South Asian Oral History Project Phase IV, 2018-19 University of Washington Libraries

Srivani Jade Interview Transcript

Deepa Banerjee: I am Deepa Banerjee. I am the South Asian Studies librarian at the University of Washington. Today is twenty sixth February two thousand and eighteen, I am interviewing Srivani Jade as a part of the South Asian Oral History Project. Srivani ji do you consent to interview today? Srivani Jade: Yes, absolutely. DB: So, I would start with the question of, the very common question, tell me a little bit about yourself. SJ: Ah, about myself, I am mostly for the most part a musician, I teach, I compose. What else? I serve in residencies as an artist where people can come and observe and listen and learn from, but mostly what I do is practice solo. So, that’s what a musician’s life is like. DB: Yeah, how long have you been here in the Pacific Northwest? SJ: I have been in the Pacific Northwest, specifically in the greater Seattle area, for about twenty years now. I have been doing music full time for ten years. DB: When and where you were born? And, also if you could talk a little about your childhood, your schooling. And, what made you pursue your art? SJ: This is my favorite question. So, I was born in 1975, in Hyderabad India. And, as is common with most Indian homes, there is a lot of music going on around, either on the radio or people making music. And that certainly was the case with my father, playing a lot of instruments. He was largely a self-taught musician, but also composed music for local, you know groups and radio programs and so on. So, I was around a lot of music. So, I must have started before I was even aware of it. Formally I started taking lessons when I was in upper Kindergarten, so that would be about four years of age. And, I have had long stretches of training that way. My childhood was one period. And, later on after I moved to the United States, it was one period. And, then when I went back to visit my guruji in Bangalore, Pandit Parameshwar Hegde. that lasted six years. So, that was another learning stint. DB: Great! Tell me a little bit also about your school and college experience. What was your focus of you know, in other words what was your major? How was that experience like? SJ: Yeah, I grew up in an engineering campus. All our dads pretty much were engineers, and I hung out you know, with that community a lot more, so … I was also pretty drawn to mathematics early on. So, I ended up becoming an electronics and communication engineer. Got my undergrad at JNTU at Hyderabad and then moved here, to Colorado State University. I had … the blessing of a fellowship and a full TA-ship. Basically, a full ride. It was an intense experience. I didn’t do a whole lot of music during my Masters. And then I moved to Seattle. And while pretty much throughout my engineering career I had music going on somehow somewhere on a back burner, till it called for more full-time attention. DB: Yes, and I … that was my next question. When did you formally start training? You did mention that music was in your family, and that was the initial inspiration and you were absorbing it, without being conscious of it. But when did your formal training start? JP: Yeah, like I said, I think I started at the age of four, with Carnatic music, South Indian music. And, that lasted for a good eight years, and I also dabbled … We were a very open house musically, my brother is a performing pianist, and my father composed a lot of light music. So, we certainly had just about everything going on. So, formally the classical music training lasted well through high school. And, it was after I came here in the United States that, I was deeply drawn to Khayal, which is my main genre now. I have been doing a little Thumri. I still do, so I would say about … two thousand two would be when I started formally learning Khayal. But my teachers at that time felt that I had probably absorbed just through osmosis so much of it, that I was debuting with a full-length concert in about a year’s time, here at Ragamala’s Utsav. So, it didn’t take that long for that process and I owe it all back to my rigorous childhood education. DB: Right. What is Khayal and Thumri? You mentioned it. JP: So, Khayal, the name comes from the Persian word for imagination. It was a music that started to cohere as a genre towards the decline of the Mughal rule that would be late eighteenth century. I think it also came about as the result of a general push for personal expression. I think the Bhakti movement had taken root at that time. There was a greater call in the socio-cultural scene to have more individual expression. And, Khayal allowed this flexible framework to take the raga music, and the structure that we had inherited from Dhrupad and do a more improvised treatment of the raga. So that is still the spirit, the guiding spirit behind Khayal. Even today, when a musician sits down to perform, there is deep respect for the structure of Khayal and for the repertoire, you know, hundred two hundred, maybe more years old. And, also there is a very deep commitment to exercise your creativity and make it your own, create something beautiful in the moment. Thumri has its root much more in the folk tradition of India. Ah, there are a lot of romantic stories about how Thumri came to be a well-defined genre unto itself from the time of Wajid Ali Shah, Nawab of Awadh. There are a couple different schools of thought in Thumri as well. Purbi Ang, the Benaras style songs and so forth. And, that is a more poetic and thematic genre of music, where the raga is placed in the service of the poetry, and the emotional expression and nuance of the piece. So, Thumri singer … think about it … is actually doing with his or her voice what a Kathak dancer would be doing with their dance, with their bhav banana. So, it’s almost a dance and poetic related art form. DB: Thank you. Going back to your early training, would you talk a little bit about what was it like? You did mention that early training played a really important role, for the inspiration to continue, even when you came to US. So, what was the early training like and what was the teaching style of your guru? And was it too difficult? If you can shed some light on that. SJ: Sure. I have to admit that my early training was not very inspired on my part. So, it was group lesson that I went to twice a week. I rarely practiced, I think it was just the fun of being around other students who sang, and somehow, I floated through class. Just the process of going to class gave me the practice necessary but it was a very well-directed and well-structured repertoire building. I must have learned about two hundred to two fifty compositions during that time and the science of South Indian classical music, Carnatic music, the beginner curriculum, is extremely methodical and rigorous. And, to this day, when I start off my Hindustani music students, I borrow a lot of patterns, paltas as we call them and a lot of rhythm rigor, the whole system of taal and you know, seven times five thirty-five different combinations that are possible, and the seventy-two scales the mela karta system that are all the possible parent skills. So, it’s a very comprehensive system. So, I think what the early childhood music training gave me unbeknownst to me, before you come of age and start thinking about what you want to do with music, the rigor was there. And for that I am extremely thankful. DB: Talk about an interesting experience that as a student that you fondly remember or are proud of … or even feel embarrassed about SJ: Oh, [laughs] there are so many … let me give it a moment’s thought. I’ll tell you one moment that was truly magical for me. And, this was I think a winter afternoon in Bangalore. And, I was sitting with my guruji in his little music studio, just outside the house. And, we started doing the afternoon raga, Vrindavani Sarang, and the bandish that was ghana gagana garajata … talking about the clouds gathering … DB: Can you sing one line of that? SJ: Yeah, sure, {ghana gagana garajata … Chapala chamakata bijuri darae … gagana garaja} … and so on … DB: Wonderful. SJ: So, while we were singing, he was teaching and I was singing, and on a stray afternoon the clouds gathered, and it started to rain … DB: Oh, wow … SJ: I am not reading too much into it but I think it is a magical moment when the musician, and the music, and the atmosphere, all come together to create magic. In some ways it’s that elusive moment that we are going for in a concert or even in our practice at home. We just want to get into that zone and it’s so elusive and that moment happens. Oh, ever so rarely I think that captures the essence of the music training. Yeah. DB: How have things changed over the years as far as teaching and learning is concerned? Is it really different back in your home country then versus coming here in in a foreign land? SJ: Yes and no. In general, let me address that question in terms of how things have changed over time. I think what’s new in the teaching learning process right now is the use of recorders. Recording technology, which allows for a student to record so many things that the teacher is saying and play it back to themselves and you know, and learn compositions through … DB: Listening … SJ: Listening and repeating, which was ultimately the method where when one would learn anything in an oral tradition. So, I think for the most part that’s been beneficial. The downside of that sometimes is that there’s not that commitment to spending in-depth time, with the learning process in the presence of the guru. It’s more of an iterative process, a more efficient process. But, lacks the imagination and that depth that comes from staying with something for a little bit longer, can sometimes you know interfere with how well you absorb the music. So, it’s a balance that students have to strike, and I have to also myself. Secondly, it’s the massive amounts of recordings available on YouTube and other ..what do you call them .. digital online repositories of music. It’s a blessing, a huge blessing, and too much of a blessing sometimes. So, I find that sometimes that people have listened to so many varieties of the raag before they embark on learning it and they’ve formed opinions without necessarily having their own take on the raag by actually learning it. And, a certain lack of focus that comes from having all those amazing materials available online. So, they are working on one raag, they are now able to listen to ten different raags that are closely aligned to this raag. So, it’s wonderful to have lots of material to analyze as long as you can bring to focus what is it that you want to do in your learning process. So, these are definitely things that have changed over time and that is true of India, where this music originally comes from. It’s true everywhere, I think. DB: So, when did you come to US, and what was the early experience like, in terms of settling down and in terms of your music? SJ: Well, coming to the US as I mentioned was for reasons other than music. It was to go to engineering school, and then I launched straight into a computer architecture related job. And, several jobs down the line was when the real hankering for making music personally started to come to the fore. I do think that I needed the distance, and time to be a little more introspective, of myself and where my spiritual connection comes from. Where my, what I am happiest doing, what my true internal joy, where that’s rooted … takes a little bit of time to step back. And, maybe that’s what that gave me. But I don’t think I did very much music during that transition. I think it’s very time consuming to set up in a country half way across the world in a culture that in the beginning seems very orthogonal to yours. Until you can create a kind of personal home culture for yourself, but it was always there. DB: So, when did you decide to pursue music full time? I am sure .. was it like a difficult decision for you to just pursue it full time and make it your career or take it very seriously? SJ: Hmm … no, because I never made those decisions. I just went with the flow. There was a strong calling to do music, and to give it undivided attention. There was a sense of devotion that was welling up inside of me, and also an acknowledgement that that’s what I was happiest doing. And, no amount of listening and reverse engineering analyzing gets you there, in an oral tradition so little is written down, that’s because so little can be written down. I think as with any conversation that’s ... this is true of our conversation, this would be different if we were having it over email, or on chat. And, likewise with music, I think ninety percent of the communication happens, actually guru to shishya, teacher to disciple, and the classes are incredibly tailored … taalim as such … is incredibly tailored to that particular student’s needs, and that particular student’s strengths and skills. DB: So, Srivani, when did you decide to pursue music full time? Was it a difficult decision because you had a very interesting full-time engineering career, and you devoted so much time going to college and studying that? So, what made it different? How did you switch to full time music? SJ: I was certainly very happy doing engineering and I was on a pretty decent growth track I think, in the industry. But I don’t know, maybe it’s a sort of coming of age where some other, maybe a spiritual need comes to the fore sometimes. I turned thirty and I know that I had dabbled with music as sort of a serious hobby on the side. I did sit down and practice. But there was also a very strong need for a guru in me at the time. I had a wonderful teacher at the time, Dr. Sharad Gadre who is well known in the Seattle area. I had taken lessons with him and had gotten instructed in the method of Khayal. He was more of the Gwalior persuasion. and then in a chance happening, I happened to listen to my guruji Parmeshwar Hegde’s music,on a recording somewhere. And, that music resonated with me, and I felt in the moment that this is the kind of music that I want to make. And, through a series of strange coincidences after that in the following year our paths crossed two or three times, without any planning. So, I took that as a sign and felt that I would take a break from my career and focus on getting the Khayal repertoire and proper gharanedar taleem in the Kirana gharana and commit myself completely while I had a guru like this. Of course, my teacher at that time, Sharadji was also happy with this idea. But where it led me, I had not imagined. So, it wasn’t a decision at any point to pursue music full time or to quit my engineering career. I have to admit that I have now since it has been ten years in engineering and ten years in music, and the music journey has taken me to places that I couldn’t have imagined. About six years into my taleem, I debuted in the Devnandan Ubhyaker Yuva music festival for students that train in the paramparik or oral tradition with the guru. And, more recently at Sawai Gandharva, which I couldn’t have imagined at all. So, it’s a stroke of luck, blessing, a right amount of commitment, being set on the right path, a lot of things coming together. So, that’s how it ended up being. DB: Yeah, it’s great. Was the local South Asian community supportive and receptive of your art form in the beginning, while you were kind of training, as well as performing? You know, there is a time when you are doing kind of doing both. So, how did you feel? Was the community receptive, did they support you? SJ: I think by and large yes. I would have to, it would be remiss if I didn’t put in a word here for the amazingly generous, open minded music community that we have in the Seattle area. I could send an email, and get a bandish in a new raag, if I wished. I sat down to practice with local musicians, tabla and harmonium here, and I would get lots of good critical feed-back. I value that tremendously. In fact, that probably has as much to do with my progress as a musician, as the taleem itself … DB: Great! SJ: The challenge sometimes has been making the shift from being an amateur musician to being regarded as a professional musician. So, both extremes of that problem are hard. On the one hand, once you are performing the world over, people are a little hesitant to approach you for music, or to say shall we sit down and make some music together. So, it’s taken a little extra effort on my part to do that, to have gatherings to happen much more informally. There’s also been the other extreme - sometimes people are not very familiar with the life and challenges of a professional musician and what it takes to put a concert together, and resources that he or she might need to bring in accompanists outside of town. And, the phenomenal amount of logistics that goes into supporting that, and how one needs to compensate for those efforts. So, those two have been a few challenges that have since been smoothed over time DB: So, when you started performing as a professional, or even a as an amateur artist locally, did you think that there were sufficient cultural outlets to support your singing? So, it’s about the, different organizations giving an opportunity for you to perform. How did you feel about that? SJ: I would say that I personally have probably been decently fortunate, being able to tap into most of the outlets that are here. I have been invited to good places by good people and have had, wonderful time performing or teaching, or lecture deming for them. But, in general, I think that the size of the pie over all is pretty small. I think on my part certainly, and perhaps other musicians in the area, there is a constant struggle to have a platform that’s meaningful for performance. Need not necessarily be a big stage, just a regular atmosphere where people can go, listen to good music, exchange notes on music, make music together. I think our atmosphere of being increasingly busy, and over committed comes in the way of creating this sort of mahol, as we call it. DB: You did mention that you had a wonderful opportunity of performing in great venues like Sawai Gandharv. But that also gives rise to more expectations from you. And so, to be able to meet those expectations you have to ensure continuous growth, developing music. How do you cope with that sort of, I shouldn’t say pressure, but I am sure you feel that you have to maintain the level that you have already proven? And so, what do you do to keep growing and performing at that level? SJ: That is a good question and I am not sure that I have simple answer to that, because I re- evaluate my process critically for this specific aspect constantly, continually. So, I am not sure always that I am on the right track with that, but over time I’ve realized that there are certain … improvements that are the direct result of effort. You have a certain speed or a variety of taan that you wish to achieve, there are certain compositions that you want to learn, certain complex raagas that you want to learn. Those are things that are achievable, doable. So, those are aspects of growth that you can yourself direct. But, when you are looking at like whole paradigm shifts within you, as an artist, different vistas of the raag opening up to you, it could be the first raag that you learnt. It could be Yaman, Bhupali. Ah, but there’s a vast difference between let’s say an emerging artist’s Yaman, and a maestro’s Yaman, and then there is Amir Khan Sahib’s Yaman. So, how does one approach, to that I take the approach of a life’s journey. I feel that if I continue to engage with Yaman and engage with humility and try to find a new facet a new dimension … we have this formula in Indian music called shravan, manan chintan. Shravan to listen to lots of good music, good musicians singing this. Manan, try to pick out and remember, you know what appeals to you, remarkably and then, chintan, think on those lines. But, when that cooks to be that perfect meal of perfect raag, I don’t know. DB: So now of course music is your full-time career. Sometimes for musicians, pursuing it as a career, and maybe it is not applicable to you. But, a lot of musicians do face the challenge of unpredictability, uncertainty financially or otherwise. What is your take on that? SJ: It’s an unfortunate thing and it’s a challenge. But, in order to be realistic, one has to accept that as a challenge, rather than as a drawback or an obstacle of the field. The constant efforts at the non-profit organizational level, at the state level to have adequate funding and insurance coverage for artists, there are certainly organizations that work on that. Having said that, the cost of supporting a family, healthcare, childcare, all of these are constantly top factors that come up in most grant applications. I have been on the panel of some, and I am certainly a grant applicant myself. And, I have received quite a lot of support over the years from 4Culture for example, they need to be called out. Artists’ Trust is one other organization. That helps, but I think most of us musicians make a livelihood through delivering concrete value to society as teachers. Now, in addition to that, to also create that space and time that a music teacher requires to be her own artist, to decompress and engage with the art without these pressures. And, who knows, miraculously creates something beautiful that is somehow missed in our times. In the era of maybe the first hundred years of the evolution of Khayal, kings were patrons. Khayalists performed in the courts of kings, hence the development of so many gharanas, unique styles, unique schools of thought that brought so much color and variety and specialization into Khayal music. And, probably the wealthy class stepped in after the monarchies were dismantled. There’s definitely a little bit of absence of strong sponsorship in the area. DB: So, how does your art form fit into the greater art community of the state of Washington? And does your art intersect with other art forms from other countries? What connections do you see? SJ: This is a very timely question for me because I have been thinking recently of Khayal as a tool and a medium, and not just as a goal unto itself. One must remember that Khayal was a popular reaction when it started out in its time, as something a genre that allowed all themes, secular as well as spiritual and everything in between. So, we must leverage that aspect that freedom that Khayal gives us to talk about things that are more relevant to our times, whether it’s equality whether it’s gender whether … DB: Social justice … SJ: … it’s any kind of orientation, social justice, you name it. We can talk about these things in Khayal. And, I have noticed that when I perform to audiences that know nothing about Khayal, that the genre and the movements building in complexity and speed and building towards a final climax, that whole package really works well as a communication medium with no prior knowledge of the art form. So, we have that, and we must leverage that more. So, last year I have, I started a project called Soul Raga, for which I have been lucky to have been funded by 4Culture for the composition work, and a recording grant from Jack Straw, a non-profit studio in Seattle. and I worked on collaborative pieces focused on the theme of building bridges. So, my approach was to pick a theme, that resonated between me and another artist from another culture, and just build the piece as a conversation between the two … not pre-set, not harmonizing, nothing at all that’s over thought musically, but more in terms of what we wanted to communicate. And the piece was named after it was created and recorded. So, we didn’t know what we were going for necessarily, while building that bridge. So, there are four pieces that I would turn a listener to. There’s one called paper boats that I did with Ade Suparman who was a visiting artist from Purwakarta in Indonesia. And also, with the ethnomusicology program the school of music. Similarly, with Thione Diop, Senegalese drumming, and how about a Rajasthani folk song about a parrot fit into this idiom of what they say about animals and birds in Africa. And likewise, lots of interesting projects that came about, and I think that’s I would love for that to be a movement that gathers momentum among Khayal singers as well. DB: Wonderful. So, um let me shift our focus here now talking about your teaching experiences. I know that in addition to performing, you have done so many concerts, you also teach. And so, I would like to start with when did you start teaching? What was your experience? And, what is your goal? What is in your mind when you are imparting your knowledge to the students that come to you? SJ: I got into teaching also quite unwittingly without making that decision. There were students in the neighborhood that wanted to learn Hindustani music, and I just started teaching what I was learning myself. And it has evolved into a fairly serious teaching practice at this time and I am blessed certainly to have wonderful students who are very strong performers, with prior training from India or Bangladesh or Pakistan. My goals with my teaching are largely the goals of the students, because I think a teacher has to be an enabler, in addition to imparting repertoire, imparting Khayal methodology and the skill set of how to do barhat or layakari or taan or sargam, all of that. In addition to that you are really creating a personal khayal path for the student. So, the aspects of the style of the gharana, or gharanas as the case may be, we all have multiple influences these days that gets automatically imparted. But it’s tapping into what the student would like to do with the Khayal, that becomes a one on one partnership and that I think that is the hallmark of good taleem. DB: What are your screening criteria for accepting students? Is there a minimum bar that they need? Are there requirements that they need to meet for the long period that they will be training with you? What are some of the major requirements for them to be able to continue long term? SJ: Indeed, over years I have found out what kind of student I am a best fit teacher for. So, I typically encourage people that are exploring, to do that elsewhere. So, come to me when you are convinced that Khayal is really what you want to do. And, the reason that I say that is not out of personal ego, but because Khayal engages all aspects of your brain. It requires a significant time commitment to start making some progress with it. And, I don’t just mean in terms of the number of raags or the number of compositions, but certain amount of marinating that’s required on a regular basis on the part of any student. And, since I teach one on one mostly, it would make sense for them to be in the place in life, time wise energy wise, to be able to make that commitment with riyaz as we call it at home and come back with some of that work done to class. So, in terms of minimum requirements, I would love for them to have a good sense of sur, tonality, a good sense of rhythm, and preferably have done a little bit of beginning training with another teacher prior to coming to me. But most importantly, and I have them sign a piece of paper [laughs] … DB: I see … SJ: … saying that they are going to sit down three to five times in between seeing me for lessons, and that is a good pace, for both of us. DB: What is your teaching style? [Ahem] What are your expectations from your students? And, you did mention a few things that you would expect from your student. The fact that you are not teaching in India or in any South Asian country, you are teaching here. Does that mean that you are kind of making adjustments to go along the student’s pace? SJ: Right, I understand. So, there are two aspects of this question. One is on the style of pedagogy itself that I would like to address first. I think my style has evolved to be a combination of analysis and synthesis. What I mean by that is that the traditional gharanedar taleem style that used to be for the guru to sing the raag and the student to follow. And, you absorb as you go along, through the process of repetition and trying to copy the guru. And, then you develop a fair understanding of the raag, and then start to improvise. I do a little bit of that and balance it out with actually analyzing. A lot of my students come from different walks of life where they are completely comfortable with analysis and are curious to understand how is this raag cooked. What kind of raag is this, is this more oriented towards certain types of phrases? So, there’s a lot of that background material as well. So, there’s a little bit of written information and I emphasize that information as I go along the taleem. So, I think it is Yin and Yang, two of them complete the picture learning wise. It’s probably a reflection of how I have learned as well. In terms of just the engagement with the student, I think I am a very non-traditional teacher in that sense. I’ve done away with the whole guruness of the teacher in me. I would like, and it’s a very comfortable spot for me to be treated as perhaps a more advanced student in the process. Someone who’s been with this raag for a little bit longer or been with Khayal for a little bit longer. And, I have probably the depth and breadth that comes from being a little bit further along the journey, and luckily for me, my own guruji has that same attitude as well. So, I’ve had a very egalitarian style of learning, open to other influences we can bring to class. We can talk about why we do this way and not the other way how about we try that, and treat the music with respect, utmost respect. And, how do you show that respect? By practicing well. [Chuckles]. DB: So, it seems like it’s kind of an experiment, trying to understand the student, and then trying to experiment with your teaching method. And, I know that you have been teaching for some time now. So, when you compare looking back when you started teaching and now, I am curious to know how your teaching has evolved over time. Do you try new approaches of teaching with changing trends? SJ: It has certainly evolved over time, it would be hard not to. But I don’t think it’s followed any trends. I think I am much more tuned to how the student is receiving the instruction, the taleem, and making minor adjustments as I go along. Knowing when to push, how hard to push, what’s achievable for them right now. Because, it always seems like a list ten things that they can potentially work on at the end of every class. To be able to prioritize for them, to kind of make small bite size pieces, otherwise it’s really easy to get overwhelmed. I think when I started teaching, I modelled my teaching after the methods of the teachers that had been in my own life. And, it was a syncretic style, and that point, and I think over time, as it should, it’s evolved to being much more tailored to making the students see the next few steps that they can make progress on. DB: As you know, professional competition is reality in all fields. Can you talk a little bit about how it affects your work as a teacher and a performer? SJ: For better or for worse, music is not a competitive sport for me. I think it’s my personality. I don’t do well with zero-sum games. For me winning is about pursuing excellence myself and enabling others to do so as well. And, the kind of tunnel vision that you get from competing with x y z person or wanting to be at the top of your genre, however that’s evaluated, I think takes the joy of learning away. And, I have found, and I have made peace with the fact that I am happiest when I am learning new things, and I go back to the original reason I came into music for, which was my own personal connection, my spiritual connection to the world and to myself. And, if I lose that it’s like dissecting a butterfly, you’ve lost it. And, I don’t work well with that, the music stops working for me. But I think I am internally competitive as an artist. If I find something that I put my mind to, that needs to be fixed or taken to the next level, I can be extremely focused on that, and there’s certain sense of achievement and winning, and overall feel good inside that comes from doing that. And, I immediately share that with students and everyone that cares to hear about it you know that I think I’ve solved this problem or how does this sound now. Isn’t it a lot better? DB: Great! I think we’ve covered a lot of various aspects of your performance and teaching. But, is there anything else that I did not cover that you would like to share? SJ: I would like to share some inspiration that motivated me in a different way regarding performanceship. I know we talked a lot about music, and certainly one can do music for various reasons. But, as a performer last year I crossed paths with two wonderful maestros, right here in the Seattle area. I had the chance to work with Ganesh Rajagopalan, who’s a Carnatic violin maestro, and we did a little concert tour. And, working with child prodigies, such as himself, gave me an insight into just the performance aspect of the music, which hasn’t been a key thrust for me in my own musical life. Performance has happened. I am happy to, it’s still a way for me to connect with the audience. And the other was with Zakir ji. So, Zakir Hussain … was here serving an artist residency again with the ethnomusicology program. We were extremely lucky to have Zakir ji in our orbit, for entire quarter. So, I invited myself over to hang out and assist with classes and put together a vocal ensemble. And, just being around a person that is extremely open to new influences, musical inputs, is relentless in the questioning of, how do we take that forward … I think is the key to keeping the music fresh at all times. And, also his commitment to using his music to communicate with people. Nothing is too out of the box with Zakir ji, when it comes to using his tabla, his art, to communicate with a whole bunch of people. So, that work ethic that I saw in both of them, and that commitment to their art, to keep it interesting fresh and bringing and creating new ideas, not be boxed in by any considerations whatsoever, that was like a breath of ah fresh air. But also, certain new dimensions that I hadn’t thought about. So, I would like to thank the University of Washington for enabling those experiences for bringing these artists to town. DB: And, I know that you have also taught at the University of Washington through the department of ethnomusicology. And, that makes me think that I should definitely ask you about your experience during that time at the University of Washington. SJ: I had two wonderful stints with the ethnomusicology program. My first time there, I was blown away by what students can achieve in just one quarter. So, we went from knowing practically nothing about Indian music, starting with sa re ga ma, naming the so la fa , and going to give a recital for about forty-five minutes, six compositions, in different raags and different taals, including Drupad taals. And, they performed, performed so joyously. And, it was validation for me also about teaching method, because one develops one’s own method after a while and it has to work. It’s only successful if it works for the particular group or individual that you are working with, and I was just so amazed with that recital. And, how much ground we covered. And so, with my second stint I got a little more ambitious. So, we tried to involve some improvisation as well, and that was my first time really teaching improvisation from scratch. How do you take this piece and make, how do you explore it, for someone who hasn’t been around it culturally? So, that really has contributed a lot to kind of some fundamental I would say evolutionary steps in my teaching, and I was wowed by the amount of practice the students put in. Some students have studied music and they know the drill, but many of them were students of philosophy, religious studies, South Asia studies, cultural anthropology, ethnomusicology, archiving, and so on. And, it was very fun experience for everyone. DB: Ah, thank you so much for taking time and talking to us and giving an insight to your musical journey, and your teaching, SJ: You are welcome. DB: … would you sing for us? Would you perform so that we have insight? So, Srivani would you like to ah demonstrate a piece based on a certain raga, and also explain what a raga is? And what the piece is all about? SJ: Sure, so raga by definition, interestingly it is not a musical term at all. It’s come to be … ranjayati iti raaga … that which colors the mind is a raga. So, it’s an emotional entity really that’s rooted in a scale and certain phraseology, that brings out these colors. In a grammatical sense of course, it could be a set of rules that we follow, as boundaries to that scale. There are certain combinations of swaras, certain approach, that help create this picture of this raag. Raag is like a painting. So, I in the moment, I am thinking about a beautiful piece in Raag Shree, an early evening raag of the twilight. A composition of Jhaptaal, a rhythm cycle of ten beats. And, this was the sung song of one of my favorite maestros of all times, D.V. Paluskar … Hari ke charana kamala … (instrumental music plays) So, start with a short what we call an alaap or an introduction to a raag, and layout the composition, and do a little improvising with it. (instrumental music continues) (SJ starts singing) Index 0:01:30 – Early initiation in music. Srivani was born in Hyderabad in India in nineteen seventy-five. Music was all around her, and her father was a self-taught musician. Her formal training in music started when she was about four years old and in upper Kindergarten. Later she restarted her training in the United States. When she went back to visit her guru Pandit Paremeshwar Hegde in Bangalore, she trained with him for six years. Keywords: Hyderabad, music, father, Kindergarten, United States, Bangalore, Pandit Paremeshwar Hegde, training. 0:03:00 – Academic training. Srivani grew up in an engineering campus, with most dads being engineers. She was drawn towards mathematics from early on and did her undergraduate at JNTU at Hyderabad. Later she did her master’s with full fellowship at Colorado State University. While she did not do a lot of music during her Masters, music was always in the background. Keyword: engineering, mathematics, JNTU, Hyderabad, Colorado State University, Masters, music. 0:04:12 – Music training. Srivani started training in Carnatic music at the age of four and continued for eight years. Her brother is a performing pianist, her father composed a lot of light music, and her house was very open musically. After she came to the US, she was drawn towards Khayal, and she is also doing a little bit of Thumri. She started learning Khayal formally in two thousand two. She debuted with a full-length concert at Ragamala’s Utsav in a year’s time. Keywords: Carnatic music, pianist, light music, composer, Khayal, Thumri, Ragamala, Utsav. 0:05:56 – Srivani explains what is Khayal and Thumri. Khayal comes from the Persian word for imagination, and it came about the time of the decline of the Mughal rule. With the influence of the Bhakti movement there was a push towards personal expression, and Khayal allowed improvisation with the ragas. Thumri has its root in the folk tradition of India and involves a lot of romantic stories. It became a well-defined genre around the time of Wajid Ali Shah. Some of the schools of Thumri are Purabang, Benaras etc. It is a more poetic and thematic form of music. Keywords: Khayal, Mughal rule, Bhakti movement, improvisations, ragas, Thumri, romantic, Wajid Ali Shah, Purabang, Benaras, poetic, thematic. 0:09:12 – Early classical music training and it’s continuing influence. Srivani’s early training was not very inspired on her part. She used to go to a group class, and just by going there she got the necessary amount of practice. However, the training of the South Indian classical music is very methodical and rigorous. She borrows a lot of rhythm rigor, the whole system of taal structures, while teaching her Hindustani classical music students. She is very thankful for her early training. Keywords: Early training, South Indian classical music, methodical, rigorous, taal, rhythm structure, teaching, Hindustani classical music, thankful. 0:11:10 – Srivani talks about a magical afternoon. Srivani talks about an incident when she was singing with her guru ji in Bangalore during a winter afternoon, and they were singing an afternoon raga, Vrindayani sarang. When they were singing about rain clouds gathering, it suddenly started raining. Srivani also sang one line of the song. Keywords: Magical, Bangalore, guruji, afternoon raga, Vrindavani sarang, bandish, raining. 0:13:40 – Srivani talks about the influence of recording in music training. Srivani talks about the use of recorders and recording technology as the biggest change in the process of music training. It is a blessing as students are able to record their gurus and listen to the latter repeatedly and learn from that. Students are also exposed to massive amounts of recordings and repertoires through digital media. However, it also leads people to form opinions about music by listening to too many varieties of ragas, without first learning any raga properly themselves. There is a certain lack of focus, and this is true for music training everywhere. Keywords: Recording, recording technology, blessing, listening, repertoires, digital media, opinions, lack of focus. 0:16:33 – Early days in the US. Srivani came to the US for joining an engineering school, and then had a computer architecture related job. It was only later that she felt the need to make music. She thinks that she needs the distance and time to realize where her internal joy lies. She didn’t have much time initially to pursue music. She naturally felt a strong calling to give music her undivided attention after certain time, and no amount of just listening to music could fulfill that need. This is because the oral tradition of Indian music depends on direct guru-disciple relationship. Keywords; US, engineering, computer architecture, internal joy, spiritual connection, music, guru-shishya, oral tradition. 0:19:47 – Shift to full time music career. Srivani was happy doing engineering, but after she turned thrity, she felt a strong need for a guru. She started training under Dr. Sharad Gadre in Seattle area who pursued mostly Gwalior gharana of Khayal. She heard a recording of Parmeshwar Hedge and felt that she wanted to make that kind of music. After a few coincidences, without much planning, she devoted herself to proper gharanedar taleem. Her music took her to places beyond her imagination. She performed in Devnandan Abhaikar Yuva music festival for students with paramparik or traditional training, and then recently at Sawai Gandharva. Keywords: Dr. Sharad Gadre, Gwalior gharana, Khayal, Parmeshwar Hedge, gharanedar taleem, paramparik, Devnandan Abhaikar Yuva music festival, Savai Gandharva. 0:23:08 – Support of the South Asian community. Srivani talks about the generous and open- minded music community of Seattle. She could do bandish with local musicians, tabla and harmonium players and received critical feed-back. That helped her progress as a musician, more than her taleem itself. The challenge lies in shifting from being an amateur musician to being regarded as professional musician. After having performed around the world, people are hesitant to approach one for music. Also, people are unfamiliar with the challenges of a professional musician. She also talked about being fortunate enough to be invited to good places by good people for performances. However, there is a struggle for musicians to get a meaningful platform to perform. Keywords: Music community, Seattle, open-minded, generous, local musicians, bandish, challenges, struggle, platform, performance. 0:27:19 – Continuous growth as a musician. Srivani re-evaluates her process critically constantly. She says that while she is not sure of being on the right track all the time, but over time there is some progress due to her efforts. Over time different vistas of raags open up to a musician, differentiating between Yaman raag of a beginner, of a maestro, and of Amir Khan Sahib. It is a life’s journey to realize that, through shravan or listening, manan or remembering, and chintan or thinking. Keywords: Growth, re-evaluation, Yaman, Amir Khan Sahib, shraman, mannan, chintan. 0:30:33 – The unpredictability and financial challenges of professional musicians. Srivani acknowledges that it is a challenge, and there are constant efforts on part of non-profit organizations and states to get adequate funding and insurance coverage for artists. Family, healthcare etc. are top factors for grant applications. She has got grants from 4Culture and Artists’ Trust. It is hard for artists to get the support to decompress and create something beautiful. During the early days of Khayal, kings were patrons, and later the wealthy class. There is absence of strong sponsorship. Keywords: Challenge, non-profit organizations, state, funding, insurance coverage, family costs, healthcare, grants, sponsorship. 0:33:29 – Musical collaboration and Soul Raga. Srivani mentions that since Khayal originated as a tool for free expression, it has a social justice orientation to it. Khayal can be appreciated even by audiences that know nothing about the genre. She talks about her project called Soul Raga, funded by 4Culture and a recording grant from Jack Straw, a non-profit studio. She talked about her collaborative work with Ade Suparman, a visiting artist from Purwakarta in Indonesia, and with Thione Diop, a Senegalese drummer. Keywords: Musical collaboration, social justice, Khayal, Soul Raga, 4Culture, Jack Straw, Ade Suparman, Purwakarta, Indonesia, Thione Diop, Senegal. 0:36:42 – Teaching music and criteria for selecting students. Srivani started teaching Hindustani music with students in the neighborhood. Now it has evolved in a serious teaching practice with students with prior training from India, Bangladesh, or Pakistan. She notes that the mark of a good taleem should be to enable students to create a personal khayal path, and to establish a one-on-one partnership with the students. She asks students who are exploring to go elsewhere, and only accepts students who are convinced that they want to do Khayal. This is because Khayal engages all aspects of one’s brain, and she wants students to commit to riyaz and have a good sense of sur, tonality, and rhythm. She also makes students sign a piece of paper saying that students are going to practice three to five times in between the lessons. Keywords: Teaching, Hindustani music, India, Bangladesh, Pakistan, taleem, riyaz, sur, tonality, rhythm, commitment. 0:41:33 – Teaching style and expectations from students. Srivani talks about her pedagogy as involving a combination of analysis and synthesis. She combines aspects of traditional gharanedar taleem based on guru’s singing, and the student following and absorbing by repetition. She also incorporates analysis of the ragas and provides written information. It is Yin and Yang, and she considers herself to be more of an advanced student. She follows a non- traditional and egalitarian teaching style, being open to outside influences, and showing utmost respect to music. Keywords: Pedagogy, analysis, synthesis, gharanedar taleem, repetition, Yin and Yang, non- traditional, egalitarian, respect. I am curious to know how has your teaching evolved over time, and do you try new approaches of teaching with changing trends? SJ: It has certainly evolved over time -it would be hard not to. But I don’t think it’s followed any trends. I think I am much more tuned to how the student is receiving the the instruction, the taleem, and making minor adjustments as I go along. Knowing when to push how hard to push, what’s achievable for them right now. Because, it always seems like at least things that they can potentially work on at the end of every class. To be able to prioritize for them, to kind of make small bite size pieces, otherwise it’s really easy to get overwhelmed. I think when I started teaching, I modelled my teaching ah after the methods of the teachers that had been in my own life. And, it was a syncretic style, and that point, and I think over time, as it should, it’s evolved to being a much more tailored to making the students see the next few steps that they can progress on. 0:44:58 – Evolution as a teacher. Srivani talks about her evolution as a teacher, and how she is now more in tune with the students and understands the needs of the latter. At the end of lessons, she knows what her students should prioritize on. Her own teaching style is modelled after her own teachers. She is able to tailor her training to the needs of her students and give them bite- size pieces to prioritize for practice. Keywords: Evolution, teacher, students, prioritization, bite-size pieces, practice. 0:46:54 – Professional competition in music. Srivani says that music is not a competitive sport for her. For her winning is about pursuing excellence in herself and enabling others to do well. Competitiveness takes the joy of learning away, and she likes to go back to her original reason for coming to music, which is to find her spiritual connection. However, she is internally competitive and can be extremely focused on pursuing excellence, the results of which she then shares with others. Keywords: Professional competition, excellence, enabling, spiritual connection, international competitive, sharing. 0:49:11 – Musical inspirations, especially from Ganesh Rajagopalan and Zakir Hussain. Srivani talks about her experience of crossing paths with two wonderful maestros. She had the chance to work with Ganesh Rajagopalan, a Carnatic violin maestro. That gave her an insight into the performance aspect of music. She also worked with Zakir Hussain, during his artist residency at the ethnomusicology program. She learned from Zakir ji’s work ethics of keeping the music fresh at all times, to be extremely open to new influences, and his commitment to communicate with people through his music. She thanks University of Washington for bringing these artists to town. Keywords: Inspirations, motivation, maestros, Ganesh Rajagopalan, Carnatic music, violin, performance, Zakir Hussain, ethnomusicology program, open, work ethics, communicate, University of Washington. 0:52:24 – Teaching at the ethnomusicology program at the University of Washington. Srivani talks about two wonderful stints of teaching at the ethnomusicology program. She was blown away by what the students can achieve in one quarter, from knowing nothing about Indian music to giving a recital for about forty-five minutes with mastery over even Drupad taals. She was amazed with the recital, and how much grounds everybody covered. During her next time, she became more ambitious and taught improvisations. She was wowed by the amount of practice students put in, and students were from all sorts of academic backgrounds. Keywords: Ethnomusicology program, stints, recital, Drupad, taals, ambitious, improvisations, evolutionary step, practice. … would would you sing for us? Would you perform so that we have insight? So, Srivani would you like to ah demonstrate a piece based on a certain raga, and also explain what a raga is? And what the piece is all about? SJ: Sure, so raga by definition, interestingly it is not a musical term at all. It’s come to be … ranjayati iti raaga … that which colors the mind is a raga. So, it’s an emotional entity really that’s rooted in a scale and certain phraseology, that brings out these colors. In a grammatical sense of course, it could be a set of rules um that we follow, as as as boundaries to that scale. There are certain combinations of swaras, certain approach, um that help create this picture of this raag. Raag is like a painting. So, I, in the moment, I am thinking about a beautiful piece in Raag Shree, ah an early evening raag, raag of the twilight. A composition of Jhaptaal, a rhythm cycle of ten beats. And, this was the sung song of one of my favorite maestros of all times, ah D.V. Paluskar … Hari ke charana kamala … (instrumental music plays) So, start with a short what we call an alaap or an introduction to a raag, and layout the composition, and do a little improvising with it. (instrumental music continues) (SJ starts singing) 0:55:18 – Srivani explains a certain raga and demonstrates it by singing. She explains that raga means that which colors the mind, it is an emotional entity. A raga includes a certain combination of swaras, bounded by certain scales. She says she will be performing a composition of Jhaptaal, a song sung by her favorite maestro – D.V. Paluskar. Keywords: Raga, emotional entity, swaras, scales, Jhaptaal, D. V. Paluskar. 0:57:34 – Shivani starts singing. Glossary Bandish: It is a fixed, melodic composition in Hindustani vocal or instrumental music. It is set in a specific raga, performed with rhythmic accompaniment by a tabla or pakhawaj, a steady drone, and melodic accompaniment by a sarangi, violin or harmonium. Barhat: It refers to the development of a raga within a performance. Bhav banana: Create expressions. Gharanedar taalim: Gharana refers to a particular house or traditional style of an art form. Taalim refers to formal training in an art form. Gharanedar taalim refers to formal training of an art form that is true to a specific traditional style of the art. Layakari: Rhythmic improvisations Paramparik: Traditional. Palta: It is also called alankar, which literally means ornaments. Paltas refer to the ornamentations or the embellishments to create patterns that a musician might add to enhance the beauty of a composition. Mahol: General atmosphere or the environment. Riyaaz: Practice. It specifically refers to a structured way of practicing an art form like music or dance. Taal: Musical beats or rhythm cycles. Taalim: Formal training. Sa re ga ma: Notes of the Indian musical octave. Sargam: It refers to singing the notes of a composition. Shishya: Student. Sur: Tone or melody. Swaras: A swara, or svara, denotes a note in the Indian musical octave. Taan: It is a technique in Indian classical music whereby the musician uses a long vowel sound, often the sound ‘a,’ to sing through the different notes of the octave in a fast tempo.