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H INTERVIEW RACHEL MADDOW Upstairs in MSNBC’s studios at 30 Rockefeller Plaza in Manhattan, Rachel Maddow is prac- tically mainlining the news of the day. Her staff of 20 (women outnumber men and diversi- ty of skin color, gender expression and age is clearly valued) calls out headlines as Maddow scribbles in micro-script on a whiteboard: bombs in Kandahar, pollution in Beijing, idiocy on the campaign trail, a two-star Navy admiral reprimanded for public drunkenness and nudity. “Oh, I love when government and nakedness collide,” Maddow says to big laughs. Of 50-odd story possibilities, roughly six make The Rachel Maddow Show, the nightly news and opinion program with a strong lefty bent that debuted two months before Barack Obama was elected in 2008. With nearly a million viewers each night, it is MSNBC’s highest-rated prime- time series and will inevitably boom bigger as November’s presidential election draws nearer. At 42, Maddow isn’t like other TV talking siasm for talk, and she broke into radio in 1999 change. As a liberal, are you still feeling hope? heads. She was the first openly gay anchor to after an open call at WRNX in Amherst, Mas- MADDOW: Theoretically. But historically host a major news program in the U.S. and has sachusetts. (That same year she met her part- speaking, after Democrats hold two terms in never pretended to be a golden girl. “I once had ner, Susan Mikula, an artist; the Berkshires the White House, the public picks a Republican long, straight blonde hair but then cut it short remain their primary residence.) Obsessive to replace them. There are a lot of determining and came back looking like Rick Santorum,” about research and with a gift for crystalliz- factors in who wins. People say it’s the price of she says. Maddow does not mask her liberal- ing even the wonkiest white papers, Maddow gas and the growth in the economy, but some- ism, but even right-wingers respect how sharp, helped launch Air America in 2004 before land- times it’s the we’re-ready-for-something-new well-informed and sane she is. Her 2012 best- ing her nine p.m. spot on MSNBC in New York, thing. There’s a reason that, almost without seller, Drift, on America’s slide into perpetual where playboy Contributing Editor David fail, in every midterm election the president’s war, includes a blurb from Fox News chairman Hochman recently met with her for a couple of party loses seats. There are psychological and CEO Roger Ailes. days. Hochman has interviewed many pundits cycles in American politics that are pretty easy Maddow grew up in conservative Castro Val- for playboy—Sean Hannity, Michael Savage, to read, and in 2016 Democrats are facing one ley, California, where her former Air Force Bill Maher, Chris Wallace—but had never met of those cycles in which they are structurally captain father was a lawyer and her mother a an anchor who works as diligently as Maddow. disadvantaged. It’s a matter of civic and inter- school administrator. By the age of seven she He reports: “She’s like the girl in high school national interest whom the Republicans pick, was reading the newspaper; in her teens, she who reads every assignment, aces every test, because even if they pick a fascist, structurally was a standout athlete turned AIDS activist. does all the extra credits and still manages to speaking that fascist or that con man, let’s say, She went to Stanford University and then to the run the yearbook, win the swim meet and get the will have a 50 percent chance of becoming pres- University of Oxford as America’s first openly president of the United States to write her back.” ident of the United States. gay Rhodes Scholar. She holds an Oxford Ph.D. I’m a liberal, but the thing that interests me in political science. PLAYBOY: After almost eight years of Presi- most in American politics is center-right to far- Academia could not contain Maddow’s enthu- dent Obama, we are once again talking about right politics, because (a) it’s a laugh a minute PHOTOGRAPHY BY AMY TROOST 58 H H INTERVIEW INTERVIEW and (b) there’s no stasis. There’s no solid core to hold high government office in Washing- then it became an issue that he doesn’t show senator Amy Klobuchar would be amazing. Ob- by how good a president she is. Just being a her a question and she would physically turn to moving forward. You never know who’s going to ton, D.C. almost inherently disqualifies you up to vote. He has the worst voting record in viously Elizabeth Warren if you have a more con- woman gets you only so far. the audience and answer. I was like, “Yoo-hoo, come along. as a Republican. So everybody is qualified, and the Senate, yet he clearly takes meetings every servative candidate like Hillary Clinton. PLAYBOY: You’ve spent time knee-to-knee over here!” PLAYBOY: Donald Trump’s strong come-on therefore you pick the person who most enter- time a hedge fund billionaire calls. It’s hard to Everybody says Clinton is going to pick with Clinton and Bernie Sanders. What are PLAYBOY: Was Sanders like that too? was certainly a stunner. What conditions gave tains you. It’s a weird thing. see Marco Rubio supporting anything other Julian Castro, the HUD secretary, but I’ve been they like off camera? MADDOW: The thing that’s interesting about rise to his popularity? PLAYBOY: Weren’t we supposed to be in the than Marco Rubio. trying to start another rumor. Maybe saying it MADDOW: It’s fascinating. I did an hour- Bernie is that he is a freaking good politician, MADDOW: First of all, anybody in day-to-day middle of another Bush vs. Clinton battle PLAYBOY: Now or in the future, what about in playboy will finally make it take hold. It long interview with Hillary in the studio last and he’s aggressive. We had a commercial break political coverage who says they saw it com- right now? Chris Christie? makes total sense to me that she’ll pick Stan- fall, right before the televised forum I did with in the middle of our discussion because I wanted ing you can write off for the rest of their life. MADDOW: That was the assumption ever MADDOW: My Spidey sense tells me he’s going ley McChrystal, the Army general who had a the candidates in South Carolina. We had no to have a reset. During that break, Martin Trump’s explosion was not just improbable, since Obama became the clear nominee in to do well in New Hampshire. We’ll know by the bad ending because of a Rolling Stone inter- ground rules. She had no idea what I was going O’Malley was hyperventilating. Hillary started it was laugh-out-loud funny. But it’s not like 2008—Hillary vs. Jeb. Now, eight years later time people read this. He’s a good campaigner. view in which he ripped into Joe Biden. There’s to ask. When she came in, she listened to me playing to the audience again and waving to peo- there’s no precedent for this. Silvio Berlusconi, we’re in a campaign where we’ve watched Jeb He has charisma. He has the right tough-guy a sort of realpolitik gender issue around Clin- so hard it felt like she was prying my thoughts ple like she was campaigning. Bernie was work- the longest-serving Italian leader after World Bush set fire to tens of millions of dollars and persona he can turn on and off when he wants. ton getting the nomination that requires she out of my brain through my eyeballs. Hillary’s ing me to ask the questions he wanted for the War II, was a zillionaire media guy with bunga- get in trouble every time he opens his mouth. Okay, so he has been like Godzilla stomping pick a Grizzly Adams as her vice pres- s econd half. He was like, “When we come bunga sex parties who had no political pedi- At one point he actually said, “You are look-ing on New Jersey as governor. A true disaster. ident. But it can’t be somebody who back, are you going to ask me about…?” gree whatsoever and just got in there and did at the nominee and I am go-ing to face Hillary Republicans don’t care about that. But if Chris- might overshadow her to the extent I was like, “Whoa, whoa, whoa. You’re a terrible job and embarrassed the nation. But Clinton and I am go-ing to whoop her.” Come tie makes it to March and April, the problem that people see the man in charge and supposed to be Mr. Socialist.” they picked him. Jesse Ventura was elected on, Jeb. You actually have to drop a g some- is the Bridgegate trials will be starting, people the woman in a supporting role. It can’t PLAYBOY: Can you picture him being governor of Minnesota and will be pleading not guilty, and be somebody who feels he ought to be at president? then didn’t really do anything. fingers will be pointing at him. the top of the ticket. MADDOW: Bernie Sanders is running Arnold Schwarzenegger became PLAYBOY: Moving on to the McChrystal doesn’t come from a tra- this fascinating campaign where he’s a non-consequential governor Democrats, what does Hillary ditional political background, which I all about people being angry and dis- of California purely on the basis TEN TO 15 Clinton need to do to win? think makes a lot of sense.

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