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00:00:00 Jesse Host I’m Jesse Thorn. It’s Bullseye. Thorn 00:00:02 Music Transition “Huddle Formation” from the album Thunder, Lightning, Strike by The Go! Team. A fast, upbeat, peppy song. Music plays as Jesse speaks, then fades out. 00:00:09 Jesse Host We’re taking this week to look back on one of our favorite interviews with Metta World Peace, from 2018. Metta World Peace has a big personality, which is saying a lot in the context of being an NBA player. Even though he’s been named an All-Star and won an NBA Championship, he remains one of the most polarizing players in the history of the game. He was born Ron Artest. He changed his name in 2012. He grew up in Queensbridge, New York—the same massive housing project that was home to players like Lamar Odom and rappers like Nos and the duo Mobb Deep. He got drafted in the first round, in 1999, by the Chicago Bulls. As a player, he was always an elite defender, but he had a reputation for losing his cool. [Music ends with a chorus of cheers.] When it worked, it made him passionate, tough, and nearly impossible to get past. But when it didn’t, things went south easily. He’d play dirty, get into dust ups on the court. Once, in 2004, at a game in Detroit, a hard foul between players escalated into an all- out brawl between players and fans. This incident, now infamous, was called then: The Malice at the Palace. 00:01:20 Sound Transition Music swells and fades. Effect 00:01:21 Clip Clip [Roaring cheers from the crowd. The squeak of sneakers against linoleum.] Announcer: Now Artest has jumped over the scores table and is trying to get down to the bench! Artest is in the stands! Ooh, this is awful. Fans are getting involved! Steven Jackson’s in the fans! [Screams from the audience build to a crescendo.] Announcer: Rasheed Wallace going into the stands! The security trying to somehow restore order! 00:01:41 Sound Transition Music swells and fades. Effect 00:01:42 Jesse Host But Metta World Peace has been honest about his regrets in life, and in his years as a player and now coach, he’s become a powerful advocate for mental healthcare. After he helped lead the Lakers to a championship title, in 2010, he thanked his therapist. 00:01:57 Sound Transition Music swells and fades. Effect 00:01:58 Clip Clip [Cheers from the audience. Music plays muffled in the background.] Metta World Peace: I definitely wanna thank my doctor, Dr. Santhi, my psychiatrist. She really helped me relax, a lot. Thank you so much. It was so difficult to play all this fuss and so much commotion going on in the playoffs. And she helped me relax. I thank you so much. 00:02:13 Sound Transition Music swells and fades. Effect 00:02:14 Jesse Host When we talked, he’d just written a memoir. It’s called, No Malice: My Life in Basketball Or: How a Kid from Queensbridge Survived the Streets, the Brawls, and Himself to Become an NBA Champion. It’s a great story. He recounts his triumphs and shortcomings. Including, of course, that incident in Detroit. It’s a story with a lot of poignant, reflective lows, but also pretty terrific highlights. 00:02:38 Sound Transition Music swells and fades. Effect 00:02:39 Clip Clip [Cheers from the crowd.] Announcer: Artest, that’s a three! BANG! [The crowd cheers.] Announcer: Lakers bisects with a minute to close. [The squeak of sneakers.] Announcer 2: Bryant turns and comes up short. Announcer 3: NO! And the buzzer! Announcer 2: Artest [inaudible]. Announcer 3: Ron Artest! Announcer 4: Artest has made four baskets in a row! Three of them jams with a 40 and a time out taken by Larry Brown and company. [Music fades in.] Announcer 5: This is 2 for his last 13, down for 3. [A whistle blows.] Announcer 5: But he’s stealing and doesn’t stay—OOH! It goes in! Announcer 6: Welcome to the crowd. [Chuckles.] Metta World Peace! Ooh, I tell ya. What an entertainer. Announcer 7: Bryant! Metta World PEACE! [Laughs triumphantly.] [The crowd goes wild.] (This clip is really chaotic and hard to understand, especially as someone who doesn’t watch sports. I think it’s multiple clips cut together but honestly I’m not really sure what’s going on.) 00:03:30 Sound Transition Music swells and fades. Effect 00:03:31 Jesse Host Metta World Peace, welcome to Bullseye. I’m so glad to have you on the show. 00:03:33 Metta Guest Yes, thanks for having me. Absolutely. 00:03:35 Jesse Host One of the things that I found the most fascinating in your book was you talking about growing up in Queensbridge, New York. For folks who have never been there, can you describe what it was like when you were a kid, in the ‘80s? 00:03:53 Metta Guest Yeah. In the—I grew up in 1979 and then in the ‘80s it was—it was tough, because… although you had your kid moments—you had fun, you were in a park, you’re doing different things like playing skelly or hopscotch—then you also had those moments where, you know, drug transactions, gunshots, fights and—you know— nobody’s motivated to become educated. You know. All those things were taking place and you just become that. I always tell my kids, “You always gotta watch who you’re around, because you will start to act like those type—those people.” You know. And it’s not that they’re bad people, but if you’re trying to be innovative and progressive, you know, it’s gonna be hard to do that in an environment like I grew up in. 00:04:39 Jesse Host You grew up with a lot of family in your house, right? [Metta confirms.] How big was your family? 00:04:44 Metta Guest Family was big. At one point, we had 17 people in a three bedroom. We did have about 13 people in a one bedroom. So, yeah. I always—when I—once I made it to the NBA, I didn’t think twice about buying a house for me and my two kids and my wife. It was about my two kids, wife, my mom, my sisters. Like, everybody’s gonna have rooms. You know? [Chuckles.] That’s my thought process, when I was young. 00:05:11 Jesse Host Did you have this—I mean, like, I grew up mostly an only child. [Metta affirms several times.] My wife grew up in a big catholic family. And when we got together, when we were teenagers, I was always anxious being at her house, because there was just always people around and it was very normal for her. And for me, I was just like, “I just wanna go sit and read a book somewhere quiet.” Or—you know what I mean? Like, just—just to have some… peace. And everyone was like being nice to me, you know what I mean? But I think, for her, it was sometimes it was the opposite, you know? It was like if there wasn’t that clamor, then she wasn’t at home. 00:05:49 Metta Guest Right. And it is true and that’s how you grew up—you get used to it. It’s like that for anybody. Any situation, any demographic, any color of your skin. When you grow up in a certain environment, and in a certain way, it’s gonna affect you. So, even if you grow up rich, but your parents is not home a lot—maybe you have nannies and the nannies are just doing their job. They’re gonna give you anything you want just to shut you up. You’re gonna grow up like a entitled kid. You know? Or maybe you’re like Stephen Curry, you know? His dad grew up pretty wealthy. Well, his dad made, and he grew up pretty wealthy, but he’s still a [inaudible] kid. So, something’s happening in that household. And you can see the parents on TV together—you know, and not everybody is as fortunate. And look at a guy like Lebron James—you don’t really see his father in the picture, but you see his mom is very supportive. You know, and it’s amazing, like, what shapes a person. 00:06:46 Jesse Host What do you think it was that shaped you? 00:06:48 Metta Guest For me, I mean, definitely my mom, my dad. But, you know— 00:06:52 Jesse Host They were—they were together when you were very young and then separated, but they were both part of your life, right? 00:06:56 Metta Guest Yeah. They was a major part of our life. So, I got—that’s why people see two side of Ron Artest. It’s a lie. It’s not one side. Because I experienced that mother and father laughing, tickling each other, the love. I’ve seen that. And then, like, the next week you will see the fighting and stuff. So, then you see that. But then they’re still together, so now that becomes normal. [Chuckles.] That’s a normal. Like, “Okay, Mom and Dad fought today. No problem. They’re still there, I’m happy.