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Qrbr ~ukon JL cgislatibr ~ s s cm bl p
Number 30 9th Session 23rd Legislature
Debates & Proceedings
Monday, February 27, 1978 .
Speaker: The Honourable Donald Taylor u u 0
o·.
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Published under the authority of the Speaker of the Legislative Assembly by the Quee n's Printer for Yukon. 0 0 Page 731
Whitehorse. Yukon Territory Mr. Speaker: Are there any further Notices of Motion or February 27. 1978 Resolution? Are there any Statements by Ministers? ThE Honourable Minister of Highways and Publi c Works? Mr. Speaker : I now call the !louse to order. We will proceed at this lime with Morning Prayers. STATEMENTS BY MINISTERS Prayers Hon. Mr. McKinnon: Mr. Speaker. I would like to inforrr. the House that the City of Whitehorse Assessment Notices fo r Mr. Spe~ker: We will proceed at this time to the Order the 1978 taxation year were mailed on Friday. February 24th . Paper. Are there any Documents for Tabling'? The Honoura and that the people of Wh itehorse will be receiving them over ble Member from Hootalinqua. the next few days. Mr. Speaker. property last assessed at 1969 fai r market ROUTI NE PROCEEDINGS value has now been assessed as per the Ordinance and the law at 1976 fair market value. Understandably, Mr . Speaker. as TABLI NG OF DOCUMENTS we all know, this new assessment will reflect a dramati c in crease in the assessed value of property within the City of Mr. Fleming: Yes. Mr. Speaker. I ha,·e for tabling this Whitehorse. morning. a brief. entitled "Han·esting of Grizzly Bear. Dall Sheep and Goat in the Yukon Territory". by the Yukon Outfit It is important to note. Mr. Speaker. that this value was ters Association. January. 1978. placed on all properties in Whitehorse before the end of 1976. Before the recent specu lative upsurge sparked by pipeline Mr. Speaker: The Honourable Member from Ogilvie. planning, particularly on commercial and industrial prop Ms Millard : Mr. Speaker. I have for tabling papers deal erty. ing with the new Federal policy of National Wilderness Parks. The Assessment Rolls in Whitehorse were old. inaccurate Mr. Speaker: Are there any further Documents for Tabl and contained values grossly out of date and a new assessment ing? was necessary because the value of property throughout the Reports of Committees·] Petitions? Introduction of Bills? Yukon must be assessed on a realistic. equitable basis. re Notices of Motion for the Production of Papers'? moved from any political influence at either the muni cipal or the territorial level. The Honourable Member from Kluane. The political role then. Mr. Speaker. is to strike a fair mill rate on an equitable and uniform assessment base. Mr. NOTI CES OF MOTION Speaker. it is not this government's intention, nor is it their Mrs. Watson: Yes. Mr. Speaker, I would give Notice of policy , to use the new assessment rates in Whitehorse as a Motion. seconded by the Honourable Member from Ogilvie, windfall bonanza to the Territorial Treasury in the form of that th e Government table its organizational chart. defining: increased property taxes for educational pu rposes. 1. the various departments and branches: Whitehorse ratepayers, presently, Mr. Speaker. contribute 2. the director or deputy head of each department and branch, none of the capital costs and about 20 per cent towards the and operation and maintenance costs of Whitehorse schools. How ever, th is government feels at this time it would not be accept 3. th e departmental responsibility of each member of the Ex able to raise the level of that contribution. ecu.i;;e Committee. In examining the effects of the Whitehorse assessment Mr. Speaker : Are there any further Notices or Motion 1or changes. we found that while the property tax revenue needs the Production of Papers? The Honourable Mt>mber from of the City of Whitehorse, as indicated in their provisional Ogilvie. budget, would produce a lower mill rate because of the higher Ms Millard : Mr. Speaker, Notice of Motion for the Produc assessment. Our fixed mill rate fo r school taxes. based on 16 tion of Papers: moved by myself, seconded by the Honourable mills, would produce a revenue increase of 55 per cent over Member from Kluane, that the Science Council of Canada 1977 revenue. Report Number 26 , ot August, 1977, "Northward Looking-A Strategy and a Science Policy for Northern Development'', be This is an amount that might subject thi s Government to tabled in the House. charges that we were stimulating inflation. Mr. Speaker: The Honourable Member from Kluane. Therefore, we gave immediate consideration to a revision ot the school tax levy system, using fixed mill rates. Mrs. Watson : Yes, Mr. Speaker, I would give Notice of Motion, seconded by the Honourable Member from Hootalin It was also evident, Mr. Speaker, from the prov isional qua, that the Government of Yukon table the selection process budgets submitted by Yukon municipalities. that they were and land selection criteria adopted by the Planning Council of facing the necessity of obtaining property tax increases to the Yukon Indian Claim, for the selection of Yukons land by enable them to continue providing existing levels of services the Yukon Indian Claim Beneficiaries. du ring this period of high cost and inflation. Mr. Speaker: Are there any further Notices of Motion for We are likewise facing sharply increasing costs for opera the Production of Papers? tion and maintenance of existing services and faci lities and a number of expanded or new services are being prov ided in Are there any Notices of Motion or Resolution? The Honour several communities. Our proposed solution to these prob able Member from Hootalinqua. lems involves reducing the school tax n'rill rate and introduc ing additional measures specifically designed to assist resi NOTICES OF MOTION dential taxpayers. u Mr. Fleming: Yes, Mr . Speaker, I give Notice of Motion We will be proposing, for the House approval, at the Budget this morning, seconded by the Honourable Member from Session, the following changes in mi ll rates and homeowner Kluane, that th e Yukon Outfitters brief, 1978, pertaining to thE grants: "Harvesting of Grizzly Bear, Dall Sheep, and Goat", be 1. 1978 tax mill rates are recommended to change as follows: moved into Committee of the Whole for discussion. _ school taxes - 10 mills, a drop of six mills on all property Page 732 taxable for tins purpo "~ ter ritorial g(•neral mill rate - 28 Mr. Speaker. the Territorial assessor will be holding open mills. Two changes combined will leave the Territorial tax house between March 15th and the 21st. at th e YWCA building 0 payers with the sanw mill rate combined as in 1977, no in in Whitehorse, to answer any questions concerning individual cren~e in tl11 mill rat(· thrott ghout the Yukon. assessment which property owners wish to ask of them. 2. The Homeotmers' Grant Ordinance be amended to provide It is ou r hope. Mr. Speaker. that these consul tations will help that the grant ~··<~ II be the lessor of the sum of $300 or one-half to reduce the number of assessment appeals to be dealt with of the tax• I · I in respect of the eligible resident, or, where by the Court of Revision. the taxes are le s~ than $200. the difference between the taxable Finally. Mr. Speaker. I feel that our assessors have done a taxes payable and $100. commendable job in bringing a hopelessly out-moded and Thts means. Mr. Speaker, an increase in the maximum out-dated assessment roll up to standard in the City of ( ·. from $250 to $300 in the Homeowners' Grants. Whitehorse. It is now our responsibility to make sure that a 3. There is r enhaPred payment to senior ci tizens, to those mill rate is struck to reflect that new assessment roll equita qualified applicants who provide e\ tdence of being in receipt bly and with a minimum of hardship to Yukon taxpayers. We of a benefi t under the O!d Age Security Act. The amount of the feel, Mr. Speaker. that the proposals outlined today will fu lfill grant shall be tlw lessor of that obligation. a l the sum of $300. or Mr. Speaker: Are there any further Statements by Mini s ters? b l 75 per cent of the taxes lc\ icd in respect of the eligible residents m the year of application. This then brings us to th e Question Period. Have you any questions? The Honourable Member from Klondike. The $100 tax minimum will not apply in such cases. This means homeo~ncrs 65 and o\'er wil bt eligible for grants up to 75 per cent. instead of 50 per cent of their taxes on their resi QUESTION PERIOD dences up to $300 with the minimum tax not taken into consid Question r e: Taxation eration no floor o J· ·' ~ nnt Mr Speaker. Mr. Berger: Yes, Mr. Speaker, referring to the speech of. We believe, Mr. Speaker, that the changes proposed are a the statement of the Minister of Local Government just made. responsible method of ensuring that the majority of I mean, he's referring to, often, to Yukon taxpayers. How \\'h tehor L :owners ,, 1.1 not be facing ma jor property tax much is this statement going to affect taxpayers in Dawson increases and tax revenues required for school purposes will City and Faro? I mean, they are outside the taxation structure be equitably distr ibuted. of the Territorial Government. The fo ll ow i n~:, resolution wi ll be proposed for your approval Mr. Speaker: The Honourable Minister of Highways and as required by the Taxation Ordinance: THAT the Commis Public Works. sioner of the Yukon Territory be authorized to levy the follow Hon. Mr. McKinnon: Mr. Speaker , we are the taxing au 0 ing mill rates in 1978 for real property taxati on purposes: thority in the municipalities for the eduction mill rate only. school taxes - 10 mills; general property taxes - 28 mills. The cities set their own general purpose property tax mill Amendments to the homeowners' grant will also be intro rate, throughout the Yukon Territory. There will be, in the 0 duced at the budget session to bring our proposed changes into educational mill rate, a drop from 16 mills to 10 mills, applying effect for the 1978 taxation year. in the municipality and throughout the Yukon. The taxing Mr. Speaker, these amendments will answer many of the authority for the general purpose mill rate still remain in the questions from the outlying members last year that the person municipal authority, the City of Dawson Council, the City of with the smaller home in the outlying residential areas, whose Faro Council and the City of Whitehorse Council. taxes were between $100 and $200 were not benefitting at all Mr. Speaker: The Honourable Member fr om Klondike. from the Homeowners' Grant Ordinance. We agreed with the statements that the Honourable Members made and where Mr. Berger: Supplementary, Mr. Speaker, then the Ter those taxes were between $100 and $200, anything over $100 , if ritorial Government, in other words, in the City of Dawson and the tax is $180 , $80 of that tax will be coming back to that the City of Faro, where no new assessment has been made, up homeowner rate payer through the amendments to the to date, the Territorial Government is going to take a loss in Homeowners· Grant Ordinance. the school taxation then. Mr. Speaker, there will always be exceptions to the general Mr. Speaker: The Honourable Minister of Highways and application of any tax measures, but the suggestions I ·am Public Works. making will benefit the great majority of Yukon taxpaying Hon. Mr. McKinnon: Mr. Speaker, for this year only. Both homeowners. Outside of the municipality, where the Territory the municipality of Faro and the Municipality of Dawson are is the sole taxing authority, every homeowner rate payer will slated for assessment next year and would be in exactly the ·be better off financially through an enhanced homeowner same position of rapidly escalating assessment when the as grant program and no increase in the mill rate than he was in sessment is completed. We felt that that is why this is such an 1977. opportune time, with the three municipalities all for assess Mr. Speaker, where the Terntorial Government is the tax ment at the same time, within a year, all facing the same ing authority for school purposes, and the municipality for problems within the same time period, a period of twelve general purposes, taking the enhanced homeowner grant into months, that it would be an opportune time to take into consid consideration, only in very exceptional circumstances will the eration those problems in the three muncipalities. For the homeowner rate payer in the municipality pay more to the purpose of this taxation year only, the cities of Faro and Daw Territorial taxing authority than he did in 1977. son, which, with their taxable assessment, does not make great changes to the Territorial Assessment Roll, will be in a 0 Indeed, Mr. Speaker, with the reduction in the school mill more beneficial position, because their assessment will not be rate, the enhanced homeowner grant programme and an ex until next year, when the City of Whitehorse, whose assess pected reduction in the municipal general purpose mill rate, ment is now completed. many residential property owners in the City of Whitehorse 0 will be in a better financial position in 1978 than they were in Mr. Speaker: The Honourable Member from Kluane? 1977. Mrs. Watson: Yes, Mr. Speaker, another supplementary question regarding the announcement: Am I correct, then. in Hon. Mr. McKinnon: Mr. Speaker this will be anotht·r interpreting the announcement that in the areas outside of the time and another place HowC\ er. it 1s the philosophy of tht:s mun icipalities. within the Yukon Territory, the school mill Government and it follows the philosophy generally through rate will be reduced by 6 mills. l'>ul the properly mill rate will out this country. that it is wrong for the senior government, it be increased by 6 mills'7 is an inequitable lax and 1 agree with this philosophy for the Mr. Speaker : Th e Honourable Minister of Highways and senior government to be using property taxes in the field of Public Works? financing education. Hon. Mr. McKinnon : Mr. Speaker. that is correct. Th e There is a strong lobby and a strong movement in all provin combined mi ll rate will remain exactly as the year previous. cial jurisdictions fo r the senior government to get out of the property taxing field and leave it to the municipal govern Mr. Speaker: Are there any further questions'? The Hon ments, the reason being that the municipal taxpayers can ourable Member from Whitehorse Riverdale? relate to the goods and services being provided to them. Mr. Lengerke: Yes, supplementary to that, I am just won through property taxes by the municipality It IS very dif :( dering if the Mi nister could tell me how the new assessment ficult for anybody m the Yukon to relate the costs and the announced or the results of the new assessment. coupled wi th operation and capital costs of schools with the educational the measures that he has announced, how that wil l affect school mill rate. which has not been <'I IIWPd in 1 :'1-P:lrS <\.nd 11 businesses as well as the small acreage owners within say the is infinitesimal the amount ol moni( , ,. hid -; r
which we are trying to take care of in this new program . there Member recognizes we have to get a legal position on it and it are no assessments planned for the smaller communities out will take some time. We must know in what ways the Hono\]r side of Whitehorse in th e next fiscal year. Mr. Speaker . 1 find it able Member is concerned. or wh ere he concerned. 0 remarkable that for three years th e tax mill rate ou tside of the Mr. Speaker: The Honourable Member from Hootalin municipalities has remained constant and with an enhanced qua? homeowner grant. all of those people under the sole prer oga Mr. Fleming: A question to the Minister of HuiT'an Re tive of the Territorial taxing authority are to be in a better sources in this regard. in regard to a question that I asked financial position than they were over the last three years. 1 before on December 15 that status Indian workers are emp don't think there is another jurisdiction in this country that loyees and are not required to pay health care premiums. That can claim that type of record in the face of rising costs and was a simple qu estion. inflation. 1 think that the Honourable Member should be commending, which I am sure she will when she sees the I got back an answer which I am not satisfied with. Mr. o·. picture, this government, for that attitude to territorial taxes. Speaker. Just a section out of our Ordinance and I would ask Mr. Speaker. the Minister at this time, because I think it was a very foolish Mr. Speaker: The Honourable Member from Kluane? answer to me. and was never researched. as to where she actually got that auth ority wh en she did not quote the Indian Mrs. Watson: Point of Order, Mr. Speaker, the Honoura Act. ble Member is talking about th e base rate. He forgets that local improvements, that the city includes in their overall mill Mr. Speaker: Th e Minister of Human Resou rces. rate- Hon. Mrs. Whyard: Mr. Speaker. the qu estion is not clear. Mr. Speaker: Order please. I would have to have it in writing, Mr. Speaker. ] don't under stand what the Honourable Member is getting at. Mrs. Watson: -are separate and above the mill rate that he is talking about. Mr. Speaker: The Honourable Member from Ogilvie. Mr. Speaker: Order please. The Honourable Member has Question re: Native Needs in Education no Point of Order and I think that we are getting into an Ms Millard: Mr. Speaker. a question for the Minister of argumentative position here. Perhaps we could continue with Education: some time ago we were promised an assessment some other questioning. The Honourable Member from of native needs in education, which would be tabled in this Whitehorse Riverdale? House. How far along has this gone and when can we expect Question re: Minister of lAND's Visit the r eport? Mr. Lengerke: Yes, Mr. Speaker, a question for any Mr. Speaker: The Honourable Minister of Education. member of the Executive Committee. I understand the Minis Hon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Speaker, we have been attempting to ter of Indian Affairs is visiting the City, I believe on March get a meeting togeth er with some of the people involved in th e 2nd . I understand further that he is to meet with Members of native organizations, and we have a meeting slated for the the Executive Committee, I don't know if I am correct on that first week in March, depending on what type. We are trying to 0 or not, but I am wondering wou ld they consider asking the get them involved so that we can get an accurate picture of Minister to meet with Members of the entire Assembly? I exactly what they're talking about. 0 think it would be an opportune time to discuss various matters After that meeting, then we will, hopefully , be able to bring a that are quite critical in the eyes of Members of this Assembly. report before the House, before the end of the Session. It and I am just wondering, could that consideration be gi ven. depends on the timing and the abili ty of the Department to would they undertake to do that, Mr. Speaker? come up with a position in this particular area . . Mr. Speaker: The Honourable Minister of Education? Mr. Speaker: The Honourable Member from Kluane. Hon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Speaker, it is my understanding that Question re: School Ordinance- Amending of the Minister is due here on Thursday. There are some rumours going around that he may not be coming. Now Mrs. Watson: Yes, Mr. Speaker, my question is for the Minister of Education. During my recent trip through my whether or not that is true, I don't know , maybe the Commis riding, approximately two weeks ago, Indians, some of the sioner could speak to that. But it is my understanding that he is Indian people expressed a desire to have their own school due here Thursday and that he will be meeting with the Execu system and non-Indian people also expressed di ssatisfaction tive Committee Thursday afternoon, and I am sure that if with our existing school system and were interested in a pri Members in this House want to take some time to meet with vate school structure. My question is: is it the intention of this the Minister, that we would see whether or not we couid get Government to amend the School Ordinance to define the role some time for all Members in the House to meet with him to of private schools in the Territory and to provide a per capita discuss the pressing matters that are before us today in grant structure for students attending a private school? Yukon. Mr. Speaker: The Honourable Minister of Education. With those remarks, Mr. Speaker, I will see what can be done and bring a reply back to this House whether or not a time Hon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Speaker, this comes as a surprise to frame can be slotted for all Members to meet with him. me. No one li'as approached me in this particular area and, at the present time, there are no amendments to the School Mr. Speaker: The Honourable Member from Hootalin Ordinance being contemplated. qua? Mr. Speaker: The Honourable Member from Kluane. Question re: Indian Act superseding Ordinances Question re: Haines Junction L.I.D. Land Disposal Freeze Mr. Fleming: Yes, Mr. Speaker, a question to Mr. Com missioner, this morning. I would ask if the Indian Act does, or Mrs. Watson: Yes, Mr. Speaker, I have another question does not, supersede our Ordinances in many ways? for the Minister of Local Government. He can take it as a 0 written question if he wishes. Mr. Speaker: Mr. Commissioner? Has the Planning Council of the Yukon Indian Claim ap Mr. Commissioner: Mr. Speaker, I don't know how tore proved the freezing of the disposal of land within the Haines spond to that, but to be more specific, as in what ways, I will 0 Junction L.I.D. until the claim beneficiaries have completed a certainly try to get the answers. As of course the Honourable land selection in that community?
l Page 735
Mr. Speaker: That is a written question') ing that it might be a matter of a few days until the documents had the proper signatures and had been passed back and fo rth Mrs. Watson: It could be taken as a written question. from Ottawa to th is government. Mr. Speaker: Well. order. pl.ease. Mr. Speaker: The Honourable Member from Ogilvie? Hon. Mr. McKinnon: No. Mr. Speaker. Question re: Yukon Teacher Education Program Mr. Speaker: The Chair could use some direction as to Ms Millard: Mr. Speaker, a question to the Minister of whether it is to be a written qu estion or not. so that we might Education on the Yukon Teacher Education Program: when deal with it in the House here. The Honourable Member from we passed this idea here. there was some hope that there Kluane. would be implementation of a policy so that native people with Mrs. Watson: Mr. Speaker. since he has answered it. less th an qualification to the University of BC would be allow maybe I can ask a supplementary'? able into the program, and the recent ad in the paper simply Mr. Speaker: Proceed. says applicants must have two or more years of accredited university course work or a Bachelor's Degree. How long do Mrs. Watson : Have the CYI requested that a freeze be we have to wait before the promise of being more flexible will placed on the disposal of all land in the Haine-; Junction, until come about and we can have people go into the program who they have completed a land selection fo r tha ~ community? have less than grade twelve? Hon. Mr. McKinnon: I don't know, Mr. Speaker, and wou ld Mr. Speaker: The Honourable Minister of Education? have to take that question as notice and see if there are any public statements from the CYI that have made th at point. Hon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Speaker, if the Honourable Member had been fo llowing the program, we have already brought that Mr. Speaker : Are there any further questi ons? The Hon- into effect in the concept of mature students entering into an ourab!e Member from Ho~talinqu a. accredited Teacher Training Program that is bei ng run by the QuestiOn re: Health ServiCes Take-over University of British Columbi a, has started in J anuary, and as Mr. Fleming: Yes, Mr. Speaker, a question regarding the • you know, anybody that has grade twelve and below would Health Services take over and the agreement that has, of have to apply to the University of British Columbia and it goes course. not been signed yet. It was a draft given to us the other through a senate committee there to be eligible, and to enter it day. through the program, it is a case of testing. Subsequently, Mr. It says, ''prior to the date ofthe takeover th at the Yukon will Speaker, the answer to the question the Honourable Member be responsible for properties" and such, and also it states, as has raised, the program is already in effect. far as I can understand that those properties may not be taken Mr. Speaker: The Honourable Member from Ogilvie? over at th e time that the agreement is signed and will possibly, Ms Millard: Supplementary to that, Mr. Speaker. Then therefore, be-. I am just wondering what that implies and could the Honourable Minister bring to us the statistics on how how long it will apply? many of those students have less than grade twelve qualifica Mr. Speaker: The Honourable Minister of Human Re tion and how many of th ose are native? sources? Mr. Speaker: The Honourable Minister of Education? Hon. Mrs. Whyard: Mr. Speaker, I don't have the draft Hon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Speaker, there is no problem bringing agreement before me, but it is the understanding of this gov statistics forth. I don't know why she wants to divide it by ernment that on the effective date of the turnover of respo.1si white and Indian, but I guess I could do that for the Honourable bility of Health Care in the Yukon from the Federal Govern Member as long as the participants are agreeable. ment to this Government, th e properties and equipment and inventories come with that turnover . In fact, that is one of the Mr. Speaker: The Honourable Member from Kluane. reasons why it involved a great deal of preparatory work on Question re: CYI Plannirlg Council/Minister of lAND the part of Treasury and Health Branches in this government, Mrs. Watson: Mr. Speaker, one more question for the doing an inventory and a financial assessment of the.values of Minister of Local Government, regarding the lines of action all these buildings and equipment, property, taxes, insurance between the Minister of Indian Affairs and the Planning Coun and the whole business. It is all part and parcel of the agree cil. And my question is: does the Minister of Indian Affairs ment that this becomes the property of the Yukon Territorial action recommendations of the Planning Council or does he Government. action recommendations of one component of a planning This was a recommendation presented to the Federal Minis council, the CYI? ter in the report prepared by his co-ordinator and th e trans Mr. Speaker: The Honourable Minister of Highways and ferer, Mr. Fleming. Public Works. Mr. Speaker: The Honourable Member from Hootalin Hon. Mr. McKinnon: As far as I know, he actions there qua? commendations of his bosses, the Prime Minister and the Mr. Fleming: Supplementary then, Mr. Speaker, I was Cabinent of Canada, Mr. Speaker. wondering in Section 13, " in the event of loss or damage by fire Mr. Speaker: The Honourable Member from Whitehorse or other cause to the property, real or personal, comprised or Riverdale. contained in various facilities after the effective date, and prior to the date of transfer of titles" . The effective date I Question re: Pipeline Path Chart would take would be the implementation of this document Mr. Lengerke: Mr. Speaker, a question fo r the Minister of here, and prior to the date of transfer of titles, which I under P ipelines, a number of weeks ago it was announce that the stand might be later. I am wondering how long in between do Minister of Local Government and, I believe, the Director of we not really own the properties? That is the question, Mr. the Economic Research and Planning Unit were expected to Speaker. come up with some kind of a, I think the phrase was used, a Mr. Speaker: The Honourable Minister of Human Re time chart. In my estimation, it would be something like a sources? critical path chart, with respect to the pipeline project. Hon. Mrs. Wbyard: Well, Mr. Speaker, I wouldn't venture I'm wondering, has that chart been prepared and are you to give a legal opinion on this, but it would be my understand- . now actively monitoring the situation with respect to the·
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pipeline pr oject and can you tell us. at a glance. what the Yukoners, based on that percentage of population in the situation is? Yukon, being of native origin. Mr. Speaker: The Honourable Minister of Highways and Mr. Speaker: The Honourable Member from Hootalin Public Wor)
l Page 737
Mr. Fleming: I second th at. weeks. there should be no problem. with respect to ~etting up the necessary administration for running our own elections. Mr. Speaker: It has been mo ved by th e Honou rabl e under th e Elections Act, whi ch you have before you today. a5 Member from Pelly Ri ver. seconded by the Honourable far as th e timing is concerned. Member from Hootalinqua. that Mr. Speaker do now leave the Chair and tha\ the House resoiYe into Committee of th e Wh ole. And you will note. as we go through the amendments, we have put a clause in there. a six month clause. with the respon Motion agreed to siblity with the board. on the provisal that if th e administra Speaker lea ves tile Chair tion can be put into place prior to the six month allotment. they can just go and present it in the newspapers and. subse COMMITIEE OF THE WHOLE quently. bring that time frame back. And I'll explain that once we get into those amendments. Mr. Chairman: Committee of the Whole wi ll come to order. Mrs. Watson: Mr. Chairman. one more question for any one from the government. None of thi s mechanism can roll After a brief recess. we will cons ider the Elect ions and begin to operate unless th is Council. I guess I had better Ordinance. I now declare a brief recess. say. Council has been prorogued. isn't that the word . has sat Recess fo r th e l ,. Pnge 7:!1f Mr. Chairman: Any other di scussion'? Yes . Mrs. Wat son'? So. I think it differentiates th e two and therefore it will make a reference for us to go back on th at. in defining both areas of Mrs. Watson: Has th e Bill been rev iewed so that any other concern. Ordinance will completely cover the requi rements th at are defined for the Legislative Assembly Ordinance. because that Mr. Chairman: Yes. Mrs. Watson. is pretty significant. th at amendment there? Mrs. Watson: Well . then. Mr. Chairman. I would submit. should you not change th e definition for "elector" . It means Hon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Chairman. it's my understanding. I "any person qualifi ed to vote in an election under th e provi should point out that we had the option of bringing up the sions of th is Ordinance". Shou ld you not be saying any person expertise that has worked on this Bil l. from Alberta. Mr. Clegg qualified to vote at a general election and-or a by-election. and Mr. Macdonald. and it was our feeling that the amend under this Ordinance? ments that you have before you co uld be di scussed in the Hon. Mr. Lang: Well. Mr. Chai rman. House without the expertise necessary. because it wou ld just 0 ·· be that much more cost to bring an indi vidual up for two or Mr. Chairman: Yes. Mr. Lang. three days . as a wi tn ess. Hon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Chairman. it is my understanding And possi bl y. I could refer the qu estion to Mr. Cos man. but it that th e qualifications for an electorate wou ld remain the is my understa nding that it ·s been thoroughly rev iewed by two same for a by-election as well as a general election. so there or thret• people to in sure that the necessary deletions are fore you don't have to. I would not think. have to di vi de the two made in 1hL• Bi II to make it come into effect. Is that not correct. as far as the defi nition of an electorate is concerned. Is that not Mr Cosman·: correct, Mr. Cosman? :\Jr. Chairman: Mr. Cosman. Mr. Chairman: Mr. Cosman'? l\lr. Cosman: Mr. Chairman. yes. I have rev iewed the Bill Mr. Cosman: Yes. Mr. Chairman. the word "election" has pl'rsorwlly. twice. to insure that thi s wording will be correct. a commonly understood meaning . and it is not defin ed in this In lad. I'm the person who prepared this particular amend Ordinance. however. by-election is a special type of election ment. not Mr. Clegg. Mr. Clegg has a copy of it und I'm su re he and it is defi ned and wh ere the term "general election" is t w~ purused it as well. used. in th e Ordinance. it was thought th at that term should be It the Committee would like to have specific references. I defined to differentiate it from by-election, however. the word ., uld return to my offi ce for a short moment. if I could be "election " itself wi ll appear through the definitions and t \t'll !:i ed. L .. Page739 or undertaken by the Board or the Administrator under this Mr. Fleming: Yes. I understand the llonourable Minister. Ordinance. but what I would like to see is that the Ordinance applies to the election of the Members of the Yukon Legislative Assembly. Yes, Mr. Lang. Now they are proposmg to just delete that. That will have to be Hon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Chairman. this was is in answer to deleted. The last part of this amendment: Electoral D1strict some of the questions th a t were posed by Members for this Boundaries Ordina11ce. I can understand that. but what do particular section. I think it's been taken care of. It clearly they put in under ··Yukon Legislative Assembly". just the outlines that the responsibility for employment belongs to the word "Assembly". or "Legislative Assembly'"? Just how is Board and not to the Commissioner and. therefore. I feel that the whole section worded? it has met the questions that were raised by Members during Hon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Chairman. when referring back to the the initial discussion on the particular section. ,· first amendment that has already been passed by the House Mr. Chairman: Yes. Mrs. Watson. here. I think it is clearly laid out in the amendment. where it Mrs. Watson: Mr. Chairman. the administrator then will refers to Legislative Assembly it is Territorial Council. As be a member of the Public Service of the Yukon Territory·) Is sembly is referred to as Council. and going through that that correct? amendment. Therefore. we are reverting back to the name as Hon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Chairma n. under the Yukon Act because the Yukon Legislative Assembly Ordinance has not gone through here and the various provi Mr. Chairman: Yes. ~r. Lang. sions that were in that particular piece of legislation which Hon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Chairma n. ~,,t : ha1 ,. tn rl'IN to Sec would pertain to the Elections Ordinance. if it were to pass this tion 51 I I. "and the Board sh: lll t • m1:lo ~ ·1p• 111 1 :1- <~d lllll11 s Hou se. Subsequently. we are going with the legislation that trator ol elect wn'. a' and 11 hl'n n·qu 1r~·rl h~ ... 1:": 11 d In :1-- ~~ 1 has passed here. the Electoral District Boundaries Commis· in the aclm1n1 st r;1t Hill ol elt'l'\ 11111, .. sion Ordinance a nd we have to refer back to it. It is m:-· understamhng tlwt the Boa rd ,. , ' • · · · 11,! Mr. Chairman: Yes. Mr. F leming. victua ls The\' 11111 be direc1ed ll\ tht Bo· r 1: 1 1 ' 'I · Gov e rnm ent ~ but tlll'\' I\ ill hell c t'o toltm1 • , ' 1, - .1 Mr. Fleming: Mr. Chairman. I wi ll take it that it would throughlh t> P ub/IC.'i(;rt.lce<'omiii/Sslnn(JJ ,' r , • 111 .... read " Thi s Ordinance applies to the electors of members of correct. Mr. Cosman '! the Yukon", I would presume that would be left in. ··Territor ial Council to represent the electoral district established by Mr. Cosman: Yes. m:- JJtlerpn•tatltlll '" . ! t,l. what you are saying. Electoral District Boundaries Ordinance. Would I be correct in reading it that way. Mr. Chairman: Yes. Mrs . Wa tson '! Mr. Chairman: Yes, Mr. Fleming. Mrs. Watson: Mr. Chairman. all sectiOJb ol tlH· l'ul,t•, Mr. Fleming: That's the way it will be. okay. Service Commission Ordinance or are you pl<.lnning llll dt'!et ing the sections where you say that the Commissioner has the Mr. Chairman: Any further discussion? authority of all Public Servants under the Public Service Amendment agreed to Commission Ordinance? Clause 3 agreed to Mr. Chairman: Mr. Lang? Mr. Chairman: The next amendment is 6, at page 3. Hon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Chairman, as I said earlier. it is my Yes, Mr. Berger. understanding that the Board will give these people direction and they will not be coming under the auspices of the Commis Mr. Berger: Just a question, Mr. Chairman. did we carry sioner. As far as direction is concerned, they will have to Clause 4 and 5? follow the general rules outlined in the Public Service Com Mr. Chairman: They were carried at our previous sitting. mission Ordinance.If that is necessary, then I would imagine Clause 4 was carried, but Clause 5 wasn't. It was stood over. so that step would be taken in that particular section. we'll have to consider Clause 5, at this time. Mr. Chairman: Mr. McCall? Are you ready for the question? Mr. McCall: Thank you, Mr. Chairman. According to the Mrs. Watson: On Clause 6? interpretation section here on the " elections officer" the Ad Mr. Chairman: Clause 5. ministrator is an officer and therefore he would come under the Public Service Commission Ordinance. Clause 5 agreed to Hon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Chairman, I am just giving you the Mr. Chairman: Clause 6(1). Moved by K. McKinnon, sec general idea that I have from this particular section. Possibly onded by F. Whyard, that Bill Number 3, entitled An Ordi· Mr. Cosman can elaborate a little further? nance to Amend the Municipal Ordinance, be amended as follows:. Mr. Chairman: Mr. Cosman? Hon. Mr. Lang: There seems to be a typing error. It should Mr. Cosman: Mr. Chairman, I don't understand the ques be Mr. Lang. tion the Honourable Member from Pelly has given, could you repeat it again please? Hon. Mrs. Whyard: No, it's the wrong Bill. Mr. McCall: Mr. Chairman, it wasn't a question, it was a Hon. Mr. McKinnon: It's the Elections Ordinance, not the statement of fact. Under the interpretation section of this Municipal Ordinance. Ordinance, "election officer" means the Administrator, the Mr. Chairman: Moved by D. Lang, seconded by F . returning officer, assistant returning officer, deputy return Whyard, that Bill Number 3, entitled An Ordinance to Amend ing officer, enumerator, revising officer, poll clerk, interpre the Elections Ordinance, Bill Number 10, deleting subsaection ter or constable;", that is under the interpretation. That l 6(1) at page 3 and substituting therefor the following: means that under Section 6.(1) the Administrator will come 6(1 ) The Commissioner shall, in accordance with the Public under the Public Service Commission Ordinance, that is the Service Commission Ordinance, authorize the employment of way I read it. It expresses itself in 5.(1), Mr. Chairma n. l such officer and employees as the Board deems necessary for Mr. Cosman: If I may answer, Mr. Chairman, the overall the carrying out of the duties and responsibilities assigned to intent of the Bill, pursuant to Section 5. ( 1) is that the Adminis-. - 'i l 'age740 trator would be an employee of the Board and would not come says .. The Administrator of the Elections .. is hin.:u l>y tire under the Public Service Commission Ordinance. The inter Board. pretationn of the word· ·officers·· and· ·employees .. as used in Why. now. when you say .. officers .. under 6. t 11. you· re ta Ik - Section 6. ( 1 l is not influenced. I would suggest. by the defini ing about returning officers. is that who you're talking about( ) tion of .. electi on officer ·· because tha t is not the term tha t is returning officers. enumerators. the whole bit. does their hir- defined. The word ··officers·· is not defined and coupled with ing have to go through th r Public Service Commission·: Docs the Section 5. t 1), I would say that it is the clear intent of the their hiring have to be Mr. Chairman: Mr. Berger? puty returning offiecr is appointed fo r each polling stat1on . ri ght '? A deputy returning officer and not the interpreta ti on. I Mr. Berger: Mr. Chairman. 1 find the proposed amended don't think. th at Mr. Chai rman was putting to it. section a little confu sing. because in 9.131 you have alrrady determined that the Board has the right to dismiss an assis The returning officer appoints them. Does it say in here th at tant returning officer. Why does it have to be in there again in the returning offi cer can suspend or rcmo\·c them from thai 10. (4)? I think the last two lines. "and by the Board in the case position'? of an assistant returning officer·· completely unnecessary. Mr. Chairman: Yes. Mr. Lang. Hon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Chairman. I think thi s further Hon. Mr. Lang: The Honourable Member shou ld re<:~d clarifies the section as it relates back to Section 9. and it goes further in Section 6 of Section 41. it states "A returning officer up to Section 10. I 1) and shall reside. and in 1b l ''shall, during may. at any time. relieve any deputy returning officer ap his appointment, refrain from any active or public support or pointed by him of his duties and appoint another person to criticism of any candidate or any political party endorsing a perform those duties ... candidate." I think it clarifies more the authority of the Board Mrs. Watson: Well. there is provision made fo r it. as well as clarifying that to terminate a returning officer. the Commissioner must have the advice of the Board. Hon. Mr. Lang: Well. there is prov ision. Mr. Chairman: Yes. Mr. Berger? Hon. Mrs. Whyard: Mr. Chairman. we' re not ... Mr. Berger: Mr. Chairman, under Section 9 we are strictly Clause 10 agreed to talking about th e assisting returning officers. and why mix up Mr. Chairman: Section 15 on page 7. Section 15 t 21 was to up the returning officer under Section 10.14 l with the assistant be reviewed to determine whether the date of the return of the returning officers. I mean this is what the confusion is all writ should be more definite. about. The returning officer is a different person altogether. Hon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Chairman. it's my understanding that ., He is going to be di smi ssed by the adv1ce of the Board to the this section is adequate and it leaves th e flexibility for the Commissioner. In the other case. it is the Boa rd that dismisses timing of the election. because we have X amount of certain the assistant returning officer. days that <1 writ is issued until the electi on. So. it leaves the Mr. Chairman: Yes. :V1r. Lang'? flexibility in the legislation to determine a date. I don't think Hon. Mr. Lang : Mr. Chairman. I think it is fwrl\' dear that you would want to specify a day in the legislation. because then you're bound by that as far as calling an election is the reason we are amending Section 10 .1 4 1. a ~ p'eople ha\·e gone through the Bill since it was in thl House anct thev noticed concerned. an error. because th e returning officPr is appointe'd by the Possibly Mr. Cosman can add something on that. Comm1->sioner. so therefore he has to be term1nated by the Mr. Chairman: Mr. Cosman. Comm isS ioner and 1l has to be written 111 accordmgly. It states "by the Commissioner on the advice of th e Board". which I Mr. Cosman: Yes, Mr. Chairman, I would refer you as well to Section 30. dealing with the writs for a general election. th111 k answers the Honou rable Memb er from Klondike's con It specifies a minimum time. for which the polling day may be cern~ that if there is a termination. it is on the advice of the named. after the issue of the writ. So tl:lere is some control Board through the Commissioner. over the apparently arbitrary date th e Commissioner would Mr. Chairman: Mr . McCall'? chose. Mr. McCall: With all due respect. Mr. Chairman. I am a Mr. Chairman: Thank you . little confused and I think the average person on the street Mr. Chairman: Yes, Mr. Lengerke? would be. What seems to be quite a justified amendment, is adding confusion because when we relate to the section where Mr. Lengerke: I know then· was some discussion with the amendment is made reference to, and you look at th e respect to 15. ( 4 l: "A writ of election shall be transmitted by interpretation. what we are actually doing is isolating the the Board to the person·· and one of the questions was how that ~eputy ~ eturning officer. because when we look through Sec writ would be transmitted, because this had some tie in as to tiOn 10, 1t makes reference to any or every returning officer. the time frame. I don't know if that was answered or not, I and then when you bring forward th e amendment with just a believe it is answered further on. reference to the returning officer and assistant returning Mr. Chairman: Any furth er discussion? officer,we may never have an assistant returning officer. Clause 15 agreed to where I am sure we are going to hove a deputy returning officer. There is a substantial element of confusion in the Mr. Chairman: We will recess now until1:30. language there. I have some reservations with it, although I Recess don't object to the amendment, I am just objecting to the Mr. Chairman: Would Committee please come to order. reference in th e amendment, because we make reference to the assistant soul, what about the deputy returning officer? He The amendment we're considering is in section 22, page 14. is out in limbo the way the language is reading. Moved by D. Lang, seconded by F . Whyard, that Bill Mr. Chairman: Mr. McCall, I believe that a deputy return Number 10, entitled Elections Ordinance, 1977, be amended as ing officer is a person who can take the place of the returning follows: In section 22, officer in his absence, but an assistant returning officer can a) by addi!lg the words", unless otherwise authorized by the not. So they are two different people. Board pursuant to subsection (1.1) ," immediately after the Yes, Mr. Cosman. words "every returning officer shall" where they occur in subsection (1) at line 26 of page 14; Mr. Cosman: I would refer Committee to Section 41 of the Bill, and it clearly delineates deputy returning officers and (b) by deleting the words "one or" where they occur in subsec· their powers and duties. tion (1) at line 27 of page 14, ) Mr. Chairman: Yes, Mrs. Watson. (c) by adding immediately after subsection (1) at page 14 the following subsection: Mrs. Watson: Mr. Chairman, by the same token , under Section 41 , I haven't had an opportunity, is the deputy return ( 1.1) The Board may authorize the returning officer of any ) ing officer appointed by the returning officer. You see, a de- electoral di strict to appoint only one person in any polling division to enumerate the electors therein. L Page 743 he is. It doesn't normally have to be a hou se. I think it can still tdl by dt•l!'ttng ~u bse<'llllll 18 1 at page 16 and substitutin!! be a voter and be a resident in a hotel. in a tent or wherever he thrrrlor tlw tol lm1·ing subsection : might be. I'm wondering why they don't use .. residence .. in till En•ry l'llUmPr .... • •• • ) tl ·~ Page 745 Mr. Chairman: Yes, Mr. Lang? who had been struck from the list for whatever reasons. I think that that amendment before you today has answered that Hon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Chairman. we have still got a couple question, as well. of days until prorogation. I woula be prepared to set this aside Mr. Chairman: Any discussion? Yes, Mrs. Watson. and we could get some information this afternoon and maybe bring it in tomorrow. Mrs. Watson: In the light of the amendment that was made last time, I'm really getting a little confused on polling Mr. Chairman: You mean stand the amendment to Sec tion 22 over. division, electoral district and so on. Is polling division cor rect, in 4, on page 20, in section 24(4)? Is the terminology Hon. Mr. Lang: Just a minute. Mr. Chairman, prior to "polling division" correct? setting the whole Section over. I would like to know if there is any other areas in this particular Section that people want to Mr. Cosman: Mr. Chairman, yes, polling division in sub section (4 ), 24, is clearly correct in my mind. The reason for look at. If you will note, there are several amendments to Section 22, which I think are fairly straight forward, I don't the amendment to 24(1 ) was that the terminology "electoral think there should be any problems with them, but if there is I division" and "polling division" had been intertwined and a would like to hear them now. matter of, wherever we see "polling division", we should not be using "polling district", we should be using " polling divi Mrs. Watson: Mr. Chairman, other than using the word sion", we should be using "electoral district". " residence" and you are going to look at this "residence" and Now, in subsection 4, the word is " polling division" and I'm "house-to-house" whether there is any need for anything sure that that is what the original draftsman intended, be further drrification on that. Otherwise I have no problems. cause he's been very thorough in going through the Bill, for Mr. Chairman: There are a couple of amendments to Sec these kind of errors. tion 24. One that was submitted in December and the one Mrs. Watson: Mr. Chairman today. I will read both of them. Mr. Chairman: Yes. Moved by D. Lang, seconded by F. Whyard, that Bill Number 10, er.titled Elections Ordinance, 1977 be amended as Mrs. Watson: -the right to strike a name from a polling follows: In subclause 24.(1 ) at page 20 by striking out " elec division is not up to the deputy returning officer who is in toral division" and substituting " electoral district" and by charge of that polling division, but it is up to the returning striking out " polling division" and substituting "electoral dis officer of the whole electoral district to strike a name from a trict". list. The other amendment is moved by D. Lang, seconded by F. That is very important. Whyard, that Bill Number 10, entitled Elections Hon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Chairman, either the revising officer, Ordinance,1977 ee amended as follows: In Section 24 or the returning officer who has the right to do that. At the (a) by adding immediately after subsection ( 1) at page 20 the same time, in answer, I believe it was to a question from the following subsection: ( 1.1 ) Every revising officer shall be Member from Kluane, that if a name is struck from the list, appointed in the prescribed manner and upon his appointment that individual is notified. That is the amendment that is shall take an oath in the prescribed form. brought in. (b) by adding immediately after subsection (4) at page 20 the Mrs. Watson: Mr. Chairman, but it must be on the author following subsection: (4. 1) Where the name of a person is ity of the returning officer of the whole electoral district or hi s removed from a list pursuant to subsection ( 4), the revising residing officer. I cannot be on the authority of the deputy officer or returning officer who removed it shall forthwith returning officer who is in charge of that specific polling divi give that person notice thereof, either in person or by sending sion within the electoral district. That is what I want to get written notice by registered mail to the address shown on the clear. list and to any other address at which the officer believes the Mr. Chairman: Any further discussion? person may be found. Amendments agreed to Hon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Chairman? Clause 24 agreed to Mr. Chairman: Yes, Mr. Lang. Mr. Chairman: Moved by D. Lang, seconded by F. Hon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Chairman, the first amendment that Whyard, that Bill Number 10, entitled Elections Ordinance, was put forth, during the last Session, and there was some 1977 be amended as follows: In subclause 25. ( 4) at page 21 by discussion in this particular area and I did get clarification adding at the end " and the decision of the returning officer is from Mr. MacDonald and Mr. Clegg, in this particular area final". and they have informed us that there is no compulsion for a revising officer to be posted at each polling division in order to Hon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Chairman, there was some discussion allow the returning officer of the electoral district the discre in the Chambers when we were considering this amendment tion to make such appointments as he deems necessary and that there should be some sort of a line of appeal to the return reasonable. ing officer. I have, since that time, discussed this area with Mr. MacDonald and Mr. Clegg, they feel that the returning So, therefore, the argument at that time, I think, is ans officer should be allowed to make the decisions. They do not wered, and the intention of that particular clause is not to deny feel that there should be any appeal because it demeans the a revising officer in the polling divisions the right to go and do returning officer's position of authority with respect to the their duties where it is necessary in that particular area. conduct of the election in that area or that district. They feel While I am on my feet, Mr. Chairman, since last Session, very strongly that the returning officer who is appointed we've reviewed the Bill once more and, in section 24, this should have the final decision. particular section (a), (1.1), was omitted and it's necessary to Mr. Chairman: Any further discussion? have it in the Legislation that every revising officer take the oath and be appointed in a proper manner. That's just clarify Amendment agreed to c ing that situation that had been omitted in the drafting. Clause 25 agreed to The second section was at the request of the House, to look at Mr. Chairman: The next amendment is subparagraph l the possibilities of notification of an individual or an elector 27.(1)(c.l) at page 23. Moved by D. Lang, seconded by F. 0. l'agt• i ·lfi Whyard, that Bill Number 10, entitled Elections Ordinance, Mr. Chairman: Yes. Mr. Lang. 1977 be amended as follows : In subparagraph 27.(1)(c.l) at Hon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Chairman. this was agreed to with 0 page 23, by deleting the words " appointed by him" and sub Mr. Hamel. the Chief Electoral Officer. to change the 42 to 45 stituting therefor the words " appointed by the Board''. days and. as I said earlier. we're attempting to comply when• 0 Mr. Lang? Mr. Hamel feels that there should be times lengthened in this. kind of a thing. in order to get his blessing for the Legislation. Hon. Mr. Loang: Mr. Chairman, the reason for the amend ment is simply to ensure that it's clarified that it is the Board After we hold the next election. I think that the people of the that makes the appointment. Where it says "appointed by day can decide whether or not the time was too long and;tho him", this clarifies appointed by the Board. legislation could be amended. I just would like to refer a question to Mr. Cosman. I see in Mr. Chairman: Any discussion? the numbering we have 27.(1)(c.ll? Amendment agreed to Mr. Cosman: Yes, Mr. Chairman. if I may. Clause 30 agreed to Mr. Chairman: Yes, (c.1) was a previous amendment. Mr. Chairman: Moved by D. Lang. seconded by F. · Mr. Cosman: That's correct. Whyard. that Bill Number 10, entitled Elections Ordina?ll'f, Mr. CjJairman: The prevjous amendment that was car 1977 be amended as follows: In subsection 41.( 14 l at page 35. ried before Christmas wac; the names of any assistant return by adding immediately after the words "shall appoint .. at Ji~e ing officers appointed by him and the clarification is that 11 thereof the words", by writing in the prescribed form," they're changing "him" to "appointed by the Board". Yes, Mr. Lang? . Mrs. Watson: Mr. Chairman, I think there's also a typog Hon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Chairman, this is just further clarifi• raphical error i11 (C) "the number and fully described bound cation for this section. The reason for including this qualifi~r aries of polling divisions of the electoral division" . It should be in the section is to ensure that an interpreter who may be ·•district''. queried to his eligibility as an interpreter to ensure that his Mr. CtJairman: Where is that? appointment will have to be made in writing. so therefore there can be no possibility of any argument or discussion of Mrs. Watson: Section 27.(1)(c), "electoral district" . whether or not the individual is capable. The appointment is Mr. Chairman: "District", that's been corrected. formally made and it would be done in the prescribed form. Mrs. Watson: Has it been corrected? Mr. Chairman: Any discussion? Mr. Chairman: Yes. Amendment agreed to Any further discussion on the amendment? Clause 41 agreed to •• Amendment agreed to Mr. Chairman: We will go on to Clause 43 which had not Clause 27 agreed t'o been camed previously, at the bottom of page 35 an~ continu ing on page 36. It has been amended, but the clause, as Mr. Chairman: Clause 29(1) on page 24. amended. has been carried. Moved by D. Lang, seconded by F. Whyard. that Bill Yes, Mr. Fleming? Nu mber 10, entitled Elections Ordinance, 1977, be amended as follows: In subsection 29(1) Mr. Fleming: I think there was some discussion as to whose name should be marked first and as to how they should Mr. Lang? Number 10 , entitled Elections Ordinance, 1977 , be amended as follows: by adding immediately after section 100 at page 86. Hon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Chairman, the reasons for these the following new section : amendments is that the returning officer must make official announcements within ten days after the official count and, 100.1(1) No amendments to this Ordinance or to the Electoral therefore, an application for recount made to a judge, after District Boundaries Ordinance applies in any election for the official count, must be limited to six days to provide time which the writ is issued within six months from the coming for the judge to notify the returning officer, because it's got to into force of that amendment unless, before the issue of the be done within that ten day frame. So, it's clarifying that area. writ, th e Board has published in the " Yukon Gazette", a notice to the effect that the necessary preparations for the bringing In (b), a judge cannot do anything until he receives the into operation of the amendment have been made. application, so, therefore, it's upon receipt of the application ()'. by the judge. It's clarifying with the proceeding section. Mr. Lang. In (c), the reason for that amendment is the, this is a ques· Hon. Mr. Lang : Mr . Chairman, earlier in debate, I refer tion, if my memory serves me correctly, it came up in the red to the fact that Mr. Hamel had had the opportunity of going House and the judge, this is going to ensure that the judge through the legislation again and he felt that it was important keeps a returning officer informed of what is taking place, that this section be put in so that the Board has some di scretion otherwise there could be some problems if there is no com if the electoral district boundaries are changed and they can munication. not get their administrative machinery in operation. Mr. Chairman: Any further discussion? Subsequently, we have accepted this. I should point out that it is not mandatory that it be a six month waiting period. It's up Amendment agreed to to the Board to assess their administrative capabilities and Clause 64 agreed to then decide when, how much time they actually need and they will publish it in the "Yukon Gazette" to let the public know Mr. Chairman: Clause 71 on page 76 was amended, and the what their situation is as far as getting their administrative amendment passed, but the Clause as ame11ded was not car machinery in order. ried. The amendment was in Clause 76 at page 78 delete the words " when a document referred to in subsection 71. (aa) as Mr. Chairman: Yes, Mrs. Watson. posted up'' and substitute " where an election officer posted up Mrs. Watson: This section bothers me a little bit, because or causes to be posted up a document referred to in Section 75 the amendment doesn't apply " for which the writ is issued in line 3" . No, I am wrong. I went too far over. I have been within six months from the coming into force of the amend informed that 71 was carried and it is 75 we should be looking ment, unless, before the issue of the writ, the Board has pub at. lished in the 'Yukon Gazette' ... " Does the Board have the Hon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Chairman, I think Section 75 refers to authority, under that section, to refuse to publish it in the the telephone poles and if I recall correctly, that we are going " Yukon Gazette", the details of the amendment? 0 to get some clarification of the proclamation of posters on Mr. Chairman: Yes, Mr. Lang. telephone poles. I have been informed that the telephone poles Hon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Chairman, Mr. Cosman can correct belong to a utility company and therefore are private property u me if I'm wrong, but it's my understanding that they would, if and the company could take civil action, if necessary, if they there was an amendment to the Ordinance, after this legisla felt that they were defacing their property. From our view tion comes in, which is very unlikely would happen, is that point, we should just leave the Legislation the way it is written they would have to publish that, would they not, Mr. Cosman? at the present time. Mr. Cosman: If I may, Mr. Chairman, any amendment Mr. Chairman: Any discussion? made to this Ordinance, which the Assembly is considering Clause 75 agreed to today, would not apply for a six month period after the Mr. Chairman: Clause 76 on page 78 wasn't carried. Any amendment came into force, which means the amendment discussions? would be public knowledge, because it would be passed through this House again, unless either six months expires Clause 76 agreed to from the time of the coming into force of the amendment, or, Mr. Chairman: There was an amendment to this carried, at some prior time, the Board has published in the "Yukon where " Board constituted" was substituted for "Commis Gazette", a notice to the effect that all necessary preparations sioner", and what we are interested in now is passing the for the bringing into operation of the amendment have been Clause as amended. The amendment carried. . made. Clause 79 agreed to Mrs. Watson: Mr. Chairman, the Board would have the Mr. Chairman: Mr. Lang? opportunity of not publishing them, if they didn't want to use the amendment and the issue of the writs would be before the Hon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Chairman, if I recall correctly, this six months expired, so the Board would then have the oppor Section was left over or held over because there was some tunity of making the decision of whether in fact they wanted to concern expressed here about the implications of the use the amendments or not. You are giving them the opportun Summary Convictions Ordinance on this Section. The legal ity to play around. draftsman has reviewed this area and has reported back to tell us that it presents no problem. The fines imposed are quite Mr. Cosman: That is correct, Mr. Chairman. That is pre within the capacity of the Summary Convictions Ordinance, is cisely the intention of the legislation. If they can't get their that not correct, Mr. Cosman? machinery into operation, then they can, in effect, waive those amendments because they haven't had enough time to get the Mr. Cosman: Yes. machinery geared up. 0 Mr. Chairman: Any discussion on clause 80? Mr. Chairman: Yes, Mr. Lang? Clause 80 agreed to Hon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Chairman, I should point out that this 0 Mr. Chairman: The next amendment 100.1(1) at page 86. particular amendment gave us a Jot of problems as well, but it. Moved by D. Lang, seconded by F . Whyard, that Bill is also one that is in the Canada Elections Act at the present time. It is to the discretion of the Chief Electoral Officer and it: L Page749 is written almost verbatim except for the deletion of Chief merely added " unless the context otherwise requires" to the Electora l Officer with the word Board put into this Section. I clause, at the end of the clause. can't see anyway how it is going to interfere with our election Any discussion? coming up. Once this legislation comes into effect. I would Clause 102 agreed to imagine there would be no amendments. subsequently would not apply. Is that not correct. Mr. Cosman? Mr. Chairman: Clause 104. This is another one that was amended. In Clause 104 at page 87, by deleting the clause and Mr. Cosman: That is correct. There undoubtedly will be no substituting Sections 1 to 3 and Sections 5 to 14 of the Elections I amendment to this before the next election. am sure. Ordinance are repealed. Mrs. Watson: Mr. Chairman, I am not thinking about now , Any discussion? I am thinking about future elections. What if the government or this House amended the Elections Ordinance to provide for Clause 104 agreed to a different make-up of the Board and the Board thought that Mr. Chairman: Clause 105. they should stay in office, and if before the six months were up, Clause 105 agreed to they called an election, they wouldn't have to publish it, and they could operate for another election, right? Mr.Chairman: Form3. Moved by D. Lang, secondedby F. Whyard, that Bill Number 10. entitled Elections Ordinanc;e, Hon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Chairman, the Honourable Member 1977 , be amended as follows: In Form 3 by relocating tije raised a very good point, but they would have to amend the words " signature of candidate" immediately after the words Legislation, and therefore, this particular section would be " as if under oath". reviewed at the same time. I don't think that we should be here trying to out-guess somebody that would be sitting here three Yes, Mr. Lang. or four years down the road. All I am saying to you is this Hon. Mr. Lang: Possibly we could get :\l r. t "r. o.: m :1 n to exp particular section is brought in here on the request of Mr. lain this. All the necessary paperwork is lwre !n: t tht•r<· ~~a !-' <1 Hamel, Mr. MacDonald has agreed to it because he can see no mix-up in the compilation of th e Bill for til t: p;·t ·sn iiH'd I• r m ~ problem with it, and we are attempting to get his blessing so here. Possibly Mr. Cosman could elaborcttt• '"' tli;!l that we can get the necessary Legislation through the House of Commons with that amendment to the Canada Elections Act Mr. Cosman: If I may. Mr. Chairman ·'"' ·· tlll'rc• 1 : , ,., <• and I should point out that this particular section, once again, confusion with respect to the forms last I lt•<·t• tnl.' ' ,. br· .....,_. is in the Canada Elections Act as it is written today. page 2 to Form 3 was in actual fact attached ;_,:; p;11 ~· · ~ t ' ' '"· •. , 2. There is a page out of order. it is a collation pr obk n •. r• · n~ Mrs. Watson: Mr. Chairman, you will certainly have to of the members presently have a page 2 lo Form:!. it ~ h ''·''' , :!. have your Board structured very soon after this legislation is fact be page 2 to Form 3 and now the amendments l ll' t ' •· m~ passed, or else it is useless. somewhat clearer. I have, as Law Clerk.looked through illt•s v Mr. Chairman, may I ask how the Executive Committee or amendments and located exactly where the words an • to be· the government plans on appointing the Board? Will it be a located. It is a form in format type of thing. There is no policy decision of the Executive Committee, or will it be a decision of involved. the Chairman of the Executive Committee? Mr. Chairman: Another amendment to the Form, in Form Mr. Chairman: Mr. Lang? 3 by adding the words " Notary Public, the returning officer" Hon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Chairman, actually I was thinking of the words "or assistant returning officer" , wherever they myself. I am sure that if any Members of the House could think occur. of a few names, we would be prepared to consider them. Any discussion? Hon. Mrs. Whyard: Not today, Mr. Chairman. The further amendment is in Form 3, by adding at the end Clause 100 agreed to thereof the following : "declared before me this .... day of...... , 19 ... Mr. Olairman: The next section 101 , which is at the bot Returning Officer or Assistant Returning Officer.'' tom of page 86 and the top of page 87. Amendments agreed to The amendment was that the words "the Government of Forms 1, 2, 3, and 4 agreed to Canada providing" , were deleted. The amendment was car ried, but the clause was not. Hon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Chairman, for clarification, that one amendment has gone through, has it not, to Form 3 by relocat Yes? ing the words "signature of candidate" immediately after the Hon. Mr. Lang: Well, it's a little bit of an aside to this words " as if under oath"? It has gone through? amendment. I think it should be pointed out that this gives us Mr. Cbairman: Yes. the ability to go into an agreement with the Chief Electoral Officer of Canada, but it would appear now, from the informa We have one clause stood over. The Clause that was stood'· tion that I have, is that with the passage ofthis Legislation, the over was Section 22. amendment to the Canada Elections Act, in Ottawa, it would · Hon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Chairman, I see that we are almost appear that the responsibility of running the next election will approaching 3 o'clock. I am just wondering if we could break be ours and it will not be in an agreement with Canada, be for recess and I can see if I can get the necessary informatio~1 cause it would appear that the Chief Electoral Officer will not to see whether or not we have to amend that Clause in Section have the time to run our elections, under the legislation that 22. we have before you here today. Mr. Chairman: That is a splendid idea. I will now declare a So, it would appear that it is going to be our responsibility, recess. providing everything goes to plan. Recess Clause 101 agreed to Mr. Chairman: I call the Committee to order. l Mr. Chairman: Clause 102. It is another clause that was We will revert to Section 22 on page 14 . . amended and the amendment carried, but the main clause, · ;·~ the clause as amended wasn't carried. And the amendment We had stood this over until such time as Mr. Lang could get further information. Mr. Lang? . Mr. Chairman: It has been moved by Mr. Lang. SI:.'\'HIId,•d Bon. Mr. Lang: Mr. Chairman. we have. over the break. by Mrs. Whyard. that Bill Number IObemovedllut.o(Conurllt· ""'\ tee. as amended. Are you ready ror the .questicm'! ) discussed the situation with ~he expertise of the drafters of the Legislation before us. It is their recommendation that no Some Members: Agreed. changes be made to the amendment. as presented before you. Mr. Chairman: I declare Bill Number 10 moved OUt'4lf There are two reasons. Number one. they don't want to Committee with amendments. · change the terminology from "house" to· ·residence·· becausl' · ·Mr. McCall? "house'' can be taken into the context of a motel or wherever one is enumerated. Mr. McCall: I move. Mr. Chairman. that Mr. Speaker do now resume the Chair. Residence is the broad. encompassing definition of a person that is in the Yukon. as far as their residency is concerned. Mr. Fleming: I second that. · · ': Q ~ . At the same time, they want to retaih the house-to-house Mr. cbairmah: lt has been moved by Mr. McCall. sec• section of the Bill. because if one looks earlier. I believe it is onded by Mr. Fleming. that Mr. Speaker do now resume the sectioh 7(bl, it is mandatory for an enumerator to go (rom Chair. Are you agreed? house to house enumerating and the situation that the Member Some Members: Agreed. from Kluane and Hootalinqua alluded to is just a back-up, but initially. it is m'andatory for an enumerator to go house to Mr. Speaker resumes Chair house to make the necessary contact with the people td enum Mr. Speaker: I will now call the House td order. . er·ate them on a face-to-face basis. May we have a report from the Chairman llf Coml'niitees? . · So, they feel that, with the section the way it's written. it Mr. Mcintyre: Mr. Speaker. the Committee ot the Whol~ gives them direction in one particular case where they are has considered Bill Number 10. Electians Ordinance, 1177, and actually going to the individual's dwelling and getting on an has ordered me to report the same, with amell ' · . ' •' . , .., '·· '• '·" l iJ(.. u ,. r () o~ 0 () I 0 ·o