The Beauty of Justice
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way, is not the same. It is as if justice is condemned to being an abstract CSD Interview noun. That enables all kinds of people to speak of justice in various and con- flicting ways. It even allows rogues to take refuge in talk of justice. Think of US vice–president Dick Cheney’s dec- laration that ‘water boarding’, the tor- ture under water and forced confession of prisoners, is an act of ‘justice’. Or President Bush: ‘I want justice’, he The Beauty of said shortly after the 11 September 2001 attacks, ‘and there’s an old poster out West I recall that said “Wanted, Dead or Alive”.’ Aren’t these exam- Justice ples of the way the notion of justice is demeaned by its abstractness? Justice is a complicated subject. There is of course no ‘justice-ing’ in English, though with a bit of linguistic manoeuvring one can create the verb ‘to do justice’ to somebody or some- thing. The same is true in Persian and Arabic. But the most important thing Abdolkarim Soroush is Iran’s most prominent and controversial is this: both linguistic strategy and conceptual analysis make it abun- philosopher and public intellectual. In November 2006 he was the dantly clear that while justice is not a verb or an action, it is often used as an subject of the annual CSD Encounter (see ‘CSD Events’, p. 20). adjective. The field of ethics tells you when and in which context actions are Shortly after the Encounter John Keane interviewed him. just, that is, justified. Here justice works as an adjective: justified lying, justified killing, or justified stealing. Justice implies the justification of action. This is how John Rawls’s A Theory of Justice proceeds. It tries to John Keane: You said recently that the concept of justice is deeply rooted in say that certain inequalities are justi- topic of justice (adalat) is back on the the teachings of Islam, it is what he fied inequalities. Justice is also a polit- political agenda in your country. You prefers to talk about. His election ical concept. It is the link between pol- contrasted the ‘era of the slogan of promises included the commitment to itics and ethics: politics becomes freedom’ under President Khatami provide ‘full justice’ to the poor and ethical through justice. Justice is a with the emergent ‘era of the slogan of the deprived. Of course, everyone concept that governs both politics and justice’ championed by Mr knows that liberty and justice are ethics. Ahmadinejad. What did you mean? twins. There can be no justice without liberty. When I spoke about the differ- So could we say that justice is about Abdolkarim Soroush: The discourse ent slogans of the two presidencies, I the right ordering of contexts – that of justice wasn’t prominent in Iran wanted to challenge Mr Ahmadinejad: ‘justice is a relationship of suitability during the two presidencies of Mr since you are for justice, you should be which actually exists between two Khatami. He came to power through for liberty as well. things’, as Montesquieu famously put elections, and that was significant. it in his Persian Letters? Or is it per- Elections not only reinforced his per- Among the many strange things about haps better to say that justice is a mat- sonal interest in liberty; they also rein- the word justice, you’ve pointed out, ter of rights, that it entails the entitle- forced the felt need of Iranian society is that in Persian, as in English, there ments of people, and their obligations for liberty. Later, people seemed to is no cognate verb for ‘justice’. We to one another in any given context? grow tired of Khatami’s slogans about have laughing, kissing, arresting or freedom. That paved the way for the murdering, but we do not have ‘jus- The definition of justice as the fulfil- new president, Mr Ahmadinejad. He tice-ing’. The verb to justify, as when ment of rights or, as in Plato and isn’t a profound thinker, but he is sup- we give reasons for doing something, Aristotle, the paying of debts, is much posed to be firmly religious. Since the or when we line up a text in an orderly clearer, if only because it confines 8 | CSD BULLETIN | SUMMER 2007 | VOL 14 NOS 1&2 itself to human beings. But I like wanted to say is that, Montesquieu’s old definition of justice since justice is an as putting things in their right place. adjective, it can be Even though it doesn’t tell us much used to cover and jus- about what to do or what to avoid, it tify any natural action. assumes that things in the universe Justice is not a virtue have potentially a right order that can over and above other be discovered, and then can be used to virtues in any given guide action. According to Rumi, the system of morality. Persian mystic, watering flowers is a When you are a moral just action, whereas watering thorns is person then you are a unjust because it is a misuse of water. just person. It resem- In Arabic, justice – adalat – means bal- bles the way Frank P. ance in this sense. For instance, if the Ramsey speaks about whole universe has a balanced archi- the redundancy of tecture, if it is not distorted, then it is truth. He doesn’t mean said to be just. This idea of justice as that there is no truth in balance overlaps with a rights-based the world. He rather conception of justice. To speak of means that when you rights is to speak of obligations. A just say ‘p’ is true, then the person, we could say, is someone who words ‘is true’ are strikes a balance between rights and redundant because ‘p’ obligations by fulfilling both in a justi- states what is the case. fied way. Here there is an anal- ogy with justice, for The principle that all matters should when we speak of moral virtues or But here we come to the issue of be decided justly lies at the spiritual actions, by definition we are speaking whether or not there are universal and political heart of Islam. There are of justified states of affairs. standards of justice. Montesquieu is many well-known passages in the This has important practical impli- again interesting. ‘Justice is eternal’, Qur’an, but this one puzzles me: ‘Let cations, for any particular moral value he wrote, ‘and doesn’t depend on not the enmity of others make you cannot be sacrificed for the sake of jus- human conventions; even if it were to sway from justice; be just, that is only tice, simply because justice is not a depend on them this truth would be a nearer to taqwa' (5:42). What does this separate value. You cannot say, for terrible one, and we should have to mean? example, that you performed an unjus- conceal it from ourselves.’ How do you tified action in order to attain justice. react to that way of thinking about This verse is among the most impor- This would be a fallacy. If you do think justice? tant in the Qur’an. Wisely, you didn’t that justice is a different entity, then translate taqwa. It isn’t fully translat- you can of course sacrifice a whole This is a wonderfully clever and poetic able. It means something like virtue, ethical system for the sake of this sup- statement. But although people con- piety, fearfulness of God, abstention posed justice. When studying Marxist stantly strive both for justice and from committing sins. ethics, I was struck by the way its pro- sometimes even a universal definition of justice, I doubt that they can or will Justice seems to be ever get there. For the most we can subordinate to ‘A just person, we could say, is some- achieve is an interpretation of justice – taqwa? a definition of what counts as justice. one who strikes a balance between Such interpretations are of course con- Yes. This verse says ventional and provisional, and they that justice should rights and obligations by fulfilling both differ from each other. be done in order to get closer to taqwa, in a justified way.’ Within contemporary discussions of which is seen as the justice, scholars like to emphasize its highest virtue one different grammars, the different can reach. Justice is a kind of ladder to ponents talked all the time about jus- kinds of equalities these grammars taqwa. tice. They were ready to sacrifice imply, and to stress that the language everything moral for the sake of jus- of justice and equality are often rid- Elsewhere you’ve spoken, rather para- tice. But justice is not an independent dled with paradoxes. The most obvi- doxically, about the redundancy of jus- virtue: it is a myth to think that it is, ous example is the tension between tice… and that is why I said that justice is justice understood as equality of redundant. Justice is the sum of all results and justice defined as equality I had something else in mind. What I moral virtues. of opportunity, a form of equality that CSD BULLETIN | SUMMER 2007 | VOL 14 NOS 1&2 | 9 typically results in the opponents of to democratic freedoms is a subset of unequal outcomes, in this virtue need it justice. ‘winners’ and ‘losers’. in order to express Doesn’t your point their opposition to Are there standards of justice that cut about the interpreted liberty. Liberty is a across borders and that should apply to quality of justice lead in necessary condi- people whom we may never meet, the same direction, so tion of itself.