The Association for Diplomatic Studies and Training Foreign Affairs Oral History Project AMBASSADOR EDWARD E. ELSON Interviewed by: Charles Stuart Kennedy Initial interview date: April 18th, 2012 Interview completed by Mark Tauber in 2017 Copyright 2017 ADST TABLE OF CONTENTS 1934: Born in New York City • Moved with family to Norfolk in early childhood, completed high school in Norfolk. • Family moved permanently to Atlanta, Georgia in 1953. 1947: Religion: Reform Judaism. Bar Mitzvah • Parents’ publishing and distribution company became very successful. • Father was also heavily engaged in humanitarian and social action, especially in crusade to end lynching in Virginia. • Father also involved with Jewish relief after WWII and supplied the provisions for The Exodus, a refurbished Bay Line steamer famous for ferrying Jews from post-Holocaust Europe to Palestine in 1947. 1948-52: Attended Phillips Andover Academy. • Honors Student. • Attended at a time when the school had a strict quota for number of Jews accepted. 1952-56: Attended University of Virginia in special honors program in political science with mentors instead of regular classes. 1957: Married. Celebrated 60 years of marriage in 2017. 1959: Graduated from Emory Law School and passed bar exam. • Never practiced law. • Took over father’s publishing/distribution business including the New York Herald Tribune, later to become the International Herald Tribune, and later the International New York Times. 1960s: Diversified business into banking and retail. • Pioneered retail outlets at airports and hotels. Very successful. • Took on African American partners in retail business. 1 1960s: Met Herman Talmadge, a member of a Georgia political dynasty. • Talmadge served as governor of Georgia and senator from Georgia. • The two began joint projects in real estate. Also very successful. 1960s: Georgia still very segregated, including against Jews. • Elson becomes active in promoting civil rights, first as Chairman of the Georgia Advisory Committee to U.S. Civil Rights Commission. • Through this position he becomes acquainted with several African Americans who would rise to top positions in politics and international affairs such as Vernon Jordan, Julian Bond, John Lewis, and Andrew Young. 1966-70: Served on the President’s Commission on Obscenity. The most important findings were: • That there was "no evidence to date that exposure to explicit sexual materials plays a significant role in the causation of delinquent or criminal behavior among youths or adults." • That "a majority of American adults believe that adults should be allowed to read or see any sexual materials they wish." • That "there is no reason to suppose that elimination of governmental prohibitions upon the sexual materials which may be made available to adults would adversely affect the availability to the public of other books, magazines, or films." • That there was no "evidence that exposure to explicit sexual materials adversely affects character or moral attitudes regarding sex and sexual conduct." • That "Federal, State, and Local legislation prohibiting the sale, exhibition, or distribution of sexual materials to consenting adults should be repealed." 1977-80: Served as Chairman of National Public Radio. • NPR Award is named for him. 1980s-early 1990s: Rector of University of Virginia • Student Health Center is named for him. 1993 Appointment as U.S. Ambassador to Denmark; arrived Denmark in November 1993 1998 Completed tenure as U.S. Ambassador INTERVIEW Q: Today is the 18th of April, 2012. We are beginning our interview with Ambassador Edward — is it Edward? ELSON: Edward, right, E-D-W-A-R-D, E middle initial, E-L-S-O-N. 2 Q: Elson. ELSON: Is my last name. Q: And you go by Ed? ELSON: Ed; fine. Q: OK. ELSON: Let me tell you, that’s the nicest thing people call me. Q: (laughs) All right, well — ELSON: You can use Excellency too, if you like. Q: All right, I’ll — ELSON: No, no, I’m — Q: Or potential Excellency. ELSON: I’ll accept anything. Q: (laughs) Okay, all right. And this is being done on behalf of the Association for Diplomatic Studies, and I am Charles Stuart Kennedy. And this is — Ed, let’s start at the beginning. Ed, when and where were you born? ELSON: Well, I was born in New York, but actually I — I grew up in Norfolk, Virginia. My father and mother moved there when I was an infant, so my whole life was spent in Norfolk until they moved when I was 19 years of age. My family moved to Atlanta, Georgia. Q: Okay... ELSON: We lived in Atlanta until I went to Denmark, and now we live in Palm Beach. Q: All right, well, let’s work on your early thing. Can you tell me something about — what do you know on your father’s side? The background of the family and what were they up to? ELSON: Well, my father was a brilliant man, extraordinarily perceptive, wise and erudite. He went to law school in New York, and that is where I was born. It was the height of the Depression and he went into business in Norfolk, Virginia. Norfolk is where I lived until I went to Andover Phillips Academy when I was 14. I finished Andover and I came south again to the University of Virginia in 1952. 3 Q: Well, I’m going to take it back here. First, do you know where your family, the Elsons came from? ELSON: Well, actually, it’s very difficult because they came from many different places. The Elson part of the family was actually a Germanic name, Alshvang, anglicized to Elson. My grandfather came from what is now Lithuania. In those days it was a country going back and forth between Germany and Russia, so he spoke a number of languages as a result. He came to the United States about the end of the 19th century and married my grandmother, whose family was named Lincoln, like Abraham Lincoln. She originally came to the United States around 1871. Q: Well, then when your father came to the — it was your grandfather who first came to the States, is that right? ELSON: Yes. Q: What was he doing? Where did he settle? ELSON: He was a shoemaker. Q: Where was he doing his work? ELSON: In Albany, New York, where my father was born, upstate New York, capitol of the state of New York. Q: And then your father grew up in Albany. ELSON: That’s right, my father grew up in Albany, went to school in New York City, and then attained a position in Norfolk, Virginia, where he moved to manage a magazine and book distribution company. Q: Well, did your father get a college education? ELSON: Yes, my father was, was not only in college, but also law school. Q: Where did he go to college? ELSON: At St. John’s University in New York. Q: And then he got a law degree too? ELSON: Actually, I don’t know if he ever got the degree, to be candid with you. Q: Well, how about, let’s say, on your mother side? 4 ELSON: My mother’s side was not dissimilar. She was also from Albany, New York, and her family came from — I’ve never been quite sure, but I think Poland. Q: And were you sort of aware of your European roots or not or? ELSON: Not really. It’s very interesting. During my stay in Denmark, Susie and I were and still are very close to the Royal Family. The queen had small dinners and invited us – by the way, everybody knows Susie as Susie, from prime ministers to princes to plumbers; everyone calls her Susie. We were invited to the palace for a dinner with the Lithuanian President. The Lithuanian President, when he was introduced to me said, “Ah, you must have a soft spot in your heart for Lithuania — I understand that your family was from Lithuania.” I said, “Well, my father’s father was.” He then said, “Well, you must have a soft spot in your heart for Lithuania.” I said, “Sir, I think my grandfather thought of Lithuania exactly the same way that Lithuania of him.” And he was somewhat taken aback by that, and later invited me to find my family roots in Lithuania as his guest. It was very difficult, because I never really knew where my grandfather was from. I found historically, people with whom I’ve spoken, if you ask them about their ancestors, very few, including those who came at the time of Jamestown or on the Mayflower can actually trace roots back. Because most people coming to America chose to disassociate from their European experiences and rarely talked about it. And I was either innocent, naive, or stupid by not questioning more. Q: Well, I know myself, with the internet I was Googling around and I discovered that my great-grandfather was born in Germany, but came in the States to get involved in politics in Illinois and ended up as Consul General in Vienna. ELSON: (laughs) Q: And here I’ve been Consul General four times, I’d written a history of the consular service, and I didn’t know that this rather obscure title had already been in the family. ELSON: That’s a wonderful story. But it confirms what I’m saying. I just I had an email, someone who discovered me on the internet. Turned out to be a cousin of — a rather close cousin of whom I had never heard. And when the first Lincoln came over, he arrived at the time of the Civil War. And the anglicized name — whatever it was before, I don’t know — became Lincoln, Abraham Lincoln.