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Cowdell, John Alexander, Oral History.Pdf JOHN CURTIN PRIME MINISTERIAL LIBRARY Verbatim transcript of an interview with JOHN COWDELL Access: Open Research Open Publication Not to be published without permission of the JCPML Not to be published without written permission of John Cowdell (applies until 7 March 2016) Accession No. JCPML00977/1 Interviewer: John Ferrell Date of Interview: 21 & 28 February & 7 March 2006 Transcriber: Jo Draffin NOTE TO THE READER Readers of this oral history memoir should bear in mind that it is a verbatim transcript of the spoken word and reflects the informal conversational style that is inherent in such historical sources. The John Curtin Prime Ministerial Library is not responsible for the factual accuracy of the memoir, nor for the views therein; these are for the reader to judge. Bold type face indicates a difference between transcript and tape as a result of corrections made to the transcript only, usually at the request of the person interviewed. [ ] are used for insertions, not in the original tape. Italics in the text indicate a word or words emphasised by the person interviewed. [ ... ] are for deletions from the transcript but not from the tapes. VERBATIM TRANSCRIPT This is an interview with Mr John Cowdell who will be speaking with me, John Ferrell, for the Oral History Collection conducted by the John Curtin Prime Ministerial Library. On behalf of the John Curtin Prime Ministerial Library, John, I would like to thank you for agreeing to participate in this oral history interview. Do you understand that the JCPML owns copyright in the interview material but disclosure will be subject to any disclosure restrictions you impose in completing the form of consent? COWDELL I do understand. JF Thank you. This being so may we have your permission to make a transcript of the recording should the JCPML decide to make one? COWDELL You have my permission. JF Thank you very much. We hope you will speak as frankly as possible knowing that neither the tapes nor any transcripts produced from them will be released without your authority. This interview, tape one in the series, is taking place today Tuesday 21 February 2006 at the John Curtin Prime Ministerial Library. [The interviewer is John Ferrell.] So as a starting point John could you tell me about the nature of your feelings for the former Prime Minister John Curtin and cover what gave rise to these attitudes perhaps? COWDELL I suppose I came to an appreciation of the role of the former Prime Minister gradually. I was of course a John Curtin boy. That is in the sense I went to John Curtin Senior High School. Now my family background was Liberal but .., ·,···:..----------------···-···------ ! TAPE ONE SIDE A JOHN ALEXANDER COWDELL 4 [ ... ] I got some idea about John Curtin at high school. remember that Kim Beazley senior was the patron of the school and on one occasion he gave a brilliant address to the school. I came home to my parents and said, "You told me all these Labor people were dummies, I've just heard the most brilliant speech by the school patron who happens to be the Labor Member for Fremantle" and of course he referred to Curtin. Then [ ... ] I went to UWA and by my second year I was doing the Australian History unit under Tom Stannage. I chose as one of the essays an essay on John Curtin. It received a middling mark with the comment, "Is there nothing negative about Curtin that you can raise or that you should raise?" My essay was considered altogether too positive and not to have a sufficient negative assessment so obviously there was some understanding there. I majored in history so I had read at that stage most of the literature on Curtin, [ ... ] including Beazley's address in the early sixties as Curtin Memorial Lecturer. And there were regular Curtin Memorial lectures at UWA in which you received various appreciations of the former Prime Minister. Then [ ... ] being involved as a member of the Labor Party I came into contact [ ... ] with members of the family and gained a greater appreciation [ ... ] of Curtin's historic role. JF Fine. Well now I believe that you became involved with the John Curtin Foundation and perhaps we should spend a few minutes where you just explain what your role was with that. COWDELL Yes. When I became Assistant Secretary of Labor Party which was in 1982 of course the immediate focus was on the 1983 election and Labor was successful at both the State and Commonwealth levels. Then [ ... ] we had the years of the Burke Government. Burke with some encouragement from the Party - well the party had discussions with the government and thought that a fund should be set up to put aside for the future some of the business donations which were being received into the leader's fund. And the concept was that we had two operating accounts, one was Perth Trades Hall Incorporated which was our property income stream from management of the Trades Halls and the other TAPE ONE SIDE A JOHN ALEXANDER COWDELL 5 was the ALP Operating Account. It was determined that we should establish an Endowment Fund which was essentially the Curtin Foundation. This was run as a third set of accounts at the ALP and the officers of the ALP were the officers of the John Curtin Foundation. That being the State Secretary as Chairman and myself as Assistant Secretary as Secretary of the John Curtin Foundation. JF And the nature and purpose of that Fund or that Foundation, what were they planning to do with it? COWDELL [ ... ] Everald Compton established the Bjelke Petersen Foundation in Queensland and Everald was employed to run the fundraising appeal. [ ... ] The Foundation was there to have a mixture of political and philanthropic roles. [ ... ] The funds donated would not be touched but the interest would be used for things such as scholarships and awards and also for developing areas of Labor history particularly pertaining to Curtin. That was viewed as an objective. But of course the objective was also political. Many of the donors were making a donation to the Burke Government rather than the ALP but the Curtin Foundation had the appearance of more than just a party election fund. JF Now how long had you been involved with the administration of the Labor Party in WA because you didn't start life as a political person did you? COWDELL No, as I've said my family background was Liberal but I became a member of the State Executive of the West Australian ALP in 1976. Then I became a Trustee of the Party in 1981 and Assistant State Secretary in 1982. I held that position till December of 1991. That was one of the two paid officer positions in the WA branch so it was significant in that sense and it was directly elected by the executive. The executive was a body of some 200 members which initially met fortnightly and subsequently monthly. JF That's a big group to be meeting incidentally - 200 at a time. TAPE ONE SIDE A JOHN ALEXANDER COWDELL 6 COWDELL It was particularly when it met on a fortnightly basis. But of course I had been a member of it for six years then and that was essentially my constituency in terms of the Party. So then [ ... ] I went into head office and was involved in administration, and as I say part of that role was setting up the John Curtin Foundation, and, therefore liaising closely with members of the family. Of course, Elsie McLeod, John Curtin's daughter had been closely involved with the Party as her mother was prior to her death. John Curtin junior, the son, had put a distance between himself and the Party. To my knowledge he wasn't a member of the Party and never attended any function pertaining to the Party or to the John Curtin Foundation or to anything to do with his father even of a secular nature vis-a-vis university or the high school. JF Mmm, interesting. But before you were with the Labor Party I think you'd been working as a public servant in the field of education. I wondered whether that brought you into any contact with the West Australian Institute of Technology at all? COWDELL Not greatly. I had done a History Degree at UWA and then a Diploma of Education in 1975. Subsequent to that I was employed by the Faculty of Education at UWA both as a Tutor and a Research Officer. And so in that area I came into contact with a range of people, notably of course Kim Beazley Senior just after he ceased to be Education Minister in the Whitlam Government and came to do a series of seminars at the Faculty of Education. And [ ... ] Peter Tannock was Professor at the time as was Bert Priest, and I worked with both of them and [ ... ] Ian Birch. [ ... ] Ian was writing a book and I did research on that particular book which was Educational Decision-Making in the Australian Context. So yes, contact and overview with the field generally, and of the debates that were going on in the tertiary education field but no particular contact with WAIT per se. ,._._.-------------------------------------- TAPE ONE SIDE A JOHN ALEXANDER COWDELL 7 JF And with Watts or not? COWDELL Yes I came into contact with Don 1 in the later seventies. He was [ ... ] Professor of Chemistry at UWA. We were both tutors at Currie Hall so of course I would have occasional conversations with Don. [ ... ] He was Chemistry tutor at Currie Hall and I was History tutor at Currie Hall.
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