Monday Volume 573 13 January 2014 No. 102 HOUSE OF COMMONS OFFICIAL REPORT PARLIAMENTARY DEBATES (HANSARD) Monday 13 January 2014 £5·00 © Parliamentary Copyright House of Commons 2014 This publication may be reproduced under the terms of the Open Parliament licence, which is published at www.parliament.uk/site-information/copyright/. 561 13 JANUARY 2014 562 scheme right to help people get back into work and to House of Commons help those who cannot get back into work through the benefits system. Monday 13 January 2014 Helen Jones (Warrington North) (Lab): As the Court of Appeal recently threw out the Government’s appeal The House met at half-past Two o’clock against the decision that the work capability assessment disadvantages those with long-term mental health problems PRAYERS and learning disabilities such as autism, will the Minister accept that the test is simply not designed to deal with such people? What will he do about that? [MR SPEAKER in the Chair] Mike Penning: The Harrington report referred to that matter specifically. Ensuring that people with hidden disabilities get all the help we can give them is is close to Oral Answers to Questions my heart, but the Harrington pilot is on hold because of the judicial review. WORK AND PENSIONS Mr David Heath (Somerton and Frome) (LD): In my part of the world, the work capability assessment and the personal independence payment are administered The Secretary of State was asked— by Atos. When my constituents finally get an assessment, they find an organisation that is as insensitive as it is Work Capability Assessment incompetent. Would not the best way of improving the work capability assessment be to remove the incapable 1. Ian Mearns (Gateshead) (Lab): What plans he has Atos? to improve the work capability assessment. [901893] Mike Penning: We inherited the contract with Atos as The Minister of State, Department for Work and Pensions the company running the WCA. We were not happy (Mike Penning): We remain committed to reviewing with the quality of its work, which is why we brought in continually and further improving the assessment. measures. We accept that that is causing delays to the Dr Litchfield’s independent review was published in system, but it is better to have the necessary quality December, and the Government will publish their response than to get it wrong. in the first quarter of this year. Ian Mearns: It has come to my attention through Mr Dennis Skinner (Bolsover) (Lab): How many people research conducted by several disability campaign groups have to lose their appeal after 12 months of trying to get that as many as four people a day are dying within six justice done? How many more people—including the weeks of being declared fit for work under the Department’s four a day referred to by my hon. Friend the Member work capability assessment. Will the Secretary of State for Gateshead (Ian Mearns)—have to die before they reflect on those figures? When he finds them to be true, get an appeal? Surely it is time for even this insensitive as they are based on his Department’s data, will he Government to understand that Atos is not fit for come back to the House and apologise to the families of purpose and should be abandoned, and that we should the deceased, who suffered unnecessarily in their last start all over again. precious days? We can recuperate benefits that are awarded incorrectly, but we cannot recuperate a person’s Mike Penning: I am sure that the hon. Gentleman life. said that all the way through to his own Government when they brought in Atos. What the Opposition put in Mike Penning: Our thoughts and prayers are with the place when they were in government was a complete people and families who have lost their loved ones. mess. We are determined to get it right. We are listening There is a system in place for people with life-threatening to why the tribunal judges make their decisions so that illnesses, and particularly for those who are likely to die. we get the decisions right earlier on. As I said to the Work and Pensions Committee, the Chairman of which is in the Chamber, we are trying to Sarah Newton (Truro and Falmouth) (Con): Will my get the decision making down to seven days, which we hon. Friend confirm that that the Department has would all welcome. service level agreements with Atos and Capita that include claimant satisfaction and timeliness? Sir Tony Baldry (Banbury) (Con): Am I right in thinking that we spend more than £13 billion on sickness Mike Penning: Yes, we do. There is a financial penalty and incapacity benefit for almost 2.5 million people of regime that I have every intention of implementing. working age? Is it not right to ensure that the support goes to those who need it most? Personal Independence Payments Mike Penning: I completely agree with my right hon. Friend. Of course, the scheme was brought in by the 2. John Robertson (Glasgow North West) (Lab): How previous Administration—the Opposition have selective many claimants have received the personal independence memory loss about that. We are determined to get the payment since April 2013. [901894] 563 Oral Answers13 JANUARY 2014 Oral Answers 564 The Minister of State, Department for Work and Pensions I have received letters in writing from the DWP saying (Mike Penning): The Department intends to publish that it cannot speed it up. What can the DWP do to official statistics in the spring. In the meantime, we are speed up the process? looking to see whether we can publish interim information as soon as it becomes available. Mike Penning: That would depend on where the claim is within the system and whether it is with Capita, John Robertson: I thank the Minister for that answer, Atos or DWP.I will look into the individual complaints. which is good news for a lot of people. He will appreciate Perhaps the hon. Gentleman would like to come and see that a lot of people are suffering while Capita takes so me and I will make sure we get on with it. long to get that information out; they have the anxiety of not knowing whether their appeals, or even their Discretionary Housing Payments applications for assessment, have been agreed. What kind of monitoring of Capita is he doing, and does it 3. Bill Wiggin (North Herefordshire) (Con): What have enough people to do the job? assessment he has made of recent trends in the award of discretionary housing payments. [901895] Mike Penning: We are monitoring the work of both Capita and Atos, and we will have the figures as soon as 9. Chris Heaton-Harris (Daventry) (Con): What we can. Under the previous Administration’s scheme, assessment he has made of recent trends in the award fewer than 6% of people claiming this or a similar of discretionary housing payments. [901901] benefit were ever assessed. It must be right and proper that there is not self-assessment; it is done by the 13. Dr Thérèse Coffey (Suffolk Coastal) (Con): What experts. assessment he has made of recent trends in the award Mrs Anne Main (St Albans) (Con): Will the Minister of discretionary housing payments. [901905] look into the fact that personal independence payments seem to get stuck in the system and are not passed on to The Secretary of State for Work and Pensions (Mr Iain the Department for Work and Pensions? My constituent Duncan Smith): Figures published in December show waited three months for an assessment. Three more that in the first half of the financial year 2013-14 the months later, it is still stuck in the system. The Department average committed spend by local authorities was wants to sort it out. What more can he do to ensure that 40% of their allocated budget. Against those who had they liaise with each other? said that they were overspending, in fact it turns out that the vast majority are not. Mike Penning: The Department’s officials and the contractors, Atos and Capita, are working closely every Bill Wiggin: Will the Secretary of State explain the single day. We need to ensure that we get the decisions particular circumstances for people who have been on right. In such situations as the one brought to the housing benefit constantly since 1996 in relation to House’s attention by my hon. Friend, we will work discretionary housing payments? closely. If my hon. Friend contacts me later, we will look exactly at that point. Mr Duncan Smith: Yes, this is a narrow but complicated area dating back to 1996 with the introduction of local Dame Anne Begg (Aberdeen South) (Lab): When the reference rent rules. They were intended to offer transitional Minister appeared in front of the Select Committee, he protection at that time for existing claimants, but they admitted that there had been very long delays in getting were not in any way time limited. There was another PIP assessment determinations. People had applied in opportunity, in 2008, to change the regulations when the summer and still did not have a determination by the previous Government brought in local housing December. We are a month further on and they still allowance. They were not adjusted then. This protection have not yet heard anything. I am now receiving e-mails had been dormant for 17 years and not used. This is a from people across the whole country, as well as from complex area that we are now resolving, but I have to my own constituents, who have been waiting for more say that in three different Governments it has missed than six months since they had their face-to-face assessment.