statement that, thanks to the extra £150 million that has very reasons I have given. If anything, the Government been made available for new masts in rural areas, the ought to capitalise on that. If the markets are prepared coverage target for mobile operators is now 99%, rather to lend to pay for unemployment, would they not be than the 95% target in the last Parliament. That is good even more willing to lend to pay for investment in news for people in rural communities who are excluded infrastructure that could give growth which, in turn, from current coverage and something we should welcome. could provide the ability to pay back the debt we It is an important investment in our infrastructure for already have? Rather than walking away from borrowing, the future. and from borrowing—perhaps only modestly—to do the things that Members have mentioned today, the Government should capitalise on the reputation that 7.5 pm their management and our flexibility outside the eurozone gives the Chancellor when it comes to borrowing Sammy Wilson (East Antrim) (DUP): First, I welcome money. a number of things set out in the autumn statement, There are already signs that the Government know such as the increased money for infrastructure that will their plan is wrong: they are engaged in quantitative come to Northern Ireland. It will not make up for the easing, which is a way of stimulating the economy by 40% cut in capital spending announced in the Budget, monetary means; and in the autumn statement they but it will fill some of the gaps. Secondly, I wish the indicated that they were prepared to spend more money Chancellor well in his battle with the Secretary of State on infrastructure. They ought then to look at what they for Energy and Climate Change, and perhaps the Prime can do and at what borrowing they can undertake not Minister, as he takes on the green lobby and seeks to to pay to leave people sitting at home, but to pay to get strike a balance in the economy and redress the damage them into work, growing the economy and generating that many green policies are doing to industry. tax revenues. I will focus on some of the points that have been made on the need for growth. All the problems that The hon. Member for Gainsborough (Mr Leigh) said have been identified as impeding growth in the UK that he did not want to see the public sector increase, economy overall are magnified in Northern Ireland. but such borrowing would not have to be for the public First, there is the heavy dependence on the public sector. Indeed, the hon. Member for Ochil and South sector, which means that public sector spending cuts Perthshire (Gordon Banks) mentioned VAT cuts for the have a greater impact. Secondly, there is the difficulty building industry. That would not increase the size of businesses have in obtaining finance from banks in an the public sector; it would stimulate the private sector economy that is heavily dependent upon failed Irish and grow the economy. banks and where penetration by UK mainland banks is not great. Of course, the problems in the eurozone have Mr Anderson: In reality, can the two sectors not work been magnified because we live next door to, and are together? My hon. Friend the Member for Bishop Auckland heavily dependent upon, an economy that has been (Helen Goodman) mentioned a classic example, Building greatly affected by what has happened in the eurozone Schools for the Future, for which we had money earmarked and the austerity measures that the Irish Government in our constituencies. In my constituency, there was have had to take. Indeed, many more such measures £80 million, and it would have gone not to the public were announced yesterday in the Irish budget. sector but to Gateshead council, which would have 225 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 226 passed it straight on to private sector builders to build sites where a couple of houses were started on the edge the schools that we need. Is that not the way we should but the rest of the estate was mothballed for a few years, be working our way out of this crisis? and getting those finished has to be a good thing. Small businesses have for a long time complained Sammy Wilson: That is exactly the point that I am that they cannot get funds out of the banks, and, trying to make. Borrowing does not necessarily have to although all our measures may have helped a little, they mean a bigger, bloated public sector; it can be directed certainly have not solved the problem, so the loan in many other ways that would meet the demands of guarantee scheme will I hope be a real step forward. even some Government Members. In Northern Ireland, Many businesses are struggling to decide whether investment tourism is a huge industry, and selective cuts in VAT is a great idea in the current climate, but as things start could stimulate spending there and help the Finance to improve the scheme will be in place and enable them Minister to realise the potential to increase tourist to secure the finance that they need. In the meantime, numbers by 3.5 million over the next two years, thereby every small business will welcome the extension of the generating private sector growth and helping us to business rate holiday for a few more months, but it rebalance the economy. keeps being extended, and at some stage it might be nice Things can be done and there is potential. The to extend it to a distant horizon so that we know where Government have more flexibility than they accept, and we are. if we are to deal with the social strain, the economic The worst impact of any economic downturn is on hardship and the impact on businesses we need to see unemployment, and especially on youth unemployment, examples of that flexibility in order to get back on to a and the £1 billion of funding that we announced to path to growth and back into a position where we can tackle that will be hugely welcome. As I visit businesses repay our debts. throughout my constituency, I see that some are taking real steps, at their own cost, to employ local young people. I pay tribute especially to David Nieper in 7.12 pm Alfreton, a fashion business that has started its own Nigel Mills (Amber Valley) (Con): It is a pleasure to fashion academy, taking students from nearby universities follow the hon. Member for East Antrim (Sammy Wilson). and showing them the entire industry—from designing Having recently joined the Northern Ireland Committee, clothes all the way through to marketing them, selling I am becoming more familiar with the issues that he them and producing brochures—in order to give them raises and, in particular, with Northern Ireland’s attempts that whole-industry experience so that they really are to show that one can compete on tax rates to grow one’s job-ready. economy. It has the right idea in wanting to match Ireland’s lower corporation tax rate in order to grow the Northern Ireland economy, but I sense that it will not Helen Goodman: I am pleased that the hon. Gentleman want to match Ireland’s new higher VAT rate in an congratulates David Nieper, because my sister works in attempt to grow the economy over there. That is aiming that factory. for the best of both worlds. I welcome the chance to contribute to this important Nigel Mills: Well, I am sure that she recognises how debate on what is the central issue for my constituents. I great an employer it is—and it is very kind of the hon. am sure that every Member who has spoken to constituents Lady to give me an extra minute! and businesses cannot have failed to notice how difficult economic conditions have become, and that is why I Many other businesses in my constituency have expressed welcome in particular the fact that the Chancellor, in his their concern about the impact of rising energy bills, autumn statement last week, did not try to hide the full especially given the Government’s climate change policies, extent of the difficulty, but set out exactly how difficult which increase those costs. In my constituency, I have things are now and will be for the next few years. another great business, Denby Pottery. I do not know whether the hon. Lady has family working there, too, The response was robust, and it should see us maintain but it has expressed a real concern that even the welcome the market’s confidence, which is the key to our recovery. help that we announced for energy-intensive industries I am not aware of any serious commentator who suggests last week will not assist the ceramics sector, so I urge the that we should change our plan, and borrow more and Government to keep working on those measures to spend more than we plan to, when we are running a protect such valuable and historic industries. deficit of more than £120 billion this year already. The shadow Chancellor chose earlier to quote Voltaire, and Another particularly welcome announcement for me I have found a second quotation for him: was the announcement of expenditure on infrastructure “Common sense is not so common.” and road building. New road construction in Amber Valley has been a little neglected, so I urge the Government Some of his speech showed eminently that that is true. to look favourably on the bid that I and Amber Valley I shall touch on the measures in the autumn statement borough council have championed for the new Ripley- that are relevant to my constituents and work through Codnor bypass, which would link the A38 and M1. We those issues that are raised most frequently. People— are not asking for the full funding, because the council especially first-time buyers—complain that they cannot is busy arranging it through developers that can pay for get mortgages or, if they can, that the deposit requirements up to half the bypass, but if the whole road were are too high or the cost is too high, so last week we completed it would present a real chance for regeneration announced measures to make it easier for first-time and a real chance to attract new business to the area, buyers to get mortgages and thus get the building which is exactly what the Government’s infrastructure industry started again. I can think of some building funding is trying to do. 227 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 228

[Nigel Mills] Why did we do that? Because the market demanded that we did it. It said that British coal was too expensive and I am happy with what the Government have announced. that we needed cheaper coal to deliver cheap power. The In a difficult situation, they have announced some Government’s response was, “That’s okay. It’s a price short-term measures to tackle the worst impacts of worth paying.” They were not paying it and their economic downturn. Now, we need to look at the constituents were not paying it; the people in my part of long-term strategy and at the measures we need in place the world were paying it. The outcome was that hundreds to make our economy as competitive as it can be in five and thousands of lives were decimated, local communities or 10 years’ time. withered and died, and support industries died off. In the final minute of my speech, I shall turn to the The truth remains that it is the less well-off, the poor, reform that we need in our tax system. As my hon. the frail, the poorly educated who lose the most, while Friend the Member for Chichester (Mr Tyrie), the those in charge—the ones to blame—get off scot-free. Chairman of the Treasury Committee suggested, many What else can we say when we face a situation where a tax regimes that affect our businesses are unduly complex quarter of our children will be living in poverty, record and out of date, discouraging investment while encouraging numbers of people are out of work, and those lucky strange and perverse behaviour, which is why we have to enough to retain a job face pay freezes, an unprecedented introduce a huge number of more complex anti-avoidance drop in living standards, and a real lack of security, rules, such as those announced today. while at the same time Barclays makes a £11.6 billion Wholesale simplification would ensure that we had a profit and pays only £113 million in corporation tax, system which encourages what we do want and make it and its poor chief executive is paid only a measly easier to stop the avoidance behaviour that we rightly quarter of a million pound salary but, luckily for him, it wish to tackle—and I think the Government are coming is topped up with a bonus of £6.5 million? round to that. Last week, they announced that 100% capital allowances will be made available to enterprise zones, Mr Bain: My hon. Friend is making a passionate and, to all those businesses in my constituency which argument, as ever. The Chancellor said earlier that the would like to invest in new machinery and need to do so only people who were calling for an alternative were, in to remain competitive, we should send the message that effect, communists. Does my hon. Friend share my we want to provide tax incentives for people to invest in sense of disgust at the Chancellor’s slurring the capital equipment at this time. If we need 100% capital democratically elected Government of Denmark, who allowances for enterprise zones, can we not find a way are engaged in a stimulus programme and have seen of being more generous with capital investment throughout their bond yields fall? the whole country, not just in those zones? Mr Anderson: I am very clear that the Chancellor is 7.19 pm trying to pretend that nobody else in the world wants Mr David Anderson (Blaydon) (Lab): Last week was what we want. The whole world is crying out for a the week when the bubble burst and the Conservatives change to a system that has let it down. had to accept what everybody else knew: that the Chancellor The people of this country—the nurses, the doctors, had got it wrong on growth, this year and next; on the care workers—are carrying the can for the failure of unemployment, up by half a million next year; on global capitalism. We now know that 98 of the top borrowing, going up to £158 billion; on children in 100 FTSE-listed companies are avoiding £20 billion-plus poverty, again set to rise; and on hitting women the of tax by putting their money into offshore tax havens. hardest. The House of Commons Library says that the effect of cuts to tax credits and attacking public sector pay will impact on 73% of the women involved. There is Lorely Burt (Solihull) (LD): I am very sympathetic to complete humiliation for the Chancellor and even more what the hon. Gentleman is saying about high pay and damage to our economy, but who carries the can for the tax evasion; we are trying to do all we can about that. failure of the system? The old, the young, the jobless, As regards stimulating the economy, what would he say the disabled and the women of this country. about the situation in America, where that stimulus has been tried and it is now £15 trillion in debt? As always, when capitalism fails, it is the most vulnerable who suffer. We should look back to the 1930s. Only a few weeks ago, young people marched to London in a Mr Anderson: I will come to what the hon. Lady’s sad echo of the crusades of those who left Jarrow party has had to say and pick up her point then. 75 years ago. Those brave souls in 1936 did not march It is little wonder that we are in a mess. We are told to London for the exercise—they did it because they that even in the City of London—the heart of capitalism— were starving, jobless, and desperate. Just like today, job vacancies have fallen by 16% in a single month. In they were turned away empty-handed and made to the past month alone, retail sales have dropped by carry the can for a mess they did not create. 1.7% despite huge pre-Christmas discounts. The Engineering We all know that history repeated itself in the 1980s, Employers Federation says that it expects a drop in its when the country was led in a series of recessions by a production from 2.2% to 0.9% next year. But do not neo-liberal Government who saw the deindustrialisation worry—the Deputy Prime Minister, the leader of the of this nation as a price worth paying. They destroyed hon. Lady’s party, tells us that he is going to crack down not only the coal mining and shipbuilding industries of on top corporate pay. Does that mean that he will do this country but the manufacturing industry that those what he and his friends in the Conservative party are industries helped to create and that was making leading, doing to public sector workers—to nurses, doctors, cutting-edge technology for the coal-mining industry. firefighters and policemen—by putting a two-year pay 229 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 230 freeze and a 1% cap on to private sector pay and the fat 30 years and look to develop an economic system that cats? Of course not. The Deputy Prime Minister tells ignores the markets and does right for the people of this us: country. “I don’t mean the government starts going around setting pay rates in the private sector...I believe that people should be well 7.28 pm paid if they succeed.” Eric Ollerenshaw (Lancaster and Fleetwood) (Con): Can he tell me where the nurses, the doctors, the firefighters, It is great to follow such passion from the north-east, the police, the home care workers, the child care workers, but I would say to the hon. Member for Blaydon and millions of others are failing? (Mr Anderson) that the problem is that my electorate remember 13 years when they were promised that there Jim McGovern (Dundee West) (Lab): As everyone is would be an end to boom and bust, and they are still aware, the Prime Minister referred to last week’s day of waiting for an answer from his party as to what went action as a “damp squib”. I think that it was anything wrong. but a damp squib. Does my hon. Friend agree that if the I want to make a few observations about what is coalition Government stay on the course they are on at happening in my constituency and generally in the the moment, there will be many more squibs and none north-west, and perhaps to have the temerity to suggest of them will be damp? something to the Treasury, but we will see how I get on with that. The key focus for my area is on growth and Mr Anderson: I certainly hope that there is no need how we get through this crisis. My electorate accept that for any more squibs, damp or otherwise. It was absolutely the deficit reduction programme is delivering low interest wrong that people felt forced to go on strike last week, rates for businesses, mortgage holders and many others, but they felt that they had no option because the and that is seen as a good thing. They also see what is Government were clearly not listening; I hope that they happening in other countries across the world and are now. recognise that this Government are delivering by keeping us out of the mess that there has been in Ireland and in All in this together? What a laugh! Has Bob Diamond Greece. really become 5,000% more successful than his predecessor was 30 years ago? Of course not, but his salary is Many hon. Members constantly see the kinds of 5,000% more than his predecessor’s was in the early businesses that I see in the north-west that have the 1980s. The people who are running our public services potential for growth and have the orders, but cannot are asking, “Where is the fairness?” At a time when manage to bridge the gap and buy the extra machine or other people are wandering around with massive pay the extra shed that they need to get things moving. That packets, they are losing their jobs by the bucketful. Last is why I, like my hon. Friend the Member for Amber week, in a throwaway line, the Chancellor dropped in Valley (Nigel Mills), am behind the Chancellor’s support the horribly disrespectful term, “headcount”, when he for infrastructure, the national loan guarantee scheme said that the headcount of job losses in the public sector of £20 billion and the business finance partnership. I would rise from 400,000 to 710,000. The headcount! was pleased that earlier in Treasury questions, the These are men and women, flesh and blood—people Chancellor said that he hopes to get that up and running with kids, with mortgages, with debt, and with holidays, in January. That will be vital for small businesses. cars and Christmas to pay for, and they face a future Sammy Wilson: The hon. Gentleman has given a list with no hope because this Government put the interests of reasons why businesses are not investing. Does he of the market before the interests of the people. It is also accept that one reason is that businesses lack economic madness driven by an ideology that does not confidence because they see an economic policy being care about the impact on real people. pursued that will not release the kind of growth that is Of course, the Conservatives will argue that this is all needed to sell the goods once they have made the necessary. Perhaps we could accept that if it was actually investment? working, but we see now that it is not. This year, in the north-east alone, 32,000 public sector jobs have gone, Eric Ollerenshaw: I am grateful for the intervention. I 1,080 of them at Gateshead council, with another was going to go on to say that some of these things are £38 million cuts to come next year. We will have more actually working. people on the dole, poorer service delivery and more One of the biggest employers in Lancaster, Northern hardship all round. It is the classic Tory remedy, and we Tissue Group, is halfway down the line of achieving have seen it all before. Mervyn King may well be right—this extra support from the regional growth fund. That will might be the worst crisis in our history—but, sadly, the lead to extra jobs. Oaktec, a small company that is Tories are using exactly the same old methods to get out developing innovative energy recovery from vehicles, of it. has just got a grant from the Technology Strategy As my hon. Friend the Member for Birmingham, Board to take that innovation further. Those are small Hall Green (Mr Godsiff) said, we need a real dialogue beginnings, but the innovation is there. that puts the needs of ordinary people first, and not the I want to suggest how we can develop that through demands of the market. We need to move away from the local enterprise partnerships and the new enterprise the appalling situation that we are in yet again, where zones that hon. Members have talked about. One problem bankers and people in the money markets are acting that my part of the north-west has had with all like the arsonist who burns your house down and then Governments is that every time they look at the north-west, comes back next week and offers to rebuild it for you they look at Greater Manchester or Merseyside. Although and charges you twice the price for doing it. This is a I welcome Lord Heseltine’s intervention, or should I say challenge to all parties in this country, including mine. re-intervention, in the north-south divide and his talk We need to go beyond the narrowness of the past of city hubs, which we are all behind, my part of the 231 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 232

[Eric Ollerenshaw] them, which could then be reinvested. I believe that it would cost the taxpayer less in the long run if we just let north-west also has businesses that have potential, as such zones happen. you will understand, Mr Deputy Speaker. With a bit of To use Lancaster as an example, I can think of two or extra investment, which I hope is coming following the three innovative businesses on campus that are struggling Chancellor’s announcements in the autumn statement, to find extra funds, but that had to start paying taxes those businesses could provide a good return. I have straight away. Just a little bit extra would allow them to cited two small examples—Northern Tissue and Oaktec— move. By the nature of a university campus, the businesses but there are many other possibilities in the area. will not be there for ever. By definition, they will have to My area also has two universities, Lancaster university move on and there will be a swifter turnover. and the university of Cumbria, and Lancaster university To put it simply, let 100 university zones bloom. The does a great deal in terms of innovation. My suggestion hon. Member for Blaydon is not in his place, but he draws on two developments that we already have. The would have liked that phrase. There is potential for first is technology innovation centres, which are planned growth and for new jobs. This could apply to most for Warwick, Strathclyde, Bristol, Rotherham and universities. It would be a simple thing to do, provided Sedgefield. In 13 years, the Labour Government delivered that we could get it through the Treasury mandarin. none of them. At least we are now getting five. Germany has 59 of them. Their mission is to bridge “the gap between research findings and outputs, and their development 7.36 pm into commercial propositions”. Mr Tom Clarke (Coatbridge, Chryston and Bellshill) The second development is enterprise zones, the mission (Lab): I have listened to this debate with interest. My of which is experience is that the problems that my constituents “to support genuinely additional growth and create new businesses bring forward for me to deal with are a reliable barometer and new jobs”. of what is happening in our economy. At present my The original concept envisaged only one zone per local constituents are getting it tough—very tough. They are enterprise partnership. Perhaps that idea was developed not alone. Earlier this month, The Guardian reported by some Treasury mandarin who had to calculate the that half a million people will be forced off incapacity hypothetical loss in taxes due to the hypothetical creation benefit. Additionally, child poverty, youth unemployment of the new businesses and jobs. As they will be new, I and fuel poverty have increased and are set to rise am yet to understand how they can calculate that. further. At the same time, fuel and food prices are rising Obviously, I am just a simpleton when it comes to the to unprecedented levels. Treasury. In a nutshell, my suggestion is that we should allow Angela Smith: I wonder whether my right hon. Friend all universities to bid to designate mini-enterprise zones feels insulted that, given the seriousness of the debate, on their campuses. Perhaps not all universities would no Minister could be present on the Front Bench. take that up, but it might fulfil the other Government objective of ensuring that there are more direct outcomes Mr Clarke: The Chancellor likes to hear himself, but for the economy from universities. It seems to me that I do not see him often when others are speaking. there is nothing in the practical definition of an enterprise We are entitled to be extremely worried given that zone that most universities cannot fulfil. over the past three months unemployment has reached I suggest that there would be savings to the taxpayer, its highest level in 17 years. There are now more women because universities would not need all the investment unemployed than at any time since 1988. All of this is a that is required for the planned enterprise zones. By consequence of this Government’s austerity measures—and their nature, the zones would be incubators for new what improvement has there been as a result of the start-ups that would eventually have to move off campus hardship? on reaching a certain size. A mini-enterprise zone on a university campus would therefore create a quicker Mr Bain: My right hon. Friend has been a champion turnover than the planned enterprise zones. The hypothetical of equality since being elected to this House in 1982. I loss in taxes calculated by the Treasury mandarin would wonder whether he has had an opportunity to consider therefore be far less, because once a business on a the report issued by the Institute for Fiscal Studies this campus got to a certain size, it would feel restricted and morning, which says that one of the biggest drivers of would have to move off quicker than those in the the lift in household incomes has been female employment. planned enterprise zones. How does he believe the cuts announced by the Chancellor in the Budget and the autumn statement will contribute Matthew Hancock: I am interested by my hon. Friend’s to living standards? proposal. Does he recognise that it is similar in structure to what happened at Stanford in the United States from Mr Clarke: My hon. Friend, as usual, makes an the 1960s onwards, where the cheap start-up costs for interesting and relevant point. I hope to return to it IT firms led to the creation of Google and many other later if time allows. world-beating companies? The Office for Budget Responsibility has forecast that growth will now be lower this year, and for every Eric Ollerenshaw: I thank my hon. Friend for that year until 2014. Unemployment will rise next year and intervention. My suggestion is a hybrid scheme for be higher than previously forecast in every year until which universities could bid. As part of a technology 2015. Consequently, Government borrowing, which we strategy, the universities could make some money out of have heard so much about, is set to be £158 billion the start-up companies through joint ventures with higher than was planned a year ago. 233 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 234

The coalition Government’s economic policy is simply Mr Clarke: My hon. Friend makes an excellent point, not working. When Labour left office, the economy was with which I agree. growing. In the past 12 months, only Greece, Portugal When it was promised that the coalition Government and Cyprus have grown more slowly than Britain. That would protect the most vulnerable from the impact of is not just because of the eurozone crisis. The British spending cuts, what part of that commitment did the recovery was choked off more than a year ago. In the Chancellor not understand? Instead, the situation of 12 months since the Government’s spending review those individuals will only worsen as the Government the UK economy has grown, but by a mere 0.5%, while announce yet more and more cuts to make up for a lack the EU has grown by an average of 1.4%. Their policy of growth. It does not have to be that way. It should not has starved us of growth. and need not. The Government could change course Britain needs sensible public sector projects that will and adopt Labour’s plans for jobs, to seek to grow the stimulate our economy, so that it is less dependent on a United Kingdom and take us out of debt. Our people downward spiral of destructive cuts. Instead, the OBR deserve no less. forecasts more than 700,000 public sector job losses as a result of Government measures, and for anyone who remains, a ceiling of 1% is being put on pay rises for the 7.44 pm two years following the spending review period. John Stevenson (Carlisle) (Con): It is a pleasure to Youth unemployment has exceeded the 1 million have the opportunity to participate in the debate. I mark, and long-term unemployment among 18 to 24-year- appreciate that it is primarily concerned with the state olds is up by a shocking 83% since the start of 2011. of the economy at present, and I accept the reality that What do the Government do in the face of that crisis? the economy is likely to dominate our debate and They scrap the future jobs fund and introduce three-year politics for the next few years as we concentrate on work placement subsidies, which will mean just over improving it and trying to achieve some growth. However, 53,000 funded jobs—a far smaller number than the as this is a general debate I thought I would take a 105,000 starts provided by the future jobs fund between slightly different approach. In the short time that I have, October 2009 and March 2011. Those new placements I wish to consider what sort of economy I would like to are not even guaranteed. No wonder our young people see in the next five or 10 years, and what sort of feel cheated by society. That message certainly comes economy we should aspire to. over to me in my constituency. Members of all parties want a rich and growing If we are not careful there will again be a lost generation economy that provides quality public services and well-paid of young people—just as there was in the ’80s, jobs. That is clearly our ultimate goal. We therefore Mrs Thatcher’s time—which will lead to broken homes, need to consider matters such as: the balance between broken relationships, dashed hopes and broken dreams. the public and private sector; what level of taxes we I would not for one second condone the riots that took should have and what those taxes should be; how much place in England earlier this year, particularly as I am regulation there should be and what we should be asking the House to reflect on what youth unemployment regulating; what industries the Government should support actually means. Indeed, I am pleased that they did not and encourage; what the relationship should be between extend to Scotland. However, it would be naive in the central and local government on economic policy; and extreme to think that we can continue with the figures what policies on education, training and the like will and statistics that are a reality in Scotland and not best support a growing economy. Those are all very big expect young people to articulate their views. issues in their own right, but I shall concentrate on three We were first warned about these matters as long ago general themes. as during the war, when Sir William Beveridge wrote: My first theme is the public sector. The critical starting “If full employment is not won and kept, no liberties are point for me is that government, whether it be national secure, for to many they will not seem worth while.” or local, can and should be a vehicle for good. However, So what about the poor and people with disabilities? the danger of government being a hindrance is all too Since 2010 jobseeker’s allowance claimants have risen in obvious. It can become too big, acquire too much debt the most deprived areas of my constituency—I underline and an oversize deficit that crowds out wealth-creating the word “deprived”—from 26.3% to 28.1%, against a sectors, and introduce too much regulation, strangling UK average of 3.9%. We are asking what the Government’s any innovation. Probably worst of all, officialdom and response will be, because that is a real problem. Additionally, bureaucracy can become all-powerful and interfering. Mencap has found that one in two families with a That has happened to some extent over the past few disabled child live in poverty. The Chancellor is playing years, and it is this Government’s job to try to reverse it. with the lives of those people. As they teeter on the It is vital that over the next few years, we start to breadline, tax credits are being cut, Sure Start centres rebalance things. I accept that the state has an important are closing at an alarming rate and the number of role to play, but it should be smaller and more efficient. people able to claim disability benefit is being cut. Government should not try to do everything, it should try to do some things extremely well, particularly the Jim McGovern: My right hon. Friend may be aware things that the private sector cannot do. The state sector that last Friday, a Spanish wind turbine company called needs to raise its productivity levels, and we must always Gamesa abandoned its plans to locate in Dundee, my remember that it is not always about the amount of home city. It is a devastating blow for Dundee and money that is spent, it is also about how we spend it. We means that a prospective 1,800 jobs will not be created. need to create a competitive environment within the Does he agree that the UK Government and the Chancellor public sector wherever possible, and most importantly should work more closely with the devolved Administrations of all we need to encourage clear leadership and quality to ensure inward investment throughout the UK? management, to maximise freedoms in the public sector 235 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 236

[John Stevenson] particular about the era of the politics of less. All of us must look to achieve our political and economic aims in so that leaders and managers can perform their jobs to an era of lower growth than we have been used to in the best of their ability and as efficiently as possible. recent years. Those overriding concepts can lead to a much more The central feature of the autumn statement last productive and effective public sector providing better week was the further downgrading of economic forecasts services for the people of this country. for the short term. The Office for Budget Responsibility We also have the wealth-creating sector, which much downgraded its growth forecast for this year from 2.6% to also be a vehicle for good, creating jobs and wealth for 0.9% and for next year from 2.8% to 0.7%, and said that our country. Our goal should be to create an environment by 2015 the economy will be 3.5% or £65 billion smaller in which the private sector can flourish, with a sensible than previously forecast. The Financial Times has estimated tax regime and an appropriate regulatory regime. We that the gap between the economic growth trajectory need consistent Government policy so that business can had the recession not happened and where we will be in plan for the future, and we need to ensure that the a few years’ time is 14% of GDP. We are therefore Government’s finances are stable. That should be their entering an era in which our economy is smaller—and aim. by some projections significantly so—than it would We need a balanced economy, but at the same time otherwise be. Recovery will be weaker than expected, we must recognise that we have certain strengths as a unemployment will be higher and the economy will be country, for instance our financial sector, and should smaller for some years to come. play to those strengths where appropriate. The key is to ensure that we have a competitive environment and a Mr Denis MacShane (Rotherham) (Lab): Is my right skilled and educated work force. Wherever possible, we hon. Friend aware that between 1997 and 2010 the need to ensure that barriers to entry are kept to a British economy grew by 75%—in other words, that it minimum. The prime example is the banking sector, in almost doubled? It has now come to a shuddering stop which organisations are too few and too big. Indeed, we and is going into reverse. Can he think of any previous could go on and criticise the accountancy world, in historical period in the past 200 years, and not only in which we have four very large firms. Are they also too the 1970s, when a Conservative Government presided big and too few? There is work to be done over the next over such an astonishing, shrinking, no-growth economy? few years in helping our economy rebalance, creating the right environment for business to grow and ensuring Mr McFadden: I agree with my right hon. Friend that that we have a skilled and educated work force and a the economic times that we are in should make us competitive market for businesses to compete in. reassess what we think of as normal. The final key area on which I wish to reflect is how The human implications have been laid out by the Britain made its fortune in the past, which was through Institute for Fiscal Studies in its analysis of the impact trade. We are a trading nation and a very open economy, on households. As was mentioned earlier in the debate, but we appear not to have performed as well as we the IFS has shown that the distributional impact of the should. We have a deficit of £100 billion in the trade in measures is geared so that the greatest losses come in goods, so there is clearly a problem. Some 50% of our the lowest-income deciles, and that there are particularly trade is with Europe, and our main trading partner is harsh effects on families with children. The shadow Ireland. What about the BRIC countries—Brazil, Russia, Chancellor in his opening speech referred to the impact India and China? Ten years ago they represented 8% of of the tax credit measures on individual constituencies. the world’s GDP. It is now 20%, yet we have only The most striking figure for me is that the IFS forecasts £2 billion-worth of trade with Brazil. that between 2009-10 and 2012-13 there will be a 7.4% fall in real median net household income, which is about the Charlie Elphicke: Does my hon. Friend agree that a same as the largest fall since records began. key Government priority should be to boost trade with BRIC countries so that we can diversify our economic base internationally? Angela Smith: In the context of what my right hon. Friend says, can it be fair that while £1.2 billion in tax credits for low-income families is taken away, only John Stevenson: I completely agree. Growth is not in £300 million extra will be required from the bankers? Europe but elsewhere in the world, and we should try to increase our trade with the BRIC countries. We need to look at those new markets and rediscover our trading Mr McFadden: Anyone who looks at the IFS instincts. distributional charts would certainly not judge the impact of the Government’s measures as fair. I accept that our concern is primarily the state of the economy here and now and in the next 12 months. The background, therefore, is less disposable income, However, we need to remember to raise our eyes above weaker growth, more unemployment and more borrowing. the horizon and think about what kind of economy we Against that, it is little wonder that there is such low aspire to in five or 10 years’ time, and how we will confidence among families and businesses alike. create it. The question, therefore, is what to do to promote the economic growth that we so urgently need to create 7.50 pm jobs. The Chancellor set out a number of measures in the autumn statement—more lending to small businesses, Mr Pat McFadden (Wolverhampton South East) (Lab): more spending on infrastructure and so on—to try to I shall use the time available to make a couple of points boost growth. Some of those individual measures are about the economic challenge facing the country, and in perfectly sensible and should be welcomed. Of course 237 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 238 small businesses want more lending, and more capital continue on a downward path for some years, and if spending will create jobs, but the real question is whether households face the kind of squeeze in their incomes set those measures will contribute to economic growth. out by the IFS, the circumstances demand an industry The OBR has already given its verdict. Paragraph 1.14 policy on a scale and ambition way beyond what we saw of its report states: in the autumn statement last week. They demand a resolve from the Government, industry and all levels of “We have not made any material adjustments to our economy forecast on the basis of these policy announcements”, education to make the rebalancing that we talk about happen, and to put weight behind those areas where meaning the ones in the autumn statement. Its verdict is Britain can succeed. The situation demands more than that however worthy the individual measures are, they a regional growth fund at half the level of spending of will not make a material difference to the overall picture. the regional development agencies; more than a tiny Therefore, if growth will not come from consumer fraction of the ¤5 billion-a-year relief for energy-intensive spending because the consumer is being squeezed in the industries that is available in Germany; and tax policies way that the IFS has set out, and if it cannot come from that support the rebalancing effort rather than pull in Government expenditure because that is contracting, it the opposite direction. must come from trade and investment. The Government should ask what more they can do 7.59 pm to encourage business to invest. My contention is that that is not a matter of putting one or two measures Matthew Hancock (West Suffolk) (Con): I shall continue suggested by business lobby groups into such statements. directly from what was said by the right hon. Member Rather, it is a matter of making a sea change in our for Wolverhampton South East (Mr McFadden). Our thinking of how we get growth in these economic times. country faces very difficult economic times, as does the I shall focus on one particular issue on which I have continent of Europe. In recovering from a debt crisis spoken before in the House. Although industry welcomes throughout the west, we face difficult challenges. I the change announced on R and D tax credits, there is listened with great interest to the right hon. Gentleman’s real concern about why the Chancellor is pressing ahead speech. It closely followed the line of argument that was with his plan for a £3 billion-a-year hit on manufacturing put forward by the right hon. Member for South Shields industry through his cuts to capital allowances. It is not (David Miliband) in a speech last week. The right hon. enough to argue for enhanced capital allowances in Member for Wolverhampton South East recognised the enterprise zones when manufacturing in the economy as scale of the problem and the need to deal with the a whole is putting up with that £3 billion tax hit. How deficit. Some of his suggestions were sensible; others I does it help us to generate a low-carbon economy if the would not follow so closely. None the less, he was Government make investment in the equipment and engaged in the economic argument. People across the machinery that will get us there more expensive through country want to see politicians engaging directly in the their tax policy? Even the excuse that that is a necessary economic argument about how we deal with the problem deficit-reduction measure is not available, because the that exists now. I am not talking about the forecast that money is not being used to reduce the deficit; it is being was set out before the credit crunch in 2007 and before recycled in a give-away to businesses in those sectors of the last election. Incomes are 14% smaller than anticipated, the economy that do not invest, including the very which is a serious problem. Most of the blame rests banks that will not lend to manufacturing businesses in with the previous Administration, so it is absurd to the first place. make party point-scoring interventions on this particular issue. This is an important argument with which to If we really want to rebalance the economy, our engage, which is why I am so disappointed by the manufacturing tax stance should recognise the shortened arguments that were put forward by the shadow Chancellor lifespan of machinery, help businesses to invest, and and the Labour party; they completely failed to engage ensure that British companies have an incentive to in the seriousness of the economic debate. invest and that they are not hindered in their efforts to keep ahead of the game. That is made more urgent by I should like to tackle three issues that show just how the sharp downgrading last week of the forecast for much the Opposition arguments miss the point. I will growth over the next couple of years. That shows that not dwell on the fact that the Opposition seem to the Government need to be more, not less, ambitious in believe that borrowing is in and of itself a good thing their plans to promote trade and investment. and I will not set out any further than has been set out already the chaos of their euro policy—a policy that We have twice heard Government plans that have was changed from the Dispatch Box in response to an been billed as plans for growth, yet at each economic intervention. However, I will set out the complete failure statement, growth has fallen, and it is projected to fall of the Opposition on three specific points. further. If we should have learned one thing in the past three or four years, it is that assumptions of snapping Karl Turner: (Kingston upon Hull East) (Lab): Before back to so-called normal trend rates of growth have the hon. Gentleman moves on to his next point, will he been consistently over-optimistic. These are not normal accept that economic growth was choked off well before economic times. The downturn has been longer lasting the eurozone crisis? Government Members were being than we feared and hopeful projections of future growth warned about the situation by many people. They were have a habit of retreating into the middle distance. even warned by me, and I have very little knowledge of My contention, therefore, is that the era of the politics the economy. of less poses challenges for us all—Government and Opposition. How do we secure economic efficiency and Matthew Hancock: I certainly accept that growth and social justice in an era of lower growth and squeezed the protection of the economy will be difficult because household incomes? If the Government’s spending is to we are escaping from a debt crisis in which we had the 239 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 240

[Matthew Hancock] Matthew Hancock: Keynes himself argued that we need to save in the good times or, as JFK on the left put biggest boom and the biggest bust. Certainly there are it, we need to fix the roof when the sun is shining. That some very important domestic causes of our problems. argument has no foundation in economic theory or The massive boom was funded by borrowing—both by experience. I have a second argument that I want to the Government and in the banking sector. I also accept challenge. It was put this morning by the shadow Chancellor that inflation, and especially commodity price inflation, in The Times. He said: has had a negative impact on the economy as set out by “The argument is whether it is better to be borrowing billions the OBR. Moreover, the Greek crisis broke in the more… or whether action now to get our economy moving will weekend after Labour had lost the election, but before get more people into work paying tax and help to get the deficit the coalition was formed. The then Chancellor set out down in a fairer way.” that Britain should participate in bail-outs, a position I could not agree with him more. It is better to be taking from which this Government have extricated themselves. action now to get our economy moving rather than The euro crisis certainly has had an impact and it broke borrowing billions more, which is the policy of the in May 2010. Labour party. Their position, therefore, is illogical. Their My first specific point is that I have not yet had an argument is that borrowing is going up. However, the answer to a question that I have been posing on TV, on shadow Chancellor was forced to admit after an intervention the radio and in this House, which is how can spending that borrowing is falling; it is lower this year than last more money lead to lower borrowing? year and it was lower last year than the year before under Labour. It is falling in the OBR’s forecast every Sheila Gilmore rose— year. Labour members may smile, but when their argument is inconsistent with the truth, they know that they are Matthew Hancock: Let me set out my point and then on weak territory. I will take the intervention. The conditions under which My final argument concerns the idea that low interest that can be true are highly specific so as to be utterly rates are a bad idea. The shadow Chancellor holds both extraordinary. The Lafferites on the right argue that in that borrowing is good and that higher interest rates the case of very high marginal personal taxation rates, would be better because he has said that low interest they can pay for themselves if they are cut, but there is rates “are a failure”. I put it to all Members in this little evidence of that. Margaret Thatcher said that the House to ask their mortgage-holding constituents and problem with the Laffer curve is that one does not know their small businesses whether that is the case. The only where one is on it. conclusion I can come to is that the reason they hold The idea that spending can lead to a Lafferite this position is purely political so that they can oppose consequence—that borrowing is lower because of more the cuts. spending—has absolutely no force in economic evidence or logic. 8.8 pm Sheila Gilmore: It has more force in economic theory. That was precisely the point that was made during the Angela Smith (Penistone and Stocksbridge) (Lab): 1930s and subsequently by Keynes. It was said that the Follow that, as they say. time one should be borrowing is during a recession. We There is no doubt that the economic news of the past should borrow to build houses, create construction jobs few weeks has been appalling. In last Tuesday’s autumn and to keep people in work and not, as this Government statement, the Chancellor finally admitted what the are doing, to keep people out of work. shadow Chancellor and many economists had been telling him for months—that the massive gamble that Matthew Hancock: I will come on to that point a little he took in June 2010 has failed. later. That is the argument that is put. The question that Last week, the Chancellor announced not plan B but has to be answered is how can the extra tax that the plan A-plus. Over this Parliament, the Government will Government get from employing people exceed the cost now have to borrow £158 billion more than they said of employment when it is the Government who are just 18 months ago. That is despite the pain of cuts paying the tax? It does not make sense. worth £40 billion imposed on the economy and tax rises imposed on ordinary families up and down the country. Sheila Gilmore rose—

Matthew Hancock: No, I will make the point in Mr Bain: Is my hon. Friend aware of the figures from another way. If a person borrows money to employ the OBR which indicate the scale of the Chancellor’s somebody and then claims that they will get back more disaster? There has been £15 billion less in tax revenues than the cost of employing that person through tax and coming into the Treasury. Does that not explain the lower unemployment benefits, the Government would scale of his under-achievement on growth? have to pay more to themselves in tax than they spend in tax. That cannot be true in logic let alone in economics. Angela Smith: It absolutely does explain the scale of it. Let us make real life sense out of some of these Angie Bray (Ealing Central and Acton) (Con): Is the figures. They mean that 700,000 public servants had to point not being missed by the hon. Member for Edinburgh be cast aside, 300,000 more than the Chancellor said East (Sheila Gilmore)? On this Keynesian argument, a would lose their jobs just a few months ago. Some person would have had to be saving during the good £1.2 billion has been taken off tax credits while bankers times, and that is what was missing from the programme suffer a mere £300 million increase in the take from of expenditure of the Labour party. their pay packets by the Treasury. 241 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 242

Any pretence of fairness and of our all being in this to work before another generation has to pay the same together went out the window last Tuesday. Ordinary price as mine for an ideologically driven Government families are taking a massive hit: already more people who refuse to learn the lessons of history. are unemployed than at any time since 1994—the current In particular, we need as a starting point Labour’s figure is 2.6 million—and to make matters worse the five-point plan, which would reverse the damaging rise number of people out of work for more than a year is in VAT temporarily and give a one-year national insurance 868,000, with the long-term rate for 16 to 24-year-olds tax break for every small firm that takes on extra standing at a staggering 30%. workers. And crucially, it would bring forward long-term investment projects for schools, roads and transport to Mr McFadden: My hon. Friend refers to the cuts in get people back to work. What we do not need is what tax credits in the autumn statement. Since they entered has been recently proposed: a shopping list of projects office, the Government have made great play of increasing here and there paid for by redistributed money. Instead, the incentive to work. How does she think that the we need a rigorous, strategically driven investment regime incentive to work will be affected by cutting tax credits designed to drive long-term economic growth. for low-income families? In the medium and long term, we need a better Angela Smith: It can only have a regressive impact economic way forward. On that point, I echo the points because it will mean that families are less able to provide made by my hon. Friends. The Thatcher-Reagan consensus for their children and to develop the aspirations that are is crumbling before our eyes. Will Hutton put it even so important in later life. more starkly in a recent article when he said that One in three young people have been unemployed for “we are about to experience economic, social and political tectonic plates on the move”. more than one year and youth unemployment stands at a staggering 1 million, with the figure for those not in We desperately need to develop an alternative economic education, employment or training standing at a terrifying paradigm, which means changing the way our capitalist 1.2 million. The Government are creating another lost structures work. We need to go back to making things generation similar to the one that they created in the 1980s. and to give manufacturing a much bigger role in our Clearly, the Chancellor’s policies are hurting the British economy. We need a capitalism that looks to the long people, but they are certainly not working. The young term, not just to short-term profits, and we need a in particular are paying a high price for his failures. society where reward and risk are shared and where it is understood that the state has a role to play in pioneering There is worse to come as the OBR now states that, at and driving strategic investment. And we need to invest best, the British economy is set to stagnate next year in innovation and the year after, with growth broadly remaining flat. Even worse, if the well-respect OECD is correct, the The Government’s strategy of cutting and hoping economy will dip again into recession early next year. that growth will magically reappear is not working now The British economy has been stagnating for the past and did not work in the past. The Government are 15 years, and the growth and jobs crisis has its roots bankrupt of ideas for our future and lack the imagination firmly planted at No. 10 and No. 11 Downing street. and the bravery needed to take our country forward to Real incomes are being squeezed like never before, with its next phase. These extraordinary days require high inflation and rocketing fuel bills not helped by the extraordinary solutions, but the fear is that it could Government’s decision to increase VAT in January. soon be too late for many millions of British families Last week’s statement gave hard-pressed families two who are paying the price for this out-of-touch, ideologically more years of austerity, with real median incomes set to driven Government who seem determined to follow fall by 7.8% according to the Institute for Fiscal Studies. their chosen course no matter what damage it does to That means that real median household incomes will be the British economy and to families in this country. no higher in 2015-16 than they were in 2003-03 and that we will have suffered the longest period of austerity since the second world war. 8.16 pm The Government inherited an economy that was Richard Fuller (Bedford) (Con): I listened with great fragile but nevertheless in growth, yet they gambled that interest to the comments of the hon. Member for Penistone recovery on the basis of tired ideas that have been tried and Stocksbridge (Angela Smith), who spoke eloquently before and found wanting. The right-wing prescription about the short-term pain that many families in her failed in the ’30s and is failing again now, with the constituency and, I am sure, in mine are going through consequence that the economy could dive into a double-dip in these difficult economic circumstances. She also rightly recession. The level of unemployment in Yorkshire is pointed to the need for the Government to think about almost twice what it is in the south-east and is growing the long term. I hope that she will listen to my observations at twice the rate. It is entirely possible that Yorkshire is in the same spirit. already in recession. Under the previous Government, the United Kingdom The autumn statement did not announce any new became the most indebted major economy on earth. resources to be injected into the economy—all it announced That was not the fault of the bankers alone, of Government was a moving around of the money. It will be families borrowing alone or of companies alone; it was the fault with children who will pay for the back to the future of us all, although led by a Government who were at jobs fund—the youth contract—through the £1 billion best asleep at the wheel and at worst systematically cut to the child element of family tax credits. If this undermining our long-term finances for short-term political country is not to face a lost decade, or even worse, we gain. These problems are so endemic that they cannot need a strategy for growth, and we need it now. The possibly be put right in one year, in one term or by one stakes are high and we urgently need to get people back policy. 243 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 244

[Richard Fuller] As a Government we need to look at building more houses and regulating mortgage lending to maintain The absolute core policy that a massively indebted sustainable norms. We need to look—as we are—at nation must pursue is the maintenance of low interest simplifying planning controls and removing obstacles rates for as long as possible. The McKinsey Global standing in the way of house building. At some stage we Institute study on debt and deleveraging shows that the also need to analyse the impact of the reintroduction of UK left the pack of the world’s largest economies in mortgage interest tax relief, should interest rates rise terms of its debt-to-GDP ratio and became increasingly precipitously. more indebted from the mid-’90s and, in particular, from 2003. From 2000 to 2010, domestic, public and private Matthew Hancock: Should we not also consider debt as a percentage of our GDP rose by 182 percentage regulating the overall debt in the economy, as was done points to nearly 500% of GDP, making the UK the until 1997, but then stopped? most indebted of all major economies—even more so than Japan at the end of the period. Richard Fuller: My hon. Friend makes a good point; indeed, that is also an idea that we should consider. Mr MacShane: In the 1930s, interest rates were close The other thing that we are leaving the next generation to zero, as they were in Japan in the 1990s. Arguably, that we need to consider is our pensions liabilities and that increases indebtedness because if people can borrow how to resolve them. The happily titled “Project massively without having to pay serious interest rates, Armageddon” report from Tullet Prebon shows that the they might run up debts. I am just gently saying that the public sector pensions liability is £1.18 trillion, which is idea that one factor can explain the problem and that almost the same as the published, or “treaty”, Government we should focus on that is wrong. We need a holistic debt of £1.11 trillion. I do not particularly want to approach. dwell on public sector pensions, but this raises in my mind the way in which we have structured our pensions Richard Fuller: The right hon. Gentleman makes a liabilities—that is, the pay-as-you-go nature of the basic helpful point. It is precisely my point, although pension scheme—such that we expect the next generation unfortunately the shadow Chancellor missed it when he to pay for them rather than paying ourselves. Given that seemed to think that the responsibility of the Government this generation will pass on such significant debts to the towards debt management was to do with Government next generation in other ways, I have been considering debt alone. It is not. The responsibility of the Government various ways to change how we fund our pensions in is to look at the whole economy. The debt of a nation, this period. whether taken on by the Government, households or companies, has to be repaid by the nation. That is what In 2006 the Australian Government established the got so out of control over the past 10 years. future fund, with 18 billion Australian dollars of seed capital. The goal was to invest in long-term infrastructure Mr Adrian Bailey (West Bromwich West) (Lab/Co-op): projects with a commercial return in order fully to fund I assume that in his figures for debt, the hon. Gentleman the pension liability of public servants—that is, to move is talking about secured debt as well as unsecured debt. from a pay-as-you-go approach to an essentially self-funding Did he read the article in the Financial Times about system for public sector pensions. In the autumn statement three weeks ago demonstrating that the level of unsecured my right hon. Friend the Chancellor talked about £21 billion debt under the Labour Government actually lagged of credit easing, which he will put through the banks via behind economic growth, which means that our boom the national loan guarantee scheme. Let me suggest to was not led by unsustainable borrowing? the Minister that instead of putting that £21 billion of credit easing through the banks, perhaps we should Richard Fuller: I thank the hon. Gentleman for his create a UK version of the Australian future fund, intervention. He makes one correct point but draws a essentially moving a portion of our pensions liability false conclusion. It may well be true that unsecured debt into what might be termed a hypothecated fund for that did not rise as rapidly as secured household debt under purpose. That is one thing that the Government could the last, Labour Government, but it is absolutely not do that would significantly benefit the future generations true that the last, Labour Government did not preside that will have to pay off the debts racked up over the over one of the most massive increases in debt of any past 15 years. nation on earth. Let me make two observations about job creation. In response to the right hon. Member for Rotherham There is nothing worse than people not having work to (Mr MacShane), let me make four points. The first is do when they are seeking it—both sides of the House about the potentially crushing impact of household think that is true. I am very pleased that the Chancellor mortgage debt. Let us compare a household deciding has said that he will ask the independent pay review whether to purchase a house with a mortgage in 1997 bodies to consider how public sector pay can be made with one making that decision in 2007, looking at the more responsive to local labour markets. That would be loan-to-value ratio and average house prices in those a far more effective way of addressing wage-price rigidities two periods, and ask how much money the average than calls to scrap the minimum wage or other such household will lose over the next 25 years because measures. It is an issue—I listened to a speech by an house prices were allowed to rise so much. The answer Opposition Member about this earlier—that in certain is that the average household will have £250,000 less to parts in the north of our country, the public sector spend—it will be a quarter of a million pounds worse premium over private sector pay is 20%, whereas in off—in the next 25 years precisely because the last, other parts it is much lower, at 4%. In those areas the Labour Government thought that they were creating private sector should not be priced out of the market wealth by making average house prices escalate way out getting people to work for it because public sector pay is of the range of the average family. set significantly higher. 245 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 246

In closing, let me also gently suggest to the Minister regional growth fund, which is a poor alternative to the that, with national insurance contributions at 13.8%, we regional development agencies, and the youth jobs measures. have a significant tax on jobs. As we look to implement These are basically repackaged measures, which the our policy to take the lowest paid out of tax, may I ask Chancellor claimed when Labour delivered them were him perhaps to consider the national insurance tax on one reason why we had this record deficit. jobs too? The problem is that the Chancellor is funding these measures out of cuts in current expenditure. We have 8.25 pm long-term infrastructure projects, which do not have a short pay-off period; we have credit easing, which is Mr Adrian Bailey (West Bromwich West) (Lab/Co-op): borrowing by another name, and neither bankers nor I will resist the temptation to answer the points made by businesses know how it will work—it will not work the previous speaker, the hon. Member for Bedford unless people feel they can sell the products that come (Richard Fuller). from the extra investment; and we have RGF funding, The autumn statement last week was the most astonishing which is glacial in its progress in tackling unemployment. litany of failure. The shadow Chancellor described the I have asked the Minister several times how many jobs Chancellor’s view as Panglossian; I myself thought it have been created nearly a year after its first implementation, was more like something from “Alice in Wonderland”. I but he cannot even give me a figure. just cannot see how the situation that the Chancellor What we have at this moment is a set of long-term inherited 18 months ago—a growing economy, and supply-side projects, which are not in themselves bad—I inflation, unemployment and our debt dropping—was would support them—but they are funded out of short-term so bad that it had to be destroyed and a set of policies current expenditure at a time when we have the worst put in place that have done the reverse. Now the Chancellor possible squeeze on personal expenditure. The real danger stands there and says, “This is what is needed. This is is that our capacity to grow in the future will be impaired what the rest of the world admires and praises us for.” by the present squeeze because many companies will Quite frankly, that bears no resemblance to reality either shed skilled workers in the meantime or will go whatever. I cast my mind back to 1997, when the former under. When we get into a position to grow out, we will Prime Minister, then the Chancellor, resisted the temptation not have the capacity to do so. The Office for Budget when he came into power to overturn everything that Responsibility has drawn attention to that very point. the previous Government had done. He kept within the previous Government’s public spending limits for two 8.31 pm years, laying the fiscal foundation for 10 years of prosperity. Perhaps the current Chancellor should eat humble pie Charlie Elphicke (Dover) (Con): I am pleased to be and look at his example. the first to welcome you to the Chair, Madam Deputy Speaker. I want to make a few remarks about economic When the Chancellor announced his policies, I tried impacts on the households and families that find it the to pick from them the rationale for why they might hardest to make ends meet. Some call them the strivers; work. As far as I could see, they were predicated on two some call them hard-pressed families; I have even heard assumptions. The first was that we would export our them talked about as alarm-clock Britons. Many families way out of trouble, the second that we would invest with children find it very hard to make ends meet, so it domestically to grow the private sector so that it could is worth underlining the strong action that the Government take the unemployment arising from the public sector. have taken to help people in that position. He did not really take into account the fact that in many regions the private sector is dependent on the public First and most important of all is keeping interest sector; indeed, the main thrust behind the surge in our rates low. I noted with interest the intervention of the manufacturing exports was because of the weaker pound shadow Chancellor on the Chancellor to point out, and the sustained high demand in Europe. At the same “Well, there is a liquidity trap; interest rates are too low; time, he failed to co-ordinate the rest of the departmental it is a bad sign; we need higher interest rates.” I think policies to sustain that. He removed the regional that that will ring very poorly with Britain as a whole. development agencies. He also failed to deal with the For people who are striving and finding it hard to make banks and enable them to borrow to companies so that ends meet, having to pay higher mortgage interest is not they could export, which meant that those companies in their interest. The shadow Chancellor and the Labour immediately ran into capacity problems. party are wrong if they are entertaining a policy that is about raising interest rates. That was my understanding Then, of course, the squeeze hit, and confidence—not of the drift of the shadow Chancellor’s speech. I regret helped by the apocalyptic economic rhetoric that the it; I do not think it is the right thing to do. Let us bear in Chancellor used to justify his policies—fell, reducing mind that a 1% hike in interest rates would mean demand from companies to invest more. Now we face £10 billion more in interest payments—about £1,000 the problem of a difficult credit situation from the extra on the average mortgage. People are finding it banking sector alongside low confidence, which means hard to make ends meet because of rising global commodity that people do not have the incentive to apply for loans. prices and the current difficult situation. Higher mortgage When I look at the measures in the autumn Budget, I interest rates would be a massively retrograde step. One fail to see how that would be addressed. of this Government’s most important achievements has The Chancellor has introduced a whole set of supply-side been to keep interest rates low by providing stability, measures that are in themselves a recognition of the clarity and a positive deficit reduction plan to get our mistakes he made when he first took office. I refer to finances in order. That is helping millions of families up things like the bank loan guarantees, which are just an and down the country and millions of businesses with extension of Labour’s enterprise finance guarantee scheme. lower interest rates are far better off than they would be Then there are the infrastructure commitments, the otherwise. 247 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 248

[Charlie Elphicke] Members on the rowdy Opposition Back Bench may not agree with what I am saying, but the figures make it The other really important thing is the help the clear to me that we are working to create fairness. For Government are providing with child care. For a long instance, unlike the Opposition, we want to create fairness time it has been difficult, particularly in deprived for motorists. By the end of next year, those who communities like parts of Dover and Deal in my experienced such difficulty as a result of Labour’s fuel constituency, for joint working parents to juggle child duty escalator will save £144 on the cost of filling up the care. The announcement to help those deprived areas average car by the end of next year. That is an important with extra help for child care places was one of the most example of progress. The apprenticeship scheme has important in the autumn statement. also been a real help to our young people after youth unemployment rocketed, particularly under the last Labour Government. [Interruption.] Sheila Gilmore: At the same time the Government reduced the amount of child care tax credit last year, so Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo): Order. far from helping working families, that did exactly the Members do not have to agree with what is being said, opposite. These provisions for nursery care, though but they do have to listen to it, and not continually important, are not really a substitute for the kind of interrupt. costs people face if they want to work. Charlie Elphicke: Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. Charlie Elphicke: I thought that child care tax credits In the last Parliament, youth unemployment in the had been protected. Indeed, I believe they are going up shadow Chancellor’s constituency rose by approaching £135 next year, so I am not sure that the hon. Lady has 150%, whereas in the current Parliament the rise has that right. been much lower. We are having to try to turn around the supertanker to return to our young people the futures that were so disappointingly taken from them by Sheila Gilmore: Like others who have spoken today, the last Government. We need to look after the younger the hon. Gentleman is confusing several different issues. generation, and allow them hope for a better future. The purpose of child care tax credits is to pay the cost of child care. The Government reduced the proportion Let me end by saying a little about what the Government of the cost that was paid from 80% to 70%. Child tax are doing for east Kent. The South East England credits are a completely different entity, and yes, they Development Agency spent £20 million on a business are being increased. Earlier, the hon. Member for Bristol park project and created tarmac, but no buildings and West (Stephen Williams) suggested that tax credits had no business park. Money was too often wasted. Now we not been frozen, but they have been, and that is another have a local enterprise partnership that has already hit suffered by working families. It would help if created an enterprise zone, which is important to a Government Members understood more about the benefit community that experienced difficulties after Pfizer decided and tax credit system. to run down its research in the United Kingdom. That is real progress. Our area has benefited from massive activism. The Charlie Elphicke: As the hon. Lady well knows, she fast train service to Deal and Sandwich will help to and I debated the issue at length during the Committee improve the economic situation, as will the £40 million stage of the Welfare Reform Bill. I know that Opposition regional growth fund. I also welcome the £180 million Members sneer at this, but I think it important that catalyst fund that the Prime Minister announced the child tax credits are rising by £135 next year. That is a other day. Such things are very important. We have seen move in the right direction. It is good that the lowest more economic activism in east Kent in the last year paid in the public sector are being protected from the than we have seen in the last decade. pay freeze because they are disproportionately women, just as it is good that 1 million people are being taken If we can establish the people’s port in Dover, it will out of the income tax system because they are give the community a sense of ownership, place and disproportionately women. We need more action of control of their destiny which will have an important that kind. The hon. Lady’s party had 13 years in which impact on their confidence in us. East Kent is so often to take such action, but, as we know, child poverty at the end of the line, a poor relation of the rest of sky-rocketed during the last Parliament. At least this Kent. I hope we can establish the people’s port project, Government are trying to take positive action in difficult and make it work so that it is a great showcase. If we times. make it a success, we will be able to hand back confidence and the idea of building a future, and thereby regenerate Hard-working families need to see stable finances, a Dover, making it every bit as good as it can be so that it stable Government and a stable fiscal position, because is once again a jewel in the crown of the nation. that is the only way in which we will bring back real Looking across the piece at what we are doing both growth. If we had continued to pursue the policies of nationally and locally in Dover and Deal, we can see the past, what would have happened to our country? We that the Government have the right policies at the right would have ended up as a basket case, like Greece, Italy, time. They are making the difficult decisions that will Portugal and Ireland. However, we had a credible plan, pay off for us over the next decade or so. and we took firm action to control the deficit and sort out our national finances. We have made tough decisions that hit the least well-off, but also the most well-off. We 8.40 pm are all in it together. Everyone is sharing the pain, more Tom Blenkinsop (Middlesbrough South and East or less equally, and I think that that is the right direction Cleveland) (Lab): The plan of the Prime Minister and of travel for the Government. the Chancellor had been fiscal austerity coupled with 249 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 250 an evacuation from the public sector, and it was initially In the EEF’s last quarterly survey of more than assumed that that plan would by itself provide private 450 manufacturers the growth forecast for 2012 has sector growth. The plan has clearly failed because of its been cut to 0.9% from 2.5%, a figure it predicted only a flawed logic and odd priorities. Under that flawed logic, few months ago. There is obviously a contraction, and a more spending was planned for Post Office mutualisation contraction that prefigures the eurozone crisis. This than the original English regional growth fund. contraction undermines the Government’s valid ambition to pursue export-led manufacturing growth. There is no Forecast growth has consistently been downgraded, manufacturing growth, and also an interim skills mismatch while borrowing has been consistently revised upwards, as any private sector manufacturing roles are being from £46 billion extra to more than £158 billion extra supplied with surplus labour from mass public sector and rising. While deficit reduction is highlighted by the redundancies and retail redundancies. In the 1980s there Prime Minister, private sector growth was assumed, was the cultural phenomenon of mass long-term male reliant upon foreign consumption at a time of international unemployment due to a politicised attack upon unionised, downturn in all consumption. That international downturn largely male, manufacturing sites, and we now face the is nowhere more evident than in the eurozone, which the proposition of mass female unemployment as the public Government are at pains to attack politically at a time sector and retail sector shed employees, again in the when the eurozone needs political union more than ever public sector’s case due to a largely anti-trade union, in order to provide fiscal credibility. Counter-intuitively dogmatic narrative mirroring the diatribes from the however, the Government undermine the required Conservatives in the 1980s. confidence, and in so doing only succeed in bad-mouthing the very export markets we so desperately need to retain Nic Dakin (Scunthorpe) (Lab): My hon. Friend is in the interim until new market partners are developed. giving a powerful analysis of the situation the country Not until last week’s autumn statement did we hear faces. Does he agree that we desperately need demand an acceptance by the Chancellor that private sector in the economy from somewhere, whereas what he is investment requires confidence and a reduction in risk describing is a situation of contraction, rather than via the injection of public investment. That is either demand to fuel economic growth? achieved directly by underwriting projects or, as we have seen, by off-balance-sheet lending on an unprecedented Tom Blenkinsop: My hon. Friend will know the scale. That lending is, of course, premised upon Britain’s consequences of the policies so far. We have seen massive own position in respect of a now highly likely eurozone job haemorrhages at Scunthorpe steelworks, and there bank failure if no political union is established to was the recent announcement about Llanwern, where reinforce fiscal union. The consequences of that will be nearly 200 steelworkers face unemployment as a result extraordinarily grave for our financial institutions, given of the mothballing of that site. Another site in Scunthorpe, the potential for contagion. What is even more troubling next door to the steelworks, has decided to move to a is that the Office for Budget Responsibility believes the short-time working agreement. Those are the consequences effect of the autumn statement’s attempt to rectify this of these economic policies. situation is negligible. Culturally and economically, these policies are counter- The Chancellor will also be aware that the Bank of intuitive to the needs of the economy. We need not just England has purchased 42% of gilt issuance, owning to rebalance the economy per se, but to rebalance 30% of total gilt stock. Britain’s interest rates have been structural unemployment, which requires as large an made lower as result. That has been achieved by the investment as that proposed for the infrastructure. For independent Bank of England’s purchasing policy, not example, in the steel industry, becoming a waterman— because of the Chancellor’s fiscal measures. It is interesting probably the most important job on a blast furnace, to note that this self-given “safe haven status” by the involving as it does ensuring that water does not mix Chancellor has not led to increased international market with molten steel—requires a minimum of two years’ ownership of British gilts. Indeed, international market training. That is a considerable cost for the industry. ownership of gilts has not changed from 2008 levels. Unemployment is predicted to pass 9% next year, according to the “optimistic” estimate of the Office for Quantitative easing is also a reason for that. When Budget Responsibility—and at what cost to the Exchequer? the independent Bank of England buys gilts from banks Such estimates actually predate the autumn statement, and pension funds, some of the money is re-channelled which increased public sector unemployment by 200,000— into the sterling corporate bond market. That is great from 500,000 to more than 710,000. My major concern, for the City, sterling and London property investment, as the son of a British expatriate family that sought a but as yet there has been no trickle-down for regional future in Qatar during the early 1980s, when the previous small and medium-sized enterprises or regional high Tory Government ratcheted up unemployment on Teesside, streets despite the much-hailed Project Merlin. is another diaspora of British skilled manufacturing What have been the consequences of the Government’s labour moving to other, far-flung nations. The promise counter-intuitive policy for manufacturing and industry? of warmer climes and job certainty will be hard to resist I should state that the Government’s aim to address our for many, especially as a recent Experian study for deteriorating balance of trade in order to create the BBC’s “Newsnight” showed that Redcar and Cleveland, surpluses we need is admirable. However, our balance and Middlesbrough are among the top three areas of trade has deteriorated in the last 18 months under hardest hit by the Chancellor’s autumn statement. the Prime Minister’s and Chancellor’s watch. Last month’s It is not just the public sector cuts. The proximity of Markit and Chartered Institute of Purchasing and Supply the north-east, which has no regional development agency, index slumped to 47.6, the lowest level since June 2009. to Scotland is having severe consequences for our regional Any figure below 50 is usually an early indicator of economy, as Scotland, which has its own RDA, is contraction. absorbing that manufacturing. 251 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 252

[Tom Blenkinsop] fund for the most promising medical treatments; it will reduce the time for the first recruitment of patients for Women are losing their jobs at twice the rate that men clinical trials to 70 days from a staggering 600 days; it are, and the Chancellor’s decision to freeze the working will ensure that medicines approved by the National tax credit will hit women hard, especially working single Institute for Health and Clinical Excellence are mothers. That move, coupled with his decision to claw automatically approved for use in hospitals; and it will back money that would have been spent on the child tax establish an early access scheme that will allow thousands credit, will have a significant impact on the well-being of seriously ill patients to get access to cutting-edge of the 36% of single mothers who claim working tax drugs up to a year earlier than they can now. Those credit, and their families. What will happen to their steps will not only help to reaffirm the competitiveness incentive to work? of the UK’s life sciences industry, but will encourage major pharmaceutical businesses to stay based in the Mrs Chapman: My hon. Friend is making a fantastic UK and materially help to rebalance the economy. But speech. the approach goes further, because it will enable patients who have simply been waiting for far too long for new Tom Blenkinsop: I thank my hon. Friend for that medicines to get them earlier. The Government are lovely intervention; it is an early Christmas present, in absolutely right to tackle that unacceptable situation. many ways. Our approach is not just about rebalancing the economy, What will be the consequences in benefit payouts to because we need to rebalance our skills set too. There the Exchequer? The OBR tells us that by 2017, we can has never been a more important time to prepare a expect to have lost 710,000 public sector jobs. With generation of young men and women for a future in 40% of women working in the public sector, making up business and enterprise. 65% of the public sector work force, it is not unreasonable Charlie Elphicke: Does my hon. Friend agree that to assume that they will bear the brunt of these cuts, apprenticeships have been a real step forward and have which could have potentially disastrous effects on the made a massive difference to our young people? unemployment rate for women, with private sector growth not providing enough employment to compensate for David Rutley: I completely agree with my hon. Friend, these job losses. and I will come on to talk about the impact in Macclesfield, Currently, 2,133 out of 6,622 Care to Learn claimants and no doubt in Dover too. Apprenticeships have been are aged 19 or over, including seven claimants each in a phenomenal step forward. the boroughs of Middlesbrough, and Redcar and Cleveland. A crucial priority for us now is getting to grips with As if young women in further education were not reshaping the life chances of millions of young people already facing massive financial challenges due to the and helping to improve the long-term economic prospects education maintenance allowance being scrapped, I of the United Kingdom. There is clearly a lot to do. A hear that the Government have recently consulted on recent survey of 3,000 parents with children aged 11 and the future of Care to Learn funding. These are the under found that the top career aspirations for their social consequences of counter-intuitive economic policies, children were: first, being a sports star; secondly, being which only beget further social consequences, further a pop star; and thirdly, being an actor or actress. Going fiscal strain and spiralling social breakdown, without into business did not even feature in the top 10. More addressing any of the necessary economic rebalancing worryingly, those aspirations are increasingly reflected requirements. in the subject choices in school, with business-related subjects lagging far behind in the popularity stakes. 8.48 pm Pat Glass (North West Durham) (Lab): Does the David Rutley (Macclesfield) (Con): It is an honour to hon. Gentleman believe that the Government’s policy follow the hon. Member for Middlesbrough South and of putting a hierarchy of subjects into their English East Cleveland (Tom Blenkinsop), a member of the baccalaureate, so that classical Judaism comes above “rowdy” Bench, perhaps better known as Snow White subjects such as business studies and IT, will help that and what were four grumpy Members. situation? In the current economic climate rebalancing the economy David Rutley: It is good to hear from those on the is a critical task, and I am pleased that the Government rowdy Bench again. are taking urgent action in this direction. We need to create the conditions in which sectors vital to the nation’s Pat Glass: I was not rowdy; I listened. growth have the best possible chance of success. Yesterday’s launch of the UK’s strategy for life sciences was an David Rutley: It is good to hear that, and the hon. important step in improving the competitiveness of life Lady makes an important point. Of course vocational sciences and pharmaceuticals, which are vital to the UK skills are important and, as my hon. Friend the Member and to the local economy in Macclesfield, where for Dover (Charlie Elphicke) was saying, the Government AstraZeneca employs some 2,000 people. Across the have taken important steps on vocational training. But country, those sectors employ about 160,000 people and it is also important to raise academic standards across have a combined turnover of roughly £50 billion. the board in education, which is why it is vital that the The launch set out important positive policies for the English baccalaureate is being put in place. life sciences sector: it will create new research partnerships To return to the theme that I was discussing, it is vital with companies such as AstraZeneca to cut the time that employers get confidence in the education being between the development of new treatments and their given to our young people; in a recent survey, 70% said application; it will introduce a £180 million catalyst that not enough business awareness was demonstrated 253 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 254 by school leavers. In June an Ofsted report on business 8.57 pm education went further, saying that students taking part in business-related education often had Mr Michael Meacher (Oldham West and Royton) (Lab): There is a paradox at the centre of the autumn “only vague ideas about the economy, interest rates and their impact”. statement that makes it self-defeating. The statement was widely touted as a growth Budget, but it is the That is clearly concerning and it will be an important opposite. The infrastructure plans relate to the medium-term spur to addressing business-related subjects in the much- future, on a three to 10-year time scale, but even if they needed national curriculum review in the months and materialise they are not the stimulus that is urgently years ahead. needed now. Pension funds will certainly not invest in The focus on business education needs to be improved infrastructure unless the Government fully underwrite in universities as well. Management, economics and the risk, in which case it will be registered in the accounting were much less popular than media studies national accounts as a potential increase in expenditure and sociology in 2010, and the growth in media studies— and thus a rise in indebtedness. The paradox is that even 15% over the past five years—continues to outstrip the to achieve that “smoke and mirrors” impression of growth in both management science and economics, the growth the Chancellor is such a deficit fetishist that he figures for which were 5% and 12% respectively. At a has been obliged to tell the markets that there is no time when companies are crying out for commercial increase in spending at all, and everything has been talent, it is troubling that the upcoming generation is funded by cutting spending elsewhere. not demonstrating an interest in business education, Significantly, the Chancellor has chosen to make which is clearly growing in other countries. those cuts by hitting the poorest hardest. Of the £1.2 billion So how can we begin to address those long-standing child tax credit and working tax credit savings over the trends? Much can be done back at school. That same next year, 32%—nearly a third—will come from the poorest Ofsted report highlighted the fact that more than a fifth but only 6% from the richest fifth, yet the poorest third of schools failed to provide sufficient opportunities are precisely the segment of our population that is by for students to engage directly with businesses. far the most likely to spend and thus to stimulate growth. Reducing that source of growth in favour of Mrs Chapman: How can the hon. Gentleman possibly will-o’-the-wisp infrastructure plans in the medium-term square that point with the dramatic nose-dive this year future is a pretty silly policy. It is certainly perverse and in applications for education from kids in the north-east anti-growth. post-16? What does he put that down to? The biggest problem facing Britain is not indebtedness, David Rutley: I am not familiar with circumstances in but the lack of aggregate demand. Everyone recognises the north-east; I am making the point that too few that except our myopic Chancellor. In the 1930s, John students want a career in business because until now Maynard Keynes said that if we look after unemployment, they have not had the right education, and we need to the budget will look after itself. Exactly the same thing get them back on to a better path. [Interruption.] applies today. Christine Lagarde, the head of the Apprenticeships are clearly one of the ways forward. International Monetary Fund, warns that if all countries deleverage at the same time, it will be economic suicide. One of the key things we have to do is expose young It is absurd to imagine that the markets would not people to more local business leaders. We have to get accept some modest loosening of the monetary targets those people into the classroom to make the case for if it was likely to produce a serious prospect of growth; business, and we have to make sure that they provide indeed, they would welcome that. positive role models. Work experience programmes go further, acting as an important way of helping children Of course we have constantly heard the Chancellor’s to apply and develop skills learned in school. In Cheshire, refrain against this argument, his canard that any increase Bentley has created a successful work experience scheme in public expenditure will push up interest rates, threaten with local schools; more than 850 pupils have gone the precious triple A rating and cost Britain more, but through the programme over the last five years. We need he does not have to increase public borrowing to kick-start more such schemes. KPMG, Tesco, Morrisons and others growth. There are two sources of funding that he could are starting to sponsor students at university. More draw on at no risk from the markets whatsoever. One is needs to be done to engage businesses at university level. to require the super-rich to make a fair contribution to the Exchequer at a time of crisis for the country. At As my hon. Friend the Member for Dover (Charlie present they are contributing next to nothing. Elphicke) pointed out, it is vital to look at alternative ways for young people to get business skills. Apprenticeships In the past year, according to the IFS, the income of are one of those ways, and we are seeing real success not the bottom 10th of the population rose by 0.1%. The just in shop floor disciplines but across a wider range of income of the directors of the top FTSE 100 companies business skills, such as accounting apprenticeships. rose by 49%. That is just about 500 times as much. It is Macclesfield college is working with Elior, a French time those latter people and the financial and corporate catering group, achieving real success not just for the elite of which they are such a part made a fair contribution. business but for the young people involved. The Government are doing well in putting forward the case Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP): The right hon. for apprenticeships, and I commend them. Gentleman has clearly identified those at the top of the Although it is vital to rebalance the economy and our earnings scale, but at the bottom of the earnings scale skills base, the most important thing we need to do in are the long-term unemployed. Does he accept the the long term is to rebalance and raise the ambitions of concern of many in the House that the long-term future generations. I encourage the Government in those unemployed are not looked after, and that there seems efforts. to be little regard for them? 255 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 256

Mr Meacher: Indeed. I very much support that point, and has tended to stray away from individual choices and I shall come on to it later, if the hon. Gentleman and consequences. We have talked about markets in the allows me to make my argument. abstract, and it is a pity that we seem to have forgotten I draw the attention of the House to the point that I that markets are a social phenomenon, and that they was making. The latest version of The Sunday Times are about people co-operating. When we talk about rich list, published in May, shows that in the 1990s the markets, we tend to imagine overpaid people, high-frequency 1,000 richest people in this country—0.003% of the trading and those who add nothing to society. population, a tiny number of people—had assets of I am reminded of something a constituent said to me £99 billion, which by 2010 had more than tripled to recently after hearing a Minister’s speech. He asked, £335 billion. That is truly staggering. It means that “Why is it that everything always seems to get harder those 1,000 persons alone could pay off the entire for the working man, whoever is in power?” Indeed, in budget deficit with just half of the gains that they have my constituency unemployment is up by 6.3% among made over that period. So not to make the ultra-rich the over-50s, up by 9.5% among those aged 25 to pay down a significant part of the deficit, which they 49 and, scandalously, up by 23% among the young. We themselves have largely created, is perverse, unjust and have heard that child poverty increased by 200,000 wilfully prejudiced. under the previous Government and that it is likely to There is a second source of funding that the Chancellor increase by up to 100,000 under this Government. In could and should, with no net increase in expenditure, the 21st century, that should not be our economic use in order to resuscitate growth. Here I come to the position. point to which the hon. Member for Strangford (Jim Shannon) drew attention. It costs £8 billion to Why are we in this debt crisis? I have just checked the £10 billion every year to keep a million people on the M4 money supply figures—I am sorry to return to dole. Instead of letting them rot on the dole, the Chancellor aggregates, but needs must. When Labour came to could create, with the same amount of money and no power the money supply was about £700 billion and it is net increase in borrowing at all, up to 500,000 jobs to now about £2.1 trillion, so it has tripled over the past begin the house building, the energy and transport 14 years. Unfortunately, most economists talk about infrastructure improvement, and the development of money flowing into the economy as if it were water the new green digital economy—all the things that the poured into a tank that found its own level immediately, country so desperately needs. but what if it is like treacle or honey? What if it builds up in piles when poured into the economy and takes a The Chancellor would then have a triple whammy. while to spread out? What if that money was loaned He would reduce joblessness by a fifth, he would get into existence in response to individual choices led by income tax and national insurance contributions and he the excessively low interest rates pushed by the central would get VAT, all by having people working rather bank? What if it was loaned into existence in particular than drawing benefits. He could well get Britain moving sectors, such as the housing sector, where prices have again. That is what the Labour party stands for, and it is more than doubled over the same period, and what if it about time the Chancellor, who has wreaked such was the financial sector that received the benefit of that devastation, caught on to a plan that will reduce the new money first? Would that not explain why financiers deficit fairly and sustainably and finally produce some and bankers are so much wealthier than everyone else, growth in this country. and why economic activity and wealth has been reorientated towards the south-east? Several hon. Members rose— Unfortunately, the idea that money takes some time Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo): Order. to move around the economy is lost on most economists, There are still seven speakers who wish to contribute to which I very much regret. Why did most economists not the debate, so I am reducing the time limit to five see the crisis coming? I put it to the House that it is minutes each. I ask each Member to pay attention to because their theories of credit are mistaken. They the clock, and to colleagues in the Chamber, so that make fundamental errors. Unfortunately I do not have they stand some chance of getting into the debate time to go into that, but the fundamental point is that today. That is five minutes, starting with Mr Steve credit is a choice to consume more now and less later. It Baker. is about the exchange of present goods for future goods, and co-ordinating the economy through time, and I am afraid that the current intellectual mainstream in economics 9.4 pm has dropped us into this desperate mess. Steve Baker (Wycombe) (Con): As I rise to speak I Opposition Members criticise the Thatcher and Reagan am reminded of a quotation from an economist who years. I think that there was much to applaud in those was a fierce critic of Keynes, a chap called Henry years, but unfortunately their intellectual underpinning Hazlitt, who said: was monetarism, which, like Keynesianism, is infected “Today is already the tomorrow which the bad economists with those dreadful mistakes. People in the Occupy yesterday urged us to ignore.” movement, and our constituents, are right to question We have heard today some moving accounts of individual the justice of our economic processes. The hon. Member and collective suffering in different regions of the country for Penistone and Stocksbridge (Angela Smith) said and among different sections of the public. We should earlier that the system cannot endure, and I am inclined be asking ourselves why, oh why, have we been delivered to agree. I agree that the current debt-based and—I am into this misery, which looks as if it will extend over afraid to say—statist system cannot endure. However, if years. Much of the conversation we have heard has been this system is not to endure, which way should it fall? along the lines of aggregates, coarse economic aggregates, We tried the statist direction in the past and it led to 257 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 258 misery and murder. I stand for free markets and free One thing on which I agree with Keynes is that, co-operation, but I say this to the House: if this is “During a recession you do not raise taxes.” But what capitalism, I am not a capitalist. have the Government gone and done? They have put VAT up. It is all very well saying, “We’re going to create jobs,” but, if someone needs to drive to work and they 9.9 pm are paying £1.33 for petrol and £1.41 for diesel, they might find it difficult to do so. If they are shopping and Chris Evans (Islwyn) (Lab/Co-op): We have heard the find that the price of their shopping basket has increased name of John Maynard Keynes again in this debate. My by 5% in the past year, they might not be able to afford favourite Keynes quotation is the one in which he says food. Those are the decisions that people face. that there comes a time when every Government have to indulge in “ruthless truth-telling”, and it is time that I wish I had more time, but I will say this: the this House stopped acting like Nero when Rome was Government have an opportunity to do something. We burning. need to look at skills and education, and to have a grown-up, adult conversation, asking, “Why are our We stand on the edge of the abyss, and we have a young people leaving school not equipped to go into eurozone crisis that is not being solved. Nothing seems work?” I talk to people in my constituency with to be happening. Greece is on the point of defaulting, it apprenticeship schemes, and they say that the kids are could exit the euro and it could be quickly followed by not prepared, so let us have an adult conversation and Spain, Portugal and, even, Italy. Yes, we might say, ask, “Why are they not prepared? What is wrong with “We’re not in the euro: we’re little Britain; they can’t the education system?” touch us,” but the key thing is that their bonds are held The final point that we need to look at is tax reform. by British banks, and British banks will have to bail It is all very well the Government giving people a 1p cut them out once again. in corporation tax, but when I speak to the small We have to ask ourselves, “Are we going to stand business man I find the thing that concerns him more is back and allow ourselves to sleepwalk into another red tape. He asks me, “When I have a micro-business, financial crisis, or are we going to heed the warnings why do I have to employ an accountant? Why can’t I and do something about it?” Last week, when we had have a simplistic tax form to fill in?” I wish I had more the autumn statement, the headlines were that the OBR time to develop those arguments, Madam Deputy Speaker, had downgraded its forecasts, but what worried me but I will sit down now. more than anything, and what was not said anywhere or by anybody in the House, was that the OBR could not Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo): Good! quantify what a crisis in the eurozone would do to the British economy. The best economists in the Bank of England could not even quantify or say what disaster 9.14 pm might befall us if there were a euro crisis, and to me that Harriett Baldwin (West Worcestershire) (Con): How is very concerning. can I follow the wonderful, lilting oratory from the hon. There comes a time with every Government when Member for Islwyn (Chris Evans)? they have to put ideology aside. When Labour nationalised It is very difficult to turn round a supertanker. The the banks, it did not do so because of ideology; supertanker that my right hon. Friend the Chancellor nationalisation was 30 years ago and belonged to the inherited was weighed down by the lead weight of past. It did so because nationalisation was a necessity having to pay out £120 million a day in interest and and a practicality, so now, as we face the crisis in the artificially inflated by a Government who were spending eurozone, we have to put ideology aside, see what the more than they were taking in, so that, in effect, £1 out practicalities are and put them into practice. It calls for of every £4 spent was borrowed. There was a very the type of bravery that is rarely seen in this House, but, challenging situation when the Chancellor took the if we had to nationalise the Bank of England and bail steering wheel of the supertanker, and we need a significant out the high street banks again, we would be saying to process of change to alter its direction towards one our constituents, “If you have the dream and the hope where we have a much healthier public sector financial of setting up a business, it ain’t gonna happen, because position and where the private sector is able to continue the banks are going to be even more cautious about its process of growth. [Interruption.] lending to you,” and, “If you have a mortgage, you’re not going to be able to move it on to a lower interest Madam Deputy Speaker (Dawn Primarolo): Order. I rate, because the banks are not going to take that risk am sorry to interrupt the hon. Lady. If Members want again.” to have private conversations, they should leave the The problem is that, with every crisis, every politician Chamber. If they are in the Chamber, they are taking will stand up and say, “Oh, it’s never gonna happen part in the debate and they will listen to the person who again. It won’t happen on my watch.”Even the Chancellor is speaking. has said, “It won’t happen again. No, not while I’m Chancellor—no it can’t,” but the truth is that it can, Harriett Baldwin: Thank you, Madam Deputy Speaker. because we have not learned the lessons of the previous I want to feed back to those on the Treasury Bench financial crisis. some of my constituents’ reactions to the decisions that In my speech, I wanted to analyse the legislation that the Chancellor announced last week in his autumn affects banking, so I looked, researched and went to the statement as regards the process of steering the supertanker. Library, but I could not find any. There was none at all, Those decisions were taken very much with a view to his so we are facing another crisis with the same banking understanding their impact on household budgets. practices and with a Government unwilling to do anything. Businesses and drivers in my constituency have welcomed 259 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 260

[Harriett Baldwin] to the European Commission and is lower than the eurozone average. The National Institute of Economic the fact that the increase in fuel duty promised for and Social Research has said that this is the slowest January is not going to happen. Following the victory in recovery from recession in Britain in a century. In the Libya and acknowledged slower economic growth, they great recession of the 1930s, it took just 48 months to were expecting the price of oil to fall and the price of rebuild the lost output in the economy. Under this petrol and diesel at the pump to decline, but it has not. Chancellor, it will be 69 months and counting. Even The increase in January would be extremely unwelcome taking into account the measures announced by the for them. Government last week, the OBR has downgraded growth My constituency has a very high percentage of people for the fourth time since its initial forecasts last June. over pension age, who, needless to say, welcome the fact Growth is now 0.8% lower this year and a whopping that they are to receive the largest cash increase in the 1.8% lower next year than in the previous March forecasts. state pension in history.They also welcome the Chancellor’s The burden is not being shouldered by the Chancellor, decision to allow councils to freeze the council tax for a nor by the rich and powerful in society. It is being paid further year, because for those who are on fixed incomes by women working part time to help support their or receiving modest pay increases, not having to suffer families. It is being paid by children facing lower living that increase in their council tax is another significant standards than the generation before them. Above all, it help to their household budgets. is being paid by the poor, with the number of people in For the many small businesses in my constituency, food poverty in this country approaching 4 million, and the fact that the small business rate relief is to be by the unemployed, with the number of young jobless extended until April 2013 is very welcome. The new now more than a million. initiative whereby larger businesses can defer some of The respected Fraser of Allander Institute has said in the rate increase by 60% for two years will also greatly its latest commentary that there is still some scope for help businesses with their cashflows. fiscal easing without damaging our fiscal credibility in On the credit easing measures, I would like to draw the long term. As Tony Dolphin of the Institute for the Chamber’s attention to an innovative idea in my Public Policy Research wrote last week in relation to the constituency called ThinCats.com—presumably the Government’s fiscal consolidation plan and its impact opposite of FatCats.com. People can put their savings on bond yields: to work with ThinCats.com and it will lend the money “If it had started with a plan that reduced the deficit more out for them. It is one of the credit circles that are slowly—say over six years rather than four—yields would probably becoming increasingly popular. Credit easing is another be little different from current levels now.” way in which we will be able to get the benefit of lower What is particularly worrying is that the same austerity interest rates into our business sector to allow businesses medicine is being applied in many other EU countries to receive help with their cashflow. with similar results. Finally, let me mention my concerns about the whirlpool The Chancellor’s growth strategy is now predicated that is offshore of the supertanker in the eurozone. The on maintaining loose monetary policy indefinitely, with three possible outcomes that could occur are an ever higher levels of quantitative easing, a policy he underwriting of eurobonds, a break-up of the entire once derided as currency union, or the current uncertainty as we jolt “the last resort of desperate governments” from summit to summit with great promises and then whose other economic policies had failed. As the experience huge disappointment. Of those, the current situation in the 1990s shows, low interest rates in themselves are causes the worst damage to business confidence in my insufficient to generate new demand. Japan has net debt constituency. I therefore urge Ministers, as they go into of more than 200% of GDP, but even lower bond yields these negotiations, to try to steer them towards one of than the UK. As the Japanese economist Richard Koo those two alternative outcomes, which would provide recently said of austerity economics in an interview some of the monetary stimulus that the eurozone needs with the Money magazine in the United States: and thereby a resolution of the current situation, which is the worst of all possible worlds. “The Japanese made a horrendous mistake in 1997.” He explained that 9.19 pm “The cutback caused a second recession… The Japanese Government didn’t do enough spending in the early 1990s and Mr William Bain (Glasgow North East) (Lab): Thank added another 10 years to the problem.” you, Madam Deputy Speaker, for calling me to speak in It is precisely that thinking that underpins what the this extremely important debate. Chancellor is doing today. The huge error made by the Chancellor on assuming The Government are ignoring four basic realities office last year was to mistake a global crisis of demand, about our economy. The first is that living standards for growth and jobs for one purely of debt and deficit. He families with working-age parents are being squeezed to launched a grand experiment of so-called expansionary levels last seen in the 1920s, amid slumping consumer fiscal contraction, which he must now admit has been confidence, slumping demand and weak retail sales. the most disastrous episode in British fiscal policy since The second is that supply-side reforms are needed to the 1930s. stimulate growth in manufacturing and construction. In The Chancellor took an economy recovering at an particular, a national investment bank could produce annualised rate of 2.1% at the end of the previous the borrowing capital needed to kick-start new investment Government’s period in office and turned it into an in the green economy.The third is that mass unemployment economy with flatlining growth. This autumn, our rate creates massive social costs and unrest, and devastates of growth stands as the fifth lowest in the EU according lives, which ends up placing a higher burden on future 261 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 262 taxpayers. That is the price of economic failure. Finally, cross between a lazy cricket umpire and Mr Tickle. I do we need to build an economy in which those on low and not believe he understands the difference between the middle incomes share more of the proceeds of growth economy flatlining and growth. It is like the difference than they have over the past three decades. between velocity and acceleration—if someone jumps The country is crying out for a fair alternative to this out of a plane, they fall at 9.98 metres per second failed Tory plan that is sucking demand from our squared. That number does not change, but as anyone economy, and hope and life from our communities. Our who has done it knows, they do accelerate. It is the same country deserves better leadership and a more optimistic with economic growth. The economy is growing year on vision of the future than that which has been offered year, as long as the figure is above zero. Labour need to by the downgraded Chancellor of this deflationary recognise that. If they accept the figures in the OBR Government. report, they must also accept that the outlook is that we can expect to see growth of up to 3% by 2015. If the Opposition say the economy is flatlining, are they saying 9.24 pm that China’s economy is flatlining with a growth level of Mr Tobias Ellwood (Bournemouth East) (Con): It is a 10%? Of course it is not; it is growing year on year. pleasure to participate in this important debate. I hope My final point is about the national debt and the that the usual channels will recognise the demand for responsibility that the last Government ignored. That is and interest in it and perhaps provide more time in the public sector net borrowing requirement—the difference future. between what we raise in tax receipts and what we spend I begin with a challenge to the Labour party about on all the Government Departments. In Labour’s last the observations made in the report by the Office for year in office, the Government put £513 billion into the Budget Responsibility. I very much welcome the existence pot but took £670 billion out, leading to a deficit of of that body and its report. If the Opposition accept the £157 billion. That was just one year. In 2002, the books figures in the report, they must also pay heed to its balanced and there was not a problem, but the year analysis. I believe they have accepted the numbers, but after they borrowed £19 billion, and then it went up to not the reality behind them. The OBR does not predict £30 billion. Year after year, they accumulated a massive a recession here in Britain, according to page 15 of the debt, which led us to the position that we are in at the report, but there is a caveat that has been stressed by moment. Members of all parties about what is going to happen in It was not until this Government came to power that the eurozone. It is hoped that the right decisions will be we said, “Stop. We cannot keep adding to this debt made to bring confidence back to that area. crisis.” By the time the election took place, we were The report provides three reasons why the OBR has perilously close to losing our triple A rating, and we had to provide an updated position. The first is rising inherited the highest structural deficit of any major commodity and food prices, the second is that the scale economy in the world. I am very pleased that we have of the boom and bust under the last Government had a got a grip on the economy now. Many quotations have greater impact on the economy than previously thought, been given in the debate, and I will give one final one, and the third is that the euro crisis has increased instability from Margaret Thatcher, who said that sooner or later, and uncertainty, which has affected household and every Labour Government run out of UK taxpayers’ business spending. money to spend. That is clearly what happened under There is also uncertainty about the liquidity of Europe’s the last Government. banks, which a number of Members have mentioned. There is an irony there, because in 2008-09 it was 9.29 pm Governments who were bailing out the banks, but today Sheila Gilmore (Edinburgh East) (Lab): This debate the banks are called upon to buy bonds and bail out is not about denying the deficit, and nor is it about Governments. However, many banks across Europe are never reducing public spending: it is about if and how unable to do that. They are desperately trying to repair we reduce the deficit and how we use public investment their exposure to the debt, and bond issuance across to grow the economy. Europe is actually dropping. In the past six months, just I intervened on the Chancellor earlier in this debate ¤17 billion was traded, compared with ¤120 billion in and asked the Chief Secretary to the Treasury a question the same period in the previous year. Big decisions need at Question Time because they ignored an important to be taken about the role of the European Central part of the OBR report, which they have quoted Bank, eurobonds and so on if we are to create the extensively—indeed, the Chief Secretary is still ignoring stability that is required. this point. He argued that we do not have growth I am grateful that our Government are in a different because the OBR discovered that the recession was position from others, because they acted to keep the deeper than previously thought. However, the OBR deficit down, cut the size of the public sector and help also said that the recovery had been quicker and stronger the private sector to grow through active enterprise in 2009 than previously thought and that the decline in policies and a reduction in corporation tax. They also growth came in the latter part of 2010. took difficult decisions about universities and tuition That is when the famous oil tanker that people have fees, to ensure that we remain competitive in the long talked about threw out its anchors and started moving term. backwards. The 2009 recovery did not happen by accident I turn briefly, in the very short time that I have, to the or because the sun was shining; it happened because the economic growth figures as measured by GDP. The previous Government took steps to stimulate the economy. shadow Chancellor is keen on suggesting that the economy Such steps can be taken. It is not true, as has been is flatlining. He uses funny gestures to say so—I wish he argued, that if we simply use Government money, we would stop them, because he looks a little bit like a will never pay off the debt. 263 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 264

[Sheila Gilmore] urging this Government to invest, to grow and to spend the money that is needed to get people back to work. The National Housing Federation, which represents We are talking about real people and real jobs that can housing associations, has made a small but helpful be created. We should not be placing families in such suggestion. It says that if the Government put £1 billion hardship. Those who think that because we have high-end towards shared-ownership housing, the housing association restaurants expanding in central London the economy sector could put £8 billion towards it. That would grow is doing okay should move themselves out of central 400,000 jobs and build the 66,000 shared-ownership London and see the real world. houses that are hugely needed by many low-income families, and at the same time reduce spending on 9.36 pm jobseeker’s allowance and housing benefit. Many who would live in shared-ownership houses would previously Nic Dakin (Scunthorpe) (Lab): I thank you, Mr Speaker, have lived in high-rent private sector housing, which for calling me to contribute towards the end of this causes the housing benefit bill, which the Government debate. I have had the privilege of hearing much of the say they are worried about, to escalate. debate. What has struck me is the unanimity on all sides That is just one small example. When we create jobs of this Chamber that the Government’s policies are in that way, we create not just that one job. It is not a hurting people in the world outside. The question is question of saying, “We spent all that money creating whether the policies are working. My constituents and those jobs. Okay, those people will pay more tax and constituents across the country want to know whether will not be on benefit, but that is not growing the the policies are right and whether they are working. At economy.” Those people exist within local communities. the moment, the early indications are that they are If people have jobs and incomes, they will buy goods certainly not working according to the plans that were from other businesses. set out by the Government 18 months ago. We have youth unemployment above 1 million and women’s It is no accident that many of the businesses in unemployment at the highest ever level. The borrowing difficulty during the recession and after are related to figures are £158 billion higher than expected to pay for the housing world. I know of one firm in Edinburgh unemployment and benefits, and not to pay for investment that not only sold furniture but built it. The furniture- or jobs. At this mid-term point of the Government, that building side of the businesses has closed because the does not appear to be a positive step forward. market has declined. People are not buying houses and Businesses across the country are struggling. In my they are not moving into new ones or redecorating, and own constituency of Scunthorpe, an agreement was they are not buying furniture. reached between the trade unions and the management at Caparo Merchant Bar to close early for the Christmas Mr Speaker: Order. It is the height of discourtesy for period so that the company can better reshape itself for an hon. Gentleman, who has just made a speech in the the challenges of 2012. The demand for global steel is debate and who is fortunate to have done so, then to sit very low, which is causing a great challenge for steel there, wittering away at other Members, completely companies in my constituency. ignoring another hon. Member on her feet. That hon. Gentleman should be thoroughly ashamed of his behaviour. One of the arguments that concerns me is that the public and private sectors are somehow different. The public sector carries an element of risk while the private Sheila Gilmore: The ongoing effect of creating sector provides innovation and drive and those two construction jobs would ripple far beyond the jobs sectors need each other. A local businessman said to themselves. That is what we mean by investing to grow me, “What we need, Nic, is demand in the economy. We the economy. We will not always borrow money for need things done that drive demand.” I welcome the such things, but if we borrow on a short-term basis, we infrastructure projects that were outlined in the Chancellor’s would still be borrowing for a purpose. Borrowing is autumn statement. Frankly, those projects should have not always bad. Many Government Members and others been in place 18 months ago. It is not a matter of too bemoan the fact that small businesses cannot borrow to little, too late but that there should be more. Consumer expand. The Government can quite legitimately borrow confidence is at an all-time low and dropping, and that to grow the economy. That is what we should be doing, is of great concern. but we have not been doing it for the past 18 months. I want to focus on individuals because they are at the heart of this. A police officer in my constituency wrote Sammy Wilson: There is an additional ingredient that to me, drawing my attention to the threats to his pay, his is needed in the hon. Lady’s proposal. Not only do the conditions of service and his pension. In a heartfelt Government need to borrow, but banks need to be way, he asked, “How much more pain do we have to willing to lend to people the mortgage side of the suffer and how much more money does my family have purchase of the house so that the shared ownership can to lose before enough is enough?” We should be listening be effective. to the words of the people out there. We owe them a stimulus and a direction forward and we should deliver Sheila Gilmore: Indeed. Despite the fact that the them today. Chancellor has assured us that he has entered into arrangements with the banks so that they would provide 9.39 pm loans, we still have this mystery of why that has not been happening. If we do not do these things, we will Chi Onwurah (Newcastle upon Tyne Central) (Lab): see ourselves going further and further into decline. Last year the Chancellor boasted, with barely contained What the previous Government did to help us climb out glee, that it would be necessary to make cuts deeper and of recession is worth repeating. That is why we are faster than any Chancellor in history in order to clear 265 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 266 the deficit in four years. In the process, we were told that to promote those sectors in which we have a competitive the private sector would be freed, that the economy advantage and where businesses pursue long-term, inclusive would soar forth just in time for general election tax and socially responsive strategies for the good of themselves cuts and that we would all be in it together. and the rest of us. One week ago, the Chancellor came to this place to Let us look at how the key drivers of our economy admit that growth had flatlined, that he would be are doing under this Government. Lee Hopley, the chief borrowing £158 billion more than forecast, that further executive of a manufacturing employers group, says cuts had to be made and that the deficit would still be that there at the next election. And it certainly does not feel “short-term confidence has all but fallen away”. like we are all in this together, as many of my right hon. That is why this week the manufacturing sector cut its and hon. Friends have said this evening—not when growth forecast to 0.9%, down from 2.2% just three there are 1 million unemployed young people, not when months ago. And still the Government talk about a two thirds of the cuts are being borne by women and manufacturing-led export-driven recovery! Today the not when manufacturing, the regions, education and Deputy Prime Minister was busy announcing an extra innovation are all suffering. round of the regional growth fund. We support its aims; This has been a lively and, at times, passionate debate, in fact, they are similar to those of the regional development and there have been many excellent contributions. I agencies, except that its fund is only half what theirs am only sorry that I do not have the time to mention all was, and it is controlled from Whitehall, not the regions, my hon. Friends who have spoken so eloquently. I where it belongs. As of today, just a quarter of the shall only mention my hon. Friends the Members for successful bidders in round one have received their Blaydon (Mr Anderson), for Bishop Auckland (Helen money.There can be no better example of the Government’s Goodman), for Birmingham, Hall Green (Mr Godsiff), inept and out-of-touch approach to regional growth. for Middlesbrough South and East Cleveland (Tom Let us look at higher education. Universities—the Blenkinsop), my right hon. Friend the Member for centres of knowledge and ideas—should be the drivers Oldham West and Royton (Mr Meacher), my hon. of both growth and social mobility. In 2009, the sector Friends the Members for Islwyn (Chris Evans) and for contributed £7.9 billion to the economy. In 2008, the Glasgow North East (Mr Bain) and my right hon. higher education sector created almost 700,000 jobs. It Friend the Member for Coatbridge, Chryston and Bellshill is our seventh largest export industry, but almost exactly (Mr Clarke), who explained with passion and determination a year ago this Government pushed through the most how the pain being experienced in their constituencies damaging and disruptive changes to the higher education was but inadequately matched by the dry, outdated system, tripling tuition fees and then changing the rules ideological dogma of too many on the Government after universities had set their fees. At the same time, the Benches. [Interruption.] Yes, and we see it again this Government introduced changes to student visas that, evening. in effect, tell the world: “Britain is closed”. All this is One week ago, the Chancellor came among us neither hugely damaging to universities and students. cowed nor humbled, and although his policies were So what about innovation, the “engine of growth”, as discredited, he delivered a lecture and a series of ad hoc the Business Secretary likes to call it? The Chancellor announcements but no proper plan for growth. Rather, likes to say that he is protecting science, but research he seems to think that if he talks about it, it will happen. from the Library shows that the science budget is being But what we needed from him last week was a proper cut by 15%. If this Government truly believed in putting plan B. We need a short-term plan to kick-start the science at the heart of the innovation economy, they economy and create jobs such as—now let me think— would protect our position as one of the world’s leading Labour’s five-point plan for jobs and growth: a tax on science nations. Indeed, a recent report from the Department bank bonuses to fund up to 100,000 jobs for young for Business, Innovation and Skills says that our position people; genuine long-term investment in infrastructure is at risk because of this Government’s lack of investment. such as roads and schools; a temporary VAT cut giving It is true that yesterday the Government produced a life families with children a boost of about £450 a year— sciences strategy, but why has it taken them 18 months [Interruption.] Government Members may laugh but to produce a plan for one sector? Eighteen months and that is a lot of money in my constituency. The plan also we still do not have a plan for innovation. That is includes a year-long cut in VAT to 5% on home because this is a “stand on the sidelines” Government, improvements and repairs to help small business; and letting companies, industries and whole sectors fail in tax breaks for small businesses to take on extra workers. the absence of action. It is a very good plan. Today the shadow Chancellor of the Exchequer said: As well as a short-term kick-start, however, we need a long-term strategy, a vision for the future of the economy. “The argument is whether it is better to be borrowing billions more to keep people out of work on benefits or whether action On “Newsnight”on the evening of the autumn statement, now to get our economy moving will get more people into work Lord Heseltine claimed that it was the beginning of an paying tax and help to get the deficit down in a fairer way.” industrial policy. I fear that he might have to explain to the Chancellor what an industrial policy is. Indeed, he In March, the Chancellor ended his Budget statement should probably explain what an industry is—and, while —he may remember this—by saying: he is at it, perhaps he should explain that to the Business “We want the words: ‘Made in Britain’, ‘Created in Britain’, Secretary too. Both are ideologically opposed to using ‘Designed in Britain’ and ‘Invented in Britain’ to drive our nation active government to ensure that industry has the forward”.—[Official Report, 23 March 2011; Vol. 525, c. 966.] environment it needs to flourish. Both fail to recognise Wanting is not enough, however. The Government need that we need a long-term vision for an economy that is to act. There are millions up and down the country who competitive, resilient and fair, and that we need strategies want to drive our nation forwards by making and 267 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 268

[Chi Onwurah] The Labour party has to face up to this reality, yet the shadow Chancellor did not. This Government have, building things. Instead, they find themselves chasing and have made the difficult choices in doing so. far too few jobs with far too many others. There are Our strategy of loose monetary policy and fiscal hundreds and thousands of young people—young men consolidation, backed with some of the most ambitious and women—who want to learn the skills to make and supply-side reforms in generations, was not just right build things, but instead are consigned to a life without when we first announced it after the election; it is right education or employment. For how long will this now. Indeed, recent events have given even stronger Government continue to pursue a bankrupt ideological confirmation that it is right. That is why, despite the vision in the face of every economic indicator and so changed forecast, our interest rates remain so low while many broken lives? The Chancellor of the Exchequer is countries all around us have seen their credit rating capable only of driving our nation forward into year slashed, downgraded or put on negative watch. The after year of rising unemployment, flat growth and markets have shown their confidence in the UK with higher borrowing. We ask—we demand—that he change the interest on our debt falling to historic lows. course. In what was probably the most remarkable part of today’s debate, the shadow Chancellor was astonishingly 9.50 pm dismissive of the low interest rates and our achievements. The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Business, Never mind that Italy and Spain have seen their rates Innovation and Skills (Mr Edward Davey): I do not think shoot above 6% while ours have fallen towards 2%; anyone doubts the serious economic challenges facing never mind the benefit to mortgage holders, businesses the UK, Europe and the wider world. The serious tone and taxpayers of that achievement. The shadow Chancellor of today’s debate reflects that. So it is important in such seems to believe that the UK is in a liquidity trap—despite a crucial debate that we can agree on the economic and the fact that we have a credible central bank, despite the financial figures and forecasts, not least because in the fact that quantitative easing has been judged effective past, Parliament, commentators and the markets and despite the major credit easing announced in the have questioned Governments’ forecasts. In the past, autumn statement. In the early 1930s, ahead of Keynesian Governments jealously guarded control of the forecasts rearmament, a monetary expansion with low rates and used that control to tweak, fiddle and fix the combined with fiscal consolidation produced a significant figures. As we can read in the previous Chancellor’s recovery. Is that not the lesson from history that the memoirs, the pressure to fiddle the figures is never shadow Chancellor simply has not learned? greater than in the tough times. By giving responsibility Of course, we could have opted for another growth for forecasts to the Office for Budget Responsibility, policy—some call it plan B—involving unfunded tax this Government have changed all that. The OBR figures cuts, more borrowing and more spending. The details of are independent; the OBR figures tell it straight; so that are never clear, but the consequences are higher these figures command respect. I challenge Labour interest rates. [Interruption.] Labour positions itself as Members to say so now if they do not accept the OBR’s the party of high interest rates, although a 1% rise in figures. market interest rates adds £10 billion to mortgage bills— meaning that the average family with a mortgage will Mr Geoffrey Robinson (Coventry North West) (Lab): pay £1,000 more—and increases business rates by £7 billion It is not a question of not accepting the integrity of the and taxpayers’ costs by £21 billion. That would be the Office for Budget Responsibility. The question is the price of Labour government. [Interruption.] reliability of the figures stemming from the credibility of the organisation. Why does it get everything so I have looked around Europe for Governments or wrong all the time? Is it not up to the job? Does it have a mainstream political parties that have opted for a policy lack of expertise, or is it just that it is being asked to fix such as plan B, but they are in short supply. Other figures that have no meaning in the real world? Governments are now having to address their budget deficits—[Interruption.] Mr Davey: Given that that comes from a former Treasury Minister in a Government who often got their Mr Speaker: Order. Far too many private conversations figures wrong, I do not think that the OBR needs to are taking place in the Chamber. Let us hear the Minister. listen to that. It is absolutely clear that the Labour party is taking the OBR’s figures seriously. It is significant Mr Davey: Other Governments, faced with rising that we can at last have a debate without the numbers interest rates on their debts, are now having to address being the issue—without the spin and the game playing their budget deficits. Often they are having to cut deeper that so debased the House’s deliberations in the past. than us. It is true that our deficit reduction, at 3.7% of The Labour party’s acceptance—grudging or otherwise—of GDP over the next four years, is the third highest in the our or the OBR’s forecasts presents Labour Members G7. After all, in 2007 our structural deficit was the with a problem. Why do they not accept the underlying highest in the G7. Yet Italy is now making much deeper explanation of the OBR’s forecasts? cuts, and France too is planning deeper cuts. Our deficit This House has heard that the OBR’s forecasts changed reduction is of course significantly less than that of not because the Government’s policy has gone wrong, Greece, Ireland, Portugal or Spain, so we will not be but because of three reasons outside this Government’s opting for plan B as suggested by the Labour party. control: imported inflation, with higher oil and commodity We heard many excellent speeches from Members in prices; the huge uncertainty caused by problems in the all parts of the House. I particularly commend those of eurozone; and, finally, the boom and bust that Labour my hon. Friend the Member for Chichester (Mr Tyrie) once arrogantly told us they had abolished, which was and of the hon. the Members for Skipton and Ripon worse under Labour than anyone had previously thought. (Julian Smith) and for Newton Abbot (Anne Marie 269 The Economy6 DECEMBER 2011 The Economy 270

Morris), all of whom referred to the importance of the Harvey, Nick Percy, Andrew supply-side reforms. The hon. Member for Skipton and Haselhurst, rh Sir Alan Perry, Claire Ripon mentioned the important employment law reforms Heaton-Harris, Chris Prisk, Mr Mark which, I believe, will make a big difference to our efforts Hinds, Damian Redwood, rh Mr John to return people to work, and the hon. Member for Hollingbery, George Reid, Mr Alan Newton Abbot spoke of the importance of ensuring Hollobone, Mr Philip Rogerson, Dan Jackson, Mr Stewart Ruffley, Mr David that regulation was cut for micro-businesses. I can tell Javid, Sajid Russell, Bob the hon. Lady that we are achieving that now, even at Jenkin, Mr Bernard Rutley, David European level. Johnson, Gareth Selous, Andrew We also heard good speeches on the importance of Jones, Andrew Skidmore, Chris infrastructure investment from the hon. Members for Knight, rh Mr Greg Smith, Miss Chloe Folkestone and Hythe (Damian Collins), for Ochil and Lamb, Norman Stanley, rh Sir John South Perthshire (Gordon Banks) and for Scunthorpe Leigh, Mr Edward Stevenson, John (Nic Dakin), and from the former Chancellor of the Mills, Nigel Stunell, Andrew Exchequer, the right hon. Member for Edinburgh South Moore, rh Michael Tyrie, Mr Andrew West (Mr Darling). The significance of the infrastructure Morris, David Vickers, Martin Mosley, Stephen Watkinson, Angela plans that we announced in the autumn statement is Williams, Stephen that they are well advanced, and some are even shovel-ready, Mulholland, Greg Munt, Tessa Wright, Simon so the problems that the shadow Chancellor worried Murrison, Dr Andrew about do not pertain. Tellers for the Ayes: Ollerenshaw, Eric James Duddridge and This was an important debate. For once, it was not Osborne, rh Mr George Mr Shailesh Vara about the figures in the economic forecasts and the Budget questions. Thanks to the innovation of the Office for NOES Budget Responsibility, it focused largely on analysis— although at times the analysis presented by the shadow Abbott, Ms Diane Creasy, Stella Chancellor was more theoretical than academic—and it Abrahams, Debbie Cruddas, Jon Ainsworth, rh Mr Bob Cryer, John sharpened the differences between the coalition and the Alexander, Heidi Cunningham, Alex Opposition. While the Government are focused on keeping Ali, Rushanara Cunningham, Mr Jim interest rates low, Labour’s priority is to spend and Allen, Mr Graham Cunningham, Tony borrow more. While this Government— Anderson, Mr David Curran, Margaret Austin, Ian Dakin, Nic Mr Alan Campbell (Tynemouth) (Lab) claimed to Bailey, Mr Adrian Danczuk, Simon move the Closure (Standing Order No. 36). Bain, Mr William Darling, rh Mr Alistair Balls, rh Ed David, Mr Wayne Mr Speaker: The Question is, That the Question be Banks, Gordon De Piero, Gloria now put. [Interruption.] I think the Ayes have it. Barron, rh Mr Kevin Denham, rh Mr John [Interruption.] Order. Hon. Members must calm Beckett, rh Margaret Dobbin, Jim themselves; it will be injurious to their health otherwise. Begg, Dame Anne Dobson, rh Frank The Question is, That the Question be now put. Benn, rh Hilary Docherty, Thomas Benton, Mr Joe Dodds, rh Mr Nigel [Interruption.] It is simply a case of putting the Question. Berger, Luciana Donohoe, Mr Brian H. I will try once more. The Question is, That the Question Betts, Mr Clive Doran, Mr Frank be now put. I think the Ayes have it. Blackman-Woods, Roberta Dowd, Jim Question accordingly put, That this House has considered Blears, rh Hazel Doyle, Gemma the matter of the economy. Blenkinsop, Tom Dromey, Jack Blomfield, Paul Dugher, Michael The House divided: Ayes 79, Noes 213. Blunkett, rh Mr David Durkan, Mark Division No. 408] [9.59 pm Bradshaw, rh Mr Ben Eagle, Ms Angela Brennan, Kevin Eagle, Maria AYES Brown, Lyn Efford, Clive Brown, rh Mr Nicholas Elliott, Julie Adams, Nigel Davies, David T. C. Brown, Mr Russell Ellman, Mrs Louise Afriyie, Adam (Monmouth) Buck, Ms Karen Engel, Natascha Aldous, Peter Davies, Glyn Burnham, rh Andy Esterson, Bill Alexander, rh Danny Davies, Philip Byrne, rh Mr Liam Evans, Chris Baker, Steve Dorrell, rh Mr Stephen Campbell, Mr Alan Flello, Robert Baldry, Tony Dunne, Mr Philip Campbell, Mr Ronnie Flint, rh Caroline Baldwin, Harriett Ellison, Jane Caton, Martin Flynn, Paul Beith, rh Sir Alan Ellwood, Mr Tobias Chapman, Mrs Jenny Fovargue, Yvonne Blackman, Bob Elphicke, Charlie Clark, Katy Francis, Dr Hywel Bradley, Karen Evans, Graham Clarke, rh Mr Tom Gapes, Mike Bruce, Fiona Farron, Tim Burley, Mr Aidan Francois, rh Mr Mark Clwyd, rh Ann Gilmore, Sheila Carmichael, rh Mr Alistair Fuller, Richard Coaker, Vernon Glass, Pat Cash, Mr William Gauke, Mr David Coffey, Ann Glindon, Mrs Mary Clark, rh Greg George, Andrew Cooper, Rosie Godsiff, Mr Roger Coffey, Dr Thérèse Gilbert, Stephen Cooper, rh Yvette Goggins, rh Paul Collins, Damian Hancock, Matthew Corbyn, Jeremy Goodman, Helen Crockart, Mike Hands, Greg Crausby, Mr David Greatrex, Tom Davey, Mr Edward Harris, Rebecca Creagh, Mary Green, Kate 271 The Economy 6 DECEMBER 2011 272

Greenwood, Lilian Murphy, rh Mr Jim Mr Speaker: That, I think, was a case of either a Griffith, Nia Murphy, rh Paul point of frustration or, as the right hon. Gentleman has Hamilton, Mr David Murray, Ian a smiling countenance, him getting his point on the Hanson, rh Mr David Nandy, Lisa record. Harman, rh Ms Harriet Nash, Pamela Havard, Mr Dai O’Donnell, Fiona Ed Balls (Morley and Outwood) (Lab/Co-op): On a Healey, rh John Onwurah, Chi point of order, Mr Speaker. Given that the motion Hermon, Lady Osborne, Sandra before the House today was on whether there has been a Heyes, David Owen, Albert Hillier, Meg Pearce, Teresa sufficient debate on the economy, given the failure of Hilling, Julie Perkins, Toby plan A, given the £158 billion of extra borrowing, given Hodge, rh Margaret Pound, Stephen rising unemployment, and given the view of the House Hodgson, Mrs Sharon Raynsford, rh Mr Nick that more time is needed for this debate, could you Hoey, Kate Reed, Mr Jamie advise on whether the will of the House could be Hopkins, Kelvin Reeves, Rachel expressed and there could be more time to debate the Hosie, Stewart Reynolds, Emma very important issues facing this House and the country? Howarth, rh Mr George Reynolds, Jonathan Hunt, Tristram Riordan, Mrs Linda Mr Speaker: I am grateful to the right hon. Gentleman. Irranca-Davies, Huw Ritchie, Ms Margaret The allocation of time for parliamentary debates is not Jamieson, Cathy Robertson, John a matter for the Chair, but the right hon. Gentleman Jarvis, Dan Robinson, Mr Geoffrey has recorded his view, as has the Deputy Chief Whip. Johnson, rh Alan Rotheram, Steve Johnson, Diana Roy, Lindsay Dr Thérèse Coffey (Suffolk Coastal) (Con): Further Jones, Graham Ruane, Chris to that point of order, Mr Speaker. I seek your advice. Is Jones, Helen Ruddock, rh Joan it fair to say that anyone who has spoken in the debate Jowell, rh Tessa Seabeck, Alison and then voted against the motion is actually misleading Keeley, Barbara Shannon, Jim Kendall, Liz Sheerman, Mr Barry the House by saying that it has not considered the Khan, rh Sadiq Sheridan, Jim motion? Lammy, rh Mr David Shuker, Gavin Mr Speaker: The very simple answer to the hon. Lady Lavery, Ian Skinner, Mr Dennis is that the House has not been misled in any way. Lazarowicz, Mark Slaughter, Mr Andy Nothing disorderly—[Interruption.] Order. I have just Leslie, Chris Smith, rh Mr Andrew Lewis, Mr Ivan Smith, Angela made the point, which brooks no contradiction, that Long, Naomi Smith, Nick the House has not been misled in any way. Nothing Love, Mr Andrew Smith, Owen disorderly has taken place. The vote is what the vote is; MacNeil, Mr Angus Brendan Spellar, rh Mr John it is not for me to interpret. Other hon. and right hon. Mactaggart, Fiona Straw, rh Mr Jack Members and people outside the House are free to do Mahmood, Shabana Stuart, Ms Gisela so as they wish. Marsden, Mr Gordon Tami, Mark McClymont, Gregg Thomas, Mr Gareth Andrew Miller (Ellesmere Port and Neston) (Lab): McDonagh, Siobhain On a point of order, Mr Speaker. McDonnell, John Timms, rh Stephen Trickett, Jon McFadden, rh Mr Pat Mr Speaker: I hope it is a different and unrelated Turner, Karl McGovern, Jim point of order. McGuire, rh Mrs Anne Twigg, Stephen McKechin, Ann Umunna, Mr Chuka Andrew Miller: Mr Speaker, by a majority of 134, the McKenzie, Mr Iain Vaz, rh Keith House has determined that this House has not considered McKinnell, Catherine Vaz, Valerie the matter of the economy. Have you heard from the Meacher, rh Mr Michael Whiteford, Dr Eilidh Government Front Bench whether the Government Mearns, Ian Whitehead, Dr Alan intend to allocate more time to ensure that the House Michael, rh Alun Williamson, Chris Miliband, rh David Wilson, Sammy does consider the economy properly? Miliband, rh Edward Winnick, Mr David Mr Speaker: No. Miller, Andrew Winterton, rh Ms Rosie Mitchell, Austin Wishart, Pete Moon, Mrs Madeleine Wood, Mike Business without Debate Morden, Jessica Wright, David Morrice, Graeme (Livingston) Wright, Mr Iain Morris, Grahame M. DELEGATED LEGISLATION (Easington) Tellers for the Noes: Mudie, Mr George Phil Wilson and Motion made, and Question put forthwith (Standing Munn, Meg Jonathan Ashworth Order 118(6)).

Question accordingly negatived. TRANSPORT That the draft Renewable Transport Fuel Obligations (Amendment) Order 2011, which was laid before this House on 14 November, be The Comptroller of Her Majesty’s Household (Mr Alistair approved.—(Greg Hands.) Carmichael): On a point of order, Mr Speaker. I seek Question agreed to. your guidance. Is there any means by which tomorrow’s record can record that the sort of meaningless gesture Mr Speaker: With the leave of the House, motions 4 that we have just seen is as good as it gets? and 5 will be taken together. 273 Business without Debate 6 DECEMBER 2011 274

BUSINESS OF THE HOUSE Short-life Homes (Lambeth) Ordered, Motion made, and Question proposed, That this House That at the sitting on Tuesday 13 December paragraph (2) of do now adjourn.—(Greg Hands. Standing Order No. 31 (Questions on amendments) shall apply to the Motion in the name of Mr Nigel Dodds as if the day were an 10.17 pm Opposition Day; proceedings on the Motion may continue, though opposed, for three hours and shall then lapse if not previously Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab) rose—[Interruption.] disposed of; and Standing Order No. 41A (Deferred divisions) shall not apply.—(Greg Hands.) Mr Speaker: Order. I appeal to hon. and right hon. Ordered, Members who, for whatever reason, quite unaccountably, That at the sitting on Wednesday 14 December paragraph (2) are leaving the Chamber to do so quickly and quietly so of Standing Order No. 31 (Questions on amendments) shall that the hon. Member for Vauxhall is afforded the same apply to the Motion in the name of Edward Miliband as if the courtesy for her Adjournment debate as they would day were an Opposition Day; proceedings on the Motion may want for theirs. continue, though opposed, for three hours and shall then lapse if not previously disposed of; and Standing Order No. 41A (Deferred Kate Hoey: Thank you very much for those words, divisions) shall not apply.—(Greg Hands.) Mr Speaker, although I do not think the House will stay full for much longer. DELEGATED LEGISLATION (COMMITTEES) It is with a great deal of sadness that I hold this Ordered, Adjournment debate, but it is important that the House understands what is happening just over the river in That the draft Daventry (Electoral Changes) Order 2012, be referred to a Delegated Legislation Committee.—(Greg Hands.) Lambeth in terms of short-life housing disposals. If there were any kind of legislation on wording, using the description “short-life” would almost be in breach of it, because the homes are not short life in the sense that people have lived in them for only a few months. Many of the people I shall refer to will have been in their homes for 30 years or more—most of them for between 15 and 25 years. There is a history in Lambeth. Short-life housing co-ops were formed in about 1980 to make use of Lambeth council properties that were in too bad a condition to let normally, but that Lambeth could not afford to repair to a lettable standard. Housing co-operatives were given licences to use those properties, usually by a secondary agency, typically a housing association. Initially, short-life meant short-life, six months being the normal period, but owing to Lambeth’s general mismanagement and policies that seemed to change every 10 years, many people have been in their homes for more than 30 years. One resident, Steve Drake, who lives in Nealden street in a co-op, has been there now for 31 years. Through the mid and late 1980s and into the 1990s many housing co-ops became established as the properties that they managed became more long-term. As I said, the phrase “short-life” became a misnomer. There were various schemes involving many properties attracting some limited funding via schemes such as Mini-HAG, which was mini housing association grants administered by the then Housing Corporation. That finished in about 2000. Housing co-ops needed an income to pay for the maintenance of the properties that they managed and the day-to-day running of the co-op, so co-op members paid rent, the amount agreed by members of each individual co-op. Throughout that 30-year history of housing co-ops, Lambeth has changed its policy at various times, thought about recalling the short-life properties and threatened evictions at various times, but as recently as 1997, which does not seem such a long time ago, Mr Drake got a letter from the then chair of housing, Labour’s housing spokesperson in Lambeth, saying: “I write to you further to your letter of 29 June 1997, to update you on the situation regarding shortlife housing. I am pleased to say that at the last Housing Committee meeting at the beginning of September, we succeeded in persuading the other parties to back our proposals for proper negotiations 275 Short-life Homes (Lambeth)6 DECEMBER 2011 Short-life Homes (Lambeth) 276

[Kate Hoey] get the long-term residents evicted. On almost every occasion the courts have said, “Hang on, we haven’t got with the shortlife housing co-ops. I am sure that … the Lambeth all the facts and we want to know more.” A number of Federation of Housing Co-ops has been in touch with you … and cases have been postponed over and over again, costing I hope that as a result of this work, it will be possible to come to Lambeth huge amounts of money each time. Many of an agreement which allows the current residents to stay in their homes.” the properties are in a really good state. There is absolutely That was from Tom Franklin, who was then the councillor no reason why they could not be kept by the council or, in charge. if they go to Notting Hill Housing, left with the current Shortly after that, the council seemed to change its residents, who have maintained them to a high standard policy. It did not seem to make much difference whether for over 20 years. it was a Labour council, a coalition council or a hung I simply do not understand how a housing association council. The policy got into one of those files that seem can get away with spending a lot of money buying up to sit around local authorities, and for many years the properties from a local authority that has tenants who residents had no idea what was happening, but they need housing and then planning to sell off 80% of carried on with their co-ops, some of which were very them. They are not trading organisations. I thought successful. The Short Stock housing co-op—I have that the point of a housing association was to provide named the person who has been leading that, Steve housing. I find Notting Hill Housing’s attitude very Drake—has been going extremely well, and is part of strange. If it is doing this as a favour to Lambeth, I do the Lambeth Self Help scheme that involved buying not think that it is much of a favour to the people living Short Stock’s properties with tenants in situ. The plan in the properties. The most recent communication I was that the very large property would be worked on received from Notting Hill Housing on 30 November and could be sold, but that everybody would be allowed indicated that it was to stay in their houses and renovate them. The people in “clear that the properties will be sold to us with vacant possession. Nealden street and in Morat street have stayed on. That means that the Council will evict all the current residents. During that time Lambeth had 100% nomination rights We will then refurbish 20 per cent, and will sell up to 80 per cent to any vacancies that came up. of them. This is the assumption so that we can give the Council the kind of receipt they require. I know this is distressing for Last year Lambeth Self Help was approached by many of the residents who have lived here for many years but I Lambeth council. It submitted a plan, which the council understand the council will rehouse everyone”. wanted revised, given the change in central Government Of course they will get an offer from the council. policy on social housing rents. The plan was resubmitted and rejected, then re-submitted and rejected again. Finally, I want to give some examples of the people who live Lambeth changed its policy in the summer and now wants in the properties and how they have been involved for to sell off all the remaining properties housing families many years in the local community, in campaigning of different sizes—there are roughly 150 of them—and organisations and in all the things that are so important the council wants to do a deal. It originally wanted to an inner-city area. The Cope family live at 26b Stockwell to do a deal with Hyde Housing. Hyde Housing had come Park road. Indeed, some hon. Members live around to an arrangement whereby some of those residents would that area, which is probably one of the most expensive be able to stay in their homes when they were bought. in my constituency. Another long-term resident lives next to them, at 24b. The family have been in a short-life That fell through because Lambeth did not think it residence there since 1987, originally part of the Ekarro was getting enough money. It has been in negotiation housing co-operative, which became a different housing with Notting Hill Housing, which is making clear its co-op, and finally they ended up with South London opinion that it is doing Lambeth a favour. It will buy Family Housing Association, which was later taken the properties and immediately put 80% of them on the over by Amicus, which was when the licence was withdrawn open market, leaving 20% as affordable houses in Lambeth. from the housing association. The family have done all I can understand that, as there is a shortage of capital, the repairs in the house and managed to prevent the although Lambeth has not said that that money will go ground-floor flat next door, which was owned by Lambeth into housing. It has said that some of the money—we council and had been empty for years, being squatted do not know how much—will go towards reducing the by what I call real squatters—I am not opposed to the shortage of school places in the constituency of my squatting of long-term empty houses in some cases. The hon. Friend the Member for Streatham (Mr Umunna). family have done all the work on that house but are now If there is money going out of housing to the council, it being told that they must move out, which will probably should come back into Lambeth to be used for housing, mean the loss of the last two or three remaining houses as there is a huge waiting list. in affordable social housing in the middle of one of the In the meantime, the council has said that it wants most expensive areas. vacant possession, and every property must be empty The Cope family is very much part of the community, by the time the deal goes through with Notting Hill and all the residents of the Stockwell Park residents Housing. Notting Hill Housing told me that it might association have signed a letter stating that they want have been prepared to consider taking on some of the the family to remain. It just does not make common residents who were adequately housed and in social sense, because they will be moved into another Lambeth need, but Lambeth council said that it wanted to give property that someone on a waiting list might have their them with vacant possession, and Notting Hill Housing eye on, and at the same time the family might be moved then said that it would take the properties only with out of their community to somewhere many miles away vacant possession. from where their children go to school—and for what Lambeth’s legal firm, Devonshires, which must be purpose? In the end the property will either go back to making a fortune out of this, is now going to the courts another tenant, if it happens to be in the 20% that in Lambeth or Wandsworth week after week to try to Notting Hill keeps, or it will be sold on the open market. 277 Short-life Homes (Lambeth)6 DECEMBER 2011 Short-life Homes (Lambeth) 278

Just up the road, literally four houses up, 20 Stockwell If Notting Hill Housing buys that group of properties, Park road was one of those short-life properties. The can the Government do anything to stop it immediately resident was evicted—taken away, asked to get out—a selling off 80% of them? It seems absolutely scandalous few years ago; the property was squatted; Lambeth got that it can spend public money buying properties and rid of the squatters and re-did the place with new immediately sell them. bathrooms and kitchens in two of the flats; three weeks Can the Government insist on Lambeth council and later it was squatted again; and the squatters in one flat Notting Hill Housing allowing those sitting tenants and have not been removed. So, the council has spent a lot residents who are adequately housed and meet the of money on its own property, allowed it to be squatted criteria to remain tenants of the association, rather by people with no housing need and, at the same time, is than being moved somewhere else to move in somebody trying to get rid of people who do have housing need. who has lived in Lambeth for only a couple of years? The Clapham North Housing Co-operative is a very That would at least be a fair way of looking at the issue. active co-op, with a substantial number of properties— Does the Minister understand the anger and misery 19 homes—on which people still pay rent, and Lambeth that is being caused by a policy of moving people out of could have negotiated with it. The negotiations started, their homes of over 20 years just so that at some time in stopped and then Lambeth changed its mind, so now, the future they will be let to new tenants? Given that despite saying at the bottom of every letter that it is a there are already very well-established co-ops in other co-op council, it is getting rid of co-ops. I speak as parts of the borough, will he encourage Lambeth to someone with many co-ops in the north of my borough incorporate those that are working adequately into and in Bishop’s ward, such as the Coin Street housing some kind of system that would allow those people co-operatives, and I have seen the value of co-ops and to stay? Most of all, does the Minister think that a local how they link people with their community. authority such as Lambeth could show a little more We have some terrible individual cases. Heidi Usher, imagination? Of course we know that there is a shortage of 12 Thorpe Park road, has been there for many years. of money everywhere, but money from the Government She has been adequately housed, with four children in has been stopped and we need to get some of that her home, which she has kept beautifully, having done investment back. all the work herself, but she is now being taken to court. Lambeth has improved its housing management. My Fortunately, yesterday when she went to court, the previous housing Adjournment debate was also about magistrate said, “This is ridiculous, this needs more Lambeth, and I have to say that things have improved than an hour. I need at least a day,” and has deferred the since then. Lib Peck, who is the cabinet member for case until 28 February. So, every case is being put back, housing, has done a sterling job and has bought into the and that gives the Minister an opportunity to intervene whole idea of this being the only way to protect the and do something that would give those people hope, investment. However, the council’s policy is misguided because it does not make common sense. and has been built on many years of mismanagement I want to ask the Minister some questions that he and neglect. As I said, there are many people to blame might or might not be able to answer. Many of these for this, but they are not the residents. issues have occurred because of the local authority’s This is a complicated situation that is somewhat inadequacy and incompetence over many years, for historical and almost unique to Lambeth, but sometimes which we can blame many people, but at the end of the in such cases, where there is clear injustice, we must find day the people who are suffering are the residents, a way to stop it happening. I hope that the Minister whose fault it is not. The cost of all those legal cases will, at the very least, offer to meet me and a group of could have adequately brought some of the homes up to co-op residents from across the borough so that we can the decent homes standard. explain how unjust this is, because in such a short time I On the decent homes standard, when I visit those have not been able to go into much depth. Not a single residents I feel that they are living in a decent home, as ordinary person would read through all the dossiers they do. It may not tick the box, because the kitchen and meet these people and not say at the end of it, “This may not be exactly like the modern kitchen that represents does not make common sense in 2011.” supposedly the decent homes standard, but, if they are happy there and adequately housed, why is the decent homes standard used as a reason to move them out? 10.37 pm Does the Minister share my view on what his Department The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for could do to ensure that families are able to stay in their Communities and Local Government (Andrew Stunell): I homes of many years? Surely the Government must congratulate the hon. Member for Vauxhall (Kate Hoey) have some say in the matter, because Lambeth will get on securing this debate and on the diligent work that Government housing money, as will Notting Hill Housing she has done in support of her constituents and residents. association. I should like an assurance that he understands She spoke very eloquently. Notting Hill Housing to be conducting the process This is the first time that the situation that the hon. properly, because I have concerns. about how it is Lady described has come to my attention. I understand doing so. that Lambeth has a proposal that is designed to dispose Some time ago, Lambeth offered many residents the of properties to help to fund renovation, perhaps of right to buy, albeit at absolutely open-market prices, but those properties but certainly of other stock in the some struggled to do so because it was their home. Will borough, some of which is being let for short-term they be considered under the Government’s new policies tenancies. She described the confusing development of on the right to buy at less than market value? That the phrase “short-term”to mean something quite different could be a solution. and gave illustrations of the very long length of tenancies 279 Short-life Homes (Lambeth)6 DECEMBER 2011 Short-life Homes (Lambeth) 280

[Andrew Stunell] and where “the works or activities are carried out in order to secure that the that some people have had in these properties. I want to land or the building will be brought into effective use”. make it clear that I am working from the description The hon. Lady has mentioned the possibility—obviously that she has given. I do not have first-hand information, I have only her words to go on—that it was proposed to and the Department has not been formally notified by provide more school places with some of this money. It Lambeth, or anybody else, of any transactions taking would be a matter for examination whether that was a place. regeneration activity. If it was not, the expenditure of The House will know that the Government fully the money from this projected sale would require specific understand the need for a radical and comprehensive consent from the Secretary of State. If it was regeneration, approach to housing. That is why we published our it would come within the general consent. I am happy housing strategy for England last week. That strategy to write to her to spell that out, because it is a complex covers a broad range of housing topics, including social area to get across in this debate. housing, the reuse of empty housing, and a number of The treatment of properties that are occupied by other factors of which I am sure that the hon. Lady is secure tenants is tightly controlled and it always requires well aware. I want to stress that it is for the London specific consent, unless the disposal is to the occupant. borough of Lambeth to decide its own strategic approach In other words, if it is not a right-to-buy sale, a secure to its housing, and not for Government to comment on tenant’s property cannot be transferred without specific it. Speaking in this debate as a member of the Government, consent. The nature of the tenancies that these constituents I have to stick strictly to that rule. In the privacy of enjoy again depends on the intricacies of the story that the Members’ coffee room, I might say something else. the hon. Lady has presented to the House. The reality is that the Government’s job is to provide the strategic approach to housing policy and it is for the The Government do not have any intention of changing London borough of Lambeth to decide its approach to those arrangements. Of course we are keen to see run-down its housing. Of course, the Government want all local properties passed on to landlords who are able to invest authorities to adopt the effective management of assets, in them while retaining them for social tenants. I have including in their disposal of stock and reinvestment. had the opportunity to announce to the House a To go back, perhaps I should say that the basic £100 million fund for bringing such empty homes back assumption is that local authorities will plan for holding into social and affordable use for social tenants. Those or redeveloping all their council stock. Clearly, the right disposals can be to other bodies or individuals, and they to buy entitles tenants to purchase properties. The hon. could be covered by the general consents in the situation Lady asked whether the right to buy would apply to that I have previously outlined. these particular tenants. The nub of that issue is that it No application has been received in respect of the depends on the nature of their tenancy agreement. If schemes that the hon. Lady has mentioned, and I they have a standard council tenancy, which it seems cannot comment on what decision the Secretary of they may not have from her words, they would be State might take unless one is submitted and there is a entitled to exercise their right to buy. Otherwise, they proper investigation into the circumstances by the Secretary would not have a statutory right to buy. of State. As well as tenants buying stock, councils can engage The Government have put significant support into in partial or whole stock transfers, but those require the social housing in Lambeth. We have committed £18 million consent of the Government. There can be no question this year and next to bring homes up to a decent of wholesale disposals without the need for some consent standard there, with a further £82 million provisionally or approval. Similarly, housing associations registered allocated for the next two years, making a total of with the Tenant Services Authority need consent to £100 million to be invested in Lambeth to bring its dispose of their properties. I want to reassure the hon. backlog of non-decent homes up to a decent standard. Lady that in this system, there is a strong degree of A significant amount of money is available to Lambeth control over what happens to social housing stock. from the Government to improve its homes, and she may want to consider encouraging the council to direct Kate Hoey: Does that mean that if this sale was going some of those resources to the homes that she has through, the Secretary of State would have to agree mentioned today. to it? London has been allocated 27% of the new affordable homes to be provided through the affordable homes Andrew Stunell: I certainly want to cover that point. programme. Combined with the existing commitments, There is a regime known as general consents, which that means that the target of 50,000 new affordable means that if certain preconditions are met, specific homes by 2012 set by the Mayor is very likely to be consent over a particular transaction is not required. reached. I am not in a position today to say how many The key point is that money arising from such disposals of those homes will be built in Lambeth, because that is must be reinvested in affordable housing or regeneration. subject to contracts, not all of which have been sold. That would be within the general consent. Use of the Lambeth currently has 25,000 council homes, and money elsewhere would not be suitable. The meaning of according to the housing strategy statistical appendix investment in affordable housing is perhaps self-evident, it has a waiting list of 23,000. In other words, there is but regeneration has a technical meaning. It means an acute demand for social housing there. It is also projects or activities on land where the land is true that Lambeth has an above-average number of “vacant, unused, underused, ineffectively used, contaminated or empty social homes, or voids. In April, 4.1% of its derelict” stock was vacant compared with a national average 281 Short-life Homes (Lambeth)6 DECEMBER 2011 Short-life Homes (Lambeth) 282 of 1.5%. According to the council tax database, Lambeth investment that we are making in new and affordable has 1,676 long-term empty homes, which are those homes and given Lambeth’s higher than average number empty for longer than six months. of empty homes and long-term empty homes— The hon. Lady might like to consider the fact that 10.48 pm given the £100 million that is being provided to Lambeth House adjourned without Question put (Standing Order over the next four years for decent homes, given the No. 9(7)).

1WH 6 DECEMBER 2011 Sport and Youth Crime 2WH

geographical areas, and I would like the Government to Westminster Hall consider some broader research that would seek to demonstrate the value for money and the performance Tuesday 6 December 2011 of sporting interventions with young people. I want to thank a number of sporting and other young people’s organisations that run such programmes [JIM DOBBIN in the Chair] and have provided information about them for the debate today—in particular, the Premier League, with Sport and Youth Crime its Kickz programme; the Manchester United Foundation; Charlton Athletic Community Trust; the Rugby Football Motion made, and Question proposed, That the sitting Union; Sky Sports; the Sport and Recreation Alliance; be now adjourned.—(Nick Herbert.) First Light, which works in the arts; and Catch22. Their formal programmes are largely delivered by volunteers 9.30 am from the communities that they serve, and so I also Damian Collins (Folkestone and Hythe) (Con): It is a want to thank the many volunteers who make them a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mr Dobbin. success and the hundreds and thousands of people who Today’s debate on the effects of sport on youth crime work every day to deliver youth sporting projects, not falls, in some ways, in the shadow of last summer’s riots, just for disadvantaged young people but for all young and from his appearance yesterday on “Newsnight”, I people across the country. Their work is incredibly know that the Minister for Policing and Criminal Justice valuable and important to us all. is up to speed with the subject. This debate is set against I want to look at four important areas that are of a longer-term concern about the rising problem of relevance to the debate: sporting programme interventions disengaged youth, which has disturbed Governments of that help to reduce crime and antisocial behaviour; all persuasions for decades, and a belief by many in the interventions that engage young offenders, both in young sporting community that sport can and does play a offenders institutions and after release; programmes for positive role in re-engaging young people and refocusing improving school attendance and attainment; and initiatives their lives. that help to rebuild young people’s self-worth. Nelson Mandela has said: We must consider costs; none of these programmes is “Sport has the power to change the world. It has the power to delivered for free, although many are delivered with the inspire… It speaks to youth in a language they understand. It is support of the private and charitable sectors. We must more powerful than governments in breaking down social barriers”, also consider the costs of doing nothing, of maintaining and I want to use this debate not just to say that sport is the status quo. Based on 2010 figures, the National good for its own sake, although many people believe Audit Office has calculated that more than 200,000 that numerous benefits come with it. Studies of the criminal offences a year are committed by people aged benefits of youth participation in sport suggest that between 10 and 17 at an annual cost to the country of sport in and of itself is not enough to refocus or turn up to £11 billion. It costs up to £100,000 a year to keep around the lives of disadvantaged young people and someone in a young offenders institution, and the number that what is required is a structured programme of of 15 to 17-year-olds in prison has doubled over the support alongside the sporting activities. It is not simply past 10 years. During the five days of riots in August, a case of putting on ad hoc sporting events or creating 26% of the rioters were under 17, and 74% were under new sporting facilities, but about how programmes are 24. There is not a male bias in the programmes and managed. activities—they are open to boys and girls—but it is This is not simply a way of saying that Government worth noting that 90% of the rioters were male. intervention is necessarily a bad thing, or that Government First, on reducing crime and antisocial behaviour, agencies and public bodies are unable to deliver programmes one of the longest running and most successful projects that successfully intervene in young people’s lives. Support, is Kickz. It has been run by the premier league for five including financial support, from the Government and years, has involved contact with more than 50,000 young their agencies is incredibly important to the success of people across 113 projects in some of the UK’s most such projects, but a good deal of new evidence suggests deprived areas and has been supported by 43 professional that sporting organisations and brands that have credibility football clubs. Kickz targets 12 to 18-year-olds, and its in the eyes and lives of young people are often more projects are football-led but include other sports and successful in achieving the breakthrough that we all programmes designed to encourage young people’s seek. awareness of health issues. The schemes typically take There has been a debate among people with an place three nights a week throughout the year, which is interest in sporting interventions in the lives of young important in that they are frequent and have a very people. People instinctively feel that such interventions fixed structure. Kickz and the Premier League believe are the right thing to do, and they have anecdotal that one in 10 of the young people who initially attend evidence that they make a positive difference, but if the programmes as participants go on to volunteer, there is any criticism, it is that there is perhaps a lack of delivering the programmes for other young people, and robust data about exactly how they reduce criminal they say that 398 people have gained full-time employment behaviour. I want to highlight some case studies that in some of the professional football clubs that have run show the positive impact of such interventions on reducing the projects. crime and on antisocial behaviour and in improving the A report published last year by the Laureus Sport for general well-being and educational performance of young Good Foundation and New Philanthropy Capital, entitled people. The studies, of necessity in some ways, focus on “Teenage Kicks”, looked at a project run with Arsenal relatively small numbers of people in relatively small football club in Elthorne park in London and discovered 3WH Sport and Youth Crime6 DECEMBER 2011 Sport and Youth Crime 4WH

[Damian Collins] have committed youth crime. Does he accept that prevention is also an issue with youngsters who might otherwise be that the investment in the project potentially created attracted into criminality? £7 of value for every £1 spent, with the savings coming May I make a quick plug for the club that is probably from the reduced costs to the state of the reduction in nearest to where we are sitting now? About 300 yards criminal behaviour, with less police and court time away is St Andrew’s club at Old Pye street. The club has needed to put people in detention. One participant said been around for 130 years, runs 12 football teams on a that he thought that 25% of the kids on the estate would weekly basis and has an indoor gym. It works well with be in jail without the programme, and he highlighted Westminster school, which has put a lot of money into the nature of the problems that many young people ensuring that the gym is up to the highest standards, face. He was someone who came home from school to and it makes an impact in the vicinity. St Andrew’s club find not a fridge full of food and people waiting for operates not too far away from what would otherwise him, but nothing for him at all and an empty time in his be a quite troubled area of social housing. day. Interestingly, the Laureus Sport for Good Foundation also commissioned a report looking at the role of sport Damian Collins: I thank my hon. Friend for his in gang culture. Young people involved in the research intervention. St Andrew’s club is indeed a great success. gave reasons why they might get involved in activities I know that it has his support as well as that of previous that would keep them out of trouble, and the top reason lord mayors of Westminster, who have made it their was that the activities would simply give them something annual mayoral charity. Its work is greatly appreciated to do. We should not underestimate the importance of by people in central London. that. The project Hitz is delivered by the Rugby Football Returning to the study of the Elthorne park Kickz Union, the premiership rugby clubs and the police project delivered by Arsenal, it suggested that there had across 10 London boroughs, and has 750 participants. been a 66% reduction in youth crime within a one-mile Again, the sessions are led by youth workers and run radius of the project. Even taking into account other frequently, twice a week for 50 weeks of the year. In the interventions—through community policing, for example Haggerston park area of Hackney, where the project —and after looking at national youth crime reduction was delivered, the fall in antisocial behaviour calls was trends for that period, the study’s authors thought it calculated at 39% during the project. reasonable to suggest that at least 20% of that reduction Such projects often encourage people not just to take was directly related to the project. part in the project itself, but to take their interest into a The Manchester United Foundation has delivered more structured environment and perhaps into full-time similar projects, with its star footballers working with participation in the sport. The Hackney Bulls rugby youth workers and volunteers to deliver football-based club recruited six new players from people involved in recreational projects for young people in Manchester. Hitz, and overall, the programme has taken 41 young Some of its research suggests a similar pattern of behaviour people into full-time participation in rugby. to that found in other research. It believes that in its In my area, Kent, the Charlton Athletic Community Salford project there was a 28.4% reduction in antisocial Trust has done excellent work with young people over a behaviour during the session times when the foundation number of years. Certain projects that have sought to was working, and a 16.3% reduction in Trafford. re-engage young people and refocus their lives have There are other smaller projects that in some ways caused similar falls in antisocial behaviour, including a work with people with more challenging needs, and I fall of 35% in Aylesham and 59% in Buckland. The want to highlight—this has been highlighted in the trust also does good work on alternative curriculum Laureus report and by other people—the work of the provision to re-engage young people with their studies, Tottenham boxing academy. Members who know more and I will come to that in a moment. about boxing than I do might take part in this debate, Good work can be done in the community to help so I will not dwell too much on this. The project was direct young people away from the path of criminality, designed for 14 to 16-year-olds. Physical impact sports— as my hon. Friend highlighted. There is also some boxing and rugby—seem to be particularly effective evidence on work being done to engage young people in when working with people from troubled backgrounds the prison environment, often at low cost, as many and certainly with those who have been involved criminal prisons and young offender institutions have good sporting activity. There were 17 people on that project. Eight of facilities, and it is a question of bringing in the right them were known to have been offenders in the past, people to engage young offenders. Those programmes and based on normal intervention programmes, two use sport to help bridge the gap between life inside an thirds of those young people would normally be expected institution to life outside it afterwards. to reoffend within a year. However, in that instance, only two did. It is a small project, but it suggests that A project called 2nd Chance has worked in the Ashfield sporting projects help to re-engage people. They engage young offenders institution. Drawing on professional young people through a sport and then allow the youth sports clubs around Bristol, such as Bristol Rovers and workers delivering the project to engage with them Bristol rugby club, it has worked with 400 offenders a about the other issues that they might have. year and is a low-cost provision. It has been calculated that, if just one offender with whom the programme works is kept out of prison, that will pay for the delivery Mark Field (Cities of London and Westminster) (Con): of the entire programme for a year. When we consider I congratulate my hon. Friend on securing this important that the current reoffending rate for young offenders in debate. He has spoken a bit about curing those who Ashfield is 76%, it seems a risk worth taking. 5WH Sport and Youth Crime6 DECEMBER 2011 Sport and Youth Crime 6WH

As part of the study of its work, 2nd Chance has programme. Those might be softer measures of asked that it and groups like it have access to information improvement, but they are important when we consider about reoffending rates for people who have engaged in that we are dealing with people who are, on the whole, such programmes, to demonstrate whether they offer a quite disengaged from their environment and from formal value for money return. At the moment, it is difficult for learning areas and practices. those groups to access that information, as all sorts of The Manchester United Foundation calculated that data protection issues rightly surround information that its project had worked with 500 young people. Of those can be traced to individual offenders. However, could 500, seven got jobs with Manchester United, 14 were general information be given to make that link and recruited as volunteers, 30 gained accreditation in music demonstrate the payback of such projects? The project and IT production projects, eight completed football within Ashfield was delivered for less than £80,000 in a level 1 and 2 qualifications, 12 won boxing tutor awards year of operation and worked with more than 400 and 30 became junior football organisers. That is not a young people. bad rate of return for engagement with 500 young The Rugby Football Union has a programme called people, and the project was delivered at relatively low Try for Life that has worked with young offenders in cost, for less than £50,000 a year. numerous institutions, and a programme called Prison to Pitch that trains young people in prison to play rugby In conclusion, I ask the Government to consider the and then helps them gain placements with rugby clubs issues raised by my remarks and the case studies that I outside prison. As with the programmes run by the have mentioned. The Government should shift their Premier League, individuals who do not go on to work priorities generally—they have already signalled a shift—so within the sport go on to volunteer to help deliver that they do not just increase participation in sport for programmes for other young people. good but consider how targeted intervention by sporting projects can help change the lives of some of the most School attendance and attainment is particularly relevant hard-to-reach young people. They should consider how to a case from my own constituency that I want to cite: to create a unified approach to delivery across Departments. the work of the Charlton Athletic Community Trust in The work touches on the role of the Home Office, the New Romney. It is worth noting in the data from the Ministry of Justice, the Department for Culture, Media riots that 30% of rioters were persistently absent from and Sport, the Department for Education and the school. In New Romney, the Charlton Athletic Community Department for Communities and Local Government, Trust has taken over alternative curriculum provision, a all of which have some interest in the delivery of such mainstream piece of provision offered across the country. projects. A unified approach is needed, probably with a Charlton Athletic won the contract to deliver it. It uses lead Minister to take responsibility for and an interest its role as a football and sport club to re-engage young in how those projects are delivered. people, but it also delivers studies in maths and English, as well as a broader basic curriculum. There should be a review of some of the rules and The project opened in New Romney in September. I regulations about the delivery of sporting projects on attended, along with my hon. Friend the Minister for the ground. Many sporting clubs cite problems with Sport and the Olympics. During the two or three months Criminal Records Bureau checks and other forms of since it started, the rate of attendance of the young bureaucracy that make their work more difficult. We people involved has improved significantly. The project should certainly look at that. All the national sporting gave me statistics. The attendance rate of one of those bodies should prioritise the development of coaching young people went from 1% at their previous institution qualifications and the training of people to help deliver to 55% now. Another student’s attendance rate went projects. from 26% at their previous institution to 100% now. To return to what I said at the beginning of the Such projects help to reduce antisocial behaviour, as debate, a good starting point would be to build on the some statistics demonstrate, and a broader, fuller study work that is being done by many sporting and charitable by the Government would be welcome. I have cited organisations, take up the research that they have done, examples showing how they can intervene successfully complete a fuller study and analysis of the benefits and in the lives of young people in prison and re-engage the rate of return from this type of intervention, and those who have had trouble at school with their studies. then consider the potential basis of further Government There is also much to be said about the projects’ ability support via Government agencies, local government to help rebuild young people’s sense of self-worth and and the police—through crime prevention strategies—to make them feel happier in their working and school make this a fuller programme for the country. The need environments. to re-engage with young people is strong and evident, and the riots over the summer demonstrated that clearly The charity Greenhouse does a lot of work across to us all. Through the fog of this despair, there is London. It was supported by the Duke and Duchess evidence of some incredible and successful interventions of Cambridge on their wedding guest list and by The that are turning around the lives of young people. We Times’s Christmas appeal. In the research based on its should draw from that and build for the future. 41 full-time sports and performing arts projects across London, some things that stand out strongly are improved school attendance, improved timeliness for the projects Several hon. Members rose— and increased happiness in school. An evaluation commissioned by Greenhouse from external valuers showed that 87% of the young people with whom the Jim Dobbin (in the Chair): Order. Before I call the charity worked reported being happy at school as a next hon. Member to speak, it looks as though four or result of the new programmes in which they were taking five other Members would like to contribute. I intend to part, compared with just 52% before the start of the call the shadow Minister at about 20 minutes to 11. 7WH Sport and Youth Crime6 DECEMBER 2011 Sport and Youth Crime 8WH

9.50 am levels of youth crime. I want to see what that project’s metrics say about the outcomes, because it may have Tom Brake (Carshalton and Wallington) (LD): Thank been very successful. you, Mr Dobbin. I congratulate the hon. Member for Another local project is Community Inspirations, the Folkestone and Hythe (Damian Collins) on securing importance of which is that it can provide wraparound this debate. I hope that hon. Members will not feel too for some young people who have fallen out of education. much of a sense of déjà vu after I have finished, because They may, for instance, be training locally at the Skills I will make many of the points that he has already and Integrated Learning Centre—SILC—in plastering, made, although I will use examples that are local to me tiling and other skills. There is often an issue about in order to illustrate them. what they do during the school holidays. The typical The debate’s title could have been recast and centred activities of organisations such as Community Inspirations on the effect of sports leaders on youth crime, because I centre on sport. It often takes a group of young people think that sports leaders are what really do it in terms of who may never have stepped outside their postcode to reducing crime. Clearly, the sport itself plays a part, but another part of the country to meet other young people I think it is the sports leaders who have the impact, and and play in competitions. It is having an important that is because of the discipline that they can instil, their impact. important mentoring role, and the values that they I had a chance meeting last night on my way to the demonstrate in leading young people, whatever their Akash Tandoori, an establishment that I would recommend sporting activity. The Government have to get on top of to anyone who finds themselves in Wallington. It is run the mentoring role. I believe that there is an issue about by Yawar Khan, who is the president of the Federation which Government Department should take responsibility of Bangladeshi Caterers and with whom I do a lot of for mentors. There is a clear need for them in, I would work. Incidentally, I think that the Government and the suggest, large numbers, but there seem to be difficulties Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government in securing them, so that is an area for the Government could perhaps give him credit for the idea of setting up to focus on. a curry college in the UK, because he and his federation have been pushing for it for a number of years. He Sport is also central to reducing youth crime and certainly sees the value in training young people here, as engaging young people in positive diversionary activities. opposed to bringing them over from abroad. I will not Sport is all about team play—working together with pursue that line of inquiry, because its link with sport is others—which might be something that they have not tenuous. experienced before. Moreover, exercise undoubtedly helps address the anger management issues that some young Mr Khan was hosting a fundraiser for the Royal people may have—it is a lot harder to be angry after Marsden at which I happened to meet Mike Fleet, who three hours of intense sporting activity. Sport is also runs Croydon Harriers. It takes its role in education about sportsmanship and being able to demonstrate to very seriously, to the extent that when it takes young other young people the value of fair play. Wrapped up people on a coach to an athletics meet, the team managers in all of that is the issue of diet, which is necessary not go around and ask the young people, “Where’s your only to succeed at sport at almost any level but to homework? Are you doing it? Do you need some help address diet failures, particularly if alcohol is an issue. with your Spanish?” It is, therefore, very hands-on in its support to those young people, as well as in coaching There are many examples of very successful sports them in their sporting activities and techniques. schemes—or schemes that use sport, which are slightly I asked Mike why he thought sport was successful different—that are used to tackle criminal behaviour or and whether it was because the young people win and it reduce the risk of offending. The hon. Gentleman has gives them a sense of worth. He replied that that was referred to Kickz, which is a very good project, and I not necessarily the reason, because, of course, they do will refer to a couple of statistics that highlight its not all win. He said that it is actually about things such success. There has been a 60% reduction in antisocial as feeling that they are part of a family. They see a behaviour in areas in which Kickz is active, and up to a group of young people and adults on a regular basis 20% reduction in the crimes that are most often associated who can provide them with support. Croydon Harriers with young people. Clearly, the project has the metrics work with a range of young people, from perhaps some to demonstrate that it is successful, but, like the hon. of the most challenging in Croydon to pupils from Gentleman, I think there is an issue about being able to Whitgift—whose behaviour I do not think is particularly demonstrate what types of projects are in fact successful. challenging—and provide them with support and a Anecdotal evidence is, of course, very good, but if the family environment. In fact, they will often bring in a Government, the voluntary sector and charities, or young person’s actual family and provide an environment social entrepreneurs want to invest in something, we in which they can work together, with sport as the need more than anecdotal evidence to support what is coalescing factor. Young people can also see their own and what is not successful. progress—they start out achieving a certain distance or I am fortunate to have Cricket for Change based in time and can then monitor their progress and realise my constituency. It does a lot of work on street cricket that they are taking positive steps. and engaging young people, both boys and girls, in it. Members may not have expected this, but the final Such is the success of its programmes that it has exported project that I would like to mention is the work of the them to other countries around the world, such as Angling Trust on urban fishing and getting young people Jamaica, Sri Lanka and South Africa, so it has taken from areas that we would least expect involved in fishing. the idea to challenging deprived areas and has bound However, a blogger responded to my suggestion that people together. It has just finished a three-year programme this was a good thing by saying that they did not want targeting the 10 communities in London with the highest oiks to ruin their fishing, so there may be some issues 9WH Sport and Youth Crime6 DECEMBER 2011 Sport and Youth Crime 10WH about ensuring that regular fishermen and women do more of a clubhouse feel and that community aspect is not feel threatened, but the project has an important far more evident than perhaps with many football teams. part to play. Those teams do a great job across the country.Often—how I have given examples of some very good schemes. can I put it?—they assemble on Hackney marshes on a Finally, I would like to go over the same ground as the Sunday and go for a drink afterwards, but the members hon. Gentleman. There are statistics and hard facts of the teams do not necessarily see each other from one about what is successful, and a lot of anecdotal evidence, week to the next. but we need to channel that into a strong body of I want to encourage the Home Office and the Minister evidence on which the Government and other groups to try to do what they can to support that programme. can base decisions about what types of sports schemes The Under-Secretary of State for Justice, my hon. Friend they should support. That is true for the whole area of the Member for Reigate (Mr Blunt), who is responsible criminal justice, for crime prevention and detection, for prisons, was very supportive of the scheme and, and for sport. I understand that a sports think-tank has indeed, still is. However, I know that Ministry of Justice just been set up. Andy Reed, who used to be the officials were initially concerned that allowing a contact Member of Parliament for Loughborough, Lord Addington sport into a youth offenders institute would introduce and a Conservative Peer whose name, unfortunately, I safeguarding issues around children. We seem to have cannot remember are on that think-tank. That organisation got over that, but I encourage the Minister to do what may want to consider the matter in terms of pulling he can to try to stress the positive aspect of sports as together the evidence. We need some joined-up government. opposed to erecting barriers. This is my last point. We know that the cost of A separate programme—the Wooden Spoon sending people to prison is £40,000 up to—who knows?— programme—essentially involves a group of teams that £200,000 for a very secure establishment. We want to go out and play and raise money for community projects. see some hard facts about the success of these projects That has been very successful; indeed, it has crossed in diverting young people away from crime, so that we codes, with the league and the union coming together to can offset the expenditure on those projects against the provide mutual support. The programme’s projects not savings that will be derived by having fewer young only tackle things such as disability and opportunities, people in our prisons. If the Government can achieve but, with the Young Men’s Christian Association, focus that, there will be a substantial improvement in our on NEETs. That has been successful in trying to tackle understanding of how we can tackle these problems. antisocial behaviour in deprived areas. My hon. Friend the Member for Folkestone and 10.1 am Hythe is a big Manchester United fan. I happen to be a Liverpool fan. After party conference this year, I was in Dr Thérèse Coffey (Suffolk Coastal) (Con): It is a Manchester, but I made the trip down to Speke in pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mr Dobbin, Liverpool. I was made very welcome there by the Liverpool in this important debate, and I congratulate my hon. football club community department. I pay particular Friend the Member for Folkestone and Hythe (Damian tribute to Bill Bygroves who is the community officer. Collins) on securing it. He has a focused team of people, and has shown true Anecdotally, we have all seen programmes that touch leadership since the scheme was set up in 2000. From us in understanding how sport has actively intervened what I could tell from my time there, the scheme has in people’s lives to put them on the straight and narrow gone from strength to strength and is broadening out or, indeed, to make them positive role models in their into a variety of functions, including addressing issues own communities and families. My hon. Friend has such as men’s health. already set out in substantial detail the wide landscape I want to focus on some of the work that the LFC within which many programmes operate. The Positive community department does with children and schools. Futures programme in Suffolk is run as part of a It employs some people who, by their own admission, national programme and has been a significant success. have strayed off the straight and narrow path but have It is funded by the Home Office drugs strategy directorate turned their lives around and have been encouraged by and I hope that the Minister may have some evidence of the positive association in the community with a brand its benefits. All of us can think of examples in our as strong as Liverpool football club. That brand association constituencies where such an approach has worked. has taken these programmes into places where things The Rugby Football Foundation, which has already that are not very cool, such as a local youth service, been mentioned, is involved with the Prison to Pitch might not reach. Of course, it is not only happening in initiative. I have been impressed by Sally Pettipher from Liverpool. We have heard about Manchester United the Rugby Football Foundation, who has described and I know Everton do it. In addition, the excellent that scheme to me. I have tried to help to organise some Kickz scheme has been mentioned. The LFC community funding and she has been very diligent in trying to get department has done something very good in systematically the initiative going, which works with people who are in associating something positive with a general challenge prison or a young offenders institute. The physical to attitudes and, critically, with talking about positive playing of rugby is a useful energy release exercise, but relationships. that is not the only beauty of the project. When people I have been shown a variety of material that has been leave prison or a young offenders institute, they are shared with many children across Liverpool. The scheme invited to join their local rugby club. The intention is works in such a way that, essentially, children from a that, instead of perhaps going back to the so-called class will spend time at a particular sports centre and family or friends who lead them astray or back into interact with people who work for the club. Various crime, they can have a new family within the rugby club. worksheets are used as part of its education curriculum, Rugby is particularly well set up for that because it has which talk about things such as “positive relationships,” 11WH Sport and Youth Crime6 DECEMBER 2011 Sport and Youth Crime 12WH

[Dr Thérèse Coffey] have been given out very effectively. I want to outline briefly why sport is important. If we understand what “tactics for families,” “respect for all,” “truth for youth,” sport is and why it is important, it becomes a no-brainer “drop the drugs,” “ban the bully,” “rule out the racist,” that it will perform the functions that we need to “shoot goals not guns” and “say no to knife crime.” As demonstrate statistically—because we are accountable hon. Members can see, very positive messages are associated politicians—before we spend money on it. It is very with leading football players such as Steven Gerrard important to understand what sport is. and because Stevie says so, kids will stand up and take I am president of my local boxing club, The National notice, which is very positive. Smelting Co Amateur Boxing club, and chair of the On other local activities, I must admit that I do not all-party group on boxing. As with many sports, boxing have children, but I always get a bit fed up when I meet is so important for many young people who have fallen younger people who say that there is nothing to do and out of all the normal authority measures. They have blame this, that and the other. If we look around us, we fallen out of school, because they do not see that it can see the great work that is done in every community offers anything for them. They have fallen out of the across this land, whether by volunteers who help to run council’s best attempts to engage them in its systems of the scouts and the guides and enjoy that kind of sport; social work, because they feel that they are dislocated those who are involved with work in lucky places such from authority. For many young people, the boxing as Manchester, Liverpool and other main conurbations club is the only rival identity to other less savoury where football and rugby teams proactively go out to identities that are offered to them. One young boxer help their local communities; or people who are involved said to me: with the local Army Cadet Force or similar organisations. “My life was a cul-de-sac of going into a gang. If I wanted an I genuinely believe that there is a lot out there for young identity, security, protection, feeling I am something, there was people to do, but sometimes we just need to encourage only one option for me and that was to join a gang. My local them in the right direction. boxing club provided an avenue off that cul-de-sac where I could find a family and identity.” Of course, many of those things are not seen as being very cool. Although the Archbishop of Canterbury Family and identity, particularly identity for young talks about civic society, he needs to go and engage with people, are massively important. We all remember our these people. Something we can all do is direct people school playground days and how important it was to be towards such organisations. One of the lessons we can a member of a group of friends for our own identity. learn is to associate positive brand ambassadors with Crucially, for many young people, sport is the first these initiatives, whether they are at a football club or a opportunity they have to have a traction on achievement. local church school hall youth club that meets on a In the riots, we saw a whole generation of young people Thursday night. We need to have such positive brand who felt that they had nothing to lose, so why not go off imagery and to encourage all our local celebrities and and do stupid things? They felt they had no traction on respected local people—that may even include Members achievement in their lives. They did not actually know of Parliament—to fly the flag for the volunteers who how to achieve. The word “aspiration” is bandied around are trying to make a difference with youth and sport. a lot, and the concept, included in the document, “Five days in August”, of hope and dreams is also bandied about a lot. There is a big, big difference between Jim Dobbin (in the Chair): In case hon. Members are having hopes and dreams, and having goals. A hope and interested, for the record, I should say that I am a a dream is something one might vaguely hope to get to. Glasgow Celtic fan. Lots of young people have hopes and dreams of being David Beckham, or a WAG. They do not have any idea 10.9 am of how to achieve those hopes and dreams. Charlotte Leslie (Bristol North West) (Con): It is a Sport begins to give young people a ladder to climb, pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mr Dobbin. from where they are now to where they think they want I congratulate and thank my hon. Friend the Member to be. Not everyone can be David Beckham. He is a very for Folkestone and Hythe (Damian Collins) for securing talented footballer. The narrative that society gives to the debate, which could not be more timely or more young people is that David Beckham became David important. I thank him and other hon. Members for Beckham by just appearing on TV one day in a football illustrating so effectively the statistical basis we have to kit, but David Beckham became David Beckham by demonstrate why sport is so important in tackling youth putting in hours and hours and hours of training and crime. hard work. The immense value of sports clubs—particularly boxing clubs for kids who will not engage with other There is also the value-for-money aspect. My hon. forms of society, because they feel they are too much Friend talked in a learned manner about boxing and the part of authority—is that they provide the first opportunity Tottenham boxing academy. What is so fascinating is to learn the very important lesson that my old swimming that, as an alternative pupil referral unit, it actually coach, Eric Henderson, taught me—no pain, no gain. costs a lot less than a regular PRU and is significantly To achieve something, one has to put in effort now, be it more successful. In difficult economic times, youth sport doing maths homework because one wants to be rich, is not only a good mechanism to tackle one of the big have a fast car and a very attractive wife, or be it putting issues of our time, which erupted in August, but an in a bit of effort going for a run and a sports training extremely valuable mechanism to deal with social problems session that one does not really want to do—because it that arise when we do not have much money to do so. is early in the morning, it is raining and one feels In my short time this morning, I do not want to tired—but one does because one wants to achieve something concentrate on anecdotes, because there are many, or in sporting life later on. That, of course, applies to the statistics and value-for-money figures, because they school, sport and life. It applies to getting a job. It 13WH Sport and Youth Crime6 DECEMBER 2011 Sport and Youth Crime 14WH applies to so many things. In fact, it is the citizenship The reason why I am so passionate about sport lesson about work and achievement—about teamwork, relates partly to my own background and partly to the learning how to win and learning how to lose—that is fact that I was the lead member for leisure on Swindon so often delivered in schools in a two-dimensional form borough council before I became a Member of Parliament. on a piece of paper, but which we need to deliver to I went to a school that was bottom of the league table in young people in a real form on our sports fields and in Worcestershire. We had many of the challenges that are our sports clubs. often raised in debates connected to this subject. Two of We have the most extraordinary opportunity on our my best friends when I was growing up ended up horizon next year. It is a once in a generation event: the spending time at Her Majesty’s pleasure. Some would Olympic games. We have just come through a summer say that, now that I am in Parliament, perhaps I did not that has rocked our nation. There is a problem with do better than those other two people, but among our youth disengagement that we all knew existed. My group of friends, the main reason why the majority of goodness me, communities up and down the country us did not follow my two friends who did go to prison knew it existed, because it was on their doorsteps daily. was, frankly, that we were too tired at the end of the day It erupted with massive force in London in August. The because of sport. We were influenced by role models on whole country looked at our young people and asked, television. We predominantly played football, but, if it “How have we let this happen?” was the Wimbledon fortnight, out came the tennis rackets. If the Tour de France was on, out came the Next year, we have the most iconic solution to that bikes from the shed. If it was the Ashes cricket, out problem—we have the Olympic games. I beg came the cricket bats. This is a serious point: we were Government—I will do everything I can to work with genuinely too tired to cause too much trouble. By the them—not to let the opportunity of an Olympic legacy time the sun went down, we were more than ready to go go to waste. On the ground, people know that sport home and be watered and fed. works. If we understand the basic psychology of kids and all human beings, it is very apparent why sport I want to focus my comments on the opportunities works. We urgently need statistics, and the statistics that I benefited from and that we as a society can base around it, to justify expenditure we need to make. provide for young children. When I was first elected, We need to put that at the heart of tackling the massive probably one of my more controversial moves was to social problem that erupted this year. What better support the move to defend the school sports partnership opportunity is there to do that than when our British programme. I was a big champion of that scheme, Olympic champions stand up on those podiums with because its whole principle was to provide sporting those medals that I have no doubt they will win, saying, opportunities for those who are not particularly naturally “Not only is this a gold medal because I was fastest or competitive. If someone is gifted at sport, invariably jumped highest on the day, not only is this a gold medal that is because their parents have encouraged them to say I was the best, but this gold medal also means a from a young age, and they will therefore have been lot to me because of all the work I put in to get there”? provided with plenty of opportunities. The vast majority Not everyone can be an Olympic champion, but everyone of children, however, need a bit more encouragement. has their own personal best that they can achieve. It The one thing that the school sports partnership programme would be a great message to have every British Olympian does very well is offer a wide programme of opportunities. standing and inspiring our young people to achieve. We There is a sport for everyone. When I refer to sport, it is can only do that if they have the rungs on the bottom of not always necessarily the obvious sports that we might the ladder in our communities at grass-roots sports level see in the Olympics or on the television, but such sports in our schools and in our amateur sports clubs. as street dance—basically, anything that can make young people active and constructive. Once again, I thank my hon. Friend the Member for Folkestone and Hythe for securing this debate, which We also need to encourage more coaches—a number could not be more timely. We do not have much time to of hon. Members have already touched on that—but act and I urge the Government to address this issue with also day-to-day volunteers. When I talk to sports clubs, all seriousness. their biggest challenge is to find someone to be the club secretary or treasurer, and someone to fill in all the 10.16 am complicated forms and to organise the fixtures. There is a real deficit of people to fill those roles. In a society, Justin Tomlinson (North Swindon) (Con): It is an people who are not particularly sports-minded can still absolute pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, play a constructive role. I welcome the work of the Mr Dobbin. I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member Football Foundation with its funding; rather than only for Folkestone and Hythe (Damian Collins) on securing the traditional provision of a brand-new, shiny set of this important debate. football kits for a variety of sports clubs, it is looking at I am passionate about the positive role that sport can the legacy and encouraging more coaches and volunteers, play in our local communities. I support that positive so that more people get an opportunity to benefit. role through encouraging a healthy and active lifestyle Charlotte Leslie: Does my hon. Friend agree that, if that improves behaviour, teamwork and enjoyment. Sport we are going to talk about the big society, for example, can channel young people’s energy and boost self-esteem. there are few areas where it is more prevalent than in Sport can be a forum for enjoyment, friendship and sport? personal fulfilment. Sport can reach and change young people by improving their life chances, increasing Justin Tomlinson: I am passionate about the merits of educational attainment and building life skills. Sport the big society, and sport can be absolutely at the heart can achieve some of the social outcomes that will help of it. We can all play a role, even if it is not the transform our society, and sport can be used a tool to traditional one of leading on the front line in the benefit disadvantaged young children. sporting team. 15WH Sport and Youth Crime6 DECEMBER 2011 Sport and Youth Crime 16WH

[Justin Tomlinson] and, once the clocks hit 4, it cost an absolute fortune to get access to those facilities. I represented a high-density During the 10 years that I was a councillor, four of housing estate with limited open spaces, but with wonderful which were spent as the lead member for leisure, the one expanses of open space behind high fences priced out of thing that I was most proud of was setting up the Sports the community’s reach. As a society, we need to look at Forum, which brought together about 60 different sporting that. organisations from throughout Swindon. They would I welcome some recent Government measures—in meet once a quarter to share best practice, to identify particular, the introduction of a “troops to teachers” additional funding, to help increase their presence in programme. When I visit schools, particularly primary the local media and to share facilities. It was a huge schools, the heads are saying that their big challenge in success. providing sporting opportunities is not necessarily having In a brief deviation, we had the extremely sad news a pool of teachers who have the confidence or the skills that Roger Byrne, who was the lead officer for leisure, to deliver a wide variety of sport. If we can get some of passed away last week. He was one of the main driving those troops who become teachers into primary schools, forces behind the Sports Forum, and during my 10 years they would be apt to offer such opportunities. on the council, he was easily the most respected officer Insurance continues to be a big burden, particularly that I and many others ever worked with. for young teachers who are extremely expensive to From the Swindon Sports Forum, an example of how insure for school minibuses, which limits the opportunities different organisations coming together can make a to go and play sport in school competitions or at the huge difference is Esprit Gymnastics, an excellent not- regional or district level. I keep calling on the Government for-profit organisation promoting gymnastics. It used a to broker a national agreement, with their collective facility that was full to capacity, with about 400 children power of hundreds and thousands of schools, to get a a week benefiting, but it was so popular that the better deal for the younger staff. neighbouring units on the industrial park where it was Let us look at legacy and the schools Olympics. As based complained, saying that there was nowhere to has been mentioned, the Olympics are a wonderful park after school times, because all the parents were opportunity to inspire young people who, however, then descending, and that either it should move away or they need the opportunity to play the sports in which we are would move away. successful. Whichever sports we are successful in are the Suddenly, a successful gymnastics organisation was ones that the children wish to replicate, so it is really faced with being homeless. Through the Sports Forum important that the schools Olympics that we are driving and Swindon borough council, an alternative facility forward are taken on board and utilised, so that everyone was found—at the old Headlands school, which was has regular opportunities, especially once the razzmatazz being bulldozed to create a new academy, although a of the Olympics has passed. £4 million sports hall had only been built a couple of There have been many mentions of mighty premier years earlier. We faced the embarrassing situation of league football clubs such as Liverpool and Manchester bulldozing a relatively new £4 million sports hall, and to United, so I will throw in Swindon Supermarine of the cut a long story short, a deal was done and Esprit seventh tier of the Football League, who I worked with Gymnastics moved into the sports hall site, while the to secure funding for from Capita, to pay for a sports school was bulldozed around it. Esprit paid a level of programme for the most challenging schools in both the rent to the council and managed the facility. Swindon constituencies. It was about not only providing I went to visit last Monday and not only does the site an opportunity to play football but helping with nutritional now have a much bigger gymnastics facility, but the advice—in some cases, the basic necessity of a meal—as Kirsty Farrow dance academy and the Leadership Martial well as providing kit. Again, that has been exceptionally Arts organisation are in place as well. From 450 children popular. a week benefiting from a facility, we now have 2,000 Finally, sport needs to work more with the youth children a week. This is all washing its face, and it is a service. In the old days, the traditional youth service fantastic facility. I met with parents who were dropping and the traditional sports club, which was for the most off one child for dance, one for gymnastics and another competitively and technically able children, would never for martial arts. Some do different activities on different mix. The two should be one and the same. In all local nights, and we even have a shop in the facility that authorities, the head of sports should also be the head provides all the specialist clothing. It is a really good of youth. When I was head of leisure, I touched on the example of organisations coming together, led by volunteers, youth service briefly, and I visited a lot of those traditional to transform a number of young children’s opportunities. youth centres, which might have only six or eight children Other opportunities go back to when I was younger on a Friday evening. Yet I would go to the ice-skating and playing lots of sport: the absolute, desperate need disco and 600 teenagers were whizzing around the rink, for accessible, usable open spaces, which I talked about chasing whoever was their flavour of the month and in my maiden speech. The turf on the football pitches keeping themselves active and constructive. It always does not have to be premier league quality. I played on used to frustrate me that sport could be used to engage an almost vertical hill that worked very well; because with children, whether street dance, ice skating or football. two of my friends, the twins Matthew and Paul Gilbert, The youth service needs to get out of its fixed facility were so much better than we were, they had the privilege and park itself outside wherever sport is enticing children. of kicking uphill all day long, while the rest of us got to Recently, I spoke to Stratton parish council, which is kick downhill—we still lost. considering spending somewhere in the region of £4,000 The other frustration that I saw when I was a borough or £5,000 on graffiti walls, which I am utterly opposed councillor was to do with private finance initiatives and to. I said that it would surely be far better to spend that access. Schools in my old ward of the borough were PFI money on hiring some coaches, whether for boxing or 17WH Sport and Youth Crime6 DECEMBER 2011 Sport and Youth Crime 18WH for football, who could come in on a Friday night—the about the value for money of those programmes, which council would not have to charge itself for opening up is a key point to which I shall return. If it is recognised its own facilities in community centres and school that the benefits accrue not just in the short term, but in grounds—and those coaches, on £30 or £40 an hour, the long term, it is necessary also to recognise whose could provide entertainment and a constructive outlook responsibility it is to support that work to secure the for young children. gain. My plea to the Minister is to keep driving home the The challenge for us all is not to make the case for need to create opportunities. The facilities do not necessarily whether sport can play an important role in helping have to be fantastic, wonderful or driven by the most young people to achieve, thereby in tackling crime and efficient, sports-minded people, but give young people under-achievement, but to say how to do that. The hon. an opportunity—they are creative enough to take advantage Member for North Swindon mentioned school sports, of it. If we can keep them engaged actively, as I was, and I pay tribute to the support that he gave to many of they will be too shattered to cause any trouble. us who were deeply worried by the proposals to cut the school sports programme. I want to put on record my 10.28 am personal thanks to my right hon. Friends the Members for Leigh (Andy Burnham) and for Dulwich and West Stella Creasy (Walthamstow) (Lab/Co-op): It is a Norwood (Tessa Jowell) for their work in improving pleasure to speak in the debate. I congratulate my fellow dramatically the teaching of sport through schools and red—in many senses, from what he said today—the for having the far-sightedness to recognise its value. hon. Member for Folkestone and Hythe (Damian Collins) on securing the debate, which is timely, as has been said. School sports drove up participation in high-quality There is a large degree of consensus in the Chamber physical education for our young people from only 25% about the importance of sport to our young people. I in 1997 to more than 90% in 2010. The school sport wish to talk about that, about some of the challenges in partnership, to which the hon. Member for North Swindon achieving the outcomes that we all say that we can referred, was vital because it enabled the infrastructure achieve through sport and about why that matters. that made participation possible to be put together, The first point to make on the record, perhaps with including the people who organised the games, provided an exception for the hon. Member for North Swindon the coaching and looked for the range of sports that (Justin Tomlinson)—I take issue with his humbleness young people want to take part in. When the Government about the impact of sport on his own achievements—is foolhardily tried to dismantle that network, there was, that we all recognise, as the hon. Member for Folkestone rightly, an outcry. It is welcome that they have backed and Hythe said, that sport is not enough on its own. It is down to some degree, although many of us who still not about containing or diverting young people, but work with our local school sport co-ordinators are about the relationship that good, positive sporting activities worried about the impact of those changes. and those who undertake them can play in securing The issue is not just what can be done in schools. achievement for our young people. Therefore, it is important Critically, it involves the role of the voluntary sector. to see sport not simply as a form of diversion but as a Some fantastic examples have been mentioned today. I form of pathway to that achievement, and that is how have worked in the scouting movement, and I want to we get the impact that we are all talking about. Not only put on the record my support for voluntary organisations do the coaches in our own communities keep kids off and the number of activities that they could provide. the street, but they keep them on that path towards the We are all clear that not just one sport is involved. straight and narrow, towards the things that they could Indeed, the scouting movement prides itself on being do in life. able to provide 200 different activities for young people This is not just about young people’s formal exercise each week and recognises that a range of provision is activities—I take on board the points made by the right needed to engage with the range of young people. hon. Member for Carshalton and Wallington (Tom Brake) and the hon. Member for North Swindon—but I see the work of organisations such as Kickz in my about the soft skills that they learn from being involved community, and I want to put on the record my thanks in sport and working with sports coaches and other to the Leyton Orient community sports programme for young people. Those skills include team leadership, promoting that work. The hon. Member for Folkestone team work and participation, and what they offer not and Hythe referred to the teenage Kickz research. We just on the pitch, but in the playground and the classroom. know the impact of its work in pulling back young The importance of data and examples to prove what we people who are at risk of antisocial behaviour, and we have all known for many years—this applies especially know that that makes a difference and is valuable not to those of us who have worked in the youth voluntary just for their antisocial behaviour but for their future sector—about those relationships and what sport gives achievement. He also referred to a social return on to young people is vital to understand in whose interest investment. Such programmes with the right people investment in sport provision is and to secure those bring rewards that we could not achieve through sport outcomes. provision alone. We have talked about different interventions, or I pay tribute to some of the grass-roots organisations. alliterations, whether prison to pitch, cricket for change, Many hon. Members have talked about fantastic large or troops for teachers, and they all show that thinking organisations that work with young people. I also pay smartly about how to bring those skills to young people— tribute to Manchester United for inspiring me in many the right people to work with to engage them in those different ways. I share sympathy with the hon. Member activities—reaps rewards that last not just while taking for Suffolk Coastal (Dr Coffey) for her support for part in the sport, but for a generation. We also talked Liverpool, and I appreciate the work of the Liverpool 19WH Sport and Youth Crime6 DECEMBER 2011 Sport and Youth Crime 20WH

[Stella Creasy] We cannot get away from how to fund such activities. My worry today is that cuts mean that organisations community sport programme. Many of us know of and programmes such as Kickz and Leyton Orient’s smaller organisations in our communities, including community sports programme are under pressure as a Salaam Peace and Asianos in my constituency, that result of some of the Government’s choices. If we all encourage young men to take part in football and accept the case that good sports activity can provide cricket. They engage with young people with mentors that longer-term function in young people’s lives, we from similar backgrounds who recognise the role of should be fighting for resources to go to those organisations sport in providing soft skills and spend their lives and making the case for investment now and in the encouraging young people to take part. future, as a way to protect longer-term achievement. All such organisations—I want to turn to risks—show The issue is not just the practical provision of services, the importance of joined-up provision. The funding but how that can help to reduce crime. The Minister for such organisations often comes from a range of may not be responsible for the allocation of budgets to sources, including public and voluntary sources, and the Department for Communities and Local Government, philanthropically from the private sector. That is a but he is responsible for community safety grants. We concern that I want to put to the Minister. We all have seen a massive slashing of those grants and the recognise, because of the relationship to achievement, very money that was helping the police and local authorities the value for money of investing in sport and providing to work creatively with local community groups to sporting activities not just early in children’s lives, but provide outreach activities. For example, in Lambeth, throughout the critical periods of transition to adulthood, one of the boroughs that was affected by the riots, the but how can we ensure that that happens not just for the community safety grant has been reduced from £691,000 few, but for all young people? in 2010-11 to just £276,000 in 2012-13. Hounslow is One of my concerns, having worked in the voluntary facing a 32% cut in its youth offending budget next year. and community sector in providing for young people, as That matters because the funding allows people to well as in local government, is the impact of some of the think creatively about how to engage with young people cuts on our ability to deliver such services. One challenge and to do more than just tackle crime; it can prevent it for local authorities, which often fund such work initially by working with those young people, but that is under and are often a vital support for voluntary organisations threat. at grass-roots and national level, is that the speed of the I want to flag up for the Minister the fact that the cuts means that they are cutting the very relationships funding cuts for local government are a real risk to that we all believe are important for young people, some of their key provision of facilities. The hon. because there was no time to find efficiencies, to renegotiate Member for North Swindon spoke effectively about the contracts or to share services. Inevitably, funding for the importance of school buildings. The extended schools voluntary sector, especially non-statutory services such programme was doing exactly what he was asking for. It as youth services, has suffered most. No one is denying was encouraging schools to consider how to open up that money must be saved, but it will clearly be a false their facilities. I represent an area in north-east London, economy if the very services and relationships that we and I am conscious of the lack of space to undertake know make a difference to our young people are the sporting activities. There is a relationship between playing first to be cut. sport at school and taking part in sporting events organised by voluntary organisations outside the school, but somewhere is needed to do that work. Will he make Damian Collins: On priorities, the previous Government a case for revising that decision? I am sure that he will decided not to support Kickz from the investment ask where the money will come from. budget of the Department for Culture, Media and Sport because the programme was not designed purely May I encourage the Minister to talk to his colleagues to increase participation. Some people may say that it in the Department for Education about the national had a stronger function, but that function has been citizen service? There are questions about the scheme’s recognised by the Home Office in particular under the value for money, and the Education Committee has current Government. Total money is important, but so highlighted concerns about the costs versus outputs is deciding on priority areas of spending. that we will get from the service as it is currently constructed. If the Minister recognises the social return on investment in sport in tackling youth crime and also Stella Creasy: The hon. Gentleman is absolutely right in delivering achievement, I suggest that he work with to talk about priorities, but he is being a little disingenuous his colleagues across the Government to make the case about Kickz, because it received public funding from for a better use of the funding that is available for youth other agencies. This is not just about particular projects; provision. the case that he made powerfully, with which I agree, is that it is about the activities that we ask youth providers Charlotte Leslie: Does the hon. Lady recognise that to undertake. Indeed, I would be critical of those who much of the purpose of the citizen service scheme is to simply offer sport without asking what it can do in the engage young people in the idea of volunteering and long-term for young people and those who say that it is getting involved in their communities? On no planet will enough just to get young people off the streets. That is the Government be able to fund the entirety of amateur why I challenge the hon. Member for North Swindon, youth sport across the country. The national citizen who suggested that all that mattered was that he was service scheme plays a valuable role in introducing tired at the end of the day. I suspect that participating in young people into their communities, so that they too sport, working with other young people and organising can coach young people and play an active part in their sport made a difference to his confidence and probably community. It cannot be measured in the simplistic also to his life chances. terms suggested by the hon. Lady. 21WH Sport and Youth Crime6 DECEMBER 2011 Sport and Youth Crime 22WH

Stella Creasy: The hon. Lady ought to listen to her We should acknowledge that most young people are colleague, the hon. Member for Folkestone and Hythe, not involved in crime. Often in our debates—for example, who talked about priorities. In a time of financial in yesterday’s debate about the causes of the riots—we austerity, the national citizen service is a very expensive ignore the fact that the vast majority of young people scheme for a very small amount of time. If we are not do not engage in crime. Sport has a value to them, able to fund everything—yet we are all in this together—we which is separate to our discussion this morning. It is have to look at what money is being spent on young also important to state that, apart from recognising the people. I advise the hon. Lady to look at the Government’s value that sport may have for reducing crime, we are commitment to fund the national citizen service for all committed, as I am sure the previous Government were, 16-year-olds and the amount of money that that implies. to reducing youth crime. That will continue to be important She has made a powerful case about value for money for the communities affected by crime. We must prevent and the cost of some of the alternative schemes that young people getting drawn into a life of crime and into support young people, but perhaps she should consider a cycle of criminality from which it can be difficult to which is the greater priority at this point in time? I have escape. Providing routes out and choices, which are so a background in working with a national scheme that important at an early age, is what this debate has been provides exactly that sort of citizen service through the about. Indeed, there was a lot of discussion about that uniformed organisations. No one is suggesting that in the context of the riots. What positive or alternative such schemes do not have merit, but in a time of options can be given to young people who may otherwise financial austerity, it is absolutely right to ask about the be drawn into criminality? What alternative structures, Government’s priorities, especially given the powerful as it were, can be offered? case that Conservative Members have made about the impact of sports provision and the importance of working Tom Brake: On the subject of routes out, does the with voluntary organisations and providing services not Minister have the capacity to look at what activities the just for eight weeks in the summer but throughout a authorities in areas where the riots took place are young person’s life, so that they can have mentoring and planning in terms of sporting and diversionary activities? support, not just to avoid antisocial behaviour, but to In Croydon, 500 people were arrested and 400 charged. secure achievement. I suspect that 200 or 300 will have gone to prison. They will be coming back to Croydon, because 80% of them Dr Thérèse Coffey: The hon. Lady suggests that the were from Croydon. It is important that the Government systems that we have had seem to have worked. It is fair monitor what will be in place to take those people on to say that this new initiative is a seedcorn project, but I board when they return. think that it has great potential. We should not keep throwing money at projects that may not have had the Nick Herbert: We will come to a discussion about impact that the hon. Lady suggested. who is responsible for providing such activity. My hon. Friend the Member for Bristol North West (Charlotte Stella Creasy: I absolutely agree with the hon. Lady, Leslie) described somebody who had gone into what he and I therefore advise her to read the Education felt was a cul-de-sac as a result of gang activity, but Committee’s report on the national citizen service in boxing had been the avenue out. Routes out are important. which questions were raised about the scheme’s value My hon. Friend the Member for North Swindon (Justin for money and efficacy. That is the key point. If we all Tomlinson) spoke about the route that he found out of agree that sport makes a difference to young people’s what might have been an alternative career option such achievement, we have to look at how we can use the as his friends pursued, which was time spent detained at resources that we do have to make sure that we get Her Majesty’s pleasure. He has found a different course, results. I will end on that point. The Minister needs to although many would suggest that there is not much champion the work that we all agree is important and difference between that role and that of his friends. he needs to champion the resourcing, otherwise many Nevertheless, there has been general agreement in the young people will not have access to the opportunities debate. There has been no dispute about the value of that we all agree make such a difference, and we all sport in having a positive impact on behaviour. It teaches recognise that Britain would be poorer for it. control, self-discipline and the importance of teamwork. It unites people and provides opportunities for people, wherever they come from. Sporting activity is of huge 10.43 am value in preventing offending. Where offending has The Minister for Policing and Criminal Justice (Nick taken place, sport can play an enormous part as an Herbert): I welcome you to the Chair, Mr Dobbin. I intervention to break the cycle that I described. We congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Folkestone must be careful to ensure that it is not the only intervention. and Hythe (Damian Collins) on securing this debate There may be other causes of offending behaviour that and on speaking with great expertise and clear conviction need to be addressed in parallel. Whether there are about the importance not just of sport, which is something learning difficulties or various addictions, sport can be that we can all agree on, but specifically the role that one of the means to help an offender, but other interventions sport can play in reducing youth crime. It is a profitable may be equally important. subject to debate and some positive contributions have There was also agreement about the importance of been made. I noted with a certain amount of concern role models, particularly the powerful role models provided his suggestion that there needed to be a lead Minister to in sport. Such role models can of course provide a co-ordinate across government. He plainly put in a catalyst for change. My right hon. Friend the Member credible bid for his own potential role in that respect, so for Carshalton and Wallington (Tom Brake) talked some of us will have to watch ourselves very carefully. about the particular value of sports leaders, but I am 23WH Sport and Youth Crime6 DECEMBER 2011 Sport and Youth Crime 24WH

[Nick Herbert] position more credible. Like any Government, we have to find savings. When it left office, the hon. Lady’s party sure he did not mean to imply that those were simply was committed to £40 billion of unspecified spending national sports leaders. Of course, national figures in reductions and knew that savings had to be made. So sport, as mentioned by other Members, have a significant far, the reduction in front-line policing numbers has impact on young people. The mentors described by my been just 2%; there is no need for the front line to be right hon. Friend work at local level and come from all affected, provided that police forces make savings in the sorts of places. They can show a leadership role, and right way. Such partisan points do not assist the debate. assist and encourage young people to engage in sporting Several hon. Members mentioned the importance of activity. That is equally important. the Olympics in offering something of lasting—rather I spoke recently to a police community support officer than just temporary—value to this country and its who, in addition to his community work, devotes much young people, and we want to harness the power of the of his private time to working with young people and games to provide new opportunities for young people to providing coaching in local sporting activities. He felt take part in competitive sport. My hon. Friend the that it was important to assist those young people to Member for North Swindon mentioned the school games, take part in a constructive activity that would prevent and such activities will be particularly important. Since them from getting into trouble. Such volunteers and the issue of funding has been raised, I will point out local heroes matter just as much as national role models; that over £128 million of lottery and Government funding I agreed with my hon. Friend the Member for Suffolk is being invested to support school games, and that is Coastal (Dr Coffey) when she said that it was important underpinned by continued investment to increase the to fly the flag for volunteers, and to celebrate them and numbers of new clubs, coaches and volunteers working recognise what they do. in sport with young people.

Damian Collins: In the United States there is a Charlotte Leslie: Will the Minister recognise the work programme called Badges for Baseball—all these of the Football Foundation? It carries out fantastic programmes have snappy names—in which the police work not only by efficiently using funds to renovate organise baseball and softball league games directly community sports facilities but by putting structures in with young people. Does the Minister feel that there place so that those facilities are more self-sustaining may be additional scope for police to be directly involved and do not require so much Government funding. That with such programmes in the UK? is the kind of long-term legacy that it would be good to see more of throughout the country after the Olympics. Nick Herbert: I am sure that there is scope. Equally, if I were to ask any of the 43 police forces in England and Nick Herbert: I am happy to recognise that; there is Wales, I bet that they would supply good examples of clearly a role for civil society, sport clubs and organisations, activities in which local police officers are already engaged. as well as for the Government and bodies that provide I am sure, however, that they would accept my hon. public funding. My hon. Friend the Member for Folkestone Friend’s encouragement in the right spirit. They play an and Hythe mentioned Kickz and Hitz as examples of important role in the community. programmes that are driven by national sporting I reject the characterisation of the police that was organisations and have a real impact on the ground. offered yesterday in research commissioned by The StreetChance is an initiative that promotes cricket, and Guardian. It suggested that some hostility to the police StreetGames works with national governing bodies to is necessary, but in fact the development of neighbourhood support athletics, table tennis, handball, gymnastics, policing and the community interaction carried out by badminton and rowing. Through the initiatives of such the police is important and something that we must national sporting bodies, it is possible to reach out and maintain and continue to develop. offer young people the opportunity to engage in a multitude of sports. Stella Creasy: The Minister and I agree that it is In the remaining time available, I wish to pick up on important for the police to interact with young people some specific points raised by my hon. Friend. He was over things other than criminal behaviour, so that trust clear that he was not calling for a general increase in can be built and young people can see the police as sporting participation, and that targeted intervention— being on their side. What assessment has the Minister rather than just dealing with crime—was the objective. I made of the effect that cuts to police numbers and the agree with him. He specifically called for robust data on safer neighbourhood teams will have on the ability of such interventions, and for research to identify whether the police to participate in sports games, to be on the they provide value for money.That general call is welcomed street and to have that relationship with young people? by the Government. The whole thrust of our criminal justice reform programme is to move to a situation in Nick Herbert: One departure from an otherwise which we are much clearer about the outcomes that consensual debate was the utterly predictable statement programmes deliver. When resources are tight, it is made by the hon. Lady when she laid at the door of the particularly important to ensure that money is being Government cuts that, in her assessment, will mean that well spent, and that is why we are increasingly moving none of the positive activities under discussion can take towards payment by results in the delivery of criminal place. She described the choices that the Government justice interventions, so that we can be certain that we are making, but we make such decisions because the are getting the outcomes we need. economy is in difficulty and we inherited debt from the In spite of the challenge of public spending, previous Government. Some contrition and responsibility Government-funded programmes are continuing, for that on the part of the hon. Lady might make her specifically in relation to youth crime. The Positive 25WH Sport and Youth Crime 6 DECEMBER 2011 26WH

Futures programme will continue until the end of 2013; Mental Health (Veterans) thereafter, elected police and crime commissioners will have a budget that they can distribute for similar 11 am programmes, should they so choose. The Positive Futures programme delivers sports and arts-based activities that Hazel Blears (Salford and Eccles) (Lab): I am very target and support vulnerable 10 to 19-year-olds in grateful to have secured the debate. It has attracted some of our most disadvantaged communities. interest from hon. Members on both sides of the House, Although I accept my hon. Friend’s injunction about who have offered me their support. Many hon. Members, targeted interventions, it is important to ensure that in all parties, have pursued the issues relating to veterans school children have access to sporting facilities—my for a considerable time and have been very effective in hon. Friend the Member for North Swindon also raised securing improvements in the way in which the country that point—and that physical education is valued in looks after and supports veterans. schools. Physical education will continue to be compulsory I am here today because of a very special young man, for all pupils following the review of the national curriculum, Mr Neil Blower, who is one of my constituents. He is and we are taking action to ensure that young people in here to observe the debate. Incidentally, that is because local communities are not deprived of access to playing of much appreciated help from Virgin West Coast Trains. fields and sporting facilities. We are glad that he has been able to make it here today. As part of Sport England’s £135 million “Places, Neil is 28. He served in the Royal Tank Regiment for six People, Play” legacy programme, the Minister for Sport years. He served a tour of duty as a peacekeeper in and the Olympics, and Sport England, recently launched Kosovo and he was involved in the invasion of Iraq. He a protecting playing fields initiative—a £10 million fund was in his tank when it was attacked at a vehicle to protect and improve sports fields across the country. checkpoint in Basra and he had the terrible experience The programme will fund projects that create, develop of watching his sergeant be attacked and killed. He saw and improve playing fields for sporting and community for himself the real and terrible horrors of war. use, and offer long-term protection of those sites for In 2005, Neil was discharged from the Army, suffering sport. Sport England will run five £2 million funding from post-traumatic stress disorder as a result of the rounds over the next three years, investing between horrific experiences that he had undergone. When Neil £20,000 and £50,000 in schemes such as buying new turned up at my surgery, I did not know what to expect. playing field land, improving the condition of pitches I thought that there would be issues about the practical through drainage, or bringing disused sports fields back help for veterans with mental health problems—issues into use. That is important; the issue is not only about about housing, employment and all the things that we role models, access and funding schemes; we must also associate with people adjusting to civilian life. What I ensure that facilities are available both inside and outside did not appreciate was that I would meet someone who schools. is incredibly articulate, passionate, committed and Again, I congratulate my hon. Friend on securing determined. Neil Blower is a very special individual this debate. The Government accept the value of sport indeed. I wanted to help him as much as I could in any in reducing crime, and that responsibility is shared by event, but our discussion was quite enlightening to me. them, local authorities, and by members of civil society He told me not only of the problems that he had and sporting organisations. I am sure that all hon. encountered when he left the Army—finding a home, Members will have listened carefully to the contributions looking for a job and trying to pick up the pieces of a made by my hon. Friend and others during the debate normal life—but that he had discovered a new talent, a today. passion for writing, which had helped him to come to terms with the horrors that he witnessed during his Army service. He gave me his book to read. It is called “Shell Shock: the diary of Tommy Atkins”. There is a warning on the front cover that it contains strong language, and it certainly does, but it also contains a deep insight and a profound humanity. I have read the book. It has the power to move people and to make them laugh. It certainly made me laugh, but it also moved me to tears. As I said, the book is called “Shell Shock: the diary of Tommy Atkins.” We all know the words of Rudyard Kipling in the poem “Tommy”: “For it’s Tommy this, an’ Tommy that, an’ ‘Chuck him out, the brute!’ But it’s ‘Saviour of ’is country’ when the guns begin to shoot”. Neil’s book is the diary of an ordinary soldier who has served in Iraq and Afghanistan, who has watched his friends die, who feels guilty that he has survived and who is struggling to come to terms with civilian life. If that sounds familiar, it’s because it is. That is why this debate is so welcome. Luckily, combat stress and post-traumatic stress are now widely recognised by our armed forces, but that was not always the case. During the first world war, 27WH Mental Health (Veterans)6 DECEMBER 2011 Mental Health (Veterans) 28WH

[Hazel Blears] Combat Stress provides very practical help. It is establishing 14 community outreach teams across the 266 British soldiers were executed for desertion, 18 for country. It has three short-stay treatment centres and it cowardice, seven for leaving their posts, five for disobeying wants to enhance the clinical care that it provides at a lawful command and two for casting their weapons those centres; it wants to provide better clinical care. aside. Some of those men were no doubt victims of shell That is one of the uses to which any additional funds shock. Their families had to live not just with the loss of should be put. These are very specialised areas of their brothers, husbands and sons, but with the shame, intervention, and giving people the highest-quality clinical anger and humiliation of their deaths at the hands of support is very important indeed. Since 2005, Combat the state. In 2006, a conditional posthumous pardon Stress has seen a 72% increase in demand for its specialist was granted in respect of those individuals. That was a services catering for veterans’ mental health problems. big turning point in how the country approaches these The services are free of charge to veterans, so they have matters. We have come a long way in recent years in to be financed through fundraising and from public recognising the problems experienced by those who sources as well. have been in battle, and Governments of both parties A number of veterans leave the armed forces with have taken action to provide improved health services very severe psychological wounds. Post-traumatic stress for both physical injuries and mental health problems, disorder can go on for a long time—for years, in fact. but there is still more for us to do. These conditions are not susceptible to easy treatment. I pay tribute to Combat Stress, which does a tremendous Therefore there needs to be a sustained commitment to job in helping veterans and is the UK’s leading military funding and support for organisations such as Combat charity specialising in the care of veterans’ mental health. Stress. It looks after people who have post-traumatic stress disorder, anxiety, depression, sometimes phobias and Combat Stress also offers a 24-hour helpline. That certainly nightmares and flashbacks—all the things provides confidential help not just to people who have associated with having been in the heat of battle and been in the military, but, crucially, to their families. We having a mental wound as a result. sometimes forget the huge impact on the families of veterans suffering from mental health problems. If people Last year, Combat Stress received more than 1,400 commonly have nightmares and panic attacks, lose their new referrals—that is the scale of the problem. It has a temper and occasionally become violent, the impact on current caseload of more than 4,600 individuals, including families can be enormous. The 24-hour helpline is therefore 211 who have served in Afghanistan and 583 Iraq a practical way for people to get emergency help when a veterans. In March 2010, its patron, His Royal Highness situation gets out of control. the Prince of Wales, launched the Enemy Within appeal on behalf of Combat Stress. That is a three-year fundraising Combat Stress has an expanding outreach service. It campaign to try to ensure that Combat Stress has the has a team of mental health practitioners, community capacity to be able to continue to treat the increasing psychiatric nurses and regional welfare officers. It has numbers of people who are now, happily, coming forward three centres in Shropshire, Surrey and Ayrshire. In with the problems that they have developed. I understand September, it introduced a six-week veterans programme, that on average it takes someone who has developed which provides enhanced treatment for people with anxiety and depression after having experienced the complicated presentations—it is intended really to dig horrors of battle an unbelievable 13 years to come deep and to delve into all the symptoms people exhibit. forward. For some, it will be longer, and for others it Combat Stress also has a well-being and rehabilitation will be a shorter period, but that length of time indicates programme, which is available to all the veterans in the the embarrassment and shame that people still feel and short-stay treatment centres. The programme uses a the stigma that there still is around mental health problems. really structured occupational therapy model, which Of course, that is not limited to military life; there is still draws on best practice in civilian mental health. It a huge stigma about mental health problems across includes employment mentoring and life skills workshops, society as a whole. But I think that, when people have and it deals with the practical issues of rehabilitation so been in combat situations, it is even worse. that people can take up social activities in the community, which they may have lost touch with while they had Sir Paul Beresford (Mole Valley) (Con): I am delighted post-traumatic stress disorder. to hear the praise for Combat Stress, which is located in Combat Stress is absolutely the leading organisation my constituency. The right hon. Lady mentioned the in this field in terms of expertise. It now has a partnership figures. Is she aware that the rise in applications is agreement with the Ministry of Defence and the running annually at about 12%, whereas the percentage Department of Health, and £350,000 of investment was of Government funding is dropping quite dramatically? recently agreed, which is, of course, very welcome. I hope that she will touch on that. Despite that, however, Combat Stress is still feeling the pressure, as the hon. Member for Mole Valley (Sir Paul Hazel Blears: Yes. The hon. Gentleman makes a very Beresford) said, and that pressure is likely to increase. I important point. The capacity of the people at Combat therefore asked it what it was looking for from Ministers, Stress to be able to cope with the increasing number of and I want to put to the Minister the points it raised so referrals is of concern to all of us in the House, because that he can address them. they are specialists—they know what they are doing and are very effective. The best way to use Government First, Combat Stress is looking for increased recognition funds is to put them into the services that we know of the number of people who are beginning to disclose achieve positive results, and Combat Stress has an that they have post-traumatic stress disorder, especially excellent record. I will come to the issue of funding given that an increasing number of servicemen are shortly. being withdrawn from the combat zones we have had in 29WH Mental Health (Veterans)6 DECEMBER 2011 Mental Health (Veterans) 30WH

Iraq and Afghanistan. As these people come home, the Hazel Blears: The hon. Gentleman makes an extremely pressures will build, and more and more of them will good and practical point. The NHS runs public health need services. campaigns about a range of issues that affect people, Combat Stress estimates that 960 of the service personnel such as smoking and obesity. If we could normalise leaving the armed forces in 2012 are likely to suffer from mental health in that way to some extent, people would post-traumatic stress disorder, while about 4,700—a feel much more comfortable about coming forward and huge number to cope with—are likely to suffer from a saying they have a problem. One symptom of post- more common mental illness, such as depression or traumatic stress disorder is that people often resort to anxiety. That is the nature of the problem. Combat drugs or alcohol and end up with alcohol problems, not Stress’s services are running at capacity and demand is recognising that there are severe mental health problems going up, so my first question to the Minister is whether underneath them. The prisons have recognised that the MOD and the Department of Health, which is about 50% of ex-service people in prison could well be responsible for treatment, recognise that this problem, suffering from post-traumatic stress disorder, and that which will increase, should be firmly on the agenda. is estimated to cost the nation about £300 million a year. This is a good example of a public health issue, Combat Stress’s second request is for increased capacity. and taking the approach I have described could not The organisation is now extremely well known, so anybody only result in significant savings, but contribute to the who is in the circumstances I have described turns to it well-being of all those who are suffering. The hon. for help. The last thing Combat Stress wants to do is to Gentleman makes a good point. turn people away because it does not have the facilities to cope. Can the Minister therefore tell us whether any Sir Paul Beresford: On the same sort of theme, when planning is being done to deal with this issue? What veterans leave the forces, it is frequently 12 to 14 years proposals are there to meet the increased demand over before they present, as Combat Stress says. In the the next few years? Where will the investment go? There meantime, as the right hon. Lady has said, families, will be investment in NHS facilities, but the facilities I communities and so on can face havoc. The United am talking about, which are close to people and their States and the United Kingdom have a decommissioning families, can make a huge contribution in addition to period in which they help people leaving the armed that made by the NHS. I would therefore like to hear forces, but ours is very short. The United States actually what specific proposals the Minister has to provide targets individuals so that they can be picked up and more funding, more resource and more capacity, particularly referred before they get into the community. The funding for Combat Stress’s outreach work and its 14 outreach that she talks about will come predominantly from the teams, which will be extremely helpful for people suffering NHS, and the Minister cannot really speak for the from the problems I have mentioned. Department of Health. However, he can speak about The third issue I want to raise with the Minister is the what the Ministry of Defence can do to catch people stigma around these conditions. There is much more to early, before they do any damage to themselves or be done on this. Some 81% of veterans with a mental others. illness feel ashamed or embarrassed, which sometimes Hazel Blears: The hon. Gentleman touches on a prevents them from seeking the help they absolutely good point, which relates not quite to prevention, but need if they are to get well. One in three veterans—this certainly to early intervention before problems get worse. is a very sad figure—are too ashamed even to tell their I am coming to the funding that will be supplied by the families about their mental health problems. I can only Big Lottery Fund, which will specifically target this imagine what it must be like to live in a family with issue, and it, too, is a good step forward. One issue is someone who becomes withdrawn, who is no longer how we co-ordinate all the funding going through the part of the family, who suffers from all the symptoms I NHS, Combat Stress and the Big Lottery Fund to make have described and who is often in a desperate state and sure that we provide a really good wraparound service. too embarrassed to tell the other members of the family how they feel. I want to say a word about the Big Lottery Fund investment. Over the next few years, the Big Lottery The Government—indeed, all of us—have a job of Fund will put £35 million into this issue. It is setting up work to do to raise the profile of these issues and to a trust called Forces in Mind, which will provide long-term remove the stigma around them. These things happen support and advocacy across the United Kingdom—it in conditions of war, and we should not be embarrassed is important that ex-forces personnel have someone to or ashamed about them. We should do our utmost to speak on their behalf. The trust is about people making help people in such circumstances. I welcome the MOD a successful transition back into civilian life. It will campaign on this, which is called “Don’t bottle it up”. It work with the people who have served in Iraq and is a good way of starting to get rid of the stigma, but Afghanistan. It will look at mental health, family more could be done. breakdown and alcohol-related problems, which are absolutely pressing. Mr James Gray (North Wiltshire) (Con): The right The trust involves a partnership between the Mental hon. Lady is talking a great deal of sense. Allied to the Health Foundation, the Centre for Mental Health, the question of stigma is people’s failure to recognise symptoms Confederation of British Service and Ex-Service in themselves. People often suffer some of these things Organisations and the Shaw Trust. It therefore includes many years after the incident that caused them. Does a number of good organisations that have reach into she agree that another role the NHS could usefully play these areas, which is positive. would be to advertise some of the symptoms and causes The trust had its business plan approved by the Big of these unfortunate mental disorders so that people Lottery Fund board last month, and it has three early actually recognise what is happening to them? projects, which I will say a quick word about. The first is 31WH Mental Health (Veterans)6 DECEMBER 2011 Mental Health (Veterans) 32WH

[Hazel Blears] Neil is busy costing the project and I am sure that we will come back to the Minister at a later date with a the early service leavers trial, and the hon. Member for detailed proposition. Giving people the chance to have Mole Valley touched on the issues it deals with. It is an outlet into higher education, whether to enter teaching called “Future Horizons” and it is an enhanced transition or another important area of life, would help them with programme for those who leave the services early, but job seeking and give them more skills and a better who currently get no support from the armed forces. chance in the labour market. Neil felt that, for him, One thousand such people recruited from across the education was a great way to deal with his mental UK will go to Catterick garrison. They will get 12 months health issues. It helped him enormously. He felt that he —this is a long-term programme—of enhanced support was doing something worth while, it made him feel as if with finding jobs and accommodation, as well as guidance he belonged and made him feel part of society again. with educational problems and mental health issues. The power of education therefore can be of tremendous Twenty-six different community organisations are involved, benefit. so, again, there is good local reach. That is the beginning of what the hon. Gentleman seeks—an enhanced transition. I am not on a sales trip, but Neil’s book is available It is no good giving people help for six weeks when they and I urge as many Members as possible to get it. I did are looking for a job, trying to find a home and trying not know what to expect from that little volume. It is to get back into life. A 12-month programme will therefore short, but incredibly moving, and I want to finish with a be very helpful. quote from it. I do not want to give away the ending completely, but in the book, Tommy Atkins is at the end Another project will involve SSAFA Forces Help, of his tether. He has come home and life is terrible. He which was the Soldiers, Sailors, Airmen and Families breaks up with his girlfriend, his mum and dad break Association. It will work with the Mentoring and up and a series of terrible events happen to him. I am Befriending Foundation, TimeBank, Shoulder to Shoulder, sure that such things happen to an awful lot of people in the British Association for Counselling and Psychotherapy these circumstances. He gets to the point where he is and Help for Heroes—again, it is a big consortium. absolutely desperate and it is so difficult for him to Working with Cruse Bereavement Care, it will support carry on that he thinks of taking his own life, but then people who are bereaved. Cruse is renowned for working something kicks in inside his head: “This was a coward’s with bereaved families. It is expert in counselling and way out. I was a British soldier and we don’t do that. We support and will be a crucial part of the partnership, never surrender and we never give up. That is for other which will work with the widows, widowers, partners, people. I realise that, despite all the pain and heartache children and siblings of those who have been killed, and suffering that there is in the world, there is good as covering the whole range. well—there is good in this world. The love of another, the bonds between family, friendship—these are the The other project, which will come on stream quite things that I fought for. These things are still worth early, is with mentoring organisations. It will involve fighting for and they are worth staying alive for. I will early service leavers who are under 24, so very vulnerable love my mum and dad whether they are together or not. young people will get a specific mentor to help them I just want them both to be happy. I will meet another through the transition—a buddy to be side by side with girl and fall in love again. I will always remember the them, if you like. Youngerpeople are often more vulnerable friends I’ve lost—Kev, Johnno, the serg, Jamie. I will and their problems can be very long term. If we can honour their memory by living, by leading a good life. I intervene early, perhaps the transition can be more stood in the mirror and looked at my medals, then I did effective. The money from the Big Lottery Fund is the bravest thing I have ever done. I picked up the therefore very welcome, but in my view it does not phone, I rang Combat Stress and I told them about me. absolve the Minister from looking at other Government I told them what I was feeling and I felt a great weight resources that might help. I am sure that we will all be lifted from my shoulders.” interested to hear from him. Neil Blower, my constituent, has made me much That, for me, is the best summary that I can give of more aware of the problems faced by people than I ever the experience of Tommy Atkins and all those thousands was before, and I am grateful to him for that. I asked like him. From this book, we can all rededicate ourselves Neil, as I asked Combat Stress, what one thing he would to ensuring that we press for better understanding and really want to happen. What is his wish to help veterans better support to improve the lives of those who have in such circumstances? Neil has been lucky enough to given so much for all of us. I am grateful for being be admitted on to the degree course in creative writing granted the debate this morning. at the university of Salford and he has had his first book published—something that many budding authors never achieve. He hopes to go on to have a career as a 11.25 am writer, and I am sure that he will be successful. He Oliver Colvile (Plymouth, Sutton and Devonport) wishes that there were a Tommy Atkins scholarship (Con): I congratulate the right hon. Member for Salford fund, and I would like the Minister to consider that and Eccles (Hazel Blears) on securing the debate. It is seriously. It would be akin to the GI Bill in America, on an issue that I have spoken about on one or two whereby the American Government paid for servicemen occasions. I am delighted to say that in my maiden and servicewomen, after the Korean war, to go to speech I gave warning and notice to my right hon. university when they left the forces. That helped them to Friend the Minister that I was likely to carry on banging go from combat to classroom. Supporting some of our on about it. I am therefore grateful to have the opportunity forces to realise their talent and potential through access to do so. A big problem with such debates is that the to higher education would be a tremendous step forward. issues are covered by not only the Ministry of Defence 33WH Mental Health (Veterans)6 DECEMBER 2011 Mental Health (Veterans) 34WH but the Department of Health, and it would be helpful called, “Fighting Fit”. I think that that was the benchmark if we could, at some stage, get a Minister to come to for ensuring that we were able to produce a strategy, talk about the health implications of what we want. and we are taking the issue more seriously. The right hon. Lady has given a very good briefing I am also concerned about the reservists. We are on Combat Stress, and I, like her, have been to talk to enormously good at talking about regular service personnel, that organisation. It has been incredibly good at ensuring but we do not talk too much about reservists, although I that I am kept informed and have an understanding of know that my hon. Friend the Member for Canterbury exactly where the problems are. Of course, we have (Mr Brazier) has been doing an extraordinarily large heard a lot about the concentration and focus on veterans amount of work on it. I was talking to the British who have come out of Iraq or Afghanistan, but we must Legion the other day, and it told me how it did not seem remember that people who were involved in conflicts in possible to share information on reservists with charities Northern Ireland will also need help. They also make that are delivering support and help. Could we look at up a significant number of the casualties who were that? Can we make sure that the information is much created from that long and bloody conflict. more readily available, so that people such as Combat Stress and the British Legion are aware of exactly where We talked at some length about how there will be an the issue is going to? increasing number of people dealing with combat stress over the years. The Government have announced that Mr Gray: There is a particular problem regarding the we will withdraw from the Afghanistan conflict by Territorial Army and reservists in general. Whereas a 2014, but activities will continue there. During a recent regimental family closes around someone among the trip that I made to Afghanistan a couple of weeks ago, I regulars who is bereaved or has mental problems, and was told that although the troops will not go out on regulars tend to live in the same place as where they are patrol, we will almost certainly need to support and serving, reservists often come from right across the help those in the Afghan army and police, who will need land, and there is a much less strong regimental hierarchy guidance. I am in no doubt at all that elements in the to look after them. Reservists need particular help from Afghan resistance will seek to ensure that our troops the Ministry of Defence. are subject to many attacks. Oliver Colvile: I was just about to make that point. I grew up with these issues. My father went into the Those people work and live in isolation. The problems Royal Navy at 14, and was awarded the distinguished that they have with decompression are enormous. When service cross for his activities in Narvik. He told me, they come back, they do not necessarily have the same when I was a child and a teenager, of how it was that he amount of time as regulars do to unwind and be had been responsible for trying to take the head of one debriefed. We need to look at that issue. When I was of the people who he had served in a cabin with to talking to a senior Royal Marine the other day, he said throw it over the side when it was blown off in action. that it would be helpful if the decompression time for Fortunately, that did not have an impact on us as reservists could be longer. I urge the Minister to consider children. He was a very normal man and lived a full and that. active life until he was 89, but there was a real chance that such activity could have had a significant impact, Another issue that we need to look at is how the not only on my mother, who, I have to say, had the most national health service is dealing with the matter. As I wonderful sense of humour, but on us, as children. We said, the question is not just about how the MOD deals have all come out, I hope, reasonably sane and balanced. with the issue, although the Minister has been doing excellent work on veterans. I support the way in which The other day, I visited the Royal Marines in Exeter. we will change the structures of the NHS. I voted for One person told me a sad story of how when he had the legislation, and I think it is the right way of going served abroad in action, he came back and wanted to about it, but will our general practitioners and talk to his wife about what he had faced. He wife looked commissioning boards will be able to manage the matter? at him and said, “Don’t start talking to me about any of If GPs commission such services, how far up the agenda that. I’ve had a damn awful day as well. I’ve had to deal is the mental health issue going to be? How will policies with 300 e-mails, so that’s my priority”, so he did not be implemented? Will we have lead GPs taking an talk to her about it. He tried to talk to his mates, who interest? I will most certainly be asking my GP were not involved in the armed services, but they found commissioning board down in Plymouth how it is proposing it very difficult to understand, so he had to find his to manage the issue. We must think the matter through. fellow servicemen—Royal Marine friends—who lived We in this place can pass legislation easily, but we must in Aylesbury, where he came from, and talk to them. It ensure that it is implemented and that we monitor the was only by having that opportunity to share his experiences results. that he saw what was going on. I represent Plymouth, Sutton and Devonport, and it Sir Paul Beresford: That issue was raised with the is a great pleasure to do so. We have just, literally, had previous Government. Some time between then and 3 Commando Brigade come back from Afghanistan, now, national commissioning of Combat Stress long and I think it also has some of the scars that come with courses was introduced. My hon. Friend is absolutely that. right about the recommendations of potential patients and about the other niche groups and niche courses. I am delighted that we have accepted the military The Department of Health will need to look at the covenant into the law. I hope that the Secretary of issue. State’s regular reports on that issue will be informed, and that we will be able to talk about mental health. I Oliver Colvile: I think that that is right. Local authorities congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for South also have to be involved. They will now take increasing West Wiltshire (Dr Murrison) on writing the paper responsibility for the matter. I was talking to the leader 35WH Mental Health (Veterans)6 DECEMBER 2011 Mental Health (Veterans) 36WH

[Oliver Colvile] Several former soldiers, from the Ulster Defence Regiment in particular, visited me in my constituency of my council last week, and she explained that until office. They had stopped serving in the late ’80s and recently, the primary care trust had not been that interested early ’90s, and yet they were still talking about things in engaging on some of those big issues. I will be that they saw that are impacting their lives now. They interested to know how that will happen. The whole look back and recognise that the awful pictures that story of mental health, as the right hon. Member for flash in their memory have had an impact on how they Salford and Eccles said, is an important issue. have lived their lives in the past 20 years, and on We closely support our armed forces and veterans. members of their community and family. Some of us—I happen to agree—are not convinced that we have handled the politics of what is going on in Mr Gray: What the hon. Gentleman is saying with Afghanistan particularly brilliantly. However, if we are great passion brings to mind an episode yesterday. My going to support our armed services, we must ensure hon. Friend the Member for Beckenham (Bob Stewart) that we look after them properly and that they come out was entertaining on the Terrace of the House of Commons with good results. How we deal with the issue of mental one of the widows from the outrage of Ballykelly all health will be paramount. As others have said, there are those years ago, when 20-odd souls were killed in a pub. issues regarding licensing. In Plymouth, we have significantly My hon. Friend was reminiscing about how he cradled more licensed premises than in Liverpool. That is a big his lance corporal in his arms. His lance corporal had issue. When people get depressed, they end up turning lost all four limbs before he died. What sort of effect to alcohol and other substances. We must ensure that does that have, not on my hon. Friend—I am glad to there is a joined-up and co-ordinated approach to the say—who is remarkably well-balanced, but on any less matter. well-balanced soldier? What possible effect will that If we do not deal with the issue, we will have problems have on the rest of their lives? with our infrastructure, not only of the health service but of education. I heard a story that it is not mainly Ian Paisley: The hon. Member makes a very important what comes out in the health stories but what happens point. I also had a constituent who visited me about this in the home that is absolutely, utterly and desperately problem. He was a big, strong, tough frame of a man, important. That is where all the problems kick off, and but he was like a quivering autumn leaf when he started they do not become apparent until significantly later. to tell me about what he had seen and what he remembered. Mr Dobbin, thank you for allowing me to talk about Indeed, his constant memory was the sound of the the matter. I feel absolutely serious about the issue. It scrape, scrape, scrape of the shovel that he had used to has been a great pleasure and honour to follow the right put his comrades and colleagues into a waste disposal hon. Member for Salford and Eccles. bag after an outrage by the Provisional IRA. It was a burning memory that he will never forget and that woke 11.36 am him in the dead of night, leaving him soaked in sweat and crying out in fear, and yet it is a memory that he has Ian Paisley (North Antrim) (DUP): I, too, add my had to bottle up and carry with him. congratulations to the right hon. Member for Salford As a nation, we must take responsibility and recognise and Eccles (Hazel Blears) on securing this important that there are things that can be done for these people debate today. Raising the profile of the matter will in we are talking about. They are not hopeless people; itself do much to enhance public recognition of the they are people who we can actually give hope to, if, as issue, and she spoke passionately and poignantly about the right hon. Member for Salford and Eccles said, we the need to achieve that. first help to remove the stigma, and help people to The hon. Member for Plymouth, Sutton and Devonport recognise that there is help available and that they will (Oliver Colvile) made an excellent point in his comments, not be stigmatised by going for that help. In fact, that which is that we must cast the net a lot wider than the help will only be of benefit to this community, this immediate conflicts that we are aware of in Iraq and nation and indeed the NHS, which will have fewer Afghanistan. It will not be unusual for Members to problems to deal with as the years go on. hear me speak about what has happened in Northern Ireland. We have a walking community of forgotten I hope that the passionate words that the right hon. heroes who have served the nation well and with gallantry, Member for Salford and Eccles put to this House this from the Ulster Defence Regiment, the Royal Irish morning will be recognised and that we also recognise Regiment, the British regular Army and the Royal that post-traumatic stress disorder is not only about the Ulster Constabulary. Only today, as the situation has immediate battles that we are aware of today but about normalised, has there been a true opening and unfolding the long-term problems that our country faces. More of the trauma and devastation in the lives of individuals than 100,000 gallant soldiers from our nation passed who gave service to this nation, and the effect that the through Northern Ireland in service and we are just conflict had on their families. Families lived with service starting to scrape the surface of this issue when we personnel who not only served our country but lived recognise that 20 or 30 years after the conflict ends within the community that they were serving—it was a there could be people who will come forward to say, double impact. It is only now, in this new Northern “I have a problem because of what I saw, because of Ireland, in a more peaceful society, that that is starting what I witnessed and because of what I went through as to unravel and unfold. We must ensure, as we have a serving personnel officer in Northern Ireland.” We started to peel back the issue and look at what could be must ensure that that issue is properly recognised. an appalling vista, that we as a country recognise that The right hon. Member for Salford and Eccles spoke we have a responsibility to address the concerns that we about the capacity to take on board the cases that will are starting to discover. come forward. I want to see that capacity extended, to 37WH Mental Health (Veterans)6 DECEMBER 2011 Mental Health (Veterans) 38WH ensure that the needs of Northern Ireland and of the problems and of that number 35 were diagnosed with soldiers there are also taken on board. The Big Lottery post-traumatic stress disorder. We have heard a lot this Fund money—the £35 million—that has been brought morning about PTSD, but it is not the mental health to our attention today will be a welcome spend and of illness that is most commonly experienced by armed course it must include spending on people who served forces personnel. Depression, anxiety and alcohol abuse in Northern Ireland under Operation Banner, to ensure are far more prevalent, especially among young men that their issues are properly addressed. leaving the service early. Indeed, those young men who I want to make a final point about the issue of leave the armed forces within four years of enlisting stigma. We need a public champion who can be identified have been identified as a particularly vulnerable group. with this issue and whose association with it will give a boost and encouragement to those soldiers who are Susan Elan Jones (Clwyd South) (Lab): I am most sitting at home, and perhaps staring into an empty grateful to the hon. Gentleman for giving way and to glass, contemplating self-harm or having a fight with my right hon. Friend the Member for Salford and their children or other family members. That public Eccles (Hazel Blears) for securing this debate. Does the champion will give those soldiers the ability to say, hon. Gentleman agree that one very important issue in “There is someone who can help me; there is an organisation this debate is the issue of homelessness among veterans, addressing what has affected me, and I can now see that which is closely linked with other problems affecting I have someone to shoulder this burden and someone veterans? When I worked for a housing charity in who can be a help or a crutch”, at the most important London, I was struck by the fact that I did not have to time—when they are at their most vulnerable. I hope speak too long to people working in night shelters that that public champion can be identified. before they made the point that there is always a certain percentage of veterans who are homeless on our streets, In addition, I love the idea of a GI Bill or something and that homelessness is a problem that is related to the similar for the UK. There would be so much opportunity other problems affecting veterans. with such a Bill that we could build on, and I think that we could do things even better than they have been done in the US because this is a nation of people who Stephen Gilbert: I am very grateful to the hon. Lady come up with even better ideas than people in other for that intervention, and she could not be more right nations do. We could learn from what has been done in about that issue. I chair the all-party group on housing the United States and come up with something really and I have made it a particular business of mine to look tremendous. I hope that this debate itself acts as a at homelessness; in fact, I have applied to speak in an springboard and is a very hopeful and positive start to Adjournment debate on that very issue, Mr Dobbin. something that we can take great pride in. When I talk to organisations such as Centrepoint or St Mungo’s, it is absolutely clear that there is a particular problem with people who leave our armed forces and 11.44 am who are unable to adapt to civilian life and stabilise their housing needs. The hon. Lady makes a point that I Stephen Gilbert (St Austell and Newquay) (LD): Thank hope the Minister will find time to address when he you very much, Mr Dobbin, for calling me to speak. It winds up the debate. is a great pleasure to serve under your chairmanship. I congratulate the right hon. Member for Salford and Mr Gray: I just wanted to intervene on that particular Eccles (Hazel Blears) on securing this very important point, before the hon. Gentleman moves on. It is often debate and on the passionate way in which she outlined anecdotally said that there are more people living on the her case on behalf of her constituent. streets who are from a service background than there I think that we all know that there are about 5 million are civilians and it is also anecdotally reported that veterans in the United Kingdom and that a further there is a higher proportion of people in prison from 20,000 personnel leave our armed forces each year. the armed forces than there should be. However, I Having recently returned from a visit to British forces in suspect that there has not been a proper statistical Afghanistan—a visit I was joined on by my hon. Friend analysis of either of those issues and perhaps one of the the Member for Plymouth, Sutton and Devonport (Oliver things that the Government could usefully do is to come Colvile)—I will take a moment to praise the work of the up with some hard facts to establish whether or not the men and women in our armed forces. They put themselves anecdotal reports about those issues are actually correct. in harm’s way and they do a terrific job under very difficult circumstances. Of course, it is not only the Stephen Gilbert: My hon. Friend steals one of the key right hon. Lady’s constituent who is a hero, although I points that I was going to ask the Minister to respond am sure that he is a hero; all the men and women in our to, but hopefully the fact that we are both making the armed forces are heroes and heroines too. same point will be better than just one of us making it In addition, I think that we all know that the transition and so I am very grateful to my hon. Friend for that from military life to civilian life will always be challenging. intervention. Of the 20,000 personnel who leave the armed forces The risk of suicide in army males under the age of 24 each year, about 10%, or 2,000, are discharged for is two or three times greater than that of young males in medical reasons and of that number about 10%, or 200, the same age group in the general population. A recent are identified as having one form of mental illness or study of 9,000 veterans showed that 20% of them had another. That group of approximately 200 personnel symptoms of common mental health problems and that are only 1% of the number of personnel who leave the 13% of them had symptoms of alcohol misuse. The armed forces each year, but these numbers that I am right hon. Member for Salford and Eccles is absolutely citing are not insignificant. Last year, 164 personnel right that we should be entirely clear that mental health had to leave the armed forces due to psychological issues can affect anybody in any part of the population, 39WH Mental Health (Veterans)6 DECEMBER 2011 Mental Health (Veterans) 40WH

[Stephen Gilbert] wonder whether they are being adequately exploited to signpost our armed service personnel to the help that and that we should try to move away from the stigma they need. As my hon. Friend the Member for North that is all too frequently associated with those issues. Wiltshire (Mr Gray) pointed out, we need more analysis Indeed, it is my understanding that 25%, or a quarter, of and research into the wider consequences, and into British adults experience at least one diagnosable mental whether we are providing the seamless support that we health problem in any one year, and that one in six should, and to families as well. experiences such a problem at any given time. Mental Our service personnel never let us down. We ask them health problems are very pervasive in our society and to do a difficult job under very difficult circumstances we must tackle the taboo about discussing them. and they are prepared to make the ultimate sacrifice, so I have spoken before in the House about the harm it is vital that this Government maintain the military that alcohol abuse can cause and that same study of contract post their departure from uniformed service. veterans showed that 40% of the veterans who responded We must not let them down either. met the criteria for heavy drinkers; 27% of them met the criteria for very heavy drinkers; and 15% of them were classed as problem drinkers. Again, young men in the 11.52 am armed forces are more at risk than young men in Mr James Gray (North Wiltshire) (Con): I did not the general population, with 36% of 16 to 19-year-olds intend to speak, and I see the little time available to us, in the armed forces drinking harmful amounts compared so if I may I will hold the House for just a few minutes to just 8% of 16 to 19-year-olds in the general population. before the shadow Minister does her bit and the Minister, It is right and proper that we do all we can to help from whom I very much look forward to hearing, those who have served our country, and not only while speaks. they are serving but after they leave the armed forces. First, I pay a warm tribute to everyone who has That is why I welcome the recent pilots by the Department spoken so far in the debate, in particular to the right of Health and the Ministry of Defence to ensure that hon. Member for Salford and Eccles (Hazel Blears). NHS health professionals have the appropriate support She and I might not agree on many subjects, but on this and available expertise to treat veterans with mental one I think we are entirely ad idem. Everything she said health problems. The four national health Departments, was absolutely right. This issue is terribly important the UK Ministry of Defence and the charity Combat and she has raised it in a timely way. I also pay particular Stress have been working together closely to develop tribute to my next-door neighbour, in constituency terms, and pilot a new model of community-based mental my hon. Friend the Member for South West Wiltshire health care, and I particularly welcome the fact that one (Dr Murrison), whose seminal work on this subject of the pilots is in Liskeard in Cornwall, which is close to fulfilled a coalition agreement commitment to do something my constituency. about the mental health conditions of the armed services. Nevertheless, we need to see what else we can do. At His report was extremely good, and it has given the the moment, the support offered for the reintegration of Government a series of pointers as to what they can former service personnel into civilian life is proportionate now do about this terrible problem. to the time they have served but, as we have seen, those I think that we are unanimous about the fact that with mental issues and other illnesses often need the there is this problem. I was struck by a conversation I most help, and we need to consider whether we have had yesterday with my hon. Friend the Member for right the balance between the time we are putting into Beckenham (Bob Stewart), who sends his apologies for their transition and their needs. We also must ensure not being here. He was having a drink on the terrace that when people leave armed forces medical care their with a young lady who was the widow of one of his transfer into the NHS is seamless. My hon. Friend the soldiers. He recounted how when he was digging into Member for Plymouth, Sutton and Devonport made it the pub in Ballykelly, she insisted on calling him “sir” absolutely clear that we need to look again at what throughout the time she was struggling to escape from happens to our reserve and territorial forces when they the mud and dirt, and how he said, “You don’t need to are demobilised, as they are increasingly part of our call me ‘sir’ under these conditions. Your husband is war-fighting mix. I welcome the previous Government’s dead beside you; we can forget the ‘sir’.” What kind of reserves mental health programme, which aimed to effect can that kind of episode, in which someone tackle some of these issues. cradles a dying soldier who has lost all four limbs, have We must redouble our efforts to raise awareness in on those who are left behind? My hon. Friend is one of the NHS, to help veterans who are concerned about the most well-balanced individuals I know, and I am their mental health. And it is not just within the NHS; not for a second suggesting that he has any such problems, there is an issue closer to the Minister’s own Department. but how many people will have had similar experiences The MOD’s website has only one link buried within it in Afghanistan and Iraq, and how many soldiers who to a charitable organisation that can help with these have had such an experience know what effect it will kinds of issues, and I ask the Minister to undertake to have on them in later life? see whether the website could be looked at, and the I remember speaking to a 19-year-old sniper when I links made more prominent, so that people who are was visiting Afghanistan last year. I asked him, “How clicking through will be better signposted towards help. many confirmed kills have you got as a sniper?” and he In all the defence establishments that I have visited replied, “I’ve got 34 confirmed, and a further 26 probables,” during the 18 months I have been an MP, and before so something like 50 or 60. I asked, “Doesn’t that worry that as a parliamentary candidate, I have seen awfully you?” and he said, “No, sir, it’s no trouble at all. It’s a large numbers of posters, notice boards and others blur at the end of the sight, and I pull the trigger and do ways of conveying information to our forces, and I my job and that’s that. It has absolutely no effect 41WH Mental Health (Veterans)6 DECEMBER 2011 Mental Health (Veterans) 42WH whatsoever.” Who are we to say whether when that them. Let’s keep in touch with the armed services and young lad is 50 or 60 he will have some form of effect find out precisely what they know about post-traumatic from that experience? It is therefore incredibly important stress disorder and the rest of it, and let’s find a military that we address this grave issue. I pay tribute to Help for solution to what is a military problem, albeit within a Heroes and to my constituents in Wootton Bassett and civilian environment.” across the area, who have done great stuff with bereaved This has been a useful debate. We have raised the families and soldiers coming back from theatre of war issue very satisfactorily and the armed services, which with injuries, but this is a much more invisible problem. are aware of the problems, will, I think, be grateful to us We should be just as aware of it, even though the for having done so. But it is very easy to do two things. average time before a patient realises his problem is First, it is easy to exaggerate the problem, and it would 14 years after the incident, and it may well be 20 or be useful if the Minister could initiate a statistical 30 years. It is important that as a society we do something analysis of how many people it affects in a real sense. about the problem. Earlier, we discussed prisons, alcohol and homelessness. Having agreed that—I am sure that everyone here How much of that is caused specifically by combat, and today will strongly be in agreement—it is much more how much is in the normal run of human beings? There difficult to say precisely what to do. It is very easy to say, are 200,000 people in the armed services. A number of “Isn’t this an awful problem? Mustn’t we do something them will be drunken or homeless. That is the nature about it?” Well, yes, but what do we actually do? Two or of the beast. How much of that is caused by military three interesting proposals have come up in the debate. service, and how much is incidental to it? The first, and as I come from the Territorial Army So first, we must not exaggerate the issue. Secondly, myself I think this is very important, is that we should we must not just take political capital from expressing ask the reserve forces carefully to consider precisely our sympathy and concern; in debates such as this, we what they can do. Very often, TA people coming back must make specific proposals about what we can actually from theatre of war leave the reserve forces within a do to lessen this problem in our society. I look forward year or two. They do not particularly want to carry on to hearing from the shadow Minister and, perhaps much beyond that, and they then disappear into civilian more importantly, from the Minister, on what we can do life and are gone for ever. We do not know where they about this dreadful problem. are or who they are, and they may well be suffering from these same problems. We must find a way of pinning down where our reserve forces go when they retire, and 12 noon do something about it. Gemma Doyle (West Dunbartonshire) (Lab/Co-op): [MRS LINDA RIORDAN in the Chair] I, too, congratulate my right hon. Friend the Member for Salford and Eccles (Hazel Blears) on securing this The second problem that people talked about very debate on an important and topical issue. More importantly, convincingly earlier was that of stigma and of people I thank Neil for coming along today and allowing us to feeling that they do not want to come forward, and I hear his story, which has both provided a context for think that that particularly applies to the testosterone-filled our discussion and put a face on the issue that we are young men we send off to war—and women to a degree, debating. but not the testosterone. They come back and do not want to say, “I’m a bit daft. I’ve gone a bit loopy. I welcome the opportunity to discuss these issues There’s something wrong with me.” The ethos is not to with the Under-Secretary of State for Defence, the right say that, and we have to find a way of encouraging them hon. Member for South Leicestershire (Mr Robathan). to believe that it is a normal thing to do, that they can We have spent much time during the past year discussing perfectly sensibly bring themselves forward and say, the Armed Forces Bill and the armed forces covenant. “I’ve got a problem here, and I need some help.” The Bill has now received Royal Assent, so it is perhaps fitting that as we come to the end of the year, we are One thing we might want to think about doing is this. again discussing the welfare of our brave serving personnel Some 10 or 15 years ago, our servicemen coming back and veterans and the impact on their families. injured from theatre of war felt very uncomfortable being in civilian wards in Birmingham. No one is saying My right hon. Friend painted an honest and vivid that they were not well looked after, but only a year or picture of the problem of veterans’ mental health. It is two after the conflicts began the previous Government easy to be preoccupied with the scenes from Afghanistan introduced military-style care in Birmingham. Armed that we still see and not to pay as much attention to the servicemen feel at home and relaxed in such an arena, issues facing service personnel and their families when and I think that something similar has to apply to they leave the forces or return from theatre. We know mental health. Too many civilian mental health workers that they are skilled, highly trained and resilient people, do not understand the problems, which may well present but more than 180,000 personnel have served in Iraq, many years after the incidents that cause them. Particularly Afghanistan and elsewhere, as we have heard, and a in areas such as mine and that of my hon. Friend the significant number will have returned with mental ill Member for Plymouth, Sutton and Devonport (Oliver health or will, sadly, go on to develop problems later in Colvile), where there are very large numbers of armed life. We should be prepared to deal with that and ensure servicemen, we have to find a way of saying to our that the right facilities and support are in place to primary care trusts, “This sort of problem is coming diagnose and treat such conditions. your way over the years. Youhave to find a quasi-military Significant progress has been made in recent years, way of dealing with it. You have to realise that military particularly through mental health pilot schemes and life is different from civilian life and that these are work done since then, to improve support and treatment different problems from civilian mental health problems, for personnel suffering from mental health problems, so let’s find a specifically military way of dealing with but no party has a monopoly on wisdom when it comes 43WH Mental Health (Veterans)6 DECEMBER 2011 Mental Health (Veterans) 44WH

[Gemma Doyle] matter what support is out there, there will be no real change. Combat Stress’s campaign focusing on the issue to improving services for our forces. We have all met of stigma is vital. constituents who have told us about their experiences. We have spent much of this year’s parliamentary We have heard about some of those and about Members’ debates on the forces discussing legislating for the covenant, personal experiences of the issues. so it is welcome that we are now debating the substance I emphasise the importance of the current campaign of the issues covered by the covenant and what it should by Combat Stress about the stigma attached to mental mean in practice. It is right that nobody who serves health, which my right hon. Friend mentioned. Combat their country in the forces should be disadvantaged as a Stress provides an invaluable service to veterans around result of their service. In some ways, however, getting the country. Its centres and outreach work allow veterans the Government to enshrine that in law was the easy bit. to get the help and support that they need in a specialised The Government must now take action to implement environment, along with other veterans going through the covenant so that we can see what it means in similar experiences. Combat Stress’s “The Enemy Within” practice. I would welcome information from the Minister campaign seeks to tackle the stigma that, unfortunately, about the planned implementation of the covenant and can be a barrier to people getting the support and help how the Government intend to ensure that Departments that they need. and public bodies audit and change their policies to give However, the work of Combat Stress and of many our forces, our veterans and their families a fair deal. other important organisations and charities such as the My right hon. Friend highlighted the need to recognise Royal British Legion should not give the Ministry of how many veterans suffer from mental health issues. Defence or the Government an excuse to opt out of My hon. Friend the Member for North Durham their responsibilities, or indeed ours. It is important that (Mr Jones), the previous veterans’ Minister, announced we do not view the services offered by the voluntary and plans when he was in post for a veterans’ ID card. The charitable sector as a replacement for acting ourselves. card would have enabled veterans to be identified easily Such organisations should complement, not replace, and to get priority NHS treatment. the services that the Government offer. The voluntary As we have discussed, it is difficult to quantify the and charitable sector is facing a tough time at the level of need. Without a tracking system for veterans, moment. Forces charities are spared some of that pain we will never be able to do so. My right hon. Friend has by generous ongoing public support, but we should not asked in written questions how many ex-service people assume that those services will always exist and will are being treated for mental health problems on the always have enough funding to run. NHS, but there is no record, so the Minister replying Government should decide what services they have a was simply unable to give an answer because the data duty to provide and should fund them properly. The do not exist. Being unable to quantify the problem Government need not always be the vehicle to deliver makes the Government unable to quantify the true cost those services, as we have heard, but they can fund of treating mental illness among former members of experts such as Combat Stress to do so on their behalf. the armed forces. Therefore, the true impact is unknown This Government should also consider how mental at the moment. A veterans’ card would enable the health services for veterans or anyone else who needs Government to track veterans and offer the right support them can be guaranteed when their national health to those who need it. service reforms are removing accountability. Again, we In the Armed Forces Bill Committee, on which the have discussed that already. Minister and I both served, the Minister reiterated his Those in the forces are trained to be strong, resilient opposition to introducing an ID card, but the Government and able to push through any challenge that stands in agreed earlier this year to launch a veterans’ privilege their way. That does not lend itself easily to admitting card allowing veterans to access commercial discounts. that one needs help because of a mental health problem. That is welcome, but I urge the Minister to look beyond My right hon. Friend highlighted the high proportion discount schemes and extend those proposals, and to of veterans suffering from a mental health condition—a use the card as a way to ensure that veterans can access staggering 81%—who are embarrassed by or ashamed the support that they require when they need it. of their condition and do not feel able to come forward. We have also discussed the average length of time it Mr Gray: I am puzzled as to why the deeply bureaucratic takes people to present in search of support, which is and complicated system of issuing 5 million people with about 13 years. I understand that there are examples of a piece of paper would help those suffering from mental people who have waited up to 40 years to get help. We stress many years after service to come forward and ask must do all that we can to change that situation. We for the help that they need. I am not certain as to why cannot just let it continue. that is a solution to the problem under discussion. Combat Stress has also provided detailed evidence involving cases of individuals who have faced marriage Gemma Doyle: The proposals were not overly break-up, unemployment, social isolation or substance complicated. The initial proposal was to start issuing a abuse, all because they were unable to deal with their veterans card to people who are leaving the services mental health. My hon. Friend the Member for Clwyd now, not to necessarily go back and identify the 5 million South (Susan Elan Jones) mentioned homelessness as people, because, as the Minister has told me, he cannot well. We should be concerned about the figures, and I identify them. If we do not start to make some changes, agree that it is right that we should seek to quantify the we will never be able to quantify the problems. When we problem. The figures show that, even though help and are able to know who the people are, the right support support exist, too many people still find the stigma far and services can be offered to them and contact can too great to overcome. Until we tackle that stigma, no be maintained where it is wanted to ensure that the 45WH Mental Health (Veterans)6 DECEMBER 2011 Mental Health (Veterans) 46WH services are being delivered. Then, when an individual 12.14 pm presents with a mental health problem, they can clearly The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Defence be identified as a veteran and we will be able to see the (Mr Andrew Robathan): This is a hugely important problem much more clearly. topic, so I am delighted that the right hon. Member for Salford and Eccles (Hazel Blears) has secured this debate. Sir Paul Beresford: The point made by the right hon. I thank all Members who have taken part. The right Member for Salford and Eccles was that many of these hon. Lady is a former Minister with responsibility for people will not present themselves and do not understand public health and therefore knows a lot about the issues. the problems, and that asking them will not get the I am not in any way clinically trained, so I tread very result that the hon. Member for West Dunbartonshire warily around issues of mental health. We should be (Gemma Doyle) seeks. That is why I have insisted— wary of making grandiose statements on a very complex I think this point was raised earlier—that the situation. I certainly try not to tell clinicians how to decommissioning that is done in the States, and to some address it. degree here, might be the answer, without the paper. There is, however, a good story to be told. A great deal of progress is being made and the subject has rightly received a lot of attention in recent years. Our Gemma Doyle: No one measure will sort out this armed forces are currently deployed in the most demanding problem—there needs to be a range of measures. I think areas of conflict, and we have a moral duty, not only as that, taken together, the hon. Gentleman’s suggestion a Government but as a nation, to support and look and mine would help to address the problem. I do not after them, to care for them when they are injured and think that we will be able to quantify the issues unless to maintain that care when they leave service. Mental the data and the systems are in place. health problems, as we have heard, may take some time to manifest themselves, in some cases many years after The hon. Member for Plymouth, Sutton and Devonport service. Mental ill-health can be a truly debilitating (Oliver Colvile) has already mentioned that it is important condition. As several Members have mentioned, it still that we do not overlook the particular impact of has a stigma attached to it, and I believe that there is a deployment on the mental health of our reservists. lot of common ground across the political parties to Professor Simon Wessely of the King’s Centre for Military remove the barriers for those seeking the help that they Health Research states that reservists who have served so desperately need. in Iraq or Afghanistan are three times as likely to suffer mental health problems as members of the regular I acknowledge the work of the previous Administration forces. The Government’s Future Force 2020 plan suggests in launching ex-service mental health pilots throughout that the role of reservists is to increase substantially as a the country during the previous Parliament. Such was result of the reductions in the number of regular service their success that they continue in the NHS, which is personnel, so the Government must have the support in leading the fight to ensure that those who need our help place to ensure that reservists are prepared to take on receive it. those extra responsibilities and that extra role, as well as Although I am responding on behalf of the Ministry guarantee that they have access to the correct mental of Defence, it has been the policy of successive Governments health care and support when they return from deployments that the treatment of all health-related conditions and or are no longer mobilised. problems for those who have been in service is the responsibility of the national health service. I mention As in the rest of the forces, there has been progress in that because I deal very closely with the Minister of recent years. The reservist mental health programme State, Department of Health, my right hon. Friend the extended mental health support for reservists, but, with Member for Chelmsford (Mr Burns), who from time to their role set to increase, the provision of support will time makes comments in the House about zombies—some have to be pointed in the right direction to cope with the Members may have noticed that recently—that may increased number of reservists who are to be deployed. have deflected us from his excellent work in the Department I would therefore appreciate an assurance from the of Health, especially his close work with us on various Minister that the mental health care of reservists will be issues, particularly mental health. Indeed, he and I given due attention. together visited Combat Stress in Leatherhead about a In conclusion, I again congratulate my right hon. year ago. The NHS and the MOD together have also set Friend the Member for Salford and Eccles on securing up armed forces networks to ensure that ex-service this debate. We have heard of experiences from around personnel in particular can access health care. Members the country, and they have illustrated the need for have said that people do not understand what ex-service attention not to be diverted from the issue. The hon. personnel need, but this should go some way to helping Member for North Wiltshire (Mr Gray) asked what in the future. measures we can and should take to improve the situation. To ensure a coherent approach across the Government, Combat Stress is asking for five things. I do not think my right hon. Friend the Prime Minister asked my that I can improve on them and would welcome the hon. Friend the Member for South West Wiltshire Minister’s comments on them. This debate has given us (Dr Murrison), who served as a medical doctor in the the opportunity to recognise the role that the NHS, the Royal Navy, to conduct a study into the relationship Ministry of Defence and Combat Stress play in supporting between the national health service and the armed the mental health and welfare of our veterans. I pay forces, including former servicemen, in terms of mental particular tribute to Combat Stress, which, along with health. It was a thorough examination of our procedures many other service organisations and charities, plays an and led to my hon. Friend’s well-respected “Fighting outstanding role in support of the whole armed forces Fit” report. If hon. Members have not read it, I commend family, for which we should thank it. it to them. 47WH Mental Health (Veterans)6 DECEMBER 2011 Mental Health (Veterans) 48WH

[Mr Andrew Robathan] support it. My Department provided Combat Stress with £3 million in the financial year 2010-11 for the The right hon. Member for Salford and Eccles asked treatment of those in receipt of a war pension who about our plans for the future. Essentially, they are require treatment for mental health problems caused by based on that report. The former Defence Secretary, my service. right hon. Friend the Member for North Somerset Combat Stress was formed shortly after the first (Dr Fox), announced on 6 October last year that we world war to help those returning from the battlefields, would accept all of the “Fighting Fit” recommendations. but it is as important today as it was then. Indeed, I first They include a scheme, beginning next spring, routinely came across Combat Stress 25 years ago when I was to contact service leavers at the 12-month point after serving. It was known then as the Ex-Services Mental discharge to establish whether they have any health Welfare Society. We have heard today about Neil Blower, need for which they are having difficulty in accessing a former serviceman who served his country in Iraq and treatment. That is actually very difficult, because when Kosovo. He experienced difficulties after service, but people leave the armed forces, they often change address, received excellent help and support from Combat Stress. move away, go abroad or do all sorts of other things. It He has now become a published author. I wish him is not as easy as one might think. In addition, we will continued success, and I should say to the right hon. enable those identified as having a mental health problem Lady that I found the quotation from his book very during service to continue to have access for up to six moving. months to the MOD’s departments of community and mental health. That will help smooth the transfer of I accept that the Government cannot and should not care from the MOD to the NHS. We have also enhanced do everything. Through the armed forces covenant, we service medical examinations to enable earlier identification are building partnerships between all arms of of mental health problems. government—national and local—and with the NHS to deliver better support to the armed forces community. One of the earliest “Fighting Fit” recommendations The hon. Member for West Dunbartonshire (Gemma to be implemented is the new 24-hour helpline, which is Doyle), who speaks for the Opposition, mentioned all run by the charity Rethink on behalf of Combat Stress arms of government and how we need to bring them and is funded by £200,000 from the Department of together. A report on the covenant will be published Health. It allows former personnel with mental health before Christmas. problems and their families to get specifically targeted We also need to work more closely with the charitable support from people trained and experienced in dealing sector to get the right support to the right people at the with serving and former armed forces personnel and right time. The covenant has the important principle of their often complex mental health needs. It is a real removing disadvantage. Any former serviceman who is success, and when I have met Combat Stress and its ill as a result of their service can access priority treatment clients, I have seen for myself how important this enabling through the NHS—subject, of course, to the clinical of the first step to seeking help really is. I telephoned needs of others. We continue to work closely with GPs the helpline shortly after it was set up because I am to make that more widely known because there is an sometimes slightly sceptical about helplines, and I can education issue. The Department of Health, working assure hon. Members that it works. with the Royal College of General Practitioners, has Through working with Combat Stress, the NHS is put in place an e-learning package for GPs. That will also increasing the number of mental health professionals, increase awareness of the status of patients who are with a focus on providing help to veterans with mental veterans, thus enabling more proactive monitoring of health problems. That provides the opportunity for veterans’ mental health and helping to ensure that they veterans to be seen locally by NHS professionals who receive the treatment that they deserve. have a better understanding of veterans’ needs, working We acknowledge that, in some cases, it can take years side by side with Combat Stress outreach teams and for psychological problems to manifest themselves. It is their extensive experience and knowledge. therefore important that we recognise through-life To help with the process of removing the stigma, to responsibility to our armed forces and that we do all we which several hon. Members referred, the Government can to increase awareness and reduce the potential for have introduced an online well-being network that is developing mental health problems in the future. accessible to serving personnel, their families and veterans. It is called the Big White Wall and is staffed by professional Hazel Blears: If the Minister’s plans to reduce stigma counsellors, who can be contacted 24 hours a day, seven are successful—and I very much hope that they are—that days a week. That social network, which is reflective of will inevitably result in more people presenting for today’s society, allows individuals to engage with others treatment and help and support. I specifically asked who are in similar difficulty. The anonymity connected him what his estimate is of the increase in the number of to that network allows for a free and frank exchange of people presenting for next year and the years after as experiences, with a view to generating a wider sense of troops withdraw from the theatres where they have been support. The Big White Wall has logged 1,000 hits since active and what plans he has to meet that increase in the going live, more than 40% of which are from serving number of people presenting. I would appreciate some personnel, which illustrates that it will be a success. detailed answers to those specific questions. I must acknowledge the significance of Combat Stress’s collaborative approach with the NHS and the MOD, Mr Robathan: I was going to come to that, but we do which was referred to by the right hon. Member for not have estimates for the figures that may emerge Salford and Eccles and others. I bought my Christmas because it is a very difficult clinical situation. Some cards this year and last year from Combat Stress, so I people—mostly not qualified doctors—say that a tidal would like to think that I do my little bit personally to wave of mental health problems is coming. I do not 49WH Mental Health (Veterans)6 DECEMBER 2011 Mental Health (Veterans) 50WH know whether that is the case, but what I do know is of PTSD compared with other studies that show a that we must be ready for whatever comes, so that we range of rates between 3% and 7% in the general can help ex-service personnel. That is the right way population. Recent evidence suggests that PTSD is forward, but making estimates that must inevitably be likely to present at a peak of about three years, but we guesses because they depend on individual situations accept that it may be longer in some cases. It is therefore would not necessarily be very helpful. important that we recognise our through-life responsibility I want to answer a few more of the right hon. Lady’s to our armed forces. questions. We have mentioned stigma. It is our policy I will try to cover the questions asked by hon. Members. and that of the armed forces that mental health issues My hon. Friend the Member for Plymouth, Sutton and should be recognised properly and handled appropriately. Devonport (Oliver Colvile) made some excellent points. Every effort should be made to reduce the stigma associated The hon. Member for North Antrim (Ian Paisley) spoke with such problems. Service personnel are given briefings with passion about the legacy of conflict in Northern before, during and after any operational deployment Ireland. Having spent the best part of a year of my life that explain the symptoms to look for and signpost the on the streets of west Belfast, I have a very real support services available. As well as medical officers, understanding and a great deal of sympathy with some welfare staff, mental health personnel and chaplains of his points. The hon. Member for St Austell and also deploy to places such as Afghanistan and are Newquay (Stephen Gilbert) spoke with great feeling, available to provide help and advice. but we should be careful that we do not see ex-service One of the most successful recent innovations has personnel as victims. They are very capable people, and been the introduction of trauma risk management— the overwhelming majority of people who leave the TRiM—which I have seen. That is a process of peer-group services plough a pretty good furrow and get a job. I risk assessment, and mentoring and support for use in had to become an MP to get a job; nevertheless, most the aftermath of traumatic events. Such a process is people get a pretty decent job after they have left the undertaken as soon as possible after the event. That armed forces, and they do not want to be patronised. could happen, for example, after a patrol in a forward My hon. Friend the Member for North Wiltshire operating base. Evidence suggests that that process has (Mr Gray) added his experience of the Territorial Army been successful in increasing awareness and reducing and acknowledged the real difficulties that we face. On the stigma attached to mental health disorders, which the reservists, he is absolutely right. I say gently to the the right hon. Lady mentioned. hon. Member for West Dunbartonshire that we must Away from the operational theatre, we provide a understand—I think that she does understand—that range of specialist care, primarily through 15 military many ex-service personnel do not want to be pursued. departments of community mental health across the When they leave the armed forces, they do not want to UK and four such departments in Germany. Those be followed-up. departments provide out-patient mental health care The right hon. Member for Salford and Eccles and are staffed by community mental health teams particularly mentioned education. I will write to her if I comprising psychiatrists and mental health nurses, with may with the details, but I think that she will find that access to clinical psychologists and mental health social the further education scheme funded by the Department workers. In-patient care, when necessary, is provided for Business, Innovation and Skills provides free tuition regionally in specialised psychiatric units under a contract for service leavers undertaking a first qualification at with the NHS. that level. That gives ex-service personnel the opportunity To help our understanding of the issues that affect for higher studies, which they may have been denied by service personnel and those who have left the services, military service. Furthermore, they can build-up learning we fund a large-scale research project at King’s College, credits during service that can be used to fund education London on the experiences of those who are serving or for up to 10 years after leaving service. However, I will who have served in Iraq and Afghanistan. Only last write to her with the details on that. Monday, I spent the morning at King’s with Professor In conclusion, there is consensus here. The right hon. Simon Wessely and other academic staff who are Lady has raised a very important issue. We can never undertaking that research. If anyone wishes to go there, remove the exposure to trauma in operations, but we I can arrange a visit because they are extremely on the must do all we can to minimise the effects that that ball and know an enormous amount about the subject, might have. TRiM on the battlefield gives the opportunity as one would hope. The project includes a large-scale to discuss the shared experience of trauma, and that study involving more than 20,000 participants, which is concept is continued with the Big White Wall. For monitoring the effects of operational service compared some, medical intervention is required, which I have with a cohort group that did not deploy. discussed, but we continue to address the recommendations In May 2010—the project was funded by the previous made in “Fighting Fit.” All that is complemented by Government—the latest phase of that research confirmed Combat Stress and other service charities. As we have that there is a continuing relatively low prevalence of heard, they do a huge amount to rebuild lives, and we probable post-traumatic stress disorder for the UK are, as a Government and a nation, eternally grateful armed forces. Some 4% of respondents displayed symptoms for that. 51WH 6 DECEMBER 2011 Arctic Convoy Veterans Medal 52WH

Arctic Convoy Veterans Medal Penny Mordaunt (Portsmouth North) (Con): I congratulate my hon. Friend on securing the debate. She mentioned the Africa star. Not only does the campaign 12.30 pm star system allow for such a stand-alone medal—the Italy star is another example—but it permits recognition Caroline Dinenage (Gosport) (Con): I am grateful to of a significant event, battle or sustained effort; for you, Mrs Riordan, for the opportunity to secure the example, the one-off clasp, the 1939-1945 star, to debate. I want to speak about two words: “heroism” commemorate the battle of Britain. Does she agree that and “bravery”. They are words that we hear too often in there has been a worrying complacency on this matter, modern language, yet their true meaning is absolutely in that neither of those ready solutions has been proposed? personified by the gentlemen in the white berets. They Today, the Ministry of Defence’s own website does not are the Arctic convoy veterans of world war two. They even mention the convoys in the criteria for the Atlantic are the men who risked their lives again and again on star. what Winston Churchill described as: “the worst journey in the world.” Caroline Dinenage: My hon. Friend makes an excellent On a daily basis, they endured sub-zero temperatures— point and has worked extremely hard on this campaign, sometimes as low as minus 60°—and had to hack away as we all have. There is a ready-made solution within the at the ice and snow that covered the decks and external star framework. The complacency in relation to rewarding parts of their ships. One veteran said that he did not these extraordinary men is, in many ways, shameful. realise how cold it was until he accidentally grabbed a ladder, which removed all the skin on his hand. However, Mark Lancaster (Milton Keynes North) (Con): My the weather was nothing compared to the continual hon. Friend is making a powerful point. Probably the aerial bombardment from German U-boats, battleships most powerful point she has made is that the qualifying and planes that plagued each trip. criterion for the Atlantic star was 180 days, which by modern standards is very long indeed. I think that for One grim feature of the campaign was the use of the Falklands it was one day. For the current operational suicide flights. Fighter planes were flung into the air service medal, it is only 30 days. In fact, if she were with the use of a catapult when enemy aircraft were devilish, she could ask the Minister what the qualifying sighted. With nowhere to land when they were shot or period was for his two medals. ran out of fuel, pilots were forced to crash into the sea and face almost certain death. A total of 78 convoys Caroline Dinenage: I thank my hon. Friend for that delivered 4 million tonnes of vital cargo and munitions very helpful intervention. to the Soviet Union, which allowed the red army to repel the Nazi invasion. The cost in terms of life was The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Defence horrific. More than 100 vessels perished and 3,000 UK (Mr Andrew Robathan): If one considers that the war seamen were killed in the treacherous waters of the went on for six years, and people then looked back and Arctic ocean as they undertook terrifying trips to keep decided on the length of time required to qualify for Russia supplied and fighting on the eastern front. Nine medals, I think that that was a perfectly reasonable per cent. of the seamen who took part were killed— position. As I recall, Northern Ireland was 30 days, the highest fatality rate of any maritime campaign in which was essentially a quarter of a four-month tour. the war. Actually, if my hon. Friend the Member for Milton The cost, had the Arctic convoys not succeeded, Keynes North (Mark Lancaster) thinks that accumulated would have been worse. Nazi Germany would very service medals should take longer to acquire—does he probably have won the second world war. Churchill had have one, or is he about to get one?—he raises a sensible promised to supply Stalin “at all costs”. He knew that, point, but the second world war went on for six years. if Russia fell, the full weight of the Nazi military machine would be targeted at the west. Yet, because Caroline Dinenage: I am very pleased to be acting as a Norway and the Baltic states had been captured by the referee in this particular discourse. Germans, the only way to get supplies to Russia was through the northern ports of Murmansk and Archangel, Mr Andrew Smith (Oxford East) (Lab): Will the hon. which are both inside the icy waters of the Arctic circle. Lady give way? Were the convoy veterans honoured with a medal by their own country? After all, even Russia—the Soviet Caroline Dinenage: In two moments, I will. I welcome Union—awarded medals that acknowledged its gratitude the intervention from my hon. Friend the Member for to the surviving sailors, whom it regarded as heroes. No. Milton Keynes North, who I think is still a serving The convoy campaign was the only major sea campaign member of the Army. I am sure that he very much of the second world war not to be honoured with a represents the views of the service people of today, who specific medal. Instead, it was included in the battle of recognise fully and fully appreciate the sacrifice that the Atlantic, which was a separate campaign to keep these gentlemen made. Britain supplied during the German U-boat blockade. This is the biggest fallacy: the Arctic convoy veterans all Mr Mike Hancock (Portsmouth South) (LD): I am qualified for the Atlantic star. Leave aside that the grateful to the hon. Lady for giving way. Like others, I Atlantic is 800 miles away from the Arctic and a wholly congratulate her on successfully securing the debate. different campaign. Uniquely for campaign medals, She said that there were two words that she wanted to recipients of the Atlantic star had to fulfil a six-month talk about. There are two other words that, unfortunately, qualifying period, as opposed to just one day for the have not been taken on board by the Government. One Africa star, for example. is gratitude—the gratitude of the nation to these men. 53WH Arctic Convoy Veterans Medal6 DECEMBER 2011 Arctic Convoy Veterans Medal 54WH

The other is obligation—the obligation that successive band of brave men: only 200 now survive. The News Governments have refused to take up to honour these might be the champion, but the cause matters not only men with the medal they deserve. The Minister’s outburst to people in Portsmouth. belittled the importance of this debate, and I regret that he chose to make those statements. I believe that Mrs Mary Glindon (North Tyneside) (Lab): I appreciate “obligation” and “gratitude” are the two things that the the hon. Lady securing the debate and congratulate her nation now needs to show these men while they are still on that. My now dear departed uncle was on one of the alive. convoys, and he was thrilled to be awarded the Russian medal, although our brave convoy veterans are not allowed to wear it on the same side as their other Caroline Dinenage: I thank the hon. Gentleman for decorations. If the veterans can receive that medal from that intervention and echo everything that he has said. I Russia, as they did several years ago with great honour know that he has also been a great supporter of the here in London, should they not be honoured by our Arctic convoy veterans in their campaign for a medal. country?

Mr Andrew Smith: The hon. Lady has been generous Caroline Dinenage: The hon. Lady makes a super in giving way. She is making a powerful and eloquent point and underlines the strength of feeling on the case. I just want to underline the strength of cross-party subject up and down the country. It is almost impossible support for her campaign, and the support it enjoys to understand why our brave servicemen have been among the wider British public, as the hon. Member for rewarded by other countries and not by our own. It is Portsmouth South (Mr Hancock) has said. We owe not only a local issue, as she pointed out. Loch Ewe, these veterans a vote of thanks, and we owe them a from where the convoys were launched, has a museum distinctive Arctic convoy medal. and an annual service of remembrance, and the Scottish Government are even considering including the story of the Arctic convoys in their national curriculum. When I Caroline Dinenage: I thank the right hon. Gentleman raised the matter at Prime Minister’s questions in January, for that good intervention. He has, in many ways, hit the incredible outpouring of support I received came the nail on the head. from all over the world and from as far afield as Canada The Minister talked about qualifying periods for and Australia. The medal has the support of people in medals. The Arctic convoys sailed in excessively awful all walks of life, young and old, and nowhere more so conditions. It is important to point out that nobody than among our serving servicemen and women. Next could possibly have managed six months of continuous year, a new diamond jubilee medal will be awarded to service in those horrific conditions. There were people anyone who has completed five years of service in the who sailed on the convoys, and many who lost limbs in military, whether on active service or not. Many of the the horrific extreme cold, who did not serve long enough young people in the armed forces in my constituency to qualify for the Atlantic star. The Atlantic star have said that, if it is only a matter of money, they will qualification—albeit maybe inadvertently—was therefore happily forgo their own medal in order to afford one for set up in such a way as to make sure that nobody who the Arctic convoy veterans. only served in the Arctic convoys could qualify. The Arctic convoy veterans who did receive the Atlantic Penny Mordaunt: I thank my hon. Friend for giving star—there were a good number of them—only did so way to me for a second time. Is she aware that the because they had also been part of an Atlantic convoy £12.3 million estimate for an Arctic convoy medal is during other parts of the war; they did not receive it based on incorrect numbers of servicemen and costings? purely on the basis of their serving in the Arctic campaign. Looking at the actual costs of other medals and allowing for inflation and even design costs, which obviously Why was the Arctic the only campaign of the second would not have to be included, I am hard pushed to world war to be ignored? The most likely explanation is reach even £1.2 million. that, as world war two ended, the cold war began and our relations with the Soviet Union deteriorated. Fear Caroline Dinenage: I am grateful to my hon. Friend of communism was growing internationally and it was for that information, which further underlines the obstacles somehow seen as inappropriate, or maybe even that are being put in the way of doing the right thing. unfashionable, to recognise the efforts of our country in The Ministry of Defence was asked to review the medals supporting the Russians. In some ways, this whole incredible, system in July 2010, and it took 16 months to get valiant episode was just brushed under the carpet. It nowhere. However, time is of the essence. It is 70 years was only in the 1990s, after the end of the cold war, that since the first convoys, and the remaining veterans are this incredibly heroic band of gentlemen felt that they in their 80s and 90s; of the thousands who took part in could put forward their case for a medal. the convoys, only 200 are yet alive. Commander Eddie Grenfell survived his ship being bombed five times, and being plunged into the icy water Mr Mike Hancock: The hon. Lady is being enormously where life expectancy was just minutes. He somehow generous in giving way again. Is she, like me, unable to managed to get rescued from the water and then spent find a single precedent other than that of successive many months recovering in Murmansk hospital. He is Ministry of Defence Ministers from all Governments now 91. Lieutenant-Commander Dick Dykes spent more against giving the medal? time in the Arctic convoys than anyone else alive today. Such men are heroes, yet they are still fighting. Portsmouth’s Caroline Dinenage: Absolutely—I have yet to find The News has led a campaign for more than 10 years to anyone who finds the medal unpalatable, other than get a medal for Eddie, Dick and the ever-dwindling members of the MOD. 55WH Arctic Convoy Veterans Medal6 DECEMBER 2011 Arctic Convoy Veterans Medal 56WH

[Caroline Dinenage] her that that work is most definitely happening at the moment. It is important that the decisions are made not Does the Minister agree that enough time has already by me or by Ministers but independently. Neither the been wasted on reviews and delays? How long will the Ministry of Defence nor I will have any hand in those new independent review requested by the Prime Minister decisions, which will be made by an independent chairman take, and when will it be completed? Finally, what are and group. It is important that politicians do not have the scope and leadership of the review? According to such decisions at their fingertips. The truth is that the MOD, the details are expected to be released shortly— politicians should not be involved in awarding medals. but “shortly” is not a period that we understand. What does it mean? Time is not on our side, and I ask him to Caroline Dinenage: I think that politicians ought to be more specific. I understand that the MOD hides have the decision in their gift. If they should not, why behind rules, protocols and precedents, but another did successive leaders of the Conservative party promise criterion ought to take absolute priority: this is the right the medal to veterans while in opposition? It should not thing to do. Those men are not politicians, and at their be subject to review and it does not need independent age they should not have to fight for justice. It appals scrutiny to decide that this is the right thing to do. me that people who gave so much to ensure the freedoms Politicians are perfectly capable of making the decision that we daily take for granted should have to beg for the and making the right one. recognition that they deserve. Successive Conservative leaders in opposition have Mr Robathan: Every Member in the Chamber, pace committed to the medal without review. It is dreadful the hon. Member for Portsmouth South (Mr Hancock) that it has to be reviewed again and again. I urge the who might possibly be an exception, was born after the Minister to ensure that it is done quickly. Time is not on end of the second world war. Politicians should not the side of those brave gentlemen. It would be utterly revisit decisions made in the past, second-guessing those disgusting were a medal awarded and no one were alive who are not around to speak for themselves and who to receive it. knew the details, were much closer to them than us and would have known people who had been on the Arctic 12.44 pm convoys, perhaps losing friends or relations on that convoy, when we do not. The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Defence (Mr Andrew Robathan): I thank my hon. Friend the The current situation is that an independent review, Member for Gosport (Caroline Dinenage) for raising into which I will have no input, will investigate. However, this important issue, and I congratulate her on securing I would like to state the facts, which are what we should the debate. She feels passionately about it, and we have deal with. The Admiralty fleet order dated October discussed it in the past. There is no scintilla of difference 1946 refers to between us about our respect for those of my father’s “Qualifications for the Atlantic Star” and her grandfather’s generation who served in the and states: Royal Navy and the Arctic convoys in the second world “After qualification for the 1939-45 Star by six months’…service, war. It might be relatively cold outside, but as we sit in areas defined below. here in our centrally heated comfort, well clothed and (A) Six months’…service afloat as defined in Section III”, dry, it is difficult to imagine the conditions in which young men in their teens and 20s went to sea in the which included time in port, and Arctic before we were born. I pay real tribute to their “(B) Service in home waters, service on the convoy routes to courage, resolution, determination and bravery when North Russian ports, service in the South Atlantic between the necessary—all those things were shown by the people longitude of Cape Horn and longitude 20° E”. whom we as a nation sent to war in the Arctic. We The point was that the Admiralty was trying to have agree about that, and the question is what we should do one medal to cover those issues. Whether that was right about it. or wrong, it is wrong to say that the Arctic was ignored. I mentioned my father’s generation, and I was brought It was not. It was mentioned in the Admiralty fleet up immediately after the second world war, so I have a order, and it was recognised, but I accept that whether it much closer feeling with it, if I may say so. My mother’s should have been recognised further is a matter for first husband was a glider pilot killed at Arnhem, and debate. the courage and resolution shown by glider pilots were The campaign suggests that the Atlantic star is not similarly astonishing. In the battle of Sicily more than enough, and I understand the strong feeling about that. half the glider force was dropped in the sea and almost I cannot understand what it was like to be in such all of them died, as far as I am aware, so then to get appalling cold. However, it was also cold in the Atlantic, back in a glider and fly off to Arnhem and D-day was and I have mentioned the 3,500 merchant ships and similarly incredibly brave. I pay tribute to all those from 175 warships that went down. Most people who earned this nation who in the second world war did amazing the Atlantic star must be very proud to have done so things. Nothing that I say should detract from that. The when so many died. One also reads of the deprivation Atlantic convoys, rather than the separate Arctic convoys, on the Atlantic convoys. It was pretty tough going lost 3,500 merchant ships and 175 warships. across the Atlantic being chased by U-boats, and many The position of the Government, which my hon. ships were sunk. Friend mentioned, is that we will have a review. It was thought that the earlier review, to which she referred, Penny Mordaunt: I do not believe that anyone here was insufficient, and therefore we are putting in place wants to get into a competition about who suffered another one, for which the terms of reference and the most, although we must recognise the appalling conditions chairman have yet to be decided. I can, however, assure endured by the Arctic convoy veterans. The Minister is 57WH Arctic Convoy Veterans Medal6 DECEMBER 2011 Arctic Convoy Veterans Medal 58WH rightly sticking to the facts, but the facts are that the Soviet survivors from the second world war, but generals Arctic convoys were a separate theatre of conflict, and a in the Soviet army were covered in medals, which is not precedent was set with the Canal medal. If it was the tradition in this country. That is the point I was thought that an error had been made, for understandable trying to make. reasons—my right hon. Friend alluded to what they might be—we could revisit a decision. I do not believe Caroline Dinenage: The Minister’s comment about that politicians should make those judgments, but it is the Russians giving out that medal disparages what the our job to raise the concerns of our constituents throughout Russians clearly recognise as an unbelievable commitment the country. There is a great feeling that we should and bravery of gentlemen such as those in the Public revisit the facts, and there is a precedent for change if Gallery to whom he referred. We are now in the habit of we think an error has been made. giving out medals to people who have not committed acts of bravery. Next year, the Queen’s diamond jubilee Mr Robathan: I am saying that that determination is medal will be given to people who may have spent five possible if people in the past got it wrong. We are saying years driving a desk in the Ministry of Defence. in this debate that those in the Admiralty who determined who would receive medals got it wrong and that in some Mr Robathan: That is a fair point, but the diamond way we who were born after the second world war know jubilee medal is a commemorative medal, not a campaign better than those who were in that war. Actually, they medal. That is the difference, but I agree with her. She were people like us, who are sitting in our centrally made a reasonable point. I apologise again if she took heated Chamber. Mountbatten was not on the Admiralty my comment the wrong way. My point was that some Board because he was Viceroy of India at the time, but regimes give out a large number of medals, whereas he had commanded Kelly during the war, and ended up traditionally the United Kingdom does not. an admiral. That was not unusual for experienced people. I commend Commander Grenfell and his colleagues We are in danger of saying that we should gainsay their on their campaign. It seems to have started in 1997, knowledge and disparage their decisions, which were which was 51 years after the Atlantic star was awarded, made by good people with experience. so I am not entirely clear what prompted it. Two Members in the Chamber have been on their parties’ Front Benches, Mr Hancock: Will the Minister give way? and the last Government, under a lot of pressure, decided that they would award a special medal, but they Mr Robathan: No, I will not. awarded the Arctic star. In Portsmouth, The News The intention post-war was not to cover everyone stated, under the heading, “We’ve Won” and “Historic with medals. Medals in the UK mean something, and victory in long battle to win honours for heroes of the we pay tribute to the people in the Public Gallery who Arctic convoys”, that Commander Grenfell said: are showing the medals that they won through risk and “I am really very happy with what we have achieved. It has rigour. My hon. Friend the Member for Gosport mentioned been a tough campaign, but we have finally got the recognition the USSR. Authoritarian regimes and dictators, such a the Arctic veterans deserved.” Gaddafi and Saddam Hussein, often throw medals It also quoted the hon. Member for Portsmouth South around. North Korean generals are covered with medal who said: ribbons. We have traditionally taken the view in this “This is a tremendous result, and it is wonderful that the Arctic country—hon. Members may disagree—that medals veterans have at last won recognition.” will be awarded only for campaigns that show risk and I must tell Opposition Members, particularly the right rigour. hon. Member for Oxford East (Mr Smith), that their Government believed that the matter had been put to Mrs Glindon: Veterans who hold the Russian Arctic bed. medal may think the Minister’s comment about regimes Finally, the facts are that the decision is not one for that give away medals is disparaging. I hope that he politicians. I have huge respect for my father’s generation, recognises that. Under Winston Churchill, the Government who gave up their youth in the service of our country discouraged the award of the Russian medal, but the and deserve to be continually respected. The Arctic fact that it was given and that the brave men who convoy veterans served in the particularly appalling received it were recognised should be mirrored in this conditions of the Arctic, but we should not pretend that country. I should be pleased if he made a different we know better than experienced people who had taken comment from the one that he made earlier. part in the second world war and who had served on Royal Navy ships at sea. A decision will be taken, Mr Robathan: I apologise if my comment was taken rightly, by the medals review. It should not be a political in the wrong way. That was not the intention. I am not decision; it should relate to those who look at all the sure when the Russian medal was given to our veterans, facts, take a view dependant on their respect for our but I believe that it was after 1990. There are not many veterans and make their decision accordingly. 59WH 6 DECEMBER 2011 Police Stations (Overnight Staffing) 60WH

Police Stations (Overnight Staffing) force has established a new appointments system so that officers will visit the public instead of expecting the public to come to them. 12.59 pm I am all in favour of new ways of communicating Ian Austin (Dudley North) (Lab): I am grateful to with people and having more locations in which the have the opportunity to bring this matter to the House’s public can meet the police, but there are specific factors attention. [Interruption.] in relation to Dudley which I am not convinced the current proposals have taken into account. As soon as Mrs Linda Riordan (in the Chair): Order. Will people the proposals were brought to our attention, my colleague leave quietly? Councillor Shaukat Ali and I launched a petition asking that the proposal for Dudley police be dropped. The fact that more than 2,000 residents signed our petition Ian Austin: I am grateful to have the opportunity to in just a fortnight illustrates the level of local concern. ask the Minister a series of questions about the proposed Residents, businesses, publicans and students in the evening closure of Dudley police station, and, as we can town all expressed their concern. The Central Dudley see from the presence of other Labour Members, other Area Committee held an emergency meeting and stations in the west midlands. I want to express my unanimously called for the proposal to be dropped. admiration and support for West Midlands police, led by our chief constable, Chris Sims—[Interruption.] There are a number of specific factors in relation to Dudley. First, the nearest station run by Dudley police for many will be at Brierley Hill, five or six miles away Mrs Linda Riordan (in the Chair): Order. Could you for many residents. Secondly, I receive frequent complaints wait until the public have left the Chamber? about antisocial behaviour on estates near the town. Much of this obviously occurs during the evening, and Ian Austin: I think those in the public gallery have people strongly value having a station open should they done their bit. They have every right to have their case need it. Thirdly, Dudley is the largest town on the list heard. and I do not think there is anywhere of similar size in Led by Chris Sims and his senior colleagues, the force the region that would not have a station open to the has seen crime across the region fall over the last few public in the evening. years, but many of us are worried that the force will find I am all in favour of using new methods of maintaining its performance impossible, because it is communicating with people, but it is to the West Midlands being forced to cut its budget by £126 million over four force’s credit that it operates so many more open front years. It is losing 14.5% of its funding, one of the desks than other forces. The fact that there is a busy and biggest cuts in the country. As a result, the force is active, fully staffed station is very important to traders losing 1,250 officers, recruitment has been frozen, and and shoppers. experienced and valuable officers are being forced to retire early because they have completed 30 years’ service. Mr Jim Cunningham (Coventry South) (Lab): My Other savings are being made in back office functions hon. Friend knows that we are in the same position in and administrative functions as well. Coventry. It will be difficult for the public to get access The force is now proposing that the front desk at to a number of police stations, particularly over the Dudley and a number of other police stations be closed weekends, as a result of the reduction in hours. Not far to the public during the evening or overnight. Dudley’s from where I live is Chace police station, which is a front desk has been closed to the public between 10 pm major station for Coventry. More important, when and 7 am for the last four years or so, but under the new anyone is arrested for alleged terrorism, they are normally arrangements the front desk would close at 6 pm and held there until they are moved somewhere else. It is not open again until 10 am the next morning. I think it vital that the Minister takes a serious look at this. is fair to say that were it not for the need to save I do not know whether my hon. Friend has experienced £126 million, West Midlands police would not have put another problem. At weekends, when crime is more this proposal forward. However, they have to make likely, it is difficult to get a senior officer at these savings and they have put forward a number of arguments, stations to talk about certain incidents that may happen which I will set out and deal with. in the centre of Coventry or in different locations in First, it is said that Coventry. Several police stations in my constituency, but equally in the other two MPs’ constituencies, will be “The review of front offices found that public demand is very experiencing the same thing. It is vital that people have low in the evenings and overnight and recommended that staff be redeployed back into contact centres to increase the efficiency of an open police station at the weekends so that they can call handling.” get to the people they want. It is no good leaving sergeants in charge. Secondly, the force will “continue to provide 65 front offices open to the public; a service Ian Austin: My hon. Friend is correct. There are to local communities far wider than most other police forces offer various ways in which his and my stations could be kept across the country.” open in the evenings and, in his case, at weekends by Thirdly, looking for savings in other areas. It would help if the “households will never be more than four miles from a 24/7 police force was not being forced to find this level of savings in station”. the first place. Finally, the force is looking for other locations in As in Coventry, specific factors in Dudley mean that which to meet the public and more modern ways of it is important to have a station open in the evening. We communicating, such as Twitter and Facebook. The have got £30 million being spent right now on new 61WH Police Stations (Overnight Staffing)6 DECEMBER 2011 Police Stations (Overnight Staffing) 62WH college and sixth-form buildings in the town centre, North and for Coventry South (Mr Cunningham) could which will result in hundreds more young people in and identify offices in their own constituencies where services around the town during the evenings. The new college could be provided much more cheaply. includes a theatre, which will bring hundreds of visitors The Minister will no doubt say that he cannot do to the town at night. Our town centre market is about to much about where the authority is based, but he ought be rebuilt, strengthening the town centre economy with, to be ensuring that it has found savings from all the again, more activities in the evening. Several pubs and other areas before touching the front line. He can cafés and a wine bar are currently being refurbished. certainly do something about the way the police force is Much of the regeneration of the town centre is based funded. on driving up trade and activity in the evening. Finally, The police authority and leaders from all parties in there is strong public support for my campaign to open councils across the region have made representations to up the castle in the evenings during the summer for Ministers on two specific issues. Although all police concerts and plays, which would bring thousands more authorities have been subject to some reduction in the people to Dudley during the evenings. Government grant, authorities such as the West Midlands On the number of visitors, the force’s own figures police authority have effectively been penalised because show that a third of front desk enquiries come between they kept precept increases to a minimum over the past 6 pm and 10 am. That is bound to increase as a result of few years. They are, therefore, more reliant on the our ambitions to boost the town’s night-time trade and Government grant compared with authorities such as visitor economy. In light of these particularly local Surrey, for example, that increased precepts at a faster factors, I want the Minister to ask the force to reconsider rate and are therefore less reliant on the Government this particular proposal. Not unreasonably, the chief grant. constable says that if front desks are not closed, savings will have to be made elsewhere. I understand that, but I Mr Jim Cunningham: My hon. Friend makes a need to be convinced that all possible savings have been comparison between the west midlands and Surrey. In found from administrative and back office functions the west midlands the authority relies on an 80% grant before front-line services such as Dudley’s front desk from central Government, whereas in Surrey it is the are cut. reverse. That shows a real disparity. Forces across the country buy pretty much the same My hon. Friend also mentioned efficiencies. I do not cars and other vehicles, uniforms, protective clothing have a lot of evidence, but once or twice I have noticed and equipment. They use similar computer systems and that during an incident such as the arrest of a person for so on. Will the Minister explain why individual forces causing a problem on a bus, for example, it can sometimes are still procuring cars, vehicles and equipment individually take six police cars to surround that bus and remove the and separately instead of driving down costs by purchasing individual. When talking about efficiencies, perhaps centrally and getting bigger and better deals for the that practice should also be examined. taxpayer? Will he tell me why we have police, fire and ambulance services in the west midlands operating Ian Austin: My hon. Friend is correct. Total spending separately instead of merging some common functions? power—the Government grant and the precept—in the Why do they all need separate finance, human resources west midlands will reduce by over 4% in 2011-12, compared and PR departments, for example? Why have we got 40 with only 1.5% in Surrey. As the Minister will know, separate local or regional police forces across England—four that position is exacerbated further by the application in the west midlands alone—all providing different and of grant damping, together with the “floors and ceilings” separate services instead of sharing expertise and knowledge, that have been applied every year since the last funding as well as administrative functions and computer systems, formula review. As a result, the West Midlands police for example? authority will receive £27 million less than its full formula Rationalising such functions would save a fortune, entitlement, whereas Surrey will receive £4 million more. but I can think of other savings that we could be It means that the West Midlands police authority, which making, too. Many of the areas I have listed are precisely has one of the highest policing demands in the country, the areas that we identified as part of the 12% efficiencies will be forced to make the biggest percentage reduction that we would have made over four years, rather than in spending, while areas such as Surrey that have much the 20% cuts that have been front-loaded and that are lower need and demand will make the smallest reductions. being imposed on police forces at the moment. Is it not As the West Midlands police authority says, the case that the Government’s decision to go much “this is neither fair, reasonable nor indeed equitable.” further and much faster has probably impeded forces’ Stations such as those in my constituency would not abilities to make efficiency savings, which would take be faced with closure in the evening if the Government time to work out with other police forces, but would introduced arrangements that properly reflected the limit the impact on the front line? They are being forced need and demand for policing services in the west to do these things more quickly and more severely. That midlands, and which treat that area and the people who has forced them into quicker but more damaging savings, live and work in it fairly and equitably. such as reducing the number of front-line officers and I will suggest one other saving. Although I am not closing stations in the evening instead of the administrative against elected police commissioners in principle, I am and procurement savings that I have suggested. not sure how they will find enough things to keep them We should also consider why the police authority and busy and in particular to justify their enormous salaries—I force are based in costly offices in the middle of Birmingham thought about that when I visited the police authority city centre, which is probably the most expensive place last week, and it is an interesting point. One argument to run a service anywhere in the west midlands. Like me, that was recently advanced for police commissioners I am sure my hon. Friends the Members for Walsall cited the great job that we were told the Mayor of 63WH Police Stations (Overnight Staffing)6 DECEMBER 2011 Police Stations (Overnight Staffing) 64WH

[Ian Austin] We started a petition to protest about what was happening, and there was not the slightest reluctance by London did during the recent riots. The Mayor of anyone to sign—I would have been surprised if there London, however, looks after a whole range of services had been. I know that the Minister is checking the and functions across the city, and has a much bigger figure I gave about the number of people who go to the area of responsibility than simply the police. I am not station—that is the average figure that has been publicised; sure what police commissioners will do to justify being if it is not the most accurate figure, so be it. The fact paid £100,000—as I understand it, the police commissioners remains, however, that until now and before the cuts in the west midlands will be paid £100,000, and they were announced, the police station remained open and will be the best paid in the country. That seems an odd its closure was never suggested. The only reason the priority when resources are so scarce that we are losing station will close after 6 pm every day is that indicated 1,200 officers and face the evening closure of stations by my hon. Friends. I hope that, when looking at the such as that in Dudley. situation in Dudley and Coventry, the issue of Bloxwich Finally, does the Minister think that the officers in station and whether it can remain open will also be question and my police station’s front desk are front-line considered. services? I would have thought it difficult to identify Finally, I sent the petition to the police authority with anything more front line than a full-time police officer a supporting letter, and I believe that there should be a and a public inquiry desk. At the election, the Prime genuine consultation exercise in which people are asked Minister promised that there would be no front-line their views. If the Minister wishes to challenge what I cuts, and that any Cabinet Minister who proposed them have said about the need for Bloxwich police station to would remain open, let a genuine consultation exercise be held “be sent straight back to their department to go away and think in Bloxwich, and other areas of my constituency that again.” use that station, so that people can express their views. Does the Minister think that the cuts in question are front-line cuts, and will he do what the Prime Minister 1.17 pm promised would happen under such circumstances and The Minister for Policing and Criminal Justice (Nick think again? Herbert): I congratulate the hon. Member for Dudley North (Ian Austin) on securing this debate. I recognise 1.13 pm that the availability of the police is a matter of concern to his constituents, and the Government share that Mr David Winnick (Walsall North) (Lab): I welcome concern. the fact that my hon. Friend the Member for Dudley North (Ian Austin) has secured this debate because Police visibility and availability is important, and we Bloxwich police station in my constituency is affected want to see more police officers on the streets preventing by this issue. My hon. Friend is right. and cutting crime, rather than sitting behind their desks. We must, however, recognise that policing today reaches Mrs Linda Riordan (in the Chair): Order. May I check people through many means, not just police stations, that the hon. Gentleman has the permission of the and we must be careful not to confuse buildings with Minister and Opposition spokesperson to speak? the visibility and availability of the police, which I fear may be behind public concern. The Minister for Policing and Criminal Justice (Nick I know that the hon. Gentleman recently attended a Herbert): Leave me time to reply. meeting of the West Midlands police authority at which it considered a report by the chief constable on the proposed operating hours for the force’s public inquiry Mrs Linda Riordan (in the Chair): Please keep your offices, and he also mentioned the petition that he contribution short, Mr Winnick. presented. As I understand it, the views expressed by petitioners will be taken into account as a response to Mr Winnick: I certainly will, Mrs Riordan. As the the police consultation. The consultation period will Minister knows, the West Midlands police force faces a continue until 15 January, after which time all responses devastating cut of 26% over the next few years. That is will be considered. Such decisions are taken locally and bound to affect it adversely both in the west midlands as not by the Government. a whole and in individual constituencies. As indicated, there will be 1,250 fewer police officers as numbers fall In his report for the authority meeting, the chief from 8,627 to 7,377. Moreover, there will be fewer constable made plain the force’s commitment to a visible members of police staff in other roles. That is the and accessible service to the public: background to what is happening and the reason why “Providing a visible and accessible service to the public is core certain cuts are taking place at the moment. to the approach West Midlands Police takes in delivering its mission of ‘Serving our communities and protecting them from The decision to close Bloxwich police station after harm.’ West Midlands Police must deliver reductions in its budget 6 pm each day cannot be justified. My figures show that of £126 million, but in making these savings we have been clear on average, more than 30 residents visit the station at that we will still offer the protection the public demands, but the some stage during the time it will be closed. Furthermore, way services are delivered must change.” the fact that the police station is closed will lessen the The approach described by Chief Constable Sims reflects feeling of security among the residents. There may be the core challenge that the police service faces—to alternative ways of contacting the police, but that does reduce costs while maintaining and, indeed, improving not alter the fact that the police station will be closed public services. The Government have no option but to when previously it remained open, and people are concerned reduce public spending. As a service spending £14 billion about that. a year, the police can and must make their fair share of 65WH Police Stations (Overnight Staffing)6 DECEMBER 2011 Police Stations (Overnight Staffing) 66WH the savings needed. I think that there is cross-party use them—I will come to that point. Staff from the sites agreement that the police can make savings; we may with reduced hours will be redeployed into contact disagree about the amount. centres, which will improve call handling, and police The hon. Member for Dudley North and his hon. officers will be released to other duties, so the proposals Friends raised the issue of the funding for the west about which the police are consulting involve changing midlands. Of course, I will revisit the damping decisions the balance of resources to improve the way in which to be made in relation to the third and fourth years of the police respond to the public through the channels the spending review. I understand the point that the by which and at the times at which the public actually hon. Member for Dudley North is trying to make. I contact the police, rather than preserving a service in have said before that we decided that an even cut across places where and at a time when the public rarely use it. police forces was the only fair solution, because otherwise West Midlands police have found that, during the we would be penalising forces that were already taking daytime, on average only two people an hour visit each more from local taxpayers than others. These are difficult front counter. Many of those visitors are solicitors decisions, but we decided that that was the fairest visiting the custody facilities or are people whom the solution. I repeat that we want to move away from police have asked to attend, such as in relation to bail or damping to full implementation of the formula as a production of documents. The proposed new opening proper reflection of policing need. It is difficult to do hours for a number of station front counters will meet that when funding is falling, because it means that other two thirds of existing demand, which is concentrated in forces would have to pick up the bill and receive a daytime hours. deeper cut than the level proposed by the Government, I note that the hon. Member for Dudley North has and those forces would not regard that as fair. Nevertheless, said that one third of front-desk inquiries come between I will continue to consider these matters and have just 6 pm and 10 pm. It is worth him looking at the graph reassured the chair of the police authority and the chief produced by the police that shows the actual demand at constable that I will do so. As I continue to take the Dudley police station. I have just been looking at it. He decisions about individual allocations, I will pay the may be right that one third of the inquiries come closest attention to the points being made. between those times, but let us look at the actual My absolute priority is to ensure that the police number of people making visits—those who choose to service retains and enhances its ability to protect and come in, not those who have been asked to come in by serve the public, but for that to happen, business as the police, because clearly they could be asked to come usual is no longer an option for police forces and in at a different time. I think that the hon. Gentleman authorities. A fundamental redesign of police force knows what the numbers are. At 6 o’clock, the average organisation is needed. This cannot be about salami-slicing number was 0.3—0.3 people came in. It was 0.4 at 7 police resources. Her Majesty’s inspectorate of constabulary o’clock, 0.4 at 8 pm and 0.2 at 9 pm. At 10 pm, it was has shown that a significant proportion of the police zero. During daytime hours, when the counter will work force are not working in front-line roles—that is remain open, the peak number of visits to Dudley certainly true in the west midlands—and that there is police station came at 2 pm. I wonder whether the hon. wide variation among forces when it comes to the Gentleman knows how many people came in at that availability and visibility of officers to the public whom peak time. One person came in. We need to understand they serve. That is evidence that forces can do much the scale of the numbers of visits, what hon. Members more to manage their resources better in order to prioritise are asking for and the impression that may be being front-line services. I know that the very good chief given to local people of what the changes to the service constable in the west midlands has embarked on that mean. mission. He is focusing on the redesign of policing that The hon. Member for Walsall North (Mr Winnick) is necessary to deliver a high-quality service to the referred to Bloxwich police station. He is right: there is public, given that resources are diminishing. a little more demand on Bloxwich police station out The test of the effectiveness of a force cannot be the of hours. I do not know whether his figure of an total amount being spent on it or the total number of average of 30 is right. It does not look correct on the staff it employs—or how many police stations it has or figures that I have, but I am happy to take what he says when front counters are open. There is no simple and at face value. I can tell him that the peak number of automatic link between those things and how accessible visits in the daytime occurred at 4 pm and that two the police are or how crime is being fought. The effectiveness people came in. At 10 pm, the start of the out-of-hours of a force depends on how well the resources available service that he was concerned about, it was one person. are used. Therefore we need to get all of this in context. It is plain from the report provided by the chief I have consistently said—this view is shared by chief constable to the police authority last week that West constables—that we must find a new range of strategies Midlands police have devoted more of their resources for the police contacting the public. There are very to managing contact with the public than similar forces good examples up and down the country of forces have, but without reaching the productivity levels that doing far more with their money—getting more bang could be achieved. The cost of that approach is not only for the buck—by finding new ways of contacting the financial; it constrains the ability of the force to return public. Whether that is through the new opportunities officers to the visible policing that the public want. The that various media present, whether it is through contact changes proposed will enable the force to deliver a centres on our new non-emergency number, 101, where £1 million saving on the cost of managing contact with people can get hold of the police, whether it is through the public. They also involve redeploying officers and the internet or whether it is the contact that the police staff to make better use of their time and skills, rather can have through things such as supermarket surgeries, than staffing police counters at times when few people where they can meet thousands of people, rather than 67WH Police Stations (Overnight Staffing)6 DECEMBER 2011 Police Stations (Overnight Staffing) 68WH

[Nick Herbert] The hon. Gentleman raised the issue of police and crime commissioners. I am pleased that he said that he the very few who may come in to a police station, it is was not against them in principle. I know that Labour is incredibly important that we realise that there are many now calling for candidates, and I have no doubt that we more innovative ways by which contact can be maintained. will be putting up a candidate in the west midlands. I do not know whether the hon. Gentleman plans to run. Mr Winnick rose— The truth is that there will be no greater running cost with the police and crime commissioner than there was with the authority. We are absolutely determined about Nick Herbert: If the hon. Gentleman will forgive me, that. There is no reason why the police and crime I must make one or two final points in response to the commissioner should cost more. I believe that it will be hon. Member for Dudley North. I hope that he understands. a full-time position, because it will involve the important job of holding the force to account, which the authority Mr Winnick indicated assent. currently does. It will be vested in one person, rather than the whole authority, so I think that it will be a Nick Herbert: I agree with the hon. Member for full-time job in a big force area. We have just decided Dudley North about the importance of driving savings that it will involve responsibility for victim services as where we can to ensure that front-line activity is protected. well. That should be our shared ambition. I am committed to The police and crime commissioner will do the very it, and so, I know, is Chris Sims. All the things that the important job of holding the force to account and being hon. Gentleman mentioned are exactly the areas where the voice of the people. They will provide a voice for we are doing that. We are driving hard on procurement. exactly this kind of exercise and pay attention to public On police vehicle procurement, which he mentioned, concern, but if I were the police and crime commissioner the Police Act 1996 (Equipment) Regulations 2011 came for the west midlands, I would be looking very hard at into force in March. That means that all forces must the proposals that the chief constable has made. I would now buy vehicles through a national procurement be looking at the numbers and saying, “Actually, they framework. We have identified some £380 million-worth make sense, given that we need to make savings and of savings that could be achieved by police forces through improve the visibility and availability of officers by better use of IT and procurement. That is a very good innovative means.” When we look at the actual number example of what the hon. Gentleman was talking about. of visits that hon. Members have talked about, does it The point about interoperability was also right. He really make sense to be saying that making the changes mentioned interoperability between the blue-light services. is scandalous and wrong and that the service will not be We are encouraging forces to collaborate and share the one that the public need? I suggest that, if people services. He will know about the innovative proposals re-read the report, they will see that the proposal is not that West Midlands police have in relation to business an unreasonable one for the chief constable to make. partnering. We are encouraging the 43 forces to share I understand why hon. Members raise these issues. I services and reduce back-office costs. I strongly agree believe that our objectives are the same, but I also with the hon. Gentleman about all that, and chief believe that in this case they should be supporting the constables are working on it. chief constable in his endeavours. 69WH 6 DECEMBER 2011 Zimbabwe 70WH

Zimbabwe instead, it has to import food. Everything we can do to bring about change and some sense in Zimbabwe would be great. 1.29 pm Andrew Selous (South West Bedfordshire) (Con): It is Andrew Selous: I am really grateful to my hon. Friend a pleasure to serve under your chairmanship, Mrs Riordan. for getting that on the record. I am extremely grateful to Mr Speaker for granting me There were three years of national food deficit in the this debate. 20 years from independence to the beginning of the Zimbabwe is an independent sovereign country, but land invasions, and those three years were actually one with which the United Kingdom has strong historical years of severe drought. In the other years, the country ties. We therefore have a duty to work for the best maintained an export surplus. Since 2000, when the outcomes for the people of Zimbabwe, because to ignore land invasions started, there have been 11 consecutive what is going on there is to condone it. years of food deficit. Let me give a little vignette of what life is like in There are now 1 million AIDS orphans out of a Zimbabwe. Last week, I was sent the story of a Christmas resident population of about 11.5 million. One child in lunch in Zimbabwe, which, with your permission, four has lost one or both parents to AIDS. Meanwhile, Mrs Riordan, I will quickly read out: up to 500,000 of the 1 million farm workers who were removed from white farms have died as a result of a “Half way through lunch two police details came to the combination of malnutrition and inadequate health gathering and informed us that we had not asked for police permission to have the gathering. The member of staff at whose services. house we had gathered and myself were taken to the local police Water supply and sewerage systems are wholly station where we were detained for over two hours before being inadequate, and one of the largest outbreaks of cholera released with a stern warning. We had apparently ignored a law in world history took place in 2008, infecting 100,000 requiring permission to have a gathering at a private house!” people and killing more than 4,000. That is a measure of the level to which Zimbabwe has The country’s jails became concentration camps. For sunk. many people, a petty offence of false conviction became There are seven issues I want to address, but first let a death sentence. Indeed, in 2009, six people starved to me give a little context in respect of recent events. death in their cells. About 4 million Zimbabweans have set up camp over The first major issue I want to concentrate on is the the border in South Africa. They are refugees from their prevention of violence and intimidation in the run-up country because of what has gone on there. That to the general election. In the 2008 elections, polling figure represents between 20% to 30% of Zimbabwe’s station results were used to target areas of Opposition entire population, including the worldwide diaspora of sympathy. Huge groups of militia roamed the countryside, Zimbabweans. beating, burning and killing people at random. Torture There have been terrible violence and brutality. In bases were established—nightmarish places where the 1983 and 1984, there were the massacres of the Ndebele innocent were afflicted for days at a time. people—the first major post-independence dispersion In this period, more than 200 people were killed, of Zimbabweans. This was black-on-black violence, thousands were beaten—hundreds of them now have and tens of thousands of people were displaced. They lifelong disabilities—and tens of thousands were displaced. fled initially to the second city of Bulawayo, while This was revenge and pre-emptive action rolled into others left for Botswana and South Africa. This crime one. The message driven home was that people’s choice against humanity was quickly forgotten by the rest of in the second round of the vote was literally between the world. President Mugabe or death. Rightly or wrongly, the The land invasions that began in 2000 were, effectively, MDC decided to pull out of the election with a week to a Government-sanctioned looting spree and a desperate go, hoping to spare people further suffering. election ploy in reaction to the rapid rise of the Opposition The International Crisis Group in southern Africa Movement for Democratic Change. ZANU-PF was warns that there is a real danger that ZANU-PF will prepared to annihilate vital organs of the economy to employ violence again to force people to vote. As we win the election. Agricultural productivity declined by know, there must be an election before 2013. Reports in 80% between 2002 and 2008. Zimbabwe used to produce the independent press and statements by Opposition about 330,000 tonnes of wheat a year; last year, it parties indicate that violence is already escalating produced 11,000 tonnes, and this year, it produced significantly across the country. 10,000 tonnes. On 10 November, Southern Africa Report, the South African Development Community’s bulletin of political Neil Parish (Tiverton and Honiton) (Con) rose— and economic intelligence, announced that the Zimbabwe Defence Force had taken delivery, via an African Andrew Selous: I give way to my hon. Friend, who is intermediary, of the first of several consignments of an expert on agriculture. Chinese small arms and equipment—a deal said to have been negotiated by Defence Minister Emmerson Neil Parish: I was an election observer in 2000. At Mnangagwa. The consignment included 20,000 AK47 that time, the farms were being overrun. It was not just automatic rifles, uniforms, 12 to 15 trucks and about the white-owned farms that were affected, but all the 21,000 pairs of handcuffs. black workers who were driven off them. Ever since, Given the escalating pre-election violence and ZANU- there has been virtually no production on that land. PF’s consistent history of initiating countrywide campaigns Zimbabwe should be one of the bread baskets of Africa; of violence to force the electorate to vote for President 71WH Zimbabwe6 DECEMBER 2011 Zimbabwe 72WH

[Andrew Selous] it raises concerns about racial issues. It would provide any future democratic Government with support to Mugabe, international observers and monitors are essential, resolve the land issue in Zimbabwe. It would also help and I will press the Minister to respond to that point to restore much needed investor confidence in the country. when he replies. Additionally, a peacekeeping force, I am concerned about the Zimbabwean Government’s which could be deployed in the country at least three consistent refusal and failure to recognise international months ahead of an election, particularly in rural areas, legal judgments. For example, the international and would help to protect the lives, livelihoods and homes regional court of the SADC tribunal, which the SADC of vulnerable communities. The peacekeeping force should Heads of State suspended in May due to pressure from be required to remain in place after the election to President Mugabe and ZANU-PF, needs international prevent violent retribution. support to become a functioning court once more. We need to look at reform of the security forces Individual states must be held accountable in future, so in Zimbabwe, because even under the multi-party that the rule of law and human rights can be promoted Government, the armed forces remain central to all in the SADC region. Pressure needs to be exerted on aspects of life. The Joint Operations Committee, which policy makers, to ensure that the SADC treaty and is a non-statutory body, is made up of President Robert protocol are not changed in the August 2012 SADC Mugabe’s inner circle, and it remains antagonistic to the summit, and I hope that the United Kingdom will be unity Government with Morgan Tsvangirai and the active in ensuring that. Without an international regional MDC. It is also distrustful of non-military politicians, court, there is little hope of effective accountability or even in President Mugabe’s own ZANU-PF party. economic development being able to take place in the The security forces’ access to economic opportunities region. Furthermore, significant economic development has strengthened their bond with President Mugabe cannot take place without respect for property rights, and their willingness to defend the status quo. While human rights and the rule of law, something with which conventional military capacity and competence have the UK Government are already properly concerned in declined massively since the 1990s, Zimbabwe’s security their international development policy. forces remain a major and arguably the central obstacle I want to turn to the Marange diamond fields. I am to the resolution of the country’s political instability. grateful to the hon. Members who have joined me for Unless the security sector is reformed, violence initiated the debate. They may be aware that participants in the by ZANU-PF is likely to continue, making the holding Kimberley process agreed to relax the ban on export of free and fair elections problematic at the very least. sales last month, subject to an adequate verification On racism, there are further steps that we can take. Is regime being in place. The European Union, the United it not a pity that Zimbabwe does not look across the States and Canada switched from opposition to the ban border to Zambia, one of whose vice-presidents, Dr Guy to abstention. The human rights group, Global Witness, Scott, happens to be white and a democratically elected is leaving the Kimberley process in protest at that politician? Would it not be good if Zimbabwe had the decision. It is estimated that last week’s diamond auction same spirit as Zambia and took the same action? could raise about $300 million US dollars. Contacts Zimbabwe actually signed the United Nations convention that I have in Zimbabwe commented earlier this week as on the elimination of all forms of racial discrimination follows: on 13 May 1991. That bound Zimbabwe to allow its “The situation is worse now than it has even been, the needs people full and equal enjoyment of human rights and are spiralling. The theft of the diamonds has sadly given ZANU-PF fundamental freedoms, as well as the right to property a new lease of life and the future looks grim. There is no reason to think that when Mugabe dies the position will improve.” and protection before the law. It also condemned racial propaganda and hate speech. Unfortunately, it does not That gloomy prognosis for Zimbabwe directly relates to allow for individuals to activate procedures to get the the sales of diamonds from the Marange mine. UN to ensure compliance; it needs a fellow signatory United Nations state to do that. Ian Paisley (North Antrim) (DUP): Does the hon. For more than a decade, the Zimbabwe Government Gentleman agree that although the picture may look and ZANU-PF have been allowed to get away with grim, as the wave of life eventually laps from Mr Mugabe, demonstrably defying the treaty. No signatory state has there is a significant opportunity for that country to called for an investigation. No signatory state has asked once again re-establish and redevelop itself and put in for the 18-member sitting committee of independent place the democratic structures that ought to be? experts to be activated and to go to Zimbabwe. No signatory state appears to care enough about racial Andrew Selous: I am grateful to my hon. Friend for discrimination in Zimbabwe to do anything about it. attending the debate and intervening. Like him, I am an Frankly, many people find that hypocritical. optimist; I think that Zimbabwe can have a fantastic What would the benefits be of a signatory state future, given its agricultural productivity, the resources getting the UN committee to investigate under article of its people and its natural advantages in the region. 11 of the convention? The committee would undoubtedly The challenge for us is to help the political process to act as a deterrent for continued acts of abuse in the land allow that to happen, so I agree with the point that he programme and the indigenisation programme, just as made. the habitat investigation acted as a deterrent to stop the On the treatment of Zimbabwean Anglicans, hon. further destruction of hundreds of thousands of homes Members may know that the Archbishop of Canterbury, by state bulldozers back in 2005. It would help protect Rowan Williams, was recently accompanied in Zimbabwe the region’s judiciary, by taking the issue to an independent by bishops, not only from Zimbabwe, but from South UN body, and it would provide the west with a defence Africa, Tanzania, Botswana and Malawi, all of whom against the fantastical charges of neo-colonialism when were absolutely horrified at what has been happening to 73WH Zimbabwe6 DECEMBER 2011 Zimbabwe 74WH

Zimbabwe’s Anglicans. Since 2007, Anglican congregations that it will make a difference to the political framework have suffered systematic harassment and persecution at of getting a peaceful resolution and a free and fair the hands of the police, often in direct contravention of election? court rulings. A report, which was handed to President Robert Mugabe, outlined details of that litany of abuses, Andrew Selous: I welcome the comments of the hon. which include false imprisonment, violence and denial Lady, who is chair of the all-party group on Zimbabwe. of access to churches, schools, clinics and mission stations. She is right; the current regime has concerns about the sanctions. I think that they are partially effective. Her In the dioceses of Harare and Manicaland, properties comments are wise, and I hope that the Minister will belonging to the Anglican province have been head her words. misappropriated. It is a matter of the greatest sadness that Zimbabwean Anglicans are being prevented from Oliver Colvile (Plymouth, Sutton and Devonport) continuing their work supporting local and often very (Con): I congratulate my hon. Friend on securing the needy communities with health care and education. debate. Does he recognise that South Africa is vital to Their priests and people are being denied access to their getting a political solution in that part of southern own clinics and schools. Many such institutions have Africa? A very big problem for President Zuma is that been taken from Zimbabwe’s Anglicans, and are now President Mugabe is still seen as a war hero and as the under corrupt or poor management, being rapidly run last war hero from the great struggle in the first place. into the ground and stripped of their assets. Details of That has made life difficult for President Zuma in trying that unwarranted activity and its impact on local to deliver. communities were presented to President Mugabe in a report by Archbishop Rowan Williams. Every week, Andrew Selous: My hon. Friend is absolutely right, tens of thousands of Anglicans are denied their basic and on hearing the remarks of former Archbishop right to worship, because of the lies and falsifications Desmond Tutu, with which I intend to conclude, he will propagated by the now excommunicated former bishop, hear that he is also in agreement with him on that point. Dr Kunonga, and his associates. Our own Archbishop of York, John Sentamu, was I have concerns about how the sanctions might be born in Uganda in 1949. A former lawyer, he incurred being evaded in Zimbabwe, and I ask that the Minister the wrath of the dictator, Idi Amin, because of his looks into that. A glaring issue is that nationals of judicial independence, and was locked up for 90 days countries, including the UK, that have applied the three weeks after his marriage. In a speech in 2007, he sanctions—both individuals and companies—have described how he had been continued to support the regime and nothing has been “kicked around like a football and beaten terribly”. done about them. The British Government and others He is a man who has suffered in a similar way to many punish ZANU-PF, but fail to police their own citizens Zimbabweans. He went on countless marches to campaign and, according to my sources, that includes companies for the end of the unilateral declaration of independence such Old Mutual. of Ian Smith and calls Zimbabwe ZANU-PF officials have been able to externalise “a scourge on the conscience of the entire world”. huge quantities of funds through share swaps between He is disappointed by the African Union’s response to the Zimbabwean and London stock exchanges. Old Zimbabwe. He calls for the UN to make Zimbabwe a Mutual has joint ventures with the Government of priority, saying: Zimbabwe that started before the formation of the “If it does not, the blood that is spilled will also be on their unity Government, yet nothing is done. Moreover, those hands.” investments are directly connected to gross human rights He has also called for President Mugabe and his officials abuses. Old Mutual has shares in a joint venture on the to be brought before the International Criminal Court. diamond fields where more than 200 panners in rags were gunned down from helicopters to clear the decks Desmond Tutu is Archbishop Emeritus of South for investors. There are numerous reports of ongoing Africa. He said that the incomprehensible greed, appalling abuses. I understand that Old Mutual claims that any lack of compassion and unspeakable cruelty demonstrated regrettable events predate its involvement. by the Zimbabwean elite contradict the classical African concept of ubuntu—the essence of being human. He The Central African Mining and Exploration Company described the purchased land from the Zimbabwean Government believed to have been extorted from another mining company “state-orchestrated crimes against humanity on a massive scale countrywide” and, in doing so, poured tens of millions into the pockets of the regime at a time when it needed election and said that Zimbabwe’s plight is all our plight and resources. What action can the British Government that take on those issues? “to ignore its suffering is to condone it.” The final words of my contribution should come I look forward to hearing what action the UK from two black Africans, not a white Englishman. Government will take, particularly on election observers, the outstanding SADC legal judgements, action in the United Nations, the integrity of the sanctions regime Kate Hoey (Vauxhall) (Lab): I congratulate the hon. and the Marange diamond fields. Gentleman on securing the debate. Before he concludes, will he say something more about sanctions and restricted measures? He understands, as does the Minister, that 1.50 pm the EU will decide what will happen with sanctions in The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Foreign February. Does he agree that it must be handled incredibly and Commonwealth Affairs (Mr Henry Bellingham): carefully and that we must not rush into removing any First, I congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for of those restricted measures, unless there is real evidence South West Bedfordshire (Andrew Selous) on securing 75WH Zimbabwe6 DECEMBER 2011 Zimbabwe 76WH

[Mr Henry Bellingham] Ian Paisley: I would like to put on record my thanks to the Minister for his kindness and his good work and this debate, and I praise him for his concise and compelling briefing that he has given many of us across the House speech. If I do not answer all his points, I shall write to on Africa and African issues. him after the debate. Recently I had the opportunity of hosting Roy Bennett here. Will the Minister consider arranging for his officials The timing of the debate is certainly opportune— and himself to receive a briefing from Roy Bennett ZANU-PF is currently holding its conference in Bulawayo, about some of the on-going party persecutions in and it has an important few days ahead of it. Next year Zimbabwe? and early 2013 will be a pivotal time for Zimbabwe. The actions that ZANU-PF and other political parties take in the next 18 months will have a huge impact on the Mr Bellingham: I am grateful to the hon. Gentleman shape of Zimbabwe’s future. for raising his meeting with Roy Bennett. I also had the chance to meet Roy Bennett when he was here, about six Our policy at such a crucial moment can be summed weeks ago. He gave us a fairly comprehensive report, up simply: we want to do all that we can to support the which we have seen. We will look at any other report he Zimbabwean people’s aspirations for a more democratic, produces, because we have great admiration and respect stable and prosperous country. To set out what that for him. means, it might be useful for me to provide a brief My hon. Friend the Member for South West Bedfordshire update on the situation on the ground and the role that mentioned Marange diamonds. I would like to touch the UK is playing. briefly on the recent Kinshasa agreement of the Kimberley process. It was the result of considerable diplomatic It is important to recognise that the reform process effort by the European Union and our partners, and we has not stood still. Although movement is slow and can played a full role in it. I believe that the outcome, often be obscured by events, progress has been made. although not perfect, is a reasonable one for both The economy, under the stewardship of the quite excellent Zimbabwe and the KP. We went into the negotiations Finance Minister Tendai Biti, continues to show signs with clear red lines on what we would not compromise of robust recovery. He forecast an impressive 9.5% on, and they remained intact in the final deal. growth in 2012 in his budget speech last week. There is a lively media, and newspapers that are openly critical of Under the terms of the agreement, Zimbabwe can the Government are sold every day on the street corners export only diamonds from the Marange region that of Harare. The provision of basic services has improved comply with KP standards. We need only to look at out of all recognition, supported by the important Minister Biti’s budget statement to see the importance contributions of the Department for International of that revenue to the Zimbabwean Treasury.Furthermore, Development and others in the donor community. the agreement establishes a credible and independent Textbooks are now in every secondary school, medicines monitoring mechanism to ensure that the standards are are in hospitals, and food is on the shelves. Zimbabwe respected, which includes a role for civil society. The has come a long way since its nadir in 2008, and we can EU, Canada and other countries were pivotal in driving be proud of the role that we have played. that forward. The United States abstained, but we were satisfied with the outcome because our red lines were There has also been progress, but not as much, in the kept in place. political arena. Constitutional reform is moving forward, I will say something about the subject of land and the and although the process has been tough and slow, continuing practice of illegal farm invasions. Such abuses there seems to be no doubt on any side that a new are once again increasing in frequency. It causes privation constitution will be adopted before the next elections. not only to farmers and their workers, who are being There will almost certainly be a referendum on the new forced from their land, but to the entire agricultural constitution early next year. sector of Zimbabwe. As my hon. Friend pointed out, tobacco yields are down 38% on 2000 levels, and wheat However, despite those green shoots of progress, yields are down a staggering 82%. As my hon. Friend there are considerable causes for concern. There are still the Member for Tiverton and Honiton (Neil Parish) those in Zimbabwe who seek to erode the reform process said, the fact that a country of Zimbabwe’s agricultural to retain their personal hold on power. The promising potential still requires food aid for its citizens is quite figures of the budget mask an unsustainable over-spend appalling, and it is a result of destructive and vindictive in public sector salaries. Violence and intimidation targeting land policies. activists from civil society and both Movements for Democratic Change continue, especially at the hands of It is not only the UK that judges such actions to be the Chipangano militia group in Harare. Partisan political illegal and in contravention of the global political agreement; bias within the state security mechanisms threatens to it was also the judgment of a 2008 Southern African undermine Zimbabwe’s democratic foundation, as has Development Community tribunal, which ruled in favour been demonstrated by the cancellation of four Movement of three Zimbabwean farmers, including the late Mike for Democratic Change-Tsvangirai rallies by the police Campbell. The demise of that tribunal was a retrograde last month. A particularly acute illustration of that step for regional law, but despite its suspension, the concern is the recent death threat made by an alleged ruling was upheld by a South African court this June. state security officer to an MDC-T Member of Parliament, We have always recognised the central importance of in response to points raised about the Marange diamond the land question to Zimbabwe, which is why we contributed fields in a parliamentary debate. My hon. Friend the to a land redistribution programme immediately after Member for South West Bedfordshire also gave other independence. While we have never accepted the allegation examples. that the UK alone should fund compensation for land 77WH Zimbabwe6 DECEMBER 2011 Zimbabwe 78WH redistribution, we remain willing to engage other donors commission and an electoral roll that is fit for purpose. in a land reform programme in Zimbabwe that is As he pointed out, it is vital that the police and army transparent, fair and pro-poor. We regard a land audit, stay out of the electoral process. as provided for in the GPA, to be a necessary first step Regional engagement is essential. No country exists in the process, and the EU made it clear some time ago in a vacuum. I certainly agree with my hon. Friend that that it was willing to fund such an exercise. the recent Zambian election provides an impressive Continued farm invasions are symptomatic of a wider regional role model to follow. We, as outsiders, have disregard for human rights, which extends to those of only a secondary role to play, but I assure Members that different political and religious persuasions. I welcome we have been absolutely explicit in assuring the southern the suggestion made by my hon. Friend the Member for African region of our commitment to and full support South West Bedfordshire on the UN convention, and I for their efforts. We stand ready to do more if called will write separately to him. I want to assure the House upon, and have made clear, for example, our willingness that the Zimbabwean Government are under no illusions to participate in the provision of international monitors. of our strong condemnation of the ongoing abuses. As for the EU’s targeted measures, we have made it The enduring uncertainty over the timing of the next crystal-clear—I say this clearly to the hon. Member for elections is at the centre of much of the abuse. Under Vauxhall (Kate Hoey)—that we stand ready to revisit the terms of the existing constitution, elections must be the measures only in response to concrete changes on held by June 2013. What is crucial is that polls, when the ground. held, are preceded by the necessary reforms and avoid Zimbabwe is facing an absolutely critical time. Lessons the devastating levels of violence that were seen in 2008. must be learned from what has happened elsewhere in To that end, the UK fully supports the efforts of SADC, Africa, including northern Africa. A free and fair poll, particularly those of South Africa and President Zuma, which respects the will of the democratic majority of as they work with all three main Zimbabwean parties to Zimbabweans, should follow the example of Zambia— agree a path to the finalisation of the GPA and a road map to elections. I assure my hon. Friend that the road 2pm map will include key items, such as provision for proper Sitting adjourned without Question put (Standing Order observers and monitors, a fully independent electoral No. 10(11)).

9WS Written Ministerial Statements6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Ministerial Statements 10WS

Accordingly, the Government are announcing today Written Ministerial that regulations have been laid to clarify the time at which companies with foreign currency loan relationships Statements or derivative contracts and matched foreign currency shares, ships or aircraft come within the provisions of the Loan Relationships and Derivative Contracts (Disregard Tuesday 6 December 2011 and Bringing into Account of Profits and Losses) Regulations 2004 (the disregard regulations). These regulations put beyond doubt that companies can only defer foreign exchange gains and losses under ATTORNEY-GENERAL the disregard regulations from the date that they have a foreign currency loan relationship or derivative contract which is matched with shares, ships or aircraft. The Ratcliffe-on-Soar Power Station regulations will apply to shares, ships or aircraft which are matched on or after 6 December 2011. The clarification follows disclosure of an avoidance The Attorney-General (Mr Dominic Grieve): On 13 July scheme in which companies claim to permanently defer 2011 a written ministerial statement was presented to foreign exchange gains on foreign currency loan both Houses setting out the decision by Keir Starmer relationships and derivative contracts by retrospectively QC, to ask the Chief Surveillance Commissioner and designating the loan relationship as a hedge of newly retired Court of Appeal judge, Sir Christopher Rose, to acquired foreign currency share capital. The regulations conduct an independent inquiry following concerns will prevent future avoidance in this area and protect about the non-disclosure of material relating to the significant amounts of revenue. activities of an undercover police officer and suggestions Further details have today been published on HMRC’s that the CPS had suppressed evidence in relation to the website, together with the regulations, technical note Ratcliffe-on-Soar power station protest cases. and tax information and impact note. The Director of Public Prosecutions committed to making public the findings of the independent inquiry and a copy of Sir Christopher Rose’s report has today Bank Remuneration Disclosures been placed in the Libraries of both Houses. The report is also available online at www.cps.gov.uk. Sir Christopher has concluded that although there The Financial Secretary to the Treasury (Mr Mark were individual failings, there was no deliberate or Hoban): The Government have today launched a dishonest withholding of information by the prosecution. consultation on a mandatory requirement for the largest More detailed conclusions can be found within the UK banks and foreign banks operating in the UK to report. publish the details of the level and composition of Sir Christopher has recommended that more explicit remuneration of their eight highest-paid senior executive guidance be included in the prosecution team disclosure officers. The first disclosures would be made in 2012, in manual, a recommendation which the Crown Prosecution respect of the 2011 financial year. Service (CPS) have agreed to adopt. In addition and in In February 2011, the Government announced an light of the report, the Director of Public Prosecutions accord between the UK Government and major UK has decided that specific training should be delivered to banks under the name “Project Merlin”. As part of this all senior lawyers in the CPS casework divisions and announcement, the Government committed to consulting complex casework units about the proper handling of on extending the remuneration disclosures of the highest- cases involving undercover officers. All chief Crown paid non-board executives made under Project Merlin prosecutors and any staff who chair CPS case management to major UK banks from 2012 onwards. panels should undergo the same training. Remuneration practices in the financial services sector Sir Christopher worked in tandem with the IPCC in have incentivised excessive risk-taking in some cases, this matter sharing all relevant information. Sir Christopher’s contributing to the severity of the financial crisis. While inquiry focused on the CPS’handling of the Ratcliffe-on-Soar a number of UK, international and European initiatives power station protests. The IPCC are conducting their have led to improvements in the alignment of risk and own inquiry which will be published in due course. reward in the financial services sector, more detailed remuneration disclosures for the highest-paid senior executives at the largest firms will provide better oversight of incentives. This information will encourage improved TREASURY shareholder governance and enhance public scrutiny, which, in turn, is expected to facilitate better decision making by boards in relation to senior executive pay. Anti-avoidance Regulations These proposals have been designed to minimise potential costs and external impacts, including the impact on privacy. A full explanation of the regulatory changes The Exchequer Secretary to the Treasury (Mr David and draft implementing provisions is set out in the Gauke): The Government are determined to reduce tax consultation document and impact assessment. The avoidance in order to protect the Exchequer, which consultation will be published on the HM Treasury provides funding for public services, and maintain fairness website, and the consultation period is scheduled to end for the taxpayer. on 14 February 2012. 11WS Written Ministerial Statements6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Ministerial Statements 12WS

Following consideration of responses to this amend the bank levy to ensure that the liabilities of joint consultation, the Government will take a decision on ventures are correctly aggregated into a foreign banking whether amendments to the draft legislation are required, group or a relevant non banking group’s chargeable equity before publishing a summary of responses document and liabilities; to ensure that double taxation relief can be restricted where the amount of a foreign bank levy subsequently and laying final regulations before Parliament during is reduced; and to amend the powers allowing the rules for summer 2012. the exchange of information with foreign authorities to work as intended. The changes to the rules on joint ventures will have effect for chargeable periods ending on or after Draft Legislation for Finance Bill 2012 and Tax Policy 1 January 2012. Update The Government will propose amendments in Finance Bill 2013 to two pieces of legislation designed to protect the UK tax base. These are contained in sections 714 to 751 of the Income Tax Act 2007 (transfer of assets The Exchequer Secretary to the Treasury (Mr David abroad) and section 13 of the Taxation of Chargeable Gauke): Following Budget 2011, the Government consulted Gains Act 1992 (gains on assets held by foreign companies on a number of tax policies. Today the Government are closely controlled by UK participators). A further publishing the responses to these consultations alongside announcement will be made around Budget 2012 and draft clauses for legislation to be included in Finance the Government intend to publish a consultation including Bill 2012. This fulfils our objective to confirm the draft legislation at that time. majority of intended tax changes at least three months ahead of publication. The Government also announce the withdrawal of five extra statutory concessions and a consultation on The draft clauses will be open to technical consultation supplementary legislation for two concessions. The until 10 February 2012. withdrawals will have effect from the beginning of the Details of the clauses published today are set out in 2013-14 tax year. Further details are available on the HMRC the overview of draft legislation document, which also website. includes tax information and impact notes for each The Government have also tabled two further written measure. All publications will be available on the HMT statements today which: and HMRC websites. set out legislation for Finance Bill 2012 which has effect The Government are making additional changes to from today; and tax policy. Legislation will be introduced in the Finance provide further details on non-domicile taxation and the Bill 2012 to: statutory residence test. provide that visiting EU forces and their civilian staff receive the tax treatment to which they are entitled under the EU status of forces agreement. Similar treatment already applies to visiting North Atlantic Treaty Organisation (NATO) forces. Draft Legislation for Finance Bill 2012: Measures with Immediate Effect exempt from income tax payments of the continuity of education allowance to service personnel in the armed forces. ensure that individuals provided with security enhanced cars The Exchequer Secretary to the Treasury (Mr David are not unfairly impacted by the abolition of the £80,000 cap Gauke): This Government are committed to creating a on the cash equivalent of the benefit on company cars. fair tax system and will take the necessary steps to exempt from UK taxation, money earned by non-resident prevent the loss of tax revenues. footballers and team officials in relation to the Champions The Government are announcing today measures League final in 2013, which will be held at Wembley. which will protect the Exchequer and maintain fairness ensure that existing tax rules dealing with tax adjustments in the tax system. The legislation for these measures will arising on a change in accounting policy continue to apply have effect from today and will be included in Finance following the expected changes to UK generally accepted accounting practice in 2012. The legislation will apply to Bill 2012. changes in accounting policy where accounts are prepared The protocol on announcements made outside scheduled after 1 January 2012. fiscal events, published at Budget 2011, sets out the introduce a lower rate of 20% of the full rates of climate criteria the Government will observe when changing change levy for supplies of taxable commodities used in the legislation with immediate effect. The Government are recycling of steel and aluminium, from 1 April 2012. acting in accordance with the protocol in announcing make consequential amendments to stamp duty land tax the following changes to legislation. reliefs arising from provisions of the Health and Social Care Lloyd’s stop-loss insurance Bill. Legislation will be introduced to ensure that all premiums make further changes to the capital allowances anti-avoidance payable by corporate members of Lloyd’s in respect of rules that apply to transactions involving plant or machinery member-level stop-loss reinsurance shall be deducted following the announcement on 12 August 2011 to close for tax purposes in the same period in which the profits down a loophole in the legislation. to which they relate are recognised. The legislation will take a power to modify the stamp duty land tax disclosure of apply to all premiums paid in respect of policies taken tax avoidance schemes regime to facilitate both the removal out on or after 6 December 2011 to remove the benefit of the grandfathering rules for certain avoidance schemes using the sub-sale rules and the removal of the property of the current mismatch without further delay. valuation thresholds for disclosure. Scope of the supplementary charge provide double taxation relief for remote gaming duty, general The Government are introducing legislation, taking betting duty and pool betting duty following the announcement effect from 6 December 2011, to prevent a potential loss on 18 July 2011 of a review of remote gambling taxation. of tax by ensuring that the supplementary charge applies 13WS Written Ministerial Statements6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Ministerial Statements 14WS to ring-fence chargeable gains and to confirm that the The Government have also tabled two further written scope of the supplementary charge matches that of statements today which: ring-fence corporation tax. set out legislation for Finance Bill 2012 and updates on tax Section 171a of the Taxation of Chargeable Gains policy; and Act 1992 will be amended to provide that an election set out legislation for Finance Bill 2012 which has effect cannot be made to transfer a ring fence chargeable gain from today. from a company carrying on a ring fence trade to a company not carrying on a ring fence trade. Section 330 of the Corporation Tax Act 2010 will be amended to put beyond doubt that supplementary charge CULTURE, MEDIA AND SPORT is charged by reference to all of the ring fence profits of a company that are chargeable to corporation tax; that is by reference to its chargeable gains in addition to the Government Olympic Executive Quarterly Report, trading profits arising to the company as a result of its December 2011 ring fence trade. Further details have today been published on HMRC’s website, together with the proposed draft legislation The Minister for Sport and the Olympics (Hugh and tax information and impact notes. Robertson): I am publishing today the Government The Government have also tabled two further written Olympic Executive’s Quarterly Report—“London 2012 statements today which: Olympic and Paralympic Games Quarterly Report December 2011”. This report explains the latest budget set out legislation for Finance Bill 2012 and updates on tax policy; and position as at 30 September 2011, and outlines some of the investments which are being made to capitalise on provide further details on non-domicile taxation and the statutory residence test. the London 2012 Olympic and Paralympic games. The anticipated final cost (AFC) of the Olympic Non-Domicile Taxation and Statutory Residence Test Delivery Authority’s (ODA) construction and infrastructure programme is £6.856 billion. This is a decrease of £394 million since July—including £333 million that the The Exchequer Secretary to the Treasury (Mr David ODA has returned to DCMS for transformation work Gauke): At Budget 2011, the Government announced a to be carried out by the Olympic Park Legacy Company package of reforms to the taxation of non-domiciled (OPLC), and savings of £61 million. On a like-for-like individuals and their intention to introduce a statutory basis with previous reports, which included the definition of tax residence. transformation work in ODA’s programme, the ODA’s Following consultation, the core reforms to non-domicile AFC stands at £7.189 billion. taxation will be included in Finance Bill 2012 as announced The ODA has achieved £42 million of savings in the and draft legislation is published today. This comprises quarter, taking the total amount of savings achieved the introduction of a higher £50,000 annual charge, a since the November 2007 baseline to over £910 million. new relief to encourage business investment and technical Construction of the venues and infrastructure for the simplifications to some aspects of the existing non-domicile games is 92% complete with the majority of venues on rules. the Olympic park now complete. Contracts for the sale The legislation of Statement of Practice 1/09, which of the Olympic village to Delancey/Qatari Diar (QDD) is one of the simplifications to the existing non-domicile joint venture have been exchanged generating a net rules, will be taken forward in Finance Bill 2013 to take benefit of £14 million above the previous forecast. effect from April 2013. With just over eight months to go until the opening The consultation on tax residence raised a number of ceremony of the London 2012 Olympic and Paralympic detailed issues which will require careful consideration games, we are in a strong position and the list of to ensure the legislation achieves its important aim of completed venues now includes the velodrome (nominated providing certainty for individuals and businesses. The for the RIBA Stirling Prize 2011), the main stadium, Government will therefore legislate the statutory residence the handball arena, the basketball arena, the aquatics test in Finance Bill 2013 to take effect from April 2013 centre and the international broadcast centre (IBC). rather than April 2012. It will introduce any reforms to During the “One Year to Go” celebrations at the end of ordinary residence at the same time. This will give time July, the completed aquatics centre was unveiled to the to consult thoroughly on the detail of these changes public and diver Tom Daly marked the occasion by well in advance of implementation. taking the first official dive into the pool. The Government are committed to the form of the The consistent and careful management of the London statutory residence test outlined in consultation. They 2012 programme has enabled us to fund additional will make a further announcement around Budget 2012 security requirements, and invest in projects to help when it will publish their response to the recent consultation drive economic growth and tourism as a result of the together with a further consultation on policy detail games, all while staying within the £9.3 billion public and draft legislation. sector funding package (PSFP). This will ensure that the full package of measures The Home Office and LOCOG have undertaken detailed announced at Budget 2011 will be implemented in a analysis of the venue security staff that will be needed two-step programme that will be completed in Finance across the UK across a range of London 2012 venues Bill 2013. The Government remain committed to making next summer. Our priority is to deliver a safe and secure no further substantive changes to these rules for the games therefore we have allocated an additional £271 million remainder of this Parliament. for venue security. This figure includes the recruitment 15WS Written Ministerial Statements6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Ministerial Statements 16WS and training of 23,700 venue security personnel based Council Directive 1999/74/EC, which lays down on more than 100 competition and non-competition minimum standards for the protection of laying hens, venues across the UK. bans the keeping of hens in conventional (“battery”) We are confident that the core safety and security cages from 1 January 2012. This represents one of the programme can be delivered within the £475million most significant welfare advances across the EU and announced in December 2010’s spending review settlement. DEFRA, along with the devolved Administrations, has In order to test the effectiveness, resilience and decision- been working hard to see it effectively implemented making capability of key games-time structures and across the European Union. processes, we have also apportioned a further £2.8 million The Government acknowledge the sterling job that for games-time command, co-ordination and the UK egg industry has done in preparing for the ban communication testing. and the very big investment made in converting to other Historically, the opening and closing ceremonies are production systems, demonstrating its commitment to some of the most memorable and enduring spectacles animal welfare, which is also a serious consideration for from every Olympic and Paralympic games. They represent many consumers when purchasing food. The vast majority a unique opportunity to showcase the creative talent of of UK producers will be compliant by 1 January 2012. the host nation to a global audience of billions. The It is a different story across Europe. 13 of the 27 member four ceremonies will have an equivalent airtime value states have said that they will not be ready. There could estimated at between £2 billion and £5 billion. To ensure be about 50 million hens that will still be in conventional that the UK capitalises on this opportunity, the Government cages across the EU in unacceptable conditions on have made available up to £41 million to LOCOG 1 January 2012. (£7 million of which is Government-held contingency) We want to protect our producers who have invested to support the delivery of the four Olympic and Paralympic some £400 million in converting out of conventional ceremonies. cages, equivalent to spending £25 per hen housed. To The Government have also allocated £25 million this end, I have met with the Commission a number of from the PSFP for domestic and international campaigns times over the last year in an attempt to find a solution. to drive economic benefits, including tourism, from the A reliance on infraction proceedings against non-compliant games. The “GREAT” campaign launched by the Prime member states will not be enough to deal with the Minister in the autumn and led by VisitBritain, will negative impact that non-compliance would cause and promote the UK as a destination for tourism and that additional enforcement measures would need to be inward investment in key overseas markets. Run in put in place to prevent market disturbance. In September, partnership with UKTI, FCO and British Council we the Secretary of State wrote jointly with nine other estimate that this campaign will attract an extra 800,000 concerned member states to the European Commission visitors, generating around £400 million of additional urging them to act quickly. At the October Agriculture spend per annum, as well as attracting £1 billion worth Council, the Commission indicated that despite their of additional trade and investment. The 70-day Olympic efforts an intra-Community trade ban was not legally torch relay is a unique opportunity for each of our possible. regions to showcase their culture and heritage to a The Commission then turned to looking for a robust national audience. Funding of up to £4 million has been enforcement approach that avoids large numbers of released so that we can use the tour to increase domestic producers having to close down their operations and tourism across the UK. Through the domestic tourism the destruction of millions of hens and non-compliant campaign, it is estimated that 5.3 million additional eggs, while at the same time protecting all those producers short break nights will be generated by 2015, creating who have complied with the ban and implemented a around £480 million of additional consumer spending. flagship animal welfare issue. While I never wished to I would like to commend this report to the members see the 2012 deadline delayed, I was willing to explore of both Houses and thank them for their continued the idea of a practical solution which would give some interest in and support for the London 2012 games. protection to UK and other compliant producers, by ensuring eggs from illegal cages did not leave the country Copies of the Quarterly Report December 2011 are of origin. available online at: www.culture.gov.uk and will be deposited in the Libraries of both Houses. There was a meeting at official level on 29 November, where the Commission said that the early stages of pre-infraction procedures had already begun with non- compliant member states. The idea of a gentleman’s ENVIRONMENT, FOOD AND RURAL AFFAIRS agreement will not be progressed, but the Commission has asked for action plans from all non-compliant member states, many of whom supported keeping non- EU Ban (Keeping of Hens in Conventional Cages) compliant eggs within national borders. The Commission’s Food and Veterinary Office missions will be targeted at the beginning of 2012 at non-compliant member states The Minister of State, Department for Environment, and all member states have been asked to submit lists of Food and Rural Affairs (Mr James Paice): I know many compliant and non-compliant producers. members of the House have been following progress on We have decided that the UK enforcement strategy to the implementation of the EU-wide ban on the keeping deal with non-compliance with the conventional cage of hens in conventional cages. I, therefore, want to take ban will be robust. this opportunity to update the House and explain how The Government have thoroughly investigated the the ban will be enforced by DEFRA and the devolved possibility of taking unilateral action and bringing in a Administrations. UK ban on all imports of egg and egg products which 17WS Written Ministerial Statements6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Ministerial Statements 18WS have been produced in conventional cages in other Retailers, food manufacturers, food service companies member states. However, given the very significant legal and processors have come out publically in support of and financial implications of introducing such a ban, UK egg producers. The British Retail Consortium has coupled with practical difficulties in enforcing it, it is guaranteed that conventional caged eggs will not be not a realistic option. bought by the major retailers or used as ingredients in Instead, DEFRA and the devolved Administrations their own brand products. They have put in place stringent will be adopting the most robust enforcement approach traceability tests to ensure that they will not be buying available to us within the legal constraints that exist. conventional caged eggs. Retailers that have made this Risk-based surveillance to ensure imported shell eggs guarantee are Marks and Spencer, Morrisons, Asda, J from other member states have been produced in compliance Sainsbury, Co-operative Group, Tesco, Waitrose, Iceland with the cage ban will be in place from 1 January. The Foods, Greggs, Starbucks and McDonald’s. Many food Animal Health and Veterinary Laboratories Agency manufacturers and food service companies have also (AHVLA) is the body responsible for enforcing the given a similar guarantee for eggs or egg products. They conventional cage ban in Great Britain. Its knowledge include: Premier Foods plc, Marlow Foods Ltd, United of the industry and those importing eggs, coupled with Biscuits, Ferrero UK, Apetito, Allied Mills, Allied Bakeries, an understanding of a member state’s level of compliance Burton’s Biscuit Company, Speedibake, Dairy Crest, will define the level of surveillance. The Silver Spoon Company, Westmill Foods, Compass, Baxter Storey, and Sodexo. The following egg processors AHVLA surveillance on imports of shell eggs will have also signed up to not sourcing conventional caged use ultraviolet light analysis to identify batches of caged eggs from 1 January 2012: Manton’s, Noble Foods, eggs that are not from an enriched cage environment. Framptons, Fridays, Oaklands Farm Eggs, Lowrie Foods, This technique has successfully been used to date to and the UK Egg Centre. We are in discussion with identify caged eggs within batches described as being others who we hope to be able to add to this list. produced in alternative systems, for example, free-range. It has not up until now been used to specifically identify The UK is 82% self-sufficient in egg and egg products, different types of caged egg production, but we have with the remaining 18% coming from other member had the technique independently validated and it can be states. Of the 18% of egg and egg products being done. This technique will be used as a marker to prompt imported, approximately 50% will be imported as shell further action. Once suspected non-compliant shell eggs egg and 50% imported as egg product (liquid or powder). are identified, AHVLA will contact the Competent The fact that we have managed to get the majority of Authority in the originating member state and ask for UK processors on board, reduces the likelihood confirmation of the system of production. of non-compliant egg products being imported and If they are found to be from an illegal system, they demonstrates that full traceability is possible and should will be prevented from being marketed as class A eggs not be used as a justification by others to say that it is and would be sent for processing (i.e. be treated as class not. B eggs)—if indeed any UK processors would accept Ultimately, it will be for the Competent Authority in them. If the eggs were found to be from a compliant each member state to take responsibility at source for system, the eggs would be released. ensuring that their producers no longer keep hens in We believe this scrutiny will mean importers will conventional cages post 1 January 2012. If a retailer make greater efforts to ensure the source and integrity purchased eggs from a conventional cage that are marked of the eggs they import, given the economic disadvantage incorrectly as class A, without exercising appropriate that would follow if they were importing illegally produced due diligence, they would be committing a marketing eggs. We have no wish to hinder legal trade or disadvantage offence. The caterer, processor or product manufacturer compliant producers wherever they are in Europe and might also be guilty of aiding and abetting such an we are quite happy to use member states’ own lists of offence if they knowingly purchased eggs purporting to compliant producers, which AHVLA can check against be class A which derive from illegal cages. and which will mean that these consignments are less The Government will also do their bit to protect likely to be held up. compliant producers. We will be making necessary changes However, the import of processed egg, principally in to the Government Buying Standards mandatory criteria liquid or powdered form, is less easy to trace as the to ensure that eggs produced in conventional cages, are supply chain is less transparent and more challenging to not used in any form whether this is fresh, powdered or audit. Because of a loophole in the egg marketing liquid. regulations, we cannot prohibit the marketing of any Given our commitment to support compliant producers, eggs produced in conventional cages from 1 January we will also be taking tough action against any UK 2012 which are sent to processing (whether sent as producers found to have laying hens in conventional ungraded or class B), nor can we prohibit the use of any cages after 1 January 2012. The AHVLA have visited products made from such eggs. We will continue to the vast majority of known cage producers to remind press in Europe to get this loophole closed, but until them of the need to comply with the conventional cage then we are taking steps to establish as much compliance ban when it comes into force at the end of the year and as is possible with the conventional cage ban for egg at the same time find out producers’ intentions, as to products by working closely with the food industry. whether they will cease production or convert to alternative An essential part of the UK’s enforcement strategy is systems. Similar action has also been taken by Scottish to ensure that retailers, egg processors, food manufacturers Government officials and officials in the Department of and the food service industry have stringent traceability Agriculture and Rural Development in Northern Ireland. tests in place to ensure that they are not using non-compliant This has helped to build a picture of where remaining eggs from either the UK or from other member states. non-compliance may be found and thus where risk Once again, our industry has risen to that challenge. based inspections should be targeted in the UK from 19WS Written Ministerial Statements6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Ministerial Statements 20WS

1 January 2012. All producers targeted by the intelligence required to roll out to any migrant who applied in-country led risk analysis will be visited at the beginning of next before a requirement to apply for a biometric residence year. If contraventions are found at the time of the visit, permit, we will continue to issue a sticker (vignette) as they will be dealt with using provisions within the evidence of leave until 1 December 2012. Any migrant Welfare of Farmed Animals (England) Regulations 2007, granted leave of more than six months from this date which implements Council Directive 99/74/EC, and the will be required by these regulations to apply for a egg marketing regulations. A compliance notice will be biometric residence permit if they have not done so issued immediately to ensure that conventional caged already. eggs do not go into the class A market, preventing the To manage the increased volumes of applicants producer from benefiting from the production of illegally registering their fingerprints and digital facial image, I produced eggs and prosecution will be considered. Similar am pleased to announce that the UK Border Agency action will be taken as appropriate in Wales, Scotland has awarded the contract for delivering third-party and Northern Ireland. enrolment to the Post Office Ltd. We will be monitoring the situation carefully in the Biometric residence permits simplify the checks that new year and will not hesitate to raise matters in Europe the UK Border Agency, employers and public service if any issues arise. I, together with my ministerial colleagues providers need to undertake to confirm immigration in the devolved Administrations, intend to continue status and eligibility to entitlements in the UK. Our urging the Commission to learn lessons from this experience plans to introduce an automated online employers checking with the conventional cage ban to avoid the same kind service for biometric residence permits from spring next of problems occurring next year, leading up to the EU year will make it even easier for employers to conduct ban on the use of sow stalls on 1 January 2013. quick and easy real-time checks on the validity of the document. I can confirm that we are publishing the impact HOME DEPARTMENT assessment for the changes on the UK Border Agency website and I will arrange for a copy to be placed in the House Library. The Draft Immigration (Biometric Registration) Regulations 2012 Criminal Records Regime Review (Government Response) The Minister for Immigration (Damian Green): The Government are today laying before the House the draft Immigration (Biometric Registration) Regulations The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the 2012. These will complete the roll-out of biometric Home Department (Lynne Featherstone): I have today immigration documents, known as biometric residence placed in the Library of the House the report by Mrs Sunita permits (BRPs), to all in-country categories of foreign Mason, the independent adviser for criminality information nationals applying to extend their stay in the UK for management, of phase 2 of her review of the criminal over six months from 29 February 2012, including records regime, as well as the Government’s formal settlement, recognised refugees and protection categories. response to both phases of that review. This is required for the UK to comply with EU I published Mrs Mason’s phase 1 report on 11 February, regulations (European Council Regulation (EC) No. 1030/ alongside the Protection of Freedoms Bill. The Bill 2002 of 13 June 2002 Regulation, amended in April 2008 includes a number of proposals which reflect by Council Regulation (EC) No. 380/2008) that the UK recommendations from that first report and which will opted in to and which lay down a uniform format for improve the proportionality and efficiency of the residence permits for third-country nationals. The UK employment vetting systems centring on the Criminal Border Agency has been rolling out biometric immigration Records Bureau (CRB). I am pleased to publish today documents, known as biometric residence permits, by Mrs Mason’s phase 2 report, which addresses wider immigration category since November 2008. criminal records issues such as definition, management We have made significant progress since the roll-out and international exchange. I am grateful to Mrs Mason of biometric residence permits began in September for her contribution to this important agenda, which 2008 and will complete the in-country roll-out three encompasses two central objectives for the Government— months before the EU deadline. rebalancing civil liberties where necessary and maintaining The roll-out to overseas applicants coming to the UK effective, efficient and affordable public protection for more than six months and to in-country applications arrangements. made prior to a biometric registration requirement needs The Government accept the large majority of significant infrastructure and system changes. No major Mrs Mason’s recommendations, either unconditionally technical changes are to be made to systems during the or in principle. Full details are in the response document. accreditation period of the games which runs from The significant improvements to the Criminal Record 30 March 2012 to 8 November 2012, to ensure that the Bureau’s processes which the Government have brought integrity and robustness of our systems is maintained forward in the Protection of Freedoms Bill will, I believe, during this critical time. substantially reduce the cost and administrative burdens For the overseas roll-out of biometric permits, we involved in pursuing necessary employment checks. And will return to Parliament with our plans, including as such, they are also supportive of other key Government policy proposals, for the final stage of the roll-out priorities such as the growth agenda and the employment which will be after the accreditation period of the 2012 law review. They will also ensure greater protection of Olympic and Paralympic games. To manage the changes applicants’ rights as only relevant and accurate personal 21WS Written Ministerial Statements6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Ministerial Statements 22WS information will ever be disclosed by the police. For The Act amends the law of succession in England example, we are giving the applicant the opportunity and Wales where a person disclaims (that is, rejects) an under these revised CRB processes to review and, if inheritance or is disqualified from receiving an inheritance appropriate, dispute any information held about them by reason of the forfeiture rule. The forfeiture rule is by the police prior to it being disclosed to an employer. defined in section 1 of the Forfeiture Act 1982 as We have also included a provision to make the CRB meaning the rule of public policy which in certain process less burdensome on all concerned by introducing circumstances precludes a person who has unlawfully a new, online status checking capability that will in killed another, or unlawfully aided, abetted, counselled effect mean individuals can reuse their certificates for or procured the death of that other, from acquiring a different employers across the same work force and so benefit in consequence of the killing. will no longer need to apply for a new certificate every In both these situations, the Act has the effect that time they want to take up a new role. This will have a the person who disclaims or whose inheritance is forfeited positive impact on business, making it significantly is treated, for the purpose of deciding who may inherit, easier for employers to take on staff in relevant sectors. as having died immediately before the testator or intestate. We do not accept Mrs Mason’s recommendation to This will have the effect on intestacy that persons claiming scale back significantly eligibility for criminal records through the person who is deemed to have died, such as checks. The Protection of Freedoms Bill is already his or her children, will be able to inherit. Where there is being used to reduce very substantially the scope of a will, the identity of the person entitled to the property “regulated activity” from which people can be barred. instead of the person who is deemed to have died will Against that background we think it is important to depend on the terms of the will. retain the capacity to apply for criminal records checks The Act also amends the law so that a child is able to in relation to a broader set of sensitive roles. inherit his or her parent’s interest in an intestate estate, We accept in principle Mrs Mason’s recommendation where the parent dies neither married nor civil partnered that there should be a clear time scale for the police to before the age of 18 and the child is alive at the time of make decisions on whether there is relevant information the intestate’s death. that should be disclosed on an enhanced criminal record certificate. However, we do not accept that the certificate should be issued at the end of a defined period where information is still being considered by the police, as SCOTLAND that could pose significant risks to public protection. In response to Mrs Mason’s phase 2 recommendations, for now we intend to maintain the current arrangements Parliamentary Written Question (Correction) for holding criminal records on the police national computer, while ensuring the controls on accessing those records are sufficiently strong. At the same time, we will The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Scotland take her steer in terms of providing a clearer definition (David Mundell): I regret that the written answer given of what constitutes a criminal record and reviewing to my hon. Friend the Member for Harwich and North precisely which convictions and other disposals should Essex (Mr Jenkin) on 15 November, Official Report, be recorded on national systems. Looking further forward, column 665W, contained an error. The answer stated and following establishment of the long-term arrangements that the TaxPayers Alliance applied for permission to for the management and delivery of the PNC services bring judicial review against the Secretary of State for after the NPIA has been closed, we will consider the Scotland in respect of the Glasgow Commonwealth need for alternative options for sharing and managing Games Act 2008 (Games Association Right) Order criminal records. Similarly, we will review and update 2009. This is not correct. The application for permission the strategy for international exchange of criminal records. to bring judicial review was made by Big Brother Watch I am clear that, taken as a package, the implementation and not by the TaxPayers Alliance. of Mrs Mason’s recommendations will make a key The correct answer is as follows: contribution to our commitment to scale back the criminal records regime to common-sense levels. David Mundell: In the last Parliament there were two applications: (1) Derek Traynor and James Fisher raised petitions for judicial review against the Secretary of State for Scotland and Scottish Ministers in respect of the Scottish Parliament JUSTICE (Elections etc.) Order 2007. The applications were unsuccessful at first instance in the Court of Session, the petitioners appealed, and the appeals remain pending at their request. Forfeiture Rule and Law of Succession The legal costs incurred by the Secretary of State for Scotland to date are £4,555.50. (2) Big Brother Watch applied for permission to bring judicial review against the Secretary of State for Scotland in The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice respect of the Glasgow Commonwealth Games Act 2008 (Mr Jonathan Djanogly): I am today announcing that I (Games Association Right) Order 2009. The application was have made an order to bring sections 1, 2 and 3 of refused. The Scotland Office’s legal costs were £7,080. The the Estates of Deceased Persons (Forfeiture Rule and Scotland Office applied for costs against the applicant. Costs Law of Succession) Act 2011 (the Act) into force on were awarded in part and they have been paid. 1 February 2012. The Act implements, with modifications, There have been no applications for judicial review recommendations of the Law Commission. against the Scotland Office since May 2010. 23WS Written Ministerial Statements6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Ministerial Statements 24WS

TRANSPORT Evidence shows that ships with armed guards are less likely to be attacked and taken for ransom, and the Access for All House will be aware that the Prime Minister confirmed last month that the Government now recognise the use of private armed guards as an option to protect UK The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Transport registered ships and their crews from acts of piracy. (Norman Baker): Improving access to Great Britain’s This applies in exceptional circumstances as defined railway stations is a key priority for this Government. I below: am therefore pleased to announce today a further when the ship is transiting the high seas throughout the £37.5 million of “mid-tier” Access for All funding for high-risk area (an area bounded by Suez and the straights of projects requiring up to £l million of Government support. Hormuz to the north, 10°S and 78°E); and This forms part of the wider £370 million Access for All the latest “Best Management Practices” is being followed programme launched in 2006 which will deliver an fully but, on its own, is not deemed by the shipping company accessible, step-free route at 148 key stations. Rail passengers and the ship’s master as sufficient to protect against acts of will benefit from better access through the provision of piracy; and new lifts, ramps, raised “easier access humps”on platforms the use of armed guards is assessed to reduce the risk to the as well as new accessible toilets. lives and well-being of those onboard the ship. Major improvements will take place at stations across I am therefore today, publishing interim guidance to the country including at London Paddington, St Austell, shipping companies on the use of armed guards onboard Stratford, Stratford-upon-Avon and Ystrad Mynach. UK flagged ships. This guidance covers, among other Network Rail will also receive funding to add tactile things, the factors to be included in the risk assessment, edge paving at 27 stations and £5 million to provide advice on selecting a private security company, and a “easy access humps” to reduce the stepping distance requirement for the shipping company to produce a between the platform and the train. The full list of counter-piracy plan and submit a copy to my Department. successful stations will be made available on the Department A private security company (PSC) employed to put for Transport’s website. armed guards on board UK ships will require authorisation All work at the stations will be completed by March from the Home Office for possession of any prohibited 2014. firearms as defined in the Firearms Act 1968 (as amended). We are also taking the opportunity to increase the Checks will be carried out by the Home Office and funding allocated to train operating companies. This police into the PSC and its personnel before an authorisation funding will increase from £5 million a year to £7 million is granted. a year for the next three years, beginning in April 2012. The guidance to shipping companies and the Home It is based on the number of stations that they manage Office process for authorising the possession of prohibited and is used to deliver smaller scale or more locally firearms are both interim and will be reviewed within focused access improvements at stations. 12 months so that they reflect continuing national and Finally, I have agreed to release £57 million from the international work to ensure high standards in the existing budget earlier than planned to allow the accelerated provision of armed guards in the maritime domain. delivery of obstacle-free routes at 27 stations.

Business Plan (Update) Roads Classification

The Secretary of State for Transport (Justine Greening): The Department for Transport’s business plan says The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Transport that, following the consultation on high-speed rail which (Norman Baker): I am pleased to announce that, following was held earlier this year, we would complete the analysis consultation, the Department will be devolving of consultation responses and announce our subsequent responsibility for roads classification and aspects of the decisions to Parliament in December. primary route network from April 2012. Since taking up office in October I have been considering This marks the first major revision of these systems the issues, raised as part of the consultation and additionally since the first Wilson Government, and represents a have listened to the views of hon. Members. In order to major decentralisation of power. It will greatly improve ensure that my decision is based on a careful consideration the ability of local authorities to make changes on their of all relevant factors, I have concluded that I should roads, and greatly reduce the amount of central allow myself until early in 2012 to announce my decisions. Government resource needed to run the system. I am therefore notifying the House that I will not be Under the new system: making a further statement on the subject of high-speed rail this year, but I expect to announce my decisions in Local authorities will have control over roads classification January. decisions in their area, determining which roads should be “A”roads, “B” roads, etc. Local authorities will be able to set the roads used by the Defending Against Piracy (UK Ships) primary route network (“A” roads with green signs), while central Government retain oversight of the whole system. The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Transport Central Government will continue to look after the strategic (Mike Penning): The rise in the number of incidents road network. involving pirates in certain parts of the world has For roads classification and the primary route network, highlighted the need to ensure UK-flagged vessels are the Department for Transport will reduce its role to able to adequately protect themselves against such threats. handling appeal cases and any disputes which might 25WS Written Ministerial Statements6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Ministerial Statements 26WS arise between local authorities, leaving local authorities I have written to the chairman of Remploy formally to manage their roads in the manner they judge most approving the agreed 2011-12 performance and resources effective. agreement between the Department and the company, As part of the consultation, we also took the opportunity as follows: to examine whether there might be better ways to link the management of the system with sat-nav technology. Target Description Target The Department will be taking this work forward, and To live within the company’s financial means in the will make a further statement in the new year. 2011-12 financial year and achieve: operational funding result of £97.7 million modernisation of the business within a cost of £5.4 million WORK AND PENSIONS Factory businesses to achieve: Remploy (Annual Report) an operating result (loss) of £52.5 million cost per disabled employee of £24,000

The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Work Employment Service business to achieve and Pensions (Maria Miller): The Remploy annual report and financial statements 2011 are published today. Copies an operating result of £28.2 million will be placed in the Libraries of both Houses and will total job outcomes of 18,000 be available in the Vote Office and the Printed Paper —of which total disabled job outcomes 16,500 Office later today. Electronic copies will be available on —of which Work Choice job outcomes 7,500 the Remploy website: —of which other Grant-in-Aid funded outcomes 1,000 http://www.remploy.co.uk/about-us/ —of which other disabled job outcomes 8,000 corporategovernance/annualreports.ashx

3P Petitions6 DECEMBER 2011 Petitions 4P Petitions Swansea Coastguard Station The Petition of residents of the constituency of Blaenau Tuesday 6 December 2011 Gwent, Declares that there is a fierce reaction to the wholly OBSERVATIONS unexpected proposed closure of the Swansea Coastguard Station, which will affect 28 staff, and declares that the TRANSPORT Petitioners fear that lives will be put at risk if the proposal goes ahead, as the Petitioners are unconvinced Closure of Liverpool Coastguard Station that new technology would be an adequate substitute The Petition of residents of Merseyside, for close proximity between the coastguard and other Declares that the closure of Liverpool Coastguard emergency services. Station would result in the loss of vital local knowledge and a reduction in the efficiency of rescues of people in The Petitioners therefore request that the House of difficulty along our coastline and at sea. Commons urges the Secretary of State for Transport to The Petitioners therefore request that the House of reconsider the decision to close Swansea Coastguard Commons urges the Government to take steps to ensure Station and ensure that a coastguard station remains at that Liverpool Coastguard Station remains open. Swansea. And the Petitioners remain, etc.—[Presented by Bill And the Petitioners remain, etc.—[Presented by Nick Esterson, Official Report, 26 October 2011; Vol. 534, Smith, Official Report, 14 November 2011; Vol. 535, c. 435.] c. 663.] [P000973] Observations from the Secretary of State for Transport: [P000975] Having decided in July that one coastguard centre Observations from the Secretary of State for Transport: from each existing operational pair should remain open in the new coastguard rescue co-ordination structure, Having decided in July that one coastguard centre the Government consulted specifically on whether there from each existing operational pair should remain open were factors that would suggest that Liverpool should in the new coastguard rescue co-ordination structure, be retained in preference to the centre at Holyhead. the Government consulted specifically on whether there Consultation ended on 6 October. No new and compelling were factors that would suggest that Swansea should be arguments were put forward and the Government therefore retained in preference to the centre at Milford Haven. announced on 22 November that given the concerns Consultation ended on 6 October. No new and compelling raised after the first round of consultation about the arguments were put forward and the Government therefore importance of familiarity with Welsh place names, it announced on 22 November that given the Department would be right to retain a rescue co-ordination function for Transport’s existing employment profile in the Swansea at the Holyhead centre. However, there will still be a area, it would be right to retain a rescue co-ordination coastguard and MCA presence at the Liverpool site in function at the Milford Haven centre. However, there support of the volunteer Coastguard Rescue Service will still be a coastguard presence at the Swansea site in and the existing local Marine Office. support of the volunteer Coastguard Rescue Service.

177W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 178W

Alistair Burt: The UK Government reiterate their Written Answers to condemnation of the widespread violations of human rights which President Assad and his regime have been Questions committing for months. The UK has been at the forefront of international action to bring a halt to the violence in Syria. The UK Tuesday 6 December 2011 co-sponsored the Human Rights Council resolution mandating the Commission of Inquiry and supported a third Special Session of the Human Rights Council on 2 December, which passed a strong resolution establishing FOREIGN AND COMMONWEALTH OFFICE further monitoring mechanisms to ensure that the flow of independent, factual information about the human British Overseas Territories: Elections rights situation in Syria continues. We have tabled a resolution in the UN General Assembly Third Committee Mr Crausby: To ask the Secretary of State for supporting the Arab League’s efforts and condemning Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs whether the (a) the violence, which passed by an overwhelming majority. Governor and (b) government of each Overseas We have pushed hard, though so far unsuccessfully, for Territory will be inviting election observers to observe action in the Security Council. We have worked with forthcoming general elections; and what criteria will be EU partners to impose sanctions on the Syrian regime. used to select the observers to be invited. [84481] We continue to believe that President Assad should step aside and allow the Syrian people to realise their Mr Bellingham: Election observers have not consistently aspirations for greater freedom, dignity and a more been invited to observe elections in the Overseas Territories. open political system. We will continue to take every The responsibility for inviting election observers varies opportunity to intensify the pressure on the Syrian from territory to territory and will depend on the regime to stop the violence. constitution, laws and practice of individual territories. The British Government believe that, in general, it is Syria: Politics and Government good practice for open democracies, including the Overseas Territories, to invite election observers. There are a Lyn Brown: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign number of organisations that organise election observers and Commonwealth Affairs what recent estimate he including the Organisation for Security and Co-operation has made of the number of protestors killed and in Europe, Commonwealth, and EU. A number of wounded in Syria. [84910] factors might be expected to inform the identification of Alistair Burt: The UN estimates that more than 4,000 suitable election observers including geography, history, people have been killed in Syria since March, including financing issues and the capacity of observer organisations 307 children. It has reported widespread and systematic to respond. I was pleased that observers from the Caribbean human rights violations, including murder, torture, illegal Community and the Commonwealth Parliamentary detention and rape. Although exact figures are unknown, Association, including members of this house, observed many reports put the number of the missing and the elections in British Virgin Islands and that they were unaccounted for in the thousands. impressed with the conduct of the elections. We have made clear repeatedly our condemnation of the widespread violations of human rights which President Foreign Relations: Education Assad and his regime have been committing for months. We continue to believe that President Assad should step Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for aside and allow the Syrian people to realise their aspirations Foreign and Commonwealth Affairs how many for greater freedom, dignity and a more open political education officers his Department employs. [84586] system. We welcome the publication of the UN Commission Mr Bellingham: We do not recognise the term education of Inquiry’s report on human rights violations in Syria. officer. We condemn the Syrian Government’s unwillingness to cooperate with the Commission. The UK co-sponsored Syria: Diplomatic Relations the Human Rights Council resolution mandating the Commission of Inquiry and supported a third Special Lyn Brown: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign Session of the Human Rights Council on 2 December, and Commonwealth Affairs what options he is which passed a strong resolution establishing further considering in respect of future diplomatic relations monitoring mechanisms to ensure that the flow of with Syria. [84909] independent, factual information about the human rights situation in Syria continues. Alistair Burt: We maintain diplomatic relations with Syria and use these to raise our concerns about the current situation in Syria. NORTHERN IRELAND Departmental Pay Syria: Human Rights Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland whether any senior staff in (a) his Lyn Brown: To ask the Secretary of State for Foreign Department and (b) its non-departmental public and Commonwealth Affairs what steps he is taking bodies are paid by means of payments to a limited with his international counterparts to prevent human company in lieu of a salary; and if he will publish his rights abuses in Syria. [84911] policy on such payments. [85073] 179W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 180W

Mr Paterson: No senior staff in my Department, or Departmental Older Workers in its non-departmental public bodies, are paid by means of payments to a limited company in lieu of a salary. Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for Scotland how many people aged over (a) 55 and (b) 65 his Department employs. [84682] SCOTLAND David Mundell: All staff in the Scotland Office are on Aircraft Carriers loan or secondment, mainly from the Scottish Government or the Ministry of Justice who hold individual staff Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for personnel records, including details such as dates of Scotland what recent discussions he has had with birth. The Scotland Office does not hold a record of Ministerial colleagues on the construction of Queen dates of birth of staff. Elizabeth-class aircraft carriers. [84680] Departmental Written Questions David Mundell: The Secretary of State for Scotland, my right hon. Friend the Member for Berwickshire, Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for Roxburgh and Selkirk (Michael Moore), has regular Scotland how many and what proportion of questions discussions with ministerial colleagues on a range of for written answer on a named day his Department has defence-related matters affecting Scotland, including answered on the due date in the present session of the construction of the Queen Elizabeth class aircraft Parliament. [84677] carriers. Good progress continues to be made on the carrier project and last month the Secretary of State David Mundell: In the present session of Parliament, visited the Babcock site at Rosyth to inspect work which the Scotland Office answered 182 (94%) of named day is underway. parliamentary questions on the due date. Departmental Equality Chris Ruane: To ask the Secretary of State for Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for Scotland what proportion of written questions for Scotland what recent steps his Department has taken answer on a named day received a substantive answer to increase equality among its staff; and at what cost. within five working days in each of the last six months. [85065] [84673] David Mundell: All staff in the Scotland Office are on David Mundell: The following table shows the number loan or secondment, mainly from the Scottish Government of named day PQs that received a substantive answer or the Ministry of Justice; both bodies provide a full within five working days of the date specified: range of initiatives specific to equality including running equality events, supporting internal staff networks and 2011 Named day PQs providing support on corporate equality programmes. June 8 Separate figures on costs are not available. July 14 Departmental Internet August — September 6 Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for October 6 Scotland how many unique hits his Department’s November 7 website has received in each of the last 12 months. [84676] Total number 41 Total percentage 100 David Mundell: The information requested is shown in the following table. The Government have committed to providing the Procedure Committee with information relating to written Unique hits parliamentary question performance on a sessional basis and will provide full information to the committee at October 2011 3,773 the end of the session. Statistics relating to Government September 2011 3,302 Department’s performance for the 2009-10 parliamentary August 2011 2,602 Session were previously provided to the committee and July 2011 2,647 are available on the Parliament website. June 2011 3,833 May 2011 3,802 Drugs April 2011 2,857 March 2011 3,444 Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for February 2011 2,887 Scotland what his policy is on mandatory drug tests for January 2011 2,849 the staff of his Department. [84675] December 2010 4,218 November 2010 4,132 David Mundell: The Scotland Office does not employ staff directly. All staff working in the office are on loan Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for or secondment from other Government bodies, mainly Scotland what social media his Department operates. the Scottish Government or the Ministry of Justice, [84681] who remain the principal employers. As such, staff remain on the terms and conditions of their parent David Mundell: The Scotland Office operates a Twitter bodies. This includes policies relating to substance misuse, account. conduct and discipline. 181W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 182W

Drugs: Misuse David Mundell: The Secretary of State for Scotland, the right hon. Member for Berwickshire, Roxburgh and Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for Selkirk (Michael Moore), has not received any letters or Scotland how many staff of his Department have been emails in respect of shale gas extraction in Scotland in disciplined due to drug offences in the last 12 months. the last 12 months. [84834] Olympic Games 2012 David Mundell: No staff have been disciplined due to drug offences in the last 12 months. Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for Scotland what recent discussions he has had with the Economic Growth Secretary of State for Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport on the effect on Scotland of the London 2012 Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for Olympics. [84663] Scotland what recent steps he has taken to support the economy of Scotland. [84678] David Mundell: The Secretary of State for Scotland, the right hon. Member for Berwickshire, Roxburgh and David Mundell: On 17 November, the Secretary of Selkirk (Michael Moore), has regular discussions with State for Scotland, my right hon. Friend the Member the Secretary of State for Culture, Olympics, Media and for Berwickshire, Roxburgh and Selkirk (Michael Moore), Sport, my right hon. Friend the Member for South announced the membership of the new Scottish Business West Surrey (Mr Hunt), on a range of issues including Board to raise issues and help provide solutions on the making the most of the opportunities that the London Scottish economy. This new Board has the expertise 2012 Olympics will bring to Scotland. and knowledge to make a real difference to the way we tackle the issues facing the Scottish economy and get Renewable Energy the most both from and for our companies across Scotland. The Secretary of State for Scotland also led Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for the largest ever trade mission to Brazil at the end of Scotland what recent discussions he has had on November. This trade mission allowed companies from renewable energy development in Scotland. [84684] a wide range of Scottish sectors to showcase their David Mundell: The Secretary of State for Scotland, services and establish links in a high-growth market the right hon. Member for Berwickshire, Roxburgh and which has become increasingly important to the global Selkirk (Michael Moore), and I meet regularly with economy. ministerial colleagues, the Scottish Government and the Jobcentre Plus business community to discuss growth of all sectors of the economy. Last month the Secretary of State and I Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for convened the Scottish Business Board which brought Scotland how many jobcentres in Scotland he has together business leaders from across a range of sectors, visited on departmental business in the last 12 months. including those with an interest in development of [84679] renewable energy, to discuss measures to break down barriers to growth. David Mundell: The Secretary of State for Scotland, my right hon. Friend the Member for Berwickshire, Roxburgh and Selkirk (Michael Moore), has visited the WOMEN AND EQUALITIES job centre in Edinburgh on departmental business in the last 12 months. The Secretary of State for Scotland Crimes of Violence: Victim Support Schemes has visited the job centre in Galashiels, Scotland as a constituency MP in the last 12 months. In addition, the Kate Green: To ask the Minister for Women and Secretary of State for Scotland has met with members Equalities what the total value was of grants awarded of the senior management team of JobCentre Plus on by the Government Equalities Office through the departmental business on eight separate occasions in Special Fund for local assault services in financial year the last 12 months. (a) 2010-11 and (b) 2011-12. [81248] Lockerbie: Bombings Lynne Featherstone: The Government are committed to tackling sexual violence and all forms of violence Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for against women and girls. Scotland what recent discussions he has had with the Victims of rape and sexual assault need support Government of Libya on the status of Abdelbaset within and beyond the criminal justice system. al-Megrahi. [84668] Support is provided through three main pillars: specialist sexual violence support services provided by civil David Mundell: The Scotland Office has had no such society organisations; discussions with the Government of Libya. sexual assault referral centres; and Natural Gas: Exploration independent sexual violence advisers. The Home Office has allocated £28 million of funding Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for until 2015 for related specialist services in addition to Scotland how many (a) letters and (b) emails he has the specialist sexual violence support services, including received in respect of shale gas extraction in Scotland funding to nearly double the number of specialist in the last 12 months. [84674] independent advisers. 183W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 184W

The Government Equalities Office, as a stand alone Dartford-Thurrock Crossing: Automatic Number Plate Department in the financial year 2010-11, contributed Recognition an additional £1 million into a combined fund for sexual violence voluntary sector, managed by the Ministry Mr Evennett: To ask the Secretary of State for of Justice. Transport what recent representations she has received Departmental Written Questions on the use of automatic number plate recognition at the Dartford crossing. [84815] Chris Ruane: To ask the Minister for Women and Equalities what proportion of written questions for Mike Penning: The Department received a number of answer on a named day received a substantive answer representations on the use of automatic number place within five working days in each of the last six months. recognition (ANPR) during the recently held consultation [85047] to raise the charges at the Dartford/Thurrock river crossing. These primarily focused on using ANPR for Lynne Featherstone: From 1 April 2011, the Government the delivery of the free-flow project and the ability of Equalities Office became part of the Home Office. ANPR to capture foreign vehicles that use the crossing. Information relating to the Government Equalities Office The proposals for an ANPR system are currently being will be included in the reply of the Minister for Immigration, considered as part of the design stage for a free-flow the hon. Member for Ashford (Damian Green). charging scheme at the crossing. Social Justice Committee: Ministers Departmental Procurement Michael Dugher: To ask the Minister for Women and Equalities how many meetings of the Social Justice Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for Committee Ministers in her Department have attended Transport how many contracts her Department has since its establishment. [85341] awarded directly to (a) small, (b) medium-sized and (c) large businesses in each month since May 2010; Lynne Featherstone: From 1 April 2011, the Government what the value was of such contracts; and if she will Equalities Office became part of the Home Office. make a statement. [75167] Information relating to the Government Equalities Office will be included in the reply of the Minister for Immigration, Norman Baker: The Department for Transport has the hon. Member for Ashford (Damian Green). directly awarded the following number of contracts to small, medium and large businesses in each month since May 2010:

TRANSPORT Small Medium Large businesses businesses businesses Value (£) Air Transport Auxiliary 2010 Ian Austin: To ask the Secretary of State for May 9 13 69 33,842,021 Transport what measures her Department is taking to June 2 16 77 35,937,683 encourage former members of the Air Transport July 6 13 62 18,967,821 Auxiliary to apply for the Air Transport Auxiliary August 2 7 64 20,756,405 Veterans Badge. [85320] September 3 9 66 14,236,977 October 7 8 61 14,370,826 Mrs Villiers: Air Transport Auxiliary veterans who November 4 13 81 18,312,478 have not been awarded a Veterans Badge can find December 3 14 72 20,854,239 details of how to apply on the Directgov website. Badges were awarded to all surviving veterans known to the 2011 ATA Association when the scheme was launched in January 4 9 46 93,978,185 2008; it was widely publicised at that time. February 3 3 25 11,876,693 Bypasses: Kegworth March 5 6 37 12,332,948 April 3 4 42 34,137,500 May 2 11 67 86,986,108 Andrew Bridgen: To ask the Secretary of State for June 2 38 193 165,457,099 Transport what recent progress has been made on the July 3 42 190 157,940,426 Kegworth bypass project; and if she will make a August 2 69 157 35,240,150 statement. [85171] September 2 58 157 81,021,994 October 2 20 64 2,630,139 Mike Penning: In October 2010, the Department for Transport set out the outcomes of the Government’s 2010 comprehensive spending review, publishing details Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency: Preston of its investment decisions for major road projects on the strategic road network. Mark Hendrick: To ask the Secretary of State for Plans to provide a bypass of Kegworth were not Transport what discussions she has had on the future included among the schemes identified, and the Highways of the Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency office in Agency is therefore not developing such a proposal at Preston; and whether the potential closure of the office this time. or redundancies were raised. [83936] 185W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 186W

Mike Penning: The Driver and Vehicle Licensing Mike Penning: The UK is working toward the Agency is reviewing all aspects of its business, including implementation of EU regulation 1177/2010 concerning the delivery of services through its local offices. The aim the rights of passengers when travelling by sea and of this is to look at ways in which the customer experience inland waterway which will apply in the UK from can be improved while delivering increased efficiency. 18 December 2012. Provided the ship operator has been The results of this exercise will be announced in due notified in advance, the EU regulation requires a ship course. operator to accommodate an assistance dog with the passenger on a cruise ship where the port of departure M4: Repairs and Maintenance is in the EU. Department for Transport officials are in discussion Huw Irranca-Davies: To ask the Secretary of State with officials in the Department for Environment, Food for Transport what improvements are planned for the and Rural Affairs to ensure the UK’s implementation M4 in each of the next five years; and if she will of the EU regulation and national rules relating to the estimate the (a) cost of the improvements and (b) pet travel scheme are compatible. number of jobs that will be created. [84722] Wheels to Work Schemes Mike Penning: In April 2011 I published the timetable for the 14 Highways Agency major road schemes due to Mary Creagh: To ask the Secretary of State for start construction by 2015; this included the M4 Junctions Transport how many people received support through 19-20 and M5 Junctions 15-17 managed motorway the wheels to work scheme in each of the last five scheme, on which work is scheduled to begin between financial years. [84839] January and March 2012. The cost of this scheme is estimated to be £88.6 million, Norman Baker [holding answer 5 December 2011]: and it is expected to provide hundreds of jobs during its As Wheels to Work schemes are local in nature, information construction. on how many people are supported through the schemes There are no current plans to develop other major is not held centrally. Funding is also provided from a improvement schemes for the M4 at this time. However, variety of sources, including the Local Sustainable Transport the Department is working with the Welsh Assembly Fund administered by my Department, and the Department Government on their proposal to improve the M4 around for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs’ Rural Newport. Development Programme for England. Railways Stations: Standards

Mr Love: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport CULTURE, MEDIA AND SPORT (1) when she expects to announce the successful bids for the Access for All Mid-Tier programme for railway Alcoholic Drinks: Sales stations; and if she will make a statement; [81198] (2) what the reasons are for the time taken to Dan Jarvis: To ask the Secretary of State for Culture, announce the successful bids to the Access for All Olympics, Media and Sport what discussions he has Mid-Tier programme for railway stations; and if she had with the Secretary of State for the Home will make a statement. [81199] Department on the extension of licences for the sale of alcohol for the tourism and hospitality industry during Norman Baker: The successful bids for the Access for the London 2012 Olympic games. [85163] All mid-tier programme for railway stations were announced today. John Penrose: The Department has been in discussion with the Home Office about extended licensing hours Roads: Rural Areas during the Olympic and Paralympic games. In deciding whether to exercise her powers under section 172 of the Geoffrey Clifton-Brown: To ask the Secretary of State Licensing Act 2003, the Secretary of State for the Home for Transport if she will amend the rules governing the Department, my right hon. Friend the Member for deployment of brown signs on major trunk roads in Maidenhead (Mrs May), has to consider matters of rural areas in order to assist small businesses. [84854] security, policing, public order and public safety for these events. Mike Penning: A working group is currently reviewing the existing criteria for the provision of brown tourist BBC: Redundancy Pay signs on the strategic and local network, to ensure that it meets the needs of road users and gives the tourist Mark Pritchard: To ask the Secretary of State for industry a helping hand at the same time. It is anticipated Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport if he will discuss that revised guidelines will be available by mid 2012. with the BBC Trust the issue of clawback of severance pay or compensation for BBC staff made redundant Shipping: Guide Dogs who are re-employed as (a) BBC staff and (b) consultants within two years. [84013] Mark Pritchard: To ask the Secretary of State for Transport if she will discuss with the Secretary of State Mr Vaizey: The employment of staff and consultants for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs the issue of is a matter for the BBC and there is no provision for travel restrictions for guide dogs with pet passports on Government to intervene. I do not intend to raise this cruise ships travelling within the EU. [84012] with the BBC Trust. 187W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 188W

Broadband John Penrose: To celebrate St George’s Day, St Andrew’s Day and St Patrick’s Day, the Department flew the St Chi Onwurah: To ask the Secretary of State for George’s Cross, the Saltire and the Union flag respectively. Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport what assessment English Heritage, one of the Department’s arm’s length his Department has made of the willingness of bodies, marked St George’s day in 2011 with four commercial companies to roll out broadband services separate events that were attended by around 16,000 of speeds of 80 to 100 MBits in the 10 proposed visitors. This included the annual St George’s Festival super-connected cities. [84726] at Wrest park, which welcomed 8,500 visitors over three days. Mr Vaizey: In support of this initiative, BT and Film Virgin Media have committed to strengthening their networks in the winning cities and will be offering their broadband services with 80-100 Mbps potential. Penny Mordaunt: To ask the Secretary of State for Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport what It is also possible that other suppliers may make representations he has received as part of his similar proposals. Department’s film policy review; when his Department will respond; and if he will make a statement. [85313] Chi Onwurah: To ask the Secretary of State for Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport what assessment Mr Vaizey: Lord Smith, who is leading the independent he has made of demand for broadband services of film policy review panel, will report to Ministers before 80 to 100 MBits in the 10 proposed super-connected the end of this year or early next year and the Government cities. [84727] response will follow later. As part of the consultation process, Lord Smith’s panel received over 300 submissions Mr Vaizey: It is expected that local authorities will of evidence from the public and industry, and have assess demand for unmet broadband services as part of conducted more than 70 meetings with a range of their bid. stakeholders. Broadband Delivery UK: Manpower Penny Mordaunt: To ask the Secretary of State for Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport what Chi Onwurah: To ask the Secretary of State for representations he has received on support for the UK Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport how many animation industry; and if he will make a statement. full-time equivalent staff Broadband Delivery UK [85314] (BDUK) (a) has and (b) will have in each year of the spending review period; and what the budget of Mr Vaizey: The Department has received representations BDUK (i) is for 2011-12 and (ii) will be for each year of on support for the British animation industry from: that period. [84724] The Deputy Prime Minister; Mr Vaizey: Broadband Delivery UK (BDUK) has Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills (Vince 9.6 full-time equivalent staff for the year 2011-12. The Cable); staff resource needed for future years has not yet been Mark Field MP; determined. Animation UK; BDUK’s budget for each of the four years from Aardman Animations Ltd; 2011-12 to 2014-15 is shown in the following table: Hands Up Productions Ltd; Q Pootle 5 Ltd; and Budget (£ million) two members of the public. 2011-12 92 We are giving careful and early consideration to the 2012-13 106 issues raised. In addition, the animation sector is represented 2013-14 165 on the Creative Industries Council. Creative Industry 2014-15 165 Council members instigate industry-led approaches to boosting the growth and competitiveness of the creative The budget profile is currently under review and will industries with Government facilitating and removing take account of the Broadband Delivery Programme barriers where appropriate. Delivery Model (published in May 2011 and available at: Paralympic Games 2012 http://www.culture.gov.uk/publications/8482.aspx the progress that BDUK has made in developing a Joan Walley: To ask the Secretary of State for Broadband Framework for suppliers; and the procurements Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport what undertaken by the initial broadband pilot projects and representations he has received on a legacy following other local areas. the London 2012 Olympics for Paralympic sports. [84876] Festivals and Special Occasions Hugh Robertson: The Department regularly receives Pete Wishart: To ask the Secretary of State for letters relating to the legacy of the London 2012 Olympic Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport what steps his and Paralympic Games. Department took to (a) celebrate and (b) promote (i) The Government are committed to leaving a strong St George’s Day, (ii) St Andrew’s Day and (iii) and lasting legacy for disabled people all over the UK. St Patrick’s Day in the last 12 months. [85158] Plans to harness the inspirational power of the games in 189W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 190W order to accelerate progress towards achieving disability County Courts equality were set out in “London 2012: A Legacy for Disabled People”, published by the Office for Disability Mr Llwyd: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice Issues in April 2011 when he expects to publish the Government’s response http://odi.dwp.gov.uk/odi-projects/2012-legacy.php to his Department’s consultation on solving disputes in As part of Places People Play, the Government’s the county courts; on what date it was initially £136 million lottery-funded sports legacy programme scheduled for publication; and what the reason is for for the London Olympics and Paralympics, £8 million the time taken to publish the response. [84688] has been allocated by Sport England for a programme specifically targeted at inspiring more disabled people Mr Djanogly: The Government expect the consultation to take part in sport and providing more opportunities response to be published in the new year. The response for participation. was initially scheduled for publication in October but There is a whole new approach through the School this was postponed due to ongoing discussions within Games to significantly increase opportunities for disabled Government. pupils to compete on a local, regional and national level. The School Games will include sports such as Mr Llwyd: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice Wheelchair Basketball, Table Cricket and Polybat. Also, with which organisations his Department had for the first time, through the Taking Part Survey, we discussions on or about the subject matter of its will specifically measure participation rates of disabled consultation on solving disputes in the county courts children in competitive sport. (a) before and (b) after the consultation closed. [84689]

Mr Djanogly: The Department has engaged in discussions JUSTICE with the following organisations during the course of this year, on subjects covered by the Solving Disputes Birmingham Prison consultation: Association of British Insurers Mr Llwyd: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice Civil Mediation Council what estimate he has made of the cost to his Forum of Insurance Lawyers Department of monitoring the HM Prison Association of Personal Injury Lawyers Birmingham contract over the next 15 years. [84329] Motor Accident Solicitors Society Mr Blunt: The authority has budgeted for costs totalling The Law Society £3,631,000 over the 15-year period of the contract to The British Bankers Association provide a controller and team for HMP Birmingham. Citizens Advice This is the nominal cost for providing this resource and Her Majesties’ Association of District Judges includes including an annual allowance for inflation R3 (Association of Business Recovery Professionals) based on average weekly earnings (AWE) in accordance Civil Courts Users Association with Treasury Green Book. Office of Fair Trade Mr Llwyd: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice Shergroup (1) what the monetary value was of G4S’s bid to The Land Registry operate HM Prison Birmingham; [84330] Centre for Peaceful Solutions and Brent Mediation Centre (2) what notional costs were added in respect of (a) Centre for Effective Dispute Resolution the in-house bid and (b) the G4S bid to operate HM Law Works Mediation Prison Birmingham; [84331] National Health Service Litigation Authority (3) what the monetary value was of the in-house bid Medical Protection Society to operate HM Prison Birmingham (a) including and Weightmans Solicitors. (b) excluding notional costs. [84333] Mr Llwyd: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice Mr Blunt: The net present cost (NPC) value of the how many submissions his Department received to its G4S contract to operate and maintain HMP Birmingham consultation on solving disputes in the county courts. is £316,500,000 over 15 years. [84690] We do not recognise what is meant by the term ‘notional’ in this context and therefore can only advise Mr Djanogly: The Department received 319 responses that no ‘notional’ costs were asked for. to the consultation. Children: Abduction Defamation

Mark Lancaster: To ask the Secretary of State for Emily Thornberry: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice whether he plans to review the law on the Justice whether he plans to bring forward legislative abduction of children by their parents. [84111] proposals on defamation. [84459]

Mr Djanogly: There are no plans at present for the Mr Djanogly: We are currently giving careful UK to review the current law on international parental consideration to the recommendations of the parliamentary child abduction. Joint Committee on the draft Defamation Bill and to 191W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 192W the views expressed by respondents to our public Departmental Civil Proceedings consultation, and will seek to introduce a substantive Defamation Bill as soon as parliamentary time allows. Mr Jenkin: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice which organisations that have received funding from his Department have brought legal proceedings against Departmental Advisory Services his Department in the last five years; which such organisations were not successful in their actions; and whether his Department (a) applied and (b) was paid Jonathan Edwards: To ask the Secretary of State for for costs in respect of such cases. [83892] Justice what contribution his Department has made to the cross-government review of advice funding Mr Djanogly: None to the Department’s knowledge. announced in July 2011. [84324] Departmental Procurement

Mr Djanogly: The Minister for Civil Society, my hon. Stewart Hosie: To ask the Secretary of State for Friend the Member for Ruislip, Northwood and Pinner Justice which services his Department has outsourced (Mr Hurd), formally announced the cross-government in each of the last five years. [84240] review of free advice services on 21 November 2011. I can confirm that my Department is working closely Mr Djanogly: The Ministry of Justice has outsourced with the Cabinet Office to support this work. the following services in the last five years.

Suppliers Service

2007 Steria, Tibco and Oracle ICT software support

2008 Information Initiatives, O2, Cable and Wireless, Global Crossing, ICT consultancy, software support, managed services Polo Lake, VP Treen, Vodaphone, Informatica, HP

2009 DHL National prisoner retail Microsoft, SDL Trados, Information Techology, Kineo LLP, IBM, Managed services and software support Mouchel QAS, Oracle

2010 HP, Bottomline, XMA, Oracle, Bantec, Steria, MEGA, SAS, Managed services, software support and hosting Accenture, Savvis

2011 G4S Custodial Services—HMP Birmingham Custodial Services—HMP Featherstone II

O2, Gartner, Amtec, Alliantist, Mouchel, Ninian Solutions, BT, Software support, managed services and hosting HFX, Bottomline, Detca, Oracle, PC Solutions, RSJ UK

Departmental Publications Mr Kenneth Clarke: Since May 2010, my Department has published (a) 17 leaflets at a total cost of £10,740.57; Dan Jarvis: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice (b) 27 posters at a total cost of £2,683.73; and (c) 61 how many (a) leaflets, (b) posters and (c) reports his reports at a total cost of £87,991.73. A breakdown of Department has published since May 2010; how much all three categories is contained in the following table. each cost; and which company (i) published and (ii) designed each. [82994]

Title Designed by Design costs (£) Published by Publishing costs (£)

Deputy Factsheets MOJ in-house design team 0.00 Prison industries 3,303.00 LPA120 MOJ in-house design team 0.00 Prison industries 929.00 OPG120 MOJ in-house design team 0.00 Prison industries 789.00 Security Group (for Home Office Zephyr Design 445.00 Zephyr Design 980.00 Exhibition) Belief in change MOJ in-house design team 0.00 Internal 0.00 Competition for Custodial Zephyr Design 735.00 Zephyr Design 1,396.12 Services and Works Rolls Building MOJ in-house design team 0.00 In-house print service 696.00 Small Claims Telephone MOJ in-house design team 0.00 Internal 0.00 Mediation Introducing our Ministers MOJ in-house design team 0.00 In-house print service 250.00 Security Awareness MOJ in-house design team 0.00 In-house print service 204.00 About MOJ MOJ in-house design team 0.00 Internal 0.00 Public Sector Equality Duty MOJ in-house design team 0.00 In-house print service 409.80 193W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 194W

Title Designed by Design costs (£) Published by Publishing costs (£)

Support Disability in the MOJ in-house design team 0.00 In-house print service 204.90 Workplace Transforming Justice MOJ in-house design team 0.00 In-house print service 150.00 Staff apprenticeship MOJ in-house design team 0.00 In-house print service 30.00 Greater London Family Panel MOJ in-house design team 0.00 In-house print service 218.75 Managing our money together MOJ in-house design team 0.00 Online only 0.00 Total 1,180.00 9,560.57

General Elections: Crown Dependencies Mr Djanogly: The roundtable discussion was postponed as the publication of the Government’s response to Mr Crausby: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice ‘Solving Disputes in the County Courts’ has been whether the Governor of each of the Crown delayed. The meeting will be rescheduled for the Dependencies will be inviting election observers to new year, once the consultation response has been observe forthcoming general elections. [84480] published. Mr Djanogly: General elections were held in the Isle of Man in September of this year, and in Jersey in Prisoners: Post-traumatic Stress Disorder October. Alderney and Sark held general elections in 2010 and Guernsey’s general election will take place in John McDonnell: To ask the Secretary of State for April 2012. Justice what estimate his Department has made of the As self-governing Dependencies of the Crown, it is number of offenders in prisons in England and Wales for the government authorities in each jurisdiction to diagnosed with post-traumatic stress disorder. [84738] determine whether they wish to invite election observers to observe their general elections. Paul Burstow: I have been asked to reply. Miscarriages of Justice The information requested is not collected centrally. Offenders are all screened on arrival in prison by a John Hemming: To ask the Secretary of State for trained nurse or trained officer to find out what their Justice whether he has considered bringing forward health needs are and get them the right treatment. legislative proposals to change the procedures of the People at risk of having a mental health problem, or Criminal Cases Review Commission to enable the vulnerable to suicide, are referred for a mental health correction of more miscarriages of justice. [84852] assessment. Mr Djanogly: I am not considering bringing forward legislative proposals to change the procedures of the Prisons: Crimes of Violence CCRC at this time. Offenders: Crimes of Violence John McDonnell: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice how many offenders have been prosecuted for Priti Patel: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice assault on a member of prison staff in each of the last how many defendants charged with (a) violent and five years. [84736] (b) sexual offences who are (i) on remand awaiting trial, (ii) in the community awaiting trial without The Solicitor-General: I have been asked to reply. conditions and (iii) in the community awaiting trial The Crown Prosecution Service (CPS) maintains no with conditions. [85203] central record of victims’ professions and they are Mr Blunt: As at 30 September 2011 there were 2,446 unable to identify, from their central database, those prisoners on remand awaiting trial for violence against assault cases involving prison staff. This data could be the person offences, and 779 on remand awaiting trial obtained only by examining all of the CPS’s files, which for sexual offences. Equivalent figures for the numbers would incur disproportionate cost. in the community awaiting trial on conditional or unconditional bail are not held centrally, and could be Prosecutions: Metals derived only by checking individual level court records; this would incur disproportionate cost. Graham Jones: To ask the Secretary of State for These figures have been drawn from administrative Justice pursuant to the answer of 24 November 2011, IT systems which, as with any large scale recording Official Report, column 580W, on prosecutions: metals, system, are subject to possible errors with data entry what the amount of each of the fines imposed and processing. following conviction under the Scrap Metals Dealers Personal Injury Act 1964 was in 2010. [84604]

Mr Llwyd: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice Mr Blunt: Pursuant to the answer of 24 November for what reason his Department’s round table 2011, Official Report, column 580W, the amount of consultation meeting on personal injury matters each fine imposed under the Scrap Metals Dealers scheduled for 1 November 2011 was postponed; and on Act 1964 in England and Wales, in 2010 (latest available) what date it is to be rescheduled. [84691] can be viewed in the following table. 195W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 196W

Total amount of fines issued under the Scrap Metal Dealers Act 19641 England (2) The following table gives the average time taken 2,3 and Wales, 2010 from receipt of an appeal to disposal by the tribunal in Number of offenders the financial year of 2010-11 and from 1 April 2011 to fined Fine amount (£) Total amount imposed (£) 31 October (the latest date for which information is available). 15050 1 100 100 Appeal time from receipt to disposal 1 190 190 Weeks 2 200 400 1 April to 31 October 2010-11 2011 2 400 800 1 500 500 Disability living 22.5 28.3 1 750 750 allowance 1 1,000 1,000 Employment and 19.4 24 support allowance 10 — 3,790 Income support 19.8 25.7 1 Includes: Offences by dealers in scrap metal and similar goods and in marine stores. Jobseeker’s allowance 12.6 14.1 2 The figures given in the table on court proceedings relate to persons for whom Tax credits 15.4 17.9 these offences were the principal offences for which they were dealt with. When a defendant has been found guilty of two or more offences it is the offence for (3) Her Majesty’s Courts and Tribunals Service does which the heaviest penalty is imposed. Where the same disposal is imposed for two or more offences, the offence selected is the offence for which the statutory not hold data specific to the west midlands or Coventry. maximum penalty is the most severe. However, the majority of disability living allowance 3 Every effort is made to ensure that the figures presented are accurate and (DLA) appeals made by people in the west midlands are complete. However, it is important to note that these data have been extracted from large administrative data systems generated by the courts and police heard in the hearing venues in Birmingham, Coventry, forces. As a consequence, care should be taken to ensure data collection Hereford, Stoke, Wolverhampton, Worcester and processes and their inevitable limitations are taken into account when those Kidderminster although these venues also hear appeals data are used. Source: from other nearby locations. The majority of DLA Justice Statistics Analytical Services—Ministry of Justice appeals made by people in Coventry are heard in the Social Security Benefits: Appeals hearing venue in Coventry although this venue also hears appeals from other nearby locations. Mr Ainsworth: To ask the Secretary of State for The following table shows the number of DLA appeals Justice (1) how long on average it took the Tribunals disposed of at all hearing venues in England; hearing Service to administer a First-Tier Tribunal social venues in the west midlands; and the hearing venue in security and child support appeal in (a) 2009, (b) 2010 Coventry in the financial years of 2009-10, 2010-11 and and (c) 2011; [84562] from 1 April 2011 to 31 October (the latest date for which information is available). The table also shows (2) how long on average the Tribunals Service took the number of DLA appeals disposed of at tribunal to administer a First-Tier Tribunal social security and hearing in these venues during these time periods. child support appeal in respect of (a) disability living allowance, (b) employment and support allowance, (c) DLA appeal disposals income support, (d) jobseeker’s allowance and (e) tax 1 April to 31 2009-10 2010-11 October 2011 credits in 2010; and what estimate he has made of the equivalent figures for 2011; [84644] Total DLA appeals disposed of (3) how many disability living allowance appeals England 50,900 50,500 38,900 were heard by the Tribunals Service from appellants in West midlands 4,800 4,800 3,800 (a) England, (b) the west midlands and (c) Coventry Coventry 690 510 450 in (i) 2009, (ii) 2010 and (iii) 2011; [84645]

(4) what proportion of appeals to the Tribunals DLA appeals Service regarding (a) disability living allowance, (b) disposed of at employment and support allowance, (c) income hearing support, (d) jobseeker’s allowance and (e) tax credit England 40,900 39,400 31,600 were successful in (i) 2009, (ii) 2010 and (iii) 2011. West midlands 4,000 3,700 3,000 [84646] Coventry 550 380 340

Mr Djanogly: Appeals against decisions made by the (4) The following table shows the proportion of appeals Department for Work and Pensions on an individual’s regarding (a) disability living allowance, (b) employment entitlement to social security and child support are and support allowance, (c) income support, (d) jobseeker’s heard by the First-tier Tribunal (Social Security and allowance and (e) tax credit which were successful in Child Support). The data are provided broken down by the financial years of 2009-10, 2010-11 and from 1 April financial year, which is more readily available for the 2011 to 31 October (the latest date for which information SSCS tribunal. is available). (1) The average time from receipt of an appeal to Successful appeals disposal by the tribunal was (a) 14.3 weeks in 2009-10, Percentage 1 April to 31 (b) 19.5 weeks in 2010-11, and (c) 24 weeks between 2009-10 2010-11 October 2011 1 April 2011 and 31 October (the latest date for which information is available). These figures include cases Disability living 41 38 39 that were decided by a tribunal hearing and those that allowance Employment and 37 37 38 were disposed of by other means (such as being withdrawn, support allowance superseded or struck out). 197W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 198W

Successful appeals such as breaches and execution of bench warrants are Percentage occasionally at short notice therefore it is not always 1Aprilto31 possible to republish the list. 2009-10 2010-11 October 2011 In civil and family cases, the only cases that are not Income support 29 28 27 published on the court lists are those cases that that are Jobseeker’s 18 13 15 emergency applications which come in at short notice. allowance Such hearings are recorded on the cause list by the Tax credits 15 10 10 court clerk. All cases are listed depending on their priority regardless In response to significant and unforecast increases in of whether they are to be in public or in private. appeals to the SSCS Tribunal, Her Majesty’s Courts Published court lists include information relating to and Tribunals Service has increased its hearing capacity. both public and private hearings although where there Total disposals by the SSCS Tribunal in the period are sensitive cases to be heard in private, the full names between April and October 2011 were 21% up on the of the parties may be withheld in order to protect the same period in 2010, and 66% higher than in the same vulnerable. This includes adoption and care proceedings seven months in 2009. Disposals have exceeded appeals involving children. received in each of the last 10 months. Treasure Trove: Coroners ATTORNEY-GENERAL Dan Jarvis: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice what information his Department holds on the cost to Crown Prosecution Service: Training local authorities of local coroners holding inquests on cases of treasure in (a) 2009 and (b) 2010; and if he Emily Thornberry: To ask the Attorney-General how will make a statement. [84061] many prosecutors in the Crown Prosecution Service have received domestic violence training in each year Mr Djanogly: The information requested is not held since 2008. [84460] centrally. To obtain this information would be at disproportionate cost as it would require every coroner The Attorney-General: Due to the volume of domestic in England and Wales to interrogate the accounts sent violence prosecutions, all prosecutors and associate to local authorities for inquests into treasure finds for prosecutors were trained between 2005 and 2008— 2009 and 2010. approximately 4,500 members of staff. From April 2008 to end of November 2011, 676 new Dan Jarvis: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice staff have completed domestic violence training. A pursuant to the contribution of Lord McNally of breakdown of yearly uptake is provided in the following 23 November 2011, Official Report, House of Lords, table: column 11605, on the Public Bodies Bill [Lords], if he Prosecutor or associate prosecutors trained in DV will establish the post of Coroner for Treasure; and if Number he will make a statement. [84155] 2011 (January to November) 115 Mr Djanogly: Implementation of the Coroner for 2010 187 Treasure is dependent on funding being available for 2009 144 that post. On 17 November 2011 the Minister for Culture, 2008 230 Communications and Creative Industries, my hon. Friend the Member for Wantage (Mr Vaizey), informed interested Departmental Pay parties that funding is not currently available for the post. However the matter will be reviewed as part of the Mr Thomas: To ask the Attorney-General whether implementation of the Coroners and Justice Act 2009. any senior staff in (a) the Law Officers’ Departments and (b) their Executive agencies are paid by means of Trials: Disclosure of Information payments to a limited company in lieu of a salary; and if he will publish his policy on such payments. [85087] John Hemming: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice what steps his Department takes to identify The Solicitor-General: No senior staff in the Law occasions when court hearings take place that are not Officers’ Departments or Executive agency are paid by formally listed; what guidance his Department has means of payments to a limited company in lieu of a issued to courts on listing cases that will not be held in salary. The Law Officers’ Departments do not have any public; and if he will make a statement. [84572] policies governing payment by such a method.

Mr Djanogly: Listing is a judicial responsibility and Departmental Written Questions function. HMCTS provides guidance to the administration on listing however it is a matter for the judiciary how Chris Ruane: To ask the Attorney-General what cases are assigned and listed in court which includes proportion of written questions for answer on a named those that are held in chambers and not accessible by day received a substantive answer within five working the public. days in each of the last six months. [85052] All criminal cases are formally listed and all hearings The Attorney-General: Information on the number of are recorded at the courthouse through internal systems named day written questions received by the Attorney- and databases which collects this information centrally General’s Office over the last six months is contained in for HMCTS. Daily court lists are published but hearings the following table: 199W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 200W

We support the work undertaken through the Counter- Number of written questions received Number Improvised Explosive Devices (C-IED) Theatre Exploitation for answer on a answered on the Proportion on Laboratory Technical Arrangement, including through 2011 named day named day time (%) sharing information on the UK’s established C-IED July 4 3 75 capability, but we do not intend to join the programme. June 9 9 100 August 0 — — Military Bases: Scotland September 2 2 100 October 5 4 80 Mike Crockart: To ask the Secretary of State for November 2 2 100 Defence which bases in Scotland are currently Total 22 20 91 undergoing a capacity review; what the scope of the The Government have committed to providing the review is; and what the time scale is for completion of Procedure Committee with information relating to written the review. [83691] parliamentary question performance on a sessional basis and will provide full information to the committee at Nick Harvey: The Ministry of Defence is currently the end of the session. Statistics relating to Government planning to look at the potential capacity, utilisation Department’s performance for the 2009-10 Parliamentary and condition or disposal opportunities of a number of Session were previously provided to the committee and sites across the UK. It is expected this work will be are available on the Parliament website. undertaken in the first half of 2012, so at present, it is too early to say which sites in Scotland will be included.

DEFENCE Angus Robertson: To ask the Secretary of State for Defence (1) how many (a) military and (b) civilian Departmental Redundancy personnel are employed at the Eastriggs Storage Depot Mr Jim Murphy: To ask the Secretary of State for in Dumfriesshire; [84260] Defence (1) how many civilian staff will lose their jobs (2) how much his Department has invested in the following the announcement on 10 November 2011 Eastriggs Storage Depot in Dumfriesshire in each of regarding the restructuring of regional divisions; the last five years; [84261] [83352] (3) what discussions he has had with the Scotland (2) how many civilian jobs will be lost as a result of office on the future of the Eastriggs Storage Depot in the closure of Headquarters 2nd Division at (a) Dumfriesshire; [84262] Edinburgh, (b) Aldershot and (c) Shrewsbury. [83361] (4) how many (a) military and (b) civilian personnel Nick Harvey: This restructuring will remove 440 civilian were stationed at the Eastriggs Storage Depot in posts from our regional force structures at both division Dumfriesshire in each year since 1997; [84263] and brigade levels, and their supporting units. (5) if he will estimate the annual cost of wages for The following civilian posts will be cut in each of the service and civilian personnel based at (a) the divisional headquarters. These losses, which were included Eastriggs Storage Depot in Dumfriesshire and (b) the in the reduction target announced in the Strategic Defence Longtown Facility in Cumbria. [84277] and Security Review White Paper, will be offset by the creation of a number of posts in the new Support Peter Luff: The Eastriggs storage depot is no longer Command headquarters in Aldershot. used. In October 2010, all personnel and operations

Headquarters Civilian job increases/decreases were moved to the nearby Defence Munitions site at Longtown. Since 2004, the number of personnel based HQ 2nd Division Edinburgh— -103 at Eastriggs storage depot were: disbands HQ 4th Division Aldershot— -82 Number disbands Military personnel Civilian personnel HQ 5th Division Shrewsbury— -63 disbands 2004 1—41 HQ Support Command Aldershot— +104 2005 1—44 forms 2006 1—43 Civilian staff declared surplus will be placed in the 2007 0 44 Department’s redeployment pool and given assistance 2008 0 34 to find an alternative post. 2009 0 28 EU Defence Policy 2010 0 5 2011 0 0 Angus Robertson: To ask the Secretary of State for 1 Not held. Defence what consideration he has given to joining (a) Records of military and civilian manpower numbers the European Air Transport Fleet Programme at Eastriggs storage depot prior to 2007, and 2004 Arrangement and (b) the Counter-Improvised respectively are not available. There have been no staff Explosive Devices Theatre Exploitation Laboratory permanently based at Eastriggs since October 2010. Technical Arrangement. [84364] For financial year 2011-12, the cost of wages for Peter Luff: We continue to monitor the progress of Ministry of Defence civilians and military personnel the European Air Transport Fleet Programme and keep based at Defence Munitions Longtown is approximately our current position of non-membership under review. £7 million. 201W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 202W

Investment over each of the last five years in the voluntarily and (ii) been subject to enforced removal in Eastriggs storage depot was: each of the last five years. [85207]

Financial year Expenditure (£) Damian Green: The following tables show the number of people who applied for asylum in a given year and 2006-07 244,000 how many subsequently: 2007-08 320,000 (a) were refused asylum and, of which, how many have had a 2008-09 992,000 removal or voluntary departure; 2009-10 120,000 (b) appealed to the Immigration Appeals Tribunal/Tribunals 2010-11 63,000 Service Immigration and Asylum against such refusal and, of No decisions have been made regarding the future of which, how many have had a removal or voluntary departure; and Eastriggs storage depot. No discussions have recently (c) had their appeal refused and, of which, how many have had a removal or voluntary departure. taken place with the Scotland Office specifically in respect of the future of the site. Information on whether the departure was voluntary or an enforced removal is not available; instead the departure type has been split into available categories of HOME DEPARTMENT ‘enforced removals and notified voluntary departures’ Asylum and ‘assisted voluntary return and other voluntary departures’. Tony Baldry: To ask the Secretary of State for the Data on asylum and removal outcomes are available Home Department how many people have (a) applied in the asylum table as.06 of the quarterly Immigration for asylum and been refused, (b) appealed to the Statistics. The latest release: “Immigration Statistics Immigration Appeals Tribunal against such refusal and July - September 2011” is available in the Library of the (c) had their appeal refused by the Immigration House and the Home Office Science website at: Appeals Tribunal; and of those numbers how many her http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/science-research/research- Department estimates have (i) left the jurisdiction statistics/migration/migration-statistics1/

Outcome analysis of asylum applications, as at May 2011 Refused asylum, HP or DL (a) (i) and (ii) Enforced removals and Assisted voluntary returns Refused asylum, HP Removals and voluntary notified voluntary and other voluntary Total main applicants or DL departures departures departures

2006 23,608 16,415 4,722 3,752 970 2007 23,431 15,203 4,179 3,238 941 2008 25,932 15,035 3,998 3,013 985 2009 24,487 15,211 3,518 2,583 935 2010 17,916 11,304 2,907 2,117 790

Appeals lodged (b) (i) and (ii) Enforced removals and Assisted voluntary returns Removals and voluntary notified voluntary and other voluntary Total main applicants Appeals lodged departures departures departures

2006 23,608 11,519 2,247 1,544 703 2007 23,431 10,462 1,975 1,300 675 2008 25,932 11,794 1,738 1,088 650 2009 24,487 12,794 1,705 1,051 654 2010 17,916 8,943 1,391 919 472

Dismissed appeals (c) (i) and (ii) Enforced removals and Assisted voluntary returns Removals and voluntary notified voluntary and other voluntary Total main applicants Dismissed appeals departures departures departures

2006 23,608 8,375 2,138 1,481 657 2007 23,431 7,421 1,796 1,208 588 2008 25,932 7,963 1,592 1,014 578 2009 24,487 8,252 1,583 988 595 2010 17,916 5,899 1,273 869 404 Notes: 1. Data relating to applications or decisions made in 2010 and 2011 are provisional figures. 2. Statistics compiled on 9 May 2011. Further initial decisions, appeals and removals and voluntary departures will have occurred since this time. 3. Year relates to the period in which the application was made; the initial decisions and appeals within a ‘year of application’ may have been made in a later year. 4. Refusals exclude withdrawn applications. 5. Excludes outcomes of cases reconsidered prior to appeal. Excludes cases which were successful after appeal to the Upper Tribunal of the Immigration and Asylum Chamber. 6. ‘Enforced removals and notified voluntary departures’ figures include asylum removals performed by UK Border Agency officers using in-country powers of removal and a small number of cases dealt with at juxtaposed controls. 7. Since October 2006, ‘enforced removals and notified voluntary departures’ include people leaving under facilitated return schemes. 8. ‘Assisted voluntary returns’ may include some on-entry cases and some cases where enforcement action has been initiated. 9. ‘Other voluntary departures’ are people who it has been established left without informing the immigration authorities. 203W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 204W

Asylum: Finance Detention Centres

Dr Whiteford: To ask the Secretary of State for the Pete Wishart: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department what emergency facilities are Home Department how much funding the UK Border available for users of the section 4 payment card whose Agency has allocated to investment in pre-departure weekly resources have been exceeded. [84276] accommodation since May 2010; and at which Damian Green: There are no such facilities. Supported locations. [82048] persons are expected to live within the prescribed weekly credit limit of £35.39 per person. Damian Green: Since we ended the detention of children for immigration purposes in removal centres, we have Civil Disorder: Compensation introduced a new approach to enforce the departure of families who have to leave and refuse to do so voluntarily. Stella Creasy: To ask the Secretary of State for the Cedars pre-departure accommodation at Pease Pottage Home Department how many claims were received by near Crawley in West Sussex is part of that approach each police authority in England under the Riot and is only used as a last resort following advice from (Damages) Act 1886 between August and October the independent Family Returns Panel. 2011; and what the amount of those claims was. The full cost of the refurbishment of the building and [84429] grounds at Cedars to provide the accommodation is approximately £5.2 million which includes all building Nick Herbert [holding answer 1 December 2011]: works, consultancy, furniture and fittings, security and Applications have been made directly to police authorities IT. and there is no requirement for them to provide this information to the Home Office. Entry Clearances: Overseas Students Therefore, the precise figures of claims received and values will be held locally by each police authority. Anna Soubry: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department what steps she is taking to ensure Mr Hanson: To ask the Secretary of State for the that genuine students from overseas will be able to Home Department (1) what estimate she has made of continue to study theology at private colleges. [85197] the number of claims under the Riot (Damages) Act 1886 that have been made by each police authority Damian Green: My officials continue to discuss in relation to the civil disorder of August 2011; [84252] implementation of the student visa rules with theological (2) how many claims have been paid by police colleges. The Government have been clear that genuine authorities under the Riot (Damages) Act 1886 in high quality educational institutions have nothing to relation to the civil disorder of August 2011 as at fear from our reforms of student visas, which ensure 25 November 2011; [84253] that we can continue to attract the best students whose (3) when she expects all final claims for main motivation is study. No permanent limit has been compensation under the Riot (Damages) Act 1886 for placed on student visas. the civil disorder of August 2011 to be assessed by police authorities. [84254] Harassment: Surveillance Nick Herbert: Applications have been made directly to police authorities and there is no requirement for Tom Brake: To ask the Secretary of State for the them to provide this information to the Home Office. Home Department on how many occasions where complaints received by each police force in England Therefore, the precise figures of claims received will and Wales about harassment or stalking the suspect be held locally by each police authority. was the subject of a police surveillance operation in Departmental Pay 2010. [81894]

Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for the Lynne Featherstone: The information requested is not Home Department whether any senior staff in (a) her recorded centrally. Department and (b) its Executive agencies and Stalking behaviour can be prosecuted under The non-departmental public bodies are paid by means of Protection from Harassment Act 1997. My Department, payments to a limited company in lieu of a salary; and working with the Ministry of Justice, the Crown Prosecution if she will publish her policy on such payments. [85076] Service and the Association of Chief Police Officers (ACPO) continues to keep the effectiveness of this Damian Green: Senior staff in the Home Office and legislation under review. The Home Office has recently its agencies are contracted to work a set number of launched a consultation seeking views on how we can hours and are paid accordingly via the departmental better protect victims of stalking. pay roll. This applies to those on permanent contracts and fixed term appointments. Senior staff outside these Hillsborough Independent Panel arrangements are appointed through frameworks and agreements as determined by the Government Procurement Steve Rotheram: To ask the Secretary of State for the Service. Full details of all such framework agreements Home Department pursuant to the statement of 17 can be found via the following link: October 2011, Official Report, columns 668-70, on http://www.buyingsolutions.gov.uk/frameworks/list.html Hillsborough disaster, how many documents relating to This also applies to senior staff in the Department’s the Hillsborough disaster have so far been released to non-departmental public bodies (NDBPS). the Hillsborough independent panel. [84563] 205W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 206W

Nick Herbert [holding answer 5 December 2011]: I All data are sourced from the National Operations am happy to confirm that all documents held by Database (NOD) system. The NOD is a management Government Departments have been released to the information tool and data from it is not quality assured Hillsborough independent panel. The Government fully under National Statistics protocols. Figures provided support the work of the independent panel and it is for from the NOD do not constitute part of National the panel to take forward its work in relation to those Statistics and should be treated as provisional. documents. However to determine which of these individuals Human Trafficking: Northern Ireland arrested have been removed would only be possible by examination of individual records which would exceed the cost threshold. Lady Hermon: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department what recent assessment she has Immigration Controls made of the extent of human trafficking in Northern Ireland. [84850] Tony Baldry: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department what steps she is taking in respect Damian Green: During the period 1 April 2009 to of her Department’s performance in arresting and 31 March 2011 there were 1,481 referrals to the National detaining those who do not comply with immigration Referral Mechanism, of these 35 (2%) related to Northern controls. [85206] Ireland and comprised 14 nationalities. 24 of these referrals were from three nationalities: China (17), Nigeria Damian Green: The UK Border Agency’s enforcement (5) and Romania (2). operation remains focused on arresting, detaining and Illegal Immigrants removing illegal migrants. Between 1 January and 30 September 2011, 26,962 illegal migrants in the UK were removed or voluntarily departed. Tony Baldry: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department what estimate she has made of the The agency has taken further steps to improve the number of people in the United Kingdom who have no information we have on the whereabouts of illegal right to be within the jurisdiction. [85208] migrants. In particular, to make it easier for members of the public to submit information, a new web form was Damian Green: The UK Border Agency is not able to introduced on the UK Border Agency website on provide the information requested. It is not possible to 2 November 2011, which sets out clearly the information accurately quantify the number of individuals currently needed in order for the agency to act. We are currently in the UK who have no right to be within the jurisdiction, developing this form further to enhance the quality of as some deliberately evade immigration control in order the information we receive from the public, part of our to remain in the country illegally. ongoing commitment to improve our capability in this area. The e-Borders system enables checks to be made on individuals arriving or exiting the country but is not yet The agency is working to improve its performance in fully rolled out. The Government are committed to achieving removals of illegal migrants. There is a current ensuring that the number of UK ports undertaking exit focus on refinement of our contact management techniques checks is increased to ensure a more complete travel to improve the voluntary return rate of illegal migrants. history is recorded on passengers. Additionally, steps are being taken to enhance absconder tracing and streamline processes to improve the success The UK Border Agency has established local rate of enforcement operations. The agency will continue immigration teams across the UK to gather intelligence, to focus on maximising productivity from all its enforcement tackle illegal working, and track down and detain assets including reporting centres, arrest teams, immigration immigration offenders. The focus of these teams include removal centres and charter flights. the prevention and disruption of illegal activity and the arrest and removal of offenders. Immigration: Europe

Tony Baldry: To ask the Secretary of State for the Mr Stewart Jackson: To ask the Secretary of State Home Department how many people have been for the Home Department what measures her arrested as illegal workers during searches of business Department has taken to share criminal records data premises in each of the last three years; and how many with other EU member states in order to exclude EEA such people were removed from the UK in each region nationals from entry to the UK under the provisions of in each year. [85300] Regulation 19 (1B) of the Immigration (European Economic Area) Regulations 2006; and if she will Damian Green: The UK Border Agency record data make a statement. [84632] relating to offenders arrested on the National Operations Database. From information held we can state that the Lynne Featherstone [holding answer 5 December 2011]: following numbers of people were arrested for offences Regulation 19(1 B) which came into effect on 1 June related specifically to illegal working visits: 2009 enables the Secretary of State for the Home Department, the right hon. Member for Maidenhead Number (Mrs May), to exclude an EEA national, or member of 2008-09 5,804 his/her family, where she considers that exclusion is 2009-10 4,288 justified on the grounds of public policy, public security 2010-11 4,186 or public health. In reaching a decision the Secretary of Total 14,278 State is obliged to take a number of factors into account. These include: the decision must be proportionate, it 207W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 208W must be based on the personal conduct of the individual Hague convention on the Civil Aspects of International concerned and that conduct must represent a genuine, Child Abduction relate to children under 16. present and sufficiently serious threat affecting one of The number of outgoing international parental child the fundamental interests of society. The fact that a abduction cases since 2006 from the UK to countries person may have a previous criminal conviction does that have ratified or acceded to the 1980 Hague convention not of itself justify an exclusion decision. are as follows, by calendar year: Where the United Kingdom receives information, International parental child abduction. Each ease may involve more than one such as arrest warrants, from foreign law enforcement child agencies which indicates that individuals might be present Cases in, or coming to, the United Kingdom and could present Outgoing from a risk to public protection, we will include that information England and Outgoing Outgoing from on the watchlists. Where an individual is extradited Wales from Scotland Northern Ireland from the United Kingdom, or is deported as a result of 2006 153 9 6 their criminal record, such information may also be 2007 183 10 5 recorded on the watchlists. 2008 181 9 12 The United Kingdom also exchanges data with other 2009 193 15 7 EU member states under Council Decision 2005/876/JHA 2010 158 10 8 on the exchange of information extracted from the criminal record. This means that where an EU national The Foreign and Commonwealth Office has is subject to criminal proceedings here, the United responsibility for international parental child abduction Kingdom may ask their country of nationality for from all parts of the UK to countries that have not details of their previous criminal record. Such information ratified or acceded to the 1980 Hague convention or may then be used in the criminal justice process. where the convention is not in force between the UK and the country in question. Children are those under When the United Kingdom connects to the new 16. The FCO may also provide consular support in second generation Schengen Information System (SIS outgoing Hague convention country cases. Cases by II) in 2015 we will receive more information about financial year dealt with by the FCO to Hague convention individuals wanted on European arrest warrants and and non-convention countries between 1 April 2006 we anticipate stopping more EEA nationals at our and 31 March 2011 are shown in the table. Where a case borders as a result. was to a Hague convention country, that case will also Kidnapping: Children appear in the statistics for the relevant part of the UK. International parental child abduction FCO cases (outgoing from the UK) Each Mark Lancaster: To ask the Secretary of State for the case may involve more than one child. Home Department what estimate she has made of the Cases number of children abducted from the UK since 2006; 2006-07 265 and how many such abductions were carried out by the 2007-08 249 child’s parents. [84110] 2008-09 196 2009-10 238 Mr Djanogly: I have been asked to reply. 2010-11 264 The Home Office has responsibility for prevention of the criminal offence of child abduction. The Home The Government have not made an overall estimate Office statistics for the number of children reported to of the number of child abductions within the UK or police as abducted within England and Wales in each from the UK to countries abroad. Statistics can only financial year for which statistics are available from cover reported cases. 2006 are shown in the table; children are those under 16. Home Office statistics do not show whether or not the Metropolitan Police: Manpower abduction was by a parent, nor whether the abducted child was removed from the UK, or not. Some of these offences may have an international element involving a Clive Efford: To ask the Secretary of State for the parent and may therefore also appear in the international Home Department how many police officers there were parental child abduction statistics as follows. in each basic command unit of the Metropolitan police force on (a) 31 March 2010, (b) 30 September 2010 Police recorded offences of child abduction 2006-07 to 2010-11, England and and (c) 31 March 2011; and if she will make a Wales. Each offence relates to one child. statement. [84750] Number 2006-07 696 Nick Herbert [holding answer 5 December 2011]: 2007-08 595 Available data on police officer strength for the Metropolitan 2008-09 567 police force by basic command unit, as at 31 March 2009-10 559 2010 and 31 March 2011, are given in the following 2010-11 552 table. The collection of police recorded statistics for Scotland Information on police officer strength relating to and Northern Ireland is a matter for the devolved 30 September 2010 is not available centrally. Administrations. The latest published police personnel statistics relate Statistics on international parental child abductions to 31 March 2011 and were published in July 2011. are collected by the number of cases, where a case can They are available online at: involve more than one child; cases under the 1980 http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk 209W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 210W

Police officer strength1 by basic command unit (BCU), Metropolitan Police: Crimes of Violence police, as at 31 March 2010 and 2011 BCU 31 March 2010 31 March 2011 John McDonnell: To ask the Secretary of State for Barking and 448 443 the Home Department how many police officers have Dagenham been stabbed during the course of their duties in each Barnet 596 585 of the last five years. [84739] Bexley 406 400 Brent 712 682 Nick Herbert: The requested information is not collected Bromley 524 511 centrally by the Home Office. Camden 889 831 City of Westminster 1,656 1,586 Police: South Wales Croydon 755 736 Ealing 728 697 Enfield 601 580 Huw Irranca-Davies: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department (1) how many police officers Greenwich 711 669 were employed by South Wales Police in each of the Hackney 784 771 last five years; [84715] Hammersmith and 600 574 Fulham (2) what estimate she has made of the number of Haringey 734 708 police to be employed by South Wales Police in each of Harrow 404 392 the next five years. [84716] Havering 395 387 Hillingdon 526 540 Nick Herbert: It is a matter for the chief constable Hounslow 540 522 and the police authority in each force to determine the Islington 719 713 number of police officers that are deployed within the Kensington and 579 565 available resource. Chelsea The latest available information shows the number of Kingston upon 337 321 police officers in South Wales police force between 2007 Thames and 2011 (full-time equivalent) is set out in the following Lambeth 1,042 1,004 table: Lewisham 691 657 Number of police officers in South Wales police force between 2007 Merton 396 392 and 20111 Newham 826 805 As at 31 March each year Number Redbridge 502 486 Richmond upon 335 307 2007 3,336 Thames 2008 3,244 Southwark 964 933 2009 3,146 Sutton 356 344 2010 3,148 Tower Hamlets 829 793 2011 3,100 Waltham Forest 578 556 1 This table contains full-time equivalent figures that have been Wandsworth 619 608 rounded to the nearest whole number. Heathrow 461 435 Central Services 12,126 11,907 Police: Surveillance 1 These are full-time equivalents figures that have been rounded to the nearest whole number. Figures include those officers on career breaks. Jonathan Edwards: To ask the Secretary of State for the Home Department if she will collect information Police: Bournemouth on the deployment of undercover officers by police forces in England and Wales over the last 10 years. Mr Ellwood: To ask the Secretary of State for the [77037] Home Department how many (a) special constables and (b) community support officers are operating in Nick Herbert: The decision on whether to deploy Bournemouth. [84574] covert undercover officers is an operational matter for individual law enforcement agencies. The chief surveillance Nick Herbert: The latest available information shows commissioner has the statutory responsibility for the that there were 79 community support officers in post oversight of whether police use of this technique is in on 31 March 2010 in the Bournemouth and Poole basic accordance with the law. His key findings and broad command unit (BCU). This is a full-time equivalent statistics are published in annual reports which are laid figure that has been rounded to the nearest whole before Parliament and are available in the House Library. number; it includes those community support officers on career breaks or maternity/paternity leave. Figures Stalking: Homicide for special constables are not available centrally for this BCU. Mr Hanson: To ask the Secretary of State for the Dorset police force was restructured and BCUs were Home Department how many cases which included a redefined during 2010-11 and, as a result, data for stalking-related murder have been referred to the Bournemouth and Poole are not available for 31 March Independent Police Complaints Commission since 2011. 2009. [78996] 211W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 212W

Nick Herbert: This is a matter for the Independent Mr Weir: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy Police Complaints Commission (IPCC). However, it and Climate Change whether any of the resources does not hold the specific data requested. reallocated from the carbon capture and storage The IPCC is responsible for the annual publication of competition fund will be directed to low-carbon statistics relating to deaths during or following police projects. [84895] contact. The most recent report is available on the IPCC website at: Charles Hendry: The £1 billion allocated for CCS projects remains available to support CCS projects. www.ipcc.gov.uk Climate Change: Africa

ENERGY AND CLIMATE CHANGE Rushanara Ali: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change what proportion of his Carbon Sequestration: Finance recently announced funding to tackle climate change in Africa he proposes will come from (a) the Department for International Development and (b) existing Mr Weir: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy funding allocated as official development assistance. and Climate Change what discussions he has had with the Chancellor of the Exchequer on the decision to [85323] reallocate the fund which had been earmarked for the Gregory Barker: I will be announcing a package of carbon capture and storage competition. [84891] support to help Africa adapt to the impacts of climate change and move to low carbon development paths in Charles Hendry: The Secretary of State for Energy Durban on 6 December. The package is funded out of and Climate Change, my right hon. Friend the Member the UK’s £2.9 billion International Climate Fund, for Eastleigh (Chris Huhne) and the Chancellor of the which was announced in the 2010 spending review Exchequer, my right hon. Friend the Member for Tatton and is all classified as official development (Mr Osborne), have discussed financing of carbon capture assistance. The fund consists of £1.8 billion from the and storage (CCS) projects and £l billion remains available. Department for International Development, £1 billion The detailed profile of spend will be determined by the from the Department of Energy and Climate Change projects selected and when they require funding. and £0.1 billion from the Department for Environment Food and Rural Affairs. Mr Weir: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change (1) when he was informed of the Rushanara Ali: To ask the Secretary of State for decision by HM Treasury to reallocate the fund Energy and Climate Change what proportion of his earmarked for the carbon capture and storage recently announced funding for climate change finance competition; [84892] in Africa (a) has already been committed and (b) is (2) what assessment he has made of the potential new funding commitments. [85324] effect of the decision to reallocate the fund earmarked for the carbon capture and storage competition on the Gregory Barker: I will be announcing a package of time taken to develop a demonstrator project. [84894] support to help Africa adapt to the impacts of climate change and move to low carbon development paths in Charles Hendry: £1 billion remains available to support Durban on 6 December. The package is all funded out CCS projects. I expect CCS projects to come forward in of an existing funding commitment—the UK’s £2.9 billion this spending review period and for some expenditure International Climate Fund, which was announced in to be committed as part of that process. The detailed the 2010 spending review. profile of spend will be determined by the projects selected and when they require funding. Rushanara Ali: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change through which (a) Mr Weir: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy Departments, (b) funds and (c) programmes he and Climate Change what discussions he has had with proposes that his recently announced funding to tackle representatives of industry involved in development of climate change in Africa will be delivered. [85325] carbon capture and storage projects on the availability and timetable for a competition supporting a Gregory Barker: I will announce the full details of the demonstration project. [84893] package of support to help Africa adapt to the impacts of climate change and move to low carbon development Charles Hendry: My colleagues and I, at ministerial paths in Durban on 6 December. The package is funded and official level, meet regularly with industry representatives out of the UK’s £2.9 billion International Climate to discuss the CCS demonstration programme. Fund and will be drawn from the budgets of the On 16 December we are holding an industry day to Department for International Development and the provide further information on the CCS programme, to Department of Energy and Climate Change through which this Government have already committed £1 billion the UK’s International Climate Fund. of capital funding. Sponsors and developers of proposed CCS projects, power generators, CO2 transport Rushanara Ali: To ask the Secretary of State for infrastructure providers, oil and gas field operators and Energy and Climate Change whether the recently independent operators, and CO2 capture technology announced aid funding to tackle climate change in providers are invited to contact the Office of Carbon Africa is additional to the funding already (a) Capture and Storage if they wish to attend. committed as fast-start funding and (b) announced for 213W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 214W climate change by the Department for Energy and on sales of goods and services during the smart meter Climate Change and the Department for International installation visit and arrangements for updating a code Development. [85326] in the light of, among other things, consumer experience during the roll-out. We will publish our response in the Gregory Barker: I will announce the full details of the new year. package of support to help Africa adapt to the impacts of climate change and move to low carbon development Guto Bebb: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy paths in Durban on 6 December. The package is funded and Climate Change whether he plans to expand the out of the UK’s £2.9 billion International Climate energy grid network to ensure people in rural areas Fund, which was announced in the 2010 spending review. who do not receive gas from the grid are able to participate in the smart meter roll out. [84999] Rushanara Ali: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change with reference to his Charles Hendry: Customers who receive only electricity recent announcement of climate change funding for from the energy grid network will be offered an electricity Africa, from which departments’ budget he proposes smart meter and in-home display by their energy supplier, such funding will be drawn. [85327] and so will be able to participate in, and benefit from, the smart meter roll-out. Gregory Barker: I will be announcing a package of Ofgem is responsible for regulating the extension of support to help Africa adapt to the impacts of climate the gas grid and has encouraged the larger gas distribution change and move to low carbon development paths in networks to extend the grid to fuel poor households Durban on 6 December. The funding will be drawn and homes within the priority group for the Carbon from the budgets of the Department for International Emissions Reduction Target. In total up to 20,000 Development and the Department of Energy and Climate households could be connected under this scheme over Change through the UK’s International Climate Fund. the current price control period (2008-13). Diesel Fuel: Prices Fuel Poverty

Annette Brooke: To ask the Secretary of State for Julie Hilling: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change what recent Energy and Climate Change what estimate he has made representations he has received on (a) diesel pump of the likely level of support for energy efficiency prices in England and (b) how such prices compare programmes for households in fuel poverty from 2013 with those in other European countries; and if he will onwards. [84169] make a statement. [85303] Gregory Barker: Government are currently consulting Charles Hendry: The Department has received a number on the Green Deal framework which will be in place of representations on diesel prices and how pump prices from late 2012 and will enable households to access compared with those in other European countries. energy efficiency improvements at no upfront cost. This includes a new Energy Company Obligation (ECO), UK pre-tax petrol and diesel prices are among the worth £1.3 billion per year, providing extra support lowest in Europe. where it is most needed. The Government are aware of the significant impacts Under the ECO ’Affordable Warmth obligation’, we high oil prices are having on consumers, which is why expect energy suppliers to invest around £350 million the autumn statement document announced that the per year in providing heating and insulation measures fuel duty increase of 3.02p/l that was expected to take for vulnerable households on low incomes at greatest place in January 2012 has been deferred to August 2012. risk of fuel poverty. We anticipate that the rest of ECO In addition, the 2011-12 inflation only increase in fuel will support energy efficiency improvements in more duty that was planned for August 2012 has been cancelled. difficult and expensive to treat properties, whatever the income or circumstances of the householder, through a Energy: Meters ’Carbon Reduction obligation’. We are consulting specifically on expected models for “roll-out”, to ensure Barry Gardiner: To ask the Secretary of State for all households stand to benefit, including those in the Energy and Climate Change (1) how his Department poorest communities. proposes to take account of consumers’ experience of the installation of smart meters when developing the Fuel Poverty: Death smart metering installation code of practice; [83622] (2) if he proposes that the smart metering Mr Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy installation code of practice will include measures to and Climate Change what estimate he has made of the prevent doorstep selling of utilities during the number of (a) men and (b) women over the age of 65 installation of smart meters. [83623] years who have died as a result of being unable to heat their home due to fuel poverty; and if he will make a Charles Hendry: Electricity and gas suppliers have statement. [R] [84549] developed a draft smart metering installation code of practice, which they published for consultation in August Gregory Barker: The specific data requested are not 2011. They are now considering responses. The Department recorded. of Energy and Climate Change (DECC) has consulted However, the Office for National Statistics (ONS) on the draft licence conditions that will formally underpin measures the number of excess winter deaths each year. an industry code. These draft conditions include rules During the 2010-11 winter, of the 25,700 excess winter 215W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 216W deaths recorded by ONS in England and Wales, around Charles Hendry [holding answer 5 December 2011]: 8,800 were recorded among men aged 65 and over, with Trade data on the amount of oil that is derived from tar around 12,900 recorded among women aged 65 and sands are not collected in National or International over. Statistics. In 2010, the UK imported 272,000 tonnes of crude Fuel Poverty: National Parks oil from Canada, and one tonne of petroleum products. In total, these imports account for 0.4% of the oil Tom Blenkinsop: To ask the Secretary of State for imported into the UK. Energy and Climate Change what estimate he has made Solar Power of the number of households in fuel poverty in the North York Moors National Park. [85383] Caroline Flint: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change whether his Department Gregory Barker: DECC do not calculate fuel poverty has made an assessment of any change in household at this geographical level. The estimated number of fuel energy consumption following the installation of solar poor households in 2009 in local authorities which photovoltaic systems. [83905] broadly cover the National Park are as follows: Redcar and Cleveland: 14,800 households (25% of households Gregory Barker: We have no robust quantitative evidence in Redcar and Cleveland) from the FITs scheme to date about behavioural change Scarborough: 13,200 households (26%) in households that install solar photovoltaic (PV) systems. Ryedale: 6,500 households (28%). Solar Power: Feed-in Tariffs Inverkip Power Station Zac Goldsmith: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change whether (a) individual Mr Weir: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy solar photovoltaic installations and (b) community- and Climate Change what the capacity and total owned solar photovoltaic schemes will be eligible to output from Inverkip power station was during its receive support through the proposed feed-in tariff lifetime; and what were the costs per MWh of this with contract for difference. [85187] output. [84424] Gregory Barker: Eligible individual and community- Charles Hendry: DECC does not hold data on the owned renewable electricity generating schemes below capacity, output or costs per MWh of output of Inverkip 50 kW can currently receive the small scale feed-in power station. However, a Scottish Power (the owners tariff, while those between 50 kW and 5 MW are able to of Inverkip) press release on the redevelopment of the choose support under either the small scale feed-in site states the capacity was 2,028 MW: tariff or the renewables obligation. Work is currently http://www.scottishpower.com/PressReleases_1891.htm under way to determine the appropriate eligibility criteria for the feed-in tariff with Contract for Difference scheme Nuclear Power and how it should interact with other support mechanisms. Further details will be published in quarter 1 next year. Miss McIntosh: To ask the Secretary of State for Warm Homes and Energy Conservation Act 2000 Energy and Climate Change what discussions he has had with the European Commission on allowing Mr Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy nuclear power to be recognised as a renewable source of and Climate Change what assessment he has made of energy; and if he will make a statement. [83612] the operation of (a) section 1 and (b) section 2 of the Warm Homes and Energy Conservation Act 2000 since Charles Hendry: The Government believe that nuclear July 2010; what representations he has received since power is an important low carbon source of energy and that month on the operation of the Act; and what should be a part of the UK’s future energy mix, but responses he gave to such representations. [R] [84484] accept that nuclear power should be considered as a low carbon rather than a renewable source of energy.Therefore, Gregory Barker [holding answer 5 December 2011]: the Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change, The Government announced a review of the definition the right hon. Member for Eastleigh (Chris Huhne), has of fuel poverty at the spending review in October 2010. had no discussions with the European Commission on The Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change, allowing nuclear power to be recognised as a renewable the right hon. Member for Eastleigh (Chris Huhne), source of energy. The UK’s vision for a low carbon appointed Professor Hills to carry out a review of the future sees a diverse mix of low carbon energy sources current definition of fuel poverty (as set out in section 1 contributing to our power supply including both renewables of the Act and under the strategy required in section 2) and nuclear power. in March 2011. Professor Hills ran a call for evidence on the definition Oil: Canada that received views from a variety of stakeholders including Fuel Poverty Advisory Group and the All Party Dr Huppert: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy Parliamentary Fuel Poverty and Energy Efficiency Group. and Climate Change what estimate he has made of the Professor Hills published his interim report in October quantity of oil used in the UK which is derived from 2011. The final report is due to be presented to Government Canadian tar sands. [84713] in early 2012, when we will respond formally. 217W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 218W

World War II: Medals Letter from Noel Shanahan: In reply to your recent Parliamentary Question about the Ian Austin: To ask the Secretary of State for Energy Child Support Agency, the Secretary of State promised a substantive and Climate Change what steps he is taking to reply from the Child Maintenance Commissioner as the Child Support Agency is now the responsibility of the Child Maintenance encourage former Bevin Boys to apply for the Bevin and Enforcement Commission. Boys Veterans Badge. [85321] You asked the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions, what consideration he has given to widening the powers of the Child Charles Hendry: To date, the Service Personnel and Support Agency to allow it to prosecute for non-payment of Veterans Agency (SPVA), acting on behalf of DECC, regular maintenance. [82912] have issued just under 5,000 Bevin Boys Veterans Badges The Child Support Agency already has a wide range of enforcement to former Bevin Boys and their widows, where their powers for the purposes of securing child maintenance from husbands passed away after the Badge was announced non-resident parents, who would otherwise fail to pay. Money on 20 June 2007. can be taken directly from a non-resident parent’s earnings if the At the time the Badge was announced and when the non-resident parent is employed, money can be taken directly from a non-resident parent’s bank or building society account, or first Badges were issued in March 2008 there was significant action can be taken through the courts. publicity both nationally and regionally by DECC and The most serious forms of enforcement are commitment to the Bevin Boys Association. Subsequently many local prison or disqualification from driving. The decision whether to councils have carried out regional advertising campaigns implement, and the length of the order, is at the discretion of a to encourage all former veterans, including the Bevin Magistrates’ Court (or Sheriff in Scotland) where they are satisfied Boys, to apply for Badges as part of their Veterans Day that a non-resident parent has “wilfully refused or culpably celebrations. neglected” to pay child maintenance—but this is not a criminal Full details of the Badge, the eligibility criteria and sanction. the application process appear on both the DECC and There are no plans at present to widen the enforcement powers SPVA website. of the Child Support Agency. I hope you find this answer helpful.

Construction: Industry WORK AND PENSIONS Business: Government Assistance Derek Twigg: To ask the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions what estimate he has made of the proportion of jobs lost in the construction industry Bill Esterson: To ask the Secretary of State for Work from sub-contracting businesses in each of the last and Pensions what assessment he has made of the three years. [84457] adequacy of support available from Jobcentre Plus for people wishing to start their own business who are in Mr Prisk: I have been asked to reply. receipt of employment and support allowance in (a) Merseyside and (b) the UK. [85218] The information is not collected in the form requested. However, the change in construction employment in Chris Grayling: While people on employment and each of the last three years for which information is support allowance (ESA) are not eligible for the new available is shown in the following table. The table enterprise allowance, Jobcentre Plus advisers can signpost covers all constructing firms, both main contractors claimants who are interested in self-employment to and subcontractors. other sources of support such as Enterprise Clubs, where available, and on-line support for new businesses, 2008 2009 2010 2011 including mentoring. ESA claimants can also access the Jobs Work Programme at a time that is right for them, where (thousand) providers are free to deliver the right support for the Workforce 2,304 2,240 2,158 2,093 individual. jobs Employee 1,361 1,363 1,281 1,231 People on ESA with more complex support needs jobs that cannot be met through other employment support Self- 933 874 872 858 provision have access, via their disability employment employed adviser, to Work Choice which can provide the right jobs support to help them find work or self-employment. Change Child Support Agency: Prosecutions (thousand) Workforce — -64 -82 -65 jobs Jack Lopresti: To ask the Secretary of State for Work Employee —2-82-50 and Pensions what consideration he has given to jobs widening the powers of the Child Support Agency to Self- — -59 -2 -14 allow it to prosecute for non-payment of regular employed jobs maintenance. [82912]

Maria Miller: The Child Maintenance and Enforcement Change Commission is responsible for the child maintenance (percentage) Workforce — -2.8 -3.7 -3.0 system. I have asked the child maintenance commissioner jobs to write to my hon. Friend with the information requested Employee — 0.1 -6.0 -3.9 and I have seen the response. jobs 219W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 220W

they do not procure whole or liquefied eggs. The Health 2008 2009 2010 2011 and Safety Executive only use fresh eggs all of which Self- — -6.3 -0.2 -1.6 are sourced in the UK. employed jobs Source: Departmental Food ONS, Workforce Jobs series, United Kingdom

Departmental Advisory Services Huw Irranca-Davies: To ask the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions what proportion of food sourced by (a) his Department and (b) public bodies Jonathan Edwards: To ask the Secretary of State for for which he is responsible was procured from UK food Work and Pensions what contribution his Department producers in the latest period for which figures are has made to the cross-Government review of advice available. [83782] funding announced in July 2011. [84337] Chris Grayling: The information requested is as follows: Chris Grayling: DWP officials met with Cabinet Office officials to discuss the review of advice funding, in (a) Since 1998 the Department for Work and Pensions order to outline the range and scope of advisory and (DWP) occupies the majority of its accommodation referral services that the Department provides. under a private finance initiative (PFI) known as the Prime contract. Under the terms of this PFI the Department leases back fully serviced accommodation from its private Departmental Eggs sector partner, Telereal Trillium. This covers a variety of facilities including, where appropriate, the provision of Huw Irranca-Davies: To ask the Secretary of State catering services which is delivered through Telereal for Work and Pensions what steps he is taking to ensure Trillium’s service partner, Compass Group UK. Compass that the same standards of animal welfare for whole undertakes all catering activity including food procurement. eggs apply to imported liquefied eggs procured by (a) Compass has confirmed that between April and his Department and (b) public bodies for which he is November 2011 the percentage of food procured from responsible. [83781] UK food producers is 24%. With regard to the sourcing from UK producers, Compass’figures have been determined Chris Grayling: The information requested is as follows: as follows: they have defined UK as guaranteed UK (a) Since 1998 the Department for Work and Pensions provenance which can be fully traced back to the source, (DWP) occupies the majority of its accommodation i.e. food that has been grown and harvested or born, under a private finance initiative (PFI) known as the bred and slaughtered in the UK. Therefore, they have Prime contract. Under the terms of this PFI the Department not included any products that even though may have leases back fully serviced accommodation from its private been produced or manufactured in the UK, are of sector partner, Telereal Trillium. This covers a variety of mixed origin. In addition Compass has confirmed the facilities including, where appropriate, the provision of following: catering services which is delivered through Telereal 100% of fresh beef is UK sourced Trillium’s service partner, Compass Group UK. Compass 100% of fresh pork joints is UK sourced undertakes all catering activity including food procurement. Compass has confirmed that all the liquid egg supplied 100% of fresh milk is both UK sourced and Red Tractor on the DWP catering contract is sourced from hens 100% of shell eggs are UK sourced and Lion marked from an enriched cage system. All potatoes and root vegetables are sourced from UK when in In line with the Department for Environment, Food season. and Rural Affairs guidance, DWP reports on how the (b) Non-departmental public bodies (NDPBs) that Government Buying Standards criteria are being met. share accommodation with the DWP on Prime contract One of the criterion that will feature in future reports is sites are included in the response at (a) above. For around how eggs are sourced. This report will feature in those NDPBs not covered by the Prime contract, none periodic updates on the DWP public website—the following directly source food, e.g. The Pension Advisory Service link gives the latest details: and the Independent Living Fund (ILF) only occasionally www.dwp.gov.uk/docs/gbs-food-catering.pdf buy food and snacks on an ad hoc basis in small quantities from local food retailers and as such unable This link advises on DWP’s commitment and that we to verify the source of food producers. Given the low are working closely with Telereal Trillium/Compass to expenditure, e.g. ILF spent £1,400 in the last calendar maximize compliance with this commitment. For example, year, it would seem disproportionate for local caterers ensuring this subject features in regular meetings/discussions to provide this information to these NDPBs. Remploy with Telereal Trillium/Compass and receiving updates/ has indicated that for their multiple sites their canteens progress on compliance. In addition, Compass regularly are operated by local third party organisations. The meets with Telereal Trillium encouraging initiatives to Health and Safety Executive’s HQ at Bootle has a promote local food producers. similar PFI contract to DWP, covering accommodation (b) Non-departmental public bodies that share and all services. HSE has no direct management accommodation with the DWP on Prime contract sites responsibility for the caterers and the contract does not are included in the response at (a) above. Of the specify how supplies should be sourced. The supplier, remaining non-departmental public bodies which have Baxter Storey, sources their catering supplies from Brake catering facilities and are not covered by the Prime Bros whenever possible; however they cannot assess contract, the Independent Living Fund (2006), Remploy what proportion of supplies is sourced at home or and The Pensions Advisory Service have confirmed that abroad. 221W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 222W

Huw Irranca-Davies: To ask the Secretary of State no central purchasing by the company of food or food for Work and Pensions what steps (a) his Department materials. All non-departmental public bodies are aware and (b) public bodies for which he is responsible are of the Government Buying Standards. taking to ensure that they meet the Government’s buying standards for food and catering. [83783] Departmental Pay

Chris Grayling: The information is as follows: Stephen Hammond: To ask the Secretary of State for (a) Since 1998, the Department for Work and Pensions Work and Pensions how many officials in his (DWP) occupies the majority of its accommodation Department and the bodies for which he is responsible under a private finance initiative (PFI) known as the earned more than (a) £65,000, (b) £95,000, (c) PRIME contract. Under the terms of this PFI, the £140,000 and (d) £175,000 in the last year for which Department leases back fully serviced accommodation figures are available. [78053] from its private sector partner Telereal Trillium. This covers a variety of facilities including, where appropriate, Chris Grayling: At the end of the last financial year, the provision of catering services which is delivered there were in the region of 122,000 civil servants in through Telereal Trillium’s service partner Compass DWP and its bodies. Of these, 761 earned more than Group UK. Compass undertakes all catering activity £65,000, 87 of whom earned more than £95,000, nine of including food procurement. whom earned more than £140,000, six of whom earned In line with the Department for Environment, Food more than £175,000. Since the end of the financial year, and Rural Affairs guidance, DWP reports on how the we have made reductions in the size of the senior civil Government Buying Standards criteria are being met. service and reduced the number in each of the two This will feature in periodic updates on the DWP public highest categories by one. website—the following link gives the latest details: Information about senior salaries can be found on www.dwp.gov.uk/docs/gbs-food-catering.pdf the data.gov.uk website at: http://data.gov.uk/organogram This link advises on DWP’s commitment and that we are working closely with Telereal Trillium/Compass to maximise compliance with this commitment. For example, Disadvantaged ensuring this subject features in regular meetings/discussions with Telereal Trillium/Compass and receiving updates/ Michael Dugher: To ask the Secretary of State for progress on compliance. In addition, Compass regularly Work and Pensions what steps his Department plans to meets with Telereal Trillium encouraging initiatives to take together with (a) the Minister for Women and promote local food producers. Regular promotions are Equalities, (b) the Department for Education, (c) the delivered throughout sites such as vegetarian week, Department for Communities and Local Government British sandwich week, Apple day, all of which support and (d) the Department of Health to tackle social local producers. exclusion. [85340] Compass/Telereal Trillium actively encourage the sourcing of local produce. Compass maintain over Chris Grayling: The Secretary of State for Work and 600 producers throughout the UK, actively encouraging Pensions, my right hon. Friend the Member for Chingford the sale of local breads, eggs, vegetables and meats and Woodford Green (Mr Duncan Smith), chairs the where possible. 38% of produce sourced for the DWP Social Justice Cabinet Committee, of which the Secretary contract is produced by SME’s. Recent promotional of State for the Home Department and Minister for activities have included: Women and Equalities, my right hon. Friend the Member for Maidenhead (Mrs May), the Secretary of State for Introduction of the Chunky Farmer Sandwich Bloomer August Education, my right hon. Friend the Member for Surrey 2011 Heath (Michael Gove), the Secretary of State for Best of British Food Month June 2011 Communities and Local Government, my right hon. Promotions on locally produced yoghurts—ongoing Friend the Member for Brentwood and Ongar (Mr Pickles) Eat Well Live Well fruit and vegetable promotion July 2011 and the Under-Secretary of State (Public Health), my hon. Friend the Member for Guildford (Anne Milton), Best Bramley Food Service Product award won by Compass in June 2011 for the Apple Crumble Slice which is sold across the are all members. DWP estate The Committee exists to consider issues relating to Support of British Fruit Orchards—ongoing poverty, equality and Social Justice, and facilitates cross- British sandwich week—May 2011 focused on locally produced Government working and scrutiny of policies for their breads. effects on some of the most disadvantaged groups on society. (b) Non-departmental public bodies that share accommodation with DWP on PRIME contract sites are included in the response at (a) above. For those Employment and Support Allowance NDPBs not covered by the PRIME contract, none directly source food, e.g. the Pension Advisory Service Mr Woodward: To ask the Secretary of State for and the independent living fund (ILF) only occasionally Work and Pensions how many people received buy food and snacks on an ad hoc basis in small overpayments of employment and support allowance quantities from local food retailers and as such unable in (a) St Helens South and Whiston constituency, (b) to verify the source of food producers. Remploy no Merseyside and (c) England in each year since 2008; longer has a catering business. Their canteens are and what average amount each was asked to repay in operated by local third party organisations and there is each such year. [84660] 223W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 224W

Chris Grayling: The information requested is not It is free to call DWP 0800 numbers from BT landlines. available as the Department does not record cases in the DWP has secured agreements to ensure that it is free to format that would enable us to report against their call via nine of the UK’s largest mobile phone operators, location. We can provide volumes for the whole country representing 95% of the mobile market. with an average. The information is in the following For other services, including calling local Jobcentres, table: 0845 numbers are used. This is because they are for inquiries that typically take less time to resolve. DWP Volume (k) Average value (£) strive to achieve the right balance between meeting 2008-091 3,329 57.19 customer needs and using taxpayers’ money effectively. 2009-10 120,521 139.18 These calls are charged at variable rates determined by 2010-11 233,481 202.71 landline and mobile phone providers. DWP has retained 1 ESA commenced 27 October 2008. geographical telephone numbers for personal advisers Source: in Jobcentres, which means that claimants can contact Debt Accounting. This does not form official statistics but is derived their adviser directly when necessary. The Department from management information. appreciates the financial hardship that this can cause Employment Schemes: Compensation some people and so, if a customer raises a concern over the cost of the call or asks, we will offer to call them Mark Garnier: To ask the Secretary of State for back. Work and Pensions how his Department calculates the The Department is currently reviewing its telephony amount of compensation due to employment agencies numbering policy in conjunction with Ofcom. This that have recorded losses due to the switch from the includes the use of 0845 telephone numbers. Flexible New Deal to the Work programme. [85213] Pensions Chris Grayling: Negotiations to agree settlements in closing Flexible New Deal Phase 1 contracts are currently Annette Brooke: To ask the Secretary of State for in train and are commercial in confidence. It would Work and Pensions what the percentage increase will therefore be prejudicial to DWP’s remaining active be in additional pension as a result of SERPS negotiations to release this information at this time. contributions from April 2012. [85101] Employment Schemes: Third Sector Steve Webb: As announced in the Uprating Statement today, SERPS pensions will rise in April 2012 by 5.2%. Mark Garnier: To ask the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions what assessment his Department Social Justice Committee has made of the effect of the Work programme on the likelihood of third sector employment agencies being Michael Dugher: To ask the Secretary of State for able to take part in future contacts. [85214] Work and Pensions how many meetings of the Social Justice Committee he has attended since its Chris Grayling: DWP’s delivery partners are expected establishment. [85291] to be able to demonstrate the capital strength to take on the risks inherent in an exclusively or heavily outcome-based Chris Grayling: The Secretary of State for Work and approach. Smaller voluntary and community organisations Pensions, my right hon. Friend the Member for Chingford were unable to demonstrate the capacity, especially the and Woodford Green (Mr Duncan Smith), is the Chair financial capacity, for selection onto the Employment of the Social Justice Cabinet Committee. It is however Related Support Services (ERSS) Framework, from longstanding Government practice not to disclose which future contracts will be delivered. However, many information relating to ministerial meetings, including voluntary and community sector organisations are involved the proceedings of Cabinet and Cabinet committees, as as subcontractors or work on a call-off basis delivering to do so would put at risk the public interest in the full personalised and tailored employment services via a and frank discussion of policy by Ministers. prime contractor. Social Security Benefits Jobcentre Plus: Telephone Services Stephen Timms: To ask the Secretary of State for Bob Russell: To ask the Secretary of State for Work Work and Pensions how many incapacity benefit and Pensions if he will make it his policy to discontinue claimants who have participated in work capability premium rate telephone numbers for people calling assessments since February 2011 resulting in a jobcentres. [85239] recommendation by Atos of receipt of employment and support allowance in the support group his Chris Grayling: The Department for Work and Pensions Department has subsequently decided should (a) (DWP) does not use any premium rate telephone numbers. receive employment and support allowance in the The Department’s policy is that all calls should be support group, (b) receive employment and support free to our 0800 numbers to claim: allowance in the work-related activity group and (c) not receive employment and support allowance. [85092] state pension; pension credit; Chris Grayling: The information requested is not jobseeker’s allowance; available. Information on the number of work capability employment support allowance; and assessments (WCAs) completed for incapacity benefits emergency payments or crisis loans. claimants can be provided using the Department’s 225W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 226W management information system, but to know the outcomes data. Key milestones, and other project-related information of the WCAs and the variation from the Atos typically included in an IAAP will form part of those recommendation requires individual level data. policy considerations. DWP is party to those considerations Due to the overall length of the incapacity benefits and will align its reporting of all projects with the reassessment process, information on the entire process transparency policy once it is agreed. including the final outcomes and subsequent destinations of claimants being reassessed is not yet available. Individual Stephen Timms: To ask the Secretary of State for level data are being collected, but it will take time to Work and Pensions how much of the funding allocated complete because of the overall length of the reassessment to universal credit implementation will be spent on process. The Department plans to publish data on the staff training. [85094] outcomes of the reassessment process, but only once they have been quality assured and are considered robust. Chris Grayling: The 2010 spending review settlement included funding of £2 billion for the period 2011-12 to Social Security Benefits: Gurkhas 2014-15. This is intended to meet all the costs of introducing universal credit including any increases in benefit Mr Kevan Jones: To ask the Secretary of State for expenditure, additional benefit administration costs in Work and Pensions how many of the retired Gurkhas the transition period, the costs of IT development and and their dependents that have settled in (a) implementation, communications, staff training and Maidenhead, (b) Aldershot, (c) Reading and (d) programme management. Detailed commitments will Folkestone since 2009 have received (i) housing benefit, be developed alongside programme plans. (ii) state pensions and tax credits and (iii) council tax benefit. [85220] Welfare to Work Chris Grayling: The information you have requested Grahame M. Morris: To ask the Secretary of State is not available. The UK’s benefit payment systems do for Work and Pensions what proportion of the upfront not record whether or not individuals in receipt of investment from private and voluntary bodies to his benefits are retired Gurkhas. welfare to work programme came from private sector Unemployment: Ex-servicemen businesses; and if he will provide a breakdown of such investment. [84247] Mr Jim Murphy: To ask the Secretary of State for Work and Pensions (1) how many armed forces Chris Grayling: During the bidding process for the veterans were (a) economically inactive and (b) Work programme, the 18 preferred bidders indicated long-term unemployed in each year since 2005-06; they planned to invest up to £580 million over the [84986] lifetime of the contracts. (2) whether his Department has estimated the A breakdown by sector is not available. number of armed forces veterans who will be (a) economically inactive and (b) long-term unemployed Work Capability Assessment in each year to 2015-16. [84987] (3) what information his Department holds on the Stephen Timms: To ask the Secretary of State for number of unemployed armed forces veterans in each Work and Pensions how many people were exempted English region. [84995] from a work capability assessment on the grounds that they were receiving intravenous chemotherapy or Maria Miller: The Department for Work and Pensions radiotherapy treatment for cancer in the latest period does not routinely record whether benefit claimants are for which figures are available. [85093] former armed forces personnel. Also, the Labour Force Survey does not record whether respondents are former Chris Grayling: The exact information requested is armed forces personnel. not available as the Department’s administrative data We are looking into ways of improving knowledge on do not record the detail of the treatment being received the employment and benefit outcomes of ex-service by the claimant. However, the Department regularly personnel. publishes official statistics on employment and support allowance (ESA) and the work capability assessment Universal Credit (WCA). The latest report was published in October 2011 and can be found on the internet at the following Stephen Timms: To ask the Secretary of State for link: Work and Pensions on what date the integrated http://research.dwp.gov.uk/asd/workingage/ assurance and approvals plan for universal credit was index.php?page=esa_wca presented to the programme board; and if he will place Table 7 of the publication shows the results of initial a copy in the Library. [83573] assessment by condition group for claims started between October 2008 and February 2011. This shows that for Chris Grayling: The integrated assurance and approvals all new claims to ESA with the primary condition in the plan was presented to the Universal Credit Programme ’neoplasms’ group (the World Health Organisation Board on 21 March 2011. The Programme Board signed-off classification of disease group for cancer), 13% were the plan. assessed to be fit for work, 14% were assessed to be in Government are currently considering how to drive the work-related activity group, 52% were assessed to be greater transparency in project reporting through their in the support group and remainder were awaiting or policy on the publication of project and programme closed their claim before completing the assessment. 227W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 228W

Table 5 of the publication shows the number of Date Event claimants assessed to be in the support group at initial assessment by reason for claims started between October 13 June Co-hosted: GAVIpledging conference with Gates Foundation 2008 and February 2011. This shows that there were and Government of Liberia. Central London. 16,400 claimants assessed to be in the support group 20 to 22 July Co-hosted: Annual Tidewater meeting. Wilton Park. because they were assessed as awaiting, receiving or 4 to 5 August Hosted: Gulf donors meeting. Lancaster House. recovering from intravenous, intraperitoneal or intrathecal 11 July Hosted: Secretary of State speech on business in Africa. London Business School. chemotherapy. This is 15% of all those assessed to be in 21 Co-hosted: MDG Countdown event. UN General Assembly. the support group at initial assessment. September 9 November Hosted: Secretary of State Beyond Aid speech. Wellcome Trust. INTERNATIONAL DEVELOPMENT 24 Hosted: 30th Anniversary event for DFID’s Scottish HQ. November Abercrombie House. Departmental Communication Departmental Pay Pete Wishart: To ask the Secretary of State for International Development how many (a) press Mr Thomas: To ask the Secretary of State for officers, (b) internal communications officers, (c) International Development whether any senior staff in external communications officers, (d) communications his Department are paid by means of payments to a strategy officers and (e) other positions with a limited company in lieu of a salary; and if he will communications remit were employed by his publish his policy on such payments. [85075] Department on the most recent date for which figures are available. [84208] Mr O’Brien: No senior members of staff working for Mr Duncan: The most recent figures are 48 (full-time the Department for International Development (DFID) equivalents) communications staff in the Department are paid by means of payments to a limited company in for International Development. This can be broken lieu of salary. DFID does not have a policy on such down as follows: payments. (a) 11 press officers Departmental Procurement (b) Five internal communications officers (c) 0 external communications officers Stewart Hosie: To ask the Secretary of State for (d) 17 strategic communications officers International Development which services his (e) Nine digital (web content) and six communications officers overseas. Department has outsourced in each of the last five years. [84227] Departmental Official Hospitality Mr Duncan: Information in relation to the outsourcing Pete Wishart: To ask the Secretary of State for of goods and equipment is on the external Department International Development what receptions and events for International Development (DFID) website: have been hosted by his Department since May 2010, www.dfid.gov.uk including those sponsored by third parties. [84207] as are the details of the competitively let frameworks Mr Andrew Mitchell: The Department for International and the associated contract details of Crown Agents, Development (DFID) has hosted or co-hosted 15 events Charles Kendall and International Procurement Agency. and receptions since May 2010. Contacting country Most recently these were let in 2009 and run until offices for details of their events and receptions would February 2013. incur disproportionate cost, so this list includes events DFID outsource their travel management requirements and receptions organised by DFID’s UK headquarters with Hogg Robinson Group (HRG). All UK generated only. All events and receptions are carried out at minimal travel requirements such as air, rail and hotels are cost to the Department by collaborating with partners booked by HRG. Value for money is achieved through and making use of free venues where possible. HRG providing “best fare on the day”. DFID are also rolling out this contract to overseas offices and migration Date Event is expected to be by June 2013. DFID will then transfer 2010 onto the new central Government contract which is currently being procured for all central Government 21 to 22 June Hosted: Politics of Poverty event. Sunningdale. Departments. The contract which is a call-down from 8 July Hosted: Launch of Development Assistance Committee peer review of DFID. Palace St. the Buying Solutions framework commenced in July 22 Co-hosted: High level event on Malaria. UN MDGs summit. 2009 and expires in June 2013. September New York. DFID outsource their facilities management 6 December Co-hosted: EU conference on international development. requirements to MITIE Technical Facilities Management Ltd for the provision of Total Facilities Management in 2011 the UK. We have also outsourced a small number of 29 March Co-hosted: Afghanistan stakeholder event, with Baroness information technology functions. Northover. British Museum. DFID humanitarian operations and support services 7 June Hosted: DFID alumni annual event. Palace St. are outsourced to Crown Agents under the Conflict 8 June Hosted: Secretary of State one year on speech. Royal College Humanitarian and Security Department (CHASE OT of Pathologists. outsourced contract). The contract duration is five years 12 June Co-hosted: GAVI reception. Central London. (2005-11). 229W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 230W

Developing Countries: Malaria Developing Countries: Malnutrition

Chris Ruane: To ask the Secretary of State for Mark Menzies: To ask the Secretary of State for International Development what assessment he has International Development what steps his Department made of the effect of rapid detection tests on the is taking to reduce levels of child malnutrition in fragile treatment of malaria. [84463] states. [84280]

Mr O’Brien: More accurate diagnosis can improve Mr Duncan: The Department for International outcomes for malaria and other diseases, including Development (DFID) recently published the paper ’Scaling major causes of child deaths, such as pneumonia. Therefore, Up Nutrition: the UK’s position paper on undernutrition’, World Health Organisation malaria treatment guidelines which states that, between 2011 and 2015, its nutrition- now recommend universal diagnostic confirmation of related programmes (in addition to humanitarian assistance) suspected cases of malaria. will reach 20 million children under the age of five, Low cost and accurate rapid diagnostic tests (RDTs) 10 million of whom are in fragile countries. For example, are now available for use at the point of care. However, in five states in northern Nigeria, the UK is developing their influence on subsequent clinical practice has been a six-year programme that will reach 6.2 million children variable in different settings and with different providers, through the expansion of services for the community and adherence to test results is still an issue in countries management of acute under-nutrition, providing essential where RDTs have been scaled up. But there is growing vitamin and minerals supplementation and helping to evidence to show that RDTs can be used for effective promote exclusive breastfeeding. case management when supported by training, supervision and the availability and use of quality assured malaria Tackling acute child under-nutrition remains a strong medicines, and options for treating or referring non-malaria focus of the UK’s humanitarian response. The UK is cases. increasing its support to the United Nations Children’s Fund (UNICEF) to scale up and sustain coverage of its young child feeding, provision of micronutrients and Chris Ruane: To ask the Secretary of State for nutrition security in emergencies and protracted crises. International Development how much funding his In Yemen the UK is delivering humanitarian assistance Department allocated to malaria diagnosis through through a variety of agencies including UNICEF, the rapid detection tests in each of the last five years; and International Committee of the Red Cross and a what funding he has allocated for each of the next five consortium of non-governmental organisations including years. [84464] Oxfam, Save the Children, CARE and Islamic Relief. This is already helping to treat over 80,000 malnourished Mr O’Brien: The Department for International children under the age of five and screen 1.1 million Development does not track inputs, allocations and more. Where possible DFID will use its nutrition expenditure according to the category requested. The programmes to build longer-term capacity to respond UK’s codes are based on the OECD DAC codes which to nutrition crises through multi-year funding. are used for reporting ODA and, as a DAC member, the UK is committed to transparent reporting of development assistance in a way that permits international comparisons. EU Aid: Family Planning Addressing malaria is one of the main priorities of the UK Government. We are committed to helping halve malaria deaths in at least 10 of the worst affected Zac Goldsmith: To ask the Secretary of State for countries by 2015. And we will support action to sustain International Development if he will discuss with his and expand gains into the future. The UK will invest up EU counterparts (a) global interests in stabilising to £500 million each year by 2014-15 to support this population levels and (b) increasing EU aid for family goal where results can be delivered and value for money planning. [84855] demonstrated. Mr Andrew Mitchell: The UK Government are working Chris Ruane: To ask the Secretary of State for closely with others, including the EU, to advance a International Development what assessment he has comprehensive understanding of the role of population made of the effect of malaria diagnosis through rapid dynamics (specifically the demographic dividend associated detection tests on the tracking and mapping of with declining fertility) in helping achieve increased malaria. [84465] economic productivity and rising per capita income in developing economies. A major cause of poverty and a Mr O’Brien: The increased use of diagnostic testing contributor to rapid population growth is the lack of can support more accurate reporting on malaria. Initially, choice for women and girls over their own fertility. We it is likely to lead to a significant decrease in the number know that 215 million women in the developing world, of reported cases in many countries, as rates of misdiagnosis who would like to delay or avoid a pregnancy, do not decrease. Data collection and monitoring systems also have access to modern family planning methods. need to be strengthened. This is why the Government have recently announced The combination of increased use of rapid diagnostic additional support for contraceptive supplies to the tests for malaria and improved data monitoring contributes United Nations Population Fund (UNFPA) to help to more effective and cost-efficient planning and delivery prevent two million unintended pregnancies and avert of malaria services. This, in turn, helps address the nearly 220,000 unsafe abortions. In November 2010, the health needs of people who would otherwise be EU also pledged ¤23 million to UNFPA’s Global misdiagnosed. Programme for Reproductive Health Commodity Security. 231W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 232W

Overseas Aid: Education Andrew Stunell [holding answer 5 December 2011]: The Homes and Communities Agency’s Affordable Homes Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for Programme 2011-15 will deliver 80,000 new homes for International Development how many education Affordable Rent and Affordable Home Ownership with officers his Department employs. [84587] Government funding of just under £1.8 billion. Around 21% of these homes will be for Affordable Home Mr O’Brien: The Department for International Ownership. Development currently employs 34 education advisers. Overall, with our total investment of £4.5 billion we During 2012 this is likely to increase to 42 education expect to provide up to 170,000 new affordable homes advisers as the result of recent and ongoing recruitment. by 2015, compared to 150,000 originally estimated. Education advisers work alongside programme management staff and advisers from other disciplines Business in the delivery of DFID’s education programmes. Andrew Selous: To ask the Secretary of State for Sri Lanka: Internally Displaced People Communities and Local Government if there are any regulations governing local authority subsidy of Mr Mike Hancock: To ask the Secretary of State for commercial businesses; and if he will make a statement. International Development what recent reports he has [85159] received on the situation of internally displaced people in Sri Lanka. [85229] Robert Neill: Authorities need to act within European Commission regulations on state aid. Other domestic Mr O’Brien: DFID receives regular reports through regulations may be relevant such as the ones governing the British High Commission in Colombo on the situation business rates reliefs. of internally displaced peoples in Sri Lanka. About Council Housing 7,500 displaced people remain in camps in Sri Lanka, out of about 300,000 at the end of the conflict in 2009. They are receiving humanitarian assistance through a Mr MacShane: To ask the Secretary of State for number of UN agencies. Communities and Local Government whether he has made an estimate of the proportion of council houses World Bank which have been sold and are available to rent. [84771]

Martin Horwood: To ask the Secretary of State for Andrew Stunell: Almost all council homes that have International Development what assessment he has been sold will have been through the Right to Buy or made of the (a) World Bank’s proposed new lending through transfer to housing associations. The vast majority instrument set out in Operational Policy 9.00: of homes disposed to registered housing associations Programme for Results heading and (b) proposal to will still be available for rent. We keep no record of the remove application of World Bank social and use made of homes sold to individuals, for example environmental safeguard policies from financing under through the Right to Buy, or to other bodies. that instrument; and whether under that proposal there Statistics relating to the disposal of council housing will be effective and appropriate use of the UK’s can be found on the Department’s website: contribution to the funding of the World Bank. [85309] http://www.communities.gov.uk/housing/housingresearch/ housingstatistics/housingstatisticsby/socialhousingsales/ Mr Andrew Mitchell: I consider Program-for-Results livetables/ (P4R), the World Bank’s proposed results-based lending Council Tax Benefits instrument, as an effective way of modernising the way the World Bank lends to developing countries. The results focus of the new lending instrument will encourage Alex Cunningham: To ask the Secretary of State for efficiency, sharpen the emphasis on impact and enable Communities and Local Government when he plans to the bank to partner with others more effectively. This announce whether the work associated with council tax will help to ensure value for money from the UK’s discounts will be transferred to local authorities along funding to the World Bank. with the council tax benefit scheme. [84053] The World Bank continues to update the proposal. We take social and environmental risks seriously and Robert Neill: The Government are proposing a number will consider these issues in detail when we receive the of technical reforms for council tax, which are currently final proposal. subject to a public consultation exercise. We would expect any changes to be in force by April 2013. The separate consultation on localising council tax support, which is to replace council tax benefit, has now COMMUNITIES AND LOCAL GOVERNMENT closed. Local schemes of support for council tax will be in place from April 2013. Affordable Housing Alex Cunningham: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr Jim Cunningham: To ask the Secretary of State Communities and Local Government what for Communities and Local Government what steps he consideration he has given to delaying his planned plans to take to provide (a) low cost housing for sale introduction of local authority-based schemes for and (b) affordable rented housing in the next three council tax benefit support to allow a greater period of years. [84652] time between the coming into force of secondary 233W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 234W legislation and the date on which local authorities must funding for (i) Ipswich, (ii) Halton, (iii) Nuneaton and issue invoices; and whether he has carried out a risk Bedworth, (iv) Slough, (v) Norwich, (vi) Thanet, (vii) assessment in respect of his current planned timetable. Reigate and Banstead, (viii) Torbay, (ix) Windsor and [84055] Maidenhead, (x) Oxford, (xi) Canterbury and (xii) Blackburn and Darwen in each financial year between Robert Neill: My Department has no intention of 2008-09 and 2011-12; [84757] delaying the planned introduction in April 2013. (3) what funding was allocated by his Department Departmental Eggs for (a) the formula grant and (b) specific grant funding for (i) Newcastle-under-Lyme, (ii) Preston, (iii) Middlesbrough, (iv) Poole, (v) Arun and (vi) Elmbridge Huw Irranca-Davies: To ask the Secretary of State in each financial year between 2008-09 and 2011-12; for Communities and Local Government what steps he [84758] is taking to ensure that the same standards of animal welfare for whole eggs apply to imported liquefied eggs (4) what per capita funding was allocated by his procured by (a) his Department and (b) public bodies Department for (a) the formula grant and (b) specific for which he is responsible. [83796] grant funding for (i) Suffolk Coastal, (ii) Teignbridge, (iii) Breckland, (iv) Mid Sussex, (v) South Oxfordshire, Robert Neill: All eggs used by the Department for (vi) South Cambridgeshire, (vii) East Lindsey, (viii) Isle Communities and Local Government and its public of Wight and (ix) Wealdon in each financial year bodies are Lion branded and sourced from enriched between 2008-09 and 2011-12; [84964] cages as a minimum standard. (5) what per capita funding was allocated by his From 1 January 2012, all eggs and egg products will Department for (a) the formula grant and (b) specific be sourced from enhanced conventional cages. grant funding for (i) Ipswich, (ii) Halton, (iii) Nuneaton and Bedworth, (iv) Slough, (v) Norwich, (vi) Departmental Food Thanet, (vii) Reigate and Banstead, (viii) Torbay, (ix) Windsor and Maidenhead, (x) Oxford, (xi) Canterbury Huw Irranca-Davies: To ask the Secretary of State and (xii) Blackburn with Darwen in each financial year for Communities and Local Government what between 2008-09 and 2011-12; [84965] proportion of food sourced by (a) his Department and (6) what per capita funding was allocated by his (b) public bodies for which he is responsible was Department for (a) the formula grant and (b) specific procured from UK food producers in the latest period grant funding for (i) Newcastle-under-Lyme, (ii) for which figures are available. [83797] Preston, (iii) Middlesbrough, (iv) Poole, (v) Arun and (vi) Elmbridge in each financial year between 2008-09 Robert Neill: The Department for Communities and and 2011-12; [84966] Local Government’s caterers procured 56% of food (7) what per capita funding was allocated by his from UK food producers. The Department does not Department for (a) the formula grant and (b) specific hold this information for its public bodies. grant funding for (i) Eastleigh, (ii) Amber Valley, (iii) The Department’s caterers are contracted to comply North Hertfordshire, (iv) Broadland, (v) Stafford, (vi) with Government buying standards for food with regard Epping Forest, (vii) Swale, (viii) Warwick, (ix) East to food purchase and provision and we are working to Hertfordshire, (x) St Albans, (xi) Guildford, (xii) increase the volume of food procured from the UK. Cherwell, (xiii) Lancaster, (xiv) Dacorum, (xv) Maidstone and (xvi) Redcar and Cleveland in each Huw Irranca-Davies: To ask the Secretary of State financial year between 2008-09 and 2011-12; [84967] for Communities and Local Government what steps (8) what per capita funding was allocated by his (a) his Department and (b) public bodies for which he Department (a) for formula grant and (b) specific is responsible are taking to ensure that they meet the grant funding for financial years 2008-09 and 2011-12 Government’s buying standards for food and catering. for (i) Vale of White Horse, (ii) Waverley, (iii) [83798] Horsham, (iv) South Kesteven, (v) East Devon, (vi) Braintree, (vii) King’s Lynn and West Norfolk and Robert Neill: The Department for Communities and (viii) Tendring in each financial year between 2008-09 Local Government’s and its public bodies’ caterers must and 2011-12. [84968] comply with Government buying standards for food and catering. Robert Neill [holding answer 5 December 2011]: These Departmental Grants data can be found online at: http://www.local.communities.gov.uk/finance/ssas.htm Nicholas Soames: To ask the Secretary of State for Comparisons between years may not be valid due to Communities and Local Government (1) what funding varying functions and responsibilities of different tiers was allocated by his Department for (a) the formula of local government. grant and (b) specific grant funding for (i) Suffolk Coastal, (ii) Teignbridge, (iii) Breckland, (iv) Mid Sussex, (v) South Oxfordshire, (vi) South Disabled Facilities Grants Cambridgeshire, (vii) East Lindsey, (viii) Isle of Wight and (ix) Wealden in each financial year between Mark Lancaster: To ask the Secretary of State for 2008-09 and 2011-12; [84756] Communities and Local Government whether he has (2) what funding was allocated by his Department any plans to change the assessment for the Disability for (a) the formula grant and (b) specific grant Facilities Grant. [84997] 235W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 236W

Andrew Stunell: There are currently no plans to make Agreement. The two funding routes ensure that both changes to the way in which Disabled Facilities Grants Registered Providers of Social Housing and smaller are assessed. However, the recently published report by not-for-profit community and voluntary groups are able the Commission on the Funding of Care and Support to apply. recommends reviewing the operation and administration We have announced £50 million of additional funding of the grant. The Government welcome this report and to tackle some of the worst concentrations of empty are reviewing the recommendations with the care sector. homes. Tackling empty homes in these areas will require Following this engagement, we will publish a White an intensive approach—refurbishing and reconfiguring Paper on social care reform in the spring next year, as homes, as well as improving the public realm and tackling well as a progress report on funding reform. By the end wider issues in the local area. Further details will be of the spending review period the national Disabled announced shortly. Facilities Grant budget will increase from £169 million in 2010-11 to £185 million in 2014-15. Empty Property: Worcestershire

Mr Robin Walker: To ask the Secretary of State for Empty Property Communities and Local Government what information his Department holds on the number of Mr Buckland: To ask the Secretary of State for empty homes in (a) Worcester constituency and (b) Communities and Local Government what estimate he Worcestershire. [85036] has made of the number of empty properties in (a) the borough of Swindon and (b) England in each year Robert Neill: Details of the number empty dwellings since 2001. [84451] in the six local authority areas that comprise Worcestershire, as at the beginning of October 2011, are shown in the following table. Data are not available at constituency Robert Neill: Details of the total number of empty level. dwellings in the borough of Swindon and England in each year since 2004 are shown in the following table. Empty dwellings The figures include both long-term and short-term empty dwellings. Data prior to 2004 are not available. Long-term Short-term Total Bromsgrove 329 671 1,000 Swindon England Malvern Hills 456 663 1,119 2004 1,768 710,935 Redditch 268 590 858 2005 2,374 723,509 Worcester 428 833 1,261 2006 1,877 744,931 Wychavon 490 832 1,322 2007 1,723 763,319 Wyre Forest 504 919 1,423 2008 1,714 783,119 Total 2,475 4,508 6,983 2009 1,928 770,661 This information was published on 16 November 2010 1,897 737,491 2011 and is available on the Department for Communities 2011 1,832 720,328 and Local Government website at: http://www.communities.gov.uk/publications/corporate/ The data are taken from the council tax base form statistics/counciltaxbase2011 completed annually in the autumn by all billing authorities The data are taken from the Council Tax Base form in England and returned to the Department for completed annually in the autumn by all billing authorities Communities and Local Government. in England and returned to the Department for This information is available on the Department for Communities and Local Government. Communities and Local Government website at: EU Grants and Loans: Yorkshire and the Humber http://www.communities.gov.uk/documents/housing/xls/ 1815793.xls Julian Smith: To ask the Secretary of State for Hilary Benn: To ask the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government what steps he is Communities and Local Government which bodies are taking to ensure take-up of the European Regional eligible to apply for funding from (a) his Department Development Fund available to Yorkshire and the and (b) the Homes and Communities Agency to Humber. [84537] address the problem of empty homes. [85304] Grant Shapps: The Yorkshire and the Humber European Regional Development Fund Competitiveness programme Grant Shapps: £100 million has been made available is worth around £500 million which aims to be fully within the Affordable Homes Programme to tackle long invested by December 2013 and spent by mid 2015. term empty homes. The Homes and Communities Agency Over £270 million has already been contracted to over issued bidding guidance on 21 November 2011 70 projects supporting innovation, research and www.homesandcommunities.co.uk/ourwork/empty-homes development, enterprise, business support and community which sets out how the funding available will be allocated led regeneration. £100 million more is committed to either through the Homes and Communities Agency projects that have not yet been contracted. (or, from 1 April 2012, for London, the Greater London Local partners in the Yorkshire and the Humber area Authority) or through a national intermediary appointed are working hard to make sure this Development Fund via the Cabinet Office’s Office for Civil Society Framework investment is taken up. Local authorities, Local Enterprise 237W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 238W

Partnerships and Universities are being brought together The consultation has closed and we are carefully by the local DCLG European Regional Development considering all of the submissions that have been made Fund Team to develop firm proposals to take up the and will then publish the revised text. remaining funding and are being encouraged to take I refer my hon. Friend to the answer I gave on advantage of the Fund Technical Assistance funding to 25 October 2011, Official Report, columns 123-24W, help build local capacity to develop and deliver eligible where we have also announced a range of measures projects. which will facilitate the use of previously developed Local Enterprise Partnerships have an important role sites. in making sure that European Regional Development Fund is aligned with local investment priorities, to this Green Belt: Gravesham end we have revised the governance arrangements of the programme to ensure that these partnerships are represented on the Yorkshire and the Humber European Mr Holloway: To ask the Secretary of State for Regional Development Fund Local Management Communities and Local Government whether he Committee—the body responsible for the strategic expects the abolition of regional house building targets management of the programme—and that Local Enterprise to result in a reduction in the number of houses likely Partnerships are directly involved in the selection of to be built on land in Gravesham constituency projects for these funds. currently designated as green belt. [84374] We are also working closely with other government Robert Neill: The abolition of regional strategies and departments to align European Regional Development top down housing targets will mean that decisions on Fund with national investment such as the Department housing and planning will be for local authorities. As of Business Innovation and Skills on UKTI and Business democratically elected representatives, working closely Coaching For Growth programme that will deliver support with local communities, they are best placed to decide to businesses in Yorkshire and the Humber. how much and where housing should be located in their We are also exploring how the Growing Places Fund areas. The Localism Act prevents any further regional can be used to get local Development Fund projects strategies being created. The existing regional strategies moving. outside London will be abolished as soon as possible I also refer the hon. Member to my Department’s subject to the outcome of the current environmental press notice of 1 August 2011, a copy of which is assessment process. The proposed abolition will also available in the Library of the House, which outlines remove top-down pressures to remove the green belt in how the European Regional Development Fund has 30 areas across England. previously been plagued by a legacy of poor administration, The draft National Planning Policy Framework reiterates and how this Government have overhauled the management long-established policy to protect the green belt. It of these schemes. As a result of these measures, the states that when considering planning applications local European Commission lifted an interruption on the planning authorities should ensure that substantial weight programme which it had ordered. These steps will also is given to any harm to the green belt. protect taxpayers from the prospect of “financial corrections” being levied due to poor administration, as Housing happened under the 2000-06 programme. Zac Goldsmith: To ask the Secretary of State for Green Belt Communities and Local Government what assessment he has made of the planning implications of potential housing need arising from the upper and lower limits of Mr Holloway: To ask the Secretary of State for the Office for National Statistics’ projected population Communities and Local Government what measures range for 2050. [84821] his Department has put in place to require local authorities to identify brownfield sites for development Andrew Stunell: I refer my hon. Friend to the answer in preference to Green Belt development. [84373] given on 21 November 2011, Official Report, columns 59-60W. Robert Neill: In July 2011, we published a draft new National Planning Policy Framework for consultation. Housing: Capital Investment The draft Framework maintains strong protections for the Green Belt, and states that Green Belt boundaries Mr Raynsford: To ask the Secretary of State for should only be altered in exceptional circumstances. Communities and Local Government what estimate he Our proposed abolition of the unpopular Regional has made of the total capital provision for housing Strategies through the Localism Act will also stop the made by (a) local authorities and (b) the Homes and top-down pressure to remove the Green Belt in 30 areas Communities Agency since 2007-08. [R] [84573] across England. The draft Framework asks local authorities to prioritise Andrew Stunell: The following table sets out the total land of least environmental or amenity value for capital provision made available to local authorities for development. The term “of least environmental or amenity spending on housing for the years since 2007-08. Allocations value” rather than “brownfield“ was used because in have been made in consultation with the Homes and some cases, previously developed land can be rich in Communities Agency, and other agencies of the wildlife and much valued by local communities. Department for Communities and Local Government. 239W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 240W

£ million 2007-08 2008-09 2009-10 2010-111

Arms length management organisations3 926 896 930 622 Decent homes supported borrowing4 312 272 266 259 Decent homes capital grant4 437 347 426 308 Gap funding3 79 123 149 131 Major repairs allowance2 1248 1240 1250 1273 Local authority new build scheme3 0 0 198 126 National affordable homes programme 2029 2612 3641 2594 1 Most recent whole year for which figures are available. Figures are unaudited. 2 Allocations made as a component of housing revenue account subsidy administered by the Department for Communities and Local Government 3 Allocations made by former Regional Offices, the Regional Housing Boards, and the Greater London Authority, in agreement with the Department for Communities and Local Government. 4 Allocations made by the Homes and Communities Agency in agreement with the Department for Communities and Local Government

I would note that the last Administration left an Andrew Stunell: Energy efficiency ratings are only unsustainable budget deficit, with the state forecast to available from Energy Performance Certificates that borrow £146 billion a year in 2010-11, or £400 million have been lodged on the Certificates Register covering being borrowed every single day. Left unchecked, that England, Wales and Northern Ireland for dwellings that public deficit would have forced up interest rates, meaning have been sold, rented out or constructed since August more expensive mortgages, more repossessions and even 2007. Based on information from the total number of fewer first-time buyers. certificates that had been lodged on these registers up to This Government are tackling that deficit, whilst and including 29 November 2011, there were 2,501,556 putting a series of measures in place to build more dwellings with a certificate rating of C or above. Separate affordable homes, to get empty homes back into use, to arrangements apply to energy efficiency ratings for buildings support the construction and house building industries, in Scotland. and to give a helping hand to first time buyers. Housing: Standards Housing: Carbon Emissions Barry Gardiner: To ask the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government how many Barry Gardiner: To ask the Secretary of State for domestic properties have a standard assessment Communities and Local Government what procedure rating of 69 or above. [84394] representations he has received on the effect on the cost of house construction of the (a) implementation of Andrew Stunell: Energy efficiency ratings are only changes to building regulations in 2013, (b) abolition available from energy performance certificates that have of the fuel factor and (c) implementation of the zero been lodged on the registers of energy performance carbon commitment for all new homes from 2016. certificates covering England, Wales and Northern Ireland [84039] for dwellings that have been sold, rented out or constructed since August 2007. Based on information from the total Andrew Stunell: Industry working groups including, number of certificates that had been lodged on these among others, representatives of the housebuilding and registers up to and including 29 November 2011, there construction products sector were convened in spring were 2,501,556 dwellings with a certificate rating of 2011 to help inform development of proposals and C or above—a standard assessment procedure rating costings for changes to building regulations in 2013. In of 69 or above is the equivalent to a certificate rating of addition, my Department has received specific C or above. Separate arrangements apply to energy representations from Calor Gas Limited on the cost efficiency ratings for buildings in Scotland. implications of potential adjustments of the fuel factor. Estimates of costs will be included in the impact assessments Mr Jim Cunningham: To ask the Secretary of State which will be published with the consultation proposals for Communities and Local Government what steps his shortly and we will invite views and further evidence as Department is taking to co-ordinate policy on poor part of the consultation. housing conditions and fuel poverty. [84648] My Department has received representations from house builders and others about the costs of zero carbon Andrew Stunell [holding answer 5 December 2011]: homes and has published impact assessments setting The Green Deal is an ambitious programme to deliver out the costs, most recently in May 2011. That assessment energy efficiency upgrades at no upfront cost, with has drawn on work undertaken by the independent repayments made over time from energy savings. This Zero Carbon Hub, the body established by industry to includes a new Energy Company Obligation, worth programme manage the delivery of zero carbon homes. £1.3 billion per year, providing extra support where it is most needed. Under the Obligation ’Affordable Warmth obligation’, we expect energy suppliers to invest around Housing: Energy £350 million per year in providing heating and insulation measures for vulnerable households on low incomes at Barry Gardiner: To ask the Secretary of State for greatest risk of fuel poverty. The Government anticipate Communities and Local Government how many that the rest of Energy Company Obligation will support domestic properties have an energy efficiency rating of energy efficiency improvements in more difficult and Corabove. [84396] expensive to treat properties through a ’Carbon Reduction 241W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 242W obligation’. Department of Energy and Climate Change staff structures including salary bands. In addition, we are consulting specifically on expected models for “roll-out”, have asked for all expenditure of £500 and over to be to ensure all households stand to benefit, including published on regular and timely basis. This should help those in the poorest communities. reveal the inner workings of local councils and shed Where a property is dangerously cold, local authorities light on monies being spent, including on trade union already have powers, under the Housing Act 2004, to expenditure. Subject to consultation, we are minded to require owners to make improvements. If a property is make compliance with the code a legal requirement. found to contain serious (category 1) hazards, the local The Cabinet Office is currently consulting on a policy authority has a duty to take the most appropriate paper about how facility time can be reformed and action. This could range from trying to deal with the reduced in the civil service. When published, my Department problems informally at first to prohibiting the use of the will provide guidance for local councils to help inform whole or part of the dwelling and ultimately to prosecution. their own reviews. The Government are also investing £2.1 billion to Ministers are open to representations on ways to improve the quality of housing through the decent increase transparency and accountability in this area. homes programme and large-scale voluntary transfer gap funding. This will be used to help bring over Rented Housing: Energy 200,000 homes up to at least the decent homes standard. Barry Gardiner: To ask the Secretary of State for Local Government: Pensions Communities and Local Government what assessment he has made of the effect of increases in energy prices Debbie Abrahams: To ask the Secretary of State for on provision of communal heating to Housing Communities and Local Government what economic Revenue Account tenanted properties; and if he will impact assessment has been carried out on the effect of make a statement. [84024] proposed changes to the Local Government Pension scheme on residents of Oldham East and Saddleworth Andrew Stunell: I refer the hon. Member to the constituency; and if he will make a statement. [85201] answer I gave him on 29 November 2011, Official Report, column 907W. Robert Neill: I refer the hon. Member to the answers given to the hon. Members for Gedling (Vernon Coaker) Barry Gardiner: To ask the Secretary of State for and Stoke-on-Trent Central (Tristram Hunt), on Communities and Local Government how many 7 November 2011, Official Report, column 23W. Housing Revenue Account tenanted properties have an Local Government: Trade Union Officials energy efficiency rating of C or above. [84395] Andrew Stunell: Information contained in the Register Priti Patel: To ask the Secretary of State for of Energy Performance Certificates does not differentiate Communities and Local Government if he will issue a between properties that are housing revenue account standard facility time agreement to local authorities tenanted and those that are not. However, certificates which sets out (a) duties which can be undertaken, (b) that have been lodged on the Energy Performance Certificate procedures for approval of such facilities time and (c) Registers for dwellings that have been sold, rented out provision for the publication of (i) each instance of or constructed in England, Wales and Northern Ireland, such facilities time and (ii) the cost of such time. since 21 September 2008 have been categorised by [84622] transaction type. Between then and 29 November 2011, there have been 564,956 certificates for dwellings rated C Robert Neill: At a time when all councils need to or above categorised as “Rented (social)”. Separate make sensible savings to protect front line services, I arrangements apply to energy efficiency ratings for buildings would urge councillors to review facility time being in Scotland. granted and the merits of using publicly-funded full-time union officials. Rented Housing: Standards The Cabinet Office is currently consulting on a policy paper about how facility time can be reformed and Barry Gardiner: To ask the Secretary of State for reduced in the civil service. When published, my Department Communities and Local Government how many will provide specific guidance for local councils to help Housing Revenue Account tenanted properties have a inform their own reviews. standard assessment procedure rating of 69 or above. [84391] Priti Patel: To ask the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government if he will require Andrew Stunell: Information contained in the register local authorities to include the (a) cost of facility time of energy performance certificates does not differentiate and (b) monetary value of resources provided to between properties that are housing revenue account trades unions in the list published of items of tenanted and those that are not. However, energy expenditure over £500. [84624] performance certificates that have been lodged on the registers for dwellings that have been sold, rented out or Robert Neill: The Code of Recommended Practice constructed in England, Wales and Northern Ireland, for Local Authorities on Data Transparency was published since 21 September 2008 have been categorised by in September 2011, will give the public greater insight transaction type. Between then and 29 November 2011, on how local councils, as employers, organise and structure there have been 564,956 certificates for dwellings their work forces. As a minimum, the code requires rated C or above categorised as “Rented (social)”. On authorities to publish organisational charts of their the Scottish register of energy performance certificates, 243W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 244W of the 130,741 certificates lodged under transaction Grant Shapps [holding answer 7 November 2011]: type “Rented (social)” there were 67,488 dwellings Given the discussion of these issues at October’s oral certificates rated C or above. questions, 31 October 2011, Official Report, column A standard assessment procedure rating of 69 or 601, I have investigated this matter and would like to above is the equivalent to an energy performance certificate use this opportunity to provide a comprehensive reply rating of C or above. to both the right hon. Member and to the right hon. Member for Greenwich and Woolwich (Mr Raynsford). Right to Buy Scheme: Worcester Numbers of lets and sales The following table provides estimates of the number Mr Robin Walker: To ask the Secretary of State for of social properties that were let or sold by private Communities and Local Government how many registered providers, the majority of which are housing homes in Worcester constituency have been sold under associations, to people resident outside the United Kingdom the right-to-buy scheme in each of the last 20 years. immediately prior to taking up this letting or purchase. [85038] I have included some historic information to provide context. Andrew Stunell: Data are not available by constituency but are collected for local authority districts. The number Social housing lettings-to households from outside of sales of local authority stock under the Right to Buy the UK scheme are given in Live Table 648 on the Department’s Outside UK as website at: Outside UK percentage of total http://www.communities.gov.uk/housing/housingresearch/ housingstatistics/housingstatisticsby/socialhousingsales/ 2002-03 583 0.26 livetables/ 2003-04 586 0.26 There have been no sales by Worcester city council 2004-05 412 0.19 since they transferred their stock to Worcester Community 2005-06 427 0.19 Housing in March 2004. From 2004-05 there have been 2006-07 290 0.13 around 200 Preserved Right to Buy sales by housing 2007-08 329 0.15 associations in the Worcester city council area, the vast 2008-09 348 0.15 majority by Worcester Community Housing. 2009-10 463 0.20 2010-11 569 0.22 Rural Areas: Finance Sales to households from outside the UK Nicholas Soames: To ask the Secretary of State for Communities and Local Government what grants are Outside UK available exclusively to local authorities classified as (a) rural-80, (c) rural-50, (c) significant rural, (d) 2005-06 4 other urban, (e) major urban and (f) large urban. 2006-07 0 [84696] 2007-08 4 2008-09 8 Robert Neill [holding answer 5 December 2011]: There 2009-10 6 are no specific grants issued by my Department exclusively 2010-11 5 available to authorities based on their rural classification. These estimates are from the continuous recording Social Justice Committee (CORE) logs reported by private registered providers to the Tenant Services Authority. Michael Dugher: To ask the Secretary of State for Many of the recorded lettings were to UK nationals. Communities and Local Government how many Whilst only a small number of sales to those outside the meetings of the Social Justice Committee he has UK were recorded in 2010-11, all of these were to UK attended since its establishment. [85288] nationals and some were to returning armed forces personnel. Robert Neill: Information relating to the proceedings Foreign nationals are only eligible to be allocated of Cabinet Committees, including when and how often social housing by a local authority (including nominations they meet and which Ministers have attended, is generally to private registered provider accommodation) if they not disclosed as to do so could harm the frankness and are covered by the housing eligibility regulations. candour of internal discussion. Housing eligibility Social Rented Housing Housing eligibility is as follows: European economic area nationals Hilary Benn: To ask the Secretary of State for Since 2006, European economic area nationals are, Communities and Local Government (1) what his broadly speaking, eligible for local authority housing if policy is on housing associations (a) letting and (b) they are working lawfully, are self-sufficient or have a selling their properties to people living outside the UK permanent right of residence (following five years lawful in the last year for which figures are available; [79278] residence). In some circumstances, European economic (2) what estimate he has made of the number of area nationals may continue to be eligible when unemployed, housing association properties that have been (a) let following a qualifying period of work (e.g. if made and (b) sold to people living outside of the UK in the involuntarily redundant or unable to work because of last year for which figures are available. [79279] accident or illness). 245W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 246W

Nationals of Bulgaria and Romania must be authorised Under our social housing reforms, councils will now to work by the Home Office (until they have worked in be able to set their own rules about who qualifies to go UK continuously for 12 months). They are eligible for on the housing waiting list. At the moment anyone can social housing if working as authorised. apply to live in social housing, whether they need to or European economic area nationals who do not have not. The ‘reasonable preference’ categories for those an EU right to reside because they are not economically with the greatest housing needs will be kept, to ensure active and not self-sufficient are not eligible for social priority for social housing continues to go to the most housing. Additionally, those whose only EU right to vulnerable in society and those who need it most. reside is as a work seeker or the initial three month right We will also be increasing support for our armed to reside derived from the EU Directive on Freedom of forces. Moving from base-to-base, and residing abroad, Movement of Persons are not eligible. can often leave our troops without strong local Non-European economic area nationals connections—something many councils reasonably look for when allocating social homes. I have pledged to give Non-European economic area nationals (“third country councils a duty to put our armed forces who want a nationals”) are only eligible for local authority housing home in their area at or near the top of the local waiting if they are a person granted: list where they are in urgent need. In addition to this (i) a form of protection leave, ie refugee status or humanitarian move to give additional preference (i.e. high priority) to protection or discretionary leave, because it would not be safe for the armed forces, we will also be consulting on regulations them to return to their country (likely to be former asylum which will make sure that service personnel who have to seekers); or move from base-to-base do not lose their qualification (ii) Indefinite leave to remain (ie settled status, usually granted rights to social housing. after working legally in the UK for a number of years). Generally third country nationals are not eligible for Hilary Benn: To ask the Secretary of State for housing because most are given leave to enter the UK Communities and Local Government (1) what his for a limited period on condition that they do not have policy is on (a) local authorities and (b) housing recourse to public funds. Asylum seekers are not eligible associations buying properties on the open market; for social housing; if they are destitute they can seek [79643] asylum support from the Home Office. (2) how many properties (a) local authorities and Where foreign nationals are eligible, they will have (b) housing associations have acquired on the open their housing needs considered on the same basis as market in each of the last 10 years. [79644] other applicants in accordance with the local authority’s allocation scheme. Some lettings are made directly by private registered providers and these would not be Grant Shapps: Local authorities and housing associations covered by the eligibility regulations. are able to buy properties on the open market. This can help to increase the supply of affordable housing to Sales and lets of open market housing meet local needs. However, the vast majority of new The tables above do not include sales of open market affordable housing supply is new build. properties that were specifically developed by the providers Information on units purchased by private registered for this purpose and have never been social housing. providers (most of which are housing associations) is Housing associations are private, independent bodies, shown in the table. and some develop properties through non-charitable subsidiaries for market sale or rent, without any public Total units purchased1 subsidy. The proceeds from these sales are then used to (thousand) cross-subsidise the development and maintenance of affordable properties. As with any commercial transaction, 2001-02 13.6 the market housing may be purchased by domestic or 2002-03 11.5 overseas buyers. I suspect that most foreign purchases 2003-04 9.4 from abroad are typically in order to rent the property, 2004-05 9.1 thereby increasing the amount of stock in the private 2005-06 4.7 rented sector available to UK residents. 2005-06 rebased2 4.4 Further to the discussion at 31 October 2011, Official 2006-07 4.0 Report, column 601, the Notting Hill Housing Trust has 2007-08 5.9 subsequently written to the right hon. Member for 2008-09 6.9 Greenwich and Woolwich (Mr Raynsford), and sent a 2009-10 5.9 copy to me. The trust has a small portfolio of market 1 Units include both self contained homes or hostel/shared housing rent and private sale properties, using the profits from units and bed spaces. these developments to support more affordable housing. 2 Figures for 2005-06 were rebased to reflect the threshold change in 2007. It does not presently market these properties abroad, Notes: but it does not discriminate against any buyer on the 1. Only private registered providers that complete the ″long return″ basis of their nationality, and nor does it believe it were required to complete this information. should do so. Before 2006, long returns were completed by private registered providers who own and/or manage 250 units Government policy From 2006-07 long returns were completed by private registered As happened under the previous Administration, I providers who own and/or manage 1,000 or more units. 2. Not all of the units purchased will necessarily be used as affordable believe that there is a public benefit from housing housing. associations undertaking some commercial activities in Source: order to support the provision of more affordable housing. Tenants Services Authority—Regulatory Statistical Return 247W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 248W

The Tenants Services Authority’s Regulatory Statistical The Localism Act also introduces a Community Right to Return dataset for 2010-11 shows that 16,700 units were Challenge. Voluntary groups that have a track record of working purchased by private registered providers. However, with their community and delivering results will have the chance 10,259 units appear to have been incorrectly recorded to show what they can do to run and improve local services. The new right will put them on the front foot when it comes to taking by an individual registered provider as purchased rather over a local service and has the potential to open up new funding than acquired through voluntary transfer from local streams. authorities or housing action trusts. This was identified We have cut Whitehall and local red tape to make it easier to after submission and confirmation of the individual organise street parties and similar community events. This was registered provider’s data and the finalisation of the particularly aimed at supporting local events for the Royal Wedding; Regulatory Statistical Return dataset, and cannot now we hope to continue with this initiative to support the forthcoming be amended. Diamond Jubilee. Information has not been collected on local authority My Department’s Voluntary and Community Sector Partnership acquisitions. Board is also acting as a forum where the voluntary sector can contribute to the Department’s work. Voluntary Organisations These reforms are in addition to a whole series of other supportive measures to the local voluntary sector David Morris: To ask the Secretary of State for being undertaken by other Government Departments, Communities and Local Government what steps his which include: Department is taking to help maintain the local £100 million Transition Fund offering financing for the most voluntary sector. [78757] vulnerable charities. Andrew Stunell: My Department is undertaking a £30 million Transforming Local Infrastructure fund to help number of steps to support the local voluntary, community modernise organisations that supply critical support to frontline and social enterprise sector, including: charities, voluntary groups and social enterprises. In September 2011, we issued new Best Value guidance: a ’fair £10 million Investment and Contract Readiness Fund being deal’ which cuts back unnecessary red tape on local authorities, made available to charities and social enterprises to help them while introducing new requirements for councils to consult with develop the skills and infrastructure to win more capital investment local voluntary organisations on changes to funding and service. and public service. It will also give the voluntary sector the opportunity to offer £600 million capital funding through Big Society Capital, options for reshaping and improving local authority services. which will offer financing to charities and the voluntary sector. We are investing £6.5 billion for Supporting People over the Simplifying Gift Aid, and encouraging legacy-giving by reducing spending review period, to provide frontline housing support to the rate of inheritance tax for those estates leaving 10% or more disadvantaged and vulnerable people; the majority of these services to charity. are provided by the voluntary sector. We are providing £20 million of funding for the voluntary Waste Disposal: Metals sector to help implement “No Second Night Out” rough sleeping strategy. As part of this, Homeless Link will work with other Hilary Benn: To ask the Secretary of State for voluntary sector partners to identify and disseminate good practice Communities and Local Government what his policy is in helping people off the streets. We are providing £10 million to on local authority powers to prevent the disposal of Crisis in order to support single homeless people, including priority client groups such as recovering drug-users and ex-offenders, stolen goods, including scrap metal and jewellery; and to access stable accommodation in the private rented sector. if he will make a statement. [84778] On 14 November 2011, we launched the Near Neighbours programme. This is a £5 million scheme to bring together people Robert Neill [holding answer 5 December 2011]: Local from diverse communities and different faiths to get to know each authorities are expected to work with police forces and other better and help them improve their local neighbourhoods. other law enforcement organisations where possible to Faith groups play a vital role in our neighbourhoods. Near tackle the disposal of stolen goods, utilising their existing Neighbours is an investment in the future, supporting grass roots powers, including trading standards, as appropriate. In groups and projects to allow communities to get on transforming relation to scrap metal, local authorities have a duty their neighbourhoods for the better. under the Scrap Metal Dealers Act 1964 to register The Community Right to Buy, being introduced through the scrap metal dealers in their area and certain powers of Localism Act, will offer new rights for voluntary groups to protect community resources like leisure centres, village halls and entry which may assist in identifying illegal behaviour. libraries. Groups will have the time they need to develop business The Government are currently reviewing what further plans and raise funds. This crucial breathing space will ensure steps can be taken to help tackle metal theft. that they are not squeezed out of open market sales of valuable local assets. We have extended funding for the Asset Transfer Unit by £1 million into 2011-12 enabling the unit to continue to offer practical support to communities who want to take on public LEADER OF THE HOUSE assets such as youth centres, museums and former town halls for the benefit of local people. Departmental Written Questions From September 2011, the new “Code of Recommended Practice for Local Authorities on Data Transparency” requires councils to Chris Ruane: To ask the Leader of the House what shine the light on local spending, including details of grants to the proportion of written questions for answer on a named voluntary sector, as well as all contracts and tenders over £500. day received a substantive answer within five working This open data initiative will allow greater public scrutiny of local days in each of the last six months. [85067] authority support, and make it easier for the voluntary sector to bid to run contracts and services. Sir George Young: I have answered all 13 named day As part of our Housing Strategy announced on 21 November questions on the named day during the last six months. 2011, we outlined how we will be providing funding for voluntary groups to bid for funds to renovate and improve empty homes The Government have committed to providing the and other types of empty property and get them back into Procedure Committee with information relating to written productive use. parliamentary question performance on a sessional basis 249W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 250W and will provide full information to the committee at Bristol university to conduct research on the rate of and the end of the Session. Statistics relating to Government reasons for breakdowns in adoption. Findings from the Department’s performance for the 2009-10 parliamentary research will inform decisions on whether we ask for Session were previously provided to the committee and additional data from local authorities. are available on the Parliament website. Children: Day Care

Jessica Morden: To ask the Secretary of State for EDUCATION Education what estimate he has made of the average Children in Care cost of childcare in (a) England and (b) each region of England in each of the last five years. [84708] John Hemming: To ask the Secretary of State for Education if he will enhance the specification of the Sarah Teather [holding answer 5 December 2011]: SSDA903 return to identify when a child who has been The Department’s annual Childcare and Early Years adopted from care returns to care in a different local Providers Survey collects information on the mean average authority area. [82416] hourly fees charged by some registered child care providers in England, nationally and by region. The 2009 survey Tim Loughton: The Department does not collect data did not collect this data, and the latest available survey on the number of adoptions that break down and where is for 2010. The available figures for the five years form the child returns to care. The Department is funding 2006 to 2010 are as follows:

Average hourly fees by child care provider and by Government Office Region £ Full day care Sessional Childminders 2010 2008 2007 2006 2010 2008 2007 2006 2010 2008 2007 2006

Overall mean 3.70 3.50 3.20 2.70 3.00 2.30 2.30 1.90 3.80 3.60 3.60 3.20 average hourly fee

East Midlands 13.20 3.60 2— 2.70 12.80 3— 2— 1.60 13.20 3.20 15.90 2.90 East 3.60 3.50 2— 2.60 3.10 2.30 2— 2.00 4.00 3.60 3.40 3.30 London 4.70 4.60 2— 2.90 13.60 2.40 2— 2.10 4.70 4.30 4.20 3.90 North East 3— 3.20 2— 42.60 3— 3— 2— 41.60 53.30 3.20 42.90 43.00 Yorkshire and 13.50 3.00 2— 4— 12.80 2.20 2— 4— 3.30 3.20 4— 4— Humberside North West 3.50 3.60 2— 2.60 12.50 2.10 2— 1.60 13.30 3.00 12.90 2.90 South East 3.80 3.50 2— 2.80 3.60 2.60 2— 2.20 4.10 3.80 3.80 3.40 South West 3.60 3.30 2— 2.80 12.80 2.30 2— 1.90 3.70 3.60 13.20 3.10 West Midlands 3.30 2.90 2— 2.70 12.60 3— 2— 2.40 13.30 3.00 12.80 2.80 1 Signifies a cell where data should be treated with caution due to a low base size between 50-100. 2 Regional data on fees for full day care and sessional is not available for 2007. 3 Signifies a cell where data has not been included due to a base of less than 50. 4 Indicates a brace. 5 North East and Yorkshire and Humberside were considered as a single region for Childminders, so these figures represent the combined average for those regions. Note: Data on hourly fees was not collected in 2009 due to the reduced nature of the survey. Source: Childcare and Early Years Providers Survey 2006, 2007, 2008, 2010

Children: Missing Persons (b) St Helens, (c) Rochdale, (d) Kirklees, (e) South Gloucestershire, (f) Hartlepool, (g) Redcar and Cleveland, Ann Coffey: To ask the Secretary of State for (h) Stockton-on-Tees, (i) city of Kingston upon Hull, Education with reference to the children in care and (j) Bedford borough, (k) central Bedfordshire, (l) adoption performance tables, November 2011, whether Bournemouth, (m) Durham, (n) East Sussex, (o) Rutland, he is satisfied that no children went missing in (a) (p) Reading, and (q) Blackpool are zero. For these Knowsley, (b) St Helens, (c) Rochdale, (d) Kirklees, local authorities no looked after child is recorded as (e) South Gloucestershire, (f) Hartlepool, (g) Redcar being absent from their agreed placement in each of the and Cleveland, (h) Stockton-on-Tees, (i) city of years 2008 to 2010. Kingston upon Hull, (j) Bedford borough, (k) central Bedfordshire, (l) Bournemouth, (m) Durham, (n) For the local authorities, (r) Hackney, (s) Manchester, East Sussex, (o) Rutland, (p) Reading, (q) Blackpool, (t) Derby, (u) Leicester, (v) Cambridgeshire, (w) Kent, (r) Hackney, (s) Manchester, (t) Derby, (u) Leicester, (x) Lancashire, (y) Nottingham, (z) Lincolnshire (v) Cambridgeshire, (w) Kent, (x) Lancashire, (y) and (aa) Oxfordshire the three year average is shown Nottingham, (z) Lincolnshire and (aa) Oxfordshire as “-”. This symbol in the tables indicates that the between 2008 and 2010; and if he will make a percentage of looked after children recorded as being statement. [83346] absent from their agreed placement for more than 24 hours for the years 2008 to 2010 is lower than 0.5%. Tim Loughton: The adoption and performance tables Therefore for these local authorities, there are some show a three year average of children absent from their children recorded as being absent from their agreed agreed placement for more than 24 hours as a percentage placement for more than 24 hours at some point during of looked after children. The figures for (a) Knowsley, the period 2008 to 2010. 251W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 252W

The information published in the Children in Care 4. Specific data is not held. The Department has and Adoption Performance Tables was sourced from contractual catering arrangements in place to ensure the Department’s SSDA903 collection. This collection that food procurement complies with the Government is returned annually by local authorities. Local authorities Buying Standards for Food and catering in relation to are responsible for checking their data and, once they food purchase and provision. are confident that it is accurate, must sign off their data. All local authorities signed off the data for the years in Free Schools question. Debbie Abrahams: To ask the Secretary of State for The data goes through extensive validation to support Education what recent assessment he has made of the local authorities in ensuring that their final data is potential effects of (a) free schools and (b) academies correct. Once this data has been finalised, statisticians on educational attainment. [82910] perform extensive quality assurance of the data. I can therefore be satisfied that the data shown in these tables Mr Gibb: The first free schools opened in September is an accurate reflection of situation regarding children 2011. The high quality of the proposals for these schools, absent from their agreed placement for each local authority coupled with the fact that they are being run by dedicated named in the question. individuals, suggests that they will be shown to perform well when performance data are available. Parents clearly Departmental Eggs agree; over half of these schools are over-subscribed, many with waiting lists to cope with the demand. Huw Irranca-Davies: To ask the Secretary of State On academies, the latest provisional 2011 GCSE for Education what steps he is taking to ensure that the results show that results in academies open for two same standards of animal welfare for whole eggs apply years have improved twice as fast as those in maintained to imported liquefied eggs procured by (a) his schools. As the number of academies continues to grow, Department and (b) public bodies for which he is we expect that they will continue to have a positive responsible. [83793] effect on educational attainment. Pupils: Disadvantaged Tim Loughton: The Department for Education’s and its public bodies’ caterers use eggs that are Lion Branded Kerry McCarthy: To ask the Secretary of State for and sourced from enriched cages as a minimum standard. Education what assessment has been made of the effect From 1 January 2012 all eggs and egg products will be of the pupil premium on the number of children living sourced from enhanced conventional cages. in poverty up to 2015. [77227] Departmental Official Hospitality Sarah Teather [holding answer 31 October 2011]: The pupil premium provides additional funding for the Pete Wishart: To ask the Secretary of State for most disadvantaged pupils, including those known to Education what receptions and events have been hosted be eligible for free school meals, those whose parents by his Department since May 2010, including those are in the armed forces and children who have been in sponsored by a third party. [84195] care for more than six months. The pupil premium is aimed at narrowing the gap in Tim Loughton: The information requested is not held educational attainment between children from deprived centrally and to gather this information would represent backgrounds and other pupils in a school. It is not disproportionate costs. intended to impact directly on the number of children living in poverty by 2015 but it is intended to allow Departmental Procurement schools to provide disadvantaged children with additional support where they need it to help them reach their potential by improving their attainment, aspiration and Huw Irranca-Davies: To ask the Secretary of State progression into adulthood. This is a key strand of our for Education what proportion of food sourced by (a) approach to improve the life chances of children and his Department and (b) public bodies for which he is prevent them from becoming the next generation of responsible was procured from UK food producers in disadvantaged parents. the latest period for which figures are available. [83794] Schools will be accountable for narrowing the attainment Tim Loughton: The information is as follows. gap for disadvantaged children. We will reform performance tables to include new measures that show the attainment 1. The Department for Education’s and its public of pupils who receive the pupil premium compared with bodies’ caterers are British Farm Assured Accredited their peers. We will also ask schools to report to parents for fresh meat and poultry and Marine Stewardship on an annual basis how they have used the pupil premium. Council accredited for fish. The award of Red Tractor accreditation ensures that all fresh meat and poultry is British produced. The majority offish used within the contracts area also sourced from British waters. HEALTH 2. Wherever practical and subject to the cost of the Alcoholic Drinks: Young People supply bacon used within the catering provision is British sourced. Ms Abbott: To ask the Secretary of State for Health 3. Subject to seasonal availability, fruit and vegetable how many people under the age of 18 years have been products conform to LEAF environmental standards treated for alcohol-induced illness by NHS hospitals and are sourced from British suppliers. since January 2011. [84865] 253W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 254W

Anne Milton: Provisional figures show that there were of alcohol consumption with information from population an estimated 7,074 admissions of people under the age surveys about self-reported consumption. of 18 years that have been treated for alcohol-induced These ″alcohol-attributable fractions″ are applied to illness1 by national health service hospitals since January data on hospital admissions to estimate the number of 2011. admissions where the patient has been diagnosed with a 1 In 2007, the Department commissioned the North West Public condition caused by alcohol consumption. For example, Health Observatory (NWPHO) to undertake a review of the it is estimated that 32% of cancers of the oesophagus epidemiological literature to identify those conditions where there among men aged 16 to 24 in England can be attributed is significant evidence of a causal relationship between alcohol to alcohol consumption. The estimate of the number of consumption and the disease or injury, NWPHO’s findings were admissions where men aged 16 to 24 have been diagnosed published in “Alcohol-attributable fractions for England, Alcohol- with cancer of the oesophagus that can be attributed to attributable mortality and hospital admissions”, June 2008. alcohol consumption is obtained by multiplying the This is shown in a table that has been placed in the total number of admissions where men aged 16 to 24 Library. The data in the table should not be described as have been diagnosed with cancer of the oesophagus by a count of people as the same person may have been 32%. admitted on more than one occasion. Cannabis: Children Some conditions (such as alcoholic liver disease or ethanol poisoning) are wholly attributed to alcohol Debbie Abrahams: To ask the Secretary of State for consumption (that is, alcohol consumption is the sole Health how many (a) people and (b) people under the cause). age of 18 years were treated for cannabis-induced psychosis in each of the last two years. [84740] Other conditions (cancer of the oesophagus and assaults) are only partially attributed to alcohol consumption Anne Milton: Data on the number of people treated (that is, alcohol consumption causes the illness in some for cannabis-induced psychosis are not collected centrally. cases). For these conditions, estimates of the fraction of However, data on the number of finished admissions cases that can be attributed to alcohol, were produced episodes with a primary diagnosis of mental and by combining information from epidemiological studies behavioural disorders due to use of cannabinoids are about the increased risks associated with different levels collected and presented in the following table:

Count of finished admission episodes (FAE) with a primary diagnosis of mental and behavioural disorders due to use of cannabinoids (ICD10 code F12) Number of people aged under Number of people aged 18 Number of people treated 18 and over Age not known

2009-10 713 93 617 3 2010-11 799 87 710 2 Notes: 1. A FAE is the first period of in-patient care under one consultant within one health care provider. FAEs are counted against the year in which the admission episode finishes. Admissions do not represent the number of in-patients, as a person may have more than one admission within the year. 2. The primary diagnosis is the first of up to 20 (14 from 2002-03 to 2006-07 and seven prior to 2002-03) diagnosis fields in the Hospital Episode Statistics (HES) data set and provides the main reason why the patient was admitted to hospital. ICD10 Code used = F12 Mental and behavioural disorders due to use of cannabinoids (including cannabis). 3. Data quality—HES are compiled from data sent by more than 300 NHS trusts and primary care trusts (PCTs) in England and from some independent sector organisations for activity commissioned by the English national health service. The NHS Information Centre for health and social care liaises closely with these organisations to encourage submission of complete and valid data and seeks to minimise inaccuracies. While this brings about improvement over time, some shortcomings remain. 4. HES figures are available from 1989-90 onwards. Changes to the figures over time need to be interpreted in the context of improvements in data quality and coverage (particularly in earlier years), improvements in coverage of independent sector activity (particularly from 2006-07) and changes in NHS practice. For example, apparent reductions in activity may be due to a number of procedures, which may now be undertaken in out-patient settings and so no longer include in admitted patient HES data. 5. Activity included—activity in English NHS Hospitals and English NHS commissioned activity in the independent sector. Source: Hospital Episode Statistics (HES), The NHS Information Centre for health and social care

Contraception Further information on the engagement exercise can be found at: www.nice.org.uk/getinvolved/currentniceconsultations/ Mr Virendra Sharma: To ask the Secretary of State NQBEngagement.jsp for Health what his proposed timetable is for An announcement on next steps will be made once development of a Quality Standard for contraceptive the responses have been analysed. services, including emergency contraception; and if he will make a statement. [84601] Departmental Advertising Mr Crausby: To ask the Secretary of State for Health Mr Simon Burns: The National Institute for Health what advertising campaigns his Department has run in and Clinical Excellence (NICE) jointly with the National each of the last five years; and what the cost was of Quality Board recently ran an engagement exercise on each such campaign. [84555] the development of a library of NICE Quality Standard topics for the national health service. The list of proposed Mr Simon Burns: The following tables show the Quality Standard topics published as part of this exercise Department’s advertising expenditure carried out through included contraceptive services (including emergency the Communications Directorate over each of the last contraception). The engagement exercise closed on five financial years for which full information is available, 14 October 2011. by campaign. 255W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 256W

Advertising spend is defined as covering only media Mr Simon Burns: Between 1 June and 30 November spend (inclusive of agency commissions but excluding 2011, 635 written questions for answer on a named day production costs, Central Office of Information (COI) were received. 100% received a substantive answer on commission and VAT). All figures exclude advertising the date for answer. rebates and audit adjustments and therefore may differ The Government have committed to providing the from COI official turnover figures. All figures are rounded Procedure Committee with information relating to written to the nearest £10,000. These figures do not include parliamentary question performance on a sessional basis Departmental recruitment/classified advertising costs and will provide full information to the committee at and ad hoc spend under £10,000. These figures may the end of the Session. Statistics relating to Government include occasional minor spend through COI by national Departments’ performance for the 2009-10 parliamentary health service organisations, to supplement national Session were previously provided to the committee and campaigns in their area. While this expenditure has are available on the Parliament website. been excluded as far as possible so that this chart reflects central departmental spend, it would incur Dilnot Commission disproportionate cost to validate that every item of NHS expenditure has been removed. John Hemming: To ask the Secretary of State for A total budget figure for the current financial year Health when he expects to publish the Government’s cannot be provided at this stage as detailed planning for response to the Dilnot Commission’s report Fairer some campaigns is under way and advertising media Funding for All. [84853] allocations have not yet been finalised. Department of Health advertising spend Paul Burstow: On 4 July this year, the Secretary of £ million State for Health, the right hon. Member for South Campaign 2006-07 2007-08 2008-09 2009-10 2010-11 Cambridgeshire (Mr Lansley), set out the Government’s initial response to the report of the Commission on Alcohol 10.56 10.61 14.77 3.25 0.00 Funding of Care and Support. Antibiotics 0.00 0.39 1.15 0.00 0.00 The Government welcomed this report, which is an Cancer signs and 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.42 symptoms immensely valuable contribution to meeting the long-term Change4Life 0.00 0.00 7.69 9.20 1.61 challenge of an ageing population. Drugs1 1.34 0.67 1.45 1.42 0.01 Government have spent the last few months engaging Flu 1.11 0.98 1.42 0.17 0.00 with stakeholders from across the care and support (immunisation) community to ensure that we get funding reform—and Hepatitis C 0.52 1.34 1.30 1.04 0.00 social care reform more broadly—right. HPV vaccination 0.00 0.00 2.80 3.73 0.00 As the Secretary of State set out in his July statement, Immunisation 1.66 0.00 0.32 0.24 0.00 the Government plan to publish a social care White National 0.00 0.00 0.00 1.58 0.59 dementia Paper and a progress report on funding reform in the strategy spring. We remain committed to this timetable. NHS injury 0.00 0.40 0.00 0.00 0.00 benefits scheme Drugs: Young People NHS Choices 0.00 0.03 0.55 0.00 0.00 NHS 111 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.11 Ms Abbott: To ask the Secretary of State for Health Patient Choice 0.00 0.00 0.53 0.00 0.00 how many (a) people, (b) under 18 year olds, (c) Pandemic flu 0.00 0.00 0.00 7.24 0.00 under 16 year olds and (d) under 12 year olds were Respiratory and 0.00 0.32 1.53 2.63 0.79 hand hygiene given drug rehabilitation treatment for each type of Sexual health/ 2.88 3.11 2.83 7.67 0.00 drug since January 2011. [84864] teenage pregnancy Anne Milton: The National Drug Treatment Social care/ 2.31 2.22 2.03 2.99 0.00 Monitoring System records information about worker recruitment substance misuse interventions in England. Data on Smoking— 13.17 10.79 23.38 14.60 1.05 adults (18 and over) in contact with drug treatment tobacco control agencies and general practitioners in England in 2010-11 Stroke 0.00 0.00 4.52 2.24 0.54 were published as “Statistics from the National Drug Tobacco 0.32 5.38 0.00 0.00 0.00 Treatment Monitoring System (NDTMS) 1 April 2010 legislation to 31 March 2011”. A copy has been placed in the 5-a-Day 0.05 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 Library. The young people’s annual statistics for 2010-11 E111/EHIC 0.00 0.00 0.16 0.00 0.00 will be published by the National Treatment Agency for Lifecheck 0.00 0.00 0.00 2.28 0.00 Substance Misuse on 8 December and a copy will be Total 23.92 26.24 56.43 60.28 4.21 placed in the Library. 1 Departmental contribution to campaign run jointly with Home Office Food: Labelling Departmental Written Questions Ms Abbott: To ask the Secretary of State for Health what the differences are between the targets put in Chris Ruane: To ask the Secretary of State for Health place by the Food Standards Agency prior to May what proportion of written questions for answer on a 2010 and the targets in the responsibility deal in named day received a substantive answer within five respect of (a) salt reduction, (b) saturated fat working days in each of the last six months. [85048] reduction and reformulation, (c) front of pack 257W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 258W nutrition labelling and traffic light colour coding and The FSA had no targets associated with front of (d) information on healthy choices when eating out; pack labelling or the use of traffic light labelling and and if he will make a statement. [84475] there are currently no Responsibility Deal pledges in this area. The FSA had no targets associated with information Anne Milton: The Responsibility Deal has the same on healthy eating when eating out. The Responsibility salt reduction targets as those developed by the Food Deal has a pledge for businesses to provide calorie Standards Agency (FSA), with a modification to the information for food and non-alcoholic drinks in out of average and maximum targets for breakfast, cereals. As home settings from 1 September 2011. a result, the Responsibility Deal targets have the potential Health Professions: Training to remove more salt from our foods than those set by the FSA. Jeremy Lefroy: To ask the Secretary of State for Health how many training posts have been funded for The FSA published recommendations for saturated (a) nurses, (b) doctors and (c) other clinical staff in fat for a number of food categories in March 2010. each of the last 10 years. [83182] There are currently no Responsibility Deal targets for saturated fat and reformulation. Work on saturated fat Anne Milton: The following table shows the total will be part of the next phase of the Responsibility population of doctors across all grades of training from Deal. 2001 to 2010:

Total number of doctors in training in England—at 30 September 2001 to 2010 2001 2002 2003 2004 2005 2006 2007 2008 2009 2010

Hospital and community 32,005 33,932 36,402 40,654 43,295 45,422 46,051 48,298 51,216 51,397 services doctors in training and equivalents General practice registrars 1,811 1,907 2,153 2,454 2,435 2,190 2,409 3,055 3,659 3,718 Total number of doctors 33,816 35,839 38,554 43,108 45,729 47,613 48,460 51,353 54,875 55,115 in training Notes: 1. Figures are shown as full-time equivalents 2. The Modernising Medical Careers programme saw the introduction of new training grades, changes in categorisation and reorganisation of training staff. Evidence of these changes were first reflected in 2007, within the component staff of the doctors in training and equivalents group (particularly registrar group and senior house officers). 3.Doctors in training and equivalents refers to the registrar group, senior house officer, foundation year 2, house officer and foundation programme year 1, other doctors in training and other staff at these grades that do not hold an educationally approved training post. Source: NHS work force census

The Department does not collect population data for giving a total non-medical trainee population of 89,359. the number of nurses and other clinical staff in training The following table shows the number of new nursing each year. However, the latest figures available show and other non medical staff courses that were commissioned that, in 2010-11, the population of nurses in training in each financial year since 2001-02. was 53,101 and other non-medical trainees was 36,258,

Non-medical commissions by strategic health authorities (SHAs) in England 2001-02 to 2010-11 2001-02 2002-03 2003-04 2004-05 2005-06 2006-07 2007-08 2008-09 2009-10 2010-11

Nursing commissions 20,624 21,523 22,815 23,369 20,308 21,199. 19,352 20,664 20,829 20,092 Other non-medical 9,250 11,819 13,536 14,508 13,842 14,124 13,992 16,726 16,225 16,401 commissions Total non-medical 29,874 33,342 36,351 37,877 34,150 35,323 33,344 37,390 37,054 36,493 commissions Source: SHA Multi Professional Education and Training monitoring returns

Health Services Mr Simon Burns: The available information is shown in the following table: Jeremy Lefroy: To ask the Secretary of State for Health how many patients have been treated by the NHS in the last 12 months. [83183]

Out-patient and in-patient hospital activity, England (commissioner based) Out-patients In-patients Non-elective First attendances Subsequent Total attendances Elective general general and acute Total general and Quarter seen attendances seen seen and acute FFCEs FFCEs acute FFCEs

Q3 2010-11 4,105,634 8,528,525 12,634,159 1,771,893 1,394,031 3,165,924 Q4 2010-11 4,198,682 9,092,643 13,291,325 1,812,254 1,366,621 3,178,875 Q1 2011-12 4,134,870 8,765,011 12,899,881 1,775,676 1,327,206 3,102,882 259W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 260W

Out-patient and in-patient hospital activity, England (commissioner based) Out-patients In-patients Non-elective First attendances Subsequent Total attendances Elective general general and acute Total general and Quarter seen attendances seen seen and acute FFCEs FFCEs acute FFCEs

Q2 2011-12 4,254,577 8,931,242 13,185,819 1,856,423 1,318,853 3,175,276 Sum of the four quarters 16,693,763 35,317,421 52,011,184 7,216,246 5,406,711 12,622,957 Note: The out-patient attendances are for all specialties. The in-patient First Finished Consultant Episodes (FFCEs) are for general and acute specialties only. General and acute does not include maternity, mental illness and learning disability. Source: Department of Health Quarterly Activity Return (QAR) for out-patient attendances and Monthly Activity Return (MAR) for in-patient FFCEs

Health Services: Finance (Mr Lansley), wrote to the Mayor of London inviting further proposals for the optimal public health improvement Ms Abbott: To ask the Secretary of State for Health system for London. Early this year, the Mayor and what plans he has to ensure that the Health Premium London councils responded positively with their proposal does not divert resources from the areas with the to set up a London Health Improvement Board. The highest level of continuing health problems. [84477] Department is working with the Greater London authority and London boroughs in considering how best to take Mr Simon Burns: The Department is developing a the proposals forward. health premium that will incentivise local authorities to make improvements in health and reduce health inequalities. Hospital Beds Those areas with the worst health problems will see the greatest incentive because they face the greatest challenges. Debbie Abrahams: To ask the Secretary of State for Detailed work on the health premium can only begin Health how many (a) acute and (b) critical care beds once the baseline spend is known and after the publication were reported in situation reports to his Department as of the Public Health Outcomes Framework. More being in use in hospitals in each week since 1 April information will be published as soon as possible after 2011. [84884] that so that local authorities know what is expected of them to receive an incentive payment. Mr Simon Burns: The Department does not collect Health: Children data on bed numbers in weekly situation reports. The information collected by the Department on a monthly and quarterly basis since April 2011 is provided in the Ms Abbott: To ask the Secretary of State for Health following tables. if he will prepare and publish a strategy for improving children’s health. [84476] England level Average number of available general and acute beds under care of a consultant Anne Milton: In the Government’s new vision for the Year Period Overnight beds Day only beds national health service and public health we have made explicit our determination to provide high quality services 2011-12 Q1 104,620 10,601 for children and young people as an essential and 2011-12 Q2 105,673 11,381 integral part of delivering better health outcomes. Source: KH03 quarterly return Since the publication in September 2010 of “Achieving Equity and Excellence for children”, Ministers and England level officials have worked with the children’s sector to Number of beds open at last Thursday in reporting develop a focus on improving children’s health in the period reformed health and public health system. Subject to Number of Number of Number of paediatric neonatal parliamentary approval, the new framework will enable adult critical intensive care critical care a more robust, focused and comprehensive approach to Year Period care beds beds cots (or beds) child health. 2011-12 April 3,707 393 1,283 A copy of the publication has been placed in the 2011-12 May 3,706 398 1,286 Library. 2011-12 June 3,683 402 1,267 Health: Greater London 2011-12 July 3,706 392 1,281 2011-12 August 3,704 396 1,269 2011-12 September 3,718 409 1,267 Mr Evennett: To ask the Secretary of State for Health 2011-12 October 3,728 396 1,289 what discussions he has had with London boroughs on Source: the Government’s public health reforms. [84817] Unify2 data collection—Monthly situation reports

Anne Milton: A pan-London Delivery board exists to Influenza support and co-ordinate public health reforms in London. This board is co-chaired by the regional director of Ms Abbott: To ask the Secretary of State for Health public health and the chief executive of Bromley council what steps he is taking to provide information on the on behalf of London boroughs. steps that the public should take to minimise the risk of Last year, the Secretary of State for Health, my right transmission and infection in the event of an influenza hon. Friend the Member for South Cambridgeshire pandemic. [84473] 261W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 262W

Anne Milton: On 10 November 2011, the Government Activity in English national health service hospitals and English NHS launched the UK Influenza Pandemic Preparedness commissioned activity in the independent sector January to March April to July Strategy 2011. The Strategy has already been placed in Primary diagnoses Age group 2011 2011(provisional) the Library and is available on the Department’s website at: Non-alcoholic fatty 0to9 6 9 liver disease www.dh.gov.uk/en/Publicationsandstatistics/Publications/ 10 to 18 25 18 PublicationsPolicyAndGuidance/DH_130903 This United Kingdom wide Strategy aims to ensure that the UK continues to be one of the best-prepared Diabetes 0 to 9 622 704 countries in the world. 10 to 18 1,768 2,120 In the event of a pandemic, the Government will use Source: Hospital Episode Statistics (HES), The NHS Information Centre for health and a wide range of media to communicate information social care effectively to the public. Until the characteristics of any emerging virus are known, plans remain flexible, but are Maternity Services likely to include regular press briefings, via the Chief Medical Officer and other trusted health professionals, Ms Abbott: To ask the Secretary of State for Health key websites and social media as well as paid-for advertising what steps he is taking to implement the Maternity where appropriate. Matters policy. [84937] Information may also be made available directly to the public through telephone help lines and other interactive Anne Milton: “Maternity Matters” (April 2007) was channels. The Department will also work closely with the previous administration’s policy for maternity choice. potential partners from the commercial and voluntary In the White Paper, “Equity and excellence: Liberating sectors to develop ways for them to disseminate urgent the NHS” (July 2010) we set out our commitment to public health messages to their customers and members. extend maternity choice through provider networks. By focusing on health outcomes and delivering maternity Influenza: Vaccination services through provider networks, we will help to make safe, informed choice throughout pregnancy and Debbie Abrahams: To ask the Secretary of State for in childbirth a reality and facilitate movement between Health what estimate his Department has made of the different services to meet women’s needs and choices. likely take-up rates of the influenza vaccine in each (a) The Department funded the “Birthplace in England” age group, (b) category of at-risk group and (c) research study, published by the National Perinatal geographical area. [84617] Epidemiology Unit in November 2011, to compare the Anne Milton: The chief medical officer (CMO) wrote outcomes of births planned at home, in different types to the national health service on 14 March 2011 setting of midwifery unit and in hospital units with obstetric out the planning assumptions for vaccine uptake for the services.. This study will help national health service in current flu season. The CMO stated that NHS in England their maternity services, based on what women want should plan to achieve a vaccine uptake rate of at least and need. It will also help midwives advise women so 75%, among people aged 65 and over, and to vaccinate that they can make the most informed choice about at least 60%, of those aged under 60 in clinical risk their birth setting. groups. Maternity Services: Finance The CMO letter can be viewed at: www.dh.gov.uk/en/Publicationsandstatistics/ Ms Abbott: To ask the Secretary of State for Health Lettersandcirculars/Dearcolleagueletters/DH_125091 what funding he is providing to support (a) all A copy of the letter has been placed in the Library. neonatal care services and (b) neonatal intensive care services during the comprehensive spending review Liver Diseases: Children period. [84474]

Ms Abbott: To ask the Secretary of State for Health Anne Milton: The Government have committed to how many children aged (a) under 10 years and (b) 10 increasing funding in real terms funding for the national years and over were admitted to hospital with a health service in every year of the Parliament. diagnosis of (i) non-alcoholic fatty liver and (ii) Primary care trust (PCT) recurrent revenue allocations diabetes since January 2011. [84862] are not broken down by service or policy area. It is for Anne Milton: Information is not available on the PCTs to commission services to meet the health care number of patients admitted. The table shows the number needs of their local populations, taking account of of finished admission episodes. local and national priorities. 1 Count of finished admission episodes where primary Mental Health Services diagnosis is fatty (change of) liver, not elsewhere classified or diabetes for children aged under 10 years and aged 10-18 since January 2011. Ms Abbott: To ask the Secretary of State for Health 1 (1) what discussions he has had with the Secretary of A finished admission episode (FAE) is the first period of State for (a) Education, (b) Justice, (c) Work and in-patient care under one consultant within one health care provider. FAEs are counted against the year in which the admission Pensions and (d) Communities and Local Government episode finishes. Admissions do not represent the number of about the implementation of the Government’s mental in-patients, as a person may have more than one admission in health strategy, No Health Without Mental Health; the year. [84866] 263W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 264W

Mental Health Services Mental Illness: Children (2) what steps his Department has taken to implement the Government’s mental health strategy, Ms Abbott: To ask the Secretary of State for Health No Health Without Mental Health. [84867] what estimate he has made of the number of people aged under 18 years diagnosed with a mental disorder Paul Burstow: “No Health Without Mental Health” for each type of disorder (i) in January 2011 and (ii) on highlights that mental health is a priority across the latest date for which figures are available. [84605] Government, and that its ambitions are shared by a number of Government Departments. Most Government Paul Burstow: No estimate has been made but Departments have plans of action that will improve information on the prevalence of mental disorders in mental health outcomes. children and young people has been published by other The Cabinet sub-Committee on Public Health is where organisations. these plans are brought together, and where the Government For example, the Mental Health of Children and will oversee progress on this strategy. The Cabinet Adolescents in Great Britain, 2004 the Office for National Committee on Social Justice will also help to ensure Statistics reported that 9.6%, of five-16 year-olds had a that there is effective cross-Government action to address clinically recognisable mental disorder. Of these; 5.8%, many of the social causes of mental health problems. had a conduct disorder; 3.7%, had emotional disorders Since publication, the Department has worked to (anxiety and depression), 1.5%, had hyperkinetic further the aims of the strategy through a number of (hyperactive) disorders and 0.3%, had eating disorders. routes. These include the recently-published national Some children had more than one disorder. The same health service (NHS) operating framework which highlights survey showed that among five-ten year-olds 10.2%, of mental health services and specifically “No Health without boys and 5.1%, of girls had a clinically recognisable Mental Health” and makes it clear that this should be a mental disorder. In the older age group, 11-16 year-olds, priority for primary care trust commissioning. 12.6%, of boys and 10.3%, of girls had a clinically Mental health is reflected in the outcomes frameworks recognisable mental disorder. for the NHS and adult social care, and in the draft outcomes framework for public health. Mental Illness: Young People Implementation will also be supported through the introduction of payment by results and improved outcome measures for mental health within the NHS. Ms Abbott: To ask the Secretary of State for Health how many (a) people and (b) people under 18 years of We have established a Ministerial Advisory Group age were treated for cannabis-induced psychosis (i) for the mental health strategy to work in partnership to since January 2011 and (ii) in the previous 12 months. realise this strategy.The group brings together Government, [84861] relevant national bodies, commissioners, mental health provider organisations, voluntary and community sector Anne Milton: Data on the number of people treated organisations, and people with mental health problems for cannabis-induced psychosis are not collected centrally. and carers. However, data on the number of finished admissions Proposals to develop a full implementation framework episodes with a primary diagnosis of mental and for the strategy were agreed by the Ministerial Advisory behavioural disorders due to use of cannabinoids are Group in October 2011. collected and presented in the following tables. The framework will be co-produced and jointly owned Count of finished admission episodes with a primary diagnosis of mental and by national mental health organisations, with involvement behavioural disorders due to use of cannabinoids (ICD10 code F12), since and engagement from organisations across the sector, in January 2011 partnership with Government Departments. Number of Number of Number of people people aged people aged Age not Mental Illness treated under 18 18 and over known

Ms Abbott: To ask the Secretary of State for Health January 69 4 65 0 2011 what estimate he has made of the number of people February 51 4 47 0 with (a) mild to moderate and (b) severe mental 2011 illness (i) in January 2011 and (ii) on the latest date for March 74 9 65 0 which figures are available. [84606] 2011

Paul Burstow: The Department does not collect this Count of finished admission episodes with a primary diagnosis of mental and information. behavioural disorders due to use of cannabinoids (ICD10 code F12), January The most recent data on the proportion of adults 2010-December 2010 Number of Number of Number of with mental disorders are from the 2007 Adult Psychiatric people people aged people aged Age not Morbidity Census (APMS). Data from this report are treated under 18 18 and over known as follows: January 60 8 52 0 Prevalence based on 2007 APMS 2010 All adults (Percentage) February 56 9 47 0 2010 Any common mental disorder 16.2 March 2010 56 10 46 0 (includes anxiety and depression) April 2010 74 9 65 0 Psychotic disorder 0.4 May 2010 79 11 68 0 Source: Adult Psychiatric Morbidity in England, 2007: results of a household survey: June 2010 69 5 64 0 www.ic.nhs.uk/pubs/psychiatricmorbidity07 July 2010 78 6 71 1 265W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 266W

Count of finished admission episodes with a primary diagnosis of mental and NHS which has been spent to date to support the behavioural disorders due to use of cannabinoids (ICD10 code F12), January 2010-December 2010 development of the Lorenzo IT system at the Number of Number of Number of University Hospitals of Morecambe Bay NHS people people aged people aged Age not Foundation Trust; [85097] treated under 18 18 and over known (2) what estimate he has made of the cost to date to August 71 8 63 0 the University Hospitals of Morecambe Bay NHS 2010 Trust of the development and deployment of the September 47 6 41 0 Lorenzo IT system. [85100] 2010 October 61 12 49 0 Mr Simon Burns: A total of £2.16 million has been 2010 provided to University Hospitals of Morecambe Bay November 64 5 58 1 2010 National Health Service Foundation Trust in their role December 62 8 54 0 as an early adopter for release 1 and 1.9 of the Lorenzo 2010 information technology system—£1,158,660 from NHS Notes: Connecting for Health and £1,007,000 from the NHS. 1. A finished admission episode (FAE) is the first period of inpatient care under one consultant within one healthcare provider. FAEs are counted against the These costs do not include payments for the system year in which the admission episode finishes. Admissions do not represent the to the local service provider, which are only made when number of in-patients, as a person may have more than one admission within the deployment has been proved successful. To date, a the year. 2. The primary diagnosis is the first of up to 20 (14 from 2002-03 to 2006-07 and payment of £0.3 million has been made by NHS Connecting seven prior to 2002-03) diagnosis fields in the Hospital Episode Statistics (HES) for Health for the deployment of the first release of the data set and provides the main reason why the patient was admitted to hospital. Lorenzo IT system at the trust. No payments have been ICD10 Code used = F12 Mental and behavioural disorders due to use of cannabinoids (including cannabis). made for subsequent releases. Total costs payable to the 3. Data quality—HES are compiled from data sent by more than 300 NHS supplier are dependent on which functionality is deployed trusts and primary care trusts in England and from some independent sector at the trust. organisations for activity commissioned by the English NHS. The NHS Information Centre for health and social care liaises closely with these organisations to The trust estimate their total costs to be £6.2 million encourage submission of complete and valid data and seeks to minimise from their involvement with the programme. These inaccuracies. While this brings about improvement over time, some shortcomings remain. relate to user training, project management, additional 4. HES figures are available from 1989-90 onwards. Changes to the figures over computer equipment and additional corporate reporting time need to be interpreted in the context of improvements in data quality and tools. In addition to the £2.16 million funding from coverage (particularly in earlier years), improvements in coverage of independent sector activity (particularly from 2006-07) and changes in NHS practice. For Connecting for Health and the NHS, £3.2 million funding example, apparent reductions in activity may be due to a number of procedures has been provided by the local service provider, with a which may now be undertaken in out-patient settings and so no longer include further £0.8 million expected before 31 March 2012. in admitted patient HES data. 5. Activity included—activity in English NHS Hospitals and English NHS NHS: Manpower commissioned activity in the independent sector. Source: Hospital Episode Statistics (HES), The NHS Information Centre for health and Shabana Mahmood: To ask the Secretary of State for social care. Health what assessment he has made of future levels of Morecambe Bay Hospitals NHS Trust: Information and staffing in the NHS; and what discussions he has had Communications Technology with the Secretary of State for the Home Department on the number of Tier 2 visas that may have to be Mr Bacon: To ask the Secretary of State for Health issued to meet future NHS staffing needs. [84729] (1) when development commenced on the Lorenzo IT Mr Simon Burns: Local national health service system at University Hospitals of Morecambe Bay organisations are best placed to decide on the work NHS Foundation Trust; and when he expects the force needs for their community, according to local system to be deployed; [84313] circumstances and priorities, with assurance and challenge (2) what estimate he has made of the cost of (a) regionally and nationally. Connecting for Health staff and (b) contractors in The Migration Advisory Committee is consulting on support of the development and deployment of the policies towards skilled economic migrants from April Lorenzo IT system at University Hospitals of 2012, including the level of the limits on Tier 2 visas. Morecambe Bay NHS Foundation Trust since the start The Department of Health will be responding to the of the project. [84315] consultation and will continue to work closely with the Home Office and stakeholders to ensure that the NHS Mr Simon Burns: Development of the Lorenzo computer is not adversely affected by the review of the Tier 2 system started at University Hospitals of Morecambe limits. Bay National Health Service Foundation Trust in August 2008. The trust has implemented the following elements North Bristol NHS Trust: Information and of the system: Requests and Results/Clinical Communications Technology Documentation; Care Management and To Take Out (out-patient department) Prescribing and plans to Mr Bacon: To ask the Secretary of State for Health implement the Emergency Care element in 2012. The (1) when development commenced on the Cerner support costs provided to date by NHS Connecting for Millennium IT system at North Bristol NHS Trust; Health staff are estimated to be £460,000 and an estimated and when he expects the system to be deployed; [84312] £3,734,000 spent on contractors. (2) what estimate he has made of the cost of (a) Connecting for Health staff and (b) contractors in Mr Bacon: To ask the Secretary of State for Health support of the development and deployment of the (1) what estimate he has made of the amount of Cerner Millennium IT system at North Bristol NHS funding from (a) Connecting for Health and (b) the Trust since the start of the project; [84314] 267W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 268W

(3) how much (a) Connecting for Health and (b) Radiotherapy the NHS has spent to support the development of the Cerner Millennium IT system at North Bristol NHS Tessa Munt: To ask the Secretary of State for Health Trust since the start of the project. [84316] pursuant to the answer of 27 June 2011, Official Report, column 537W, on radiotherapy, and the answer Mr Simon Burns: The project to deliver the Cerner of 31 October 2011, Official Report, column 458W, on Millennium IT system at North Bristol National Health radiotherapy, how stereotactic body radiotherapy Service Trust under the BT Local Service Provider treatment will be commissioned under his proposals for contract commenced on 26 April 2010. The trust is the NHS. [84996] planning to start using the system on the 8 December 2011. Paul Burstow: Stereotactic body radiotherapy (SBRT) The support costs for the deployment of the Cerner is currently commissioned as a specialised service by Millennium IT system at North Bristol NHS Trust are regional specialised commissioning groups and as informed estimated to be £60,887 for NHS Connecting for Health by the specialised services national definitions set. The staff and £585,106 for contractors supplied via the intention, subject to parliamentary approval, is that in Southern Programme for IT. These costs cover support the future services such as SBRT for people with rare provided to the trust for test assurance, additional and complex cancers should be directly commissioned testers and trainers, and extra project management. by the National Health Service Commissioning Board North Bristol NHS Trust has spent £3.9 million since (NHSCB). the start of the project. However, no official decisions have yet been taken on NHS Connecting for Health has not directly incurred what services will be directly commissioned by the costs for development of the Cerner Millennium IT NHSCB from April 2013. system as the configuration of the system has taken place between the supplier, BT and their subcontractor Sex: Health Services Cerner and the trust. Mr Virendra Sharma: To ask the Secretary of State Mr Bacon: To ask the Secretary of State for Health for Health what steps his Department is taking to (1) how much has been (a) paid to date and (b) he ensure that the indicators for sexual health in the expects to be paid in the future to the local service forthcoming Public Health Outcomes Framework meet provider for the Cerner Millennium IT system at the the needs of women of all ages; and if he will make a North Bristol NHS Trust; [85098] statement. [84600] (2) what estimate he has made of the cost to date to the North Bristol NHS Trust of the development and Anne Milton: We are considering the consultation deployment of the Cerner Millennium IT system. responses to the Public Health Outcomes Framework, which includes three indicators relevant to sexual health [85099] and we will publish that framework very soon. We will Mr Simon Burns: No payments have been made to also be publishing a new sexual health policy document date to the local service provider for the Cerner Millennium in spring 2012. This will consider the needs of women information technology system at the North Bristol of all ages. NHS Trust. Payment will be made 45 days after delivery of a working system, which is planned for 8 December Ms Abbott: To ask the Secretary of State for Health 2011. Once the deployment has been proved successful when he plans to publish his Department’s sexual by the trust, a one-off deployment charge of £15.2 million health policy document. [84607] will be made followed by an annual service charge of Anne Milton: The Department plans to publish a £2 million, only payable while the trust continues to use sexual health policy document in spring 2012. The the system. These figures are in 2009-10 prices. document will set sexual health in the context of the North Bristol NHS Trust has spent £3.9 million since proposed new commissioning, arrangements and will the start of the project for the development and deployment promote the evidence base for improving sexual health; of the Cerner Millennium IT system. including behaviour change and links to wider public Obesity: Females health issues. Ms Abbott: To ask the Secretary of State for Health Smoking what steps he is taking to reduce obesity among women. [84547] Ms Abbott: To ask the Secretary of State for Health what steps he is taking to provide information for the Anne Milton: The Government are concerned about public on the effects of inhaling second hand tobacco the prevalence of obesity in women. As set out in smoke. [84471] “Healthy Lives, Healthy People: A call to action on obesity in England”, we are taking a life course approach Anne Milton: Second hand smoke is a serious health with the aim of reducing levels of overweight and hazard, and there is no safe level of exposure. While obesity in adults and children. smokefree legislation has removed second hand smoke The “Call to action” sets out the key role for central from enclosed work and public places, people can still Government, for local areas in developing approaches be exposed to it at home or in family cars. which work best for local communities and for specific In March, the Department published “Healthy Lives, population groups facing the greatest challenges, and Healthy People: A Tobacco Control Plan for England”, for other partners. which sets out the Government’s plans to tackle tobacco A copy of the “Call to action” has already been use over the next five years. This plan includes our placed in the Library. commitment to launch a national marketing campaign, 269W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 270W planned for spring 2012, to remind smokers of the risks Business of exposing children and adults to second hand smoke. We want people to recognise the risks of second hand smoke and decide voluntarily to make their homes and Kate Green: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet family cars smokefree. Office what steps he is taking to ensure that public sector spending stimulates growth in the small business In addition, the NHS Smokefree website: sector. [84102] www.nhs.uk/smokefree contains information on the harms of second hand Mr Maude: On 21 November 2011, I unveiled a smoke. Materials, including leaflets, are also made available radical package of measures that will change how by the Department on the harms of second hand smoke Government buys from the private sector in a way that for use by local areas. supports business and promotes growth: A copy of “Healthy Lives, Healthy People: A Tobacco Government will provide an open door for current and future Control Plan for England” has already been in the suppliers to discuss forthcoming procurement opportunities, cutting Library. the time taken in the procurement process, and working with industry to identify and address any key capabilities needed to Smoking: Motor Vehicles meet future demand. We will publish a pipeline of potential business opportunities Jason McCartney: To ask the Secretary of State for across Government, giving an unprecedented view into the Health what assessment he has made of the evidence Government’s expected future requirements and helping business presented to the inquiry on smoking in private vehicles to build the confidence to invest in plants, machinery and people. by the All Party Parliamentary Group on Smoking and We will work with Departments to ensure that SMEs can Health. [85002] access the value of procurement, including where relevant encouraging or challenging prime contractors to do more, or breaking up large Anne Milton: The Department has received a copy of contracts. the All Party Parliamentary Group on Smoking and We will make it 40% faster to do business with Government so Health’s report on smoking in private vehicles. This that, from January, all but the most complex procurement processes report is currently under consideration. will be completed within 120 working days compared to the average of 200 days now. Gordon Banks: To ask the Secretary of State for And we will require all civil servants responsible for running Health what research his Department has (a) major procurements to be trained in the Government’s new commissioned and (b) evaluated on the practicalities approach. of enforcing a smoking ban in privately owned vehicles. These measures build on the earlier initiatives to [85164] support SMEs that we announced in February. Anne Milton: The Department has not commissioned any specific research on the practicalities of enforcing a Communities First Fund smoking ban in privately owned vehicles. However, the All Party Parliamentary Group on Smoking and Health Michael Dugher: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet recently conducted an inquiry into smoking in private Office what assessment he has made of the potential vehicles. The report of that inquiry, published in November role of the (a) Community Organisers programme and 2011, addresses regulation and enforcement issues with (b) Community First scheme in tackling social respect to smoking in cars. The All Party Parliamentary exclusion. [85283] Group on Smoking and Health’s report is currently under consideration by the Department. Mr Hurd: The Government recognise that supporting the most disadvantaged is a key part of the big society approach which focuses on enabling all groups in society CABINET OFFICE to be able to play their part. Government Procurement The Community Organisers programme aims to stimulate and support greater social action, particularly in areas Andrew Stephenson: To ask the Minister for the of high deprivation. Both the National Partner, Locality, Cabinet Office what proposals he has made to the and their training partner, RE:generate, have a strong European Commission on the simplification of EU history of supporting and working with people from rules on government procurement; and if he will make disadvantaged backgrounds. RE:generate’s method, a statement. [83620] Listening Matters, focuses on having conversations with as many people as possible to find out their issues and Mr Maude: On 21 November 2011, I put the case to their opinions, thereby ensuring that everyone’s voice is the European Commission in Brussels for a radical heard, and not just those that speak the loudest. simplification of the public procurement directives to The Community First programme is designed to reduce costs for business and for procurers. encourage people to come together to make their The details of our proposals are set out in the neighbourhood a better place to live. The focus is on Government’s response to the Commission’s Green building social capital, encouraging ‘bonding and bridging’ Paper on the modernisation of EU public procurement within and between different parts of a neighbourhood. policy, which we published in July 2011. This can be The design of the programme is underpinned with found at: principles from Community Organising, ensuring that http://www.cabinetoffice.gov.uk/sites/default/files/resources/ improvements are community-led and that people take 0707UKGPpbResponsefinal%20(2).pdf responsibility for those things that they can do themselves. 271W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 272W

Federation of Small Businesses Mr Maude: The Government intend to commence consultation shortly with the nationally recognised civil Roger Williams: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet service trade unions on facility time. The aim of the Office on how many occasions he has met the consultation is to introduce a new framework for the Federation of Small Businesses to discuss the role of provision of facility time and time off for trade union public sector spending in stimulating small business activities in the civil service. growth. [84057]

Mr Maude [holding answer 1 December 2011]: There ENVIRONMENT, FOOD AND RURAL AFFAIRS have been no meetings with the Federation of Small Businesses. Details of ministerial meetings with external Agriculture: Bureaucracy organisations are published on the Cabinet Office website at: Huw Irranca-Davies: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (1) what http://www.cabinetoffice.gov.uk/resource-library/ministerial- gifts-hospitality-travel-and-meetings-external-organisations progress her Department has made on reducing administrative burdens for farmers; [80770] Government Departments: Procurement (2) what steps her Department has taken since its announcement that farmers with the best track records on environmental protection and animal welfare could Malcolm Wicks: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet have fewer inspections. [80784] Office what effect the Growth Review and Procurement Review will have on ensuring that Government tenders Mr Paice: I refer the hon. Gentleman to my written include an assessment of the (a) jobs, (b) tax revenues, statement of 3 November 2011, Official Report, (c) potential benefits to the domestic manufacturing columns 40-41WS and the interim response to the supply chain and (d) welfare costs associated with jobs independent Farm Regulation Task Force, which set moving overseas in assessing the value for money of out the work that is being done to apply and implement bids; and whether these factors will be assessed when the recommendations made by the task force. I was also assessing tenders for new nuclear power stations. pleased to announce changes to the animal welfare [81370] inspection regime in Great Britain at the same time, in response to the recent public consultation. In particular, Mr Maude: On 21 November 2011, I announced a that from January 2012, we will concentrate most cross new approach to ensure the huge purchasing power of compliance inspections on those farms that have the Government supports the task of boosting growth, and highest risk of non compliance, recognising that members enables the Government to actively shape the UK market of livestock assurance or organic certification schemes for the long term. have been shown to be lower risk. This approach is reflected in the autumn statement Biofuels: Imports and associated documentation of the Chancellor of the Exchequer, my right hon. Friend the Member for Tatton Barry Gardiner: To ask the Secretary of State for (Mr Osborne), published on 29 November 2011. This Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what can be found at: information her Department holds on the likely effects http://www.hm-treasury.gov.uk/as2011_index.htm of importation of woody material to the UK for biomass consumption on the price of (a) wood for use Industrial Disputes: Voluntary Organisations in furniture and building and (b) food in exporting countries. [83031] Jack Lopresti: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet Mr Paice: International wood prices are determined Office what his policy is on encouraging voluntary by a number of complex variables such as the demand groups to maintain key services during periods of for wood across different sectors (e.g. paper and pulp industrial action. [84479] and energy), the supply of raw material from both domestic and international sources, and exchange rate Mr Maude: All public services are expected to have fluctuations. The international nature of the markets robust contingency plans in place to minimise any disruption also makes the establishment of direct links between to essential services from a wide range of challenges use patterns and prices extremely difficult. Industries including industrial action. Such plans will look to that tend to use imported material will mainly be affected reprioritise activities and resources as appropriate, manage by fluctuations in the international prices, while those demand, and draw in additional staffing and expertise that do not have such close links with the international where necessary, including from the voluntary sector. markets are less likely to see such strong effects. Currently there is not enough historical data to provide Public Sector: Trade Union Officials firm information about the link between imported biomass for use in the energy sector and the impact on prices for Priti Patel: To ask the Minister for the Cabinet Office other sectors. DEFRA has been working with the if he will issue a standard facility time agreement to Department for Energy and Climate Change, the public sector employers which sets out (a) duties which Department for Business, Innovation and Skills and can be undertaken, (b) procedures for approval of other Departments, as well as representatives from industry, such facilities time and (c) provision for the including the agriculture, energy, and wood panelling publication of (i) each instance of such facilities time sectors, to understand the evidence base in this complex and (ii) the cost of such time. [84623] area. 273W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 274W

On the domestic biomass supply side (as set out in Devolution the Woodfuel Implementation Plan of June 2011), Forestry Commission England is working to bring more existing Ian Paisley: To ask the Secretary of State for private woodlands into active management to help supply Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (1) what the both fuel and non-fuel markets. In addition, increased outcomes were of the meeting between her Department demand for bioenergy may lead to upward pressure on and the devolved Ministers on 28 October 2011; the price of sawdust and other coproducts from furniture whether any specific outcomes related to Northern makers and other wood processors. Ireland; and if she will make a statement; [78577] In the short term, woody biomass imports are likely (2) what recent discussions she has had with her to continue to come from existing forests. If these are ministerial counterparts in the devolved sustainably managed, it is unlikely that the demand administrations on Common Agricultural Policy from the bioenergy sector will result in significant land reform. [78624] use change or influence food prices. Bovine Tuberculosis Mr Paice: No meeting with the devolved Administration Ministers took place on 28 October. However I and my Nadhim Zahawi: To ask the Secretary of State for DEFRA ministerial colleagues meet with our devolved Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what steps she is counterparts to discuss Common Agricultural Policy taking to monitor the presence of tuberculosis in (CAP) and other EU matters on a regular basis. Most camelids and the extent of any infection. [75358] recently we met to discuss the Commission’s package of draft CAP regulations for the next multi annual financial Mr Paice: There is no mandatory TB surveillance framework period (2014-20) in advance of the UK’s programme for camelids because they are not regarded response at Agricultural Council on 20 October. as significant reservoirs of TB infection for other species. The DEFRA ministerial team also met devolved There are no validated, sufficiently accurate and practical Ministers with responsibility for policy areas on which diagnostic techniques to routinely screen live camelids DEFRA represents the UK in EU negotiations on for TB. Surveillance for TB infection in camelids in 25 October. The meeting discussed the practicalities of Great Britain relies primarily on notifications of suspected working relationships on EU issues, including how to cases detected during post mortem examination by build a spirit of trust and respect, how to maximise the private veterinarians and Animal Health and Veterinary UK’s impact on EU policy; and the specific concerns of Laboratories Agency (AHVLA) regional laboratories. devolved Administrations regarding the application of Owners and their private veterinarians are under legal EU policies in their regions. obligation to notify such cases to AHVLA. The July 2011 TB Eradication programme for England includes measures to tackle TB in non-bovine farmed Food Supply species, including pigs, goats, deer, sheep, alpacas and llamas. Zac Goldsmith: To ask the Secretary of State for Simon Hart: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what long-term Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what assessment she has made of the prospects for UK food representations her Department has received from security in 2050 arising from the upper and lower limits welfare organisations on the impact of bovine TB on of the Office for National Statistics’ projected the welfare and well-being of farmers and their population range for 2050. [84820] families. [75408] Mr Paice: The Office for National Statistics produce Mr Paice: In 2009 the Farm Crisis Network published population projections for the UK based on a set of a report entitled ’Stress and Loss: A report on the demographic assumptions. Their principal projection impact of bovine TB on farming families’: for the UK in 2050 is 78.4 million. Population projections http://www.farmcrisisnetwork.org.uk/tb_support become increasingly uncertain the further they are carried DEFRA has since worked with this charity to set up forward and the long-term figures should be treated a free business support service for TB-affected farmers. with great caution. Our food security depends on access to the world Dangerous Dogs market; and our domestic food industry needs to be able to compete on the world stage. In a world where Huw Irranca-Davies: To ask the Secretary of State climate instability can disrupt patterns of production, for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what recent food security cannot be delivered from a narrow, self- discussions she has had with the Association of Chief interested, national protectionist stance, or by Police Officers on dangerous dogs. [81043] recommending self-sufficiency. Mr Paice: Over the last months, my noble Friend Earlier this year the Government’s chief scientist, Lord Henley, the then Parliamentary Under-Secretary Sir John Beddington, published a Foresight report into (Lords), has met with the Assistant Chief Constable of the Future of Food and Farming which looked at the the North Wales police force to discuss the issue of challenges today and in the future. It explored how we dangerous dogs. Additionally, the Association of Chief can feed a global population of 9 billion by 2050 Police Officers have been engaged in stakeholder meetings, healthily and sustainably and identified hunger and including one held most recently, on the subject of environmental degradation as the key problems we face. irresponsible dog ownership which was chaired by my The Foresight world population figures are derived noble Friend, Lord Taylor of Holbeach. from United Nations projections. 275W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 276W

As an immediate response to the report, DEFRA Mr Paice: The Department has not received any have signed up to a Foresight Action Plan which will specific evidence of on-farm burial causing harm to include: public health or the environment since it was banned in championing an integrated approach to food security; 2003 under the EU Animal By-Products (ABP) Regulation pressing for integration of agricultural GHGs into UNFCCC 1774/2002 (and continued in its successor regulation process; 1069/2009). The ban was made on a precautionary basis taking forward Nagoya work on international biodiversity; influenced by the evidence provided in a number of promoting the importance of sustainable intensification; scientific opinions from the European Food Safety pressing for trade liberalisation and CAP/CFP reform; Authority (EFSA) and its predecessor the Scientific Steering Committee. The evidence relating to those showcasing what can be achieved on food waste reduction within the UK and share best practice; and opinions identified the following uncertainties: increasing the productivity and competitiveness of UK food location of burial sites; and farming and ensure that agriculture and the food sector potential for transmission of Transmissible Spongiform can contribute fully to the green economy. Encephalopathies (TSEs) from specified risk material buried near the surface was poorly characterised; Forestry Commission: Termination of Employment extent to which infectivity would be reduced by burial; Fiona O’Donnell: To ask the Secretary of State for penetration of prions into leachates and groundwater; Environment, Food and Rural Affairs how much her dangers arising from “re-engineering” in areas where Department has spent on exit costs for staff leaving the previous burial of TSE contaminated material had occurred. Forestry Commission in the last year. [84638] Palm Oil Mr Paice: Following the reductions agreed at the Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Secretary of State for spending review and in line with the Government’s Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what recent determination to tackle the national deficit, the Forestry steps she has taken to encourage food companies to Commission has been provided with £4.9 million this source palm oil from sustainable sources. [84747] financial year from the DEFRA Modernisation Fund to support a programme of voluntary early exits, to be Mr Paice: In May 2011 DEFRA published a study spent by 31 March 2012. In addition, the Forestry which mapped UK palm oil supply chains. The project Commission, a non-ministerial department responsible looked at how much palm oil we use, in what for operating within its budget allocation, has committed products, where it comes from and how much could be £0.1 million from its own budget for voluntary early considered sustainable. It also looked at the potential exits over this same period. actions that could be undertaken to move towards the Forests UK sourcing only sustainably produced palm oil. The project involved businesses from across the industry Mary Creagh: To ask the Secretary of State for and its report is available on the research section of Environment, Food and Rural Affairs whether her DEFRA’s website. Department plans to consult on the interim findings of Following publication of this study, we have been the independent panel on forestry. [84657] investigating possible further action in two main areas: Work with business groups to explore options for a collaborative Mr Paice: The Independent Panel on Forestry’s final voluntary commitment on sustainability of UK palm oil consumption; report is due in spring 2012, although we understand and that it will publish a progress report very soon. It is for Developing the business case for including sustainable palm oil the Panel to decide on what consultation it will do as requirements in Government Buying Standards. part of its work. Reed Gangmasters Licensing Authority Brandon Lewis: To ask the Secretary of State for Mrs Glindon: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what estimate Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what assessment she has made of the proportion of thatching reed used she has made of the possible effect of the relocation of in England which was sourced from the UK in each the Gangmasters Licensing Authority from her year since 2006. [82719] Department to the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills on the activities of unlicensed Mr Paice: The Government have made no assessment gangmasters in the agricultural sector. [78036] of the proportion of thatching reed used or sourced in the UK. Mr Paice: There are currently no plans to relocate the Gangmasters Licensing Authority (GLA) from DEFRA Sky Lanterns to the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills (BIS). Therefore, no assessment has been made of the Mr Laurence Robertson: To ask the Secretary of effect this might have. State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what progress has been made on regulating the use of Livestock: Waste Disposal Chinese lanterns in order to protect livestock on farms; and if she will make a statement. [82204] Roger Williams: To ask the Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs whether her Mr Paice: We share farmers’ concern about the potential Department has received any evidence of harm to risks of sky lanterns (also known as Chinese lanterns). public health or the environment as a result of the We are continuing to work with other Departments and burial of fallen stock on a farm. [R] [83931] the agricultural industry to address them. 277W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 278W

Our current approach is to raise public awareness of the criteria, a badge will be awarded. The application the potential dangers posed by sky lanterns (and to form for the WLA badge is available on the DEFRA focus on voluntary action with the aim of influencing website at: consumer behaviour). I wrote to the British Hospitality http://archive.defra.gov.uk/foodfarm/farmmanage/working/ Association in the summer to advise its membership of wla/ hotels, restaurants and other venues of the problems they cause, principally the harm to livestock and litter and to ask that they discourage customers from using these lanterns. DEFRA also issued a press release earlier BUSINESS, INNOVATION AND SKILLS this month for bonfire night to warn people of the harm Arts sky lanterns can cause. We are also pursuing other voluntary options and Stephen Timms: To ask the Secretary of State for working closely with the National Farmers Union and Business, Innovation and Skills what assessment he has the Women’s Farming Union as they gather the evidence made of the effectiveness of the current Standard necessary to justify any potential future ban. These two Industrial Classification codes in quantifying the organisations are doing a sterling job in raising awareness economic contribution of the creative industries. of the risks posed by sky lanterns and urging support [84950] for local farmers. In parallel, the Department for Business Innovation Mr Prisk [holding answer 5 December 2011]: Creative and Skills is raising the issue with the Commission and industries are a collection of specialised business activities exploring the views of other member states. reaching across the whole range of industrial sectors including: Sustainable Development printing and fashion in the manufacturing sector; retail of art and antiques; Justin Tomlinson: To ask the Secretary of State for architectural and design services; and Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what steps she is publishing and advertising. taking to tackle the challenges of population growth for sustainable development ahead of the United As this group of industries is so wide and detailed the Nations Conference on Sustainable Development; and standard industrial classification system (SIC) is never going to be ideal for capturing it entirely. if she will make a statement. [78804] The Department for Culture, Media and Sport (DCMS) Mr Paice: The birth of the ’seven billionth baby’ on have policy responsibility for creative industries and, in 31 October served to emphasise the challenges that we close consultation with a number of other Government face in providing a prosperous, sustainable future for a Departments including BIS, have formed a SIC-based rapidly growing global population. Natural resources definition. DCMS will be publishing a statistical bulletin are neither inexhaustible nor free. At Rio+20 (the United on the creative industries on 8 December. Nations Conference on Sustainable Development), we Billing must make the case for a greener global economy—showing that growth need not occur at a cost to the environment, that this growth can be inclusive, and that sustainability Caroline Nokes: To ask the Secretary of State for is the foundation for long-term prosperity. We must also Business, Innovation and Skills how many claims have make clear that the major global challenges facing been made under the Late Payment of Commercial us—for example, food security, environmental degradation, Debt (Interest) Act 1998 in each year since the Act was climate change and poverty eradication—are inextricably passed. [84870] linked, and that we will not succeed in tackling them Mr Prisk: The Late Payment of Commercial Debt piecemeal. (Interest) Act 1998 provides suppliers with the right to The UK is pushing for an ambitious outcome at claim interest for late payment and reasonable debt Rio+20—we should agree tangible actions that make a recovery costs. difference. Engagement and preparations are under way; Government do not hold a record of the number of we have submitted initial ideas to the UN ahead of the claims as they are made by the supplier direct to the Conference, and are developing the UK’s position and purchaser: the supplier informs the purchaser that payment engaging with EU and international partners. is overdue and seeks both prompt payment and the World War II: Medals claim for interest and recovery costs. It is only where the purchaser does not pay the interest and/or debt recovery Ian Austin: To ask the Secretary of State for costs that the supplier can then pursue their claim Environment, Food and Rural Affairs what steps her through the courts. Claims of this type are not centrally Department is taking to encourage former members of recorded. Guidance on late payment legislation can be the Women’s Land Army and Timber Corps to apply found at: for the Women’s Land Army and Timber Corps badge. www.bis.gov.uk/files/file37581.pdf [85319] It is important to note that late payment legislation is intended to be a deterrent against late payment, not a Mr Paice: Since the launch of the award in 2008 more routine way of dealing with an overdue invoice. Suppliers than 35,000 badges have been issued to former members should therefore reference the Act and the costs of of the Women’s Land Army and Women’s Timber overdue payment in all invoicing to make clear to the Corps (WLA). DEFRA continues to receive a number purchaser when payment is due and the additional costs of requests for badges and where the application meets of failing to pay on time. 279W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 280W

In that context, it is estimated that over half of UK them locally. To ensure services are readily accessible and meet a transactions are not covered by pre-agreed terms, and variety of needs, our services include online tools, tutorials and Barclays estimate that only one in 10 suppliers regularly case studies, and will be accessible using mobile technology. credit checks their customers. This suggests that there is Established a national helpline to help people find what they much suppliers can do to improve their management of need on the web and for those who cannot access the web. supplier relationships and that is why we have joined Encouraged businesses to seek a business mentor to help them forces with the Institute of Credit Management and the develop their business and encouraging mentoring organisations UK’s leading business representative and financial bodies to offer access to their mentors through a mentoring portal, to produce and promote the highly regarded Managing www.mentorsme.co.uk Cashflow guides: Almost concluded the procurement of a new Business Coaching www.creditmanagement.org.uk/bisguides.htm for Growth (BCG) Programme to enable small businesses with high growth potential to realise their potential. Business: Government Assistance Capita Bill Esterson: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills what assessment he has Keith Vaz: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, made of the adequacy of support available for those Innovation and Skills how many contracts his (a) wishing to start a business and (b) running a Department has awarded to Capita since May 2010; and what the (a) purpose, (b) monetary value and (c) business. [85217] net worth was of each such contract. [84743] Mr Prisk: The information is as follows. Mr Davey: I refer the right hon. Member to the (a) The Department for Business, Innovation and answer I gave on 17 October 2011, Official Report, Skills consulted on the effectiveness of business support column 748W, to the hon. Member for Stoke-on-Trent delivery and what improvements could be made to the Central (Tristram Hunt). Business Link service with representatives from; The Institute of Chartered Accountants in England and Construction: Billing Wales, Federation of Small Businesses, Engineering Employers Federation, Confederation of British Industry, Derek Twigg: To ask the Secretary of State for Federation of Private Business, British Chambers of Business, Innovation and Skills what recent assessment Commerce and Institute of Directors, with a group of he has made of the effect on sub-contractors of late or independent entrepreneurs including members of the non-payment of bills by larger contractors in the Secretary of State’s Entrepreneurs Forum, and through construction industry. [84456] the business representative bodies, via workshops in every English region involving business support Mr Prisk: The impact assessment for the Revision of practitioners, providers (including; enterprise agencies), the Scheme for Construction Contracts (England and local authorities and small and medium-sized enterprises Wales) Regulations 1998 Construction Contract (England) (SMEs). Exclusion Order 2011 estimated that commercial disputes (b) Improvements identified included: A preference between contractors and sub-contractors had an estimated for advice to business provided by peer networks, financial cost of £40 million in 2010. The exact proportion professionals and intermediaries such as, accountants of these disputes relating directly to late or non-payment and banks; Government funding for targeted face to is unknown, as is the proportion of the disputes costs face advice to be aimed at SMEs with high growth that fall on sub-contractors as opposed to contractors. potential; easier access to business information, advice Amendments to the above legislation were commenced on regulation and Government transactions on the in October aimed at mitigating the cost of such disputes. Business Link website and the ability to personalise There is also evidence that payments within the content; Government not to duplicate private sector construction sector are improving relative to other sectors provision. in the UK. pH Group, a subsidiary of Experian, provide On 14 November 2011 we launched a new approach data by industry sector in respect of days beyond term to the way people receive the information, advice and (DBT) payments, i.e. the number of days later than guidance they need to start and grow their business. contract terms by which invoices were paid. The latest This was developed with experts in the relevant subject data show that construction was the only sector where matter and tested with prospective SME users. The DBT fell over the last quarter (Q3 2011) which is the mentoring web portal was developed in conjunction second consecutive quarterly fall in DBT for the with British Banking Association. construction sector. The number of days beyond term Our new approach is based on: digital services which for the construction sector is now 13.15 days, which is provide high quality information and advice, accessible the second lowest (behind only the agricultural sector) when businesses need them; and face to face advice out of the 11 sectors reviewed, and well below the UK provided by business people for business people, not by average of 16.62 days. the public sector. We have: Departmental Eggs Revamped the Business Link website www.businesslink.gov.uk Huw Irranca-Davies: To ask the Secretary of State introduced two new online services; a dedicated “My New Business” for Business, Innovation and Skills what steps he is area developed by experts to provide training, tools and checklists for those looking to start a business; and the new Growth and taking to ensure that the same standards of animal Improvement Service which will provide new tools to help businesses welfare for whole eggs apply to imported liquefied eggs understand the issues they face, plus a business support and an procured by (a) his Department and (b) public bodies events finder tool so businesses can find out what is available to for which he is responsible. [83778] 281W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 282W

Mr Davey: The Departments contracted catering and inception of the Public Sector Food Procurement Initiative conference supplier Baxter storey only use pasteurised (PSFPI) in 2003 and now the Government Buying liquid egg that is bought in the UK and is Lion Brand Standard, Baxter Storey has operated a policy of full standard. Baxter Storey do not buy non UK whole egg compliance in all its Government contracts. or liquid egg. Information for non departmental public bodies is Information for non departmental bodies is not held not held centrally and could be provided only at centrally and could be provided only at disproportionate disproportionate cost. cost. Departmental Food Departmental Procurement Huw Irranca-Davies: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills what proportion of David Simpson: To ask the Secretary of State for food sourced by (a) his Department and (b) public Business, Innovation and Skills what procedures his bodies for which he is responsible was procured from Department has put in place to ensure value for money UK food producers in the latest period for which on purchases; and what savings have been identified figures are available. [83779] using those procedures in the last year. [82316]

Mr Davey: The Department’s catering and conference Mr Davey: In August 2011, the Minister for the services are contracted to Baxter Storey who source the Cabinet Office and Paymaster General, the right hon. food used. Member for Horsham (Mr Maude), announced that Currently 85% of all produce and 92% of indigenous the Efficiency and Reform Group’s new measures had produce is procured from UK food producers. saved £3.75 billion over 2010/11. Information for non departmental public bodies is This impact was assessed using methodologies in the not held centrally and could be provided only at following table. The assessment has been independently disproportionate cost. verified by Government auditors who found the benefits assertions to be fairly calculated and presented. Huw Irranca-Davies: To ask the Secretary of State These savings are borne out in Department accounts. for Business, Innovation and Skills what steps (a) his The table on page 79 of the annual report and accounts Department and (b) public bodies for which he is 2010-11 (HC1001) reports that non-pay gross administration responsible are taking to ensure that they meet the costs for BIS reduced from £187 million in 2009-10 to Government’s buying standards for food and catering. £140 million in 2010-11. Figures in this report are [83780] prepared in accordance with HM Treasury’s Financial Reporting Manual for central Government Departments Mr Davey: The central Departments conference and and associated Treasury resource accounting and budgeting catering is contracted out to Baxter Storey. Since the guidance.

Activity and calculation method Area Activity description Evidence base/calculation

Consulting Government put in place a moratorium on new consulting Savings are calculated by subtracting total departmental spend, and extensions to existing contracts. Where spend reported spend on consultancy for 2010/11 from total was considered operationally critical (for example, where it departmental reported spend on consultancy for 2009/10. might put at risk critical services) an exception process To reduce the risk of costs shifting between categories, existed for Department Ministers to sign off expenditure we also monitored expenditure on other professional over £20,000. services categories, including contingent labour.

Crown Commercial Government have renegotiated deals with some of the The method of calculation varies according to the largest suppliers to Government. initiative that yields the saving, but was based on cash releasing savings against a baseline of what would have otherwise been spent. This was often price savings against the previous price paid. Savings agreed with suppliers are recorded in memoranda of understanding as guaranteed-in-year or conditional-in-year savings. Realised savings were subsequently tracked back to departmental verification of supplier progress reports.

Contingent Labour Government have significantly cut the number of temporary Savings are calculated by subtracting total departmental staff. reported spend on contingent labour for 2010/11 from total departmental reported spend on contingent labour for 2009/10.

Communications Government froze all new marketing spend unless it is an Calculations compare departmental spend on marketing operational necessity. Where spend was proposed, ministerial and advertising through COI for 2010/11 with that for sign-off was required for £20,000 or above. 2009/10. Centralising Procurement Government has started to centralise spend on common For each initiative, calculations are performed using goods and services to drive down prices. These savings individual benefit methodologies that set out how savings derive from the 10 categories of expenditure targeted for will be calculated against a 2009/10 price baseline. centralisation, and relate to price savings through increased Evidence is management information provided by aggregation. suppliers. 283W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 284W

Activity and calculation method Area Activity description Evidence base/calculation

ICT We implemented: (a) a moratorium on all new ICT spend Calculations are based on departmental reports of above £1 million; and (b) a review of all ongoing ICT spend that has not proceeded. Spend that has not gone commitments. Departments also reported those projects ahead in 2010/11 is recorded, as a result of stopping or that were closed before undergoing the review. reducing spend. Further, sustainable savings are targeted through the Government ICT strategy.

Major Projects We reviewed the Government’s biggest projects to see where HMT have provided assurance that the relevant amounts 2010/11 costs could practically be reduced within contractual were removed from departmental budgets following constraints, or wasteful projects stopped altogether. We the Major Projects-related negotiations. have halted or curtailed spend on four projects: 14-19 Reform—£60 million Identity Cards—£50 million Highways Agency Projects—£54 million Whole Farm—£5 million We have redacted £22 million of potential double counting from these figures, that arises between this work and our supplier renegotiation work stream. £14.9 million arises from the Home Office National Identity Cards and £6.7 million from DEFRA Whole Farm.

Property We put in place national property controls such that signature Calculations are property by property based on the of new property leases or lease extensions were approved amount Departments have reported saved through the centrally. It has not always been possible to net off all costs Government’s property database by non-renewal of associated with vacating buildings. However, we have also property leases at lease breaks or upon lease expiry. not claimed savings in respect of revenue from property disposals.

Stewart Hosie: To ask the Secretary of State for have owed money to the Export Credits Guarantee Business, Innovation and Skills which services his Department due to defaults by the Arab Organization Department has outsourced in each of the last five for Industrialization since 1981. [84120] years. [84237] Mr Davey: None. Mr Davey: In 2007, the Department outsourced the assessment of what reasonable adjustments were Export Credit Guarantees: Libya recommended for staff with disabilities or long-term health conditions. Lorely Burt: To ask the Secretary of State for The Department has outsourced no other services in Business, Innovation and Skills what projects backed each of the last five years. by the Export Credits Guarantee Department involved exports to or investments in Libya since 2000-01. Derby Economic Task Force [84109]

Shabana Mahmood: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr Davey: The Export Credits Guarantee Department Business, Innovation and Skills pursuant to the answer has not supported any export contracts to or investments of 3 November 2011, Official Report, column 762W, on in Libya since 2000-01 to date. rolling stock: procurement, if he will publish the minutes, actions and attendees of the Derby Economic Fish: Procurement Task Force meeting held on 31 October 2011. [84597] Fiona O’Donnell: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr Prisk: There was not a Derby Economic Task Business, Innovation and Skills what proportion of fish Force meeting on 31 October. There was a sub group sourced by (a) his Department and (b) those agencies meeting about supply chains on that day. The Derbyshire/ and non-departmental public bodies for which he is Nottinghamshire Chamber of Commerce are the lead responsible are procured from Marine Stewardship organisation. Council approved sustainable sources [83910]

Export Credit Guarantees Mr Davey: The central Department’s conference and catering is contracted out to BaxterStorey who are Jeremy Lefroy: To ask the Secretary of State for currently sourcing 35% of fish from Marine Stewardship Business, Innovation and Skills how much outstanding Council-approved sustainable sources. debt is owed to the UK through the Export Credits I have approached the chief executives of the Guarantee, broken down by country. [84857] Department’s executive agencies and they will respond to the hon. Member directly. Information for non- Mr Davey: I refer my hon. Friend to the answer I gave departmental public bodies is not held centrally and to the hon. Member for Carmarthen East and Dinefwr could be provided only at disproportionate cost. (Jonathan Edwards), on 9 November 2011, Official Letter from David Williams, dated 5 December 2011: Report, column 375W. Thank you for your question addressed to the Secretary of Export Credit Guarantees: Arab States State for Business, Innovation and Skills regarding what proportion offish sourced by (a) his Department and (b) those agencies and non-departmental public bodies for which he is responsible are Lorely Burt: To ask the Secretary of State for procured from Marine Stewardship Council approved sustainable Business, Innovation and Skills which sovereign states sources. (83910) 285W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 286W

The UK Space Agency of the Department for Business, Innovation The Met Office itself does not procure any fish. However, and Skills has procured no fish from Marine Stewardship Council catering is provided by Eurest Services at the Met Office Headquarters approved sustainable sources. in Exeter. Eurest Services does not source any fish products from The UK Space Agency are tenants in Polaris House, Swindon, the Marine Stewardship Council (MSC) “Fish to Avoid” list. in which catering services are supplied by the Research Councils Moreover, I understand the majority of Eurest’s fish supply has UK, who have a catering contract with Baxter Storey. All food MSC accreditation and that it is currently reviewing the MSC procurement is made by the catering contractor. “Fish to Eat” list against the remainder of its supply. Letter from John Alty, dated 5 December 2011: I hope this helps. Letter from David Evans, dated 29 November 2011: I am responding in respect of the Intellectual Property Office (IPO) to your Parliamentary Question tabled for 25 November You tabled the following Parliamentary Question on 25 November 2011, asking the Secretary of State, Department for Business, 2011: Innovation & Skills, what proportion of fish sourced by (a) his “To ask the Secretary of State, Department of Business, Innovation Department and (b) those agencies and non-departmental public and Skills, what proportion of fish sourced by (a) his Department bodies for which he is responsible are procured from Marine and (b) those agencies and non-departmental public bodies for Stewardship Council approved sustainable sources. which he is responsible are procured from Marine Stewardship The Intellectual Property Office (IPO) does not conduct any Council approved sustainable sources”. food related procurement activities. The IPO has access to a Land Registry, who are an Executive Agency within the catering contract owned by the Office for National Statistics Department for Business, Innovation and Skills, do not directly (ONS), for the provision of hospitality and restaurant facilities source fish however we do have one staff canteen, for which the for IPO staff. ONS confirm that currently the proportion of fish contract for catering has been outsourced. Our catering provider procured form Marine Stewardship Council approved sustainable sources 100 percent of the fresh fish served from Marine Stewardship sources is zero. Therefore the proportion offish procured from Council certified suppliers. marine Stewardship council approved sustainable sources is zero Letter from Peter Mason, dated 30 November 2011: for the IPO. I am responding in respect of the National Measurement Letter from Geoff Russell, dated 5 December 2011: Office (NMO) to your Parliamentary Question tabled on 25 November Thank you for your question addressed to the Secretary of 2011, asking the Secretary of State, Department for Business, State for Business, Innovation and Skills asking the Skills Funding Innovation and Skills what proportion of fish sourced for his Agency (the Agency) what proportion of fish sourced by (a) his Department and the Agencies and non-departmental public bodies Department and (b) those agencies and non-departmental public for which he is responsible are procured from Marine Stewardship bodies for which he is responsible are procured from Marine Council approved sustainable sources. Stewardship Council approved sustainable sources (83910) NMO has responsibility for its site in Teddington that also Please be advised that the Agency does not directly purchase houses the National Physical Laboratory (NPL), a Government fish. Its caterers are committed to responsible sourcing and all Owned Contractor Operated body. We provide restaurant and fish products are sourced within UK and international regulatory hospitality facilities for NPL and NMO through a total facilities guidelines. management contract. We have received verbal assurance from the catering sub-contractor, Baxter-Storey, that 100% of the fish Letter from Dr VanessaLaurence CB, dated 30 November used in delivering the catering and hospitality service are procured 2011: from Marine Stewardship Council approved sustainable sources. As Director General and Chief Executive of Ordnance Survey, Letter from Gareth Jones, dated 28 November 2011: I have been asked to reply to your question with the information I am replying on behalf of Companies House to your Parliamentary on what proportion of fish sourced by Ordnance Survey is Question tabled on 25 November 2011, UIN 83910 to the Secretary procured from Marine Stewardship Council {MSC) approved of State for Business, Innovation and Skills. sustainable sources. Companies House does not procure seafood directly but our Ordnance Survey’s procurement of food is managed by a third contracted catering provider only procures fish from sustainable party. Their seafood supplier is recognised as a Key Foodservice sources approved by the Marine Stewardship Council. Supplier by the Marine Stewardship Council offering MSC certified products within their chain of custody framework. Fossil Fuels: Export Credit Guarantees It is estimated that Ordnance Survey’s catering provider is currently sourcing 35% of its fish from MSC approved sustainable Zac Goldsmith: To ask the Secretary of State for sources. This percentage is, I understand, likely to increase soon, Business, Innovation and Skills pursuant to the answer as the company responsible for managing Ordnance Survey’s of 10 October 2011, Official Report, column 271W, on catering facilities are currently in the process of achieving ‘company fossil fuels: export credit guarantees, whether he plans wide’ MSC chain of custody accreditation. In addition, I have been informed that no fish that sit in the red category of the to announce his decision before the Christmas recess. online MSC fish database are served by our supplier. [84020] Letter from Stephen Speed, dated November 2011: Mr Davey: No firm date has been fixed. The Secretary of State, Department for Business, Innovation and Skills has asked me to reply to your question, what proportion Government Departments: Procurement of fish sourced by (a) his Department and (b) those agencies and non-departmental public bodies for which he is responsible are Chi Onwurah: To ask the Secretary of State for procured from Marine Stewardship Council approved sustainable sources. Business, Innovation and Skills what contribution his Department has made towards meeting the The Insolvency Service Executive Agency of the Department Government’s target of procuring 25 per cent. of for Business, Innovation and Skills has procured no fish from Marine Stewardship Council approved sustainable sources. central Government supplies from small and medium- sized enterprises. [84879] The Insolvency Service no longer has canteen facilities. Letter from John Hirst, dated 29 November 2011: Mr Davey: The Department in financial year 2010-11 I am replying on behalf of the Met Office to your Parliamentary spent £48.2 million directly with small and medium-sized Question tabled on 25 November 2011, UIN83910 to the Secretary enterprises, equating to 19% of total procurement spend of State for Business, Innovation and Skills. for that period. 287W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 288W

In September 2011, the latest period for which figures Manufacturing Advisory Service: Peterborough are available, the Department spent £3,789,000 directly with small and medium-sized enterprises, equating to Mr Stewart Jackson: To ask the Secretary of State 18.35% of total procurement spend. for Business, Innovation and Skills what plans the Manufacturing Advisory Service has to provide Groceries Code Adjudicator Bill assistance to manufacturers in Peterborough; and if he will make a statement. [84096] Nic Dakin: To ask the Secretary of State for Mr Prisk: A new Manufacturing Advisory Service Business, Innovation and Skills whether he plans to (MAS) national service will launch on 1 January 2012. increase the power of suppliers in relation to large The national service will be delivered locally by people retailers under the Groceries Code Adjudicator Bill. who understand the dynamics of their local economies [83119] while leveraging leading edge national resources. MAS will work with the Cambridge and Peterborough Local Mr Davey: By enforcing and overseeing the Groceries Enterprise partnership (LEP) and regional sector bodies Code, the Groceries Code Adjudicator will strengthen to ensure provision is driving local impacts, both in the position of suppliers in relation to large retailers. terms of priorities and local tailoring of services. New Businesses: Capital Investment Nic Dakin: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills (1) whether the Chi Onwurah: To ask the Secretary of State for Groceries Code Adjudicator Bill will have provision to Business, Innovation and Skills what steps he is taking protect the anonymity of suppliers when requesting an to encourage private sector investment in high-risk investigation be launched; [83120] start-up businesses; and if he will make a statement. (2) what steps he is taking to ensure that the criteria [84889] for launching an investigation under the provisions of Mr Prisk: Government recognise that high risk, the Groceries Code Adjudicator Bill do not adversely innovative start-ups have the potential for high growth affect the ability of a supplier to request an and job creation. investigation anonymously. [83121] Government support tax incentives including the Enterprise Investment Scheme (EIS) and Venture Capital Mr Davey: Protecting the confidentiality of suppliers Trusts (VCTs) to encourage private investment in start-up who raise a complaint will be both a power and a duty firms. The March 2011 Budget announced changes to of the Adjudicator. the rules and capacity relating to EIS and VCTs to simplify and increase the incentive for investors to use Nic Dakin: To ask the Secretary of State for these schemes. Business, Innovation and Skills whether the Groceries The Autumn Statement went even further in the Code Adjudicator will be given the ability to launch an targeting of relief toward start-up firms. The Seed investigation if he has reasonable grounds to suspect a Enterprise Investment Scheme (SEIS) which will be breach of the Groceries Code regardless of where the introduced from April 2012 aims to encourage investment evidence has originated. [83122] into new early stage companies by providing a higher rate of income tax relief of 50% (compared to the Mr Davey: The Groceries Code Adjudicator will be normal EIS rate of 30%) for individuals who invest in able to launch an investigation based on information qualifying seed companies. To kick start the scheme the that is publicly available, or information provided by a Government are offering a capital gains tax exemption supplier. The Government have agreed to consider the on any gains realised in the year 2012-13 that are Business, Innovation and Skills Select Committee’s invested through SEIS in the same year. proposals that information provided by trade bodies Government continue to support the early stage market and industry whistleblowers should also be considered. by leveraging in private investment through Enterprise Capital Funds (ECFs). ECFs invest £250,000 to £2 million Manufacturing Advisory Service: Redditch in small, early stage businesses. 10 funds with a total of £250 million to invest have been established and a further £200 million committed to leverage an additional Karen Lumley: To ask the Secretary of State for £100 million of private sector funding. Business, Innovation and Skills what plans the Manufacturing Advisory Service has to provide Government are also supporting the development of assistance to manufacturers in Redditch; and if he will a new £50 million Business Angel Co-investment Fund make a statement. [84823] as part of a successful bid to the Regional Growth Fund. The fund will be available to invest, alongside Business Angel networks or syndicates, into eligible Mr Prisk: A new Manufacturing Advisory Service start-ups and is due to launch by the end of the year. (MAS) national service will launch on 1 January 2012. The national service will be delivered locally by people Overseas Trade: China who understand the dynamics of their local economies while leveraging leading edge national resources. MAS Julian Smith: To ask the Secretary of State for will work with the Worcester and Greater Birmingham Business, Innovation and Skills what process UK Trade and Solihull Local Enterprise Partnerships and regional and Investment has put in place to track the economic sector bodies to ensure provision is driving local impacts, plans of Chinese provinces and identify opportunities both in terms of priorities and local tailoring of services. for trade for UK firms. [84535] 289W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 290W

Mr Prisk: Identifying business opportunities for UK Those individuals who go on to make a claim to firms across China is a key strategic driver of UK Trade benefit will enter a personalised system of support and Investment’s work. One aspect is a major regional within Jobcentre Plus that allows more flexibility to cities initiative which has identified significant opportunities Jobcentre Plus. This framework allows advisers greater for UK business across 35 Chinese regional cities. discretion to draw down from a flexible menu of support The addition of some 50 FCO frontline staff into the options that is tailored to the needs of both the individual China Network will also increase our reach, engagement and the local labour market. and understanding, and allow us to build closer relationships In addition, Jobcentre Plus advisers will signpost with China’s fastest-growing regions and cities in support claimants to appropriate specialised agencies which can of UK business. help claimants with particular skills or professional capabilities to find relevant suitable work quickly.Jobcentre Julian Smith: To ask the Secretary of State for Plus advisers will also, as appropriate, signpost people Business, Innovation and Skills how many trade shows to opportunities for starting up their own business in China UK Trade and Investment has attended; and through measures like enterprise clubs and/or the new in which provinces. [84536] enterprise allowance.

Mr Prisk: In 2011-12 there are 19 exhibitions in Regional Assistance: Northern Ireland China in UK Trade and Investment’s published Tradeshow Access Programme (TAP), comprising: eight in Beijing, Vernon Coaker: To ask the Secretary of State for eight in Shanghai, two in Guangzhou and one in Shenzhen. Business, Innovation and Skills what funding Northern In addition, TAP has agreed support for individual UK Ireland has received as a result of its automatic assisted exhibitors at a further 10 exhibitions: four in Shanghai, area status in each of the last three years. [84452] four in Shenzhen, three in Guangzhou and one in Zhuhai. UKTI officials also support UK commercial Mr Prisk: This is a devolved matter which is the interests at other exhibitions in different parts of China responsibility of the Northern Ireland Executive. according to their duties. Postal Services: Dangerous Dogs Vernon Coaker: To ask the Secretary of State for Business, Innovation and Skills (1) what assessment he Michael Connarty: To ask the Secretary of State for has made of progress with the review of automatic Business, Innovation and Skills what contribution he assisted area status for Northern Ireland; and if he will has made to the Home Office consultation on make a statement; [84453] anti-social behaviour in respect of the risk posed by (2) what assessment he has made of the dangerous dogs to Royal Mail deliveries to customers. consequences to Northern Ireland of the removal of [85299] automatic assisted area status; [84454] (3) if he will undertake an equality impact Mr Davey: I have not made any contribution to the assessment of the potential effect of the removal of Home Office consultation on antisocial behaviour in automatic assisted area status for Northern Ireland. respect of the risk posed by dangerous dogs to Royal [84455] Mail deliveries to customers. I understand that this consultation closed on the Mr Prisk: The removal of the automatic assisted area 17 May 2011. It would have been an operational matter status for Northern Ireland is one of four proposed for Royal Mail to decide to contribute to the consultation, changes to the Industrial Development Act 1982. The in terms of dangerous dogs, had it felt it appropriate to Government’s consultation covering these proposed changes do so. closed on 2 November 2011 and we are on target to Private Sector: Employment publish a response within three months of the consultation close. Mr Amess: To ask the Secretary of State for An impact assessment for all four proposed changes Business, Innovation and Skills what assistance is was included at annex 3 of the Industrial Development offered to former public sector workers to help them Act Revisions consultation document. The post 2013 find work in the private sector. [83704] allocation implications for Northern Ireland of removing the automatic 100% assisted area coverage will not be Chris Grayling: I have been asked to reply. known until the new Regional Aid Guidelines are The primary responsibility for supporting public sector implemented by the European Commission and we workers made redundant rests with the public sector start to draw up the 2014-2020 assisted areas map. An employer, supported by Jobcentre Plus as appropriate. economic and equality impact assessment will be Employers have a variety of support in place ranging undertaken at this time. from internal redeployment managers to externally contracted outplacement services. A cross Government Regional Growth Fund career transitions service is also being piloted in London which provides redeployment assistance both inside Mr Marsden: To ask the Secretary of State for and beyond the public sector. Business, Innovation and Skills pursuant to his answer Everybody who loses their job as a result of workforce of 7 November 2011, Official Report, column 112W, on management measures—including former public sector Regional Growth Fund, (1) how many meetings the workers—is able to access support from the Jobcentre Ministerial Group held to consider the panel’s Plus led Rapid Response Service both during their recommendations; [81051] redundancy notice period and, for those who require it, (2) how many meetings took place; on which days; up to 13-weeks after their last day of work. and which Ministers attended each meeting. [81052] 291W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 292W

Mr Prisk [holding answer 14 November 2011]: In line Mr Prisk: The following table gives total figures for with the constitutional convention of collective decision- Regional Selective Assistance, Selective Finance for making, and section 2 of the Ministerial Code, the Investment in England (SFIE) and Grant for Business Government do not disclose details of the internal Investment (GBI) provided in north-east England, process through which decisions are taken. combined with the funding for the One North East (ONE) regional development agency established in Mr Marsden: To ask the Secretary of State for April 1999. Business, Innovation and Skills pursuant to the answer of 7 November 2011, Official Report, columns £ million 111-12W, on Regional Growth Fund, what the monetary value is of the provisional allocations for the 1996/97 22.7 successful bids to the second round of the Regional 1997/98 36.0 Growth Fund in each region. [81053] 1998/99 22.8 1999/2000 110.6 Mr Prisk [holding answer 14 November 2011]: Given 2000/01 121.2 as follows is the regional breakdown of provisional 2001/02 190.9 (subject to the outcome of due diligence) allocations for 2002/03 231.5 winning bids to the second round of the Regional 2003/04 247.5 Growth Fund. 2004/05 251.2 2005/06 250.9 £ million 2006/07 294.5 2007/08 293.9 North-west 227 2008/09 267.0 North-east 93 2009/10 261.0 Yorkshire and Humber 143 2010/11 201.1 West midlands 100 East midlands 67 In 2011/12 the current funding allocation to ONE, London, south-east and east of England 1113 SFIE and GBI is £100.4 million. In addition, following South-west 88 the completion of rounds 1 and 2 of the bids under the Other bids—national 119 Regional Growth Fund programme, £156.9 million has 1 This includes value of bids from round 1 where the number of bids is less been allocated to the north-east (for spending between than 2. 2011/12 to 2013/14). Jessica Morden: To ask the Secretary of State for Regulation Business, Innovation and Skills how much successful bidders to the Regional Growth Fund have paid for the Chi Onwurah: To ask the Secretary of State for due diligence process to date; and what estimate his Business, Innovation and Skills what best practice Department has made of the total amount that will be timescales his Department advocates for the paid by successful bidders to complete the due introduction, removal or change of Government diligence process. [84905] regulations. [84919] Mr Prisk: 19 projects totalling £112 million, following Mr Prisk [holding answer 5 December 2011]: The the completion of due diligence, have signed final contracts Better Regulation Executive has issued guidance on a and are set to deliver 924 new or safeguarding jobs and number of relevant components of the processes for nearly 29,000 jobs in the supply chain. We expect that introducing, amending or removing Government all projects allocated conditional allocations will complete regulations. These include: due diligence and will start to receive their share of the 12 weeks for public consultation exercises £1.4 billion in the spring. The guidance as always been guidance being issued twelve weeks before regulations come clear that the cost of due diligence should be met by the into effect applicant and that due diligence costs will vary due to domestic regulations affecting business coming into effect on a commercial circumstances. Common Commencement Date post-implementation review being carried out between three Jessica Morden: To ask the Secretary of State for and five years after regulations come into effect Business, Innovation and Skills what estimate his sunset clauses having effect seven years after regulations come Department has made of the number of successful bids into effect to the Regional Growth Fund that will receive funding In practice, the total time taken for introduction, in (a) 2012-13 and (b) 2013-14. [84906] removal or change will depend on a variety of factors including the scope and complexity of the regulations, Mr Prisk: It is normal for regional growth fund whether they are domestic or EU in origin, whether a funding to be paid in arrears of private sector investment formal public consultation is required, and the type of and phased over several years. The majority of successful parliamentary procedure. bids will receive some funding each year. Renewable Energy: Export Credit Guarantees Regional Planning and Development: North East Zac Goldsmith: To ask the Secretary of State for Grahame M. Morris: To ask the Secretary of State Business, Innovation and Skills what steps he is taking for Business, Innovation and Skills how much to ensure that new trade finance products offered by Government funding for regional development has the Export Credits Guarantee Department are been provided in the North East in each year since marketed and accessible to small and medium-sized 1996. [83401] renewable energy enterprises. [84010] 293W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 294W

Mr Davey: I refer my hon. Friend for Richmond Park Regional Investment to the reply I gave to the hon. Member for Newcastle upon Tyne Central (Chi Onwurah), on 9 November 20. Sarah Newton: To ask the Chancellor of the 2011, Official Report, column 377W. Exchequer what assessment he has made of the effect The awareness campaign has included companies of fiscal policy on the level of investment in the regions. and trade associations in the renewable energy industry. [84802] Technology and Innovation Centre Danny Alexander: Returning the UK economy to Jonathan Ashworth: To ask the Secretary of State for sustainable economic growth that is more balanced Business, Innovation and Skills what recent discussions across the UK and sectors is a key priority. In the he has had on the establishment of a Technology and autumn statement, this Government took steps to encourage Innovation Centre in the East Midlands. [82798] investment and exports as a route to a more balanced economy. Mr Willetts: I have had a range of discussions on the In addition, we have continued to support investment establishment of technology and innovation centres in all places, increasing the Regional Growth Fund for including in the east midlands. England by £1 billion, plus Barnett consequentials for The network of technology and innovation centres the devolved administrations, approving two new Enterprise will be established and overseen by the Technology Zones in Lancashire and the Humber, making 100% Strategy Board and, while I will follow progress on this capital allowances available in six Enterprise Zones, and very closely, the decision on the final technology areas, funding up to six rural growth networks. together with the location of the centres, will be made by the Technology Strategy Board following a process Economic Growth of detailed discussions with the business and academic communities on the basis of where there is most potential for a centre to have a catalytic effect in stimulating 21. Karl Turner: To ask the Chancellor of the long-term economic growth. Exchequer what assessment he has made of levels of economic growth in (a) the UK and (b) other G7 Written Questions countries in the last 12 months. [84803]

Chris Ruane: To ask the Secretary of State for Miss Chloe Smith: The Government’s latest assessment Business, Innovation and Skills what proportion of of the UK economy is set out in the autumn statement. written questions for answer on a named day received a The independent Office for Budget Responsibility’s substantive answer within five working days in each of Economic and Fiscal Outlook was published alongside the last six months. [85057] the autumn statement. Mr Davey: Figures indicate that a total of 588 named The Organisation for Economic Cooperation and day parliamentary questions were due for answer by Development collates GDP data for all member countries. BIS Ministers during the period June to November These data show the UK economy growing in the most 2011. 480 (82%) received a substantive reply within five recent three quarters. The OECD’s latest forecast shows sitting days from the date the parliamentary question UK GDP growing faster than that of France, Italy, and was tabled. A total of 549 (93%) received a substantive the euro area both next year and in 2013. reply either on the date stipulated by the Member, or within five sitting days from the date stipulated. UK’s Current Account Balance The figures have been drawn from the Department’s database which, as with any large scale recording system, is subject to possible errors with data entry and processing. Mr Bone: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer what estimate he has made of the UK’s current account balance with (a) the EU and (b) non-EU countries in the last year. [84788] TREASURY Unemployment Miss Chloe Smith: In 2010 the UK had a current account deficit of £37 billion. This deficit results from 18. Pat Glass: To ask the Chancellor of the a deficit of £52 billion with the EU and a surplus of Exchequer what assessment he has made of the £16 billion with non EU countries. implications for his policies of the Office for Budget Responsibility’s forecast for unemployment in 2012. Bank Levy [84798] Danny Alexander: In line with a weaker outlook for Chris Leslie: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer GDP growth, the OBR has revised up the projected what assessment he has made of the effects of the level of unemployment over the near term. Finance Act 2011 (Bank Levy: Amendment of Netting The Government are taking steps to support private Agreements Provisions) Order 2011 on the revenue sector job creation and reduce unemployment: raised by the bank levy. [85322] Reducing red tape and facilitating SMEs access to finance through credit easing, helping businesses to grow and take on new Mr Hoban: It is estimated that there is a negligible workers; impact as the amendments simply make it clearer Implementing reforms to help people find work including how the netting agreements work in respect of these specific support for young people through the Youth Contract. transactions. 295W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 296W

Future Jobs Fund their dependency on benefits. This will help people along a journey toward financial independence from Julie Elliott: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer the state. what discussions he has had with the Secretary of State Building Societies for Work and Pensions on the effects of cancellation of the Future Jobs Fund on levels of employment. [84804] Mr Jim Cunningham: To ask the Chancellor of the Danny Alexander: The Chancellor of the Exchequer Exchequer what steps his Department has taken to and I have regular discussions with the Secretary of ensure the interests of all building societies are taken State for Work and Pensions on the economy and levels into account in his Department’s financial strategy. of employment. [84931] As announced at the autumn statement, the Government are introducing the Youth Contract which provides Mr Hoban: Ministers and officials meet regularly almost £1 billion in new funding to support up to with the Building Societies Association and individual 500,000 young people into employment and training. building societies to discuss a range of policy issues. The Youth Contract builds on work the Government The Government have been working with building are already doing to tackle youth unemployment, including societies to ensure a positive outcome in European apprenticeships, work experience places and the Work discussions on the Capital Requirements Regulation. programme, one of the largest payment-by-results Building societies have been consulted on the draft employment programmes in the world. Financial Services Bill, which requires the new regulatory The Government were right to abolish the Future authorities to publish an analysis of how draft rules Jobs Fund. It was too expensive and created too many may affect mutual and non-mutual firms differently, jobs in the public and voluntary sector that were fully and makes minor amendments to the Building Societies funded by the subsidy and therefore ceased when the Act. subsidy ran out. The YouthContract will create sustainable Building societies will be consulted on any legislation jobs in the private sector, with an estimated 160,000 introduced to implement the findings of the Independent wage incentive places to make it easier for private sector Banking Commission report. The Government will employers to take on young people. announce its response to the report by the end of this year. Universal Credit Business: Loans Stephen Timms: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer for what reason he has decided to extend the Stuart Andrew: To ask the Chancellor of the working tax credit hours rule but not to impose an Exchequer what steps he is taking to reduce the cost of hours rule in respect of receipt of universal credit. bank lending and credit for businesses. [84801] [85096] Mr Hoban: At the autumn statement the Chancellor Mr Gauke: Under the current tax credits system, of the Exchequer announced the launching of a package couples with children can claim the working tax credit, of credit easing measures to help improve the flow of if one partner works 16 hours. Lone parents must work credit to businesses. The National Loan Guarantee at least 16 hours to qualify for the working tax credit. Scheme will lead to reductions in the cost of bank loans This change makes the system fairer by reducing the for smaller businesses while the Business Finance disparity in the number of hours which lone parents Partnership will deliver additional finance for mid-sized and couples are obliged to work. businesses through non-bank lending channels. In 2013, universal credit will provide a new single system of means-tested support for working-age people Child Care Tax Credit who are in or out of work. The key aim of universal credit is to move claimants into work, more work or Stephen Timms: To ask the Chancellor of the better paid work (and so towards self-sufficiency). To Exchequer how many households in receipt of tax achieve that aim, a single taper rate and a simple system credits whose total weekly working hours are under 24 of earnings disregards will allow people in work to see are in receipt of childcare tax credit; and how much clearly how much support they can get while making they receive on average. [85095] sure that people considering a job will understand the advantages of work, thereby smoothing the transition Mr Gauke: The working hours requirements for the into work, and encouraging progression in work. child care element of working tax credit are 16 hours for While there will be no hours rules under universal a lone parent or 16 hours for each member of a couple credit, the clear financial incentive provided by universal (unless one member of the couple is incapacitated, in credit will be backed up by a strong system of conditionality; hospital or in prison). Therefore, apart from a negligible unemployed people who can work will be required to number of couples, all households working fewer than take all reasonable steps to find and move into employment. 24 hours and benefiting from the child care element of The Government intends to apply conditionality at a WTC would be lone parents. higher level of income under universal credit than it The number of lone parents benefiting from the does under the current benefits system. This will enable childcare element of working tax credit and working the Government to apply work-related requirements to fewer than 24 hours as of April 2011 was 127,000. The claimants who are in some work but who we expect to average amount they received was £66 a week. These earn more than they currently do, in order to reduce households would not be affected by the policy announced 297W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 298W by the Government in the spending review of 2010 to likely effect on the economy of an increase in interest restrict working tax credit for couples with children to rates. [84789] those who work a combined minimum of 24 hours (with one member working at least 16 hours). Miss Chloe Smith: An increase in interest rates would Employment Agency Standards Inspectorate be particularly damaging to an economy with the UK’s level of indebtedness. A one percentage point rise in the cost of government borrowing would add around John McDonnell: To ask the Chancellor of the £7.5 billion to debt interest payments by 2016-17. A one Exchequer pursuant to the answer of 5 September percentage point rise in effective mortgage rates would 2011, Official Report, column 352W, on minimum add £10 billion a year to households’ mortgage interest wage, what recent discussions he has had with payments. ministerial colleagues in the Department for Business, Innovation and Skills on relocation of the Employment Agency Standards Inspectorate to the national Taxation: North West minimum wage enforcement team in HM Revenue and Customs; and whether any (a) voluntary or (b) Hazel Blears: To ask the Chancellor of the compulsory redundancies would result from such a Exchequer what estimate he has made of the number of relocation. [77702] people in (a) Salford and Eccles constituency and (b) the North West who are subject to the (i) higher and (ii) Mr Gauke [holding answer 2 December 2011]: Treasury additional rate of income tax. [84902] Ministers and officials have discussions with a wide variety of organisations in the public and private sectors Mr Gauke: An estimated 3.74 million taxpayers are as part of the process of policy development and delivery. liable to income tax at the 40% higher rate and 308 The Treasury publishes a list of ministerial discussions thousand taxpayers are liable to income tax at the 50% with external organisations, available at: additional rate in the United Kingdom in 2011-12. http://www.hm-treasury.gov.uk/minister_hospitality.htm In the north west, 318 thousand taxpayers are liable Mortgage Express to income tax at the 40 per cent higher rate and 18 thousand taxpayers are liable to income tax at the 50% additional rate in the 2011-12 George Eustice: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer how many buy-to-let properties have been These and estimates for other UK Government Office repossessed by Mortgage Express in the last 12 months. Regions are published on the HMRC website in tables 2.1 [84620] and 2.2 which are available at the following addresses: http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/stats/income_tax/table2-1.pdf Mr Hoban: The Government do not publish data on http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/stats/income_tax/table2-2.pdf arrears and repossessions. The Council of Mortgage Reliable estimates for taxpayer marginal rates are not Lenders collects data on buy-to-let repossessions across available at the parliamentary constituency level, due to the UK. Specific repossessions data for Mortgage Express greater uncertainties in projections for small geographical is not publically available. areas and small sample sizes. George Eustice: To ask the Chancellor of the These estimates are based on the 2007-08 Survey of Exchequer how many cases concerning Mortgage Personal Incomes, projected using economic assumptions Express have been referred to the Financial consistent with the Office for Budget Responsibility’s March 2011 economic and fiscal outlook. Ombudsman Service in the last 12 months. [84621] Estimates of income and tax by parliamentary Mr Hoban: The matter raised is for the Financial constituency for 2007-08 and preceding years are available Ombudsman Service (FOS), whose day-to-day operations in table 3.1 5: are independent from Government. The FOS publishes http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/stats/income_distribution/menu-by- complaints data on their website at: year.htm http://www.ombudsman-complaints-data.org.uk Social Justice Committee VAT: Business

Michael Dugher: To ask the Chancellor of the Robert Halfon: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer how many meetings of the Social Justice Exchequer if he will consider extending VAT Committee Ministers in his Department have attended exemptions for VAT-registered businesses in the since its establishment. [85281] construction industry building new properties to small firms in other sectors; and if he will make a statement. Miss Chloe Smith: Information relating to the proceedings [84799] of Cabinet Committees, including when and how often they meet and which Ministers have attended, is generally Mr Gauke: It is not possible to extend existing VAT not disclosed as to do so could harm the frankness and zero rating to the construction of commercial properties candour of internal discussion. under EU law. Taxation However, it should be remembered that a VAT registered business that is charged VAT on the construction of a Nick de Bois: To ask the Chancellor of the new property will be able to recover the tax, subject to Exchequer what recent assessment he has made of the the normal VAT rules. 299W Written Answers6 DECEMBER 2011 Written Answers 300W

Gordon Banks: To ask the Chancellor of the Welfare Tax Credits: Uprating Exchequer what progress has been made by the Office of Tax Simplification in reviewing the VAT threshold Rachel Reeves: To ask the Chancellor of the for business registrations. [85318] Exchequer if he will estimate the cost to the public purse of uprating tax credits using a consumer prices Mr Gauke: The information requested falls within index level of (a) 2.5, (b) 3, (c) 3.1, (d) 3.5, (e) 4, (f) the responsibility of the Office of Tax Simplification 4.3, (g) 4.5, (h) 4.6, (i) 4.9, (j) 5.1 and (k) 5.2 per (OTS), and I have asked the OTS to reply. cent. in 2012-13. [82750] Letter from John Whiting, dated 2 December 2011: Gordon Banks MP has submitted a written parliamentary Mr Gauke: As of the June Budget 2010, most tax question about the VAT threshold for business registrations. The credit elements are uprated by CPI each year. By convention, question was: the CPI for September 2011 would be used to uprate “To ask Mr Chancellor of the Exchequer, what progress has these elements in 2012-13. The official ONS estimate been made by the Office of Tax Simplification in reviewing the for CPI for September 2011 is 5.2%. VAT threshold for business registrations.” The following table gives the estimated savings against The OTS’s interim report on small business taxation was this baseline for 2012-13 if CPI were to be at the published on 10 March 2011. The report included a short section specified levels. (paragraphs 4.61-4.66) on VAT, which did address the question of the registration threshold. Our conclusion was: “On balance we Savings in 2012-13 of different uprating percentages in 2012-13 for the elements think the registration threshold should stay as it is, though it is an that are currently uprated by CPI area that is worth further study.” Uprating £ million

The Chancellor responded to this report in Budget 2011, and 5.2% 0 commissioned the OTS to look into tax administration in their 5.1% neg final report on small business taxation. On 9 May 2011, the Exchequer Secretary to the Treasury wrote to the OTS Chairman, 4.9% 40 Rt Hon Michael Jack, outlining the Government’s response and 4.6% 130 setting out priorities for the next stage of the Office’s work in 4.5% 170 more detail1. 4.3% 200 1 This letter has been published on the OTS website: 4% 270 http://www.hm-treasury.gov.uk/d/ 3.5% 400 ots_xstletter_small_business_tax_review_090511.pdf 3.1% 490 As set out in the Exchequer Secretary’s letter, the remit of the 3% 500 work on tax administration will require the OTS to “examine 2.5% 630 closely small businesses1 experience of tax administration and their contact with HMRC at key stages of their annual cycle” and In this comparison, we have assumed the following to “give specific consideration of the issues involved in starting tax credit elements are uprated by CPI in 2012-13: and growing a new business.” The terms of reference for this work Working tax credit are attached in the annex of this document. Disability element Since the interim report on small business taxation, the OTS Severe disability element has been gathering evidence and conducting research to determine the areas of tax administration that ought to be prioritised. As Child tax credit highlighted in the interim report, the OTS is interested in the Child element administrative difficulties, including those related to VAT and Disabled child element international trade, which pose particular problems for small businesses. The operation of VAT registration is, therefore, very Severely disabled child element much within the remit, although we understand that HMRC is This answer assumes the couple and lone parent already working hard to improve the registration process. The elements of working tax credit are frozen in 2012-13, as OTS has not, however, been asked to review the VAT registration announced in the autumn statement 2011. In addition, threshold limit. the basic and 30 hour elements of working tax credit The OTS has been asked to deliver recommendations on tax are frozen for three years from 2011-12, as announced administration for small business ahead of Budget 2012. We would be happy to inform the questioner when the report is at spending review 2010. published. Working Tax Credit I hope this is helpful, and would like to thank Mr Banks for his interest in our work. John Mann: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer how many people receive working families tax credit in VAT: Charities each constituency; and what the total amount paid was. [84846] Andrew Rosindell: To ask the Chancellor of the Exchequer what his policy is on reviewing the charging Mr Gauke: The latest information on the number of of irrecoverable value added tax for charities providing households in receipt of child tax credit and working healthcare services; and if he will make a statement. tax credit and average award sizes in each constituency [84685] can be found in table 3 of the HMRC statistical publication “Child and Working Tax Credits Statistics: finalised Mr Gauke: HM Treasury officials are currently reviewing annual awards 2009-10-geographical analysis”, available the VAT position of charities providing health care at: services and discussions between the sector and the http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/stats/personal-tax-credits/cwtc-geog- Department are ongoing. final-awards-may11.pdf ORAL ANSWERS

Tuesday 6 December 2011

Col. No. Col. No. CHANCELLOR OF THE EXCHEQUER...... 141 CHANCELLOR OF THE EXCHEQUER—continued Bank Lending and Credit (Businesses)...... 144 Public Sector Borrowing Requirements...... 154 Benefit Changes (Women)...... 154 Regional Investment ...... 151 Capital Allowances (Regional Growth)...... 155 Tax Loopholes ...... 153 Economic Growth...... 152 Tax Rates ...... 150 HMRC Contact Centres ...... 149 Taxation (Banks)...... 146 Interest Rates ...... 147 Topical Questions ...... 156 National Asset Management Agency...... 144 Unemployment ...... 142 Official Development Assistance...... 141 WRITTEN MINISTERIAL STATEMENTS

Tuesday 6 December 2011

Col. No. Col. No. ATTORNEY-GENERAL ...... 9WS SCOTLAND...... 22WS Ratcliffe-on-Soar Power Station...... 9WS Parliamentary Written Question (Correction)...... 22WS

CULTURE, MEDIA AND SPORT ...... 14WS TRANSPORT ...... 23WS Government Olympic Executive Quarterly Report, Access for All...... 23WS December 2011 ...... 14WS Business Plan (Update) ...... 23WS Defending Against Piracy (UK Ships) ...... 23WS Roads Classification...... 24WS ENVIRONMENT, FOOD AND RURAL AFFAIRS...... 15WS TREASURY ...... 9WS EU Ban (Keeping of Hens in Conventional Anti-avoidance Regulations ...... 9WS Cages) ...... 15WS Bank Remuneration Disclosures ...... 10WS Draft Legislation for Finance Bill 2012 and Tax HOME DEPARTMENT...... 19WS Policy Update ...... 11WS Criminal Records Regime Review (Government Draft Legislation for Finance Bill 2012: Measures Response) ...... 20WS with Immediate Effect...... 12WS The Draft Immigration (Biometric Registration) Non-Domicile Taxation and Statutory Residence Regulations 2012...... 19WS Test ...... 13WS

JUSTICE...... 21WS WORK AND PENSIONS ...... 25WS Forfeiture Rule and Law of Succession ...... 21WS Remploy (Annual Report)...... 25WS PETITIONS

Tuesday 6 December 2011

Col. No. Col. No. TRANSPORT ...... 3P TRANSPORT—continued Closure of Liverpool Coastguard Station ...... 3P Swansea Coastguard Station...... 4P WRITTEN ANSWERS

Tuesday 6 December 2011

Col. No. Col. No. ATTORNEY-GENERAL ...... 198W BUSINESS, INNOVATION AND SKILLS—continued Crown Prosecution Service: Training ...... 198W Departmental Food...... 281W Departmental Pay ...... 198W Departmental Procurement...... 282W Departmental Written Questions ...... 198W Derby Economic Task Force...... 283W Export Credit Guarantees...... 283W BUSINESS, INNOVATION AND SKILLS ...... 278W Export Credit Guarantees: Arab States...... 283W Arts...... 278W Export Credit Guarantees: Libya...... 284W Billing ...... 278W Fish: Procurement...... 284W Business: Government Assistance ...... 279W Fossil Fuels: Export Credit Guarantees ...... 286W Capita ...... 280W Government Departments: Procurement ...... 286W Construction: Billing...... 280W Groceries Code Adjudicator Bill ...... 287W Departmental Eggs ...... 280W Manufacturing Advisory Service: Peterborough .... 288W Col. No. Col. No. BUSINESS, INNOVATION AND SKILLS—continued EDUCATION—continued Manufacturing Advisory Service: Redditch ...... 287W Children: Missing Persons...... 249W New Businesses: Capital Investment ...... 288W Departmental Eggs ...... 251W Overseas Trade: China ...... 288W Departmental Official Hospitality...... 251W Postal Services: Dangerous Dogs ...... 289W Departmental Procurement...... 251W Private Sector: Employment...... 289W Free Schools...... 252W Regional Assistance: Northern Ireland ...... 290W Pupils: Disadvantaged...... 252W Regional Growth Fund ...... 290W Regional Planning and Development: North East . 291W ENERGY AND CLIMATE CHANGE ...... 211W Regulation ...... 292W Carbon Sequestration: Finance...... 211W Renewable Energy: Export Credit Guarantees ...... 292W Climate Change: Africa...... 212W Technology and Innovation Centre ...... 293W Diesel Fuel: Prices...... 213W Written Questions ...... 293W Energy: Meters...... 213W Fuel Poverty...... 214W CABINET OFFICE...... 269W Fuel Poverty: Death ...... 214W Business ...... 270W Fuel Poverty: National Parks ...... 215W Communities First Fund...... 270W Inverkip Power Station...... 215W Federation of Small Businesses...... 271W Nuclear Power...... 215W Government Departments: Procurement ...... 271W Oil: Canada...... 215W Government Procurement...... 269W Solar Power...... 216W Industrial Disputes: Voluntary Organisations ...... 271W Solar Power: Feed-in Tariffs...... 216W Public Sector: Trade Union Officials...... 271W Warm Homes and Energy Conservation Act 2000 . 216W World War II: Medals ...... 217W COMMUNITIES AND LOCAL GOVERNMENT.. 231W Affordable Housing...... 231W ENVIRONMENT, FOOD AND RURAL Business ...... 232W AFFAIRS...... 272W Council Housing...... 232W Agriculture: Bureaucracy ...... 272W Council Tax Benefits...... 232W Biofuels: Imports ...... 272W Departmental Eggs ...... 233W Bovine Tuberculosis ...... 273W Departmental Food...... 233W Dangerous Dogs ...... 273W Departmental Grants...... 233W Devolution...... 274W Disabled Facilities Grants ...... 234W Food Supply...... 274W Empty Property ...... 235W Forestry Commission: Termination of Empty Property: Worcestershire ...... 236W Employment ...... 275W EU Grants and Loans: Yorkshire and the Forests ...... 275W Humber ...... 236W Gangmasters Licensing Authority...... 275W Green Belt...... 237W Livestock: Waste Disposal ...... 275W Green Belt: Gravesham ...... 238W Palm Oil...... 276W Housing ...... 238W Reed...... 276W Housing: Capital Investment...... 238W Sky Lanterns...... 276W Housing: Carbon Emissions...... 239W Sustainable Development...... 277W Housing: Energy ...... 239W World War II: Medals ...... 277W Housing: Standards ...... 240W Local Government: Pensions ...... 241W FOREIGN AND COMMONWEALTH OFFICE .... 177W Local Government: Trade Union Officials ...... 241W British Overseas Territories: Elections ...... 177W Rented Housing: Energy ...... 242W Foreign Relations: Education...... 177W Rented Housing: Standards ...... 242W Syria: Diplomatic Relations ...... 177W Right to Buy Scheme: Worcester...... 243W Syria: Human Rights ...... 177W Rural Areas: Finance ...... 243W Syria: Politics and Government...... 178W Social Justice Committee ...... 243W Social Rented Housing...... 243W HEALTH...... 252W Voluntary Organisations ...... 247W Alcoholic Drinks: Young People ...... 252W Waste Disposal: Metals...... 248W Cannabis: Children ...... 254W Contraception...... 253W CULTURE, MEDIA AND SPORT ...... 186W Departmental Advertising...... 254W Alcoholic Drinks: Sales...... 186W Departmental Written Questions ...... 255W BBC: Redundancy Pay...... 186W Dilnot Commission...... 256W Broadband ...... 187W Drugs: Young People ...... 256W Broadband Delivery UK: Manpower...... 187W Food: Labelling...... 256W Festivals and Special Occasions ...... 187W Health: Children ...... 259W Film ...... 188W Health: Greater London ...... 259W Paralympic Games 2012...... 188W Health Professions: Training ...... 258W Health Services ...... 257W DEFENCE...... 199W Health Services: Finance...... 259W Departmental Redundancy ...... 199W Hospital Beds...... 260W EU Defence Policy ...... 199W Influenza...... 260W Military Bases: Scotland ...... 200W Influenza: Vaccination ...... 261W Liver Diseases: Children ...... 261W EDUCATION...... 249W Maternity Services ...... 262W Children: Day Care ...... 250W Maternity Services: Finance...... 262W Children in Care...... 249W Mental Health Services ...... 262W Col. No. Col. No. HEALTH—continued NORTHERN IRELAND ...... 178W Mental Health Services ...... 263W Departmental Pay ...... 178W Mental Illness ...... 263W Mental Illness: Children...... 264W SCOTLAND...... 179W Mental Illness: Young People...... 264W Aircraft Carriers ...... 179W Morecambe Bay Hospitals NHS Trust: Departmental Equality ...... 179W Information and Communications Technology.. 265W Departmental Internet ...... 179W NHS: Manpower ...... 266W Departmental Older Workers...... 180W North Bristol NHS Trust: Information and Departmental Written Questions ...... 180W Communications Technology...... 266W Drugs...... 180W Obesity: Females...... 267W Drugs: Misuse...... 181W Radiotherapy ...... 268W Economic Growth...... 181W Sex: Health Services ...... 268W Jobcentre Plus ...... 181W Smoking...... 268W Lockerbie: Bombings ...... 181W Smoking: Motor Vehicles...... 269W Natural Gas: Exploration ...... 181W Olympic Games 2012 ...... 182W HOME DEPARTMENT...... 201W Renewable Energy...... 182W Asylum ...... 201W Asylum: Finance...... 203W TRANSPORT ...... 183W Civil Disorder: Compensation...... 203W Air Transport Auxiliary ...... 183W Departmental Pay ...... 203W Bypasses: Kegworth ...... 183W Detention Centres...... 204W Dartford-Thurrock Crossing: Automatic Number Entry Clearances: Overseas Students ...... 204W Plate Recognition...... 184W Harassment: Surveillance...... 204W Departmental Procurement...... 184W Hillsborough Independent Panel...... 204W Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency: Preston...... 184W Human Trafficking: Northern Ireland ...... 205W M4: Repairs and Maintenance...... 185W Illegal Immigrants...... 205W Railways Stations: Standards ...... 185W Immigration Controls ...... 206W Roads: Rural Areas ...... 185W Immigration: Europe ...... 206W Shipping: Guide Dogs...... 185W Kidnapping: Children ...... 207W Wheels to Work Schemes ...... 186W Metropolitan Police: Manpower ...... 208W Police: Bournemouth ...... 209W TREASURY ...... 293W Police: Crimes of Violence ...... 210W Bank Levy...... 294W Police: South Wales...... 210W Building Societies...... 296W Police: Surveillance ...... 210W Business: Loans...... 296W Stalking: Homicide ...... 210W Child Care Tax Credit...... 296W Economic Growth...... 294W INTERNATIONAL DEVELOPMENT...... 227W Employment Agency Standards Inspectorate...... 297W Departmental Communication ...... 227W Future Jobs Fund...... 295W Departmental Official Hospitality...... 227W Mortgage Express ...... 297W Departmental Pay ...... 228W Regional Investment ...... 294W Departmental Procurement...... 228W Social Justice Committee ...... 297W Developing Countries: Malaria...... 229W Taxation...... 297W Developing Countries: Malnutrition ...... 230W Taxation: North West...... 298W EU Aid: Family Planning...... 230W UK’s Current Account Balance ...... 294W Overseas Aid: Education...... 231W Unemployment ...... 293W Sri Lanka: Internally Displaced People...... 231W Universal Credit...... 295W World Bank...... 231W VAT: Business ...... 298W VAT: Charities ...... 299W JUSTICE...... 189W Welfare Tax Credits: Uprating ...... 300W Birmingham Prison...... 189W Working Tax Credit ...... 300W Children: Abduction ...... 189W County Courts ...... 190W WOMEN AND EQUALITIES...... 182W Defamation...... 190W Crimes of Violence: Victim Support Schemes ...... 182W Departmental Advisory Services...... 191W Departmental Written Questions ...... 183W Departmental Civil Proceedings...... 192W Social Justice Committee: Ministers...... 183W Departmental Procurement...... 192W Departmental Publications ...... 191W WORK AND PENSIONS ...... 217W General Elections: Crown Dependencies...... 193W Business: Government Assistance ...... 217W Miscarriages of Justice...... 193W Child Support Agency: Prosecutions...... 217W Offenders: Crimes of Violence ...... 193W Construction: Industry...... 218W Personal Injury ...... 193W Departmental Advisory Services...... 219W Prisoners: Post-traumatic Stress Disorder ...... 194W Departmental Eggs ...... 219W Prisons: Crimes of Violence ...... 194W Departmental Food...... 220W Prosecutions: Metals ...... 194W Departmental Pay ...... 222W Social Security Benefits: Appeals ...... 195W Disadvantaged ...... 222W Treasure Trove: Coroners ...... 197W Employment and Support Allowance ...... 222W Trials: Disclosure of Information...... 197W Employment Schemes: Compensation ...... 223W Employment Schemes: Third Sector ...... 223W LEADER OF THE HOUSE ...... 248W Jobcentre Plus: Telephone Services ...... 223W Departmental Written Questions ...... 248W Pensions...... 224W Col. No. Col. No. WORK AND PENSIONS—continued WORK AND PENSIONS—continued Social Justice Committee ...... 224W Universal Credit...... 225W Social Security Benefits...... 224W Welfare to Work...... 226W Social Security Benefits: Gurkhas ...... 225W Work Capability Assessment...... 226W Unemployment: Ex-servicemen...... 225W Members who wish to have the Daily Report of the Debates forwarded to them should give notice at the Vote Office. The Bound Volumes will also be sent to Members who similarly express their desire to have them. No proofs of the Daily Reports can be supplied, nor can corrections be made in the Weekly Edition. Corrections which Members suggest for the Bound Volume should be clearly marked in the Daily Report, but not telephoned, and the copy containing the Corrections must be received at the Editor’s Room, House of Commons,

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CONTENTS

Tuesday 6 December 2011

Oral Answers to Questions [Col. 141] [see index inside back page] Chancellor of the Exchequer

Benefits Uprating [Col. 163] Statement—(Steve Webb)

Registration of Commercial Lobbying Interests [Col. 173] Motion for leave to bring in Bill—(John Cryer)—agreed to Bill presented, and read the First time

The Economy [Col. 178] Motion—(Mr George Osborne)—on a Division, negatived

Short-life Homes (Lambeth) [Col. 274] Debate on motion for Adjournment

Westminster Hall Sport and Youth Crime [Col. 1WH] Mental Health (Veterans) [Col. 26WH] Arctic Convoy Veterans Medal [Col. 51WH] Police Stations (Overnight Staffing) [Col. 59WH] Zimbabwe [Col. 69WH] Debates on motion for Adjournment

Written Ministerial Statements [Col. 9WS]

Petitions [Col. 3P] Observations

Written Answers to Questions [Col. 177W] [see index inside back page]