S9186 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD — SENATE September 25, 2002 Jeff Bingaman, Jim Jeffords, Joseph HOMELAND SECURITY ACT OF 2002 Ensign Kyl Smith (NH) Lieberman, Bill Nelson of Florida, Enzi Lott Smith (OR) Blanche L. Lincoln, Byron L. Dorgan, The PRESIDING OFFICER. Under Fitzgerald Lugar Snowe Frist McCain Jack Reed, Patrick Leahy, Robert C. the previous order, the Senate will now Specter Gramm McConnell Stevens Byrd, Mary Landrieu, Max Baucus. resume consideration of H.R. 5005, Grassley Miller which the clerk will report. Thomas The PRESIDING OFFICER. By unan- Gregg Murkowski Thompson The assistant legislative clerk read Hagel Nickles Thurmond imous consent, the mandatory quorum Hatch Roberts as follows: Voinovich call under the rule is waived. Hutchinson Santorum Warner The question is, Is it the sense of the A bill (H.R. 5005) to establish the Depart- Hutchison Sessions ment of Homeland Security, and for other Inhofe Shelby Senate that debate on the Byrd amend- purposes. ment No. 4480 to H.R. 5093, the Interior NOT VOTING—2 appropriations bill, shall be brought to Pending: Helms Torricelli Lieberman amendment No. 4471, in the na- a close? The yeas and nays are required The PRESIDING OFFICER (Mr. NEL- ture of a substitute. under rule XXII, and the clerk will call SON of Nebraska). On this vote, the the roll. CLOTURE MOTION yeas are 49, the nays are 49. Three- The assistant legislative clerk called The PRESIDING OFFICER. Under fifths of the Senators duly chosen and the roll. the previous order, pursuant to rule sworn not having voted in the affirma- Mr. REID. I announce that the Sen- XXII, the Chair lays before the Senate tive, the motion is rejected. the pending cloture motion, which the ator from New Jersey (Mr. TORRICELLI) The majority leader. is necessarily absent. clerk will report. Mr. DASCHLE. Mr. President, I enter The legislative clerk read as follows: Mr. NICKLES. I announce that the a motion to reconsider the vote by Senator from North Carolina (Mr. CLOTURE MOTION which cloture has not been invoked on the Lieberman substitute amendment HELMS) is necessarily absent. We, the undersigned Senators, in accord- ance with the provisions of Rule XII of the No. 4471 to H.R. 5005, the homeland se- The yeas and nays resulted—yeas 51, curity legislation. nays 47, as follows: Standing Rules of the Senate, hereby move to bring to a close the debate on the The PRESIDING OFFICER. The mo- [Rollcall Vote No. 224 Leg.] Lieberman substitute amendment No. 4471 tion is entered. YEAS—51 for H.R. 5005, the Homeland Security bill. Mr. DASCHLE. I thank the Chair. Debbie Stabenow, Harry Reid, Charles AMENDMENT NO. 4738 Akaka Dayton Leahy Schumer, Evan Bayh, Mark Dayton, Allard Dodd Levin Jeff Sessions, John Edwards, Jim Jef- The PRESIDING OFFICER. Under Baucus Dorgan Lieberman the previous order, there will now be 2 Bayh Durbin Lincoln fords, Joseph Lieberman, Bill Nelson of Biden Edwards Mikulski Florida, Blanche L. Lincoln, Byron L. hours of debate on the Gramm amend- Bingaman Feingold Miller Dorgan, Jack Reed, Patrick Leahy, ment, with the time to be equally di- Boxer Feinstein Murray Robert C. Byrd, Mary Landrieu, Max vided between the Senator from Texas Breaux Graham Nelson (FL) Baucus. Byrd Harkin Nelson (NE) and the Senator from Connecticut or Campbell Hollings Reed The PRESIDING OFFICER. By unan- their designees. Cantwell Inouye Reid imous consent, the mandatory quorum The Senator from Texas. Carnahan Jeffords Rockefeller call under the rule is waived. Mr. GRAMM. Mr. President, I send Carper Johnson Sarbanes Cleland Kennedy Schumer The question is, Is it the sense of the an amendment to the desk and ask for Clinton Kerry Stabenow Senate that debate on the Lieberman its immediate consideration. Conrad Kohl Wellstone amendment No. 4471 to H.R. 5005, an The PRESIDING OFFICER. Without Corzine Landrieu Wyden act to establish the Department of objection, the clerk will report. NAYS—47 Homeland Security and for other pur- The legislative clerk read as follows: Allen Fitzgerald Nickles poses, shall be brought to a close? The Senator from Texas, Mr. GRAMM, for Bennett Frist Roberts The yeas and nays are required under himself, Mr. MILLER, Mr. MCCONNELL, Mr. Bond Gramm Santorum the rule. THOMPSON, Mr. STEVENS, and Mr. HAGEL, pro- Brownback Grassley Sessions poses an amendment numbered 4738. Bunning Gregg The clerk will call the roll. Shelby Mr. GRAMM. I ask unanimous con- Burns Hagel Smith (NH) The legislative clerk called the roll. Chafee Hatch Smith (OR) Mr. REID. I announce that the Sen- sent the reading of the amendment be Cochran Hutchinson Snowe dispensed with. Collins Hutchison ator from New Jersey (Mr. TORRICELLI) Specter The PRESIDING OFFICER. Without Craig Inhofe is necessarily absent. Stevens Crapo Kyl objection, it is so ordered. Thomas Mr. NICKLES. I announce that the Daschle Lott The text of the amendment is printed Thompson Senator from North Carolina (Mr. DeWine Lugar in today’s RECORD under ‘‘Amendments Domenici McCain Thurmond HELMS) is necessarily absent. Ensign McConnell Voinovich The result was announced—yeas 49, Submitted.’’ Enzi Murkowski Warner nays 49, as follows: The PRESIDING OFFICER. Who yields time? NOT VOTING—2 [Rollcall Vote No. 225 Leg.] The majority leader. Helms Torricelli YEAS—49 Mr. DASCHLE. Mr. President, I ask The PRESIDING OFFICER. On this Akaka Dodd Levin for the yeas and nays. Baucus Dorgan Lieberman The PRESIDING OFFICER. Is there a vote, the yeas are 51. The nays are 47. Bayh Durbin Lincoln Three-fifths of the Senators duly cho- Biden Edwards Mikulski sufficient second? There is a sufficient sen and sworn not having voted in the Bingaman Feingold Murray second. affirmative, the motion is rejected. Boxer Feinstein Nelson (FL) The yeas and nays were ordered. Breaux Graham Nelson (NE) The PRESIDING OFFICER. The ma- The majority leader. Byrd Harkin Reed Cantwell Hollings jority leader. Mr. BYRD. Mr. President, can we Reid Carnahan Inouye Mr. DASCHLE. Mr. President, I Rockefeller have order? Carper Jeffords Sarbanes wanted to take a few minutes of leader Chafee Johnson The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen- Schumer time this morning, before we get into ate will come to order. The majority Cleland Kennedy Clinton Kerry Stabenow the debate on the amendment offered leader. Conrad Kohl Wellstone by the Senator from Texas, to talk Mr. DASCHLE. Mr. President, I enter Corzine Landrieu Wyden about a concern that I have wanted to Dayton Leahy a motion to reconsider the vote by avoid talking about for weeks. I am which cloture was not invoked on the NAYS—49 very saddened by the fact that we have Byrd amendment No. 4480, as amended. Allard Bunning Craig debated homeland security now for 4 The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen- Allen Burns Crapo weeks. I have noted on several occa- Bennett Campbell Daschle ator has that right. The motion is en- Bond Cochran DeWine sions that there is no reason, on a bi- tered. Brownback Collins Domenici partisan basis, this body cannot work

VerDate Sep 04 2002 23:54 Sep 25, 2002 Jkt 099060 PO 00000 Frm 00008 Fmt 4624 Sfmt 0634 E:\CR\FM\G25SE6.019 S25PT1 September 25, 2002 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD — SENATE S9187 together to overcome our differences Advice was given by Karl Rove, and The Senator from West Virginia. and to pass a meaningful and sub- the quote on the disk was: ‘‘Focus on Mr. BYRD. Mr. President, I commend stantive bill dealing with homeland se- war.’’ the distinguished Democratic leader curity. I guess, right from the beginning, I for the position he has taken here Some have suggested that the delay thought: Well, first it was pollsters, today. I commend him for the restraint has been politically motivated, and I and then it was White House staff, and he has shown in his remarks. have said: I am not willing to believe then it was the Vice President. And all I, too, was astounded upon reading that. In fact, yesterday I said: We in- along I was asked: Are you concerned this story in the Washington Post this tend to give the President the benefit about whether or not this war is politi- morning. It reads as follows in part: of the doubt. cized? And my answer, on every occa- As he seeks to boost Republican candidates Over the course of the last several sion, was: Yes. And then the followup in the midterm elections, President Bush is weeks, as we have debated national se- question is: Is the White House politi- increasing his emphasis on terrorism and na- tional security, shedding his previous deter- curity, the issue of war in Iraq has be- cizing the war? And I said: Without come more and more prominent. And mination to demonstrate his concern about question, I can’t bring myself to be- the flagging economy. again, as I go back to my experience in lieve that it is. I can’t believe any Four times in the past two days, Bush has 1991 and 1992, during a similar period— President or any administration would suggested that democrats do not care about the fall and winter prior and after an politicize the war. But then I read in national security, saying on Monday that election—I expressed the concern that the paper this morning, now even the the Democratic-controlled Senate is ‘‘not in- our politics in this climate could easily terested in the security of the American peo- President—the President is quoted in ple.’’ His remarks, intensifying a theme he create a politicized environment and, the Washington Post this morning as in so doing, diminish, minimize, de- introduced last month, were quickly sec- saying that the Democratic-controlled onded and disseminated by House Majority grade the debate on an issue as grave Senate is ‘‘not interested in the secu- Whip Tom DeLay (R–Tex.). as war. rity of the American people.’’ At a fundraiser for GOP House candidate No one here needs to be reminded of Not interested in the security of the Adam Taff in Kansas Monday, Vice President the consequences of war. No one here American people? Cheney said security would be bolstered if should have to be admonished about Taff were to defeat Rep. Dennis Moore (D– You tell Senator INOUYE he is not in- politicizing the debate about war. But, Kan.). ‘‘Cheney talks about Iraq at congres- terested in the security of the Amer- sional fundraiser/Electing Taff would aid war Mr. President, increasingly, over the ican people. You tell those who fought course of the last several weeks, re- effort,’’ read the headline in the Topeka Cap- in Vietnam and in World War II they ital-Journal. ports have surfaced which have led me are not interested in the security of to believe that indeed there are those Mr. President, are we to believe this? the American people. who would politicize this war. Are we to believe that this President That is outrageous—outrageous. I was given a report about a rec- said what I have just quoted? This is The President ought to apologize to ommendation made by Matthew Dowd, the President who was going to change Senator INOUYE and every veteran who the pollster for the White House and the tone in Washington. has fought in every war who is a Demo- the Republican National Committee. I am terribly disappointed. We are crat in the Senate. He ought to apolo- He told a victory dinner not long ago— entering an election. War clouds loom I quote—‘‘The No. 1 driver for our base gize to the American people. over this country. Yet the President That is wrong. We ought not politi- motivationally is this war.’’ would say the Democratic-controlled Dowd said war could be beneficial to cize this war. We ought not politicize Senate is ‘‘not interested in the secu- the GOP in the 2002 elections. And then the rhetoric about war and life and rity of the American people.’’ I quote: ‘‘When an issue dominates the death. What about MAX CLELAND? Is he in- landscape like this one will dominate I was in Normandy just last year. I terested in the security of the Amer- the landscape, I think through this have been in national cemeteries all ican people? What about DANNY election and probably for a long time over this country. And I have never INOUYE? Is he interested in the security to come, it puts Republicans on a very seen anything but stars—the Star of of the American people? good footing.’’ David and crosses on those markers. I I am disgusted by the tenor of the I thought: Well, perhaps that is a have never seen ‘‘Republican’’ and war debate that has seemingly over- pollster. Perhaps pollsters are paid to ‘‘Democrat.’’ taken this capital city. Here is the say what is best regardless of what This has to end, Mr. President. We President of the Senate, the Vice Presi- other considerations ought to be made. have to get on with the business of our dent of the United States, out cam- Pollsters are paid to tell you about the country. We have to rise to a higher paigning. The President is campaigning politics of issues. And were it left with level. using war talk to win the election. The pollsters, perhaps I would not be as Our Founding Fathers would be em- Vice President of the United States is concerned. barrassed by what they are seeing barnstorming for Republican can- But then I read that Andy Card was going on right now. didates. There, in at least one instance, asked: Well, why did this issue come We have to do better than this. Our he was telling voters that electing Re- before Washington and the country standard of deportment ought to be publicans would aid the war effort. now? Why are we debating it in Sep- better. Those who died gave their lives Is the President determined to make tember? Where were we last year? for better than what we are giving now. his party—that great party of Abraham Where were we last spring? And Mr. So, Mr. President, it is not too late Lincoln—the war party? What would Card’s answer was: ‘‘From a marketing to end this politicization. It is not too Abraham Lincoln have to say if he point of view, you don’t introduce new late to forget the pollsters, forget the were here? products in August.’’ campaign fundraisers, forget making This war strategy seems to have been New products? War? accusations about how interested in hatched by political strategists intent And then I listen to reports of the national security Democrats are; and on winning the midterm election at Vice President. The Vice President let’s get this job done right. any cost, even if that cost places this comes to fundraisers, as he did just re- Let’s rise to the occasion. That is Nation on the brink of battle and the cently in Kansas. The headline written what the American people are expect- Nation’s sons and daughters there on in the paper the next day about the ing. And we ought to give them no less. that brink. It is despicable. The distin- speech he gave to that fundraiser was: I yield the floor. guished majority leader used the word CHENEY talks about war: electing Taff The PRESIDING OFFICER. Who ‘‘outrageous.’’ He is exactly right. It is would aid war effort. yields time? despicable that any President would And then we find a diskette discov- Mr. BYRD. Mr. President, I ask unan- attempt to use the serious matter of ered in Lafayette Park, a computer imous consent that I may proceed for impending war as a tool in a campaign diskette that was lost somewhere be- 10 minutes. war. tween a Republican strategy meeting The PRESIDING OFFICER. Is there I am not going to continue to be si- in the White House and the White objection? lent. The blood of our sons and daugh- House. Without objection, it is so ordered. ters, our soldiers, sailors, and airmen,

VerDate Sep 04 2002 23:54 Sep 25, 2002 Jkt 099060 PO 00000 Frm 00009 Fmt 4624 Sfmt 0634 E:\CR\FM\G25SE6.024 S25PT1 S9188 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD — SENATE September 25, 2002 has far more value than a few votes in The American people have serious There is another footnote in history a ballot box. questions. The Nation’s allies have se- that we should recall. In that ancient There is nothing more sobering than rious questions. Members of this body war we engaged in 60 years ago, World a decision to go to war, but the admin- have serious questions. These must be War II, in the U.S. Army, 95 percent of istration has turned the decision into a answered before going to war, and it is the men in uniform had no spouses; bumper sticker election theme. That is not now, nor was it ever, unpatriotic to there were no children. Five percent what I felt I saw in the beginning of ask questions. had spouses and children. In my regi- this war on terrorism. It was being Mr. President, I yield the floor. ment, 4 percent had spouses and chil- used politically also. It is clear now. It The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen- dren; 96 percent were young men, 18, 19, is out in the open. There it is. ator’s time has expired. The majority 20. We were ready. We had no strings For the President to suggest the Sen- leader. attached. ate is not interested in the security of Mr. DASCHLE. Mr. President, I ask Today, in the U.S. Army, over 77 per- the American people is outrageous. It unanimous consent that Senator cent of our men and women have is insulting. It is wrong, wrong, wrong. INOUYE have 5 minutes of my leader spouses; they have children. We should To suggest that one is unpatriotic sim- time. be concerned about their sensitivities. ply because one is affiliated with a cer- The PRESIDING OFFICER. Is there It is not easy going into combat. No tain party and may oppose a war that objection? one enters battle planning to become a Mr. GRAMM. Mr. President, I cer- may have horrendous consequences is hero. You just happen to be in the tainly do not object to any time Sen- irresponsible—irresponsible. It is the wrong place at the wrong time. If you ator INOUYE wants, but we have come worst kind of political opportunism. stepped one foot to the right, the bullet to debate an amendment on the home- I have been in this Congress 50 years. would have missed you. land security bill, and I would like to I have never seen a President of the The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen- have an opportunity to speak on it. I United States or a Vice President of ator has used 5 minutes. the United States stoop to such low do not object. The PRESIDING OFFICER. Without Mr. GRAMM. Mr. President, I ask level. It is your blood, your sons and unanimous consent that the Senator daughters. Those who are looking at objection, it is so ordered. Senator INOUYE. may have 5 additional minutes. the Senate through the electronic The PRESIDING OFFICER. Without lenses, it is your blood, your treasure. Mr. INOUYE. Mr. President, the gen- tleman who resides at 1600 Pennsyl- objection, it is so ordered. For the first time in the history of Mr. INOUYE. Mr. President, there the Republic, the Nation is considering vania Avenue is the President of the United States of America, and al- are those who plan war, and there are a preemptive strike against a sovereign those who engage in war. As we have state. I will not be silenced. I have no though the Constitution does not spe- cifically state it, his most important always said in the subcommittee and in brief for Iraq, but I am not going to be the Appropriations Committee, in silenced. I will not give the benefit of chore is to keep our people united, to keep our Nation united. order to avoid war, we should be pre- the doubt to the President. I will give pared for war. We voted for a bill to the benefit of the doubt to the Con- Accordingly, this morning I am sad- dened by the reports of my leader, the spend over $356 billion. Does that sug- stitution. I will give the benefit of the gest we are not concerned about the se- doubt to the American people who will majority leader, and my leader, Sen- curity of our people? And when we soon be called upon, if this President ator BYRD of West Virginia, because it passed it unanimously—bipartisan, has his way, to give their sons and appears that our administration and united—does that suggest we are not daughters, the blood of this country. our President are making statements I do not defend the Iraqi regime. I do that only serve to divide our people. concerned about the security of this not justify its actions. But I also do I have been honored to serve as chair- country? I am concerned about the security of not want to commit our sons and man of the Defense Appropriations daughters to battle without a thorough Subcommittee. Four weeks ago, this this country. I am concerned about understanding and a thorough debate. subcommittee reported a bill unani- what history will say about this Nation You silence me, if you can. There are mously. It is a Democratically con- 50 years from now. Did we brutalize others in this body who are going to trolled subcommittee, but it reported a people or did we carry on ourselves as speak up for their people. measure unanimously. It went to the a civilized people? As my leader from This administration is making the full committee, chaired by the Senator West Virginia stated, to attack a na- war their battle cry. That is their from West Virginia, and the committee tion that has not attacked us will go bumper sticker politics. They are put- reported that measure unanimously. It down in history as something of which ting it front and center. They don’t was reported to this floor, and by an al- we should not be proud. want to talk about domestic issues. most unanimous vote—three Members Mr. President, I can assure you that They don’t want to talk about those had questions—it passed the Senate. this Democratically controlled Senate, things. So they choose to make the war That was 4 weeks ago. That was carried and especially the Defense Appropria- center stage. OK. out by a Democratically controlled tions Subcommittee, will support the ‘‘Lay on, McDuff. And damn’d be him Senate. President of the United States because that first cries, ‘‘Hold, enough!’’’ There are a few footnotes in history that man is my President also. Cer- My people in West Virginia expect that I think we should recall. I listened tainly, I did not vote for him, but he is me to speak out. If the Lord lets me to all the talk shows on Sunday. I am my President, and it grieves me when live, I shall do that. a good listener. I very seldom speak on my President makes statements that I also do not want to commit our the floor. One statement was made divide this Nation. sons and daughters to battle without a that some of us in the early 1990s ques- I can assure you this is not a time for thorough understanding of the motiva- tioned the war in the Persian Gulf. I Democrats and Republicans to say I tions, the strategies, the repercussions was one of those. This spokesperson have more medals than you, and I have of that battle. said: They questioned the war because lost more limbs than you, and we have America fights wars, but America they said a lot of body bags would be shed more blood than you. This is not does not begin wars. This is my battle returning, and just a few returned. But the time for that. This is a time in cry. This is yours. Each of you has we should recall that the war ended at which we should be working together, sworn to support and defend the Con- the border of Iraq. If we had gone into debating this issue. As the Senator stitution of the United States against Baghdad, we would have had many from West Virginia said, it is American all enemies foreign and domestic. body bags, unless the United States to question the President. It is Amer- There it is. That doesn’t give this had decided to do the most inhuman ican to debate the issues. I stand before President, that doesn’t give this Na- thing and wipe out Baghdad—men, you as a proud member of the Demo- tion, a right to launch an unprovoked women, and children. cratically controlled Senate. attack on a sovereign nation. America Some have now suggested: The war in I thank the Chair. fights wars, but America does not start Afghanistan has resulted in 100 casual- The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen- wars. ties. That is not a war. ator from Texas.

VerDate Sep 04 2002 23:54 Sep 25, 2002 Jkt 099060 PO 00000 Frm 00010 Fmt 4624 Sfmt 0634 E:\CR\FM\G25SE6.028 S25PT1 September 25, 2002 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD — SENATE S9189 Mr. KERRY. Will the Senator from with us. No matter what the United can be broken down into all positive Texas yield? Nations decides, we are never, ever, and all negative completely misrepre- The PRESIDING OFFICER (Ms. under any circumstances, going to del- sents the reality of the world. STABENOW). The Senator from Texas egate to the United Nations the protec- There seems to be no objection to has been recognized. The Senator con- tion of American lives. taking all of these Government agen- trols 1 hour. Hopefully, the United Nations is cies and putting them into one agency. Mr. KERRY. Madam President, I ask going to come to their senses and sup- So far as I know, 100 Senators are will- if the Senator from Texas will allow port the President, but the idea that ing to do that. But remarkably, rough- me to speak about 5 minutes before he we ought to change this resolution, ly half the Members of the Senate seem begins. when we do debate it, to say we should intent on taking away emergency pow- Mr. GRAMM. Madam President, the work within the U.N. I am not willing ers the President had on September 11, pending business is homeland security. to put American lives at risk based on but that would be taken away by the I came over to offer an amendment what the U.N. may or may not do. Lieberman bill that is before us. with the Senator from Georgia. The A final point, in response to the de- I wonder how many Americans who majority leader has made a statement. bate we just had, we have a commin- are listening to this debate understand The distinguished President pro tem- gling of two different wars. The first the proposal made by Senator pore of the Senate has made a state- war is with Iraq, and we are going to LIEBERMAN, on behalf of the vast ma- ment. debate that in 2 weeks. Everybody will jority of Democrats, would actually Our distinguished and beloved col- have a chance to state their position. I weaken the President’s ability to use league from Hawaii has made a state- wanted to make mine clear today. The national security powers to protect ment, and we are here to debate a war second war, however, is the war on ter- America. I do not think people under- which we have an opportunity to do rorism. That is the war we are fighting stand that. something about now. We are here to today. That is the debate we are having Our Nation has been attacked. Thou- debate an issue where we have an op- today. sands of our citizens have been killed. portunity to prevent anybody’s blood When we started this debate as to The lives of countless thousands have from being spilled by having an effec- giving the President the power to pro- been altered forever. We are debating tive homeland security program, and I tect America from the horror we saw homeland security. We have a proposal want to exercise my right to speak on on September 11, it never crossed my before the Senate that says we want to that issue. mind we would end up with a Senate take powers away from President Bush, I want to be brief on the subject, but that was almost perfectly divided, powers that President Clinton had, accusing a President of starting a war where Republicans were on one side that Bush 41 had, that President for political reasons is a pretty serious and Democrats, in the preponderance, Reagan had, that President Carter had, accusation. This Senate, on several oc- were on the other. and powers they used. casions, has passed resolutions that in There is one exception, apparently, Now, why are we debating such a pro- the strongest terms called on the on each side at the moment. I have not posal? How could it possibly make any President, if he so decided, to use force looked into people’s hearts. We have sense that we were perfectly content to against Iraq. not had a vote. I do not know where give every President since President The United Nations has passed reso- people are down to the individual Sen- Carter the ability to declare a national lution after resolution that Saddam ator, but it certainly appears at the emergency and set aside business as Hussein has rejected. So the idea that moment that we find ourselves in the usual in the Federal bureaucracy to re- somehow this is a new problem and has extraordinary circumstance that we spond to an emergency? But suddenly, suddenly been created out of whole are almost perfectly divided along as we are creating this Department, cloth as we face the election simply party lines over the issue of giving the the majority proposes we take these will not bear up to scrutiny. President the power he has asked for to powers away from President Bush. Secondly, there has been a confusion defend the American homeland and to In other words, we will put everybody between two wars, and I think this is a defend our people. in the Department, but the price the very important issue. In listening to Maybe this should not be a partisan President would have to pay is less all of those quotes, most of what has issue, but if one defines a partisan ability to use emergency powers than been said has had to do with a force issue as an issue that ends up being four of his predecessors have had. The resolution which we are not debating split along party lines then by that def- President has rejected that. Does any- today, which we will be debating next inition the debate we are engaged in one blame him? Can anybody believe week or the week after. right now, has become divided along that any President, especially this As Jefferson said so long ago, good partisan lines. The point I want to be President, would sit idly by while the men with the same facts are prone to sure people understand is the last Congress takes away powers that his disagree. Based on our history in deal- statement quoted by the President was four predecessors had? ing with Saddam Hussein, based on the not about Iraq. It was about defending I don’t think anybody would think threat he poses, based on the new infor- the American homeland. that is realistic. Why are we doing it? mation on that threat which was made Why has this become a political Why is the Senate almost evenly di- available by the British Intelligence issue? I do not believe Iraq is going to vided along partisan lines on this Service and by the Prime Minister in be a political issue, despite the fact issue? The reason is, we are down to a today’s paper, I reach a totally dif- some of our colleagues today have ex- tough choice. The tough choice is the ferent conclusion than many of my pressed reservations about Iraq. I be- following: To give the President the Democrat colleagues in that I believe lieve in the end the President is going power to put the right person in the the President should be supported, and to get a much stronger vote on a force right place at the right time to do the I believe a resolution of that support resolution on Iraq today than we got in right job in protecting lives, we have to should pass in the Senate. 1991. In the end, I do not believe Iraq is change the way the Government oper- As clearly as I can say, I think inter- going to be a partisan political issue. ates. But there are powerful political nationalism is important, I think the Why has homeland security divided interests that are opposed to making United Nations has a role, but when we the Senate right down the middle along that change. And there are people who are talking about the lives and safety partisan lines? The reason is, it in- are committed to that system, the sys- of Americans, I am not going to turn volves a very tough choice. Govern- tem we call the civil service system. those lives and that safety over to the ment is about making tough choices. I remind my colleagues we have had U.N. When one gets outside the civics class, study after study after study, studies As much as I love our allies, espe- it is not about black and white, right headed by Paul Volcker, appointed by cially the British, I am not going to and wrong. It is about tough choices. It President Clinton to be head of the turn those lives and that safety over to is about give and take. It is about giv- Federal Reserve bank. We have had our allies either. When we are talking ing up some things to have others. In studies by Lee Hamilton, a Democrat about American lives, the buck stops fact, this whole idea that everything in the House, and Warren Rudman, our

VerDate Sep 04 2002 23:54 Sep 25, 2002 Jkt 099060 PO 00000 Frm 00011 Fmt 4624 Sfmt 0634 E:\CR\FM\G25SE6.030 S25PT1 S9190 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD — SENATE September 25, 2002 beloved colleague from the Senate. In the protection of American lives, they keep dope out of the country, or keep study after study concerning national have to yield. That is my choice. Many out illegal aliens, maybe that is not so security, they have concluded the fol- of my colleagues appear to have made unreasonable. I do not agree with that, lowing, and this is the Volcker Com- a different choice. but maybe I am wrong. mission: ‘‘The current system is slow. What are we talking about when we But when you are trying to keep It is legally trammeled and intellectu- are talking about changing union work weapons of mass destruction that can ally confused. It is impossible to ex- rules? I have heard over and over and kill thousands of our people out of the plain to potential candidates. It is al- over again that we are eliminating country, do we really want to go to the most certainly not fulfilling the spirit merit and unions. FLRA and spend months and months of our mandate to hire the most meri- First, the substitute Senator MILLER and months trying to renegotiate this? torious candidates.’’ and I have introduced is a substitute Or do we want to give the President That is not President Bush talking. which strictly constrains the President the power to say: Lives are at stake. As That is not Senator GRAMM talking. to make decisions based on merit, and long as that is the case, under the That is Paul Volcker talking. The Rud- it limits it strictly to those areas emergency powers as President I am man-Hamilton bipartisan commission where lives are at stake. I will give going to send the Border Patrol where on national security concluded that we some concrete examples. In 1987, the there is no dry cleaner. needed an agile, flexible personnel sys- Customs Service at Logan Airport in That is what we are talking about. tem. And then they wrote: ‘‘Today’s Boston tried to change the inspection That is what this issue is about—the civil service has become a drag on our facility to make it safer and more effi- ability to deploy on merit, when lives national security. The morass of rules, cient. But there was a union work rule are at stake, instead of seniority. We regulation, and bureaucracy prevent that said the inspection facility could are talking about the ability of agen- the Government from hiring and re- not be changed in any significant way cies to set gun policies—something taining the workforce that is required without a renegotiation of the union today they cannot do because of union to combat the threats of the future.’’ contract. So guess what. The Treasury work rules—and search policies. When What the President has proposed is employee labor union went to the we are worried about drugs getting that he have the ability to streamline FLRA and they overruled Customs. into the country or contraband of var- the process, and when it comes to a And Customs was not able to change ious kinds, maybe we want to say the choice between national security and the inspection facility. union work rules are more important the status quo in the Government sys- Look, maybe when you are talking than the search policy. So you have to tem, the status quo must yield. When about trying to keep drugs out of the go to FLRA to renegotiate with the it comes down to union work rules, country or illegal aliens, those work union and spend 18 months doing it. business as usual, or the life and safety rules are more important. But when of our citizens, the President says that But if lives are at stake, and we are you are talking about lives, are they talking about a nuclear weapon getting the system has to yield. Civil service more important? If we can increase the rights are important, but they are not into New York Harbor, surely people probability of keeping chemical or bio- see the difference. These are the kinds as important as the right of Americans logical or nuclear weapons from com- to life and freedom. When our people’s of things we are talking about. ing in through an airport in America lives are at stake, business as usual in Let me try to sum up where we are by changing the inspection facility, are Washington has to yield. and what the issue is. We are divided we supposed to wait around 18 months The substitute that Senator MILLER almost perfectly along partisan lines and I have offered prohibits the ability to negotiate with the union about the with the exception of one Member on to discriminate on the basis of race, ability to change the room in which each side. Is preserving this old horse- color, creed, national origin, and arbi- the workers are working? Some of our and-buggy system from the 1950s—that trary and capricious factors, but allows colleagues think so, but I do not think was designed primarily to protect the President the flexibility to hire so. I do not believe the American peo- workers, not to get the job done—more without waiting 6 months, to fire with- ple think so. important than enhancing the prob- Let me give another example. You all out waiting 18 months, to eliminate a ability that we can protect lives? I say remember Barry McCaffrey, the gen- system where 99 percent of Govern- no. Some others say yes. That is the eral who was appointed by President ment employees get pay raises whether issue. Clinton to be drug czar. He made note they received good evaluations or not. It ends up being contentious because I am not saying one side is right and in the San Francisco Examiner about we cannot have it both ways. You can’t one side is wrong. Obviously, I believe the different work rules of the different serve two masters. You have to make a the President is right, and I believe my Government agencies that were pro- choice, and the choice I choose is na- Democrat colleagues, other than Sen- tecting America’s borders: tional security. ator MILLER—and maybe some I don’t Officials at one agency were actually for- Madam President, how much time know about—are wrong. Obviously, I bidden to open the trunks of cars, a policy have I used? well known to drug dealers. believe that or I would not be standing The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen- up here. My opinion does not make Look, maybe it makes sense to some ator has used 27 minutes. their position morally inferior to my people that a union work rule says peo- Mr. GRAMM. Madam President, I ask position. The division is about what is ple working for this agency or in this for 10 minutes off the leader time. more important. classification can not open a trunk at a The PRESIDING OFFICER. Is there That is what the division is about. border inspection, and so dope gets into objection? Hearing no objection, it is You have powerful concerns on both the country or an illegal alien gets into so ordered. sides. You have the concern of national the country. But if it is a nuclear Mr. GRAMM. This time would not security and you have the concern of weapon, does it make sense? Do we count toward our hour. Government employees, one of the really think preserving that work rule Madam President, Senator MILLER most powerful political constituencies that General McCaffrey pointed out and I have spent 4 weeks listening and in America. was being gamed by drug dealers—do participating in this debate. We have I am not saying they are wrong and we really believe that is more impor- looked at the House bill, a bill that the we are right. I am saying we disagree tant than keeping a nuclear weapon President says he would sign. We have and we disagree almost perfectly along from getting into the United States? looked at the President’s proposal, a party lines and we have to make a That is the issue we are debating. I bill the President would sign. And we choice. You cannot be for the primacy could go down the list and go on and have looked at the bill before us, a bill of existing work rules of the Federal on. In terms of deployment of the Bor- the President has said he would veto. I Government and be for the primacy of der Patrol special task forces, the do not know how we promote homeland national security. You have to make a union work rule says you cannot de- security by giving the President a bill decision. ploy somebody where there is not a he would veto. I have made my choice. My choice is, barber shop, a place of worship, or a We have made some 25 changes in the when Government work rules impede dry cleaners. If we are just trying to President’s proposal. Quite frankly, the

VerDate Sep 04 2002 23:54 Sep 25, 2002 Jkt 099060 PO 00000 Frm 00012 Fmt 4624 Sfmt 0634 E:\CR\FM\G25SE6.033 S25PT1 September 25, 2002 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD — SENATE S9191 President has compromised more than defend. I would hate to have to go back efficient manner possible this part of I would have compromised had I been to Mexia and stand up in front of the the Federal Government when the goal in his position. But the President print shop of my dear friend Dicky is to protect the lives and safety of our wants to try to work on a bipartisan Flatt and explain to people that we are people? That, I think, is the choice. basis, and he wants this bill because going to take some of power the Presi- Final point: Senator MILLER and I lives are at stake. dent has to protect us and we are going have worked hard with the White We have limited, very narrowly lim- to do it in a bill that is supposed to be House for 4 weeks to provide what we ited, the President’s power to use his responding to the death of thousands of believe is a compromise. It is the first emergency waiver in civil service. We our citizens in Washington and New real compromise that has been pro- have limited it by setting out param- York. posed, in my opinion. We want a vote eters which he cannot violate in terms Maybe you can make that sale in on it. There is going to be an effort of his personnel flexibility. We have Mexia. But I cannot. I am not that later by people on the other side of the adopted some 95 percent of the good at it. I am talking about political issue to defy us that vote by amending Lieberman bill. We have adopted provi- ability. I could not make that sale, and our bill in these two critical areas so sions of the House bill that represented I don’t believe anybody else can make we never get an up-or-down vote on the bipartisan consensus. And we have that sale in Mexia. Maybe they can President’s program. talked to some 25 Members of the Sen- make that somewhere else. I don’t I am not crying foul by saying it is ate and we have adopted some 18 meas- think they can make that sale in against the Senate rules to do that. I ures that have been influenced by Young and Harris Counties, either. am not saying it is wrong to do it in Members. The President has said this But that is the first issue. What we terms of the way the Senate operates. is as far as he can go. have gotten from our colleagues on the I am saying I think the President de- What does that mean? Is it as far as other side of this issue is a series of serves an up-or-down vote on his pro- he can go because he is mad about proposals that all boil down to one gram. If you want to vote no, you have something? Is it as far as he can go be- thing: The power of the unions, and the the right to vote no. But don’t you cause he is tired of the Democrats power of doing it the same old way it think we ought to let the President being successful, the Democrat leader- has been done since the 1950s will be have an opportunity to have his pro- ship being successful in stopping him preserved, and the power of the Presi- gram voted on in the way he would like from doing what he wants? No. The dent in the name of national security to see it voted on? President has said this is as far as he When that amendment is offered, we can go because he does not believe that will be reduced. That is the first major issue where are going to use our rights under the he can effectively do the job if he gives we are at an impasse. We have lan- Senate rules to hold out for a vote on up any more power. He doesn’t believe guage now that was written by the our substitute. I believe in the end we if he gives up more power that he is Public Employee Labor Union. It was will get it. I am sure some people on getting the tools he needs to fight and the other side of the aisle will stand up win the war on terrorism. And I agree offered in the House. It was rejected in the House. Yet that is being proposed and say, you are delaying, you are de- with him. I think he is right. laying, you are doing this, you are What are the issues we come to? The once again. The answer is no. I don’t know what part of that old country and doing that. biggest issue we come down to is the All we want is to vote. We have about western song they do not understand, issue I have already talked about at 40 Members of the Senate who want to What part of ‘‘no’’ don’t you under- great lengths, and that is the issue of speak on it. They want to be heard. stand? But the answer is no. letting the President keep the powers They will be heard. But, in the end, the The second issue is: When lives are that every President since Jimmy President is going to be heard. In the on the line, should the President have Carter has had. The Lieberman bill end, the people are going to be heard. the ability to hire people and have the takes away power to declare a national We want an up-or-down vote on the flexibility to do it without waiting 6 emergency and to take extraordinary President’s program. action that President Carter had, that months? Should he have the power if I hope we are going to win. If we President Reagan had, that President somebody comes to work drunk in a don’t win, then we are going to be in a Bush had, and that President Clinton national security department to fire situation of trying to pass a bill the had. The President has said he is not him without having to go through 18 President will veto, and maybe we will going to let power that he had on Sep- months of rigmarole? I think the an- have to wait until after the election tember 11 be taken away in a bill that swer is yes. I think the answer is yes. and try again. That will mean that for is supposed to be responding to Sep- But, obviously, the people on the other 3 months we are not going to have the tember 11. side of this issue think the answer is program in effect to protect national Interestingly enough, the President no. security. I think that is a risk. As a re- has offered a compromise where he will Those are the two issues. You might sult, I want us to pass a bill. do things that President Clinton did say this is a great big, old, thick bill, I don’t think any Member of the Sen- not have to do when he used that and you sent a great big, old, thick ate can stand up and say they wanted power. He will have to notify Congress amendment. to talk about this issue but Senator in advance, he will have to make public Let me make it clear. I sent that MILLER, Senator THOMPSON, or I have a declaration as to why he did what he amendment for myself, for Senator not been willing to try to work this did and his justification, something MILLER, for Senator THOMPSON, for the thing out. But so far, we have seen no that President Clinton did not have to President, and for some 40 Members of effort to work it out. So far it has been do. That is how much our President the Senate. That was our best effort at that we are going to take power away wants to get this job done. But has a real compromise where the President from the President, and if you don’t that been met by reasonable com- gave up powers he really, honestly to like it, that is all right. Well, we don’t promise on the other side? No. God, believes he needs. But he did it to like it, and it is not all right. It is not We have a bill before us that takes try to solve this problem and to get going to happen. that power away from the President. this Department established and to get Ultimately, the debate ends here and That is not going to happen. It is just on with defending national security. the public has to make a decision. Is not going to happen. We are not going The terrorists are not waiting for this a partisan issue? God knows that to let it happen. The world may come this debate. I don’t know what they are it should not be partisan. But, if you to an end, but we are not going to take doing. But it scares me. define partisan as being divided rough- powers away from this President that When you look at these great big, ly along party lines, it is a partisan four other Presidents have had when thick bills, we are really apart only on issue. It shouldn’t be. I don’t want it to we are trying to fight and win a war on two issues. What should come first? be. There are many people on the other terrorism. It is just not going to hap- Business as usual, or national security? side of the aisle who don’t want it to pen. And should the President have the be, but it is. The idea that it should be asked for power when lives are at stake to hire, In saying that, it is simply telling is an idea that I would hate to have to to promote, and to operate in the most the truth. It is a terrible indictment of

VerDate Sep 04 2002 23:54 Sep 25, 2002 Jkt 099060 PO 00000 Frm 00013 Fmt 4624 Sfmt 0634 E:\CR\FM\G25SE6.036 S25PT1 S9192 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD — SENATE September 25, 2002 us, a terrible indictment of the Senate, I think Senator LIEBERMAN and the Senator hear, as I did, the direct but it is telling the truth. members of the committee have shown quotes that they wanted a strategy for I yield the floor. good faith from the start. We have the campaigns that dealt with the war? The PRESIDING OFFICER. Who come to the floor day after weary day, Did the Senator hear that? yields time? many times with absolutely nothing Mr. DURBIN. Yes, I did. Mr. LIEBERMAN. Madam President, happening, except the threat of an- Mr. REID. That didn’t seem to say I yield to the Senator from Illinois other filibuster. And here we stand. anything about homeland security, did such time as he requires. Here we stand this day without the De- it? The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen- partment of Homeland Security bill Mr. DURBIN. Not a bit. It suggested ator from Illinois. passing the Senate. I think it is unfor- to me, I say to the Senator from Ne- Mr. DURBIN. Thank you, Madam tunate. I think it is sad. vada, coming back to this bill, when we President. And I thank the chairman of Earlier, the Senator from Texas said: go to the merits of this debate, let’s be the Governmental Affairs Committee, Now, some of those who spoke earlier, very honest about what this concerns. Senator LIEBERMAN. such as Senator DASCHLE, Senator This is a question about moving some Let me say for the record, this bill— BYRD, and Senator INOUYE, about their 150,000 or 170,000 employees of the Fed- the creation of a Department of Home- concern over the President’s state- eral Government under a new roof land Security—is a bill that has had ments that raised a question as to called the Department of Homeland Se- two births. whether the Democrat-controlled Sen- curity. I support it. I supported it when It was first born in our committee ate was, in fact, committed to the se- Senator LIEBERMAN offered it. I sup- under Senator LIEBERMAN’s leadership curity of America—the Senator from ported it when the President suggested before President Bush proposed its cre- Texas said: Understand, he was not re- it. I still support it. ation. We worked for the creation of ferring to the war on Iraq. He was only But the question before us today is, this Department—believing the con- referring to this bill, the Department for 40,000 or 50,000 of these employees, cept was sound—to bring together, in of Homeland Security. when they come under that new roof, reorganization, agencies that are nec- Well, I am glad the Senator from will they bring with them collective essary to protect America. Texas made the distinction. But it does bargaining rights that they have had, When we had a vote in the Govern- not allay my fears that what we have have earned, have worked for, perhaps, mental Affairs Committee on Senator emerging is partisanship when it comes all of their adult lives? LIEBERMAN’s proposal, I was happy to to the security of America and the There are those who argue—and you support it, but not a single Republican rhetoric that is coming out of the cam- have heard it from the Senator from member of the committee supported it. paign forces, the campaign machine of Texas—once they come into this new Not 2 weeks later, President Bush the White House. It is no comfort to Department, we can’t afford to run the came forward and said: I now support a me to be told: Oh, they are just ques- risk that someone who belongs to a Department of Homeland Security. tioning your patriotism when it comes labor union can really rise to the chal- And Senator LIEBERMAN said: We will to the war on terrorism, not on the war lenge of defending America. work with you. Let us put together a on Iraq. I am sorry, that is unaccept- Pardon me, Madam President. Do I plan to bring it forward in a bipartisan able. recall correctly those profiles in cour- fashion because, harkening back to an When September 11 occurred last age of September 11, 2001, of which so earlier statement on this floor: There year, President Bush did not even have many of us are so proud? Did you stop is no partisanship when it comes to to make the appeal to Congress. Within and think for a moment that those protecting America or its security or hours, Congress came together on a bi- New York firefighters, going up those its freedom. partisan basis. We came together and stairs in those burning buildings to res- Senator LIEBERMAN, working with not only sang ‘‘God Bless America,’’ we cue people did not know—complete Senator THOMPSON, tried to bring out a also came together, within a few days, strangers—doing their duty to their bill, a bipartisan bill, to address the to give this President the authority country, meeting the duty of their pro- President’s concern about a Depart- and resources he needed to wage the fession—did we stop and reflect, for a ment of Homeland Security. I think we war on terrorism. moment, that they were carrying, per- have done a good job. I think we have There was never any question that haps in their wallet, next to the pic- brought this bill to the floor in good this Nation would stand together— ture of their family, a union card? Did faith. We had a lengthy hearing, many Democrats, Republicans, and Independ- anyone question their patriotism, their witnesses. Amendments were consid- ents—and we did, as did Capitol Hill. loyalty to our country, their devotion ered; some adopted and some rejected. We have stood with this President. to so many people? The orderly process of Congress was For those who are trying to fire up Oh, and yet today we hear speech followed. My hat is off to Senator the campaign rhetoric for this coming after speech: We just can’t run the risk LIEBERMAN for his leadership. election, questioning the patriotism of of letting people who are members of But to think we have spent 4 straight anyone in the Senate who would even labor unions in this situation, public weeks on the floor of this Senate un- offer an amendment to the Department employees—— able to bring this bill to closure is of Homeland Security bill goes too far. Mr. GRAMM. Will the Senator yield? clear evidence that there are people on Whether this questioning of patriotism If the Senator is going to quote me, he this floor who do not want to see this is over the war on terrorism or the war ought to do it accurately. bill passed in any form. on Iraq, it is entirely inappropriate. It Mr. DURBIN. Madam President, I ask When the Senator from Texas comes is an afront to the many veterans in that order be restored in the Senate. up and says: Well, you have to under- this Senate on both sides. It is an The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen- stand, we are going to bring an amend- afront to many of us who believe this ator from Illinois has the floor. ment, and a few of our colleagues country is something we hold dear, and Mr. REID. Will the Senator yield for would like to speak on it on the floor, who try, in every single vote we cast, a question? perhaps 40 Senators would like to to keep that in mind. Mr. DURBIN. I yield to the Senator speak on it on the floor—well, be pre- Mr. REID. Will the Senator yield for from Nevada for a question. pared, that just means a filibuster by a question? Mr. REID. The Senator would agree, another name. Mr. DURBIN. I am happy to yield to would he not, that the debate over this It means, frankly, there are forces at the Senator for a question. labor issue is one that we should have, work on this floor that do not want to Mr. REID. Did the Senator hear the and it has nothing to do with patriot- see this bill passed. They want to drag statement of Senator DASCHLE, the ma- ism? I see on the floor one of the spon- it out not 4 weeks or 6 weeks but 8 jority leader, today? sors of the amendment, the Senator weeks and beyond. They have some Mr. DURBIN. Yes, I did. from Georgia, who is a distinguished other agenda other than giving the Mr. REID. Did the Senator hear the American. He has written a book about President a Department of Homeland statement of the Presidential pollster, the Marine Corps. No one can question Security. That is unfortunate. and also that of Karl Rove? And did the his patriotism, his qualifications.

VerDate Sep 04 2002 01:13 Sep 26, 2002 Jkt 099060 PO 00000 Frm 00014 Fmt 4624 Sfmt 0634 E:\CR\FM\G25SE6.038 S25PT1 September 25, 2002 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD — SENATE S9193 Wouldn’t you agree a debate on from Texas? Do you have any idea? Let’s decide where the will of the Sen- labor-management relations is some- They were fired from their jobs for tes- ate is going. Don’t be afraid of the will thing we should have, and it has noth- tifying before Congress, terminated of Senate. Don’t be afraid of the will of ing to do with patriotism? from their employment. Of course, the people. Don’t be afraid to say that I have listened to the Senator from there was a hearing because they had collective bargaining does not dis- Georgia and how strongly he feels collective bargaining rights, and these qualify people from defending America about Federal employees, and how we whistleblowers were restored to their and from serving their Nation proudly. have to change, in his opinion, the way positions. Many of the people in these agencies employees are treated. But that is an If we are going to talk about what is are veterans who have served this Na- issue, would the Senator agree, that at stake, let me tell you this. tion with pride and have risked their has nothing to do with patriotism? Mr. GRAMM. Will the Senator yield lives for the flag. To say as they come Mr. DURBIN. I agree completely with on that? to a new Department that they some- the Senator from Nevada. For the Vice Mr. DURBIN. I will after I have made how have to give up their rights to col- President, the President, or their cam- my point. The point I am making at lective bargaining is unfair. paign advisers to suggest that if we dis- this juncture is that collective bar- It has been said that it takes up to a agree on a labor-management issue in gaining rights make a difference. It is year to fire an employee under civil this new Department, we really are not not a question about how bright the service. That is a total myth. During committed to the freedom and security light is over the coffee pot for the em- their first year, employees can be ter- of America goes way too far. And I am ployees taking their break and what minated without notice, and 36 percent afraid that is the point that was raised color uniforms they are wearing. That of new employees were removed during on the floor today and needs to be re- is, I am afraid, a ridiculous extreme their probationary period in the year visited. when we look at collective bargaining 2001. Any employee can be terminated I will yield to the Senator from rights. It is the right of an individual with 30 days’ notice. Texas, if he has a question. employee at our Border Patrol to be Incidentally, in fiscal year 2000, it Mr. GRAMM. Yes. The only point I able to stand before a committee of was said that out of 1.8 million Federal was going to make is, never in my re- Congress and say: I don’t care what my employees, only 6 were fired because marks did I say anything about people boss is telling you; I don’t care what they were found incapable of doing being a member of a union. And if I am they are saying in their press release; their job; and in 2001, only 3 out of 1.8 going to be quoted—and I like to be they are not doing the job to protect million were fired. These statistics quoted; and I think it improves the America. grossly underestimate the number of Senator’s speech to quote me—I would For these Border Patrol agents to Federal employees fired each year. The like him to do it accurately. stand up and tell us the truth under Republican claim that only three peo- I never said anything about a mem- oath before a committee of Congress ple were fired in 2001 refers to the three ber of a union. I simply said that when should not be grounds for termination. employees who were immediately re- you have work rules that prevent you But they were. Thank goodness they moved for national security reasons from deploying more patrol agents had collective bargaining rights and only. In fiscal year 2001, 8,920 Federal where there is no laundry, or where their jobs were restored. I don’t believe employees were terminated and re- you are not able to change an inspec- being a member of a labor union auto- moved for disciplinary reasons. tion room without renegotiating a matically qualifies you to be ready to The fact is, under civil service, em- union contract, and lives are at stake, fight for our Nation’s security and be ployees can be removed. The fact is, there needs to be some give. That is all involved in intelligence gathering, but under the bill that came out of the I said. I did not say anything about it certainly does not disqualify you. Governmental Affairs Committee, joining a union or never mentioned a There are good, loyal, patriotic Ameri- there is a procedure in national secu- union in terms of the right of people to cans who have collective bargaining rity for the President to make that de- belong to it or their union membership rights. termination. That is an issue. or lack thereof having any relevance to Make no mistake, the bill reported to I respect the Senator from Texas and do with this whatsoever. the Senate gives this President the au- the Senator from Georgia for what Mr. DURBIN. I thank the Senator thority, which he needs; if any indi- they are bringing as a substitute meas- from Texas, but that is a distinction vidual employee, because of their new ure. Let me tell you this: They are without a difference. To say, on one job assignments or because of the sen- leaving out some very critical ele- hand, I am not against labor unions, I sitivity of their assignments, needs to ments of the bill brought out of the am just against collective bargaining be removed from a bargaining unit, Governmental Affairs Committee. rights, is to get to the heart of the there is a way to do it, a legitimate, After September 11 of last year, I fo- issue. honest way. That is the point we are cused on one particular issue that trou- Let me give you an illustration that debating. To suggest that that has bled me. I learned in the months lead- makes my point. something to do with love of America ing up to it of the gross inadequacy of After September 11, 2001, we discov- and patriotism—I don’t see it. the information technology of the ered that most of the terrorists respon- What we have before us and what agencies of our Government relating to sible for the World Trade Center were concerns the Senator from Texas is, we law enforcement and intelligence, the coming over the northern border of the have a bipartisan group that has come FBI being the classic example of an United States from Canada. We said together and said: We have come up agency dealing with the most primitive that we were going to beef up efforts at with a compromise. Let’s deal with it. technology. the border to check people coming in As Senator Bumpers of Arkansas I have worked for over a year to try so that others did not come in to used to say: The Senator from Texas to bring modernization of computers threaten the United States. This ad- hates this bipartisan compromise like and information technology into intel- ministration said it. The Border Patrol the devil hates holy water. He is afraid ligence gathering and law enforcement. said it. And do you know what. We did if we bring this to the floor and get a I have spoken to everyone—Attorney not do it. Two Border Patrol agents vote supporting the bipartisan posi- General Ashcroft, FBI Director came forward and testified before a tion, all of his arguments and the Mueller, the Vice President, as well as committee of Congress that it was all President’s arguments are weakened the President of the United States— talk, we weren’t putting the resources and disappear. That is what concerns about what I consider to be one of the and the manpower in the right place to him about this process and why he is glaring examples of our inability to protect America after September 11, promising 40 Senators who will speak deal with terrorism. 2001. interminably and drag this bill on for As a result, I prepared and offered an These were Federal employees, mem- another 4 weeks. amendment which was on the Govern- bers of labor unions with collective If the President needs a Department mental Affairs bill that came to the bargaining rights. Do you know what of Homeland Security—and I believe he floor and is still pending today. This happened to them, I ask the Senator does—let’s have this up-or-down vote. amendment establishes that at the

VerDate Sep 04 2002 23:54 Sep 25, 2002 Jkt 099060 PO 00000 Frm 00015 Fmt 4624 Sfmt 0634 E:\CR\FM\G25SE6.041 S25PT1 S9194 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD — SENATE September 25, 2002 Federal Government level, we will different ways, who are proud to have port, the Immigration and Naturaliza- start blending together the computer these collective bargaining rights and tion Service was worried about a surge architecture of different agencies of be members of labor unions. in flights and the long lines, and they the Federal Government so that they Before we adopt this substitute, con- wanted to hire more INS agents to en- are not only modern but they are inter- sider the elements it does not include. force the law. operable, so they can communicate One of the elements is the fact that it The American Federation of Govern- with one another, pass information does not deal with the information ment Employees filed a complaint with along. If the FBI has a most wanted technology that is essential to fighting the National Labor Relations Board list or danger list, they can pass that a war on terrorism in the 21st century. saying, under their contract, INS could along to the Federal Aviation Adminis- Their bill is silent on what I consider not hire more agents without renegoti- tration and the Immigration and Natu- to be one of the most important ele- ating its union contract. Guess what. ralization Service. ments of this war and one of the most The National Labor Relations Board I am sorry to report that does not important weapons we can use to bring ruled in favor of the union, prohibiting exist today. I worked long and hard on it to a successful conclusion. the people from being hired. this amendment. It had the support of I yield the floor. The Senator talks about a vote. I ask all of my colleagues on the Govern- The PRESIDING OFFICER. Who unanimous consent that on Friday mental Affairs Committee. They be- yields time? morning at 10 o’clock, we have an up- lieve, as I do, that this is a critical ele- Mr. LIEBERMAN. Madam President, or-down vote on the substitute I have ment in the defense of America. I yield myself a moment or two or as offered with Senator MILLER. That But the substitute amendment being much time as I require. I will yield in way, there will be no doubt about the offered by the Senator from Texas a moment so Senator MILLER may fact we are ready to bring it to a vote doesn’t include this provision. They speak. at that point. We would like an up-or- While he was on the floor, I wanted have decided it is unnecessary, or at down vote on our amendment at 10 to thank Senator DURBIN for the sub- least they have not addressed it. I sin- o’clock. stantial contribution he made to the cerely hope they will at least recon- Mr. LIEBERMAN. Objection. committee’s proposal for a Department The PRESIDING OFFICER. Objec- sider that if we do bring this forward of Homeland Security overall and the tion is heard. and this substitute becomes the bill we specific, unique, very valuable proposal Mr. GRAMM. Madam President, the are going to amend, they could intro- he made regarding information tech- point I want to make—and I am sorry duce a motion of cloture, for example, nology. I had to put our colleague in a position raise germaneness questions. This is really a key to all sorts of ac- like that to object. If we don’t include it, some element tivities in our world today, including Mr. DURBIN. Will the Senator yield? of information technology in a Depart- homeland security; the ability to inter- Mr. GRAMM. I will yield, but the ment of Homeland Security, we are connect levels of our government, dif- point I want to make is we want an up- fooling ourselves. We are saying we are ferent agencies that will be part of the or-down vote on our amendment. This creating a new Department that has a new Department and Federal, State, is the President’s substitute, and the brandnew nameplate on the door with county, and local governments. I ap- President’s supporters should have a 170,000 employees but with computers preciate it. chance to speak on it. We have gone on that are inadequate to the job. Senator GRAMM and I have had dis- for 4 weeks on this bill, not because of When I spoke to Gov. Tom Ridge cussions, and at some point, as the what supporters of the President have about this amendment, he said: I sup- most controversial parts of this discus- done, but because we have had amend- port this. It is a force multiplier. That sion work their way to either an agree- ments offered, probably 90 percent of means it takes the existing resources ment or the Senate works its will, I that time taken up by people who do of our Government and makes them hope we can sit and talk about sections not support the President’s position. that much more effective in fighting of our committee bill, such as Senator That is where we are. terrorism. DURBIN’s, which are not partisan; they I will be happy to yield to the Sen- The substitute offered by the Senator are good Government, with a capital G, ator. from Texas does not include that. That good. We ought to be able to reach a bi- Mr. LIEBERMAN. Will the Senator is sad. partisan agreement to include that in yield for a question? Frankly, it may be a political victory Mr. GRAMM. Yes. whatever Department of Homeland Se- for his substitute to prevail, but it will Mr. LIEBERMAN. Madam President, curity we create. not be a victory in the war against ter- of course, we want to have a vote on I yield the floor. rorism. We should put the weapons in The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen- the substitute amendment. What is the place, the arsenal we need to protect ator from Georgia. basis for denying Senators the normal America on a bipartisan basis, looking Mr. GRAMM. Madam President, will privilege, which the Senator from not only to employees of the Depart- the Senator yield for 2 minutes? I do Texas has exercised and utilized on so ment but also the resources and tech- not want the Senator to lose the floor. many occasions, to offer a second-de- nology available in the Department. Mr. MILLER. I yield. gree amendment to his substitute so It has been made clear on this floor Mr. GRAMM. Madam President, I the Senate can work its will, dispose of that when it comes to the security of would like to make a couple responses. it, and then go to an up-or-down vote? the Nation, there should not be any First, let me give you the actual fig- Mr. GRAMM. The question is a to- partisanship whatsoever. We can stand ures of people being fired from the Fed- tally fair question. As I said earlier, here as Americans and Members of the eral Government. There are 1.8 million people have a right to offer amend- Senate and debate the provisions of people on the Federal payroll. In the ments, but the point is, this is the this bill and others, and no one should year 2001, three of them were fired out- President’s best effort to reach a com- call into question our patriotism. right. The previous administration, the promise with the Senator and with There is no reason we should take Clinton administration, found that those who oppose his proposal, and he the roles and lives of 40,000 or 50,000 64,340 Federal workers were poor per- would like to have an up-or-down vote new employees of this Department and formers. on his compromise as we have written say it is basically going to be impos- Mr. DURBIN. Will the Senator yield it, not as it would be rewritten by oth- sible for them to serve their Nation for a question? ers. The Senator has every right to and to have their rights as employees Mr. GRAMM. Let me finish my point. offer an amendment. We have every respected. We can do both. They have Only 434 of them went through the re- right to resist it and not let the Sen- already proven we can do both. To try moval process, and that process takes ator have a vote on it. But we would to eliminate their rights to collective as long as 18 months, and many of like at some point to have people vote bargaining or to reduce them dramati- them remained on the payroll. That is yes or no on the President’s proposal. cally to a point where they are mean- the first point. That is all. ingless is unfair to the men and women The second point, the Senator talks Mr. LIEBERMAN. Madam President, who have served us so well in so many about INS. In 1990, at the Honolulu Air- in responding, I want the record to

VerDate Sep 04 2002 23:54 Sep 25, 2002 Jkt 099060 PO 00000 Frm 00016 Fmt 4624 Sfmt 0634 E:\CR\FM\G25SE6.043 S25PT1 September 25, 2002 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD — SENATE S9195 show—and I yield myself a moment that is for another day—but I rise to lem for the 21st century, especially more—we are fully prepared to have an speak on the homeland security sub- when this country is threatened in up-or-down vote on Senator GRAMM’s stitute that Senators GRAMM, THOMP- such a different and sinister way. substitute, but after we have the right SON, and I, and about 40 other Senators, I do not want to belabor the point to offer an amendment. That is the have sponsored that the President says about how long it takes to hire a per- way the Senate works. That is why I he supports and will sign. son or how long it takes to fire a per- objected. We do not teach our children the les- son. I just know it is too long. I also Mr. GRAMM. There is the rub. I yield sons of Aesop’s Fables as much any- know that a Federal worker can be to the Senator. more. The wisdom of Sesame Street caught knee-walking drunk and he can- Mr. DURBIN. Madam President, I and the Cat in the Hat have taken not be fired for 30 days, and then he has thank the Senator from Texas. Is the their place. There is one fable I learned endless appeals. Productivity should be Senator from Texas aware of the fact at my mother’s knee, sitting around an the name of the game, and we lose pro- he is mistaken again in saying only 3 open fireplace, that I believe is perti- ductivity when we have such a law. Federal employees out of 1.8 million nent to this debate on homeland secu- That is no way to wage a war. were terminated, when the official fig- rity that has so divided this Senate Do we not realize there is another ures show in fiscal year 2001, 8,920 Fed- along party lines. disaster looming just around the cor- eral employees were terminated, and in It goes like this: A certain man had ner, where American lives are going to fiscal year 2000, 8,400 Federal employ- several sons who were always quar- be lost? And another one after that? ees were fired for reasons related to reling with one another, and try as he And that those attacks against Ameri- poor performance? Is the Senator might, he could not get them to live cans and against our country will aware of those numbers? together in harmony. So he was deter- occur for the rest of our lives? Would Mr. GRAMM. Let me respond— mined to convince them of their folly. anyone dare suggest that is not going Mr. DURBIN. Let me complete my Bidding them fetch a bundle of sticks, to happen? Would anyone suggest 9/11 question and then I will sit down. Is he he invited each in turn to break it was some kind of isolated phenomenon aware, as he continues to use the INS across his knee. All tried and all failed. never to happen on American soil example at the Honolulu Airport, that Then he undid the bundle and handed again? Surely no one, even the most after the ruling he referred to, they did them the sticks one at a time, which naive optimist, believes that. Surely no work out differences with the workers they had no difficulty at all in break- one in this body believes that. and established the 9 p.m. to 5 a.m. ing. Over 60,000 terrorists worldwide have graveyard shift once they worked out There, my boys, said he. United you already been identified. Terrorist cells negotiations? will be more than a match for your en- in some unlikely places, such as Mr. GRAMM. Does the Senator know emies, but if you quarrel and separate, Lackawanna, NY, have been discov- how long it took to work it out? your weakness will put you at the ered. They are all around us, they are Mr. DURBIN. I am sure the time it mercy of all those who attack you. everywhere, and when these other at- took for the lawsuit. It took a long That is a lesson for today. That is a tacks come, as certainly they will, do time. lesson for the ages. That is a lesson for Mr. GRAMM. While they were work- you not think Americans throughout this Senate and the House, for Demo- ing it out, what if somebody brought a this great land are going to look back crats and Republicans, for the execu- chemical weapon in to Hawaii where at what went on at this time in the tive and legislative branches of Gov- my kinfolk live. What if they had been Senate? And when they do, do you not ernment. I am one of the most junior killed? think some hard questions and some I am constantly capable of mis- Members of this body. I do not have the terrible second-guessing will take stating facts and figures. I always tell experience and I have not seen the place? my children: Do not get into a debate number of bills most other Members I can hear them now. The talk show about facts, look them up. All I am have, so my historical perspective, ad- lines will be clogged, and the blame saying is, the facts I have—and I do mittedly, is limited. But in the short will be heaped on this body. Why was have as much faith in mine as anybody time I have been here, I have never the Senate so fixated on protecting else’s—say the Clinton administration seen such a clear choice as there is on jobs instead of protecting lives? found 64,340 Federal workers to be poor this issue. The Senate’s refusal to grant this performers; 434 went through the proc- For me, there are no shades of gray. President and future Presidents the ess to be terminated, and that can take It is clear cut. Why, in the name of same power four previous Presidents as long as 18 months. homeland security, do we want to take have had will haunt those who do so, Maybe it does not matter unless the power away from the President like Marley’s ghost haunted Ebenezer somebody’s life is at stake. That is all that he possessed on 9/11? It is power Scrooge. They will ask: Why did they I am saying. If somebody’s life is at Jimmy Carter had, power Ronald put workers’ rights above Americans’ stake, you do not do business as usual. Reagan had, power the first President lives? Why did that 2002 Senate, on the You can defend business as usual, but Bush had, and power Bill Clinton had. 1-year anniversary of 9/11, with malice when it puts somebody’s life at stake, Do we really want to face the voters and forethought, deliberately weaken when a man, woman, or child has their with that position, that vote written the powers of the President in time of life at stake, business as usual is not large on our foreheads like a scarlet war? And then, why did this Senate, in usual. I think there is some urgency letter, and even larger on a 36-inch tel- all its vainglory, rear back and deliver here. That is all I am saying. I am not evision ad two weeks before the elec- the ultimate slap in the face of the trying to indict any of these work rules tion? President by not even giving him the or say they are crazy. I would hate to We must give the President the flexi- decency to have an up-or-down vote on have to run my business under these bility to respond to terrorism on a mo- his own proposal? This is unworthy of work rules. I would go broke. All I am ment’s notice. He has to be able to this great body. It is demeaning, ugly, saying is, when people’s lives are at shift resources, including personnel, at and over the top. stake, there is some urgency. I yield the blink of an eye. When the Civil What were they thinking of, they back to the Senator from Georgia. Service was created well over a century will ask? What could have possessed The PRESIDING OFFICER (Mrs. ago, it had a worthy goal, to create a them? Do not ask then for whom the CARNAHAN). The Senator from Georgia. professional workforce free of cro- bell tolls. It will toll for us. Mr. MILLER. Madam President, how nyism. Back then, it was valid. But all Few leaders have understood the les- much time is remaining for our side of too often in Government, we pass laws sons of history as well as Winston the argument? to fix the problems of the moment and Churchill because he was not only a The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen- then we keep those laws on the books soldier and a politician, but he was also ator has 231⁄2 minutes. for years without ever following up to a Nobel Prize-winning historian. Per- Mr. MILLER. I thank the Chair. see if they are still needed. haps then at this time we should re- Madam President, I rise to speak not The truth of the matter is a solution member the question Churchill framed on the subject of the war against Iraq— for the 19th century is posing a prob- to the world when he made that famous

VerDate Sep 04 2002 23:54 Sep 25, 2002 Jkt 099060 PO 00000 Frm 00017 Fmt 4624 Sfmt 0634 E:\CR\FM\G25SE6.046 S25PT1 S9196 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD — SENATE September 25, 2002 Iron Curtain speech at Fulton, MO, at think we do. And some of us do. A town ating a Department of Homeland Secu- Westminster College in 1946. He first hall meeting here, a senior center rity, consulting with Members on both reminded the audience: there, a focus group or two, but we sides, working with the White House, War and tyranny remain the great enemies don’t really. We do not talk to real to have what is, for the most part, a bi- of mankind. people anymore. We are too busy in partisan piece of legislation. Then he asked this question: that room dialing up dollars. The only Senators have spoken this morning Do we not understand what war means to horror we can grasp from that experi- about the Senate being divided on this the ordinary person? Can you not grasp its ence is some fat cat telling us that he bill. The fact is, the Senate is not di- horror? is already maxed out. vided on this bill. The Gramm-Miller Some of the remarks earlier this Why are we even in this debate? How substitute, by Senator GRAMM’s own morning on this floor reminded me of will it be recorded in years to come reckoning, is 95 percent the same as something else about that speech and when the historians write their ac- our Senate Governmental Affairs Com- its aftermath. Churchill, being so counts of the days of a Senate in Sep- mittee bill. And it ought to be. We blunt, did not go over very well. The tember of 2002? How will our actions be have a common ground desire to go American media and others did not judged by the people who go to the ahead and create a Department of want to hear that kind of talk. They polls this year on November 5? Frank- Homeland Security. called Winston Churchill a warmonger, ly, I think it will be one of our sorriest We have a few areas we disagree on, and even the usually gutsy Harry Tru- chapters, certainly the worst time in the most significant of which, the most man denied knowing in advance what my short time here, a chapter where controversial of which, is the one that was in the speech and even suggested special interests so brazenly triumphed the Senator from Georgia has focused that Churchill should not give it. national interests. on. But I cannot let stand the question The old soldier went on and said Herodotus, who lived in Athens in that somehow the committee bill, sup- some other very sensible and thought- the 4th century B.C., is usually called ported by nine Democrats and three provoking things in that speech, like the father of history. He wrote about Republicans—Senator STEVENS, Sen- war used to be squalid and glorious, the Persian wars, and about the Battle ator VOINOVICH, Senator COLLINS— but now war is only squalid. of Marathon, which later historians somehow puts the protection of Fed- I want to repeat that line that is at called the seminal event in the history eral workers ahead of national secu- the heart of what I want to say today: of freedom. Herodotus wrote that the rity. We have a different way we have Do we not understand what war means Persians lost that battle, even though tried to achieve fairness for Federal to the ordinary person? Can we not their army was bigger and better workers. We can debate that. There is grasp its horror? Has scoring points equipped, because the Persians com- a compromise achieved by Senator BEN with some labor boss become more im- mitted the sin of hubris; hubris, best NELSON, Senator CHAFEE, Senator portant than the safety of our citizens? defined as outrageous arrogance. If you BREAUX, that we will have a chance to Can you not grasp its horror? study the lessons of history, especially vote on, the amendment we want to I wonder if you would feel the same the lessons of the history of freedom, put on to this bill. However, there has way if the Golden Gate Bridge was you will find that hubris would time been so much misstatement and my- thology that has no relationship to re- brought down and 95 cars plunged into and time again bring down many other ality. the San Francisco Bay. Could we then powerful civilizations. Let me state it clearly, national se- not grasp its horror? Would we then in Hubris, outrageous arrogance, is so curity always must trump and prevail the name of homeland security still prevalent in this debate. The hubris of over any other aspect of law in the want to take powers away from the some labor bosses and their purchased cases that are described. Let me be President? partridges in a pear tree. Outrageous very specific why I say that. I will Or would you feel the same way if arrogance. What else can you call it quote the law, United States Code, that beautiful little city of New Roads, when the interests of the few are put LA, on the False River, with the Span- Title 5, collective bargaining law, sec- above the welfare of the whole coun- tion 7106(a)(2)(A) which says, first: ish moss dangling on those live oaks, try? were to go up in a mushroom cloud? Nothing in a collective-bargaining law For the rest of our lives, we will have shall effect the authority of any manage- Could you then not grasp its horror? to live with what we do on this issue. ment official of any agency in accordance We rev up our emotions so easily to Will we choose to protect the special with applicable laws to assign and direct em- fight superhighways from leveling eth- interests or will we choose to protect ployees in the agency. nic neighborhoods. So it would seem to the lives of Americans? Will we hog-tie Second, section 7106(a)(2)(B) says: me we should be able to get up the the hands of our President or give him Collective bargaining shall not effect man- same kind of rage when terrorists want the same unfettered flexibility other agers’ authority to assign work and deter- to level entire cities such as Baltimore Presidents have had before him? Do not mine the personnel by which agency oper- or Atlanta or the manicured mansions let this be one of those votes you will ations shall be conducted. of Newport, RI. If those beautiful cities look back on and ask yourselves for This is the directly relevant statute were the target of a terrorist attack, the rest of your lives, what was I section of law which will continue to could you then not grasp its horror? Or thinking? For as we are reminded in prevail and expresses the clear desire— the Space Needle in Seattle, filled with the ‘‘Rubaiyat’’ of Omar Khayyam: The I presume the desire of every Member tourists, crashing to the ground. Or a moving finger writes, and having writ, of the Senate—to give maximum au- smallpox epidemic, in days, wiping out moves on. All your piety nor wit shall thority, latitude, to managers at a completely the Twin Cities of Min- lure it back to cancel half a line, nor time of national emergency; section nesota or spreading across the forest all your tears wash out a word of it. 7106(a)(2)(D) of the United States Code, plains of South Dakota. From the I ask one last time, do we not under- Title 5, provides that collective bar- great Atlantic Ocean to the wide Pa- stand what war means to the ordinary gaining shall not affect the authority cific shore, from the Blue Ridge of Ten- person? Can we not grasp its horror? of managers ‘‘to take whatever actions nessee to Beacon Hill in Massachu- I yield the floor. may be necessary to carry out the setts, I guarantee then the country The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen- agency mission during emergencies.’’ would grasp that war is horror. And as ator from Connecticut. In an emergency situation, the agen- sure as night follows the day, when ca- Mr. LIEBERMAN. Madam President, cy has statutory authority to act im- tastrophes occur, the Senate, us, we I yield myself up to 5 minutes from my mediately. It does not have to take any will be held accountable if we fail to time. time to collectively bargain. The agen- give the President the tools to do his I will answer the question the Sen- cy actually has authority to act, even job. ator from Georgia has raised. Of course if a collective bargaining agreement Why are people back home always we understand what war means to our would ordinarily require some other ahead of the politicians? Because most country and average citizens. That is course of action. All the agency head politicians, most at our level, do not why our committee has labored so long has to do is to invoke a national emer- get out among them anymore. We and so hard to bring forth this bill cre- gency.

VerDate Sep 04 2002 23:54 Sep 25, 2002 Jkt 099060 PO 00000 Frm 00018 Fmt 4624 Sfmt 0634 E:\CR\FM\G25SE6.049 S25PT1 September 25, 2002 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD — SENATE S9197 Therefore, the claims we have heard I really deeply regret that this argu- The words ‘‘labor boss,’’ what do they in the Senate today about how union ment has been so deeply politicized. mean? It is OK to be a CEO and have contracts tie the hands of managers I am here to stand up to protect more perks than a potentate—that is with ‘‘silly union work rules’’ and America and vote for a Department of OK, we can have the imperial CEO. But about how managers cannot order em- Homeland Security. But I also have to when people organize, they are called ployees to do what is necessary to pro- stand up for those who are protecting labor bosses, as though somehow or an- tect the security of the American peo- the United States of America, our other it is the goon squad? I really re- ple in an emergency are simply not brave, our gallant Federal employees sent that. I resent that for my customs true. who are out there every day on the workers. I resent it for the postal In a Federal agency, there is no such front line wanting to do their job, workers after what happened at Brent- thing as a union work rule that im- whether they are Customs workers, in wood. The postal workers didn’t sit pairs a managers’ authority to assign the Coast Guard, the FBI, or the G men down and go on strike because we work, to direct employees, or to take at the Department of Treasury, trying failed to protect them. They showed up whatever action that manager deems to do their job. I resent that my stand- every day, and because they showed up necessary in an emergency. That is the ing up for them, to have their constitu- every day and did their job, as I say, law. That is not my opinion; that is tional right to organize, have freedom two are dead and many are sick. And United States Code Title 5. When lives of assembly, would be called arrogant we are sick at heart because it hap- are at stake in the kinds of cir- and hubris. pened to them. cumstances the Senator from Georgia I listened to an argument that said: So I am kind of tired of this. I am has described, a Federal manager can Battle? You don’t know about it. tired of the politicization of the proc- impose any changes in assignments im- You are exactly right. I have never ess. I am tired of the cynical manipula- mediately, without dealing with unions gone into battle. I do not bear the per- tion of this process. I feel as though I at all. And the unions get to bargain manent wounds of war like some of our am being set up. If we stand up for the over ways, if they choose to, to affect dear colleagues, names such as Dole workers, we are somehow or another the impact of those decisions long after and INOUYE. But I do know this. When slowing down the debate on homeland the fact. we are going to send people into battle, security. So we have some disagreements I know we are going to think long and This national leader, JOE LIEBERMAN, about the specific wording of civil serv- hard about it, because I know what it the Senator from Connecticut, has ice protections, management flexi- means. When I stand up for America, I been working on homeland security bility, collective bargaining rights. also want to stand up, not for a Depart- and an agency to do it long before the But, please, make no mistake about it, ment, but for what America believes White House has. Just like he was call- in a case of national emergency, the in. ing for a national commission to look law of the United States, unchanged by Why was it OK to have a union in Po- at what went wrong on September 11 the committee’s proposal, makes clear land that brought down the whole long before the White House. We have that national security prevails over Communist empire and not to have a been ahead of the White House, but any other section of the law and over union here? now we are going to work with the any provision of a collective bar- When our firefighters ran up into White House. gaining agreement. that burning building at the World I think we have to defeat the I yield up to 10 minutes to the Sen- Trade Center nobody asked if they Gramm-Miller amendment—put that ator from Maryland. were in the union. They didn’t look at aside and no hard feelings. I think we Mr. GRAMM. Madam President, are their clock and wonder if they were have to then move on to the Lieberman we going back and forth? We do not working to the rule. bill, pass it expeditiously to show the have to, but we normally have. When our emergency workers from world we can organize and mobilize to Mr. LIEBERMAN. In this case, be- Maryland dashed over to be part of the protect America, and then let’s get on cause I have used very little time, I mutual aid at the Pentagon, they were to the other debate related to Iraq. And want to hold it to allow the Senators mission driven. They weren’t there be- then let’s also get back on another de- from Maryland both to have the chance cause they were union members—Oops. bate, such as what is happened to the to speak. I am wrong. They were there because economy. The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen- they were union members. They be- The stock market has plummeted. It ator from Maryland. longed to a union. They belonged to a is about as bad as it was when Gerald Mr. SARBANES. Parliamentary in- union called the United States of Ford was President, in 1974. We do not quiry: How much time remains on ei- America. That is the union that they want to go there again and then need a ther side? belong to, and that is the union they Democrat to bail us out—or maybe we The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen- put first. will need a Democrat to bail us out, ator from Connecticut has 32 minutes. Why are we abusing them as if they but I don’t want to go there. I want to The Senator from Texas has 7 minutes. are the enemy? I hope we will start to stand up for this country, but I want to Mr. SARBANES. So there are 7 min- be as hard on terrorists as we are on stand up for the people who built this utes on the other side and 32 minutes these union members. It has been over country, and it is the trade union left with the Senator from Con- 1 year—where is Bin Laden? We haven’t movement. If we don’t start protecting necticut? found Bin Laden, but we are going to the protectors, to make sure they have The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen- nitpick over whether or not you have a the right equipment, the right train- ator is correct. union. ing, and also have the right legislative Mr. LIEBERMAN. So I yield up to 10 We had an anthrax killer who at- framework where they can have their minutes—let’s say I yield up to 20 min- tacked the Senate and used the post of- constitutional rights, then we have utes for both Senators from Maryland fice as a weapon. I have Marylanders other issues. as they wish to use that time. dead and I have Marylanders perma- I want to go back to the bill JOE Ms. MIKULSKI. I thank the Senator nently ill because of the anthrax killer. LIEBERMAN is presenting. I think it is from Connecticut. I know others are Let’s make sure that our workers can an excellent framework. I will go back anxious to speak. go out and do the manhunt they need to being part of the red, white, and Madam President, I rise in opposition to do, or to do the money hunt for blue party. Let’s put the politics of to the Gramm-Miller amendment. I those who fund them. Let’s not worry hard feelings behind us, let’s get Iraq rise to support the efforts of Senator about whether they belong to a union together, and let’s show America we JOE LIEBERMAN to create a framework or they don’t. They don’t hide behind can govern, and let’s show the bullies for homeland security. I had hoped, the union not to do their job. But I tell of the world we are going to take them when we were working on this legisla- you, there are those hiding behind a on. tion, we were not going to be Demo- right-wing agenda to get rid of unions God bless the Federal employees who crats or Republicans, we were going to in this country or to make unions the stand sentry every day to protect be the red, white, and blue party. And problem. America.

VerDate Sep 04 2002 23:54 Sep 25, 2002 Jkt 099060 PO 00000 Frm 00019 Fmt 4624 Sfmt 0634 E:\CR\FM\G25SE6.051 S25PT1 S9198 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD — SENATE September 25, 2002 I yield the floor. much of this flexibility. The legislation Mr. LIEBERMAN. Madam President, The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen- has the emergency flexibility in it. The I thank my colleagues from Maryland, ator from Maryland. civil service law was originally put in Senators MIKULSKI and SARBANES, for Mr. SARBANES. Madam President, I place to protect against politicizing their very eloquent and passionate and rise, first of all, to commend the very the public service. It has been adjusted compassionate statements. I appre- able chairman of the committee, the and amended over the years. ciate the way Senator SARBANES and distinguished Senator from Con- These arguments that it impedes pro- Senator MIKULSKI talked about the im- necticut, for the very fine work he has ductivity have been addressed again pulse of the people who are working for done on this legislation, particularly and again by the chairman’s com- the Federal Government. on this issue of Federal employees, and mittee. Adjustments have been made in I cited the law before which talked the care and sensitivity with which he the light of changing circumstances. about the primary status of national has struck the balance. But no one has ever come before the security. But the people, the loyal pa- Obviously, on the one hand we have committee and said we ought to take triotic Americans, does anybody really national security concerns. But as the away all of those protections which think in a case of national emergency Senator indicated in the quotes he have given us a public service with they are going to be citing subsections took right from the legislation, the ac- some integrity to it, and which is not of the collective bargaining agree- tual words of the legislation, the flexi- subject to political whim. ment? They are going to do what any bility that is necessary to deal with na- How are you going to call upon peo- American did. In fact, that is what tional security questions or emergency ple to serve above and beyond the basic they did on September 11. situations is contained in this legisla- requirements of their job description if I was in a meeting of a group of Fed- tion. Those would be stripped out by you do not treat them with some dig- eral employees who happened to be the amendment. The Gramm-Miller nity and respect? from FEMA. They rushed from where proposal would then move the balance. I don’t know. Some around here may they were to the Pentagon. A whole Really, it would eliminate the balance. find that they draw the best out of group of them were flown up to New It would provide no significant or those who work for them by sort of York. They worked long hours. They meaningful protections for the Federal beating up on them; that if you are got very little sleep for days and days. employees. sort of whipping them all the time and Obviously, the firefighters in New York In one sense it raises the question: driving them without any protections, are unionized. It is a remarkable story. What is the nature of the society we completely at your whim, that enables I don’t remember the exact number. I are trying to protect? What is the na- you to bring out of them the best re- ture of the society we are trying to talked to a battalion commander of a sponse. That has never been my experi- protect? How far are we prepared to go unit of New York firefighters a couple ence. I don’t know of any labor-man- in denying the essential freedoms and of weeks ago. He said on September 11, agement text or treatises by noted ex- essential protections in the name of when they heard about the planes hit- perts in the field who say that is the national security? Not in the reality of ting the World Trade Center, several best way to get a stellar performance national security because the Senator hundred firefighters who were off duty out of your workers. I haven’t seen from Connecticut has protected that just rushed to the scene to help. They reality. that treatise yet. In fact, the ones I weren’t thinking about a collective Their proposal would give unfettered have looked at say that is exactly the bargaining agreement. They were authority to the Executive in dealing wrong thing to do if you want to draw thinking about America and their with their employees—the very em- out a quality and stellar performance duty. These are public servants in the ployees we have to draw upon to pro- from your workers. best meaning of the term. tect the Nation and to respond to the There are a lot of very dedicated em- Mr. SARBANES. Will the Senator challenges we face. ployees across the country. I think em- yield? I want to assert in unequivocal terms ployee rights and the civil service pro- Mr. LIEBERMAN. I would be happy that, in my judgment, our Federal em- tections which we have are essential to to yield. ployees are loyal and committed work- the effective workings of our Govern- Mr. SARBANES. Given this display ers who are dedicated to providing a ment. of dedication on the part of these pub- high level of service. Legislation cre- Some come and try to portray this as lic employees, why now all of a sudden ating the new Department of Homeland some special interest. The public inter- are we seeking to take away from them Security should protect the rights of est is served by having these arrange- these basic rights and protections? those workers to engage in collective ments because those arrangements en- If someone came in and said what a bargaining and to protect their rights able us to get better people into the dismal performance we have, and, under the current civil service system public service, and to draw on them therefore, we ought to give the man- unless critical questions of national se- and their full capabilities. agement more leeway to sort of beat on curity or emergency are presented. And I rise in very strong opposition to the these people or something of that sort, those questions have been dealt with provisions in this amendment that I don’t know that I would buy that ar- carefully, skillfully, and thoughtfully have been offered by Senator GRAMM gument. But at least it would be some- by the able Senator from Connecticut. and Senator MILLER which would strip thing of an argument. I commend him for those efforts. away from our Federal employees these Instead, you have this exemplary per- I don’t understand why some are en- important collective bargaining rights formance, this manifestation of real gaged in beating up on the Federal em- and these important civil service pro- dedication. And despite that, some now ployees. Why is this happening? Have tections. In my judgment, given the are coming along and, in effect, want- the terrorist strikes driven some to balance which the chairman has al- ing to beat on people who have behaved this point? Do they not recall the Fed- ready struck on important national se- in the most extraordinary, dedicated, eral office building in Oklahoma that curity questions, to do what this and selfless fashion. was blown up by a terrorist, albeit a amendment does—taking away those Mr. LIEBERMAN. The Senator from domestic terrorist? Do they not recall bargaining rights and those civil serv- Maryland is absolutely right. There is that, and those dedicated lives that ice protections—will harm our national no justification for it. At some level, it were lost? People all across the coun- security, not help our national secu- is not only wrong, it is offensive. And I try who were working in similar office rity. It will harm our national secu- thank the Senator for his substantial buildings went back in the next morn- rity. contribution to this debate. ing to do their job on behalf of the For that reason, I very strongly op- May I ask the Chair how much time country to serve the public interest— pose the provisions that are contained is remaining on our side? all across America—despite the fact in this amendment that deal with our The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen- that some of their colleagues had just committed and dedicated Federal em- ator has 121⁄2 minutes. suffered this grievous blow. ployees. Mr. LIEBERMAN. Madam President, Why do we have this assault taking The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen- I am very pleased to see in the Cham- place? The Federal managers have ator from Connecticut. ber my friend from Hawaii, Senator

VerDate Sep 04 2002 23:54 Sep 25, 2002 Jkt 099060 PO 00000 Frm 00020 Fmt 4624 Sfmt 0634 E:\CR\FM\G25SE6.054 S25PT1 September 25, 2002 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD — SENATE S9199 AKAKA, a very significant member of and MILLER fail to provide the same Section 2302(b)(8) (relating to whistle- our committee, who has contributed level of whistleblower protection that blower protection) and all provisions of Title substantially, in so many ways, to our Federal employees have in most Fed- 5 relating to the administration or enforce- eral agencies. Although the House bill ment or any other aspect thereof, as identi- legislation that came out of com- fied in regulations prescribed by the Com- mittee. I yield the Senator up to 10 and the Gramm-Miller amendment al- mission in consultation with the Office of minutes for his statement. legedly maintain whistleblower protec- Personnel Management. The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen- tions and other merit system principles It is fair to conclude that whistle- ator from Hawaii. for employees of the new Department, blowers in the new Department do not Mr. AKAKA. I thank the Senator both allow the Secretary to waive due have the same protections as other em- from Connecticut. process procedures and the remedies an ployees in the Federal Government due Madam President. I rise to address employee needs to assert those rights. to the absence of any similar reference the amendment offered by Senators The Gramm-Miller amendment bars to the whistleblower protection en- GRAMM and MILLER as it relates to the Secretary from waiving the appli- forcement provisions of title 5 in the whistleblower protections. Contrary to cability of several chapters of title 5 House bill or in the Gramm-Miller press accounts, the Gramm-Miller covering a variety of civil service amendment. amendment, as well as the House- issues. The list of nonwaivable chap- The Lieberman substitute, however, passed bill and the President’s initial ters conspicuously fails to include pro- maintains all of the title 5 protections bill, do nothing—do nothing—to pro- tections against unwarranted discipli- for whistleblowers to ensure that they tect whistleblowers. As Congress de- nary actions and performance apprais- have the needed protection to come bates the creation of the new Depart- als, access to third party investiga- forward and alert us to serious prob- ment of Homeland Security, we must tions by the Office of Special Counsel, lems in the Federal Government that remember the role that whistleblowers or independent hearings at the Merit can hamper our efforts to secure our play in protecting this great Nation. Systems Protection Board. Those agen- homeland. It also ensures the continu- We commend the courage of FBI Spe- cies provide vital third party review ation of union representation which al- cial Agent Coleen Rowley, who blew and transparent enforcement for whis- lows third party arbitration for whis- the whistle on the serious institutional tleblower and other merit system tleblowers. The Lieberman substitute problems at the FBI which impacted rights. also contains two provisions, sponsored the agency’s ability to effectively in- When Federal employees allege that by myself and Senator LEVIN, which vestigate and prevent terrorism. We they have been subject to a prohibited enhance the protections afforded to commend Federal Border Patrol personnel practice, including viola- Federal employees. Agents Mark Hall and Bob Lindemann, tions of the Whistleblower Protection The Akaka-Levin provisions grand- Act, OSC has authority to receive and who risked their careers by alerting father the whistleblower rights of em- investigate such allegations. If the spe- Congress to Border Patrol and INS ployees transferred into the new De- cial counsel finds reasonable grounds policies that compromised the security partment and provide full whistle- to believe that a violation has occurred of our borders. blower protections for TSA baggage Their actions alerted us to flaws in and corrective action is required, she screeners. Whistleblower protections the current system and allow us to fix must report the determination to the for TSA employees had unanimous bi- MSPB, the affected agency, and the Of- such problems in order to have a more partisan support from the Govern- fice of Personnel Management, OPM. If secure Nation. Because whistleblowers mental Affairs Committee and the pro- the agency fails to act to correct the play such an important role in pro- vision mirrors the language of S. 2686 prohibited personnel practice, the spe- tecting our country, we must do our which was introduced by Senator cial counsel may petition the MSPB for part to protect them from retaliation GRASSLEY. Despite such widespread corrective action. support, the Gramm-Miller ‘‘com- for disclosing Government waste, Since these procedures are not spe- promise’’ amendment does not include fraud, and abuse. The Lieberman sub- cifically included in H.R. 5005, it is this bipartisan protection for whistle- stitute is the only amendment before doubtful that the protections afforded blowers. us that provides real whistleblower to other employees are available to Under the terms of the Aviation and protection. Homeland Security employees. Transportation Security Act that we During the Committee on Govern- In 1995, Congress gave wide latitude passed last year, the Under Secretary mental Affairs hearings on the creation to the Federal Aviation Administra- of Transportation for Security has the of the proposed Homeland Security De- tion to create its own personnel sys- authority to employ, terminate, and partment, I asked Governor Tom Ridge tem. Although this system was to af- fix the conditions of employment for about whistleblower protections for ford whistleblower protections, the the Federal screening workforce while Federal employees in the Department Justice Department found that Con- the rest of the employees of the Trans- of Homeland Security. He said that all gress incorporated only selected provi- portation Security Agency are gov- employees in the new Department sions of title 5 into the FAA personnel erned by the personnel system estab- would have whistleblower protections management system, thus leaving OSC lished by the Federal Aviation Admin- because the bill would require the new without authority to investigate or istration. personnel system to be grounded in the otherwise pursue cases of whistle- While the FAA personnel system now public employment principles of merit blower retaliation alleged by FAA em- provides full whistleblower protection and fitness. ployees. to employees, TSA security screeners However, requiring that a human re- The reasoning of the Justice Depart- are denied such protection. In May, sources system be grounded in the pub- ment is supported by Supreme Court TSA and OSC reached an agreement to lic employment principles does not precedent, which states that: provide limited whistleblower protec- equate to whistleblower protection. [w]here Congress explicitly enumerates tion to TSA baggage screeners. Under Congress has worked hard, and con- certain exceptions to a general prohibition, this nonstatutory agreement, security tinues to work, to provide real whistle- additional exceptions are not to be implied. screeners were not afforded appeal blower protection to Federal employ- Moreover, Congress has repeatedly rights. However, the right to appeal to ees. Claiming that whistleblower pro- demonstrated that if its intention is to an independent third party is a nec- tection will be provided based on such exempt certain entities generally from essary part of providing real whistle- principles does nothing to assure Fed- title 5, but to apply the substantive blower protection. Such protection is eral employees of their rights and pro- whistleblower protections and all the necessary to ensure that screeners feel tections or assure Congress that their ancillary enforcement procedures, it secure in coming forward with informa- bipartisan efforts on behalf of whistle- knows how to do so unambiguously. tion of government waste, fraud, and blowers would not be frustrated. For example, when Congress applied actions that are dangerous to public Adding to my concern over the lack only selected provisions of title 5 to health and safety. of protections afforded to employees in the Panama Canal Commission, it pro- Recognizing the need for full whistle- the new Department, H.R. 5005 and the vided for application of the whistle- blower rights, Congress resolved to pro- amendment offered by Senators GRAMM blower protection provisions as follows: vide OSC enforcement authority and

VerDate Sep 04 2002 01:56 Sep 26, 2002 Jkt 099060 PO 00000 Frm 00021 Fmt 4624 Sfmt 0634 E:\CR\FM\G25SE6.057 S25PT1 S9200 CONGRESSIONAL RECORD — SENATE September 25, 2002 full whistleblower rights to FAA em- NELSON be recognized to offer an because unscrambling the eggs is im- ployees in 2000. amendment. possible. I urge my colleagues to once again The PRESIDING OFFICER. Without The new Department will not begin protect our Federal whisleblowers by objection, it is so ordered. well if it begins with a staff who feels their concerns have been ignored. We providing full and explicit whistle- f blower protection to employees in the now have the opportunity to break Department of Homeland Security. I UNANIMOUS CONSENT REQUEST— that logjam. This compromise address- urge my colleagues to oppose the S. 1140 es the concerns of both sides. The Gramm-Miller amendment and support Mr. REID. Madam President, I ask agreement preserves the Presidential the Lieberman substitute. unanimous consent, on behalf of Sen- authority to exempt union employees The PRESIDING OFFICER. Who ator DASCHLE, that the Senate proceed from collective bargaining as employ- yields time? to the immediate consideration of Cal- ees of the Department of Homeland Se- Mr. LIEBERMAN. Madam President, endar No. 210, S. 1140, the motor vehi- curity. It also grants the President his- could the Chair indicate how much cle franchise contracts bill; that the toric personnel flexibility, giving him time is remaining on each side? bill be read three times, passed, and the authority to hire, fire, promote, de- The PRESIDING OFFICER. One the motion to reconsider be laid upon mote, and to rewrite civil service laws minute to the Senator from Con- the table; and that any statements re- in the area of performance appraisals, necticut, and 7 minutes to the Senator lating to the bill be printed in the classifications, pay rates and systems, from Texas. RECORD, without intervening action or and adverse action. Mr. LIEBERMAN. Madam President, debate. The agreement provides binding arbi- I suggest the absence of a quorum. The PRESIDING OFFICER. Is there tration on personnel flexibility. All The PRESIDING OFFICER. The objection? sides will have a seat at the table dur- ing the development of the new per- clerk will call the roll. Mr. BENNETT. Madam President, I sonnel rules and any disagreements The legislative clerk proceeded to have no objection to this request, but I over the rules will be referred to the call the roll. understand there is a Senator on this Federal Service Impasse Panel, which Mr. LIEBERMAN. Madam President, side who wants to review it further, will have the authority to set the rules I ask unanimous consent that the order and on his behalf I object at this time. and resolve disputes. This is modeled for the quorum call be dispensed with. The PRESIDING OFFICER. Objec- after the IRS Restructuring and Re- The PRESIDING OFFICER. Without tion is heard. objection, it is so ordered. form Act of 1998, which is current law. Mr. LIEBERMAN. Madam President, f The Federal Service Impasse Panel let me conclude in the moment I have HOMELAND SECURITY ACT OF has discretion to impose new rules to remaining. I have the feeling this will 2002—Continued break this agreement. This is existing law. It is the way in which we ought to not be the last moment I or other The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen- Members will have to discuss the proceed. ator from Nebraska is recognized. I know this amendment will receive Graham-Miller substitute or the ques- AMENDMENT NO. 4740 TO AMENDMENT NO. 4738 broad bipartisan support, and I hope tion of protections for Federal workers. those of us who seek to complete ac- There is a significant disagreement (Purpose: To modify certain personnel provisions, and for other purposes) tion on this important legislation will about the protections for homeland se- support this effort to clear one of the curity workers. I do think, as we talk Mr. NELSON of Nebraska. Madam major hurdles that has been currently about the Nelson-Chafee-Breaux com- President, I call up my amendment at blocking our progress so we can move promise, which I support, that it will the desk. forward on this important and vital se- be seen that it not only gives some pro- The PRESIDING OFFICER. The curity matter currently before us. tection to Federal workers, particu- clerk will report. The assistant legislative clerk read I ask for the support of my col- larly those who are currently unionized leagues, and I hope we will move for- as follows: and will be transferred to the new ward on this as soon as we possibly building, but it leaves the President The Senator from Nebraska [Mr. NELSON], can. There is no reason to delay this for himself, Mr. CHAFEE, and Mr. BREAUX, with the last word on matters of na- legislation any longer. tional security. Let not the debate on proposes an amendment numbered 4740 to amendment No. 4738. The PRESIDING OFFICER. The Sen- that matter obscure the fact that, as ator from Louisiana. Senator GRAMM himself has said, 95 Mr. NELSON of Nebraska. Madam Mr. BREAUX. Madam President, I percent of his substitute is the same as President, I ask unanimous consent support the amendment to the Gramm- our committee bill. So let’s settle the that the reading of the amendment be Miller amendment which has been of- small point of disagreement and get dispensed with. fered by our good friend and colleague the rest that we agree on done. The PRESIDING OFFICER. Without Senator NELSON, and by my colleague I believe my time has expired. objection, it is so ordered. Senator LINCOLN CHAFEE. It is very I yield the floor and suggest the ab- (The text of the amendment is print- clear the Senate, as we debate home- sence of a quorum. ed in today’s RECORD under ‘‘Text of land security, has reached a point The PRESIDING OFFICER. Without Amendments.’’) where we are at a logjam. I, for one, objection, the clerk will call the roll. Mr. NELSON of Nebraska. Madam and I think the vast majority of our The legislative clerk proceeded to President, I am pleased to join with my colleagues, strongly support the cre- call the roll. friends, Senator JOHN BREAUX of Lou- ation of a Homeland Security Depart- Mr. REID. Madam President, I ask isiana and Senator LINCOLN CHAFEE of ment, and why is very simple. unanimous consent that the order for Rhode Island, in helping break the In light of today’s terrorist threat to the quorum call be rescinded. stalemate on the labor-management this country, we can no longer con- The PRESIDING OFFICER (Mrs. issues that have held up the homeland tinue to operate and protect our Na- CLINTON). Without objection, it is so security legislation. We need to move tion’s security in the way we always ordered. forward and pass a bill that provides have. In the past, too often the right The Senator from Nevada. real security for all Americans without hand did not know what the left hand Mr. REID. Madam President, I have a the distractions of labor-management was doing, and vice versa. It is clear, unanimous consent request which I issues. from the evidence that has now been have informed the minority I am going This legislation is a huge under- presented, we have agencies within our to propound at this time. Senator NEL- taking, and the reorganization will cer- own Government that had certain SON has been designated as Senator tainly not be accomplished overnight. amounts of information that was im- DASCHLE’s designee. I ask unanimous That being said, we need to get to it portant information, but information consent that following my unanimous right now because the later we come they did not adequately share with consent request—and I understand back to try to do this, the more dif- other Departments and agencies within there will be an objection—Senator ficult it will be. We need to do it right our Government.

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