Tuesday Volume 637 6 March 2018 No. 105 HOUSE OF COMMONS OFFICIAL REPORT PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES (HANSARD) Tuesday 6 March 2018 © Parliamentary Copyright House of Commons 2018 This publication may be reproduced under the terms of the Open Parliament licence, which is published at www.parliament.uk/site-information/copyright/. 145 6 MARCH 2018 146 Helen Hayes: I have been raising concerns about the House of Commons closure of Lambeth county court for the past two years, and the court finally closed in December. My constituents facing the repossession of their homes must now attend Tuesday 6 March 2018 Clerkenwell county court, which lawyers report to be a chaotic environment, which is impossible to contact by The House met at half-past Eleven o’clock telephone, where cases and files frequently go missing and where the number of respondents failing to attend is rocketing. When will the Justice Secretary take action PRAYERS to address this unacceptable situation? Mr Gauke: The reality is that we are undertaking a [MR SPEAKER in the Chair] series of reforms, making much greater use of digital technology and increasing access to online ways of dealing with this. This is an important modernisation Oral Answers to Questions that the courts system needs. Mr Philip Hollobone (Kettering) (Con): Very sadly, we have lost our magistrates court in Kettering, which, I have to say to the Government, was a mistake. It means JUSTICE that magistrates, the police and witnesses are all having to travel further. The closure of court sends a poor signal to the magistracy that they are not valued. Can The Secretary of State was asked— we get rid of this ridiculous age limit, whereby magistrates Court Closures have to retire at the age of 70? 1. Ruth George (High Peak) (Lab): What recent Mr Gauke: I am grateful to my hon. Friend for assessment his Department has made of the effect of raising this point, on which I have received representations. court closures on access to justice. [904186] This is consistent with what happens elsewhere within the judiciary, but I am conscious that it will continue to 2. Helen Hayes (Dulwich and West Norwood) (Lab): be a matter of some debate. What recent assessment his Department has made of the effect of court closures on access to justice. [904188] Yasmin Qureshi (Bolton South East) (Lab): The Government are continuing to cut court staff, close The Secretary of State for Justice and Lord Chancellor courts and sign contracts worth millions of pounds for (Mr David Gauke): Maintaining access to justice is a their digitisation programme. These are huge changes, key principle when changes to the estate are proposed. which will have an impact on our courts for decades. Before issuing our consultation on court closures in Will the Minister promise not to close any more courts January, we assessed the impact on access to justice— or sign contracts until the courts Bill is published and principally, the changes in travel time for court users. the matter has been debated fully in this Chamber? The decision to close a court is never taken lightly, and is made only after full public consultation and where we Mr Gauke: I hope to be able to bring forward further are satisfied that access to justice is maintained. Our news on the courts Bill in the near future, but I am not reform programme will improve access to justice for going to give the undertaking the hon. Lady seeks. It is many users, while allowing many needs to be met without important that we continue to look to get the best out the need to attend court. Online solutions and video of the resources we have. If that means reforms here in hearings will make access to justice easier. making greater use of digital technology and ensuring that our court estate is as rational and efficient as Ruth George: The Minister’sexperience is not happening possible, we will need to continue to do that. in my constituency, where Buxton court closed in 2016. Some of my constituents now have to travel 40 miles on Vulnerable Witnesses a one-and-a-half-hour trip to Chesterfield court. The police say that it now takes them a whole day to take 3. Tony Lloyd (Rochdale) (Lab): What assessment his someone to court, whereas it used to take less than half Department has made of the time taken to bring to a day, and that is having an impact on the number of court criminal cases involving vulnerable witnesses. offenders they can bring to court and on justice in my [904189] area. Please will the Minister take this into account in the current consultation? The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice (Lucy Frazer): I understand that the hon. Gentleman Mr Gauke: I am grateful to the hon. Lady for her has a great interest in this area and did a lot of work comments, but we also have to take into account the when he was the police and crime commissioner of fact that 41% of courts and tribunals used less than half Greater Manchester, calling for a review of how victims their available hearing capacity during the financial and witnesses are treated in the criminal justice system. year 2016-17, and across the country courts are utilised It is right that cases come to court as quickly as possible, at 58% of their capacity. In those circumstances, where and timeliness in the criminal courts system is improving. resources are scarce we have to make decisions about The average mean number of days from listing to the reforms we undertake. completion is down from 33 in 2015 to 27 in the third 147 Oral Answers 6 MARCH 2018 Oral Answers 148 quarter of 2017. Unfortunately, as he will know, there made to relive harrowing experiences. Will the Minister are particular challenges in relation to sex offences, be responding directly to the Spicer review’s where it does take longer for cases to come to court. recommendations? Tony Lloyd: The Minister is absolutely right that Dr Lee: I thank the hon. Lady for her question. The there are complexities in cases of, for example, child Department is of course aware of that serious case sexual abuse or rape.Nevertheless,constant, even legitimate, review of the sexual exploitation of children. The details adjournments in cases can lead to months of delay. are shocking. Like all the agencies involved, we are Sometimes, it takes years before victims come to court. looking into ways to continuously improve our service. Victims who are already traumatised by what has happened I shall write to the hon. Lady about whether we will to them deserve better than to be traumatised by the respond directly to that review. process. Can we make them a priority? Patrick Grady (Glasgow North) (SNP): Is the Minister Lucy Frazer: The hon. Gentleman is absolutely right aware of new regulations that the Scottish Government that we need to be extremely careful with vulnerable are introducing to exempt domestic abuse victims,recipients witnesses and witnesses in sex cases and ensure that of crisis welfare support and those on low incomes from they get justice. We are bringing in and rolling out civil court fees? What discussions is he having with the measures on the taking of their evidence to ensure that Scottish Government about what lessons he might learn they can do that pre-trial and therefore safely, which from that process? will speed up justice. As the hon. Gentleman knows and as the Secretary of State has mentioned, we are hoping Dr Lee: We have plenty to learn from what is to introduce the courts Bill, which will ensure the happening in Scotland with regard to the way we deal streamlining of justice and do away with unnecessary with women who are victims of domestic abuse, and hearings. Hopefully, that will speed up access to justice. indeed offenders who have been victims of domestic abuse. As the Justice Minister with responsibility for the Jim Shannon (Strangford) (DUP): Will the Minister devolvedAdministrations,mydiscussionscontinueregularly. further outline what training lawyers receive in the I look forward to learning from Scotland in future. handling of vulnerable witnesses? Does the Department intend to make updates to such training compulsory? Sir Edward Davey (Kingston and Surbiton) (LD): The Government had plans to legislate to ban alleged Lucy Frazer: In the family court, all judges have domestic abusers from cross-examining their victims in training on dealing with vulnerable witnesses. I am sure the family courts. Is that still Government policy? If so, that the Crown Prosecution Service has training as well. when will such a provision be put before the House? Every day that there is a delay, more vulnerable people Victims and Witnesses: Court Experience get tormented in court. 4. Alan Mak (Havant) (Con): What steps his Department Dr Lee: The right hon. Gentleman is spot on in his is taking to improve the court experience for victims analysis. The abuse and coercion of females, invariably and witnesses. [904190] by males, through the court process is wrong and not acceptable. We will bring forward details on how we The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for Justice intend to address that in the Bill that is coming later this (Dr Phillip Lee): We are committed to improving the year. experiences of those who have become victims of crime, which is why, by the summer, we will publish our victims Gloria De Piero (Ashfield) (Lab): The court experience strategy, a key aspect of which is how we can improve can be a bewildering one—it can often feel like a support for victims as they interact with the criminal different planet.