The West Wing Weekly 4:11 “Holy Night” Guest: The Whiffenpoofs, Robert Malina HRISHI: Hey West Wing Weekly listeners, for anyone who might have missed out on merch in our last round of sales, we are unveiling a brand new West Wing Weekly store thanks to our friends at Cotton Bureau. JOSH: Yes, it looks great, it feels great, and everything is once again available. HRISHI: That’s right. You can get the What’s Next Hat, as well as all the t-shirts, the newest addition—Single Cell Paramecium— plus all the old favorites: The Signal, Ok, Ok, What’s Next, and the University Sweatshirt. JOSH: You’ve got your hat, I think there are still a few signed posters, you’ve got the lapel pin, you’ve got the challenge coin, Bartlet’s Army, you’ve got it all. And remember when you buy West Wing Weekly merchandise you support the podcast, the entire endeavor, and you make it clear to the rest of the world that you are a person of integrity. HRISHI: And taste! JOSH: And taste, sure! And I love seeing Weeks-ling, as we call you, out in the world. I love seeing somebody with just a little, subtle lapel pin or the full on Single Cell Paramecium shirt. HRISHI: Go to thewestwingweekly.com/merch to check out all of the stuff we’ve got. Or, if you just want to look at the brand new fancy pretty store. JOSH: And know that new products are being developed in the creative lab even as we speak. [Ad Break] [Intro Music] HRISHI: You’re listening to The West Wing Weekly, I’m Hrishikesh Hirway. JOSH: And I’m Joshua Malina. [West Wing Episode 4.11 excerpt] CJ: This is like something you’d get on the internet. [end excerpt] JOSH: Haha, awesome. It’s 2018. HRISHI: It is. You know what else it is, Josh? JOSH: No, don’t say it. It won’t be until the end. HRISHI: Ah, okay, alright, alright. [laughs] JOSH: [laughs] I blew this once, I’m not going to do it again. HRISHI: Today, we’re talking about the midway point of The West Wing. JOSH: Which is what we will reach when we’re done with this episode. HRISHI: Today, we’re talking about the episode Holy Night. It’s season 4, episode 11— it’s the Christmas episode. And I watched this over the holidays, which was nice. JOSH: It first aired on December 11, 2002; it was written by fan favorite Aaron Sorkin, directed by fan favorite Tommy Schlamme. It’s one of those episodes. HRISHI: They’re a good team. JOSH: Yeah. HRISHI: In this episode, we get a special appearance from the Yale Whiffenpoofs, and later on in this episode, we’re going to be joined by a couple of the Whiffenpoofs who were in the episode. JOSH: Boula, boula, very exciting. HRISHI: From the class of 2003. Plus, we’ll get a visit from Josh’s father, the charming and funny Mr. Bob Malina. JOSH: Woo! [musical interlude] Mr. Bob Malina, Mr. Bob Bob Malina. [end musical interlude] JOSH: This is a special episode. For a variety of reasons I remember this episode better than most. You get your cold open in Yiddish. HIRSHI: I mean, that’s just badass. JOSH: It is badass. HRISHI: At this point in the series, I was watching the show on TV every week. I had caught up on DVDs and I was excited every Wednesday to watch and I remember when this episode aired I remember watching it in L.A. and my mind was blown. This whole thing is Yiddish! That seemed very ballsy. JOSH: Yeah, a very bold choice by Aaron that pays off very well. And I think Tommy does a great job also taking us back to the, do we get a year, a specific year? HRISHI: 1954. JOSH: [cross talk] I know it’s the ‘50s. ‘54! Gotcha. The reason I asked the year is because I thought the, I thought Murder, Inc. was done by the ‘50s. HRISHI: The group was exposed in the 1940s. JOSH: There you go. HRISHI: According to Wikipedia. JOSH: I thought so. I wonder why they said ‘50s. It’s probably a question of what cars they had lying around on the lot. [laughs] HRISH: [laughs] Well I think also because Toby had to have just been born. JOSH: Oh, that’s what it was. Of course, right. Although you know I think Richard could play older. [laughs] HRISHI: [laughs] JOSH: Just kidding. They could have done 30s. You’re exactly right that’s why it is— they kind of fudged the true era a little bit to make a plausible Toby. Little Tobias. HRISHI: Which is funny because having the dates correct and knowing the history is part of the episode later. JOSH: I also learned, I’m not sure how I, “Jew-y Jew” that I am, that I didn’t know this but that Yankel, which one of the characters calls the other. I didn’t realize that Yankel was a diminutive for Jacob, which I should have known just being who I am but also I’m a Jacob. My Hebrew well I ,(יקון) but through this episode, I discovered not only am I a Yaakov ,(יקון) name is Yaakov knew that, I’m a Yankel. You could legitimately call me Yankel and I encourage you to do so. HRISHI: [laughs] Yankel, what is my Hebrew name? .I mean, sound-wise ,(הושוה) JOSH: Yours, let’s see, Hrishi, Hrishi could be a Hoshuah HRISHI: Mmhmm. JOSH: Hrrrshoah. [laughs] HRISHI: How about Hrishikesh, if you take the full thing. JOSH: Can’t be done. HRISHI: Can’t be done? There’s no Hebrew equivalent of Hrishikesh? JOSH: [laughs]. Let’s crowdsource this, let us know what you think. HRISHI: Ok. That would be cool. And then when we get our West Wing Weekly jerseys, I can have my Hebrew name on the back. JOSH: [laughs] Yeah, that’s good. HRISHI: While we’re on the subject of words that I don’t understand, the beginning of the episode, as we’re doing this crane shot getting down to the car where Jules Ziegler is sitting, the first few lines in Yiddish are not translated. The first one we get with subtitles is “You hear what I said?” I was like No, I didn’t. JOSH: [cross talk] No. Well I heard it. [laughs] HRISHI: [laughs] I heard it, I guess. So can you translate? JOSH: Oh, I’m sure I cannot and I probably should have. This is probably a good opportunity to get my dad on the horn. HRISHI: For all the goys will you explain the difference between Yiddish and Hebrew and how they relate? JOSH: Well, Yiddish, I guess, and I’m no expert in Linguistics, or anything else. [laughs] HRISHI: [laughs] JOSH: But Yiddish is, I think, a high Germanic language used by central and Eastern Europeans before the Holocaust, and less and less after, that combines elements of Hebrew, uses the Hebrew alphabet and I think also incorporates elements of other languages. There’s probably a better Wikipedia explanation than that. [laughs] HRISHI: [laughs] At this point, if you didn’t know that and you’ve been listening to this podcast and watching The West Wing, I mean, you’ve been doing a fakakte job. JOSH: This is actually a good phrase, a better way to put it. It’s the historical language of the Ashkenazic, the Ashkenazic Jews who are the Eastern and Central European Jews. HRISHI: Ok. As to the actual plot within the— JOSH: [cross talk] I was actually just going to go with the production design and directing and lighting, I think it looks great. HRISHI: Yeah. JOSH: I can also imagine it being part of the Warner Bros. backlot— HIRSHI: [cross talk] For sure. JOSH: But they dressed it beautifully. The snow works, the lighting is gorgeous. It still works for me, almost there’s a little, if they had a movie budget and much more time could they have made it more photorealistic to the time, I’m sure, but it works almost for me in the sense that it also feels a little like an idealized memory of the time. HRISHI: Hmm. Yeah. JOSH: I think they did a very good job. And also I sometimes criticize the way things look, usually in the Oval through the windows. For some reason, the snow all works for me so well this episode. It really looks like it’s snowing! We get the portico, I think, and the exterior of the White House and then we get through the windows. It all really works. HRISHI: Oh the shot at the end where the President’s just got his back to the camera and he’s looking out of the window. JOSH: Yeah. HRISHI: Yeah, that’s a great shot. JOSH: [cross talk] Lovely. HRISHI: So, we have in the cold open, Toby’s father, Jules Ziegler in 1954 he’s played by Danny Jacobs, he’s played by Jerry Adler in the present day. But before we get to the present day, I was wondering, I didn’t totally understand why Zev— JOSH: Took one to the back of the head? HRISHI: Yeah. JOSH: [cross talk] yeah. HRISHI: So we have Yaakov/Yankel, and Zev and Jules and, for some reason, they’re supposed to meet a guy, Zev has set up this meet, and he says he’s gonna be there and then they go in and Zev never comes back out, and I didn’t know, did he get killed because he screwed up? Or was the plan for him to be, this was how they were setting up killing one of their own.