i donT know Brad Troemel in conversation with Haley mellin

a lot of money, that’s a good way to go. The only way you can get them to come into the real world is to print them up. HM: At times I feel like we live in a constant dot-jump. BT: We figured if we were making sculptures for the sole purpose Supposedly, humans nowadays have 60,000 thoughts a day, most of them different in nature from the previous one. of making installation images, why not just cut out the middleman BT: In an attention economy, there is more value in being and get rid of the objects? This gave us the freedom to work even ubiquitous than in being scarce, especially when there is no THE more quickly. That’s when we started compositing Google Image- added cost in publicizing more works and no depletion of searched products, scenes, and textures together. This meant that the works’ aura, given that digital content exists permanently images made on a laptop using Photoshop would be called sculp- only as a copy. The waiting period between releases that once tures, installations, or paintings, just like the things we made phys- structured the market and assigned a price to each work does ically. Some of the images reveal themselves to be obviously Jogging not suit online content. There is now simply not enough time digitally edited, while others are passable as real. for a single assessor to explore an aesthlete’s full catalog, or for the market to price it all. The aesthlete is outrunning them. Brad Troemel HM: I think this reflects the more intimate reliance we have these wha in conversation with MellIn days on “poor images” – like the pics we swap around that Haley T To believe HM: Outrunning is a good way to escape but not disappear. articulate the atmosphere of a moment, but are maybe 2 inches Normally I run ideas and images by a group of people. Here in size. You’ve sent some good grainy ones with that old cell an image would enter an open-sourced vetting process? phone. How does the blog act as a vehicle for speed, exposure, anymore, 2013 BT: Time spent on anything is time worth being redeemed in trying out ideas? attention by sharing it. A private process of refinement is simply BT: Speed became a priority for us. It was a way of changing The Jogging is a Tumblr lost time. The studio as a site of self-reflection and craft is originated by the artists Brad TROEMEL both our content and our work flow. We made videos featuring going public; no middle ground or time lapse between produc­ brief, deliberately flippant actions made in a style that later tion and publicity is necessary. For the audience, what’s missing and Lauren CHRISTIANSEN: became associated with Vine. Leftover scraps from exhibitions in production quality is supposedly recouped in honesty and an art project for the masses, at Scott Projects were reconfigured as sculptures, set up in the personal connection with creators, whose every image, poem, gallery space, photographed as an installation image, uploaded song, video, or status update becomes a chance for direct to the blog, and then the objects were thrown away or recon­ it is a collaborative endeavor with interaction. an open submission policy. figured for a new set of photos. HM: And the critic becomes an anachronism? HM: The images simultaneously take up so much space and so Its popularity is such that the rapper BT: This dynamic of the audience reposting their favorite little space. They respond well to their technical circumstances. GuccI Mane used a Jogging content makes the risks associated with releasing undesirable Everyone and anyone can be a part of the blog. It has an inclusive content fairly low, while enhancing the potential rewards of post as his album art. Many of the feeling. How many people are in the actual collaborative? releasing beloved content. The opportunity costs of not releasing BT: In 2012, we added a dozen other people to the project. This images posted to The Jogging work quickly rise as audiences become less discriminatory helped boost the number of posts we released, and expanded and more participatory. Notes, Likes, and reblogs serve as are reposted on non-art sites and our audience greatly. Then we opened up the blog portion of 4:18 pm • 12 December 2013 • 40 noTes the quantitative basis for influence in an art world where the The Jogging to moderated submissions, which is what comprises many receive thousands of reposts, critic’s written word has been stripped of power. Haley Mellin: Emily Dickinson wrote something that feels about the majority of what you see on http://thejogging.tumblr.com so that a popular Jogging image today. The thing that excites me most about the open submissions right – “Nature is a haunted house, but art is a house that tries porTraiT of a lonely may reach 20 million viewers to be haunted.” Something about The Jogging reminds me of this, to The Jogging is that the image posts have become conversa­ tional – every submission is in some way a response to a submis- (as compared with the 200,000 visitors for the blog as a place for trying things out and seeing what works, what falls flat. Let’s begin with how The Jogging started. sion that came before it. a popular museum show). Brad Troemel: Lauren Christiansen and I began the project in The Jogging is in the top 1 % of Tumblrs viewed, Chicago in 2009. In 2008 I ran a gallery in Chicago called HM: I like the term you coined – “athletic aestheticism”. Like the Scott Projects. This led me to start thinking about online audiences term “jogging”, it references continuous motion, constant making. and was named #3 in its section of Tumblrs and how cultural capital could be most effectively organized. BT: “Athletic aesthetics” is a term I use to describe artists who nylon/spandex blend ( blend nylon/spandex to Follow by Time in 2013. The collaborative also are releasing more and more work online for free at an increasingly HM: Did starting a blog come from a curiosity, like a question fast rate. Artists using social media have transformed a series does physical exhibitions, including shows to try out answering, or from something else? of isolated shows or artworks into a constant broadcast of one’s at sTill house and Art Basel Miami in 2013, BT: I had a growing dissatisfaction with long­term, conceptual art artistic identity as a recognizable, unique brand. What the artist projects that revolved around collecting or working with large once accomplished by making commodities that could stand inde- and is creating a MocA LA YouTube series, pendently is now accomplished through ongoing self-commodi- amounts of materials. I would put all of this work into making an li coming out this spring. installation or sculpture, release an image of it on Facebook, fication. The notion of the masterpiece has reached its antithesis laugh Ve. and it would be steamrollered in image streams by other people’s with the “aesthlete” – a cultural producer who trumps craft and T of comforT and The perfecT

selfies, lunch decisions, baby photos, and all else. It seemed contemplative brooding with immediacy and rapid production. . lulu pursui like a certain kind of precious, belabored art was, in effect, Troemel and the artist Haley ) rejected by the internet, which led Lauren and me to start thinking HM: How does this change the role of an audience? MELLIN discuss how, in The Jogging, of ways to make art that would flow well with social media. BT: It has reversed the traditional recipe that you need to create artists are outrunning the art world art to have an audience. Today’s artist on the internet needs HM: So the materiality became less important? Kelley Walker an audience in order to create art. An online audience, once assem- made some of the first immaterial art when he started selling bled, becomes part of the medium. With the constant broadcast digital files in 1999. When you’re starting out and you don’t have as goal, editing oneself becomes a waste of resources.

4:18 pm • 12 December 2013 • 40 noTes 113 114 Brad Troemel in conversation with Haley mellin

P.H.I.S.H: PInk HydrograPHIc Integrated FIsH swImS HorIzontally, 2013

piranhas, hydrographic film, screws

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4:18 pm • 12 December 2013 • 40 noTes 4:18 pm • 12 December 2013 • 40 noTes

4:18 pm • 12 December 2013 • 40 noTes 116 115 4:18 pm • 12 December 2013 • 40 noTes Brad Troemel in conversation with Haley mellin

CeramIc PItcer Pours Water Onto extremely rare GenetIcallyextremely m rare HM: I respond on a gut level to how many people can see some- thing so quickly. What is the math? BT: I wish Tumblr had more complete statistics for viewership. My fuzzy math is as follows – a post called Pizza Table received 365,000 notes, and around half of those are Likes and half ariable are reflags. Maybe even 60% Likes and 40% reflags. If the average user has 100–300 followers, then to calculate the total poten-

od tial viewership you’d multiply the number of reposts by the IFI

ed tred number of eyes those reblogs reach – 146,000 � 150 = 21,900,000 potential viewers. IP let Watermelon HM: Yes, I like that the strategies of these forms of media are still so young. We are coming of age alongside a medium.

museum gel Dimensions oz, 24 v The Jogging supports shifting art out of art contexts, so it loses

, 2013 that sense of being in an envelope. BT: Image anarchy is the path that leads art to exist outside of the context of art. Image anarchists behave as though intellectual property is not property at all. The image anarchist reflects a generational indifference toward intellectual property. This

chain, meTal carabineer, porcelain piTcer, piTcer, porcelain carabineer, meTal chain, indifference stems from file sharing and extends to de-authored, decontextualized Tumblr posts. Just don’t tell anyone it’s art HM: The lewd, playful, open­source logic of The Jogging once the images get out there. For all I know, the images might attracted me before I joined the group. The images strike be something else at that point. a nerve that is confusing, off-putting, new. They’re both funny

and sincere. An artist said to me about a recent retrospective, ratIOned Water, 2013 “If it wasn’t good, it would be an embarrassment.” I don’t really see embarrassment entering the logic of The Jogging – people just see how far they can go. What are some of your favorite images?

BT: DORITOSLOCOS taco MASTER LOCKED shut, Baguette waTer, glass, coaTing, Tempered hydrophobic Koozie, and Batteries Frozen in Powerade are crowd favorites

that have become signature Jogging works. 20 inces × 1 33 HM: The blog has a literal texture, yet it avoids being sunk by that realism. It gives me a sense of a digital “report from De, 58 1 × 1 De, 58 the front”. You seem to get people who are looking at it as an ora artwork, and people who just are looking, this “accidental

audience”. gaT Te BT: First, it might be helpful to describe what an accidental audience is. Our audiences share images and videos initially omegrana

conceived as artworks in non-art contexts without any concern p for authorship, context, or property – without any particular awareness that they are engaging with “art” at all. Whoever lueberry-

sees the reposted images is an art audience b

by accident.

e, D ora gaT apple fierce les, TT bo Tic las HM: The JPEG is maybe the most common medium today. p It can be easily shared, it’s free, it is how we’re used to seeing things. There’s a level of anonymity, it can’t be tracked, it disappears and reappears, there are nicely no storage fees. HM: It feels like the blog is opening up new hieroglyphs. We all share that position, pulling images, developing them, It offers a kind of meandering, chaotic, multi-trajectory type remaking or furthering the content we come across. of look as to how people share nowadays. BT: To a certain extent, The Jogging has attempted to down- BT: One way to conceptualize this is through David Joselit’s play authorship and produce works that draw inspiration ideas of “image fundamentalism” and “image neoliberalism”. from general web content. For artists using social media like For the image fundamentalist, art’s meaning is inseparably Tumblr, the question is whether the specificity of curating tied to its place of origin through historic or religious signi- and art-making are tenable when placed in front of audiences ficance; to remove art from its home is to sever its ties with who have wide-ranging motivations for being spectators. the context that grants the work its aura. For the image neo- liberal, art is a universal cultural product that should be free to travel wherever the market or museums take it.

nylon/spandex blend (liVe. laugh. lulu) 4:18 pm • 12 December 2013 • 40 noTes

117 118 Interview by: Kevin McGarry With: Brad Troemel Page: 1/4 Interview by: Kevin McGarry With: Brad Troemel Page: 2/4

Kevin McGarry: How much money have you I use a lot of objects that are aestheticized Bazaar and Beautiful made on Etsy? forms of radicalism. Semiotext(e) books are a good example of that. Bitcoin holograms [Brad Troemel takes out Amazon.com too. Vice teaches its employees how to be ba- Brad Troemel receipt for 504 recently purchased dass in a 9-page PDF they circulate internally. interviewed by Kevin McGarry Semiotext(e) books from left pocket, turns Clothing from Westwood’s Sex shop is argu- it over, pulls out a used SuperCut pen from ably the start of both punk rock as a nameable his right pocket, writes down a FIVE FIG- thing and a commercial product, while cloth- Brad Troemel’s/The artist’s (depending on for- Il marchio del flusso di coscienza commerciale di URE number, turns it back over receipt- ing from Hot Topic is the end of that safety- matting) brand of stream of consciousness mer- Brad Troemel/The artist (a seconda della format- side-up, slowly pushes the number across pinned sentence. These products are funny cantilism fits comfortably into nascent online tazione) s’inserisce comodamente nelle nascenti the table. Kevin peeks underneath.] things—they are consumable and passively economies while jamming conventional art dis- economie online, intervenendo nella tradizionale customizable goods meant as a rallying cry course in the most choreographed albeit authen- teoria sull’arte in modi estremamente scenici, seb- KM: My God... fabbergasted. After material against the mainstream, against consumer cul- tic ways. A mix of poetry and spam is belched bene autentici. Una mescolanza di poesia e spam costs, shipping, and paying an assistant, you ture. I use things that have many color options must’ve paid of at least 3 student loan pay- and in doing so allow a degree of customiza- from a fine assortment of ideas about money, sgorga da una selezione di idee sul denaro, sul lin- ments for your graduate education at NYU with tion on the part of my collectors. Maybe read- language, and other universal controls. guaggio, e su altri metodi di controllo universali. that chunk of change. What would you describe ing the beautifully crimson “Theory of the as your most successful product? [Kevin asks Young-Girl” by Tiqqun will match your nails with respect. Brad removes a sugar-free e- better this week? [Kevin thinks “The Com- cigarette from his ear and lights it with a ing Insurrection” by the Invisible Commit- Mousse Magazine butane torch he received BT: I’m currently making large-scale vac- tee would look great with a new royal blue from his mother on his 21st birthday.] uum-sealed crypto-currency works for up- “DITCH DEITCH WE ARE THE 69%” t-shirt coming exhibitions with Untitled Gallery, he just bought in LA.] Maybe buying one of KM: Where’d you get that lighter? Zach Feuer, Tomorrow Gallery, the Still my 72-book Semiotext(e) grids that feature House, and Room East. [Royalties cash reg- only black and white books will go better with Brad Troemel: My most successful prod- ister goes off, Brad earns a TWO FIGURE your living room. uct? Hmmm... I take pride in providing some welfare check via the Zach Feuer nanny of the most signifcantly organic and inscruta- state.] These 40 x 60” clear vacuum seals KM: [Flabbergasted] Interesting. I’m start- bly rare products on Etsy. Sometimes I re-use often involve Semiotext(e) books, Bitcoins, ing to understand how your inclusion of eco- the same components and try to fnd diferent Hot Topic clothing, original pieces made by nomically volatile currencies and culturally combinations that may be even more locally Vivienne Westwood (via her 1974-1976 shop, accelerationist consumer goods is itself a stand- made or ergonomic. The same Hot Topic Sex), taxidermied fsh, Confederate currency in for your role as an upstart creator of neces- hair extension might be used in 3 separate from the Civil War, Vice Magazine’s in-house sarily radical and perpetually new content for installation images for diferent products. So guide for how employees should write for art’s luxury economy. By using passively cus- when one item is purchased sometimes other them, customized human hair dreadlocks I tomizable goods as the material basis for your listings’ auctions have to end, because they purchased from Etsy vendor Armoredgirl65. work while allowing that work itself to be cus- all contained a common variable. When that tomized once purchased, it’s as though your happens there are technically 0 of those other KM: [Flabbergasted] What are all of these work both points to the conditions of the mar- products in existence. They’re only ideas. wacky materials? What do they have to do with ket while also implicating yourself within it. Can you imagine how rare something is that each other? doesn’t even exist? I wish I could sell those BT: [Replies with respect and admiration] products because they would be worth way BT: Well, let me explain these wacky things. Ugh, stop, I get that all the time… more than the ones that do exist. I think they First the crypto-currency. I always include call that a “Catch 22”. This is the frst time an physical Casascius Bitcoins and Lealana Lite- KM: Are your new pieces sold via Etsy too? art magazine has paid attention to this project, coins in all of my works—they are a hedge or to me in general, so for that I thank Mousse. for the value of my work. I’m interested in the [A crowd of art dealers erupts in laugh- [Brad fist bumps a nearby Italian person point when currencies go from being units of ter. Brad turns around and gives them a with respect.] Early on most of the (often exchange to being commodities or collectibles thumbs-up. They cheer enthusiastically bewildered) attention paid to my Etsy store unto themselves. All of these works are priced and full of emotion, with respect. Brad came via mainstream digital media sources based on a multiplier of the peak market value walks away from Kevin (still flabbergast- like Buzzfeed, the Daily Dot, Gawker, etc. of the currency included in them. So a work ed), runs past the chorus of art dealers giv- Most of the people aware of this project are that has $2000 worth of physical crypto-cur- ing them high fives. Someone respectfully not in the art world, and for a while about half rency probably goes for around $6000-8000. blows an air horn, a new media artist in his of my buyers were not in the art world either. When I seal a Bitcoin it makes this transi- early fifties attempts to assassinate Brad They were suburban moms, middle American tion into being an art commodity, but that’s unsuccessfully using an iPhone firearms ofce workers, rural college students. This not necessarily permanent. The value of my app. The man is apprehended and never meant that the people who were determining work is always racing against the value of the allowed to make glitch art again, under the course of my art production through their volatile investments the vacuum seal contains. the threat of capital punishment. As Brad buying power (determining which products When a collector buys my work there is the grows older he sees how his mild hatred would be realized and which products would latent possibility that the value of the currency of interviews manifesting itself through remain at the level of an image or conceptual inside the piece will very quickly outpace the fan fiction came off as dickish. Brad has a potential) were not involved in the art world value of the artwork. That certainly was the child who becomes a conservative abstract at all. The products I sold to suburban moms case for the collector who bought a 25 Bitcoin painter (despite Brad’s insistence on a rig- were my most successful ones. piece from me for $5000 over the summer. orously suburban upbringing like his own). The face value of that piece rose to $30,000 two Brad is still proud of his boring-ass daugh- KM: [Responds cheerfully, with rever- months later. This means that they would have ter regardless of creative difference. Brad ence] Those do sound remarkably successful, to destroy the vacuum seal in order to cash in returns to the interview a little sweaty and in the way you were able to fnd a price point, on the piece, and maybe it would be wise for out of breath.] a fctional brand as maker, and a recurring set them to do so. It’s a little bit For The Love of of material cues that would allow your work to God-ish, except the value of diamonds isn’t BT: Woof! No, those crypto-currency vacu- create demand outside of the class-based con- prone to a 10,000% increase in price over the um-seal works are sold through galleries now. Above - Brad Troemel with Jogging, P.H.I.S.H Pink Opposite - Vacuum sealed Christian Marazzi - “the VIOLENCE of fnes of the art world, harnessing the Internet course of a year—Bitcoins already have done Hydrographic Integrated Fish, 2013. financial capitalism” with 100 BITCOIN gold plated bar (2/5 tsa as a populist generator of attention for what is that. The value of a blue chip artist’s work Courtesy: the artist and Tomorrow, Toronto / New York no fly list series), 2013. Courtesy: the artist and Tomorrow, Toronto / New York otherwise considered a debilitatingly Balkan- on the secondary market isn’t likely to rise ized corner of the luxury economy. What are you 10,000% either, but an “emerging artist” can working on now? have those types of gains early in their career. 162 163 Interview by: Kevin McGarry With: Brad Troemel Page: 3/4 Interview by: Kevin McGarry With: Brad Troemel Page: 4/4

Kevin McGarry: Quanti soldi hai guada- dell’arte, sfruttando il passaparola di Internet certezza assoluta. Questi prodotti sono og- gnato con Etsy? come veicolo pubblicitario per un più vasto pub- getti divertenti: si tratta di beni di consumo [Brad Troemel tira fuori dalla tasca sinistra blico per quello che altrimenti resterebbe soltanto e per così dire personalizzabili, concepiti per la ricevuta di Amazon.com per 504 libri una nicchia debole e frammentata dell’economia essere un incitamento alla ribellione contro dell’editore Semiotext(e) appena compra- di lusso. Su cosa stai lavorando al momento? ciò che è commerciale, contro la cultura del ti, la gira, prende dalla tasca destra una consumismo. Utilizzo cose che hanno una penna SuperCut usata, scrive un numero a BT: Sto realizzando, su vasta scala, opere grande varietà di colori, e nel far questo con- QUATTRO ZERI, volta di nuovo la ricevuta, in criptovaluta sottovuoto per le prossime sento un certo grado di personalizzazione ai mettendola a faccia in su e la spinge len- mostre da Untitled Gallery, Zach Feuer, To- miei collezionisti. Forse la lettura della Teoria tamente sul tavolo. Kevin sbircia la cifra.] morrow Gallery, Still House e Room East. della Jeune-Fille di Tiqqun con quella splen- [Alla chiusura degli incassi, Brad riceve dida copertina cremisi si sposerà con il colore KM: Santo Iddio… [sbalordito] Togliendo una sostanziosa percentuale dalle gene- delle vostre unghie questa settimana? [Kevin le spese per materiali, consegne e lo stipendio di rose tasche di Zach Feuer.] I sottovuoto, pensa che “L’insurrezione” che viene del un assistente, una cifra del genere equivale ad 100 x 150 cm, spesso comprendono libri del- Comitato Invisibile starebbe benissimo almeno 3 prestiti studenteschi per laurearsi alla la Semiotext(e), Bitcoins, abiti Hot Topic, con la nuova maglietta blu scuro con la New York University. Secondo te qual è il tuo oggetti originali prodotti da Vivienne We- scritta “DITCH DEITCH WE ARE THE 69%” prodotto di maggior successo? [Chiede Kevin stwood (nel suo negozio Sex tra il 1974 e il che ha appena comprato a Los Angeles.] cauto. Brad si sfila una sigaretta elettro- 1976), pesci imbalsamati, monete della Con- Forse una delle mie composizioni a 72 libri nica senza zucchero da dietro l’orecchio federazione dell’epoca della Guerra Civile, le della Semiotext(e), fatta solo con volumi dal- e l’accende con un accendino al butano norme redazionali per gli impiegati di Vice le copertine bianche e nere gioverà all’aspetto con il logo di Mousse Magazine che la ma- Magazine, dreadlock umani personalizzati del vostro soggiorno. dre gli ha regalato per il suo ventunesimo che ho comprato su Etsy dalla venditrice Ar- compleanno.] moredgirl65. KM: [Sempre più sbalordito] Interessan- te. Comincio a capire come l’inclusione di mo- KM: Dove hai preso quell’accendino? KM: [Sorpreso] Come mai materiali così nete dal valore economico instabile e di beni di stravaganti? Che relazione hanno tra loro? consumo culturalmente accelerazionisti sia ciò Brad Troemel: Il mio prodotto di mag- che più ti consacra come creatore innovativo di gior successo? Hmmm… Vado orgoglioso BT: Allora, intanto vorrei spiegare i materia- contenuti radicali necessari e perennemente nuo- del fatto che i miei prodotti su Etsy sono tra li stravaganti. Anzitutto la criptovaluta. In- vi per il mercato di lusso dell’arte. Utilizzare i più naturali e indefnibili. A volte riutilizzo cludo sempre i Casascius Bitcoins e i Lealana oggetti suscettibili di essere personalizzati come gli stessi componenti e cerco di creare nuove Litecoins in tutte le mie opere: costituiscono fondamento del tuo lavoro, e allo stesso tempo combinazioni così che risultino più artigia- la base del valore dei miei lavori. Sono afa- prevedere anche la personalizzazione dell’opera nali e funzionali. Ad esempio l’extension per scinato dal momento in cui il denaro smette dopo l’acquisto, equivale all’idea che l’oggetto capelli Hot Topic trova applicazione in tre di essere un’unità di scambio e si trasforma artistico si riferisca alle condizioni del mercato, diverse immagini che pubblicizzano prodot- in beni o oggetti da collezione. Ciascuna ope- ma al tempo stesso ti trascini dentro in prima ti diversi tra loro. Quindi se viene acquistato ra ha un prezzo che si calcola moltiplicando persona. un oggetto, a volte dobbiamo chiudere anche per tre o quattro volte il massimo valore di altre aste perché contenevano quell’elemento mercato della valuta considerata. Quindi un BT: [Risponde piacevolmente sorpreso] comune. Quando ciò accade, tecnicamente lavoro stimato 2.000 dollari di criptovaluta Dai, smettila, me lo dicono tutti in continua- abbiamo zero disponibilità degli altri prodot- costerà tra i 6.000 e gli 8.000 dollari correnti. zione… ti. Restano solo a livello teorico. Hai idea di Un Bitcoin, una volta sigillato, si trasforma quanto possa essere raro qualcosa che non in un oggetto d’arte, ma non è un processo KM: Vendi anche le tue ultime cose su Etsy? esiste nemmeno? Vorrei poter vendere quei necessariamente irreversibile. Il valore della prodotti, perché varrebbero molto più di mia opera è in costante competizione con il [Una folla di mercanti d’arte scoppia a ride- quelli che invece esistono. Credo che venga valore variabile contenuto nella confezione re. Brad si volta, li guarda e mostra i pollici defnito come un “Comma 22”. È la prima sottovuoto. Quando un collezionista acquista all’insù. Gli astanti reagiscono con grida volta che una rivista d’arte si interessa a que- un mio oggetto, esiste una possibilità latente entusiaste ed emozionate di approvazione. sto progetto, o in generale a me, quindi sono che il valore della valuta inclusa in esso pos- Brad si allontana da Kevin (ancora più sbi- molto grato a Mousse. [Brad batte il pugno sa superare anche molto rapidamente quello gottito) e corre in mezzo ai mercanti d’ar- affettuosamente con uno che gli sta accan- dell’opera d’arte. È stato senza dubbio il caso te, battendo il cinque con loro. Qualcuno to, un italiano.] All’inizio gran parte dell’in- capitato al collezionista che quest’estate ha suona una tromba da stadio, e un artista di teresse (spesso misto a sgomento) per il mio comprato per 5.000 dollari un mio pezzo con mezza età dei new media cerca senza suc- negozio su Etsy arrivava da media digitali del dentro 25 Bitcoins. Il valore nominale della cesso di assassinare Brad usando un’ap- circuito commerciale, come Buzzfeed, Daily valuta salì a 30.000 dollari due mesi dopo. plicazione per iPhone che simula armi da Dot, Gawker eccetera. La maggior parte del- Questo signifca che avrebbe dovuto distrug- fuoco. L’uomo viene arrestato e non potrà le persone che conoscono il progetto non fa gere la confezione sottovuoto per incassare il mai più dedicarsi alla glitch art, o rischierà parte del mondo dell’arte, e per un bel po’ di denaro, e forse non sarebbe stata una cattiva la pena capitale. Con gli anni Brad ha capi- tempo nemmeno la metà dei miei acquiren- idea. È del tutto aleatorio: mentre il valore to quanto la sua antipatia per le interviste ti proveniva da lì. Erano casalinghe, colletti dei diamanti non cresce certo del 10.000% nel all’epoca delle fan fiction fosse in realtà un bianchi americani, studenti universitari di giro di un anno – i Bitcoins l’hanno fatto. Ne- atteggiamento un po’ spocchioso. Brad ha provincia. Questo signifca che a determinare anche l’opera di un artista di punta sul merca- una figlia interessata alla pittura astratta il corso della mia produzione artistica attra- to secondario può salire del 10.000%, mentre conservatrice (anche se lui avrebbe volu- verso il loro potere d’acquisto (decidendo in questo caso un “artista emergente” ha la to che si fosse dedicata a una cultura più quali prodotti dovevano essere realizzati e possibilità di arrivare a incrementi del genere suburbana come la sua). Brad è comunque quali invece sarebbero rimasti solo immagini già all’inizio della carriera. orgoglioso della sua noiosissima figlia no- o concetti potenziali) erano persone che non Uso moltissimi oggetti che sono frutto nostante le differenze artistiche. Brad torna avevano nulla a che fare con l’arte. I prodot- dell’incontro fra radicalismo ed estetica. I li- a farsi intervistare un tantino sudato e col ti venduti alle casalinghe sono stati quelli di bri di Semiotext(e) ne sono un buon esempio, fiato corto.] maggior successo. come pure gli ologrammi dei Bitcoins. Con un documento in PDF di 9 pagine, Vice inse- BT: [Ansimando] No, ora le opere di crip- KM: [Sorride, assentendo] E sembra davve- gna ai suoi impiegati come diventare dei vin- tovaluta sottovuoto le vendono le gallerie ro un bel risultato, visto il modo in cui sei riuscito centi. L’abbigliamento del Sex, il negozio di d’arte. “Stamps”, 2013, “This is the Story of America” installation view Bottom - Parker Ito, Haley Mellin, Brad Troemel and Artie Vierkant a fssare un prezzo di vendita, un marchio di pro- Vivienne Westwood, è senza dubbio all’origi- at Brand New Gallery, Milan, 2013. “Trending” installation view at Untitled, New York, 2013. duzione fttizio e una serie ricorrente di materiali ne del punk rock in quanto articolo non certo Courtesy: the artist and Tomorrow, Toronto/New York Courtesy: the artists and Tomorrow, Toronto / New York che consentirebbero al tuo lavoro di creare una trascurabile e insieme prodotto commerciale, domanda anche al di fuori dell’altolocato mondo mentre quello di Hot Topic è la fne di ogni 164 165 Victoria Fu Gaylen Gerber VICTORIA FU speaks with right combo of clothes and acces- on a treadmill, work in an offce), I the footage, created on green screen, Tumblr presence was always meant sories to formulate a unique identity can imagine an analogous situation is meant for any kind of advertise- to maximize attention effciency in PAUL PFEIFFER and BRAD TROEMEL and lifestyle. The only thing you are where our neurological pathways ment background; dictated by that context. We would make and not free to choose is your ontological form along Google image-search capital, the visual content adheres photograph multiple confgura- Paul Pfeiffer: Victoria, viewing your new video installations, I’m imme- limits. In my opinion, what distin- typologies. to a one-size-fts-all, generic fat- tions of sculptures—let the free- diately struck by how the edges of the video image don’t line up with the guishes art is the focus on ontology: ness. Exaggerating the “home-less” market attention economy decide edges of the projection screen. The image spills off onto the walls and foor the intent to question reality. It’s PP: I think it’s important for artists aspects of green screen, Belle Captive which version is best! Downplay of the surrounding space. Also, the people and objects on-screen appear not just the production of another today to acknowledge their roots in weaves the blandness of stock media authorship by only using abstract unfxed from their background, like cutouts suspended in an ambiguous, object, image, or experience to be the legacy of Conceptual art—the into a narrative-like spectatorial symbols—let the images’ reblog- green-screen void. At one point a hand tries to fnger swipe a cockatoo as consumed; it’s the production of generation of artists in the sixties experience—looping and stretching gers decide what to do with the if to advance to the next page on an iPad touch screen. But the bird doesn’t self-awareness in the act of consum- and seventies who deeply distrusted the duration of actions, collaging author’s identity in relation to their move. Each element in the picture seems isolated on its own separate layer. ing. It’s an experience of disjunc- images, for whom it was necessary absurd combinations. In a way, the online personas! Post more content In the sound track I hear background voices and someone typing on a key- tion, of crossing a threshold from to reject the visual and material in images we encounter on the internet than any one person could possibly board, which makes me think an invisible director or editor is controlling one reality to another. favor of words and ideas. But we’re are surrealist objects or readymade share—let the rebloggers express the action. All of this suggests to me a new, expanded image environment— far removed from that moment. The combines—hyperlinked and end- individuality through what they one that blurs the boundaries of projected image, real physical space, and VF: You’ve often considered these “Pictures Generation” in the 1980s lessly divorced from their original choose to share! Make use of topical hyperspace. You’re making installations that behave like cinema in some thresholds in your work, Paul, represents a shift like ours to a focus contexts. events and known products—let art ways, like sculpture in others, and like the internet in still others. asking viewers to switch modes of on threshold, where there’s a desire become a background for the image engagement between differently me- to play with the power of spectacle, BT: One of the coolest things consumer’s comment threads! [Puts Victoria Fu: Every fgure and object be digitally mediated (many works diated images. It makes me wonder, to appropriate the image toward Jogging [thejogging.tumblr.com] hand up to high fve Rupert Murdoch, in Belle Captive (2013) is appropri- are now constructed with their what happens when the threshold other ends. stole from advertising is the idea of Rupert swings, Brad swipes hand ated green-screen stock clips from inevitably mediated form in mind), is broader and the apparatus less having an unavoidable relationship over his head as if to run hand through the internet. The footage is overlaid but I’m also a fan of art’s signal detectable? What are the phenom- VF: Yes, we aren’t far from the with media. Lauren Christiansen hair—“Too slow old man!”] and manipulated—cropped, looped, getting lost in the digital abyss. enological implications of engaging Pictures Generation’s play with and I started the project as a re- blurred—to appear as foreground Decentralized image-sharing net- in digital simulation? spectacle. The gesture of appropria- sponse to the attention economy. We VF: Alternative curatorial and on a color-feld background that I’ve works allow art to become some- tion has been normalized (ani- wanted to create a way of produc- production models that the Jogging shot on 16mm flm. Each layer is thing other than itself, reblogged BT: [Embarrassed, looks up from mated GIFs, for instance), but is ing (and a type of) content that represents reach networked commu- disconnected from the others, but into contexts and for purposes one-handed sexting on a Motorola no less relevant given the ease and would fuidly exist in a digitally nities in ways that make me hopeful. at the same time they’re legible all totally unrelated to the author’s Razr] I don’t think scrolling on a speed with which we encounter mediated environment that privi- Our discursive participation within together as action within cinematic initial intentions. Art’s integration device produces a greater degree of and proliferate images. The global leges image ubiquity rather than expanded image environments has narrative space. Installed, the off- (disintegration?) into everyday life engagement for viewers. Scrolling advertising network is imbricated operating on the scarcity model of the ability to build awareness of our kilter projection merges the videos’ feels most exciting here because this is an act of indifference; it’s a tepid, in the stock footage I use, and the the art market. [Polishes fag lapel own actions and complicity. spatial logic with ours in trompe- is a uniquely contemporary phe- upstream doggy-paddle against videos I make are just single nodes pin, runs hand through hair to appear l’oeil fashion, toying with our nomenon based on current mediat- the deluge of status updates, lunch along paths of dispersion. Moreover, more Romney-esque] The Jogging’s perception of actual space. Cinema ing technologies. Can you imagine decisions, selfes. Scrolling is a is pixels on-screen is projected light another time in history when twenty pattern-fnding mission that doesn’t is a sculptural object is the walls thousand ffteen-year-olds in sub- privilege any bit of information over GAYLEN GERBER speaks JD: As I recall, before the of the room. In what some call a urban America were using Robert another, but serves to identify links Backdrops you were making “post-cinematic” or “post-internet” Smithson images to impress each between posts. I won’t click a news with JEANNE DUNNING works that were more eas- moment, is the viewer a spectator, other and get laid? [Wipes Andrea link until three people who don’t ily understood as discrete protagonist, user, all of the above? Fraser–based alligator tear from eye] know each other have shared it. Jeanne Dunning: I thought a good way to discuss your new work at the objects: paintings, drawings, With the emergence of the digital, Historical avant-garde dreams do We use our calloused index fngers Whitney and perhaps to shed some light on it, would be to talk about other photographs… painting’s problem of representation come true!! to scroll, but it’s a process derived pieces you’ve made that use some of the same elements. One of the cen- (Magritte’s “This is not a pipe”) per- from the organizational principles of tral elements of the Whitney project is the very large Backdrop painting; GG: Each Backdrop is a discrete sists with higher stakes: now, more PP: Great expectations! There’s machines. I am, by the way, totally Backdrops have been part of your work for a long time. In these works you object—canvas over a wooden intricate degrees of simulation ask a sense of new possibility in this fne with that. [Winks at Jaron in take a pre-existing wall and stretch a huge canvas of the same dimensions, stretcher. us to engage with the constant food digital era, particularly around the the front row of the press conference and then paint the canvas some neutral color, typically gray. You hang this of images on a haptic level—swip- emergence of decentralized modes Victoria, Paul, and Brad are holding at painting on the wall, so that when it’s hung you can barely see it’s there un- JD: But we don’t really experi- ing, tapping, dragging. I recognize of content distribution and con- Madison Square Garden; Jaron angrily less you look at the edges. I’ve seen photographs of the process of building ence them that way, So it seems the impulse to translate the digital sumption. Whole new horizons wind-futes back] and stretching one of these canvases. You have to build the stretcher and like a shift to me. The Backdrops into analog, extrude sculptural space are opening up to support freedom stretch the painting in the same room where it will be hung—it’s too big to are so much about the fact that out of the virtual, then back again. of expression and interconnec- VF: Scrolling appears to give get through the doorway. It’s this massive work, but as soon as you lift it up they don’t function on their tivity, new ways to reinvent our freedom of choice, but we are still onto the wall, it seems to disappear. It’s sort of the perfect way of getting own. Even calling it a backdrop Brad Troemel: Virtual!! [Giggles, identities and customize our user limited and informed by the system. at this idea that the painting is a background—the ground against which points out that it only functions pops leather jacket collar, takes a drag experience. But I wonder if all this Psychogeography at the virtual level we see other things. When did you frst start making the Backdrops? if there is something in front of before placing clove e-cigarette over really amounts to is a kind of vastly still shapes being and conscious- it. Of course, ultimately the point magnetic-faux-pierced left ear, clears extended shopping mall. In his book ness. Just as our bodies conform to Gaylen Gerber: The frst one Scanlan’s work in front of it. But you’re making is that all those throat] I’m interested in this feed- Design and Crime (2002), Hal Foster behavioral patterns dictated by our was made in 1993 and exhib- it’s hard to say, I had been mak- supposedly discrete art objects back loop you describe wherein all describes the endless possibilities in built environment and social status ited the following year at Nicole ing work related to this idea for do the same thing, that they physical art-things must eventually a suburban mall to choose just the (whether we hunt for our food, jog Klagsbrun Gallery, with Joe more than a decade… don’t function independently.

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