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Vol. 741 Thursday No. 80 6 December 2012 PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES (HANSARD) HOUSE OF LORDS OFFICIAL REPORT ORDER OF BUSINESS Questions UK-Israel Life Sciences Council Department of Health: Budget NHS: Hospital Services NHS: Hospital Beds Police (Complaints and Conduct) Bill First Reading Business of the House Timing of Debates Scotland Act 1998 (Modification of Schedule 5) (No. 2) Order 2013 Public Bodies (Water Supply and Water Quality Fees) Order 2012 Motions to Refer to Grand Committee Foreign Affairs: Global Role, Emerging Powers and New Markets Motion to Take Note Ugandan Asians Motion to Take Note Economy: Growth Question for Short Debate Written Statements Written Answers For column numbers see back page £3·50 Lords wishing to be supplied with these Daily Reports should give notice to this effect to the Printed Paper Office. The bound volumes also will be sent to those Peers who similarly notify their wish to receive them. No proofs of Daily Reports are provided. 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All prices are inclusive of postage. © Parliamentary Copyright House of Lords 2012, this publication may be reproduced under the terms of the Open Parliament licence, which is published at www.parliament.uk/site-information/copyright/. 747 UK-Israel Life Sciences Council[6 DECEMBER 2012] UK-Israel Life Sciences Council 748 we feel it is necessary, but we also enjoy a close and House of Lords productive relationship with Israel. It is this very relationship that allows us to have the frank discussions Thursday, 6 December 2012. that are often necessary between friends. We believe that imposing boycotts would lessen that influence, 11 am not increase it. Prayers—read by the Lord Bishop of Guildford. Lord Palmer of Childs Hill: My Lords, does my noble friend the Minister agree that joint business initiatives between Palestinians and Israelis could play UK-Israel Life Sciences Council a valuable role in encouraging diplomatic engagement Question between both peoples? What role does the Minister consider that the Government can play in supporting 11.07 am such efforts, very much within what the noble Baroness, Asked By Baroness Deech Lady Deech, has said about the UK-Israel Life Sciences Council’s work? To ask Her Majesty’s Government what assessment they have made of the UK-Israel Life Sciences Baroness Warsi: As the noble Lord will be aware, Council. the UK-Israel Life Sciences Council is a group of top scientists from both countries and includes Members The Senior Minister of State, Department for of your Lordships’ House as well as, I think, four Communities and Local Government & Foreign and Nobel Prize winners. I think that all noble Lords Commonwealth Office (Baroness Warsi): My Lords, would agree that we are at a very delicate stage in the the UK-Israel Life Sciences Council is an excellent Middle East peace process. As I have said from this example of the opportunities for successful collaboration Dispatch Box on many occasions in the past few between our two countries. Since its launch in 2011, weeks, 2013 will be a critical year. It is therefore funding has been raised for five major research projects important that we use whatever avenues we have to in regenerative medicine as part of the British-Israel strengthen those diplomatic relations to achieve a research and academic exchange programme. peaceful resolution to a two-state solution in the Middle East. Baroness Deech: I welcome the Minister’s reply. She is aware, I imagine, that this work could produce great Lord Hannay of Chiswick: My Lords, does the advances in stem cell and regenerative medicine, which Minister accept that I would have no difficulty in may make a major difference in the treatment of answering my noble friend’s Question? I oppose diabetes, Parkinson’s and multiple sclerosis. Does she fundamentally any boycotting of co-operation between therefore agree that this sort of work, and the search academics and researchers in this country and those in for cures, should rise above politics? Will she condemn Israel. However, does she not also agree that when the the politicisation of academic exchange—for example, Government of Israel pay absolutely no respect to the boycotts of scientific work—which could have so much views of the British Government on crucial issues of potential for cures in this country? international policy, such as the legality of settlements, that is bound to have an effect on government-to- government relations, even if it should not have an Baroness Warsi: My Lords, regenerative medicine, effect on co-operation between scientists and academics? such as stem cell treatments, has the potential to play an increasingly vital role in delivering the next generation Baroness Warsi: I am a firm believer that when of healthcare, offering treatments or possible cures for matters are most difficult to discuss, that is the time to areas of unmet medical need. Where there are areas of strengthen relationships further. We have never managed expertise, both in this country and in Israel—or in any to resolve any matter by walking away from relationships. other country around the world—it is important for It is because we have strong relationships with Israel that collaborative work to continue. When we are on a variety of issues that we can be so robust in our collaborating with countries that we consider to be engagement. I hope noble Lords will agree that we friends and there are disagreements, we still have those have been robust in that engagement in the past week. discussions, for it is important that this work continues. Noble Lords will be aware that on Monday the Israeli ambassador was called in by the Minister for the Lord Anderson of Swansea: My Lords, does not the Middle East to express our grave concerns about pre-eminence of Israel in this and so many other illegal settlements and the comments made by the fields, and also the academic freedom enjoyed by Israeli Government. universities in Israel, make nonsense of any attempts by our academics to boycott their counterparts in Lord Turnberg: My Lords, the medical field is a rich Israel? Will the Minister, as the noble Baroness suggested, source of interaction not only between the UK and roundly condemn any such attempts at a boycott? Israel but also, and perhaps more importantly, between Israel and the Palestinians. When I go round hospitals Baroness Warsi: My Lords, the UK Government in Israel I see many Palestinian patients from both have made their position on boycotts clear. We do not Gaza and the West Bank. Is the Minister aware of hesitate to express disagreement with Israel whenever this? 749 UK-Israel Life Sciences Council[LORDS] Department of Health: Budget 750 Baroness Warsi: It is not something that I am Lord Hunt of Kings Heath: My Lords, in asking the directly aware of, but I am grateful for the noble Question standing in my name on the Order Paper, I Lord’s information. remind the House of my health interests. Lord Howarth of Newport: If academic effort ought The Parliamentary Under-Secretary of State, Department to be collaborative across international frontiers, and of Health (Earl Howe): My Lords, the department that is surely right, why do Education Ministers so underspent against its budget by 1.7% in 2010-11 and frequently speak of British universities being in by 1.3% in 2011-12, or by 1.5% combined across the competition with universities elsewhere in the world? two years. Baroness Warsi: I am sure that noble Lords will Lord Hunt of Kings Heath: My Lords, I think that agree that British universities are some of the best in is about £3 billion; perhaps the noble Earl will confirm the world. We therefore have to praise our competitiveness that. This Government promised to protect the NHS and competitive edge. Whenever I and my ministerial and to cut the deficit. In fact, they are cutting the NHS colleagues are in places around the world we say that and the deficit is rising. How can the department we are in direct competition with other academic justify handing back so much money to the Treasury institutions, because we are trying to encourage citizens when large parts of the NHS are under great financial of those countries to choose Britain as a destination pressure at the moment? for study. Lord Kilclooney: My Lords, the Minister said that Earl Howe: My Lords, the deficit is not rising. the Israeli ambassador was called in to the Foreign The Government are putting £12.5 billion extra into Office about the seizure of Palestinian land by Israel. the NHS over the course of the spending review. The What was his response? noble Lord, Lord Hunt, will know from his ministerial experience that government departments have an absolute requirement to manage expenditure within the financial Baroness Warsi: My Lords, that is probably slightly controls that are set by Her Majesty’s Treasury and beyond the Question on the Order Paper.