MINUTES HORRY COUNTY COUNCIL Infrastructure & Regulation Committee Meeting November 21, 2013 9:00 a.m.

MEMBERS PRESENT: Jody Prince, Chairman; Paul Prince; Gary Loftus; and Bob Grabowski. Council Chairman Mark Lazarus and Councilman James Frazier were also present.

MEMBERS ABSENT:

OTHERS PRESENT: Chris Eldridge; Pat Hartley; Arrigo Carotti; Anne Wright; Sandee Garigen; Gary Watson; Janet Carter; Sam Graves; Randy Haldi; Barry Spivey; Andy Markunas; David Schwerd; John Danford; Brent Taylor, and Lisa Bourcier.

In accordance with the FOIA, notices of the meeting were provided to the press stating the time, date, and place of the meeting.

CALL TO ORDER: Mr. J. Prince called the meeting to order at approximately 9:00 a.m.

INVOCATION: Mr. P. Prince gave the invocation.

Mr. J. Prince introduced the committee members, welcomed Councilman James Frazier to the meeting, along with several members of the Solid Waste Authority Board. He said he appreciated what they did and thanked them for being there.

PUBLIC INPUT: There was none.

APPROVAL OF AGENDA CONTENTS: Mr. Grabowski made a motion to approve the agenda contents. The motion passed unanimously.

APPROVAL OF MINUTES: I&R Committee Meeting – September 12, 2013 and October 3, 2013. Mr. P. Prince moved to approve, seconded by Mr. Grabowski. The motion passed unanimously.

DISCUSSION ITEMS:

Conditions placed on special exceptions by the Zoning Board of Appeals. Mrs. Carter said that towards the end of 2005, County Council passed an ordinance that required any business that was located within 500-feet of a residential property and served alcohol for on-premise consumption to go before the Zoning Board of Appeals for special exception approval. Basically, what that meant was that the use was allowed in the zoning district – it would have to be allowed in the zoning district to begin with, for instance, like in Highway Commercial, but if they measured 500-feet to the closest residential property, then there had to be a public hearing and notice to surrounding property owners, and then the Board would hold a hearing and place any conditions on the request that they deemed appropriate.

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During the first year or so of that application, the Board came up with some standard conditions that they pretty much always placed on the approvals. They could vary slightly from time to time, based on the request, but thought the condition that Mr. Grabowski was concerned about was the condition that the special exception expired or required them to come back before the Board when the business changed ownership. They have had some discussions about that over time.

For all properties that were out there and existed before 2005 would be regarded as legal non- conforming uses…and you were talking about a lot of restaurants and bars. It’s everything from a Ruby Tuesday’s type of restaurant to a biker bar that was included in the mix. If you were a legal non-conforming establishment prior to 2005 when the law changed, then you were able to just continue on until you have abandoned that use. Probably, 90% or more of the businesses that are out there were out there prior to 2005, and they changed hands all the time. That was approved at the staff level and they go on because they were legal non-conforming uses. They had not abandoned their zoning so, therefore, they got to continue it into perpetuity until they did.

They had two different classes of businesses that have been created by this: those that have come into the location since 2005 and those that existed prior to, but thought that today, they were talking strictly about those that have come into existence since 2005 and that have changed ownership and have had to come back before the Board each time…that’s what has raised the concern today. Mr. Grabowski said that was right. He had a situation in his district where a special exception was granted, they sold the business, the business did not change its use, look, appearance, or anything…they didn’t change a thing – they just changed the owner, and the owner had to go before the Zoning Board of Appeals to get that special exception granted again. It just didn’t make sense. The exception was already granted, nothing changed except for the owner’s name, and it just didn’t make sense that he had to do that all over again. He wasn’t advocating that if they changed the nature of the business, then certainly, whatever the new nature of the business was needed to conform to their rules, but he was talking strictly about there being no change in the use of the business other than the ownership, title of it, or whatever – they shouldn’t make them need to come back before the Board. Mrs. Carter said that staff proposed an amendment a couple of years ago that would have had that effect, but that was strongly opposed by some of the Board members, and that amendment never went anywhere…because what they were trying to do was line up the two different types of businesses – those that existed prior to 2005 and those that have come into existence since so that they weren’t treating them so differently, but as she said, there was opposition and that ordinance never made it past the I&R Committee.

Mr. J. Prince said he was familiar with Mr. Grabowski’s situation and had the perimeters set by the Zoning Board of Appeals followed that property – no matter what they were…there could be a wide range from the differences in businesses that he assumed the Zoning Board of Appeals could say “Okay, these are the rules that you have to follow here if you want to do this”, and six miles down the road, they could have different rules they could go by. He asked Mrs. Carter if that was correct. Mrs. Carter said that by and large, the rules they applied were the same in every instance, but there were occasional tweaks. For example, they generally didn’t allow outdoor entertainment or outdoor dining, but if the location was appropriate and it didn’t appear that it would create any problems, they would modify that condition from time to time. In one case, they added a condition for security in the parking lot at the request of one of the neighbors that came out, so it varied slightly, but by and large, the conditions were standard and they applied them in most cases. Mr. J. Prince asked if those conditions followed the property as long as that use didn’t change, that would fix the problem.

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Mr. Grabowski said sure…then they wouldn’t have to go through the Zoning Board of Appeals again.

Mrs. Carter said that generally in zoning, zoning did run with the land…it wasn’t person to person, for example with a variance. She could not find any case law in South Carolina on special exceptions, but did find case law in other jurisdictions in other states that said the same thing about special exceptions. They weren’t personal to the individual, but they ran with the land like all regulatory permits. The cases she read equated them to wetlands permits, variances, and other things. Mr. Grabowski said they should mirror that in case they didn’t. Mr. J. Prince said it could still be problematic, especially with the lack of communication. In other words, you bought a parcel that had a special exception plus a condition that they didn’t know about, that could be problematic too, so communication would be very important for the sale of that property and that business. Mr. Grabowski said that was the responsibility of the buyer and the purchaser…he didn’t think that was the county’s responsibility.

Mr. J. Prince asked Mr. Grabowski what he proposed they asked staff to do. Mr. Grabowski said to do what the other areas were doing, and have those special exceptions and conditions stay with the property provided there were no changes in the use of the business. Mr. P. Prince said that they needed to understand that when the property changes, and if they made changes, they would have to do that. Mr. Grabowski agreed and said then they would have to comply. If they were changing the use of the property, then they had to get their ducks in a row and go through the process, but if they weren’t changing the use of the property, they didn’t need to make them come back before the ZBA.

Mrs. Carter said that one thing she thought the Board was concerned about was, for example, they approved a neighborhood tavern, and then they sold that tavern and it became a biker bar. You were still talking about the sale of alcohol within 500-feet of residential. They believed there was a different impact in different types of businesses. Mr. Grabowski said that the conditions then would still apply – no outdoor use, no outdoor entertainment etc…, so they would still apply. The conditions set forth by the ZBA originally stayed with that property, it didn’t matter who owned it, provided the use was the same. Mrs. Carter said they included a condition of no banners, no bike week vending, etc… Mr. Grabowski said so, if they changed from a tavern to a biker bar, they had the same conditions to abide by. Mrs. Carter said that was correct. Mr. J. Prince asked if a tavern could be a biker bar. Mr. Grabowski said yes. Mrs. Carter said that Ruby Tuesday’s could be a biker bar. Mr. J. Prince asked that what if Ruby Tuesday’s became a biker bar – it was here. Mrs. Carter said that was probably not a good example.

Mr. P. Prince asked how they should handle it. Mrs. Carter said they could do one of two things. They could either just send a message to the Board through their attorney, who was Sam Graves, who was also there…he could counsel the Board on what the desire was. Mr. Grabowski said that didn’t alleviate the person from a change in ownership going back to the ZBA. Mrs. Carter said that it did because that was a condition the Board would need to stop including in their orders. Mr. J. Prince confirmed that they didn’t have that one as law. Mrs. Carter agreed and said if the Board was willing to just make that change, they could do it that way, but if the Board felt strongly about it and wasn’t willing to make that change, they could do it by ordinance. Mr. Grabowski said to do it the simplest way first. Mr. P. Prince asked why they couldn’t do it by resolution. Mr. J. Prince agreed and said that he wanted council to hear it and help them with it, so it wasn’t just the committee doing it…he thought that was important. Mrs. Carter asked Mr. Carotti if that would be acceptable.

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Mr. Grabowski asked if that would be a resolution to the ZBA and if he would draft it. Mr. Carotti said yes, and would be drafted for the next agenda for County Council. Mr. P. Prince made a motion they send a resolution to council to that affect, seconded by Mr. Grabowski. The motion carried unanimously.

Update on dirt road product tests (David Gilreath). Mr. Gilreath said good morning and since Steve (Gosnell), he would say keep it brief. Mr. J. Prince said that by the way, Mr. Gosnells’ father was in the hospital sick and they needed to keep him in their prayers, and Gary’s wife as well, who has had a difficult bout with diabetes…so to keep them in their prayers. Mr. Loftus walked in at this time. Mr. J. Prince said he was glad he could make it.

Mr. Gilreath said that with their indulgence, he wanted to do one thing that was slightly off the agenda and introduce a couple of guys that they have moved around. As some of them knew, Wayne Small retired after 36 years of service with Horry County, and they have moved a district maintenance supervisor from Mr. Grabowski’s area…the south beach district, to the north area, where Donald lived, and they promoted Mr. Richie Smith, who was from the Socastee area – he grew up down there. They promoted him to be their district maintenance supervisor for the south beach district. Donald’s district covered districts 9, 10, and 11, so if they had not met him, they could meet him on good terms before somebody was upset. Mr. J. Prince said that he and Mr. P. Prince would get to know him real well. Mr. P. Prince said that was 80% of Horry County. Mr. Richie Smith, on the south beach had districts 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, and 8, and the borders along district 10. Mr. P. Prince said he pitied him being out there. Mr. Gilreath said that most of them knew Donald, but that Richie grew up as a contractor, and had been with the county for a little over a year now. He has done a lot of things for them, and they were really pleased with him, but he just wanted to introduce him to them now…on good terms, before somebody was upset with him. Mr. J. Prince said that he was happy to see that they had promoted within – he liked that. He wished them both good luck – they would need a little bit of luck, and he congratulated them on their promotion.

Mr. Gilreath said moving on, they had 657 miles of unpaved roadways, and as they knew they were scraped every two to four weeks. They spent about $2,200 per year per mile of road to maintain just the surface…it didn’t include mowing, signage, or other drainage issues…that was just surface maintenance. All of them have seen they have put what was traditionally called coquina, or most of the time now was called structural filled…they put that on roads to improve their surface level of service, and to make them more stable during bad weather. That cost about $25,000 per month…to kind of give them a base line so they would know what they were talking about, and that was funded through Fund 34 – the Road Plan funds.

The goal of the pilot program, which he wanted to give them an update on, was to reduce maintenance costs…there was no other goal other than that. If they didn’t reduce their maintenance costs, they could not do it because they weren’t asking for any money…it had to pay for itself, so they had to save money over here to fund this over here on the other side. They could save money through reduced grading, loss of aggregate, and this program, and just so they knew, they talked about this in their last briefing on it…it was not for dust control. It was often a secondary benefit, but didn’t think the county could afford to get them into a dust control program unless they chose to allocate more funding for the effort…and that was a choice they could make, but it was a very expensive choice. They have done six roads, which he highlighted. They had about six or eight miles of road where they put down recycled asphalt on, and they have had varying degrees of

4 success. Sometimes they got a little wash boarded, and could be hard to deal with sometimes…they didn’t re-bond together. This was material they have taken off of their road that they were resurfacing, so it was free material, and it made good sense to use it. They were trying to be “green” he guessed they could say. They have treated roads…the first one they did was Skipper’s…all of these roads had a polymer added to them that basically looked like Elmer’s Glue, to put it simply. They put it on Skipper Rd, here in Conway, and about three months after that, they moved in and started logging, and wanted to haul the logs up and down the road, which was disconcerting to say the least. They worked with the loggers and the property owners, and ended up allowing them access to the last 100 feet on one end of the road. It reduced their exposure and also gave them a little bit of test that surprised them that it held up on the log trucks…they logged 120 acres out there. They put it on Grainger Road in District one…it was very successful and looked really good, and in Henrietta Bluff’s – the very south end of District seven…they put it down there about a month and a half ago he believed.

On the limestone surface, which was their coquina…it was what they had the most of and was most interested in, and that they conducted on the last two, New Road and Hucks Road. New Road had a polymer…New Road right here in Conway…it was actually named New Road, and didn’t know why it was named New Road, but assumed that at one time it was a “new” road. It had a polymer added to it, which was that Elmer’s Glue type material. It has performed very well so far. On Hucks Rd, it had something called “calcium chloride” on it…it was a material that basically absorbed water out of the air if you get 29% relative humidity. Water would actually be taken out of the air, even if it was during a dry period. Mr. P. Prince asked where the limestone came from. Mr. Gilreath said it came out of Wake stone. Mr. P. Prince said he was talking about the structure. Mr. Gilreath said it was coquina.

Edge Road was a little bit special. He showed them the locations of the road on the presentation, just south of Hwy 22, and said he would tell them a little bit more about it shortly. To tell them more about it…they tested five products. They were all polymers, enzymes, and chlorides. They worked by different methodologies and cost anywhere from $3,000 to $30,000 a month. The $30,000 per mile was very expensive. They were testing to see on small scales and haven’t done a mile of that, but were testing on small scales to see how effective they were. He showed them on the presentation the products they have used…the one in the middle and top was a calcium chloride vendor, EnviRemed, EnviroTac and Soil Works…they came from all over the country – California, Arizona, North Carolina, and Georgia. Mr. P. Prince asked if they did those, or did the company do them for the county. Mr. Gilreath said they purchased the materials from them and did the work in- house. They used Edge Road as a test because it was long enough and the majority of the traffic originated from the end of the roadway, which gave them a uniform study over all the products. They did four, one-quarter mile sections, enzyme, and three polymers, and the remainder of the road was done in calcium chloride because it was a bit cheaper – it was the $3,000 per mile range. They did four, four-mile sections that were labeled, and they were welcomed to go out in the field and take a look at it if they wanted to, but they were labeled tests A, B, C, and D. It was a semi-blind study of sorts…they were trying to evaluate the products, but not the name brand, so they would see which one performed the best. They were evaluated every week and were scored. In the interest of time, just to be brief, generally, all the products were put down the same, and he showed a picture of Grainger Road, up in District one. Generally, you roughened the surface and the material, and loosened the material, then you applied the material – the polymer being sprayed, but you applied the material, and then you reshape it and compact it, and it either dried or set, depending on which

5 side the material it was. The calcium chloride was a little bit different…basically you go the shape you wanted with the calcium chloride and the company came in and sprayed out of the back of a tanker truck, and that was all you had to do – it was a very simple process…that was encouraging but calcium had a shorter life span…it was cheaper to apply. He showed them a photo of Edge Rd – the first section where the enzyme had been applied. They had to use a motor grader to move the material from left to right and roll it back and forth to mix the material, and had to be real careful about getting it into the right place at the right time because once it sets, it sets. It was kind of like concrete, so you had to be expedient in your work. Basically, you just mixed the material, shaped it, compacted it, and that was it. They have had it down since the beginning of August on Edge Road, and September/October on some of the other roads, and wanted to continue to study it over the next year to two years and see how the benefits played out, and would come back at some point and give them another update…probably in another three or four months to see how they faired through the winter, which was their biggest concern. He asked if they had any questions, and showed them what the final product typically looked like. Some of the products had different characteristics – some were water resistant, and some were not. Some liked water, which was a good thing for them as well, but they were all different. If they went out to Edge Road, they would see how different they were. Mr. J. Prince said he has been down that road and encouraged them to do so…it was pretty neat to see – especially those of them that dealt with dirt roads. Mr. Gilreath said that dust control was a secondary benefit…there were some substantial benefits provided in dust control by some of the products…some didn’t have that effect as much as others.

Mr. J. Prince said that he was assuming at some point, he had a goal to come back to them to say he tested X, Y, and Z and that he thought they needed to do this, and to give them an idea of when that would be. Mr. Gilreath said his hope was that they could come back to them within probably a year, and would include some more testing in the upcoming budget to further expand the study. They felt good about what they’ve seen so far, and if everything fell apart this winter, they would come back at that point…certainly before it went for a final vote in the spring. They were going to propose some more funding for it…ideally, this would be so effective that they could reduce their motor grader fleet, they could reduce the amount of effort, time, and money they had to spend putting down coquina and scraping the road surface…such that it would be able to treat a substantial portion of the unpaved network. To give them a timeframe would be ambitious, but said that within a two-year range, they should know with a fair amount of certainty how well these things were going to do.

Mr. P. Prince said that for the public’s input and information, so that people knew that to pave a mile of Horry County dirt road, it costs more or less somewhere of $400,000 - $500,000. Mr. Gilreath said that was correct. Mr. P. Prince said that people kept after him asking why he didn’t pave this or that road, and the answer was because there wasn’t enough money to do it all at one time when you were talking about $400,000 - $500,000 per mile. Mr. Gilreath said that those costs included construction and utility relocation – they had to pay the utilities or the utilities wanted to be paid. Mr. J. Prince thanked Mr. Gilreath.

Fire Pump Request Letter (Anne Wright). Mrs. Wright said that she would be brief, as David (Gilreath) mentioned he would as well. Back in 1995, there were several businesses that made infrastructure improvements in the Fantasy Harbor area, and that allowed them to form a special district called Fantasy Harbor Admissions Tax District. An added benefit to that formation allowed the county to actually receive one-quarter of the admissions tax generated by those businesses after

6 the state took their collection fee from it. The taxes were remitted to the state and the state would then forward the county one-quarter of it to be used for infrastructure improvements related to or to benefit the Fantasy Harbor Admissions Tax District.

The first priority the funds were used for was the completion of the Fantasy Harbor Bridge, so the monies...as they came in were actually pledged against a loan from the SIB, and that money has since been paid. The second priority was approved by County Council by resolution in 2009, shortly after the Freestyle Music Park acquired property there, and the property owners agreed that they felt they would benefit from some road frontage directional signage.

The letter that was in their packet under item three for discussion items is on a Beach Church letterhead, but was actually coming from three businesses located within the Fantasy Harbor Admissions Tax District. Beach Church represented the sports mall and Strand Imports, and making the request for funding to come from the Admissions Tax fund for a particular purpose, which was a fire pump.

In the past, these requests that were financial in nature have come before the Administration Committee and Mr. Chairman had referenced that prior to the meeting, and believed that Mr. Gosnell, since he received the letter, was seeking input from the I & R Committee, but would also like to make a recommendation that the request be considered by the Administration Committee. Mr. J. Prince said he agreed. Mr. Eldridge said it was to boost the water pressure for the sprinkler system of those three buildings. They used to share another system, and whoever owned the park property cut them off.

Mr. J. Prince asked that with the special tax district, if the money was collected by businesses in that district. Mrs. Wright said they were no longer collecting any revenue – it was for a set period of time – 15 years. It began in 1995…there were five businesses, and then slowly, some of those businesses were no longer doing business. They were subject to the businesses actually collecting admissions tax…it was the nature of the business that would be subject to collecting admissions tax, but currently the Arrowhead Country Club and Medieval Times Theatre were two of the original businesses…and they no longer received the revenue from them because the 15-year period has expired. That’s the nature of the admissions tax district…to allow for the 15-year period for that revenue to be shared with the jurisdiction in which the district was located. Mr. P. Prince asked what they needed to do. Mr. Eldridge asked what the balance was now. Mr. P. Prince asked if the balance was $833,000. Mrs. Wright said that was what was shown, but in 2000 and the memo was done in 2009…her recollection off the top of her head was that it was closer to $600,000 because there was still time that those businesses were remitting as well as the season that Freestyle Music Park operated, they got the benefit of their admissions tax as well, so the number shown in the packet has grown since that time. Mr. P. Prince said that there was nothing they could do there today though…Mrs. Wright said that she wanted to make the recommendation that it be considered by the Administration Committee from the standpoint of looking at the compliance requirements on how those funds should be used. She was involved with the second designation resolution, and they actually contacted the businesses that contributed the admissions tax for their support or recommendation. Mr. J. Prince said for them not to take any action, but to request that the Administration Committee take it up. Mrs. Wright said that it would go before full council as a resolution if there was a recommendation that came from the Administration Committee.

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Mr. Loftus asked if they took the pumps or if they were just shut down. Mrs. Wright said it was her understanding that they shut them down. Mr. Eldridge said they shut them down…they said they were not going to maintain them anymore and cut them off. Mr. Loftus asked if that was in spite of the agreement. Mr. Eldridge and Mrs. Wright both said they gave notice. Mr. Loftus asked if it was 90 minutes or 90 days. Mr. Eldridge said it had been going on six to nine months…it had been going on awhile, and they gave them till so and so, then they pushed it out till the end of September and then to the end of this year. Mr. Loftus asked if The Plex wanted this. Mr. Eldridge said they were one, yes. Mrs. Wright said they were one that was requesting it, but were not one that contributed to the admissions tax. Mr. Eldridge said that part of the thing was public use…there would be some type of maintenance agreement he would think that they would want…there were issues to address. Mr. J. Prince thanked Mrs. Wright.

Lunch Wagon Permitting (Janet Carter). Mrs. Carter said there was a briefing memo that was handed out this morning and prepared by Mary-Catherine Cecil, one of their Planners, who had done some initial research into this. This was brought up at the last council meeting at public input, and the gentleman who spoke was there also. He was advocating that they should allow food trucks and temporary food vending in the county, and right now, they only did that in connection with special events. They have proposed that they do it on a year-round, regular basis. Back in 2010, they adopted an ordinance that allowed for hot dog carts, but push carts – where you could sell hot dogs and prepared foods, ice cream, and things like that – anything that DHEC allowed to be sold in those types of carts. It was a pretty stringent ordinance…they haven’t had any problems with it, and probably should relook at it, and perhaps consider loosening it up a bit. They wanted to start out stringent in application, and then later come back and look at it, so this would probably be a good time to do that.

What they would like to know from this committee was if they were interested in opening up Horry County to food trucks. By food trucks, she meant two different things. One would be, although she didn’t like the terminology, she has heard it be referred to as a roach coach, which was basically prepared foods, or packaged foods, where they were sold right out of the truck. People come out from a construction or job site and were able to purchase already prepared food. And of course, there were the full-blown food trucks, which was really a commercial kitchen on wheels. DHEC regulated both. If they looked on the back of their memo, they would see that staff checked with several jurisdictions in the state, and there was no consistent way of dealing with them…everyone was doing it differently. She would see that it was something that has picked up in popularity across the country, and there were a lot of positives, but of course some negatives too. From a staff perspective, if this committee was interested in pursuing it, what staff suggested was that they get a committee of stakeholders together, put together some proposals, and take it to the Planning Commission for their input, but they didn’t want to get all that going if they (the committee) were not interested in opening up the county to that type of business.

Mr. P. Prince said that he had a situation, where the Loris Middle School did a project, and it took about a year or so, and had probably 30 or more employees, and they had a convenience store come up close to them – within a couple of hundred yards. He would have a problem if a vendor went and set up there and took business away from the kinds of businesses that were established. He has watched it go on and that was where they came back and forth to get their sandwiches and things like that. Mrs. Carter said that has always been a concern, and was one of their biggest concerns. Mr. P. Prince said he understood that in the crowded areas, you didn’t want your employees leaving

8 and going back and forth all over the place…it created a traffic hazard, but if it was out in a rural area, he would hate to see someone just pull up and get in-between and set up a temporary business and get business off the businesses that were already there doing that business. Mrs. Carter said their concern was not only from convenience stores but from brick and mortar restaurants as well who were putting in the landscaping, parking, and adhering to all the codes that were required, and were then having to compete with someone in a truck. She would say that there were a lot of jurisdictions that have been able to work those issues out and do this quite successfully, and usually that was done with spacing – you could only be within so many feet of an existing, permitted, brick and mortar business. Again, it was a big step, and there wasn’t a lot of it going on in Horry County, but you would see some down in Charleston, Folly Beach, and Mt. Pleasant – places like that, and they were happy to put the work in and work with the folks to come up with something if the committee was interested in pursuing that.

Mr. P. Prince asked what they would have to do further than what they have already done in order to do this in Horry County…he thought they already had an ordinance that took care of that. Mrs. Carter said they did have one, but all they allowed were push carts for hot dogs, and they had to be on the site of an existing business for bathroom facilities and that sort of thing, and they were charged a $750 annual permit fee, which they have gotten a lot of complaints about as well, and they may want to relook at that. They did allow the pushcarts, but nothing motorized, or like she said, the trucks…they were just completely out of question at this point in time, and even the large pushcarts were limited in size. Mr. P. Prince asked that as of right now, that they couldn’t go to parks and recreation sites, or ball parks, where they already had their own concession stand to raise money for fundraisers, and if they couldn’t go to set up a business in those type of places. Mrs. Carter said that is correct, but they could if it was a special event…and only special events, like bike week, Blue Crab Festival, or things like that. They did allow them at that time and at those locations.

Mr. J. Prince asked how the areas that dealt with vending dealt with parking. He could see where it would be very complicated and potentially problematic dealing with parking, pulling off the side of the road, or a construction site…what were those rules? Mrs. Carter said that as she said, no one was doing it the same way, and she thought a lot of them just were not dealing with it from some of the regs she looked at, and those were the issues they had to hammer out…they had to go in more depth than where they had gone thus far in dealing with regulations. The last time she went to the American Planning Association conference, she went on a food truck tour, and they were parked on the city streets, and in two instances that they visited, they were near brick and mortar restaurants and seemed to be functioning fine – there didn’t seem to be any problems. They would gather weekly in a church parking lot for a food rodeo, and the whole community or neighborhood would come out and try different types of food, so it was being done and it was being done successfully. With regard to parking in those instances, they weren’t really doing anything about parking, but thought they would have to look at that. They limited their temporary vending permits by vending overlays, and would probably want to do something like that because you wouldn’t want them to all congregate on the beach, for example. If anything, you would want them to serve the underserved areas like factories or businesses in the rural part of the county that don’t have access to food without a good drive, but they would have to craft their regulations in order to make it work that way.

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Mr. J. Prince requested that the gentleman who spoke during public input at the last council meeting tell them what he wanted to do. The gentleman introduced himself as Carl Moser. He wanted to do a vending food truck, which was the pre-prepared food. He would go to places like Conway Ford, and pull up to the back of the shop, open the two doors up, they (employees) got a sandwich, and then you went to the next place. You were usually there about five to ten minutes and then you would go to the next spot. He has done a lot of research, and owned restaurants as well, but a lot of the questions about schools and that stuff there…they had regulations throughout the country, like in New York or Miami, Los Angeles, or Chicago. As far as schools went, an hour before school started, or an hour after school ended, they were not allowed anywhere near a New York school – they were off limits totally. Regarding parking off the streets and stuff, 20-feet from a traffic light, 20-feet from a fire hydrant, and no more than four hours at one time. With a big food truck, you couldn’t set up and work in 10 minutes. They gave them four hours, and in four hours, you were gone. The places he talked to in Myrtle Beach that had a vending license in Myrtle Beach said that from 10th Avenue to 38th Avenue…Ocean Blvd and down was off-limits. There was no vending there at all. As far as competition in regards to brick and mortar businesses, most of the places do not allow a food truck within three to five hundred feet of another actual brick and mortar restaurant serving the same product. In other words, if you were selling hamburgers or hotdogs, the truck could not be within three to five hundred feet of serving the same product. It gave a little bit of competition for the other vendors, but it could be regulated very well. Miami had over 700 food trucks in Miami alone, and it worked fine…like Janet said, it was just getting the regulations and getting the ball rolling…and if anyone violated the regulations, then you made the penalties stick. In other words, if you do, you lose your license for three months…you make it so they don’t want to violate that. There weren’t a lot of jobs out there right now and people were trying to start things to get work…that’s what everybody was trying to do. He had 158 resumes out, and had three returns – one from Hawaii and two from Belize, South America…there were just no jobs and this gave people an opportunity to create jobs, be self-employed, and bring taxes to the county and cities…and help build the city up…it was a $3.8 billion per year industry. Charleston was doing it very successfully, as Mrs. Carter said, but they were a little more lax on the parking up and down there.

The one thing he wanted to again stress was that if they made this happen, they should stress specifically, without a doubt, was that all trucks had to have a serve-safe manager. In other words, you had to go through a course and get serve-safe certified because you were dealing with hazardous foods, and these people doing the trucks should have full training about how to handle the food properly. They didn’t want to make people sick – they wanted to make sure they stayed well and that course was a very good course, and needed to be one of the stipulations. If they were going to have a food cart or food truck, they should be serve-safe certified so they knew proper temperatures and stuff.

Mr. J. Prince asked if there was a way they could get a few stakeholders involved in the discussion, maybe with staff, without immediately jumping out to a full scale, 500 hour job (inaudible), and get an idea of how many people would be interested in this…an idea of what restaurant owners were going to think about it, and how they would start that – small scale. Mrs. Carter said they could advertise and hold a public meeting to take input, and then summarize that and bring it back to the committee to let them know what they heard. Mr. J. Prince asked them to please do that. Mr. P. Prince agreed and said he was not ready to move on with anything at this time.

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Mr. Loftus said he had a few questions. If Miami did it, he didn’t care – nothing translated from Miami to Myrtle Beach – except the beginning letter. He said that Mr. Moser stated it was a $3.8 million industry, but asked what his source was. Mr. Moser said it came from a bunch of articles that were published online and what was called Intuit – they did a survey, and were doing very well with this…and it would keep increasing as the job market fell down, people were getting out to do things. The cost to do a brick and mortar restaurant was very, very, prohibitive. With most people, the banks were not loaning them money and you couldn’t get started. You could put together a truck for $20-$25,000 and work with that, but coming up with $4, $5, or $600,000 was almost impossible nowadays…people just couldn’t get it…a bank won’t work loan the money. Mr. Loftus said to trust him, he was all about entrepreneurship because it was part of what he did, but asked if he had done any market studies as to whether it was going to go, and what were the results. Mr. Moser said that for years, he ran one of the local grills in the area, and was also a manager of Bojangles in Conway, so he knew a lot of people, and had emails from people asking him when he was getting started because there was a need for people in the evenings, for people who worked at Wal-Mart, for example – there was no food in the area, except to drive down the road to The Cookout or to The Waffle House. If you had a half-hour lunch break, he could pop up there…and even talked to the manager of Wal-Mart – no problem, they could grab a hot sandwich and go. If they had to go to the Waffle House, they had to drive there, which would be five minutes over there and five minutes back, they wait for their food, there was no time to eat, they had to rush back and get back in, so there was a need for it – especially for people that worked at night. People that worked during the day…they couldn’t get out, you could go to the auto garages and stuff, or to the auto dealerships that had 15 to 20 employees where it was hard for them to get out, but they could run outside, grab a sandwich, and go back to work, so there was a need for it. Mr. Loftus said he might perceive there was a need, but wondered if the customer perceived there was a need. In other words, Mr. Moser was going on anecdotal stuff and no sort of methodology or anything. Mr. Moser said no, just by talking with people that he knew worked at these different businesses. Mr. Loftus said he would hate to go through all this and then end up with only two food trucks that were gone within six months, yet they expended all this energy.

Mr. J. Prince asked to let Janet (Carter) and her crowd advertise for a public meeting to take public input…that would be a minimal expenditure, and they would go from there. He asked if that was ok with the committee, and asked Mrs. Carter if she needed anything else from them. Mrs. Carter said they would schedule that and report back the results. However, because of the timing this year, she didn’t think it would be so successful in December, so they probably needed to wait until January to do that if that was ok. They had trouble getting turnout at meetings during the holidays.

Mr. Loftus said he had a question for either Janet or Arrigo. He asked that in regards to DHEC, if the vehicle was preparing foods, if DHEC covered it. Mrs. Carter said that they covered it whether they were preparing it or if they were selling prepared foods. Mr. Loftus asked that in other words, if they went and loafs of sandwiches were already made, prepaid, and wrapped in cellophane, if DHEC still covered it. Mrs. Carter said yes. Mr. Moser thanked the committee. Mr. J. Prince asked that they talk amongst themselves…he needed a two-minute break.

RESOLUTIONS

Resolution authorizing the Solid Waste Authority to purchase a grinder in lieu of the compactor approved in the FY 14 budget (Mike Bessant). Mrs. Sandee Garigen said that Mr.

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Bessant with the Solid Waste Authority was going to explain the resolution authorizing the Solid Waste Authority to purchase a grinder in lieu of a compactor approved in the fiscal year ’14 budget.

Mr. Bessant said that in August of 2003, County Council asked the Solid Waste Authority to put in their by-laws that any changes in capital purchases over $50,000 to be brought to council for a resolution. In last year’s budget, they put a steel-wheel compactor in the budget, and had a need because of the metal, and two – the debris and metal yard waste stuff, they needed an additional grinder, so they were asking council to approve them substituting not buying the steel-wheel compactor, which was $800,000 and instead buy a grinder (wood grinder), not to exceed $500,000. Mr. P. Prince said that wasn’t a change in the budget…the money was in their budget. Mr. Bessant said yes, they already had the money in the budget, but it was such a gray area that they wanted to make sure they covered all the bases by coming by and asking because they listed the steel-wheel compactor as a capital purchase, and not the wood-grinder in their budget, so they needed to change it. Mr. Loftus asked if they were asking for permission not to spend as much money as you thought. Mr. Bessant said pretty much. Mr. P. Prince moved to send it on to full council.

Mr. Loftus asked why they were switching…he didn’t have a problem with it, but wanted to know why. Mr. Bessant said the amount of land debris had increased over the last few years….yard waste had increased and had only one unit running and couldn’t keep up with it. The pile just kept getting bigger and they needed a wood-grinder. Mr. Grabowski asked if they were going to need the compactor at a future date. Mr. Bessant said they had an additional compactor in for next year that they already had in their budget for next year, and then another one the following year, so they probably would, based on a number of things. They may or may not need it, but if they did, they would put it back in their budget in three, four, or five years. Mr. Grabowski made a motion to send it to full council with a recommendation for approval. The motion passed unanimously.

ORDINANCES

An ordinance amending Chapter 10.5 (Solid Waste), Article II (Applicability), of the Horry County Code of Ordinances, so as to provide for certain modifications to the County’s Flow Control Law (Arrigo Carotti). Mr. Carotti said as everyone was aware, in April 2009, County Council passed the Flow Control Ordinance, which has been subject to much debate since that period of time. He had recently been asked to draft an ordinance which would remove construction and demolition debris and waste from the ordinance. The ordinance now included both MSW and C&D, so the request was made to remove C&D for a variety of reasons.

A draft, which he prepared, was circulated among council, as well as delivered to the Solid Waste Authority for review and consideration, and should be recognized that it contained three components. One had to do with C&D actually being delivered to the Hwy 90 facility. That was the biggest concern and component of flow control, but there were two other components, which were just as important. One had to do with C&D being hauled by haulers, or hauling companies. There was a stated business concern as part of the analysis whether or not to remove C&D for council consideration. The second was for individuals hauling or bringing C&D somewhere. He didn’t take that provision out, but it was easy to take that out of the ordinance so that not only haulers could bring their C&D to other facilities other than designated facilities by the Solid Waste Authority, but also individuals – he didn’t include that in the proposed draft, but it was easy to include.

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The third component was a licensing component. He did not remove that from the proposed draft, but it was within the discretion of council to remove that as well to not require C&D haulers to be licensed by the Solid Waste Authority. The reason he didn’t remove that was because it should be recognized that flow control established and emphasized concerns, not only about waste that crossed the scales at the Hwy 90 facility, but also addressed environmental concerns that the Solid Waste Authority should be interested in, in terms of collection, transportation, and disposal – whether it be at the Hwy 90 facility or not. So, he kept in the licensing component in the proposed amendment, but again, that was within the discretion of County Council to remove the licensing requirements of C&D haulers, or to keep it in, but at the same time, not requiring or removing the requirement now that C&D by haulers, and if council desired, individuals as well, to remove the requirement that it be delivered to designated facilities such as the one on Hwy 90, so that it could be taken out of the county. There was an issue raised about equal protection…there was a general misunderstanding about what the equal protection clause actually meant, but he would be happy to address those issues as well.

Mr. Loftus said he wanted to talk about the independent haulers for a moment. He asked if currently, they allowed a guy in a pickup truck with a load of C&D to go to the landfill. Mr. Bessant said yes. Mr. Loftus asked even if he was not licensed. Mr. Bessant said yes. Mr. Loftus asked if they had to be licensed, or could he load up his pickup truck and haul stuff. Mr. Bessant said if he were an individual owner he could…if it was something he did. Mr. Loftus asked that if you were hauling it for hire, did you? Mr. Bessant said that was correct. Mr. Loftus said he could understand that, and asked if there was any thought that under a certain weight, they could take it where they wanted to and not be licensed. If they were hauling less than one ton, did they have to be licensed? Of course, they could still make a lot of runs – he knew that. Right now, a guy that tore down a garage to build another garage had to be licensed to haul it wherever. Mr. Grabowski said he had to haul it to an approved facility, and not dump it in the middle of 50 acres somewhere. Mr. Loftus said that it happened…he was complicating things though.

Mr. J. Prince said in order to simplify that part of it, basically, if they required the haulers to be licensed…and he wasn’t advocating one side or the other on that, but if they required that anybody for hire continued to have to do that, they would basically mandate some three or four hundred. He asked how many C&D people they had. Mr. Bessant said they had over 400. Mr. J. Prince said with over 400 being required to be licensed, which he guessed was good, and also have a haulers license…their Solid Waste Authority was going to have to police them all. It was just a matter of whether they wanted to continue to do that for any particular reason…he thought at the time that the haulers license was free. Mr. Bessant said they just had to have a business license in order to get. Mr. J. Prince said that they were basically policing our business licensing department…he didn’t mind the change there if they were going to do away with the C&D licensing as far as haulers went…if they were hauling only C&D. Two, it was giving a disadvantage to the Solid Waste Authority in that…he hated to say it, but say that someone in the county for two weeks doing a job, it’s likely they wouldn’t have a business license in Horry County, and to keep from getting one, they would probably bypass the SWA if they were going to make them have a haulers license. He thought that had been the argument and the downside to that. Mr. Loftus commented that if they did licensing, they were going to end up with a lot of stuff in the woods around the county. Mr. J. Prince said that they were doing licensing now. Mr. Grabowski said his concern was that if they didn’t do licensing, that they would end up with that problem.

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Mr. P. Prince asked what the 400 number came from, and if that was the number of businesses that were doing that. Mr. Bessant said there were 400 contractors, and they hauled their own and there were also had a lot of small individual contractors that were doing work for hire…and they were coming in. Mr. Loftus said like Flagship Construction, for example. Mr. Bessant said if they brought their own, they would have to be providers. Mr. P. Prince asked if they already had a Horry County business license. Mr. Bessant said that probably 50% of them didn’t have them when they came through the gate with a load…Mr. P. Prince asked about the construction haulers. Mr. Bessant said not necessarily…Mr. J. Prince said they were supposed to be. Mr. Loftus said that when they came for their hauling license, the first question they were asked was to show them their business license…that way they got both. Mr. Grabowski said he didn’t have a problem with that.

Mr. Loftus said that it seemed they didn’t have any problem taking C&D out of the picture, but were having problems on who was going to haul it where, and they didn’t care where they hauled it, they just wanted to know who was hauling it. Mr. J. Prince said that was right…but to slow down, because it was important that they got it right. Mr. Grabowski said it was important they knew where they hauled it also…they had approved places in Horry County that they could haul it to, and they should only haul it to those approved places. Now, if they want to haul it outside the county, they had no jurisdiction over where they were dumping it outside the county or where they were taking it to…that would be the adjoining county’s responsibility to make sure…Mr. J. Prince said it was already illegal to dump…Mr. Grabowski said it was illegal to dump, but they needed to insure that they were either hauling it to an approved place in the county or that it was going out of the county. Mr. Loftus said that if they were hauling it to destinations in Horry County, it had to be an approved site. Mr. Grabowski agreed that it had to be an approved site and asked Mr. Loftus if he knew where those approved sites were. Mr. J. Prince said that again, that was pretty much the law as it was…if you were legally hauling C&D, it had to be at an approved site or it was illegal…nothing was going to change that. Mr. Grabowski said there wasn’t nothing they were going to do that was going to stop that. Mr. J. Prince said that was exactly right. He personally didn’t see a need to do it, but again, they needed to help him…he would say that the Authority would rather not have to police it. Mr. Loftus agreed and didn’t think they wanted to do that…Mr. Bessant said they had no enforcement power. Mr. J. Prince said he guessed he would say that they would be just as well as a redundant measure for them to do the same thing that DHEC said in state law already, so to just do away with the C&D haulers license. Mr. Carotti asked if the other thing they wanted was to extend it to other individuals as well…as haulers.

Mr. J. Prince said that Mr. P. Prince educated him on it a long time ago. He asked him a question…that if he lived in Spring Branch or Murrells Inlet, and he tore down a block shelter in his backyard…he was in Spring Branch and had three miles to go to the closest C&D landfill, and if he was in Murrells Inlet, the closest would be their landfill…it’s all C&D but legally…he couldn’t legally take it over there, which had been problematic. He knew if you were in the center of the county, you didn’t hear about that. Just as a matter of fairness, if they were going to do the C&D thing, individuals…and he didn’t think they would lose much with individuals…it was only going to be the outskirts of the county and thought they were going to do it either way – it was just going to be legal or illegal. He thought they needed to allow individuals to take their own stuff to a South Carolina landfill to any approved site. Mr. Grabowski agreed. Mr. Loftus asked if anyone could haul to the landfill, but if they were doing it for hire, if they had to have a license. Mr. J. Prince said not with C&D…but thought that they had to have a state license, and asked if there was a state license for C&D haulers. The only law that he knew of this moment was that they were supposed to

14 carry to an approved site and not in the woods. Other than that, if they were going to allow the businesses to move around the C&D, they needed to allow individuals to do it too.

Mr. Loftus said he hated to pick on Flagship Construction, but it was the only company he had in his head at the time, and asked if Flagship was doing demo because they were building a development and they had to tear down some buildings that were already there, and they were obviously doing it for hire because they were getting paid to do it, were they saying that if you were doing it for hire that you had to be licensed, regardless of where you took it, as long as it was an approved landfill. Could anyone do it and if an individual on his own didn’t have to be licensed? Mr. J. Prince said he thought they just agreed that it would be problematic to require the license on C&D, period. Mr. Loftus said he didn’t disagree with that. Mr. J. Prince said they would continue that with the MSW…and asked if they could do that because obviously, they wanted that to continue. Mr. Grabowski agreed.

Mr. J. Prince said that pertaining to C&D haulers or loads of C&D…whether you had to be particularly a C&D hauler he didn’t know, but if it was C&D waste, then you didn’t have to be a licensed hauler to haul to the authority. Mr. Carotti said regarding what he was discussing, no, it would be taken out. That requirement would be removed from their flow control ordinance. The only issue they were handling was in carrying disposal of the C&D material to a designated facility, which, at this time was the Solid Waste Authority on Hwy 90 or somewhere else. That removed that requirement with respect to haulers. The only question remaining was if they wanted to remove that requirement with respect to individuals as well. Individuals that were not haulers, and were not licensed, could take it anywhere else as well. Mr. Loftus said he didn’t mean for them to be able to dump it in the woods, obviously. Mr. J. Prince said it had to be a legal place. Mr. Carotti said yes, it had to be another facility – an appropriate facility for disposal. Mr. Loftus said that was fine with him.

Mr. P. Prince asked in regards to C&D, what you could bury on your own property. Mr. Bessant said that was regulated under DHEC regulations and didn’t know the particular law, but knew that sometimes they allowed you to use trucks to fill with concrete and stuff like that…they haven’t been allowing anything else, but that was regulated through DHEC’s regulations. If you had to separate concrete now, it wasn’t regulated through flow control. Mr. P. Prince said that what he was saying was that if you had a hole that you wanted to fill up, that right now you could put blocks or cement in the hole and bury it. Mr. Bessant said that currently, you could. Mr. P. Prince said there was no rule on that. Mr. Bessant added that if DHEC agreed with it, but not our ordinance. Mr. Loftus said he was always afraid to ask this question, but if you were using concrete and so forth as riprap to keep your property from eroding along the waterway, if you needed the Corp (of Engineers) as well. Mr. Bessant said that the Corp and DHEC were state regulated and had nothing to do with them or the current ordinance. Mr. Frazier said that was what bothered him was that anybody can dump anywhere…that bothered him a lot. They had a problem in South Carolina right now…they were hauling it out of New York, New Jersey, and everywhere else, and bringing it down to South Carolina. Those that were born and raised here don’t want that and don’t need that, but anybody…he didn’t care who it was…could just pick it up and carry it to anywhere they wanted it to go was not good for them. They lived on the lower part of the state and right now, last year, when they checked the water in Myrtle Beach, they knew what happened down in Myrtle Beach, but when they were dumping up in Lee County it was running down to them (Horry County) because they were on the lower part of the state. His thing was that if they were doing it, and doing

15 it right…let them keep doing it right. Other than that, he wouldn’t go along with people just dumping it wherever they wanted to dump it. Mr. Loftus said they couldn’t dump it wherever they wanted.

Mr. J. Prince said he thought that Lee County had a big MSW landfill up there, or the I-20 Mountain. Mr. Frazier said it was a mountain…about three to four miles… (inaudible). Mr. Loftus said he thought it was off exit 116 or 120…Mr. J. Prince said that he thought they had been the subject of a lot of the “Don’t dump on South Carolina.” He hadn’t gotten there yet, but was going to go ask Lee County. Mr. Loftus asked if they prohibited out of county here. Mr. Bessant said yes. Mr. Loftus asked that if a hauler came from anywhere outside this county, they couldn’t go to the Solid Waste Authority. Mr. Bessant said that was correct. Mr. Frazier said they didn’t have to go to the Solid Waste Authority…they could go up to Lee County and then it came down to them. Mr. Loftus said he understood that, but all they could do in that regard was to give their support to SCAC in what they were doing. Mr. Frazier said that just because other counties allowed it didn’t mean they needed to allow it in Horry County. Mr. Loftus suggested a resolution supporting SCAC in their efforts to keep out of state waste in any landfill in South Carolina. Mr. J. Prince said that before he went there, he didn’t know that they needed to have a resolution stating that. Mr. Loftus said he was asking for support for the position of the South Carolina Association of Counties. Mr. J. Prince said he was all for that, but again, it was a separate issue and needed to discuss that at some point because home ruled said that each county could do what they wanted to. Mr. Loftus said he was just trying to get to what Mr. Frazier was asking….did they need to discuss a resolution, yes. Mr. J. Prince said he agreed, and that might be an appropriate time, unless he wanted to do the video, then it would be an appropriate time to deal with the video as they did the resolution. Mr. Frazier said that would be fine. Mr. Grabowski said they were separate issues. Mr. J. Prince said that was right. They were getting kind of off the beaten path here. He asked if there were any more questions on this.

They had an amendment before them and they needed to decide if they were going to let it go to council with a recommendation to approve. Mr. Grabowski said he was in favor of the amendment, provided that they had language in there stating that the C&D waste needed to be taken to an approved site. Mr. Carotti said it would be in there. Mr. J. Prince asked that they make a statement of what they were going to try to have…if they were going to do this. Mr. Loftus said an approved site within Horry County. If they took it out of Horry County….Mr. Grabowski said they had no jurisdiction. Mr. Carotti said they when they said approved, they could word it “an appropriate disposal facility” or something like that. Mr. J. Prince added within our borders. Mr. Loftus said no…appropriate within our borders, but outside our borders, an appropriate landfill. Mr. Bessant said that was right.

Mr. P. Prince said he had two or three examples he wanted to be clear on, and that he would use himself as an example. If he had a block building with a cement slab and wanted to tear it down, and he had a friend that was in North Carolina that would bring the equipment to tear it down because he wanted the equipment, either because he wanted to buy that material for his plant in North Carolina or he could give it to him, and asked if the amendment would prohibit it or allow it. He asked what was wrong with a person being allowed to sell his product for a profit. Mr. Grabowski said he would have to get a business license. Mr. P. Prince said he was talking about an individual tearing his block building down and either selling the product with the option of the brick, mortar, etc…, and he wanted to take it to North Carolina…it’s gone and done with…he didn’t

16 want to prohibit somebody from being able to give it to somebody…and they could come and get it and take it away. Mr. Loftus asked that if he was taking it to a place he called appropriate, if it was allowed. Mr. Carotti said that the way the ordinance was written now spoke to disposal of – not resale or anything of that nature, but he could put something in to specifically exclude that scenario from the flow control ordinance, which, the intent of flow control didn’t really deal with that. Mr. Grabowski said he thought it was already included. Mr. Carotti said by implication, but he could put something specific in there. Mr. Loftus said it didn’t say it could be done, but it didn’t say it couldn’t be done. Mr. Bessant said that it currently said that if its mixed construction, it had to go to a designated site. Mr. Grabowski asked what that meant. Mr. Bessant said if it was concrete, wood, steel, etc… Mr. Grabowski said it was still C&D. Mr. Bessant said if you separated it and it was just concrete then it wasn’t regulated. If you took all the wood out, then it was separate and was not regulated. If you took all the metal out of it, then it was not regulated in terms of flow control. Mr. J. Prince said he saw it being a bit problematic when they started saying what somebody could do with it when they left our borders. Mr. P. Prince said yeah, because it belonged to them. Mr. Loftus said that once they go over the border, they had no jurisdiction. Mr. J. Prince said to answer what he was asking…currently, under the flow control ordinance, the scenario he just said would be illegal…or they could carry C&D out of the county. Mr. Bessant said no, if it was concrete they could take it wherever they wanted to. Mr. J. Prince asked what if they had mixed concrete with two by fours and pins. Mr. Bessant said that then, they couldn’t…they would have to separate. Mr. P. Prince asked if that meant he couldn’t just give it to someone who lived in North Carolina. Mr. Bessant said if it was pure concrete, he could. Mr. J. Prince said there has been an argument about that prior to it being crushed because it was raw. Mr. Bessant said if it was being used…that was the way they currently looked at it. Mr. J. Prince said that basically, they wanted it to be crushed on-site before they carried it out. Mr. Bessant said they could take it somewhere else as long as it was to a crushing site and they have done that. Mr. J. Prince asked if this amendment would continue to allow mixed…if you had mixed two by fours, concrete, and tin in the same thing and somebody wanted it, you could carry it. Mr. Loftus said that instead of concrete only, they were allowing mixed now. Mr. P. Prince said if he understood it, if it was separated, he could give it or sell it to anybody he wanted to. Mr. Grabowski said he could do that right now. Mr. Loftus said if this passed and it was mixed, he could do it…if this passed as is. Mr. Carotti said if they removed it, then that wasn’t a concern anymore – mixed or separate…it didn’t matter. The concern was that the detail he was trying to grasp a hold of was whether they still required it to be sent to an appropriate disposal facility, even if it was out of the county…they were going to include that requirement that it was to an appropriate disposal facility anyway, but the scenario where you were selling it – it wasn’t going to a disposal facility, so they could carve out a little exception that excluded it as resale of C&D materials. It didn’t have to be delivered to an appropriate disposal facility because they were not being disposed of. Mr. Loftus said he thought that a recycling plant would be an appropriate facility. Mr. Carotti said that it was because it was being disposed of, and resale was a form of disposal, but it could construed otherwise…but he could clarify that to carve that out to make it clear that you could resale it. Mr. J. Prince added you can’t police it…they hadn’t been policing it with individuals anyway…but it’s been illegal in some cases.

Mr. P. Prince said that right now, there were a lot of people that went around and picked up metals, copper, or aluminum, or any kind of metal that they got…and asked if right now, they could pick it up and take it to sell at recycling places. Mr. Bessant said the ordinance actually encouraged people to separate it and resell it or recycle…the ordinance allowed for that currently, so if you separated it you could sale it. You could take the wood out of construction as long as you took it and grinded it

17 up and sold it for wood chips. If your company was outside of the county recycling wood chips and grinding up construction wood, and took it and grinded it up, you could take it out of the county currently. Mr. J. Prince added as long you were not hauling concrete and the rebar. If you were hauling the concrete and the rebar, you had to carry it to the Authority under the current ordinance. Mr. P. Prince asked that if they passed this, if you had a person that had a dump truck and he wanted to go around to peoples places and pick up just cement blocks or bricks, and he had a place he wanted to sell it to – a legitimate place in Horry County or any other county, could he do that if the amendment passed. Staff said yes. Mr. J. Prince asked if there was anything else. Mr. P. Prince asked if they were going to have a workshop for this with council before it went to full council, or would this be good enough from I&R to go before council, or would it be enough information. Mr. J. Prince said they would leave that up to the chairman. Mr. P. Prince said he was there. Mr. J. Prince said he must have slipped in on him. Mr. Lazarus said he thought this would be fine to go to council. Mr. J. Prince said they needed to, as always, try to educate…they’ve been in trouble before with other issues, but should educate council members, and that was part of what committees were supposed to do. They were supposed to work on this, which as they all knew, they have worked on it for a long while, but they needed to be educating their council members.

Mr. P. Prince asked that if a contractor was doing a house, and he had his boxes out at his house, yet he’s at Spring Branch building a house, and he took his wood and threw all his wood in that box…and then took all his concrete, brick, and mortar and threw it in another box, if he was at Spring Branch, could he haul it over to Fair Bluff, and just give it to them, or would he be restricted from doing that. Mr. J. Prince said not with this amendment, he wouldn’t…if he separated it all, but if he had concrete and rebar together, or concrete and a two by four, he cannot. Mr. P. Prince asked what if he put everything in one box from building a house…and then carried it over there, or somebody took to Fair Bluff, what they cared if it was mixed or not…it was going over there. Mr. J. Prince said they didn’t care if it was mixed…that was what the amendment was allowing – it was allowing for that to happen. Currently, it couldn’t happen, but this amendment was allowing that to happen. Mr. Grabowski said he thought they should proceed with this amendment. Mr. P. Prince said this also helped to cut down on the costs with people building. He asked if right now, the rule they had like it was that they had to be checked before they got a C.O. Mr. J. Prince said yes. Mr. Loftus said a C.O. didn’t have anything to do with trash. Mr. J. Prince said it did to. Mr. Loftus said that a C.O. was the certificate of occupancy…that meant that the building was ok to go into…it had nothing to do with hauling (inaudible). Mr. J. Prince said it has been a way for them to police it. Basically, if you didn’t have all your tickets, they as a county would hold up the C.O. till after punishment had been enough. Mr. Grabowski said they needed to move forward with the amendment. Mr. J. Prince asked for a motion. Mr. Grabowski made a motion to send to full council with a recommendation for approval. The motion passed unanimously.

Mr. J. Prince said as far as the SCAC and the resolution, he suggested getting together with Mr. Carotti…he thought they needed to be supportive. Mr. Lazarus asked Mr. Frazier to get that to Arrigo (Carotti), and then get it to him, and they would get that done.

Mr. P. Prince said that before he left, he wanted to ask about an ordinance that they had about the grinding of concrete and all that stuff, and wanted to know if they were going to work on that another meeting or two before they sent it to full council. Mr. J. Prince said he didn’t know…he had to see it and get their opinion, so he couldn’t say that.

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Mrs. Garigen said they would take the next two ordinances together, and would be presented by Mr. John Danford.

An ordinance to amend Appendix B, Zoning Ordinance, Article XII, Section 1207 of the Horry County Code of Ordinances pertaining to firearm training and sports facilities (John Danford) and, An ordinance to amend the Horry County Code to adopt procedures for the issuance of a firearm training and sports facilities permit upon approval of County Council by resolution after public hearing (John Danford). Mr. Danford said good morning, and that he believed they had been briefed enough on the purpose of this…it was to establish conditional uses for firearm training and sports facilities in the county in specified zoning districts. Part of this effort was to establish some kind of technical review and permitting process for those facilities.

On October 24th of this year, this ordinance went forward to the Public Safety Committee and it came out of that committee favorable with some changes. One of those changes required them to create two separate ordinances. The reason being was that Councilman Schulz asked that County Council be the technical review body for these facilities and in order to do that, they wanted to maintain what they’ve done in the past with telecommunications facilities and mining facilities where there was a permitting process via resolution by County Council. What they did was they took the whole technical review process out of the zoning code and put it in the general code, creating a permitting process for County Council to review.

Other changes that were made coming out of that committee were that they really needed to define the difference between a commercial facility and a public facility. Councilman Schulz and the rest of the committee asked that public facilities be party to these regulations as well, so they have included any facility built by the state, operated by the state, and as well as the county of Horry.

Regarding the Zoning Ordinance, there were other changes as well. They heard back from area headquarters in Virginia. They wanted them to change a little bit of the language regarding substantial harmony with their design guidelines and best practices, so under C-1, they tweaked it a little to line up with what the NRA was looking for.

Another change regarding concealed weapons permits was because they have set up the technical review process through County Council, they did not want to have a CWP operator get mixed up in a long technical review…that was never the intent. From the beginning of this process, working with Mr. Ted Gragg, they wanted to make sure that they didn’t get these little operators mixed into this. Mr. Loftus wanted to make sure they were not going to review everyone that got a CWP in Horry County. Mr. Danford said that was what they were trying to avoid and why they made the change there, so if you’re licensed to instruct in the state of South Carolina, you didn’t have to go through technical review. They would like to see the plans come into the office so that they knew where your office was and that you’ve designed your range for projectile containment.

The other major addition to the zoning side of this is that they have excluded ranges from the 540 Review, and so in a lot of these zoning districts, public facilities were allowed via a 540 Review…there was nothing else that they really had to follow. Again, Public Safety wanted these to go through a technical review process, and so these ranges would be exempt from a 540 Review…they would have to go through the technical review process. So, each of those zoning districts – FA, CFA, so on and so forth were exempt and that had been added to the zoning side.

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Regarding the permitting through a technical review process, the only thing they did was to take the technical review out of the zoning ordinance and they put it into the general code. The only other major change was that they increased the fee from $250 to $500. The reason being was that they had to notify all property owners within 1,000 feet of a facility and that took a lot of stamps and a lot of paper. They wanted to make sure that they had enough coming in with the application that they covered those fees associated with notification.

Other than that, since back in the beginning of this process in 2012, the spirit of what they were looking for really hasn’t changed. The meetings he and Mr. Gragg have had the past six months weren’t about the principle and the idea as much as making sure the language captured what they were trying to accomplish, and he thought that Mr. Gragg signed off on it, and he certainly liked the product as its been proposed.

Mr. J. Prince thanked Mr. Gragg and asked if he had anything he would like to add. Mr. Gragg said that after working with John (Danford) and reviewing the processes, he thought they were on the right track and that it all sounded good. On another note, he hadn’t had a chance to address all of them, but thanked them for getting the Horry County Museum where it was now…he appreciated it. Mr. J. Prince thanked Mr. Gragg for his hard work. He knew the Public Safety Committee had worked hard on this. A lot of the work was protecting gun rights and rights as individuals…there was a great fear anytime they started talking about managing firearms in some way, and Mr. Grabowski had been all over this.

Mrs. Carter asked that if she could make a comment, the change Mr. Danford talked about, where right now in the Zoning Ordinance in most of their zoning districts, public facilities were allowed with just a 540 Review. A 540 Review was a review by the Planning Commission to determine whether or not the proposal was consistent with the Comprehensive Plan. If the Planning Commission gave it a thumbs up, then it could be built, and that was the process they used for fire stations, libraries, or any public facility that the county was building. Coming out of Public Safety, per Mr. Schulz’ request specifically, he wants the firearm training facilities to not fall under that 540 Review, but to go through the full notification and council process, so that was a significant change, and she just wanted to make sure the committee was aware of that. Mr. J. Prince said he was in agreement with that. Mr. Grabowski wanted to make sure that this still didn’t infringe upon the right of somebody that owned a bunch of property and wanted to go out and shoot in their backyard. Mr. J. Prince said that was correct. Mrs. Carter also said that was correct, and that this applied to commercial and public firing ranges…outdoor ranges.

Mr. J. Prince said they currently did not have a quorum of council there today, but with that being the case, he asked Mr. Frazier if he had any input and how he felt about it. Mr. Frazier said he agreed with it. He lived in the country where people could walk out on their land and shoot their gun. Mr. Grabowski moved to send to full council with a recommendation for approval. The motion passed unanimously.

An ordinance to adopt the Racepath Neighborhood Revitalization Plan as an amendment to the Horry County Comprehensive Plan, Envision 2025 (Adam Emrick). Mr. Emrick said they have been working on a Racepath plan for a little over a year. Racepath, as they may know, was a donut hole within the City of Myrtle Beach, but was unincorporated county. It was located between Hwy 501 and Grissom Parkway. They could see a map of it…it was a pretty small community…about 200 parcels, or thereabouts. There were some very large parcels and some very

20 small parcels. As they started working on this neighborhood plan, four main issues came out that the neighborhood was facing, and four reasons that they were there at all.

The first was public safety. There was a rampant drug problem in this community…drug dealers on the streets every time they were in the community – whether it be day or evening. They personally witnessed drug deals going down on the street. Since they started the plan, the police presence in the community has gone up dramatically. Just earlier this week in fact, they saw in the Sun News a number of busts that were happening there. It was an ongoing problem, but the solution was developing as they spoke.

The next issues were Zoning, Code Enforcement, Housing, and Infrastructure. He would go through each one of them individually and how they’ve addressed them. They were the four recurring themes that came up each time they talked to anybody in the community, had any community meetings, and met with a number of individual stakeholders, and the four same things kept coming up.

Public Safety. The ways they needed to increase public safety was to number one – they needed to increase the police presence. That meant a number of different things and within the plan they would see individual strategies that addressed each of those goals, but increasing the police presence was definitely one of the main focuses they needed to work on.

They needed to encourage more community presence. If they looked at the number of calls within the community right now to the police, they would see that they were going down. What that doesn’t implicate was an improvement in the crime…it indicated that that the community has given up. They needed to encourage that community to come back and buy in. In the past, they have had community outreach groups, they have had take back our streets events, and have by and large, been phased out. They were reaching a point now, since they started the plan that they were coming back. He was going to interrupt himself now…this plan was different than any other one they’ve ever written in that it was being implemented before the plan was actually adopted. A number of the strategies they have recommended have already taken place. The public safety, he thought, was the biggest one that has taken place in that the police have reacted to the problem in the community with great success, and with great attention. They have been at every meeting they have had, the community has seen more presence, and like he said, the drug busts were going up. They knew that there were two primary drug dealers and one of them has already been arrested since the plan had been worked on. The community presence was coming back, and a lot of policy decisions in the past that weren’t being made were now being made at the police level…public safety has bought in incredibly well. Again, it was already being implemented to some extent. If they looked through some of the strategies, they might recognize some of them…some of them have already come across their desks.

Zoning and Code Enforcement were next. Several months ago, they approved the Priority Investment Zone for the Racepath Community. What they noticed out there was that a number of the parcels were overcrowded. There were mobile homes – sometimes three, four, sometimes as many as seven mobile homes on one parcel. They were either not permitted when they were put out there or they predated zoning. What that prevented was any improvements for those homes being done, so there was an increasing level of dilapidation for the homes, and they were not able to get building permits to improve those. They put forward the Priority Investment Zone several months ago, and that addressed a lot of those nonconformities to allow housing to be improved by being

21 able to pull building permits and be able to seek money that was previously not allowed within the community. That was one of the nonconformities that they have addressed with the Priority Investment Zone. They were also working with Code Enforcement to encourage coordination with the community. They didn’t want Code going out there and start citing all the property owners for the obvious violations they had. They wanted them to work with the property owners to try to encourage ways to improve properties to make it so they could stay in their homes and live in a quality of life that was expected. Both of these leaned to the housing.

They needed to encourage and repair the rehabilitation of housing, improve the quality and durability of housing, increase the quantity of affordable housing, and resolve the numerous heirs’ property issues out there. A lot of this implementation was going to be happening through their Community Development Department, which has already started with grants. They were a CDBG entitlement community, which meant if it was a low to moderate income area, they qualified for a large number of grants. Reverend Gause, who was sort of the unofficial community leader out there, just moved back in his house. He was one of the first guinea pig projects for CDBG. Mr. J. Prince said he was a great guy. Mr. Emrick agreed, and said it was great to see the amount of improvements they were able to make to his home. The entire community was bringing applications. He thought there were as many as 10 applications that have been received or accepted, but they were going to redo the houses, and there were like 10 or 12 more out there that they expected to come in, so when you considered the relatively small area, the number of applications that have already come in for CDBG money was pretty impressive, so the community was going to be rebounding.

The heirs’ property issue…if they weren’t familiar with the heirs’ property issue…essentially, if a property owner died without a will, the property should be probated to go to the next set of heirs. What has happened was that since the 1950’s when the community started developing was that probates were not done, so they had properties that now were owned by as many as 70 different individuals. They cannot be improved, you could not ascertain ownership, and the community, by and large, cannot afford to go through the process by which was required to be able to do that. CDBG and Community Development have actually already contracted with a law firm with the South Carolina Legal Services to resolve the heirs’ property issues where it impacted community development funds. Again, it was one of those things that was already being implemented before the plan has occurred.

The final aspect was Public Infrastructure. Number one, they needed to share the adequate community spaces provided. There was a community park in the center of the area and one suggestion that came out during the strategy section of the plan was that they needed to provide a safe storm water network. Again, since the plan was started, Storm Water has made a number of improvements in there and they were working with CDBG to provide some new additions. They needed to provide a complete road system. In the 1950’s when the community was developed, a number of roads were platted, and then never built, so there were several landlocked parcels, a number of roads that were private roads with no ascertainable ownership that were inferior, so one of the things they could work with the Community Development people on was to provide a more complete road system and make sure it is safe and operable…and also to ensure that all utilities were assessable. There was public water and sewer in the community, provided by the City of Myrtle Beach, but very few homes were tapped into it. It was expensive for them to tap into it and it also required that they filed deed restrictions on their property saying that they would someday

22 annex into the City of Myrtle Beach, something they were not wanting to do. It was a conundrum in many cases, but all of these things were already being implemented. He hoped that they have had a chance to look at the plan, and if they had any questions, he would be happy to answer them.

Mr. J. Prince asked if the district Councilman, Mr. Foxworth, was involved. Mr. Emrick said he was, and had been to almost every community meeting they have had. He was one of the main drivers of the plan. Mr. J. Prince asked if he was satisfied with what he had there. Mr. Emrick said yes. Mr. J. Prince asked if there were any questions. Mr. Loftus moved to send to council with a recommendation for approval. The motion passed unanimously.

An ordinance approving and authorizing the County Administrator to execute the requisite legal documents to convey an easement across a portion of the parking lot for the M.L. Brown, Jr. Building to Dick’s Concepts, LLC (TMS #123-00-02-139) (Randi Haldi). Mr. Haldi said that Dick’s Concepts, LLC, was actually a property owner that owned property located in between county property at the M.L. Brown Building and the post office off of Hwy 701. They would like to develop that property and in order to do so, they’ve requested an easement across a small, approximate 425 square foot portion of the M.L. Brown parking lot, to allow them to tie into existing sewer lines. Mr. Grabowski asked if the easement was just for utilities. Mr. Haldi said that was correct. They have determined an appropriate fair market value for that portion of property and have conveyed that to them. They had a representative for the property owner there, Harris Comb, one of the property engineers, who would be able to answer any questions if they had any specifically about the property, but it was staff’s recommendation to go ahead and approve that.

Mr. Loftus asked that if they didn’t, if the storm water would through the M.L. Brown parking lot. Mr. Haldi said it was a sewer line. Mr. J. Prince asked if they were going to repave that parking lot. Mr. Haldi said yes, and it would be subject to oversight by the Engineering Department. Mr. J. Prince said he didn’t have any problems with it. Mr. Grabowski said he didn’t either, and moved they send it forward with a recommendation for approval. The motion passed unanimously.

Mrs. Garigen said that Mr. Hamilton would present numbers six, seven, eight, and nine on the agenda all together, as follows:

An ordinance approving the administrator quit claim the abandoned portion of public right of way on Old Hwy 90 back to the property owners, An ordinance approving the administrator quit claim the abandoned portion of public right of way on Daffodil Drive back to the property owners, An ordinance approving the administrator quit claim the abandoned portion of public right of way on Harvest Moon Drive back to the property owner, and An ordinance approving the administrator quit claim the abandoned portion of public right of way on Royals Circle back to the property owner (Larry Hamilton).

Mr. Hamilton said that basically, these were four roads, penny sales tax/dirt road paving program, and basically were where they squared off intersections at the main roads. Instead of coming at an angle, they T’d the intersection and left the original right of way and got new right of way for the new realignment. It was just giving the old easements back to the existing property owner(s). Mr. J. Prince asked if there were any questions from the committee. Mr. Grabowski moved to send forward to full council with a recommendation for approval. The motion passed unanimously.

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An ordinance authorizing an amendment to the agreement authorized by Ordinance No. 173- 01 for development of a joint county industrial/business park between Georgetown County, South Carolina and Horry County, South Carolina (Randi Haldi). Mr. Haldi said that back in 2001, County Council entered into a multi-county business park agreement with Georgetown County, wherein certain properties in Georgetown County would be designated as a multi-county business park and Horry County would receive one percent of the income from those properties. That agreement had a termination date of 20 years, so it would terminate in 2021. Recently, Georgetown County requested that property for one of their economic development projects be placed into this multi-county business park, and that Horry County would agree to that, and also to extend the term of the multi-county business park to match the term of the fee in lieu of tax agreement that they have reached with the Economic Development. That would be another 30 years from the date of extension, and it would be 2014 after it went through third reading, so it would go through 2044.

Mr. Loftus said that Georgetown County has been gracious enough to partner with Horry County on their multi-county business parks, and made a motion that they moved it forward, seconded by Mr. Grabowski. Mr. J. Prince said that it was basically a win-win for them. Mr. Loftus said that was right…they basically got one percent for waking up. The motion passed unanimously.

An ordinance to amend Section 1202 of the Zoning Ordinance pertaining to the conditions and requirements for material crushing and processing operations (David Schwerd). Mr. Schwerd said they would remember that a couple of years ago, they came forward with an amendment to the PDD Batch Plants that required all asphalt and concrete batch plants to be internal, as well as all aggregate processing facilities that were related to them. They also created a public exception for temporary batch plants and facilities. What this ordinance did was recognize there was a need to allow processing facilities outside of permanent structures. Meeting with a lot of engineers, facilities for concrete recycling, concrete crushing, and asphalt recycling…physically it was infeasible to locate those facilities inside. This ordinance would not touch any of the actual batching facilities. Asphalt and concrete batching facilities would still be required to be internal to structures…this was only for those facilities that were concrete crushing and recycling of asphalt and other aggregate materials. There was also a need for large, onsite demolition projects to have crushing facilities located onsite to reduce the number of trucks on the roads. With a large facility, i.e. a large grocery store or something like that, you had to remove the debris, and it took a significant volume if you had to take it off in dump truck loads without actually crushing and processing onsite. What this ordinance did was that it kept those concrete and asphalt batch facilities internal to the buildings – it didn’t touch anything to do with the batching facilities. All this did was propose that outdoor aggregate facilities be located in a permanent structure if they were located 1,000 feet from residential. That distance came from back when the Planning Commission was doing its original study before they decided to locate the facilities indoors – they were looking at 1,000 feet. When they decided to locate them indoors, they required them to be 500 feet, so this recognized the nature of the noise that was generated by a permanent facility that would be crushing concrete or things on that site, or crushing aggregate. The additional noise required the additional 500 foot separation.

The second thing it did was allow onsite crushing and recycling of aggregate processing facilities for private projects. Currently, the only way they allowed a temporary facility was for a public

24 project to do it as a batching facility. This allowed private projects, in connection with the demolition of those structures that were 20,000 square feet or less. That was going to handle most of your old grocery stores, most of your really large, old beachwear stores, and mostly your large office buildings. Those facilities contained a lot of debris when they were knocked down, and most of it was very bulky unless it was processed onsite. What this ordinance proposed to do was allow those facilities to operate in connection with. When they came to pull the demolition permit, they were limited to 30 days on the demolition permit so they couldn’t be there, and they couldn’t be closer than 300 feet to any of the residents. They also had to be screened while they were operating so that they were not creating big piles of debris and rubble that were clearly visible and have became an eyesore for the month while they were being processed and stored. Mr. Schwerd asked if there were any questions.

Mr. Loftus asked if there were time limitations, i.e. they couldn’t operate before this time in the morning, or at that time of night. Mr. Schwerd said they already had the noise ordinance in place that limited the time of construction. If they wanted to change anything that was different than that… Mr. Loftus said he didn’t want to amend the noise ordinance, he just wanted to make sure that…Mr. Grabowski said to make sure that this doesn’t grant them an exception to the noise ordinance…it did for some state projects. Mr. Schwerd said it did not. Mr. J. Prince asked if they were adding any zoning districts to it. Mr. Eldridge asked if he had the dust to pavement in there too. Mr. Schwerd said that dust to pavement was part of it. The private permits, as far as temporary, were not limited to a zoning district…it was still permitted in the same districts that it could be located in before – it did not change any of those districts…only temporary ones. They had a lot of nonconforming structures, and when they got knocked down due to redevelopment…they had a growing economy again, so they would see a lot of redevelopment of those larger, old buildings…and those may not be in a zoning district that would normally allow aggregate processing, so that was why they didn’t limit it to the district – they limited it to spacing from existing residential. Mr. J. Prince confirmed that it wouldn’t be pertaining to permanent sites. Mr. Schwerd said it wasn’t pertaining to permanent sites. Permanent sites were still limited to the same industrial districts that were allowed to before. Mr. J. Prince asked if there were any questions.

Mrs. Carter said this had not been to the Planning Commission yet. It originated at this meeting last month, so if the committee chose to move it forward, it would need to go to the Planning Commission for a report and recommendation. Mr. Grabowski said they should have done that already. Mr. J. Prince said it was kind of odd to come to them…they had an ordinance there. Mrs. Carter said it originated at this committee. The first time it came up was last month…Mr. Gosnell brought it before them at the request of a council member, and they were directed to come back with a draft at this meeting, which they have done. Mr. J. Prince confirmed that it had to go to the Planning Commission, prior to third reading. Mrs. Carter said they could send it before it went to County Council, or they could send it simultaneously. Mr. Loftus said that Planning Commissions next meeting was before the next council meeting. Mrs. Carter said that it had not been advertised, and it had to be advertised for a public hearing. Mr. Loftus asked if they did not have 15 days. Mrs. Carter said not by the next Planning Commission meeting, no. Mr. Loftus asked if the next Planning Commission meeting was on the 5th (December). Mrs. Carter said it was, but the ads have already run…they had to have them in a week ahead of time, and to meet their schedule, they had to advertise way out in advance. Mr. Loftus said he was talking state level (inaudible), but said he was sorry, he was just venting. Mrs. Carter said otherwise, they could add it to the agenda. Mr. J. Prince said being that there was no big rush, to give a positive recommendation to the

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Planning Commission, seconded by Mr. Grabowski. The motion passed unanimously. Mrs. Carter asked if after the Planning Commission reviewed it, if they wanted it to come back to the committee or to go straight to council. Mr. J. Prince said he saw no need for it to come back to the committee. Mr. Loftus agreed.

Mrs. Sandee (Garigen) said they were done except for the date of the next meeting. Mr. J. Prince said the date was tentative for December 12th at 9 a.m. for their next committee meeting, and that was tentative, but it was important for Mrs. Sandee (Garigen) to have it so she didn’t get in a tear for trying to get her stuff on the agenda at the last minute.

Mr. J. Prince asked if anyone else had anything. Mr. Loftus said that a possible conflict he had…he couldn’t make it at 9 (a.m.)…there was an EDC Prospect Committee. Mrs. Garigen said it was very tentative at this point. Mr. Loftus said to go ahead and set it – he would figure it out. Mr. J. Prince said he didn’t like to meet without him, he knew how much he loved him. Mr. Loftus said that he knew he loved him and he appreciated that…go ahead and set it for the 12th and he would work it out. Mr. J. Prince asked Chairman Lazarus if he had anything to add. Mr. Lazarus said for everyone to have a Happy Thanksgiving. Mr. J. Prince said yes, please do…everybody have a Happy Thanksgiving.

EXECUTIVE SESSION: Mr. J. Prince said there was no need for an executive session.

ADJOURNMENT: Mr. Grabowski made a motion to adjourn, and the motion passed unanimously. The meeting adjourned at 10:54 a.m.

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