Girlsh Karnad Interview by AHMED RIZVI and NANDAN NILEKANI After Basu Chatterjee's 'Swami', Girish Karnad is much in demand as a 'character actor' in commercial Hindi cinema. But he first made his mark as a playwright ('Tughlaq', 'Hayavadana') and as one of the pioneers of the new cinema movement in Karnataka. Karnad maintains his varied involvement in theatre and cinema— as a writer, an actor and a film-maker. He has just written his fifth play and is planning to begin work on his next feature film Debonair: We may as well fit anywhere as a director if I did begin with a question that is anything other than what I'm w orrying a lot o f people sick. doing, which is one project every To put in a sentence: "Why few years. The two year gap after is Girish Karnad selling out?" 'Ondanandu Kaladalli' is absolutely intentional. I'm planning my next Girish Karnad; (laughs) Yeah, film now. all of a sudden everyone seems to be plagued with this question of Deb.: But doesn't this tend to what the hell I'm doing in com­ mix you up? Doesn't it have a mercial films. It's gratifying to have corruptive influence on you? so many people who have your interest at heart, who come and G .K .: It certainly does have a tell me that I was quite bad in corruptive influence on many 'Ratnadeep' or good in 'Aasha', people. In most cases you can't but how come a nice guy like me segregate two interests; they fuse is here, anyway. and then you can't get back to Look, what am I supposed to whatever you had been doing. do if I want to make a living as an In my case. (pause) well, I actor? Either. I depend on certain can only say anything on my work people to give me roles in all their by the sole yardstick open to films, people like Shyam Senegal me, which is the degree to which and Basu Chatterjee, which is it has satisfied me. The films I quite unrealistic— I mean, I make, or the plays I write. I've wouldn't do that in my films, take just completed a play called the same people— or I quit acting 'Hittina Hunja' (which means a and take an office job or run an ad cock of flour) which I think is the film agency the way Shyam is most exciting play I've ever done. doing, or just sit around. The point One is of course never fully that nobody realises when they tell satisfied in that one always hopes me to stick to direction is that f to do better than whatever one cannot make six films at one time has done in the past. 'Anju the way they do in commercial Mallige', which I wrote two years cinema, and that barring Ray there ago, was criticised badly by the is nobody in India who can be press, but I still like the play. I purely a director and yet stick to think there is something in it that one film at a time. I wouldn't is open to anyone who wants to 11 I read it. 'Ondanondu Jaladalli' too, actors. Do you sense this dif­ Hitchcock or John Ford. You just which was the film I had made ference? look at that work and you say on martial arts in Kerala, when I "Oh my God! What a sweeping, look back on it I see that I could G.K.: What I think you are asking wonderful canvas!" These people have put in more work than I did, me is, why does 'Stardust' think have produced something worth­ but it is still something I am quite I'm a talented actor (smiles). I while within the popular tradition. fond of. don't know, I guess it is perhaps And that is what I have always the age-old connection that exists strived towards doing, it has been Deb.: How do you manage to between a successful actor and my aim. prevent being corrupted? an artistically acclaimed actor— this is so everywhere. Then again, Deb.: Is that the reason why G.K.: In my case the question a sympathetic role always fetches you have never tried to do a hasn't really arisen because I have artistic plaudits, a complex role is contemporary film or written never taken the commercial less easily understood and there­ a play documenting the times cinema seriously; it's been more fore less easily appreciated. For you have lived in and experi­ like a windfall. I can understand instance, most people thought I enced? You work on either someone who has always been an was better in 'Manthan' than in themes based on legendary actor, always wanted to act. He 'Nishant'. The complexities of that myths ('Hayavadan', 'Hittena might stick on, even if he has to do school master in 'Nishant' are Hunja') or historicals lousy roles with bad directors. I've more difficult to understand. These ('Tughlaq'); I think the only never worked towards acting the were the same people who didn't time you ventured on a con­ way I've worked towards being a like Anant Nag in 'Ankur'— you temporary theme is the film playwright or a good film-maker. can see how good he was in that 'Kaadu', and even there you One has to be totally aware of the film. created a w orld that w as quite technique of the medium, one impervious to outside influ­ has to have seen or read the Deb.: Do you have any parti­ ences. Barring that last cular audience in mind for moment when the police whom you perform? At what come, the feud is entirely point do you relate with the within the village. "It doesn't upset me people? that people tell me I G.K.: (Pause) Well, obviously have written a bad play; G.K.: I have never written any­ you're right in that I've never but when they say they thing, or made anything......... dealt with contemporary themes. haven't understood a (pause) Well, let's put it the other You had better ask the literary way round— whatever I have critics why that is so, but speaking word of it, that would done, I have done for a large for myself, that somehow fits into really Upset me" audience, I have wanted it under­ the form that I work within. I'm stood by a large audience. It told that a playwright like doesn't upset me that people tell Tendulkar for instance, has written classics, worked very hard to me I have written a bad play, but plays that he had not consciously acquire the discipline. Acting is when they say that they haven't planned, plays that just "flow". something that I was forced to do understood a word of it, that would Well, nothing flows like that for when I started— that was when really upset me. This is not to take me. My theme is a consciously Pattabhirama Reddy told me that a theoretical standpoint. I'm stat­ executed one, where everything, there was nobody he could afford ing, and accepting, what has the whole development, has been for 'Samskara' so why don't I act always been for me a fact. worked out over several drafts the Brahmin— and today it is When I wrote 'Tughlaq', for and a lot of work. something like a windfall. I'm instance, it was deliberately in the In all the plays I have done, it is going along with it as far as it will Company Natak style, with murder the idea of the basic theme that take me. And, of course, for the and thunder and suspense and has come to me first— the mythical first time in my life I'm saving everything. It is in no sense an tale in 'Hayavadan' and my recent money. intellectual play, but I have said 'Hittina Hunja' which is based on that I wanted to say nevertheless. an old Jain legend,on the conflict Deb.: There's this particular I do want to do that kind of thing, between brother and sister who contradiction about your act­ because ultimately what makes are incestuously drawn towards ing. Many people believe that someone like Dostoevsky great is each other as a conflict that is you really are quite bad as an that he worked within a popular merely an extension of the one of actor. But there is that milieu. In films I might admire the British National Front— this peculiar stratum of film someone like Resnais, I might see is the fundamental structure. Once society— that swinging, so­ 'Charulata' four times and admire I get the structure I then think phisticated type, which is Ray's calibre in his ability to see about it, the possibilities open to easily intimidated by "intel­ dramatic possibilities in this story. interpret the theme. I sometimes lectuals" — these people have But what really impresses me, take years: both 'Anju Mallige' conferred on you the role of sends me reeling, is the work of and 'Hittina Hunja' had been one of our truly talented someone like Akira Kurosawa, or brewing for years. And then 12 ' ^ 4 ' - 2 "The parallel film movement in Karnataka is crawling with but if you think of Ibsen or thing is inevitable. But if you have badly-made small Chekov as playwrights that you got the impression from what I've would like to emulate, or even a said that I'm about to replace budget films; not just play like 'Mrichakatik', then first Dostoevksky then I've not made that, sheer racketeering rate is really something fantastic.