BRITISH-IRISH PARLIAMENTARY ASSEMBLY Fifty-Third Plenary Session 27-29 November 2016, Cardiff, South Wales 1 MEMBERSHIP OF THE BRITISH-IRISH PARLIAMENTARY ASSEMBLY STEERING COMMITTEE Co-Chairs Mr Laurence ROBERTSON MP Ms Kathleen FUNCHION TD Vice-Chairs Mr Declan BREATHNACH TD Senator Frank FEIGHAN Mr Andrew ROSINDELL MP Ms Karin SMYTH MP MEMBERS IN ATTENDANCE Oireachtas Members Westminster Members Mr Declan BREATHNACH TD Lord BEW Ms Joan BURTON TD Viscount BRIDGEMAN Mr Joe CAREY TD Mr Andrew BRIDGEN MP Senator Paul COGHLAN Ms Deidre BROCK MP Mr Séan CROWE TD Miss Rosie COOPER MP Senator Frank FEIGHAN Rt. Hon Baroness CORSTON Mr Peter FITZPATRICK TD Lord DUBS Ms Kathleen FUNCHION TD Mr Mark DURKAN MP Mr Pat the Cope GALLAGHER TD Lord EMPEY Senator Terry LEYDEN Mr Paul FARRELLY MP Mr Tony McLOUGHLIN TD Baroness HARRIS of Richmond Ms Margaret MURPHY O’MAHONY Ms Helen JONES MP Senator Catherine NOONE Mr Conor McGINN MP Mr Fergus O’DOWD TD Mr Mark PRITCHARD MP Mr Eamon SCANLON TD Ms Karin SMYTH MP Mr Brendan SMITH TD Mr Andrew ROSINDELL MP Senator Diarmuid WILSON Lord SKELMERSDALE 2 Welsh Assembly Members Scottish Parliament Members Ms Ann JONES AM Mr Willie COFFEY MSP Mr Steffan LEWIS AM Ms Linda FABIANI MSP Mr Ross GREER MSP Mr John SCOTT MSP Tynwald Member Mr Tim CROOKALL MLC Northern Ireland Assembly Members Mr David FORD MLA States of Jersey Member Mrs Brenda HALE MLA Apologies sent from representative Mr Barry McELDUFF MLA Mr Colin McGRATH MLA States of Guernsey Member Mr Robin SWANN MLA Deputy Al BROUARD OTHERS ATTENDING AS GUEST SPEAKERS Rt. Hon Carwyn Jones AM Ms Ann Jones AM First Minister of Wales Deputy Presiding Officer of the National Assembly for Wales Mr Robin Walker MP Parliamentary Under-Secretary of Dr. Brian Turner State, Department for Exiting the University College Cork European Union Mr Tim Gardner Rt. Hon James Brokenshire MP The Health Foundation Secretary of State for Northern Ireland His Excellency Mr Dan Mulhall Ambassador, Embassy of Ireland, London Rt. Hon Lord Whitty Chair of the House of Lords EU Internal Mark Sub-Committee 3 OFFICIALS Joint Clerks to the Assembly Clerks of the Devolved Institutions Dr Robin James, British Co-Clerk Mr Steven Bell Dr Laoise Moore-Durajczyk, Irish Ms Nicola Crawford Co-Clerk Mr Al Davies & Ms Cathryn Newman COMMITTEE CLERKS TO THE ASSEMBLY Committee A: Sovereign Matters Committee B: European Affairs Ms Marie-Claire Hughes Mr Ed Beale Mr Ed Faulkner Ms Marie-Claire Hughes Committee C: Economic Committee D: Environmental and Social Ms Kate Oliver Mr Stuart Stoner Dr Anna Dickson Ms Kate Oliver British and Irish Secretariats Official Reporters Mrs Veronica Carr (absent) Ms Claire Bennet Sir Michael Davies KCB Mr Hywel Evans Mrs Amanda Healy Mr Dominic Gilmore Miss Jessica O’Connor Ms Jodi Govier Mr Rónan O’Reilly Mr Eugene Wolstenholme 4 Monday 28 November 2016 The Assembly met at 9.35 am. PLENARY BUSINESS PROGRAMME OF BUSINESS The Co-Chairperson (Ms Kathleen Funchion TD): You are all very welcome to our 53rd British-Irish Parliamentary Assembly (BIPA) plenary. I am very pleased to be here in Cardiff. I thank the British Members for hosting us today. I extend special thanks to the Welsh Members and officials for their hospitality. I need to go into some administration and procedural issues before we get into our speakers and debates for today. I extend a special welcome to the honourable Joe Garcia MP, the Deputy Chief Minister of Gibraltar, and the delegation from the Government of Gibraltar this morning. [Applause.] I remind people to please turn off their mobile phones and any electronic devices. They interfere with the microphone equipment. People should turn their phones off or put them on airplane mode; it is not adequate to just have them on silent. When Members are invited to contribute, I ask them to state clearly their name and legislature for people who might not know everybody in the room. Finally, I remind Members that the proceedings of this body do not attract parliamentary privilege. [Laughter.] We have some Associate Members that I need to go through to inform the Assembly. In accordance with rule 2(a), the following Associate Members have accepted the invitation of the Steering Committee to assume the powers and responsibilities of Members for the whole of this session: Viscount Bridgeman, Lord Empey, Mark Pritchard MP, Lord Kilclooney and Tim Crookall MLC. They are also very welcome this morning. We have received apologies from Baroness Blood, Oliver Colvile MP, Jeffrey Donaldson MP, Nigel Evans MP, Jack Lopresti MP, Lord Mawhinney, Nigel Mills MP, Mark Griffin MSP, Deputy John Le Fondré, Deputy Mattie McGrath, Deputy Kevin Boxer Moran, Senator Niall Ó Donnghaile and Senator Landy. The Acting Co-Chairperson (Mr Andrew Rosindell MP): Good morning, ladies and gentlemen. Members, you are aware that we are attending the 53rd plenary session of the British-Irish Parliamentary Assembly here in Cardiff. A warm welcome to you all. You will have received a copy of the proposed programme of business. Over the next day and a half, we have a strong panel of speakers who will consider various items of relevance to British-Irish relations, not least the exiting of the United Kingdom from the European Union. First, we will hear from the First Minister of Wales, the Rt Hon Carwyn Jones AM. Following that, Robin Walker MP, the Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State for the Department for Exiting the European Union, will address the Assembly. That will be followed by a debate on the implications of Brexit for British-Irish relations. We will then 5 hear from the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland, the Rt Hon James Brokenshire MP. The Assembly will then break for lunch. At 2.30 pm, the Assembly will reconvene to continue its consideration of the implications of Brexit for British-Irish relations. We will hear from His Excellency Dan Mulhall, Ambassador of Ireland to the United Kingdom, and the Rt Hon Lord Whitty, the Chairman of the House of Lords EU Internal Market Sub- Committee. We expect today's session to conclude at around 5.00 pm. That will give Members the opportunity to freshen up ahead of travelling to this evening’s reception at the National Assembly for Wales, which will be followed by dinner at Cardiff Castle. On Tuesday morning, the Assembly will hear first from Ann Jones, the Deputy Presiding Officer of the National Assembly for Wales, on the Assembly's work on engaging children and young people. Following that, there will be a session examining the different health service funding and governance models in the BIPA jurisdictions. The Assembly will hear from Dr Brian Turner of University College Cork and Tim Gardner, a senior policy fellow at the Health Foundation. That will be followed by an update on the work of the BIPA Committees from the various Committee Chairmen. The Assembly will adjourn at 12.30 pm tomorrow lunchtime. Programme of Business agreed. ADDRESS BY THE FIRST MINISTER OF WALES The Co-Chairperson (Ms Kathleen Funchion TD): Thanks very much, Andrew. Members, as was stated, we are very honoured that the First Minister of Wales, Carwyn Jones, will give the Assembly's opening address. I now call on the First Minister to address the Assembly, please. [Applause.] Mr Carwyn Jones AM (The First Minister of Wales): Thank you, Kathleen. Go raibh maith agat. Bore da, bawb. Mae’n bleser mawr i gael chi gyd yma yng Nghymru am y tro cyntaf, rwy’n credu. It is a great pleasure to have you all here. I think that this is the first time that BIPA has met in session here in our capital city. Céad míle fáilte go dtí an Bhreatain Bheag. I begin by expressing my appreciation to the Co- Chairs for their kind invitation to speak this morning. Following on from last week’s British- Irish Council, it is good to have the opportunity to discuss and debate areas of common interest. I have a particular personal interest in the affairs of this body in the sense that I am a Welshman married to an Irishwoman from Belfast. I can say with a hand on my heart that the co-operation across the Irish Sea that so many of us wish to promote has happened in our household for the past 22 years. It is fantastic to see so many of you here in Cardiff today. We know that we find ourselves at a hugely important moment not just for these islands but for the world. The UK begins soon, we think, the process of leaving the European Union. It is important for us to reflect on and discuss the challenges that lie ahead. I have been very clear about what I want to see for Wales. I want to see us as an outward-looking nation that is ready and willing to reach out to and cooperate with our partners across the globe. 6 Nowhere is this better evidenced than here in our capital city of Cardiff, a city founded on Wales's trading relationship with the rest of the world. The first £1 million cheque was written in this city. It was a cheque to buy coal on the part of the US Navy. It is one of the most diverse and open cities anywhere in the UK. I imagine that the focus for the next two days will be the profound implications that EU withdrawal will have for British-Irish relations. We know that the result of the referendum will have major ramifications for our politics and our communities.