COMMISSION OF INQUIRY RESPECTING THE DEATH OF DONALD DUNPHY Transcript Volume 30 Commissioner: Honourable Justice Leo Barry Friday 24 February 2017 February 24, 2017 Commission of Inquiry Respecting the Death of Donald Dunphy No. 30 MS. SHEEHAN: All rise. I declare this Commission of Inquiry open. Commissioner Leo Barry presiding. Please be seated. THE COMMISSIONER: Okay. Go ahead when you’re ready, Ms. O’Brien. MS. O’BRIEN: Thank you. I’ve finished my direct examination of Sergeant Henstridge, so we’re into cross-examination now. So I think the first lawyer would be Erin Breen. THE COMMISSIONER: Okay, Ms. Breen. MS. BREEN: Thank you. Mr. Commissioner, I do feel like I will be a little longer than Mr. Simmonds said I will be yesterday. I just wanted to alert you to that at the beginning. I will not be repeating Ms. O’Brien, but I do have areas to cover with …. THE COMMISSIONER: Well, do the best you can. MS. BREEN: I will. THE COMMISSIONER: We have other witnesses, yeah. Thank you. MS. BREEN: Good morning, Sergeant Henstridge. Erin Breen for Ms. Dunphy. Sergeant Henstridge, I apologize if I call you Corporal Henstridge during this examination. It’s just that you were Corporal Henstridge at the time, we’ve been referring to you as Corporal Henstridge. So I do apologize in advance because I think I will slip, but I understand – SGT HENSTRIDGE: No, that’s fine. MS. BREEN: – you’ve been promoted in rank since that time. STG HENSTRIDGE: That’s fine. MS. BREEN: Sergeant Henstridge, how long were you with St. John’s Major Crime section? SGT HENSTRIDGE: Approximately seven-and-a-half years. MS. BREEN: Okay. And during that time frame, how long was Staff Sergeant Osmond your supervisor? SGT HENSTRIDGE: The entire time. 1 February 24, 2017 Commission of Inquiry Respecting the Death of Donald Dunphy No. 30 MS. BREEN: Okay. And how long have you worked with Corporal Burke? SGT HENSTRIDGE: At that point it would have been approximately three years, I think. MS. BREEN: Okay. And in the past had you worked with Corporal Burke as your lead investigator? SGT HENSTRIDGE: I can’t be certain but it seems like there was a file in which he was the primary and I was a tasker, but I can’t recall exactly when. MS. BREEN: Okay. And in reverse, had there been previous files where you were lead investigator and Corporal Burke worked as a tasker? SGT HENSTRIDGE: Yes, there was. MS. BREEN: Okay. And how many, roughly, cases would have been like that? SGT HENSTRIDGE: Three or four. MS. BREEN: Okay. So, Sergeant, is it fair to say that you work very closely with Corporal Burke and Sergeant Osmond? SGT HENSTRIDGE: That’s correct. MS. BREEN: And that throughout this file we see in the disclosure that you met with them regularly, frequently, I would suggest, early, and discussed ideas and tasks? SGT HENSTRIDGE: During the initial days, yes. MS. BREEN: And that you work in the same offices, do you? You work – SGT HENSTRIDGE: That’s correct. MS. BREEN: – in physical proximity to one another very closely. SGT HENSTRIDGE: That’s correct. MS. BREEN: Sergeant, you’ve also worked with – or I should say have you worked before with Darryl Barr? We understand Darryl Barr is being called as a witness in this case. SGT HENSTRIDGE: Yes, his name is familiar to me. I think we may have used him as a firearms person on another file but I’ve never met the man and I don’t know …. MS. BREEN: Okay. We see that in – I won’t bring up the exhibit but it’s P-0359, page 266. I understand that Mr. Barr had been retained by the RCMP on the Crockwell case. Would that – is that the case you’re referring to? SGT HENSTRIDGE: Yes. And, actually, that’s another occasion when Corporal Burke would have been a primary and I would have been a tasker on that file as well. 2 February 24, 2017 Commission of Inquiry Respecting the Death of Donald Dunphy No. 30 MS. BREEN: And Dr. Peter Collins, do you know Dr. Peter Collins? SGT HENSTRIDGE: Yes, I do. MS. BREEN: Okay. And how do you know Dr. Peter Collins? SGT HENSTRIDGE: Through an investigation, another investigation that we retained him for. MS. BREEN: Okay. And what year was that? SGT HENSTRIDGE: 2013 perhaps, 2014. MS. BREEN: Okay. And this was the major crimes unit had retained him? SGT HENSTRIDGE: Pardon me? MS. BREEN: The major crimes unit had retained Dr. Collins. Is that correct? SGT HENSTRIDGE: Yes, that’s correct. MS. BREEN: Okay. And what was the purpose of his retention at that time, do you know? SGT HENSTRIDGE: It was in relation to assisting with a task on a particular historical homicide that we were working on. MS. BREEN: Okay. And was this the only time that you had worked or had you – you met Dr. Collins at that time I presume. SGT HENSTRIDGE: Yes, that’s correct. MS. BREEN: And had he been used prior to – by the major crimes unit prior to that? SGT HENSTRIDGE: No. MS. BREEN: Or since? SGT HENSTRIDGE: Not for me to know. I don’t believe so. MS. BREEN: Okay. Now, Sergeant, just before we get to this matter a couple of questions I want to ask you because I understand that you are – you have a lot of training in the area of interviewing techniques. SGT HENSTRIDGE: Yes. MS. BREEN: And general, I guess, police work in terms of taking statements of witnesses. Is that correct? SGT HENSTRIDGE: That’s correct. MS. BREEN: And would you agree that it is important for an investigator to take notes at all times, have the notebook, and record key times? SGT HENSTRIDGE: I would agree with that, yes. 3 February 24, 2017 Commission of Inquiry Respecting the Death of Donald Dunphy No. 30 MS. BREEN: Okay. And the key times for taking statements from witnesses or interviewing witnesses would be the interview start time and the interview end time. Do you agree with that? SGT HENSTRIDGE: Yes. MS. BREEN: Okay. Now, I was not here yesterday, Sergeant, but I did review your testimony last night, and I will do my very best not repeat any ground where Ms. O’Brien has already gone. And, I think, it’s fair to say that you have acknowledged there were numerous errors in the – at least with the statement of Constable Smyth that you had conducted on April the 6th. SGT HENSTRIDGE: Yes. MS. BREEN: And, Sergeant, I saw your testimony yesterday, and I know that you have acknowledged that you had, what I would describe to be, an emotional reaction when you entered into Mr. Dunphy’s house. SGT HENSTRIDGE: That’s correct. MS. BREEN: And that what you described to Ms. O’Brien in your interview was that you had enormous empathy for what Constable Smyth had gone through the night before. And that you think that might have clouded some of your common sense during the interview? SGT HENSTRIDGE: Yes, that was possible. MS. BREEN: And this was at page 139 of the interview. And you said to her, at that time: Whether it was because he was a police officer or I empathized with him for some other reason, I can’t really say. SGT HENSTRIDGE: Yes. MS. BREEN: Do you recall saying that to Ms. O’Brien? SGT HENSTRIDGE: Yes. MS. BREEN: You also told Ms. O’Brien at that time, Sergeant, that you had fixated a little bit on that, on that issue, as to whether or not you would’ve been able to react in time. SGT HENSTRIDGE: Yes, I did say that. MS. BREEN: And that was at page 57, lines 3 to 6 of the interview for the benefit of counsel. So it bothered you, obviously, Sergeant. And you did fixate on that part. SGT HENSTRIDGE: To a certain extent, yes. MS. BREEN: Okay. Now, you’ve also acknowledged that in your training no information known to the investigative team should have been given to a witness unless it was for an investigative purpose. SGT HENSTRIDGE: That’s correct. 4 February 24, 2017 Commission of Inquiry Respecting the Death of Donald Dunphy No. 30 MS. BREEN: You also agreed with Ms. O’Brien – this is at page 141 – that there were certain statements made by Corporal Burke in that interview that were also inappropriate. SGT HENSTRIDGE: I’d have to see which statements you’re referring to, but …. MS. BREEN: In particular, she referred you to the fact that Corporal Burke told Constable Smyth about where, apparently, the firearm had – how it had gotten into Mr. Dunphy’s house. It had come from family members. I believe that was the statement she was referring to. SGT HENSTRIDGE: Yes. MS. BREEN: Okay. And, Sergeant, if you could just tell us why it is that it is inappropriate to provide information to a witness when you are investigating a situation such as this? SGT HENSTRIDGE: Typically, the issue is you don’t really know what the relevance of the information is at that particular time that you’re conducting that interview and therefore information should, for the most part, be a silo. As I mentioned yesterday, there’s information exchanged during an interview and these interviews can go on for extended periods of time. And sometimes mistakes are made in an effort to build rapport and in an effort to encourage dialogue. In that case, no, it shouldn’t be.