Oversight Field Hearing Committee on Resources U.S
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CRISIS ON THE NATIONAL FORESTS: CONTAINING THE THREAT OF WILDLAND FIRE TO THE ENVIRONMENT AND COMMUNITIES OVERSIGHT FIELD HEARING BEFORE THE SUBCOMMITTEE ON FORESTS AND FOREST HEALTH OF THE COMMITTEE ON RESOURCES U.S. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES ONE HUNDRED EIGHTH CONGRESS FIRST SESSION Friday, March 7, 2003 in Flagstaff, Arizona Serial No. 108-5 Printed for the use of the Committee on Resources ( Available via the World Wide Web: http://www.access.gpo.gov/congress/house or Committee address: http://resourcescommittee.house.gov U.S. GOVERNMENT PRINTING OFFICE 85-487 PS WASHINGTON : 2003 For sale by the Superintendent of Documents, U.S. Government Printing Office Internet: bookstore.gpo.gov Phone: toll free (866) 512–1800; DC area (202) 512–1800 Fax: (202) 512–2250 Mail: Stop SSOP, Washington, DC 20402–0001 VerDate 11-MAY-2000 10:34 Jun 26, 2003 Jkt 000000 PO 00000 Frm 00001 Fmt 5011 Sfmt 5011 85487.TXT HRESOUR1 PsN: HRESOUR1 COMMITTEE ON RESOURCES RICHARD W. POMBO, California, Chairman NICK J. RAHALL II, West Virginia, Ranking Democrat Member Don Young, Alaska Dale E. Kildee, Michigan W.J. ‘‘Billy’’ Tauzin, Louisiana Eni F.H. Faleomavaega, American Samoa Jim Saxton, New Jersey Neil Abercrombie, Hawaii Elton Gallegly, California Solomon P. Ortiz, Texas John J. Duncan, Jr., Tennessee Frank Pallone, Jr., New Jersey Wayne T. Gilchrest, Maryland Calvin M. Dooley, California Ken Calvert, California Donna M. Christensen, Virgin Islands Scott McInnis, Colorado Ron Kind, Wisconsin Barbara Cubin, Wyoming Jay Inslee, Washington George Radanovich, California Grace F. Napolitano, California Walter B. Jones, Jr., North Carolina Tom Udall, New Mexico Chris Cannon, Utah Mark Udall, Colorado John E. Peterson, Pennsylvania Anı´bal Acevedo-Vila´, Puerto Rico Jim Gibbons, Nevada, Brad Carson, Oklahoma Vice Chairman Rau´ l M. Grijalva, Arizona Mark E. Souder, Indiana Dennis A. Cardoza, California Greg Walden, Oregon Madeleine Z. Bordallo, Guam Thomas G. Tancredo, Colorado George Miller, California J.D. Hayworth, Arizona Edward J. Markey, Massachusetts Tom Osborne, Nebraska Rube´n Hinojosa, Texas Jeff Flake, Arizona Ciro D. Rodriguez, Texas Dennis R. Rehberg, Montana Joe Baca, California Rick Renzi, Arizona Betty McCollum, Minnesota Tom Cole, Oklahoma Stevan Pearce, New Mexico Rob Bishop, Utah Devin Nunes, California VACANCY Steven J. Ding, Chief of Staff Lisa Pittman, Chief Counsel Michael S. Twinchek, Chief Clerk James H. Zoia, Democrat Staff Director Jeffrey P. Petrich, Democrat Chief Counsel SUBCOMMITTEE ON FORESTS AND FOREST HEALTH SCOTT McINNIS, Colorado, Chairman JAY INSLEE, Washington, Ranking Democrat Member John J. Duncan, Jr., Tennessee Dale E. Kildee, Michigan Walter B. Jones, Jr., North Carolina Tom Udall, New Mexico John E. Peterson, Pennsylvania Mark Udall, Colorado Thomas G. Tancredo, Colorado Anı´bal Acevedo-Vila´, Puerto Rico J.D. Hayworth, Arizona Brad Carson, Oklahoma Jeff Flake, Arizona VACANCY Dennis R. Rehberg, Montana VACANCY Rick Renzi, Arizona VACANCY Stevan Pearce, New Mexico Nick J. Rahall II, West Virginia, ex officio Richard W. Pombo, California, ex officio (II) VerDate 11-MAY-2000 10:34 Jun 26, 2003 Jkt 000000 PO 00000 Frm 00002 Fmt 5904 Sfmt 5904 85487.TXT HRESOUR1 PsN: HRESOUR1 CONTENTS Page Hearing held on March 7, 2003 .............................................................................. 1 Statement of Members: Flake, Hon. Jeff, a Representative in Congress from the State of Arizona, Prepared statement submitted for the record ............................................ 108 Gibbons, Hon. Jim, a Representative in Congress from the State of Nevada ........................................................................................................... 11 Hayworth, Hon. J.D., a Representative in Congress from the State of Arizona ........................................................................................................... 12 Prepared statement of ............................................................................... 13 McInnis, Hon. Scott, a Representative in Congress from the State of Colorado ......................................................................................................... 4 Prepared statement of ............................................................................... 6 Pombo, Hon. Richard W., a Representative in Congress from the State of California ................................................................................................... 7 Prepared statement of ............................................................................... 8 Renzi, Hon. Rick, a Representative in Congress from the State of Arizona 10 Shadegg, Hon. John, a Representative in Congress from the State of Arizona ........................................................................................................... 15 Walden, Hon. Greg, a Representative in Congress from the State of Oregon ............................................................................................................ 8 Statement of Witnesses: Ack, Bradley L., Program Director, Grand Canyon Trust ............................ 92 Prepared statement of ............................................................................... 94 Cassatt, Sarah, Gardens Manager, The Arboretum at Flagstaff ................. 70 Prepared statement of ............................................................................... 72 Covington, W. Wallace, Ph.D., Regents’ Professor and Director of the Ecological Restoration Institute, Northern Arizona University ................ 64 Prepared statement of ............................................................................... 65 Donaldson, Hon. Joseph C., Mayor, City of Flagstaff, Arizona .................... 2 Prepared statement of ............................................................................... 3 Gibson, Kent B., Pulp & Paperworkers Resource Council ............................ 85 Prepared statement of ............................................................................... 86 Kelley, Hon. Gene, Mayor, City of Show Low, Arizona ................................. 29 Prepared statement of ............................................................................... 31 Kolb, Thomas, Ph.D., School of Forestry, Northern Arizona University ..... 75 Prepared statement of ............................................................................... 77 Laverty, Lyle, Director, Colorado State Parks, State of Colorado ................ 43 Prepared statement of ............................................................................... 45 Massey, Dallas, Chairman, White Mountain Apache Tribe .......................... 38 Prepared statement of ............................................................................... 40 Moore, Patrick, Ph.D., Chairman and Chief Scientist, Greenspirit Strategies Ltd. ............................................................................................... 58 Prepared statement of ............................................................................... 60 Rey, Hon. Mark, Under Secretary, Natural Resources and the Environment, U.S. Department of Agriculture .......................................... 17 Prepared statement of ............................................................................... 23 Watson, Hon. Rebecca W., Assistant Secretary, Land and Minerals Management, U.S. Department of the Interior .......................................... 20 Prepared statement of ............................................................................... 23 (III) VerDate 11-MAY-2000 10:34 Jun 26, 2003 Jkt 000000 PO 00000 Frm 00003 Fmt 5904 Sfmt 5904 85487.TXT HRESOUR1 PsN: HRESOUR1 VerDate 11-MAY-2000 10:34 Jun 26, 2003 Jkt 000000 PO 00000 Frm 00004 Fmt 5904 Sfmt 5904 85487.TXT HRESOUR1 PsN: HRESOUR1 OVERSIGHT FIELD HEARING ON ‘‘CRISIS ON THE NATIONAL FORESTS: CONTAINING THE THREAT OF WILDLAND FIRE TO THE ENVI- RONMENT AND COMMUNITIES’’ Friday, March 7, 2003 U.S. House of Representatives Subcommittee on Forests and Forest Health Committee on Resources Flagstaff, Arizona The Subcommittee met, pursuant to call, at 9:53 a.m., in the City Council Chambers, City Hall, Flagstaff, Arizona, Hon. Scott McInnis [Chairman of the Subcommittee] presiding. Present: Representatives McInnis, Pombo, Walden, Renzi, Gibbons, Hayworth and Shadegg. Mr. MCINNIS. You may be seated. I would like to thank the Veterans of Foreign Wars and the American Legion, and of course the Boy Scouts. I would also like to begin the meeting by thanking the community of Flagstaff. As I said earlier, it is a beautiful community. We also appreciate the utilization of your City Hall, and I am particularly pleased—I know we come from different sides on this issue, but I am particularly pleased at the turnout that we have today. It is an issue that is very important to all of us, and the fact that we have come out like this to participate in it, this is what it is about, this is why we wanted to bring this hearing, so that you could see what a hearing that would otherwise be conducted in Washington, you could witness how we do this. With that, Congressman Renzi—and what I would like to do as we go for our opening comments, I would like each Congressman, since most of us are from out of this area, to introduce themselves. But Congressman Renzi, why don’t you introduce our special guests. Mr. RENZI. Thank you, Congressman, McInnis. Today, we have with us two very important people from Wash- ington, D.C., The Honorable