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1 2 3 4 5 6 7 ************************* TOWN OF FLOWER MOUND 8 OIL AND GAS BOARD OF APPEALS MARCH 12, 2008 9 *************************
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20 MEETING OF THE TOWN OF FLOWER MOUND OIL AND 21 GAS BOARD OF APPEALS, taken on the 12th day of March, 2008, 22 from 7:00 p.m. to 11:54 p.m., at the Town Hall, 2121 Cross 23 Timbers Road, Flower Mound, Texas, and transcribed from 24 videotape by Sherry Patterson, CSR in and for the State of 25 Texas, as follows:
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1 P R O C E E D I N G S 2 CHAIR MURPHY: Welcome to the Town of Flower 3 Mound Oil and Gas Appeals Board meeting for March the 12th, 4 2008. I'm Tina Murphy, the Chair. And I just want to go over 5 again -- we've got a wonderful crowd, and we very rarely have 6 any more than ten people here at a time, so this is exciting; 7 and I'm glad to see so much participation and interest. After 8 we do the Pledge of Allegiance and take care of some other 9 details, we'll give you what's going on for this evening; so
10 let's stand for the Pledge of Allegiance.
11 (The Pledge was recited.)
12 CHAIR MURPHY: The next item on the agenda is
13 the citizen's participation; but before we go into that, I
14 want to make something very clear. If it has nothing to do
15 with the cases presented tonight, you may speak; and we're
16 going to limit it for two minutes, not three, because we want
17 to give as much time possible to the Applicants.
18 And so that you know what the cases are for tonight,
19 I'm going to read them to you. The first one is going to be
20 holding a public hearing to consider a request from Braden
21 Exploration, LLC, for a variance from Section 34-402 K and N
22 under Oil and Gas Well Permit Required, Section 34-422 D under 23 Oil and Gas Well Permit, and Section 34-427 A35 under 24 Technical Requirements. 25 The request is to decrease floodplain,
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1 environment -- environmentally sensitive area, residence,
Page 2 0313og.txt 2 building used or designed and intended to be used for human 3 occupancy, property line, road right-of-way, tank battery and 4 storage tank setbacks for one natural gas drilling pad site 5 permit known as the Armstrong Huggins with 1H and 2H wells. 6 The property involved is generally located east of Winding 7 Oaks Lane, north of Grapevine Lake and south of Cross Timbers 8 Road FM 1171 and west of Post Oak Road. That's the first 9 case. 10 The second case will be a public hearing to consider 11 a request from Red Oak Gas Operating, LP for a variance from
12 Section 34-420 K and N under Oil and Gas Well Permit Required,
13 Section 34-422 D under Oil and Gas Well Permit, and Section
14 34-427 A35 under Technical Requirements. This request is to
15 decrease the floodplain, environmentally sensitive area,
16 public park, residence property line, tank battery and storage
17 tank setback requirements for one natural gas well permit
18 known as the McDowell Number 1H.
19 The property involved is generally located east of
20 FM 2499 Long Prairie Road, north of Euclid Avenue and west of
21 Morris Road and south of Timber Creek Trail. Those are the
22 two cases that we will be reviewing tonight at the Oil and Gas
23 Appeals Board. I have before me some comment cards or
24 requests to speak. And what I'm going to do is I'm going to 25 bring these out and let you speak on them. I will identify
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1 the name, the address and read the request. 2 Is that okay, Counselor? Is that the way I do this? 3 MR. LATHROM: Madame Chair, that is correct.
Page 3 0313og.txt 4 CHAIR MURPHY: Okay, thank you. I do want, 5 like I said, to limit this as much as possible because we want 6 to get to the cases tonight; and I do not see any reason for 7 us to go into the wee hours of the morning. I just think it's 8 disrespectful to everyone involved. If we have to, we'll 9 continue at another day. Okay. Citizen participation, first 10 of all, I have Harold Garner, 4100 Post Oak Road in Flower 11 Mound. As a long time member of Flower Mound, a stakeholder 12 in the -- 13 MR. LATHROM: Madame Chair, you don't -- you
14 can just let the App --
15 CHAIR MURPHY: Very good.
16 MR. LATHROM: -- the people that filled out the
17 forms come up and --
18 CHAIR MURPHY: Thank you.
19 MR. LATHROM: -- have their say.
20 CHAIR MURPHY: Make sure you do state your
21 name again and your address.
22 MR. GARNER: My name is Harold Garner. I live
23 at 4100 Post Oak Road in Flower Mound. So I actually want to
24 thank you again for this opportunity to speak. I've spoke
25 with you before at these occasions. And I also want to say
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1 that I represent a fairly substantial number of stakeholders 2 and land owners in the area. If you would please rise, or 3 just show yourself here.
4 And I -- we're going to speak with a single voice to 5 help move these proceedings forward. And so what I want to
Page 4 0313og.txt 6 say is that we're a very diverse group of retirees, single 7 mothers, small business owners, professionals with a variety 8 of backgrounds and things like that. And perhaps one of the 9 reasons I was chosen to speak is that my background is I have 10 a bachelor's degree in nuclear engineering, a Ph.D. in 11 physics. But currently I'm a professor of internal medicine 12 and biochemistry at UT Southwestern Medical Center, which is 13 Parkland Hospital if you don't know it, where I really conduct 14 research in cancer, heart disease and biodefense. 15 And so we've discussed this a lot and brought many
16 different viewpoints into this, and I just want to say that
17 we've concluded that we really support this for a number of
18 reasons. There's tremendous national and local benefit to
19 this --
20 CHAIR MURPHY: I'm -- wait a minute. I'm
21 sorry, Mr. Garner. What are we supporting?
22 MR. GARNER: Oh, supporting the actual
23 variance for --
24 CHAIR MURPHY: It's not time for that. This
25 is -- this is something that you want to speak in citizen
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1 participation that has nothing to do with either one of the 2 cases before us. 3 MR. GARNER: I'm sorry, ma'am. 4 CHAIR MURPHY: That's okay, Mr. Garner. And 5 I'll probably hear from you tonight later on, but that will be
6 another time. This has nothing to do with either one of these 7 cases.
Page 5 0313og.txt 8 MR. GARNER: Okay. I'm sorry. 9 CHAIR MURPHY: Thank you, Mr. Garner. 10 MR. GARNER: We'll start again, but I -- 11 CHAIR MURPHY: No, I appreciate it and -- 12 (Inaudible due to multiple speakers.) 13 CHAIR MURPHY: -- and we'll get back to that 14 one. Eric Parsam [phonetic] -- 15 (Inaudible speaker from audience.) 16 CHAIR MURPHY: Okay. Yeah, this has nothing 17 to do with the two cases we have tonight. That's why I read
18 them, so you would know what we are not speaking on right now.
19 Tammy --
20 MR. LATHROM: For clarification, if I may,
21 Madame Chair, for the audience's benefit. You will have an
22 opportunity to speak during the case. If you're here to speak
23 on -- if you're here regarding either one of the cases that
24 are coming up before the Oil and Gas Board of Appeals this
25 evening, there is a time frame during the public hearing
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1 process for each individual case that you will be allowed to 2 speak regarding that particular case. That's why we try and 3 make sure that we consolidate or just -- or limit those 4 comments to those particular cases so that when we go back we 5 have a clear record regarding who spoke regarding -- involving 6 a particular case in the event there was some kind of a 7 challenge to the determination that's rendered by the Oil and
8 Gas Board of Appeals. 9 CHAIR MURPHY: So as I continue to read the
Page 6 0313og.txt 10 names, if you are going to be speaking on behalf of either 11 case, just say "later;" and I'll know, unless you have 12 something else you want to talk about as far as citizen 13 participation that does not refer to either one of the cases. 14 Tammy Anderson. Okay. Paul Huggins. Okay. Yolanda Jones. 15 Thank you. Shavontha [phonetic]. Later, okay. I'm -- I'm 16 sorry for the misunderstanding. Karen Spencer. Okay. Carol 17 Collins. Virginia Jewelson -- Jellison. Okay. Ernia Hague 18 [phonetic]. Ron Jetson. Eddie Alcot [phonetic]. Okay. Yes, 19 sir?
20 (Inaudible speaker from audience.)
21 CHAIR MURPHY: You can talk about anything you
22 want to talk about that does not pertain to either one of the
23 cases on the agenda for this evening. Okay? All right,
24 super.
25 State your name and address, please.
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1 MR. ALCOT: Can I take this mic off of here so
2 I can walk around? 3 CHAIR MURPHY: No. We don't have a -- 4 MR. ALCOT: My name's Eddie Alcot, my wife's 5 Lilly, and my Justin -- my son Justin is five years old; and 6 we live at 2829 Aberdeen Drive, Woodlake Estates, so right 7 down the street. Our concern -- I disagree with individual 8 cases, because I believe every one of these cases that are 9 coming and continue to come is going to affect every one in
10 this room. 11 With that said, I want to talk about the history of
Page 7 0313og.txt 12 Flower Mound and us moving here three years ago from southern 13 California. We moved here after me looking for three months 14 online for a spot in the DFW market and traveling here on 15 business looking for a spot for our year-and-a-half-old, not 16 joining the LA County school system but to join a great town 17 and a great school system. After months and months of looking 18 and seeing how you put a stop to -- I lost my train of 19 thought. 20 But you put a stop to the out of control building, 21 and that very much impressed me, because I've seen it in
22 Florida; and it's been horrible. It impressed me that Board
23 after Board has looked after this town. And we bought this
24 house because of that and put our son who's now in Old
25 Settler's Kindergarten. With that said, I want to get a
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1 little personal.
2 Just -- in July of 1996 I was -- I was diagnosed
3 with a angioblastoma stage 4 brain cancer. It was removed.
4 I've gone through all the treatment. I've had nine straight 5 MRIs clean. They don't know where it comes from. It's not 6 hereditary, but they will find out. It might be five years, 7 it might be ten years. They will find out where it came from. 8 Excuse me if I get a little emotional. Cell phone towers, we 9 don't know. 10 All I can tell you, with what's going to go into the 11 ground that we don't know about and into our water in our
12 beautiful town back there with those trees, eventually maybe 13 it will be an oil well out there. What I'm concerned about is
Page 8 0313og.txt 14 my five-year-old in ten years or your five-year-old or your 15 grandchild or any of the small children. In ten years they 16 find out that the drilling in Flower Mound caused cancer, 17 caused allergies, caused asthma in these children and how 18 we've looked back to this night and the nights going forward 19 trying to approve these things and think what we should have 20 done and what we should be looking at. 21 This is a beautiful town. That's why we're all 22 here. That's why we're all living here. We do not want to 23 turn into an oil well town. I'm not against oil well
24 drilling. That shale goes forever. There's millions and
25 billions of dollars, but why in the Town of Flower Mound? Why
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1 here? And why is it clustered areas of people that if there's
2 an accident that thousands of homes could go up in flames.
3 Hundreds of people could die.
4 And I -- respectfully, Madame Chair, if it took
5 until midnight tonight for us to discuss this, look at all the
6 people here. I don't know if you've seen more, but there's 7 going to be more and more people as they find out about the 8 drilling. And I ask you when you're making decisions about 9 setbacks -- and by the way, 1,000 foot setback's one of the 10 best in the country. You did that for a reason, to protect 11 this town. And for you to lower it to 500 and to 300 feet for 12 people to drill is going against what we built this town on, 13 which you built and your predecessors built this town on.
14 It is one of the best towns in the country. It's in 15 Money Magazine. Well, it will go out of Money Magazine,
Page 9 0313og.txt 16 because the drillers will not stop if you allow them to enter 17 this town. And you also speak of the Lakeside District. 18 They'll be able to see that. When we're on that beautiful 19 lake, we'll be able to see oil wells. If they drill in North 20 Shore, if they drill in Hilliard [phonetic] and many other 21 areas, especially in the winter because you can see through 22 the trees. 23 And I respectfully request just one more minute, 24 ma'am, to speak about something else that I read. Excuse me 25 for being emotional. Who says men don't get emotional. But
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1 again, the point I want you to remember is they will find out,
2 no matter how much is going on with oil and gas drilling and
3 what you're trying to do to protect it, what is happening and
4 how people are going to be affected; but what happens is we
5 might not know it for five or ten years. No one has been able
6 to prove that the ground is not poisoned and they'll be able
7 to get out of it.
8 And the Master Plan update in 2006 -- just a couple 9 things, I'll be done, ma'am. The gateway to make major 10 thoroughfares leading to Flower Mound are at the front door of 11 our community, and I believe firmly that the major gateway is 12 coming off these freeways at 2499, coming towards the Lakeside 13 District. Do we want to see as we're bringing these people 14 into our beautiful town all these oil wells being brought up? 15 I don't believe so.
16 Park Board can keep Flower Mound beautiful. Town 17 Staff will oversee the design of it and the implementation.
Page 10 0313og.txt 18 We're concerned about lakefront. You talked -- you talked 19 earlier about a tree -- I'm sorry, I didn't get your name. 20 But we talk about trees and protecting wildlife for our 21 beautiful town. Well, the Board -- the Oil and Gas 22 Departments will tell you, well, we're going to replace those 23 trees. Well, they'll replace the 40-foot trees in your area 24 in your woods with 6-foot trees we may not even live to enjoy. 25 And they do replace trees.
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1 But if drilling gets approved at North Shore and
2 Hilliard -- I know they haven't permitted it yet, but they
3 will -- these towers will be in full view, again, of the lake.
4 And you guys have done a spectacular job and all your
5 predecessors since the beginning of Flower Mound keeping this
6 the town that everybody wants to live in, the school district
7 that everybody wants their children to go to. It's not going
8 to happen if we start letting these drillers take over our
9 town.
10 And again, I'm not against drilling. Just not in -- 11 one explosion is all it will take. There is so many other 12 areas to build in, I ask with due respect for everybody on 13 every council to think about what I've said about my 14 five-year-old son. Because my brain cancer, they don't know 15 where it came from. He may develop -- your children 16 may develop -- you may develop in five or ten years something 17 that came from this drilling and may not ever know about it or
18 may not know about it for 10 or 15 years. 19 I respectfully ask you do not think about moving
Page 11 0313og.txt 20 that 1,000 foot setback for these greedy drillers to get in. 21 I'm not against it. Just not in Flower Mound. It will ruin 22 our town. It'll put our taxes up, our insurance up; and no 23 one's going to want to live here. And you guys have done a 24 great job of keeping the town this way. And we moved 1,500 25 miles to move to this town three years ago, and we want to
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1 continue living here safely.
2 CHAIR MURPHY: Thank you, Mr. Alcot.
3 MR. ALCOT: Thank you very much.
4 CHAIR MURPHY: We do appreciate it. Thank you
5 so much. Do we have Becky Belcher?
6 MS. BELCHER: Thank you. My name is Rebecca
7 Belcher, and I live at 2900 Aberdeen Drive. Until the evening
8 of February 1st, 2008, I had never heard of the Barnett Shale
9 or horizontal drilling or something called net mineral
10 interest -- or net mineral acre. See, I still don't know it.
11 That all changed when I opened a letter that night from a
12 company called Cherokee Horn. One sentence stopped me dead in 13 my tracks. We are going to be drilling a well on the North 14 Shore Club plain. 15 I share a 120-foot property line with the North 16 Shore Club. I went to work. I began researching. I learned 17 that gas wells are not subject to the Federal Clean Air or 18 Federal Clean Water Act. I learned that this heavy industrial 19 activity could be located a few hundred feet from homes and
20 schools, yet no environmental study or impact study was 21 required. I learned as many as 500 80,000-pound truckloads of
Page 12 0313og.txt 22 water might have to be trucked to the site within the first 23 seven to ten days. 24 I learned that besides the truck traffic the 24/7 25 noise and lights of a drill site could be maddening. I
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1 learned that the water once used may be contaminated with
2 chemicals such as benzene, a known carcinogen, salts in
3 concentrations that sterilize the land and even radioactive
4 materials. And then what about the pipeline that would be
5 necessary to transport the gas to the nearest collection line,
6 whose property would have to be acquired through eminent
7 domain?
8 I concluded that urban gas drilling was disturbing,
9 but what was even more disturbing was finding out that it was
10 a possibility in Flower Mound, and only 500 feet from my home.
11 At that point I decided that something had to be done. There
12 had to be others who had no idea of the dangers that came with
13 Cherokee Horn's promise of easy money; and thus, the Flower
14 Mound Citizens Against Urban Drilling was begun. 15 Our mission is to work in legal, ethical and a civil 16 manner to stop urban gas drilling in the highly residential 17 areas of Flower Mound. We are not against all gas drilling, 18 but rather that which will adversely affect the public safety, 19 the enjoyment of our homes and our overall quality of life. 20 Let me reiterate, we are not against all gas drilling; but we 21 are against drilling in heavily residential areas which will
22 impact our quality of life, the life which so many of us have 23 specifically chosen here in Flower Mound. And I hope you will
Page 13 0313og.txt 24 support that mission. Thank you very much. 25 CHAIR MURPHY: I believe that the ordinance
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1 for the oil and gas is on the web site; is that correct? 2 MR. LATHROM: Yes. 3 CHAIR MURPHY: And Flower Mound is one of the
4 few municipalities that do have ordinances, and that's why we
5 have the Oil and Gas Appeals Board. And I just invite you to
6 see what they are providing to make it a safe environment; and
7 that's why we're here, to make sure that it does fit what
8 Flower Mound has in store for its citizens. Do we have one
9 more? If you -- okay. We've got two more. If you want to
10 step to the lectern, I am going to start the three minutes
11 now.
12 Wait a minute, just a moment please. Yes, sir?
13 (Inaudible speaker from audience.)
14 CHAIR MURPHY: We need to step to the lectern,
15 state your name and address.
16 MALE SPEAKER: My name is (inaudible). It's a 17 long name. I live in 2208 (inaudible) Drive, Flower Mound, 18 Texas, Town View Estates. I think Eddie and the other speaker 19 spoke about environment impacts about gas wells. So I took 20 the study this afternoon after my work from the EPA, this 21 document. It is very thorough document about oil and gas 22 wells. 23 And basically what the EPA states is for the
24 majority of the gas waste generated by the drilling process is 25 exempt from the EPA regulations. And so there are some
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1 compounds that are nonexempt, but the majority of them are 2 exempt. So there are some (inaudible) cases in here that if 3 we have mixture of two chemicals, one from nonexempt versus 4 the exempt, it will be eventually categorized as nonexempt. 5 So and if you really look at the EPA study, which is 6 about this thick -- and I just wanted to show you the summary
7 of the compounds that they found in tests. Pretty much you
8 will find almost all the chemical compounds or elements that
9 you studied in high school. Almost all of them are here. And
10 I found fairly interesting on some sort of -- I would say not
11 entertaining, because I know some folks have cancer and stuff
12 like this -- some of these compounds are benzene (inaudible),
13 mercury and arsenic.
14 These are only -- I can give all these reports to
15 you for your reading. So my concern here is that according to
16 the report, they say these chemicals because of the drilling
17 process will come with the water and will actually be
18 surrounding the well later. So it will go to the soil, and it 19 could actually go to the wells, possibly to contaminate the 20 water and so on. So I didn't have enough time to read the 21 100-page report from the EPA, but bottom line is that I'm a 22 little concerned that before at least we had a good ordinance 23 which is 1,000 feet away from it. 24 Now that we have so many variances for 300 feet if 25 you are infrastructure -- if you are interested party of the
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1 oil drilling site, otherwise the limit is 500 feet from 2 neighborhoods and 500 feet from parks and so on. So this is a 3 little concerning to me that -- whatever these environmental 4 pollutants, this is so close. And the other thing is you will 5 have trucks going back and forth transporting these chemicals 6 to the site. What if accidentally you have a spill over. We 7 only need one more disaster or one more small impact to have
8 all of our property values go up -- down. I mean, forget
9 about selling property in Flower Mound if such an event
10 happens.
11 So I'm a little concerned. I'm very happy. I have
12 two small twin girls myself. I lived in Flower Mound for nine
13 years. I'm very happy with the Town's work, have been very
14 much pro -- for residences. And I know you get -- Town of
15 Flower Mound gets a lot of revenue from taxpayers like us,
16 like from the property taxes. So what I would ask you is to
17 keep Flower Mound as beautiful as before. While it may not
18 generate quick money as the oil and gas drilling, in five
19 years down the road if we stop oil and gas drilling and keep
20 Flower Mound as beautiful, we'll get that money in ten years, 21 three or four times over. 22 CHAIR MURPHY: Thank you. 23 MALE SPEAKER: And I would encourage you to 24 keep the regulations strict and not allow variances just 25 because it is in the ordinance. I have read all these
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Page 16 0313og.txt 1 ordinances. To keep -- and I will be not against drilling if 2 it is out in some sort of bare lands so that there won't be 3 any -- 4 CHAIR MURPHY: Thank you. Time is up now. 5 Thank you. 6 MALE SPEAKER: Thank you very much. 7 CHAIR MURPHY: I had one over here. You can 8 come up. Hang on, and we'll -- just bear with us. Three 9 minutes, please. 10 MS. JELLISON: My name is Virginia Jellison.
11 I reside at 27605 Lake Ville Lane. It is your obligation to
12 consider multiple factors when determining the right of an
13 appeal. One of the considerations is if the drill site were
14 to adversely affect any other feature of the comprehensive
15 Master Plan of the Town. The Town's Master Plan does not
16 include sites for the oil and gas industry. This is bringing
17 an industrial site in the middle of a master planned
18 community. Another consideration is if it will bring
19 material detriment to the public welfare or injury to the
20 enjoyment or value of the property of the vicinity. Bringing
21 an industrial site into our community compromises or
22 community's health, safety and welfare. The buildings that 23 are master planned for this site will no longer be permitted 24 within the 300-foot circumference of the drill site. This 25 compromises our Town's master plan. Any short-term financial
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1 gains will be lost due to the negative impact this site will
2 bring to our community. Page 17 0313og.txt 3 Our roads will have excessive truck traffic from the 4 water trucks. Our quality will be compromised -- our air 5 quality will be compromised. There will be excessive water 6 use, which will ultimately be tainted, undrinkable. And this 7 information I verified with oil and gas specialists. The 8 marketability and the desirability of our homes will also be 9 compromised, and I've researched this with Realtors, banks and 10 insurance companies. 11 There are many reasons that the variance should be 12 denied. The number one reason, we should never place profit
13 over safety. Please protect our community. Deny the request
14 for waivers. Thank you.
15 CHAIR MURPHY: Sir, hang on.
16 MS. HEE [PHONETIC]: Good evening, ladies and
17 gentlemen. My name is Sonja Hee [phonetic], and I live in
18 1016 Lakehurst Drive, Flower Mound. I want to thank you
19 everyone for (inaudible) for your hard work. Thank you very
20 much. And I'm not against gas drilling. If something
21 goes (inaudible) against that. But I am against drilling in
22 highly public areas such as my neighborhood which is right
23 across the street off of North Shore Club.
24 The reason I am against those drilling in my 25 neighborhood because of the following. First, the proposed
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1 drilling site is in such a densely populated area that unless 2 I miss something here, I believe I bought a house in a 3 residential area, which is not industrial to me. And I don't
4 know why it happened that they can have a gas site in my Page 18 0313og.txt 5 neighborhood and when does that change happen. And unless 6 it's a loophole in the ordinance of the city, which I think if 7 there's any cases like that we may want to make a change in 8 the ordinance to close that loophole. 9 And second, I respect the fact that each, you know, 10 resident has his own (inaudible) regarding what you want on 11 your land. And again, I respect the large land owners for 12 your preferences. And just for this drilling site in the 13 proposed site, which is North Shore Club which is right across 14 my street, and that's like 500 feet away from my house, I feel
15 that that will affect the use and enjoyment and value of
16 property in the neighborhood as well as many, you know, houses
17 in the area as well.
18 And for example, according to Denton Record
19 Chronicle, there will be (inaudible) 226 and 228, the two most
20 common elements that travel up gas wells, and those will add
21 radioactive substances such as they decay. And radon gas, the
22 second leading cause of lung cancer also is part of the decay
23 process, meaning we're going to have huge risk of health
24 exposures whenever they have the gas wells in our
25 neighborhoods. And also this is not just for us, but also for
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1 anyone who is living across the lot whenever there's a huge 2 truck passing by your neighborhood. So think about that. 3 Almost everyone in this room will be impacted by
4 that, and therefore this is not just those who live close in 5 neighborhoods such as me and my neighbors, but also everyone
6 living in the Town of Flower Mound. And another example -- I Page 19 0313og.txt 7 don't have time probably. Just conclude my speech, I strongly 8 believe I live in this town for a reason, that is quality of 9 life which is priceless. I can put a price tag on the, you 10 know, gas lease mineral rights, whatever you can buy; but 11 there's nothing I can buy or pay a price for quality of life 12 we have in Town of Flower Mound. If there's any town in this 13 -- is this country, in this state that can protect us, I 14 believe it's the people right here in front of us. That's why 15 I have hope, that's why I have faith in you guys. Thank you 16 so much.
17 CHAIR MURPHY: This will be our last one for
18 citizen participation, and then we're going to introduce the
19 Board so you'll know where we're coming from. Okay.
20 BOARD MEMBER RICH: We would appreciate if you
21 would tell us your subdivision. That helps a lot, because we
22 don't know exact streets, and that's sure helpful. We'd
23 appreciate it.
24 MS. JUNKIN [PHONETIC]: Woodlake Estates. I
25 live in Woodlake Estates, and I have a 600-foot common area
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1 with the North Shore Gun Club. It's on the south area of 2 North Shore Gun Club. 3 CHAIR MURPHY: Name and address. 4 MS. JUNKIN: With all the current and 5 proposed --
6 CHAIR MURPHY. Give your name and address. 7 MS. JUNKIN: I'm sorry. Yolanda Junkin, and
8 it's 2937 Queen Mary Drive. With all the current and proposed Page 20 0313og.txt 9 gas drilling going on in Flower Mound, the most valuable 10 commodity is not the gas but the water. It hasn't been that 11 long since we've all had strict watering conservation in 12 effect. Each gas well in the Barnett Shale uses two to four 13 million gallons of fresh water for drilling and fracturing. 14 Between 25 and 100 percent of the fracture water returns to 15 the surface, but this is polluted water. 16 It is polluted with salt, crude oil, drilling 17 chemicals and other pollutants that are harmful to land, 18 vegetation, fish, birds and humans. TRC Rules do require an
19 operator to take precautions to prevent pollution of surface
20 and subsurface water, but nearly half of the state's oil and
21 gas leases have not been inspected in the five years ending
22 October 2006. As an example, one Houston case of ground water
23 pollution was not reinspected until 279 days after the
24 compliance date. Staffing cannot be increased without
25 legislative action, and the 2007 state legislature did not
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1 authorize significant increases in the Texas Railroad 2 Commission inspection staff. 3 Transportation -- transporting the polluted water 4 from the gas well is an additional problem, as we have the 5 possibility of traffic accidents and associated spills. 6 Accidents will happen. Canada had almost one spill per month 7 directly associated with gas drilling. Salt water has spilled
8 on the ground in Parker County and has bubbled up in the 9 ground in Wise County. In addition, natural gas leaks have
10 extremely negative effects on the environment. Past safety Page 21 0313og.txt 11 records have shown that accidents will take place. 12 Some things in life are more important than material 13 goods, like breathing fresh air and drinking pure water. We 14 do not allow drilling in Alaska wildlife refuge areas. How 15 can we allow drilling in urban areas? Let's keep Flower Mound 16 the best place to live and say no to urban gas drilling. 17 CHAIR MURPHY: I want to introduce the Board 18 -- the Oil and Gas Appeals Board and a little bit of our 19 background. I also want to say that we have some wonderful 20 staff in the Town of Flower Mound that cover every possible
21 situation or scenario. When we first started hearing the
22 cases, one of the things that I did talk with the public
23 relations director was is that the people of Flower Mound need
24 to know the systems that are in place for some of these gas
25 wells.
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 24
1 And you talk about polluted water. Well, there's a
2 thing called a closed loop system that's being used. The
3 water is not eroding the ground. Because we all care about 4 urban areas, we all care about the Conservation District. So 5 just because you came here tonight, please don't just go away 6 and not come back. Come to every meeting that we have on the 7 Oil and Gas Appeals Board, not only so you can be aware of 8 what's going on; but you can also be educated on how the 9 process is made and what the technology is being used.
10 Because we don't just haphazardly grant variances. 11 With that, I want to introduce the Board Members so
12 they can explain a little bit who they are and why we're Page 22 0313og.txt 13 sitting here. And if you would be brief so we can get on with 14 the first case, I'd appreciate it. And we'll start down there 15 with Board Member Poston. 16 BOARD MEMBER POSTON: I'm Gavin Poston. I 17 live right behind this building. I have one child, married. 18 Came here like many people did from a different state and for 19 the same reasons that you did. So thank you much. Oh, 20 background? Do you want me to be brief and give my 21 background, oh, my goodness. 22 I'm a volunteer on the Board. I have an MBA. I
23 also have a degree in education. I'm a supply chain logistics
24 person. I served in the -- in the Navy. I retired as a
25 commander. I've been aboard nuclear vessels, so I certainly
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1 know that -- you know, the power components. That's about
2 all. Okay, thank you.
3 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: Good evening. I'm Mike
4 Walker. I've been a resident of Flower Mound since 1995. I
5 live in the Bridlewood Community. Educationally I have a 6 master's degree in urban planning and an undergraduate degree 7 in history and government. I used to work for the State of 8 Colorado, western Colorado reviewing mine land reclamation 9 plans, environmental studies, federal EIS applications. I 10 used to work in municipal government. I used to provide 11 assistance to towns like Flower Mound, places like Vale and
12 Steamboat Springs and Aspen and Rangely, Moffat County, if 13 you're familiar with those areas.
14 They also went through tremendous amounts of Page 23 0313og.txt 15 pressure, both from recreational development and energy 16 development and it still continues as we speak. And the thing 17 that I took from that experience was to be consistent with a 18 smart growth mentality, so I'm very much keyed into that. In 19 the Town I served on the Park Board and previously on the 20 Planning and Zoning Commission. Now I'm lucky enough to be on 21 the Board of Adjustment. If I stay here long enough, I'll 22 probably touch all the bases. 23 And then after my background in consulting, I worked 24 in investment management and managed large portfolios for
25 various pension companies; and now I'm doing consulting, so
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1 please hire me I guess. Feels like I'm being interviewed.
2 BOARD MEMBER RICH: My name is Alisa Rich. I
3 have been on the Board for over ten years on the Zoning Board
4 as well as the Oil and Gas Board now for five as vice chair or
5 chair, either one. I have a master's in environmental
6 toxicology. I'm very familiar with most cancers that
7 environment can be caused -- or cancers which can be caused by 8 environmental contaminants. I'm a chemical specialist. I am 9 an EPA contractor with half of the United States in private 10 contracting risk assessments, which basically we go in and we 11 look at environmental lands that have been addressed as 12 negative impact to human health. 13 I have a Ph.D. in air pollution control design. If
14 that does not satisfy you, I don't know what possibly could. 15 I'm a specialist in the oil and gas. I am not only a
16 specialist, I am a consultant to oil and gas to provide the Page 24 0313og.txt 17 most possibly environmentally sensitive, environmentally 18 supportive industry technology that gives the rights to the 19 land owner but at the same time protects human -- human 20 environments as well as animal environments. I am an air 21 specialist. I have a doctorate in air pollution. 22 We do know what we're talking about, and we also are 23 residents here in Flower Mound for the same reasons that you 24 guys are. We take your comments to heart. We are very, very 25 serious about our jobs here, which is not an easy one;
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1 otherwise y'all would be sitting here. And we will take very,
2 very serious consideration of everything that everybody has
3 said. And we thank you for coming out.
4 CHAIR MURPHY: Board Member Ward.
5 BOARD MEMBER WARD: Yes. My name is Jim Ward,
6 I'm the newest member here on the Oil and Gas Appeals Board.
7 I joined in October of this past year. I guess a little bit
8 of background, I lived in this area in 1994 and '95, and my
9 job transferred me away. And I had the opportunity to move 10 back, and it was one of the best places I've ever lived; and 11 so we had the opportunity to come back here in 2002, so I've 12 been here since then. I have four children, all in the LISD. 13 And I live just off of 2499 next to -- near the Target store 14 and all that. 15 My background, I have a bachelor's in electrical
16 engineering; and I studied engineering in graduate school, 17 University of Houston and North Carolina State. Served as a
18 Marine Corps officer, also served in the Navy prior to that. Page 25 0313og.txt 19 And I've been in the -- spent most of my time after the 20 military working with federal government customers, and I'm 21 actually out of that right now; but I spent about 15 years 22 working with federal government customers, a lot of the 23 customers we talk about here such as the EPA and a lot of the 24 military and Nuclear Regulatory Commission and some of the 25 others. That's about it for me.
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1 CHAIR MURPHY: Board Member Melugin.
2 BOARD MEMBER MELUGIN: My name is Richard
3 Melugin. I have been a resident of Flower Mound for
4 approximately four years. I am an information technology
5 consultant. I have a master's in business administration. I
6 am married. I have a two-year-old daughter. And my -- I
7 worked in the oil and gas -- oil and gas companies before in
8 the past, consulted for many years. But my primary
9 qualifications for serving on this Board, like most of you, is
10 that I'm a property owner, a resident and a father. So I
11 encourage you all to consider taking part in these Boards. 12 CHAIR MURPHY: And I am Tina Murphy, and I've 13 been in Flower Mound for over 13 years. I have a degree in 14 marketing, and I have done a lot of things with community. 15 One of my specialties was home owners' associations. And 16 because of Flower Mound is where I learned about the whole 17 management, the whole workings of home owners' associations.
18 And one of the things about Flower Mound is they are very 19 serious about their ordinances, and we appreciate it.
20 We may hear comments about how Flower Mound doesn't Page 26 0313og.txt 21 like working with developers, blah, blah, blah, blah; and I 22 just smile and say that's okay, we like it. I've also served 23 on the Zoning Board of Adjustment for over eight years. I 24 served on the Master Plan Update Steering Committee this past 25 year for a full year, and I've served on the Mayor's Advisory
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1 Council for the Home Owners' Association. I've also gone
2 in -- I'm also a Realtor. And I also have served in many
3 different areas in Cub Scouts and in my church and all the
4 other places around Flower Mound. So we do take this very
5 seriously.
6 And then you ask how did we get on this Board? We
7 are appointed by the Town Council, and we are always looking
8 for concerned citizens that want to participate in the
9 process. And I will say with the Staff of Flower Mound, they
10 have -- with the attorney, to the council people, to the
11 mayor, to the people that work for the Town of Flower Mound,
12 they are very thorough. They give us the information we need
13 when we need to have it. No stone is overturned. So when a 14 decision is made by the Zoning Board of Adjustment or the Oil 15 and Gas Appeals Board, it's a quasi judicial Board that one 16 person cannot make the decision. It has to be made as a 17 Board, and it cannot be overturned by a council member or 18 anyone in the City or the Town government. It can only be 19 taken to state district court.
20 Am I right there, Counselor? Right words? 21 MR. LATHROM: Yes, ma'am.
22 CHAIR MURPHY: And we have a ten-day period, Page 27 0313og.txt 23 that's why we have a stenographer that takes every word that 24 is used or spoken at these meetings so that if anyone chooses 25 to appeal our decision in state district court, we will show
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1 that we have used every effort and every course possible to 2 make a clear, concerned decision.
3 So again, thank you for coming; and we will start
4 the meeting now. And thank you for allowing us to introduce
5 ourselves to you and your comments back to us. Now then --
6 MR. LATHROM: Madame Chair?
7 CHAIR MURPHY: Yes, sir?
8 MR. LATHROM: If I could intrude. Let me
9 explain to the audience for those of you that don't know the
10 difference between the Board of Adjustment --
11 CHAIR MURPHY: Councilman?
12 MR. LATHROM: Yes, ma'am?
13 CHAIR MURPHY: I mean, Counselor, would you
14 introduce yourself?
15 MR. LATHROM: Oh, I'm sorry. My name is Allen 16 Lathrom. I'm the Town attorney or assistant Town attorney. I 17 work with Terry Welch in representing the Town in legal 18 matters and providing legal advice to the Town Council, Board 19 of Adjustment, Planning and Zoning Commission, PALS, the other 20 various Boards and Commissions appointed by the Town. 21 I wanted to explain that there is a significant
22 difference between the way that the Town Council functions or 23 the Planning and Zoning Commission functions and the way that
24 the Board of Adjustment or the Oil and Gas Board of Appeals Page 28 0313og.txt 25 works. The Town Council and the Planning and Zoning
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1 Commission are both legislative bodies, so before those bodies 2 being able to come up and voice your opinions at the 3 microphone is a much broader impact on the actions taken by 4 the Commission and by the Town Council or by the PALS Board.
5 The Oil and Gas Board of Appeals, like the Zoning
6 Board of Adjustment is a quasi judicial body. They act in the
7 same role as a judge and jury. That's why I made the request
8 earlier that if you wanted to say something that applied to
9 one of the cases that are on the agenda here this evening
10 before the Oil and Gas Board of Appeals that you hold your
11 comments until that particular case came forward, because the
12 Board has to make their decision based on the evidence that is
13 presented to them during that public hearing.
14 So while I appreciate the comments that we had and
15 the discussion we had earlier from the speakers that we --
16 that we heard from earlier, those are all very pertinent to
17 most of the gas -- oil and gas cases that come before this 18 body. But it's also something that's pertinent to take 19 forward to council and have your voices heard before Town 20 Council on that front. The Board -- the Oil and Gas Board of 21 Appeals cannot make a determination on a specific case based 22 on your speaking in citizen participation before that hearing 23 is called.
24 If you -- you know, so it's very important -- again, 25 the Chair has invited you to be sure and come to as many of
Page 29 0313og.txt CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 32
1 the Board of Adjustment meetings as you have time and 2 opportunity to attend. The same thing with the Zoning Board 3 of Adjustment, we need to hear your voices and have your 4 evidence, your testimony heard and reported, put into the 5 record so that all sides can be heard and known on any 6 particular case that comes before this body. So again, some
7 of you may want to have your -- have your voices heard and be
8 counted as part of the record on that particular gas variance
9 case that's going to be heard this evening. And if that's the
10 case, you know, hey, I have no problem with that whatsoever
11 and encourage you to do so.
12 But we have to make our decision -- there are 14
13 criteria that are spelled out in the Town's Code of Ordinances
14 which the Oil and Gas Board of Appeals weighs in trying to
15 decide what is in the best interest of the Town. And
16 that's -- that's the burden that they are faced with in
17 dealing with a gas well variance request that they receive
18 from a -- from a particular property owner or drilling company
19 or developer. So I just wanted to sort of give you that 20 background that they have to rely upon that testimony. 21 They can't go out and perform individual 22 investigations. They can't rely upon information that they 23 hear from somebody when they go out to a particular location 24 and visit with a property owner. It has to be based on what's 25 presented during the record, during the case. That's very
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 33 Page 30 0313og.txt
1 important for us to make that decision on those facts. 2 Thank you very much. 3 CHAIR MURPHY: Thank you, Counselor. Okay. 4 We need to consider the agenda -- consider the approval of 5 minutes from the regular meeting of the Oil and Gas Appeals 6 Board held on February 13th, 2008. On the agenda there is a 7 typo. It's 2007, that needs to be 2008. Thank you so much. 8 Any corrections or additions to the minutes, please? The
9 minutes will be approved as written.
10 Now to the public hearing. GO-08-0120, public
11 hearing to consider requests from Braden Exploration, LLC, for
12 a variance from Section 34-420 K and N under Oil and Gas Well
13 Permit Required, Section 34-422 D under the Oil and Gas Well
14 Permit, and Section 34-427 A35 under Technical Requirements.
15 This request is to decrease floodplain, environmentally
16 sensitive area, residence, building used or designed and
17 intended to be used for human occupancy, property line, road
18 right-of-way, tank battery and storage tank setback
19 requirements for one natural gas drilling pad site permit
20 known as the Armstrong Huggins with 1H and 2H wells.
21 The property involved is generally located east of 22 Winding Oaks Lane and north of Grapevine Lake, south of Cross 23 Timbers Road FM 1171 and west of Post Oak Road. Is the 24 Applicant here, please? Please state your name and address, 25 please.
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Page 31 0313og.txt 1 MR. DOLLAK: Good evening. My name is Bobby 2 Dollak, 111 Hillside Drive. I guess I'll start off, since 3 everybody else started off, I've got two kids, a wife, lived 4 here 15 years, live in the area. And I too am passionate 5 about the gas wells. You know, it's my job as a consultant to 6 work with the residents of Flower Mound who have entered into 7 these gas leases with these gas companies, to work within the 8 limits of the ordinance that's -- that you're charged with -- 9 with upholding. And we put together and try to make the best 10 sense out of the desires of the mineral holders and keeping
11 into -- keeping a pulse on the other citizens of town, so
12 there's a lot of thought. These things don't just happen
13 overnight. And I'm going to get on with my presentation
14 because we've got two of them tonight.
15 I'm here on behalf of Armstrong Huggins lease, which
16 is held by Braden Exploration. I have a -- I have my whole
17 design team here sprinkled in amongst you. I should have
18 color-coded the shirts so I can spot them, but they're all
19 here if I yell at them. If I can't answer any of your
20 questions, we've got the technical staff here to answer
21 anything that I might not be able to answer. Again, this is
22 for wells number 1H and 2H at the Arm -- Armstrong Huggins
23 lease. This lease is approximately 123 acres. It's located 24 just south on 1171 from the entrance into Tour 18. 25 With just -- I'll kind of just walk you through
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1 this. This is the existing property lines of the various
2 leaseholders within this unit. And -- and a lot of -- a lot
Page 32 0313og.txt 3 of those property lines come into the variances that we're 4 asking for you tonight. They're mostly all of the 5 leaseholders. There's the location of the proposed gas pad 6 site. There's the two proposed -- two proposed wells that 7 we've got permits from the Railroad Commission to drill. I'm 8 just going to kind of walk you through our thought process. 9 Part of your ordinance is -- talks about floodplain. The only 10 floodplain that touches our property is the FEMA floodplain 11 zone AE, it's shaded in blue, and the zone X shaded here in 12 light blue.
13 You have a requirement to be 500 foot setback from
14 your floodplain. That's one of your criteria in your gas and
15 oil ordinance. You have to be 500 foot setback from the
16 property line. That's essentially the whole property. I
17 mean, there's nowhere you can put a gas pad and be 500 foot
18 from all the property lines, but all the property lines are
19 members of the unit. Okay. Just zooming in, then there's
20 another setback. I'm kind of showing you all the constraints
21 of this particular 123 acres.
22 Another setback is 500 foot off of the -- what I've
23 done here is the future right-of-way of TxDOT, the take line
24 for the improvements to 1171. And what I don't show is
25 there's another setback 500 foot off the edge of the road,
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1 which is kind of inside this 500 foot setback. Then we've got 2 a 500 foot setback, which I'll walk you through this. There's
3 a 500 foot setback from the wells. There's a 500 foot setback 4 from the perimeter of the edge of the pad site itself.
Page 33 0313og.txt 5 There's a 1,000 foot well setback. 6 There's the two identified areas by both the Town 7 Staff and our -- our environment consultants. Waters of the 8 State, there's requirements of how far you're supposed to be 9 away from Waters of the State. And this area right here by 10 the definition of the Town for Upland Habitat has been 11 identified as Upland Habitat where we need to be 500 feet away 12 from the Upland Habitat area also across the road. So you can 13 see the challenges. 14 Transportation, I heard a lot of citizens that were
15 concerned about the traffic and stuff. That's one of the
16 things that we look at when we sit down with the gas companies
17 is how are you going to get your trucks in and out, and how
18 are they going to be the least effective on the citizens of
19 Flower Mound when we're doing this urban drilling. The route
20 for this particular pad site will come in from 377 and 35W.
21 It'll come in on 1171, turn south into the site and then go
22 back west also. In other words, it won't come any further
23 than the site to the east.
24 Now I'm going to get into the -- into the guts of
25 the setbacks. I've got me some cheat sheets. I think I've
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 37
1 got the right one. All right, I'll read it. One setback you 2 have before you tonight, distance from a tank battery 3 compressor location to a structure. We are -- we are 934 feet 4 away from the tank battery to the resident in Tour 18 which is
5 not part of the lease. The resident's not part of the lease. 6 The ordinance says 1,000 foot from that resident. The other
Page 34 0313og.txt 7 two are actual members of the lease, and they -- we can get a 8 variance down to 300 foot setback for those. You've got an 9 existing house, and you've got an existing building that's a 10 horse operation where people gather and stuff; so it's 11 considered a habitable building. 12 There's the distances. You've got a house, horse 13 stable and a house. That's one of the set of variances that 14 you have. Distance from the edge of a construction limits to 15 environmentally sensitive area. Well, as we showed, the two 16 little ponds are considered Waters of the State. That's
17 considered an environmentally sensitive area. That's 35 foot
18 to the first pond, a little greater than 100 foot to the
19 second pond. And if you draw a straight line from the edge of
20 the pad across the street on 1171 to the Upland Habitat area,
21 it's 260 feet. Your requirement is 500 feet from those
22 environmentally sensitive areas.
23 Next variance, distance from the wells to a resident
24 without mineral rights interest. Again, the well -- before
25 you saw the tank battery to the resident. Here it's 992 feet
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1 to the corner of the resident's house from the well heads, the 2 closest well head. And then to the residents that are part of 3 the lease, there's a caretaker's in the barn that's considered 4 a residence that's just -- just over 400 feet away. And the 5 resident to the south, Mr. Bliss, is 569 feet away. 6 Okay. Now, the distance from a well to a humanly
7 occupied building, the humanly occupied building is the stable 8 itself. And you can see how the -- the barn changes shades
Page 35 0313og.txt 9 right there. It went from the caretaker's to the actual barn 10 itself, so that's 3 -- it's just right at 300 feet, which is 11 the closest you can get per your ordinance to a habitable 12 building; not a resident, but a habitable building, 300 feet 13 away. And so you know, that -- that in itself dictated how 14 far we could push this thing to the east. 15 Okay, the next one, distance from a well to the 16 right-of-way and property line. Now, this got real tight 17 because there's a lot of property lines. And -- and I can 18 walk through if anybody has any questions I've got them
19 labeled. They're in your packets. There's the TxDOT
20 right-of-way line. There's the edge of the road. Here's
21 property lines. These are all property line distances
22 setbacks from within the property owners that are part of the
23 unit itself. But they're all spelled out in your packets, and
24 we can -- I can go over any individual one that you have.
25 Distance from a storage tank to a property line,
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1 same thing. We've got various property lines that are here 2 that the storage tank -- these are some of the -- some of the 3 lines. They're all to individual property lines that are 4 within the unit. Now, the one that does -- this is 362 feet 5 away from the property line on the opposite side of 1171 -- 6 Cross Timbers Road 1171. And those are all spelled out in 7 your packet also, and I just put it in a -- in a -- these are 8 all graphical because just reading it, it's hard to understand
9 what we're asking for. 10 All right. The next one, distance from a tank
Page 36 0313og.txt 11 battery compressor location to a resident. So the tank 12 battery to a resident, 933 feet, 534 feet, 510 feet. Even 13 doing these slides, I mean, they start becoming repetitious; 14 but the way your ordinance is written, I have to ask for the 15 same variances for the tank as I do the wells themselves; so 16 that's why there's so many. All right. And then again, the 17 stable. Now you've got -- we're 237 feet from the tank 18 battery to the ultimate right-of-way of 1171 to the tank 19 battery. 20 Now, this is the grading plan for this proposed pad.
21 There's an existing driveway that runs right here all the way
22 down. Right now there's an existing driveway that runs here
23 right now that has -- that's crepe myrtles on both sides.
24 This is a pasture. This is -- this is the tree line. You
25 know, we've worked close with Staff, worked close with the
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1 fire marshal on the safety aspects of the pad as well as
2 protecting the environmentally sensitive area. We followed
3 all the Town's rules as far as chain link fence from the tree 4 line here, the mulch berms, the grading of the site. 5 There was -- a lot of thought went into, you know, 6 what it looks like when you're driving down 1171. We're about 7 nine feet -- this pad's cut in here nine feet lower here. You 8 got to have a flat surface for your rig. This is -- this will 9 be widened, similar to the Loveless entrance down on 1171, 10 similar to the Crowe Wright entrance just to the west of here.
11 We'll have a cattle guard and entrance gate. 12 All these -- all these pad sites for the drilling
Page 37 0313og.txt 13 operations are secure. They have security guards, log in and 14 out. There'll be a secondary gate here so you can separate 15 the rig traffic and the construction of the wells with the 16 ownership of this driveway that's going to the south. Kind of 17 what -- and we can go back to any of these slides when you 18 have -- this is some pictures that I took. This is looking 19 from -- this is standing at the northeast corner looking back. 20 The pad site's going to be right in here. This is looking 21 straight in. The two wells are right there in the middle. 22 This is the tree line you're looking at that we're trying to
23 stay out of, the environmentally sensitive area.
24 This is the driveway that's going to be improved
25 right here, 40-foot driveway here. This is where the trucks
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 41
1 will come in and out. I went out and took some pictures of
2 the new erosion control measures that the Staff -- and when we
3 first started with the gas drilling ordinance we put silt
4 fence around everything. That didn't seem to really do the
5 trick and work real well. So these mulch berms are working -- 6 and this is after the rain here. This is at well number -- 7 pad number 6 at the Crowe Wright, and this is pad number 5. 8 And I'm just showing you how the silt is being stopped and -- 9 from moving off the site, and the mulch berms are really 10 working. 11 This one was just constructed. The orange fence 12 that you see here is also a requirement to where the
13 construction workers don't get back into the environmentally 14 sensitive area. You put your mulch berm right up next to it.
Page 38 0313og.txt 15 The water that comes off the pad or anything goes through the 16 mulch berm. It's a very effective BMP, probably one of the 17 most effective BMPs. It's actually recycling the wood chips 18 from any trees that have to be taken down. On this site 19 particularly, there won't be any trees taken down for this gas 20 pad site; but you know, I believe they have a few chips left 21 across the street that could be brought over to build the 22 mulch berms here. 23 Now, the biggest effect that this pad has on the 24 community and the area, and looking at the whole 123 acres of
25 where to put it in relationship to all the environmentally
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 42
1 sensitive areas, the existing residents, all the houses, you
2 know, you saw the pictures of where we -- we're out in this
3 field right here. Now, we're close to 1171. We're close to
4 the corridor -- the scenic corridor. So in following along
5 with your guidelines and your Master Plans build a -- back
6 here on the TxDOT -- the new TxDOT right-of-way will be a
7 split rail fence. Your -- your scenic right-of-way doesn't 8 allow any berms or anything. 9 We'd -- we proposed a berm to kind of help block, 10 but we didn't -- we took that out because that's not a re -- 11 that's not allowed in your -- your scenic corridor. But we 12 have went into -- I think I have to push that one time. We 13 went above and beyond to basically take what -- (inaudible) -- 14 but our landscape architect Ron Stewart's here today. You
15 probably heard him. We -- been here 15 years and done a lot 16 of stuff in Flower Mound. But this is what Braden Exploration
Page 39 0313og.txt 17 and the team is willing to do to go above and beyond to 18 landscape the front of this to camouflage, hide, make the 19 drive more aesthetic through there. 20 The green shaded area's how we -- we come in and we 21 resow the disturbed areas with -- primarily since you're not 22 building it, we've been going with like an Upland prairie mix 23 type stuff. It works real well around the pad sites. Down 24 here in the bottom, this is your -- your Town's required 25 landscaping around your tank batteries as well as your well
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 43
1 heads. Again, this will be a secured site. The water will
2 drain around the site, not through the site. The only water
3 that comes to the site is what hits this -- hits the gravel
4 pad site. It'll drain around. It'll go to this pond just
5 like it does today.
6 Virtually this pond is -- this pad site is kind of
7 right at the top of the hill. There's not a whole lot of
8 drainage area that comes to this site. And as Chairman Murphy
9 indicated -- or maybe it was Council Member Allen -- I mean, 10 Counsel Allen, there's criteria that we try to -- we try to go 11 through. And I'm going to read this, and so we can go through 12 it because this same thought process is on every single pad 13 site we bring before the Commission as to why we feel as a 14 team this is the best spot on this 123 acres. 15 There are special circumstances existing on the 16 property in which the applications made relative to size,
17 shape, area, topography, surrounding conditions and locations 18 that do not apply generally to the other properties in the
Page 40 0313og.txt 19 vicinity. There do exist special circumstances that do not -- 20 do not apply generally to other properties in the area. This 21 lease is 123 acres, has various mineral rights owners 22 associated with it. The eastern half is all residential. The 23 western half is residential and floodplain. 24 The variance is necessary to permit the Applicant 25 the same rights in the use of this property that are presently
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 44
1 enjoyed by other properties in the vicinity and zone but which
2 rights are denied to the property owner on which the
3 application is made. Variances are necessary no matter where
4 we place the pad site to explore this -- to explore, develop
5 and produce minerals for these mineral rights owners, as we've
6 shown in the various exhibits.
7 Granting the variance on the specific property will
8 not adversely affect any of the features of the comprehensive
9 master plan of the Town. Granting variances will not
10 adversely affect any other feature of the comprehensive
11 master plan. Granting variances will aid in achieving the 12 goals of the master plan. And this is in the Conservation 13 District, so as indicated by some speakers before, within 300 14 feet of this well there won't be anything built. And the 15 surface owners who are making this application to drill this 16 pad site understand that. It's their property. 17 The variance -- the variance, if granted, will be no 18 material detriment to the public's welfare or injury to the
19 use, enjoyment or the value of the property in the vicinity. 20 The other properties in the vicinity are participants in the
Page 41 0313og.txt 21 proposed gas unit. That's shown in my exhibit. Whether the 22 operations proposed are reasonable under the circumstances and 23 conditions prevailing in the vicinity considering the 24 particular locations and character of the improvements located 25 there. We believe the proposed operations are reasonable,
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 45
1 considering the development of the surrounding property.
2 Whether the drilling of such wells would conflict
3 with the orderly growth and development of the Town. Drilling
4 of the wells will blend in with the orderly growth of the
5 property and of course with the Town's vision of the Cross
6 Timbers and the Conservation District, therefore keeping this
7 property open. Whether other alternative well site locations.
8 Any other alternative well site location on this property
9 would require variances. It's a floodplain, environmentally
10 sensitive, property lines, etcetera. There's no place on this
11 property that we looked at as a group that would be better
12 than the one we're bringing -- that we feel we're bringing
13 before you today. 14 And the list goes on. Whether the operations 15 proposed are consistent with the health, safety and welfare of 16 the public when and if conducted in accordance with the oil 17 and gas or combined well permit conditions to be imposed. 18 Yes, we are consistent with the health, safety and welfare of 19 the public, providing for emergency access and providing low 20 impact -- and providing a low impact traffic route to the
21 site. 22 Whether the operations proposed are consistent with
Page 42 0313og.txt 23 protecting the ecological integrity and environmental quality, 24 including protection of the surface and ground water sources 25 or potentially impacted environmentally sensitive areas.
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 46
1 Locally accepted BMPs are provided to protect the surface and 2 ground water sources. Protective construction fencing is also
3 provided to protect the existing trees around the perimeter of
4 the proposed pad, and a storm water pollution prevention plan
5 has been prepared and will be followed and monitored. Now,
6 that's not required by the gas and oil industry. That's --
7 that's volunteer; and quite honestly, I won't get up before
8 y'all without insisting that my client prepare and monitor one
9 of those storm water pollution prevention plans, being that
10 we're in an urban area. Even though the State doesn't require
11 them to follow it, they've all been willing to do it; and so
12 we've provided that.
13 Whether there is reasonable access to the Town's
14 fire personal -- personnel and fire fighting equipment. We
15 are providing an access point for emergency vehicles as 16 required by the fire marshal. Twelve-inch water line on FM 17 1171. 1171 is available as a source for water for the fire 18 protection. It's right -- virtually there's a fire hydrant 19 right across the street. And the list goes on. 20 Whether the impact upon the adjacent properties and 21 the general public by operations conducted in compliance with 22 the gas and oil or combined well permit conditions are
23 reasonable and justified balancing the following factors: The 24 reasonable use of the mineral estate by the mineral estate
Page 43 0313og.txt 25 owners to explore, develop and produce the minerals; and B,
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 47
1 the availability of alternate pad sites, alternate drill 2 sites. The adjacent properties are generally residential and 3 part of the mineral estate. The property to the north is 4 residential and part of the 970 acre Crowe Wright gas unit, so
5 they're in a different gas unit across the street, for the
6 most part, to the north and to the west. Any other proposed
7 location would require variances also to explore, develop and
8 produce these minerals.
9 The recommendation of the oil and gas inspector --
10 and he'll be up here. But we have worked with the oil and gas
11 inspector locating the proposed pad in an area that made the
12 most sense when looking at the press -- at the present gas
13 exploration goals while preserving as much of the
14 environmentally sensitive area as possible.
15 Thank you for listening to me. I'll be happy to go
16 back at any point in time to any slides if there's any
17 questions by you or the audience. 18 CHAIR MURPHY: Thank you, Bobby. Before we go 19 on, I know you may have some questions. The way we will 20 follow the procedure is the Applicant presents his, the Board 21 will ask specific questions for clarification, the Staff comes 22 and gives their presentation; and after the Staff does their 23 presentation, then we will accept questions from the audience. 24 So just hang onto your questions. You can write them down so
25 you won't forget them, and we can take it from there. Okay?
Page 44 0313og.txt CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 48
1 So at this point in time, does anyone on the Board have a 2 question? 3 BOARD MEMBER RICH: I do. Can you go back to 4 the graph of all the houses, please? Yes, that one. The 5 street -- the road in which the trucking -- the trucks are 6 going to access is directly to the left of the yellow -- 7 MR. DOLLAK: That's correct.
8 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Okay. That's better.
9 MR. DOLLAK: That's the transportation route.
10 There it is right there. They're going to access --
11 CHAIR MURPHY: Go back --
12 BOARD MEMBER RICH: No. Go back to the other
13 one, please. I would like to look at the residences around
14 there, please.
15 MR. DOLLAK: This --
16 BOARD MEMBER RICH: If you could back up
17 just --
18 MR. DOLLAK: Back one more?
19 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Yes, please. That one. 20 That'd be great. The house directly -- or the dwelling that's 21 white and rectangular directly south, correct, is that a house 22 inhabited by humans? 23 MR. DOLLAK: Yes. It's Mr. Bliss's house. 24 BOARD MEMBER RICH: All right. Are they 25 accessing through that specific road?
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 49
Page 45 0313og.txt
1 MR. DOLLAK: Yes. This driveway right here. 2 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Is it our understanding 3 there's going to be an exterior gate before you get to the 4 gate of the well pad site where -- 5 MR. DOLLAK: That's correct. 6 BOARD MEMBER RICH: So it's a double gate 7 situation -- 8 MR. DOLLAK: Correct.
9 BOARD MEMBER RICH: -- where he will have to
10 access a gate, and then there'll be an additional gate; so the
11 land owners can come through a gate?
12 MR. DOLLAK: He has to access one gate.
13 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Right.
14 MR. DOLLAK: But the gas guys'll have to
15 access two gates.
16 BOARD MEMBER RICH: The gas will be two. So
17 they are using this common road --
18 MR. DOLLAK: Correct.
19 BOARD MEMBER RICH: -- with the trucking --
20 with the trucks that will be coming and going in accessing
21 their property. The other people access through Post? 22 MR. DOLLAK: There's a -- there's a house here 23 that accesses this other driveway that's lined by the -- what 24 are those called -- crepe myrtles. There's crepe myrtles 25 lined up. That's a little dirt driveway that comes down to
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 50
1 this house right here. Page 46 0313og.txt 2 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Oh, okay. So that is a 3 house? 4 MR. DOLLAK: I believe this is Mr. Bliss's 5 house. I believe this -- Kathy, help me out. I don't know if 6 there's a resident down here or if this is an operation. 7 There's a lot of boats and stuff. I think they do a little 8 repair work. This is a boat -- 9 (Inaudible speaker from audience.) 10 MR. LATHROM: Please come to the microphone. 11 MR. DOLLAK: What's that?
12 MR. LATHROM: Have her come to the microphone,
13 please, Bobby.
14 MR. DOLLAK: Okay. It's a -- it's a metal
15 barn.
16 CHAIR MURPHY: So says --
17 MR. DOLLAK: So says Kathy.
18 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Start --
19 MR. DOLLAK: Tell her your name, how many kids
20 you have.
21 MS. ANIELLO [PHONETIC]: My name is Katherine
22 Aniello. I'm with Braden Exploration, 307 West 7th Street,
23 Fort Worth. I don't have any kids. But I do have a master's 24 degree. That is a metal barn which is part of the (inaudible) 25 Lease on tract two.
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 51
1 BOARD MEMBER RICH: It's not --
2 CHAIR MURPHY: What's the name of the lease? 3 Boney? Page 47 0313og.txt 4 MS. ANIELLO: The Boney [phonetic]. 5 (Inaudible speaker from audience.) 6 MS. ANIELLO: Oh, is it Jameson's? I'm sorry. 7 BOARD MEMBER RICH: And that -- 8 MR. DOLLAK: This is the Boney Lease here. 9 This is a separate lease here. 10 MS. ANIELLO: Oh, I'm sorry. 11 MR. DOLLAK: And this is Mr. Bliss. 12 CHAIR MURPHY: So the outline you have there, 13 those are leases; or are those properties?
14 MS. ANIELLO: They're tracts.
15 MR. DOLLAK: Those are tracts -- tracts of
16 land.
17 BOARD MEMBER RICH: So that is a non --
18 nonhuman occupied?
19 MR. DOLLAK: Exact -- that's what -- that's
20 right. Because this -- this is the occupied house here.
21 CHAIR MURPHY: And Post Oak Road is that road
22 to the west or --
23 MR. DOLLAK: Post Oak Road is right down this
24 property line here.
25 CHAIR MURPHY: And what's the road on -- to
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 52
1 the left? 2 MR. DOLLAK: This one?
3 CHAIR MURPHY: No. Keep going. 4 MR. DOLLAK: This one?
5 CHAIR MURPHY: Right there, uh-huh. Page 48 0313og.txt 6 MR. DOLLAK: That's the driveway to their 7 house right here. 8 CHAIR MURPHY: Okay. 9 MR. DOLLAK: It's right across from Tour 18. 10 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Are they currently 11 drilling on that site? 12 MR. DOLLAK: On this site up here? 13 BOARD MEMBER RICH: No, no. South -- 14 MR. DOLLAK: Down here, no. Oh, no. This is 15 their operation. They've got buffalo and emus and all kinds
16 of stuff.
17 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Okay. So all those are
18 either dwellings or they're farm -- barn dwellings?
19 MR. DOLLAK: Yes. This is the -- this is the
20 primary house right here; and I'm not sure what this is, a
21 barn or something
22 BOARD MEMBER RICH: They are not part of this
23 lease or --
24 MR. DOLLAK: They are part of this lease.
25 BOARD MEMBER RICH: They are part of this
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 53
1 lease? 2 MR. DOLLAK: Everything you see in the red, 3 this is the lease -- 4 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Got it.
5 MR. DOLLAK: -- 123 acres of the lease right 6 here.
7 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Okay. Thank you. Page 49 0313og.txt 8 CHAIR MURPHY: Who owns the ponds that you 9 were pointing out that was the environ -- environmentally 10 sensitive areas? 11 MR. DOLLAK: This is owned by Boney. This is 12 owned by Mr. Bliss here. 13 CHAIR MURPHY: Boneys and Bliss, okay. 14 MR. DOLLAK: Correct. 15 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Mr. Dollak, what -- what 16 water source are you accessing? Are you accessing that -- I'm 17 assuming that pond is not being accessed?
18 MR. DOLLAK: Well, this -- this pond right
19 here is -- is potentially going to be the frack pond. But
20 we're going to buy water from the City out of a fire hydrant
21 here, bring it down the road, through the culvert here, back
22 over to supply water for this site. So we're going to buy
23 water from the City. At this time that's the game plan.
24 That's the proposed plan, to buy the water from the City out
25 of their 12-inch line and supplement this pond in the fracking
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 54
1 process. 2 BOARD MEMBER RICH: So the actual fire hydrant 3 is north of 1171? 4 MR. DOLLAK: Yes, yes. It's on -- your 5 fire -- your line -- the end of your system comes here and 6 goes up into Tour 18. That's the end of your line right now.
7 BOARD MEMBER RICH: So that could -- that 8 possibly will be a frack pond?
9 MR. DOLLAK: Yes. Unless they work an Page 50 0313og.txt 10 agreement similar to what Red Oak did with Tour 18 across the 11 street on some of their ponds. That's possible, too. 12 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Okay. 13 CHAIR MURPHY: With the blacked area, all 14 those people or all those sections are part owners of this 15 particular lease? 16 MR. DOLLAK: That's correct. 17 CHAIR MURPHY: Are those all individual owners 18 of the lease? 19 MR. DOLLAK: That's -- I believe so, yes. And
20 they're listed on the -- all the owners of the lease are
21 listed on the cover sheet of your packets, the cover sheet of
22 my plans with their addresses and phone numbers.
23 CHAIR MURPHY: And what's the building just
24 east of the yellow pad?
25 MR. DOLLAK: This? This is a horse operation
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 55
1 where they ride, train. They do have a caretaker's -- as was
2 part of -- in your report that Dustan came up with is back in, 3 I believe, 1996. There was an SUP to have a caretakers in 4 the -- 5 CHAIR MURPHY: Barn. 6 MR. DOLLAK: -- in the barn right here. And 7 that's some of those variances that we were pointing to as 8 your ordinance is written.
9 BOARD MEMBER RICH: For those people who are 10 not real informed, we'll state the fact that Code differs for
11 land owners and mineral right owners, that -- well, mineral Page 51 0313og.txt 12 right owners that are also land owners. There is a different 13 Code than if you are a nonmineral right owner. If you own 14 mineral rights and you also own the property, the exploration 15 company has the option, the right to place their well and 16 their whatever pad sites closer if you are a mineral right 17 owner. So if you find that our -- we are varying from what 18 you might assume to be the facts, it is because on this piece 19 of property the property owners are also the mineral right 20 owners. Just to clarify. 21 MR. LATHROM: Vice Chair Rich, let me also
22 add, those mineral owners are also participants in this
23 particular well site. That's -- that's the rest of that
24 story.
25 CHAIR MURPHY: Any other questions for
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 56
1 Mr. Dollak? Thank you, Bobby.
2 MR. DOLLAK: I'll be available.
3 CHAIR MURPHY: You'll be available,
4 absolutely. 5 MR. DOLLAK: I don't have a chair, but I'll be 6 available. There's one. 7 CHAIR MURPHY: Okay. Now we'll have a 8 presentation from the Town Staff. 9 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: Madame Chairman, before 10 we -- the Staff doesn't get a chance to go through the job
11 interview process like we did for stewardship. So I was going 12 to have either Matthew, Dustan, or both just state for the
13 public your backgrounds in the environmental services Page 52 0313og.txt 14 department. 15 MR. COMPTON: Sure. 16 MR. LATHROM: Members of the Board, let me 17 interrupt. We have a request from those people sitting out in 18 the lobby that you speak up a little bit louder or closer to 19 your microphone so you can be heard in the lobby as well, 20 please. 21 MR. WOODS: Thank you, Commissioner Walker. 22 My name is Matthew Woods. I've been with the Town 23 approximately seven years and the director of environmental
24 services, which encompasses gas wells, tree ordinance, health
25 department code enforcement and a couple of other things. But
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 57
1 I defer to Dustan.
2 MR. COMPTON: Thank you, Madame Chair, Board
3 Members. My name's Dustan Compton, environmental review
4 analyst, slash, oil and gas inspector for the Town of Flower
5 Mound. I've been with the Town for three and a half years.
6 My background is in environmental management, and a master's 7 degree in applied geography, water resources management 8 specialty. I've been doing this oil and gas work ever since 9 I've been here with the Town, gone through all of the 10 ordinance changes. I've studied every other community in this 11 area, across the nation. We have instituted some of the -- 12 you know, the better technologies and best management
13 practices that we know of. And I don't know much else -- I 14 have two kids, and I like changing diapers.
15 Okay. I'll try and keep this brief and just run Page 53 0313og.txt 16 through it as fast as I can, and I may skip over a few slides. 17 Setbacks have already been identified, but I'll hit some of 18 the -- the key components. The Applicant is requesting 19 variances to environmentally sensitive areas on the Upland 20 Habitat and Waters of the State are within the 500 foot 21 setback measured from the edge of disturbance. Residences 22 without mineral interests within a 1,000 foot setback, 23 residences with mineral interests within the 500 foot setback, 24 human occupied buildings at 500 feet, property line within 500 25 feet, public road and right-of-way within 500 feet, tank
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 58
1 batteries and residences within 1,000 feet, tank batteries and
2 human occupied buildings within 500 feet, storage tanks and
3 the right-of-way within 500 feet, and storage tanks and
4 property lines within 500 feet.
5 The proposed site resides within the Cross Timbers
6 Conservation Development District, and the current zoning is
7 agricultural. Essentially the outer boundaries of that purple
8 layer you see there is the boundaries of the lease. Our 9 parcel date is a little different from what the Applicant had. 10 This is a -- just the aerial of the two gas wells as well as 11 the 500 foot and the 1,000 foot setbacks. Here's the 12 environmentally sensitive area survey that was done for the 13 property. It's already been shown that the Upland Habitat is 14 located across the street on another property, and the two
15 ponds within the 500 feet meet the requirement of Waters of 16 the State.
17 There's the definition of Waters of the State. The Page 54 0313og.txt 18 pad, the edge of construction is within 35 and 100 feet from 19 the ponds. Along with the erosion control plan, the compost 20 berm as well as the seeding, and there will be protective 21 fencing along that tree line row where no construction 22 activity will be getting through that area. Everything will 23 be localized on the pad site itself. The Upland Habitat 24 variance, there's the definition for Upland Habitat. The pad 25 site located approximately 260 feet from the Upland Habitat
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 59
1 that is across the road, across 1171. So -- and all of the
2 water drains to the southwest, so we don't anticipate any
3 impact to the Upland Habitat. Just an aerial showing the
4 location and the setback distances.
5 CHAIR MURPHY: Would you go back to that one a
6 minute, please?
7 MR. COMPTON: Sure.
8 BOARD MEMBER RICH: There's no ESA south of
9 1171 there?
10 MR. COMPTON: Just the Waters of the State. 11 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Okay. Other than Waters 12 of the State, we don't have tree lines, we don't have anything 13 ESA, right? 14 MR. COMPTON: Obviously there are trees, and 15 those trees do provide value, you know, from all range of 16 value that even some habitat is in there. But we have
17 specific guidelines and definitions of what we call 18 environmentally sensitive areas within our Smart growth
19 criteria, and none of that area meets that definition. A Page 55 0313og.txt 20 residence owned by a person without the mineral interest in 21 the application, it's a 1,000 foot setback with a possibility 22 of a variance before this Board down to 500 feet. And the gas 23 wells are located approximately 560 feet and 992 feet from 24 residences that are owned by people that do not have a mineral 25 interest in the application.
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 60
1 The first one that's 992 feet from the closest well
2 is the first house on the right I guess in Tour 18. It is a
3 1,000 foot setback, so they are within eight feet of that
4 setback. And the second residence that's within 1,000 feet
5 that does not have a mineral interest is the residence
6 directly south of the gas wells. That's 560 feet. This
7 residence owner also owns the property -- the surface rights
8 of where this gas well is being located. There's a letter in
9 your packet that states that he is in support of this gas
10 well. And I -- and it's my understanding that a surface use
11 agreement has been developed with the Applicant and this
12 owner. 13 BOARD MEMBER RICH: But he doesn't -- he is 14 not a mineral right owner? 15 MR. COMPTON: That is correct. 16 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Thank you. 17 MR. COMPTON: The second setback regarding 18 residences -- we'll talk about persons without mineral
19 interests in the application. Well, it's supposed to say with 20 mineral interests. I apologize for that. So it's a 500 foot
21 setback automatically if you are a residence owner with a Page 56 0313og.txt 22 mineral interest in the application from your residence. And 23 we're looking at the caretaker guard -- caretaker quarters on 24 the eastern edge of the commercial stable boarding facility. 25 It's approximately 400 feet from the nearest gas well. So the
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 61
1 owner of that building or residence is a mineral owner in the
2 application, so they are able to ask for a variance below 500
3 feet but never less than 300 feet. And the gas well is
4 located approximately 400 feet from that section of that
5 building that is designed and used as a caretaker quarters.
6 The human occupied building is that same commercial
7 boarding facility for the horses. Gas wells are located --
8 the gas well nearest to it is located 300 feet from that
9 commercial boarding stable. That commercial boarding stable
10 does meet the definition of that human occupied building, and
11 it is located at 300 feet. A variance is not allowed less
12 than 300 feet. The setback starts at 500 feet with variances
13 not allowed below 300 feet, and the gas well is located
14 exactly 300 feet from that human occupied building whose owner 15 is a mineral interest in the application. 16 The property line setback is a 500 foot setback. 17 There is not a minimum that you can go to a property line in 18 the oil and gas ordinance. So we identified all of the 19 property lines within -- within 500 feet of this application. 20 So if you take the closest well to each property line, the
21 surface owner that has -- that does not have a mineral 22 interest in the application but does have an agreement to have
23 his property used for this gas well operation, his property is Page 57 0313og.txt 24 divided into approximately three and a half acre and a six and 25 a half acre tracts. So there's a property line that goes
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 62
1 right down the middle of this property here. 2 The closest gas well to his own property line is 24 3 feet. The closest gas well to the property line to the east
4 is 186 feet. The closest gas well to the property line to the
5 southeast corner is 260 feet. The closest gas well property
6 line to the west is 159 feet. The closest property line to
7 the north is 279 feet. And the property line across 1171 is
8 379 feet. There's a 500 foot setback from a public road and
9 right-of-way, and the wells are proposed to be located
10 approximately 321 feet from Cross Timbers Road 1171 and 246
11 from the -- feet from the ultimate TxDOT right-of-way.
12 There's a 1,000 foot setback from associated tank
13 batteries, compression facilities, well facilities and
14 equipment to any public park or from any residence, religious
15 institution, public building, hospital building or school. So
16 the tank batteries and compression facilities, well facilities 17 and equipment being proposed are within 1,000 feet of 18 residences; specifically 510 feet to the caretaker's area, 19 quarters, 534 feet to Mr. Bliss's residence here that the gas 20 well is on the surface, and 933 feet from the Tour 18 home. 21 Tank batteries, 500 feet from a human occupied 22 building setback. The tank batteries are approximately 404
23 feet from the closest edge of the commercial boarding 24 facility. Storage tanks and right-of-way, storage tanks have
25 their own setback as well as tank batteries. There's a 500 Page 58 0313og.txt
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 63
1 foot setback to any public right-of-way, so the storage tanks 2 are located approximately 237 feet from the ultimate FM 1171 3 right-of-way. 4 Storage tanks and property line, so a similar 5 situation with the gas wells and the property lines. All the
6 property lines are coming into play here. So the closest
7 storage tank to the interior property line is 131 feet, to the
8 eastern property line, 300 feet, to the southeastern property
9 line is 312 feet, to the southern property line is clipping
10 that 500 foot distance, it's 462, 50 feet from the property
11 line to the west, 275 feet to the property line to the north
12 and approximately 362 to the property line across the street
13 to the north.
14 And the following is just a recap of all the
15 variances that are being requested this evening for this
16 Armstrong Huggins case. Any questions?
17 CHAIR MURPHY: With the storage tanks, tank
18 batteries, does it have the same criteria for the residence 19 with the mineral rights as does the web -- the well sites? 20 MR. COMPTON: The tank batteries do have 21 limitations of where they can be reduced down to. 500 feet if 22 a residence does not have mineral interest and 300 feet if the 23 residence does have mineral interest. 24 CHAIR MURPHY: So that is the same as the well
25 pad?
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 Page 59 0313og.txt 64
1 MR. COMPTON: That is correct. 2 CHAIR MURPHY: Okay. 3 MR. COMPTON: But those same distances do not 4 apply to storage tanks. Storage tanks is a separate technical 5 requirement of the ordinance. 6 CHAIR MURPHY: But they can be reduced if 7 the --
8 MR. COMPTON: They can be.
9 CHAIR MURPHY: -- residence has mineral
10 rights?
11 MR. COMPTON: It doesn't -- that situation
12 doesn't come into play for storage tanks.
13 CHAIR MURPHY: Okay.
14 MR. COMPTON: Storage tanks are only listed to
15 property lines and to right-of-way and to -- and to
16 floodplain. Tank batteries are setback from residences.
17 CHAIR MURPHY: Okay.
18 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: Just for clarification
19 under the tank batteries and residence section, you mentioned
20 the updated noise management plan would have to be submitted. 21 There's some to be do -- TBD kind of things, and it could 22 ultimately be an amended permit at some point in the future? 23 Could you just clarify that for the record? 24 MR. COMPTON: Sure. The noise management plan 25 that was submitted and is approved for the gas wells and the
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 65
Page 60 0313og.txt
1 drilling and the fracturing of those wells, the updated site 2 plans identify compressors within that tank battery area. And 3 if this permit is approved tonight, the permit will be 4 released; and it will not allow for the installation of those 5 compressors until an updated noise management plan has been 6 submitted and reviewed per the Town Code. 7 BOARD MEMBER WARD: Yes, I had one question. 8 Our packets had a letter from Tim Robinson at 4500 Tour 18 9 Drive. And I just wanted to clarify, is that the house that
10 was to the north of the well site across --
11 MR. COMPTON: That is correct. That is at
12 Tour 18.
13 BOARD MEMBER WARD: Okay. And so he does not
14 -- that is the property that does not have mineral rights?
15 MR. COMPTON: He is -- he is not in this
16 lease.
17 BOARD MEMBER WARD: He's not in the lease,
18 okay. All right, thank you.
19 BOARD MEMBER RICH: He has mineral rights in
20 another lease but not this lease that we're speaking about.
21 If we could go back to the property line limits where we had a
22 minimum I think of 15 feet at one location -- 24 feet. It 23 appeared that what you were trying to tell us is that this man 24 's property is actually two properties, so therefore there is 25 a property line; but he's actually the owner of both
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 66
1 properties?
Page 61 0313og.txt 2 MR. COMPTON: That is correct. 3 BOARD MEMBER RICH: And that 24 foot is 4 actually to a property line, but then you go further south and 5 he owns more of the property? 6 MR. COMPTON: That is correct. He owns 7 essentially -- it's a -- you know, this rectangle here, this 8 ten-acre rectangle. 9 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Oh, the whole thing all 10 the way down? 11 MR. COMPTON: That is correct.
12 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Okay.
13 MR. COMPTON: And this property is in this
14 shape. This three and a half acres is here, and the rest of
15 the six and a half or so acres is there; but he owns this
16 entire rectangle.
17 BOARD MEMBER RICH: And once again, can you
18 point out the residences that are located on that property?
19 MR. COMPTON: Just right here, outside 560
20 feet away from the nearest gas well.
21 BOARD MEMBER RICH: And he is not the
22 mineral -- sorry. He's not -- yeah. He is not the mineral
23 right owner. He is the land owner with a lease agreement
24 to -- for the exploration company? 25 MR. COMPTON: A surface --
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 67
1 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Surface lease agreement -- 2 MR. COMPTON: -- use agreement. 3 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Use agreement or lease?
Page 62 0313og.txt 4 MR. COMPTON: I believe that's the correct 5 term. 6 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Surface use. Okay, thank 7 you. 8 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: And also for the record, 9 the floodplain issue is not an issue, correct? 10 MR. COMPTON: That is correct. 11 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: They're beyond the 500 12 foot setback requirement per the ordinance? 13 MR. COMPTON: That is correct. If you draw
14 the 500 foot buffer from the edge of disturbance, there is
15 FEMA floodplain that is through this Army Corps of Engineer
16 property here. And a flood study was submitted to engineering
17 services, and it was determined that the floodplain is outside
18 of that 500 foot setback; so a variance is not needed.
19 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: And on the Waters of the
20 State again, minimal to no impact based on the plan that was
21 submitted and your review?
22 MR. COMPTON: Yeah. The drainage area is
23 pretty small. With the BMPs and with the operator staying out
24 of those areas, I don't anticipate any impact to those.
25 They're essentially stock ponds that fill up and may overflow
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 68
1 during heavier rain events. 2 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: And in the Upland 3 Habitat review, no impact anticipated because it's within
4 private prop -- I notice because it's within private property 5 also.
Page 63 0313og.txt 6 MR. COMPTON: Yes, in private property. 7 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: And it's not involved in 8 the lease, so no construction -- it won't be disturbed? It's 9 an area that's beyond that? 10 MR. COMPTON: It's not really involved with 11 this operation. 12 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: Okay. I'm just going 13 through my checklist here to make sure we get -- 14 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Dustan, did you advise the 15 exploration company that if they -- that -- did you advise
16 them to drop -- or potentially look at dropping the pad site
17 eight feet further to the south in order not to impact that
18 1,000 foot residence line? Just drop the pad further to the
19 south?
20 MR. COMPTON: I personally did not advise,
21 but --
22 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Did you suggest? Did you
23 recommend? Did you talk about it?
24 MR. COMPTON: Perhaps not in those terms, but
25 discussions did occur of the location of those gas wells; and
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 69
1 the Applicant's just chosen that location for their reasons. 2 BOARD MEMBER RICH: We will ask the Applicant 3 what those reasons are then. 4 MS. ANIELLO: We -- we're -- I'm sorry. Kathy 5 Aniello, Braden Exploration. As we discussed earlier, we're
6 pretty landlocked as far as where we could put that pad. And 7 we went out several times with Mr. Bliss and agreed on that --
Page 64 0313og.txt 8 that specific location, the dimensions being where they are. 9 Yes, we could move the well heads eight feet to the south, and 10 that wouldn't cause us a problem. We can't move the pad 11 anymore obviously because we really have nowhere to go. 12 We did make some attempts to contact Mr. Robinson 13 and talk to him about getting a waiver. We felt since he was 14 already leased with another company that he would be amenable 15 to talking with us about it, and he was not. So -- 16 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Did he decline to talk to 17 you about it?
18 MS. ANIELLO: No.
19 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Or are you saying he did
20 not return your calls?
21 MS. ANIELLO: He -- he directed us to his
22 representative. We talked to his representative who said they
23 will sign a waiver if we pay them several thousand dollars to
24 do so. We said well, we didn't feel that that was a
25 reasonable request. So his response was unless you meet our
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 70
1 terms, then move -- move the well. 2 BOARD MEMBER RICH: And is there no way to 3 move the well further eight feet south without impacting the 4 tree line? 5 MR. DOLLAK: Well, that's the reason why it's 6 where it's at. You know, it's 300 feet to the east as far as 7 we could go. And then this tree line that we're trying to
8 protect along here, if you move the wells we're going to 9 have -- she said we can't move the pad without invading the
Page 65 0313og.txt 10 trees. We're going to have to move the pad to get enough pad 11 for the rig to set up. So we're -- and we're taking the 12 big -- it's all the way across the street. When you look back 13 here, you can barely see the house from the pad site when 14 you're standing right on the well. It's a technical thing. 15 We certainly could. 16 I think you would lose -- you'd lose some of that 17 environment -- though it's not dubbed environmentally 18 sensitive, but there is a growth of trees there. And you saw 19 on the pictures that I took and the aerials that we're trying
20 to be sensitive to those trees as a backdrop for this well
21 site.
22 BOARD MEMBER RICH: And you're -- and we're
23 noting that we're -- that your location of the pad is within
24 eight feet of the property line, not of the house but of the
25 property line to Mr. Robinson's property; is that correct?
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 71
1 MR. DOLLAK: No. It's the corner of the
2 house. 3 BOARD MEMBER RICH: It's at the corner of the 4 house. 5 (Inaudible due to multiple speakers.) 6 BOARD MEMBER RICH: So actually to the 7 structure. How many acres does Mr. Robinson own? 8 MR. DOLLAK: I'm not sure. It's an acre, acre 9 and a half. Most of those lots are an acre, acre and a half.
10 I think most of them are closer to an acre and a half. 11 BOARD MEMBER RICH: That is within Tour 18?
Page 66 0313og.txt 12 MR. DOLLAK: Yes. 13 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Thank you. 14 BOARD MEMBER MELUGIN: The Robinson residence 15 is 992 feet from the pad. There's -- am I correct, there's 16 one that's also 560 feet? 17 MR. DOLLAK: That's Mr. Bliss. 18 BOARD MEMBER MELUGIN: That's Mr. Bliss, all 19 right. Sorry. Thank you. 20 BOARD MEMBER RICH: For the record, we have a 21 letter from Mr. Robinson stating that he is opposed to
22 granting of any variance which would allow Braden Exploration
23 to drill the subject gas well within 1,000 feet of the
24 residence. As noted, Mr. Robinson is also part of the
25 Robinson Law Group.
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 72
1 CHAIR MURPHY: Thank you, Mr. Compton.
2 MR. COMPTON: You're welcome.
3 BOARD MEMBER RICH: I do actually have a quick
4 little question. The graph -- it varies just a little bit, 5 the map varies just a little bit. And we're seeing a little 6 -- a little pocket on the -- the boat -- boating property. 7 What is that property right there? No, come down south. Down 8 south. 9 MR. COMPTON: Here? 10 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Right there, yeah. 11 MR. COMPTON: Yeah. Our parcel data only
12 follows -- for some reason these roads are separate parcels 13 that is not really mapped in our system. But the lease is
Page 67 0313og.txt 14 along -- includes that line all the way up to that line across 15 the road. That entire boundary is part of the lease. That's 16 just part of -- our parcelator is just kind of lacking in 17 that -- 18 BOARD MEMBER RICH: So you are in agreement on 19 the mapping? 20 MR. COMPTON: Yes. 21 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Thank you. 22 MR. LATHROM: Vice Chair Rich, I can clarify 23 the roads in the Tour 18 subdivision are private roads; and so
24 that's why it probably should be platted or shown differently
25 than what you would typically see. So they are owned by the
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 73
1 home owner's association.
2 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Is that part of Tour 18
3 south of 1171?
4 MR. LATHROM: That is -- it's not part of Tour
5 18 there? That's a private driveway I suspect then.
6 MR. COMPTON: This -- the west road is a 7 private road. Post Oak Road is maintained by the Town, but 8 the minerals are reserved by the Post Oak HOA. 9 CHAIR MURPHY: The HOA reserves the minerals 10 and not the individual home owners? 11 MR. COMPTON: Or the development I believe or 12 -- yeah. It is the HOA that has the mineral rights to their 13 pond lot down here and the road as well.
14 CHAIR MURPHY: Okay, thank you. Thank you, 15 Mr. Compton.
Page 68 0313og.txt 16 MR. COMPTON: You're welcome. 17 CHAIR MURPHY: Okay. It's 9:26. We need to 18 take a break. We will reconvene at 9:35. 19 (A recess was taken.) 20 CHAIR MURPHY: Now then, at this part of the 21 presentation is the question and answer period; and let me 22 review how we will do that. After the presentation by the 23 Applicant we'll ask for questions from the audience. All 24 questions are to be directed to the Chairperson who will 25 determine the appropriate person to respond. Those asking
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 74
1 questions will be allowed three minutes to state their
2 question, and those responding to questions will be allowed
3 three minutes for their response. The Chairperson may provide
4 that the duplication of questions will not be allowed and in
5 this regard determine that redundant questions have already
6 been answered.
7 Okay. If you have a question, I would like for you
8 to step to the lectern, state your name and address and your 9 question. 10 MR. ALCOT: I promise you I will not be 11 emotional or talk about children, although I am a little 12 offended about that, because our children are going to run 13 this town and run this country in the next generation. 14 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Name? 15 MR. ALCOT: Again, Eddie Alcot, 2829 Aberdeen
16 Drive, Woodlake Estates. Question, public roadway 1171, if I 17 heard correctly -- again, my memory is not the greatest, never
Page 69 0313og.txt 18 was -- not a very traveled roadway? I'm using the wrong term, 19 but I heard something about not that traveled, low impact 20 road. Well, I've taken that road off of 35 coming from south 21 and north coming home from work, and it is a very impact road 22 as far as cars and traffic. 23 My question is how many trucks, ballpark, because we 24 don't know once you start drilling, are going to be coming in 25 and out of there every day? My guess is 30 to 60. And how
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 75
1 are they going to be able to control that when they -- when
2 I've seen pictures in the past in Grand Prairie and Fort Worth
3 and other areas of Texas of them not backing up down the road
4 a half a mile or so?
5 CHAIR MURPHY: Okay. Dustan or Mr. Dollak,
6 would y'all like to answer that question. Where's Bobby? Oh,
7 there he is.
8 MR. DOLLAK: Be happy to answer it. I didn't
9 mean a low impact road. I meant a low impact truck route to
10 the site. You know, it depends on the stage of development 11 when they're building the pad with the gravel trucks. It'll 12 be staged. You know, when they built the pads across the site 13 there was a couple of trucks an hour or so as they come from 14 Bridgeport or the gravel yards out west to build the pads 15 themselves. 16 Due to the stacking of the site and the proximity to 17 11 -- to 1171, it's unlike across the street. There's not a
18 lot of stacking, so they'll have to stage the delivery of 19 their rig to where they deliver one or two trucks at a time.
Page 70 0313og.txt 20 And they're very -- these transport companies are very -- they 21 come up with their game plan. They get in, they bring a 22 couple, unload them, take those trucks out, bring some in. So 23 there -- there's -- there will be no trucks backing up on 1171 24 through this process. It'll be very methodically thought out. 25 During the drilling operation, you know, there's
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 76
1 various different support companies that come out during
2 different stages of the drilling operation and the fracking
3 operation. Probably your most intense truck traffic and
4 staging is during the fracking stage when they get their frack
5 trucks in there. They'll have to be positioned on the pad in
6 such a way -- you know, in a -- in a timely -- when they get
7 them all backed up, and then they'll disperse them in a timely
8 fashion.
9 You know, during that type of operation similar
10 to -- or any heavy truck traffic would probably have some type
11 of law enforcement officer out there or some traffic for
12 safety getting not only their employees but the safety of the 13 citizens of Flower Mound for that truck. So I guess the 14 answer in short is it's a very staged operation, our 15 experience in working with these pads in these urban areas. 16 BOARD MEMBER RICH: One minute. Can you just 17 clarify your entry and how -- the width of the entry into that 18 property? 19 MR. DOLLAK: It's as wide as TxDOT will allow
20 us, 40 foot, a 40-foot entry, gravel entry. The first gate is 21 set back. It's recessed far enough back to where a full
Page 71 0313og.txt 22 18-wheeler can pull completely off the road before it gets to 23 the gate. During the time when they bring in one or two at a 24 time, that gate will be open. The guard shack will be there. 25 And these -- when these operations are under way, it's a very
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 77
1 monitored site. Everybody who comes in is checked in,
2 everybody who goes out is checked out, so --
3 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Thank you.
4 MR. ALCOT: If in fact it did not happen that
5 way and there were 30 or 40 trucks backed up because everybody
6 has to stop, as he stated, and be checked in, who is going to
7 monitor that? Is that the Town of Flower Mound that monitors
8 that and controls that and our police department or our fire
9 department, or is it the state? That's a concern.
10 CHAIR MURPHY: All right. Dustan or
11 Mr. Dollak. I think he did state there would be law
12 enforcement there as well that would help with the trafficking
13 of it.
14 MR. COMPTON: (Inaudible, microphone turned 15 off.) 16 CHAIR MURPHY: I will also say that we're very 17 much aware of the whole condition of 1171, and I think 18 everybody involved in this whole process is aware of what's 19 going on with 1171. And we take special notice and special 20 care, because even without the trucks, the cars alone and the 21 speed and the shoulders and all the things that go on with it,
22 plus the future construction; so we are very much aware of it. 23 MR. ALCOT: Last question is if that happened
Page 72 0313og.txt 24 and our Flower Mound Police Department or Fire Department was 25 going to go out there, who is going to pay for it? The
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 78
1 taxpayers in this room that are not involved or this company? 2 CHAIR MURPHY: Mr. Alcot, I will say that our 3 services from the Town of Flower Mound, we all pay for it
4 regardless of whether it is an oil truck or it's a gravel
5 truck or it's a moving truck or a pickup truck or a car. So
6 regardless of who is on there, because it is a public
7 right-of-way, we as a town do take care of that. Okay? Thank
8 you, sir.
9 Next question. Step to the lectern and state your
10 name, please, and address.
11 MALE SPEAKER: My name is (inaudible). I'm
12 from 2208 (inaudible) Drive, Flower Mound, Texas 75028. I
13 have several questions regarding the distance to the public
14 road from the oil rig. And I believe the current code says
15 it's 400 feet or something like that. But during the break I
16 found out if a variance is requested for that there is no 17 minimum distance specified, so that is a little disturbing to 18 me. So in theoretical possibility it could be one feet away 19 from the road that we (inaudible) -- 20 CHAIR MURPHY: I'm sorry? I missed the 21 question. You're saying that -- that -- 22 MALE SPEAKER: There is no minimum -- 23 CHAIR MURPHY: Minimum -- what?
24 MALE SPEAKER: -- specified for variance. 25 CHAIR MURPHY: For a variance?
Page 73 0313og.txt
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 79
1 MALE SPEAKER: Yes. So in theory you could 2 request something which is five feet away, so that's not a 3 good precedent. 4 CHAIR MURPHY: Well, in that case they would 5 have to come before the Board -- 6 MALE SPEAKER: Yeah. What I --
7 CHAIR MURPHY: -- and they would have to
8 request a variance.
9 MALE SPEAKER: What I am pointing out is some
10 weakness in the current code that should have specified these
11 things. First -- first of all in the code itself states that
12 without variance is 400 feet. And if a variance is requested,
13 it's a little unusual to find out that there is no minimum.
14 So I'm just commenting on some weakness on top of it.
15 Then my other question is that regarding the
16 exceptions we are asking for the person who is living on the
17 north which is 992 feet and he has written a letter
18 specifically disagreeing with this project and the person 19 making exception on the south which is 460 feet. And even 20 though he has specifically agreed for this particular case, I 21 believe the person down -- as the Applicant states does not 22 hold mineral rights. I believe it is not fair to make an 23 exception in this particular case even though in one case he 24 has agreed, the other one -- anyway, he's disagreeing. 25 Reason for that is if you make a precedent for this
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 Page 74 0313og.txt 80
1 one, the other Applicant who is coming next time, he's going 2 to ask well, we made eight feet or maybe 100 feet exception 3 for him; therefore, it is reasonable for me to go for 4 exception for 200 feet. So if we make a precedent in -- in 5 legal terms, I mean, you hear in U.S. Supreme Court and all 6 these things, precedent takes all the weight in the courts. 7 That's one of my other questions.
8 The third question I had was regarding the
9 fracturing pond from the Applicant, the little information
10 that they plan to use one of those ponds as the source of
11 water. That's not what I heard from my prior discussion from
12 the folks from the Flower Mound city. What I was told,
13 specifically our good officers Mr. Matthews and Dustan, is
14 that -- that there will be water brought out from the trucks.
15 And the water -- the polluted water will be taken out from the
16 city. And the code specifically states the polluted water has
17 to be taken out. And in this particular case, the fracturing
18 pond uses (inaudible) and how the water with the -- how can
19 that get polluted and how are -- how are they going to clean
20 it up? There's not specification information on this -- on 21 this project. 22 Finally, and the last one, is in this current -- in 23 the code specifies a noise plan which is 300 feet away. You 24 have to be 70 db, decibels. I haven't -- I haven't seen 25 anything. Final point is that also Applicant guarantees there
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 81
Page 75 0313og.txt 1 will not be much traffic on 1171. He can guarantee right now, 2 the Applicant, but the police officer who will be busy driving 3 the road for answering to somebody's emergency, he's not going 4 to look around oh, I saw three trucks right here, maybe I 5 should complain to the oil and gas company for violation. He 6 has duties, too, for the residents. He does not have 7 particular instances -- I don't want you to use police persons 8 (inaudible) for counting the number of trucks for violation 9 of -- 10 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Fifteen seconds.
11 MALE SPEAKER: 1171 is already backed up many
12 times. So those are my questions. I hope you regard my
13 questions if you are --
14 CHAIR MURPHY: Thank you -- thank you very
15 much. There's a couple of things I do want to point out on
16 your questions. The Board does not grant variances or deny
17 variances, whether it's the Zoning Board of Adjustment or the
18 Oil and Gas Appeals Board, based on anything that was granted
19 or not granted previously. Each case stands on its own merit.
20 So just because something was granted previously has no
21 relevance in our decision. Okay? So number one, take that
22 into consideration. 23 The distance on the dba, as he stated, that will be 24 forthcoming. They cannot even start the rig or the well until 25 that is -- isn't that right, Mr. Compton? We talked about the
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 82
1 noise level. And we've reviewed many noise level engineers
2 and everything of that sort, so we look forward to seeing what Page 76 0313og.txt 3 their noise levels would be. As far as the obligations for 4 our law enforcement officers and their duties to help guide 5 trucks in, it's my opinion that the people requesting this 6 variance are indeed taxpayers and residents of this community; 7 and they're entitled to their rights on their property as well 8 and their rights for the services the Town provides. 9 Now, going back to the fracturing of the pond and 10 the water, I will turn that over to Mr. Compton or Mr. Dollak. 11 MR. COMPTON: (Inaudible, microphone turned 12 off.)
13 CHAIR MURPHY: Dustan, would you check your
14 mic and see if you can -- try Matt's.
15 MR. COMPTON: That sounds like it's working.
16 I believe the question was related to what happens to the
17 water after it comes back from fracturing? Is that -- am I
18 correct with that, with the spent used water or --
19 (Inaudible speaker from audience.)
20 MR. DOLLAK: It's hauled off of the site.
21 CHAIR MURPHY: He said that the pond was going
22 to be a fracturing pond and he wants to indicate how it's
23 going to be removed or how it's going to be handled so as not
24 to pollute the environment. 25 MR. COMPTON: Well, a fracturing pond is all
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 83
1 fresh water. It is not contaminated until it goes into the 2 formation, at which point it is held aboveground in steel 3 tanks and trucked off out of the community to approved and
4 sanctioned saltwater injection wells. And those wells are not Page 77 0313og.txt 5 allowed within the Town of Flower Mound limits. 6 CHAIR MURPHY: And period. 7 (Inaudible speaker from audience.) 8 BOARD MEMBER RICH: I would also make -- like 9 to make one clarification that there's some knowledge that 10 wasn't quite accurate. The only thing that has a zero 11 property line, to my understanding, are the storage tanks. 12 Everything else has a -- they're not requesting a zero line. 13 But isn't that right, Counsel, that we're not talking about 14 tank batteries. We're not talking about anything else. It is
15 storage tanks only that have no minimums; is that correct?
16 MR. LATHROM: In addition to the minimums we
17 have in the Town's Code of Ordinances, the Railroad Commission
18 also has minimums from roadways and property lines and -- I
19 can't remember, there are half a dozen other minimum setbacks
20 that the Railroad Commission requires which are over and above
21 or subordinate to the Town's ordinances. Our ordinances can
22 be a little more stringent than the Railroad Commission's.
23 But there are some areas where their regulations come into
24 play, and particularly with respect to setbacks from
25 right-of-way -- rights-of-way.
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 84
1 The Board of Adjustment or the Oil and Gas Board of 2 Appeals does not have the ability or the authority to revise 3 any ordinances. Again, that's a part of the legislative
4 process which falls within the purview of the Town Council 5 rather than the Oil and Gas Board of Appeals. The Oil and Gas
6 Board of Appeals simply administers the ordinance as it's been Page 78 0313og.txt 7 crafted and approved by the Town Council and applies the 8 ordinance to requested variances or waivers in accordance with 9 or pursuant to those ordinances that are in effect. 10 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: I might also, just -- 11 just for clarification, for tank batteries and residence, the 12 minimum is 500 feet, correct? We cannot -- even with a 13 variance you can't be closer than 500 feet, per the ordinance? 14 MR. LATHROM: That is correct. There is a 15 minimum setback. 16 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: And tank -- and tank
17 batteries and the human occupied, that drops to 300 feet as a
18 minimum; so we cannot grant a variance closer than 300 feet to
19 a human occupied building? I just want to make sure.
20 MR. LATHROM: Yes, sir.
21 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: Okay.
22 BOARD MEMBER MELUGIN: One more point of
23 clarification for your question, sir. And Counsel could
24 correct me if I'm incorrect here. But you asked about the
25 distance to the public roads, that a request could be any --
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 85
1 any -- any length. Currently it's 500, the setback 2 requirement. They can request any amount they want down to 3 one foot or 499 feet; however, this request is stated to be no 4 closer than 246 or 321 feet. If we approved this request, 5 that is their limit, 246 and 321. They could not arbitrarily
6 change it on their own. They would have to return to us and 7 request another variance. Is that --
8 MR. LATHROM: Board Member Melugin, you are Page 79 0313og.txt 9 correct on that. There are some setback requirements that can 10 be reduced to zero under the ordinance, so there are some. 11 But we don't have any -- the -- I don't -- I don't know what 12 the ordinance -- what the requests are on this one. I 13 haven't -- I can't recite them to you off the top of my hat. 14 But in any event, the Oil and Gas Board of Appeals cannot 15 grant a variance to a distance less than that which is 16 approved or set out in the ordinance if there's a minimum 17 established. 18 MR. MASSEY: My name is Glen Massey, 3608 Polo
19 Run Drive in Bridlewood; and I have two questions. First
20 question is if those are two successfully commercially drilled
21 wells and the variance you get -- you get the approval for the
22 variance, how many more wells could you drill on that
23 particular lease? And then number two is if you could just
24 provide some color as to the pipeline, you know, where are you
25 kind of hooking up the pipeline and where does it kind of
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 86
1 travel, I'd appreciate that. 2 MR. DOLLAK: I mean, with the technology and 3 -- to answer the question of potential wells in the future, is 4 there potential -- on this lease and on -- on all the other 5 leases, there is a potential in the future as the technology 6 advances and -- and the geologists and the experts figure out 7 how to get more of the gas out of the Barnett Shale, there is
8 definitely the possibility. I'm not sure what that percentage 9 is and when that'll happen. It comes with experience in
10 drilling in the Barnett Shale. Page 80 0313og.txt 11 CHAIR MURPHY: May I interrupt here? 12 Counselor, if they wanted to drill additional wells on that 13 pad, would they have to come back for the variance request? 14 MR. LATHROM: Not -- not necessarily. If -- 15 it depends on whether the bore hole falls within the 16 parameters of the variance, if granted, by the Oil and Gas 17 Board of Appeals. 18 CHAIR MURPHY: But it still has to fall into 19 the variance that was granted the first time? 20 MR. LATHROM: It would either have to conform
21 to the Town's Code of Ordinances or conform to the variance,
22 if any, granted by the Oil and Gas Board of Appeals.
23 CHAIR MURPHY: Okay.
24 BOARD MEMBER MELUGIN: Follow-up. Is the
25 variance in these cases granted to the Applicant or to the
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 87
1 property or to the lease?
2 MR. LATHROM: The answer differs between the
3 Zoning Board of Adjustment and the Oil and Gas Board of 4 Appeals. 5 BOARD MEMBER MELUGIN: In the context of the 6 Oil and Gas Board of Appeals, please. 7 MR. LATHROM: I understand, Board Member 8 Melugin. I'm buying time. 9 BOARD MEMBER MELUGIN: I know.
10 MR. LATHROM: The -- typically a variance 11 granted by the Zoning Board of Adjustment runs with the land.
12 It does -- it is not specific to the individual Applicant or Page 81 0313og.txt 13 property owner. The waiver or variance that is granted for a 14 gas well site similarly is not specific to the Applicant or 15 the operator. It is site-specific. 16 CHAIR MURPHY: Mr. Dollak, you may continue. 17 Thank you. 18 MR. DOLLAK: I've lost track of the second 19 part of the question. Can you -- 20 MR. MASSEY: Pipeline -- 21 MR. DOLLAK: The pipeline -- 22 CHAIR MURPHY: I'm sorry. Wait a minute.
23 MR. MASSEY: Assume you have directional
24 drilling (inaudible) --
25 MR. LATHROM: Sir, could you go back to the
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 88
1 microphone, please, so we can get you on the tape recording,
2 please. Thank you.
3 MR. MASSEY: The question is assuming that,
4 you know, today's technologies don't change, how many more
5 wells could you drill on that lease? 6 CHAIR MURPHY: That -- that was what we said. 7 It had to be within the variance that was granted or within 8 the regular parameters of the ordinance. 9 MR. MASSEY: How many? 10 CHAIR MURPHY: Oh, I guess as long as it's 11 within that variance, it's unlimited. Is that correct?
12 MR. LATHROM: There will be physical 13 limitations that --
14 CHAIR MURPHY: Yes, there would be. Page 82 0313og.txt 15 MR. LATHROM: -- the Applicant can explain to 16 you right now. 17 MS. ANIELLO: Kathy Aniello again. Given that 18 it's only a 124-acre lease and given the length of the well 19 bores and given how close we can be with those well bores, two 20 is the only thing we can put in given that current acreage. 21 So right now the way that stands, two is all we can do. Now, 22 you're right, there might be some technology later on down the 23 line that you could squeeze in more wells; but that's not 24 anytime --
25 CHAIR MURPHY: That's when --
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 89
1 MS ANIELLO: -- in the next year or whenever.
2 CHAIR MURPHY: -- it falls back to being in
3 the variance that was requested originally. It's got to still
4 fall within the variance and the guidelines the Town has set
5 forth; is that correct?
6 MR. LATHROM: Yes.
7 MR. DOLLAK: The pipeline, to my knowledge 8 right now, the discussions are being had with CrossTex who is 9 servicing the wells on Tour 18 who are bringing the line down 10 to the well that's currently being drilled right now. That's 11 the closest pipeline to this site. The only other pipeline is 12 down where Williams has their compressor station down the 13 other way. So I believe the discussions right now are to
14 bring the pipeline down, over and to this pad site. Those 15 negotiations haven't been finalized, but that is probably
16 where it's going to head. Page 83 0313og.txt 17 CHAIR MURPHY: Thank you, Mr. Dollak. Next 18 question. Come to the lectern, please, ma'am. 19 MS. WILLIAMS: Hello. My name is Elizabeth 20 Williams, and I live at 2804 Aberdeen here in Flower Mound. 21 One of the questions I had, you talked about water and that -- 22 purchasing water from the City, from the hydrant. My concern 23 is it's a tremendous amount of water, and I'm wondering if we 24 make this a precedent for every different well site, that's a 25 lot of water that's going to be purchased from the water. We
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 90
1 are in -- we are not living in an area that has a tremendous
2 supply of water. I'm also looking at this particular site and
3 any other site, we have a lot of tree area, a lot of homes in
4 that area. How does that affect -- as they're pumping water
5 from the hydrant, how does it affect the water pressure in
6 that area in trying to fight a house fire or may it be, God
7 forbid, worse that during dry season, drought season that we
8 then have a brush fire that really develops under high winds
9 and then we're really fighting a much serious fire that is 10 then going to put a lot of homes in -- into danger? 11 CHAIR MURPHY: Thank you, Ms. Williams. 12 Dustan? Oh, we've got the fire department here. Excuse me. 13 FIRE MARSHAL SMITH: I thought I was just 14 going to get people out of here tonight. 15 CHAIR MURPHY: State your name.
16 FIRE MARSHAL SMITH: Mike Smith, I'm the fire 17 marshal here in the Town of Flower Mound. There were several
18 questions there. I'll try to answer in a limited amount of Page 84 0313og.txt 19 time. There's got to be certain demands that we have to be 20 able to keep at any time, fire flow, domestic water flow; and 21 the Town's prepared to do that, you know, under -- undergoing 22 this drilling here. And any time we feel like we can't meet 23 those demands, there's other drilling sites where we've 24 required them to bring frack tanks in, storage tanks. And 25 we're currently doing that at another drilling site where we
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 91
1 don't have water close to it where they're providing 42,000
2 gallons of water for us to fight a fire at the gas well.
3 We're not going to fight any fire at the gas well.
4 You know, that -- that would be silly. What we do require
5 that water for is for the trailers that are there, the
6 ancillary equipment that are there for us to extinguish that
7 fire. When the gas is on fire, that's like our best friend.
8 We know where the gas is at that time. What was some more
9 question?
10 CHAIR MURPHY: Would it be a drain on the
11 water pressure if they had to fight a fire at a residence or a 12 brush fire? 13 FIRE MARSHAL SMITH: If we had a structure 14 fire in that area, we could always shut that water flow off to 15 the drilling. It's just like any other developer in the Town; 16 if we have a demand for fire fighting water, we'll shut their 17 meter off and we'll take control of that hydrant. And we do
18 also have a tanker truck with a certain amount of water in it 19 for brush fires. And if we get into a season like we're in
20 right now, I'll institute a burn ban next year to try to limit Page 85 0313og.txt 21 our grass fires. 22 CHAIR MURPHY: Thank you, Mr. Smith. One more 23 question? Oh, we have one coming. State your name and 24 address, please. 25 MR. PARSAM [PHONETIC]: Eric Parsam. I live
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 92
1 at 4304 Lauren Way. I haven't seen all of you since last
2 year. Hope you had a good Christmas and New Year. I've got
3 quite a few questions. Before I start, I'm not an astronaut,
4 or I'm not a rocket scientist. What I've done in the past or
5 what I do now shouldn't really matter. But I'm a resident of
6 Flower Mound, and don't tell my wife, but I think I can change
7 my two-year-old's diaper a lot faster than she can. I hope
8 this isn't on the tape tonight.
9 I've got a couple of questions, and I'll run through
10 them quickly. If for some reason you don't get them, please
11 ask me, and I'll be more than happy to restate them for you.
12 When you pointed out the setbacks from 500 feet and 1,000
13 feet, the chart that you showed showed the center point of the 14 plat up to 500 feet and 1,000 feet. Now, when the ordinances 15 were changed, my understanding was that was actually the end 16 point of the plat drawing the line out 500 feet and 1,000 17 feet. I could be wrong, but if we could get clarification on 18 that. 19 Second question, does the Town have any mineral
20 rights involved if we're actually going into 1171? So is 21 there a financial interest to the Town from the drilling?
22 Third question, have we looked at the grade on 1171, because Page 86 0313og.txt 23 you do have a pretty steep drop there. And my concern -- I 24 drive there all the time because my family -- I have family 25 members that live in the Vineyards. And you have a lot of
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 93
1 people speeding. You have a pretty steep grade there, and 2 half the time the people coming out of Tour 18 have the deer
3 in the headlights when they're trying to zip through traffic.
4 Now we've got semi trucks that are going to try to cut in and
5 out of there. And the last drill site I remember west of
6 there, they actually had a guy holding a sign with a stop
7 sign; and half the time he got ran over. So are we going to
8 have police officers this time to actually direct traffic?
9 Next question, have we considered the risk of the
10 residents west of the drill site location? Because that is
11 the only road across. There is no road around. There is no,
12 from my understanding, fire station west of there. So what
13 happens to the residents in the Vineyards or Roanoke if we did
14 get a fire in there? That's going to block the access of any
15 emergency vehicles going through. You've basically stranded 16 the residents on the west side. Is that something that's been 17 considered? 18 The setback reduction request from the road, what 19 happens when that road is expanded? Are we taking that into 20 consideration now? Because that land, my understanding, has 21 already been purchased; so where is the actual setback? My
22 question to the folks who've actually signed the lease, have 23 you read your home owner's policy to see if in fact you would
24 have coverage in the event of a loss, shockwave, ground Page 87 0313og.txt 25 movement? I urge you to please read that. And have we
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 94
1 considered the guard tower in Tour 18? My understanding is 2 that's occupied, the guard tower at Tour 18. Is that an 3 occupied building? So if that's an occupied building, I 4 didn't see that addressed here. What happens to the poor guy
5 that's sitting there and something happens and he has no clue
6 what's going on? Every life is important, even the guard --
7 the guard gate guys basically taking care of the security of
8 all those residents. Why not take care of him as well?
9 And my next question is why would we sell water for
10 drilling when we are in an area that doesn't have that much
11 water? We were lucky to have a lot of rain last year. Why
12 would the City take on that expense, yet we have to conserve?
13 I have no problem with conserving water, I think that's a
14 great thing; but yet we give them free reign to drill. Why
15 would we do that?
16 CHAIR MURPHY: Thank you. Okay. First of
17 all, we have the ordinance that changed. I didn't realize the 18 ordinance changed. Is there any clarification on that one? 19 MR. COMPTON: I believe the situation you were 20 talking about is the 500 foot setback from the edge of 21 disturbance only applies to floodplain and environmentally 22 sensitive areas. All other measurements are measured from the 23 well bore itself or the tank batteries or the storage tanks.
24 CHAIR MURPHY: And as far as the Town -- 25 MR. PARSAM: (Inaudible.)
Page 88 0313og.txt CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 95
1 CHAIR MURPHY: Wait a minute, wait a minute. 2 You've already given us enough questions. Hang on a second. 3 And as far as the Town's mineral rights, does the Town have 4 any mineral rights or economic gain? 5 MR. COMPTON: The Town is not a part of this 6 lease, and I don't anticipate the Town having, you know, any
7 mineral rights in the TxDOT right-of-way of 1171. They're
8 either maybe owned by TxDOT or those property owners where
9 that road was taken from in the far past. But you know, deed
10 searches would have to be done and for any other areas in the
11 Town. The Town does not have any mineral rights in this area.
12 CHAIR MURPHY: So for clarification,
13 Counselor, the only moneys or revenue the Town receives is
14 just in the ad valorem taxes?
15 MR. LATHROM: There -- the State of Texas does
16 not take into consideration -- or the taxing entities do not
17 take into consideration the mineral estate in determining the
18 value of people's real property. So no, there is no increase
19 in the ad valorem taxes the Town collects based upon gas being 20 drilled or being taken from the mineral estate. 21 CHAIR MURPHY: Okay. Now we have -- back to 22 the grade on 1171, which I think we talked about as well, too, 23 on how it would happen. And it's my understanding even as far 24 as anything obstructing the road to the residents to the west 25 or to the east, I think it would be just as normal as any
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 96 Page 89 0313og.txt
1 other catastrophic accident that does appear on that road from 2 time to time unfortunately. I don't think our services or our 3 police department or fire department would treat it any less, 4 and it would be taken care of as quickly as possible. 5 Therefore the risk of the residents -- again, the residents 6 that are asking for this variance are mineral owners or have 7 given approval for the surface rights. And most of them are 8 in that area, and we do ask they come forward if they have any
9 kind of opposition to that.
10 Mr. Dollak, I'll let you talk about the guard towers
11 of Tour 18, any home owner policy; and I'll go back to selling
12 the water from the Town.
13 MR. DOLLAK: First of all, Madame Chair, I'm
14 unaware of anybody who was run over out there. We haven't had
15 any incidents that I'm aware of with Schlumberger or their
16 guard shack or any complaints of truck traffic at that
17 intersection. I'm unaware of any complaints. Setback from
18 the road, the only thing we can ask is from the current road
19 right now. The other road's not built yet, so --
20 CHAIR MURPHY: Didn't you show the property
21 lines of -- 22 MR. DOLLAK: Yes. That -- I did -- we did 23 illustrate, because they have taken -- TxDOT has their take 24 line. But the actual edge of the future road, it's -- you 25 know, we can -- we can guess. We probably can be within a
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 97
Page 90 0313og.txt 1 couple of feet of the future road, but right now we're drawing 2 a fact to what the road is from the well head at the time of 3 the variance request. TxDOT comes in, widens the road, that 4 setback changes. The guard shack -- 5 MR. COMPTON: I can cover that one. It's -- 6 the guard shack does meet the definition of human occupied 7 building, but the human occupied building setback is 500 feet 8 from the gas wells, and it is approximately 700 feet from the 9 gas wells. It was not identified as a variance needed. 10 MR. DOLLAK: And we did ask them for a waiver
11 for that, and they said there was no need in signing a waiver
12 because it wasn't a residence which would be a 1,000 foot
13 setback; so we didn't get a waiver from the guard shack for
14 the reasons that Dustan stated. And about the water, you
15 know, that's still to be worked out. As the fire marshal
16 said, if the water pressure's available -- I'm sure the Town
17 would love to sell water to the gas company. The Town is in
18 the water business. You have a surplus of water, and they
19 would be happy to -- to sell this -- this consumer the amount
20 of water necessary to frack these ponds.
21 BOARD MEMBER RICH: But if there was a
22 situation, you would of course tank in water?
23 MR. DOLLAK: Correct. I believe that was all 24 the questions. 25 MR. PARSAM: Eric Parsam again. My question
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 98
1 in regards to the setback request for the main road and if
2 there was a catastrophe from the gas well, say an explosion, a
Page 91 0313og.txt 3 fire, a fire ring that started, which would start working its 4 way, my guess, west, south, east and north, how would -- my 5 question probably would be to the fire marshal. How would you 6 get across that to help the residents west of that if that 7 road is not accessible? 8 FIRE MARSHAL SMITH: All right. Going -- 9 going into one of these drilling permits, we look at each one 10 of them independently. We have mutual aid agreements with all 11 the surrounding towns, cities, neighborhoods that they're 12 there for us like we are for them. When they come -- submit
13 this drilling permit, they also have to come up with an
14 emergency response plan. That's not a cookie cutter plan
15 written on one piece of paper. It's a very detailed plan for
16 each of those events that you just spoke about.
17 It's not easy to pass my personal test for these
18 emergency response plans, because I do have a background in
19 that stuff. It's -- you can ask any one of them, whether
20 they're a big company or a small company, I don't really care.
21 They still have to meet our expectations. And there's a lot
22 of prethought on the emergency response plans.
23 MR. PARSAM: Could you elaborate as to what
24 that would be for the residents west of there? Because that
25 is a very strong concern of mine. My parents are elderly.
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 99
1 They would have a heck of a time trying to get out of there, 2 and there's only one road in and out. And my understanding,
3 the closest fire station to Roanoke is quite a distance away. 4 FIRE MARSHAL SMITH: Whether -- you know,
Page 92 0313og.txt 5 whether -- I don't know that the proximity of the fire station 6 makes a difference, because I mean, it's like the rest of the 7 town out that way. Until we -- future development and if we 8 ever go with Canyon Falls where we do put a fire station out 9 there, we have to rely on our neighbors, just like they have 10 to rely on us. We look at evacuation plans. That's part of, 11 you know, what we do in advance. You know, we're looking into 12 the code red system that the Town has for early evacuation in 13 the event of an emergency where the residents are notified. 14 If we have to evacuate, it may be a type thing where we
15 evacuate in place. But we have trucks that can get in and out
16 of that area.
17 MR. PARSAM: So if we had fire on both sides
18 of that road, you guys would be able to drive through?
19 FIRE MARSHAL SMITH: Oh, we'd have trucks that
20 come from another town from the other direction. And if it
21 came down to it, we have access to helicopters, too, if we --
22 if we needed to bring water in. It's just like the grass fire
23 fighting season. You know, we have plans for that, too, what
24 are we going to have to do. We have to be prepared. We can't
25 wait until the last minute to decide what are we going to do
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 100
1 today. There's a lot of -- a lot of prethought put into this 2 drilling. 3 MR. PARSAM: Okay. Well, if I can meet with 4 you, I'd like to see --
5 FIRE MARSHAL SMITH: I would love to share it 6 with you.
Page 93 0313og.txt 7 MR. PARSAM: Okay, thank you. 8 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Mr. Dollak, could you 9 possibly come up a minute. I think there's a misunderstanding 10 of when a well blows. Could you explain fairly clearly when a 11 well blows? You know, we all know that Red Adair can get here 12 in a few minutes. But besides that could you explain exactly 13 when a well blows what happens, because I think people are 14 anticipating that half the Town of Flower Mound is going to be 15 dissent -- disintegrated. 16 MR. DOLLAK: Ms. Rich, I'd really like to
17 defer to Mike. He is very knowledgeable of that, of what
18 happens and the procedures, the emergency response plan is
19 this -- this big, who gets contacted first, who gets contacted
20 second, where the -- where the workers evacuate to. There's
21 muster [phonetic] points either -- depending on which way the
22 wind's blowing. All that's laid out in the plan, approved by
23 the fire marshal. You know, he has -- there are -- certain
24 agencies are noticed immediately. The -- and Mike, jump in
25 here. He's -- he's the expert on how -- what happens if.
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 101
1 FIRE MARSHAL SMITH: You're doing pretty good. 2 MR. DOLLAK: Not when, if. He's going to give 3 me a grade on this, you know. I'm the civil engineer that 4 works through all of these setbacks and trees and floodplains. 5 FIRE MARSHAL SMITH: One thing we've got to 6 remember, the Barnett Shale, you've got to do -- you've got to
7 stimulate it before you get any gas out of it. I've made 8 presentations to home owners before where we'd get parts of
Page 94 0313og.txt 9 the shale and put it in a blender and just blend it up to get 10 a measurable amount of gas out of it. You actually have to do 11 something to it to get anything out. It's not like east Texas 12 and west Texas where you get the high pressure pockets. It's 13 all -- it's relatively low pressure. 14 Everybody goes back to the incident a couple of 15 years ago in Forest Hill when there was mass panic. That was, 16 you know, 99.9 percent water that was -- that was coming out 17 of the well. And it's under pressure, you know, after they 18 stimulate it. They're going to get that water back out
19 through their flowback operations. So it's -- it's not the
20 doom and gloom like a lot of people think. It's relatively a
21 low pressure -- we have detection equipment to monitor the
22 vapors in the event of a gas release. They also have shut
23 downs for high or low pressure on each of the drill sites.
24 They can monitor that over the Internet at all times. It will
25 shut -- you know, have an alarm; and they can shut that thing
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 102
1 in at a moment's notice. 2 BOARD MEMBER RICH: There are shut off valves 3 on all the wells. You do not have to worry about somebody 4 falling asleep and having the place blow up. And that's just 5 not how these systems are run. These are a closed loop 6 system. It's the safest possible system that can be 7 implemented -- implemented in exploration at this time that I 8 know of anyway. When a well does catch fire, it generally
9 goes straight up. It does not go left, right. It goes 10 straight up, and generally that does not impact as much as
Page 95 0313og.txt 11 what you might think, because it is under pressure; and that's 12 fairly easy to get in and shut down. 13 This isn't -- and it isn't the Gulf War where you've 14 got black clouds flowing everywhere. It's a fairly 15 simplistic, small well in consideration. And I think that -- 16 that is completely manageable by Captain Smith. 17 FIRE MARSHAL SMITH: The smoke from one of 18 these wells -- I mean, you watch TV and the Red Adair and the 19 John Wayne and all those -- it's the same gas that you're 20 burning on your stove. You're not getting a whole lot of
21 smoke off of that. So it's relatively clean burning.
22 CHAIR MURPHY: Well, I think also not long ago
23 there was a gas well fire in Fort Worth where it did travel a
24 mile. And that was -- from my understanding, people were not
25 doing what they were supposed to do; and the equipment was not
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 103
1 working as it should. And that's one of the things that I
2 will say with the Town and Mr. Dollak who we've worked with,
3 they are complying to everything that's being requested. So 4 even accidents happen, they do; but I think the odds are even 5 better that it won't happen here. Not that it won't, but 6 everything is being done to make it safe. 7 FIRE MARSHAL SMITH: I mean, the odds of an 8 accident are equivalent to a car running into a gas meter, you 9 know, in a residential neighborhood. It's -- if it happens, 10 it happens; and we're prepared to deal with it.
11 BOARD MEMBER RICH: As I recall, that was 12 the -- that was a gas line --
Page 96 0313og.txt 13 FIRE MARSHAL SMITH: It was a pipeline. 14 BOARD MEMBER RICH: It was a pipeline 15 permeation from the digging. 16 FIRE MARSHAL SMITH: Right. 17 BOARD MEMBER RICH: It was not a well head 18 that exploded, just -- 19 FIRE MARSHAL SMITH: And that happens in the 20 Town quite frequently from backhoes. And Verizon, you know, 21 they'll cut into a gas line; and we're prepared to deal with 22 that. If we have to evacuate, we'll evacuate. If we keep you
23 in place, we'll have water down protecting the exposures.
24 MR. ALCOT: Eddie Alcot, Woodlake Estates.
25 Question for the fire marshal. I have seen those on TV blow
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 104
1 straight up when there is an issue, but it only takes one.
2 I've seen in the three years I've lived in Texas, in fact in
3 the last couple of weeks, 35 to 60 mile an hour winds. What
4 happens when that blows up and we have 50 or 60 mile an hour
5 winds and it blows it across north, south, east or west as 6 they spoke of? How -- no matter what you shut off, things are 7 burning. 8 And only this May -- I think it was May when we had 9 all the storms -- since I've lived here have we had enough 10 water in this town. We have been in a drought for years 11 before that, which may come again this summer. And the 12 concern is, yes, it blows straight up. But I've never -- this
13 should be called the windy city, not Chicago, because winds 14 are constantly 20, 30, 40, 50 miles an hour. And if it blows
Page 97 0313og.txt 15 straight up and the wind's blowing that way, I don't care what 16 we turn off, you're the expert; but it's going to move 17 quickly. 18 FIRE MARSHAL SMITH: Gas has, you know -- 19 expansion ratio, when it meets with air, it's going to turn to 20 a certain amount of particles. It's going to dissipate rather 21 quickly in -- in windier conditions than you have with still 22 conditions. And just to press that, I'm also a resident of 23 Flower Mound in North Shore; so I take a personal interest in 24 the safety of the wells being -- that come into Flower Mound.
25 So it doesn't go unnoticed, all the -- all the questions and
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 105
1 the concerns, because I look at it, you know, they may be
2 wanting to drill under my house some day.
3 MS. COHANKE [PHONETIC]: Carol Cohanke, 4312
4 Lauren Way. I've lived here for 27 years and was new to
5 natural gas moving here. It's my understanding that there are
6 woven and snaked through this town all over are gas pipelines
7 that go from the airport to Canada or whatever. They can run 8 through Chaucer Estates. They run by Timber Creek School, so 9 forth. What I'd like to ask the fire marshal is how many 10 lines are there that go through the town? I'm not asking for 11 an exact, you know, number; and also -- 12 FIRE MARSHAL SMITH: Good, because you're not 13 going to get an exact number. 14 MS. COHANKE: And how many incidents in the
15 last -- I do not recall in the 27 years I've lived here that 16 we've ever had an incident with a gas pipeline that runs
Page 98 0313og.txt 17 through our town now. 18 FIRE MARSHAL SMITH: Well, as you know, I've 19 been with the Town of Flower Mound since June after retiring 20 from another fire department. I haven't studied the exact 21 number of pipelines. But I mean, you think every subdivision, 22 every thoroughfare there's pretty much a pipeline going 23 through. You look at the substations, the valving stations 24 around our schools, around churches, they're -- they're 25 everywhere. I'm sure Dustan could probably answer better on
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 106
1 the number of pipelines.
2 MS. COHANKE: I'm talking about the big ones
3 that run from the airport to Canada, the massive ones. And
4 they're there, because I know the fire department has had
5 drills as to -- emergency drills years ago when my husband was
6 a volunteer here with the fire department. That they had --
7 that was one of the practice drills that they did was the --
8 you know, what to do with the gas pipeline. So I can tell you
9 exactly where -- where the drill was. But the point I'm 10 trying to make is -- and form it in a question -- is we've 11 been living with gas pipelines in this community for years 12 very safely. Thank you. 13 CHAIR MURPHY: One more question? Okay. At 14 this point -- at this point we'll go to the next area, which 15 is going to be opposition to the Applicant's request. I would 16 like for you -- if you want to oppose this, to come to the
17 lectern. Please don't be redundant. Please state some reason 18 and -- and, you know, let's do our three minutes. Okay?
Page 99 0313og.txt 19 First one to the lectern, anyone in opposition of this 20 applications request. 21 MR. PARSAM: Eric Parsam, 4304 Lauren Way. I 22 oppose this request because the pad site I feel is far too 23 close to 1171. I feel that it creates an undue risk, hazard, 24 safety issue for the residents west of there. I think the 25 access is going to be relatively limited. I know the fire
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 107
1 marshal said we could probably use helicopters; but the
2 helicopters can only take so many people, and you have far too
3 many residents that live west of there. And by the time we
4 get an emergency response, I think you're going to have a
5 serious problem on your hands.
6 I think we are far too close to the road. I think
7 the setback request for the road shouldn't be granted. I
8 mean, we're within that 500 feet. Plus when that road is
9 expanded, where is that going to be?
10 CHAIR MURPHY: Thank you.
11 MR. PARSAM: I cannot -- I cannot emphasize 12 how strongly I feel about how wrong this is being that close 13 to the road. 14 CHAIR MURPHY: Okay, thank you. Anyone else? 15 MR. MASSEY: My name's Glen Massey, 3608 Polo 16 Run drive in Bridlewood; and I oppose this. I think oil and 17 gas wells constitute an industrial site, and that's in direct 18 conflict with our master plan that, you know, we -- we have
19 here in Flower Mound. 20 CHAIR MURPHY: Thank you.
Page 100 0313og.txt 21 MALE SPEAKER: My name is (inaudible), 220 22 (inaudible) Drive, Flower Mound, Texas. I oppose this 23 proposal primarily because we are making some exceptions to 24 the current code with respect to the person living north and 25 the one living south. And Madame Chairman indicated that such
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 108
1 an exception would not make precedents, but if something goes
2 to some sort of court of law, I think there will be -- these
3 precedents is going to be an issue. And the other point
4 is that this project would -- seems like these small changes
5 to the code, trying to relax these things even from the
6 variances we have is going to negatively impact when they come
7 to -- come closer to the neighborhoods such as North Shore and
8 even (inaudible), and it's a matter of time. So therefore I
9 strongly oppose this one.
10 CHAIR MURPHY: Thank you. Anyone else? Okay.
11 This is the time where we ask for anyone who wants to support
12 the request may come to the lectern and speak.
13 MR. GARNER: My name is Harold Garner. I live 14 at 4100 Post Oak Road. Again, I actually represent the large 15 group of individuals who are stakeholders and who are the 16 people who are most likely to be impacted by this because 17 we're in close proximity to the project. And we have studied 18 it and looked at the advantages and disadvantages, and we are 19 very confident that the plans that have been worked out by the 20 City and in collaboration with the petroleum company,
21 etcetera, is -- is optimized to -- to make certain that -- 22 that our particular safety interests are well taken care of.
Page 101 0313og.txt 23 And this is -- in particular in the light of the 24 fact that we've all made judgments about risk and things like 25 that, in particular driving here we took a tremendous amount
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 109
1 of risk; and we have to evaluate those kind of things. And -- 2 and so -- well, I know it's rather funny; but unless you've
3 been in the ER of Parkland you wouldn't know about that.
4 Okay, that's good. That's good.
5 And on a personal note, I would like to say that --
6 that I know that things like cancer and stuff like it is still
7 quite a mystery; and if there is anything that I can do to
8 help and provide through UT Southwestern, please feel free to
9 contact me. Because I would like to make certain that every
10 citizen of Flower Mound has every right to speak like they did
11 here today, as well as to benefit from all the -- all the
12 resources that are here, including the people.
13 So thank you very much. Again, we very much support
14 this. We think it's important for Flower Mound, the nation
15 and for our progress in this world. So thank you very much. 16 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: I just had a quick 17 question. You said you represented all of the stakeholders? 18 I want to make sure I'm clear. You're not speaking for 19 yourself, you're speaking as a representative? 20 (Inaudible speaker from audience.) 21 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: Yes, sir, I know. Would 22 -- question for you, please.
23 MR. GARNER: In order to minimize the impact 24 and not drag this on much longer, they asked me to speak --
Page 102 0313og.txt 25 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: That's what I wanted to
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 110
1 make sure. 2 MR. GARNER: -- in unison for them. 3 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: I wanted to make sure I 4 understood that clearly.
5 CHAIR MURPHY: Would the people you're
6 representing please stand again? Thank you.
7 MR. GARNER: Thank you very much for your
8 time.
9 CHAIR MURPHY: Thank you. Anyone else wishing
10 to speak in support for the request? So it's fair to say that
11 Mr. Garner spoke for 11 people. Any other questions or
12 comments to the Town Staff, to Mr. Dollak?
13 (Inaudible speaker from audience.)
14 CHAIR MURPHY: State your name and address
15 again, please.
16 MALE SPEAKER: My name is (inaudible), and
17 this refers to previous instance that I spoke, my address 18 should be there. So I would ask Madame Chairman to ask the 19 people who are present just like you asked the people who 20 support the project to raise their hands and show how many 21 people are in opposition. I think that should be fair. 22 CHAIR MURPHY: Okay, you're right. And I will 23 do that. Is there anyone who's in opposition, stand or raise 24 your hand. That hasn't already spoken, let me put it that
25 way. Okay. Oh, you've already spoken? Okay. Even if you've
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1 already spoken, please stand if you're in opposition of this 2 request. 3 (Inaudible speaker from audience.) 4 CHAIR MURPHY: No. The question that was 5 asked of him is I asked everyone for whom Mr. Garner was 6 speaking for to stand, and I would say that means that times 7 11 they would be in support of the request. So then I was
8 asked for those that were not in support of it or opposition
9 to it to stand, and that's what we just did. Okay?
10 BOARD MEMBER MELUGIN: Can I interject as
11 well, though? It's not a number thing. It could be 1,000 in
12 support of and one in support against -- or against. It
13 doesn't change how we're going to rule. It doesn't change how
14 we're going to analyze this. It's -- that's good to know that
15 we have support from both sides and opposition, etcetera; but
16 that is not a vote from the general audience. This is a
17 representation or an analysis of the --
18 CHAIR MURPHY: And as Board Member Rich had
19 put into the record earlier from Mr. Robinson who was opposed 20 to granting of the variance, I think we did talk about that, 21 too. And he is a leaseholder, but not in this particular 22 lease; and he did request financial compensation in order to 23 have the -- the variance granted. So it is in opposition, and 24 those are his reasons. Any other questions from the Board? 25 Any other further questions from the audience?
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Page 104 0313og.txt
1 BOARD MEMBER MELUGIN: I have a question for 2 Bobby. If you -- that's okay? 3 CHAIR MURPHY: Yes, sir, absolutely. 4 BOARD MEMBER MELUGIN: That's the perfect 5 slide to have here. Bobby, I have a question. I see that the 6 well site is located, you mentioned, just near the edge of the 7 tree line. Not a protected area necessarily, but still a tree 8 line. I understand and appreciate the desire to retain trees
9 and not to remove as many as need be and whatever. If you
10 removed -- how many of those trees could you remove and still
11 move it south? Could you remove 200 feet worth of trees or
12 part of them and maybe -- I don't know who needs to speak to
13 this, I'm sorry. What -- if the trees weren't there, what
14 would the limitation be? Let me ask it that way.
15 MS. ANIELLO: Well, part of our agreement with
16 Mr. Bliss, the surface use agreement was that we leave those
17 trees. He didn't want anything cut down. That's where he
18 wanted it. And that's -- you know --
19 BOARD MEMBER MELUGIN: You're working within
20 the limitation of what the Applicant --
21 MS. ANIELLO: Right. I mean, with the surface 22 owner and what he wants and what he's agreed to. 23 BOARD MEMBER MELUGIN: Are there any technical 24 reasons that you know of why it could not be moved further 25 south away from 1171?
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 113
1 MS. ANIELLO: I guess we could (inaudible) the Page 105 0313og.txt 2 pond. 3 MR. DOLLAK: Right. I mean, you're getting 4 closer to that setback to the wetland area. 5 BOARD MEMBER MELUGIN: It would obviously 6 change other setbacks, but -- 7 MR. DOLLAK: But as far as the topography and 8 stuff, no. I mean, you would lose -- my guess, you would lose 9 close to a dozen trees to push the pad back all the way back 10 to -- eight feet to get that eight-foot setback. 11 BOARD MEMBER MELUGIN: Well, that's from the
12 -- from the 1,000 foot. I'm really more -- I'm really more
13 concerned about the road and --
14 MR. DOLLAK: Well, if you were to go to the
15 road, you would -- you would definitely get into the Waters of
16 the State because of the definition of Waters of the State.
17 We -- you know --
18 BOARD MEMBER MELUGIN: I believe the Waters of
19 the State already have a -- you already have a variance
20 request for those.
21 MR. DOLLAK: Right. But if you were to move
22 the pad back, you would eliminate -- we're just setting back
23 from them. I mean, we would be on top of -- 24 BOARD MEMBER MELUGIN: Oh, I see, okay. 25 MR. DOLLAK: -- them. And -- and take down
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 114
1 the trees; and as Kathy had said, I'm not so sure we would
2 have an agreement with our leaseholder -- 3 BOARD MEMBER MELUGIN: Okay. Page 106 0313og.txt 4 MR. DOLLAK: -- for the surface rights to put 5 the pad back and take the trees out, because there's some 6 privacy that -- that they get with this house here. 7 BOARD MEMBER MELUGIN: Okay. I understand 8 that. And as I -- was pointed out in previous meetings and 9 cases before, the percentage of the request is always one of 10 my major concerns. If it's one or two percent, 499 versus 11 500, I don't have as much of a problem with that. But the 12 setback from the road is about 50 percent versus -- so I -- I 13 -- and a number of them have a high percentage, so that's why
14 I was in particular asking how far back it could go; not
15 necessarily could it be eliminated from the variance request.
16 So thank you.
17 MR. DOLLAK: No problem.
18 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Melugin, also to
19 follow up on the tree area there, that tree area also has
20 approximately four specimen Blackjack oak trees; so they are
21 very beneficial in their size and stature. And that's why the
22 surface owner prefers to preserve them.
23 BOARD MEMBER MELUGIN: But that's not in any
24 sort of protected area that is --
25 MR. COMPTON: It does not meet the
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1 environmentally sensitive area criteria. That's why there is 2 a chain link fence along the southern boarder of that pad site
3 protecting that -- those trees specifically. 4 BOARD MEMBER MELUGIN: But there's no official
5 setback from those trees; is that what we're saying? Page 107 0313og.txt 6 MR. COMPTON: No. 7 BOARD MEMBER MELUGIN: Okay. 8 MR. LATHROM: They would be prohibited from 9 damaging or destroying those trees. The drip line, the root 10 system of those trees would be required to be protected; and 11 they'd have to conform to the Town's tree ordinance in their 12 dealing with those trees if they are specimen trees. 13 CHAIR MURPHY: This is in the Conservation 14 District; is it not? 15 MR. LATHROM: I believe it is in the -- in the
16 Conservation District.
17 CHAIR MURPHY: Any other questions?
18 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Counsel, could you --
19 could you define again Waters of the State, what it -- what it
20 includes size-wise, limits, etcetera, just -- thank you.
21 MR. COMPTON: I can help with that.
22 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Or Dustan.
23 MR. COMPTON: Sure. So the definition of
24 Waters of the State comes from our Smart growth criteria. And
25 that is it right there. So ponds fall into it, natural or
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 116
1 artificial, fresh or salt, inland -- or navigable or 2 nonnavigable inside the state. 3 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Is there size attached to 4 that at all? There's really not a size, is there?
5 MR. COMPTON: No. 6 BOARD MEMBER RICH: So that -- is that pond a
7 collection pond for rainwater? Page 108 0313og.txt 8 MR. COMPTON: Yes. Surface flow flows into 9 that pond from -- the whole area in that southern section of 10 that pad site flows from the east to the west. It's a very 11 small drainage area. I believe it's maybe Sheet 4 or 5 in 12 your packet. But it just flows kind of starting -- the 13 southern end of that horse arena area flowing towards the east 14 into that pond overflows there into the next pond during large 15 heavy rain events overflowing, and then eventually makes its 16 way to the -- to the creek approximately 800 feet away or so 17 to the west.
18 And in Smart growth there is a water impoundment
19 protection provision for ponds that are greater than a
20 half-acre. Those ponds do not meet those criteria, and
21 they're not also proposing to alter those ponds either.
22 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Are those cattle watering
23 ponds?
24 MR. COMPTON: There is cattle or horses on the
25 pond section of the pond below -- south of the pad site, and
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 117
1 on the west of the pad site I believe -- I guess there's 2 buffalo and emu; and animals do go through those ponds. 3 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Well, the reason why I was 4 asking is according to when you look at the picture, the pond 5 on the farthest west looks like it's been bermed. 6 MR. COMPTON: It does. It's definitely
7 manmade. 8 CHAIR MURPHY: Did you say bermed or burned?
9 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Bermed, b-e-r-m-e-d. Page 109 0313og.txt 10 CHAIR MURPHY: Thank you. 11 VICE CHAIR RICH: Bermed, like you -- you -- 12 you berm it so that the cows can feed from it or water from it 13 is what I'm trying to get. So I'm looking at this as, yes, 14 okay, this is -- you know, we're in cattle area without a 15 doubt at one time. This looks like it had been man-bermed 16 instead of a natural occurring lake or even of a small area 17 like that. I mean, it's quite obvious on this western pond -- 18 to me it is very obvious that it's been bermed. The eastern 19 pond did not have visibility -- did not have good visibility
20 for me to actually see.
21 MR. COMPTON: Yeah. We have -- we have done
22 site evaluations. Both -- both of those ponds do not meet any
23 criteria for wetlands. They are wetlands; but they're not
24 jurisdictional in that they provide for, you know,
25 jurisdictional waterways and the right plant matter and things
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 118
1 like that associated with it. But they are technic -- they're
2 basically stock ponds, manmade stock ponds. Environmentally 3 sensitive, you know, they do have their benefits; but 4 obviously a wetland is -- jurisdictional wetland does have I 5 guess more ecological value than a stock pond does. 6 CHAIR MURPHY: While you're still there, the 7 yellow boundary line, is that the TxDOT line of where 1171 8 will be extended approximately?
9 MR. COMPTON: That's approximately the 10 right-of-way. And what we've identified this evening was the
11 ultimate right-of-way, so that was even closer than the Page 110 0313og.txt 12 proposed TxDOT road. So we only identify the variance to the 13 road as it's now -- stands now, and the ultimate right-of-way 14 is also being requested. Any new construction of that road 15 would be within that right-of-way that's being asked for 16 tonight. 17 CHAIR MURPHY: Any other questions for 18 Mr. Compton? Thank you, sir. Okay. At this point in time we 19 will close the meeting to public input, and we will deliberate 20 amongst ourselves before we make a motion for the variance 21 request. So at this point in time, you can't ask anymore
22 questions or make any oppositions or support for. It will be
23 a dialogue between the Board members. And at this point in
24 time, Fellow Board Members, I welcome the dialogue.
25 I do want to say one more thing. We do meet -- the
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 119
1 Zoning Board of Adjustment and the Oil and Gas Appeals Board
2 meet at the same time every month as long as there's a case,
3 and it's the second Wednesday of the month. I do encourage
4 you to follow the web site and any mailings you get to follow 5 what cases are on the agenda for that month. Because as you 6 can see tonight, it's an extremely important learning of 7 what's going on and how the Town is adhering to the ordinances 8 and the Smart growth and protecting the residents of this city 9 and making it one of the finest in the State of Texas. 10 So before we go into deliberations and conclude the
11 meeting, I just want to say that, that we encourage you to be 12 a part of the meeting. We encourage you to get involved and
13 get on one of the many, many boards that we have in the Town Page 111 0313og.txt 14 of Flower Mound. So with that, I will close the meeting to 15 the Board. 16 MR. LATHROM: So you've closed the public 17 hearing, correct? 18 CHAIR MURPHY: Thank you. I do close the 19 public hearing. 20 BOARD MEMBER RICH: I'd like to start off. 21 First of all, I'm very impressed with everybody that came out 22 tonight. I'm -- they're all probably bored to death at this 23 point and realize that the Oil and Gas Board is probably one
24 of the least exiting boards on the face of the earth and how
25 incredibly technical it is. And we seem to -- we seem to be,
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 120
1 you know, trying to define things that seem very obvious at
2 times and at other times; but we're very strict to the law.
3 And one of the things I appreciate is not only hearing from
4 people that are in support of something but also hearing from
5 people that are not in support of something and why they're
6 not in support. 7 And one of the things that struck me was we are a 8 board of exceptions, variances. That's why people have the 9 right to come in front of us. That does not mean that it's 10 automatic we grant them because somebody comes in front of us. 11 Quite the opposite. I think we were called the -- what was 12 it -- the Board of Denial for a long time, because it seemed
13 like we just never passed anything. The other thing that we 14 have to take into consideration was the statement about the
15 industrial sites are in direct conflict with master -- with Page 112 0313og.txt 16 the master plan. Many of these land owners and these mineral 17 right owners were here long before many of us have actually 18 ever graced the face of Flower Mound. 19 We have -- sorry. We take into consideration 20 everybody's rights; and that's a really tough thing, because 21 what we are not looking at is what we like or what we dislike. 22 Our personal likes and dislikes have nothing to do with this 23 issue. And if you don't think that's hard to sit on a board 24 where you dislike something and you do not want something and 25 yet you have to stand here and sit here in a very strong state
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 121
1 and say my preference is not relevant. My only point is to
2 evaluate somebody's desire and somebody's lack of desire and
3 how the code reads.
4 Everybody has the right to ask for a variance under
5 certain circumstances, and we do not have the right to give
6 our opinion on whether their variance is our preference. We
7 only go with what we're instructed to do, and that is look at
8 the criteria in which we have to look at. That being said, we 9 take very strongly the rights of all individuals that live in 10 Flower Mound to exercise their right of possession and their 11 right to use their land the way the Town variances, the Town 12 ordinances allow them to use their land. None of us like 13 anybody to tell them they can't do something on the property 14 in which they pay very large sums of money and blood every
15 year, month after month to support. 16 Whatever our vote is tonight has no relevance in any
17 way, shape or form to any of North Shore or any future Page 113 0313og.txt 18 developments, even on the left side of that yellow line. We 19 are trained, and we take it very serious that the only thing 20 ahead of us this evening is that one parcel. That is it. 21 What we do consider is the future development within that 22 parcel, because those land owners have told us we want to 23 develop this land; and in doing so, we realize that in the 24 future if somebody wants to physically develop the land for 25 homes they will have to come back in front of us and have a
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 122
1 very hard sell.
2 So in actuality, sometimes as we -- as we've looked
3 at a parcel of land we've said, I don't know why y'all want to
4 do anything with the mineral rights because you have just
5 hosed yourself in the future for any land development of a
6 residence on this piece of property. But again, that is not
7 our situation. We don't make that call. If somebody chooses
8 to be under such strict guidelines that they couldn't put --
9 they couldn't put a dog house on their land, that's their
10 right to do it; but that's what they've done. 11 CHAIR MURPHY: So in essence, by granting a 12 variance we've just preserved the conservation. 13 BOARD MEMBER RICH: At times, that's correct. 14 CHAIR MURPHY: That's what we have discovered 15 a lot of times. 16 BOARD MEMBER RICH: That is -- that at times
17 is correct. Now, this is not a highly -- this is not an ESA, 18 an environmentally sensitive area, a highly environmentally
19 sensitive area property. Directly north of there is. So I'm Page 114 0313og.txt 20 not really nervous about the ESA on this. There's some nice 21 property; but again, this is -- this is, you know, an area in 22 which they're running cattle right now. And if anybody knows 23 anything about the -- you know, cattle certainly are not the 24 most environmentally friendly individuals on the face of the 25 earth.
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 123
1 CHAIR MURPHY: I think this is also zoned, and
2 correct me if I'm incorrect, as it's a single family, one-acre
3 to two-acre estates, period. But as far as residential or
4 building, it's single family, two-acre estate; so there won't
5 be any big developments out there as far as close proximity to
6 houses like we've seen closer into the Town.
7 BOARD MEMBER RICH: That's a two-acre
8 minimum --
9 CHAIR MURPHY: Thank you.
10 BOARD MEMBER RICH: -- from our understanding.
11 Now, that doesn't include roads. That doesn't include
12 everything else. So when you get out there, like -- like we 13 have said, some people are going to have a hard time. They're 14 going -- they're going to come in the future and say we want 15 to subdivide this land, and we're going to say you sold your 16 right a long time ago. You can't get a school within 1,000 17 feet. You can't get a house within 1,000 feet. So where you 18 see that bulls eye right now, you're going to have some nice
19 green property for a very long time, because there's not going 20 to be much that they can do with that.
21 The -- a few of these I'm going to address, and then Page 115 0313og.txt 22 I'll let other people address them. I respect the right of 23 Mr. Robinson to state his preference of being opposed to the 24 property -- or excuse me, to the variance. He is within eight 25 feet of -- eight feet of the variance. I do respect his right
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 124
1 to oppose. Several of these variances are not to me critical,
2 and yet I obviously take them serious. The property in which
3 Mr. Bliss I believe owns and has the odd acreage split up, he
4 owns the long triangle -- not triangle, rectangle -- he owns
5 the long rectangle; but it's actually split into several --
6 well, two parcels.
7 That's such an odd variance, but -- or excuse me.
8 The request for the variance is really odd, and it puts our
9 property line so way under what we would even consider. I
10 think we have a 24-foot property -- variance to a property
11 line, but he owns the property north and south of there. So
12 some of these variances are odd just because of the way that
13 the land is situated. I think that is the case with the
14 storage tanks and right-of-way and the property line being 15 very, very close to what we -- what I would probably be 16 normally very uncomfortable with even considering. But 17 because it's the way that property's divided up and it doesn't 18 really impact a residence as much as it just impacts his 19 subdivided land, for whatever reason it got subdivided. I'll 20 let other Board Members jump in.
21 BOARD MEMBER MELUGIN: I will go next then. 22 And I have a couple of thoughts for the rest of the Board.
23 And I agree with Vice Chair Rich on a number of points that Page 116 0313og.txt 24 some of the variances are less impactful than others, in 25 particular the property lines, which is just a logistical, not
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 125
1 necessarily a realistic setback. What -- what concerns me and 2 what I don't like necessarily is that -- I do these 3 calculations, and I'm going to go down real quick, percentage
4 of the request that the setback is required; and this is how
5 much.
6 The first one is, for instance, a 48 percent
7 setback -- 44 percent.
8 CHAIR MURPHY: (Inaudible.)
9 BOARD MEMBER MELUGIN: This is -- well, I'm
10 not -- I can give you the specifics if you'd like to have them
11 actually. I'll do that.
12 CHAIR MURPHY: Yeah, do that.
13 BOARD MEMBER MELUGIN: Okay. The -- the
14 Waters of the State is requesting a 93 percent setback from --
15 from 500 down to 35, if I read that correctly. The Upland
16 Habitat is requesting -- and Dustan, I'll ask you to please 17 interrupt if I'm incorrect on these. But -- because my math 18 and my reading are not always straight. The Upland Habitat is 19 requesting a 40 percent variance. Residents without the 20 mineral interest is -- if we don't consider Mr. Bliss is -- 21 then we're down to only a .8 percent setback. Residents with 22 mineral interests, we're requesting a 20 percent setback.
23 Human occupied building, a 40 percent setback. Property line, 24 again, this is the odd one. Technically it's 95.2 percent,
25 but it's actually much higher -- much lower than that. Page 117 0313og.txt
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 126
1 Public road and right-of-way, and this is the one I 2 spoke on earlier that somewhat concerns me, is a 50.8 percent 3 setback; and that is to the ultimate right-of-way for TxDOT. 4 Tank batteries and residence, 49 percent setback. Tank 5 batteries and human occupied building, 19.2 percent setback.
6 Storage tanks and right-of-way, a 52.6 percent setback. And
7 finally storage tanks and property line, a 73.8 percent
8 setback. That's a lot of high numbers.
9 BOARD MEMBER RICH: But again -- excuse me.
10 On your storage tank and right-of-way, again you've got the
11 odd line of --
12 BOARD MEMBER MELUGIN: Oh, that's -- that's
13 right. There's a couple of them that are that way.
14 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Yeah.
15 BOARD MEMBER MELUGIN: But my -- my bigger
16 point is when we take a larger look at this, that's a lot
17 higher numbers. Now, I realize -- and if I asked you, you
18 would tell me like you've told me before, there's no place we 19 could put this where we would not have -- you would not have 20 to come back and ask for one setback; and I understand that. 21 I just don't necessarily know that this is the optimal 22 location for the interest of the Town as a whole or the 23 interest of the property or mineral rights owners. 24 And so I would like to see exploration of other
25 sites, of other locations if there are, because I don't
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 Page 118 0313og.txt 127
1 necessarily like granting variances with these high percentage 2 setbacks. The setbacks are there for a reason, like we said. 3 Some of them I don't necessarily -- some of them I feel 4 stronger about than others, let's put it that way. Either 5 way, these are high setback numbers; and I don't feel 6 comfortable necessarily with all of them, so -- 7 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: I'll add my comments,
8 too. I won't re -- I know the clock keeps ticking over there.
9 I've got one eye on the clock and one eye down here. It's
10 hard at times.
11 CHAIR MURPHY: Don't worry about the clock.
12 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: That's right. Don't
13 look at the clock. For the audience out there, as part of our
14 review there are 12 points that we must look at and consider
15 when we grant variances. And the variance, the way it's given
16 to us by the Town, the wisdom of the Town is we have to stay
17 within a certain box. That's our latitude. If we stay within
18 the box, we can grant variances. And the reason I say it, I
19 know there was good comments about what if there's an
20 explosion, what about -- what about buying water and all that. 21 Good points, not part of our mission tonight. 22 We're looking at variances and how far we can have 23 setbacks and deviations from what would not require variances. 24 The most important thing to me is our point 11 which is a 25 balancing act, and the keyword is balancing. Because when we
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 128
Page 119 0313og.txt
1 look at all of these factors that are put before us, and that 2 includes the mineral interest, the owner of the mineral 3 interest, the surface interest, the surrounding home owners, 4 the Applicant and the assemblage to the lease agreement, we 5 have to balance between what's considered to be a usable -- 6 reasonable use of the mineral estate and the availability of 7 alternative drill sites. 8 When I go through the mechanical exercise checklist 9 to try to come to an answer here, one of the first things I
10 look at, and that's why I'm dovetailing behind Mr. Melugin
11 over there, is alternate drill sites. You -- our -- and
12 again, the question again is are there any other alternate
13 drill sites that have less impact than what's being proposed
14 this evening; and that's the critical thing. You have to
15 demonstrate that there's less impact, this balancing act that
16 we go through, less impact than what we're looking at as
17 proposed. So I encourage somebody to come up and tell me
18 where the alternate site is that has less impact than this.
19 MR. LATHROM: Ask it in a --
20 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: So with permission, I'll
21 ask the Applicant --
22 CHAIR MURPHY: (Inaudible). 23 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: Sorry. I told you one 24 eye on the clock, one eye at the microphone. 25 MR. DOLLAK: Well Mr. Walker, you know, the
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 129
1 application -- I mean, we don't -- overnight we don't come up
Page 120 0313og.txt 2 with, you know, where this is at. This takes weeks of 3 surveying and looking at where it is and looking at the 4 mineral owners and the surface owners and their wishes and 5 desires. And we've come before you tonight with the best 6 based upon the input we've gotten from the surface owners, the 7 mineral owners, the drillers, ourselves out there surveying. 8 If -- if the Commission says that the four specimen 9 trees are not as important as being 297 feet from the road and 10 you want to be 380 so you get a better percentage, but we take 11 down, you know, specimen Blackjack oaks. I mean, we're all
12 looking at the same yellow line, the same boundaries, the same
13 houses, the same property owners out here in the audience that
14 represent this drill site.
15 You know, you've heard access, truck traffic, you
16 know, that's a key concern on getting in, getting out. Fire
17 protection to fight this, if you -- if you put this thing way
18 down in the corner down here, you know, getting Mike down
19 here; and then he tells me I've got to have two points of
20 access down there because I'm so far off of the road. I mean,
21 then I'm blazing a trail for another point of access. You
22 know, there's a -- there's a lot of challenges.
23 I could put this well pad site all over the place if
24 I can get their agreements, and then we would come up with 25 those lists of variances. And then would I be before you
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 130
1 again and say well, are these variances okay? I mean, we 2 truly have looked at it from safety, from the tree aspect, 3 because it's in the Conservation District. We don't want to
Page 121 0313og.txt 4 take down specimen trees. The desires of the surface owners, 5 I mean, the actual pad site that's granted from the surface 6 owner doesn't even own the minerals. The minerals are owned 7 by someone else. 8 So I mean, there's been a lot of coabulation 9 [phonetic] -- collaboration with all the people in this unit 10 on where the best thing would be for them as citizens and 11 mineral owners within the Town of Flower Mound on where to put 12 it. You know, if we were to push the site back, the 13 topography comes in. If you fill in this -- this stock tank,
14 Waters of the State, whatever you -- whatever we call it, it
15 wouldn't simply just be coming back and taking these trees
16 out. By the time you graded it back, you'd probably take all
17 these trees out just to push the pad back.
18 And what's that magic number? Do I come back at 400
19 feet? If I go 500 feet, you can see what 500 feet would be;
20 it'd be back here on Mr. Bliss's house. So what's that magic
21 number? It's a balancing act. And these ordinances are set
22 up, and I go at it systematically on every pad site I bring
23 before you on, you know, a logical reason why we think as a --
24 as a design team of professionals why this pad site would be
25 the best place for the citizens of Flower Mound. That's the
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 131
1 best answer I've got. 2 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: I think you're saying 3 that based on all of these impacts -- and again, I did the
4 preamble by saying less impact. I think you answered my 5 question.
Page 122 0313og.txt 6 MR. DOLLAK: Thanks. 7 CHAIR MURPHY: Thank you, Mr. Dollak. I agree 8 with Board Member Walker, it is a balancing act. There are a 9 couple of things -- I also like the mathematical equations of 10 Board Member Melugin. However, if one is not granted, it 11 would throw everything else off, because you can tell they've 12 really done their work to provide the best possible place, the 13 least invasive and the safest possible. 14 Although there are 11 criteria, not all of them have 15 to be met at one time. Because I really think the first one
16 being the special circumstances on the property the
17 application is made relate to size, shape and area, I think
18 that was given on just how the -- number one, it's a gas well
19 request. And that variance is necessary to permit the
20 Applicant the same rights -- and the Applicant being the
21 mineral right owners or the people that live in that area.
22 And they've given up any kind of future construction without
23 having to come back to the variance request.
24 I think they -- they -- on Number 11, as Board
25 Member Walker talked about, whether the impact on the adjacent
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 132
1 property and the general public by operations conducted in 2 compliance are reasonable and justified, and I think that was 3 given just because of the mineral right owners in that area. 4 And Fire Marshal Smith let us know that there was reasonable 5 access for town fire personnel and fire fighting equipment. I
6 think they've met most of the 11 criteria. 7 BOARD MEMBER POSTON: Madame Chair, are you
Page 123 0313og.txt 8 done? 9 CHAIR MURPHY: I'm done. I'm sorry, go ahead. 10 BOARD MEMBER POSTON: I have a question, if I 11 could -- I used to refer to him as Esteemed Counsel, but since 12 he's been promoted to partner I now call him Most Esteemed 13 Counsel. The letter that was in our packet from Mr. Robinson 14 expressing opposition to the granting of the variance, I found 15 that was fairly compelling until I heard that he had requested 16 financial consideration; yet there's no mention of 17 consideration in this letter. Now, should I regard or
18 disregard important to me information that was provided but
19 unconfirmed regarding Mr. Robinson's request for financial
20 consideration?
21 MR. LATHROM: The determination regarding the
22 quality and weight to be given to any evidence or testimony or
23 items that are presented to the Board of Adjustment -- excuse
24 me -- to the Oil and Gas Board of Appeals are within your
25 particular purview as to what kind of weight, what kind of
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1 credibility you want to grant to or give to those particular 2 items of evidence or that particular information that's 3 provided to you. 4 BOARD MEMBER POSTON: Thank you. Then I'll 5 just -- without trying to duplicate anything, let me just say 6 that there have been just so many wonderful relevant 7 illuminating comments by my Fellow Board Members. I would say
8 that with Board Member Melugin's math, I was sitting here 9 pretty much at the same time doing the same figures and coming
Page 124 0313og.txt 10 up with really the same conclusions; and that is that I am 11 very uncomfortable with the number of variances and the 12 relative high percentage of those numbers. 13 And couple that with the opposition from the -- from 14 the house of Mr. Robinson, and that gives me great, great 15 cause for concern. I think that the presentation by Bobby was 16 just superb. And one of the things that I picked up on was 17 when he mentioned that the best solution for them was the site 18 that has been selected. I'm thinking that could be the best 19 for them; but as with Board Member Melugin and also Board
20 Member Walker, I -- in the back of my mind I'm thinking is
21 there another solution that although it would present some
22 complications might be a little better.
23 So at this point I would agree with Madame Chairman
24 that the request meets most of the criteria; but unlike the
25 Board of Adjustment, what we have to do is we have to evaluate
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1 the relative importance of the ones that we have real issues
2 with. And right now I'm having great issues with several of 3 the criteria that we need to valuate. 4 BOARD MEMBER RICH: I want to go through and 5 just knock out a few of these and throw it back open for 6 discussion if that's the case. Waters of the State at a 93 7 percent dis -- decrease. I would regard -- although I 8 understand the definition of Waters of the State, I regard a 9 stock pond as a real stretch of my imagination to the Waters
10 of the State. Anything that has already been tampered with, 11 which that obviously has been, which has been heavily grazed,
Page 125 0313og.txt 12 which that obviously has been, although it is a very high 13 percentage at 93 percent, that is a stock pond. And it is 14 certainly not an environmentally sensitive area, nor is it an 15 area which has not had human impact. So Waters of the State I 16 have no problem with. 17 Upland Habitat, which is our ESA, is it not, I think 18 I've got 48 -- 48 percent impact on that; and that is, again, 19 northeast of this property at 1170 -- north of 1171. The 20 presence of 1171 the road which goes through that has already 21 impacted that area. I would not like it impacted further, but
22 the site that they're proposing has less disturbance than
23 if -- which was my original thought, like several of the other
24 members, is just move it down eight feet. I think we're --
25 we're all very sensitive to impacting any tree cover.
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 135
1 And the only other site that I see that has -- that
2 has no -- that has an area that is bare that had potential,
3 when you start really investigating it, it doesn't have
4 potential would be the middle corner on the left-hand side of 5 the east -- or the western side. And what you get into then 6 is a boundary line, and you get into a creek area; and you get 7 into two more stock ponds, the Waters of the State, that 8 aren't -- that doesn't even make sense. Plus you pull it 9 farther down off of 1171. 10 But that impacts -- that actually impacts a worse 11 situation if there was, you know, a fire or necessity of -- of
12 access for emergency crews; so I don't see that happening at 13 all. So I don't have a problem with Upland Habitat.
Page 126 0313og.txt 14 Residence without mineral interest at a .8 percent, again, I 15 respect Mr. Robinson's opposition. Residence with mineral 16 interest at 20 percent, this is when we get into the right of 17 the individual. What is the right of the individual that owns 18 the land? 19 If I want to do something with my land that would 20 cause me to request a variance, if I am not impacting anybody 21 else but the future development of my land -- not that it's an 22 absolute zero impact. If I wanted to put ten dogs on my land 23 and ask for a variance, yes, it would have an impact. It may
24 have a smell impact, it may have -- it may have a noise
25 impact; but -- and that's, you know, obviously a
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1 consideration. But we also have to consider the mineral
2 rights -- we have to respect the mineral right owner and the
3 fact that he is -- he, she, whomever is requesting this to
4 their residence. If they have no -- if they don't have a
5 concern that this is an issue, then at a 20 percent I'm not
6 really worried. 7 The human occupied building, that goes back to what 8 I would consider a barn, you know, a caretaker's property near 9 a horse stable. That's -- it's a horse stable. I don't 10 know -- you know, that's an animal occupied building. I guess 11 we could say animal rights might tell us that the animals 12 could be in danger, too. So I mean that's -- you know, we -- 13 we start getting into an issue of percentages. Property line,
14 again, we've discussed. I don't have an issue with it. 15 The public road and right-of-way, this is a setback
Page 127 0313og.txt 16 to a public road. I don't consider it -- I don't consider it 17 a total negative, though. And the reason why I say that is 18 because in actuality you're protecting more of the environment 19 by not having even a further drive on a further dusty road, 20 you know, getting further into a deeper area. So to me I'd 21 almost -- when I look at it, I almost hesitate in saying yes, 22 this is a variance. And I respect the fact that it's a 23 variance; but that -- but any time you get a major 24 thoroughfare, which it's going to be a major thoroughfare out 25 there -- it's already a major thoroughfare. Anytime you have
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1 that, you have multiple future setbacks coming.
2 So even though we're not addressing that tonight, I
3 don't see it as a huge major negative. That's -- that one I'm
4 not panicked over would be the best way of saying it. And
5 we're still 321 feet and 248 feet. It's not like we're ten
6 feet away from the roadway. We're still a considerable way
7 away from the roadway, so I'd almost rather the trucks get in
8 and get out instead of impacting a larger area. But that -- 9 you know, again I'm looking at it -- if we just -- if we just 10 strictly looked at percentage-wise, you know -- but I'm not, I 11 can't. We have to look at all factors. 12 Tank batteries and human occupied, again we're at a 13 19 percent. That doesn't -- it doesn't bother me that much. 14 That doesn't, to me, impress that much. Storage tanks and 15 right-of-way we discussed, because of the property line that's
16 a bizarre variance; and I'm not really concerned about it. 17 And the last one, again, is the storage tank issue. Overall
Page 128 0313og.txt 18 when we do run -- when we start -- when we start going over 19 all the variances and the reason for the variances, the 20 majority of them I don't have a problem with. 21 And again, this isn't like the Zoning Board of 22 Adjustment which every single four criteria have to be met. 23 This is not the case, because we've got 13 with some 24 subsections -- 12 with some subsections. To me this is an odd 25 property. Good luck finding another location. I don't see
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 138
1 another location. But I have seen other properties addressed
2 where we have said huh-uh, there's other locations, don't give
3 us the maximum -- the maximum productivity of the land.
4 There's no criteria here that says the mineral owner has the
5 right to maximum profit of his land despite all the other
6 variances.
7 So in this case, you know, I don't have a problem
8 with that. Number 2 is -- you know, that's a tough one. Here
9 we're asking does an owner of a property not have the right
10 that other owners of the property, including Mr. Robinson has 11 of enjoying the same -- same rights and the use of his 12 property that other people are using -- that other people are 13 enjoying. So I don't have a problem with number 2 at all. 14 Number 4, we're back into the variance, if granted, 15 will be no material detriment to the public welfare, injurious 16 use (inaudible) enjoyment or value of the property in the 17 vicinity. They're all happy with it. Number 6 -- sorry,
18 number 7, whether there are alternative well sites. I don't 19 see too many alternatives on this piece of property.
Page 129 0313og.txt 20 Whether -- number 8, whether the operations are consistent 21 with the health, safety and welfare of the public. If I've 22 got a captain over here telling me -- and I apologize if 23 I've -- if I've deranked you. We've never actually gotten 24 your title. 25 FIRE MARSHAL SMITH: It's actually battalion
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 139
1 chief. I went through that a long time ago.
2 BOARD MEMBER RICH: The Honorable Battalion
3 Chief Grand Puba of the fire station, when -- when we look at
4 him and we say -- you know, he would tell us. We have to rely
5 on some people's -- in some people's specialty in this area;
6 and if there was a fire issue, this man would stop this well.
7 It would not have come to our -- our table at all or he would
8 be jumping up and down saying no, this is not flying in our
9 town. And if the Council didn't -- didn't actually, you know,
10 support him, we would all be in trouble.
11 So if I am relying on my specialist, which I have to
12 in this case -- I am not a fire specialist. If I am relying 13 on him as I do and he's telling me he does not have a problem 14 with this, that he believes that he is confident and competent 15 of covering any fire situation out there, then I must trust 16 that he is accurate and he wouldn't be in the position that 17 he's in if that's the case. So I must say I'm confident with 18 that one, and I'm comfortable with that one. 19 We go back to number 9, which again, they've done --
20 done a great job with it (inaudible) that he -- normally they 21 don't always have to do. These are storm water documents that
Page 130 0313og.txt 22 are -- that oftentimes you don't even have to do on a piece of 23 property like this; so I appreciate Mr. Dollak doing -- you 24 know, saying that he does -- he insists on an SWPPP for that. 25 So -- and the best management practices of the -- we call them
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 140
1 socks, you can call them berms or whatever you want to call
2 them, the -- you know, I'm very, very familiar with that.
3 If they're microbial in nature, they do a great job
4 of cleansing; so I don't have any problem with the ground
5 water surface runoff. I'm very, very comfortable with that.
6 It's a closed loop sent -- closed loose -- closed loop system,
7 and that's very, very safe in consideration. Ten, back -- I'm
8 back to Battalion Chief and relying on him. Eleven, I've
9 got -- is the right of the mineral estate by the mineral owner
10 to explore, develop and produce the minerals, he -- it is
11 their right to do this. It is -- it is our obligation to see
12 whether the impact on the adjacent property and the general
13 public is in compliance with the oil, gas and combined well
14 permit conditions and are reasonable and justified. 15 Just like we have a right to say no in a heavily 16 populated area, that we don't want oil -- or excuse me -- gas 17 exploration, these people have the right to say we want it on 18 our property; and it's our right to exercise it if it does n't 19 impact the rest of us. And I guess that's where we get to the 20 rural and urban comments that were placed earlier tonight. 21 And I respect the fact that the people were so eloquent in
22 stating that in the right place but not under my house. In 23 the right place they have the right to exercise their mineral
Page 131 0313og.txt 24 rights. 25 And Mr. Compton, if he isn't the most diligent
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1 individual in the recommendations of our oil and gas 2 inspector, which he is -- I think that's what you are, aren't 3 you? Then we again rely on -- we have relied and continue to
4 rely on him to say I disagree with it and I'm not supporting
5 this, and he does tell us when he is in -- not in support of
6 these variances. So overall weight in my -- is every single
7 one of these am I absolutely thrilled out and 100 percent
8 behind, I think that they've done the best job in which they
9 could do under the circumstances to allow the mineral owners
10 to exercise their right as owners, to allow the Town to
11 protect themselves and to allow us to protect the Town in the
12 future from other situations that might arise of
13 overdevelopment or maximum development in an area.
14 This is going to be a nice area for a long time. We
15 cannot guarantee -- we cannot guarantee that 50 years from now
16 something won't happen, but I can't guarantee -- like when we 17 came in tonight, I'm sure that man that -- that was hit on the 18 motorcycle right in front of this building -- I don't know if 19 you guys all saw it. But at 5:30 tonight a man was hit right 20 in front of a motorcycle, I bet that was -- or on a 21 motorcycle. I bet that was not in his game plan on the way 22 home from work today. So we can and only -- we can only do as 23 far as we can see and project.
24 And there is an amazingly minuscule odds of anything 25 happening in this case given the new condition of this
Page 132 0313og.txt
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1 property, and I'm more confident with it than I probably am 2 driving halfway across the Town like I do every day and the 3 safety of it. 4 CHAIR MURPHY: Just quickly, I appreciate 5 Board Member Melugin's percentages; but I guess everything is 6 relative. It really doesn't make any sense to me as far as
7 the percentage of the setback request, because it was
8 explained the reason why; and we've gotten the ability to look
9 at it. One of the things was the Waters of the State and the
10 runoff and, quote, the pollution and the SWPPP. One of the
11 things we talked about with the Master Plan Update Committee
12 and we're talking about the water running off to Lake
13 Grapevine, and it became apparent that there is more pollution
14 running off from Tour 18 golf course that we have to worry
15 about every day.
16 And with the closed loop system and even if the
17 trucks have to be brought in, it's still much safer for our
18 environment and for our water than the fertilizers or the -- 19 the aerated septic tanks on the two-acre estates that water 20 the grass that runs into Lake Grapevine; so everything is 21 relative. As far as the -- to the -- next to the land -- I 22 mean, to 1171 the ultimate right-of-way, the well tower boom I 23 guess is the word for it or whatever the term is, is only 24 there for a short period of time, after which you would see 25 something as insignificant as a concrete pad and something
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1 about two feet sticking out of the ground; and that's all you 2 see from the right-of-way. 3 You can drive down even near the fire station over 4 in North Shore, you've got the power plant right behind it. 5 And then when you go down Bruton Orand you have the gas 6 transfer station. There's all these different things that are 7 right next to the road that we don't ever notice on a daily
8 basis, but they're there; so I really don't have a problem
9 supporting the variances. And if I think you -- if we deny
10 one, it would throw everything out of whack and it won't be in
11 balance; and it will not achieve the goal that they had
12 intended to achieve of protecting our environment, of
13 protecting the land and at the same time letting the land
14 owners enjoy their rights too. So I'm in favor of granting
15 the variance on all counts. Counsel?
16 MR. LATHROM: Yes?
17 BOARD MEMBER POSTON: If --
18 CHAIR MURPHY: Go ahead.
19 MR. POSTON: Okay. If I may, I'd like to --
20 this probably isn't the right word; but I'd like to rebut Vice 21 Chair Rich's -- at least one of her comments here. One of the 22 factors that was discussed was to permit the Applicant the 23 same rights and use of this property that are presently 24 enjoyed by other properties; and I believe she mentioned 25 enjoying the same rights as Robinson -- Mr. Robinson. What we
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 144
Page 134 0313og.txt 1 don't know is if there's a variation if it had been either 2 requested or approved on there. So I don't think we can say 3 that the rights are not being the same rights, because I 4 wouldn't equate equivalency in the two issues. 5 In other words, we don't know about the case of the 6 Robinsons. And if we knew that there had been variances 7 granted, then would that matter because even at the beginning 8 of this we discussed that each case may stand on its own. I'm 9 still having -- although I would agree that I'm a little less 10 concerned with the Waters of the State, I'm very concerned
11 with that house, the setback from -- from the road, the tank
12 batteries and the storage tanks. And I continue to be
13 concerned over the number of variances.
14 And as I go to number 11 on our criteria list, I
15 think the keyword here isn't rights. I respect rights. But
16 to me that there are a number of variances, and if it was just
17 about rights, then these rights would be the equivalent of
18 entitlement and there would be no reason for this Board. My
19 issue with this case is the use of the word reasonable in 11A,
20 and I haven't been convinced that the variances are reasonable
21 with that criteria; and that's very important to me.
22 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Which -- which human 23 occupied building are you concerned with? 24 BOARD MEMBER POSTON: I didn't mention 25 a building. Oh, you mean the house -- the house that is the
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 145
1 Robinson house, the one that is I think 992 feet away.
2 CHAIR MURPHY: You don't -- Page 135 0313og.txt 3 BOARD MEMBER RICH: You're worried about an 4 eight-foot variance? A variance of .8 percent is what I'm 5 trying to say, .8 percent on that? 6 BOARD MEMBER POSTON: It's a concern, yes. 7 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Well, it's a concern and 8 being worried are two different -- two different -- 9 BOARD MEMBER POSTON: I think, again, that I 10 look at those percentages, the numbers of waivers; and you 11 know, to me -- and part of me says I'm looking at this letter 12 at face value. If that were my house, that eight feet might
13 be important.
14 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Well, I have to look --
15 yeah, I agree with you that, of course, we're looking at all
16 of the factors. But we're also of the knowledge -- we do not
17 know that there's any variances on the property that
18 Mr. Robinson -- but we do know that he's a mineral rights
19 owner. In fact, I couldn't even tell you if we've ever had a
20 case with that; and I don't -- I do not look as -- I don't
21 think any of us look in our minds at what -- oh, that was
22 the -- that's the Crowe whatever, you know, property or that's
23 the Wilson property or something. When -- when we look at
24 this, I don't even look -- all I look at is this particular 25 property. But we do know that he's a mineral right owner, not
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 146
1 on this lease; but he is a mineral right owner. 2 CHAIR MURPHY: The other thing that I take 3 into consideration even with the number of requests is just
4 for the sheer fact that there's this much protection going on Page 136 0313og.txt 5 to make sure nothing go awry. I think that's the way I look 6 at it, instead of just saying well, we'll just, you know, 7 drill the well and worry about something else later. They've 8 taken everything into consideration and pictured -- painted 9 the whole scenario so that everything could be protected, 10 preserved and everyone work the way it should. 11 And again, I do put my faith in -- and trust into 12 Town Staff, because they do a very thorough job of researching 13 it. And if it doesn't work and it's not going to work, we 14 don't see it. And I might point out there are still a lot of
15 gas wells that have been drilled in our town's city limits
16 that never came before the Oil and Gas Board of Appeals
17 because they didn't need a variance.
18 BOARD MEMBER RICH: And the other
19 consideration that we make, which I think, Dustan, you've
20 mentioned several times is there are not a lot of companies
21 that are allowed to drill here. We -- we have been -- you
22 have been very good about keeping bad drillers out, you know.
23 I mean, that's -- that's the best way of saying it. Our
24 variances do not allow bad drillers, because we -- Dustan does
25 a really good job of making sure that everybody's miserable
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 147
1 before they finally finish this process. So you know, and I 2 look at it that way and say I -- you know, I feel like just 3 like maybe the developers feel like we've been too tough on --
4 on developers developing in Flower Mound. 5 I think Bobby might agree that those developers, he
6 would love to be a developer instead of -- instead of in Page 137 0313og.txt 7 charge of this exploration stuff, because I think we've 8 probably been tougher on the -- the oil and gas guys than 9 we've ever been on developers. But that's -- you know, 10 there'd be developers that would disagree with that statement, 11 too. 12 CHAIR MURPHY: And I also think the Town has 13 put together -- even with the whole ordinance that we know 14 what we have, and we know what we're up against instead of 15 just guessing it along the line. And that's why I appreciate 16 that the Town works with the -- with Mr. Dollak and some of
17 these other requests and that they do come before us and talk
18 about a variance. And we have not always granted variances on
19 anything if there's another solution that comes back to us.
20 But we need to make a decision whether we make a motion to
21 grant the variance or we make a motion to table it, because it
22 is 11:30 and everyone is getting tired, including me, and out
23 of respect to the Applicants, to the audience and to the Board
24 and to the Staff. And Matt, did you say there was something
25 we needed to talk with Counsel on in the wording of the
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 148
1 variance? 2 MR. WOODS: Dustan will provide you with 3 amended draft motions. 4 CHAIR MURPHY: Are we ready to go to a motion? 5 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: I'm willing to make a
6 motion. 7 MR. LATHROM: If I may, Madame Chair, before
8 we make the motion let me just explain to the audience that -- Page 138 0313og.txt 9 that one of the things that we do when we have a variance that 10 comes before the Oil and Gas Board of Appeals, we'll -- or the 11 Board of Adjustment is that we'll prepare a motion for the 12 Board to utilize. The Oil and Gas Board of Appeals, their 13 determinations, as with the Board of Adjustment, requires a 14 super majority vote. You have to have at least four of the 15 five members of the Board of Adjustment or Oil and Gas Board 16 of Appeals to vote in support of a motion for it to carry. 17 So all of the motions that are made, 99 percent of 18 the motions that are made by the Oil and Gas Board of Appeals
19 or the Zoning Board of Adjustment are made in the affirmative.
20 You know, those of you who saw the sign variance that was
21 sought earlier that was denied by the Board of Adjustment,
22 there was a motion made to approve the request for that
23 variance. The motions we've provided for use by the Oil and
24 Gas Board of Appeals are all in the affirmative, because there
25 again, it requires four affirmative votes to approve any
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 149
1 motion that is made by the Board of Appeals. 2 So sometimes you think it's a little bit awkward, 3 somebody may vote against a motion that they make; but there's 4 no requirement that you actually vote in favor of a motion 5 that you make or a motion that you second under Roberts Rules 6 of Order. 7 CHAIR MURPHY: And I'd also like to point out
8 that Board Member Melugin did have to go. He had a family 9 minor emergency. So he may be back, but I -- in that case we
10 have our alternate Board Member Ward which will be voting in Page 139 0313og.txt 11 his place. He sat with us the whole time. 12 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: Do we have to read each 13 one of these and -- I mean, it's -- some people will fall 14 asleep I think. There's 11 motions that -- draft motions. Do 15 they have to be read verbatim, or can we reference? 16 MR. LATHROM: Board Member Walker, you're not 17 going to like my recommendation. 18 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Read them verbatim. Read 19 them verbatim. If you want to do some of the motions, and 20 then we'll continue onto -- so other people can --
21 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: Okay. This is going to
22 be a little bit like grade school, everybody gets a chance to
23 read for the teacher.
24 MR. LATHROM: Yes.
25 CHAIR MURPHY: Yes, sir.
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 150
1 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: Okay. I'll make a
2 motion to approve the request for -- this is in reference to
3 GO-08-0120, public hearing to consider a request from Braden 4 Exploration. The first draft motion concerning Waters of the 5 State, I move to approve the request for a variance to the 6 environmentally sensitive area Waters of the State setback 7 requirements stated in Section 34-420N Oil and Gas Well Permit 8 Required of the Land Development Regulations to allow the 9 Armstrong Huggins gas well pad site and associated edge of
10 construction limits to be situated no closer than 35 and 100 11 feet from the Waters of the State located to the south and
12 southwest respectively of the gas well pad site. Page 140 0313og.txt 13 CHAIR MURPHY: Second. 14 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Poston? 15 BOARD MEMBER POSTON: Aye. 16 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Walker? 17 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: Aye. 18 MR. COMPTON: Vice Chair Rich? 19 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Aye. 20 MR. COMPTON: Chair Murphy? 21 CHAIR MURPHY: Aye. 22 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Ward?
23 BOARD MEMBER WARD: Aye.
24 CHAIR MURPHY: Granted. Okay, next.
25 BOARD MEMBER RICH: All right. We'll figure
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 151
1 this out, we'll get quicker. Again, Counsel, please change --
2 please correct us if this isn't -- isn't correct. Ongoing to
3 the item GO-08-0120, the next motion in consideration is to
4 move to approve the request for a variance to the
5 environmentally sensitive area Upland Habitat setback 6 requirements stated in Section 34-420N Oil and Gas Well Permit 7 Required of the Land Development Regulations to allow the 8 Armstrong Huggins gas well pad site and associated edge of 9 construction limit to be situated no closer than 260 feet from 10 the Upland Habitat located to the northeast of the gas well 11 pad site.
12 CHAIR MURPHY: Second. 13 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Ward?
14 BOARD MEMBER WARD: Aye. Page 141 0313og.txt 15 MR. COMPTON: Chair Murphy? 16 CHAIR MURPHY: Aye. 17 MR. COMPTON: Vice Chair Rich? 18 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Aye. 19 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Walker? 20 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: Aye. 21 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Poston? 22 BOARD MEMBER POSTON: Aye. 23 CHAIR MURPHY: Granted. I make a motion to 24 vote, part of the GO-08120 Item 3, residence without mineral
25 interest, move to approve the request for a variance to the
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 152
1 residence setback requirements stated in Section 34-422 D1D
2 Oil and Gas Well Permit of the Land Development Regulations to
3 allow the Armstrong Huggins 1H and 2H gas wells to be situated
4 no closer than 560 feet to 992 feet from a residence owned by
5 a person that does not have a mineral interest in the permit
6 application located to the south and north respectively of the
7 gas well pad site on property identified is DCAD Parcel 8 Numbers R65035 and R176045. 9 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Second. 10 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Poston? 11 BOARD MEMBER POSTON: Nay. 12 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Walker? 13 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: Aye.
14 MR. COMPTON: Vice Chair Rich? 15 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Aye.
16 MR. COMPTON: Chair Murphy? Page 142 0313og.txt 17 CHAIR MURPHY: Aye. 18 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Ward? 19 BOARD MEMBER WARD: Aye. 20 CHAIR MURPHY: Not approved. It was for? 21 MR. LATHROM: That is correct, it was 22 approved. 23 CHAIR MURPHY: Oh, excuse me. 24 MR. LATHROM: Four -- four in support and one 25 in opposition.
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 153
1 CHAIR MURPHY: All right. Oh, I thought he
2 said no.
3 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Did you say no?
4 BOARD MEMBER WARD: I said Aye.
5 CHAIR MURPHY: Oh, Aye, okay. Granted. Okay,
6 Jim, take the next one.
7 BOARD MEMBER WARD: Okay. Continuing on Item
8 GO-08-0120 and then on Item Number 4 residence with mineral
9 interest, I move to approve the request for a variance to the 10 residence setback requirements stated in Section 34-422 D1C 11 Oil and Gas Well Permit of the Land Development Regulations to 12 allow the Armstrong Huggins 1H and 2H gas wells to be situated 13 no closer than 400 feet from a residents owned by a person 14 that does -- that does have a mineral interest in the permit 15 application located to the east of the gas well pad site on
16 property identified as DCAD Parcel Number R177478. 17 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Second.
18 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Ward? Page 143 0313og.txt 19 BOARD MEMBER WARD: Aye. 20 MR. COMPTON: Chair Murphy? 21 CHAIR MURPHY: Aye. 22 MR. COMPTON: Vice Chair Rich? 23 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Aye. 24 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Walker? 25 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: Aye.
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 154
1 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Poston?
2 BOARD MEMBER POSTON: Aye.
3 CHAIR MURPHY: Granted.
4 BOARD MEMBER POSTON: So is it my turn to
5 read?
6 CHAIR MURPHY: Yes, sir.
7 BOARD MEMBER POSTON: If I read this one, then
8 Mr. Walker has to read the long one after me. I'd like to
9 continue on and recommend that we approve GO-08-0120,
10 Subsection 5, Human Occupied Building. Move to approve the
11 request for a variance to the building used or designed and 12 intended to be used for human occupancy setback requirements 13 as stated in Section 34-422 D1E Oil and Gas Well Permit of the 14 Land Development Regulations to allow the Armstrong Huggins 1H 15 and 2H gas wells to be situated no closer than 300 feet from a 16 building used or designed and intended to be used for human 17 occupancy located to the east of the gas well pad site on
18 property identified as DCAD Parcel Number R177478. 19 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Second.
20 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Poston? Page 144 0313og.txt 21 BOARD MEMBER POSTON: Aye. 22 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Walker? 23 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: Aye. 24 MR. COMPTON: Vice Chair Rich? 25 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Aye.
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 155
1 MR. COMPTON: Chair Murphy?
2 CHAIR MURPHY: Aye.
3 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Ward?
4 BOARD MEMBER WARD: Aye.
5 CHAIR MURPHY: Granted.
6 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: I'll make another
7 motion, reference GO-08-0120, property line. A motion to
8 approve the request for a variance to the property line
9 setback requirements stated in Section 34-422D1F Oil and Gas
10 Well Permit of the Land Development Regulations to allow the
11 Armstrong Huggins 1H and 2H gas wells to be situated no closer
12 than 24 feet from the nearest property line of property
13 identified by DCAD Parcel R65035 to the east of the gas well 14 pad site, 186 feet from the nearest property line of property 15 identified by DCAD Parcel R177478 also to the east, 260 feet 16 from the nearest property line of property identified by DCAD 17 Parcel Number R177479 to the southeast, 159 feet from the 18 nearest property line of property identified by DCAD Parcel 19 R286976 to the west, 279 feet from the nearest property line
20 of property identified by DCAD Parcel Number R166756 to the 21 north, and 379 feet from the nearest property line of property
22 identified by DCAD Parcel R65070 also situated north of the Page 145 0313og.txt 23 gas well pad site. 24 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Second. 25 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Ward?
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 156
1 BOARD MEMBER WARD: Aye. 2 MR. COMPTON: Chair Murphy?
3 CHAIR MURPHY: Aye.
4 MR. COMPTON: Vice Chair Rich?
5 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Aye.
6 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Walker?
7 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: Aye.
8 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Poston?
9 BOARD MEMBER POSTON: Aye.
10 CHAIR MURPHY: Granted.
11 BOARD MEMBER RICH: I'd like to make a motion,
12 continuation GO-08-0120, 7, Public Road and Right-of-Way.
13 Move to approve the request for a variance to the public road
14 and right-of-way setback requirements stated in Section
15 34-422D1H Oil and Gas Well Permit of the Land Development 16 Regulations to allow the Armstrong Huggins 1H and 2H gas wells 17 to be situated no closer than 321 feet from the public road 18 and no closer than 246 feet from the ultimate TxDOT 19 right-of-way located to the north of the gas well pad site. 20 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: Second. 21 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Poston?
22 BOARD MEMBER POSTON: Nay. 23 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Walker?
24 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: Aye. Page 146 0313og.txt 25 MR. COMPTON: Vice Chair Rich?
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1 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Aye. 2 MR. COMPTON: Chair Murphy? 3 CHAIR MURPHY: Aye. 4 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Ward?
5 BOARD MEMBER WARD: Aye.
6 CHAIR MURPHY: Granted. My turn. In relation
7 to GO-08-0120, Item Number 8, Tank Batteries and Residence.
8 Move to approve the request for a variance to the tank
9 battery, compression facilities, well facilities and equipment
10 setback requirements stated in Section 34-422 D2 Oil and Gas
11 Well Permit of the Land Development Regulations to allow tank
12 batteries and associated equipment for the Armstrong Huggins
13 gas well pad site to be situated no closer than 510 feet from
14 the closest exterior point of the residence on property
15 identified by DCAD Parcel Number 177478 to the east of the gas
16 well -- gas well pad site, 534 feet from the closest exterior
17 point on the residence on property identified by DCAD Parcel 18 Number R65035 to the south of the site and 933 feet from the 19 closest exterior point of the residence on the property 20 identified by DCAD Parcel Number R176045 to the north of the 21 gas well pad site. 22 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Second. 23 MR. LATHROM: Madame Chair, if I may, that
24 reference to DCAD Parcel Number 177478 should be R177478. My 25 apologies.
Page 147 0313og.txt CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 158
1 CHAIR MURPHY: R177478, okay. Thank you. Do 2 we have a second? 3 BOARD MEMBER RICH: I seconded. 4 CHAIR MURPHY: Okay. 5 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Ward? 6 BOARD MEMBER WARD: Aye.
7 MR. COMPTON: Chair Murphy?
8 CHAIR MURPHY: Aye.
9 MR. COMPTON: Vice Chair Rich?
10 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Aye.
11 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Walker?
12 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: Aye.
13 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Poston?
14 BOARD MEMBER POSTON: Nay.
15 CHAIR MURPHY: Granted.
16 BOARD MEMBER WARD: Continuing with item
17 GO-08-0120, Subsection 9, Tank Batteries and Human Occupied
18 Building. I move to approve the request for a variance to the
19 tank batteries, compression facilities, well facilities and 20 equipment setback requirements stated in Section 34-422 D2 Oil 21 and Gas Well Permit of the Land Development Regulations to 22 allow the tank batteries and associated equipment for the 23 Armstrong Huggins gas well pad site to be situated no closer 24 than 404 feet from the building used or designed and intended 25 to be used for human occupancy located on property identified
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1 by DCAD Parcel Number R177478 to the east of the gas well pad 2 site. 3 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Second. 4 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Poston? 5 BOARD MEMBER POSTON: Nay. 6 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Walker? 7 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: Aye. 8 MR. COMPTON: Vice Chair Rich?
9 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Aye.
10 MR. COMPTON: Chair Murphy?
11 CHAIR MURPHY: Aye.
12 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Ward?
13 BOARD MEMBER WARD: Aye.
14 CHAIR MURPHY: Granted.
15 BOARD MEMBER POSTON: Continuing, I'd like to
16 move that we approve GO-08-0120 Subsection 10, Storage Tanks
17 and Right-of-Way. Move to approve the request for a variance
18 to the storage tank setback requirements stated in Section
19 34-427 A35A Technical Requirements of the Land Development
20 Regulations to allow the storage tanks location for the
21 Armstrong Huggins gas well pad site to be situated no closer 22 than 237 feet from the ultimate TxDOT right-of-way located to 23 the north of the gas well pad site. 24 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Second. 25 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Poston?
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Page 149 0313og.txt 1 BOARD MEMBER POSTON: Nay. 2 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Walker? 3 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: Aye. 4 MR. COMPTON: Vice Chair Rich? 5 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Aye. 6 MR. COMPTON: Chair Murphy? 7 CHAIR MURPHY: Aye. 8 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Ward? 9 BOARD MEMBER WARD: Aye. 10 CHAIR MURPHY: Granted.
11 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: And finally, reference
12 GO-08-0120, Motion Number 11. I move to approve -- reference
13 Storage Tanks and Property Line. I move to approve the
14 request for a variance to the storage tanks setback
15 requirements stated in Section 34-427 A35A Technical
16 Requirements of the Land Development Regulations to allow the
17 storage tanks location for the Armstrong Huggins gas well pad
18 site to be situated no closer than 131 feet from the nearest
19 property line of property identified by DCAD Parcel Number
20 R65035 to the east of the gas well pad site, 300 feet from the
21 nearest property line of property identified by DCAD Parcel
22 Number R177478, also to the east, 312 feet from the nearest
23 property line of property identified by DCAD Parcel Number 24 R17749 to the southeast, 462 feet from the nearest property 25 line of property identified by DCAD Parcel Number R65035 to
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1 the south, 50 feet from the nearest property line of property
2 identified by DCAD Parcel Number R286976 to the west, 275 feet
Page 150 0313og.txt 3 from the nearest property line of property identified by DCAD 4 Parcel R166756 to the north, and 362 feet from the nearest 5 property line of property identified by DCAD Parcel Number 6 R65070 also situated north of the gas well pad site. 7 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Second. 8 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Ward? 9 BOARD MEMBER WARD: Aye. 10 MR. COMPTON: Chair Murphy? 11 CHAIR MURPHY: Aye. 12 MR. COMPTON: Vice Chair Rich?
13 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Aye.
14 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Walker?
15 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: Aye.
16 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Poston?
17 BOARD MEMBER POSTON: Nay.
18 CHAIR MURPHY: Granted. Okay, next item,
19 we're going to need a motion.
20 BOARD MEMBER RICH: This time I'd like to move
21 that we table the motion -- which one are we --
22 CHAIR MURPHY: There you go.
23 BOARD MEMBER RICH: -- G0 -- GO-08-0728 to the
24 next regularly scheduled Oil and Gas Board public hearing to
25 consider the request from Red Oak Gas Operating, LP, for a
CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING (214) 320-9911 162
1 variance from Section 34-420 K and N under Oil and Gas Well 2 Permit Required, Section 34-422 D under Oil and Gas Well
3 Permit, and Section 34-427 A35 under Technical Requirements. 4 The request is to decrease floodplain, environmentally
Page 151 0313og.txt 5 sensitive area, public park, residence property line, tank 6 battery and storage tank setback requirements for one natural 7 gas well permit known as McDowell Number 1H. 8 The properties involved -- involved is generally 9 located east of FM 2499 Long Prairie Road, north of Euclid 10 Avenue, west of Morriss and south of Timber Creek Trail. 11 The purpose for the table is at this time it's 11:54 p.m. on 12 the 12th of March. 13 BOARD MEMBER WARD: Second. 14 CHAIR MURPHY: Have a vote?
15 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Poston?
16 BOARD MEMBER POSTON: Nay.
17 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Walker?
18 BOARD MEMBER WALKER: Aye.
19 MR. COMPTON: Vice Chair Rich?
20 BOARD MEMBER RICH: Aye.
21 MR. COMPTON: Chair Murphy?
22 CHAIR MURPHY: Aye.
23 MR. COMPTON: Board Member Ward?
24 BOARD MEMBER WARD: Aye.
25 CHAIR MURPHY: So we will table this and move
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1 it to the next scheduled meeting for the Town of Flower Mound 2 Oil and Gas Appeals Board which will be the second Wednesday 3 of April. I don't know what the date is. Thank you. Good 4 night. Be careful. Bye now.
5 (The meeting was adjourned.) 6
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1 STATE OF TEXAS ) 2 COUNTY OF DALLAS ) 3 This is to certify that I, Sherry Patterson, a 4 Certified Shorthand Reporter in and for the State of Texas, do 5 hereby certify that the foregoing transcript is a true, 6 correct and complete transcription, to the best of my ability,
7 of the videotaped proceedings had in the above-entitled matter 8 and that I was not physically present during the recording of
Page 153 0313og.txt 9 such videotape. 10 Certified to on this the 31st day of March, 2008. 11 12 13 ______Sherry Patterson, CSR No. 7607 14 Date of Expiration: 12/31/08 CREWS CERTIFIED REPORTING 15 Firm Registration No. 271 6922 Mistletoe Drive 16 Dallas, Texas 75223 (214) 320-9911 17 18
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