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Home , Chester Gould, Comic Book Artist, Dick Tracy, Dick Tracy (serial), Dick Tracy (soundtrack), Don Newton

1 E-ManMadman & TM TM & © 2015 Joe Michael T. Staton. Allred. Femme Flaming Noir TM Carrot & © 2015 TM Christopher& © 2015 Bob Mills Burden. & . 8 also: 2 A 6 5 TwoMorrows Publication 8 9

7 LEILA LEIZ • • •STAN LEIZ GOLDBERG LEILA 0 7 3 4 0 3

No. 9,Summer2015 THE GODS OF MOUNT OLYMPUS MOUNT OF GODS THE ™ •KATIE GREEN $ in theUSA 8.95

Summer 2015 • Voice of the Comics Medium • Number 9 table of contents

Ye Ed’s Rant: The Tyranny of Time...... 2

E-WOOdy Comics Chatter CBC mascot by J.D. King Remembering Kushner: The late photographer/writer’s good friend and ©2015 J.D. King. collaborator Christopher Irving recalls the recently departed CBC contributor...... 3 About Our Cover Katie Green: An interview with the Lighter Than My Shadow graphic novelist...... 4 Aushenkerology: A personal ode to Cowboy Henk and the great European comics..... 6 Art by JOE STATON Color by MATT WEBB Incoming: The Therapeutic Value of “It” and on Kull the Conqueror...... 10 The Good Stuff: George Khoury talks with artist Leila Leiz about living the dream...... 14 Hembeck’s Dateline: Our Man Fred chats up longtime pal Joe Staton...... 17 Stan Goldberg: Part one of Richard J. Arndt’s interview with the late and Marvel , a man remarkably appreciative for his long career in comics...... 18 GODS OF MOUNT OLYMPUS SPECIAL section Johnny Lee Achziger’s Olympian Achievement: CBC’s three-part examination of a little-known but breathtaking 1970s comics project starts with recollections of the guy who authored and helmed the tabloid-size (and ill-fated) series...... 26 Joe Staton, Myth-Maker: The issue’s featured subject shares the story behind Only two things were requested his spectacular artistry on the Greek mythology comics series...... 30 of cover artist Joe Staton: Please include Alec Tron, Nova Kane John Workman’s Mighty Aphrodite: The artist who followed up Joe on the short- (a.k.a. Katrinka Colchnzski), and any other creator-owned lived series talks about the Gods’ brief revival in ’s Star*Reach...... 32 character he’d like to add — plus The Comics Library: R.J. Arndt looks at Tintin and the Great Library Mystery...... 34 caricatures of his kind self and lovely bride Hilarie… and, boy, THE MAIN EVENT does Our Man deliver! The bonus figure here is Femme Noir, the The Energizing Art of Joe Staton: CBC ’s exhaustive interview with the artist on artist’s and writer Christopher Mills’ “Blond of Nocturne his career, from Charlton to , also featuring wife and collaborator, Hilarie.... 36 City,” a tough-talking, gun-sling- ing, curly-haired . Check BACK MATTER out www.femme-noir.com for her crime-fighting exploits. —Ye Ed. Creator’s Creators: Steven Thompson...... 79

Art, E-Man, Nova TM & ©2015 Joe T. Staton. Femme Noir TM & © 2015 Christopher Mills J. Art, E-Man, Nova TM & ©2015 Joe T. If you’re viewing a Digital Coming Attractions: Peter Bagge & WARP! The Broadway Play...... 79 Edition of this publication, PLEASE READ THIS: A Picture Is Worth A Thousand Words: X-Ray specs’ mystery artist revealed!...... 80 This is copyrighted material, NOT intended for downloading anywhere except our Right: Sporting the kinchy hues of CBC pal Mort Todd (himself profiled in #4), it’s E-Man and Nova Kane website or Apps. If you downloaded it from another website or torrent, go ahead and as drawn by the indomitable Joe Staton. The fave Charlton character will be appearing in Todd and Roger read it, and if you decide to keep it, DO THE RIGHT THING and buy a legal down- McKenzie’s Charlton Neo title Charlton Action soon. Find details at www.morttodd.com/charlton. load, or a printed copy. Otherwise, DELETE IT FROM YOUR DEVICE and DO NOT SHARE IT WITH FRIENDS OR POST IT ANYWHERE. If you enjoy our publications Artist Vol. 1 & 2 are now available enough to download them, please pay for them so we can keep producing ones like as digital downloads from twomorrows.com! this. Our digital editions should ONLY be downloaded within our Apps and at www.twomorrows.com Comic Book Creator ™ is published quarterly by TwoMorrows Publishing, 10407 Bedfordtown Dr., Raleigh, NC 27614 USA. Phone: (919) 449-0344. Jon B. Cooke, editor. John Morrow, publisher. Comic Book Creator editorial offices: P.O. Box 204, West Kingston, RI 02892 USA. E-mail: [email protected] subscription funds to TwoMorrows, NOT to the editorial offices. Four-issue subscriptions: $40 US, $54 Art, E-Man & Nova Canada, $60 elsewhere. All characters are © their respective copyright owners. All material © their TM & © 2015 Joe T. Staton. Comic Book Creator creators unless otherwise noted. All editorial matter ©2015 Jon B. Cooke/TwoMorrows. Comic Book Image courtesy of is a proud joint production of Creator is a TM of Jon B. Cooke/TwoMorrows. ISSN 2330-2437. Printed in China. FIRST PRINTING. Shaun Clancy & Mort Todd. Jon B. Cooke/TwoMorrows The Other Man Called Stan Stan G.’s Truest Colors Part one of our interview with the late, great artist about his Marvel and Archie work

Conducted by RICHARD J. ARNDT CBC Contributing Editor I always drew, so I was always sitting in a corner and they’d ask “Draw this. Draw that,” and I did. I wasn’t [Stan Goldberg began his career in comics in 1949 running around the house screaming or breaking as a colorist for . Within a few things or causing trouble. My cousins used years he became the head of the colorist to tease me, you know. “Everybody loves department, which lasted until ’58, when Stanley.” But it was an easy childhood. Timely/Atlas experienced a publication Of course, my parents knew that I implosion after their distributor went drew and they always encouraged me out of business. He then went free- at it, but they never encouraged me to lance (and has remained so through- go out and make a living as an artist. out the rest of his career), beginning Not because of any lack of talent, but with work in TV commercials, then they never thought I would succeed. as the colorist for Nobody really knew what jobs were from ’59 through the mid-’60s. He available for artists in those days. My was also a penciler for numerous teen dad worked for the government and humor books, including Marvel’s Millie he suggested that I get a federal job, the Model, DC’s Binky and, most notably, take some tests, work, and retire with a ’ Archie, among many others. nice pension at the age of 49 or 50. My dad, In recent years, before his death last August, though, worked until he was 75, and he loved he worked for drawing working. My mother would always say, “On Sunday, and for on their Three Stooges and Drew you can sit home and paint. I’ll buy you an easel.” Above: In 2010, in consideration for Stan Goldberg’s considerable titles. He also did many public service projects, including a It never dawned on me that I’d end up with a career contributions to Archie Comics one recently dealing with bullying. Mr. Goldberg has been a as an artist. I graduated from high school. In fact, I got out from the mid-1970s onward, IDW true mainstay of comics from the Golden Age to his passing a little early because I skipped some classes. I graduated published Archie: The Best of at age 82. What follows is the first of a two-part interview when I was 17 years old. Most kids didn’t graduate until they Stan Goldberg. Inset: The artist conducted between March and April 2013. — RJA] were 18 or older. I went away as a counselor at a summer at the 2012 Comic-Con Interna- camp, up in New Hampshire, teaching arts and crafts. When tional: San Diego in a photo by CBC: Thank you for taking the time for this interview. Kendall Whitehouse. Below: Stan: You’re welcome. I regard all the time I’ve spent in Detail of Stan G.’s Millie the comics with a great fondness. All the people I’ve worked Model #140 [Aug. 1966] cover. with — , , , , , , all those guys. It’s all real history and I’ve got a great memory. I remember them very fondly. Now that the whole interview is over, thank you for calling, Richard, and that’s the end of it. Photo © Kendall Whitehouse. Archie TM & Publications, Inc. CBC: Ooookay! [laughter] Before that actually happens can we start off with information about your early life? How you got interested in drawing, that sort of thing. Stan: I grew up during the Depression, in the 1930s. Money was pretty tight in those days, but my dad was fortunate enough to work for those years. Sometimes he had private jobs, but for the most part he worked for the government until he retired. He worked in the Social Security Administra- tion and in the Internal Revenue Service. I was an only child, but that was fine. I didn’t have to share anything with a sibling and I never even missed having a brother or sister, because it was the type of family that would be called an “extended family” today. There was the matriarch, the grandmother, and the patriarch, the grandfa-

ther. Mine had a little house in . They came from TM & © Marvel Characters, Inc. Europe and worked themselves up. They lived in the Lower East Side, where all the new immigrants lived. My grandfa- ther was a tailor. He designed clothes and that sort of thing. When they made enough money, they moved to the Bronx, which at the time was considered moving on up. They bought a little house and had four children, one of whom was my mother. Their house was the meeting place for all the rela- tives. I had aunts and uncles and a few cousins and we all hung out together. I was always treated quite royally because I was a good grandson. The good nephew. The good son.

18 #9 • Summer 2015 • COMIC BOOK CREATOR I came back, I called up a good friend from school and asked him what he’d been doing all summer. He told me he had this job, but that he wasn’t going back there on Monday, so why didn’t I go up there and take his seat because they’ll need somebody up there. I didn’t even know what job he had, but it turned out that he had a coloring job in the office of Timely Comics. He’d been doing some menial coloring gigs there. There were a lot of books there and a lot of pages to do. So I went up there on Monday and I remember a guy came in who ran the department and he asked me who I was and what I was doing there. I told him I was taking over for my friend — my friend’s name was Marvin — that Marvin wasn’t coming back and he’d asked me to take his chair. I named Hubie Paley. They formed their own coloring compa- Previous page: Inset bottom, don’t know why, but they gave me some things to do immedi- ny. They worked for a bunch of different companies coloring courtesy of Heritage Auctions, is Stan G.’s cover art for Millie the ately and that’s how I came to work at Timely Comics. their books. They did very well for a long time because there Model #165 [Dec. 1968]. Above: This would have been the end of August, so at the were a lot of publishers around putting out comic books and some of them didn’t have a color department. So Pat and Stan Goldberg was honored by beginning of the next year, which would have been 1949, the the Australian ’ As- whole bullpen was fired. I was there for four months and Hubie formed this company and did alright with it for quite a while. I don’t know what their rates were, but they had sociation in 2010 as he received then, I don’t know why, but everybody was laid off. Within their Stanley Award for the a few months they were publishing again and they started a lot of work. I freelanced for them from time to time, after the day’s work at Timely. I’d spend half the night making “” category. hiring artists, writers, and production people back. They Courtesy of then-ACA president some extra money working for them. One night I worked the wanted me to return to work in the coloring department and, Chatfield.Below: Kirby & because I had another job by then and I was afraid they’d whole night there. I told my parents where I was going to be, Ayers’ Thing pin-up from FF #2. fire me just as soon as I returned, so I told them no. I didn’t though. Hues by Stan G. Courtesy hear from them for a while. Then I got another note from John D’Agonisto left Timely to work for them, clearing of Cory Sedlmeier. them asking me to please come back. “We like what you do. the way for me to become the head of the coloring de- We’ll give you a couple of dollars raise.” You know, it’s funny: partment at Timely. John became an artist, working as There was another guy up there who got a callback, too, and an . He worked for Archie Comics for years and we thought we were both getting a five dollar raise but they years. He inked probably hundreds of my pages. split it between the two of us, so we both got $2.50 apiece. We were good friends right up until his death It was a big $25 salary I was making at the time but, in those a year or so ago. Up until then, he was my days, $25 was not that bad for a 17-, almost 18-year-old kid. oldest friend in the business because I met I also liked that I was working on all the comics that I’d him when I was 17 years old. read as a young boy. I sit at my grandmother’s house, on The Timely offices were in the her porch, reading all the comics. I loved . I Empire State Building at that time. The loved the Young Allies. I loved those books, but didn’t know coloring department was a part of who the artists’ names were. I knew all the characters the Bullpen. We were in a different though. I did come back to Timely although it took until the area at first, but shortly, after I third time that they called me. The job I had in the meantime came back, they moved the coloring looked like it wasn’t going anywhere. Not that I knew that department in with the rest of the this one was going to last for over 60 years! But it did. So Bullpen. We were I went back and, within a year, I was running the coloring in a different area department. because the offices The guy, John D’Agonisto, who’d been running it before at the Empire State me, was about three years older than me. About six months Building were or so after I returned, he went to another company to work in too small. When their coloring department. That company that John went to Timely moved to a was also started by two former Timely . One of them different building we was a Italian fellow who later became an editor at Charlton had a bigger space and were all moved into Comics… the same offices. CBC: Would that have been Pat Musulli? After the Empire State Building, we Stan: Yeah, that would have been Pat. Pat and another guy moved to a big old hotel on Park Avenue. I

Photo © Jason Chatfield. Archie characters TM & Publications, Inc. The Thing Marvel Characters, think it was called the Hotel Marguerite and

Comic Book Creator • Summer 2015 • #9 19 the gods of mount olympus An Olympian Achievement Johnny Lee Achziger recalls the ambitious tabloid-sized mythological comics project

by JOHNNY LEE ACHZIGER which turned out to be cursed from the get-go. My first inclination was to ask the popular fan artist [YE ED’S NOTE: Back in the 1970s, I encountered a tabloid- to draw it, but I wanted to go with a “professional” artist (I sized, black-&-white comic book exquisitely drawn by a don’t think Newton had turned pro yet), so I wrote to three young Joe Staton entitled The Gods of Mount Olympus. The of my favorite artists, offering them a guaranteed $25 per series was short-lived but unforgettable, and it was subse- page up front with a possibility (based on sales) of as much quently reformatted for a regular-size appearance in Mike as $75 per page. Two of my choices, Barry Smith and Russ Friedrich’s Star*Reach anthology. Serendipitously, I came Heath, never replied to my generous offer, but Joe Staton did in contact with the original publisher and writer, Johnny respond, in January 1974. I didn’t know what was going on Lee Achziger, who agreed to share the story behind this with him at Charlton at the time, but he replied that he would lovely production. Also featured is contributing editor be interested in doing three issues of the series. (and Star*Reach Companion author) Richard J. Arndt’s I was thrilled to have Joe as my artist because I loved interviews with Joe and John Workman about Gods.] his art at Charlton, especially E-Man, and he had recently I have been a comics fan since I learned to read in done some color covers for Fantastic Science Fiction and the mid-1950s. I published a few fanzines in the late ’60s/ Fantasy Stories magazine, which got me hoping that I could early ’70s (The Collector’s Chronicle, Quintessence), and get him to also do some color art. The first thing I commis- I later published a collection of World War II-era Phan- sioned, an illustration of Ares and Aphrodite, just blew me tom comic strips, the first and only in what was going to away! I thought it was the best art Joe had ever done and be an ongoing series of reprints, with Alley was certain the project would be a success! I used that Oop and ’s Secret Agent Corrigan in the art in a full-page ad in the Comic Buyer’s Guide; it looked works. But sales were so low, I had to cancel typeset, but the lettering was actually done with those little all those ambitious plans. stick-on letters that you’d rub on one at a time! I advertised Above: Cover of the first I had always wanted to be a comics writer the 16-page, tabloid-size comic at $1 per issue, three issues Gods of Mount Olympus and had actually “auditioned” when DC had a for $2.75, six issues for $5. Joe had only committed for three tabloid. Art by Joe sort of open-house solicitation for new writers issues and wondered why I offered a six-issue subscription, Staton. Right: Promo sometime in the ’70s (they called it the Junior but I figured if he bailed, I could continue the series with art by Joe of Athena, Woodchucks, I believe). But, unfortunately, I someone else. the goddess of war. wasn’t motivated enough to actually sit down and The response to the ad was not overwhelming. On the All Olympus art in this write all the time as any real writer must do. day I took the book to the printers, I only had about 100 section courtesy So I decided I’d publish my own comic orders (I think I got less than 200 orders total). But I went of Johnny Lee books. I toyed with the idea of publishing a ahead anyway, thinking I could sell a bunch of copies to Achziger. weekly, tabloid-sized comic, similar in format to dealers like Bud Plant (well, actually just Bud Plant; there the great Menomonee Falls Gazette, but featur- weren’t a lot of choices in those days). The art for the first ing all-new stories and art by top professionals. story came in and I was thrilled! Joe did a fantastic job and I even wrote to dozens of writers, including Ray I thought sure we’d make a fortune on this series once the Bradbury, , Jane Gaskell (who word got around. I had 3,000 copies printed and started was very nice), and Robert A. Heinlein (who work on the next two issues. By now it was Spring ’74 and wasn’t), about adapting their works to comics. I thought it would be a great idea to take my product direct I also inquired about licensing some popular to the fans and attend some comic conventions. So I sent TV and movie rights, such as Kung Fu, Joe the scripts for the next two issues and asked him to get Honey West, and James Bond 007. When them done as fast as possible so that I could take them to I finally realized what all this would cost, the summer cons. When the art for #2 and #3 arrived, I was I came to my senses and decided to go somewhat disappointed because it looked very rushed (in with something in the public domain. fact, Joe stated he had done the third issue over a weekend). The Gods of Mount Olympus TM & © Johnny Lee Achziger. Art © Joe Staton. I had always enjoyed reading about I don’t blame Joe at all because I had put the rush on him ancient mythology and thought that and he came through as best he could under the circum- would be a subject that would be of stances. The art wasn’t bad by any means, just nowhere interest to many in fandom. So The Gods near the standard he’d set with the first issue. of Mount Olympus was chosen. Let me state So I printed up the second and third issues at the same up front that I was a very naive young man time (another 3,000 of each) and picked what I thought would when it came to how things worked in the be the best conventions to debut my pride and joy. I had real world of publishing (or in the real world in never been to a con yet, but I chose Houston Con as my first general actually), so everything you read from stop, intending to go on to after that. The following hereon reflects that youthful stupidity (I never is a true story — several of the people named here are still did anything maliciously, I just didn’t know what alive and can testify to the truthfulness of this insane misad- I was doing). My memory of exact dates and venture. Let me also mention that I never in my life did drugs. such may not be perfectly clear, but what I was just very stupid at times. follows is as best as I can recall. I owned an old ’67 Ford station wagon and had just spent It was sometime in late 1973 some $300 getting it ready for the trip (new tires, brakes, when I started this endeavor, shocks… I had everything checked out… everything except

26 #9 • Summer 2015 • COMIC BOOK CREATOR the radiator). I stuffed it full with 2,000 copies of each issue moving van to haul about a half-foot of comics. Above: Spectacular spread by (remember, these were tabloid-size!) and together with my Did I mention that I didn’t have enough cash to rent the Joe Staton from The Gods of friend Don Kruger, we left Spokane, Washington, and set out U-Haul? Nor did I have a bank card. So I went to a nearby Mount Olympus #1. Someone for Texas. We drove all the way through Montana, over 700 bank and asked for a loan! When the nice bank man stopped hurry up and reprint TGOMO at miles, that first day (that state had no speed limit in those laughing, he offered to call my bank back in Spokane so large-size… this masterwork days) and turned south into Wyoming, stopping for the night I could see if they could do anything to help me. My bank deserves it! Below: Johnny Lee in Sheridan. The next morning we continued south down the wouldn’t loan me any money, but checking my account, $800 Achziger and his then-fiancée eastern side of Wyoming (did you know that eastern Wyo- was available. By coincidence, this was the exact amount of in the 1970s. They have been ming is a virtual desert? Neither did I!). The temperature was the check I had just mailed to Joe Staton for the artwork of married for 36 years now! over 100 degrees and I started to see the radiator gauge go #2 and 3… okay, it wasn’t a up and up, then greenish liquid started trickling out through coincidence. Joe just hadn’t the edges of the hood. We were in the middle of the desert, gotten the check yet. So my with no towns even close. I pulled over and poured all the feeble-minded brain thought water we had into the radiator, then set out again. By the that if I had my bank wire time we neared Cheyenne, Wyoming, steam was billowing me that money, I could make from the engine. I took the first exit near Cheyenne and the enough in Houston to put the car died on the exit ramp, but we had enough speed going money back, then I would to coast into the inevitable gas station nearby. The attendant give Joe the money in person there called a tow truck, which hauled us into town and in New York, and everything dropped us off at a Ford dealership repair shop. would be fine. But instead of Now, I knew little or nothing about cars, so when the just letting his check bounce, mechanic told me that the radiator had a massive hole and for some stupid reason I had by continuing driving while it was overheating probably them put a stop-payment warped the heads and blew the engine, I immediately wrote on it. So my bank wired off the car as damaged beyond repair and started thinking the money down to me in of alternative means to get to Houston. I started calling car Wyoming and we rented the rental agencies, but because I didn’t have one of those U-Haul. new-fangled bank cards, none of the major agencies would The next morning, I went rent to me (and none would accept cash!). Finally I got a back to the Ford repair shop local company to rent me a Volkswagen bug. I thought about and the mechanic told me he renting a small trailer and pulling my 6000 copies of Gods to thought that if they patched Houston behind the VW bug, but wisely thought the better of up the radiator we would be it. Finally, we decided to rent a U-Haul. Of course, the U-Haul good to go. But my brain was dealer didn’t have any of the small vans, so we got a 20-foot convinced that the car was TM & © Johnny Lee Achziger. Art © Joe Staton. The Gods of Mount Olympus TM & © Johnny Lee Achziger.

Comic Book Creator • Summer 2015 • #9 27 THE ENERGIZING ART OF

During a period when the “good” comic art was heavily rendered and often overly realistic, the arrival of artist Joe Thomas Staton to the comics scene in the early ’70s, boasting an effervescent, energetic cartooning style, was a delight. Starting at the bottom rung of the professional ladder, Joe began at , very soon teaming-up with enthusiastic writer (and artist) Nicola Cuti at the Derby, Conn. imprint. Together they created E-Man, perhaps the character they will always be best remembered for, though each would go on to have stellar careers as comics pros. This interview was conducted at the Staton abode in Kingston, N.Y., in mid-March, where we were joined by Joe’s lovely wife, Hilarie. The transcript was copyedited by the pair.

Comic Book Creator: Where he in the Air Corps immediately before that? are you originally from, Joe? Joe: Right. In World War II. He and my Uncle Dave Staton Joe Staton: I was born in Fort were briefly together in Italy. They would get together on Bragg, North Carolina, and I mostly grew bombing runs… They weren’t bombers, but they were being up in West Tennessee — Milan, Tennessee. bombed! So there’s a family history of war stuff. I am a Southern boy. My dad was in the CBC: By the Italian Air Force or the Luftwaffe? Air Force. That’s why we happened to Joe: The Luftwaffe. I’m pretty sure. I think. be in Fort Bragg. We were actually at CBC: Wow! He wasn’t involved in any of the invasion Fort Pope, which was the Air Force… force? Pope Field. So I am briefly from North Joe: No, but he was involved in helping evacuate Naples Carolina. when Vesuvius erupted. CBC: Were there any creative people in CBC: What year was that? your family? Joe: ’46? ’45? I need to look up these things. [laughs] Joe: I had an uncle who was an artist. Hilarie Staton: I’m the reference person. [Looking online] My grandfather had things that he had The last serious eruption was in ’44. drawn. He didn’t follow it up, but you Joe: Because the U.S. Army was there handy, they had all could just see that he had done it, illus- these trucks to get people out of town. There were all these

tration-type stuff. Just enough to know ashes coming down… E-Man TM & © Joe T. Staton. Green Lanterns TM & © DC Comics. Portrait ©2015 Kendall Whitehouse. that he was interested. So… CBC: Yeah, right, and we know what happened there CBC: What is your mother’s maiden name? before. Joe: Butler. Joe: Right. We saw that movie. CBC: Staton is an English name? CBC: Did he share any specific stories about the war? Joe: It’s English. From what I’m told, it’s a Joe: Not really. Occasionally, but mostly funny stories, stuff Saxon name. With me it’s a long “a.” Stay-tuhn. like that. Getting lost in Libya in a jeep and trying to get out. CBC: I guess many must say Stah-tuhn. That sort of thing. Daddy died when I was young, so I heard Joe: Yeah. One of my early credits at DC was a lot of stories from my Uncle Dave. very often Stanton. [laughs] And I’ll be plugged CBC: Do you have brothers and sisters? at conventions very often as Joe: I have one sister, Janice. Jan may get me for this: “Stanton,” with that extra “n.” When she was born, my parents wrote back to my Staton CBC: What’s your grandfather and told him her name. He didn’t recognize the middle name? name so he figured it out phonetically. He always called her Joe: Thomas. John-ah-see. [laughter] She’s not quite two years younger CBC: Joseph than me. She was a paralegal for a long time, and actually, Thomas Staton. before that, she was an agent for the Florida Department of Joe: Not Joseph. Law Enforcement, which we always thought of as the FBI It is Joe. [laughs] CBC: So the CBC: A cop? Air Force was Joe: She was an investigator. She did have to carry a gun very new and she got tired of that. She was actually involved in wear- then? Was ing wires and that sort of thing.

36 #9 • Summer 2015 • COMIC BOOK CREATOR From E-Man to the Gods of Olympus to The to , a dog named Scooby, and Dick Tracy, this guy named Joe has done it all!

Conducted by Jon B. Cooke • Transcribed by Steven Thompson • Portrait by Kendall Whitehouse Hilarie: She worked with insurance investigations. CBC: That’s some weird characters! Joe: Right. And being in Florida, there’s a lot of insurance Joe: Yes. That’s right. Bonnie Braids… all that stuff. fraud. CBC: Do you remember the newspapers that came CBC: How come? into the house? Joe: Boats. Lots of boats. You can do things with boats and Joe: Oh, golly. It was later. When I was little I had no idea then collect on them. Sink them and burn them. what papers there were. Back in West Tennessee, there CBC: Are you close with her? were always the Memphis Press, the Commercial Appeal, Joe: Reasonably, yes. and Memphis Press-Scimitar. I think it was the Commercial CBC: Were you close growing up? That’s only two years, Appeal that had Dick Tracy. Jackson, Tennessee, had the right? Jackson Sun. I still follow the Jackson Sun online although Joe: Well, I was terrible to her, but I would say we were they don’t carry Tracy anymore. That’s the weird thing. Mike reasonably close. CBC: Are your earliest memories in Tennessee? How long were you in North Carolina? Joe: I was born there and then we moved around to differ- ent parts, mostly in Tennessee. CBC: Were you always moving? Joe: We moved several times. Yeah. CBC: How was that? Joe: I… guess it was… okay! [laughs] Yeah. CBC: What are your earliest memories of growing up? Joe: The comics. My earliest memories are always what comics was I reading at the time. [laughs] I’d be reading Gene Autry, and that’s what happened that year. Now I’m reading , and that’s what happened that year. I was learning to read. That sort of thing. CBC: So, Gene Autry was the first comic that you remem- ber? Were you immediately drawn to it? Joe: Well, I just remembering reading Gene Autry and Roy Rogers. All that stuff! There was a lot of that. Of course, the earliest things I remember are ’s Dick Tracy. CBC: Comic strips? Joe: As long as there were newspapers and strips, I was drawn to the strips, drawn to Chester Gould. It was strange. Before I could read, there was that strange drawing. I was always following that. CBC: What were your impressions? Was it the weird vil- lains? Was it the earnestness of the protagonist? Was it… ? Joe: It must have been just the weird black-&-white drawing. CBC: ? Joe: Pruneface, Flattop, and all that.

Previous page: Upper left are, of course, some of Joe Staton’s best-known characters, including E-Man and the . Photo of Joe at the 2012 snapped by Kendall Whitehouse. Photo inset is uncredited pic of Hilarie. This page: Upper right is the /Joe Staton creation, The Huntress. At right, done for John Read’s superb Stay Tooned! magazine, Joe’s self-caricature used as cover for #2 (2008). Colors by the marvelous Matt Webb. All characters TM & © their respective copyright holders. Self-caricature illo artwork ©2015 Joe Staton.

Comic Book Creator • Summer 2015 • #9 37 Joe: It was! Joe: I did some writing. CBC: Was it mimeographed? CBC: You had a natural Joe: It was mimeographed… badly. facility to write? CBC: And the illustrations were drawn on ditto? Joe: Yes, it came naturally. Joe: No, not ditto. On mimeograph stencils. You remember And I did some art and a lot mimeograph stencils? of paste-up. I guess that’s Hilarie: They were blue. as close to being social as I CBC: I always mix ’em up with ditto. was. There would be group Joe: Yeah, a lot of fanzines were done on ditto, though mim- gatherings where everybody eograph was preferred because it lasted better, but it was would get together and harder to reproduce. I guess it was like fabric with a sort of paste-up the newspaper. wax in the fabric and you typed it and the keys would like And I would get to hang out punch the letters. To copy art (and I still have mimeograph with the cheerleaders who tools around somewhere) you would trace the art onto the also worked on the paper. stencils. CBC: When was the first CBC: I remember that. You had to redo your art. time you saw your name in Joe: Yeah. I do say I’m probably the only currently function- print? ing artist who was influenced by having to adapt his art to Joe: Apparently the letters I tracing on mimeograph. sent to Julie Schwartz. CBC: So if mimeograph comes BACK… ! ’Cause we know CBC: Did that have an it will, like vinyl! [laughter] impact on you? Joe: If civilization collapses, there’s going to be runs on Joe: Yes. these… these… CBC: It had your street CBC: “Who do we know? Send out the pigeon!” address, too? Joe: There’s warehouses full of stencilers! You ask Maggie Joe: I think it must have, Thompson! Maggie knows all that stuff. Maggie was the yeah. master of drawing on mimeograph stencils. Hilarie: They could have CBC: The master of the mimeograph master. sent it to Milan and it would Joe: [Laughs] Right! And as Maggie reminded us, Steve have reached you. It’s not a Stiles was the real master. city. It’s a small town. CBC: So it was Maelstrom at the time. You get that in the Joe: Right. Julie Schwartz mail and you realize that there’s a community of like-mind- is my touchstone. Other than ed people… Was it the science fiction elements in Julius Chester Gould, he was really Schwartz’s edited comics? Is that what attracted you? the first name I attached to Joe: Yes. somebody who was signifi- CBC: What were you reading as far as fiction goes? Who cant in the comics. So I sent was a favorite? Julie letters and some were Joe: Oh, golly. Clifford Simak … my all-time favorite over published. He was doing the all was Philip K. Dick. I still read Philip K. Dick. I like Murray kind of science fiction I liked Leinster for just straight stories. Oh! And I went through a — Strange Adventures and spell when I was a teenager reading all of the Burroughs . stuff! I guess I was a younger teenager. I knew it was junk CBC: Did you like “Adam but I loved it! Strange”? CBC: The first three or four Tarzan books, but the others… Joe: Yes! I really liked oy! “Adam Strange.” A beautiful Joe: Oh, who could be critical at that age? [laughter] strip! CBC: All the Pellucidar, John Carter, Carson of Venus in the CBC: For the school news- Ace paperbacks… It was a golden age for that stuff, right? paper, did you do spot illos or Joe: With the Frazetta covers… editorial cartoons? CBC: Roy Krenkel… Joe: This one time, for Joe: Yeah! I guess it was Krenkel, right? the school yearbook, I did CBC: They alternated. caricatures of some of Joe: So I had those and I went through a spell of reading the teachers and I would H.P. Lovecraft. Historical note: Where we live, Kingston, occasionally do a drawing New York, is famous in the annals of H.P. Lovecraft history of a sports event for some because he had his suitcase stolen in Kingston, New York. reason. It was cartoony, ex- [laughs] aggerated stuff. I think they CBC: Clark Ashton Smith probably took it. Were you into were well-received. I don’t movies at all? remember any objections. I Joe: Not so much movies. I guess there weren’t that many was just trying to get a cartoon likeness. Above: As your incredulous outlets for movies or I just didn’t see them? I do remember CBC: No biting ? editor learns during this compre- going to drive-ins. Joe: No. [laughs] That was in college! hensive interview, Hilarie Wol- CBC: How many times did you move between the time you CBC: Those were really changing times. Where were you ford married artist and aspiring comics creator Joe Staton when were, like, five and 15? when JFK was assassinated? he was jobless, in 1971. It was Joe: About three or four. Joe: I was in the school library in high school. They didn’t during their budget-conscious CBC: It didn’t have much of an effect on you? Leaving an end school but they announced it on the PA system. honeymoon to Mystic Seaport entire community behind and starting in a new one? CBC: They said the President’s dead? when Joe stopped at the Joe: I don’t remember that being a problem. Joe: Well, they announced he was shot. I guess they didn’t bottom-of-the-ladder Charlton Hilarie: After you were ten, you only moved twice. know he was dead at that point. Comics in Derby, Connecticut, Joe: That’s when Daddy died and we stayed in Milan near CBC: Did that affect you? Did you feel like times were which would jump-start the my mother’s family and especially her brother Tom Butler. changing? man’s career. These photos of CBC: You worked on the school newspaper? You did some Joe: I did think that things were getting a little strange, yes. the couple were shot in the early writing? 1970s. Note the brass plaque. Photos courtesy of Joe and Hilarie Staton. CBC: Did you feel with Camelot coming on, with the Presi-

Comic Book Creator • Summer 2015 • #9 41 dent coming in, that there was a sea-change coming? Was it your prospects? Were you always college-bound? Was that a hopeful time? assumed? Joe: Yes, I remember Kennedy’s time being very hopeful. Joe: I think I would occasionally trifle with ideas of heading CBC: You were in the South, right? What were your views out and trying to get into comics or something before I went on civil rights at the time? to college, but I don’t think it ever was seriously considered. I Joe: I was pro-civil rights and all. That sort of thing. was always headed for college. CBC: Did you belong to a liberal family? CBC: How did you make spending money when you were a Joe: Well, not really liberal but accepting. teenager? CBC: How was the neighborhood? The society you were Joe: Oh! Well… [Hilarie laughs] My uncle Tommy But- in? The culture you were in? ler was manager of a Purina feed store. It was a farming Joe: Pretty conservative. I mean, my school was all-white community. And I worked for him fairly often, help unload and that was before integration. rail cars of chicken chow and corn and stuff like that. The CBC: So your sympathies were with desegregation? high-point of my working for him was when I would assist in Joe: Yes. I was with Kennedy. I was actually very pro on vaccinating chickens. [laughter] This page: Before becoming a Kennedy. CBC: Where’d you have to vaccinate them? In the butt? comic book professional, Joe CBC: So it was Joe: No, in the armpit! Chickens are prone to a form of Staton contributed to science terrible when he was colds and they have to be vaccinated. You do two things fiction fanzines, and even assassinated? to chickens at the same time. You burn off the tips of their scored a number of art assign- Joe: Yes! It was a beaks with a little electric wire and then you stab ’em in the ments from legendary editor Ted shock! armpit. It wasn’t like a regular job, Occasionally, I’d work for White for Amazing and Fantastic CBC: Then times him. I did odds and ends of other things. Stories. Above is Rich Brown’s really started changin’ CBC: The fanzine work, did that become an obsession? 1972 zine, Beardmutterings #2, pretty quick, right? Joe: I’m not sure it was an obsession, but it took a good bit profusely illoed by Joe. Below is Joe: I think, in lots of of my time. I did a lot of that. presumably an unused Fantastic ways, I’m still a child of CBC: Yeah, but at the time you would otherwise be social- cover (courtesy of Heritage) and the early ’60s. I’m still a izing, right? So you’re in the room, you’re working alone, inset are two of Joe’s cover jobs Kennedy guy at heart. yelling at your sister to keep the noise down… Did you get for the SF digest mag in 1973–74. CBC: What were an art table or did you work flat? Joe: I guess I worked flat or on a drawing table for a long time. I actually took the Art Instruction Course through mail when I was in high school. And the table came with the course. I’ve gone through several tables since then. The one I’ve got now I’ve had a long time. For a long time I had a little easel thing that you could use a board on. I have to find one of those somewhere. I really need one of those for shows. But I had a little, angled easel thing you could use on that table. CBC: And this art course that you took? Did they judge your work? Did they grade it? Joe: They corrected it and graded it. CBC: Was it good? Was it useful or were they full of it? Joe: It was limited, but at least they had textbooks that told you what people did, that sort of thing. So, specifically, it was not as useful as it might have been, but exposing you to information was good. CBC: Did you have art classes in high school? Joe: I don’t think we ever had art classes in high school, but there was a college close by, Murray State College, in Kentucky, that had summer workshops for art and I went to those for… what? Two or three… ? Hilarie: Two years, I think. Joe: At least two years. So that was really good. CBC: Were they expensive? Did your mother pay for them? Joe: Gosh, I don’t know. I don’t remember what they would have cost. I probably had a scholarship. CBC: Were you good at saving money? Joe: I’ve always been pretty good at saving money. Artwork © Joe Staton. Fantastic TM & the respective copyright holder. CBC: Did you continue to buy comics into your older ado- lescence, your older teens? Joe: There was a spell when I wasn’t buying comics. Hilarie: He was spending his money on science fiction. Joe: Probably! I remember getting back into comics. In Jackson, Tennessee, there was a second-hand bookstore run by an old railroad man named Bill Frady. The connection here is that Mike Curtis — who today writes Dick Tracy — was a regular at Bill Frady’s and was buying his comics and science fiction at Bill Frady’s. I didn’t run into him! CBC: You never met him! Joe: Basically! Mike’s a little bit younger than I am. A couple years, but not much. He was buying his stuff at Bill Frady’s, I was buying my stuff at Bill Frady’s but we didn’t know each other. We probably would’ve crossed. But I ran into somebody that had dumped a bunch of Marvels. I

42 #9 • Summer 2015 • COMIC BOOK CREATOR pressed by those… I forgot about the Harvey reprints! It was a real shock to me seeing those. Those were great. CBC: Did it have an impact on you as far as your drawing? Joe: Certainly on layouts. I realized that was something cool and different. CBC: What was like? Joe: Very friendly, very accommodating. Sal Gentile was still there when we went in. I guess George was basical- ly running things, but Sal was officially in charge, so we talked to Sal and George. Both were nice guys. George was especially friendly and accommodating. Sent us away with a story and some paper. They had pre-printed pages with the borders and everything to make sure you didn’t get the wrong sizes for the originals. Hilarie: The pay there was pencils, inks, and letters for $24. Joe: Which I thought was fine. [chuckles] CBC: How long would it take you to do a page? Joe: Well, I got to where I could do three pages a day. Obviously it took longer to start out, but I do remember some specific day when I got three pages done and that was my speed from then on. CBC: Did you work every day of the week? Joe: Oh, yes. [laughs] Hilarie: Or nights. CBC: And how did you get it to Derby? Joe: Oh, just shipped it out by mail. Occasionally, we went up to Derby to turn things in and hung out. CBC: Not in a rush to deliver, but just to check in? Joe: It was always good to check in and be a familiar face around the office. And after a while they kept on giving me stories. CBC: Did you socialize with them at all? Did you go out to lunch? Joe: Yeah, when we’d go up. CBC: Look, just to be frank, Charlton wasn’t looking that good at the time. After left and Sal Gentile came in, there was a lot of and Vince Alas- cia, and some work that wasn’t necessarily pretty. But your stuff came in and was fresh! Joe: That was after Nick was there. [laughs] I knew they were obviously bottom of the barrel, but I didn’t approach it as I was the savior or anything. It was just, “This is where I’m working now.” Hilarie: It was a first step. Joe: Yeah, right. Was working there by then? CBC: What was it? Hilarie: Yeah. Joe: I think he was called the Thing. CBC: Not very much. He was mostly at Warren. [laughter] CBC: was the first Top: Joe Staton Joe: Oh, right. strip for the ’75 New CBC: You came in at that transitional time, when Charlton job and then you did the Secret Romance? Con souvenir got a second wind. Nick and George were a part of that. You book. seemed to approach it with enthusiasm and maybe gratitude. Joe: Actually, I think the way it Joe: Well, yeah! I was trying to do the best job I could, you worked out was the first thing I know? did was the Ghost Manor story CBC: Was there any sense that Charlton was on the come- and they gave me Primus right back? They’d gone through the Action Heroes. Were you after that. I think the first issue familiar with that work? of Primus is dated the same as Joe: Oh, yes, certainly all the Ditko stuff, , Blue that ghost story. I did all of them, Beetle… And I came after it. [laughter] I was not at DC when however many there were. Bernie and those guys were making the big breakthroughs, I [Looking at the Primus photo wasn’t there when Dick Giordano was making the big break- covers] Sal liked to do those throughs at Charlton. I’d come along at odd times. collages. He did those personally. CBC: You forged your own path. Look, I did, not one, but CBC: February of ’72. So it was ’71 two issues of Comic Book Artist devoted to Charlton. The that you were actually working on a first one was the Action Heroes with Dick Giordano. The sec- licensing project. A series! Right off ond one was the Charlton of you, Nick, and George. the bat. Joe: Right, with the cover with all the hosts. I loved doing Joe: Yeah! that cover. CBC: You have to explain for our CBC: Yeah, that was great! younger readers who Primus CBC: I had a contest to see who could name them all. was. Who was he? Because there were a couple there that were tough even Joe: [Laughs] Well, back in the for me. days before cable, there was Joe: There was one little blob of a thing behind somebody syndication and local stations had to fill in time slots that didn’t

Strip © Joe Staton. E-Man, Nova TM & © Joe T. Staton. All others TM & © their respective copyright holders. Strip © Joe Staton. E-Man, Nova TM & T. that nobody identified.

Comic Book Creator • Summer 2015 • #9 49 movie was out, Papillon. And there were all these pictures of Dustin Hoffman in these really thick little glasses in Papillon, so I just thought, “Well, he’s not Arnold Stang, but he’s close enough. So that was the original visual. Dustin Hoffman looked very mousy and very rat-like, and I think I have some memories of an E.C. character who looked… CBC: Yeah, right. “Outer Sanctum.” Joe: Right. And that was a reprint in one of the black-&- white paperbacks and that was the original Mauser. So it kind of all came togeth- er. He’s Mauser, he looks mousy, he carries a Mauser. It’s just one of those things. You can’t get that mix of names and visuals again that just comes together. CBC: And his demeanor? Was it cynical, hard-bitten? Joe: Yeah. Although Nova’s tough, she’s not bitter and she’s trying to keep E-Man’s idealism, his niceness, intact around Mauser, and Mauser is presented as a kind of cyn- ical, embittered character, vated to write my own stuff. I submitted some script so the dynamic is really between Nova and Mauser fighting ideas for Primus when I was doing that and they for the soul of E-Man! That’s the basic dynamic there. told me, “That’s ’s job.” So I didn’t follow CBC: And ultimately what would Mauser use E-Man for? up on it. Joe: Violence? When we were doing E-Man later, Mauser Hilarie: He likes drawing too well! employs E-Man as an agent in the detective agency, but Joe: I think writing comics properly is a whole that’s just a technicality. other thing, [chuckles] a little too complex to Hilarie: But I think the goal for Mauser isn’t violence. The work out the structures. goal is to solve whatever it is and, very often, whether he’ll CBC: E-Man lasted 10 issues and, in 1974, you admit it or not, it’s something fairly humane and so even got into Marvel, inking The . though they may be going after the soul of E-Man, where Hilarie: Oh, right. That’s the phone call. they end up is a fairly humane place, whether he does it for Joe: Oh, that’s right. Roy Thomas called up out of the Mauser or for Nova. blue. He was editor at Marvel at that time and Roy called Joe: Yeah, I think part of it is both Nova and Mauser are up, told me his whole life story for about an hour, and then trying to be tough or they’re tough enough but they basically says, “Would you like to ink The Avengers?” I said, “Well, This page: Two lasting friend- have hearts of gold. yeah!” And he says, “Okay. It’s on the way.” He sent the Sal ships made during Joe Staton’s Hilarie: They’re tough in protecting E-Man, too, because Buscema pages. [laughter] freelance career at DC Comics he’s not tough and that’s something they don’t wanna see CBC: Was it just as easy as that? [laughter] Was it like, include Paul Levitz (above) him lose! [laughs] “Hey, honey, I’m at the House of Ideas.” and Brit artist sensation Brian Joe: Yeah, I don’t think we ever got into this as a story, but Hilarie: It was like that! Bolland (below). Levitz & Staton if E-Man had fallen into the wrong hands when he first came Joe: It’s like called up one day and says, “My boy, co-created The Huntress togeth- to Earth, he could’ve taken over the Earth or he could’ve would you like to do layouts for me?” and I said, “Sure.” er. Bolland drew the cover for launched an intergalactic war. I mean, even turning to the And then Roy calls up and says, “Hey, you wanna ink for the collection seen top right. dark side is certainly not a pleasant proposition. His powers Marvel?” “Okay.” have to be channeled and maybe he doesn’t understand that CBC: You were a fan of Gil’s work, right? So, in the Mauser’s cynicism is only a front. I mean, actually, once you chronology here, where did Gil fit in? start talking about it E-Man is a more complex character Joe: I was working for Gil while I was still doing than he might seem to be. E-Man. I worked for Gil, I guess, for about a year. CBC: Does he have potentially infinite power? Could he be CBC: Did you get paid? god-like? Joe: Very little and not often. Gil died owing me Joe: I always figured him as a minor deity. He has the money. power of a supernova. Hilarie: But it was well worth it. CBC: Which means he could obliterate the solar system. Joe: Yes. Well, I told Gil one time that, “Well, Joe: He could! Yeah. Well, he’s part of a supernova. He you’re not gonna pay me, so I’ll chalk this up to could probably take out the other planets, that’s for sure. education.” Actually, he started laughing and said, CBC: Never knew it had such depth. Did you have interest “Oh, that’s great!” [Hilarie laughs] I would like to get to write at all? You’ve written some things, right? some of those layouts back. Joe: There are things that have been written with my name CBC: So, what was the commitment? Did you go in to

TM & © DC Comics. Levitz portrait the estate of Seth Kushner. The Huntress, DC Super-Stars on them. [Joe and Hilarie laugh] Never been seriously moti- his… Where was his place?

Comic Book Creator • Summer 2015 • #9 55 Joe: Wilton, Connecticut. CBC: Obi Wan Kenobi! “These are the reservations you’re Hilarie: It wasn’t too far from Charlton, but I don’t know looking for.” that it was in the same exact direction. But we drove over Joe: We are the droids who have reservations! [laughter] there and hung out for a day at his house. Yeah, that was quite an evening! CBC: What’d you think of him? CBC: Now, he was quite a raconteur. Did he impart his Hilarie: Oh, I was really impressed! [laughs] He intimidated wisdom on you? Was it a dialogue? me! Joe: It was a… CBC: Did he call you, “My boy”? Hilarie: A monologue? Joe: He always called me, “M’boy!” Joe: It was a monologue. He did pause occasionally to let Hilarie: And his wife was really sweet. me agree with him. [laughter] Joe: And his mother was there. A sweet little lady. Very Hilarie: But his stories were great! much a little old country lady. Our favorite Gil Kane story is a Joe: Oh, yeah. He had stories about everything! And he show in Boston, Newcon, and we were there and going out had theories about everything and how to draw stuff. I was to dinner with Gil and and our friend Col- very impressed with Gil. But he understood that he was not leen. We wanted to go to Trader Vic’s. We had no reservation transformational. But he was very dynamic. and it was very crowded. CBC: Did you channel him at all in your Green Lantern Gil just took over and work? he was looming all Joe: Oh, yeah! over everything. CBC: Actually, a lot of your work you could argue is The maître de was Kane-influenced. trying to see if we Joe: Well, it’s that whole composition in depth thing, really. had reserva- My super-hero stuff shows a lot of Gil’s composition and tions and Gil storytelling. Because, you know, when I was working for him, was doing this I was totally trying to understand how he told a story. That thing was what I was doing and it stayed with me. with his CBC: Do you think he’s under-appreciated? hands. Joe: Yeah, I think so. I did talk to him on the phone very He kept often. I’d ask him questions and he would explain things. his CBC: You not coming the fan route, but you were a profes- hands sional right off. You were a neophyte in the beginning, but moving you were a peer! You looked at it as a job. Was the end goal so that the ever to work on Superboy or or… ? maître de Joe: [Laughs] My goal was to do comics! couldn’t see Hilarie: Joe introduced me to comics. I never got the his book and Gil feeling he was a “fan,” except for specific comics, specific would say, “I know issues at certain times. It was always, “This is what I’m we’re late, my boy. We gonna do. This is what I was meant to do!” missed our time, but Joe: Right. maybe you could fit us CBC: And you were a professional. Were you always on in, my boy.” time? Hilarie: Over and over Joe: I was always on time. I was compulsive about being again! on time. But I do remember I was inking one issue of The Above: Thanks to recruiting Joe: “My boy!” he was Incredible when the previous issue was on the stands. by Paul Levitz, Joe Staton re- calling him and the maître That was close. ceived a ton of DC assignments de had no idea what to do so Hilarie: And then there was the time that we couldn’t leave in the ’70s, including a stint on Plastic Man and illustrating he gave us places! [laughter] It for vacation because we were waiting in the mail for pages the two-part run of Power was amazing! I never figured out to come for him to ink and they would arrive one or two at a Girl in [1978]. what he was doing. I think it was like time. Even though he was intending to take the assignment Cover detail of Showcase Mandrake the Magician. He gestured with him, he couldn’t leave because not all the pages were #97 and panels from same. hypnotically… there! CBC: You’re in Marvel and simultaneously you did a “Mike Mauser” back-up in Vengeance Squad. Joe: Yeah, we did sev- eral Mauser stories in Vengeance Squad. I think Mauser is one of the all-time great characters. CBC: ! I was al- ways curious. There seemed to be some books coming out of Charlton that seemed linked to certain creators — for instance, Monster Hunters and Library with Don Newton and

Midnight Tales with Wayne All TM & © DC Comics. Howard… Scary Tales came across as your book. Did you design the host? She had orange hair. Joe: The Countess Von

56 #9 • Summer 2015 • COMIC BOOK CREATOR the years. Marty Pasko wrote it for a little while, but you’re always associated with the character. It’s a threesome… or foursome. I don’t know. Joe: Well, it’s a three and a half-some if you count Teddy. [laughter] The core crew of E-Man is E-Man, Nova, Mauser, and Teddy. CBC: I’m sorry I jumped over Teddy. [Hilarie laughs] I’m always forgetting he was a part of the original run, wasn’t he? I’m always thinking he was part of the ’ run. Joe: He was. He got stranger later. CBC: What was he? Hilarie: A koala bear! Joe: He’s a koala bear. Samuel Boar, the evil energy czar, had found that there’s a small ball of sun-like energy inside the earth and he was going to capture it and steal it and sell it as a power source. He had a henchman who was an Australian who had a koala bear and… [laughs] And during the course of that adventure, which is where Nova became a super-hero or super-heroine or whatever she is, Teddy was acquired by E-Man and Nova. The henchman I guess was sent off to prison, but they took custody of the koala. He’s been with Nova ever since. [Jon and Hilarie laugh] You two the main artist on Showcase or something like that. Some- Above: Teamed with writer don’t seem to be taking this totally seriously. thing kept on coming up that sounded like… “Oh! We’re , Joe Staton CBC: I’m so sorry. He certainly was a cute little fella. going to do Showcase #100 with everybody who’s ever been made a considerable contri- [laughs] You know Mike Mauser was enough, but then she’s in Showcase.” “Oh! I’d like to do that!” bution to the Green Lantern a super-hero, and why don’t you throw in a koala bear? It just CBC: Did you sometimes get overwhelmed? Were you mythos, as they developed added that Jack Cole kind of wackiness. It may not be Woozy good at saying no at the right times? and created such Winks but… along the same path. Were you gonna keep Joe: Not so good at saying no at the right times. [laughs] characters as Ch’p and him? Was there any reaction to that story? We’re gonna Mostly I would say yes too much and then wind up sleeping during their ’80s tenure. keep him around? Did you like drawing him? too little. It kind of wore you down over time, I guess. Joe: Yeah. CBC: [To Hilarie] Did you see much of him? CBC: [To Hilarie] Did you like him? Hilarie: No, not at all. We did very little traveling at that Hilarie: Yes, I did. In the whole first E-Man run, Joe was point. I was teaching, so I was in the schools all day. No, we known for what he put in the backgrounds so, if they didn’t didn’t see a whole lot of each other. plan to keep him, he ended up in the backgrounds anyway, Joe: We just kind of waved at each other. [laughs] so he got kept. CBC: Did you tell him, “You’re working too hard”? Joe: That’s right. I forget which one it was. There was one Hilarie: Oh, everybody told him that. issue of E-Man where we totally forgot Teddy. Teddy was He was a workaholic, always has not in the story at all and I went back and had him sitting in a been. That was not anything new. He chair in Mauser’s office without explanation. He was sitting was working on things he liked. listening or something! [laughs] Teddy’s part of the crew. Joe: That was the trouble. I did like it. CBC: You said he got stranger in the First years. What made I really enjoyed doing it. him strange? Hilarie: And he was perfectly happy. Joe: I think Teddy is totally blissed-out forever. He’s at one There wasn’t any major changes that with the Universe. Very happy. He’s prone to break into danc- were in the offing. ing without explanation. He doesn’t sing, but he dances. CBC: [Laughs] You and he both always working CBC: You were stalwart with DC there for a while. all the time… to this day! Joe: I was. I was kind of drawing everything there for a Joe: I work less now than I used to. I very seldom while. I did some Superboy. work ’til way in the morning these days. Hilarie: When he did Superboy… talk about going back to Hilarie: That’s true. his roots. We went back to visit his mother and we got his old CBC: You had a reputation for pulling through, getting high school yearbooks! So he could have reference on what the job done. Was that a source of pride for you? people in a small town of that time period looked like. Joe: I think it was. Sometimes it worked against me, Joe: My version of Superboy was kind of retro. It had a but I think I was pleased that people know that I ’50s look. It was when the Kents had their store in town. In would get things done. the Kents’ store they had a rack of comic books, that sort of CBC: The database says you did a job for thing. 2000AD? CBC: Who was writing it? Joe: Oh, yes, right. I did one story in 1979 for Joe: Tom DeFalco wrote several of them. I think he was… 2000AD. It was called “Black Hawk.” It was CBC: Is that where he started off his professional career? about a black slave taken into space to fight At DC the late ’70s? I don’t remember his name before that. a gladiator. We were visiting Brian Bol- Joe: I don’t know. land. I’d met all the guys up at 2000AD Hilarie: You said he wrote Wheelie. and because I was there, they gave Joe: Oh, yeah. He was writing the Wheelies at Charlton, so me an assignment. So I did that one. he was around before then. We did one really cool Superboy I was thrilled to do it. It seemed very story that brought back a teenage wizard from an old story, cool. They paid me well. That was fun. CBC: What’s your relationship with CBC: Did you collaborate with Paul or did you just get a full ? script? Did you just say, “Hey. I’d like to do this?” Joe: Brian is a real good pal, for a Joe: It was more a question of “Hey, I’d like to do this.” I long, long time. We hit it off with was around the DC offices a lot in those days. Paul Kupper- Brian and Rachel immediately. berg, Marty Pasko, would have something up and I’d say, Hilarie: Immediately! We had

All characters TM & © DC Comics. “Oh! I’d like to do that!” You know. That’s why I seemed to be

Comic Book Creator • Summer 2015 • #9 61 who’d like to do some Green Lantern covers.” And Jack knew Brian’s work very well from 2000AD and he says, ‘Okay! Great! Here’s what we need.” CBC: That was Brian’s first American work? Hilarie: Yes. CBC: Who do you think is your best inker? Joe: My best inker is Horacio Ottolini, who inked a Femme Noir story and also the Elseworlds story, Citizen Wayne. Archie Goodwin put us together. Archie had samples from Horacio and saw that we would go very well together, so I did my Batman Elseworlds story, which I really liked and thought I did a good job on, and then Horacio just found things in there that I would never have thought to finish off or add mood or lighting, or… CBC: A true embellisher! Hilarie: Yes! Joe: A real collaborator! And then strangely enough, when I was on Scooby, Horacio was working in the studio that was doing Scooby in Argentina, so he wound up inking a lot of my Scooby-Doo stories and he did wonderful, wonderful Scooby-Doo inks. CBC: You had to send ’em all the way down to Argentina? Joe: Well, DC did. CBC: Did you ever meet him? Joe: I have never met him. CBC: Do you communicate with him? Joe: Yes, we’ve had conversations. His daughter speaks English, translates for him, and now there are functions online we can more or less translate. CBC: Other favorites? Joe: Always liked Bruce Patterson’s stuff on Green Lantern. Andrew Pepoy inked a lot of my Scoobys. I liked those. CBC: How do you like your own inks? The best? Joe: No, I like Horacio’s best. CBC: Better than you? Joe: Yes, much better than me. There were a few jobs that Dick Giordano did that really stand out. One job that really stands out — just the one time — was a Brave and the Bold issue called “The Autobiography of Bruce Wayne,” which was the story of how Bruce and fell in love. They were married in that story. That was inked by George Freeman. CBC: And it’s beautiful work. You did the old-time Batmobile in that, too. Did not Alan Brennert write that story? gone to England during the summer. We wanted to go to Hilarie: Yes. science fiction [fandom]’s Worldcon in Brighton and that was CBC: Let’s talk about Alan a little bit. What do you think of at Labor Day. We wanted to go early, so Joe found a comics’ him as a writer? convention in London and it was six weeks earlier. So we Joe: They don’t come any better! went early and Joe needed someplace to draw. CBC: Did you ever meet him? Joe: Paul Levitz knew Richard Burton, the writer, who Joe: Oh. Yeah. We’ve met several times. was working at Marvel UK when we were talking about the Hilarie: He’s a very nice guy. fact I needed somewhere to work. So Paul checked in with CBC: I have exchanged emails with him. He seems quite Richard and Richard said there was a spot I could sit and grateful for your work. draw at Marvel UK while I was there. But I think Richard left Joe: Oh! I did two stories that Alan wrote. A lot of people Marvel UK before we got there. So I had nowhere to work, know that one, “The Autobiography of Bruce Wayne.” but Richard knew that Brian’s wife Rachel was going to be George Freeman inked it and I think it’s great. It gets re- working on a project outside the apartment for a whole so printed a lot. I also did a Secret Origin of The Black Canary her table was empty. So he set it up for me to go over to that Dick Giordano inked and nobody knows that one. It’s Brian’s flat during the day and draw and Hilarie was going in the last issue of Secret Origins and never gets reprinted off finding tours and seeing the country. So I would sit back because it’s not in continuity anymore. But it’s just such a to back with Brian and he would draw and I would draw and beautiful human story. we would talk back and forth. CBC: Alan wrote it? CBC: Who’s Rachel? Joe: Yeah. Alan did a really nice Batman story Dave Joe: Rachel is Brian Bolland’s wife and she was a fabric Gibbons did. I didn’t do it but did. So that was designer. really nice. Whatever Alan does, it’s always the best of CBC: And she had an art table? whatever it is. Joe: Yeah, she had an art table and Richard found out that I CBC: Didn’t you also do another Brave and the Bold story?

could use her table while we were in England. So that’s how Joe: I did a Brave and the Bold story that was Batman and All TM & © DC Comics. we met Brian and Rachel. Plastic Man that finished. Hilarie: When we went, Joe had a job to do. CBC: Now there’s a mix! Joe: I was probably still on Green Lantern. I think that’s Joe: Which worked very well. It’s more Jim Aparo than it is when I called back to the states and Jack Harris was the me, but it looks really nice. editor. I told Jack, “I’m sitting her with this guy in England CBC: That’s very interesting. What’s the biggest surprise

62 #9 • Summer 2015 • COMIC BOOK CREATOR I do believe Big Al is part of control of this? Is he your baby and you don’t really want to canon. [laughter] Teddy was see him in the hands of other people? Or are you pragmatic in the original run, so he’s still about it? there. And Marty had a great Joe: It’s not like I’m specifically trying to control things. It’s character called Mad Wax! just how things are. We wanted to mention that if anybody’s He could change shapes. It’s reading this that E-Man would be a really great property to just a great name. I love it! film! At one point, before the super-hero boom, Roger Cor- [laughs] man was interested in picking up E-Man. It would have been CBC: Has DC or Marvel a lower budget operation and he had some changes in mind. ever approached you guys He was going to move Nova to Las Vegas and she would be about E-Man? part of the chorus line at a club. That would have worked! I Joe: At one point, there don’t see any reason it wouldn’t. But before he actually got were kind of second-hand to the point of making the deal, he went to a film festival in feelers that DC might want to Germany and he talked to people at the festival and they pick up E-Man to be part of said, “There’s no future in doing these super-hero movies, so the Charlton purchase, but forget it!” [Jon laughs] So he backed out of it and that never nothing ever came of it. happened. I guess that’s as close as E-Man’s ever come to CBC: Dick Giordano was being a proper movie. a friend of yours, right? Did CBC: So far! Since we’re plugging, you have this set of you ever say, “Hey! Check characters: you have the innocent super-hero, the stripper this out!” Or did you want with a brain and a heart of gold, the tough, rat-like detective, to maintain control of your a dancing koala bear, and a whole set of villains! character? Hilarie: Many topical! Joe: It just never happened. Joe: Certainly Samuel Boar is still a topical character. We I know when Nick was have the Entropy Twins, Mad Wax, and so on. A whole bunch still on staff at DC, he had of villains. One thing we worked on at First with E-Man was approached them. I guess to see E-Man as the only super-hero who was the sidekick in he talked to them about his own book. The Adventures of Michael Mauser, starring picking up E-Man from E-Man! It could actually make a very goof lighthearted police First. Nick had an idea for procedural week-to-week with a super-hero sidekick! Lots the Rubber Band: E-Man, of good visuals. E-Man really should be filmed or on TV! Plastic Man, the Elongated CBC: Did we talk in depth about Nova? About her person- Man, and Metamorpho! All ality? How strong she is? I would think she would be a great This spread: Joe Staton is now the shape-shifters an they would be the Rubber Band. That role for an actress to express individuality, control of the living the dream, drawing his woulda been cool! situation, and still be provocative. beloved Dick Tracy daily news- CBC: Except who’s the comic foil? Joe: Actually you do wind up with a tough detective and a paper strip, teamed with Mike Joe: Hey, they’re all comic foils! [Hilarie laughs] That’s super-hero, and the one in charge is the stripper. Curtis! One of the detective’s when they team-up with the Inferior Five, right? Just so the CBC: She’s not just a stripper! She’s got multiple majors. recent adventures had him solv- could have comic foils. But DC didn’t go for it. It just never Archaeology, geology! ing the mysterious disappear- happened. Joe: She’s at least a grad student by now! So she’s ance of Little Orphan ! CBC: Do you want to, in our heart of hearts, maintain educated. Hilarie: She’s smart! Not just educated. CBC: She’s smart, she’s self-reliant. She’s living on her own in the very begin- ning. Joe: I’d love to be acquaint- ed with Nova. CBC: Heck, yeah! When you get these guys, “Hey, I love that Nova!” It’s not just a lusty thing, but it’s like, “Yeah. This is a really dyna- mite personality.” As much as I want Wonder Woman to be like that, she’s not always. They try to do it and then they slip off into different personifications. But Nova’s always been tough and she’s soft, all at the same time! Just remarkable… Is it a Dick Tracy TM & © LLC. testament to Nick? Nick’s comfortable with women, is he? Joe: Yeah. Hilarie: Yes. Very! CBC: I mean, that’s not always true of a lot of comic book greats. [Joe laughs] He knows how to depict females in comics, right? Not

66 #9 • Summer 2015 • COMIC BOOK CREATOR This page: Hey, it was a ’70s hat because once Tracy’s hat’s been shot off, he retires, Joe: Well, he’s a grandpa. He’s got family and kids and thing, okay? Rutland hosted a and he puts it on his Wall of Hats! This is something Chester grandkids and so on. Halloween parade every year, Gould introduced. He has hats that have been blown off CBC: In real life, if he was first came in 1931, what’s the and comics folk were only happy with handguns, with shotguns, that have been knocked off math there? to oblige. Here’s some float par- with machetes. Dick Tracy has all these hats! So Black Jack Joe: [Laughs] The thing is you can’t think like that! ticipants dressed up as Charlton wants to contribute to Dick Tracy’s Wall of Hats. Sometimes CBC: I was just curious! Is it going to be collected? characters in the mid-’70s, Note he shoots Dick Tracy’s hat off and he gets arrested and he’s Joe: That unfortunately doesn’t seem to be in the works. E-Man’s skivvies! At bottom is sent away. He’s happy! He’s a good character. Double-Up is CBC: And you won two Harveys. Was that as a team? Joe Staton and Nick Cuti check- just a big guy with a bull-whip. He’s a threat but he’s not one Joe: Yeah, our whole little team. ing out the float. Next page: Joe of the more exotic characters. We have a brother and sister CBC: And who else is on the team? and Hilarie during Ye Ed’s March team called Silver Nitrate and his sister, Sprocket. All their Joe: Well, there’s me. I do the pencils. Mike Curtis writes visit to their Kingston, NY, abode. crimes have to do with old movies. Oh, and we have a horror it. His wife, Carole, is his first, in-house editor. Our inker and show host gone bad named Abner Kadaver, letterer is Shelley Pleger and our colorist is Shane Fisher. with his sidekick, Rikki Mortis, who’s in And our police consultant has been Sgt. Jim Doherty. And punk regalia. She’s really cute. And we our editor in Chicago now is Tracy Clark. Our editor used to bring back the old characters. be Leigh Hanlon. And the funny thing is, Shelley and Shane Hilarie: And the crossovers! came to our team because they had worked with Mike on Joe: When ’s strip was Shanda the Panda! So Mike kind of showed up with the canceled, she was left on a cliffhanger,IF soYOU ENJOYEDwhole team THIS lined PREVIEW,up! [laughs] And, of course, Hilarie is my people wondered for years did AnnieCLICK make THEown LINK traffic TO manager! ORDER THIS it back after she was kidnapped byISSUE the IN PRINTCBC: OR You DIGITAL guys had FORMAT!the audacity to use their copyrighted Butcher of the Balkans. So we finished up characters and then end up with the strip. That’s pretty cool! that story! Punjab, the big Asian bodyguard, Joe: It is, like, entirely unreasonable! [laughter] sent him to “fly with the Magi.” Which is, Hilarie: Had a lot of luck that they didn’t get sued. you know, something magical. It has to Joe: Yeah! Right! [laughs] do with Annie characters and had to do CBC: Well, yeah! It was like, “Do we sue these guys or do with plots from the 1940s and we actually we save on the lawyers’ fees and hire ‘em?” I like that prag- brought in some characters from Terry and matic thinking! They’re not angry. ‘No! Let’s just hire ’em!” the Pirates. Pretty good job! “This Staton brings the work in on time. We The best place to see Tracy is GoCom- don’t have to worry about deadlines!” ics. And occasionally we’ll just do one or Joe: With Tracy, we do have to worry about deadlines. It’s two pages with other comic strips where amazing! I’ve talked to Ramona Fradon and June Brigman we know the people involved. Dick Tracy about this — that you can be doing a daily strip and be had to go out to Hootin’ Holler to see if perfectly on time and the next day they’ll call you and tell you there’s anything going on with Snuffy Smith. you’re six weeks behind. I don’t know how the math works We had like a couple days’ crossover COMICout BOOK or where CREATOR the days #9 go but somehow there’s a whole with . We did a cross-JOE STATON on hisdifferent comics career frame (from E-MAN,of time to passingco-creating on daily strips. over where Walt Wallet from GasolineThe Huntress, and his currentWe hadstint on a thecall Dick one Tracy day. comic We strip), had like half an hour to get the plus we showcase the lost treasure GODS OF MOUNT OLYM- Alley came to town for about a week.PUS drawnWe by Joe!Sunday Plus, Part Onestrip of ourin andinterview Shane with the Fisher, late he’s normally a designer consider it very “meta.” You know STANwhat GOLDBERG the for, JOHN a huge WORKMAN print, plus shop HEMBECK! out in Detroit. He left work, went home, kids say? [laughs] When fiction comments(84-page colored FULL-COLOR the Sundaymagazine) $8.95strip — fortunately he lived close. He on itself. Everybody in a strip kind of knows colored(Digital Edition)the strip $3.95 in less than half an hour and uploaded it or http://twomorrows.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=98_132&products_id=1205 they’re in a strip. otherwise we would have missed being printed that week! CBC: By your calculation, how old is Dick [chuckles] Tracy if he was a human being? CBC: Do you have a fitness regimen? You are quite trim. Do Joe: As I draw Dick Tracy, I think he’s 52 you exercise at all? Do you walk? years old and I think Tess is about 48. Joe: Actually, this is a three-story house, so I walk a lot just CBC: Fifty-two? That’s mature. in the house. But I have a friend, Paul Abrams, another artist, who lives just a couple of blocks away and we will routinely go for long walks. We have a real nice Victorian cemetery right up the street and we’ll go for long walks in Montrepose Cemetery which was designed by Calvert Vaux. I do a lot of walking. CBC: And you two said you did 20 shows last year? Hilarie: Maybe not last year. Maybe the year before it was 20 and last year was a little less. CBC: But still! That’s more than a third of the year! Joe: Yeah, I think this year is just like six or seven, which is Photos courtesy of Joe and Hilarie Staton. E-Man TM & © T. Staton. more reasonable. CBC: What’s your favorite show? Joe: Heroes Con, in Charlotte. CBC: Without hesitation. Joe: Yeah. It’s all comics. Very friendly people. Shelton, who runs it, really cares about comics. It’s a very family-oriented show You can bring little kids to it and they’re just fine. It’s a real good show. CBC: What are your plans coming up? Do you have any comics in mind that you’d like to do? Joe: Actually, I have several things I have to get done. I mentioned I’m doing an old script that Nick wrote for Don Newton for Michael Ambrose’s Charlton Spotlight. CBC: “Mastermind”! He kind of looked like Sinestro. Joe: Yeah, right. Don did those designs so I’m working off

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