Legislative Assembly

Thursday, 15 May 2003

THE SPEAKER (Mr F. Riebeling) took the Chair at 9.00 am, and read prayers. BEDNALL ROAD BRIDGE Petition Mr M.P. Murray presented the following petition bearing the signatures of 19 persons - To the Honourable the Speaker and Members of the Legislative Assembly of the Parliament of Western Australia in Parliament assembled. We, the undersigned, say That the area known as Bednall Road Bridge is a hazard to pedestrian and vehicular traffic. The current situation has a speed limit of 110km/h onto a one lane bridge where traffic is in excess of 350 vehicles a day. Now we ask that the Legislative Assembly Take action to make safe the area. The resolution to this situation is twofold in that the Bridge needs to be upgraded to allow for two lanes of traffic, and the speed limit needs to be lowered to recognise the amount of foot traffic in the area. [See petition No 179.] RETAIL TRADING HOURS Petition MS M.M. QUIRK (Girrawheen) [9.04 am]: I present the following petition on behalf of the member for Joondalup who is a victim of the weather and adverse traffic conditions - To the Honourable the Speaker and Members of the Legislative Assembly of the Parliament of Western Australia in Parliament assembled. We, the undersigned, say that deregulation of retail trading hours will adversely impact small business retailers, their employees and the local community. Suburban shopping centres are a common point of contact for the local community and any negative impact on the local businesses will ultimately impact on the community itself through such things as reduced sponsorships to local sporting groups, schools and community organisations etc. Current trading hours provide a balance in the competition between small retailers and the greater purchasing power of the major chains. Deregulation will ultimately lead to the major retail supermarket chains commanding 80% of all trade, as has been the precedent in the Eastern States. The flow on of such an impact will lead to the decimation of smaller businesses that rely on the walk by trade created by these small supermarket retailers. Now we ask that the Government protect small business retailers, their families and the local community by rejecting any attempts to deregulate trading hours in the State of Western Australia. The petition bears 369 signatures and I certify that it conforms to the standing orders of the Legislative Assembly. The SPEAKER: I direct that the petition be brought to the Table of the House. [See petition No 180.]

PRESTON BEACH, WATER QUALITY Grievance MR J.L. BRADSHAW (Murray-Wellington) [9.06 am]: My grievance today is about the water quality in the Preston Beach area. This has been an ongoing saga for many years because the area draws its water from bores and, unfortunately, the quality of the water is very poor. As I was a late replacement for grievances today, I was not able to get all the information to provide members with evidence of the poor quality water. However, some members will certainly be aware that the quality of water is an ongoing issue at Preston Beach, as it has been at Myalup and Binningup Beaches. The Government has decided to hook the latter two places into the Harvey water supply to overcome their problems - that service is being put in place now or it has already been put in place. That has been done to the great joy of the people of Binningup and Myalup as their water was much more unacceptable because of its hardness, the scaling it left on appliances, its taste and so on. However, Preston Beach has the same problem and for some reason the Water Corporation has been reluctant to go down the same path.

7850 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

At a recent meeting, the Water Corporation indicated that it is doing its homework to determine the cost of this work, but I got the impression that the Water Corporation will not install a pipe from the Stirling trunk main to Preston Beach. My fear is that a lot of money will be spent on improving the water quality at Preston Beach, but at an ongoing cost to the Water Corporation. If a line were installed from the trunk main that runs from Stirling Dam to Perth, the residents at Preston Beach would access the superb water from Harvey. That water requires no additives, apart from chlorine to kill the bugs, because there is very little salt in it and the water is not hard. That option would be very acceptable. A couple of years ago the Water Corporation spent about $1.5 million on a calgon treatment plant at Preston Beach to reduce the scaling in appliances. At the meeting that was held about a month ago, a person brought in a bucket containing stuff that a plumber had cleaned out of his hot water system - the amount of gunk in it was horrendous! It is like limestone because it is basically calcium carbonate, and I could hardly pick up the bucket because it was so heavy. This stuff is collecting in all the appliances used in the Preston Beach area. It shortens the life of appliances and it also has a drastic effect on taps and that sort of equipment. The attitude is that the water is not harmful to the people in the area. I beg to differ because the salinity in the water being used at Preston Beach is relatively high. If people are ingesting large amounts of calcium carbonate, then surely that might possibly lead to the creation of kidney stones and those sorts of things. The community in that area is concerned that the water could cause health problems, even though the Water Corporation has said that there are no health risks with this water. As I said previously, the Water Corporation seems to be reluctant to run the pipe across from the Stirling trunk main. That is probably because it will be more expensive. However, in the long term it will be cheaper, because there will be no need for treatment plants and those sorts of things, the maintenance of which costs a lot, as do the materials used for filtration to take the impurities out of the water. I ask the minister to put some pressure on the Water Corporation to ensure that these people are able to enjoy water of the same quality that everybody else enjoys. The Australian Drinking Water Guidelines were introduced in 1996. However, unfortunately, the Department of Health has not gone down the path of setting these guidelines in stone so that the Water Corporation must abide by them. I guess the Department of Health has not done that because a number of water supplies around Western Australia need to be upgraded and brought into line with the 1996 Australian Drinking Water Guidelines. The quality of the water supply to the people at Preston Beach is outside those guidelines. It is important to try to bring that water quality to acceptable standards. It is important that people have a nice lifestyle. They should not have to worry about their kettles and hot water systems scaling up or about the taste of the water, and they should not have concerns about the impact of the water on their health. The Water Corporation has said that those people should not have health concerns. I believe that if people ingest a lot of extra salt and calcium carbonate, there is a risk of health problems arising. If the minister could put some pressure on the Water Corporation to extend that line from the Stirling trunk main across to this area, it would solve a lot of problems, and treatment plants would not have to be built. DR J.M. EDWARDS (Maylands - Minister for the Environment and Heritage) [9.12 am]: I am responding to this grievance this morning on behalf of the Treasurer, who represents the Minister for Government Enterprises in this Chamber. For a start, I reassure the member and his community that the water supply to Preston Beach complies with all health-related guidelines. Obviously, across the State priority is given to ensuring that water supplies comply with health guidelines. As the member said, water supplied to Preston Beach does contain elevated levels of calcium and salinity, which are in the realm of aesthetic or non-health water quality parameters. As the member has pointed out, issues arise for the local community when the water is hard and the salinity level high. Unfortunately, this is typical of many small coastal communities. That is because of the source of the water. I am informed that the Water Corporation has an agreement with the Department of Health to progressively improve the aesthetic water quality parameters. Obviously, in all cases, an examination of the health parameters is the first priority, and an examination of the aesthetic parameters is the second priority. I understand that two meetings were held with the Preston Beach Progress Association in February and April this year, so the community is aware of the nature of its water supply from a health and aesthetic perspective. These meetings have also provided information about what the Water Corporation is doing to address this aesthetic water quality problem. As the member has alluded to, the use of calgon was introduced several years ago to try to reduce the scaling effect associated with water hardness. However, from what the member said about that person’s hot water system, it clearly has not been as successful as it might have been. As the member for Murray-Wellington said, the community would like to connect to the Harvey-Stirling scheme. At this stage the cost of that is estimated to be in the order of $2 million, and there would be ongoing operating costs. The Water Corporation already fulfils a community service obligation for the provision of water supplies to Preston Beach. I understand that CSO requirement would increase if the connection were made to the Harvey-Stirling scheme. Equally, though, the cost associated with treating water to reduce the calcium and salinity levels is prohibitive. I appreciate the member’s grievance. I will take up this matter with the Water Corporation. I have been aware in the past of complaints about water quality at Myalup and Binningup; I am not sure that Preston Beach has come to my attention. Can the member tell me by interjection roughly the number of people who live in that area permanently and what the population swells to seasonally?

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7851

Mr J.L. Bradshaw: I suspect there are about 300 to 400 permanent residents, but the population would at least double during holiday time. There are a number of holiday cottages there. Dr J.M. EDWARDS: Right. I am informed that the Water Corporation plans to carry out investigative drilling in the coming financial year, 2003-04, with a view to augmenting and improving the water supply in the area. I will take up this matter with the Water Corporation. I will also seek information from the Office of Water Regulation to check on the progress that the Water Corporation has made in complying with the Australian Drinking Water Guidelines, particularly in small communities. Clearly, if people in those communities need to replace items such as hot water systems much more often, that becomes a real impost on the community. Mr J.L. Bradshaw: What I am trying to say is that the Water Corporation should not drill for extra water, because the risk is that it will not find it anyway; and, if it does, the water will still be salty or hard or both. The money should go towards offsetting the cost of this new pipeline. Also, I find it difficult to understand why the Water Corporation would have an increased CSO under those circumstances, because the current cost of treating the water would be offset. Dr J.M. EDWARDS: I will seek more information on that issue and provide that to the member. PUBLIC ACCESS WAYS Grievance MS M.M. QUIRK (Girrawheen) [9.17 am]: My grievance is directed to the Minister for Planning and Infrastructure and relates to the vexed issue of public access ways. In particular, I am concerned about the process to close those PAWs. These access ways are highly contentious, with many residents lobbying for their closure, as it is felt that they facilitate the commission of criminal offences by providing cover for miscreants. Even aside from security concerns, the suburbs in my electorate of Girrawheen are not readily geared towards pedestrian entry and egress. There are many roads on which there are few traffic-calming measures, and also the main roads have a speed limit of 70 kilometres an hour. There are no traffic-free zones. Places of interest are spread out, which necessitates car usage as a matter of course. Moreover, many places are without footpaths. Similarly, there are no clear sight lines of visibility, and street designs are principally cul-de-sacs and access ways with permeable barriers, such as fences, widespread throughout. For these reasons, Girrawheen is not a pedestrian-friendly environment. Given the general physical layout of the suburbs within my electorate and the surrounding amenities, they clearly fail the so-called walkable neighbourhood criteria. These criteria are set out in the Western Australian sustainable cities initiatives, which lists a number of principal aims to achieve more livable and sustainable neighbourhoods. A number of these are worth examining in the present context. Although these criteria are intended for future developments rather than existing ones, they are instructive for the purpose of ascertaining how well existing urban design conforms with the so-called notions of livability. The Western Australian Planning Commission document entitled “Introducing Liveable Neighbourhoods”, edition 2, sets out these livability guidelines. Among other things, they state - 1. To provide for an urban structure of walkable neighbourhoods clustering to form towns of compatibly mixed uses in order to reduce car dependence for access to employment, retail and community facilities. 2. To ensure that walkable neighbourhoods and access to services and facilities are designed for all users, including users with disabilities. The guidelines further state - 4. To provide for access generally by way of an interconnected network of streets which facilitate safe, efficient and pleasant walking, cycling and driving. 5. To ensure active street-land use interfaces, with building frontages to streets to improve personal safety through increased surveillance and activity. In this context I note the observations of Wekerle and Whitzman in their 1995 book Safe Cities: Guidelines for Planning, Design, and Management, which states - Low-density suburban residential developments, with pedestrian pathways and cul-de-sacs, create streetscapes with no people or activities, especially during the day. Large shopping plazas turn inward away from the street, and drain the streets of vitality. Their large parking lots are isolated at off-peak hours and increasingly become sites for abductions, assaults, and carjackings. Given the foregoing, it is no wonder that members of the community are ill disposed towards public access ways. It is also apparent that unless these access ways are part of overall and holistic planning strategies, they are unlikely to be successful and promote the objectives intended. Having said that, I am firmly of the view that each application for closure should be judged on its merits. Some difficulties with PAWs can also be addressed by improving sightlines or lighting or, in some cases, ensuring regular clean-ups. This remedial action can in many cases obviate the need for closure. I do, however, support the principle that the decision to close or to not close is essentially a matter for comprehensive community consultation. At present the procedure for closing PAWs incorporates community input, but my concern is that the current processes can potentially devalue and discount that input.

7852 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

Ordinarily, an application will be made to a local authority by way of petition. This may also require the payment of a small fee to cover administration costs. The council will then consider whether the closure is warranted. Prior to reaching that decision, the council will advertise and serve notice on the public in the general locality of the PAW and on service authorities, such as Telstra, the Water Corporation and Western Power, that the closure of a particular PAW is being considered. Such notification is by way of newspaper advertisements, mail when appropriate and by signs on the site. As the land within the PAW needs to be amalgamated with the adjoining landholdings, no recommendation for closure will be made if the property owners decline. If, after considering any submissions made, the council resolves to proceed with the closure, it will refer the request to the Department of Land Administration. I understand that DOLA may consult with the Western Australian Planning Commission and the Department for Planning and Infrastructure. In the event that DOLA agrees to the closure, the land will be divided equally, as is practicable, amongst the adjoining property owners or whoever desires the amalgamation of their landholding. The full cost of the closure including administration and advertising, land acquisition, service relocation, pavement removal and fencing is to be met proportionally by those owners. My difficulty is when DOLA or the WAPC disagrees. Clearly, the community and local government would have undertaken a comprehensive and thorough process and consulted widely; yet DOLA can overrule the will of the community and the local council. The decision of DOLA or the WAPC to overrule the will of the community is not subject to any appeal or review mechanism. I have been approached by a local authority within my electorate, the City of Wanneroo. It considers that after a council has gone through considerable effort and expense to ascertain and advance community wishes, and DOLA or the WAPC chooses to overrule the decision, it should be the subject of a review or an appeal mechanism. It may well be that the decision could be highly amenable to review by the local government division of the soon to be established State Administrative Tribunal. I ask the minister to give consideration to either establishing an informal mechanism of review or consenting to an appeal mechanism formally established under the aegis of the SAT. Such a scheme would signal to local governments that any reversal of the wishes of the council and the community is not done lightly or without due consideration and is subject to external review to ensure greater transparency and full accountability in decision making. MS A.J. MacTIERNAN (Armadale - Minister for Planning and Infrastructure) [9.23 am]: I thank the member for her grievance. She has raised an issue that has been of great concern to a number of local authorities. The issue of public access ways and their impact is very much the result of a failed planning theory that is in place in suburbs developed particularly in the 1960s and 1970s. It was based on a philosophy that it was somehow or other desirable to have suburban layouts that were based on cul-de-sacs. Inherent in these designs was the notion that the car was the dominant form of transport and that any other activity was secondary. Those suburbs have created a number of problems. They are very impermeable and make it very difficult to provide public transport. As the member knows from her own area, it is very difficult getting adequate public transport into suburbs that are laid out in that fashion. Concessions had to be made because some people, even in the 1960s and 1970s, did not own cars. Some people by virtue of age, disability, preference or economics did not have access to a car and had to walk, whether it be to school, shops or churches, to visit friends or for any other community activity. Under these particular cul-de-sac designs, the time it took people to walk to places that were often, as the crow flies, very close was extended enormously. Public access ways were created in these subdivision designs to give those people who were not able to access a motor vehicle an opportunity to walk to their destinations within a reasonable time frame. The theory was great. It was a theory presumably developed in “Pleasantville” in the United States, where there was complete social homogeny and harmony. The SPEAKER: That will be Karratha! Ms A.J. MacTIERNAN: Yes, in a place such as Karratha, and not any slagheap of despair. The reality, particularly in the past 15 years, is that these access ways have increasingly become sources of access to properties by various villains and tyrants, and people have become hostile to them. It is also the case that sometimes obviously the people who live adjacent to those access ways would very much like to absorb that additional land into their properties. Numerous representations have been made to me by members of my local community who want their public access ways closed. That is only one-half of the story. I urge members and councils to consider the position of the other people, particularly schoolchildren, old people and disabled people, who are not able to use a car or do not want to use a car and need that pedestrian access. I have done some work and considered the additional travel times that would be imposed on those people if public access ways in my electorate were closed. We cannot always go along with those closures. I understand that it is a difficult problem for councils. Pressure is put on them. However, at the end of the day we must consider the whole community. We must consider not only the people applying that pressure who perhaps are often better resourced, but also the consequences of the closure. As the member said, it is important to look at this on a case-by-case basis. The Government has changed the way in which the closure of access ways is assessed. There is a different proposition altogether. I have approved a planning bulletin that will set out a new regime. It is not appropriate that DOLA make the decisions. In fact, by law, and now in practice, these decisions must be made by the WA Planning Commission.

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7853

Today I will issue a planning bulletin that will set out the new process for assessment. It will set out what the local council needs to report on when it puts a proposition to the WA Planning Commission. It sets out how the Western Australian Planning Commission will make its assessment on whether to close it. As I say, we must consciously look at those issues. In the couple of minutes left remaining to me I will go through the types of issues that must be addressed. The impact that closing the public access way will have on local pedestrian and cycling activity must be considered; that is, the additional travelling distance required to get from one’s original destination after the closure and the impact of traffic and other activities on the remaining PAWs. The WAPC must consider the impact the closure of the PAW will have on safe accesses to neighbourhood and district facilities, including schools, education facilities, shops, parks and recreation facilities, community facilities, employment, public transport services and aged persons and disability facilities. The WAPC must also consider the length of the alternative routes and the safety and surveillance of those alternative routes and their impact, particularly on the young, disabled and elderly. It must look at the role of that PAW as part of a wider pedestrian-cycling network or continuous access routes. It must look at the incidence of crime and consider the views of the adjoining landowners and the alternatives to closing the PAW. As the member suggested, it must also consider improved visibility and lighting and also nocturnal gating. We have changed the system. The matter is a concern, but I urge members to remember that this is a very complex matter as a result of a failed planning strategy that we must ensure is not repeated in the future. WESTERN AUSTRALIAN GROUP TRAINING SCHEME Grievance MRS C.L. EDWARDES (Kingsley) [9.31 am]: I grieve to the Minister for Education and Training. An article appeared in the Sunday Times last Sunday about the West Australian Group Training Scheme. I will give members some background information on this issue. The group has existed since 1990. Bill Ethel, of the Construction, Forestry, Mining and Energy Union assisted in its establishment. It is a registered training organisation under the Australian National Training Authority. It was re-registered as a training organisation only last September. It operates from Balga TAFE. It is a not-for-profit scheme and has a board of which two Department of Education and Training representatives are ex officio members. It has 155 apprentices, 28 of whom could currently be placed in jobs, including 18 hairdressers and 10 apprentices involved in the construction industry. The Government has said it cannot employ those people. The group has a good, new board that wants to get on with the job under the chairmanship of Richard Kendall. The group has had a fight or two with the CFMEU, and that was highlighted in the Sunday Times article. The CFMEU believes and acts as though the WAGTS is its training organisation. Kevin Reynolds of the CFMEU is also the Chairman of the Construction Skills Training Centre at Welshpool, which also operates under a board. Brian Burke - lobbyist extraordinaire - is a member of that board. The board has made a conscious decision to take over the WAGTS, and the Construction Skills Training Centre is the skills training centre that was the subject of comment in the Cole royal commission. It was mentioned in the commission because of the compulsory training levy and a $1 million grant from ANTA, which was based on what is now known to be wrong information used in an application form for revenues to go to the skills training centre, but which instead go to the CFMEU. Less than a third of that money is loaned back to the CSTC. The CFMEU makes no secret of the fact that it wants the 155 apprentices at Welshpool. The report in the Sunday Times states - The latest edition of the union’s journal The Construction Worker reports in a review of 2002: “We also looked at expanding the training centre in Welshpool to accommodate the WA Group Training Scheme . . . While this was not achieved in 2002 we have not given up on the proposal entirely.” The WAGTS has rejected the advances of the CFMEU. Why is the Government pursuing this registered training organisation with a vengeance? The Government wants to evict the WAGTS from its premises at Balga TAFE and is auditing it only six months after the last audit was conducted. The Government has also threatened it with deregistration as an incorporated body through a technicality in its adoption of a new constitution, and is squeezing it financially by reneging on a written agreement to fund it. Is that happening because the WAGTS kicked two CFMEU members off its board because they were not elected but were appointed by Kevin Reynolds? The Sunday Times reports that Frank Allen smells a rat. I think it is because of the incestuous relationship between the CFMEU and the Government. The member for Peel is the best mate of Kevin Reynolds. Matt Keogh is an ex-Builders Labourers Federation member who now works for the office of the Minister for Education and Training. A number of people involved have close associations with the Government. Brian Burke is also a part of this. I wonder which government members he has been talking to about this matter. There has been a hugely acrimonious dispute between the CFMEU and the WAGTS, which was also reported in the Sunday Times. Frank Allen’s son Mark, who was employed by the CFMEU, died on a construction site. If someone challenges the CFMEU, it will respond viciously and this Government will aid and abet the CFMEU. Last Thursday the Government gave the WAGTS 21 days to get its constitution in order or it would be deregistered. That follows the registration of its new constitution last February, which the CFMEU challenged. It took the Government three months

7854 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] to find a technicality on which it could base a challenge. The Government claimed the motion for members to adopt a new constitution omitted the words “special resolution”. The WAGTS went through the process again. It sent out a notification that included the two words. A meeting was held three weeks ago and the new constitution was passed. The representatives from the CFMEU voted against it and one person did not attend. Frank Allen lodged the constitution with the Department of Consumer and Employment Protection the next day. Can members guess what happened next? There was another objection. This time the objection came from Department of Education and Training on the basis that the board did not give approval for the notices of special resolution to be sent. The Department of Education and Training gave the WAGTS 21 days to get its constitution in order and then objected to it when it did. The Department of Education and Training has a conflict of interest. The minutes that authorised sending out the notices have been lodged with the Department of Consumer and Employment Protection and the WAGTS hopes that the department will do the right thing. I refer to the notice given to the WAGTS to vacate its premises. It has been reaffirmed that the WAGTS is to vacate its premises by 30 June 2003. The TAFE directors asked for an extension of one year, which the Department of Education and Training knocked back. Why? Presumably because it needs the space for a child-care centre. Previously, the Minister for Education and Training had told Frank Allen that there would not be a problem because the premises were not classrooms. Interestingly, the director of the college is not aware that the premises are to be used as a child-care centre. In November last year the Department of Education and Training agreed to support the WAGTS and to work with the board. Larry Davies was the Department of Education and Training officer who dealt with the WAGTS. He has since been shifted from his position. The Department of Education and Training also agreed to advance funding from February 2003 and pay it in December. I asked a question of the then minister, who confirmed that agreement. A new contractual agreement supporting that arrangement was signed on 3 December. The agreement stated that $60 000 was to be paid in December last year and another $60 000 was to be paid in June this year. There has been a change of minister and the Government has reneged on the agreement. Various excuses have been given for not paying the $60 000. No meetings were held and no financial records have been given to the WAGTS, yet two ex-officio representatives from the Department of Education and Training are on the board and they have been given the financial records. Further, the cost of apprentices increased. Enterprise bargaining agreements incorporated apprentices who were given back pay for six months, and that cannot be recouped. There is also the issue of the Baulderstone Hornibrook Pty Ltd site. Warren Anderson of Anderson Formrite Pty Ltd owes $52 000 but has been declared bankrupt. Westswan Formwork owes $23 000 for wages and allowances for apprentices, but it too has been declared bankrupt. Kevin Reynolds told the WAGTS that Westswan would pay Warren Anderson’s debt, but only after the royal commission handed down its decision. Why? Because of threats and intimidation. John Graham of Westswan told Eddy Campbell, a field officer with the WAGTS, that Kevin Reynolds had told Westswan Formwork not to give the money to the WAGTS because the Westswan would do the work at its training centre for apprentices in Welshpool. Why? The money is not owed to the CSTC or the CFMEU; it belongs to the WAGTS. MR A.J. CARPENTER (Willagee - Minister for Education and Training) [9.39 am]: I thank the member for the grievance. This case is a personal tragedy that is being publicly played out in Western Australia. What has happened is very sad. I am not talking about it being sad in a political sense, but in a personal sense. Every time this matter is exposed, the tragedy gets deeper and deeper. It is a tragedy revolving around Mr Allen, and it goes back to the death of his son when he was a Construction, Forestry, Mining and Energy Union member. It is fair to say that the relationship between Mr Allen and the union movement has now soured. I knew nothing about this before. When I became the training minister Mr Allen sought a meeting with me. I met him in Parliament House; it was a good meeting. He is a very pleasant fellow. He raised a number of issues. Some concerned the way in which the group training scheme was reconstituted. In my mind, they raise questions of its legality. Subsequent to that, an issue came to light through some of the department’s notices. The member for Kingsley has not mentioned that Mr Allen received a termination payment. When the old group training scheme was de-constituted, Mr Allen sought and was granted by one person on the board, a payout of $35 000. Three days later he was back at work in essentially the same job. Given that the State Government had given considerable amounts of money to prop up what was a collapsing scheme, for that to occur raises very serious questions in my mind about the operations of the training scheme. What is happening is very sad. I know that the member for Kingsley has a good relationship with Mr Allen. I would suggest to her to treat this matter very carefully. I do not know how this will play out; I am fearful how it will play out for Mr Allen. Investigations will eventually occur. The situation is distressing; Mr Allen is a very pleasant man. He has had a lot of tragedy in his life. I feel sorry for him. The Western Australian Group Training Scheme employs 295 apprentices and trainees. Its financial situation is a problem. The group training scheme has been experiencing financial problems since November 2001. It has had ongoing discussions with the Department of Training regarding its financial position. Payments were brought forward because it was on the verge of collapsing through massive debt. The scheme’s financial position has arisen largely due to poor financial management.

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7855

Mrs C.L. Edwardes interjected. Mr A.J. CARPENTER: This is the essence of the problem; the member knows it. The scheme has failed to increase its charge-out rates in line with wage increases and has allowed a significant number of outstanding debts to accrue. The debts ended up being in the vicinity of $700 000, 25 per cent of which were long- term and potentially bad debts. Assistance was sought and money was injected. Payments were brought forward by the previous minister to try to help. Since then WAGTS has been able to negotiate with a number of its creditors to defer monthly payments. The WAGTS was originally established as a union-run group training scheme with a constitution that specified that membership of the management committee should comprise an elected chair and vice chair, two representatives from the Construction Contractors Association of Western Australia, two representatives from the Construction, Forestry, Mining and Energy Union, one representative from the West Australian Solid Plastering Association, one from the housing industry, and one from the Department of Training. The CFMEU is understood to have expressed concern for some time about the management abilities of Mr Allen. This is what this comes down to: the financial management of the scheme and whether Mr Allen, for all his good intent - which no-one doubts - is capable of managing the scheme. As a consequence, relations between Mr Allen and the CFMEU have become extremely tense. We must remember the connection between Mark Allen, who was killed on a construction site and whose memorial is across the road from Parliament House, and Mr Frank Allen. This is a deeply personal issue that is being played out in a public away. The tensions culminated at an annual general meeting of the WAGTS that was held on 26 November 2002. Prior to the AGM, both the chair and vice chair resigned and the AGM was chaired by an outside person. At the meeting the CFMEU representatives were ejected. It is understood that a number of new employer members had been signed up in the week prior to the AGM. Following the election of a new committee, Mr Allen tabled the new constitution for approval by members. The new constitution was approved by the members present and subsequently forwarded to the Department of Consumer and Employment Protection, not my department. At the AGM, a new chair and vice chair were appointed. The new constitution effectively limits union representation on the management committee to only one person and removes the requirement that the chair and vice chair be representative of any organisation at all. This is where the question of the legality of the new constitution arises. Is the organisation now constituted legally? It is not a technical issue. It is fundamental whether it is legally constituted. It is a pretty big technicality. Mrs C.L. Edwardes interjected. Mr A.J. CARPENTER: I am advising the House of information we are working on supplied by the department. It is the view of the department, confirmed by the Department of Consumer and Employment Protection, that the process did not meet the requirements under the Associations Incorporation Act, which were included in the WAGTS constitution and which specify a number of requirements. There is also the matter of the termination payment for Mr Allen. Am I, as the custodian of the finances of the department, really expected to keep pouring money into an organisation that has deep financial problems, about which serious questions have been raised as to the management capacity of the person running it, and which is determined by the Department of Education and Training and the Department of Consumer and Employment Protection to not be legally constituted? We must bear in mind that the CEO has received a $35 000 payout from his previous position. He has flipped over and continued in the same job. I cannot condone support for the organisation. This matter must be dealt with correctly otherwise the government approach to the training industry will be completely blown away. The notion that I, as the Minister for Education and Training, would be involved in, or part of, some conspiracy against Mr Allen is offensive. It is not conceivable. I am not, and never will be, a prisoner of, or directed by, undue influence from any group. I will treat people fairly. TRAVELSMART PROGRAM Grievance MR J.N. HYDE (Perth) [9.47 am]: My grievance is to the Minister for Planning and Infrastructure. I am concerned that the community may not be giving the TravelSmart program the praise and benefit it deserves. Many of the benefits of TravelSmart are shown in our public transport system and, more importantly, our total transport system. Unfortunately, we sometimes put transport issues into silos. People either talk about roads, trains or buses; they do not talk about the comprehensive system of transport. We cannot look at things in isolation. It is no good talking about the Peel deviation or the Mandurah rail line without looking at the whole system. I acknowledge that some very good work was done by the previous Government, although I note that when I was Mayor of the Town of Vincent money for the TravelSmart program was spent on some very glossy brochures and giant pictures of the then Minister for Transport, Hon Murray Criddle. Ms A.J. MacTiernan: Photogenic though he is! Mr J.N. HYDE: When another part of my electorate, the Town of Cambridge, had a similar TravelSmart program people were not treated to gigantic pictures of the minister’s good self. My electorate is poorer for that.

7856 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

Ms A.J. MacTiernan: Sarcasm is the wit of a half-wit! Mr J.N. HYDE: The retorts from one’s friends are much more incisive than those from one’s enemies! I applaud the minister for cutting back on the glossy brochures, the silly hats and the other excesses that were in the program and concentrating more on changing commuter behaviour. That is the success of TravelSmart. I have received some feedback from residents in the Town of Cambridge. I would like to see whether it is correct. They told me that although there has not been a gigantic increase in the number of people using buses, as has been seen in the local government areas of Vincent, South Perth and Melville, there has been a very big increase in the number of cars with two or more passengers. Previously, the Town of Cambridge was an area that had a high proportion of single passenger cars - lots of Landcruisers and so on. The TravelSmart program in the area has changed commuter behaviour. More people are now car pooling. That is a very important factor in this program. Every person who is off the road, either on a train, walking or using a bus, means less congestion on the roads; and in a holistic sense it also means less capital expenditure for government, this being a State that does not have toll roads. In terms of road infrastructure, the solution by the previous Government was to keep adding lanes onto the Narrows Bridge. If it gets any wider it will be like an aircraft carrier. That is clearly not the best solution for a sustainable society or sustainable transport. It is very important to link the decrease in the growth of car use and road transport with the increase in public transport. The train line to Mandurah, the four new train stations in my own electorate and other advantages will lead to more people being attracted to use public transport, which leads to less congestion, particularly in the inner city. If things go right under the minister’s visionary leadership, we will not reach the point at which the Lord Mayor has to introduce a $20 car levy every time a vehicle goes into the central business district, because congestion in the CBD has been kept down by devoting resources to public transport, the underground train is coming through, and TravelSmart and the CAT buses have been introduced. When people criticise public transport, the CAT bus system is self-funding. That is one of the best examples of user-pays I have seen for that form of finance gathering. In many cases people have the luxury of big car bays close to the CBD and they make a lifestyle choice not to use public transport but to drive their car right into the CBD. It is only fit and proper that there be a tax on those car bays, and that tax pays for a free transit system - the CAT system - which keeps more people off the roads, which means that those people who do choose to use their cars are able to use their cars for less time, less running costs and, importantly, less pollution costs for the environment. There are benefits, and it is a true user-pays system. People who are paying that car bay tax are getting value for money, and many others in our community are benefiting. It is a good development in terms of sustainability and the development of a modern city. I am sure the minister has many examples of cities around the world where this does not work. In Perth we are able to look to the future. This is the most centralised State in the western world. There is no other area in the western world where so many people choose to live in its wonderful capital city - 76 per cent. Unfortunately the needs of those people have been neglected many times, certainly by previous Governments. It is important that through the TravelSmart program, through a holistic understanding of public transport and its symbiotic relationship with the private car, we can create a system that gets people to work, leisure and culture quickly and gets them home just as quickly and safely and in an environmentally sensitive and sustainable way. MS A.J. MacTIERNAN (Armadale - Minister for Planning and Infrastructure) [9.55 am]: I thank the member for Perth for his grievance. I note he is grieving perhaps more against a lack of appreciation in some quarters, and I could point to the opposition benches rather than any criticism of this Government that is very focused on public transport and ways of reducing the level of car dependency in our city. Mr J.N. Hyde: That was not a sarcastic comment. Ms A.J. MacTIERNAN: Not at all. The member would be aware that I have had a brief trip to foreign parts in recent weeks. The overwhelming lesson that came out of that trip was that those communities that have not continued to invest in public transport infrastructure have found themselves with very real problems, which is certainly the case in London and in many other cities in the United Kingdom. The member alluded to the fact that they are now looking at some radical alternatives when trying to deal with car dependency. The Mayor of Greater London, Ken Livingstone, has introduced a congestion charge of £5 for cars coming within the inner city boundaries, and that has had a great impact. There has already been a 15 to 20 per cent reduction in the number of vehicles on the roads in that inner city precinct. As a result, people who go into the city are finding it comparatively easy to move around. We were constantly being given time estimates of how long it would take to get from the London Public Transport Users Group to the office of the Minister for Transport, for example, and the time was always being over-estimated because internal travel times have dropped so dramatically. This leads me to another important point: we need to understand that good public transport is not just a welfare issue. So many people think public transport is all about welfare. While those issues of social equality and access to mobility are very important, there are also other important aspects to public transport, a couple of which are to ensure that the city operates effectively and that we can move around the city relatively efficiently. So many people in the UK are finding that the congestion tax is adding to the economic activity and the life of the city, and is making it a far more economically efficient place in which to operate, not to forget the environmental issues to which the member referred.

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7857

TravelSmart fits within this project. I acknowledge that in its pilot phase, TravelSmart was commenced by the previous Government. Having successfully completed the pilot, it did not continue to keep the program going. I do not have the figures here, but by the end of next year this Government will have spent in excess of $5 million on TravelSmart. TravelSmart is a behaviour change program. It is one thing to provide the infrastructure, but also we must deal with the demand side - we must convince people that other serious transport options are available apart from the automobile, such as public transport, cycling and walking. For those who are sceptical, the results have been remarkable. Two projects have been completed in South Perth and the Cambridge local government area, and there has been a five to 14 per cent reduction in car trips, a 61 to 67 per cent increase in cycling and up to 35 per cent increase in walking. Mr R.C. Kucera interjected. Ms A.J. MacTIERNAN: The Minister for Health bought a bike as an example to his portfolio. Mrs C.L. Edwardes: But does he ride it? Ms A.J. MacTIERNAN: He does. That is why he is looking so trim and wonderful; and I am not being sarcastic either. There has been a 13 to 17 per cent increase in the use of public transport patronage. The residents of Leederville and Wembley, also in the electorate of Perth, have reduced their car usage by increasing the use of alternatives, and we are awaiting final figures from that project. There is a project in Marangaroo, and over the next 18 months projects will be established in Subiaco, Fremantle, west Melville - I think that is Willagee - Armadale and Belmont. The Treasurer will be persuaded about the benefits of TravelSmart when he sees it operating in Belmont. Projects will also operate in Gosnells and Thornlie. One of the Government’s early concerns was that although such a project worked in the more affluent suburbs such as South Perth, it did not know how translatable it would be elsewhere. That is why the Government has been keen to take it to places like Marangaroo, Willagee, Thornlie and Armadale, where it has been tried in various ways and configurations to determine its impact. We are still awaiting those results. However, the project is looking positive, particularly for Marangaroo. The follow-up research for South Perth suggests that there is longevity in that change of behaviour. I thank the member for raising this important issue and for his genuine commitment to public transport and the reduction of automobile dependence in our city. The SPEAKER: Grievances noted.

MEMBER FOR PEEL Personal Explanation - Mr Frank Allen MR N.R. MARLBOROUGH (Peel - Parliamentary Secretary) [10.03 am] - by leave: I was as disturbed as the Minister for Consumer and Employment Protection when the member for Kingsley implied that I had used what she perceives to be a personal friendship with Kevin Reynolds as an opportunity to be a party to the action against Mr Frank Allen. I want to put the record straight. From the word go I say that I do not believe that Frank Allen raised this matter directly with the member for Kingsley. I would be very surprised if that were the case, because only two weeks ago Mr Frank Allen rang the office of the Minister for Consumer and Employment Protection and asked whether I would continue working with the Perth City Council to create a memorial for his son Mark, which is something I have been working on for the past 10 months. I take umbrage at the suggestion that I have played a personal role in what has happened to the organisation. In the time that the organisation has been in financial trouble, Mr Frank Allen would tell anybody who asked him that in my position as Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister for Consumer and Employment Protection, I have been the vehicle by which his case has been brought before the minister. Further, at least on one occasion, I have been party to putting forward an argument to the Government so that the financial problems Mr Allen experienced last year could be overcome with further assistance from the Government. There is absolutely no intent on my part to see any apprentice scheme fall over for whatever reason, least of all on the basis of a personal relationship that the member for Kingsley perceives I have with Kevin Reynolds, one she believes is clouding my judgment on the matter.

PUBLIC ACCOUNTS COMMITTEE Review of the 2001-02 Annual Report of the Auditor General MR J.B. D’ORAZIO (Ballajura) [10.06 am]: I present for tabling the Public Accounts Committee’s “The 2001-2002 Annual Report of the Office of the Auditor General: A Performance Review: Report No. 3”. [See paper No 1118.] Mr J.B. D’ORAZIO: On 5 March, the Public Accounts Committee resolved to undertake a review of the 2001-02 annual report of the Office of the Auditor General of Western Australia. The Auditor General provides a great review function for Western Australia. Over the past 12 months, he has produced an impressive annual report, the details of which are contained in the committee’s report. The Auditor General has produced 10 extensive reports. This is the first

7858 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] time that the Public Accounts Committee has reviewed the role of the Auditor General, and it is appropriate that it continue to do so. The committee assessed the reports and their implementation. More importantly, the committee assessed the report that Parliament receives about the efficiency of the Office of the Auditor General. The committee found that the information that explains how potential audits are prioritised is inadequate, and believes that when the Auditor General picks topics for investigation, priority should be given to certain issues. There should also be a basis upon which the parameters for the investigations are decided and a determination is made of how the resources will be allocated to the investigations. The committee also found that the implementation of the Auditor General’s recommendations are not clear cut. In a small number of cases the Auditor General reviewed issues two years after they were initially considered. There must be a more effective way of ensuring that the Auditor General’s recommendations are taken on board and, more importantly, implemented by agencies. The parliamentary survey that the Auditor General relies on to determine the effectiveness of the Auditor General’s office is inadequate. There must be a further strengthening of that process to ensure that the report of the Auditor General and the effectiveness of his office are judged in a more extensive way. The committee found that matters of significance identified in reports must be clearly identified. The basis upon which they are included in the reports and the context in which they are delivered must also be clearly identified. To that end, the Public Accounts Committee has made 12 recommendations that it believes will improve this process. The annual report should provide a brief background on the way the terms of reference are determined for performance examinations. That is important for not only agencies but also those who are reading the reports. The information regarding follow-up performance examinations is limited at best. There should be brief summaries on the examinations and relevant conclusions from the examinations. Further, there must be better implementation processes for the recommendations. The committee’s main recommendation is that from now on the Public Accounts Committee will require agencies who have performance examinations to report on the progress of the implementation of those recommendations within 12 months. The Public Accounts Committee would like to put agencies on notice that if the reports are not adequate, the committee will take further action by either referring matters back to the Auditor General for further investigation or conducting a public hearing. In that way, we will be able to establish why the agencies have not complied with the recommendations in the Auditor General’s report. It is important that the Office of the Auditor General be effective. It is also important that agencies understand that recommendations are made for a reason and that they must be implemented as quickly as possible. Of course, there will be circumstances in which agencies cannot comply because of a lack of technology, resources or other factors. In such cases, the Public Accounts Committee would like to be informed. More importantly, Parliament must be made aware of why the recommendations have not been implemented. It can then consider ways of solving the problems, because it is important that once weaknesses are identified, we implement change. The committee was happy with the performance of the Office of the Auditor General. However, the reporting of the office’s effectiveness depends on a parliamentary survey that is filled out by members of Parliament. That in itself is inadequate. There must be greater depth in the process that determines the effectiveness of the Office of the Auditor General. To that end, the committee is of the view that more face-to-face interviews with some of those involved in the process would be adequate. Filling in a questionnaire that has boxes to tick is an inadequate way of assessing the performance of the Auditor General. The annual report should contain extra information on projects that the Auditor General has undertaken and time frames that have not been met. For example, if the Auditor General undertakes an investigation, he allocates resources and imposes time lines. It is important that his report informs the Parliament of the reasons for not meeting time lines, the fact that the Office of the Auditor General has needed extra resources, and any other problems encountered. Giving us merely the conclusions may not necessarily give us the full picture. It is very important for both agencies and the Parliament that when matters of significance are identified, their background be highlighted so that they become understandable in the context in which they have been raised. The committee believes that reports of the peer review of the Office of the Auditor General should be made available. Auditors around Australia have a peer review group, and it is important that the feelings and acknowledgments of that group be incorporated in annual reports. It is important that the Parliament obtain from the Office of the Auditor General as much information as possible so that it can see that the agencies working for the Parliament and the people of Western Australia are operating in the most efficient way. It is important that the Auditor General’s role be strongly supported. If further resources are required, highlighting some of the issues, as has been done in the report, will allow us to have a more efficient Office of the Auditor General, which in the long term will make the public service in Western Australia that much more efficient. I believe that the key item in the end is that it will deliver better outcomes for the community of Western Australia. I thank the deputy chairman, the committee members and the staff, Andrea McCallum and Simon Kennedy for their work on this report. I look forward to working with the Office of the Auditor General and, more importantly, delivering a message to the agencies in Western Australia that once parameters have been examined through the Office of the Auditor General, the Public Accounts Committee will have a watching brief on all departments to make sure on behalf of the Parliament of Western Australia that those recommendations are implemented.

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7859

MR M.P. WHITELY (Roleystone) [10.13 am]: Let me start by thanking Andrea McCallum and Simon Kennedy for the work that they did on the inquiry. Their work was of high quality, and I greatly appreciate it, as do the other committee members. I echo the comments of the member for Ballajura: the committee appreciates the work of the Auditor General and acknowledges the need for the independence of the Office of the Auditor General. I refer to some of the key recommendations. I believe the most important are recommendations 3, 4 and in particular, 5, which are really designed to ensure that better follow-up work occurs so that the good work done by the Auditor General is not wasted. There is not much point in the Auditor General identifying issues and making recommendations for implementation if appropriate follow-up work does not occur. Recommendations 3 and 4 are particularly aimed at ensuring a better and more cooperative approach between the Auditor General, Public Accounts Committee and the agencies. Recommendation 5 is probably the most significant because it requires that agencies respond to the Public Accounts Committee 12 months after the tabling of the Auditor General’s report and that they comment upon the implementation of every recommendation of the Auditor General. It is a key recommendation because it ensures that the good work done by the Auditor General will not be wasted. It is one thing to have a well-resourced Office of the Auditor General that does effective work, but unless follow-up work can be ensured with the authority of the Parliament behind the Public Accounts Committee, the potential is that the work will not be followed up. I commend the work of the committee and particularly those recommendations that ensure that the good work of the Auditor General is followed up. MR J.L. BRADSHAW (Murray-Wellington) [10.16 am]: The report has been well prepared. I congratulate our research assistants, Andrea McCallum and Simon Kennedy, for the great work that they have done. The Office of the Auditor General had never been examined by the Public Accounts Committee, so this was a first and was worthwhile. It is a question of who watches the watchdog. In this case the Public Accounts Committee has that role. It has therefore examined the performance of the Office of the Auditor General. It is important that the Auditor General have an independent role to ensure that he is not put under pressure. The main recommendation of the report is that the departments subject to performance examination must report back to the Public Accounts Committee. That is important because all too often reports and recommendations are made but nothing comes of them because reports sit on a shelf and are forgotten about. The implementation of this recommendation will mean that those departments must come back to the Public Accounts Committee and outline what they have or have not done and why they have or have not done it. The Public Accounts Committee can then assess its performance and bring to bear any pressure that might need to be brought to bear. The committee’s recommendations are important and will play an important role in ensuring that government agencies perform better and give the best value to the taxpayers. JOINT STANDING COMMITTEE ON DELEGATED LEGISLATION Powers of Entry and Powers to Make Local Laws that Affect Private Land under the Local Government Act 1995, Seventh Report MS M.M. QUIRK (Girrawheen) [10.18 am]: I present for tabling the seventh report of the Joint Standing Committee on Delegated Legislation entitled “Powers of Entry and Powers to Make Local Laws That Affect Private Land Under the Local Government Act 1995”. [See paper No 1119.] Ms M.M. QUIRK: The report’s genesis has taken a long time. It raises issues of fundamental importance for the liberty of the citizen. Before I comment on the contents of the report, I thank the clerk assistant Nigel Pratt, who first raised the issue when he was principal advisory officer to the committee some years ago, and more latterly Denise Wong, Jan Paniperis and Anne Turner. Their help in compiling this report is much appreciated. I am very pleased that we have finally managed to table it after its fairly lengthy gestation period. Underlying the report is the inevitable tension between disallowance of subordinate legislation in the public interest and the objective to advance the legislative agenda through regulation. This report can be seen as a case study of the Local Government Act 1995. The report examines the extent to which that law erodes the common law principles of right of entry onto private land to permit local officials to enter for a variety of purposes. When the Local Government Act was first passed in 1995, it was seen as creating a much more flexible and autonomous regime under which local governments could operate. It was seen as a shift away from a prescriptive system to a broader framework for the operation of local government. Under the Act, local government was given general powers to make laws and provide services and facilities for the good government of the people in its district. In particular, the rationale was that instead of being restricted to prescribed specific functions and procedures, local authorities were given more general powers to perform a broader range of functions so long as they could be categorised as falling within the ambit of the general function of providing good government. Since the enactment of the Local Government Act in 1995, the committee has looked at a range of local laws made under the Act. In particular, the committee has looked at the rights of entry of local government officials under the Act

7860 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] and the ambit of the powers conferred thereunder. Under section 3.5 of the Local Government Act, local authorities are permitted to make laws that are required or permitted to be prescribed, or are necessary or convenient, for the performance of their functions under the Act. The contentious issue for the consideration of the committee was whether the powers to make laws for the entry onto private property should be interpreted narrowly or widely. We had no direct case law to assist us in our task. We also saw a conflict between section 3.1 of the Local Government Act, which exhorts a liberal interpretation of the Act, and the underlying common law presumption of the right to quiet enjoyment of private land, which, of course, would favour a much more restrictive interpretation of such rights. Over the years the prevailing view of local governments, which has been backed by legal opinion - a number of legal opinions referred to are annexed to the report - has been that purported local government laws were necessary and convenient for their operations and, as such, were not ultra vires. However, part 3 of the Act contains a number of sections relating to entry, and these are specific in nature. For example, section 3.25 deals with the issue of notices to owners and occupiers of private land relating to matters specifically referred to in schedule 3.1. Similarly, section 3.27 of the Act sets out the activities that local government can carry out on land that is not council property, and, again, specific reference is made to a number of activities under schedule 3.2. It was considered that if entry can occur in all the circumstances in which it is necessary or convenient, the question arose as to what obligations would operate to comply with the notice requirements if those obligations were limited to the circumstances set out in the schedules. As I said, schedules 3.1 and 3.2 deal with a level of detail that would not have been anticipated had there been no intention for the listed circumstances to be exhaustive. For example, schedule 3.1 permits entry in a number of circumstances, such as to prevent water from running onto land; to place a number on the premises; to repair or modify constructions causing damage to a public thoroughfare; to ensure enclosure of unsightly land; to cut back overgrown vegetation and remove rubbish; to take measures to remove sand drifts; and to ensure that a tree endangering neighbouring land is made safe. Similarly, schedule 3.2 sets out prescriptive and limited circumstances in which powers can be exercised. Against those circumstances are the underlying common law principles. For centuries the power to exclude strangers from one’s property has been regarded as an inviolable principle. At common law every unauthorised entry onto private property is considered a trespass. In summary, a man’s home is his castle. As Sir Edward Coke famously said in 1604 in Semayne’s case - . . . the house of every one is to him as his castle and fortress, as well for his defence against injury and violence, as for his repose . . . That principle was adopted also in the case of Entick v Carrington in 1765, which continues to be relied on today. In that case Lord Camden said - By the laws of England, every invasion of private property, be it ever so minute, is a trespass. No man can set his foot upon my ground without my licence, but he is liable to an action, though the damage be nothing . . . If he admits the fact, he is bound to shew by way of justification, that some positive law has empowered or excused him. These authorities are not arcane, nor are they merely of historical interest. They represent the status of the current law of Australia. In the case of Coco v The Queen in 1994 the High Court expressly relied on these cases to find that a trespass had been committed by the installation of a listening device by law enforcement officers under the purported authority of Queensland’s Invasion of Privacy Act 1971. In that case a standard warrant for the installation of a listening device under the Act was held invalid, as it failed expressly to authorise entry onto private premises. The High Court, comprising Chief Justice Mason and Justices Brennan, Gaudron and McHugh, stated - The courts should not impute to the legislature an intention to interfere with fundamental rights. Such an intention must be clearly manifested by unmistakable and unambiguous language. General words will rarely be sufficient for that purpose if they do not specifically deal with the question because, in the context in which they appear, they will often be ambiguous on the aspect of interference with fundamental rights . . . It was on the basis of these underlying principles that the Joint Standing Committee on Delegated Legislation subjected a range of local laws to scrutiny. These local laws included entry onto land for actions to remove rusty fridges, garden gnomes and bees; to abate nuisance lighting; to repair and inspect boundary fences; to inspect the conduct of amusements at a carnival on private land; to prevent trucks being driven on private land between 11 o’clock in the evening and seven o’clock in the morning; and to inspect the erection of signs and hoardings on private land. The difficulty is that none of those activities is specifically mentioned or authorised in the schedules to the Act to which I have referred. It was therefore necessary for the committee to examine these laws, apply these principles and decide whether they were within the scope of the Local Government Act. The committee found that, because of these underlying principles, the Act requires entry onto private land to be carried out only in certain circumstances; that is, with the permission of the owner or the occupier; in an emergency; by warrant; or, if entry was authorised specifically, under the schedules to the Local Government Act. It was the committee’s view that all the examples I previously referred to were ultra vires. The impact of the committee’s finding was obviously significant, and we therefore sought an opinion from senior counsel.

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7861

Mr McCusker, QC’s opinion is also annexed to the report. He concurred with the committee’s view. He said that this was a case in which specific mention of some powers militated against more generic powers being inferred. He also believed that the capacity in the Act to amend regulations to create more categories of circumstances authorising entry suggested that the Legislature did not intend broader powers to be inferred or implied. He stated also that the common law presumption, enunciated in cases such as Coco, prevailed unless expressly rejected. In the light of the foregoing, I am pleased to say that the minister has agreed to amend the schedules to the Act to broaden the circumstances so that local authorities can enter onto private property. In this context the committee has had some dialogue with the Western Australian Local Government Association on this issue. In the course of the Act being reviewed more generally, it is anticipated that the minister will look closely at these issues to ensure that local government has the ambit of power that it needs, without unduly trespassing on owners’ or occupiers’ rights. In conclusion, these cases illustrate that although the committee considered only local laws, it is important that they nevertheless receive a high level of scrutiny, because their operation has the potential to erode fundamental rights. The committee was pleased to note and took some comfort from the fact that the common law prevails, despite many incursions by authorities under various laws, and that the state of the law is essentially that which was enunciated by William Pitt in 1766 - The poorest man may in his cottage bid defiance to all the forces of the Crown. It may be frail - its roof may shake - the wind may blow through it - the storm may enter - the rain may enter - but the King of England cannot enter - all his force dares not cross the threshold of the ruined tenement. CORRUPTION AND CRIME COMMISSION BILL 2003 Introduction and First Reading Bill introduced, on motion by Mr J.A. McGinty (Attorney General), and read a first time. Second Reading MR J.A. McGINTY (Fremantle - Attorney General) [10.31 am]: I move - That the Bill be now read a second time. Western Australians deserve a Police Service and a public sector that are free from the scourge of corruption. To achieve this objective, the State Government has taken, and will continue to take, all necessary measures, including the enactment of new legislation, to restore the community’s confidence in the integrity and honesty of those who serve the public. Therefore, this Bill continues and strengthens the Government’s achievements in tackling crime and corruption. It will do so by providing Western Australia with one of the most powerful crime and corruption fighting bodies in Australia. The Corruption and Crime Commission will be able to investigate Western Australian judges, ministers, members of Parliament, police officers and other public officers. At the last state election, Labor made an important commitment to the people of Western Australia to establish a royal commission into police corruption. In this way we would fight police corruption and restore public confidence in Western Australia’s Police Service. For too many years the community’s demands for action were ignored. This undermined public confidence in our Police Service and jeopardised the reputations of honest and hardworking police officers. The State Government promptly established the Royal Commission Into Whether There Has Been Any Corrupt or Criminal Conduct by Western Australian Police Officers. The constant stream of allegations or admissions of assaults, perjury, theft and bribery has caused even the most cynical to agree that previous efforts to combat police corruption in this State have been ineffective. In an interim report delivered in December 2002, Royal Commissioner Geoffrey Kennedy, AO, QC indicated that it has been possible at an early stage - to conclude that the identifiable flaws in the structure and powers of the ACC have brought about such a lack of public confidence in the current processes for the investigation of corrupt and criminal conduct that the establishment of a new permanent body is necessary. The Government has accepted Commissioner Kennedy’s advice and consequently this Bill has several major and innovative features. There are 10 principal ways in which the CCC is an improvement over the Anti-Corruption Commission. Accountability - a new structure: The CCC will have one commissioner, with provision for an acting commissioner, a parliamentary inspector, and continued monitoring by a parliamentary committee. To ensure the community and Parliament will have confidence in the commissioner, the appointment of the commissioner can be made only after the Premier has consulted the parliamentary leader of each party in the Parliament. The commissioner will be a person appointed by the Governor, for a term of not more than four years, but with the possibility of reappointment. A person will be eligible for appointment as commissioner if that person is or has been a legal practitioner with not less than eight years legal experience, or is a practising barrister of the High Court of Australia with not less than eight years legal experience. An acting commissioner can be appointed if the workload of the CCC requires more than one commissioner; when the commissioner is unable to perform the functions of that office

7862 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] or is absent from the State; or if the commissioner has declared himself or herself unable to act, perhaps due to an actual or potential conflict of interest. A greater degree of accountability is achieved through the role of the inspector, which is extremely powerful. The inspector has completely unfettered access to all CCC information, including operational matters and, for the purpose of his or her inquiries, all the powers, protections and immunities of a royal commission. In addition to having a reporting function, the parliamentary inspector will have responsibility for auditing the operations of the CCC and assessing the effectiveness and appropriateness of the CCC’s procedures. In the overall context of the legislation, this office of the parliamentary inspector provides an important balance in relation to the CCC’s extensive powers. Its presence will give Western Australians an additional reason to have confidence in the CCC by ensuring that the CCC’s operations and exercise of powers conform to, and are conducted in accordance with, basic principles underlying the law. With the approval of either House of Parliament or a standing committee, the inspector’s reports may be published. However, the inspector must ensure that his or her reports do not contain information that would identify a person who has been or is likely to be a witness before the CCC or reveal any particular investigation undertaken by the CCC or the Police Service. Jurisdiction of the CCC - organised crime: The CCC will have three main jurisdictions: investigation of police corruption; investigation of public sector corruption; and a role in relation to the investigation by the police of organised crime. Members should also be aware that this Bill will repeal the Criminal Investigation (Exceptional Powers) and Fortification Removal Act 2002 and the Anti-Corruption Commission Act 1988. The Criminal Investigation (Exceptional Powers) and Fortification Removal Act 2002 will be substantially reproduced in this Bill. In addition to the desirability of having all relevant provisions in one statute, this Bill will have another major benefit in that it will enable the CCC commissioner to perform the functions of a special commissioner under that Act. In addition, this Bill will increase police powers to fight organised crime. Other powers that are available to the CCC, such as assumed identities, integrity tests and controlled operations, will be able to be used by the Police Service against drug traffickers, outlaw motorcycle gangs and others associated with organised crime. In order for the police to have access to those powers, the Commissioner of Police will need to satisfy the CCC commissioner that there is a legitimate need for those powers to fight organised crime. These powers will significantly enhance police ability to investigate major crime. Less secrecy: There will be less secrecy surrounding allegations that are referred to the CCC. A person can, if he chooses to do so, disclose the fact that he has referred a particular allegation of misconduct to the CCC. This should avoid the situation in which a person says, “I have referred this matter to a body which cannot be named.” Disclosure by the commissioner: There will be less secrecy surrounding the CCC generally. The commissioner can reveal details about particular matters and outcomes of investigations when the commissioner decides that disclosure of those matters is in the public interest. The commissioner can also reveal when a matter has been referred to an appropriate authority or an independent body for consideration of prosecution or disciplinary action of the person concerned. The secrecy and disclosure provisions are an essential component of this legislation because they will enable the CCC to effectively and successfully conduct investigations. For example, the Bill creates a category of “restricted matter”. In this context, a person is prohibited from disclosing evidence that is before the CCC, or information or documents given to the CCC. Also, the Bill prohibits disclosure of the fact that a person has been, or is about to be, examined by the CCC, or of any information that might enable that person to be identified or located. However, the State Government recognises that there are circumstances in which it will be in the public interest to disclose some matters. First, such restricted matter may be disclosed if it has already been disclosed as part of a public hearing, unless the CCC orders otherwise. Second, disclosure may also be in accordance with a CCC direction or in other specified circumstances. For example, persons may disclose restricted matter to a legal practitioner to obtain legal advice or to a person for the purpose of obtaining legal aid. Thirdly, as I have stated above, the Bill’s prohibitions which relate to restricted matter do not apply to the CCC, the parliamentary inspector, or officers of the CCC or the parliamentary inspector. Notification: There will be more natural justice for people the subject of complaints. If the Corruption and Crime Commission investigates an allegation and recommends that an independent body such as the Director of Public Prosecutions give consideration to prosecution, the independent body will be obliged to notify the person concerned that it has received such a recommendation prior to any charge being laid. Disclosure and Protection: There will also be greater requirements of disclosure on the CCC. If the CCC recommends that an independent agency give consideration to the prosecution of a particular person, the CCC must also give the independent agency all materials in its possession that would be required for the purposes of section 103 of the Justices Act or section 611B of the Criminal Code if that prosecution took place. Members may recall that those provisions resulted from the Criminal Law (Procedure) Amendment Act 2002 and require disclosure to an accused person by the prosecution. In view of the extensive powers given to the CCC, the Bill also contains necessary provisions to preserve, protect and safeguard the rights of any person who may be subject to the CCC’s jurisdiction. It also contains provisions to restrict the disclosure of information to protect witnesses and persons being investigated.

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7863

The Bill includes provisions that protect the State, ministers, independent agencies, principal officers of notifying authorities and officers who constitute a notifying authority if any of them, in good faith, disclose the fact that the commission has received or initiated an allegation, or the details of an allegation. Similarly, no action in tort lies against the State, ministers, the commissioner, the parliamentary inspector or an official for anything done in good faith or in the performance of a function under this legislation, and no action or proceeding, civil or criminal, lies against the State, a minister or a person employed or engaged by the State in respect of the printing or publishing of a transcript of an examination, or a report of or a recommendation made by the commission or the parliamentary inspector. The CCC will have greater powers than the ACC: Many Australian States and overseas jurisdictions recognise that corrupt and criminal conduct by public officials, in particular within law enforcement agencies, cannot be effectively investigated and prosecuted by relying on traditional police powers. Consequently, the Government believes that a corruption fighting body must have all of the powers, resources and modern techniques that are now available for the investigation of corrupt, criminal and improper conduct. The CCC will have all of the powers of the Anti-Corruption Commission, plus the powers currently used by the Royal Commission Into Whether There Has Been Any Corrupt or Criminal Conduct by Western Australian Police Officers, including powers to examine on oath, both in public and private; powers to use assumed identities and surveillance devices; and powers to conduct covert activities, such as controlled operations and integrity testing programs. Even when no allegation of misconduct has been made, the CCC may conduct integrity tests on police officers and prescribed classes of public officers. The police royal commission has used this power to great effect by targeting particular groups of people and revealing corruption, such as was evident in the case of Mr Purvey and T2. The purpose behind giving the CCC powerful provisions, such as the ability to conduct integrity tests, is not aimed at otherwise innocent people. It is envisaged that these powers will be used against a person or group of people to reveal criminality that already exists. The relevant provisions should be interpreted accordingly. There will be serious consequences for people who fail to comply with orders of the CCC. For example, the CCC will be able to issue a warrant for the arrest of a person who has been issued a summons and who fails to attend, or whose evidence is necessary and the CCC is satisfied that the person would not attend without being compelled or was planning to leave the State. Such a warrant would allow an authorised officer to apprehend the person and bring him before the CCC. The CCC will be able to detain a person or impose conditions on his release. However, that person would be able to apply to the Supreme Court for a review of any such CCC decision. Part 11 of the Bill sets out the offences against the CCC. For example, to assist effective investigations, the Bill prohibits specified actions including the bribing of witnesses, destruction of evidence and victimisation of any person assisting the CCC. Penalties for hindering the CCC are substantial, with many of the offences containing penalties of five years imprisonment, with fines of $100 000. As I have indicated, strong and extensive powers will be given to the CCC. Therefore, it is appropriate to include a review clause in the Bill. The responsible minister must carry out a review of the operations and effectiveness of the Bill five years after its commencement. Ombudsman’s Role: The role of the Ombudsman in reviewing police conduct will be transferred to the CCC. For example, the CCC will review a decision made by a police officer when the police officer should have given reasons for his or her decision and did not. Proactive: The CCC will have the power to be proactive. The CCC will be proactive in relation to all its functions, ranging from taking a strong prevention and education role to investigating matters when there has been no formal allegation of misconduct, and taking the initiative to report on relevant matters. Prevention and Education Function: The CCC will also have a prevention and education function. The CCC will take an active role in raising the standard of integrity and conduct of public officers and public authorities. It will provide information to, consult with and make recommendations to public authorities and the general community, and it will report on ways to prevent misconduct. Misconduct Function: A major function of the CCC will be to ensure that allegations and information about misconduct are dealt with in an appropriate way. The CCC will be able to investigate Western Australian judges, ministers, members of Parliament and other public officers and police officers. The commission will be able to receive allegations about misconduct from any person, as well as from the police royal commission, the parliamentary commissioner, the ACC, the Inspector of Custodial Services, the Commissioner of Police, the principal officer of a notifying authority - for example, a department or organisation as defined in the Public Sector Management Act - or an officer who constitutes a notifying authority. The CCC will perform its misconduct function by - receiving and initiating allegations of misconduct; considering whether action is needed in relation to allegations and matters related to misconduct;

7864 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

investigating or taking other action in relation to allegations and matters related to misconduct if it is appropriate to do so, or referring the allegations or matters to independent agencies or appropriate authorities so that they can take action themselves or in cooperation with the commission; monitoring the way in which independent agencies and appropriate authorities take action in relation to allegations and matters that are referred to them by the commission; investigating whether misconduct has or may have occurred, is or may be occurring, or whether further misconduct may be about to occur or is likely to occur; or furnishing reports and making recommendations on the outcome of investigations, and consulting, cooperating and exchanging information with independent agencies and appropriate authorities. The CCC may not make a finding or form an opinion on whether a person has committed, is committing, or is about to commit a criminal or disciplinary offence. This is consistent with the position that it is for the prosecuting authorities and the courts to deal with these matters. Reporting Function: The Bill takes cognisance of the State’s democratic and parliamentary system of government. The CCC will have the ability to prepare a report for presentation to Parliament at any time and on any matter that has been the subject of investigation by the CCC; referred by the police royal commission or Ombudsman; or not completed by the police royal commission or ACC. The State Government recognises that extraordinary investigatory powers are being conferred on the CCC. Therefore, the Bill also provides for an essential accountability mechanism to independently scrutinise the use of these powers. Therefore, as I have already alluded, a parliamentary inspector of the CCC will be able to audit the operations of, and investigate complaints about, the CCC. Additionally, the parliamentary inspector will be able to assess the CCC’s procedures and report and make recommendations both to the CCC and Parliament. The CCC may prepare reports - to Parliament on the investigation of allegations; to Parliament on the adequacy of further action that has been taken by appropriate authorities; on any administrative or general policy matter relating to the functions of the CCC; to the minister, another minister or a standing committee of Parliament; annually regarding its general activities; and periodically to each House of Parliament or a standing committee, in accordance with the rules of Parliament. In addition, the Corruption and Crime Commission may also prepare reports - to a relevant minister concerning the appointment of a chief executive officer; to the Minister for Police and Emergency Services concerning a proposed appointment of a Commissioner of Police or commissioned officer; to the Commissioner of Police or Minister for Police and Emergency Services concerning a proposed appointment of a police officer; and to the Commissioner of Police concerning a proposed appointment of a special constable or an Aboriginal aide. The Bill stipulates that only specified persons may have access to these confidential reports. However, the person who is the subject of an adverse report must be given a copy of the report. Resources: Resourcing will be dramatically increased. The budget for the CCC will be more than twice the budget for the Anti-Corruption Commission. Provision has been made for approximately $21 million in the 2003-04 financial year. In concluding, I take this opportunity to reassure all honest public officers that they have nothing to fear about this legislation or the CCC. Indeed, the State Government is confident that the vast majority of dedicated and hardworking police officers will welcome this Bill and the creation of the CCC. The Bill will restore the public confidence in the Western Australia Police Service that their corrupt colleagues have eroded. The Government makes no apologies to corrupt public officials. This legislation sends a clear and unequivocal message to these officials. Their conduct will no longer be ignored or tolerated in Western Australia. It will be rigorously investigated and prosecuted. Finally, in his interim report, Commissioner Kennedy considered it extremely important that there be a smooth transition from the Royal Commission into Commercial Activities of Government and Other Matters and the ACC to the new CCC. Consequently, it is imperative that the CCC be established and operating prior to the conclusion of the royal commission, which is expected to occur on 31 August 2003. Therefore, expeditious passage of this Bill through the Parliament is essential. With this Bill, members have a unique opportunity to support the creation of an effective

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7865 corruption-fighting agency. This will demonstrate to the people of Western Australia our resolve not to tolerate the appalling behaviour being exposed by the police royal commission. On behalf of the State Government and the people of Western Australia, I have much pleasure in commending the Bill to the House. Debate adjourned, on motion by Mr J.H.D. Day.

APPROPRIATION (CONSOLIDATED FUND) BILL (NO. 1) 2003 APPROPRIATION (CONSOLIDATED FUND) BILL (NO. 2) 2003 Second Reading - Cognate Debate Resumed from 14 May. MR P.D. OMODEI (Warren-Blackwood) [10.54 am]: The budget debate is an opportunity for members to comment on the Government’s direction for the next financial year and to make some observations and comments in relation to their own electorates. If I had to describe the budget I would say that in some places it is dishonest, but in other places the things the Government intends to do over the next financial year are quite positive. I say that because all budgets provide for an increase in spending on health, education, disability services and other essential portfolios that relate to the plight of human beings in the community. That has always been the case and I do not think I will ever see a budget that reduces spending. It does not seem to be the lot of Treasurers to do that. The important point is that there be some honesty in the way the budget is portrayed and to that extent I will make some further comments. I look at the Treasurer from time to time and he reminds me of the Iraqi Deputy Prime Minister, Tariq Aziz - he even looks a little like him. The only thing that is absent is the green beret and pullover. However, I do not expect the Treasurer to shave off his moustache based on those comments. The sleight of hand, the way that the budget has been drafted and the fact that Governments deliver their budget speeches in a way that pulls the wool over the eyes of the general public - I suppose it has happened historically over a long period - is not good for the community. This Government is probably the highest taxing Government that Western Australia has had for some time, with more than $410 million in taxes now being imposed on taxpayers in this State. This has happened since the Government came to office only two and a half years ago. In its first budget, payroll and other taxes went up by $132 million. In its second budget taxes went up by $116 million and were concentrated on stamp duty and third party insurance. In this budget stamp duty and other taxes have increased by $162 million. The references to the past that were made in the budget speech do not do the Government any credit. Interestingly, the Treasurer referred to Sir John Forrest and said that the budget for the pipeline from Perth to Kalgoorlie was equivalent to the whole of the State’s budget, and that Sir John Forrest was criticised for that. However, the Treasurer failed to say John Forrest was a conservative and the first federal Treasurer, who then proceeded to attack the federal Government for its failure to return to Western Australia the hard earnings of its taxpayers. Further on in the speech the Treasurer referred to Sir Charles Court. Everyone in this House and Western Australia knows that Sir Charles Court is a highly regarded former Liberal Premier of Western Australia who cut his teeth on industrial and resource matters in this State. It smacks a little of hypocrisy for the Treasurer to refer to former Liberal leaders to bolster his budget speech. He referred to Sir Charles Court’s comments in response to the Garnaut-Fitzgerald review of commonwealth-state financial relations. Those comments were made in the context of Sir Charles Court’s time in office in the 1960s when Western Australia helped itself and had a very efficient Government. He felt that Canberra and the eastern States were using Western Australia as a milch cow. It is well known that the more wealthy States of Australia subsidise the other States. It always has been thus and probably will continue to be in the long term. However, that can be contrasted to the actions of this State Government. The majority of this State’s wealth is created in rural and regional Western Australia, whether it be through mining, agricultural, fishing or forestry industries. This Treasurer is complaining about the way this State is treated by the Commonwealth, but then proceeds to treat country WA in exactly the same way! Again, that smacks a little of hypocrisy. I referred to the budget papers and their structure, and compared them with this year’s budget. However, I will talk about that in a moment. I will now quickly refer to the goods and services tax payments to the States and Territories. I was interested to hear the interjection by the member for Albany that Western Australia would not be cash positive as far as GST is concerned until 2007. Again, I go back to this question of honesty; my concern is that the frontbench members of the Government are not telling the truth to their backbenchers. A briefing note from the federal Treasurer, Peter Costello, states - In 2003-04, Queensland, the Northern Territory, Western Australia, Tasmania, and the Australian Capital Territory will be better off than they would have been had tax reform not been implemented. This means that after just three years since the introduction of The New Tax System on 1 July 2000, the shares of GST revenue for these States will exceed what they would have received had tax reform not been implemented.

7866 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

The briefing note then refers to the taxes that would be abolished under tax reform. For instance, in 2000-01, Western Australia received $2.374 billion in GST revenue. Revenue increased to $2.518 billion in 2001-02 and to $2.911 billion in 2002-03. The estimated return from goods and services tax to the State in 2003-04 will be $3.008 billion. It bears repeating that Western Australia is already in a cash-positive arrangement as far as the GST is concerned. The Government is trying to paint a picture that the State will not make any money from the GST until 2007. Financial commentators in the media have not mentioned state stamp duty charges, which run to more than $100 million. They have made no comments with regard to the GST. I suspect that the 10 per cent GST on stamp duty transfers of land, houses and so on will probably mean the State will receive at least an extra 2.5 per cent increase in taxes. The Treasurer is using the Commonwealth Government as a medium to gain tax revenue via GST on the charges the Government has already implemented. That has not been explained either to the Parliament or the people of Western Australia. The Labor Party’s budget delivers a huge tax slug. I note with interest the increases in the health budget - it was always going to be so. We all know that there is a huge demand for health services. I am now starting to understand how the Treasurer brings down surplus budgets. The major redevelopment of the Margaret River Hospital, which has been on the books for three years and has not even started, again appears in the budget papers. I sincerely hope the project will go ahead. The budget also refers to the provision of mental health services in the south west, which is a major area of deficiency. I refer to surplus budgets and the position in which the former Government left the State’s finances in 2001. Upon forming government in 1993 we inherited a budget bottom line of $8.5 billion worth of debt. During the eight-year period the coalition Government was in power, it sold more than $4 billion worth of state assets, which reduced the state debt to $4.5 billion by 2001 when the Labor Party came to power. By any measure, that is quite a remarkable achievement. The previous Government has received little recognition for that effort. Critics argue that the state debt was reduced only by selling more than $4 billion worth of assets. Had we not sold assets, state debt would still be about $8.5 billion, plus interest. By any measure, the former Government’s achievements were remarkable. The money that has been saved in interest by reducing the debt to $4.5 billion runs into millions of dollars, which was poured back into health, education and other necessary services for Western Australia. The previous Government enjoyed some windfall gains, as has this Government. This Government has enjoyed more than $3 billion in windfall gains, yet debt has still blown out by more than $900 million in the past financial year alone. What will be the Labor Party’s legacy to the people of Western Australia at the next election? I put it to members and the people that this is a high-taxing Government. Its legacy to our children will have to be fixed by a future conservative Government because this Government is financially incapable. It has been said that five of the previous Government’s eight budgets were deficit budgets. I am only a farmer, but I will tell members what I mean when I talk about being honest with the public of Western Australia. Three months from the end of the financial year it is very easy for a Government to either defer projects or to capitalise some recurrent capital works. What does this Government do? It moves from a deficit budget to a surplus budget. It pretends to be a good financial manager when debt is actually soaring. Any businessmen knows that when the Premier and the Department of Treasury and Finance repeat that the previous Government brought down deficit budgets, they are trying to persuade the public that the former Government was a poor economic manager. However, the Western Australian community is not that silly. The public will not be conned. That is what I mean when I talk about being honest in the way the budget is brought down. The difference between the Labor Party and the former coalition Government is that the Labor Party is dishonest. It is as simple as that. The federal Government was to provide $15 million to Western Australia under the Regional Forest Agreement. Members opposite must acknowledge that the RFA no longer exists. Therefore, why would the federal Government give us the money? It has good excuse to withdraw it. The federal Government places conditions on the State to receive those funds. It places conditions on funding for the National Action Plan for Salinity and Water Quality and the roads to recovery program. The Commonwealth Government and the State Government are having a tete-a-tete about who is to blame for the issues. The arguments go on and on. Both Governments act like a mob of school kids. Rather than blame the Commonwealth, the Treasurer and the Premier must resolve the issues with the Commonwealth. If it rains, the Government blames the Commonwealth - actually, it would not do that because that is a good thing. Mr J.N. Hyde: The Labor Party would take credit for that. Mr P.D. OMODEI: That is right. We are all adults. Members of Parliament have a responsibility to be honest about these things. I tell my federal colleagues that it is all well and good for them to whack the Labor Party in Western Australia, which probably deserves it because it is being dishonest, but the ordinary people in country Western Australia suffer as a result. Country people in particular suffer when the Governments argue about funding for timber, the roads to recovery program and salinity. It is important for the State to receive funding to address the salinity problem that has been building up for decades, if not centuries, and even before the Europeans arrived. We need to make some progress on that issue. Rather than play petty political games and blame somebody else, we should grab the bull by the horns and fix the problem.

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7867

I do not say that the Treasurer is akin to the Iraqi minister for misinformation just because the Treasurer looks like him; I say it because this budget has been delivered dishonestly and politically. We must be above that when talking about the future of Western Australia. I now refer to national competition policy payments. I am not a financial genius. However, I read the papers provided by the Treasury’s financial advisers. The papers show that the State Government has factored $75.2 million for national competition policy payments in this year’s budget. Those funds have come to the States under the national competition policy. They are contingent on the State Government reviewing its situation with regard to the national competition policy and also its response to the National Competition Council. However, it is conditional on a review being conducted by the end of June this year. The Government has factored into the budget $77 million for 2004-05 and $79 million for 2005-06, but there is nothing for 2006-07. That begs the question, what will happen after that? What will happen when we talk about the four issues of retail trading hours, liquor licensing, taxi control and potato marketing? Will the Government of Western Australia proceed with deregulation and receive those funds from the Commonwealth under the national competition policy? Some of the issues must have some form of compensation. The Government cannot just issue a large number of new plates for the taxi industry without devaluing the existing plates. In many cases, the plates represent the superannuation of many taxi drivers. It is a dilemma for the Government. It needs to sensibly go through the issues. Ms A.J. MacTiernan interjected. Mr P.D. OMODEI: I am not prepared to listen to the minister because I have more important things to do. I will refer to the education budget. I note with interest that the Manjimup Primary School is still not in the budget, either for planning or capital works. The previous Government had set down the school opening for the beginning of 2004. The Minister for Education and Training is well and truly aware of this. He has visited the old school - I facilitated the visit. He knows the existing school is substandard. People in Manjimup have taken a fair whack through dairy deregulation and the restructuring of the timber industry. One would have thought the Government would show some goodwill and at least keep to the program promised by the previous Government. I have raised with the minister the issue of education support in schools. Currently, we have a policy of inclusivity so that disabled children are part of mainstream schooling. That is a good thing. However, there is a need for teachers to have time out by establishing a special education unit. That will allow teachers to teach more complex subjects to mainstream classes. The Principal of the Margaret River Primary School has a very good grip on what should happen. I will give an example of how schools are coping with children with disabilities. The Margaret River Primary School has a principal and two deputies, which is the norm for a school of its size. The principal has had to trade the equivalent salary of one deputy principal so that he can have part-time teacher aides to assist with children who have autism or Down syndrome. Sooner or later, the school will be under so much stress that the principal will have to have two deputies in administration. That means the part-time teacher aides will not be employed. We know what that means for the students. I understand that a local solutions paper has been produced by the Minister for Education and Training. I am keen to have access to it and speak to the minister about trying to resolve some of these issues. I will now speak on the disability services budget. The Government has increased funding for people with disabilities by $12 million this year. The budget and supporting papers are drafted in a particular way. Disability services will receive a funding increase of $37 million over the next four years. Next year, why not just say what the figure is for the year so that people are not deceived into thinking they will receive a huge amount of money? I recall that when we came into government the disability sector was in disarray. I was the minister for five years but, under the previous minister, Hon Kevin Minson, a program worth $125 million over four years was initiated. That makes this budget pale into insignificance. Our budget was so large because there was a large number of people in dire need in the community. Why not just say that next year’s budget is $12 million and that next year’s will be $10 million? There is no real growth in the budget. I know that the member for Perth and the minister are dedicated to the task. Approximately 70 per cent of people with disabilities in Western Australia are looked after by their families. The previous Government had two consecutive five-year business plans that predicted the number of disabled people who would come on-stream and require respite, accommodation or whatever. We must bear in mind that the age bracket of people who have children or family members with disabilities is very large. At any given time, if there is a breakdown in the community, that figure will blow out. There must be some flexibility in predicting how many people will demand places. The number of places promised for next year falls far short of what is needed by people with disabilities in this State. There are 722 people with disabilities on a waiting list for community homes and clusters. For in-home services, carers and respite packages, 1 090 people are on the waiting list. For day activities the figure is 760. We need appropriate accommodation for 175 people who live in institutional settings. Therapy and specialised equipment is needed for 2 000 adults and children with disabilities. The demand in the sector is far greater than the Government is providing for. I implore the Government to look at this issue. I must refer to the petitions that have been brought to the Parliament by people who are in dire straits. The Treasurer was given the petition for the Robinsons but he did not even read the whole petition. I had to read the same petition in full some weeks later so that the people concerned could get their story on the public record in the hope that someone might pick it up and recognise their plight. We are talking about 80-year-old people with 50-year-old children in an almost impossible situation. Members can see how easily

7868 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] families can break down under the kind of pressure they are facing. One person in three in Western Australia has some connection with a person with a disability. One person in six has a disability. If we ignore that, we are failing the people of Western Australia, particularly those with disabilities. I will refer to the budget for the Department of Agriculture. We all know that its budget was reduced by $6.5 million this year. I introduced a motion last week for a select committee to look at the future of the department. The department’s budget went down despite that. It went down $8 million last year. It is just not good enough. I have a copy of today’s Countryman. Some of the headlines are: “Urban, country divide widens”, “Agriculture not a high priority” and “Disappointment over education and health”. They all reflect comments by high-profile people in agriculture in Western Australia. The articles are very graphic. They are on page 3 - they cannot get much more prominent than that. How do people in rural and regional Western Australia gain confidence in this Government when every year they are kicked and kicked again? Mr J.P.D. Edwards interjected. Mr P.D. OMODEI: The member for Greenough makes the point that agriculture was not mentioned in the Treasurer’s speech. Not only was it not mentioned this year, it was not mentioned the year before. The industry has been part of the foundation of Western Australia. Its people are very proud. They are suffering greatly as a result of the drought. Certain issues must addressed. Wild dogs are running loose near the Nullarbor and in pastoral and wheatbelt Western Australia on a scale never seen before. It has been reported that one farmer has lost up to 1 800 sheep. This issue has been brought before Parliament and the Minister for Agriculture, but to little effect. The only thing that relates to this issue in the budget is $250 000 to match the local government rate for pastoralists and farmers to control wild dogs. More than $1 million is needed. We need trained people to deal with the wild dogs, which are not only killing but also maiming animals. Sheep are being mauled and their entrails hang on the ground. Young calves are hamstrung; in other words, their calf muscles and hamstrings are pulled out by the wild dogs and they are left to die a terrible death. Although the situation is the worst it has ever been, the Government has responded by establishing another committee. To that situation, we can add the underfunding of the Agriculture Protection Board. The previous conservative Government is not blameless in this issue, because it changed the structure of the APB and reduced its funding. There must be a new focus on agriculture in Western Australia, and the Government of the day, whether it is Labor or Liberal, must ensure that agriculture is properly funded. The wheat streak mosaic virus, which is a serious wheat disease, has appeared in Esperance. We must ensure that that is controlled. Skeleton weed, which was controlled by the APB, is becoming the responsibility of farmers. There are 21 declared plants on a national basis in Western Australia that must be controlled by the APB. We also have to consider Johne’s disease. The member for Greenough and I recently met with a distraught family who run a highly successful mohair stud in Geraldton, which is in the electorate of the member for Greenough. The genetic pool of the family’s goats is probably as good as any in the nation; however, their goats have been placed in quarantine. As a result, if the family wants to sell its stock it must do so at rock-bottom prices. Further, it cannot trade any of its goats. There is also an outbreak in Bridgetown of both ovine and bovine Johne’s disease. Animals suffering from these diseases become skinny and waste away as a result of diarrhoea. I turn to the projected years in the 2001-02 budget for the agriculture portfolio, because they paint a very interesting picture. The budget decreased from $165 million to $135 million. However, in the out years, the projection was $132 million in 2002-03; $130 million in 2003-04; and, $129 million in 2004-05. In comparison, this year’s projections for the agriculture budget are $128 million for 2002-03; $121 million in 2003-04; $121 million in 2004-05; $123 million in 2005-06; and $124 million in 2006-07. This Government has reduced the importance of agriculture in Western Australia. Agriculture is an industry of great importance to the State, and I will certainly pursue this matter in the Estimates Committee. A range of research stations and agriculture centres are being closed in rural WA. However, I will not go through them all, because I want to refer to some important electorate matters. I now turn to the Premier’s visit to Pemberton. Members will recall that the Premier and I were at loggerheads over his failure to visit my district, given that the Labor Party had been in government for a couple of years. The Premier finally made that visit, and it was nice and pleasant. We exchanged pleasantries with the local community. The Premier visited Pemberton so that he could present a $160 000 cheque for the Pemberton Recreation Centre, which was very well received. The project is worth $2.5 million, and most of the $160 000 had been promised by previous State Governments and the federal Government. It is a great credit to the community that after eight or nine years it has been able to achieve not only a licensed bar, but also all the sports clubs under one roof. It is a good model for other towns. The recreation centre has created some problems in the community, because people are concerned about competition. However, what else do we do in rural Western Australia to ensure that people have access to good recreation facilities? The Premier, having absolutely devastated the timber industry in Western Australia, decided to visit the timber mill. The day before the Premier arrived I was contacted by two men who had been Labor voters all their lives. They asked me whether I knew that the Premier was visiting and told me that they had been called in by management at the mill to ensure that the Premier was not upset in anyway. The Premier visited the workers and, although they have had their lives destroyed and now face uncertain futures, they were models of good behaviour. When we reached the top of the catwalks, I looked towards the log landing and saw not one log more than 600 millimetres in size. Everybody knows

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7869 that there are always big logs in a two-tiered forest. The company went to the trouble of making sure that the television cameras could not see one big log on the landing. That was well done, because it would put the company in a good position for future negotiations with the Government. Inside the mill a big beam extended from under the rollers beneath us. Given that he comes from the United Kingdom, the member for Greenough will be aware that the 10 x 5 beams that are eight metres long are used for crossovers on railway lines for the export market to the United Kingdom. I was so kind that day, I did not remind the Premier that our prime timber was being used for that purpose. We had lunch with the Premier and it was all well and nice. To this day, the Government has failed to announce the timber volumes. The Premier and the Minister for the Environment and Heritage continue to blame the Commonwealth Government for not handing over the $15 million for the Regional Forest Agreement they have decimated. That is dishonest. Manjimup is going downhill. A once thriving commercial centre is now racked with uncertainty, because, until this Government makes an announcement on volumes, it does not know whether it will get the much needed furniture industry that will create jobs and certainty for its future. The volume of jarrah required is about 180 000 cubic metres. The federal minister, Hon Ian MacDonald, has stated that it should be at least 200 000 cubic metres, otherwise WA will not get the $15 million. Let us get on with it; too much time has passed and enough pain has already been experienced. In Manjimup 15 men are working in the bush to harvest timber. Only two years ago, there were 250 men harvesting timber. In the time of the previous Labor Government, when former minister Hodge was responsible, 680 000 cubic meters of jarrah was being cut. On a political whim, and because it was convenient - there had always been bipartisan support for forest management plans in Western Australia - the Labor Party embarked on its policy to stop the logging of old-growth forests. Since that day, the economy of that district has deteriorated. Having made that decision, the Government has a responsibility to the people of the lower south west to ensure that value-added industries, such as the furniture industry, and value adding to agricultural products are fast tracked. Thank God for agriculture in Manjimup, Pemberton, Bridgetown and the south west corner, because without we would certainly be under stress. There was also the situation in which the Manjimup Apple Export Syndicate bought the Simplot site after it closed down the potato chip factory. The apple export syndicate bought that site for $2 million and then had liquidity problems. However, rather than buy the Simplot site for $2 million and save the company, the Government let the company collapse financially at a cost of $1.5 million to unsecured creditors in Manjimup and surrounding districts. Had the Government bought the site for $2 million, it would have saved the Manjimup Apple Export Syndicate and the unsecured creditors in that town. It was a very simple solution. In the past, when the old Manjimup canning company was there, the land belonged to the State. All the State needed to do was to take it back, create a small industrial park and sublet it to the current owners. Mr M.P. Whitely: Was it worth $2 million? Mr P.D. OMODEI: When Edgells bought it, it was worth $9 million. It spent $27 million on buildings, which of course devalued over the years. The new people - the Bendotti family, whom I know very well - who bought Simplot Australia Pty Ltd after the company went into liquidation, started the potato chip plant again and applied for a grant that equated to $800 000. All the Government needed to do was to add $1.2 million to that and buy back the land. Not only would the State then have retained the Bendottis, but it would also still have the Manjimup Apple Export Syndicate. I am running out of time but I want to refer to tourism because it is very important. The previous and current Governments committed to the sky jetty in the Donnelly Valley. Donnelly Valley is west of Manjimup and east of Nannup and lies in the middle of the triangle of Manjimup, Nannup and Bridgetown. The idea of having a regional facility there is very good, so much so that the current Government supported the previous Government and allocated $1 million. The federal Government has allocated $900 000. This leaves a shortfall of $1.3 million. The Government has advertised for expressions of interest in obtaining that $1.3 million from the private sector under a public-private partnership, as the Treasurer has mentioned. We want it to proceed. I make it very clear that it is supported by all the shires in the area and all the tourist operators. It will draw people from Margaret River and Busselton into that area who will then filter into the Blackwood Valley, Manjimup, Pemberton and so on. Another project that has been proposed by a private sector proponent is the Diamond Tree skylift. The four partners involved have $1 million of their own money and a grant from the Commonwealth Government of $800 000. They need some top-up money but they have run into a dead end. The dead end is the assignment of lease issue. A government department has told them that if they on-sell that project at any time after they construct it, they must indemnify the new owner. They have $1.8 million in their hands, but they cannot proceed because of some bureaucratic red tape. Surely the Minister for the Environment and Heritage or the Premier could sit down and sort out those kinds of things. The lease could be renewed and the new owner could take up the new lease and indemnify the State. How many people must the originator of the project indemnify over the next 20 years? This trivial nonsense is holding up a $2 million project. The replica of the old Pemberton hydro-electric plant was built by the Government just after it came into power. The original wooden plant was built during the early settlement of Pemberton. The Institution of Engineers Australia and the South West Development Commission championed the project. The funds that would be generated by the project starting up again would be put into tourism in the town, which was a very good concept. Guess what happened?

7870 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

Somehow the project was not managed properly. The project company put a big black polythene pipe smack down the middle of the Lefroy River right in the middle of Pemberton. Everybody said that it was an abomination. The local reference group, which had a lot of greens and environmental members, asked why they could not build a boardwalk on the top of it and camouflage it rather than shift it. A few extremists had the ear of the Minister for the Environment and Heritage and the Minister for Peel and the South West, and the decision was made to shift the pipe at a huge cost. The pipe was cut up and stacked in a big heap. Guess what has happened? It is still stacked up in a big heap today. That is why the State has surplus budgets; projects that should have been completed have not been completed. We can all see the rain falling outside. How will that project be finished between now and the end of the financial year during some of the wettest months of the year? Members talk about the black hole, but this is the black pipe. It started off as a very good project. Had the project been managed properly and the pipe camouflaged on the side of the bank, by now the State would have a project that would be generating money through hydro-electricity being put into the grid. Instead, it is a stack of black pipes over one metre in height right next to the rainbow trail and the trout hatcheries on the doorstep of the town. Surely somebody should grab the project and make it work. In the last couple of minutes of my speech I will refer to some very important matters for the south west. They include the reconstruction of part of the South Western Highway. Some passing lanes are being constructed near Balingup. That road is very dangerous. The members for Mandurah and Rockingham say the proposed railway line is absolutely wonderful because they need not campaign any more and people will automatically vote for them, but a lot of people in my electorate could use some of that $1.4 billion. This morning I drove in from Hillarys. The traffic was banked up for 20 kilometres. A train with three carriages was running alongside the freeway. I had time to look in the windows of the carriages because the traffic was at a standstill. Half the passengers were standing, so where are the train wagons? I use the Kwinana Freeway on a regular basis because I travel south to go home and then I travel back to Perth. It never has that kind of build-up. Some members on this side of the House support the Mandurah rail project. However, the project is 10 years ahead of its time. This is the third time I have said this. If the member for Mandurah wants to take traffic out of the centre of Mandurah, all he needs is the Peel deviation. Mandurah has eight sets of traffic lights. That road is vital for the carriage of all the produce that comes from the south west of the State and all the people who travel to Margaret River, Pemberton, Denmark, Albany and so on. One of the reasons that tourists are not travelling to the south west is that the South Western Highway is an absolute disaster. Some work is being done on Muir Highway. Somehow Main Roads has transferred the responsibility for the maintenance of some of that road to the shire, which is improving the road. Guess what it is doing? It is improving all the straight bits of the road. All the dangerous bends are being left. It begs the question: how serious is this Government about good government in Western Australia? I cannot see it. The last issue I will mention briefly, because I must mention it at another time, is the question of fire. It is a very important issue about which I will speak later. MR M.P. WHITELY (Roleystone) [11.39 am]: I will be brief because other members wish to speak. I will refer to the effects of the budget on my electorate and the south east metropolitan corridor in general. Before I do that, I make one simple observation: both the Gallop and Court Governments achieved three budget surpluses. This Government has done that in three years and the previous Government took eight years. I will come back to economic performance, but I want to talk about the impact of the budget on my electorate. I have spoken before about these projects and the people involved, so I will not labour the point. Some $125 000 has been allocated to the Beckenham Primary School over the next four years as part of the 100 schools project. Since we have come to government, the benefits that have accrued to Beckenham Primary School include airconditioning and the fact that kids can go safely to school because William Street is now a safe road as a result of the Roe Highway being built. Benefits to the community include $49.4 million for the extension of Tonkin Highway from Mills Road west to Thomas Road, which will be of tremendous benefit to people in my electorate, particularly people in Byford because it will get some of the heavy traffic off the South Western Highway and make their community safer and quieter. Of a total $1 million commitment to the Byford recreation centre, $500 00 has been allocated, so the local community will no longer need to travel outside the Serpentine-Jarrahdale region to engage in recreational activities. That is another fantastic boost to the region. Some $80 000 has been allocated to assist private rental housing in the Kenwick, Maddington and Bentley areas. Bentley is obviously not in my electorate, but Kenwick and Maddington are. That will be of assistance to people who are struggling to make ends meet in that area. I want to talk briefly about the Maddington-Kenwick sustainability project, about which I am incredibly excited. It is a partnership project between the State Government and the City of Gosnells. Benefits from it will accrue to the people of Maddington and Kenwick over a number of years. It may take five to 10 years to see the full benefits of this project. Maddington and Kenwick are areas of great need. Most people living in those suburbs are in my electorate. I am an enthusiastic supporter of this project, as are the members for Southern River and Thornlie. I am proud to have been appointed chairperson of this project by the Premier. The City of Gosnells has taken a lead role in the project. It instigated the project and its enthusiasm has generated the project. The State Government came on board. I congratulate the councillors for their work, in particular Mayor Pat Morris for her work. I will speak briefly also about the work of some of the non-elected officials. Ray, Rebecca and Maureen comprise an extremely enthusiastic and capable team; they will achieve great things in Maddington and Kenwick. Their boss, Stuart

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7871

Jardine, has his heart in the right place. He is a very capable human being and puts the future of Maddington and Kenwick high on his list of priorities. I commend their commitment to this proposal. As I said, it is a long-term project; the benefits will not accrue overnight. Things are happening in Kenwick. Work is proceeding on the park behind the mud hut, the official name of which escapes me. We are working with the owners of the Maddington village shopping centre. I commend the efforts of Rodney Wright, an extraordinary human being who, I think, lives in the member for Stirling’s electorate. He is a farmer and an owner of the Maddington village shopping centre who is doing work off his own bat with kids from the Maddington area who are in trouble. He has pulled money out of his own pocket and put his own time into securing these kids a future. He was instrumental in taking four kids to the south of the State to participate in a shearing course. He is truly a remarkable human being. With that cooperation between the State Government, local government and private enterprise, we will achieve fantastic things in Maddington and Kenwick. I want to talk a little about what has happened to the south-east corridor in the past two and a half years. The Armadale Redevelopment Authority has started to do some fantastic work and in addition to the revitalisation of Gosnells. Kelmscott has engaged in a process of inquiry by design. Upgrades are being made to the Armadale, Gosnells and Kelmscott train stations. Stages 4 and 5 of the Roe Highway have been built - a long overdue project about which I have spoken at length in the past. That was delivered on time and ahead of budget. I obviously had a personal interest in that. I would no longer be in this place if the time lines had not been achieved, given my undertaking to resign if Roe Highway stage 4 had not been built by the end of 2002. People at Beckenham are incredibly grateful to the Government for that and for the work done by the Minister for Planning and Infrastructure to deliver that project. The Tonkin Highway extension is also about to proceed. The Kalamunda District Community Hospital will have $5.5 million pumped into it over the next four years, which will benefit the people who live in the north of my incredibly diverse electorate, including Walliston, Carmel, Pickering Brook and Bickley Valley. A change is occurring in the mind-set of people in the south-east corridor. They are up-beat and confident and they know that there is an end in sight after years of neglect. They know that this Government has their best interests at heart. Ms K. Hodson-Thomas: What nonsense! Mr M.P. WHITELY: They know that we have put our money where our mouth is; we have backed up our commitments. If the member for Carine believes that is nonsense, she should look at her Government’s shameful history of deception on the Roe Highway issue. People in the south-east corridor know that they are getting a good deal from this Government and they know that they are getting another good deal from this budget. I want to talk briefly about the Government’s record of economic management. I applaud the Treasurer and all ministers for the discipline they have shown in being able to deliver three budget surpluses in three years - not eight years. The budgets have been based on sound economic management. Members need not take my word for that, because obviously I have a barrow to push in this place and I am a very enthusiastic and keen member of the Gallop Labor Government. Members should listen to people who are not, and in the past have not been, typically our allies; that is, the members of the Chamber of Commerce and Industry of Western Australia. The chamber’s mid-term review of the performance of the Gallop Government gives a mixed report card. Its introduction and summary states - From a business perspective, Labor’s record in its first two years has been a mix ranging from the very bad to the very good. The very bad aspects that the chamber outlined will come as no surprise to members. It is critical of the fact that workers in Western Australia have enjoyed increased wages. It is critical of the fact that we have supported workers in their endeavours to improve their situation. That reflects the obvious difference in ideology between any Labor Government and the Chamber of Commerce and Industry. I would expect it to be critical of us. Frankly, I welcome that criticism. I wear it as a badge of honour that we are, in fact, the champion of workers. Mr R.N. Sweetman: As long as you wear as a correlation the unemployment figures as a badge of honour as well. Mr M.P. WHITELY: It is entirely predictable. It is interesting to hear the member for Ningaloo interject and ask about unemployment. It is interesting to note the rationale of the Chamber of Commerce and Industry for saying that we should not give increases in wages to low-paid workers and that there will be an increase in the rate of unemployment. What is the record of this Government on unemployment? The unemployment rate in our first year of government was 6.5 per cent. It has fallen to six per cent and is anticipated to fall to 5.7 per cent. In the three years we have been in government, employment grew by 1.1 per cent, 2.5 per cent and 2.25 per cent respectively. The Chamber of Commerce and Industry’s rhetoric does not match the reality of our performance. Employment growth has been strong and unemployment has fallen. The rate of economic growth has increased massively. Real growth in state products in 2001-02 was 5.7 per cent, and it is anticipated to be 4.25 per cent in 2003-04 and 4.5 per cent in the out years. That is a fantastic job of economic management. The Chamber of Commerce and Industry criticised the Government, predictably, for supporting workers by increasing their pay. However, the Chamber of Commerce and Industry said that there were some very good aspects of our performance. It said -

7872 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

On other issues, the government has made strong and significant progress where its predecessor languished. CCI especially welcomes the reforms of the energy sector and proposals to break up Western Power Corporation. . . . The government has scored some significant achievements in management of fiscal policy. It recorded surpluses in its first two years, and turned around the deficits projected just prior to the election. That is a ringing endorsement from people who are naturally inclined towards the other side of politics. These are words from the Chamber of Commerce and Industry, not words from our sponsors. This is not the Australian Council of Trade Unions evaluating our performance but a traditional supporter of members opposite. The CCI said not only that this Government had done very well but also that the previous Government did very poorly. Referring to the Gallop Government, the CCI went on to say - . . . it has controlled expenditure growth more tightly than its predecessor. More importantly, it has put in place mechanisms to deliver ongoing budgetary control in future. These began with the important first step of introducing a rational and transparent structure of government agencies by implementing the reforms recommended by the Machinery of Government Taskforce. That is a ringing endorsement of us and a slamming criticism of members opposite. The CCI goes on to refer to further improvements that will be delivered by the Functional Review Taskforce and the cabinet expenditure review committee. It continues - But these organisations will have little effect unless they are supported at Cabinet level to keep up the pressure for fiscal stringency. The record of the previous administration suggests that this gets harder over time. That is again a ringing endorsement of where this Government has got to. It sounds a warning bell that we must continue but asks us not to go the way of the previous Administration. There we have it - the Chamber of Commerce and Industry giving a ringing endorsement of the performance and economic management of our Government. That will continue in this budget because of the discipline displayed by the Treasurer and ministers in staying within their budgets rather than blowing them out. They have been able to perform as a team and have seen the bigger picture. I commend them on a brilliant job. Members may want to read an independent analysis by the Under Treasurer of June 1998, in which he commented on problems that had been outlined in the budget process of the previous Government. He highlighted four categories of budget incompetence. I am conscious of the fact that other members wish to speak, but suffice it to say that there were four different ways in which individual ministers blew their budgets. Who was the guilty party in all four cases - the only minister who got a mention in all four cases? It was the then Minister for Education, the present Leader of the Opposition. Mr R.N. Sweetman interjected. Mr M.P. WHITELY: It is very easy to be a good Minister for Education if one is extravagant; just blow the budget with no view of the bottom line. It is not easy to deliver budget surpluses. The previous Government could only do it three times, with the benefit of huge windfall gains such as stamp duty from the privatisation of AlintaGas. The previous Government was incompetent. That blows the myth of the Liberals being superior economic managers. The present Treasurer and ministers have done well, and must keep up the good work. DR J.M. WOOLLARD (Alfred Cove) [11.51 am]: I will address three main areas in relation to this Bill: health, education and law and order. I begin by congratulating the Government on introducing the nurse practitioners legislation. I was very concerned that the Government might just be introducing this legislation to ease some of the problems it is having in country areas. However, in the past week or so, the debate in the House on prostitution indicated how the Government can really show that it is committed to nurse practitioners. The key problems for sex workers are sexually transmitted diseases and drugs, and the associated psychological and social problems. I was fortunate to speak with some of the ex-prostitutes who had been able to leave the industry with the support they were given by Archbishop Hickey and Linda Watson, the ex-madam who now runs Linda’s House of Hope. I had the opportunity to speak only to girls, although I appreciate now, after looking at the Internet where these brothels are advertised, that there are both girls and boys in the industry. They told me that some of them had drug habits, and they turned to prostitution because it was an easy way to earn money to feed those habits. Others told how, when they approached a brothel looking for work, the madams would look at their arms to see whether they were regular intravenous drug users. If they were not, they would be turned away, because the madams said that girls who are on drugs give better service to the clients. I listened to some of their stories, and watched some of the videos that have been made about the prostitution industry. I seek leave to table one of these, entitled The Madam and Company for the information of members. [The videotape was tabled for the information of members.]

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7873

Dr J.M. WOOLLARD: Last week, when I asked the minister about street prostitutes, she said that the police were clearly dealing with that problem. Anyone who has the opportunity to look at that video will see a madam escorting her prostitutes down to the Fremantle wharf, and then handing out the cards as the sailors come off the ships. There are many problems in the prostitution industry. Some girls are on drugs before they go into the industry, but there is an increase in the use of drugs after girls enter the industry, not only because some of their clients introduce them to new drugs, but also because some prostitutes move to stronger drugs to help them ignore what is happening to them in the brothels. Those prostitutes have health problems, and currently have regular checks for sexually transmitted diseases. I draw the attention of the House to some of the booklets prepared for prostitutes by Phoenix. They refer to regular clients, how to get them and why they are needed. They provide a list of parlours and escort agencies. There is also information about sexually transmitted diseases and the use of condoms. Some of this information has been tabled in the upper House. However, in all the information I have been able to collect I have found nothing about support services for prostitutes who want to leave the industry. That is where this Government could make a big difference. I have been told by many of these prostitutes that they lose their families; their children are taken away from them. Some people see prostitution as a lucrative career. However, because the prostitutes are using drugs and their drug habits increase while they are in the industry, some of these girls are spending well over $1 000 a day just to feed their drug habits. When they want to leave the industry, they do not have a bank balance. They may have been managed by a pimp, someone in the parlour, or a boyfriend or husband who also has a drug habit and is looking for his share of the profits. When women want to stop working as prostitutes, there is usually nowhere for them to go. I congratulate Linda Watson, the ex-madam, for setting up the House of Hope, which means some prostitutes now have somewhere to go. It was stated in the House last week that there are something like 3 600 prostitutes in Western Australia alone. I have raised this issue under the health portfolio and I have congratulated the Government on the nurse practitioners legislation because the provision of nurse practitioners in this area would be an excellent way for the Government to try to assist prostitutes. The Government would probably need to appoint six nurse practitioners. This could be a designated area for nurse practitioners. We know that school nurses already deal in schools with just about all the issues that nurses would need to deal with for adult prostitutes. School nurses already provide education on sex and drugs, and assist with the social, physical and psychological problems of students. Nurses could also work with prostitutes. They could ensure that prostitutes who have sexually transmissible diseases or are taking drugs do not provide a service. Such nurses would have counselling skills; they would have been involved in drug rehabilitation programs. This would be a way for the Government to show that it would like to help these workers. I know that members of this Government are trying and have tried to help people in this area. Before she became a member of the Legislative Council, Hon Sue Ellery wrote an article on understanding the employment relationship in the sex industry. Although the Government did not provide all the information it needed to, it tried to do something when it funded Phoenix. It is a shame that it did not include in that documentation more information on support services, drug control and rehabilitation centres. Providing nurse practitioners to work in these areas would be a way for the Government to try to stop the problems associated with prostitution in Western Australia. At the moment, drugs are ripe within brothels. As I said before, drug dealers visit prostitutes as clients. Once a drug dealer has seen a girl a few times, he will open up a satchel and ask which drug the girl would like to try. Drug dealers are using prostitutes to introduce new drugs into the market. The Government has so far put together documents on how prostitutes can keep their jobs and how they can look for employment. I am pleased that the Minister for Health has entered the Chamber. I would like the minister to move into this area. Mr R.C. Kucera: I think I’m a bit old, member. Dr J.M. WOOLLARD: I did not mean in a literal sense. I meant that the Department of Health and nurse practitioners could play a major role in helping prostitutes, both in terms of teaching them more about sexually transmitted diseases - Mr R.C. Kucera: I understand that it is intended that the prostitution legislation will fall under my portfolio. If that is the case, I intend that it would be part and parcel of the process, and that the Department of Health would undertake all those things. At the end of the day, women have a choice, but at the same time they must be able to make an informed choice. Dr J.M. WOOLLARD: Yes, an informed choice. Does the minister agree that the current role of nurses covers every aspect that prostitutes face? Mr R.C. Kucera: Absolutely. Dr J.M. WOOLLARD: Nurses would be able to assist prostitutes with their mental health and physical problems, provide drug counselling and deal with all the issues that confront prostitutes today. Mr R.C. Kucera: I applaud the work of Perth Women’s Centre in Aberdeen Street. I have visited that centre on a number of occasions. That is exactly what that centre does. Many of the staff of that centre are nurses. I could not agree more with the member. That is one of the reasons this Government is so insistent on moving that legislation into the health arena. As well as making sure that there are proper sanctions in place that the community wants to support,

7874 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] there is also an absolute need to make sure that the health of women who, for whatever reason, become involved in this industry is properly supported. Dr J.M. WOOLLARD: I am pleased to hear that, Minister for Health. I would be delighted to help the minister further develop this role for nurse practitioners. I spoke this morning with the Australian Nursing Federation, which also believes that this is a role that nurses currently perform. The ANF agreed that it would be an excellent idea for this to be a designated area for nurse practitioners. I know that the ANF would also be happy to work with the minister. Mr R.C. Kucera: As you may be aware, on Monday we appointed Dr Phillip Della as the first Chief Nursing Officer of this State. That appointment now elevates the top position in nursing to the level of the chief medical officer in this State. Nursing has been put on that platform. I invite you to talk to Dr Della at any time to make sure that the nurse practitioner role is reflected wherever appropriate. Dr J.M. WOOLLARD: I will speak with Dr Della. I congratulate the minister on making that appointment. Mr R.C. Kucera: Thank you. He is a very worthy appointee. Dr J.M. WOOLLARD: Yes, and I look forward to working with him. I will now move on to law and order issues. As I mentioned yesterday, the role of the police and the armed forces is to protect the community from harm that others want to inflict on it. In terms of the protection of workers, the Government also has a role to protect the community from the manufacturers of certain products and the providers of certain services. I will now consider the issue of smoking. I am pleased that the Minister for Consumer and Employment Protection is in the House. Before I consider the Occupational Safety and Health Act, I will address one further comment to the Minister for Health. Unless the Minister for Health cares to answer by way of interjection, I will ask him during question time today why, when the Health Amendment Act 1998 states that a review was meant to have been conducted after the expiry of the amendments on 12 January 1999, and was meant to have been tabled in this House one year after that date, the minister has still not tabled the review. I believe that the minister is in breach of the Act and his role. However, I will ask that question of the Minister for Health today. I will address the big question I have regarding the Occupational Safety and Health Act and smokers, to the Leader of the House. The Act defines smoking as a poison, and we know that anyone who passively smokes within an enclosed space is exposed to those toxins. The minister is fully aware of all the research that has been conducted in Western Australia, Australia and worldwide, yet he still allows people in the hospitality industry to work in enclosed spaces seven and a half hours a day or 37.5 hours a week. I listened to government members state that the Labor Party has traditionally been there for the workers in offices and schools and in many other sectors such as the building industry and the public service. However, the minister seems to have had no consideration for the workers in the hospitality industry. This might have been acceptable five, 10 or 15 years ago, but it is not acceptable today because of the knowledge we now have about passive smoking. We know that passive smoking causes heart disease, cancer and an increase in lung problems in children. Each year 100 to 200 children are admitted to Princess Margaret Hospital for Children because they are passive smokers because their parents smoke. Tragically, this can also lead to sudden infant death syndrome. The minister and the Government are well aware of the dangers of smoking, but the review has not been tabled. Regulations were introduced several years ago of which the minister is well aware, yet no-one in this Government has done anything to help hospitality workers. Although this Government has not done anything during its term of office, some people have worked very hard. I congratulate the Australian Liquor, Hospitality and Miscellaneous Workers Union, in particular Helen Creed, Sharryn Jackson - who is now Labor’s federal member for Hasluck - and Sue Lines. I also congratulate the Australian Council on Smoking and Health and its director, a former federal Labor member for Stirling and Deputy Speaker of the House of Representatives. Those two groups together with Professor Bill Musk, from the University of Western Australia, and Sir Charles Gairdner Hospital, were able to ensure that casinos were smoke free. Apart from research carried out by Healthway showing that 80 per cent of the community supports no smoking in enclosed public places, there is a strong move from within Labor Party ranks to stop smoking. Many people find it difficult to comprehend why this Government has done nothing about the matter after two years in government. Perhaps now the Government is ready to move; I very much hope that that is the case. I hope the private member’s Bill that I tabled yesterday will get full support from the Labor Party. It is not just the Western Australian community that would like to see that legislation introduced. Legislation of this nature has already been introduced in New York and California, and last week it was introduced in the city of Boston. Therefore, this State is a little behind the times, but the Government has the opportunity to come good in this area. Research has shown that young adults - those 18 years of age plus - who might be occasional smokers and who smoke two or three cigarettes a day or a week, move from being occasional smokers to becoming habitual and addicted smokers when they socialise with their friends in the hospitality area. When cigarettes are being passed around in those venues, these young adults will smoke 10 to 15 cigarettes in an evening. A ban on smoking in public places would protect not only the community from the harm associated with passive smoking, but also the young adults who are

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7875 currently occasional smokers but are likely to become habitual smokers because smoking occurs inside hospitality venues. I have spoken a little about health and about law and order. I will now refer to education, from a slightly different angle. The Government must not consider education from only the perspective of the three Rs. I acknowledge that the Government is trying to improve education standards and provide adequate resources, and that the Minister for Education and Training wants to increase the age at which children can leave school. I support funding to provide appropriate courses for the children who decide to stay at school. It is appropriate that the Minister for Education and Training is also the Minister for Sport and Recreation, because our youth are often neglected with regard to sport and recreation. It concerns me that the minister supports the sale of school ovals and land. Less than two per cent of land in one suburb of my electorate is public open space. The minister is encouraging the sale of that land. He says that it must be sold in order to build a new school and improve the existing school’s facilities. I am quite happy to take an interjection from the minister. Mr A.J. Carpenter: The school is in your electorate, but you do not know what you are talking about. My children go to that school. That school is unable to use the two school ovals, which are part of the Department of Education precinct, because they are too far from the school buildings. I am making a change that will allow the students to use a fully equipped and maintained oval, and the member is opposing it. For the first time ever, the children will be able to use the oval. They use the oval only one day a year, when they hold a sports day. The rest of the time they have no play area, yet the member is opposing what I am doing. In the same breath she says that more should be done for children with regard to sport and recreation. She does not understand the dynamics involved in the issue. I live in the area and my children go to school there. I understand what I am doing, which is in the best interests of the children. Dr J.M. WOOLLARD: I am very pleased the minister made those comments. I am aware that the minister’s four daughters go to that school. Some 18 months ago I saw the minister about the condition of the toilets at that school. The young boys would hold on all day rather than use the toilets. They could not reach the toilet button. The toilets were in a very poor condition. When I asked the minister how he could allow that situation to continue, he informed me that his four daughters attend the school. That is when I found out that the minister’s children attend that school. The land at that school used to be a class A reserve. Mr A.J. Carpenter: In 1959. Dr J.M. WOOLLARD: I beg the minister’s pardon. Does he wish to interject again? Mr A.J. Carpenter: In what year was it a class A reserve? Dr J.M. WOOLLARD: It was a class A reserve some 30 or 40 years ago. Mr A.J. Carpenter: That is what I said. It was a class A reserve in about 1959. The Department of Education bought the land from the City of Melville for school purposes, to which it will now be applied for the first time ever. Dr J.M. WOOLLARD: I accept that the Department of Education bought the land. Maps of the area at that time show that there was much more public open space in the area. When the children left the school, they had other parks and venues in which to play. The minister said that the children would have an oval to play on. However, he has not said that the Government will knock down the buildings and sell the land. Some of the parents are happy for a new school to be built, but they do not want to lose the open space. They do not mind if some of the buildings are demolished and the lovely area where the trees are is kept for the children as a recreational area. However, that is not what the minister wants to do. He wants the school bulldozed, the land sold and a new school built. Mr A.J. Carpenter: We will build a new school. I would have thought that most parents - not all - want it. We will build a new school, and for the first time ever the children at that primary school will have access to an oval for play times and lunchtimes and after school. They have never been able to access it before. The member is right when she says that the current footprint of the building will be sold. The first thing to do is to build a new school. Dr J.M. WOOLLARD: I am informed that the children have access to the oval now. Not only the children but also the public have access to that oval. Under the Town Planning and Development Act - Ms A.J. MacTiernan: His children go there. Dr J.M. WOOLLARD: Unfortunately I do not have time to go into some of the issues under the Minister for Planning and Infrastructure’s portfolio. I would be delighted to be given another 45 minutes - in fact another three hours - to deal with issues under her portfolio. Mr A.J. Carpenter: I understand that the member is acting on information that has been provided to her. However, I know that area intimately. I know how much the two ovals are used. In contrast, I know how much the Marmion reserve is used. That reserve is just 250 metres away from the school, and organised sports are played there under lights. I ask the member to give me a little more time, because I am also working on the redevelopment of the high school, which for the first time in many years will, I hope, open up the high school oval to community use. I have not been able to nail that down yet, but within the next four to six weeks I hope to make an announcement about it. The member knows that the high school is absolutely magnificent.

7876 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

Dr J.M. WOOLLARD: That will come within my boundaries. I am looking forward to that. Mr A.J. Carpenter: It has not happened yet. For the first time in many years, the Melville High School will be opened up for community use. Although the oval at the primary school will be lost, a brand new school will be built and the kids will be provided with an oval that they can use for the first time. As part of that development, I want Melville High School’s oval opened for community use. It is a good development. Dr J.M. WOOLLARD: I appreciate that the minister wants to provide better facilities for the students. Mr A.J. Carpenter: I am going to. Dr J.M. WOOLLARD: He intends to provide better facilities. What other options has the minister considered on the land in view of the fact that there is less than two per cent public open space in that suburb? What about using the metropolitan regional tax fund to buy back the land or give it to the community so the community will not lose that public open space? Money is exchanged from one department to another all the time. Why can there not be an exchange of funds to ensure that the suburb and community do not lose their public open space? Mr A.J. Carpenter: There is a debate about whether the two school ovals are correctly designated as public open space. They are actually for educational purposes. The ovals are not able to be used in that way at the moment. They are so lightly used that the member would not believe it. There is virtually no use of the ovals. I know because I live nearby; I see it and I talk to people. I understand that people want a nice green space to look at but no-one uses the ovals. I guarantee that once the new primary school is built and one oval receives decent facilities and is cared for, the amount of use of the public open space, as the member calls it, will be much greater than it is now. I guarantee that because it will be properly cared for. I hope to reach an agreement with the City of Melville to share some management ideas. The City of Melville has been told that the option is available for it to purchase the current school footprint site. I do not think it will because it will have to spend money. It says there is a chronic shortage of public open space at the very time it is allowing people to subdivide their blocks and potentially double the population and the impact on the available space. I do not accept the lines of argument it runs. When examined closely, one can see they are full of holes. I have told the council and the department that I am willing to become involved in negotiations between them over the potential use of the school footprint site. It is possible to achieve what they want to achieve but I will not give it to them. The council sold the land to the Department of Education and Training at commercial rates. I will not give it back to the council for the taxpayers of the rest of Western Australia to subsidise the City of Melville. I am a ratepayer in the council. The City of Melville is allowing subdivision to increase its rate base. Dr J.M. WOOLLARD: The Town Planning and Development Act states there should be 10 per cent public open space. Where does the minister believe the responsibility to achieve that lies? Is it a state government or a local council responsibility? Mr A.J. Carpenter: For a start, my understanding of the 10 per cent public open space requirement is that it is for new developments. It is not my responsibility, as Minister for Education and Training, to help local government authorities in their aspirations - if that is what it really is; look at what they are doing - to tell their ratepayers they are providing more public open space by giving them education department land. That is not my responsibility. I would be negligent in my responsibilities to the rest of the State and the children of this State if I started handing over education department assets to local government authorities that are allowing subdivisions to build up population pressure many times over on the available public open space. My responsibility is to properly provide for the children of the State and to manage the education department of this State. I am sorry I took up so much of the member’s time. I can provide details to the member in written form. Dr J.M. WOOLLARD: I would appreciate that because the community is very concerned. The City of Melville has a new council. There are two new councillors; they are both very community minded. There has been a change in the balance of the council. The 10 per cent public open space requirement should be enforced by the Government rather than by councils. Mr A.J. Carpenter: Retrospectively? We cannot go around bulldozing houses in established suburbs. Ms A.J. MacTiernan: What about the Liberals for greenhouse gases group? Dr J.M. WOOLLARD: If I am granted an extension of time I will respond to the minister’s ridiculous comment. Unless I am given an extension the minister is not worth responding to. Mr A.J. Carpenter: I have encouraged the councils to negotiate with the education department. Dr J.M. WOOLLARD: If so, I look forward to meeting with the minister, some councillors and the community. MR B.J. GRYLLS (Merredin) [12.36 pm]: I welcome the opportunity to comment on this year’s budget. As the newest member of this Parliament, this is probably the one and only opportunity of the year for me to provide a wide- ranging review of my electorate in the past year. I will also comment on the effect that last week’s budget will have on my electorate. Before I start I welcome back the member for Swan Hills. It is fantastic to see her looking so well and recovering from her illness. It is great to see her back on deck giving this side of the House a hard time again.

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7877

Mr A.J. Carpenter: Very statesmanlike. Mr B.J. GRYLLS: Thank you. The minister will probably not be saying that shortly! I hold shadow portfolio responsibilities in the National Party for water and business. My initial comments on the budget will specifically focus on those portfolios. I will then comment on my electorate and the effects this budget will have on it. The most critical issue for the State is rain. It is good to have a few solid days of rainfall. I am happy to report that the rain has been quite significant in the agricultural region, especially in the wheatbelt. I was happy to read in the farming press this morning that my home town of Corrigin has received some of the most significant rainfall in the State. The rain has progressed from the south west of the wheatbelt to the northern wheatbelt, which normally is quite dry. The seeding programs are well under way. It is good to see such a great change in attitude by landowners and people planting crops, as well as by the whole community. They have all been affected by the bad season. Local shoe shops, hairdressers and farm supply operators can look forward to a promising year. The income is in the system and, hopefully, they can go forward without experiencing the significant problems caused by last year’s drought. The rain is most welcome and will provide benefits to the agricultural region and the State. Despite that, we are facing a crisis of some sort under the National Action Plan for Salinity and Water Quality. The national action plan has been my key concern since I came to this place, and still there have been no results. Members must be aware that I am talking about a $158 million offer from the Commonwealth to Western Australia that will allow the State to implement salinity and water quality projects. The plan will match the State’s contribution dollar for dollar. Therefore, over the next seven years, $316 million could be used to fight Western Australia’s salinity and water quality problems. Western Australia is the only State not to have signed a bilateral agreement with the Commonwealth Government. In its budget speech, the Commonwealth Government referred to its concern about the direction of this issue and Western Australia’s inability to devise a plan that meets the criteria set down by the Commonwealth Government. Western Australia’s ability to receive matching commonwealth funding is at a standstill, and it looks like the situation will remain the same in the near future. That is extremely distressing to not only me as a member of Parliament, but also my electorate. I am sure that everybody involved in land care in Western Australia is hanging on every word of both the state and federal ministers involved in reaching an agreement on the national action plan. I was disappointed that there was no allocation for national action plan moneys in the budget announced by the Treasurer last week. It concerns me, because when questioned in the upper House, the Minister for Agriculture said that if an agreement on the national action plan had been reached before May, it would have allowed the State to access commonwealth funding, and then allocations for funding the plan could have been made in this budget. I refer to a letter written by the Prime Minister on 31 March, which is well before the May cut-off date referred to by Minister for Agriculture. In his letter the Prime Minister states - I am prepared to recognise $31.48 million towards initial priority projects for the NAP in Western Australia, as described in Attachment A. The initial priority projects eligible for commonwealth funding include $1.2 million for regional coordinators; $6 million for catchment demonstrations; $4 million for engineering evaluations; $1.57 million for state administration; and, $18.71 million for AlintaGas funds, which were allocated to salinity. Therefore, the Commonwealth Government recognised that $31.48 million worth of funds could receive matching funding from the Commonwealth. However, the latest budget does not contain that $31.48 million. Once again, this situation is in limbo. In the statements he has made to the upper House, the Minister for Agriculture has revealed the complete lack of interest that the Gallop Labor Government has shown towards salinity and water quality problems in Western Australia. At the moment, we languish as the only State in the Commonwealth that has not signed off on the bilateral agreement. Once again, political gains, trickery and skulduggery have been involved in this issue. I turn now to an editorial that appeared in the Farm Weekly a couple of weeks ago. The National Party has been the only party to take up the national action plan fight with the State Government on behalf of landowners and people interested in the environment. The Farm Weekly editorial states - After months of stalling, a bilateral agreement was finally signed between both parties in November last year. With WA’s reluctance to sign the NAP coming under criticism from various quarters, Dr Gallop found $88m for an initial commitment to the NAP, with the proviso that the remaining funds to match the $158m would be negotiated by the two governments before the 2003/04 state budget. But again Dr Gallop wanted the upper hand - he made more demands by insisting that most of the NAP contributions had to be tied to six “priority projects” as nominated by his government. Mr Howard rejected the notion, expressing concern at locking up such a significant proportion of funds this way. It was on this basis that Mr. Howard instead offered the lesser amount of $31m for the “priority projects”, resulting in the current stand-off. The National Party is not alone in its extreme concern about the state of the national action plan. The Farm Weekly, one of the two major rural newspapers in Western Australia, has also called on the Government to get its act into gear and to provide the funds for the NAP. Sadly, like last year, this year’s budget does not contain any funding for the NAP.

7878 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

Given the way this debate has taken place, I am extremely concerned that the State Government will not make any commitment towards finding matching funding for the NAP. That would be an absolute travesty for Western Australia land care and for the State’s salinity problems. The green tinge that the Government claimed after it ended the logging of old-growth forests has been lost in the wheatbelt, where salinity is a far more serious problem. However, because that issue does not have a feel-good nature to it, not even $1 can be found for national action plan matching funding. I turn now to the water symposium, which was held last year. I am extremely concerned that both the member for Warren-Blackwood and I were denied the chance to speak at the water symposium, particularly given some of the strange recommendations that are now being implemented. Yesterday we had quite a lengthy debate about the Labor Government’s decision to gain an administration fee from farmers for their dams. Today’s business section of The West Australian reports that mining companies are extremely concerned about that same charge. Consider also the amazing scenario of subsidies being provided for the purchase of water tanks under the Government’s plan to save water, even though previous Water Corporation research has revealed that the water tank option is twice as expensive as the Kimberley pipeline. Once again, the Government has flown in the face of research and science and taken the populist option to supply a subsidy on water tanks. The Managing Director of the Water Corporation, Dr Jim Gill, is regularly on radio and in the media generally extolling the virtues of not drinking the water from home-based rainwater tanks because the quality of that water cannot be guaranteed. I am extremely concerned that the recommendations of the water symposium do not reflect what the public wants and what the facts state. One of the issues I hoped to raise at the water symposium was desalination and the opportunity that it presents for not only country towns but also the wider country area. The rising watertable in many country towns causes the salinity issue about which I have previously spoken. As a result of an innovative plan, the watertables in some regional towns have been lowered. The water is pumped from under the towns into evaporation ponds. I do not know why the Government cannot find the funds to carry out extensive research and development to harness this water resource, which is already being pumped, and turn it into an asset. The reason the Merredin desalination project received one year of funding and was then nipped in the bud alludes me. Water and salinity issues should be a priority for this Government. I will continue to ensure that desalination options from the wheatbelt are pushed to the fore. Recently I had a discussion with Harvey Water about some of the issues it is facing. Harvey Water is responsible for the irrigation of vast quantities of the south west and much of the horticultural produce from which this State benefits. It faces a problem with the dam safety program for the Waroona, Drakesbrook, Samson Brook, Stirling and Wellington dams. The cost of the dam safety project will probably reach $100 million. The irrigators and Harvey Water are extremely concerned that the $100 million will be sought from irrigators and customers of Harvey Water. Placing a cost burden of an extra $100 million on the irrigators would increase their water costs by up to 100 per cent. Debate interrupted, pursuant to standing orders. [Continued on page 7912.]

YOUTH CENTRE, BUSSELTON Statement by Member for Vasse MR B.K. MASTERS (Vasse) [12.50 pm]: Last year Nyoongah elder Barbara Stammner-Corbett raised with me the need to provide young Aboriginal people with the opportunity to learn more about their culture and to develop a hope for their future. Thanks largely to Barbara’s perseverance, the Koorlangka Community Centre is now more than just a faint hope. Instead, with the help of a wide range of people from the Busselton community, a committee has formed and met several times with the goal of creating an incorporated body to establish a centre for Nyoongah youth. Antony Ohlson, a person of Maori descent, has brought his New Zealand experiences of working with young indigenous people to Busselton. His vision is, and I quote from the centre’s draft constitution - . . . To assist Noongar youth to achieve self respect, accept responsibility and improve their spiritual and cultural well-being by:

• Establishing a facility to be used for meetings and for sporting, educational and learning activities,

• Encouraging the use of the Noongar language, and

• Encouraging Noongar and other people in the widest number of ways to interact with Noongar youth so as to make them better citizens, give them confidence in the future, develop their self esteem and provide them with leadership. Incorporation of the association is still some months away; funding will also take many months; and finding the correct site for the centre, while also gaining the support of the broader community for its establishment, will take additional time. However, the concept is sound, the people are committed, and the need for a centre to be used by young Nyoongah people is undoubted. I call upon the Government to provide funding and other support to the centre as and when such support is requested.

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7879

STALLARD AND BUCKLEY FAMILIES, NANNUP Statement by Member for Bunbury MR A.J. DEAN (Bunbury) [12.52 pm]: I bring to the notice of the House a tragedy that has befallen the town of Nannup, and, more importantly, the extended families of Stallard and Buckley. On 19 April Debbie Stallard and two of her sons were swept to their deaths from the rocks of Black Point, a coastline Debbie and her family had fished for generations. I first met Deb when she transferred from St Joseph’s Primary School to Nannup Primary School in 1963. Deb and I did all our schooling together and later we moved onto different careers. We renewed our friendship when Deb came back to Nannup to marry Ron Stallard. I have the highest regard for Ron as a man, husband and parent. This tragedy touched almost everyone in Nannup in that they were three well-known and loved people. It has touched people because they were doing what a large proportion of people in Nannup do - fishing as a hobby. It shocked people to think that three valuable lives could be lost in such a benign activity. Deb and her sons will not be forgotten by the people of Nannup. Deb’s work, particularly her volunteer service with the Nannup Historical Society, will remain with the people of Nannup for years to come. This tragedy might have been prevented. This story might have had a different ending if rescue facilities had been available on the coast. Rescue facilities can be as simple as a lifebelt and reels of ropes to help retrieve swimmers. These are low-cost devices, which could be placed at strategic positions at favourite but dangerous fishing spots along the south coast. The cost of providing all weather rescue points would be minimal when compared to the loss suffered by the Stallard family and the people of Nannup. Money could be allocated for this cause from our old-growth forest policy package. I seek leave to table for the remainder of this day’s sitting a copy of the celebration of thanksgiving for the lives of Deb, Andrew and Paul Stallard. [The paper was tabled for the information of members.]

CUNDERDIN AVIATION EXPO COMMITTEE Statement by Member for Merredin MR B.J. GRYLLS (Merredin) [12.53 pm]: I congratulate the Cunderdin Aviation Expo Committee, which organised and ran the wheatbelt’s biggest ever air show over the Easter weekend. This event provided entertainment for not only people in the wheatbelt but also those from much further afield. It was good to talk to many people who travelled long distances to attend this great event. The benefits flowing to the region from this event are enormous. Eleven thousand spectators enjoyed the air show over the two days. The profit generated was between $80 000 and $90 000. It will be distributed to community groups that helped with catering and organising the day. It will also be used to fund an upgrade of the heritage-listed Cunderdin airfield, which has played an important role in the training of pilots over the past century. I thank all the owners of planes who made the event such a significant one. Many Tiger Moths were there, Skywest was there, and Bill Wyllie brought his Mustang, which was fantastic. The model aeroplane clubs put on fantastic spectacles for all the spectators. I thank all who travelled there. Their support will ensure that the expo will now be a biennial event. I thank the Wheatbelt Development Commission for its generous sponsorship. I must single out for special mention, president Rod Carter, publicity officer Lia Elliades, the Cunderdin Shire Council, Graeme Cooper, David Godfrey and all the volunteers who gave their time to guarantee the success of the event. The wheatbelt is gaining a reputation for staging exciting and diverse entertainment, and I encourage all members to visit the wheatbelt for one of these events this year.

ALBANY PRIMARY TELEGRAPH Statement by Member for Albany MR P.B. WATSON (Albany) [12.55 pm]: I wish to speak today about the remarkable achievement of a group of students at the Albany Primary School, who produce their own online newspaper, the Albany Primary Telegraph. The Albany Primary Telegraph was instigated by Greg Grey, a year 6 teacher, and Rob Daniel, a parent and local writer. Their vision has enabled the students to go throughout their school to interview students and take photos, and then to publish the work immediately. This allows the children to show people, including parents, friends and relatives overseas, interstate or in WA, what is happening at their school. I have seen first-hand how this concept has the children working as a team and I felt their excitement as they put the paper together. It is no easy task to put the paper together. Students must learn about editing, story writing, creative writing and finding solutions. The opportunity to develop their Internet skills and build web pages is another asset they gain from putting together the paper. The site has had more than 30 000 hits and feedback from schools as far away as Poland, Germany, the UK, and, prior to the recent conflict, Iraq. The Albany Primary Telegraph is the only online newspaper in the world run by children. It not only

7880 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] gives the children an opportunity to develop all the skills needed by staff at a conventional newspaper, but also the school a chance to promote itself and the Albany region. I congratulate all those concerned on the production of the paper. It was a great honour to be shown how the paper operates. It was especially pleasing to see the pride the students have in their finished product. HON TOM STEPHENS, CARNARVON ELECTORATE OFFICE Statement by Member for Ningaloo MR R.N. SWEETMAN (Ningaloo) [12.56 pm]: I rise to recognise one of my parliamentary colleagues in the other House. We too rarely give credit to our parliamentary colleagues. I want the House to consider the exploits and the rare genius displayed by Hon Tom Stephens in opening an electorate office in my home town of Carnarvon. It is indeed a privilege for a rural community to have an electorate office when one considers the number of offices members of the upper House have compared with members of the lower House. Carnarvon feels doubly privileged, by virtue of the taxpayers of Western Australia, to have another electorate office - or I should say campaign office - in Carnarvon. The first thing I said, when I was asked for my thoughts on Hon Tom Stephens’ opening an electorate office in Carnarvon, was, “Thank you, God.” I want to send a whole lot of constituents from Carnarvon to Hon Tom Stephens, because I am sick of trying to explain to them the difficulties involved in getting even the most basic consideration from this Government. I can now refer those people to a member of Cabinet. Rather than ridicule or belittle the efforts of Hon Tom Stephens, I congratulate him for coming to Carnarvon to share some of the significant issues that I try to wade through day in and day out in my home town of Carnarvon. I spare a thought for the communities in Mt Magnet, Meekatharra, Cue and Exmouth. I am sure that if Hon Tom Stephens had asked them whether he could set up an electorate office in one of those communities, they would have dipped into their own pockets to share in the cost. MR FRED DRAKE-BROCKMAN Statement by Member for Collie MR M.P. MURRAY (Collie) [12.58 pm]: I take this opportunity to pay tribute to a man who has made a significant contribution to local government in my electorate. Recently, Fred Drake-Brockman retired from the Shire of Donnybrook-Balingup after service spanning 15 years. In that term he served a three-year stint as deputy shire president and took on the role of shire president for the past six years. Fred followed in the footsteps of two previous generations in service to local government. Fred’s father was a councillor for 15 years in the 1940s and 1950s and Fred’s grandfather was a founding member of the shire’s governing body back in 1896 and continued his service for another 20 years. Fred is one of those extraordinary leaders who puts the good of the community above his own politics and, as such, has been an effective worker for the community. Apart from his duties as shire president, Fred serves on the board of the South West Development Commission; is the fire control officer for the Lowden bush fire brigade; is Chairman of the Preston Valley Irrigation Cooperative; and is a board member of the South West Regional Planning Committee and the Bunbury-Wellington Economic Alliance. I have had the pleasure of working with Fred in the past two years on matters relating to the shire and, although our views were not always the same, Fred was always willing to work through the issues with me. I was always very appreciative of his input and outlook on all matters. The Donnybrook community has had its money’s worth from Fred, who has had loyal support from his wife Jan. I am sure their involvement in the community will not cease just because Fred is no longer in the limelight. Fred carries a wealth of knowledge and experience that will be sorely missed in local government circles. Sitting suspended from 1.00 to 2.00 pm The SPEAKER: Members, before we start question time, I acknowledge the presence in the Speaker’s gallery of a member of the South Australian Parliament, Hon Robert Brokenshire. [Applause.] QUESTIONS WITHOUT NOTICE CANNABIS, DECRIMINALISATION 717. Mr C.J. BARNETT to the Premier: I refer the Premier to his Government’s Cannabis Control Bill 2003, under which the possession and cultivation of substantial amounts of cannabis will be decriminalised. (1) Is the Premier aware of comments made by Mr Joe Bullock, senior Labor Party member and General Secretary of the Shop, Distributive and Allied Employees Association of Western Australia, about the legislation? He is reported in the newspaper as saying that - “It is just a step in the wrong direction. “You can’t dress up something that is wrong as being right,” . . . “No matter how you dress it up, it is wrong.”

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7881

(2) Does the Premier agree with Mr Bullock, or does he intend to tell the parents of a suicidal 20-year-old, the parents of a 30-year-old schizophrenic and the parents of a 15-year-old mental patient - all of whom have expressed their concerns to me - that his decision to decriminalise and normalise cannabis use is the right thing to do? Will the Premier really say that to those parents? Dr G.I. GALLOP replied: (1)-(2) I can say one thing about the Leader of the Opposition: he can certainly draw a crowd. Mr C.J. Barnett: You insult those parents. They are parents of children suffering the effects of cannabis use, and you make a smart-alec comment. That is how good you are. They are parents of children suffering mental health problems. Mr J.N. Hyde interjected. The SPEAKER: I call to order the Leader of the Opposition and the member for Perth. Dr G.I. GALLOP: First of all, I once again indicate, through this Parliament, that the legislation that passed through the Legislative Assembly makes it absolutely clear that the possession of cannabis is still illegal, and associated with that are relevant penalties for that offence. I make that absolutely clear. The misinformation that is put out to the public by the Opposition does it no credit at all. I am aware of the comments of Mr Bullock, because I was at the state executive meeting when he made them. That is his view; it is not the view of the Government of Western Australia, the Commissioner of Police in Western Australia or the Australian Labor Party, and it was not the view of the Drug Summit. Mr R.F. Johnson: Is it your view, Premier? Dr G.I. GALLOP: My view is the view that was supported in this Parliament when the legislation was passed. Does the Leader of the Opposition know what I was elected to do? I was elected to legislate, not agitate. I believe the Leader of the Opposition would do well to read the latest biography of one of the great legislators in American history, Lyndon Baines Johnson. Johnson put a lot of reform legislation through the American Congress. He always stressed to his reform-based colleagues in the Democratic Party, and others whom he was trying to corral to bring in reforms, that they must remember that it was their job to legislate - not to give long speeches but to get legislation passed. I will answer the Leader of the Opposition’s question. Because of tragic circumstances, many people in our society are caught up in alcohol or drug abuse, and have serious problems related to the substances that they use. As a Government, it is our responsibility to work with those people and their families to bring about a solution to those problems. That is exactly what the Drug Summit said when it reported to the Government. The Government agrees with the principles laid down in the Drug Summit. We should work with parents and carers of people in our community who are suffering because they have abuse problems; we must work with those families. The Leader of the Opposition cannot understand that we must have a relevant legal framework for dealing with cannabis and a relevant framework for working with individuals and their families to solve this problem. Members on this side of the House will never spread misinformation; secondly, we will never use fear as a political tactic. The Opposition is doing that. The people of Western Australia know where the Government is coming from. They know that changes are needed. I remind the Leader of the Opposition that the tragic circumstances of those families about which he spoke arose under the legal framework that currently exists in this State.

ALBANY POLICE AND JUSTICE COMPLEX 718. Mr P.B. WATSON to the Minister for Police and Emergency Services: Given the State Government’s large-scale $130 million capital works program in the police and justice budget, can the minister update the House on the Government’s commitment to law and order in the great southern and on progress on the $20 million Albany police and courthouse complex? Mrs M.H. ROBERTS replied: I certainly thank the member for his question and for his ongoing commitment to this important project through his role as chair of the local community reference group. I am pleased to report to the House on the progress of the complex. As the member for Albany said, the new complex is a $20 million investment in law and order in the region. Such investments across the State are part of our Government’s commitment to equipping front-line officers with the resources and equipment to successfully do their job on behalf of the community. This week, the architectural drawings that I have in my hand, which I am happy to show the House, were presented to the council and met with approval. This is a sketch of the completed police and justice complex. It will be a two-storey building, as I know the member is aware. The area shaded yellow is the police section, and the area shaded pink is the justice section. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER: I call to order the member for Warren-Blackwood.

7882 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

Mrs M.H. ROBERTS: I am very pleased that we are progressing this, because, when in opposition, I raised the issue of the sad state of the Albany Police Station. This complex will include a DNA forensic facility, new video and public interview rooms and communication equipment, and will have accommodation for about 86 personnel. The proposed courts will provide faster carriage of justice, without the need for hearings to be delayed or transferred to other centres. There are also separate public waiting and interview areas. Through the hard work of the local member, the member for Albany, and the community reference group, the community has been kept very well informed of the developments with and the design of this important new complex, which incorporates important heritage aspects. Tomorrow, the member for Albany will release to the public the final design proposals. The Albany police and justice complex has been designed to meet the needs of modern policing. In addition, it will substantially improve justice facilities and community justice services. It is yet another example of the way in which our Government is delivering these services. CANNABIS, DECRIMINALISATION 719. Mr R.F. JOHNSON to the Minister for Community Development, Women’s Interests, Seniors and Youth: I refer the minister to the strong support she expressed in this House on 16 April for the Government’s decision to decriminalise the possession and cultivation of cannabis when she said - . . . we have the guts to take on these social issues and deliver a good social policy. Mr R.C. Kucera: What were you smoking outside a few minutes ago? Mr R.F. JOHNSON: It certainly was not cannabis. I have never touched it, but I bet some of the guys opposite have. Mr R.C. Kucera interjected. Mr R.F. JOHNSON: No, it does not; the minister should not be stupid. I will continue - (1) Is the minister aware that The British Journal of Psychiatry recently found that the progression from adolescent cannabis use to dependence in young adulthood is strong? (2) Is the minister further aware that Melbourne’s Centre for Adolescent Health, The British Journal of Psychiatry, the University of Maastricht, the World Health Organisation, the Australian Medical Association and the TVW Telethon Institute for Child Health Research have all found that cannabis use can trigger severe mental health illnesses, especially in young children? Ms S.M. McHALE replied: (1)-(2) I did say that this Government had the guts to introduce a good social policy, and it does have the guts to do so. I am aware of the research into cannabis and its potential to trigger mental illnesses; I think all policy makers are aware of that. The member would do well to look very carefully at the research and at whether the causal link has been established. Several members interjected. Ms S.M. McHALE: There is a whole complexity underneath that research about the link between cannabis smoking, mental illness and the progression to other drugs. Other indicators will lead to mental illness, and it is not a straightforward causal effect. As Minister for Youth and as a parent, I am aware of the issues surrounding cannabis. However, I am aware that thousands of young people in the community are currently smoking cannabis and have been for years. As a parent first and foremost, I am aware of the dangers. However, I am also aware that if we leave the legislation within a criminal context, the real difficulties for young people will become even more magnified. Let me make it clear again: cannabis smoking remains unlawful under the Government’s legislation. If opposition members refuse to accept that for political point-scoring purposes, that is their problem, not ours. Cannabis smoking remains unlawful, but our legislation introduces other penalties and programs that will strengthen the protective measures around cannabis. The Opposition does not like that. It is a worry for parents that their children will smoke. However, that worry, plus the knowledge that it may ruin their future careers for a long time, is much worse. This is a Government that is about making good social policy. That does not necessarily come easy, but we are clear that this is good policy. CANNABIS, DECRIMINALISATION 720. Mr R.F. JOHNSON to the Minister for Community Development, Women’s Interests, Seniors and Youth: As a supplementary question, does the minister intend to tell the parents of teenage suicide victims, paranoid schizophrenics, cannabis addicts, depression sufferers and mental patients that her Government’s decision to normalise cannabis use among young people is good social policy?

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7883

Ms S.M. McHALE replied: It is a tragedy that some young people in our community have schizophrenia and mental illnesses. The reality is that those people are present in our community regardless of this legislation. That is the reality with which members opposite cannot grapple. This is a long-term problem. The research does not make a causal link. That question is still under active consideration. I say to parents that we are keeping the framework that cannabis is unlawful, but that within that environment there is a greater focus on education and being able to explain to young people - Mr C.J. Barnett interjected. The SPEAKER: I call the Leader of the Opposition to order for the second time. Ms S.M. McHALE: It is very clear that the Leader of the Opposition does not want to engage in a discussion. We say to those parents that education about the potential harm of cannabis is the real focus, because kids are doing it anyway.

SOUTHERN RAIL LINK, CITY SECTION 721. Mr J.N. HYDE to the Minister for Planning and Infrastructure: Can the minister advise what has been the response from industry to the expressions of interest for the city section of the Government’s fast, direct and visionary railway from Perth to Mandurah? Ms A.J. MacTIERNAN replied: I thank the member - Several members interjected. The SPEAKER: Members! Ms A.J. MacTIERNAN: It gets them excited. I like to see the Opposition and the National Party get excited about rail. They want deviating rail, but it is good to see that they can still get excited about rail. We have very good news about this project. We have attracted five consortia to tender for the work from the Narrows to Northbridge. Several members interjected. Ms A.J. MacTIERNAN: This is interesting, because the Opposition has told us in the past that the laws of physics and engineering change when we cross the Nullarbor and that Perth cannot have tunnels and rail cannot be put in tunnels. However, it can be done. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER: Order, members! Ms A.J. MacTIERNAN: Five companies have tendered for the work, all of which have had extensive rail and bore tunnelling experience. The project covers 600 metres of cut and cover and 700 metres of twin bore tunnel structures. It also includes the fantastic underground stations at The Esplanade and William Street, pedestrian and cycle links, rail tracks, overheads, landscaping and the associated urban improvement works. The value of this work is over $200 million. It certainly is a most significant package. The first consortium, CityConnect, comprises Clough Ltd, McConnell Dowell Constructors (Aust) Pty Ltd and Obayashi JV; the second comprises Bilfinger Berger and Baulderstone Hornibrook Pty Ltd; the third comprises Leighton Contractors Pty Ltd and Kumagai Gumi Co Ltd; the fourth comprises Multiplex Constructions Pty Ltd, John Holland Pty Ltd and Tyco; and the fifth comprises Henry Walker Eltin Contracting Pty Ltd and Bouygues JV. Those five consortia are preparing for this work. We expect to shortlist the proponents by June 2003 and award the contract by December 2003. I also add for the benefit of members that today we handed out the extensive documentation to the five tenderers. Several members interjected. The SPEAKER: Members! Ms A.J. MacTIERNAN: This project is absolutely on target and on time. Several members interjected. Ms A.J. MacTIERNAN: I thought members opposite would be interested to know that today we also issued the tender documents for package A, which is for the work from the Narrows to Mandurah. Two local companies were prominent in those four consortia - Multiplex and BGC.

WATER TAX ON FARM DAMS AND MINING BORES 722. Mr P.D. OMODEI to the Premier: I refer the Premier to his failure yesterday to rule out a water tax on farm dams.

7884 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

(1) Is the Premier aware of the article in today’s edition of The West Australian regarding a similar new tax to be levied on mining bores? (2) Can the Premier confirm that the Government intends to instigate a user-pays system for farmers and miners, despite the fact that they have already paid the capital cost of the water? (3) Does the Premier concede that in the light of these revelations, his so-called consultation process on this matter is nothing but a sham and the outcome is already predetermined? (4) Does the Premier intend to place a similar tax on backyard bores, or does he simply intend to levy the agricultural and mining industries, the backbone of our economy? Dr G.I. GALLOP replied: Unless I am mistaken, I received the same question yesterday, and my answer today is exactly the same. Mr P.D. Omodei: It is not the same question. The SPEAKER: Member! Dr G.I. GALLOP: There will not be any tax on backyard bores; in fact we are trying to encourage people in Western Australia to use bores to help us with the water problems we have in this State, and we are doing that through an incentive. Mr P.D. Omodei interjected. The SPEAKER: Order, member! Dr G.I. GALLOP: The discussions that are continuing between the department and the community following the recommendations of the water summit will continue. A report will be presented to the Government on the implications of those proposals, and we can then make a considered decision. It is not true to say that the Government has made a preconceived decision on this matter. We are waiting to get all of the information so that we can make a decision based on real information.

AMMONIA PLANT, BURRUP INDUSTRIAL ESTATE 723. Mr N.R. MARLBOROUGH to the Minister for State Development: I refer the minister to an article on page 26 of The West Australian of Monday, 12 May 2003 which reported that work had begun on the world’s biggest ammonia plant, marking the first development on the ground in the multi-billion dollar Burrup industrial estate. (1) Is the minister aware of this article? (2) Can the minister advise the Parliament on the significance of this project to other projects proposed for the Burrup? Mr C.M. BROWN replied: (1)-(2) I thank the member for Peel for that very important question. As members know, a number of projects have commenced on the Burrup Peninsula. The Burrup fertiliser project, worth $630 million, is now under way, and I am sure more projects will follow. I know that you, Mr Speaker, have been a strong supporter of industrial development in your electorate and of all of the jobs it provides in your electorate and in the Pilbara generally, as well as in Perth and the south west. This is an important project and it will provide highly skilled jobs. The Government is optimistic that a number of other projects will commence on the Burrup Peninsula. We have advised in various media releases that we are looking at developing other projects on the Burrup and we are at various stages of examining them. Those projects involve Dampier Nitrogen Pty Ltd, LiquiGaz, Japan DME Ltd, DME International and others. This is a very important area of the State. It is good that we are working positively with Minister McFarlane at a national level trying to get a number of these projects up and running. Both the State and federal Governments are strongly committed to seeing the Burrup fully developed. Not everybody has a perfect idea about all the projects that will occur on the Burrup; there are always some doubting Thomases, and one of those is the Leader of the Opposition. He made this comment - When I was Minister for Resources Development, we were hopeful that a number of projects would proceed. The most advanced project at that stage was the Syntroleum Sweetwater Operations gas-to- liquids project. The next most advanced was the Plenty River Corporation Ltd project. We allocated land on Hearson Cove for two projects, and also for a third project that I think is far less probable. That project was Burrup Fertilisers Pty Ltd. Every time the Leader of the Opposition gets up and professes to predict the future on these matters, he is pretty wrong. I am pleased that this project is getting up; we are working actively on a number of other projects, including that of Methanex Corporation. Methanex will be a difficult project, and, unlike some members of the Opposition who were quite gleeful when it looked as though

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7885

we had lost that project, we continue to work with that company to secure that investment for Western Australia. You will remember, Mr Speaker, that prior to your time as Speaker and when Labor was in opposition, you made a very good speech about the Leader of the Opposition, the then Minister for Resources Development, being the leader of press releases, because when a project was going to start there was press release after press release, and the only consistent thing about those projects was that none of them ever did start. NATIONAL ACTION PLAN ON SALINITY AND WATER QUALITY, NO BUDGET ALLOCATION 724. Mr B.J. GRYLLS to the Minister for the Environment and Heritage: I refer to comments made by the Minister for Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries in the other place on 9 May 2003 that there is no funding allocation for the National Action Plan on Salinity and Water Quality in the state budget. (1) Does the minister agree with the Minister for Agriculture that if she had reached agreement with the Commonwealth prior to May, an allocation would have been made in the budget? (2) If the minister does agree, why do the budget papers not contain an allocation of $18.6 million for 2003-04, reflecting the federal Government’s budget released this week allocating that funding to Western Australia? Dr J.M. EDWARDS replied: (1)-(2) I have not seen the comments referred to by the member, but what he has just said is not true. My own budgets contain moneys waiting to be matched under the bilateral agreement that was signed with the Commonwealth last November. I have money in the Department of Conservation and Land Management budget from the AlintaGas sale, which commenced during the time of the previous Government; it has sat there and sat there, and it is waiting to be matched. Unfortunately, the letter that has come through from the Prime Minister indicates that it will be matched and it will go out. In addition, this Government has put money on the table for the engineering evaluation initiative, and it is good news that that is being matched. Work has already started on that initiative, and the work will proceed much more rapidly. In addition, money is set aside for the demonstration catchment initiatives. This is all new money that will be spent in these areas. The real story about the federal budget is what has been done with the national action plan money. I encourage the member to look at those fantastic graphs. They show some great bars on a chart for the promises of two years ago; then they show what was spent last financial year, and we see drops and gaps; they then show what will be spent this financial year, and there are even more gaps. I am bemused - except that this issue is so serious that one should not be bemused. After three months the Prime Minister has written to the Premier saying that he agrees to match $31.5 million. How much is in the budget? An amount of $18 million. The federal Government cannot even keep its word. FUELWATCH, FINANCIAL BENEFITS 725. Mr M.P. MURRAY to the Minister for Consumer and Employment Protection: Does the minister have any evidence of the financial benefit for Western Australian motorists from using the FuelWatch system? Mr J.C. KOBELKE replied: I thank the member for some notice of this question. I know the member has made representations on behalf of his constituents who have noticed that when they compare the price they pay for petrol with what is being paid in metropolitan Perth, they see a big discrepancy. We have extended FuelWatch to a range of other regional centres where it is proving to be incredibly popular with motorists because it is delivering petrol at a much lower price. A comparison of prices in Perth, Sydney and Melbourne, particularly the lowest one hundred, and a check of how people can benefit from buying in the price cycle in Western Australia, show that motorists in Western Australia are winners if they use FuelWatch. I will provide a couple of simple examples. Using FuelWatch and looking at the price of fuel in the northern suburbs, a person who drives a six-cylinder car and travels 400 kilometres a week would save $200 a year, which equates to five weeks of free fuel. Another example involved a case study of a one-tonne ute that travelled 1 500 kilometres a week; the driver would save more than $700 a year by using FuelWatch. When motorists were given prior warning that fuel prices were going to rise - looking at the prices on nine price alerts - and they bought at the lower price before the cycle started up again, they would save $97 on their fuel bill for the year. There are plenty of positive examples of the benefits motorists receive from FuelWatch. They receive a much better deal when they buy fuel due to the action of the Gallop Government. MR JEFF ENOCH 726. Ms S.E. WALKER to the Minister for Justice: I refer to the report in today’s The West Australian about prison executive Jeff Enoch, who was sent by the minister’s department to Hakea Prison to act in the critical position of troubleshooter in response to the report of the Inspector of Custodial Services that this maximum security prison was in danger of failure and ask -

7886 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

(1) Was Mr Enoch the subject of investigation for corruption prior to being sent to Hakea Prison? (2) Given that the credit card on which he purchased sex romps with prostitutes and strippers and alcohol at taxpayers’ expense had been withdrawn on 19 March, two months ago, why did he resign only yesterday after journalists had leaked this information? (3) Why was Mr Enoch not suspended while the investigation was under way? Mr J.A. McGINTY replied: I thank the member for some notice of this question. (1) Not to the best of my knowledge. Ms S.E. Walker: Didn’t you make inquiries? Mr J.A. McGINTY: The member for Nedlands asked me whether something had occurred. I said that to the best of my knowledge it had not occurred. I cannot give a more direct answer than that, I am sorry. (2)-(3) These issues relate to problems with which I am sure members opposite are familiar; namely, the unduly complicated and burdensome discipline provisions of the Public Sector Management Act. Members will be aware that the procedures laid down in the Act - Ms S.E. Walker interjected. Mr J.A. McGINTY: Excuse me. The procedures in the Act for disciplining people are very time consuming and cumbersome, which often defeats justice and defies commonsense. The procedures in that Act were implemented at a very early stage of the issue, some months ago. Prior to the issue being publicised in the newspaper, the Director General of the Department of Justice had - Ms S.E. Walker interjected. The SPEAKER: Member! Mr J.A. McGINTY: I will go back to the start. The disciplinary provisions in the Act were invoked a month and a half to two months ago. Mr Enoch was written to and, in accordance with the Act, asked to give reasons why he should not be suspended without pay and was given either five or seven days to respond. Preceding that, an investigator had been appointed in accordance - Ms S.E. Walker interjected. The SPEAKER: The minister should answer the question. Mr J.A. McGINTY: Thank you, Mr Speaker. An investigator had been appointed, pursuant to the provisions of the Public Sector Management Act, to inquire into 21 specific allegations of misuse of credit cards by Mr Enoch. That person was provided with details of the complaint and was asked to provide a report. This issue has highlighted the need to overhaul the relevant provisions of the Act. As soon as sufficient evidence was obtained, and natural justice accorded to Mr Enoch, he should have been sacked. The provisions in the Act simply do not allow that to occur. As expressed in this morning’s newspaper, it is my view that changes to the Act are highly desirable to enable these problems to be efficiently dealt with. Mr Enoch’s behaviour was unconscionable and corrupt. He has submitted his resignation from the department. The police are continuing to investigate the matter to see whether criminal charges of either theft or fraud are appropriate in the circumstances. For people who are not familiar with this matter, when it was first drawn to my attention in February this year, it was obvious that the Department of Justice was either unable or failed to properly identify this issue as an abuse of the system. A full audit has been established and changes have been implemented to deal with this matter appropriately. MR JEFF ENOCH 727. Ms S.E. WALKER to the Minister for Justice: I have a supplementary question. Why did it take the leaking of this issue by journalists to get the minister to announce that new systems would be implemented to prevent any further abuses of alcohol, sex romps and mates’ bucks parties? Mr J.A. McGINTY replied: It did not. SMOKE-FREE ENCLOSED PUBLIC PLACES, REVIEW 728. Dr J.M. WOOLLARD to the Premier: I refer to the Minister for Health’s strong stand against smoking and passive smoking when he was Chairman of the Western Australian Heart Foundation and ask -

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7887

(1) Will the Government support the Minister for Health and take measures to stop smoking in all enclosed public places or will the Government put the interests of the community behind the interests of the Australian Hotels Association? (2) When will the Government allow the Minister for Health to table the review undertaken and completed last year to achieve smoke-free enclosed public places? Dr G.I. GALLOP replied: (1)-(2) The Government will look very carefully at the recommendations in that review so that when it is tabled, a government response will be provided with it. The issues surrounding this matter are complex. The Government will work through them properly as it does on all issues referred to it and reach a conclusion that is in the interests of the people of Western Australia. When it does that, this Parliament will be the first to know about it. SMOKE-FREE ENCLOSED PUBLIC PLACES, REVIEW 729. Dr J.M. WOOLLARD to the Premier: I have a supplementary question. By law, the review should have been tabled on 12 January. What excuse does the Premier have for not tabling this review? Dr G.I. GALLOP replied: It is not a matter of the Government making excuses; it is a matter of it working on its response to the recommendations in the review so that it can give a proper account to the Parliament when the review is tabled. CONSTRUCTION SKILLS TRAINING CENTRE, FUNDING 730. Mrs C.L. EDWARDES to the Minister for Education and Training: I refer the minister to the Cole royal commission report, which raised concerns about funding the Construction Skills Training Centre and ask - As the custodian of departmental funds, will the minister instigate an investigation into the CSTC concerning the Australian National Training Authority capital grant of $1 million made in 1998 through his department on the basis of what is now known as wrong information about the revenues that the CSTC was to receive through the training levy and that it was, and I quote - a deliberate course of conduct designed to protect the union’s interest (i.e. the CFMEU) and ensure that if the CSTC was not viable the grant made by ANTA would not have to be repaid for the benefit of any other training organisation. Although the investigation might have been done in 1998, this is new information. Mr A.J. Carpenter: Was the member for Kingsley the minister? Mrs EDWARDES: Yes, I was and this minister should investigate it. Mr A.J. CARPENTER replied: No. The member for Kingsley was the minister at the time. I am confident that the matters have since been rectified.

CONSTRUCTION SKILLS TRAINING CENTRE, FUNDING 731. Mrs C.L. EDWARDES to the Minister for Employment and Training: This is new information, which has been reported in the Cole royal commission. In the light of the Cole royal commission revelation, will the minister now instigate an investigation of this serious matter concerning an ANTA grant of $1 million and the deliberate attempt to protect the union’s interests rather than public funds that should be used for training? Mr A.J. CARPENTER replied: It happened under the minister’s tutelage as minister. She should have known about it; she was negligent, and, quite rightly, she is now on the opposition benches. LAW AND ORDER Matter of Public Interest THE SPEAKER (Mr F. Riebeling): I received within the prescribed time today a letter from the Leader of the Opposition seeking to debate as a matter of public interest the following motion - That this House condemns the Gallop Government’s failure to honour its pre-election commitment to ensure the safety of the Western Australian community by increasing the number of police officers on our streets.

7888 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

The matter appears to be in order, and if at least five members rise in support of the matter, it can be discussed. [At least five members rose in their places.] MR C.J. BARNETT (Cottesloe - Leader of the Opposition) [2.41 pm]: I move the motion. I note that the Premier walks out of the Chamber again. Every time we debate an issue like cannabis, child safety, public interest, and law and order, the Premier scampers out of the Chamber like a rabbit in the spotlight. I will speak briefly in this debate and make a couple of observations. Why is there a law and order issue mounting in this State? A prime reason is that we have a Minister for Health hell-bent on decriminalising cannabis; that is his first priority. We also have a Minister for Police hell-bent on legalising brothels; that is her first priority. Little wonder we have problems in our community. No wonder people do not feel safe and there is a rising tide of crime in our community. I refer to what the Labor Party promised people in this State prior to the last state election. I refer to the ALP election policy titled “More Police, Better Policing”. What a joke that is! It states - Making Western Australians safe and secure in their homes and in their community is a key priority for a Gallop Labor Government. Do people feel safer in their homes under Labor? No. Let us look at the evidence. In the last year of the coalition Government, 2000-01, 93 per cent of people surveyed indicated they felt safe at home during the day. The same survey question today for 2002-03 showed that the figure of personal safety at home had fallen from 93 per cent to 88 per cent. That was a five percentage point fall in one year under Labor. People felt less safe in the their homes after one year of a Labor Government. Similarly, people were asked in the survey whether they felt safe at home at night. Under the coalition, 79 per cent of people felt safe; today, only 73 per cent. From where do the figures come? They are from the Labor Party’s own budget documents. The Government’s survey information shows that people feel less safe at home during the day and at night under this Administration. I notice that the police minister is not paying attention. The SPEAKER: Order! I can hear about six conversations around the Chamber. Members should either listen to the debate or leave the House. Mr C.J. BARNETT: I direct my comments to the Minister for Police: concentrate less on legalising brothels, and concentrate on the job as police minister, whose prime responsibility is for law and order. The minister is not interested, but the people of this State and I are interested. On 6 April, a man threw a boulder at a moving car, causing grievous bodily harm to the driver. On 8 April, another man allegedly stabbed a 15-year-old in Nollamara. On 28 April, a man was stabbed in broad daylight in Northbridge in a gang-related incident. On 3 May, a violent clash took place in Subiaco between an associate of John Kizon and a member of the Coffin Cheaters. On 10 May, a firebombing in Alexander Heights took place in a gang-related incident. Seven murders took place in this State in March alone. No wonder people feel less safe in their homes and on the streets in Western Australia under a Labor Government. Mr R.F. Johnson: One murder was of a young woman police officer. Mr C.J. BARNETT: That is correct. In March 2003, the most recent month for which information is available, there were 695 more offences committed in this State than occurred in the corresponding month a year earlier. We have an accelerating rate of offences, including violent offences, in this State. However, the minister’s priority is to legalise brothels. The minister should get her act together and do the job she is paid for and address law and order issues in this city and State. Labor said it would be tough on crime. The policy states - Labor will be tough on crime, and tough on the causes of crime. The Government’s only action has been to get rid of sentences of less than six months. As the shadow Minister for Police has pointed out on several occasions, people convicted of sexual assault, physical assault, car theft, home invasion and other offences of that nature now no longer face the threat of a jail sentence. That is the reality of the so- called tough on crime policy. What about the whopper of all whoppers? The ALP election policy titled “More Police, Better Policing” states that Labor will “boost police numbers by 250 over four years”. I cannot see those officers on the streets. Business people and citizens in the community are calling my office and writing to me indicating that they cannot see these police numbers. The minister is not doing her job. She should forget about legalising brothels and do the job the people of the State want done. They want to be safe in their homes and neighbourhoods. Elderly parents and teenage children should feel safe on the streets of Perth and regional centres around the State. Forget about the brothels for a while, minister. These reforms may be trendy Labor Party policy, but the minister should do the job as required and live up to the policy commitment. So far, the minister has been a spectacular failure on every aspect of policing policy. MR M.J. BIRNEY (Kalgoorlie) [2.46 pm]: I will add to the matter of public interest. I will expose the Labor Party’s pre-election policy of an increase of some 250 police officers above the attrition rate to be nothing more than a cruel hoax and to be completely unachievable at this stage of the electoral cycle. As the Leader of the Opposition said, the Labor Party’s “More Police, Better Policing” policy had a subheading “250 more police on the beat”; it reads -

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7889

A Gallop Labor Party will: • boost police numbers by 250 over four years. That was a well-publicised policy that had some degree of public support. I suggest that probably it was the policy that the Labor Party took to the election that had the most public support. I cannot think of many others that had any public support. In fact, that policy may have influenced the votes of many Western Australians who were concerned about law and order. Some two years on, one might expect that at least half of the 250 police might have been delivered to the people of Western Australia. Sadly, that is not the case. I will spell out the situation for members present, and particularly the Minister for Police, who seems intent on propagating misinformation on the matter. I see the Minister for Police chuckling away to herself. I invite the minister to listen carefully to what I say. She has been either deliberately lying, has no idea what is happening in the Police Service or has been given wrong information. I outline the correct information. On 30 June 2001, at the start of the Labor Party’s first full financial year in power, the first opportunity the Labor Party had to influence public policy in this State, there were 4 993 police officers in Western Australia. That information can be gained from the Western Australia Police Service annual report. I table a page from the report for the information of members. [The paper was tabled for the information of members.] Mr M.J. BIRNEY: At the end of last month, there were 5 025 police officers in Western Australia - that is, 32 police officers more than at the start of Labor’s first full financial year. Given that members opposite had promised 250 extra police officers, one would expect in the order of 125 new police officers to have been appointed by that stage of the electoral cycle. It has increased the number of police officers by 32. Members should not simply take my word for it. On Tuesday, 6 May 2003, Hon Derrick Tomlinson asked the Minister for Racing and Gaming representing the Minister for Police and Emergency Services this question without notice - (1) How many sworn police officers were members of the Western Australia Police Service as at 30 April 2003? In other words, how many coppers did we have in Western Australia at the end of last month? The minister’s answer was 5 025. I table that question for members to look at. [The paper was tabled for the information of members.] Mr M.J. BIRNEY: The Labor Party has increased police numbers by 32 since the start of its first full financial year in government. That is despite a promise that it would increase police numbers in Western Australia by 250. That promise undoubtedly convinced some swinging voters to vote for the Labor Party at the last election, and has now been exposed as a hoax. In fact, at this stage of its term of government, the Labor Party is 93 police officers short of fulfilling its commitment. It faces the problem of making up those numbers over the next two years. How will it ensure that its promise of an extra 250 police officers will be kept in the next two years? I put to members present that the Labor Government cannot keep that promise. Based on history, it is almost a physical impossibility. The attrition rate of the Western Australia Police Service is 194 police officers a year. In other words, every year 194 police officers leave the employ of the Western Australia Police Service, either voluntary or at the direction of the Commissioner of Police. Once again, I back up that claim by reading to members a parliamentary question. On 25 February 2003, the Minister for Police and Emergency Services answered question on notice 404, which asked in part - Will the Minister advise the number of sworn Police Officers that left the employ of the W.A. Police Service during the financial years ending - (a) 1999; (b) 2000; (c) 2001; and (d) 2002? The answer is - (a) 1999 198 (b) 2000 217 (c) 2001 180 (d) 2002 181 I put that question on the Table for the information of members. [The paper was tabled for the information of members.]

7890 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

Mr M.J. BIRNEY: An average of 194 officers left the employ of the Western Australia Police Service each year over the past four years. We lose 194 officers each year. For the Labor Party to keep its pre-election promise to increase police numbers by 250, it will need to recruit above and beyond the average attrition rate of 194 officers a year. Let us do the maths. I know some members on the other side of the House might have difficulty following the maths, but I will try to keep it as simple as I can. Mr P.B. Watson interjected. Mr M.J. BIRNEY: That is particularly important for the member for Albany. He has a lot of difficulty with many things, not the least of which is maths. The Labor Party has two years left of its term of government. It has so far increased police numbers by 32, which means it must make up another 218. The Police Service will lose 194 officers next year and 194 the year after that. The Labor Party will need to recruit 109 police officers in each of the next two years. When that figure is added to that of the 194 officers who leave each year, we find that the Labor Party must recruit a massive 606 police officers over the next two years to keep its tatty pre-election promise to employ 250 extra coppers in Western Australia. The Labor Party recruited 120 police officers last year. It needs to recruit an extra 606 in two years, or 303 a year. I put to the House that that is a physical impossibility. This Minister for Police and Emergency Services and this Government are totally incompetent. They propagated a hoax at the last election when they promised an extra 250 police officers. Once again, I will provide some supporting evidence for my claim that the Labor Party has failed to recruit the required number of police officers to meet its pre-election promise. I do not want members to simply take my word for it. I know members on this side of the House might be that way inclined, but I am sure members on the other side might be somewhat sceptical. I point them to the Labor Party’s latest budget document. The Police Service has five basic outputs: community support, crime prevention and public order; emergency management and coordination; traffic management and road safety; response to and investigation of offences; and services to judicial processes. In every one of those outputs, the Police Service failed to achieve the required number of full-time employees budgeted for by the Labor Party in its last budget. Every one fell short of the mark. If the figures for all the outputs are compiled, we see that the Labor Government was 109 police officers short of the mark. That magical figure of 109 is the number of police officers required to be recruited each year for the next two years to meet Labor’s pre-election promise. I refer to the outputs. Page 687 of the latest budget paper tells us that the Labor Party budgeted for 2 274 full-time employees to undertake the job of community support, crime prevention and public order. The actual number who took part in that output last year was 2 234, about 40 fewer than was budgeted for. Page 689 of the latest budget paper deals with the emergency management and coordination output. It is a very important output in the light of recent world events such as September 11 and more importantly the bombing in Bali, which is a lot closer to home. The Labor Party budgeted for 84 full-time employees to work towards that particular output. It achieved 82, two fewer. Page 691 of the latest budget paper refers to the traffic management and road safety output, an output very dear to the heart of my friend from Carine. The budgeted number of full-time employees for that output was 1 032. The number that was achieved is 1 013, considerably fewer than was budgeted for. Page 694 deals with the response to and investigation of offences. That is another very important output. The Labor Party budgeted for 2 102 full-time employees and achieved just 2 064, which was down from 2 083 in the 2001-02 budget. Page 696 of the latest budget deals with services to the judicial process. Last year the Labor Party budgeted for 576 full-time employees to work towards that output. It achieved only 566 full-time employees. It is not as though the police budget contains 25 outputs; it has only five. In each of those five outputs the Government has fallen short of the mark in providing the budgeted number of full-time police employees. In fact, it was short by 109 officers. I do not know if the Minister for Police and Emergency Services has read the budget papers. If she has not, I am sure she will avail herself of them in the very near future. When we put these things to the Minister for Police and Emergency Services she sends out a mixed message. On the one hand she says, “It is all happening. We are under way and we will achieve that promise when the time comes.” However, on the other hand, she says, “I gave the police department the money, and it is its fault that it has not done it.” Can we imagine the Minister for Planning and Infrastructure saying, “It is not my fault. I gave the Department of Transport money for a new road but it did not build it”? The Minister for Police wants to bunker down in her St Georges Terrace office, or wherever it is, and play no part in the police department. She does not follow through with her promises. She is not interested in the running of the police department. She says, “I gave it the money, but it did not do anything with it.” What an absolute joke! What an indictment of the Minister for Police! We would think she would have followed it through. We would think she would have gone there every month, or even every two months, and said, “Where are all these extra coppers that I gave you the money for?”, just as the Minister for Planning and Infrastructure would do if she had given the Department of Transport some money to build a road. We would not find that minister saying she gave it the money but it did not build the road. There would be an absolute uproar if she said that. Why there is not an absolute uproar with regard to the comments of the Minister for Police I am not sure. Mrs M.H. Roberts: Because you are telling fibs. That is why. Mr M.J. BIRNEY: The minister is certainly running her department by remote control. However, even when she says she gave it the money but it did not provide the extra coppers she is still not being completely honest, unfortunately.

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7891

What the minister has done in this year’s budget can be found in the Premier’s recent press release, which states that the budget will provide funding for an additional 60 police officers. I have just made the case that we need 109 police officers in the forthcoming budget and we need a further 109 police officers in the budget following that in order for Labor to meet the attrition rate of 194 officers a year and to meet its pre-election commitment of an extra 250 police officers. On the one hand the minister has not been providing those extra police officers, and on the other hand she has not been providing the police department with enough money to do the job. It is as simple as that. People are sick and tired of hearing political parties front up to an election campaign and make extravagant promises in the hope that they can solicit the odd vote or two and then not follow through. Law and order is a very important issue, particularly at election time. It is an issue that is very dear to people’s hearts. It is certainly an issue that is dear to my heart in the electorate of Kalgoorlie. In Kalgoorlie, in my view and in the view of many community leaders, we are some 10 to 12 police officers behind the eight ball. My friend the member for Ningaloo tells me he has a significant crime problem in his electorate. My friend the member for Greenough, another very good local member, tells me that he also has a significant problem in his electorate with crime, particularly juvenile crime. Rome is burning, and all this mob opposite can do is legalise prostitution! Mr N.R. Marlborough interjected. Mr M.J. BIRNEY: The member for Peel does not have a clue what he is talking about. You clown! Mr N.R. Marlborough: You have been out there with your white shoe brigade, collecting money in Darwin. The SPEAKER: Order! I call the member for Peel to order for the first time. Mr M.J. BIRNEY: Mr Speaker - Mr N.R. Marlborough: Do not give us your sanctimonious position when you have been acting like a pretend millionaire in Darwin! Mr M.J. BIRNEY: I learnt many years ago never to argue with idiots, because they will drag us down to their level and beat us on experience every time. That is why I shall not engage in an argument with the member for Peel. Mr N.R. Marlborough: Have you been to Darwin to go sailing? Mr M.J. BIRNEY: No, you clown! Mr N.R. Marlborough: Have you been to Darwin as a commodore for four days? The SPEAKER: Order! The member for Peel can have his chance to contribute to the debate once he stands on his feet. I call the member for Peel to order for the second time. Mr M.J. BIRNEY: Thank you for your protection, Mr Speaker, from that tirade. A number of other issues need to be considered in the context of this debate. Mr R.C. Kucera: You are very good at using sailing clubs for your own purposes. Mr M.J. BIRNEY: What is wrong with members opposite? I do not belong to any sailing club, you clown! The minister is the one who belongs to a sailing club. Does the minister want me to talk about that? Does the minister want me to talk about his sailing club and the allegations that have been made against him at his sailing club? Does he want me to put that on the public record here and now? Several members interjected. Mr M.J. BIRNEY: The minister would not like me to do that, would he? Mr R.C. Kucera: We will wait until the ACC talks to you about it. The SPEAKER: Order! Have members all finished? I am sure the member for Kalgoorlie wishes to continue his remarks on the motion. Mr M.J. BIRNEY: I have pretty much finished my remarks. I simply wanted to make the point that Rome is burning, crime is out of control in this State, particularly juvenile crime, and all the Labor Party can do is introduce legislation to support druggies, union thugs, prostitutes, radical greenies and all of the other minority groups who have the ear of the Labor Party. This is the modern day Labor Party - new Labor. That is what this is all about. The Labor Party does not give a stuff about the number one priority in the community - law and order. Let me reiterate. The Government has increased police numbers by 32 since it came into office, despite its promise to increase them by 250. It is an indictment of the Minister for Police that she does not give a stuff about her department. She simply wants to drive around in her ministerial car and enjoy the trappings of office and hope the police get it right. Mr P.B. Watson interjected. The SPEAKER: Order! I call the member for Albany to order for the first time. MR R.A. AINSWORTH (Roe) [3.09 pm]: I wish to indicate the National Party’s support for the motion. We know the effect of the Government’s lack of success in honouring its pledge to put on additional police officers. The Labor

7892 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

Party’s pre-election commitment was to boost police numbers by 250 officers over four years. My understanding of boosting police numbers is not to put on 250 new police officers but to put on 250 officers over and above the number that it started from. That means that the Police Service may have to recruit 400 or 500 police officers, or even more, to take account of the attrition rate. That has not been happening. If we take the Police Service generally, not only the police officers but also the backup staff and other people who are necessary to make the system work, according to the Budget Statements the total number of full-time equivalents employed in the Police Service increased by 18 in 2002-03 and is estimated to increase by 97 in 2003-04. Even if those FTEs were all police officers, it would still be a long way short of the boost of 250 additional officers required to meet the commitment that the Labor Party made when it came into office. The Labor Party said before the election that having more police on the beat and better policing strategies is a vital element in the fight against the State’s crime problems; the police are the front line when it comes to dealing with criminal and antisocial behaviour and must be properly resourced to do their job properly. I do not think there is one person in this House who would disagree with that statement. What we are complaining about is the fact that that statement of intent by the Labor Party and this minister has not been and will not be met, because the Government cannot possibly do that during its current term in office. I disagree with the member for Kalgoorlie. I do not think the Government has two years left in office. It has a bit less than that. The Government will not be able to produce sufficient new police recruits and have them trained and on the beat in order to have a genuine increase of total police numbers of 250 in a four-year period. It just is not possible. It is not just the opposition parties who are making that claim. The Western Australian Police Union, whose heart and soul is right in the middle of this, because it is its responsibility to represent the needs and aspirations of its police members, is saying precisely the same thing. It is saying that the Government has not made adequate provision to comply with the new enterprise bargaining agreement. It has also not made adequate provision to comply with the requirements of the Occupational Safety and Health Act or to fully replace all police pistols, and it is not meeting its commitments on extra police. What commitments has the Government met? If the Western Australian Police Union, which one would expect would normally be more on side with the Labor Government than our side of the House, is making these claims and statements, it is either telling untruths or exposing what the Government is not doing. I suspect the latter is the case; in fact, I know it is. I also have some other concerns about resourcing the Police Service generally, particularly in regional areas. On page 67 of budget paper No 3, savings of $6.7 million per annum are expected by 2005-06 as a result of the refinement of administrative processes and functions and the delivery of new technology. I argue that the police need that new technology. They were lagging behind in the technology they had, but there have been progressive improvements since steps were initiated by the previous Government, and have been carried on by this Government, to better resource the police with equipment. However, to suggest that there will be a saving of $6.7 million by that time suggests also that savings may result from the removal of services from some areas. The most likely target would be some smaller regional centres. The regions are very nervous about an attempt to take away their police services. There has been a move towards the closure or downgrading of some smaller stations. We believe that step will lead to a further loss of police staff and resources in the regions where they are so desperately needed. Some of the other measures that the police minister has been part of, such as the introduction of legislation that is soft on drugs and the aims to push criminal elements of the prostitution industry underground, will require more, rather than fewer, police resources. The situation is quite clear. The Government’s own statistics, not just the figures that opposition members and I have put before this House, show that the Government has abysmally failed in its job. MRS M.H. ROBERTS (Midland - Minister for Police and Emergency Services) [3.12 pm]: It was a wise person who once said that things are not always as they seem. There is no better illustration of that than when the member for Kalgoorlie went to Melbourne in Melbourne Cup week last year. People in this House assumed that he had gone to see the Melbourne Cup. Of course, he came back and said no, that was not the case; although he may have been at the races, he did not watch the races. Maybe he was looking out for girls or maybe he was at the bar. I do not know what he was doing. However, one thing that he did say was that he was having a week’s holiday. It seems that this week, the budget debate week, he has had another week’s holiday. I was told that he went to Darwin fishing. I wanted to put that to him, but he scurried out of the Chamber. Maybe he was in Darwin fishing; maybe he was not. Maybe he was fishing when the hall of fame in Kalgoorlie was opened. I make that point because things are not as they seem with the member for Kalgoorlie. I give this warning to the Leader of the Opposition and other members opposite: do not trust him. They should not trust a single fact that he puts in front of them. Mr B.K. Masters interjected. Mrs M.H. ROBERTS: I have half an hour to make my case, and I am quite relaxed about using that time. Several members interjected. The ACTING SPEAKER (Mr A.J. Dean): Order, members! Mrs M.H. ROBERTS: We can see how sensitive members opposite are, because they are already beginning to sense that they have got it wrong. I began my address by saying that things are not always as they seem and that members opposite should not trust the member for Kalgoorlie. The arguments that have been put forward by the Opposition are without any foundation at all. They are absolutely fallacious. The Opposition stands condemned for launching such a deceitful campaign. Knowing that it has the facts wrong, it continues to propagate lies and deceit in the community.

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7893

I will explain the situation to the Opposition once again; and I have put it on the record previously. Mr J.H.D. Day interjected. Mrs M.H. ROBERTS: The member for Darling Range keeps interrupting. He is probably the most unsuccessful police minister in the history of this State. I have no desire to hear interjections from him. Several members interjected. Mrs M.H. ROBERTS: This is my time and I believe I have the call. The ACTING SPEAKER: I will call members to order if they persist with their interjections. The minister has indicated that she does not wish to take interjections. Mrs M.H. ROBERTS: I do not intend to be bullied by interjections. I will put the case on the record, as the Opposition requested. I will put all the facts about police numbers in this State on the record. I have no shortage of time. I will certainly put the facts on the record, because it is an excellent story and a situation of which the Government is proud. We must look back a little. In the lead-up to the move to the new academy in Joondalup, it was always known that there would be a hiatus or a gap in recruitment in the time between moving from the Maylands Police Academy to the Joondalup Police Academy. Mr R.F. Johnson: Why should there be? Mrs M.H. ROBERTS: Because that is how the member’s Government planned it. That was the plan approved by the previous Minister for Police, the previous member for Albany, who lost his seat at the last election. A complete gap in the recruitment of officers had been approved then. However, in my view, the previous Minister for Police does not stand condemned for that. I congratulate him on it, because he and the commissioner ensured that they over-recruited in the six months leading up to that hiatus. When we came to office, we found that because the Police Service takes account of the attrition rate, they recruited more than the number of full-time equivalents they were entitled to recruit according to the government and Treasury formula. To pluck a figure at a given moment in time and compare it with another figure is never a fair comparison. At some points in time - there was a particular case - more police must be recruited than at other times. Because groups go through the academy and graduate at certain times, the difference in the number of police officers on one day compared with the next day can be as many as 60 or 70. I believe a group of police officers will graduate from the academy on Friday. Mr M.J. Birney: Recruits are included in sworn officer numbers. Don’t you know that? Mrs M.H. ROBERTS: No, the member for Kalgoorlie does not have a clue. He should apologise and perhaps sit in his place and learn something. Mr M.J. Birney interjected. The ACTING SPEAKER: Member for Kalgoorlie - for the third time. Mrs M.H. ROBERTS: The Opposition continues to be inane and challenge the facts. If it does not want to hear the facts from me, it should not have put the motion forward. Since I have been on my feet, all members opposite have done is interject inanely, because they do not want the facts put on the record. After I have put them on the record, I will invite the Commissioner of Police to also put them on the record for the Opposition during the Estimates Committee hearings next week. Opposition members can accuse him of lying if they like, but from my point of view he tells the truth. I will put the facts on the record. The approved strength of the Police Service as at 1 March 2001 was 4 698 full-time equivalents, which is to be increased by 250 FTEs to 4 948 FTEs during the term of this Government. In the first two years of government, we have delivered an additional 115 police officers above the attrition rate. As at June 2003, 567 police will have been recruited, of whom 115 are part of the Government’s initiative for additional police. A further 135 police will be recruited during 2003-04 and 2004-05. On top of that, from 1 July 2003 to 1 March 2005, based upon current projections, the WA Police Service will need to recruit those 135 additional police plus 315 for attrition - a total of 450 police officers. The member for Roe stood in this Chamber and said that, to cover attrition and the promise it made, the Government might have to recruit 400 or 500 police officers in its term. He was so far wrong it is not funny. Guess how many police officers the Government is recruiting over four years? Over 1 000 police officers will be recruited through the academy. That is the real story. If members opposite ask the Commissioner of Police, the command team, the Treasurer or the Under Treasurer, they will find out how many recruits will be recruited through the academy. That is the fabulous story of the Gallop Government: 1 000 new police officers will be recruited through the academy during our term of government. That is the truth. The lies and the deceit come from members opposite. They should be damned for perpetuating such lies in the community and for undermining people’s confidence in the Police Service, so that it cannot get on with the job it is paid to do. That schedule is in place and we will be able to achieve those levels. Over 1 000 new police officers will be recruited in four years. Despite the fact that members opposite have run down our academy and its capacity to recruit, I am advised that our police academy is more than capable of dealing with that issue and is getting on with the job of recruiting those officers.

7894 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

Let us look at more of the deceit of members opposite. The member for Kalgoorlie selectively quoted from the answer to a question asked by Hon Derrick Tomlinson, which he had the audacity to table in this Chamber. One part of the question asked by Hon Derrick Tomlinson states - (3) How many sworn police officers left the Police Service between 31 January 2001 and 30 April 2003? The answer I gave was 377. Think about that: 377 police officers left in that 15-month period. He also asked - (4) How many recruits joined the Police Service between 31 January 2001 and 30 April 2003? That is the same period. The answer I gave was 530. Over that 15-month period, 153 additional police officers were recruited over and above the attrition rate for that period; that is, I deducted the 377 officers who left the service from the 530 who joined. Have members opposite used those figures? Those figures possibly give an inflated view of the situation. However, members keep asking questions about various time frames, and when they get a time frame that suits them, they start citing those figures and saying that they prove something. Nothing the member for Kalgoorlie has said today proves a single thing. Mr F.M. Logan: He’s slippery. Mrs M.H. ROBERTS: Slippery! He partly quoted from answers to questions asked in the upper House! He did not like the answer that indicated that the Government had recruited 153 more officers over that 15-month period than had been lost through attrition, so he selectively did not use it. He said that the Government had recruited only 32 more police officers in the entire time it had been in office, yet the answer that Hon Derrick Tomlinson received demonstrated that during a 15-month period we gained 153 more officers than we lost. What a nonsense and what nonsense we have heard from the Opposition! Opposition members have taken the opportunity during this debate to criticise our record in government. Let us look at the record of the previous Government. In its last four years in office, not one additional police officer was recruited above those lost through attrition. On top of that, during the Estimates Committee hearings in this House in 2000, I asked the then Liberal Minister for Police how many additional police officers he intended to recruit in each of the next four years, given all the problems that were occurring and given that Kalgoorlie was short about 15 police officers at the time. Kevin Prince said none, none, none and none. The Liberal Government had not recruited any police officers in the previous four years, and it did not plan to recruit any in the next four years until the Labor Party embarrassed it. The previous Government also failed to address the issue of corruption in the Police Service. It swept it under the carpet and pretended that it did not exist. I think people now know better. It also had no forward planning for crime fighting. It had hollow policies for, and no commitment to, what it alleged it would do. For example, let us look at its lack of commitment to the computer-aided dispatch and related communication system and the Delta communications and information technology project. It said that it would set up those projects. It just did not budget for them! Tens of millions of dollars were budgeted for because it was in the never-never. I suggest that it was never going to happen under the previous Government. It paid lip-service to DNA legislation. It did not even introduce it into the Parliament. When we came to office, Western Australia was the only State in Australia that did not have DNA legislation. There was more trickery, because when I looked in the budget for the funding for the implementation of the DNA legislation that it had been talking about but had not introduced, I found $1 million in the forward estimates to implement DNA legislation. Members should compare that with our record and the $22 million that we budgeted for it. There is no comparison. The answer I gave in the House yesterday clearly demonstrates the immense success we are having with the DNA legislation. It was hard to put that money in the budget. What was even harder, and what we have been criticised for, was taking police officers, section by section, out of police stations and training them in DNA techniques and the implementation of the legislation. They got advice on how to take samples and so forth, as well as on the legislation. Every police officer in this State was trained in the new legislation and how to proactively use the DNA technology. This will pay immense dividends for this State in the future. The previous Government also failed to tackle the difficult issue of organised crime. In eight years it failed to put in place occupational health and safety legislation for our police officers - something that this Government has already delivered on. Let me compare that with our record. In three budgets we have increased the output for police by over $90 million. We have put more police officers on the street. In our first two budgets, 110 more police officers were recruited than were lost through attrition. We have established the Royal Commission Into Whether There Has Been Any Corrupt or Criminal Conduct by Western Australian Police Officers. We have invested more than $20 million in DNA technology, and we have plans to build nine specialist police stations in regional Western Australia as part of the Government’s $75 million commitment to implement the Gordon inquiry recommendations. We have enacted legislation to deal with outlaw motorcycle gangs and organised crime in Western Australia. For the first time police officers are covered by occupational health and safety legislation. We have introduced new legislation to address the removal of officers from the Police Service, which the previous Government had been unable to deal with in the previous few years. We have put in place country incentives for police officers and have backed them up with proper funding. We have expanded the role for both the mounted and canine sections of the Police Service. Beyond doubt, we have delivered.

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7895

Members opposite have been deliberately mischievous in their comments. They should not continue to perpetuate deceit in the community. I am glad the member for Roe has returned to the Chamber. The member suggested that we might have to recruit 400 or 500 police officers in our term of office to get the 250 additional officers. We are committed to recruiting more than 1 000 new recruits through the academy over four years, and that has been backed up with funding. The Commissioner of Police is doing that job. As for the nonsense perpetuated by the member for Kalgoorlie when he said that maybe the minister has given the Police Service the money and it is just not doing it, the fact is that the minister and the Government have given the Police Service the money and it is doing it and it is delivering. Mr M.J. Birney interjected. Mrs M.H. ROBERTS: I have told the member for Kalgoorlie previously that I used to teach maths and if he wants me to go through the figures with him very slowly, I can. I suspect that he was not a very good student. I think you, Mr Acting Speaker (Mr A.J. Dean), may have been a teacher too. Teachers get to know the students who do not quite follow things as quickly as others, and I think the member for Kalgoorlie was one of those students. Perhaps if he reads slowly in Hansard the comments I have made today, he might finally understand. If he does not want to hear it from me, perhaps I can get the Commissioner of Police or a member of the command team to explain to him slowly how we are on track to delivering 1 000 new police officers into the Police Service. DR E. CONSTABLE (Churchlands) [3.30 pm]: I have tried to listen carefully to both the member for Kalgoorlie and the Minister for Police and Emergency Services. I wanted to understand any figures or information provided by the minister. Following her somewhat convoluted explanation about the figures for new recruits and the attrition rate in the Police Force, I ended up more confused than when she started. I was reminded of the old saying that there are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics. It was very confusing, and I would like to have been convinced. The minister said several times in her speech that she had recruited more than 1 000 new police officers. Mrs M.H. Roberts interjected. Dr E. CONSTABLE: I could not understand the minister because she was throwing figures around everywhere. Mrs M.H. Roberts interjected. Dr E. CONSTABLE: It was very hard to hear what the minister was trying to get across, what with the yelling and members interjecting. Perhaps the minister could have simplified the figures for us so that we could understand. She kept saying that she will recruit more than 1 000 new police officers during her only four-year term in government, but she did not say what the attrition rate would be. If she had done that, I would have had a clear picture of what she was doing. Mrs M.H. Roberts: It is about 750 and 250; it is quite simple. Dr E. CONSTABLE: The minister did not make that clear. Perhaps she could think about how she presents that type of information in future. What is important is what happens when those police officers go about their work. At the moment the people of Western Australia are very disappointed in the performance of the Police Service in some areas. One of the areas that affects all of us and our constituents is the most extraordinary situation in this State when it comes to house break-ins. This affects people in their day-to-day lives. Western Australia has a 14 per cent clearance rate for house break-ins, which makes it the home burglary capital of Australia. I ask the minister why her police officers are not doing something about that. That is what matters; not the numbers or the argument about how many she is recruiting and how many are leaving. The quality of the work they are doing affects the day-to-day lives of Western Australians. Western Australians want to be safe on the streets and in their homes. At the moment they do not feel safe in their homes. Mrs M.H. Roberts interjected. Dr E. CONSTABLE: The minister should go back and look at a few of the questions I have asked over the past 12 years about clearance rates and she will be educated. Mrs M.H. Roberts: You may have put them on notice, but you have never raised them verbally in the House. Dr E. CONSTABLE: I have done so, and I have raised them during estimates hearings. The minister can go back and look at those as well. She should not make up that rubbish. Mr P.G. Pendal: Under both Governments the police capacity has been abysmal, starting from the top with the commissioners and moving downwards. They should think about resigning. Dr E. CONSTABLE: It is certainly abysmal when it comes to the day-to-day lives of people who do not feel safe in their homes. Mrs M.H. Roberts: Do you think the commissioner should think about resigning, as the member for South Perth said? Dr E. CONSTABLE: The commissioner should be applying himself to the clearance rates of home burglaries, for example, and then I will be satisfied that he is doing a good job. We will all be happy when we see an increase in those

7896 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] clearance rates, but it has been going on like this for year after year. We should not argue about numbers; we should insist that this Government make sure that the police are doing a good job in the day-to-day lives of Western Australians. Question put and a division taken with the following result - Ayes (20)

Mr R.A. Ainsworth Mr J.H.D. Day Mr R.F. Johnson Mr M.W. Trenorden Mr C.J. Barnett Mrs C.L. Edwardes Mr B.K. Masters Mr T.K. Waldron Mr D.F. Barron-Sullivan Mr J.P.D. Edwards Mr P.D. Omodei Ms S.E. Walker Mr M.J. Birney Mr B.J. Grylls Mr P.G. Pendal Dr J.M. Woollard Dr E. Constable Ms K. Hodson-Thomas Mr R.N. Sweetman Mr J.L. Bradshaw (Teller) Noes (27)

Mr P.W. Andrews Mrs D.J. Guise Mr M. McGowan Mr E.S. Ripper Mr J.J.M. Bowler Mr S.R. Hill Ms S.M. McHale Mrs M.H. Roberts Mr C.M. Brown Mr J.C. Kobelke Mr N.R. Marlborough Mr D.A. Templeman Mr A.J. Carpenter Mr R.C. Kucera Mr M.P. Murray Mr P.B. Watson Mr J.B. D’Orazio Mr F.M. Logan Mr A.P. O’Gorman Mr M.P. Whitely Dr J.M. Edwards Ms A.J. MacTiernan Mr J.R. Quigley Ms M.M. Quirk (Teller) Dr G.I. Gallop Mr J.A. McGinty Ms J.A. Radisich

Pairs

Mr A.D. Marshall Mr J.N. Hyde Mr W.J. McNee Mrs C.A. Martin Question thus negatived. RESERVES (RESERVE 43131) BILL 2003 Message - Appropriations Message from the Governor received and read recommending appropriations for the purposes of the Bill. Introduction and First Reading Bill introduced, on motion by Dr G.I. Gallop (Premier), and read a first time. Second Reading DR G.I. GALLOP (Victoria Park - Premier) [3.40 pm]: I move - That the Bill be now read a second time. It is a fundamental responsibility of the Western Australian Government to provide a safe and secure environment for all its citizens, particularly its children. Yesterday I addressed the House about a community in which such an environment had not been ensured for the residents. The tragic death of Susan Taylor at the Swan Valley Nyungah Community is but one terrible example of the systemic sexual and physical abuse, substance abuse, family violence and intimidation that has occurred, and continues to occur at this community. Susan’s death was the impetus for this Government to commission the Inquiry into Responses by Government Agencies to Complaints of Family Violence and Child Abuse in Aboriginal Communities, headed by Magistrate Sue Gordon. The Gordon inquiry raised a number of concerns about the Swan Valley community, particularly the difficulties experienced by government agencies in accessing the site and providing services to the residents due to such access being controlled by the management of the community. It is entirely unacceptable that residents’ rightful access to services and assistance be hindered in this way. As I have detailed in this place at other times, this Government has made a major commitment to address the child abuse and family violence issues raised by the Gordon inquiry. In addition to the $75 million package, which will fund a raft of strategies to address these problems, the Government revoked the management order over the Swan Valley reserve held by the Swan Valley Nyungah Community Aboriginal Corporation, and replaced it with one that guaranteed government officers full access to the site. However, despite these actions, grave concerns continue to be held about the safety of children and women living in the Swan Valley community. Senior government officers advise that residents are not free to access government services, that intimidatory tactics prevent reporting of incidents, and that communication between children and women, and government officers is being hampered by the community management. I will not stand by and allow a tragedy like Susan Taylor’s death to be repeated. Unless we tackle these issues in a meaningful way, the despair and dysfunction that characterises this community will continue. There is only one course

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7897 of action that will secure for the children and women of the Swan Valley Nyungah Community the protection and safety they deserve and halt the cycle of abuse and violence; that is, the current management order must be revoked, and the Swan Valley reserve be vested in the Aboriginal Affairs Planning Authority so that the reserve might truly fulfil its role “for the use and benefit of the Aboriginal inhabitants”. The Bill before the House today is the only option to resolve the ongoing safety and management issues at this community in a timely fashion. Further amendments to the management order will not result in women and children being able to live safely at the community. It is inappropriate to allow the Swan Valley Nyungah Community Aboriginal Corporation to retain responsibility for implementing any new management order that demands greater access by government officers when some members of the corporation have been connected to the problems, particularly the access problems, at the community. Let it be shown that the corporation has been given ample opportunity to improve the situation for children and women at the reserve. In October last year, following the Gordon inquiry, a new management order was put in place with conditions to ensure that service providers are able to access residents and to require the Swan Valley Nyungah Community Aboriginal Corporation to present a management plan for the community. I put it to the House today that the plan offered by the corporation does nothing to address the very serious abuse and violence issues at the community and demonstrates the corporation’s total disregard for the safety and wellbeing of the women and children at the community. The failure of the corporation to take action on the abuse and violence endemic at the Swan Valley community is highlighted all the more by the commitment of the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Commission to do everything in its power to eradicate the scourge of family and sexual violence. As the national leader of indigenous peoples, ATSIC has adopted a family violence policy statement setting out principles and strategies for action on this issue. I also note the comments of the ATSIC spokesman yesterday that gave support to the Government for taking action to protect the women and children of the Swan Valley Nyungah Community. It is no longer appropriate for the Swan Valley Nyungah Community Aboriginal Corporation to be responsible for the care, control and management of this reserve. Legislation revoking the management order and rescinding the vesting of the reserve in the corporation is therefore our only option to bring an end to this terrible litany of abuse and violence. Under the provisions of the Bill, the existing management order will be revoked, but the reserve will continue to exist for the use and benefit of indigenous people, and management of the reserve is placed with the Aboriginal Affairs Planning Authority. The authority will appoint an administrator to manage the transition. To address the issues that have made the revocation of the management order necessary, the new management will have additional powers to ensure a smooth transition. The administrator will have the power to direct a person to leave the reserve, a direction that can be made either in writing or verbally by an authorised officer. If the person should refuse to leave the reserve, the police may remove him. These powers attach to the land, and ultimately lie with the minister responsible for the Land Administration Act, should some other person or body not be empowered to use them, either by statute or by the minister. The administrator will also be responsible for the day-to-day management of the land, and activities on the land, and the future planning for the land in accordance with reserve purposes. It is the firm commitment of this Government that the reserve, in line with the original vesting legislation, be retained for the use and benefit of the Aboriginal peoples. At present the reserve does not serve the broader Nyoongah community, but is monopolised by only one group. Options for its future use are being considered. Any future use will be decided through a consultative process with the indigenous community, to ensure the land and structures are best used. It is also the intention of this Government that the management of any future activities on the reserve will be passed to an appropriate Aboriginal organisation. The administrator appointed to manage this transition will pass day-to-day responsibility to an Aboriginal organisation at the earliest possible date. I do not undertake this legislation lightly, but with much consideration and concern for the children and women of the Swan Valley Nyungah Community, as it has become abundantly clear that the Swan Valley Nyungah Community Aboriginal Corporation is no longer fit to continue in its management role of the reserve. This issue is not about race; it is about intimidation, violence and abuse. The safety of all our children must be paramount, and it is incumbent upon all Western Australians to uphold the right of every child in this State to security and protection. I take this opportunity to invite all members of this House to support this Bill as a strong message that neither the Government, nor the Legislative Assembly, of Western Australia will tolerate child abuse and violence wherever it may arise. I commend this Bill to the House. Declaration as Urgent DR G.I. GALLOP (Victoria Park - Premier) [3.47 pm]: In accordance with Standing Order No 16(2), I move - That the Bill be considered an urgent Bill. MR C.J. BARNETT (Cottesloe - Leader of the Opposition) [3.48 pm]: Before commenting I will put on the public record what has happened in the parliamentary process. I will return to the merits or otherwise of this action in a

7898 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] moment. The first the Opposition knew of this Bill was when the leader of opposition business in the House, the member for Hillarys, was informed of it late last night. Dr G.I. Gallop: It wasn’t late. Mr C.J. BARNETT: Last night after dinner. The parliamentary secretary to the Premier, the member for Rockingham, informed me of the Bill when I returned from a function about 10.30 pm. A government member interjected. Mr C.J. BARNETT: When someone is doing the Government a favour, members opposite should concentrate and show some courtesy. The Opposition was informed that the Bill was to be introduced. It was also informed that the Government would provide a briefing for the Opposition at 10.30 this morning because the Government wanted to proceed with the Bill as a matter of urgency. Dr G.I. Gallop: With regret. We thought the Bill would be available at the time. We could have had the briefing but we thought it was not appropriate until the final draft of the Bill was available. There were technical issues. We regret that, but it is one of those things that happens. Mr C.J. BARNETT: That is not good enough. Dr G.I. Gallop: Don’t make an issue of this. Let’s get on with it. You’re being, you know - Mr C.J. BARNETT: I have been on my feet for one minute and the Premier has already insulted me, while I am doing the Government a favour and facilitating its legislation. Dr G.I. Gallop: I’m not having a go at you. Mr C.J. BARNETT: Within one minute the Premier has made a personal insult. I restate the point: the Opposition was informed that the Government wanted to debate this Bill as a matter of urgency. We were told that a briefing would be available for opposition members at 10.30 this morning. The Government cancelled that meeting. Dr Gallop: With regret. Mr C.J. BARNETT: With regret! Members on this side of the Chamber have not seen the Bill. They have not had any opportunity to ask questions of the public servants involved on any aspect. Dr G.I. Gallop: It was handed out a couple of hours ago. Mr C.J. BARNETT: The Premier should listen. That is what happened. I understand from the officer who informed my office that the briefing had been cancelled that some drafting matters had to be finalised. I accept that, but I did not have a choice. Given a choice, I would have been prepared to proceed with a briefing and be told that some technical issues were being sorted out. At least members on this side of the House would have been given the courtesy of an opportunity to read the Bill and ask obvious questions. Mr Marlborough: The Premier has apologised. Mr C.J. BARNETT: This Government chose not to do that. I do not care whether he apologised. The Opposition received a copy of the Bill at 1.15 pm today. I have not read it. A staff member of mine has gone through it quickly, and the members for Kingsley and Nedlands are flicking through the Bill now, using their legal experience to discover issues. I understand that the Bill went to the Labor Caucus, and that Labor members were briefed, last night. Is that correct? Dr G.I. Gallop: We offered you a briefing last night, but you were not available. Mr C.J. BARNETT: I was not offered a briefing last night. Dr G.I. Gallop: I went to the opposition leader of the House. Mr C.J. BARNETT: The Premier did not come to me. Dr G.I. Gallop: You were not here. Mr C.J. BARNETT: At no stage did anyone from the Government come to me yesterday or contact me and my staff and offer a briefing, yet Labor members were briefed at a meeting of Caucus. Labor Party members were given an opportunity to ask questions on the Bill, for which the Premier seeks immediate and bipartisan support. The Premier chose not to allow members on this side of the House to have knowledge of the Bill. It may not have been intentional, but that happened. Mr R.C. Kucera: If it’s not passed, more children will suffer. Mr C.J. BARNETT: Does the Minister for Health have a contribution to make, or was that his usual insult to Parliament? The Premier could have contacted me yesterday afternoon and made the Bill available even at a preliminary stage on a confidential basis. Dr G.I. Gallop: I did. I went to the member for Hillarys.

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7899

Mr C.J. BARNETT: We received the Bill at 1.15 pm, two and a half hours ago, in my office. No-one had received it prior to that time. At 1.15 pm, we got a copy of the Bill. That is the reality. Labor Party members had it last night, yet the Premier wants bipartisan support for its passage through Parliament. The Premier has not been genuine on this matter in not allowing members of Parliament any opportunity to read the Bill, to look at it and to ask cursory initial questions. No attempt was made to do so. A briefing was cancelled. This was the only opportunity we had to learn about the Bill, and we were willing to go along with it. Incredibly, I am still willing to go along with this measure. There is a fair amount of justified criticism from some of my colleagues: they rightly point out that we are asked to vote on a Bill we have not even seen. I can understand their criticism of me for making the decision to proceed. No good grace is shown by the Government on this at all - none! That is the truth, Premier. The Premier can scowl and shake his head. He could have dealt with this yesterday. He could have come to me, as is the convention in this Parliament - Dr G.I. Gallop: I came to you. I knocked on your door and no-one was there. Mr C.J. BARNETT: If there is a matter of urgency - I am willing to accept there is a matter of urgency in this matter - the Premier could have contacted me personally. Dr G.I. Gallop: I did. You weren’t there. Mr C.J. BARNETT: It was a big attempt, Premier- he knocked on the door! Maybe I was in the Chamber. The Premier did not contact me. He did not have his staff contact me yesterday, and no attempt was made to treat this matter with urgency. He now asks members of Parliament to vote on something they have not seen, and he cancelled the briefing this morning. The Premier can shake his head, but that is the reality. We are asked to support legislation we have not seen. Even if we had considered this legislation, I imagine we would support it. Representatives from the Swan Valley Nyungah Community wanted today to express their point of view to me. I might not agree with them; nevertheless, they have been denied any opportunity to express their point of view, whatever that might be. That is hardly a democratic process or natural justice. Whether I agree with them or not, that community has been denied the opportunity to present their point of view to the Opposition. That is what the Premier has done. Having said that, and having put up with the insults from members opposite, in good faith I am willing to back the Premier’s judgment on this matter. I am willing to give bipartisan cooperation to get the Bill through Parliament. That is far more gracious and courteous than the Government has been to the Opposition. I do not draw parallels, but I remind members that I asked this Chamber yesterday to hear Julie Fawcett for half an hour, and government members made fun of it, called it a stunt, denied it and accused me of abuse of Parliament. Here we are 24 hours later and the tables are turned, but the response is different. I respect the urgency of the situation. I am prepared to take it on good faith. I hope the Premier is right in what he is doing and that this measure is properly constructed. We will not find out in the Chamber today whether that is the case. I am working off a few notes hurriedly put together by my staff. A couple of members are flicking through clauses of the Bill. No serious debate will take place on this measure, and we must take it on good faith. I have not seen an Opposition placed in this position before in my 12 years in Parliament. It is asked to vote without having seen or read the Bill. I have not even discussed it with the member for Kingsley or Nedlands, let alone the shadow Minister for Indigenous Affairs or the shadow Attorney General. I have not discussed it with my colleagues in the National Party. No discussion has taken place, and no Liberal Party room meeting has been held. We will vote on the Bill that the Liberal Party has not had an opportunity to discuss. That is what the Premier asks us to do. I tell the Premier that we will do so in good faith. However, is there any good grace shown by those opposite? There is none at all. This issue arose from the Gordon inquiry following a coronial inquest into the very tragic death in 1999 of 15-year-old Susan Taylor at the Swan Valley Nyungah Community. From that event, the Government established the Gordon inquiry. It received bipartisan support for the establishment of the inquiry, which came down with a significant number of recommendations. The Opposition supported those recommendations. The Premier is not even listening. The Government adopted those recommendations bar two. Significantly, one of the recommendations of the Gordon inquiry rejected by the Government was to establish a commissioner for children. Is it not an ironic coincidence that the week this Bill is rushed to Parliament without any scrutiny, Hon Barbara Scott moved in the upper House to establish a select committee to inquire into the creation of a commissioner for children? That move was strenuously opposed by the Labor Party in the upper House, yet today this Bill is walked into Parliament in this fashion. The Liberal Party supported the establishment of the Gordon inquiry and, unlike Labor, supported all of its recommendations. This Bill relates to reserve 43131, which is crown land situated in the Swan Valley that has been made available for the use and benefit of Aboriginal people. Registered management order No 1262262 was issued under the Land Administration Act 1967 to place the care, control and management of the reserve with the Swan Valley Nyungah Community Aboriginal Corporation. The previous Government took the action at the request of the community to give

7900 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] a degree of independence to try to bring about what was hoped would be a more cohesive community. I recognise that this has not happened and that the abuse of children has occurred in the community. That is a tragedy. Still government members do not listen. I am trying to make a point to the Premier. Dr G.I. Gallop: I’m listening. Mr C.J. BARNETT: The Premier is talking to his colleagues. I am explaining a couple of points. The Premier brings in the Bill, but does not have the courtesy to listen. Dr G.I. Gallop: I’m listening. Mr C.J. BARNETT: He is not. I make a 10-minute speech to make a few points to the Premier, but he shows no courtesy to me or to Parliament. I am cooperating with the Government. I am doing my best. I have not read the Bill. I am working on notes I am reading for the first time right now. I am thinking as I read, and I seek some comments and reaction, if that is not too much to ask. I promise I will keep the Premier no more than 10 minutes. It is not a lot to ask. The previous Government established the facility hoping the community would be more cohesive and functional. It was not, and the abuse of children continued. I take it on good faith that the reason for the urgency of this Bill is that the Premier has evidence of continuing abuse of children. I assume that the reason this Bill is being put through this Parliament without effective debate is that there is an urgency relating to the protection of children today. I would like some verification of that. The reason I give the Premier good-faith support for the passage of this Bill without scrutiny of any sort is that I assume children are at risk right now. I assume that is the reason for the urgency. The Premier’s second reading speech did not make clear why this Bill is being proceeded with in this way. We have had no briefing or advance warning, and we have no opportunity for scrutiny and proper debate. I hope that the Premier can verify and explain the reason for the urgency, because his second reading speech did not do so. This Bill will revoke the management order providing that the Swan Valley Nyungah Community Aboriginal Corporation is the management body for that reserve, and will place the care, control and management of the reserve with the Aboriginal Affairs Planning Authority. That is appropriate. It will also set out how the reserve should be dealt with. The effect of clause 5 of the Bill will be to ensure that the reserve can be dealt with and handled under the Land Administration Act in the same way as reserve and management orders that are created in the normal manner. Clause 6 will allow the Registrar of Titles to record the revocation of the management order on the register of titles in accordance with the Transfer of Land Act. Clause 7 is a significant clause that will allow the Aboriginal Affairs Planning Authority to appoint an administrator who will have the power to direct people to leave or not enter the reserve. The clause will also allow the administrator to be provided with the assistance that he requires to remove a person from the reserve or prevent a person from entering the reserve. The administrator will essentially have a policing role over the reserve. He will approve who can go into the reserve, who can live in the reserve and who can leave the reserve. They are extraordinary powers over the Swan Valley Nyungah Community. The clause will also give the land administration minister the power to place the control of the reserve with a person other than the authority, and provide that the clauses of the Bill that apply to the administrator also apply to that person. In the absence of an administrator, the minister will have the ability to exercise the administrator’s powers. Police officers will be empowered to prevent people entering the reserve or to remove people from the reserve. I am sure the lawyers in the Parliament will have an interest in the latter clauses of the Bill. Clause 8 will exclude the rules of natural justice. The Bill also provides that the discretion of persons acting under clause 7 will be absolute. They will be immune from judicial review and protected from liability when acting in good faith. I am not a lawyer. I do not know if the lawyers in the Parliament can grasp the import of that. Maybe the member for Innaloo can help me out. If the members for Innaloo and Nedlands have something to offer, I would appreciate it. I understand that this Bill will remove natural justice, give absolute power and protect anyone who abuses that absolute power from redress. Is that a broadly correct interpretation for a layperson? That is significant. This might be an isolated issue relating to a small community, but it is a significant change in the legislation. For those reasons alone the Opposition should have been given better opportunity to consider this Bill. We are affecting natural justice and giving absolute power. This Bill will impact on one particular community, and it has not had any scrutiny. Members of this place had no prior knowledge of it. I hope that by the time the Bill gets to the upper House, Hon Peter Foss, Hon Derrick Tomlinson and other members will have had more opportunity to look at it. They may even have the opportunity to talk to the Aboriginal people concerned. I and others in this place have had no such opportunity. We have allowed this debate to proceed. I accepted in good faith the Premier’s word that this is an urgent matter, and I have extended to him a courtesy that to my knowledge is unprecedented in this Parliament. I wish the Premier had shown us a similar courtesy this week. Nevertheless, the Premier has been extended an unprecedented courtesy. I am not sure that I am doing the right thing. I can see a few raised eyebrows among my colleagues on this side of the House. I am sticking my neck out in allowing a piece of legislation to go through essentially without debate. I hope the Premier is right. I take him in good faith on this. MR M.W. TRENORDEN (Avon - Leader of the National Party) [4.04 pm]: This is a very draconian act against a group of people. The Premier last night offered me a briefing. I refused that because it would not have made any

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7901 difference to our position. We would still have been only half informed instead of fully informed. We would have had no opportunity to go beyond that briefing and seek input from anywhere else. I saw little point in attending a briefing - Mr D.A. Templeman interjected. Mr M.W. TRENORDEN: Of course I do that for everything. Mr D.A. Templeman interjected. Mr M.W. TRENORDEN: I attend briefings as part of the learning process and to engage in the scrutiny of a Bill. I am saying that we have no opportunity to scrutinise this Bill. The member cannot deny that. I do not want to speak for very long. I am prepared to take two people on trust, one of whom is the Premier. He has said that he wants this Bill passed. On behalf of the five members of the National Party, I abdicate our responsibility and duty to scrutinise this Bill. On the Premier’s call, we are giving that up, and we are happy to do that. The Premier must admit that I did not argue with him. Members of the Nyoongah community have spoken to me. They were not from the Swan Valley Nyungah Community. Those people are opposed to what is happening on that reserve. I have had that representation, unlike the Leader of the Opposition, so I at least know that a section of the Aboriginal community clearly wants this stopped. The Minister for Health is nodding his head. Last night he called me a racist because I criticised the Aboriginal funding in the health budget. I could do the same to him today, but I will not because he is not a racist. We will perform a very draconian act against a very small section of Western Australia. This is an example of the enormous pressure of the might against not just the small but the minuscule. We are taking the Premier at his word. Frankly, that is good enough for me. MR P.G. PENDAL (South Perth) [4.07 pm]: This is the first and only occasion in eight years that I can think of in which there is some justification for the House to set aside the normal constraints of standing orders to allow a Bill to be treated as urgent and to presumably pass all stages in one sitting. It is perhaps a reminder to all of us that the rules exist for good reason. Regardless of the Government in power, there has too often been a view that the constraints of standing orders can be easily dispensed with. Over the years I have been disappointed at the reaction of some members who think that - regardless of who is in government - when a party has the numbers, it can do anything. It is true that it can do anything, and that is all the more reason that a party that has the numbers should proceed with great caution in asking the Parliament to set aside its rules to treat a Bill as urgent. I repeat that this is the only occasion that I can think of in which the Parliament has some justification in acting in the way it is about to act; that is, if it is true that the welfare of children, women and men are at risk. Two clauses of the Bill are of exceptional gravity. The Leader of the Opposition touched on them very briefly. The first is that when this Bill is passed, it will put any of the actions taken under the Bill beyond judicial appeal. The second is that it will set aside the rules of natural justice. That is how grave is the matter that we are dealing with procedurally today. We are setting aside, because of the gravity of the situation, not only our own internal rules but also other external rules that would ordinarily put this Bill within the scope of judicial appeal and the rules of natural justice. That is not an ideal position, and it is one that I hope I will not see for another eight years, albeit that I make my own judgment that this is the only time in eight years that this serious step has been justified. I hope that we do not see it again for another eight years, or, for that matter, for many years to come. The question of early warnings to members is of concern to me. I learnt about this Bill not last night by someone mentioning it in the corridor or knocking on my door - because, in the end, every person’s vote in this place is and should be equal - but from a staff member when I came to Parliament this morning. Again, for us to concertina our views, set aside our own natural instincts and suspicions and take the Government on trust is something that I do not do lightly. However, I place a lot of store on what has been outlined in the Premier’s speech. I also place a lot of store on the fact that the Premier has chosen to introduce the Bill himself, because this is not a Bill that would normally be introduced by the Premier; I presume that in the normal course of events it would be introduced by the minister responsible for lands. That sends a message to me that the Government has put the highest possible premium on seeing the legislation through, and seeing it through quickly. In those circumstances, and I stress only in those circumstances, and with great reluctance, I support a Bill that will put this decision beyond judicial appeal, that will set aside all the rules of natural justice, and that has already set aside our own constraints on debate in this Chamber. However, because of the Premier’s request, and taking the Government at face value, I am prepared to support the Bill. DR J.M. WOOLLARD (Alfred Cove) [4.12 pm]: I think we are all aware of the problems in the Swan Valley Nyungah Community. The fact that the Reserves (Reserve 43131) Bill has just been put on the Table reminds me of the situation in the past within my own community of Melville and the grave concerns that were expressed when often just before the Christmas break, at 10 o’clock or 11 o’clock at night, the council would put things on the Table that it wanted to get through quickly. This issue has not just blown up this week, yet it has been left until the last item of business on a Thursday afternoon to be put on the Table. The Premier’s speech did not outline to the Parliament what other options the Government considered before it came up with this Bill. The Bill makes no mention of what will happen to the families who are currently living in that community and whether they will be moved together into group

7902 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] housing or will be divided. I have been informed that the Premier has discussed this matter with the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Commission council and administration. However, if these discussions have been going on for a while, why could the Parliament not have been informed? Like probably many other members in this Parliament, I have a good relationship with the Aboriginal elders in my community. It is very difficult to contact people when we are given less than one day’s notice of the introduction of a Bill. I would have liked to have been able to discuss this Bill with the Aboriginal elders in my community to see whether they were aware of the Bill, what they have heard from ATSIC, and what options they would have liked to have had considered in dealing with this issue. I hope that when the Premier responds, he will address the issue of what other options were available, and what will happen to the families in that community. We need to know whether they will be moved down south to Albany or up north somewhere, and what the communication links will be. We all know that there have been problems in that community, but there probably are also strengths within some members of it. They may lose those strengths if they are moved all around the State. MR R.N. SWEETMAN (Ningaloo) [4.15 pm]: I wish to make a couple of comments on the Reserves (Reserve 43131) Bill. I will not go into any of the technical aspects of the Bill that have already been highlighted by other speakers. However, I must say that for me this is a great occasion to be in the Parliament, because the reason I came into the Parliament in the first instance was to try to improve the circumstances of people in the broader community. That is what this Bill will do. My only reservation or caution in giving my wholehearted support to the Bill is perhaps in knowing the consequences of turning many of these troublemakers out of this community, because to simply show them the gate will not in any way make these people - these despots and monsters - any better people. I can tell the Premier, and I am sure he already knows, that the Swan Valley Nyungah Aboriginal Community is not the only problem community in Western Australia, although it has received a lot of attention and I believe is the epicentre of a lot of the problems in the Perth urban area. One example of the problems that exist in other Aboriginal communities in Western Australia is the women’s refuge in Carnarvon. To give a snapshot of the problem, the temporary facility has been operating in Carnarvon for about three or four years. I think I mentioned in the Parliament either earlier this year or last year that in the 10-month period from January to October last year about 355 women went through that refuge. Only six of those women were non-Aboriginal. That is a clear indication that this problem is endemic in many Aboriginal communities. I have been shouting about this matter from the rooftops for as long as I have been a member of Parliament. I have had Aboriginal women sit opposite my desk in my electorate office in Carnarvon, weeping and saying that they cannot do anything about this; I am the only one who can. I managed to get the former Minister for Aboriginal Affairs, Hon Kim Hames, to come to Carnarvon. Kim Hames is a wonderful and very compassionate man, but because he was under so much pressure from Aboriginal people in very high and significant places who were giving him information, he did not directly intervene in the problem. I remember my embarrassment when I sat with a group of Aboriginal women at the Aboriginal medical centre on the day minister Hames came in to address the serious issue of child abuse and molestation and the bashing of women in the Aboriginal community in Carnarvon, and in the Mungullah community and the broader area of the Gascoyne, and he announced what I think was a $2.4 million advertising campaign that would be the answer to all their problems. We would educate people through an advertising campaign that they should not bash and molest their kids or bash their wives. I was embarrassed and they were embarrassed, and of course the problem continued. Those advertisements ran for a while, but the people who were supposed to be targeted by that message were never going to get that message. I support the Bill. It is a wonderful step. However, regardless of what people may want to read into it, such as it is a violation of a person’s human rights, and of natural justice and things like that, we must take it one step further. We must be involved in behaviour modification programs. Many of the despots and monsters to whom I referred earlier became what they are as a result of the abuse of one substance or another, generally alcohol. There are many of these people, yet even though on this occasion we can deny them natural justice and turn them out of this community, we think it would be going too far to further impinge on their human rights and put them into some sort of rehabilitation or detoxification programs and directly intervene through behaviour modification programs. These people are almost always men. Hopefully we might turn them into better people, so that they would be better husbands and better carers for their wives and children. A consequence of that would be that the State would have far fewer dysfunctional families and these people would make far greater contributions to Western Australian society. I have kept my comments as brief as possible. I wholeheartedly support the Bill. I hope that it does the job. The future is quite vague, because it is assumed that people will be found who will be a whole lot better than those who are currently in the community and that they will administer the community during the transitional period from the current corporation to the next corporation. The Government must be extremely diligent in ensuring that the right people go into the community and do what the Government expects in the time frame in which it expects it to be done. The speedy transition of the Bill through this House, and hopefully the upper House, will create an excellent precedent. I am not being in any way partisan about this, but I believe that we as legislators could look at the situation community by community and region by region, if that is what it takes to get similar measures in place to improve the circumstances of all Aboriginal women and children in this State. DR G.I. GALLOP (Victoria Park - Premier) [4.22 pm]: I thank the members for their contributions to the debate on this Bill. It is an extraordinary Bill that has been introduced in circumstances that are quite different from any we

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7903 normally face in the Parliament. I appreciate the support that members are giving. I hope the Bill will go through this Parliament with the full support of all members on the basis of their proper consideration of all the clauses, because clearly, even though we want the Bill to be treated as an urgent Bill, I trust that all members will be confident that they are voting for something they can be satisfied with. I will not dwell on the issues raised by the Leader of the Opposition except to say that I am deeply disappointed that he would think that I was trying to keep the Opposition out of the discussion of this Bill. It only went through the Labor Caucus during the dinner break last night. Before that happened, of course, I was not in a position to go to the Opposition. I approached the Leader of the Opposition, but unfortunately he was not in his office. I then went to the opposition manager of business in the House. It was not possible to have the briefing last night. We organised it for 10.30 this morning. It was not possible because the Leader of the Opposition was not here. We could have had the briefing last night, but it was much better to have it at 10.30 this morning. Unfortunately the final print of the Bill was not available, so the decision was made that, rather than have the briefing in the absence of it, we would get the Bill and give it to the Opposition, which we did at 1.15 this afternoon, and then hopefully later on in the afternoon we would be able to deal with it. I tried to cooperate with the Opposition. If opposition members feel that that was not done, I am disappointed that they would think that. Mr R.F. Johnson: You did come and talk to me; that is absolutely true. The reason I said that the briefing would not be possible last night is that the upper House does not sit on a Wednesday night, so many members had left by the time you spoke to me. It was certainly difficult to get those members together. We agreed to have a briefing at 10.30 this morning, but unfortunately you had a problem with the Bill so that had to be cancelled. Dr G.I. GALLOP: As I said, I regret that. I appreciate the support given to me by the opposition manager of business. Ms S.E. Walker: Are you going to ensure that the Bill will move quickly through the upper House? Dr G.I. GALLOP: That is a matter for the upper House, but we would like to see that happen if it is possible. The upper House sits on Friday. We were advised by the directors general of the Department for Community Development and the Department of Indigenous Affairs that there was an unacceptable level of risk. The history of the camp indicated that we could not ensure that there would not be a recurrence of the tragic incidents that have occurred there in the past. We determined that decisive action needed to be taken. In answer to the good question asked by the member for Alfred Cove as to other alternatives, we could have gone to court and argued that the management order given to the Swan Valley Nyungah Community was not being properly abided by. We believe that we would have had a strong case, but the matter could have got strung out in the court. We have seen how that process has occurred with other issues relating to the Swan Valley Nyungah Community. We could have gone to court and said that it was in the public interest to revoke the management order. That matter could have been strung out in court proceedings. We had to make a decision whether to go by that route or to go directly to the Parliament. We decided to come directly to the Parliament because we believe that we can do it in a more timely manner with the concurrence of members. We do not have the numbers in the Legislative Council, but we hope that through good argument we can convince them to agree with us. Mr J.H.D. Day: When did you make the decision that it was necessary? Dr G.I. GALLOP: The advice was given at the cabinet meeting on Monday. Mr J.H.D. Day: When were you advised that there was such a major problem? Dr G.I. GALLOP: We were told of the problem the week before I went to the cabinet meeting on the Monday. We understand the point on natural justice made by the member for South Perth. Natural justice is only taken away in respect of clause 7(3)(a) and (b) and I remind the member as to what those provisions contain. They deal with directing a person to leave the reserve or stopping someone going onto the reserve. They therefore deal with those specific points in relation to natural justice. They do take away those aspects of natural justice, but the reason is quite simple. If the administrator makes a decision to remove someone from the reserve - I believe there are good reasons for thinking that will be necessary - again, we would not want that tied up in court processes. We believe that decisive action must be taken, and these provisions give the power to enable that to happen. I think I have answered the specific points that have been raised by the members. Dr J.M. Woollard: You have not mentioned where the women and children are to be placed. Dr G.I. GALLOP: I am coming to that. The Bill raises an interesting question: what is the role of the State in our community? We often talk about the role of the State being to facilitate improvement in the community and obviously to pass laws that restrict the liberties of people in the interests of the public. However, in the end the State exists to protect people from anarchy and tyranny, because the alternative to having a Government in society is either anarchy or tyranny. We have all studied those subjects over the years as members of Parliament and before that as citizens. In a way what we are saying through this

7904 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] legislation is that the Government is asking this Parliament to give the Government power to act in a very decisive way to protect the rights and interests of women and children at that camp. This is a great set of powers that we are giving to the State. Why are we doing it? It is not to aggrandise the State but, as the member for Ningaloo put it, to look after the interests of women and children. It is decisive action and it is giving the State strong power, but it is to do the very thing that Governments exist for; that is, to protect the interests of those who are vulnerable and those who are at risk, even if it means taking on powerful people, people who over the years have got away with things that they should not have got away with and people who might use every avenue available to them to resist the process. These are occasions when we must contemplate the use of that power. It is circumscribed to a particular area and in a particular way, but it is necessary to protect the interests of the women and children. I will assure the member for Alfred Cove of two things. First, the interests of indigenous people in respect of that land will be protected. We have already had a discussion with the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Commission on that matter. We will be looking for new ideas about the way in which that land can be used for indigenous purposes. We certainly give that guarantee. We are also very conscious of the families. When we as the Government discussed that matter, it was foremost in our mind that we would have to work with those families to find appropriate accommodation for them in our society. I thank members for their comments. This is an extraordinary situation. Given the advice that we have, and given the history of this issue, action is justified. Mr J.H.D. Day: You said you would be working with them but can you guarantee that you will find accommodation for them? Dr G.I. GALLOP: Of course; that is the responsibility of the Government through the Department of Housing and Works. Question put and passed. Bill read a second time. Consideration in Detail Clauses 1 and 2 put and passed. Clause 3: Definitions - Mrs C.L. EDWARDES: I refer the Premier to the definition of “management order no. I262262”. I received a copy of the annexure to the management order on the reserve while the Premier was making his second reading speech. The Gordon inquiry report was handed down in July. This management order is dated 11 October 2002. The Government of Western Australia responded to the Gordon inquiry in November 2002. I understand the management order was made following the handing down of the Gordon inquiry report, and that a number of changes were made to the order. Will the Premier outline to the House the reason for the management order and the changes that were made to the order as a result of the Gordon inquiry? Dr G.I. GALLOP: The Gordon inquiry recommended a revision in the relationship between the Government and the Swan Valley Nyungah Community through the development of an understanding of the rules and regulations. As the member knows, the coronial inquiry said that access to the land was a problem. There was a gate there that caused difficulty for government officers and there was a climate of opposition to government officers going in there and consulting with the family. The changes that were made in the first instance related to access. There had to be free access to that site, and that was backed by the Government’s ensuring that the gate was open. The difficulty we found was that, although there was formal access, in reality the power structures at the camp were such that the Government was unable to talk properly to the people in the community. Secondly, the desire of the Government to develop a program and policies to look after the welfare of the women and children at that camp was made almost impossible by the attitude of those who controlled the camp. Basically there was no proper governance in place and there was a lack of access. The management order attempted to deal with those issues as best it could within the framework that existed. However, we concluded at the end of the day that it was not successful. Ms S.E. WALKER: I want to sort something out in relation to the original management order to ensure that all ground is covered. In the Government’s action plan for addressing family balance and child abuse in Aboriginal communities dated November 2002, the Premier referred to the registration of a new management order. I presume that new management order is the annexure to management order No I262262 referred to in clause 3. What will happen to the original management order? Is that original management order on foot and can it be used to circumvent the other provisions in this Bill? Dr G.I. GALLOP: Management order No I262262 replaces the original order. The difficulty with the original order was that no vesting conditions were placed on the management of the community; in other words, management was passed over to the Swan Valley Nyungah Community and it was basically given the right to do what it liked in that

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7905 camp. That was the problem. We tried to address that problem following the Gordon inquiry; however, although we put conditions on the management, we were unsuccessful in addressing it. Ms S.E. WALKER: I understand that. I hope this Bill is scrutinised closely in the upper House to ensure that the original management order is not still on foot. Dr G.I. Gallop: It is not. Ms S.E. WALKER: Secondly, part 1 of the Government’s action plan required a management plan to be prepared by the Swan Valley Nyungah Community Aboriginal Corporation within six months. That requirement was included in the annexure to the management order. Was that management plan produced by the corporation? Dr G.I. GALLOP: I believe that such a plan was put forward. It was unacceptable. It did not deal properly with the issue of access; that was one factor we took into account in our decision. The attitude of the people at the community was such that it was impossible for us to have a proper relationship. Ms S.E. WALKER: The Premier said that he had seen it and it was not acceptable; I accept that. How long did it take for the management plan to come from the corporation? Dr G.I. Gallop: It was received on 30 March. Mrs C.L. EDWARDES: I will follow through on the management plan, because I understand that part of the reason for this legislation, which is unusual and unique, is that the management plan was unacceptable. The plan went to the respective directors general who have responsibility for this area and they advised the Premier that there remained a high and unacceptable risk. Was feedback on the management plan given to the Swan Valley Nyungah Community Aboriginal Corporation that it was deficient in some areas? If so, was it after that discussion that relations and communications broke down; or did the directors decide that the plan was so deficient that it was unacceptable? Given the other information that the Premier provided, was there still such a high and unacceptable risk to women and children at the community that the Premier believed the best procedure was for the Government to take over the management of the place? Dr G.I. GALLOP: As I said, the proposed plan arrived on 30 March and was considered by the Government. The comments from the directors did not go back to the Swan Valley Nyungah Community. However, events intervened following that to lead to this debate in the Parliament today. In answer to the question: no, the comments were not passed back to the Swan Valley Nyungah Community on this matter. The matter was considered in government. The advice to the Cabinet was - I think I can say this - that the proposed plan indicated the attitude of the Swan Valley Nyungah Community to what we were doing. That attitude was negative and such that we reached the conclusion that we could not work through that vehicle. Mrs C.L. EDWARDES: Without breaching the privacy of particular individuals, could the Premier, in a generic sense, give an indication of what events overtook the receipt of the plan by the directors general, informed their decision not to go back to the Swan Valley Nyungah Community Aboriginal Corporation and led to this unique legislation? Dr G.I. GALLOP: The answer is: two factors; first was the advice coming through the government system from the officers on the ground in the various departments, who were set up to deal with this issue following the Gordon inquiry. Their advice was of the continuing obstruction and difficulty in accessing the women and children. Second was continuing allegations about violence in the camp, and the dangers facing some of the women and children at the camp. Those two factors put together led to a decision to close the camp. Mrs C.L. EDWARDES: Although this is a unique situation, perhaps there are some parallels between police intervention and intervention by the child protection unit at the Department for Community Development, when abuse of children takes place in the home. Can any such parallels be drawn? Dr G.I. GALLOP: There are some parallels. On many occasions the police are asked to intervene in domestic violence situations, and they have powers they can use in those situations. We are dealing here with allegations about a community and we are following them up with legislative action. There is a general parallel here. Mrs C.L. Edwardes: You cannot go in and remove the children, as can be done in a child protection case? Dr G.I. GALLOP: The problem is that the power structure in that camp is such that getting through to the women and children and enabling them to speak freely about what is going on is impossible. Even though there are ways and means by which certain information filtered out to the government officers that led them to be concerned about the liberties and rights of certain individuals there, resolving the issues in the way the member has just suggested was deemed to be impossible. Therefore, the more decisive action of closing the camp was thought to be the better way to go. Ms S.E. WALKER: I fully support the reasons behind this legislation. Have any charges or complaints been made by the community since the management plan? If so, how many? Dr G.I. GALLOP: We have had some anonymous complaints, but the people who made them were not willing to follow them up by making formal complaints. Issues at the camp, however, have led to real concerns on the part of the government officers.

7906 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

Ms S.E. WALKER: How many members does the corporation have, and were they all from inside the camp? Dr G.I. GALLOP: The governance of the community was one of the issues we were trying to address following the Gordon inquiry. It was very difficult to work out precisely what that community was. Some people were still part of the community, but not living there. Governance was a very important issue, and was one of the reasons it was difficult to use the strategy recommended by the Gordon inquiry to deal with this issue, which was to have a new relationship with the community, given that the definition and formal structures of that community were very hard to find and decipher. It was almost impossible to go down that track. The question asked by the member for Nedlands is a good one, because it was one of the very problems that led to the decision to legislate. Ms S.E. WALKER: I understand that besides the children at the camp, other children who may be enticed to visit the camp are a problem as well. Is that correct? Dr G.I. GALLOP: That is indeed one of the problems with this camp. It is not just the children; it is the adults who come and go. The Susan Taylor tragedy was very much related to that issue. Mr R.N. SWEETMAN: I want some further clarification of the definitions, including “administrator”, “authority”, “management order” and “the reserve”. When I went to the briefing this morning, the question in my mind was whether the camp would be completely shut down. From the news bulletin last night it was very clear that everybody was out. However, when I began reading aspects of the legislation in relation to the administrator, the authority, and natural justice, I formed the impression that the Government was trying to integrate sections of the Aboriginal Communities Act 1975, passed by the Court Government. That Act allowed Aboriginal communities to make local laws, which are enacted in various communities throughout the north west and have served those communities very well. They are able to turn out of their communities people who cause problems. For example, if it is a dry community and people bring in alcohol or go on a drinking binge, they can very quickly be told to leave the community. I thought this was a bit of a mix and match when I speed-read through the clauses of the Bill and the explanatory memoranda. The issues of the administrator, the authority and natural justice perhaps apply to people who want to squat and then resist the order to move off the community. It creates another problem. While I applaud the Government for what it is doing with this Bill, it must have contemplated the possibility that it is simply shifting the problem from here to there. The Government is intervening in the community as it is currently structured. What long-term measures will be taken to interfere with this quite extraordinary behaviour of systematic abuse and molestation taking place in the families in the community? Dr G.I. GALLOP: I will repeat the first point I made. The original order that vested management of the land in the Swan Valley Nyungah Community Aboriginal Corporation was deficient. No controls were put in place at that time. It is the intention of the Government to close the camp, and it is proposing the means to that end. There must be a means to an end that is legally enforceable and practical, and that will lead to the desired result. In terms of the issue raised by the member for Ningaloo, the Government responded to the Gordon inquiry with a $75 million investment, extra child protection workers and more police officers to deal with this issue. A relationship has been developed with the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Commission, which is committed to working on this issue. The Government will work on the issues through the community. The one thing the Government will not do, which is implicit in the member’s question, is recreate the Swan Valley Nyungah camp somewhere else. Clause put and passed. Clause 4: Revocation of management order no. I262262 and effect - Mrs C.L. EDWARDES: I have a question about clause 4(2). What does section 50(2) of the Land Administration Act say? What, therefore, is the meaning of this subclause? There is also a reference to section 5(2) of that Act under clause 5(5). To save time, could the Premier respond about the impact of both provisions? Dr G.I. GALLOP: Section 50 of the Land Administration Act deals with the revocation of management orders. Clause 5(5) of the Bill allows future action along the lines of section 50 of the Act in relation to this order. Ms S.E. WALKER: I have a copy of the Land Administration Act, which states that a minister can revoke a management order in any event. I suppose it is a double whammy. Section 50(1) states - When a management body - (a) agrees that its management order should be revoked - Dr G.I. Gallop: I will perhaps answer the member’s question while she is on her feet: that was the point I made in my reply to the second reading debate. The Government considered the court action approach, either on the grounds of public interest or that the Swan Valley Nyungah Community was not acting in accordance with its agreement with the Government. However, we felt the time it would take and the possibility of legal delay etc would not be in the interests of the people at the reserve. Mrs C.L. EDWARDES: This clause provides that section 50 of the Land Administration Act will remain in place, irrespective of this legislation. This legislation will not replace any of the minister’s powers under section 50.

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7907

Dr G.I. Gallop: That is correct. Clause put and passed. Clauses 5 and 6 put and passed. Clause 7: Additional powers in relation to care, control and management - Ms S.E. WALKER: It appears that the administrator who will oversee the removal of people from this community will be appointed under the Aboriginal Affairs Planning Authority Act. Dr G.I. GALLOP: In effect, the administrator will be appointed by the minister. It is clearly an important position and one that is required so that this transition can occur, to move people from that site and pave the way for a new approach to the delivery of indigenous interests on that land. Mrs C.L. EDWARDES: Is the responsible minister the Minister for Indigenous Affairs and not the Minister for Planning and Infrastructure, even though the Minister for Planning and Infrastructure has responsibility for the Land Administration Act? Dr G.I. Gallop: That is correct. Mrs C.L. EDWARDES: I wanted to clarify that point. Could the Premier provide some indication of who will be appointed to this position? Subclause (3) outlines what the administrator will be able to do in directing a person not to enter or to leave the reserve. I am concerned that under subclause (4) the direction may be given orally. The exclusion of the rules of natural justice and judicial review in subclause (3) will protect and provide some immunity to the administrator. Therefore, it is not necessary to put that into the legislation. However, it would be far better for the operational procedures to provide that if the administrator is placed in the position of having to give a direction orally, it must be done in the presence of another person so that there is a witness to it. We do not know how broad these exclusion rules will be. Allegations of assault or actions of a criminal nature may be made. These rules may or may not protect that individual. Dr G.I. GALLOP: I thank the member for the point she has made. I am advised that the administrator, who will deal with that very point, will put procedures and processes in place for the giving of oral directives. In terms of the general issue of appointing an administrator, we must find someone who is experienced in these matters. Work is already being done to find such a person. There are many Aboriginal communities in Australia. From time to time, decisive action is needed in the management of those communities. Australia has some people who are very experienced in this area. Such a person must be capable of acting decisively. The Government is consulting the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Commission on finding an appropriate person for that job. I appreciate the member’s contribution. Mrs C.L. EDWARDES: I refer the Premier to subclause (9), which states - A person who may exercise a power under subsection (3)(c) - Which in turn states - with such assistants as the administrator thinks are necessary - (i) prevent a person from entering the reserve . . . (ii) remove a person from the reserve - Subclause (9) concludes - . . . may use such reasonable force as is necessary for the purpose of exercising the power. That provision would place an individual, other than a police officer, in a very difficult position. What advice has the Premier received on the “reasonable force as is necessary” that a person will be able to use? Dr G.I. GALLOP: These powers would be used by the person assisting the administrator. If a situation arose and that power needed to be exercised, in most circumstances it would be exercised by the police, who have this sort of power in any case. Clause put and passed. Clause 8: Exclusion of rules of natural justice - Mrs C.L. EDWARDES: Because of the sensitive nature of this clause, I ask the Premier to put on record what this provision to exclude the rules of natural justice means. Dr G.I. GALLOP: There are two points. The first is that the rules of natural justice - lawyers always put things in the negative and it confuses me enormously - will no longer apply in respect of clause 7(3)(a) and (b), which of course deals with the direction to a person not to enter or to leave the reserve. This clause applies only to those areas. The Government’s experience of these sorts of issues and this camp is that legal avenues are often used to thwart the proper pursuit of justice. This is something that Governments do not necessarily like to do. However, if we are to ensure that

7908 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] the interests of people in this case are to be properly protected, we do not want lengthy legal processes to hold up that exercise of power. Ms S.E. WALKER: I suppose other statutes that could potentially override the provisions of this Bill have been examined; for instance, the Interpretation Act. I put that matter in Hansard for when this Bill goes to the upper House. Dr E. CONSTABLE: I understand why this clause is in the Bill, even though all members in almost all circumstances would consider the denial of natural justice to be a very worrying matter. There is always the potential for abuse with a clause such as this. Can the Premier provide an outline of the accountability or record keeping the Government will expect of the administrator, so that some sort of oversight of this clause can be documented? Dr G.I. GALLOP: Ultimately, the administrator will be accountable through the processes to the minister. The second point is that should these powers not be exercised properly, I am sure that it would be publicised. Dr E. Constable: I expect that they will be, but I still think that accountability needs to be built into the process. Dr G.I. GALLOP: The administrator will ultimately be accountable to the minister. I refer to the appointment of the administrator under clause 7(2). The minister ultimately has the authority to remove an administrator if he needs to. Ms S.E. WALKER: With regard to this Bill, we have put our trust in the Premier, as the Leader of the Opposition said today. It dismantles a group that currently has control of a reserve in the Swan Valley. Once that group has gone and the authority has taken over control of the property, will this clause still operate with regard to other people? Do these clauses and the denial of natural justice apply only to the removal of 25 people, or will they continue to apply indefinitely, because that is then a different situation? I have not read the Bill closely, but there may be a provision in clause 7 or elsewhere in the Bill that limits the duration of the denial of natural justice to the 25 people who are currently at the reserve. Bearing in mind that other people are accustomed to being allowed onto the reserve, how long will this denial of natural justice be enforced with regard to sections of the Aboriginal community? Dr G.I. GALLOP: While this legislation is active, these powers are capable of being exercised if given to an administrator of this issue. Over time, when all these questions have been resolved, we hope to repeal the legislation. Future management bodies will be given powers under the Land Administration Act and there will be an agreement with the Government on how it should operate etc. That is how it should operate now for the Swan Valley Nyungah Community, but the powers are not adequate at the moment. Obviously, this is extraordinary legislation for an extraordinary situation. Once all the matters at the community have been resolved and everyone is satisfied with the situation, the legislation will not be necessary. In any case, a future management body of this land would not necessarily be given these powers. Ms S.E. WALKER: I raised this matter because under clause 7(6) a variety of people can be granted the power to remove people. I do not know whether this provision has been thought through properly, and perhaps the Premier could give it some consideration, because this will be the only tract of land that is administered by the authority with powers such as these indefinitely. Dr G.I. Gallop: It could happen. Ms S.E. WALKER: Is that not a cause for concern? We are trying to deal with a problem - I am not trying to be difficult - Dr G.I. Gallop: I agree with the member. That could be the case but I indicated earlier that when all those issues are resolved and the situation becomes acceptable again, we will be in a position to repeal the Bill. Ms S.E. WALKER: Then perhaps there should be some sort of review clause in the legislation. Mrs C.L. Edwardes: Or sunset clause. Ms S.E. WALKER: A review clause would be better because the situation may not be resolved by the time a sunset clause takes effect. There should be some sort of clause in the Bill, because otherwise draconian laws will apply to the community indefinitely. Dr G.I. GALLOP: The difficulty is not knowing how long it will take to reach an acceptable situation. We hope that it can be done speedily and in a timely manner. That is why a sunset clause has not been placed in the Bill. I assure the member that this Bill is all about the Swan Valley Nyungah Community and this particular management order. It is not something that can be used in other areas. It is a specific reserves Bill. The member can have confidence in knowing that that is what we are trying to do and we will not take it any further than that. Mrs C.L. EDWARDES: I understand what the Premier is saying. However, if he refers to clause 5, he will note that an administrator will be responsible for the care, control and management of the reserve forever and a day; there is no end time. It is nothing to do with the Swan Valley Nyungah Community; the administrator is not linked to that. The administrator is linked to the land and he can toss off people or allow people or his representatives onto the land. There is no control in terms of natural justice and, consequently, in terms of authority. I understand that there might not be enough time to get that authority set up, but there is no backup for the administrator and there is no time frame within which to end this management order. What if somewhere down the track there was a plan for this piece of land? What

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7909 would stop a Government selling off or redeveloping that land under LandCorp? Will anything that is not in front of us prevent someone or something doing that? Dr G.I. GALLOP: It has been made absolutely clear in the second reading speech that we have no intention whatsoever of doing such a thing. This land has been vested for Aboriginal purposes and we will be consulting with the Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Commission about its future use. Mrs C.L. Edwardes: So the vesting still stays in place for Aboriginal purposes and it can only ever be used for Aboriginal purposes. Dr G.I. GALLOP: That is our view - Mrs C.L. Edwardes: Is that the legal position? Dr G.I. GALLOP: Yes, while it is a reserve. Ms S.E. WALKER: I know it has been a long week and we are all a little tired, but what concerns me is that this Bill may be putting that piece of land in a worse position than it is in already. This legislation will give an administrator, appointed by the minister, the power to prevent anyone from coming onto that reserve, forever. Nobody has that power at the moment. Under an annexure to the management order, a gate has just been put on the reserve - Dr G.I. Gallop: But the administrator is accountable to the minister. Ms S.E. WALKER: That may well be the case, but will he have powers under this Bill? I urge the Premier, some time between now and when the Bill gets to the upper House, to insert a sunset clause. This legislation will give the Aboriginal Affairs Planning Authority unlimited power, forever, to prevent any person from entering the reserve or to direct a person to leave the reserve, and it will allow the administrator to appoint anybody to do that. That will open up a minefield. I hope the Premier reconsiders that provision before the Bill passes. Dr G.I. GALLOP: Two points must be made. First, the minister appoints an administrator and, in this very Parliament, that minister is accountable to the people of Western Australia. That is absolutely clear accountability. Second, I refer the member to clause 12, which deals with protection from liability. This occurs only if actions are conducted in good faith. If such a person started doing the things to which the member has referred, he would be subject to legal action. Ms S.E. WALKER: That is exactly why I raised this point. It has taken us years to find out what is really going on in the community, and this Bill is setting us up for the same situation to occur again. I am not having a go at the Bill - I know it was put together quickly - but I urge the Premier to reconsider the situation. Dr G.I. GALLOP: We must go back and remember why the Bill is here. Ms S.E. Walker: It does not matter. Dr G.I. GALLOP: No, it is important. The Bill deals with a particular issue and this is the means to that end. Dr E. CONSTABLE: I draw the Premier’s attention to his second reading speech in which he stated - It is also the intention of this Government that the management of any future activities on the reserve be passed to an appropriate Aboriginal organisation. The administrator appointed to manage this transition will pass day- to-day responsibility to an Aboriginal organisation at the earliest possible date. It seems to me, from listening to the comments of the members for Nedlands and Kingsley, that it would be wise if provision were made that clause 8 cease to exist when the day-to-day responsibility is passed to an Aboriginal organisation. I can almost accept, as an emergency measure, that the exclusion of rules of natural justice should apply in certain circumstances, but it should not be an open-ended provision. We should be clear, in passing this legislation, that this clause will cease to exist when the day-to-day responsibilities are passed to an Aboriginal organisation. Dr G.I. GALLOP: Ultimately, the rules that apply to the new management would have to be given authority by the minister and the Government of the day. Although the administrator will be engaged to organise the transition, as indicated in the second reading speech, the ultimate authority will reside with the minister. The powers to be given will be determined through the process. Ms S.E. WALKER: That simply is not the case, Premier. This is legislation. The member for Churchlands is correct in saying that it is for Parliament to determine. Whether the Premier likes it or not, it is not for the minister to direct - it is here by statute. Following the comments of the member for Churchlands, the Government has a problem not only with clause 8, but also with immunity from the judicial supervision in clause 11 and protection from liability in clause 12. I do not want to debate those points or raise the same issues again. Nevertheless, they are important. It is no good flippantly saying that the minister will give out the rules, Premier, because the rules are in legislation. I refer to the person seeking natural justice in 10 years, five years, two years or one year once it has all settled down and the new community is going well and a bad apple turns up. The same problems may arise. The Government will not be able to do anything about it, and it may take a year until the situation builds and the statute returns to Parliament as people seek natural justice and judicial supervision. I urge the Premier to look at the legislation.

7910 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

Dr G.I. GALLOP: I refer the member to clause 7(5), which deals with the point she raised. It reads - The LAA Minister, in an order under the LAA section 46(1) by which the care, control and management of the reserve is placed with a person other than the Authority, may authorise a person, or the holder of an office, specified in the order, to exercise any power set out in subsection (3). Ms S.E. WALKER: It is not a matter of what the minister will direct the administrator to do, but what a person will be denied. It will apply in perpetuity. I hope this issue is taken up in the upper House. Some sunset clause is needed or this Bill needs some review in the not too distant future. Clause put and passed Clause 9: Nature of discretion - Mrs C.L. EDWARDES: Could the Premier advise the purpose of the discretion in clause 9 as linked to clause 10 to disclose any of the reasons? It is a discretion exercised to either refuse entry or throw somebody off the place. The person is not required to give reasons for how the discretion is exercised. What is meant by that? A person is not entitled to expect that a discretion will be exercised in any way. A person is not required to give reasons under clause 10; however, if it is in the public interest to do so, he can disclose all the reasons as exercised under clause 7(3)(a) and (b). I know I am linking clauses 9 and 10 together, but it may save later debate. The SPEAKER: That is reasonable. Dr G.I. GALLOP: I refer to the reasons I gave in relation to clause 8. The same argument applies relating to the necessity to deal with a problem in a decisive way. Mrs C.L. Edwardes: What is meant by how the discretion is exercised? Dr G.I. GALLOP: I am advised that it is whether a person is told to leave or not told to leave. Dr E. CONSTABLE: The Premier mentioned a number of times that the ultimate responsibility is with the minister. I assume that the administrator will be accountable to the minister. Will the person give reasons to the minister and keep records of excluding people or throwing them off the land, or will this person be a law unto himself? If I were a minister - which I probably never will be - I would want some reporting mechanism and record keeping of the activities of the administrator. To follow the Premier’s argument that the minister is ultimately responsible, if the administrator erred in judgment and made a terrible mistake, the minister would be responsible and be sacked. Dr G.I. GALLOP: Yes. Going back to clause 7(2) by which the authority engages a person, it could be under a contract of service or a nominated officer referred to in the Aboriginal Affairs Planning Authority Act 1972. The minister will have an expectation about the nature of the job. In the case of the contract for service, that aspect will be built into the contract. There is a direct relationship with the minister, and, as I keep pointing out, ultimately, the minister has power over the administrator. Mr R.N. SWEETMAN: I continue the point made by the member for Churchlands. The Premier has done everything in his comments in the second reading speech, the explanatory memorandum and in consideration in detail - and my basic interpretation of the legislation has encouraged me to this belief - to maintain that this legislation was the Government’s best way to get rid of the incorporated body. Are options still open to the Premier to do a deal, for want of a better word, with someone else who may be part of the Swan Valley community and who may approach the Premier? Can that person say, “Mr Premier, we’re not the bad people; give us a chance”? Will the Premier have a chance to negotiate an arrangement under which the people could reoccupy the community, and maybe, in the first instance, not leave it? People may point to the local rules as prescribed under the 1975 Act and indicate that they will live rigidly by them - they can hang as a sword of Damocles over their heads. Does that opportunity exist? Is it the case that the problem in the Swan Valley Nyungah Community has been longstanding; therefore, the Government must disband the incorporated body and the connection with everybody else in the reserve? It is like when a council is sacked or a Government is voted out; not only bad members of Parliament are voted out at elections - very good people also are lost. Mr Speaker agrees. The SPEAKER: Very much so. Mr R.N. SWEETMAN: It may be that some good and capable people, if given the right opportunities, could provide the right leadership for the community to prosper. In time, and with some assistance, it could become a model Aboriginal community. Does the legislation contain provision for somebody to put such a proposition to the Premier to regain the tenure and reoccupy the area by undertaking to do certain things? Dr G.I. GALLOP: Technically, it would be possible to do that, but it is certainly not the intention of the Government’s legislation. Our aim is to consult Aboriginal communities of Western Australia about the way the land could be best used in the future. Mr R.F. Johnson: If another Aboriginal group wanted to run the camp, it would have to do so under the authority and the guidance of an administrator?

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7911

Dr G.I. GALLOP: No. That would involve setting up a new management order for the area. It is not our aim and intention to set up another residential community like the one in this case. Mrs C.L. Edwardes: What is the Government’s time frame? Dr G.I. GALLOP: We are dealing with this issue now. The time frame we have is as long as it takes to get a very good result. Mrs C.L. Edwardes: Are we talking about months? Dr G.I. GALLOP: It has not entered our minds what the time frame is. Ms S.E. WALKER: I was thinking about the Premier’s response to the issue I raised that these draconian powers will be available forever to the administrator to use against people who want to go onto the land. The Premier said the minister can tell the administrator which powers he can exercise. Dr G.I. Gallop: It will be a future management body, not the administrator. Ms S.E. WALKER: Please hear me out. The Premier keeps referring to the Bill being a dismantling of a community. I accept that. The Bill goes much further than that. It deals with the transfer of the management of the land to another authority. Along with the transfer, the person who administers it, or his representative, receives enormous powers. People who want to go on to the land will have their basic rights revoked. Let us assume the government changes in the next year or so and a shadow minister wants to go onto the land because he thinks something funny is happening. The administrator can tell him to leave. Nothing can be done by the shadow minister about it under this Bill. People are excluded from the rules of natural justice under this Bill. They cannot obtain a writ of certiorari, mandamus, prohibition or any other prerogative writ. No action in tort is available either. I hope the Premier is listening because my point is important. I accept that there is a valid reason for the dismantling of the community. However, I do not accept that the powers given should continue in perpetuity to affect citizens of Western Australia. It will affect anyone who wants to go onto the land. Mrs C.L. EDWARDES: The debate on clause 7(3) has been on the assumption that we are dealing with individuals and members of the corporation. In fact, clause 7(3)(b), which directs a person to leave the reserve, can be used by the administrator to remove anyone from the reserve. As the Government has indicated, it no longer wants it to be a residential area. One of the competencies that members of Parliament will want is to know how that will occur. Clause 9 states that how it will be done will not be questioned. There may or may not be public reasons for all or any actions. It also means that there should not be any expectation of how the discretion will be referred to. We want to know in advance how people in the community, other than members of the corporation, will be dealt with. How does the Government intend to deal with members of the corporation? Dr G.I. GALLOP: It is clear that the Government wants to look after the interests of the women and children and start to talk to them about their accommodation needs. The powers given to the administrator to remove anyone will be directed against anyone who makes that difficult to occur or who represents a threat to the community. I remind members why the Government is doing this. This is not a normal piece of legislation because we do not face a normal situation. Ms S.E. WALKER: The Premier said it is not a residential community - Dr G.I. Gallop: It is now. Ms S.E. WALKER: Yes, the Premier is right. It is not envisaged to be a residential community; is that what the Premier is saying? Dr G.I. Gallop: In the future. Ms S.E. WALKER: Has the legislation been framed this way so that women and children can stay on the land and undesirables asked to leave? Mrs C.L. Edwardes: What if some women and children do not wish to leave? Dr G.I. GALLOP: The Government is keen to close down the camp. We have to follow through on that. We want to talk to the people there about their housing needs. Our view is that it is not an appropriate situation and the best way to resolve it is to be decisive and deal with it comprehensively. Ms S.E. WALKER: This legislation could work if the women and children stay. What is behind the legislation? There could always be a power for the administrator to direct undesirables to leave. Is that what is really behind this? Dr G.I. GALLOP: We are protecting the rights of women and children; they are part of families. We will work with those families to find appropriate accommodation. Clause put and passed. Clauses 10 and 11 put and passed.

7912 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

Clause 12: Protection from liability - Mrs C.L. EDWARDES: I purposely wanted to jump over clause 11 as it refers to immunity from judicial supervision. Questions about the clause have been answered in the same way as questions about excluding rules of natural justice have been answered. I am sure they are the same reasons the Premier would give for the inclusion of an immunity from judicial review. Has the Premier been advised that liability may flow to the Government as a result of liabilities of the Swan Valley Nyungah Community? Dr G.I. Gallop: It is just a standard provision. Mrs C.L. EDWARDES: Just a standard provision; there is nothing exceptional in it that the Government may take over any of the liabilities that currently vest in the community? Dr G.I. Gallop: It is a matter for the Aboriginal corporations registrar. There are a lot of assets out there. It is a matter in which it will be interested and concerned. Clause put and passed. Title put and passed. Leave granted to proceed forthwith to third reading. Third Reading Bill read a third time, on motion by Dr G.I. Gallop (Premier), and transmitted to the Council.

GAS PIPELINES ACCESS (WESTERN AUSTRALIA) (REVIEWS) AMENDMENT BILL 2003 Receipt Bill received from the Council. PUBLIC TRANSPORT AUTHORITY BILL 2003 Returned Bill returned from the Council with an amendment.

APPROPRIATION (CONSOLIDATED FUND) BILL (NO. 1) 2003 APPROPRIATION (CONSOLIDATED FUND) BILL (NO. 2) 2003 Second Reading - Cognate Debate Resumed from an earlier stage of the sitting. MR B.J. GRYLLS (Merredin) [5.31 pm]: When we broke for lunch, I had just referred to Harvey Water and the issues being faced by the irrigators and their dam safety program. I look forward to the Estimates Committee so that we can question the relevant minister to determine where this issue is heading. The National Party is concerned that the finance for the $100 million dam safety program will become the responsibility of the irrigators, which is a cost burden they simply cannot afford. I turn to the dividend from the Water Corporation, which is the underlying factor in all the issues I have raised under the water portfolio. Many exciting and innovative desalination projects have been put forward for not only Merredin, which is the location of my electorate office, but also Katanning and other areas. I am greatly concerned that the dividend the Government will receive from the Water Corporation will increase from 85 per cent to 92 per cent. The extra $20.1 million that will be taken from the Water Corporation could have been used to fund programs like the Merredin desalination program. The Government will argue that there is not enough money in the Water Corporation to fund such programs. The increased dividend from the Water Corporation will be partly responsible for that. I am disappointed about that, and look forward to raising the matter during the Estimates Committee. I turn to the issue of deep drainage. This morning I spoke with one of the key proponents of a deep drainage plan. Drainage is becoming an innovative and respected way of reducing some of the salinity problems in the wheatbelt. When I visited some properties in the wheatbelt, I saw first-hand the good effects that drainage can have on ground water levels. On several occasions I have spoken to the Minister for the Environment and Heritage about support for deep drainage programs. The budget contains money for engineering evaluations, which are important, but it is also important that some of the money for engineering initiatives finds it way into some of the deep drainage programs. We must let landowners, the Commonwealth Scientific and Industrial Research Organisation and other relevant departments do the work that will prove their engineering methods. I hope that we will be able to achieve good results from deep drainage so that we can attempt to solve the salinity problems in the wheatbelt. Many members on the other side of the House have crowed about the surplus in the budget. However, they have failed to mention that tax increases enabled the delivery of that surplus. If a business goes through its figures, gets to the bottom line and realises it is in deficit, one could hardly call that a surplus arrangement. Most businesses do not have

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7913 the ability to find the extra income that would turn that deficit into a surplus. This time round the Government has not had that problem; it has managed to deliver the surplus through increased tax measures and by reaching into the pockets of Western Australians. That fact has been highlighted by the media; however, members opposite have been coy about it and have not talked about it at great length. The increased taxes will be an impost on business, which is disappointing. Stamp duty on conveyances will increase by 15 per cent. There has been a lot of talk about the housing sector and how it is helping to prop up the state budget. Conveyances also apply to the transfer of businesses, farms and the like. It is of great concern that these businesses will be slapped with a 15 per cent increase in conveyances. The other tax grab in this budget is the stamp duty on insurance premiums, which will increase from eight per cent to 10 per cent. That is particularly disappointing, because I have engaged in many long hours of debate in this House about reducing the cost of insurance premiums. The Government has taken away people’s rights and has legislated to restrict their ability to sue. Caps and thresholds have been placed on claims in an attempt to reduce insurance premiums, and that will come at a cost. I am sure that the media will provide examples of injured people who claim recompense for their injuries. The legislation introduced by the Government, and supported by the House, will mean that people will not be able to claim what they believe is a fair amount. That had to be done to get the insurance industry back on track and to make insurance affordable so that community groups and individuals can go about their lives in an acceptable and affordable way. The member for Rockingham, who is in the Chamber, has taken the lead on this issue. We have engaged one another during debate on the insurance issue and have come up with some good results. He must have been concerned when this issue went through the party room and Cabinet, because stamp duty on insurance was singled out for a two per cent increase, and that flies in the face of what we sought to achieve with the legislation that was passed by Parliament. That is rank hypocrisy. It is disappointing that although we have reduced people’s ability to sue in the hope that there will be a downward pressure on premiums, the Government has whacked a tax on it that will serve to increase premiums. Mr E.S. Ripper: By less than two per cent. Mr B.J. GRYLLS: It may be less than two per cent for the minister, but that is the cost impost. It is disappointing that the insurance industry was singled out when so much work had been done in this House to try to change the long established laws that allowed people to claim compensation for injury. That is now being taken back with the other hand through a tax grab. Another issue that was not announced in the budget - it was announced previously - was the single rate of payroll tax. Although this issue has already been debated, it must go on the record again that half of the approximately 8 000 businesses in Western Australia that pay payroll tax will see an increase in their payroll tax - Mr E.S. Ripper: Forty per cent; 60 per cent will be winners. Mr B.J. GRYLLS: Half - that is 4 000 - Mr E.S. Ripper: You are leaving out the ones that will be exempt from payroll tax altogether. Mr B.J. GRYLLS: I do not have the time to engage in that debate. On top of the increases in stamp duty on insurance and conveyancing, many businesses in Western Australia face increased taxes. The Government has used increased taxes to raise revenue and to bring in a budget surplus. Members on the other side of the House have not crowed loudly about that point. Another point I want to touch on comes under my business portfolio, and that is the deregulation of trading hours. I take the opportunity to explain to some of the members on the other side of the House part of the reasoning behind the position I have taken on this, because when interjecting they tell me that it will affect not businesses in regional Western Australia but those in metropolitan Perth. I would like the members who say this to understand that the reason deregulation of trading hours will affect businesses in my electorate of Merredin is that if the Midland Gate Shopping Centre is open after hours on a Sunday afternoon when people from the country have driven to Perth to visit members of their family, to watch the Eagles or to have a weekend off, they will have the opportunity to spend money at the shopping centre. Mr E.S. Ripper: Do you want to make life more inconvenient for your constituents? Mr B.J. GRYLLS: What will be inconvenient is when the Midland Gate Shopping Centre has all their business and they do not have a small supermarket in their own town in which to do their shopping, because then they would have to travel to Midland Gate Shopping Centre. This is a critical issue. The Treasurer by way of interjection shows how ignorant he is of the flow-on effect that the deregulation of trading hours will have in Western Australia. Mr E.S. Ripper: I am concerned that you are not supporting your constituents’ right to choose. Mr B.J. GRYLLS: I would be supporting this if there were a level playing field, but I do not see a level playing field. We will see a Woolworths supermarket that has attached to it a liquor shop, a petrol station, a bank and a newsagency. Woolworths will dominate the market. The small players that do not have the buying or advertising power or the ability to grossly undercut the market will be wiped out. It is as simple as that. We have seen it before and we will see it again. The big players will use their market power to distort the market. The small independents will be at a distinct

7914 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] disadvantage. If the Treasurer can come up with some solution to stop the big majors from using their market power to put unneeded pressure onto small independents, he will find much more support for his move to deregulate trading hours. Where trading hours have been deregulated in Port Hedland in the north of the State, big multinationals have used deregulation - Mr E.S. Ripper: Our review will examine all options. Mr B.J. GRYLLS: I am glad that it will. The Government has received over 1 400 submissions, of which probably 1 300 are against deregulation because most of them come from regional Western Australia, where the issues have been clearly framed. Big companies use deregulation to exert their market power, and small independents go out of business. The big companies then wind back their hours, so the customers get no benefit from extra hours. However, the small independents and the big companies’ competition in the market will have been wiped out. It has happened before and it will happen again. I turn to tourism, which is another issue of great concern at the moment. The severe acute respiratory syndrome virus is causing a big decrease in the number of travellers who are visiting Western Australia. This creates a lot of opportunities, because not only will travellers from overseas not come to Western Australia but also a lot of Western Australians who would normally travel overseas will decide to travel within Western Australia. The member for Albany’s electorate will benefit from this. It means that many Australians who would have travelled overseas will decide to travel within the State. That is good for the electorate of Albany. On the weekend I was at Esperance, which is a fantastic destination. The same applies to the wheatbelt; it has some good tourist destinations. I hope that this Labor Government will be focusing on these opportunities to make sure that the required promotion is done to attract dollars to be spent in regional Western Australia. Whatever is lost from the international downturn as a result of the SARS virus and its flow-on effect hopefully can be made up by an increase in domestic travel so that tourism operators can maintain an even keel. I read an article from the tourism peak body in which it compared the SARS virus to the drought in the wheatbelt. That is probably a fair comparison, because the SARS virus would be having a significant effect on the tourism industry. This Parliament needs to be aware that the tourism industry is an important part of our community and needs to be supported. I represent the electorate of Merredin with great pride. As I said earlier, Merredin has had very good rain over the past week. The season is shaping up to be much better than the one last year. Mr J.B. D’Orazio: Did Merredin get rain during the week? Mr B.J. GRYLLS: Yes, Merredin had rain during the week and it is raining there now. Mr P.B. Watson: The Gallop Labor Government delivers again! Mr B.J. GRYLLS: I wish it could guarantee to deliver rain. The member for Bunbury tried yesterday to assure me that he could deliver rain, but I have yet to take him up on that offer. It would certainly be of great advantage to us if he could achieve that. On the day after the budget was brought down, The West Australian indicated that tax increases for most Western Australian households would be about $83 a year. The Government is clearly putting them in place to make sure it can deliver extra services in health, education and policing. Obviously, this sort of spending needs to be supported. However, the people of Merredin want to know how that extra $83 a year that they will be paying will deliver extra services to them. Mr A.J. Dean: What tax is it? Mr B.J. GRYLLS: There are increases in water, sewerage and drainage, drivers licence fees, various recording fees, third party car insurance fees and stamp duty on general and compulsory third party insurance, which means the annual household expenditure will go up by $83.78. That is according to the front-page article in The West Australian. I want to outline how these increased charges will benefit the people of Merredin. I turn first to the health portfolio, because health is probably the most critical issue on everybody’s mind. Health spending is growing at six to seven per cent a year. The Government is committed to increasing health expenditure by $1.3 billion over the next three years. How much of the increase in health expenditure will flow into regional Western Australia is our great concern. That is the issue that we want to flesh out during the Estimates Committee hearings. It is of great concern when people in towns like Wyalkatchem are continually hearing rumours that their hospital is to be the subject of a downgrade. No matter what we do to try to get the health minister to reassure the people of Wyalkatchem that their hospital will not close, constant rumours and innuendo still persist. I hope that the extra $83 of tax that those people will pay will mean that they can still go to a local hospital and access its services. I refer to some of the comments that the member for Stirling made during his speech. He referred to a really important idea. He said that there is no doubt that many health resources are situated in country Western Australia and that average bed occupancy figures are lower than those in the metropolitan area. There is no doubt that areas like Peel and the growing areas on the coastal fringe need extra money put into their health budgets. No-one in the wheatbelt would argue with that. However, we argue that our budget should not be raped and pillaged in order to prop up their budgets.

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7915

Mr P.B. Watson: Your constituents had a very good run last year. Mr B.J. GRYLLS: This is the issue that is happening. One of the points I want to raise is that the wheatbelt has extra bed capacity. The member for Stirling spoke about using the patient assisted travel scheme not merely to bring patients to the city in order to access services. We could do it back to front. We could provide country hospitals with areas of expertise so that city people could access, say, a hospital in a wheatbelt town for medical services, instead of waiting for long periods on a list in Perth. We would have to make sure that the doctors in those towns had the skills to perform those services. We could operate a reverse patient assisted travel scheme so that people could fly to and from the towns to access the services they required. This scheme could be taken up by the Government. I will continue to flesh it out. Another issue, which is obviously a federal issue, is the number of places at universities for medical students. It is of great concern to me that it is difficult to attract doctors to regional Western Australia. The point I make, which many members do not understand, is that when 120 students graduate from the medical school in WA they have a choice of where to work. Although I love the wheatbelt and think it is the greatest place in the world in which to live, obviously many students graduating from medical school do not think so. That is one reason that we are increasingly relying on overseas-trained doctors. Currently Merredin has three Nigerian doctors supplying services to the Merredin District Hospital. Mr J.B. D’Orazio: That is a disgrace! Mr B.J. GRYLLS: It is a fantastic result for Merredin that we have doctors, but I agree that it is a disgrace. I am currently working on a bonded scholarship scheme - which is nothing new - to bond students to a town. The Shire of Merredin has spent more than $1 million in the past five years trying to attract doctors to regional Western Australia with packages that include houses, surgeries and cars. It still cannot attract doctors and has to bring them in from overseas. I have not yet mentioned to the Shire of Merredin council that I am working on a scheme to get the council to provide a fraction of that amount to help fund a place at the University of Western Australia or at the new medical school at the University of Notre Dame Australia. The shire could then bond the student who received the medical scholarship to the town for a period. We have gone quite a way with this scheme. I have had meetings with the medical school and next week I have a meeting with the Australian Medical Association. The scheme will not be easy to implement. It will involve federal cooperation, which we are hoping to get, but perhaps it will lead to an increase in the number of places in the medical school. I turn now to police. I have a real concern about some of the smaller police stations in country WA. A town that has a one-man or two-man police station does not necessarily have a police presence. Police officers work a 38-hour week, which is fine; I have no problem with that. However, when training schemes, holidays and the like are factored into that week, it is rare to find a police officer on duty. I could fill many files with letters that have come to my office about the problem of the lack of police in regional WA. I note in this budget that there is a commitment for more police officers. We hope that a commitment by the people of Merredin to pay extra taxes and charges will lead to more police in the wheatbelt. Education is another critical issue. The school bus industry has played an important role in getting country students to school. I was brought up going to school on the orange school buses. That industry is currently under great pressure and is still struggling to come up with a deal to go forward. I urge the Government and the minister responsible to bring a quick and satisfactory end to the long-running stand-off in this industry, so that school bus drivers can get back to doing what they do best - transport kids to and from school - rather than spending inordinate amounts of time driving back and forth to Perth to attend meetings to sort out their industry. I was happy to hear that the member for Wagin had a meeting the other day with people from the Department of Education and Training to discuss district high schools. The high schools in some towns in my electorate are getting close to the cut-off point for district high school status and are likely to lose that status. They will then fall back to the status of primary school, which would be absolutely devastating for those towns. We must look at a different way of calculating the cut-off point to keep these district high schools open. It is an issue for a small school of five or seven pupils to be closed down. It is important for kids to have a peer group, but it is quite another issue to downgrade a high school just because it does not have 70 or more students. My time is short. I turn now to power, which is a major issue in the wheatbelt. Western Power has an ageing infrastructure line. The strong winds of the last year and general wear and tear on the line over time have resulted in major problems in the wheatbelt. More than 300 written complaints have been made to the energy safety directorate about power fluctuations, power blackouts and the time it takes to get faults repaired. This is an ongoing issue. I note in the budget that $2.8 million will be allocated to pole upgrades. However, $2.8 million is not enough to rectify the problem. In the past three months my home town of Corrigin has had two serious accidents involving cars that had their roofs removed by fallen power lines. This is not only a power issue but also a safety issue. The member for Stirling talked about Telstra offering to refund money to its customers when phone lines are down for a time. Perhaps Western Power should move to a similar system. When the power goes off, it can be off for three or four days for some customers. However, those people have no recourse; it is simply bad luck for them. We must consider giving some recompense to people who suffer being without power for long periods.

7916 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

Roads are a critical issue. I do not have to tell anyone in the electorate of Merredin, or anywhere else in country WA, that the building of the railway to Mandurah is taking all road funding in the budget. The increase in road funding this year is mainly to fund the building of bridges for the Perth to Mandurah railway line. This project has vast opposition in my electorate. Mr D.A. Templeman: It is an absolute appalling thing to do! Mr B.J. GRYLLS: I will tell the member for Mandurah why. Let us forget about what the $1.4 billion could do for all the issues that I have spoken about, such as roads and so on. It will cost $100 million a year to finance this railway - $60 million to repay the loans and $40 million for an operating subsidy. There are many better ways in which we could spend that money. Mr D.A. Templeman interjected Mr B.J. GRYLLS: I cannot believe that the member for Mandurah would happily advocate this vast spending, when health, education and police in his electorate could do so much more with it. The member for Mandurah can yell at me as much as he wants to, but I tell him that there is vast opposition to this project. Mr D.A. Templeman interjected. The SPEAKER: The member for Mandurah is normally quiet but he is not quiet this evening. We wish to proceed with this debate as quickly as possible. Mr B.J. GRYLLS: The member for Mandurah can yell and rant all he wants, but the bottom line is that I am more passionate about spending $1.4 billion in areas where it will provide a benefit. We talk about subsidising country Western Australians. The Perth to Mandurah railway will subsidise every user of that railway by between $3 500 and $5 000 each a year. If we advocated expenditure of that magnitude on the people of country Western Australia, the member for Mandurah would go feral. One thing I can say about trains, though, is that the National Party welcomes the proposed upgrade of the Prospector service. Being a member who finds it difficult to get to his electorate, as I have a three-hour drive every time I go to my office, I hope that we can cut that time with a high-speed Prospector service. For sure, I will be one of the users of that service if it gets off the ground. I will draw my comments on this budget to a close. The agricultural budget again has been slashed. I have said this before in Parliament and I say it again: regional WA needs the Government to go back out to the regions and make large capital injections like the Government at the turn of the century did when it built roads and pipelines and really invigorated the region. The State has been recouping the benefits of that cash injection for the past 100 years. Western Australia has benefited enormously from the growth in agricultural and mining production in the regions. Western Australian agricultural exports are worth $3.5 billion. It is responsible for 40 per cent of Australia’s grain exports, 25 per cent of its wool exports, 31 per cent of its vegetable exports and 60 per cent of its live animal exports. Agriculture in Western Australia is a critical industry that is being left to die the death of a thousand cuts. My challenge as a member from the wheatbelt is to encourage the Government to reinvigorate spending in this region. If I had $1.4 billion in capital and $100 million a year in recurrent expenditure for regional Western Australia, we could come up with some fantastic reinvigoration of those regions. There would be enough money flowing from that reinvigoration to build railways of the sort the member for Mandurah wants in four different directions out of Perth. The Government has not done that. It has spent the $1.4 billion on the railway. That money is now gone. The $100 million it will cost to run that railway is a debt the State will have to carry for ever and a day. Regional Western Australia continues without any cash injection. I do not know how members opposite expect the State to continue to grow when they continually ignore that sector and leave it up to regional WA to develop the simple infrastructure projects, like power, water and roads. If I had $1.4 billion to spend, I could produce enough growth to guarantee the member for Mandurah his railway. We would have growth in the regions as well, and the State as a whole would be better off, not just the electorate of the member for Mandurah. The mistake being made in this budget is spending $1.4 billion on the railway. It is a one-off project that will not continue to return the dividends that this State needs. MR A.J. DEAN (Bunbury) [6.02 pm]: I love following the physiocrats of the National Party. They think the accumulated wisdom of the country resides with them. However, there are more Labor Party members in the country than there are National Party members. It is worth thinking about. I will reflect a bit on last year’s budget, because it was very important in setting the scene for this year’s budget. I am not making any disparaging comments about members opposite here, but budgets seem to create a cargo cult mentality in politicians. An aeroplane flies over their electorate and drops goodies, and they all run around and pick them up and then crow about the cargo they have collected. I will continue in that vein, but I am not a worshipper of cargo cults. Some things in last year’s budget have come to fruition only in this calendar year. I must declare an interest here, because my wife is a primary school teacher. One of the items in last year’s budget provided for 305 additional primary school teachers in years 1 to 3, to reduce the classes sizes to 24. This is a very commendable exercise. Anyone who has ever taught a class of 28 to 32 year 1, 2 or 3 pupils will know what a difference smaller class sizes can make to the

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7917 outcomes of early childhood education. Those early years are when the real difference can be made. This is one of the features of last year’s budget, but my wife and the other primary school teachers of the south west would like to express their gratitude to the Government. Apart from the Catholic college, I have two contrasting high schools in my electorate. One is Newton Moore Senior High School and the other is Bunbury Senior High School. Newton Moore is situated in a lower socioeconomic area than Bunbury, and the $100 reduction in fees for all secondary students has made a major impact on that school. One of the things I found in the first two years as a member of Parliament was the number of parents coming to me complaining about fees and how to meet them. With the reduction of $100 per secondary student, I have not had one person from either Bunbury Senior High School or Newton Moore come to see me seeking solutions for paying their fees. Most of the parents have met those fees, and collections of voluntary fees have not fallen off in those schools. Also in last year’s budget, 117 full-time equivalents were allocated to the Getting It Right literacy and numeracy project. That brings the figure to 157 since Labor came to government. Last year’s budget also brought in the behaviour management system, of which Newton Moore Senior High School was a beneficiary I will now look at the future of education in Bunbury, which is very bright, with money in the budget for two primary schools. One is Djidi Djidi, which is a purpose-built Aboriginal school. I have seen the plans and I believe the contract has been let and may have gone to a local builder. Felicity Dear is the principal there, and I praise her for the work she does with the Nyoongah community in Bunbury. Bunbury is a difficult community to work in sometimes, and working in the Nyoongah community there is particularly rewarding. The new certified enterprise bargaining agreement is also coming up in the budget. Teachers are realistic; they know that their ambit claim of 10 per cent will not be met, but they will be looking to this Government to honour an unstated promise that values teachers in a big way. I particularly commend the Minister for Education and Training and the Premier for introducing the Western Australian Teacher of the Year award. That tells teachers a lot. Mr J.L. Bradshaw: The problem with the Teacher of the Year award is that most teachers miss out on it. That is why I am not mad about awards, because there are so many people out there doing fantastic jobs. Mr A.J. DEAN: The selection process with be an octopus-type thing spread over the year, so that many teachers will receive the recognition of being nominated for the award. My wife was nominated for a national teacher of the year award, and reached the finals of that. The nomination means that a teacher is recognised by his or her peers, and by parents. It is not so much winning the prize as the recognition it brings. This Government has given teachers and other professionals like nurses and police the due recognition they need. I will turn now to the environment. Bunbury’s is a marine environment. The city is surrounded on three sides by water: the Leschenault Inlet, and the Indian Ocean in the north and west. It is a very fragile environment, particularly the primary dune system. In this budget for the environment - I am including water in that category - we have $4.4 million to spend through the Aqwest-Bunbury Water Board, to upgrade its water treatment facilities. Bunbury, as members know, has its own independent water board, which is in a particularly healthy financial condition, with something like $35 million in cash reserves. It is able to finance its upgrades entirely from its internal reserves, with no government funding. The Leschenault Peninsula is one of the Premier’s favourite election promises. He was down there before the election, and has been there numerous times after, making sure that that election promise is carried out. The budget provides for $1.1 million over the next two years to upgrade Belvedere and Buffalo beaches. Despite what the Opposition says, infill sewerage is alive and active in Bunbury and the south west and continues to grow. Bunbury will receive its fair share from the $33.3 million infill sewerage program this year. The Bunbury Port Authority probably does not export much material that is produced in the city of Bunbury itself; in fact, zero per cent of its exports come from Bunbury. However, it is a regional facility. As such, it provides a service to the hinterland. The budget provides $11 million to the Bunbury Port Authority, which will go towards upgrading the container facilities and conveyor belts at the port, and constructing new roads, so that the people from electorates such as Merredin, Murray-Wellington and Collie can export their produce through the port of Bunbury. It is a fairly vigorous port. One of the major issues in Bunbury at the moment is the deregulation of trading hours. I have made my position on this issue clear; I am against the deregulation of trading hours. I was heavily involved with junior cricket and football when Saturday afternoon trading was introduced in Bunbury in the early 1990s. The extended trading hours decimated the junior teams, particularly the under 14 age bracket, because many players became trolley boys, checkout chicks and so forth. Quite a few of those teams did not exist for a few years, because they could not get the numbers. As we know, the member for Mitchell has been spreading half-truths about the Government’s intention in country areas. He fails to mention that he is an ex-employee of the federal member for Forrest, who owns one of the biggest shopping centres in the south west. The member for Mitchell supports the deregulation of shopping hours. That is on the record. He supports the Shire of Dardanup - an area within his electorate - because its planning scheme allows for 24-7 trading hours. It has not invoked 24-hour trading, but it has certainly invoked seven-day trading. It must worry small businesses in the Bunbury region that a shire such as this has that provision on its books. I recently asked the City of Bunbury to make its position clear on this issue, because the decision on how to treat seven-day trading really falls to it.

7918 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

The City of Bunbury will hopefully make its position clear in a couple of weeks. I believe the heat will go out of the situation when it does, because I am sure it will take the advice of the Bunbury Chamber of Commerce and Industry and be against seven-day trading. I have spoken now for 10 minutes so I am getting the hairy eye from a few members. My final point is on housing in Bunbury. Carey Park and Withers are old Ministry of Housing estates that are being revamped. This year’s budget provides $3.82 million to refurbish 87 houses and 18 blocks in those estates. Sometimes the owners of those homes move back in, but often they move on. The properties are then on-sold. This project has reinvigorated Carey Park. The impact on Withers must be seen to be believed. The Treasurer has a very difficult job in restraining expenditure. Sometimes we must take that pain. Bunbury is certainly taking its fair share of the pain of restrained expenditure. I thank members for listening. MR M. McGOWAN (Rockingham - Parliamentary Secretary) [6.13 pm]: I congratulate the Treasurer on his effort to produce the budget. One thing that must be said about the Treasurer is that he devotes an enormous amount of effort to producing a budget that provides a surplus, despite the numerous pressures on government to provide funds to a range of areas. It has been a salutary lesson to have a specific minister allocated as Treasurer. That is a good and proper thing for a Government to do. In the coalition Government, the Premier was also the Treasurer, which made it enormously difficult for him to restrict the spending proclivities of his ministers. I suspect that he did not have the time, or perhaps even the inclination, to ensure that spending within his ministers’ portfolios was kept within their means. Accordingly, the State faced those now infamous budget deficits for five of the eight years in which the Court Government held office. It was an enlightened move to appoint a Treasurer to manage this considerable specific responsibility. That arrangement now applies in all the States. It is a very good decision of any Government. I thank the Treasurer and the Government for the amount of spending that has been allocated to the Rockingham area. For some time the Rockingham community has felt that it was missing out on a range of government facilities and resources. However, the 2003-04 budget allocation for the Rockingham-Kwinana Health Service upgrade is much overdue and eagerly awaited by members of the community. The budget allocation for the rail line, which is much maligned by the Opposition, is welcomed by the 80 000-plus people who live within the boundaries of my constituency. I am very pleased to be part of a Government that will construct that historic infrastructure in the area. Other budget initiatives include upgrades of local high schools. New primary schools have been built and major water recycling and water treatment plant upgrades have been done at the Woodman Point treatment plant. There is also the continued development of the infill sewerage scheme. I am very happy with government spending and budget allocations in my electorate. I suspect that my constituency is also very happy that a Government has finally recognised the demands of the extremely fast-growing southern corridor of this city. The Government has been spending an increasing amount of money on education and community services. However, I want to talk about an aspect of drug abuse, which, in many ways, does not receive much attention in the media. It certainly has not received much attention from academia. I am referring to volatile substance abuse, also known as chroming, glue sniffing or petrol sniffing. Not enough studies or investigations of this practice have been undertaken by the people who have the capacity to do those studies, so information on this largely hidden but awful problem is scarce. I recently spent some time driving around my electorate with an ambulance crew observing their routine. We came across a young man of about 18 years of age who was incapacitated. He had been chroming - in other words, sniffing the fumes that built up in a plastic bag after spraying paint into it. He was lying in a culvert that had a drain running alongside of it. It was quite distressing to observe the state he was in. He was well known to the ambulance officers. They told me that a group of young people engages in this practice around the city. It was very distressing to see his behaviour and his lack of capacity. I felt that this was an issue that probably needed more attention across the country. It came to some notoriety in Rockingham in 1997 or 1998 when a photograph appeared on the front page of The West Australian of a young woman inhaling paint through a plastic bag covering her face. I understand that she subsequently died. Following that, an incident occurred in Warnbro, a suburb of Rockingham, in which a young man died as a result of sudden sniffing syndrome - when a person’s heart stops after sniffing a volatile substance. This is a problem across all communities in Perth, and probably Australia for that matter. Petrol and other volatile substances are certainly a problem to Aboriginal communities. It is an issue with which we must deal. People who abuse these substances have a range of substances available to them, which makes it very difficult to outlaw their procurement. Other States have attempted to do that and have put in place measures in relation to young people purchasing certain products that they can abuse, and I will go over them shortly. This problem reflects the fact that many young people in particular have a sense of hopelessness about their place in society. They have a sense of alienation and a feeling that they come from families or communities that do not care about them. As a consequence, their relief or perhaps their only sense of pleasure is to extricate themselves from that community, that family and that dysfunctionality by inhaling these substances and going on some sort of a depressant trip that relieves them of the burden of dealing with reality. In many ways, one of the simple and straightforward solutions to this problem is to create a better community and a better society, which most of us feel is our purpose in

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7919 this place. It is a kind of utopia - the light on the hill - that we are all working towards. However, there are some specific things that this Government can do that I will go over shortly. Most young people engaging in this activity do so in a transitory way and end up ceasing the habit. However, there are some medium-term and long-term users of these volatile substances. A couple of studies have been done on the matter. One was carried out in Victoria and is entitled “Inquiry into the Inhalation of Volatile Substances”. A recent study was done in Western Australia but the rest of the evidence in this area dates back to the 1980s. These studies have shown that approximately 3.9 per cent of Australians have used volatile substances and about 0.8 per cent of Australians have abused volatile substances in the past 12 months. Large numbers of young people, particularly those aged 10 to 14 years, have been hospitalised because of their use of volatile substances. A 1996 study found that 32 per cent of 12- year-olds had tried inhalation and volatile substance abuse. In September 2001, a study was carried out in Western Australia entitled “Volatile substance abuse: background paper”. It found that in 1999 in Western Australia, in the 15 to 19 year-old-age group, eight young people died as a consequence of using volatile substances. Some deaths were attributed to suicide and others to accidental poisoning, which can occur through accidents or as a consequence of abusing the substances. We all know that these substances can cause brain damage, liver and kidney damage, the sudden cessation of a person’s heart, burst blood vessels and can cause people to choke on their vomit. They can also result in a permanent lowering of IQ levels. Therefore, a lifetime of problems can result from using these substances as a young person. The current strategies are known as harm minimisation. Police in Western Australia can seize the inhalants from a person in question - that action is not available to police in all States - and take the young person into custody for his or her own protection. I support both measures. I do not support criminalising this activity. All evidence suggests that criminalising such activity would make the circumstances worse. It would ensure that young persons who might engage in the activity come into contact with the system and undertake the activity more in the future. Everybody agrees that to criminalise this activity would be a mistake. I take a couple of minutes now to go over some actions we can take. Young people can be taken into custody in Western Australia for their own protection, and materials can be seized from people engaged in the activity. Those actions should continue. Also, a cooperative approach could be adopted with places that sell such material, including hardware stores and supermarkets. Codes of practice should be worked on as a matter of urgent priority. In other States, the most highly used materials are on occasions put in locked cabinets in places of purchase. We should work on that action as part of a code of practice in Western Australia. It is an offence in Victoria, South Australia and the Northern Territory to sell to juveniles materials that could be reasonably suspected to be used for inhalation. We should consider that measure in Western Australia. Admittedly, it would put the onus on shopkeepers to make such a judgment, but it would make them think before selling the commonly sold materials to juveniles for inhalation. It would be a difficult offence to prove. It would put an onus on people selling the substances to consider that the material sold could lead to the deaths of susceptible young people. Specific education measures can be put in place. That is probably the principal area of action. Education is difficult in such areas because many people say that if young people are educated about solvent abuse, it is more likely they will use the material; that is, if it is made known that people can get high on certain material, it is more likely they will use the material. I accept that that is the case in some circumstances. However, various studies I cited earlier indicate that various categories of people are involved. There are people who have never used and others who are known users. Specific measures are needed for the two groups. Classroom education measures could essentially not educate young people who have never used about the so-called pleasurable consequences of inhalation abuse, but provide a form of occupational health and safety education. This would inform them that the materials are a poison. The other category of people could be provided with education on product safety, first aid and fire safety around the substances. Advice from Massachusetts and Victoria indicates that if young people are informed that these things are poisonous, they are far less likely to use them. I advocate conducting our own study in Western Australia to separate the two groups and provide them each with different forms of education. One group would have no education and the other would be informed that these materials are poisonous and an occupational health and safety issue. Of course, the education program would not give them advice on how they might use the materials. As a consequence, some young people’s lives might be saved. We should treat this issue seriously. Young people have died and will continue to die. It is an issue whereby people will suffer from damage for the remainder of their lives. This Government and society must address it. MS J.A. RADISICH (Swan Hills) [6.30 pm]: Time is limited tonight and I regret that I will not be able to do justice to the full spectrum of activities that are occurring in my electorate. However, I draw to the attention of the House some initiatives that are currently being pursued or discussed within the electorate of Swan Hills. An important issue with which the electorate is faced is speeding, particularly on Great Eastern Highway. This is not a new issue; it has probably been around for as long as the hill and ever since cars were created. However, a group of concerned residents have reinvigorated this debate, which I welcome wholeheartedly. The stretch of Great Eastern Highway to which I refer is between Glen Forrest and Mundaring. The speed limit on that segment of the road is 90 kilometres an hour, which is convenient for many people who commute along it daily. Often when I am in a rush to get to Mundaring or elsewhere in the hills -

7920 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

Ms A.J. MacTiernan: Don’t confess anything; anything you say now can and will be used against you. Ms J.A. RADISICH: I would only ever drive at the 90-kilometre-an-hour speed limit on that portion of the road. Speeding is a fact in our society, and it causes accidents. The problem with the speed limit on this portion of the road is the vehicle mix. Passenger vehicles share the highway with very heavy vehicles that transport goods critical to our economy and food supplies. The driveways of some residents who live on that portion of the road come right on to the highway where they are faced with a 90-kilometre-an-hour speed limit, which can put them in a worrying position. Some residents in my electorate had an idea to change the speed limit on that part of the highway to 70 kilometres an hour. That idea has some support from some segments of the community. However, other groups in the electorate have a different view. Another proposal that has been suggested in the context of the debate we are having is for a greater speed mix whereby passenger vehicles would travel at 70 or 80 kilometres an hour and trucks would be forced to travel at 40 or 50 kilometres an hour. Problems would occur if different vehicles travelled at different speeds. The important point I stress, which I have stressed to my constituents throughout the debate, is that we must make a sensible choice based on all the facts available to us. One of the statistics that has been expressed is that seven per cent of the accidents that occur on that portion of the highway are due to speed. That is not satisfactory. However, in the broader context, that means that 93 per cent of accidents are caused by other factors. Those factors could include driver inattention, carelessness or any number of other factors that can contribute to road accidents. The community must pursue this issue with the assistance and support of Main Roads to make a factual determination from an engineering point of view of what a more appropriate speed regime might be on that section of the highway. That also is necessary so that we can balance the interests and concerns of not only the residents who live on that section of the highway and who must drive out into traffic travelling at that speed, but also those who commute through the area and the other residents in the hills hamlets who use the highway on a regular basis. I commend the members of the community who have decided that this is an important issue that we need to address. I want to work with them to ensure we achieve an outcome that is practical, sensible and responsible. I hope we can prevent more accidents on this portion of the road and on all our roads. The minister responsible for road safety, the Minister for Planning and Infrastructure and many other ministers with relevant portfolios pay a great deal of attention to making sure that accidents are minimised and that drivers do the right thing on our roads. On this occasion we need to have a good look at whether the current regime is the best regime. That may or may not be the case. That is one issue the hills portion of my electorate is facing. I will quickly go to the flats, proverbially speaking, and touch base with some of the other activities in my electorate. I am getting carried away, but that will always happen with an electorate of 35 suburbs and 31 000 electors. I am pleased that Mandy O’Brien, a member of the Ellenbrook community and an absolutely amazing woman who puts her heart and soul into any activity in our area, has initiated the Ellenbrook community support group. I am very excited at the way that is coming along. It will hold its inaugural annual general meeting in the next week or two. If the Ellenbrook community support group turns out to be anything like the Hills Community Support Group, we will have another wonderful organisation within our community. The budget has brought many benefits to the community in and around the Swan Hills electorate. These include the continued works on the upgrade of Upper Swan Primary School, the establishment of the new school at Charlotte’s Vineyard in Ellenbrook and the upgrade of the emergency department and new observation ward at Swan District Hospital. A number of nurses have returned to that hospital as part of the Minister for Health’s initiative to encourage nurses back into the hospitals. That is absolutely fantastic, and I am very glad that that is the case. The people in my community support their hospital and our health system. I recently conducted a magazine drive to try to provide some reading materials for people and patients who get very bored sitting in hospitals and waiting rooms. A number of kind people collected all their old books and magazines - all sorts of reading material - and brought them into my office to be redistributed. That is absolutely fantastic. I asked members of the community to provide recent magazines, but some I was given featured things such as the Atari 500! Mr R.F. Johnson: You could provide some copies of Hansard. Ms J.A. RADISICH: That would keep people occupied for hours, but not necessarily interested. Ms A.J. MacTiernan: It would save on sleeping pills. Ms J.A. RADISICH: This speech has gone past my limit. Ms K. Hodson-Thomas: We have enjoyed it. Ms J.A. RADISICH: I thank the member. I will speak further in the third reading debate and elucidate for the House some of the continued activities in my electorate, many of which are supported by funding from state government

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7921 portfolios. That funding is much appreciated by the different community groups and police officers, schoolteachers, Main Roads workers and other public service providers within my electorate. Question put and passed. Bill (Appropriation (Consolidated Fund) Bill (No. 1) 2003) read a second time. Pursuant to Standing Order No 222, Bill and estimates referred to Estimates Committees A and B.

APPROPRIATION (CONSOLIDATED FUND) BILL (NO. 2) 2003 Second Reading Resumed from 8 May. Question put and passed. Bill read a second time. Pursuant to Standing Order No 222, Bill and estimates referred to Estimates Committees A and B.

PUBLIC TRANSPORT AUTHORITY BILL 2003 Council’s Amendment Amendment made by the Council now considered. Consideration in Detail The amendment made by the Council was as follows - Page 18, line 27 - To insert after “request” - except where under paragraph (b) the document is to be laid before either House of Parliament by its own order Ms A.J. MacTIERNAN: I move - That the amendment made by the Council be agreed to. The member for Carine, the opposition spokesperson on transport matters, has asked me to make clear what is behind this amendment. It was moved by Hon Peter Foss QC. It is aimed at modifying a provision that the Government included in the Public Transport Authority Bill to improve transparency. The Government set out in the Bill a strong regime of tabling documents before the Parliament because it believes that, whenever possible, such documents and contractual obligations of government should be made public. We also wanted to acknowledge that there were times and phases in negotiation of contracts when there was a particular commercial sensitivity. We put in a provision that the Public Transport Authority would, from time to time, have the capacity to approach the minister to ask that before tabling a document, certain exclusions were made of material that might be considered commercially sensitive. We put in an unprecedented clause that stated that those aspects would be excluded only if the Auditor General had given an independent certification that the items were commercially sensitive. We were bending over backwards to improve the transparency of the process and the degree to which documents are declared without compromising the interests of the public. Hon Peter Foss QC was concerned that, in some way, it might impinge on parliamentary privilege such that if, for example, the Legislative Council orders the tabling of a document, the Auditor General’s process might interfere with the document being tabled in its fullness. We were keen to persuade Hon Peter Foss QC that there would be some benefit in allowing us to go down the route in which we would obtain the Auditor General’s opinion and certificate but not in any way fetter the Parliament in its ultimate decision as to whether it wants a document revealed in full. We were unable to persuade him of the merit of that argument. However, in the interests of getting this important piece of legislation through the Parliament, we will agree to the amendment. The amendment means that if one of the Chambers of the Parliament has ordered the production of a document, it will not be open to us to go to the Auditor General and seek this independent certificate. I think that is a bit of a shame. I agree that ultimately it should be the Parliament’s decision as to whether it wants a document to be revealed in full. I would have preferred for us at all times to be able to get that independent advice before we did that. However, that is not to be. Nevertheless, I do not think there is any great damage in the amendment. We certainly have no intention or instinct to want to conceal documents that should be made public. Therefore, we will agree to the amendment. Ms K. HODSON-THOMAS: I thank the minister for that clarification. I have not had the opportunity to talk to Hon Peter Foss about this amendment. The minister has given quite a good clarification of the clause that Hon Peter Foss obviously thought necessary to add to this legislation. I commend the minister for taking up the amendment. We would certainly like the Public Transport Authority to work well for all Western Australians. Question put and passed; the Council’s amendment agreed to. The Council acquainted accordingly.

7922 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

ADJOURNMENT OF THE HOUSE On motion by Mr J.C. Kobelke (Leader of the House), resolved - That the House at its rising adjourn until Tuesday, 3 June 2003 at 2.00 pm. House adjourned at 6.46 pm ______

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7923

QUESTIONS ON NOTICE

Questions and answers are as supplied to Hansard.

MEDICAL SERVICES AGREEMENT, SIGNING 704. Mr M.W. Trenorden to the Minister for Health (1) Has the Medical Services Agreement been signed? (2) If not, why not? (3) When was the due date for signing? (4) Are doctors currently out of contract? Mr R.C. KUCERA replied: 1. The Medical Services Agreement is the Department of Health generic contract to be used in negotiating on an individual basis between Public Hospitals and Medical Practitioners providing services on a commercial contract basis. Approximately 940 medical practitioners are now contracted under these new arrangements. 2. Refer to (1) above. 3. There is no due date for signing. 4. No.

NURSE-LINK RECRUITMENT CAMPAIGN 721. Dr E. Constable to the Minister for Health I refer to the State Government’s Nurse-Link recruitment campaign and ask: - (a) how many nurses are currently participating in refresher programs as part of the Nurse-Link recruitment campaign; (b) how much is the salary paid to nurses participating in refresher programs as part of the Nurse-Link recruitment campaign; (c) how many nurses have renewed their registration as part of the Nurse-Link recruitment campaign; (d) how much financial assistance is given to each nurse renewing his or her registration as part of the Nurse-Link recruitment campaign; (e) what is the current budget for the financial assistance given to nurses as part of the Nurse-Link recruitment campaign; (f) what is the form of the financial assistance given to the nurses renewing their registration as part of the Nurse-Link recruitment campaign; and (g) how many nurses are there across each of the following age groups for nurses re-entering the public sector under the Nurse Link recruitment campaign - (i) 20-29 years of age; (ii) 30-39 years of age; (iii) 40-49 years of age; (iv) 50-59 years of age; and (v) over 60 years of age? Mr R.C. KUCERA replied: (a) Refresher courses are for current registered and enrolled nurses who require up skilling to return to practice. As at March 2003: 178 nurses have completed refresher programs, and 24 enrolments were confirmed until May 2003. In addition to refresher courses, renewal of registration courses have been established and: 110 nurses have completed this program, and 93 are currently enrolled for 2003 courses. (b) Enrolled Nurse (EN) $589 per week as per the current Enterprise Agreement Registered Nurse (RN) $685 per week as per the current Enterprise Agreement

7924 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

(c) As part of the sponsorship conditions the 110 nurses who have completed the renewal of registration course are required to register with the Nurses Board of Western Australia. The Nurses Board of Western Australia records registration details as at December of each calendar year. Registration numbers for the last three years are as follows: December 2000: 25 636; December 2001: 26 678; and December 2002: 28 945 (provisional). (d) External studies cost of course fees through a tertiary institution plus EN $500 per week for clinical practice and RN $650 per week for clinical practice. ENs & RNs undertaking a renewal of registration program cannot be paid a registered/enrolled nurse salary as they are not registered with the Nurses Board of Western Australia. Hospital based EN $500 per week for the course duration and RN $650 per week for the course duration. (EN $1,030 and RN $2,830 per semester). The cost of the renewal course is paid for each nurse. The cost of the public health industry access fees are paid as a block instead of for individual nurses. (e) $2.1 million (f) Payments in the form of personal cheques to the individual nurse whereby half is paid at the commencement of the course and half is paid halfway through the course. (g) This information is not collected as it is not mandatory to be eligible to enter the program.

SERPENTINE RIVER, GUIDE POLES 722. Mr J.L. Bradshaw to the Minister for Planning and Infrastructure (1) Are there sufficient or any guiding poles in the Serpentine River so boats are guided in the deeper part of the river? (2) If not, will the Minister have such guide poles installed? Ms A.J. MacTIERNAN replied: (1) Yes, there are ten (10) sets of navigation marks between the entrance from the estuary upstream to Nairn Road ramp. This is the most popular area of river use. There is another set of navigation marks upstream of the Barragup Bridge in an area of the river known as 'The Ford'. This area shallows and the marks indicate the navigable channel. Between these sets of marks the river is less than 2 metres in depth and the speed limit for vessels throughout the river is 5 knots. (2) N/A.

NURSES, NUMBER AND STRESS LEAVE 739. Dr E. Constable to the Minister for Health (1) How many nurses were employed in the public sector in each of the following years - (a) 1998; (b) 1999; (c) 2000; (d) 2001; and (e) 2002? (2) How many of the nurses in (1) took stress leave in each of the following years - (a) 1998; (b) 1999; (c) 2000; (d) 2001; and (e) 2002? (3) What was the total number of working days missed by nurses on stress leave in each of the following years - (a) 1998; (b) 1999; (c) 2000;

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7925

(d) 2001; and (e) 2002? Mr R.C. KUCERA replied: For the purpose of this response the following nurse numbers (which includes both register and enrolled nurses) have been collected from a 'head count' as opposed to full time equivalent nursing positions. It is important to note that a nurse may be employed at two or more different health sites but will appear in these figures as one nurse. 1. The number of nurses employed in the public sector in each of the following years, as at 1 January, is as follows : (a) 10057 (b) 10224 (c) 10461 (d) 10720 (e) 11399 2. RiskCover reports the current number of claims from nurses in (1) who were absent from work and receiving stress recognised workers compensation in each of the identified years was: (a) 38 (b) 22 (c) 33 (d) 19 (e) 24 3. RiskCover reports the total number of working days lost by nurses who were absent from work and receiving stress recognised workers compensation in each of the identified years was: (a) 2541.8 (b) 1647.2 (c) 2598.0 (d) 567.9 (e) 164.5 Please Note: The information provided in response to questions 2 and 3 has been obtained directly from RiskCover. When considering the responses to questions 2 and 3 it should be noted that the finalisation of workers compensation claims does take considerable time and therefore may effect the reported figures in the most recent years. PEEL DISTRICT HEALTH ADVISORY COUNCIL, MEMBERSHIP 753. Mr J.L. Bradshaw to the Minister for Health I understand that 18 people have put their names forward to serve on the Peel District Health Advisory Council and ask - (a) has this Council been selected yet; (b) if yes, who are the members of the Council and where do they reside; and (c) what are their qualifications? Mr R.C. KUCERA replied: (a) Membership for the Peel Council has not been decided at this stage. I can advise that I have recently approved membership of establishment panels to assist with the membership selection process for the new District Health Advisory Councils. It is anticipated that this will occur shortly. (b) Not applicable. (c) Not applicable. JOONDALUP HEALTH CAMPUS, EMERGENCY BYPASSES AND CALL OFFS 755. Hon. C.L. Edwardes to the Minister for Health I refer the Minister to the report in The West Australian on 31 December 2002, titled ‘Hospitals rort bypass rate’ and ask: - (a) in the past 12 months, has the Joondalup Health Campus telephoned the St John Ambulance Communication Centre to advise that they would not accept emergency patients; (b) if yes, what were the times and dates of the ‘call off’;

7926 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

(c) which other Metropolitan Teaching Hospitals have telephoned in a ‘call off’; (d) if other Metropolitan Teaching Hospitals have telephoned in a ‘call off’, what were the time and dates of the ‘call off’; (e) was the St John Ambulance Communication Centre advised when the ‘call off’ was withdrawn; (f) during the past 12 months, were there any times when all the metropolitan hospitals were subject to a ‘call off’ for, non-urgent, emergency patients; (g) if yes, when; (h) for patients in the northern suburbs, without Ambulance Insurance, who pays the extra ambulance transport fees when Joondalup Health Campus is on ‘call off’; (i) how is the St John Ambulance Service compensated for the extra travel incurred with bypasses and call offs; (j) if no records have been kept of hospitals going on ‘call off’, why not; and (k) if no records have been kept, of a ‘call off’, how can the Health Department accurately access the workload of a hospital? Mr R.C. KUCERA replied: (a) In the past twelve months, Joondalup Health Campus has activated a 'call first process' in the event they are unable to accept patients with a specific clinical need, e.g. No ICU or Orthopaedic beds. The patients are assessed on a case by case basis according to clinical need and the ambulance is not always diverted to another Emergency Department or is diverted in the best interests of the patient to receive immediate definitive care. (b) The term 'call off' is not used by hospitals, however the term 'call first' is used in relation to ambulance activity at Joondalup Health Campus. 'Call first' Times January 2002 14.01.02 2230 – 2330 18.01.02 2037 – 2230 February 2002 17.02.02 1325 – 1515 24.02.02 1300 – 1500 March 2002 01.03.02 1245 – 1448 11.03.02 1155 – 1320 15.03.02 1309 – 1423 24.03.02 1538 – 1938 29.03.02 2109 – 2226 April 2002 07.04.02 1148 – 1412 08.04.02 1824 – 2028 10.04.02 2000 – 0842 (11.04.02) 15.04.02 1900 – 2245 16.04.02 0830 – 1356 26.04.02 1052 – 1500 28.04.02 1209 – 1706 29.04.02 1243 – 1800 29.04.02 2102 – 1658 (30.04.02) May 2002 04.05.02 0655 – 1000 05.05.02 1725 – 2100 14.05.02 1330 – 1605 20.05.02 0145 – 0520 20.05.02 1608 – 2035 22.05.02 1945 – 2145 26.05.02 1155 –1510

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7927

June 2002 01.06.02 1835 – 2015 02.06.02 1705 – 1800 03.06.02 1330 – 1450 10.06.02 2240 – 0145 (11.06.02) 12.06.02 1435 – 1700 17.06.02 1122 – 1405 19.06.02 1635 – 1840 21.06.02 1555 – 2040 21.06.02 1137 – 1400 22.06.02 2350 – 0515 (23.06.02) 26.06.02 0015 – 0425 23.06.02 1705 – 1920 26.06.02 0920 – 0835 (27.06.02) July 2002 16.07.02 1350 – 1450 18.07.02 2330 – 0200 (19.07.02) 21.07.02 1100 – 1350 29.07.02 2200 – 0330 (30.07.02) August 2002 03.08.02 1110 – 1450 05.08.02 1205 – 2105 12.08.02 1230 – 1640 16.08.02 1700 – 2130 25.08.02 1500 – 1830 26.08.02 0200 – 0649 September 2002 04.09.02 1240 – 1440 06.09.02 1345 – 2030 10.09.02 2010 – 0915 (11.09.02) 16.09.02 1530 – 1730 27.09.02 1130 – 1445 29.09.02 1435 – 1520 October 2002 08.10.02 1320 – 1700 09.10.02 0140 – 0600 10.10.02 1700 – 1850 19.10.02 1615 – 1715 November 2002 04.11.02 1645 – 2315 05.11.02 2115 – 2315 08.11.02 1420 – 1820 08.11.02 2100 – 2234 09.11.02 1415 – 1615 10.11.02 1255 – 1515 16.11.02 0750 – 1210 17.11.02 1635 – 1835 18.11.02 1625 – 2100 20.11.02 1800 – 2100 24.11.02 2050 – 0130 (25.11.02) 30.11.02 2000 – 2230 December 2002 03.12.02 1900 – 2230 06.12.02 1600 – 1745 08.12.02 1200 – 1415 10.12.02 1903 – 2035 11.12.02 1500 – 1755 11.12.02 2010 – 2225 13.12.02 2045 – 2345

7928 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

(c) No metropolitan teaching hospital participates in any other process aside from the recognised ambulance diversion process. (d) For information relating to Ambulance Bypass I would refer the Member to my answer provided to Question on Notice 269. (e) Yes, Joondalup Health Campus advises St John Ambulance Communication Centre when the 'call first' is withdrawn. (f) No, as only Joondalup Health Campus utilises 'call first'. (g) Not applicable (h) There are no extra ambulance fees, a flat rate is levied for the metropolitan area regardless of distance travelled. (i) St John Ambulance has a fixed contract to deliver the ambulance service and funding takes into account variations in the distance travelled. (j) With the exception of Joondalup Health Campus, no other Metropolitan hospital uses 'call first diversion' and as such no records are required. (k) Not applicable as 'call off' is not a process in common use, please refer to response to Question (c) The Department of Health accurately assesses the workload of a hospital by approved monitoring and reporting as published in the Department's Annual report. The records of Emergency Department attendances are monitored constantly through the Emergency Departments Information System (EDIS), St John Ambulance data and monthly contract meetings with state funded private hospitals at Joondalup and Peel.

BALED HAY, OVERSIZED 783. Mr J.L. Bradshaw to the Minister for Planning and Infrastructure (1) Is the Minister aware that Main Roads has put out a discussion paper regarding oversized Baled Hay? (2) Is the Minister aware that if the recommendations are implemented there will be a reduction in the number of bales carried from 42 bales to 34 bales per load? (3) Does the Minister realise the cost implications with the lower number of bales per load? (4) Will the Minister, personally, check to see that the extra width of 0.2m makes virtually no difference in safety between the two policies but will add 20% cost to the transport of these hay bales? Ms A.J. MacTIERNAN replied: 1. Yes. 2-4 . The Policy states that hay may be carried in the following height/width ratios: · At 4.3m high and 2.5m wide, with no requirement for an additional permit, and travel permitted at night, and during metropolitan curfew hours. · At 4.6m high and 2.5m wide, with a requirement for an Overheight Hay Permit, and travel also permitted at night and during metropolitan curfew hours. · At 4.3m high and 2.7m wide, an Overwidth Hay Permit is required, and travel is not permitted during the night, or during metropolitan curfew hours (Monday to Friday 07.30 hrs to 09.00 hrs and 16.30 hrs to 18.00 hrs). It is acknowledged that to make the loads legal and comply with regulations will result in a reduced amount of hay which can be carried. The Policy provides for the safe and secure carriage of overwidth loads of hay and straw. Vehicle stability will be in keeping with the proposed national Performance Based Standards. The 20% loss in loading capacity is offset by efficiency gains in loading and restraint procedures, and improved safety on the road. The Overheight Policy, which allows 4.6m high by 2.5m wide loads, was designed in 1993, at the request of the industry, and has not been altered as part of the development of the Overwidth Policy. The Static Roll Threshold was a key performance measure used to develop the Overwidth Policy and was a major factor in limiting the overall height to 4.3m when a load width of 2.7m is allowed. The Static Roll Threshold is a key performance based measure of vehicle stability and one of the most important measures of vehicle safety.

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7929

COMMITTEES AND BOARDS, MOBILE TELEPHONES, PAGERS, VEHICLES AND CREDIT CARDS 789. Hon. C.L. Edwardes to the Minister for Police and Emergency Services (1) Will the Minister advise whether any member or chairperson of Government committees or boards, other than ex-officio members, within the Minister’s portfolio have been provided with the following - (a) mobile telephones; (b) pagers; (c) vehicles; and (d) credit cards? (2) If yes, will the Minister provide the name of the committee or board and the name of the member or chairperson to each committee and board? (3) If a credit card has been issued, what is the credit limit for each card? Mrs M.H. ROBERTS replied: Western Australia Police Service 1 (a)-(d) No members or chairpersons have been provided with these items. 2-3 Not applicable. Fire and Emergency Services Authority 1 (a)-(d) No members or chairpersons have been provided with these items. 2-3 Not applicable. COMMITTEES AND BOARDS, MOBILE TELEPHONES, PAGERS, VEHICLES AND CREDIT CARDS 792. Hon. C.L. Edwardes to the Minister for Education and Training; Sport and Recreation; Indigenous Affairs (1) Will the Minister advise whether any member or chairperson of Government committees or boards, other than ex-officio members, within the Minister’s portfolio have been provided with the following - (a) mobile telephones; (b) pagers; (c) vehicles; and (d) credit cards? (2) If yes, will the Minister provide the name of the committee or board and the name of the member or chairperson to each committee and board? (3) If a credit card has been issued, what is the credit limit for each card? Mr A.J. CARPENTER replied: Department of Indigenous Affairs (1) (a),(c)-(d) No existing members or chairpersons have these items. However, Aboriginal Lands Trust; Chair - Clem Riley ceased on the 13 February 2002, and Aboriginal Cultural Material Committee; Chair - Irene Stainton ceased 17 December 2002 had access to these items. The credit card limit was $10,000, for item (d). (b) Not applicable (2) Not applicable (3) See 1(a),(c)-(d) above. Sport and Recreation Department of Sport and Recreation (1) (a)-(d) Nil (2) Not Applicable (3) Not Applicable WA Institute of Sport (1) (a)-(d) Nil (2) Not Applicable (3) Not Applicable

7930 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

WA Sport Centre Trust (1) (a)-(d) Nil (2) Not Applicable (3) Not Applicable Education and Training Department of Education and Training (1) (a) Yes (b)-(d) No (2) College Governing Council, Central TAFE, Hon Mal Bryce, Chair (3) Not applicable Curriculum Council (1) (a)-(d) Nil (2) Not Applicable (3) Not Applicable Department of Education Services (1) (a) Yes (b)-(c) Nil (d) Yes (2) Mrs May L O'Brien, Chairperson, Aboriginal Education and Training Council (3) Charge Card (Corporate) - $500 monthly limit

COMMITTEES AND BOARDS, MOBILE TELEPHONES, PAGERS, VEHICLES AND CREDIT CARDS 794. Hon. C.L. Edwardes to the Minister for Health (1) Will the Minister advise whether any member or chairperson of Government committees or boards, other than ex-officio members, within the Minister’s portfolio have been provided with the following - (a) mobile telephones; (b) pagers; (c) vehicles; and (d) credit cards? (2) If yes, will the Minister provide the name of the committee or board and the name of the member or chairperson to each committee and board? (3) If a credit card has been issued, what is the credit limit for each card? Mr R.C. KUCERA replied: Department of Health 1. (a)-(d) None 2. Not applicable 3. Not applicable Healthway 1. (a)-(d) None 2. Not applicable 3. Not applicable Office of Health Review 1. (a)-(d) None 2. Not applicable 3. Not applicable

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7931

COMMITTEES AND BOARDS, MOBILE TELEPHONES, PAGERS, VEHICLES AND CREDIT CARDS 795. Hon. C.L. Edwardes to the Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister for Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries; the Midwest, Wheatbelt and Great Southern (1) Will the Minister advise whether any member or chairperson of Government committees or boards, other than ex-officio members, within the Minister’s portfolio have been provided with the following - (a) mobile telephones; (b) pagers; (c) vehicles; and (d) credit cards? (2) If yes, will the Minister provide the name of the committee or board and the name of the member or chairperson to each committee and board? (3) If a credit card has been issued, what is the credit limit for each card? Mr F.M. LOGAN replied: Department of Agriculture (1) (a)-(d) No (2)-(3) Not applicable Department of Fisheries (1) (a)-(d) No (2)-(3) Not applicable Forest Products Commission (1) (a)-(c) No (d) Yes (2) Forest Products Commission Mr Murray Jorgensen Dr Per Christensen Dr Marilyn Clark-Murphy Mr Nick Oaks Mr John Castrilli Ms Sandy Breeze Mr Ray Curo (3) AMEX and Visa for above members with credit limit of $10,000 Mid West Development Commission (1) (a)-(d) No (2)-(3) Not applicable Wheatbelt Development Commission (1) (a)-(d) No (2)-(3) Not applicable Great Southern Development Commission (1) (a)-(d) No (2)-(3) Not applicable GOVERNMENT DEPARTMENTS AND AGENCIES, CREDITORS, PAYMENT OF INVOICES 804. Hon. C.L. Edwardes to the Minister for Planning and Infrastructure For each department and agency within the Minister’s portfolio since 1 May 2001, will the Minister provide the following - (a) the number of creditors for each month; (b) the number of creditors paid within 30 days, 45 days, 60 days and 90 days or more of the receipt of the invoice; (c) for invoices paid after 60 days, what was the value of each invoice; and

7932 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

(d) for invoices paid after 90 days or more, what was the value of each invoice? Ms A.J. MacTIERNAN replied: The information being sought by the member is not readily available. I would advise that information systems used in agencies are designed to address operational and statutory requirements and don't necessarily facilitate the ready provision of information being sought by the member. However, if the member has a particular issue of concern, I would be pleased to consider arranging for the agency to provide information on that specific issue. GOVERNMENT DEPARTMENTS AND AGENCIES, SALE OF ASSETS VALUED AT OVER $500 000 831. Hon. C.L. Edwardes to the Minister for Police and Emergency Services Will the Minister provide the following information for all Government-owned assets, sold since the election of the Labor Government, which had a sale price of $500,000 or greater - (a) the name and nature of the asset; (b) the date of sale; (c) the nature of the sale and name of the buyer; (d) any associated revenue from the sale, such as stamp duty; (e) the application of the funds received; and (f) any associated costs incurred in the process of the sale? Mrs M.H. ROBERTS replied: Western Australia Police Service (a)-(f) The Western Australia Police Service advise it has not sold any such assets since the election of the Labor Government. Fire and Emergency Services Authority The Fire and Emergency Services Authority advise it has sold two such assets: (1) (a) Name: 1625 Albany Highway Beckenham Nature: Land (b) 11 August 2000 (c) Land disposal – Australian Property Acquisition Pty Ltd (d) $510,000 (e) Capital Works building program (f) $9,900 (2) (a) Name: Lot 1, 2 & 3 Pinjarra Road Mandurah Nature: Land and building (b) 28 February 2002 (c) Land and building disposal – Bandaberry Pty Ltd (d) $749,400 (e) Mandurah Fire Station (f) $14,712.75 GOVERNMENT DEPARTMENTS AND AGENCIES, PAYMENT OF CLUB/ASSOCIATION MEMBERSHIPS 848. Hon. C.L. Edwardes to the Minister for Education and Training; Sport and Recreation; Indigenous Affairs (1) Will the Minister advise if any Government department or agency within the Minister’s portfolio paid for membership to a club/association for a member of staff since February 2001? (2) If so, will the Minister provide - (a) the name of the staff member; (b) the name of the club/association; and (c) the amount paid? Mr A.J. CARPENTER replied: Department of Indigenous Affairs (1) Yes

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7933

(2) (a) (2)(b) (2)(c) Corporate Membership Active 8 $4,500.00 (Expired February 2002) Lucy Tarrant Laverton Council Pool $66.00 William Doble (2002) Geraldton Cycle Club $100.00 (2003) Geraldton Cycle Club $100.00 David Pedler (2002) City of Bayswater ('Waves') $90.91 (2003) City of Bayswater ('Waves') $100.00 Corporate Vouchers* (2002) The Edge Fitness Centre Port Hedland $460.00 Corporate Vouchers* (2002) Port Hedland Swimming Pool $218.18 Rose Butler Body Care Health Club Albany $100.00 Corporate Membership Broome Bowling Club $145.45 Rebecca Khan Body Care Health Club Albany $100.00 (* Staff not recorded) Sport and Recreation Department of Sport and Recreation (1) Nil (2) (a)-(c) Not Applicable WA Institute of Sport (1) Yes (2) (a) (b) (c) Alex Parnov Australian Track and Field Coaches Association $178.50 Lyn Foreman Australian Track and Field Coaches Association $178.50 Grant Ward Australian Track and Field Coaches Association $178.50 Aaron Holt Australian Track and Field Coaches Association $178.50 Benjamin Tarbox Australian Strength and Conditioning Association $80.00 Australian Association for Exercise and Sports Science $180.00 Jon Fletcher WA Netball Association $40.00 Kere Johanson Australian Softball Federation National Coaches Association $75.00 Darryl Benson Cycling Australia and Cycling WA $200.00 Liz Chetkovich Gymnastics Australia and Gymnastics WA $145.00 Nikolai Lapchine Gymnastics Australia and Gymnastics WA $145.00 Joanne Richards Gymnastics Australia and Gymnastics WA $145.00 Martine George Gymnastics Australia and Gymnastics WA $145.00 Vladimir Joura Gymnastics Australia and Gymnastics WA $145.00 Dhana Antulov Gymnastics Australia and Gymnastics WA $145.00 Carly Brockis Gymnastics Australia and Gymnastics WA $145.00 Tatiana Lapchina Gymnastics Australia and Gymnastics WA $145.00 Elise Pryce Gymnastics Australia and Gymnastics WA $145.00 WA Sport Centre Trust (1) Yes (2) (a) (b) (c) Graham Moss Venue Managers Association $220.00 Carbine Club of Western Australia $50.00 Greg Clarke Institute of Engineers $337.00 Institute of Hospital & Health Care $337.00 Dean Solly Venue Managers Association $220.00 Justine Smetham Australian Human Resources Institute $195.00 Rob Verboon Leisure Institute of WA Aquatics $125.00 Events Industry of Australia $150.00 Venue Managers Association $220.00 Donna Fox WA Club $300.00 Events Industry of Australia $200.00 Graham Hush Events Industry of Australia $150.00 Venue Managers Association $220.00 Ross Peters Venue Managers Association $220.00

7934 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

Rod Bonsack Australian Swim Coaches and Teachers Association $420.00 Viki Shelver Royal Life Saving Association Training Members $30.00 Clint Vawser Australian Human Resources Institute $195.00 Liz Leyden Association of Payroll Specialists $150.00 Stephanie Michielsen Events Industry of Australia $150.00 Venue Managers Association $220.00 Curtis Clarke Venue Managers Association $220.00 Barbara Tchorzewski Venue Managers Association $220.00 Cindy Lewis Customer Service Association $125.00 Terri Bent Injury Control Council of WA $25.00 Education and Training Department of Education and Training (1)-(2) An interrogation of the financial database revealed numerous payments to organisations that include the word club or association in the name. It is unlikely that membership costs would have been incurred unless it was directly related to the official duties of any officer concerned. There are known circumstances where a corporate membership is undertaken to source current data or developments in a particular field or profession. If the member could be more specific I will arrange for the financial records to be further searched. Department of Education Services & Curriculum Council (1) Nil (2) (a)-(c) Not Applicable

MINISTERS OF THE CROWN, STAFF, CORPORATE CREDIT CARDS 854. Hon. C.L. Edwardes to the Premier; Minister for Public Sector Management; Federal Affairs; Science; Citizenship and Multicultural Interests Will the Premier advise in respect to the allocation of corporate credit cards in the Premier’s office, since the election of the Labor Government, the following - (a) the name and position of each person, including the Premier and Parliamentary Secretary allocated a corporate credit card; (b) the credit limit on the card; and (c) the total monthly expenditure for each person allocated a card? Dr G.I. GALLOP replied: (a)-(b) Name Position Card Limit $ G Gallop Premier Amex 20,000.00 Visa 20,000.00 G Houston Media Advisor Amex 25,000.00 Visa 30,000.00 M McGowan Parliamentary Secretary Visa 10,000.00 K Murphy Principal Media Adviser Amex 30,000.00 Visa 30,000.00 S Walsh Chief of Staff Amex 20,000.00 Visa 30,000.00 R Young Executive Officer Amex 50,000.00 Visa 10,000.00 D Hatt Director Visa 2,000.00 R Saffioti Principal Policy Adviser Amex 20,000.00 Visa 20,000.00 (c) Cardholder Period Amex Period Visa $ $ Premier G Gallop May 01 5.00 April 01 335.70 April 02 5.00 July 01 3.00 Sept 01 51.51

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7935

Oct 01 3.00 Jan 02 3.00 Mar 02 206.00 July 02 173.09 K Murphy Jun 01 5.00 April 01 3.00 May 02 5.00 June 01 466.80 July 01 7,736.56 Oct 01 3.00 Jan 02 3.00 May 02 72.60 Sept 02 8,582.84 Oct 02 1,125.40 Nov 02 265.93 S Walsh May 01 5.00 April 01 389.50 Oct 01 1,707.71 July 01 3.00 Nov 01 1,707.71 Sept 01 11,573.58 April 02 5.00 Oct 01 3.00 Aug 02 3,241.15 Jan 02 3.00 July 02 7,956.71 R Saffioti Nov 01 5.00 Nov 01 2,965.41 Oct 02 5.00 Feb 02 3.00 Dec 02 43.90 M McGowan April 01 3.00 July 01 73.30 Aug 01 80.60 Oct 01 3.00 Jan 02 3.00 Feb 02 165.80 April 02 117.33 July 02 2,658.48 Sept 02 1,665.39 Oct 02 212.11 Nov 02 35.81 Dec 02 160.00 D Hatt May 02 100.40 July 02 110.30 Sept 02 258.07 Jan 03 40.40 R Young April 01 5.00 April 01 487.26 May 01 4,758.48 May 01 409.59 June 01 2,685.90 June 01 39.00 July 01 4,495.24 July 01 3.00 Nov 01 14,031.86 Aug 01 158.95 Dec 01 3,959.32 Sept 01 35.90 Mar 02 5.00 Oct 01 236.45 April 02 1,091.29 Dec 01 110.45 May 02 6,584.21 Jan 02 143.75 Jun 02 1,211.51 Feb 02 114.51 July 02 5,711.61 Mar 02 111.90 Aug 02 3,809.71 April 02 2,044.22 Sept 02 1,359.95 May 02 68.07 Oct 02 2,571.48 June 02 60.00 Nov 02 5,679.82 July 02 102.53 Dec 02 3,644.70 Aug 02 29.95 Jan 03 5,647.50 Sept 02 405.23 Feb 03 1,046.78 Oct 02 321.42 Mar 03 5.00 Nov 02 333.49 Dec 02 2,460.51 Jan 03 66.59 Feb 03 199.89

7936 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

EDUCATION, CONFERENCES AND SEMINARS BY SCHOOL EXECUTIVE ORGANISATIONS 877. Mr D.F. Barron-Sullivan to the Minister for Education and Training (1) Will the Minister provide the full details, including venues, of all conferences and seminars conducted by school executive organisations since 19 February 2001? (2) What total financial contribution was made by the Department of Education in conducting these conferences and seminars? (3) Who paid for each school executive to attend these conferences and seminars? (4) What process was in place for approval to be given for each school executive to attend each of these conferences and seminars? (5) What has been the total cost expended since 19 February 2001 by the Department of Education, District Offices and schools in the attendance of school executives at these conferences and seminars? (6) What percentage of these conferences and seminars were conducted outside of normal school hours? Mr A.J. CARPENTER replied: (1),(3)-(6) This information is not readily available and would require a significant level of resources to consolidate. (2) The Department of Education and Training provides financial support to the following organisations, annually, to assist them in conducting conferences and/or seminars. 2001 2002 Professional Association (Excluding GST) (Excluding GST) $ $ WA State School Registrars' Association 16 000 16 000 WA Education Support Principals and Administrators' Association 6 300 6 300 WA Secondary School Executives' Association 21 000 21 000 WA District High School Administrators' Association 18 000 18 000 Association of Secondary Schools Registrars WA 4 000 4 000 WA Secondary Teaching Administrators' Association 14 000 14 000 Australian Primary Principals' Association - WA Chapter 7 500 WA Primary Principals' Association 34 000 51 200 WA Primary Deputy Principals' Association 17 200 Totals 130 500 138 000 The Department also provides assistance by way of relief days for teaching administrators to attend professional association meetings or conferences. Expenditure amounted to: 11 617 2 658 GOVERNMENT VEHICLES, PRIVATELY PLATED 952. Mr D.F. Barron-Sullivan to the Attorney General; Minister for Justice and Legal Affairs; Electoral Affairs; Peel and the South West Will the Attorney General provide - (a) details of all officers (including their classification level), within all agencies and statutory bodies that come under your ministerial jurisdiction, who have use of a privately plated vehicle as at 31 January 2003; (b) the reason why each officer has access to a privately plated vehicle; (c) the details of each privately plated vehicle allocated to each of these officers, including make, model and a full list of additional extras and options applicable to each vehicle; and (d) the details of the annual leasing, hiring or purchase costs applicable to each of these privately plated vehicles? Mr J.A. McGINTY replied: DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE (a) See attached schedule. [See paper No 1120.] (b) The Salaries and Allowances Tribunal determinations for remuneration of the Judiciary, Masters, Registrars, Magistrates, legal officers and the Director-General provides access to privately plated fully maintained vehicles.

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7937

Judges, Masters, Magistrates and Registrars are not officers of the Department of Justice and have not been included in the response. Privately plated vehicles are supplied to officers contributing to the GVS scheme and contribute accordingly for the private use of the vehicle. Officers whose position classification is Level 9 and above access privately plated vehicles as part of their position remuneration. Officers whose position is less than Level 9 access privately plated vehicles at the discretion of the Director-General and where specific circumstances and benefit to Justice arise from provisions of access to privately plated vehicles. Three business operations of Justice operate privately plated vehicles due to confidentiality, sensitivity of operations or for security reasons. These vehicles are not provided for private usage. - Special Services Branch vehicles for covert operations and for security reasons are not provided in the information return. Sheriff’s office vehicles used for warrant execution. Community and Juvenile Justice and Victim Support vehicles where confidentiality and sensitivity of operations are required. (c)-(d) See attached schedule. DIRECTOR OF PUBLIC PROSECUTIONS (a) OFFICER CLASSIFICATION NUMBER OF LEVEL VEHICLES Crown Prosecutors Class 4 4 Crown Prosecutors Class 3 8 Executive Officer Level 8 1 (b) In each instance the officer has access to a privately plated vehicle through eligibility under the Government Vehicle Scheme (GVS) and as part of their general conditions of employment. (c)-(d) MAKE MODEL EXTRAS & APPROX. OPTIONS ANNUAL LEASE COST (State Fleet) Ford Fairmont Nil $6447 Mitsubishi Verada Nil $5998 Toyota Camry Nil $5087 Holden Berlina Nil $6319 Mitsubishi Verada Nil $6459 Ford Fairmont Nil $5841 Holden Commodore Towbar $5367 Subaru Impeza Nil $5452 Ford Fairmont Nil $5530 Ford Fairmont Nil $5540 Ford Fairmont Towbar $6317 Mitsubishi Verada Nil $6723 Holden Berlina Cargo barrier $6397 ELECTORAL COMMISSION (a) (i) Lyn Auld, Electoral Commissioner Group 2 (ii) Fiona Colbeck, Deputy Electoral Commissioner Level 8 (b) Conditions of employment under Salaries and Allowances Tribunal determination (c) (i) Mitsubishi Verada (ii) Holden Berlina (d) (i) Rental cost $6,013pa Operating costs $3,180pa (ii) Rental cost $5,480pa Operating costs $3,829pa EQUAL OPPORTUNITY COMMISSION (a) The position of Commissioner for Equal Opportunity is a Group 1 (maximum) classification. (b) The Commissioner for Equal Opportunity is a prescribed office holder as determined by the Salaries and Allowances Tribunal and as such is entitled to the use of a private plated vehicle.

7938 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

(c) The motor vehicle used by the Commissioner, and approved by the Salaries and Allowances Tribunal, is a Ford Fairmont sedan. The only optional extra attached to this vehicle is a weather shield. (d) The Commissioner’s annual leasing costs (GST exclusive) for the above vehicle totals $7,255.80. LEGAL AID WA (a) Officers who have use of a privately plated vehicle as at 31 January 2003:- George Turnbull, Director of Legal Aid Salaries & Allowances Tribunal Special Bevan Warner Class 1 Alexander Payne Class 4 Ronald Smith Level 9 Christine Slattery Level 9 Gail Archer Class 4 Greg Boland Level 9 Vicki Platt Level 9 Peter Huxtable Class 2 Elizabeth Hamilton Level 9 Bunbury Office - General pooled vehicle Level 2 up to Level 8 (b) All officers listed above, except Mr Turnbull and the Bunbury Office car, contribute to the GVS scheme, allowing personal use of the motor vehicle. Mr Turnbull has private use of a vehicle as a result of his employment arrangements. The Bunbury office car has private plates due to the sensitivity of clients being seen to receive visits from government officers. (c)-(d) All vehicles are purchased outright – see below for details. Name Make Model Extra’s Cost(GSTinc) George Turnbull Toyota Tarago Tow Ball $45,058 Bevan Warner Holden Acclaim Tow Ball & Roof $29,780 Commodore Rack (at own Alexander Payne Holden Acclaim expense) & Tow $29,473 Commodore Ball Ronald Smith Holden Commodore Acclaim Tow Ball $29,138 Christine Slattery Toyota Corolla Hatchback $21,578 Gail Archer Mazda 626 Eclipse $28,375 Greg Boland Toyota Corolla (Liftback) Tow Ball, Headlight $20,656 Protectors, Bull Bar, Vicki Platt Holden Jackeroo Steel Roof Rack, Spotlights $36,409 Peter Huxtable Ford Falcon Forte (Wagon) Tow Ball, Cruise Control $27,816 Bunbury Office Ford Falcon Forte (Sedan) Cruise Control $25,730 Liz Hamilton Mitsubishi Magna (Wagon) Roo Bar, Tow Ball, Cruise $28,171 Control, Cargo Barrier & Cover TOTAL $322,184 OFFICE OF THE INFORMATION COMMISSIONER (a) Information Commissioner; Executive Director level 9; and Senior Legal Officer, level 9. (b) Condition of employment and application of the Government Vehicle Scheme. (c) Ford Fairmont; Toyota Avalon; Toyota Camry. They have window tinting applied pre-delivery. (d) Annual running costs: Fairmont – $3012.60 Avalon – $4325.88 (less GVS = $1894.88) Camry – $3291.96 (less GVS = $1003.96) Annual hire costs: Fairmont – $6085.08 Avalon – $4546.92 Camry – $4428.72 TOTAL: $25691.16 (less EVS = $20972.16) OFFICE OF THE INSPECTOR OF CUSTODIAL SERVICES (a) Robert Stacey – Director of Operations (Level 9). (b) Robert Stacey as Director, Level 9 Senior Executive is permitted to contribute to the Government Vehicle Scheme .

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7939

(c) 2000 Ford Futura Sedan. Extra options of automatic, towbar, metallic paint and rubber floor mats. (d) Annual Lease charges and fees $5509.44 (including GST). PEEL DEVELOPMENT COMMISSION (a) (1) Chief Executive Officer (L9 - SAT) (2) Assistant Chief Executive Officer (L8 - PSA) (b) (1) Terms of employment contract (2) Contributor to Government Vehicle Scheme - approved by CEO (c) (1) Ford AU Fairmont Sedan Mobile telephone cradle (2) Ford BA Falcon XT Wagon Floor mats, Cruise control, Window tint, Tow bar, telephone cradle SOUTH WEST DEVELOPMENT COMMISSION (a) (i) Don Punch, Chief Executive Officer – Level 9 (ii) Dominique Van Gent, Manager, Industry and Business Services – Level 7 (b) (i) Part of employment agreement (ii) Part of the Government Vehicle Scheme (c) (i) 2003 Toyota Camry (ii) 2003 Holden Commodore Acclaim. The tow ball is the only non-standard option on the vehicle (d) (i) $8 178 (ii) $5 535.24

MINISTERS OF THE CROWN, STAFF VEHICLES, PRIVATELY PLATED 997. Mr D.F. Barron-Sullivan to the Minister for Police and Emergency Services Will the Minister provide - (a) details of all officers (including their respective classification level), within your Ministerial office who have had use of a privately plated vehicles between 19 February 2001 and 31 January 2003; (b) the reason why each officer has had access to a privately plated vehicle; (c) the details of each privately plated vehicle allocated to each of these officers, including make, model and a full list of additional extras and options applicable to each vehicle; and (d) the details of the annual leasing, hiring or purchase costs applicable to each of these privately plated vehicles? Mrs M.H. ROBERTS replied: (a) Chief of Staff Level 9 Media Secretary Level 6 (b) Both vehicles have been approved by the Director General for use in the Government Vehicle Scheme (GVS). (c) Chief of Staff Registration: 1BCT102 Make & model: Holden TS Astra Hatch Additional extras/options: Full tank fuel/air conditioning/metallic paint. Media Secretary Registration: 1BFP155 Make & model: Camry Wagon Additional extras/options: Transferred tow bar from previous vehicle. (d) Annual Costs GST excl. Chief of Staff Media Secretary Management $ 328.90 $ 284.61 Lease $ 739.40 $ 344.24 Insurance $ 905.00 $ 905.00 Fringe Benefits Tax $ 511.00 $ 1,560.00 Total $2484.30 $ 3093.85

7940 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

GOVERNMENT DEPARTMENTS AND AGENCIES, CONFERENCES AND SEMINARS, COST 1009. Mr D.F. Barron-Sullivan to the Minister for Consumer and Employment Protection Will the Minister provide - (a) the full details, including total cost, since 19 February 2001, expended by each agency and statutory body that comes under your ministerial jurisdiction of officers attending conferences or seminars that were not conducted by each respective agency or statutory body; (b) the total costs, since 19 February 2001, expended by each agency and statutory body that comes under your ministerial jurisdiction in conducting ‘in-house’ conferences and seminars; (c) the details, including costs, of officers and contractors specifically employed since 19 February 2001 to conduct ‘in-house’ conferences and seminars; and (d) the specific reasons why it was necessary to employ officers and contractors to perform this task? Mr J.C. KOBELKE replied: (a) Information on the conferences and seminars attended by the agencies within my portfolio, where travel is required, is provided in the quarterly travel returns tabled in parliament. (b)-(d) The information systems used in agencies do not necessarily facilitate the ready provision of the data required to respond to these questions. However, if the member has a particular issue of concern, I would be pleased to consider arranging for the agency to provide further details on the particular issue.

TONKIN HIGHWAY, "BUILDING THE HIGHWAY" PUBLICATION, COST 1081. Ms K. Hodson-Thomas to the Minister for Planning and Infrastructure I refer to a publication produced by the Government entitled ‘Building the Highway’ dated July 2002 and ask will the Minister advise - (a) how much did this publication cost to produce; (b) how many were printed; (c) how were these distributed; (d) how many of these information sheets about the Tonkin Highway does the Minister envisage producing; and (e) is it Main Roads policy to produce information brochures on every major road project undertaken? Ms A.J. MacTIERNAN replied: (a) $6076.00. (b) 20 000 copies. (c) They were distributed to local residents and businesses through the unaddressed delivery service (UDS) of Australia Post, and to absentee landowners/ratepayers by direct mail. Copies were also available for collection at the public displays and through the offices/libraries of the Cities of Armadale and Gosnells, the Shire of Serpentine-Jarrahdale and local Members of Parliament. (d) Under the terms of the design and construct contract for Stage One of the Tonkin Highway extension, awarded to John Holland Macmahon Joint Venture, newsletters will be produced quarterly with 14 editions expected to be produced during the course of the project. (e) Yes, Main Roads typically produces newsletters or fact sheets on all major road projects to keep the local community informed about the scope and status of the project and advise them of any likely impacts that may be generated as part of the delivery of the works.

FAMILY LINKS PROGRAM, FUNDING, NORTH WEST 1112. Mr L. Graham to the Minister for Education and Training I refer to the recent announcement of an additional $100,000 to be allocated to the School Chaplaincy Program, raising the Government's total commitment to $300,000 in the 2002-03 financial year, as part of the Government’s commitment to $3.99million Family Links initiative, and I ask - (a) how much of the proposed $300,000 in the 2002-03 financial year is to be spent on programs in the North West of the State; (b) in which towns and communities will the funds be spent;

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7941

(c) who will be responsible for administering the funds; (d) when will the programs commence operation in each town referred to above; (e) how much of the proposed $3.99million Family Links initiative is to be spent on programs in the North West of the State; (f) in which towns and communities will the funds be spent; (g) who will be responsible for administering the funds; and (h) when will the programs commence operation in each town referred to above? Mr A.J. CARPENTER replied: (a) Funding is provided to the Churches' Commission on Education (CCE) to support the administrative operations of the Commission for the School-based Chaplaincy Program. CCE has indicated that a new chaplaincy program will be starting in Kununurra shortly with a seeding grant of $10 000. A further $10 000 is provided annually for Chaplains in the North West to participate in an ongoing professional development program. (b) Kununurra. The chaplains at Broome, Newman and Kununurra (when appointed) are able to access professional development funds. (c) CCE. (d) CCE will determine when the Kununurra program commences. Broome and Newman currently have access to School Chaplains. (e) $110 000 in 2002-2003. The Pilbara and Kimberley education districts each received $25 000 this financial year to support the establishment of School-based Community Liaison Officers. Similar amounts will be granted over the next three years. Roebourne Primary School received a grant of $60 000 during 2002-2003. (f) The following schools have received funding to employ School Based Community Liaison Officers. Karratha Primary School $5 000 Roebourne Primary School $72 400 South Hedland Primary School $7 600 Cable Beach Primary School $25 000 (g) Schools administer the funds. (h) Immediately staff are appointed.

GOVERNMENT DEPARTMENTS AND AGENCIES, EMPLOYEES, PUBLIC AFFAIRS, PUBLIC RELATIONS AND MEDIA LIAISON SECTIONS 1148. Mr M.J. Birney to the Minister for the Environment and Heritage (1) How many people are employed in the public affairs, public relations and media liaison sections of each Department answerable to the Minister? (2) What was the total wages bill for each of these sections in 2001/2002? Dr J.M. EDWARDS replied: Department of Environmental Protection/Water and Rivers Commission (1) The Department of Environmental Protection (DEP), and the Water and Rivers Commission (WRC) have five people (4.5 FTE) employed in media liaison/public affairs delivering services to DEP, WRC, Environmental Protection Authority and Swan River Trust (SRT). SRT as a separate entity has a further two community relations positions (2FTE) for the Swan Canning Cleanup Program. (2) The total salary budget covering for the direct DEP, WRC and SRT public affairs/media liaison positions in 2001/2002 was approximately $373,000. Department of Conservation and Land Management (1) For the Department of Conservation and Land Management, 4 FTEs are employed in public affairs, public relations and media liaison sections. These staff work in the Department’s Strategic Development and

7942 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

Corporate Affairs Division. Other staff in the Division are engaged in providing various communication, information and public participation services and in developing and delivering EcoEducation programs for schools. (2) $294,986.75 Office of Water Regulation (1) Nil (2) N/A GOVERNMENT DEPARTMENTS AND AGENCIES, EMPLOYEES, PUBLIC AFFAIRS, PUBLIC RELATIONS AND MEDIA LIAISON SECTIONS 1153. Mr M.J. Birney to the Minister for Community Development, Women's Interests, Seniors and Youth; Disability Services; Culture and the Arts (1) How many people are employed in the public affairs, public relations and media liaison sections of each Department answerable to the Minister? (2) What was the total wages bill for each of these sections in 2001/2002? Ms S.M. McHALE replied: Disability Services: (1) Three people working the equivalent of two full-time positions. (2) Approximately $128,550. Department for Community Development: (1) 12.8 FTE (Department for Community Development) (2) $674,727 (Department for Community Development) Department of Culture and the Arts: (1) Three (2) $132,678 Western Australian Museum (1) Three Two at Perth Site One at the Maritime Museum (2) $98,798 Art Gallery of Western Australia (1) One (2) $22,624.91 Perth Theatre Trust (1) Nil (2) Not applicable ScreenWest (1) One (2) $52,293. State Library of Western Australia (1) One (5% of time) (2) $3,115.60. State Records Office (1) Nil (2) Not applicable NURSES, NUMBER AND RESIGNATIONS 1169. Mr C.J. Barnett to the Minister for Health (1) How many enrolled nurses were employed by the Health Department in the following financial years –

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7943

(a) 1999-2000; (b) 2000-2001; and (c) 2001-2002? (2) How many enrolled nurses were employed by the Health Department as at – (a) 1 January 2000; (b) 1 January 2001; (c) 1 January 2002; and (d) 1 January 2003? (3) How many enrolled nurses left the employ of the Health Department in the following financial years – (a) 1999-2000; (b) 2000-2001; and (c) 2001-2002? Mr R.C. KUCERA replied: I assume that these questions relate to the number of Enrolled Nurses employed in the Government Health Services as the Department of Health does not directly employ any Enrolled Nurses in the capacity of an Enrolled Nurse. For the purpose of this response the following Enrolled Nurse numbers have been collected from a 'head count' as opposed to full time equivalent enrolled nursing positions. It is important to note that an enrolled nurse may be employed at two or more different health sites but will appear in these figures as one Enrolled Nurse. 1. (a) 2254 (b) 2196 (c) 2265 2. (a) 1868 (b) 1813 (c) 1896 (d) 2018 3. It should be noted that the overall nursing workforce is ageing. At the 1986 census, 23.3% of nurses were aged under 25. This figure had fallen to 7.7% while the proportion of nurses aged 45 years or more had increased to 30.3% by 1999 as reported in the Australian Institute of Health Workforce (2001) Nursing Labour Force 1999, AIHW Catalogue No. HWL 20, Canberra. It is worth noting, a significant number of Enrolled Nurses have undertaken the Enrolled Nurse to Registered Nurse conversion course which will also impact upon the number of Enrolled Nurses recorded as leaving the public system. There are currently 80 Enrolled Nurses enrolled at Curtin University undertaking the conversion course to become Registered Nurses. Health workers, including Enrolled Nurses may leave the employ of one public health service but commence work with another. The number of Enrolled Nurses who have left the employ of public health services entirely are: (a) 257 (b) 228 (c) 273 NURSES, NUMBER AND RESIGNATIONS 1170. Mr C.J. Barnett to the Minister for Health (1) How many registered nurses were employed by the Health Department in the following financial years – (a) 1999-2000; (b) 2000-2001; and (c) 2001-2002? (2) How many registered nurses were employed by the Health Department as at – (a) 1 January 2000; (b) 1 January 2001; (c) 1 January 2002; and (d) 1 January 2003? (3) How many registered nurses left the employ of the Health Department in the following financial years – (a) 1999-2000; (b) 2000-2001; and (c) 2001-2002?

7944 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

Mr R.C. KUCERA replied: I assume that these questions relate to the number of Registered Nurses employed in the Government Health Services as the Department of Health does not directly employ any Registered Nurses in the capacity of a Registered Nurse. For the purpose of this response the following Registered Nurse numbers have been collected from a 'head count' as opposed to full time equivalent Registered Nursing positions. It is important to note that a registered nurse may be employed at two or more different health sites but will appear in these figures as one Registered Nurse. 1. (a) 10840 (b) 11178 (c) 11475 2. (a) 8593 (b) 8907 (c) 9503 (d) 9976 3. It should be noted that the overall nursing workforce is ageing. At the 1986 census, 23.3% of nurses were aged under 25. This figure had fallen to 7.7%, while the proportion of nurses aged 45 years or more had increased to 30.3% by 1999 as reported in the Australian Institute of Health Workforce (2001) Nursing Labour Force 1999, AIHW Catalogue No. HWL 20, Canberra. It is also shown in the AIHW data that the average age of Registered Nurses increased from 39.1 years in 1994 to 41.6 years in 1999. Health workers, including Registered Nurses may leave the employ of one public health service but commence work with another. The number of Registered Nurses who have left the employ of public health services entirely are: (a) 1204 (b) 1278 (c) 1326 EMPLOYER-EMPLOYEE AGREEMENTS, REDRAFTING 1189. Hon. C.L. Edwardes to the Minister for Consumer and Employment Protection I refer the Minister to the registration of Employer Employee Agreements (EEA) and ask - (a) why do EEAs that require amendment need to be re-drafted before signing and not initialled by both parties; (b) does the requirement of a total re-drafting, discriminate against those employees who want to negotiate a better deal at the time of signing; and (c) as employees cannot use the ‘time of signing’ to gain a better deal, will the Minister now stop unions from using the same practice? Mr J.C. KOBELKE replied: (a) There is no requirement that EEAs have to be re-drafted in their entirety if correction is required but any revision, which in the opinion of the Registrar may be confusing where it is merely altered, may need redrafting to ensure the parties understand their rights and obligations under the EEA . (b) No. (c) The statement made in the question is not correct. EMPLOYER-EMPLOYEE AGREEMENTS, DRAFTING ERRORS 1190. Hon. C.L. Edwardes to the Minister for Consumer and Employment Protection I refer the Minister to the registration of Employer Employee Agreements (EEA) and ask - (a) how many EEAs have been rejected because of drafting errors; (b) does the Industrial Relations Commission have a help desk to assist employers and employees in drafting an EEA; and (c) if not, why not? Mr J.C. KOBELKE replied: (a) EEAs are not rejected for drafting errors, only a failure to comply with the legislative requirements. (b) Registration of EEAs is a matter for the Registrar, not the WA Industrial Relations Commission. The Registrar’s staff provide information to persons, but do not advise on the drafting of documents.

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7945

(c) It is not appropriate that the registering authority advise on the drafting of documents. However, Government departments such as the Small Business Development Corporation or the Labour Relations Division of the Department of Consumer and Employment Protection are available to provide advice on the drafting of EEAs BUILDING INDUSTRY AND SPECIAL PROJECTS INSPECTORATE, EFFECTIVENESS 1317. Hon. C.L. Edwardes to the Minister for Consumer and Employment Protection I refer the Minister to the finding of the Royal Commission into the Building and Construction Industry that ‘In the Building Industry in Perth there is a strong perception that [the Building Industry and Special Projects Inspectorate], in contrast to the previous WA [Building Industry Taskforce], is ineffective. Part of this perception arises from a view that BISPI is reactive rather than proactive and has achieved little,’ and I ask - (a) what will the Government now do to ensure that the Inspectorate is a proactive body with a meaningful place in the management of industrial relations on building and construction sites; and (b) when does the Minister anticipate that the Inspectorate will be sufficiently empowered to eliminate the misuse of power in the industry and be given a role in enforcing the Code of Practice for the Building and Construction Industry? Mr J.C. KOBELKE replied: (a) The Building Industry and Special Projects Inspectorate (BISPI) has always adopted a proactive approach to breaches of state industrial law. BISPI conducts frequent visits to construction sites throughout the metropolitan area and regularly communicates with builders, subcontractors and individuals within the industry. BISPI investigates all reports of alleged unlawful conduct. Such investigations are initiated on BISPI’s own motion or in response to information obtained or received by BISPI inspectors, regardless of its source. The recent successful prosecution of CFMEU Assistant State Secretary, Joe McDonald is clear evidence of BISPI being proactive with investigations and prosecutions. A signed Protocol between BISPI and the Police means BISPI is able to facilitate quickly the reporting of criminal matters to the relevant police officer. (b) The Code of Practice for the Building and Construction Industry was never intended to be a document which would be enforced by BISPI. It is a voluntary Code, which was developed and agreed to by the major industry participants, including the CFMEU. The State Government expects industry participants to comply with the Code requirements. Compliance with the Code is mandatory for all State Government construction works. A private mediation service and the Code Monitoring Committee has been established to resolve disputes regarding compliance and to consider appropriate responses where breaches do occur. JUSTICES OF THE PEACE, AGE OF TERMINATION OF COMMISSIONS 1363. Dr J.M. Woollard to the Attorney General It is my understanding that the Justices of the Peace Bill 2003 proposes the termination of Justice of the Peace (JP) commissions at the age of 75. If this is correct, will the Attorney General explain how this age limit has been reached, with consideration of the following - (a) how many community Signing Centres are currently staffed by JPs; (b) in which cities, towns, and suburbs are Signing Centres located; (c) how many hours per week does each Signing Centre provide a service for their patrons; (d) how many JPs over the age of 75 are currently rostered at each of the Signing Centres; (e) is there a ready pool of younger JPs available to serve on the Signing Centre roster; (f) will the Signing Centres remain viable without the participation of the JPs who are over the age of 75; (g) what level of expertise and experience will be lost from the exclusion of JPs over the age of 75; (h) how will the community benefit by terminating the appointment of those JPs who have reached the age of 75 years; (i) what is the cost to the Ministry of Justice to support the operation of Signing Centres; and (j) are JPs currently appointed for life? Mr J.A. McGINTY replied: There is no proposal to terminate Justice of the Peace commissions at the age of 75 in the Justices of the Peace Bill 2003.

7946 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

MINISTERS OF THE CROWN AND MINISTERIAL STAFF, MEETINGS WITH MR BRIAN BURKE AND MR JULIAN GRILL 1404. Mr C.J. Barnett to the Parliamentary Secretary to the Minister for Agriculture, Forestry and Fisheries; the Midwest, Wheatbelt and Great Southern (1) Has the Minister met with Brian Burke or Julian Grill in his official capacity since 10 February 2001? (2) If so, to discuss what issues? (3) Has any senior member of the Minister’s Ministerial staff met with Brian Burke or Julian Grill in an official capacity since 10 February 2001? (4) If so, to discuss what issues? Mr F.M. LOGAN replied: (1) The Minister has not met with Brian Burke since 10 February 2001. He has met formally with Julian Grill on two occasions. The Minister has met informally with Mr Grill on a number of other occasions however these have not been in an official capacity and were casual or social occasions. (2) On 13 June 02 Mr Grill was present at a briefing provided to the Minister by Griffin Coal on their operations in Western Australia. On 25 September 02 Mr Grill attended a luncheon meeting with the Minister and representatives of United Utilities Limited regarding proposed water and sewerage projects in the Goldfields and the Wheatbelt. (3) No (4) Not applicable.

CANDLES, WICKS CONTAINING LEAD, BAN ON IMPORTATION, PRODUCTION AND SALE 1431. Mr B.K. Masters to the Minister for Health (1) Is lead a component of candle-wicks sold in Western Australia? (2) Is the Minister aware that the USA is about to ban the import, production and sale of candles with wicks containing lead due to concerns about children inhaling lead-bearing smoke or fumes from such candles when they are alight or recently extinguished? (3) Does the Western Australian government have the power to ban the import, production and/or sale of candles containing wicks which include lead? Mr R.C. KUCERA replied: 1. Candle wicks containing lead should not be available in Western Australia. Candles with wicks containing more than 0.06% lead have been banned permanently by the Commonwealth Trade Practices Act 1974, Consumer protection Notice No. 7 of 2002. 2. Yes. Australia has also banned such candles. 3. Not applicable, as the Commonwealth has legislation to control the sale of candle wicks containing lead.

LEAD CONCENTRATIONS IN HUMAN BLOOD, GUIDELINES 1432. Mr B.K. Masters to the Minister for Health (1) Under state and federal guidelines, what are the recommended maximum concentrations of lead in human blood above which there may be a risk to human health? (2) What studies have been done in Western Australia in recent years to show the average and range of concentrations of lead in humans, in particular, to show what impact the banning of leaded petrol has made to overall lead levels in the community? (3) What are the most common sources of lead in the Western Australian environment, now that leaded petrol is no longer available? (4) What research has been conducted to show a correlation between the level of lead in children and their intellectual development? Mr R.C. KUCERA replied: 1. The National Health and Medical Research Council has not recommended a maximum concentration of lead in human blood, as the level at which there is no risk to human health has not been definitively established. However the Council has set, as a national goal to be worked towards for all Australians, a blood lead level of

[ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003] 7947

less than 10ög/dL. The Council also recommends that cases of blood lead in excess of 15ög/dL should be investigated to see if a source of lead exposure can be identified and removed. 2. Recent studies of blood lead concentrations of Western Australians with no point source exposure to lead were conducted in 1991 (Health Department of Western Australia, Perth), 1995 (Australian Institute of Health and Welfare) and 2003 (Department of Health, Brookdale). The Brookdale survey, the first of any significant size known to have been carried out in Australia since the phase out of leaded petrol, shows a very substantial decline on levels previously detected. All petrol has been lead-free in Western Australia since January 2001. 3. The most common exposure for the wider population would be paint in older houses, which was lead-based. Renovation of older (pre-1970) houses poses special risks of inhalation of lead-containing dusts or ingestion of flakes of lead paint. Occupational exposure is still possible in industries such as the manufacture of pigments, battery manufacture, lead light windows etc. 4. A substantial body of well recognised research shows the association between exposure to lead and reduced intellectual capacity in exposed children. HOSPITALS, NORTH WEST, POSITRON EMISSION TOMOGRAPHY SCANNERS 1453. Mr L. Graham to the Minister for Health I refer to the announcement made in December 2002 of the installation of an $8million Positron Emission Tomography (PET) scanner at Sir Charles Gairdner Hospital, and ask – (a) how much is to be spent on similar equipment programs in the North West of the State; (b) in which towns and communities will the funds be spent; (c) who will be responsible for administering the funds; and (d) when will the programs commence operation in each town referred to above? Mr R.C. KUCERA replied: (a) The State has established a PET facility to provide services on a Statewide basis. The PET scanner is a large and expensive piece of equipment requiring specialist staffing. This restricts the State to one machine at a central location. Patients from country areas requiring PET scans will be transported to Perth. (b) Not applicable. (c) Not applicable. (d) Not applicable. SPORT AND RECREATION PROGRAMS, NORTH WEST 1467. Mr L. Graham to the Premier I refer to the December 2002 announcement that the Premier visited the new Royal Life Saving Society of Australia call centre in Bridgetown and presented a cheque for $200,000 to the new Bridgetown Recreation Centre, as part of a State Government commitment of $500,000 to the project, and ask – (a) how much is to be spent on similar programs in the North West of the State; (b) in which towns and communities will the funds be spent; (c) who will be responsible for administering the funds; and (d) when will the programs commence operation in each town referred to above? Dr G.I. GALLOP replied: (a) $2,558,029 was allocated to sport and recreation facilities in the North-West of the State in the 2003/04 round of the Community Sporting and Recreation Facilities Fund (CSRFF). (b) Broome Kununurra Derby Fitzroy Crossing Halls Creek Carnarvon Port Hedland Newman Tom Price Indigenous communities: Jarlmadangah Burru Aboriginal Corporation Kalumburu Aboriginal Corporation Wirrimanu Aboriginal Corporation

7948 [ASSEMBLY - Thursday, 15 May 2003]

(c) The Department of Sport and Recreation (through the Community Sporting and Recreation Facilities Fund). (d) The commencement of programs is the responsibility of the grantee. ROCKINGHAM PLANNING AND DEVELOPMENT TASK FORCE, STAFF AND COSTS 1485. Mr B.K. Masters to the Premier (1) In reference to the media statement of 30 April 2003, on the Rockingham Planning and Development Taskforce, how many staff or consultants will be employed and on what basis (part-time or full-time) to undertake the various taskforce projects? (2) For what period of time is the taskforce planned to exist? (3) What will be the total estimated cost for each year of the taskforce’s existence? (4) Will any of the members of the taskforce be paid for their attendance at meetings, etc? (5) Does the budget for the taskforce include an allowance for travel and, if yes, how much money is allocated for this purpose? Dr G.I. GALLOP replied: Cabinet has agreed to the establishment of the Rockingham Planning and Development Taskforce. The Taskforce will prepare a report for consideration by Cabinet later this year that assesses the range and scope of projects which require a State Government presence in the South West Corridor and to make recommendations on the organisational and reporting arrangements, project details and resource requirements for further action. The members of the Taskforce consist of the State Members for Rockingham and Peel, the Federal Member for Brand, the Mayor and CEO of the City of Rockingham, the CEO of the West Australian Land Authority, the Executive Director of the Department of Planning and Infrastructure (Planning) and the Director of Regional Policy in Premier and Cabinet. None of the Taskforce members will receive a remuneration or allowance as a result of their membership. The initial work of the Taskforce will be supported by a senior project officer and an executive officer resourced from within existing departmental budgets. WESTERN AUSTRALIAN LABOUR ADVISORY COUNCIL, ESTABLISHMENT 1487. Mrs C.L. Edwardes to the Premier I refer to an article in The Australian newspaper on Tuesday 29 April 2003 under the heading ‘Brawls to spoil union love-fest’ and ask – (a) is it correct that a Western Australian Labour Advisory Council has been established; (b) if so, what is the origin of the Council; (c) if so, who are the members; (d) when did the Council hold its first meeting; (e) how often will these meetings be held; (f) what is the purpose of these meetings; (g) are minutes being kept of these meetings; (h) is it correct that one objective of the Council is to give the union movement greater input into decisions made by the Government; (i) why was no public announcement made about the formation of the Council; (j) will a public statement be issued after each Council meeting; (k) if not, why not; and (l) is the establishment of this Council along the lines of Recommendation 15 of the National Committee of Review Report August 2002 by Hawke and Wran, and where it is stated that ‘Labor MPs should respond directly to local unionists priorities’ and support the role of local union activities.’? Dr G.I. GALLOP replied: The WA Labour Advisory Council is convened by the State Secretary of the Australian Labor Party and questions about the Council should be directed to the Party's office. ______