In the Circuit Court of Taney County, Missouri

Cheryl Barnes PO Box 6521 Branson, MO 65615 (417) 334-2405 • [email protected]

IN THE CIRCUIT COURT OF TANEY COUNTY, MISSOURI JUVENILE DIVISION

In the Interests of :

Deciman Maximos “Max” Barnes, Male, age 4. Case No. 06AF-JU00096

Related Consolidated Cases: Clinton Steele Barnes Male, age 14. Case No. 06AF-JU00094 Sterling Preston “Preston” Barnes Male, age 13. Case No. 06AF-JU00089 Tritton Cassidy “TC” Barnes Male, age 11. Case No. 06AF-JU00087 Peter Sextus Barnes Male, age 11. Case No. 06AF-JU00091 Taler Corbin Barnes Male, age 9. Case No. 06AF-JU00093 Benjamen Octavier Barnes Male, age 8. Case No. 06AF-JU00095 Cebaschin Tomas Barnes Male, age 6. Case No. 06AF-JU00088 Joseph Undemus Barnes Male, age 2. Case No. 06AF-JU00090 Dozen Duodemus Barnes Male, age 10 months. Case No. 06AF-JU00092

TRANSCRIPTS OF FORENSIC CHILD INTERVIEWS

Index of Transcripts

Interview of Deciman Maximos “Max” Barnes, Age 4, DOB: 6/19/2002, at the Children’s Advocacy Center on June 29, 2006...... Page 1

Interview of Peter Sextus Barnes, Age 10, DOB: 8/19/1995, at the Children’s Advocacy Center on July 5, 2006...... Page 9

Interview of Tritton Cassidy “TC” Barnes, Age 11, DOB: 10/07/1994, at the Children’s Advocacy Center on July 5, 2006...... Page 18

Interview of Sterling “Preston” Barnes, Age 12, DOB: 8/04/1993, at the Children’s Advocacy Center on July 5, 2006...... Page 25

Interview of Benjamen Octavier Barnes, Age 8, DOB: 2/14/1998, at the Children’s Advocacy Center on July 2, 2006...... Page 34

Interview of Cebaschin Tomas Barnes, Age 6, DOB: 10/08/1999, at the Children’s Advocacy Center on July 2, 2006...... Page 43

Interview of Taler Corbin Barnes, Age 9, DOB: 3/13/1997, at the Children’s Advocacy Center on July 2, 2006...... Page 54 Deciman Maximos “Max” Barnes, Age 4, DOB: 6/19/2002 Interview with Ginnifer Jobgen at the Children’s Advocacy Center

Interviewed on June 29, 2006

JOBGEN: Look. Look at that one, that’s big. What colors are on there?

MAX: Yellow and blue.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Hey tell me what your name is.

MAX: My name is Max.

JOBGEN: Your name is Max. My name is Ginnifer Max. How old are you?

MAX: Uh, Four.

JOBGEN: You’re four, okay. Hey Max, I want to draw a picture of your face, can we do that?

MAX: Yes.

JOBGEN: What goes on here? Specific problems with Interviews:

MAX: My face. None of the kids recall seeing a mark JOBGEN: Your face, what are these? on Max’s face. Interviewer pointed this out to Max and Benjamen. MAX: Eyes. Preston, TC and Peter say they heard JOBGEN: Eyes. How many eyes do you have Max? about the spanking from Taler, but

MAX: Two. Taler said he doesn’t know if Max got a spanking. JOBGEN: You have two eyes, okay. What goes right here?

MAX: Uh, my mouth.

JOBGEN: Your mouth, okay. Do you need one of these?

JOBGEN: Yeah, what’s that called?

MAX: Nose.

JOBGEN: Nose, okay. How bout here, what’s this, what goes there?

MAX: A nose, uh, a head.

JOBGEN: What’s this stuff?

MAX: Hair.

JOBGEN: What’s that stuff called?

MAX: Hair!

JOBGEN: Hair?

of 65 MAX: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Hey Max, is your hair long or short?

MAX: Uh, short.

JOBGEN: Short, okay.

MAX: Hey look.

JOBGEN: Yeah? I’m going to put your name on here. Max and you’re four. And I’m going to put my name on here. Ginnifer.

MAX: You got these?

JOBGEN: Yeah. Hey Max, I’m going to find out where you live.

MAX: Uh, in my house.

JOBGEN: In your house, well let’s put your house on here. And let’s put Max in there. There’s Max and your four. Who else live with you Max?

MAX: The boys.

JOBGEN: The boys?

MAX: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah, who are they?

MAX: Uh, uh, Peter and Taler and Clinton and Mother and Andrew and Dad.

JOBGEN: Yeah, and who are they? Are those your…?

MAX: Boys!

JOBGEN: Are those your brothers? Or something else?

MAX: Boys!

JOBGEN: Boys? Okay, I’m gonna put, I’m gonna put that down, I’m gonna put boys. Who else lives here?

MAX: All the boys.

JOBGEN: All the boys. Do you have a mom or a dad that lives here?

MAX: Mom and Andrew lives here.

JOBGEN: Mom. What’s Mom’s name?

MAX: Uh, um, uh, Mother’s three. Look, you can do this.

JOBGEN: Who else lives here except for you and the boys and mom? Is there anyone else?

MAX: And Andrew.

JOBGEN: Who’s that?

MAX: That’s Andrew.

of 65 JOBGEN: And do you live here right now? At this house.

MAX: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah?

MAX: I live all day in that house.

JOBGEN: You live all day in that house?

MAX: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah? Okay. Hey Max, I want to find out what you call all of your body parts and I have a drawing of a boy. See my drawing? It has a front side and a back side. Let’s name the parts on this drawing, okay? What do you call these right here?

MAX: Eyes.

JOBGEN: Eyes. And what’s this?

MAX: Mouth.

JOBGEN: Mouth. And what are these?

MAX: Uh, um, with my shirt up, lift my shirt up and then those are moles.

JOBGEN: What are those called?

MAX: Moles!

JOBGEN: Marks?

MAX: No, moles.

JOBGEN: Okay, what do you call this right here?

MAX: Hmm, tummy.

JOBGEN: Tummy?

MAX: And that’s a penis.

JOBGEN: This is a penis. Okay. Penis.

MAX: And the butt is to the back.

JOBGEN: Where’s the butt?

MAX: The butt is back.

JOBGEN: Is on the back?

MAX: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Show me where the butt is.

MAX: Right there.

JOBGEN: Okay, that’s the butt. Do you know what this is called?

of 65 MAX: Yeah, a back.

JOBGEN: Back. And what are these here Max?

MAX: I don’t know.

JOBGEN: What are these called?

MAX: I don’t know.

JOBGEN: Like right here on you , what are those?

MAX: Legs.

JOBGEN: Legs. Okay.

MAX: We have legs to walk.

JOBGEN: You have legs to walk. That’s right.

MAX: And foots to walk.

JOBGEN: And foots to walk. Hey Max, do you get hugs and kisses?

JOBGEN: Yeah, who gives you hugs and kisses?

MAX: Uh, hmm, Mother do.

JOBGEN: Who?

MAX: Mother do.

JOBGEN: Where do you get hugs and kisses at on your body?

MAX: I get kiss on the mouth.

JOBGEN: You get kissed on the mouth.

MAX: And I get a hug.

JOBGEN: Where do you get hugged at?

MAX: I get hugged on the body.

JOBGEN: On the body. Okay. Hey Max, do you ever get any touches you don’t like to get?

MAX: No.

JOBGEN: No? Tell me, um, what happens when you get in trouble.

MAX: Um, I get spanking and sit down til Mother gets back.

JOBGEN: You get spanking and you had to sit down until Mom gets back?

MAX: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Who gives you a spanking?

of 65 MAX: Um, Mother do.

JOBGEN: Who? Your Mother?

MAX: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Your Mother. And where does your mother give you a spanking at?

MAX: On my butt.

JOBGEN: On your butt. What do you get spanked with?

MAX: With a belt.

JOBGEN: With a belt? Yeah, and what’s that belt look like Max?

MAX: It’s black and it hurts me and I cry.

JOBGEN: It’s black and it hurts you and then you cry?

MAX: Yeah. When Mother spanks me.

JOBGEN: Hey Max, can you draw me a picture of that belt? And show me what that belt looks like. Look I have some markers and crayons here. Can you draw me a picture of that? So, let’s see you said you get spanking on your butt with a belt?

MAX: Yeah. I can’t open this.

JOBGEN: What do you get a spanking for?

MAX: It’s a belt.

JOBGEN: You said that you have to sit down and wait for mom to come back?

MAX: Yes.

JOBGEN: Yeah, tell me about that.

MAX: See, a belt.

JOBGEN: Where did mom go?

MAX: She go to the store and then she gets back.

JOBGEN: She went to the store?

MAX: Yeah til he gets back.

JOBGEN: Til she gets back?

MAX: Yeah last night.

JOBGEN: What do you have to do til she gets back?

MAX: a spanking

JOBGEN: When you get a spanking?

MAX: Yes.

of 65 JOBGEN: Yeah? Tell me about that.

MAX: Look, a belt.

JOBGEN: Who told you you had to sit down until mom gets back?

MAX: See, a belt.

JOBGEN: It’s a belt?

MAX: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Okay. Hey Max, who told you you had to sit down until mom gets back?

MAX: When he gets back he go to the store and when he gets back he goes to the store and then he gets back.

JOBGEN: Hmm.

MAX: And this is a belt, this is a belt too.

JOBGEN: What happens if you get up before mom gets back?

MAX: When I got up and then Mother got back.

JOBGEN: You got up and then mom got back and then what happened?

MAX: Then I got in trouble again.

JOBGEN: Then you got what?

MAX: In trouble again.

JOBGEN: You got in trouble again?

MAX: Yeah.

JOBGEN: What happened? Tell me about it?

MAX: Look, now a black belt. And then he spanked me with a black belt.

JOBGEN: Who beat you?

MAX: He spanked me with a black belt. And now this belt. and he spanked me with this belt.

JOBGEN: Who did?

MAX: Mother did.

JOBGEN: Mother did?

MAX: Yeah, with this belt, I mean with this belt.

JOBGEN: Mother hit you with that belt?

MAX: Yes.

of 65 JOBGEN: Yeah, show me where at on our body.

MAX: On my butt!

JOBGEN: Oh Okay. Okay. What did that feel like?

MAX: It feel like something like she spanked me on the butt.

JOBGEN: Hmm. Did any other part of get hit with the belt? Tell me about that.

MAX: I want to go out of your room (agitated).

JOBGEN: Huh?

MAX: I want to go out of your room.

JOBGEN: You want to go out of my room? How come?

MAX: Because I don’t want to talk to you anymore (upset).

JOBGEN: How come?

MAX: Because I’m going to leave (upset).

JOBGEN: Cause you’re gonna leave?

MAX: Yes.

JOBGEN: Hey listen do you want to draw a picture of your hand on here? Let’s see if we can trace your hand. Can we do that? Put your hand on here and I’ll trace it and then you can color it for me. Okay? Can you put your hand on here?

JOBGEN: There we go. What color is your favorite color Max?

MAX: Uh, a hand and a body.

JOBGEN: Yeah what color is your favorite color? Hey Max.

MAX: What?

JOBGEN: Which one of these is your favorite color?

MAX: This one.

JOBGEN: Do you want to color your hand that color?

MAX: Yes.

JOBGEN: Okay. Hey Max?

MAX: What?

JOBGEN: Did Mommy hit you with anything else besides a belt?

MAX: No.

JOBGEN: No. Hey Max, tell me what happened to your face there. Tell me what happened to your face.

of 65 MAX: I got hurt on my face.

JOBGEN: How did you get hurt on your face.

MAX: And I got this hurt on my back.

JOBGEN: How’d you get that?

MAX: Because JW said.

JOBGEN: Huh?

MAX: JW said. I want to go out of your room for to leave (upset). I want to go out of your room for to leave (crying).

JOBGEN: How come you want to go out of the room?

MAX: Because I’m going to leave.

JOBGEN: Cause you’re gonna leave?

MAX: Yes. I want to leave to go home. I want to go home (very upset).

JOBGEN: How come.

MAX: Because I do want to go home.

JOBGEN: Because you what?

MAX: Because I do want to go home.

JOBGEN: Because you do want to go home?

MAX: Yes.

JOBGEN: How come?

MAX: Because I want to go home.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Okay. Are you gonna color your hand for me? Do you want to color it blue?

MAX: Yes.

JOBGEN: Okay. Here you go.

MAX: I don’t know how.

JOBGEN: Okay. You want me to help you?

MAX: Yes.

JOBGEN: Okay. Here we can color it. You said something happened to your back Max.

MAX: This is my hand.

JOBGEN: Yeah, you want to help me color it? Here you can help me. Here. There you go.

MAX: I want to go home. I want to go home.

of 65 JOBGEN: Well let me think for a minute Max. Because you know we might be running out of questions.

MAX: I want to go home.

JOBGEN: Okay. Hey Max, Thanks for coming in and talking with me. Do you have anything else you want to tell me?

MAX: No.

Peter Sextus Barnes, Age, 10, DOB: 8/19/1995 Interview with Ginnifer Jobgen at the Children’s Advocacy Center

Interviewed on July 5, 2006

JOBGEN: I know your first name is Peter but I don’t know your full name. Tell me what that is?

PETER: My name is Peter Sextus Barnes.

JOBGEN: Peter Sexton Barnes?

PETER: Yes.

JOBGEN: Yeah, and how old are you?

PETER: Ten years old.

JOBGEN: So, do you remember what I said my name was when I met you out there?

PETER: Um, No.

JOBGEN: It’s Ginnifer. My full name is Ginnifer Lee Jobgen but you can call me Ginnifer for today, okay?

PETER: Ginnifer.

JOBGEN: Yeah, so let’s see, if you’re ten years old, let’s see, do you go to school?

PETER: No, I’m homeschooled.

JOBGEN: Homeschooled, what grade are you in?

PETER: Fourth, going into fifth.

JOBGEN: Tell me about that, tell me about being homeschooled, what’s that like?

PETER: Um, our Dad bought us this homeschool computer thing so we log onto that and the kids when they get on we’re supposed to help them get on and we get paid allowance by that and everything else and then Cebaschin and everybody gets on and usually, Blase’s wife, Flavia comes over and homeschools us once in awhile because my mom pays her.

JOBGEN: So you said the the kids?

PETER: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Like who do you mean? Page 10 of 65 PETER: Taler, Benjamen and Cebaschin.

JOBGEN: And who are they?

PETER: My brothers.

JOBGEN: And who is Blase?

PETER: One of my brothers, my older brothers.

JOBGEN: Okay. And so his wife comes over and helps you sometimes?

PETER: Mmhmm. Yeah.

JOBGEN: Have you always been homeschooled or did you ever…?

PETER: Yeah, I’ve been to school.

JOBGEN: Do you remember that?

PETER: Mmhmm.

JOBGEN: Tell me about that.

PETER: Um, my mom said if they called DFS on us one more time that we’d leave from school. Because they thought we were wearing clothes we shouldn’t wear.

JOBGEN: Like what does that mean?

PETER: Like it was hot out and we were wearing jeans.

JOBGEN: So, uh, like who called DFS?

PETER: Actually I don’t know, she just told us that they did.

JOBGEN: Uh huh. So then you quit going to school?

PETER: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah? When did you go to school?

PETER: Um, I don’t really remember.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Okay. So, let’s see, um, you, you were telling me about some of your brothers that you have, how many brothers do you have?

PETER: Twelve.

JOBGEN: Twelve.

PETER: Or no wait, eleven.

JOBGEN: Eleven. And do you have any sisters?

PETER: No.

JOBGEN: No. Just brothers?

PETER: Yeah.

of 65 JOBGEN: And so do you live with all your brothers?

PETER: Mmhmm.

JOBGEN: Yeah?

PETER: Well actually not two.

JOBGEN: Not two? How come not two?

PETER: Because Blase moved out and so did Paul.

JOBGEN: Blase and Paul moved out?

PETER: Mmhmm.

JOBGEN: Are they like grown-ups or…?

PETER: Mmhmm.

JOBGEN: Yeah. So, uh, do you live there now at that house?

PETER: Mmhmm.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Okay. So tell me um, how come you came here today?

PETER: Actually, I don’t really know.

JOBGEN: You don’t know? Has something been going on at your house?

PETER: I’m not sure but they said that we had to leave.

PETER: Because the room was… I don’t know but the house was really messed up and everything. There was a whole bunch of trash everywhere stuff. And then we left. That’s all I know.

JOBGEN: Who left?

PETER: All the kids and me.

JOBGEN: Where have you been staying at?

PETER: Karen’s house.

JOBGEN: Are you staying now with any of your brothers?

PETER: Uh, two of my brothers.

JOBGEN: Two of your brothers? Okay. So you said the house was messed up?

PETER: It wasn’t messed up it just had some trash in it and stuff that needed cleaned up.

JOBGEN: Like what kind of trash do you mean?

PETER: Like paper and then the laundry was everywhere and you know just trashed.

of 65 JOBGEN: Okay. So like did somebody come to your house?

PETER: Um, yes the cops.

JOBGEN: The cops. Tell me about that.

PETER: Um they were talking with everybody. Talking about Max. They said that Max got a mark on his back. I don’t really know much about that but I do know that every time Max gets swats… my mom stopped that like a month ago. Well it wasn’t like a month ago it was like two months. So she said she’ll stop it and she’s going to instead of doing that she’ll if he does anything bad, she’ll make him sit down in the corner.

JOBGEN: So um, you said they were talking about something… and who’s Max?

PETER: Max is one of my other brothers.

JOBGEN: Okay. They were talking about Max having some marks on his back?

PETER: Yeah, they said that he had a mark on his back.

JOBGEN: Did you see that mark?

PETER: Um, no but they just told me.

JOBGEN: And what did they think… how did they think Max got that mark?

PETER: I don’t really know.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Do you know how he got that?

PETER: Um no, but my brother Taler said that my mom gave him a spanking and he had a mark on his back but I’m not sure that happened.

JOBGEN: How come?

PETER: Because Max doesn’t usually get spankings anymore because he usually just sits down by the wall for about five minutes.

JOBGEN: So he used to get spankings?

PETER: Yeah about two months ago.

JOBGEN: Yeah. What did he get spankings for?

PETER: Because he peed on the bed. He was right there sitting and he wasn’t all the way potty trained and he just peed on the bed.

JOBGEN: I see. So he got spankings for that?

PETER: Oh and there was another reason. He usually gets spankings by another person. Uh, Clinton, he usually is the one that babysits us.

JOBGEN: And who’s Clinton?

PETER: My brother.

JOBGEN: Your brother. Okay.

PETER: The oldest one there.

of 65 JOBGEN: The oldest one there. How old is Clinton, do you know?

PETER: Uh, 16 or 15. Anyways, he gave Max swats once he gave him about ten because he pooped on the ground. Because he wasn’t all the way potty trained. And me, Preston and TC and Clinton were potty training him. But I’m not allowed to give people swats. I wouldn’t anyways.

JOBGEN: How come?

PETER: Because it stings and everything… leave marks and everything. So I don’t want to do that.

JOBGEN: Do you ever get swats?

PETER: Oh let me see, when I was five.

PETER: I used to do the same thing Cebaschin does, he steals stuff all the time. Taler and Cebaschin usually steal stuff all the time. Anyway they stole stuff a whole bunch of times so she, my mom gave them swats and then made them stand by the corner.

JOBGEN: So when you were five you did that too?

PETER: Yeah.

JOBGEN: So like what does your mom give swats with?

PETER: Uh, a belt.

JOBGEN: A belt?

PETER: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Okay.

PETER: Sometimes she has this belt with holes in it and belt with no holes in it. It’s just black.

JOBGEN: So did you ever seen any marks on you when you got swats?

PETER: Um no, just a red mark on my butt.

JOBGEN: When you would get swats would you get them like just on your butt or on other places?

PETER: Well yeah sometimes I move because it stings and it hit my back once.

JOBGEN: Okay. I see. Um, you were… like when you were five that you stole stuff? Like what did you steal?

PETER: Like the food she bought and everything and we didn’t have that much money then. Because she needed to get two jobs and everything.

JOBGEN: Like the food who bought?

PETER: My mom.

JOBGEN: Oh.

of 65 PETER: And my Dad. My Dad buys most the food just only like every week. If we have less food.

JOBGEN: Well who’s your Dad, tell me about him.

PETER: Elvis, I don’t know his middle name, Barnes. He comes every week and buys us food and we go to the lake or something. This one time we went to um… Right now she said that probably next week… we have to go but… once we go back to our house, she said next week we had to chose x-men or the lake.

JOBGEN: So does he live there with you guys?

PETER: Uh no, I don’t know where he lives.

JOBGEN: So, um, you were talking about how Clinton sometimes gives swats and your mom, has anybody else ever done that?

PETER: Um, let’s see, nope.

JOBGEN: Okay.

PETER: But Clinton stopped the swatting because mom my said he… if he would give swats, hit us, anything at all like that, that she would lower down his payment on his allowance. So he stopped it and now he just sends us to the corner.

JOBGEN: So, um, like you said that you would steal food sometimes. Like where would you steal the food from?

PETER: Cabinets.

JOBGEN: Oh okay. I see. Okay.

PETER: I’d use a chair to get up on the counter and … yep.

JOBGEN: So like tell me, what’s your favorite thing to eat?

PETER: Pizza.

JOBGEN: Pizza. Yeah. Do you have pizza at home a lot?

PETER: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Like at home what kind of food do you usually have?

PETER: Um Peanut butter sandwiches, peanut butter and jelly sandwiches, burritos, um let’s see, macaroni, spaghetti, and let me see, I don’t know what it’s called, oh yeah, this one time Flavia made us something, it was chicken noodle soup which she has vegetables in it and we had chicken and corn…

JOBGEN: Uh huh. How was that?

PETER: Good.

JOBGEN: Good? Um, let’s see, you said that the cops came to your house?

PETER: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah. So, um, um, let’s see, do you know if um Max had got swats from anybody then?

of 65 PETER: Nope.

JOBGEN: Like when they said that he had marks on him?

PETER: The only think I know about that is Taler said he got swats, but that was only because he messed up my mom’s room, peed on all of her papers. Well actually the only reason that happened was because Clinton put Max and Joseph in the room and he got really angry.

JOBGEN: So did Clinton give Max swats or…?

PETER: No. No. My brother Taler said he got swats because he messed up my mom’s room, threw paper on the ground, her important papers, her job papers, and then he also peed on them.

JOBGEN: Mmhmm. Okay.

PETER: And then Max says no he didn’t because he doesn’t want to get in trouble and then when Mother finds out that he did it, he says, I’m sorry, I’m sorry.

JOBGEN: So, let’s see, um, so like is that stuff at your house cleaned up now, like all that trash and stuff?

PETER: Yeah we we always clean it up that’s what we get paid for.

JOBGEN: Uh huh.

PETER: It’s just at night everyone’s tired, but once the cops came everyone like woke up.

JOBGEN: So, tell me about your house, like do you have your own room, or do you share a room… ?

PETER: I share a room with my big brother, my older brother, eleven.

JOBGEN: Yeah, what’s his name?

PETER: TC.

JOBGEN: TC? You share a room?

PETER: Mmhmm.

JOBGEN: So is it just you and TC in your room?

PETER: Me and him are in that room and in the room next to us, it’s Preston and he said he’s probably let me move in there and then Taler, Benjamen or Cebaschin, one of them’s moving in TC’s room… actually, no that’s not true because there’s a three way bed in the room, uh, in Taler, Cebaschin and Benjamen’s room. So they sleep in there, but what’s supposed to be happening is Taler not supposed to be sleeping in there, and he’s supposed to be sleeping somewhere else I’m not sure, but um, Max and Joseph sleep in Preston’s room which they shouldn’t be but my mother, my mom said it was okay because… well actually, my brother Clinton is the one that came up with that idea. Then my mom said okay, okay. So, yeah, now it’s that way. Taler’s room is Max’s room…

JOBGEN: So do you have like your own bed or…?

PETER: No we have a hide-a-bed.

JOBGEN: What does that look like, I don’t know what…?

of 65 PETER: Sofa bed.

JOBGEN: Yeah.

PETER: Me and TC share that bed. We have this one big giant cover.

JOBGEN: So do you have like, um, so how many bedrooms are in your house? Do you know?

PETER: Five.

JOBGEN: Five bedrooms, how about bathrooms, how many bathrooms are in your house?

PETER: Two.

JOBGEN: Two?

PETER: Well three.

JOBGEN: Three bathrooms? Yeah?

PETER: That’s in my room.

JOBGEN: There’s a bathroom in your room?

PETER: Mmhmm.

JOBGEN: Yeah. And do all those bathrooms work okay or…?

PETER: Uh, one of them don’t, my bathroom, so we don’t use it anymore. And then the other two bathrooms work fine but one of the bathrooms, it’s a small bathroom, it’s Clinton’s bathroom, he won’t even let us use it.

JOBGEN: How come?

PETER: Because he’s usually a jerk.

JOBGEN: Like what does he do that’s a jerk?

PETER: Well he says if we don’t… if this doesn’t get done when I get back, he comes up and punches me and then once in awhile actually he said I told you to do this before and actually it was done and the kids messed it up again. And then he kicked my legs because I said that. He said no that’s not true it was there before. He kicks my leg and he kicks me around. Usually he bullies everybody around, except Preston because he just acts… he doesn’t even care about Preston anymore. Because alls he does, once he tells him, usually he has…

JOBGEN: So does your mom see Clinton like…

PETER: We tell her and then she talks to him. But it seems to not do anything.

JOBGEN: So tell me about… Clinton babysits you guys?

PETER: Mmhmm.

JOBGEN: Is that right? So, is he always there or…?

PETER: Yeah. He’s always there. But this one time when he had a job, Flavia always comes over here at our school time and then Blase takes him to work and then Flavia is here babysitting us.

of 65 JOBGEN: Okay. So, is there anything else that’s been going on like at your house?

PETER: Um, let me see. Nope. Except Clinton throws a knife in the wall everyday.

JOBGEN: Hmm. Tell me about that.

PETER: Uh, actually I don’t really know about it, but he throws a knife in the wall and it leaves like a whole bunch of marks in his room. And then he’s got his paint, he spray painted Clinton on the wall. And actually he usually steals stuff from us so when he’s gone like at the Highlands or something, we sneak in there and take our stuff back and then our mom gets home and then we tell her that we took it back and then she says we need to stop doing that and we did.

JOBGEN: When he’s gone to the highlands?

PETER: Yeah.

JOBGEN: What’s that?

PETER: Uh, the highlands is like another neighborhood.

JOBGEN: Mmhmm.

PETER: It’s a place where all our friends are and we usually go there to play with them… like visiting our friends.

JOBGEN: Like where do you play at, at the highlands?

PETER: Um. Next to the pool, they have like this big out yard, we play there, and then the basketball is where I like to play… play basketball. And then usually we go swimming, not that much, but yeah, and then usually, I usually go around the highlands looking for jobs to do. Like I did this weeding. But then one time when I get money, like cash and everything, my brother says, Clinton, my brother, he tries to act all nice so he can get money from me, for my to buy something from him.

JOBGEN: And then what happens?

PETER: Well, I end up having stuff like, that’s his and sometimes I don’t even buy anything from him.

JOBGEN: Oh. Okay. So, let’s see, um, do you have any questions for me today?

PETER: Um, no.

JOBGEN: Okay. Is there anything else you want to talk about today?

PETER: Hmm, let’s see, nope.

JOBGEN: No, okay. Well thanks for coming in and talking to me. Do you want to go back out there now?

PETER: Yeah.

Tritton Cassidy “TC” Barnes, Age 11, DOB: 10/7/1994 Interview with Ginnifer Jobgen at the Children’s Advocacy Center

of 65 TC: What are these?

JOBGEN: Those are called koosh balls. I just like to hold on to them when I talk. What’s your whole name then?

TC: Tritton Cassidy Barnes.

JOBGEN: Tritton Cassidy Barnes? Yeah. And what do you like to go by? What do people call you?

TC: TC.

JOBGEN: TC. And do you remember what I said my name was?

TC: Ginnifer.

JOBGEN: It is Ginnifer. So you can just call me Ginnifer today, okay?

TC: Okay.

JOBGEN: TC, how old are you.

TC: Eleven.

JOBGEN: You’re eleven. So do you go to school, or…

TC: Homeschooled.

JOBGEN: You’re homeschooled? What grade are you in?

TC: I don’t know.

JOBGEN: You don’t know. Um, tell me about homeschool, what’s it like?

TC: It’s good. We do it on the computer and do our schoolwork and my older brother’s wife, she used to come over and help us teach.

JOBGEN: Your older brother…?

TC: Wife.

JOBGEN: Oh, what’s her name?

TC: Flavia.

JOBGEN: Favia?

TC: Flavia.

JOBGEN: Flavia. And she comes over and helps you guys.

TC: Yeah, but not anymore, she got a job now.

JOBGEN: She got a job now? Yeah. Well, like, who helps you guys now?

TC: Well, we always helps ourselves, we know all of it and how to do and we just get on the computer and do that.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Like what kind of stuff do you do?

of 65 TC: Math, science, all those.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Math and science. Like what kind of stuff are you learning in math?

TC: I’m learning times… and algebra, stuff.

JOBGEN: So, let’s see, um, so you’re, you’re the older brother…?

TC: Blase.

JOBGEN: Huh?

TC: Blase and Paul.

JOBGEN: Blase and Paul.

TC: And Clinton and Preston.

JOBGEN: Clinton and Preston. And then you have some other brothers too?

TC: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah. What are there names?

TC: Um, Peter, um Taler and Cebaschin, or Benjamen then Cebaschin, Max, Joseph, Dozen.

JOBGEN: Okay. And those are all your brothers. Yeah. So, do you live with all them?

TC: Um, two don’t live with us.

JOBGEN: Who doesn’t live there?

TC: Paul and Blase.

JOBGEN: Paul and Blase. How come they don’t live there?

TC: They just moved out. Blase has a wife and Paul is 18 and moved to Kansas.

JOBGEN: He moved to Kansas?

TC: And he has a baby.

JOBGEN: He has a baby. Yeah. Okay. So, are you living there right now, at your house?

TC: Who?

JOBGEN: You.

TC: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah? Okay. So, do you know why you came here today, or…?

TC: Nope.

JOBGEN: No?

TC: Just to talk.

JOBGEN: Just to talk. Has something been going on at your house TC?

of 65 TC: Not that I know of.

JOBGEN: Not that you know of? So, who brought you here?

TC: Uh, I don’t know her name, the girl out there, I don’t remember her name.

JOBGEN: Yeah. So, um, did your mom bring you here today? Was it your mom?

JOBGEN: No. Are you with your mom right now?

JOBGEN: No. How come?

TC: I don’t know.

JOBGEN: You don’t know. Um, so are you living somewhere else?

TC: Yeah. Um, this um foster care place at this… or something like that.

JOBGEN: At a foster care place.

TC: Yeah, or something.

JOBGEN: Yeah. And are your brothers living at home with your mom?

TC: No. They’re all in a different foster house. Like four are at that one, and Peter, Joseph and Cebaschin are at one, and I don’t know where Dozen is.

JOBGEN: And when did that happen?

TC: Um, I don’t know, um, I don’t know, um, I think I’ve been there for like four days… four days ago…

JOBGEN: Four days ago?

TC: That’s what I think, I really don’t know how long.

JOBGEN: Well, tell me about that happening. What happened?

TC: I don’t know.

JOBGEN: Well like what happened when, when you weren’t at your house? Like, um, did someone come get you, or… ?

TC: Um, I just came home from friends and the cops were there and they were all inside and they said they were going to take us away and that’s all I know.

JOBGEN: And that happened four days ago?

TC: I think.

JOBGEN: Yeah. And the cops were there and they said they were just gonna take you guys away?

TC: Mmhmm. I don’t know why.

of 65 JOBGEN: They didn’t tell you why? Well, okay. So, did anybody like talk to you and ask you any questions?

TC: Yeah. This one wanted to know… a lady… I don’t what her name is…

JOBGEN: A lady did?

TC: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Like what kind of questions did she ask you?

TC: She asked, uh, if, has Max got any beatings or anything. I said no because he hasn’t.

JOBGEN: Okay. What does that mean, beatings, like…

TC: Like got whipped by a cord…

JOBGEN: By a cord? Yeah. Did somebody say that?

TC: That’s what they… they said that JW… he said he did… but he didn’t because he… I was there all day with him and I didn’t hear him cry or no whips… and if he was going to get a spanking, he always comes to me and says, “Mother’s going to give me a spanking” and tells me he’s going to get a swat, mother only gives one swat, and he tells me he’s going to get a swat.

JOBGEN: Max always comes and tells you he’s going to get a swat?

TC: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Hmm. So, does your mom give spankings then?

TC: Um, yeah, only one to Max. That’s it.

JOBGEN: Only one to Max. Yeah.

TC: When we tell him not to do something and he doesn’t do it and we keep telling him, she usually just gives him one swat.

JOBGEN: How do you know it was only one?

TC: That’s all she gives him.

JOBGEN: Do you see that, or… ?

TC: I just hear it, one swat, that’s it.

JOBGEN: So, tell me, um, let’s see, what does, uh, what does he get a swat with?

TC: Belt.

JOBGEN: A belt. Yeah. Okay. Um, let me think, um, I don’t know, tell me about, let’s see, what’s your favorite thing to eat at your house?

TC: Pizza.

JOBGEN: Pizza. What kind of pizza do you like TC?

TC: Meat pizza.

of 65 JOBGEN: Meat pizza?

TC: Pepperoni, sausage.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Do you have that at your house a lot?

TC: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah. What kind of stuff do you eat at home?

TC: Ramen noodles, cereal, waffles…

JOBGEN: Yeah. Who cooks at your house?

TC: Me and Preston.

JOBGEN: You and Preston do? Yeah, are you a pretty good cook?

TC: Yeah.

JOBGEN: What do you cook?

TC: Um, mostly everything at the house, chicken, hamburger, hot dogs… Um my Dad gets us hamburger, tacos, and you know, all that stuff and he get us a bunch of fruit like apple, oranges, and bananas…

JOBGEN: Your dad does that?

TC: Yeah.

JOBGEN: What’s his name?

TC: Elvis.

JOBGEN: Elvis, is your dad. Does he live there at your house?

TC: No.

JOBGEN: No, he doesn’t. Do you see him?

TC: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Tell me about him.

TC: Uh, he does, mostly like on his day off he takes us to the lake, uh, he does a lot of stuff with us, he was going to take us to see X-men, he just does a lot of stuff with us.

JOBGEN: Yeah. So, um, has he ever lived there?

TC: No.

JOBGEN: No, he hasn’t.

TC: He only lived in the… two houses… before we lived in this brown house and this small house, he lived in those.

JOBGEN: He did?

TC: And a few other houses.

of 65 JOBGEN: Yeah. Okay. So, um, you said that you mom like has gave Max a swat like once. Does anybody else in your house give spankings.

TC: Um, no, because they do what mother says, when mother says do it, they do it, Max, he doesn’t, he just makes a fit.

JOBGEN: He makes a fit, and everybody else like does what they’re supposed to do?

TC: Yeah, sometimes we get swats.

JOBGEN: Yeah? From who?

TC: My mom.

JOBGEN: From your mom. Tell me about that.

TC: Uh… Like Cebaschin Ben they only get like one swat, like Max, they’re little and we get like three or five if we do something wrong and we know we’re not supposed to do it.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Do you get those sometimes?

TC: Only some.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Like what do you do that you’re not supposed to do?

TC: Just like if she’s gone, we can’t go outside, and we just go to our friends, go away, and like if the cops come and stuff so she wants us to stay at home the whole time.

JOBGEN: Why would the cops come?

TC: If they did, she just wants us there at all times.

JOBGEN: If they did?

TC: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Hmm. Okay. So like all you guys have to stay there at all times or is that just you, or… ?

TC: All of them.

JOBGEN: Okay. Okay. So, uh, hmm, let’s see, I’m trying to think, sometimes my brain doesn’t work very good. Can you think of anything, like anything that you want to talk about today or any questions that you have TC?

TC: Um, no questions.

JOBGEN: You don’t have any questions? Is there anything you want to talk about?

TC: No.

JOBGEN: No. Okay. Well thanks for coming in and talking to me. Do you want to go tell your brother it’s his turn?

TC: Sure.

JOBGEN: Okay.

of 65 Sterling “Preston” Barnes, Age 12, DOB: 8/4/1993 Interview with Ginnifer Jobgen at the Children’s Advocacy Center

JOBGEN: Do you want to hold on to one of these?

PRESTON: Uh, sure.

JOBGEN: Okay. Tell me what your whole name is.

PRESTON: Preston Sterling Barnes.

JOBGEN: Preston Sterling Barnes and how old are you Preston?

PRESTON: Uh, twelve. I’m going to be thirteen soon.

JOBGEN: When will you be thirteen?

PRESTON: A few days.

JOBGEN: A few days? What’s…

PRESTON: I don’t know in particular…

JOBGEN: Yeah. Okay. So, let’s see, um, did I tell you what my name was when I met you out there?

PRESTON: I don’t know.

JOBGEN: It’s Ginnifer. My whole name is Ginnifer Lee Jobgen. But you can just call me Ginnifer, okay?

PRESTON: Okay.

JOBGEN: Okay. And so do you like to go by Preston?

PRESTON:

JOBGEN: So, tell me, um, what grade are you in?

PRESTON: Um, in homeschool, I’m in sixth, but I’m falling behind.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Tell me about that.

PRESTON: Uh, well, we do schoolwork and our dad pays us for it and we go on vacation if we do a good job. And I’m falling behind, I stuck on a test and I failed it and it automatically brings you behind like twenty tests. It’s like we do lessons on the internet, it’s called SOS Student, that’s the schoolwork I do. All my brothers do something different.

JOBGEN: They all do something different?

PRESTON: Yeah, except for Clinton. He does a way harder schoolwork than us all.

JOBGEN: Hmm.

PRESTON: Anyway, my schoolwork, we have like science, history, language and math. Yep. Page 25 of 65 JOBGEN: And so how did you fall behind, what happened on a test?

PRESTON: I had a test, a quiz, for language, but I failed it.

JOBGEN: How come?

PRESTON: Uh, I just…

JOBGEN: Yeah, so that made you fall behind?

PRESTON: Yeah, all the stuff that you were supposed to learn to do the test, it brings it back and you have to do it over and take the test again.

JOBGEN: So, you said that, that your dad pays you to do that?

PRESTON: Yes. He doesn’t pay us, it’s… when we’re done if we have a good report card, he gives us, uh, he gives us like this huge allowance.

JOBGEN: Yeah, like what?

PRESTON: For our trip to like Florida.

JOBGEN: Have you ever been to Florida?

PRESTON: Oh, about twice.

PRESTON: We went to Florida at… no wait, three times. Once we went with just us four big boys and dad…

JOBGEN: Who’s that? Tell me who those four big boys are.

PRESTON: Clinton, me, TC who’s out there, and Peter who was here a second ago.

JOBGEN: Okay.

PRESTON: We go there, we stay in this huge hotel, I don’t remember what it’s called. Last time stayed in the Liki Tiki resort. But anyway, then when we’re there, we go to like theme parks.

JOBGEN: Theme parks?

PRESTON: Disney World, Sea World, we’ve been to like all of them.

JOBGEN: Yeah?

PRESTON: And then the last time we went with the whole family, we went to Universal Studios. That was good.

JOBGEN: And, so, everybody went?

PRESTON: Yes.

JOBGEN: Did you go with your mom or your dad or… ?

PRESTON: Our dad took us but my mom went too.

JOBGEN: She did?

of 65 PRESTON: The whole family. Everyone.

JOBGEN: Yeah. So, how many, um, so you talked about…

PRESTON: Oh wait, two didn’t go, that’s Paul and Blase, but they don’t live in our house.

JOBGEN: Okay, you have two brothers that don’t live your house? How come they don’t live there?

PRESTON: They moved out, they’re married.

JOBGEN: Oh, they’re married? Yeah. Do they have, um, kids?

PRESTON: Paul has one kid.

JOBGEN: Yeah. What’s, what’s his kid’s name?

PRESTON: Destiny.

JOBGEN: Destiny. Okay. And so, let’s see, and do you have some brothers younger than you?

PRESTON: Yes.

JOBGEN: Okay, who are they?

PRESTON: Uh, TC, Peter, Taler, Ben and Cebaschin, Max, Joseph and Dozen. I’m the fourth.

JOBGEN: Okay. You’re the fourth?

PRESTON: I only have twelve brothers.

JOBGEN: Twelve brothers.

PRESTON: No girls.

JOBGEN: No girls?

PRESTON:

JOBGEN: What is that like?

PRESTON: It’s okay.

JOBGEN: It’s okay?

PRESTON: It’s cool.

JOBGEN: Yeah. What do you think about not having any sister?

PRESTON: It’s okay.

JOBGEN: It’s okay.

PRESTON: We have a baseball team.

JOBGEN: Yeah. I guess you do have enough to have a baseball team, huh?

of 65 PRESTON: Mmhmm, yeah.

JOBGEN: If you had a baseball team, what spot would you play?

PRESTON: I’d probably be like… I have no idea, I don’t play baseball.

JOBGEN: You don’t play baseball. Do you like sports at all?

PRESTON: Just basketball.

JOBGEN: Basketball? Okay. Do you play basketball?

PRESTON:

JOBGEN: No?

PRESTON: I play it sometimes around the house.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Okay.

PRESTON: Or at the highlands.

JOBGEN: At where?

PRESTON: The highlands?

JOBGEN: What’s that?

PRESTON: That’s a neighborhood next to ours where all my friends live.

JOBGEN: Oh.

PRESTON: But they have this huge basketball course.

JOBGEN: And you go there sometimes to play.

PRESTON: Mmhmm.

JOBGEN: Okay. Excuse me. So, um, who brought you here today?

PRESTON: Uh, I don’t know, I can’t remember her name.

JOBGEN: Just some lady did? Yeah. So, like you were telling me about all those people at your house, are you living at that house right now?

PRESTON: Uh, yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Okay. So, um, do you know why you came here today?

PRESTON:

JOBGEN: No? So, um, like did you stay at your house last night?

PRESTON:

JOBGEN: No? Tell me about that.

PRESTON: I stayed at a house with, uh, TC and Peter and Max, we stayed, no Taler, we stayed at a house with a bunch of other people I do not know what it is.

of 65 JOBGEN: You don’t know what the house is?

PRESTON: No, I don’t know whose it is. Some people took us there…

JOBGEN: How come?

JOBGEN: So, is any of your brothers at home?

PRESTON: Uh, one.

JOBGEN: Which one is at home?

PRESTON: Clinton.

JOBGEN: Clinton. How come no one’s at home?

JOBGEN: Did um, did something happen?

PRESTON: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah. What happened?

PRESTON: Some cops and stuff just came and were going around our house and they just took us.

JOBGEN: Hmm, when did that happen?

PRESTON: Uh, it was like six or seven days ago.

JOBGEN: Yeah. And so, they, uh, some cops just came and they just took you, why did they take you?

JOBGEN: Did they talk to you at all?

PRESTON: Uh, yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah, what did they talk…

PRESTON: I think it was because my mom, uh, spanked my brother.

PRESTON: Well my brother, Max, got in trouble… I wasn’t sure what it was for, I just heard it from my other brother… and he got a spanking. My mom doesn’t usually spank any of us though.

JOBGEN: She doesn’t usually spank… ?

PRESTON: Uh, but my dad did.

JOBGEN: Tell me about that, your dad.

PRESTON: My dad used to always spank us all, but went to jail a long time ago.

of 65 JOBGEN: Your dad that you were talking about awhile ago?

PRESTON: Yeah.

JOBGEN: What’s his name?

PRESTON: Uh Gene I think it is… I don’t know his full name.

JOBGEN: Gene?

PRESTON: Gene Barnes, something like that.

JOBGEN: Okay. And, so, um, he, he used to spank… Did he spank you?

PRESTON: Yes.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Tell me about that.

PRESTON: He just spanked us with this huge stick.

JOBGEN: Oh. What was that like?

PRESTON: Painful.

JOBGEN: Painful? Yeah. How old were you when that happened?

PRESTON: Uh, I was like eight.

JOBGEN: Eight? Yeah. And so do you see him now? Gene?

PRESTON:

JOBGEN: Does he spank now?

PRESTON:

JOBGEN: No?

PRESTON: My mom and him got divorced and he went to jail.

JOBGEN: Oh. So, you said your mom doesn’t usually spank, but she spanked Max?

PRESTON:

JOBGEN: Yeah. How come she spanked Max?

JOBGEN: Did you see her spank Max?

PRESTON: I just, I was in my room… And I heard it from my other brothers.

JOBGEN: Oh. Who told you?

PRESTON: Taler and Ben.

JOBGEN: And Ben said that your that your mom spanked Max?

of 65 PRESTON: They are my younger brothers.

JOBGEN: Oh. Okay. So, did Max have any like marks on him or anything?

PRESTON: Yes.

JOBGEN: He did. Did you see those? Like what did he have?

PRESTON: He had like huge bruises on his back from a belt.

JOBGEN: How did you seen them?

PRESTON: Uh, I saw them on his back.

JOBGEN: Oh. Okay. Where were you guys at when you saw them?

PRESTON: He told me he had a spanking so I took his shirt off and just saw all of those bruises.

JOBGEN: Hmm. Okay. Was he, um, did you hear him like when he got a spanking or anything?

PRESTON:

JOBGEN: No. Did he say anything to you about the spanking?

PRESTON:

JOBGEN: What did he say about it?

PRESTON: He told me mother spanked him and it hurt.

JOBGEN: Yeah. What is, uh, what does she spank with?

PRESTON: A belt.

JOBGEN: A belt. Do you ever get spanked with a belt from your mom?

PRESTON:

JOBGEN: No. Does she spank anyone else with a belt.

PRESTON: Not that I know of.

JOBGEN: Not that you know of. Okay. How did you know she spanked him with a belt?

PRESTON: He told me and my two younger brothers Ben and Taler told me.

JOBGEN: Oh. Were you there when that happened?

PRESTON: I was in my room.

JOBGEN: You were in your room? Do you know where they were at when your mom spanked him?

PRESTON: Uh, probably in her room.

JOBGEN: In her room. Okay. Did they tell you why he got a spanking?

of 65 JOBGEN: No. Did he tell you?

PRESTON:

JOBGEN: Did Max tell you?

PRESTON: He just said he got in trouble.

JOBGEN: Oh. Does he get in trouble a lot?

PRESTON:

JOBGEN: No? Okay. Hmm. Tell me about, um, let’s see, who does the cooking in your house?

PRESTON: My mom and sometimes me.

JOBGEN: Yeah. What do you cook?

PRESTON: And Clinton.

JOBGEN: And Clinton? And that’s your older…

PRESTON: Oh, and sometimes Flavia because she babysits us a lot. She’s like our teacher.

JOBGEN: Hmm. And so, um, what kind of stuff do you guys eat at home?

PRESTON: Like chicken and stuff… and applesauce and vegetables, corn dogs, hot dogs, anything, all kinds of stuff.

JOBGEN: What’s your favorite thing?

PRESTON: Pizza.

JOBGEN: Pizza. Yeah. Okay.

PRESTON: Most kids like pizza.

JOBGEN: Yeah. I like pizza too and I’m not a kid.

PRESTON: Okay.

JOBGEN: Tell me, you were telling about how dad spanked you one time with a huge stick…

PRESTON: No, he used to do that all the time.

JOBGEN: Oh, he used to do that all the time. How come, why would he do that?

PRESTON: I don’t remember, uh, we would just always get in trouble for some things, and he would spank us.

JOBGEN: Did he spank other people other than you?

PRESTON: Yes, all of us.

JOBGEN: All of you?

of 65 PRESTON: But like Cebaschin wasn’t born then.

JOBGEN: Oh okay.

PRESTON: And one of the other babies. And then when Cebaschin was born, he got spankings too, but when he was like five.

JOBGEN: Did you ever have any marks from your… ?

PRESTON: That’s why he went to jail.

JOBGEN: Like what did you have?

PRESTON: Bruises.

JOBGEN: Bruises. Where did you get spankings with that stick thing at?

PRESTON: Uh, we get spanking like in the living room…

JOBGEN: Where at on your body would you get a spanking?

PRESTON: On our butts.

JOBGEN: Your butt. Yeah. Would your clothes be on or off?

PRESTON: On.

JOBGEN: On. Okay. Okay. But you said that he doesn’t spank now?

PRESTON: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah, he does… ?

PRESTON: He would go back to jail.

JOBGEN: Oh. Okay. What happens when you get in trouble with him now?

PRESTON: Uh nothing. We don’t usually get in trouble with him because we only see him like once every three months.

JOBGEN: Oh. Okay. When you see him what do you do?

PRESTON: He just like comes to our house, checks up on our schoolwork, tells us about our vacation, how he’s doing, we just talk with him all day, oh, and work out.

JOBGEN: Hmm. Tell me about that.

PRESTON: Well uh, it all, we started this work out thing, because you know, we just all wanted to get in shape, so my dad bought all these weights and pads for it and told us all to do work out stuff. Like crunches, squats, lifting up weights, push ups, sit ups, stuff like that.

JOBGEN: Where’s that stuff at… all that stuff?

PRESTON: Uh, it should be in Clinton’s room, that where we keep it all.

JOBGEN: That’s where you have it? Oh. Um, you were saying that you lifted Max’s shirt up and you saw the marks on his back… Had you ever seen any marks on him before like that?

of 65 PRESTON: Oh, yeah, he has a mark right there (points to forehead).

PRESTON: It’s a scar that he got from a car crash. He had stitches there.

JOBGEN: Oh. Has he ever had any marks like from a spanking that you’ve seen?

PRESTON: No.

JOBGEN: No. Okay. Did Max used to get spanked by your dad with that… ?

PRESTON: He wasn’t born, my dad went to jail before he was born.

JOBGEN: Oh. Oh I see. Okay. Um, have you ever seen any marks on any of your other brothers?

PRESTON: Taler, he has marks, from like, he went to foster care, DFS… and he when we got him back, he had all these marks and he’s part blind, one of his eyes, the one like completely red, because he’s blind in that eye.

JOBGEN: When did that happen?

PRESTON: It happened when we got him back from foster care…

JOBGEN: Was that here? Did you live here when that happened?

PRESTON: Um, no, we lived in a different place. I’m too young… I was too young to remember, it was like a blue house.

JOBGEN: Okay. Okay. Hmm. I think I might be running out of questions. What do you think?

PRESTON: Uh, yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Do you have any questions for me today Preston?

PRESTON: Nope.

JOBGEN: Is there anything that you want to talk about? Anything that you are concerned about or afraid of or anything that you want to talk about?

PRESTON: No.

JOBGEN: No. Well thanks for coming in and talking to me.

PRESTON: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Do you want to go back out there?

PRESTON: Yeah.

Benjamen Octavier Barnes, Age 8, DOB: 2/14/1998 Interview with Ginnifer Jobgen at the Children’s Advocacy Center

JOBGEN: Tell me what your whole name is.

of 65 BENJAMEN: Benjamen, but people call me Ben for short.

JOBGEN: Benjamen for short. Do you want to hold on to one of those (koosh ball). Okay. And how old are you Ben?

BENJAMEN: Eight.

JOBGEN: You’re eight. Hey Ben, do you remember what I said my name was when I met you out there?

BENJAMEN: No.

JOBGEN: My name’s Ginnifer and people just call me Ginnifer so if you want to call me that today, that’s okay. Okay?

BENJAMEN: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Okay. So, if you’re eight years old, tell me, do you go to school?

BENJAMEN: Nope. Homeschooled.

JOBGEN: You’re homeschooled? Tell me what that’s like.

BENJAMEN: It’s a pretty much like regular school.

JOBGEN: Pretty much like real school. Tell me what you do.

BENJAMEN: I do it on the computer and do it not on the computer, pretty much, yeah. I get on the computer and then don’t get on the computer.

JOBGEN: On the computer? On the computer? Is that what you said?

BENJAMEN: Yep.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Okay. So who like teaches you stuff?

BENJAMEN: Flavia used to but now, uh, we don’t do schoolwork… now we only do schoolwork on the computer and now we do it again on the computer again.

JOBGEN: Okay. So, let’s see, um, I want to find out like where you live and who all you live with, okay?

BENJAMEN: I live with Preston, Cebaschin, Clinton, Paul, Blase, well wait a minute, Blase doesn’t live with us anymore, neither does Paul, and uh, did I say Preston already?

JOBGEN: Who are those people?

BENJAMEN: They’re my family.

JOBGEN: They’re your family. Okay.

BENJAMEN: Mother is our mom.

JOBGEN: Uh huh.

BENJAMEN: Hmm, Joseph, Max, Cebaschin, oh yeah I already said that, Taler, and me, and that’s pretty much all I know.

JOBGEN: That’s pretty much all you know. Tell me about, um, living there.

of 65 BENJAMEN: It’s alright, it’s pretty good.

JOBGEN: It’s pretty good?

BENJAMEN: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah?

BENJAMEN: There’s holes in the wall by our brother Clinton, he kicked them so much and made holes in them, pretty much all those holes…

JOBGEN: Who kicked the wall?

BENJAMEN: Clinton.

JOBGEN: Kristen?

BENJAMEN: Clinton. Person that’s helping you… Clinton.

JOBGEN: Trenton?

BENJAMEN: No not…

JOBGEN: Clinton?

BENJAMEN: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah. He punched holes in holes in the walls.

BENJAMEN: He punches them, kicks them…

JOBGEN: How come he did that?

BENJAMEN: I don’t know. I think he just do because he was mad and let it out by kicking the walls and stuff.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Okay. So tell me some other stuff about living at your house.

BENJAMEN: Well, uh, there’s a, our room is pretty good, except we have to clean it up now, we should clean it up now.

JOBGEN: Uh huh.

BENJAMEN: Our house just keeps getting dirty by Joseph and Max, they just get up on the counter with a chair. They dumped some flour out but I had to keep, uh all of us keep getting them off.

JOBGEN: Mmhmm.

BENJAMEN: Yeah.

JOBGEN: They dumped some flour out?

BENJAMEN: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah? Who did that? Max and who?

BENJAMEN: Joseph.

of 65 JOBGEN: Max and Joseph and those are your brothers?

BENJAMEN: Uh huh.

JOBGEN: Yeah? And let’s see, um, are you living there right now?

BENJAMEN: No, not right now.

JOBGEN: How come?

BENJAMEN: Because uh, right now, the baby’s living there I think, I don’t really know.

JOBGEN: Because why?

BENJAMEN: I think, I don’t know why, I think because they are babysitting me or something. I think they are.

JOBGEN: They’re babysitting you?

BENJAMEN: I think so because I never seen them for about five days.

JOBGEN: Who’s babysitting?

BENJAMEN: Uh, Kenneth, he’s the dad, I don’t really know who the mom is.

JOBGEN: Yeah? Okay.

BENJAMEN: I think they’re like babysitting me or something.

JOBGEN: So, are you staying at Kenneth’s house?

BENJAMEN: Yeah, pretty much. Kenneth is the dad, but I had a Kenneth who’s a friend too.

JOBGEN: Uh huh. And so he, you think they’re babysitting you?

BENJAMEN: Yeah, but I don’t know what they’re doing, I just think that.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Have you been home at your house lately?

BENJAMEN: Yeah sometimes, but then I had to go back.

JOBGEN: Hmm.

BENJAMEN: I had to go here now. The other house.

JOBGEN: Yeah. So Ben, who brought you here today?

BENJAMEN: Um, the girl who’s out there already with the grey car.

JOBGEN: Yeah. And how come you came here today?

BENJAMEN: Um, I don’t know.

JOBGEN: You don’t know? Okay. Has something been going on at your house or did something happen lately?

BENJAMEN: Yeah, a lot of stuff.

of 65 BENJAMEN: One time we be bad… did I tell you that?

JOBGEN: Huh uh.

BENJAMEN: Sometimes we be bad and stuff. Yeah.

JOBGEN: Sometimes who’s bad?

BENJAMEN: Sometimes all of us say bad words because we get mad a temper and stuff and we… pretty much all of us get mad sometimes.

JOBGEN: And then what happens?

BENJAMEN: We all fight and say it’s their fault, we all say it’s their fault and fight and it’s pretty much all of our faults…

JOBGEN: Uh huh.

BENJAMEN: Because we all been being bad and stuff and having a temper. Yep.

JOBGEN: Yeah. And what happens when you’ve been being bad?

BENJAMEN: Uh, we get in trouble.

JOBGEN: What happens when you get in trouble?

BENJAMEN: We go to the corner or get a spanking… yeah…

JOBGEN: Who gives spankings?

BENJAMEN: Um, pretty much all of us because we pretty much be bad.

JOBGEN: Who gives spankings though?

BENJAMEN: Mother.

JOBGEN: Mother? Tell me about that.

BENJAMEN: Well she’s the mom and she gave Max a spanking because he got in the crackers she bought and it was a brand new box, half of them are gone.

JOBGEN: She gave Max a spanking because…

BENJAMEN: Yeah because he was in the crackers.

JOBGEN: Because he stole some of the crackers?

BENJAMEN: Yeah, half of the box is gone.

JOBGEN: Half the box is gone?

BENJAMEN: And it was a brand new one.

JOBGEN: Tell me about that happening. Tell me about Max. Max is your brother, is that right?

BENJAMEN: Yeah, he got in a car crash.

JOBGEN: He got in a car crash?

of 65 BENJAMEN: Uh huh, he had this huge bump right here and he was bleeding and he needed stitches and it finally grew back.

JOBGEN: Oh.

BENJAMEN: Just like mine, I used to have one of those…

JOBGEN: How did you get one of those?

BENJAMEN: Well, uh, I was running around this table, it was right here and I was running around the table and then I tripped and then bumped to this, you know this side part of the wall, well it’s like uh, this side, and then I bumped my head on there. And I got a humongous bump like this big and it was bleeding. It was a little one.

JOBGEN: So, you were telling me that your brother Max got a spanking… Did you see him get a spanking?

BENJAMEN: Yeah. I looked through the crack of the door a little.

JOBGEN: You looked through the crack of the door. Where were they at when he was getting a spanking?

BENJAMEN: In mother’s room.

JOBGEN: In mother’s room?

BENJAMEN: On the bed.

JOBGEN: On the bed?

BENJAMEN: Yeah. Only mother was giving him a spanking because he was the only one that got in, to the crackers. Cebaschin said that, but I think Joseph did too.

JOBGEN: So what was Max getting a spanking with?

BENJAMEN: Um, a belt.

JOBGEN: A belt?

BENJAMEN: Yeah they didn’t have a board and they didn’t want to use a board because a board hurts more.

JOBGEN: How do you know that? How do you know a board hurts more?

BENJAMEN: Uh, I used it once when our dad lived with us.

JOBGEN: Because your dad used a board once.

BENJAMEN: Yeah. Me and mother found a broken belt. We decided to use it because it’s broken and we decided to use it to get spankings because there’s nothing else you can use it for.

JOBGEN: Okay. So, did you see any marks on your brother Max after he got that spanking?

BENJAMEN: Yeah, pretty much.

of 65 BENJAMEN: Well uh it’s on his front and back (touching tummy side and back) because he had one somewhere on his back because he wouldn’t follow the rule, she told him to lay down on the bed, but he wouldn’t do that because he was crying too hard, so they had to hit him in the back some more and then he finally did it and then he had to do spanking on the butt. Yep, that’s pretty much all.

JOBGEN: Yeah. And do you get spankings with the belt?

BENJAMEN: Um, only when I be bad, but sometimes we don’t really be that bad. Me and Cebaschin and Taler don’t really be that bad sometimes

JOBGEN: Tell me about, um, when you get a spanking with the belt.

BENJAMEN: Um, it kinda hurts, but sometimes we don’t really get spankings pretty much… It hurts a lot though because, uh, our brother Max said so, he can talk. He said it hurt a lot.

JOBGEN: Max said it hurt a lot?

BENJAMEN: Yeah. But I think it hurts a lot.

JOBGEN: Yeah? Hmm.

BENJAMEN: That’s pretty much that. Pretty much that’s all.

JOBGEN: When did that happen, like when did Max get that spanking?

BENJAMEN: About a few weeks ago.

JOBGEN: Hmm. Yeah.

BENJAMEN: Pretty much that.

JOBGEN: Pretty much that?

BENJAMEN: Yeah, that’s pretty much all.

JOBGEN: Anything else been going on at your house?

BENJAMEN: Well, ummm, no, I don’t… Oh yeah there’s that sofa bed but it got ripped up because TC was, uh, jumping on it too much, and it broke.

JOBGEN: TC was jumping on the sofa bed and it broke?

BENJAMEN: Yeah. He was trying to turn of the fan because he was too cool.

JOBGEN: Oh.

BENJAMEN: But now he wants it on, but the bed’s broken so he can’t get it on. He wants to turn it on now. That’s pretty much all.

JOBGEN: Um, does uh, does anybody else get spankings?

BENJAMEN: Yeah, sometimes Clinton never gets spankings but he does be bad, he’s the person that be’s the baddest. He says shut up and he hits us for no reason.

JOBGEN: Who gives him spankings?

BENJAMEN: Nobody. He keeps locking his door.

of 65 JOBGEN: He locks his door?

BENJAMEN: Yeah and mother’s gone at work. So, that’s pretty much all. That’s pretty much all. That’s pretty much all.

JOBGEN: Um, you were telling me that you saw marks on Max and he had some marks here (touching face)… Where did you see marks?

BENJAMEN: Yeah, on his back, on his butt. Well we were giving him a bath because he was dirty.

JOBGEN: Oh. Who was giving him a bath?

BENJAMEN: Me and Cebaschin.

JOBGEN: You and Cebaschin?

BENJAMEN: Yeah, because he was dirty.

JOBGEN: Okay. Okay. And, um, hmm, tell me about um, like where you sleep at your house.

BENJAMEN: Huh?

JOBGEN: Like, where do you sleep at?

BENJAMEN: Like way over there and then up.

JOBGEN: Do you have your own bedroom or do you share…

BENJAMEN: But sometimes I sleep in the garage.

JOBGEN: You sleep in the garage?

BENJAMEN: Sometimes.

JOBGEN: Okay. Like, um, what do you, like on the floor or something else, or… ?

BENJAMEN: Um no I don’t sleep on the floor, I sleep like on the sofa.

JOBGEN: On the sofa in the garage?

BENJAMEN: Mmhmm.

JOBGEN: Yeah? Does anyone else sleep in the garage too?

BENJAMEN: Yeah, let me think, I forgot who sleeps in the garage. There’s two more kids in there but I don’t really keep up so I don’t really remember.

JOBGEN: Yeah.

BENJAMEN: I think we should ask Cebaschin.

JOBGEN: There’s just too many and you can’t keep up?

BENJAMEN: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah, I can understand that.

of 65 BENJAMEN: I’m like… I think I’m done with this.

JOBGEN: You think you’re done with this?

BENJAMEN: Mmhmm. (Throws koosh ball back into box) Seriously, I’m done with this.

JOBGEN: Seriously, you’re done. Can I ask you a couple more questions?

BENJAMEN: No, I mean it I’m done with this. (pointing to ball)

JOBGEN: Oh you’re done with that, okay, do you want a different one?

BENJAMEN: I’m going to try to juggle.

JOBGEN: Um, let’s see, tell me about, um, what your favorite thing to eat is at home.

BENJAMEN: Pretty much, uh, meat.

JOBGEN: Meat?

BENJAMEN: Yeah, Preston, he eats chicken nuggets but, uh, they’re vegetarian chicken nuggets. There’s no chicken in it.

JOBGEN: Who, who’s a vegetarian?

BENJAMEN: Preston.

JOBGEN: Preston? How come he’s a vegetarian?

BENJAMEN: Well, actually, like mother says meat comes from chicken, cows and stuff, and he was so freaked out, he wanted to be a vegetarian and doesn’t want to eat chicken for the rest of his life.

JOBGEN: That makes sense. So, but he eats chicken nuggets, but it’s not real chicken.

BENJAMEN: Yeah, there’s vegetarian tofu in it.

JOBGEN: Oh. So, um, so your favorite thing to eat at home is what? Meat? Like what kind is the meat?

BENJAMEN: Like sometimes sausage and sometimes, I only eat like half a hamburger sometimes.

JOBGEN: You eat half a hamburger?

BENJAMEN: I don’t really like hot dogs though.

JOBGEN: Yeah?

BENJAMEN: And I eat jello, that’s made out of guts and stuff.

JOBGEN: Jello?

BENJAMEN: Yes.

JOBGEN: Is made out of guts.

BENJAMEN: Pretty much, that’s what our mother told us. I think it’s made out of guts, it’s made out of something with chickens or cows or something. That’s what she told me and it was on the computer…

of 65 JOBGEN: Hmm. What does it look like?

BENJAMEN: I don’t know what it looks like, it only said so in the computer. It said it comes from chickens or cows or something like that.

JOBGEN: Hmm.

BENJAMEN: Oh cheese comes from cows and milk comes from cows and I don’t know what else.

JOBGEN: What’s your favorite thing to eat ever?

BENJAMEN: Um, sausage.

JOBGEN: Sausage?

BENJAMEN: Yeah, that’s pretty much it.

JOBGEN: Okay. Hmm. So, like where do you guys keep the food at your house.

BENJAMEN: In the cabinets.

JOBGEN: In the cabinets? Yeah. So, what kind of food do you usually have at your house for if you get hungry.

BENJAMEN: Well, um, pretty much, uh we have hot dogs, like our mom doesn’t really buy that, um, oh yeah and I like pizza too, but our mom never really buys sausage. She never buys sausage. That’s pretty much all I can talk about (throws ball back into box). Oh, I missed. Can you hand that back to me?

JOBGEN: Sure.

BENJAMEN: I’m going to try to throw it in… one… two (throwing balls in bucket).

JOBGEN: Do you think we’re pretty much done talking?

BENJAMEN: Yep.

JOBGEN: Yeah? Hey thanks for coming in and talking to me today.

BENJAMEN: Uh, you’re welcome.

JOBGEN: Should we go tell your brother it’s his turn?

BENJAMEN: Yeah. Which room is he going in, this one?

JOBGEN: No, he wants that other room.

Cebaschin Tomas Barnes, Age 6, DOB: 10/8/1999 Interview with Ginnifer Jobgen at the Children’s Advocacy Center

JOBGEN: Okay. Do you want to hold on to one of these (koosh ball)?

CEBASCHIN: Mmhmm.

JOBGEN: Tell me what your whole name is. Page 43 of 65 CEBASCHIN: Cebaschin Tomas, that’s my middle name, and Barnes, that’s my last name.

JOBGEN: Cebaschin Tomas Barnes. And how old are you Cebaschin?

CEBASCHIN: Six.

JOBGEN: You’re six years old. And do you remember what I said my name was?

CEBASCHIN: Um, no.

JOBGEN: It’s Ginnifer.

CEBASCHIN: Okay.

JOBGEN: Um, my whole name is Ginnifer Lee Jobgen, but you can just call my Ginnifer, okay?

CEBASCHIN: Mmhmm.

JOBGEN: Okay. So, if you’re six Cebaschin, um, do you go to school?

CEBASCHIN: Homeschool.

JOBGEN: You’re homeschooled? Tell me about that.

CEBASCHIN: You have to u, to do, um like books, our notebooks, but now you don’t have to do that anymore, but now you have to do homework on the computer and it takes one hour to get finished and you get one hour for your games and then um, we have another notebook for our mom gived us to do more work.

JOBGEN: To do more work?

CEBASCHIN: Mmhmm.

JOBGEN: Okay.

CEBASCHIN: The other one, that I don’t have to do anymore, is for drawing on.

JOBGEN: So, what grade are you in?

CEBASCHIN: Second grade.

JOBGEN: You’re in second grade?

CEBASCHIN: Mmhmm and I’m about to go to third.

JOBGEN: You’re about to go to third. Okay. So, tell me um, about where you live.

CEBASCHIN: We live in um, Branson.

JOBGEN: You live in Branson?

CEBASCHIN: Mmhmm.

JOBGEN: Who lives with you?

CEBASCHIN: Benj, we have twelve kids, Benj, me, Preston, TC, Taler, Dozen, Joseph, Max, Peter, did I say TC?

of 65 JOBGEN: Mmhmm.

CEBASCHIN: Okay then that’s all.

JOBGEN: Okay. So tell me about living there. Does your mom live there too?

CEBASCHIN: Mmhmm.

JOBGEN: What’s her name?

CEBASCHIN: Mother… Cheryl Barnes.

JOBGEN: Cheryl Barnes?

CEBASCHIN: Yeah. But all the kids call her mother.

JOBGEN: Mother? Okay. So, anyone else live there? Except for you and all your brothers and mom, is there anyone else?

CEBASCHIN: No.

JOBGEN: No? Okay. And, um, tell me about living at your house, what’s that like?

CEBASCHIN: Um, good.

JOBGEN: Good?

CEBASCHIN: Um, when you get through schoolwork for one hour, you get to play for one hour on the games.

JOBGEN: Mmhmm.

CEBASCHIN: And, um, other stuff like that.

JOBGEN: Yeah. So, who brought you here today?

CEBASCHIN: I know it was a cop but just I don’t know her name.

JOBGEN: Is her name Lynn?

CEBASCHIN: I don’t know.

JOBGEN: Yeah. So do you know why you came here Cebaschin?

CEBASCHIN: No.

JOBGEN: No? So, has something been going on at your house or did something happen there lately?

CEBASCHIN: No. No. Nope.

JOBGEN: So, um are you staying at your house right now? Are you living at your house right now?

CEBASCHIN: Am I living at my house right now?

JOBGEN: Yeah.

CEBASCHIN:

of 65 JOBGEN: How come?

CEBASCHIN: Because… I don’t know.

JOBGEN: Where are you living at?

CEBASCHIN: Um, what?

JOBGEN: Where are you living at?

CEBASCHIN: Now, I’m from foster care, and I don’t know where I live now.

JOBGEN: Now you’re at foster care?

CEBASCHIN: Mmhmm.

JOBGEN: What’s the people’s name that you’re at foster care at their house?

CEBASCHIN: I don’t the mom’s name, I just know all the kids names.

JOBGEN: Yeah, what’s their names?

CEBASCHIN: Um, Patrick, don’t know this one anymore, or this one, and me and Peter are from foster care… and I don’t all them, it’s just I only know Patrick.

JOBGEN: Why are you in foster care?

CEBASCHIN: Because the house was… but it’s pretty clean though, the living room, hallway, kitchen, dining room, Preston’s room and um, the laundry room, and that’s really all that’s clean… and then this is all the stuff that wasn’t clean, the bathroom and the other room.

JOBGEN: And it wasn’t clean?

CEBASCHIN: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Tell me about that?

CEBASCHIN: There was trash in the bathroom, like you know like the bathroom was clogged, you know how sometimes the bathroom is clogged with water and stuff in the toilet and stuff?

JOBGEN: Yeah.

CEBASCHIN: That’s how that got dirty. And um, the other room, there was a whole bunch of trash in there, like um, candy wrappers and trash bags and everything, whole bunch of stuff in there, like a whole bunch of toys on the floor and shoes, and Ben’s cards and everything and that’s all.

JOBGEN: Do you have your own room at your house?

CEBASCHIN: Mmhmm.

JOBGEN: Yeah?

CEBASCHIN: Actually, I don’t have my own room, um, me, Taler, and Benj and Max have to share this room, and it has a bottom bed and a top bed and then um Benj sleeps on the top bed with Max, I sleep on the bottom bed with Taler.

of 65 JOBGEN: Mmhmm. I see. Okay. So tell me about what kind of fun things you do at your house.

CEBASCHIN: Jumping on the trampoline, that’s my mostest fun thing.

JOBGEN: It’s what? Doing what?

CEBASCHIN: Jumping on the trampoline, that’s the funnest thing, and um, I go to my friend’s house to play there, they have a slide and stuff… And now my bike has a flat tire now, because when I went to my other friend’s house, he popped it with a knife. And um, hide and seek, hide and seek tag, and… that’s all.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Tell me about like what happens when you get in trouble at your house.

CEBASCHIN: Whenever you get in trouble, you only have to go in the corner. And then when you get in trouble, you get time out, like sitting on the sofa or something.

JOBGEN: Mmhmm.

CEBASCHIN: And, uh, get spankings.

JOBGEN: Get spankings. Yeah. Tell me, uh, who gets spankings?

CEBASCHIN: Really, nobody gets spankings right now, because sometimes no one gets spankings for cleaning the house, most of the time we don’t get spankings. Only one we got spankings, from last time, this one time, the other time, the second time, we went in the corner, time, we got spankings.

JOBGEN: Who did?

CEBASCHIN: Everyone.

JOBGEN: What did you get spankings for?

CEBASCHIN: For our house not being clean. But a lot of other times we didn’t get spankings for not cleaning the house.

JOBGEN: What do you get spankings with?

CEBASCHIN: A belt.

JOBGEN: A belt?

CEBASCHIN: Mmhmm.

JOBGEN: Okay. Where at on your body do you get spankings?

CEBASCHIN: Um, on our butt with our pants on.

JOBGEN: On you’re butt with your pants on?

CEBASCHIN: Mmhmm.

JOBGEN: Um, who’s the last person that got a spanking at your house?

CEBASCHIN: The last one?

JOBGEN: Mmhmm.

CEBASCHIN: Max.

of 65 JOBGEN: Max. Tell me about that.

CEBASCHIN: Maxie has um… This happened with his car, his giant monster truck, when he was driving, when somebody else was driving it, like Taler or somebody was driving it, he hitted Max on the back and Max got a three red scratches. One’s big and two are small. And when Max got spankings, he got, um, three spankings.

JOBGEN: He got what?

CEBASCHIN: Three spankings.

JOBGEN: Three spankings? Yeah. And where was he at when he got these spankings?

CEBASCHIN: Um, when he got a spanking, he had to sit down, when mother got back, it was only a little time, so then Maxie was getting to get up when mother got back and then that’s all.

JOBGEN: Yeah? Where was he at in the house when he got a spanking?

CEBASCHIN: In mother’s room when he had to sit down.

JOBGEN: In mother’s room? Yeah? And what did mother spank him with?

CEBASCHIN: A belt.

JOBGEN: Did you see that happen?

CEBASCHIN: Um, yes when I was going in mother’s room to tell her something.

JOBGEN: Mmhmm. Okay. And you said something about, um, someone driving his truck and hitting him?

CEBASCHIN: Mmhmm.

CEBASCHIN: Um, when Maxie was hurt, someone was driving it so fast, he hitted Max in the back.

JOBGEN: Hmm. Was that when he, um, hurt his head right here (touching forehead), or… ?

CEBASCHIN: No, when he hurt his head, it was a car crash, when Andrew was driving and Clinton… Andrew was driving, Clinton was sitting in the front, Maxie, he was sitting in the middle, he put didn’t his put his belt on, so when um, Maxie taked his belt off, and when Andrew stopped he got crashed by this person coming on the road. It was right here, he had to stitches and go tot the doctor’s.

JOBGEN: He had to get stitches? Yeah? Um, did you see Max after he got the spanking that last time?

CEBASCHIN: Mmhmm.

JOBGEN: Yeah?

CEBASCHIN: Only once though and then um, I didn’t see him any more, only Benj and everyone else did.

JOBGEN: Did he have any like marks on him from… ?

of 65 CEBASCHIN: No.

JOBGEN: No?

CEBASCHIN: Only on his butt when he got a spanking. He had a big red mark.

JOBGEN: On his butt from getting a spanking? Okay. Tell me about baths at your house.

CEBASCHIN: What?

JOBGEN: Taking a bath. Does anyone help you take a bath?

CEBASCHIN: No. Actually, um sometimes, sometimes my brother Clinton has to help and TC… TC has to help the little kids and Preston… TC has to help me… Yeah TC has to help the little kids and Preston has to help me and Clinton has to help Taler and Benjamen, he takes baths just my himself and all big kids take baths by theirselfs.

JOBGEN: Do you ever help anyone take a bath?

CEBASCHIN: Um, only um, Joseph and um, me and Benj helped Joseph and Max last time and me and Benj got Joseph dressed.

JOBGEN: You helped Max and who?

CEBASCHIN: Um, Joseph, and I got Joseph dressed and Benj got Max dressed.

JOBGEN: I see. Okay. And when you helped Max take a bath the last time was it after he got a spanking? Or before? Or do you remember?

CEBASCHIN: That was when he got a big mess from the water.

JOBGEN: He made a big mess from the water?

CEBASCHIN: Yeah. So he had to bath and he got ketchup on him and Joseph got ketchup on him. And then um that’s when they got a bath, and they only got it the other day, a different day, not when Max got a spanking.

JOBGEN: Tell me what’s your favorite thing to eat at your house?

CEBASCHIN: Um, spaghetti, with um, I mean fettucine, it’s called that, um, it’s different sauce it isn’t real sauce, and you put chicken and spaghetti in and that sauce… a different kind of sauce.

JOBGEN: Chicken and spaghetti?

CEBASCHIN: Mmhmm.

JOBGEN: And a different kind of sauce? Is it like red sauce or a different sauce?

CEBASCHIN: Not red sauce…

JOBGEN: Is it white?

CEBASCHIN: Yeah, white sauce.

JOBGEN: Is it like alfredo sauce, is that’s what it’s called?

CEBASCHIN: Mmhmm.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Is that pretty good?

of 65 CEBASCHIN: Mmhmm.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Do you get that at your house a lot?

CEBASCHIN: Not a lot, just um sometimes when we have the sauce for it.

JOBGEN: When you have the sauce for it?

CEBASCHIN: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah?

CEBASCHIN: We have a lot of spaghetti sauce and we only have a little spaghetti.

JOBGEN: Yeah. You have a lot of spaghetti sauce but only a little spaghetti?

CEBASCHIN: Mmhmm.

JOBGEN: Yeah. So, um, who cooks at your house?

CEBASCHIN: Really everybody cooks, except Peter.

JOBGEN: Everybody cooks except Peter?

CEBASCHIN: Yeah, not everybody, only Preston and TC… not Peter because Peter doesn’t know how.

JOBGEN: Oh. Okay. So, like, um, if you’re hungry at your house, what do you usually eat at your house?

CEBASCHIN: Usually, when we wake up, we eat breakfast, I guess we only have to eat, um, we don’t have, we have eggs but not sausage or anything, and also we can have cereal, when we don’t we do that.

JOBGEN: You don’t have what? Soda?

CEBASCHIN: No, cereal… and then so we have to have eggs.

JOBGEN: Yeah. So tell me, um, does your dad live there at your house?

CEBASCHIN: No, he lives somewhere else.

JOBGEN: He lives somewhere else? Okay. Do you see him?

CEBASCHIN: We have um four dads, his name is Henry, JW, Elvis and Andrew.

JOBGEN: You have four dads? Do you see those four dads?

CEBASCHIN: I see them but now I don’t really see Henry.

JOBGEN: You don’t see Henry?

CEBASCHIN: Henry just comes here sometimes.

JOBGEN: And you said JW, do you see him?

CEBASCHIN: I see JW a whole bunch of times because he keeps on brings Max to the movies and everything.

JOBGEN: He keeps on what?

of 65 CEBASCHIN: Brining Max over… taking him places.

JOBGEN: He comes and gets Max?

CEBASCHIN: Yeah and brings him places.

JOBGEN: And brings him to some places? Okay. And how bout um, Elvis, do you see Elvis?

CEBASCHIN: Um, I see Elvis just sometimes.

JOBGEN: Just sometimes. Yeah. Okay.

CEBASCHIN: Because sometimes he has to go to work.

JOBGEN: He has to go where?

CEBASCHIN: To work.

JOBGEN: To work?

CEBASCHIN: Mmhmm.

JOBGEN: Where do you see him at? Where do you see Elvis at?

CEBASCHIN: At my house.

JOBGEN: At your house? Okay. You were telling me about how, um, sometimes you guys get spankings from your mom. Does anyone else give spankings besides your mom?

CEBASCHIN: My mom doesn’t really give spankings. Only everybody gets spankings, except, hold on, everybody gets spankings just sometimes.

JOBGEN: Um, so your mom doesn’t get spankings, is that what you said?

CEBASCHIN: Mmhmm.

JOBGEN: So does anyone else give spankings except for your mom? You said your mom gives spankings sometimes. Do you guys ever get spankings from anyone else too?

CEBASCHIN: No.

JOBGEN: No? Okay. Is um, Cebaschin, is there anything that you’re afraid of, that you’re scared of?

CEBASCHIN: Um, sometimes when people hide from me, and they pop out and yell like this , like that, yeah.

JOBGEN: That makes you scared?

CEBASCHIN: Mmhmm.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Anything else you’re scared of?

CEBASCHIN: Movies. Scary movies.

JOBGEN: Scary movies?

CEBASCHIN: Only some.

of 65 JOBGEN: Yeah. What kind of scary movies have you seen?

CEBASCHIN: I seen um, this one, this one scary movie, um this girl, somebody killed him and his eye, it’s a play eye, and his eyeball’s out and then he’s still alive and he went in one of those cars like this, and he um, kills people, and then the person at end, he killed him cuz now he was killing everybody, and there’s a kid that kills everybody.

JOBGEN: Wow.

CEBASCHIN: And I’m scared of this one, this one is a zombie movie, alright there’s one zombie and he bites people.

JOBGEN: He’s a zombie?

CEBASCHIN: Yeah and like there’s an army of people that’s a zombie now and the only reason they’re doing that is to get the President because the President steals all of their money.

JOBGEN: Wow.

CEBASCHIN: And that’s why the President’s going to leave. And but uh, they already killed the President.

JOBGEN: They already killed them?

CEBASCHIN: Yeah. And then um, all the other people that didn’t be a zombie, they saw them and leaved.

JOBGEN: The people that weren’t zombies saw those zombies and left?

CEBASCHIN: Yeah, only the one saw one zombie and leaved and then um really all them were leaving and all the people left.

JOBGEN: Hmm. What happened at the end?

CEBASCHIN: At the end? That was the end.

JOBGEN: What happened?

CEBASCHIN: That was the end.

JOBGEN: That was the end? Yeah. Oh. Hmm. So, let’s see, have any of those dads ever lived in your house Cebaschin that you’ve told me about?

CEBASCHIN: No.

JOBGEN: No? Okay. Is there anything else you want to talk about today?

CEBASCHIN: Nope.

JOBGEN: Anything that you want to tell me that’s been going on or anything?

CEBASCHIN: Um, um, like no.

JOBGEN: No? Are you sure?

CEBASCHIN: Mmhmm.

of 65 JOBGEN: Okay. Thanks for coming in and talking to me? Yeah. So, where did you see that zombie movie at?

CEBASCHIN: From Andrew. Andrew keeps on getting a whole bunch of movies.

JOBGEN: And who’s Andrew?

CEBASCHIN: He um, lives in the house.

JOBGEN: Oh, he lives in the house. And was he um, one of your dads?

CEBASCHIN: Mmhmm.

JOBGEN: Oh okay. Okay. And he um, got some zombie movies?

CEBASCHIN: Some. Some were different.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Were all those movies scary?

CEBASCHIN: Not all of them. Some were just about other things.

JOBGEN: They were about other things? Like what were the other things about?

CEBASCHIN: Just this one was about, um, um, I don’t really know anymore, the movies anymore.

JOBGEN: You don’t know anymore of the movies anymore? Um, do you think zombies are real?

CEBASCHIN: No.

JOBGEN: Yeah, probably not. Okay. Well I think I’m running out of questions.

CEBASCHIN: This is the only how to make a zombie real. You have to get a whole bunch of like cups of acid and dump it on a person and keep on getting more and then he will turn to a zombie.

JOBGEN: Is that what happened on the movie?

CEBASCHIN: That’s what I heard on the movie from the people.

JOBGEN: Oh. Um.

CEBASCHIN: And all the people will get dead on this one, all the people are dead.

JOBGEN: Really?

CEBASCHIN: All the people are dead except two people.

JOBGEN: Except two people?

CEBASCHIN: On this zombie movie, this one’s different. And um, how they um, killed the rest of the people with a dynamite, a giant dynamite, and just they didn’t kill all of them, there was one left and then um, there’s yeah, that’s all.

JOBGEN: Okay, I think I’m done.

CEBASCHIN: And the only how to make the zombies know that you are a zombie, but you’re a person, is your rub some blood on your eyes and everything, they think you’re a zombie.

of 65 JOBGEN: Yeah? That sounds like a crazy movie Cebaschin. Thanks for coming in and talking to me. Are you to go out there?

Taler Corbin Barnes, Age 9, DOB: 3/13/1997 Interview with Ginnifer Jobgen at the Children’s Advocacy Center

JOBGEN: Can you check things out? Do you want to have a seat on this bean bag?

TALER: Sure.

JOBGEN: Okay. There we go. Okay. Is that comfortable?

TALER: Yep.

JOBGEN: You want to hold on to this (koosh ball)?

TALER: What is it?

JOBGEN: It’s a koosh ball. Doesn’t that feel pretty cool?

TALER: Yes.

JOBGEN: Yeah.

TALER: I have one of these but it’s missing it’s things off of it.

JOBGEN: Oh yeah? Tell me what your whole name is.

TALER: Barnes, Taler, I don’t know what my middle name is.

JOBGEN: Yeah. So what do you go by? What do people call you?

TALER: Taler.

JOBGEN: Taler?

TALER: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah? Did I tell you what my name was?

TALER: Uh, no.

JOBGEN: Ginnifer.

TALER: Ginnifer?

JOBGEN: Yeah. You can just call me Ginnifer, okay?

TALER: Okay.

JOBGEN: Is that cool?

TALER: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Okay. Taler, how old are you?

of 65 TALER: Nine.

JOBGEN: You’re nine years old. Do you go to school?

TALER: No.

JOBGEN: No?

TALER: Homeschool.

JOBGEN: You’re homeschooled. Tell me about being homeschooled. What’s that like?

TALER: School, we do schoolwork and when we’re done with that schoolwork, we make lunch and then, do schoolwork again until seven, and then we have supper and then we don’t do schoolwork anymore. And we have to wake up at seven.

JOBGEN: You have to wake up at seven?

TALER: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Do you have like a teacher that helps you do schoolwork?

TALER: No. Well, we don’t have to do schoolwork because we’re at a different house and they don’t got anything like flash cards.

JOBGEN: You don’t have anything like flash cards?

TALER: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah?

TALER: We only have those at home.

JOBGEN: Oh, okay. So, who helps you learn, like when you do schoolwork?

TALER: Um, Flavia, he helped us learn until he got an job, now Clinton helps us and Preston and TC.

JOBGEN: Okay. Preston and TC?

TALER: And Clinton.

JOBGEN: Clinton? Yeah. Okay.

TALER: He’s the meanest.

JOBGEN: He’s what?

TALER: The meanest. He always makes us do our chores and stuff.

JOBGEN: Oh, he makes you do your chores? Okay.

TALER: He always slaps us and once he gave us spankings with a belt.

JOBGEN: Who is he? Who’s Clinton? Clinton, is that it?

TALER: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Who is he?

of 65 TALER: He, he’s at home, he’s at home and he always, when he wakes up, he always makes us do our chores.

JOBGEN: Is he your…?

TALER: Brother.

JOBGEN: Brother. Okay. I got it. So, um, let’s see, who all do you live with, like… ?

TALER: Preston, TC and… Preston, TC, Benj, Cebaschin, and Max, Joseph, Mother, Dozen and Paul, I mean Clinton…

JOBGEN: Yeah?

TALER: And that’s it. And then there’s our father…

JOBGEN: Huh?

TALER: Our father, our dad.

JOBGEN: Your dad, what’s his name?

TALER: Um, I don’t know, his name’s Elvis and I don’t know what’s his last name or his middle name.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Does Elvis live there with you?

TALER: No. He lives in a different house and he visits us, when he don’t have, when he has a day off of work.

JOBGEN: He lives in a different house but he visits you when he had a day off of work?

TALER: Mmhmm. Yeah, and he takes us somewhere like to the lake or the park.

JOBGEN: Okay, and does your mom live there at your house?

TALER: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah? And what’s her name?

TALER: His last name’s Barnes and his first name’s Mother. Our mother.

JOBGEN: Okay. Okay. So, are you living there at your house right now?

TALER: No, we’re at a different house.

JOBGEN: Huh?

TALER: We’re at a different place. And Ben and Cebaschin’s at a different place and Mother, and me, Max Preston and TC are at a different place.

JOBGEN: How come you’re at a different place?

TALER: Um, I don’t know.

JOBGEN: Yeah. So, who are you living with right now?

TALER: Um, these girls, these girls have a job and we live at this one home, it has about a thousand rooms of beds and a bathroom, two bathrooms, and I don’t know where were living at.

of 65 JOBGEN: Yeah? Do you know what those people’s names are?

TALER: No.

JOBGEN: No?

TALER: I know some, Jan, Russell, and, and Brian, that’s it.

JOBGEN: Are any of your brothers there with you?

TALER: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Who?

TALER: Preston, TC, Max. Only Preston, TC, Max.

JOBGEN: Okay. So, how come you’re not living with your mom at your house?

TALER: Actually our mother’s at our house, she’s at a different house and it’s a clean house, it looks like the same house we got.

JOBGEN: It looks like the same house you’re at?

TALER: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Who’s there?

TALER: Preston and TC, Max. And Max.

JOBGEN: Okay. So, let’s see, um, has something been going on at your house? Or has something happened? Or?

TALER: Something been going on.

JOBGEN: Yeah? What’s been going on?

TALER: We been making holes in the wall and we, people, Preston has been hurting us.

JOBGEN: Preston has been hurting you?

TALER: He hurt us and we don’t do nothing to him, he just hurt us.

JOBGEN: What’s he do to hurt you?

TALER: We don’t do nothing, we didn’t do nothing. I don’t know.

JOBGEN: What did he do to you?

TALER: He always punch people and then, and that’s it. He always punch people and pull their hair. He always punch people, that’s it.

JOBGEN: Where did Preston punch you at?

TALER: He punched us on the arm, on the back sometimes.

JOBGEN: And Preston’s your brother?

TALER: Yeah.

of 65 JOBGEN: Yeah. Who else did he punch other than you?

TALER: Everybody, he punches everybody except Clinton.

JOBGEN: Everybody except…

TALER: He’s the oldest.

JOBGEN: Clinton?

TALER: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah? Okay. And does your mom know that Preston does that?

TALER: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah? What does she do?

TALER: He do’s nothing.

JOBGEN: Yeah.

TALER: Just do’s nothing.

JOBGEN: Does anybody else… Does, um…

TALER: No.

JOBGEN: Does anybody else at your house hit like that?

TALER: Um, yeah, the oldest, he always hit us when we don’t do our jobs, when our jobs are not done.

JOBGEN: Clinton does?

TALER: Mmhmm.

JOBGEN: What does he hit you with?

TALER: Once he gave us spankings, hit us with their hands, his hands, that’s it.

JOBGEN: He gives spankings with his hands?

TALER: He slap us and pull our hairs sometimes.

JOBGEN: Does anyone else give spankings?

TALER: Once all of us got spankings from Clinton.

JOBGEN: From Clinton?

TALER: Yeah, Peter got a spanking, Preston got a spanking, TC, and me.

JOBGEN: What does Clinton…

TALER: And Peter and Cebaschin.

JOBGEN: What does Clinton give spankings with?

TALER: He don’t get no spankings. Mother do’s nothing about it. Nothing.

of 65 JOBGEN: Does mom give spankings?

TALER: Our mom did give us spankings once, everybody except Peter.

JOBGEN: Everybody except Peter?

TALER: And Clinton.

JOBGEN: What does mom give spankings with?

TALER: The belt.

JOBGEN: With a belt?

TALER: But she doesn’t give spankings with a belt.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Where did you, um, like where at on our body do you get spankings with a belt?

TALER: On the butt.

JOBGEN: On your butt?

TALER: Sometimes on our leg, sometimes on our back, because they miss sometimes.

JOBGEN: Sometimes on your leg, sometimes on your back? What’s that feel like?

TALER: Hurts, really bad.

JOBGEN: Yeah?

TALER: And our butt gets red.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Hmm. Who was the last person that got a spanking at your house?

TALER: Um, Max.

JOBGEN: Max. Tell me about that.

TALER: He got a whole bunch of spankings and he had a big cut on his back.

JOBGEN: Mmhmm.

TALER: Um, his butt was really red but then I don’t know how many spankings he got.

JOBGEN: Mmhmm. Who’d he get a spanking from?

TALER: From mother, he got a spanking from a belt.

JOBGEN: From a belt?

TALER: Mmhmm.

JOBGEN: How come?

TALER: For eating his crackers that mother said no one’s not allowed to eat.

JOBGEN: He got some crackers that you’re not allowed to eat?

of 65 TALER: Yeah, it’s only for her because the baby in his tummy is trying, if he don’t eat those crackers, he will throw up.

JOBGEN: The baby in your mom’s tummy, you said?

TALER: Yeah, he throw up, mother…

JOBGEN: Oh. Okay. How do you know Max got a spanking?

TALER: Cuz I heard it and none of us was in mother’s room.

JOBGEN: Who was in mother’s room?

TALER: Nobody, nobody, only our mom, only our mom. And…

JOBGEN: Your mom? Where was Max?

TALER: On the bed… and he had to do this, put his head down. Since he put his head up too much, that’s how he got a spanking, a lot of spankings.

JOBGEN: Yeah? And then what happened?

TALER: And then he had to sit down, til mother, till he got back, then he could get up. That’s it.

JOBGEN: Yeah? Did you see that happen? Did you see?

TALER: No, I just heard the sounds.

JOBGEN: Okay, what did you hear?

TALER: Like (slapping backside of leg three times). And Max was crying.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Okay. Okay. And did, did you, you said that Max had to sit there til your mom got back?

TALER: Mmhmm.

JOBGEN: Where did she go?

TALER: To the store to buy only a little stuff.

JOBGEN: Yeah?

TALER: And then, he get to get up.

JOBGEN: Yeah? Did he get up?

TALER: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah. What happened then?

TALER: He gotted up, he got up but when our mom was gone, and nobody said tell her, because we didn’t want Max to sit down again, for more time.

JOBGEN: None of you told your mom?

TALER: Yeah.

of 65 JOBGEN: Yeah. Yeah. Did he get in trouble for getting up?

TALER: No, nobody, mother didn’t no.

JOBGEN: Okay.

TALER: And that’s all the things. That’s all the I think.

JOBGEN: Huh?

TALER: There’s nothing else I need to say.

JOBGEN: Oh, there’s nothing else you need to say?

TALER: Yeah. But I got, I got a blind eye, I got a blind eye, abd when I was a baby I got a blind eye, and these people, were killing me, were climbing up the wall, they dropped me, that’s how I got a blind eye.

JOBGEN: That’s how you got a blind eye?

TALER: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah? So tell me about, you were telling me about your dad, Elvis, do you get to see him very much?

TALER: No, because he don’t get a day off at work sometimes, sometimes he has to work a lot.

JOBGEN: Yeah?

TALER: And he gets home at dark time.

JOBGEN: Does he live at your house?

TALER: No.

JOBGEN: No? Okay. Um, let’s see, you were telling me about…

TALER: Mother and dad got, my mom and dad got married, til um, til they didn’t. And what else? What do you want to tell?

JOBGEN: Huh?

TALER: What do you want to say?

JOBGEN: U, let me think for a minute, okay? Um, you were telling me about how your brother gives spankings sometimes and your mom. Does your dad ever give spankings?

TALER: Um, no, he gave spankings to Ben once and he got, he has this stick, it has nails in.

JOBGEN: He has a stake?

TALER: Stick.

JOBGEN: A stick.

TALER: It has nails in.

JOBGEN: It has nails in it?

of 65 TALER: Yes. When he give Ben spankings, he was bleeding.

JOBGEN: He gave Ben spankings…

TALER: Only Benjamen, that’s it.

JOBGEN: And Ben was bleeding?

TALER: Yeah. I didn’t know he was bleeding.

JOBGEN: Yeah. How do you know that that happened?

TALER: He, because um, I heard it with sounds and his shoes wasn’t on.

JOBGEN: Hmm. Okay. Does mom know that? About that happening to Ben?

TALER: Hmm Mmm (no), mother was gone.

JOBGEN: Mom was gone?

TALER: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Tell me, um, what’s your favorite thing to eat?

TALER: Spaghetti.

JOBGEN: Spaghetti?

TALER: Spaghetti, broccoli, potatoes.

JOBGEN: Yeah?

TALER: And, um, and pizza… sausage pizza.

JOBGEN: Sausage pizza?

TALER: Yep.

JOBGEN: What do eat at home?

TALER: At home? Nothing. Mostly nothing, because our brothers won’t make nothing.

JOBGEN: You’re brother makes nothing?

TALER: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah?

TALER: None of them did.

JOBGEN: Like when you’re hungry at home, what do you get to eat?

TALER: Well we ask our mother, can we have a sandwich, sometimes he say yes, sometimes he say no, like a hot pocket or a sandwich or ramen noodles. That’s my favorite thing to eat, ramen noodles.

JOBGEN: You eat noodles?

TALER: Ramen noodles.

of 65 JOBGEN: Ramen noodles?

TALER: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah? Do you like those?

TALER: Yeah I like beef, chicken, there’s more ramen noodles then that.

JOBGEN: Yeah.

TALER: That’s all the things I like.

JOBGEN: Tell me, um, do you have your own bedroom?

TALER: Yeah.

JOBGEN: Yeah? Where do you sleep at?

TALER: In the garage.

JOBGEN: In the garage?

TALER: Yeah it got into a room now.

JOBGEN: Huh?

TALER: It got into a room. But Ben and Cebaschin sleeps in there with me too, they have their own bed, it’s a three way bed…

Uh huh.

And I have my own… and Max sleeps in there too, until Preston got his bed out and put it in his room.

JOBGEN: In the garage with you?

TALER: Preston’s… Max moved in to Preston’s room.

JOBGEN: Yeah. Do you have an air conditioner in out there?

TALER:

JOBGEN: No.

TALER: We have an air conditioner in the dining room.

JOBGEN: Okay. What do you sleep on in the garage?

TALER: My… a bed.

JOBGEN: A bed. Okay. Okay. Do you have like sheets and blankets and stuff on your bed?

TALER: No, we have no sheets and no blankets.

JOBGEN: Okay.

TALER: Because nobody don’t wash some or pillow.

JOBGEN: Hmm. Okay.

of 65 TALER: Anything else?

JOBGEN: You were telling me earlier that Max…

TALER: Got spankings.

JOBGEN: Huh?

TALER: Got spankings.

JOBGEN: Yeah. And you said it was really red. How do you know it was red.

TALER: I don’t know it was red. I think it was red, but I don’t know it was red.

JOBGEN: Okay.

TALER: But when we get spankings, really spankings make us really, really red, like it’s been bleeding, it’s bleeding.

JOBGEN: Okay. Okay. Did your mom ever say anything to you about telling anybody about that? About people getting spankings at your house?

TALER: Um, no. Well Peter did, he did.

JOBGEN: Peter? What did he say?

TALER: I don’t know what he say. Cuz I don’t know what he say.

JOBGEN: Okay. Well, let me think for a minute okay, cuz I know I’ve asked you a lot of questions but I need to think. And you think and you see if you have any questions for me, okay?

TALER: Okay.

JOBGEN: Did you have any questions for me?

TALER: Nope.

JOBGEN: None at all?

TALER: Not… I’m still thinking.

JOBGEN: You’re still thinking. Okay. … You got anything?

TALER: No.

JOBGEN: No. Do you have anything else you want to talk about today?

TALER: No.

JOBGEN: No. Okay. Well thanks for coming in and talking to me. Do you want to go back out there?

TALER: Sure.

of 65 CERTIFICATE OF SERVICE

I hereby certify that on September 7, 2006 a copy of the above and foregoing “Transcripts of Forensic Child Interviews” was served upon the following parties via facsimile or first class mail:

William Duston Eric Eighmy Attorney for Juvenile Office Guardian ad Litem PO Box 482 274 Wintergreen Rd Forsyth, MO 65653 Branson, MO 65616 Fax: (417) 334-8165 Fax: (417) 339-2677

Monica Whitt David Taylor Attorney for Children’s Division Attorney for Eugene Barnes Division of Legal Services 110 Wintergreen Rd 149 Park Central Square, Room 925 Branson, MO 65616 Springfield, MO 65806 Fax: (417) 895-6309

Respectfully Submitted,

______Cheryl Barnes, Mother 657 Taneycomo Rd PO Box 6521 Branson, MO 65615 [email protected] (417) 334-2405