WhyNot Him? Maverick ad-man, inspirational talk-show host—and possible future New York mayoral candidate? —Donny Deutsch on the ups and … well, mostly just the ups … of being Donny Deutsch. By Jordana Horn

32 MAY | JUNE 2008 THE PENNSYLVANIA GAZETTE PHOTO BY CHRIS CRISMAN THE PENNSYLVANIA GAZETTE MAY | JUNE 2008 33 am sitting in Donny Deutsch W’79’s difference between taking my shirt off office at CNBC’s studios in Ridgewood, among friends and colleagues and doing INew Jersey, discussing whether or it in front of a reporter. Sometimes can- not he is going to run for mayor of New didness, a certain goofball lunacy, a will- York City—and that’s when he decides ingness to let people into your world and to get undressed. have some fun, just backfires. It certainly “In reality, I could be mayor,” he says, did this time.” The chapter concludes, leaning forward in his seat with all the “Sometimes, you’re a wise guy and it unbridled enthusiasm he’s known for backfires on you. Sometimes you just do on the CNBC show he hosts, The Big schmucky things.” Idea with Donny Deutsch. “You know, if As Deutsch stands bare-chested, his I really wanted to do it, I would meet publicist looks up from her desk across with a top advisor. I’d find some great the room and rolls her eyes: She’s seen political operatives, and hire the head this all before. “This is off the record,” of my campaign. she says to me. “I’d meet with all the top people I “No, she can put it in, I don’t care,” know on Wall Street, and start a fund- Deutsch tells the publicist. “I’m on my raising campaign,” he continues, paus- way to my next meeting, and it is what ing for dramatic effect. His voice gets a it is: The interview’s over, or you have touch higher, the vocal equivalent of to watch me change.” raising his hands in the air. “I’m a can- Okay, back to business. He runs for didate! It’s not that crazy!” mayor. He wins. So, congratulations, It is at this point that I notice, look- Mr. Mayor, what are you going to do? ing up from my notepad, that Deutsch He smiles archly and walks behind my is unbuttoning his shirt. chair. “I’m going to stand over here so “You’re gonna have to watch me take you don’t have to watch me take my my shirt off, because I have to change, pants off.” I hear the sound of a zipper. all right?” he says. He stands up and Welcome to the in-your-face, candid, finishes unbuttoning his shirt, facing self-referential, unapologetic and (argu- me and sliding it off to reveal a bare ably) occasionally schmucky world of chest and a not-bad set of abs for a Donny Deutsch. 50-year-old guy. It’s clear that he’s aware that it’s a not-bad set of abs— The world of Deutsch today— perhaps more than a little aware. host of his own primetime show on CNBC, “This isn’t part of the story,” he says multi-millionaire, single father—is a long perfunctorily, but immediately follows way from the world he inhabited for the up by saying, “Oh, you can mention it. I first part of his life. To be sure, it was a did it in advertising once—I ripped my comfortable world of privilege … but one shirt off in front of a reporter and told in which Deutsch was labeled as someone her I had the best body in advertising.” who had “potential,” rather than as some- He grins sardonically. “I can no longer one who ever would act on it. make that statement.” While he was a student at Penn, Deutsch I want to tell him, I know you did. I’ve recalls, for example, “I was a little bit of read your book, Often Wrong, Never In a fish out of water, a little bit of the village Doubt: Unleash the Business Rebel Within idiot. I think I was the last person off the (2005). I recall one chapter devoted entirely wait list into Arts and Sciences—so I was to the incident when he took off his shirt in literally the dumbest person they took in front of an Ad Age reporter in 2002 (noting all of Penn.” “It didn’t hurt that the reporter was a Be that as it may, Deutsch transferred woman”), and she reported it straight, rath- into Wharton and graduated cum laude er than as the tongue-in-cheek move he’d after what he characterizes as a not-overly- intended. The title of that chapter—and I academic undergraduate experience. “It reconfirm it when I get home—is “The Big- was a little crazy back then, let’s put it that Shadow Principle: Why taking your shirt way. There was a lot of … hmmm … ” He has off for the press is a really bad idea.” a big grin on his face. “It was the late ’70s, In that chapter (on page 234), he had that’s all we need to say. A lot of partying, written, “I should have known there’s a and a lot of hard … hard work, hard play.”

34 MAY | JUNE 2008 THE PENNSYLVANIA GAZETTE “You gotta at least say, ‘Why not me?’ Or else the next bold step— that nonlinear step—never happens. Until you say that, the great things can’t happen.”

And, perhaps unsurprisingly, he notes, ing a gay couple shopping for furniture “My friends and I were more of the party- (accompanied by no fanfare whatsoever), ing ilk. A lot of my friends were the least were, like Deutsch himself, memorable. likely to succeed.” After dabbling a bit in a film production (Deutsch is a little more serious about company, and writing his book, he won- his current Penn role serving on the dered: What next? But why, one might ask, board of overseers for the School of would anything have to be next? After all, Social Policy and Practice. “It’s an honor with an estimated net worth of over $200 to be on the board working with Dean million, why do anything at all? Gelles,” he says. “He is an inspirational “It’s success and the irony of success,” leader, and the school is really poised to Deutsch confides. “To me, in advertising, do some amazing things.” there was no margin of failure,” he notes. Deutsch was one of the first board- “It was a question of, well, do I grow [to] members recruited by Dr. Richard Gelles, $2.7 billion, $3.2 billion. I felt I cracked the Joanne and Raymond Welsh Chair the code. And if you can ever force your- of Child Welfare and Family Violence, self to climb a new mountain, well, the who became dean in 2003. According to energy of when you, at 26, are just start- Gelles, in addition to contributing gener- ing out, with the possibility of failure, ously, Deutsch “has been extremely effec- it’s so much more invigorating. tive and helpful, both in helping us build “So I want to force myself to another the board and helping us put forward our mountain, so that’s why I keep doing other first conference on nonprofit leadership things,” he says. “But having said that, still, [“Gazetteer,” Jan|Feb 2006]. all within the core competency of creativity, “Donny knows everybody,” he adds. of creating content, of motivating people. “When we build a board, I use the Gladwell “After I sold the company and I was approach—we need the board to be a ‘tip- saying, ‘What do I want to do next?’ I ping point,’ so we look for people who are thought, ‘Hey, what about a TV show?’” connectors, experts and sales people, and he recalls, with a glint in his eye. Deutsch Donny’s greatest skill is connectivity.”) often poses rhetorical questions, to As the heir apparent to his father’s which the answer is almost always the advertising company, success—or at least same: “You’ve got to say, ‘Why not me?’ financial comfort—was Deutsch’s birth- You gotta at least say, ‘Why not me?’ Or right. But when his father decided to sell else the next bold step—that nonlinear the company in 1984, Deutsch asked that step—never happens. Until you say that, he be allowed to run it instead. the great things can’t happen.” He proceeded to shed his self-applied enfant terrible label and to rise to the occa- It is this conviction—the can-do, sion, renaming David Deutsch Associates anything’s-possible, expansive as Deutsch Inc. and building what had American spirit of the entrepreneur— been a small, print-oriented boutique that animates The Big Idea with Donny agency into a top-tier full-service power- Deutsch, which airs at 10 p.m. and 1 a.m. house. He sold the agency to the Interpublic ET weeknights on CNBC. Gossip doyenne Group of Companies in 2000 for $250-300 Liz Smith dubbed the show “Oprah at million, remaining as both chairman and night.” As characterizations go, one could CEO until 2005. He still serves as chair- do worse. man of the firm. “There is no inspirational stuff on TV How did he do it? Arguably, simply by like what Oprah does during the day for being himself. Deutsch was brash, in- mostly women at home,” Deutsch says. your-face—and Deutsch Inc.’s advertising “I’m trying to do that at night for young was as well. The firm’s ads for Tanqueray professionals, or people at any stage of gin featuring the sardonic “Mr. Jenkins” their life who want to get going, go after character, as well as the IKEA ads featur- their dream, and make millions.”

THE PENNSYLVANIA GAZETTE MAY | JUNE 2008 35 Deutsch himself is a born showman—if Interview segments featuring both fighting with you.’ And most of the thing anything, your 82-inch flat screen isn’t famous and non-famous guests are a was like that. It was talk to try to really large enough to capture his ebullience. dominant element of the program. The teach people, whether or not you agree Even in breaks in taping, he’s cracking non-famous guests tend to be self-start- with her, we’re going to show people the jokes between sips of Diet Coke, wiggling ing entrepreneurs with inspirational sto- Ann Coulter model.” to the disco music pumped into the studio. ries. The roster of the better-known runs The interview, however, went awry— “You have a big personality,” I say to the gamut from Dan Rather to Daymond and eventually, viral, on YouTube and him at one point in our interview. John, founder and CEO of the urban blogs around the world—when Deutsch “So I’ve been told,” he rejoins. clothing line FUBU, to Top Chef’s Padma asked her what her ideal world would “Well, that’s the good way of saying Lakshmi to actor Matthew McConaughey. look like: it,” I add. The eclectic nature of the guest lineup is “What’s the other way of saying it?” part of the show’s raison d’être. COULTER: Well, OK, take the he asks, smiling. “We’ll combine a celebrity or a billion- Republican National Convention. “Hypothetically, maybe some might aire with the little entrepreneur start- People were happy. They’re think of you as arrogant or egotistical,” ing in the basement, because it’s all Christian. They’re tolerant. They I tell him. about this community of people going defend America, they — After confirming that his feelings for the American dream,” Deutsch says aren’t hurt, he says, “Look, here’s what in his office. “So I love that I can start DEUTSCH: Christian — so we should be you learn, and it’s a theme of my show. out with an actor, but he’s talking about Christian? It would be better if we There are people who have very fresh success and how he got there. Then you were all Christian? ideas, or who do it differently—there is go into a little woman who created a always a chorus of naysayers. candy business out of her basement. It’s COULTER: Yes. “Because when something is different, that world together, from Bill Gates to when you’re out of the box, the traditional the little guy. And that’s what’s different DEUTSCH: We should all be Christian? perspective is, ‘No, you can’t do that!’ Or about this show. So whether it’s with a maybe it’s different because it redefines politician, or a celebrity or a billionaire, COULTER: Yes. Would you like to come others,” he points out. “Whenever you’re we’re lensing it through lessons of suc- to church with me, Donny? blazing any kind of path, doing things your cess and then bringing them on down to way, very successful, putting a stake in the the little guy starting out, and it’s a very DEUTSCH: So I should not be a Jew, I ground—you know, some people get a little inspirational hour.” should be a Christian, and this threatened by it. It comes with the territory. Even though Deutsch has stepped would be a better place. Show me any successful person who trods away from day-to-day involvement the their own path, and there are naysayers.” client-service industry of advertising, Following a conversational detour But now, he’s enlisted his ego for the he is still selling a product—a positive that included an exchange on show, and for what he believes is a great sense of hope and optimism for anyone whether interracial couples in New cause. “What I’m doing, I like to think, in or aspiring to be in business. But York have a “chip on their is helping people,” he says. “I’m very one notable interview went markedly shoulder”—a Coulter claim that happy to do it. Anybody who has a prob- off-message. Deutsch rather restrainedly dis- lem with me now, it’s hard to under- In October 2007, conservative author missed as “erroneous”—he returned stand why. But you’re never going to be and larger-than-life personality Ann to the question: “We should just all things to all people. And that’s what I Coulter came on The Big Idea. She’d been throw Judaism away and we should teach people about branding and adver- on the show before, Deutsch points out, all be Christians, then.” tising: you don’t have to be.” and the two had gotten along swim- The Big Idea with Donny Deutsch is a mingly (his favorable comments about COULTER: Yeah. calculated hybrid of formats. The show her legs are on the record for posterity). runs in power-punch segments, some of “I pride myself on the fact that the DEUTSCH: Really? which have a deliberately cheeky game show is purely positive,” Deutsch says, show aspect. The gaming spirit incorpo- speaking almost contemplatively. “Most COULTER: Well, it’s a lot easier. It’s rates segments like “Will It Play In of cable is just people screaming at each kind of a fast track. Peoria?” where Deutsch poses the ques- other. We’re pure positivity. That is not tion of the viability of a newly invented her MO. But I said, you know what? We DEUTSCH: Really? product to a crowd in a diner in … you can work with her business model, and guessed it. Another such segment is the say we’re going to teach people how to COULTER: Yeah. You have to obey. recently minted “Elevator Pitch,” where build a brand and make money by being an aspiring entrepreneur has a one- contrarian. Okay? And I wasn’t going to DEUTSCH: You can’t possibly believe that. minute interview with an angel inves- fight with her, it wasn’t a political debate; tor: Can he or she seal the deal? she’d been on before, and I said, ‘I’m not

36 MAY | JUNE 2008 THE PENNSYLVANIA GAZETTE I’m finding as a recently single person,” COULTER: Yes. DEUTSCH: Ann Coulter, author of If says Deutsch, who is separated from Democrats Had Any Brains, They’d Be his second wife. DEUTSCH: You can’t possibly — you’re Republicans, and if Ann Coulter had “Wealth—obviously, what a person does, too educated, you can’t — you’re like any brains, she would not say Jews who they are—you put any level of notori- my friend in — need to be perfected. I’m offended by ety or celebrity on top of it, it’s just crazy,” that personally. And we’ll have more he adds. “We live in a world which cele- COULTER: Do you know what Big Idea when we come back. brates that in such a disproportionate, Christianity is? We believe your reli- silly way, and it makes you a very appeal- gion, but you have to obey. When watching the clip, a viewer can eas- ing person. People are very drawn to that ily discern Deutsch’s anger in his facial for some reason. DEUTSCH: No, no, no, but I mean — expressions if not his words. When asked “It is a very seductive quality,” he says, his opinion of the interaction in retrospect, with a half-smile. “I’m living a science COULTER: We have the fast-track pro- he responds with a certain degree of weari- experiment in how our society elevates gram. ness. “I don’t believe Ann Coulter’s anti-Se- people. People just want to be around you.” mitic. I think the problem is that Ann Overall, whether you’re the interview- DEUTSCH: Why don’t I put you with Coulter is a little out of touch with reality,” er or the interviewee, there is a certain the head of Iran? I mean, come on. he says. “And what made it so powerful, solipsistic quality to talking with You can’t believe that. and what I think made her look so poor, Donny Deutsch. It all comes back to his was that I wasn’t fighting with her. And you relentless self-confidence, his brashness, COULTER: The head of Iran is not a saw a hate crime in front of you.” his conceit, his deliberate “bad boy of busi- Christian. While it may have addressed a “big ness” persona. But, truthfully, you leave a idea,” the exchange was dramatically at conversation with him thinking that it’s DEUTSCH: No, but in fact, “Let’s wipe odds with the show’s purpose. “We didn’t not such a bad thing. At one point, we were Israel”— even exploit it after that, because I said, talking about the show—but could have ‘You know what? Our show is positive,’” just as easily been talking about him. COULTER: I don’t know if you’ve been Deutsch recalls. “Four or five days later, “I want to stay very focused on this paying attention. it just caught fire. It was the CNN story niche. In order to keep it fresh, you of the day.” But he points out, and right- have to stay narrow, but mine it in a DEUTSCH: “Let’s wipe Israel off the ly, that after “going negative,” as it were, very broad way, because it gets old earth.” I mean, what, no Jews? Coulter has virtually disappeared from after a while,” he says, leaning back in the cultural radar. his chair. “How do you make it more COULTER: No, we think — we just want “Interestingly enough, we haven’t heard interactive, engaging, fun, entertain- Jews to be perfected, as they say. from her since,” Deutsch says. “That really ing? Stay true to your core. hurt her.” “It’s voyeuristic,” he shrugs. “Hey, it’s DEUTSCH: Wow, you didn’t really say Deutsch generally is almost relentless- fun.” that, did you? ly positive, always looking for the good spin—even, in the end, when it comes to So does he really want to be mayor COULTER: Yes. That is what Christianity Ann Coulter. “[Coulter] will be fine. She’s of New York, as he has bandied about in is. We believe the Old Testament, but brilliant, she’s a very successful writer interviews in various publications over ours is more like Federal Express. and she does have a lot to say,” he says. the past few years? You have to obey laws. We know “Sometimes she obviously goes too far, “I would love to,” he says. “I don’t know if we’re all sinners — but it’s an example of our culture: We cre- I’ve had too much craziness in my life, you ate the monster. This is what we want, know what I mean? I really love what I’m DEUTSCH: In my old days, I would what we push for. She’s almost trained to doing now. I really believe I’m inspiring have argued — when you say some- go there. And then it becomes collateral people. I mean, that’s a gift. And you know, thing absurd like that, there’s no — damage.” And it is that collateral damage I think I maybe can have more of an impact of yelling-head media that Deutsch hopes doing what I’m doing now on a broader COULTER: What’s absurd? to avoid in the future: Coulter’s not com- scale. So we’ll see. I’m not going to rule it ing back on his show. out. It’s obviously a big commitment to be DEUTSCH: Jews are going to be per- mayor, but you know, stranger things have fected. I’m going to go off and try to hen off-air and not being asked happened. You gotta say, why not me?” perfect myself — to talk about Coulter, Deutsch And, as noted earlier, about two min- Wenjoys living the semi-famous utes later is when he started to get COULTER: Well, that’s what the New life: “You get the best tables at restau- undressed. Call it naked ambition. Testament says. rants, free desserts. It’s a great way to Jordana Horn C’95 L’99 is a lawyer and meet women, nothing wrong with it—that, freelance writer.

THE PENNSYLVANIA GAZETTE MAY | JUNE 2008 37