A Conversation with Kaija Saariaho and Jean-Baptiste Barri
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Edmund Campion Dual Reflections: A Center for New Music and Audio Technologies 1750 Arch Street, Berkeley, California Conversation with Kaija 94709, USA [email protected] Saariaho and Jean-Baptiste Barriere` on Music, Art, and Technology During the fall of 2015, composer Kaija Saariaho took by Camilla Hoitenga, and Ekstasis, for soprano and up residence as Bloch Professor in the Department electronics, based on two texts by Simone Weil of Music at the University of California, Berkeley and Louise Michel and sung by soprano Raphaele¨ (UCB). In addition to conducting master classes Kennedy. and private lessons with student composers, she On 1 December 2015 I interviewed Saariaho participated in appearances at UCB’s Center for and Barriere` (see Figure 1) at CNMAT in Berkeley. New Music and Audio Technologies (CNMAT) Saariaho had just completed her Bloch Residency and at the Doreen B. Townsend Center for the and Barriere` had just ended his David Wessel Music Humanities. Her music was performed by the and Science Fellow Residency. The interview has UCB Symphony Orchestra and the Eco Ensemble, been extensively edited by Danielle DeGruttola in both with David Milnes; the Berkeley Symphony, close consultation with the interviewees. conducted by Joana Carneiro; the San Francisco Contemporary Music Players; and the Left Coast Chamber Ensemble. Saariaho gave public Bloch Recent Saariaho Projects and Real-Time Lectures, featuring conversations with distinguished Processing collaborators. Cellist, long-time collaborator, and concurrent Regent’s Lecturer Anssi Karttunen Edmund Campion: What’s going on recently in your appeared as soloist in the Cal Performances Saariaho lives, musically speaking? portrait concert. Camilla Hoitenga, Jennifer Koh, Kaija Saariaho: Today I had a long meeting on and Susanna Malkki appeared on stage with Saariaho Skype with Christophe Lebreton, who works at for lectures and live performances. the studio of the GRAME center, in Lyon, and is One of the concerts and lectures presented during collaborating with me on my latest opera, Only Saariaho’s residency was with long-time collabo- the Sound Remains, in which I am using real-time rator Jean-Baptiste Barriere,` the Parisian composer transformations of human voice, and live electronics and visual artist. Barriere` worked from 1981 to 1997 in general, different from those used in my previous at Institut de Recherche et de Coordination Acous- works with electronics. We are, in particular, tique/Musique (IRCAM), successively as director developing two kinds of real-time treatments of Musical Research, Pedagogy, and Production. for one of the two soloists in the opera, who Barriere` held the first David Wessel Residency in represent two supernatural characters: a ghost and an Music and Science at CNMAT in the fall of 2015. He angel. performed a multimedia concert at UCB’s Hertz Hall This is a commission from the Amsterdam on 28 October of that year, where his historical elec- National Opera with the Finnish National Opera, tronic piece Chreode´ was played. Also performed the Teatro Real opera house in Madrid, the Toronto were Violance, for flutes and electronics, performed Opera, and the Paris Opera. [Interviewer’s note: The premiere took place 15 March 2016.] It is Computer Music Journal, 41:3, pp. 9–20, Fall 2017 based on two classic Noh plays, first translated into doi:10.1162/COMJ a 00426 English by Ernest Fenollosa and then adapted by c 2017 Massachusetts Institute of Technology. Ezra Pound, whose language I admire greatly. The Campion 9 Downloaded from http://www.mitpressjournals.org/doi/pdf/10.1162/comj_a_00426 by guest on 27 September 2021 Figure 1. Jean-Baptiste Barriere` and Kaija Saariaho. (Photograph by the author.) stage director is Peter Sellars. There are only seven want it to be prominent and not blurred with effects. instrumentalists, two vocal soloists, and a choir Sound quality in electronics is extremely important or vocal ensemble of four voices. It is not a large for me, and for a long time it was not attainable score, but the electronic part is important. I imagine with real-time technology. So when I worked with it being performed in rather large spaces, allowing the voice, I prepared processed treatments in sound the processing to be spatialized widely around the files to be triggered at given cues in the score, and audience. I mixed these together with amplification and live Campion: How many pieces have you done with electronics, mostly consisting of reverberation. In voice and processing in this way? this way, I could achieve a satisfying blend between Saariaho: In the past, I had not done much in instrumental qualities and electronics possibilities. terms of complex real-time processing. Rather, I Now real-time sound quality has finally improved created lots of material with recorded voices, mostly greatly, so this time there is only real-time process- for pieces in which voice processing was realized ing. I started this kind of work with my third opera, with different kinds of filtering: phase-vocoder, Emilie,´ a monodrama for soprano and orchestra models of resonance, etc. I really like the voice and based on the life and work of Emilie du Chatelet,ˆ 10 Computer Music Journal Downloaded from http://www.mitpressjournals.org/doi/pdf/10.1162/comj_a_00426 by guest on 27 September 2021 one of the first important woman scientists of the Saariaho: I just wanted my music to sound as I 18th century. During the opera, set during the last imagined it. That is how at some point it became night of her life, she is remembering and thinking an important aim for me to get to IRCAM so that I about various persons who have been important in could understand more about sound itself through her life. I wanted her voice to change, in real time, acoustics and psychoacoustics, and develop the into a child’s and into several men’s voices when she knowledge to achieve what I imagined. was quoting these characters. That is how I started I took my first course at IRCAM in 1982. I started this work with Christophe. It is about finding the using the program Chant, which allowed me to intimate characteristics of a person’s voice, older control the physical and acoustical parameters for or younger, and all the acoustic parameters that creating sound, whereas in other programs you were define a specific voice timbre and quality. Only the working principally with oscillators, filters, and Sound Remains further develops these ideas started envelopes. I learned about sound properties and how in Emilie´ in a much more abstract way. they are perceived, how to hear sounds, and what Campion: Is the use of real time an extension of to do to build the sound I wanted. I understood the how you conceived of doing electronics all along, or importance of designing coherent variations of all is it a huge shift in your approach? parameters with Chant to obtain a living, organic Saariaho: The aspects I am addressing more sound. Which, in turn, also gave me ideas for my recently with electronics, like when we collaborated orchestration. with Jean-Baptiste for Frises, mostly deal with the fact that the technologies are finally now capable of meeting the quality I want to achieve, especially in Saariaho and Barriere` at IRCAM interaction with the voices and instruments live on stage. Campion: In 1982, is that when you met Jean- Campion: Are the electronics a kind of sceno- Baptiste? graphic aspect of your music, or is it integral, more Saariaho: Yes, he was my teacher at IRCAM. We essential to your sound world? got married in 1984, and have been married for over Saariaho: Until Emilie´ or this new opera, the thirty years. electronics were mostly an extension of the orches- Campion: You mentioned the program Chant, tration, even if they could have an autonomy, like which is deeply connected to Jean-Baptiste. It would in Lonh for soprano or Jardin Secret II for harpsi- be a good time to hear from him about it. chord. I was essentially using processing as a kind Jean-Baptiste Barriere:` Kaija, as she explained, of orchestration and a way to blend the voice or the was first “orchestrating through amplification,” instrument with the electronics. More recently, the using microphones like microscopes, observing and processing sometimes has to do with the dramaturgy revealing modes of playing, timbres that could not of the piece, not only extending the voice or the be heard in purely acoustical music. Amplifying instrument, but in its own way contributing to the these sonic worlds actually provided a natural narration, which of course makes special sense in bridge to her work with computers, which started an operatic context. by detailed analysis of vocal and instrumental I’ve been working with technology for a long time. sounds with spectral analysis (e.g., with Iana, a I started doing so during my studies in Helsinki, program implementing Ernst Terhardt’s algorithms going to the studio to amplify sounds and adding for determining the perceptual weights of spectral reverberation to them, because I could not stand components for complex sounds), and compositional the lousy concert spaces where my music was then manipulations (with Formes and Esquisse) of the being played. Later, I used tape recorders and other analysis data to control filtering, synthesis, and analog devices, and later still, digital electronics and processing with Chant. computers. Campion: The issue of space also comes into my Campion: What were you trying to achieve? mind . resonance and space. Campion 11 Downloaded from http://www.mitpressjournals.org/doi/pdf/10.1162/comj_a_00426 by guest on 27 September 2021 Saariaho: I was interested in space since the specify all the small variations of parameters beginning when working on amplification, because needed to make a sound interesting, so ways were it helps to create dimensions.