Vol. 760 Thursday No. 113 5 March 2015

PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES (HANSARD) HOUSE OF LORDS OFFICIAL REPORT

ORDER OF BUSINESS

Questions Gender Equality: Developing Nations...... 331 Sexual Violence against Girls and Women...... 333 Women in Sport...... 336 Lake District National Park Authority...... 338 Women: Economic Empowerment Motion to Take Note...... 341 Transport: Accident Prevention Question for Short Debate...... 414

Grand Committee Israel and Palestine...... GC 101 Sport: Women in Rowing...... GC 116 Employment Levels of Older People ...... GC 132 HIV/AIDS...... GC 144 Women: Domestic and Mental Abuse Questions for Short Debate...... GC 158

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The first time a Member speaks to a new piece of parliamentary business, the following abbreviations are used to show their party affiliation: Abbreviation Party/Group CB Cross Bench Con Conservative Con Ind Conservative Independent DUP Democratic Unionist Party GP Green Party Ind Lab Independent Labour Ind LD Independent Liberal Democrat Ind SD Independent Social Democrat Lab Labour Lab Ind Labour Independent LD Liberal Democrat LD Ind Liberal Democrat Independent Non-afl Non-affiliated PC Plaid Cymru UKIP UK Independence Party UUP Ulster Unionist Party

No party affiliation is given for Members serving the House in a formal capacity, the Lords spiritual, Members on leave of absence or Members who are otherwise disqualified from sitting in the House. © Parliamentary Copyright House of Lords 2015, this publication may be reproduced under the terms of the Open Parliament licence, which is published at www.parliament.uk/site-information/copyright/. 331 Gender Equality: Developing Nations[5 MARCH 2015] Gender Equality: Developing Nations 332

Baroness Kinnock of Holyhead (Lab): My Lords, as House of Lords the Minister knows, millions of marginalised girls are literally risking their lives to get a safe, high-quality Thursday, 5 March 2015. education. In Pakistan, the schooling of girls has been outlawed by the Taliban. In Afghanistan, girls have 11 am been attacked in their classroom and a schoolgirls’ bus was bombed. In Congo, girls have been raped by soldiers on their way to school and, as we know, 200 schoolgirls Prayers—read by the Lord Bishop of Norwich. in Nigeria were abducted by Boko Haram. Will the Minister tell the House how DfID is supporting the efforts of UNESCO and UNICEF to focus more Gender Equality: Developing Nations effectively on marginalised girls, in line with the aim Question that she just mentioned of leaving no one behind?

11.06 am Baroness Northover: My Lords, the noble Baroness Asked by Lord Loomba is quite right about the risks girls often take in seeking To ask Her Majesty’s Government what steps an education. I hope that I can reassure her by saying they are taking to promote the education of girls that one of our focuses now is to try to ensure that the and young women and gender equality in developing most vulnerable girls and boys are able to get into nations. school safely, and not only to primary school but to progress on to secondary school. The very fact that they can get there is an indication that they have The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department actually succeeded in primary school. for International Development (Baroness Northover): My Lords, the United Kingdom has prioritised girls’ education as one of the four pillars of our strategic Baroness Hayman (CB): My Lords, I have recently vision for women and girls. Since 2010 the UK has returned from Sierra Leone where all the schools have supported more than 10 million girls and boys in been closed for almost nine months. This has had a primary and lower secondary schools. We are working devastating effect on the education of girls in particular, to ensure that gender equality is central to the post-2015 many of whom will never return to school now and development framework, with a dedicated gender goal, among whom there are very disturbing reports of targets throughout the framework and data broken increased rates of sexual exploitation, early marriage down by sex and age. and teenage pregnancy. Can the Minister assure me that Her Majesty’s Government will continue to support the outstanding efforts on the part of both UK Lord Loomba (LD): I thank my noble friend for government bodies and NGOs, which I was privileged that Answer. The education of girls and young women to witness in that country, not only right until the end and their equality is linked in one way or another to of the Ebola outbreak, which is far from finished, but the welfare of widows and how societies around the also in the longer term for rebuilding education and world treat them. I declare an interest as founder and health in that very needy country? chairman of the Loomba Foundation. An estimated 245 million widows and 500 million children around the world suffer injustice in silence. Baroness Northover: I thank the noble Baroness for More than 100 million widows live in poverty, struggling her tribute to the work that we are doing in Sierra to survive, and 1.5 million widows’ children die before Leone, and I also pay tribute to that work, which has their fifth birthday. been outstanding. We are trying to get Ebola down to Due to conflict, war, poverty, lack of adequate zero cases because that is crucial. We want to see the living standards, nutritious food, clean drinking water schools reopen, and at the moment we are focused on and healthcare, the number of widows is increasing in how to rebuild within Sierra Leone. However, she is the developing world. How will the Minister ensure quite right to talk about the special vulnerability of that the importance of the plight of widows is included women and girls. We are seeking to protect them and in the framework of the UN millennium development ensure that the risks that she has talked about do not goals for 2015-30? come to fruition.

Baroness Northover: My Lords, I commend my Baroness Jenkin of Kennington (Con): My Lords, noble friend on his work in this extremely important perhaps I may take this opportunity to congratulate area. DFID supports a range of projects to assist the Government on getting these 5 million girls educated. widows—for example in Bangladesh and Pakistan. Andrew Mitchell was the first Secretary of State to We recognise how especially vulnerable widows can focus on it, along with Justine Greening and the rest of be. As my noble friend knows, we place great importance the DfID team, and it has been so effective. What are on gender equality and on the principle of leaving no the Government doing on early and forced marriage, one behind in the new framework which it is hoped one of the related topics here and which came up at will be agreed at the UN in September. This is clearly the very successful Girl Summit that took place in vital in seeking to eradicate extreme poverty. London last year? 333 Gender Equality: Developing Nations[LORDS] Sexual Violence 334

Baroness Northover: Again, I thank my noble friend “This is Abuse”, and the materials developed to support for her tribute to the work that has been done within better teaching of sex and relationship education in DfID. As she has said, last year we had the Girl schools. Summit which focused on both FGM and early and forced marriage. These are clear abuses of girls’ rights. Baroness Hussein-Ece (LD): My Lords, I commend We have already invested significantly in both areas the Government for introducing these new guidelines, and I trust that that will continue in the future. on the back of some very high-profile and unpleasant cases. Does the Minister agree with me that there are some very depressing surveys that show that one in Lord Collins of Highbury (Lab): My Lords, will three boys still think it is okay to hit a girl and to force the Minister confirm that in the forthcoming negotiations her to have sex? Even more revealingly, a student on the SDGs in New York, the UK will resist attempts survey in the colleges of Cambridge showed that 77% to weaken the draft standalone goal on gender of students there had experienced sexual harassment equality? Does she share the view that it is vital that it and violence. Is it not time to have a consistent approach should include strong language on women’s rights and to educating boys and girls in what the law is and what be underpinned by progressive targets that tackle is acceptable behaviour, and to try to combat sexual discriminatory social norms? violence against women and girls in this country?

Baroness Northover: I fully agree. Lord Bates: My noble friend is absolutely right in that regard. Of course, that is the purpose of the Baroness Manzoor (LD): My Lords, the law is unequally website, “This is Abuse”, which is targeted at young applied in Bahrain between Sunni women and Shia people. It has been viewed by some 2 million young women in areas such as inheritance, divorce, child people. That is the purpose behind the new campaign, What is Consent? custody and domestic disputes. What are the Government , which sets out what is involved: the doing to address these issues with the Bahraini capacity to consent, the freedom to consent and the Government, and if they have had any discussions, steps taken to obtain consent, which must be present what are the timescales for addressing these terrible in all relations of a sexual nature. The noble Baroness injustices and inequalities? is also absolutely right that more needs to be done. Baroness Smith of Basildon (Lab): My Lords, part Baroness Northover: There is inequality for women of the problem is that young girls who are manipulated everywhere. The Foreign Office, as part of its work and sexually abused have been groomed to believe particularly on International Women’s Day, is engaging that they are in a consensual relationship. While there with those countries where these problems are particularly can be legal arguments about what consent is when a acute. In the case of Bahrain, the ambassador is case gets to court, surely it is even more important to holding a round table with a number of Bahraini protect those young girls before any such abuse takes women from all walks of life to discuss these issues. place. Let me press the Government again: given that the value of sex and relationship education is widely Lord Howell of Guildford (Con): My Lords— understood and known to be effective, why are the Government refusing to ensure that it is compulsory in all schools? Noble Lords: Eight minutes. Lord Bates: I think that best practice is happening in most schools. It is certainly compulsory in all state Sexual Violence against Girls and Women schools. There was a case related to certain freedoms Question being given to academies, which covered this. However, the expectation is not that academies can somehow 11.15 am disregard this, but that they will use their freedom to improve on the minimum standards for the teaching Asked by Baroness Hussein-Ece of sex and relationship education that were set out by the Secretary of State in 2001. To ask Her Majesty’s Government what steps they are taking to foster greater public understanding Baroness Howarth of Breckland (CB): My Lords, about the prevention of sexual violence against what are the Government doing to develop programmes girls and women in the light of the publication of for parents? One issue I have come across in my work the What is Consent? toolkit by the Crown Prosecution in this area is that parents are very confused about Service. what their children can and cannot do and what kind of advice they themselves should be giving. Do the The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Home Government want, or does the Minister know of any, Office (Lord Bates) (Con): My Lords, the new support programmes from which parents can get help consent guidance from the Crown Prosecution Service and education in this area? supports the Government’s aims that every report of rape be taken seriously, every investigation conducted Lord Bates: There is a range of helplines and support professionally and every victim given access to the services, as well as rape help centres, but I totally support they need. It complements the Home Office’s accept that the role for parents is very strong and teenage relationship abuse and prevention campaign, profound and that parents need to be aware. As the 335 Sexual Violence[5 MARCH 2015] Women in Sport 336 noble Baroness said earlier, much of this grooming Women in Sport takes place online. That is something that parents Question need to be especially vigilant about, not just in the context of rape but of all kinds of child sexual exploitation. 11.22 am Lord Avebury (LD): My Lords, will my noble friend Asked by Baroness Parminter accept on behalf of the Government the recommendation made by two all-party groups on refugees and migration, To ask Her Majesty’s Government what measures under the chairmanship of Sarah Teather MP, that they are taking to encourage women to participate women who are victims of rape and sexual violence in sports on a professional basis. should not be held in immigration detention? Lord Gardiner of Kimble (Con): My Lords, the Lord Bates: The Home Secretary is looking at very Minister for Sport has made the participation of women closely at that very important report, which came out in sport one of her top priorities, along with raising its just two days ago, particularly in the context of the profile. Last year the Government hosted their first very disturbing allegations made about Yarl’s Wood. national women’s sport conference, where Sport England We take that very seriously and will be responding. launched the campaign This Girl Can. We wish to inspire women at all levels of ability and we seek Baroness Farrington of Ribbleton (Lab): My Lords, increased media coverage, sponsorship and participation will the Minister undertake to talk to his noble friend at professional level. Lord Nash about what I believe is a widespread concern that this is treated as a freedom in some schools? Does he not agree that the time has come to ensure that all Baroness Parminter (LD): I thank my noble friend girls are protected and all boys receive the proper for that reply and celebrate the fact that the Royal and education to help prevent violence? Ancient Golf Club and Royal St George’s Golf Club have at last opened their doors to women members. Lord Bates: That is something that should be done. What are the Government doing to encourage more Of course, the quality of that education is monitored participation in women’s golf so that we can have by Ofsted as well. It is something that should happen more 18 year-old women like Charley Hull competing in all schools. It is a crucial part of this, and schools, for the world’s biggest prizes in women’s golf? along with parents and the wider community, have a vital role to play in making sure that young boys in Lord Gardiner of Kimble: My Lords, at grass-roots particular are educated about the limits and the need level Sport England is investing £13 million in the to obtain consent. England Golf Partnership to get more people playing golf. The partnership has also launched specific Lord Elystan-Morgan (CB): My Lords, perhaps I programmes to attract new participants, such as Get might raise a matter that is, in many respects, a background into golf, and the reports are that 45% of participants to this Question. Will the Minister tell the House, with in the starter programme are women. There has just regard to the last available period for which data are been a BBC documentary about Charley Hull, the kept, first, what percentage of complaints of rape extraordinary golf player. actually led to trial in court and, secondly, what percentage of those trials ended in conviction? Baroness Grey-Thompson (CB): My Lords, it is Lord Bates: I am very happy to set those details out. wonderful to see in the modern era of sport that Up to September 2014, there were 72,977 recorded governing bodies such as cricket’s have finally issued criminal offences. The number of rape prosecutions real contracts to women, but in other sports such as was 3,891 in the same period. There is a lot of detail football there is huge disparity between the men’s and behind that. I do not have the time to go into it at this the women’s game. We only have to see the recent point but I am happy to write to the noble Lord. England v Germany match at Wembley to see that the public embrace women’s football. I pay tribute to the tireless work of Kelly Simmons at the FA. In the USA Lord Elton (Con): My Lords, several of your Lordships some of this inequality has been tackled by the Title IX have drawn attention to the importance of early education legislation. Is it not time that we had our own version in sex. Will my noble friend tell us what the arrangements in Britain? are for the initial training of teachers in this subject, how consensus on what is appropriate at different ages is identified, and what INSET—in-service training—is Lord Gardiner of Kimble: My Lords, first I think also available in this? that the noble Baroness has been an extraordinary inspiration for sport and women in sport. The Americans Lord Bates: The guidance issued by the Secretary of have had that experience in the higher education sector. State for Education sets out that age-appropriate education In this country, participation rates for men and women must be provided to young people. There are steps that in higher education are 61% and 53% respectively, could be taken to improve on that. There are a lot of so the gap is less than in other sectors. We wish to examples of best practice around the country, which concentrate our efforts on ensuring that a much broader schools have to draw on. cross-section is able to enjoy sport. 337 Women in Sport[LORDS] Lake District National Park Authority 338

Baroness Nye (Lab): Following on from the noble Baroness Seccombe (Con): My Lords, does my noble Baroness’s previous question, I am sure that the whole friend agree with me that it is probably the right day to House will join me in wishing the England football congratulate the England women’s cricket team? It is team well as they prepare for the World Cup in Canada probably best not to mention the men’s cricket team, in July. However, have the Government made any save only to wish them well on Monday. representations to FIFA about the fact that they will play on artificial pitches? That would never be contemplated Lord Gardiner of Kimble: My Lords, I certainly for their male counterparts. In this instance, it is not a wish them extremely well. The women’s cricket team case of wanting a level playing field, but the same are currently ranked second; they won the last two playing field. Ashes, so they are a great team. Increasing sponsorship is also an important part of how we raise the profile of Lord Gardiner of Kimble: My Lords, I will certainly women’s sport. Kia Motors has sponsored women’s take up the point. I am not aware of the different cricket, which is an example of what we need to do. playing pitches. I think grass is a very good surface to Newton Investment Management is going to sponsor play on. I wish the football team extremely well. They the women’s boat race. Some very important innovations are currently ranked sixth in the world. I hope that are coming forward. they win. Lord Storey (LD): My noble friend the Minister Lord Howell of Guildford (Con): Will my noble will know that the English women’s football team beat friend bear in mind that the Commonwealth Games Finland 3-1 last night, yet if you look at the sports gives enormous encouragement worldwide to the full pages of our national newspapers, you will find no participation of women professionally in all sports? mention of it in the Times, the Telegraph, the Mail, the Of course, that is a reflection of the wider fact that the Express or the Mirror. There was a tiny piece in the Commonwealth, as a total system covering almost a Guardian and a tiny piece in the Independent.Ifyou third of humankind, places absolute gender equality look at the sports pages on a daily basis, hardly ever at the very top of its priorities. will you find a mention of women’s sport. For women to be empowered in sport, they need to have coverage. Will the Minister agree perhaps either to write to or Lord Gardiner of Kimble: My Lords, I thoroughly meet our newspaper editors to suggest that they cover endorse that. The Commonwealth Games is a great women’s sports? celebration of countries and sport. Interestingly, at the last Winter Olympics, 58% of medallists were women, and 66% of the Sochi Paralympic medallists Lord Gardiner of Kimble: My noble friend makes a were women. I have not got the figures for the very important point. Improving the media profile of Commonwealth Games, but I hope that they were women’s sports is one of the five key goals of the equally encouraging. Women and Sport Advisory Board, set up by the Government. The broadcasting companies—BT Sport, BBC Sport and Sky Sport—are getting much better, Lord Hunt of Kings Heath (Lab): My Lords, will but I certainly think that the broadsheet newspapers the Minister join me in congratulating the Birmingham need to up their game. City Ladies professional football team on their great exploits, in contrast, perhaps, to the men’s team? Coming back to my noble friend’s comments about a level Lake District National Park Authority playing field, the Minister will note that the Premier Question League has concluded an extraordinarily lucrative agreement with the TV companies for the next period of agreement. The Premier League has shown great 11.30 am reluctance in, shall we say, helping other parts of Asked by The Earl of Clancarty football from that largesse. Would he meet the Premier League to encourage it to give more resources to To ask Her Majesty’s Government what is their women’s professional teams? response to the intention of the Lake District National Park Authority to sell areas of land in the Lake District. Lord Gardiner of Kimble: My Lords, I would be very pleased to arrange such a meeting. But it is important to say that the Chancellor announced a The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department new £50 million package of government money for for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (Lord De improvements in grass-roots football. That will include, Mauley) (Con): My Lords, national park authorities for instance, further money for new coach educators, are independent bodies and, as part of their responsibilities which will be important for women. As part of what to review their services and assets, it is right that they the government investment is doing, Premier League consider the sale of land, enabling the proceeds to be and Football League clubs are also sharing an ambition reinvested to enhance the national park. The Lake for about £200 million of total funding. But I do District National Park Authority owns less than 4% of think that, across a range of subjects, professional land within the national park. As with all our national football could do a lot better for women and some parks, who owns the land is not the determining factor spectators. in its beauty or value to the public. 339 Lake District National Park Authority[5 MARCH 2015] Lake District National Park Authority 340

The Earl of Clancarty (CB): My Lords, Stickle should be consultation of a sufficient length of time to Tarn, Coniston Water, the River Derwent. Are we allow community groups—such as the Langdale Valley really selling off treasured public spaces—some of the Association, which wants to register Stickle Tarn as a most beautiful land in Britain—to fund the building community asset—to be consulted. This takes time. of visitors’ centres? Will not the Government intervene Will the Minister have words with the national park to stop this? authority to ask it to withdraw these proposals for the moment, to give time for public consultation and for Lord De Mauley: As the noble Earl knows, the the Langdale Valley Association to prepare its bid? Government have no powers to direct national park authorities to dispose or not to dispose of a particular piece of land. Furthermore, it would not be right to Lord De Mauley: My Lords, I know that my noble intervene, because they must be allowed—and, indeed, friend is intimately involved in these matters. I assure encouraged—to take responsibility for their own affairs. him that I have obtained confirmation from the Lake To put it in context, the eight sites offered for sale total District National Park Authority that it recognises the 59 hectares, equivalent to 0.6% of the Lake District legitimate interests of stakeholders. It has consulted National Park Authority’s land holdings. and continues to consult widely in a number of ways ahead of any final decisions. That includes liaison with parish councils, public notices advertising its Lord Cormack (Con): My Lords— intention to invite offers for some of the properties, direct consultation with a number of neighbouring Lord Dubs (Lab): My Lords, it is the turn of this landowners and so on. side; I live there. Is it not shocking that parts of the national park—one of the most beautiful national parks—have to be sold off as a result of government Lord Campbell-Savours (Lab): My Lords, I have cuts? Is there not a problem that, in a further sale of spent most of my life living in the Lake District the land, the Lake District planning people might well National Park, which formed the greater part of my give a more relaxed permission in order to get half the former constituency. Can we have an assurance that money? Is it not rather unhappy that we are doing this there will be no interference at all with existing rights at all? Surely we should adamantly say that the Lake of way? What is the position on the maintenance of District is not for sale to the highest bidder. those rights of way and bridleways which the national park carried out previously? Can we be assured that the new private owners will maintain them to the Lord De Mauley: I agree with much of the sentiment previous standards? behind the noble Lord’s point, but the national park has assured me that this is not about cuts. It routinely reviews its assets and makes disposals where appropriate Lord De Mauley: I can absolutely assure the noble so that the proceeds can be reinvested into the acquisition, Lord that there will be no lessening of rights of way. improvement or maintenance of other properties. It is Indeed, in one instance, there will be an improvement worth saying that between 2007 and 2010—three years in rights of way as a result of these sales. during which the noble Lord’s party was in government—it made sales totalling £1.9 million. In the five years from then, sales have totalled £1.8 million. Baroness Royall of Blaisdon (Lab): My Lords, I find this whole process and practice deeply shocking. I was Lord Cormack: My Lords, I am sure that we all not aware until quite recently that this could be done. wish the noble Lord, Lord Dubs, many more happy As has been said, the Lake District is a glorious part years in one of the most glorious parts of England. of our country. These public spaces are for all the However, is not what really matters here the integrity people of our country. I understand that the Lake of the landscape and that there are no further incursions District National Park has cash-flow problems but into its tranquillity? Can my noble friend assure us I baulk at the idea that this land can be sold, that whatever transactions take place, both the integrity notwithstanding what has happened in the past. What of the landscape and its tranquillity will be preserved? would happen in the case of this land being sold, then resold at a profit? Would the Lake District National Park get any of the benefit? Secondly, I again ask the Lord De Mauley: Yes, my Lords, I absolutely agree noble Lord for an assurance to this House that this with my noble friend. I can confirm that none of the plan will not—indeed, cannot—lead to any change in protections afforded to the land by virtue of being in a the planning restrictions on the land. Such a special national park is affected by a sale. area must be protected. Lord Greaves (LD): My Lords, there has not been a very satisfactory process here. The national park authority Lord De Mauley: I can assure the noble Baroness made the decision to sell these pieces of land in secret. on her latter point that there will be no change to the People discovered it only when an advertisement appeared planning restrictions on that land. On her former in the Westmoreland Gazette, giving them precisely point, I hope that noble Lords heard what I said one month to make bids. Surely there should be public earlier. The Government have no powers to intervene debate about which of the 168 pieces of land owned over disposal or otherwise of land. It is not for central by the national park authority should be sold if it has government to know about retained rights over the to sell any. Once it decides to put some forward, there land going forward. 341 Women: Economic Empowerment[LORDS] Women: Economic Empowerment 342

Women: Economic Empowerment full-time workers and overall, the gender pay gap is at Motion to Take Note its lowest point in history. All around the UK, women are breaking new ground and succeeding in careers previous generations could only dream about. 11.37 am There is a consensus in the country which certainly Moved by Baroness Jolly was not there when I was growing up; and if you That this House takes note of women’s economic should ask any number of men and women whether empowerment and the progress in achieving it that they believe that their daughters should have the same has been made in the United Kingdom and opportunities as their sons, the resounding answer you internationally. would get is “of course”. These parents will be the gender equality ambassadors for a whole new generation of girls and their impact should be seen right across Baroness Jolly (LD): My Lords, it is a pleasure to the economy. Our challenge today is that, in spite of address the House today in celebration of International the progress I have talked about, this consensus is still Women’s Day. My noble friend Lady Garden and I yet to be fully grounded in the running and practices started the day at a reception for British businesswomen of our economy and places of work. As a result, many at the British Library. The list of speakers today is women continue to face barriers at every stage and at really impressive, with a fine record in women’s rights all levels of their economic life—barriers around pay, and achievement over the years, following the record promotion, choice, and work-life balance. of many Members of this House—too many to mention —who have campaigned hard and achieved so much It is particularly fitting that we are having this for the rights of women. debate as the 59th UN Commission on the Status of Women is about to get underway in New York and Today we should remember two noble Lords who as we mark the 20th anniversary of the Beijing died over the past year. They both, in their time and in Platform for Action. Written in 1995 at the historic their fields, played a key role in women’s rights. Baroness UN Fourth World Conference on Women, it was Miller of Hendon was a stalwart member of this signed by 189 Governments from across the world, all House who received an honour for her services to pledging to end gender inequality across 15 different women’s rights. She was an entrepreneur and a campaigner areas, including economic empowerment. While we for more women MPs. Baroness Platt of Writtle was a have much to celebrate, we cannot ignore the fact that trailblazing aviation engineer. I read that when she there is not one country in the world that can say that completed her engineering studies at Cambridge in it has achieved this ambition. It is a reminder of how 1943, women did not receive the same honours as their pertinent it is that we push for real change so that we male counterparts. As such, she was not awarded a do not find ourselves uttering that infamous phrase degree, only a “title of degree”. I am in no doubt that “We’ve made progress, but” in 20 years to come. it was this injustice that propelled the noble Baroness to dedicate her life to the advancement of women in We in Government remain more focused on this science and technology careers. task and the progress we have made over the past five These two women fought in the hope that their years gives us a strong platform to work from. We work could be the spark for the aspirations of women know that if we are to fulfil our ambition of creating and girls today and future generations. It is because of an economy that creates opportunities for everyone, women like them that the journey of gender equality then we need fundamentally to rebalance it. It means a in this country has ultimately been one of progress. paradigm shift around how men and women operate Nowhere is this journey of progress more evident than their lives, how businesses invest and how workplaces in the theme of today’s debate—women’s economic operate. Above all, it means focusing our efforts not empowerment, at home and abroad. just on professional women and the few near the top, but to make sure we give all women, regardless of their The breakthroughs that we have achieved since age, background or stage they are at in their career, International Women’s Day first came into being over the opportunities to pursue their own choices and a century ago are nothing short of remarkable, but happiness in life. the coalition has also made quite a few significant breakthroughs in recent years as well. On coming into Our ambition starts with sweeping away the archaic office five years ago, one of the first commitments that rules and assumptions that can make it near impossible we made as a Government was to put women at the for women to balance work and family life. Last year, heart of our economic recovery and long-term plan we extended the right to request flexible working to all for growth. We made this our priority because promoting employees and next month will see the introduction of equality of opportunity and equal treatment is not shared parental leave so mothers and fathers can just the right thing to do—it is the key to promoting decide for themselves how to balance their family and growth. Five years later, our plan is working. Today work life. But even with these changes, we know that there are more women in work than ever before. There we will still continue to see women drop from the are more women running their own businesses than labour market unless we do more to make work pay. ever before. There are record numbers of women at So we are expanding the amount of free childcare higher levels of management. Indeed, thanks to the available to make it easier for people to take time off tremendous work of my noble friend Lord Davies, for to look after their babies and then return to work. the first time in the history of our country we have a From next month, we are investing an extra £750 million woman on every single FTSE 100 board. On top of in tax-free childcare worth up to £2,000 per year for this, the latest ONS statistics show that, for both each child. This is in addition to our offer of 15 hours 343 Women: Economic Empowerment[5 MARCH 2015] Women: Economic Empowerment 344 a week of free early years education for every three of work. We are working hard to promote greater pay and four year-old as well as for two year-olds in those transparency and introducing measures and guidance families most feeling the squeeze. This comes on top to help companies to identify and tackle their own pay of a raft of measures, such as raising the personal gaps. For example, through our Think, Act, Report allowance threshold and increasing the national minimum initiative, we are encouraging firms actively to look at wage to its highest ever rate, to ensure that women on how their female employees are faring, take action to low and middle incomes can keep more of the money address any issues and report publicly on their progress. that they earn. More than 270 companies have signed up so far, including major employers such as BT, Tesco, Specsavers, Women should not have to choose between their Unilever and BAE Systems. That means that more job and their families, and all these changes will help than 2.5 million employees are working in organisations them to find a balance that works for them. Supporting signed up to Think, Act, Report. In December we more women to set up their businesses is another way announced a range of additional measures to ensure in which we can help them to achieve greater flexibility that we keep up this momentum. These include free between work and family life. We are stepping up our pay analysis software and new simplified guidance efforts to invest record amounts in support and training that will shortly be available to employers to make for female business mentors and to encourage greater calculating their gender pay gap easier and quicker. female take-up of the Business Bank’s Start Up Loans There is also £2 million of funding towards helping programme. We also want to make sure that starting a women move from low-paid, low-skill work to higher-paid, business is an option for everyone, so we have introduced higher-skill work. a new enterprise allowance, offering expert business mentoring and financial support to people living on These are just some of the measures we are taking benefits. Our message is simple: if you have drive, across Government to improve the prospects of women determination and a good idea, we will do everything and girls at every level and in every field. But that we can to help you get that idea off the ground. work does not begin and end at home. We know how important it is that we use the UK’s position as a We are also determined to tackle the ongoing injustice leader in development to improve the lives of women of gender pay and doing all that we can to reduce the and girls across the globe as well. I recently read that a pay gap further and faster. It is, however, a complex girl in South Sudan is more likely to die in childbirth problem to solve. It is not as simple as demanding that than to complete primary school. No other fact could women be paid the same as men for equal work. so eloquently underline the responsibility that we have Thankfully, the Equal Pay Act 1975 means that cases to take action, but, as well as there being a strong of outright discriminatory practices are illegal and few moral imperative, experience has shown time and again and far between. When they happen, we have been that in development there are few better options than very clear that these employers should be dealt with investing in women. through the full force of the law. Reforms we brought in last year will now mean that companies found guilty We know that in the Ivory Coast alone an increase of pay discrimination will be required to produce pay of just $10 in women’s income achieves the same audits, to give greater confidence that such discrimination nutritional and health outcomes for children as an will not happen again. increase of $110 in men’s income. That is exactly why we have put girls and women at the centre of our However, the causes of the gender pay gap are development efforts and our engagement with the multiple and far more deeply embedded in our culture world. Through the Girls’ Education Challenge Fund, and in our labour market for them to be solved by we have raised £355 million with the aim of getting up changing laws alone. A major factor can be explained to a million girls into school in some of the most by career choices, which remain strongly gender-biased. difficult parts of the world. We have provided nearly More women than men choose to work in the caring 27 million women with access to financial services, professions of social work, nursing and teaching, which such as savings, credit and insurance. historically have had lower rates of pay. This gender bias starts early. A 2013 report showed that half of We are helping more women find work through state coeducational schools did not see a single girl skills and leadership training and business development. progress to A-level physics. That is scandalous. That is For example, our Zardozi project in Afghanistan— why we are pouring our efforts into working with “zardozi” means “embroidery”—has created jobs for schools and parents to open up young women’s eyes to 6,500 women in the handicraft and textile sector and a much wider range of careers—hence our support for supported them to set up their own businesses and to fantastic schemes such as the Your Life campaign to become entrepreneurs. I could go on providing hundreds encourage more girls to study subjects in traditionally more examples and statistics but I am sure your Lordships male-dominated and higher-paid areas like science have your own to bring to the debate. You may, and engineering. however, be asking yourselves, “What does all this actually mean for the lives of women and girls?” so I Of course, that cultural change we are looking for will end by giving examples of two exceptional women in the classroom also needs to happen in our places of our programmes have supported. work. Many companies are doing fantastic work to support their female employees, but the fact remains The first is a young girl, Immaculate, from Uganda that this kind of corporate support is still not translating who was forced to leave school after her father died. into the wholesale shift in attitudes that we need. Determined not to give up, she heard about one of our Institutional discrimination, the old boys’ club and programmes and walked for three days in a bid to win unconscious bias are still in full swing in many places a scholarship to go back to school. Her efforts paid off 345 Women: Economic Empowerment[LORDS] Women: Economic Empowerment 346

[BARONESS JOLLY] living in crack houses, and some unfortunately engage and she ended up winning that support to return to in prostitution. St Mungo’s, the homeless charity, feels education. A few years later, she is now a highly that unless urgent action is taken now, the numbers articulate woman determined to become a teacher and are likely to increase, and too many women will not to put back into her society what she herself had been get the right help to escape homelessness for good—a able to draw from. The second is a 28 year-old woman, situation not assisted by the cuts to public services, Angelique, from Rwanda. Like most Rwandans, she restrictions on welfare, rising housing costs, or a lack makes her living from cultivating land, but she has less of housing supply. than a quarter of a hectare of farmland to support her Women’s homelessness can occur after prolonged family of three. However, thanks to UK support, she experience of trauma, including physical, sexual and found employment and opened her first savings account. emotional abuse. It can follow a cycle of mental health With her first salary, she bought school uniforms for and substance use, and myriad other problems. Half her children, and with her second and third salaries have experienced domestic violence, 70% have mental she bought a goat so that her children would not have health needs, and 27% have a combination of mental to go hungry again, and she is now planning to use her and physical health problems and problems with substance savings to build a house for her family. These women misuse. are symbols of everything we are trying to achieve and A classic example comes in evidence from a St Mungo’s our reason for doing more. client, who I will call Ann. She said: “I became homeless This House has been at the forefront of the journey because I got pregnant at 14, mum threw me out and that women’s rights has taken in this country and after that I got married. My husband raped me and beat across the world, and we look to noble Lords to help me up. So I ran to London to escape him and have us continue that journey. been on the streets ever since”. She fled and has been on the streets because her local refuge had to close 11.54 am down through lack of funding. No doubt we will hear Baroness Gould of Potternewton (Lab): My Lords, I from the Minister that £10 million has been put into fully agree with so many of the principles that the refuges for the next two years. The problem for Ann Minister has talked about. Of course, we have all been and her refuge is that the money comes far too late. fighting, arguing and campaigning for women’s equality In my own area of Brighton and Hove, evidence for so many years, but I want to talk not about the from the Brighton Women’s Centre—I declare an interest women she has talked about but about those who have as a patron—shows that almost half of its clients are really suffered because of the Government’s recession mothers, and of those, 67% have had their children and austerity programme. In spite of the Minister’s taken into care or adopted. So not only are they words, that programme has seen a widening of the grieving for their lost children, but in many cases they gender pay gap in the UK, which has gone down to are also grieving for their own lost childhood. Much 26th in the world from 13th, according to the World of the complexity of homeless women’s needs is rooted Economic Forum gender gap analysis, perhaps because in histories of violence and abuse stemming from of the increase in the cost of childcare, which interestingly childhood. These problems are intergenerational. We points to the future—over the past five years the cost have to make sure, and work has to be done to make of childcare has gone up enormously, and many women sure, that they are not passed on to the next generation. are having to give up work because they cannot afford So much hurt could be prevented by ensuring that it—discrimination because of pregnancy, and perhaps the troubled families programme addresses the risk the attack on access to justice, which undermines the factors that increase the likelihood of girls becoming rights that have underpinned much of women’s progress homeless in adulthood. Research by Crisis found that in the workplace over many years. many of those homeless women are marginalised in I want to mention in particular a group of women labour markets, and there are examples of women we never talk about, or very rarely talk about: women losing their jobs once they have no registered place of who, for many reasons beyond their control, find abode. None of the women Crisis interviewed were in themselves vulnerable and homeless—women who have full-time employment, and only 3% were working part been overlooked for far too long, who have become time. But its research goes on to show that the majority marginalised people in society, not from choice but of these women wanted to work; they wanted a job. because of circumstance, and who find themselves in The potential for meaningful occupation, training and a downward spiral of chaos and exclusion, and get employment to boost self-esteem and help recovery little help. from homelessness cannot be underestimated. Homelessness is a growing problem in the UK. Making matters worse for many of these women is Government figures show that the number of people the fact that they experience stigma and shame sleeping rough has risen by 55% since 2012. Perhaps because they are homeless and are judged by societal we could find out why that is the situation. There are expectations of women to be good mothers and currently over 10,000 women in homeless services, and maintaining good homes. A perceived failure to live many thousands more who are hidden homeless and up to those expectations and not having a job and not are on the streets, at risk. Homeless women who are being part of society can be significant barriers to roofless and with few belongings will not often show recovery. Unfortunately, the histories of far too many up in a headcount of rough sleepers. The hidden of these women are full of missed opportunities for homeless may be sofa-surfing, staying with family or getting the right help at the right time due to insufficient friends, or trapped in abusive relationships because co-ordination and inappropriate and erratic interventions they have nowhere else to go. Others may be squatting, that leave needs unaddressed and recovery unachieved. 347 Women: Economic Empowerment[5 MARCH 2015] Women: Economic Empowerment 348

The building of trust and relationships is at the “There is no tool for development more effective than the heart of creating a change to empower these women to empowerment of women”. maintain control over important decisions. However, This rings true in so many parts of society but is both national and local government too often fail to particularly apt for today’s debate. Many studies on understand this. To achieve that trust there has to be a economic development have found what Annan put so co-ordinated response across the various departments succinctly to be the truth—namely, where women succeed that respond to the relevant challenges, be they drugs, and are given economic opportunity, society succeeds. alcohol, domestic violence, mental health services Today, I want to recognise how far women have come, or children’s and adult services. This interrelated but discuss equally how far we have to go. challenge means that it is difficult for women to As my noble friend Lady Jolly said, the world progress in one area without the others being addressed. truly has changed for women, especially working Co-commissioning across a local authority is key to women, even within the past few years. The better co-ordination and the provision of services that PricewaterhouseCoopers 2015 Female Millennial report can have a positive impact on these women’s lives. notes that women today are more educated than ever Responding to women with vulnerabilities can, if it is before: they earn more bachelor’s degrees and tertiary done in this way, make real financial savings. degrees than men. They are more confident than ever Commissioners should invest in cost-benefit analysis before, too: just under half of all women beginning of services to prevent or resolve homelessness. They their careers believe that they can rise to the top with should look at the savings that can be made by recognising their employers. They are more able to choose from a women’s organisations as partners in meeting local wide range of opportunities than their predecessors. needs and should engage and involve them from the However, while we should celebrate their successes, it very beginning in the commissioning process and early is important to hold them under scrutiny. interventions for families in need. Organisations that Companies today are more aware and place a higher deliver a range of social and economic benefits over importance on recruiting women than they did even the short and long term to vulnerable and marginalised just a few years ago. Another international study women and girls, such as my local women’s centre, conducted by PwC found that 64% of CEOs have and have proved that every pound they invest in support utilise strategies to increase diversity and inclusiveness and care saves more than three and a half times that in their businesses, and a further 13% plan to form amount in real terms. We ought to spend much more such a strategy. This is a significant improvement on a on the whole question of prevention. similar survey conducted four years ago, in which only In conclusion, holistic, gender-sensitive support needs 1/10th of CEOs voiced plans to change their companies’ to be provided, staff need to be better trained to recruitment and retention policies to increase women’s enable them to provide gendered responses and we presence in their companies. need to engage in innovative approaches, partnership Yet, we are not seeing results from these initiatives. working, multi-agency case management and cross- Improvement to the wage gap has been stagnant across boundary initiatives working with peer support groups OECD countries, and although more women than to address past and current trauma by providing access ever before serve as CEOs of Fortune 500 companies, to counselling in a safe and secure environment. But they still stand as just 4.8% among the body of their most of all there has to be preventive support in peers. Women continue to face difficulty in advancing advising women on how to avoid homelessness, as I their careers. In a separate international study of said. The longer a woman sleeps rough, the worse her “millennial working women”, it was found that nearly problems become and the more costly it becomes to three-quarters of women feel that companies are “all help her off the streets and to make her life worth talk” when it comes to equality. They felt that although while so that she can contribute to the economy of this their companies speak about diversity and inclusion, country. access to opportunities is not yet equal for women. More than that, it was found that women grow increasingly 12.03 pm discouraged about their chances of promotion or of furthering their careers as they progress in them. The Baroness Brinton (LD): My Lords, I declare my percentage of women who believe they are capable of interests as a trustee of UNICEF UK and a patron of rising to a senior level with their current employer falls Christian Blind Mission. by 10 points in just a seven-year period. When the level Five years of coalition government has meant that of talent of the women in today’s economic market is 2.3 million women overseas have been helped to get so high—higher than ever before—these statistics are jobs and more than 5 million girls have been helped to disappointing, to say the least. I do not mention this attend school. As we know, education levels are a key to temper excitement over the gains that women have indicator of the ability to obtain self-sustaining jobs made in economic empowerment, but merely to insist and careers. Those statistics show our commitment to that we can and must do better. and responsibility for the most vulnerable women and I turn now to the economic advancement of women girls in the world. It is not by chance that we have in much different circumstances—women who are committed 0.7% of GDP to international development. not trying to advance professional careers but simply That is part of our achievement in this area and it is trying to survive and support themselves and their important that it continues. families. For the poorest women in the world, economic I shall focus my speech on the subject of women’s empowerment is often just a dream. Up to 45% of position in the international economy. Kofi Annan, women living in the poorest parts of the world have the former secretary-general of the UN, said: absolutely no say in how their household income is 349 Women: Economic Empowerment[LORDS] Women: Economic Empowerment 350

[BARONESS BRINTON] She later reflected: spent, even when it includes their own income. In “I was feeling like I’m not a human being. I felt frustrated and Bangladesh—a country in which almost half the lonely. But when I received the tricycle it was better. I decided to population survives on $1.25 a day, and in which the go into trading. I used the small capital I had and bought some disparity of treatment and status between men and groundnuts, biscuits, and I sell pure water. I will use the profit and women is astounding—situations like this are not buy the things again I had. So I think this one is very good”. uncommon. Abena has now become a disabled women’s organiser However, we should note the groups of organisations for the Disabled Society in Builsa South district, her that are trying to combat this—the microfinance service area of Ghana, and works to inspire and encourage providers, in particular the Grameen Bank, which is a other disabled women to take on work and lead their microfinance titan and the originator of the micro- lives normally. Abena’s case so aptly shows us how, financing scheme. Grameen began its operations in with a little bit of empowerment, a woman’s life can Bangladesh just over 30 years ago and exists because, improve drastically. in the words of its founder, Muhammad Yunus, John Stuart Mill, in a letter to Charles Eliot Norton “the financial system … only serves the top one-third of the in 1869, said: world; two-thirds are left out”. “The most important thing women have to do is to stir up the Grameen holds particular significance in our debate zeal of women themselves”. today, as nearly all of its 8.4 million clients are women, Abena is testimony to that. and women make up the majority of the bank’s management board. Through its microfinancing program, 12.12 pm Grameen empowers women to start and sustain small businesses, to support themselves and their families. Baroness Greenfield (CB): My Lords, I commend The benefit of this is felt especially by widows, many the noble Baroness, Lady Jolly, on bringing attention of whom are left without resource or recourse after to this urgent and wide-ranging issue. As a research the passing of their spouse. scientist at Oxford University, and now founder and A recent study by the World Bank found that CEO of a biotech company, I focus on just one aspect: microfinance, especially microfinancing for women, is the importance of science for women’s economic beneficial in alleviating poverty and raising income empowerment in both private and public sectors. and education levels. With only a 10% increase in At a national level, graduates of both genders in the women’s borrowing, household spending and women’s so-called STEM subjects—science, technology, engineering participation in the labour force both improve—and and maths—are perhaps unsurprisingly on higher starting improve at higher rates than with a similar increase in salaries. However, there is a clear gender discrepancy. men’s borrowing. My hope is that the Grameen Bank Just over 10% of science-based business owners are continues on this path of achievement and sees similar women, compared to 33% for other types of businesses. success in Glasgow, where Grameen UK has opened Of the FTSE 100 companies in STEM sectors, 13% of its first branch. We need microfinancing projects for board directors are female, compared to 17% in non- women here in the UK too. science-based organisations, while fewer than one in The final group of women I would like to highlight 10 of STEM managers is female. today is women with disabilities, who face even greater When it comes to apprenticeships, the gender disparity hurdles when seeking economic empowerment. A recent is particularly stark. In IT and telecommunications survey by the World Health Organization found that, roughly 10% are taken by women, in engineering less across the 50 countries studied, only one-fifth of disabled than 4% and in construction just 1.4%. So in the private women were employed, compared with one-third of sector, whether it be founding a company, sitting on a women without disabilities. Many factors contribute board or taking up an apprenticeship, women are woefully to this disparity, but inaccessibility of workplaces, underrepresented in the very occupations that in general transportation to workplaces, discrimination and lack would be among the most economically empowering. of education are prime concerns. These factors are The public sector, too, presents problems. While amplified in developing countries, where disabled women’s sexist views may be suspected but hard to prove in the inaccess to accommodation for their disability can corporate world, overt prejudice against women has severely restrict their ability to receive education, hold been explicit in academia, sadly. Back in 1997 a report a job and participate in society. was published in the high-impact journal Nature from To illustrate these key points, I want to share with the Swedish Medical Research Council. This clearly noble Lords the story of Abena, a Ghanaian woman demonstrated a gender bias in peer review of grant living with a disability as a result of a childhood bout applications. Astonishingly, women with the highest of polio. She was supported by Christian Blind Mission: scores on their objectively measured publication record given a tricycle that transformed her life and the lives were judged subjectively to be about as good as a of those around her. CBM is the major disability low-average man. charity in the world. It runs this initiative aimed at Meanwhile, in January 2005, the then president of raising awareness of the link between disability and Harvard, Larry Summers, sparked uproar at an academic poverty. Abena says: conference when he said that “innate differences between “I realised that I could not walk. But I was so serious to go to men and women” might be one reason why fewer school because the children would go to school and come with their books and be reading. So I would crawl to school. Sometimes women succeed in science and maths. Sadly, the situation at the school the children were playing, jumping and I will be has not improved. In a paper published more recently, sitting down looking at them. I felt like I am alone. So I decided to in 2012 in the Proceedings of the National Academy of stop the school. I said, ‘This one is a waste.’”. Sciences, there was still an objectively demonstrable 351 Women: Economic Empowerment[5 MARCH 2015] Women: Economic Empowerment 352 bias, this time by the faculty, in both the biological and A big problem often is lack of awareness of current the physical sciences in terms of perceived competence initiatives that would help to combat these problems. and hireability of men over women. One example that includes both university and industry Another major hurdle for women in the academic is so-called WISE—Womenin to Science and Engineering science sector in particular is the lack of any type of —which aims to improve the gender balance in the structure in the first stages of their career. This will UK’s workforce, pushing the presence of female employees have devastating implications for having children. Typically, to 30% by 2020. WISE launched an ambitious, industry- a research scientist in a university will gain tenure, and led campaign in September 2014 to ensure that women hence any kind of job security and structure, only in science, technology, engineering and manufacturing when they are in their mid-30s. Those women wishing have the same opportunities to progress in their career to start a family, as might be expected, in their 20s are as their male counterparts. They invited a cross-section therefore faced with an unpalatable set of options. of businesses to tell them what had made the most difference to the retention and progression of women This is an important thing to grasp about science in their organisation. The result has been 10 recommended research: it is at this stage that a young post-doc steps, which, interestingly enough, all relate to mindset scientist, having become finally independent of their and the need for changing attitudes, particularly in the thesis supervisor, now needs to be maximally productive corporate world. in publishing their own all-important peer-reviewed papers, which will in turn serve as the gold standard Meanwhile, for women in science-based academia, for obtaining a lectureship. Therefore, the choices the Athena SWANprogramme addresses gender equality would be: first, have no children; secondly, defer having in UK universities. Athena SWAN has been developed children beyond your biological optimum; thirdly, have to encourage and recognise commitment to combating a child and give up research science altogether; or this underrepresentation and to advancing the careers fourthly, have a child and inevitably take time out just of women in science-based research and academia. as your male competitors are forging ahead with their In addition, Sheffield Hallam runs Women in Science, publications. Very rarely would a man have to make Engineering and Technology—WiSET—based within these choices. the Centre for Science Education. This aims to widen In addition, the situation is not helped by the the participation of underrepresented groups in science, meagre and often prohibitively expensive childcare technology, engineering, maths and the built environment. facilities available in universities. Moreover, a frequent It has developed and delivered a wide range of innovative complaint is that in the national audit of science projects, resources, schemes and activities for more research in universities—the so-called REF—the one-year than 10 years now, based on gender and occupational dispensation allocated against your track record for segregation at all levels of education and employment. having a child is just not enough. One rising star in her It works from a local to an international level and 30s, who has a toddler, summed it up: provides resources and runs events to encourage participation in science, as well as supporting those “Quite frankly it is exhausting and I am not surprised that already working in the STEM subjects. many women decide to quit science … I don’t feel anywhere near as competitive or productive as my peers can be or I used to be. It Sheffield Hallam was also one of the universities does make you wonder if it is all worthwhile”. involved at the start of Aurora. This is a national It is no surprise, then, that women are once again scheme aimed at developing future leaders for higher underrepresented in senior science university posts. I education. It was launched in 2013 as a women-only first flagged this issue back in 2002 when, as requested leadership development programme. Aurora aims to by the then Secretary of State for Trade and Industry, encourage a wide range of women in academic and I prepared a report on the recruitment and retention professional roles to think of themselves as leaders, to of women in science, published as the SET Fair report. develop leadership skills, and to help institutions maximise Looking back at data from that time to the most the potential of these women. These are innovative recent statistics published in 2012-13, there has been development processes for women up to senior lecturer some improvement. Across all STEM areas the percentage level or professional services equivalent. of female academic staff has increased from 35% in These are all really impressive initiatives that could 2002 to 42% some 10 years later. However, currently change the prospects for women in science since I just over 2% of all women academics are professors, published SET Fair in 2002. So why is there still a compared with almost three times as many males, so problem? Why is it not unusual to read in the press of the situation is still not good enough. a “female scientist” but not of a “female politician” or In general, women hoping to flourish in science-based “female lawyer”? It is as though the fact that a woman careers face a wide range of difficulties. In a survey of is a scientist is still unusual and worthy of note. more than 100 employees in the science-related public Perhaps that is at the heart of the problem. Clearly, for and private sectors, an astonishing 70% of women the real economic empowerment of women in science, stated that they had experienced personal and professional attitudes still need to change. I recommend the following barriers to entry and progression in science. These initiatives. barriers varied; while some that the survey flagged The excellent schemes just mentioned for helping cannot be readily addressed, such as the need to live in women in science need much more publicity and geographical proximity to their partner, others can, co-ordination. Presumably this could best be achieved including the lack of resources and funding—particularly by central government. Moreover, it is surely only the for childcare—institutional sexism and male-dominated Government who could bankroll a sufficiently well informal networks. resourced scheme for funding a truly realistic—not 353 Women: Economic Empowerment[LORDS] Women: Economic Empowerment 354

[BARONESS GREENFIELD] what they would assume about any man who was just a token effort—large number of ring-fenced taking over. If I had my time again, people might still fellowships and/or return-to-work allowances for pump- ask whether I had enough experience to do the job priming a career for those returning from childcare. but, if they did not feel the need to ask about my The same benefits currently available to women should gender, that would be progress. Let me be clear: we are be extended to men if they choose to share the burden on the path to progress. My mother’s generation did of maternity leave traditionally taken by women—for not even enjoy equal rights before the law. Some example, the allowances in REF and in fellowship professions and institutions were completely closed to applications. This might encourage male scientists to her. We now need to move on from changing the law to share parental responsibilities more, as they could be changing perceptions, attitudes and culture. less concerned about the long-term effect on their This debate is important for women but it should career, and we could move towards an equal future be important for everyone interested in the success of where both male and female scientists were competing our country. Women’s economic empowerment is about on equal grounds. success, not just for us but, more importantly, for UK Within the private sector, the L’Oreal Women in plc. It is about not missing out on half the talent pool Science awards have shown how awareness can be which is available to do the top jobs in this country, to raised of the achievements of individual women in lead our companies in the global economy and to start their research, but we now need other companies, new ones and grow them too. It is about diversity of particularly those in science and technology, as well as thinking, different perspectives on the same issues, smaller biotech companies, to take up the challenge of new skills, new mindsets and new ideas. We need to new initiatives for promoting the appeal of science to challenge existing ways of doing things, and empowering women as well as celebrating the benefits that they women is a great way of achieving this. A good board bring. For example, only last week I attended a gender- should have a variety of executives with different diversity summit in Luxembourg, organised by KPMG, backgrounds and bodies of expertise. A starting point where the advantages of female representation in the should be more women. Boards are there to challenge corporate world were stressed over and over by the the executives, to ask the difficult questions and to men attending as well as the women. It would be hold them to account. wonderful if science and tech-based companies were So how do we get half of our companies, our to organise similar events, and from them develop boards and even our Governments to be run by women? constructive programmes. First, I want to say that I am proud to be a Conservative Finally, none of these initiatives—neither those already Peer because I am proud of my party’s record on in train nor those just suggested—will have any effect women’s economic empowerment. Under the previous at all without one single, essential ingredient, which Government, there were 21 all-male boards in the has already been mentioned by the noble Baroness, FTSE 100. Now there are none. In 2010, women made Lady Jolly. That is the essential ingredient of a woman up only 12.5% of the members of corporate boards of who chooses to do a degree in science. Schoolgirls the FTSE 100; this figure is now 22.8% and I want to need to be aware not only of the thrill of doing see it increased further. I am not saying that boards research at the bench but of the wide variety of career with no women should be made to appoint some on options that will open up to them with a science the spot, but they should at least be made to answer background, even beyond the lab bench, such as patent why they do not have any. law, media, politics and teaching. What a shame it I am also pleased to say that there is a record would be if they were deterred from such exciting number of women in work. Our long-term economic prospects by the perception—indeed the reality—that plan has helped to increase the number of women a major obstacle to realising their true potential in in work to record highs—with 14.4 million now in science was their gender. employment, an increase of 796,000 since 2010. As an active business mentor and as this party’s Small Business 12.24 pm Ambassador, I am pleased that there are also more Baroness Brady (Con): My Lords, I welcome the women-led businesses than ever before. opportunity to make a contribution to this debate On our journey into the world of work, women and regarding the significant role that women’s economic their employers need to know that any career door can empowerment has both nationally and internationally. be open to them, as they start to move away from Women’s economic empowerment is often talked about thinking of certain industries as male-oriented. I know in terms of quotas or targets, but this is the language how necessary this is, coming from a background in of charity, of welfare and of equality for equality’s football. That is why I am pleased that we are increasing sake. As someone who did not need a quota or a target the number of women who take up careers in science, to get on in the business world, I can assure the House technology, engineering and maths. The “Your Life” that it is not, and should not be, about those things. campaign is working with businesses to support more When I became the CEO of Birmingham City women in these industries—for example, Airbus is Football Club, people thought it was tokenistic, that I committed to recruiting 25% women engineers. We are was window dressing and that hiring a woman was a also providing a £10 million fund to help women gimmick. It was only once they realised that I had a progress as engineers. serious plan to turn around a failing business and put It is not all down to government policy. Some of it that into practice that attitudes changed and people is down to culture and attitudes—even the attitudes of understood that I was there because I was qualified, women themselves. As Facebook’s Sheryl Sandberg up to the job and could do it well. After all, that is said, women systematically underestimate their own 355 Women: Economic Empowerment[5 MARCH 2015] Women: Economic Empowerment 356 abilities. If and when they succeed, they typically do friend Lord Davies of Abersoch, and all credit to him. not attribute that success to themselves. This needs to But going back to the theme of my contribution to change and I hope that I, and many others, can be an this debate, I will say that one swallow does not make a example to other women. I have been lucky enough to summer. This annual debate really gets my juices work with boards which have looked at what I have going and reminds me of years ago, when I was a bit done, not at my gender. This is the attitude that we more of a firebrand than I am today. need to foster. We do not need to stack the deck in In 2010, we were concerned about the gender pay favour of women; we just need to tell them—and tell gap. We called for a requirement to be put on medium- the world—that women can do anything they want. sized and large companies—not small ones—to publish Where they lack the tools, Governments should provide information about average wages based on gender in them. their companies. The coalition decided that they did Someone said to me recently that, in society today, not want any legislation or regulation, but to encourage it is not okay to be a bit racist or a bit homophobic, companies to take up a voluntary code. Although we but it is still okay to be a bit sexist. I am delighted that tried to get that changed, the Government did not this debate is taking place as a means to stamping accept it, but we have made progress: four companies that out. are now doing it. That is an average of one a year since the year we tried to introduce the requirement. I raise 12.28 pm this, perhaps a bit unfairly on the Minister who is to reply to the debate, to ask whether, when an amendment Baroness Dean of Thornton-le-Fylde (Lab): My Lords, is tabled next week asking companies employing more I, too, welcome this debate. It has become a set piece than 250 people to publish their average wages based each year and it is important that we have it. It on gender, the Government will accept it. Remember reminds me how privileged all the speakers in this that the theme for International Women’s Day this Chamber are in that we have a voice. With that, comes year is “Make it happen”; that would help to make it a responsibility to speak for the women who do not happen. The pay, opportunity and empowerment gap have a voice at any level in our community and our needs a whole range of initiatives—legislation and society today. I think that we will see a concordat regulation, yes, but also a lot of others. I am not across the Chamber, as we usually do, about the stupid enough to think that legislation is the whole principles and the purpose of this event, but that we answer; it is not. will disagree on how we achieve it. It is important to I have the huge privilege of being president of the air and discuss that disagreement. The theme for charity the Abbeyfield Society. Indeed, one of its International Women’s Day this year is “Make it happen”. former presidents is in the Chamber and will speak That is a very profound theme because we can talk all later in the debate: the noble Baroness, Lady Bottomley we like, but making it happen is more difficult and of Nettlestone. She did a wonderful job as president challenging, and we have to do it. and I look forward to her contribution. The charity This week we will also have the Women of the provides housing and accommodation for older members World Festival on the South Bank, a marvellous festival of our community. that has grown in size since it began. I should like to Over the past week, in the lead-up to this debate, a congratulate the BBC “Woman’s Hour” programme Resolution Foundation survey has revealed that 930,000 on transferring itself to the festival and broadcasting care workers are paid less than the living wage. I have from it each day. If we have seen any steadfast support chosen this theme for the debate because it is an area for women over the years, it has come from Jenni that is in the public eye, it is an area that will grow, and Murray and her team at “Woman’s Hour”. it is one of the last big areas of employment where Some 20 years ago—it does not seem like it, but it employees are undervalued and underpaid. We read in is—as a young and new Member of this House, I the press only about the abuse that takes place in a asked this question: when will women achieve equal minority of cases. As I say, it is an enormous area of pay? We had Barbara Castle’s Equal Pay Act 1970 and employment. I never thought that I would thank the the Sex Discrimination Act, which is 40 years old this Times, but let me put this on the record. Last year the year, and we have still not achieved equal pay. Without Times chose the Abbeyfield Society as one of its that Act, I wonder where we would be—probably in Christmas charities of the year, and the Telegraph an even more inferior position than we are today. I am followed that up. I thank both those newspapers for reminded, too, that in the other place the majority of showing the work that these underpaid and undervalued Members on the opposite Benches to the Labour members of society provide. Government of the day opposed both of those Acts, The Alzheimer’s Society says that 670,000 unpaid as indeed they opposed the 1997 Labour Government’s carers are women working for people with dementia. National Minimum Wage Act 1998. All three of these Some 82% of older people’s care home managers are Acts have been a big help, not for women like us in this women. It is the biggest area of women’s employment Chamber, who have enjoyed enormous opportunity that I can think of. In Abbeyfield, 85% of our staff are and privilege, but for the women who do not have a women, of whom 26% are in senior management roles. voice. The average number of women working in the care The noble Baroness, in introducing the debate in sector is much higher than in most other areas of such an interesting, wide-ranging and enjoyable way, employment in Britain, so it is a very important area referred to the fact that there is now a woman on the for us to get right. Our first woman CEO, Natasha board of every company in the FTSE 100. The instigator Singarayer, is an inspirational leader. Under her leadership, of the policy on that was a Labour Peer, my noble in only the last 12 months or so, this smallish charity 357 Women: Economic Empowerment[LORDS] Women: Economic Empowerment 358

[BARONESS DEAN OF THORNTON-LE-FYLDE] 12.40 pm provided 8,000 older people with homes. Of our 9,000 staff Baroness Hussein-Ece (LD): My Lords, it is a privilege and volunteers, over 80% are women. We have a to follow so many excellent speeches by so many responsibility for them and we have a responsibility strong and experienced women. for the people that we care for. The evidence is overwhelming: when more women Last year I was proud—as I am sure the noble are in work, economies grow. An increase in female Baroness, Lady Bottomley, will be—that we were the labour force participation and a reduction in the gap first national care organisation to pay the living wage. between women’s and men’s labour participation result Our 1,500 directly employed staff are now all on the in faster economic growth. Evidence from a wide living wage. Of course, some asked why, because in range of countries shows that increasing the share of some cases it meant a pay increase of over 20%. But household income controlled by women through their we asked: why not? We expect our staff to give first-class own earnings impacts positively on their families and care to our people; we expect them to respect them. children. How can we expect that if we do not respect our staff in their own right? It was the right thing to do. We My own maternal grandmother was a very poor have gone a bit further than that; we have said that by woman. She had no education. She had seven children March 2017 all our direct staff must be on the living to feed and clothe. She baked bread every day in her wage and all our suppliers must pay their staff the village and took in laundry just so that she made living wage, too. I give this example because we will enough money—a small amount but it was enough—to not be required to do it by legislation or, probably, by feed her seven children. That was in the early part of regulation. Depending on the outcome of the election, the previous century, but there are still millions of if it was the coalition’s policy, it will not be government women like my grandmother all around the world policy either. This is where an organisation has taken today, who take part in what is called informal employment responsibility itself, and it is where companies must and do not have the privileges that we enjoy. In south take responsibility. Asia, for example, over 80% of women in non-agricultural jobs are in informal employment; in sub-Saharan Africa I said that today was a day of celebration: it is. In it is 74%. Women comprise an average of 43% of the particular, I celebrate and congratulate a Peer on our agricultural labour force in developing countries; this own Benches—my noble friend Lord Soley. Why him? varies considerably across the regions from 20% or less He is making it happen for women. He is the chairman in Latin America to 50% or more in parts of Asia and of the Mary Seacole Memorial Statue Appeal, which Africa. That is the reality today. he helped to establish. A 15-foot statue will be erected right opposite Parliament, in the grounds of Guy’s We know that women and children also bear the and St Thomas’ Hospital. Mary Seacole was the daughter main negative impacts of collecting and transporting of a Scottish father and a Creole mother, born in fuel and water. According to the UN Women figures, Jamaica. In 2004, she was voted the greatest black women in many developing countries spend more Briton. The location of that statue is important and than one to four hours each day collecting biomass for the work of the noble Lord, Lord Soley, is also important. fuel. Another study of water poverty in 25 sub-Saharan The statue has a disc behind it that comes from the African countries estimates that women spend at least very site of a British hotel in the Crimea where Mary 16 million hours a day collecting drinking water; men Seacole set up her nursing station. She applied to the spend 6 million hours a day and children 4 million British authorities five times to go there and they hours. refused, so she made her own way, as women with Like many noble Lords, I go into a lot of schools, determination will. The noble Lord, Lord Soley, and speaking mainly to girls who come from deprived his colleagues managed to get the team of artists backgrounds. They are very interested in talking about building the statue into the Crimea just two months the sorts of issues that impact on women and girls before the Russians went in. The disc will come from around the world. We also have problems in this the site of the British Hotel, as she called it—from the country with young girls who come from different site that overlooks the valley where the charge of the backgrounds who are not encouraged to go into further Light Brigade actually happened. Although she was education and reach their full potential. One thing I not born in Britain, in my view Mary Seacole is one of always tell these girls when I go into schools and the great Britons. colleges is, “Do not let anyone tell you what you It reminded me that we had a debate some time ago cannot do”. Many of us, including me, had it drummed about a statue of Sylvia Pankhurst. It is still a dream into us what was not appropriate for a girl to do, but I of mine that we should have that, as well as a statue of always tell them, as the noble Baroness, Lady Brady, the Special Operations Executive women, which we do said earlier, “There is nothing you cannot do. If you not have in Britain. We have too few statues and focus, get the right education and are determined, commemorations of women. That is my dream—to there is nothing you cannot achieve”. We need far commemorate the women who have gone. But the more positive messages like that for young girls in this biggest legacy that we could have in commemoration country from all backgrounds. of those women is making sure that the thousands of We know that social institutions, as I have mentioned, women in Britain today who do not have a voice are affect female participation in economic life. A more treated fairly and that the Government—whatever proactive approach from donor countries such as ours Government—stand up and make sure that they are is needed to address the roots of gender inequality. It treated fairly and that equal pay is not still a factor in is entirely right that the approach by donors has been Britain 40 years hence. to improve women’s access to education and health—as 359 Women: Economic Empowerment[5 MARCH 2015] Women: Economic Empowerment 360 we heard from my noble friend Lady Jolly—including It has brought huge success and educated a whole birth control. That is very important, but it is not community. Sadly, it is still needed, but it has become sufficient. The root causes of gender discrimination in quite entrenched and well respected. IMECE, the some of the countries I have mentioned, with very Turkish-speaking women’s group based in north London, strong social and cultural institutions, also need to be is still there and has been doing fantastic work for addressed. For example, the enrolment of girls in more than 25 years—it celebrated its 25th year last year. primary schools can rise without it ultimately increasing This debate marking International Women’s Day female participation in the labour market if traditional provides us with an opportunity to ensure that women’s customs forbid women from working outside the home. rights are high on the agenda of global leaders. I Where such customs go against women being in authority, commend this Government on keeping this issue high the enrolment rate in universities may rise without that on the international agenda and hope that whoever is having any effect on the number of female managers in the next Government—I am not going to be party or women starting up businesses outside traditional political, because I think that we all want the same roles. It is therefore important to increase the effectiveness thing and are all committed, which is why we are of country and donor policies. Measures to address taking part today—will do the same. institutional inequalities must be put in place. Later this year, world leaders will agree on a set of Even when there are strong customs influenced sustainable development goals. Key charities are urging by culture and religion that have adverse effects, positive the United Kingdom Government to ensure that, for changes in favour of women are possible. In Turkey, a the first time, a globally agreed target on addressing all country that has seen huge economic development forms of violence against women and girls is secured, and success, a recent project had the motto, “We Are with a stand-alone goal on gender equality and women’s Equal and We Are Together At Work, At Home, empowerment. Will the UK Government commit to Everywhere”, which was very ambitious. The project an ambitious action plan to meet this goal? As one of aims to create decent work opportunities for women the major donors in the world, we need to lead by and the development of inclusive and coherent policies example on this. I would like to see a greater focus on to promote women’s employment in Turkey. The UN women’s economic equality, with SDG targets to recognise, Women’s regional office for Europe and Central Asia reduce and redistribute women’s unpaid care work signed a partnership with one of the country’s largest and to secure equal rights to economic resources and industrial conglomerates, Koç Holding, a significant assets and access to decent work and a living wage. holding in Turkey that manages companies involved in There should be equal pay for work of equal value to finance, energy, tourism, food and IT. These types of ensure women’s full and equal participation and influence initiatives are beginning to break down customs and at all levels of decision-making. traditions in encouraging women to play a full role in Each day around the world, hundreds of millions the economic development of their country. Increasing of women collect firewood and water for their families. numbers of women are now active in the workforce, They cook, do the chores and take care of the elderly, bringing greater prosperity not only to their families the young and the sick; and all the time, they try to but to the country. As a footnote, I say that this is by scrape a living from the poorest paid and most precarious no means widespread. It is a great start, but there are jobs. Women’s labour is vital to sustainable development still traditions that have not been broken down that both within the home and outside it, and for the prevent women going out to work, particularly once well-being of their own society. Women make up they are married. roughly 60% of the world’s working poor, despite their I am going to talk about violence against women, low rates of participation in the labour force overall, because it has a huge impact on the ability of women but their work is undervalued and mostly invisible. On to participate in the workforce and community. This is a global level, we urgently need an agreement to one of the most widespread abuses of human rights guarantee women’s access to decent work opportunities worldwide, affecting a staggering one-third of all women. and to reduce and redistribute unpaid care responsibilities The effects go way beyond individual women to negatively that fall disproportionately on women, just as they do impact across whole communities. Action Aid reports here in the United Kingdom. We need to ensure that that violence against women and girls is one of the economic policies work for women, not against them. biggest barriers to ending poverty and inequality. It We are already doing a lot of promotion, but we maintains and reinforces women’s unequal status and need far more of it to promote women’s voices and is really so disempowering, making women more leadership at all levels. There should really be no more vulnerable to future violence and driving increased summits: we see these summits when countries are in inequality and poverty. conflict or when we are trying to nation-build. There Before I came into your Lordships’ House over are always these summits, but women have to be there. 25 years ago, I had experience of establishing the first How many summits have we witnessed where women domestic violence project and refuge for women from were just not at the table? How on earth is this going a Turkish and Kurdish background. In those days, one to work when half the population is excluded? As I felt insecure talking about violence against women in mentioned, violence against women and girls works the community of which I am part. It was not recognised; against these goals, so will the Minister tell me whether it was not addressed; and to talk about it was seen as the Government will champion these goals in the way taking women away from their husbands—I was accused that I have described? of that many times and faced threats for doing it. I also make a plea for refugee women. Will the Establishing the project, which is still going strong after Government please continue to prioritise survivors of more than 25 years, is one of my proudest achievements. sexual violence through the Syrian vulnerable persons 361 Women: Economic Empowerment[LORDS] Women: Economic Empowerment 362

[BARONESS HUSSEIN-ECE] and sub-Saharan Africa are illiterate. In Mali the relocation scheme? Will they significantly increase the figure is 29% and in Pakistan 40%, while Afghanistan number of resettlement places in the United Kingdom has equally appalling figures. We all know that newly made available to Syrian refugees? We were told that literate women have a positive ripple effect on all this number is still several hundred. We know the scale development indicators. Literacy does not save lives or of the refugee crisis for the Syrian people; thousands fill hungry mouths, but it is a central component in have been taken in by other wealthy countries while we women’s empowerment. A woman who is able to keep have only taken in hundreds. This is surely not the her own business records is more likely to be able to right way to go: we should be leading by example. manage her income and expenditure, and to manage Violence against women and girls is still endemic in her family size. The children of a literate mother are Afghanistan, affecting women across Afghan society. more likely to complete their education, all the more A report just last month from the Afghan Independent so in a technology-driven world where smartphones Human Rights Commission showed that it is increasing, are ubiquitous. Illiteracy limits women to only basic with 4,250 cases of abuse reported to the commission levels of engagement. The disparity is growing greater, in nine months. The report followed numerous cases all the more so for women with disability—and I of violence against women making headlines in the endorse the comments made on that by my noble country, including, among other practices, beheading, friend Lady Brinton. gang rape, execution and the exchanging of women I warmly applaud the leadership from our Secretary and girls to settle disputes. A significant feature of of State for DfID, Justine Greening, and the work she violence against women and girls in Afghanistan is the had done consistently to focus on girls’ and women’s violence and threats faced by women human rights rights. Having a woman in that role, to me, is defenders. These women in civil society surely need extraordinarily important. When my noble friend Lady greater support and protection. We have a responsibility, Chalker held that office, it was the same. The redoubtable as one of the largest donors to the countries that I Clare Short, as many on the Benches opposite will have mentioned to ensure that we attach serious conditions know, relentlessly campaigned for women and children. of greater equality and power for women, and that we The Secretary of State has consistently highlighted the do not simply allow aid to be received without the targets, and reported back on progress; women should acceptance of these key principles respecting the human have control over their own bodies and a voice in their rights of women and girls. community and country, they should live free from the In conclusion, I commend the BBC for screening fear of violence, marry who they wish and when, receive “India’s Daughter” last night in face of pressure by an education and a job, and choose how they spend the Indian Government, which have banned it. The the money they earn—and how strongly I agree with film exposed the horrific attitudes towards rape and those points about microfinance and women having violence in that country. Surely the best way to combat control over their budgeting. The recent Girl Summit such violence is to shine a light and hold Governments on female genital mutilation and the work that the to account. Will the Minister tell us whether, as a Foreign Secretary, William Hague, has done with Angelina major donor to India, the Government are doing this? Jolie on putting an end to sexual violence in conflict are, again, examples of how giving a focus and a 12.53 pm profile together with a determined programme backed Baroness Bottomley of Nettlestone (Con): My Lords, by resources is critical. That would not be possible I am delighted to follow my noble friend. I was looking without that 0.7% commitment of GDP to aid. at her maiden speech again only recently in preparing From talking about the parts of the world where for today, and she has a track record of supporting there are deep concerns, I will just say a little more women in particular who need economic empowerment, about the other end of economic opportunity. I am have mental health problems or are in prison. I applaud hesitant to speak at all in this debate without the noble her comments. Speaking about Turkey, she will be Baroness, Lady Howe, being here. She came into the concerned, as I am, about Safak Pavey, one of the Chamber briefly and I wonder whether she has lost bravest MPs from the Republican People’s Party in her voice, as I cannot recall a debate on this subject Turkey. She is an LSE graduate, like me, a human without her contribution. Although the noble Lord, rights campaigner and the first disabled woman to Lord Davies, has done a lot on this, I do not think he become a Member of Parliament in Turkey. She is a would say that the campaign for female empowerment reminder, as has previously been said, of the huge started with him—although, my goodness, the way he privilege that we, as a generation, have of being able to has brought forces together to achieve change is quite speak freely and openly; we constantly have to remember remarkable. As has been said, in 2010 12.5% of board that life is very different in other parts of the world. members were female. The figure is now 23%. The On the first International Women’s Day, a hundred changes are remarkable. The last FTSE 100 company years ago, life expectancy for a woman in this country without a woman on the board was named and shamed was about 55. Today it is about 83—a dramatic, life- and now they all have one. Some have several. In our changing experience for all of us. Of course, in Swaziland own House, we have my impressive noble friend Lady life expectancy is 51, in Somalia 52 and in Sierra Harding, who is one of those leading figures. The first Leone 39. In our debates, we must constantly be female CEO of a FTSE 100 company was not until mindful about the paradox and contrast with other 1997, but we now have three. The first female FTSE parts of the world. Some 774 million adults cannot 100 chair was in 2002 and we now have three. We now read or write, 493 million of them women. Sixty per have 22 female heads of state in different fields, including cent of women in the Arab states, south and west Asia Angela Merkel in Germany. 363 Women: Economic Empowerment[5 MARCH 2015] Women: Economic Empowerment 364

In our lifetime we have seen these dramatic changes. International Women’s Day and to persuade the usual In my lifetime I never thought there would be a channels—of, I have to say, the party of the noble woman Prime Minister. We have had a woman Prime Baroness—that this was a noble topic to take up. I am Minister, we have had women Leaders of the Lords thrilled that now we all take it for granted but it was a and the Commons, and we have had women Speakers real struggle in those early days. Given that the previous in the Lords and the Commons. These are all achievements Government had women as Chief Whips for such a that I doubted would ever be reached. We have a great long time, we were able to establish it without any deal to be excited about, but none more so, at long discussion at all. This has followed what the other last, than the church that I belong to, which has House is doing in simply having a debate every year, so overcome all the obstacles to women bishops—and we can all bring to it the things that really matter to us how wonderful that is. I am sure that the right reverend as women. It is good that the men also contribute. Prelate will speak about this at greater length, and I do As a woman in politics, I go back to what it is that not mean to steal his thunder, but the installation of has given me all the privileges and opportunities that I Reverend Libby Lane last month as Bishop of Stockport have had. A lot of it was my family, but for two years is absolutely splendid. I am keeping my fingers crossed after my degree I went with Voluntary Service Overseas that this time next year when we have this debate, we to work in Kenya and that changed my life. It made might even have a bishop of our own in the Lords, me see that I had a responsibility to make a difference— although my campaign now is to get the bishops to and that I could do that. There were things that I remove their white dresses and just have the splendid could do that I had never dreamed of doing, certainly purple, but I do not want to lead the House down a not growing up in Sunderland. I know that the noble false avenue in this particular regard. Baroness, Lady Perry, who will speak later, did as well. Womenhave done well, I believe, under this Government. In my cohort, I was one of only 6% who went on to There is always more to do. The gender gap is closing. higher education. I went to Kenya soon after that. There are record numbers of women in employment— There was no internet in those days so you could not numbers that are very favourable compared with anywhere keep referring to what was going on back at home. My else in the European Union. The tax cuts, the help with father by then was a Member at the other end, and he childcare, and more to come, all mean that this is a used to send me the Guardian Weekly, so that I could good time to be a woman in the United Kingdom. It is keep some basic sense of was going on in the West, but splendid to hear from a great role model, my noble actually I was taken over by what was going on in friend Baroness Brady, who shows what can be done developing countries and what our role was. with energy, ability and a positive attitude. I am giving this long account to explain why today I There are always going to be areas where women’s will speak about international development and what interests need to be properly considered. I have been is going on in the developing world; I will not be thinking about the effect of policies to increase tempted by the things that I have heard from colleagues employment into the late 60s and how that may exacerbate speaking about this country. I have the enormous gender income and class disadvantages for women. privilege of having kept in contact with VSO throughout Professor Sara Arber at the University of Surrey has my life and of now being involved with it again in recently been writing in a very earnest way about this, governance. VSO now works in around 30 countries in and the noble Baroness’s points about the Abbeyfield the world. From that, we have learnt, taken evidence Society and the vast number of carers are equally and built up a good means of understanding what is important. happening in communities in the developing world Let me just finish on a topic which the noble and of knowing—not guessing—that women’s economic Baroness, Lady Greenfield, has covered far better empowerment has such a major effect on families and, than I ever could. With all the concentration on the of course, on local communities. The whole community number of women in boards, I have long been far benefits. This is particularly true for women in more concerned about the inadequate number of female communities where men are absent or are unable to vice-chancellors. I want the noble Lord, Lord Davies, work, particularly in places where men are travelling and anybody else who wants to join him, to focus their to work in southern Africa. I will say a little about efforts on working out why we cannot have more Mozambique shortly. women vice-chancellors and what the obstacles, hidden pressures and prejudice are against this progress. My I want to say something about Kenya where I keep excellent noble friend Lady Perry might well be able to going back. I met some women’s groups that a volunteer tell us the answer to all these matters later on. was working with. The first group that she took me to see was able, through microfinance, to buy some goats. I always regard this debate as enjoyable and At first, they bought about half a dozen goats but by enlightening. I think we are privileged, as I say, to be the time I went, there were about 200—goats are good in this House, but we know that our job is to make life at reproducing. Those goats were now supporting the so much better for other women, not only in this women to care for more than 200 children in the country—a liberal and civilised country—but in so village who were orphaned through HIV/AIDS. They many other disadvantaged and very often very disagreeable were remarkably strong women—they simply accepted countries around the world. this was their responsibility and they got on with it. With the volunteer, they had been able to find the 1.03 pm means of doing that in an effective way with regular Baroness Armstrong of Hill Top (Lab): My Lords, it meat and regular milk and then selling some of the is a real pleasure to take part in this debate. I remember goats so that they could financially sustain their when we had to argue very hard to have a debate on responsibilities. 365 Women: Economic Empowerment[LORDS] Women: Economic Empowerment 366

[BARONESS ARMSTRONG OF HILL TOP] Decisions this year by the international community In the next village we went to, the women’s group are therefore critical. At the meeting later this year to with the volunteer had begun planting a whole range agree the new development goals, those attending—largely of seeds that they had not planted much before. They men, I am afraid to say—will have a real opportunity were all seeds that could be milled, so, again with to change the position for women and actually develop microfinance help, they bought a small mill. They goals that will enable women to take more part in the were milling different sorts of flour which they were decisions around their country, their community and able to use themselves—so their families were better the world. We simply have to say to them that this is an fed—but they were also able to sell to others. They opportunity they have to face up to. They are the were making enough money to pay school fees and to people who this year will have to listen and ensure that do things that otherwise they would not have been women’s voices are heard, and face these challenges in able to do. the way that they take their decisions. This is a huge In Mozambique, VSO is working with the Association opportunity and we will all be watching closely to for Mozambiquan Miners and has been supporting make sure that this group, largely consisting of men, migrant workers and their families. Many of the men takes the right decision. work in the mines in South Africa, which is very difficult and dangerous employment, so many of the 1.14 pm women have to bring their families up in the absence The Lord Bishop of Derby: My Lords, I rise with of the men, and of course many of the men die early. some trepidation to be the first man to speak in this VSO has been providing support and training to help debate, particularly having been gently chided by the widows in particular to build a business and move noble Baroness, Lady Bottomley, about wearing a themselves out of poverty and, again, make a huge dress. Still, perhaps that is suitable bridging attire at difference in their local community and in their families. this moment in the debate. I am also very conscious I could read noble Lords testimony from some of the that the church could be seen to be behind the curve men who are now too old to work but are being cared on this issue, as has been mentioned, and I hope that for because there are these real changes in women’s noble Lords can see that we are trying very hard to activity. catch up and make proper progress. I want to do three I know that empowering women economically really things in this short address. I want to take up the makes a difference to families and communities, but theme that the noble Baronesses have talked about, we have to accept that it is not enough. We all talk the international perspective; look at some issues in about the importance of women in development, but the UK; and say what we might learn in terms of we do not take it sufficiently on to the next stage. This policy priorities. is essentially about how to enable women to ensure A number of speakers, especially the noble Baronesses, that these changes are sustainable and that their societies Lady Bottomley and Lady Armstrong, have mentioned are organised in ways that enable their economic the importance of an international perspective. I declare empowerment to be sustainable. However, we know an interest as a director and trustee of Christian Aid. that that bit is not yet working. Why do women still It is axiomatic in the developing world, as we have struggle so much for economic equality and work heard, that if you invest in women you invest in an equality? In the world of work, 60% of the world’s advance for the economy. In western Afghanistan, for working poor are women. Other speakers have given example, Christian Aid has been working for over the figures around the challenges that women are 30 years with partners. There are more and more facing, such as the lack of literacy. That traps too women-headed households because of all the conflict. many of them with insufficient means to be involved We have pioneered a new form of silk production and in their communities in the way that they should be. So offer training in technology, with 1,400 women in VSO now has a campaign, which I am part of, looking those businesses. That is producing income that is now at how to ensure greater equality around the world for being diversified into other sectors such as clothing women, and that means getting many more women manufacture, and it is women who have the drive and into decision-making positions. commitment to make that happen. In Mali, Christian We have begun doing that in this country but we are Aid, with partners, has helped 4,000 women to gain not there; however, in many developing countries it access to land. As a result, vegetable production increased has hardly even begun. Some of them are doing better by 50%, with women leading and directing the businesses. than us in terms of the numbers of women in their So it is axiomatic that this is a sensible thing to do. parliaments, but we really need to move this agenda If noble Lords want more scientific evidence, some on. Evidence is clear that where women are participating might know about Goldman Sachs’s 10,000 Women in and influencing decision-making, it is leading to a initiative. In 2008, Goldman Sachs set up this initiative more efficient, effective and responsive set of decisions to provide business education, mentors, networks and for communities. It helps progress towards gender links to capital. By 2013, it had enrolled its 10,000 women equality, and helps to transform the deep-rooted social across the world, and of course it does a scientific norms and attitudes that act as barriers. It also seems analysis of the programme’s effectiveness. It shows clear to me, however, that it is by tackling the barriers very clearly that revenues have been increased, jobs to women’s equality that we will take the massive steps have been created and there has been an expansion of that we need to in order to render the changes that aid women’s contribution to their communities. There is making around the world sustainable. Unless our is a very clear message, as we have heard: if you aid leads to long-lasting change it will continue to be invest in women for development, the whole of society under attack, and that threat is continual. benefits. 367 Women: Economic Empowerment[5 MARCH 2015] Women: Economic Empowerment 368

I want to remind us of some of the factors in our for evaluating performance and ensuring promotion own context, if we accept the principle of investing in need to be much more targeted towards embracing women for economic and social development. The women, including women coming at different speeds Fawcett Society has done some interesting research to into the labour market. show a number of factors that I invite us to think We need, in the private sector, to set clear diversity about and the Minister perhaps to comment on. There targets. The noble Baroness, Lady Brinton, talked has been a very welcome growth in jobs in the private about the danger of “all talk”. How are we going to sector since 2010, much trumpeted and very valuable. encourage the private sector to set clear diversity Some 59% of those jobs have gone to men and 41% to targets? How are we going to introduce more flexible women, so we have to think about how we are proactive employment contracts? What is very interesting in the in giving women equal opportunities. private sector is the Australian model, which you may Further research shows that many women work know about. In Australia they realise you have got to well below their qualification level in the labour market. do what they call “engage the majority” in terms of We have heard some speeches about getting behind the workplace and the economy, and therefore you through taking time out for child-rearing, but another need male diversity champions. In Australia the effect factor that might be important is that the jobseeker’s has been very significant of male diversity champions allowance has a strong emphasis on getting people acting in this field, especially in the private sector. into work; that is understandable, but it can have the Finally, in society we have to challenge the myth effect of getting people into work so quickly that they that women taking jobs will displace men. In fact, as have to take work that is below their level of ability we have heard, when women take jobs, the whole and skill and therefore not fulfilling their potential. economy and culture benefit. In society, we have to Those people are mainly women, who end up working tackle the mindset that we have heard about violence below their qualification level. We need to take some against women and girls, which is the substructure of kind of look at the jobseeker’s allowance strategy. discrimination and not taking rights and opportunities A final bit of research about our own context is that seriously. This is the issue that the noble Baroness, 85% of the money saved from tax and benefit changes Lady Greenfield, spoke about. has come from the pockets of women. I invite the I think there is great encouragement of the general Minister to comment on that. The noble Baroness, principle of women being at the forefront of economic Lady Jolly, said that women need to keep more of development and its well-being for society in terms of what they earn, but 85% of the money saved from tax our experience in an international context. There are and benefit changes has come from the pockets of serious issues we have to face about women having the women. right opportunities in the UK. There are some important I raise the issues, finally, of policy direction and policy issues for Government, the private sector and policy priority.Goldman Sachs has done a very interesting society that we may do well to take seriously if we study of Japan which I think can put alongside our really want to make some progress in this area. own context some markers about policy issues. It has shown that the amazing progress of Japanese culture 1.23 pm and economics in involving women has been made through a series of targets: targeting female representation Lord Graham of Edmonton (Lab): My Lords, it is a in various fields, as we have heard other speakers pleasure once more to participate in what I call the mention; targeting lifting female labour participation Thursday debates. I have listened to all of them, and in particular age groups through a reading of the they all inspire me because I am old enough to look economy and its potential; targeting the boost of the back over the years when the situation of recognition supply of childcare; targeting an increase in the percentage of women in any shape or form in running things in of fathers who take up paternity leave, which is a shift the country was far worse than it is now. I am one of towards equality; and targeting the issue of companies those members of society who started to work before making disclosures about gender policy and gender the war, and I mean the 1939 war. I was 14. I passed practice. my 11-plus exam, but I could not go because dad was on the dole for the whole of the 1930s. It was not until From that research, Goldman Sachs highlights three I got the opportunity given to me by the Open University sectors and a number of issues that we might consider many years later that I gained a bachelor of arts for our own policies with our Government and our degree and then was awarded an honorary master’s business practice. On government, the research says degree. I knew that I had the degree in me somewhere. that we need to encourage gender diversity target The trouble was that it did not come out, or the setting, and the Government need to lead the way. We opportunity did not come out. need to boost female representation in government. I think we should be patient, but we should proud That is a very important sign. We need to promote, of the progress that has been made, and a lot of as the noble Baroness, Lady Brady, said, female progress has been made. During the war, I was in the entrepreneurship. We need to encourage retraining Royal Marines. I was badly wounded. In May 1944, opportunities, and we need to invest in childcare. They I was preparing for 6 June in the same year when are issues of policy priority for Government. things went wrong on a certain exercise, and I finished In the private sector, the research shows that we up on a hillside with my guts in my hand and my legs need to stress the business case for diversity. There are damaged. When the nurse said to me, “The man who plenty of studies which show that. We need to create a did the operation on you is coming round today”, I more flexible working environment. In particular, schemes said, “I’d like to see him”. I said to him, “Mr Anderson, 369 Women: Economic Empowerment[LORDS] Women: Economic Empowerment 370

[LORD GRAHAM OF EDMONTON] ably introducing the debate, and I very much look I understand you saved my life”. He said, “Well, put it forward to hearing the response of the noble Baroness, like this: if I’d got to you 20 minutes later, you would Lady Garden. have been dead because of the loss of blood”. I had planned to talk about entrepreneurialism, Now, 70 years later, I am still standing here, and although, interestingly, women entrepreneurs do not therefore I have faith in longevity, and I intend to keep like to refer to themselves as such; according to recent going as long as I can. One of the great things that I polling, they prefer to be called “business founders”. can recall of the period is the extent to which this Having reread the Women’s Business Council report Chamber has changed. I have been here 30 years and and the Government’s response in preparing for this in Westminster 40 years. A great change has taken debate, I was encouraged by how much good stuff place in the population of both Chambers. The there was in it. I will share with the House a very short background of this House has radically changed since preview of research by the Centre for Entrepreneurs, I first came here. I look across at the Bishops’ Benches, which, together with the Legatum Institute, it will and of course they have changed as well. The change launch next month. It has been drawn from polling is coming. One has to be patient and not too peremptory and interviews with focus groups, 500 entrepreneurs in criticising the progress that has been made because and C-suite executives. I hope noble Lords will forgive I am convinced that the whole of society wills and me if later on I move on to the topic of women in wants the changes that many of us have wanted. There politics; I quite accept that that does not fit quite so needs, however, to be a right moment. There needs to neatly into this year’s topic as it has done in previous be a right happening. There needs to be an event years. which tips the balance. On that research, the headline findings are that One can argue politically, “Well, you could have women are just as interested as men in growing their produced legislation under Labour”, but it would business. They take a different approach to risk—a not have got through then because the mood of the more calculated approach. They perceive their growth country was not there. I believe that the changes that trajectories to be steady and think of male entrepreneurs have taken place which demonstrate that both Houses as more concerned with fast growth and quick sell. have what I call ordinary men and women who have The research shows that they care more about their an extraordinary background of achievement are workforce, few are willing to risk staff for the sake beginning to tell. of growth, and many focus strongly on corporate responsibility and their contribution to society and When one looks at sport, the noble Baroness, Lady their local area. They spoke of turning to family and Heyhoe Flint, who was of course the captain of women’s close networks for funding, and the exit stage is just cricket for many years, is a Member of this House. not on their radar. Instead they talk about planning, The noble Baroness, Lady Grey-Thompson, the great managing and controlling growth. I do not think that wheelchair athlete, has been marvellous. One realises any of that will surprise us, as it probably confirms our that women have a contribution to make, and they existing suspicions, but I for one look forward to reading make it very well. When I got my degree, it opened a much more when the report is published in April. world for me which I knew was there but the key was In previous years I have discussed the international given to me through the Open University. I will always aspects as co-chair of the Conservative Friends of be grateful to it. International Development. However, as the noble I am completely on the side of those who want to Baroness, Lady Tonge, is unable to join us today and see progress along the lines described by the noble as an officer of the APPG on Population, Development Baroness, Lady Jolly. She was a marvellous opener of and Reproductive Health, I must make the obvious this debate, and she must be very proud that the point that, without access to modern family planning, debate itself has attracted so many people from so no woman anywhere across the world can become many aspects of the matter. It is a privilege to be here economically empowered. Investing in women’s economic in this House. It is a privilege to be able to get to one’s empowerment sets a direct path towards gender equality, feet and to speak on topics like this with a modicum of poverty eradication and inclusive economic growth, experience from outside this place. I believe that all we and that puts our debate today in context. want to achieve is coming. The disappointment, of However, as I say, I hope that this close to the course, is that at the end of the day it is the politicians election and with most of the seats selected, I will who will decide because this will be changed only by return to the subject which is so close to my heart—most legislation, and that legislation needs to be tempered noble Lords will know that women in Parliament is and put forward at the right time. I hope I am still here one of my things—and was at the heart of my own to support it when it does. maiden speech, which I made in this same debate four years ago. An awful lot of us were making maiden speeches in that debate. I talked about my grandmother, 1.29 pm who was the only Conservative woman MP in 1945, Baroness Jenkin of Kennington (Con): My Lords, it and her father—my great-grandfather—who was a is a great pleasure to follow the noble Lord, Lord Liberal MP and subsequently a Labour MP, who Graham. All these issues we have been discussing introduced the first Women’s Suffrage Bill in 1907, today will change only if we get buy-in from men, and how proud he must have been to see his daughter because men are still in the driving seat in so many take her seat in 1937, and how astonished the two of countries, so it is a very great pleasure to have his them would be, having sat on the green Benches there, support. I thank the noble Baroness, Lady Jolly, for so to see me here now. 371 Women: Economic Empowerment[5 MARCH 2015] Women: Economic Empowerment 372

I also talked about Women2Win, which is the Part of what we have been working on is the next organisation the Home Secretary and I set up nearly generation. That first step—that first seat—is a challenge, 10 years ago, and how after the last election we went as any of us who have done it will know. I fought a from 17 to 49 MPs—which is not great, but a huge Glasgow seat in 1987 and it put me off—I did not improvement. I am sorry that my noble friend Lady want to do it again. It is lonely, boring and difficult. Bottomley is not in her place, but I think that when We have also been raising money for the candidates she was in the House of Commons the number of the first time round. Only yesterday I was speaking at women MPs was considerably lower than 17. a fundraiser for a highly capable 25 year-old Indian girl who is fighting Dulwich and West Norwood this Over the past four years, as Members of Parliament time; I would love it if she won, but I very much want have announced that they are retiring, and those seats her to be there in the next generation, and I am have been selected, I have been rather gently teased by delighted that we at Women2Win—the Home Secretary Members opposite about how we are not making was also there last night—are able to support them, enough progress and how all-women shortlists is the encourage them to come forward, and keep them only solution. I have lost my nerve on the journey and there. have thought that maybe that was the only solution. Indeed I caused some kerfuffle by saying that, if we go I take this opportunity to congratulate CCHQ on backwards at the next election, all options should be achieving that considerable success without a row. My on the table. However, I am delighted to be able to say noble friend Lady Chisholm is a big part of that. I that I do not think we will go backwards. We have had congratulate Conservative members on selecting outside a very good run, and I will update noble Lords on their comfort zones, and most of all, I congratulate whereweare. those candidates who are stepping up to the plate. People often say to me, “Why does it matter?”. It I will take this opportunity to congratulate a matters because women’s life experiences are different number of people who have been involved in making to men’s. They are not inferior or superior, but different, that happen. We all know that going into politics is and that difference has to be better reflected, whether not an easy career choice or option, and women in in the Chamber next door, this Chamber, the boardrooms particular need to be encouraged to come forward or the judiciary. Every sector in this country is not and need to be supported on their journey, from their doing well enough. None of us in this Chamber, nor first interview right through to the green Benches. the men who understand how important all this is, That is what Women2Win is there for; I know that can afford to be complacent or take our foot off the the Labour Party has a similar organisation, as do the pedal. Lib Dems. I therefore congratulate those who have been involved in making sure that the selections that have taken place have, to start with, had a balanced 1.39 pm list; almost every interview selection panel has had at Lord Boateng (Lab): My Lords, there is an old least as many women as men. We have voluntarily African proverb in the Akan tradition of west Africa, had 10 all- women finals—those constituencies have where I was brought up, which says in translation, chosen to do that—and only four all-male finals. That “Men tend not to listen to women until it is too late”. is significant progress. We have ended up with 33%—one Bearing in mind all that is to happen this year in New in three across the board—which includes the seats we York and Paris in relation to the sustainable development are not likely to win, and of the retirement seats the goals and climate change, we men had better listen to figures are nine out of 27, or 12 out of 33 if you count women or it will be too late. So many remarkable the ones that might be in the margins of error. That contributions have been made, and are to be made, in excludes the ones that I hope we will gain next time. this debate from so many remarkable women that There was also a bit of a hoo-hah about a number there is much that we need to heed. of Conservative women retiring. In fact only three I want to concentrate on Africa and development. retired, out of 33 retirement seats, and they did the Bearing in mind that this is a day of international responsible thing, which was to retire early to provide celebration, I mention two remarkable west African an opportunity for their successors to get in place. women—my grandmother, an entrepreneurial, innovative Therefore, although the situation post-election is not medium-sized cassava and cocoa farmer in the Akyem clear, I am very pleased to be able to report significant region of the Gold Coast, as it was—Ghana, as is—and progress. I have to say that two of those very good Bertha Conton, a renowned educator who taught me seats selected last week, and I might not have chosen to read, was the inspiration for a book club in my this theme had they not done the right thing and primary school and is well into her nineties, but to this chosen excellent women. day is a teacher presiding over a school in Freetown, If I may stray a little further from the topic before Sierra Leone. noble Lords, I also welcome the number of BME I shall concentrate my remarks on Sierra Leone. candidates who will be joining the green Benches next Ebola has had a devastating impact not simply on the time, which includes candidates for Fareham, Braintree, economy of Sierra Leone but also, significantly, on the Richmond (Yorks), Havant, North East Hampshire, real progress that had been made in the advancement Wealden, and South Ribble—not natural Conservative and empowerment of women. I am afraid that Ebola BME territory. I congratulate those on the selection is not an equal opportunity virus: it discriminates panel on having gone outside their comfort zone in against women. Why is that? It is because women have selecting candidates who might not necessarily fit into caring responsibilities. Traditionally in west Africa those constituencies. and, indeed, globally, at times of death or sickness, 373 Women: Economic Empowerment[LORDS] Women: Economic Empowerment 374

[LORD BOATENG] women to become scientists and to take up roles in the women are always to be found in the front line either health infrastructure. That involves training women domestically or professionally as nurses and clinicians. nurses and doctors and training women to work in The result of that in Sierra Leone is that more women scientific laboratories. Strengthening the healthcare than men have died tending to the bodies and to the system demands the involvement and engagement of sick. However, the consequences go beyond that as the women. not insignificant gains that had been made in education, We should not lose sight of that or of the fact that which started from a very low base, have been set back more than 60% of women in Sierra Leone are engaged markedly. With the closure of schools, girls have been in agriculture, which is key to the future of that sent home in circumstances which make it very unlikely economy and of Africa as a whole. My paternal that they will ever return even when the schools reopen. grandmother—this innovative cassava and cocoa There has been a huge rise in teenage pregnancies in grower—knew the value of agricultural extension officers, Sierra Leone and a rise in sexual assaults on girls as who, interestingly enough, were more prevalent in men have preyed on the increased vulnerability of colonial times than they are across Africa today. My these young women who are now often the sole providers grandmother knew the importance of research and in these circumstances. development in agriculture. She knew the importance Sierra Leone is not a poor country but it is an of being able to link, and her produce being linked, impoverished one. It is rich in minerals, agriculture to global markets. We therefore have to make sure and human potential but it is impoverished as a result that we do not neglect agriculture, the role of women of greed, avarice and exploitation, quite apart from entrepreneurs and, importantly, thinking beyond the sister evils of ignorance and neglect. It is an subsistence to the creation of wealth and linking women impoverished country where more than half the to global markets. population lives on less than $1.25 a day. One of the We have an opportunity on this International Women’s key causes of the civil war, which ended only just over Day to celebrate the achievements of the many great a decade ago, was the unequal distribution of power, women who have gone before and those who work and the consequences of which were felt significantly by are activists now—north, south, east and west and on women. Women were effectively prevented from accessing all sides of the political spectrum. We have the opportunity the sources of either traditional power in the chieftaincy to celebrate their work and to rededicate ourselves to a or power through democratic institutions. The good future that they are enabled to shape. We need to heed. news is that prior to the outbreak of Ebola that It is not too late and the best may yet be to come. situation was being reversed. Sierra Leone had one of the fastest growing economies in Africa, as I saw for 1.51 pm myself when I had the privilege to visit that country Baroness Nye (Lab): My Lords, I, too, should like last year shortly before the outbreak. During that visit to thank the noble Baroness for initiating this debate I met the Parliamentary Women’s Caucus and an and perhaps continue the theme started by the noble inspirational group of women brought together by Baroness, Lady Jenkin. Christian Aid with their local partners in that country. It has been 112 years since the Women’s Social and I met women who were empowered through being able Political Union was formed. Eight years later came the to hold local budget holders to account for the money first International Women’s Day. History—even familiar that was being spent on health and education through history—can be illuminating, so I looked up the a project supported by the European Union, DfID, Encyclopaedia Britannica for that year, 1911. It described Christian congregations and others the length and a woman as meaning a wife, and women as, breadth of this country. Women were being empowered “the wife division of the human race”. through their activity on the ground. The danger is We have come on a little since then but perhaps not that all that will now be set back and will not produce as far as we would have liked. The “wife division” of the real economic gains that were beginning to come the human race then was not economically empowered; on stream. nor did it have a right to vote or hold public office. It Therefore, I ask for two things. First, even as we was also that year Sylvia Pankhurst—I share the view debate what is to happen post-Ebola, we must ensure of my noble friend Lady Dean that Sylvia Pankhurst that we learn from the experience of those women and should have some recognition—founded the East London that we listen to their voices. When you ask women Federation of Suffragettes because she wanted a what they want in Sierra Leone and, indeed, in many movement that included women from all backgrounds, other places in Africa, they tell you that they do not especially those from working-class backgrounds, because want massive spending on tertiary hospitals but rather they had the greatest need of emancipation. The a focus on community and public health. They want suffragettes wanted to “Make it Happen”—which is girls to attend primary schools but they also want to the theme of this year’s International Women’s Day. see them enrolled in secondary and tertiary education However, apart from proving their worth as war workers, because, although real advances have been made in little happened for them until the Representation of primary education, girls are not advancing in secondary the People Act 1918 gave propertied women aged over and tertiary education. Even as we advance the cause 30 the right to vote. We had to wait another 10 years of primary education on that continent, we must take before women over 21 achieved equality. I mention care not to forget secondary and tertiary education this because, in election year, we all have reason to because African women want to be scientists too. remember those women and to honour their bravery They believe that the future of their continent and of and sacrifice by encouraging maximum use of the Sierra Leone depends on the capacity of African precious vote. 375 Women: Economic Empowerment[5 MARCH 2015] Women: Economic Empowerment 376

I am proud that my party will build on our record has stalled. The higher the level of education there is, of women’s representation in this Parliament because the higher the prevalence of gender disparity, even for we have more than 50% female candidates standing in girls living in higher-income households. There are our target seats, although there is always more to do. ways to make things better, such as making the school But we have to work hard to find ways in which to environment more conducive to girls by improving the engage with the 9 million women who did not vote in sanitation facilities, making roads and transport safer, the last election and to ask them to not give up on and having more female teachers as role models. It has democratic politics. We know that women are worried been estimated that an extra year of primary schooling about the cost of living, the NHS, exploitative zero-hours for girls increases their wages by up to 20%. Mothers contracts and the future of their Sure Start, but we with even a few years of education are more likely to have to emphasise that voting is vital to those and send their children to school and have healthier babies other basic concerns. with lower levels of child mortality. In doing that, we must never of course forget our The sustainable development goals to be finalised sisters who are not properly enfranchised still. In this year include inclusive and equitable quality education, Saudi Arabia, King Abdullah declared that women and lifelong learning opportunities for all. I heard the will be able to vote and run in this year’s local elections question that the noble Baroness, Lady Hussein-Ece, for the very first time—although, sadly, they will not asked the Minister about whether there will be a be able to drive to the polling stations. In Burma, stand-alone goal. However, as Julia Gillard, the chair where elections are expected later this year, it is unlikely of the Global Partnership for Education and former that Aung San Suu Kyi will be able to stand for Australian Prime Minister has pointed out, aid to President, because the constitutional clause banning education has fallen by almost 10% since 2010, compared anyone with foreign partners or children will not be with just over 1% in overall development assistance amended by the quasi-civilian Government. It is hard worldwide. She calls for the sharp decline in global aid to see how the elections can be seen as credible and to education to be reversed and for there to be the fair without reform of the eligibility clause. political will to reprioritise education aid. While it was a step forward that President Thein As part of that campaign, the charity A World at Sein endorsed the Preventing Sexual Violence initiative School has teamed up with campaigners all over the last year, the military Government continue to stand world to call for every girl and boy, wherever they are by while the violence perpetrated by the Burmese born, to have the chance to go to school and get a full army continues with impunity. The Women’s League education. Tomorrow, the A World at School youth of Burma and the UN special rapporteur have been ambassadors, Shazia and Kainat, the teenagers injured documenting rape and sexual violence by the Burmese alongside Malala on their school bus in Pakistan, will army for decades. There was one such case in January share their courageous story and help launch the this year, when two young Kachin female teachers— Stand #UpForSchool campaign to secure a future Maran Lu Ra and Tangbau Hkawn Nan Tsin—were where every girl around the world is educated and brutally raped and murdered in Shan State. They had empowered to reach their potential. As part of that been working in the village for about eight months as campaign, there is a Throwback Thursday campaign, volunteer teachers for the Kachin Baptist Convention. with which noble Lords can join in by posting an old The Burmese army arrived in the village two days school picture on Twitter, Facebook or Instagram to before the murders, posted guards around it but then promote girls’ education and get more people to sign left shortly before the bodies were discovered. Burma the petition calling on all Governments to keep the Campaign UK, in which I declare an interest as a promise made 15 years ago. With 31 million girls denied trustee, has called upon the British Government to their right to education and more than 500 million implement provisions in their Preventing Sexual Violence girls dropping out before completing their basic education, initiative and dispatch a team of experts to Burma to there cannot be progress on economic empowerment investigate the case. I would be grateful for the Minister’s until no child is left behind. comments on why this has not happened. What are the criteria for making such a decision? The international community, including the UN, has repeatedly called 1.58 pm on the Burmese Government to investigate such cases Baroness Evans of Bowes Park (Con): My Lords, we fully. They have repeatedly failed to do so. Those have heard much today about the crucial role that 20 year-old women had left the relative safety of their women play in our economy. More than 14 million are homes to teach children in an area of ethnic conflict. in full-time or part-time work, 1.4 million are self- In Burma, as elsewhere, there is an urgent need for employed, and there are now more women than ever education, not only for children but adults, if the on FTSE 100 boards. However, despite the progress demand for teachers, health workers and better living made, there remain great challenges. To ensure that standards is to be met. As the noble Baroness, Lady future generations of women are able to access the Brinton, mentioned, Kofi Annan has said that there is jobs that will power our economy and continue to no tool for development more effective than the improve their economic position, it is critical that our empowerment of women, and that empowerment must education system helps them develop the knowledge include access to education. Educating girls has enormous and skills they need to succeed. It is here that I declare benefits for their families, communities and countries. my interest as director of New Schools Network. The millennium development goal to eliminate gender It is no surprise that as girls’ academic achievements disparity in primary and secondary education has have grown, at both school and university, so their been nearly achieved in primary education but progress success in the job market has increased and their 377 Women: Economic Empowerment[LORDS] Women: Economic Empowerment 378

[BARONESS EVANS OF BOWES PARK] regular sessions with leaders from STEM-based industries employment options have expanded. Last year again and leading academics to gain a better understanding saw girls outperforming boys at GCSE in every of the employment opportunities open to them. mainstream subject except maths. At A-level, although In conclusion, as in so many fields, given a new the gap between them is much smaller, girls continue opportunity, women are rising to the challenge. However, to outperform boys. While overall the picture of if we are to ensure that they continue to play a attainment is positive, women remain underrepresented growing role in our economy, we have to start early—and in some subjects, particularly at A-level and then at that means ensuring that every young woman has university. access to a high-quality education that helps her develop As noble Lords will know, at A-level boys are twice the character, confidence and skills she needs to do as likely as girls to study maths, three times as likely to whatever she wishes. study further maths and four times as likely to study physics. At degree level, fewer than a quarter of maths undergraduates are women, as are fewer than 20% of 2.03 pm computer science undergraduates and just 16% of those studying engineering. Yet these are the very Baroness Healy of Primrose Hill (Lab): My Lords, I subjects that can open the door to some of our fastest- welcome this opportunity to debate women’s economic growing sectors, where many of the high-value jobs of empowerment as it allows me to highlight the means the future are likely to lie. While women are well to prevent so many women entering prison in this represented in many sectors of our economy, such as country. Economic empowerment of women who have the service industries and across the public sector, it is been imprisoned, or are in danger of entering the important that they have access to jobs in other leading criminal justice system, is key to their positive participation industries, such as the creative industries, pharmaceuticals in society. and high-value manufacturing. In January this year there were 3,807 women in With education being such an important foundation prison in England and Wales. More than eight in 10 for increasing women’s economic empowerment, it is sentenced women entering prison had committed non- little surprise that they have been an important driver violent crimes. Most of these sentences were short. for change and improvement in the system over the Around 60% of women entering custody each year past few years. The opportunity to set up new schools have been sentenced to six months or less. In addition, has been enthusiastically seized by women around the in a 12-month period around 4,000 women will be sent country—by mothers who want a new option for their to prison on remand. The majority of these women children in their community, and by teachers, who see spend only around four weeks in custody. Yet any time them as a chance to raise standards in their area and spent in prison has a devastating effect on women’s ensure that all children have access to a good education. lives, often resulting in the loss of their homes, employment Education is an area dominated by women. More and, most importantly, their children. than 70% of teachers are female. As in many sectors, Financial concerns are a driver to women’s offending however, they are underrepresented in leadership positions. according to a Cabinet Office study which found that The free school policy is providing a new opportunity 28% of women’s crimes were financially motivated, for women to unleash their entrepreneurial spirit and compared with 20% of men’s. Not surprisingly, earlier help shape educational provision in their area—women research on mothers in custody found that 38% attributed such as Charlotte Warner and Katy Parlett, who both offending to a need to support their children, single have autistic children and have drawn on their own mothers being more likely to cite a lack of money as experiences to establish new special schools in London the cause of their offending than those who were and Leeds. Another example is Sarah Counter, a married. determined head teacher who has set up Canary Wharf Theft and handling offences are the biggest single College, now an outstanding primary school, and is driver to custody for women. In 2013, theft from a setting up a further two schools to offer high-quality shop accounted for more than a third of all custodial education to young people in one of the poorest sentences given to women, with the average sentence boroughs in the country. A group of mothers are length being 1.9 months. Between October and December setting up a primary school in Crystal Palace to help 2013 more women entered prison on remand awaiting tackle the acute shortage of school places in the area. trial for this offence than for any other. Shoplifting As well as being a driving force behind their creation, was one of the few offences to increase in the 12 months we are seeing outstanding female leaders in many free to June 2014. I fear that with the increase in the schools, from Sasha Corcoran at Big Creative Academy number of those on benefit being sanctioned, some to Angela Reynolds at Corby Technical School and will have to turn increasingly to this form of petty Sue Attard at Hatfield Community Free School. crime. The Fawcett Society recently found that, Furthermore, we are seeing free schools set up with “particular groups of women … including single mothers, women specialisms to help ensure that girls as well as boys facing sexual and domestic violence … are exceptionally vulnerable have the skills desired by employers of the future. to sanctions through no fault of their own”. King’s College London and the University of Exeter Many women entering prison are in debt and have set up England’s first two specialist maths sixth imprisonment exacerbates their financial situation, forms. North Somerset Enterprise and Technical College making it difficult for them to access housing and is developing its curriculum with local employers to benefits on release and to be reunited with their children. address the STEM skills gap in the area, while students The Prison Reform Trust has recommended that the at Sir Isaac Newton Sixth Form in Norwich have time limit for eligibility for housing benefit for sentenced 379 Women: Economic Empowerment[5 MARCH 2015] Women: Economic Empowerment 380 prisoners be extended from 13 weeks to six months closure of the only two open prisons for women could to prevent short-sentenced women from losing their result in the loss of local partnerships with employers homes. which have built up over the years. Employment, and A recent survey of women in HMP Holloway found the education and training that underpin it, is a vital that benefits were the main source of income for more pathway to reducing reoffending for women. As the than half of those surveyed, and 43% admitted that Prison Reform Trust has said, they were currently in debt. Women are more likely “more concerted action by both government and business would than men to have claimed out-of-work benefits prior improve employment opportunities for women who have been in to, and post, time in custody. trouble”. Employment outcomes for women leaving prison It is widely acknowledged that most of the solutions are three times worse than for men. Women were more to women’s offending lie outside prison walls. Women’s likely than men to worry about housing debts, which is centres, providing services and supervision to women linked to the need for suitable housing prior to regaining on community orders, are ideally placed to support custody of their children. Fewer women than men had them to build the skills, training and confidence they bank accounts. More women than men said that they need while maintaining community links. If women felt unsure about managing money. Fewer than one in have jobs that enable them to find and keep hold of five women interviewed were offered financial advice secure housing, look after their children and move while in prison. According to the Prison Reform Trust away from abusive relationships, they are less likely to in its recent and excellent report, Working It Out: return to crime. “Former offenders, both male and female, face a number of The reorganisation of probation services under barriers to employment. A combination of factors including Transforming Rehabilitation has led to a period of mental health problems, low self-esteem and educational gaps, as great uncertainty for many centres working with women well as the legal requirement to declare unspent (and sometimes subject to community orders or on licence from prison. spent) convictions if asked by employers, can make it extremely Initially funded by central government and, more difficult for people with a criminal conviction to find work”. recently, by local probation trusts, funding from Women in the criminal justice system are community rehabilitation companies is confirmed only disproportionately affected by mental illness, drug until this March, when it will depend on commissioning and alcohol dependency and lack of confidence. As decisions taken in each contract package area. Some my noble friend Lady Corston’s ground-breaking report CRCs are offering between three and six months’ of 2007 said: extension on current contracts, but the uncertainty “The chaotic lifestyles and backgrounds … disproportionate and short-term nature of such funding risks irrevocable prevalence of learning disabilities and difficulties result in many damage to many services and loss of experienced staff. women in the criminal justice system having very little employment Understandably, there is growing concern that funding experience or grasp of some very basic life skills”. for such women’s centres is insecure. What assurances So of those women who are imprisoned, many, if can the Minister give that women’s centres will receive not most, need substantial assistance to become job-ready adequate funding to ensure their continuation post on release. At the same time, the dual stigma of March 2015? mental health need and offending history creates extra Only by supporting vulnerable women to help obstacles. The exclusion of prisoners with mental health themselves and their families can we begin to address problems from vocational rehabilitation, often on the the cycle of deprivation and reoffending that blights basis that they are “not ready” is another barrier in too many young lives. itself, despite all the evidence that work promotes recovery from mental illness and desistence from crime. For women in prison much greater emphasis on 2.11 pm training for employment on release is needed. I welcome Lord Storey (LD): My Lords, I wanted to speak the Government’s announcement of a package of in this debate not because I have especially great reforms for women in prison, including English and expertise on women’s issues, but because I think it is maths skills assessments on reception, assessments for vital that we see men being proactive by standing up special educational needs and the introduction of tailored and speaking up. It is of concern to me that too few learning plans to meet individual needs that offer a men take part in these important International Women’s mix of life skills and formal educational skills. However, Day debates. more needs to be done. The second thing I want to say is that women’s Greater use should be made of schemes for release rights and equality issues should not be seen as the on temporary licence to allow women assessed as preserve of just one political party; it is the work and low-risk and suitable for day release to gain the experience contribution of Members across this House that is and skills that will aid their resettlement by taking up important. Indeed, year after year all the Oral Questions employment in the community, and to help rebuild on International Women’s Day have come from just links with children and other dependants. one Bench. How refreshing it is that there has been a Recent changes to ROTL have made it harder for change this year. I thank my noble friend Lady Jolly women to access the scheme by insisting that they for leading this debate and for her excellent opening must have a job secured beforehand. Finding a job or comments, and I look forward to my noble friend voluntary work in the community while in prison is Lady Garden’s closing remarks. I have learnt so much challenging, given lack of access to the internet, the from listening to the debate, and I just wish that more high cost of phone calls and the inability to meet people could hear the comments that Members have potential employers face to face. Also, the proposed made. 381 Women: Economic Empowerment[LORDS] Women: Economic Empowerment 382

[LORD STOREY] I am reassured by the progress that we have made International Women’s Day provides us with the so far, but even in the UK many women still lack opportunity to raise awareness, continue discourse access to adequate childcare provision, flexible working and ultimately accelerate action on women’s economic conditions and balanced career advice. It is encouraging empowerment in the UK and beyond. As the chief to hear stories of women’s economic empowerment executive of UN Women said, we must, from around the world, and I hope that we can take “push for women’s economic empowerment alongside other priorities, inspiration from places as far afield as Cambodia and because this is essential to ending poverty and advancing gender China, in which it has been shown that increasing equality”. adult female income by 10% of the average household A major priority must be education, and I believe that income increased the years of schooling for girls and the universal provision of education will pave the way boys. for women’s long-term economic empowerment by High pupil enrolment and attainment figures are, of ensuring that every child gets the best possible start course, promising. However, we need to continue to in life. If our ultimate objective is gender equality in ensure that pupils who are enrolled in our education business, we must focus on the education of our future system can make informed decisions about their future, business leaders. When we have an educated, literate including the pursuit of STEM subjects from GCSE citizenry, we will pave the way for effective and inclusive onwards. At A-level, there are currently almost twice economic development. as many boys taking maths as there are girls, and But gender equality should not be seen as just a almost five times as many boys take A-level Physics. I women’s issue. The World Bank’s research, Promoting find it incredibly worrying that the UK still has the Women’s Economic Empowerment, found that improved lowest percentage of female engineers in Europe, and economic opportunities for women led to better overall even more so that only 4% of engineering apprentices outcomes for families, societies and countries. Inclusive are women. and sustainable economic development can be achieved Some businesses and multinational companies should through gender-equal educational provisions, creating be commended for their efforts thus far to actively opportunities for entrepreneurs across the board and increase the number of women in science, technology long-term business networks for all. and communications, and for their work in enabling Education has been defined as one of the top 10 young women to develop the necessary skills. Cisco priorities by the Association for Women’s Rights in Systems’ Global Education Initiative is an example of Development, and the ratio of female-to-male enrolment good practice that has been able to teach core subject in secondary education is often a crucial indicator of skills to young women around the world in conjunction gender equality across the world. Let me tell noble with the World Bank. Lords of a real success story. Currently, DfID’s We need to make sure that the 2 million apprenticeships programmes in India support a range of human-related that this Government have created over the past four activities that have a positive impact on the lives of years are accessible to young women, and that young women and girls, including assistance with government people from all backgrounds can benefit from the education and health initiatives. For instance, helping opportunities on offer. Ensuring that we have a diverse girls to stay in secondary school as part of India’s range of young apprentices in the UK will mean that Right to Education Act can push back the average age we are better placed to compete with our European of marriage, increasing the potential for greater social neighbours in the important fields of science, technology, entrepreneurship and allowing more young women to engineering and maths, in addition to our impressive become beneficiaries of different social ventures. DfID’s track record in the arts. We must ensure that the new investments have addressed, and continue to address, national careers company effectively addresses the gender a variety of different issues that left unchallenged can disparity in the uptake of STEM subjects and empowers often act to reinforce each other and affect sustainable young women to make informed decisions about their development in the long term. futures. In the UK, economic development should reflect British values and be governed by freedom, democracy I believe that we have a great opportunity on this and inclusivity. Recent attempts by the Government International Women’s Day to create real change and Equalities Office have sought to step up efforts to discuss the root causes of economic disempowerment. attract qualified women to public positions, while ensuring By linking together women’s economic empowerment that working practices and conditions are consistently and the role of education in youth, we can help family-friendly. So far, we have been able to help many women directly but also widen the talent pool in the women reach their potential in the workplace and future and with it the potential for market-related enabled many businesses to get the full economic benefit innovation. I thank noble Lords for their dedication to of women’s skills, including through the work of the this subject, both nationally and internationally, and Women’s Business Council, Women on Boards and the urge them to consider diversity in the future, primarily Think, Act, Report programme. We have also made a as a means of empowering women but also as a concerted effort to ensure that women’s interests are strategic business advantage. always represented in government by regularly meeting Finally, I was interested to hear the comments women’s groups and campaigners and listening to women made by the noble Baroness, Lady Brady, and her across the country. Furthermore, more than 4,500 remarks about women in the world of business, yet grants have been paid out to those establishing new there are still huge areas of our society where women childcare businesses, with a further £2 million extension are absent and little progress has been made. Like the of the scheme for the rest of this year. noble Baroness, I do not believe in enforcing targets, 383 Women: Economic Empowerment[5 MARCH 2015] Women: Economic Empowerment 384 but I do believe in role models, action programmes these global institutions will continue. We hope to see and, perhaps most effectively, naming and shaming. a further three around the world by the end of this Perhaps in her reply my noble friend might consider year. my suggestion that the Government from time to time To ensure that peace agreements stay in place, it is publish lists of areas where very few women are very important that Britain should be a world leader. represented. We already had an international conference last year on women’s security and sexual violence, and this year 2.20 pm we had a global conference of faith leaders. It is Baroness Goudie (Lab): My Lords, I, too, congratulate important that we show the lead in this, not only with the noble Baroness, Lady Jolly, on arranging this funding but in encouraging other countries to partner debate today, and I am pleased to be able to speak with us. with many of my colleagues. I declare an interest as a board member of the Vital Voices Global Partnership, 2.25 pm which is recognised for supporting emerging women Baroness Mobarik (Con): My Lords, like all noble leaders and taking their vision around the world. I am Lords I welcome this opportunity to debate the issue also a founding member of the 30% Club—a group of of women’s economic empowerment. I agree with chairs and CEOs committed to better gender balance other noble Lords that much needs to be done to at all levels in their organisations through voluntary address gender inequalities: from the issue of the actions. Business leadership is key. This takes the issue gender pay gap to the cost of childcare, which makes it beyond specialised diversity effort into mainstream prohibitive for some to seek employment; and from talent. The 30% Club was launched in 2010 with an fewer girls taking STEM subjects—science, technology, aspirational goal of 30% women on FTSE 100 boards engineering and maths—which would lead to higher by the end of 2015. It has become an international paid jobs, to the lack of women on FTSE boards, business-led approach with men and women working despite there being enough women of seniority and together. talent available. I know that much has been done to Will the Minister and the Government condemn address this, but we still have some way to go. There the action of the establishment running Yarl’s Wood? are also cultural issues preventing aspiration and We are discussing women’s economic empowerment discouraging women from achieving their full potential. and how to achieve it. Women and children, who have Of course, there are differences and degrees of come to the United Kingdom having fled to seek gender inequality between countries. Indeed, between asylum and refugee status, are being treated abominably. the developing and developed world there are extreme They are treated like criminals and even worse, with and pronounced differences. In fact, women in the no respect. Instead, the Government should be welcoming developing world are at a serious disadvantage both in them and expediting applications so that these women education and the labour market. There are many and children can start to lead a normal life. I would strands to the subject of the economic empowerment like to see this as a priority by the Home Office and, if or disempowerment of women, and these issues are necessary, the Cabinet should be involved across all both national and international. The international government departments. issues are enormous and other noble Lords have spoken In 2000, UN Security Council Resolution 1325 was passionately about these—they need increased and the first to specifically address the unique impact of persistent effort. As time is limited, however, I shall conflict on women and women’s important contributions confine my remarks to the area of entrepreneurship to conflict resolution and sustainable peace. It marked within the national sphere. a watershed moment, when the international community The Institute for Public Policy Research has indicated recognised the role of women and gender to peace and that men across Europe are 90% more likely to be security.Following UNSCR 1325, subsequent resolutions self-employed than women and that in every European further defined the importance of women’s roles in country the rate of female self-employment lags behind conflict and peace, recognising sexual violence as an the rate for males. The IPPR has also stated that, while issue of international peace and security and reiterating the relatively high rates of women entrepreneurs in the need for a comprehensive response to sexual and emerging and developing countries is due to a high gender-based violence. A further resolution in 2013— level of necessity, in the developed world women are UNSCR 2122—aims to strengthen the measures to often motivated by other factors, such as maintaining improve the participation of women in all phases of a balance between work and caring for family. There is conflict resolution. no doubt that in the UK significant strides have been We know that women are key to peace. If women made in recent years in addressing many of the issues are not at the peace table, peace does not last for very faced by women, with the Government putting in long. A number of peace negotiations have lasted for place very many measures to help women into work only five years and then they fail. That is because there and to start up businesses. However, we must explore are no women at the peace table and no local women. every aspect of what it will take to create real gender Hillary Clinton and Ambassador Melanne Verveer equality and real economic empowerment for women. are global leaders and have established an Institute for First and foremost, we must kindle a sense of Women, Peace and Security at Georgetown University. confidence in women, to make entrepreneurship an William Hague and Angelina Jolie Pitt encouraged attractive career option. Statistics from the Office for and enabled the London School of Economics to National Statistics show that, in 2014, 1.4 million establish a Centre for Women, Peace and Security in women were in self-employment in the UK—just under February of this year, and we very much hope that one-third of the total number employed. Although 385 Women: Economic Empowerment[LORDS] Women: Economic Empowerment 386

[BARONESS MOBARIK] I am grateful to the noble Lord, Lord Davies of this number has increased by 34% it should be noted Abersoch, and others who are further improving that the top three occupations for self-employed women women’s economic empowerment by making the business were: first, cleaners and domestics; secondly, child and social case for increasing the representation of minders and related; and, thirdly, hairdressers and women on British boards. These are boards which barbers. While these activities are important, women oversee the activities of our top companies in the have also a role to play in high-worth businesses. For FTSE 100 through to the FTSE 350. Having raised this, we must continue to provide support such as the question in your Lordships’ House, I am delighted mentoring as well as providing access to education to say that talented black businesswomen are now and information and communication technologies. getting the opportunity to share in this special social Very importantly, there must be support in financial change. literacy along with access to finance. The report of the I should like to share with noble Lords an event OECD, Enhancing Women’s Economic Empowerment which shaped my view on the direction of travel of through Entrepreneurship and Business Leadership in black women’s economic empowerment from a more OECD Countries, found that women often have less pointed perspective. In doing so I am reminded of a experience when they start up a business and are also quote from the Irish philosopher Edmund Burke, who less likely than men to borrow money to finance their said that those who do not know their history are business. Although both women and men in OECD destined to repeat it. I also recall that the economist countries are likely to hold accounts with formal financial Arthur Lewis encouraged entrepreneurship among institutions, men are more likely to receive a loan from women, saying that they would not flourish unless these institutions. Women also tend to raise a smaller women were empowered and encouraged to be involved amount of capital when it comes to financing business in business. expansion. According to that report, there is also evidence that women are constrained in accessing I quote these because of an experience I had. In the equity and venture capital because of their weak late 1970s I attended a conference on how to a start representation in key networks. business. It was attended by more than 200 black These are just some of the issues. If the aim is to people. The first speaker was an official from one of raise productivity, employment and economic growth the leading banks. He opened his contribution by nationally, then these concerns have to be addressed. saying that he did not lend money to black people on It has been acknowledged that women play a crucial principle. I leave noble Lords to imagine the consternation role in driving economic development throughout the on the faces of those assembled women and men. It world. Expanding our existing business development was a totally black audience. Being aware that banks services to take into account those issues faced by are the lifeline for small businesses and enterprise, I women entrepreneurs would be a useful exercise. Industry- had the temerity to stand up and ask what his principles specific business training programmes for women, or were. He went on to cite that, to him, black people other such initiatives, would go a long way towards were not trustworthy, nor did they have any track encouraging more women into business and helping record for establishing a line of credit. This made those already there to grow. them a high risk and he was sure that we would agree If we wish to close the gender gap and to create a that he should not be prepared to risk the bank’s diverse and inclusive society where individuals can money on those from the “coloured community”. attain success, then entrepreneurship and leadership There were up to seven principles but I will not bother for women can play a vital role towards achieving noble Lords with them. this aim. Enterprise in Britain was already happening among black women. The first generation of those who came 2.31 pm found it impossible to find anyone in this country who Baroness Howells of St Davids (Lab): My Lords, I could do their hair or have make-up to suit them. So too thank the noble Baroness, Lady Jolly, for raising they were doing it in their homes. As community this debate during the week when we commemorate relations officers, we thought it would be good to get International Women’s Day. Sunday marks an them on to the high street and into proper businesses. international day of celebration and events that respect That bank manager was lucky to leave the room alive. and appreciate women’s economic, political, and social Having been part of establishing that conference, I achievements across the world. International Women’s was saying, “No! No! No!” throughout, because we Day was established in 1909; 105 years later, this year’s really wanted to convert him. We wanted to instil in theme is “Make It Happen”, which for me is very women that growth meant loans and here was a banker appropriate. It strikes a chord as, putting it quite dishing out not money but a slap in the face. bluntly, for many women of colour over the years In my role as patron of the European Federation of economic achievements have not happened. Black Women Business Owners, I am confident in With the indulgence of the House, I will explain sounding a positive note. The second generation of further. Multicultural Britain can boast many different black women is breaking out of the stagnation which individual cultures and subcultures that define the the whole community had to endure. Their pain and term “woman”, as that term is not homogenous. To suffering is becoming heard and is fast disappearing. truly empower women and “make it happen”, all the It is not quick enough for us, but it is happening. We integral parts that make up womanhood must show now have women who are determined to make this a advancement so that progress benefits not only the level playing field. It has meant challenges and hard few, but all women. work in order to disprove the claims levelled against 387 Women: Economic Empowerment[5 MARCH 2015] Women: Economic Empowerment 388 them by that banker. What was sad was that the social businesses. They have maximised local, personal money- burdens were deliberate, and were propagated by the lending schemes known in the Caribbean as “pardners” media then, as today. and “sou-sous”. The most prominent among the business start-ups are to be found in the hair and beauty sector, We are grateful that the Scarman report highlighted as I have mentioned. It is now impossible to walk the needs of the black community. Today you will find down a high street without seeing a black hairdressing black women involved in all sorts of businesses. I want salon that caters for Europeans as well. Hairdressers to name just a few. Joy Nichols is the owner and chief are able to ply their trade and thus to empower both executive of Joy Nichols & Associates. Kanya King is themselves and the country they live in. We know that a businesswoman and entrepreneur in the music business. that bank manager would not be able to say what he Cynthia Dyell opened a care home which, she always said today because attitudes have changed—and we says, was on the advice of Mrs Thatcher. She now has have laws to ensure that he does not. four such homes. She is still having problems with local authorities but she carries on and says that the We now know that the gatekeepers of economic people she cares for decide to call her “Mother”. opportunity have become more adroit in excluding Yvonne Thompson is another entrepreneur and one those who are black, but we will continue to fight. I of the founders of Choice FM. She has written a book have a cautious optimism for the future. I recognise about women on boards. The majority of people that more people in our society understand that the buying the book are white, and she is thriving. social and economic isolation of one community affects us all. Another note for optimism are the black women The race relations Acts, effective equal opportunities who are the leading lights of today. Those coming policy, the formation of the British Caribbean Chamber after them will have role models to follow. I would of Commerce and borough councils were all involved mention Heather Rabbatts CBE, a black woman who in the growth of the second generation into economic has the distinction of being the youngest ever chief development. When we now see a black woman, we do executive of a local authority in the UK. She has risen not believe that she would be stopped by the seven to become the first woman to be a director on the principles of that bank manager. The United Kingdom board of the Football Association. In her slipstream needs all sorts of people to contribute to it. Black and one to watch for the future is Karen Blackett women are contributing every day in all areas where OBE. She is the CEO of MediaCom, the UK’s largest the opportunity to do so is offered to them. The media buying agency. This year she has become the banker’s words were for me a seminal moment because first businesswoman to top the UK Powerlist. Karen is I understood right there and then how powerful the a product of the environment that Diane Abbott and negative impact of racism could be. I knew that the Yvonne Thompson have helped to create. With Karen whole of the black community was struggling to start and many other young, determined businesswomen up businesses in this country. The first generation like her blooming in our community like redbuds in served, but the second generation had the advantage spring, I am reminded of a quote by Franklin D of education and was seeking to enter the world of Roosevelt: entrepreneurship. If you are powerful and you are “The test of our progress is not whether we add more to the prejudiced, it is difficult not to exercise that prejudice, abundance of those who have much; it is whether we provide so we have forgiven the banker and hope that he will enough for those who have too little”. never say what he said again. I wholeheartedly welcome the events that will celebrate Miss Diane Abbott MP was at the forefront of the this year’s International Women’s Day. However, let us economic empowerment of black women in this country. together and as a society “make it happen”. We want She started an organisation which is still going today to see the economic, social and political empowerment called Black Women Mean Business. She also encourages not only of white women, but of women from all black businesswomen to encourage others. Yvonne communities in the UK today. Thompson CBE, who I have already mentioned, and her media company, ASAP Communications, are going 2.46 pm from strength to strength. I have named these two Baroness Kidron (CB): My Lords, I would like to women, but there are many more. Both of them would put on the record at the outset my admiration for attest to the difficulties they faced and the barriers women and men all over the globe who by their placed before them that were seemingly designed to bravery and hard work advance the cause of women prevent them and their contemporaries from achieving and girls, particularly those who risk violence to do so. economic freedom. Diane Abbott’s organisation has However, my comments today concern how women’s provided much-needed support and guidance to black primary responsibility for bringing up children impacts women who dared to want to enter into business. negatively on their economic empowerment. I hope Dr Thompson has gone on to establish the European that noble lords will forgive me if my words start from Federation of Black Women Business Owners, which a personal perspective. supports and empowers black businesswomen by creating a dialogue both in the UK and across Europe. Latterly, A month ago, when the nominations for the Oscars the Prince’s Trust has also identified the challenges were announced, there was an outcry that none of the faced by minority groups in business and has attempted nominees for best director was a woman. In the 87 years to bridge the gap. of the Academy Awards, out of the 429 nominations for best director, there have only ever been four women, In spite of the barriers to economic prosperity, so no surprise there, really. Only in the writer categories black women in their droves have shown their resilience do women make a showing, but even there at less than by finding alternative sources of funding for their 10%. Women make up less than 1% of sound nominees, 389 Women: Economic Empowerment[LORDS] Women: Economic Empowerment 390

[BARONESS KIDRON] wages under 40 as a measure of victory for women at there has only ever been one female nominee in the all. As others have already said, it is not at the beginning effects category, and for cinematography, none at all. of their journey that women experience the most And, as has been the case every year for the last discrimination and difficulty, but as they become mothers. decade, media outlets rang and professional associations Data show that the gap gets exponential as careers set up urgent debates to discuss why. progress, including that published by the Chartered But this year I was approached by a powerful Management Institute last year, which reported a 35% blogger from LA who had written to every female executive pay gap between the earnings of men and director they were able to find and asked for an women over 40. Figures from the Office for National “anonymous” response. My response was to say that Statistics on all UK pay show that in their 20s women the authority and centrality implicit in the role of “the earn 1.1% more than men, but by their 50s they earn director” is something that is trained in to young men 18% less. As the ONS report said: and out of young women, Even if they do make the “This is likely to be connected with the fact that many women leap and imagine themselves as film directors, and have children”. then advance through the bruising ups and downs of To be clear, it is not because women are in a the critical perception of creative genius, box office position to “choose” to be at home, in some sort of acumen and adamantine self assurance, just at the apple pie or yummy mummy fashion. Some 70% of point that it may pay off in terms of a stable and women in the UK with dependent children are in the highly paid career, many—although clearly not all— labour market, routinely taking lower paid or lower become mothers. Being an artist at that level requires a quality work in order to balance duties of parenting selfish devotion to your art; being a primary carer and earning a living. For the same reason, it is women requires selfless devotion to your charges. It is not an who make up the vast majority of part-time workers. insuperable contradiction to brook at any individual The ONS statistics on the UK labour market from moment, but over the length of an entire career, it February this year reported 6.14 million UK women defeats many. and just over 2 million men working part time, with Female directors rarely want to highlight their gender, the inevitable blight on career progression and greater and as it turned out I was the only person, across risk of poverty in old age. several continents, who responded to the blogger. The All parts of the political spectrum express belief in email I got back said, “Spot on analysis. It is hard to gender equality and fairness, but then fail to account get people to talk about this even anonymously ... for the overall contribution to society, family and the unless I get three other people responding ... I’m not economy by those who bring up the next generation. going to run anything”. Nothing ran. In failing to account for that contribution we continue The rarefied world of the Oscar nominee is hardly to perpetuate a system in which women, who by the cutting edge of gender inequality. However, an fourfold are the primary carers, see the possibility of Oscar nomination has an almost magical “multiplying well rewarded or competitive employment recede as effect” on the financial success of a film and the they struggle with the dual demands of work and subsequent career of its director, which, in turn, makes parenthood. it more likely that when we think of a film director, we I do not diminish in any way a man or woman who think of a man. wishes and is able to choose to do full-time childcare. Of course, this cycle plays out across many professions. On the contrary, my point is that there is an unsustainable Several years ago I was transfixed by a radio interview contradiction between our collective duty of care to where a female politician was being pressed to explain the next generation, the burden on women as they why she was not running for party leader. The interviewer disproportionately fulfil that duty and our desire for implied that she was failing in her duty to party and gender equality in public and economic life. Nor is this people. Eventually, and somewhat reluctantly, the politician only a first-world issue. Four years ago I sat at the feet explained that she had three young children. Her of an elderly woman in Karnataka in south India. She husband was running in the same race, so presumably was desperately trying to persuade her 12 year-old had the same three young children. Why did the granddaughter into sex work. Furious at the young interviewer not ask what cultural and structural changes girl’s resistance, she demanded of me, “What shall I the politician thought were necessary to enable women do? I am old, my daughter is dead, my brother is with young children to occupy high office? Why cast disabled, there is rain coming in. How will we feed the the woman as failing in her duty to public and party—why children if she does not go to do this work?” How not question whether male politicians are routinely indeed? I had no answer. failing in their parenting duty? Why did the interviewer The grandmother was not a bad person. The economic remain entirely silent on the fact that Messieurs Blair, options available to her family group were limited to Brown, Cameron and Clegg all had young children her granddaughter doing sex work. In her world view, when they became party leader—as indeed did Ed she had a responsibility for her daughter’s children Miliband, who was the eventual victor in that race? and was fulfilling that duty by sacrificing one child As a result of taking on the unequal responsibilities who, when she was gone, would be able to support the of parenthood, women routinely occupy lower-status rest. The girl in question received help, at least in the work than men, in all fields, with the inevitable short and medium term; but this scenario is repeated downgrading of their economic prospects. On “Question throughout the world. Estimates suggest that of 40 million Time” last month a Minister joyfully talked about sex workers globally, 80% are female. Three-quarters parity of wages between men and women under 40. I of them are aged 13 to 25 and many are pushed into was horrified that a Minister would consider parity of sex work to support their families. 391 Women: Economic Empowerment[5 MARCH 2015] Women: Economic Empowerment 392

On every stratum, on every continent and in every are running their own businesses. Why? Because as the context, the outcomes for women are distorted by the noble Baroness, Lady Mobarik, has already said, women unequal responsibility for parenting. So unless and are half as likely as men to start their own firm, with until we see the raising of children as a collective the majority saying they do not feel they have the right endeavour across gender, family, communities and skills or adequate access to capital. nations, we will never achieve economic empowerment In the workforce, three-quarters of chief executives for women in any context. We will never be able to and 69% of full-time directors are men. Those rates protect girls and women from sexual exploitation in have not budged since 2003. Some 75% of female communities where women do not have access to employees say that they face a glass ceiling, a career other forms of paid work. Unless and until we recognise bottleneck and little opportunity for advancement. A that the unequal responsibility for children is a direct recent US study showed that women entered their obstacle to women’s advancement and proactively take business careers with the wind in their sails, expecting steps to redress the balance, not only in fragmented to achieve the same career advancement as men, but corporate and third sector initiatives but as a priority over time lost confidence in their ability to contest from the centre of government and all parts of civil managerial positions and simply stopped trying. This society, we will never have enough female voices in the may be one reason why a particular article caught my system to make the structural and cultural changes eye in the New York Times. Did your Lordships know necessary to deliver the economic empowerment for that there are more men called John than women women that is the subject of today’s debate. running America’s largest companies? I kid you not. Back in the UK, women on average earn 20% less 2.57 pm than men. They bear the main burden of child-rearing Baroness Rebuck (Lab): My Lords, as we approach and caring for elderly parents. But while, as we have the 104th International Women’s Day this weekend, I, heard, the pay gap has almost disappeared for young like so many other speakers, am grateful to the noble women working full-time, there is a much bigger pay Baroness, Lady Jolly, for introducing this debate, which gap for women in their 40s and older. This suggests gives us an opportunity to reflect on how far women that some employers are inflicting a “motherhood have progressed but also on how much more there is to penalty”, as Claire Enders describes it in her Women achieve. There have been important strides towards at Work report. We have heard about this from the greater equality and many of the opportunities that noble Baroness, Lady Kidron, who will no doubt are taken for granted by young women today would agree with me. Put bluntly, it appears that professional scarcely have seemed possible for their grandmothers women of a certain age are simply sidelined. Next growing up in the last century. However, enormous Wednesday we will have a opportunity to try to help issues of unfairness and inequality, most eloquently close the gender pay gap by supporting an amendment highlighted by my noble friend Lady Gould and others, to the Small Business, Enterprise and Employment are still there to be addressed, both here and around Bill to ask larger businesses to publish differences the world. between men’s and women’s pay. At the heart of my comments today is the belief There is also another factor at play for women—I that through achieving greater financial autonomy call it an aspirational gap—with too few successful women are empowered. Education, improved literacy, role models to learn and gain confidence from. This is decent work and an independent income give women also true globally, where more than 126 million women the freedom to make choices, support their families entrepreneurs were running businesses in 67 economies and realise their potential. But women also need the in 2012. While many of those businesses were small role models, the aspiration and the confidence to take and started out of necessity, in every single economy up these opportunities. This is crucial to the health of women reported worse perceptions of their own abilities our society. One of the most effective ways to tackle than men and a greater fear of failure, which means childhood poverty is to support women into well paid that support networks and mentoring are as important work and, for a vibrant, innovative and successful globally as they are in the UK, and on a par with economy, we need as many women in leadership roles access to seed funding. as there are men. This is not opinion but fact, based on I was fortunate to pursue my career in book publishing, several close studies of the performance of mixed-gender an industry that pioneered promoting women to top teams. positions. My generation felt that they did break through Many speakers today have referred to the excellent a glass ceiling, often propelled by the memory of work of my colleague, the noble Lord, Lord Davies, growing up with their mothers’ thwarted ambitions. and we can certainly celebrate the fact that in 2014 But recently publishing has been wondering why all women made up 23% of board non-execs in the FTSE the senior women who have retired or left the industry 100—close, if you like, to the 25% target set for this have been replaced by men. With women very well year. However, if you look at the FTSE 250, where represented on boards and at divisional level, why are women account for only 17.7% of board directorships, they no longer the CEOs? there is still work to be done. There are still 24 all-male Corporations have to consider what structural and boards and although that number is down from the cultural barriers are still preventing women from reaching 131 all-male boards that existed in 2011, we should the top and what training and help need to be put in certainly think about extending our targets to this place—beyond targets—to achieve a fair and dynamic sector. But the real problem we face is in the executive spread of talents. When I became CEO in 1991, it was pipeline for women. Yes, more women than ever work— common for women to feign illness when a family over 14 million in total—but only a small percentage matter interrupted work. But what better excuse than 393 Women: Economic Empowerment[LORDS] Women: Economic Empowerment 394

[BARONESS REBUCK] As we look forward to celebrating International a child’s event at school? A meeting can be rescheduled, Women’s Day, let us remember how much more there a childhood cannot. Businesses simply have to become is to do in terms of both legislation and attitude. If we more flexible, both practically and in terms of attitude, do, women will be a transformative force in the world. in order to benefit both parents. I have mentored I will leave your Lordships with the words of 15 year- several young women in the media. They were all old Priya, speaking to the charity Plan, which powerfully stunningly gifted and ambitious but after the first express women’s potential. She says: 20 minutes of discussing their professional situation, “Because I am a girl, every man in the corporate world puts a the conversation always turned to work-life balance glass ceiling over my head. But because I am a girl, I have the and how on earth they would cope. So it is right that power to shatter it”. we reflect on the availability of good childcare, company culture and lack of flexibility. 3.09 pm Like the noble Baroness, Lady Brady, I am influenced by Sheryl Sandberg, whose book Lean In I published Baroness Perry of Southwark (Con): My Lords, I in the UK exactly two years ago. Sheryl identifies add my thanks to my noble friend Baroness Jolly for aspiration and confidence as pivotal qualities for women introducing the debate so well and giving us the and the extent to which sometimes women’s awareness opportunity to hear some quite astonishing speeches. of the career pitfalls ahead leads them unconsciously I start by congratulating the five brave men who to limit their ambition. When I speak to young women have spoken in the debate. What a pleasure it was to in schools, confidence comes up time and again. These hear them. But sitting here, I have also been reflecting students are intelligent and feisty but the world of on what an astonishing collection of women we have executive achievement is often as distant from their heard from in the House today. These hugely high- reality as a show they might watch on television. One achieving women have given us absolutely remarkable initiative that has been beneficial to young women was accounts of their thoughts and their lives. As I was pioneered at the Women of the World festival at the listening to them, one thought suddenly came to me: South Bank, which takes place again this weekend. We let us suppose that instead of those of us who are here have already heard from the noble Baroness, Lady on these Benches, each one of us was replaced by our Dean, how important this event is and how grateful mother. How many of our mothers would have been we are that BBC “Woman’s Hour” is now recording it. able to have the opportunities to achieve the things The initiative is called speed mentoring, where young that we have achieved? Yet it was their strength and women discuss problems with their mentors in 10-minute their teaching that made us who we are. intervals, to really astonishing success. I am very pleased to have an opportunity to speak We also have to recognise that while some women in this debate. It will surprise no one that I would like are struggling to climb up the ladder, others are fighting to talk about the role of education in women’s to get on it at all. It is a particular problem for empowerment. It is on the quality and reach of its low-skilled women, where lack of confidence and education that the prosperity of every nation depends. education relegates them to low-paid work. The rising I am very proud to be the person who ran one of the cost of childcare also prohibits them from working, first two access courses for women into higher education even when work is available. For example, the cost of nearly 50 years ago back in the 1960s. We have come a nursery places has gone up a staggering 30% since long way, have we not, from those days? Now, it is 2010. One important reason for low aspirations and taken for granted that women attend university in lack of confidence is poor literacy. A woman who can equal numbers to men and in some cases more so. In read confidently can find a better job, keep records those days, it was a very small proportion, as the noble and complete a training course. She can help her Baroness has already said: 6%, I think it was, back children with their homework and learn how to protect then. her health. Whether in the UK or internationally, There is much to celebrate in what is happening there is precious little opportunity to escape poverty today. We have come a long way and a great deal has without the ability to comprehend the written word. been accomplished in recent years. I would like to talk As we heard earlier from the noble Baroness, Lady about some of that good news in a moment, but I Bottomley, of the 781 million adults globally who pause for a moment to pay tribute to the many splendid cannot read, two-thirds are women. But an educated women who have fought the good fight for women and girl will contribute 90% of her income to her family, girls to be properly educated in times past and on compared to 40% from men, and will be more likely to whose shoulders we now stand. Without their courage insist on her own daughter’s education. The charity and determination, we would not have seen the huge Plan points out that one extra year of girls’ education contribution that women today bring to the economy, boosts wages by 20% and, as we heard from the noble about which we have heard much today. First, I think Baroness, Lady Nye, reduces infant mortality by the of London in 1848, when the famous pair, Miss Beale same amount. Yet global education on its own will not and Miss Buss—names to conjure with—started the solve all women’s economic challenges. A UN report Queen’s College school for girls. showed that unemployment rates among university- In higher education, my own British hero is Emily educated women in Turkey were three times higher Davies, the doughty woman who fought the 19th-century than among similarly educated men; in Saudi Arabia, prejudice and chauvinism of Cambridge University they were eight times higher. Education and literacy to found Girton College, my happy home as an are crucial for women but they cannot compensate undergraduate many years ago. Emily believed that alone for discriminatory attitudes. the equality she sought could be achieved only if no 395 Women: Economic Empowerment[5 MARCH 2015] Women: Economic Empowerment 396 concessions were made on the grounds of gender. The starting apprenticeships in engineering and manufacturing girls who came to her fledgling college were to be has increased threefold. Here, my glass is half full. I admitted on the same criteria as the men and to take rather think that my noble friend Lord Storey’s glass the same examinations and within the same timescale. was half empty on these facts, but I rejoice in the good Time and again, she was offered compromise to the news that there is here. Indeed, it is particularly rewarding demanding standards which men at the university had to note that in 2013-14, almost 53% of young people to meet. Time and again, she said no: no lower entry starting apprenticeships were female. I cannot adequately requirements, no longer timescale to reach final, no express the pleasure that I feel at this news. I feel watered-down easier examinations. I am on Emily immensely proud of the Government’s record in bringing Davies’s side. I strongly believe that offering concessions real change in the ambitions and prospects of young to women because they are women, whether through women through apprenticeship training. quotas, targets or distorted shortlists, is not equality, In the academic higher education route, the story is and it perpetuates the myth that women are second also encouraging. The number of UK women students class and can achieve only if they are given special entering universities here increased from more than treatment. 188,000 in 2010 to more than 197,000 in 2014, which is Around the world, as we have been hearing today, an increase of about 9,000. Adding the numbers from the struggle for women’s education is still being fought. the rest of the EU and overseas, the number of women We have been humbled by the courage of Malala in students entering British universities has increased by Afghanistan, seeking the benefit of equal access to almost 20,000 since 2010. That is in spite of dire education for girls at huge personal cost, and inspired predictions that the increase in fees would drive down by the work of women like Sheikha Mozah and Sheikha the number of women willing to pursue a university Sheikha bint Saif, who have pioneered good education education. for the girls and women of the Middle East. It is also encouraging to look at the recent report on So where do we stand in Britain today, and what academic staff in universities by Amy Norton, senior have the current coalition’s policies brought about for HE policy adviser in the Higher Education Funding girls and women in education? There is good news to Council. Her report shows that women academics report. If women are to take their full part in the now make up almost 47% of full-time teaching and economy of the future, it is essential that more of research staff. This has been increasing steadily in them achieve in the hard subjects of science, technology, recent years, and has gone up to around 4,000 just in engineering and mathematics, and other noble Lords the last three years. At senior level, especially vice- have mentioned the importance of these subjects. I am chancellor level, however, the men still dominate. This therefore particularly pleased to see the rise in the is of particular sadness to me, as I was—I do not number of girls in the STEM subjects. Since the know whether I would say proud—pleased to be the Government introduced the EBacc, the number of first woman appointed executive vice-chancellor in girls taking science and maths at A-level has increased the UK. I had hoped that after me the floodgates by no less that 12%, and the number taking maths and would open and there would be many more. It has not the separate sciences of physics and chemistry has happened that way. steadily increased year on year since 2010. When we look at the place of women in the state school teaching force, however, we see that the picture This good news is part of the hugely successful is more mixed. At primary level, 81% of all primary increase in the overall number of pupils taking maths teachers are female, and many carry leadership roles and science subjects at A-level: an increase of 13% in below the head. Of primary heads, 71% are female. At maths, 21% in further maths, 16% in physics, 17% secondary level, the picture is much more stark. While in biology, 6% in chemistry. More girls than ever are 62% of all secondary teachers are female, only 32% of taking A-level chemistry and physics, while at GCSE secondary heads are women. Women are still finding it the number of girls taking chemistry, for example, has difficult to scale the steep-sided pyramid. Perhaps the almost doubled since 2009 from over 37,000 to over women of the future will right the imbalance that 63,000. That is indeed good news. We have much leaves so many talented and professionally skilled reason to thank the former Secretary of State Michael women who could contribute so much to the quality Gove for his insistence on a broad, balanced and of our schools lacking the recognition that they should rigorous curriculum, which has brought about this achieve. much needed change. The young women who have achieved in this new range of tough subjects will be In conclusion, I celebrate what this Government’s well equipped to take their part in a world economy policies have achieved for girls and women in enabling that depends so much on technology and its supporting and empowering them to take a full part in the economic sciences. future of this country. With more women skilled and fully equipped to play an even bigger role, I believe But it is not only in academic achievements that the that the world of the future will be a better place. Government have succeeded in bringing girls into success, for themselves and for the national economy. 3.19 pm Our economy will depend just as much on those qualified through apprenticeships as on those who go Baroness Crawley (Lab): MyLords,itisalwaysa on to university. The little-recognised success of this joy and a privilege to take part in this annual Women’s Government in this field is tremendous. Since 2009-10, Day debate. It always goes off in marvellous and the number of female apprenticeships has increased unpredictable directions. A by-product of today’s by a magnificent 70%. Within those numbers, those wonderful debate is a strong call for more memorial 397 Women: Economic Empowerment[LORDS] Women: Economic Empowerment 398

[BARONESS CRAWLEY] Our colleagues on the coalition Benches might say statues to women, including Sylvia Pankhurst. I underline to me, “Why so gloomy? Look, for instance at the my noble friend Lady Dean’s strong call for more number of women starting their own businesses in this recognition for the SOE women of the Second World country”. Indeed, we have heard powerful testimony War. I am delighted to report back to the House that from my noble friend Lady Howells about the challenges after our debate on the SOE women some years ago, for black women going into business on their own. we managed to raise a statue to those women in Yes, the good news is that, in 2014, 1.4 million women Tempsford, near the airfield that they flew out of in were self-employed in the UK. Let us rejoice at that. their highly dangerous missions. Much thanks goes to In the past five years, the number of self-employed Tazi Hussain, Tempsford Parish Council and His Royal women has increased by 34%. However, as the noble Highness Prince Charles, who unveiled it last year. Baroness, Lady Mobarik, has told us, the top three Despite much progress outlined very effectively by sectors for women going into self-employment are the noble Baroness, Lady Jolly, women’s equality in those golden oldies that we all know, and that do not the world today is as stable as Madonna’s footwear at have very much gold at the end of the rainbow: the O2 Arena last week. It is really not that gender cleaning, childminding and hairdressing. These are, of equality is so much unfinished business; it is that the course, important and necessary businesses, but businesses business has barely started to serve its worldwide that have not traditionally made a big impression on customers. As my noble friend Lady Gould said, in the pay gap. What more can the Minister tell us about December 2014, the highly respected World Economic the Government’s plans to assist women both financially Forum released its Global Gender Gap Report, showing and in terms of training to expand opportunities for that the UK had slipped from 18th to 26th in the those women wishing to go into self-employment in world for gender equality. Perhaps the Minister, when this country? she replies to the debate, couldshare with us what she Across the world, of course, the picture of women’s thinks about these worrying conclusions. participation in entrepreneurship varies markedly. Yes, of course there is the good news. As the World According to the 2012 figures by the Global Bank review recently stated, women’s participation in Entrepreneurship Monitor, the numbers range from the labour market globally has, since 1980, increased 1% of women in Pakistan to more than 40% of women sharply over time, at each level of income, showing in Zambia who are engaged in entrepreneurship activity. that more women are now engaged in economic activity Can the Minister tell the House what priority DfID gives outside the home than ever before. Indeed, here in the to the encouragement of women into self-employment, UK, in the last quarter of 2014, 68% of women aged globally? 16 to 64 were in employment. As the ONS put it, that The International Women’s Day theme this year is, number was, as has been said, “Make It Happen”. For us, that must “the highest since comparable records began in 1971”. mean making it happen for the most vulnerable women However, much of this, according to the House of in society. In the UK, according to the Resolution Lords Library, reflects the ongoing changes to the Foundation, one in four women are now earning less state pension age for women, resulting in fewer women than the living wage; many of those are in the caring retiring between the ages of 60 and 65. professions. Why has it not been possible for the There is also the bad news. Employment gaps globally Government to match Labour’s proposal to support between men and women continue to persist well into families on low pay by raising the minimum wage to the 21st century, as the ILO has emphasised in its £8, which would not only give 3.9 million low-paid recent data on the subject. It stated that: women a pay rise but make their place in the labour “Women continue to suffer from lower rates of employment, market far more stable? As a member of the rural task are less likely to participate in the labour force and face higher force that feeds into the Prime Minister’s challenge on risks of vulnerable employment”. dementia, I often engage with carers and managers. In the UK, too, as well as large gaps in access to While the proposed introduction of the care certificate employment between men and women—according to for newly appointed healthcare assistants and social the European Commission—there are also data from care workers is to be welcomed, the issue of low pay in Unite the union showing that the gender pay gap this caring sector, as has been pointed out by several between men and women in their 20s has doubled in noble Lords this afternoon, cannot be left to one side. the past three years and is on the rise between men and Such staff in this sector provide some of the most women in their 30s. This is becoming a youth problem. personal and fundamental support for people with On average, women are still earning just 81p for dementia—people who deserve the best possible care. every male pound, despite the 46 years that have In conclusion, if we are to continue working towards passed since the T&G women at Ford in Dagenham women’s economic empowerment, both at home and first went out on strike for equal pay and the 30 years abroad, the last thing this country needs is to come out that have passed since they finally achieved it. If we of the European Union. Farage is a feminist issue. The look at part-time working, taken up by 42% of all EU is not only the UK’s largest economic market, but working women in the UK, we see that it is an area also the body that helped established standards for where women earn more than one-third less than their working men and women on their rights at work. full-time equivalents. Does the Minister think that it is Having worked, many years ago, with colleagues to time that large companies were required by law to bring about the 1992 maternity leave directive from publish the average hourly pay of men and women in Europe, I would not want to see women in the UK lose their workforce to expose this continued pay gap? out on future rights at work through withdrawal from Many of us in this House certainly do. the European Union. 399 Women: Economic Empowerment[5 MARCH 2015] Women: Economic Empowerment 400

I hope Kathy Lette will forgive me if I steal one of in maths and science. That is a preposterous idea her jokes to make a point. She said that no wife ever according to the OECD. Its report is adamant that shot her husband while he was vacuuming the living there can be and is, room carpet. Be patient with me on this one, but “no biological reason for girls to do badly”, because of our membership of the EU today we can in science. Professor Brian Cox, whom we see on say—perhaps less pithily—that no wife ever shot her television frequently, was also reported by the Sunday husband while he was on paid paternity leave. In other Times as saying that girls are for the United Kingdom, words of course, progress has been made both nationally science and the economy, and internationally. We all recognise that in this House “a great reservoir of untapped talent”— today. However, the work must be relentlessly pursued but why untapped? nationally and internationally. The article quotes a lady who read engineering at Cambridge 35 years ago, when she was indeed one of 3.30 pm the very few women reading engineering there. She Lord Watson of Richmond (LD): My Lords, I suppose, apparently said in this report that she thought not on the arithmetic of the noble Baroness, Lady Perry, I much had changed. I am afraid that I must disagree am the seventh of the brave men to have participated with that. Certainly, engineering at Cambridge is an in this debate, and—looking at the speakers list—the extraordinary story. It is now the largest department last. It has been a very good debate, as indeed was the in the whole university. As many people know, it is led debate last year. If I may say so, I particularly enjoyed by Dame Ann Dowling, who is an outstanding engineer the speech by the noble Baroness, Lady Greenfield. It and very successful businesswoman. The numbers made many important points. I declare an interest as registering for engineering in Cambridge are quite the high steward of Cambridge University. Although decisive. The numbers of women now reading mechanical some of the noble Baroness’s remarks related specifically engineering have risen by 18% in the recent period and to Oxford, they had resonance with me and the Cambridge in electrical engineering by 27%. In both cases, these experience. Incidentally, she made reference to the percentage increases are much greater than those recorded L’Oreal scholarships. I heard only this afternoon that by men. the scholarships this year include a presentation to The House of Lords committee that recently reported Dame Carol Robinson, professor of chemistry at Oxford on the UK’s digital future clarified the issues involved University.She came out top of the poll on a Europe-wide a lot further. That report is also alarming. The committee judgment, not just in terms of the UK. That is excellent. found that increasing the number of women working In 2003, a long time ago, there was the World Bank in information technology could generate an extra report on gender equality. I should just like to read its £2.6 billion each year—good for the UK, good for conclusion: growth—but the facts are that less than 30% of this country’s IT workforce is female. Women make up “Gender inequality, which remains pervasive worldwide, tends to lower the productivity of labor and the efficiency of labor only 6% of the engineering workforce, despite what I allocation in households and the economy, intensifying the unequal said about Cambridge, and only 15.5% of the STEM distribution of resources. It also contributes to the non-monetary workforce. Then, there is an extraordinary statistic. Of aspects of poverty—lack of security, opportunity and empowerment the 4,000 students taking computer science at A-level, —that lower the quality of life for both men and women. While fewer than 100 are girls. Why is that? women and girls bear the largest and most direct costs of these inequalities, the costs cut broadly across society, ultimately hindering The key conclusion seems to be that girls are development and poverty reduction”. disheartened because they see STEM occupations as Well, here we are in 2015, being invited in this good male dominated—which of course they are. Another debate to, finding is that some feel that the subjects are boring compared with social studies, arts studies, history of “take note of women’s economic empowerment and the progress art studies, education and design. If you read Country in achieving it that has been made in the United Kingdom and internationally”. Life—in many ways a most excellent magazine—you will see that it features a full-page photograph each We have heard a number of excellent examples of real week of eligible young ladies soon to be married. They progress. However, I want to strike a slightly different all have daunting names. However, if you read the note. Progress has been made but, depending on how small print under the glamorous photographs, it is we measure it, there are still many very alarming signs. striking that, overwhelmingly, those depicted above In February, the Sunday Times covered an OECD are described as having or studying for degrees in report which highlighted one critical area for the United subjects such as art history, social studies or other soft Kingdom and its comparison internationally. It makes subjects. I think Country Life has the wrong role gloomy reading. When it comes to the performance of models, though I was glad to see that in the current girls in the UK in the sciences, edition the lady concerned is apparently reading biology. “we have one of the biggest gender gaps in the world”. That is something. Not only is Britain, and business in The OECD report identified that of the 67 countries Britain, wasting a huge talent pool; so many individuals measured by the internationally recognised PISA tests, are denying themselves opportunities, intellectual the UK was in the bottom five, just above Colombia fulfilment and, of course, superior financial rewards. and equal with Costa Rica. PISA focused on the 13% There is one further dimension, well expressed in difference in science between boys and girls in the UK, this House of Lords digital report. If IT is our second compared with an average 1% difference across the industrial revolution, sadly, it will not replicate Britain’s 67 countries. That raises the question, and other people commanding lead in the first. As one witness expressed have raised it, whether girls are inherently less competent it to the committee: 401 Women: Economic Empowerment[LORDS] Women: Economic Empowerment 402

[LORD WATSON OF RICHMOND] prosecutions. To oppose this extremist ideology is not “The kind of innovation we are getting relies on the whole on to be in any way anti-Muslim. I know many Muslim young men with narrow engineering degrees thinking about the women who are opposed to these inequalities and to future … If we want a creative industry, we need a diverse this terrible kind of ideology. I am referring to an workforce”. international committee which many Members of your Creativity, as we all know, is the key to a competitive Lordships’ House have supported from time to time. future. Let us also recognise, while congratulating The committee concerned is mostly made up of refugees, ourselves on some progress that has been made, that mostly from Iran, and is led by a woman, Maryam the greater involvement of women in the STEM industries Rajavi, who is based in France. The campaign is for is crucial to this country’s competitive survival and equality. Again, you have to admire the women who, success. in a culture that is certainly not pro-women, are 3.40 pm campaigning and continue to campaign for equality. I and others have supported them and continue to do Baroness Turner of Camden (Lab): My Lords, I so. It is right that on a day such as this we should say thank the noble Baroness, Lady Jolly, for introducing that these are the people we should support—the this debate—and for the manner in which she did so. people who are in difficult circumstances but nevertheless Today, it is appropriate to celebrate what has been struggle and campaign for equality. achieved by previous generations of women, their courage and their persistence. Of course, much remains Again, I thank the noble Baroness, Lady Jolly, for to be done and we have been reminded of that in the introducing this debate and all the women who have marvellous debate that we have had this afternoon. participated. We can all very well support what they have said to us. We say there should be more attention One hundred years ago, women did not have the paid to women who need support. We have to press vote. It took campaigns and much suffering, including ahead with our campaign in the way that we have done terms in prison, before that was eventually achieved. It —and we will continue to do so. pains me when I hear some young women say that they will not vote and to hear them oppose any form of political involvement. We should remind people 3.45 pm that equal pay was achieved in law in this country by Baroness Uddin (Non-Afl): My Lords, I apologise women’s organisations—and after the wonderful women to my noble friend Lady Turner for standing in her place. employed by the Ford Motor Company came out on As a Member of the House of Lords on 8 March 1999 strike for it and eventually achieved it in law; although, and as the first woman, I believe, to call, very of course, we have heard today that far too many unfashionably, for a debate on International Women’s women are still working in low-paid employment. We Day, I feel deep pride at taking part in this now well should be proud of the fact we live in a welfare society. established honourable practice of celebrating women’s Child benefit, maternity leave and other provisions advancement to mark International Women’s Day. have all been achieved as a result of campaigns mostly I am speaking in the gap to make two points. First, organised by women and their unions. if the definition of economic empowerment is the In this context, I recall a Member of this House ability to make decisions and make things happen, who sadly died recently and was referred to by the then, despite much of the progress rightly noted by noble Baroness, Lady Jolly, in her introduction: Baroness noble Lords, we have giant leaps yet to take. As some Platt of Writtle, who was the chair of the Equal of the most powerful and respected women leaders Opportunities Commission at a time when I was a present in your Lordships’ House will know, economic member. She was herself an engineer at a time when emancipation and opportunity remain far out of reach it was not thought a suitable occupation for women. for the majority of Asian women lying at the wrong She campaigned for what was known as the WISE end of the statistics regarding employment, education campaign—Women into Science and Engineering—by and political participation. Too many minority women the Equal Opportunities Commission. We had some lack opportunities for mainstream lives and economic success. We went around, talking to schools and to empowerment. I am truly impatient about the pace of parents to try to persuade them that training in science change. How do the Government intend to bridge the and engineering was a suitable career for women. I gap between women and women of colour, as referred must admit that, following the campaign that was to by my noble friend Lady Howells, who after all are introduced, women have emerged in science and in also citizens? engineering in a way that would not have been possible My second point is about violence against women. without our campaign. A great deal was owed to the In many regions in the past 50 years, women’s status leadership we had from the Baroness Platt of Writtle. has improved markedly, but violence against women There is another development that bothers me greatly and girls remains a global phenomenon that historically and I feel I should refer to it: the recent disappearance has been, and indeed still is, hidden, ignored and of young girls—aged 15 and 16—to join the Islamists accepted in many parts of the world. Child sexual in Syria. The newspapers say that around 60 young abuse has remained a silent shame. Rape is often a women have made a similar trip. Do they realise what matter of stigma for the victim rather than the perpetrator. they are doing? The ideology that they are joining Violence in the home is still considered domestic, treats women not as individuals at all and as not despite being a crime. The full extent of the abuse of entitled to any kind of human rights. The extremist children within our own institutions and across our culture involves FGM—female genital mutilation. communities is slowly unfolding, while multiple, differing Although we have made it against the law in this forms of violence around the world have become ever country, there still have not been any successful more difficult to counteract. 403 Women: Economic Empowerment[5 MARCH 2015] Women: Economic Empowerment 404

No magic wand will eliminate violence against women disproportionately advantage women in their overseas and girls, but evidence tells us that changes in attitudes programmes yet disproportionately disadvantage women and behaviours are possible, and can be achieved in their domestic programmes? There is an avalanche within less than a generation if we are certain in our of data showing that the coalition Government are determination to root it out. It requires many responses, doing domestically exactly what they decry internationally. but one is to provide adequate funding, including Instead of following the common-sense strategy of for refuges in the UK and globally, through our inter- putting money into women’s pockets, which everyone national development funds, particularly to encourage here, including government Ministers, has supported, Governments to support women raped in conflicts the Government have systematically taken money out and wars, as the Bangladeshi Government are doing. of women’s pockets. Independent research from the Violence against women and girls is not just another House of Commons Library shows that, over the women’s issue; it is a public health and development course of this Parliament, a staggering 85% of cash matter of concern to all. Its elimination should be part raised from tax and benefits changes has come straight of the post-2015 sustainable development goals, just from women’s pockets, a figure that was quoted by the as the elimination of apartheid was an important goal right reverend Prelate. Eighty-five per cent is a truly of the 1970s and 1980s for the world community. staggering figure. That is not all: according to the I add my tribute to that of the noble Baroness, respected Institute for Fiscal Studies, the group hardest Lady Brinton, to the work of Grameen and its impact hit by the coalition Government’s choices are families on women’s economic empowerment. I also draw the with children. attention of the House to the remarkable work of Sadly, the Government’s choices are not delivering Sir Fazle Abed and BRAC—the largest NGO in the women’s economic empowerment; quite the opposite, world, operating from Bangladesh in 69 countries—and they are not benefiting women and children. The its 43-year programme of economic empowerment of Government’s own figures show that, for example, in women in Bangladesh. It is an amazing example to the terms of some of its reform policies and benefits, world and offers an effective model for the empowerment two-thirds of those hit by the bedroom tax are women. of women entrepreneurs. It is easy to go on. The majority of those on zero-hours contracts, which the Government refuse to ban, are 3.50 pm women. The majority of those earning the minimum Baroness King of Bow (Lab): The message today, on wage are women. While Labour will increase that International Women’s Day 2015, is on “Empowering minimum wage to £8 per hour, the Government will women”. I, too, congratulate the noble Baroness, Lady not. The Government will not listen to their own Jolly, on securing this important debate. Empowering advice on increasing women’s incomes, and the women means giving them the practical tools to escape Government package this ongoing wealth transfer poverty and prejudice. Around the world, including away from women as benefits reform, deregulation, here in Britain, a baby girl’s life chances are disadvantaged cutting red tape, liberalising the labour market or in comparison to her brother’s at almost every turn, value for money. The point is that either the Government and once she becomes a woman the disadvantage do not undertake gender impact assessments or they becomes entrenched. ignore them. The noble Baroness, Lady Jolly, opened the debate So here are five key changes the Government could by giving examples of how investing in women yields make immediately that would transform women’s lives. radically better results than investing in men. The First, close the gender gap, increase the minimum noble Baroness, Lady Gould, gave the example of how wage to £8 per hour and ban exploitative zero-hours spending £1 on vulnerable women here in the UK contracts. Secondly, improve maternity and paternity saves £3.57 later on. The noble Baroness, Lady Brinton, provision and provide affordable childcare, because, as quoted Kofi Annan on this point, who has said that Ministers will be aware, under this Government childcare there was no more effective tool in development than costs have increased 30%. Thirdly, do far more to investment in women. The right reverend Prelate the protect women from violence, most often sexual violence. Bishop of Derby quoted Goldman Sachs to show Again, the facts are shocking: despite a rise in reported scientifically that investing in women benefits society rapes, prosecutions for rape are down 14%. Fourthly, economically. Indeed, the many noble Lords who spoke give women the power to challenge discrimination. powerfully about the international development aspect Face facts: since the Government introduced tribunal of this debate, including the noble Baronesses, Lady fees—and this is one of the saddest statistics of all—claims Bottomley and Lady Hussein-Ece, and my noble friends for sex discrimination have fallen by 91%. It is not Lady Armstrong and Lord Boateng, all said that we possible to put a price on justice and not realise that must invest in women. It is fantastic that there is no that price will be paid, and here it is clearly being paid disagreement; there is complete cross-party consensus by women. Fifthly, empower the next generation: stop that we must do that. From the government Minister channelling girls into low-paid work. So much of this to former Cabinet Ministers on both sides of this is bound up with cultural barriers, as illustrated by the House to every Back-Bencher, everyone is agreed on noble Baronesses, Lady Greenfield, Lady Brady, Lady the clear, indisputable fact that investing in women Rebuck, Lady Perry, Lady Kidron, Lady Mobarik boosts the economy and benefits society. and Lady Crawley, among others. I am sorry I cannot I applaud those international development mention every single Peer in this debate—although I programmes funded by this Government, some of am doing my best. Also, my noble friends Lady Howells which the noble Baroness, Lady Jolly, outlined, that and Lady Uddin raised the point of the obstacles invest in women. My question is: why do the Government facing BAME women. 405 Women: Economic Empowerment[LORDS] Women: Economic Empowerment 406

[BARONESS KING OF BOW] wage to £8 per hour. I understand; it is a different What everyone is saying is “Give girls and women a world view—fine. However, pay transparency does not level playing field”, and this theme was taken up by cost anything, and it really is unforgivable not to bring IMF managing director Christine Lagarde. The IMF it in. As Asha, the ex-director of the investment bank is not known for its bleeding-heart liberalism. Christine who got the money back by taking legal action, said: Lagarde says that nations should remove laws that “Why would turkeys vote for Christmas? Transparency has to prevent women from working in order to increase the be legally enforced, with repercussions for not doing so”. female labour supply and boost economies. She says: “In too many countries, too many legal restrictions conspire Possibly my favourite example is Shannon, 25, who against women to be economically active. In a world in search of works in advertising, and whose end-of-year bonus growth”— was a £100 Liberty voucher. Guess what her male and that is our holy grail, as we all want growth— equivalent got in the same job as an end-of-year “women will help find it, if they face a level playing field instead bonus. He did not get a £100 Liberty voucher—he got of an insidious conspiracy”. £2,000 hard cash. Those examples of blatant pay Here in the UK we do not have an insidious conspiracy; discrimination are going on right now, today, this we have insidious complacency. This brings me to our hour, this minute, in Britain, and we have a way to very own gender pay gap. I will focus the majority of remedy them. my remarks on this subject, not because it is the single I will mention only one more example—there are most important subject, but it is the single most important so many others. Donna, 38, was a PR director from issue we are debating today that will be up for a vote in Yorkshire. She explained: this House next week. I hope your Lordships will understand why I focus my remarks in this area. “I landed a job at a PR firm in London. After a year I was promoted to account manager and at this point they employed I want to highlight the campaign begun by Harriet another account manager to work alongside me, with the same Harman and Gloria De Piero and taken up magnificently amount of experience. The only difference? He was a bloke. I was by the women’s magazine Grazia on pay transparency stunned when over lunch he told me”, and closing the pay gap. Since Grazia launched this he was earning over 30% more than her. Donna campaign, it has heard from countless women who are approached her bosses for a rise but still did not get paid less simply because of their gender. One told how enough to match her male colleague’s salary. She she managed to create a department at an ad agency. says—and I would really like noble Lords to understand Looking at the salary information, she was staggered the implication of this— to see an obvious wage differential between the male and the female employees. Another woman described “I know I could have sued for sex discrimination, but I didn’t her horror at discovering that the man who was employed want to rock the boat so early in my career. All I wanted was to be to take over on her maternity leave was paid more paid fairly”. than her. When she confronted her boss about this, she That is the point. Women are not asking for charity. was told that the man—who, incidentally, was less They are just asking not to be blatantly, systematically qualified than her—was paid more because he had to discriminated against just because they are women. support his family. Therefore I ask the government Benches opposite: Ellie, 36 years old, a former investment banker, what are they going to do to deliver the pay transparency discovered she was getting paid £5,000 less than a that would help all those women and hundreds of male colleague only when he let this slip himself. Ellie thousands like them, up and down the country? When says: the amendment on pay transparency comes up next “We were identical in performance, age, level, experience, week, so ably championed by my noble friend Lady everything. Even he supposed we were paid the same ... I confronted Thornton and others in this House, including my my boss, but he warned me that pay was confidential and couldn’t be discussed. I’d already been given a higher offer by a rival bank, noble friend Lady Crawley, who will they side with? so I offered my resignation there and then”. Will they side with Donna, Asha, Shannon and Ellie, Asha, 55, ex-director of an investment bank, long who have been discriminated against just because they suspected her pay was not keeping up with that of her are women, or will they side—as they are currently male colleagues, but she could not get her bosses to saying they will—with the employers who refuse to admit the difference, let alone begin to redress the pay them the same just because they are women? It is a balance. simple choice. “They would insist I was at the top of my pay grade, and tell I make no apology for getting quite angry about me to keep it up, but despite working harder and longer than my this. It is a scandal. What is more, it is a scandal that male counterparts, my pay plateaued”. the Government could right, and do so fairly easily. It took her £60,000 and 16 months to reach an out-of- We are the people who have a voice in Parliament; court settlement with her former employer. That is Donna, Asha, Shannon and Ellie do not have a voice time and money most women just do not have. here. As my noble friends Lady Crawley and Lady Those are the women, the 91% drop, who cannot Dean said, we have that voice and we need to make bring these claims anymore, so women’s ability to that change. The vote is next Wednesday; the amendment achieve economic empowerment is being cut away to the Small Business, Enterprise and Employment from under them. That is why transparency is the Bill would implement Section 78 of the Equality Act 2010, answer—and, incidentally, a very cheap answer. I which enables the Government to make regulations understand why Members on the Benches opposite requiring companies employing 250 people or more to probably do not agree with our view, in the Official publish information on the differences in pay between Opposition, that we should increase the minimum men and women. Granted, that is the very beginning—it 407 Women: Economic Empowerment[5 MARCH 2015] Women: Economic Empowerment 408 would not help women who work in smaller companies, to improve. Those speeches show that you cannot some of whose cases I just mentioned—but it is a disentangle economic empowerment and place it neatly start. in a box. The least that we could do is empower It is 44 years since the Equal Pay Act was passed, women and pay them the same as we pay men. and here we have clear evidence that the law is being broken, day in, day out, to the detriment not just of 4.07 pm women but, by the Government’s own logic, of our Baroness Garden of Frognal (LD): My Lords, the economy as well. How much longer do we want to debates in the House of Lords for International Women’s wait? I echo the comments of my noble friend Lord Day are always outstanding, and this has been no Graham of Edmonton, who said that we should be exception. proud of the progress we have made—and we have made incredible progress. I remember that when I As the noble Baroness, Lady Crawley, said, it has think of my grandmother, who was the auntie of gone off in wonderful directions. I was pleased that Uncle Ted, as I call my noble friend Lord Graham—he the noble Baroness, Lady King, said that there was is my mum’s first cousin. His auntie and my gran—being clear agreement on much that was mentioned in the one and the same woman—worked in a cigarette debate, although she then seemed to go off in another factory. Jenny left school at 13 and worked in a cigarette direction. factory. Do noble Lords know what her job was? It I am delighted to attempt to respond to contributions was picking cigarettes off the conveyor belt at intervals which have covered a very wide range of topics and and dragging on them to check whether they were themes from both men and women. Any hope of dragging properly—literally, the definition of a dead-end ending gender inequality will be achieved only with job. the active involvement of men. The noble Baroness, I know that we have made progress and I am Lady Greenfield, the right reverend Prelate the Bishop grateful for everything that the Labour Party has done of Derby, my noble friend Lord Storey and others in this regard—it has been predominantly the Labour spoke of men as being the agents of change for gender Party which has done this—but the Government have equality. At the 20th anniversary of the Beijing Platform done some things here and there as well. I admit that I for Action, the UN will mark the HeForShe campaign. cannot think of any off the top of my head, but the My personal experience mirrors that of some other Government will have done some things because, to be speakers. My noble friend Lady Perry spoke of our fair, all of us in this House think that the instances of mothers being on these Benches. I was reminded that clear pay discrimination that I have just described are my mother achieved a first at Cambridge in the 1930s, unacceptable. but never became a graduate. It was not until 1948 On this issue, I appeal to the noble Baroness, that Cambridge accepted that its women students Lady Jenkin, who described her family’s extraordinary were members of the university and awarded them heritage in championing women’s rights. The noble degrees. What is more, she had to resign from the Civil Baroness’s grandparents would surely have been dismayed Service as soon as she married. to see such blatant sex discrimination going unchecked. I was at Oxford in the 1960s when, as the noble Perhaps the noble Baroness could champion this issue. Baroness, Lady Armstrong, said, only 6% to 7% of I appeal to the noble Baroness, Lady Bottomley, who people went to university, and at Oxbridge there were surely has the clout—I know that she has the decency—to seven times as many places for men as for women. This get the Government to make this simple change. was a feature of the single-sex college set-up. Our The noble Baroness said that our job is to make life university careers office advised women who might get much better for other women. I appeal to the noble married that teaching or secretarial work would be Baroness, Lady Brady, who said that our job is to give sound futures to consider. For me, who married an women the tools. This is the point; pay transparency RAF officer, that was definitely not a route to economic is just a tool. It is not even a case of giving women empowerment, but I have never for one moment regretted any money, but it is giving them a tool. It is not my marriage. As the noble Baroness, Lady Nye, said, charity and it is not expensive. Surely, those on the we were the wife division of the human race. Astonishingly, government Benches have a teeny bit of influence in no one suggested that we might aspire to be a football this area—a smidgen, a soupçon, a crumb. Not a club CEO. My noble friend Lady Brady has chosen a single Member opposite can consider that what is challenging career in which her talents and hard work going on is acceptable. have led to great achievement, and she has totally In summary, I ask the Minister only two questions. ignored glass ceilings, quotas and targets. These days, I do not expect her to answer the first, but I would be equal numbers of men and women go to university, sincerely grateful if she would answer the second. and no careers office would last long offering women First, how can it be right to push money into women’s the narrow set of options that we were offered. pockets overseas but take money out of women’s Looking to education, many doors have been opened pockets at home? Secondly, will the Minister agree to but there are still barriers to be overcome. I pay tribute lobby the Government to make a concession and to the right reverend Prelate and the church for all that support pay transparency next week in this House? It it does in education in this country. How exciting it is clear that women’s economic empowerment is was to have in this House the Bill on women bishops, intertwined with their social, psychological, physical which is going to fast-track women on to the Bishops’ and cultural empowerment. I am sorry that I have not Benches. I am not sure how far the role brings economic commented on all the fantastic speeches that touched empowerment, but I am sure that spiritual empowerment on the cultural and educational aspects that we need should be equally valuable. 409 Women: Economic Empowerment[LORDS] Women: Economic Empowerment 410

[BARONESS GARDEN OF FROGNAL] over the years, helped to empower and educate women, Too many girls feel that their career options are and encourage them to take up interests much wider limited because of stereotypes about jobs being more than they found at home. suitable for boys or girls. We heard that from my noble Even in the field of education, women are less likely friends Lady Mobarik, Lord Storey, Lady Perry and to be in positions of authority, as head teachers, Lady Evans, and the noble Baroness, Lady Greenfield. principals, professors or vice-chancellors. My noble This can start from a very young age. In an experiment friend Lady Bottomley lamented the shortage of women in the United States, primary school children were vice-chancellors. The latest data show that 20% of asked to draw pictures of a scientist before and after a vice-chancellors are female. That, my friends, is up visit to a lab. In the “before” drawings none of the from 17% two years ago. So there we are; there has boys and only 36% of the girls depicted a scientist as a been meteoric improvement. We believe that sector female. In the “after” drawings, although, interestingly, should go much further to seek out and harness the still none of the boys depicted a scientist as female, for diverse talent available. HEFCE, the Higher Education girls there was a 58% increase in female scientist Funding Council for England, is continuing its active representation. There is much research showing that programme to try to identify senior managers from aspirations are indeed formed at a relatively young more diverse groups. In the world of work more age, and that gendered influences in particular begin generally, women’s strengths and skills remain an untapped very early. A recent Ofsted report found that girls as resource. young as seven and eight thought of conventionally I turn to employment and enterprise. We have been stereotypical jobs for men and women. This is one berated about the measurement which showed that the reason why it is so important that we get careers UK had plummeted down the gender gap ladder to advice and people from business and the outside world number 26. That was based on a particular set of into schools for the very earliest ages. measures. It does not represent the gender pay gap as Expanding the apprenticeship programme and it stands in the UK. That is now at 19.1%, the lowest improving careers advice help to open the eyes of level ever, and the pay gap has been virtually eliminated young women to options and aspirations that they among full-time workers under the age of 40. may not have considered—or, if they did, considered them inaccessible. We have heard of the programmes to raise girls’ aspirations, and to encourage them to Baroness King of Bow: Does the Minister, however, study STEM subjects and pursue careers in science accept, from some of the examples I just gave, that and engineering. I am glad to hear that my noble there are many unreported instances of the pay gap— friend Lady Perry’s glass was half full, and to hear my including those brought to light by campaigns such noble friend Lord Watson affirm that girls are not as that of Grazia magazine—where it appears that biologically wired not to be able to do maths and professional women are quite often earning 30% less science. The noble Baroness, Lady Greenfield, spoke than their male counterparts? with great expertise and wisdom in STEM subjects, and I join her and the noble Baroness, Lady Turner, in Baroness Garden of Frognal: I agree that there are recalling Baroness Platt and all she did for WISE—Women cases of that in women’s earnings, and that women are in to Science and Engineering—a fantastic programme still bearing the greater responsibility for children, the that continues to help young women. home and the care of sick and elderly relatives. However, Compared to 2010, a thousand more girls are studying we are encouraging much greater transparency in the physics at A-level every year and two thousand more reporting of pay. I will not be lured into pre-empting are studying maths, but they are still too few. As the my noble friend the Minister next week, when the noble Baroness, Lady Greenfield, said, we need to amendment on transparency of pay comes up. Rest open up the thrill of science to get more young people assured, however, that the Government have done a engaged in the excitement of it. There have been 1,260 great deal and have taken practical measures to ensure new science-based apprenticeships since 2010. Again, equal opportunity, whether it be in Parliament, among we are getting there but they are too few. The STEM judges and editors, or on boards. However, as the right Ambassadors programme is a network of 28,000 reverend Prelate also said, women very often take jobs volunteers, of whom 47% are women, who work with below their qualification level, which is another feature women to encourage science uptake. Organisations of the lower pay that women may receive. Very often it such as Athena SWAN do excellent work in trying to is part-time pay, which is one of the factors that encourage this, too. influenced the OECD measurement—it was factoring The Government are setting up a new employer-led in part-time pay as if it was full-time pay. careers and enterprise company to support greater My noble friend Lady Jenkin has spoken of the engagement between employers, schools and colleges. Women2Win initiative and the initiatives of all political As my noble friends Lady Brady and Lady Brinton parties to encourage more women and ethnic minorities pointed out, it is important to change the culture of into the political field. It is particularly important that the workplace. We have just launched Your Daughter’s the other place is fully representative of the country. It Future, an online guide to help parents support their is, in fact, the most diverse Parliament ever. Women daughters through qualification and career choices. represent 22.8% of current MPs. That is up from We are working with the media to tackle gender 19.5% in 2010. With the efforts of all parties to promote stereotypes and improve diversity of representation. I women and to mentor and help them into Parliament, also salute, with the noble Baroness, Lady Dean, we can hope only that the next election will see even “Woman’s Hour” and other programmes that have, more women coming into Parliament. 411 Women: Economic Empowerment[5 MARCH 2015] Women: Economic Empowerment 412

We set ourselves an ambitious aspiration that by combine their caring responsibilities with work. The the end of Parliament at least half of all new appointees noble Baroness, Lady Dean, and others referred to made to the boards of public bodies will be women. these essential workers’ low pay, but we have just We are getting there. From April to September 2014, begun a £1.5 million project to help local businesses the percentage of public appointments given to women support more carers to work remotely from home across all departments increased from 37% to 44%. through the use of assisted technology. However, the noble Baroness, Lady Rebuck, and my We have done a great deal for women in this coalition noble friends Lady Brady and Lady Bottomley, all Government. We have lifted 1.1 million of the lowest-paid talked about the FTSE 100. The percentage of women workers out of income tax altogether, more than half on FTSE 100 boards has been climbing steadily. Women of whom are women. We have also increased child tax now account for around 23% of FTSE 100 directors credits for low to middle-income families. We have and over 17.4% of FTSE 250 board directors. The introduced shared parental leave and the right to request numbers, therefore, are going up: they are still small flexible working. To tackle the concern that parents but we are seeing progress. Furthermore, the Women’s have about their children getting the right start, we Business Council, in its recent report, has made have invested a record £7.5 billion pupil premium in recommendations to both the Government and the education to help the poorest children get the boost business community. Those recommendations are being they need. implemented and will go some way, we hope, to promoting better equality. The noble Baroness, Lady Kidron, had thought- provoking words on the impact of motherhood on We have seen some progress in the City of London, careers, especially within the arts. We all noted her the financial hub of the country. Last year only the concern about the lack of women in such specialisms second woman in over 800 years became Lord Mayor as film directing. Given how well the UK does in the of London. Dame Fiona Woolf brought distinction creative fields, it would be good to see women represented to the post as she travelled around the country, and across those fields too. the world, promoting UK plc and, indeed, women’s contribution to the world of work. The other key The cost of childcare was also mentioned. We now historic roles within the Corporation of London are have tax-free childcare supporting childcare costs for those of the two sheriffs, where only five women have working families. That can be worth up to £2,000 per held office since the 12th century, three of them within child per year, to be introduced in autumn 2015. the last five years. The noble and learned Baroness, A number of noble Lords mentioned violence against Lady Scotland, has just become one of the few women women. The noble Baroness, Lady Gould, linked it to aldermen in the City. So the pace is quickening. homelessness. We acknowledge that women facing Staying with the City, key to education and training violence need support to rebuild their lives and to for work have been the livery companies. There are become economically independent. The Government now 110 of them, some dating back to the medieval have announced a £10 million fund to support women’s guilds. Over all the centuries, the number of lady refuges in 100 areas across England. I also note her masters, of whom I have been one and my noble friend comments on joining up the services so that people do Lady Byford another, has been just over 100. not fall through gaps between different forms of support My noble friend Lady Mobarik spoke of the services. We have ring-fenced nearly £40 million of importance of enterprise. Indeed, there is enormous funding for specialist support services and brought in potential in women’s untapped entrepreneurialism. The legislation for tougher enforcement. This includes laws noble Baroness, Lady Howells, who has been a champion to combat stalking, to enforce the protection of girls in this area, reminded us of the contribution of black from female genital mutilation and to make forced women in business. The noble Baroness, Lady Uddin, marriage a crime in this country. As we seek to combat mentioned this too. Indeed, we recently held a summit the oldest of challenges, so we are acting to tackle the for black and minority ethnic women entrepreneurs, new ones and treating the online abuse of women and chaired by my noble friend Lady Verma, a successful girls as robustly as offline abuse. entrepreneur herself, which highlighted the immense I turn to the international dimension of this achievements of the community but also some of the debate, on which we had a great many contributions. I challenges that it still faces. We shall continue to apologise if I may not be able to refer to them all. My support and encourage the talents of BAME women. noble friend Lady Brinton and the noble Baroness, Nevertheless, we can celebrate the fact there are now Lady Uddin, mentioned Grameen Bank, which has more women-led businesses than ever before: 20% of reversed conventional banking practice; 97% of its small and medium-sized enterprises are run either by customers are women. It is doing great work to enable women or by a team that is more than 50% female. and empower women to go into business. On microfinance, These women contribute around £82 billion gross value access to finance for women is a core priority for added to the UK economy.The Government are supporting DfID. We have exceeded one of the departmental them in myriad ways, for instance by providing £1.6 million results targets, access for 18 million women by 2015, to support rural women’s businesses, by providing with 27 million accessing finance in 2014. DfID’s £1 million to the women and broadband challenge programmes for microfinance around the world have fund to help women move their businesses online, and a focus on savings, especially for women in rural by investing £1.9 million in the Get Mentoring project. areas. As a number of noble Lords have said, it makes The amount of time that women spent on care all the difference in the world, particularly in came up in a number of contributions. Carers are the underdeveloped countries, if women are enabled to go unsung heroes of society. We are helping them to into business. 413 Women: Economic Empowerment[LORDS] Transport: Accident Prevention 414

[BARONESS GARDEN OF FROGNAL] and we just hope that we will see improvements. The On fuel and water poverty, which my noble friend noble Baroness, Lady Goudie, mentioned Yarl’s Wood. Lady Hussein-Ece and the noble Lord, Lord Boateng, I assure her that steps are certainly being taken to mentioned, my noble friend Lady Northover and other ensure that those vulnerable women are treated with DfID Ministers have led an 18-month campaign on the due care and consideration that they deserve, often clean energy access for girls and women. We support having come here with some absolutely hideous programmes to improve technology and to increase experiences in other countries. It is perhaps notable access to affordable and clean energy sources. that the noble Baronesses, Lady Rebuck and Lady The noble Lord, Lord Boateng, also mentioned Brinton, my noble friend Lady Brady and others how Ebola affects women more, because it is women spoke of the importance of instilling confidence in who care. DfID is indeed supporting two local NGOs women. Even this generation of young women do not in Sierra Leone through Womankind Worldwide and seem to have the confidence of their male counterparts. Women’s Partnership for Justice and Peace, specifically It is important to encourage girls to do things, as my to address the Ebola impact on girls. I note his remark noble friend Lady Hussein-Ece said, and to instil in that men tend not to listen to women until it is too late. them that there is nothing they cannot do if they really I hope we will make sure that it is not too late. set their minds to it. A number of noble Lords mentioned social norms I apologise that I am out of time and have missed and culture, including the noble Baroness, Lady answering some of the issues that were raised, but I Armstrong, and my noble friend Lady Hussein-Ece. shall write to noble Lords on issues to which I have The noble Baroness, Lady Armstrong, relayed just not had the chance to respond. I would like to note how transformative her VSO experience had been in that many older women were trail-blazers in their Kenya, finding a completely different culture and way time, and I acknowledge, if I may, with due deference of life. One of my daughters went off to Lesotho for a in your Lordships’ House, that such people as the year after she graduated and found it an absolutely noble Baronesses, Lady Turner and Lady Trumpington, transformative experience 20 years ago in a land where both hit through glass ceilings in their time in ways the need and level of living was so completely different that we of our generation can only begin to imagine. from anything in the UK and the developed world. I hope that I have made clear the Government’s My noble friend Lady Bottomley also spoke powerfully determination to everything in our power to transform of the difference between women in the UK and the rights and opportunities available to women and women in other parts of the world. The right reverend girls in the UK and overseas. This has been a most Prelate mentioned the work of Christian Aid, which insightful, stimulating and informative debate, which has such importance and has had such an impact on will play its part in driving forward the gender equality underdeveloped countries. My noble friend Lady Jenkin that we all need to see. It will benefit women, families, referred to family planning, proper maternity care and communities and nations. I thank very sincerely all health for women. That, of course, can have an enormous noble Lords who have taken part. impact on women’s lives in these countries. Motion agreed. We have put women and girls at the centre of our development efforts. We should be proud that last week we passed a Bill to put into legislation a target of Transport: Accident Prevention spending on overseas aid of at least 0.7% of national Question for Short Debate income. We hope that our efforts will enable women to exercise voice, choice and control, which are critical to 4.30 pm ending poverty and building freer and fairer societies. Asked by Earl Attlee The noble Baroness, Lady Kidron, spoke of the challenge of sex work. To ask Her Majesty’s Government what steps they are taking to use, and to encourage the Baroness King of Bow: My Lords, will the Minister development of, technologies to reduce the number give way? of collisions between heavy goods vehicles and cyclists. Earl Attlee (Con): My Lords, the House will be Baroness Garden of Frognal: I am running out of aware that, every year in London, there are several time. I apologise but I cannot give way as I have only a cyclist fatalities involving HGVs and that these accidents couple of minutes and want to finish quickly. often occur at relatively low speeds. These are extremely We hope that putting more work and effort into distressing incidents for all concerned, not least because businesses for young women will help them to avoid of the gross disparity in vulnerability. I have been first going into sex work. The noble Baroness, Lady Nye, on the scene on one occasion and witnessed a near mentioned the Stand Up for Girls campaign, which miss on another. has been so important. My noble friend the Minister, his department and I will touch on one or two other issues. The noble Transport for London take these accidents very seriously. Baroness, Lady Healy, spoke about women offenders, When one occurs, TfL does not just place another which is an enormously important area. I am afraid appropriately coloured sticker on the map. It takes it that I cannot possibly do justice to it now, but the very personally and understands the effect on the Government are mindful that we need to have more families, friends and all concerned. The House will financial information within prisons and more support also recognise that, for every fatality, there are also when women come out of prison. It is on the radar numerous serious and life-changing injuries. 415 Transport: Accident Prevention[5 MARCH 2015] Transport: Accident Prevention 416

The Metropolitan Police should be investigating I understand that in the past three years more than each fatal accident carefully and dispassionately.However, 20 new companies have been set up selling HGV blind it is not clear to me why, on one occasion, it was spot safety technology. The technology they offer ranges appropriate for the highways engineers at TfL to be from simple electromagnetic and ultrasonic sensing interviewed under police caution. It would be helpful devices to sophisticated camera monitoring systems, if the Minister could write to me to help me understand radio frequency identification, short-range radar and the logic of that police action. infrared. We should applaud their work. The sales pitches of these companies make ambitious claims While the Department for Transport has been a bit about being “the solution to the problem”, but static slow in consulting on some obvious and desirable tests and live vehicle trials reveal why it is very difficult, changes to the construction and use regulations, TfL if not impossible, for anyone to make these claims has made imaginative use of a traffic regulation order themselves. During my researches this week, I have concerning mirrors and sideguards. I expect that other come to realise to my horror that there is no specification noble Lords will cover this point. However, mirrors in terms of functional and performance criteria for work only if drivers invariably use them and if cyclists what the equipment and technology must achieve in do not enter the truck’s blind spot or danger areas in order to be mandated. This is clearly a role for the DfT an inadvisable way. We could alter the technical since we cannot have large metropolitan authorities requirements for the cab of an HGV but these are each having their own systems and standards. I have to quite properly determined at European level. Designs ask my noble friend the Minister what he is doing are predicated on the needs of operators using national about this. roads and not for the peculiar problems of London. Products said to be designed to save lives should be Last week, I attended the Construction Logistics independently evaluated and compared. The operators and Cycle Safety—CLOCS— conference at ExCeL. of HGVs would then have all the facts they need to We saw some of the technological developments in make informed choices and know that the safety better cab design, sensor technology and how freight equipment they are investing in offers value for money operator recognition scheme operators can reduce risks. and is effective. I am sad to say that this is not the case. I am sure that all noble Lords will applaud the efforts Unlike every other safety device in the workplace, of all those involved in the CLOCS programme. those being sold to HGV operators do not have to meet stringent performance criteria or undergo rigorous Can my noble friend the Minister explain why the testing. A robust and consistent process needs to be CPC regime for HGV drivers does not include a established independently to evaluate HGV safety products mandatory road safety objective? Furthermore, at present, against the functional and performance criteria set. a work-related, road traffic accident fatality is not Does the Minister agree that his department, and not reportable under RIDDOR. There does not even seem TfL, should ensure that there is an assessment and to be a need for a risk assessment for work-related approval organisation and mechanism in place? driving. Why not? This is not regulation for regulation’s sake. Not While all these points and policies are helpful and only will it help HGV operators now, it will also steer interesting, they are not predicated on meeting a target the technological developments of the future so that of zero. By that I mean that, in some years, no cyclists more lives can be saved, and not just for this specific in London will be killed by an HGV, irrespective of type of accident. I am passionate about road safety fault. and I believe that we should be going for zero for this type of accident. I will happily engage with all concerned My understanding is that, despite claims to the both inside and outside the House. I look forward to contrary, none of the sensor systems developed thus the Minister’s response. far is good enough to be mandated. That is how I was briefed when I was in the Minister’s position and I do 4.38 pm not think that it has changed. However, we could make the problem orders of magnitude simpler if Lord Berkeley (Lab): My Lords, I am grateful to the cycles were to be fitted with transducers for truck-mounted noble Earl, Lord Attlee, for initiating this debate because equipment to detect. I want to emphasise that I am it is a terribly important subject. We have regular not applying parliamentary pressure to adopt any debates both in the House and in Grand Committee particular technology, nor have I been stimulated by on the minor detail of the various bits of legislation any outside organisation. I have proposed a system under which people use the roads, and often Ministers whereby one or more infrared transmitters are fitted say in their responses that basically it is all too difficult. to the relevant truck. The cycle has a transducer All the legislation going back almost 100 years needs mounted on it which retransmits the IR signal radio to be reviewed. That is not going to happen quickly, so frequency back to the truck. This is known as a let us get on with what we can do. tag-and-beacon system, and a very similar system has I declare an interest as a vice-president of the already been marketed which uses RFID. These systems Cyclists’ Touring Club. Like everyone else, the club is do have the difficulty that the cycles would have to be very interested in this subject. I suppose we should fitted with a tag, which could be a problem, but that start with the problem, which is that lorries and cyclists has to be balanced against the technical advantages. do not mix, and we are trying to find solutions to that. It would be necessary to fit only certain types of high- I want to talk about a number of those. The most risk HGVs, in particular construction vehicles. My obvious one is more space. We have a lot to learn from understanding is that the concept would work, but the some continental cities, not only in terms of the space difficulty is in its implementation. that has been provided for whatever reason—demand 417 Transport: Accident Prevention[LORDS] Transport: Accident Prevention 418

[LORD BERKELEY] of Rail Regulation was going to be responsible for from cyclists, political will or whatever—but in the monitoring the costs of the new strategic highways design of our cities. We are making progress here. The company, as it does for the railways—it should also be Mayor of London is going ahead with the east-west able to enforce cost reductions, as it is required to for highway, which is a segregated route. I think it is the railways, which is another subject—it should be absolutely wonderful and have welcomed it for a long responsible for road safety, as it is for the railways. Let time. If we cannot have segregation—and cyclists feel us not forget that 2,000 people are killed on the roads much happier if they are properly segregated—then in this country every year and one on the railways. we need space with suitable white lines that are not It comes back to the Health and Safety at Work etc. transgressed by other vehicles. There are particular Act: people should be responsible for their own actions. problems at junctions, as we have seen in London. It is If these people are employed—as in the example I very easy just to talk about London, but the problems have just given of the accident in London—why is are just as bad in other cities. In fact, there may be nobody taking action against the companies that employ fewer people cycling in other cities, but there are also them? They are not doing what they should be doing fewer facilities. Certainly, when I go to some other to ensure that their employees are behaving and complying cities with my bike, I sometimes feel a lot more frightened with the law. There is an awful lot more that could be than I do in London. done there. It is a massive subject but if you think Another issue of course is the trucks. We are focusing about everybody driving—whether pedestrians and in particular on construction industry trucks, which is cyclists come into it, we can debate—being responsible the right thing to do; but we must not forget the for your own safety as far as is reasonably practical logistics industry. I declare an interest as chairman of would make many road users think twice before doing the Rail Freight Group, so I get involved in quite a lot some of the very stupid things that they do at the of it. Big lorries in the middle of towns are necessary moment. for delivering freight, unless there is some kind of I will say one last thing about the technology. The logistics transfer point at the edges at which the freight noble Earl, Lord Attlee, mentioned the idea of fitting can be transferred into smaller vehicles. In some places transponders or something to cyclists. It sounds attractive it is proposed that freight is taken round by smaller in the first instance but there are questions to be asked, vans, or bicycles. Obviously, this cannot be done for such as, if they did not work, who would be guilty? construction traffic. Would there be too much information in the cab for Here we come to the issue of enforcement, which the driver of the lorry to be able to appreciate it all? the noble Earl, Lord Attlee, mentioned. First, it is a Would it be a defence, if the cyclist did not have one of pity that more people do not obey the law. Cyclists these transponders, that it would be all right to run have been infamous for going through red lights, sadly. him over? That is a bit of an extreme example. I hope It is good that the trend is reducing in London, that the Minister will tell us a bit more about what perhaps because there are more cyclists; perhaps it is research the Government are doing to look into all due to peer pressure. I am pleased that PCSOs have these things, finding out what is going on on the now been allowed to stop cyclists—I have seen them continent and elsewhere, because something needs to doing it and have talked to them—if they go through a be done but I think it would probably be better if it red light or the stop lines. It is ironic that they are not was led by the Government as a major contribution to allowed to fine vehicle drivers in the way that they can safety. Then we would be able to move forward on all fine cyclists for doing it, because it is a different the various other issues that, as the noble Earl, Lord regulation. What is good for cyclists surely should be Attlee, suggested, could reduce the number of cyclists good for vehicles. I have seen PCSOs talk to car killed in this country—not just London—to zero. drivers and it is obvious that some of them would like to have these other powers. 4.47 pm Another issue is the reduction in traffic police. CTC has produced figures that show that the number of Baroness Ludford (LD): My Lords, it is a great road traffic police has reduced to a third of what it was pleasure to take part in this important debate. I thank in 2005. That is a very major reduction in enforcement my noble friend Lord Attlee for initiating it. It was and I suspect that many road users probably reckon also a pleasure to listen to the noble Lord, Lord that they can get away with more than they could then. Berkeley, who is a transport expert like my noble There is a strong argument for having a separate friend. I am not a transport expert and I am not a traffic police force, though that is probably a slightly cyclist—I think a combination of laziness and fear has separate argument. prevented me. I am afraid I will probably concentrate on London, as that is my experience. On enforcement, there is a further example of a man who ran over and killed a cyclist in 2009. He had I was first sensitised to the issue we are discussing been disqualified from driving as a teenager; he was today as a local councillor in the 1990s in the London breathalysed when the accident occurred; and he was Borough of Islington, when I was aware of two fatalities also talking on his mobile phone. One of the possible in my area. As a Member of the European Parliament, solutions to this issue came up when we were debating I got involved particularly in supporting the See Me the then Infrastructure Bill. The noble Earl, Lord Save Me campaign, which was started by the Cairns Attlee, mentioned it briefly—namely, the question of family after Eilidh Cairns was killed in Notting Hill. why we do not use the Health and Safety at Work etc. The death statistics are indeed terrible. I think there Act and RIDDOR in the roads sector. I put down an are about 14 fatalities of cyclists a year in London. amendment to that Bill suggesting that since the Office Heavy goods vehicles represent only about one in 20 419 Transport: Accident Prevention[5 MARCH 2015] Transport: Accident Prevention 420 of the vehicles on the roads but are responsible for the wheels of the lorry. The question is whether they 55% of the fatalities. There are clearly some cowboy really do need to travel around London without HGV drivers and employers but I feel that others are safeguards. I think that we are all a bit disappointed let down by the poor design of cabs and the lack of that the Department for Transport has been slow in warning equipment leading to these fatal lorry blind launching its consultation on removing those exemptions spots. from construction vehicles. Can the Minister give me a The basic design of HGVs can and must play a date when the consultation will be launched and a significant role in reducing cycling fatalities and serious promise that it will be expedited and wide in scope, in injuries, and I think there are three issues. The first is the sense of reducing, as far as possible, any exemption? better design of cabs, allowing greater visibility to see While we wait for European and national action, I cyclists and other road users. That can be done by am pleased that the Mayor of London, Transport for lowering the cab, placing the driver in the middle of London and London Councils have agreed on a London- the cab, using more glass and improved mirrors. Secondly, wide ban on lorries not fitted with safety equipment to there could be some kind of warning equipment. My protect cyclists and pedestrians coming into London. noble friend talked about the possibility of equipment. I think that the Safer Lorry Scheme will be launched I tried to follow the technical aspects of what he said, in September, once warning signs and so on are in but it was about some kind of RFID on a bike. My place. All roads in Greater London, except motorways, experience has been more learning a bit about sensors will be covered by this scheme. It will require vehicles on a lorry to warn the driver. But I take the point—I of more than three and a half tonnes to be fitted with think that Transport for London makes the point, side guards to protect cyclists and class V and class VI too—that there are so many different schemes, it is mirrors—I confess that I do not actually know what very difficult to assess their value. TfL is doing a study those are—to give drivers a better view of cyclists and to try to get an evaluation of them. The third issue, pedestrians around their vehicle. I saw recently that which I will come back to in a second, is side guards Sir Peter Hendy, the boss of Transport for London, on construction lorries. has indicated his willingness to mandate cycle-friendly I very much welcome the agreement recently achieved HGVs on all contracts. It has been operating on the at EU level on a new directive on the weights and Crossrail contract, but it sounds as though he is interested dimensions of lorries. That should deliver life-saving in widening that procurement role. changes to lorry design, improving the direct vision I conclude with some points that are unrelated to under the front windscreen and minimising the risk of lorry design or equipment. I very much welcome, as overrun and damage in the event of collision by replacing does my colleague Caroline Pidgeon on the London the blunt front with a more elongated and rounded Assembly, the superhighways for cycle lanes in London. one and an expanded glazed area with mirrors and I have also been asked to find out, going outside cameras. Are the Government committed to the follow-up London, when the Department for Transport will work from this directive? As I understand it, the talk is empower local authorities to enforce moving traffic of a type-approval directive with a rather long timescale— offences, such as stopping in box junctions and driving longer than the European Parliament wanted—of about in cycle lanes. Apparently, some foot-dragging appears seven years. Are the Government committed to seeing to be going on there. I must stop now. I look forward the directive into law and to a mandatory requirement to answers from the Minister. for HGVs to carry these safety features? Last year, in conjunction with some other politicians, I wrote to the Minister’s colleague Mr Stephen Hammond. It was 4.56 pm slightly unclear in the reply whether there was that Lord Freeman (Con): My Lords, I congratulate my commitment from the Government. I would like to noble friend Lord Attlee on securing this debate. know whether there is a formal position of the Department Perhaps I may say once again in your Lordships’ for Transport on the prospect of a type-approval Chamber how much your Lordships appreciated the directive. I think that we do need to get HGVs fit for noble Earl’s spokesmanship for the Department for the 21st century. Transport, which he discharged not only with courtesy As I said, TfL has commissioned a study to develop but with tremendous efficiency and knowledge. I listened an independent testing method for vehicle safety to his speech and agreed with what he said. I do not technology. My noble friend Lord Attlee talked about have the expertise of the noble Lord, Lord Berkeley, the national role for the Department for Transport. I or my noble friend Lady Ludford, but my contribution am sure that that is right, eventually; but in the mean is based on being a parent of a 20 year-old daughter time, it is good that TfL is doing some work on this. who cycles regularly from home in Dulwich to work in I mentioned side guards, as others have. We know Battersea and to visit her parents in Kensington. Each that among the HGVs involved in fatal collisions, time she does that, particularly at night, my heart is construction lorries—tipper lorries, skip loaders and literally in my mouth. Therefore, I have taken an so on—are disproportionately represented. They are interest in security for cyclists in London. Frankly, apparently exempt under the 1986 regulations because every life lost is probably a life that could have been they claim to be vehicles designed and constructed for saved and is avoidable. Some of the ideas that my special purposes where it is not possible for practical noble friend Lord Attlee has mentioned need to be reasons to fit side guards. TfL does not regard these pursued with great vigour. vehicles as special purpose. Only in very special I compliment the Mayor of London, Boris Johnson, circumstances are they going on to such terrain where on what I call “the cycling revolution”. It has some side guards would help stop people being pulled under penalties and downsides to it but we must congratulate 421 Transport: Accident Prevention[LORDS] Transport: Accident Prevention 422

[LORD FREEMAN] which is best placed to judge the right technology. If him and a bank whose name I will not mention on the necessary, focus within the department, working with initiative in terms of the growth of cycling in London. Transport for London and other transport authorities One sees while travelling to and from your Lordships’ around the country in our bigger cities and conurbations, House in the morning and in the evening how many could identify what is the sensible technology to put in cyclists there are. However, I am an advocate of greater the cab and on the bicycle. I am not in any way discipline among some of the cyclists. Whether changes competent to comment on the technology and I suspect come through legislation or clearer direction remains that my noble friend Lord Attlee would not claim to to be seen, but I often see cyclists in central London have that knowledge. Someone in the department or without proper lights, headgear or yellow jackets to some individuals in the department will certainly have identify them. I have heard the comments of many that knowledge. Mandatory assessment and approval taxi drivers in central London who are concerned by the department and recommendations to the industry about the behaviour of some cyclists. It is not just that about what should be applied is much to be desired. I they go through red lights, as many of your Lordships hope very much that the Department for Transport will have witnessed, but it is sometimes difficult to see will take up that challenge. them and there is also concern about their ability to see other traffic. I am in favour of certain compulsions 5.05 pm on cyclists, certainly in the metropolis. Lord Jordan (Lab): I thank the noble Earl, Lord I turn to an excellent campaign article provided by Attlee, for this timely debate, coming as it does during the research department in the House of Lords. I RoSPA’s family week. I declare an interest as a vice- again compliment it on the publications it has reviewed president of RoSPA. and the documents it has produced for your Lordships for this debate. The national cycling charity’s December My interest in safety began while working on the 2014 briefing states: factory floor. My passion for cycling, sadly now dormant, “In London specifically, where HGVs make up around 3.5% predated that; I was part of a great bunch of lads with of traffic, almost half of the 44 cyclist fatalities between 2011-13 the unlikely name of “The Eager Beavers”. With them (inclusive) were as a result of a collision with a lorry. Of these 21, I cycled every weekend come rain or shine. Our single ten involved a collision with a left-turning lorry”. claim to fame was to have cycled from Birmingham to The statistics are horrifying just in that brief period of Abergavenny and back in one day. Its connection to time. I very much compliment the charity for drawing this debate is that I was stopped on the way back, just this to our attention. half a mile from my home, by a policeman who told What is the solution? I find myself very much in me that my front light was not working and that I agreement with my noble friend and the noble Lord, would have to push the bike the rest of the way. Lord Berkeley, who I think referred to known black For many years we never had an accident on what spots. Work needs to be done on improving visibility seemed at the time to be car and lorry-free roads. It is at certain known black spots. That is the responsibility not now as it hath been of yore. Every year in Great of Transport for London and the Mayor of London. Britain, around 100 cyclists are killed, 3,000 are seriously Whether it means widening the road or giving clear injured and 16,000 are slightly injured in reported indications to both cyclists and traffic—heavy good road accidents. Lorries present a particular danger to vehicles in particular—depends on the precise location cyclists. Although cyclists are less likely to be involved but work needs to be prioritised at these known black in a collision with an HGV than with a car, they are spots. more likely to be killed or seriously injured in any I welcome the cyclists’ designated area along the collisions that do occur. Embankment, but the implications for road traffic, let Between 2009 and 2013, HGVs were involved in alone buses and heavy goods vehicles, remain to be 23% of cyclist deaths, despite comprising only 5% of properly analysed. Certainly, creating that space will the traffic. A disproportionate number of female cyclists better protect many cyclists heading for the City and are involved in collisions with HGVs. HGVs present a work. In passing, I just mention the joint work that the particular danger to cyclists when they are turning noble Lord, Lord Berkeley, and I tried to undertake—we left: 55% of cases where cyclists were seriously injured failed—to get more heavy goods vehicles off the road by HGVs larger than 7.5 tonnes in London occurred by taking freight from Felixstowe on to the railway. when the driver turned left across the path of the Much of that traffic comes into and crosses central cyclist. London to go west or south. So what is being done about this problem? There Concrete and tipper lorries seem to be the culprits are many good developments, and many solutions are in many of the incidents that have been referred to. being developed, especially in London, by Transport They in particular need a mandatory warning system for London, the Met and individual companies that in the cab. That needs to be complemented by appropriate use large vehicles. Of course, very significant effort precautions regarding cyclists. I am not familiar with and resources are being put into producing a safer all the technology but my noble friend Lord Attlee road environment for cyclists, especially in London reminded me that up to 20 companies are already but also in many towns and cities across the country. interested in the technology to be either installed in Vehicle technology is also advancing rapidly and the heavy goods vehicles or applied to the cycle. I am will help to significantly reduce road crashes and not a technologist and do not understand the technical casualties. HGVs are increasingly being fitted with complications but there ought to be renewed enthusiasm sensors and cameras that warn the driver if a cyclist is and effort here by the Department for Transport, to their nearside. This type of technology will certainly 423 Transport: Accident Prevention[5 MARCH 2015] Transport: Accident Prevention 424 help, although in the case of cameras it still requires the safety, sustainability and accessibility panel, where the driver to check the screen as well as the mirror. these very tragic circumstances are discussed, as well Sensors can often give an audible warning, but may as being reported and debated at the main board. pick up pedestrians on the pavement. Being a board member has been an eye-opener in Many of the companies who enter RoSPA’s managing terms of the rules and regulations that govern this occupational road risk—MORR—awards are making area. It would be easy to assume that it might be good, innovative use of technology to reduce the risk slightly simpler, but it is with a heavy heart that I hear created by large vehicles. of any tragedy on the road. As a very slow recreational The noble Earl, Lord Attlee, has given us an example cyclist when a member of Cleveland Wheelers, but of the sort of technology that is being developed to also when I was wheelchair racing, most of my training minimise cyclists’ vulnerability. Another example is a was done on the roads. Two friends of mine have been new collision-avoidance system that was presented to killed on the roads by cars, not in the UK, and a RoSPA’s national safety committee in October by Professor number of friends have been injured cycling, my husband David Cebon of Cambridge University. The system included. Perhaps very fortunately, he ended up with a uses sensors to detect the presence of a cyclist on the spinal cord injury rather than being another of the HGV’s near side, and software that predicts the path number of fatalities. of the speed of the cyclist and the HGV. If it predicts I have been hit twice on the road while training at that the HGV is going to hit the cyclist when it turns, it T-junctions when I had the right of way. I was able to automatically applies the HGV’s brakes to bring it to recognise that the driver was not looking correctly, a stop. According to Professor Cebon, an analysis of took evasive action and was left with nothing more 19 fatal accidents involving a cyclist and a left-turning than a few bruises and a couple of black eyes, but it is HGV concluded that 15 of these would have been very shocking when it happens to you and it makes completely avoided, and three would have been less you think very carefully about everything else that is severe, using the new system. on the road. The noble Earl, Lord Attlee, makes a very good The noble Lord, Lord Berkeley, is right about peer point about the lack of performance requirements for pressure. I have seen a change in London in the past HGV blind-spot technology, although perhaps it would year or so with the increased number of cyclists: when be better to put these into a standard rather than somebody jumps a light, other cyclists shout and tell directly into regulation, at least until the point is them to be more careful. reached where they could become mandatory in a European directive. The regulation would then require In London, heavy goods vehicles are overrepresented products to meet the standard. As technology develops, in fatal collisions with cyclists and pedestrians. it would be easier to update a standard than a regulation. Between 2008 and 2013, 55% of all pedal cycle fatalities This should also apply to the transducer device fitted involved an HGV.In 2013, 20% of pedestrian fatalities to bicycles if, of course, that particular technology is involved an HGV. I would like to see more direct progressed. action to improve the safety of the most vulnerable What more can be done? We could adopt the Vision road users, such as cyclists and pedestrians, but support Zero approach recommended by the noble Earl, Lord is needed. Attlee, which principally means attempting to prevent There are many issues, many of which have been crashes from happening in the first place and reducing most ably covered by other noble Lords in the Chamber. the impact of those that do to a level low enough for The first for me, though, is that some HGVs, which those involved to survive without serious injury. Another are overrepresented in fatalities, are exempt from basic would be to include a mandatory road safety objective safety features. The requirement for HGV side guards in the certificate of professional competence—CPP— under the Road Vehicles (Construction and Use) regime for large vehicle operators and drivers. Another Regulations 1986 does not apply to certain vehicles, would be a comprehensive evaluation of the effectiveness “designed and constructed for special purposes”. of the CPC directive, specifically of the effectiveness of both the initial qualification and periodic refresher Should there really be vehicles that have this special- training requirements for large vehicle drivers. purpose designation? Older HGVs, so pre-2007, are also exempt from close proximity class V and VI As the noble Earl suggested, making work-related safety mirrors designed to address vehicle blind spots. road traffic accident fatalities and injuries reportable In September 2015, the Safer Lorry Scheme will come under RIDDOR is a must. Of course, with so much into force in London. This will require HGVs registered varied development under way, it would be very useful after 1983 and driven in London to have side and for the Government to review and co-ordinate all class V and VI mirrors fitted. these developments to identify the best examples and then push them forward, including proposing any I agree with noble Lords who say that the DfT has necessary legislative changes in the European Community. been a bit slow in its proposal to consult on removing side-guard exemptions for certain HGVs. Their planned consultation will cover only HGVs first registered 5.12 pm after 2010. The proposal is also expected to consult on Baroness Grey-Thompson (CB): My Lords, I welcome the retrofitting of class V and VI mirrors to all HGVs the debate that the noble Earl, Lord Attlee, has tabled. first registered from 2000. Will the Minister consider I declare that I sit on the board of Transport for whether the consultation should seek public and industry London, which is listed in my interests on the register. opinion on retrofitting these safety features to vehicles I also chair the surface transport panel and sit on registered from 1983? 425 Transport: Accident Prevention[LORDS] Transport: Accident Prevention 426

[BARONESS GREY-THOMPSON] Finally, once again I congratulate the noble Earl, Many operators are investing in vehicle safety Lord Attlee, as well as the noble Lord, Lord Berkeley, technology and camera systems, but it is an emerging on his passion for cycling—I wish I could go at the market, and an awful lot more could be done. There speed he does on his bike. I congratulate both of them are many that claim to solve the problem, but I think on their persistence in promoting safety on the roads this can be confusing for a number of operators, and I for cyclists. believe that the DfT should work with TfL and other relevant organisations to develop and communicate 5.19 pm performance-based criteria for safety systems that are technology-neutral. Viscount Simon (Lab): My Lords, I find it very interesting that the noble Baroness has just discussed Other noble Lords have mentioned the European the training of HGV drivers; I shall attack from a Commission and its review of weights and dimensions. completely different angle. Will the Minister tell us if the Government will declare I have observed Operation Motorwise on an Army their position on this proposal and actively support base a few times. Essex Police hold the exercise on a the Commission’s recommendation to ensure the next regular basis on private land in various locations generation of HGVs is fit for 21st-century streets? throughout the county, in which teenagers are introduced Under driver training, drivers have to undergo 35 hours to all kinds of useful matters to do with driving prior of training over five years. This covers rationalisation to learning to drive. That includes the Highway Code, of fuel consumption, and may cover first aid, manual some mechanical bits and pieces, observational tests, handling and customer care. All these are very important, and various other items that prepare them for when but a driver could achieve the full CPC qualification they learn to drive and warn them of some of the with no training covering driving standards and road hazards that might well not be brought to their attention safety. It seems crazy to me that we are not taking and which might go wrong during that period. these seriously and are not including some of the most Of those latter hazards, they are shown some emergency obvious things. braking distances taken by HGVs at increasing speeds, The noble Lord, Lord Berkeley, mentioned workplace and they all seem to be shocked by the results. They deaths and work-related road deaths. The management are also invited to sit in the driver’s seat to observe of work-related road risk lags behind the management where cyclists can be seen in the numerous mirrors. So of more general health and safety. I would like to see far, so good—they learn from that. However, when an the Government review the regulations governing this. HGV begins to turn, the mirrors will also turn, and In the short term, perhaps an approved code of practice the cyclist who was clearly visible a few seconds earlier could be published on the management of work-related might well have disappeared from the view of the road risk. driver. There is nothing the cyclist or driver can do to resume sight, irrespective of the number and construction Finally, a consistent national approach is needed to of the mirrors. improve HGV/cycle safety. I have talked about London, and it is probably in London that these things are The noble Earl suggested some very interesting reported more often, but accidents like this are happening technology that might well overcome this problem all over the country that might just make the local and, having chatted with him recently, it sounds well news but would not make the national news. I do not worth developing. He mentioned some companies that think that a lot of people are aware of the number of have developed various systems; a company in Braintree fatalities that happen in this way. The Government has fitted alarms along the side of its HGVs, which have recently announced £114 million of funding for make a sound when anything gets too close to the Cycle City Ambition, in addition to the £94 million sides of the vehicles and which alerts both the driver awarded in August 2013. The eight cities are Birmingham, and the cyclists or pedestrians. That is really good Bristol, Cambridge, Leeds, Manchester, Newcastle, news, and it is a start on the part of that company to Norwich and Oxford. address the problem. As the noble Earl has suggested, there must be other such companies. TfL has significant experience in dealing with HGV/ What can we do to reduce deaths and injuries in the cycle safety and has developed proven initiatives aimed mean time? Both cyclists and HGV drivers are aware at raising operator and driver awareness. The noble of the problem facing them, and it would be wonderful Earl, Lord Attlee, mentioned CLOCS. There is also if all cyclists wore high-visibility clothing, crash helmets Safe Urban Driving, which is a driver CPC accredited and good lighting fitted at the front and back of their course in which drivers undergo an on-cycle hazardous cycles. It would also be wonderful if they obeyed the awareness module. That has had a great deal of success. traffic lights and other legislation. However, the initial There is also an award-winning Fleet Operator manoeuvrability of a cyclist exceeds that of an HGV, Recognition Scheme, which has been recently rolled which can lead the cyclist into a sense of false security—but out nationally. an HGV turning left at a slow speed can kill or Does the Minister agree that we should strongly seriously injure that cyclist. encourage Cycle City Ambition to adopt and support Is there, therefore, stalemate? No. It might seem these existing initiatives? That will save money, not by very heavy-handed, but at least it would stop the designing new standards but by ensuring that operators deaths and injuries to cyclists if they were encouraged have national consistency. We do not need to reinvent not to be alongside a stationary HGV or one turning the wheel. A lot of good work is happening, but there left until such a time as suitable safety technology is is not enough awareness. fitted to all HGVs. I am afraid that the cyclists would 427 Transport: Accident Prevention[5 MARCH 2015] Transport: Accident Prevention 428 not like it, but in the interim, would that not be nicer HGV blind-spot safety technology, and in their response than adding more deaths and seriously injured cyclists to his point made on lack of specifications in terms of to the figures of STATS19, which are currently the performance for what this equipment and technology position? should achieve and lack of independent evaluation and testing. Indeed, on those specific points made by 5.24 pm the noble Earl, Transport for London has said that Lord Rosser (Lab): My Lords, as everyone else has while many HGV operators are investing in vehicle done, I extend my congratulations to the noble Earl, safety technology and camera monitoring systems to Lord Attlee, on securing this debate on cycling safety protect cyclists, the effectiveness of some of the products and heavy goods vehicles. Not everyone has necessarily is questionable and HGV operators need independent agreed with the specific proposal he highlighted as one product information to inform their purchasing decisions. way of addressing a very serious problem. However, Of course, steps are being taken to try to improve there certainly has been agreement on the need to take cycling safety in the important area we are discussing. action to reduce the number of collisions between London Councils is working with Transport for London heavy goods vehicles and cyclists. If today’s debate to implement a new London-wide Safer Lorry Scheme contributes to realising that objective, it will certainly from September, which will require the fitting of extended achieve its purpose. view mirrors and side guards to all heavy goods vehicles The Transport Committee in the other place issued over 3.5 tonnes. a report last July on cycling safety which included Transport for London has also called on the information highly relevant to this debate. Transport Government to review the driver certificate of professional for London has also provided some relevant statistics. competence syllabus to ensure that the European Heavy goods vehicles are disproportionately involved regulation requiring HGV drivers to undergo 35 hours in fatal collisions with cyclists. Some 20% of cycling of training over a five-year period with, fatalities in the last five years have involved HGVs, “specific emphasis on road safety”, even though such vehicles account for only some 5% is fully satisfied. Under the UK’s application of the of motor traffic. As has been said, in London the driver certificate of professional competence, it is situation is even worse, since between 2008 and 2013, apparently possible for a driver to achieve the full some 55% of all pedal cycle fatalities involved a heavy driver CPC qualification with no training covering goods vehicle despite HGVs accounting for less than driving standards and road safety. Transport for London 4% of London’s road miles. Indeed, in 2013, HGVs has said that the Government should introduce a were involved in nine out of 14 cyclist deaths on mandatory and more prescriptive road safety objective London’s roads. which should include minimising the road risk for Reference has already been made to construction vulnerable road users. Like the noble Earl, Lord Attlee, vehicles. Construction vehicles, and particularly concrete I ask the Minister to comment on this in his response. or tipper lorries, are most likely to be involved in collisions with cyclists, with seven out of nine fatal In his contribution, my noble friend Lord Jordan collisions in London between cyclists and large goods referred to a new collision avoidance system being vehicles in 2011 involving construction vehicles. There developed. There was an indication that an analysis of has also been an issue with vehicles that carry stone, 19 fatal accidents involving a cyclist and a left-turning sand, cement and water in compartments and mix the heavy goods vehicle concluded that 15 of those would concrete when on site, known as volumetric mixers, have been completely avoided, and three would have and which are classed as plant and not goods vehicles been less severe, with this new collision avoidance and are thus exempt from a number of regulations in system. In view of those figures, it would be helpful if place for goods vehicles, meaning that operators of the Minister could say what the Government know such vehicles do not require an operator’s licence, and about this new system and what role they are playing are not required to subject the vehicles to annual in encouraging its development. roadworthiness inspections. It seems that the Department We need to further improve cycling safety if we are for Transport found that targeted vehicle inspections to encourage more people to make the switch and led to five out of six volumetric mixers that were increase the number of journeys made by bike in the stopped receiving immediate prohibitions for mechanical UK from its present figure of just 2%. The recent defects, and that in addition three of the stopped RoSPA-commissioned poll indicated that one-third of vehicles were also prohibited because of either overloading people think that cycling safety is one of the biggest or an insecure load. No doubt those who believe that transport issues we face, with more than 100 cyclists a regulations represent red tape and a burden will see no year being killed. need for action, but what is alleged to be a so-called When in government, we made real progress on burden for one person is the potential difference between cycling, with cycle use growing by 20% and casualty life and death for another. figures falling significantly. These increases in cycling The Government published their response to the numbers and casualty reductions did not happen by Transport Committee’s report on 31 October last year, chance but through decisions we made, with ambitious and the Minister’s reply may draw quite heavily on road safety targets, increased use of speed cameras, that response. However, I hope that he will also reply road safety awareness campaigns, traffic calming measures to the specific points raised by the noble Earl, Lord and new home zones, which have introduced 20 mph Attlee, since I for one will be interested to hear where limits in residential areas. What we have seen since the Government now stand in relation to encouraging then, from 2010 to 2014, is half of all local authorities or promoting the effectiveness and practicability of feeling that they have had no alternative but to reduce 429 Transport: Accident Prevention[LORDS] Transport: Accident Prevention 430

[LORD ROSSER] and local government, manufacturers of technology, their investment in cycling, and no long-term certainty the police and of course road users themselves. This is to enable local authorities to plan ahead and invest in an important matter, as can be seen from the four the infrastructure they need, which is so important for tragic fatal collisions to cyclists involving heavy goods increasing cycling usage and improving cycling safety. vehicles already this year in London. This situation was highlighted by the fact that the Britain’s roads are among the safest in Europe, but Government’s Cycling Delivery Plan, published recently we cannot be complacent: we can and will do more. but more than a year late, contains no specific targets Following the successes of our Olympic team, cycling on increasing the percentage of journeys undertaken has become increasingly popular, and we wish to build by bike from the current level of 2%, and no specific on that excellence. Cycling can contribute to keeping long-term funding targets for cycling. The Government’s you healthy and we want to encourage more people to strategic framework for road safety, published in May get on their bikes. The first step is ensuring that they 2011, contained no specific goals for making cycling feel that it is safe to do so. The Construction Logistics safer, and targets to cut deaths and serious injuries on and Cycle Safety event last week at the ExCeL centre, roads have been axed, with heavy goods vehicle speed attended by my noble friend Lord Attlee, gave 200 limits on single-carriageway roads being increased from delegates the opportunity to view 10 new HGVs fitted 40 mph to 50 mph on a highly questionable evidence with the latest technologies to detect cyclists. base. Cuts to front-line policing, which the Government Some of these technologies, such as “tag and beacon”, said would not happen, have made, as my noble friend can be fitted to bicycles and would alert the driver of Lord Berkeley, said, enforcement of road traffic offences an HGV of their presence. However, there is a risk more difficult, with some 23% fewer traffic police either that this may provide a false sense of security patrolling the roads, and a very much higher figure in, for both the cyclist and the driver—as neither of them for example, Essex, where there has been a reduction can rely on the other having the equipment—or that in traffic police from 257 in 2010 to 76 in 2014. the driver suffers from overload because of repeated Cycling safety clearly remains an issue of concern, warnings. The existing sensor-detection technologies and the noble Earl, Lord Attlee, has drawn our attention are not connected to the vehicle controls. The combination in this debate to what is far from the only cause of of the detection time, the reaction time of the driver concern affecting cycling safety but certainly the one and the operating time of the braking system means that receives the most publicity. That is no doubt in that a cyclist moving at moderate speed could have part because of the number of collisions between travelled the length of the HGV after being detected, cyclists and heavy goods vehicles occurring in London, which makes it very difficult for the driver to avoid a on the doorstep of the national media and Parliament, collision. and because, in proportionate terms, such collisions I turn to other matters. I can report that the result in more fatalities and serious injuries than any Government have secured improved requirements in other single form of collision or incident involving the United Nations Economic Commission for Europe cyclists. regulations for mirrors on the passenger side of vehicles, I hope that, in his response, the Minister will include which will mean that drivers have a better view of the firm assurances and evidence that the Government are area adjacent to the cab, and should improve safety actively engaged in ensuring that HGV operators will for cyclists. The European Union has now mandated have vehicle safety technology that is effective and fit these improved mirror requirements for new HGVs for purpose, and will enable us to reduce still further registered after 30 June 2015. the number of fatalities and serious injuries involving Department for Transport officials are continuing cyclists and heavy goods vehicles. to work in the UNECE to develop the technical requirements for camera monitoring systems that replace 5.33 pm existing mirrors and enable the driver to have a better Lord Popat (Con): My Lords, I welcome the view of other road users. Although we cannot be opportunity to respond to this Question for Short certain how quickly these discussions will progress, it Debate on technologies for reducing the number of is possible that such systems could be on new HGVs collisions between heavy goods vehicles and cyclists. It by 2017. is a privilege, admittedly a daunting one, to respond to The noble Baroness, Lady Grey-Thompson, and my noble friend Lord Attlee. When I became a Whip, my noble friend Lady Ludford mentioned side guards. he was the lead spokesman for transport matters in Since 29 October 2014, most new HGVs have had to this House, and was kind enough to mentor me in comply with revised European rules on side guards these matters. He speaks not only with great passion which permit fewer exemptions than the current domestic and knowledge on these matters but upholds the finest legislation. Changes to domestic legislation are also traditions of this House when doing so. being prepared for consultation which will reduce the Moving to the matter in question, I would like to number of exemptions for existing vehicles. More vehicles assure your Lordships’ House that the Government will be fitted with side guards. are fully committed to creating a safe environment for The noble Baroness also asked about the Cycle City all road users. As I will set out, advancements in Ambition and whether such cities should follow some technology will play a vital role in this. All of us who of the initiatives that Transport for London has use a car know how much technology is advancing, undertaken. These decisions are a matter for individual and improving both the driving experience and safety— local authorities. However, I am sure that many cities—not and the same is true for HGVs. However, it is not just just the eight mentioned—see the work done in London about technology. Everyone has a part to play: central as a benchmark for which to aim. 431 Transport: Accident Prevention[5 MARCH 2015] Transport: Accident Prevention 432

The Government, along with European Union member It includes action on justice, sentencing and cycle-proofing states, have developed the proposal to amend the to ensure that cyclists are considered at the design general circulation directive, in particular to allow stage of new and improved road infrastructure, which extra length for HGVs in order to enable more in turn benefits pedestrians too. Responses are currently aerodynamic and safer cab designs. These negotiations being analysed and should be published shortly. were successful and formal approval will follow shortly. The DfT continues to monitor the number and rate Officials are continuing to work closely with the European of all road casualties, including cyclists killed or injured Commission and other member states to ensure that in incidents involving HGVs. This evidence base will type approval legislation is amended quickly, so that be used to assess progress in improving road safety. the benefits of these improved designs are on the road My noble friend Lord Attlee raised the issue of the as soon as possible. HSE and being interviewed under police caution. It The noble Lord, Lord Berkeley, asked what research has been the rule ever since the HSE was set up that it the Government are doing on this. The Department does not duplicate the work of other enforcement for Transport is working with the Society of Motor bodies. The police are responsible for road traffic Manufacturers and Traders, Transport for London legislation, but the HSE works with the police on cases and other stakeholders on HGV safety, including where unsafe working practices appear to be implicated manufacturers of sensor technologies. As part of this, in a road traffic incident, and employers can be, and Transport for London has contracted the Transport have been, prosecuted by the HSE following incidents Research Laboratory to test a range of products to on the road. identify ones that may provide an improvement in safety. Although all vehicles meet minimum safety My noble friend Lord Attlee mentioned that some standards, hauliers can fix additional equipment if TfL staff, including highways engineers, had been this would be beneficial for their specific operations. interviewed under caution by the police. I have been advised that this was as part of a corporate manslaughter I mentioned earlier the role of local authorities. investigation. In these circumstances, it is appropriate They have the flexibility to introduce 20 miles per that people are interviewed under caution so that they hour speed limits in residential areas, which could have all the legal rights and safeguards that that process have a significant effect on cyclist safety. The Secretary brings, including having a solicitor present. of State issued two special authorisations on traffic signing in 2011 to enable all English local authorities I hope that noble Lords can see that this issue is to provide Trixi mirrors at road junctions to make complex and that there is no single solution that will cyclists more visible to drivers and “no entry except provide the outcome that we are all seeking: to stop cycles” signing, which can facilitate overflow cycling. these terrible collisions. I trust that this has sought to I am pleased that a number of initiatives have clarify the actions that the Government have taken emerged on the role that hauliers have in improving and the areas where we will continue to focus our safety.These include the construction-industry-led CLOCS efforts in collaboration with other cycling interests. initiative and the Fleet Operator Recognition Scheme, which encourages good practice for road freight operators. Lord Berkeley: Could the Minister possibly write to They are now both supported by more than 3,000 noble Lords on some of the questions that he has not operators nationally. The CLOCS standard is being had time to answer, including, for example, whether used in major transport construction projects in London there is a specification from the department about the and across the UK, including Crossrail and Network near-side equipment that we have all been debating, Rail, and it is intended for HS2. The Department for and also how many convictions there have been for Transport has also been providing advice to road users employers whose vehicles and things have contravened through the THINK! campaign, with the most recent the legislation that we have been discussing? launched on 2 March. Compliance rates with legal requirements for HGVs Lord Popat: As time is a limiting factor I cannot in use have been nearly constant nationally over the answer all the questions now, but I am happy to write last few years. For the construction and waste sectors, to noble Lords, and I will go through the Hansard an interagency HGV taskforce has been in operation report. in London over the last 17 months. It involves the This is a very serious issue. There is cross-party Driver and Vehicle Standards Agency and police to agreement that we are very concerned about the incidents carry out highly targeted enforcement to crack down happening. Week after week we hear of injuries because on non-compliant and unsafe HGVs. For the benefit of cycling and we want to minimise them. If we can of the noble Lord, Lord Berkeley, I can say that, in its bring them to zero that would obviously be much first year or so, the 16 officers from the DVSA and the better. I am glad that my noble friend Lord Attlee police have made about 4,000 highly targeted stops, raised the very important issue of whether technology issued about 2,000 roadworthiness prohibitions and can help to reduce the numbers. It is a tragedy when more than 1,000 fixed penalty notices, detected 1,500 any cyclist dies and my heart goes out to all the drivers’ hours offences and seized nearly 50 vehicles. families who have had to cope with such terrible Furthermore, enforcement officers report better load circumstances. This Government will not be satisfied security on scaffolders’ HGVs. until our roads are safe for all users—more especially The noble Lord, Lord Rosser, mentioned a report, cyclists. I hope that advancing technologies can help the draft Cycling Delivery Plan, which was heavily to make this a reality. discussed and debated in the other House. It was published on 16 October 2014 for informal consultation. House adjourned at 5.46 pm.

GC 101 Israel and Palestine[5 MARCH 2015] Israel and Palestine GC 102

humanity. The Jews deserve and need a secure home in Grand Committee Israel for those who want to live there. They have created a remarkable nation in a short time. But I have Thursday, 5 March 2015. to say in no uncertain terms that Israeli settlements in the West Bank and Jerusalem, which amount to more Israel and Palestine than 500,000 people, have emerged as the gravest impediment to a peaceful settlement. They also contravene Question for Short Debate the Geneva Convention and conflict with Article 2 of the UN charter, which prohibits the acquisition of 1pm territory by the use of force. As the late Mr Sharon Asked by Lord Luce once said: “It is impossible to have a Jewish democratic state and at the To ask Her Majesty’s Government what is their same time control to all of Eretz Israel. If we insist on fulfilling assessment of the current proposals for a two-state the dream in its entirety, we are liable to lose it all”. solution for Israel and Palestine. It is worth reminding our Israeli friends that we in Britain have extensive experience of occupying other Lord Wallace of Saltaire (LD): My Lords, we are people’s territories on different continents, of taking extremely tight on time. In view of the great interest in other people’s land and of discriminating between this debate, I ask all noble Lords to watch the clock religious communities in Northern Ireland. We know and ideally to come in just below two minutes rather from experience that this can be the recipe for anger, than above. despair and violence. It is striking that so many Israeli intelligence, armed forces and security leaders have Lord Luce (CB): My Lords, I am most grateful to said in recent times that war will not solve the problem, the Minister for replying to this debate, and to all and that occupation of the West Bank and, in effect, noble Lords, who will no doubt make distinctive Gaza undermines Israel. But the determination of contributions despite the time constraint. some Israeli politicians, egged on by extreme religious A few months after I was born in 1936, a royal groups intent on the occupation of Judea and Samaria, commission on Palestine set up by the Government to go on ignoring this advice can only inflame the concluded: problem and provide a powerful argument for Islamist “An irrepressible conflict has arisen between two national recruiters. The international community has been regularly communities within the narrow bounds of one small country.” supine in confronting the issue of settlements, partly Some 78 years later, following interminable cycles of perhaps from a reluctance to counter Israel’sdemocratically war, occupation and violence, the Israelis and Palestinians elected politicians, however extreme their views. are still locked in a desperate and dangerous impasse Against this background, the prospects for a two-state out of which they seem unable to escape. solution are receding. Secretary of State Kerry’s sterling All this is against an even more ominous background efforts have produced regrettably few results, perhaps where much of the Middle East has sunk into a dark because he addressed only part of the problem. But age of wars of religion and ethnic conflict. In these the international community cannot give up. Credible circumstances, the most dangerous thing of all would polls show that the majority of both Israelis and be to continue with the status quo and to assume that Palestinians still want a two-state solution. The only there is no hope of progress on Palestine. On both alternatives are the status quo or a binational state of sides, the insecurity, fear, frustration and anger can be some kind. Both are a dead end. The status quo means a recipe only for an endless cycle of violence—a time drift, more settlements, Gaza imprisoned and isolated bomb that threatens continually the peace and security with more extremism, and Israel retreating to another of the Middle East and of the international community. Masada fortress. Growing international support for This area is and will remain vital to Britain’s security recognition of Palestine as a state and as a member of and economic well-being. Both are at great risk without UN bodies and of the ICC will be complemented by a solution to the Palestinian problem. Beyond that, growing international isolation of Israel as a pariah Britain, responsible for the Balfour Declaration, still state, with the prospect of intensified sanctions, particularly has a moral obligation to play an active role in seeking on those in Israel who do business with the settlements. a just settlement. Today we have a State of Israel—though There is no secure future in the status quo for Israelis it is not yet secure—while Palestinians have been driven or Palestinians. out of much of the land of Palestine. Many now live As to the binational state or one-state solution, as refugees elsewhere in the West Bank, surrounded by Kerry’s withdrawn public reference to apartheid was Jewish settlements, or in the most desperate conditions in fact right. The population trends show that there in Gaza—all this despite a British Government mandate are at present 6 million Israeli Jews, with a similar and as long ago as 1920 to guide Palestine to independence. rapidly growing population of Palestinians living in Since then, on the Palestinian side, there have been Israel, the West Bank and Gaza. If this is to be a repeated failures of leadership, internal divisions, missed Jewish nation, it would, in all likelihood, lead to an opportunities and appalling acts of terrorism. As to apartheid nation of Bantustans, where democracy would Israel, I draw a sharp distinction between the Jewish be undermined by the treatment of Palestinians as people and the policy of certain Israeli leaders and second-class citizens. Israel would be at serious risk of extreme religious groups. I condemn utterly the re- no longer providing a permanent home for the Jews, emergence of anti-Semitism in Europe and elsewhere. but of destroying itself through civil strife and international The Holocaust was an unimaginable crime against condemnation. GC 103 Israel and Palestine[LORDS] Israel and Palestine GC 104

[LORD LUCE] massive towns and vast agricultural estates. Today, I However, time and events are rapidly eroding the want to encourage reconciliation work between the prospect of a two-state solution and it is imperative different religious leaders in Jerusalem of the three that international efforts should not lose momentum. faiths to whom it is especially sacred, and also between As Israelis go to the polls, the international community, the many strands within each faith, which are particularly not least the European Union, needs to get the message obvious in that part of the world. across that, given leadership and determination, Israelis The faith leaders have a duty to reach out to each and Palestinians can still reach a two-state solution other and to work to recognise and respect the religious and that the dangers for all parties in the alternatives sensibilities of the others. That is easier said than still outweigh the challenges of reaching a peace settlement. done, I fully realise, but that only emphasises its The elements are well known, as has been restated importance. The conflict is primarily about land and so many times since Resolution 242 nearly 50 years ethnicity, but faith is a key expression of the differences, ago. The Israelis for their part must show readiness and all the faith leaders have, after all, a commitment to end their occupation of the West Bank and the to peace in their own way. The Holy Land has been imprisonment of Gaza and to remove settlements in scarred by religious wars throughout history.If organised return for firm security guarantees. The biggest problem religion could now contribute to the peace, progress on both sides remains lack of political leadership and would be easier. trust. The international community has to do yet more to find ways to encourage a climate for renewed discussion. 1.11 pm That includes an unequivocal stand on the issue of settlements and the condemnation of all violence. Lord Judd (Lab): My Lords, in congratulating the noble Lord on having introduced this important debate At the same time, the Palestinians must be brought and having given such a clear analysis of the situation, to demonstrate their unified determination to construct I simply say that if we are thinking about the men, a viable state: a state which links Gaza and the West women and children in Palestine and the men, women Bank, both of which must be the focus of negotiations. and children in Israel, we have to look to long-term, Jordan and Egypt in particular should be invited to sustainable solutions. We must beware of attempts at contribute to this process. It requires imagination and short-term fixes; we need to find something that will fresh thinking. Any political agreement must be supported last. By definition, if something is going to last it has by the equivalent of an economic Marshall Plan to to have the support of the maximum number of people rescue Gaza and to rejuvenate the Palestinian economy. on all sides. With our special moral and historical Against this background, I now believe that if we responsibilities, which the noble Lord rightly underlined, are to remain a serious international player, HMG we have to think of that principle all the time. The must give impetus to the peace process by recognising solution in the end will be with the people and their a Palestinian state without delay. Two factors persuade leaders in the region. me of this. Negotiations will have a better chance if If there is one thing that I think that we should say some equivalence of status is created between the two as friends of the Israeli people and friends of the parties, and the Palestinians need such a spur to work Palestinian people, it is that counterproductivity is the hard to construct a viable state. It is worth noting that real enemy. Just as it was totally counterproductive of Israel was not a fully viable state when the British those within Gaza to fire their rockets into Israel and Government recognised her in 1948—and nor today led to great grief on the part of many of us who see do we recognise some of her borders or Jerusalem as ourselves as close friends of the people of Gaza, one her capital. On Palestinian recognition, we are lagging must remember that there had been years of provocation, behind not only opinion in Europe but that in Israel with the ruthless blockade which was systematically itself, where there are open calls and petitions from destroying the economy and the social welfare structure senior and credible figures for Israeli recognition of of Gaza. One has to think of the West Bank checkpoints, Palestine on the basis that Israel’s safety and security the daily humiliation of the people of the West Bank, depend on the two states existing side by side. farmers separated from their land, and the rest. One The inclination by Israeli and Palestinian leaders to has to think of the recent proposal by the Cabinet in wait for something to happen must be replaced by a Israel to make it a Jewish state. will to succeed in reaching a comprehensive settlement. From that standpoint, it seems to me that we must That will must be supported rigorously and robustly back to the hilt the principle of a two-state solution, by Britain, the EU and the wider international community. which will give both sides the confidence of international I look forward to hearing from the Minister the position respect as they go about trying to find a long-term that HMG take on this vital issue. solution.

1.10 pm 1.14 pm Lord Cope of Berkeley (Con): My Lords, first, I Baroness Deech (CB): My Lords, the time has come thank the noble Lord, Lord Luce, for initiating this for the active involvement of the regional Arab states debate and for an excellent speech. If I may say so, if I in reaching a solution for the whole area. I fear that do that on behalf of all of us, we need not repeat that Israel probably does not take the UK or Europe phrase at the beginning of every speech. seriously as impartial fixers, because of their fixation I have explained before my interests and my belief on Israel while they remain relatively silent on terrible that the biggest enemy of the peace process is the situations in, for example, North Korea, Russia and occupation and the so-called settlements—in reality, China. Israel sees the rising tide of anti-Semitism in GC 105 Israel and Palestine[5 MARCH 2015] Israel and Palestine GC 106

Europe and this country, connected with intransigence between those camps and the Palestinian mansions of by Palestinians of violence, and that makes Israel those people who lived in Gaza and the West Bank more intransigent. before the refugees came. Then there are the divisions The Kerry proposals are as good as any, but, in between Hamas and Fatah. Hamas needs to change its addition, Hamas and Gaza must be disarmed, there vocabulary if there is to be peace in the Middle East. must be no more tunnels and disarmament must be covered by UN inspectors. We should call on the 1.18 pm Palestinians to renounce their arms, recognise their Lord Stirrup (CB): My Lords, in the few moments neighbour state and get on with creating a homeland available to me I will focus on just two issues. The first for Palestinians wherever they may be, and not set up is the question of recognition. In his very powerful another rogue, extremist state. There must be two speech, much of which I agreed with, my noble friend states. That means that Palestine must recognise Israel. Lord Luce argued that we should recognise the state Palestinians have been unwilling ever to accept a Jewish of Palestine immediately. My concern is that it seems presence and that is more of a problem in the area to assume that the only obstruction to the peace than the settlements, remembering how Gaza was process is the Israeli political position. Of course, it is evacuated. One state, we know, is impossible and has a massive obstruction, and, of course, settlements are never worked where there is a Muslim majority around an enormously controversial and difficult issue—I the world. find that my Israeli friends have great difficulty in The Palestinians have turned down a two-state solution explaining to me the rationale behind this policy—but many a time, while we know that Israel accepts it. The there are also problems on the Palestinian side, including Palestinians need a democratic leader, a man of peace. their unwillingness, for internal political reasons, to They must make the citizens of the new Palestine be address the key question of right of return, for example, existing residents and not continue to call them refugees. and their unwillingness to address seriously the key They must gather in their refugees from the diaspora. question of security on the West Bank. The last thing If they do not do that, I have to believe that their that the Jordanians, let alone the Israelis, need is a intention is to overrun Israel. They say that, “Palestine fragile and insecure state on their border. These questions should stretch from the river to the sea”—a Judenrein have to be addressed and we have to be sure, before we state—whereas Israel has 1.8 million Arabs. go through a process of formal recognition, that there The solution depends on normalisation. There are are sufficient levers on the Palestinian side as well as many partition states, such as India, Pakistan and the Israeli side to force the two sides to the appropriate Bangladesh, but in the end there must be normalisation. compromises. My second point is on the two-state solution itself. I 1.16 pm think that pretty much everyone agrees that this is still the only reasonable and viable way forward. However, Lord Palmer of Childs Hill (LD): My Lords, despite in considering the two-state solution, I ask that there what the noble Lord, Lord Luce, said, there will be a be a degree of flexibility in the application of the two-state solution, which I passionately want, only if Clinton parameters. Clearly, in broad terms these must the Israelis and Palestinians sit down and negotiate. I be right, but the post-1918 settlement in the Middle worry that nothing much has moved on since it was East has unravelled almost totally, and borders in so said about President Arafat that he missed no opportunity many parts of that region are in question. We should to miss an opportunity.There can be no quick, misguided look at a broader approach to this whole question of fix of recognition of the state by the United Nations. the two-state solution and in particular we should seek Let us be clear. Many noble Lords have talked, or to draw Egypt and Jordan into a four-way negotiation will talk, about the requirements of Israel towards so that the borders can be created in a way that that peace negotiation. I would like to use the short produces a viable Palestinian state and will meet the time I have to talk about the requirements of the needs of the Israelis, the Palestinians and their nearest Palestinians as well as of the Israelis. There has to be a neighbours who are most closely concerned—Egypt cessation of rockets and mortars from Gaza. There and Jordan. were 4,036 rockets in 2014 landing on Israel. Just think—if rockets were being fired at the Peers’ Entrance 1.20 pm of this place there would soon be a militia acting in The Lord Bishop of Southwark: My Lords, the response. There has to be a cessation of tunnels. These flourishing of the freedom to practise religion is essential are attack tunnels; they are not just for goods and to the viability of a two-state solution. This freedom is supplies. It is people going down these tunnels to come under increasing pressure. I agree with the noble Lord, out at the other end and attack civilians within the Lord Cope, that faith leaders have a duty to act State of Israel. These tunnels are being built with together—but there are other factors. On 17 February, concrete and building materials which should go to without notice, the Israeli police entered the Church of the building and restoring of the houses, hospitals and the Holy Sepulchre, blocked the entry of worshippers schools within Gaza. and pilgrims, and closed the church for four hours. As has been said by noble Lords, one of the This sort of action represents the all too frequent requirements would be the granting of citizenship of disruption that the Christian community experiences— the new state of Palestine to all who live in the West action that often increases around Easter. Muslims Bank and Gaza. On the subject of those refugees who suffer, too. All West Bank Muslim males aged 16 to 45 live in UNWRA refugee camps, I was appalled by the are routinely banned from praying at the al-Aqsa way they live and the fact that there is no barbed wire mosque on security grounds. GC 107 Israel and Palestine[LORDS] Israel and Palestine GC 108

[THE LORD BISHOP OF SOUTHWARK] I would love to see the Government recognise Palestine Freedom to practise religion is further exacerbated as a first step towards breathing new life into the peace when it strikes at the work of the church in cross- process. It is in the interests of all who love Israel, community support. The Cremisan situation is a particular Palestine and the wider Middle East that we, as a example here. The Israeli plan to site the separation Government, and our international partners do all barrier through land which supports the livelihoods of that we can to support the moderate, secular Palestinian more than 50 Christian families and the two religious authority. communities which run a school and a vineyard puts at risk a delicate infrastructure. The school, which 1.25 pm educates people from across the Palestinian community, will be separated from its pupils. The land—a vital Lord Hannay of Chiswick (CB): My Lords, I shall source of income—will be annexed and what remains necessarily speak in telegraph-ese in this absurdly truncated will be separated from the community’s buildings. but remarkably timely debate, for which I thank my Israel asserts that the separation barrier is necessary noble friend Lord Luce. I will make four salient points. for its security; that is a legitimate concern. Whatever First, it is frequently asserted that the two-state the outcome, the route of the barrier will be illegal solution is dead or dying. I disagree. No one has yet unless it divides the settlement of Har Gilo on the put forward a viable alternative to it that has any Green Line. This does not appear to be the current chance of assuring Israel’s future security, the rights of intention of the Israeli Government. the Palestinian people and the peace of Israel’s Arab The problem with interference in the practice of neighbours. The international community needs to religion and the frustration of Palestinian Christians’ persevere with that approach, however unpropitious attempts to serve the whole community is that it the circumstances. actively undermines the position of moderate voices in Secondly, over many decades I have in good faith the Holy Land. We must remember the call for the argued with my Arab friends that they should give recognition of Palestine, made by the Christian leaders absolute priority to the peace process and not pursue in Jerusalem and endorsed in a joint statement on status issues which might damage the prospects for 13 October last year by the Roman Catholic Bishop of such negotiations. I no longer hold that view. The Clifton and the Bishop of Coventry. I would be grateful Netanyahu Government have tested it to destruction to hear from the Minister what particular steps are by their policy of expanding settlements and by their being taken in regard to the situation in the Cremisan abuse of their undoubted right to self-defence through Valley and, more generally, to the supporting of disproportionate use of force in Gaza. I believe that communities of faith in the practice of their religion, Britain should support, not just abstain on, the recognition which must be an essential element in the securing of a of Palestine’s status. It is the only viable way of promoting long-term, viable and stable peace. the legal, practical and political case for a two-state solution. 1.23 pm Thirdly, Mr Netanyahu has, with the help of Republicans who should know better, ridden roughshod Baroness Morris of Bolton (Con): My Lords, I over every convention of international diplomacy by declare my interests as set out in the register. We must pursuing his election campaign in an overseas legislature. never forget that this is not simply a question of one I shall reciprocate and say that I hope that the Israeli people seeking autonomy from another. As Max people, in their wisdom, in this month’s election will Blumenthal said in his book Goliath, this is about, choose a new Prime Minister and a new Government “people living under a regime of separation, grappling with the who will be ready to revive the negotiating process. consequences of ethnic division in a land with no defined Fourthly, I trust that whatever the outcome of borders”. those elections, and whatever the outcome of our To that I would add that it is also about people living elections, our Government will work tirelessly with under the daily grind of occupation. our European partners and the US to revive the peace process and will not be discouraged by all the difficulties Last year Laurence Brass, the former treasurer of which will inevitably arise. To neglect this issue or to the Board of Deputies of British Jews, spoke out relegate it to the “too difficult” slot would be to court about the miserable conditions he witnessed when he a subsequent painful reminder that the Middle East visited the West Bank. Following criticism of his will never be at peace without a solution to the problem statements he was supported by former Israeli of Palestine. ambassadors and a former Israeli Attorney-General, who praised his willingness to see the grim reality on the ground in the West Bank—and to that we must 1.27 pm add the appalling situation in Gaza. Lord Davies of Stamford (Lab): My Lords, the Time is running out and I fear that the resilience noble Lord, Lord Luce, in introducing this debate, and amazing good humour of the Palestinian people said a number of very wise things, but I thought that is at breaking point. With the help of British aid, the he was less than balanced and less than fair in ignoring Palestinian Authority has built the necessary structures entirely the many attempts over the years by Israel to for statehood and, despite the longest occupation in establish a dialogue leading to peace. Just to take the modern history, the Palestinians are highly educated most recent examples—because the problem has existed and have universities, hospitals, a rich cultural life and since the beginning of the Jewish-Palestinian relationship leaders who believe in peace. in that area—there was the rejection of Ehud Barak’s GC 109 Israel and Palestine[5 MARCH 2015] Israel and Palestine GC 110 proposals at Camp David and the consequences of the and moral obligation to promote vigorously their pursuit Israelis withdrawing from Gaza, which, far from leading of a peaceful two-state solution in the best interests of to peace and stability, actually created a nest of terrorism the Israelis, the Palestinians, the region and our own and constant missile attacks on Israel. Naturally, that wider security. has left Israeli public opinion with the idea that, far from there being a necessarily positive relationship 1.31 pm between sacrificing land for peace, there is probably an inverse relationship between the two, which is a major Baroness Ludford (LD): My Lords, the noble Lord, factor in the present situation. There was also the Lord Luce, said that settlements were the biggest period when Israel declared a unilateral suspension of impediment to peace. I do not agree. However, that all activities related to building settlements. For nine does not mean that I approve of settlement-building—far months, the Palestinians did not respond at all; they from it. I am a declared friend of Israel, although let the opportunity go completely. certainly not a fan of the present Government. I believe that occupation is toxic to Israeli polity and Nevertheless, I share some of the concerns that society, as well as miserable for Palestinians. However, have been expressed about the policies of the present the lack of progress in peace negotiations cannot be Government and of Mr Netanyahu. It was a profound blamed solely on Israel. As the noble Lord, Lord mistake, last year, to suspend peace talks because of Davies, said, the Palestinians have rejected many the formation of the Palestinian unity Government. If opportunities. there is going to be peace, it obviously has to include Gaza as well as the West Bank and it has to include I was unable to participate in the debate on 29 January. Hamas as well as Fatah. The Israelis themselves would However, reading it afterwards, I was struck by the set no value whatever on a deal with Fatah if Hamas number of speakers who talked about how unilateral could go on exercising violence and threatening the recognition of a state of Palestine would send a message existence of Israel. or a signal, or be a symbol—of what I was not quite clear. A sustainable long-term settlement can be achieved What is more, clearly there can be no settlement only through bilateral negotiations involving difficult unless there is unity in the Palestinian camp, or at least compromises on both sides. Unilateral recognition of a consensus between the major parties in it, for the Palestine is a cul-de-sac, not a catalyst for progress. It simple reason that, otherwise, anything that was agreed might satisfy an urge among some of us for “something by Fatah or by Mahmoud Abbas would be denounced to be done” but it does not achieve movement. by Hamas as treason to the Palestinian cause, and there would be no possibility of a settlement. Therefore, Israel set no preconditions for the resumption of it seems to me a positive, not a negative, feature that direct talks in 2013. It is broadly assumed that it the two Palestinian groups have come together. That would give up all but about 3% of the West Bank should have been welcomed rather than treated as a through land swaps. Israel needs recognition and security, reason for suspending all contact with the other side. and the confidence of having a predominantly Jewish, democratic state. Former UK chief negotiator Dennis Ross recently wrote: 1.29 pm “It’s fair to ask the Israelis to accept the basic elements that Lord Dannatt (CB): My Lords, I am sure we all make peace possible—1967 lines as well as land swaps and agree that this is a timely debate because it would seem settlement building limited to the blocks. But isn’t it time to that, elsewhere, energy has gone out of the Middle demand the equivalent from the Palestinians on two states for two East peace process. peoples, and on Israeli security? Isn’t it time to ask the Palestinians to respond to proposals and accept resolutions that address I recall that in the aftermath of 9/11, there was Israeli needs and not just their own?”. much talk of not taking any significant action as a I agree with those remarks. consequence until there was some measureable progress in the Middle East peace process. Nevertheless, despite 1.33 pm no progress at the time, much action was taken. That action has provoked the reaction across the Muslim Lord Green of Deddington (CB): My Lords, I declare and Arab world with which we are all too familiar, an interest as a former chairman of Medical Aid for with the unfortunate shifting of the focus away from Palestinians. the Middle East peace process to the fight within First, I strongly endorse the remarks of the noble Islam between Shia and Sunni states and groups. The Lord, Lord Luce, and indeed those of the noble Lord, Iran nuclear threat has also now gained a higher Lord Hannay. I was very interested to hear his support profile than the Middle East peace process. for the recognition of Palestine. That is something The downside of this diversion of focus has allowed which I, too, support, as I made clear in the debate on the Israelis to continue their settlement programme, 29 January. I will not repeat it today. Nor do I making the ambition of a two-state solution that underestimate the political problems that the Israeli much more difficult to achieve. I wonder now whether Government face. None the less, I think that it is a a two-state solution is still viable or whether, when sensible way forward. compared to a one-state solution, it remains the least Instead, I would like to support the noble Baroness, unattractive of a series of unattractive options. Lady Morris, in drawing attention to conditions on If one comes to the conclusion that a two-state the ground in Gaza. The chief executive of Medical solution is still the best—or the least worst—option, I Aid for Palestinians has just returned from there. He hope that Her Majesty’s Government, notwithstanding has reported that he has never seen the place more other distractions, will continue to discharge our historic depressed. Only 5% of the money pledged last summer GC 111 Israel and Palestine[LORDS] Israel and Palestine GC 112

[LORD GREEN OF DEDDINGTON] and unsustainable; we oppose the settlement policy; to rebuild has actually arrived. As for health, he and we all broadly know what the boundaries of the reported that there were, again, severe shortages of two states will be. That leaves us with two big unanswered drugs and consumables. Many of the medical staff questions, which are linked. First, what sort of state have been unpaid or getting only 60% of their salaries, do noble Lords believe that the proposed Palestinian and there are 8,000 unexploded munitions around the state will be as things now stand, realistically, and place, which are a terrible danger to children, several what will be its model—Iran, Iraq, Syria, Saudi Arabia, of whom underwent surgery while he was there. Libya, Bahrain, Lebanon, Egypt or Qatar? It is not Lastly, I draw attention to an article in Haaretz on shaping up to be Sweden, nor is it shaping up to be 26 February by Gideon Levy. He reported that “Gaza’s Israel. This may be controversial, but it is simply a disaster is dreadful” and cited the case of a baby girl in realistic view of what is happening. Beit Hanoun who froze to death in the makeshift Who, then, would wish to live next door to a shelter in which she and her family had been living, neighbour likely to prove violent? That is the second “since their house was bombed. ‘She was frozen like ice cream,’ question. For 40 years, Israel has been asked by well her mother said”, meaning noble Lords to surrender strategic defence of the last night of her baby’s life. These are the positions to Syria as an act of trust in the Assad realities on the ground behind the endless diplomacy. family. Who would volunteer to have the Assads running A two-state solution cannot come too soon. the next-door borough council or to have Hamas there—except in the fantasy version of the noble 1.35 pm Baroness, Lady Tonge—or Hezbollah, or ISIS? Noble Lords urging unilateral recognition step around Baroness Tonge (Ind LD): My Lords, one would this problem by the extraordinary feat of neglecting have thought, with our Government’s promotion of to mention Hamas at all, or pretending that it is democracy worldwide, that when Hamas won the election something it is not. The failure to grapple with this is in Palestine in 2006, which was monitored by the astonishing. European Union, we would then have talked with Hamas leaders to find out their agenda for the future There cannot be peace in the Middle East until we of their country. Instead of taking that opportunity, can imagine a peaceful, democratic Palestinian state, the election result was not accepted and Hamas retreated willing to let the Jews live in peace. It is just nonsense to run the Gaza enclave, as we know, where the people to say that there would be peace without settlements, have been held in an open prison and attacked viciously because there was no peace before settlements. Why by Israel ever since. The Gazan people stand guilty of do we talk of a 1967 border? It is because there was a defending themselves. war in 1967 that created it. We are often told that the Jews should learn the lesson of the Holocaust. That is Another opportunity was missed when the European quite right, and one of the key lessons is not to trust court ruled last December that Hamas was no longer the security of the Jewish people to compassionate, to be categorised as a terrorist organisation—a ruling liberal people who cannot recognise murderous extremists which has been appealed by the European Union and when they are staring in our faces and pointing guns. ourselves. When I and other parliamentarians have met Khaled Meshaal and other Hamas leaders over the past few 1.40 pm years, they have been quite clear in their position, Lord Hylton (CB): My Lords, the politics of humanity which is that while Hamas cannot bring itself to demand the ending of the blockade of Gaza, the recognise the right of Israel to exist, it recognises, phasing out of Israel’s occupation of the West Bank however, the existence of Israel within the 1967 borders. and fair access for all the world to the holy places of It offers an indefinite truce—a hudna—with the State Bethlehem and Jerusalem. Of course, Israel’s security of Israel within those borders and demands the release is critical, but it cannot trump the interests of peace. of prisoners, including those parliamentarians who Security can be handled by many techniques and by were arrested after the elections in 2006. They do not disarmament, but above all by local and regional mention the right of return for all the refugees spread agreements. Funds pledged for Gaza must be paid up. all over the Middle East. This is urgent to prevent children dying from a poor They are very clear about these messages. I have diet and cold and wet conditions. Life-saving repairs heard them on two occasions; others have heard them, must be done now. too. I heard them transmitted again yesterday evening at a meeting in this place—not by members of Hamas, We have the right to demand that Israel ceases in case your Lordships all want to duck under the collective punishments and all illegal acts. Keeping desks. They want the opportunity to give these three international law will earn respect for Israel, and messages face-to-face to European and American build confidence for two-state and wider agreements. negotiators. Will the Minister tell us why this cannot This would benefit the whole of the Middle East happen? and the Islamic world. Recognising the notional Palestinian state would be a step towards two full states before it is too late. Peace must prevail. Our 1.37 pm Government should stop balancing interests and help Lord Finkelstein (Con): My Lords, in this Room all sides to behave humanely. Palestine deserves the there is a surprising degree of consensus. We all support complete self-determination that Israel has enjoyed a two-state solution; we regard the status quo as tragic for so long. GC 113 Israel and Palestine[5 MARCH 2015] Israel and Palestine GC 114

1.41 pm Palestinian Territories. The UK’s long-standing position on the Middle East peace process is well known; we Lord Bach (Lab): I thank the noble Lord, Lord support a negotiated settlement leading to a safe and Luce, and congratulate him on obtaining the debate secure Israel living alongside a viable and sovereign and all speakers for their much too short but expert Palestinian state. Such a vision is based on 1967 borders contributions. The Opposition of courses support what with agreed land swaps, with Jerusalem as the shared has been British foreign policy now under Governments capital, and a just, fair and agreed settlement for of all colours for many years: namely, a two-state refugees. We share the deep frustration felt in this solution to the tragic impasse—I use the same word as Room today at the lack of progress towards achieving the noble Lord, Lord Luce—that has existed for far this vision. We will continue to push for progress too long. The impasse has resulted in so many lives towards peace and lead the way in supporting Palestinian being lost, so much agony for Israelis and Palestinians state-building and measures to address Israel’s security alike and so much danger to the rest of the world. concerns. As good a symbol as any of this long-standing tragedy is Gaza today, and all those killed and injured, The noble Baroness, Lady Tonge, asked why we do so many children among them, in last summer’s events. not talk to Hamas. Our policy on Hamas remains The human cost of the failure to negotiate a lasting clear: it must renounce violence, recognise Israel and and sustainable agreement is all too apparent in the accept previously signed agreements. Hamas must make continued trauma, destruction and insecurity, not just credible movement towards these conditions, which in Gaza but in the West Bank and in Israel itself. We of remain the benchmark against which its intentions course support Her Majesty’s Government in their should be judged. We call on those in the region with contribution to the reconstruction effort in Gaza, but influence over Hamas to encourage it to take those we are concerned that too much of the money pledged steps. Further, the noble Baroness asked a specific by international donors has not translated into actual question about the European court decision to annul disbursements. I wonder if the Minister could comment the Hamas EU designation. The court judgment is on that. procedural and does not mean that the EU and UK have changed its position on Hamas. The effects of the It is one of the concerns of the donors that there EU Hamas listing, including asset freezes, remain in has been a failure so far of the technocrat unity place. We will work with partners to ensure that the Government agreed by Hamas and Fatah in April last Hamas listing at the EU is maintained. Hamas’s military year to take control of Gaza. We believe that it is wing has been proscribed in the UK since 2001 under important, if we are not to see some ghastly repeat of separate UK legislation, which is not affected by last summer, that the international community remains December’s EU General Court judgment. focused on efforts to stop Hamas building up its arsenal and rebuilding tunnels or firing thousands of While the UK has not yet recognised a Palestinian rockets into Israel itself. We want to see the blockade state, the Government have long said that they would of Gaza ending. The cycle that we have seen in recent like to see a sovereign, independent, democratic, years of rocket attacks, periodic incursions and permanent contiguous and viable Palestinian state living in peace blockades has not brought the lasting peace and security and security, side by side with Israel. We reserve the that Israeli citizens deserve and the justice that Palestinians right to recognise a Palestinian state bilaterally at a have long waited for. moment of our choosing and when we judge that it can best help bring about peace. We remain convinced that only negotiations can deliver a solution that ends 1.43 pm the conflict once and for all, and that they are the most effective way for Palestinian aspirations of statehood The Minister of State, Foreign and Commonwealth to be met on the ground. That is what we are continuing Office (Baroness Anelay of St Johns) (Con): My Lords, to work towards. Either we move towards peace, as at the risk of disobeying my former Chief Whip, my noble Lords have said today, with the strong support noble friend Lord Cope, I add my thanks to the noble of the region and the wider international community, Lord, Lord Luce, for tabling today’s debate. It is or we face an uncertain and dangerous future. indeed timely. It is a subject on which all noble Lords have made significant contributions, despite the narrow Several noble Lords referred specifically to the peace limit of two minutes for most of those taking part in process itself and strongly commended Secretary Kerry this debate. In response, given my own time limit of for his tireless efforts to deliver a final status deal. We 12 minutes, I shall address the main themes that have strongly support his work. Whatever the disappointments been raised today: the UK Government’s position on of 2014, Secretary Kerry has made it clear that progress the Middle East peace process; what the parties must was made. But it is vital that Israel and the Palestinians do; what the regions should do; and Gaza. take advantage of any momentum gathered; it is vital I start by saying that I am grateful to the noble that they commit to restarting the process, and focus Lord, Lord Bach, for making clear the Opposition’s once again on finding common ground. position in continuing their support. I am clear that So what must the parties do? They must take steps the way in which the British Government can play a to build an environment conducive to peace, and they constructive part and speak with a strong voice is by must avoid actions which undermine the viability of a speaking as a united Government and Opposition. two-state solution. In this regard, I am as one with I turn first to the Government’s position on the noble Lords who are deeply concerned by Israel’s Middle East peace process, and how we see the prospects decision to freeze the transfer of tax revenues to the for a two state-solution for Israel and the Occupied Palestinian Authority. This is contrary to Israel’s GC 115 Israel and Palestine[LORDS] Sport: Women in Rowing GC 116

[BARONESS ANELAY OF ST JOHNS] religion must be protected. I know that the Government obligations as an occupying power. We urge Israel to have worked strongly to support the position of those fulfil its legal obligations under the 1994 Paris protocol, of all faiths in the area and that these matters are transfer the revenues without delay and refrain from discussed at the Human Rights Council and in the taking any further punitive action, including announcing United Nations. All those of faith have a role to play. new settlements. There must also be progress for Palestinians in We have repeatedly condemned Israel’s announcements Gaza. Noble Lords, in particular my noble friend to expand settlements in the Occupied Palestinian Lady Morris and the noble Lord, Lord Hylton, described Territories, including East Jerusalem. As the noble the terrible situation there. At the Cairo reconstruction Lord, Lord Luce, pointed out, as well as being illegal conference, we pledged a further £20 million to kick-start under international law, settlements undermine the Gaza’s recovery. The noble Lord, Lord Bach, asked possibility of a two-state solution to the Israeli-Palestinian about disbursal. We have disbursed a quarter of our conflict and those working for a sustainable peace. funding, but we agree that other donors have not come The Palestinian Authority must also show leadership. up to scratch and we call on all donors to fulfil their It must recommit to dialogue with Israel and to making financial pledges to aid the reconstruction efforts in progress on governance and security for Palestinians Gaza without delay. I should point out that our pledge in Gaza, as well as the West Bank. We note the of £20 million was in addition to our earlier provision Palestinian Authority’s recent decisions to sign a number of £19.1 million in UK aid in response to the crisis. of conventions, including the Rome statute of the That relates to Gaza itself, not the wider area of International Criminal Court. While we understand reconstruction. that the Palestinian Authority is seeking alternate There is a problem with money, but there is also a ways to deliver the state that the Palestinian people physical problem with being able to get materials into deserve, there can be no substitute for negotiations Gaza to enable the works to make progress. This is with Israel. Negotiations must remain the focus. partly caused by the security situation in Sinai and the What should the region do? I agree with all noble Egyptian response to that, and partly by the situation Lords who made the strong point that the international between Israel and the Palestinians in Gaza. There are community can and must do more to support US-led limits to what donors can achieve without a political efforts to find a viable, permanent solution to the solution. As a priority, we continue to urge both conflict. I agree with the noble Lord, Lord Luce, that parties to ensure that the ceasefire is durable. It must regional players have a significant role to play. Through address Israel’s security concerns and ensure that the Arab peace initiative, Arab states have offered movement and access restrictions are lifted. We therefore Israel the normalisation of relations in the event of a urge the parties to resume serious negotiations to comprehensive peace agreement. This opportunity must reach a durable ceasefire and tackle the underlying be seized upon as part of a relaunched negotiation causes of the conflict. process. It signals the benefits that peace would bring We strongly believe that dialogue is the only way to for the entire region. ensure a lasting solution to the Middle East peace process. We will continue to work closely with the US, We also agree on the need to promote economic the EU and the wider international community to development for the Palestinians to support the political re-energise the process. Once a new Israeli Government process. That is why we are supporting the Office of are formed following elections on 17 March, the the Quartet Representative, whose economic initiative international community must take note to redouble aspires to grow rapidly the Palestinian economy over a its efforts working with the new Government to move three-year period. We are aware of the Israeli peace the process forwards. Ultimately, Israeli and Palestinian initiative and the work on the important role that civil leaders must show the courage, determination and society has in generating ideas to resolve the Israeli- creative leadership to make the compromises that a Palestinian conflict. deal will require. When they show such leadership, we Europe must also remain a key partner in the peace and our partners will be ready to show our full support. process. In December 2013, we led EU efforts to set out an unprecedented package of political, economic and security support that Europe would offer to both 1.56 pm parties in the event of a final status agreement. That package remains on the table, should the parties return Sitting suspended. to negotiations—but much more needs to be done, and we will continue to work closely with our EU partners to support both sides in taking bold, necessary steps. Sport: Women in Rowing My noble friend Lord Cope and the right reverend Question for Short Debate Prelate the Bishop of Southwark referred in particular to the duty of the faith communities in their varied forms. I agree with my noble friend Lord Cope that 2pm there is a duty on religious leaders to play their part on Asked by Lord Thomas of Gresford the route to finding peace. It is vital that Israel, the Palestinian Authority and Jordan work together to To ask Her Majesty’s Government what plans maintain the long-standing status quo at Temple Mount/ they have to encourage women to participate in the Haram al-Sharif and other historic sites. Freedom of sport of rowing at every level of ability. GC 117 Sport: Women in Rowing[5 MARCH 2015] Sport: Women in Rowing GC 118

Lord Thomas of Gresford (LD): My Lords, on side of the sport. Last June, Grosvenor Ladies won 11 April, Oxford and Cambridge women’s crews will the Leicester cup for coxed fours at the Henley Women’s race over the Putney/Mortlake 6.8 kilometre course Regatta, with two of the crew coming to rowing for for the first time ever. When in 1927 the first women’s the first time through Learn to Row courses on the race between the universities took place at Oxford, River Dee. large and hostile crowds gathered on the towpath to protest. It was conceded that it was unladylike to row However, if there is a drive for more participation, side by side, so the crews competed on time and style. it has to be backed up with support both in the clubs Oxford were quicker but some of the umpires thought and by funding. It is not expensive for the individual that Cambridge were more stylish. but it does collectively require expensive equipment— although boats and oars can be used over and over Prejudice persisted. In the 1960s, a Cambridge college again with proper timetabling. captain—male, of course—objected to women racing altogether. He complained: I turn to access. Of the 43,000 miles of inland river “It is a ghastly sight, an anatomical impossibility and and canal waterways, 2,800 miles are currently in use physiologically dangerous”. for rowing. The potential for shared water use is By 1973, male attitudes had not improved. In the race considerable. Chester Royals, founded in 1838 and one that took place on the Cam, the boats nearly collided of the oldest clubs in the country, have initiated a when a male spectator trumpeted the “Last Post” at proposal for the development of a new water sports the start. Talking about press coverage, the Times hub at their boathouse on the Dee, in conjunction correspondent in 1973 thought it right to refer to the with West Cheshire and Chester councils. Incidentally, fact that the rowers had ankles, thighs, biceps and, like nearby Grosvenor, their captain is a lady, Jane most shockingly of all, padded seats, and that the Sweeney, the first to be club captain in the Royals’ winning crew had celebrated on beer and sang bawdy 177-year history. I declare an interest as president of songs in a Cambridge curry house afterwards. Rex Rowing Club, which rows nearby. The times of patronising women’s rowing have long I hope that the Minister will be able to confirm the gone. It is a sport that has earned the right in this Government’s commitment to initiatives of this nature. country to be treated with equality and parity. At However, last November, as co-chair of the All-Party Sydney in the 2000 Olympics, the GB women’s four Parliamentary Rowing Group, I wrote to the Secretary gained silver medals for the first time, and they repeated of State, Mr Javid, and I regret that I have not, as yet, that success at Athens and Beijing with rowers of the had a reply. I drew attention to the plight of the calibre of Katherine Grainger and Debbie Flood. Hillingdon Rowing Club, which was set up in 2012 Bronze medals were also won in the double sculls. In with post-Olympic enthusiasm and is the only rowing London in 2012, Helen Glover and Heather Stanning, club with many women novices in the area to the both graduates of British rowing’s Start programme, north-west of London. Hillingdon Outdoor Activity unforgettably began a haul of gold medals in the Centre caters for a number of water sports and coxless pairs. Katherine Grainger with Anna Watkins accommodates rowing on a course of about 700 metres. won gold for the first time in the double sculls, and Unhappily, it is on the route of the HS2 railway. The Katherine Copeland and Sophie Hosking romped home club’s proposal to relocate to nearby Broadwater Lake, in the lightweight pairs. In the Paralympics, golds were where there is a stretch of some 1,200 metres, has been won by Pamela Relph, Naomi Riches and Lily van met by opposition from Natural England because of den Broecke. What those outstanding athletes did was the number of waterfowl on the water. Rowing ought to inspire women of all ages and abilities to take up to be accepted as a natural and beneficial use of our the sport. waterways. It is not all about the Olympics or university sport. Volunteering is crucial to successful rowing. Coaching In 1927 the very first Women’s Eights Head of the is key, and regrettably there is a dearth of women River Race took place over the tideway course, with coaches. I am grateful to Lisa Taylor, an experienced just two clubs competing. As late as the 1980s, the coach who has written a thesis on the subject, who event attracted only 50 crews—but in 2013, following pointed out to me that lack of coaching may put off the Olympics, the 73rd race attracted 320 entries and underconfident women. It may also have an impact on some 2,880 active women participants. A week on the retention of newcomers, because more ambitious Saturday next, for the 75th race, there will again be in athletes may feel unable to progress without a higher excess of 300 crews on the river. The competitors coaching input. Coaching is like lining up eight golfers range in age from 15 to 70-plus—from beginners to on an expanded golf tee and requiring each to swing in international competitors. time and in harmony so as to hit the sweet spot on the Last weekend, I was able to talk to the captain of ball at exactly the same moment, and then to repeat the Grosvenor Rowing Club of Chester, Louise Tobias. the stroke up to 30 times a minute for 20 minutes. She epitomises the women who are now attracted to Those who want to see poetry in motion will no doubt the sport. Louise was a hockey player, but, in her watch the House of Lords crew next July as they shoot mid-30s, at the time of the Beijing Olympics, she was under Lambeth Bridge. There are no stars. Teamwork inspired by the British women rowers in action and is about getting the best out of every member of the decided to have a go herself. She joined a Learn to crew. To meet the demand for coaches, I invite the Row course and was soon into competitive rowing. Minister to consider whether employers should allow She enjoys the elation in winning and the devastation volunteers one or two paid days off a year to attend of losing. She and her family revel in the strong social accredited coaching courses. GC 119 Sport: Women in Rowing[LORDS] Sport: Women in Rowing GC 120

[LORD THOMAS OF GRESFORD] Beijing Games in 2008, it was Britain’s Helene Raynsford I turn to identifying talent. British rowing has honed who steamed through to win gold, the first Paralympic its talent identification process of the past 15 years or gold on the water, in the single sculls by over 12 seconds. so. It has had immense success with the women’s That is a sporting performance. That is impressive squad. British rowing in 2013 implemented a new rowing. programme led by England Talent Pathway coaches, It matters what happens at the high end—at the whereby a performance coach in a particular area Olympic and Paralympic Games—not just for those trawls local clubs and schools for juniors with potential performances, for the nation and for elite sport. It and develops them along GB best practice lines. They matters because role models are so important to driving educate the clubs and coaches so that they can keep participation and opportunities for people throughout nurturing talent when they have it—a sustainable pathway sport. There are so many impressive programmes from rather than a stop-gap. This scheme is in its infancy, British rowing, not least the Sportivate programme but it should be extended to adults for the benefit of inspired by London 2012—female participants now women who take up the sport at a later stage in their make up 49% of its rowing element. It is a similar lives. situation with the Start programme—the talent ID The Government’s Women and Sport Advisory Board programme already mentioned by my noble friend. is tackling the emotional capability and opportunity Before London 2012, the ratio of men to women was barriers preventing women from taking part in sport 4:1 on the talent programme. Now it is almost equal. generally. I hope to hear more of its work in this That is impressive progress. debate. The great thing about rowing is that it is not just On 11 April, thanks very much to the investment about the athletes and participants. It is a great sport and support of Newton Investments and BNY Mellon, because it has developed and believes in an inclusive women’s rowing will gain a massive new television culture right through the sport—whether you are an audience for their Putney to Mortlake race. I wish athlete, a volunteer, coach, official or an administrator, both crews as much enjoyment out of the event as no there are opportunities for anybody, whatever your doubt those pioneers of 1927 achieved in the teeth of background and wherever you want to go in the sport. male chauvinist opposition. I hope that the raised That is because it has been led right from the top. The profile of the sport will attract many more women to chair of British rowing for 20 years was Di Ellis: a find the camaraderie and companionship of a crew in tremendous performance. She has now been succeeded this country’s leading Olympic sport. by Annamarie Phelps, who is doing a phenomenal job. She comes from a rowing family that is so tied to the Lord Bourne of Aberystwyth (Con): My Lords, I Thames. I would not say that they have webbed feet, remind noble Lords that this is a time-limited debate but I can imagine that their semi in Chiswick could and that speeches are limited to 5 minutes. When five certainly be called The Boathouse. minutes shows on the screen, those minutes have elapsed. Such leadership is required in sport if you are truly to develop an inclusive culture. Electing Debbie Flood 2.10 pm as the first female captain of Leander and Sophie Hosking as the first female captain of the London Lord Holmes of Richmond (Con): My Lords, I Rowing Club is groundbreaking stuff. This is a great thank my noble friend Lord Thomas of Gresford for time for girls and women in sport, including across the securing this significant and timely debate. As a swimmer, sport of rowing, from the boat to the boardroom. To I have always had more than a passing admiration for anyone who has children who are girls, I say, “Get rowers. As we splash around in the pool, they seem to them into sport”. There is no better time—and rowing be able to glide gracefully on top of the water, clearly is a pretty good place to start, with fantastic opportunities as a more evolved species. right across the water. To those at the higher level It was women’s rowing, as already mentioned, that looking to the world championships and to Rio 2016, started the gold rush in London 2012. I was lucky I say, “Good luck, we support you, we salute you enough to be at Eton Dorney that day and what a and we look forward to celebrating your future moment it was. How significant it was for Glover and successes”. Stanning and for the sport of rowing—but it was even more significant for Team GB. There is nothing more important than the first gold medal for a host nation 2.15 pm at their home Games. It was followed by tremendous Baroness Walmsley (LD): My Lords, I would like to performances on the water and demonstrated that focus my remarks on both ends of the age scale. rowing is now not just a sport for the boys; it is very Perhaps I should start with older women. I started much for the girls. rowing at the age of 60 and still do it occasionally. I There is no question that Sir Steve Redgrave is would probably do it more often if it did not entail Britain’s most successful and prolific Olympian of all getting up so early in the morning. I have also been a time—five Games and five gold medals. But ever since member for several years of your Lordships’ House’s the late 90s, it is the girls who have come through and mixed-gender eight for the Lords and Commons boat shown, in tremendous gold, silver and bronze race on the Thames. This has been a mixed experience performances, that this is a sport that everybody can since the Thames can be like the North Sea in a storm participate in, perform in and excel at. When rowing when the wind is against the tide. However, on the was introduced to the Paralympic programme—an whole it has been an enjoyable and certainly a sociable excellent sport to be added to the programme—for the experience. GC 121 Sport: Women in Rowing[5 MARCH 2015] Sport: Women in Rowing GC 122

Rowing, I am told, is very good for me because it imaginative initiative, involving local authorities and helps to strengthen the core muscles, which get weaker many partners in taking account of women’s real lives as you get older. I know of an all-women crew in and bringing sport to them. I did not notice rowing in Australia called the Ancient Mariners, two of whom the list of sports but, if the scheme is rolled out across are over 80. I relate these facts in order to emphasise the country, does the Minister know whether rowing the fact that you do not need to be either young or an will be included wherever there is a suitable body of elite athlete to enjoy rowing and benefit from it. It is water? Can he tell us whether the initiative has yet one of those sports that you can take up at any age been analysed and what plans there are to roll it out? and do either for enjoyment or take it right to the top Will women’s rowing benefit? level. What is important is that we make provision for girls and women of all ages to row. 2.19 pm The Olympic legacy has brought about a tremendous Baroness Grey-Thompson (CB): My Lords, I am increase in interest in women’s rowing, to the extent delighted that the noble Lord, Lord Thomas of Gresford, that some adult clubs simply cannot cope with the has been able to secure this debate today. Rowing is a demand for Learn to Row courses. It is a great pity if fantastic sport with many fans. I am one of them. women are put off by having to wait many months for Apart from the Olympic and Paralympic Games and such a course and find a different sport where participation the Boat Race, there have been limited opportunities is easier. If we are going to develop the Olympians of to watch this sport on TV. We should be very proud of tomorrow, we must nurture the grass roots of today. Is the institution that is the Boat Race. It has a very there anything the Government can do to help here? special place in the hearts of the British public. At the other end of the scale there are girls who I found the opening speech of the noble Lord, Lord would like to take up rowing at school. Many independent Thomas, quite amusing when he explained how it was schools offer this facility, with boats, coaches and considered unladylike to race side by side. I am very accessible water, but what about young people at glad that in my own sporting career I was never maintained schools? Apart from the excellent Westminster marked on the skill and grace of my performance. I Boating Base which caters for many disadvantaged looked far more like somebody from the This Girl Can young rowers, it is often difficult for schools to find campaign: red, sweaty and snotty. I would definitely coaches and the money for boats. I therefore endorse have been considered unladylike, and I am very pleased the call of my noble kinsman Lord Thomas of Gresford about that. for employers to consider giving volunteers time off to Having the women’s Boat Race on the same day as train as rowing coaches as part of their community the men’s is a major step forward, but we must not service programme. forget that the women’s race has its own very proud Whatever the reality, there is a perception among history. Many casual fans might not know that the pupils and others that schools care more about, and women’s race exists, but it is not a new invention. We spend more money on, sport for boys than for girls. I should thank all those who got the race to where it is would not want to add to bureaucracy, but the decline now. Many women, and men, campaigned for it. Credit in girls’ participation in sport is sufficiently serious for should be given to Helene Morrissey, CEO of the there to be a need to ask schools to focus more sponsor and a Cambridge graduate, but not a rower. attention on girls’ sport. It has been suggested that this She is well known for her work on encouraging women. might most easily be done by an amendment to the Money makes a difference to what to what we are public sector equality duty for schools. In the United trying to do. Annie Vernon wrote about Miss Morrissey States there is a thing called Title IX legislation, which and said: makes it an offence for publicly funded institutions to “She refused to listen to excuses that women could not cope discriminate in funding between boys and girls or men with negotiating the tides and bends of the men’s 7000m course”— and women. That may not be appropriate here but we so in many ways it is remarkable how far we have need to find a way of achieving the same result. come. I was very interested in the House of Commons However, it is important that young women know a Culture, Media and Sport Committee report on bit of the history—and are slightly horrified by it. In girls and sport. It is concerned about the lack of the Chamber this morning, the Minister, the noble communication and co-operation between government Baroness, Lady Jolly, said in the International Women’s departments, which it thinks presents a serious obstacle Day debate that she did not want still to be talking to delivering the Olympic legacy. It recommends that about how far we have come in 20 years’ time, and that the DCMS, Department for Education and Department is very important. of Health publish a joint annual report to Parliament If we look back at the history of the Boat Race, in on school sport, focusing on participation levels, the 1927 there was much discussion about whether the availability of different types of sport, partnerships women should be allowed to wear shorts or more with clubs and charities, and training for teachers. demure gym tunics. One of the Cambridge rowers had Perhaps such an annual review would force departments to sit on a stool in front of university staff, simulating to work together and pool funding to achieve better the action of rowing, to ascertain which clothes best value. preserved her modesty. Even in 1985, there was a Sport England is doing a lot, in particular with its picture in one of the papers, which is shown on the This Girl Can initiative, though I am delighted to see BBC website, of the women’s team in their gowns and that many participants were girls many years ago. fishnet tights, showing their legs. I hope that we have Also its place-based pilot launched in Bury is an moved on a little from that. GC 123 Sport: Women in Rowing[LORDS] Sport: Women in Rowing GC 124

[BARONESS GREY-THOMPSON] events, only open and elite events for men. So perhaps For a bit of context, while we may consider some of investment by clubs and schools in women’s equipment, these views slightly idiosyncratic, in my sport of athletics, programmes and coaching does not have a high enough it was only in 1984 that women were allowed to priority. I hope that having the men’s and women’s compete in the marathon and a very few distance Boat Race on the same day will change this. races. Even in Moscow, the longest race women were allowed to do was the 1,500 metres, which was introduced only in 1972. Before 1960, it was considered safe for 2.26 pm women to run only 200 metres. It took until the 2000 Games in Sydney for women to be able to compete in Baroness Brady (Con): My Lords, I add my the pole vault. The excuse given each time was that it congratulations to the noble Lord, Lord Thomas, on would have a detrimental effect on their ability to bear securing this debate. Indeed, I am delighted to participate. children. Tell that to Paula Radcliffe or YelenaIsinbayeva. Sports governance is an issue very close to my heart, Looking back at 2012, it is hard to imagine anybody especially when we are talking about celebrating women’s being hostile towards our amazing Olympic and participation and trying to raise awareness of how we Paralympic athletes. I cried when Katherine Grainger can improve it. I stress that I am not a rower myself won—actually before she started. Ten strokes in, I but, according to the British Rowing Association, knew that she was going to be fine, and it was good. I rowing, am very proud that Kat Copeland, who is also a gold “is a low-impact sport, suitable for all ages and abilities and with medallist, lives in Ingleby Barwick, very close to where strong female representation across all types”. I live in the north-east of England. I drive past her So I will just say at this point, “Never say never”—I gold postbox most weeks. That is an amazing inspiration may joint the team at some point. for women who live around the River Tees, who can Despite not participating myself, the exploits of see rowing as an option for them going forward. British rowing have by no means passed me by. One of There are questions we still need to answer. As my abiding memories of watching Britain compete in rowing is a sport which is deeply entrenched in the the Olympics has been our extraordinary exploits in university structure, this is perhaps a place for Title IX rowing. I first remember Sir Steve Redgrave and Matthew to make the most impact. At Oxford this year, not Pinsent winning gold after gold in their amazing only are the men’s and women’s races being held partnership, which almost ended prematurely with the together for the first time but the men’s and women’s final gold at the Atlanta Games in 1996, when a teams will be together at the post-race dinner. Well seemingly exhausted Sir Steve gave his interviewer, done, Oxford; I hope that Cambridge will follow next and indeed anyone else watching, permission to “shoot” year. him if he went anywhere near a boat again—only for him to return four years later, thankfully unscathed, We should also be very proud of Helene Rainsford, and sporting another gold medal in Sydney. who other noble Lords have mentioned. She put women’s para-rowing on the map. In the interests of equality, in But at London 2012 it was the women who stole the the mixed coxed team of Pam Relph, Naomi Riches show, from Heather Stanning and Helen Glover in the and Lily van den Broecke, I will mention the two men coxless pairs winning our first gold of the Games, to in the team, David Smith and James Roe. I wonder the looks of utter surprise, bewilderment and joy on how they feel—is it how women feel most of the time, the faces of Katherine Copeland and Sophie Hosking being mentioned last? It is a little bit of a change in the lightweight skull. Finally, there was Katherine around. Grainger—what a story. In her fourth Games after three successive silver medals, she persisted, with the There are many challenges along the way for kind of grit and determination that I so admire. She Paralympic rowing, including accessibility. Rivers are came back again, redoubled her efforts, and this time not the most accessible places for wheelchair users to it was gold for her and teammate Anna Watkins in the be, but when I watch my daughter kayaking along the double skull—Britain’s ninth medal in women’s rowing River Tees I am frequently asked by members of the since 2000. Nine medals since 2000, with three golds rowing club whether I would like to join in. I very coming in 2012, cannot be a coincidence. This politely refuse, because I do not like moving water—but unprecedented success has been underpinned by a perhaps I could offer my services as a cheerleader for club network with impressive stats on women’s the Lords team. I will very happily sit and cheer from participation. the terrace; I hope that that is an appropriate place In a nutshell, we want that success to be made to be. permanent. So how does it look for women’s rowing? There are also challenges with sponsorship. Women’s Numbers from the British Rowing Association make sport is an excellent opportunity to get involved in for excellent reading, and it sounds as if success in the terms of branding, return on investment and encouraging London Games is being translated into more women people to think differently. Within our celebration, we getting involved. Noble Lords before me have mentioned must not forget that, back in 2013, British rowing various impressive statistics. A point very well made is carried out some research that was presented by Dr that not only are more women getting involved in the Alison Maitland, which showed that the traditional sport but leadership positions in rowing are increasingly clubs value men’s events and achievements above women’s. being held by women. As has been said, there has been For example, the Henley Women’s Regatta, which a female chairman for the past 27 years, Dame Di includes para-rowing, is not as valued by clubs as Ellis, and now we have chairman Annamarie Phelps, Henley Royal Regatta, which has no women’s club making a great impact. But we must keep pushing. GC 125 Sport: Women in Rowing[5 MARCH 2015] Sport: Women in Rowing GC 126

I commend a piece of research by Dr Alison Maitland good. I hope that we will hear why that occurred and of Brunel University, which concluded, among other have it put it into context. I will leave that one where it things, that barriers to increased participation include falls. a lack of opportunity at suitable times of the day and As has been said, general congratulation to rowing a lack of female coaches. As someone who is committed has to go forward, given that rowing now has to turn to empowering women, particularly working mothers away people from its clubs because it cannot deal with such as myself, to achieve their business goals, I can the great demand to take part. At the bedrock of any see that some of the same challenges might apply to sport is the participation level. We have already heard rowing. Providing weekday time slots is key to allowing from numerous people that you have to build capacity. for greater participation, but this is when only paid We will be able to continue to build that capacity only coaches are likely to be available, rather than volunteers. if we make sure that people can open new rowing British Rowing could look at repeating what it did at clubs. At all amateur clubs, somebody goes out as the Walton Rowing Club. It provided a paid coach to run missionary and says, “Let’s do something new”, inspired an adult improver programme, which attracted more by a great vision that this sport should be played—or women to row. having fallen out with the people at the club they were Just as in business, so in sport; we need to encourage at in the first place. It does not matter; they are still more women to have confidence to come forward and doing it. That is what is required to build capacity. volunteer in an environment they may not be familiar Every time somebody does this, they have to take on a with. With the help of British Rowing, clubs should series of bureaucracies that are national, local and provide more support and training to get women into internal to the sport. I hope that my noble friend will volunteering and coaching roles, which in turn will be able to tell us what the Government are doing lead to more female rowers. As has been said, we must centrally, and encouraging locally, to make sure that also praise schemes such as Women on Water and This those people go out and form a club. All political Girl Can, which encourage all women to get involved parties should look to this. in sport. Do we remember the idea of the big society? I know I am delighted to say that the future looks bright that is an election ago now, but amateur clubs in sport for women’s rowing. We must ensure that the governance are probably the epitome of that. If you take on a arrangements, the volunteer network, the facilities public good, you make sure that you can do it properly. and, yes, the funding, continue to be there to deliver You bring in bigger organisations and build a social the pipeline of talent needed to build on the success of background to it. Making sure that this can happen is 2012. Just as they were at Eton Dorney, I want to see incredibly important, and what the Government do is more women atop podiums in Rio de Janeiro in 2016, vital. I spoke to new rowing clubs in Oxford, Leeds Tokyo in 2020 and beyond. Let us do everything we and the Lake District. All said that their relationship can to make that happen again. with government was slightly patchy. Going north, they were Cheney Falcon Rowing Club, Leeds Rowing 2.30 pm Club—there had been no rowing club in a city of that size—and Lakeland Rowing Club. All had a mixed Lord Addington (LD): My Lords, I must declare bag when it came to dealing with local bureaucracy—and, one interest. I am the third member of the House of indeed, the bureaucracy with such things as universities Lords boat to be here. I am afraid I have to say to my and centres. Clubs with people who knew how to fill in noble friend Lord Thomas of Gresford that it is his forms did better. That is a lesson which all sports can fault, because I could not row before I got in there. I carry forward. can now row badly. My other sporting claim to fame is Trying to address this in order to allow people who that I am what is left of a rugby player. are doing a good thing to do it better is something that In talking about the esteem that women’s sport has we should expect of government. Doing this—not just to be held in, the Boat Race is important. It has funding but making sure that people can access and become something that conveys esteem. Until very get the best out of systems—is something which those recently, it was probably the only rowing that anybody of us in power should be encouraging. I hope that this had ever heard of. It was the time when the Thames will be a central thrust of everything we are doing became full of people having a pint and occasionally here. seeing a boat go past. Now, as we know, it is part of a huge international sport built upon the success of the Olympics. I hope that we will put this to use and make 2.35 pm sure that the esteem of the sport is seen, worked into Baroness Bottomley of Nettlestone (Con): My Lords, government and supported. it is most unusual for anyone in this House to hear me To take a slight diversion into my original sport of say anything derogatory about the Member of Parliament rugby, I hope that my noble friend the Minister can for West Worthing—but on this occasion I feel a need point out that esteem has to be carried in a message. I to do so. There are magnificent rowing clubs in Worthing have given him notice of this point. When England’s and I salute and pay tribute to them, but my condition men won the Rugby World Cup, they all got honours. for getting married was that my husband would come When England’s women won the Rugby World Cup, to Henley, because I come from a rowing family. My which they did as amateurs and not as part of their son is a member of Leander, my father was a member professional lives, only two got honours. It is not the of Leander, my great-uncle rowed in the Blue Boat, same sport but the message of esteem has to be there. my nephew rowed in the Blue Boat. This was a very There may be a good reason but it does not smell important matter and his rowing is quite appalling— GC 127 Sport: Women in Rowing[LORDS] Sport: Women in Rowing GC 128

[BARONESS BOTTOMLEY OF NETTLESTONE] information. People do not feel that they understand shameful. He swims well, he has joined British canoeing, the sport or know how to be a volunteer, but the club but rowing is not him. When I was first in the other has shown some wonderful examples. place I rowed once in the parliamentary eight, but had I will quickly speak about Hull—because rowing is to abandon it because there was no way I could row in not just a southern, elite sport. As chancellor of the the boat which would not encourage him to do so—and university, I pay tribute to Matt Evans, who was on then there would be more ignominy on the way. British Rowing’s Young Person’s Panel. He was very I am an oarswoman. Coastal rowing is me; the involved in the Hull University Boat Club, where there Seaview regatta on the Isle of Wight. I have won is a great deal of enthusiasm and a growing participation skulling races, particularly randan races. That is a very by women. Similarly, community rowing in Hull is exciting form of rowing, with three of you in a clinker-built equally important. Of course, they do more and I shall boat. I have even rowed in the Great River Race, which be writing about them getting a lottery award in the is an incredibly long distance. I fear that we have a near future. stranger in the Room who should not have been here. April 11 will be a wonderful day. The best person in I have identified a very poor rower in this Room. my family at the moment is our son who has bought a Nevertheless, be that as it may, I then discovered house exactly on the finishing post at Mortlake. He is recently, preparing for this critical debate, that my having a tremendous party to celebrate the women cousin rowed in the women’s Blue Boat in 1941. When rowing down the tideway—and no male rowing supporters I put this to my male relations, they all denied all will be admitted at all. knowledge of it. There is a long-standing problem in the relationship of male oarsmen to very distinguished 2.41 pm female oarswomen. Penelope Poulton, now aged 92, is delighted that she is being mentioned here today. Lord Collins of Highbury (Lab): My Lords, I cannot Similarly, my wonderful colleague, Clare Glackin, won pretend to be either an expert or an enthusiastic rower. in the Cambridge Blue Boat on two occasions in 1992. The extent of my involvement has been to use the So this year is a triumph. It is quite a dilemma as to machine in the gym. I seem to have more things in why it has taken so long for the women’s Boat Race to common with the noble Baroness’s husband—apart row on the tideway. from being in the same trade union branch, which I With others here I pay the warmest tribute to was very proud of. Clearly, we need to balance this Helena Morrissey. She has been such a force. In the debate in terms of the sides. I suggest that the rowing Chamber we have been debating female empowerment. team contact my noble friend Lady Hayter, who was a I have already spoken there, as has my noble friend rowing blue. She could be another recruit to the team. Lady Brady, and we paid tribute to the voluntary Compared with many other sports, rowing has an movement—not quotas—that has resulted in the quite impressive record in both changing attitudes to, and extraordinary increase of women on boards, so that increasing the participation level of, women. The Olympic we are now in a very good place indeed. Helena effect on rowing was enormous in 2011 to 2013, and I Morrissey is entitled to a great deal of that credit. She suspect that it will still be evident. As a direct consequence founded the 30% Club and she said the other day, very of UK Sport and National Lottery funding, women interestingly, that, rowers have won, as we have heard in the debate, nine “the relatively low proportion of girls participating particularly in Olympic medals since 2000, including three golds. team sports at school has a bearing on many aspects of how That Olympic and Paralympic success has inspired women’s lives develop—not just our health but our careers, too, girls to take part in rowing. Prior to London 2012, and in business. It’s all part of a continuum that starts very early uptake for the Start programme had a ratio of 4:1 in life, leading to different experiences and expectations for women male to female participants. Since 2012, the ratio is compared with men … the importance of learning to be part of a team, depended upon and depending on others, playing to personal almost equal. strengths and respecting the complementary skills of others”. As the noble Baroness, Lady Walmsley, said, clubs Sport teaches people, were delighted that the profile was so high—but, sadly, “to deal with performance nerves, to overcome disappointments, the majority were unable to cope with such a huge to have the strength of character to carry on when losing—and to influx of beginners. I know this first-hand from my enjoy victories. If girls have less opportunity to develop these niece and nephew who live in Chertsey, an area where skills, that surely puts them at a disadvantage in many other you would expect to be able to row. But local Learn to situations”. Row courses were massively oversubscribed even before From my perspective, rowing, of all sports, is the the Olympics. Clearly, if you drive up participation, ultimate team game. There is no space for a prima you need to back it up with support in the clubs. donna at all. However good your stroke is, if it is not British Rowing is doing some of this, but clubs need to in time with the next person’s stroke, you are out of the make it a priority. boat. The other reason why I particularly enjoy rowing British Rowing now has 31,000 members, of whom is that it is the one very competitive, very intense 43% are female, compared with 38% in 2009. In the activity where you spend all of your time going year following London 2012, 50% of new members backwards—totally trusting your future to the cox at were under 18 and 48% were female. As the noble the other end. Lord, Lord Holmes, said, British Rowing is committed Good points have been made about the importance to promoting equality within the sport, setting an of coaches. I am particularly pleased that my local example for other national governing bodies, from rowing club at Guildford has done a lot of work on grass roots to Olympic and Paralympic rowers. I read encouraging volunteers to have more knowledge and in the briefing provided by the noble Lord that the GC 129 Sport: Women in Rowing[5 MARCH 2015] Sport: Women in Rowing GC 130

Lea Rowing Club is a great example of where attitude Lady Brady and the noble Baroness, Lady Grey- change produces results. The focus on men’s and women’s Thompson—I would like to call her my noble friend— rowing there has shifted in the past few years to the both spoke of the great national pride there has been point where they have an entirely equal focus. The and will continue to be in these exceptional achievements. women’s eight won the intermediate level competition UK Sport is investing £36 million in rowing and for clubs at women’s Henley in 2013. That result para-rowing through this Olympic cycle. It is the highest- demonstrated that a club could achieve results on a funded Olympic programme and it continues to yield national level with women who were recruited as beginners. success. Some 41% of rowers and 31% of para-rowers British Rowing and Sport England research suggests on the World Class Performance Programme are women. that barriers to women’s participation include a lack This great sport has given us some outstanding role of local access, a lack of opportunities at appropriate models—your Lordships have highlighted a number times of day, a lack of daytime rowing and a lack of of them. We all remember those huge successes of female coaches. Again, that is an issue that can be 2012. It would be invidious to seek to name-check replicated in other sports. them all but we are fortunate to have them. My noble British Rowing works with other water-based sports friend Lord Holmes of Richmond spoke of the emotions for joint use of facilities. That is important, but the of being there and of the inspiration that those support of local authorities is critical. Will the Minister extraordinary and exceptional rowers provided. They assure the Committee that this will be further encouraged? were not only an inspiration for rowing but for our British Rowing staff deliver and support indoor rowing country as well. competitions at schools and universities. I have heard Sport England is providing more than £8 million of what has been said about universities, but for me, it is funding to British Rowing during the 2013-17 whole also fundamental to start early—and that means starting sport plan period to do exactly that: to increase in schools, which is why I very much welcome British participation. As part of that funding, Sport England Rowing’s work. is working with British Rowing to encourage innovative Many clubs are supported through British Rowing ways of delivering rowing which might appeal to new with leadership and coaching support, and more clubs participants, particularly women. and centres are now offering Learn to Row courses, We know that there are various obstacles, both and adult and youth recreational rowing activities. perceived and real—the noble Lord, Lord Collins of The results of the programmes will be measured after Highbury, spoke of them. They may be emotional 10 years in 2019, which is the time BR believes it will barriers such as low body image and self-esteem, take to change the culture of rowing clubs. I hope that capability barriers such as fear of not having the right it will be faster than that. The programme is clearly skills, and practical barriers such as cost or lack of something that other governing bodies could emulate. time. We need to break down those barriers. It is why, I, too, look forward to seeing the final report of the pan sport: This Girl Can. I say in answer to my noble Women in Sport advisory committee, of which the friend Lady Walmsley that, at this early stage, the noble Baroness, Lady Brady, is a member. I would like sports that have been chosen are on demand and those to hear from the Minister about his plans to ensure its which have come forward from the demand do not as final implementation. yet include rowing, but I encourage rowing to seek that demand. However, the situation is constantly evaluated. We want to engage with 14 to 18 year-olds 2.46 pm and lower socioeconomic groups who, so far, we think need the most encouragement. Lord Gardiner of Kimble (Con): My Lords, I am most grateful to my noble friend for securing this Sport England is working with the national bodies debate. The Government are absolutely committed to to help design and market sports in a way that overcomes increasing women’s participation in all sport, including these barriers and taps into what women want from rowing, at every level of ability and age. I was very sport. It may be about rethinking and redesigning struck by my noble friend Lady Walmsley’s expression sport to appeal to women and to fit in with their lives. of the great enjoyment that rowing provides. My noble In the case of rowing, joining a boat club and committing friend Lady Bottomley spoke about teamwork. The to training every week might not be feasible for all essence of what we all try to do in different parts of women. Alternative formats of rowing, located in our lives is so much more positive when we work in a different environments, may appeal. That is why 5% of team. I have to say to my noble friend Lady Bottomley British Rowing’s funding has recently been redeployed that my sympathies may lie with the honourable Member to initiatives that promote indoor rowing, in the hope for Worthing when it comes to prowess in rowing that this will do for rowing what spinning has done for ability, although I think that this debate has produced cycling. some enthusiastic volunteers for my noble friend Lord The noble Lord, Lord Collins of Highbury, spoke Thomas of Gresford’s team. of participants. Almost half the participants in the This country has an outstanding reputation for School Games indoor rowing programme are girls. being at the forefront of rowing at the elite level. Over Sport England is also investing more than £300,000 the last 20 years, Great Britain has won 23 Olympic in the Rowability programme. This aims to get more rowing medals, 39% of which have been won in women’s disabled people rowing and includes beginners’ rowing events. Since para-rowing was introduced in the 2008 right through to those who aspire to compete at the in Beijing, Great Britain has won four medals, 50% of top level. At this high level, UK Sport is investing which have been won by women. My noble friend almost £4 million in para-rowing during this Olympic GC 131 Sport: Women in Rowing[LORDS] Employment Levels of Older People GC 132

[LORD GARDINER OF KIMBLE] At the other end of the scale, UK Sport encourages cycle. Additionally, through its Get Equipped fund, all its funded athletes to give five days a year to Sport England is investing more than £120,000 in volunteering. Through that programme, those world-class adaptive rowing equipment to help disabled people get athletes have given back more than 10,000 days to on the water. schools and communities since London 2012. Many British Rowing has also recognised the value of organisations already allow their staff days off for networks for sharing information and supporting others. volunteering as part of their corporate social responsibility Women on Water is an online community that aims to strategy, and I encourage that. For example, many bring together women rowers to connect with each departments in the Civil Service offer up to five days a other and activate the rowing community. year for volunteering, recognising the benefits for employees and recipients of their time. As my noble friend Lord Thomas of Gresford and My noble friend Lord Thomas of Gresford raised a other noble friends have already highlighted, the profile number of issues regarding specific boat clubs. I know of women’s rowing will be raised even further next that Sport England is familiar with the proposal from month, when for the first time the women’s Boat Race Chester Royals and is supporting the club as it develops will take place on the same day as the men’s Boat Race the idea for a water sports hub on the Dee. I was very on the tideway. Additionally, the BBC will broadcast sorry to hear that my noble friend has not received a the women’s race live, as it does the men’s race, putting reply about Hillingdon Rowing Club. I will of course the women on an equal footing with men for the first look into the matter and report back to him. time in history. Frankly, I am amazed that this has not been done before, because the Boat Race is watched by The Minister for Sport has done something extremely more than a quarter of a million people live, while important in establishing a Women and Sport Advisory television audiences in the UK are upwards of 7 million Board. The noble Lord, Lord Collins of Highbury, people and more than 100 countries request rights to mentioned that. It will be focusing on increasing women’s screen the race live or as a highlights package. participation in sport, improving the media profile of women’s sport, increasing commercial investment in A key factor in achieving this success has been the women’s sport, improving women’s representation in investment in the women’s team by Newton Investment leadership—my noble friend Lady Brady mentioned Management. I am so glad that my noble friend Lady that in particular—as well as representation in the Bottomley spoke of the CEO of Newton, Helena workforce, and a greater recognition for women’s sporting Morrissey, who sits on the Government’s Women and achievements. A final report will be published this Sport Advisory Board. She is personally committed to month and will give suggestions for future action on women’s sport and recognises the commercial opportunity women’s sport, which I believe we will all welcome. that it offers. I want to acknowledge some of the other high-profile sponsorship deals for women’s sport; for British Rowing, with the support of Sport England, example, Investec sponsors women’s hockey, while Kia is initiating innovative ideas to increase participation. Motors sponsors women’s cricket. We want other brands We wish to encourage sport, including rowing, to be to capitalise on the commercial opportunities in women’s enjoyed at all levels and by all abilities. I think that we sport in the same way. all wish rowing every success, and may it continue to flourish. As well as through sponsorship and media, it is important that sportswomen are recognised in other 2.58 pm ways, too, and I was glad that my noble friend Lord Addington spoke about honours. I am pleased to Sitting suspended. report that one of the five key factors on which the Women and Sport Advisory Board focuses is recognition and honours. The board has pushed for more women Employment Levels of Older People to be nominated in the honours process. The Department for Culture, Media and Sport writes to sports bodies Question for Short Debate twice a year urging them to nominate more women for honours. Since London 2012, at least 30% of sports 3pm honours have gone to women each year. Asked by Baroness Greengross My noble friends Lord Thomas of Gresford and Lady Brady were right to emphasise the importance of To ask Her Majesty’s Government what is their volunteers in sport. Last month, Sport England launched assessment of the effect on the youth unemployed Club Matters, a £3.6 million programme to support of a potential increase in the employment levels of community sport and volunteers at grass-roots level. older people. Club Matters also supports people to set up new clubs, which my noble friend Lord Addington was absolutely Baroness Greengross (CB): My Lords, I have tabled right to raise. There is a whole range of resources this debate largely to illuminate the employment challenges available online to help those at the very start of the faced by the over-50s in our society. I am privileged to journey—for amateur clubs, as well as for more established head up a think tank, the ILC-UK, or International clubs. As part of the Olympic legacy, Join In has Longevity Centre, one of 17 around the world. Through continued to increase its pool of volunteers. It now it, we try to help people plan for the future in the light has more than 250 local leaders trained, enabling of demographic change and look at the challenges, as more people than ever to become involved with grass-roots well as some of the advantages, of our increased sports clubs through the 30 established local networks. longevity. GC 133 Employment Levels of Older People[5 MARCH 2015] Employment Levels of Older People GC 134

Recently, the ILC published two new reports called knows the history of the company and young people The Missing Million. These illuminate the employment who may have more vibrant or new ideas to introduce. challenges of people who are over 50, demonstrating Together, they are stronger than if there is just have that, of the 3.3 million economically inactive people one age group. That is a good sign in an economy, and aged 50 to 64, approximately 1 million have been made it needs to be encouraged. “involuntarily workless”. We know that the plight of Saga carried out some research on that, which people aged 50-plus is worse than that of those aged showed that the extension of people’s working lives 60-plus in a country where there has been very important has enhanced employment opportunities for people of legislation to ban age discrimination for some years. all age groups, in particular for younger people. Using This really is bad and economically stupid. data spanning about 50 years from 22 countries, some The ILC research also shows that if people aged 50 very good OECD research in 2010 found that old and and above are helped back into employment, it does young workers complement each other rather than not mean that younger people are crowded out of the substitute for one another, so encouraging later retirement labour market. Helping older people into the labour will not have an adverse effect on youth employment. market, or back into it, could also lead to a potential At an individual level, there are also potential benefits— £88 billion boost to UK GDP. As we know, these earnings gains, pensions saved and improved financial people create jobs in the consumer sector if they are well-being—but there are also benefits to individuals’ working because they create the need for more things health and well-being. There is a reason to get up in for other people to buy as those people have more the morning. There is a reason to meet your friends, money to spend. If they work and are caring for older social interaction, having a part in society and feeling relatives, grandchildren or even their own children, that you have self-worth. Those are all excellent things. then other people are employed in caring. They are a It is encouraging that as part of the DWP’s Age boost to the economy, not a drain on it. This is Positive initiative, the Government announced in creating more wealth. December an older workers’ champion scheme to We also know that people who are denied access combat age discrimination offering targeted support into the labour market through discrimination, or for for older jobseekers. I welcome that and hope that the whatever reason, will tend to disappear into the black Minister will tell us how well it is doing and how we market and the black economy. They will do that can all encourage it to do more. because very often they need the money and they have Looking at other good examples, everybody in this some skills. That is the rather sad result of inadequate field has heard of B&Q, because it led the way in policies and safeguards to ensure that they can get employing older people. Barclays recently launched a work. new apprenticeship scheme for the over-50s who want The Government created a business champion for a career in the City. We know of the success of Teach older workers, Dr Ros Altmann, who argued recently First. I have been promoting the idea of “mentor that if everybody retired one year later, it would add later”. We are looking at how we can do something on 1% to this nation’s GDP. We know that chronological those lines with older people. age has now become rather irrelevant; what we are There are many things that one can do. Paid talking about is capacity and the will to work and to employment is one thing, but there are other opportunities contribute to society and in most cases—because we for older people to play a full role in society. As for do not force people into scaffolding or something at stimulating youth employment, the best way to achieve the age of 50-plus—people who are in work have a that is through targeted measures that will make young better health record, a better social life with mates or people better prospects for employers, such as improved friends and feel that they have more self-worth because training and supporting the growth agenda. Young they are contributing to the nation’s economy and to people often benefit from mentoring at work from society at large. I share Ros Altmann’s belief that their older colleagues. retirement should be a journey rather than a one-off The employment of older people does not keep event. No employer should make an assumption that younger people out of the job market. Rather, by the employees should be on the work scrapheap because means outlined above, all our adult citizens, irrespective they have reached an arbitrary milestone in their lives. of their age, who want to work should and could be One common argument against greater labour market helped not only to fulfil their aspirations but to contribute participation in older age is that it will prevent younger to the economy at large, our economy, our society and people entering or staying in paid employment because the benefit of us all. it takes the jobs away from them. We know, however, that that argument is built on the false assumption 3.09 pm that there is a fixed number of jobs in an economy—the Lord Bhattacharyya (Lab): My Lords, I thank the lump of labour argument. It has been demonstrated noble Baroness, Lady Greengross, for securing this over and over again that that is a fallacy: there is no important debate. She is a superb advocate for the lump of labour. Creating jobs for people creates a elderly, and this debate demonstrates her sharp concern market for more jobs. It is nonsense to assume the for old and young alike. It is appropriate that we are opposite, but that assumption goes on. having this debate in the Moses Room. The Bible tells An increasing number of older people in employment us that Moses lived for 120 years, and even at that age, can also support employment across all ages. Older his eyes were clear and his vigour unabated. Sadly, and younger people in a job in a firm can work history is silent on the effect on the Old Testament together. You have the experience of someone who labour market. British life spans have not reached GC 135 Employment Levels of Older People[LORDS] Employment Levels of Older People GC 136

[LORD BHATTACHARYYA] failed apprentices studying for an extra year and at the biblical levels, but many Britons are now working well same time having some mentoring by older people into their 60s, and 1.1 million workers are now over who are beyond retirement age. This will mean working 65. That is a quarter of a million more than when unconventionally, whether with employers or with health default retirement was abolished four years ago. That and social work teams that pick up the hardest-to-reach has had a major effect, but broader social trends are young people. also at work. The number of older people working has Finally, we must expose young people to the world increased throughout the past two decades. The decline of work much earlier, so that they can build links with of heavy manual work, improved health and the rise employers and understand what is required to hold of part-time working are all making a contribution. down a good job. To do that, we need local employers, We cannot turn back these trends, nor should we try councils and colleges to work together to improve to. For one thing, the earnings of older workers create education and training courses. This will help employers demand and jobs. For another, the impact on full-time anticipate the problems some young people have in workers is smaller than it appears. Fewer than 20% of adapting to work, such as with the structure of the over-65s have a traditional full-time job. Most are working day. This is not an impossible challenge. In part-time or self-employed. The vast majority of young most cities, just a few hundred young people need this people want full-time jobs, so they will not feel direct kind of focused support each year. Each worker over competition. retirement age could be a mentor, providing early However, the ability to retain skilled workers will work experience and career support, and putting young impact on companies’ decisions to hire new people. people on the right course to get a good job. For higher-paid workers, this can be partly dealt with In an age when the competition for work is greater by employers offering lower wages as workers learn than ever, our challenge lies with the neglected young their trade. However, at lower levels of pay, the minimum people who deserve better from us. We cannot prevent wage rightly limits this approach. This should not older workers earning, and we should not race to the change. We have the minimum wage in order to prevent bottom on wages. That means that we must resolve to exploitation of all workers. do better for those at the margins of the labour We must find another way to help younger workers, market. especially those on the edges of the labour market. The key is to improve the skills of those young people 3.15 pm who struggle to find full-time work. We offer significant Lord Shipley (LD): My Lords, I am grateful for the support to university students, but our offer to those opportunity to discuss this issue and I thank the noble who do not take that route is much less effective. The Baroness, Lady Greengross, for initiating this debate. I crucial group is the NEETs: young people not in work, share her concerns and conclusions. There is an school or vocational education. For all the media assumption that apprenticeships should be for younger stereotypes, what sets NEETs apart is that they do not people, but there are advantages in apprenticeships for have good GCSEs. This means they often pursue older people—I think of the example of Barclays, as low-level qualifications which lead only to casual work well as others in the construction industry, which are and frequent unemployment. Bluntly, the Government particularly welcome. The noble Baroness is absolutely are failing these teenagers, at school, after school and right, too, to draw our attention to the needs of the in the job centre. over-50s. Those who, for whatever reason, lose their How can we do better? First, we must offer all jobs in their late 40s or early 50s can find it quite young people the chance to advance their careers difficult to return to the world of work. while still at school, not just those destined for higher It is true that more older people work than used to education. This requires a greater variety of educational be the case. There are now more than 1.1 million provision, which could be delivered through vocational people aged over 65 who work—an increase in the last courses, specialist schools, university technical colleges year of more than 50,000. I welcome the opportunity or even by industrial partners—provision by industrial for older people to be in work if they wish to be, and I partners is growing. Next, we need every young person accept entirely that we have to do more to ensure that to get maths and English qualifications, even well after every individual is enabled to work if they want to be they finish school. All the evidence shows that these in work. It is also true that younger people can face core qualifications are vital to finding work. The difficulties in securing employment, in securing Government have made the right choice by insisting employment that pays enough and in securing employment students who do not get good maths and English that can lead to career development. However, it does GCSEs take these courses as part of vocational education not follow—I am entirely with the noble Baroness, or apprenticeships, yet many drop out or do not pass. Lady Greengross, on this—that there needs to be an Data from the Centre for Economic and Social Inclusion adverse effect on youth employment arising from older show that more than a quarter of apprentices do not people staying in employment for longer. successfully complete their course, a far higher rate There are two reasons for that. The first is the than for A-level students. That is a disturbing figure, growth in the economy that we are now experiencing, as those young people are precisely those likely to together with the huge growth in vocational struggle in the labour market. apprenticeships for young people, both of which will Our aim should be that every single 21 year-old has make a big difference. Secondly, older people will still maths and English qualifications. We should not stop be retiring at some point, so the growth need not be educating them until they do, whatever it takes. For a long-term upwards trend, even if it continues for a example, that might mean paying employers to support few years. GC 137 Employment Levels of Older People[5 MARCH 2015] Employment Levels of Older People GC 138

Given the growth in the number of jobs that has have an effect on the potential for additional employment taken place in the last five years, with almost 31 million opportunities for older people. This week I noticed on people now in work in the United Kingdom, older Tuesday a report on the front page of the Financial people are needed, not least to train the next generation Times and then later comments from the Institute for and transfer their skills to them. It is interesting to Fiscal Studies about movements in pay reported by note that around two-thirds of the growth in employment HMRC from the PAYE system over the past six years. over the past five years seems to be in higher-skilled It is interesting to see that the regions outside London jobs. Older people have tended to fill those jobs, and cut the pay gap with London in the six years from one consequence is that fewer young people get promoted 2008 to 2014, with cash growth in median pay in and so start to earn more. As I said, before long that London half the rate in the United Kingdom as a trend should cease. whole. Interestingly, the rate in London is a quarter of the rate in the north-east of England, where I live. Not everyone wants to continue working when they Regionally, from the perspective of the north-east, I are older. Over the next few years, despite the growth strongly welcome that. However, that is a geographical in the number of older people staying in work for test of course, and we need to go a bit further. By age, longer, some 200,000 people are expected to retire the IFS said that median pay for young people between from manufacturing and engineering jobs. They will the ages of 22 and 29 is down 9% in real terms in those have to be replaced at a time when more are needed six years, so growth in median pay is lower in London anyway. This country has a skills gap. All over the and it is much worse for younger people. Those two United Kingdom, in manufacturing, engineering and facts relate to each other because in London young the process industries, there are shortages at level 3 people make up a much higher proportion of the and above. That is why apprenticeships matter— workforce: the average age of workers is 34 in London apprenticeships driven by the needs of businesses. We but 40 in the rest of the United Kingdom. should welcome the huge growth in apprenticeship starts. There have been more than 2 million under this In one sense, this confirms what we already know in Government, which is twice as high as the figure terms of intergenerational differences, but we need to achieved by the previous Government. That is contributing be more alert to it because younger people cannot be so much to vocational training and equipping many expected to manage high personal debt as well as more young people to undertake skilled work. cover future debt from government borrowing today. They need secure jobs and jobs that pay enough to Apprenticeships can be of different kinds, and older meet their essential expenditure. We need to ensure workers can transfer their skills to younger workers that the overall gains of economic growth resulting through them. I am impressed by the commitment of from the work that this Government have undertaken businesses all over the country to them—for example, so effectively, particularly in the past two or three the shared apprenticeship scheme of the Construction years, are spread and shared by all—both the older Industry Training Board, which enables more young and the younger. people to be trained because they can be with more than one employer over the three-year period of an apprenticeship. There have been successful pilots in 3.24 pm Lancashire, Merseyside and Wales, with several more Baroness Sherlock (Lab): My Lords, this has been schemes now offering three-year apprenticeships. an interesting short debate. I, too, thank the noble Importantly, more than 90% of those who complete Baroness, Lady Greengross, for enabling us to reflect their three-year shared apprenticeship by this means on this issue today and for her many years of championing secure full-time jobs, which is higher than the average. older people in our society. I also thank my noble As we achieve higher growth, we need to reflect on friend Lord Bhattacharyya for pointing out that we the fact that just over 16% of young people aged 16 to have Moses presiding over us today. I remind him that 24 are still unemployed. That is around three-quarters we also have a very young Daniel presiding over us. of a million. Of those, some 40% are in some form of Perhaps that tells us something about the importance education or training, but that figure is simply too of both young and older people and the wisdom that high, despite the significant achievements of this they both have to offer to us in our judgments. Government. We need much better careers advice for The noble Baroness, Lady Greengross, and the young people when they choose courses at school, to noble Lord, Lord Shipley, have done a fine job of ensure that the courses they take enable them to take debunking the lump of labour fallacy, thereby saving up the apprenticeships at a later date. We need careers the Minister and me the need to do that. However, it is advice in schools to broker better relationships with worth dwelling on it briefly. I am amazed by just how employers. Some very interesting research has been hard it is to persuade most people that something that undertaken, not least that by IPPR North in January seems as obvious as the idea that if more older people 2014 which explained how that might be done to the work, younger people will not be able to may not in advantage of both employers and young people. The fact be true. That is something for the Government to reason why all this matters is that the nature of think about. How does one go about trying to make employment is changing and the level of skills needed sure that everybody understands that things are a bit is higher than it used to be. more complicated than that? It is a welcome fact that unemployment is going In the pack that the House of Lords Library made down, and has been doing so for some time, but it to help us with this debate, which was very helpful, needs to go down faster for young people, and the pay they kindly included a very interesting report from the rates for young people need to rise. None of this needs Institute for Fiscal Studies from 2008 called Releasing GC 139 Employment Levels of Older People[LORDS] Employment Levels of Older People GC 140

[BARONESS SHERLOCK] scarred by damaging periods of unemployment, which jobs for the young? Early retirement and youth can carry on having effects throughout their working unemployment in the United Kingdom. It could almost lives. have been written for today. Of course, the IFS evaluated Then there is the position of older workers, described the job release scheme, which was designed precisely very movingly by the noble Baroness, Lady Greengross. to release jobs for younger people, but also looked at If you want to see the effects on older people of being the measures that Governments took between the late able to turn up every day for work, to feel that they a 1960s and 2005. Its findings precisely backed up the sense of worth and something to contribute and to comments made by the noble Baroness, Lady Greengross. mix with friends and colleagues, we do not have to On the job release scheme, it found, look very far from this Room. The House of Lords “some evidence that it reduced employment of the old but no shows just what a positive effect having a role to play positive effect can be found on youth employment”. in society can have on some people at quite a considerable It went on to say: age. “When looking at the entire 1968-2005 period, labor force However, as the noble Lord, Lord Shipley, and the participation of the old is positively associated with employment noble Baroness, Lady Greengross, pointed out, there of the young … Overall we find no evidence of long-term crowding-out of younger individuals from the labor market by are still too many older people who would like to work older workers. The evidence, according to a variety of methods, but cannot get a job or who lose their job in their 50s points always in the direction of an absence of such a relationship”. and then struggle to get back in, despite having great So the evidence is really very strong, and I hope that skills and experience. If the state pension age is to we can all agree with that. continue to rise, we need to ensure that older people can stay in employment on the kind of wages that That said, I agree with the noble Lord, Lord Shipley, enable them to carry on saving for a pension. Otherwise, that there is an issue about youth unemployment, not only will they end up struggling to get by on which needs quick and careful attention. I agree with benefits designed for those who are temporarily my noble friend Lord Bhattacharyya about the importance unemployed, they will not be able to build up the kind of focusing on NEETs and the importance of skills, a of pension provision that they will need to have a point also made by the noble Baroness, Lady Greengross. comfortable retirement when they get there. However, despite the welcome improvement in employment rates generally, young people are now The noble Baroness, Lady Greengross, mentioned almost three times as likely to be unemployed as the that the DWP will be giving more tailored support, rest of the population. The youth unemployment and I will be very interested to hear what the Minister proportion is 13%, whereas it is only 4% for 25 to has to say. At the moment, it is not working. In fact, 64 year-olds. So something is going on there. Young the Work Programme works even less well for older people are now faring, comparatively speaking, worse workers than for younger workers. In the latest figures than at any point since 1992, which means that the available, 30% of 18 to 24 year-olds achieved a job UK is now towards the bottom of the league table outcome, but of 50 to 54 year-olds it was just 17% and internationally when it comes to giving young people a it fell to 13% of 55 to 59 year-olds and of those who fair chance, with the gap between the youth unemployment were 60-plus fewer than 7% achieved a job outcome. rate and the overall rate higher in the UK than in all Whatever is happening now is simply not working for but five out of 39 OECD countries for which data are older people who want to get back into the workforce. available. Labour would reform the Work Programme, devolving We need to see some good help being given to it to make it more responsive to the needs of older young people, but only 35% of young people find a people in different areas of the country. We would also job after two years on the Work Programme. Indeed, introduce a compulsory jobs guarantee to ensure that more people return to the jobcentre than find a job as older jobseekers who have been unemployed for more a result of the Work Programme. Last summer, the than two years are guaranteed the offer of a paid job, Government announced that they had decided to scrap and we would look to help more older workers save for the Youth Contract ahead of its planned closure. The a pension. With the latest figures showing that less latest figures published by the DWP showed that than a third of self-employed workers are currently two-thirds of the way through the scheme’s three-year saving into a pension—older workers are more likely duration, the Youth Contract had delivered less than to be self-employed—we would act to find ways to 13% of the promised job placements, with 20,030 wage help older self-employed workers to save for a pension. incentives paid rather than the target of 160,000. So We would cut red tape for older workers. The new there is reason to be concerned and need for action. universal credit rules threaten 600,000 self-employed I agree with my noble friend Lord Bhattacharyya workers with a huge increase in red tape, and that is about the importance of careers and mentoring and something that Labour is committed to addressing. getting education right, but we need more direct We would also introduce a higher rate of jobseeker’s intervention, too. Labour would tackle this problem allowance for those who have contributed for longer, by bringing in a compulsory job guarantee for anyone funded by extending the length of time for which under 25 who has been on JSA for a year or more, as people need to have worked to qualify. well as reforming the Work Programme and introducing I will be very interested to hear from the Minister a new youth allowance to ensure that unemployed 18 what the Government’s strategy is to address that very to 21 year-olds who do not have the skills they need to serious problem. I have two other specific questions get a decent job are training as well as looking for for him. First, what thought are the Government work. We simply cannot afford to have young people giving to ways in which employers as a whole can GC 141 Employment Levels of Older People[5 MARCH 2015] Employment Levels of Older People GC 142 think about the way workers move into retirement? We older and younger workers across the EU found no have known for a long time that it is not always the trade-off between rates of employment. The IFS study most healthy thing for someone to go from a full-time, which the noble Baroness, Lady Sherlock, quoted very high-stress job into nothing at all. It is not good looked specifically at the UK. It concluded: for their physical or mental health and is certainly “When looking at the entire 1968 to 2005 period … we find no not good for their spouse or partner in many cases. evidence of long-term crowding-out of younger individuals from Have the Government given some thought as to how the labour market by older workers”. strategically as a country we might approach that? Secondly, have the Government considered what impact, It is interesting how Governments used to think like if any, the new pension freedoms might have on the this. The 1970s and 1980s programmes such as the Job pattern of labour market participation by older workers? Release Scheme, which positively encouraged older people to leave the market so that it would free up jobs There is a challenge for us as a country to ensure for the young, had their origins in that thinking. It is that neither older nor younger workers are left behind interesting that the IFS concluded that that particular as the economy slowly recovers. Fortunately, I do not programme did achieve one its aims. It reduced believe that the people of our country will warm to a employment among older workers but there was no public debate that divides generation from generation. evidence of a corresponding effective employment of After all, many older people are deeply concerned young people. about the opportunities and prospects for their children and grandchildren, and conversely the young do not The noble Baroness, Lady Greengross, raised the want to see their parents and grandparents thrown on Saga report on how over-50s make an important and the scrapheap at 50 when they have so much to contribute. growing contribution to society. It made the point that Apart from the individual costs, our country can ill she was making that encouraging people to leave the afford to lose the talents and energies of either our labour force early reduces spending power and demand younger or our older workers. If we do not tackle in the economy. those challenges, we will all be the poorer. Evidence from research goes in the entirely opposite way to the lump of labour fallacy, because older and 3.33 pm younger workers are likely to complement each other. A study by the RAND organisation in 2009, using The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department data from 22 OECD countries, suggested that there for Work and Pensions (Lord Freud) (Con): My Lords, was a positive effect. In other words, for every one like other speakers in this debate, I am grateful to the additional older person in work, the overall effect was noble Baroness, Lady Greengross, for bringing this nearly 1.1 more people in work. Far from the substitution question to the Committee. I am really pleased to effect, firms may choose to hire both because this acknowledge the work she has done in this area. She brings a healthy mix of skills, qualities and experiences. has been director general of Age Concern and is now chief executive of the International Longevity Centre. I want to outline briefly what the Government are I am also very pleased to be able to respond to as doing for older workers. We abolished the default many of the points made by colleagues in the Committee retirement age in 2011; we extended the right to request as I can. flexible working for all; and we have introduced Fit for Work, which helps with sickness absence and provides We are today talking not about a potential increase an occupational health assessment and health and in the employment of older people but about a very work advice to employees, employers and GPs. In real and sustained improvement. The past year has Jobcentres, work coaches have the flexibility to offer seen the number of over-50s in work exceed 9 million all claimants a comprehensive menu of support. In for the first time. It has risen by nearly 250,000 in the addition, in last year’s Autumn Statement we announced past 12 months and by more than 1 million since 2010. two pilots, which will support 3,000 people who need That is not just about the number of older people help to move back into work or start a new career in a rising. The proportion of over-50s in work has also different sector. These will be based on our current reached the highest on record. sector-based work academies and work experience The question of whether the increase in the number programmes—currently more orientated at youngsters— of old people in work has an impact on other groups is but tailored to the needs of older people. one that I think we are all in violent agreement on—the lump of labour fallacy. The figures that we have just We are planning two further trials that will explore seen demonstrate that it is a fallacy. If we exclude what may provide effective support for these older young people who are in full-time education, the claimants. The first will look at support through a employment of under-25s has risen by nearly 70,000 in career review-based approach and the second will the past year alone and by 140,000 since 2010. look at providing IT and digital support. We will also introduce regional champions in Jobcentre Plus, as I will pick up on the point made by the noble Lord, referred to by the noble Baroness, Lady Greengross. Lord Shipley, and the noble Baroness, Lady Sherlock, That champion role will start later this month. I want that 60% of young people are still unemployed. The these roles to work with local employers and share actual figure, if students are excluded, is 6.8% of good practice so that we can promote activity for young people unemployed at that level. So we should older claimants in the regions. not worry about a rise in employment in one group damaging the chances of another. We are not in a The noble Baroness raised the issue of those made zero-sum game. A recent report for the European involuntarily workless and talked about there being Parliament which looked at employment trends for 1 million of them. We published Fuller Working Lives GC 143 Employment Levels of Older People[LORDS] HIV/AIDS GC 144

[LORD FREUD] 3.45 pm to set out what the Government and others are doing Sitting suspended. to tackle this. We are making good progress on the commitments in respect of it. The noble Baroness, Lady Sherlock, asked about HIV/AIDS the Work Programme. That treats everyone as an Question for Short Debate individual rather than looking at this on the basis of age. Up to September 2014, there had been 300,000 4pm referrals of people aged 50 and over, which resulted in more than 42,000 job outcomes. Asked by Lord Fowler The noble Baroness, Lady Sherlock, made a point To ask Her Majesty’s Government what steps about flexibility in pension schemes. That is key, in they are taking to meet the continuing challenge of that it enables more flexible retirement options. We are HIV and AIDS. bringing in new flexibilities in April for people with defined contribution pension arrangements by introducing new freedoms in terms of how and when they access Lord Fowler (Con): My Lords, we are nearing the their pension payments. end of a Parliament, which is, perhaps, a good time to assess what progress has been made in this important As for policies for younger workers, sector-based area, where we are and where we want to be. I start by work academies are available in England and Scotland. congratulating the Government on two measures of That has been a very successful programme, with a immense importance. The first was their decision to combination of pre-employment training, work experience enable equal marriage, which did a vast amount not and guaranteed interviews. They are local and demand-led, only to encourage equality but at the same time to so you have different sectors depending on where you fight prejudice against gay people, which stands against are running those schemes. There have been more than progress in fighting HIV and AIDS literally around 88,000 sector-based work academy starts for 18 to the world. The second was to double their contribution 24 year-olds since the scheme began in August 2011. to the Global Fund to Fight AIDS, Tuberculosis and We have had 247,000 work experience placements for Malaria, which brings invaluable help to areas where 18 to 24 year-olds, and various healthy outcomes, with the death toll has been immense. AIDS alone has been half of work experience participants off benefits 21 weeks responsible for 35 million deaths around the world after starting their placements. The noble Lord, Lord since the epidemic began. Frankly, the criticism of the Shipley, raised the issue of the success of apprenticeships. National Audit Office that this was an example of a There have been more than 2 million since the election. last-minute decision was about as far from the mark as This is more of a theoretical debate than a political it was possible to get. It was first promised not by the one, but I will just pick up very gently the description current Secretary of State but by her predecessor, given by the noble Baroness, Lady Sherlock, of some Andrew Mitchell, and it was, as I say, extraordinarily of the Labour policies, such as the jobs guarantee. I welcome. am in despair about all that, because that is the kind of However, in this short debate I want to concentrate top-down approach of saying, “We can produce the on this country and ask whether we are making the jobs for the people and put them into them”, which is progress that we should. In bare statistics, last year exactly the wrong way to go about creating a dynamic there were almost 6,500 new HIV diagnoses. I have economy. You want to have people put into real jobs just come back from Russia, where I looked at the that will last. I just express my despair and move on. position there. Indeed, they were kind enough to present To pick up the point about apprenticeships again, me with a medal for 25 years service. It is a damn sight we clearly need to see how that works for older people. more than I ever get from the Department of Health, I It has worked really well for younger people and is can tell noble Lords, but I fear that it makes me no something that Ros Altmann has been championing more sympathetic to their policies, which last year for older people. As noble Lords have pointed out, resulted in 85,000 new HIV diagnoses. The figure goes there are schemes now, from Barclays for example, to up remorselessly each year. do that. In response to the noble Lord, Lord The temptation is, against that background, to say Bhattacharyya, they have been successful: 89% of about Britain, with fewer than 6,500 new HIV diagnoses, employers report that that process has helped their what are you worried about and what is the problem? business and improved their quality and standards. The problem, basically, is that today in Britain there Last year the Education Secretary announced a new are 100,000 men, women and children living with HIV. careers and enterprise company for schools to transform That is almost double the number accessing care a the provision of careers education and advice for decade ago. The National Health Service now spends young people. I repeat my thanks to the noble Baroness, £860 million a year on treatment and care: almost £1 Lady Greengross, for bringing this Question to the billion a year. Worst of all, of those 100,000 with HIV, House. Today’s contributions have been interesting about a quarter are undiagnosed. They do not know and I think we are all fundamentally in agreement, that they have the virus and, of course, other things apart from my one point of despair. being equal, they spread HIV further. In other words Youth unemployment is a really serious matter and we have, in my view, an undoubted public health crisis this debate has been another opportunity for us to and, although we now have antiretroviral drugs which emphasise that increasing the number of older workers prolong life, we still face the situation which we faced, does not have an adverse effect on youth employment. frankly, in the 1980s, with no cure and no vaccine. GC 145 HIV/AIDS[5 MARCH 2015] HIV/AIDS GC 146

Against such figures, what can we do and what are Of course, we all want to see as many people as we doing? The obvious step is to put the maximum possible living a drug-free life, but we should not effort into prevention. We save £320,000 in lifetime underestimate the difficulties, which are not going to costs for every infection which is prevented. Top of the be reconciled by a speedy review of a few weeks. If you list in prevention policy is to persuade ever more want to see the alternative, again, go to Russia: see the people to be tested. We are not going to win when we treatment centres there and the attempt at rehabilitation, have around 25,000 people untested and undiagnosed and look at the figures. They show that after 12 months in the community. Second to that is that we also need of treatment and rehabilitation 80% or 90% go back to persuade people to continue with their treatment to injecting drugs, and after five years virtually everyone once they are on it. Too many drop off. The point to does. recognise, generally, here is that persuasion can work, Given that drug users have never really been able to provided that sufficient imagination is put into the be forced off drugs in the way that seems to be messages and it is backed by sufficient resources. We imagined, I think we might also remember that methadone established that back in 1986-87 with the promotion of can lead to a recovered life. I remember visiting a clinic condom use and the warnings against shared needles. in Ukraine, where the doctor in charge basically said The Select Committee that I chaired in 2011—I am just that—that, although some of them had been on glad to see that one of its members, my noble friend methadone for six, seven or eight years, they had at Lord Gardiner, is sitting very near me—raised this least been restored to society: they held down jobs and point with the Government. We said that publicity were relating to their families again. Basically, I would was inadequate and should be increased, so what did like an assurance that there is no intention on the part the department do? It cut it further. Today, the department of the Government to turn their back on sensible spends about £2.4 million a year nationally on promoting harm reduction policies. prevention. I repeat that the cost of treatment and My last point I make in précis. The latest research care is £860 million a year. It is, frankly, a ludicrous shows that the drug Truvada can very substantially position. We spend hundreds of millions on treating cut HIV for men who have sex with men. It prevents the casualties but next to nothing on trying to prevent HIV infection. Given that men who have sex with men those casualties coming about. The defence for this is are the group most affected by HIV in this country, it that, in addition to the national campaign, another seems obvious that we should develop that policy as £10 million or £11 million is spent by local authorities, quickly as we can. Of course, there are costs to the although the figures suggest that some of the most policy, but there are even greater costs in doing nothing. affected local authorities are spending next to nothing, My conclusion is this. On a number of issues, such if anything at all. as the increased contribution to the Global Fund, this Frankly, making every allowance in the book, the country has been among the leaders in the world, but I amount we spend on trying to prevent infection is fear that nationally, inside Britain, there are too many seriously inadequate. Prevention is simply not being gaps in our policy to say that we lead the world. What given the priority that it deserves. If it were not for the we can say is that we have some of the finest and most NGOs and the volunteers, our overall national policy devoted clinicians, NGOs, voluntary organisations and would, in my view, be not only in trouble but in tatters. officials. If I had one word of advice for the Government, Therefore, I say to the Government that we need a it would be that Ministers should raise their general new campaign to encourage testing, which is the obvious policy game to the level of those doctors and volunteers glaring gap in our policy. A few weeks ago, I proposed who work so tirelessly in this country to eliminate HIV to the Minister on the Floor of the House that a task and AIDS. force should be set up to explore how to take that forward. The Minister, as is his custom, was courteous— 4.10 pm even encouraging— but, frankly, I have heard no more, doubtless because he was planning the detail of Lord Cashman (Lab): My Lords, I begin with what the campaign that I set out. Perhaps this afternoon he is a normal courtesy but I really mean it. I thank the might come forward with those proposals. noble Lord, Lord Fowler, for securing this debate and I would like to make two further points. The first is for his dedication and overwhelming commitment to on drugs and harm reduction policy generally. We the issues of HIV/AIDS and non-discrimination. I introduced clean needles and then methadone as a also want to develop the theme which he outlined. policy back in the 1980s. Methadone is not injected There has been a massive expansion globally of HIV and therefore has an obvious use in reducing transmission. interventions, which has transformed the HIV epidemic It has been demonstrably successful as a policy. For and the broader public health landscape, demonstrating the last 25 years the number contracting HIV in this that the right to health can be realised even in the most country through shared needles has been around 1% trying circumstances. I remember well the 1980s when, of the total—almost imperceptible. Therefore, it is as a gay man, I saw AIDS and HIV portrayed in the vastly important that that policy is maintained and media as the gay plague. We have moved further, and that there is no lurching away from it. Why do I say, onwards, since then. I welcome that move and I welcome “lurching away from it”? In recent weeks there has this Government’s commitment and their increased been a suggestion that policy is changing. There has funding, particularly for the Global Fund. been a hint that drug users should be forced into There has been much progress in the developing taking treatment—taken not only off injecting drugs but world but I must express my concern at our view, now off methadone as well. I say to the Minister that my taken, that we should pull back in those so-called only advice on this is to go very cautiously indeed. middle-income countries such as South Africa, where GC 147 HIV/AIDS[LORDS] HIV/AIDS GC 148

[LORD CASHMAN] To quote the chief executive: there is a high and increasing prevalence of HIV “In the current climate of cuts and pressure on budgets we are infection. To pull back in those middle-income countries, extremely worried this money will be used to shore up other areas with this Government leading on asking the Global of council spend. This would be a disaster for public health in this Fund to pull back in them, will reverse all the good country”. that has been done. I now come to my questions. Will the Government address this funding gap, maintain public health ring- I turn now specifically to the United Kingdom. fencing and prioritise HIV prevention and testing People with HIV who receive appropriate treatment, services? It is three weeks to purdah and the new as we know, have a near-normal life expectancy and financial year. The people who are supposed to be are very unlikely to transmit the virus. Yetthe proportion managing the national HIV prevention programme, of people receiving a late diagnosis, according to which has been cut in half, have still had no instruction Library statistics, was 47% in 2012. An estimated 22% on how the money should be reallocated, let alone of people living with HIV in the United Kingdom are spent. They are dependent on getting approval for this unaware of their infection or status. Increasing HIV from the Department of Health, which means that the testing is therefore important so that treatment can be charities involved will not even get the four weeks’ given and onward transmission prevented. Successful notice they need to give notice, in turn, to staff who prevention depends on a combination of testing, treating may lose their jobs. How do the Government intend to and behavioural change. Giving antiretroviral drugs ensure continuity of service? to those at risk could reduce infections. We know that We also need a nationally co-ordinated approach to that work is being rolled out in the United States. ensure that we use ever-decreasing resources effectively Work is also being done here on that. I have to express to reduce undiagnosed HIV and forward transmission. concerns at some parts of the media comparing the How will the Government ensure a co-ordinated approach cost of this treatment to that of cancer care. When it when they are not planning and consulting on it? We comes to the health of an individual, comparisons are have a situation where reducing duplication and using odious. There are concerns that the separation of money wisely is paramount, yet I am reliably informed commissioning HIV treatment and prevention has that there is a total abdication of any national negatively impacted patients. responsibility for this. Both the Department of Health I have specific questions for the Minister but I will and Public Health England say they can only advise. It come to those shortly. First, let me refer to the National is deeply worrying and I look to the Minister for his AIDS Trust and its press release of 20 February 2015. replies. In its report, HIV Prevention—Underfunded and Deprioritised, the charity states: 4.18 pm “Not enough money is being spent on HIV prevention to have Lord Crisp (CB): My Lords, I, too, pay tribute to any impact on the … new HIV infections”— the noble Lord, Lord Fowler, for his leadership on this as was outlined by the noble Lord, Lord Fowler. The issue. It was needed right at the beginning of the trust estimates that, epidemic, and he gave it, and it is needed again very strongly now and over the next few years. I am going “in 2014/15 £15 million was spent nationally on HIV prevention to talk about the situation outside the UK. I have told compared with £55 million allocated in 2001/02 … In this time the the Minister that I am not expecting instant replies number of people living with HIV has trebled whilst the amount to the two questions I have, but I hope that they spent on prevention has decreased to less than a third of the original budget”. can be passed on to the Department for International Development. This makes no sense whatever. The report continues: This is, of course a global epidemic and it is in our “This estimate is based on information provided to NAT from interest to see that it is contained and managed globally local authorities in England with a high prevalence of HIV. £10 as well as locally. As the noble Lords, Lord Fowler and million was spent in 2014/15 on HIV prevention in these areas—this Lord Cashman, both said, the UK is very influential works out at only 70p per person. The report found that in local in this regard. Globally, there has been amazing progress. authorities with high prevalence of HIV less than 1% of local The epidemic is coming under control in the sense that authority public health allocation is spent on HIV prevention. In 2013 the NHS spent 55 times more on HIV treatment and care in more people are going on to treatment than there are these areas than local authorities spent on HIV prevention”. new infections each year. That is true even in South Africa, thanks to changes in the political leadership According to the chief executive of the NAT: there. But it is still devastating and it will be for years “Our research found, shockingly, in the 58 areas of highest to come, so there is much more to do. prevalence of HIV in England, seven local authorities weren’t In 2013, 35 million people were estimated to be spending anything on primary HIV prevention or on additional living with HIV/AIDS, of whom less than half had testing services. Worryingly we also found no correlation between been diagnosed; 13 million were in treatment; 2.3 million level of HIV prevalence in an area and how much was being spent more received treatment; 2.1 million more became on prevention”. infected and 1.5 million died. This is an awful picture. The report continues: In those countries that are particularly badly affected, HIV/AIDS affects everything about health and health “The HIV charity is also concerned that more problems are on the horizon when the ring-fencing for the public health budget is services. In South Africa, there is 5% prevalence and removed. Currently, local authorities are given money to provide there are huge costs to its health system. It will grow basic services such as sexual health clinics. In April 2016 they will and be more costly over the next few years because the be able to spend this money on anything”. WHO has changed its guidelines about when to put GC 149 HIV/AIDS[5 MARCH 2015] HIV/AIDS GC 150 people on treatment, and still many people are not yet Access Denied, which identifies these and other more receiving treatment. This is a big problem. Nevertheless, detailed issues about problems in the supply chain, UNAIDS aims to see what it describes as the end of monitoring, pricing, R&D and so on. the epidemic by 2030. That will require increased funding until 2020, and it will decline thereafter. What should Her Majesty’s Government do? There are many recommendations from that All-Party There are economic issues as well. This is not just Parliamentary Group, but I shall draw out three. In about human devastation, illness and death; it is also asking questions, I want to congratulate the UK on its about the economy. Conservative estimates suggest global leadership on this issue and, indeed, on development that the gross national product of South Africa has in global health generally. It is because DfID is so decreased by at least 1% per year because of the illness influential globally that the signals it gives on aid are of its people. I shall sum up this quick summary of the fundamental. It is supporting the Global Fund. Indeed, situation with the South African Government’s vision it increased its support, and it needs to use its influence for 2030—in 15 years’ time—which reflects this reality. to make sure that there is continuing support from They aim to have life expectancy reaching 70 and a other countries. However, its recent decision to stop generation of under-20s largely free of HIV. That is a funding work on an AIDS vaccine is counterproductive. great vision from where they are, but it is also rather Will Her Majesty’s Government reassess the decision sad that is what we are talking about. This is a long to stop funding an AIDS vaccine, as was proposed by march. It is a very long-term issue which needs, as I the All-Party Parliamentary Group? said, champions like the noble Lord, Lord Fowler, to keep the momentum up globally as well as nationally. The second issue is that as the needs move to What are the key issues? The first is funding. The middle-income countries from low-income countries, noble Lord, Lord Cashman, has already pulled out the funding gap needs to be addressed. It is important one extremely important point, which is that most not just that external parties such as DfID do something people who are affected are now in middle-income about this but that the countries themselves are encouraged countries, and the development agencies of the world, to take up the slack. There were, after all, the Abuja particularly DfID, do not give money to middle-income agreements of 2003 and 2001, whereby every African countries. Even the Global Fund, which is cash strapped, Government committed themselves to spend 15% of is having to prioritise the poorest countries. This is a their expenditure on health. Only six have yet hit that wider issue about development because most poor target. So there is a great challenge that should be put people now live in middle-income countries. Therefore, to the middle-income countries. we cannot think about this as being aid to poor My second question is: what are Her Majesty’s countries; it is much more targeted. Government doing to help facilitate continued access The response of groups such as the International to funding for countries moving to middle-income HIV/AIDS Alliance is to try to raise money locally. status? That includes encouraging national Governments This is very difficult. I am proud to be the chair of to play an increased part. My final point is not in the Sightsavers, which works, for example, in India, where form of a question. The UK is also very influential on we can raise money because you can raise money for civil liberties, and it needs to argue the case about elderly people with cataracts or children going blind discrimination louder than it has. I know that that is relatively easily in any society. It is much harder when difficult. I have spent a lot of time in Africa. I was you are talking about intravenous drug users or men recently in Uganda, where I came across a situation who have sex with men. It is even harder in those where Ugandan doctors were extremely annoyed—with countries than it is in our own country. That is the the Americans, I am happy to say, rather than the second big point about prejudice and discrimination Brits—because on the one hand Americans from various against the groups that are most at risk. In purely gay groups were arguing their case and on the other, health terms, this affects treatment and prevention Americans from various church groups were arguing and is very counterproductive economically and in their case. They said: “The last thing that we need is an health terms—but, of course, there are other profound American war on our territory”. They likened that to ethical and human rights issues here that ought to be some other things that had happened earlier in their addressed. history. The third issue that people who work in this area It is difficult to intervene in any other country, but tell me about is the loss of priority that is coming to we need to take a stance as a nation about who we are HIV/AIDS because, at the end of this year, we will as well as who our friends are and how we work with move on from the millennium development goals to other people. There is a vital health case to be made the sustainable development goals, which I support. here, because this is about health and the economy as Let me be very clear: I think that the sustainable well as people’s beliefs about society. The right to development goals, which put an emphasis on the health is fundamental. It is also ultimately an economic whole of the health system, are exactly what is needed case. Healthy populations can be productive and prosperous. for the future in low and middle-income countries, particularly on the light of things such as Ebola. I Finally, I support the call made by the noble Lord, think the case is made by Ebola. However, it raises a Lord Fowler, at the end of his excellent book, where very serious issue of transition from HIV/AIDS being he says that there should be some sort of international central to international development to it not being in convention based here in London—something that quite the same position, and how that transition will this Government or a Government formed after May be managed. The All-Party Parliamentary Group on should take up—on protecting the rights of people HIV/AIDS has just published an excellent report, who are discriminated against in that way. GC 151 HIV/AIDS[LORDS] HIV/AIDS GC 152

4.27 pm friend pointed out, and the other is ensuring ever-higher levels of testing. On prevention, there is a great deal of Lord Black of Brentwood (Con): My Lords, like hope and optimism with the development of pre-exposure other noble Lords, I am indebted to my noble friend prophylaxis presenting incredibly exciting opportunities. Lord Fowler for securing this debate today and for Although it has been available in the US for some giving us, as he said, what is probably the last opportunity time, it is not yet here, but should, I believe, be before Dissolution to discuss the issue of HIV and available to all those at risk in the UK as soon as AIDS. possible. As Yusef Azad at the National AIDS Trust—and It is therefore a fitting moment to pay him the I pay tribute to its work—put it to me, the very recent warmest of tributes, as other noble Lords have done, PROUD trial looking at the impact of pre-exposure for everything that he has done throughout this Parliament prophylaxis here, to keep this subject right up at the top of the political “is a prevention game-changer which we cannot afford to ignore. agenda, focusing on not just the impact of HIV and As a much needed addition to—not substitute for—condom use, AIDS in the United Kingdom but on the terrible its costs are modest when compared with the lifelong costs of scourge of the epidemic in so much in developing treating someone with HIV if we fail to prevent their infection”. world, which the noble Lord, Lord Crisp, spoke about He is absolutely right, and I hope that NHS England so eloquently just now. I only hope that at the end of will heed those wise words. Action sooner rather than the next Parliament in five years’ time, we will have later will save not just lives, but money too. I support seen more progress at home but also some of the everything that my noble friend said. It must be Mickey incredibly important changes that need to take place Mouse economics to spend so much on treatment and in the developing world as a prerequisite to tackling so little on prevention. HIV and AIDS. I absolutely agree with the noble Lord Similarly, there has been much progress on testing, that the most crucial is the rapid decriminalisation of as we have heard, but the figures for late diagnosis—still homosexuality in many Commonwealth countries. above 40%—are shockingly high. To tackle that, I Criminalisation is not just a moral outrage; it is a hope that, among other things, the NICE public health public health disaster, and we must do everything that guidance recommending that high-prevalence local we can to stop it. I do not want to dwell on that subject authorities commission HIV testing to be offered to today, but it would be good to hear from the Minister all those admitted to a hospital and all those registering that the Government are continuing to put pressure with a GP is implemented soon. The Government and on Commonwealth institutions to live up to their Public Health England can play a powerful leadership obligations under the Commonwealth charter. role, and I would be grateful if the Minister could take I do not know whether it is a coincidence or whether the lead today in calling for such important initiatives my noble friend has engineered it this way, but this to be implemented. very week is the 30th anniversary of the approval of Of course, key to both testing and prevention is the the first commercial HIV blood test on 2 March 1985. ongoing problem of stigma. The National AIDS Trust That was a seminal moment in the battle against what survey on public attitudes published in December last was then an unstoppable horror. Testing meant that year still makes very depressing reading. If anything, the blood supply could essentially be freed of HIV. It public knowledge and attitudes seem to be deteriorating, also helped scientists and other public health officials and we need to take action to reverse that, otherwise, to determine the extent of the epidemic. For the first all the good work on testing and prevention could be time, it empowered individuals by allowing them to in vain. This is, of course, a matter that goes well know their status and to protect their partners if they beyond central government, but local government, the had been infected. What a change 30 years have made. NHS and schools all have a role to play.The Government Today, HIV testing is at an all-time high. As I understand can, again, take a lead, and I know that the Minister, it, in the United States, 86% of people who are infected who has done so much to help in this area in the past, know their status, although that means that an eye- will take up that challenge and this afternoon energise watering 186,000 people in the United States of America all those involved to redouble their efforts to tackle do not know that they are infected. stigma. Despite that success, however, rates of infection are I am conscious that there are no noble Baronesses still disturbingly high, as we have heard, with 6,000 people speaking this afternoon, undoubtedly because of the in the UK diagnosed in 2013. That figure crosses every clash with the debate on International Women’s Day, age group. I am grateful to the Minister for providing but I want to say a word or two about the special information on that point in a Written Answer to me issues still faced by women with HIV and to cast a in the past few weeks. While the majority of people quick glance beyond our own shores to where the diagnosed in 2013 were in the 35 to 50 age group, 462 situation for people with HIV is still incredibly difficult new cases of HIV among gay men were in those aged and in some cases horrific. I commend an excellent under 24 and 308 were in those aged over 50. Among report published in the past few months by the Salamander heterosexuals, 105 women and 47 men were aged Trust, which last summer conducted a global survey between 15 and 24 and 439 were over 50. This is still a on the sexual and reproductive health and human virus that respects no boundary of age or background. rights of women living with HIV.Of those who responded Despite the fact that an HIV diagnosis is no longer, in a survey that took place in 94 countries, a shocking as it was 30 years ago, a death sentence—indeed, those 89% reported that they had experienced violence or infected and properly treated will probably have a fear of violence since or because of their diagnosis— normal, healthy lifespan—problems, as we heard during in their homes, in their communities and even, most the debate, remain. One is prevention, as my noble appallingly of all, in healthcare settings. Only 50% of GC 153 HIV/AIDS[5 MARCH 2015] HIV/AIDS GC 154 respondents found their healthcare service providers middle-income countries whereby funding is being to be well trained and knowledgeable about their pulled out from all directions, including from the condition. A significant number emphasised the challenges Global Fund, while the pharmaceutical industry continues of poverty and the resulting strain that it places on to expect MIC Governments to afford higher prices mental as well physical and sexual health. It is little for ARV treatment? wonder that 80% of respondents reported experiences In England, the Health and Social Care Act changed of depression, shame, loneliness and feelings of rejection. the commissioning and monitoring of HIV prevention, The report contains a wealth of recommendations testing, treatment and care services. Conditions that about how to improve the specific condition of many require specialist expertise and medication are the women across the globe living with HIV. I hope that responsibility of NHS England, including HIV treatment. the Government will be prepared to support such In its Five Year Forward View, NHS England states recommendations. It is an initiative that the that it plans to let local commissioners share responsibility Commonwealth in particular could pursue. Progress for commissioning specialised services, incentivising may be slow—I think that we all understand that—but them to direct funding towards local priorities. this is a tangible way in which we could help improve Naturally, many patient groups are concerned about the lot of thousands of lonely, frightened and vulnerable the impact on service standards leading to a possible people across the globe. postcode lottery. Their concern is heightened by the As so often in debates on this subject, there is much fact that there are so many outstanding questions significant progress to applaud and great hope and about what co-commissioning will look like and no optimism, but there are problems, too: in tackling specific announcements related to HIV. What steps stigma in particular. There are serious challenges will the Minister take to ensure that the overall beyond our shores in tackling the criminalisation of responsibility for the provision of services is clearly homosexuality, which is turbo-charging the HIV epidemic defined? It is also vital that standards of care are in much of the world, in dealing with the special maintained across the country. problems faced by women with HIV and in ensuring As we have heard in this debate, particularly from access to healthcare for all who need it. As I said the noble Lord, Lord Fowler, the Government have earlier, some of those issues will take time to tackle, funded national HIV prevention programmes since but I hope that this debate will again spur us to 1996. In recent years, funding for these programmes redouble our efforts both here in the UK and in the has been progressively reduced. The current English wider world one day to bring to an end a horrific national prevention programme HIV Prevention epidemic which has already claimed too many lives England—HPE—has been funded for three years until and will yet claim many more. the end of March 2015. Funding for HPE is £2.4 million per year, which is less than the combined funding 4.36 pm received by the previous prevention programmes in Lord Collins of Highbury (Lab): My Lords, I, too, 2011 and 2012. In December 2014, the Government pay tribute to the noble Lord, Lord Fowler, for his indicated that they intended to reduce funding for outstanding work on HIV and AIDS both here and HPE by 50% to £1.2 million for 2015-16. globally, advocating action on prevention, treatment That decision was criticised by many organisations, and care while attacking discrimination and stigma. who led a public campaign seeking reconsideration, As we have heard in this debate, it is estimated that and shortly afterwards it was reversed and a commitment 35 million people are living with HIV worldwide, made to fund the programme at current levels for a with 1.5 million AIDS-related deaths in 2013. Here, further year. Will the reallocated budget support a 6,000 people were diagnosed as carrying the HIV new programme of work or existing activities that are infection in 2013, and 320 people were reported as currently paid for with other budgets? having AIDS. An estimated 107,800 people are now In addition to the national HPE programme, local living with HIV. authorities should be investing in complementary As we have heard in the debate, the UK is one of prevention initiatives as part of their public health the world’s leading funders of global health. If we are responsibilities. However, National Aids Trust research to move beyond investments to control HIV and towards shows that less than 0.1% of local funding allocated to eradication, we desperately need new tools. Where public health in high HIV-prevalence areas is being there is an affluent market, as is the case with adult spent on primary HIV prevention. A total of about HIV drugs, we can see significant private investment. 1.2 million men have sex with men and black African By contrast, there are very few formulations of paediatric adults living in England. A budget of £1.2 million HIV drugs, where the market is smaller and more means that the national programme has only £l to heavily based in developing countries. UNAIDS highlights spend a year for each person in its target audience. the fact that only 24% of children living with HIV Does the Minister believe that that is enough to achieve currently have access to HIV treatment. Will the Minister the programme’s objectives? The estimated lifetime support within government the recommendation from cost of treating someone with HIV is £360,777. That the HIV/AIDS APPG that the UK commissions an means that even if a £2.4 million programme prevented economic paper to contrast the total costs of developing only seven new transmissions a year, it would save the and purchasing medical tools using the current R&D NHS money. Is there not a strong case for increasing model with the costs of a delinked model? the funding rather than cutting it? As was asked by other noble Lords, including the Finally, I raise the issue of pre-exposure prophylaxis— noble Lord, Lord Crisp, can the Minister explain how PrEP—to which the noble Lord, Lord Black, referred. the Government will address the growing problem in Really impressive research from England was released GC 155 HIV/AIDS[LORDS] HIV/AIDS GC 156

[LORD COLLINS OF HIGHBURY] However, we are acutely aware that challenges remain last week. I read it at the international retrovirus in how we tackle HIV.Although overall HIV prevalence conference in Seattle. The study recruited men who in the UK is very low, there are marked variations. In have sex with men and trans women who were at London, HIV prevalence in men who have sex with elevated risk of acquiring HIV. They had multiple men—MSM—is much higher, and in 2013 one in eight partners; condom use was inconsistent or irregular; men were living with HIV, compared to one in 26 rates of sexually transmitted infections were high; outside London. In 2013, the prevalence rate of HIV many participants had needed post-exposure prophylaxis was approximately 30 times higher for MSM and before and recreational drug use was common. black African men and women compared to the general Participants were generally well-educated and in full-time population in England. New diagnoses in MSM continue employment. The fact that the study has demonstrated to increase, with 3,250 MSM diagnosed in 2013. Some such a high and statistically significant level of efficacy of this increase will be due to increased testing but with a few hundred participants tells us both about there is evidence of increasing risk-taking behaviours, how effective PrEP is and how high the rate of infection which prevention services and community groups must is in some groups of gay men. address, taking into account the latest research and What is being done to ensure that this highly effective evidence. Achieving sustained changes in risk-taking HIV-prevention intervention is made available is challenging for all. to those who need it without delay? What work is Today, HIV prevention is just as important as it was being done to ensure that prescribing of PrEP is in the 1980s. Investment in prevention also makes appropriately targeted to those who are most likely to good economic sense, as noble Lords have argued, benefit from it? given that each new HIV infection represents between £280,000 and £360,000 in lifetime treatment costs alone. I will pick up a point made by the noble Lord, Lord Cashman. Although we have excellent NHS 4.45 pm HIV treatment and care services, and antiretroviral The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department treatment is highly effective, we are still seeing too of Health (Earl Howe) (Con): My Lords, I am most many people diagnosed late, after treatment is grateful to my noble friend for today’s debate on this recommended. This means they are unable to benefit important issue. All of us know how much he personally from that treatment and risk transmitting HIV to their has done to ensure that HIV and AIDS remain firmly partners. Although we have seen improvements, HIV on agendas, both at home and abroad. I may not be still attracts stigma, which is unacceptable and can able to give him a medal, but I congratulate him on his deter people from getting tested and, if positive, taking book AIDS: Don’t Die of Prejudice, which is very their medication. I listened with care to my noble timely and draws on his great experience. It is most friend Lord Black on that theme. welcome given that there is still, as we have heard In 2013, the department published A Framework today, much to do around the world to reduce the for Sexual Health Improvement in England, setting out stigma and prejudice associated with HIV. I welcome, our ambitions to improve sexual health and well-being too, his appointment as a member of the International for all. These include reducing the rate of sexually AIDS Vaccine Initiative. transmitted infections, including HIV, using evidence- Compared with many other countries, HIV prevalence based prevention and treatment initiatives; tackling in the UK remains relatively low: just under three per HIV through prevention, including increasing access 1,000 of the adult population were living with HIV in to testing to enable earlier diagnosis and treatment; 2013. Thanks to the Government’s early efforts and and tackling the stigma, discrimination and prejudice the leadership of my noble friend back in the 1980s, often associated with sexual health and HIV. we have been spared the higher prevalence rates seen by other European countries and countries in other Late diagnosis is included as an indicator in the continents. Our confidential sexual health clinics are public health outcomes framework and progress is doing more and more HIV tests—more than a million being monitored. Since we published the framework, in 2013, up 5% from 2012. The NHS continues we know that HIV testing services are changing and to provide excellent, high-quality HIV treatment and becoming more innovative and focused around the care for everyone, with 90% having an undetectable needs of people. A good example of that is self-sampling viral load. Diagnosed early, the outlook for people HIV tests to reduce undiagnosed and late diagnosis with HIV in the UK is very good and most people can of HIV. expect a near normal life expectancy. We also benefit Self-sampling HIV test schemes, such as those provided from government’s sustained investment in Public Health through the HIV Prevention England programme and England’s comprehensive HIV surveillance systems. the 56 Dean Street clinic in Soho, show that new types A 2014 report for the National AIDS Trust by of tests are acceptable. Importantly, they appeal to Ipsos MORI reported that overall public support for people who choose not to use traditional services, and people with HIV is higher than ever, with 79% of they are picking up undiagnosed HIV. An assessment adults agreeing that people with HIV deserve the same of more than 4,000 people using self-sampling HIV level of support as people with cancer. Today, it is testing services in November 2013 indicated that the much easier to get an HIV test, with virtually all NHS majority had never had an HIV test, yet were reporting sexual health clinics providing the option of same-day high-risk behaviour. It is encouraging that the rates of testing results. Like many other countries, we have late diagnosis are improving, albeit slowly—down from virtually eliminated mother-to-child transmission of HIV. 57% in 2004 to 42% in 2013. However, I agree that we GC 157 HIV/AIDS[5 MARCH 2015] Women: Domestic and Mental Abuse GC 158 need to do more to reduce this. Last year, we removed need to build an honest and open culture, where the ban on the sale of self-testing kits, which will everyone can make informed decisions and responsible eventually provide further options for testing. choices about relationships and sex. Healthcare services, including general practice, The noble Lord, Lord Cashman, referred to the especially in high-prevalence areas, have a key role in role of local authorities. We believe that local authorities offering HIV testing. We were pleased to fund the are best placed to make decisions on investment in Medical Foundation for HIV & Sexual Health to HIV health promotion services and primary prevention produce a web-based interactive tool to make testing services. Reducing the late diagnosis of HIV is included easier in primary care. That was launched by MEDFASH in the public health outcomes framework, as I mentioned. last November. We have provided local authorities with £8.2 billion of Finally, my noble friend Lord Fowler referred to ring-fenced funding for public health, including HIV the prevention budget. We are committed to protecting prevention. I completely understand the arguments in the national HIV prevention budget for next year. I favour of the ring-fence; it has played an important agree with him that we will need to be more ambitious part in ensuring a smooth transition of services and and innovative in our plans to prevent the spread of will continue to apply through the next financial year. HIV. We will be announcing our plans very shortly We have always intended to review the need for it and these are likely to include a contract with the after that. We will do that during discussion on the Terrence Higgins Trust for the HIV Prevention England next spending round, but of course it is for the next programme, but we are also keen to be more innovative Government under the ensuing comprehensive spending and ambitious in our response. At that time, the review to decide on the continuation of the ring-fence. answer to one of the questions posed by the noble In primary care, there is evidence that HIV testing Lord, Lord Collins, will become clearer. is acceptable to patients and healthcare professionals. I will endeavour to answer as many questions as I My department was pleased to fund the Medical can in the time available but I will of course write to Foundation for HIV & Sexual Health for its HIV noble Lords whose questions I cannot answer today. testing in primary care project, launched last November. The noble Lord, Lord Collins, referred to a lack of I just mention the issue of PrEP and Truvada, clarity, as he perceives it, in the overall responsibility referred to by my noble friends Lord Fowler and Lord for commissioning these services. We recognise that Black and the noble Lord, Lord Collins. The recent the public health and NHS reforms have presented results from the trial are encouraging. Further work is some challenges for sexual health services, and a number needed, and NHS England has set up an expert committee of actions have been taken or are planned. Public to consider the results of the PROUD study and Health England has worked with partners, including whether PrEP should be provided by the NHS. Some the Local Government Association, and last summer outstanding issues are being considered in that process published Making it Work: A Guide to Whole System which prevent us forging ahead immediately with any Commissioning for Sexual Health, Reproductive Health action. For example, there is the evidence supporting and HIV. It is planning to undertake a review of use in other higher-risk groups, such as black African commissioning arrangements for sexual health and groups, and whether the recommendation should be HIV, similar to the one just published for drugs and for daily treatment, as in the study, or only to protect alcohol. individuals for a certain high-risk event. The service My noble friend Lord Fowler called for a new model is also important here. I can write further on campaign to promote testing. As I mentioned, the that to noble Lords. level of testing in sexual health clinics is increasing, I hope that I can reassure my noble friend Lord which is encouraging. More than 1 million tests were Fowler on the continuation of methadone and reducing carried out in 2013, which was an increase on the the harm that drug-taking can cause. Again, I shall previous year. I agree that that level needs to increase, write to him on that subject, as I shall to the noble with action by local authorities, especially in high- Lord, Lord Crisp, and all those who have spoken prevalence areas. We need to offer new ways of testing, about global issues. For now, my time is up. I thank all as I mentioned—for example, home sampling. contributors for their expert speeches, to which I shall The noble Lord, Lord Cashman, rightly said that respond. engagement with HIV charities was vital in determining the way forward. We see 2015-16 as a transition year 4.58 pm towards a longer-term plan for sexual health promotion and HIV prevention. Public Health England will engage Sitting suspended. with key stakeholders on their new strategy, and my department has been discussing 2015-16 contracts since last November. Women: Domestic and Mental Abuse My noble friend Lord Black mentioned stigma. Question for Short Debate I remind us all that it is not just the NHS or the Government who have a role to play here, it is everybody. 5pm Community and faith groups, the media and individuals Asked by Baroness King of Bow all have a part to play in eliminating HIV-related stigma. We should not forget some of the good news, To ask Her Majesty’s Government what assessment part of which is that people with HIV are now protected they have made of the role that women’s refuge by UK equalities legislation. The department’s framework centres play in protecting victims of domestic and for sexual health improvement is clear that there is a mental abuse. GC 159 Women: Domestic and Mental Abuse[LORDS] Women: Domestic and Mental Abuse GC 160

Baroness King of Bow (Lab): My Lords, I want to prison that he committed suicide rather than live in open this debate by considering the fundamental constant fear of his father coming back to get them. importance of housing. I always remember that when Without specialist refuges for Mandy to go to and I first became an MP, I received a leaflet called “Don’t services which understood the level of danger they Make Me Laugh”. Because of very poor-quality housing were in, she does not think that she would be alive three of the children living in a particular house in my now. They provided not only a roof over the heads of constituency, which had dripping wet damp on all the her and her children, but specialist knowledge to help walls, had bad respiratory and asthmatic conditions. protect her from a dangerous perpetrator. They helped The doctor had said to the mother, “You must make her to rebuild her life and gave her the ongoing support sure that your children don’t laugh”. The importance she needed. of housing should be seen as a fundamental public That is what Mandy needed then. What we need service, in the same way as education or health, because now is a new model of funding and commissioning a successful housing policy is never just about bricks that promotes a sustainable service and high-quality or mortar. This is particularly true when you add care. Going back to what the Government have done, domestic violence to the mix. in November 2014 the Government responded to the As we all know, domestic violence accounts for one SOS campaign by announcing a £10 million fund for in four murders in British society—murders of a woman specialist domestic violence refuges. The fund will by her partner or ex-partner—and costs our economy seek to deal with some of the problems that I and an extraordinary £15.7 billion per annum. Just think others, including Women’s Aid, have pointed out, very of the waste, never mind the human misery, which is vocally, around the need to keep refuges open, first unquantifiable. I spoke at an event last night for and foremost, to ensure that non-local women are not Housing for Women. Its domestic violence helpline restricted from accessing services and to improve what received 2,000 calls last year. It is just one small provision there is. As I have said, this £10 million fund charity working in the area. Across the country, the is extremely welcome; however it will end in March police receive a call from a survivor of domestic violence 2016. This will impact Women’s Aid and the other every 30 seconds. incredible organisations up and down the country that I initiated this debate because I have been particularly seek to protect women in such terrible circumstances. struck by the work of Women’s Aid, an incredible These will be left in the same position that they were in organisation which works to help women and children last October: they have no long-term, sustainable funding. survivors of domestic violence. It is expert in the This debate also touches on the issue of mental matter and it understands—and would like us and abuse and I want to flag up some of the issues there. those in Government to understand—that we need a Clearly, domestic violence has an enormous effect on needs-led intervention for this issue. Critically, we one’s mental health. A third of all female suicide need to help women and children achieve long-term attempts and half of those by ethnic minority women independence. I want to say how much I welcome the are attributed to past or current experiences of domestic Government’s announcement of new money, which I violence. Some 70% of women psychiatric in-patients will come back to. The problem is that it is a short-term and 80% of women held in secure psychiatric facilities stop-gap measure. It is none the less clearly very have a history of physical or sexual abuse. That is an welcome and I genuinely thank the Government for incredible figure. If we are to deal with those women what they have done there. who have the biggest problems, we need to deal with The Women’s Aid annual survey found in 2014 that the issue facing 80% of them, which is a history of a third of all referrals to refuges were turned away. A physical or sexual abuse. Clearly, the impact on children third of those women who arrive looking for shelter is devastating. and seeking refuge from violence, and sometimes My noble friend Lady Thornton has previously despicable torture as well, were turned away. Women’s highlighted cases in the south-west of England and in Aid would like to see a national network of specialist Chester West and Chester, where vulnerable women domestic violence refuges that are protected and have fleeing domestic violence no longer have access to a new model of sustainable funding. specialist accommodation, or where numbers of women I begin with an example of a survivor case study and children from outside local authorities are being because quite often when we talk about the human capped. I know that the Government are aware of this misery, the statistics do not quite capture the experience. issue. What will happen when this funding round I will give only one example; I have given many others ends? The Minister will also know that there are still in many other speeches on many other occasions. authorities where services are not available to women Mandy experienced 18 years of domestic violence at from outside the area. Obviously, if one is fleeing a the hands of her partner, which included severe physical psychotic, violent perpetrator, one wants to get as far abuse, rape and humiliation in front of her children. away as possible, not to be in the same authority. Every element of her life was controlled by her partner. In Northamptonshire, the county council planned He made her leave her job when she got a promotion. to cut all its support for domestic violence refuges. She tried to escape on numerous occasions but he After a successful campaign with Labour colleagues would track her down. He hacked into her medical and the refuges themselves, the council backed down. files, broke into her property and repeatedly attacked However, the funding has been reduced, especially for and threatened the whole family until she went back. Nene Valley Christian Family Refuge, one of the few Mandy’s eldest son witnessed a particularly horrific organisations in the area to support women. It helps attack in which Mandy nearly lost her life. Her son women who have been brought over for arranged or was so traumatised when his father was let out of forced marriages and who are especially vulnerable. GC 161 Women: Domestic and Mental Abuse[5 MARCH 2015] Women: Domestic and Mental Abuse GC 162

I trust that the Minister shares my concern that such services for victims, together in partnership with other vital services are being put at risk. What advice does authorities and sector specialists. In all the work that I he have for refuges that are seeking long-term funding do with communities and victims of crime, I have beyond 2016? Does he agree that we need a new, always said that valuable partnerships need to be sustainable model? Does he agree, in particular, that if sustainable partnerships. While domestic abuse victims we focus only on high-risk victims, we fail to appreciate need to know that they have a safe place through the the fluid nature of risk? We need to look at need as provision of a refuge space or alternative housing well as risk or we will not get a full picture. accommodation, they must also be able to have access Finally, in the time remaining, will the Minister to other support services that are needed as a result of make a statement on the Government’s understanding being in the refuge. I am not suggesting that specialist of the gendered nature and impact of abuse? Too and support services need necessarily to be co-located often, the professionals charged with dealing with this at refuges or local housing centres, but the wide range subject, as we saw in the Statements to Parliament of services and support that a victim will need when this week on child abuse in Oxfordshire, are simply not they have left the perpetrator are properly recognised. aware of how their decisions endanger vulnerable This will also include financial support and legal people, often young women. Those experiences lead to advice. In addition, it is likely that some women may a lifetime of catastrophe. I truly thank the Government also need help and support to manage or treat mental for averting catastrophe for some women like Mandy, health issues as a result of any mental abuse they have but should we not do more to avert catastrophe for all also experienced during an abusive relationship. women like Mandy? We are all aware of the different forms that domestic abuse can take. Some victims will experience mental 5.10 pm health issues as a result of the abuse they are suffering Baroness Newlove (Con): My Lords, I thank the and some victims may in fact be abused because they noble Baroness, Lady King, for drawing the Committee’s have a mental health condition. Abuse can also very attention to the plight of women and men who experience often worsen an existing condition. It is so important domestic abuse, and the availability of refuges for that any refuge provision or alternative housing solution them. In my role as Victims Commissioner for England recognises this and can facilitate intervention from and Wales, I have met many women who have suffered mental health professionals where needed. The noble almost unimaginable abuse at the hands of their partners Baroness, Lady King, highlighted the outstanding work and have been faced with homelessness as a result. The of Women’s Aid. Figures from Women’s Aid reports Government’s commitment to assist women, and in show that domestic abuse is the most prevalent cause some cases men, to escape the abuse that they are of depression, anxiety and other mental health difficulties suffering is admirable. However, it is clear that more in women. It is so sad to hear that 70% of women needs to be done. psychiatric in-patients and 80% of those in secure We hear a lot about statistics relating to the prevalence settings have a history of physical or sexual abuse. It is of domestic abuse. We know for example that: one in all well and good for there to be an increase in the four women will experience domestic violence or abuse quality of refuge and alternative accommodation at some point in their lives; that almost 100 women are provision, but what really needs to be in place is a killed every year as a result of an act of domestic recognition of what specialist support women need to abuse; and that on average a domestic abuse victim will help them when they leave an abusive partner. attempt to flee the perpetrator several times before Staff at refuges should be required to complete they successfully manage to do so. Local housing training on mental health awareness so that these authorities have a clear duty towards victims of abuse. issues can be identified and victims assisted in accessing Housing and accommodation provide a pivotal role in the right services for their specific needs. I do not wish making sure that victims can be made to feel safe by to criticise the few services that do exist to help women providing them with a refuge from the abuse they are accessing mental health support when they are placed suffering. in refuges or alternative accommodation. Rather, what There is a real problem in the availability of I am trying to say is that we must not lose sight of the accommodation for women escaping abusive partners. fact that some women are so traumatised they may not While there are many refuges undertaking commendable realise that they need specialist support in addition to work, they are buckling under the pressures of being a housing solution. able to provide a place of safety for all victims who I do not consider myself to be a professional politician need it. The lack of availability at refuges across or a policymaker. My experience comes from being a England and Wales tells a sad story. Knowing that a victim of crime and seeing how agencies do not work victim can access such services might help them to feel together. In fact, I stand here today in this debate still more able to escape their abuser. However, where going through those issues. I do not pretend to have all victims are continually being told that there is insufficient the answers, but from meeting and speaking with space for them at refuges, or where housing authorities many victims of domestic abuse, I know that it is a are unable to provide appropriate accommodation, complex and emotional issue which cannot be resolved this important lifeline presents an increased risk that by a one-size-fits-all response. This is why it is important the victim will remain where she is and possibly risk that the Government consider how such support can her life by continuing to stay with the perpetrator. be provided across the board so that victims of domestic I commend the Government’s recent funding of abuse can be kept safe from further harm and further £10 million and I was heartened to see that the bidders traumatisation through providing quality practical had to demonstrate how they could develop sustainable support. The biggest obstacle to this is that government GC 163 Women: Domestic and Mental Abuse[LORDS] Women: Domestic and Mental Abuse GC 164

[BARONESS NEWLOVE] Of course, there is an issue about resourcing and departments, such as those responsible for homelessness, models of provision. The February 2015 APPG report health and social services issues, do not seem to join states: together to address this issue. This simply is not good “The current model for funding specialist domestic and sexual enough. There needs to be joined-up support across violence services is not fit for purpose”. all the agencies, and women must be supported to grab Since 2011, Refuge has had funding reductions in 80% the whole of their problems in the order that makes of its service contracts, with some contracts cut by up most sense to them. to 50%. That is the background of our case study on The fact that we are having this debate today shows some of the issues. People desperately need safe space how we and society have moved forward in speaking and the struggle is to provide it and to fund it. about and recognising the nature and prevalence of What might safe space look like, and where are we domestic abuse, more so perhaps than previous failing? Because of the lack of resources and of stable generations. However, I know we can often become provision, there are fewer specialist services, especially desensitised and be made complacent by facts and for minority-ethnic communities and disabled women, figures. We must remember that there is a real person so they are not being offered a safe enough space behind each of these figures who has suffered, and because there is not special provision for people in continues to suffer, dreadful abuse despite the very those categories. Similarly, Refuge reports that in some best intentions of government and policymakers. local commissioning the tenders specify mixed-bedroom I am sickened and saddened by the numbers of provision. That may be an economic factor if you are domestic abuse victims suffering from mental health short of money, but one of the things women are issues, more so when I hear that there is little funding trying to get into a safe space for is to step away from a available for those who can provide the services and strong male environment. They need to be protected specialist help to support these victims. I know the from that. To have tenders that specify that is rather feeling of not feeling safe outside your home, and for alarming. That is not safe space either. As the noble these victims to not feel safe inside their homes because Baroness, Lady King, said, there is a tendency to of the horrific abuse received by their partners must be spend our money in our space and therefore to say that hell on earth. These victims need to be listened to, and we will support local women only. As she said, women their experiences understood, to ensure that the most need to cross the boundary to feel safe, so if the space appropriate support can be identified for them. In doing is going to be genuinely safe it needs to be shaped across so, we will provide a co-ordinated, accessible response boundaries, which requires more imagination about which genuinely makes a difference to their lives. funding streams and how they can be deployed. Another issue is the short contracts for commissioning. Refuge and others win one or two-year contracts. That 5.19 pm is a start, but if you are going to build a reputation in a The Lord Bishop of Derby: My Lords, I, too, community for a safe and stable place, it needs to be congratulate the noble Baroness, Lady King, on securing there, because people learn about these things through this debate. I shall offer a brief case study and try to gossip. It is only if it is there and stable that it feels safe highlight some of the issues that we need to consider to potential consumers. If every couple of years there together. The contributions of the noble Baronesses, is a new provider, a new image and all those new things Lady King and Lady Newlove, and the briefing pack that anybody has to put in to get established, the very graphically show the scale and challenge of this issue. people we are trying to help are going to wonder To escape from domestic violence and mental abuse, whether the new provider is up to it and what it is people need safe space, because that is what they do about. To construct a safe space requires stability, so not have, which is what is so destabilising. I shall that is a challenge for how we use limited funds. The explore what safe space looks like and how we might danger is that if we do not get the provision of safe try to provide it securely so that it is genuinely safe. In space right then, as we all know, women in vulnerable Derby, where I work, an excellent organisation, Refuge, situations flee to the streets, which are the most unsafe won a contract in November 2013 to provide a women’s spaces in our society. refuge in the city. There are 25 spaces available and it I understand this very difficult problem of limited is always full. There are probably 40 or 50 children resources, but there are two issues that I want to raise. as well as the women involved. There is a very If we are serious about safe space being constructed high turnover because the contract states that the and maintained, how can we marshal our funds so accommodation can be provided for 12 weeks only. that there is stable provision, proper recognition of That is the deal, so you create a bit of safe space, but specialist needs and proper fluidity across local authority as soon as you start feeling safe, you have to move. It boundaries? We also have to encourage the statutory offers a resettlement service for up to three months, agencies that hold and administer funds to be proactive which is good, but all the research shows that women in working with the voluntary and faith sectors about need at least five or six months to begin to feel safe the added value that we can bring along with the other and settled. The aspiration for safe space is being forms of stability and safe space. As we found in frustrated by the 12-week turnover and the three-month considering the Modern Slavery Bill, in which I was limit on resettlement. The further graphic statistic that involved, faith and voluntary groups can provide space Refuge has shared with me is that 50% of the women it alongside statutory providers. We are just there to deals with have experienced death threats. That is the love people, really, which helps people to feel safe, degree of unsafeness which we are trying to create an alongside all the proper provision of a bed and room alternative to and a refuge from. of a certain size. GC 165 Women: Domestic and Mental Abuse[5 MARCH 2015] Women: Domestic and Mental Abuse GC 166

When the Minister replies, I encourage him to look Many of your Lordships will know that research at the limits of resources, how best to create a safe has revealed a typology of abuse, and that different space that is stable, dependable and flexible for the forms require different solutions. Coercive and controlling right specialisms—that is a pretty big ask—and how abuse, or intimate terrorism, is not the same as situational faith and voluntary groups can be challenged to put couple violence, violent resistance or separation-instigated their resources alongside the statutory ones to make violence. In addition, Professor Murray Straus’s research the provisions as stable and effective as possible. has made it clear that a surprisingly similar proportion of women and men use violence against their partner, 5.26 pm and one in seven men report being abused by their partner or ex-partner. However, as men are usually Lord Farmer (Con): My Lords, I, too, am grateful stronger than women, they tend to inflict far greater to the noble Baroness, Lady King, for securing another physical harm. debate on this important and, sadly, prevalent issue of domestic abuse. I hope that the Government are aware I want to lay out four ways in which we can intervene of the encouraging paradigm shift that is happening early and how policy can support this paradigm shift. right now in domestic abuse services, such that many First, it is imperative that families are helped to build are now intervening early to prevent many women strong parent and child relationships in the early years ending up in refuges. I must, however, stress at the to lay the foundations for secure relationships throughout beginning that I understand that the women and children life. Children who know that they are loved and cared who need the safety that refuges provide have typically for and who have learnt valuable interpersonal skills somehow survived the most terrifying and sustained are far less likely to grow up feeling that they need to attacks on their bodies and personhood imaginable. use violence in relationships or that they will inevitably Until we see the elimination of domestic violence— be on the receiving end. Recent YouGov polling for thankfully, many organisations are working towards the Centre for Social Justice found that 73% of the that ambition—those safe havens will be needed. public think that tackling abuse requires acknowledging that perpetrators were themselves young victims. Former hedge fund manager Diana Barran set up the greatly respected organisation Co-ordinated Action Secondly, it is essential that we encourage positive against Domestic Abuse, or CAADA. Diana’s starting relationships in schools by building supportive school point then and now is, “What would you want for your cultures, ensuring that students who need it can best friend?” Being safe in her own home rather than access counselling and mentoring services—great living in secrecy in a refuge, possibly at the other end examples being Place2Be and Chance UK—and providing of the country, must be the goal if at all possible. effective relationship education. The Government have CAADA, renamed as Safe Lives, recently concluded acknowledged the very high prevalence of adolescents that it needs a fresh approach if it is to provide the best in abusive dating relationships by including 16 and help, and it is strongly endorsing a paradigm shift 17 year-olds in the new definition of domestic abuse. towards early intervention, prevention and a family-based Worryingly, patterns set in adolescence can define emphasis in domestic abuse work—all without in any relationships in adulthood. Voluntary sector programmes way deprioritising safety, hence the new name. such as those run by Love4Life in Loughborough aim to help adolescents develop the skills to enjoy non-violent, I want to use my time today to draw your Lordships’ equal relationships, increase understanding of domestic attention to how the best available practice in the abuse, encourage appropriate attitudes and reduce country is seeking to achieve that shift and how abusive behaviours. The Government should make policy can and must support it. My simple point is relationship education mandatory and call it that, and that intervening early is vital to break the cycle of teach the biology of sex, which is already mandatory, domestic abuse that so many men and women are separately. Teachers often find relationship education caught up in. very hard to deliver, so schools should draw in the voluntary sector as its outsider status means it can add Although nothing excuses violence and it is by no real value. means inevitable, childhood exposure to domestic abuse is one of the most powerful predictors of becoming Thirdly, there should also be help for high-conflict both a perpetrator and a victim as an adult. However, and otherwise risky couples going through key transitions organisations are increasingly grasping the urgency of such as pregnancy or early years of parenting, or working across the whole family, with victim, perpetrator when parents decide to separate. Couple relationship and children being helped with all that they are contending education programmes, as well as the help for parents with so that they can move on, but with safety of mentioned earlier, needs to be offered in the community, course the top consideration. ideally in family hubs. In its recent report, Fully Committed, the Centre for Social Justice extensively describes how Atal Y Fro, for instance, Welsh for Safety in the Sure Start children’s centres should be evolved into Vale, was formerly known as the Vale of Glamorgan one-stop shops in every community. These would offer Women’s Aid. The name change reflects its broader a much wider range of help to parents to tackle the base of working. It has become convinced over years root causes of family breakdown and disadvantage. of practice that if it works only with the mother and children, it is just putting a sticking plaster on the Fourthly, prevention of ongoing and future abuse is problem. It also refers to those using their service as also taking place where couples are being helped to men, women and children, rather than perpetrators and explore staying together. Increasingly, and very carefully, victims, not least to reflect the complexity of what is mainstream service providers are no longer taking the going on in many households where there is violence. break-up of the abusive relationship as their starting GC 167 Women: Domestic and Mental Abuse[LORDS] Women: Domestic and Mental Abuse GC 168

[LORD FARMER] national network. That is why on 25 November last point of help for victims in cases of situational couple year in this House, my noble friend announced a violence. However, couple counselling can be positively £10 million fund to strengthen and boost refuge provision dangerous in cases of intimate terrorism. for vulnerable victims, as referred to by the noble Many people on the receiving end of domestic Baroness, Lady King. That funding was put in place abuse desperately want to keep the family together but to respond to the concerns expressed by the sector. We know that that can happen only if the abuse stops. If will shortly announce the successful areas which will both partners have a strong desire to work the issues receive funding—unfortunately not in time for this through, and whoever is being violent is taking full debate. A significant number of local housing authorities responsibility for their actions, therapeutic support will benefit from a share of the £10 million. can help end that abusive behaviour. It is very important That funding will see local authorities working to acknowledge that that may not mean that the closely with some of the 400 specialist domestic abuse couple stay together. Troubled families programmes support providers, such as Refuge or My Sisters Place, must include this help for couples, where appropriate, which was advocated by the right reverend Prelate. as part of their drive to equip parents to provide safe, Not only will it stop refuges closing but it will increase stable and nurturing relationships. Again, CSJ/YouGov the number of bed spaces, improve services in existing polling found that three-quarters of the public agreed refuges and place local refuges on a more sustainable that services should be available, if they wanted them, footing. That is not all that we have done to ensure the to help couples stay together. long-term quality of provision in England. In November Returning to Safety in the Vale, there is much to 2014, we used powers in the Housing Act 1996 to learn from how to work with a range of organisations publish strengthened statutory homelessness guidance. in a one-stop shop to help families with medium to This was developed with help from Women’s Aid, low-risk abuse to reshape and restore their lives. Current Imkaan and SafeLives, and it sets out clear standards evidence suggests that it has helped two-thirds of of support that victims of domestic abuse can expect families to stay together safely through a strategy to receive. of education, prevention and intervention in the Those standards cover a broad range of service community—EPIC. This involves different evidence-based areas including safety, health and well-being, children perpetrator programmes for men and women, a healthy and young people and prevention. All those who will relationships programme in every school in the Vale of receive funding have signed up to these exacting standards Glamorgan, and couples work. The current pilot is and we expect others to follow suit now that they are largely being paid for through charitable foundations, under the statutory guidance. We know that these but once it has proven its effectiveness, the aim is that standards are effective as they were developed, as I local authorities can commission it with confidence. said, with help from Women’s Aid and were derived Its annual cost is around £83,000 with a conservative from the national quality standards. estimate of cost savings of around £1.4 million. Although I think that the whole Committee agrees Finally, Safety in the Vale is still running a refuge, that refuges can play such an important role protecting but it is straining with every sinew to drain away all victims at their most vulnerable, we must do all we can need for it. Can the Minister please inform me where to prevent a situation from reaching crisis point. That and how government policy is keeping in step with this begins to address the question that my noble friend promising shift towards early intervention? Lord Farmer put at the end of his speech about early intervention. We are determined to continue to reach 5.35 pm out to young people to encourage them to challenge unacceptable attitudes and behaviours. For example, Lord Ashton of Hyde (Con): My Lords, I, too, am the Home Office’s This is Abuse campaign is helping very grateful to the noble Baroness, Lady King, for to reach young people. Only by preventing violence initiating this debate, and for the other very interesting and abuse in the first place can we hope to make a contributions on this important subject. I have no sustainable change over the long term. Education has experience of women’s refuges, but I live in an all-female a very important role to play in encouraging young household with a wife, four daughters and two female people to build healthy relationships. That is why we dogs, so I have a strong interest in the opportunities are committed to working with schools and other available to women in the UK today and the terrible experts to ensure that young people are receiving effects of domestic abuse when it occurs. age-appropriate information that allows them to make I want to make it clear that the Government believe informed choices and stay safe. that high quality refuge provision plays a vital role in protecting victims of domestic abuse who find themselves in a situation so difficult that they are forced to flee Baroness King of Bow: While the Minister is on the their own homes. Being able to access a specialist subject of a sustainable future, is there anything he domestic abuse refuge at the point a victim chooses to can do within government to assure Women’s Aid that leave home can make the difference between life and a sustainable, long-term funding solution might be death. The right reverend Prelate talked interestingly found? about safe space in this regard. The Government’s approach to strengthening refuge Lord Ashton of Hyde: I will come to that. As I was provision is underpinned by clear legal duties to homeless saying, education in schools is very important. Maintained victims, robust standards and significant investment. secondary schools are already legally required to teach We are strongly committed to maintaining a resilient sex and relationship education, and we expect academies GC 169 Women: Domestic and Mental Abuse[5 MARCH 2015] Women: Domestic and Mental Abuse GC 170 to do so, but I take my noble friend’s point about There was mention, too, of the fact that women are separating those two key areas. I will come to the being turned away from refuges. The Government measures that the Government are taking later. fund UKRefugesOnline, so that victims and those Rather than waiting for a crisis to happen, one of who work to support them can find appropriate the strengths of today’s homelessness services is that accommodation. Also, the new strengthened statutory local housing authorities are reaching out proactively guidance places clear expectations on how local authorities to those in need and helping them to avoid a commission and organise their refuge provision. The crisis in the first place. Since 2010, more than 20,000 guidance makes it clear that available bed spaces or households experiencing domestic abuse have had their support should not be restricted to local people only. homelessness prevented by sanctuary schemes installed The homelessness legislation also protects victims of by local authorities working with the domestic abuse domestic abuse by placing a duty on local authorities support sector. Of course, they have to have victim to provide accommodation to those vulnerable people approval. who find themselves homeless as a result of fleeing domestic violence. Supported by an investment of £6.5 billion over this spending review period, interventions such as The noble Baroness also asked about the impact of family mediation, resolving rent arrears and sanctuary local authority cuts on refuge services. The DCLG’s schemes all help to prevent problems escalating out of statutory best value guidance to local authorities makes it control. Frequently, it is the local authority working clear that councils need to avoid making disproportionate hand in hand with the voluntary and community cuts to the voluntary and community sector. They sector which helps get the lives of victims and their have un-ring-fenced many of these funds, so that the families back on track. The Troubled Families programme, local authorities have flexibility in their use of funds. for example, will target an extra 400,000 troubled This duty will make it clear to them that they are not families, thanks to the investment of an additional allowed disproportionately to cut the voluntary and £200 million. Our research shows that 29% of families community sector. There is some good news. Local on the current programme have experienced domestic authorities’ own estimates show that 91% expect a abuse in the past six months and that is why the growth in their business rates income, which would expanded programme will use domestic abuse as a equal about £400 million. specific indicator of eligibility. My noble friend Lady Newlove complained that we We have a strong record on tackling domestic violence do not join up government support enough. I absolutely and abuse. For the first time ever, this Government acknowledge that it is difficult to co-ordinate service provided £40 million for specialist local domestic and delivery across government. We recognise this, and sexual violence support services. Our approach is set recognise that one size does not fit all. The Government’s out in our Call to End Violence Against Women and commitment to tackling these dreadful crimes is set Girls strategy published in 2010 and updated each out in the call to end violence against women, as I year. We will be publishing a further update shortly. It said, which is driven by the Home Secretary. The has put in place a tough legislative framework and Public Services Transformation Network funding, which strong protections to support victims of domestic is backed by the Cabinet Office and the Treasury, is abuse, which is overseen by the Home Secretary through also enabling local areas better to fit services to victims’ an inter-ministerial group. needs. For example, Essex has developed a strategic I now come to some of the questions I was asked. approach to commissioning a wide range of wrap-around The noble Baroness, Lady King, generously acknowledged services, including refuges, outreach, support for children, that the £10 million was welcome and that it is a survivor support groups and an enhanced perpetrator stop-gap. It is a limited amount of money. She has just strategy, and they are all included so that victims can asked me what advice I will give to the Government get the help that they need. and what commitment I can make on behalf of the Government about future funding. She knows how The right reverend Prelate asked about women government works. I am unable to give total government being moved on before they are ready. They should commitment at the moment, particularly six weeks not be being moved on in that way; it is right that before an election. We have put that £10 million funding victims, when they are given the chance, move on in place for two years in response to concerns and we when they are ready so that others can find a place of have made clear that that funding is a priority. I expect safety, but they should not be moved before then. As I that to continue and we will prioritise this matter mentioned, the Public Services Transformation Network when we are thinking about future spending after the helps local areas better to fit services to victims. We election, if we are in a position to do that. are clear that services must meet the needs of victims, and our guidance says that. The noble Baroness also asked for advice for refuges which are seeking to survive past 2016, which is a The right reverend Prelate also mentioned getting similar point. The duties to vulnerable women in the faith and voluntary sector to work alongside homelessness legislation will remain. New standards government. The guidance is clear that, when will ensure that the standards are maintained and commissioning services to help to support homeless meet the needs of victims. In fact, we prioritised victims, authorities should not exclude any sector. In funding in response to the issues that Women’s Aid fact, our experience shows that those sectors often and Refuge raised. I would expect that we would know the best, do the best jobs and are better able to prioritise this matter and continue to do so when we relate to and thus support victims—so I completely think about future spending plans after the election. agree with him. GC 171 Women: Domestic and Mental Abuse[LORDS] Women: Domestic and Mental Abuse GC 172

[LORD ASHTON OF HYDE] I think that I have answered most of the questions As for commissioning guidance, decisions on how that I was asked. If not, I shall be very happy to write best to find services for victims of domestic abuse are later. local matters, and we think that it is right that they Finally, I thank all noble Lords for participating in should be handled at local level. this hugely important and varied debate, which rightly To support effective local commissioning, the has the attention of the Committee. I wish all noble Government held a series of local road shows with Lords a very good weekend, including Sunday of local commissioners last year to share best practice in course, which will be International Women’s Day. effective commissioning. New standards published by the DCLG make it clear that the needs of those with a protected characteristic must be met in refuges. Committee adjourned at 5.50 pm.

Volume 760 Thursday No. 113 5 March 2015

CONTENTS

Thursday 5 March 2015 Questions Gender Equality: Developing Nations ...... 331 Sexual Violence against Girls and Women ...... 333 Women in Sport...... 336 Lake District National Park Authority ...... 338 Women: Economic Empowerment Motion to Take Note ...... 341 Transport: Accident Prevention Question for Short Debate ...... 414 Grand Committee Israel and Palestine...... GC 101 Sport: Women in Rowing ...... GC 116 Employment Levels of Older People...... GC 132 HIV/AIDS...... GC 144 Women: Domestic and Mental Abuse Questions for Short Debate ...... GC 158