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Title: Thursday, January 18, 1990 Ms Title: Thursday, January 18, 1990 ms January 18, 1990 Members’ Services 115 [Chairman: Dr. Carter] [9:44 a.m.] AN HON. MEMBER: Would you sisters get your act together? MR. CHAIRMAN: Good morning. MS BARRETT: I have a badge to this effect downstairs. I’ll get you one. SOME HON. MEMBERS: Good morning, Mr. Carter. MR. CHAIRMAN: All right; now we’ll find out. Was this MR. CHAIRMAN: Give us a break; give us a break. We’re all serious? Was it passed unanimously? in our places with sunshiny . Okay. You’ve got the proposed agenda in front of you. In MRS. BLACK: No. that regard, if we have, first off, errors or omissions or anything else you’d like to add under New Business .. Nothing strikes MR. CHAIRMAN: Okay. Thank you. It was not passed you immediately? unanimously. There was one opposed. All righty, item 3(a). Now, this is the approval of the minutes MS BARRETT: It looks fine to me. of our two meetings immediately prior to Christmas. First, I’d like to mention that because of changeover of equipment over MR. CHAIRMAN: Approval for the agenda? the Christmas holiday period, plus the time of the holidays, we apologize that we weren’t able to get all these minutes together MS BARRETT: So moved. until late yesterday. So the Chair would not feel it untoward if members of the committee did not want to make approval of the MR. CHAIRMAN: All those in favour, please say aye. minutes until the next meeting, but I leave it to the pleasure of the committee. HON. MEMBERS: Aye. MR. WICKMAN: Well, Mr. Chairman, I have a question that MR. CHAIRMAN: Thank you. does pertain to the minutes. That question is in reference to The next question is not on the agenda. According to comments that were made at the last meeting about the formula Beauchesne a committee sets its own standards as to how it for the allowances for members, that formula being broken or operates and so forth. In our previous existence - Members’ shot down by myself and Nick Taylor. My question is that I Services Committee - we had agreed that on the day of the would like some information, if anyone has any information, as meeting the agenda, when approved, could be handed out to to when some specific action took place that would have seen representatives of the media, who may or may not be here. that formula destroyed. Because my research of minutes, even Since this is a new Members’ Services Committee and we going back to the days when Nick Taylor was here, is that there haven’t had to deal with this before, I’m open to the fact that was no motion on the books that in fact took away that formula. perhaps we continue to do this. MR. CHAIRMAN: All right. Which day are we dealing with? MS BARRETT: So moved, Mr. Chairman. The 21st or the 22nd? MR. CHAIRMAN: Thank you, Edmonton-Highlands. MR. WICKMAN: The 22nd. MR. HYLAND: Question. MR. CHAIRMAN: Thank you. Could we first deal with the 21st? MR. CHAIRMAN: All those in favour, please signify. Thank you. Carried unanimously. Now we can hand out copies of MR. McINNIS: Mr. Chairman, I haven’t seen the minutes at all agendas. [interjection] at this point. I’m open to taking your offer to defer them until I’ve had a chance to look at them. MS BARRETT: So what? The majority rules, kiddo. If you don’t stick your hand up to say no, he’s got no choice but to HON. MEMBERS: Agreed. interpret it that way. MR. CHAIRMAN: Does that apply to both the 21st and the MRS. BLACK: He didn’t ask for the nays. 22nd? MS BARRETT: You’re being told how to do your job. AN HON. MEMBER: Yes. MR. CHAIRMAN: So what’s new? MR. CHAIRMAN: All right. Thank you. Any further discussion? Okay. Moved by Edmonton-Jasper Place that the MR. McINNIS: Let’s have a ruling on whether it’s unanimous approval of minutes of December 21 and 22 be held over until or not. the next meeting, which is projected to be February 1 at this stage. Is there a call for the question? MS BARRETT: Yeah, right. MR. HYLAND: Question. MR. CHAIRMAN: Would you like to record the fact that the motion was not unanimous? Mrs. Black would like to signify MR. CHAIRMAN: All those in favour, please signify. Op­ that she was opposed to . posed, if any? This one is carried unanimously. Thank you. With regard to the issue as raised by the Member for Edmon­- 116 Members’ Services January 18,1 990 ton-Whitemud, does anyone care to respond, or do you want to the amount per caucus would be whatever the dollar amount hold that until the next meeting? would be, and that was how that dollar amount was arrived at. The only way one would see why or how, and see the comment MS BARRETT: Well, I would be prepared to respond. Percy that we tried to talk Mr. Taylor out of that, would be in the might be right; there might never have been a specific motion transcripts and not in the motions. on the record. But I mean most of the members on this committee were also present last year when Nick moved to MR. BOGLE: Well, the only other item I’d like to add to what freeze the formula for his caucus at that time. It might not have Alan has said is that the committee went on to caution Nick. been phrased that way, but it certainly had that effect. It was We asked the questions point blank. Are you here representing the understanding, I think, of everybody. I recognize that this your three colleagues? Are they aware of what you’re doing? is not an identical committee, but we in large measure have the Do they agree and concur in what you’re doing? The answer same members. That was the understanding, you know: that if was in the affirmative. We reluctantly accepted the motion put one caucus moves away from the formula, then the formula just forward by Nick. That in effect killed the formula that we had didn’t exist any more. been using because it was a formula that applied to all caucuses in the Assembly. MR. BOGLE: Agreed. I really believe this item should be held until we get into the caucus budgets in the overall budget process, and we can then MR. WICKMAN: You know, Mr. Chairman, I really object to deal with it. Because, Percy, you will recall that I did ask the what’s happening. Going back, doing a bit of research: Nick Clerk if he could provide us with information on what the Taylor did not move to freeze the formula; he simply moved to proposed increases would mean on a per member basis for the freeze the increase for that particular year. If we talk in terms three caucuses. But rather than getting into that right now, I of understanding, I clearly had an understanding that the budget move that we table the item and that it be brought back once we would come in this year reflecting the equal amount per member get into the three caucus budgets. for all MLAs in all three caucuses, with the exception, of course, of the cabinet ministers, who get their resources from other MR. CHAIRMAN: Under item 5(c), motion to table those to budgets. I don’t think two members of this committee have the later in the agenda. Those in favour, please signify. Opposed? right to just announce that a formula is gone. If you’re going to Carried. So on your agenda under 5(c): that’s the area when destroy the formula . .. we come to caucus budgets, where it would normally fall. Thank you. MS BARRETT: No, it wasn’t just two members. I mean it Item 4(a), Transportation and Administrative Services Orders. really .. The Member for Edmonton-Highlands. MR. WICKMAN: . put a motion on it. MS BARRETT: Mr. Chairman, I move to table until this afternoon this item and the following one, as no discussion has MS BARRETT: Pardon me? taken place on the matters. MR. WICKMAN: You’re making an assumption that Nick MR. CHAIRMAN: Thank you. We’d better do them one at a Taylor meant to do something, to destroy a formula. I’ve talked time, just to keep it procedurally correct. with him. That was not his intent. The reference is made in the minutes that I assisted in destroying that formula, and I don’t MS BARRETT: Okay, sure. I’ll move to table it till this know how because I wasn’t even here. afternoon, Mr. Chairman. MR. CHAIRMAN: Thank you. MR. CHAIRMAN: Thank you. Those in favour, please signify. Cypress-Redcliff, followed by Taber-Warner. Opposed? Carried. Item 4(b). Edmonton-Highlands. MR. HYLAND: Mr. Chairman, I think the formula that was there in days gone by was that once an amount was agreed to, MS BARRETT: Similarly, I move to table till this afternoon. that amount would be moved for each caucus budget. That’s how the formula is arrived at. There was never saying that the MR. CHAIRMAN: Thank you. Those in favour, please signify. formula shall be X. It was that once we agreed what the caucus Opposed? Carried. Okay. budgets would be, it was multiplied out by the number of Item 4(c). Clerk. members in that caucus.
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