1881. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. 383'
Mr. DAVIS, of West Virginia. I move that the Senate proceed to mittoo of the Whole on the state of th7Uiiion with the view of tak- the oonsi.deration of executive business. ing up the funding bill. : The motion was agreed to; and the Senate proceeded to the con Mr. FRYE. Before the House goes into Committee of the Whole,. sideration of executive business. After twelve minutes spent in ex I would like to inquire, as the gentleman from New York, [Mr. FER ecutive session the doors were reopened, and (at four o'clock and ~ANDO WooD,] the chairman ?f the Committee on Ways and Means,. twelve minutes p.m.) the Senate adjourned. IS absent, what arrangement, 1f any, was made touching the length of general debate and the division of time. The SPEAKER. The Clerk will read an extract from the Journal of the proceedings of December 22, 1880. The Clerk read as follows: HOUSE OF REPRESE~TTATIVES. Mr. FERNANDO WooD, by unanimous consent, moved that when theHousenext .resumes in Committee of the Whole House on the state of the Union the consid ~ration of the bill of the Honse No. 4592 to facilitate the refunding of the national•, THURSDAY, January 6, 1881. debt, all general debate thereon shall be limited to one day ; the time to be eqnally. divided between the supporters and opponents of the bilL The House met at twelve o'clock m. Prayer by the Chaplain, Rev. Mr. FRYE. Now, Mr. Speaker, I would like to inquire whether or W. P. HARRISO~, D. D. not gentlemen have signified to the chairman of the committee their The Journal of yesterday was read and approved. desire to occupy this tim·e. I do not understand that any arrange CUSTOMS DISTRICT I:'i MAINE. ment has been made touching the occupation of the time. I simply The SPEAKER. The Chair desires to state that the bill which desire that gentlemen who are in favor of a funding bill may know was yesterday passed by unanimous consent, on the motion of the that half the time of to-day's debate is appropriated to those who gentleman from Ohio, [Mr. TOWNSEND,] during the morning call of favor such a measure, and no names of gentlt1men who desire to occupy committees, was, according to the record, on the Calendar. The the time have been gi_ven to the chairman of the committee. I under Chair at the time was under the impression that the gentleman from stand that the gentleman from New York [Mr. CmTTENDEN] desires. Ohio was reporting it from the Committee on Commerce. The House half an hour to follow the gentleman from Pennsy1 vania [Mr. KELLEY J had better agree that the record shall show that the bill was taken who opens the debate this morning against the bill. from the Calendar for consideration by unanimous consent. The SPEAKER. The gentleman from Pennsylvania [Mr. KELLEY} Mr. TOWNSEND, of Ohio. I make that request. and the gentleman from Texas [Mr. Mn.Ls] both desire to speak, as The SPEAKER. The Chair never allows the record of the pro the Chair is advised. ceedings to be touched without the consent of the House. Mr. MILLS. I desire to state that there was an agreement between Mr. TO,VNSEND, of Ohio. I beg to state that the matter was a the gentleman from New York [Mr. FERNANDO Woon] and myself mistake on my part-a misapprehension. The bill was placed in my that he should parcel out the time among those who are supporting hands by my colleague on the committee, the gentleman from Vir his bill, and(the gentleman from Pennsylvania, 1\Ir. KELLEY, not beincr ginia, [Mr. BEALE.] I was not aware that the bill was on the Cal then present) that I should parcel out the time among the opponent';. endar. of the bill. The SPEAKER. The Chair did not intend to reflect in the least .A. MEMBER. Judge KELLEY is here. on the gentleman from Ohio. On the contrary he knew that the bill Mr. MILLS. I know that; bnt he was not here at the time I speak. was brought up by the request of the gentleman from Virginia, [Mr. of. He and I understand each other in reference to this matter. BEALE.] If there be no objection, the record in regard to the bill The gentleman from Maryland [Mr. McLANE] also wishes to speak. . will be made up in the form which the Chair has suggested. The SPEAKER. This is a matter which is always regulated by l1r. TOWNSEND, of Ohio. In what shape will that leave the bill~ the chairman of the Commiitee of the Whole, in accordance with The SPEAKER. It will leave it passed, so far as the Hoose is con- the rules. cerned. The Chair hears no objection. ' Mr. MILLS. Yes, sir; and members of the committee that reported ORDER OF BUSINESS. the bill will have precedence in the discussion. Mr. WHITTHORNE. I ask unanimous consent to take from the The SPEAKER. The Chair is speaking of the Committee of the Speaker's table, for reference to the Committ.ee on Naval .Affairs, Sen Whole on the state of the Union. ate bill No. 616 to promote the efficiency of the Navy. Mr. MILLS. I understand that; but the chairman of the Com Mr. BELFORD, Mr. MILLS, and others, called for the regular mitteeof the Whole will defer to the Committee on Ways and Means order. in regard to the course of the discussion. · The SPEAKER. The regular order is the call of committees for The SPEAKER. The Chair never undertakes to rule in the Ho'tlSe reports. as to what should be done in Committee of the Whole. Mr. TUCKER. I move to dispense with the call of committees for Mr. COVERT. In answer to the question of the gentleman from to-day, my object being to move that the House go into Committee Maine, I desire to state that a number of gentlemen have spoken to of the Whole to resume the consideration of the funding bill. me desiring to speak on this question, among them the gentleman Mr. REAGAN. Inasmuch as the sense of the House was taken upon from Missouri, [Mr. BLAND,] and the gentleman from Illinois, [Mr. the funding bill in antagonism to the bill which we had up yester SPR~GER,] whom I do not now see in his seat. day, I do not feel that I would be josthled in.opposing the proposi Mr. BLAND. I have an amendment to the bill which I desire to. tion to go into Committee of the Whole on the funding bill. discuss. The SPEAKER. The Chair under the rules most recognize the 1\Ir. MILLS. I claim that the Committee on 'Vays and Means ought. motion of the gentleman from Virginia, [Mr. TucKER.] The gentle to be entitled first to discuss the question before other gentlemen. man from Texas [Mr. REAGAN] could not reach his bill until after Mr. FRYE. The gentleman from Texas states he has charge of the the morning hour. time against the bill and that the chairman of the Committee on Mr. REAGAN. Perhaps the Chair misunderstood my remark. I Ways and Means reserved to himself the charge of the time for the· observed that inasmuch as the sense of the House had previously been bill. The chairman of the committee will not be here to take charge· taken between these two bills, I would not antagonize the purpose of of the time for the bill, and I do not propose to take it and allot the the Committee on Ways and Means to take up the funding bill. time even if I could. Therefore I simply desire to give notice to those· Mr. BURROWS. Will the gentleman from Virginia [Mr. TucKER] who are friendly to the bill and desire to speak that there will be a yield to me for a moment Y chairman in his place in a few minutes who undoubtedly will have· The SPEAKER. The regular order has been demanded; and the conti·ol of it, and those gentlemen may signifv to him, without refer gentleman from Virginia has not the right to yield. ence to the chairman of the Committee on 'ways and Means, what Mr. BURROWS. I understood the gentleman to ask to uispense time they desire. I do not propose to undertake to allot the time. with the morning hour. Mr. TuCKER's motion was agreed to; and the Honse accordingly· The SPEAKER. The demand for the regular order was made by resolved itself into the Committee of the Whole House on the state rhe gentleman from Colorado, and others. of the Union, Mr. CoVERT in the chair. Mr. BURROWS. Pending which the gentleman from Virginia The CHAIRMAN. The House is in Committee of the Whole Honse· moved to dispense with the morning hour. on the state of the Union, and resumes, as the first business in order, ·The SPEAKER. That motion is in order. the consideration of the hill (H. R. No. 4592) to facilitate the refund lli. BURROWS. I ask the gentleman to yield to me to make are ing of the national debt. When the committee rose the gentleman port. from Iowa [Mr. WEAVER] had twenty-five minutes of his time remain The SPEAKER. The regular order is demanded. The Chair rec ing, which the Chair understands he now yields to the gentleman from ognizes under the rules the motion of the gentleman from Virginia; Pennsylvania, [Mr. KELLEY,] who i@ therefore entitled to the tloor. and while holding the floor upon that motion the gentleman cannot Mr. KELLEY. I Mr. Chairman, let us see what economy invites us to do and what would be an interest rate during the period of gradual payment of we may do if it has not been predetermined by a majori~y of .this from 2.60 to 2.65 per cent. Two hundred million dollars carry 6 per 'Honse that we must refund, must fall into the wake of European cent. and $437,000,000 carry 5 per cent. He who will add the total of nations and adopt the worst of their characteristics, the creation of interest on these two sums for ten years and divide it by two will great national debts; if we are not unwilling that foreign statesmen ascertain the annual rate of interest we will have paid, and find shall continue to bold us up, as the writers of England, Germany, and that it will have been lower than that proposed by any bill. France are doing, as a people so prosperous that, while we invite mill No bill proposes to pay less than 3 per cent. Therefore they all pro ions of immigrants from every other country, we proceed year by year pose to pay for the privilege of surrendering the option we are soon to pay our debt and are thus enabled to reduce the rate of interest on to possess. They propose to pay for the privilege of extending a he constantly diminishing balance of our debt. debt which we may pay year by year out of our current surplus at a Of the six hundred and thirty-seven millions which are to be pro lower rate of annual interest than is proposed in any bill, and to extend -vided for-and as the Secretary bas paid forty-two millions in the first it by the scheme of the Secretary of the Treasury for fifteen years, part of this year, when the 1st of July comes round it will be found that with a possibility of forty years, and by that of the Committee of much, if not all, of the thirty-seven millions will have disappeared Ways and Means for twenty years, with a possibility of forty years. but if the account should then stand as it does now, there would be In the name of the nation that stands as an exemplar to the op two hundred millions of six per-cents. They would be paid in a little pressed people of the world I appeal to gentlemen to do no wanton -over three years, and the interest on those two hundred millions act which shall lead them to believe that the American people regard would be less than 5 per cent. for the period of payment; not 150 a national debt as a national blessing and are willing to pay for the per cent., or 120 per cent., as proposed. privilege of perpetuating it. But gentlemen say, we will buy in the long bonds we propose to I have made no statement upon my mere judgment. I have given issue and save the interest. Why issue them if you can so soon pay the data, and every gentleman can calculate what will be the rate -them f At what rate of premium will you buy them f If you have of interest we will pay by extinguishing this debt by constant pay paid nearly four millions in one year to buy maturing bonds, what will ments for ten years. To issue bonds at 3 per cent. as proposed for be the premium on bonds having fifteen, twenty, or forty years to 500,000,000 to run the full ten years and notes for 137,000,000 more runT Who can say f Look where your 4 per cent. bonds stand to-day. bearing the same rate, as is also proposed, the iD.terest on the $500,000,- .At 113. Why f Because they are long bonds, though bearing a low 000 for ten years will be $150,000,000, and that on the notes $41,205, rate of interest. You can buy the maturing sixes at 2-1 or thereabouts; 180, making a total interest of 6191,205,180. That is the amount of but go to buy a long four and you pay 13. And it is proposed to get rid interest we will pay if we borrow but for ten years and not for the . -of the optional control of this deut in order to enjoy the privilege of longer time proposed by the committee's bill. · paying the premium that may be demanded when the Government To meet the principal and the interest at the end of ten years will shall go into the market to bid against itself for the purchase of its require $828,555,780, bonds. Who that advocates ~ncb theories as these may talk of sagacity My throat, Mr. Chairman, is so much affected that I shall have to or honesty without feeling the reproach of hypocrisy every time be omit much I would have been glad to say; but I must add that I find .applies the innuendo to those who oppose so extravagant a scheme¥ by the figures before me that while the cost of the payment of the Admit, sir, that it will take something over three years to pay the six sixes and the fives, assuming that the whole shall remain unabated per-cents; here is a calculation to which I invite attention: I ask by payments during the current half year, would, as I have already gentlemen to mark that I deduct the interest only at the end of the said, be$828,555,780; but allowing only for annual payments of interest _year. The Secretary calls matured bonds by the week or the month, at the end of each year, allowing the Secretary of the Treasury to and when they are paid interest on them stops, and the interest thus hoard the surplus revenue until the end of the year, instead of reducing liberated increases the purchasing power of the Government. But as interest by making weekly or monthly payments, as he has been doing, I could not obtain the data on which to calculate all that, I thus and which it is certain he will continue to do, the total cost would be throw at least ten millions into the account against myself by making not much over eight hundred and twenty millions of dollars, show the interest payable onlyonce a year, and that at the end of the year. ing a saving by paying the debt, even with the allowance of all sums Assuming that there will be on the 1st of July two hundred millions that will be paid between now and the 1st of July next, and with -of six per-cents, which there cannot be; with the first payment in July, the allowance for the annual payment of interest only, a saving as 1882, the interest will be $12,000,000; with the second payment, in against the 3 per cent. ten-year bonds, of within $93 of five millions 1883, the interest will be $8,400,000; with the third payment, in 1884, of dollars. the interest will be $4,000,000. The fourth payment, which would By paying these bonds in this way we would have no syndicate to include forty millions of five per-cents, after paying the whole of the market new bonds; we would pay no commission of one-half of 1 per sixes, $180,000,0001 in three years, and $20,000,00() in the fourth, will cent. to such syndicate; we would cause no disturbance of the financial be $1,200,000, or a total interest account of twenty-six millions. So market of our own or other nations. The people would know that much for the sixes. That part of our debt would then be paid. We each month the surplus revenue was being applied to the reduction would ;not thru:eafter have to o1fer premiums to anybody to permit us of our interest account by the calling in at par of bonds on which the to pay 1t. Themterest account V\Ould have been wiped out by the pay Government bad an option. ment of the principal. The twelve millions a year it had originally Sir, I bad hoped to say many things which I feel might be useful amounted to would remain in our coffers, earning money and com to some members on this floor. I find, however, that in view of the .poonding interest for the people instead of for bondholders. And condition of my throat I must omit them, but not without recurring mark you, sir, the amount of interest that you would pay in thus briefly to the question, Can we pay these bonds and thus reduce the extinguishing the debt calculated upon the whole sum would be debtf greatly reduced. The whole sum at the start, say twelve millions Are we not more in numbers than we were between August, 1865, per annum, would be six millions at 3 per cent., and would continue and August,l870 T Are we not more prosperous than we were between six millions so long as your bonds were outstanding. But under the 1873 and 1878 T Is not the South a section of our country from which system I propose both principal and interest will have disappeared in we now gather large revenues; and was she not a tax upon us in the less than four years. autumn and early winter of 1865 T Are not immigrants :flowing in Wha.t is to be said on the subject of the fives f The interest on the upon us in unparalleled 11.umbers, and are not those immigrants drawn whole body of fives, $437,000,000, would have run during the three from classes of people who have heretofore come to us rarely and in years and ten months required to pay the sixes, and therefore we will but small numbers f Do not these immigrants bring with them cap charge it up at$83,825,532. We start in this account with$437,000,000, ital, skill in agriculture and varied branches of industry f Do they less $40,000,000 paid in the fourth year, leaving $397,350,600 as the not come to increase our tax-bearing power-to share our taxes and balance due May 1, 1885. all our other burdens T Are we so craven, have we so lost confi At the fifth payment of $60,000,000, May 1, 1886, the interest will dence in the energy and integrity of the American people, as to 'be $19,867,520. At the sixth payment the interest will be $16,867,520. believe that fifty millions in the height of abounding prosperity can . .At the next payment the interest will be $13,867,520, and the next not do what thirty-seven millions did when emerging from a deso payment will show an interest charge of $1D;867,520. The payment lating war or living thro~_s.h a panic that suspended the trade of the in 1890 will show an. interest charge of $7,867,520; the payment world T From 1865 to 1~0 our average annual pa.yment upon our -of 189t will show an interest charge of $4,867,520, and in 1892 but debt was more than fifty-seven millions; and I reiterate the state $48,000,000 would be required to pay the last bond, and the interest ment that our payment last year was nearly seventy-four millions, for that yeat would be $1,867,520. and that in the first six months of the current fiscal year we paid The interest on the sixes would be $26,400,000, and that on the fives nearly forty-three million dollars. Our revenue steadily increases. while the annual payments were going on would be $76,072,000 and Without reflecting upon the motives of any one, I will say that were for the period required to pay the six per-cents would, as I have said, I to seek a motive that would induce me to surrender an optional be $83,825,000, giving a total of interest during the whole process of right to p;i.y these bonds out of our current income, I would find it payment of $186,298,062. (my mind may be peculiar) only in the fact that I might de ire to By this process we would have paid every bondholder that was en give some of my banking friends the privilege to become members of a titled to 6 per cent. his full interest, and.every one entitled to 5 per syndicate and to share the commissions and profits to be derived from .-cent. his full interest; yet we would have paid interest on the whole mortgaging the lands, labor, and enterprise of the American people debt for but one-half of the period, for we would have been paying for terms ranging from fifteen through twenty to forty ye¥'rs. it regularly along and extinguishing the debt in ten years, so that I must say a. few words more, let come what may come. Let me the total interest paid would be precisely five years' full interest. It show what has happened to the nations of Europe from familiarity XI-25 386 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. J .A.lffi AR~ 6, witb making loans. Let us see how insidiously but overwhelmingly Indeed, sir, no portion of this debt should be refunded into new national Mr. WIDTE. Efforts have been made to put it into circulation. :Mr. KEIFER. It is not offered yet. Mr. WEAVER. Only to enable the Secretary to hoard the green Mr. SPRINGER. I understood that unanimous consent was asked backs. to offer it at the proper time. If consent were now given that it Mr. FORT. About nineteen million dollars is represented by cer should be offered, it would not be subject to a point of order unless tificates. points of order were reserved. Mr. WHITE. And about twenty-five million dollars :ne in circu A MEMBER. The amendment has only been read to ue printed. lation. Mr. CHITTENDEN. Mr. Chairman, I am taken entirely by sur Mr. WEAVER. And the remainder, about thirty million dollars, is prise by the course of this debate to-day. I spent more than an hour idle in the Treasury and can be paid with all future coinage on these yesterday in trying to :find out its probable course and my chance of bonds. an opportunity to speak. The most encouragement I obtained pointed Let me ask the gentleman if he will vote for an amendment to this to a possible permis ion to speak for five minutes during the time of bill which will compel the Secretary of the Treasury to pay out silver three other members at some indefinite stage of the debate, under the coin in payment of these bonds f five-minute rule. Before leaving my house this morning I was in Mr. WHITE. In answer to the question of the gentleman from Iowa formed that the chairman of the Committee on Ways and Means was [Mr. WEAVER] I will say that I never cross a stream until I come to ill and that this funding bill would not come up to-day. Hence I it. I will be prepared for that question when it comes up. I believe left a,t home the few meager notes which I had prepared for my that nuder the act of 1870 there is no violation of the contract if three speeches of :five minutes each, and I happen to have nothing we pay the bonds in silver. I will take the law as I find it. And, with me now but a small memorandum pointing to the doctrines for furthermore, I am conscious of t,he fact that we have now outstanding which I speak here to-day and which have been uttered on this floor 4t and 4 per cent. bonds without any privilege of that kind. I do by our late associate, the distinguished gentleman from Ohio, the not want any amendment offered in regard to these bonds.which will President-elect of the United States. Fortunately for me, I have cripple the power of the Secretary of the Treasury to negotiate them. these te;x:ts to fall back upon. Mr. WEAVER. Are not the 4t and 4 per cent. bonds payable in A single word personal to myself and then I will state my doctrine silver coin Y upon this question. If there be a man of this body who is in a posi Mr. WHITE. They are nuder the same rule. tion to be judicially impartial, absolutely unbiased by any selfish or Mr. WEAVER. Of course they are. political consideration in discussing this subject, I am such a man. Mr. WHITE. I would have no discrimination against these bonds; I do not own a Government bond; I do not own a share of national I would have them on the same footing with the others. bank stock; I have not a shilling deposited subject to any such influ Mr. WEAVER. That would be no discrimination. ence or force. Mr. WHITE. I say this, that the 4t and 4 per cent. bonds are issued Now, Mr. Chairman, I will ask the Clerk to read a.n extract from a and negotiated nuder the act of 1870. Many people think they are speech made by General Garfield on the 13th of July, 1876, which is a payable eithf'lr in gold or silver, as the Government may see fit; the better answer than I can give to those who insist upon paying the gentleman so says. It is now proposed to issue bonds at 3 per cent. national debt in silver. to take up these maturing bonds. I do not wnnt to put a badge upon The Clerk read a follows: these bonds which will depreciate them in the market. It is claimed that, by the terms of the act of 1869, it would be lawful for us to Mr. McLANE. And make it impossible to sell them. r~~ ~~ls~~~£ ~e~s\f sih·er dollars such as might have been coined under the Mr. WHITE. And make it impossible to sell them. Now I desire to recall to the miDd of the Honse the letter and the spirit of .that Mr. WEAVER. The gentleman does not answer my question. law. After all the doubt and the turbulent excitement n.bout what the actual ob Mr. WHITE. I will answer it. ligation of the nation was in regard to the public debt, the firat act of the Congress Mr. WEAVER. My question is whether this Government has not approved by President Grant ma.de a solemn decln.ration designed to put oJl those doubts to rest. It was declared by Congress that- the option to pay these bonds after the 1st of July, and whether the "The faith of the United States is solemnly pledged to the payment" gentleman is in favor of exhausting the hoard of silver on hand in In wbati Not in silver, not in gold, not in coin, but- their payment before we proceed to fund any of them? "in coin or its equivalent of all the obligations of the United States not bearing in Mr. WHITE. I want tbe Treasury Department to exhau tall the terest, known as United States notes, nnd of all the interest-bearing obligations of the Unit-ed States, except in cases where the law authorizin~ the issue of any such surplus funds it has over current expenses to meet any obligations of obligations has expressly provided that the same may be paid in lawful money or the Government in gold or silver or paper. other currency than gold and silv6r." Mr. WEAVER. Including the silver dollar ~ The declaration there was that the payment of all these national oblig~tiona not Mr. WHITE. Certainly. S'{lecificallycurrencvobligations was to be in "coin or ifs equivalent." .Now, what d1d Congress mean·~ Wliat were our laws before 1861 ~ Why, Mr. Speaker, since Mr. WEAVER. I am very glad my friend has taken square ground 1634 we have had one standard, a dollar; and we have by law em bodied it in two on that proposition, but it is not the doctrine of his party. Without metals, gold and silver. But all the time, in order to have one standard, not two, an amendment to this bill, specifically requiring the Secretary of the we have sought to make the coins of the two metals conform to the one standard; Treasury to pay out silver on the bonds falling due this year, it will keepin"' the amount of metal in one so adjusted to the amount of metal in the other that a 8ollarof gold shoul8. be equivalent to a dolla.r of silver. Every hour that we not be done; for we have the public declaration of the Secretary of had a double standard it was double ouly on the ground of equivalency; and when the Tren.sury that he will allow the holder of public securities to de by reason of the shifting value of the two metals in reference to each other the mand either form of lawful money. That is equivalent to saying silver dollar nnd the gold dollar have varied from each other in value Congress that the silver shall remain in the Treasury. has undertaken to equalize them by increasing the amount of metal in one or de creasing the amount of metal in the other. We always sought to avoid the evil of Now, in the face of that declaration a.nd in the fa-ce of the fact that having two kinds of dollar, one worth more than the other. .And when Congress this silver is hoarded and is not accounted a part of the money avail promised to pay in coin it was a promise to pay gold coin or silver coin cf equal able for the payment of the public debt, if we pass this bill without value to the same nominal sum in gold. I cannot believe that this statement Will a specific declaration that the Secretary of the Treasury shall pay be denied. out the silver, it will not be done. At the proper time, Mr. Chair Mr. WARNER. Will the gentleman allow the Clerk to read in this man, I propose to offer an amendment providing that nothing in this connection the Stanley Matthews resolution f I have it here. bill shall be construed to authorize the SecretRry of the Treasury to Mr. CHITTENDEN. I cannot yield. retain in the Treasury the surplus standard silver coin, but that he Mr. BLAND. I would like the gen~leman to state what change shall exhaust it in payment of the bonds falling due in common w.ith was ever made in the silver dollar. The gold dollar was changed, all other lawful money. I shall offer that amendment, and, if possi but never the silver dollar. ble, get a vote npon it by yeas and nays. Mr. CIDTTENDEN. I will myself read from the same authority Mr. 'Chairman, I believe I have said all that I desire to say until touching a question which lies to-day at the foundation of our cur we reach the :five-minute rule. rency system, and which foreshadows, if persisted in, serious disn.sters Mr. CIDTTENDEN. Mr. Chairman, I wish, in the first place, to to the commerce of this country. Mr. Garfield on the 16th of Novem ask unanimous consent to pre8ent, have read, and printed in the ber, 1877, uttered these words: RECORD an amendment which I believe to be an essential condition I want it remembered in the outset that the greenback currency was, and is eo of a proper funding bill, and which at a proper time I hope to see known in the courts, and so known everywhere, a forced loan-a forced loan by the adopted. Government upon its Army and upon its other creditors, to meet the great emer · The CHAIRMAN. The gentleman from New York a-sks unanimous gencies of the war; and the primary fact connected With every greenback is that it 1s a promise to pay. Those who beli~ve in resumption intend some time or other consent to have read at this time and printed in the RECORD the the nation shall make good the proml.!le. . amendment which he sends to the Clerk's desk. Is there objection 7 The Chair hears none, and the amendment will be reported. Once more, Mr. Chairman, and this, so far as I have looked, is an The Clerk read as follows : utterance of the President-elect on his very last appeam.nce in this House. At any rate, i't was so pointed and good, so just and honest, Add to the bill the following: "And all acts and parts of acts imposing taxation upon the capital and deposits so true and grand as the exponent of the principles of the first man of savings-banks, national banks, State lianks, and private bankers are hereby of the nation, that I look no farther. It is nn utterance of General repealed; and the tax upon the circulating notes of the national banks issued uvon Garfield here on the 5th of April, 1880, in respect to this very ques the bonds authorized by this act shall not exceed one-half of 1 per cent. J.>er an tion now under consideration. I will ask the Clerk to read it. num : And PTO'IIi Mr. CHITTENDEN. No, sir; not now. I mayyield to the gentle- tion to it. And he never has corrected it, so far as 1 know He m·an after I read this. It is very interesting. [Laughter.] certain~y did n_?t reply to my note. [Renewed laughter.] ' I have only to say th:lt these three ma,ke the triple-beaded monster of centraliza- I beheve I Will read the rest of this card. tion, inflation, and repudiation combined. One hundred and four republicans and ten democrats voted against it. Were I should like to ask some of my democratic friends to consider that the one hundred and four repnblicans wrong and Mr. CHITTE!oil>EN right~ Mr. CBlT'l'Eb'DEN stands With the democracy of the South upon the tariff question as he in view of _the _gre~t many speeches I have heard ~ere about fright did when he voted against the civil-rights bill. ful centralization m the last few years. If there 1s anything about it of a "dangerous character, General Garfield bas touched it here: Now, do any of :vou remember that T I did vote against the civil- This monst-er is tot~ against it. was known that I was a reluctant candidate. I was ill; confined to my house. I did not go out in the canvass and refused to engage with Were the 104 REPunhq S wrong and anybody in respect to it. I simply accepted the nomination. All I Mr. Chittenden right? know of Mr. Smith's politics is that in one of his Sunday sermons he protested against making hats in the State prisons of the State of llr. Chittenden stands with the DEM:OCRA New York. This I got from my newspaper. CY OF THE SOUTH upon the TARIFF And there seems to have been an association of hatters, [laughter,] two ~:mndred_strong, in the end of t~e district_where he preaches, who QUESTION as he did when he voted against nommated him for Congress. I behave he himself thought it was a the CIVIL-RIGHTS BILL. joke when it first happened. But things went on, and a regular dem ocratic candidate was nominated, who seemed to be a little weak, and The "SOLID SOUTH" approves his vote upon 1 some of his friends came to me to know if I would help to support the Civil Rights Bill. and GREAT BRITAIN him. Now, I have understood that a great many of you here know how to run a third candidate in yonr districts where it seems to be applauds his speeches and votes upon the TAB necE?ssary for success, and it seems to be the right thing to do in the IFF QUESTION. ,/' minds of many. [Laughter.] But I said to these gentlemen, "I will not give you a half dollar to keep your democratic candidate in the LET US SEND TO CONGRESS a. man field. If the people want Mr. Smith to represent them, I hope they who all his life has done manful service in the will elect him, and that he will prove to be a better man than I am. CAUSE OF HUMAN RIGHTS, and who I can afford to be defeated, but I cannot afford to go back upon the principles which have governed me for years as a candidate for office represents the .Al\IERICAN DOCTRINE of and as tlie occupant of an honorable office." They said, ''Well, then, PROTECTION TO Al\IEB.ICAN INTER he will be withdrawn." Said I, "Withdraw him;" and they did with ESTS. That man is draw him. [Laughter.] Let me say again I was sick and confined to my house. On the Friday prior to the election on Tuesday, a newspaper in the district charged me with being a free-trader. [Great laughter.] It said ex J. Hyatt Smith. plicitly, H Mr. CHITTENDEN is a free-trader, and he voted "-1 must read now: Mr. Chairman, the merriment of the House has brought my serious On the 26th of March, 1878, S. B. CHITTENDEN voted, with one hunured and speech to rather a rid.icnlons conclusion. But there is a moral in the twenty-two democrats, in favor of the Wood tariff bill. fun after all. The responsible author of that card is an uncommon There, now, you see what a man gets when he votes with the ingrate, hypocrite, and idiot. The card is a lie, as inexcusable, mean, democrats in opposition to brother CONGER. [Laughter.] I told the and immoral as the forged Garfield letter. But it ha.<~ done-can do editor of that paper t!:tat I opposed the Wood tariff bill, and I voted me no harm. I hope its reverend and honorable beneficiary will en to get it up for a chance to oppose it on the floor. [Laughter.] I joy the distinction it brings him, and that lie will prove to be a more had written every correspondent in my district who had alluded to it useful representative of the people than I have been. He has been that it was an utterly impracticable bill, and I wanted to get a chance in the habit of standing in the pulpit, all his own, and preaching fifty at it as quickly as possible. times a year at home. He says that hereafter Congress will be a part Bnt I was not the only repn blican who voted for taking it up. Here of his pulpit; he said that the other day, according to the newspapers. is my friend, Mr. HiscocK; he is a copper-fastened protectionist, and I hope you will listen to him, [laughter,] and that he will use this he voted with me on that occasion, as did eight or ten other New part of his pulpit to the best possible advantage. York straight republicans. [Laughter.] In the mean while, in respent to this funding bill, with an earnest I wrote a note to that editor stating that if he would refer to my and honest belief that it has much to do with the economical wel record he would see that I simply voted to fix a day for the consider fare, the real prosperity, and the honor of this great nation, which ation of a revenue measure reported from the Committee on Ways to-day is a spectacle to all mankind and promises in the near future, and Means, and he might as honestly have charged me with having within the life-time of many who are standing about me, to be abso shot Abraham Lincoln as with being in favor of that bill and with lutely the monarch of the world, I say to the representatives of the votisg for it. I Wl'ote him that I left it to him to correct the state people, in the interest of such a nation, brush away your selfish, par ment or not as he pleased; to let it stand unless he had manhood tisan, political purposes, and allow reason to have sway. Come up enough to correct it without intimating that I had called his utten- to this question as fearless, honest, worthy representatives of the 1881. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. 391 greatest people on the earth, and revise our vicious currency system' surplus money without funding it at all, or, if funding it, then limlt: mot and branch l ing the period to the time that our current revenue will meet it. [Here the hammer fell.] I am in favor of paying off that debt with our surplus money. I Mr. McLANE obtained the :floor. believe that the funded debt of four percents due in 1906 and. tlie Mr. GILLETTE. Will the gentleman from Maryland yield to me funded debt of four-and·a-half percents due in 1891 are the only amomentY funded debts which this country ought ever to know in the future: Mr. McLANE. I have agreed to yield to the gentleman from Illi I stand here to·day to support the report of the Secretary of the nois [Mr. MORRISON] for a moment. Treasury. I would not alter a line of it, except as to the rate of in Mr. MORRISON. :Mr. Chairman, the gentleman from New York terest, and I have no objection to leaving that rate of interest discre! [Mr. CmTTE:NDEN] baa been giving us the views of the President tionary. The Secretary of the Treasury st.ates that after paying out eleet upon the subject of our national currency and the silver dollar. the surplus revenue of the year which expires on July 1, 1881, there I would be glad to have read, ·in justice to the President-elect, his will then be $637,350,600 of indebtedness to be provided for. And last public expression upon that subject. It is contained in a short he then makes an estimate of our current revenues and our current • extract from his letter of acceptance. expenses and shows we must have a surplus of from eighty to ninety The Clerk read as follows : million dollars. Our paper currency is now as national as the flag, and resumption has not only Now, Mr. Chairman, any gentleman in this House who will follow made it everywhere equal to coin, but has brought into use our store of gold and the statistics accompanying that report will find that every year and silver. The circulating medium is more abundant than ever before i and we need every half year our revenue increases over the preceding year and enly maintain the quality of all our dollars to insure to labor and cap1tal a measure of value from the use of which no one can sufter loss. The great :prosperity which half year, and for the very obvious reason that our revenue is derived the country is now enjoying should not be endangered by any VIolent changes or from articles of consumption, and as our population increa-ses our doubtful financial experiments. consumption increases. And if there was no other reason but that Mr. GILLETTE. Will the gentleman from Maryland allow me to one it would make it a sure thing that our revenue will increase. put a question to the gentleman from New York, [Mr. CBI'l"'''DD"'DEN Y] And when the Secretary of the Treasury estimates $90,000,000, if the Mr. McLANE. I do not yield to the gentleman from Iowa. I am present condition of prosperity in the country continues, his $90,000,000 sure that the gentleman from New York has disposed of all his per will become 100,000,000 and $120,000,000 before these ten years have sonality as well as his argument. Nor would I trespass at all upon expired. This House will run no risk at all in giving him the author the attention of the committee if I were not persuaded that there ity he asks to pay off$520,904,707.58, which is the aggregate amount iB no necessity at all for any further funding of the public debt. of the money due the sinking fund in these ten years. He proposes Although I have no responsibility as t.o the mode in which this debt to limit these yearly payments to that amount. was issued, I feel the fullest responsibility for every effort that we But, Mr. Chairman, why should he limit it to that amount T By can make to discharge it, and to discharge it with the least possible his own figures, liberally considered, he will have nearly twice that burden to the people of the country. I am persuaded that the main amount in those ten years. I am quite willing, and I hope this HoU86 t-enance of the public credit has been of more value to the country will give the Secretary precisely the authority he asks-$400,000,000 than any other legislation that has been effected since the close of in Treasury notes of a denomination not less than ten dollars, he says, the war. I think I am within bounds when I say that the mainte at 4 per cent. But he states in that connection he bas no doubt at nance of the credit of this country bas saved the people more than all he can negotiate that $400,000,000 at 3 per cent. Why should we forty millions of dollars per annum in taxation since the war, and it hesitate, therefore, to give him authority to negotiate that $400,000,000 is for this reaSOJ!. that I would set my face against the gentleman at 3 per cent., and, if need be, at 4 per cent. t For one I should not from Iowa [Mr. WEAVER] when he would endeavor to use either of have the least hesitation in giving him that discretion at 3t or 4 per our standards, gold or silver, to destroy the credit of the country. I cent. Is it to be supposed when he is required by law to sell these am as much in' favor as he is of the double standard; but while I main bonds in the open market and at not less than par he will sell them tain the right of the country, to maintain these two standards which bearing 4 per cent. if he can get par at 3 per cent. Y We who are were in existence when we contracted the debt, I would think it in legislating for the people, believing aa I do their best interest is in the last degree unwise to stipulate that we should pay the debt in paying oft' this debt at the earliest possible moment-why should we one of those standards at a time when that standard had by the hamper him in his negotiating those $400,000,000 of bonds 7 He says, course of commerce become de based. expressly for the encouragement of the country and of this House, It is a. notorious fact to-day that silver, as compared with gold at that he can negotiate them in his opinion at 3 per cent., but in order their relative values as now fixed, is at a depreciation, and although that he may not be put at disadvantage he asks for the authority to we may hold it in our Treasury and hold it in our banks as other great negotiate at four. countries that have a double standard do, I would not consent to en Then he proceeds, and asks for authority to negotiate $400,000,000 in force payment in it at the moment when it was thus depreciated. I short bonds. And that is a very proper authority to give him, be would consider that by such an amendment to this bill I did more cause although we stand to-day in the face of this vrosperity and harm to the credit of the country than by a. failure to pay the debt plenty, and although we can count to-day, if we continue as we are, at all. A failure to pay the debt would only leave the Government that we will have ninety or one hundred millions of dollars surplus, responsible to pay current interest on it until it was finally paid-- yet by a disaster to-morrow, by a failure of our own crops or by Mr. GILLETTE. May I ask the gentleman a. question T greater abundance of crops in Europe, we might not have this pros Mr. McLANE. I beg the gentleman from Iowa to let me pursue perity so far as imports and exports are concerned, and therefore this my remarks. I would yield to any gentleman if any rema-rk that I surplus of ninety or a hundred or a hundred and ten millions might had made required of him an explanation. But I do not recognize not exist. And in case it does not exist, then it would be necessary that any individual of this House is responsible for the silver theory for him to fund these debts rather than to pay them off in Treasury any more than for the gold theory. I am stating for myself that notes. Give him the discretion to do that which is best for the people while I believe in the double standard, yet I believe that an amend of this country, to negotiate a bond bearing 3 per cent. interest, or 4 ment to this bill requiring this debt due in 1881 to be paid in silver per cent. interest, if that be the figure-! am coming to the figure would be a vital injury to the public credit; and I believe the pub directly-the discretion to do that or to issue his Treasury notes in lic credit to be of vital interest to the people of this country. sums not less than ten dollars. · Mr. WEAVER. Will the gentleman yield to be corrected f I wish :Mr. Chairman, the Secretary of the Treasury not only would be able to correct a misunderstanding. in the ten years that these bonds have to run, that is to say, before Mr. McLANE. If the gentleman wishes to correct anything that we come to 1891, when the four and one-half percents are due, he be has said, I will yield with pleasure. would not only be able to take up these short Treasury notes, or pay Mr. WEAVER. I want to correct what you have said. off this short loan-and I suggest here that loan ought not to go Mr. McLANE. I do not want the gentleman from Iowa to correct beyond that year, 1891-he would not only have money enough to pay what I have said. off this poor little $637,000,000, but he would have more than enough Mr. WEAVER. I merely wish-- in the Treasury to pay off the four and one-half percents due in 1891. Mr. McLANE. I decline to yield. l · do not want the gentleman And if we continue as we are now-! ask only the present condition from Iowa to correct what I have said. If he rises to correct what of commerce; that the present industries of the country shall remain he has said, I will yield to him with pleasure. undisturbed by disaster-then our income in these ten years will Mr. WEAVER. Will not the gentleman yield to let me suggest exceed the present debt of $637,000,000, and the debt due in 1891 of that he has misunderstood met $250,000,000, and even adding to that the debt of about $100,000,000 Mr. McLANE. I cannot misunderstand the gentleman, for he stated, which falls due in 1895, the bonds issued to the Pacific Railroad. if he did not read, the amendment that he proposed. Now I have com There is, in my judgment, within. our reach to-day a solution of this mented upon that, and it is all I have to say upon that point. debt question which will save to the people in taxation $12,000,000. ( Mr. WEAVER. The gentleman did misunderstand me. We could not to-day, if we entered upon the question of revenue Mr. McLANE. I bel~eve that the maintenance of the public credit reform, with any satisfaction to ourselves, in the present condition of is of vital importance to this country; and the only question in my the country politically, effect a reduction as satisfactory as that: judgment that we haw to consider is how we shall maintain that And I for one do not desire to disturb the tariff in its revision in such credit-whether we shall maintain it by passing a bill such as has way as would reduce the revenues of the country. I believe that it been reported from the Committee on 'Vays a.nd Means, which funds is in our power on this side of the Honse to revise that tariff' and to the debt doe in 1&31, and makes it payable twenty or forty years hence, reduce these duties and yet not to reduce the revenue. And I believe it or whether we shall endeavor to pay off that debt with our current . will be our duty in the future, ·aa an opposition, to enforce upon the. 392 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. JANUARY 6, Government that policy, that they shall not reduce revenue but that deficiency, and although the sinking fund to-day stands fully pro they shaH reduce taxation. I have no doubt at all, sir, that in that vided for, as every dollar due it will be paid up in the next year, yet way we have a political future not only honorable to ourselves but there were three years when we were altogether unable to meet it. in the best interests of the people of this country. And of course such a disaster as overtook the country in 1873 can I understand very well that there are two extremes to this ques overtake it in 1883. And it is because that is possible that I for one tion. I understand perfectly well that the capitalists of this coun not only want to put it in the power of the Treasury Department t& try, or of :my country, whether they have banks or not, like these have a choice of issuing bonds or notes, but I want to adopt this sug long bonded loans. They have even in their very length of time a gestion, vaguely stated but yet intelligently enough, that these notes feature of value. They find in the length of time that they have to when they shall fall due shall be redeemable rather than payable; in run a value so material that it will be a question as between seventy other words, if we have a recurrence of disaster and ha.ve not the years and forty years of nearly or quite 5 per cent. on the bond. necessary surplus revenue, then we let the notes lay, paying the interest So we have the other extreme of gentlemen who would pay off this on them till we are able to redeem them; and when it is known that debt in fiat money. That I regard as the other extreme. I hope, Mr. these notes can either be redeemed at the day named or can become Chairman, as a Representative to stand perfectly independent of as good as a bond redeemable at the pleasure of the Government but • either extreme. I would be sorry to advocate a policy that was in still bearing interest, the Secretary of the Treasury will have no diffi the interest of any single class in this country. I would be sorry if culty in placing those notes, and we need not be disturbed on that any act of mine here in reference to the payment of the public debt accoun·t. should have that for its result; so, a.lso! I would be sorry if any error I do not bold this opinion because a banker here or a banker there of mine would induce me to vote for silver or for any other currency tells me the money can be placed at 3 per cent. I understand per which was depreciated or any paper which had no value in payment fectly the bankers and individuals who are not bankers can be inter of a debt of the United States which by law is made payable in coin. ested in bonds, say of 4 per cent. or of the fives and sixes, and there Mr. GILLETTE. Is there any such proposition before the House t fore advocate the issuing of bon~s at 3 per cent. or of not funding Mr. McLANE. It is not material that either proposition is before at all, that the value of the four percents may be advanced or that the House, but I do know perfectly well that both ideas are repre the same may be so of the fives and sixes. As I said before, I reject sented in the House. them and their counsels and come back to my own judgment and the Now, sir, a word more and I have done. There are two bills pend support of what I believe to be in the interest of this country ; that ing, the bill of the committee and the bill or substitute of the gentle is, to borrow the money necessary to pay the debt in 1881 and make the man from Pennsylvania. Now, I hope the bill of the committee will best terms I can, and make the period for which I borrow not a day be so amended as to embody these two features. The bill is a valu longer than I will be able to pay it in. able bill. Its first section provides that all the existing laws which If I had the least doubt of the revenue of this country being equal have reference to funding shall be applied to these two debts which to these fifty or sixty or seventy millions a year, then I would not are to be funded, and that those laws and stipulations which are advocate the payment of these bonds as early as 1885. But I am per valuable to the proposed system of funding shall be continued in suaded under any reasonable view of the futnre we can count upon force and applied to the funding of these two debts. a sum 20 or ::JO per cent. larger ihan the Secretary asks us to appro Then it withdraws from the Secretary the authority to act under priate; that is, the amount due the sinking fund, $520,000,000. See the law of 1870 and 1871, under the operations of which there are where we are. Sixhundredand thirty-seven millions is the entire debt, 104,652,200 which he has the right to use under the law of July 14, and if we take five hundred and twenty millions out of it in the next U!70. That is repealed in this law, and those provisions of the first ten years there is left only a little under one hundred and twenty mill section of the bill are of great importance. But when we pass from ions of dollars. I would not repeal that provision which authorizes that we come, in this first section, to what are clearly only questions the Secretary to issue one hundred a.nd four millions.at 4 per cent. of details, whether the interest shall be 3 or 4 per cent., or whether I would be perfectly willing to leave that as it is, because with that the amount shall be $400,000,000 of the one kind and $200,000,000 of one hundred and four millions and this money due to the sinking the other, or whether we shall make both $400,000,000 as recommended fund he has nearly the amount necessary to cover the entire debt. by the Secretary. In my opinion, for the Secretary to sell his one hundred and four Now, Mr. Chairman, as to the debt due in 1891, as I sa.id before, that millions of four percents at a premium of 12 is quite as good as sell is a debt of only $250,000,000, while if we are ri~ht in this view that ing his new bonds at 3t, and we mjght just as .well leave him the the surplus revenue of the country will pay off m five years, and not authority to sell his one hundred and four millions at 4 per cent., be in ten, this entire debt of $637,000,000, then there will be in the accru cause really to sell one hundred and four millions of four percents at ing revenue in the remaining five years more than enough to provide the present premium is just as good an operation for the Government for the debt falling due in 1B91; and I have no doubt at all that by as selling a 3t per cent. bond at par. I am perfectly willing, there this legislation we will not only relieve the country of the debt due fore, to let that amount of one hundred and four millions stand. But in let:n but we will furnish the Treasury with means necessary to pay as it is the sense of the committee to repeal that provision, I acquiesce, the debt due in 1891, and therefore by this action to-day we will as I think we ought to concede to each other on points that are not relieve the country of all debt excepting the 4 per cent. material. I take the bill as it comes from the committee, only en Thusweridourselvesentirely of these-I will not call them intrigues, larging the amount of the bonds so as to have four hundred millions though they are perfectly well characterized by this term-we will of each. In other words, I follow up the report of the Secretary of relieve ourselves of the intrigues of those who are already in the pos the Treasury. I hold the operation, if he can accomplish it, is a. session of the funded debt, and who do not want the debt funded at splendid operation for this country. If he can sell four hundred mill all, while on the other hand we relieve ourselves of those who would ions at 3 per cent. he will have done well for the country, and then keep the whole debt of the country at 3 or 3i per cent. for seventy if he can negotiate a short bond-he says fifteen years, I would say years. a less time-at 3.65; be has done well for the country. We have now a sinking fund which will provide for the 4t per Give him his authority, and we know very well that even if he cent. bonds as well as the four percents. So that thus it is not ex were capable of doin~ a wrong, which I for one do not dream that he travagant at all to say that when we pass this bill to-day, which pro would, the manner m which the bonds are to be issued makes it vides for the debt due in 1881, we know there is provision for the impossible for him to do it. He has to sell these bonds in the open payment of the entire debt of the United States. No further legisla market, and the only room for distrust that I can conceive of is the tion will have to be adopted. None will be required. If reasonable amount of money we give him to pa.ythe expenses of that negotiation. prosperity continues we will have a surplus long before 1907. In my I will not say anything about the Secretary having his favorite own humble opinion I think that surplus will justify the reduction bankers and brokers, for that would follow if any of us had snch a of taxation in 1885. So that this bill will enable all surplus revenues duty to perform. All the brokers in the world and all the bankers after paying the sixes and five percents to be applied to the payment in the country cannot be employed. There must be a selection, and of any debt whatever in addition to the sinking fund specially pro the Secretary must make that selection. I should feel that I was vided by law. wasting my time to embarrass myself with that question. Now, I believe firmly that if we stand together in defense and in But tbere is a point to be considered, and that is in connection with support of the natiop.al credit, if we on both sides of the House show the expense of this negotiation, whether it ~:~hall be 1 per cent. or one a spirit of accommodation and meet the Secretary of the Treasury in half per cent. That is the question which we cannot go very far wrong a fair and a liberal spirit, we will pass a bill that will relieve this on, for it is one which every expert banker in the country can settle for country from all public debt, and have it in our power to reduce taxa us. We all know that the loan cannot be negotiated without some a.a tion :fifty millions a. year after 1885,. I understand very well that this sistance, not even these ten-dollar certificates. If gentlemen have it picture may be highly colored. I understand perfectly well that no in their mind to allow these notes to be sold at the Treasury Department country in the world, no commercial country, has ever gone so long and to permit every man in the country who wants to buy a ten-dollar without some set-back, without some financial check. We have had bond to go to the Treasury Department and buy it, he has but to call lessons enough in our own country, Mr. Chairman. It was only in to mind our experience under the law passed some years ago, when the 1873, when, with an enormous revenue, a revenue greater than our brokers of the whole country in different localities took the matter present revenue, we were obliged to suspend payment on our sinking out of the hands of the people by sending their agents to the Treas fund. .AJJy gentleman who will follow these tables will find that in ury to buy the bonds. There never has been devised any mode by 1873 and 1874 and 1875 we were unable to perform our full duty as which this Government could negotiate a large loan without the as provided bylaw in rega.rd to the sinking fund; and although a period sistance of men who trade in money. Their assistance is necessary. of prosperity which has since ensued has enabled us to make up that When you wish to buy flour and clothing, it is necessary for you to 1881. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. go to the people who deal in those articles. If you wish to sell these other words, we could only pay at par $200,000,000 within the next bonds you must go to the people who deal in money; you must employ ten years, at which time $250,000,000 of the four-and-a-half percents. them and pay them what is reasonable. That is the only point for would be payable, and after these sums we could pay nothing until distrust I find in this bill. after twenty years from this time. . I certainly do not find the amount extravagant which the committee This being the effect of the passage of the bill, I wish to call the have allowed. There is a. difference between the report of the Secre attention of the committee to our ability to pay within this time, so tary of the Treasury and the bill of the committee, but that is a dif as to ascertain whether this bill does not put far beyond the reach ference which I am quite willing to l~ave to the committee and to of our present ability to pay the public debt of the United States. the Secretary. For myself, if I can I want to go on the line of that I hold in my hand the public debt statement issued on the 1st day. report, and I want to take so much of this bill as covers that report. of January of this year, from which it will be seen -that there will be The House must remember that it is no reproach to the committee, redeemable on the 1st day of May next 5 per cent. bonds to the amount either in its entirety or in its individuality, that this bill is not ex of$469,651,050, and on the 30th of June there will be redeemable6per actly in pursuance of the report of the Secretary of the Treasury. cent. bonds to the amount of $144,339,900, and other 6 per cent. bonds. The bill was reported last year, and the Secretary of the Treasury to the amount of 857,216,100, making in all$671,207,050redeemable at said in his report of that year that it was absolutely necessary that the pleasure of the United States between this time and the 1st day he should be allowed to issue 4 per cent. bonds. Doring the year of July next. The Secretary of the Treasury informs us in his annual which bas passed since then be bas modified his opinion, and has gone report that the surplus funds in the Treasury will redeem a portion of even below the original proposition of the bill, which was for a 3i this, so as to reduce the whole amount at that time (July 1) to about ner cent. bond. six hundred and forty million dollars. Without further legislation we - These are details which I refer to only to put the Secretary and the have $630,000,000 within our reach on the 1st day of July next and committee in perfect harmony, as I believe they are. For one I am 250,000,000 within our reacll ten years from this time. But this bill willing to leave the credit of this country to the Committee of Ways proposes to put $500,000,000 of this amount beyond our reach for the and Means and to the Secretary of the Treasury. period of twenty years from this date, leaving only $200,000,000 of I have promised to yield to my friend from Illinois [Mr. SPRINGER] interest-bearing Treasury notes and the 4t per cent. bonds due ten. some of my time. years hence, or $450,000,000 in all, as redeemable within the next The CHAIRMAN. The gentleman has twenty minutes of his time twenty years. remaining. · We can do better than that; and I am opposed to placing the pub~ Mr. GILLETTE. Will the gentleman allow me to ask him a ques lie debt in funded loans which will deprive the Government of the tion! right to pay it to the extent of the sinking fond and the surplus. Mr. McLA.NE. With pleasure. revenues without increasing taxation. I would leave this debt in Mr. GILLETTE. The gentleman from Maryland [Mr. McLANE] such a shape that we conld continually apply to it these means of· conveys the impression that the use of the surplus silver coin in the payment. This we cannot do if this bill is passed. After the pas Treasury to pay the bonds when they become due would be an in sage of this bill and the payment of $200,000,000, which can be made jury to the public credit. I wish to ask him how the fulfillment by within two or three years, we must go into the market and boy our the Government of the contract according to its letter and its spirit own bonds at such premium aa the bondholder may be willing to could injure its credit? accept ; and when the Government is the largest purchaser of bonds, :Mr. McLANE. I will answer the question. Although the Govern when there is a lar~e demand by the Government on account of pur ment bas the power to pay this either in silver or in ~rold-and I chases for the sinking fund, the market price of bonds will neces have no doubt it has that power-yet when it bad in the Treasury all sarily go up. I have in my hand the statement of the Secretary of the gold that was necessary to pay the debt, if it should take silver the Treasury showing what will be the accumulations of the sinking at a depreciation of 8 or 10 or 12 per cent. and pay the debt, I should fund for the next ten years. I find this statement in the very able consider it a fraud on the creditor. I think any individual or any and exhaustive speech of the gentleman from Ohio [Mr. WARNER] government that did such a thing as that would lose its credit in the who sits on my right. The Secretary of the Treasury, in his last world. report, says : I do not think the gentleman from Iowa [Mr. GILLETI'E] or any The requirements of the sinking fqnd prior to the maturity of the 4! per cent. other advocate of the double standard should allow the silver ques bonds, {or a period of ten years, from 1882 to 1891, both inclusive, are estimated.as tion to come into this discussion. Whether we should have two follows: standards or one standard is a question entirely apart from the con For the fiscal year ending June 30, 1882 ...... $43, 386, 645 00 sideration of this bill. We have two standards now; we have the For the fiscal year ending June 30, 1883.... .•.... .•••...... •..•• 45,1'.!2, 110 80 For the fiscal year ending June 30, 1884 .••.••.... ····--···-----. ... 46,926,995 24 right to pay the debt either in gold coin or silver coin; that is admit For the fiscal year ending June 30, 1885...... ••••.•. ...••••.• 48,804,075 04 ted by everybody. There may be those who would like to have the For the fiscal year ending June 30, 1886 .•.. ······------...... 50,756,238 04 debt payable in gold; they have not a majority in this Hoose to make For the fiscal year ending June 30, 1887 ..•.•••••..••.•. ·-----. •..•• 52,786,487 56- the debt so payable. For the fiscal year ending June 30, 1888 .•...• ·---···--··----·----•. 54,897,947 07 Forthefiscal yearendingJune30, 1889 ...... 57,0!13,864 95 The debt is payable in gold or silver at the option of the Govern For the fiscal yearendingJune30,1890 ..•.•..•••.•••••••••.•.•...• 59,377,619 55 ment. If the Government had no gold; if it had nothing bot silver, For the fiscal year ending June 30, 1891...... • . . .. • . • . • . • . . • • • • . . 61, 752, 724 33 it would not be dishonorable on the part of the Government to p&y the debt in silver. There might be some necessity for negotiation; 520, 904, 707 58 there might be a question as to whether the Government ought to From this statement it will be seen that the accumulations of the make up the depreciation of its silver. That would be an equitable sinking fund for the next ten years will amount to $520,000,000, say if not an abstract question; and I have no doubt at all that this Gov ing nothing of the surplus revenue which must be added to this sum,. ernment of the United States, if it ever found itself in a condition which will be the means in our Treasury that we may apply to the to be obliged to pay off its debt in a depreciated coin or a depreciated payment of the public debt during the next ten years, and which the paper, would recognize its obligation to pay the balance when it was Secretary of the Treasury estimates, as the gentleman from Mary able. I do not think this Government will ever fall to any form of land [Mr. McLANE] has stated, to be equal to the sum I have just repudiation. named. If within ten years we shall have in our hands for applica Mr. GILLETTE. Another question. tion to our indebtedness, without increasing taxation, a thousand Mr. McLANE. I agreed to yield a part of my time to the gentle million dollars, why not leave the debt in such shape that we can apply man from Illinois, [Mr. SPRINGER,] and I do not desire to take any this surplus revenue to it f This bill does not make such provision, more of it now. and I shall vote for no bill which proposes to fund the debt beyond Mr. SPRINGER. Mr. Chairman, there are not many minutes of the reach of payment by the use of this $1,000,000,000 within the· the hour remaining, and I desire to yield a portion of my time to the next ten yea.rs. · gentleman from New York; hence I shall ask the attention of the I have been endeavoring to find out by a.n examination of there .committee for only a short time. I am opposed to the pending bill, ports of the Trea.sory Department the amount of debt that has been 'and unless it can be amended in a very material manner I must vote paid in the last ten years. I bold in my hand a statement issued by against it. the Treasury Department, July 1, 1879. Upon an examination of this. Let us consider, first, w bat would be the effect upon the poblic debt table, which purports to be an analysis of the principal of the public in the event of the passage of this bill. It provides that the Secre debt from July 1, 1856, to July 1, 1879, showing the amount of the tary of the Treasury may issue bonds not exceeding :fi\'e hundred debt at the close of each fiscal year, it appears that during the ten million dollars, redeemable at the pleasure of the United State., after years last passed we have reduced the public debt to the extent of twenty years and payable forty years after the date of issue. It pro $38'2,000,000, and that we have now in the Treasury $100,000,000 more vides also for the issue of Treasury notes to the amount of $200,000,000, than we had when we started out on this decade. During three of· redeemable at the pleasure of the United States after two years and these years, as the gentleman from Maryland [Mr. McLANE] sug payable in ten years. If this bill should be passed it would carry all gests, we paid very little; yet during those ten years we did pay ;the debt payable within the ensuing yeru:s, except $200,000,000 pay 382,000,000, while we increased the amount in the Treasury to the able in Treasury notes, to a period twenty years beyond this time. extent of 100,000,000, which might have been applied to the same If this bill should be passed, there would only be within our reach purpose, but which is held for resumption. for payment $200,000,000 after two years, 250,000,000 of the four I have another table from the Secretary of the Treasury accompa and-a-half percents at the end of ten years, and the bonds provided nying the report submitted to this House a year ago. From this for ~y this bill, about five hundred millions, in twenty years. In statement of the amounts of the payment of the public debt, it seem.a- 394. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. J.ANU.A.RY 6, that the Treasury has paid during the same time $53,000,000 more than must assume that for the next few years at least the income of the the sum I just named, or $435,810,339. I do not know which of these Government will be much larger than it has been in the past. We statements is correct; I cannot reconcile these discrepancies of the cannot expect from this Congress, and very likely not from the next, Secretary of the Treasury, but I am willing to take either statement any radical change in our customs laws, whereby the people shall be .as substantially correct for the purpose of t his argument. We ma.y relievecl from taxation. We may therefore expect the revenues aria assume that the reduction bas been between $48,000,000 and$53,000,000 ing from the increased prosperity of the country will gradually in per annum, with the increased accumulations in the Treasury for pur- crease rather than diminish from duties on imports. The national poses of resumption. One statement shows $53,000,000 more paid in resources then will be greater, and yet it is stated by the Secretary of the same time than the other. If, then, we have paid off during the the Treasury that for the last year our revenues furnished $DO,OOO,OOO last ten years the public debt at the rate of $50,000,000 a year-- to diminish the national debt. Mr. McLANE. Of the principal. Now, sir, if we adopt the proposition of this bill to refund$500,000,000 Mr. SPRINGER. Of the principal; yes, sir. If during that time into a ptm:nanent debt, outside of the possibility of being redeemed we have had a succession of years when our imports were very small, for thirty years, there must necessarily be gathered into the Treasury -owing to the hard times in this conntry consequent on the crisis of an amonnt of income which cannot be used in the payment of the 1873, and the amount of accumulations from customs revenue fallen public debt. Under the present law it cannot even be used as a o0ff, some years making the reduction of the whole amount less than sinking fund. Hence arises the difficulty which has not been stated four millions of dollars, we can assume at least our ability to pay in this debate hitherto, but which to my mind is a controlling one. '$50,000,000 a year for the next ten years; and I think the estimate A large fund gathered into the Treasury will furnish temptation for for the payment of $1,000,000,000 in ten years, or $100,000,000 for each large and unusual appropriations of money. Members of Congress year, is not beyond reasonable probability. I do not anticipate, bow- here in this House, all of them, are pressed by their constituents in ~ver, so favorable a result. • one way or another for the construction of public buildings, for the I believe this bill can be so amended that we can refund the whole commencement of public works, for expenditures upon those that are amount of the bonds redeemable within theperiodsihavementioned, already commenced, or for expenditures upon this matter or that, and make the new issues payable or redeemable at such times in the and there will be a constantly increasing pressure brought to bear future as the surplus funds in the Treasury from year to year and the upon them, so that extravagant appropriations of the public moneys sinking fund can meet. Then we will have, after the payment of the lying idle in the Treasury, which cannot be even used for the pay amounts covered by this bill and of $250,000,000 of four-and-a-half ment of the national debt and the cancellation of the outstanding percents due ten years hence, remaining of the public ·debt the sum bonds, will inevitably follow. -of $738,420,400 of four percents which are not redeemable until the In the first place, by my vote and position upon this billJ in alliance year 1907-twenty-six years hence before we can pay any part of the with my friencl from Pennsylvania, [Mr. KELLEY,] who from exactly remaining portion of the public debt, unless we shall go into the opposite motives opposes this permanent debt because he sees in it a market and buy it there atwhateverpreminmitmaycommand. We reason why Congress will be moved from time to time, and more have then but t,OOO,OOO,OOO, or $921,207,050 in exact numbers, to be strongly moved for the reduction of customs duties, I am moved to paid within these twenty-six years, and after we have paid this vote against the proposition of funding $500,000,000 because I fear it amount, which we may in ten years from this time, we will have all must necessarily place in our Treasury a large sum of money, and be the accumulations of the sinking fund and surplus revenues for the a temptation thereby to the House of Representatives and to the Sen purpose of meeting the 4 percent. bonds which can onlybepaidafter ate to discover some new fashion of expending money in the public twenty-six years from this time. service. It is fortunate that this is not a party measure at this time. Hence, Mr. Chairman, if this bill can be so amended as to place the It might well have been forced into the rut of party consideration. public debt coming due between this and the 1st of July next within But we meet this question, a purely economic and business one, tho means of the United States to pay, I think we ought to pass it, standing alone upon figures and computation, fortunately at this time and the bonds should be such that they can be negotiated in the mar- in such manner that I find high-tariff men and low-tariff men such kets of the world at the lowest rate of interest possible. If the bill as myself, the leaders of the greenbackers of the country and the can be amended in this and in one other respect, I shall take pleasure hard-money men of the country, all able to unite in opposition to a in supporting it. permanent fastening of the public debt upon the people of this coun- 1 am opposed to the theory which has been auvanced here that we try. should pass no refunding bill and make no provision to meet these [Here the hammer fell.] bonds. If I were the possessor of five: ten, or fifteen millions of dol- .Mr. MILLS. Mr. Chairman, I desire to invite the attention of the lara of :five or six percents dne on the 1st of July next, or of any of committee to the practical questions presented for our determination. those bonds, my interests might induce me to oppose any provision We have $671,917,600 of bonds that are redeemable between this and of law by which those bonds should be refunded into bonds at a lower the 1st day of July next. Of this amount 202,266,550 bear interest at rate of int.erest; because, holding such bonds, I could demand 5 and 6 6 per cent. and $469,651,050 bear interest at 5 per cent. The annual in per cent. interest on them until the Government was able to pay terest on these bonds is $:35,618,545. It is not denied that we can sell them off. It seems to me such would be the position of the holders other bonds bearing 3 per cent. interest and obtain the money with of bonds due the 1st of J nly next. They would I;~.aturally oppose the which to redeem those now outstanding. The annual interest of snob refunding of those bonds into bonds bearing a lower rate of interest. 3 per cent. bonds would be 20,157,5~. By this means the Govern But as representatives of the people we should seek to make the pub- ment would save annually 15,461,017. lie debt as little burdensome a-s possible. Low rates of interest, short The question before us is a practical business question, just snch as bonds, and rapid payments as possible, should be our motto. presents itself to every one in his own individual affairs. It is neither I desire also a provision to be incorporated in the bill to prevent the more nor less than that. The measures proposed embrace two dis .abuses which grew up under the last funding bill of paying double tinct propositions. One provides for the sale of long-term bonds, and interest and large commissions to syndicates of bankers to nego- the other for Treasury notes and abort-term bonds that may be called tiate our loans, giving exclusive privileges by contract to such syn- and paid with the annual surplus revenues of the Government. There dicates. I hope we shall not have repeated under the sanction of this are grave objections to long bonds. They are only justified when the proposed legislation (as the first section seems to provide) the paying emergencies of the State are such that the required revenue cannot of double interest or large commissions to syndicates and brokers, or be obtained in any other way; they are like that onerous and exce68- the keeping of large deposits of Government moneys in private banks ive taxation endured in war but wholly indefensible in time of peace. during long periods of time, thus encouraging speculation with Gov- Nothing except a great calamity like war can justify the Government ernment funds and making possible irregularities like those attending in selling long-term bonds and piling up interest upon the people year the last negotiation of Government bonds. after year and generation after generation. Such a policy is un-Amer- 1 yield now the remainder of my time to the gentleman from New ican, undemocratic, and unrepublican. It has not met the sanction York. of any great statesman in this country in any period from the organ- The CHAIRMAN. The gentleman from New York is entitled to ization of the Government to the present time. The payment of the eight minutes. public debt as rapidly as p6ssible without oppressing the people baa Mr. LOUNSBERY. Mr. Chairman, I am obliged to the gentleman been the constant and cherished policy of those who have gone before from Illinois [Mr. SPRINGER] for the unexpected opportunity I have to us. It is a policy founded in the wisest statesmanship and demanded make a brief expression of the reason why I shall oppose the general by the best interests of the nation. Our :first great President said to propositions contained in this bill. There are no doubt very many of Congress- the people of the country and of my own constituency who are induced No pecuniary consideration is more urgent than the reanlar redemption and dis· to favor a refunding bill on account of the promise it affords for are- charge of the public debt. "' ·doction of the interest on the national debt. But there is much that Again calling their attention to the subject, he urged them "to con is delusive in this promiso. I esteem it of much greater importance 1 summate the work teiihout delay." In his farewell address to the that this debt of the country should be paid at the very earliest oppor- American people he warned them of the evils that lay in the path . tunity afforded to the Government and according to t he means and of their progress to jeopardize their institutions and imperil the com revenue of the Government than that it should be refunded at a lower mon welfare of themselves and their children. He warned them rate of interest. We must assume-and in this respect I am greatly against the evils of sectionalism, of foreign entanglements, of party relieved in the statement of my views by the fact that my friend from spirit, of the encroachments of power, and prominent among the dan Maryland [Mr. McLANE] and my friend from Illinois [Mr. SPRINGER] ~ers that would rise to confront them was the accumulation of debt. have given the statistics upon which the proposition rests-I say we He admonished them to avoid it, "not only by shunning occasions 1881. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. 395 of expense, but by vigorous exertions in time of peace tO discharge the Government must pay by 1005, and may pay as much earlier as it debts which unavoidable wars may have occasioned, not ungenerously can: throwing upon posterity the burdens which we ourselves ought to Amount of sinking fund for each fiscal year fi·orn 1882 to 1905, inclu-8ive. bear." For fiscal year ending- Amount for each year. Mr. Adams, who succeeded him, charged Congress to be careful and June 30, 1882...... ••••• ...... $43,3a6, 645 00 prevent the growth of the debt and to provide for the necessities of June 30, 1883...... •• • •• ...... • ...... • .. 45, 122, 110 80 Government "as much as possible by immediate taxes and as little Jnne 30, 1884...... •• • • .. •• • • • ...... • • .. .. 46, 926, 995 24 as possible by loans." Dr. Benjamin Rush, one of the great mipds of June 30, 1885 .. • • ...... • • • • • • . • • • . • .. • . .. . • • • • • • .. • • • • • • • ...... • 48, 804, 075 04 June 30, 1886...... •• • • • • • ...... • . ••• • •• • •• • . • • . • .. . 50, 756, 238 04 that day and one of the fathers of the Republic, besought Mr. Adams J nne 30, 1887 ...... • ...... • • • ...... • .. . • • ...... 52, 786, 487 56 to leave a posthumous address to the American people, and when he June 30,1888.. .••.•• ...... 54,897,947 07 came to speak of public debts and banks to summon all his resources June30,1889 ...... - ..... --·····---- 57,093,864 95 and blaze with all the splendor of his genius, as he did on the 2d of June30,1890 ...... _. 59,377,619 55 .July, 1776. President Jefferson, after spending his life impressing June 30, 1891...... 61,752,724 33 June 30, 189~ ...... ··-··· ...... ; . • 64,222,833 25 upon the &Ubllc duty has been more constantly cherished in the United States than the convulsion that would shake every government on earth to its center. policy of paying the nation's debt as rapidly as possible. But I shall be answered by the friends of this measure that they pro These are noble words, fitly spoken, and "like apples of gold in pose to repeal taxes, which is much more plausible. pictures of silver." In response to these utterances, these oft-re It will be so much more agreeable to the people to tell them that peated utterances of our statesmen, we are now told by the advo you are going to lighten the burden of taxation. That is all very cates of these long bonds that our debt must be prolonged for thirty, well, and I will go with yon as far· in reduction of taxes as any one, forty, or fifty years. Are there no evils growing out of this prolonga but I will first pay the debt, stop the annual drain of a hundred mill tion of debt through these many years f Have we suffered nothing ions to pay interest, and then cut down the taxation to the lowest by putting our debt beyond the control of the Government f Look figure and require from the people only taxes enough to support an at your seven hundred and thirty-eight millions of 4 per cent. bonds economics.l & I · 396 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. JANUARY 6~ dition cf things is temporary; tha.t it cannot last. Why not f Every year, and after that when w~ take up a hundred millions per year of body knows that the great bulk of our taxes are raised from con four-and-a-half percents, then the deduction will be four and a half sumption. millions per year. And after they are paid and we purchase a hun The annual consumption depends upon the number of people who dred millions annually of the four percents, then it will sink at the rate are to consume and their ability to purchase such things as their want of four millions each year. Here is the table. The population, which requires. Therefore, if the number of our people increase, and their is the basis upon which it is made, is by estimate of Mr. Elliot, of tb& pecuniary ability increases with their numbers, their consumption Treasury, and General Walker referred me to him and assured me his. must increase in a corresponding ratio. We are increasing in popu estimate could be relied on: lation rapidly. We are receiving a half million annually by immi gration. In a recent article on this subject in the London Economist 'd "i~ it is estimated that these immigrants bring to the United States annu :~ ;g_a ally $500,000,000. What is the cause of this vast tide that is pouring ~ gj §'te'...; upon our shores Y The author of the article answers that they are &sa>~ flying from the vast national debts that are pressing upon the people Years. 1-l·s ...:l....,'d of Europe, and the prosperity of our country invites them to come as to a>'d s~~ l>:::s S.c a house of refuge. We have added twelve millions to our population ~ ~ ;gap in the last ten years. We are increa.sing to-day at the rate of a. mill ] ~ell "ao!· ion and a half a year. Why should not consumption increase Y Will 8 ~ ~~0 not fifty millions of people wear more clothing than forty f And cloth ------·1-----1---l---l-r------ing is taxeu. Will they not eat more rice and sugar, and drink more 1881 •••••• -----·················· 51,462,000 eQ5 130 20 355 260 95 whisky, and chew and smoke more tobacco f Will they not use more 1882 ...... ·------.••...•.. . 52,799,000 211 134 20 365 260 105 implements of labor Y All these things are taxed. The consumption 1883 ··------..•...... 54,163,000 216 138 20 374 265 109 of these things must increase as population increases, and revenue 1884------········------··· · 55,554,000 222 141 20 383 270 113 must increase as consumption increases. 1885...------·····-········ .. 56,973,000 227 144 20 391 275 116 18!!6. -----·---······· .••••. ····•· 58,419,000 233 149 20 402 280 122 Again, our monetary circulation is increasing rapidly and adding 1887 ------· --- · ---······--··· :>9, 892,000 239 153 20 412 285 127 to the ability of the people to buy. The Director of the Mint in 18a8 ------·-·············· 61,393,000 245 157 20 422 290 132 forms us that our circulation since January 1, 1879, in gold, silver, 1889 .••••• ------········-··· 62,921,000 251 160 20 431 295 136 and currency bas increased among the people-outside the Treasury 1890 ·------···················· 64,476,000 257 165 20 442 300 142~ and the banks-more than $186,000,000. Increa-sed capacity to buy increases demand for the things that satisfy want, and the increased I ask gentlemen to look at the annual surplus-over a hundred mill demand increases the price of commodities. Let us take the tariff, ions and growing larger every year-and tell me how they can vote which is the largest source of our revenue. to sell bonds that are not to be paid for twenty years. Is not the Mr. WRIGHT. Why not talk about the tax on incomes f estimate made on a sound basis, and is it not a very reasonable one f Mr. MILLS. I am dealing with a practical question. I am trying Does it not follow, as the night follows the day, that our revenues to show that our customs will increase year by year. Our tariff· is must increase with our increasing population and wea.lth f Would it in the main specific. That is, it is imposed by weight and measure not be a piece of supreme folly in this body representing the interests and not by value. It is so much per yard and so much per pound. of all the people to take this debt, fast disappearing, and which would Let us take a ton of iron for illustration. If itisworth$10 per ton be wholly exhausted in five or six years at the furthest, and fasten and the duty is $10 per ton the equivalent acl valorem is100 per cent. it on us for twenty or forty Y Look at this thing as an intelligent If by increased demand it rises in value to $20 per ton the equivalent business man, and act as you would if it were your own personal con ad valorem is 50 per cent., and a large importation would result and cern. When a man embarks in any business enterprise be looks for- we would get a large revenue where we would otherwise get none ward and judges the future by the experiences of the past. You invest or a very small one. Our tariff is largely on the prohibitory order. your capital upon the probabilities that like causes will produce the Revenues have been designedly sacrificed to the manufacturing in- same results in the future that they have in the past. If you buy terests. The tariffbeingabovetherevenuestandardeveryreduction land, engage in mercantile pursuits, invest in public securities, you brings it nearer to that point. The very term revenue standard calculate the probabilities of success, and determine your course a.c means the largest amount of revenue that can be reached without cordingly. restricting consumption. Two years ago iron went up 125 per cent. Butitissaid taxation is too high and should be reduced. Taxation, Other things rose in price, not so largely as iron perhaps, but there much or little, should never be greater than the demands for an honest was a general rise in the price of all commodities. What was the and economical administration of the Government. It should always result f Imports increased largely and the revenues rose from one be sufficient to meet the demands of the Government. When we com hundred and thirty millions in 1878 to one hundred and thirty-seven pare the taxation we have to-day with that of the last twenty years millions in 1879 and one hundred and eighty-six millions in 1880, and we see that it is far below the average. In 1866 we paid in Federal the imports are still increasing. During the five months ending 30th taxation 14.75 per head; 1867, .13.07; 1868,$10.49, and 1880,$6.75. If November our imports amounted to two hundred and sixty-two mill- we act wisely and continue our revenues and pay these bonds and ions, a gain over the corresponding five months of last year of forty- those of 1891, which we can do in the next seven or eight years, we seven millions. If the remaining months of the year but equal those may then repeal a large amount of taxation. of last year we shall have seven hundred millions of imports this year. I have heard it frequently said by the advoca.tes of these long bonds. It is a fact that cannot be disputed that every enhancement of the that posterity must bear some of these burdens. Whose posterity! price of commodities must increase our imports in the present status Not theirs. The men who clamor for oppressive taxation on all the of the tariff. The importations of last year demonstrate the truth necessaries of life are equally clamorous against imposing any taxes. of the proposition. And so do the revenues derived from internal upon their wealth. The right to eat bread by the sweat of one's brow taxes. They rose from one hundred and ten millions in 1878 to one is a right that was reserved in the primal curse of man; but these hundred and thirteen in 1H79, one hundred and twenty-four in 1880, men who are so zealous to escape taxation themselves mercilessly de and the Secretary tells us they will be one hundred and thirty-five maud that the burden shall grow heavier upon the shoulders of thos& millions the present year. who toil, and deny to them the right to satisfy their hunger with the I have expended some labor in trying to reach an approximate esti- products of their own toil. The wealthy do not intend to bear any of mate of our revenues for the next ten years. 1 took the fifteen years the burdens of the Government, nor do they intend that their children from 1866 to 1880, inclusive, and made an average of customs taxes per shall. It is the great a.rmy of toilers who live by daily labor who ar& head of our population and found it to be four dollars in round num- to bear while living this enormous burden, and it is their posterity hers. I took the last nine years of the internal-revenue taxes, and that are to continue to bear as their fathers did. It is of these that foundtheaverage$2.56perhead. I selected nine years for the internal President Washington spoke when he said we should" not ungener revenue because very considerable changes were made in the laws prior ously place upon posterity the burdens which we ourselves ought to to that time. I take Elliot's tables of estim.ated population for each bear." · In those days the people were not separated into two orders of the years from 1880 to 1890. far apart-one enjoying an immunity from taxation and the other Applying the averages of taxes paid per bead for the time given to suffeirng and bending under all its unconscionable burdens. In those the ensuing ten years, it gives me the following table of population, days" equal and exact justice to all men" was the proud motto borne customs, and internal revenue. The miscellaneous revenues are about upon the frontlets of the Republic and engraven on the palms of her· the same every year, and I place them at twenty millions, though they hands. Suppose yon go to the capitalists in Wall street and propose are already fifteen millions for the half year that is gone. In the to fix a tax on.tbeir income and continue it upon their posterity, what column of expenditures, including charge of annual interest, I have would be their replyt Suppose yon propose a tax on the five thousand retained the Secretary's estimate for this and next year, and after millions invested in railroads in the United States and continue it that added five millions each succeeding year. I have made no de- upon the children and grandchildren of the present owners, what will duction on account of the large sum that will be taken from the they say' They will denounce the proposition, as they have repeat annual expenditure in a few years by reason of the payment of the edly done, as odious and inquisitorial. They once paid taxes, bot they arreara~es of pensions. Nor have 1 made any deduction on account swept away the laws that imposed them aa with the breath of a.. of the fiiteenmillionsreductionof interest. Nor have I made any de- whirlwind. They said it was a wartax andfearfullyoppressive, and dnction on account of the decrease of interest by annual payment.of Congress gave them up. But the other day we heard another com the public debt. If one hundred millions of that debt is paid each plaint of excessive taxation. We are told every day that taxes ar& year, the amount required for interest will be three millions leas each I too heavy. And so they are on those who pay them. 1881. CONGRESSIONAL REOORD-HOUSE. 397 Bot the question is, do you propose to relieve those who are best Burke, the great English statesman, tells us that every exemption .-entit.led to your sympathy Y Let us see if we understand each other. from the burdens o-f government of any cla.ss in the State tends to How much do you propose to reduce the tax on sugar, that is taxed the dissolution of the ties of sympathy and citizenship, and to pro from 62 to 73 per cent. Y On rice, that is taxed 100 per cent. Y On duce in the bosoms of those who are exempted a feeling t'hat is alien salt, that is taxed from 40 to 66 per cent. 7 On cotton goods, that are to the rest of the commonwealth. The observation is true. There taxed from 61 to 71 per cent. f On window-glass, that is taxed from is a class, few but powerful, that have grown up under the fostering "90 to 116 per cent. 7 On iron, that is taxed from 70 to 90 per cent. f care ~f legislative robbery, and who feel toward the vast body of On candy, that is taxed from 100 to 153 per cent. f The children of their fellow·citizens as though they were but hewets of wood and poor folks would like for it to come near enough for them to get a drawers of water for them. They ask Congress to keep this debt on lick at it occasionally. How much do yon propose to reduce the taxes the people that they may amass great fortunes by its stock-extend on spices, that are all the way from 1S1 to 461 per cent. f How much the power of the banks and increase the spoliations of the tariff. ()n wool and woolen goods, so essential to the comfort of fifty millions As President Washington says, let us pay the debt "without of people in winterY They are taxed from 60 to 90 per cent. How delay," and not ungenerously place upon the shoulders of our chil much on blankets and wool hats, that are taxed 89 per cent. f Is it -dren the burden we should bear ourselves. In the language of Presi not a shame that woolen clothing is taxed 90 per cent. f How many dent Madison, let us press for the "effectual and early extinguishment thousands are to-day destitute of such comforts because they are not of the debt." In the language of President Jackson, let us" hasten within their reach! These taxes are shamefully oppressive. They the extinguishment of the debt." In the langnaae of President are so exorbitant that they defraud the Government and rob the Hayes, let us pay the debt "as rapidly as possible." Everything now people. And yet the gentlemen who are here urging a repeal of taxes is propitious. The shadow of the long night of distress lies in the would not so much a.s touch them with their little fingers. vale behind us. Our faces are turned away from the habitations of Who is it, then, that is so oppressed with taxes 7 Why, the banks. the task-masters. Let us with a glad heart and bounding step move The little tax on their circulation must be repealed. 'What next Y forward in the discharge of the great trust committed to us and in The tax on bank deposits must be repealed. What next Y The tax on the fulfillment of the great destiny that awaits us. [Applause.] bank capital must be repealed. Wha.t next 'I The tax on bank-checks Mr. PHILIPS. Mr. Chairman, I ask to have read as a part of my most be repealed. It is banks, and only banks-banks first, banks remarks a bill which I have prepared and propose to submit as a last, and banks all the time. The banks in whose vaults are two substitute for the pending measure. • thousand millions of money, and who are receiving a bounty from the The Clerk read as follows: Government of over fifteen milliQns annually as interest on the bonds .A. bill to facilitate the refunding of the public debt. they havedeposi ted, while 90 per cent. of them have been paid in dollars SECTION 1. Be it enacted, &c., That in lieu of and for the purpose of redeeminp; the that are equal in value to gold, are greatly oppressed. So oppressive United States bonds authorized to be issued by the actofJuly L4,1870 entitled" .An is this taxation and so eager was the Hoose to comply with there act to authorize the refunding ofthenationaldebt," and all acts amendatory thereof, quest of the bankers and repeal it at once that it only lacked a half the Secretary of the Treasury is hereby authorized and directed toissueTreasury notes of the United States in the amount of not more than five hundred million dozen votes of securing the requisite two-thirds, a few days ago, dollars, in denominations of not less than ten dollars, and bearing interest at a. when it was proposed to pass a bill by suspension repealing the tax rate not exceeding 3 per cent. per annum, redeemable at the pleasure of the Gov. ()n checks. When we begin to reduce taxes I want to see it begin in ernment at any time after the 1st day of July, 1882: Prouided, That not more than sixty millions of said notes shall so mature in each year from the date of their the right place. The first point to attack is the tari:ff. The first taxes issue ; and said notes shall be disposed of by the said Secretary at not less than to reduce are the taxes on food and clothing and the implements of par, and the proceeds thereof shall be applied to the payment of the 5 and 6 per labor. cent. bonds of the United States maturing during the year 1881. Now, sir, I have shown that we have every probability to expect SEc. 2. That the Secretary of the Treasury is hereby authorized to exchange at not less than par any of the notes aforesaid for any of the said bonds so maturing the increase of our revenues. We are in the enjoyment of a prosperity in the year 188l. .And on the bonds so redeemed the Secretary of the Treasury the result of two co-operating causes, and when these two concur we may allow to the holders the difference between the interest on such bonds from will always have increased revenues. The first is increasing popula the date of the contract of exchange to the time of their maturity and the interest tion, and the second is increasing wealth distributed among the peo for a like period on the notes so exchanged. . SEc. 3. That the Secretary of the Treasury is hereby authorized to issue the said ple. No man can gainsay the proposition. On these two" hang all notes either with coupons or registered, and in such appropriate form as he may the law and the prophets." A man's wants always increase with his prescribe, and to make suitable regulations for disposing of said Treasury notes ability to satisfy them. When a man is poor he will be contented to the best advantage for the Government, the expenses attending such disposition, with a two-horse wagon, but if he rises to an income of ten thousand not to exceed one-fourth of 1 per cent. of the notes so disposed of or exchanged. SEc. 4. That for the purpose of redeeming the residue of said bonds so maturing a year he will discard his wagon and ride in a carriage attended with in the year 1881 the Secretary of the Treasury is hereby authorized and directell. servants in livery. A millionaire will live in a palace, a mendicant to appropriate and apply the sum of 100,000,000--{)ne-ha.lf in gold and one-half in will be contented with a hovel. Weare prosperous to-day. We can silver-of the coin in the Treasury of the lJnited Stab~s. together with so much of remove the producing causes and bring distress again. We can drive the Slilrplus revenues on hand as may be necessary therefor. SEC. 5. All acts and parts of acts inconsistent with provisions of this act are away our population as Europe is doing by the oppressive burdens of hereby repealed. national debts fastened upon the people and persecuting them with taxes. We can stop the coinage of gold and silver and issue no more Mr. PHILIPS. Mr. Chairman, I claim no originality for the· bill paper convertible into coin. We can continue large taxes and lock just read. It contains what in my judgment is the good in the sev them up in the vaults of the Treasury, and it would not be long till eral substitutes proposed, and attempts to avoid the chief evil of the we would see our land as though it were visited by the "pestilence original bill. I have sought a common ground on which I believe that walketh in darkness, and the desolation that wasteth at noon every patriot can stand. · day." The people would soon be unable to bear the burdens of gov This question is one of practical legislation. It ought to be ad ernment, and hunger and want would stand on many of the thresh justed by the roles of plain common sense and business experience ; olds of the poor. We are coining silver every day and addin~ it to and there ought to be wisdom and conservatism enough here to se ()Dr circulation. It is bound to remain in the country and aid lll the cure such unity of action as will bring out of the conflict of opinion increase of prices. The Secretary tells us that it has the fiat quality. a result that will command public approval. It is worth in commerce eighty-five cents in London and elsewhere. It is the very sum of folly for us to stand here chaffering and Mr. DAVIS, of North Carolina. Ninety and six-tenths. whining about how or why this debt was created, or how or why it Mr. MILLS. Somewere along there. The exact figure is not ma took its present shape. History and an enlightened public sentiment terial to my argument. We have invested the silver dollar with all will assign this responsibility to its rightful place. the functions of money. We compel creditors to accept it in liquida The debt exists. It has the sanction and sanctity of legislative tion of their debts. It is worth here one hundred cents in gold; in authority. To its ultimate liquidation the faith of this great Govern London it is worth ninety. Every dollar, therefore, that we add to ment stands pledged. The principal of a part of this debt becomes the circulation must remain here and contribute to the enhancement payable or redeemable on or before July 1 next, as follows : of the value of property, the amount of the revenues, and the pros perity of the people. Loan. Rate. Payable. Redeemable. .Amonnt. Now, sir, in the light of the prospects around ns will we continue this debt for forty years f If we pay it in six years we will pay one hundred and eight millions of.interest. If we put it off to forty years February, 1861..----···-·· 6 per cent. Dec. 1, 1880 ······-····--· $13, 414; 000 Oregonwar.. ·------·-···-· 6percent. July1, 1881 . •. ....•...•. 711,800 we will pay seven hundred and twenty millions of interest. Are we July and August, 1861.._. 6 per cent. ···--· -·-····· June 30,1rl81 145,786,500 to lay six hundred and twelve millions of unnecessary borden upon 1863, (1881s). ·-·-·· .....••. 6 per cent..••... ___ ..... Jnne 30, 1881 57,787,250 the vast body of the people and their children Y W onld it not be an 1881,fnnded.. ---·--···-··· 5percent. ···-··--······May 1,1881 469, 651, 050 act of consummate folly, nay, would it not be treason to the people, ----- whose interests we are here to represent, if we should bind them like OutstandingNov.1,1880 .. ·········-·· ·----··-······ .•...•...... 687, 350, 600 Prometheus upon the rock to be torn by the talons of those foul birds that feed and fatten on corruption f If taxes are no burdens, let None of the remaining public bonds become redeemable prior to those two hundred and seventy thousand persons who have an an September 1, 1891, and those are 4t per cent. bonds. The bonds pay nual income of eight hundred and fifty millions come forward and able December 1, lSBO, have been redeemed, leaving $637,350,600 to contribute something to the support of the Government. Let those be provided for. Under the acts of July 14, 1870, and January 20, large railroad corporations come forward and contribute something 1871, there are 104,652,200 of 4 per cent. bonds in the hands of the to aid the Government to transport over their own track& the troops Treasurer available for the purpose of sale with which to continue that are necessary to preserve their own property from conflagration the work of redemption. Thus it iB apparent that the practical ques when the torch is in the hands of their own strikers. tion which confronts Congress, first, is, shall the Secretary of the 398 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. JANUARY 6., Treasury dispose of these $104,1'552,200 of four percents to obtain that cent. bonds in 1891, will aggregate for the ten years from 1882, $520,- amount for redemption purposes t For Congress to permit this would 904,707.58, or an average in round numbers annually of $52,000,000. certainly be most culpable when it is now conceded by the best in The total of revenues collected in the last fiscal year amounted to formed that a 3 per cent. bond of like provisions can be readily nego $333,526,610.98. The total of ordinary expenditures for the year, in tiated. So, too, as to the bonds redeemable this year bearing 6 and cluding 2,795,320.42 for premiums on bonds purchased, were $267,- 5 per cent. interest. We would confessedly be unsafe custodians of 642,957.78, leaving a surplus revenue of $651883,653.20. The item of the public credit and welfare if we were to permit this immense sum $2,795,320.42, for premiums on bonds purcnased ought never to be of money to continue to bear these rates of interest when we could repeated in the schedule of public expenditures. It is a shameful substitute this debt with a 3 per cent. interest bond, with its saving commentary on the financial management of the republican party of millions of interest, which is a tax on the earnings and resources that the Government should be forced into competition with the of the people. · bond-mongers, the bulls and bears of Wall street to call in its own Under the favoring conditions of internal peace and abounding bonds; an occurrence we will not again witness if the policy be prosperity, resulting from unexampled home production and foreign adopted which I propose to outline. demand, the day and the hour is ours in which toobtainloans at a rate It is apparent that the application of the surplus revenues, leaving hitherto unknown to the Government; and which no statesman, in the sinking fund intact, to the redemption of the 1881 debt, would the vicissitudes of harvests, commerce, foreign trade, and peace at liquidate it in ten years. home and abroad, can predict will continue for a year. For the ten years from 1870 to and inclusive of 1879 there was paid of So that the plainest dictates of common sense and self-preservation principal of public debt $436,356,968.06, and of interest on public debt require that we should, at once, refund this debt, unless it can be sat the sum of $1,092,330,558.33, making a grand total of $1:528,687,526.39; isfactorily demonstrated that this question admits of some other solu and this, too, during a period of four years of unexampled stringency tion consistent with public faith and sound financial economy. in monetary affairs and business distress. Chief among the pending bills, chief because it is presented to us The receipts of the Government, now far in excess of the most favor from so important a committee as that of the "Ways and Means," able year of the past decade, may not, under any reasonably conceiv is the able fortune, average less through the next decade, and, coupled with II WOOD FlTh"'DING BILL.' I an annual interest debt from twenty millions to thirty-five millions It authorizes, in brief, Ae Secretary of the Treasury to issue bonds to less than the average of the past period, it becomes an absolute demon the amount of $500,000,000 bearing 3t per cent. interest, redeemable stration that the wbole of the 1881 debt can be liquidated inside of at the pleasure of the Government after twenty years, and payable in the ten years. Therefore any enactment by this Congress that would forty years; and also 200,000,000 of notes bearing 3t per cent., re prolong it or put it out of our power to wipe it out would be almost deemable after two years and payable in ten years ; but not more criminal. than $40,000,000 to be payable in any one year. Since this bill was Since March, 1877, in a period of little over two years, with our reported to the Honse the chairman of the Ways and Means Com heavy interest rates and the payment of premiums, there has been mittee ha.s been instructed by his committee to move an amendment paid of the principal of the public debt 109,489,850. In addition to reducing the rate of interest on the bonds to 3 per cent. and to increase the foregoing ordinary resources, there is no satisfactory objection to the volume of Treasury notes to $400,000,000. the application of a portion of the coin locked up in the Treasury In other words the amended bill is but the echo of the recommen vaults. The Secretary admits that of the $218,710,154 so held $141,- dation of the Secretary of the Treasury. I am opposed, Mr. Chair 597,013.61 are available for redemption purposes; but he claims that man, to the issue of another public bond beyond the power of the it is, and should be, retained as the ba-sis of specie resumption-the Government to call it in and redeem whenever it has the money to security for the greenba-ck circulation of 346,681,016. I shall con pay. If the lessons taught by history in other governments were cede, Mr. Chairman, what the intelligence of the age approves and forgot, the fresh experience of the past fifteen years of our people all political economists teach that a healthful and stable pa.per cur teaches us that our bonded debt system is an intolerable curse, pro rency rests upon the assurance of its ultimate redemption, :i.i de lific of evil and dangerous to popular liberty. manded, in a money of intrinsic value. Yet it is due to the actual The report of the Comptroller of the Currency submitted to this facts to admit that the real convenience and utility qf such a cur Congress announces the amount of United States bonds held by the rency, and the reliance on the ability of the Government to redeem banks, as follows: ultimately, make it quite as current when it is well known to the public that there is not dollar for dollar in specie in the vaults for the Savings-banks.·----·---- ••.••...... •... ·-----·----· $189,187,816 State banks and trust companies .•• _••.• ___ •...•.•... 24,498,604 circulating notes. No better proof of this need_be offered here than 14,366,684 the patent fact that the $346,000,000 of greenbacks to-day are at par Private banks .... ·----· .. · -·· .••••..... ·----·-----·. with gold and silver when there are only $141,597,013 of coin avail National banks •...... •...••...... ••....•••.••..•... 403,369,350 able for their redemption in the Treasury. I entertain not the shadow Total ...... •...... -...... 631, 422, 454 of a doubt in asserting that at least 100,000,000 of this coin could at once be put to the service of the redemption of the bonds without And it is a well-known fact that one-thirtieth of the entire public affecting in the lea.st the circulating value and office of the green funded debt of this nation if:! held and owned by a single man. backs. The effect of this concentration of public obligations in the hands On the day of the proclaimed resumption of specie payments there of a few corporations and individuals is but too palpable. They have were in fact in the Treasury only $112, 703,34~ of gold and 32,000,000 become autocrats in finance and dictators in legislation. Under the of silver. The whole amount of notes presented for redemption the false notion that the holders of the nation's obligations are its bene year prior to November 1, 1880, was only $706,658. What contin factors, their wants and wishes have hitherto displaced all just con gency is likely to arise in the near future to lessen confidence in the siderations of the needs and rights of 50,000,000 of tax-paying people. greenback or increase the demand for specie f The greenback sur The holders of these securities are always on the side of immense vived the shock of battle, the desolations of war, and the depletion revenues and high taxes; for in these exactions lie the value of of the Treasury. It ha-s withstood the frowns and hatred of gold their claims. They are so potential at home that they dictate con mongers. And despite the devilish ingenuity and machinations of gressional nominationB and dominate elections. There are so few of the bondholders its very name for ten years made their knees to them and they are so vigilant that on -short warning they concen smite together like Belshazzar at the handwriting on the wall amid trate on the National Legislature and make their power felt in all of even his royal revels. And even the Secretary of the Treasury, whose its financial policies. They uphold and sustain the man and party right hand penned the resumption act-" the steel point unseen, not in politics whose voice and vote will maintain and magnify the in unfelt," beneath the fair words of which was a covert thrust at the terest rates on their bonds; for they have no convictions in politics greenbacks to make place for the national-bank notes-is now com that are permitted to hazard their gains. pelled in his late report to pay this high tribute to its worth : THE NATIONAL BA..."'"KS United States notes are now in form, soourity, and convenience the best circulat ing medium known. * * • The United States note, to the exteut that it is will being dependent on the perpetuation of these bonds for their continued ingly taken by the people and can beyond question be maintained at par in coin, existence and a high rate of interest for their better security and is the least burdensome form of debt. profits, are ever impressed with the idea that And yet with all the seeming instincts of the miser he clutches with 'Tis their duty, so all the learned think, nervous hands and guards with greedy eyes his coin bags, as if he T' 'spouse the cause by which they eat and drink. would suffer the pangs of starvation rather than let one darling shin So they can always, in our politics, be implicitly relied on to aid ing piece go. He pleads in justification of the doting passion the pos with votes and money the party that will continue the bonded debt sibility of" an adverse balance of trade, or a sudden panic, or other and stand for high rates of interest. And in turn the dominant party unfortunate circumstances." is the unswerving friend of the nationa.l banks. Hence, for years all No such misery can possibly come upon this land for the nex.t four our ministers of finance, from the Secretary to his subordinates, have years; for last fall preceding the election the Secretary from the in their annual reports to Congress devoted a large space to a most hustings, and all his party allies, assured the people that financial dis labored defense of the supreme importance of the national banks, orders and reverses were only possible in the event of Hancock's elec without whose existence, they teach, there would be no outlet for tion; but only elect the hero of the "tow-path" and sage of Men our gushing revenues, no healthful actions in the financial system. tor, and the golden glimmer of the dawning of a financial millennium Therefore, as to the public debt, their motto is esto perpetua. would light the Orient on the mom succeeding his inau~uration. The The Secretary of the Treasury states in his recent report that the people were taken in imagination upon the very top of PISgah's Mount, requirements of the sinking fund, prior to the maturity of the 4t per and pointed, as an inheritance for the faithful, to a republican Canaan 1881. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. 399 :flowing eternally with milk and honey, ever swelling in abundance, These small notes would be eagerly sought for as safe investments where even the blasts would but shake "spices from the leaves" and for the humble savings of the people, as also by guardians, trustees, " every month drop fruits upon the ground." and insurance companies. They would, in such shape, be mof:!t con No trade currents, no foreign disturbanQes were to interrupt a joy venient to the masses for temporary use and investment, roa perpetually jog on. The greenbackers and the national banks are refunding the national debt, to exchange at not Jess than par any of the bonus or •much alike. They both exjst upon the present condition of the pub notes herein authorized for any of the bonds of th6 United States outstanding and uncalled bearing a higher rate of interest than 41 per cent. per annum, and on lic debt. The passage of a bill embodying the views I have indicated the bonds so redeemed the Secretary of the Treasury may allow to the holders the ·would short1y remove Loth of these barnacles on the body-politic. It difference between the interest on such bonds from the date of exchange to the would remove insuperable objections to the inauguration of legis time of their maturity, and the interest for a like period on the bonds or notes is -lative measures for the revision of our outrageous custom and excise sued, but :cone of the provisions of this act shall apply to the redemption or ex change of any of the bonds issued to the Pacific railway companies, and the bonds 1laws, the repression of monopolies, the invigoration of internal com so received and exchanged in pursuance of the provisions of this act shall be can merce, the revival of American ship-building, restoring to us the lost celed and destroyed. glory of the American flag streaming on the high seas and flaunting SEc. 3. Authority to issue bonds and notes to the amount necessary to carry out ·in every foreign port of trade. the provisions of this act iR hereby granted. SEc. 4. The act approved February 26, 1 79, authorizing the issue of certificates Mr. Chairman, in the future of so grand a republic as ours, with of deposit is hereby amended so as to continue and limit the amount of certificates its march of empire, its swelling tide of population, its new rising to be issued to $50,000,000 to be outstanding at any one time, and fixing the rate of stars in the constellation of States, its marvelous production of cereals interest to be allowed thereon at three and one-hill of 1 per cent. per annum for one year, after which interest shall cease; and the said certificates shall be con and precious ores; with its pasture lands and meadows stretching vertible, at the option of the holders, when presented in sums of $50 or multiples from ocean to ocean, all capable of indefinite expansion, develop thereof, into the coupon or registered bonds authorized by this act; and whenever ment, and utilization under the crafty hand and inventive genius of any of the said certificates shall be converted into bonds, the same shall be can as bold, energetic, and aggressive a race as e>er '' wrought or fought" celed and destroyed; but the Secretary of the Treasury may, in his discretion, issue new certificates in place of those so converted up to the limit of $50,000,000, under the sun of civilization, there are other problems for the solu until the aggregate amount of the bonds authorized by this act and of the said cer tion of statesmanship, for which patriotism and genius sigh, rather tificates combined then outstanding shall equal the amount of bonds hereby author than for this perpetual struggle of degradation with debt and money ized. It shall be unlawful for any person or pArsons to form combinations by changers. which to procure said certificates of deposit authorized under this act, forpur :poses of sale to others, or for acting as agents of others, and any person so offend Let us, with rugged, practical business sense, and in the spirit of mg shall be liable, on conviction, to be fu:ied S1,000 or imprisoned not to exceed one patriotic compromise, settle this bond question here and now, and year. The Secretary of the Treasury is authorizetl and directed to make suitable turn the country's eye to those brighter fields of glory. regulations in compliance with this act, providing that the expense for the dispos· Mr. TUCKER. If there is no other gentleman who wishes to engage ing of the certificates and bonds authorized to be issued shall not exceed one-quar ter of 1 per cent.: Provided, That said certificates shall not be sold or converted in this general debate I will move the committee rise with a view, I at less than par. will say, of taking up the bill on Saturday next and considering it SEC. 5. From and after the 1st day of July, 11:180, the 3! per cent. bonds author .section by section, as to-morrow is private bill day. ized by the first section of this act shall be the only bonds receivable as security Several MEMBERS. Oh, no; let it be taken up to-morrow. for national-bank circulation. SEC- 6: This act shall be known as "The funding act of 18t:O," and all acts and Mr. TUCKER. To-morrow is private 'bill day. parts of acts inconsistent with this act are hereby repealed. Mr. McLANE. That makes no difference. Mr. TUCKER. I will say for the information of the Honse that The substitute proposed by Mr. KELLEY is as follows: to-day I stand in charge of this bill at the instance of the chairman A bill to provide for the payment of the bonds falling due in 1881. rof the Committee on Ways and Means, [Mr. FERNANDO WooD,] who Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of is detained from the House by sickness. He hopes to be in the House America in Congress assembled, That the Secretary of the Treasury be, and he is hereby, authorized to issue Treasury notes to the amount of $<100,000,000, in denomi by Saturday next, when the bill comes up to be considered by sec nations of not less than $10, bearing interest at the rate of 3 per cent. per aunum, tions. I move, therefore, the committee rise with a view to taking redeemable at any time at the pleasure of the Government after the 1st day of July, this up again on Saturday next. The idea of the gentleman from 1BB2, and to sell the same at not less than par. Heia also authorized to issue bonds to the amount of 237,000,000, bearing interest at the rate of 3 per cent. per annum .New York was that as to-morrow is private bill day the funding bill and redeemable at the pleasure of the Government at any time after the 1st day of must go over until Saturday next. July, h !85, and to sell the same at not less than par. Anu the proceeds of the sale Mr. REAGAN. That being the case, Mr. Chairman, I give notice of said notes and bonds shall be applied to the payment of the bonds of the United -that I shall try to-morrow to get up the interstate-commerce bill. States falling due in 1881. SEC. 2. The Secretary of the Treasury is hereby authorized to exchange at not Mr. TUCKER's motion was agreed to. less than par any of the bonds or notes herein authorized for any bonds of the Uni The committee accordingly rose ; and the Speaker having resumed ted Sbttes outstanding and which mature during the year 1B81. And on the bonds the chair, Mr. COVERT reported that the Committee of the Whole so redeemed the Secretary of the Treasury may allow to the holders the difference House on the state of the Union had, according to order, had under between the interest on such bonds from the dat~ of exchange to the time of their maturity and the interest for alike period on the bonds or notes issued and the -consideration the bill (H. R. No. 4592) to facilitate the refunding of bonds so received and exchanged in pursuance of the provisions of this act shall be the national debt, and had come to no conclusion thereon. canceled and destroyed. . Mr. COOK. I now move the House adjourn. · SEc. 3. The Secretary of the Treasury is hereby authorized to issue the said notes · Mr. HISCOCK. Before the motion is made to adjourn, Mr. Speaker,' and bonds, either coupon or registered, and in such form as he may prescribe. SEC. 4. The Secretary of the Treasury is authorized and directed to make suita ~ wish to move that the refunding bill and the amendments proposed ble regulations in compliance with this act, providing that the expense for the dis ·thereto be printed in the RECORD to-morrow fer the convenience of posing of said notes and bonds authorized to be issued shall not exceed one-half IDembers. of I per cent. Thf} SPEAKER. The gentleman from New York moves that the The substitute proposed by Mr. GILLETTE is as follows : refunding bill and all amendments proposed thereto shall be printed in the REcoRD to-morrow so they may be seen in.one connection. Is A bill to provide for the payment of the public debt of the United States. Be it enacted-, &c., That all bonds of the United States that shall become redeem there objection t able in the year 1B8l or prior thereto, shall not be refunded or exchanged for other There was no objection, and it was ordered accordingly. bonds of t.he United States, but shall be paid as hereinafter provided. Mr. TOWNSHEND, of Illinois. Will not the bill be open to amend SEc. 2. That it shall be the duty of the Secretary of the Treasury to set apart ·ment when taken up section by section t all surplus coin and paper money which may be in the Treasury from time to time The SPEAKER. The bill is now in Committee of the Whole House as a fund for the payment ofthe said maturing bonds, and for the purchase of silver -on the state of the Union, and an amendment to an ame-ndment will be ~~:a!~~~~~& ~£~~~su~iJf8:I:s ~~d~~l ~rl~; ~~~s:ihs~£~ae~~~ ~~ in order at the same time, and when the amendment to an amend the capacity of the mints, and he is hereby authorized to purcha-se the silver bullion ment is voted down another amendment to the- amendment will be for said purpose as provided in the act approved February 2B, 1B78, entitled "An act to authorize the coinage of the standard silver dollar, and to restore its legal in order. In the Honse amendments will be in order in like manner tender character." until the previous question is seconded and the main question or SEc. 3. That it shall be the duty of the Secretary of the Treasury to prepare :dered. Treasury notes to the amount of $340,000,000, with such additional amount as may Mr. HISCOCK. My order has been agreed to. be necessary to equal but not exceed theamountofnational-bank notes in the United States as shown by the books of the Treasury on May 1, 18Bl. These notes shall The SPEAKER. It has. . be in denominations of 1, $2, $5, 10, $20, $50, aud $lOU, as mo t adapted to the con -The bill and amendments are as follows: venience of business, and shall be receivable for all dues and debts and taxes of every kind due or that shall become doe to the United States, and shall be receiv· H. R. No. 4592.-A. bill to facilitate the refunding of the national debt. able for all dues and debts of every kind due from or that shall become due from Be it enacted, lEe., That all existing provisions of law authorizing the refunding the United States where not otherwise provided by law, and shall be a legal tender to fully meet all of the said bonds of the United States, only so many of them act to authorize the rt-funding of the national debt," and all acts amendatory thereof, · ·shall be called in as can be paid under the provisions of thi8 act, but as fast as the Secretary of the Treasury is hereby authorized and directed to issue Treasury J>OSSible the Secretary of the Treasury shall call in, redeem, and cancel them. notes of the United States in the amonn t of not more than five hundred million dolla.l'8, in denominations of not less than ten dollars, and bearing interest at a rate notexeeed The substitute proposed by Mr. Bucn""ER is as follows: ing 3 per cent. per annum, redeemable at the pleasure of the Government at any time Strike out all after the enacting clause and insert the following: after the 1st day of July, 1882: Provided, That not more than sixty millions of said " That in lien of the bonds authorized to be issued by the act of J nly 14, 1870, en notes shall so mature in each year from the date of their issue ; anii said notes shall titled •An act to authorize the refunding of the national debt,' and the acts amend be disposed of by the said Secretary at not less than par, and the proceeds thereof atory t1lereof, the Secretary of the Treasury is hereby authorized to issue Treas· shall be applied to the payment of the 5 and 6 per cent. bonds of the United States nry notes of the United States, in the amount of not more than $600,000,000, in de maturing during the year 1881. • nominations of not less than $10, and bearing int~rest at a rate not exceeding 4 per SEc. 2. That the Secretary of the Treasury is hereby authorized to exchange at cent. per annum, of which said notes not more than six;ty millions shall mature not less than par any of the notes aforesaid for any of the said bonds so maturin~ each year from the date of their issue ; and said notes shafi be disposed of by the in the year 1&!1. .And on the bonds so redeemed the Secretary of the Treasury Secretary of the Treasury at not less than par, and the proceeds thereof shall be may allow to the holders the difference between the interest on such bonds from applied to the payment of the 5 and 6. per cent. bonds of the United States maturing the date of the contract of exchange to the time of their maturity and the interest dnrinJ:t tl1e year 1881, or the Secretary may exchange the Treasury notes for the for a like period on the notes so exchanged. said bonds, on such terms as he may deem mostadvantap;eous to the United States. SEC. 3. That the Secretary of the Treasury is hereby authorized to issue the said "SEC. 2. That the Secretary of the Treasury is authonzed to make suitable regu notes either with coupons or registered, and in such appropriate form as be may lations for disposing of said Treasury notes to the best advantage to the Govern prescribe, and to make suitable regulations for disposing of said Treasury notes ment, and all expenses attending the same shall not exceed one-quarter of 1 per to the best advantage to the Government, the expenses attending such disposition cent. of the notes so disposed of or exchanJ:ted. not to exceed one-fourth of 1 per cent. of the notes so disposed of or exchanged. in SEc. 4. That for the purpose of redeeming the residue of said bon.ds soma~~ "Sxc. 3. That the sum of $100,000.000 of the coin the Treasury of the United is States be set apart as a fund for the redemption of the notes known as Ie~al-tender in the year 1881 the Secretary of the Treasury hereby authorized and directen notes; and any surplus of coin over and above said sum, and belongmg to the to appropriate and apply the sum of $100,000,000-one-b.alf in gold and one-half'in United States, remaining in the Treasury shall be used by the Secretary of the silver-of the coin in the Treasury of the United States, together with so much of of the surplus revenues on hand as may be necessary therefor. Treasury in the purchase or redemption on account the sinking fund of any of SEc. 5. .All acts and parts of acts inconsistent with provisions of this act are the said 6 per cent. bonds maturing in the year 1881." hereby repealed. The amendment proposed by Mr. l\IcMILLIN is as follows : MESSAGE FRO~I THE SENATE. Add to section 1 : A message from the Senate, by Mr. SYMPSON, one of its clerks, in "And provided further, That the bonds issued under this act shall be subject to formed the Honse that the Senate had passed, and requested the taxation as other property." concurrence of the Honse in, a bill of the following title: The substitute proposed by Mr. BL.U-.'D is as follows:· A bill (S. No. 965) to authorize the appointment of D. T. Kirby to Strike out all after enacting clause and insert as follows: the rank of captain. "That of the coin now in the Treasury the sum of $100,000.000 is hereby appro ORDER OF BUSDi'ESS. priated for the payment of the interest-bearing debt of the United State-s due in the years 1ESO and 1881: And it is further provided, That the sum of $100,000,000of Mr. COOK. I insist upon my motion, that the Honse do now ad- revenues not otherwise appropriated be, and the same is hereby, appropriated for jonrn. the purposes aforesaid: It is further provided, That the Secretary of the Treasury tlhall cause to be coined the maximum amount. of silver bullion into standard sil The SPEAKER. The Chair requests the gentleman from Georgia ver dollars in the manner now authorized by law, and shall pay out such dollars in to allow the introduction of some executive documents pending the the redemption of the public debt hereinbefore mentioned monthly, and the par motion to adjourn, and also some enrolled bills. ticular bonds to be redeemed from time to time in pursuance to this act shall be Mr. COOK. I yield for that purpose. determined by lot under such rules as the Secretary of the Treasury shall pre scribe. E~""ROLLED BILLS SIGXED. " SEC. 2. That all laws and parts of Jaws, so far as the same may authorize the Mr. WARD, from the Committee on EDI'olled Bills, reported that issuing of bonds for the purpose of refunding or redeemin~ the interest-bearing •lebt of the United States, be, and they are hereby, repealed." the committee had examined and found duly enrolled bills of the fol lowin~ titles; when the Speaker signed the same: The amendment proposed by Mr. HATCII is a follows : A b1ll (H. R. No. 4GO) granting the right of way to the county of Amend by adding at the close of section 5 the following: Warren, in the State of Mississippi, and to the Memphis and Vicks '' .And any bank duly chartered or incorporated and doing business under the )aws of any State shall, on transfer and delivery to the Treasurer of the United burgh Railroad Company through the United States cemetery tract States of registered 3 per cent. bonds authorized by the first section of this act~ be of land near Vicksbnrgh, Mississippi; -e ntitled to receive from the Comptroller of the Currency circulating notes in the A bill (H. R. No. 4006) authorizing the Blue Hill National Bank same manner, proportion, and amount as is authorized and prescribed by Jaw for of Dorchester, Massachusetts, to change its location and name; and national-bank associations, which circulating notes shall be subject to the same regulations an