CANADA VOLUME 134 S NUMBER 094 S 2nd SESSION S 35th PARLIAMENT OFFICIAL REPORT (HANSARD) Thursday, October 31, 1996 Speaker: The Honourable Gilbert Parent CONTENTS (Table of Contents appears at back of this issue.) The House of Commons Debates are also available on the Parliamentary Internet Parlementaire at the following address: http://www.parl.gc.ca 5917 HOUSE OF COMMONS Thursday, October 31, 1996 The House met at 10 a.m. My report does not stop at listing the key reviews and their objectives, but also shows what Canadians have a right to expect _______________ for their tax dollars. [English] Prayers This report states what 16 government departments and agencies _______________ expect from their activities. We have devised a new format that makes this report easy to read. Our new approach is based squarely on program review decisions and departments’ business plans. This ROUTINE PROCEEDINGS is the first time the government has compiled this information in one document. [Translation] I am also tabling today 16 departmental performance reports. TABLING OF DOCUMENTS These pilot documents demonstrate our new results based way of managing in the public sector. They will help Canadians under- Hon. Marcel Massé (President of the Treasury Board and stand the objectives of each department and agency as well as the Minister responsible for Infrastructure, Lib.): Madam Speaker, progress made in meeting those objectives. I have the honour to table, in both official languages, a report entitled ‘‘Getting Government Right: Improving Results Measure- Federal departments and agencies must from now on meet three ment and Accountability with Departmental Performance Re- requirements: first, identify and communicate the results expected; ports’’, the President of the Treasury Board’s annual report to second, improve the measurement of these results; and, third, Parliament. improve the way they report to Parliament. Madam Speaker, I also have the honour of tabling 16 pilot [Translation] reports on performance. The documents I am tabling today show that we are honouring * * * our commitment to constantly improve the information we give to Parliament and to Canadians, in a way that is open and transparent. [English] Having the right information at the right time will allow Parliament to perform its work better. Improving the quality of information GOVERNMENT RESPONSE TO PETITIONS will ensure better informed discussions and debates within govern- ment, in this House, and among Canadians. The quality of these Mr. Ovid L. Jackson (Parliamentary Secretary to President debates will, in turn, lead to better decisions, improved account- of the Treasury Board, Lib.): Madam Speaker, pursuant to ability and, ultimately, better government. Standing Order 36(8), I have the honour to table, in both official languages, the government’s response to 15 petitions. I would like at this point to draw attention to the untiring work of the hon. member for St. Boniface, who has led parliamentarians in * * * defining their needs for information on expenditure management. [Translation] With his help, we have developed documents that are more concise, more clear, and focused on results. THE ROLE OF GOVERNMENT These reports are an important step in the process of planning for Hon. Marcel Massé (President of the Treasury Board and the next fiscal year. Minister responsible for Infrastructure, Lib.): Madam Speaker, [English] honourable members, ladies and gentlemen, I have the honour today of tabling ‘‘Getting Government Right: Improving Results If the pilot documents meet our expectations, we plan to seek the Measurement and Accountability’’. This is the second annual permission of the House to require all departments and agencies to report of the President of the Treasury Board, a report that focuses table separate reports on planning in the spring and on performance on results, performance and accountability. in the fall. 5918 COMMONS DEBATES October 31, 1996 Routine Proceedings I think that the efforts of members of the government to It is now up to parliamentarians to do their job and review these objectively assess how well they met their commitments will be documents to see what is missing and what can be improved. The encouraging to everyone. Treasury Board Secretariat, along with the public accounts and the auditor general, have also recognized the need to improve measure- Focusing our attention on results and demonstrating our achieve- ment of results and to improve accountability in the public sector. ments are an important step in our efforts to get government right. I applaud the recognition but in reviewing these documents I [Translation] note that we still have a long way to go. There is one question to ask at the end of the day after reading these reports. Has the system Mr. Yvan Loubier (Saint-Hyacinthe—Bagot, BQ): Madam been improved and will these reports assist in reviewing and Speaker, I would invite the minister to continue along the path he improving government policy? I do not feel this question has been has begun toward more accountability and greater transparency in answered. public administration. In particular, I would invite him to ensure that members of Parliament and ministers also have an obligation Last year Treasury Board reviewed 19 priorities or key govern- of accountability and transparency. ment programs. I do not dispute the fact that all 19 programs were reviewed. Many of them were reviewed by standing or special D (1010) committees. After the review, have the necessary steps been taken to improve the programs or to change the way the services are I would also invite him to keep the promises made by the Liberal delivered? Let me offer four examples. government about revitalizing democracy. Too often in the past three years the impression has been that the public service and the Last year Treasury Board said that the government reviewed the federal administration are often being led by the mandarins, that GST, family trusts, the infrastructure program and TAGS, the the mandarins are often telling the ministers what to do, and the Atlantic groundfish strategy. What has happened as a result of the ministers are letting themselves be pushed around by these manda- review? With the GST we note that the government has initiated rins. harmonization which includes four provinces, but not abolition. The answer is to hide the GST in the sticker price which is not a Revitalizing democracy, as the Liberals so well presented it very creative solution. during the last electoral campaign, means more transparency in the work of committees. This was not been the case in connection with The review has taken place on family trusts but the loophole is the family trusts, particularly the transfer to the United States of still open. Infrastructure: $85,000 per job has been spent and the two billion dollars, in which there was no transparency whatsoever, unemployment rate is still 9.9 per cent. The youth unemployment but rather a systematic camouflage operation. I think there is a rate is still double that. There has not been a very creative response. good deal to be done in this area. What have we learned about the TAGS program? It is in as bad if The question of revitalization of democracy, accountability and not worse shape. Even those who have received the benefits of this transparency raises the whole question of political party funding. program are extremely unhappy and the Pacific fishery is still in a We can boast of having a grassroots funding structure, but the terrible situation. major federal parties do not have that. I would therefore invite the minister to continue along the path I do not believe we have made progress in these programs. The on which he has begun, so that accountability, transparency and review has been interesting but the outcomes have not illustrated revitalization of democracy will be made concrete, rather than any improvements in the government’s decision making process. remaining mere empty promises. Please do not get me wrong. I can understand that quantum leaps are virtually impossible. However, one critical attribute of a well [English] performing government organization is that it seeks optimum performance. It will not settle for second best. Mr. Philip Mayfield (Cariboo—Chilcotin, Ref.): Madam Speaker, the work described by the minister stems from the In the review of the GST, family trusts, infrastructure and TAGS recommendations of the sixth report of the public accounts com- there are no descriptions of optimum performance. We have no mittee tabled in March 1994. benchmarks to tell us whether or not the programs are performing well or meeting the needs they were created to meet. Let me There is no doubt that the President of the Treasury Board has illustrate my concerns with something more concrete. taken his responsibility to report to Parliament very seriously. We now have several detailed documents from Treasury Board which One of the so-called faults of a public institution is that there is include the main estimates, the annual report on review and these no bottom line, no hard data, but in some cases this is not true. Last new performance reports. month the auditor general reported on the quality of service in the October 31, 1996 COMMONS DEBATES 5919 Routine Proceedings public sector. He found that 30 million phone calls to government CANADA ENDANGERED SPECIES PROTECTION ACT departments went unanswered, 20 million in Revenue Canada alone. This figure seems like a concrete starting point. Revenue Hon. Sergio Marchi (Minister of the Environment, Lib.) Canada is largely a service department. Finance sets most of our moved for leave to introduce Bill C-65, an act respecting the tax policy. protection of wildlife species in Canada from extirpation or extinction. D (1015) He said: Madam Speaker, it is a pleasure on behalf of the Government of Canada to introduce for the first time federal In looking at the performance report submitted by Revenue legislation to promote and protect endangered species across the Canada, the problem is mentioned which is a start.