174 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-SENATE. DECEMBER 11,
330 companies had n2 net income available for dividends or profits; 92 law appointing one additional justice of the supreme court of said Ter companies made under 1 per cent. ; 116 between 1 and 3 per cent. ; 182 ritory-to the Committee on the Judiciary. between 3 and 7 per cent.; 114 between 7 and 10, and the remaining By Mr. T. M. BROWNE: Petition of 50 citizens and ex-soldiers of companies made over 10 per cent. ' the city of Muncie, Ind., for the passage of the Mexican war pen.sion It thus appears that there are many companies that might be bank bill and Senate amendments-to the Committee on Pensions. rupted by this section, although many now making a large profit would By Mr. GOFF: Petition of Eli Phillips and 62 others, asking forth~ not be injured. It would cripple the weak and not the powerful. passage of the Mexican war pension bill-to the same committee. Butiwill not dwell any further upon elements which enter into the By Mr. HANBACK: Petition of Lebanon Post, No. 240, Grand Army cost of the running of railroad trains. Fink gives fifty-eight elements of the Republic, Department of Kansas, for the passage of the Mexican entering into cost of transportation. war pen.sion bill-to the same committee. I favor in general the bill of the gentleman from Texas [Mr. REAGAN] By Mr. HEPBURN: Petition of J. E. Teale ·and 50 others, citizen.s as a substitute for the first seven sections of the committee!.s bill, still I of Davis City, Iowa, asking for the passage of the Mexican war pen.sion think it shduld be amended; that the .first and seventh sections should bill and amendments-to the same committee. be cl1anged as indicated, the fourth section struck out, and the third By Mr. A. S. HEWITT: Memorial of the Chamber of Commerce of strengthened. All remedies for railroad abuses other than Govern the State of New York, relative to the defenses of the port and har'bor ment ownership have elsewhere proved inadequate, and ultimately this of New York-to the Committee on Appropriations. will be the solution everywhere. I do not mean the ownership of all By Mr. LEWIS: Papers relating to the claim of Lucius J. Seals-to railroads, but of a few trunk tracks crossing the country and kept in the Committee on War Claims. ' order by the Government, over which, at a low toll and lUlder proper By Mr. MATSON: Petition of James R. Fritts and 75 others, mem regulation.s, any one can run a train of cars as now they can a boat upon bersofWinchester-Post, No. 333, Grand ArmyoftheRepublic, Gosport, the rivers. Ind., for the passage of the Mexican war pension bill as amended-to I would have oon.sidered it far better for California, and for the people the Committee on Pensions. of the Pacific coast generally, if some Pacific railroad bill regulating By Mr. :f)llLLIKEN: Petition of Thomas J. Lyon and others, for pas the operations and charges on those roads which had received aid from sage of bill to enforce the eight-hour law-to the Committee on Labor. the Government, and preventing extortion.s and unjust discriminations By Mr. NELSON: A bill for an exaiillnation and survey of the har thereon, had been passed by this House, even amended if necessary, bor of Duluth, &c.-to the Committee on Rivers and Harbors. such as contemplated and introduced by my'colleague [Mr. SUMNER], By .Mr. CHARLES O'NEILL: P~tition of John Connell, to have the who has given this subject long study. But that not being the case, we charge Qf desertion removed from his Army record-to the Committee should take the best we can get if so amended as to accomplish the re on Military Affairs. sult desired. I would like to point out and urge many of the good pro By Mr. RANNEY: Petition of Thomas G. Stevenson Post, No. 26, visions of this substitute, but as others have done this and my time Grand Army of the Republic, Department of Massachusetts, for pub has expired I can not now do so. I desire to see amendments adopted to lication in Official Records of ·the War of the Rebellion of photo the :first, second, third, fourth, :fifth, and seventh sections of tbils bill, and graphic illustration.s-to the same committee. I will offer them when in order. They are to perfect the bill, and in part By Mr. ROSECRANS: Petition of August V. Kautz, Colonel Eighth prevent wars of rates and such pooling and combination.s as are injuri Infantry, and other officers of the United States Army, i.n favor of a bill ous to the people. How much time have I remaining? to facilitate promotions in the Army-to the same committee. The SPEAKER. The gentleman ltas :five minutes of his time re- Also, petition of H. Brooks and others, citizen.s of San Francisco, maining. requesting an early consideration of th~ bill for the relief of Charles M. Mr. BUDD. I desire to reserve the remainder of my time. Blake-to the same committee. Mr. GLASCOOK was recognized. - By Mr. STEELE: Paper relating to the pen.sion claim of Col. E. W. Mr. REAGAN. If the gentleman from California does not desire to Penney-to the Committee on Invalid Pension.s. proceed this evening I will move that the House do now a
Commerce of the State of New York, favoring the construction of suita minority of the Committee on Commerce, to have a .day set for the co:p. ble defenses for New York l.Iarbor; which was referred to the Commit sideration of the bill (S. 1652) to provide for the improvement of the tee on Military .Affairs. · channel between Galveston Harbor and the Gulf of Mexico. He also presented the petition of E. A. Fau, of Washington, D. C., The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The Senator from Texas asks that agent of the estate of S. 0. Baker, deceased, praying compensation for the bill indicated by him be now taken up with a view to his moving supplies furnished United Sta11es troops during the late war; which was its postponement to a day certain and that it be m~e a. special order. referred to the Committee on Claims. Is there objection? He also presented a petition of over 2,000 citizens of the city of New Mr. CULLOM. I should like to inquire of the Senator what day he York, praying the repeal of all acts by which the term of many ad proposes to fix. ministrative offices is :fixed at four years; which was referred to the Mr. COKE. Thursday, the 8th day of January next, at 2 o'clock. Committee on Civil Service and Retrenchment. The PRESIDENT pro tempore. Is there objection to taking up the ~ Mr. LOG'AN presented a telegram from Mark L. Crawford', president bill for the purpose named by the Senator from Texas? The Chair of the ':Grade and Labor Assembly of Chicago, Til., in behalf of 30,000 hears none. The Senator from Texas moves that the further consider organized workmen of Chicago, in favor of the passage of the bill now ation of the bill be postponed until January 8, next, at 2 o'clock in pending before the Senate forbidding the importation of foreign la.bor the afternoon, and that the bill be made a special order for that time. ers under coni.ract; which was ordered to lie on the table. Is the Senate ready for the question? Senators in the affirmative will REPORTS OF COMMITTEEii. say "ay "; the ne~tive will say "nay." (Putting the question.) In the opinion ofthe Chair, two-thirdsofthe Senators present have voted Mr. MORRILL, from the Committee on Finance, to whom was re in the affirmative, and the order is made. ferred the bill (S. 2393) to change the name of the State National Bank of North Providence, R. I.,. reported it without amendment. MESSAGE FROM THE HOUSE. HILLSBOROUGH NATIOXAL BANK. A message from the House of Representatives, by Mr. CLARK, its Clerk, announced that the House had passed a bill {H. R. 7577) making Mr. MORRILL. I am instructed hv the Committee on Finance to appropriations for the support of the Military Academy for the fiscal report favorably without amendment th.; hill (H. R. 742P) to authorize year ending June 30, 1886, and for other purposes; in which it requested the Hillsborough National Bank tothange its nameto i hat oftheFirst the concurrence of the Senate. National Bank of Hillsborough, Ohio. Mr. SHERMAN. That is simply the correction Qf the name of a FORFEITURE OF OREGON LAND GRANT. bank. It is recommended by the Comptroller of the Cnrl'ency, and I The PRESIDENT pro t(;mpore. If there be no further resolutions believe there can be no possible ebjection to it. I ask that the bill be that order is closed. Pursuant to the order of the Senate of yesterday put on its passage now. the Chair lays before the Senate the bill (H. R. 181) to declare forfeit The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The Senator from Ohio asks unani ure of certain lands granted to aid in the construction of a railroad in mous consent that the bill be now considered. It, will be read for Oregon. The bill has been considered as in Committee of the Whole information. and reported to the Senate. The question is on agreeing to the amend The Chief Clerk read the bill; and by unanimous consent, the Senate, ment of the Senator from Kansas [Mr. PLUMB], which will be read. as in Committee of the Whole, prwccded to consider it. The CHIEF CLERK. It is proposed to insert as an additional section: The bill was reported to the ~enate without amendment, ordered to SEc. 2. That the act of March 3, 1875, entitled "An act for the relief of settlers a third reading, read the third time, and passed. within railroad limits," is hereby repealed. BILLS INTRODUCED. · Mr. SHERMAN. I should like to have the yeas and nays on agree 1\Ir. SHERMAN introduced a. bill (S. 2434) to amend section 5 of ing to the amendment. the act entitled "An act to a.mend the statutes in relation to imme The yeas and nays were ordered. diate transportation of dutiable goods, and for other purposes,'' ap 1\Ir. SHERMAN. Temporarily occupying the chair yesterday I was proved June 10, 1880; which was read twice by its title, and referred · a ~ood deal interested in the subject of the debate in so much as it to the Committee on Finance. · affected the bill. The lands-embraced in the bill are scarcely worth a Mr. WILSON introduced a bill (S. 2435) for the relief of the volUB. dollar and a quarter an acre according to the cOncurring testimony of the teers of the Fourth Regiment of Iowa. Infantry; which was read twice two Senators from Oregon, but the precedent about to be set in regard by its title, and referred to the Committee on Military Affairs. to dealing with lands which have been forfeited and are now restored to public entry is so important, that the Senate ought to consider this ERICSSON'S SUBMARINE GUN. question very carefully and vote understandingly. The ~RESIDENT pro tempore. "Concurrent or other resolutions " It seems to me it would not be wise to set a precedent in this case being in order, the Chair lays before the Senate the resolution submit that can not be followed in regard to other land grants when they are ted yesterdaybytheSenatorfrom New Hampshire [Mr. BLAIR], which restored to public sale. The Senator from Alabama [Mr. 1\foRGAN] will be read. ~- made a suggestion that this case might be made an exception; but we The Chief Clerk read the resolution, as follows: can not make exceptions of this lLnd without doing a great deal of Resolved, That the Committee on Naval Affairs be instructed to investigate the damage. It can do no harm to the people of 01·egon to allow the land new system of naval defense for the seaports of the United States proposed by to be entered only under the homestead law. Under the law as it Capt. John Ericsson, especially with a view to ascertaining the efficiency of hi!t new submarine gun and projectile torpedo for that purpose; also to ascertain now stands when this land is restored to the public domain it is open whether the same is about to be purchased for the exclusive use of any foreign to homestead entry. All the lands that are really needed by the peo power, and whether or not the efficiency of the naval service and prudent pro ple of Oregon can be acquired under the homestead law; but if the vision for the national defense require the purchase and approprta.tion of this invention by the Government. example is set of restoring lands that have long been reserved from sale to the old price of a dollar and a quarter an acre it will enable The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The question is on agreeing to the speculators under the pre-emption law and other laws to get possession resolution. of the lands, largely increased in value, and thus withhold them from The resolutWn was agreed to. general settlement. DEBATE ON SPANISH TREATY. I am therefore decidedly in favor of the amendment. Indeed, if it Mr. VAN WYCK. I ask for the consideration of the following res- were not for introducing general legislation on a private or local bill, I olution: should be in favor in this bill of repealing the pre-emption laws. T*ey Whereas a commercial treaty of great importance has been negotiated be- have long survived their usefulness; they ought to have been repealed tween the United S~tes and Spain, which w~s made pul?lic by tl)e·King of Sp~in Ilong ago. to s.uci?- extent that 1t wa:s cabled from Ma.dr1~ by the Times, of New York etty, When the homestead law was enacted it was a new policy which em- and gwen to the American people by that JOurnal before the same was pre- . . ' . sen ted with becoming solemnity and secrecy to the Senate: braced all the public lands; and I myself will not vote for any bill that Wberea:s th~ provi:Sions ofSf!oid treaty ~a.teriall! affect the subject of revenues will open any portion of the public lands of the United States to dis ~d ta~tton, mvolvmg no ser~ous questto.ns of diplomacy and state secrets, the position in any other way than under the homestead law. I believe discussiOns thereof should be m open SCSSlon, so that the people may be fully a.p- ...... prised of the reasons why said treaty should be ratified or rejected: Therefore that the homestead law IS a WISe prOVISIOn for the dispositiOn of pubpc ~9lved, Thattbe.~ommitteeon.Rules_bedirectedtoreportanamendmento; lands; and all wild lands, wherever they may be located, should be ~~!~doe~:~r~~ r~~~~~~t treaties whtch concern matters of revenuesh~ be thrown _open for settlement and occupation and acquis~tion o?ly upon P the basl.S of that law, except, as a matter of course, m special cases, The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The Senator from Nebraska asks where, as in military reservations and other lands which have been long unanimous consent that the resolution be now considered'. Is there withheld from the market, which have a largely increased value by the objection? growth of settlements around them, in which case they should be sold Mr. WILSON. I object to the present consideration of the resolu- at public outcry to- the highest bidder under circumstances that would tion. secure to the Government the highest price; but all public laBds should The PRESIDENT pro tempore. Objection is made, and the resolu- only be acquired under the homestel}d policy. tion goes over: I think the amendment of tlie Stnator from Kansas is much more GALVESTON HARBOR IMPROVE!\'IENT. important as a precedent than it is so far as it affects this particular Mr. COKE. I desire, with the concurrence of both themajority an~ grant; but it seems to me that in every case where land, after long be- •
I 176· CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-SENATE. DECEMBER 11, ing withheld from public entry, is restored again to public disposition, there to have their rights determined, unless the Senators can give as- it ought to be disposed of only under the homestead law. i surance to the Senate that there are no such rights. · Therefore I shall vote for the amendment, and I only make these re Mr. SLATER. My understanding is that there are no such cases aa marks in order rocall theattentiow>f Senators to the importance of the those referred to by the Senator from Alabama. While I could not say question upon which they are now· about to vote. there might not be a single case, my understanding is that there bas Mr. PLUMB. The position the Senator from Ohio takes exaetly ae been no effort to sell any part of the land by the company or to place cords with my vote on yesterday. I should have been glad to have any mortgages upon it. So it is a case absolutely and entirely between had his aid yesterday in support of the position of the Public Lands the Government of the United States and the corporation claiming the Committee, but the Senate, by a somewhat decided vote, disputed the grant, ancl there is no occasion, it seems to me, to attach to the bill a position of the committee, and that has passed out of the jurisdiction provision sending the case to the courts, which would opern.te simply of the Senate for the time. - · to cause unnecessary expense and long delay, l\fr. SHERMAN. The Senator probably is not aware that I voted Mr. DOLPH. I believe that there are mortgages which embrace in for his prQposition. I waa not in a position to speak, however. t.heir terms and description the entire grant earned and unearned, but Mr. P L U lB. I was going to say that the proposition now pending I suppose that a mortgage of a railroad company or other grantee of a before the Senate on the motion to adopt the amendment which I pro land grantwhich has been made upon a condition sub equentcan only posed yesterday is in the same direction-that is to say, the direction take such rights as the original grantee from the Government had, and of preventing speculation in public lands-and I hope there will be no that if the condition is not performed and the unearned portion of the dissent in the Senate as to its adoption_. grant is forfeited because of such non-performance, the mortagee would l\fr. LAPHAM. So far as I am concerned I am entirely ignorant of have no just claim as against the United States to the unearned portion the policy which led to the passage of the act of 1875. But it is a of the grant; that is to say, that the mortgagee could take by the mort general law enacted by Congress, and I risE; merely for the pury~ of gage no greater rights than the mortgageor, and that if as against the suggesting that to repeal such a law by an amendment to a bill like company .Congress has power to forfeit the grant, it also has the same this is improvident legislation, and we ought not to entertain the idea power to forfeit the grant against its grantees and mortgagees. For that of doing it. If the law of 1875 is to be repealed let it be done by a reason I do not conceive that in this case the amendment mentioned by bill, when its merits and the purpose of its ellc'l.Ctment can be consid the Senator from Alabama is necessary. ered. If we repeal it by this amendment, we repeal it without really I thought when the bill wa.s before the Committee on Public Lands knowing anything about the policy which led to its enactment, and it that there were no cases of persons who had gone upon the lands claim seems to me we ought not to do it. ing nnder the railroad company. I am informed by Mr. GEORGE, Mr. PLUMB. The Senator from New York is entirely mistaken. of the House, and beard something to that effect while in Oregon This amendment is not only entirely germane to the purpose of the recently, that there are a few persons who have chosen to go upon the bill, but it is an absolute necessity if speculation is to be prevented, lands under the company; but there is no doubt, as I said in my re because the occasion for speculation arises on the passage of the bill; marks in regard to the amendment already adopted by the Senate, if that is to say, it then brings up the class of claims under the aet of they have made any payments to the railroad company those payments 1875, and unless we repeal the act at this time a repeal of it hereafter will be refunded. At all events, I do not see why Congress should un in reference to these· claims will be entirely valueless. It is the hand dertake to recognize contracts between the railroad company and set maid, the necessary aecompaniment, of this forfeiture bill. No for tlers on the land under it. But it is provided in the amendment that feiture bill ought to be passed finally until the ·act is repealed. such settlers as are not qualified to purchase under the general laws of The PRESIDING OFFICER (Mr. GARLAND in the chair). The the United States may secure the land by payingt.he United States the 9.uestion is on agreeing to the amendment of the Senator from Kansa.S minimum price for the same-a dollar and a. quarter an aere. I think · LMr. PLUMB], on which the yeas and nays have been ordered. there are very few such cases. I do not think any question can be in The Secretary proceeded to call the roll. volved that will not be settled justly and equitably under the amend Mr. DOLPH (when his name was caJ.led). I shall vote "nay, on ment already adopted by the Senate. this. question, because I do not like to atta(lh the repeal of the act to Mr. :MORGAN. Does the Senator from Oregon say there is a mort this bill. gage upon these lands? Mr. KENNA (when his name was called). I am paired on all ques Mr. DOLPH. There is a general railroad mortgage and a deed of tions with the Senator from Minnesota [Mr. SABIN]. trust, according to my recollection, which embraces this grant. The roll-call was concluded. Mr. MORGAN. There are two incumbrances on it, then? Mr. GARLAND. I am paired with the Senator from Vermont [Mr. Mr. DOLPH. It embraces this grant in terms, and of course if the EDMUNDS]. land were earned by the construction of t.he road, the mortgage would The result was announced-yeas 33, nays 11; as follows: take effect upon the earned lands, but to the extent that these lands YEAS--38. have not been earned I cannot conceive that the grantees of the rail Blair, Hampton, Mitchell, Sawyer, road company or the mortgagees of the railroad company have any Brown, Harrison, Morgan, Sherman, greater rights than the company itself, and when we forfeit the lands, Call, Hawley, Morrill, Slater, and cut off the right of the railroad company to earn them by the con Oruneron of Pa., Hill Palmer, Vance, Cameron of Wis., Hoa'r,· Pike, VanWyck, struction of the r~ad, we necessarily cut off the right of all persons Cullom, Ingalls, Platt, Vest. claiming under the railroad company either as grantees or mortgagees. Dawes, McMillan, Plumb, l\fr. MORGAN. I am compelled on this occasion to refer to some Frye, Manderson, Pugh, Groome, Miller of N.Y., Riddleberger, thing that occurred in the Committee on Public Lands. When this subject was under discussion and the bill was being prepared, I put the NAY8-ll. question to both the Senators from Oregon whether there was any in Bayard, Dolph, Lapham, Sheffield, Coke, Jackson, Maxey, Walker. cumbrance upon these lands, and I understood both Senators to say that Conger, Jonas, Sewell, there was not. . I further put the question whether there were any per ABSENT--32. - sons who had taken land from the railroad company by purchase or Aldrich, Edmunds, Harris, Miller of Cal., under contract, whose rights would be affected by this forfeiture. I Allison, Fair, Jones of Florida, Pendleton, understood both Senators to say that there were none. Now, we are Beck, Farley, Jones of Nevada, Ransom, informed by one of the Senators at least that there are persons who Bowen, Garland, Kenna, Sabln, Butler, George, Lamar, Saulsbury, have purchased land from the railroad company, whose rights are ex Camden, Gibson, Logttn, Voorhees, pected to be protected under an amendment which he offers to the bill. Cockrell, Gorman, McPherson, Williams, We are informed further that there is a mortgage upon the land, and Colquitt, Hale, Mahone, Wilson. perhaps also a deed of trust. I will say that if these facts had been So the amendment was agreed to. known to the Committee on Public Lands (and I do not pretend that The PRESIDING OFFICER. If no further amendment be proposed, they were withheld from the committee improperly, but the Senators the question is on the third reading of the bill. evidently did not know the facts at the time) a motion at least would Mr. MORGAN. Before the bill goes to a third reading I desire to have been made in that committee to have the principles applied to call the attention of both the Senators from Oregon to a question that this bill which were applied by the Senate to the Atlantic and Pacific may arise in this case. The same qnestion, I will say, arose in com Railroad, which principles I think are applicable to every case of for mittee and was there answered, but I wish to have it answered in the feiture where the question is not exclusively between the Government Senate. I wish to know whether there are any persons concerned in and the grantee corporation. this land grant by purchase from the railroad company, or by mortgage I hold to the doctrine, and the Senate has so voted by a very large of the railroad company upon the lands, whose rights would be affected majority of the body, that whenever we declare the forfeiture of a land by this forfeiture; whether there are any other parties to this forfeiture grant and it is found that there are claims asserted in good. faith on the now than the Government of the United States on the one hand and part of mortgagees or on the part of other purchasei'S or contractors the railroad corporation on the other; because if there are persons whose with the company to the lands, it is our duty to extend a remedy throogh rights will be affected, their rights\.re totally unprovided for in the bill, the courts of the United States to the company and to these parties to and I shoulcl feel compelled to offer an amendment for the purpose of litigate the extent and character and value of their claims, and that carrjing the case into the circuit court of the United States for Oregon, duty becomes absolutely inclimhent upon the Congress of the United
. 1884. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-SENATE. 177
States, because our system oflaws prohibits really the Government of may be, here stand these mortgagees with legal rights under tbe.laws the United States from being sued by any private peNon unless it is of the land as palpable and as plain as the right of any gentleman in done by the express consent of Congress. Now, to take the property this body to the homestead that he may occupy, and that without kn·ow of these mort~ees, ·about which we know nothing, and here to con- ing or seeming to care what is the character of that right and its extent fiscate it (for that is the effect of it). in an ex parte proceeding, without and its value in law, and proceed to take it away from these mortgagees. due process of law and without giving them a hearing to show what We are the only body of men in the world that can do it, and we do it their claims are, is something that I can not consent to. I wasnotput without an inquiry and without knowledge. · here for the purpose of sitting in judgment upon private rights between I reassert, sir, that I have not been informed-and I made due in individuals in this country. My fnn~tion here is to legislate, to make quiry-of the existence of these mortgages at all until this morning. constitutional laws and none other, and not to invade private rights If I had been informed of it I should certainly have brought to the at by the legislative action of this body of which I am a member. tention of the committee and also of the Senate the same provision Now, Ur. President, I ask that the further consideration of the bill be which the Senate Toted on the Atlantic and Pacific bill at the last ses postponed until this question can be examined into and until the Com- sion, which requires :l'b. a case of this kind that the GoverQment of the mittee on Public Lands can be informed as to when these mortgages were United States shall become the actO I' and shall file a bill in the proper created, in whose behalf they exist, what the rights and equities of the circuit eourt in the nature of a bill of interpleader, through which ac mortgagees may be, for we are legi.<~lating here entirely in the dark. tion every person claiming to have an interest in the property may be We are legislating upon a1tate Of facts that I did not know or believe beard in court and have his rights adjudicated by that tribunal which to exist. the Constitution sets apart for this express purpose. Mr. DOLPH. Mr. President, I would not occupy the time of the I can not conceive bow we could go along and condemn and confis- Senat.e for a moment longer if the hon~rable Senator from Alabama cate property without due process-of law, as we are doing here to-day, had not referred to what was supposed to have mken place in the com- when we are just informed that we are striking at rights of which we mittee. · know nothing and people whose rights we do not at aU comprehend. If I was ever questioned in regard to this matter of mortgages I cer- I will change my motion, Mr. President, and I will ask that this bill tainly stated the fact as I understood it to be, that mortgages had been be recommitted to the Committee on Public Lands, in order that it may executed which in theirtennsembraced thegrantand would takeeffect be thoroughly understood. upon the earnedportion oftheg~;ant; butiftheroad wasnotcompleted The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Senator from Alabama moves the unearned portion, I suppose, would fhll with the forfeiture of the that the bill be recommitted. grant itself. I can not conceive why, if Congress proposes to act upon Mr. BLAIR. Mr. President, I am also a member of the Committee the rights of the grantor, the railroad company, it can not act in the on Public Lands, and certainly have from the beginning understood same manner upon the rights of all persons claiming under t.b.e com- that this bill proposing a forfeiture of a certain land grant in the State pany as grantees or mortgagees of the company, and why the title of of Oregon had reference to one in which no questions arose, excepting the company and all its grantees does not stand precisely on the same such as might exist between the Government, the grantor, and the state of 1acts and is not governed by the same rules of law. grantee, the railroad company; and I am confident that such was the I think the Senator is mistaken in supposing that the statement was understanding of the committee generally before action was taken on made either by my colleague or myself that the grant bad never-been this bill favorable to its passage by t.he Senate. mortgaged. I was not aware that there were any persons upon any of I made due inquiry, as I thought, upon that point. I also under the unearned lands which it is proposed to forfeit at the time the mat- stood furthe1· that this fact was found: that it was conceded upon all ter was under consideration in the Senate Committee on Public Lands hands tha.t no controversy could arise; that it was a fact that the com claiming under the railroad company. That is a matter of recent in- pany had abandoned absolutely and entirely all intention and all effort . formation to myself, but the number is very few, and their rights I think for the construction of the road; and the1·efore it was a clear case where are sufficiently provided for by the amendment offered by myself. the Government had a right to resume its control over the land grnnt. I do.not think there will be any legal controversy-whatever over this I did not know until this morning, and I learned it this morning by unearned portion of the grant if the bill' is passed as reported by my information coming from the other end of the Capitol, that there wa.~ colleague from the committee. I think the ~nstruction of this road a mortgage, and I learn still further by the declaration of the Senator has been yirtually abandoned by the company, at least nothing bas from Oregon [Mr. DoLPH] there is also a deed of trust. Whether he been done recently, and there is no present disposition to commence its means the same instrument by these expressions I know not, but I un construction. I do n,ot think this is a case requiring the amendment derstand that there is an incumbrance on this land grant; and further, which was made to the Atlantic and Pacific Railroad bill. I speak that questions may arise between individual settlers, and it may be from a knowledge of the circutllStances and the facls of the case. I hope other individual parties in addition to those that may arise under the that the honorable Senator will allow the bill to come to a vote and be mortgage and the deed of trust. . passed as it now stands. So it is conceded now t.bat the necessity for the intervention of a Mr.. MORGAN. Mr. President, if we pass this bill in the shape it court in determining whether in equity or in law there should be this now is,' of course there will be no legal controversy between the United forfeiture arifles with reference to this land grant as to all the othel'" State..
ing a shadow, that he will really find, when he comes to ex.:'lmine it, has and ceases to become. an active factor in this matter then the rights of no substance whatever. As a matter of course we know very well that the mort~gees spring up, and they can go on doubtless under the pro Congress can not affect any vested rights. These rights can be pre visions of the trust deed or of the mortgage, and ~hey can foreclose and sented in the proper com:t, if there be any. .My understanding is that perhaps uy a mere power of sale become possessed of tbe fmnchises of there are none that can be presented. Under the well-established this rompany and conclude the building of this mil way and earn money decisions of the courts it would be simply foolish for the company or the enough and property enough to redeem their bonds out anil out. I am mortgagees to present their alleged rights. They could not succeed if opposed to ha. ving this amount of property stru~k down by the. Govern t~ey were "allowed to interplead, for the court would decide that they ment of the United States claiming as against the company a technical ha.ve no equity. Why, then, make this delay? Whyhaveitattached forfeiture when there may be and doubtless are mortgagees whose in to this bill? It can only end in one direction. terests the Government ought to look to. I think my colleague and myself understand this; and as I under l\1r. INGALLS. Will the Senator permit me to ask him a 'f.Uestion stand my colleague to-day there is no necessity. for an amendment of at that point? . this kind or an investigation of this kind. As a matter of f:l.Ct we can Mr. .MORGAN. Yes, sir. not foreclose the rights of these parties· if we should undertake to do Mr. INGALLS. Grant that mortgages and deeds of tr ust have been ~· 1 t is only a q ue::~tion of the form of remedy. In one instance they placed upon the land included within the limits of this grant; sup come in under the direction of the United States and in the other they pose, also, that there have been settlers upon the lands who claim to would have to come in against the individual citizen. As a matter of have purchased from the railroad compa¥ to whom the grant was course my colleague and myself desire to look out for the interest of ID.ri.de, does the Senator think that if we should pass this bill it would our constituents, and we would not wish them to be placed in an im deprive them of any Pights to which they wonld be entitled by virtue proper attitude; but we are satisfied. there is no such case ·as this of existing law? In other words, can the constitutional protection to alleged, and there ought to be no delay in this matter. the rights of property-which decla:t:es that it shall not be taken except Mr. DOLPH. Mr. President, I regret exceedingly that there should ··by due process of law be impaired by a subsequent act of Congress? have been any suggestion that there is a necessity tor a re-examination And if the view that I take is correct, what would be the practical diffi of any tact in this case before the Committee on Public Lands. I will culty following the adoption of the pending bill that is now before us? state that my own recollection is, and I ani very positive, that on.one Mr. 1\IORGA.N. Of course, Mr. President, any law passed here in occasion, having some knowledge in regard to this matter, I. stated to violation of the Constitution or ultra 'Vires by Congress is to be regarded the committee the history of this grant among others, and on that oc and will beregardl;*la.s a nullity in any court before which it is brought, casion I mentioned the fact of these mortgage8; and I did say, as I and there is not a court in the United States whose jurisdiction is so said before, that I did not think there were any personSII
. 1884. OONGRE.SSIONAL RECORD-SENATE. . J79 color of title of some character in order to have a standing in court as I dare say", I believe it to be t r ue upon the statement made here this a()'ainst that party, and proceed by hill in equity to foreclose the mort morning, that these mortgagees have the right to do that same thing. g~ge. I can think of llQtbing so hopeless as a remedy of that kind. If the right to build a road from Portland to Astoria down that river is We have destroyed the title of the mortgageor, the railroad company. so valuable that citizens of Oregon desire to avail themselves of the op By our bill we permit whatever the interec;t there may be there on the portunity under some Htate charter, why is it not valua.ble enough to part of cjtizens to controvert with the Government to be taken up l>y the holders of these mortgage bonds at least to give them a right to be allowing them to pay to the Government and by paymen~ of money to heard on the facts·before the Sena te of the United States when we are obtain title to the land direct from the Government, wh1ch of course about to take awa.y trom them this land grant and to confiscate it for they would do in preferenCe to having any litigation. the benefit of the United States? Now, sir, if I were an attorney practicing in Oregon and after this Ur. President, I do not wish to express the shadow of an opinion bill becomes a l::l.w some one should come to me and ask to employ me here that would reflect in the slightest degree upon any pen>on con to file a bill to foreclose this mortgage and try to collect these bonds on nected with this matter, for there is no reason for that. Senators are these lands and to controvert with the Government of the United States candid in their opinion, no doubt entirely so, that this su~ject is a the constitutionality of the law we are trying to pass this morning, I matter of no concern to any person, and not to tbe bondholders, because should be certain to say to my client, Go hence; do not send good money ·there is no va.lue in the grant, they say, and because they do not want after bad money; do not undertake to fight the Government of tile to press this question as against the company, or against the GoYern United States, which has put itself behind the barrier of legaltortifica ment. But before I act upon it I desire to have an opportunity of un tions which no man in the world dare assail. That is the situation. derstanding it. Two members of this committee ha.ve assured the It was for t-he purpose of remedyin~ against this difficulty and giv Senate that they were not informed as to the condition of this matter; ing to our people something analogous to the English petition of right, and under these circumstances I do not Eee how the Senate will refuse whereby any British subject may come in and question the Crown as to all >w this subject to go before the committee, when it can be re to the ownership of a piece ofproperty thatitseeksto condemn by for ported back again and taken up by the Senate and acted upon \vith a feiture, confiscation, or otherwise-it was to·give to them some remedy proper knowledge of the facts. analogous to that, so that the proud boast of American liberty should Mr. LAPHAl\1. Mr. President, the Senate at the last session, after have some shadow ofsupportatleastin the nature of the statutes upon very elaborate argument and with much deliberation and by a Jarge which we di.o;;pense and dispose of the rights of private individuals, that majority, decided that where the Govern_ment was seeking a forfeiture I proposed the amendment which the Senate inserted on the Atlantic of a railroad grant and it appeared th~re were mortgagees o.r bond and" Pacific Railroad forfeiture bill. holders interested in the question the Government should perfect a Now, I hope that I have answered the question of the honora.bleSen· proceeding by a bill in equity, calling in all proper parties, and have a ator from Kansas. He and I proceed together upon this question until legal determination of the question involved. Now, believing in the we come to the point of the remedy. I assert that if these mortgagees, wisdom and justice of that provision in all these cases, believing that these bondholders, who have a legal estate in this property to-day of a the Government should be the actor instead of throwing private indi certain ch!lracter, a legal 1·ight of satisfaction out of it, are to be disre viduals to their remedies, imperfect as they would be, when this bill garded entirely, and they are to have no · opportunity to controvert came up yesterday I went to the honorable Senator from Alabama and with the Government in respect of how much of this land is still cov asked him whether it was necessary to have any such provision in ibis ered by the mortgage, we are leaving them in a forlorn condition that bill, and he answered me very frankly, "There is no occasion for it, we ought not to do. . I do not know who they are or where they live; because I have inqnired and learned that there are no outstanding I know nothing about them; but it is my duty to know before I legis mortgages upon this road, that there are no. rights of third persons late in this case. involved in the question." I know that was the condition of mind of I think, Mr. President, that thQ Senate would not be doing right to the Senator from A1ahama and the reason why he said nothing upon go along with the passage of this bill because the two Senators from the subject until this morning. Oregon happen to agree about it. They are bot;h most worthy and ex Now, Mr. President, I submit, whether the amount of the interest cellent Senators, men of high ability as well a.S high character; but we of bondholders Qr mortgagees be greater or .less, whether it be one that have also an interest in this question, and the holders of these bonds, can be maintained successfully or not, the mode of determining that who are doubtless not all of them residents of the State of Oregon, have question adopted by the Senate in the case of the Atlantic and Pacific an interest in this matter that ought to be looked after. It can not be Railroad Company is one from which we should never (lepart, and from fairly looked after until this case can go to the committee and the com which we ought not to depart in this case. It will require time. The mittee be authorized upon theevid.wceto report how much thesedebts amendment necessary to accomplish the object that was sought to be are and what is the nature of the lien. accomplished in the Atlantic and Pacific Railroad bill was an elaborate The Senators from Oregon both assume that a ·railroad company bas amendment. It will require hours to prepare it. It can not be pre no right to mortgage more than it owns. . Nobody will deny that propo pared and offered now, and there is no other mode of reaching this sition. Neither has a railroad company by its act a right to forfeit the remedy except to adopt the suggestiofl of the Senator from Alabama rights of the bondholders to collect their money out of this property, and and recommit or postpone tltis bill. it is required here that the right of these bondholders shall he deter Mr. VAN WYCK. Mr. President, I have been listening attentively mined bemuse the railroad company has simply abandoned the construc to ascertain if I could the object to be gained by a recoJDmittal of this tion of this road. That is more than the railroad company had a right bill. Now for the first time after the long discussion of this matter' to do under the law. in the other House, as the RECORD shows, and its long deJa.y and pro Now, sir, I want to know and I want the Senate to know whether it crastination in this body, first in its committee and then here, an urgent is a shadow that I am fighting about here or not. I maintain that appeal is presented on the part of the bondholders or mortgagees of there are rights in favor of bondholders against railroad corporations this road, who have not for two years felt their interests so much im that sometimes rise superior to the rights of the corporation, not per periled or the duty of self-preservation so impemtive as to come here haps to the rights of the Government, but ce1 ta.inly to the rights of the by themselves or their attornQys and make an appeal on their behalf. corporation. And these mortgagees, I repeat, if this moi"too-age is at all Is not that a remarkable proposition? akin to the multitude that have been examined by this Committee on Gentlemen have been relating what took place in the comwittee Public Lands, have the right to carry out the contract with the Gov room. I may go a little {urther and say that day after day, until mid ernment, to go on and build the road. to foreclose the mortgage and night, and even beyond, did attorneys of different railroads appear be take the very franchises away from the corporation, assume the duties fore the Committee on Public Lands and enter all conceivable objections and obligations of its charter, build the road, and thereby satisfy the to any forfeiture. The gentlemen who have served on the committee public policy in which this railroad grant was first founded. Shall will remember that those Senators who have spoken are correctin their we cut them off from all these rights? Have we a right to say· here, own understanding, and they 'vill remember that several of these rail upon what meager knowledge we have about this thing, that these roads were placed together, particularly those in California and Ore mortgagees would not proceed to foreclose ~his mortgage, would not gon, for consideration and argument befote the committee, and that proceed to gather up what belongs to them under it, including the learned attorneys came there, and I well remember (if I may be allowed franchises of this company, and build this important road .from Port to say it, although'it is entirely out of order) that a. questio~ was pro land to Astoria down t.he Columbia River? pounded during the argument of some of the cases whether the mort Sir, that is an important road. The time, perhaps, is not ten or gage of the railroad co.mpany covered all the lands embnl.Cf'd in the twenty years distant when that will be looked upon as one of the great grant, and t.he question was answered affirmatively that it did. arteries of trade iri this country, and one of the means of completing by I understand, and I think the Senator from Alabama will agree lvitb competitive railroads aCcess oo the Pacific Ocean. While it ma.y be that me, that it must have been understood by every member of the com persons in Oregon desire to get hold of this right, or rather to get it out mittee who listened to and heard the arguments, the long tedious ar of their way so tha.t they can proceed to build a road over the same ter guments on that matter, that it was the custom and, as far as any rule ritory-and that is the allegation which is made here; while it may be went, the rule of railroad compani~ about the first thing they did to that it is one of the necessary conditions precedent that they shall get issue bonds covering all the lands ~ted by the act. I think the rid of this mortgage and this railroad and this land grant in order that Senator from Alabama and the Senator from New Hampshire can not they may have untrammeled access to this important region of country call to mind a single land-grant railroad that did not place a mort for the building of this road-while this may all be so, it is still true, gage on all the lands granted. 180 CONGRESSIO:NAL . RECORD-SENATE. DECEl\lBER 11'
Mr., MORGAN. {will say, if the Senator will allow me, that I do The bill has been already nearly two years before one branch of Con call to mind this particular case in which I was informed, and believed, gress and the other, and this is the first time an application has been there was no mortgage of any kind. . made by the mortgagees as the creditors of this road or any uggestion Mr. VAN WYCK. Whether the case of this road was argued sepa made in that direction. .. rately before the committee or in..connection with certain other roads .Mx. MORGAN. Ur. President, I feel bound to say that this is the which were represented by the same interest and hy the same attor first time the fact has come to the attention of some members of the neys I fail to remember; but my recollection is distinct that repre committee at all events, about this mortgage. I do not think I ha~e sentations were made, not for the purpose ·of antagonizing the state been delinquent about it, though I certainly have inquired -very assid ment made by any member of ·the committee or any ~enator here; but uously; the Senator will bear me out in that;. and I certainly gave the impression was given to the committee at some stage of these de notice that I would be prepared with an amendment if there was any liberations and arguments that the railroads conveyed by mortgage all question of that sort in this C2.Se. the lands embraced within the grants. This bill can go back to the committee, and we can consider it and What is to be· accomplished by the delay now proposed? The mort ascertain precisely from evidence, I suppose here in Washington, what gagees ditl not seek to oe heard. If they have any interest outside of the extent of this mortgage is and who it is who owns it. The Senator the railroad itself, which probably controls the bonds, no mortgagees from Nebraska intimates that t~e mortgage is owned by orne railroad
have appeared in this case asking to be heard, and I do not know that company. I do not know a word about that; he may; but I do not.1 any one appears·for them in the Senate to-day asking that they shall for I never heard of it until it was suggested to me this morning by be heard on the ground that their rights are to be taken from them. eminent gentlemen in the House of Representatives who have been in If the po ition now taken be correct., a fotfeiture by Congress will be quiring into these matters very assiduously, and who informed me of impossible. If -the position is correct that every mortgagee must be the existence of these mortgages, very tnucb ·to my surprise. I think heard, t.hen the position will be equally good that every judgment cred the committee ought to have the opportunity of looking into this q ues itor should be heard. Why not? A judgment creditor of this railroad tion to see what the facts are. Shall we sit as a court here in condem company would have the same right to come in and ask to be heard by nation of a railroad company or of its mortgagees and adjudicate the Congress before a forfeitUre could be dec1ared. I suppose the Govern property out of their hanU.S by a reclamation of the title absolutely, J.Dent of the United States is not required to ascertain by an examination when there is no Senator on this floor who can tell who the mortgagees {)f the county records who may be mortgagees or creditors of a railroad are, what length of time the mortgages have to run, what rights they oompany. have got, or the amount of the debt? I think, sir, that it woultl be I understand there was a condition in this grant. That condition absurd for us to do it, and I do not see why Senators are in such a hurry runs with the land evidently, and every mortgagee who takes a mort to push this bill through this morning as to deny to the committee, or gage on thiS land takes it subject to this condition. It is for Congress members of it who have not been informed about this matter, an op or the Supreme Court to say whether the condition has been broken; portunity to know what the real state of the facts is. We ought to be and if the fact be true that the condition has. been broken and the land allowed to know it befoxe we are compelled to act; and I protest that is suQject to forfeiture, then the same reason applies to all mortgagees we ought to know it. · andjudgmeut creditors, for neither.can h.ave any greater r~ght to the 1\lr. VAN WYCK. I did not mean to say absolutely in this case as land granted. · a matter of fact that these mortgages and bonds were owned by this That is not the question in regard to this railroad grant. That ques railroad company. tion never has been raised in the committee or outside of it until this lli. MORGAN. The Senator does not know who owns them, neither morning. The ouly question was how far this forfeiture should extend. do I. The House by its bill said that the forfeiture should reach all the lands Mr. VAN WYCK. I can say as a matter of fact, however, that granted, as well those adjoining the road constructed as those adjoining ordinarily the bonds and mortgages of a road of this nature are under the road not conStructed. The House, if I may be allowed to say it, were the control of the managers of the railroad; and when their attorneys more lo~ical than the Senate in this matter, and the facts sustain their appeared before the committee to argue for their interest they would action more than that of the Senate, and in order that that point should most naturally have argued for this interest if it was in peril at that not be pressed too far the Senate committee, on the only point m dis time. . cussion on this railroad grant, thought it better to go no further than l'rlr. MORGAN. I do not care to try the rights of this company or to declare a iocl'eiture of the lands adjoining the part of the road not of the mortga~ees on a suspicion. I want to know what the facts are. constructed; and that is all the bill which we reporteq proposes. . Mr. VAN WYCK. This fact was public, it was notorious; in April The railroad company expressly declared that it abandoned this road. last, when the bill was discussed ia the House of Repre...<~entatives, it Mr. Villard, in 1B83, when he was president of nearly all the roads in was there stated that mortgages existed on the line of this road. Sen Oregon, wrote to the board of trade or commerce of Astoria a commu ators may not be conduded by what took place in the other branch, nication in which he figured up the cost of this railroad and said they but that was a fact which was made as notorious as a fact could be must apandon it. He was president of this railroad company. Then made in legislation. lt appeared in the discussion; it was stated as a it became evident that the House was right in the forfeiture which it fact there that mortgages had been issued upon this railroad. That declared, because here was a company organized to construct a road surprised nobody, for I supposed everybody knew that about the first .from Portland to Astoria, one hundred and twenty or one hundred and thing a land-grant railroad company did was to issue mortgages upon thirty miles, to which a land grant was given with a view to the con its lands and put bonds upon the market. Every railroad company struction of a road that distance, with a branch rnnningoffsometwenty does that before it constructs a. mile of road. It is done in all cases. miles. The railroad company built twenty miles from Portland and These persons for manyyearshaveknown of this. A person who owns then ran its branch in an opposite direction from Astoria, and there a mortgage on a land-grant railroad is apt to know the history of legis stopped. They had constructed the easiest portion of the road; they lation affecting that road. For many years the question has been be bad built it through the most valuable part of the land granted, and fore the American Congress, and nobody can presume that any mort then they stopped. ~ . gagee who would desire to be beard has not had an opportunity to The condition of the gmnt was that if the road was not completed at present his case. the end of six years the gran~ should be forfeited, and they accepted The PRESIDING OFFICER (Mr. HARRIS in the chair). The the grant upon that condition, and the mortgagees accepted their mort question is on th~ motion to recommit the bill. gage upon that condition. Now it would seem ·to an ordinary jury, 1t1r. SLATER. This whole case it seems to me is in a nutshell. I think, that they. had no right to any part of the land. It became The question is, has this corporation failed to perform the conditions of evident that they did not. intend to build the road ·from Portland to the grant? Now, it is an admitted fact that for eight years ~his com Astoria. They only got the grant with a view to build twenty miles pany bas done nothing toward the prosecution of the grant, and has from Portland and then diverge twenty miles down. That waS the intimated through its president that it can not and will not undertake only question there was, and it is the only question to-day. This rail to build the remainder of the road. Then there is a condition broken road company abandoned its road. It represented the bondholders evi in this case, and it has been broken for eight years. This bill has been dently, and represented the mortgagees. There can be no possible ques pending.before Congress ever since the second day of the last session of tion in regard to that matter. Did I understand niy friend from Ala the Senate, the second day of the legislative ~ession of Congress, and bama to say that if these mortgagees proposed to foreclose the mort it is strange to me that we hould not have heard somewhere at some gage there was no person against whom they could bring a snit, not time and in some place a plea for these·mortgagees prior to just on the even the railroad company? eve of the passage of the bill. 1\~r. MORGAN. I do not understand the question. 1\Ir. MORGAN. Will the Henator allow me to ask him a question? 1\Ir. VANWYCK. ·My friend said thatwhen themortgageeswanted I ask the Senator when he first heard that there wa a mortgage upon to foreclose their mortgage there would be no one they could arraign in this property ? court as the defendant, not even the railroad company. 1\Ir. SLATER. I can not say that I have.heard it before this morn , Mr. 1\IORGAN. Nobody; and if the Government of the United ing. My impression was, and I was led to believe, that theJ:e was none States now reclaim the land it would be useless to put in a party who in this case; and yet, as I said before, reflection should have taught me would have no interest in the land. that perhaps in all these cases it was the custom, and I might say the Mr. VANWYCK. That may be, but they could get a standing in unbroken usage, to put a mortgage on the land grants as a means of court in that way. The only question is as 'to delay in this matter. constructing the roa 1884. CONGRESSIONAL RECOR ~ D-SENATE. 181 Mr. MORGAN. The Senaoorwill allow meoosay that reflection led orally, and I think also in a printed argument filed in the case. And me in the direction of supposing that there might be a mortgage until my recollection is in accord with the recollection of other members of the I asked the question and it was stated to me in the committee that committee. I do not question the good faith or the correctness of the there was none. · Senaoor who has just spoken, or the Senator from Alabama, as to what Mr. SLATER. I do not remember how that might be. they understood in regard to the matter; but I will say that when it Mr. MORGAN. I do. . was agreed that this bill should be reported I understood that the privi Mr. SLATER. But ·granting that there is a mortgage, I do not see lege was reserved by the Senator from Alabama of offering his amend that it is necessary for us to concern ourselves about that. The mort- ment in the Senate, and I understood the Senator to say no longer ago . gagees stand on no higher plane, no broader basis, no higher right than than the last session of the Committee on Public Lands, on Monday the mortgageors tbemselves do. They can take no right that the mort last, that he might do so. gageors did not possess. The title of the mortgageors was one hampered I do not care anything about this matter auy further than as to the aud controlled and embarrassed by a condition. The mortgagees know suggestion made that there may have been some withholding of infor the condition has been broken, and all we have to do now is to declare mation on this subject. But whatever has been done in committee, I that condition broken and a forfeiture for that reason. These parties do not see the necessity of again referring the bill to the committee are not remediless. We only chan~ the condition, the manner and for information. It is now stated on all hands. that there are mort .mode of the procedure. One mode is proposed by the Senator from gages: The amendment which was adopted by the Senate to the At Alabama, and I do not see why be does not propose his amendment, as lantic and Pacific bill is in print; it can be offered to.this bill, and the he did in the former case, instead of proposing to send the bill back to sense of the Senate tested on it at any time without delay. the committee, and let us pass on it at once if it is desirable. That · I will say t.hat I voted for the amendment refen-ed to to the Atlantic . amendment only changes the mode. In the one instance under the and Pacific bill, but I distinctly stated that I did so because the bills amendment parties would go into court by an interpleader at the in making the grants to the Atlantic and Pacmc Railroad Company, the stance of the United States. In the other case they would go into court Texas Pacific Railroaa Company, and the Northern Pacific Railroad in a suit against an individual citizen. There can be but few cases, if Company were peculiar and exceptional; that in my judgment Congress any at all, in which there would be any one to go into court in regard had undertaken to say what the remedy should be or what penalty to this grant. should be inflicted if those companies failed to construct their roads As I said before, as I understand this case there is no ground or within the time limited in the grant, and that was that CongresS might basis for the application of the principle of the amendment as the Sen take s_uch steps as were necessary to secure the completion of the roads ator proposed to apply it to another bill; there are no rights which can and at leru:;t one court had held that Congress could not 1orfeit these possibly be brought into court in behalf of the original corporation, or grants, but must apply them for the purpose originally intended. That of their subsequent purchasers, or of the mortgagees of the original cor was the reason why I thought that in those three cases the amendment poration upon which they can or would have an equitable or legal stand referred to ought to be adopted, and I do not stultify myself in view of ing in court. Why then proceed with it? It simply hampers the ac what I stated on the 3d of July last when the Atlantic and Pacific bill tion of Congress; it simply ties up the matter of forfeiture an indefinite was under discussion by proposing to vote for this bill without the amend period and withholds these lands from occup!l.tion. It seems to me ment when I voted for the amendment to the other. this is wholly unnecessary. If we bad undertaken to forfeit the earned Mr. MORGAN. I regret to appear so frequently in this matter be lands as well as the unearned lands, the question whether they would fore the Senate, but I have been led into some trouble about it un have rights would be a question which would go to the courts; but we expectedly. The Senator from Oregon on my left [Mr. SLATER] in avoid that by not agreeing with the House on that point. We treat forms us that this morning was the first time he ever knew that there that question as settled. In my judgment we can not touch the lands was a mortgage on-this property. ·Well, Senators living in other States that base been earned, and can only touch the unearned portion of the very far distant fiom Oregon are perhaps not expected to find out what grant. neither of the Senators from Oregon knew or told the committee of so I hope the Senate will now vote on the question and refuse to recom far as I know. When I made the motion to recommit I did it because mit. I wanted the committee to examine the.subjectand to ascertain whether :ltir. BLAIR. The Senator from Oregon is arguing a question upon there was any necessity for putting on this bill the amendment which which the Senate has already pronoun;;ed its judgment. By a very the Senate voted onto the Atlantic and Pacific bill. I do not want the large majority, in the discussion upon the bill proposing to forfeit the Senate to go before the HouseofRepresentatives and before the world land grant of the Atlantic and Pacific Railroad during the last session as voting an amendment onto a bill of the cbarat::ter which I had the of Congress, the Senate said that there should be a remedy provided in honor to offer _at the last session and it was passed by this body, and the courts 1or those whose rights were concerned, and proposed, by an then refusing oo put it upon another· bill of precisely the same charac amendment suggested by the Senator from Alabama, to constitute a spe ter. That woUld leave us in rather bad shape, and the committee of cmc kind of court to entertain and decide those rights. conference in which the two Houses are now represented would be very The distinction between the Atlantic and Pacmc case and this, as it much embarrassed no doubt if the Senate should vacillate in its course has hitherto been supposed ·to exist, was simply that in the case-now trom day to day, and on one day say that such a tribunal and such a being considered by the Senate, that of the land grant in Oregon, there jurisdiction was necessary to be created for the protection of private was no possibility of controversy arising with reference oo any other rights, and on another day neglect it entirely in a case of precisely the rights than those between the General Government and the original same character. Therefore I wanted the bill to go to the committee, to grantee, and therefore that there was no case for the attaching of that see if the committee could ascertain that there were in this case facts to amendment and the constitution of the proposed court in relation to excuse ns from doing that which the Senators both agreed to. They say this grant. But the Senate had before it no other case, unless it was they do not want this subject drawn into litigation at all; that if we this.Oregon case, where that state of facts was supposed to exist; and pass their bill just as it is there will be no litigation . . Why will there therefore those who were in favor of the creation of such a tribunal be no litigation?- I wish to know whether i.t is because by the passage were willing that this particular bill should proceed to forfeiture with of the bill we paralyze the people who have rights, or whether it is out any such condition or any provision for such tribunal being at because 'there are no rights of a substantial character to advance. tached. And so the bill was going through; but a discussion arose this Therefore I want the committee to act upon it. morning between gentlemen of both Houses who are engaged in the con At the time I made my motion to refer I was. not aware that I should sideration of the amendments upon the Atlantic and Pacific bill, and have it in my power to get a print of the amendment which I offered · there I fil'st obtained information that this bill was understood by the at the last session of the Senate. Since. that time I have obtained a 9tber House of Congress to be just like the others, and that there was copy of that print and I am now prepared to offer the al:nendment. At the same occasion for the constitution of such a court with reference to the same time I dislike to offer it without act.ion of the committee, rights arising under tbis grant as in the other cases which are before because the two Senators from Oregon, both members of that commit Congress. And H. will be understood, I know I understand, that if this tee, assert here in this body that there is no occasion for having this bill now before the Senate passes without such an amendment, it is prac amendment put upon this pill. Yet on the face of the case as pre tically a committal of the Senate against the very policy which it adopted sented by one of the Senators from Oregon at least wbo has some ac initsactionon theAtlanticand Pacific bill, and therefore it is important. quaintance with this mortgage matter, the other not having any ac This radical mistake with reference to the questions involved is one quaintanee with it at all, it does appear that there are mortgagees (we which leads to this discussion, and it seems to me perfectly apparent do not know who they are) who have rights that ought to be protected that unless the Senate proposes to stultify itself by its action upon these in the courts of the United States. If the persons concerned in the two different bills the motion of the Senator from Alabama should pre Atlantic and Pacific, or in the Texas and Pacific, or in any of the other vail, and this bill should return to the committee, that it may come roads whose lands are sought to be forfeited need the protection of the from the committee under precisely the same conditions as the other jurisdiction and power of the Federal" courts, then of_course in this bills where the Senate committee understands that there are questions case it is needed, unless the Senators from Oregon are able to show the of fact to be adjudicated by the courts. That is all I wish to say. committee that there is some reason why this is an exceptional case. Mr. DOLPH. I desire to say again that I distinctly recollect on more Therefore I wanted the bill to be recommitted to the committee, and than one occasion 8tating to the Committee on Public Lands from my I think that is the true course to take. knowledge of this matter that there were mortgages upon this grant. I am very much obliged tomyfriendfroml~Iassachusetts [Mr. HoAR] I distinctly recollect tha.t counsel appeared for the company and so stated for calling my atteittion to a propositibn in this case which I think I '. 182 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-SENATE. DEOEJ\IBER 11' ouO'ht to state, although I do not Wish to abuse the patience of the Sen first place satiated their desires, like a before-breakfast toddy, by the at:. It is tha.t it i.:J our duty iu ma.king the torfetture of these land destruction of a railroad-these gentlemen will miss their purpoRe en gmnt.s to protect the settlers upon the land aml all persons interested tirely if they simply rely upon the idea that the Congress or the United in the railro:l States, I think I should then h:1ve made out a case which would appeal na he was yesterday in his speech. He s:1ys the State should have at eo strongly to the sense of justice of every Senator that no consideration least th!3 population requisite for a member of the House, but it. may as to the effects of this measure qpon the weight of p:1rties in the Sen ha>e that population aud more, according to the answer of the Senator ate of the United States or in the electoral college could influence any from Mis.~ouri , it might have twice that population, and still have-no Senator in his vote. claim to admission, notwithstanding its population is entirely homo Now, I cbim to have established every one of those propositions. I geneous, not only between its own parts, but a population homogeneous assert th::~>t the Senator from Missouri has not successfully assailed any with th~t of the whole country. one of them. I am not yet authorized to anticipa,te that we are to have Mr. VEST. If the Senator will pe_rmit me, I will propoundaques a pa.rty division npon the question of the admission of DJ.kota, although tion to him. I am free to B:lY th~t the indications seem to be all that way. I felt Mr. HARRISON. Certainly. that I should be imputing a dis~ful thing if I charged any Senator Mr. VE3T. If I understand the Senator correctly, he says that with approaching the consideration of this q tfestion from a partisa.n when a population e~ists over and above the ratio for a member of the standpoint or voting upon it from partisan motives. lower House that fs conclusive of the question, if the population is But the Senator from Missouri says he would not regard it as dis homogeneous. Is that his position? graceful to declare that his vote waa influenced upon this question by Mr. HARRlSO~. Not at allj my proposition is that as to popula- party-feeling, though at the same time protesting that in this particu tion it is conclusive. lar case no such feeling actu~ted his vote. He alluded to the debates Mr. VEST. As a matter of course. which have taken place in the past upon the admission of States to the Mr. HARRISON. And I ask the Senator whether he regards it so. Union, and he said that tbe discussions and the votes .upon those meas Mr. VEST. I state to t~e Senate emphatically, as I stated yester- ures showed that the Senate in those olden and better times, I bilieve day in my feeble way, and I can make it no stronger, that population he called them, had been actuated by partisan motives. It is true that of itself is not sufficient. Suppose Utah should apply here with a before the war and while slavery was still maintaining its aggressive . million inhabitants for admission, would the Senator vote for it? I and persistent fight for f?.Upremacy in the politics of this country and undertake to answer for him '' no.'' Therefore there are other consid for an equipoise between the slave and free States, questions affecting erations besides pop-.liation. . freedom or sbvery in the Territories did influence the votes of Sen Mr. HARRISO~. I have not denied, but in my opening remarks ators, and that motive was confessed in debate. I had Pnpposed, how asserted, the very proposition which the Senator now asserts. But my eYer, that that exigency which seemed to make it necessary, a9 the his question related to poyulation only. Supposing all other things, as iory of such legislation shows, to admit States by pairs, one slave and to the character of the "people, the institution..~ they ha.ve adopted, the one free, had passed away with ~he destructi'on of the institution of civilization that prevails among them-suppose all those to be in line slavery. with the general civilization of our country; then, it being a question I am sure that the Senator from Missouri would feel that it was a only of population, how much does he insist upon? That is the point. dis.,ooraceful thing to say upon the floQ_r of the Senate to 300,000 Ameri The Se'na.tor is too good a lawyer not to see it. All the other conditions can citizens living in the Territory of Dakota tha.t they should not be that are essential to the admission of a State, and which assure us that admitted to sta.tehood because the prevailing opinion there was Re when she takes her place among us it will be with institutions that publican. I am sure he would feel it to be SOj and ~ feel very sure are in harmony with the civilization of the other States; all that being that no Senator on the other side of this Chamber will be bold enough assumed, how much population can we insist upon; and the u.uswer I to make that confession. Yet the Senator from Missouri suggests that get from the Senator is at least the ratio of representation in the Honse it would be altogether a fair thing, seeing that the Territories of the of Representatives. He leaves the other limit entirely unfixed. He United States have been so long under what he calls Republican in leaves himself free, as I understand, notwithstanding there are people fluence, to keep them for a while longer under Democratic influence, in enough to entitle the new State to a member in the lower Honse, not the hope th:1t the Federal officers to be sent to the Territories as gov withstanding all her institLltiollil are right and unexceptional, to vote ernors,-secretaries, and marshals by the incoming .Democratic adminis against her a 184 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-SENATE. DECEMBER 11, am fortified by the facts. In 1880 we had an opportunity of arrivillg When the march of settlement had gone farther west, Indiana, at the exact ratio between inhabitants and voters in the Territory of which had embraced under tha.t name as a Territory much territory Dakota. An enumeration was taken, taken by the same agencies which west and north, was .carved out and constituted into a State. So it took the enumeration in the State of Missouri and in the State of In will be seen that vast territories, section by section, divided more often diana, and the result is entitled to just as much credit in the case of upon artificial lines than by natural barriers,·were constituted parcel Dakota as in the cases of the other States and Territories. We have by parcel into States. The same policy was pursued in connection with the population given, we have the number of votes that year, and by the great grant which we got under the treaty with France in the pur making a division we find that the ratio of inhabitants to voters was chase of Louisiana. State after State was carved out of it. It never four and eighty-two one-hundredths. Yet for some reason or other the was thought before that because, for convenience in organizing a Tel' Senator, while accepting this census ratio as applied to all the States ritory, a vast sweep was included rmder one Territocial organization by and using it in his argument, repudiates the ratio as applied to Dakota, force of that fact the w~ole Territory thus organized must come into und for the very singular reason that, a.ccOrding to his idea of the course ·the Union as a sin~le State. No one suggested it when Ohio, Indiana, of emigration to D.tkota, more women and children went into that illinois, Michigan, and Wisconsin came into the Union. It was simply Territory prior to 1880 when the only accesS to it was by the Missouri ~question whether the area of country proposed to be constituted into River or overland, when thetravel was not only expensive but tedious a State was sufficient to give the State a. respectable standing among and perilous, than have goneintoit since, with its twenty-:five hundred the great States of the Union. It was simply a question whether the miles of railway in its own borders, connecting with all of our great divisions were convenient. It never was thought before: to be a repre- · east and west lines. hensible thing to divide one of these great Territories. If there is anything perfectly clear, it is that the mtio found to pre If I were to look for an intimation in Congiessionallegislati"on as to vail in 1880 instead of being diminished must have been increased from what was about the right size of ~State I should look at these States that time till now. The town population of Dakota has increased enor which have been thus carved off from a vast outlying country. Just mously. Railroads have penetrated the Territory from east to west as if I wanted to get the judgment of the carver at the head of the and some spurs in a north and south direc tio~ so that now there is no table as to how much venison or turkey would be good for my friend I reason in the world why an emigrant to Dakota should not t:}ke his should look at the work of his carving-knife. We see Congress con wife and children with him the very moment he has entered his home stituting Ohio, Indiana, Illinois, Wisconsin, .Michigan, and Missouri aa stead. States of the Union. They were not stinted for territory. Missouri Does the Senator from Missouri think that a rat.io of 3 is too much might have been pushed westward indefinitely when she was admitted for D.1kota? The census showed 4. 82. Does he not think that it into the Union. Ohio mightnave been stretched westward to the Wa- would be a very stingy arithmetic that would cut them down to 3? If bash or the Mississippi, and yet I am pleading here for the admission there is a ratio of 3 inhabitants to a voter South Dakota has 165,000 of a State that is larger than any one of the St..'l>tes thus constituted by population. I have here the official vote by-counties of the Territory the American Congress. of Dakota, with the exception of a single county in Southern Dakota, If I were to look for another suggestion in public legislation as to which was not reported but which is estimated; showing 55,000.votes what was a reasonable size tor a State I should look to- the act admit in Southern Dakota. Is there any Senator on that side of the Chamber ting the great State of Texas into the Union. It was there provided who believes that it. is an unfair thing to estimate 3 inhabitant<> to one that tHat State might be divided into no~ more than fiv.eStates, which voter? would give to each an area of about 52,000 square miles, or 25,000 less I showed in my opening remarks that in some of the Southern States than the area of the Territory of South Dakota. Texas, California, the mtio was 10 to . 1; that in the States bordering on Dakota, the Nevada, Colorado, Kansas, Minnesota, and Oregon would be larger than States of Nebraska and Minnesota, it was more than 5 to 1-I think 5.17 the St.ate of Dakota, and only those. I do not think the Senator was to 1; as I recall the figures. And it niust not be forgotten that in Da so definite that I would be justified in saying that he had made the point kota, as Governor Pierce says in his report, there are quite a number that South Dakota did not have sufficient area for a State; but if that of unorganized counties where the people do not vote, having from one point is involved at all in his argument, I submit that a State which hundred to a thousand population in each. No, Mr. President, no 1air would be 7,500 square miles larger than the State the Senator so ably argument can be made against the presence in Southern Dakota of a represents ought to be accepted as big enough. population largely more than the 151,000 required as a basis of repre- But theSenator has a poor opinion of the productive capacity of Da- ' sentation in the House of Representatives. kota. He has great doubt whether if it were divided itwonld be aOle But the Senator himself has brought in some witnesses. He indulged to sustain in the divided portions such a population as would enable it in panegyric when he described the character of the gentlemen who to rank fairly with Missouri, for instance, among the States. brought here a_protest against the division of Dakota. He said they The soil of Dakota, he said, was very similar to and ita agricultural were men of great intelligence and of high reputation; that they were adaptations very much like that of Colorado and Nevada. I do not men whose statements with reference to senttment and fact in Dakota think I misquote the Senator, though I do not pause to read his exaci were to be accepted wibh the greatest respect. Did the Senator noti c~ words. That certainly was a comparison which came into the mind of that those very gentlemen declare in their memorial that the Territory the Senator while he was upon his feet, and that he did not have an of Da kota had then 400,000 inhabitants-the whole Territory? The opportunity to verify by any reference to census tables of prt>duction memorial was presented nearly a year ago. It is conceded that two or soil. Ne\"ada is perched on the mountain-tops; Dakota is a grea• thirds or-more of the population is in the southern part of the Terri plain. If he had said that as to the great bulk of its lands Dakota was tory. The very gentlemen whose sentiment upon tne subject of divis similar in its agricultural adaptation to the States of Nebraeka and Min ion he regards as so infl.uential, and whose character he. describes as so nesota, which border it on the east and south, he would have been high, tell us that at that time there were over 400,000 people in the nearer to the exact truth, Nevada was admitted into the Union of the whole Territory. · States in 1864; Colorado was admitted in 1876. Now I want to show The Senator seemed to think that it was a great innovation, ~grave how unlike the Territory of Dakota is to the States of Nevada and departure from precedents, and a most outrageous and extrnorillnary Colorado, judged as agricultural States, and I do not ·mean at all to thing that an artificial line, a parallel of latitude, should be established underrate the capac1ty at least of Colorado to maintain a great popu- as a line of division between North and South Dakota. He said there lation. . was no great river there rolling like the turbulent Missouri does In 1880 the State of Nevada, which-was admitted into the Union of through his State. Why should it be divided? The Senator is too the States twenty years ago, had only 1,404 farms; Colorado, which has familiar with the map not to know that artificial lines are the frequent, been a State for.ten years, had 4,506 farms, while Dakota had 17,435, and even the ordinary, boundaries o"f States in this country. His rea or 11,525 more farms than both those States put together. Dakota son will show him that it is the best boU.ndary, because it is cermin like those States ! The eager searchers for agricultural lands, the rest and unfluctuating. It is well for the State of Missouri that she did less men who shake off the limitations of a settled neighborhood, sell not border on the Missouri River. That line would have been very out their Jittl_e farms, and go out to look for land, know good land when difficult to define from year to year. If the middle thread of the they see it, and the comparison which I have made between the num stream had been one of her borders, some of he~ .citizem would, very ber of farms taken up shows the judgment of the settlers. It is not a likely, have found themselves in another State without moving out of fuir comparison to ~en Dakota's capacity to sustain population to their houses. The low-water mark, the middle thread of a stream, Nevada or Colorado. particularly streams flowing through alluvial beds, is rather a bad But that is not all. Nevada had a total of land in farms of 530,862 boundary for a State, whereas a parallel of latitude is absolutely the aeres, and Colorado had a total of 1,165,373 acres; while Dakota had most convenient, easily marked, and certain line that could be adopted. 3,800,656 acres in fa,rms in 1880, or over 2,200,000 acres moreinfarms But does the Senator think that it is an unusual thing to divide a than both of those States combined. Territory and admit one part of it as a State? No; he can not think . Let us look at their production and see how those States compare that, because it was the course pursued with that great domain which with Dakota. In 1880 Nevada raised 69,298 bushels of wheat, Colo we called the Northwestern Territory. I twas first placed from Ohio to rado 1,425,000 bushels, the total of the two States being 1,494,312 its extreme borders under one ·Territorial organization, and when the bushels. In that same ye.ar Dakota produced 2,830,(J{)O bushels of settlements in that part nearest to the States became sufficiently numer wheat. ous and the population sufficiently great Ohio was carveQ. out of the Mr. FRYE. Dakota entire? Northwestern Territory and constituted a State. Mr. HARRISON. Theentire Territory; I am speakingofthatnow .. . 1884. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-SENATE. 185 I should say to tlie Senator from Maine that of this 2,830,000 bushels RELL], and tha.t hiS own distinguished predecessor, Senator Bogy, somewhat leSs than half of ir. was raised in Southern D..tlmh, but I both voted in1876foradivisionoftheTerritoryon the forty-sixth parallel think Southern Dakota itself--I gave the exact figuras in my opening and. for the admission of the southern partofit as a State, and not only remarks-was very nearly equal to the aggregate production of those those Democratic Senators, but the Senator from North Carolina [Mr. two States in wheat. As I stated in my opeain.; rem:uks, the wheat RANSOM], and several others whose names I do not recall. Now, in the crop of Dakota. for this year is estimated at 30,0UO,OQO bushels. name of consistency, a jewel which I know my friend the senior Sena Nevada. produced 12,891 bushels of corn in 1880; Colorado produced tor from Missouri highly values, for I know bow he clings to prece 455,968 bushels; an aggregate of 468,859 bushels for the two States. dent in the Committee on 1\lilitm·y Affairs-in the name o 1the jewel Dakota produced 2,000,000 bushels of corn the same year, nearly all of of consistency, I beg at least the senior Senator from Missouri and the it in Southern Dakota. So we have here in Dakota 1,400,000 bushels Senator from North Carolina and any surviving members here in the more of wheat and over a million and a ha.lf more bushels of corn Senate of that noble band of Democrats who voted for the admission of raised in 1880 than in the combined States to which the Senator from Dakota in 1876 to stand by it now. Missouri likens Dakota as to its agricultural possibilities. Mr. COCKRELL. Will the Senator yield to me for a moment? But the Senator said that this new Territory ~ad become the abode of Mr. HARRISON. Certainly; with great pleasure. the agricultural monopolists; that its til.rms were great farms; and he 1Ir. COCKRELL. Unfortunately I was not present 'during the first alluded to the great DJJrymple farm, which many here have seen per part of my colleague's speech yesterday, when a paper was read (my haps, though I have not. It has been made too much to stand as a sam attention bas been called to it this morning) in which it is stated that ple Dakota farm. Would the Sena.tor believe that. the census shows in 1876 there was a vote taken in the Senate on this question. I have the average acreage in ea.ch farm jn Dakota to be only 218 acres? It is the paper before me, but I have not examined it very carefully. I not a land of Dalrymple fa.rms, where agricultural monopolists have believe it states that the question was ·only on a proposed division of absorbed the entire Territory and bring only in harvest-time fugitive Dakota. workmen to reap the crop and then send them off. The average acre Mr. HARRISON. No; the Senator will find tha;t his colleague, on age of farms in Dakota is only218. In North Carolina it is.212, and in page 143 of the RECORD, after an interruption by me, says it was a bill Oregon it is 260. dividing the Territory of Dakota and admitting the southern half of it. I procured from the Commissioner of the General Land Office th~ sta Mr. COCKRELL.• The memorial only refers-to a bill ·to divide the tistics of homestead entries in tbe Territory of Dakota. I do not intend Territory. Now I desire to say simply that if a proposition was ever to put in the entire table, for it is not necessary, but I notice that the before the Senate to divide the Territory I should doubtless have voted first homestead entry marked here in North Dakota was in 1871. The for it. If there has ever been any pr~position before the Senate· for the original homestead entries in South Dakota go back further than this admission of the Territory since I have been a. member of it, from the table, which begins in 1863 with seventy-five homestead entries in South 4th of March, 1875, to this time, I have certainly not voted for it. I Dakota that year. T.he total number of original homestead entries in am opposed on principle to the admission of new Territories with im South Dakota is 62,400, and the number of acres ta,ken up is 9, 677,463. mense area and a small population, and I have persistently and con The Senator seems to ha'9"e the impression that the emigration to Da- sistently voted against any proposition for their admission as States in . kota. in recent years has been composed of amateur cowboys-men with the Union. out families, who went out to ranches to live in huts on the hills and ride I desire to say that I have searched every solitary J olirnal of the Sen ( bronchos. Let me show the Sen&.tor the number of homestead entries ate from 1870 to 1883, and I can find no record of any such vote as is made in Dakota in 1884 in a single year. In Southern Dakota the nil.m stated in the memorial. I can find no yea-and-nay vote upon that ques ber was 10,117. I do not mean to say that every.one of these implies a tion at all. I have before me every bill that was introduced and printed family. I believe it is true that some women have taken homesteads so far as the Journal shows touching Dakota. The first one was in the in Dakota, and I have seen some remarkable stOries of their success as Forty-:fi.ft.h CoJ:!gress. There were memorials presented previously, but I agriculturists. I should not be at all surprised if Miss Bones, whose let this is a bill, Senate bill144, reported by Senator Chaffee, February 28, ter the Senator read yesterday, was a homesteader in Dakota. These 1878, accompanied by report No. 110. It was to establish the Territory homestead entries imply not cowboys, notra.nchmeu, not cattle-herders of Lincoln and provide a temporary government therefor. I can not find o:ntthe public domain, but farmers, who have gone there to take up the that there was ever any yea-and-nay vote -or any divisi€>n ·taken upon moderate amount of land allowed by the homestead law and to make that bill. That was the first paper in the shape of a bill. Then, in homes about which families are to be gathered. 1879, Senator Paddock, of Nebra:Ska, introduced a bill. In 1880 Sen The Senator argued at some length the question as to the sentiment ator Saunders, of Nebraska, introduced a bill, and my colleague upon of the Territory on the subject of division. I should be glad to ask the that bill made a minority report. · Senator whether if it were made clear to his mind that a very large per lit 1881 a bill was· introduced by Senator Windom to .divide the Ter cent., largely more than a majority of the _people of Dakota, favored ritory and form a Territorial government, but I do not find any vote division be would favor it. If not, it is idle for him to be arguing the taken upon it. I have a recollection that there has been a vote taken question as to what the wishes of the people are. Ifthatwould influ in the Senate since I have been a member of it upon the division of Da ence him in the smallest degree, then I invite him to offer an amend kota, but I have no recollection of any vote having been taken for the IQ.ent to the bill which shall provide for submit£ing the question of a organization·of the Territory of Dakota. into a State, ap.d I should like division as a preliminary measure to a vote of the people ofthe Terri very much for the record ofitto be found. I have examined the Jour tory, and that the scheme for the admission of the southern half shall nals myself. I understanq the Senator from Indiana has also ba,d some be staid unless a majority of the people vote for division. examination made, and I called upon the gentleman to whom we all As I say, there is no use discussing the question of the wishes of the look for information, our reporter, and be was not able,_ in the few mo people unless their wishes when they are known are to be in some degree ments he gave, to find it; so that there must be some mistake in regard influential with Senators; and yet as I understand the Senator if every to a portion of the memorial. voter in Dakota, if every inhabitant, ·man, woman, and child in the Mr. HARRISON. I am very sorry the record can not be found, Territory, north an~ south, were to express here by petition their desire because it would show that the Senator from North Carolina, the Sen for a division on the forty-sixth pamllel he would not voteforit. Then ator from 1\lissouri who has just spoken, and two or three other Sena . it is not very important to find out what their wishes .are; bot I want tors, perhaps, on that side of the Chamber had given a very creditable to look at that question for a moment, and I wish to say here that if vote. The Senator from :Missouri who has just taken his seat says any Senator would be influenced at all by such a vote as I have de that he would vote at any timl3 for a division; he thinks the Territory scribed I should not oppose an amendment to the bill which would ought to be divided; he would vote now for a division. There is a ascertain in some authoritative waythesentimentofthepeople on that conflict then between him and the j finior Senator from that S.tate, who subject. turns his batteries most strongly, perhaps, upon the proposition for a The Senator by way of showing opposition in the Territory to a di division of the Territory, while the senior Senator from Missouri says vision brought here a memorial presented by a delegation from Bis be is constitutionally opposed to the admission of a State with a large marck rather than from Dakota, and there is this peculiar thing about area and a small population, and therefore be is going to vote against the representations of that memorial. It refers to a vote taken on a. the admission of Southern Dakota. The area is large, ample, in his bill which the Senator from Missouri described as a bill. dividing the mind, for a State. M:ay I ask the Senator whether he does not think Territory of Dakota and admitting the southern portion of it. The that a population equal to a basis of representation in the Honse of memorial refers to the bill as having been presented to the Senate in Representatives is sufficient population for the admission of a State? 1876, and it assumes to give the vote taken in the Senate upon the Mr. COCKRELL. No, sir; not if it ha.d four times that much. bill. I have had a careful examination made of the Journals of the That is no criterion at all. Senate from 1871 to this time, and the experts in the document-room Mr. HARRISON. The Senator is frank, perhaps, in that resi>ect; have been unable to find any trace of such a bill or of such a vote. It · without intending to indulge in any odious compa.rison, I might say may yet be discovered, but up to this time it seems probable tha.t these franker than his.-colleague, because he says he would vote against the memorialists were mistaken; but if it is true, what would be its pro ba admission of Dakota if it had four times 150,000 population. The area the effect, I may ask ? in his mind is ample for a State. If a Democratic Territory with 600,000 The Sefiator from Missouri proves, if this is to be accepted as a·jour inhabitants and a sufficient area, and the other necessary incidents of nal record of the action of the Senate, that his own present colleague, Statehood, were to ask his vote,_I think he would change his mind. my distinguished friend the senior Senator from Missouri [Mr. CocK- Mr. President, to refuse Dakota admission is one method of disfran- 186 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-SENATE. 'DECEMBER 11, chising men, and when the disfranchisement goes· upon the ground of think he was an old Maryland Know-Nothing; he ml'lst have belonged politicalopinion,·and can find no other justification in precerlent or rea- to that old party, and, as my friend from l\lassachusetts' [MI. DAWES] son, it is an outrage upon the rights of a free people. . suggests, that old party in Maryland, after some feeble protest, in great The Senator from Missouri (Mr. VEST] fortified himself in his argu: part; consented to a lasting wedlock with the Democmtic party. ment to sustain the proposition that the people did not desire admi~ But, Mr. President, the statement of this gentleman is just as wide $on as a State by two most extra,Qrdinary letters. He did not deal of the· truth when he alludes to the ratio of toreign and native born with the evidence furnished by conventions n.nd Legislatures. He citizens iu Dakota as it is when be sa.vs tbq.t he does not know a. man brought individual witnesses. I most 8ay that I was surprised at the who is in favor of Statehood. According to the census of 1880 there bitterness with which the Senator from Missouri talked about ambi was a majority of over 30,000 of the inhabitants of Dakota that were tious politicians, and attributed to the presence of a pernicious and native born; and yet this intelligent correspondent, ·upon .whom the pestiferous class of men whom he thus descrihe Mr. HARRISON. Well, Mr. President, I accept the Senator's ex a national sabbath, as any other sabbath that may be ordained by law planation, that he' offered this onder that compulsion which rests upon or may be rec.ognized by Christi.~nity . ..,ny Senator, when any citizen of the country, howev,er humble, ad Mr. S HER MAl.~. The Senate will remember that a large number of .· (1resses a communication to this body in respectful terms,. to present delegations are coming from different parts of the United States, some it, and that he would not have used it in his argument if it had not of them military in their chara.cter, and the commission felt unani boon for this obligation. mously that it was not wise to put those ceremonies in antagonism to Mr. President, e\·en this lady insists upon division, as does also"Mr. a sentiment among the religions people of the country, and, therefore, Richmond. it was deemed better to change the time. We did not !eel nt liberty Now, Mr. Presttient, so far as I am concerned I propose to leave this to do it without the consent of Congress. question to the judgment of the Senate. I will not repeat the proposi The joint resolution was 'reported to the Senate without 1tmendment, tions which I have endeavored to maintain. I will only remind Sena ordered to be engrossed for a third reading, read the third time, and tors that this population, which is entitled to their res.pect, which is passed. entitled to the care of this body as charged with the enactment of pub HOUSE BILL REFERRED. lic laws, is, by the testimony of men whose veracity you can not im The bill (H. R. 7577) making appropriations for the support of the peach, now hampered, restrained by an inadequate governmental organ Military Academy for the fiscal year ending June 3.{), 1&:!6, and tor ization; that the business of its courts is so delayed and encumbered as other purposes, was read twice by its title, and referred to the com to amount to a denial of justice. mittee on Appropriations. Let every Senator, then, answer to his own conscience. Let him re member t&at he is making a precedent so far as ltis vote und influence ·IMPROVEMENT OF GALVESTON HARBOR. go that is t • , 188 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-- HOUSE. DECEMBER 11, merce and for other purposes, was mad.e the special order for to-day. and yield for his request, but I can not consent to do so if the bill which In cas~ the bill is not reached to-day will it follow as the speclal order he now ca-lls up is likely to give rise to debate or consume much time in after the present pending bill is disposed of? its consideration. It is all-important that speedy action should be The PRESIDENT pro tempore. 'l;'he Chair is of opinion that the taken npoD the unfinished business. special orQ..ers w-e to be taken up in ~he order for which they_ ma~ be Mr. MILLS. If it leads to any debate I will withdraw the motion. assigned, and not in the order at w h1ch ~be Sena:te made the directw_n. M:J;. REAGAN. With that understanding I shall not object to the Mr. CULLOM. The desire I have IS that It shall follow the bill request. now under consideration. . . The SPEAKER. The bill to which the gentleman from Texas re The PRESIDENT pm tempore. The Cha~r thinks that it ~his duty fers will be read, after which the Chair will ask for objection. to lay the first special order before the Senate on the conclusiOn ?f the The bill was read at length. pending business, the time having arrived when it should be latd be- The SPEAKER. Is there objection to the present consideration of fore the Senate. · this bill? " EXECUTIVE SESSION. :Mr. PERKINS._ I object. _Mr. HOAR. I move that the Senate proceed to the consideration of ORDER OF BUSINESS. executive business. Mr. WEAVER. I a2k unanimous consent to take from the Speak The motion was agreed to; and the Senate proceeded to the consid er's table for present consideration the bill S. 348. eration of executive business. Afterthirty-eightminutes spent in ex Mr. TULLY. I can for the regular order. ecutive session the doors were reopened, and (at 4 o'clock and 11 min PUBLIC BUILDING AT WACO, TEX. utes p. m.) the Senate adjourned. The SPEAKER. The g~ntleman fro!Jl Kansas [Mr. PERKINS) withdraws his objection to the request of the gentleman from Texas [Mr. MILLs]. Is the call for the regular order insisted on? liOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES. Mr. TULLY. I withdraw the call for the regular order. Mr. THOMPSON. I wish to know whether this is to open the flood THURSDAY, Decembe-r 11, 1884. gates to all the bills for public buildings. Mr. HOLMAN. Before action is taken upon this bill I hope there- The Honse met at 12o'~lock m. Prayer by the Chaplain, Rev. JoHN port will be read. · S. LINDSAY, D. D. . The Journal of yesterday's proceedings was read and approved. The SPEAKER. The Chair will state that this is a Senate bill. The following additional members appeared and took their seats: Mr. HOLMAN. There is a corresponding bill which bas been re ported by the House committee. Let the report of_the House com Mr: BLACKBURN and Mr. NICHOLLS. mittee be read. ORDER OF BUSINESS. Mr. BRUMM. I object to the present consideration of the bill. Mr. REAGAN. Mr. Speaker, I call up the unfinished business com- There are many others in the same condition as this. Let them all ing over from yesterday. - take their chance together. The SPEAKER. Pending the demand for the regular order, the PENSION APPROPRIATION BILL. Chair will lay before the House certain executive communications. · Mr. HANCOCK, from the Committee on Appropriations, reported a _ CLAIMS FOR INDIAN DEPREDATIONS. bill (H. R. 7676) making appropri'ttions for the payment of invalid The SPEAKER laid before the House a letter from the Secretary of and other pensions of the United States for the fiscal year ending June the Interior, transmitting, in compliance with law, an abstract of · 30~ 1886, and forotbe~ purposes; which was read a first and second fu.ne, I· claims on account of Indian depredations, presented to the Secretary of referred to the Committee of the Whole Honse on the state of the Umon, the Interior since February 20, 1884, together with the action taken and, with the a-ccompanying report, ordered to be printed. thereon and the evidence on which the same is based; which was re.: INTERSTATE COMMERCE. ferred to the Committee on Indian Affairs, and ordered to be printed. Several members called for the regular order. PRINTING AND BINDING CODIFIED LAND LAWS. · The SPEAKER. The regular order isdeinanded, and the House re The SPEAKER also laid before the House a letter from the Secretary sumes the consideration of the special order, the bill (H. R. 5461) to of the Treasury, asking an appropriation of $2,500 for printing, binding, c."'tablish a board of commissioners of interstate commerce and to ~egn a.nd distributing the codified land laws and history of the public domain late such commerce. The gentleman from California [Mr. GLASCOCK) of the United States; which was referred to the Committee on Appro is entitled to tbetloor. priations. Mr. GLASCOCK .. Mr. Speaker, in discussing a measure so fraught_ OFFICE OF THE SECOND AUDITOR. with moment to the great body of our industrial and commercial interests The SPEAKER also laid befqre the House a. letter from the Second it is necessary to examine its approaches with some degree of caution. Auditor, relative to additional accommodations required for his office, The railroad problem is not easy of access, much less of ready solution, and making an increase of $1,200 in the estimates for rent of buildings; to those-who have not been charged with a. close, constant, and practi which was referred to the Committee on Appropriations. cal study of its details. The many complexities that invest the latter day railway transportation existence,"tbe interdE>pendence of its many REPRINT OF A REPORT. parts, the delicate adjustment of its complicated machinery, its close On motion of Mr. HUNT, by unanimous consent, it was ordered that connection with trade, and the stimulating and diversifying influence the report from the Committee on American Ship-building and Ship that it exercises upon all forms of industry, commend its careful and owning Interests, accompanying House bill No. 4984, be reprinted for slcilled supervision to a power that may be used to destroy· when it the use of the House. should regulate. WITHDRAWAL OF PAPERS. We recognize in it a potential factor of civilization. lt binds a con At the requelit of Mr. OURY, by unanimous consent, ]eave ·was tinent and .practically annihilates spare in the diffusion of production. granteq to withdraw papers in the claim of William Christy from the It tunnels the mountain and tracks the desert. It furnishes an outlet files of the Honse, there being no adverse report. for the farm, the loom, and the forge. On the other hand, althou~h it PUBLIC BUILDING AT WACO, TEX. selfthecreatureoftrade, by combination itholds tradein an irongrasp, and where competition is wanting imposes its own terrru; upon pro Mr. MILLS. _Mr. Speaker, my colleague will, I hope, yield to me duction. for a moment to make a. request of the House to which I believe there Transportation depends upon_production for existence, as production can be no objection. depends upon it for profit. The connection between the two is so inti I desire to ask consent of the House to take from the Speaker's table mate that an injury inflicted upon one iB an injury to the other. This and put upon its passage Senate bill"No. 52, providmg for the erection is so manifest that one would suspect naught but the friendliest and - of a public building at Waco, Tex.; and I want to state to the House most obliging relations between the two. And such would be the case in this connection what will be remembered by all-if gentlemen will were the millennium come and selfishness eliminated from human trans recall the action taken in reference to this matter when it was under actions. But the shipper must have the highest profit on production, consideration-that this bill, or rather I should say another bill, a and the carrier will, where not prevented by competition or controlled House bill precisely similar and identical to it word for word, was con bylaw, assess traffic what it will bear. The constant warfare between sidered by the Committee of the Whole on·"tbe state of the Union and these two great conflicting interests has given rise to the agitation that recommended to the House for passage, and' is now upon the Speaker's bas result,ed in constitutional enactments in twenty-two States regu table, no action having been taken upon that recommendation by the lating the opemtions of the railway carrier within State limits and now House. I ask now that this Senate bill be taken up and passed. There demands Congressional legislation to regulate commerce between the has not been a bill of this character passed by this Congress; and gen States. tlemen will recognize the fact that there i.s great and pressing necessity -It is conceded that much of the evil formerly complained of has been for the passage of certain of these bills through the House witliout remedied. ~Iany sharp angles have been smoothed by the friction of delay. trade. Whether this bas happened, as intimated by the gentleman Mr. REAGAN. I shall beverymuchpleased togratifymycolleague from ~1assachusetts [Governor LoNG] through a realization on ibe part • I~ J .1884. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. 189 of the corporations that "the nearer the approach to fair and square which he must make a reasonable profit. This he is entitled to, and of dealing the better it pays in the long run," or through the sharp com this no reasonable man would deprive him. I .would be the last to petition that has sprnng in the carrying service· from improved -water counsel or sanction the divorcing of any man from the legitimate fruits ways and the rapid and enormous incrt>ase in population with the re of his industry. It is the illegitimate fruits of unchecked power that sultant increase in the area of production, it is immaterial for us to we object to, and furthermore to the power itself that enables ·capital .inquue. Thismightlead to a discussion of ethics and good morals which, by combining to pluck the fruits of others labor without let or hin although always in order, would at present be altogether unprofitable. derance from lawful authority. Suffice it that freight rates on the whole have decreased with us to When a carrier under corporate _authority invests his money in a such an extent that our freight is now ca\ried at a less rate pe:r ton per carrying plant he dons the livery of public service, becomes an agent mile than in. Belgium, France, and England; that our ra.tes have ihllen for the public, and renders himself amenable to public supervision and on the average, in a dec..'\de, from 2! cents per ton per mile to less than authority. His plant is his private property. He can give it away, a cent; tha.t in the diminution of rate for through traffic, sometimes at sell it, destroy it. It can not be taken from him except by the laws the expense of way traffic, the food product of the great West has found of eminent domain upon full compensation. paid. But so long as he Us way to the populous East and the mill product of the East bas turned uses it in the performance of the powers and privileges flowing from his to the West by rapid transit and at such cheapened rates that they are charter, his service is a public service apd he to that extent becomes a brought within easy reach of all consumers. . public servant, invested with the obligationS of full and fair ~ervice for But with the consideration of these )Hatters, while deserving of praise, an adeq·uate remuneration. we have nothing to do. The efforts of the committee were directed to Is the public to sit idly by and see its serv:mts confederating and com the formulation of certain rules that would in 3! general way meet the bining with the intent and obvious result of exempting themselves frOJll complaints made and at t\le same time allow"the carrier the fullest lib their proportionate-share of the burdens of service? But, say the erty of operation compatible with the protection of commerce. Unrea friends of the pool, unless the carriers are permitted to combine, com sonable charges, taking into consideration the cost of service and the petitive strife, cuts in rates, railroad wars, fluctuations in business, and advantages accruing to the shipper by 1·eason of increased facilities in unsettlement of securities will be the inevitable and disastrous result. rapid and safe sbi pmen t, unjust discriminations between con tern porane It might, and the contingency is to be deplored. But we cannotdo evil ous shippers, actual and possible broader combinations between carriers that good may come of it. We can not permit the power given by com by which competition is virtually destroyed and the power placed in bination to throttle production. Railroad wars occurred before the the hands of the carrier to unreasonably tax production-these are the divine intricacies of the pooling system were evolved from the mental questions that now claim the serious attention of this body. consciousness of the railroad expert,. They have occurred since the pool After much laltor of analysis-many, I trust, profitable weeks of dis has been in active operation, and the country still lives. They will cussion by the ablest railroad talent in the countrJ (whose arguments, occur so long as human cupidity backed by corporate soullessness holds printed by order of the committee, seem, judging from certain lines of the reins of the carrying power. There are no doubt many who consci reasoning adopted in the preceding part of this debate, to have found entiously believein the efficacy of the pool to cure the evils that so fre their way to the desks of others besides members of the committee on quently result from sharp competition. Buttbe'factis, in my humble the floor of this Hou:se)-after long and mature deliberation,. the_com judgment, no human power can prevent the precipitation of the con mittee rejected eighteen bills submitted to it and presented to the ditions just mentioned so long as avarice and selfishness dominate the House in lieu thereof the bill now under consideration. This bill, I commercial world. am happy to say, has found a champion. in at least one member of the Trade will find its level wherever carried on, and railway as other committee, who, while not claiming the paternity thereof, is yet will corporations must render obedience to the law that dominates it ing to be placed in the category of foster-tatber to this orphan without supply and demand. Railways spring from the necessities oftbe people, dotting a bib or crossing a tucker. and like all other pursuits so originated offer a fair field to the investor. In this diversity of opinipn the committee but reflected the/thought It is the effort to make them monopolies that proves baneful to the of the country at large upon this perplexing and fascinating question. _public and ruinous to the investor. The business that outrages the Granted certain evils, how can legislation be brought to bear upon public by its charges must give way to some other in which the investor them so as to cure without injury? How can we formulate a rule of is satisfied with smaller returns, or it must absorb the new enterprise, conduct for the carrier that will not prove harsh and iron-clad and will and this can be done only at a price above cost. Every new absorption not fail to meet the shifting demands of a varying trade? We are told must be.attended by increased fictitious capitalization to enable it to that if the Government lays its strong hand upon the carrying service meet and conquer the next competitor. Either the process of absorp- · trade will suffer. We learn among other things that a combination tion must continue or crushing must be resorted to. Either event is of competitors will n:ot prevent competition; that it is just and fair t~ disastrous to the business public and to investors. c~arge one shipper more than another for similar service, or, rather, to And right here lies the chief danger to be apprehended from this charge the same originally to both, and t}len by a secret rebate to one pooling system. The great pools are monopolies within their juris to create the inequality complained of. diction. If they are allowed to live and increase they will absorb or Noli me tangere is the motto of transportation, towhich might be justly crush their weaker rivals, and the result will be theinthrallment of in added the nemo m.e impune lacessit, of sharper and truer signifiCance. Is dustrial enterprise aud the establishment of a business oligarchy whic)l it right? Is it just that production· should be tied hand and foot and will hold despotic sway over land transportation and practically con handed over to the tender mercies of its great servant? Of course trol the waters of our country. This may seem visionary, but it is transportation is too astute to kill the industry that lays the golden within the limits of possibility. When we re~ect that forty great lines egg; but why should it complain when.the moderate though firm hand are pooled between Chicago and the Eastern seaboard, that the Missis of authority is laid upon its efforts to force nature by demanding of sippi Valley and the Southwtst are under pool, and that 'the West is in an already overburdened production that it honor its double, and often similar condition, it does not appear such a remote contingency_that ·treble, drafts for the golden product? some master hand may in the not distant future weave all these threads You who live in the East have not felt as we of the West the full into the warp and woof of a _great railway transportation personality, measure of this evil. Nature bas provided you with abundant water that will be a standing menace not only to the liberty of production ways. Inland seas and magnificent rivers are the natural .competitors but to the free institutions of our fair land. of the rail way. These water ways, furnishing a naturally cheaper means Considerable has been said in the course of this debate concerning of tmnsportation, control and fix the rates of carriage by Jand as well the English policy of railway amalgamations, and the impression-bas as on their own element Besides this, a growing and rcstlcsR people, been conveyed, whether designedly or not, that in England pooling is stimulated by example and eager to acquire wealth, ha\e dug costly recognized as lawful. Not so. On the contrary, whenever a pooling cana,Js and constructed other railways, until now the East is rife with contract has come before the courts it bas been declared void. The competition in the carrying service. The supply oftransporting agen common-law doctrine that all contracts between companies to pool cies is in excess of the local demand, and in consequence transporta their earnings and divide the profits on other than a natural basis are tion must stretch its arms to the boundless prairies and fertile valleys void has been steadily adhered to, and is still the rule. One citation of the West. will answer for a dozen. · There are two lines of rail way between Rugby There, however, the Conditions are changed. With a population and Shrewsbury. These roads as to competitive traffic entered into a sparse in proportion to territory, the inilway holds sway undisputed, pooling contract. This contract came before the courts in the case of save by rivals of its kind. We have no inland seas, no majestic rivers, the Shrewsbury and Birmingham Railroad Company 'I.'S. The North to dictate terms of transportation to these gentlemen. We have no canals western Railroad Company (4 De G.~ Macn., 134), and was held un except those used for purposes of irrigation-adjuncts to production, not lawJU.l, on the grounds that it provided for an alienation by one of these o~ transportation. 'When these rail way carriers combine, pool, confedet companies of a portion of its traffic to the other, and that it was against ate, as they can and now do, what mercy can production expect? The public policy. farmer must, to get ahead in tho world, ship his surplus product. Mr. Gladstone's a,ction in acting as an arbitrator to divide certain Neighborhood consumption is soon exhausted and with small returns. traffic from London among the roads, as evidence of the lawful estima If it be fed to live-stock, that in turn must be marketed. tion in which pooling-conh·acts are held in England, has been cited with In any event transportation must be had at any price above the cost approval. But the citation is at fault. His arbitration was upon the of the article shipped. True, the carrier must live. He bas a valua division of traffic rea{)hing a certain station, not upon a pooling con ble and costly property in which his money bas been invested and from tract which divides earnings. 190 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. DECE~IDER 11' Mr. Albert Fink, the great railroad authority, acknowledges the ille you can, and according to the measure of success in that direction will gality at common law of pooling contracts when he asks us "to legalize trade return to the channels of legitimate <:ompetition. • the management of railroad property under this plan and to abandon Let us recur to the illustration on this point used by the gentleman the an tiq ua.ted notion that a government or combination, as it is called, from Massachnsetts [Governor Lmw], namely, the inabili1~ · of the ofthiS kind is. against public poliey. " · American stave~maker to compete with his Norwegian brother in the In this country,· wher~ver pooling contracts have been submitted to 'English market by reason of the refusal of the carrit!r, enforced through judicial investigation they have been uniformly held void, as against the enactment of the Heagan substitute, 1o alJow a rebate on the charges public policy. Nota,bly the case of the M. R. H. Co. vs. Barclay Coal of transportation sufficient to meet the expense of the ocean carriage. Mining Co. (68 Pa. St. Rep., 173), the careful perusal of which is com I refer thus often to the remarks of my brother on the committee be mended to the gentleman from Pennsylvania (Ur. O'NEILL], and the cause they are always intensting. alwaysinstruetive, and nearly always famous case of the Atchh>on, Topeka and Santa Fe Railroa"1f Company correct. But in this instance he is at fault. His claim is that the enact ·pool with the Denver and Rio Umnue, by which the earnings of the ment of this section of the Reagan substitute woulu compel the railroad roads were to be divided and all trespassers upon their territory to refuse the rebate so necessary to the exportation of American staves, crushed. Theopinion was delivered by Judge Hallett, Judge McCrary and thus inure to the djsadvautage of American production. concurring, and declares that it is enou_gh to say that it is a conspiracy In the first place, the railroads are carrying the staves to New York to grasp commerce and to suppress the building of railroads in two for six-tenths of a cent per ton per mile. This we learn from l\lr. Fink is great States-, citing decisions from Pennsylvania, New York, and other very little above the actual cash cast of service. Very little additional States in support. · reduction would reduce the price of carriage to the cost of service. Is Railway corporations are formed as free and independententitiesfor the carrier to transport without compensation merely for the pleasure public service. How long would any legislative body tolerate a propo of seeing a foreign trade built up for a ~rtain American product? sition to petmit them to go into partnership? Yet the pro.,position in Does he hold the same financial views as the party who exi>ected to be volved in pooling is tantamount to such permission. The evil involved come wealthy by selling at cost price, simply from the enormous sales in a partnership of corporations is inherent in corporate combination tor he made? Or does he expect to assess on other shippers the amount the purpose of dividing earnings, to wit, the power to oppr~ by aggre that he has failed to charge this particular one? · gation of capital and to prevent fair ~nu free competition among bread In thL~ case competitive service does not enter inlo the problem. winners. Thus the common law has alwaysset its face against combi There are no natural advantages or disadvantages that would tend, by nation. An individual may set the price of his commodities at what decreasing or increasing the cost of service, to lower or raise the carry rate he pleases, but when two or more enter into a combination to raise ing price. It is a case of pure patriotism or pure favoritism, and from or lower the price of an article it becomes a conspiracy and is indict our knowledge of the fact that railroad men are human, very human. able. So men are allowed to join their 1ortunes under corporate law for we must incline to the latter view. · the transaction of legitimate business. But here the line must be Who gives to thecarrierstheright to say to one man or one product, drawn. It should not be extended to the union of corporate power and ''We will build yon up and exalt you above your neighbors, and your wealth. The results upon public business would be too far-reaching, enemies shall become a footstool under yonr feet?'' Who invested them and public policy calls a halt. It is manifestly in the interest of the with the power to determine'What American pr:oduct shall be exported Amedcan shipper that the pooling system should be abolished and the and what shall not? carriers left to compete for traffic under the recognized .and legitimate Besides, even under the committee bill how will the stave-exporter laws of trade. fare? No rebate, drawback, or other advantage can beextt>nded to him This power is prohibited by both t.he committee bill and the Reagan which is not granted to all others under similar circumstances. Suppose substitute; the committee bill, however, does not seem to feel folly as a hundred stave-makers live in the same vicinity. One coultl not enjoy sured of its position, for it commends the subject to the careful inves an ad vantage not possessed by all. The words '' under similar circum t,igation of the commission that it creates. · The main differences in the stances" are broad. Would not shingle or shake makers con1e in this bills lie in the questions of the short and long haul, the rebate and category? Must the'' similar circumstances'' apply only to shapers of drawback section, the posting of schedules, and the establishment of a wood? Would not iron and steel be included? In fi.ue, are not the commission clothed with inquisitorial and quasi-judicial powers. . words broad enough to cover all articles manufactured or grown and The second section of the Reagan substitute is as follows: susceptible, under the laws of supply and demand, of export? Wilen SEC. 2. That it shall be unlawful for any persOn or persons engaged in the this point is reached and all articles capable of exportation are brought transportation of property as aforesaid directly or indirectly to aJJow any rebate, within the sacred circle of this clause it is obvious that the stav~ drawback, or other advantage, in any form, upou shipments made or services maker will stand small show of competing with his Norwegian brother 1:endered as aforesaid by him or them. in the English markets. This omnibus clause carries us back virtually The third section of the committee bill adds to the section just cited to the letter of the Reagan substitute. Being surplusage, it should be the words "which under similar circumstances are not allowed to all . stricken out. other persons,'' thus allowing rebates anu drawbacks, but making them The full measure of the evil of this system is felt nowhere so keenly applicable, where circumstances are similar, to all alike. Gentlemen as in sections where little or no competition exists. There it holds im who have addressed you in support of the committee hill have depre perial sway. It builds up and tears down private business. It has its cated rebates, but have claimed that there are certain circumstances favorites to reward, its t!nemies to punish. It controls a host of spies under which rebates are not only j ustifiahle but are necessary to equal and informers. Its special contracts are systematized and graded. The ize and forward trade. . I have listened with attention to the argu books of your merchant are ~mbjected to examination and his private· ments use(l in this behalf, but am unable to subscribe to the doctrine affairs laid bare to prying eyes that his good faith with the carrier may there enunciated. be verified. Mr. Depew, in his argument before the committee, stated that the This power is too great to leave in the bands of tile carrier. It is se system of rebates and drawbacks was resorted to by " one railroad for cret, sly, and insidious. Its very secrecy-the fact that it works in the the protection of its customers.3.eo-ainst the attempt on the part of other dark and dreads the light-carries with it a warning of a danger too im-.) railroads competing with it from the same point to the same point, minent to pass unheeded. It should be met at once with the strong giving low mtes to their customers." And this refreshing declaration curb of the Reagan section. _ was made almost in the same breath with the statement that the effi The fourth section of the Reagan substitute provides that no more cacy or the pool now existing lay in its ability to prevent competitive shall be charge situated. He has ready and cheap transportation at his door. The done more to bring our people into a common brotherhood than could railway carrier is he1·e thrown into. competi_tion with a rival whose otherwise have been effected. right of way and road-_bed h~ cost him n?thmg. H~ must of neces.- The fifth section of the Reagan substitute requires the posting of sity refuse to extend h1~ ~rn~e to ~hat pomt, or, havrng ~ exte1_1ded, schedules· by the carrier: must enter into competition w1th h1s cheaper and more eastly eqmpped SEc. 5. Th&t all persons engaged in carrying property-as proYided in the first rivaL This he can only do by putting his charges at a paying mini- :~:~~n ofthis a"ct shall adopt and keep posted up schedules which shall pl&inly mum. Who is injured? Certainly not the shipper at this point. He ""First. The different kinds and clasees of property to be carried. 1ms now two strin!!S to his bow, where formerly he had but one. Second. The different places between whlch such property ~hall be carried. The iutroductio~ of a new and more rapid competing service has, in Third. The rates of freight and prices of carriage between such places, and for all sen·iees connected with the receiving, delivery, loading, unloatlin~. l:ltoringl a11 probability, resulted in lowering the mtes by water. Who com- or handling the same. And the accountll for such service shall show what pan plains'! The shipper ~ho li~es a hun~ed mil.es inlan~, and w bon p to of the charged are for transportation, and what part are forloading, unloading, tJ1e time of the ex tenston of the carrym!Z semce to h1s door has been and other terminal facilities. ~ .Such t!Chedules may be changed from time to time as hereinafter provided. compelled, at un expense of say 10 cents per ton per mile, to rely upon Copies of such schedules shall be printed in plain, large type, at least the size .J. ox-tea.m transportation. Now by rail be ships at a. cost of2 cents per of ordinary pica, and sbo.ll be kept plainly posted for puulic inspection in at . . ton ner mile. Yet be is loud in denunciation of the outrage practiced Joost two places iu every depot where freights are received or delivered; and J.' • h. fr• d no SUch t!Che course among the States and the transmission of intelligence are not obstructed violations of the law, and requiring United States marshals and their or unnecessarily encumbered by State legislation. deputies and subordinates to prosecute all violations which come to * . * * * * * * The Government of the United States, within the scope of its powers, operates their notice or knowledge. upon every _foot ofterritory under its jll!isdiction. It ~egislate~ for the whole This action of Congress has been universally acquiesced in and ac nation and 1s not embarrassed by State hnes. Its pecuharduty 1s to protect one cepted without protest by the States and by State corporations as within part of the country from encroachments by another upon the national right-s which belong to all. the scope of its powers. No State corporation can properly object to the exercise of such powers by Congress, as their ch.'lJ'tera were origi· This would seem to be a complete answer and refutation of the vari nally granted and accepted with a full know ledge that when their roads 'Ous points of objection taken bythe opponents not only of the pending should be connected with those of other States, and continuous lines ;measure, but of any legislation whatever looking to the regulation of formed extending through more than one State, such lines would be interstate commerce, so far as the power and jurisdiction of Congress are come channels for interstate commerce, and would thereby be subject bOncerned. It may be here remarked that there are two distinct classes to such.commercial regulations as Congress in its wisdom should from -of service performed by railways. time to time prescribe. First. The transportation of interstate traffic, that which originat~ The bill of the committee, the first pa~ of it :1,11d the substitute, in one State or Territory and is transported into or through one or more declare that equal facilities shall be granted to all as nearly as may other States or Territories. Over this class of traffic Congress has abso be in shipping and traveling privileges. That is right; and if it is righli lute control under the powers delegated by the Constitution "to regu it ought to be enforced. Each of these bills declares that discrimina late commerce with foreign nations and among the several States," as tions between individuals ·and places in the transaction of the business ..shown by the case already quoted. _of the railroads is wrong; and if it is wrong, it ought to be prohibited. Second. The transportation of State or domestic traffic, that which The bill assumes that rebates are only the means of concealing -originates and is confined within the territorial limits of the State. undue discrimination, and for that reason should be prohibited. If ()ver this class of businesa the State governments have exclusive juris- that assumption be true, rebates ought to be prohibited. The bills diction and control. ' assume that the pool is organized as a means of preventing competi The meaning of the word '' ~ommerce '' has been judicially defined tion and will be made the means of undue discrimination, and there by Chief-Justice Marshall in Gibbons VB. Ogden (9 Wheat., 188, 189): fore shall be prohibited. If that be true, it ought to be prohibited. ' The subject to be regulated is commerce, and our Constitution being, as was The pool, it is assumed and perhaps it is true, has grown and developed :aptly said at the bar, one of enumeration and not of definition, tQ ascertain the extent of the power it becomes necessary to settle the meaning of the word. out of the fa-ct that the Government hvs itself never exercised the con * * * Commerce undoubtedly is traffic, but it is somethi~g more; it is inter stitutional power of regulating commerce; and in the absence of that course. It describes the commercial intercourse between nations and parts of regulation, which the Constitution enjoins upon Congress, the pool haa nations in all its branches. * * * Commerce, as the word is used in the Con -stitution, is a. unit, every part of which is indicated by the term. arisen. Somewhat like a great smr-chamber court, it has been consti tuted by the consent and agreement of the gre..'\t railroad potentates of In a more 1·ecent case of the Philadelphia and R.eading R.ailroad vB. this country; and in that court the people have no representative and Pennsylvania, December term, 1872, the Supreme Court says: they have no day. I am not of the c1'lSS of people who believe that the Beyond all question the transportation of freights or of the subjects of com railroad managers of this country are criminals or bad men. I do not merce for the purposes of exchange or sale is a constituent of commerce itself. This has never been doubted, and probably the transportation of articles of believe that. trade from one Srate to nnother was the prominent idea in the Iilinds of the In many cases railroad corporations have yielded to the temptations, framers of the Constitution, when to Congress was committed the power to that men always yield to on opportunity, to aggrandize themselves regulate commerce among the several States. with too much power and an undue measure of wealth, perhaps, if they In construing the words "power to regulate," Chief-Justice Mar·· are not restrained. But all must confess that the ablest minds and shall, in the Gibbons vs. Ogden case, says: many of the best men of this country have become interested in the · This power, like all others vested in Congress, is complete in itself, may be development of the grand railroad system of this conntry and have ~xercised to its utmost extent, and acknowledges no limitations other than are linked their names to immortality. I object to the commission because provided in the Constitution. I think it will prove a failure; it will not answer the purposes which Congress has already exercised this power to regulate interstate rail the friends of the commission hope it will answer; and it is unnecessary. ways. On Jun.e 1G, 1 66, the following act was passed, as is claimed, I believe that the correct principle in government was asserted when at the instanceofrailwaycompanies (see Revised Statutes of the United the courts, State and national, were ordained and created to enforce States, section 5258) : rights and to prohibit wrong. I believe that whatever rights they are Every railroad company .n the Uuited States whose read 1s operated by Bteam, incapable of enforcing will fuil, and whatever wronga they are incapa its successor3and a,,signs, is hereby authorized to c:: rry upo::t and over its road, ble of prohibiting will go unprevented and unrestrained. boats, bridgca, and ferries all pa~se · ·gers, troops, Government supplie.. , mails, freight, and property, on their wo.y from any State to another State, and tore These courts have been ordained by the people as one of the co-ordi cdve compenEation therefor, and to connect with roads of other States, so as t<> nate bran<:hes of the Government. To them haY~ been committed the form continuous rnes for the tnnsportation of the same to the pln.ce ofde ~ tioa great powers of judgment upon all law that we enact. To their keep tion. * * * And Congress m ay at any time alter, amend, or repeal this seo tioo. ing are committed the hopes, fortunes, lives, and liberties of the people and the integrity of ourlaws. If weh:we come nponatimewhenany Again, on March 3, 1873, the following act was passed (see Re·vised law that we enact declaring rights and prohibiting wrongs can not be S.tatutes, section 4386): administered through their agency, then indeed have we reached the No railroad company within the United States whose road forms any part of a line of road over which cattle, sheep, swine, or other animals are conveyed from beginning of the end of free government. If the day has or shall ever one State to a.nothe1·, or the ownel'Sor mastersofsteam,sailing, or other vessel.! come in our country's history when the foul waters of political corrup carrying or transporting cattle, sheep, swine, or other animals from one State tion shall rise high enough to touch and pollute the judicial ermine·and to another, shall confine the same in cars, boats, or vessels of any description for a longer period than twenty-eight consecutive hours without unloading the so corrupt all the fountains ofjustice, then, I t·epeat, the end will be at sarue for rest, water, and feeding for a. period of at least five consecutive hours, hand and free government a demonstrated failure. &c. The commission provided for in the bill is not clothed with judicial The same law provides that the animals so unloaded from cars ''shall powers. As stated by the gentleman from California who has just left be properly fed and watered during such rests" by the railroad com the floor [Mr. GLAscocK], it is not clothed with the powers conferred pany, in case the owner or person in charge shall fail to do so. Any upon the English commission; for that commission can investigate, it failure to comply with the provisions of this law renders the company can restrain, it can enjoin, it can render advice. But my objection to liable to a penalty of from one hundred to five hundred dollars :fine, the English commission is that it is placed between the citizen and and section 4389, Revised Statutes, provides that" it shall be the duty the court. Its opinion, its advice must be had upon the legalicy, the of all United Sta.tes marshals, their deputies and subordinates, to prose right and the wrong of any act complained of, before suit can be insti cute all violations which come to their notice or knowledge." tuted in the English court to enforce the right, prohibit the wrong, or It a.ppears, therefore, that Congress has full and ample power under recover damages for mischief done. I will never give my consent in the Constitution to regulate interstate railway compahies, that this this country to place any body of men, any commission, between the power has been judicially confirmed and clearly defined by the United suitor and the court in which his rights are to be adjudicated. No States- Supreme Court. It also appears that Congress has already ex man, no set of men, shall ever, with my consent, stand between the . ercised such power to the extent of granting permission to railway citizen and justice, and hold the power to say whether his rights shall companies chartered by State governments to transport passengers and be adjudicated or not. Let no petty autncrat stand between the citi property "on their way from any one State to another State," to "re zen ·and justice. ceive compensation therefor,'' to ''connect with roads of other States This commission· does not stand in this case entirely between the so as toformcontinuouslines," and has reserved to itselfthe right "to citizen suitor and the court, hut it performs a sort of advisory function. alter, amend, or repeal" the law giving such permission. It will fail, as such commi~ons have failed in all other countries. We Congress has further exercised such power by fixing the length of had better draw some .t:SSOns of wisdom from the experience of other time that live-stock shall be kept in cars without unloading, and the governments in this respect. In Prussia, where legal eontrol of railroad length of time such freight shall stop for rest, feed, and water, by re management has been pushed to further development than in any other quiring railway companies to properly feed and water such stock in country, the commission business has entirely failed. I will read to case the owner shall neglect or refuse to do so, by fixing penalties for the House a speech delivered by the German chancellor, Bismarck, upon . .1884. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE . 195 the result of what was really a railroad commission in Prussia. This was to connect the eastern and western parts of the monarchy by s_tate rail ways. It was during the first reading of the bill that Lasker made hlS memorable speech was delivered in 1876 in the Prussian Parliament. He says: speech of .January 14,1873. He asserted boldly that in matters of con~ssion The imperial constitution attributes to the empire the d~ty of a gene~l su~r the point chiefly considered by the minister of commerce Count Itzenphtz, ~as vision over a.llGerma.n railways, a. certain controlovertar1ffs, &c. An1mper1al not .the interests of the neople and the state, but person~ fav~r or persona~ Ill railway office has been called into existence with the view of ro.rrying out the will; that Dr. Strousbe'rg, e. g., was ah~ays g_ra:nted the des1red concesswn_; provisions of the constitution. · that concessions had been granted to a. h1gh otliClal and to members of promi nent families, who from the outset had no intention of building railways; that Just as we propose to do in this case. these parties had derived profit by trading with the concessions (so-rolled 196 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD- HOUSE. DEOEl\ffiER 11' nse of that power is no evidence that it does not exist. It has lain dor tracks. When this capital is completely amortized in case of any railway track the receipts deriv~dfrom_saidrailway t~ shall n_ot_exceed the sum necessary mant for a. long time. :Railroad officials have apparently reached the to keep the same 1!-1 rep!l'Ir and the cost of 1ts admimstration ; that is, that rail conclusion that with their charters granting them the privilege to op way tr!l-ck wo~d, m th1s case, ~ecome government property and be a.dminis erate railroads t.hey have conveyed to them as a part of the charter the teredJik:e a. h1~hway, from which the government raises sufficient toll to pay for keeping it m r~pa!r and to !Deet the expenses of administration. right, the power, to regulate commerce. In theabsenceofthe exercise e42. At the exp1rat10n of thirty years after the opening of any railway the of that power by Congress-which seems up to this time to have abso state bas ~he right of purchasing it. In case the government and the r.1ilwu.y lutely abdicated and surrendered it to the great associations of wealth ~n co,me to no other voluntary agreement, the company receives twenty-five tunes the average yea_rly ~mount ?f dividends during the last five years. operating the vast railroad system of t!tis country, the roads having e44. Before the e:xptratlOn of thtrty years after the opening of a railway no formed the pool-they fo;med their combinations, and they are regu concession may be granted to a. l?arallel line. lating commerce to suit themselves. This paragraph was rep~aled ~~ 1867 by ar~icle ;U of the constitution of the North German Confederation. Finally the right IS reserved of enacting such We have been told in argument before the committee by the cou.D.sel further laws as experience shall show t<> be necessary. of the railroads, who attempt to confuse this question, that the Govern ment has no power, that the States which granted the charters have all ~e pending measure, it will be.seen, ~ails far short of the stringent the power over the subject. When they come before the State Legis requrrement.s of the Jaws of those countnes. It is unfortunate that a wh?leso~e and wise and uniform system of regulation of commerce had latures they tell them that the States have no power, that all the power I is vested in the General Government; that their roads, though con not been maugurated and perfected as our railroad system pro!rressed structed under State charters, have gone to the boundary lines of States, and developed. In the absence of any such public regulation the mil where they are connected with other roads which run through other road managers have become accustomed to the exercise of unrestrained States, and are, therefore, interstate railroads. So here they are State power, and many of them have seriously thought the power to rern railroads; there they are interstate railroads. They make of them a sort late commerce generally was to be claimed and reckoned as amgng of jointed snake. It is an entire snake so long as the Government d'oes their charter rights, and they naturally feel shocked at any effort to not touch it, but when the hand of the Government is stretched out interpose public control. · and touches them they go to pieces, and then they are State railroads; They -~ust und~rstand that the State or Government, as the case may but when the States go after them, then they reunite and become inter be, establishes a I?ghway not for the ~nrposeofbenefi.ting a corporation, state railroads.- It is almost a game of thimble-rig. [Laughter.] . but to serve the mterests ~n~ convernence of the people, and its enjoy We have been repeatedly told by the distinguished counsel and mil ment must be open to all on JUSt .and equal terms, and the State must road officials. who have appeared before 11he committee that we are at and does have powers to secure these results. tempting something newunderthesun; thatallonrefforts.have prvved The corporation is used as an instrum~nt of State service merely as a I and will prove failures, as they have in all other civilized countries· and convenie~t way of carrying out a_ public object. This is the·great and tha~ the best intellects of all civilized nations have grappled with this sole public good, for the accomplishment of which all other powers are subJect, but they have not thus far succeeded in accomplishing thede given and duties imposed. sired end. The ''desired end'' aimed at here has been in the main This is a :people's ~overfl:illent. They are our soverejgn, and for them a{Jcomplished by legislation in almost every civilized country in the and for the1r protection this Government was ordained and for them it world except this, and we are now struggling to do only part of what must be administered in accordance with the Constitu'tion. To those they have long ago accomplished. . ~ho love t~eir country and who have faith in humanity and who de I find the following interesting statement of the laws of Prussia and siTe that this Government shall be the scene of the progressive happi other Europea~ states regulating railroad traffic . and transportation, ness of the many rather than an arena of combat of the strong against and of the pohcy of those governments, in Dr. Ely's report, before re the weak, where the few only can attain demoralizing and excessive ferred to: wealth and unstable pleasures at the expense of their brothers the path of duty is plain and unmistakable. ' - Between the 21st of August and the 13th of November, 1837 concessions were 1\Ir. WOODWARD. No one, I believe, Mr. Speaker, denies the grante~fo! foursh?.rtrailways, namely, theBerlinandPotsda'm, the Magdeburg and LeipZig, t.J:te Dusseldorf and Elberfeld, and a. part ofthe Rhenish Railway. power of Congress to legislate upon this subject. If there are any who Jn the followmg year, when only one of the above-mentioned railways (the deny the_ necess_ity for such legislation they are sufficiently answered by Berlin and Potsdam, 26.4 kHometers) was finished, the celebrated law of Novem the public sentiment of the country, by the legislation of many of our be_r 3, 1838, was enacted. This law, which is still valid, except in so far as cer tam parts have been rendered of no effect by subsequent legislation formed the greatest. State;:;, and by the nun;tber of. bills introduced into Congress basis of l;l-llla~r Prussian railway laws, and is in many respects a ~odel. upon th1s subJect. These premises berng granted, it seems to me un Its roam pomts are as follows: necessary to take up the time of the House in denunciations of rail ee 1 t~ 5. E;v~ry coinpany having the inten~ion of building a. railway must ap ply to the mm1stry of commerce for a. concession. The application must con tam roads and passionate invectives which throw no light on the question an exact stat~ment of the principal points through which the road is to pass before us. and of the capital stock to be divided into shares. It must be accompanied by~ The duty ofthe Honse is to considersoberlythevariouspropositions plan of the road, stating clearly the manner ln which the road is to be built the materials t-o be used, the wagons, coaches, locomotives to be employed &c: before us and select from them all that which is safe judicious and If no objections on the score of safety, public interest, &c., are found' against most _effi~ie~t to correct the evils of which the country'complains: the plan after it has been carefully exammed, the concession is granted and a Th1s, SIT, IS no easy task. As a rule, those who are loudest in their time is fixed within which it .must be shown that shares have been tak.e~ to the full amotmt of the capital stock, and the shareholders have met and framed the clamors against the railroads are found least able to master it. The statutes of the company. The statutes are not valid unless approved of by the gentleman from Kansas [1\ir. ANDERSON], who addressed the House on government. All those who subscribe for shares are unconditionally respon T!"mrs.day, and permitted ~mself to use language implying suspicion in sible for 40 per cent. of the full amount. If afterward the regular payments for the rem~ining ~per cent. cease, the company has the choice either t-o prose. ~s mmd that the co:m:m~tee had allowed some railroad attorney to .to cute the .subscribers and force them fulfill their obligations or to release d!-ctate the form of t~eiT bill1 undert<>?k to wrestle with this problem them frof!l the same under loss of the 40 per cent. already paid in. No share srngle-handed. At the openmg of this Congress he in~roduced a bill may be given out before the full nominal value for which it reads has been paid. e6. Additional shares may not be emitted without the consent of the govern disposing of the whole subject in two short sections so wonderfully con ment. No loa? may be <;<>ntracted _without the approval of_ the ministry of cise and comprehensive that I will ask the Clerk to read the bill or I - C?nu;nerce, wh1ch has the nght to obl!ge the company to establish a satisfactory will read it myself: · ' sinkmg fund for the payment of cap1tal and interest. e8. The company has the right of expropriating such property as is necessary A bill to prevent unjust discriminations by raikoad companies and subjecting to re?-der the road ~pal?le of fulfilling its functi~ns as a public highway. them t<> the control of the States under certain circumstances; ThiS paragraph xs of nnportance (1) because It establishes the character of Be if ~m;acted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the Unil.ed. States of railways as ~~ntially public and not private undertakings; (2) because it justi Amenca--tn Oo-ngress a-ssembled, That in all cases wherein any railroad or railway fies e:xproprmt10n orily. upon grounds of public welfare. company has received grants of lands of the United States or of the bonds of i! 24. The company is obliged to keeptheroad and all appurtenances in a con the Government of the United States, to aid in the construction of anY: such dition which insures, as far as possible, safety in the transport- of goods and railroad or railway thewholeorany part of which runs into or through an )'State passengers. or Territory of the United States, such railroad or railway shall be subject to and . e25. The COmpany is responsible for all damage to persons and goods unless controlled by the laws" of the State or Territory into or through which such rail· It can prove that the damage was in no wise the fault of the company. The road or railway may run. weig~t of proof, it ~1 be ~bserved, lies with the company. The dangers nec SEC. 2. That all legislation of any State or Territory of the United States and essarily conn~ct~d Wit~ railways do not free the company from this obligation. regula~ions duly auth~rized and ma~e-in pursu. ance of such legislation, shli.U be . ~ 26. The rmlwa;v t-ariff ~ust be made known to the government and pub operative upo_n all ratlroads and nulways running into or through any such liShed. Changes m the tariff are not allowed to bo made without notifying the ~ta~e or Terntory, or such _part of such railroads or railways as are within the gove_rnment and th~ public. In cas~ the change increases the rates, it must be hm1ts of such State or Territory, and any such law or regulation made in pur pubhshed at lea t s1x weeks before It comes into effect. All parties are to be suance thereof, pres~ribing rates of charges by any such railroads or railwaylt treated alike without partiality. for the transportation of passengers, merchandise, or live-stock over any such ~ '1:7. :rhe minister of. commerce has the right to allow a second company to use railroads or railways, shall be effective and operative as to all shipments and any railway track which has been open three -xears. For this use the se('()nd transportation charges, whether such shipments originate and termmate within company must indemnify the first. This provision, which it was thought would the limits of such State or Territory or originate in one State or Territory and effectually protect the pnb~c against railway monopolies, has, for obvious terminate in another; and such legislation or regulations shall extend to all reasons, never proved practical. • · shipments of merchandise and live-stock which directly affect the people of the i! 33. When the profits of any railway exceed 10 per cent. of the car>ita.l in State or Territory where such legislat.ion exists. vested the passenger and goods tariff must be reduced until the annual profits are no longer in excess of lOper cent. 'The firstofthese sections, sir, is entirelyinopemtive, because at law ~ 36 ~ Railways are obliged to carry all postalsendings and to transport postal wao-ons free of charge. now the fact that a railroad has been aided by the bounty of the Gene ~~ t<> 40. All rai~ways mus~ pay a tax in proportion to their receiptB. The ral Government does not withdraw it from the j nrisdiction of tpe States state 1s to use the mcome denved from this tax (1) as indemnification for the through which it passes. The second section proposes to confer upon loss of the government occasioned by the railways-the government had for rnerl.Y a monopoly of the_tra?sportofpassengers in connection with the postal States a jurisdiction which Congress alone can exercise; to extend the sel'Vlce; {2) for the amortiZation of the capital employed in building the railway operation of t.he laws of one State into the territory of other States, an.d - 1884. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-· HOUSE. 197 to subject one line of railroad at the same time to the operation of sched But, Mr. Speaker, the rules of evidence favor the civil suit rather ules adopted by two or more States or Territories and liable to differ in than the _criminal prosecution. In the civil suit the plaintiff can re their rat~ for the same distances and between the same points. I vent cover his damages upon a mere preponderance of evidence. In the crim ure to assert, Mr. Speaker, that if the railroad attorneys were permitted inal prosecution the court will instruct the jury that they must acquit to name their choi~e among all the bills proposed here they would not the defendant unless the evidence of the prosecution excludes every hesitate a moment in giving the palm of preference to the bill of the reasonable doubt of his guilt. From what source and in w.hatmanner gentleman from Kansas. will you produce evidence of so high a grade in the criminal court ifyou The Committee on Commerce spent a great deal of time in listening must rely for discovery under the equity powers of the court to procure to arguments and testimony and discussing among themselvel:> the a much lower grade of evidence in tho civil suit? Sir, if the gentle various propositions referred to them. They could not agree upon an man's argument is good, you must, in order townake this provision ef entire bill, and they reported the pending measure with the under fective, confer chancery powers and the right to enforcediscoveryupon standing that members of the committee should have the privilege of the criminal court aJso. A bill 9f discovery in aid of the grand jury or offering amendments in the House. I am iR favor of all of its pro tacked on as a rider to an indictment I am afraid would be regarded as visions except the one indicated by the gentleman from Connecticut an odious novelty in our criminal practice. [1\Ir. SEYMOUR], and I shall vote for the amendment which he intends REBATES AND DRAWBACKS. to offer. The substitute prohibits rebates altogether. The bill of the com Those parts of the bill which establish a commission and prescribe mittee provides that they shall be given to all persons alike under the its duties, giving it full power to investigate all complaints and to take same circumstances. It has been shown that there are cases in which all necessary action to correct them, to study the subject in the light ot the allowance of 1·ebates constitutes a necessary and beneficial feature experience and report to Congre...~ what further legislation maybe nec of railroad management. It has also been shown that the practice is essary to perfect an intelligent system of railroad control, are in my sometimes abused by allowing discriminations. Shall we stamp out judgment the most valuable. I shall not speak at length upon this the good and the evil together, or shall we endeavor to destroy the feature of the bill, because other gentlemen have already fully explained evil and preserve the good? The only evil lies in the discriminations. it in debate and I concur in what they have said. This evil the bill of the committee attempts to prohibit. If it is prac Those members ofthe committee who fayored the plan of a commis ticable to enforce the provision of the substitute, no one will pretend sion consented to incorporate in the bill certain portions of the '' reme that it is not just as easy to enforce the provision of the bill of the com dial'' legislation proposed in the Reagan bill. I have no confidence, mittee. If enforced, it will remove the only evil complained of in Mr. Speak~r, in the effectiveness of these provisions, but I am willing connection with the allowance of rebate&. to put some of them on the statute-book and give them a trial. I am even willing now to amend section 6 of the committee ·bill so as· to POSTING SCHEDULES. make the private action there authorized one of "equitable jurisdic The substitute of the gentleman from Texas provides for posting tion and discovery," giving to the court in every such case the power rates .five (lays before they go illto effect. I agree with everything said specified in section 7 of the Reagan bill, to compel discovery and the by the gentleman from Michigan [Mr. HORR] and others who have production of boOks and papers; and perhaps to carry out the inten opposed this provision, and will add by way of supplement to their tion of the committee itself this ought to be done. In the courts of remarks some observations upon its relation to other provisions of the some of the States that may be unnecessary by reason of the codes, bill and substitute. Under the first sections of both all rates must be which abolish wholly or partly the distinctions between courts of law reasonable. It would seem to follow that the rates posted must be and equity; but in other States where the old distinctions remain in reasonable. I venture to say, M]:.Speaker, that it is within the knowl torce the provision might fail through mere defect of form. edge of every member of this House that the conditions which must With this exception the "remedial legislation" in the committee determine the reasonableness of a charge frequently change in the bill is all that can safely be adopted at· this time. It declares· that all course of a single day. A railroad company may post its rates as Ie charges must be reasonable for the service rendered. It makes it un quired by the substitute bill, and then go on under its old schedule lawful to discriminate between persons in the matter of rates and fur until five days have passed. On the morning of the sixth day a change nishing facilities for business. It makes it unlawful to allow rebates in f1·eights by lake, river, or other roads or other circumstances may or drawbacks to one person which are not allowed under :similar cir make it necessary for that road to reduce its rates below the post.eu cumstances to all other persons. It gives to a party injured a right of schedule or go out of business tor five days until it can post a new action for his damages and an extra allowance for costs where the act schedule. This substitute forbids it to lower the rate. It is impos complained of is willful. And it provides for a criminal prosecution, sible for any railroad company to determine with certainty so far ahead to be conducted by the district attorneys of the United States, and for what will be reasonable charges on all classes of goods. a penalty, upon conviction, of not more than $1,000. · Again, sir, under ordinary circumstances it is the legal duty of a. With these general remarks, Mr. Speaker, I pass to the considera common carrier to receive and transport goods offered fur that purpose. tion of the ili:fferences between the bill and substitute, those portions Freight may be offered on a day when the carrier has concluded that of the original Reagan bill which a majority of the committee declined his posted schedule contains unreasonable rates. He can not change to report favorably. them for five days. The freighter insists upon his obligation as a car PENALTIES. rier. If he carries at all under this substitute; he must charge the rate The .first-difference between the bill and substitute to which the gen in his posted schedule or subject himself to civil damages.and criminal tleman from Texas calls attention is the provision of the committee bill prosecution. If be refuses the freight, he is liable to another action tor which exempts unreasonable charges from penalty. I agree with the damages for violation of his co-mmon-law duty as a carrier, unless this gentlemen who argue that an error of judgment should not be treated statute absolves him from it, and no one, I think, will pretend ihat it aa a crime. But, sir~ I have another objection to it. It is impracticable. does. The question whether a charge is reasonable or not opens a range of If I have read the substitute arigM, sir, this wQ.Uld be among the investigation which is practically unlimited. The length ofthe whole most serious consaquences of its passage and enforcement. But pos road; the length of the haul; the cost of the entire mad and its sev sibly the gentleman from Texas [Mr. REAGAN] is correct in the state eral sections; the· indebtedness of the road and urgency of payment; ment of its purpose and effect. I will a.sk·the Clerk to read what the operating expenses; the value and quality of the goods r.arried; the gentleman said on this subject in his opening speech. · · state of the weather; the amountoftherisk; the income of the road in The Clerk read as follows: · former years or months and in thecurrentyea.ror month; the prospects The committee's bill contains no provision requiring a railroad company to . post up schedules of its rates of charges, while section 5 of the substit•tte bill of fUture business; the valueofthe service; competition ortheabsence does require such schedules to be posted up. And this is essential to secure of competition; the amount and value of the article carried in the given fairness and equality in rates between shippers ·aud as a means of evidence in instance compared with the whole amount and value of the same article determining whether discriminations have been made, and whether more than regular or schedule prices have been charged. If you leave that provision out ordinarily carried or produced, and with the whole amount and value and come to a trial m each case you will have to prove what reasonable rates of the t~nnage; a comparison with the rates charged for the same service are. If you put the provision in requiring them to post up their schedules of by other roads and water routes-all of these facts and circumstances, rates the law will presume they constitute reasonable rates, and the production of t-he schedules at a trifling expense would directly show the jury the amount with many others, must be brought into view and fully considered in of charges which tlie road had fixed, Rnd it would then be for tile court and order to determine fairly whether a given charge is reasonable or not. jury to determine whether the schedule bad been disregarded or not in the case Thiuk for a moment, Mr. Speaker, of the consequences of bringing under consi 198 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. DEOEMBER 11, quiry is then to be made. Your courts, Mr. Speaker, will not be crowded that I should hesitate IQyself some t:im.e before I committed myself ~bsolutely to the provision of the Reagan bill which prohibits more for a shorrhaul than with suitors when they find themselves invited in the outset to traverse for a long haul under all possible circumstances. There is a very serious ques and combat a presumption of law. tion there that certainly is deserving the best examination of the committee. I The rates in lhe schedule may be more for a short than for a long say this because I thought to some extent differently yesterday. It is probably haul. In fact they may be pool rates, and itis worth while to inquire the most doubtful quest.ion there is involved in the bill. . whether the enforcement of this provision will not compel competing Mr. .WOODWARD. What is said in this statement in relation to roads to pool. If each road acts for itself the immense advantage to the effect of the ninetieth section of the rail way clauses consolidation act the road posting . the latest schedule will immediately bring on such is not strictly pertinent, because both the rates there mentioned were disaatrous railroad wa~that the roads will be compelled to post their within the maximum allowed by law. But the opinion of the house schedules at the same time and with the same rates, as well as to change of lords and the opinion of Mr. Chittenden on the questions of poUcy them at the same time. I would like any gentleman who favors the and practicability are certainly worthy of attention. substitute to explain what more the ''pool'' does or pretends to do. Now, Mr. Speaker, what were the facts and arguments which changed RULE OF DAMAGES. Mr. Chittenden's view overnight, and which have influenced the views of a majority of your committee? Winona is distant from any landing I am opposed to allowance of triple damages as proposed bythesub on the Mississippi River and has no railroad connection save the one stitute. 'l'riple damages are vindictive and punitory. They cannot be mentioned. Steamboat and barge lines running on the river from understood in any other way. The substitute provides that the same Memphis carry cotton to New Orleans for $1 or less per bale. 'Dbe act may be punished criminally by a fine of not less than $1, 000-it railroad, then, must carry the cotton to the same destination for $1 per may be a million. We can not justifY to reason or conscience such an bale or abandon the business entirely. The current expenses of the accumulation of penalties upon the same person for the same act. road, the wear and tear of its cars and track, will be substantially the Pooling and charging more for a short than for a longer haul are both same whether its trains return empty to New Orleans or go back laden methods of railroad management which are capable of abuse, but it with cotton. The rate of $1 per bale may not pay if we ta"!ce into ac _does not follow that they are always abused, and I prefer to leave those count interest npon the cost of the road, but, sir, if it pays Qperating subjects for the consideration of the commission to be appointed under expenses, or even a considerable portion of them, the road can not afford the bill. to lose it, and the people of Winona can not afford i1> have the road lose POOLING. it, because any diminution of its net income will probably result in au The ostensible purpose of the pool is to prevent railroad wars and increase of rates from that place. discriminations. ·It is only attempted between roads with substan But t];le gentleman from Texas insists that no harm can result from tially the same termini. It is wrong and injurious for one road to dis his·bill because the road is permitted to charge as much for the long criminate between its own customers; but it is quite as injurious to the as for the short haul. Then, Mr. Speaker, the best that the company country to have one road charging less or more to its customers in can do is to equalize the two rates. I venture to assert, sir, that in Chicago or New York than is charged by a competing road .between the nine cases ont of ten this will result in an increase of the through rate. same points. The effect upon trade is precisely" the same whether the Very many railroads in this country, especially in the South and West, discrimination is made between the customers of tha same road or the enjoy large debts and have a very limited income. This road from customers of half a dozen roads. Let the commission examine this Memphis to New Orleans, I believe, is one of that class. Stockholders subject and report what legislation is practicable to do away with the may ~jford to wait indefinitely for dividends; bnt the road must derive evils of po_?ling. sufficient income from the business on its line to pay operating expenses, LONG AND SHORT HAUL. repairs, and intereston its debt. It must do this, sir, orfall into bank· The provision prohibiting a greater charge for the short than for the ruptcy. Its business on the present basis produces, perhaps, that longer haul has been charaderized by the gentleman from Indiana [Mr. amount of income. · SHIVELY] as an effort to make the benefits of competition universal; Then, sir, an equalization of the rates, in order to produce the same in other words, to give to South Bend all the commercial advantages of income, must result in decre:wing the rate at Winona and raising it at Chicago. This alone would be sufficient to determine my vote upan it. Memphis. To illustrate: Assume that its shipments from Memphis '.I;he powers of Congress are great, bnt they do not extend to a repeal amount to 5,000 bales at$1 per bale; from Winona 1,000 balesat$3.25. of the laws of nature and of trade. Any.attempt to do that, sir, can Then it receives from its cotton business at these two points $8,250, and ' only lead to mischief. Yut, sir, I am opposed to it because it is wrong it must continue to receive that amount from that business or make in principle and must inevitably prove injurious to the interests of my good the deficiency by charging more at other sta~ions or on other classes section. As a basis for what I shall say on this subject I recur to the of freight. If it redu~ the Winona rate to $1 it falls short of the illustration first brought to the notice of onr committee by the gentle- necessary income. If it raises the Memphis rates to $3.25 it not only man from l\fississippi [:Mr. BARKSDALE]. . loses the Memphis business but inflicts enormous damage on the..public This is the case: A railroad runs from New Orleans through Winona, at large. The very best it can do is to fix the rate at both places at Miss., to Memphis. The.distance from New Orleans to Winona is two $1.37!, which, if it can Tetain the Memphis business, will yield the hundred and seventy-five miles, to Memphis four hundred miles. This same income which it now receives. road charges for carryiB.g a bale of cotton from Winona to New Orleans But, sir, the provision of this substitute almost literally places the $3.25; from Memphis to New Orleans, one hundred and twenty-five railroad '' between the devil and the deep sea.'' An increase of 1 cent miles longer haul, $1. The first impression of almost every man will in the rate from Memphis deprives . them of the business there. Kn probably be that this is an outrageous discrimination ~aainst Winona, increase of 3 shillings not only throws the business to the .barge lines, whichoughtnotto bepossibleunderanystate ofthelawwbatever. But but enables those lines to advance their rates to $1.30 or even $1.35. examination of all the con,ditions of the problem will rarely fail to This will incite and authorize railroads carrying cotton north and change this view. In this way the view of a majority of the Commerce ea&t from Memphis to increase their rates also, and this increase in. Committee was changeQ.; and I take the liberty of calling attention to rates of transportation will be paid by the producers. The practical ef another conversion which took place in the committee-room on this fect of this provision of the substitute, Mr. Speaker, will be to levy a subject. fine of from 1 to 3 shillings per bale upon every produoer whose cotton Hon. L. E. Chittenden, of New York, an able lawyer and business is marketed at Memphis, and for no better reason than the simple geo man of large experience, came before the committee to advocate the graphical fact that the town of Winona is situated at a distance from adoption of the original Reagan bill, which is the substitute now of the l'tfississippi River. fered. His attention was called to this Memphis and Winona case, The same thing will occur, Mr. Speaker, at Chicago, but on a vastly and he was asked to give his views upon it. After hearing all the cir greater scale. The great staples of the Upper MibSissippi Valley, Wis cumstances, he declined to give an opinion and said he would look into consin, Minnesota, Dakota, the northern portions of Illinois, Iowa, itfurther. On the next day he appeare.d before the committee volun and Nebraska, must pass Chicago on their way to the seaboard. There tarily and made a statement which I will ask the Clerk to read. they meet the competition between lake and rail. The railroads are· The Clerk read as follows: compelled by the competition of the water routes to carry these Mr. CHITTENDEN. Mr. Chairman, I do not want to take ·up a moment's time staples to the seaboard at very low rates-rates which benefit immeas of the committee. I have been giving the time since yesterday to the problem nrablynot only the millions of producers in the Northwest but the mill that was presented in the Memphis and Winona case, and that had led me to ions of consumers in the East. The roads have their option-they can an examination of the decisions under the ninetieth section of the railway clauses act in England to which I had reference yesterday, and I find that that carry at these low rates, or send their trains back empty toNew York. problem has given to the house of lords in England the same trouble that it Like the road at Memphis, they prefer to get what they ca,n out of the certainlygivesme. It maynotgivethecommitteeany. In one ease that I have business to pay or help to pay their current expenses. If they in found whick went up from Scotland to the house of lords, the house of lords were divided upon the question whether under this ninetieth section" such a crease the through rates, as they must in any attempt to equal ~ ze the similar discrimination as that mentioned here was authorized. In that case the through with the local rates, they lose the business; the water routes road led from Derby to London. Its maximum rates, as all the rates in Eng- and Canadian railroads ad vance their charges, and the increase of freight ~~~i:J:~~rT~;d~:r~d~~~}i\TI\~gs1~r=d;j:~~~!<'~ b~r'h;~~~do~h~gt~b= is paid by the producer. Upon all the producers of that vast region passenger traffic from Hampton to .London the proportion would be only 2 tributary to Chicago you levy a fine for every bushel of grain, barrel shillings, and yet bY a divided court the hcmse of lords held that that was not of flour, and pound of meat raised in a vain attempt tf> extend the b,&ne contrary to the ninetieth section of the act which I read yesterday, and they ·held further that it was certainly doubtful whether it was practical to tak~ away :fits of competition to places where competition does not in fact exist that power of discrimination from the railway companies. AU I have t-o say is an attempt whose only result can be to hamper and restrict competi- 1884. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. ·199 tion at those places where nature and the enterprise of man have estab- business. In favor of rebates, the erudite and learned gentleman from lisbed its necessary conditions. Massachusetts [Mr. LONG] has attempted to harrow up the feelings of Mr. Speaker, if I were well convinced of the soundness of the prin- the great American Congress fqr an unfortunate owner of staves who is· ciple attempted to be expressed in thissectionofthesubstitute, I should hobbling around creation on rebate-crutches looking for a market for hesitate long before voting to inflict its inevitable consequences upon his wares. Suppose this unfortunate and nomadic individual knew in the people whom I represent. Let the commission also examine into advance that in no case could be get a rebate, would be not entirely this subject and recommend to Congress such legislation as will·tend stave off the evil day by either staying at home and saving his staves. to prevent abuses, and leave to the road~ and to the peol>le theiT nat- or send them to market when he knew there was no risk? What is ural right to the uses and advantages of competition. the history of rebates? Have they not been used by a powerful com- The great difference between the substitute and the bill of the com- pany to crush its rivals and by great enterprises to ruin struggling. mittee is fonnd in the faet that the bill assumes that l:! complete code competitors? Perfect equality should be the law. As to schedules of" of railroad regulations can :not be framed by anyone Congress, and lays rates, I cannot see any·possible injury.to the-companies from that. Ii the foundation for the building of such a code in the light of practical trouble is found in carrying out this provision legislation can supply a. experience and calm reflection. The substitute assumes that all the remedy. Against proposed regulations of any kind captions objections conditions of the problem are completely within our grasp, and pro- will always be raised. You could stay here until the day of doom and poses forthwith to lay the mailed band of political power upon the make propositions to regulate the railroads, and every one would be most complicated and sensitive business adjustments of modern times. met by some objection. They want unlimited freedom; the people I believe the results of such action where not ineffective will be disas- reasonable restriction. • ~us to the interests ofthe country, and Ithereforesupportthe bill of Nothing seems to me so unfair as the allowance in favor of the long the committee. Festina lente should be our motto in a matter so deli- haul as against the shorter one. cate and important. We should proceed with caution and delibera- The fertile and oriental imagination of the gentleman from Massa tion, groping outward toward the limits both of jurisdiction and expe- cbusetts [Mr. LONG] illustrates his position by supposing the case of a diency. Irr this way only can we secure to the country a wise, safe, railroad to Jericho on the hilltop without competition, to Jerusalem be- and beneficent system of railroad control. • yond with competition. He says the difficult grade of the hill makes- · ~ · Mr. McADOO. I am not ofth<>se to whom a railroad company, be- Jericho pay for Jerusalem. The physical altitude of Jericho inures to cause it is a railroad ·company, is always and everywhere an object of the :financial elevation of Jerusalem. The malarious vapors of Jeru attack. There are gentlemen to whom the interesting, useful, and civ- salem are made bearable owing to the heavy toll on the tonic air oi. ilizing locomotive is "a monster of such bideoU$ mien that to be bated Jericho. To the wayfaring man who now as in Scripture falL~ among needs but to be seen" in connection with some proposed legislation. tb,e rebate and pool thieves on his way to Jericho our benevolent friend There are other gentlemen who, applauding the victories of this mighty from Massachusetts would give his sympathy, and our learned and able monster, would abdicate all governmental functions in its favor. Be- friend from Maryland [Mr. FINDLAY] would in his own language say:.. tween these contending hosts there must be a golden mean. In the utter hopelessness of the case we mutt~r between our teeth "God help I have long observed that in discussing railroad legislation in the State them," or, with a. deeper charity and a more genuine submission to His will ,. Legislature or in Congress the advocates and opponents rapidly array put our hands in our pockets and do what we can. themselves into two classes, the one drawing strong pictures of railroad But neither would send an officer of the law after the robbers. Prac benefits and asking liberal legislation or non-interference, _and the other tically speaking, the ~&tration of the gentleman from MaEsa(bm:etts. calling for restriction to protect the welfare and liberties of the people is not a good one in this country; not even, I think, in mundane J ern against railroad injustice and aggression. The one cries out, "You salem. Railroads are operated to make money. In makingitletthem would have no country without railroads;" the other, "Restrict the not rob Peter to pay Paul. railroads or you will soon have a country without liberty." Let it be Let us take an occidental illustration: Here is Chicago (not the olll ours to so legislate as to have a free country and great railroads, each and certainly not the new Jerusalem), with many competing lines. aiding and harmonizing with the other. I am opposed to alllegisla- Here is Paradise, Pa., on the most natural and easy route between New tion savoring of paternal government. Government is an umpire, to York and Chicago. Only one line of railroad passes through it.. It i,s. see fair play between the contending rivals in the game of life. only two hundred miles from New York, and yet passage or fi:eight. But in regulating railroads the Government is dealing with its own under existing circumstances is liable to be greater to Paradise than creations. The railroad company is a public concern-a governmental Chicago. Of course I know Chicago and another similar place axe both agent as it were-a public carrier upon a public highway. reached by down grade and easier of access than Paradise, but on what In dealing with railroad companies there are legislators whose liber- idea of justice should Paradise, Pa., pay up for Chicago, Ill.? This aJity makes them dangerous guides to follow. For the results of being system is very unjust to the Eastern farmer. With higher taxes, dearer too liberal and enthusiastic in legislating for railroads we need not ac- land; and higher cost of production, all paid on account of proximity to company the amiable, interesting, eloquent, and distinguished gentle- the seaboard, be can not compete with those thousands of miles inland. man from Massachusetts [Mr. LONG] to the Palestine of cooing winds It is unjust to theWestern and Southern merchant, because his Eastern and waving palms, but we can linger to learn-in the no less heavenly, rival, without breakage in transit, meets him in the inland towns with if less beautiful, precincts of Jersey City, N. J. To build up her rail- ·positive advantage. road system New Jersey gave exemptions from local taxation to the com- The gentleman from Pennsy1 vania. [Mr. HOPKINS] has very ably panies. To-day the metropolitan city of the State has over $40,000,000 shown the constitutionality of this bill. As its distinguished author of property within her borders that does not share equally in the local says, it is the commerce and not the railroads he aims to regulate. All burdens while benefiting fully from municipal government. These ex- admit the power to regulate the measure if regulation is alone in dis eruptions have been held by tlie United States Supreme Court to be in pute. The substitute, by putting everything in the courts, prevents the nature of irrepealable contracts. The enactors of these statutes may any unconstitutional interference being exercised. have meant well, and when the giant genius of Webster procured the RaP,road commissions work well in many of the States. There they decision of this supreme tribunal in the Dartmouth College case be little are invaluable in settling questions of taxation between the railroads thought he was but rearingamonumenttohislegalfamewhoseshadow and thepeople. · SucbisthecaseinmyownState. Butthecommission would fall like blight on the citie.'l of his country. On the college ease proposed by the bill of the committee seems to me a. useless institution. bas been based these decisions in favor of the irrepealability of such I should think the railroad managers would favor the commission. contracts. Very imposing but entirely impotent, it would be a harmless safety- In the light of experience I am opposed to railroad discrimination, valve for popular and individual discontent, without benefiting or but rebate, pooling, and to centralizing, expensive, imposing, but worth- ing any one concerned. Their finding would be less potent than the less commissions, and so in favor of the substitute bill of the distin- editorial condemnation of a leading journal. Looking imposing from guished statesman from Texas, Judge REAGAN. Let us look at some the respectability of his office and income and the princely freedom of of the evils this bill attempts to remedy. his travel, a railroad commissioner under the committee bill could walk At pooling, for instance. For many years the statute-books of the adown the sunny years of his official life amid the serried ranks of smil~ various States have been laden with ~enal statutes forbidding the com- ing railroad directors and all-attentive train conductors, tremendous bination of laborers and artisans to' strike" for higher wages. ..It was in his processes and infinitesimal in his results-the stall-fed ox of the said to be a conspiracy against trade and commerce for them to so com national farm, unable to plow and not merchantable in the shambles. bihe. But, while the printers or the brakemen could be cast into jail The complainant . before the commission waits and watches like for combining to say how much shall constitute pay for a day's work, another Jarndyce, and finally possessed of their impotent :finding is Messrs. Gould and Vanderbilt and Huntington can form a pool and say compelled to go into court on his own responsibility and at his own ex bow much it shall cost the printer or brakeman to transport his barrel pense,. for the committee bill gives him no counsel and less encourage of flour or pork from Chicago. What wonder that such inequalities in ment. The district attorney is not paid nor compelled to succor him. legislation awaken popular discontent? What 'healthy competition Even if the commission was powerful, I would still think an honest court does pooling admit of? Make pooling illegal, and an honest standard and jury preferable. What influences might not control the appoint and fixed schedule will be the result. The people and the companies ment and action of the commissioners. Tbe safety of our institutions · will both benefit. and rights demands an honest and fearless judiciary, and if we can not A system of rebates encourages unjust discrimination and fraud. depend upon our courts, then indeed is our condition a bad one. In Under it one man's success is built up on the ruins of another man's view of the colossal wealth and great power of these companies any 200 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. DECEMBER 11, three men, however pure and good, holding in their power 125,000 miles Mr. O'NEILL, of Pennsy1 vania. I do not know that it is necessary, of railroad and dealing with a commerce of not less than $10,000,000,000 but I wish to say that at some stage of the proceedings, if I can get the annually, might indeed fervently exclaim, "Lead us not into tempta floor, I desire to make the motion to recommit the bill so that it may be tion." Besides all this, the dangers which might occur in their ap- Jmproved. pointment are too patent· to be discussed. _ The SPEAKER. That motion will be in order. A.s I said in opening, I have no desire to make indiscriminate war Mr. O'NEILL, of Pennsylvania. I wish to r~commit the bill so that fare on railroads, and am only concerned that the welfare of the people it can go back to the committee and be brought again into the House shall bea.smuch consideredastheprosperityofthesecompanies. !agree improved in many provisions. _ , with much that has. been said as to how far they have advanced the The SPEAKER. The gentleman can not be deprived of his right to material growth of the country but this great country and this free recommit the bill. Government must not become . totally~ubservient to their power. Our · Mr. PETERS. I rise to make a parliamentary inquiry. free Constitution banishes the feudal lords; let us see to it that they The SPEAKER. The gentleman will state it. are not replaced by railroad monarchs who can control the election and Mr. PETERS. I wish to ask whether, after the previous question is selection of the representatives of the peop~e and direct their actions to ordered, any amendments could be offered to the bill other than those suit the interests of these great corporations. I applaud their aote is taken between the two. legitimate business. But of course there can 1>e an understanding on the p:ut of the House It is contended that there is a difference of mind as to what is wrong · • that a test vote shall be taken between the two opposing propositions, or abusive in railroad practice and management. There is in Bll human and that the one sustained by the vote of the House shall be considered conduct. The action of the law-making power, consistent with the under the five-minute rule. organic law of the country, is decisive of that question. It is fair to Mr. REAGAN. It was from IDY- knowledge that such was the prac say that no legislative power in this country would declare certain con tice of the House I have ventured fo make the suggestion. duct in business a crime without just cause or reason for it. ·- • r:. 1884. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. 201 • I would only support a bill up to a law that would remedy abuses in to the given point when the regular schedule rate is 50 cents, clearly railroad management. I ·would encourage all their legitimate traffic. he derives 25 cents from the wheat-raiser, the laborer, and the flour:. Which measure is the better, the committee bill or the Reagan substi- maker. It enables him to reap large gains from the laborer and pro-' tute? The main difference in them is, the committee bill provides for ducer in other useful industries for which he gives no equivalent, and a commission w bile the substitute does not, and the. substitute pro- it is an injustice that can not be defended. It enables him to continue hibits a greater charge :per mile for a short haul than for a long one. I a prosperous business, while other shippers feeding him all the while submit these are substantial differences, and I must favor the substi- are not able to do so well, thereby injuringthe growth of competitive tute for the committee bill. . industry. There has been a good deal of declamation about the great benefits In this instance the railroad compaRy and the preferred shipper are of a commission. They are mostly imaginary. Suppose a commis- doing a wrong to the producer and to the public by enabling the shi p:per sion is established under the commi~tee bill. It is to sit in Washing- to obtain money that he has no right to get. It is money obt-ained by ton or adjourn to other parts when it deems it necessary. Very well. a false pretense to all concerned that he pays the schedule rate, when Whn.t is the practice ? The shipper is to complain to the commissioners in truth he does not; but through this secret arrangement he unjustly in writing. He lives in my district, nine hundred miles away, and he obtains the money of oth.ers without rendering unto them any equiva must send ;his complaint toWashington; or if he lives in the South or far lent. I do not hesitate to say that this conduct ought to be called a West he must send his complaint to Washington. Then what? The crime, and that a just penal~ should be fixed for it. I know it is commissioners investigate. How? Gowheretheshipper lives and does claimed that railroad property is individual and private property and his business, and take testimony? Or require him to employ an attor- that the owner has a right to use it in a way that best suits him; but ney and send his deposition, and possibly hire an attorney in Wash- that claim is no longer well founded, for the courts have declared rail ington to argue the merits of his case before the commission? After roads public ways so far as commerce and transportation are concerned, hearing his side then they are to send for the p.ilroad company, per- and their management in this respect is not only individual but for the haps doing business in Kansas, for such information as it has on the best interest and safety of the public. snhject. . It is asserted here that rebates are proper and that railroad companies .After this is done then the commission may send a copy of its de- have a right to make them. Why, this is the same thing as the secret cision to the United States distl'ict attorney of the State and one to the .agreement in effect. The understanding in such cases is that the ship railroad company. Then the United States district attorney is to ask per shall pay the schedule rate, and upon production of his receipt for an injunction to stop the injustice. Here is litigation begun after paymentofitatthemainorspecialofficeheshallhave acertainamount waiting for the report of the commissioners. This is elastic. It is an refunded. Why is this done? To deceive other shippers? To deceive india-rubber performance to stretch out the case in hand until the in- the public? It is the sam~ false pretense and favoritism. Transporta jured party falls from pure exhaustion. After the district attorney tion charges over public ways is the same thing as a tax on all articles gets the matter before the United States court then real delay begins. transported. Why tax one man more than another engaged in the same Then time is asked for a hearing, trial, and argument; then an appeal business? It would be no worse for the taxing power in any State to to the Supreme Court of the United States, where errors are reviewed tax. one man more than it taxes another, or that the tax-collector should all through the case, and possibly the case will be reversed. A great collect the fixed rate of tax on a certain individual's property and after remedy that. ward refund to him halfofit on theground thathewasabigta.x-payer Then see how impracticable the work ofthis commission. Ifitisto and influential citizen. The act is so unfair and unequal as to become hear and investigate all grievances of every shipper complaining in the unconscionable, and I would make it a crime and declare a penalty. United States, as well as decide the protracted contests over pooling There are instances of freight carriage that appeal strongly for re operations, then the work and the field is too large for it altogether, and bates, and in such cases the law ought to permit the facts to come out it could not. begin to examine the oomplaints made. A commission fully before the court or jury hearing the case, and if it is found to be would be a farce. It is what the wrongdoing railroad companies sug- fair Jlnd reasonable it should be a good defense under the law. I would gest and want this House to pass. Why declare certain acts and prac- like to see section 8 of the substitute amended so as. to allow the facts tices of railroad companies wrong and a crime and then leave it out to to come out, and let the court or jury determine whether they consti a commission to investigate? Oh, what a farce! Make certain eonduct tute a defense to the case or not. a crime, then deal gently and name a commission to handle it carefully. I come now to the other question of pooling. Yes; by all means have a commission, to let the criminals have a chance Pooling contracts between divers competing lines of railroads are made before it, and then another chance before a court when the district attor- ·to cut off all competition in the hauling of freight. It does not bene ney files his complaint. fit the :people or the patrons of the roads; .it does benefit the railroad I see no reason for allowing these corporations more leniency after companies, because the pooling contract establishes· and maintains cer the commission of crimes than the humblest citizen after he is indicted tain charges wholly fixed by the parties to the pooling contract. It and brought before the court to answer at once. Declare certain acts is wholly one-sided in its execution and effect. Shippers and other wrong, unlawful, a crime, and then appoint a commission to investi- patrons ofthe roads are notconsultedatall; theirinterestisnotconsid gate ~ Is that your tender policy? If so, it is a gross discrimination ered in these contracts. The producer has no voice in making the pool ~crainst the balance of mankind, who must answer directly to the proper ing contract. It does prevent honest competition in freight hauling. authority for their crimes and misdemeanors. I say if we declare cer- I know it is claimed that competing lines can not survive without pooling tain conduct of rail.\'oad companies a· crime, then deal with it as a crime contra-cts, that is, the stronges_t line will destroy the others, but that directly, as provided in the substitute. Why leave it to a commission the pooling contract protects all the lines. to investigate? It would mean nothing in the end. I think it does protect all the lines.from reasonable com:petition, but This brings me to the question ofunjustdisc1·iminations. It is well I deny that competition would destroy any rival line of railroad.. It known that certain railroad corporations enter into secret agreements would have the effect to reduce freights to reasonable rates, and it can with certain shippers, wherein they pay less rates on through or local not be presumed that any competing line of railroad would mark down freight than is paid by other shippers, and this is true whether there freight charges below the reasonable limit to destroy adversary lines, as are competing lines of railroad or not. The effect of t'his preference is no profit could result from such methods to any line of road. I see no to build up one shipper at the expense -of others, and thus affecting all reason why the people, the shipper, and other patrons of railroads should the people-the producer, laborer, and shipper. It is safe to say that be deprived of the benefits of honorable competition in railroad freights the preferred shipper does not pay less than reasonable rates; but if he by pooling and combinations. One of the blessings of every trade is did, then the company could not continue business unless it charged competition. Anything done to prevent competition establishes roo more than a reasonable rate to other shippers in order to make good nopoly, and with it comes the cast-iron grip upon the earnings of honest the loss. industry. Pooling is a combination of railroad corporations to equally If this be done, then an unjust favoritism is graJ;tted, by which he get the most from thefarmer, the mechanic, the laborer. It is anagree- . r&'lps large gains not only at the expense of other shippers who pay ment not to injure the chancesof one another to get unjust money from his freight charges in the payment of their own unequal charges, but all .other people. also at the expense of the laborer and producer from whom the pre- Why talk here persuasively and softly of this wrong? Are you afraid ferred shipper buys, whether it be the product of the farm, the fac- these railroad companies will take revenge upon you for combating tory, mill, or the shop, for the price of all such products is fixed in part their wrongs upon the public? Are you afraid of these corporations? by the cost of shipment to a given point. Transportation charges are They are in the hands of the people of this country, and their wrongs always considered in establishing the prices of commodities. Then we ought to be remedied by law just the same as other wrongs are reme have the preferred shipper buying flour at $5.50 per barrel, the market died. Talk to me about turning on light to wipe out rascality and price at the place of production, and shipping _it to another point, the wrong! "'ny, since the Christian era light has been turned on every freight rate on which is 50 cents, re~ular schedule rate. This makes phase of wrong known to human annals, and is it wiped out by the the barrel of flour worth $6 per barrel at place of delivery. extra light? Not at all. - You may turn light on murder, rapine, and. Now the farmer must pay labor and raise wheat at a ·price fixed arson until the whole world knows how it is done, and they will not after considering the cost of flour :per barrel and cost of shipment to the abate one jot or tittle. What does the evil spirit care for the light pf given point. These fix the price of his bushel of wheat, and the price exposure? That is no punishment and no preventive at all. Positive of his wheat fixes the price he pays for labor. - Now if the preferred 1 law, with penalties, is the only remedy. shipper only pays 25 cents per barrel by a secret contract for shipment 1 It is urged in this discussion that it is right to charge more for a· 202 · CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. DECEMBER 11, short haul of freight on same line of road than for along haul Well, NEW YORK CANALS. that is elasticity indeed. Pending the question on the motion to adjourn, Is it right, is it fair, is it honest to charge the same a.ruount for haul Mr. HISCOCK, by unanimous consent, "introduced a joint resolution ing fre1ght fifty miles as for three hundred miles ? The haul of fifty (H. Res. 298) to _appoint a. committee to investigate the capacity of the miles is only one.sixth of the oost of steam, wear and tear, and time for canals of the State of New Y~rk, and for other purposes; which was the 300 miles. Why do they do this? Oh, they say there is river or read a. first and second time, referred to the Committee on Commerce, lake competition in the long haul and none in the short haul. Ah! is . and ordered to be printed. that it? Then where there is competition they must come down to Mr. HISCOCK. I ask that the joint resolution be printed in the what? Destructive rates? Not at all. What then? Down to what RECORD. the carriage of goods or produce can be done for. They say that is a There was no objection. The joint resolution is as follows: loss to them. Who knows? Where is the proof ? I want no bald Be it re3e£ved, &c., That a joint committee of eight mcm hers of the next Con· assertions. · gress be appointed, to consist of five Representatives, to be appointed by the It is known thatrailroads baved~troyedgood river traffic and canal Speaker of this House, and three Senators, ·to be appointed by the President of the Senate. - traffic. What destroyed the Wabash and Erie Canal? The railroads. Said committee shall confer with a committee of like power appointed·by the Here the water traffic could not be done as cheaply as it could be done Legislature of the State of New York and with the Governor and other State on the railroads. Greater speed and _convenience of handling freight is officers of said State, in regard to the maintenance of the canals thereof, and ascertain if said canals are sufficient for the requirements of interstate com on the side of the railroads. Take the statement as true that long merce or if they should be enlarged, and the cost of such enlargement. hauls must be made at less figures than short ones, still is it right? And said committee shall ascertain upon what terms and condition.- the If competition makes the long haul unprofitable, wqich is never true, United Stat~s can acquire the title to and jru·isdiction of said canals, or of any of them. . is it right to double .up the rate on the short haul where there is no Said committee is authorized to appoint one of its members chairman, aad competition? Is it right to overload the people and shippers of inter may hold its meetings at such _times and places as it may appoint in the State of mediate-points on the road with high charges to make up the loss on New York or the city of Washington, and to take testimony, and employ a clerk, who shall be a stenographer. The expenses of said committee shall be paid from long hauls of which other people and other shippers get the benefit? _ the contingent funds of t·he two Houses of Congress, to be disbursed therefrom Is that the beneficent system of railroading? Carry out the parallel, upon the order of the chairman of the committee and of two other members, one and, if neces...~ry, the long haul must be made for nominal rates; but of whom shall be a Representative and the other a Senator; and said commit we will make the people in the back towns smart for it. They have tee shall report in writing to the next Congress. no competing roads, and we will just make them sweat under the ADDITIONAL COl\£MITTEE CLERK. doubled-up rates in order that we may make big profits in railroading, Mr. WARNER, of Ohio, ~ unanimous consent, submitted a resolu though we will haul through freight for nominal rates. Do you call tion authorizing the Select Committee on the Payment of Pensions, this syste_m beneficent? Do you call it right? I do not. It is a wrong Bounty, a.nd Back Pay to employ an additional clerk; which was re that the people will not much longer endure. ferred to the Committee on Accounts. It is contended that every time a railroail runs through a hill, over, FEES OF PENSION CLAil\I AGENTS. a mountain, or across a stream, that the local shippers must pay rates in proportion to the extra cost of the road by reason of these contingen Mr. WARNER, of Ohio. I also submit a resolution directing the cies, while the through shipper shall go free of charge for these causes. Secretary of the Interior to furnish certain· information relating to fees Well, that isreal elasticity indeed. That is called masterly. It certainly of claim agents in pension cases. This is a report from the Select Com..: is ridiculous, to say the least of it. Does not the through shipper get mittee on the Payment of Pensions, Bounty, and Back Pay, and I ask the benefit of the whole road, with all the hills it. cuts, with all the for its immediate consideration. mountains it tunnels, and with all the streams it crosses? Is he not The resolution was read, as follows: Resolved, That the Secretary of the interior be directed to report to the House benefited when he ships over the entire road the same as the "Shipper. the number of contracts providing for the payment of fees of S25 in pension over part of it? Certainly he is. Then why charge him half wha~ou cases to claim agents under the act approved July 4,1884, which have been filed charge the local shipper? The answe~ is only because it can be done in the Pension Office, and whether any of such contracts cover claims on file prior to the passage of said act; and also how many, if any, of such claims for without regard to justice, right, or reason. It is a matter of.pure force fees have been allowed and paid, an.d if any fees so paid are for claims so filed and not of right. It is the old saying, that might makes right.. I have prior to the passage of said act. no prejudice against railroads or their legitimate business; I am for The SPEAKER. Is there objection to the present consideration of them; but I say to them, do right with all people and there will be no . this resolution? complaint. [Applause.] Mr. . KEIFER. That, I think, woqld take so much time that it Mr. REAGAN ..Before any other gentleman proceeds to address t~e would be necessary to provide a new corps of clerks. House I desire there should be an understanding about what was agreed Mr. . WARNER, of Ohio, I am assured that this information can be upon some time ago. I supposed I had got unanimous ·consent to proceed very easily furnished. · with the further consideration of this bill to-morrow. I have been.told Mr. KEIFER. I will not object. by some gentlemen that that was not understood. I desire now to know The resolution was adopted. . whether I had unanimous consent to go on in the morning. Mr. WARNER, of Ohio, moved to reconsider the vote by which the The SPEAKER. The Chair did not state to the House that part of resolution was adopted; and also moved that the motion to reconsider the request which the gentleman from Texas says be submitted and be laid on the table. which the Chair failed· to hear, a request for unanimous consent to The latter motion was agreed to. proceed with the considerati~n of this bill to-morrow. Is there objec- tion? · MOSES M. BANE. Mr. McMILLIN. I dislike to ~ppear to antagonize in any way this Mr. MORRISON, by unanimous consent, introduced a bill (H. R. bill,· the importance of which I fully realize, by insisting on the Pri 7677) to reimburse Moses M. Bane, receiver of public moneys at Salt vate Calendar to-morrow. But I think we should proceed to-morrow Lake City,forreut paid by him; which was read a first and second time, to the consideration of the Private Calendar. If thus early in the ses referred to the pommittee on Claims, and ordered to be printed. "" sion we can not reach that Calendar there is no hope of reaching it at INTERNATIONAL POLAR. EXPEDITION. all My friend from Inrliana [Mr. HOLl\IAN] suggests that I should Mr. THOMAS. I ask rmanimous consent to submit for present con not insist on the consideration of the Private Calendar to-morrow if sideration the resolution which I send to the desk. it placed this bill in jeopardy. But the bill can becompl~tedon Satll! The Clerk read as follows: da.y, while we can not go on with the Private Calendar on Saturday. Resolved, That the Secretary of War be requested to transmit to the House of I am as much for the cons:ideration of this bill as any one, but I think Representatives, if not inconsistent with the public service, the report of the it can be disposed of this week without interfering with the considera international polar expedition to Point Barrow, Alaska, by Lieut. D. H : Ray, tion of the Private Calendar. United States Army, for the years 1881, 1882, and 1883. The SPEAKER. Does the gentleman from Tennessee object? Mr. KEIFER. I desire to reserve the right to object until we leam Mr. McMILLIN. I shall have to object, Mr. Speaker. the reason for offering this resolution. 1t1r. REAGAN. Then I ask tba.t the understanding heretofore come 1\fr. THOMAS. I will make a very brief statement. rThere were to as for to-morrow shall be the understanding for to-morrow or the two expeditions organized at the same time, the Greely and the Ray first day the matter shall be considered, if that day be Saturday. expeditions, one to go up on the Atlantic side and the other on the Pa The SPEAKER. The Chair understands the request made by the cific. Lieutenant Ray, having charge of the Pacific expedition, dis gentleman from Texas, except that part in relation to the consideration charged his duties, remaining in the Polar region at Point Barrow, the of the bill to-morrow, has already been agreed to by the House. most northern point of Alaska., for two years, made the most accurate Mt·. REAGAN. I want it understood it is agreed that after voting and exhaustive examination and observations, returned with all his men on these amendments we proceed under the five-minute rule to con in good shape, antlhas prepared the most magnificent report of his obser sider that one of these bills which shall have the preference. vations in that section of the world. Under the law the Secretary of The SPEAKER. That was part of the understanding. War bas no authority to have this document printed; and we desire to Mr. O'NEILL, of Pennsylvania. That is the understanding of what call for it, simply for the purpose of bringing it to this House that it shall be done when the bill next comes up. may be printed for the use of members and of the scientific world. 1t!r. REAGAN. If no one desires to continue the debate this even Mr. McMILLIN. Is this resolution repor~ed by a committee? ing I shall move that the House do now ad~ourn. Mr. THOMAS. It is not; i~ does not req~ any report. P884. CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. 203 • Mr. McMILLIN. Let it be considered by a com.m.ittee. ernment Printing Office, as provided for by joint resolution of 'February :Alr. THOMAS. It is aU right. The report ~ all ready to be trans 6, 1883; - mitted here as soon as it may be called for. I hope the objection will A letter from. the Acting Secretary of the Treasury, transmitting a be withdl'l\,wn. . letter from the First Comptroller of the Treasury, with inclosures, re The SPEAKER. Is thero objection to thP- resolution? lating to estimate of appropriation for printing revised laws of Wyoming Mr. McMILLIN. My judgment is that this matter ought to be Territory; and considered bya committee. I have no objection to the introduction of A letter from the Acting Secretary of the Treasury, transmitting an the resolution for that purpose. If it is right the committee can soon estimate from the Secretary of the Navy of the appropriation required report. to pay owners of the steamer Druid for damages sustained by collision Mr. THOMAS. ·The report is all ready to be transmitted. The with United States steamer Powhatan. adoption of the resolution involves no expense at all. I hope no ob The SPEAKER. If there be no objection the Chair will lay before / jection will be made. the House certain executive communications, The SPEAKER. Unless the objection be withdrawn the resolution There was no objection. will have to go to a committee. POSTMASTERS' CLAIMS FOR LOSSES BY FIRE, ETC. Mr. McMILLIN. Do I understa.11d that this report has already been printed? The SPEAKER laid before the House a letter from the Acting Post Mr. THOMAS. It is all ready to be transmitted to the Hbuse. The master-General, transmitting, as requested by act of March 17, 1882, adoption of this resolution will involve no expense at all. lists of claims allowed and disallowed for losses by postmasters from Mr. McMILLIN. Is it not proposed to have the report printed by fire, burglary, and other casualties; which was referred to the Com this House? mittee on Appropriations, and ordered to be printed: Mr. THO!tiAS. That is a matter to be determined hereafter when FORBES'S HISTORICAL ART COLLECTION. the report comes in-not now. The SPEAKER-laid before the HQuse the following communication; Mr. McMILLIN. If the object is simply to get the report before the w:hich was referred to the Committee on ·the Library: House I have no objection to the resolution. There being no objection, the resolution.was considered and adopted. NEW YORK, June 17, 1884. DEAR Sm: I have the honor to transmit the following extract from the pro Mr. THOMAS moved to reconsider the vote by which the resolution ceedings of the nileeting of the Army of the. Potomac, held in Brooklyn, N.Y., was adopted; and also moved that the motion to reconsider be laid on June 11 and 12: · the table. " Resolved, That this society earnestly recommend the passage of the bill now pending in Congress providing for the purchase by the Government a.nd pres The later motion was agreed to. ervation in the Government archives of the extensive a.nd comprehensive series of sketches and etchings of the battles and campaigns of the Army of the Po EDW.A..RD 8. KEARNEY. tomac, known as the Forbes Historical Art Collection; and that a. copy of this resolution, duly certified by our president and secretary, be transmitted to the Mr. GEORGE; by unanimous consent, introduced a bill (H. R. 7678) Senate and to the House of Representatives." for the relief of EdwardS. Kearney; which was read a first and second Respectfully, your obedient servants, time, referred to the Committee on Expenditures in the Departmentof U. S. GRANT, . President of the Army of the Potomac. Justice, and ordered to be printed. HORATIO C. KING, · Secretary of the Army of the Potomac. TO NATIONAL AID EDUCATION. Hon. JoHN G. CARLISLE, Mr. LONG, by unanimous consent, presented the following resolu Speaker House of Representatives. tion; which was referred to the Committee on Educa:tion, and ordered FffiST NATIONAL BANK OF OMAHA, NEBR. to be printed in the RECORD: BOSTON, December 6,1884. On motion of Mr. WEAVER, by unanimous consent, the bill (S. DEAR Sm: At a convention of superintendents of public schools held at Bos 2348) to .authorize the increase of the capital stock of the First Na ton, November 21, 1884, it was voted that the president forward to each member tional Bank of Omaha, Nebr., was taken from the Speaker's table and of Congress from this Commonwealth the following resolution adopted by the read a first and second time. convention: "Resolved, That it is the sense of this convention of superintendents that the The bill was read, as follows: Senate bill for national aid to education should become la.w by action of the pres Be it enacted, &c., That the First National Bank of Omaha., in the State of ent Congress." Nebraska, is hereby authorized to inc~ its capital stock, in accordance with Very respectfully, yours, existing laws, to any sum not exceeding $2,000,000 notwithstanding the limit E. 0. CARRIGAN, President. heretofore in its original articles of association, a.nd determined by the Comp To Hon. JoHN D. LoNG, WaBhington. troller of the Currency; and the Comptroller of the Currency is hereby author ized to fix the limit of increase of the capital stock of the First National Bank MESSAGE FROM THE SENATE. oj Omaha, Nebr., at the amount of$2,000,000. A message from the Senate, by Mr. SYMPSON, one of its clerks, an The bill was ordered to a third reading; and it was accordingly read nounced that the Senate had passed a joint resolution (S. R. 101) in the third time, and passed. relation to the ceremonies to be authorized upon the completion of the Mr. WEAVER moved to reconsider the vote by which the bill was Wa~;~hington Monument, in which the concurrence of the Honse was passed; and also moved that the motion to reconsider be laid 8:a the requested. table. LABORERS IN CLERK'S DOCUMENT-ROOM. The latter motion was agreed to. Mr. HOLMAN. I am requested to submit, for reference to the Com HELL GATE. mittee on Accounts, the resolution which I send to the des\{. Mr. WILLIS, by unanimous consent, submitted the following reso The Clerk read as follows: lution; which was referred to the Committee on Rivers and Harbors: Ruoltled by the Ho-use of .Representatives, That the Clerk of the House~ empow Resolved, That the Secretary of W a.r be directed to inform this House whether ered, a.nd is hereby authorized, to continue in the service of the House the two the amount appropriated by the act of July 5,1884, for Hell Gate, New York, laborers in the Clerk's document-room a,uthorized under resolution of June 13, has been diverted from the purpose therein set forth. 1884, to arrange, sack, and ship the reserved calf-bound and special-bound docu ments belonging to mem hers and to arrange the files; the said laborers to be And then, on motion of Mr. REA.GAN (at 4 o'clock and 20 minutes paid out of the contingent fund of the House at the same rate heretofore named, p.m.) the House adjourned. under the supervision of the Committee on Accounts. There being no objection, the resolution was referred to the Commit . PETITIONS, ETC. tee on Accounts. The following petitions and papers were laid on the Clerk's desk, PRINTING OF EXECUTIVE DOCUMENTS. under the rule, and referred as .follows: The SPEAKER. The Chair asks that an order be made for the print By' Mr. ALEXANDER: Petition of citizens of Carroll County, Mis ing of certain executive documents heretofore referred to the Commit- souri; also of citizens of Sullivan County, Missouri, for the passage of tee on Appropriations without any order to print. . a Mexican war pension bill and amendments-severally to the Com There being no objection, the following executive communications mittee on Pensions. heretofore laid before the House and referred to the Committee on Ap By Mr. BARBOUR: Papers relating to the claim of Thomas Mc propriations were severally ordered to be printed: Cardell-to the Committee on Claims. A letter from the Secretary of the Treasury, tfansmitting supple By Mr. BLANCHARD: Petition relating to the claim of J. A. Lam mentary estimates of the Interior Department for appropriati~ns for the pite-to the Committee on War Claims. Indian service for the fiscal year ending June 30, 1886; By Mr. BRAINARD: Petition of citizens of Erie County, Pennsyl A letter from the Secretary of the Treasury, transmitting a commu vania, for the pa.c:;sage of the M~xican war pension bill-to the Commit- nication from the Comptroller of the Currency correcting his former tee on Pensions. · estimates for expenses of the national cqrrency, and submitting an Also, petition of citizen&•of Venango County, Pennsylvania, for the additional estimate of $110,000 for the expense of engraving, printing, enactment of a law taxing incomes-to the Committee on the Judiciary. and furnishing national-bank notes, for the fiscal year endingJune30, By Mr. CANNON: Petition of JohnS. Vesey and others; also of M. 1886· F. Davis and others, of Paris, Ill., asking for the passage of the Mexi A ietter from the Acting Secretary of the Treasury, asking an imme can war pension bill and amendments-severally to the Committee on diate appropriation for the removal and storage of material at the Gov- Pensions. 204 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD-HOUSE. DEOEMBER 12, By Mr. CASSIDY: Petition of Albert Arent.8, mechanical enginee-r, By Mr. HOLMAN: Of Julius C. Burgoyne and 64 Union soldiers relative to the metric system of weights and measures-to the Commit- and citizens of Franklin County, Indiana. tee on Coinage, Weights, and Measures. By Mr. HISCOCK: Of citizens of Virgil and other places in New / By Mr. COLLINS: Petition of Elizur Wright and others, citizens of York. Massachusetts, for r~peal of the act of .Tuly 12, 1876, known as the By .Mr. HITT: Of 63soldiers and citizens of East Dubuque. Comstock law-to the Committee on the Judiciary. By Mr. B. W. JONES: OfcitizensofWisconsin. By Mr. W. W. CULBERTSON: PapersreJ.a,tingtothepension claim By Mr. JORDAN: Of citizens ofCadiz, Ohio. of Sarah T. Duke-=-to the Committee on Invalid Pensions. By Mr. KEIFER: Of E. Sherrett and 139 others, soldierS of the la~ By Mr. G. R. DAVIS: Petition of ex-soldiers of the war, for the pas- war. sage of the Mexican war pension bill as amended-to t.he Committee on By Mr. LACEY: Of M. D. Reed and 246 citizens of Barry County, Pensions. Michigan. By Mr. DIBRELL: Papers relating tO the claim of James W. Rouls- By Mr. LAWRENCE: Of citizens of Beaver County, Pennsylvania. ton-to the Committee on War Claim..<~. By Mr. MORRISON: Of citizens of Du Rois, and of 70 citizens of By Mr. DUNHAM: Petition of tug and vessel owners of Chicago, Ashl~y, Ill. favorable to House bill No. 7591-to the Committee on Commerce. By Mr. MOULTON: Of 500 citizens of illinois, and 500 citizens of By Mr. liiLL: Petition of D. G. Bntson and 100 othersJ citizens of Nilwood, Ill. • Willshire, Ohio, for the passage of the Mexican war pension bill and By Mr. MUTCHLER: Of citizens of Bucks County, Pennsylvania. amendments-to the Committee on 'Pensions. By Mr. NUTTING: Of citizens of Cazenovia, N. Y. By Mr. HOPKINS: Petition of 500citizens of Massachusetts; also,· By Mr. POLAND: OfWilliam A. Chamberlainandothers, of Stock- of 500 citizens of Massachusetts; also, of 125 citizens of Massachusetts, bridge, Vt., and of F. ·H. Atherton and 300 others, of Waterbury, Vt. for the passage of the resolution introduced by Mr. HOPKINS relative By Mr. PARKER: Of citizens of Saint Lawrence County, New York. to the transportation of cattle-severally to the Committee onAgricult- By Mr. PAIGE: Of George L. Boult and others, of Medina, Ohio, ure. and of Thomas F. Wright and others, of C~eveland, Ohio. By Mr. B. W. JONES: Papers relating to the pension claim ofWill- By Mr. PHELPS: Of citizens of Passaic County, New Jersey. iam N. Wiggins-to the Committee on Invalid Pensions. By Mr. NELSON: Of citizens of Melrose and Utica, Minn. By· Mr. LORE: Petition of Joseph E. Vantine and 34 others, citi- By Mr. REED: Of citizens of Maine. zens of Delaware, for the passage of the Mexican war pension bill and By Mr. RIGGS: Of A. C. Morris and others; of William Elick and amendments-to the Committee on Pensions. others; of William F. Connor and others; of J. C. Weiser and others; By Mr. MAYBURY: Petition of citizens of Detroit, :Mich., relative of E. L. H. Barry and others, and ofS. H. Lambert and others. to the metric system of weights and meaaures-to the Committee on By Mr. W. F. ROGERS: Of citizens of Springville, Erie County, New Coinage, Weights, and Measures. York. By Mr. O'HARA: Papers relating to the claim of Furney Mercer- By Mr. SENEY: Of James Berrington and 100 others, of Crawford to the Committee on War Claims. . County; of B. A. Thomas and 84 others, of Rushville; of GeorgeS. Meyer By Mr. T. G. SKINNER: Papers relating to the claim of K. R. Pen- and 31 others, ofWyandotConnty; and ofW. P. Wilson and 120 others, dleton; also, papers relating to.the claim of Elisha Colbert-severally of Hancock County, all in Ohio. to the same committee. By Mr. C. R. SKINNER: Of 85 citizens of Black River, N. Y. By Mr. H. Y. SMITH: Petition of citizens of Adair County, Iowa, By Mr. A. HERR SMITH: · Of citizens of city and county of Lan- for the passage of the Mexican war pension bill and amendments-to the caster, Pennsylvania. Committee on Pensions. By Mr. STEELE: Of Nathan ;Erhman and 50 others, of Adams By Mr. STOCKSLAGER: Petitions of citizens of Medora, Ind.; also County, Indiana; of John Coughlin and 100 others, of La Gro, Ind.; of ofcitizensofSeymour, Ind., forthepassageoftheMexicanwarpension John W. Miller and 75 others, of Dunkirk, Ind.; of F. N. Kellogg bill and amendments-to the same committee. • and 90 others, of Bluffton, Ind.; of Thomas E. Ream and 50 others, By Mr. VANCE: Papers relating to the claim of Andrew J. Lafter- of Peru, Ind.; and of .Alfred 0. Briggs and 60 others, of Monroeville, to the Committee on Claims. Ind. By Mr. WARD: Petition of Henry C. Applegate and 33 others, for . By Mr. STRUBLE: Of Charles Isbell and 18 others, of Sioux Rapids, the relief of John Osborn-to the same committee. Iowa. .Also, two petitions of citizens of Indiana, for the passage of the Mexi- By Mr. WILKINS: Of Franklin Myers and 42 others, of Licking can war pension bill and amendments-severally to the Committee on County, Ohio. · Pensions. By Mr. W. L. WILSON: Of B. J. Davis and 61 others, citizens of By Mr. WEAVER: Petition of 125 citizens of Nebraska; also, of83 West Virginia. citizens of Nebraska, asking for the passage of the.Mexican war pension By Mr. VANCE: Of sundry citizens of Macon County, North Carolina. bill and amendments-severally to the same committee. By Mr. E. B. WINANS: Petition of JacobS. Smith, Abram Frick, and other citizens of Otisville, Mich.; also, of Silas T. Fern, Luman Beebe, and 100 other citizens of Oxford, Mich., for the passage of the HOUSE OF REPRESENT.A.~IVES. Mexican war pension bill and amendments-severally to the same com FRIDAY, mittee. Decenwer 12, 1884. By Mr. YAPLE: Petition of A. Vanderheyden, and 130 others, citi The House met at 12 o'clock m. Prayer by the Chaplain, Rev. zens of Three Rivers, Mich.; of David Bacon and 69 others, and of JOHN S. LINDSAY, D. D. Willirun H. Smith and 118 others, citizens of Niles, Mich. ; also, reso The Journal of the proceedings of yesterday was read and approv~. lutions of George H. Thomas Post, No. 14, Grand Army of the Republic, NEW ORLEANS EXPOSITION. Department of Michigan, for the passage of the Mexican war pension bill and amendments-severally to the same committee. · Mr. ELLIS. Mr. Speaker, I ask unanimous consent to offer for The following petitions, praying for the passage of the Mexican war present consideration the concurrent resolution which I send to the pension bill with Senate amendments, were presented and severally Clerk's desk to be read: · referred to the Committee ·on Pensions: • The Clerk read a.s follows: Whereas the Congress of the United States has been formally invited to attend . By Mr. BEACH: Of citizens of .Am,ity, Orange County, New York; the opening ceremonies of the World's Industrial and Cotton Centennial Exposi of Rockland County, New York; of Cornwall and Newburg, N.Y. tion t-o be inaugurated at New Orleans on Tuesday, December 16, 1884; and By Mr. BOUTELLE: Of Isaiah N. ¥erritt and 60 others, of Addi Whereas the exigencies of the public service prevent their attendance on said day; and son, Me. Whereas the President of the United States has decided to open said exposi By Mr. W. W. BROWN: Of 62 citizens an(! soldiers of Kane, McKean tion by telegraph and to start the machinery thereof by electricitrfrom the Ex County, Pennsylva.nia; of 61 citizens and soldiers of Potter County, ecutive Mansion in the presence of his Cabinet and the representat1ves of foreign powers; and . Pennsylvania; of91 citizens and soldiers of thesameplace; and of102 Whereas the Congress of the United States entertains for said exposition the citizens and soldiers of McKean County, Pennsylvania. best wishes and desires to lend to its su1.:cess its coudtenanne and good-will: Now, By Mr. J. M. CAMPBELL: Of citizens of Somerset, Pa. therefore, · Resolved ln! the House of Repruent{Jtives (the Senate concurr-ing herein), Th&t the By Mr. CARLETON: Of citizens ofPeckand New Baltimore, Mich. President of the Sena.\e, together with a committee of thirteen Senators, to be By Mr. DINGLEY: Of E. D. Heald and 50 others, of Bucldield, appointed by him, and the Speaker of the House, together with one Representa Me., and ofP. P. Getchell and 200 others, of Lewiston, Me. tive or Delegate from each State and Territory of the Union, t-o be selected by him, be requested to attend at the Executive Mansion on Tuesday, the 16th in By Mr. EATON: Of John Girard and others, of New Britain, Conn. stant, at 12.30 p. m., to witsess on behalf of the Congress of the United States By Mr. GREENLEAF: OfcitizensofMedina, N.Y., and of Medina, the opening of said exposition by the President, and to adopt and forward Rochester, &c., N.Y. thereto such address of congratulation as may seem appropriate to the occasion. By Mr. HA.RT: Of John Landon and 12~ others, Union soldiers of The SPEAKER. Is there objection to the present consideration of Ohio. the concurrent resolution? By Mr. HATCH: OfcitizensofKnoxandScotlandCounties, Missouri. There was no objection. By Mr. HAYNES: Of Samuel Walker and 54 others, of Suncook, Mr. ELLIS. I move its adoption. N. H., and of Charles A. Barrett and 161 others. The resolution was adopted. .